# [Official] Delidded Club / Guide



## SonDa5

Add me.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Add me.


I'll add you but try to use the submission style please


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## ivanlabrie

I'll join the club asap...waiting on Sidewinder's package








Liquid Ultra ftw.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll join the club asap...waiting on Sidewinder's package
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Liquid Ultra ftw.










Theres a format! ugh lol some people


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## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theres a format! ugh lol some people


Hey don't get all Mod on me








I haven't delidded yet.
Just supporting the cause


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## Conquistador SW

OCN name: *Conquistador SW*
CPU: *3770K*
On-die TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Pro*
IHS TIM: *MX4*
Mhz gained: *+100MHz (for now)*
OC after delid: *I'm at 4.7GHz http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2533967 (higher overclock coming when I have time)*
Temp drops: *On average dropped ~25C with the hottest core dropping 30C*

Pictures:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!





























Might I suggest we add that you have to state which TIM you used under the IHS?


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey don't get all Mod on me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't delidded yet.
> Just supporting the cause


I'm just making sure is all lol not going mod here at all I'm to crazy for that lol.


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## ivanlabrie

You could add another category as Conquistador suggested:

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:


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## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You could add another category as Conquistador suggested:
> OCN name:
> CPU:
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:


I like this! Edited my post.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> I like this! Edited my post.


Agreed and changed!


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## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll add you but try to use the submission style please


I am not using the IHS.

Photos


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



My i5-3570k delidded and prepped for first boot


Contact Paper Pressure test with my i5-3570k and DT SNIPER Water Block. The nice solid pink pattern shows good contact for proper mount.




OCN name: SonDa5
CPU: i5-3570k
on die-TIM: IC Diamond 24
*NO IHS*
Mhz gained:200mhz stable on 20 pass of LinX
OC after delid: 4.9GHZ stable 20 pass of Linx X
Temp drops: Average of 12.5C per core during Linx 20 pass.

I have water cooled system and I just sold a 360mm radiator that I normaly run with this loop which also has a HD7950 in it. I am only running a slim HWLaBS black ice stealth 120mm radiator which doesn't work very well for a video card and cpu in same loop. I think my temps will come down when I get my radiator replaced with a proper sized one for the job.


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## PCWargamer

Glad you made this club Valgaur! I hope it encourages and informs those who are thinking about deliding. And I am one of them! Good info and successful examples are important to the decision to delid or not. I also like the suggested info listing format, and I hope to see some data charted if possible. TIM info, suggestions, and results will be very improtant for both die to IHS, and between IHS to HSF.

Here are two other good info threads for those thinking of deliding:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?s=3b5070269ec23691280dbf97f0c942c0&t=2261855

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280892-3770k-IHS-Removals-CPU-temp-dropped-from-79C-to-71C&s=92acd5bf013f081e6f7b86ae7abfe762

I hope this all allows for additional sucessful delids and for a growing OCN delid club and community of our own! Keep up the good work guys!


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## Swag

For now, make a list in the OP that shows the people who are in the club and once you make the Google Spreadsheet, just transfer it over.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Glad you made this club Valgaur! I hope it encourages and informs those who are thinking about deliding. And I am one of them! Good info and successful examples are important to the decision to delid or not. I also like the suggested info listing format, and I hope to see some data charted if possible. TIM info, suggestions, and results will be very improtant for both die to IHS, and between IHS to HSF.
> Here are two other good info threads for those thinking of deliding:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?s=3b5070269ec23691280dbf97f0c942c0&t=2261855
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280892-3770k-IHS-Removals-CPU-temp-dropped-from-79C-to-71C&s=92acd5bf013f081e6f7b86ae7abfe762
> I hope this all allows for additional sucessful delids and for a growing OCN delid club and community of our own! Keep up the good work guys!


You info has been added to the main page Gamer,

As for the data charted I'd like to submit mine once I get some new thermal paste and such. just waiting to hear from the liwuid pro/ultra guys and indigo group......it's a waiting game now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> For now, make a list in the OP that shows the people who are in the club and once you make the Google Spreadsheet, just transfer it over.


Join us Swag!...also how do I post the sig so that it doesn't show as the actual sig but the code so people can copy and paste?

Also cleaned up the front page more. doesn't look so bland now.


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## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Glad you made this club Valgaur! I hope it encourages and informs those who are thinking about deliding. And I am one of them! Good info and successful examples are important to the decision to delid or not. I also like the suggested info listing format, and I hope to see some data charted if possible. TIM info, suggestions, and results will be very improtant for both die to IHS, and between IHS to HSF.
> Here are two other good info threads for those thinking of deliding:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?s=3b5070269ec23691280dbf97f0c942c0&t=2261855
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280892-3770k-IHS-Removals-CPU-temp-dropped-from-79C-to-71C&s=92acd5bf013f081e6f7b86ae7abfe762
> I hope this all allows for additional sucessful delids and for a growing OCN delid club and community of our own! Keep up the good work guys!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You info has been added to the main page Gamer,
> 
> As for the data charted I'd like to submit mine once I get some new thermal paste and such. just waiting to hear from the liwuid pro/ultra guys and indigo group......it's a waiting game now.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> For now, make a list in the OP that shows the people who are in the club and once you make the Google Spreadsheet, just transfer it over.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Join us Swag!...also how do I post the sig so that it doesn't show as the actual sig but the code so people can copy and paste?
> 
> Also cleaned up the front page more. doesn't look so bland now.
Click to expand...

PM me the code you put in the thread and I'll make it for you. Also, have you made the spreadsheet?


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> PM me the code you put in the thread and I'll make it for you. Also, have you made the spreadsheet?


I'm about to right now lol. Doing python homework first while super chilling my room = cold fingers (I'm preparing for a high OC run) .....A very High OC


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## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> PM me the code you put in the thread and I'll make it for you. Also, have you made the spreadsheet?
> 
> 
> 
> I'm about to right now lol. Doing python homework first while super chilling my room = cold fingers (I'm preparing for a high OC run) .....A very High OC
Click to expand...

I'll PM you some info right now.


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## seward

Nice to see some serious hardware hacking. Seems like this sort of thing has been going out of style. Godspeed, gentlemen.


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## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *seward*
> 
> Nice to see some serious hardware hacking. Seems like this sort of thing has been going out of style. Godspeed, gentlemen.


I have a vision of a brilliant master mind Ivy Bridge Intel engineer smiling when an IB is delidded in the pursuit of performance. Having access to the bare die of IB is a special gift and if the IB IHS would have used fluxless solder like SB we would not have been given the opportunity to easily access the bare die of IB.

The benefits to have freedom to cool the bare die of IB may be greater than the design of the SB IHS with fluxless solder.

This is real modding and it is very rewarding.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *seward*
> 
> Nice to see some serious hardware hacking. Seems like this sort of thing has been going out of style. Godspeed, gentlemen.


Thank you Sir! That's what we strive for!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have a vision of a brilliant master mind Ivy Bridge Intel engineer smiling when an IB is delidded in the pursuit of performance. Having access to the bare die of IB is a special gift and if the IB IHS would have used fluxless solder like SB we would not have been given the opportunity to easily access the bare die of IB.
> The benefits to have freedom to cool the bare die of IB may be greater than the design of the SB IHS with fluxless solder.
> This is real modding and it is very rewarding.


I might steal that and quote it for this threads main page....that was awesome man!


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## beniroc

Been delidded since july. Little too much pressure and chipped the die, but works perfect.
OCN name: beniroc
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: ? Didn't like the temps I was getting the first day so the next I delidded.
OC after delid:Was at 4.7, then i got some Liquid Ultra and been playing with it. Got to 5.0ghz needs little more vcore prime errors after 11hrs after the screen shot.


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## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> Been delidded since july. Little too much pressure and chipped the die, but works perfect.
> OCN name: beniroc
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: ? Didn't like the temps I was getting the first day so the next I delidded.
> OC after delid:Was at 4.7, then i got some Liquid Ultra and been playing with it. Got to 5.0ghz needs little more vcore prime errors after 11hrs after the screen shot.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That's impressive! 77c max on the hottest core if I'm reading right...Ambient temps?


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## beniroc

Not sure if i was guessing around room temp no ac or any thing like. Pretty common cooling also.


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## ivanlabrie

Nice setup! I like the gpu mod, and the whole layout.


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## Swag

Here is the code guys.







Be sure to add it once you get into the club!








Delidded Ivy Bridge Club








Code:



Code:


:devil:[SIZE=4]Delidded Ivy Bridge Club[/SIZE]:devil:


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## ivanlabrie

You could link this thread in it...

Code:



Code:


:devil:[URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][SIZE=4]Delidded Ivy Bridge Club[/SIZE][/URL]:devil:


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Here is the code guys.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Be sure to add it once you get into the club!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delidded Ivy Bridge Club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> :devil:[SIZE=4]Delidded Ivy Bridge Club[/SIZE]:devil:


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You could link this thread in it...
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> :devil:[URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][SIZE=4]Delidded Ivy Bridge Club[/SIZE][/URL]:devil:


Thanks you two! So far everyone is added to the sheet (sorry I disappeared for a bit) Now I'm just trying to get this spread sheet imbedded and gonna see if it works!


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## VonDutch

OCN name: VonDutch
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: 200+mhz
OC after delid: 4.645 ghz
Temp drops: 25+C

I like to join









Defore De-lid


After De-lid


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> OCN name: VonDutch
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 200+mhz
> OC after delid: 4.645 ghz
> Temp drops: 25+C
> I like to join
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Defore De-lid
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After De-lid


Accepted!

Okay guys I need to make my 5.3 run or else I'm gonna freeze!

Max temp for 100% load at 1.4vcore on 4.8 is 61°C!!!

Thats a spike by the way They are sitting nice and chill at 52°C

time for 1.6vcore for 5.3!


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## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted!
> Okay guys I need to make my 5.3 run or else I'm gonna freeze!
> Max temp for 100% load at 1.4vcore on 4.8 is 61°C!!!
> Thats a spike by the way They are sitting nice and chill at 52°C
> time for 1.6vcore for 5.3!


TY!

and good luck, beat that 5.3ghz








will make a attemt if im done with 12 hour prime run at 4.9ghz today ..lol


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## ivanlabrie

My 4.7ghz on stock tim feels lame atm








Good luck guys!


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## Valgaur

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2534283

Boom..... and to show how cold I was.....here's my town temps right now...0°C https://www.google.com/search?q=grand+forks+weather&oq=grand+forks+weather&sugexp=chrome,mod=3&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8



looks at those temps! LOL perfect background for it as well!


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## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You could link this thread in it...
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> :devil:[URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][SIZE=4]Delidded Ivy Bridge Club[/SIZE][/URL]:devil:


I just realized I didn't.







Thanks.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just realized I didn't.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks.


you silly you


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## ivanlabrie

Gtg play some coop Saint's Row 3 with the gf...cya guys! Congrats on your new high oc's


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Gtg play some coop Saint's Row 3 with the gf...cya guys! Congrats on your new high oc's


Have a good one!......so jelly of a gf that would play SR3 with her bf...not fair mines like look at my highscore on angrybirds and lego harry potter!! She tries though lol.


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## dreamslides

I did this using the following as a guide 




Without his insight about where the die is and seeing him do the process I'd never have had the guts or the knowledge, even reading wouldn't have made me comfortable enough to try it.

Old temps with Hyper Evo 212 full load were 72C

New temps with Thermal Fusion 400 are 64C full load. Clearly something is very wrong with the TIM Intel used, absurdly wrong. But these results are in line with what others have from what I see.

Also keep in mind I have probably reseated the heatsink 10x on the before de-lidding so that temp is valid, I've no idea how anyone is getting lower temps with the Hyper 212 Evo.

I'm satisfied with this, it's NORMAL IMO.................. So anyways........... I will try overclocking till it reaches 70C then stop, I don't really wanna go higher because I am not sure but would using the Virtua MVP option cause the IGP to heat the CPU more? I have no way of testing this since I have a GTX 670 and don't use the onboard video. That is how it was for the AMD APU's I've had, but they weren't using Virtua MVP so idk


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## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dreamslides*
> 
> I did this using the following as a guide
> 
> 
> 
> Without his insight about where the die is and seeing him do the process I'd never have had the guts or the knowledge, even reading wouldn't have made me comfortable enough to try it.
> Old temps with Hyper Evo 212 full load were 72C
> New temps with Thermal Fusion 400 are 64C full load. Clearly something is very wrong with the TIM Intel used, absurdly wrong. But these results are in line with what others have from what I see.
> Also keep in mind I have probably reseated the heatsink 10x on the before de-lidding so that temp is valid, I've no idea how anyone is getting lower temps with the Hyper 212 Evo.
> I'm satisfied with this, it's NORMAL IMO.................. So anyways........... I will try overclocking till it reaches 70C then stop, I don't really wanna go higher because I am not sure but would using the Virtua MVP option cause the IGP to heat the CPU more? I have no way of testing this since I have a GTX 670 and don't use the onboard video. That is how it was for the AMD APU's I've had, but they weren't using Virtua MVP so idk


glad it all went well for you, i found that same vid after i de-lidded mine ..lol
but i really like it, he is doing a great job ..

i was reading your post, and noticed the TIM youre using, Thermal Fusion 400
i looked for the W/mk at their website, it says
Thermal Fusion 400
Thermal Conductivity 2.89 (W/m-K)

i think if you would use a tim with a higher w/mk on the Die, youll see a much better improvement in temps then you have now,
take a look at this,

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources and post #216 in this thread)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

espacially the tim used on the die is important everyone says, on the ihs you can use another tim ..


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## ivanlabrie

I've looked at the Coollaboratory site and the Liquid Pro and the Ultra both are very close, in heat conductivity, the Pro being 1% better. No where near the double...It's in the spec sheets.

But, as Vondutch said, can't go wrong with a better tim on the die, just be careful with the application and follow Swag's guide.


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## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I've looked at the Coollaboratory site and the Liquid Pro and the Ultra both are very close, in heat conductivity, the Pro being 1% better. No where near the double...It's in the spec sheets.
> But, as Vondutch said, can't go wrong with a better tim on the die, just be careful with the application and follow Swag's guide.


Interesting, could you be so kind to link where you found that. I read through all the data sheets they link on their site and cannot find a thermal conductivity rating.


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## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> Interesting, could you be so kind to link where you found that. I read through all the data sheets they link on their site and cannot find a thermal conductivity rating.


Can't find the link now, it was a german page. The reviews show a 1% for the Liquid Pro, so there's nothing to worry really...Also, IC Diamond claims a thermal conductivity of 2500w/mk, comparing it to silver that has a 400 or something w/mk rating. So I guess it's just marketing hype, kinda like watts pmpo.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Can't find the link now, it was a german page. The reviews show a 1% for the Liquid Pro, so there's nothing to worry really...Also, IC Diamond claims a thermal conductivity of 2500w/mk, comparing it to silver that has a 400 or something w/mk rating. So I guess it's just marketing hype, kinda like watts pmpo.


I'm getting sick of companies doing that. They need to be a real man suck it up if there's isn't the best and just present the real data. Technically they aren't providing full information on their product and lying tot he customers which should never be a priority of a company.......grrrrrrr


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## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Can't find the link now, it was a german page. The reviews show a 1% for the Liquid Pro, so there's nothing to worry really...Also, IC Diamond claims a thermal conductivity of 2500w/mk, comparing it to silver that has a 400 or something w/mk rating. So I guess it's just marketing hype, kinda like watts pmpo.


it says,
"Purified synthetic diamond has a thermal conductivity of 2,000-2,500 W/mK compared to 406-429 W/mK for pure silver"

thats the thermal conductivity of diamonds..

specifications say this,

Specificaties:
Thermal Condunctane: 4,5 w/m-k
Thermal Resistance: 0,25oC-cm2/[email protected] 100 µ BLT
Average Particle Size: <40 µ
Compliancy: RoHS Compliant

http://www.innovationcooling.com/thermal.htm

a 3.5C improvement compared to other compounds



in my case,

i used AS5 first, saw a drop of 5-10C max, reseated my cooler twice to make sure..
thermal conductivity of Arctic Silver 5 is 8.7 W/(m·K)

then i used liquid pro, and saw a drop of 25-30C..

till now, the biggest temp drops i saw, where from people using liquid pro on the Die,
on the ihs ic diamond is good enough..but i still say, why not go for the best w/mk out there








doesnt have to be liquid metal, if cleaning is a problem, i havent done that yet, so cant say if its easy or not ..


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## mothow

Wow you guys are crazy..lol.A few years back i killed my AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ delidding it but then i delidded my Opteron 165 with no problems .I dont think my nerves could take doing this to my 3770K..lol But i do envy you guys that have the gut's to do it..


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## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Can't find the link now, it was a german page. The reviews show a 1% for the Liquid Pro, so there's nothing to worry really...Also, IC Diamond claims a thermal conductivity of 2500w/mk, comparing it to silver that has a 400 or something w/mk rating. So I guess it's just marketing hype, kinda like watts pmpo.


You are forgetting that that 1% is the difference when using on top of the IHS, not under. This makes a big difference as the area under the IHS is much smaller. For on top of the IHS you could use toothpaste and it will still be close performance wise. If you would have taken the time to read some of these threads you would understand that the difference between Liquid Pro and other pastes is actually very large.

And I think 2500w/mk is the thermal conductivity of actual diamond, not the paste. The paste is around 5 W/mK (Look at Vondutch's post)


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## Swag

I would invest in Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra for the DIE-IHS and anything really for the IHS. I mean, what makes the MOST significant drop in temps would be the Liquid Pro/Ultra. A 1 - 3C drop really all depends on the seat you get. That's why normally, I just say +/-3C for all TIMs because I have had cases where I put on some really dry old paste and it got better temps than my new pastes. Only because I realized that I had a really bad seat with the others.


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## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it says,
> "Purified synthetic diamond has a thermal conductivity of 2,000-2,500 W/mK compared to 406-429 W/mK for pure silver"
> thats the thermal conductivity of diamonds..
> specifications say this,
> Specificaties:
> Thermal Condunctane: 4,5 w/m-k
> Thermal Resistance: 0,25oC-cm2/[email protected] 100 µ BLT
> Average Particle Size: <40 µ
> Compliancy: RoHS Compliant
> http://www.innovationcooling.com/thermal.htm
> a 3.5C improvement compared to other compounds
> 
> in my case,
> i used AS5 first, saw a drop of 5-10C max, reseated my cooler twice to make sure..
> thermal conductivity of Arctic Silver 5 is 8.7 W/(m·K)
> then i used liquid pro, and saw a drop of 25-30C..
> till now, the biggest temp drops i saw, where from people using liquid pro on the Die,
> on the ihs ic diamond is good enough..but i still say, why not go for the best w/mk out there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> doesnt have to be liquid metal, if cleaning is a problem, i havent done that yet, so cant say if its easy or not ..


I Still refuse to use the diamond stuff on my die I will never torture my die by doing that with that sandpaper.







sorry those are my feelings I can't put frank through that
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mothow*
> 
> Wow you guys are crazy..lol.A few years back i killed my AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ but then i delidded my Opteron 165 with no problems .I dont think my nerves could take doing this to my 3770K..lol But i do envy you guys that have the gut's to do it.


Yeah we are a bit crazy lol. But I want the best performance for my folding rig....aka my only rig lol. I will be getting either pro or ultra depending on just how tough pro is to clean (think I'm gonna get ultra instead) and then use my proven indigo xtreme yet again on the IHS....I will make that stuff work again that ETI was amazing.


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## mothow

Does the intel overclockers warranty cover delidding?


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## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> You are forgetting that that 1% is the difference when using on top of the IHS, not under. This makes a big difference as the area under the IHS is much smaller. For on top of the IHS you could use toothpaste and it will still be close performance wise. If you would have taken the time to read some of these threads you would understand that the difference between Liquid Pro and other pastes is actually very large.
> And I think 2500w/mk is the thermal conductivity of actual diamond, not the paste. The paste is around 5 W/mK (Look at Vondutch's post)


That remark somewhat offended me...I've read TONS of stuff about this, and I KNOW that Liquid Pro/Ultra is the best for the die, heck I've ordered it 5 days ago.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mothow*
> 
> Does the intel overclockers warranty cover delidding?


I very much doubt so. :/


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I Still refuse to use the diamond stuff on my die I will never torture my die by doing that with that sandpaper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry those are my feelings I can't put frank through that


good for frank..lol

wouldnt do that either, read about a guy who used it on the die,
yea ..he had scratches on it ...

im liqiud pro all the way, on die, under the ihs, on the ihs, and bottom cooler too ...lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bottom cooler, as in a heatsink on the backside of the mobo?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That remark somewhat offended me...I've read TONS of stuff about this, and I KNOW that Liquid Pro/Ultra is the best for the die, heck I've ordered it 5 days ago.
> I very much doubt so. :/


silly peoples lol arguing and such







just kidding but remember guys I'm going to use my rig as a template for TIM and such on the die. Heck even my pk-3 is getting better with every day my 5.3 burns last night made my temps go down lol.


----------



## Schmuckley

In! http://www.overclock.net/t/1286994/schmuckleys-delidding-of-3570k


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> In! http://www.overclock.net/t/1286994/schmuckleys-delidding-of-3570k


Nice!

Wanna submit the format!?







muhahahahahahahaha


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bottom cooler, as in a heatsink on the backside of the mobo?


yea, srry, sometimes i dont know the right words ..lol

I mean, Cooler Base plate , like in this photo..


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I Still refuse to use the diamond stuff on my die I will never torture my die by doing that with that sandpaper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry those are my feelings I can't put frank through that
> .


I have used IC Daimond many times on bare GPU die and I only had one bad problem with scratches and damage to a block 1 time and that was from what I think was a bad batch of IC Diamond..

Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals that were in my IC Diamond.

Pit in block.
forIB/ICDIAMONDDUSTPIT/markondie.jpg[/img]

Micro scratches and mark on die. Did not effect performance of GPU


The minor scratches can greatly be avoided if you soak it a little with some TIM remover liquid solvent before removing and dab it of instead of rubbing it off.

It does work well though but it is too abrasive and I'm going to try liquid Pro soon.

I would love to see a perfectly made graphene pad to to replace the IHS for direct die contact with block. I think it would work better than any TIM currently available. If perfectly formed it could make perfect contact with die and PCB surface to increase heat contact area.


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That remark somewhat offended me...I've read TONS of stuff about this, and I KNOW that Liquid Pro/Ultra is the best for the die, heck I've ordered it 5 days ago.


My apologies







. I was in a bad mood and my post came over to harsh.


----------



## XiDillon

I was wondering when this would be done. anyone running IB after this procedure?...SonDa5 is, how is it doing?


----------



## Swag

Intel's Overclocking Warranty or Intel's Tuning Plan *DOES NOT* cover delidding. Like I have said, there is a way to have Intel replace it even though it is dead. All you need is a black glue from your local hardware store and a Q-tip and you're ready to send it back to Intel.









Glue: Black Epoxy Adhesive or anything to that effect

Apply a tiny dot in each side a bit closer to the die vs the sides. Use a Q-tip to spread it out thinly and apply IHS. Make sure NONE of the glue show because Intel will find out you did do this if you have glue sticking out.


----------



## Riotvan

EDIT: posted in other thread.


----------



## neopunx

OCN name: NEOPUNX
CPU: i7-3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: Same
Temp drops: None

I beleive I got a bum chip to begin with, it was weak weak weak, which is why I did this. It did not help in my case, but It was fairly easy. Oh well. Here's a link to my efforts

http://www.overclock.net/t/1309699/trying-a-few-things-that-will-defiantly-void-your-warranty-if-not-destroy-your-cpu#post_18236309

Good luck all!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> OCN name: NEOPUNX
> CPU: i7-3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: Same
> Temp drops: None
> I beleive I got a bum chip to begin with, it was weak weak weak, which is why I did this. It did not help in my case, but It was fairly easy. Oh well. Here's a link to my efforts
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1309699/trying-a-few-things-that-will-defiantly-void-your-warranty-if-not-destroy-your-cpu#post_18236309
> Good luck all!


youre using watercooling, XSPC etc?
i bet theres something else wrong, im sure if thats true,
theres enough knowledge around here to figure it out








by weak weak weak , you mean bad oc, and/or high temps?


----------



## Swag

As you can see, the Liquid Pro and Liquid Ultra are basically exactly the same, the only difference is that one is thicker than the other. (I prefer the thinner one)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> As you can see, the Liquid Pro and Liquid Ultra are basically exactly the same, the only difference is that one is thicker than the other. (I prefer the thinner one)


if you look at it that way, the whole top 10 in there should do well,
with only 1C difference, and.. there it is again, a big difference in W/mk ..lol
i can only compare liquid pro, and AS5, thats what ive used so far..
which in this list is 43C against liquid pro 41C..

still leaves the big difference when used on the Die..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> As you can see, the Liquid Pro and Liquid Ultra are basically exactly the same, the only difference is that one is thicker than the other. (I prefer the thinner one)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you look at it that way, the whole top 10 in there should do well,
> with only 1C difference, and.. there it is again, a big difference in W/mk ..lol
> i can only compare liquid pro, and AS5, thats what ive used so far..
> which in this list is 43C against liquid pro 41C..
> 
> still leaves the big difference when used on the Die..
Click to expand...

I don't care about specs, if it performs better than another, that's proof to me. Technically, AMD's 8-core CPU's should perform better than a Quad-core, but Intel's int architecture is better, so it performs better in real life and most benchmarks. I go for the Intel.








Screw the specs that the companies' Head of Advertising put.

"The difference between a headphone and a gaming headphone is that one has a Bachelors"

How long does it take for First Class International to arrive to their International Destination? Trying to send this package to a friend, but I don't want to spend too much. What's the time-frame? Like 5 - 10 days?


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> youre using watercooling, XSPC etc?
> i bet theres something else wrong, im sure if thats true,
> theres enough knowledge around here to figure it out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> by weak weak weak , you mean bad oc, and/or high temps?


I delidded before I went with WC trying to find a way to overclock at all. But my temps would go to 100+ both pre and post the delidding process. I'm talking about minor change in the Multiplier, not even voltage changing stuff. I was at a loss. Even the regular Asus OC program threw me into the high 80s at load in about a second. So I tried it delidding, and it was easy. I tried three diff TIMs and nothing really helped more than a couple of degrees. So that is when I got the XSPC kit. Its helped a lot, 100+ down to 60-70, plus an overclock finally! I would love to know how I can get a better temp/OC off this chip, but I'm at a loss. Thanks for the interest.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> OCN name: NEOPUNX
> CPU: i7-3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: Same
> Temp drops: None
> I beleive I got a bum chip to begin with, it was weak weak weak, which is why I did this. It did not help in my case, but It was fairly easy. Oh well. Here's a link to my efforts
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1309699/trying-a-few-things-that-will-defiantly-void-your-warranty-if-not-destroy-your-cpu#post_18236309
> Good luck all!


It's is very possible that your IHS is not making good contact with the die.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> It's is very possible that your IHS is not making good contact with the die.


Could you post photos of your IHS and Die TIM application?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't care about specs, if it performs better than another, that's proof to me. Technically, AMD's 8-core CPU's should perform better than a Quad-core, but Intel's int architecture is better, so it performs better in real life and most benchmarks. I go for the Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Screw the specs that the companies' Head of Advertising put.
> "The difference between a headphone and a gaming headphone is that one has a Bachelors"
> How long does it take for First Class International to arrive to their International Destination? Trying to send this package to a friend, but I don't want to spend too much. What's the time-frame? Like 5 - 10 days?


i dont care about it either









only thing i know is, it worked for me ..lol
this is my first ever intel processor, only had AMD's so far,
last one was a 1100T, but when i saw the 3770k, and the follow up FX8150,
i knew it was time to change ..lol

with my new temps after De-lid, and new oc's, about 30% extra speed, im very happy with this proc..very


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't care about specs, if it performs better than another, that's proof to me. Technically, AMD's 8-core CPU's should perform better than a Quad-core, but Intel's int architecture is better, so it performs better in real life and most benchmarks. I go for the Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Screw the specs that the companies' Head of Advertising put.
> "The difference between a headphone and a gaming headphone is that one has a Bachelors"
> How long does it take for First Class International to arrive to their International Destination? Trying to send this package to a friend, but I don't want to spend too much. What's the time-frame? Like 5 - 10 days?
> 
> 
> 
> i dont care about it either
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only thing i know is, it worked for me ..lol
> this is my first ever intel processor, only had AMD's so far,
> last one was a 1100T, but when i saw the 3770k, and the follow up FX8150,
> i knew it was time to change ..lol
> 
> with my new temps after De-lid, and new oc's, about 30% extra speed, im very happy with this proc..very
Click to expand...

I used my brother's 1090T for some time and it wasn't desirable to me. It performed worse than my 930 w/o HT. I think AMD needs to step up their game!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think AMD needs to step up their game!


Way off topic of thread but AMD has been trying for years to catch up with Intel they just don't seem to have the know how.

Also you should have tried delidding that cpu to see if it helped.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think AMD needs to step up their game!
> 
> 
> 
> Way off topic of thread but AMD has been trying for years to catch up with Intel they just don't seem to have the know how.
> 
> Also you should have tried delidding that cpu to see if it helped.
Click to expand...

I wonder if it's possible to delid the 1090T. My dad's 1090T is running @ 65C (TJ Max is 60C) on normal load. It's just crazy.


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Could you post photos of your IHS and Die TIM application?


No, not really, I've finished setting up EVERYTHING and its not coming apart yet. Plus that Liquid Ultra is not cheap. But next time I have to change it out, or if temps don't stay low, ill redo it all, and take pictures. Basically, I removed everything tht intel had just thrown together, and applied the LU TIM to the top of the die(completely) and the the underside of the IHS(completely). The Locked it in, spread the LU on the top of the IHS and also the CPU block. So, any who, I think it's covered, I made sure there was no back glue left on the IHS or on the chip, and I'm using the LU TIM on die. Any thoughts?


----------



## bigblock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> No, not really, I've finished setting up EVERYTHING and its not coming apart yet. Plus that Liquid Ultra is not cheap. But next time I have to change it out, or if temps don't stay low, ill redo it all, and take pictures. Basically, I removed everything tht intel had just thrown together, and applied the LU TIM to the top of the die(completely) and the the underside of the IHS(completely). The. Locked it in, spread the LU on the top of the IHS and also the CPU block. So, any who, I think it's covered, I made sure there was no back glue left sep the IHS from the chip, and I'm using the Rex TIM in die. Any thoughts?


This is the first time I've heard of applying TIM to the underside of the IHS, Did you come up with that?


----------



## bigblock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dreamslides*
> 
> I did this using the following as a guide
> 
> 
> 
> Without his insight about where the die is and seeing him do the process I'd never have had the guts or the knowledge, even reading wouldn't have made me comfortable enough to try it.
> Old temps with Hyper Evo 212 full load were 72C
> New temps with Thermal Fusion 400 are 64C full load. Clearly something is very wrong with the TIM Intel used, absurdly wrong. But these results are in line with what others have from what I see.
> Also keep in mind I have probably reseated the heatsink 10x on the before de-lidding so that temp is valid, I've no idea how anyone is getting lower temps with the Hyper 212 Evo.
> I'm satisfied with this, it's NORMAL IMO.................. So anyways........... I will try overclocking till it reaches 70C then stop, I don't really wanna go higher because I am not sure but would using the Virtua MVP option cause the IGP to heat the CPU more? I have no way of testing this since I have a GTX 670 and don't use the onboard video. That is how it was for the AMD APU's I've had, but they weren't using Virtua MVP so idk


Thanks for that video link, I did mine today after watching it. I think he said the die runs perpendicular to the lid rails, I think he should have said parallel.
This CPU is for a new build, I'll be updating all my info soon.
This is the razor I used, easy to control and easy on the fingers, until you slip.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I would invest in Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra for the DIE-IHS and anything really for the IHS. I mean, what makes the MOST significant drop in temps would be the Liquid Pro/Ultra. A 1 - 3C drop really all depends on the seat you get. That's why normally, I just say +/-3C for all TIMs because I have had cases where I put on some really dry old paste and it got better temps than my new pastes. Only because I realized that I had a really bad seat with the others.


One thing of note in choosing which TIM to use between the die/IHS is effects of the extream changing thermal conditions and how they seem to be impacting the TIMs' longer term effectiveness. Some deliders have noticed that the large temp drops seemed to go away over time - only to return once new TIM was applyed. Seems that the dynamic effects of thermal change between the dis & IHS is having some effect on the TIM - maybe pushing it out or making voids.... I don't know all the findings yet, but seems that Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra was better at preventing this, where other otherwise very good TIMs did not. Something to be aware of.

Check out some of this converstation on this link below @#295

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=12
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mothow*
> 
> Does the intel overclockers warranty cover delidding?


Hahahaha.......we wish










Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> As you can see, the Liquid Pro and Liquid Ultra are basically exactly the same, the only difference is that one is thicker than the other. (I prefer the thinner one)


Good & useful chart, but what was the source? Also, it seems to be missing some other good TIMs I wish it had included. Is it dated/older?


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigblock*
> 
> This is the first time I've heard of applying TIM to the underside of the IHS, Did you come up with that?


Well, originally, I didn't. I tried just AS5 on the die and on the IHS top. That didn't work out so well, so I tried LU only on the die and IHS top. Still not seeing major changes. So then I tried it the way it is currently. Just trying anything at this point. Why do you ask? I doubt with how thin this stuff is that it would be interfering with the heat transfer. Or am I missing something?


----------



## bigblock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Why do you ask?


I can't offer you any help. I'm gathering information for my new build. I de-lidded a 3770K today and have a tube of pro on the way.
Since you saw no difference between single or double layer I'll start with a single layer.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Well, originally, I didn't. I tried just AS5 on the die and on the IHS top. That didn't work out so well, so I tried LU only on the die and IHS top. Still not seeing major changes. So then I tried it the way it is currently. Just trying anything at this point. Why do you ask? I doubt with how thin this stuff is that it would be interfering with the heat transfer. Or am I missing something?


No problem with using some on the IHS, as long as you don't add too much TIM overall. I think some deliders have had good results from using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra with some on the die and IHS.


----------



## XiDillon

Honestly if I were to do this, I wouldnt even replace the lid. I havent read anywhere that the chip is pressure sensitive or too weak to have direct contact with a water block or air cooler. The base of the chip sits solidly across the socket so i wouldnt see why theres a need to spread any weight. Has anyone already tried this without a lid? Im playing with the idea in my head to do this to my 2500k for the heck of it


----------



## bigblock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XiDillon*
> 
> Honestly if I were to do this, I wouldnt even replace the lid. I havent read anywhere that the chip is pressure sensitive or too weak to have direct contact with a water block or air cooler. The base of the chip sits solidly across the socket so i wouldnt see why theres a need to spread any weight. Has anyone already tried this without a lid? Im playing with the idea in my head to do this to my 2500k for the heck of it


Refer to post #12, SonDa5 is not using a lid.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XiDillon*
> 
> Honestly if I were to do this, I wouldnt even replace the lid. I havent read anywhere that the chip is pressure sensitive or too weak to have direct contact with a water block or air cooler. The base of the chip sits solidly across the socket so i wouldnt see why theres a need to spread any weight. Has anyone already tried this without a lid? Im playing with the idea in my head to do this to my 2500k for the heck of it


You can't Sandy Bridges are all soldered on.....there is literally no safe way to get that thing off of their without risking that die at all times.

Sorry guys just got off work and been reading the thread ever since lol. And for these LU/LP arguements lets wait until I get my tube in of ultra (hopefully they email me back soon) and then we shall compare it to my pk-3 which is actually going DOWN in temps it did have a slight burn in which I love for my folding. I truly think that any TIM will seperate over time from the die no matter what you do...it's going to happen my stock TIM on my die was almost gone and I had straight contact to my IHS (no idea how i was getting those temps honestly)

For the new guy with the heat issues (I'm sorry I don't like quoting multiple people and making a huge post lol. could you possible show us your bios settings or at least the cpu-z validation to help. if you are using a mobo (motherboard) that has a in windows suite where you can mess with the temps and such let us take a look at that as well. you should be getting lower temps. Ohh and what OC are you running by the way?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> My apologies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I was in a bad mood and my post came over to harsh.


No problem, no offense taken.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Intel's Overclocking Warranty or Intel's Tuning Plan *DOES NOT* cover delidding. Like I have said, there is a way to have Intel replace it even though it is dead. All you need is a black glue from your local hardware store and a Q-tip and you're ready to send it back to Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glue: Black Epoxy Adhesive or anything to that effect
> Apply a tiny dot in each side a bit closer to the die vs the sides. Use a Q-tip to spread it out thinly and apply IHS. Make sure NONE of the glue show because Intel will find out you did do this if you have glue sticking out.


Great tips








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't care about specs, if it performs better than another, that's proof to me. Technically, AMD's 8-core CPU's should perform better than a Quad-core, but Intel's int architecture is better, so it performs better in real life and most benchmarks. I go for the Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Screw the specs that the companies' Head of Advertising put.
> "The difference between a headphone and a gaming headphone is that one has a Bachelors"
> How long does it take for First Class International to arrive to their International Destination? Trying to send this package to a friend, but I don't want to spend too much. What's the time-frame? Like 5 - 10 days?


It takes up to 3 weeks, normally 2 weeks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> No, not really, I've finished setting up EVERYTHING and its not coming apart yet. Plus that Liquid Ultra is not cheap. But next time I have to change it out, or if temps don't stay low, ill redo it all, and take pictures. Basically, I removed everything tht intel had just thrown together, and applied the LU TIM to the top of the die(completely) and the the underside of the IHS(completely). The. Locked it in, spread the LU on the top of the IHS and also the CPU block. So, any who, I think it's covered, I made sure there was no back glue left sep the IHS from the chip, and I'm using the Rex TIM in die. Any thoughts?


Sounds like too much tim, have you tried direct die cooling with your wb?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XiDillon*
> 
> Honestly if I were to do this, I wouldnt even replace the lid. I havent read anywhere that the chip is pressure sensitive or too weak to have direct contact with a water block or air cooler. The base of the chip sits solidly across the socket so i wouldnt see why theres a need to spread any weight. Has anyone already tried this without a lid? Im playing with the idea in my head to do this to my 2500k for the heck of it


Your ihs is soldered to the die, it's gonna be hard to do it.


----------



## Swag

The only way to do it is to have a blowtorch and 2 razor blades.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> OCN name: NEOPUNX
> CPU: i7-3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: Same
> Temp drops: None
> I beleive I got a bum chip to begin with, it was weak weak weak, which is why I did this. It did not help in my case, but It was fairly easy. Oh well. Here's a link to my efforts
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1309699/trying-a-few-things-that-will-defiantly-void-your-warranty-if-not-destroy-your-cpu#post_18236309
> Good luck all!


Accepted!







welcome! I need to get this spreadsheet on the main page.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I changed my main rig's name for what it's worth...I hope to join you guys soon enough. It's getting boring being stuck at a 5.2ghz max oc :/


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I changed my main rig's name for what it's worth...I hope to join you guys soon enough. It's getting boring being stuck at a 5.2ghz max oc :/


Can't wait to get you in on the new spreadsheet!! hurry up already!


----------



## Swag

Everyone ignore the spreadsheet chat, it was just so we got the spreadsheet issue down.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Everyone ignore the spreadsheet chat, it was just so we got the spreadsheet issue down.


it's gone lol.....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Everyone ignore the spreadsheet chat, it was just so we got the spreadsheet issue down.
> 
> 
> 
> it's gone lol.....
Click to expand...

Good.







That was awkward!


----------



## SonDa5

The spread sheet is looking good!









I'd like to see a field for max OC Valid CPU-Z, one field for stability test such as Prime95 with AVX or LinX with AVX for an hour or so, A 32m score field would be cherry as well.









This is my favorite club so far!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> The spread sheet is looking good!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to see a field for max OC Valid CPU-Z, one field for stability test such as Prime95 with AVX or LinX with AVX for an hour or so, A 32m score field would be cherry as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my favorite club so far!


I think we might just make this the Delidded club lol


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> The spread sheet is looking good!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to see a field for max OC Valid CPU-Z, one field for stability test such as Prime95 with AVX or LinX with AVX for an hour or so, A 32m score field would be cherry as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my favorite club so far!


Spreadsheet is looking good. I like *SonDa5's* ideas if they can be done. Good data to have for fun comparisons - not required though.

Hey *SonDa5*, how is the ICD working for you. Do you think it may be better than Pro or Ultra?


----------



## Schmuckley

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have used IC Daimond many times on bare GPU die and I only had one bad problem with scratches and damage to a block 1 time and that was from what I think was a bad batch of IC Diamond..
> Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals that were in my IC Diamond.
> Pit in block.
> 
> Micro scratches and mark on die. Did not effect performance of GPU
> 
> The minor scratches can greatly be avoided if you soak it a little with some TIM remover liquid solvent before removing and dab it of instead of rubbing it off.
> It does work well though but it is too abrasive and I'm going to try liquid Pro soon.
> I would love to see a perfectly made graphene pad to to replace the IHS for direct die contact with block. I think it would work better than any TIM currently available. If perfectly formed it could make perfect contact with die and PCB surface to increase heat contact area.










If anyone reads this: *Do NOT use IC Diamond in between die and IHS* It has bits of diamond in it..hence the name..has been known to abrade the top of IHSes..can't be good on bare silicon.

PS: Swag..Which one is thinner?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have used IC Daimond many times on bare GPU die and I only had one bad problem with scratches and damage to a block 1 time and that was from what I think was a bad batch of IC Diamond..
> Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals that were in my IC Diamond.
> Pit in block.
> 
> Micro scratches and mark on die. Did not effect performance of GPU
> 
> The minor scratches can greatly be avoided if you soak it a little with some TIM remover liquid solvent before removing and dab it of instead of rubbing it off.
> It does work well though but it is too abrasive and I'm going to try liquid Pro soon.
> I would love to see a perfectly made graphene pad to to replace the IHS for direct die contact with block. I think it would work better than any TIM currently available. If perfectly formed it could make perfect contact with die and PCB surface to increase heat contact area.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If anyone reads this: *Do NOT use IC Diamond in between die and IHS* It has bits of diamond in it..hence the name..has been known to abrade the top of IHSes..can't be good on bare silicon.
Click to expand...

I have said that many times but some people are just too reluctant to listen. Just have their CPU's develop problems and they'll start to learn how to listen.


----------



## PCWargamer

Hey *Valgaur*, on the warning link, it may be nice to note that the end of the story was that he did not kill his 3770K! Even with the giant pcb nicks, it still booted! Still a good warning about what could have happened and the dude's fears and the real risk. But the chip made it through it all - tough chips!

"Now, I hate to say this but we have had chips die in the past and this is what can happen if you aren't ready and fully prepared!

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to hide)
http://www.overclock.net/t/1309536/did-i-kill-my-3770k-trying-to-delid-it"


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I made sure there was no back glue left sep the IHS from the chip, and I'm using the Rex TIM in die. Any thoughts?


You should have seen and instant temp drop. I would take it apart and reapply your TIM and re do your mount. Clean die and IHS super clean. Get rid of all the glue.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I have said that many times but some people are just too reluctant to listen. Just have their CPU's develop problems and they'll start to learn how to listen.


I've been using it for almost 2 years and I only had one problem and I really think it was because I got a bad batch with a larger diamond crystal than normal.

Did you see the photos of the damage?

Again in case you missed the photos.

IC Diamond problem.


Block was RMAd no problems


HD7950 works perfectly fine. Probably better than 99.5% of all other HD7950s. Its a great over clocker.

Other than that I haven't had any problems and it has been smooth sailing with good temps.

I do think IC Diamond needs a revision in its formula to make it less thick and more liquid like.

I'm taking a break from IC Diamond till they fix the formula and going to try liquid Pro. I think I have to be more careful with Liquid Pro because when I make contact with die it will be less forgiving as I sqeeze down the mount. I think some people that are having problems doing the delid are having problems when they do the mount.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Spreadsheet is looking good. I like *SonDa5's* ideas if they can be done. Good data to have for fun comparisons - not required though.
> Hey *SonDa5*, how is the ICD working for you. Do you think it may be better than Pro or Ultra?


I do think IC Diamond is too abrasive for bare die contact. Diamonds can cut through glass and silicon is a form of glass.
However it does work well and I think IC needs to revise the formula and make it into a much more finer more liquid type of application for better thermal transfer and less abrasive.
The only reason I have scratches on my die is because I rubbed it off instead of dabbing it off with a wet clothe.

I am going to get some Liquid Pro soon and when I remove the IC Diamond I will take photos so everyone can see the damage to my die and block if any. I don't think there will be any damage.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I have said that many times but some people are just too reluctant to listen. Just have their CPU's develop problems and they'll start to learn how to listen.
> 
> 
> 
> I've been using it for almost 2 years and I only had one problem and I really think it was because I got a bad batch with a larger diamond crystal than normal.
> 
> Did you see the photos of the damage?
> 
> Again in case you missed the photos.
> 
> IC Diamond problem.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Other thani that I haven't had any problems and it has been smooth sailing with good temps.
> 
> I do think IC Diamond needs a revision in its formula to make it less thick and more liquid like.
> 
> I'm taking a break from IC Diamond till they fix the formula and going to try liquid Pro. I think I have to be more careful with Liquid Pro because when I make contact with die it will be less forgiving as I sqeeze down the mount. I think some people that are having problems doing the delid are having problems when they do the mount.
Click to expand...

I saw those pictures and even though in that case, it may not be a problem, but if my IHS on my other CPU's got scratched, I think silicon won't be too far away. Liquid Pro isn't too hard to worry about, just make sure you apply a tiny bit in the center and just work it away around with the brush. Shouldn't have a problem after that.

To people who say they have had no change in temp: I have delidded multiple Ivy Bridges (mine, friends', and clients') from different batches and they all survived for one, and they all had really bad TIM (dry even if it was new). Unless the TIM you put on was really bad, you will see a temperature change. Just keep re-seating and trying again and you won't have a problem. Also, before I got my Coollaboratory Liquid Pro, I used my Noctua NT-H1. Apply a half-a-rice-grain in the center of the die and just apply the IHS, do not spread it. The pressure from the IHS and the block will do the spreading like how the TIM on the IHS is spread!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> The spread sheet is looking good!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to see a field for max OC Valid CPU-Z, one field for stability test such as Prime95 with AVX or LinX with AVX for an hour or so, A 32m score field would be cherry as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my favorite club so far!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey *Valgaur*, on the warning link, it may be nice to note that the end of the story was that he did not kill his 3770K! Even with the giant pcb nicks, it still booted! Still a good warning about what could have happened and the dude's fears and the real risk. But the chip made it through it all - tough chips!
> "Now, I hate to say this but we have had chips die in the past and this is what can happen if you aren't ready and fully prepared!
> Warning: Spoiler! (Click to hide)
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1309536/did-i-kill-my-3770k-trying-to-delid-it"


Changes have been added to the page. for the spot on the max oc (was already there lol) with the testing and such I'm trying to figure out a spot to put it in...it's already crunched in their lol







keep the ideas coming guys we might have to make this just the delidded club eventually lol.


----------



## SonDa5

Here is photo of the application of IC Diamond I put on my my die for direct contact with water block. No IHS.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have a vision of a brilliant master mind Ivy Bridge Intel engineer smiling when an IB is delidded in the pursuit of performance. Having access to the bare die of IB is a special gift and if the IB IHS would have used fluxless solder like SB we would not have been given the opportunity to easily access the bare die of IB.
> The benefits to have freedom to cool the bare die of IB may be greater than the design of the SB IHS with fluxless solder.
> This is real modding and it is very rewarding.


borrowed this for the motto......tell me what you guys think. I like it.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> borrowed this for the motto......tell me what you guys think. I like it.


Its great. Captures the spirit of doing this mod and all that is good about it.

Sad part is fluxless solder works way better than any other TIM that is available to easily put on a de-lidded IB.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> borrowed this for the motto......tell me what you guys think. I like it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Its great. Captures the spirit of doing this mod and all that is good about it.
> Sad part is fluxless solder works way better than any other TIM that is available to easily put on a de-lidded IB.


Good motto, and it does capture the spirit of it all...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I do think IC Diamond is too abrasive for bare die contact. Diamonds can cut through glass and silicon is a form of glass.
> However it does work well and I think IC needs to revise the formula and make it into a much more finer more liquid type of application for better thermal transfer and less abrasive.
> The only reason I have scratches on my die is because I rubbed it off instead of dabbing it off with a wet clothe.
> I am going to get some Liquid Pro soon and when I remove the IC Diamond I will take photos so everyone can see the damage to my die and block if any. I don't think there will be any damage.


Why PRO over ULTRA? I hear they have similar cooling properties and results, but that ultra is easier to apply. Do we have any sources/data to show that one is better than the other through actual use?

I am interested as I am thinking of getting the ultra. I think the anandtech forum felt that both pro amd ultra were both great, but that ultra was easier to apply.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I do think IC Diamond is too abrasive for bare die contact. Diamonds can cut through glass and silicon is a form of glass.
> However it does work well and I think IC needs to revise the formula and make it into a much more finer more liquid type of application for better thermal transfer and less abrasive.
> The only reason I have scratches on my die is because I rubbed it off instead of dabbing it off with a wet clothe.
> I am going to get some Liquid Pro soon and when I remove the IC Diamond I will take photos so everyone can see the damage to my die and block if any. I don't think there will be any damage.
> 
> 
> 
> Why PRO over ULTRA? I hear they have similar cooling properties and results, but that ultra is easier to apply. Do we have any sources/data to show that one is better than the other through actual use?
> 
> I am interested as I am thinking of getting the ultra. I think the anandtech forum felt that both pro amd ultra were both great, but that ultra was easier to apply.
Click to expand...

I like Pro better but Ultra is easier to apply because it has higher viscosity. The temps are going to be exactly the same. One is NOT better than the other as some people say. It is not. Ultra is just thicker and pastier and easier to put on. Pro takes a bit of practice because it is more fluid like and you can easily spill it over the die and you kinda don't want that.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Pro takes a bit of practice because it is more fluid like and you can easily spill it over the die and you kinda don't want that.


Will it eat a hole through the PCB? What is the problem if it does?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Pro takes a bit of practice because it is more fluid like and you can easily spill it over the die and you kinda don't want that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will it eat a hole through the PCB? What is the problem if it does?
Click to expand...

Won't eat a hole, but since it's electrically conductive (very much), if you hit the gold parts of the PCB, it may cause some issues. Electric current + electric conductivity isn't too well digested in the PC world.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Won't eat a hole, but since it's electrically conductive (very much), if you hit the gold parts of the PCB, it may cause some issues. Electric current + electric conductivity isn't too well digested in the PC world.


When I do my application of Liquid Pro it will be on the die only. I've read that some put it on the top of the IHS and the Die. Since I'm doing direct die mount with my water block I think it will be safer to only put a thin coat only on the die. Will be less Liquid Pro that could possibly flake off and short something out.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Won't eat a hole, but since it's electrically conductive (very much), if you hit the gold parts of the PCB, it may cause some issues. Electric current + electric conductivity isn't too well digested in the PC world.
> 
> 
> 
> When I do my application I'm going to only put a coat of it on the bare die.
Click to expand...

It should be the tiniest layer ever. The thinner the better. As long as it covers the entire die's top, thinnest as possible is what's desirable.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Why PRO over ULTRA?


Main reason is because its specification list it has higher thermal conductivity rating. The other reason is because I like how it applies.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Main reason is because its specification list it has higher thermal conductivity rating. The other reason is because I like how it applies.


That looks mighty impressive! Instant mirror-like finish








Wonder how the Ultra will look like...Gonna search for a similar vid.

EDIT: DUH!




After seeing this, wouldn't it be a bit too much for just the die if we used a similar sized drop on it and then spread it with the mounting pressure? I mean, it covers the whole ihs with that application.


----------



## ketapang

Do you guys facing any issues running delidded proc? I've watch this: 



 & he's not using any double-sided tape to put the ihs back on top but only using the cpu retention bracket to keep the ihs in place. Is it safe? Do you guys think the pressure from the hsf will damaged the pcb?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Do you guys facing any issues running delidded proc? I've watch this:
> 
> 
> 
> & he's not using any double-sided tape to put the ihs back on top but only using the cpu retention bracket to keep the ihs in place. Is it safe? Do you guys think the pressure from the hsf will damaged the pcb?


If you have the IHS on, it would be exact same as a CPU that wasn't delidded. The pressure would still be the same on the die and on the PCB as the non-delidded CPU. A delidded CPU that doesn't have the IHS on will of course have more pressure put on the die, but not on the PCB. The PCB would be about the same. The critical point in making sure that not too much pressure is applied to the die is to use washers to space out the extra space you now have because you don't have the IHS on.


----------



## Valgaur

Lol I just put my ihs and used my bracket and went.....now run!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lol I just put my ihs and used my bracket and went.....now run!


That's basically what I did. I put my CPU (bare) on a sheet of paper on my desk, applied Liquid Pro to the die and put it on the socket. Put on the IHS and just put the bracket on and I just assume that the bracket put the IHS correctly.


----------



## HPE1000

Someone should find some glue similar to the one that was originally used on the ihs so people aren't just setting the ihs on the die. I watched a video of someone who didnt use any glue to stick it to the PCB and it looks very sketchy attaching it.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Someone should find some glue similar to the one that was originally used on the ihs so people aren't just setting the ihs on the die. I watched a video of someone who didnt use any glue to stick it to the PCB and it looks very sketchy attaching it.


Well, as long as you use the bracket or you put the heatsink on fairly tight, you won't have any problems. What happens if you make a mistake in applying the paste in the die and you glue it on? You'd have to re-delid it which would be scary. Also, the glue that you are looking for is a Black Epoxy Adhesive like I said before. I have used it on my other things like my GPU in some cases. It's the closest thing you can get to what the PC component manufacturers use.


----------



## Riotvan

I also just put the IHS straight on without any spacer, those cores are tough.. remember those athlon xp's and PIII's? Those cores also took quite a bit of abuse, if the mount is level i see no problem with it tbh.
Back in 2000 i had one of those slot A Athlon's where i removed the case and mounted one of those Alpha coolers directly on the core, not sure but i think i had to drill some holes in the cooler for that. And that went great i think it was either a 600 or 650 but i managed to get 1ghz out of it, was pretty proud about that


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, as long as you use the bracket or you put the heatsink on fairly tight, you won't have any problems. What happens if you make a mistake in applying the paste in the die and you glue it on? You'd have to re-delid it which would be scary. Also, the glue that you are looking for is a Black Epoxy Adhesive like I said before. I have used it on my other things like my GPU in some cases. It's the closest thing you can get to what the PC component manufacturers use.


Well I was thinking something like 2 drops, 1 on the top right, and one on the bottom left just to hold it down a little more. I know its okay without glue but I dont like the idea.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, as long as you use the bracket or you put the heatsink on fairly tight, you won't have any problems. What happens if you make a mistake in applying the paste in the die and you glue it on? You'd have to re-delid it which would be scary. Also, the glue that you are looking for is a Black Epoxy Adhesive like I said before. I have used it on my other things like my GPU in some cases. It's the closest thing you can get to what the PC component manufacturers use.
> 
> 
> 
> Well I was thinking something like 2 drops, 1 on the top right, and one on the bottom left just to hold it down a little more. I know its okay without glue but I dont like the idea.
Click to expand...

Doesn't do as much as you'd think. To be honest, not having glue would probably be the best. First, the paste is actually able to freely spread unlike if the glue is there and the spread would be stopped either because it can't be pressed anymore or the IHS doesn't have that moving left and right to actually squeeze the paste to spread thinly and properly. All in all, no glue would probably be 2nd best to a soldered die.


----------



## kgtuning

So interested in deliding my 3770k...great info guys thanks!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Main reason is because its specification list it has higher thermal conductivity rating. The other reason is because I like how it applies.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That looks mighty impressive! Instant mirror-like finish
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wonder how the Ultra will look like...Gonna search for a similar vid.
> After seeing this, wouldn't it be a bit too much for just the die if we used a similar sized drop on it and then spread it with the mounting pressure? I mean, it covers the whole ihs with that application.


Both of those were great to see *SonDa5* and *ivanlabrie*. Makes more excited about using either, although I am now leaning to the PRO a bit. Thanks for finding and posting those.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Someone should find some glue similar to the one that was originally used on the ihs so people aren't just setting the ihs on the die. I watched a video of someone who didnt use any glue to stick it to the PCB and it looks very sketchy attaching it.


From what I have read, having the IHS sitting directly on the die, without the gule, has removed a gap that was stopping the efficeint transfer of heat. Part of the improved temps from deliding seems to be from a better TIM and the removal of that gap. So, it is an advantage to have the IHS resting directly on top of the die and what one should attempt to achive when deliding for optimized heat transfer away from the die - barring a proper HFS that can make direct contact to the die that is. Not all HFS can opperate without the IHS.


----------



## Valgaur

Also when you put that glue back on their and you put your heatsink back on....it won't be straigh anymore unless you leave you CPU out overnight to dry (um no, not in college anyways) And that glue will heat up again when you do high OC benches. it could possibly get soft and shift. The bare IHS is much ebtter for the contact as Gamer has said it gets rid of the gap their. Even when you delid and look at the stock TIM it may look like it's a very close grip but I had a good chunk of stuff on the under side of the IHS bewteen my temps are the best yet (still tweaking) because I didn't get rid of all of the glue yet (didn't have time mainly) and I will be getting rid of the rest next time I open this baby up. Can't wait to get my indigo xtreme back on ym IHS again...I miss it...a lot........that stuff rocked.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> So interested in deliding my 3770k...great info guys thanks!


No problem and that's our goal is to inform people!


----------



## kgtuning

would love to see my chip at 5ghz...right now it's 4.8ghz @ 1.248, 24 hour prime95 blend "stable"...but my temps are wicked high, max temps is 95 c. I will be ordering liquid pro this week and hopefully I can join the club.


----------



## Renairy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> would love to see my chip at 5ghz...right now it's 4.8ghz @ 1.248, 24 hour prime95 blend "stable"...but my temps are wicked high, max temps is 95 c. I will be ordering liquid pro this week and hopefully I can join the club.


I noticed you're using an Asrock board.

FYI ... That chip is getting alot more V-core than 1.248v

http://www.overclock.net/t/1310519/maximus-v-formula-vs-fatal1ty-z77-higher-v-core/0_30

ASRock are dropping their offsets to give lower readings through the sensors.
Asrock are a joke mate.

On my old Z77 Fatal1ty, it was reporting 1.29v for 4.8Ghz..
Now that i'm on a more truthful board... the v-core required for the same OC and same Chip is 1.35v


----------



## Schmuckley

OCN name:Schmuckley
CPU:i5 3570K
on die-TIM:AS5
ihs-TIM:AS5
Mhz gained:0 (just did it for the temps) It would do 4.7 before PROCHOT on water.
OC after delid:4.5Ghz
Temp drops:4-12c

I sold it shortly thereafter..and bought a nice 2500K









link to temp screenshots n whatnot http://www.overclock.net/t/1286994/schmuckleys-delidding-of-3570k


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Renairy*
> 
> I noticed you're using an Asrock board.
> FYI ... That chip is getting alot more V-core than 1.248v
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1310519/maximus-v-formula-vs-fatal1ty-z77-higher-v-core/0_30
> ASRock are dropping their offsets to give lower readings through the sensors.
> Asrock are a joke mate.
> On my old Z77 Fatal1ty, it was reporting 1.29v for 4.8Ghz..
> Now that i'm on a more truthful board... the v-core required for the same OC and same Chip is 1.35v


Dont throw a whole company under the bus for a few problems you had.


----------



## Swag

This club is killing the activity on my guide.







Haha. It's okay, at least people are starting to do this mod! I'm slowly convincing 3 - 5 people per day into delidding their Ivy! If people on my OC guide complain about the temps, I say delid!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This club is killing the activity on my guide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha. It's okay, at least people are starting to do this mod! I'm slowly convincing 3 - 5 people per day into delidding their Ivy! If people on my OC guide complain about the temps, I say delid!


Then you are still providing them an extra service on your thread! Help then to OC, then they run in the IB temp problem, then show them were they can fix that problem too! Great job *Swag*!!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This club is killing the activity on my guide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha. It's okay, at least people are starting to do this mod! I'm slowly convincing 3 - 5 people per day into delidding their Ivy! If people on my OC guide complain about the temps, I say delid!
> 
> 
> 
> Then you are still providing them an extra service on your thread! Help then to OC, then they run in the IB temp problem, then show them were they can fix that problem too! Great job *Swag*!!!
Click to expand...

It's like a business plan. First, I give them a way to do something, but a small problem and when they realize that small problem, they go ahead and bite on the "fix".







Just like the map packs on the games nowadays. Buy a game for $60 and end up paying about another $60 in maps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This club is killing the activity on my guide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha. It's okay, at least people are starting to do this mod! I'm slowly convincing 3 - 5 people per day into delidding their Ivy! If people on my OC guide complain about the temps, I say delid!


I saw that while I was at work on my break lol. I almost started laughing when I saw that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> OCN name:Schmuckley
> CPU:i5 3570K
> on die-TIM:AS5
> ihs-TIM:AS5
> Mhz gained:0 (just did it for the temps) It would do 4.7 before PROCHOT on water.
> OC after delid:4.5Ghz
> Temp drops:4-12c
> I sold it shortly thereafter..and bought a nice 2500K
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> link to temp screenshots n whatnot http://www.overclock.net/t/1286994/schmuckleys-delidding-of-3570k


Accepted!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It's like a business plan. First, I give them a way to do something, but a small problem and when they realize that small problem, they go ahead and bite on the "fix".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just like the map packs on the games nowadays. Buy a game for $60 and end up paying about another $60 in maps.


You going all EA there mate









But, yeah, it's a good fix.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It's like a business plan. First, I give them a way to do something, but a small problem and when they realize that small problem, they go ahead and bite on the "fix".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just like the map packs on the games nowadays. Buy a game for $60 and end up paying about another $60 in maps.
> 
> 
> 
> You going all EA there mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But, yeah, it's a good fix.
Click to expand...

Haha, I just spent about $50 on MSP to buy the BF3 map packs.







I really want delidding to become mainstream so not only overclockers would do it, but also the normal people.


----------



## PCWargamer

*Valgaur*, I'm still reading through other IB deliding threads around the web and I keep seeing posts from people with SB's and other cpus thinking about deliding there processors. Might be good to have some note on the first page making it more clear that we are only talking about IB in this IB Deliding Club. Yep, its in the name, but I am seeing these posts in many other threads talking only about IB and with IB in their name. I guess it just sounds like so much fun that many with other cpu owners want to join in, but no, this fun is only reserved for IB's right now!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Valgaur*, I'm still reading through other IB deliding threads around the web and I keep seeing posts from people with SB's and other cpus thinking about deliding there processors. Might be good to have some note on the first page making it more clear that we are only talking about IB in this IB Deliding Club. Yep, its in the name, but I am seeing these posts in many other threads talking only about IB and with IB in their name. I guess it just sounds like so much fun that many with other cpu owners want to join in, but no, this fun is only reserved for IB's right now!


I've thought about making it just the delidded club...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Valgaur*, I'm still reading through other IB deliding threads around the web and I keep seeing posts from people with SB's and other cpus thinking about deliding there processors. Might be good to have some note on the first page making it more clear that we are only talking about IB in this IB Deliding Club. Yep, its in the name, but I am seeing these posts in many other threads talking only about IB and with IB in their name. I guess it just sounds like so much fun that many with other cpu owners want to join in, but no, this fun is only reserved for IB's right now!


I've only delidded one soldered CPU in my life and I almost killed it! You have to use a blowtorch! I don't think many people want to go to that type of extreme!


----------



## Blameless

I delidded an i7 920 by sanding through the entire IHS; leaves a convenient shim around the die, but is extremely labor intensive. Unfortunately I scratched the die later on while relapping it and this scratch eventually grew into a crack that caused failure.

Anyway, with non-soldered IHS, it's much easier to cut them off.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> I delidded an i7 920 by sanding through the entire IHS; leaves a convenient shim around the die, but is extremely labor intensive. Unfortunately I scratched the die later on while relapping it and this scratch eventually grew into a crack that caused failure.
> Anyway, with non-soldered IHS, it's much easier to cut them off.


I think people on this thread did that to their ivys also to avoid the risk involved with cutting the glue. I dont know if I saw that on this thread or some other thread though.


----------



## PCWargamer

Very interesting results from a very good delid test of deliding and TIMs on an anandtech forum thread where the OP *Idontcare* found that the IB temp problem was not from the intell TIM at all, but from the gap between the die and IHS.

- if interested, see post #570 on link below:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=23
_________________________________
And the results?
.....
And if we remove the paper shim and drop that IHS down onto the CPU (not perfectly zero of course, there is still some NT-H1 CPU TIM there after all) reducing the gap to as close to zero as possible then we get the "c" cases...and the temperatures show the expected fantastic drops we have all come to expect from delidding our Ivy Bridge chips.

Conclusion: The Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason Ivy Bridge's run hot, and replacing the Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason a delidded Ivy Bridge runs so much cooler - the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS
_________________________________

This is also noted, and first discovered, on post # 496
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=20

*>>>>> Surprising also was his finding that direct die to HFS did not help to reduce temps as much as he had thought they would.*

see #583:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24
_________________________________
....
The take home message there is replacing the CPU TIM doesn't really provide any benefit. Reducing the gap between the CPU and the IHS does. And removing the IHS entirely doesn't really provide much benefit either.

And that stands to reason. The heat is going to flow through the copper of the IHS the same as it does through the copper of the H100 waterblock.

But if there is a thick pad of thermal paste in the way, as was the case with my 3770k at time of purchase, then it doesn't really matter how good the TIM itself is (unless it too is made of metal) because the mere presence of that thick pad of thermal paste becomes the weakest link in the thermal conductivity equation.

Once you eliminate the bottleneck that is the gap between the IHS and the CPU, or if you happen to end up with an Ivy Bridge CPU which doesn't have much of a gap to begin with (Yuriman ), then you have pretty much optimized the system at that point regardless which CPU TIM of choice you employ and regardless whether or not you leave the IHS in place.

Now the choice of CPU TIM still plays a role in terms of the robustness in maintaining those nice low temperatures. If the so-called "pump out" effect is real then we can expect it to bite us unless we choose a substitute CPU TIM that is designed to avoid such thermo-mechanical effects.

I haven't really got into testing that part out yet, but I expect IC Diamond and the metal TIMs like Liquid Ultra to be key there.
_________________________________


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Very interesting results from a very good delid test of deliding and TIMs on an anandtech forum thread where the OP *Idontcare* found that the IB temp problem was not from the intell TIM at all, but from the gap between the die and IHS.
> - if interested, see post #570 on link below:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=23
> _________________________________
> And the results?
> .....
> And if we remove the paper shim and drop that IHS down onto the CPU (not perfectly zero of course, there is still some NT-H1 CPU TIM there after all) reducing the gap to as close to zero as possible then we get the "c" cases...and the temperatures show the expected fantastic drops we have all come to expect from delidding our Ivy Bridge chips.
> Conclusion: The Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason Ivy Bridge's run hot, and replacing the Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason a delidded Ivy Bridge runs so much cooler - the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS
> _________________________________
> This is also noted, and first discovered, on post # 496
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=20
> *>>>>> Surprising also was his finding that direct die to HFS did not help to reduce temps as much as he had thought they would.*
> see #583:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24
> _________________________________
> ....
> The take home message there is replacing the CPU TIM doesn't really provide any benefit. Reducing the gap between the CPU and the IHS does. And removing the IHS entirely doesn't really provide much benefit either.
> And that stands to reason. The heat is going to flow through the copper of the IHS the same as it does through the copper of the H100 waterblock.
> But if there is a thick pad of thermal paste in the way, as was the case with my 3770k at time of purchase, then it doesn't really matter how good the TIM itself is (unless it too is made of metal) because the mere presence of that thick pad of thermal paste becomes the weakest link in the thermal conductivity equation.
> Once you eliminate the bottleneck that is the gap between the IHS and the CPU, or if you happen to end up with an Ivy Bridge CPU which doesn't have much of a gap to begin with (Yuriman ), then you have pretty much optimized the system at that point regardless which CPU TIM of choice you employ and regardless whether or not you leave the IHS in place.
> Now the choice of CPU TIM still plays a role in terms of the robustness in maintaining those nice low temperatures. If the so-called "pump out" effect is real then we can expect it to bite us unless we choose a substitute CPU TIM that is designed to avoid such thermo-mechanical effects.
> I haven't really got into testing that part out yet, but I expect IC Diamond and the metal TIMs like Liquid Ultra to be key there.
> _________________________________


adding that!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've only delidded one soldered CPU in my life and I almost killed it! You have to use a blowtorch! I don't think many people want to go to that type of extreme!


That's some balls right there!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blameless*
> 
> I delidded an i7 920 by sanding through the entire IHS; leaves a convenient shim around the die, but is extremely labor intensive. Unfortunately I scratched the die later on while relapping it and this scratch eventually grew into a crack that caused failure.
> Anyway, with non-soldered IHS, it's much easier to cut them off.


Ouch!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting results from a very good delid test of deliding and TIMs on an anandtech forum thread where the OP *Idontcare* found that the IB temp problem was not from the intell TIM at all, but from the gap between the die and IHS.
> - if interested, see post #570 on link below:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=23
> _________________________________
> And the results?
> .....
> And if we remove the paper shim and drop that IHS down onto the CPU (not perfectly zero of course, there is still some NT-H1 CPU TIM there after all) reducing the gap to as close to zero as possible then we get the "c" cases...and the temperatures show the expected fantastic drops we have all come to expect from delidding our Ivy Bridge chips.
> Conclusion: The Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason Ivy Bridge's run hot, and replacing the Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason a delidded Ivy Bridge runs so much cooler - the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS
> _________________________________
> This is also noted, and first discovered, on post # 496
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=20
> *>>>>> Surprising also was his finding that direct die to HFS did not help to reduce temps as much as he had thought they would.*
> see #583:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24
> _________________________________
> ....
> The take home message there is replacing the CPU TIM doesn't really provide any benefit. Reducing the gap between the CPU and the IHS does. And removing the IHS entirely doesn't really provide much benefit either.
> And that stands to reason. The heat is going to flow through the copper of the IHS the same as it does through the copper of the H100 waterblock.
> But if there is a thick pad of thermal paste in the way, as was the case with my 3770k at time of purchase, then it doesn't really matter how good the TIM itself is (unless it too is made of metal) because the mere presence of that thick pad of thermal paste becomes the weakest link in the thermal conductivity equation.
> Once you eliminate the bottleneck that is the gap between the IHS and the CPU, or if you happen to end up with an Ivy Bridge CPU which doesn't have much of a gap to begin with (Yuriman ), then you have pretty much optimized the system at that point regardless which CPU TIM of choice you employ and regardless whether or not you leave the IHS in place.
> Now the choice of CPU TIM still plays a role in terms of the robustness in maintaining those nice low temperatures. If the so-called "pump out" effect is real then we can expect it to bite us unless we choose a substitute CPU TIM that is designed to avoid such thermo-mechanical effects.
> I haven't really got into testing that part out yet, but I expect IC Diamond and the metal TIMs like Liquid Ultra to be key there.
> _________________________________


That's a great find! That was the post I mentioned earlier, which contained evidence that direct die cooling is not that great compared to delidding and replacing the tim, whilst having the ihs on top.
Perhaps the ultimate setup would be to use a slice of indigo xtreme on the die, remove the black glue altogether, lap the ihs and use another indigo xtreme thermal pad.
Thoughts?


----------



## Blameless

I was always skeptical of it being the TIM itself that was the issue. Intel does not use garbage TIM (it's fairly high end Dow Corning stuff) and even the worst TIM one can imagine should be responsible for double digit temperature increases.

Looks like Intel kept the same substrate/IHS underside gap that they have been using forever, while at the same time reducing die height from ~1mm to about 0.56mm, then they just decided to use gap filler TIM instead of redesigning the IHS.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've only delidded one soldered CPU in my life and I almost killed it! You have to use a blowtorch! I don't think many people want to go to that type of extreme!
> 
> 
> 
> That's some balls right there!
Click to expand...

This is what you had to do with the old CPUs.








You be the judge on how nerve racking that would be.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's some balls right there!
> Ouch!
> That's a great find! That was the post I mentioned earlier, which contained evidence that direct die cooling is not that great compared to delidding and replacing the tim, whilst having the ihs on top.
> Perhaps the ultimate setup would be to use a slice of indigo xtreme on the die, remove the black glue altogether, lap the ihs and use another indigo xtreme thermal pad.
> Thoughts?


it would be amazing but the skill to get the right amount of indigo xtreme on there would be ridiculous......lol...I just thought of a new product for them....die indigo xtreme....I'd buy it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This is what you had to do with the old CPUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You be the judge on how nerve racking that would be.










wow..........


----------



## Hokies83

Valgaur gots his own club!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Indigo Xtreme - On die killer edition®

Coming to a store near you!


----------



## Hokies83

I got some cool labs pro laying around meh...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valgaur gots his own club!


I know right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I got some cool labs pro laying around meh...


Do it man!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Indigo Xtreme - On die killer edition®
> Coming to a store near you!


I'm gonna call them later today.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I know right?
> Do it man!!!
> I'm gonna call them later today.


I might.. But if i failed id glue that SOB back on and send it for an RMA to Intel lol see what happens...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I might.. But if i failed id glue that SOB back on and send it for an RMA to Intel lol see what happens...


LOL just make it look pretty again.


----------



## JQuantum

btw... must we have a pic with the chip :S i delidded mine before i put my build together and don't feel like taking it apart again yet.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's the spirit!









EDIT: Got ninja'd...I want to paint stuff with Coollab L Pro, insta bling lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> btw... must we have a pic with the chip :S i delidded mine before i put my build together and don't feel like taking it apart again yet.


Nope don't need to it's mainly for show. I know who has delidded mainly just when you can it would be nice so I can really know lol.


----------



## JQuantum

lol, then...

OCN name: JQuantum
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: gelid gc3 extreme
ihs-TIM: gelid gc3 extreme
Mhz gained: Unknown
OC after delid: 4.4GHz @ 1.205 dVid (my top temps are good but it's unstable after 4.5GHz with this motherboard.... and it breaks my raid if it breaks... so I didn't bother much with the OC just a random number for stability)
Temp drops: Unknown but my max load is ~ < 64 C at 4.5GHz at 1.205 + 0.015 dynamic voltage + turbo vdrop, I don't think mine gained a ton :S
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2514408

I'd probably try an OC run if I swap motherboards and/or decide to break my raid for the 8th time.

I might swap the GC3 later but not till christmas time-ish.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> lol, then...
> OCN name: JQuantum
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: gelid gc3 extreme
> ihs-TIM: gelid gc3 extreme
> Mhz gained: Unknown
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz @ 1.205 dVid (my top temps are good but it's unstable after 4.5GHz with this motherboard.... and it breaks my raid if it breaks... so I didn't bother much with the OC just a random number for stability)
> Temp drops: Unknown but my max load is ~ < 64 C at 4.5GHz at 1.205 + 0.015 dynamic voltage + turbo vdrop, I don't think mine gained a ton :S
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2514408
> I'd probably try an OC run if I swap motherboards and/or decide to break my raid for the 8th time.
> I might swap the GC3 later but not till christmas time-ish.


Have you removed the black glue?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Renairy*
> 
> I noticed you're using an Asrock board.
> FYI ... That chip is getting alot more V-core than 1.248v
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1310519/maximus-v-formula-vs-fatal1ty-z77-higher-v-core/0_30
> ASRock are dropping their offsets to give lower readings through the sensors.
> Asrock are a joke mate.
> On my old Z77 Fatal1ty, it was reporting 1.29v for 4.8Ghz..
> Now that i'm on a more truthful board... the v-core required for the same OC and same Chip is 1.35v


Not going to derail this thread however there is no proof that the Asrock z77 fatal1ty professional misreads voltage. your link does not prove that either.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Have you removed the black glue?


I think I only got most of it IIRC, else I got all of it from the pcb part and almost all from the IHS, at least from the edges. After taking so long getting it off I ended up trying to take it off with my finger lol. I'd like to guess it's just the spreader too high and I need to lower it.


----------



## ketapang

Really tempted to delid my 3570k now... Btw, any consequences running delidded processor for a long time?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Really tempted to delid my 3570k now... Btw, any consequences running delidded processor for a long time?


not really if you ask me,
if you done it, and put it all back together like it should ,
theres no real difference then before it was de-lidded..
but then, noone can tell yet..lol, its not that old


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not really if you ask me,
> if you done it, and put it all back together like it should ,
> theres no real difference then before it was delidded..
> but then, noone can tell yet..lol, its not that old


That was my thought, not enough time has passed for people to know lol... Would be pretty messed up if everyones delidded chips died in a month or so.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Really tempted to delid my 3570k now... Btw, any consequences running delidded processor for a long time?


Other than warranty void... shouldn't be too different than normal.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> That was my thought, not enough time has passed for people to know lol... Would be pretty messed up if everyones delidded chips died in a month or so.


hahaha... funny..


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> That was my thought, not enough time has passed for people to know lol... Would be pretty messed up if everyones delidded chips died in a month or so.


Oh no, mine has been delidded for ~2 months right now. I will give it a pep talk to not give up yet, maybe I can convince it to not do irrational things.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> Oh no, mine has been delidded for ~2 months right now. I will give it a pep talk to not give up yet, maybe I can convince it to not do irrational things.


lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I think I only got most of it IIRC, else I got all of it from the pcb part and almost all from the IHS, at least from the edges. After taking so long getting it off I ended up trying to take it off with my finger lol. I'd like to guess it's just the spreader too high and I need to lower it.


Yeah, I think it is the ihs being too far off from the die in the first place, and not so much the tim. (though nothing can beat Liquid Pro it seems...so far)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Other than warranty void... shouldn't be too different than normal.


That can be fixed


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, I think it is the ihs being too far off from the die in the first place, and not so much the tim. (though nothing can beat Liquid Pro it seems...so far)
> That can be fixed


Actually i kinda want to try the MetalPad from Coollaboratory and cut it to shape of the die isntead of trying the liquidmetal.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Actually i kinda want to try the MetalPad from Coollaboratory and cut it to shape of the die isntead of trying the liquidmetal.


If you want to sell me half of that metal pad for cheap hit me up in PM. I'd like to try that as well. I will wait for your results though.









I just ordered some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro from Frozen.CPU they have a ton of it in stock right now. I've read so many threads on delidding from different forums and the best results seem to be from Liquid Pro. Right now I am using IC Diamond 24 so it will be interesting to see what type of improvement Liquid Pro offers.









It's going to take very little liquid pro to cover the die. I'm putting some on my hd7950 as well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Actually i kinda want to try the MetalPad from Coollaboratory and cut it to shape of the die isntead of trying the liquidmetal.


No do not i have the Metal pad and it sucks for tim....

Use the Cool Lab liquid metal pro.


----------



## HesterDW

At the risk of sounding dumb, what is the point in doing this?


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HesterDW*
> 
> At the risk of sounding dumb, what is the point in doing this?


Lower temperatures of up to 20c in some scenarios.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HesterDW*
> 
> At the risk of sounding dumb, what is the point in doing this?


You have 100 posts nobody can call you dumb till you have atleast 500 lol

But it drops your temp to give more Overclocking head room.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You have 100 posts nobody can call you dumb till you have atleast 500 lol
> But it drops your temp to give more Overclocking head room.


Can I say dumb things then?


----------



## Vuzer

Question, if copper is best for thermal conductivity, why there's no copper IHS?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Can I say dumb things then?


Yes you can.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Can I say dumb things then?


Not yet


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yes you can.










you will regret that lol...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



p.s. I hope I dont get warned on that asrock thread


----------



## Hokies83

Yea pretty hard trolling that thread over there...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vuzer*
> 
> Question, if copper is best for thermal conductivity, why there's no copper IHS?


The IHS is made of nickel-plated copper









this guy sanded it a bit


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> The IHS is made of nickel-plated copper


Intel needs to make a solid gold chip, ihs, and heatsink XD

is that stupid enough?


----------



## Vuzer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> The IHS is made of nickel-plated copper


Ah i see, but wouldn't nickel take abit resistant?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Intel needs to make a solid gold chip, ihs, and heatsink XD
> is that stupid enough?


no srry, you have to do better then that ...lol


----------



## HesterDW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Lower temperatures of up to 20c in some scenarios.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You have 100 posts nobody can call you dumb till you have atleast 500 lol
> But it drops your temp to give more Overclocking head room.


Lol, I see. Thanks guys.


----------



## Vuzer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Intel needs to make a solid gold chip, ihs, and heatsink XD
> is that stupid enough?


I'm sure if you have the money you may can make a special order from intel ;P .. or from some private sector...


----------



## Vuzer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> The IHS is made of nickel-plated copper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this guy sanded it a bit


That's shinny, i likey.. bet that conduct the heat much better huh?

How to DIY sand it exactly?


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vuzer*
> 
> That's shinny, i likey.. bet that conduct the heat much better huh?


Lapping does not do much for temps, but it does help maybe a couple c at most and there is no real risk, so people do it.


----------



## ketapang

Thx for all the feedback guys.







Btw 1 more question, i heard how the liquid ultra tends to hardened after a long period. Is the same thing happens between the die & ihs? If so, how do i clean the metal residue on the die?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Thx for all the feedback guys.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Btw 1 more question, i heard how the liquid ultra tends to hardened after a long period. Is the same thing happens between the die & ihs? If so, how do i clean the metal residue on the die?


i did mine with papertowl, and some high alcohol cleaner, like 85-90% , isnt that hard to remove..

this, not sure what they call it elsewhere, we say spiritus.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denatured_alcohol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Thx for all the feedback guys.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Btw 1 more question, i heard how the liquid ultra tends to hardened after a long period. Is the same thing happens between the die & ihs? If so, how do i clean the metal residue on the die?


I bet and assume you could clean it off like I had to for my IHS with my indigo xtreme ETI. I used a razor blade and it just peeled right off.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vuzer*
> 
> Question, if copper is best for thermal conductivity, why there's no copper IHS?


Copper is the best but I think it's easier to make non copper allowes (allouwes........ummmm special metals made by man lol) (( shut up I can't spell sometimes))


----------



## VonDutch

the best aircooler would be solid copper, in stead of the alu fins they use now etc..

aluminium has a w/mk of 200, copper 400









EDIT:
yea, i can do "offtopic" .solly ..lol

im still very happy i de-lidded my 3770k








25C temp drop is amazing..lol..


----------



## Vuzer

I guess they use aluminum because copper weight much. I thought the IHS is alu too but hey its not! :O

Some day, i'll lap the IHS, then i'll delid it. I know i will.. mwhahaa....


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Lapping does not do much for temps, but it does help maybe a couple c at most and there is no real risk, so people do it.


You'll easily drop a good 5C+ in temps. For alot of people, =>5C is quite a big difference.

Start with 800grit sand paper, work up to 1500gritt, finish it off with using a single DRY 2000gritt piece. You can also finish it off with some polishing compound.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> lol, then...
> OCN name: JQuantum
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: gelid gc3 extreme
> ihs-TIM: gelid gc3 extreme
> Mhz gained: Unknown
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz @ 1.205 dVid (my top temps are good but it's unstable after 4.5GHz with this motherboard.... and it breaks my raid if it breaks... so I didn't bother much with the OC just a random number for stability)
> Temp drops: Unknown but my max load is ~ < 64 C at 4.5GHz at 1.205 + 0.015 dynamic voltage + turbo vdrop, I don't think mine gained a ton :S
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2514408
> I'd probably try an OC run if I swap motherboards and/or decide to break my raid for the 8th time.
> I might swap the GC3 later but not till christmas time-ish.


Accepted!


----------



## neopunx

Found this thanks to VonDutch.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=4


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> the best aircooler would be solid copper, in stead of the alu fins they use now etc..
> aluminium has a w/mk of 200, copper 400
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT:
> yea, i can do "offtopic" .solly ..lol
> im still very happy i de-lidded my 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 25C temp drop is amazing..lol..


I remember back in the XP-90 days, that the all copper version needed higher airflow fans to cool more efficiently than the Alu one, but with the same high cfm it did have an advantage, temp wise.
I think it is related to the ability to let go of heat alu has, which is better than copper's, despite copper absorbs heat faster.


----------



## SonDa5

IC Diamond rep posted some good damage control posts at TPU about the problems I have had with IC Diamond. Very good read and now I am not sure if Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/ultra is a good choice. I'm worried it will suffer from fast pump out/Burn out. This is when the TIM turns to dust and doesn't work very well.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2740927&postcount=239

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2740998&postcount=240

Good read. Read the whole thread as it develops.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> IC Diamond rep posted some good damage control posts at TPU about the problems I have had with IC Diamond. Very good read and now I am not sure if Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/ultra is a good choice. I'm worried it will suffer from fast pump out/Burn out. This is when the TIM turns to dust and doesn't work very well.
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2740927&postcount=239
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2740998&postcount=240
> Good read. Read the whole thread as it develops.


Just asking because I don't know... when does the die, IHS, or heatsink/ water block get to 150c? Or even close to that?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just asking because I don't know... when does the die, IHS, or heatsink/ water block get to 150c? Or even close to that?


Good question. I asked the IC Diamond rep that in that thread.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170121&page=10

I think it is just and extreme test but maby the unrealistic condition will never happen with lower temps. Looking forward to response from IC Diamond representative.


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just asking because I don't know... when does the die, IHS, or heatsink/ water block get to 150c? Or even close to that?


Nothing will reach those temperatures. The cores in the die will be the hottest points in the setup and those will not exceed much of what you see Realtemp displaying.


----------



## kgtuning

I see. I was just curious. Numbers and testing that mean nothing to us. Don't get me wrong, I use i c diamond between my IHS and water block. But real world testing is what we need.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I remember back in the XP-90 days, that the all copper version needed higher airflow fans to cool more efficiently than the Alu one, but with the same high cfm it did have an advantage, temp wise.
> I think it is related to the ability to let go of heat alu has, which is better than copper's, despite copper absorbs heat faster.


yea..besides the extra weight, a while ago i read a article/review about coolers,
and saw a company made one of their models pure copper..a anniversary model ..lol
so the reviewers tested that one too, to see if it would do better then the "normal" one,
it got the temps 3-4C more down








will look for the link , but theres alot of reviews about coolers out there ..lol


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I see. I was just curious. Numbers and testing that mean nothing to us. Don't get me wrong, I use i c diamond between my IHS and water block. But real world testing is what we need.


I agree. I understand that "pump out" can be a problem, but I doubt I will ever notice anything in the time I will be using this chip. Nobody can say with certainty that what that representative describes will actually happen. I will stay using Liquid Pro for under the IHS because it is simply the best and as long as I don't experience any problems (which I now have no reason for to suspect) I will keep using and recommending Liquid Pro.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I see. I was just curious. Numbers and testing that mean nothing to us. Don't get me wrong, I use i c diamond between my IHS and water block. But real world testing is what we need.


do the folding test then lol if you can fold for 4 days straight then your good lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> IC Diamond rep posted some good damage control posts at TPU about the problems I have had with IC Diamond. Very good read and now I am not sure if Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/ultra is a good choice. I'm worried it will suffer from fast pump out/Burn out. This is when the TIM turns to dust and doesn't work very well.
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2740927&postcount=239
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2740998&postcount=240
> Good read. Read the whole thread as it develops.


IC Diamond Spreads like crap You have to heat it or use a bunch of it to get it to spread. Ive used it for years and it is on both my gpus and my Cpu.

Gpu Tim will be replac3ed with Cool Lab Pro.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I have some ic diamond still...using it atm. Works good, after heating it and waiting for 5-10 minutes before slapping the heatsink on it though.
Good thing is it's not conductive, bad thing is it scratches stuff if you twirl your cooler while mounting it lol


----------



## Hokies83

I got mine when IC diamond first hit the market Review Samples etc.. Had like 30G of the stuff gave away 25G but i still have about 3G left lol...

After reading up Cool Lab Pro is the best tim.. And by the time any tim turned to dust the hardware would be so out dated or no longer working it would not matter anymore.


----------



## VonDutch

this is a nice read too., about de-lidding etc.
http://forum.avsim.net/topic/387006-ivy-bridge-pictorial-de-lidding-guide/

The final step is to apply your choice of TIM. I recommend using a liquid metal TIM such as Coollaboratory Liquid Pro or Liquid Ultra, Phobya Liquid Metal is a good option as well. In my testing, temperature drops by 20-30 degrees C over the stock thermal paste with the use of any liquid metal TIM when applied properly. Note: it may be necessary to apply some liquid metal to the underside of the IHS. You can check this by placing the IHS on the CPU die (simply let it rest, no force required, no need to use any adhesive to re-attach either) and placing the CPU back in the socket on the motherboard. You then use the CPU retention mechanism to hold it in place. Remove the CPU from the socket and the lid from the CPU to check the contact of the TIM. If you don't see a nice even splotch of TIM on the underside of the IHS go ahead and apply a thin layer of TIM to the underside of the IHS and then reinstall the CPU in the socket as described above.

For further temperature reduction one can lap their IHS (top side only!) and heatsink/waterblock base.

Good luck, and happy overclocking!

especialyy the Note,where he says,
" it may be necessary to apply some liquid metal to the underside of the IHS". etc.

thats what i did, did all the sides actually,
the manual from liquid pro mentoins it too,
you could/can apply a thin layer on both sides..something like that.
with the 1gram you could apply it like that several times..


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted!










lol thanks.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No do not i have the Metal pad and it sucks for tim....
> Use the Cool Lab liquid metal pro.


kk then avoiding metalpad... how bad was it?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol thanks.
> kk then avoiding metalpad... how bad was it?


10c worse then ic diamond on cpu

5c on gpu.

It is pretty much made for consoles.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 10c worse then ic diamond on cpu
> 5c on gpu.
> It is pretty much made for consoles.


+1 rep for the info

:S bummer, well saved me the time and pain finding out.


----------



## Valgaur

Thanks for the inquiry and call today; my apologies for the delayed reply; sure, we can send you a few 1155 mounts to review! Please provide your shipping address.

Here is an interesting test with LiquidPro (under the lid) and IX (above the lid): http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=391334

BTW: You had mentioned "thermal patches" for the Ivy Bridge chip; what are your specific requirements?

Sincerely,

I need the size of the die.....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> Thanks for the inquiry and call today; my apologies for the delayed reply; sure, we can send you a few 1155 mounts to review! Please provide your shipping address.
> 
> Here is an interesting test with LiquidPro (under the lid) and IX (above the lid): http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=391334
> 
> BTW: You had mentioned "thermal patches" for the Ivy Bridge chip; what are your specific requirements?
> 
> Sincerely,
> I need the size of the die.....


Who is sending 1155 mounts?


----------



## daddyfatsax

OCN name: daddyfatsax
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Timtronics Grey Ice 4200 (Waiting on CL Pro Liquid Metal
ihs-TIM: PK1
Mhz gained: 200
OC after delid: 4.7
Temp drops: 10C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Pending


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> Thanks for the inquiry and call today; my apologies for the delayed reply; sure, we can send you a few 1155 mounts to review! Please provide your shipping address.
> 
> Here is an interesting test with LiquidPro (under the lid) and IX (above the lid): http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=391334
> 
> BTW: You had mentioned "thermal patches" for the Ivy Bridge chip; what are your specific requirements?
> 
> Sincerely,
> I need the size of the die.....


Where did that come from? And can your read that link's language? Looked like CL Pro was best on it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Where did that come from? And can your read that link's language? Looked like CL Pro was best on it.


CL pro on the die an IC diamond on the IHS won.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *daddyfatsax*
> 
> OCN name: daddyfatsax
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Timtronics Grey Ice 4200 (Waiting on CL Pro Liquid Metal
> ihs-TIM: PK1
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4.7
> Temp drops: 10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Pending


Congrats!

All delidders get automatic REP+ from me. Significant step in over clocking IB.


----------



## Valgaur

Indigo is very interested in making die material for us lol thats why i asked for the size of the die and I'm getting free ETI for bench runs.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *daddyfatsax*
> 
> OCN name: daddyfatsax
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Timtronics Grey Ice 4200 (Waiting on CL Pro Liquid Metal
> ihs-TIM: PK1
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4.7
> Temp drops: 10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Pending


Accepted and thank you for the picture!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Indigo is very interested in making die material for us lol thats why i asked for the size of the die and I'm getting free ETI for bench runs.


Perhaps I should send them a message asking for some ETI...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Perhaps I should send them a message asking for some ETI...


anyone got a die dimensions?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Perhaps I should send them a message asking for some ETI...
> 
> 
> 
> anyone got a die dimensions?
Click to expand...

I don't think so, you should measure it. I'm about to go to sleep so I can't for now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't think so, you should measure it. I'm about to go to sleep so I can't for now.


Ohh well I'm asking the rep if they could make us a special die application.....wonder how many I'm gonna get?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't think so, you should measure it. I'm about to go to sleep so I can't for now.
> 
> 
> 
> Ohh well I'm asking the rep if they could make us a special die application.....wonder how many I'm gonna get?
Click to expand...

Are you asking about the die application or how many you're going to get for the IHS-Heatsink?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Are you asking about the die application or how many you're going to get for the IHS-Heatsink?


I'm curious to myself how many IHS ones i'll get.....I asked about the die applications.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Are you asking about the die application or how many you're going to get for the IHS-Heatsink?
> 
> 
> 
> I'm curious to myself how many IHS ones i'll get.....I asked about the die applications.
Click to expand...

I'm gonna go call them tomorrow and ask for some.







I'm probably gonna end up buying like 10 of the die applications and just give it out for free or something like that.


----------



## Donkey1514

voltages for those clocks on the spreadsheet would be awesome...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm gonna go call them tomorrow and ask for some.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm probably gonna end up buying like 10 of the die applications and just give it out for free or something like that.










they don't have die stuff...I'm asking them if they would be willing to work with us to make some....sheesh
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Donkey1514*
> 
> voltages for those clocks on the spreadsheet would be awesome...


I'll do that tomorrow probably. If everyone can give me their CPU-Z lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm gonna go call them tomorrow and ask for some.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm probably gonna end up buying like 10 of the die applications and just give it out for free or something like that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> they don't have die stuff...I'm asking them if they would be willing to work with us to make some....sheesh
Click to expand...

Yea, I know. Haha. I meant that if they actually do allow us to buy them, I'll buy about 10 for some giveaways if they delid obviously.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> they don't have die stuff...I'm asking them if they would be willing to work with us to make some....sheesh
> I'll do that tomorrow probably. If everyone can give me their CPU-Z lol.


You should have called it The Delidded Ivy Bridge / Sandy Bridge Ass kickers club...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I know. Haha. I meant that if they actually do allow us to buy them, I'll buy about 10 for some giveaways if they delid obviously.


Okay gotcha now!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You should have called it The Delidded Ivy Bridge / Sandy Bridge Ass kickers club...


I've thought about just naming it The Official Delidded Club...but would need to redo the front page a lot lol.


----------



## VonDutch

off topic question but, how do i get this under my posts, and other things?

Delidded Ivy Bridge Club 3770K
or
5 GHz Overclock Club 3770K @ 5.3 Ghz
etc etc..


----------



## SonDa5

Updating temp post.

My IC Diamond seems to be cooling better after a few days.

Also I have been able to tweak my voltage a little more than before for stability.

Under load at 4.5 GHZ my 3570k is stable with 1.13v.
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2537884

10 pass in diagnostic mode with maximum memory Intel Burn Test
Ambient Temps 24C.
Temps under IBT *63C 72C 71C 66C
*









*My temps at 4.5 GHZ have now lowered to 68C average per core.*







That is a *19.25C* per core average temperature drop so far since I de-lidded.









I didn't think IC Diamond had a break in period. The only things I have done is lower my CPU voltage from 1.17v to 1.15v in BIOS and I have raised my PLL voltage from 1.5v to 1.60v and lastly I hand tightened my cpu mount set screws just a little where they felt lose. I'm being as careful as possible to not crack the die with the block. (NO IHS)

As I tweak it for lower temps I will update with changes.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> off topic question but, how do i get this under my posts, and other things?
> Delidded Ivy Bridge Club 3770K
> or
> 5 GHz Overclock Club 3770K @ 5.3 Ghz
> etc etc..


Update your signature in your profile, click your name on the top right, click edit community profile scroll down until you get to your photo area or CTRL+F Signature and edit signature... I have trouble finding it too sometimes







.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Updating temp post.
> My IC Diamond seems to be cooling better after a few days.
> Also I have been able to tweak my voltage a little more than before for stability.
> Under load at 4.5 GHZ my 3570k is stable with 1.13v.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2537884
> 10 pass in diagnostic mode with maximum memory Intel Burn Test
> Ambient Temps 24C.
> Temps under IBT *63C 72C 71C 66C
> ***SNIP**
> *My temps at 4.5 GHZ have now lowered to 68C average per core.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is a *19.25C* per core average temperature drop so far since I de-lidded.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think IC Diamond had a break in period. The only things I have done is lower my CPU voltage from 1.17v to 1.15v in BIOS and I have raised my PLL voltage from 1.5v to 1.60v and lastly I hand tightened my cpu mount set screws just a little where they felt lose. I'm being as careful as possible to not crack the die with the block. (NO IHS)
> As I tweak it for lower temps I will update with changes.


I hate your voltages... i hate them kuz i'm jelly...

On a side note I bought two sets of LiquidMetal Pro from FrozenCPU and ready to face some insane duty/brokerage charges via customs +_+... too bad I didn't read the indigo post I would've waited.


----------



## kgtuning

Liquid pro has been ordered...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Update your signature in your profile, click your name on the top right, click edit community profile scroll down until you get to your photo area or CTRL+F Signature and edit signature... I have trouble finding it too sometimes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


found it , thanks


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> Thanks for the inquiry and call today; my apologies for the delayed reply; sure, we can send you a few 1155 mounts to review! Please provide your shipping address.
> 
> Here is an interesting test with LiquidPro (under the lid) and IX (above the lid): http://foro.noticias3d.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=391334
> 
> BTW: You had mentioned "thermal patches" for the Ivy Bridge chip; what are your specific requirements?
> 
> Sincerely,
> I need the size of the die.....


This is in Spanish? Can you translate it?


----------



## Conquistador SW

I don't speak a word Spanish, but from the graphs I get that they tested AS5 vs Liquid Pro for under the IHS. Result: Liquid Pro is much better under the IHS than AS5. However, on top of the IHS it does not really matter what TIM you use as long as it is decent TIM. The results in the thread even say that Indogo Xtreme and PK-1 are better for on top of the IHS. So the combo of Liquid Pro under the IHS and Indigo Xtreme on top of the IHS should give the best results.

This is exactly what I have been saying all the time. The TIM under the IHS is by far the more important; the difference between something like AS5 and Liquid Pro is huge. For on top of the IHS, the difference between the worst and best paste is much smaller and therefore does not matter as much. The area on top of the IHS is much larger which means other properties than thermal conductivity become important and therefore Liquid Pro might not be the best for on top of the IHS. For under the IHS however, Liquid Pro is by far the best (and maybe other liquid metals like Ultra, but I have never seen comparisons and I am willing to bet that Liquid Pro is still slightly better than Liquid Ultra.)


----------



## daddyfatsax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted and thank you for the picture!


Thank you.

Anyone have any tips on using CL Pro? I watched the video on their website and it looks they just put a tiny bit on the CPU and the swab spread it over the entire CPU. I do not want to put too much on the die, because I know cleaning that stuff up is a problem .


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd put a smallish dot and spread it like they do and check for proper contact with ihs, if neccesary apply some more on the underside of the ihs and swab it all over it.

Fast translation for the link above:

Liquid Pro on die + IX on IHS gives best results, but ihs tim doesn't matter that much.
He couldn't get 5ghz stable on his chip despite having max temps of 74c under load at 1.51v...So he backed down to 4.8ghz and called it a day.
He also mentions testing some 150cfm fans on the h100 but the cooling improvements were negligible compared to the 1450rpm GT's.


----------



## daddyfatsax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd put a smallish dot and spread it like they do and check for proper contact with ihs, if neccesary apply some more on the underside of the ihs and swab it all over it.
> Fast translation for the link above:
> Liquid Pro on die + IX on IHS gives best results, but ihs tim doesn't matter that much.
> He couldn't get 5ghz stable on his chip despite having max temps of 74c under load at 1.51v...So he backed down to 4.8ghz and called it a day.
> He also mentions testing some 150cfm fans on the h100 but the cooling improvements were negligible compared to the 1450rpm GT's.


Thanks.

Right now I am running a Swiftech block with a dual 120mm rad. I am using 2 Panaflo 38mm fans that are running at about 1400RPM. They are a little loud for my taste, but they do a great job.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *daddyfatsax*
> 
> Thanks.
> Right now I am running a Swiftech block with a dual 120mm rad. I am using 2 Panaflo 38mm fans that are running at about 1400RPM. They are a little loud for my taste, but they do a great job.


Do you run them as pull or push fans? Pull tends to make more noise...There's a useful thread that compares 120mm fans here.

That should give you some ideas


----------



## daddyfatsax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Do you run them as pull or push fans? Pull tends to make more noise...There's a useful thread that compares 120mm fans here.
> That should give you some ideas


Right now they are in push, since it is mounted to the top of my HAF X case. I like the swiftech block and rad because of the multiple inputs in the rad and the block has multiple outputs. Early next year I will be running 2 EVGA GTX 670 FTW watercooled in a parallel loop. I may have to move up to a triple rad or add another pump. Decisions....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *daddyfatsax*
> 
> Right now they are in push, since it is mounted to the top of my HAF X case. I like the swiftech block and rad because of the multiple inputs in the rad and the block has multiple outputs. Early next year I will be running 2 EVGA GTX 670 FTW watercooled in a parallel loop. I may have to move up to a triple rad or add another pump. Decisions....


Nice! 1x360 and 1x240 is your best bet...You could pull it off with 2x240 perhaps, with louder fans.


----------



## Valgaur

Yup you guys got the spanish page right. It says exactly that Liquid under and IX top has the best effects. I'm trying to see if IX representatives will be willing to make me special die application for benching and see how good it would be down there, but who knows lol.

Complete side note lol! Someone contacted me for a computer build from my company! w00t ooooooh happy day!!!

http://steeldds.com/


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yup you guys got the spanish page right. It says exactly that Liquid under and IX top has the best effects. I'm trying to see if IX representatives will be willing to make me special die application for benching and see how good it would be down there, but who knows lol.
> Complete side note lol! Someone contacted me for a computer build from my company! w00t ooooooh happy day!!!
> http://steeldds.com/


IC diamond on die = no no.

ON IHS = yes


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> IC diamond on die = no no.
> ON IHS = yes


compare you IC diamond seating to my IX seat.....


----------



## Hokies83

LoL that looks like cool labs L Metal pad...

Anywho my seat is fine i have a spare cpu/hs i use for test seats...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL that looks like cool labs L Metal pad...
> Anywho my seat is fine i have a spare cpu/hs i use for test seats...


Nice I need a bench test rig soon.........but that's not gonna happen lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh i got old cpus laying around that are worth 5 = 15$ each not worth the hassle of selling so i test stuff on them .. I also have a old water block 2 Antec 620s and a NH-D14 sitting here lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i got old cpus laying around that are worth 5 = 15$ each not worth the hassle of selling so i test stuff on them .. I also have a old water block 2 Antec 620s and a NH-D14 sitting here lol.


Make a Youtube account and make review videos and make bank lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yup you guys got the spanish page right. It says exactly that Liquid under and IX top has the best effects. I'm trying to see if IX representatives will be willing to make me special die application for benching and see how good it would be down there, but who knows lol.
> Complete side note lol! Someone contacted me for a computer build from my company! w00t ooooooh happy day!!!
> http://steeldds.com/


Great, good luck with your bussiness man








Hope that IX deal goes through too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i got old cpus laying around that are worth 5 = 15$ each not worth the hassle of selling so i test stuff on them .. I also have a old water block 2 Antec 620s and a NH-D14 sitting here lol.


You can always do some reviewing if you can write a semi decent article and provide accurate temps with proper equipment...You might need a good thermometer (those infrared ones perhaps), something to measure noise levels and perhaps you can build a custom wind tunnel to measure cfm too








Oh, and the most important thing, a good DSLR and some skill.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Great, good luck with your bussiness man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope that IX deal goes through too.
> You can always do some reviewing if you can write a semi decent article and provide accurate temps with proper equipment...You might need a good thermometer (those infrared ones perhaps), something to measure noise levels and perhaps you can build a custom wind tunnel to measure cfm too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and the most important thing, a good DSLR and some skill.


I been Reviewing the Galaxy GC Gtx 680 4GB and how much better built it is then it's Evga counter parts is quite shocking. from Vrams to Chokes to PCB design.. and even cooling..

Im more of a Gpu guy then cpu guy lol. Every Gpu ive got for the past 5-6 years ive had to take apart and look inside @[email protected]


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I been Reviewing the Galaxy GC Gtx 680 4GB and how much better built it is then it's Evga counter parts is quite shocking. from Vrams to Chokes to PCB design.. and even cooling..
> Im more of a Gpu guy then cpu guy lol. Every Gpu ive got for the past 5-6 years ive had to take apart and look inside @[email protected]


I am going to get the galaxy gc gtx670 4gb, its the only gtx670 I would consider.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> I am going to get the galaxy gc gtx670 4gb, its the only gtx670 I would consider.


Samsung Vrams custom chokes vented pcb..





Only Knock i found on it is the Heatsink it'sself is not polished it is kinda rough.. i took 800 >1500>2500 grit sand papeer smoothed it uut temps drops 3=5c.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I ordered a 670 ftw, I'd rather have EVGA's customer support...buying from abroad and all. If I had got another brand I'd be screwed.

EDIT: I have something waiting for me at the Post office, not sure if it's Liquid Ultra or an Iphone 4s 16gb...I'll pick it up tomorrow.
I decided to delid this weekend and remove the glue to make better contact between the ihs and die, whilst keeping the stock paste.
I'll record delta temps with that setup and as soon as I get my Liquid Ultra I'll try with that instead of the stock tim, to see if there's any improvement.
What do you guys think?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I ordered a 670 ftw, I'd rather have EVGA's customer support...buying from abroad and all. If I had got another brand I'd be screwed.
> EDIT: I have something waiting for me at the Post office, not sure if it's Liquid Ultra or an Iphone 4s 16gb...I'll pick it up tomorrow.
> I decided to delid this weekend and remove the glue to make better contact between the ihs and die, whilst keeping the stock paste.
> I'll record delta temps with that setup and as soon as I get my Liquid Ultra I'll try with that instead of the stock tim, to see if there's any improvement.
> What do you guys think?


Galaxy has re trained and hired 20 more customer service reps... There just as good as Evga now.. selling better made Gpus... Besides Ref cards there all the same pretty much..

When buying a Ref card just get the cheapest one lol... However... With Galaxy a rma takes 1 week for me it did took 5 days to get my new card.. Evga took 2 weeks... Evga is on the west coast.. Galaxy planed this smart and put there Rma center in the middle of the country so there faster.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Galaxy has re trained and hired 20 more customer service reps... There just as good as Evga now.. selling better made Gpus... Besides Ref cards there all the same pretty much..
> When buying a Ref card just get the cheapest one lol... However... With Galaxy a rma takes 1 week for me it did took 5 days to get my new card.. Evga took 2 weeks... Evga is on the west coast.. Galaxy planed this smart and put there Rma center in the middle of the country so there faster.


*hint: read my location under my avatar*

Not reading my post properly...I live in Argentina and I bought an EVGA card from the US, cause pricing here is insane. ($1000 for a gtx670)
I contacted several brands and the only two brands that would offer me a warranty despite buying from another country were EVGA and Gigabyte, both serial no. based.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> *hint: read my location under my avatar*
> Not reading my post properly...I live in Argentina and I bought an EVGA card from the US, cause pricing here is insane. ($1000 for a gtx670)
> I contacted several brands and the only two brands that would offer me a warranty despite buying from another country were EVGA and Gigabyte, both serial no. based.


Yeah, I have a friend in mexico that just built himself a computer because the xbox and xbox games cost soooo much there. He said its like 110$ for an xbox game where he is from so he just switched to pc because of steam.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> IC diamond on die = no no.
> ON IHS = yes


Working well for me so far. I'm not using IHS. I have LIquid Pro on the way to compare to IC Diamond.


----------



## Chewy

why do some people say get liquid pro and others say get the ultra version??

Which one hardens over time?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> *hint: read my location under my avatar*
> Not reading my post properly...I live in Argentina and I bought an EVGA card from the US, cause pricing here is insane. ($1000 for a gtx670)
> I contacted several brands and the only two brands that would offer me a warranty despite buying from another country were EVGA and Gigabyte, both serial no. based.


Yah i kno i was speaking for americans lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chewy*
> 
> why do some people say get liquid pro and others say get the ultra version??
> Which one hardens over time?


Pro has better heat transfer then Ultra.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Working well for me so far. I'm not using IHS. I have LIquid Pro on the way to compare to IC Diamond.


IC diamond Scratches things and i would not want my die scratched and i have both already... IC Diamond is easy to remove Cool LAb LP is not.. But under the IHS where u will not have to remove it.. CL LP should see upwards to 5c improvement over IC diamond... Do to it making it like one Object being like a solder instead of a tim.


----------



## Hokies83

dbl post


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah i kno i was speaking for americans lol
> Pro has better heat transfer then Ultra.
> IC diamond Scratches things and i would not want my die scratched and i have both already... IC Diamond is easy to remove Cool LAb LP is not.. But under the IHS where u will not have to remove it.. CL LP should see upwards to 5c improvement over IC diamond... Do to it making it like one Object being like a solder instead of a tim.


From what the I have read IC Diamond if removed with a solvent and dabbed not rubbed will clean off without making little tiny micro scratches. When I swap out the IC Diamond TIM for Liquid Pro next week I will see how my die has been doing so far. I hope it's not scratched. I will post photos.

Also I don't want to glue my die to my water block with Liquid Pro. I am not using the IHS. I am using a copper DT Sniper water block. Are you sure that Liquid Pro will create a glue like bond between the die and the copper water block?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> From what the I have read IC Diamond if removed with a solvent and dabbed not rubbed will clean off without making little tiny micro scratches. When I swap out the IC Diamond TIM for Liquid Pro next week I will see how my die has been doing so far. I hope it's not scratched. I will post photos.
> Also I don't want to glue my die to my water block with Liquid Pro. I am not using the IHS. I am using a copper DT Sniper water block and I don't think. Are you sure that Liquid Pro will create a glue like bond between the die and the copper water block?


I do not know, but have you heard that PRO causes the IHS to stick to the die so that it is hard to remove? Or maybe damage the die once applied? I would not like that if true, and I have not heard that it does, but your concerns that it might make your HSF stick to your die makes me want to know.

And yes, I'd love to see how the IC Diamond did as it is an option for some and others worry that it will damage the die.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I do not know, but have you heard that PRO causes the IHS to stick to the die so that it is hard to remove? Or maybe damage the die once applied? I would not like that if true, and I have not heard that it does, but your concerns that it might make your HSF stick to your die makes me want to know.
> And yes, I'd love to see how the IC Diamond did as it is an option for some and others worry that it will damage the die.


I think it sticks to metals (corrodes aluminum) but it has trouble sticking to the die occationally and you need to actually rough the die a little to allow the LP to stick properly.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> >>>>> Surprising also was his finding that direct die to HFS did not help to reduce temps as much as he had thought they would.
> see #583:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24
> _________________________________
> ....
> The take home message there is replacing the CPU TIM doesn't really provide any benefit. Reducing the gap between the CPU and the IHS does. And *removing the IHS entirely doesn't really provide much benefit either.*
> And that stands to reason. The heat is going to flow through the copper of the IHS the same as it does through the copper of the H100 waterblock.
> But if there is a thick pad of thermal paste in the way, as was the case with my 3770k at time of purchase, then it doesn't really matter how good the TIM itself is (unless it too is made of metal) because the mere presence of that thick pad of thermal paste becomes the weakest link in the thermal conductivity equation.
> Once you eliminate the bottleneck that is the gap between the IHS and the CPU, or if you happen to end up with an Ivy Bridge CPU which doesn't have much of a gap to begin with (Yuriman ), then you have pretty much optimized the system at that point regardless which CPU TIM of choice you employ and regardless whether or not you leave the IHS in place.
> Now the choice of CPU TIM still plays a role in terms of the robustness in maintaining those nice low temperatures. If the so-called "pump out" effect is real then we can expect it to bite us unless we choose a substitute CPU TIM that is designed to avoid such thermo-mechanical effects.
> I haven't really got into testing that part out yet, but I expect IC Diamond and the metal TIMs like Liquid Ultra to be key there. [/SPOILER]
> Courtesy of PCWargamer.


Valguar I think removing the IHS completely does help.









The key improvement that de-lidding does is allow the modder to apply the perfect coat of TIM and it allows the modder to apply the perfect mount.

A perfect mount is when you have perfect thermal contact area pressure and you have the best TIM applied properly.

My logic for not using the IHS is based entirely on contact pressure tests that I have performed with contact pressure paper.

My test results with the IHS and without. The solid pink colors shows good pressure and surface area contact for maximum thermal dissipation.

Bad contact area coverage and pressure between DT Sniper water block and IHS.


Good contact area coverage and pressure between DT Sniper water block and the die.


When you have mixed TIMs and multiple surfaces to transfer heat IMO the effectiveness of the heat transfer is going to be hindered. Maximum heat transfer is more likely between only 2 surfaces and a TIM rather than 4 surfaces and 2 mixed TIMs.

That is my logic for direct DIE mount being superior to DIE+IHS.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Valguar I think removing the IHS completely does help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The key improvement that de-lidding does is allow the modder to apply the perfect coat of TIM and it allows the modder to apply the perfect mount.
> A perfect mount is when you have perfect thermal contact area pressure and you have the best TIM applied properly.
> My logic for not using the IHS is based entirely on contact pressure tests that I have performed with contact pressure paper.
> My test results with the IHS and without. The solid pink colors shows good pressure and surface area contact for maximum thermal dissipation.
> Bad contact area coverage and pressure between DT Sniper water block and IHS.
> 
> Good contact area coverage and pressure between DT Sniper water clock and the die.
> 
> When you have mixed TIMs and multiple surfaces to transfer heat IMO the effectiveness of the heat transfer is going to be hindered. Maximum heat transfer is more likely between only 2 surfaces and a TIM rather than 4 surfaces and 2 mixed TIMs.
> That is my logic for direct die mount being superior to mount with DIE+IHS.


LM pro + Ihs + Ic diamond vs die + IC diamond u maybe getting 1 c better cooling 2 c tops.. but then u also have an exposed die which nobody recommends doing for the min gain u get if any.

Anywhos i have been using IC diamond before it was able to buy... as i got samples from them to test on GPU's before they released it...

Ive put IC Diamond on tons of things.. Many seats of coolers on my 3770k and about 6 gpus multi times lol. My 2600k my i5 750 and my i7 930 lol each with multi seats with diff coolers.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> but then u also have an exposed die which nobody recommends doing for the min gain u get of any.


I don't have any problems doing a direct die mount. The key to effective mount is in the contact area coverage and pressure between the surfaces and the TIM used.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Valguar I think removing the IHS completely does help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The key improvement that de-lidding does is allow the modder to apply the perfect coat of TIM and it allows the modder to apply the perfect mount.
> A perfect mount is when you have perfect thermal contact area pressure and you have the best TIM applied properly.
> My logic for not using the IHS is based entirely on contact pressure tests that I have performed with contact pressure paper.
> My test results with the IHS and without. The solid pink colors shows good pressure and surface area contact for maximum thermal dissipation.
> Bad contact area coverage and pressure between DT Sniper water block and IHS.
> 
> When you have mixed TIMs and multiple surfaces to transfer heat IMO the effectiveness of the heat transfer is going to be hindered. Maximum heat transfer is more likely between only 2 surfaces and a TIM rather than 4 surfaces and 2 mixed TIMs.
> That is my logic for direct DIE mount being superior to DIE+IHS.


I think most of us, through logic, agree with you that it _ought_ to be better without the IHS - and it is. But what the person who wrote that (*Idontcare*) found when he tested it was that it didn't provide much benefit. Not what he wanted nor expected, I might add.

Read post #583 on the link below to see what temp data *Idontcare* found through his testing. Also, I think I saw you on that thread, so maybe you already know what he found and disagree. If so, it would be great if you can test it yourself and share if you get significant temp differences as that would help us to make a more informed decission to go directly to die or keep using the IHS. I hope you can find even more improvments!









http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I don't have any problems doing a direct die mount. The key to effective mount is in the contact area coverage and pressure between the surfaces and the TIM used.


I agree with you SonDa on the fact of Physics and how heat moves through objects. when you see a pane engine they have built in cooling through fins in the engine block. (just go with me here lol) when you think about all the material you would have to go through from the die to TIM then IHS then TIM to waterblock. Even if it's soldered on you will have resistance no matter what the material is. There is nothing in this world that has perfect 100% heat transfer. With direct mounting you pump the heat straight into the dump site (allbeit heatsink or radiator cooling). Now if you can get something like Liquid or IX inbetween the two for as more flush seal in case of uneven ness then that is completely ideal. How does the human body cool itself? it puts viens right under the skin skin = TIM, blood vessels = the die, the water or air = the cooler. now put on a coat.....It's gonna take a while now wont it. the coat is resistance like the IHS.

So to make it short basically resistance is resistance. the less stuff you have in the way the more heat you can just straight out dump. Also your cooling can only take so much heat as it stands. Their are limits to coolers so eventually you will reach it with even the best TIM in the world.

Hope that clarifies this subject lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

That write off was perfect, and sort of made me think of overclocking myself







(reminded me of that cooling device for your wrists/forearm that improved your muscle tissue regeneration or something)


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I think most of us, through logic, agree with you that it _ought_ to be better without the IHS - and it is. But what the person who wrote that (*Idontcare*) found when he tested it was that it didn't provide much benefit. Not what he wanted nor expected, I might add.
> Read post #583 on the link below to see what temp data *Idontcare* found through his testing. Also, I think I saw you on that thread, so maybe you already know what he found and disagree. If so, it would be great if you can test it yourself and share if you get significant temp differences as that would help us to make a more informed decission to go directly to die or keep using the IHS. I hope you can find even more improvments!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24


I'm *not* going to do the test because as I have shown with my contact paper pressure tests results my IHS doesn't have very good contact with my DT SNIPER water block and because I don't think the added resistance of multiple TIMS and surfaces is better than direct mount between 2 surfaces and 1 TIM.

Idontcare did show that the lowest temps were achieved by going direct die wihout the IHS. Also in Idontcare's thread he stated that he had problems doing the direct die mount method. His CPU wouldn't boot a few times. It was tricky getting it done.

This is Idontcare's chart he made to show how performance was with IHS or without. Without IHS direct DIE mount was the coolest.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I'm *not* going to do the test because as I have shown with my contact paper pressure tests results my IHS doesn't have very good contact with my DT SNIPER water block and because I don't think the added resistance of multiple TIMS and surfaces is better than direct mount between 2 surfaces and 1 TIM.
> Idontcare did show that the lowest temps were achieved by going direct die wihout the IHS. Also in Idontcare's thread he stated that he had problems doing the direct die mount method. His CPU wouldn't boot a few times. It was tricky getting it done.
> This is Idontcare's chart he made to show how performance was with IHS or without. Wihout IHS direct DIE mount was the coolest.


Yep. His lowest temps were direct to die. Not as much benefit as he had hoped though. Maybe he did not get much benefit due to what you note about his problems doing direct die mount. I do not think he is done though and hope he continues testing different TIMs using direct to die and gets us more info on it as it ought to make a significant difference.

Are you going to be able to mount your HFS directly to the die? Or does it end up unsiuted to the task?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Are you going to be able to mount your *HFS* directly to the die? Or does it end up unsiuted to the task?


I don't follow you???? HFS = "Holy F***ing S**t"???







???

You mean IHS???


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I don't follow you???? HFS = "Holy F***ing S**t"???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ???
> You mean IHS???


LOL - Sorry! Do you think you can get your DT SNIPER water block to go directly onto your die? Or will you need to keep using your IHS?

(My mistake, typo, not supposed to be HFS, but HSF = Heat Sink & Fan - cooling unit - in this case your DT SNIPER water block!)


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> LOL - Sorry! Do you think you can get your DT SNIPER water block to go directly onto your die? Or will you need to keep using your IHS?
> (My mistake, typo, not supposed to be HFS, but HSF = Heat Sink & Fan - cooling unit - in this case your DT SNIPER water block!)


Read the chart on page 1 bro.










I have never used the IHS. I skipped IHS from day 1 of my delid and went straight to direct mount between DIE and DT SNIPER water block.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Read the chart on page 1 bro.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have never used the IHS. I skipped IHS from day 1 of my delid and went straight to direct mount between DIE and DT SNIPER water block.


Double sorry dude! Is it working as well as you have hoped and wanted? Are you seeing temps significantly lower than the delided IHS people???

I just ordered some CoolLab Ultra from Sidewinders - it should be here sometime next week! I'm going to delid my IB as soon as I can after that and hope to see some much improved temps!

...and maybe a higher max OC if I'm lucky - watch out *Valgaur* - I'm going to try to get to 5.3Ghz and beyond!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Double sorry dude! Is it working as well as you have hoped and wanted? Are you seeing temps significantly lower than the delided IHS people???
> I just ordered some CoolLab Ultra from Sidewinders - it should be here sometime next week! I'm going to delid my IB as soon as I can after that and hope to see some much improved temps!
> ...and maybe a higher max OC if I'm lucky - watch out *Valgaur* - I'm going to try to get to 5.3Ghz and beyond!


The pro is the one you want.. twice the thermal transfer then ultra.. Ultra is just more user friendly.

I ordered mine direct from Cool Labs lol.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Double sorry dude! Is it working as well as you have hoped and wanted? Are you seeing temps significantly lower than the delided IHS people???
> I just ordered some CoolLab Ultra from Sidewinders - it should be here sometime next week! I'm going to delid my IB as soon as I can after that and hope to see some much improved temps!
> ...and maybe a higher max OC if I'm lucky - watch out *Valgaur* - I'm going to try to get to 5.3Ghz and beyond!


SideWinders is great shop.

With IC Diamond my average temperature has dropped 19.25C per core. I am very happy with the performance but I want more!!!









I will put Liquid Metal PRO to the test.


----------



## Hokies83

Maybe need to start a 5ghz + overclocking guide now that it seems easy to pass 5ghz on IB...

As long as temps are good im willing to go to 1.6v and see what that gets me.. 5ghz takes 1.35v.. so maybe 5.3 = 5.5?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The pro is the one you want.. twice the thermal transfer then ultra.. Ultra is just more user friendly.
> I ordered mine direct from Cool Labs lol.


The user friendly part is nice, but I hear the PRO is very tough to remove - needs to be sanded off? And the PRO and ULTRA are _supposed_ to be about the same. Is there really a known gap between them? If so, are we talking 1-2C, or more?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> SideWinders is great shop.
> With IC Diamond my average temperature has dropped 19.25C per core. I am very happy with the performance but I want more!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will put Liquid Metal PRO to the test.


Nice temp drop. Yeah, Sidewinders has a great price for Ultra right now.

I am really interested in how the PRO will work for you compared to the IC Diamond. I think they are both top TIMs. I am still a bit concerned about scratching the die surface with ICD.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The pro is the one you want.. twice the thermal transfer then ultra.. Ultra is just more user friendly.
> I ordered mine direct from Cool Labs lol.
> 
> 
> 
> The user friendly part is nice, but I hear the PRO is very tough to remove - needs to be sanded off? And the PRO and ULTRA are _supposed_ to be about the same. Is there really a known gap between them? If so, are we talking 1-2C, or more.
Click to expand...

I have stated this before, the *PRO vs Ultra yield no difference in temperature*.



Just because one has a higher spec than the other doesn't mean it'll perform better.


----------



## Valgaur

Man this 5.4.......it's tough....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Man this 5.4.......it's tough....


I donno but 5.2-5.3 should be faster then a 3960x is everything besides the 5 things that use more then 8 threads lol.

You need to get some benchmark results that do not use more then 8 threads to show.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Man this 5.4.......it's tough....


Yea...I had a hard time too...
I got 5.3 so easily. I just booted up like nothing, but the second I tried doing 5.4, I couldn't do anything! Well, if anyone gets 5.4 on a 3570k, remember to join the 2GHz club. I'm OP to it and it's been quiet for a long time.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Man this 5.4.......it's tough....


Have you tried the ice on your rad or a home made duct tube thing to blow cold AC air STRAIGHT to your rad?
Also, less vcore might do more for you than mindlessly pumping volts through your chip









Gotta go to bed now...I trust I'll wake up and see some 5.5ghz validation. G'night!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno but 5.2-5.3 should be faster then a 3960x is everything besides the 5 things that use more then 8 threads lol.
> You need to get some benchmark results that do not use more then 8 threads to show.


check my delidding before and after results thread. It's not about speed here or this time.....It's about bragging right now














darn roomate being asleep so I can't pump super chilled air in....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno but 5.2-5.3 should be faster then a 3960x is everything besides the 5 things that use more then 8 threads lol.
> You need to get some benchmark results that do not use more then 8 threads to show.
> 
> 
> 
> check my delidding before and after results thread. It's not about speed here or this time.....It's about bragging right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> darn roomate being asleep so I can't pump super chilled air in....
Click to expand...

Screw your roommate! Do it! I can't live with a roommate because I'll drive them mad with my Blues keyboard.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Man this 5.4.......it's tough....


You know *VonDutch* is only at 5301.82, and your at 5300.55, which means only a slight bump of bclk will put you on top.....

Are you making any progress above your 5300.55?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> check my delidding before and after results thread. It's not about speed here or this time.....It's about bragging right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> darn roomate being asleep so I can't pump super chilled air in....


Benchmarks = bragging rights.


----------



## Swag

@*Valgaur*

When benching or going for Extreme OCs, turn off HT. Don't cheat though, you can only go a max of half of what you have so all you can do is turn off HT! Don't touch how many cores! For all 3570k owners, you can only disable 2 cores. After that, it's just cheating!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Benchmarks = bragging rights.


duh hence me pushing for 5.4 Ghz


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @*Valgaur*
> When benching or going for Extreme OCs, turn off HT. Don't cheat though, you can only go a max of half of what you have so all you can do is turn off HT! Don't touch how many cores! For all 3570k owners, you can only disable 2 cores. After that, it's just cheating!


Well, that's nice to know....where did you get those rules? Are they, like, official type rules from somewhere?

Makes me think I might be able to get to 5.3...hmmmm.....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Man this 5.4.......it's tough....


let me show you how its done ..today ...muhaha..


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I have stated this before, the *PRO vs Ultra yield no difference in temperature*.
> 
> Just because one has a higher spec than the other doesn't mean it'll perform better.


I have tried to explain multiple times why these benchmarks are irrelevant for under the IHS. Please please don't choose your TIM based upon tests done on top of the IHS.

Swag, by your logic, Indigo Xtreme or IC diamond would be the best under the IHS (because when used on top of the IHS they perform best). However, they are not even close to Liquid Pro when used under the IHS. Another example: according to this tests, using MX4 would give almost the same results while in reality, there is a ~10C difference between the using Liquid Pro and MX4 when used under the IHS.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> let me show you how its done ..today ...muhaha..


Go for it lol. I tried all night long for 2 hours trying to get it I even went as far as 1.7 Vcore (Yeah I know). I'm gonna have to wait until tomorrow night for another run....darn roomate.......


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> I have tried to explain multiple times why these benchmarks are irrelevant for under the IHS. Please please don't choose your TIM based upon tests done on top of the IHS.
> Swag, by your logic, Indigo Xtreme or IC diamond would be the best under the IHS (because when used on top of the IHS they perform best). However, they are not even close to Liquid Pro when used under the IHS. Another example: according to this tests, using MX4 would give almost the same results while in reality, there is a ~10C difference between the using Liquid Pro and MX4 when used under the IHS.


Do you know what the temp difference is between PRO and ULTRA between the die and IHS? How significant? Cause I have some ULTRA on the way and I hope it works. I still expect it to be better than what I have now (AS5), but I'd like to know how much better PRO is than ULTRA. Any good links to delided tests and results between the two?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Go for it lol. I tried all night long for 2 hours trying to get it I even went as far as 1.7 Vcore (Yeah I know). I'm gonna have to wait until tomorrow night for another run....darn roomate.......


but youre temps where still good?

im still a bit confused about using 1.6-1.7V vcore in relation to temperature
lets say i can get to 5.4ghz with 1.7V vcore, with temps not even reaching 80C,
is it ok to do or?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Do you know what the temp difference is between PRO and ULTRA between the die and IHS? How significant? Cause I have some ULTRA on the way and I hope it works. I still expect it to be better than what I have now (AS5), but I'd like to know how much better PRO is than ULTRA. Any good links to delided tests and results between the two?


No one knows because nobody has had both to test!

This is the last time I want to read this lol. I've read it to many time for myself, no offence or anything to anybody......cranky I couldn't get 5.4 Ghz........Plus We go back and forth on this Pro and Ultra argument every day or so lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Do you know what the temp difference is between PRO and ULTRA between the die and IHS? How significant? Cause I have some ULTRA on the way and I hope it works. I still expect it to be better than what I have now (AS5), but I'd like to know how much better PRO is than ULTRA. Any good links to delided tests and results between the two?


it will do better then AS5, let me look today if i can find tests between PRO and ULTRA,
will be hard i think, most tests are the "normal" ones, with IHS on..no De-lidding.


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No one knows because nobody has had both to test!
> This is the last time I want to read this lol. I've read it to many time for myself, no offence or anything to anybody......cranky I couldn't get 5.4 Ghz........Plus We go back and forth on this Pro and Ultra argument every day or so lol.


No one knows indeed, but most benchmark show that the better the thermal conductivity, the better the TIM does under the IHS, that is why I think Pro will be better. However, the difference will probably be small and as long as nobody does a good Pro vs Ultra test we can not be sure there even is a difference.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No one knows because nobody has had both to test!
> This is the last time I want to read this lol. I've read it to many time for myself, no offence or anything to anybody......cranky I couldn't get 5.4 Ghz........Plus We go back and forth on this Pro and Ultra argument every day or so lol.


maybe we can ask it different,
is there anyone, here or elsewhere, who had a 20+C temp drop
using different compound then CLP on the Die ?

i can only compare what ive used, that is AS5 and after that liquid pro,
let the pic's speak for its self..

after de-lid, using AS5, oc 4.545ghz

80C hottest core

after de-lid, using coollaboratory liquid pro, oc 4.545ghz

55C hottest core


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it will do better then AS5, let me look today if i can find tests between PRO and ULTRA,
> will be hard i think, most tests are the "normal" ones, with IHS on..no De-lidding.


That would be great







If you are going to do this, might I ask you to repeat the tests (replying the TIM) as many times as you are willing to do? Because I am afraid that if you do a single comparison, you might end up with results that are not very reliable which would be a shame as you put time and money in doing the test.
(Edit; oops, read your post wrong, I thought you were going to do the test







)

And you are right, because most tests are done with the IHS on, these tests have no relevant information for us unfortunately. Even if Pro or Ultra are better on top of the IHS, this might not be the case under the IHS.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> That would be great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are going to do this, might I ask you to repeat the tests (replying the TIM) as many times as you are willing to do? Because I am afraid that if you do a single comparison, you might end up with results that are not very reliable which would be a shame as you put time and money in doing the test.
> (Edit; oops, read your post wrong, I thought you were going to do the test
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> And you are right, because most tests are done with the IHS on, these tests have no relevant information for us unfortunately. Even if Pro or Ultra are better on top of the IHS, this might not be the case under the IHS.


lol, i could, but having it run like it is now, with my temps,
im afraid to ruin it, and never get the same results again,
"never change a winning team" .right









my idle temps at noon, 12 o'clock, 30 min idle

looks like the lowest is about the same as my ambient temp next to my computer.. 13C
hope winter will be here soon haha, cant wait for -10 or -15C








comp is not in my livingroom, but in the hallway, no heater there so


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well, that's nice to know....where did you get those rules? Are they, like, official type rules from somewhere?
> Makes me think I might be able to get to 5.3...hmmmm.....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Go for it lol. I tried all night long for 2 hours trying to get it I even went as far as 1.7 Vcore (Yeah I know). I'm gonna have to wait until tomorrow night for another run....darn roomate.......


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> but youre temps where still good?
> im still a bit confused about using 1.6-1.7V vcore in relation to temperature
> lets say i can get to 5.4ghz with 1.7V vcore, with temps not even reaching 80C,
> is it ok to do or?


I wouldn't pump more than 1.55v on air, even for benching...Plus, that should be enough to get you up there. You're causing instability by forcing that much vcore, generating higher temps that demand more vcore. It's a vicious circle! Read Sin's guide, he explains that there.
You should try to disable HT and disable 2 cores. That's what those max cpu-z validation guys do, world record and whatnot. It's not cheating, hwbot guys do it.
And you don't need to freeze your room, just make some sort of tubing to connect the cold air outlet of your ac to the intake of your case.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol, i could, but having it run like it is now, with my temps,
> im afraid to ruin it, and never get the same results again,
> "never change a winning team" .right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my idle temps at noon, 12 o'clock, 30 min idle
> 
> looks like the lowest is about the same as my ambient temp next to my computer.. 13C
> hope winter will be here soon haha, cant wait for -10 or -15C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> comp is not in my livingroom, but in the hallway, no heater there so


You may want to watch your humidity levels when you start to get those kind of ambients. Condensation is a distinct possibility, you may want to consider a dew point indicator of some sort. Otherwise it is a good use of mother nature to help lower your temps.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> You may want to watch your humidity levels when you start to get those kind of ambients. Condensation is a distinct possibility, you may want to consider a dew point indicator of some sort. Otherwise it is a good use of mother nature to help lower your temps.


will do,
i read somewhere that Condensation starts at 6C ?
nice and shiny Die btw ..lol


----------



## kgtuning

As soon as I get my liquid pro I'll post a real submission but here it is not cleaned, I did reassemble and test to make sure it boots and we have success! thanks for all the info guys!! I will rep accordingly.


----------



## Valgaur

My 680 truely hates my current work unit......a lot


----------



## Vuzer

Umm, anyone can think of a resell value for a delidded 3570K and 3770K? :/


----------



## Hokies83

10% Higher then normal ones

The biggest boost would be if it does 5.3ghz like the ones above that would be another 20% boost.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> As soon as I get my liquid pro I'll post a real submission but here it is not cleaned, I did reassemble and test to make sure it boots and we have success! thanks for all the info guys!! I will rep accordingly.


Great


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Valgaur, you chickened out?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, you chickened out?


Shut up.......


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Great


yeah I couldn't help myself this morning, just had the urge to cut the lid off. too bad I have to wait another day or two before coollabs pro gets here.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Shut up.......












Come on man! I expect more from you


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Shut up.......


little update from me hitting the 5.4ghz ...... nope! ...lol
1.7V didnt do it, could loggin to windows, but not everything loaded etc ..no go,
im done with it tho, i like doing some crazy , but everyone says, 1.55V vcore is max,
1.6V vcore at the 5.3ghz was over the max, and about as high as i was willing to go ,
but i had to try anyways right ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Come on man! I expect more from you


meanie







..haha, let the man first drink some coffee, kick out his roommate, and lower AC ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> yeah I couldn't help myself this morning, just had the urge to cut the lid off. too bad I have to wait another day or two before coollabs pro gets here.


yea i know, i had to wait 6 days, because of a weekend ..grmbl ..
but it will be well worth it, im sure..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> meanie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..haha, let the man first drink some coffee, kick out his roommate, and lower AC ..


I'm tempted to try again but my darn 680 won't fold for some reason...but i'll bench heaven....... -.-


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm tempted to try again but my darn 680 won't fold for some reason...but i'll bench heaven....... -.-


How strange man!








No artifacts on screen when running heaven or 3dm11?

I bet you'll succeed with the 5.4ghz run, eventually...Please don't die of hypothermia though


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> How strange man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No artifacts on screen when running heaven or 3dm11?
> I bet you'll succeed with the 5.4ghz run, eventually...Please don't die of hypothermia though


Yeah it runs perfectly fine I'm gonna play some league and see what happens it freaking benched heaven fully and everything....but this work unit....just won't run at all...it is a highly experimental one but still


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hopefully it's a problem with the [email protected] client...and not your card.


----------



## Hokies83

meh My Grand mother died from Cancer yesterday.. after a long battle she is out of pain....

Beloved Mother, Grandmother and Great Grandmother"

ROANOKE, VA Geraldine M. (Woods) Simpson, "Geri" as she was known, died Monday, October 8, 2012 at Pheasant Ridge Nursing & Rehab Center in Roanoke, Virginia. She was the widow of Preston Simpson who passed away in 1999.
Born July 6, 1942, she was a daughter of the late George F. and Irene (Lambert) Woods. She was raised and educated in the Merrimack valley, where she lived for most of her life. She was a graduate of Lowell High School and attended Springfield Community College.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> meh My Grand mother died from Cancer yesterday.. after a long battle she is out of pain....
> Beloved Mother, Grandmother and Great Grandmother"
> ROANOKE, VA Geraldine M. (Woods) Simpson, "Geri" as she was known, died Monday, October 8, 2012 at Pheasant Ridge Nursing & Rehab Center in Roanoke, Virginia. She was the widow of Preston Simpson who passed away in 1999.
> Born July 6, 1942, she was a daughter of the late George F. and Irene (Lambert) Woods. She was raised and educated in the Merrimack valley, where she lived for most of her life. She was a graduate of Lowell High School and attended Springfield Community College.


Sorry for your loss man. Merrimack valley...like in Mass.?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Sorry for your loss man. Merrimack valley...like in Mass.?


Yeah she was from Mass but im from Virginia lol.

She came here to die around her family and grand children and great grand children.. Which are my kids..

MY cous live in Nasuha New Hampshire btw...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah she was from Mass but im from Virginia lol.
> She came here to die around her family and grand children and great grand children.. Which are my kids..
> MY cous live in Nasuha New Hampshire btw...


Small world. I work in Boston.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> yeah I couldn't help myself this morning, just had the urge to cut the lid off. too bad I have to wait another day or two before coollabs pro gets here.












I did mine all of the sudden and earlier than planned as well. I just wanted to get it over. I knew in my mind how to do it so i did.

Congrats. Hope it works out well for you.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did mine all of the sudden and earlier than planned as well. I just wanted to get it over. I knew in my mind how to do it so i did.
> Congrats. Hope it works out well for you.


Thanks. I am so glad I tested it to see if it would boot because if I didn't it would drive me crazy


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> meh My Grand mother died from Cancer yesterday.. after a long battle she is out of pain....
> Beloved Mother, Grandmother and Great Grandmother"
> ROANOKE, VA Geraldine M. (Woods) Simpson, "Geri" as she was known, died Monday, October 8, 2012 at Pheasant Ridge Nursing & Rehab Center in Roanoke, Virginia. She was the widow of Preston Simpson who passed away in 1999.
> Born July 6, 1942, she was a daughter of the late George F. and Irene (Lambert) Woods. She was raised and educated in the Merrimack valley, where she lived for most of her life. She was a graduate of Lowell High School and attended Springfield Community College.


Sad to hear about your loss. Glad to hear she could come home to family before she left us.....


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Thanks. I am so glad I tested it to see if it would boot because if I didn't it would drive me crazy


I'm waiting for my CL Ultra to arrive sometime next week, when I will join you in being delided. I might do it before the Ultra arrives to see how AS5 works between the die and IHS first. I too will be worried about if it will still boot and run after the delid process......good to hear yours survied the process.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I'm waiting for my CL Ultra to arrive sometime next week, when I will join you in being delided. I might do it before the Ultra arrives to see how AS5 works between the die and IHS first. I too will be worried about if it will still boot and run after the delid process......good to hear yours survied the process.


I have AS 5 and ic diamond but I don't want to use either one on the die. But my cl pro should be here tomorrow or Friday. I can't wait. So my 24 hour prime stability test at 4.8 GHz was at max 95 c. Good reference for me to see how much my temps drop.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I have AS 5 and ic diamond but I don't want to use either one on the die. But my cl pro should be here tomorrow or Friday. I can't wait. So my 24 hour prime stability test at 4.8 GHz was at max 95 c. Good reference for me to see how much my temps drop.


Lol mine will be at my parents tomorrow as well, gonna go get it this weekend and might swap it next week. I might grab some fans too since my current ones are loud as f..

I'll probably put the IHS back on though since there's a good possibility i'll change my cooler later on.

actually if I do a backup I wouldn't mind doing a max OC run on manual voltages vs Dynamic since apparently i suck at picking a good DVID.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Lol mine will be at my parents tomorrow as well, gonna go get it this weekend and might swap it next week. I might grab some fans too since my current ones are loud as f..
> I'll probably put the IHS back on though since there's a good possibility i'll change my cooler later on.


Lol yeah my rig is loud too but oh well I went with 7 high speed Yates fans. Its a good hum though.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Lol yeah my rig is loud too but oh well I went with 7 high speed Yates fans. Its a good hum though.


Mines coming from my two 3000rpm typhoons...


----------



## Hokies83

The heat coming from the Air vents from my heat exchanger is louder then my case fans....

Cougar + SilentX = Win.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Mines coming from my two 3000rpm typhoons...


For EFF sake..lol


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> For EFF sake..lol


What... they were cheap


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like Nidec fans...You guys should try their double bladed beasts







GT's are awesome but those are totally epic.


----------



## JQuantum

back on topic though I think I'll be hit with a bit of duty and I might get them later since Customs has it now









EDIT: nevermind just left customs.... but still UPS makes me worry how much it'll cost. Considering how much shipping costs I should've ordered more than 2.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> back on topic though I think I'll be hit with a bit of duty and I might get them later since Customs has it now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: nevermind just left customs.... but still UPS makes me worry how much it'll cost. Considering how much shipping costs I should've ordered more than 2.


Nothing against cheap fans...my Yates were 6$ each. Yeah you guys get hit hard on tax. When I went to P.E.I. I could not believe it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> back on topic though I think I'll be hit with a bit of duty and I might get them later since Customs has it now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: nevermind just left customs.... but still UPS makes me worry how much it'll cost. Considering how much shipping costs I should've ordered more than 2.


You should always opt for USPS when buying from abroad...it tends to skip customs tax. Either Priority or First class are the way to go. Express will go straight to customs and stay there.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You should always opt for USPS when buying from abroad...it tends to skip customs tax. Either Priority or First class are the way to go. Express will go straight to customs and stay there.


I usually do but i wanted to get it before this weekend lol since the only shipping address i have is over 230km away from where i am normally


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I usually do but i wanted to get it before this weekend lol since the only shipping address i have is over 230km away from where i am normally


Too bad...Express can bite you back, it did to me. I still have my Achieva at customs, at the airport, which is like 40km away from home. *Thank God you use the metric system lol


----------



## Swag

Always purchase using the countries postal service. It always skips custom fees and taxes and also it normally arrives at your door quicker because it skips the extra checking at customs.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Those are words of truth my friend...

I'm gonna have to sell my iPhone 4S. So many debts lol


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Those are words of truth my friend...
> I'm gonna have to sell my iPhone 4S. So many debts lol


No those are the words of truth lol... I sold my 4s gotta sell my Galaxy Nexus soon.

Even if it hits customs it's still faster than USPS -> Canada Post... least as a % chance.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sucks, but well...we can get xpPhone 2's later on


----------



## Valgaur

w00t got my first company work order!!!! gonna get my [email protected] client figured out first then I might OC again tonight...don't think so though.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Focus on the bussiness man








Bet you'll do good, perhaps you can get some referrals too, and more customers!


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> w00t got my first company work order!!!! gonna get my [email protected] client figured out first then I might OC again tonight...don't think so though.


I probably missed something  what are yo utalking about... anyways i'm done for the night gotta wake up at 5 for classes (at 8 no school is that insane afaik) :S


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Focus on the bussiness man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bet you'll do good, perhaps you can get some referrals too, and more customers!


Exactly! What I would freak out over would be to review mobos and all sorts of parts.....I would be in heaven.....oh my gosh


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, me too...though I would have to grab a good DSLR and cure my parkinson


----------



## Hokies83

I had to post this sorry.. this guy has no clue lol.... And the worst part of the story is he has a 3770k in his sig rig.. @[email protected]
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Divineshadowx*
> 
> Give me a link to a store that sells the "3930x", how can you even talk about benchmarks if you don't know the accurate name of the cpu.
> Anandtech? I've seen an official post showing a 660ti beating a 680, very trusted.
> http://community.futuremark.com/hardware/cpu/Intel+Core+i7-3770K+Processor/review
> Futuremark, a company who creates benchmarks, not a guy sitting behind a computer making pretty graphs with inaccurate info. 3930k is close to twice the 3770k's performance, when overclocked the score scales exponentially due to more cores/threads now you seem to be judging intel, if 3770k oc beats 3930k oc then why on earth would they put a price tag of almost $300 for the 2011?
> You are living proof that knowledge is not required to build a computer lol.


LoL this made me laugh so hard i spit all over my monitor lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's beyond words...lol
He's all in that MOAR corez phase. (yeah, with Z like his rig's name)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I had to post this sorry.. this guy has no clue lol.... And the worst part of the story is he has a 3770k in his sig rig.. @[email protected]
> LoL this made me laugh so hard i spit all over my monitor lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's beyond words...lol
> He's all in that MOAR corez phase. (yeah, with Z like his rig's name)


6 slower cores in a world that 99% of things do not take Advantage of... = fail to 4 Faster cores all day long...

Anywho i posted the AnAndtech Bench off.. i mean who is more trusted in benching hardware then AnAndtech really?

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/552?vs=551

But AnAndtech benches were wrong....

The only one that was right was furmarks 3Dmark 11 bench lol the one that loves all the cores you can throw at it lol.

Anywho that comment is in my Sig in 5 diff forums now lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*


LoL Quit being grumpy V gar and laugh at it to..


----------



## Valgaur

Hi Jonathan,

We shipped you an 1155 Single Pack with an extra ETI today; I'll discuss your request of a chip-level solutions with the team and see what is possible; we look forward to learning your results with IX!

BTW: Can you send a pic of the second ETI you installed? Perhaps, we can determine what may have happened.

Thanks,

Chris

IX guy btw


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hi Jonathan,
> 
> We shipped you an 1155 Single Pack with an extra ETI today; I'll discuss your request of a chip-level solutions with the team and see what is possible; we look forward to learning your results with IX!
> 
> BTW: Can you send a pic of the second ETI you installed? Perhaps, we can determine what may have happened.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Chris
> IX guy btw


LoL where were u when i was giving away free IC Diamond tubes lol.

You get free tim!! I gets free Gtx 680 and free gtx 780 whens it comes out yo's!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's beyond words...lol
> He's all in that MOAR corez phase. (yeah, with Z like his rig's name)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 6 slower cores in a world that 99% of things do not take Advantage of... = fail to 4 Faster cores all day long...
Click to expand...

Agreed. To be honest, you only need one example for this.







Bulldozer vs 3570k. Choose.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Agreed. To be honest, you only need one example for this.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bulldozer vs 3570k. Choose.


LoL my bad i forgot this one to..








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Divineshadowx*
> 
> 3930k*
> Any program that uses 4 cores and 8 threads most likely uses 6 cores and 12 threads, and those programs scale linearly with more cores and threads. *2011 destroys ivy bridge in every way. More cache, more cores,* and basically same overclocking, you can't even get 5ghz+ with ivy w/o serious cooling, like dice, you can however with sb.
> How come every in every post you write, you have someone else's info. Test for yourself, you get the most accurate results trust me.


----------



## Swag

Many games can benefit from a quad-core but not all do. Some are still on 2 cores and I believe StarCraft 2 is a 32-bit game. Six-cores wouldn't do anything to StarCraft 2. Many programs can't utilize 6 cores.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Many games can benefit from a quad-core but not all do. Some are still on 2 cores and I believe StarCraft 2 is a 32-bit game. Six-cores wouldn't do anything to StarCraft 2. Many programs can't utilize 6 cores.


Hardly anything uses more then 4 cores let alone 4 cores 8 threads.. Having 12 threads unless what ever you are doing benefits from 12 threads is a huge waste lol

Like having a Car that can go 200mph on 12 small cyle but has a governor on it that only allows 4 of them to run.... So a Car with 4 larger higher performance cycle is gonna cream it lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL my bad i forgot this one to..


o Hokies, can i use Lt. Worf for my avatar?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL my bad i forgot this one to..


wait...he wants you to bench...but earlier he said people in front of comps that test their stuff lie...hmmm.........seems legit to me.....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o Hokies, can i use Lt. Worf for my avatar?


Sure bro.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wait...he wants you to bench...but earlier he said people in front of comps that test their stuff lie...hmmm.........seems legit to me.....


It is AnAndtech there some of the most trusted backed up bench marking people on the internet... With one of the best knowledge based people on forums....

Where i get alot of my Infos.. As where you got alot of yours for this thread from IDONTCARE...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Many games can benefit from a quad-core but not all do. Some are still on 2 cores and I believe StarCraft 2 is a 32-bit game. Six-cores wouldn't do anything to StarCraft 2. Many programs can't utilize 6 cores.


but in the future that will change, so having a 6 core, or a processor with threads is more future proof then the others?
im coming from a 6 core AMD 1100T, im sure it will gain some speed if programs fully use all cores


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o Hokies, can i use Lt. Worf for my avatar?


Muhahaha....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Many games can benefit from a quad-core but not all do. Some are still on 2 cores and I believe StarCraft 2 is a 32-bit game. Six-cores wouldn't do anything to StarCraft 2. Many programs can't utilize 6 cores.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but in the future that will change, so having a 6 core, or a processor with threads is more future proof then the others?
> im coming from a 6 core AMD 1100T, im sure it will gain some speed if programs fully use all cores
Click to expand...

Not really. Because it took a long time for us to even remotely transition to quad-core. It'll take a long time before we fully translate to 6-core programs. By that time, our CPUs would probably be outdated. I almost assure you, you will probably get a better overall experience in using a 3570k over an 8-core APU from AMD. Not being a fanboy or anything, the architecture of Intel is just far more superior and Intel quad-cores are an amazing piece of work.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> but in the future that will change, so having a 6 core, or a processor with threads is more future proof then the others?
> im coming from a 6 core AMD 1100T, im sure it will gain some speed if programs fully use all cores


Maybe in 5 = 10 years... By then 2011 will be so far behind in will be like a pent 4.... is now...

Alot of games use only 2 cores... There just now really starting to use 4...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sure bro.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is AnAndtech there some of the most trusted backed up bench marking people on the internet... With one of the best knowledge based people on forums....
> Where i get alot of my Infos.. As where you got alot of yours for this thread from IDONTCARE...


I was agreeing with you lol I was saying compared to his last post where he said that most people just post their own results....then he says he wants to to do exactly that. Come on here Hokies!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I was agreeing with you lol I was saying compared to his last post where he said that most people just post their own results....then he says he wants to to do exactly that. Come on here Hokies!


I knew that.... He is also the Guy that thinks he needs 3 60mm 480 rads to cool a 3770k and 2 gtx 690s lol when one would do it fine..

Then he showed why he thinks the way he does from 2011's 3D mark 11 scores... a benchmark that takes advantage of all 12 threads.. none of the other 49 i posted counted lol they were fake and lies lol.

I mean i was feeling bad about my Grand mother dieing but all the laughing this guy has me doing has me feeling so much better now lol.


----------



## Swag

I know this doesn't fit here, but I'm planning to mod the hell out of my 600T. Anyone got an idea on how to cut out the drive bay? Like the ones for the CD rom?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Not really. Because it took a long time for us to even remotely transition to quad-core. It'll take a long time before we fully translate to 6-core programs. By that time, our CPUs would probably be outdated. I almost assure you, you will probably get a better overall experience in using a 3570k over an 8-core APU from AMD. Not being a fanboy or anything, the architecture of Intel is just far more superior and Intel quad-cores are an amazing piece of work.


They are,
this is the first time ever i have a intel, my last build was a FX-ready one, only used the 1100T to w8 for the FX-8150,
man , was i disappointed, seems my 1100T was faster with many things then the FX-8150 ...lol

when Ivy came, well, i didnt have to think long, and made the switch to intel,
not 1 moment of regret ever since








maybe the future AMD's will be better, i hope so.. but i dont think AMD can beat my 3770k soon ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know this doesn't fit here, but I'm planning to mod the hell out of my 600T. Anyone got an idea on how to cut out the drive bay? Like the ones for the CD rom?


Rivets? popem out with a hammer and screw driver.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Not really. Because it took a long time for us to even remotely transition to quad-core. It'll take a long time before we fully translate to 6-core programs. By that time, our CPUs would probably be outdated. I almost assure you, you will probably get a better overall experience in using a 3570k over an 8-core APU from AMD. Not being a fanboy or anything, the architecture of Intel is just far more superior and Intel quad-cores are an amazing piece of work.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are,
> this is the first time ever i have a intel, my last build was a FX-ready one, only used the 1100T to w8 for the FX-8150,
> man , was i disappointed, seems my 1100T was faster with many things then the FX-8150 ...lol
> 
> when Ivy came, well, i didnt have to think long, and made the switch to intel,
> not 1 moment of regret ever since
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maybe the future AMD's will be better, i hope so.. but i dont think AMD can beat my 3770k soon ..lol
Click to expand...

I don't think they can beat Intel's architecture at all. I mean, Intel probably has developed a full CPU market killer but decides to wait it out and update the current generation slowly to maximize profit. No competition = no production. Just how it works.


----------



## Hokies83

Yeah Amd is pretty Flat on it's face in the cpu market.. there Gpus are performing very well tho.

If you see my Avatar that is a pumpkin taking a crap and craping out pumpkin pies lol.


----------



## Vuzer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If you see my Avatar that is a pumpkin taking a crap and craping out pumpkin pies lol.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vuzer*


I must use this one








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's beyond words...lol
> He's all in that MOAR corez phase. (yeah, with Z like his rig's name)


I was in the more core phase when, when I was 17 had no money and the q6600 was the newest thing. So I got one >.> but considering i was coming from an AMD Athlon 64 3200 or something on that line it was a different world comparison. I twas also the first time I built a computer and had more than 1GB of ram... and spent 250 on the motherboard + cpu (Supposedly I got them all new even though I got them from the classified - least it was sealed) and another 40-50 for a gig of ram (not cheap)... ddr2 667MHz lol

I think when I first finished it was an nForce 680i LT SLI (http://www.nvidia.com/object/designed_by_nvidia_680i_lt_sli.html) + Q6600 (http://ark.intel.com/products/29765/Intel-Core2-Quad-Processor-Q6600-8M-Cache-2_40-GHz-1066-MHz-FSB) + 1GB of DDR2 667 Kingston RAM (http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/kingston-ram-1gb-ddr2-desktop-memory/10072687?trail=SRCH%3Akingston&fromPLP=true&ancestorID=alldept&searchString=kingston&startSearch=yes&fromSearchBox=true&addFacet=SRCH%3Akingston) and a random case/psu and a recycled dvd drive and hdd.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I must use this one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was in the more core phase when, when I was 17 had no money and the q6600 was the newest thing. So I got one >.> but considering i was coming from an AMD Athlon 64 3200 or something on that line it was a different world comparison. I twas also the first time I built a computer and had more than 1GB of ram... and spent 250 on the motherboard + cpu (Supposedly I got them all new even though I got them from the classified - least it was sealed) and another 40-50 for a gig of ram (not cheap)... ddr2 667MHz lol
> I think when I first finished it was an nForce 680i LT SLI (http://www.nvidia.com/object/designed_by_nvidia_680i_lt_sli.html) + Q6600 (http://ark.intel.com/products/29765/Intel-Core2-Quad-Processor-Q6600-8M-Cache-2_40-GHz-1066-MHz-FSB) + 1GB of DDR2 667 Kingston RAM (http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/kingston-ram-1gb-ddr2-desktop-memory/10072687?trail=SRCH%3Akingston&fromPLP=true&ancestorID=alldept&searchString=kingston&startSearch=yes&fromSearchBox=true&addFacet=SRCH%3Akingston) and a random case/psu and a recycled dvd drive and hdd.


That was a great rig back then...Core 2 quads rocked!








But yeah, back then more than 2 cores in a game was totally out of the picture.

I have more than 4 threads but only for folding really...


----------



## SonDa5

I just got done doing my first 27 hour Prime95 v27.7 with AVX long FFTs (hot selection).

Ambient temps ranged from low 20C to high 27C.
[email protected] 1.15v.


Hottest temps were recorded during the 15th hour of testing.

*Max Temps recorded

64C 72C 69C 64C*


----------



## Hokies83

Why not go for 5ghz?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Why not go for 5ghz?


And Thats what I'm doing. gonna let it run while i shower.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Why not go for 5ghz?


Me?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Me?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> And Thats what I'm doing. gonna let it run while i shower.


Yes







soon as my Liquid Pro gets here my goal is as high as i can go...

As i got a great clocker i wanna be the guy chillen at 5.5ghz


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I just got done doing my first 27 hour Prime95 v27.7 with AVX long FFTs (hot selection).
> Ambient temps ranged from low 20C to high 27C.
> [email protected] 1.15v.
> 
> Hottest temps were recorded during the 15th hour of testing.
> 
> *Max Temps recorded
> 64C 72C 69C 64C*


gratz







vey nice..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> As i got a great clocker i wanna be the guy chillen at 5.5ghz


look at my avatar ... muhahahaha!!

nah, i hope you will get it, this forum needs more crazy-ocers ..lol 5.5ghz ..lol..


----------



## ivanlabrie

He's still on IC Diamond, temps are good for his ambients...Bet Liquid Pro will do better









Got my GTX 670 ftw today... (all stock for now, gtg to work sadly) 9089 3dmarks


----------



## SonDa5

I really don't think Liquid Metal Pro will be much better that IC Diamond. As soon as I get it I will start doing more tests with it.

My real handicap right now is only having a single slim HWLABS 120mm GT Stealth radiator for a loop with a HD7950 and CPU in it.

Once I get my loop upgrades done in the next weeks (crosses fingers) I think my temps will lower and I will be ready to start pushing for max OC.

I have done 5 GHZ by the way.








Before I De-Lidded.

Super Pi 32m 5GHZ



http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2518087


----------



## SonDa5

Good news! Mailman just delivered Liquid Pro and some other stuff I ordered for cooling! As soon as I get some time its going on.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Good news! Mailman just delivered Liquid Pro and some other stuff I ordered for cooling! As soon as I get some time its going on.


great news







, im curious to see your new results


----------



## Hokies83

Just got mine in to mail...

Now to go to Lowes and get a cheapo thin razor blade..


----------



## kgtuning

you guys are killing me... cl pro will be here tomorrow. lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Time for my 5.4 Ghz run [email protected]!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Time for my 5.4 Ghz run [email protected]!!!!


LoL that guy from last night is trollin me again About GPU'S this time which i review and happen to know alot about..


----------



## feniks

well, well, this thread nearly exploded!









all right ... ordering Liquid Ultra and once I confirm my CPU is not a lemon - got a project in progress with it - I will be (hopefully!) joining this club in near future


----------



## Valgaur

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2540735

Got it!!!!!

W00t!

Take that VonDutch!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2540735
> Got it!!!!!
> W00t!
> Take that VonDutch!


EPIC man!









Congrats buddy


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> EPIC man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats buddy


So much Vcore


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol indeed...I bet I can get 5.4 with less than that








You wait and see


----------



## kgtuning

holy vcore! nice job


----------



## Hokies83

LoL i tried with a Standard Razor knife sized razor that thing is to thick gonna have to go to the hardware store and get one that is thiner..

Anywho i have my Gtx 680 apart heh Sanding down and polishing the heat sink then gonna post some CL Liq pro on it...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2540735
> Got it!!!!!
> W00t!
> Take that VonDutch!










hahaha..gratz!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i tried with a Standard Razor knife sized razor that thing is to thick gonna have to go to the hardware store and get one that is thiner..
> Anywho i have my Gtx 680 apart heh Sanding down and polishing the heat sink then gonna post some CL Liq pro on it...


i de-lidded mine with this,


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i de-lidded mine with this,


Yeah that is a really thin blade.

Ones i had on hand are pretty thick.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i de-lidded mine with this,


this guy is using 1 model smaller looks like





edit:
i double posted somehow,
can i undo this?


----------



## Fonne

- Sub -

Still thinking about doing it on my i7-3770k


----------



## Hokies83

but anywho...

Before...


And After...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah that is a really thin blade.
> Ones i had on hand are pretty thick.


quote
The math tells us the IHS is sitting on top of the CPU, held aloft and creating a gap some 0.14mm to the PCB.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=33789593&postcount=78
end quote

with the black adhesive, a bit more, not sure how thick that stanleyknife is tho


----------



## Hokies83

Ill just go to Local hardware store and get the most thin i can.


----------



## Valgaur

Yes join the delidding republic lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> but anywho...
> Before...
> 
> And After...


Yup lil polishing and CL Liq Pro temp dropped 5c on that gpu.. Now my top card runs cooler then my bottom lol....

Top card i polished..


Bottom card stock tim..



Running Heaven 3.0 temp diff was even more.. top card Polished and liq pro stayed 8 to 10 c cooler then bottom card which is stock.


----------



## JQuantum

Question guys I know wrong forum but since you guys are OC'in them aynways...

If I have a Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H and a i7-3770k OCed to 4.5GHz and it's not very stable using:
Normal Voltage for the voltage settings (Options are Auto/Manual/Normal there might've been one more) if on normal I can control the Dynamic voltage so basically this is Offset mode. I've used 0.015V and Turbo LLC so my max voltage was around 1.320~ which is pretty high for the OC IMO.

Is this a crap board or a crap chip. Temperature is fine at ~66C peak temperature (core 2 aka 3rd core) but the voltage is shotty... after I go to 4.6GHz my DVID I think needs to be higher... it's not very stable at this point. Hell I'm using it at 4.4GHz 100BCLK and normal + 0.05V which makes it to 1.205+0.05+turbo llc bringing it to about 1.274~1.294. I picked this UD5H board kuz of the hardware it uses but i didn't expect it to be a crap clocker (I don't particularly like it but I don't hate it either).


----------



## Hokies83

UD5H is a great board. My 3770k clocked a little better on my UD5H then it does on my G1 Sniper 3.

What are your BSOD codes correct things to what they are saying.. Could be your ram and not your cpu.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2540735
> Got it!!!!!
> W00t!
> Take that VonDutch!


grats















any word on temps to be expected at such vcore?


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> UD5H is a great board. My 3770k clocked a little better on my UD5H then it does on my G1 Sniper 3.
> What are your BSOD codes correct things to what they are saying.. Could be your ram and not your cpu.


windows 8 bsod so occationally it didn't give a code but it i think it generally gave the need more vcore bsod.
I put the rams down to as stable as u could get them lol and they didn't change anything so i ruled it out quickly. Couldn't play with it too much kuz the system is on the raid 0 which breaks kuz I can't reach the UEFI when it's unstable and if I did a CMOS reset it'd break the raid.

There's a trick if you turn the power on and off quickly it'll force it to default values without breaking the raid but on the Gigabyte UEFI it'd occasionally send a Corrupt UEFI message and reboot the backup which is F7 and I'd lose the raid again (the power trick was from my asus z68 deluxe and it'd freeze well before the UEFI could boot).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> grats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any word on temps to be expected at such vcore?


oh my look at that vcore lol


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> will do,
> i read somewhere that Condensation starts at 6C ?
> nice and shiny Die btw ..lol


It depends on a combination of temperature and humidity, if you google Dew Point Calculator you can download a chart. I use Tec`s in my CPU loop so I have to be careful with dew point saturation.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> It depends on a combination of temperature and humidity, if you google Dew Point Calculator you can download a chart. I use Tec`s in my CPU loop so I have to be careful with dew point saturation.


Definitely wrong place to put it (my post about tec).... but just a thought I have and definitely off topic.

If you put the TEC as a water chiller instead of direct pump... and use it to chill the liquid after it's been heated by the CPU/GPU and before it's been cooled by the radiator... Would that not work as a way so if condensation does happen it'd be on the rad and most likely would warm the water up (mine would probably be vertical and blowing outward in an ideal situation) and if it's warmer ie under load the radiator would cool whatever the TEC couldn't.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> windows 8 bsod so occationally it didn't give a code but it i think it generally gave the need more vcore bsod.
> I put the rams down to as stable as u could get them lol and they didn't change anything so i ruled it out quickly. Couldn't play with it too much kuz the system is on the raid 0 which breaks kuz I can't reach the UEFI when it's unstable and if I did a CMOS reset it'd break the raid.
> There's a trick if you turn the power on and off quickly it'll force it to default values without breaking the raid but on the Gigabyte UEFI it'd occasionally send a Corrupt UEFI message and reboot the backup which is F7 and I'd lose the raid again (the power trick was from my asus z68 deluxe and it'd freeze well before the UEFI could boot).
> oh my look at that vcore lol


Yeah i can not help you with windows 8 i hate everyhting about it so i have took no time to learn anything about it lol.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah i can not help you with windows 8 i hate everyhting about it so i have took no time to learn anything about it lol.


lol, I have learned to live with it since I have the RTM and it works OOB faster than 7 *shrugs*. I just wait the flaming later on lol.

Well at least that rules out the board... I'll probably blame using Normal setting and RAID 0 for system... >.> first time raiding and last time I raid the system partition but I want 512GB of SSD space, 6TB for storage/data/vms and 256GB for other OS boots


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I just got done doing my first 27 hour Prime95 v27.7 with AVX long FFTs (hot selection).
> Ambient temps ranged from low 20C to high 27C.
> [email protected] 1.15v.
> 
> Hottest temps were recorded during the 15th hour of testing.
> 
> *Max Temps recorded
> 64C 72C 69C 64C*


Impresive vcore for a 4.5GHz 15hr stable run. Nice temps too considering the upper ambient.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fonne*
> 
> - Sub -
> Still thinking about doing it on my i7-3770k


I'm planning on doing so next week when my CL Ultra arrives. You should join us. Fun project that ends up with great chance of lower temps, and more OC fun if your into that. We are! Not to say that there is no risk, but so much info these days to avoid that if careful.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Impresive vcore for a 4.5GHz 15hr stable run. Nice temps too considering the upper ambient.


That was over 27 hours of testing. I stopped it and you can see in the screen shot the total time ran of over 27 hours with ZERO errors.

Not 15hr.....


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> That was over 27 hours of testing. I stopped it and you can see in the screen shot the total time ran of over 27 hours with ZERO errors.
> Not 15hr.....


...even more impressive than I thought.....


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Definitely wrong place to put it.... but just a thought I have and definitely off topic.
> If you put the TEC as a water chiller instead of direct pump... and use it to chill the liquid after it's been heated by the CPU/GPU and before it's been cooled by the radiator... Would that not work as a way so if condensation does happen it'd be on the rad and most likely would warm the water up (mine would probably be vertical and blowing outward in an ideal situation) and if it's warmer ie under load the radiator would cool whatever the TEC couldn't.


How is my post in the wrong place ? I was responding to VonDutch about his rig that is in a hall that is unheated. Ambient temps were pretty low as was his core temps and I just wanted to make sure he had correct dew point measurements. My 3770K was de-lidded in May and my waterblock sits directly on the die without any IHS. Retention system for cpu had to be removed so that the block would actually mount on the die.


----------



## Valgaur

UGH I want to get LN2 going in my rig...that would be amazing. I could get some really crazy OC's then....not that I don't have a crazy OC......


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> How is my post in the wrong place ? I was responding to VonDutch about his rig that is in a hall that is unheated. Ambient temps were pretty low as was his core temps and I just wanted to make sure he had correct dew point measurements. My 3770K was de-lidded in May and my waterblock sits directly on the die without any IHS. Retention system for cpu had to be removed so that the block would actually mount on the die.


Was in reference to my own post


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> UGH I want to get LN2 going in my rig...that would be amazing. I could get some really crazy OC's then....not that I don't have a crazy OC......


Crazy OCs, and crazier vcore!

You need to go to more serious cooling to join the big boys now....


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Was in reference to my own post


Sorry, I guess I`m not paying attention, time to hit the sack. For chiller to work correctly you have to have two loops. one for hot and one for the cool side. Like you said though, should post in TEC cooling I`ll be in there tomorrow evening.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Crazy OCs, and crazier vcore!
> You need to go to more serious cooling to join the big boys now....


That's why I wanna LN2 really really REALLY badly...but I'd need a test bench then....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's why I wanna LN2 really really REALLY badly...but I'd need a test bench then....


Valgaur + LN2 = Frozen Penis.

Thats what that face is all about in your Avatar!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valgaur + LN2 = Frozen Penis.
> Thats what that face is all about in your Avatar!


You got that right lol. But I could push this thing so much farther lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You got that right lol. But I could push this thing so much farther lol.


Meh it has already been done... and ur not gonna get to far ur already at 1.75v just for 5.4ghz.. a good chip does 6.6ghz under ln2 with 1.8v

Id find your best 24/7 overclock and be happy get us some bench marks and have fun with it.


----------



## feniks

the current record for this chip (on liquid helium) is 7183MHz at 1.95V I believe (asus rog team recently achieved it) ... without serious chip binning that is currently unbeatable IMHO








5.4GHz @ 1.75V is nowhere near close to that, I'd say forget LN2 and enjoy a daily 5GHz OC at low temps!







... that's my goal anyways


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You got that right lol. But I could push this thing so much farther lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Meh it has already been done... and ur not gonna get to far ur already at 1.75v just for 5.4ghz.. a good chip does 6.6ghz under ln2 with 1.8v
> Id find your best 24/7 overclock and be happy get us some bench marks and have fun with it.
Click to expand...

But not done by Valgaur yet! Think of the challange! Even if he does not have a chip that can do that well, he'd still have the fun and learn alot - for his next new chip he will need to purchase to replace this one.....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> the current record for this chip (on liquid helium) is 7183MHz at 1.95V I believe (asus rog team recently achieved it) ... without serious chip binning that is currently unbeatable IMHO
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.4GHz @ 1.75V is nowhere near close to that, I'd say forget LN2 and enjoy a daily 5GHz OC at low temps!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... that's my goal anyways


Yeah, that max OC run was awesome, as is that OC, and it will be very hard to beat as they even went to liquid helium instead of LN2. Even colder and very expensive.

And I'd just love to have a 5GHz stable system at low temps.....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> But not done by Valgaur yet! Think of the challange! Even if he does not have a chip that can do that well, he'd still have the fun and learn alot - for his next new chip he will need to purchase to replace this one.....
> Yeah, that max OC run was awesome, as is that OC, and it will be very hard to beat as they even went to liquid helium instead of LN2. Even colder and very expensive.
> And I'd just love to have a 5GHz stable system at low temps.....


Thats the Point!! it's the challenge also temps do bring your vcore needs down by quite a bit I've heard from Asus (phone calls Lovely people there) I can do a very easy 5 Ghz OC for every day easy shoot even 5.2 I'm only at 1.49 vcore but it's the heat that gets me so if I could I would love to say That i LN2'ed my chip and got like 6 Ghz or something and you never know...it might like to be cold like myself.

It's the 5ghz oc for foldign that's tough to get......the stability needed is crazy.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats the Point!! it's the challenge also temps do bring your vcore needs down by quite a bit I've heard from Asus (phone calls Lovely people there) I can do a very easy 5 Ghz OC for every day easy shoot even 5.2 I'm only at 1.49 vcore but it's the heat that gets me so if I could I would love to say That i LN2'ed my chip and got like 6 Ghz or something and you never know...it might like to be cold like myself.
> It's the 5ghz oc for foldign that's tough to get......the stability needed is crazy.


Heat will not limit you your limited by volts.. if u need 1.75v for 5.4ghz your gonna need 1.95v for 5.5ghz lol.

Somebody give my thread some love i did all that work and got those great results and nobody is leaving me any love...

http://www.overclock.net/t/1315215/polished-galaxy-gtx-680-4gb-heatsink-cool-labs-liquid-pro-tim/0_20#post_18347905


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2540735
> Got it!!!!!
> W00t!
> Take that VonDutch!


aaww..did i just beat you again by 1mhz....LOL

5401.82mhz, chew on that









http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2541182

so...how low can you go with your AC ?? haha


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> aaww..did i just beat you again by 1mhz....LOL
> 5401.82mhz, chew on that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2541182
> so...how low can you go with your AC ?? haha


ugh your multiplier...100.04...I mean realy...why spite me!!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ugh your multiplier...100.04...I mean realy...why spite me!!!!


*looks at Valgaur's avatar* now you look at mine.. muhahaha......


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> *looks at Valgaur's avatar* now you look at mine.. muhahaha......


Just realized that after my other post lol.


----------



## Valgaur

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2541251

Dun dun duuuuuuun


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2541251
> Dun dun duuuuuuun


dont go posting all over da place again kk...lol
hate to follow you everywhere with my new, 5.5ghz oc








i know youre proud you did it, haha...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dont go posting all over da place again kk...lol
> hate to follow you everywhere with my new, 5.5ghz oc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i know youre proud you did it, haha...


I post in the 5Ghz club ivy bridge club and here that it. Those are the places they care/update lol i'll update our OC's tomorrow...tired and I hope you don't go to 5.5....that vcore is gonna be nuts....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I post in the 5Ghz club ivy bridge club and here that it. Those are the places they care/update lol i'll update our OC's tomorrow...tired and I hope you don't go to 5.5....that vcore is gonna be nuts....


all good, 5.4ghz is crazy as it is, with the voltages we used on air/water ...

o, and i can(finally) use the xmp profile too, not sure why now but,

RAM Speed : 800.3 MHz (1:6) @ 9-8-8-21


10-10-10-25 was default
9-9-9-24 are factory specs

not sure if i should change it to factory, or leave it like this..
dont know anything about ram oc etc.. did adjust ram voltage to 1.520V instead of the default 1.5V

and instead of having a 4.645ghz oc with 46x multi and 101 blck for daily OC,
changed it to 47 multi , 100 blck, 0.040V offset..gives about 1.3V-1.310V vcore under load in cpu-z and other programs
coretemp shows 1.2610V VID max..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> all good 5.4ghz is crazy as it is, with the voltages we used on air/water ...
> o, and i can use the xmp profile too, not sure why now but,
> RAM Speed : 800.3 MHz (1:6) @ 9-8-8-21
> 10-10-10-25 was default
> 9-9-9-24 are factory specs
> not sure if i should change it to factory, or leave it like this..
> dont know anything about ram oc etc.. did adjust ram voltage to 1.520V instead of the default 1.5V


Yeah me either...my ram no likey OC very much lol I just run it at 1600mhz and let it be at 1.5V


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heat will not limit you your limited by volts.. if u need 1.75v for 5.4ghz your gonna need 1.95v for 5.5ghz lol.
> Somebody give my thread some love i did all that work and got those great results and nobody is leaving me any love...
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1315215/polished-galaxy-gtx-680-4gb-heatsink-cool-labs-liquid-pro-tim/0_20#post_18347905


I'm a check it out now!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah me either...my ram no likey OC very much lol I just run it at 1600mhz and let it be at 1.5V


Vengeance sticks can be dodgy...I bet you guys can easily get 2000mhz cl9. That should work at 1.65v and be harmless.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm a check it out now!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vengeance sticks can be dodgy...I bet you guys can easily get 2000mhz cl9. That should work at 1.65v and be harmless.


Yeah I could get 2000Mhz but my CPU OC's hated it so I kept it at 1.5V and 1600 Mhz and it loved it for some reason lol. I'm trying to dabble in either phase change, dry ice, or even Ln2 lol.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I could get 2000Mhz but my CPU OC's hated it so I kept it at 1.5V and 1600 Mhz and it loved it for some reason lol. I'm trying to dabble in either phase change, dry ice, or even Ln2 lol.


Phase change would let you run your oc 24/7 but can be a little pricey initially.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Phase change would let you run your oc 24/7 but can be a little pricey initially.


It's mainly for bench's, which I'm slowly starting to obsess about lol.

Hey....you guys need to participate more in these here there threads sillys!









You want to be and Official club right? lol we gotta show our Pro's of being a delidded Ivy man/Girl is all about!

Yes in the process of becoming Official


----------



## stellamonster7

VonDutch & Valgaur - you are inspirational (and hilarious with your back and forth!)









I am still playing with fan config and making sure I can get my stable 45x up to 46 or 47 with my evo and case fans, but I am getting limited by heat and not volts (although I am at 1.28+). I think it's time I order some cool lab liq pro and find a good box cutter.


----------



## Riotvan

I'm getting great results from delidding and liquid pro, well atleast temp wise ocing isnt going as good as i hoped for. 65C on the hottest core running at 4.5Ghz with 1.338v using prime custom blend to use all my ram. I think using 4 sticks of ram is holding it back, will need some more testing hehe.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> VonDutch & Valgaur - you are inspirational (and hilarious with your back and forth!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am still playing with fan config and making sure I can get my stable 45x up to 46 or 47 with my evo and case fans, but I am getting limited by heat and not volts (although I am at 1.28+). I think it's time I order some cool lab liq pro and find a good box cutter.


Yeah VonDutch & Valgaur are the Dumb and dumber of OCN .


----------



## stellamonster7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riotvan*
> 
> I'm getting great results from delidding and liquid pro, well atleast temp wise ocing isnt going as good as i hoped for. 65C on the hottest core running at 4.5Ghz with 1.338v using prime custom blend to use all my ram. I think using 4 sticks of ram is holding it back, will need some more testing hehe.


are you going to try for Ivy stable club? 4 sticks of RAM should just mean you have more power from VRM being sent to RAM, and yes you have an IMC on the CPU, but I've never heard of this impacting your OC of your CPU. Are you getting BSODs with RAM codes? Lower your RAM settings to 1333 if so. It's not the RAM you are trying to test so that won't matter.

you're already on par temp wise with other deliders, so you're ahead of me and should be able to push those volts now. sure it looks like you didn't win the chip lottery with those volts to get to 45x, but your deliding means you got room now.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> VonDutch & Valgaur - you are inspirational (and hilarious with your back and forth!)


TY!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah VonDutch & Valgaur are the Dumb and dumber of OCN .


TY!







(i think)







hahaha...


----------



## Riotvan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> are you going to try for Ivy stable club? 4 sticks of RAM should just mean you have more power from VRM being sent to RAM, and yes you have an IMC on the CPU, but I've never heard of this impacting your OC of your CPU. Are you getting BSODs with RAM codes? Lower your RAM settings to 1333 if so. It's not the RAM you are trying to test so that won't matter.
> you're already on par temp wise with other deliders, so you're ahead of me and should be able to push those volts now. sure it looks like you didn't win the chip lottery with those volts to get to 45x, but your deliding means you got room now.


Yeah you're right it shouldnt matter i think i just misread some posts. Anyways i'm going for stable and as quiet as possible and i don't think those two go well together when 4.7 probably needs 1.5v(i stopped at 1.45v). I think i'm going to leave it like it's now, all the power management stuff is working and tbh 4.5Ghz was the goal at the start of the build. Guess i got greedy haha, thanks for the help man


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> VonDutch & Valgaur - you are inspirational (and hilarious with your back and forth!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am still playing with fan config and making sure I can get my stable 45x up to 46 or 47 with my evo and case fans, but I am getting limited by heat and not volts (although I am at 1.28+). I think it's time I order some cool lab liq pro and find a good box cutter.


Thank you sir that's what I strive for lol!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah VonDutch & Valgaur are the Dumb and dumber of OCN .


I agree.....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Riotvan*
> 
> I'm getting great results from delidding and liquid pro, well atleast temp wise ocing isnt going as good as i hoped for. 65C on the hottest core running at 4.5Ghz with 1.338v using prime custom blend to use all my ram. I think using 4 sticks of ram is holding it back, will need some more testing hehe.


Yeah OC can be effected by ram but only through the BCLK and even with stability issues mainly during my 5.3 and 5.4 runs all i kept getting was ram errors....thats it....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o, and i can(finally) use the xmp profile too, not sure why now but,
> RAM Speed : 800.3 MHz (1:6) @ 9-8-8-21
> 
> 10-10-10-25 was default
> 9-9-9-24 are factory specs
> not sure if i should change it to factory, or leave it like this..
> dont know anything about ram oc etc.. did adjust ram voltage to 1.520V instead of the default 1.5V.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Vengeance sticks can be dodgy...I bet you guys can easily get 2000mhz cl9. That should work at 1.65v and be harmless.


really?
i didnt know that, i thought my 1600 could only run 16 multiplier?
and only change some timing settings, like i talked about in that post..
i think those 9-8-8-21 are good tho..right?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> really?
> i didnt know that, i thought my 1600 could only run 16 multiplier?
> and only change some timing settings, like i talked about in that post..
> i think those 9-8-8-21 are good tho..right?


Mine runs at 800 as well...no idea why...


----------



## ivanlabrie

800mhz in cpu-z is the same as 1600mhz...DDR = double data rate. You are running 800mhz but each mhz carries two instruction sets.







(actually ddr2/3 are kinda different but I can never remember how exactly lol)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 800mhz in cpu-z is the same as 1600mhz...DDR = double data rate. You are running 800mhz but each mhz carries two instruction sets.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (actually ddr2/3 are kinda different but I can never remember how exactly lol)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Mine runs at 800 as well...no idea why...


i figured that, well.. at least we know now who is who..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah VonDutch & Valgaur are the Dumb and dumber of OCN .


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i figured that, well.. at least we know now who is who..


What's funny is that im letting my hair grow out and im slowly starting to look like the guy on the right lol!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What's funny is that im letting my hair grow out and im slowly starting to look like the guy on the right lol!


hahaha... i shaved my head 1mm 2 days ago so ...ok..i will be the other guy

o, and sleep well tonite, might have a "little" wake up call for you


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 800mhz in cpu-z is the same as 1600mhz...DDR = double data rate. You are running 800mhz but each mhz carries two instruction sets.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (actually ddr2/3 are kinda different but I can never remember how exactly lol)


so, you where saying, i can let it run on 2000mhz?


----------



## Hokies83

I got Avatars!
Valgaur


VonDutch


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hahaha... i shaved my head 1mm 2 days ago so ...ok..i will be the other guy
> o, and sleep well tonite, might have a "little" wake up call for you


Uh oh......


----------



## kgtuning

OCN name: *kgtuning*
CPU:*3770K*
on die-TIM: *Coollabs liquid pro*
ihs-TIM: *IC diamond*
Mhz gained: *none right now*
OC after delid: *4.8ghz*
Temp drops: *24 c*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: *5.2ghz*


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> OCN name: *kgtuning*
> CPU:*3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Coollabs liquid pro*
> ihs-TIM: *IC diamond*
> Mhz gained: *none right now*
> OC after delid: *4.8ghz*
> Temp drops: *24 c*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: *5.2ghz*


Sweet results bro


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> really?
> i didnt know that, i thought my 1600 could only run 16 multiplier?
> and only change some timing settings, like i talked about in that post..
> i think those 9-8-8-21 are good tho..right?


your ram kit was rated at 1.50V ... but mind that most 1.65V ram kits use same/similar chips, they were just rated differently









My Mushkin kit(s) can do either Default 1333MHz with 9-9-9-24 @ 1.50V or XMP 2000MHz with 9-11-9-27 @ 1.65V ... but I choose to run them together (4 sticks) at 2200MHz with 10-11-10-30 @ 1.65V








Just make sure that your RAM can actually do 1.65v before you try ... google it ...







... or deal with RMA later if things go wrong hehe ...


----------



## feniks

wow! 5.2GHz at 71C max, nice!!!! I'm getting seriously jealous here ...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> OCN name: *kgtuning*
> CPU:*3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Coollabs liquid pro*
> ihs-TIM: *IC diamond*
> Mhz gained: *none right now*
> OC after delid: *4.8ghz*
> Temp drops: *24 c*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: *5.2ghz*


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> your ram kit was rated at 1.50V ... but mind that most 1.65V ram kits use same/similar chips, they were just rated differently
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My Mushkin kit(s) can do either Default 1333MHz with 9-9-9-24 @ 1.50V or XMP 2000MHz with 9-11-9-27 @ 1.65V ... but I choose to run them together (4 sticks) at 2200MHz with 10-11-10-30 @ 1.65V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just make sure that your RAM can actually do 1.65v before you try ... google it ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... or deal with RMA later if things go wrong hehe ...


Hmph i runs mine at 2500mhz with 1.7v

Dudes this is Ivy Bridge Not SB why are you using 1600mhz kits???

Ivy Bridge IMC is beast.... get a Gskill 2400mhz 8gb kit for 90$ lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> your ram kit was rated at 1.50V ... but mind that most 1.65V ram kits use same/similar chips, they were just rated differently
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My Mushkin kit(s) can do either Default 1333MHz with 9-9-9-24 @ 1.50V or XMP 2000MHz with 9-11-9-27 @ 1.65V ... but I choose to run them together (4 sticks) at 2200MHz with 10-11-10-30 @ 1.65V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just make sure that your RAM can actually do 1.65v before you try ... google it ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... or deal with RMA later if things go wrong hehe ...


thanks








im used to a little gamble with voltages etc ...lol


----------



## kgtuning

@ feniks...i wish it did 5.2 at 71. it does 4.8 "stable" at 71.... we will find out what 5.2 does at some point.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmph i runs mine at 2500mhz with 1.7v
> Dudes this is Ivy Bridge Not SB why are you using 1600mhz kits???
> Ivy Bridge IMC is beast.... get a Gskill 2400mhz 8gb kit for 90$ lol


because tests show theres not that much improvement above 1600?
mayby its different with ivy ..idk better memorycontroller?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> because tests show theres not that much improvement above 1600?
> mayby its different with ivy ..idk better memorycontroller?


Better imc + Gpu overclock = speed baby...
How do you think i was getting a 25k gpu score with 2 gtx 680s at 1350mhz? on SB it was taking ppl 1400mhz + to get those scores..
Also some games benefit from fast ram the biggest one i know of is Metro 2033.. from 1600mhz to 2400mhz there is a 5fps jump...

I creamed a guy i was doing a game bench off with in the metro 2033 bench he did have a 690 tho..
His best was 55fps i got 88fps lol.

Also your Physx scores will jump by 1000 points lol.

I mean if it is crazy priced like 200$ no it is not worth it but 8gb 2400mhz for 88$ shipped is well worth it...

I sold my 16gb 1600mhz kit for 70$ and got this kit lol.

to be blunt.. Ivy Bridge has a kill IMC much better then DB why not take advantage of it?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> OCN name: *kgtuning*
> CPU:*3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Coollabs liquid pro*
> ihs-TIM: *IC diamond*
> Mhz gained: *none right now*
> OC after delid: *4.8ghz*
> Temp drops: *24 c*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: *5.2ghz*

















gratz..very nice


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Better imc + Gpu overclock = speed baby...
> Also some games benefit from fast ram the biggest one i know of is Metro 2033.. from 1600mhz to 2400mhz there is a 5fps jump...
> Also your Physx scores will jump by 1000 points lol.


yea, guess i was thinking old ...thanks








know alot more now then 2 pages ago ,
if i get my new HD7870, ill prolly have some money for RAM too ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> @ feniks...i wish it did 5.2 at 71. it does 4.8 "stable" at 71.... we will find out what 5.2 does at some point.


i know of 1 thing 5.2ghz does, gives you blue screens ..lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmph i runs mine at 2500mhz with 1.7v
> Dudes this is Ivy Bridge Not SB why are you using 1600mhz kits???
> Ivy Bridge IMC is beast.... get a Gskill 2400mhz 8gb kit for 90$ lol


hehe, just so








if you don't want to bump voltage to keep tight timings, then keep same voltage and loosen timings instead








Each of my single kits (2 sticks each) can do 2400Mhz with 10-12-11-31 @ 1.65V
I tried 2600Mhz, but it's borderline bootable, and even if it boots it fails memtest sooner or later. haven't figured out that one yet








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im used to a little gamble with voltages etc ...lol


LOL, I hear ya, good luck!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> @ feniks...i wish it did 5.2 at 71. it does 4.8 "stable" at 71.... we will find out what 5.2 does at some point.


I see he he, yeah it takes way more of vcore to make it fully stable instead of bootable


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hehe, just so
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you don't want to bump voltage to keep tight timings, then keep same voltage and loosen timings instead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Each of my single kits (2 sticks each) can do 2400Mhz with 10-12-11-31 @ 1.65V
> I tried 2600Mhz, but it's borderline bootable, and even if it boots it fails memtest sooner or later. haven't figured out that one yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, I hear ya, good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see he he, yeah it takes way more of vcore to make it fully stable instead of bootable


here is my 4.8ghz 24 hour stable run:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> here is my 4.8ghz 24 hour stable run:


Im gonna need your 5.2 oc cpuz id for the spreadsheet lol


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Im gonna need your 5.2 oc cpuz id for the spreadsheet lol


not a problem...


----------



## Valgaur

Hank you for the link. Also @ hokies....there are 8gb and 16 gb of 2400mhz ram for 79 and 146....both by gskill and corsair.......which one is better or is it just the speed.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> not a problem...


5.2ghz with .1.46 v is pretty sweet...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so, you where saying, i can let it run on 2000mhz?


Yeah! go for it







You can likely go higher...but it'll take some testing.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> OCN name: *kgtuning*
> CPU:*3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Coollabs liquid pro*
> ihs-TIM: *IC diamond*
> Mhz gained: *none right now*
> OC after delid: *4.8ghz*
> Temp drops: *24 c*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: *5.2ghz*


Awesome man!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> your ram kit was rated at 1.50V ... but mind that most 1.65V ram kits use same/similar chips, they were just rated differently
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My Mushkin kit(s) can do either Default 1333MHz with 9-9-9-24 @ 1.50V or XMP 2000MHz with 9-11-9-27 @ 1.65V ... but I choose to run them together (4 sticks) at 2200MHz with 10-11-10-30 @ 1.65V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just make sure that your RAM can actually do 1.65v before you try ... google it ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... or deal with RMA later if things go wrong hehe ...


Sounds like PSC to me...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmph i runs mine at 2500mhz with 1.7v
> Dudes this is Ivy Bridge Not SB why are you using 1600mhz kits???
> Ivy Bridge IMC is beast.... get a Gskill 2400mhz 8gb kit for 90$ lol


You don't need to spend so much, if you know the ram ic's you can do some gambling on generic or cheap stuff and clock it as high or even more so.
But, in my case, I'd grab a guaranteed 2400mhz set, cause my current ram can't go past 2200mhz, and I'm not sure if it's the imc or the board not liking my kit.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 5.2ghz with .1.46 v is pretty sweet...


thanks! would like to push a little higher overclock.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah! go for it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can likely go higher...but it'll take some testing.


so 1800 with these timings is ok to start with,
what do i need to change first, or keep in mind?

oo, i just saw these,
Kingston 2x4GB, DDR3, PC19200, CL11, HyperX Predator, XMP
for 50euro, any good or

wait and go for gskill
G.Skill F3-2400C10D-8GTX
but 80euro..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> thanks! would like to push a little higher overclock.


Push it like me and dumby!!!! lol


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Push it like me and dumby!!!! lol


I think 1.52-1.55 will be my limit. would love to go more but would rather not blow anything up... lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Push it like me and dumby!!!! lol












i got some bad news, all because of our big oc's,
my 3770k starts to degrade...
i need 0.005V less vcore to get the same oc as before ......


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i got some bad news, all because of our big oc's,
> my 3770k starts to degrade...
> i need 0.005V less vcore to get the same oc as before ......


nice...lol


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i got some bad news, all because of our big oc's,
> my 3770k starts to degrade...
> i need 0.005V less vcore to get the same oc as before ......


What was your previous Vcore where it was stable?


----------



## Fonne

Is planning to use Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra inside my i7-3770k - Will it be fine ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fonne*
> 
> Is planning to use Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra inside my i7-3770k - Will it be fine ?


yes, it has the same w/mk as pro..
i wrote a bit about here ,
http://www.overclock.net/t/1283797/ivy-bridge-3770k-de-lid-liquid-pro-as-5-tested-amazing-results/30#post_18342699


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yes, it has the same w/mk as pro..


No it has half w/mk as pro


----------



## stellamonster7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so 1800 with these timings is ok to start with,
> what do i need to change first, or keep in mind?
> oo, i just saw these,
> Kingston 2x4GB, DDR3, PC19200, CL11, HyperX Predator, XMP
> for 50euro, any good or
> wait and go for gskill
> G.Skill F3-2400C10D-8GTX
> but 80euro..


dude, do neither new kit. OC what you got, look at how those timings get looser and volts also probly go up on those new kits. you'll have to the same thing for what you have. you like OCing the cpu, shoot you're way ahead of me, so do the same and keep the change in your pocket. IMC is sweet on IVY, but you don't need XMP from out of the box kit, it's overrated IMO. Personally, I am working on getting my 1600 clock with tighter timings because for my apps, I doubt I'll notice any difference if I have to loosen timings to get to 1800 or 2100, etc. saving my money for liq pro and an exacto blade....like how I got us back into forum topic


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i got some bad news, all because of our big oc's,
> my 3770k starts to degrade...
> i need 0.005V less vcore to get the same oc as before ......


Try on a different day it depends on the day sometimes it really does.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No it has half w/mk as pro


they say different in their stat on that page
http://www.pc-max.de/artikel/kuehlung/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/5863

now im not sure anymore, think ive read it elsewhere too..


----------



## daddyfatsax

Got my CL Pro today and my PK-1. Unfortunately when I opened the box this is how the PK-1 looked...

Thankfully the CL Pro was fine. I should be able to scrape enough PK-1 to put on the IHS and my water block.


----------



## kgtuning

WOW, what the hell? did it get crushed? or did it explode?


----------



## daddyfatsax

It looks like somebody stepped on it. The actual PK-1 box was crushed and it was all over the inside of the box, so maybe it could have exploded. I have no idea. FrozenCPU is sending me another one.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> WOW, what the hell? did it get crushed? or did it explode?


He overclocked it to far and it went BOOM


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so 1800 with these timings is ok to start with,
> what do i need to change first, or keep in mind?
> oo, i just saw these,
> Kingston 2x4GB, DDR3, PC19200, CL11, HyperX Predator, XMP
> for 50euro, any good or
> wait and go for gskill
> G.Skill F3-2400C10D-8GTX
> but 80euro..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> dude, do neither new kit. OC what you got, look at how those timings get looser and volts also probly go up on those new kits. you'll have to the same thing for what you have. you like OCing the cpu, shoot you're way ahead of me, so do the same and keep the change in your pocket. IMC is sweet on IVY, but you don't need XMP from out of the box kit, it's overrated IMO. Personally, I am working on getting my 1600 clock with tighter timings because for my apps, I doubt I'll notice any difference if I have to loosen timings to get to 1800 or 2100, etc. saving my money for liq pro and an exacto blade....like how I got us back into forum topic


QFT!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Try on a different day it depends on the day sometimes it really does.


It's normal to see some degradation after 1.55v on air...but well, this IS ocn.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> they say different in their stat on that page
> http://www.pc-max.de/artikel/kuehlung/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/5863
> now im not sure anymore, think ive read it elsewhere too..


I've read the specs from their site, they're really close. That review stated otherwise, but I don't trust that so much. Seems like a typo.
How the heck did they measure that btw?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *daddyfatsax*
> 
> Got my CL Pro today and my PK-1. Unfortunately when I opened the box this is how the PK-1 looked...
> 
> Thankfully the CL Pro was fine. I should be able to scrape enough PK-1 to put on the IHS and my water block.


Man! too bad :/
Luckily you're getting a replacement


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> QFT!
> It's normal to see some degradation after 1.55v on air...but well, this IS ocn.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've read the specs from their site, they're really close. That review stated otherwise, but I don't trust that so much. Seems like a typo.
> How the heck did they measure that btw?
> Man! too bad :/
> Luckily you're getting a replacement


No it is not.. he prolly was not stable to begin with and got into windows with luck.. I have seen IB run at 1.8v for days on end with none.. IB is very tough un like it's older brother.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No it is not.. he prolly was not stable to begin with and got into windows with luck.. I have seen IB run at 1.8v for days on end with none.. IB is very tough un like it's older brother.


That's what im thinking with my 5.428 Ghz run I needed .08 more because of the blck that's it thought came vcore value I put in though. Im still getting my oc perfectly fine...wait......VonDutch is your chip a malaysian chip or no? Mine from malaysia


----------



## Hokies83

I think mine is Taiwan









Anywho i love my Gpu's now...

My room is 75 Degrees and one is idle at 25c and the other 27c.. lol Guess LP has a lil burn in time? Im getting same temps as i did with Antec 620 mod lol..


----------



## kgtuning

Does where it's made matter for overclocking?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Does where it's made matter for overclocking?


No not really lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I think mine is Taiwan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anywho i love my Gpu's now...
> My room is 75 Degrees and one is idle at 25c and the other 27c.. lol Guess LP has a lil burn in time? Im getting same temps as i did with Antec 620 mod lol..


I heard those taiwan chips oc really well....but who know its all in the chip lottery lol.....ugh I want some dry ice or ln2 now....I wanna see what my chip will do at -190 C


----------



## kgtuning

I was gonna say mine was made in Costa Rica and I think its a decent clocker


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I was gonna say mine was made in Costa Rica and I think its a decent clocker


Hokies right it doesn't matter but I swear the chances of getting a good chip are higher. I've seen taiwans next malaysia but not costa ricas since they have been coming in lately.

By the way you are Accepted!


----------



## daddyfatsax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I was gonna say mine was made in Costa Rica and I think its a decent clocker


My chip is from Costa Rica as well.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hokies right it doesn't matter but I swear the chances of getting a good chip are higher. I've seen taiwans next malaysia but not costa ricas since they have been coming in lately.
> By the way you are Accepted!


I assumed







, after seeing the speadsheet change. thanks man


----------



## Hokies83

I donno i got my 3770k on Ivys release day.. Newegg sold out instantly i caught one on Tiger direct.


----------



## Valgaur

Here ill explain a little more on this. Anyone correct me if im wrong lol! But the taiwans chips were in fluxed first then the malaysias and now the costa rica chips are starting to flux in as well. Or atleast that what I see it as.

Hokies delid already and post your stuff silly!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Here ill explain a little more on this. Anyone correct me if im wrong lol! But the taiwans chips were in fluxed first then the malaysias and now the costa rica chips are starting to flux in as well. Or atleast that what I see it as.
> Hokies delid already and post your stuff silly!!


Meh i will when i get around to going to the hardware store..

You donno how bad i want a 5.3ghz 24/7 OC and change my System name from Ivy Bridge is Faster then sandy to " Sandy Bridge Fan Boi Slayer " lmao...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i will when i get around to going to the hardware store..
> You donno how bad i want a 5.3ghz 24/7 OC and change my System name from Ivy Bridge is Faster then sandy to " Sandy Bridge Fan Boi Slayer " lmao...


LMAO, do it!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's what im thinking with my 5.428 Ghz run I needed .08 more because of the blck that's it thought came vcore value I put in though. Im still getting my oc perfectly fine...wait......VonDutch is your chip a malaysian chip or no? Mine from malaysia


Bclk increases need more VTT volts...not vcore. Give that a boost







And keep the imc voltage close by a 0.005v difference.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No it is not.. he prolly was not stable to begin with and got into windows with luck.. I have seen IB run at 1.8v for days on end with none.. IB is very tough un like it's older brother.


Could have been that, I'd boot with a safe oc and go software on it till 5.5ghz








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i will when i get around to going to the hardware store..
> You donno how bad i want a 5.3ghz 24/7 OC and change my System name from Ivy Bridge is Faster then sandy to " Sandy Bridge Fan Boi Slayer " lmao...


That would rock so much man!


----------



## HPE1000

Both my celeron g530 and 3570k came from costa rica


----------



## Hokies83

Now we just need somebody to Photoshop that kid peeing on a Sandybridge logo...


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Now we just need somebody to Photoshop that kid peeing on a Sandybridge logo...


What is the sandybridge logo?


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Here ill explain a little more on this. Anyone correct me if im wrong lol! But the taiwans chips were in fluxed first then the malaysias and now the costa rica chips are starting to flux in as well. Or atleast that what I see it as.
> Hokies delid already and post your stuff silly!!


Question is there any reason why I shouldn't use Indigo Xtreme on a delidded CPU?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> What is the sandybridge logo?











Kids shirt needs to say Ivy Bridge on it tho lol.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> What do you mean flux in, is Inytel starting to use flux solder over the cheap TIM? Another question is there any reason why I shouldn't use Indigo Xtreme on a delidded CPU?


no he meant from those places


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kids shirt needs to say Ivy Bridge on it tho lol.




Like this?


----------



## kgtuning

YES, rofl!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> 
> Like this?


Need color and he needs Ivy Bridge on his shirt! and him lower like his feet level with the bottom of the cpu.

And closer to the cpu cause it is going to be shrunk when u make it an Avatar lol.


----------



## HPE1000

update, I will keep working on it, I am a noob at photo editing



its closer to him, now I need to do his shirt and I can do color


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> update, I will keep working on it, I am a noob at photo editing
> 
> its closer to him, now I need to do his shirt and I can do color


Prolly gona have to make the cpu really large to or make the Sandy Bridge writting larger.. ill make it an Avatar and u can see what has to be done.

You could prolly edit out the Intel aswell for more room for Sandy Bridge.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Prolly gona have to make the cpu really large to or make the Sandy Bridge writting larger.. ill make it an Avatar and u can see what has to be done.
> You could prolly edit out the Intel aswell for more room for Sandy Bridge.


ugh, that is going to be difficult, surely there is a real graphics designer in here!


----------



## Systemlord

Can we please stay on topic here? Thank you


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Can we please stay on topic here? Thank you


Yeah lol. But with that IX question its darn near solder when the reflow process is done and I love the stuff its really really good. It may take time to get that reflow right but take the necessary steps to get it done right.

Hey ktung.....sorry if I can't type your name lol...where exactly is the VTT at or under??


----------



## daddyfatsax

Well I managed to get enough PK-1 from my busted tube and I got the CL Pro put on. I am absolutely stunned at the difference. I was maxing out before around 86C with the Timtronics and PK-1 now I am maxing out at 68C with the CL Pro and PK-1. AMAZING!! I am stunned.

Before 

After


----------



## kgtuning

Nice







, gotta love the temp difference


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah lol. But with that IX question its darn near solder when the reflow process is done and I love the stuff its really really good. It may take time to get that reflow right but take the necessary steps to get it done right.
> Hey ktung.....sorry if I can't type your name lol...where exactly is the VTT at or under??


I was the VTT guy...you need that for pushing bclk. vtt or qpi is the same as vccio in Asus boards. IMC is vccsa.

EDIT: Congrats daddyfatsax!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was the VTT guy...you need that for pushing bclk. vtt or qpi is the same as vccio in Asus boards. IMC is vccsa.
> EDIT: Congrats daddyfatsax!


Thank you! What do you think it would take to get my bclk to 104 or 106......yes making my oc 5.6 and 5.7.....

Also sorry I thought it was ktung.......


----------



## daddyfatsax

Got it to boot at 5GHz, but 1 min or so into Prime95 I BSOD.

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2542153


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *daddyfatsax*
> 
> Got it to boot at 5GHz, but 1 min or so into Prime95 I BSOD.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2542153


lol...I'm running prime too at 5ghz


----------



## daddyfatsax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> lol...I'm running prime too at 5ghz


I went all the to 1.59V and still no go. I am at 4.8GHz now with only 1.4V.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thank you! What do you think it would take to get my bclk to 104 or 106......yes making my oc 5.6 and 5.7.....
> Also sorry I thought it was ktung.......


You should try 1.8v pll, enable internal pll overvoltage (this alone will let you get away with less vcore!), 1.2v vtt / vccio (max 1.35v on air, though it's QUITE high) and vccsa / imc only 0.005v less than that.
Go for slight bclk bumps from within windows using AI suite or some software overcloking program. Boot at 5ghz or so...Then bump vcore and multi/bclk slowly.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *daddyfatsax*
> 
> I went all the to 1.59V and still no go. I am at 4.8GHz now with only 1.4V.


yikes... [email protected] 1.328 here


----------



## daddyfatsax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You should try 1.8v pll, enable internal pll overvoltage (this alone will let you get away with less vcore!), 1.2v vtt / vccio (max 1.35v on air, though it's QUITE high) and vccsa / imc only 0.005v less than that.
> Go for slight bclk bumps from within windows using AI suite or some software overcloking program. Boot at 5ghz or so...Then bump vcore and multi/bclk slowly.


I will give it a try. Thanks for the info.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> yikes... [email protected] 1.328 here


That board software reads voltages wrong btw There was a huge fuss over it... Most likely your really at 1.4v


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That board software reads voltages wrong btw There was a huge fuss over it... Most likely your really at 1.4v


I am pretty sure "huge" is an understatement


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> I am pretty sure "huge" is an understatement


LoL well he did prove it was under reading the voltage in the end tho lol


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That board software reads voltages wrong btw There was a huge fuss over it... Most likely your really at 1.4v


Will not be dicussing as the board may or may not be.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL well he did prove it was under reading the voltage in the end tho lol


I still don't trust a thing he said.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> I still don't trust a thing he said.


Yeah I read the entire thread, and I disagree with him "showing" proof.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah I read the entire thread, and I disagree with him "showing" proof.


HE showed an AnAndtech Review at the end that they also confirmed it and since im a member at Anandtech i trust what they say.

It is not to huge of a deal tho as u are with in safe voltages.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You should try 1.8v pll, enable internal pll overvoltage (this alone will let you get away with less vcore!), 1.2v vtt / vccio (max 1.35v on air, though it's QUITE high) and vccsa / imc only 0.005v less than that.
> Go for slight bclk bumps from within windows using AI suite or some software overcloking program. Boot at 5ghz or so...Then bump vcore and multi/bclk slowly.


Thank you man! When I get back this weekend from home for a quick little break ill try that out. For the pll stuff thought I've already mastered that stuff...I think I could maybe get 1.8v out of it but it doesn't like it....especially at 5.4 it was not very nice without 1.9 flowing through its veins lol.

By the way guys im considering getting some liquid nitrogen or dice stuff to see what I can really get with my current crazy ass vcores lol.


----------



## kgtuning

But I will say this... If the board is off .1volt I can deal with it. using that then my 5 ghz is running at 1.412...that still would be cool.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> But I will say this... If the board is off .1volt I can deal with it. using that then my 5 ghz is running at 1.412...that still would be cool.


I agree 100% it is still great voltages.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thank you man! When I get back this weekend from home for a quick little break ill try that out. For the pll stuff thought I've already mastered that stuff...I think I could maybe get 1.8v out of it but it doesn't like it....especially at 5.4 it was not very nice without 1.9 flowing through its veins lol.
> By the way guys im considering getting some liquid nitrogen or dice stuff to see what I can really get with my current crazy ass vcores lol.


With the same vcore you might see 6ghz...or close, with LN2.
With dice I bet you can get to the same clocks with much less vcore. And bench with it no prob


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I agree 100% it is still great voltages.


Man either way I'm happy. before this build, I never overclocked anything...nevermind build a computer. All noob. lmao


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> With the same vcore you might see 6ghz...or close, with LN2.
> With dice I bet you can get to the same clocks with much less vcore. And bench with it no prob


See that's why I wanna dice it!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Man either way I'm happy. before this build, I never overclocked anything...nevermind build a computer. All noob. lmao


Im also the one doing this as a first OC and build man....im not alone!!!!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> See that's why I wanna dice it!
> Im also the one doing this as a first OC and build man....im not alone!!!!










I have always had projects just never like this. I have been wanting to build a computer for years but never had the money to do it until now. I am so glad I stumbled upon OCN.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, same here...Last pc was a Pentium 4 that I got used for really cheap, I was broke at the time.
Got it to 4ghz on air with an XP-90, I was quite new at the ocing scene, and had no clue it was so crappy for 2010's standards lol
Figured it might be good to play a game or two







Silly me...
I could never get to play much with it, and I already had to sell it to buy food :/ (I made some bucks though, sold it for more than I had originally spent!)
Then I got a new job and BANG! 2600k rig lol
Then resell and bigger BANG! 3770k/670 ftw and stuffs


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, same here...Last pc was a Pentium 4 that I got used for really cheap, I was broke at the time.
> Got it to 4ghz on air with an XP-90, I was quite new at the ocing scene, and had no clue it was so crappy for 2010's standards lol
> Figured it might be good to play a game or two
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Silly me...
> I could never get to play much with it, and I already had to sell it to buy food :/ (I made some bucks though, sold it for more than I had originally spent!)
> Then I got a new job and BANG! 2600k rig lol
> Then resell and bigger BANG! 3770k/670 ftw and stuffs


See here's the thing I have thought about selling my ballsy rig....custom liquid cooling and alls. I bet I could get 4k for it lol. I put 3k into it.......silly college loan extras....don't tell the bank I filed it under study materials....LAWL


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol

I have bought and reselled tons of stuff already...Almost free upgrades so far


----------



## stellamonster7

I haven't even taken the top off yet and I agree and I am in the same boat. first timer for all of this building and OCing, taking it in like a sponge and I know for certain my OC and tweaks to my OS, etc, could easily covet twice as much as I paid for all of this and start working on a test bench (want to talk more dry ice and LN2 with you all, but let's save that for later and I'll let you in on my profession).

but here's my loaded question. we have no data to understand long term effects of deliding and while none of us care because it's our machine. do you have to sell to people with a "buyer beware" if you sell them a system that has a cooler packed on top of a delided cpu? I guess I should rephrase, there's probably nothing that's going to harm it, in fact we know the temp change is ridiculously good. I'm just thinking maintenance, someone opens it up and then their SOL because they weren't expecting this if IHS comes loose if they are cleaning, but maybe I'm overthinking it.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> I haven't even taken the top off yet and I agree and I am in the same boat. first timer for all of this building and OCing, taking it in like a sponge and I know for certain my OC and tweaks to my OS, etc, could easily covet twice as much as I paid for all of this and start working on a test bench (want to talk more dry ice and LN2 with you all, but let's save that for later and I'll let you in on my profession).
> but here's my loaded question. we have no data to understand long term effects of deliding and while none of us care because it's our machine. do you have to sell to people with a "buyer beware" if you sell them a system that has a cooler packed on top of a delided cpu? I guess I should rephrase, there's probably nothing that's going to harm it, in fact we know the temp change is ridiculously good. I'm just thinking maintenance, someone opens it up and then their SOL because they weren't expecting this if IHS comes loose if they are cleaning, but maybe I'm overthinking it.


Just mention or choose to exclude the warranty from the CPU. Ie. all the other parts probably have warranty of sort and the cpu doesn't for obvious reasons.

OR you could just go it's a custom computer warranty not included and thus if something breaks too bad kind of deal... I did that to my 4 year old computer and was ok (was probably on it's last leg too seemed to work fine for me though







).

I think for most ppl who buy it used would probably only be concerned with that much. you could probably tell them but I don't know I don't plan to sell mine.


----------



## Fallout323f

just wondering what intel official response is on those delidded ivy's en those nice temp results.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Mailman left these at my doorstep today!


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fallout323f*
> 
> just wondering what intel official response is on those delidded ivy's en those nice temp results.


Probably, THERE ON TO US!


----------



## rexbinary

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mailman left these at my doorstep today!


Sweet


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Probably, THERE ON TO US!


There like NOOOOO You Bastards !!!!!!! Your hurting the sells of our 600$ and 1000$ Cpu'S with your faster core fore core CPUS!!!
That we knowingly put stupid glue on and made the IHS to far from the cores to cool correctly!

But Aha! we will tell them if they make there Cpus overclock like beasts we will revoke there warranty's!

Those overclocking SCUM have figured out our plot to limit Ivy Bridge overclocking so we can sell more 1000$ cpus! now we going to lose 50 million this quarter!!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fallout323f*
> 
> just wondering what intel official response is on those delidded ivy's en those nice temp results.


They are probably jealous... lol


----------



## Systemlord

I believe Intel is embarrassed by the fact that we came up with a much better solution, Intel has a huge reputation and we just one upped them on their own manufacturing of the IB! It makes me wonder if they will do the same thing with Haswell...?


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I believe Intel is embarrassed by the fact that we came up with a much better solution, Intel has a huge reputation and we just one upped them on their own manufacturing of the IB! It makes me wonder if they will do the same thing with Haswell...?


We did not really one up them as solder would probably be about as good as what we do. If Haswell uses as little power as Ivy Bridge (according to their presentations it will use less) they will probably use the same TIM again and not solder like Sandy Bridge. For Intel, there is no point in soldering the chips if it is not needed.


----------



## Hokies83

Anyeho i hsve her de lidded my glue was not very thick at all.

*What did you guys use for the glue on the PCB that stuff is a PITA.*

Yah im talking to you from my HTPC lol check it.. bad arse htpc huh ? lol http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2543337


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Anyeho i hsve her de lidded my glue was not very thick at all.
> 
> *What did you guys use for the glue on the PCB that stuff is a PITA.*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Yah im talking to you from my HTPC lol check it.. bad arse htpc huh ? lol http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2543337


Use your nails. Just scratch it off. You won't kill it or damage it at all. Our nail strengths are like 3.


----------



## HPE1000

I don't know if people understand, but the whole reason intel did this is obvious, if they would have unlocked the true overclocking potential, it would have competed with lga 2011 so they put sucky tim on it and glued it down with tar so you couldn't do anything. At least that's what they thought.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Use your nails. Just scratch it off. You won't kill it or damage it at all. Our nail strengths are like 3.


I used my nails too with a bit of 91% Iso.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Use your nails. Just scratch it off. You won't kill it or damage it at all. Our nail strengths are like 3.
> 
> 
> 
> I used my nails too with a bit of 91% Iso.
Click to expand...

Yea, that's what I did. I used a bit of alcohol on it and just rubbed it out.


----------



## Hokies83

IN process of lapping IHS.. hreres some pics at where im at now at the 1500 grit.. still have 2500 grit to go..


----------



## Valgaur

Dude nice!!!!!!!!! Keep it going! Impress the Valgaur!


----------



## kgtuning

How much does lapping the IHS help?


----------



## stellamonster7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> I don't know if people understand, but the whole reason intel did this is obvious, if they would have unlocked the true overclocking potential, it would have competed with lga 2011 so they put sucky tim on it and glued it down with tar so you couldn't do anything. At least that's what they thought.


LOL....but isn't it more fun to think that you are not only getting a chance to OC the item, but also mod the part. I mean this is a new ball game. let us that buy a K series do what we want. also someone should check the stats in all seriousness - intel makes their money selling cpus for stock vendor builds like Dell and all the other home/office crap. sure they know were doing this and they might even be paying attention to this very thread, but while I'd like to think they might consider using better materials...if it don't make dollars, it don't make sense so it was probably about money more than anything else


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> How much does lapping the IHS help?


1-3 c maybe


----------



## stellamonster7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> IN process of lapping IHS.. hreres some pics at where im at now at the 1500 grit.. still have 2500 grit to go.


I second the question, can you explain what you are doing? should I do this when I delid?

edited: okay, I guess you are just wet-sanding to get better contact.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1-3 c maybe


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Dude nice!!!!!!!!! Keep it going! Impress the Valgaur!


Finished Hail to the hokie baby.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> LOL....but isn't it more fun to think that you are not only getting a chance to OC the item, but also mod the part. I mean this is a new ball game. let us that buy a K series do what we want. also someone should check the stats in all seriousness - intel makes their money selling cpus for stock vendor builds like Dell and all the other home/office crap. sure they know were doing this and they might even be paying attention to this very thread, but while I'd like to think they might consider using better materials...if it don't make dollars, it don't make sense so it was probably about money more than anything else


I know, that is the main income for most, if not all companies. Electronics companies make more money selling off to other companies that their products that go straight to the end user. Such as rolls royce and their jet engines.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1-3 c maybe
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Dude nice!!!!!!!!! Keep it going! Impress the Valgaur!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Finished Hail to the hokie baby.
Click to expand...

Are you not getting a mirror finish?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1-3 c maybe


Not bad. At some point maybe I'll do that to mine. But I'm pretty happy with 71*c as my highest temp.


----------



## HPE1000

IDK why no one lapped their delided cpus. you already had the lid off, thats what I would have done.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> IDK why no one lapped their delided cpus. you already had the lid off, thats what I would have done.


If I had thought about it more I would have. But its not like its hard to do now. It'll make a nice rainy day project.


----------



## Valgaur

OC that baby hokies!!!!!!!! Get to the 5.4 ghzers!


----------



## Hokies83

taking a break for a few before i put it back in the mb trying to get glue off pcb with no finger nails was a pita....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Are you not getting a mirror finish?


2500grit is best i got i have no leather to do that.. this is good enough alot better then it was before it slides around like melted butter lol


----------



## Hokies83

Back on my main rig and she works... Lets see what happen brb while i play in the Bios...









5.1Ghz...


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> LOL....but isn't it more fun to think that you are not only getting a chance to OC the item, but also mod the part. I mean this is a new ball game. let us that buy a K series do what we want. also someone should check the stats in all seriousness - intel makes their money selling cpus for stock vendor builds like Dell and all the other home/office crap. sure they know were doing this and they might even be paying attention to this very thread, but while I'd like to think they might consider using better materials...if it don't make dollars, it don't make sense so it was probably about money more than anything else


^This^ My thoughts as well


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> IDK why no one lapped their delided cpus. you already had the lid off, thats what I would have done.


I did, it looks pretty, but since I did it when I delided, I have no reference point to measure outcome from doing it. Oh well.


----------



## Valgaur

hokies...why you use coretemp! use cpu-z and realtemp


----------



## Hokies83

Meh looks like i hit the wall at 5.2ghz. Takes 1.6v for 5.1


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh looks like i hit the wall at 5.2ghz. Takes 1.6v for 5.1


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hokies...why you use coretemp! use cpu-z and realtemp


I hate real temp i use cpu z and core temp


----------



## ivanlabrie

I use coretemp, it's the same thing as realtemp, same sensor readings. No timer though, and weird vid reports instead of cpu-z vcore.

Just sliced a P4 prescott die in half after delidding it, went too far in with the blade. But I'm getting the hang of the fine motions needed.
I'll get one or two more of these to delid them before doing it to my 3770k.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh looks like i hit the wall at 5.2ghz. Takes 1.6v for 5.1


Could be worse right... still at least you made it into the 5's


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Could be worse right... still at least you made it into the 5's


LoL i would use more V core to get into the 5s that was the whole point of this..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i would use more V core to get into the 5s that was the whole point of this..


do 5.4 like dumb and dumber lol


----------



## neopunx

@Hokies83, if you want to squeeze some more out of that chip, you might want to think of doing a custom water loop intead of your '100. Bigger rad/pup/more luids would probably cool you down a bit more....actually, I could be speaking out of turn here. Whats your 5.1 temps?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> do 5.4 like dumb and dumber lol


Tried Bios locked up lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Tried Bios locked up lol.


The 5.4 needs crazy vcore...dont do it in bios do it through your in windows settings.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> here is my 4.8ghz 24 hour stable run:


nice voltage for 4.8GHz stable! mine needs lot more than that to be stable - around 1.33v under load to be OK.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sounds like PSC to me...


what?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> nice voltage for 4.8GHz stable! mine needs lot more than that to be stable - around 1.33v under load to be OK.
> what?


PSC, as in ram IC chips...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> nice voltage for 4.8GHz stable! mine needs lot more than that to be stable - around 1.33v under load to be OK.
> what?


Thanks! hopefully have a solid 4.9-5.0 stable this week but depends on how much time I have to play around with it.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> PSC, as in ram IC chips...


I still have no clue what you are talking about, but that's OK








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Thanks! hopefully have a solid 4.9-5.0 stable this week but depends on how much time I have to play around with it.


good luck!









I confirmed today my CPU can do 5GHz with around 1.464v under load vcore, if it doesn't start degrading like crazy within a week (that's what happened to my former chip when I benchmarked it once at 4.8GHz...) I will be delidding it in 2-3 weeks







Coollaboratory Ultra on order since Thursday already


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I still have no clue what you are talking about, but that's OK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I confirmed today my CPU can do 5GHz with around 1.464v under load vcore, if it doesn't start degrading like crazy within a week (that's what happened to my former chip when I benchmarked it once at 4.8GHz...) I will be delidding it in 2-3 weeks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coollaboratory Ultra on order since Thursday already


1.464 is an aweso e vcore man!!!!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I still have no clue what you are talking about, but that's OK


Not really important...only talking about the type of ram chip, according to the timings and clocks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I confirmed today my CPU can do 5GHz with around 1.464v under load vcore, if it doesn't start degrading like crazy within a week (that's what happened to my former chip when I benchmarked it once at 4.8GHz...) I will be delidding it in 2-3 weeks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coollaboratory Ultra on order since Thursday already










Good luck with that! Anxious to see your results...


----------



## Hokies83

IM burning in 5.1ghz atm going to drop V core as needed got a 12500 Physx score in 3d mark 11 btw.. if only had had my 2 old 2gb 680s i could have cracked the top 10 in 3d mark 11 scores meh but im fine being # 20.. lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> IM burning in 5.1ghz atm going to drop V core as needed got a 12500 Physx score in 3d mark 11 btw.. if only had had my 2 old 2gb 680s i could have cracked the top 10 in 3d mark 11 scores meh but im fine being # 20.. lol


1.59 vcore...owwwwyyyyy for 4 hours rly?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1.59 vcore...owwwwyyyyy for 4 hours rly?


1.57 now.. gotta start high then work lowwer yo.. Since 5.2 would not even post windows lol... Until we find a way to work with the blk r something that is.. has to be more to overclocking IB... then just a multi.. and vcore...

I rmember my 1366 days overclocking took alot of crap..

Can not be a SB fan Boi Slayer unless it is a stable OC.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I was chatting and browsing at 5.1ghz and 1.57v lol
Figured out after an hour of that...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was chatting and browsing at 5.1ghz and 1.57v lol
> Figured out after an hour of that...


Hey im doing that to lol

Oh and Btw 25c temp drop.. I used The Liquid pro thick on the die.. then i used it on the IHS as tim.. got 3 c cooler then the IC diamond.


----------



## Valgaur

let me call intel...

me: intel?

intel: yes?

me: 1.55v for ivy is to low.....*click*

intel:...Wha???


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> let me call intel...
> me: intel?
> intel: yes?
> me: 1.55v for ivy is to low.....*click*
> intel:...Wha???


You liked me talking from my HTPC..

And seen it is Faster then alot of people main rigs lol...

I was able to take pictures while i was doing things was quite fun..


----------



## Swag

I called Intel and I told them that my CPU started burning up running on stock and they said it might just be that I didn't have a HSF on it. Dumb idiots. I laughed so hard, Intel reps are funny when they deal with weird situations. Of course, the story I fed to them was just a lie. This was last week when I inquired about the max voltage they'd cover.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I called Intel and I told them that my CPU started burning up running on stock and they said it might just be that I didn't have a HSF on it. Dumb idiots. I laughed so hard, Intel reps are funny when they deal with weird situations. Of course, the story I fed to them was just a lie. This was last week when I inquired about the max voltage they'd cover.


Call and be like..

Why did all this stuff that looks like Glue leak from under my IHS... and all of a sudden my tempatures dropped 20c is that normal?!

And Valgaur why am i not added to the club Roster son?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I called Intel and I told them that my CPU started burning up running on stock and they said it might just be that I didn't have a HSF on it. Dumb idiots. I laughed so hard, Intel reps are funny when they deal with weird situations. Of course, the story I fed to them was just a lie. This was last week when I inquired about the max voltage they'd cover.
> 
> 
> 
> Call and be like..
> 
> Why did all this stuff that looks like Glue leak from under my IHS... and all of a sudden my tempatures dropped 20c is that normal?!
Click to expand...

Hmm, should I? That'd be funny too. I might just do it on Monday. After that, I'll call again and say, I took off my HSF and my IHS popped off. What do I do? My temps dropped 20C and I thought that was bad.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Call and be like..
> Why did all this stuff that looks like Glue leak from under my IHS... and all of a sudden my tempatures dropped 20c is that normal?!
> And Valgaur why am i not added to the club Roster son?


Submit it right you foo!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hmm, should I? That'd be funny too. I might just do it on Monday. After that, I'll call again and say, I took off my HSF and my IHS popped off. What do I do? My temps dropped 20C and I thought that was bad.


Dude record it and make a Youtube video...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Submit it right you foo!!!!


25c drop 3770k 5.1ghz overclock.. could do 5ghz before but stayed 4.8 24/7..

But say 300mhz gain anywhos...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Dude record it and make a Youtube video...


i would like and sub to that in a heart beat lol.

anyways guys hokies tell me your correct submission and ill add you lol


----------



## Swag

I might make a video. I feel bad for Intel with all our funny calls.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Submit it right you foo!!!!


That's right! We gots rules on this hear thread that has ta be followed!


----------



## feniks

thanks guys









1.464v is what it landed at (as per cpu-z) when under IBT load. however currently I am using 25% (Medium) LLC which brings it to around 1.544v vcore at idle (when at 5GHz that is).
5GHz is max I dare to do with 25% LLC (helps lower temps under load by a bit), for anything above it I will stick to Ultra High (75%) LLC to balance the voltage and not overshoot too high even temporarily.

... hopefully I don't destroy my chip while delidding it LOL! that would be a bummer he he. will be back here once I do the "trick".

ivanlabrie, thanks for explaining it a bit more, finally understood what you meant







had no idea that my ram sticks kind has a name








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1.464 is an aweso e vcore man!!!!!!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not really important...only talking about the type of ram chip, according to the timings and clocks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good luck with that! Anxious to see your results...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> i would like and sub to that in a heart beat lol.
> anyways guys hokies tell me your correct submission and ill add you lol


Hey Valgaur, did you get to watch any of the LN2 meet stream today? I saw you on the OCN N2OC thread and I was able to watch it some before running some tasks. Real cool stuff (pun intended!)!

I think you should try the dice first before going to LN2. Much easier transition I'd think, and you can get a POT that supports both I think so you'd have what you needed to go further when you were ready.









Also, I think delided IBs do poorly with LN2, but I'd think they would be fine with dice.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, did you get to watch any of the LN2 meet stream today? I saw you on the OCN N2OC thread and I was able to watch it some before running some tasks. Real cool stuff (pun intended!)!
> I think you should try the dice first before going to LN2. Much easier transition I'd think, and you can get a POT that supports both I think so you'd have what you needed to go further when you were ready.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, I think delided IBs do poorly with LN2, but I'd think they would be fine with dice.


I'm actually already thinking about dicing lol. I got about 4 mins to watch then i lost my 3g connection i was super bummed. but with the delidded IB's and the cold i have an idea on how to et it right. with the cold you just don't need to go so extreme on the cold necessarily since the cbb (cold boot bug) is somewhere lol so sit in the -80's area and then give that puppy a whirl and see i guess...yeah i wanna do dice though. i would love to but those pots are expensive man!!!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, did you get to watch any of the LN2 meet stream today? I saw you on the OCN N2OC thread and I was able to watch it some before running some tasks. Real cool stuff (pun intended!)!
> I think you should try the dice first before going to LN2. Much easier transition I'd think, and you can get a POT that supports both I think so you'd have what you needed to go further when you were ready.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, I think delided IBs do poorly with LN2, but I'd think they would be fine with dice.


I've heard that one before...Not sure if it is the testers fault, perhaps they left the glue on, or used as5 or something more average than Liquid Pro.
I bet our chips will do just fine under cold!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I've heard that one before...Not sure if it is the testers fault, perhaps they left the glue on, or used as5 or something more average than Liquid Pro.
> I bet our chips will do just fine under cold!


all my company profit....is going towards a pot lol.....


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I've heard that one before...Not sure if it is the testers fault, perhaps they left the glue on, or used as5 or something more average than Liquid Pro.
> I bet our chips will do just fine under cold!


Ithought LP doesn't do as well sub 0


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Ithought LP doesn't do as well sub 0


Why won't liquid metal do good? Any links? Perhaps we need a special sub zero tim...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Ithought LP doesn't do as well sub 0
> 
> 
> 
> Why won't liquid metal do good? Any links? Perhaps we need a special sub zero tim...
Click to expand...

I just use my normal TIM and I just end up switching it over after I'm done. I don't see a point in buying some special TIM to lower my temps 5C when I'm already at the sub-zero temps.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just use my normal TIM and I just end up switching it over after I'm done. I don't see a point in buying some special TIM to lower my temps 5C when I'm already at the sub-zero temps.


what do you use to sool sub-zero? phase, dice, LN2?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just use my normal TIM and I just end up switching it over after I'm done. I don't see a point in buying some special TIM to lower my temps 5C when I'm already at the sub-zero temps.
> 
> 
> 
> what do you use to sool sub-zero? phase, dice, LN2?
Click to expand...

I only did it once a while back and it was DICE. I couldn't find any quick source of LN2. I borrowed a pot from a friend and just went with it. I'm in the process of saving up some money for a pot. I want the OCN Marksman pot. Looks so nice!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I only did it once a while back and it was DICE. I couldn't find any quick source of LN2. I borrowed a pot from a friend and just went with it. I'm in the process of saving up some money for a pot. I want the OCN Marksman pot. Looks so nice!


i want it too!!!!!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I only did it once a while back and it was DICE. I couldn't find any quick source of LN2. I borrowed a pot from a friend and just went with it. I'm in the process of saving up some money for a pot. I want the OCN Marksman pot. Looks so nice!
> 
> 
> 
> i want it too!!!!!!
Click to expand...

I got about $200 saved up.

Isn't that damn nice?
http://www.tankguys.com/site-merchandise/marksman-extreme-cooling-pot.html


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I got about $200 saved up.
> Isn't that damn nice?
> http://www.tankguys.com/site-merchandise/marksman-extreme-cooling-pot.html


i...........its sooo pretty!!!!!!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I got about $200 saved up.
> Isn't that damn nice?
> http://www.tankguys.com/site-merchandise/marksman-extreme-cooling-pot.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i...........its sooo pretty!!!!!!!
Click to expand...

I've always wondered. Is it possible to get a direct extreme cooling pot? Like that one DT water block but for extreme cooling. It'd be amazing what you can do with a direct LN2 on the die or something. I doubt it'll get damaged either.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've always wondered. Is it possible to get a direct extreme cooling pot? Like that one DT water block but for extreme cooling. It'd be amazing what you can do with a direct LN2 on the die or something. I doubt it'll get damaged either.


Some serious vasaline would be needed though.......and the right application of it too as well. But the direct mount....would be able to stay I bet at -60 to -80 for the best results that -100 range likes to get cbb lol me and you should go to a meet swag!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've always wondered. Is it possible to get a direct extreme cooling pot? Like that one DT water block but for extreme cooling. It'd be amazing what you can do with a direct LN2 on the die or something. I doubt it'll get damaged either.
> 
> 
> 
> Some serious vasaline would be needed though.......and the right application of it too as well. But the direct mount....would be able to stay I bet at -60 to -80 for the best results that -100 range likes to get cbb lol me and you should go to a meet swag!
Click to expand...

We could. My family might move to Alberta Canada. Have an Extreme Cooling OC Party. I've done it twice already with some people I met at MicroCenter.







Not bad actually. We got to do a lot of things and I learned a lot of about sub-cooling.


----------



## VonDutch

we like numbers right








and its the Delidded Ivy Bridge Club..
4.7ghz

so i did a IBT 10x run, stress level: maximum

temperature cores:
56-64-62-60 C.
















4.7ghz, vid: 1.2360-1.2510V
........vcore: 1.2840-1.3080V

offset: 0.045V

core temp has 1C lower readings, but i started it later,
or it is just the difference in program ..

i tried offset at 4.8ghz,
but you all know i have a bad chip voltage wise,
was stable with 4.8ghz and 1.420V vcore,
my VID was 1.2610V, so i needed a offset 0.160V

Vcore-VID=offset
1.420-1.2610=0.159V right, so 0.160V for me,

im not sure what to think of such a big offset, could it work?
should it be no problem for me, or do i need to think of some things ?
could changing LLC from Turbo to Extreme help me?
turbo is slight vdroop, extreme is no vdroop,
would extreme give me lower offset?

o, and the high offset, will give me a higher idle voltage too..


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> We did not really one up them as solder would probably be about as good as what we do. If Haswell uses as little power as Ivy Bridge (according to their presentations it will use less) they will probably use the same TIM again and not solder like Sandy Bridge. For Intel, there is no point in soldering the chips if it is not needed.


There is a need to solder the IHS as everyone knows it provides much better heat transfer, why bother unlocking a 3770K for overclocking if you are going to handicap the heat transfer capabilities? I say that the 3770K is a chip people would buy to overclock, it only makes sense to use TIM on the lower end chips and not the 3770K's!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> We did not really one up them as solder would probably be about as good as what we do. If Haswell uses as little power as Ivy Bridge (according to their presentations it will use less) they will probably use the same TIM again and not solder like Sandy Bridge. For Intel, there is no point in soldering the chips if it is not needed.
> 
> 
> 
> There is a need to solder the IHS as everyone knows it provides much better heat transfer, why bother unlocking a 3770K for overclocking if you are going to handicap the the heat transfer capabilities? I say that the 3770K is a chip people would buy to overclock, it only makes sense to use TIM on the lower end chips and not the 3770K's!
Click to expand...

Don't say that! Advocate for all chips to be soldered!


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> There is a need to solder the IHS as everyone knows it provides much better heat transfer, why bother unlocking a 3770K for overclocking if you are going to handicap the heat transfer capabilities? I say that the 3770K is a chip people would buy to overclock, it only makes sense to use TIM on the lower end chips and not the 3770K's!


I was talking about "needed" from Intels perspective; these chips still clock very well with the crappy TIM they are using now, so fro them it is mission accomplished.
For us however, if we don't want to mod, solder would indeed be needed. I would be happy if they just soldered the K models as we are already paying more for those.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> I was talking about "needed" from Intels perspective; these chips still clock very well with the crappy TIM they are using now, so fro them it is mission accomplished.
> For us however, if we don't want to mod, solder would indeed be needed. I would be happy if they just soldered the K models as we are already paying more for those.


could you imagine if our 3770K's were soldered?


----------



## neopunx

I would def be in line to buy a new one/pay to have some one else do it(soldered version I mean)


----------



## beniroc

Got bored this morning tried out getting at 5.4ghz..








http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2544198


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> could you imagine if our 3770K's were soldered?


To be honest, I think Liquid Pro or other liquid metals will do probably as good or maybe even better as solder. The power density for Ivy Bridge is higher than of Sandy Bridge, but I get lower temps at higher clocks with the same voltage and the same cooling, which indicates that even though the power density is higher I am able to cool Ivy Bridge better.


----------



## neopunx

@beniroc, very Nice!


----------



## Swag

A soldered CPU will transfer heat better than any other method. The reason being metal is the best heat transfer-er. The reason we have thermal paste is to assure that the CPU touches the HSF fully but we can only put a little so we won't bother the parts that will already be touching metal-to-metal.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> To be honest, I think Liquid Pro or other liquid metals will do probably as good or maybe even better as solder. The power density for Ivy Bridge is higher than of Sandy Bridge, but I get lower temps at higher clocks with the same voltage and the same cooling, which indicates that even though the power density is higher I am able to cool Ivy Bridge better.


So maybe liquid metal is better then. I'm still amazed at the before and after temps we are all seeing.


----------



## Valgaur

I know and the crazy OCs we are getting as we'll thanks to those temps


----------



## kgtuning

Maybe I missed it but has anyone shaved down the lip on the underside of the IHS to make sure it is sitting as low and close to the die as possible?


----------



## Hokies83

I sanded mine a little bit and it is sitting right on it.

Also i wonder how delidding effects value.. u would think a delid lapped 3770k value would go up a bit...

Instead of a used value of lets say 260$ the value would be 300$


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I sanded mine a little bit and it is sitting right on it.
> Also i wonder how delidding effects value.. u would think a delid lapped 3770k value would go up a bit...
> Instead of a used value of lets say 260$ the value would be 300$


Depends on your buyer... everything is worth something to someone. To a person that doesn't dare to do what we do then it very well could be worth more.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I sanded mine a little bit and it is sitting right on it.
> Also i wonder how delidding effects value.. u would think a delid lapped 3770k value would go up a bit...
> Instead of a used value of lets say 260$ the value would be 300$
> 
> 
> 
> Depends on your buyer... everything is worth something to someone. To a person that doesn't dare to do what we do then it very well could be worth more.
Click to expand...

I've delidded someone's 3570k for $50 once. I just guaranteed him that if it died, I'd get him a new one. So easy since most electronic store doesn't check the CPU if it was delidded...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've delidded someone's 3570k for $50 once. I just guaranteed him that if it died, I'd get him a new one. So easy since most electronic store doesn't check the CPU if it was delidded...


Shhhh...lol.


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Maybe I missed it but has anyone shaved down the lip on the underside of the IHS to make sure it is sitting as low and close to the die as possible?


According to some people that measured all the parts, if you clean of the glue properly, the IHS should not be able to touch the PCB so sanding it down would be unnecessary. However, sanding it down a little bit also can't really hurt anything, so if you think your IHS is touching the PCB, go for it.


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A soldered CPU will transfer heat better than any other method. The reason being metal is the best heat transfer-er. The reason we have thermal paste is to assure that the CPU touches the HSF fully but we can only put a little so we won't bother the parts that will already be touching metal-to-metal.


I understand the theory, but reality seem to not be like that. The fact still is that Ivy Bridge has a higher power density but still runs cooler with Liquid Pro at the same frequency and voltage as Sandy Bridge. Therefore, Liquid Pro must be better than solder. My 2600K and 3770K are proof for this.

I have not seen any proof for the statement you make "A soldered CPU will transfer heat better than any other method".


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> Got bored this morning tried out getting at 5.4ghz..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2544198


Very nice OC *beniroc*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> According to some people that measured all the parts, if you clean of the glue propersly, the IHS should not be able to touch the PCB so sanding it down would be unnecessary. However, sanding it down a little bit also can't really hurt anything, so if you think your IHS is touching the PCB, go for it.


Yes, *Conquistador SW* is correct that the IHS should sit directly on the die once all the black glue is removed. In fact, the glue keeping the IHS from sitting on the die is what some consider as the real problem with the IB chips and not the intel TIM choice. Deliding allows for the IHS to sit on the die and may be what is mainly responsible for the great temps you deliders are seeing!

...I hope to be able to join your deliding temp fun next week when my CL Ultra arrives!!! - then I'll consider going beyond the 5.241GHz OC hi of my chip......


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> According to some people that measured all the parts, if you clean of the glue properly, the IHS should not be able to touch the PCB so sanding it down would be unnecessary. However, sanding it down a little bit also can't really hurt anything, so if you think your IHS is touching the PCB, go for it.


I don't think its touching any of the residue from the glue. However I could not get it down to the PCB. And when I was delidding there was almost no gap so it was just a thought. Guess I should have checked it with a micrometer.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I don't think its touching any of the residue from the glue. However I could not get it down to the PCB. And when I was delidding there was almost no gap so it was just a thought. Guess I should have checked it with a micrometer.


Well, if your IHS is not able to spin on the die without the PCB keeping that from happening, then you may want to sand down the IHS sides some to make that happen. Improved temps can happen if the die IHS gap is reduced to zero I'd think.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well, if your IHS is not able to spin on the die without the PCB keeping that from happening, then you may want to sand down the IHS sides some to make that happen. Improved temps can happen if the die IHS gap is reduced to zero I'd think.


Mine does spin on the die. Maybe I'm just over thinking it. And considering my temps, it is probably fine. But when I lap the IHS I'll sand down the lip just in case.


----------



## Neo Zuko

I want to delid my 3770K...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Neo Zuko*
> 
> I want to delid my 3770K...


Its risky business make sure you read everything accordingly and get everything in your mind prepared for the worst...that's how I think even when I bench lol.


----------



## beniroc

Thanks neopunx and pcwargamer,may try 5.5ghz next weekend. There may be a few more mhz in it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> Thanks neopunx and pcwargamer,may try 5.5ghz next weekend.


What you using for cooling?? Sorry im on my phone lol.........kinda freaking out that my folding has stopped.....im worried for my little Franky!!!!!!!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Neo Zuko*
> 
> I want to delid my 3770K...


read all of the info on here before you decide to do it. I expected a dead chip so when it worked I was super happy.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't do the more than 1.55v oc's more than once, and only for a cpu-z validation...We're treading on some dangerous terrain here, temps at those volts start degrading the chips right away, most 5.5ghz oc's are done on dice, and 1.75v for DICE is considered MURDER!


----------



## maestrobg

before removal IHS:

4.5ghz

max temp 87 c!



after IHS removal:

4.5ghz

max temp 67 c!!!

it is 20 c lower!!!!



and LINX completed at 4.9 Ghz !!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Im running 5.1ghz prime 95 7 hr stable @ 1.54 v core that is my new 24/7 OC.

Gives me the go juice to set back and wait for my guy to have a Haswell hardware ready for me so i gets it cheapppp


----------



## ivanlabrie

Man that's insane vcore for 24/7 and ambient temps!
I'd back down to 5ghz or 4.9...have you tested volts for those clocks?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man that's insane vcore for 24/7 and ambient temps!
> I'd back down to 5ghz or 4.9...have you tested volts for those clocks?


Temps? i barely break 80c? lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't do the more than 1.55v oc's more than once, and only for a cpu-z validation...We're treading on some dangerous terrain here, temps at those volts start degrading the chips right away, most 5.5ghz oc's are done on dice, and 1.75v for DICE is considered MURDER!


I don't mean to be a broken record or anything but IB is much more resiliant to degredation than SB is im honestly very surprised my little Franky has started getting old lol. Also for my suicide runs I did them just long enough to either bsod for unstable or to get that cpuz run I don't push it super horrible hard I get a few tests in then cpuz that thing fast longest time was maybe 4 mins before at 1.752. Although I might have the Prodigy chip the Ln2 guys are telling me and that its just one of those lucky chips with crazy resistances.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I don't mean to be a broken record or anything but IB is much more resiliant to degredation than SB is im honestly very surprised my little Franky has started getting old lol. Also for my suicide runs I did them just long enough to either bsod for unstable or to get that cpuz run I don't push it super horrible hard I get a few tests in then cpuz that thing fast longest time was maybe 4 mins before at 1.752. Although I might have the Prodigy chip the Ln2 guys are telling me and that its just one of those lucky chips with crazy resistances.


Hehehe, yeah, seems like your chip is quite sturdy. I can't afford another chip so I won't go that far on regular cooling, with dice perhaps...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Temps? i barely break 80c? lol.


Over ambient temps...no sub zero stuff. I wouldn't risk it, despite the lower temps, you're still pumping some decent watts out of your chip (though faster and more efficiently).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hehehe, yeah, seems like your chip is quite sturdy. I can't afford another chip so I won't go that far on regular cooling, with dice perhaps...
> Over ambient temps...no sub zero stuff. I wouldn't risk it, despite the lower temps, you're still pumping some decent watts out of your chip (though faster and more efficiently).


Yeah little Franky is a tough guy lol. And Hokies yeah Id hold off on a 5.1 stable yeah the temps are good but even I wouldn't do 1.55vcore for everyday those 300 mhz wont make a huge difference and if they do then what you doing lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

BTC with his cpu? lol
I'd keep the stable 5.1 and so on clocks for benching 3d and 2d stuff...24/7 there's no real point in running more than 4.2ghz really. Even I know that, and I'm insane and overclock anything I touch lol


----------



## Valgaur

Hmmm.... to push for 5.5 or 5.6..........or test my stability and make sure Franky is okay.......


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't risk it...it's too far a stretch!
Better do something productive like bench at 5.4ghz. 5.4 on air should net you some good scores









Heck, even 5.2ghz on air would insane for a 3770k.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't risk it...it's too far a stretch!
> Better do something productive like bench at 5.4ghz. 5.4 on air should net you some good scores
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heck, even 5.2ghz on air would insane for a 3770k.


NO!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't risk it...it's too far a stretch!
> Better do something productive like bench at 5.4ghz. 5.4 on air should net you some good scores
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heck, even 5.2ghz on air would insane for a 3770k.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> NO!


...you got to think about more than yourself...what about little Franky???


----------



## feniks

I wouldn't go above 1.52v vcore on daily basis, that is considered an absolute maximum (be it off load or under load, no matter). intel claims that fast degradation may take its toll above that voltage.

keep higher clocks for benching, keep lower ones for daily running.


----------



## Hokies83

im running 1.53V 24/7 @ 5.1ghz

My system can not slay SB fan Bois if it is not faster then every 2700k 24/7 on OCN..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> ...you got to think about more than yourself...what about little Franky???


He's happy lol I'm gonna wait until my indigo xtreme gets here to test my new OC's and bring my folding OC to 4.5 instead now.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> im running 1.53V 24/7 @ 5.1ghz
> My system can not slay SB fan Bois if it is not faster then every 2700k 24/7 on OCN..


that is a feat *Hokies83* - and I bet you do slam the SBs with that too - got to love delided IBs

I bet your temps are still good, but 1.53v for 24/7 may cause derogation over time - I guess you will be able to tell us soon if that is true or not









What are you using for stability testing at that OC - IBT, prime95 - how long of runs

...also, what's your Cinebench score???? any other benching scores you can share for that OC? superpi?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> that is a feat *Hokies83* - and I bet you do slam the SBs with that too - got to love delided IBs
> I bet your temps are still good, but 1.53v for 24/7 may cause derogation over time - I guess you will be able to tell us soon if that is true or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What are you using for stability testing at that OC - IBT, prime95 - how long of runs
> ...also, what's your Cinebench score???? any other benching scores you can share for that OC? superpi?


got this 5ghz run, gave me 10.11 points in Cinebench


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> that is a feat *Hokies83* - and I bet you do slam the SBs with that too - got to love delided IBs
> I bet your temps are still good, but 1.53v for 24/7 may cause derogation over time - I guess you will be able to tell us soon if that is true or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What are you using for stability testing at that OC - IBT, prime95 - how long of runs
> ...also, what's your Cinebench score???? any other benching scores you can share for that OC? superpi?


Meh i do not think it is gonna degrade ...

I ran 7 hrs of prime 95 And i scored over 12k Physx points in 3D mark 11 which beats a 3930 @ 4.7ghz " i think"

Im getting Haswell when it is out so i do not really care lol.

Oh And Valgaur.. My Gpus are now running at 23c idle and 25c idle Wut?! and it is 78 degrees in mah room..

Who needs water for there gpu?? just get a friken galaxy GC card lap the mofo and put some Liquid metal pro for the true win!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i do not think it is gonna degrade ...
> I ran 7 hrs of prime 95 And i scored over 12k Physx points in 3D mark 11 which beats a 3930 @ 4.7ghz " i think"
> Im getting Haswell when it is out so i do not really care lol.
> Oh And Valgaur.. My Gpus are now running at 23c idle and 25c idle Wut?! and it is 78 degrees in mah room..
> Who needs water for there gpu?? just get a friken galaxy GC card lap the mofo and put some Liquid metal pro for the true win!


lol my idles are 26C and my ambients are 26C............and i have dynamex TIM...super crappy stuff.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol my idles are 26C and my ambients are 26C............and i have dynamex TIM...super crappy stuff.


Yah but im using an Air cooler son not the Antec 620.. temps are to good to need to even touch it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> got this 5ghz run, gave me 10.11 points in Cinebench


Cool - over 10! nice score
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i do not think it is gonna degrade ...
> I ran 7 hrs of prime 95 And i scored over 12k Physx points in 3D mark 11 which beats a 3930 @ 4.7ghz " i think"
> Im getting Haswell when it is out so i do not really care lol.


7hrs of prime is good at that OC, as is even being able to run 3DMark11 - great physics score too

I can only get a run or two of superpi at 5.1 before it errors-out or the system BSODs - of course my temps are a serious issue at that OC until I delid - LOL


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah but im using an Air cooler son not the Antec 620.. temps are to good to need to even touch it.


Lol it's because of the liquid pro or ultra (not the cooler) what were idles before?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lol it's because of the liquid pro or ultra (not the cooler) what were idles before?


Before Lapping hs and liquid pro they were 29c on one and 31 on the other..

You have to take into account i have 2 open Gpus which = greater heat as they pump out air at each other.

If i was using 1 card my temps would be crazy low.


----------



## Chrit

Might remove my IHS completely and check my temps. Hopefully my H60 will be able to put enough pressure on it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Before Lapping hs and liquid pro they were 29c on one and 31 on the other..
> You have to take into account i have 2 open Gpus which = greater heat as they pump out air at each other.
> If i was using 1 card my temps would be crazy low.


can only be ambient temp lol. unless you do he 80 fan h100.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> can only be ambient temp lol. unless you do he 80 fan h100.


78 degrees in here and if u look at the picture you see my fan speed is at 30..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, killed the chip...No nicks nor scratches in the pcb at first sight though. May have to do with an inapropriate Liquid Ultra application? I found a tiny shiny copper like nick under the black glue in one corner. Perhaps that's the death wound?

Anyways, gonna have to find some black epoxy now and as5 or something similar. Ceramique?

Next chip will stay as is :/ Eventually I'll get a pot and some dice and call it a day.

PS: Only thing worth noting is that Liquid Ultra is AWESOME! (I used it on my gpu and dropped 25c off my load temps, so I'll keep using it for the cpu and everything else that needs tim)


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, killed the chip...No nicks nor scratches in the pcb at first sight though. May have to do with an inapropriate Liquid Ultra application? I found a tiny shiny copper like nick under the black glue in one corner. Perhaps that's the death wound?
> Anyways, gonna have to find some black epoxy now and as5 or something similar. Ceramique?
> Next chip will stay as is :/ Eventually I'll get a pot and some dice and call it a day.
> PS: Only thing worth noting is that Liquid Ultra is AWESOME! (I used it on my gpu and dropped 25c off my load temps, so I'll keep using it for the cpu and everything else that needs tim)


I dread it when I here those who have killed their chips, I feel your pain and makes it that much more scary when I know that I can't back down from delidding my chip! Can tell or show us what blade you used? I bought the thinnest razer, as thin as two pieces of paper, many times thinner that the average single strait edge blade!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, killed the chip...No nicks nor scratches in the pcb at first sight though. May have to do with an inapropriate Liquid Ultra application? I found a tiny shiny copper like nick under the black glue in one corner. Perhaps that's the death wound?
> Anyways, gonna have to find some black epoxy now and as5 or something similar. Ceramique?
> Next chip will stay as is :/ Eventually I'll get a pot and some dice and call it a day.
> PS: Only thing worth noting is that Liquid Ultra is AWESOME! (I used it on my gpu and dropped 25c off my load temps, so I'll keep using it for the cpu and everything else that needs tim)


Don't call it dead just yet...I've seen someone have 3 full on streaks right through the pcb to the gold....and it still works. try gournding your case and yourse;f out and turning the psu on and off with the chip in no cooler attached. then power the mobo and use the mobo power button. also don't use the bracket to hold it down use your hand.....well maybe the bracket then. and see if it posts at first mine didn't...I thought I killed it try it again and see what happens and let us know also give us some picture to assess it. ohh try cleaning the gold connectors on the bottom with alcohol cleaning agent not much though might be some crap on them. and watch very closely on those capacitors on the bottom. try to get us pics we can help you through it better.

If you believe you can achieve!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, killed the chip...No nicks nor scratches in the pcb at first sight though. May have to do with an inapropriate Liquid Ultra application? I found a tiny shiny copper like nick under the black glue in one corner. Perhaps that's the death wound?
> Anyways, gonna have to find some black epoxy now and as5 or something similar. Ceramique?
> Next chip will stay as is :/ Eventually I'll get a pot and some dice and call it a day.
> PS: Only thing worth noting is that Liquid Ultra is AWESOME! (I used it on my gpu and dropped 25c off my load temps, so I'll keep using it for the cpu and everything else that needs tim)


Big bummer. Any insights into what you did that you would do different (besides not doing it - LOL). What tool did you use, and where do you think the mistake was? Amy help would be good for those who are still going to try. Once again, we are all sad for the loss but admire your desire to try in the first place!


----------



## Conquistador SW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, killed the chip...No nicks nor scratches in the pcb at first sight though. May have to do with an inapropriate Liquid Ultra application? I found a tiny shiny copper like nick under the black glue in one corner. Perhaps that's the death wound?
> Anyways, gonna have to find some black epoxy now and as5 or something similar. Ceramique?
> Next chip will stay as is :/ Eventually I'll get a pot and some dice and call it a day.
> PS: Only thing worth noting is that Liquid Ultra is AWESOME! (I used it on my gpu and dropped 25c off my load temps, so I'll keep using it for the cpu and everything else that needs tim)


Try remounting it a couple of times. Does your mobo give any codes?
My chip seemed dead at first too, but after a 2 remounts it suddenly came back to life because of who knows. I guess it has to do with either that one of the landing pats got dirty from touching it and makes no contact or the mounting pressure is not even because the IHS is placed back slightly off.


----------



## beniroc

To valguar a h100 push pull with Scythe Kaze fans and the stock fans on top. This was just a suicide run been running 5ghz at 1.43v 24/7 temps never above 82c.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, killed the chip...No nicks nor scratches in the pcb at first sight though. May have to do with an inapropriate Liquid Ultra application? I found a tiny shiny copper like nick under the black glue in one corner. Perhaps that's the death wound?
> Anyways, gonna have to find some black epoxy now and as5 or something similar. Ceramique?
> Next chip will stay as is :/ Eventually I'll get a pot and some dice and call it a day.
> PS: Only thing worth noting is that Liquid Ultra is AWESOME! (I used it on my gpu and dropped 25c off my load temps, so I'll keep using it for the cpu and everything else that needs tim)


Oh no! Hope you can get it running.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Don't call it dead just yet...I've seen someone have 3 full on streaks right through the pcb to the gold....and it still works. try gournding your case and yourse;f out and turning the psu on and off with the chip in no cooler attached. then power the mobo and use the mobo power button. also don't use the bracket to hold it down use your hand.....well maybe the bracket then. and see if it posts at first mine didn't...I thought I killed it try it again and see what happens and let us know also give us some picture to assess it. ohh try cleaning the gold connectors on the bottom with alcohol cleaning agent not much though might be some crap on them. and watch very closely on those capacitors on the bottom. try to get us pics we can help you through it better.
> If you believe you can achieve!


Thanks man, I think it may be the gold pin part, I'll take it off, clean it and remount with no hsf to see if it posts a couple of times. It was late last night and I wanted to sleep.
I only nicked the pcb a little bit and I think it was after cutting, whilst trying to sratch the glue off...Doubt that killed it really, seems odd.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Oh no! Hope you can get it running.


Thanks, I won't give up!


----------



## soundrats

Hi out there,
if I use Liquid Pro do I have it to put it on the processor *and* on the IHS or do I put it *only* on the processor? How did you do this with success?
Kind Regards to the forum Tom


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *soundrats*
> 
> Hi out there,
> if I use Liquid Pro do I have it to put it on the processor *and* on the IHS or do I put it *only* on the processor? How did you do this with success?
> Kind Regards to the forum Tom


Try to get a hold of those single edge razors someone posted above, those won't bend and are really thin.

You need to use Liquid pro on the die, and remove the black glue carefully, add a little bit to underside of the ihs if it doesn't make good contact. Then you put it over the ihs like a regular tim.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Try to get a hold of those single edge razors someone posted above, those won't bend and are really thin.
> You need to use Liquid pro on the die, and remove the black glue carefully, add a little bit to underside of the ihs if it doesn't make good contact. Then you put it over the ihs like a regular tim.


exactly what he said and yeah those kaze fans are good for the h100 you should delid and get better results with that max of 83C already.

I know you can do it Ivan its tricky but you can get it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm remounting as we speak...Already cleaned the contacts with an isopropyl soaked wipe that came with the Liquid Ultra. I'll re utilize the ihs application for now, I'm out of Liquid Ultra, and a friend has my tube of IC Diamond. I asked him to give it back so I can remount properly, but if it posts with some help from above (







) I'll be happy.


----------



## beniroc

Goodluck


----------



## ivanlabrie

Meh, no post yet...first remount. Debug code shows a dim 0 for a sec, then nothing, and it keeps rebooting.

I can see what looks like some bent pins in the socket! It may not be the cpu...I'll have to see if I can straighten them carefully. DANG!









Gigabyte has me covered though, I hope I can fix it though.


----------



## Powermonkey500

I'll be joining when my Liquid Ultra comes and I can get a picture... Unfortunately I don't really feel like pulling my computer apart at the moment.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Hey guys,

Sorry if this has been answered already.
What is the best way to remove the glue without damaging the PCB? I've heard of solvents but are they safe?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Meh, no post yet...first remount. Debug code shows a dim 0 for a sec, then nothing, and it keeps rebooting.
> I can see what looks like some bent pins in the socket! It may not be the cpu...I'll have to see if I can straighten them carefully. DANG!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gigabyte has me covered though, I hope I can fix it though.


Check your mobo codes for the 0 dim and try without ram check everything you can. Heck even try taking your mobo mounting screws out and try to see if its ground itself out. My mobo did that and it'd turn on..then off..then on etc etc.


----------



## beniroc

I used a q-tip with 91% alcohol to and my fingernails and a thin card for the harder sections.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Hey guys,
> Sorry if this has been answered already.
> What is the best way to remove the glue without damaging the PCB? I've heard of solvents but are they safe?


Use a box cutter no exacto knifes they aren't ment to be thin I used a standard box cutter and that nice thin blade made it super easy to do


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Use a box cutter no exacto knifes they aren't ment to be thin I used a standard box cutter and that nice thin blade made it super easy to do


I used the regular box cutter as well and cleaned the PCB with finger nail with 91% Iso.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used the regular box cutter as well and cleaned the PCB with finger nail with 91% Iso.


I need to get that glue off soon.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Check your mobo codes for the 0 dim and try without ram check everything you can. Heck even try taking your mobo mounting screws out and try to see if its ground itself out. My mobo did that and it'd turn on..then off..then on etc etc.


No debug code matches, I'll try removing the ram altogether. I tried single channel ram and got the same result.
I really think it's those bent pins man, they look pretty bad. Every time I remount the cpu they make this chirping noise. Not good...
I'll rma the board, I didn't really like it's ram overclocking capabilities. I'll see if I can get an up5 instead if I pay a little difference, or if not the same ud5h-wb.

EDIT: Hey! wait a sec, a coworker has a z68 board, it used to be mine till I sold it to him. I'll ask him to see if he can lend that to me to test the cpu out.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> No debug code matches, I'll try removing the ram altogether. I tried single channel ram and got the same result.
> I really think it's those bent pins man, they look pretty bad. Every time I remount the cpu they make this chirping tnoise. Not good...
> I'll rma the board, I didn't really like it's ram overclocking capabilities. I'll see if I can get an up5 instead if I pay a little difference, or if not the same ud5h-wb.
> EDIT: Hey! wait a sec, a coworker has a z68 board, it used to be mine till I sold it to him. I'll ask him to see if he can lend that to me to test the cpu out.


Yes do that lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *soundrats*
> 
> Hi out there,
> if I use Liquid Pro do I have it to put it on the processor *and* on the IHS or do I put it *only* on the processor? How did you do this with success?
> Kind Regards to the forum Tom


i did just that, applied a very thin layer of it on every side.. Die, underside IHS, on the IHS and my cooler's base-plate

i quote Coollaboratory manual,

Now you may apply a small amount of "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" to the cooler surface's center.
Do not use too much, you will be amazed at how little you need.
To begin with, do not use more than a little drop.
Remember that Liquid Metal's purpose is to fill tiny gaps, not to drip from the cooler.
Now spread out the "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" evenly across the cooler's surface from center to the sides.
You may use a thin paint brush, a "Q-Tip" cotton swab or anything similar.
Do not use your finger (greasy surface). Powder free rubber gloves may be used.
Once done with this work, your cooler's surface should shine like a mirror.

Note: You may also apply Liquid Metal to both the die or to the cooler's surface and the die. Make sure the applied amount is not too large.

end quote

i think its better to do it that way, but others that didnt apply like this,
also had good results in the end so..








well, i did have one off the biggest temp drops..haha


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> I used a q-tip with 91% alcohol to and my fingernails and a thin card for the harder sections.


Thanks. I guess I'll just have to grow out my fingernails and muster up the patience!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Thanks. I guess I'll just have to grow out my fingernails and muster up the patience!


Be extra patient while doing it! I scratched the pcb area with my nails and left a copper like spot exposed








I think it'll work, gonna test out with another board soon. Being impatient killed my mobo though, bent pins :/


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Be extra patient while doing it! I scratched the pcb area with my nails and left a copper like spot exposed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it'll work, gonna test out with another board soon. Being impatient killed my mobo though, bent pins :/










Well, didn't know that fingernails would even be hard enough to scratch it... good to know.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Be extra patient while doing it! I scratched the pcb area with my nails and left a copper like spot exposed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it'll work, gonna test out with another board soon. Being impatient killed my mobo though, bent pins :/


Use a knife or a pin and try to straighten them


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Use a knife or a pin and try to straighten them


Man, it's beyond my reach! I have very poor sight, and I aready tried using a magnifying glass, but the ones that are in the middle are VERY hard to move without touching an adyacent one.








I'll rma it...I just hope my cpu works in another board. It'll be sweet to have a delidded 3770k with Liquid Ultra on the die!


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man, it's beyond my reach! I have very poor sight, and I aready tried using a magnifying glass, but the ones that are in the middle are VERY hard to move without touching an adyacent one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll rma it...I just hope my cpu works in another board. It'll be sweet to have a delidded 3770k with Liquid Ultra on the die!


lol when my board had bent pins so I just did it with my fingers and no assistance except sunlight, same for my AMD cpu for an HTPC for my parents (not a intel one btw). Get a friend to do it or smt isntead of rma'ing it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man, it's beyond my reach! I have very poor sight, and I aready tried using a magnifying glass, but the ones that are in the middle are VERY hard to move without touching an adyacent one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll rma it...I just hope my cpu works in another board. It'll be sweet to have a delidded 3770k with Liquid Ultra on the die!


Yeah but give us some pics! we can help you more lol.


----------



## stellamonster7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man, it's beyond my reach! I have very poor sight, and I aready tried using a magnifying glass, but the ones that are in the middle are VERY hard to move without touching an adyacent one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll rma it...I just hope my cpu works in another board. It'll be sweet to have a delidded 3770k with Liquid Ultra on the die!


hope it's the mobo pins and you can either RMA or fix 'em. for every success case, this is the kind of stuff that freaks me out. man, I want to order liq pro, but I just don't know. I have horrible temps and can't go past 46, maybe 47x without a delid, but let's face it, in theory it's well understood, but none of us are surgeons.

hey, you know what, this is like that game "operation" (yes, that dates me)...remember the tweezers and the electric board and it shocked you briefly when you hit the board instead of getting out the plastic part...only here, the razor is the tweazers, it's a girl (Ivy) instead of a dude from the game board, and if you mess up you get sticker shock instead of a real shock (as in you be shelling out more money for another cpu).









In all seriousness, I hope there are far more successes that will ultimately push me over the edge to do this.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Meh, no post yet...first remount. Debug code shows a dim 0 for a sec, then nothing, and it keeps rebooting.
> I can see what looks like some bent pins in the socket! It may not be the cpu...I'll have to see if I can straighten them carefully. DANG!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gigabyte has me covered though, I hope I can fix it though.


Bent pin on the MB socket?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bent pins, I suspect the cpu is ok...I already asked a coworker to lend me his z68 board (my former board) to test the cpu.

Here's my take on it, I suspect the IHS positioning is crucial when re-lidding it.
I think mine bent the socket pins when putting the latch cover in place, cause of the uneven pressure.

Any thoughts on this?


----------



## Hokies83

Yah the pins are so easy to bend it is not funny only real safe way to avoid that is to remove mb and install the Cpu flat...

I can fix your pins but u would have to ship to the states.. which would prolly end up being about the price of the board lol...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bent pins, I suspect the cpu is ok...I already asked a coworker to lend me his z68 board (my former board) to test the cpu.
> Here's my take on it, I suspect the IHS positioning is crucial when re-lidding it.
> I think mine bent the socket pins when putting the latch cover in place, cause of the uneven pressure.
> Any thoughts on this?


No i do not think this is so.. i have a ton of pressure on mine and no bend pins..

However when installing the cpu and ur holding it then any up down left right movement will bend them instantly done it many times lol.

Amd cpus with pins on the cpu its self is much worse.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bent pins, I suspect the cpu is ok...I already asked a coworker to lend me his z68 board (my former board) to test the cpu.
> Here's my take on it, I suspect the IHS positioning is crucial when re-lidding it.
> I think mine bent the socket pins when putting the latch cover in place, cause of the uneven pressure.
> Any thoughts on this?


If you can lol again try and give us a picture of your IB chip then we can diagnose it. For example on the first post look at the link where I say although we have had people kill their chips before. And his actually still runs so go check that one out.


----------



## nagle3092

I'm really thinking about attempting this but I got one question. Has anyone tried to use a thing gauge wire instead of a razor? Maybe some strong fishing line which I would think would work and put the die and pcb at much less risk of being damaged.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah the pins are so easy to bend it is not funny only real safe way to avoid that is to remove mb and install the Cpu flat...
> I can fix your pins but u would have to ship to the states.. which would prolly end up being about the price of the board lol...
> No i do not think this is so.. i have a ton of pressure on mine and no bend pins..
> However when installing the cpu and ur holding it then any up down left right movement will bend them instantly done it many times lol.
> Amd cpus with pins on the cpu its self is much worse.


Thanks a lot for that! I think you may be right, cause I installed the cpu with the mobo in the case, and over my knees while sitting down. Bad idea








I'll rma it, see if I can get it repaired for free or get a replacement.

This week I'll be testing my cpu with a z68 board hopefully, so I'll be able to post some results and pics for ya.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> I'm really thinking about attempting this but I got one question. Has anyone tried to use a thing gauge wire instead of a razor? Maybe some strong fishing line which I would think would work and put the die and pcb at much less risk of being damaged.
> Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


Possibly but you'd have to use something line spider wire fishing line. Inly thin srtond enough but then you run into the issue of how your going to hold the cpu while your using both hands for the fishing line.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thanks a lot for that! I think you may be right, cause I installed the cpu with the mobo in the case, and over my knees while sitting down. Bad idea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll rma it, see if I can get it repaired for free or get a replacement.
> This week I'll be testing my cpu with a z68 board hopefully, so I'll be able to post some results and pics for ya.


Take the board out get bright light look and see what direction the pins are going use a razor to bend it back in that direction making sure no pins are touching one another.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> I'm really thinking about attempting this but I got one question. Has anyone tried to use a thing gauge wire instead of a razor? Maybe some strong fishing line which I would think would work and put the die and pcb at much less risk of being damaged.
> Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


Glue is pretty tough i donno... I see the baking the cpu in the oven heating the glue idea a great one and use a very thin razor.. just after u break the edge of the glue aim the razor up and you should not hit anything...

I did it like this not 1 scratch on my pcb.


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Possibly but you'd have to use something line spider wire fishing line. Inly thin srtond enough but then you run into the issue of how your going to hold the cpu while your using both hands for the fishing line.


You could just hold it down with your thumbs as your dragging the wire under the IHS. This is tempting but the fact of killing my good clocking chip kinda deters me. Maybe you could even break one corner open with a razer then get the wire in there to finish it. I dunno, just some thoughts.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Take the board out get bright light look and see what direction the pins are going use a razor to bend it back in that direction making sure no pins are touching one another.
> Glue is pretty tough i donno... I see the baking the cpu in the oven heating the glue idea a great one and use a very thin razor.. just after u break the edge of the glue aim the razor up and you should not hit anything...
> I did it like this not 1 scratch on my pcb.


I really feel like repairing it myself, but I find it too hard...I'll see if a friend can help me out. He has done that type of repairs before and has better eye sight than me.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> You could just hold it down with your thumbs as your dragging the wire under the IHS. This is tempting but the fact of killing my good clocking chip kinda deters me. Maybe you could even break one corner open with a razer then get the wire in there to finish it. I dunno, just some thoughts.


You could do that but you really don't wanna hit that die. Shoot even when I delidded mine I put my box cutter blad completely flat and very slowly wiggled it back and forth and eventually got under the lid. Then the rest was just slowly moving it around and I only put in maybe an 8th of an inch under the lid just enough for the glue.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's not too hard once you break in, lay blade flat and wiggle it carefully.
Be careful when removing the glue, and try to avoid cutting the pcb when doing the sides...I found it UBER easy to start cutting the glue from the 4 corners first, doing the following:

-Grab a Gillette razor (thin bendable ones)
-Bend it to make a U shape with the lowest part of the U fitting under the IHS and with the edge touching the glue.
-Whilst keeping this U shape press the cpu and blade in opposite directions to help moving the blade flat.

See how that goes, it was the easiest way to cut my way into the toughest partsn of the IHS that were too tightly pressed against the pcb.


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Take the board out get bright light look and see what direction the pins are going use a razor to bend it back in that direction making sure no pins are touching one another.
> Glue is pretty tough i donno... I see the baking the cpu in the oven heating the glue idea a great one and use a very thin razor.. just after u break the edge of the glue aim the razor up and you should not hit anything...
> I did it like this not 1 scratch on my pcb.


I thought about this as well, then someone pointed out the fact that these chips basically do cook when they are running, so they don't use a heat sensitive glue on the PCB/IHS. It wouldn't make since if the glue would become soft and pliable over and over again causing distortion/unevenness. Not saying you're wrong here brother. You did it, so if it worked and you noticed it way softer, let us know. I just didn't want to risk turning my chip into slag by baking it....that's what OCing is for!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I thought about this as well, then someone pointed out the fact that these chips basically do cook when they are running, so they don't use a heat sensitive glue on the PCB/IHS. It wouldn't make since if the glue would become soft and pliable over and over again causing distortion/unevenness. Not saying you're wrong here brother. You did it, so if it worked and you noticed it way softer, let us know. I just didn't want to risk turning my chip into slag by baking it....that's what OCing is for!


It does make it softer but not smooshy soft.

Anywho im now testing how far i can go with HT off now that i have a Stable 5.1ghz HT on OC..

Seeing what i can do with HT off so far im at 1.45v 5.1ghz and 2 hrs in prime95.. with an avg temp drop of 8c

It is ungodly easy to use HT off for gaming and turn it back on when u need it when u have 2 stable overclocks.

I have not even broke 70c yet,


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It does make it softer but not smooshy soft.
> Anywho im now testing how far i can go with HT off now that i have a Stable 5.1ghz HT on OC..
> Seeing what i can do with HT off so far im at 1.45v 5.1ghz and 2 hrs in prime95.. with an avg temp drop of 8c
> It is ungodly easy to use HT off for gaming and turn it back on when u need it when u have 2 stable overclocks.
> I have not even broke 70c yet,


maybe just buy a 3570K? not trying to sound like a donkey here.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> maybe just buy a 3570K? not trying to sound like a donkey here.


????!!??!!!

Then i would have no HT i need HT why on earth would i just buy a 3570k?

u can turn it on are off in about 10 seconds?!

Having 2 stable Overclocks one HT on one HT off is a very smart thing to do.. If your not using HT u can run the Stable 4 coe Overclock..

If you need HT run the Stable HT overclock it is as easy as loading a profile in the bios..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> ????!!??!!!
> Then i would have no HT i need HT why on earth would i just buy a 3570k?
> u can turn it on are off in about 10 seconds?!
> Having 2 stable Overclocks one HT on one HT off is a very smart thing to do.. If your not using HT u can run the Stable 4 coe Overclock..
> If you need HT run the Stable HT overclock it is as easy as loading a profile in the bios..


just wondering since your turning off HT thats all.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> just wondering since your turning off HT thats all.


Because i can drop V core way down and drop temps way down.. 70% of what i do is stream movies and play games the other 30% needs HT

I can boot into windows in 7 seconds you just load which profile needed for what you want to do.. weather it be gaming or things that need HT.. Thats why you have the option to turn it off.


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Because i can drop V core way down and drop temps way down.. 70% of what i do is stream movies and play games the other 30% needs HT
> I can boot into windows in 7 seconds you just load which profile needed for what you want to do.. weather it be gaming or things that need HT.. Thats why you have the option to turn it off.


Do you have 5 240gb ssds???


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Do you have 5 240gb ssds???


In this system yes i have 2 more in my other 2 systems.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Because i can drop V core way down and drop temps way down.. 70% of what i do is stream movies and play games the other 30% needs HT
> I can boot into windows in 7 seconds you just load which profile needed for what you want to do.. weather it be gaming or things that need HT.. Thats why you have the option to turn it off.


Yeah I was just curious man. I run mine with HT on all the time. but it only a few hours a week. temps don't bother me considering my overclock, I'm happy with 71 as a max.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bent pins, I suspect the cpu is ok...I already asked a coworker to lend me his z68 board (my former board) to test the cpu.
> Here's my take on it, I suspect the IHS positioning is crucial when re-lidding it.
> I think mine bent the socket pins when putting the latch cover in place, cause of the uneven pressure.
> Any thoughts on this?


Good info to be aware of when putting the latch back on (and I hope it was that and MB pins with your IB being OK in the end)

Also, make sure the Z68 is updated with BIOS that can support an IB and not just the SB chips....


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> In this system yes i have 2 more in my other 2 systems.


Any particular reason you have them? Was there a great deal or you won them or something? And what type of raid array if any are you using?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HPE1000*
> 
> Any particular reason you have them? Was there a great deal or you won them or something? And what type of raid array if any are you using?


1 is a boot drive windows on it nothing else..

1 keeps all my files the other 3 are for my large mass of games... and the huge mass of torrent games i have... the 3 games ones are about 70% full each.

240gb is not that large.. and i refuse to use a HDD .

When you gonna finish my Ivy bridge pee boy avatar?


----------



## HPE1000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1 is a boot drive windows on it nothing else..
> 1 keeps all my files the other 3 are for my large mass of games... and the huge mass of torrent games i have... the 3 games ones are about 70% full each.
> 240gb is not that large.. and i refuse to use a HDD .


XD amazing


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll be fixing my socket pins tomorrow...






A buddy will bring his dslr so I can zoom in and see them pins up close, my eyesight SUCKS








He'll also bring me a 580 to remount the heatsink and apply IC Diamond (and my IC Diamond hehe...I'll need it for the IHS)

Hopefully everything will end well. Wish me luck guys!


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll be fixing my socket pins tomorrow...
> A buddy will bring his dslr so I can zoom in and see them pins up close, my eyesight SUCKS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He'll also bring me a 580 to remount the heatsink and apply IC Diamond (and my IC Diamond hehe...I'll need it for the IHS)
> Hopefully everything will end well. Wish me luck guys!


Good luck Brother! My fingers will be crossed and I will check hourly for update!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I expect to do it at 4pm, Buenos Aires time...not sure what's the time where you guys are.
Thanks...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I expect to do it at 4pm, Buenos Aires time...not sure what's the time where you guys are.
> Thanks...


I'll be watching for updates too! good luck.


----------



## Hokies83

Its not to hard ive had to do it about 5=6x you just gotta take ur time be slow and careful if ur are unsure of the pin take extra time making sure..

Best way is to see which directions all the pins are going around it then look for one out of line and slowly move it into place.. they break sooo easy so little nudges till it is close to where it was.. it does not have to be exact... and make sure if u move any pins while doing so that no pins are touching each other..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Mine seemed quite hard to break or rip apart when trying to fix them...I'll be extra careful and do it tomorrow.

Hey Hokies, have you tried a 5.2ghz 3d benching stable with ht oc?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mine seemed quite hard to break or rip apart when trying to fix them...I'll be extra careful and do it tomorrow.
> Hey Hokies, have you tried a 5.2ghz 3d benching stable with ht oc?


If it is in my Sig it is stable ive been testing multi diff Overclocks to see if there stable im running pime 95 now as a matter of fact...

Im not into all that software shoot voltage really high to get a cpu screenie crap..

Imo if it is not stable it does not count.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If it is in my Sig it is stable ive been testing multi diff Overclocks to see if there stable im running pime 95 now as a matter of fact...
> Im not into all that software shoot voltage really high to get a cpu screenie crap..
> Imo if it is not stable it does not count.


Ok, thanks man!
Validations are just that, you don't have to agree with hwbot's rules and competitions...
I could run at 5ghz with 1.56v, bet my chip will do better once I get my board up and running again.
Have you tried lowering vcore even more? And pll?


----------



## neopunx

@Hokies83, can you post a CPU-z link to the 5.2 your running stable? I see the one from your 5.1 run and would like to see the OC diff. What do your temps look like on your sable 5+ runs? Thank you for the info.

Edit: also, how long are your qualifying runs at these volts? Seems to run prime or burn at this level would really ball up your chip in a matter of weeks.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't run prime, but that's just me. He's a brave man


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> @Hokies83, can you post a CPU-z link to the 5.2 your running stable? I see the one from your 5.1 run and would like to see the OC diff. What do your temps look like on your sable 5+ runs? Thank you for the info.
> Edit: also, how long are your qualifying runs at these volts? Seems to run prime or burn at this level would really ball up your chip in a matter of weeks.


Im running 5ghz atm with HT off.. 1.45v temps are not breaking 70c im below 1.55v i have no screenie of 5.2 it was far to much Vcore to even worry
about running 24/7

5.1ghz was 1.53v and temps were on avg between 78c and 83c with max hitting 88c for a sec or so.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That 5.1ghz looks sweet for benching stuff...1.45v seems reasonable!








How bad did HT hurt your temps/vcore needed?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That 5.1ghz looks sweet for benching stuff...1.45v seems reasonable!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How bad did HT hurt your temps/vcore needed?


10c hotter almost a full 1.0v needed.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 10c hotter almost a full 1.0v needed.


lol that makes it 2.45v








What do you mean?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol that makes it 2.45v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you mean?


1.45v no ht 1.535v with HT sorry talking in to many threads..

Some guy is trying to argue 3d on AMD is better then Nvidias 3D vision LOL...


----------



## Hokies83

The funnest part is my core 0 which is farthest from the I Gpu is 5c cooler then the other 3... Core 4 which is next to it is the hottest.

When i reinstall windows ima turn the i gpu off and not install the drivers for it.. heard that drops V core needed and temps.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The funnest part is my core 0 which is farthest from the I Gpu is 5c cooler then the other 3... Core 4 which is next to it is the hottest.
> When i reinstall windows ima turn the i gpu off and not install the drivers for it.. heard that drops V core needed and temps.


It does drop temps considerably. You can disable it in the Bios...No need to uninstall drivers!


----------



## Valgaur

By the way just for referance all my OC's were benched using max testing of IBT running 40 times.......except the 5.4 Ghz one...that was a quick and nice little burn.

Also I didnt cheat by disabling HT lol I used all 8 threads on every OC.







whats your max vcore you've hit Hokies?? just curious and I saw that your 5.1 hit that 1.55vcore wall pretty quickly...that things jumps doesn't it lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> By the way just for referance all my OC's were benched using max testing of IBT running 40 times.......except the 5.4 Ghz one...that was a quick and nice little burn.
> Also I didnt cheat by disabling HT lol I used all 8 threads on every OC.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> whats your max vcore you've hit Hokies?? just curious and I saw that your 5.1 hit that 1.55vcore wall pretty quickly...that things jumps doesn't it lol


I got the 5.1 down to 1.53.5v With HT On


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I got the 5.1 down to 1.53.5v With HT On


I really hate how the vcores jump with each multiplier after 4.7 OC...its nuts


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really hate how the vcores jump with each multiplier after 4.7 OC...its nuts


Yeah oh well. Ur getting Haswell right? so it is no biggie then lol.

Stay under 1.55v and wait for it.

Imo Haswell / IB -E is gonna put a Nail into AMD"S cpu dept coffin...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah oh well. Ur getting Haswell right? so it is no biggie then lol.
> Stay under 1.55v and wait for it.
> Imo Haswell / IB -E is gonna put a Nail into AMD"S cpu dept coffin...


Probably, as Intel is sooo much better these days, but I hope not as I want Intel to have some competition

- might be that part of the reason IB got TIM was because of no real competition from AMD.....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Probably, as Intel is sooo much better these days, but I hope not as I want Intel to have some competition
> - *might be that part of the reason IB got TIM was because of no real competition from AMD*.....


Nah a 5ghz 3770k makes there really no point in a 3930k / 3960x
3930x is 250$ more then a 3770k a 3960x is 700$ more.. Intel likes those profits.

They took a page from AMD'S play book " Hey lets put a bunch of slower cores in a cpu and charge alot for it "

IB-E shouda launched when IB did....


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Nah a 5ghz 3770k makes there really no point in a 3930k / 3960x
> 3930x is 250$ more then a 3770k a 3960x is 700$ more.. Intel likes those profits.
> They took a page from AMD'S play book " Hey lets put a bunch of slower cores in a cpu and charge alot for it "
> IB-E shouda launched when IB did....


LOL - that too!


----------



## Swag

I just killed a Core 2 Quad because I didn't know that there were 2 dies in that thing.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just killed a Core 2 Quad because I didn't know that there were 2 dies in that thing.


Guess that is why it is called a Core 2 lol

Those are still worth $$$ to much to mes with play with Pent 4s... i cut the core in half of one of mine. lol

Hmm i should start a thread " IS my Cpu Dead?! " with pictures of my Die cut in half then argue with ppl that it is not dead lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just killed a Core 2 Quad because I didn't know that there were 2 dies in that thing.
> 
> 
> 
> Guess that is why it is called a Core 2 lol
Click to expand...

I thought it was mostly because it was breakthrough for Intel.


----------



## Valgaur

Nope im not getting Haswell...as of yet haven't heard much about it and if so then ill Ln2 my 3770K and go for an absolute max OC at one of the Ln2 events how much are they gonna be and Im assuming they are the Ivy bridge still right? Z77 and everything??


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nope im not getting Haswell...as of yet haven't heard much about it and if so then ill Ln2 my 3770K and go for an absolute max OC at one of the Ln2 events how much are they gonna be and Im assuming they are the Ivy bridge still right? Z77 and everything??


Haswell will be a different socket. The socket will be 1150 and it is supposed to be quick faster than Ivy Bridge. I've heard some rumors that Haswell temps will be on par of Sandy and won't have Ivy's issue. Of course, this is all speculation. It does however have matured 3d transistors.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haswell will be a different socket. The socket will be 1150 and it is supposed to be quick faster than Ivy Bridge. I've heard some rumors that Haswell temps will be on par of Sandy and won't have Ivy's issue. Of course, this is all speculation. It does however have matured 3d transistors.


Matured trans huh? You sayin' Im immature or something Swag!








I've heard a few things about it but now much....sadness that means a new mobo...ugh but mines not made anymore lol....


----------



## ivanlabrie

And don't forget fsb straps for bclk overclocking without dead pci-e stuff and storage.









Hey, I straightened all the pins in my socket, but I think one of them got cut in half when fiddling with the tweezers this morning.
I'm trying to figure out how to attach a piece of copper wire in that hole or solder it to the existing piece of pin. I bet that if I just stick a piece of copper wire it'll work.
Tomorrow I'll use a friends DSLR to zoom closer than what my magnifier let's me.
G'night


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> And don't forget fsb straps for bclk overclocking without dead pci-e stuff and storage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, I straightened all the pins in my socket, but I think one of them got cut in half when fiddling with the tweezers this morning.
> I'm trying to figure out how to attach a piece of copper wire in that hole or solder it to the existing piece of pin. I bet that if I just stick a piece of copper wire it'll work.
> Tomorrow I'll use a friends DSLR to zoom closer than what my magnifier let's me.
> G'night


You mean the loopdeloops on the bottom? I don't call them pins anymore.







Pins are nothing really other than being there so they can expand the technology on it if they want to. Like add-ons from motherboard creators and everything like that.







Now, I'd probably recommend the least non-conductive wire you can get so it'll work and it'll detect everything is there, but it won't be trying to receive data as well. Your choice though, I'm not much of an expert in terms of breaking a pin. Pins to me are fix or replace entire CPU.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You mean the loopdeloops on the bottom? I don't call them pins anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pins are nothing really other than being there so they can expand the technology on it if they want to. Like add-ons from motherboard creators and everything like that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, I'd probably recommend the least non-conductive wire you can get so it'll work and it'll detect everything is there, but it won't be trying to receive data as well. Your choice though, I'm not much of an expert in terms of breaking a pin. Pins to me are fix or replace entire CPU.


you mean mobo right?


----------



## VonDutch

i once put my amd 1100T back in its socket, and bent alot of the pins doing it wrong...pffft

took me over 3 hours to straiten them, using a pincet, didnt break any, and it worked
when i was done


----------



## JQuantum

sighs... I hope I don't regret this later but I just held the trigger from buying a i5-3570k for 160+tax







Only because I still have a working (recently found out) i5-2500k and my old i7-2700k is still great. That said my i7-3770k is better







(well binned less but w.e).

The only thing is if I did buy it I'd have popped the top just as quickly as I did with my i7 :S haswell u better have been worth holding off on! lol jk... I really want to try out amd again but there's nothing interesting still


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> sighs... I hope I don't regret this later but I just held the trigger from buying a i5-3570k for 160+tax
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only because I still have a working (recently found out) i5-2500k and my old i7-2700k is still great. That said my i7-3770k is better
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (well binned less but w.e).
> The only thing is if I did buy it I'd have popped the top just as quickly as I did with my i7 :S haswell u better have been worth holding off on! lol jk... I really want to try out amd again but there's nothing interesting still


Of course there is! Trinity man








Freeze them and have some igp fun









To Swag:

Why non conductive? I need something to extend the cut in half pin in my mobo socket...That's the only thing wrong with it atm.
I'll see if Gigabyte can repair it at the local RMA center if not. Guess they'll charge me a wee bit, but hope it's not too much.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Of course there is! Trinity man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Freeze them and have some igp fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To Swag:
> Why non conductive? I need something to extend the cut in half pin in my mobo socket...That's the only thing wrong with it atm.
> I'll see if Gigabyte can repair it at the local RMA center if not. Guess they'll charge me a wee bit, but hope it's not too much.


I can't freeze them







for some reason every location I go to my computer is always in a warm room. That and I rather have something that'll beat my i7-2700k rig yet as portable as my i5-2500k rig lol... or am I just greedy. Don't care if it beats my i7-3770k rig though







so not that greedy


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I can't freeze them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> for some reason every location I go to my computer is always in a warm room. That and I rather have something that'll beat my i7-2700k rig yet as portable as my i5-2500k rig lol... or am I just greedy. Don't care if it beats my i7-3770k rig though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so not that greedy


I meant freeze as in, get a dice pot and put some massive volts through it and go for a WR









I think an a10-5800k offers a great fun/cost ratio


----------



## neopunx

So, What exactly do we have to do to become an "Official" OCN club?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> So, What exactly do we have to do to become an "Official" OCN club?


We are really close actually lol. The intel Director is readin through it to make sure we are good.

TO ALL THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE SUBMITTED THEMSELVES ON HERE CAN YOU DO IT AGAIN i WAS GONE THIS WEEKEND AND I WANT TO ADD EVERYONE, SO IF YOU HAVEN'T BEEN ADDED OR SUBMITTED YOUR INFORMATION YET THEN DO SO!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> So, What exactly do we have to do to become an "Official" OCN club?


Prolly just ask a mod to make it so Number one.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> We are really close actually lol. The intel Director is readin through it to make sure we are good.
> TO ALL THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE SUBMITTED THEMSELVES ON HERE CAN YOU DO IT AGAIN i WAS GONE THIS WEEKEND AND I WANT TO ADD EVERYONE, SO IF YOU HAVEN'T BEEN ADDED OR SUBMITTED YOUR INFORMATION YET THEN DO SO!!!!


Hokies83

3770k

Liquid metal pro

Liquid Metal Pro

100mhz

5.1ghz

25c
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2543678


----------



## feniks

guys, just a quick question. any of you recently stress testing (priming or burning) above 5GHz, could revert down to let's say 4.6-4.7GHz and see if you get the chip same stable (same vcore that is) as in the past?
also, please state which RAM you are running (1.50v vs 1.65v) ... I discovered slight chip degradation on my end after recent stability testing near thermal limits, but I also run a 1.65v memory which is said to degrade the IMC faster, but I've never seen any IMC degradation (no memory stability trouble ever here), however I do see cpu core degradation - e.g. before my suicide run towards 5GHz on water (no delidding yet, used AC to cool things down), my 3770K used to run 4.6GHz with around 1.212v vcore under IBT load, now it seems to call for 1.240v under load (different approach though, lower LLC and higher offset) for same stability at same clock ... hmmm ... wodnering if I should delid it this weekend or rather keep observing it and RMA if needed be and delid the new one...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> guys, just a quick question. any of you recently stress testing (priming or burning) above 5GHz, could revert down to let's say 4.6-4.7GHz and see if you get the chip same stable (same vcore that is) as in the past?
> also, please state which RAM you are running (1.50v vs 1.65v) ... I discovered slight chip degradation on my end after recent stability testing near thermal limits, but I also run a 1.65v memory which is said to degrade the IMC faster, but I've never seen any IMC degradation (no memory stability trouble ever here), however I do see cpu core degradation - e.g. before my suicide run towards 5GHz on water (no delidding yet, used AC to cool things down), my 3770K used to run 4.6GHz with around 1.212v vcore under IBT load, now it seems to call for 1.240v under load (different approach though, lower LLC and higher offset) for same stability at same clock ... hmmm ... wodnering if I should delid it this weekend or rather keep observing it and RMA if needed be and delid the new one...


i have and I haven't seen any degradation yet...but for some reason my 4.8 OC had a really weird freeze during folding this weekedn but I think I had a windows error since it just froze and was still folding until it finished lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Prolly just ask a mod to make it so Number one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hokies83
> 3770k
> Liquid metal pro
> Liquid Metal Pro
> 100mhz
> 5.1ghz
> 25c
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2543678


Accepted!


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I meant freeze as in, get a dice pot and put some massive volts through it and go for a WR
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think an a10-5800k offers a great fun/cost ratio


well that is true but i want something... more... than that







I also wouldn't go sub 0 kuz if it's not 247 then i don't care too much







unless I'm going for a WR suicide run that's a different story... but i wanna keep it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> well that is true but i want something... more... than that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also wouldn't go sub 0 kuz if it's not 247 then i don't care too much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> unless I'm going for a WR suicide run that's a different story... but i wanna keep it.


Thats why I might make a WR run with Little Franky and get Haswell you know?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> i have and I haven't seen any degradation yet...but for some reason my 4.8 OC had a really weird freeze during folding this weekedn but I think I had a windows error since it just froze and was still folding until it finished lol.


interesting ... you running 1.65v RAM kit? ever stress tested CPU at near thermal limits (104-105C so it thermally throttles down even for split second)? wondering if I degraded my CPU because of any of the two mentioned potential causes. well, for it's still good at higher clocks as it used be, but 4.6GHz was the first and oldest overclock I did on it and this one got altered most in meantime.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> interesting ... you running 1.65v RAM kit? ever stress tested CPU at near thermal limits (104-105C so it thermally throttles down even for split second)? wondering if I degraded my CPU because of any of the two mentioned potential causes. well, for it's still good at higher clocks as it used be, but 4.6GHz was the first and oldest overclock I did on it and this one got altered most in meantime.


I run 1.5v kits and I've hit that 105C range a couple times lol...probably to many times lol. just try it later or shut down for a few hours then try it again....I haven't really lost anything but the vcores do fluctuate a bit.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> guys, just a quick question. any of you recently stress testing (priming or burning) above 5GHz, could revert down to let's say 4.6-4.7GHz and see if you get the chip same stable (same vcore that is) as in the past?
> also, please state which RAM you are running (1.50v vs 1.65v) ... I discovered slight chip degradation on my end after recent stability testing near thermal limits, but I also run a 1.65v memory which is said to degrade the IMC faster, but I've never seen any IMC degradation (no memory stability trouble ever here), however I do see cpu core degradation - e.g. before my suicide run towards 5GHz on water (no delidding yet, used AC to cool things down), my 3770K used to run 4.6GHz with around 1.212v vcore under IBT load, now it seems to call for 1.240v under load (different approach though, lower LLC and higher offset) for same stability at same clock ... hmmm ... wodnering if I should delid it this weekend or rather keep observing it and RMA if needed be and delid the new one...


I have been Prime 95 four 5ghz + diff overclocks for 7 hrs each the last 2 days.. and i have 2400mhz ram 1.65 that i have set at 2500mhz and 1.70v and i notice no issues at all.

But anyways i have found and saved 3 diff stable 5ghz + over clocks to my MB profiles..

However i did re install windows last night as it was un godly Corrupted from 30-40 BSOD'S


----------



## ivanlabrie

You won't have an issue with 1.65v ram...don't worry guys! Don't be pussies







What's the point of our chips IMC then?
You will see degradation only if you push them to the max on a regular basis, vcore and temp wise. Vcore alone like Hokies' is unlikely to cause degradation, this chips are TOUGH, but I wouldn't do it anyways...I wanna resell when I get a Haswell rig you know







I got enough to worry with a delidded chip in the first place!


----------



## kgtuning

My ripjaws are at 1.65volts. I haven't had any issue.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I run 1.5v kits and I've hit that 105C range a couple times lol...probably to many times lol. just try it later or shut down for a few hours then try it again....I haven't really lost anything but the vcores do fluctuate a bit.


interesting, I did the same a few (too many) times LOL! especially during recent quick stress testing runs at 4.9-5.0GHz when playing around with AC - anywhere from few minutes up to 30 minutes full load stress testing at near thermal limits. all looked good, but I am wondering why I see most vcore degradation at lowest overclock I use(d) and least of degradation at the highest ones I use (perhaps because they are more recent) ... time will tell, still have a few days to Saturday, will need to decide what to do (Intel RMA using performance tuning plan or deliding).
thanks for input on type of mem kit used.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have been Prime 95 four 5ghz + diff overclocks for 7 hrs each the last 2 days.. and i have 2400mhz ram 1.65 that i have set at 2500mhz and 1.70v and i notice no issues at all.
> But anyways i have found and saved 3 diff stable 5ghz + over clocks to my MB profiles..
> However i did re install windows last night as it was un godly Corrupted from 30-40 BSOD'S


yeah, hehe, I had to re-install Win7 3 weeks ago, because I corrupted it too from too many BSODs while overclocking CPU and RAM (my mem sticks are rated at 2000MHz @ 1.65V)







... however software corruption can easily get fixed (re-install) while vcore degradation is permament. any chances you could try checking stability of any "low" overclock that was used in past (e.g. 1-2 months ago) and see if it still runs stable at same vcore as in past?
thanks on your input on memory kit used. I use my 1.65V RAM either with 2x4GB @ 2400MHz or 4x4GB at 2200MHz. however I do not see any kind of IMC degradation ever, just the vcore needs to get upped for same CPU core stability versus value from the past.

for now I came up with a 1600MHz speed & stable timings @ 1.50V for my mem kit (9-11-9-24) and will use it this way, just to rule out possible (not really probable though) impact of running 1.65V memory. I will keep my CPU at 4.6GHz at 90C max (stock intel TIM under IHS) and observe ... if I need to use 1 more notch on vcore to re-gain stability within a week of running a safe clock and specs then it will be an RMA time instead of deliding...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You won't have an issue with 1.65v ram...don't worry guys! Don't be pussies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's the point of our chips IMC then?
> You will see degradation only if you push them to the max on a regular basis, vcore and temp wise. Vcore alone like Hokies' is unlikely to cause degradation, this chips are TOUGH, but I wouldn't do it anyways...I wanna resell when I get a Haswell rig you know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got enough to worry with a delidded chip in the first place!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> My ripjaws are at 1.65volts. I haven't had any issue.


yeah, I personally never believed that 1.65V RAM can actually harm the IMC in SB/IB chips, have yet to see that and I've been through one 2600K Sandy Bridge (zero problems up to 5GHz) and two different 3770K cpus here. never a problem with IMC ever.
vcore degradation is however something that worries me, as my former 3770K degraded vcore severely within only 8 weeks (killed it off eventually and RMA'ed) and it never went above 4.8GHz stable and was run at 4.6-4.7GHz daily 24/7 using fixed voltage however (was using and EVGA z77 FTW board back then, it doesn't support offsets) ...


----------



## midniteboss

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra or Liquid Pro better to apply under the lid? I've already removed the ihs and applied thermal paste and my temperatures dont go past 77 after 8 hours of prime with my 3770k @ 4.6ghz with 1.65 volts but I want to get those temperatures a little cooler.

Thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *midniteboss*
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra or Liquid Pro better to apply under the lid? I've already removed the ihs and applied thermal paste and my temperatures dont go past 77 after 8 hours of prime with my 3770k @ 4.6ghz with 1.65 volts but I want to get those temperatures a little cooler.
> Thanks


All results point to Liquid pro as the better.

1.65v for 4.6ghz?? that does not seem right .. seems like way way to much volts.. you should be 5ghz+ with that many volts... Try 1.4v for 4.6ghz and i even think that is over skill.


----------



## midniteboss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> All results point to Liquid pro as the better.
> 1.65v for 4.6ghz?? that does not seem right .. seems like way way to much volts.. you should be 5ghz+ with that many volts... Try 1.4v for 4.6ghz and i even think that is over skill.


Oh trust me dude I've tried. I don't have a good chip what so ever. When I use 1.45 volts my temperatures reach 80c but when I use 1.65 they don't go past 75. I think its the thermal paste that I am using. Im hoping that when I get the Liquid Pro I can get better results.

Thanks for the help


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *midniteboss*
> 
> Oh trust me dude I've tried. I don't have a good chip what so ever. When I use 1.45 volts my temperatures reach 80c but when I use 1.65 they don't go past 75. I think its the thermal paste that I am using. Im hoping that when I get the Liquid Pro I can get better results.
> Thanks for the help


Yeah it will drop 20 = 25c.. Lapp this IHS for better results 800 --> 1500 > 2500 grit sand paper and water.

Use the Liquid pro or IC diamond on the IHS between Heatsink for best results.

Also it is not your temps that scare me it is your V core i have never seen that much V-Core needed for a mere 4.6ghz heck i can do that with 1.19V So are you sure you really need all those volts?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> interesting, I did the same a few (too many) times LOL! especially during recent quick stress testing runs at 4.9-5.0GHz when playing around with AC - anywhere from few minutes up to 30 minutes full load stress testing at near thermal limits. all looked good, but I am wondering why I see most vcore degradation at lowest overclock I use(d) and least of degradation at the highest ones I use (perhaps because they are more recent) ... time will tell, still have a few days to Saturday, will need to decide what to do (Intel RMA using performance tuning plan or deliding).
> thanks for input on type of mem kit used.
> yeah, hehe, I had to re-install Win7 3 weeks ago, because I corrupted it too from too many BSODs while overclocking CPU and RAM (my mem sticks are rated at 2000MHz @ 1.65V)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... however software corruption can easily get fixed (re-install) while vcore degradation is permament. any chances you could try checking stability of any "low" overclock that was used in past (e.g. 1-2 months ago) and see if it still runs stable at same vcore as in past?
> thanks on your input on memory kit used. I use my 1.65V RAM either with 2x4GB @ 2400MHz or 4x4GB at 2200MHz. however I do not see any kind of IMC degradation ever, just the vcore needs to get upped for same CPU core stability versus value from the past.
> for now I came up with a 1600MHz speed & stable timings @ 1.50V for my mem kit (9-11-9-24) and will use it this way, just to rule out possible (not really probable though) impact of running 1.65V memory. I will keep my CPU at 4.6GHz at 90C max (stock intel TIM under IHS) and observe ... if I need to use 1 more notch on vcore to re-gain stability within a week of running a safe clock and specs then it will be an RMA time instead of deliding...


Man, if you're gonna waste that awesome ram kit like that I'll trade you mine, 1.35v Samsung Green 2x4gb kit and some bucks lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, I personally never believed that 1.65V RAM can actually harm the IMC in SB/IB chips, have yet to see that and I've been through one 2600K Sandy Bridge (zero problems up to 5GHz) and two different 3770K cpus here. never a problem with IMC ever.
> vcore degradation is however something that worries me, as my former 3770K degraded vcore severely within only 8 weeks (killed it off eventually and RMA'ed) and it never went above 4.8GHz stable and was run at 4.6-4.7GHz daily 24/7 using fixed voltage however (was using and EVGA z77 FTW board back then, it doesn't support offsets) ...


QFT

I'd suspect of that mobo btw...sounds fishy.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *midniteboss*
> 
> Oh trust me dude I've tried. I don't have a good chip what so ever. When I use 1.45 volts my temperatures reach 80c but when I use 1.65 they don't go past 75. I think its the thermal paste that I am using. Im hoping that when I get the Liquid Pro I can get better results.
> Thanks for the help


post a cpu-z pic and we can help you out.....yeah those volts...are what I used for a 5.3 Ghz run.....don't put that in any more. Do this let your mobo auto clock you up and see how high it gets then look at the vcore. Ands theres no way you could go down in temps with higher vcore its impossible, not trying to sound mean but the more vcore the more heat.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *midniteboss*
> 
> Oh trust me dude I've tried. I don't have a good chip what so ever. When I use 1.45 volts my temperatures reach 80c but when I use 1.65 they don't go past 75. I think its the thermal paste that I am using. Im hoping that when I get the Liquid Pro I can get better results.
> Thanks for the help


What motherboard are you using? Something is buggy...


----------



## midniteboss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah it will drop 20 = 25c.. Lapp this IHS for better results 800 --> 1500 > 2500 grit sand paper and water.
> Use the Liquid pro or IC diamond on the IHS between Heatsink for best results.
> Also it is not your temps that scare me it is your V core i have never seen that much V-Core needed for a mere 4.6ghz heck i can do that with 1.19V So are you sure you really need all those volts?


I will update you on my results after and I had a type. I am at 1.265 volts not 1.60 volts. LOL


----------



## kgtuning

That's much better..


----------



## malmental

afternoon ladies and gents.
I plan on joining you real soon, this evening in-fact...
pics and temps to come.
cheers.

3570K for the win...
if in the US and live near Microcenter or Fry's they have in-store only deals and you can get the CPU and/or CPU + mobo combo for less than anywhere else.
plus they price match.

i5-3570K @ $195.74 out the door..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Updates: I couldn't fix the bent pins, so I contacted local RMA dept, and they said I can pay them a visit board in hand and they'll fix it for me. Not covered under warranty though, so I guess I'll have to pay a bit.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Updates: I couldn't fix the bent pins, so I contacted local RMA dept, and they said I can pay them a visit board in hand and they'll fix it for me. Not covered under warranty though, so I guess I'll have to pay a bit.


well hopefully its not too expensive to fix. but probably better then buying a whole new board. The risks we take in the name of performance...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I bet it won't be too expensive. I truly with they can repair it, it would suck to have such an expensive brick! It would also leave me without a pc for a while...I'll have to buy a Maximus V Gene soon I suppose. Hopefully I can resell this board soon, if it works...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man, if you're gonna waste that awesome ram kit like that I'll trade you mine, 1.35v Samsung Green 2x4gb kit and some bucks lol
> QFT
> I'd suspect of that mobo btw...sounds fishy.


nah, not wasting this RAM like that LOL! just testing for a few days some theory I heard from an Intel Customer Rep stating that running 1.65v ram kit damages the IMC over time LOL! I call it BS, as none IMCs on any of chips I had never ever suffered anything from that 1.65V.

I just want to rule it out and be sure it doesn't somehow affect core degradation that I am seeing here on second chip and second (different brand) board. truth though is that both chips ran on same Z77 FTW board initially which was in deed faulty (both hardware and BIOS issues which were common to certain batches only), sent it back for a refund, hence why I am running ASUS MVE now









I am kinda stumped on this core degradation, perhaps t was started by that faulty mobo in first place while running "VDROOP DISABLED" setting (equalling to 100% LLC) and now just the chain reaction continues despite using offset vcore and EIST? perhaps I should start fresh with a new chip and most likely won't ever see a problem again ... it gets me wondering ... might use Intel's Performance Tuning plan finally after this weekend and delid the new chip once it comes in... will be a heck of a surprise though if the new one turns out a bad clocker LOL!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> nah, not wasting this RAM like that LOL! just testing for a few days some theory I heard from an Intel Customer Rep stating that running 1.65v ram kit damages the IMC over time LOL! I call it BS, as none IMCs on any of chips I had never ever suffered anything from that 1.65V.
> I just want to rule it out and be sure it doesn't somehow affect core degradation that I am seeing here on second chip and second (different brand) board. truth though is that both chips ran on same Z77 FTW board initially which was in deed faulty (both hardware and BIOS issues which were common to certain batches only), sent it back for a refund, hence why I am running ASUS MVE now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am kinda stumped on this core degradation, perhaps t was started by that faulty mobo in first place while running "VDROOP DISABLED" setting (equalling to 100% LLC) and now just the chain reaction continues despite using offset vcore and EIST? perhaps I should start fresh with a new chip and most likely won't ever see a problem again ... it gets me wondering ... might use Intel's Performance Tuning plan finally after this weekend and delid the new chip once it comes in... will be a heck of a surprise though if the new one turns out a bad clocker LOL!


Intel also said there was no Tim under the IHS that is was solder


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Intel also said there was no Tim under the IHS that is was solder


LOL! true, I heard such opinions from CS as well hehe .. they mostly don't know what they are talking about or not understanding the complexity of it unless you are actually talking to an engineer (II/II level support).

anyways! I just discovered I made a serious mistake in vcore comparison before and after!!! somehow I remembered the under load vcore wrong at 4.6GHz! I thought it used to be 1.212v under load at 4.6GHz, no it wasn't!
back then I used 100% LLC and 1.2v vcore setting in BIOS, just double checked it and it generates (overshoots) up to 1.24v under load (gives me WHEA warnings now though, wasn't the case in past), my bad







...

... and so the "degradation" is only probably within 2-4 notches on vcore/offset (each "notch" defined as 0.005v) ... nothing more ... still it happened, but I think I did it by stress testing it close to or sometimes at thermal limits, can live with that









... now restabilizing the 4.6GHz using exact same settings as before (fixed vcore, 100% LLC, same memory speed/timings/volts) to compare directly. some slight degradation happened, but it's not nearly as vast as I was afraid of, phew


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL! true, I heard such opinions from CS as well hehe .. they mostly don't know what they are talking about or not understanding the complexity of it unless you are actually talking to an engineer (II/II level support).
> anyways! I just discovered I made a serious mistake in vcore comparison before and after!!! somehow I remembered the under load vcore wrong at 4.6GHz! I thought it used to be 1.212v under load at 4.6GHz, no it wasn't!
> back then I used 100% LLC and 1.2v vcore setting in BIOS, just double checked it and it generates (overshoots) up to 1.24v under load (gives me WHEA warnings now though, wasn't the case in past), my bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...
> ... and so the "degradation" is only probably within 2-4 notches on vcore/offset (each "notch" defined as 0.005v) ... nothing more ... still it happened, but I think I did it by stress testing it close to or sometimes at thermal limits, can live with that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... now restabilizing the 4.6GHz using exact same settings as before (fixed vcore, 100% LLC, same memory speed/timings/volts) to compare directly. some slight degradation happened, but it's not nearly as vast as I was afraid of, phew


I donno but one would think to see signs of degrading in only afew weeks Vcore such as 1.8v would be needed... With something like 1.6v it should last a long time.. with 1.55 afew years...

Cpu is not a GPU .. Gpu degrade very easy Cpu's are pretty tough.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL! true, I heard such opinions from CS as well hehe .. they mostly don't know what they are talking about or not understanding the complexity of it unless you are actually talking to an engineer (II/II level support).
> anyways! I just discovered I made a serious mistake in vcore comparison before and after!!! somehow I remembered the under load vcore wrong at 4.6GHz! I thought it used to be 1.212v under load at 4.6GHz, no it wasn't!
> back then I used 100% LLC and 1.2v vcore setting in BIOS, just double checked it and it generates (overshoots) up to 1.24v under load (gives me WHEA warnings now though, wasn't the case in past), my bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...
> ... and so the "degradation" is only probably within 2-4 notches on vcore/offset (each "notch" defined as 0.005v) ... nothing more ... still it happened, but I think I did it by stress testing it close to or sometimes at thermal limits, can live with that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... now restabilizing the 4.6GHz using exact same settings as before (fixed vcore, 100% LLC, same memory speed/timings/volts) to compare directly. some slight degradation happened, but it's not nearly as vast as I was afraid of, phew


You can't compare volts between two different boards like that man...Sensors are not accurate nor VRM's are of the same quality.
Unless you measured vcore using a multimeter, you can't just scream 'DEGRADATION!" like that









EDIT: And don't believe Intel's support...they supply you with a testing utility which is tailored for old school fsb capable chips lol All Sandy/Ivy chips will be defective according to that tool, cause neither can do 133mhz bclk


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno but one would think to see signs of degrading in only afew weeks Vcore such as 1.8v would be needed... With something like 1.6v it should last a long time.. with 1.55 afew years...
> Cpu is not a GPU .. Gpu degrade very easy Cpu's are pretty tough.


yeah, true ... however I'd think the difference of 0.02v between virgin stock chip and chip that have run 5GHz ... is acceptable to me, I call it "burning in" ... however if trend continues than that would suck (chain reaction in progress) ... and that's exactly what happened to my initial chip and it took 8 weeks only to degrade from 1.35v up to 1.45v under load for same clock (4.8Ghz) ... but that was on a different board and with a different chip. 4 days to go to decide between RMA vs deliding.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can't compare volts between two different boards like that man...Sensors are not accurate nor VRM's are of the same quality.
> Unless you measured vcore using a multimeter, you can't just scream 'DEGRADATION!" like that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: And don't believe Intel's support...they supply you with a testing utility which is tailored for old school fsb capable chips lol All Sandy/Ivy chips will be defective according to that tool, cause neither can do 133mhz bclk


I am comparing observations on same board. whatever I achieved on z77 ftw is past and null, taking into account only my notes and records written down for this very same board I am running now, sorry if I wasn't clear about that.

LOL about that intel tool! what is the name of it?
i used a few times the Intel Diagnostics tool, but it worked fine hehe, it even uses something like prim95 to generate the load on cpu during testing:
http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=19792

works fine on SB/IB. however it gives false positives sometimes, e.g. when you have a corrupted entry for a hard drive deivce in registry (or Device Manager), it will state the CPU is faulty, because it cannot communicate with a SATA controller LOL!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Saw a bunch of guys at the Ivy Stable club use that bug to get new chips...xD


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Saw a bunch of guys at the Ivy Stable club use that bug to get new chips...xD


LOL! haha, that's funny of Intel to actually accept such claims LOL!


----------



## feniks

all right, good news! by confirming actual lowest reached voltages under load (kept observing CPU-Z while running IBT Standard 10 rounds) I was able to narrow down the "degradation" to a mere 0.008v under load LOL! meaning that upping the actual under load vcore by only 0.008v fixed the slight instability (WHEA warnings are no more).

it does take 3-4 notches up on vcore in BIOS, but actual vcore reacts differently (1st notch up = nearly no change, 2nd & 3rd borderline change still dipping to old unstable value sometimes, finally the 4th one makes a firm change to lowest observed vcore under load). that being sad, problem is minimal here and could actually be related to MB and not CPU at all








deliding that sucker on Saturday, just waiting for Liquid Ultra to come in


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good luck! Do it carefully and with proper equipment...Single bladed razor, a very thin one is ideal. But It'd be good if it doesn't bend too.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good luck! Do it carefully and with proper equipment...Single bladed razor, a very thin one is ideal. But It'd be good if it doesn't bend too.


thanks!
i bought a 10-pack of single sided razor blades in Lowe's like this:
http://www.lowes.com/pd_79621-16878-RB10_4294857647+4294965329_4294937087

not sure if they are the correct thickness (can use them for other purpose and tasks, e.g. as glass or mating surface scrapers), but I can get more of some others - perhaps the dual sided ones are thinner, however they are flexible at same time too.

other option I could think of while in store was an exacto knife, but I'd think it's much easier to chip the PCB with it since it's long (leverage effect) and slight change of angle on far end could cause a disaster on the sharp point end ... will post back with my findings and hopefully a success story over the weekend.


----------



## ivanlabrie

The exacto knife helped me get the sides better, after opening up at the corners with a flexible dual edge razor which I bent in a U shape to avoid nicking the pcb when getting the initial break in.


----------



## Systemlord

Has anyone used this type of blade, skip forward to 3:30 in You Tube video. These are the blades I purchased that are far thinner than that single sided blade!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Has anyone used this type of blade, skip forward to 3:30 in You Tube video. These are the blades I purchased that are far thinner than that single sided blade!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


i saw some vid's with bloody fingers at the end, using those,
its hard to get a good grip on them, did see them with a metal kind of cap on it somewhere tho,
that might work ok ..will try find a pic of it ..

found one, looks like this..


----------



## kgtuning

This is the kind I used. Its a bit flexible but super thin.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> This is the kind I used. Its a bit flexible but super thin.


yea, thin is good, can be a bit flexible , its a matter of being carefull and take time to delid, prepare well etc..
i used this to delid mine,


i had my mind made up within a week of purchase..lol, but took me a Month orso to prepare, read, watch vid's etc..
before delid my OC at 4.5ghz gave me 105C on prime, well....


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> i saw some vid's with bloody fingers at the end, using those,
> its hard to get a good grip on them, did see them with a metal kind of cap on it somewhere tho,
> that might work ok ..will try find a pic of it ..
> found one, looks like this..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That's funny, bloody fingers! You have to be careful and perhaps use some duct tape on one end, I want to put something in the center of the super thin blade to make it stiffer. I could fill it with solder...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> You have to be careful and perhaps use some duct tape on one end


yep, when i was looking for info, i saw one mention just that, use some tape/duck tape on one side, should work,
its still a matter of not bending it to much, flexible or not..there should be enough "room" to get most blades between.


"The math tells us the IHS is sitting on top of the CPU, held aloft and creating a gap some 0.14mm to the PCB."

if i look at this pic, there should be more then 0.14mm between pcb and ihs,
because the black glue is still there..
have no idea about the thickness of the blades were using tho..

had to laugh so hard with this vid, using normal knife and hammering it ..lol


----------



## bigblock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> i saw some vid's with bloody fingers at the end, using those,
> its hard to get a good grip on them, did see them with a metal kind of cap on it somewhere tho,
> that might work ok ..will try find a pic of it ..
> found one, looks like this..


I used this and wiggled it under the lid in a see saw motion with steady pressure the whole time. It's easy to control, take your time, don't rush it, you're only cutting a little at a time. You'll feel when you break through the adheasive.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigblock*
> 
> I used this and wiggled it under the lid in a see saw motion with steady pressure the whole time. It's easy to control, take your time, don't rush it, you're only cutting a little at a time. You'll feel when you break through the adheasive.


When you insert the blade do you just wiggle it strait in and is it a tight fit at the corners?


----------



## VonDutch

The "wiggle" part is important









this guy is doing a great job taking the IHS off,


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> When you insert the blade do you just wiggle it strait in and is it a tight fit at the corners?


Mine was tight all the way around but the corners are easier to get through. Look at swags guide shows how far you can go in with the razor.


----------



## Notion

Woohooo Finally got my chip stable after delidding the raskle.. Yes a nerve racking time of marking the pcb in several places due to too much flex in a shaving razor (old style square ones). rubbed some MX-4 in to make the showing copper non conductive.. and it works .. counting my stars at the mo..

The odd thing though was the temps droped but i had to up my voltage from 1.31 - to 1.33 v odd but i have it running stable now.

Here are my results, My previous results before de-lidding, raystorm water cooling, using XSPC K-2

once delidded i used MX-4 on the die and on the block applied very thinly via the razor blade.

73c,79c,73,70c.. Prime95 40 mins.. running at 4.7Mhz.. (before de-lidding) This is @1.31 V

After de-lidding with Auto temps 30 mins prime


After de- lidding with 1.33v


going to try and get the volts down even further..

Also awaiting Liquid Ultra to arrive .. will post temps once applied and tested.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Has anyone used this type of blade, skip forward to 3:30 in You Tube video. These are the blades I purchased that are far thinner than that single sided blade!


I used one and had no bloody fingers...nor duct tape on one end. They are hard to control cause they are flexible...


----------



## kgtuning

Not to sound like a jerk but idle temps don't matter.


----------



## kgtuning

@ ivanlabrie... the guy in the video seems to have that razor awfully far in...yikes.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Woohooo Finally got my chip stable after delidding the raskle.. Yes a nerve racking time of marking the pcb in several places due to too much flex in a shaving razor (old style square ones). rubbed some MX-4 in to make the showing copper non conductive.. and it works .. counting my stars at the mo..
> The odd thing though was the temps droped but i had to up my voltage from 1.31 - to 1.33 v odd but i have it running stable now.
> Here are my results, My previous results before de-lidding, raystorm water cooling, using XSPC K-2
> once delidded i used MX-4 on the die and on the block applied very thinly via the razor blade.
> 73c,79c,73,70c.. Prime95 40 mins.. running at 4.7Mhz.. (before de-lidding)
> After de-lidding with *Auto temps* 30 mins prime
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After de- lidding with 1.33v
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> going to try and get the volts down even further..
> Also awaiting Liquid Ultra to arrive .. will post temps once applied and tested.


Your before and after temps are not good, your second picture of Core Temp is at idle. What is auto temps, never heard of that before? Confused!


----------



## Notion

Sorry Auto Temps refers to voltage being set to Auto instead of specifying the vcore voltage..

I have just rerun @ 1.32 v and run prime for 30mins everything seems stable.. i.e no bsod


things starting to look better


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Not to sound like a jerk but idle temps don't matter.


not concerned with Idle temps to be honest.. trying to create some more head room to get the chip to 5ghz.. awaiting Liquid Ultimate.. will post updated results as and when


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> not concerned with Idle temps to be honest.. trying to create some more head room to get the chip to 5ghz.. awaiting Liquid Ultimate.. will post updated results as and when


I get that but I'm not sure what the point of posting that screenshot of core temp with no load... that is the point I'm making. Could you do a run under load and take a screenshot and post that so we could see volts, clock and temps?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Woohooo Finally got my chip stable after delidding the raskle.. Yes a nerve racking time of marking the pcb in several places due to too much flex in a shaving razor (old style square ones). rubbed some MX-4 in to make the showing copper non conductive.. and it works .. counting my stars at the mo..
> The odd thing though was the temps droped but i had to up my voltage from 1.31 - to 1.33 v odd but i have it running stable now.
> Here are my results, My previous results before de-lidding, raystorm water cooling, using XSPC K-2
> once delidded i used MX-4 on the die and on the block applied very thinly via the razor blade.
> 73c,79c,73,70c.. Prime95 40 mins.. running at 4.7Mhz.. (before de-lidding) This is @1.31 V
> After de-lidding with Auto temps 30 mins prime
> 
> After de- lidding with 1.33v
> 
> going to try and get the volts down even further..
> Also awaiting Liquid Ultra to arrive .. will post temps once applied and tested.


If your doing a custom loop then these temps are way to high. I barely broke 80C when I ran 1.4vcore at 4.8 Ghz. Try dropping your PLL and messing with your load line calibration %s


----------



## Notion

Ok speaking of the devil the Liquid ultra just arrived ..
just added liquid ultra under IHS and on top of IHS.. like before it seems to require more voltage for a "stable" still hasn't completed 30 mins of prime.. but @ 1.33v it was giving BSOD.. hoping this new setting will help..
Had a scare though.. after applying the new LU it would not start.. lol today is testing my nerves.. resetted the cpu and ihs and all seems ok.. well would not boot up at all and reset its self to stock.. then i find its because it is drawing more voltage..

Is it normal for more voltage to required the cooler it runs?

not hat much of a techy ..

temps are looking good.. not complete yet but looking in the upper 50's

will post again in 30 mins once complete.

looks to be 20+ C gain soo far

back soon


----------



## Notion

AArrggh prime cpuz keep crashing.. not BSOD but applications crashing..

Any inkling why peeps?

already added .02 to the voltage..

why is it eating the voltage with Liquid Ultra..

just reloaded optimal settings in Bios to see if prime will work correctly..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> AArrggh prime cpuz keep crashing.. not BSOD but applications crashing..
> Any inkling why peeps?
> already added .02 to the voltage..
> why is it eating the voltage with Liquid Ultra..
> just reloaded optimal settings in Bios to see if prime will work correctly..


Its not the Liquid Ultra causing it,
you had it also before using it,
makes me wonder if it has something to do with you scratching the pcb,
and you used something to fill the scratch(es)?


----------



## feniks

try running it at all stock clocks with only memory running rated speed and voltage (and timings). your overclock might have rendered unstable over time, but stock speeds should be perfectly stable ... and if they aren't then the CPU is damaged.

20C improvement in under load temps looks about right though.
also lower operating temperature should actually call for slightly lower voltage (than high temperature potentially causing electron migration stuff and so). either CPU slightly degraded or it's damaged from the scratches...


----------



## Notion

ok think i am getting to the bottom of it..

some how Bios changed..

reset to stock then booted prime all good temp below 45c..

just applied all overclock setting again and running prime to see if its stable again.. currently running @ 1.32v.. been 20 min's so far(first test completed) and peaking at 58C..

hopefully all is good.

I think the chip is fine.. as it wouldn't with stand prime on stock for 30 mins..

Time will tell.

up date shortly


----------



## VonDutch

to compare with









4.7ghz, 30 min prime blend

core temps: 57-63-61-60C

dont have any that many test with 4.7ghz yet ..lol
most are 4.8 and more..


----------



## Notion

Hell yeah all good on the western front.. little buggers come back into line..

Right after doing complete reset on all settings in BIOS i have managed to re-set all setting and successfully run Prime for 30 mins @1.32v All good.. no error and stable.

*few* .. Think i gained a good 10yrs.. heart is now reduced to a normal human pace and life is starting to seem like 5ghz is on the horizon..*few*

thank god this is back to normal..



Thanks for all the help peoples. Much appreciated through this roller-coaster of a ride!!

Only do this if you have the nerves.. Plus if using a razor that flex's be super careful!!!!!!! be warned!!!!


----------



## Notion

TIme to clock higher..


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> to compare with
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.7ghz, 30 min prime blend
> 
> core temps: 57-63-61-60C
> dont have any that many test with 4.7ghz yet ..lol
> most are 4.8 and more..


Is this with Liquid Ultimate or Pro on IHS Die and block


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Hell yeah all good on the western front.. little buggers come back into line..
> Right after doing complete reset on all settings in BIOS i have managed to re-set all setting and successfully run Prime for 30 mins @1.32v All good.. no error and stable.
> *few* .. Think i gained a good 10yrs.. heart is now reduced to a normal human pace and life is starting to seem like 5ghz is on the horizon..*few*
> thank god this is back to normal..
> 
> Thanks for all the help peoples. Much appreciated through this roller-coaster of a ride!!
> Only do this if you have the nerves.. Plus if using a razor that flex's be super careful!!!!!!! be warned!!!!


LOL..glad to hear its all good now ..im using about the same for 4.7ghz, 1.320V vcore, but with offset ..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> TIme to clock higher..


dont go to close to 1.5V vcore









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Is this with Liquid Ultimate or Pro on IHS Die and block


with Liquid Pro, but Ultra should give about the same results..


----------



## kgtuning

Only 30 minutes on prime? Lol. I run mine for 24 hours on prime, but that's what I do to make sure its "stable". Others run shorter times.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> LOL..glad to hear its all good now ..im using about the same for 4.7ghz, 1.320V vcore, but with offset ..
> dont go to close to 1.5V vcore
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> with Liquid Pro, but Ultra should give about the same results..


From the results im seeing Pro is beating Ultra by an Avg of 5c

They may be even on the Ihs but on the Die not so much so.. Pro is like solder.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Only 30 minutes on prime? Lol. I run mine for 24 hours on prime, but that's what I do to make sure its "stable". Others run shorter times.


i know, this was just for temperatures..
i ran my 4.8ghz 24H prime stable, no WHEA errors etc..
so im proud to have that link in my signature,
"The Ivy SUPER STABLE Club"


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, quick question...
How many of you have dings in the pcb with exposed copper and what did you do with them?
I have a small onne, should I cover it with something non conductive just in case?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i know, this was just for temperatures..
> i ran my 4.8ghz 24H prime stable, no WHEA errors etc..
> so im proud to have that link in my signature,
> "The Ivy SUPER STABLE Club"


Lol sorry man I meant Notion. I saw your 24 hour run.


----------



## Notion

I'm looking to go to 4.8ghz .. just decrease the PLL so re running temps to see if it improves at all..

Have to say i was majorly disappointed with the amount of LU , the tube was half empty.. only just managed to cover the die and IHS with the amount supplied.. not happy

otherwise happy with the results so far..

Many thanks for the support given .. cheers peeps


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> From the results im seeing Pro is beating Ultra by an Avg of 5c
> They may be even on the Ihs but on the Die not so much so.. Pro is like solder.


yea, i dont have much to compare yet, but will keep it in mind next time,
didnt think the difference was that big tho, then i will keep saying,
pro is best on the Die, but harder to remove then ultra,
ultra gives a bit less results then pro, but is easier to remove..

but also, you remove a cooler more often then the IHS,
so most likely you dont have to clean the die everytime,
only if you really see the temps are getting higher again,
but we have no real proof yet on how it will do over longer timeperiod,
will its structure change , will it go to dust as some say ..idk ..lol

on the IHS, you only need a good compound, no need to put pro or ultra on there too,
i did tho


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, quick question...
> How many of you have dings in the pcb with exposed copper and what did you do with them?
> I have a small onne, should I cover it with something non conductive just in case?


i saw someone on another forum who used nail polish,
to cover the dings..if it dries, it gets hard enough.
A bit epoxy glue ? not sure if its non conductive..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> I'm looking to go to 4.8ghz .. just decrease the PLL so re running temps to see if it improves at all..
> Have to say i was majorly disappointed with the amount of LU , the tube was half empty.. only just managed to cover the die and IHS with the amount supplied.. not happy
> otherwise happy with the results so far..
> Many thanks for the support given .. cheers peeps


Wait you used the whole tube? I have liquid pro, pretty sure same size as yours and was only half full... after using it on the die I have enough to do a lot more.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Wait you used the whole tube? I have liquid pro, pretty sure same size as yours and was only half full... after using it on the die I have enough to do a lot more.


Same here, i used it on all sides, Die, indside ihs, on the ihs, base plate cooler, and im not half way empty yet ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Remember guys you need to use a better TIM on the IHS like IX







like im going to review with pk 3 on the die. (I want lp but I hax no monies) I will provide the results when its all done. We got to remember lp and lu aren't the best for on the IHS they are ment for small surface area on the die mainly. Not saying you can't but just saying its not the best (or so I've heard from them directly).


----------



## ivanlabrie

I emptied my Ultra really fast...Gpu die, cpu die, underside of ihs and ihs top. I'll buy Liquid Pro next time, I'll run it as is as soon as I have my board up and running and check the temps. If they are not so great I'll get Liquid Pro and call it a day. I still have IC Diamond for the IHS though...But I'd rather get the best of the best, after this ordeal.
On to the ding topic, I'll try with nail polish or something, I'll figure it out.
Thanks guys!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember guys you need to use a better TIM on the IHS like IX
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like im going to review with pk 3 on the die. (I want lp but I hax no monies) I will provide the results when its all done. We got to remember lp and lu aren't the best for on the IHS they are ment for small surface area on the die mainly. Not saying you can't but just saying its not the best (or so I've heard from them directly).


I got better temps with LP on the ihs then ic Diamond id say because it is quiye hard to get a better spread with IC diamond then LP.. as u cover the whole IHS with it for complete IHS heat transfer to the Heat sink.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I got better temps with LP on the ihs then ic Diamond id say because it is quiye hard to get a better spread with IC diamond then LP.. as u cover the whole IHS with it for complete IHS heat transfer to the Heat sink.


that's why I said IX lol







it made a perfect contact on my IHS that it printed my batch # and such from the IHS on the IX


----------



## ivanlabrie

And that free IX man?

I want some for my ihs, and lp for the die...Doubt it will perform better than LP for the die though.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> And that free IX man?
> I want some for my ihs, and lp for the die...Doubt it will perform better than LP for the die though.


IC Diamond Tim great stuff ive had it since before it hit the market... in the Gtx 400 series era lol rep gave them out to evga forum members to put it on there gpus and post heat results.

I do think Liquid pro is better tho.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll use it for a friend's gtx580...It's hitting 90c as is, so I bet it'll help.
I'll bite the bullet and buy Liquid Pro for my cpu.


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Wait you used the whole tube? I have liquid pro, pretty sure same size as yours and was only half full... after using it on the die I have enough to do a lot more.


yeah it was crazy.. literally seemed like it had been used.. have complained to the company i bought it from.. i was literally scrapping the residue from inside the lid.. took about 10 mins to spread it out over the IHS.. think i was done.. might go for Pro next time though.. if the results are better..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> yeah it was crazy.. literally seemed like it had been used.. have complained to the company i bought it from.. i was literally scrapping the residue from inside the lid.. took about 10 mins to spread it out over the IHS.. think i was done.. might go for Pro next time though.. if the results are better..


I only used pro on the die but I have a ton left. I think I used half a grain of rice sized blob. And then did the same thing to the underside of the IHS.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I spread it over the die...Most of you did the same thing or did you use the half rice grain method?


----------



## Notion

i thought Liquid Pro and ultra was supposed to have like a needle on the end.. mine didn't.. i had a tiny blob on die spread out with brush supplied.. then rest on the IHS between water block.. still miffed about how much was in the tube.. for the price..

didn't put any on the underside of the IHS though..


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think it's totally worth it...10 bucks for the best thing out there sounds reasonable. You get like 4 applications in a tube of Ultra perhaps 5. (Die, underside of ihs, ihs and gpu in my case, granted I wasted some of it when applying it incorrectly







)


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I spread it over the die...Most of you did the same thing or did you use the half rice grain method?


I used a half rice but spread it with a q tip.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used a half rice but spread it with a q tip.


I put it on the die kinda thick as to make sure all points of die were making great contact with the IHS any access would just go to either side.. i can push 1.6v and barely touch 85c... i can push 1.53c and stay below 75c i can do 1.45v and not touch 70c max temp of 69c on hottest core.
And this is not 30 min runs this is after hours and hours...

I ordered mine directly from Cool Labs i have done about 5 apps and still have a good 2-3 more in the tube lol...


----------



## midniteboss

can someone redirect me to another post or video of someone applying the coollaboratory liquid pro on top of the die?

Thanks


----------



## bigblock

mispost


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I put it on the die kinda thick as to make sure all points of die were making great contact with the IHS any access would just go to either side.. i can push 1.6v and barely touch 85c... i can push 1.53c and stay below 75c i can do 1.45v and not touch 70c max temp of 69c on hottest core.
> And this is not 30 min runs this is after hours and hours...
> I ordered mine directly from Cool Labs i have done about 5 apps and still have a good 2-3 more in the tube lol...


with HT disabled or enabled?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> with HT disabled or enabled?


HT on for all of them but the last.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's 1.45v no HT for 5ghz right?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's 1.45v no HT for 5ghz right?


5.1ghz









It is a very safe 24/7 OC and i can just change the profile to my Saved 5.1ghz HT on OC when i need HT benching encoding etc.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sounds neat









I needed 1.49v for 5ghz with HT on...Perhaps delidding will shave some volts off, hopefully.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sounds neat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I needed 1.49v for 5ghz with HT on...Perhaps delidding will shave some volts off, hopefully.


Meh i have been trying to fix a Streaming movie screen tearing issue with google chrome now for 2 days...

Gonna try a bit more if no go ima go back to firefox....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i have been trying to fix a Streaming movie screen tearing issue with google chrome now for 2 days...
> Gonna try a bit more if no go ima go back to firefox....


I ditched google chrome for IE9 and Firefox...


----------



## JQuantum

btw... when i was delidding my cpu... i got very frustrated partway and just went fk this ***** and started applying a bunch of pressure on the ends... after that it came off a bit easier. Don't be too afraid to put pressure on it since the first 40 minutes were me just wasting my time doing nothing - apparently.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> btw... when i was delidding my cpu... i got very frustrated partway and just went fk this ***** and started applying a bunch of pressure on the ends... after that it came off a bit easier. Don't be too afraid to put pressure on it since the first 40 minutes were me just wasting my time doing nothing - apparently.


LOL... did you make sure it worked after?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> btw... when i was delidding my cpu... i got very frustrated partway and just went fk this ***** and started applying a bunch of pressure on the ends... after that it came off a bit easier. Don't be too afraid to put pressure on it since the first 40 minutes were me just wasting my time doing nothing - apparently.


Yep if your putting pressure up towards the IHS when u break thru the glue the IHS will give u some safety from hitting the core..


----------



## Valgaur

Thats why it took me a long time to do this. I was very careful to control my force on the blade. I had quite a bit but applied it very slowly. not a single scratch on my pcb or anything for that matter.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats why it took me a long time to do this. I was very careful to control my force on the blade. I had quite a bit but applied it very slowly. not a single scratch on my pcb or anything for that matter.


Me to work wise it took me like 30 mins i kept stoping to chat/ watch kid / talk to wife lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Did the same thing...Valgaur inspired me to do it, 'feel as if you're bending the chip'.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Did the same thing...Valgaur inspired me to do it, 'feel as if you're bending the chip'.


With me it was more that newb Valgaur did it dammit now i have to do it or i can no longer be is system advice go to guy..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember guys you need to use a better TIM on the IHS like IX
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like im going to review with pk 3 on the die. (I want lp but I hax no monies) I will provide the results when its all done. We got to remember lp and lu aren't the best for on the IHS they are ment for small surface area on the die mainly. Not saying you can't but just saying its not the best (or so I've heard from them directly).


don't even bother ordering PK-3 paste. I have it right now between IHS and cooling block and it's giving me awful temperatures, nearly 8-10C worse (higher) than with IC Diamond ... waste of time and money.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *midniteboss*
> 
> can someone redirect me to another post or video of someone applying the coollaboratory liquid pro on top of the die?
> Thanks


check this out, Q-tip seems to work (haven't used this paste personally):
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't trust those TIM roundups at all...They measure temps with Speedfan, come on


----------



## rexbinary

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't trust those TIM roundups at all...They measure temps with Speedfan, come on


Maybe all the temps are at least wrong by the same amount?


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> LOL... did you make sure it worked after?


Yup in my sig atm







actually I didn't even know if it was DOA or not since I never even turned it on before delidding it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yep if your putting pressure up towards the IHS when u break thru the glue the IHS will give u some safety from hitting the core..


yes even with the pressure applied there was enough safety for the thing to not scratch.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats why it took me a long time to do this. I was very careful to control my force on the blade. I had quite a bit but applied it very slowly. not a single scratch on my pcb or anything for that matter.


no scratches either







but no control really... I wasn't happen with the amount of time I was spending on this and was getting hungry lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember guys you need to use a better TIM on the IHS like IX
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like im going to review with pk 3 on the die. (I want lp but I hax no monies) I will provide the results when its all done. We got to remember lp and lu aren't the best for on the IHS they are ment for small surface area on the die mainly. Not saying you can't but just saying its not the best (or so I've heard from them directly).


Would've given you some LP to use if you were closer lol but no way I am paying for shipping/duty/brokerage and back


----------



## ivanlabrie

Wonder how IX will stack up when used on the die...Any word on that Valgaur?


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

I delidded my i5 3570k a while ago and saw around 7-8c drop. Last weekend I took a dremel buffing wheel to the cpu and IHS to clean up the left over epoxy a bit better. I also lapped the IHS which was far from flat. I even lapped the base of the IHS where it rests on the pcb a bit so that it fits tighter. That gave me a massive drop in temps. That probably netted me another 15c drop in temps on the hottest core.

I'm currently using MX-2 on the IHS and die. I'm currently using 4.7ghz. I'm not sure what a cpu-z validation proves. I'm sure that I can post at over 5ghz and post that. Hell, here I am priming at 4.9ghz at 1.4v. That failed after about an hour. I just settled for 4.7 for 24/7.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Looking good, but do get some Liquid Pro/Ultra paste...The TIM of true Sandy bridge buttkickers


----------



## kgtuning

hey I have 4.9 running prime right now too. what does your go up to in temps when it gets to like at the 20 minute mark?


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> hey I have 4.9 running prime right now too. what does your go up to in temps when it gets to like at the 20 minute mark?


That is about 20 minutes in. Even after about an hour it didn't climb much more.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Looking good, but do get some Liquid Pro/Ultra paste...The TIM of true Sandy bridge buttkickers


I doubt that it'll make that much of a difference to be honest. Of every thermal paste that I've ever tested not one has been noticeably better than MX-2. MX-2 is also super easy to apply. It almost applies itself. You apply a dab and it spreads itself. Which is why temps seem to improve a bit over a short period of time. Oh, it also cleans up easy and is non-conductive.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> That is about 20 minutes in. Even after about an hour it didn't climb much more.
> I doubt that it'll make that much of a difference to be honest. Of every thermal paste that I've ever tested not one has been noticeably better than MX-2. MX-2 is also super easy to apply. It almost applies itself. You apply a dab and it spreads itself. Which is why temps seem to improve a bit over a short period of time. Oh, it also cleans up easy and is non-conductive.


Have you been following this thread at all?








Check VonDutch's comparison between AS5 and LP...Drastic difference my friend.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't trust those TIM roundups at all...They measure temps with Speedfan, come on


LOL! true, also most of "soft" pastes are pretty much same ... bad







no matter if ac5, mx-2, mx-3, mx-4, pk1, pk3, whatever

Only soft paste I know to work is Shin Etsu X23 (7783D model I think it was), only couple degrees worse than awesome ICD (my favorite, minus the scratching feature), can't wait the package with Liquid Ultra








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rexbinary*
> 
> Maybe all the temps are at least wrong by the same amount?


LOL! doubt it ... all those reviews are not worth a broken dime if you ask me ... I mean all those common "soft" pastes differ in real world by around 0.25 up to 1C and are usually same bad save a few (ICD, CLP, CLU, SE-X23), what gives? no noticeable difference at all between most of them LOL.


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Have you been following this thread at all?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Check VonDutch's comparison between AS5 and LP...Drastic difference my friend.


No offense but what is one application supposed to prove? AS5 is pretty thick and very susceptible to application methods. Even when it is applied in the best way possible it still doesn't perform as well as some of the better pastes on the market like MX-2.

The comparison doesn't exactly sound scientific.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Only soft paste I know to work is Shin Etsu X23 (7783D model I think it was), only couple degrees worse than awesome ICD (my favorite, minus the scratching feature), can't wait the package with Liquid Ultra


I've never noticed a difference between Shin Etsu X23 and MX-2. Thats on a cpu or gpu.

IC diamond I did notice a difference but not in a good way. That stuff was so thick that I must have gotten a bad application. Although in that one application it managed to scuff the IHS of the cpu that I had at the time pretty well. It was also a real pita to clean up. I have a bunch of that crap left over and refuse to use it. I guess that all of that viral marketing on the forums did good for them since in day to day use that paste isn't very good.


----------



## Valgaur

I just got my IX stuff from them and I'll be doing my review shortly and my tests as well. I'm sick and I need sleep....but the vishie games are a calling lol.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> I've never noticed a difference between Shin Etsu X23 and MX-2. Thats on a cpu or gpu.
> IC diamond I did notice a difference but not in a good way. That stuff was so thick that I must have gotten a bad application. Although in that one application it managed to scuff the IHS of the cpu that I had at the time pretty well. It was also a real pita to clean up. I have a bunch of that crap left over and refuse to use it. I guess that all of that viral marketing on the forums did good for them since in day to day use that paste isn't very good.


well, I frequently used both in past and I did, at least 3-4C improvement in temps under load when using SE-X23 (7783D) versus MX-2 ... but either way both are beaten by old good IC Diamond - that stuff is so far the best I used to date ... still waiting on CL Liquid Metal Ultra to show up, so I can use it on Saturday (both, the die and IHS).

there's a few Shin Etsu X23 pastes out there, beware of the one made by Masscool, it's a cheap clone (NOT a 7783D) ... the one I used with some success (over MX-2) for the last 6 months was this:
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/8922/thr-58/Shin-Etsu_X23-7783D_Silicone_Thermal_Compound_-_5_Gram.html


----------



## Hokies83

Go vote for 3770k in this thread this guy is Gaming and video editing which the 3770k is faster at...

There using fanboisum to make dude waste his money...

http://www.overclock.net/t/1317254/3930k-vs-3570k/40_20#post_18391934


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> well, I frequently used both in past and I did, at least 3-4C improvement in temps under load when using SE-X23 (7783D) versus MX-2 ...


You shouldn't, look at skinnee labs testing. That pretty much mirrors what I've seen. I really like their tim testing methodology.
Quote:


> but either way both are beaten by old good IC Diamond


I've yet to see any independent third party testing that I trust verify that. It shouldn't make that much of a difference. From what I was that paste is just a royal pita to work with. The cons heavily outweigh the possible pros, I didn't see any pros tbh.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You have to heat that sucker up, and leave the application rest for 10 min before putting the heatsink on top and pressing it to spread it...Perhaps that's why you got a bad application in the first place.

You have to agree that we're seeing awesome results with LP in here, me myself tested it on my gpu die and it reduced temps by 20c under load. (I had good contact with the stock tim btw)


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> You shouldn't, look at skinnee labs testing. That pretty much mirrors what I've seen. I really like their tim testing methodology.
> I've yet to see any independent third party testing that I trust verify that. It shouldn't make that much of a difference. From what I was that paste is just a royal pita to work with. The cons heavily outweigh the possible pros, I didn't see any pros tbh.


not sure why then, but x23 always comes up at least slightly better or a few degrees better (probably depends on application) in my own testing than mx-2 ever does, they are not same to me the last time I checked ingredients too (MX-2 is different color and way more liquid than X23 is) ...

with ICD, I usually warm up the syringe in a cup of boiled water for 30 secs, then squeeze out a rice grain size on the CPU and spread it evenly with an old plastic card (credit, debit, whatever), then I mount the heatsink/block on top of it. I re-tighten the mountings (if they are spring loaded) after at least 10 mins into some stress testing. ICD always gives me some wonderful temperature gains, even over my favorite "soft" x23.
it's also not so bad during removal, it's usually easy to peel/scrub off and then clean & polish. the only thing I dislike is that it leaves the IHS surface scratched/discolored where it was pressed in (or swiped) hard.

EDIT:
one correction though, in my own comparison of efficiency between mx-2 vs x23 I actually used an older (over 1yr old) syringe of MX-2 and a brand new syringe of X23. perhaps that accounted for always better results with X23 I observed on my end.

however there is one more factor.
with high temp stress testing I always found MX-2 getting weak(er) after around 3+ months of daily 24/7 use. however I didn't have a chance to observe that with X23 (was removing the cooling block for various reasons more frequent than that).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> No offense but what is one application supposed to prove? AS5 is pretty thick and very susceptible to application methods. Even when it is applied in the best way possible it still doesn't perform as well as some of the better pastes on the market like MX-2.
> The comparison doesn't exactly sound scientific.
> I've never noticed a difference between Shin Etsu X23 and MX-2. Thats on a cpu or gpu.
> IC diamond I did notice a difference but not in a good way. That stuff was so thick that I must have gotten a bad application. Although in that one application it managed to scuff the IHS of the cpu that I had at the time pretty well. It was also a real pita to clean up. I have a bunch of that crap left over and refuse to use it. I guess that all of that viral marketing on the forums did good for them since in day to day use that paste isn't very good.


it where several applications, and i used AS5 for years, never had any problem applying it








maybe this pic will give better "proof",

350 tests, on 11 forums, as well from 10 website reviews..

guess i can say the same, what does one user experience proof?


----------



## Hokies83

Look at my last post over there i posted like 50 Toms hardware benchmarks lmao..


----------



## PCWargamer

CL Ultra has arrived today. Bought some tools too. Doing some benching to collect some before delidding temps to compare to the after. Hope I don't destroy my chip! If you don't hear from me for awhile you will know what happened.....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> CL Ultra has arrived today. Bought some tools too. Doing some benching to collect some before delidding temps to compare to the after. Hope I don't destroy my chip! If you don't hear from me for awhile you will know what happened.....


Don't use the small snap knife. Use the single-edged blade. I delidded a friend's Ivy a couple days back for $25.







I used a double-edged blade but it was the same.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't use the small snap knife. Use the single-edged blade. I delidded a friend's Ivy a couple days back for $25.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a double-edged blade but it was the same.


i used the small snap knife blade to get into the glue on the corners then used a 1 sided razor blade to finish the job.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> CL Ultra has arrived today. Bought some tools too. Doing some benching to collect some before delidding temps to compare to the after. Hope I don't destroy my chip! If you don't hear from me for awhile you will know what happened.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> [IMG ALT]=""http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1091361/width/500/height/1000


I hope everything will go well for you, good luck


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't use the small snap knife. Use the single-edged blade. I delidded a friend's Ivy a couple days back for $25.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a double-edged blade but it was the same.
> 
> 
> 
> i used the small snap knife blade to get into the glue on the corners then used a 1 sided razor blade to finish the job.
Click to expand...

Haha, look at my guide. I used some unconventional blade I just had because I was too lazy to go to Home Depot and I was so eager to start and make my guide.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> CL Ultra has arrived today. Bought some tools too. Doing some benching to collect some before delidding temps to compare to the after. Hope I don't destroy my chip! If you don't hear from me for awhile you will know what happened.....


You do not get the boy peeing on Sandy Bridge Cpu Avatar if you fail!









You got to use this Avatar for a month if you fail..



Ack WTH.. How did i get a picture of Valgaur from middle school?









He looks like this now....

 You broke Mah Game boy!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't use the small snap knife. Use the single-edged blade. I delidded a friend's Ivy a couple days back for $25.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a double-edged blade but it was the same.


$25 for a delid ?
man, i should start making some money delidding haha...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> CL Ultra has arrived today. Bought some tools too. Doing some benching to collect some before delidding temps to compare to the after. Hope I don't destroy my chip! If you don't hear from me for awhile you will know what happened.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You do not get the boy peeing on Sandy Bridge Cpu Avatar if you fail!
Click to expand...

Ivy Bridge. Intel's conspiracy to get rid of Sandy-Bridge.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ivy Bridge. Intel's conspiracy to get rid of Sandy-Bridge.


Lies! Peeing in Sandy Bridge-e E-Peen Brand Corn flakes in fun!

RAWR!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Lies! Peeing in Sandy Bridge-e E-Peen Brand Corn flakes in fun!
> RAWR!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Come on Hokies on list of 50 is enough. Also don't force things onto people with stats. Yes you may be right but it is their build, thus their choices the OP may have asked for some help but not a shove.

Now get that thing delidded PC Your my Vice and should be delidded to be it!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> Come on Hokies on list of 50 is enough. Also don't force things onto people with stats. Yes you may be right but it is their build, thus their choices the OP may have asked for some help but not a shove.
> Now get that thing delidded PC Your my Vice and should be delidded to be it!


Not forcing telling the truth... Ppl need to quit wasteing hundreds of peoples dollars with crap.

And if nobody stands up to the people wasteing ppls money it will continue.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Not forcing telling the truth... Ppl need to quit wasteing hundreds of peoples dollars with crap.


I know but sometimes you can't stop them. Like me with my mobo I love the features which is why i got it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I know but sometimes you can't stop them. Like me with my mobo I love the features which is why i got it.


LoL you got it because your UD5H was DOA and you got that one cheap









If you started from scratch and seen a G1 Sniper 3 for 249$ Vs that 449$ board you would not have gots it.









Still think u should sell it and get the G1 Sniper 3 for your color combo.. the green Hornet needs it..

 *+*  *=* 

That guy asked and wanted the truth i gave him the truth and im about 90% sure he is gonna get a 3770k.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL you got it because your UD5H was DOA and you got that one cheap
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you started from scratch and seen a G1 Sniper 3 for 249$ Vs that 449$ board you would not have gots it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still think u should sell it and get the G1 Sniper 3 for your color combo.. the green Hornet needs it..
> +  =
> That guy asked and wanted the truth i gave him the truth and im about 90% sure he is gonna get a 3770k.


never had a UD5H......lol and yeah I persuaded him


----------



## PCWargamer

OK. So things have not gone so well.... It was not hard to do really, or so it seems.....cause it would not POST.









Closer examination found a tiny scratch in the PCB. Guess I was in too much of a hurry......









So, I'll have to head to micro center soon and hope they have a 3770K in stock - and maybe an even better one!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't use the small snap knife. Use the single-edged blade. I delidded a friend's Ivy a couple days back for $25.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a double-edged blade but it was the same.


Yeah, "don't use the small snap knife" - and I tried it only once before going to the single-edged blade. I think that was all it took......

So, don't use the small snap knife....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> OK. So things have not gone so well.... It was not hard to do really, or so it seems.....cause it would not POST.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Closer examination found a tiny scratch in the PCB. Guess I was in too much of a hurry......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, I'll have to head to micro center soon and hope they have a 3770K in stock - and maybe an even better one!










After u break the outside of hte glue ush pressure so the blade is aimed at the IHS and not the PCB to avoid that..

Have you tried to do what someone else did with the tim?

Did you check to see if u bent a MB pin or not?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah, "don't use the small snap knife" - and I tried it only once before going to the single-edged blade. I think that was all it took......
> So, don't use the small snap knife....


Get a better OC'er you! Sad to see it go man but it's really worth it. but with the blade i put it straight flat with the PCB and very lowly pushed it forward. until i used my fingernail to dip the edge just under the IHS then i slightly bent the pcb to give me more "wiggle room". Again don't rush this. take your time guys. That's why i spent hours not minutes, speed isn't key its the workman ship and it needs to be done just right.

Btw....I like your avatar...man stands to his words guys. Glad to have you as my Vice sir!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah, "don't use the small snap knife" - and I tried it only once before going to the single-edged blade. I think that was all it took......
> So, don't use the small snap knife....


Mail me that Deadzor chip see if i can bring it back to life with Hokie magics...

ill pay shipping..


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After u break the outside of hte glue ush pressure so the blade is aimed at the IHS and not the PCB to avoid that..
> Have you tried to do what someone else did with the tim?
> Did you check to see if u bent a MB pin or not?


Did the blade towards the IHS, but the knife wanted to go into the pcb - which is why I quickly put it down and only used the blade from then on - and I will use only the blade for my next chip - also, my IHS was pushed hard into the PCB from months of being pressed down by my H80 - new chip should be better.

What does everyone else do with the TIM???? - is there a way to fix the PCB?

Yeah. First thing I did was verify the chip placement and MB for bent pins - when I found nothing wrong there I started to take a closer look at the chip - and thats when I found the nick in the PCB....

Do you like my new Avatar....?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Did the blade towards the IHS, but the knife wanted to go into the pcb - which is why I quickly put it down and only used the blade from then on - and I will use only the blade for my next chip - also, my IHS was pushed hard into the PCB from months of being pressed down by my H80 - new chip should be better.
> What does everyone else do with the TIM???? - is there a way to fix the PCB?
> Yeah. First thing I did was verify the chip placement and MB for bent pins - when I found nothing wrong there I started to take a closer look at the chip - and thats when I found the nick in the PCB....
> *Do you like my new Avatar.*...?


Still mail me that chip..

Nice Avatar looks like the Sandy Bridge / Sandy bridge-E Mascot ..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Still mail me that chip..
> Nice Avatar looks like the Sandy Bridge / Sandy bridge-E Mascot ..


He's gonna fix and get a new one from intel..........









Oops i spoiled le surprise Muhahahahahahahahahaha


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Still mail me that chip..
> Nice Avatar looks like the Sandy Bridge / Sandy bridge-E Mascot ..


Dude, if you have some ideas on saving the chip - please do tell - as I'd rather not spend $300 for a new chip if there is something I can still try to rescue this one.









...or is it new glue and an Intell refund you want???

...kinda like my new avatar....maybe I can get a discounted SB, or better yet - Bulldozer!!!


----------



## soundrats

Good morning from germany, please tell me how do you clean DIE and IHS after a failed try with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro. I did something wrong. Now I have a bit debris (hope this is the right word) on DIE and IHS which i cannot wipe off with Aethanol as usual.
Regards Tom


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Dude, if you have some ideas on saving the chip - please do tell - as I'd rather not spend $300 for a new chip if there is something I can still try to rescue this one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...kinda like my new avatar....maybe I can get a discounted SB, or better yet - Bulldozer!!!


Eh well try Non Conductive tim in the scratch... if that does not work them try some conductive stuff lol..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *soundrats*
> 
> Good morning from germany, please tell me how do you clean DIE and IHS after a failed try with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro. I did something wrong. Now I have a bit debris (hope this is the right word) on DIE and IHS which i cannot wipe off with Aethanol as usual.
> Regards Tom


You can put more Liquid pro ontop of liquid pro it is like solder ..

If it is dirty ur gonna have to try and pick it out some how.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> He's gonna fix and get a new one from intel..........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oops i spoiled le surprise Muhahahahahahahahahaha


I kill joo infidel !


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Eh well try Non Conductive tim in the scratch... if that does not work them try some conductive stuff lol..
> You can put more Liquid pro ontop of liquid pro it is like solder ..
> If it is dirty ur gonna have to try and pick it out some how.


Cool - I'll try em both and see what happens!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Eh well try Non Conductive tim in the scratch... if that does not work them try some conductive stuff lol..
> You can put more Liquid pro ontop of liquid pro it is like solder ..
> If it is dirty ur gonna have to try and pick it out some how.
> I kill joo infidel !


Use a blade.......







No dont do that. I'm not quite sure since I havent delt with LP yet.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Cool - I'll try em both and see what happens!


You could also i donno try to find the Chips re flow temp and bake it i donno..

If you send it to me ill try all kinds of crazy stuffs!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Use a blade.......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No dont do that. I'm not quite sure since I havent delt with LP yet.


I put Liquid pro ontop of liquid pro on my Die cause i did not think it was making even Contact ended up working great as i got some of the best temps drops of anybody...

Sit down son the big Dawgs are talking..


----------



## Blatsz32

my quick 4.8 run..notice the temps


So I was experimenting..decided to practice on an old Athalon cpu and a q6600 cpu. The Athlon delidding went fine, no scratches and came off easily...as for the Q6600..well that was tough. There seems to be a lot of glue. i went all the way around carefully, pulling black sticky stuff, which I assume is glue, along with each pass and I still couldn't seperate the cpu. I ended up breaking the blade and I gave up. I really want to try my 3570k but if it is as hard to do as the Q6600 then I'm going to have to pass.

reason I'd like to delid : when i sit at idle or bench and max load my cpu core 0 and core 3 are always 10c lower than core 1 and 2. Example..currently I'm idleing at core0: 24.0c, core1: 31c, core2: 32c, and core3: 20c..what I'd like to see is 1 and 2 as low as the other 2 core. Would delidding help that issue? Some one told me that it's normal for 2 core to run hotter than the other..but i find a 10c diffrence to be quit ridiculous.

I have been able to hit 4.7 on my chip for 2 hours on OCCT. I backed off and decided not to go further because the 2 hot cores wre dangerously close to the TJmax. Anyway, I guess my questions are ; Would delidding help the issue and is delidding the 3570k IB as hard as delidding the q6600?

Oh also, what am i trying not to scratch? the thing in the center I know for sure but am i also trying to keep the pcb as flawless as possible? I just wnat to cover all my bases. i'm sure it was mentioned at the beginning but I'm not really schooled in all the technical names..like IHS and all that. Excuse my noobness. If my lack of technical experience suggests that i shouldn't delid please let me know. I do know that I shouldn't stick a pocket knife in the middle and bang away at it like I saw in the video.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blatsz32*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my quick 4.8 run..notice the temps
> 
> So I was experimenting..decided to practice on an old Athalon cpu and a q6600 cpu. The Athlon delidding went fine, no scratches and came off easily...as for the Q6600..well that was tough. There seems to be a lot of glue. i went all the way around carefully, pulling black sticky stuff, which I assume is glue, along with each pass and I still couldn't seperate the cpu. I ended up breaking the blade and I gave up. I really want to try my 3570k but if it is as hard to do as the Q6600 then I'm going to have to pass.
> reason I'd like to delid : when i sit at idle or bench and max load my cpu core 0 and core 3 are always 10c lower than core 1 and 2. Example..currently I'm idleing at core0: 24.0c, core1: 31c, core2: 32c, and core3: 20c..what I'd like to see is 1 and 2 as low as the other 2 core. Would delidding help that issue? Some one told me that it's normal for 2 core to run hotter than the other..but i find a 10c diffrence to be quit ridiculous.
> I have been able to hit 4.7 on my chip for 2 hours on OCCT. I backed off and decided not to go further because the 2 hot cores wre dangerously close to the TJmax. Anyway, I guess my questions are ; Would delidding help the issue and is delidding the 3570k IB as hard as delidding the q6600?
> Oh also, what am i trying not to scratch? the thing in the center I know for sure but am i also trying to keep the pcb as flawless as possible? I just wnat to cover all my bases. i'm sure it was mentioned at the beginning but I'm not really schooled in all the technical names..like IHS and all that. Excuse my noobness. If my lack of technical experience suggests that i shouldn't delid please let me know. I do know that I shouldn't stick a pocket knife in the middle and bang away at it like I saw in the video.


you will get less temperature difference between cores, but there will always be a difference,
be it because of the what they call sleeping core, or just 1 core doing a bit more work..
my core differences where 10 to 15C before delid, after it was better, but still there, like here,


delidding depends on what you want to do with OCing, if a 4.7-4.8ghz OC gives very high temps,
like i had 105C with prime , running at 4.5ghz..

youre trying not to scratch the PCB, made this pic to make it more clear what what is ..lol


not sure if a 3570k is harder to delid then a Q6600, all i know, and see, if it goes wrong,
most of the time its because peeps are in to big a hurry, take your time i would say,
prepare well, by reading and watching vid's, ask questions etc


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> OK. So things have not gone so well.... It was not hard to do really, or so it seems.....cause it would not POST.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Closer examination found a tiny scratch in the PCB. Guess I was in too much of a hurry......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, I'll have to head to micro center soon and hope they have a 3770K in stock - and maybe an even better one!


onoooo







, try what others say,
reseat , retry a few times, see if you can get it to boot etc..
nail polish, or epoxy glue might help, not sure about their conductivity tho


----------



## 4thKor

WOW! This looks challenging, scary, and exhilerating all at the same time! Right up my alley! Can a Q9550 be de-lidded very easily? Or is it in the same class as a Q6600? I've got both, so if I were to practice on one I think I would chose the Q6600 or even my Q8200 if it's similar too.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> WOW! This looks challenging, scary, and exhilerating all at the same time! Right up my alley! Can a Q9550 be de-lidded very easily? Or is it in the same class as a Q6600? I've got both, so if I were to practice on one I think I would chose the Q6600 or even my Q8200 if it's similar too.


Mail me the Q6600 and ill mail u 2 Pent 4s to test it on lol


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Mail me the Q6600 and ill mail u 2 Pent 4s to test it on lol


Don't know what I'm thinkin'! I've got a couple of old P4's I could practice on. Now I just need to read up on the subject more and go for it!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> Don't know what I'm thinkin'! I've got a couple of old P4's I could practice on. Now I just need to read up on the subject more and go for it!


Why destroy good benching cpu's like that? mail me the q9550 I'll put it to good use under DICE.









I bet those cpu's have soldered IHS, you're gonna kill them like I killed my 775 P4. Delid the 478 and 423 P4's...those were glued.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Why destroy good benching cpu's like that? mail me the q9550 I'll put it to good use under DICE.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I bet those cpu's have soldered IHS, you're gonna kill them like I killed my 775 P4. Delid the 478 and 423 P4's...those were glued.


The LAST thing I wanna' do is kill my CPU's! I think I'd cry! Now I'm skeart..........


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> The LAST thing I wanna' do is kill my CPU's! I think I'd cry! Now I'm skeart..........


Don't be scared, just delid the Ivy chip carefully...You always can resort to black epoxy and rma








BTW, I only wanted to warn you cause soldered die to ihs chips die rather fast when delidded, unless you are fearless and can blowtorche them apart.
Practice on pentium 4's, they are dirt cheap and willing to die protecting your Ivy.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Don't be scared, just delid the Ivy chip carefully...You always can resort to black epoxy and rma
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, I only wanted to warn you cause soldered die to ihs chips die rather fast when delidded, unless you are fearless and can blowtorche them apart.
> Practice on pentium 4's, they are dirt cheap and willing to die protecting your Ivy.


Actually I am an accomplished coppersmith and I own a NICE jeweler's torch. I would actually feel more comfortable with that method. I've already formulated "slicing" about a 1/4" piece from an ice cube to rest under it while I de-lid to keep the center cool. Should work. Heck, I've lapped 'em all so I'm used to plopping a perfectly good CPU down in a puddle of water!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> Actually I am an accomplished coppersmith and I own a NICE jeweler's torch. I would actually feel more comfortable with that method. I've already formulated "slicing" about a 1/4" piece from an ice cube to rest under it while I de-lid to keep the center cool. Should work. Heck, I've lapped 'em all so I'm used to plopping a perfectly good CPU down in a puddle of water!


Watch and learn ...LOL


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> Actually I am an accomplished coppersmith and I own a NICE jeweler's torch. I would actually feel more comfortable with that method. I've already formulated "slicing" about a 1/4" piece from an ice cube to rest under it while I de-lid to keep the center cool. Should work. Heck, I've lapped 'em all so I'm used to plopping a perfectly good CPU down in a puddle of water!


Coppersmith you say...? i have been wanting to design my own copper water block for years....


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Coppersmith you say...? i have been wanting to design my own copper water block for years....


That would probably fall more in the line of machinist. I'm in the sheet metal division. I personally want to build a solid copper case!


----------



## dalastbmills

Does anyone have any experience with MX-4? It seems everyone here is using Coollaboratory but all I have is MX-4. How do the 2 compare? I am very tempted to do this but I am contemplating waiting until I move to a real water loop. What do you guys think? Would it be worth it to delid using MX-4/H80?


----------



## kgtuning

@vondutch.... that's big brass (you know) right there...lol.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Watch and learn ...LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awsome! I'm vague on actual procedure as far as the blades and how to actually set this up.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Does anyone have any experience with MX-4? It seems everyone here is using Coollaboratory but all I have is MX-4. How do the 2 compare? I am very tempted to do this but I am contemplating waiting until I move to a real water loop. What do you guys think? Would it be worth it to delid using MX-4/H80?


you will see a tempdrop using mx4, but wont be as much as using liquid pro/ultra on the Die..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> That would probably fall more in the line of machinist. I'm in the sheet metal division. I personally want to build a solid copper case!


Copper case huh... sounds like fun.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Does anyone have any experience with MX-4? It seems everyone here is using Coollaboratory but all I have is MX-4. How do the 2 compare? I am very tempted to do this but I am contemplating waiting until I move to a real water loop. What do you guys think? Would it be worth it to delid using MX-4/H80?


Order liquid pro and wait.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Copper case huh... sounds like fun.


My only holdup is the price of copper! Could almost go solid gold! Plus, all my funds are being directed toward hardware. The case will wait. Do you guys do any Folding? You'd do VERY well in Team Competition!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> My only holdup is the price of copper! Could almost go solid gold! Plus, all my funds are being directed toward hardware. The case will wait. Do you guys do any Folding? You'd do VERY well in Team Competition!


Hmm ill trade you my Cosmos 2 for teh gold case..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> My only holdup is the price of copper! Could almost go solid gold! Plus, all my funds are being directed toward hardware. The case will wait. Do you guys do any Folding? You'd do VERY well in Team Competition!


No, I don't fold. The price of copper is silly right now. Its like 3.70$ lb. I remember a few years ago it was a little over 1.50$ lb. I love the look of copper.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmm ill trade you my Cosmos 2 for teh gold case..


When I DO get around to building my copper case there is a "preservative" that you can spray on copper that actually turns it a BEAUTIFUL gold color! It's also pricey, but it would be NEAT!


----------



## VonDutch

this one is using some kind of card delidding, looks like it works well too,
maybe bit more work and slower then using a box knife, or razor blade etc,
but much more safe..

sound off/low before start











i also wonder what that "black sealer" tube is on his desk ..


----------



## kgtuning

That's the super secret black glue Intel uses... that's so If they EFF it up they can RMA it...lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this one is using some kind of card delidding, looks like it works well too,
> maybe bit more work and slower then using a box knife, or razor blade etc,
> but much more safe..
> sound off/low before start
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also wonder what that "black sealer" tube is on his desk ..


Awesome!








Would have liked to do it that way instead of the razor :/
Hope my chip is alive...

Guys, today's rma time for my board, wish me luck!

EDIT: I'll have to resort to that special black sealer in case I did screw up...rma and next I7 will receive the credit card treatment.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this one is using some kind of card delidding, looks like it works well too,
> maybe bit more work and slower then using a box knife, or razor blade etc,
> but much more safe..
> sound off/low before start
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also wonder what that "black sealer" tube is on his desk ..


Don't think this'll work on a soldered CPU. I need a 775 base I could latch a CPU into. I have a brainstorm!







Need to find me a dead mobo.....and processor to practice on.....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would have liked to do it that way instead of the razor :/
> Hope my chip is alive...
> Guys, today's rma time for my board, wish me luck!
> EDIT: I'll have to resort to that special black sealer in case I did screw up...rma and next I7 will receive the credit card treatment.


I do not see how a plastic card can cut thru that glue .. it is pretty tough glue.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not see how a plastic card can cut thru that glue .. it is pretty tough glue.


Magic..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> Don't think this'll work on a soldered CPU. I need a 775 base I could latch a CPU into. I have a brainstorm!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Need to find me a dead mobo.....and processor to practice on.....


nope, thats for the "normal" de-lid









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> That's the super secret black glue Intel uses... that's so If they EFF it up they can RMA it...lol


LOL








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not see how a plastic card can cut thru that glue .. it is pretty tough glue.


patience, the glue isnt that tough, but it could help to not damage the pcb..
thats why i posted it, never saw this before..


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think it's neat...I'll try it in case my chip has to be rma'ed.


----------



## Hokies83

I had a thought .....

Haswell Vs Ivy-E Ivy-E is giving 10% performance clock for clock over SB-E...

Haswell is giving 10% performance over IB but the Igpu is going to be twice as fast... the Igpu is where IB gets it's media encoding speed from..

I guess what im trying to say is.. Socket 2011 is getting 10% performance socket 1150 *Haswell* is getting twice the Igpu power and 10% performance...

Thinking this way you would think Haswell would Steam roll IB-E with video/media...

2 ways to stop this...

1 Put tim on Haswell and glue IHS on

2 Include the HD 4000 Igpu on Ivy-E.

I think the first one can happen.. number 2 is unlikely.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nope, thats for the "normal" de-lid


"Normal" worries me..........


----------



## kgtuning

I don't think delidding is " normal". Lol.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I don't think delidding is " normal". Lol.


That's exactly what I was talkin' about!


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this one is using some kind of card delidding, looks like it works well too,
> maybe bit more work and slower then using a box knife, or razor blade etc,
> but much more safe..
> sound off/low before start
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also wonder what that "black sealer" tube is on his desk ..


Nice find man +REP I am going to do my chip this weekend..... And this idea just gave me the courage to do it .

I already have the liquid pro liquid ultra .... And a spare 3570k in case I mess up I had to order it while I was in the us because prices here are crazy.

Any ideas on which card can we use ???


----------



## feniks

deliding Q6600? it had a soldered IHS (to CPU die) ... you won't be able to simply delid by cutting the black glue (silicone RTV most likely) around it ... you would need to heat up the IHS at a final stage to break the solder connection in oder to separate them.
Ivy Bridge use TIM instead of solder on the die, that's why it's so easy to delid them ... unless someone scratches the PCB that is ... crap happens sometimes. interesting method with using a credit card for safe cutting through the glue ...


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> No, I don't fold. The price of copper is silly right now. Its like 3.70$ lb. I remember a few years ago it was a little over 1.50$ lb. I love the look of copper.


You should try it! I find it extremely challenging. And fun! Kinda' like car racing, but not as hard on the equipment.... At least not quite as expensive.... maybe....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I don't think delidding is " normal". Lol.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> "Normal" worries me..........


LOL









thats why i put it between " " and a









of course its not normal we have to mod a cpu that costs about 300 euro,
and also have to buy a (very)good cooler if we dont delid..and want to do some OC-ing,
i didnt buy the "K" to have it running at stock ..lol

ooooo.. i got a +rep ...thanks!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Any ideas on which card can we use ???


thin as possible, not to flexible..i have some cards that are sealed with plastic, like my ID-card,
very thin, and not to flexible ..creditcard is to thick,
was looking for something, then i saw a deck of playing cards...about that thick it should be i think
but then plastic..idk, you have to look for something you can use and have at home or is easy to get


----------



## kgtuning

There was no way in hell I could fit a credit card between the IHS and PCB.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thats why i put it between " " and a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> of course its not normal we have to mod a cpu that costs about 300 euro,
> and also have to buy a (very)good cooler if we dont delid..and want to do some OC-ing,
> i didnt buy the "K" to have it running at stock ..lol


I'm not "normal" at all! I love to push the envelope, and this is definitely the most extreme way I've seen for doing that!









EDIT: Short of LN and such....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this one is using some kind of card delidding, looks like it works well too,
> maybe bit more work and slower then using a box knife, or razor blade etc,
> but much more safe..
> sound off/low before start
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also wonder what that "black sealer" tube is on his desk ..


Pfft i learned more from this Video..


----------



## itinerant

Hi fellas... long time listener first time caller.

I've been going around in circles for the last week whether to do this. My logic is I've built/handled enough systems where if I'm careful, it should be doable.

Is there any feedback regarding performance degradation over time? I had read somewhere else that some delidders were reporting increased temperatures as time went on.

Anyway, thanks to you all for your very valuable and helpful information. It seems I've read every single post while doing some bench runs. If I can just pull the trigger perhaps I can join the club as well.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Pfft i learned more from this Video..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Stop being mean Hokies and I'm not kidding. You may be older but I am an adult myself, so don't just kick people out of conversations especially their own threads.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> Hi fellas... long time listener first time caller.
> I've been going around in circles for the last week whether to do this. My logic is I've built/handled enough systems where if I'm careful, it should be doable.
> Is there any feedback regarding performance degradation over time? I had read somewhere else that some delidders were reporting increased temperatures as time went on.
> Anyway, thanks to you all for your very valuable and helpful information. It seems I've read every single post while doing some bench runs. If I can just pull the trigger perhaps I can join the club as well.


Mr. Obvious Whats your question caller? (love that thing man) There is no way you could get degradation from better heat dissipation by getting rid of that spacing issue with these IB chips. I got way more headroom for my OC'ing just with temps I don't give a crap about Vcore walls or anything like that. I'm an Oc'er and I want to push things are far as they can go and this let me do just that. You will absolutely love these temps, BUT BE WARNED, READ ALL THE INFO PLEASE, I hate to see dead chips coming out, we've had a few in a row actually so read the first page thoroughly and all the links please we wants success stories not pictures of dead chips.

Besides you could Oc even better when your done








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> My only holdup is the price of copper! Could almost go solid gold! Plus, all my funds are being directed toward hardware. The case will wait. Do you guys do any Folding? You'd do VERY well in Team Competition!


*cough* *cough* I think I qualify..........







Yeah we need some for folders though and I agree anyone who haz a delidded IB would rock out PPD like I currently am I knocked up 50K points yesterday alone.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> *Stop being mean Hokies* and I'm not kidding. You may be older but I am an adult myself, so don't just kick people out of conversations especially their own threads.
> Mr. Obvious Whats your question caller? (love that thing man) There is no way you could get degradation from better heat dissipation by getting rid of that spacing issue with these IB chips. I got way more headroom for my OC'ing just with temps I don't give a crap about Vcore walls or anything like that. I'm an Oc'er and I want to push things are far as they can go and this let me do just that. You will absolutely love these temps, BUT BE WARNED, READ ALL THE INFO PLEASE, I hate to see dead chips coming out, we've had a few in a row actually so read the first page thoroughly and all the links please we wants success stories not pictures of dead chips.
> Besides you could Oc even better when your done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *cough* *cough* I think I qualify..........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah we need some for folders though and I agree anyone who haz a delidded IB would rock out PPD like I currently am I knocked up 50K points yesterday alone.


LoL dude im JOKEING









I thought that was super Obvious... did u even see the video LOL...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> Stop being mean Hokies and I'm not kidding. You may be older but I am an adult myself, so don't just kick people out of conversations especially their own threads.


you tell him dumber, im not here to follow dance lessons


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL dude im JOKEING
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought that was super Obvious... did u even see the video LOL...


Yes and its a completely legitimate way to delid a processor. there is no rule saying how to do it. My pet peev is when someone posts something helpful then someone shoots it down with a "joke" of a comment gets me very irritated it's who I am and he provided very good information. Unlike your PSY video.

Also Jokeing should be joking.


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> *cough* *cough* I think I qualify..........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah we need some for folders though and I agree anyone who haz a delidded IB would rock out PPD like I currently am I knocked up 50K points yesterday alone.


You do indeed kick some serious a$$!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yes and its a completely legitimate way to delid a processor. there is no rule saying how to do it. My pet peev is when someone posts something helpful then someone shoots it down with a "joke" of a comment gets me very irritated it's who I am and he provided very good information. Unlike your PSY video.
> Also Jokeing should be joking.


LoL you do not even get the Joke LoL...

The joke had nothing to do with his info it was to listen to that girl sing and look at the hot chics.. >.>

Do not make me Point you at my Avatar Bro..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> Hi fellas... long time listener first time caller.
> 
> Is there any feedback regarding performance degradation over time? I had read somewhere else that some delidders were reporting increased temperatures as time went on.
> Anyway, thanks to you all for your very valuable and helpful information. It seems I've read every single post while doing some bench runs. If I can just pull the trigger perhaps I can join the club as well.


performance degradation over time..well , time will tell i guess, cant say much after 5-6 months of usage..
for me, i did some crazy stuff with mine, like 5.4ghz with 1.750V vcore on it ..on air!
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2541182
few times 1.6V vcore etc..
i dont notice any degration yet, dont need more voltage to get the same OC..

i think increased temps will happen to any proc over time, dust, compound getting less etc..
but again, i cant say yet, maybe in 1 year, i have more/better answers..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> performance degradation over time..well , time will tell i guess, cant say much after 5-6 months of usage..
> for me, i did some crazy stuff with mine, like 5.4ghz with 1.750V vcore on it ..on air!
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2541182
> few times 1.6V vcore etc..
> i dont notice any degration yet, dont need more voltage to get the same OC..
> i think increased temps will happen to any proc over time, dust, compound getting less etc..
> but again, i cant say yet, maybe in 1 year, i have more/better answers..


I do not see the Solder like tims having much of an issue if the cores are making correct seat to the IHS closing what is on the die off from anything getting between it and the IHS.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> You do indeed kick some serious a$$!


btw your sig says a 3870K might wanna fix that ^.^
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL you do not even get the Joke LoL...
> The joke had nothing to do with his info it was to listen to that girl sing and look at the hot chics.. >.>
> Do not make me Point you at my Avatar Bro..


There wasn't even a joke with that video comment after a delidding video at all. You stated I learned more from a music video than someone showing a completely relevant topic on theis thread about delidding a processor using only a blade to start and a even safer way of using a credit card to get the rest of the glue off. There is by no means a joke their at all. You "jokes also do come off a bit harsh sometimes like in the 3930K vs 3570K thread







Which shouldn't have been brought up here in the first place. we don't need to "persuade" a person to choose what we think is right. he just wanted recommendations not a fist fight of who knows more about processors.

Anyways that topic is done.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *btw your sig says a 3870K* might wanna fix that ^.^
> There wasn't even a joke with that video comment after a delidding video at all. You stated I learned more from a music video than someone showing a completely relevant topic on theis thread about delidding a processor using only a blade to start and a even safer way of using a credit card to get the rest of the glue off. There is by no means a joke their at all. You "jokes also do come off a bit harsh sometimes like in the 3930K vs 3570K thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which shouldn't have been brought up here in the first place. we don't need to "persuade" a person to choose what we think is right. he just wanted recommendations not a fist fight of who knows more about processors.
> Anyways that topic is done.


where on earth do u see that i see 3770k

I like to debate and im quite good at it....

i will not let someone be lied to and waste hundreds of dollars for nothing.

When people have been lied to for so long it is nice to shine the light on the truth then dis prove the ppl feeding false info it is what forums are all about.


----------



## itinerant

Thanks V and Dutch... good points.

Currently trying to find a VERY thin card (like in the video Dutch showed).

Going over the gotchyas and tips again, but trying to work up the nerve to do this.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> Thanks V and Dutch... good points.
> Currently trying to find a VERY thin card (like in the video Dutch showed).
> Going over the gotchyas and tips again, but trying to work up the nerve to do this.


one thing ive learned on this forum and de-lidding,

take your time

really, the de-lidding takes maybe 15 to 30 min, did mine in 10 tho,
but i prepared for a month, reading, watching vid's, trying to get it all in my head,
and yes,. i was nervous as hell, but well prepared, so was easy for me









i knew within a week of purchase i wanted to delid,
at 4.5ghz and running prime gave me 105C,
shut down a core, and started to throttle the others to 80% i think

now i can run prime at 4.9ghz,
and 79C on the hottest core


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> Thanks V and Dutch... good points.
> Currently trying to find a VERY thin card (like in the video Dutch showed).
> Going over the gotchyas and tips again, but trying to work up the nerve to do this.


Really Easy to do if you take your time and be careful.. Take a break if your hands get tired i took many..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> where on earth do u see that i see 3770k
> I like to debate and im quite good at it....
> i will not let someone be lied to and waste hundreds of dollars for nothing.
> When people have been lied to for so long it is nice to shine the light on the truth then dis prove the ppl feeding false info it is what forums are all about.


re read my post on the 3870K....it was to someone else silly.

I understand with the charts and such and providing correct information...just say it nicer and not so.....ummm....pushily i guess i can call it lol. thats how it comes off to me atleast.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> re read my post on the 3870K....it was to someone else silly.
> I understand with the charts and such and providing correct information...just say it nicer and not so.....ummm....pushily i guess i can call it lol. thats how it comes off to me atleast.


You never been in any debates then being nice = fail sauce ..

Meh i do it over 5 forums on each multi times a day i rather enjoy it.. maybe when im old ill run for Local office @[email protected]


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it where several applications, and i used AS5 for years, never had any problem applying it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maybe this pic will give better "proof",
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 350 tests, on 11 forums, as well from 10 website reviews..
> guess i can say the same, what does one user experience proof?


That pic doesn't prove anything. Other than maybe the viral marketing on the forums from hidden focus group members thats gotten people banned on Hardforum. Stuff like that works.

I will say this, in the threads that I've seen on hardforum a lot of people seem to have had the same less than stellar impression from their experience with ICD. That paste is highly over rated due to the focus group members advertising on the forums.

I see no real reason to use AS5 these days. Its thick, its a pain to clean up, its capacitive, and its not really among the better performers. Skinnee labs testing pretty much says the same thing. Its not a bad option at all though.

According to skinnee labs testing and most other tests for that matter there isn't any more of a difference than a couple of degrees in most pastes and that includes indigo extreme.

I honestly think that differences in prepping, and applications will make far more of a difference with delidding than what paste that you actually use. I think that where indigo does do well is that its more forgiving with poor contact and skinnee labs testing seems to back that up. If there is that large of a difference between indigo and another tim then odds are that means you have poor contact. Correcting that and using a normal paste may actually result in better temps.


----------



## soundrats

In tribute to the god of speed: I said that I had bad debiris on my IHS after failed tries with Indigo Extrem. I accepted that and put the things back together - but temps higher then before. Of course! Today I bought car polish paste for steal and copper and cleaned the IHS till it was shining like a little piece of gold. The DIE I cleaned only with QTips which I dived in soap water, no more alcohol or other agressive stuff. The top of the IHS and the Copper of the cooler I cleaned also with that polish and soap water. Then I used Coollaboratory Liquid on the DIE and ARTIC MX4 between IHS and cooler. The effect was drastic the temps went down dramatically. I made a quick OOCT TEST with 4.8 and 1.4 vcore and the max temp was always below 60. It was really a pitty that Indigo Extrem does not work, maybe I use in a next operation Coollaboratory Liquid also between IHS and cooler. Should be better then Arctic.
Cheers Tom


----------



## Powermonkey500

I'd like to join your ranks








Huge success!

CPU: i5-3570k
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.9GHz (work in progress)
Temp drops: 22C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548968


----------



## kgtuning

@ Powermonkey500 awesome job. good to see another delid.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> @ Powermonkey500 awesome job. good to see another delid.


Thank you








I'm currently overclocking - already at 5GHz!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Thank you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm currently overclocking - already at 5GHz!


very cool, I'm running prime at 4.9...going for 24 hour "stable"
I know a lot of people that only run 12 or less but I feel better about it if I do 24 hours. lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *soundrats*
> 
> In tribute to the god of speed: I said that I had bad debiris on my IHS after failed tries with Indigo Extrem. I accepted that and put the things back together - but temps higher then before. Of course! Today I bought car polish paste for steal and copper and cleaned the IHS till it was shining like a little piece of gold. The DIE I cleaned only with QTips which I dived in soap water, no more alcohol or other agressive stuff. The top of the IHS and the Copper of the cooler I cleaned also with that polish and soap water. Then I used Coollaboratory Liquid on the DIE and ARTIC MX4 between IHS and cooler. The effect was drastic the temps went down dramatically. I made a quick OOCT TEST with 4.8 and 1.4 vcore and the max temp was always below 60. It was really a pitty that Indigo Extrem does not work, maybe I use in a next operation Coollaboratory Liquid also between IHS and cooler. Should be better then Arctic.
> Cheers Tom


Great results man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Thank you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm currently overclocking - already at 5GHz!


Wow! Great chip there...that's prime stable for 6hs with 5min duration tests at least? If so, you can go really high if the voltage wall doesn't hit too soon.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Great results man!
> Wow! Great chip there...that's prime stable for 6hs with 5min duration tests at least? If so, you can go really high if the voltage wall doesn't hit too soon.


It's passed IBT. I'll be doing some longer tests soon.
I haven't seen anyone directly answer this question - how high can I crank voltage before risking damage?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> It's passed IBT. I'll be doing some longer tests soon.
> I haven't seen anyone directly answer this question - how high can I crank voltage before risking damage?


1.5v


----------



## Powermonkey500

Well damn, I'm at 1.6v. Hahahahahaha.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Well damn, I'm at 1.6v. Hahahahahaha.


yeah turn it down a bit. lol. don't want to burn it down.


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.5v


Intel's max vid rang is 1.52. Due to vdroop the actual max voltage under load that you should be pushing to the chip is much less than that. Probably closer to 1.4v. I've degraded cpus in the past.


----------



## soundrats

Here you find all you need
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards
Tom


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> It's passed IBT. I'll be doing some longer tests soon.
> I haven't seen anyone directly answer this question - how high can I crank voltage before risking damage?


Its 1.55vcore actually and that's right from intels page. You could do a suicide run like me and VonDutch and join us 5.4 Ghzers lol its took us 1.752 vcore....we need to dice or Ln2 Von!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Max reccomended on air/water is 1.45v, Intel's max vid chart tops at 1.52v which doesn't mean it's safe at all...Just that they didn't bother to test further, what's tested is the tjmax and stock turbo multis' vid ranges, that's all.
You can always get the tuning plan warranty in case you screw up, or not.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Max reccomended on air/water is 1.45v, Intel's max vid chart tops at 1.52v which doesn't mean it's safe at all...Just that they didn't bother to test further, what's tested is the tjmax and stock turbo multis' vid ranges, that's all.
> You can always get the tuning plan warranty in case you screw up, or not.


Delidding voids that warranty too, unfortunately.


----------



## Hokies83

LoL Steam is weird i was getting steam Game crashes with HT off.. turn it back on it is fine.. but means be running 1.53v O well..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Delidding voids that warranty too, unfortunately.


Little black rubber glue reinstates that warranty


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah I know...For more than 1.45v you need DICE or LN2 to be safe.

Hey Valgaur, you need a pot man


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah I know...For more than 1.45v you need DICE or LN2 to be safe.


I'm at almost 1.6v (1.58) and my temps don't exceed 80C. Does that still hold true?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I'm at almost 1.6v (1.58) and my temps don't exceed 80C. Does that still hold true?


No one really knows, but I think it's pushing it for 24/7. You can bench and fool around, of course, but don't run prime95 for hours at more than1.45v. I wouldn't risk it...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I'm at almost 1.6v (1.58) and my temps don't exceed 80C. Does that still hold true?


Id stay below 1.55v and try to stay as close to 1.5c as you can. .. im at 1.53v myself..


----------



## PCWargamer

OK. Good news is the new 3770K POSTs and boots right up.









But, the bad news is using the same BIOS profiles from my old 3770K it uses ~0.13v higher! Not what I was hoping for.









My 4.5 prime stable profile used to run at 1.232v, but the new chip runs that same profile at 1.36v!

And it takes more vcore to reach 5.0GHz, and no go yet on 5.1, much less the 5.241......using my saved max OC profile that worked for my old chip.

But, the system runs! MBs OK. I'll keep playing with it and see what I can get it to do as I have only had it a couple of hours so far.









http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548928


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> OK. Good news is the new 3770K POSTs and boots right up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But, the bad news is using the same BIOS profiles from my old 3770K it uses ~0.13v higher! Not what I was hoping for.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My 4.5 prime stable profile used to run at 1.232v, but the new chip runs that same profile at 1.36v!
> And it takes more vcore to reach 5.0GHz, and no go yet on 5.1, much less the 5.241......using my saved max OC profile that worked for my old chip.
> But, the system runs! MBs OK. I'll keep playing with it and see what I can get it to do as I have only had it a couple of hours so far.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548928


That sucks...

Get some black rubber glue and put the ihs back on the gold chip and return it and get another see if u get a good one..


----------



## Powermonkey500

Fell back to 4.9GHz. It takes substantially less VCore.
For some reason, 5GHz was working and passing every test I threw at it, but a lot of my applications were crashing. Normal?
Anyway, 4.9GHz looks to be the upper limit of my chip without having to crank the voltage a huge amount for only 100MHz.


----------



## Hokies83

Woah Amd is no longer making Cpus for PC's..

Do or Die: AMD Moves Away From PCs Amid Steep Losses
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ultramobile-tablet-apu-cpu,18546.html


----------



## ivanlabrie

Whoa! That's remarkably odd...I thought they would focus on APU's and not discrete cpu without igpu.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Woah Amd is no longer making Cpus for PC's..
> Do or Die: AMD Moves Away From PCs Amid Steep Losses
> http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ultramobile-tablet-apu-cpu,18546.html


I think they're just cutting back.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Whoa! That's remarkably odd...I thought they would focus on APU's and not discrete cpu without igpu.


There done Means Intel going to get Lazy and expensive now @[email protected]
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I think they're just cutting back.


But it looks like AMD gave up it's fab at the worst time. If they still had the fab, maybe they would be really attractive to buyers. Now, all they own is IP, and you have to wonder if they will just die and various groups will pick their corpse for morsels to take.

On the more positive side, it will be interesting to see the phone and tablet market heat-up as both AMD and Intel step in. I am pretty pessimistic on AMD re-gaining much of their server market though. With ARM low-power servers on the horizon, and Intel still owning the sector, I just don't see much of a market for them there.

There no longer making Cpu's for desktops...


----------



## neopunx

Since I installed the new bios,1616, I am unable to overclock at all, with the exception of Asus Default OC. Then I switched back to 1504, and it still wont let me OC. Any thoughts?

edit: well I finally got my 1504 back and working agian, my OC is back to pre flash, but I could never get 1616 to work right. Oh well.....Asus FIX your ****E!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Since I installed the new bios,1616, I am unable to overclock at all, with the exception of Asus Default OC. Then I switched back to 1504, and it still wont let me OC. Any thoughts?


Totally erase BIOS and set it back to default and then try to OC again from there - but you probably already tried that

Try letting the auto OC app see what it can do - maybe it will change something in BIOS you may have overlooked???


----------



## neopunx

A. Have no idea how to totaly erase BIOS. Im looking in the manual, but dont see it. Can you explain?

B. I dont see anything diff, except it keeps wanting to throw my BLCK to 103 when it used to be 102.5.


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> btw your sig says a 3870K might wanna fix that ^.^


A8-3870K is a valid AMD Chip. I had to check on that, confused me for a sec....I love their GPUs, but never had one of their CPUs.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Its 1.55vcore actually and that's right from intels page. You could do a suicide run like me and VonDutch and join us 5.4 Ghzers lol its took us 1.752 vcore....we need to dice or Ln2 Von!











Dont forget me....geeze, just cause I don't have a sweet Jim Carrey avatar.


----------



## itinerant

Guys, I disassembled my PC and started, and finally came to the conclusion I don't have the manual precision required to do this with a sharp object (that shhht is REALLY SMALL IRL)

For those who have done it... would dental floss work? Would it mitigate the chance of scratching the PCB, and more importantly, could it cut through the glue?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> Guys, I disassembled my PC and started, and finally came to the conclusion I don't have the manual precision required to do this with a sharp object (that shhht is REALLY SMALL IRL)
> For those who have done it... would dental floss work? Would it mitigate the chance of scratching the PCB, and more importantly, could it cut through the glue?


Getting it started with a blade then using a Credit card looks like a good option.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> Guys, I disassembled my PC and started, and finally came to the conclusion I don't have the manual precision required to do this with a sharp object (that shhht is REALLY SMALL IRL)
> For those who have done it... would dental floss work? Would it mitigate the chance of scratching the PCB, and more importantly, could it cut through the glue?


Could be done...heat it at first, run prime95 for 30 min or so, wait a few minutes and try again.
I'd try getting a thin but not too soft plastic card like in that video. I wouldn't wanna risk cutting the die with the string, not sure if possible though.


----------



## Systemlord

Does anyone know where to get Holt's Black Sealer and that super thin metal card? The metal card must be similar to a Feeler Gauge, link *here*. Feeler gauges are used on older cars to adjust the valve gap when performing a valve job, I once used a feeler gauge on my 1980 Datsun 200SX. S= Sport & X= 4 wheel disk brakes.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> That pic doesn't prove anything. Other than maybe the viral marketing on the forums from hidden focus group members thats gotten people banned on Hardforum. Stuff like that works.
> I will say this, in the threads that I've seen on hardforum a lot of people seem to have had the same less than stellar impression from their experience with ICD. That paste is highly over rated due to the focus group members advertising on the forums.
> I see no real reason to use AS5 these days. Its thick, its a pain to clean up, its capacitive, and its not really among the better performers. Skinnee labs testing pretty much says the same thing. Its not a bad option at all though.
> According to skinnee labs testing and most other tests for that matter there isn't any more of a difference than a couple of degrees in most pastes and that includes indigo extreme.
> I honestly think that differences in prepping, and applications will make far more of a difference with delidding than what paste that you actually use. I think that where indigo does do well is that its more forgiving with poor contact and skinnee labs testing seems to back that up. If there is that large of a difference between indigo and another tim then odds are that means you have poor contact. Correcting that and using a normal paste may actually result in better temps.




kk, maybe that pic doesnt proof anything, so i went to the skinnee lab website to check out
what youre talking about..

they did some testing with AS5 and others,
which resulted in, 72.40C for AS5
Artic Cooling MX-2, 71.46C
and the best of the test, indigo extreme, 70.66C

so yea.. just a few degrees between them, i never said AS5 was the best compound out there,
ive tested myself tho, the difference between using AS5 on the Die, and after that Liquid pro on the Die,
20+C difference between the two..

what i do tell people is, on the Die its important to have a high w/mk tim,
liquid pro has one of the highest w/mk's out there, 82 w/mk..
the compounds were talking about have a w/mk roughly between 2 and 10 w/mk..

about prepping, and applying tim's,
well, one guy tested that too, he put a hair on it, made some nice fingerprints..lol
he only noticed a few degrees difference.. funny right









any good compound will do *on* the IHS, and eventually on the base plate cooler..
on the Die tho, its a different story, the heat dispersion area is so much smaller then the on the IHS,
thats where the high w/mk story comes in again ..lol
solder has a w/mk between 30 and 60w/mk,
like i said before, other compounds between 2 and 10w/mk max,
the winner in this regard is ..liqiud pro 82w/mk


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> Guys, I disassembled my PC and started, and finally came to the conclusion I don't have the manual precision required to do this with a sharp object (that shhht is REALLY SMALL IRL)
> For those who have done it... would dental floss work? Would it mitigate the chance of scratching the PCB, and more importantly, could it cut through the glue?


havent seen anyone using it yet, but yea, i think it could work,
like ivanlabrie said , run prime 30 min orso, to warm it, maybe it helps,
the black glue isnt very hard..I thought it was more rubber like, then real glue.

how about normal yarn,

Spool of all purpose sewing thread, closeup shows texture of 2-ply Z-twist mercerized cotton with polyester core.

i remember my mum using some kind of black yarn, which is very strong..let us know your findings if you try it








looks like a 2 man job tho..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I'd like to join your ranks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Huge success!
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.9GHz (work in progress)
> Temp drops: 22C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548968


Accepted


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Does anyone know where to get Holt's Black Sealer and that super thin metal card? The metal card must be similar to a Feeler Gauge, link *here*. Feeler gauges are used on older cars to adjust the valve gap when performing a valve job, I once used a feeler gauge on my 1980 Datsun 200SX. S= Sport & X= 4 wheel disk brakes.


when i clicked your link, i got another idea,

should be easy to get one of those at a local paint store, might do the trick, its thin, not to flexible ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I'd like to join your ranks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Huge success!
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.9GHz (work in progress)
> Temp drops: 22C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548968


Gratz, very nice









o, i just noticed, 1.56V vcore? intel says 1.52V vcore max, 1.55V is max. set by others..
wouldnt recommend that for a daily OC ..lol








1.4V maybe, 1.30-1.35V vcore for daily OC's



we dont know much yet about degradation over longer time,
but better be safe then srry right


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> when i clicked your link, i got another idea,
> 
> should be easy to get one of those at a local paint store, might do the trick, its thin, not to flexible ..


I think the idea behind using those ultra thin metal piece is it might just be the safest way to delid without harming the PCB! Just for the hell of it I pulled my brother's 2001 Pentium 4 1.6GHz CPU out today and this sucker requires (printed on CPU) a Vcore of 1.75V, mind you that's the minumum voltages for this chip! It even has the pins sticking out like AMD's CPU's!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I think the idea behind using those ultra thin metal piece is it might just be the safest way to delid without harming the PCB! Just for the hell of it I pulled my brother's 2001 Pentium 4 1.6GHz CPU out today and this sucker requires (printed on CPU) a Vcore of 1.75V, mind you that's the minumum voltages for this chip! It even has the pins sticking out like AMD's CPU's!


wow 1.75V ..lol, i had my 3770k at that voltage ..haha..shhht









you gonna try de-lid it? with plastic card or thin metal piece?

thought plastic was better then metal, when it comes to scratching the pcb..
maybe im totally wrong, and what the guy is using in the vid, is metal too, doesnt look like it tho..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *itinerant*
> 
> For those who have done it... would dental floss work? Would it mitigate the chance of scratching the PCB, and more importantly, could it cut through the glue?


also, im curious how this would work, or something similar..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Fell back to 4.9GHz. It takes substantially less VCore.
> For some reason, 5GHz was working and passing every test I threw at it, but a lot of my applications were crashing. Normal?
> Anyway, 4.9GHz looks to be the upper limit of my chip without having to crank the voltage a huge amount for only 100MHz.


Because it wasn't a stable over clock.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Gratz, very nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, i just noticed, 1.56V vcore? intel says 1.52V vcore max, 1.55V is max. set by others..
> wouldnt recommend that for a daily OC ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.4V maybe, 1.30-1.35V vcore for daily OC's
> 
> we dont know much yet about degradation over longer time,
> but better be safe then srry right


Yeah, I've cranked it down considerably since that validation was taken. I kind of cranked the voltage then saw how high I could get the multi. Probably not the best way to do it.
Anyway, work in progress. I'll check back with my *decent* voltages and max OC.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Yeah, I've cranked it down considerably since that validation was taken. I kind of cranked the voltage then saw how high I could get the multi. Probably not the best way to do it.
> Anyway, work in progress. I'll check back with my *decent* voltages and max OC.


It's not the best way cause there's a sweetspot to be found, most often than not temps limit your max clock stability, even when delidding, voltage does that...So go in tiny increments and monitor vcore under load in cpu-z , that's what matters.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's not the best way cause there's a sweetspot to be found, most often than not temps limit your max clock stability, even when delidding, voltage does that...So go in tiny increments and monitor vcore under load in cpu-z , that's what matters.


I'm not a patient man.
I reverted back to the proper way, like you're saying - I'll also see if there are any other voltages in play stopping me from hitting 5GHz (PLL maybe?)

Edit: It's funny, I know exactly how to do it, I've done it before, but my impatience leads to my noobiness. Hahaha.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I'm not a patient man.
> I reverted back to the proper way, like you're saying - I'll also see if there are any other voltages in play stopping me from hitting 5GHz (PLL maybe?)
> Edit: It's funny, I know exactly how to do it, I've done it before, but my impatience leads to my noobiness. Hahaha.


Hehehe, happens to everyone...
Internal pll overvoltage helped me a great deal, and leaving pll volts at 1.8v did too. Also try bumping imc voltage 0.005v below vtt. That did a HUGE difference stability wise for me. I could bench at 5ghz no prob, even without delidding.


----------



## neopunx

This by far my favorite thread/club on OCN. Def the Most fun!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> A. Have no idea how to totaly erase BIOS. Im looking in the manual, but dont see it. Can you explain?
> B. I dont see anything diff, except it keeps wanting to throw my BLCK to 103 when it used to be 102.5.


clear CMOS - normally a jumper on the MB or a switch on higher-end boards - totally clears out old saved BIOS settings and profiles - some even take out the on-board battery for 10min to make sure everything saved goes away...check your manual or do a google search on clearing your MB CMOS - hope that helps get your OC back


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> clear CMOS - normally a jumper on the MB or a switch on higher-end boards - totally clears out old saved BIOS settings and profiles - some even take out the on-board battery for 10min to make sure everything saved goes away...check your manual or do a google search on clearing your MB CMOS - hope that helps get your OC back


Yeah, I did that, Stellamonster rec the same thing. Got my old bios to work again, so Rep to both of you. But new bios still wonkie. Oh well, if it ain't broke, don't fix it I guess is the lesson learned here. Thank you.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hehehe, happens to everyone...
> Internal pll overvoltage helped me a great deal, and leaving pll volts at 1.8v did too. Also try bumping imc voltage 0.005v below vtt. That did a HUGE difference stability wise for me. I could bench at 5ghz no prob, even without delidding.


Nice info *ivanlabrie*. I'll give it a try. Have you been able to determine if the problem was your delidding the chip or the MB? I may have missed the outcome/news on how that turned out.....

After my 3770K fatality (and fresh avatar choice), my new 3770K was able to hit 5.1GHz @ 1.48v







- but it BSOD'ed very soon after that. Not even able to run superpi....

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548916

IBT used to do 10 default passes easily & repeatedly at 4.6GHz @ ~1.22v, now it needs to be at ~1.32+v to even run, and it has the hi temps in 90s-100sC that go with that voltage.









Prime95 used to be stable for 18+hrs at 4.5GHz @ 1.232v, but I have yet to get prime to run stable so far with vcore up to 1.33v for 4.6GHz. I'll try higher vcore after work today. Oh joy....

Not a good chip. I also used CL Ultra on it already....







(I know - not a good idea, but I really wanted to try it instead of AS5, and I was opptimistic my chances of a simular or better chip were ~66%!)

But I can still use my computer for gaming and everything else I need to do, just not as much fun doing one of my favorite activities - OC'ing!!!









Still, trying to see how far I can take this chip is a challenge....


----------



## kgtuning

I don't get it. How does that happen? All of a sudden need that much more voltage? Kinda odd.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Nice info *ivanlabrie*. I'll give it a try. Have you been able to determine if the problem was your delidding the chip or the MB? I may have missed the outcome/news on how that turned out.....
> After my 3770K fatality (and fresh avatar choice), my new 3770K was able to hit 5.1GHz @ 1.48v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - but it BSOD'ed very soon after that. Not even able to run superpi....
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548916
> IBT used to do 10 default passes easily & repeatedly at 4.6GHz @ ~1.22v, now it needs to be at ~1.32+v to even run, and it has the hi temps in 90s-100sC that go with that voltage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prime95 used to be stable for 18+hrs at 4.5GHz @ 1.232v, but I have yet to get prime to run stable so far with vcore up to 1.33v for 4.6GHz. I'll try higher vcore after work today. Oh joy....
> Not a good chip. I also used CL Ultra on it already....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I know - not a good idea, but I really wanted to try it instead of AS5, and I was opptimistic my chances of a simular or better chip were ~66%!)
> But I can still use my computer for gaming and everything else I need to do, just not as much fun doing one of my favorite activities - OC'ing!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still, trying to see how far I can take this chip is a challenge....


Keep at it!








I rma'd my mobo, found some bent pins, tried fixing them but it was a no go (I may have broken one or two while at it







)
In one or two weeks I should have it back, and luckily my 3770k survided the pirate surgery.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I don't get it. How does that happen? All of a sudden need that much more voltage? Kinda odd.


Simple, he was testing with IBT. You GOTTA use prime95 blend with 90% ram...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Keep at it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I rma'd my mobo, found some bent pins, tried fixing them but it was a no go (I may have broken one or two while at it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> In one or two weeks I should have it back, and luckily my 3770k survided the pirate surgery.
> Simple, he was testing with IBT. You GOTTA use prime95 blend with 90% ram...


I must have missed something I was thinking before and after delidding and then had to jack up voltage.. I was making assumptions. Lol I always run prime.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I don't get it. How does that happen? All of a sudden need that much more voltage? Kinda odd.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I must have missed something I was thinking before and after delidding and then had to jack up voltage.. I was making assumptions. Lol I always run prime.


Yeah. Only makes sense knowing it is a new chip! My first 3770K did not survive delidding.... So I bought a new 3770K with hopes of getting something better, or at least simular....but no, I got a bottom feeder....


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah. Only makes sense knowing it is a new chip! My first 3770K did not survive delidding.... So I bought a new 3770K with hopes of getting something better, or at least simular....but no, I got a bottom feeder....


I guess that's what I get for reading the thread on my phone while at work....


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Nice info *ivanlabrie*. I'll give it a try. Have you been able to determine if the problem was your delidding the chip or the MB? I may have missed the outcome/news on how that turned out.....
> After my 3770K fatality (and fresh avatar choice), my new 3770K was able to hit 5.1GHz @ 1.48v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - but it BSOD'ed very soon after that. Not even able to run superpi....
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2548916
> IBT used to do 10 default passes easily & repeatedly at 4.6GHz @ ~1.22v, now it needs to be at ~1.32+v to even run, and it has the hi temps in 90s-100sC that go with that voltage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prime95 used to be stable for 18+hrs at 4.5GHz @ 1.232v, but I have yet to get prime to run stable so far with vcore up to 1.33v for 4.6GHz. I'll try higher vcore after work today. Oh joy....
> Not a good chip. I also used CL Ultra on it already....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I know - not a good idea, but I really wanted to try it instead of AS5, and I was opptimistic my chances of a simular or better chip were ~66%!)
> But I can still use my computer for gaming and everything else I need to do, just not as much fun doing one of my favorite activities - OC'ing!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still, trying to see how far I can take this chip is a challenge....


bro, your chip is degrading fast ... at that rate it won't be able to run stock Turbo clocks in less than a month ... just saying, had one of those in past ...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> bro, your chip is degrading fast ... at that rate it won't be able to run stock Turbo clocks in less than a month ... just saying, had one of those in past ...


Not degrading - its a new chip! Replacement for the first one that died during delidding....

This new chip came out of the box this way! Only had it for less than a day......


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Not degrading - its a new chip! Replacement for the first one that died during delidding....
> This new chip came out of the box this way! Only had it for less than a day......


What are you gonna do with the old chip? remember if u do not want it ill takes it...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Simple, he was testing with IBT. You GOTTA use prime95 blend with 90% ram...


man, no offense, but if there is a program that *causes* degradation of the chip at fast rate then all CPUs from Ivy Bridge should be considered faulty and recalled ... it ain't happening though, so it's not the case. why on earth would you think that cpu gets degraded by running a program??? some people use those CPUs for complex scientific calculations (linpack is a very complex calculation it performs on CPU), do you think Intel would release a line of CPUs being aware they can't be used for such purpose? sorry, but it's just silly to think so IMHO.

BTW, the latest Prime95 also uses AVX extensions (same as any current linpack stress tester with AVX) to stress test the CPU, but when using Prime95 it takes 10-20x times LONGER UNDER LOAD to actually prove stability/instability and I'd rather be inclined to say that it's the Prime95 stress testing causing more degradation (much longer under load) than IBT/LinX could ever do (much shorter runs) ...

some chips will degrade when overvolted even if temps are not a big issue (will degrade more if temps are at thermal limits) and some won't, and most of them will also degrade slowly over time, nothing wrong with it, that's how it is


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Not degrading - its a new chip! Replacement for the first one that died during delidding....
> This new chip came out of the box this way! Only had it for less than a day......


gotcha








missed the part it was a replacement, sry








thought your old chip survived somehow and got degraded that bad.


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Gratz, very nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, i just noticed, 1.56V vcore? intel says 1.52V vcore max, 1.55V is max. set by others..
> wouldnt recommend that for a daily OC ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.4V maybe, 1.30-1.35V vcore for daily OC's
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> /spoiler
> we dont know much yet about degradation over longer time,
> but better be safe then srry right


Intel lists 1.52v as the max vid range. VID is not vcore. Loadline is there by spec so introducing loadline which most people do when using those voltages changes things. Under load that 1.52v VID is probably closer to 1.4v. You might want to check out this older anandtech article which explains what loadline can do. I think that it is still relevant.

I don't know where that graph came from that you posted or more importantly where those numbers came from. I know that it wasn't Intel. Looks to me like some one pulled that from their rear end tbh.


----------



## Valgaur

Man we are busy in here lately!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> man, no offense, but if there is a program that *causes* degradation of the chip at fast rate then all CPUs from Ivy Bridge should be considered faulty and recalled ... it ain't happening though, so it's not the case. why on earth would you think that cpu gets degraded by running a program??? some people use those CPUs for complex scientific calculations (linpack is a very complex calculation it performs on CPU), do you think Intel would release a line of CPUs being aware they can't be used for such purpose? sorry, but it's just silly to think so IMHO.
> BTW, the latest Prime95 also uses AVX extensions (same as any current linpack stress tester with AVX) to stress test the CPU, but when using Prime95 it takes 10-20x times LONGER UNDER LOAD to actually prove stability/instability and I'd rather be inclined to say that it's the Prime95 stress testing causing more degradation (much longer under load) than IBT/LinX could ever do (much shorter runs) ...
> some chips will degrade when overvolted even if temps are not a big issue (will degrade more if temps are at thermal limits) and some won't, and most of them will also degrade slowly over time, nothing wrong with it, that's how it is


Hey get off your horse cowboy!









I never said degradation happened in the first place, what I meant is that perhaps he was never really stable to begin with. IBT is NOT a reliable stress test, only good for having a quick guesstimate of your theoretical max temps under load. He eventually had to jack up voltages upon finding instabilities IBT never detected.

But anyway, he has already stated that it's a different chip altogether so case closed.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey get off your horse cowboy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I never said degradation happened in the first place, what I meant is that perhaps he was never really stable to begin with. IBT is NOT a reliable stress test, only good for having a quick guesstimate of your theoretical max temps under load. He eventually had to jack up voltages upon finding instabilities IBT never detected.
> But anyway, he has already stated that it's a different chip altogether so case closed.


LOL! no sweat buddy, not shooting anybody here








was just saying, because I like using IBT, it's much quicker (than Prime) for stability testing and in fact with Ivy Bridge architecture and WHEA warnings in Windows Event Logs, those are my current favorite tools for setting a rock solid stability








I consider rock solid when no WHEA shows up in logs when under load of IBT running at least 20 rounds in Maximum stress mode (using around 14GB out of 16GB RAM). it works this way pretty nicely for me


----------



## feniks

BTW, Liquid Ultra 5g arrived here








tomorrow will get to deliding my 3770K chip, wish me luck








hopefully I will be back with some good news by tomorrow evening


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> BTW, Liquid Ultra 5g arrived here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tomorrow will get to deliding my 3770K chip, wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hopefully I will be back with some good news by tomorrow evening


Good luck!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Good luck!


won't reply, don't wanna jinx it


----------



## Hokies83

Ive seen SB ppl that have Been running 1.55 v core for over a year with no issues.


----------



## Notion

hey peeps, what voltage can one expect @5ghz ?

mine @ 4.8ghz is 1.365 volts.. but when i try 5ghz, I'm @1.5 volts and still freezing.. some of the core will not process prime tests.. doesn't throw any errors but will not complete a test.. is it safe to go above 1.5v for 5ghz?


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> BTW, Liquid Ultra 5g arrived here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tomorrow will get to deliding my 3770K chip, wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hopefully I will be back with some good news by tomorrow evening


good luck and take your time..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> Intel lists 1.52v as the max vid range. VID is not vcore. Loadline is there by spec so introducing loadline which most people do when using those voltages changes things. Under load that 1.52v VID is probably closer to 1.4v. You might want to check out this older anandtech article which explains what loadline can do. I think that it is still relevant.
> I don't know where that graph came from that you posted or more importantly where those numbers came from. I know that it wasn't Intel. Looks to me like some one pulled that from their rear end tbh.


took it from this forum, from the Sin0822 guide








http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end
not sure how his rear end looks ..but hes got some good info in that thread,
maybe you can pm him and ask?

i only use what i come across most, like, if 9 of 10 peeps say the same thing,
and i can find any other info that confirms it, im using it to help others,
i had the same "conflict" with others, about anandtech not being honest, toms hardware etc etc, they all seem to lie all the time,
with their graphics, reviews and what more, i figure , somewhere in all that theres some truth,
i do care about what others experience, or know about any subject..and use it if i think its true








so, the 1.52V is something ive heard alot of times, here and elsewhere..

will look into it tho, i know VID isnt vcore, would be something if its like you say,
" Under load that 1.52v VID is probably closer to 1.4v. "
then putting 1.6V on it, would be about 1.5V ...lol

just copied this too,
"On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max."

well, im contacting intel atm, and will ask them about the max voltage ok


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> good luck and take your time..


will do


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> BTW, Liquid Ultra 5g arrived here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tomorrow will get to deliding my 3770K chip, wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hopefully I will be back with some good news by tomorrow evening


well, i wanted to say good luck to you, but had to answer that other post first ..lol

GOOD LUCK!! may the OCN force be with you..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> hey peeps, what voltage can one expect @5ghz ?
> mine @ 4.8ghz is 1.365 volts.. but when i try 5ghz, I'm @1.5 volts and still freezing.. some of the core will not process prime tests.. doesn't throw any errors but will not complete a test.. is it safe to go above 1.5v for 5ghz?


i wouldnt run it for a daily OC








going above 4.7-4.8ghz needs alot more vcore..
i could get 4.8ghz prime stable , but needed 1.440V vcore..
4.9ghz needed almost, or a bit above 1.5V to make it prime stable..

for testing its ok i guess, i ran 1.750V vcore to get my 5.4ghz validation .lol
and other times 1.6V , and it still works perfect, time will tell if it was a bad thing to do


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i wouldnt run it for a daily OC
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> going above 4.7-4.8ghz needs alot more vcore..
> i could get 4.8ghz prime stable , but needed 1.440V vcore..
> 4.9ghz needed almost, or a bit above 1.5V to make it prime stable..
> for testing its ok i guess, i ran 1.750V vcore to get my 5.4ghz validation .lol
> and other times 1.6V , and it still works perfect, time will tell if it was a bad thing to do


IT WAS WORTH IT BECAUSE.....

Weeeee areeee theee championss my friendssssss. Weee will keep Clockinggggg 'tilll the eeeeeeend.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, i wanted to say good luck to you, but had to answer that other post first ..lol
> GOOD LUCK!! may the OCN force be with you..










letting it in right now, hopefully it suffices to precisely stabilize my hand when working on the chip


----------



## bebimbap

ah I didn't know this club existed, too bad I didn't take any pics before I put everything back together. I don't want to redo everything again though. I didn't think Liquid pro would be THAT much better than AS5 it is crazy good.

But if anyone wanted to know the differences I got in OC i'll do it with temps

always used a NH-D14 cooler
stock - 4.7ghz max 85c+ temps stopped me from getting a stable 4.8
delid + as5 inside and out - 4.9ghz max 1.41v 99c temps stopped me from getting stable 5.0
delid + CL pro inside and ultra outside - 5.1ghz 89c 1.5v, voltage scared me from going higher

From my experience voltage and temps skyrocket after 80c but maybe that's just for my chip
And I also noticed if i do anything else that uses my GPU when i'm doing Prime stability it can cause a whea error. but if i just let it sit there with just prime running it will have no errors.

I did a prime stable test 20+ hours 50x multi of a 3770k on air


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






the power of CL liquid pro/ultra


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wow 1.75V ..lol, i had my 3770k at that voltage ..haha..shhht
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you gonna try de-lid it? with plastic card or thin metal piece?
> thought plastic was better then metal, when it comes to scratching the pcb..
> maybe im totally wrong, and what the guy is using in the vid, is metal too, doesnt look like it tho..
> also, im curious how this would work, or something similar..


CPU Vcore 1.75V.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive seen SB ppl that have Been running 1.55 v core for over a year with no issues.


SB is key...32nm vs 22nm man. Not the same thing...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> BTW, Liquid Ultra 5g arrived here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tomorrow will get to deliding my 3770K chip, wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hopefully I will be back with some good news by tomorrow evening


Have fun! And do post back with results








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bebimbap*
> 
> ah I didn't know this club existed, too bad I didn't take any pics before I put everything back together. I don't want to redo everything again though. I didn't think Liquid pro would be THAT much better than AS5 it is crazy good.
> But if anyone wanted to know the differences I got in OC i'll do it with temps
> always used a NH-D14 cooler
> stock - 4.7ghz max 85c+ temps stopped me from getting a stable 4.8
> delid + as5 inside and out - 4.9ghz max 1.41v 99c temps stopped me from getting stable 5.0
> delid + CL pro inside and ultra outside - 5.1ghz 89c 1.5v, voltage scared me from going higher
> From my experience voltage and temps skyrocket after 80c but maybe that's just for my chip
> And I also noticed if i do anything else that uses my GPU when i'm doing Prime stability it can cause a whea error. but if i just let it sit there with just prime running it will have no errors.
> I did a prime stable test 20+ hours 50x multi of a 3770k on air
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the power of CL liquid pro/ultra


Impressive!


----------



## Hokies83

Borderlands 2 = best stress test ever LoL..









I passed 7hrs of prime 95.. But fail and crash 10 mins of Borderlands 2... Upped the Vcore a notch and have not crashed in BL 2 in 8 hrs of game play since then.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> *SB is key...32nm vs 22nm man. Not the same thing...*
> o


If SB can take 1.55v for a year IB should be able to take 1.6v for a year then.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Borderlands 2 = best stress test ever LoL..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I passed 7hrs of prime 95.. But fail and crash 10 mins of Borderlands 2... Upped the Vcore a notch and have not crashed in BL 2 in 8 hrs of game play since then.


So true! Same happened to me with Saint's Row the third...give that whirl


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If SB can take 1.55v for a year IB should be able to take 1.6v for a year then.


It's the other way around...Remember those 2.2v AMD chips from the 90s? That was a more than a nanomicron, as you reduce the footprint you need less vcore, and the chip tolerates less.
Though, it's been reported that IB chips are much tougher than SB so you might be right anyway


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's the other way around...Remember those 2.2v AMD chips from the 90s? That was a more than a nanomicron, as you reduce the footprint you need less vcore, and the chip tolerates less.
> Though, it's been reported that IB chips are much tougher than SB so you might be right anyway


I think im right from no true reports of degrading from anyone throwing massive volts such as 1.95 and none at all.


----------



## Powermonkey500

The smaller the manufacturing process, the lower the voltage.
The way I see it, you need more electrons to fit through wider (higher nanometer count) channels, but that's just how I remember it with my ignorance of electricity.


----------



## Powermonkey500

There would be degradation over a longer period of time, leading to sooner failure. It's all based on how long you want your CPU to survive.


----------



## ivanlabrie

If we keep our chips cool and don't run 1.5v 24/7 while folding (100% load) I think our chips will live plenty of time...


----------



## Notion

just want the 5ghz been there done that stamp







.. without blowing the darn thing.. so it would be safe to say that if i can get prime to run for 1hr @ 5ghz, wether it be 1.6V on vCore it should in theory be fine.. .
like me having a bad day at the office..


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If we keep our chips cool and don't run 1.5v 24/7 while folding (100% load) I think our chips will live plenty of time...


so if i have it @1.55 vCore it should be fine for daily use as it hardly hit 100%load..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> took it from this forum, from the Sin0822 guide
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end
> not sure how his rear end looks ..but hes got some good info in that thread,
> maybe you can pm him and ask?
> i only use what i come across most, like, if 9 of 10 peeps say the same thing,
> and i can find any other info that confirms it, im using it to help others,
> i had the same "conflict" with others, about anandtech not being honest, toms hardware etc etc, they all seem to lie all the time,
> with their graphics, reviews and what more, i figure , somewhere in all that theres some truth,
> i do care about what others experience, or know about any subject..and use it if i think its true
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so, the 1.52V is something ive heard alot of times, here and elsewhere..
> will look into it tho, i know VID isnt vcore, would be something if its like you say,
> " Under load that 1.52v VID is probably closer to 1.4v. "
> then putting 1.6V on it, would be about 1.5V ...lol
> just copied this too,
> "On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max."
> well, im contacting intel atm, and will ask them about the max voltage ok


i hate chat ..lol, had to wait long time for him to search through all the papers,
i think i will just copy/past the convo in here ....

Please wait for a site operator to respond.

You are now chatting with 'Fred'

Fred: Hello. Thank you for using the Intel Customer Chat Support service. We are glad to be of service. How may I help you?
: hello,
: i have bought a 3770k in may, im a member of a OC forum..
: now someone debates with my the max vcore voltage is not 1.52V vcore ..
: i thought it was the max voltage intel recommended?
: i just want to make sure, so that i dont give wrong answers to questions
: but cant find any conclusive answers online, or on your site
: can you help?

Fred: let me check that information
Fred: Please wait for 2-4 minutes and I will check your concern. Thank you.
: cool thanks








Fred: I need more time to research on this issue. Is it ok if I get back to you in 5 minutes?
: np, i leave this chatbox open ..thanks again
Fred: I found those two documents with technical information about the processor but I am trying find the exact information
Fred: http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/datasheets/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-2-datasheet.pdf
Fred: http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/datasheets/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.pdf
Fred: I am still checking
Fred: thanks
: will read it too ..maybe i can find it faster ..lol
: appreciate your effort..
Fred: thanks

Fred: I think I found it on the second link on page 84, under 7.10.1 Voltage and Current Specifications
: figure 1-2 ? ..o ..ok..
Fred: Table 7-4.
: im looking at it now..

Fred: I do not think this is specified by core
Fred: Each processor is programmed with a maximum valid voltage identification value (VID), which is set at manufacturing and cannot be altered.
: ok..
: well, it does say 1.52V
: max
Fred: 1.5200 maximum and 0.2500 minimum

: im not that technical, all i know is intel stated 1.52V vcore maximum for the 3770K
: well, thanks alot for your help/search ..think i have my answer ...
Fred: the information I can provide is the one that is on those PDF files. you can contact a Field Application Engineer (FAE) so; he/she can give you more information. you can contact a FAE through one of our Authorized Distributors using the following link
Fred: http://premierlocator.intel.com/
: cool, thanks
Fred: you are welcome
Fred: Thank you for using Intel's live chat. If you are satisfied with our support, please score items with 5 in the online survey that will be shown once you close this chat window. We value your feedback and we will use it to improve our services.
: yea, you did a great job, so will answer it ..np


----------



## USFORCES

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> so if i have it @1.55 vCore it should be fine for daily use as it hardly hit 100%load..


Question is, Do you need 1.55 vCore for daily use? If you do then use it if not I wouldn't use more then needed.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> so if i have it @1.55 vCore it should be fine for daily use as it hardly hit 100%load..


its not the 100% load, or temps, but its the maximum of 1.52V,
of course, if you have a car that runs 200kmph, and you drive it 190 all the time,
it shouldbe ok right, but that old lady with the same car only drives 100,
will her car wear out slower?

(not sure if i say that correct, wear out)

o w8, the first car has a turbo boost build in it, so it can drive 220,
but its still a normal standard car, you think its good to drive that fast all the time 24/7 ? ....LOL


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its not the 100% load, or temps, but its the maximum of 1.52V,
> of course, if you have a car that runs 200kmph, and you drive it 190 all the time,
> it shouldbe ok right, but that old lady with the same car only drives 100,
> will her car wear out slower?
> (not sure if i say that correct, wear out)


yeah true point taken, ..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *USFORCES*
> 
> Question is, Do you need 1.55 vCore for daily use? If you do then use it if not I wouldn't use more then needed.


Hmm not really, but i like things to be optimum ..









Guess i will stick with 4.8ghz @1.36v kinda seems like it is best for this chip i have..

Thanks for the replies!

Anyone know what the next Gen of chips are gonna be like?


----------



## Hokies83

Nvidia states 1.175v is the Max for kepler but people push all the way to 1.35c for 24/7 use..

So take it with a grain of salt until there are some factual reports.. we need to go off our gut feelings and do what we want with our chips.. for me that is 1.6v Max 24/7.. But i will tell another 1.55v and they can choose to go higher or lower from there.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> yeah true point taken, ..
> Hmm not really, but i like things to be optimum ..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Guess i will stick with 4.8ghz @1.36v kinda seems like it is best for this chip i have..
> Thanks for the replies!
> Anyone know what the next Gen of chips are gonna be like?


10-20% performance Jump perfected 22NM and 3D transistors

Igpu twice as fast as well... Should blow SB-E out of the water clock for clock.

Should clock better then SB and IB should have Lower temps and Vcore then SB with huge overclocking head room for temps..

Kinda like delided IBs but most likely a tad better temps wise.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Nvidia states 1.175v is the Max for kepler but people push all the way to 1.35c for 24/7 use..
> So take it with a grain of salt until there are some factual reports.. we need to go off our gut feelings and do what we want with our chips.. for me that is 1.6v Max 24/7.. But i will tell another 1.55v and they can choose to go higher or lower from there.
> 10-20% performance Jump perfected 22NM and 3D transistors
> Igpu twice as fast as well... Should blow SB-E out of the water clock for clock.


well, your avatar suits you, the word "mad" has 2 meanings ..lol..jk


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Guess i will stick with 4.8ghz @1.36v kinda seems like it is best for this chip i have..


thats a very nice daily OC you have








im sticking with 1.3-1.35V vcore max for my daily usage..

man, i was just thinking, when i joined OCN, i wanted to have a 4.5ghz oc with a nice 1.25V vcore ..lol
now i pumped 1.75V vcore through it, and got to 5.4ghz ..








i blame Valgaur...lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, your avatar suits you, the word "mad" has 2 meanings ..lol..jk


Guess u never read my Review on Kepler Voltage @[email protected]

Nvidia Locking volts cause they do not want to eat all the RMA's from degrading chips..

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313300/nvidia-forcing-voltage-locking-600-700-series-discussion-thread/0_20#post_18307977

I can also point out the fact that a Cpu is a hell of alot tougher then a gpu.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yep, in the end it's up to you...1.45v is reported as safe, but with regular 'stock' glued ihs chips. Ours run much cooler, so perhaps they behave differently.
One safer way would be to use offsets and turbo, with speedstep and c1e enabled.
That way our chips would reduce vcore to 0.9v at 1.6ghz during idle periods, and jump to 5ghz at 1.5v f.ex. when needed.
Again, I wouldn't fold at more than 1.4v, but I would definitely go much higher for benching


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats a very nice daily OC you have
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im sticking with 1.3-1.35V vcore max for my daily usage..


yeah.. makes better sense than 1.5v+ for 5ghz.. considering that extra 200hz is costing alot of voltage..!

strange how much of a jump it is though.. oh well.. all is going ok and hope it remains for the mean time









Has to be said though.. Ivy Bridge is a complete shambles considering what you have to go through to get good temps and an ok OC.


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yep, in the end it's up to you...1.45v is reported as safe, but with regular 'stock' glued ihs chips. Ours run much cooler, so perhaps they behave differently.
> One safer way would be to use offsets and turbo, with speedstep and c1e enabled.
> That way our chips would reduce vcore to 0.9v at 1.6ghz during idle periods, and jump to 5ghz at 1.5v f.ex. when needed.
> Again, I wouldn't fold at more than 1.4v, but I would definitely go much higher for benching


sounds like a plan..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yep, in the end it's up to you...1.45v is reported as safe, but with regular 'stock' glued ihs chips. Ours run much cooler, so perhaps they behave differently.
> One safer way would be to use offsets and turbo, with speedstep and c1e enabled.
> That way our chips would reduce vcore to 0.9v at 1.6ghz during idle periods, and jump to 5ghz at 1.5v f.ex. when needed.
> Again, I wouldn't fold at more than 1.4v, but I would definitely go much higher for benching


I have almost 24hrs of prime 95 under my belt and cpu still hits my old OCs with 100% success.

Until degrading is reported you can not throw out a number what is safe and what is not.... Unless it is some un godly vCore of 1.7v +

Anywho the road map >.>


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Guess u never read my Review on Kepler Voltage @[email protected]
> Nvidia Locking volts cause they do not want to eat all the RMA's from degrading chips..
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313300/nvidia-forcing-voltage-locking-600-700-series-discussion-thread/0_20#post_18307977
> I can also point out the fact that a Cpu is a hell of alot tougher then a gpu.


no man srry,. i have to read so many things,
im still very new to ocing and intel cpu's..
but im a fast learner


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> no man srry,. i have to read so many things,
> im still very new to ocing and intel cpu's..
> but im a fast learner


Joo Learn more lurking over in AnAndtech forums then you can here cough cough..

If you really wanna learn in depth about it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Joo Learn more lurking over in AnAndtech forums then you can here cough cough..
> If you really wanna learn in depth about it.


o, im all over forums, only this forum ive joined, and im glad i did


----------



## ivanlabrie

Wise words man...

You go all Rambo with voltage cause you don't care and are rich lol
Or Intel's RMA loves you xD

Hey quick question, do they ask for a proof of purchase for replacing your chip there? In Argentina they wanted a receipt, but I don't have it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> yeah.. makes better sense than 1.5v+ for 5ghz.. considering that extra 200hz is costing alot of voltage..!
> strange how much of a jump it is though.. oh well.. all is going ok and hope it remains for the mean time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Has to be said though.. Ivy Bridge is a complete shambles considering what you have to go through to get good temps and an ok OC.


yea, and the speedgain for every 100mhz above 4.5ghz is only about 3%,
didnt get that number from somewhere else, but noticed it myself, to be clear ..lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Even the stock 3.9ghz boost is really strong lol...we just can't get enough


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Wise words man...
> You go all Rambo with voltage cause you don't care and are rich lol
> Or Intel's RMA loves you xD
> Hey quick question, do they ask for a proof of purchase for replacing your chip there? In Argentina they wanted a receipt, but I don't have it.


Intels warranty covers over clocking..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Intels warranty covers over clocking..


You never answered my question man. Do they ask for a receipt?


----------



## Valgaur

So much......to....read.....oh my lord! and Hokeis with that 24rs of prime gratz on that but for myself who has Oc'ed a lot higher and been at 1.4v for 4.8 for 3 months I actually have been getting a bit of stability issues from folding for my 4.8 Ghz at 1.4 vcore. I'm still trying to figure it out exactly to see if it was instability or some weird work unit that stressed it to much to fail (happens sometimes) So thats why I'm kinda holding back a little bit more even just to make sure.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Intels warranty covers over clocking..


they dont/didnt normally, but if you have the New Warranty Plan they will,

quote

"devices damaged by overclocking up to now have not been covered by warranties. Intel Corp. has decided to change that.

Intel on Wednesday introduced a new pilot plan targeted at the enthusiast community.
The new pilot service plan for "K", "X", and LGA2011-socketed boxed processors called the performance tuning protection plan (PTPP)
provide certain out-of-warranty service offerings in the event of damage caused by overclocking or overvoltaging by the user.
Available at the cost between $20 and $35 (depending on microprocessor),
the plan enables user to receive a *one-time replacement processor if the user's overvoltaging or overclocking* causes the original processor to fail."

end quote


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So much......to....read.....oh my lord! and Hokeis with that 24rs of prime gratz on that but for myself who has Oc'ed a lot higher and been at 1.4v for 4.8 for 3 months I actually have been getting a bit of stability issues from folding for my 4.8 Ghz at 1.4 vcore. I'm still trying to figure it out exactly to see if it was instability or some weird work unit that stressed it to much to fail (happens sometimes) So thats why I'm kinda holding back a little bit more even just to make sure.


Ive been Higher then that Since April lol..

Check ram.. first as that is the normal cause.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> they dont/didnt normally, but if you have the New Warranty Plan they will,
> quote
> "devices damaged by overclocking up to now have not been covered by warranties. Intel Corp. has decided to change that.
> Intel on Wednesday introduced a new pilot plan targeted at the enthusiast community.
> The new pilot service plan for "K", "X", and LGA2011-socketed boxed processors called the performance tuning protection plan (PTPP)
> provide certain out-of-warranty service offerings in the event of damage caused by overclocking or overvoltaging by the user.
> Available at the cost between $20 and $35 (depending on microprocessor),
> the plan enables user to receive a *one-time replacement processor if the user's overvoltaging or overclocking* causes the original processor to fail."
> end quote


Intel would have to invest in an employee to test and investagate that it died from Over clocking..
That is not Cost effective .. So i see it as long as u do not tell them.. they have no reason to refuse you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You never answered my question man. Do they ask for a receipt?


You need invoice / receipt .


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive been Higher then that Since April lol..
> Check ram.. first as that is the normal cause.
> Intel would have to invest in an employee to test and investagate that it died from Over clocking..
> That is not Cost effective .. So i see it as long as u do not tell them.. they have no reason to refuse you.
> You need invoice / receipt .


it worked fine for months....and then i made my 1.75 vcore run silly


----------



## ivanlabrie

Dang, I'm screwed...I'll have to shoot myself if my processor is dead then :/


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it worked fine for months....and then i made my 1.75 vcore run silly


Well that 1.75v core thing was kinda dumb..









Any who.. id point more towards ram or glitch with the folding.

Also i read that the AnAndtech reviewer seems to think the Malaysia chips have a Stronger IMC and the Costa rica chips seem to overclock with less volts..


----------



## Notion

S in principle if i blow this little beauty up and just glue IHS back on then send it to intel They will send me a new one obviously with the proof of purchase.. I have no extended warranty.. do they offer that warranty in the UK?

The place i bought it from, are very savy and check everything with a fine comb.. hence suggestion of sending to Intel..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Well that 1.75v core thing was kinda dumb..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any who.. id point more towards ram or glitch with the folding.
> Also i read that the AnAndtech reviewer seems to think the Malaysia chips have a Stronger IMC and the Costa rica chips seem to overclock with less volts..


That reviewer seems to be spot on, mine has a weaker imc but clocks with less volts than most... :/


----------



## stellamonster7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, and the speedgain for every 100mhz above 4.5ghz is only about 3%,
> didnt get that number from somewhere else, but noticed it myself, to be clear ..lol


so VonDutch you say another 300MHz is almost 10% performance increase, that's nothing to shrug off when someone is only at 4.5GHz. With what apps, what kind of data can you provide since you know I've said that I can't get stable past 4.6GHz due to temps without delid? I really need proof that it's not only a "push this as far as it can go" attitude for us, but some real-world applications that say I'll get more out day to day.

delid seems like a large time investment for me to conduct patiently and slowly to not screw up. my windows are small b/c I've got Stella every night I come home. I've seen many quoted here and other places that say it's really just e-peen for anything over 4.5GHz when it comes to day to day gains. so please... continue your thought...


----------



## beniroc

Well gave up on 5.5ghz voltage was getting crazy, was up to 1.76v no go. Working on 5.1 12 hour prime stable. Oh well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> so VonDutch you say another 300MHz is almost 10% performance increase, that's nothing to shrug off when someone is only at 4.5GHz. With what apps, what kind of data can you provide since you know I've said that I can't get stable past 4.6GHz due to temps without delid? I really need proof that it's not only a "push this as far as it can go" attitude for us, but some real-world applications that say I'll get more out day to day.
> delid seems like a large time investment for me to conduct patiently and slowly to not screw up. my windows are small b/c I've got Stella every night I come home. I've seen many quoted here and other places that say it's really just e-peen for anything over 4.5GHz when it comes to day to day gains. so please... continue your thought...


More cpu Helps with Encoding Borderlands 2 and Battle field 3..

I play both those games and work with video sometimes so it means something to me









Also 100mhz depending on the task at hand is anywhere from 2% to 5% per 100mhz


----------



## kgtuning

Here's my latest prime95 run


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Here's my latest prime95 run


Nice chip go higher!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Nice chip go higher!


Thanks, when I go on vacation the last week of october I am going to go for 5 ghz 24/7 "stable" but voltage may get too high.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Thanks, when I go on vacation the last week of october I am going to go for 5 ghz 24/7 "stable" but voltage may get too high.


If you can do 4.9ghz with 1.295 V 5ghz should be a cake walk at 1.4v


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If you can do 4.9ghz with 1.295 V 5ghz should be a cake walk at 1.4v


hope so but I'm very new to overclocking... so we will see how 5 ghz goes.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> hope so but I'm very new to overclocking... so we will see how 5 ghz goes.


You missed the old days then...

1366 socket took alot of tweaking and skill to overclock... you had to change about 8 things up and down back and forth to get it to work.. Sb/Ib is noob OC friendly.. Vcore and Multi lol









I had the cream of the cream i7 920s ran at 1.5v @ 5ghz for over a year and sold about 6 months ago to a member here who continues to run it at 5ghz 24/7.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You missed the old days then...
> 1366 socket took alot of tweaking and skill to overclock... you had to change about 8 things to get it to work.. Sb/Ib is noob OC friendly.. Vcore and Multi lol


Yeah this is the first chip I've ever overclocked. But I did have someone teaching me along the way.


----------



## Lobsterman

Coolaboratorys Liquid Ultra with 3770k appplied!








taken on Nokia 1680 Classic


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guy with 4.9ghz chip at 1.296v...you GOTTA push that chip higher, otherwise I'll personally hunt you down and steal your cpu lol








jk
No, really, that's a bloody great chip you have there


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Coolaboratorys Liquid Ultra with 3770k appplied!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> taken on Nokia 1680 Classic


Nice!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yep, pcb looks healthy









Good luck!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guy with 4.9ghz chip at 1.296v...you GOTTA push that chip higher, otherwise I'll personally hunt you down and steal your cpu lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jk
> No, really, that's a bloody great chip you have there


lmao, trust me it's going as high as it will go but 24/7 stable.


----------



## ivanlabrie

4.9ghz is plenty for 24/7...but well, I'd go for more, me myself. Doesn't mean you should too xD


----------



## Valgaur

I think imma make a 5.5 run tonight quick

I want that 2ghz club man. And my h100 will get me their vccio for bclk right ivan? (I remembered who you were this time lol)


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol I have a new avatar and all..same I use at OCF and EVGA.
My pet bird, Burd!









Yeah, vtt is what you need...the vicinity of 1.2v and vccsa at 1.195v should do fine for 106bclk, with some cold.
I'd reccomend you to put some paper towels around your socket and some rags or vaseline too, and submerge your h100 radiator inside a bucket of ice, or better yet dry ice.
You should be able to get 5.7ghz like that! xD


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol I have a new avatar and all..same I use at OCF and EVGA.
> My pet bird, Burd!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, vtt is what you need...the vicinity of 1.2v and vccsa at 1.195v should do fine for 106bclk, with some cold.
> I'd reccomend you to put some paper towels around your socket and some rags or vaseline too, and submerge your h100 radiator inside a bucket of ice, or better yet dry ice.
> You should be able to get 5.7ghz like that! xD


l I got 0C temps outside mang! Gotta use it up im gonna go to 1.62 vcore for 5.3 for super stability and put the vccio to 1.2 and go for 106 bclk.

That will get me 5.6 Ghz lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> l I got 0C temps outside mang! Gotta use it up im gonna go to 1.62 vcore for 5.3 for super stability and put the vccio to 1.2 and go for 106 bclk.
> That will get me 5.6 Ghz lol


If you intend to push it that hard, do 1.3v vtt/vccio and 1.295v imc/vccsa...you need to have those at a 0.005v distance.
Godspeed!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 4.9ghz is plenty for 24/7...but well, I'd go for more, me myself. Doesn't mean you should too xD


Im sure 4.9 is plenty but I want more...


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If you can do 4.9ghz with 1.295 V 5ghz should be a cake walk at 1.4v


What am I? Lol. This thread is awesome, not just the fact that that I was just mentioned but all these 4.5ghz + overclocks!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> What am I? Lol. This thread is awesome, not just the fact that that I was just mentioned but all these 4.5ghz + overclocks!


Lmao. it's cuz we're awesome.


----------



## An4rchyZ

Hey could you guys help me? I'm trying to go 5ghz and beyond 24 /7 stable and I do have the subzero cooling to do so, but after I put in any extra voltage the CPUwill bsod 124. Is this the vccio and vvcssa? Or do I just need to try to take my base clock a little?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *An4rchyZ*
> 
> Hey could you guys help me? I'm trying to go 5ghz and beyond 24 /7 stable and I do have the subzero cooling to do so, but after I put in any extra voltage the CPUwill bsod 124. Is this the vccio and vvcssa? Or do I just need to try to take my base clock a little?


try 1.6v for your ram


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yep, bump ram and imc/vccsa volts!


----------



## rexbinary

I missed a couple of days reading this thread and I was 196 posts down! Nice club ya'll!


----------



## Valgaur

Darn....couldn't get 5.5 Ghz even.....and I dont wanna do a 5.4 Ghz run again on Little Franky. I got close i did a 104 at 5.3.....but it tried and failed...so I'm stuck at 5.4 until Ln2 I gues...sad day.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *An4rchyZ*
> 
> Hey could you guys help me? I'm trying to go 5ghz and beyond 24 /7 stable and I do have the subzero cooling to do so, but after I put in any extra voltage the CPUwill bsod 124. Is this the vccio and vvcssa? Or do I just need to try to take my base clock a little?


been collecting some codes lately, for 1155 ivy too,
BSOD Codes for LGA 1155 Ivy Bridge
0x101 = increase vcore
0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT... have to test to see which one it is
0x0A = unstable RAM/IMC, increase QPI first, if that doesn't work increase vcore
0x1E = increase vcore
0x3B = increase vcore
0x3D = increase vcore
0xD1 = QPI/VTT, increase/decrease as necessary, can also be unstable Ram, raise Ram voltage
0x9C = QPI/VTT most likely, but increasing vcore has helped in some instances
0x50 = RAM timings/Frequency or uncore multi unstable, increase RAM voltage or adjust QPI/VTT, or lower uncore if you're higher than 2x
0x109 = Not enough or too Much memory voltage
0x116 = Low IOH (NB) voltage, GPU issue (most common when running multi-GPU/overclocking GPU)
0x7E = Corrupted OS file, possibly from overclocking. Run sfc /scannow and chkdsk /r

0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT

maybe its helpful


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stellamonster7*
> 
> so VonDutch you say another 300MHz is almost 10% performance increase, that's nothing to shrug off when someone is only at 4.5GHz. With what apps, what kind of data can you provide since you know I've said that I can't get stable past 4.6GHz due to temps without delid? I really need proof that it's not only a "push this as far as it can go" attitude for us, but some real-world applications that say I'll get more out day to day.
> delid seems like a large time investment for me to conduct patiently and slowly to not screw up. my windows are small b/c I've got Stella every night I come home. I've seen many quoted here and other places that say it's really just e-peen for anything over 4.5GHz when it comes to day to day gains. so please... continue your thought...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> More cpu Helps with Encoding Borderlands 2 and Battle field 3..
> I play both those games and work with video sometimes so it means something to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also 100mhz depending on the task at hand is anywhere from 2% to 5% per 100mhz


i used Aida64 for that 3% gain in speed number, it was the difference in speed between 4.5 and 4.6ghz..
speedgain from stock to 4.5ghz was about 27%
yea, could be some more with other apps or games ..like i said, it was a personal observation,
not a extended test or something









i think 4.5 - 4.6 - 4.7ghz are the best oc's for most of us, with or without de-lidding, temp and voltage wise.
all depends on how lucky you are/where in the chip lottery ,
i have a "bad" chip when it comes to voltages i need,
and 4.8ghz and higher oc's need that much more voltage,
so you have to think for yourself if its worth the trouble,
to get it stable, even if it means 1.4V -1.5V vcore
if your willing to de-lid to get those speeds, if temps are holding you back.

mine couldnt even run prime at 4.5ghz, i hit 105C in a few seconds...lol
for me that was reason enough to de-lid..
4.5ghz and a 25-30% speedgain for free is great..
i can run 4.6-4.7ghz around 1.3V vcore..4.8ghz needs 1.420V to get it stable in prime..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Here's my latest prime95 run
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


wauw








that looks very nice ..gratz,
im so jealous right now,i need 1.3V vcore for 4.7ghz ..grmbl...lol..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> been collecting some codes lately, for 1155 ivy too,
> BSOD Codes for LGA 1155 Ivy Bridge
> 0x101 = increase vcore
> 0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT... have to test to see which one it is
> 0x0A = unstable RAM/IMC, increase QPI first, if that doesn't work increase vcore
> 0x1E = increase vcore
> 0x3B = increase vcore
> 0x3D = increase vcore
> 0xD1 = QPI/VTT, increase/decrease as necessary, can also be unstable Ram, raise Ram voltage
> 0x9C = QPI/VTT most likely, but increasing vcore has helped in some instances
> 0x50 = RAM timings/Frequency or uncore multi unstable, increase RAM voltage or adjust QPI/VTT, or lower uncore if you're higher than 2x
> 0x109 = Not enough or too Much memory voltage
> 0x116 = Low IOH (NB) voltage, GPU issue (most common when running multi-GPU/overclocking GPU)
> 0x7E = Corrupted OS file, possibly from overclocking. Run sfc /scannow and chkdsk /r
> 0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT
> maybe its helpful


how bout x76?????


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> how bout x76?????


what about it?? ..lol
like i said, im collecting them for later use/help..

edit:
found it









The PROCESS_HAS_LOCKED_PAGES bug check has a value of 0x00000076.
This bug check indicates that a driver failed to release locked pages after an I/O operation,
or that it attempted to unlock pages that were already unlocked.


----------



## PCWargamer

Success! That new chip had such bad vcore and temps I could not wait any longer to delid it and see if that would help.









And it did lower the temps - avg. ~ 15C. Very nice, but not as nice as some others. This was with CL Ultra on all surfaces. I have ordered some CL PRO to see if it helps more. Also, I plan on lapping the IHS on both sides to see if that can gain a few C's too. No performance gains yet - same high OC of 5.1GHz so far. This chip just takes way too much vcor to reach any OC. I will see if I can lower it some now that temps are lower.

Really, delidding is not hard at all (once I got rid of that blade-knife and used only the one-sided razor blade). Takes only a few minutes. Getting that first corner shows you all you need to know to do the other three, and then the sides. Just use a razor and it is easy. The only really hard part is the taking of the risk if something does go wrong. The temps are worth it though, and I'd do it again!









Time to change that avatar!









OCN name: *pcwargamer*
CPU: 3770K (#2)
on die-TIM: CL ULTRA
ihs-TIM: CL ULTRA
Mhz gained: none
OC after delid: 5.1GHz
Temp drops: 15C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2550216


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Darn....couldn't get 5.5 Ghz even.....and I dont wanna do a 5.4 Ghz run again on Little Franky. I got close i did a 104 at 5.3.....but it tried and failed...so I'm stuck at 5.4 until Ln2 I gues...sad day.


Nice try! Poor Franky.... You don't have to go all the way to LN2, I think you can make it on dice first. Check out the info on the link below (unless you have already done so....)

http://www.overclock.net/t/1307983/so-i-want-to-give-dry-ice-a-try

Are you planning on going to the next LN2 meet? Last one looked great and I bet you would learn a ton by going to even one.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Success! That new chip had such bad vcore and temps I could not wait any longer to delid it and see if that would help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And it did lower the temps - avg. ~ 15C. Very nice, but not as nice as some others. This was with CL Ultra on all surfaces. I have ordered some CL PRO to see if it helps more. Also, I plan on lapping the IHS on both sides to see if that can gain a few C's too. No performance gains yet - same high OC of 5.1GHz so far. This chip just takes way too much vcor to reach any OC. I will see if I can lower it some now that temps are lower.
> Really, delidding is not hard at all (once I got rid of that blade-knife and used only the one-sided razor blade). Takes only a few minutes. Getting that first corner shows you all you need to know to do the other three, and then the sides. Just use a razor and it is easy. The only really hard part is the taking of the risk if something does go wrong. The temps are worth it though, and I'd do it again!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time to change that avatar!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *pcwargamer*
> CPU: 3770K (#2)
> on die-TIM: CL ULTRA
> ihs-TIM: CL ULTRA
> Mhz gained: none
> OC after delid: 5.1GHz
> Temp drops: 15C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2550216
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


very nice, glad it all went well








i think i have about the same chip as you , when it comes to voltages..
5.1ghz needed 1.512V to do at least some benching..


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> very nice, glad it all went well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i think i have about the same chip as you , when it comes to voltages..
> 5.1ghz needed 1.512V to do at least some benching..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I hope your chip is better than mine. I know it is. This new chip takes 1.3+v to even run IBT at 4.5GHz. And I can run prime95 only for a short time at that 4.5 and 1.344v before the system reboots, so I will have to increase vcore somewhere past 1.344v at 4.5GHz to be able to run prime stable. And I was sooo hoping my new chip would be a winner!

At least the delidding went well and the temps are significantly lower. I will love to see if the PRO helps more, and then the lapping....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Success! That new chip had such bad vcore and temps I could not wait any longer to delid it and see if that would help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And it did lower the temps - avg. ~ 15C. Very nice, but not as nice as some others. This was with CL Ultra on all surfaces. I have ordered some CL PRO to see if it helps more. Also, I plan on lapping the IHS on both sides to see if that can gain a few C's too. No performance gains yet - same high OC of 5.1GHz so far. This chip just takes way too much vcor to reach any OC. I will see if I can lower it some now that temps are lower.
> Really, delidding is not hard at all (once I got rid of that blade-knife and used only the one-sided razor blade). Takes only a few minutes. Getting that first corner shows you all you need to know to do the other three, and then the sides. Just use a razor and it is easy. The only really hard part is the taking of the risk if something does go wrong. The temps are worth it though, and I'd do it again!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time to change that avatar!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *pcwargamer*
> CPU: 3770K (#2)
> on die-TIM: CL ULTRA
> ihs-TIM: CL ULTRA
> Mhz gained: none
> OC after delid: 5.1GHz
> Temp drops: 15C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2550216
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


*REJECTED!*

Just kidding it's Accepted


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *REJECTED!*
> Just kidding it's Accepted


LOL..









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I hope your chip is better than mine. I know it is. This new chip takes 1.3+v to even run IBT at 4.5GHz. And I can run prime95 only for a short time at that 4.5 and 1.344v before the system reboots, so I will have to increase vcore somewhere past 1.344v at 4.5GHz to be able to run prime stable. And I was sooo hoping my new chip would be a winner!
> At least the delidding went well and the temps are significantly lower. I will love to see if the PRO helps more, and then the lapping....


looks like it, i can do 4.5ghz with about 1.235V
and did you try 4.6 , 4.7 and 4.8ghz?
i noticed not much vcore difference between 4.5 and 4.6..

can we assume pro does better then ultra on the Die ?


----------



## Droogie

I'd try it, but I'm way too afraid to have a $200 paperweight. It would barely even qualify for that if it failed, really.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wauw
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that looks very nice ..gratz,
> im so jealous right now,i need 1.3V vcore for 4.7ghz ..grmbl...lol..


Thanks!


----------



## SonDa5

Spent most of the night swapping out IC Diamond 24 TIM for Liquid Pro TIM on my bare die NO IHS 3570k.

I tried using some Thermal pad around the die on the PCB with the Liquid Pro but I couldn't get the right spacing and my CPU would not post.

So I removed the thermal pad and still would not post.

Messed around with my mount for a few hours and I kept getting error 55 on my MB LED display.

I finally got a snug fit and was able to boot up but my temps are still not that great. My 3rd core is hotter than it has ever been. So I am going to have to redo this mount after I get some rest later on this weekend.

So far from what I am seeing Liquid Pro requires a nearly perfect mount to work right while the IC Diamond was more forgiving on the mount.

Screen shots of my temps so far.

Before with IC Diamond.

26C Ambient


With Liquid Pro
25C Ambient



My 3rd core has never been so hot so I think I may have a bubble in that area. I'm going to let it run prime95 for a few hours to see if the temps settle down. Probably going to have to remount.

IC Diamond is leading right now.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Spent most of the night swapping out IC Diamond 24 TIM for Liquid Pro TIM on my bare die NO IHS 3570k.
> I tried using some Thermal pad around the die on the PCB with the Liquid Pro but I couldn't get the right spacing and my CPU would not post.
> So I removed the thermal pad and still would not post.
> Messed around with my mount for a few hours and I kept getting error 55 on my MB LED display.
> I finally got a snug fit and was able to boot up but my temps are still not that great. My 3rd core is hotter than it has ever been. So I am going to have to redo this mount after I get some rest later on this weekend.
> So far from what I am seeing Liquid Pro requires a nearly perfect mount to work right while the IC Diamond was more forgiving on the mount.
> Screen shots of my temps so far.
> Before with IC Diamond.
> 26C Ambient
> 
> With Liquid Pro
> 25C Ambient
> Coming soon....


Interesting about the diff in mounts for PRO vs ICD. Looking forward to your results.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> LOL..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> looks like it, i can do 4.5ghz with about 1.235V
> and did you try 4.6 , 4.7 and 4.8ghz?
> i noticed not much vcore difference between 4.5 and 4.6..
> can we assume pro does better then ultra on the Die ?


The chip failed prime stable run last night of 4.5GHz @ 1.36v after around 4hours. Will have to try again at even greater vcore.

I have tried running IBT and short prime runs at higher OC's like 4.6, 4.8, 4.9, but due to high voltage the temps really start to raise at 4.8 and higher even with the delid.

This chip will be a challenge to see if I can do anything to lower the voltage needed to be stable and/or just bench at higher OCs.

On the PRO vs ULTRA, I have some PRO on the way to confirm that idea (or not)!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *REJECTED!*
> Just kidding it's Accepted


ohhh no.....back to the fanboy avatar.....wait! I did'nt read the small print!!!

LOL - glad to be an actual (delidded) member of the club!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Spent most of the night swapping out IC Diamond 24 TIM for Liquid Pro TIM on my bare die NO IHS 3570k.
> I tried using some Thermal pad around the die on the PCB with the Liquid Pro but I couldn't get the right spacing and my CPU would not post.
> So I removed the thermal pad and still would not post.
> Messed around with my mount for a few hours and I kept getting error 55 on my MB LED display.
> I finally got a snug fit and was able to boot up but my temps are still not that great. My 3rd core is hotter than it has ever been. So I am going to have to redo this mount after I get some rest later on this weekend.
> So far from what I am seeing Liquid Pro requires a nearly perfect mount to work right while the IC Diamond was more forgiving on the mount.
> Screen shots of my temps so far.
> Before with IC Diamond.
> 26C Ambient
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With Liquid Pro
> 25C Ambient
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My 3rd core has never been so hot so I think I may have a bubble in that area. I'm going to let it run prime95 for a few hours to see if the temps settle down. Probably going to have to remount.
> IC Diamond is leading right now.


hey sonda








already started to wonder where you were..

IC is leading because of the better mount,
im almost sure when you get it right with CLP it will give better temps
do you still have the IHS, maybe try with it on again?
not sure if thats easy to do with your setup tho..

Good luck


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> LOL - glad to be an actual (delidded) member of the club!


So am I








only wished you had a better voltage chip..o well ..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The chip failed prime stable run last night of 4.5GHz @ 1.36v after around 4hours. Will have to try again at even greater vcore.
> I have tried running IBT and short prime runs at higher OC's like 4.6, 4.8, 4.9, but due to high voltage the temps really start to raise at 4.8 and higher even with the delid.
> This chip will be a challenge to see if I can do anything to lower the voltage needed to be stable and/or just bench at higher OCs.
> On the PRO vs ULTRA, I have some PRO on the way to confirm that idea (or not)!


Atleast it's delidded now. and boots...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Droogie*
> 
> I'd try it, but I'm way too afraid to have a $200 paperweight. It would barely even qualify for that if it failed, really.


Re instated warranty in a tube.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Re instated warranty in a tube.


LMAO, thats what I'm saying!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Atleast it's delidded now. and boots...


True kgtuning. I am very happy about that.

*CLUB SPREADSHEET TEMPS QUESTION*

So, how is everyone determining temps for the spreadsheet on this site?
Greatest diff, or average, or what?
And using what load program and what OC?

At 4.5GHz, and combining results from both IBT and prime95, my lowest temp diff was 11C, my greatest diff was 21C, and my average diff was 15-16C

So I listed the average of 15C for the spreadsheet.

But my entry is missing too much contextual data to be of much comparative use other than a general statement of finding for only my system with CL Ultra. And I will try CL PRO next for my system to see if it is better on my system. (and yes, although we all know, YMMV is very true - this data can also have a more or less generalizable quality to it that could suggest which TIM might be better if we had more contextual data).

The reason I am wondering is, if we really want to gather any usable information to get an idea as to which TIM may be better, then we need some uniform method for listing our temps on the spreadsheet at a minimum. And maybe also consider if we want to add the OC and which load program too?

Just an idea - this club is plenty fun already - please no stones


----------



## kgtuning

I use Prime to test so I use the highest temp in 24 hours for before temps and after temps.

Oh and that is with HT ON.


----------



## PCWargamer

*Valgaur* - I was noticing some max OC's on the spreadsheet could be updated (compared it to 5GHz club spreadsheet)

Valgaur - 5300 > 5428
VonDutch - 5301 > 5401
Neopunx - same > 5453
Schmuckley - 4500 > 5708!
also,
Kgtuning - 5200 > 5300

Anyone else who has some new high OCs to report we would love to hear about them!
(make sure you add the proof link!)

Lots of great high OCs here on the delidded club!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I use Prime to test so I use the highest temp in 24 hours for before temps and after temps.
> Oh and that is with HT ON.


Cool way to do it *kgtuning* - that would have got me a 17C lower temp.....

So the info from me could have been:
least core change - 11C
greatest core change - 21C
average change - 15C
highest temp to highest temp - 17C

Any other ways to do it? Should we consider using only IBT default run or only prime custom for some short time (~20-30min)?


----------



## kgtuning

Yeah I take the core with the highest temp. IBT would be cool but with HT enable or disabled?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah I take the core with the highest temp. IBT would be cool but with HT enable or disabled?


HT enabled for sure.....

IBT default only takes a short time to run and would produce high load temps quickly to compare with - and high to high could be a good way to do it.

I hope some others also have some ideas on this - hint, hint....


----------



## kgtuning

If we are updating max OC's here's mine...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> If we are updating max OC's here's mine...


Nice 100MHz gain to 5.3GHz


----------



## kgtuning

Thanks man, I had got that a little over a week ago but forgot to update here. I tried for 5.4 without going over 1.52 but it wouldn't play nice.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> HT enabled for sure.....
> IBT default only takes a short time to run and would produce high load temps quickly to compare with - and high to high could be a good way to do it.
> I hope some others also have some ideas on this - hint, hint....


I completely agree for this. but I am curious as to how many times to run IBT I always hit my max temps at 10 runs with STANDARD usage. if we are gonna do this right we might as well use the standards for it so everyones is equal and only do 10 runs I say With HT enabled for better result comparison's instead of having results fluxtuate so much.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Valgaur - I was noticing some max OC's on the spreadsheet could be updated (compared it to 5GHz club spreadsheet)
> Valgaur - 5300 > 5428
> VonDutch - 5301 > 5401
> Neopunx - same > 5453
> Schmuckley - 4500 > 5708!


I will need these Validations from people!

I also need:

SonDa5
beniroc
NEOPUNX
Swag!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (come on really Swag?)
Schmuckley
daddyfatsax

Thanks again guys for making this a great thread!


----------



## kgtuning

Im down with 10 runs of IBT







, quick and easy.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I completely agree for this. but I am curious as to how many times to run IBT I always hit my max temps at 10 runs with STANDARD usage. if we are gonna do this right we might as well use the standards for it so everyones is equal and only do 10 runs I say With HT enabled for better result comparison's instead of having results fluxtuate so much.
> I will need these Validations from people!
> I also need:
> SonDa5
> beniroc
> NEOPUNX
> Swag!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (come on really Swag?)
> Schmuckley
> daddyfatsax
> Thanks again guys for making this a great thread!


Yeah. I think standard/default IBT run will do 10x runs at high loads and high temps and would be a good standard measure that is quick, easy, and effective at finding what we want to know about temp differences.

Measure of temps differences could be as simple as high to high, or an average. What do we want that to be?

*Valgaur* - Updated list. All these validations can be found on the 5GHz club spreadsheet for all those except for Kgtuning who has his validation on this page!

Valgaur - 5300 > 5428
VonDutch - 5301 > 5401
Neopunx - same > 5453
Schmuckley - 4500 > 5708!
also,
Kgtuning - 5200 > 5300

Fine set of high OCs we have for our delidding club! And with nice low temps! (the way IB should have been!!!) Keep up the encouraging work!


----------



## VonDutch

i took the highest core temp before, and the highest after, so i got 80C and 55C
why not take temps from all cores, like,

before, 68-76-80-75


After, 49-55-53-51


And the 10 runs IBT with HT on, stresslevel: standard ..sounds good to me,
so we need to do it all over again or ?? ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Here lets do this.

We shall all make runs at 4.8 Ghz since everyone can reach that fairly easily and then we run IBT 10 times and compare their Average temp drops for all the cores for example:

1st run NOT delidded 80-80-87-98 (its an example







)

2nd run Delidded 60-63-66-87

Then we take the differences

20 17 21 11 Then add them all up!

LOL its 69!!!!!!! okay okay enough kid stuff, then we divide by 4 since we have 4 cores.

so average temp drop is.

17.25C

That work?


----------



## kgtuning

sounds good, let me see what I have for IBT before delid.... I may not have anything at 4.8


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> sounds good, let me see what I have for IBT before delid.... I may not have anything at 4.8


If not we can just show our Hottest core if that would also make it easier....I kinda like that idea more actually.


----------



## kgtuning

I think I only grabbed this one at 4.8ghz before delidding....



It was right in the middle of a run...


----------



## SonDa5

All my temps recorded before were at 4.5GHZ with 4 core temps divided by 4 for average temp minus the after average temps for difference.


----------



## VonDutch

i dont have befores at that speed, i coulndt even run IBT at 4.4ghz before de-lid, 105C ...lol

just the hottest core before and after, to make it simple ?
could mean its a different core tho..like i showed on the other page..


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I completely agree for this. but I am curious as to how many times to run IBT I always hit my max temps at 10 runs with STANDARD usage. if we are gonna do this right we might as well use the standards for it so everyones is equal and only do 10 runs I say With HT enabled for better result comparison's instead of having results fluxtuate so much.
> I will need these Validations from people!
> I also need:
> SonDa5
> beniroc
> NEOPUNX
> Swag!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (come on really Swag?)
> Schmuckley
> daddyfatsax
> Thanks again guys for making this a great thread!










5453.42 MHz http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2544682


----------



## kgtuning

Holy voltage... nice job..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5453.42 MHz http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2544682


pssssssst you....yeah you!

I already got it from the 5 Kajiggahertz club ^.^


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ]I also need:
> SonDa5
> beniroc
> NEOPUNX
> Swag!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (come on really Swag?)
> Schmuckley
> daddyfatsax


I will get one when I'm done with this month's folding. I need to make sure my team comes out #1!


----------



## Notion

whats required for the 5ghz + club, do you need to run it for 24hrs or just get it stable?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> whats required for the 5ghz + club, do you need to run it for 24hrs or just get it stable?


just need to run at 5ghz enough to validate and provide the validation link on the 5 ghz clubs thread.


----------



## Notion

AAaah right.. will send like shortly


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey sonda
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> already started to wonder where you were..
> IC is leading because of the better mount,
> im almost sure when you get it right with CLP it will give better temps
> do you still have the IHS, maybe try with it on again?
> not sure if thats easy to do with your setup tho..
> Good luck


No IHS for me. My IHS has terrible contact with my block.

Going to take the MB out of case and totally redo my loop anyways. I'm sure my problem is getting a good mount with Liquid Pro. With IC Diamond it was much easier to get a good mount and I'm sure it is because of how thin the Liquid Pro TIM coat is vs IC Diamond TIM pea drop mount technique.

Haven't given up on Liquid Pro yet but if I can't get a good mount with it I am going back to IC Diamond. I feel confident I can get a good mount. Just going to take some time to take MB out of case and mount the block out of the case to make sure I get good contact.


----------



## kgtuning

Man the first time I fired up my rig after delid and putting on liquid pro I decided to run IBT....
temp jacked right up to 105c....haha. I shut it down and took it apart.... had super crappy contact so I added a tiny bit more and put some on the underside of the IHS. it worked like a charm then.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Man the first time I fired up my rig after delid and putting on liquid pro I decided to run IBT....
> temp jacked right up to 105c....haha. I shut it down and took it apart.... had super crappy contact so I added a tiny bit more and put some on the underside of the IHS. it worked like a charm then.


Yeah i got mine on very thick allows for complete perfect core to ihs contact and any extra will just get pushed to the sides.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> All my temps recorded before were at 4.5GHZ with 4 core temps divided by 4 for average temp minus the after average temps for difference.


me too....


----------



## TSXmike

ultra tempting to de-lid my 3570k...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TSXmike*
> 
> ultra tempting to de-lid my 3570k...


It was for me too.. but then I had to do it. lol. Seeing the results the other guys had pushed me over the edge.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TSXmike*
> 
> ultra tempting to de-lid my 3570k...


It takes some guts, but it is really easy, and the results are just great. Makes an IB what it should of always been....!


----------



## beniroc

Valgaur here is mine 5440.71 mhz. http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2544198


----------



## feniks

done!









took me a while to clean off the old crap (black glue/rubber/RTV) after opening the chip, but using isopropyl alcohol 70%, my nails, paper towels and buffing pad on (chineese version of) my "dremel" did the trick on the PCB









I had my goof moment when I put everything together and my rig was getting stuck on POST code 20 ... after 3rd (failed) attempt to boot it up I noticed I left out my memory sticks on the desk LOL!














removed them from MB prior to working on CPU to get more working space and forgot to put them back in ha ha! ... but for 5 minutes I was like ... "oh well, time to go to Microcenter and get another chip since my deliding skills suck so bad ..." LOL!









PICS of progress:

Uploaded with ImageShack.us


Uploaded with ImageShack.us


Uploaded with ImageShack.us


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

as you can see in last picture - something I missed when looking at the die before putting it together - I actually screwed up CL Ultra application in 2 spots ... could be better, oh well, live & learn








also, I put some black silicone sealer on the under side of IHS so it stays in place once settled







... CPU now after procedure looks same as stock









anyways here are temps BEFORE & AFTER, nearly 24C improvement in temps under load at 4.6GHz!

on the left side of both screen shots you can see AI Suite Sensor Monitoring, the only 2 you can take note of are temperature sensors OPT1 & OPT2 I use to have an idea of computer air & water conditions and so they are:
a) OPT1 water loop temperature (sensor mounted in drain valve, before returning to reservoir)
b) OPT2 air inlet temperature at computer air intake (and internal 360 rad), sensor mounted on fan shroud

BEFORE (IHS TIM was PK-3):

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

AFTER (IHS TIM was CL Liquid Ultra):

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

OCN name: feniks
CPU: i7 3770K
on die-TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: haven't checked yet
OC after delid: will see what I can do without playing around with room AC
Temp drops: 24C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: will soon get there to see how far I can go after delid.

Will try some OC'ing again to 5GHz and see if I can do this now without playing with my AC acting as a cold air intake to my system haha!


----------



## kgtuning

very cool man! nice job


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> very cool man! nice job


thanks!!! finally can say that he he








let me see how far it takes me now


----------



## Valgaur

Sweet! Ill add them after I get done with work...ugh lol but nice job on these OC's guys we gotta show Intel what they did wrong and make them give us new chips to make us happy!

Also on the matter of temp results and such. We will tak a vote.

1st do a 4.8Ghz run and recod the HIGHEST temp of all the cores

2nd Compare your temps to an OC you had previously made for example the people who have 4.5 make a 4.5 run and compare the temps of the HOTEST core drops. On the main sheet ill include the Ghz you did that test at so ill need that info along with the temp drops.

3rd any other options will be considered!

Thanks again guys.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Sweet! Ill add them after I get done with work...ugh lol but nice job on these OC's guys we gotta show Intel what they did wrong and make them give us new chips to make us happy!
> Also on the matter of temp results and such. We will tak a vote.
> 1st do a 4.8Ghz run and recod the HIGHEST temp of all the cores
> 2nd Compare your temps to an OC you had previously made for example the people who have 4.5 make a 4.5 run and compare the temps of the HOTEST core drops. On the main sheet ill include the Ghz you did that test at so ill need that info along with the temp drops.
> 3rd any other options will be considered!
> Thanks again guys.


10 runs IBT? I like the idea, got my vote


----------



## Agoniizing

Whats the best way to apply Coollaboratory to the CPU die?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> Whats the best way to apply Coollaboratory to the CPU die?


Q tip that comes with the Liquid pro you wiggle it around a bit and it spreads like butter and very easy to get a perfect spread.


----------



## kgtuning

So here is the best I could do...

This one is before delid..



And this one is after delid..



As you can see the hottest core is 90C, now the hottest is 65C. So 25 degrees celcuis difference in IBT. In Prime95 I had a 24 degree celcuis difference.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Here lets do this.
> We shall all make runs at 4.8 Ghz since everyone can reach that fairly easily and then we run IBT 10 times and compare their Average temp drops for all the cores for example:
> 1st run NOT delidded 80-80-87-98 (its an example
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 2nd run Delidded 60-63-66-87
> Then we take the differences
> 20 17 21 11 Then add them all up!
> LOL its 69!!!!!!! okay okay enough kid stuff, then we divide by 4 since we have 4 cores.
> so average temp drop is.
> 17.25C
> That work?


We may have to just see what we have (for saved temp results) for those of us who have already joined from our pre-delided days, and then do comparisons off of those recorded OC, vcore, and temps. We can't go back to being lidded to redo temp runs!

But for new deliders we can state what we want after what we have learned so far.

1) I'd think 4.5GHz is a reasonable OC as it is typical of what lidded IBs are able to reach.

2) IBT default 10x runs would be good choice for load program

3) Also, for temps, I think the high to high way would be the easiest to do and would have useful info

We can decide on some good club rules, then post them on page one, and hope they are easy and useful enough, while also being standardized and able to generate some useful and helpful information to help others choose good TIMs, and see how delidding can help them get the temps IB can and should have.

What are you guys thoughts on these ideas?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> took me a while to clean off the old crap (black glue/rubber/RTV) after opening the chip, but using isopropyl alcohol 70%, my nails, paper towels and buffing pad on (chineese version of) my "dremel" did the trick on the PCB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had my goof moment when I put everything together and my rig was getting stuck on POST code 20 ... after 3rd (failed) attempt to boot it up I noticed I left out my memory sticks on the desk LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> removed them from MB prior to working on CPU to get more working space and forgot to put them back in ha ha! ... but for 5 minutes I was like ... "oh well, time to go to Microcenter and get another chip since my deliding skills suck so bad ..." LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PICS of progress:
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> as you can see in last picture - something I missed when looking at the die before putting it together - I actually screwed up CL Ultra application in 2 spots ... could be better, oh well, live & learn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also, I put some black silicone sealer on the under side of IHS so it stays in place once settled
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... CPU now after procedure looks same as stock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways here are temps BEFORE & AFTER, nearly 24C improvement in temps under load at 4.6GHz!
> on the left side of both screen shots you can see AI Suite Sensor Monitoring, the only 2 you can take note of are temperature sensors OPT1 & OPT2 I use to have an idea of computer air & water conditions and so they are:
> a) OPT1 water loop temperature (sensor mounted in drain valve, before returning to reservoir)
> b) OPT2 air inlet temperature at computer air intake (and internal 360 rad), sensor mounted on fan shroud
> BEFORE (IHS TIM was PK-3):
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> AFTER (IHS TIM was CL Liquid Ultra):
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> OCN name: feniks
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: haven't checked yet
> OC after delid: will see what I can do without playing around with room AC
> Temp drops: 24C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: will soon get there to see how far I can go after delid.
> Will try some OC'ing again to 5GHz and see if I can do this now without playing with my AC acting as a cold air intake to my system haha!


Accepted!


----------



## Systemlord

I have heard that if you ever need to remove Liquid Pro from die or IHS that it's very hard to remove, is there any truth to this?

*@feniks*

What type of blade did you use to delid? Also where did you get the glue and what brand?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I have heard that if you ever need to remove Liquid Pro from die or IHS that it's very hard to remove, is there any truth to this?
> *@feniks*
> What type of blade did you use to delid?


Why would u ever have to remove it from the die? it is like a solder so u have to remove it like u would a solder.


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> We may have to just see what we have (for saved temp results) for those of us who have already joined from our pre-delided days, and then do comparisons off of those recorded OC, vcore, and temps. We can't go back to being lidded to redo temp runs!
> But for new deliders we can state what we want after what we have learned so far.
> 1) I'd think 4.5GHz is a reasonable OC as it is typical of what lidded IBs are able to reach.
> 2) IBT default 10x runs would be good choice for load program
> 3) Also, for temps, I think the high to high way would be the easiest to do and would have useful info
> We can decide on some good club rules, then post them on page one, and hope they are easy and useful enough, while also being standardized and able to generate some useful and helpful information to help others choose good TIMs, and see how delidding can help them get the temps IB can and should have.
> What are you guys thoughts on these ideas?


I like this, I vote with PCwargamer, and not just because he had the most epic avatar ever and traded it out with a yoga master. I actually don't know what the diff is between pre a post lid on my chip. So I will be of no help when it come to the spread sheet. But for new comers, it makes sense. I do get grandfathered in right.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Why would u ever have to remove it from the die? it is like a solder so u have to remove it like u would a solder.


So it's that permanent, I guess that's a good thing, will it keep the IHS on the die even if you remove the CPU from the MB?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> So it's that permanent, I guess that's a good thing, will it keep the IHS on the die even if you remove the CPU from the MB?


I do not know if it will maybe after awhile it will get thicker and make a great bond.. I do know however it does not in 2 hrs lol.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted!


thank you!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I have heard that if you ever need to remove Liquid Pro from die or IHS that it's very hard to remove, is there any truth to this?
> *@feniks*
> What type of blade did you use to delid? Also where did you get the glue and what brand?


I used a regular single sided razor blade (10-pack from local Lowe's like this)
The black "glue" is an automotive silicone based sealant good up to 200F (seals even against water and such) or so, like this from a local Harbor Freight Tools store.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Why would u ever have to remove it from the die? it is like a solder so u have to remove it like u would a solder.


I had to ... for some reason core #2 (counting 0,1,2,3) stays 13C hotter than others. Liquid Ultra stays liquid and it doesn't turn solid even after a few burn-in cycles (not sure about later) ... long story short, despite re-brushing, re-applying it 3 times under the IHS, temps of core #2 stay hotter than others and there's nothing I seem to be able to do about it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I like this, I vote with PCwargamer, and not just because he had the most epic avatar ever and traded it out with a yoga master. I actually don't know what the diff is between pre a post lid on my chip. So I will be of no help when it come to the spread sheet. But for new comers, it makes sense. I do get grandfathered in right.


I do agree:
-4.5GHz as a baseline achievable for all
-quick 10 rounds of IBT 2.54 Standard (1GB RAM used) as a baseline load test and max temp generator for all cores
-comparing hottest before deliding (core1 for me) to hottest after deliding (core2 for me) seems like the best method - reasoning is simple you can't go higher than hottest core go, it limits the clocks (thermally) at 105C, no matter which core hits the limits, the whole die downclocks to cool down.
-we also should all use the same core temp monitoring program, e.g. RealTemp 3.70


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> thank you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a regular single sided razor blade (10-pack from local Lowe's like this)
> The black "glue" is an automotive silicone based sealant good up to 200F (seals even against water and such) or so, like this from a local Harbor Freight Tools store.
> I had to ... for some reason core #2 (counting 0,1,2,3) stays 13C hotter than others. Liquid Ultra stays liquid and it doesn't turn solid even after a few burn-in cycles (not sure about later) ... long story short, despite re-brushing, re-applying it 3 times under the IHS, temps of core #2 stay hotter than others and there's nothing I seem to be able to do about it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do agree:
> -4.5GHz as a baseline achievable for all
> -quick 10 rounds of IBT 2.54 Standard (1GB RAM used) as a baseline load test and max temp generator for all cores
> -comparing hottest before deliding (core1 for me) to hottest after deliding (core2 for me) seems like the best method - reasoning is simple you can't go higher than hottest core go, it limits the clocks (thermally) at 105C, no matter which core hits the limits, the whole die downclocks to cool down.
> -we also should all use the same core temp monitoring program, e.g. RealTemp 3.70


Liquid Pro and Liquid Ultra are not the samethings..

Looking at your Die there no where close.. Liquid Metal pro looks like pure melted metal with nothing else in it. Kinda like that liquid metal guy from Terminator 2. it is also Impossible not to get a perfect spread with it.. Greatest stuff ive ever worked with as far as that goes.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I have heard that if you ever need to remove Liquid Pro from die or IHS that it's very hard to remove, is there any truth to this?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1283797/ivy-bridge-3770k-de-lid-liquid-pro-as-5-tested-amazing-results/30#post_18342699
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Good info *VonDutch*. About as good a explanation as I have seen so far on this issue. I'm going to use the Ultra myself because of this concern: "...*easy to apply but a pain to remove requiring either scrubbing with wire wool or mild lapping*. Sometimes it also temporarily *'welded' my block to the IHS needing a bit of force to remove it.*" It may be the PRO is slightly better, and that I will not be needing to remove it much, but just the thought of it sticking to my die and possibly needing force to remove it made me want to avoid that possibility. Maybe I will lose some temps, but I hope not enough to worry about in the midst of the gains I hope to get through deliding.


for 10 bucks orso you could buy their cleaningset, if you ever need to clean

http://www.coollaboratory.com/de/produkte/liquid-cleaning-set/
that should do it i think, in 3 phases









personally i havent got mine off again yet, its only under there for a short period so ..
thats why i wanted to collect some info of us using liquid ultra on the die,
instead of liquid pro, to see if it works as good/better temp wise,
liquid ultra should be easier to remove later on..
when time comes, i will use the cleaningset, for 10 bucks im not gonna try
use the normal rubbing alcohol, wire wool or use other means to clean it..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Liquid Pro and Liquid Ultra are not the samethings..
> Looking at your Die there no where close.. Liquid Metal pro looks like pure melted metal with nothing else in it. Kinda like that liquid metal guy from Terminator 2. it is also Impossible not to get a perfect spread with it.. Greatest stuff ive ever worked with as far as that goes.


yeah, I've seen those videos for both kinds of CLL paste, hence why I went with Ultra - creates a thicker layer (easier to make a proper contact on first try) and is extremely easy to clean even with 70% alcohol and paper towels! It's like mercury when you work with it and brushing it on. based on reviews and opinions from other people temps are similar even though Pro has twice the thermal conductivity of Ultra.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1283797/ivy-bridge-3770k-de-lid-liquid-pro-as-5-tested-amazing-results/30#post_18342699
> for 10 bucks orso you could buy their cleaningset, if you ever need to clean
> 
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/de/produkte/liquid-cleaning-set/
> that should do it i think, in 3 phases
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> personally i havent got mine off again yet, its only under there for a short period so ..
> thats why i wanted to collect some info of us using liquid ultra on the die,
> instead of liquid pro, to see if it works as good/better temp wise,
> liquid ultra should be easier to remove later on..
> when time comes, i will use the cleaningset, for 10 bucks im not gonna try
> use the normal rubbing alcohol, wire wool or use other means to clean it..


Ultra is very good and extremely easy to work with (easier than ICD Diamond for sure), there is nothing extra needed to clean it and the package contains brushes for application and some scratch pad to removal in future (if it gets more slid, I guess, otherwise paper towels and alcohol removes it)


----------



## VonDutch

jpg



first off, nice job feniks









ive noticed, and read about it too, you can see for yourself if you compare
delidded pics,



that the side im pointing at is open, that has a goal too,
its a way to get heat out of there..
i would leave it open next time, well, if there is a next time,
im not taking apart mine if i dont have to, it works so ..dont touch..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, I've seen those videos for both kinds of CLL paste, hence why I went with Ultra - creates a thicker layer (easier to make a proper contact on first try) and is extremely easy to clean even with 70% alcohol and paper towels! It's like mercury when you work with it and brushing it on. based on reviews and opinions from other people temps are similar even though Pro has twice the thermal conductivity of Ultra.
> Ultra is very good and extremely easy to work with (easier than ICD Diamond for sure), there is nothing extra needed to clean it and the package contains brushes for application and some scratch pad to removal in future (if it gets more slid, I guess, otherwise paper towels and alcohol removes it)


On a IHS results are close on the Die LP is beating LU by an AVG of 5 c cause of twice the thermal conductivity .. It is pure Liquid Ultra is not.. they made it friendly for people hence having to add unpure things to it.

I do not consider myself a Novice and rather have better results then make it easy so Liquid pro was the only choice for me..

My temp drops were 27-28c i just have 25c on there for a nice rounded number.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> On a IHS results are close *on the Die LP is beating LU by an AVG of 5 c* cause of twice the thermal conductivity .. It is pure Liquid Ultra is not.. they made it friendly for people hence having to add unpure things to it.
> My temp drops were 27-28c i just have 25c on there for a nice rounded number.


yep, had the same, 27-28C biggest difference using Pro,
25C i used for the rounded number ...LOL


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep, had the same, 27-28C biggest difference using Pro,
> 25C i used for the rounded number ...LOL


Yeah the stuff is shocking.. And it is not so hard to apply i donno what noob scared ppl off of it..

Just wiggle it a bit to get it warm.. and it spreads like butter lol. I think it is more easy then IC diamond to work with.. atleast my Test batch stuff is thick like glue... and you have to heat it or do the line "very thick" or put a huge double pea sized gop in the middle to make it spread correctly.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> jpg
> 
> first off, nice job feniks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ive noticed, and read about it too, you can see for yourself if you compare
> delidded pics,
> 
> that the side im pointing at is open, that has a goal too,
> its a way to get heat out of there..
> i would leave it open next time, well, if there is a next time,
> im not taking apart mine if i dont have to, it works so ..dont touch..lol


interesting pointer








I missed that. might be I re-do this again tomorrow, 4th attempt!









however as I stated before, my CPU degraded a bit in last 4 weeks ... and it did again ...








might need to RMA it in less than a month, will see. I found 1 brownish mark on the underside of CPU (where the terminals are), it's not visible at first, but after looking at different angles it stays in same spot and is always there no matter how hard I rub it with alcohol and paper towels or q-tips ... my CPU had it before I delided it (I thought I cleaned it off last time I looked at underside), so I guess it only explains why it degraded in first place ... and why it keeps doing it ... it's slowly dying IMHO, and I only make it die faster by forcing it to run higher and higher clocks and vcore... he he, all I can say, is I will make it die in glory









time will tell. currently I am unable to stabilize 5GHz OC at room temps (24C) due to temperatures on cores 1 & 2 becoming too high under load ... other cores stays good 20C colder under load ... so maybe that opening you marked is the trick ... or maybe at least one of cores of my CPU is degrading fast and I am simply watching it die ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> On a IHS results are close on the Die LP is beating LU by an AVG of 5 c cause of twice the thermal conductivity .. It is pure Liquid Ultra is not.. they made it friendly for people hence having to add unpure things to it.
> I do not consider myself a Novice and rather have better results then make it easy so Liquid pro was the only choice for me..
> My temp drops were 27-28c i just have 25c on there for a nice rounded number.


well, I know at least 1 person, who achieved 30C drop in temps by using CLL Ultra ... so ... maybe Pro is better maybe not (considering downsides and CoolLaboratory statement that it's designed for copper only and NOT aluminum), but in real world comparison the results are pretty close anyways. considering the downsides of using Pro paste, I picked easier Ultra and am happy with it. Possibly I could have achieved better results with Pro paste IF I did it right the first try, Ultra is not far behind anyways...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> interesting pointer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I missed that. might be I re-do this again tomorrow, 4th attempt!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> however as I stated before, my CPU degraded a bit in last 4 weeks ... and it did again ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> might need to RMA it in less than a month, will see. I found 1 brownish mark on the underside of CPU (where the terminals are), it's not visible at first, but after looking at different angles it stays in same spot and is always there no matter how hard I rub it with alcohol and paper towels ... my CPU had it before I delided it, so I guess it only explains why it degraded in first place ... and why it keep doing it ... it's slowly dying IMHO, and I only make it die faster by forcing it to run higher and higher clocks and vcore...
> time will tell. currently I am unable to stabilize 5GHz OC at room temps (24C) due to temperatures on cores 1 & 2 becoming too high under load ... other cores stays good 20C colder under load ... so maybe that opening you marked is the trick ... or maybe at least one of cores of my CPU is degrading fast and I am simply watching it die ...
> well, I know at least 1 person, who achieved 30C drop in temps by using CLL Ultra ... so ... maybe Pro is better maybe not (considering downsides and CoolLaboratory statement that it's designed for copper only and NOT aluminum), but in real world comparison the results are pretty close anyways. considering the downsides of using Pro paste, I picked easier Ultra and am happy with it. Possibly I could have achieved better results with Pro paste IF I did it right the first try, Ultra is not far behind anyways...


5 c can be alot depending on what is going on..

Also u can put LP ontop of LP so you do get a 2nd try.. i put mine ontop of it's self after i had already mounted it once cause it was not thick enough and got the 27-28c temp drop.

Anywho off to play Borderlands 2 with gpus hitting 45 c max and cpu barely touching 50c <3 LP


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 5 c can be alot depending on what is going on..
> Also u can put LP ontop of LP so you do get a 2nd try.. i put mine ontop of it's self after i had already mounted it once cause it was not thick enough and got the 27-28c temp drop.
> Anywho off to play Borderlands 2 with gpus hitting 45 c max and cpu barely touching 50c <3 LP


good point on putting one layer atop another, I agree!


----------



## VonDutch

another tip,



where i put the red rectangle, that little thing there, is higher then the pcb,
if you put back the IHS, keep in mind if you close the bracket, it will slide a bit forward,
if your not carefull, it will make the IHS go up , maybe just enough to give higher temps on some of the cores









i wanted to take the black thing off, but didnt know if i would scratch the pcb doing so,
so what i did was putting the IHS more to the backside. and let the bracket slide it more to the front,
trying not to let the IHS touch the black thingy to much..

(srry, my english sometimes limits me to explain things very well,
hope you understand what im trying to say







)


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ...
> however as I stated before, my CPU degraded a bit in last 4 weeks ... and it did again ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> might need to RMA it in less than a month, will see. I found 1 brownish mark on the underside of CPU (where the terminals are), it's not visible at first, but after looking at different angles it stays in same spot and is always there no matter how hard I rub it with alcohol and paper towels or q-tips ... my CPU had it before I delided it (I thought I cleaned it off last time I looked at underside), so I guess it only explains why it degraded in first place ... and why it keeps doing it ... it's slowly dying IMHO, and I only make it die faster by forcing it to run higher and higher clocks and vcore... he he, all I can say, is I will make it die in glory
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> time will tell. ...


Hey *feniks*, one thing to consider is what some deliders have found, that since the die and IHS now touch, and there is some thermal heat/cool action taking place, that this can cause a "pumping" action that slowly removes some TIMs over time and can also create voids. This made those affected by this see temps rise over time, and the higher temps can reduced chips performance. So they would then reapply new TIM every few weeks to bring back the improved temps.

What TIM are you using between the die and IHS?

Maybe see if reapplying some new TIM between the die and IHS fixes the problem...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> another tip,
> 
> where i put the red rectangle, that little thing there, is higher then the pcb,
> if you put back the IHS, keep in mind if you close the bracket, it will slide a bit forward,
> if your not carefull, it will make the IHS go up , maybe just enough to give higher temps on some of the cores
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i wanted to take the black thing off, but didnt know if i would scratch the pcb doing so,
> so what i did was putting the IHS more to the backside. and let the bracket slide it more to the front,
> trying not to let the IHS touch the black thingy to much..
> (srry, my english sometimes limits me to explain things very well,
> hope you understand what im trying to say
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Meh you got the red light dist tho man all of us other guys only dream of having women like that in the windows when we walk down town lol..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh you got the red light dist tho man all of us other guys only dream of having women like that in the windows when we walk down town lol..


LOL









my avatar pic was taken when i was walking down that street hehe...


----------



## PCWargamer

OK, so I have delidded this chip and have a high temp to high temp reduction of 17C using CL Ultra. Good, but not as good as others using both CL PRO and CL Ultra. So I will try remounting again to see if that helps, and I have also ordered some CL PRO to try soon.

But, I also wanted to try lapping the IHS to see if that could help - and when doing so I noticed that it was very concave, with the center of the top sinking in. More than I would have thought until the sanding brought the problem to light. No wonder I had temp problems! I bet the H80 could never make good contact with that thing!

I bet my IHS is not the only one either....but anyway, I have one un-lapped IHS on my system, and the other lapped one ready for testing when I can, and some CL PRO on the way! Hope my temps improve some more....


----------



## bigblock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> well, I know at least 1 person, who achieved 30C drop in temps by using CLL Ultra ... so ... maybe Pro is better maybe not (considering downsides and CoolLaboratory statement that it's designed for copper only and NOT aluminum), but in real world comparison the results are pretty close anyways. considering the downsides of using Pro paste, I picked easier Ultra and am happy with it. Possibly I could have achieved better results with Pro paste IF I did it right the first try, Ultra is not far behind anyways...


Neither ULTRA or PRO are suitable for contact with aluminum.
I found the PRO to be very easy to work with and got a very thin even layer of it on all contact surfaces. I'm new to this, not a pro, I don't know where the PRO product got a rep for being hard to use because I got a mirror surface finish with it just like the video on the first try.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigblock*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> well, I know at least 1 person, who achieved 30C drop in temps by using CLL Ultra ... so ... maybe Pro is better maybe not (considering downsides and CoolLaboratory statement that it's designed for copper only and NOT aluminum), but in real world comparison the results are pretty close anyways. considering the downsides of using Pro paste, I picked easier Ultra and am happy with it. Possibly I could have achieved better results with Pro paste IF I did it right the first try, Ultra is not far behind anyways...
> 
> 
> 
> Neither ULTRA or PRO are suitable for contact with aluminum.
> I found the PRO to be very easy to work with and got a very thin even layer of it on all contact surfaces. I'm new to this, not a pro, I don't know where the PRO product got a rep for being hard to use because I got a mirror surface finish with it just like the video on the first try.
Click to expand...

More user-friendly: Ultra

Pro and Ultra yield the same temperatures so don't worry whichever you get.

I personally like the Pro over the Ultra but that is my own preference. I do use Indigo Xtreme though for my IHS to HSF because I bought a lot actually. I bought about 10 units from a friend who bought them in bulk and got them for a cheaper price.


----------



## Valgaur

Speaking of IX I got my free trials lol. just need to get some liquid pro ordered and possibry sand paper for my IHS. I want the best stuff available lol.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> first off, nice job feniks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ive noticed, and read about it too, you can see for yourself if you compare
> delidded pics,
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that the side im pointing at is open, that has a goal too,
> its a way to get heat out of there..
> i would leave it open next time, well, if there is a next time,
> im not taking apart mine if i dont have to, it works so ..dont touch..lol


dude! Vondutch, you are my hero now!







the Flying Dutchman I'd say you should call yourself








I have just finished completely re-doing the die TIM and IHS cleaning together with black RTV silicone and avoided the area intel stock glue avoided (which you pointed out) and I am saved!!! core# 2 temps are pretty much only slightly above core #1









here, my 4.9GHz screenie (note that before the core #2 was hitting 102C!) where core#2 hit only 87C









Uploaded with ImageShack.us

despite my CPU degradation trouble, at least I was able to fix the temperatures AND my CPU looks still stock







.. I bet even Intel won't notice that I have tampered with IHS









... hitting on 5GHz next


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey *feniks*, one thing to consider is what some deliders have found, that since the die and IHS now touch, and there is some thermal heat/cool action taking place, that this can cause a "pumping" action that slowly removes some TIMs over time and can also create voids. This made those affected by this see temps rise over time, and the higher temps can reduced chips performance. So they would then reapply new TIM every few weeks to bring back the improved temps.
> What TIM are you using between the die and IHS?
> Maybe see if reapplying some new TIM between the die and IHS fixes the problem...


This is new to me, is this true and if so which TIM's are effected? Again this is the first I've heard of this so am somewhat unsure whether or not this is true, correct me if I'm wrong.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey *feniks*, one thing to consider is what some deliders have found, that since the die and IHS now touch, and there is some thermal heat/cool action taking place, that this can cause a "pumping" action that slowly removes some TIMs over time and can also create voids. This made those affected by this see temps rise over time, and the higher temps can reduced chips performance. So they would then reapply new TIM every few weeks to bring back the improved temps.
> What TIM are you using between the die and IHS?
> Maybe see if reapplying some new TIM between the die and IHS fixes the problem...


hey buddy, I use CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra paste ... actually used up the whole syringe in my today's attempts (3 applications total on the die-2-IHS and 1 application on the IHS-2-cooler contact) to make it right







check my post above for results at 4.9GHz








I don't want Pro paste, because it's a PITA to remove while Ultra wipes off with alcohol and paper towels easily








I hope it stays that way for long time ... until my chip dies of degradation ha ha!









I like CLL Ultra paste very much!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> This is new to me, is this true and if so which TIM's are effected? Again this is the first I've heard of this so am somewhat unsure whether or not this is true, correct me if I'm wrong.


*Systemlord*, yes something odd that some deliders found on the anandtech forums. Delidded temp gains degraded over time. Problem is related to TIM choice and caused by thermal action "pumping" some types of TIM out - needing to be replaced over time. The link to the thread is found on the first page of this, our own, thread link under:

*Now for the real reason your Ivy Bridge runs hot.*

Where it notes the following about the die to IHS gap as being the main cause of the IB temp problem, but he also mentions the TIM choice issue they ran into and the need for further TIM testing. They still plan on doing further TIM testing sometime soon.

see #583:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24
_________________________________
....
The take home message there is replacing the CPU TIM doesn't really provide any benefit. Reducing the gap between the CPU and the IHS does. And removing the IHS entirely doesn't really provide much benefit either.

And that stands to reason. The heat is going to flow through the copper of the IHS the same as it does through the copper of the H100 waterblock.

But if there is a thick pad of thermal paste in the way, as was the case with my 3770k at time of purchase, then it doesn't really matter how good the TIM itself is (unless it too is made of metal) because the mere presence of that thick pad of thermal paste becomes the weakest link in the thermal conductivity equation.

Once you eliminate the bottleneck that is the gap between the IHS and the CPU, or if you happen to end up with an Ivy Bridge CPU which doesn't have much of a gap to begin with (Yuriman ), then you have pretty much optimized the system at that point regardless which CPU TIM of choice you employ and regardless whether or not you leave the IHS in place.

*Now the choice of CPU TIM still plays a role in terms of the robustness in maintaining those nice low temperatures. If the so-called "pump out" effect is real then we can expect it to bite us unless we choose a substitute CPU TIM that is designed to avoid such thermo-mechanical effects.*

I haven't really got into testing that part out yet, but I expect IC Diamond and the metal TIMs like Liquid Ultra to be key there.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hey buddy, I use CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra paste ... actually used up the whole syringe in my today's attempts (3 applications total on the die-2-IHS and 1 application on the IHS-2-cooler contact) to make it right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> check my post above for results at 4.9GHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't want Pro paste, because it's a PITA to remove while Ultra wipes off with alcohol and paper towels easily
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope it stays that way for long time ... until my chip dies of degradation ha ha!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like CLL Ultra paste very much!


Great find - and thanks to *VonDutch* for his help. Great to see your temps fixed.









If you use CL Ultra, then that is one of the TIMs that might/should do better on the "pumping" issue. But not fully tested yet. Did you notice how your first application looked before you replaced it today? Do you think the whole fix was due to the IHS problem? Or the new application of the TIM?

Keep an eye out to see if your temps start to degrade over time or not to see if this "pumping" issue is happening. If so, new TIM application will restore temps gains, and you/we will need to consider if Ultra is as good as ICD or PRO at fighting this "pumping" problem.


----------



## Hokies83

Well the only tim that should never go away is Liquid Pro as it is Pure metal the others are not pure they have other things added to them.


----------



## Valgaur

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Systemlord*, yes something odd that some deliders found on the anandtech forums. Delidded temp gains degraded over time. Problem is related to TIM choice and caused by thermal action "pumping" some types of TIM out - needing to be replaced over time. The link to the thread is found on the first page of this, our own, thread link under:
> *Now for the real reason your Ivy Bridge runs hot.*
> Where it notes the following about the die to IHS gap as being the main cause of the IB temp problem, but he also mentions the TIM choice issue they ran into and the need for further TIM testing. They still plan on doing further TIM testing sometime soon.
> see #583:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24
> _________________________________
> ....
> The take home message there is replacing the CPU TIM doesn't really provide any benefit. Reducing the gap between the CPU and the IHS does. And removing the IHS entirely doesn't really provide much benefit either.
> And that stands to reason. The heat is going to flow through the copper of the IHS the same as it does through the copper of the H100 waterblock.
> But if there is a thick pad of thermal paste in the way, as was the case with my 3770k at time of purchase, then it doesn't really matter how good the TIM itself is (unless it too is made of metal) because the mere presence of that thick pad of thermal paste becomes the weakest link in the thermal conductivity equation.
> Once you eliminate the bottleneck that is the gap between the IHS and the CPU, or if you happen to end up with an Ivy Bridge CPU which doesn't have much of a gap to begin with (Yuriman ), then you have pretty much optimized the system at that point regardless which CPU TIM of choice you employ and regardless whether or not you leave the IHS in place.
> *Now the choice of CPU TIM still plays a role in terms of the robustness in maintaining those nice low temperatures. If the so-called "pump out" effect is real then we can expect it to bite us unless we choose a substitute CPU TIM that is designed to avoid such thermo-mechanical effects.*
> I haven't really got into testing that part out yet, but I expect IC Diamond and the metal TIMs like Liquid Ultra to be key there.






Very well put PC. Couldn't have answered any better.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great find - and thanks to *VonDutch* for his help. Great to see your temps fixed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you use CL Ultra, then that is one of the TIMs that might/should do better on the "pumping" issue. But not fully tested yet. Did you notice how your first application looked before you replaced it today? Do you think the whole fix was due to the IHS problem? Or the new application of the TIM?
> Keep an eye out to see if your temps start to degrade over time or not to see if this "pumping" issue is happening. If so, new TIM application will restore temps gains, and you/we will need to consider if Ultra is as good as ICD or PRO at fighting this "pumping" problem.


definitely and absolutely my problem with core #2 running hot was related to putting silicone under IHS where it was not supposed to be. either it was raising the whole IHS upwards or it was blocking some internal air flow. either way it's fixed now after I re-did the delid and omitted the mentioned area while applying black RTV under IHS.

however, my run for 5GHz daily seems to be cursed either way, because now my BIOS is playing tricks on me ... can't go above x49 multi and 140% of CPU current capability no matter what! have just upgraded my Asus MVE bios to new release (published 5 days ago) and even when I set 50x multi and disable the CPU current limits it still reports 49x multi (which is exactly 140% current limit) in Windows, grrrrrr .... and what's worse I'm too drunk by now to think of any solutions that would make sense ha ha! ... I guess I will leave it for tomorrow ...









edit:
tomorrow will also re-submit my deliding club entry with new temps, max OC gain and max OC CPU-Z validation ... just need to figure out why my board started limiting me to 140% of CPU OC on new BIOS ...


----------



## SonDa5

Had problems getting Liquid Pro on my die and block to mount properly. I think I got good coat of it on die and block with good mount now. Running IBT test right now and will post results soon. Looking good so far.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Had problems getting Liquid Pro on my die and block to mount properly. I think I got good coat of it on die and block with good mount now. Running IBT test right now and will post results soon. Looking good so far.


Very interested in how PRO on your system will compare to ICD on your system.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Well the only tim that should never go away is Liquid Pro as it is Pure metal the others are not pure they have other things added to them.


Yes, I think PRO is one of the best choices to fight the possible "pumping" problem and maintain long-term temp gains. The other TIM choice that seems to do well so far is ICD. Ultra should also do good, but it may remain too liquid (unlike PRO) and thus suffer the "pumping" problem over time.

More long-term TIM testing needs to take place to figure out the eventual list of good and bad TIMs for delidding. People on this thread should be on the lookout for temp degradation issues and let us know what TIM you are using and for how long, so we can start to see which TIMs are best ourselves.


----------



## SonDa5

Delidded IB i5-3570k @ 4.5GHZ 1.15v with *NO IHS* with DT SNIPER Water block
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2551498

Loop configuration as tested. Single 120mm slim HWLABS Black ICE radiator.


TIM IC Diamond 24
IBT 4.5GHZ Maximum memory tested 5 passes
Ambient Temps 26C
Best Temps seen over a 2 week period using IC Diamond



TIM Liquid Pro
IBT 4.5GHZ Maximum memory tested 10 passes
Ambient Temps 25C
Fresh Install



With IC Diamond 24 average temp of each core was *73C* under IBT load. With Liquid Pro average temp of each core is at *61C!!* under IBT load.









Taking a look at my IB 3570k progress since delidding.

Before Delidding.

Ambient Temp 26C

TIM IC Diamond 24

Temps under LinX load 83C 93C 89C 84C average of *87.25C* per core.

*Since delidding I have been able to lower my average core temps under IBT 100% load at 4.5GHZ by 26.25C per core!!!*


----------



## beniroc

Valgaur wondering if you got my validation link its in my sig.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> dude! Vondutch, you are my hero now!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the Flying Dutchman I'd say you should call yourself
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have just finished completely re-doing the die TIM and IHS cleaning together with black RTV silicone and avoided the area intel stock glue avoided (which you pointed out) and I am saved!!! core# 2 temps are pretty much only slightly above core #1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> here, my 4.9GHz screenie (note that before the core #2 was hitting 102C!) where core#2 hit only 87C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> despite my CPU degradation trouble, at least I was able to fix the temperatures AND my CPU looks still stock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .. I bet even Intel won't notice that I have tampered with IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... hitting on 5GHz next


Haha, glad it all worked out for you







great!,
but i wont change my name ...LOL


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> With IC Diamond24 average temp of each core was *73C* under IBT load.
> With Liquid Pro average temp of each core is at *61C!!* under IBT load.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Taking a look at my IB 3570k progress since delidding.
> Before Delidding.
> Ambient Temp 26C
> TIM IC Diamond 24
> Temps under LinX load 83C 93C 89C 84C average of *87.25C* per core.
> *Since delidding I have been able to lower my average core temps under IBT 100% load at 4.5GHZ by 26.25C per core!!!*


Great results sonda








i almost knew for sure if you got the mount right, CLP would do better then ICD


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yes, I think PRO is one of the best choices to fight the possible "pumping" problem and maintain long-term temp gains. The other TIM choice that seems to do well so far is ICD. Ultra should also do good, but it may remain too liquid (unlike PRO) and thus suffer the "pumping" problem over time.
> More long-term TIM testing needs to take place to figure out the eventual list of good and bad TIMs for delidding. People on this thread should be on the lookout for temp degradation issues and let us know what TIM you are using and for how long, so we can start to see which TIMs are best ourselves.


All i can say, till now liquid pro is only getting better, after weeks of usage
i noticed the temp difference between cores reduced more and more,
while i still had a temp diff off about 6-8C between cores when i just applied it,
(before de-lid it was 10-15C)

short after applying

6C idle, 7C light load

today









4C idle, only 1C difference on light normal use, like above..

wouldnt be fair if i didnt do this with load,
this is after a few min with Aida

only 4C difference between cores , nice huh









im tempted to take the IHS off and look how it spread out after weeks of usage,
but im afraid i cant get it done again this good..lol
its hard to get that mugen2 rev.B mounted well if your alone,
my kids(13 and 15 years old) helped me last time..one holding motherboard,
the other holding the backplate, me mounting that heavy cooler ..lol
was a fun project to do with them, that way i already learn them about
building computers, repairs etc








that way, if im 85 years, and my hands are shaking, they can do the work for me ...LOL


----------



## kgtuning

That's pretty awesome Von. Mine is 4 c apart at load. Oh forgot to mention in one of my last posts with my IBT runs that the average temp drop was 22.25 celcuis. So I'm pretty happy. Using the high temps its 24 c difference and 22.25 c for average temp drop.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> That's pretty awesome Von. Mine is 4 c apart at load. Oh forgot to mention in one of my last posts with my IBT runs that the average temp drop was 22.25 celcuis. So I'm pretty happy. Using the high temps its 24 c difference and 22.25 c for average temp drop.


yep








despite of the few chips we lost when de-lidding, i see more and more happy faces in here ...









o, changed my avatar, i like that spinning IHS on the Die ..lol
now we only have 1 dumber left







aaaww.......

and i got a +REP today ...woot!!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> despite of the few chips we lost when de-lidding, i see more and more happy faces in here ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, changed my avatar, i like that spinning IHS on the Die ..lol
> now we only have 1 dumber left
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaaww.......
> and i got a +REP today ...woot!!


Definally cool avatar..


----------



## Harry604

He just took the lid off my 3570k....
How do I get the silicone off the pcb

Thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Harry604*
> 
> He just took the lid off my 3570k....
> How do I get the silicone off the pcb
> Thanks


Finger nails and cussing.. Worked for me lol.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> All i can say, till now liquid pro is only getting better, after weeks of usage
> i noticed the temp difference between cores reduced more and more,
> while i still had a temp diff off about 6-8C between cores when i just applied it,
> (before de-lid it was 10-15C)
> short after applying
> 
> 6C idle, 7C light load
> today
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4C idle, only 1C difference on light normal use, like above..
> wouldnt be fair if i didnt do this with load,
> this is after a few min with Aida
> 
> only 4C difference between cores , nice huh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im tempted to take the IHS off and look how it spread out after weeks of usage,
> but im afraid i cant get it done again this good..lol
> its hard to get that mugen2 rev.B mounted well if your alone,
> my kids(13 and 15 years old) helped me last time..one holding motherboard,
> the other holding the backplate, me mounting that heavy cooler ..lol
> was a fun project to do with them, that way i already learn them about
> building computers, repairs etc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that way, if im 85 years, and my hands are shaking, they can do the work for me ...LOL


Those are the best Idle temps ive ever seen.. what do you have the windows open and ice sickles hanging from the ceiling?

While you have 2 of the girls from the red light dist to keep you warm?









I always windle to simple the local offerings of Amsterdam... But i went to Thai land instead ...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Those are the best Idle temps ive ever seen.. what do you have the windows open and ice sickles hanging from the ceiling?
> While you have 2 of the girls from the red light dist to keep you warm?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I always windle to simple the local offerings of Amsterdam... But i went to Thai land instead ...


my hallway is very cool, no heater, so i decided to put my comp there, and no noise in livingroom









the 2 girls are just a bonus, winter is coming ..lol (how did you know??)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my hallway is very cool, no heater, so i decided to put my comp there, and no noise in livingroom
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the 2 girls are just a bonus, winter is coming ..lol (how did you know??)


I know if i lived there i would take advantage of that lol...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Harry604*
> 
> He just took the lid off my 3570k....
> How do I get the silicone off the pcb
> Thanks


cool, hope everything went well for ya,
yea, what hokies said.. and papertowl and rubbing alcohol ..

Welcome


----------



## Harry604

woooo it booted

i thought for sure i dinged the pcb


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Harry604*
> 
> woooo it booted
> i thought for sure i dinged the pcb


Grats!









Might wanna remove 2500k and put 3560k in sig lol.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Harry604*
> 
> woooo it booted
> i thought for sure i dinged the pcb


Hopefully you can post some screen shots with temps and clock speeds.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Harry604*
> 
> woooo it booted
> i thought for sure i dinged the pcb


talk about a "stresstest" ey ...lol

o, and did you take pic's? what compound are you using? before and after temps etc etc...
you know, we want to know everything ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Grats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Might wanna remove 2500k and put 3560k in sig lol.


3560K ??...LOL didnt know they made a new model..


----------



## TSXmike

did a practice round on an old core2. cracked the die (was being impatient), but wasnt planning on using it anyways.

good learning experience.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TSXmike*
> 
> did a practice round on an old core2. cracked the die (was being impatient), but wasnt planning on using it anyways.
> good learning experience.


Just got to take your time.


----------



## feniks

resubmitting my entry to the club!









anyways here are temps BEFORE & AFTER, nearly *31C improvement* in temps under load at 4.6GHz!

on the left side of both screen shots you can see AI Suite Sensor Monitoring, the only 2 you can take note of are temperature sensors OPT1 & OPT2 I use to have an idea of computer air & water conditions and so they are:
a) OPT1 water loop temperature (sensor mounted in drain valve, before returning to reservoir)
b) OPT2 air inlet temperature at computer air intake (and internal 360 rad), sensor mounted on fan shroud

BEFORE (IHS TIM was PK-3):

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

AFTER (IHS TIM was CL Liquid Ultra):

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

OCN name: feniks
CPU: i7 3770K
on die-TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: 400
OC after delid: 5.1GHz
Temp drops: 30-31C (adjusted for ambient temp difference between tests, high-2-high calculation)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2552128


----------



## Notion

Ok here is my 5ghz







whoop!!
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2552172


----------



## Valgaur

I can't update you guys until later lol I have work until 7....sooooo about 5 and a half hours left


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> resubmitting my entry to the club!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways here are temps BEFORE & AFTER, nearly *31C improvement* in temps under load at 4.6GHz!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2552128


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Ok here is my 5ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> whoop!!
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2552172


wauw feniks, thats alot.. gratz

yesss!...gratz notion ..well done, now push it some more ...lol..jk jk


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I can't update you guys until later lol I have work until 7....sooooo about 5 and a half hours left


looks at valgaurs avatar...you look tired ...take the rest of the day off ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TSXmike*
> 
> did a practice round on an old core2. cracked the die (was being impatient), but wasnt planning on using it anyways.
> good learning experience.


wished i could have done some practice before the real deal..
like kgtuning said , Just got to take your time.
didnt know core2 wasnt soldered tho..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wished i could have done some practice before the real deal..
> like kgtuning said , Just got to take your time.
> didnt know core2 wasnt soldered tho..


It must have been soldered... to break in half.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I can't update you guys until later lol I have work until 7....sooooo about 5 and a half hours left


Lol someone else who is at work on a sunday? Guess it is as productive as mine...lol.


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> didnt know core2 wasnt soldered tho..


It is


----------



## TSXmike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> It is


this wasnt.

i totally expected it to be soldered too. but as soon as i had the seal cut out, the heatspreader just about fell off.

was some sort of grey TIM between the die and the HS. i can take some pics when i get home (was going to anyways, the inside of the die looks neat! )


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wauw feniks, thats alot.. gratz


he he, thanks, I am really happy how it worked out finally ... not to mention that I was totally drunk with Heineken when re-deliding this cpu at like 2am or so








one thing, I had to do was to use older BIOS on my MVE, the latest 1309 has some bugs in CPU overcurrent protection area and didn't allow me to go above 4.9GHz, while with older BIOS I could boot up to 5.1GHz no trouble ... well, it took hell of vcore (1.63v under light load), so my chip is not too good per high clocking ... couldn't do 5.2GHz at higher volts, because BIOS was forcing me back to configuration with a message "CPU overvoltage error" LOL!

as per my former 5GHz at 1.46v under load, it wasn't stable when I re-run IBT 10 rounds in standard mode and eventually it took 1.512v vcore under load to make it fully stable under IBT Max mode, good enough I'd say








5.1GHz booted to Windows with no errors (and no more WHEA warnings in logs while loading Windows) with a lot more vcore ... however I was using Ultra High 75% LLC with offsets, if that matters.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Delidded IB i5-3570k @ 4.5GHZ 1.15v with *NO IHS* with DT SNIPER Water block
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2551498
> Loop configuration as tested. Single 120mm slim HWLABS Black ICE radiator.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TIM IC Diamond 24
> IBT 4.5GHZ Maximum memory tested 5 passes
> Ambient Temps 26C
> Best Temps seen over a 2 week period using IC Diamond
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TIM Liquid Pro
> IBT 4.5GHZ Maximum memory tested 10 passes
> Ambient Temps 25C
> Fresh Install
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With IC Diamond 24 average temp of each core was *73C* under IBT load. With Liquid Pro average temp of each core is at *61C!!* under IBT load.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Taking a look at my IB 3570k progress since delidding.
> Before Delidding.
> Ambient Temp 26C
> TIM IC Diamond 24
> Temps under LinX load 83C 93C 89C 84C average of *87.25C* per core.
> *Since delidding I have been able to lower my average core temps under IBT 100% load at 4.5GHZ by 26.25C per core!!!*


These are significant findings *SonDa5*.Great overall temp gains, and looks more like CL PRO is better than ICD with these mountings on your system. Please keep all of us updated on how your system does over time and when you make any more changes. Good stuff.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> We may have to just see what we have (for saved temp results) for those of us who have already joined from our pre-delided days, and then do comparisons off of those recorded OC, vcore, and temps. We can't go back to being lidded to redo temp runs!
> But for new deliders we can state what we want after what we have learned so far.
> 1) I'd think 4.5GHz is a reasonable OC as it is typical of what lidded IBs are able to reach.
> 2) IBT default 10x runs would be good choice for load program
> 3) Also, for temps, I think the high to high way would be the easiest to do and would have useful info
> We can decide on some good club rules, then post them on page one, and hope they are easy and useful enough, while also being standardized and able to generate some useful and helpful information to help others choose good TIMs, and see how delidding can help them get the temps IB can and should have.
> What are you guys thoughts on these ideas?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I like this, I vote with PCwargamer, and not just because he had the most epic avatar ever and traded it out with a yoga master. I actually don't know what the diff is between pre a post lid on my chip. So I will be of no help when it come to the spread sheet. But for new comers, it makes sense. I do get grandfathered in right.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ...
> I do agree:
> -4.5GHz as a baseline achievable for all
> -quick 10 rounds of IBT 2.54 Standard (1GB RAM used) as a baseline load test and max temp generator for all cores
> -comparing hottest before deliding (core1 for me) to hottest after deliding (core2 for me) seems like the best method - reasoning is simple you can't go higher than hottest core go, it limits the clocks (thermally) at 105C, no matter which core hits the limits, the whole die downclocks to cool down.
> -we also should all use the same core temp monitoring program, e.g. RealTemp 3.70


Thanks *neopunx*, and good addition *feniks* - using the same core temp monitoring program is a good idea.

So *Valgaur*, if we are good with this, what do you think about adding something like the following to the first page delidding club thread instructions:
________________________________________________________________________________________
Please record the following information before and after delidding:

1) Obtain a 4.5GHz OC that can run IBT
2) Lanch RealTemp to record temps
3) Run IBT using default settings (10x runs) at the 4.5GHz OC
4) Record resulting highest core temp

Compare the resulting highest temp before and after delidding as your temp gain from delidding. - Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________________________

Please feel free to modify any of this to make it better and consider if this would improve the information our club can generate on the positive temp effects of delidding as well as what different TIMs do to assist or hinder the possible temp gains.

Of course, this is to improve the info gain as we go on, so those members who started before these additional rules should be grandfathered in, and if they can use whatever before and after temps they can it should be fine. Opinions from others are welcome!!!

Edit: Three other things we might want to add - run CPU-z to note OC and vcore info, run StickyNotes with OCN screenname etc., and then do screensaves of these to maybe post along with the delidded chip pic and the CPU-Z max OC validation as proof.


----------



## feniks

all sounds good to me per those pre-formal rules, however I have no 4.5GHz before deliding to compare with LOL!
maybe let's just keep it at whatever OC above 42x the user prefers to make a comparison of before & after? I personally usually start overclocking my SB/IB chips at 4.6GHz and move forwards where all the fun starts








Also it might be important to state that before screenshot should be fresh (last 24 hours) and not something like from half a year ago which could have changed a dozen times already in meantime








Lastly, ambient room temperature at computer/radiator intake is important! it's hard to compare before and after when one doesn't state what the ambient was at. e.g. former test was done at 18C ambient while after test was done at 26C ambient, will make high to new high core temp meaningless, unless one (mathematically) adjusts them to same level of ambient ... then the comparison will be direct.

speaking of which, I need an advice, because I am wondering if my chip simply hits a voltage wall past 5.1GHz or not ... do those numbers below look more or less normal or something totally off like I am trying to overvolt the hell out of it for no apparent reason?

4.6GHz - IBT stable vcore under load 1.240v
*4.7Ghz - IBT stable vcore under load 1.288v (0.048v more than 100MHz lower)
4.8GHz - IBT stable vcore under load 1.344v (0.056v more than 100MHz lower)
4.9GHz - IBT stable vcore under load 1.416v (0.072v more than 100MHz lower)
5.0GHz - IBT stable vcore under load 1.512v (0.096v more than 100MHz lower)
5.1GHz - IBT stable vcore under load 1.638v (0.126v more than 100MHz lower)
5.2GHz - even possible with this chip? BIOS refuses to boot it at fixed voltage specified at 1.7V and CPU OverCurrent Protection disabled ... hitting a wall at multi 52x?
*all OC clocks & voltages under load (except for 4.7GHz) were double-checked in last 24 hours, so they are fresh and current, stable under IBT for at least 10 quick rounds or 2 (up to 20 sometimes) Maximum mode rounds, no WHEA warnings.

I use Ultra High 75% LLC and offsets for now, if it makes a difference. tried fixed vcore (also at UH LLC) at 1.7v for 5.2ghz but still no go, bios doesn't let me boot it stating some crap about CPU Overvoltage error (first time I see it) ... I guess I should start working the BCLK up


----------



## PCWargamer

Lapping IHS helped improve my temps another 12C!









1) pre-delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.344v high temp = 96C
2) delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.344v high temp = 82C (-14C)
3) lapped IHS & delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.352v high temp = 70C (-26C)

One reason for the additional 12C gain was that my IHS was concave, which came out during sanding/lapping, so that the HSF never made the best contact with it. This is still using CL Ultra as the CL PRO has not yet arrived.

I would encourage others to consider lapping their IHS too as they may find additional temp gains from doing so.











Hey *Valgaur*, when you get home from work *can you update my temp gain to 26C!*


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Lapping IHS helped improve my temps another 12C!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1) pre-delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.344v high temp = 96C
> 2) delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.344v high temp = 82C (-14C)
> 3) lapped IHS & delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.352v high temp = 70C (-26C)
> One reason for the additional 12C gain was that my IHS was concave, which came out during sanding/lapping, so that the HSF never made the best contact with it. This is still using CL Ultra as the CL PRO has not yet arrived.
> I would encourage others to consider lapping their IHS too as they may find additional temp gains from doing so.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey *Valgaur*, when you get home from work *can you update my temp gain to 27C!*


Yah lapping helps ..

Im guessing at my temp drops i know with 1.65v i can not get past 85c in a 78 degree room.

And this is not no 10 15 min stress test this is 7 hrs.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Lapping IHS helped improve my temps another 12C!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1) pre-delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.344v high temp = 96C
> 2) delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.344v high temp = 82C (-14C)
> 3) lapped IHS & delidded IBT (default 10x run) @4.5GHz & 1.352v high temp = 70C (-26C)
> One reason for the additional 12C gain was that my IHS was concave, which came out during sanding/lapping, so that the HSF never made the best contact with it. This is still using CL Ultra as the CL PRO has not yet arrived.
> I would encourage others to consider lapping their IHS too as they may find additional temp gains from doing so.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey *Valgaur*, when you get home from work *can you update my temp gain to 27C!*


wow, that's quite an improvement! grats bro








will consider it, if my chip survives the next month








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah lapping helps ..
> Im guessing at my temp drops i know with 1.65v i can not get past 85c in a 78 degree room.
> And this is not no 10 15 min stress test this is 7 hrs.


I could only wish for such temps at 1.65V vcore ... my chip at 1.52v and 50x multi already closes in to thermal limits on 2 "middle" cores when running IBT in Maximum mode (4x4GB ram @ 2200Mhz) ... ambient similar to yours, maybe a tad higher.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> wow, that's quite an improvement! grats bro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will consider it, if my chip survives the next month
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could only wish for such temps at 1.65V vcore ... my chip at 1.52v and 50x multi already closes in to thermal limits on 2 "middle" cores when running IBT in Maximum mode (4x4GB ram @ 2200Mhz) ... ambient similar to yours, maybe a tad higher.


I have 2x 4gb 2400mhz ram.. My stuff just runs cool.. I also have 2 Non Ref 680s that even at idle vent some heat into my case.. I have 2 Cougar Vortex fans in push and 2 silent X in pull config.. Nothing fancy...

Just lapped IHS and sanded down back edge to make better contact and with Liquid Pro the App is super easy to get 100% perfect.. If it needs to be thicker just remove and put more on top.

Also if the 2 middle cores are hotter then core 4 something is wrong with the Ap cause it is proven that core 4 is next to the IGPU and should always run hotter then the other 3.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have 2x 4gb 2400mhz ram.. My stuff just runs cool.. I also have 2 Non Ref 680s that even at idle vent some heat into my case.. I have 2 Cougar Vortex fans in push and 2 silent X in pull config.. Nothing fancy...
> Just lapped IHS and sanded down back edge to make better contact and with Liquid Pro the App is super easy to get 100% perfect.. If it needs to be thicker just remove and put more on top.
> Also if the 2 middle cores are hotter then core 4 something is wrong with the Ap cause it is proven that core 4 is next to the IGPU and should always run hotter then the other 3.


cool









for now I removed 2x4GB sticks and left other 2x4GB in, made it run 1333mhz @ 1.50v so I can make focus on cpu oc only. so far was able to boot into windows with 1.52v fixed vcore (switched to extreme LLC for now) at 51 multi, stabilizing it and will see where I land. hopefully later on I will be able to get to 5.2GHz with 102 bclk.


----------



## hermitmaster

I've read through about half of the thread, but there is a ton to read. I just have one question: Has anyone tried lapping or removing material in any way from the bottom of the IHS to reduce the gap between the die and the IHS? I would think reducing that gap further would be highly beneficial to temperatures.


----------



## Killa Cam

does this really help temps? i think i got a hot azz 3770k, how much of a decrease should i see if i was to successfully do this with my brain?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Killa Cam*
> 
> does this really help temps? i think i got a hot azz 3770k, how much of a decrease should i see if i was to successfully do this with my brain?


25 = 35 C using Cool Labs Liquid pro
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hermitmaster*
> 
> I've read through about half of the thread, but there is a ton to read. I just have one question: Has anyone tried lapping or removing material in any way from the bottom of the IHS to reduce the gap between the die and the IHS? I would think reducing that gap further would be highly beneficial to temperatures.


I sanded down the back side a bit id say it helped bring the IHS closer to the die and helped a bit.


----------



## Killa Cam

im using a hyper 212 evo with gelid extreme tim to cool my 3770k. idk, on idle i get about 28c but i ran small fft on prime, and my temps are at mid 80s c from jump. im using stock voltage too. im going to reseat my evo and reapply the pea method of tim as i used a thin spread (which i think is the reason







). if that don't work - its time to delid this mofo


----------



## hermitmaster

I just tried running LinX instead of Prime95... 10C higher on load!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hermitmaster*
> 
> I've read through about half of the thread, but there is a ton to read. I just have one question: Has anyone tried lapping or removing material in any way from the bottom of the IHS to reduce the gap between the die and the IHS? I would think reducing that gap further would be highly beneficial to temperatures.


The main thing that causes the IHS to rise above the die, and cause a gap, is the black glue Intel used to secure the IHS to the PCB. Once all the black glue is removed the IHS should sit on the die without touching the PCB already. You should then be able to spin the IHS on top of the die without contacting the PCB like this:



(Pic thanks to VonDutch!)

I did lap the inside of my IHS to try to make it flatter and remove the convex problem which that side of my IHS had - so it now sits better and more flat onto the die. Temps are much better for me since lapping the top and bottom of my IHS ~12C. Overall temp gain from delidding and lapping IHS is 26C.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The main thing that causes the IHS to rise above the die, and cause a gap, is the black glue Intel used to secure the IHS to the PCB. Once all the black glue is removed the IHS should sit on the die without touching the PCB already. You should then be able to spin the IHS on top of the die without contacting the PCB like this:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Pic thanks to VonDutch!)
> I did lap the inside of my IHS to try to make it flatter and remove the convex problem which that side of my IHS had - so it now sits better and more flat onto the die. Temps are much better for me since lapping the top and bottom of my IHS ~12C. Overall temp gain from delidding and lapping IHS is 27C.


12c ? wow thats a big difference. nice job! what did you use for lapping 1000 1500 2000? guess I'm gonna lap mine. lol


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> 12c ? wow thats a big difference. nice job! what did you use for lapping 1000 1500 2000? guess I'm gonna lap mine. lol


Yeah. Much more difference than I thought it would make when I decided to try it. I expected ~5C, not 12C.









As I noted, turned out my IHS was concave on the top and convex on the bottom so the lapping/sanding actually made it flat on both sides. Big help.









I went with 400>600>800>1000. I have some 1500, but I have read that you do not get much of a difference after 800, so my fingers were tired and I skipped the 1500.









I'd say it is well worth trying....


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah. Much more difference than I thought it would make when I decided to try it. I expected ~5C, not 12C.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As I noted, turned out my IHS was concave on the top and convex on the bottom so the lapping/sanding actually made it flat on both sides. Big help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went with 400>600>800>1000. I have some 1500, but I have read that you do not get much of a difference after 800, so my fingers were tired and I skipped the 1500.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd say it is well worth trying....


Man if I can drop another 5c, I'd be stoked. I will say I'll expect 2-3 c which still would be great. should just buy a copper square that has been machined lapped.. and replace the intel ihs....


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> he he, thanks, I am really happy how it worked out finally ... not to mention that I was totally drunk with Heineken when re-deliding this cpu at like 2am or so
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> one thing, I had to do was to use older BIOS on my MVE, the latest 1309 has some bugs in CPU overcurrent protection area and didn't allow me to go above 4.9GHz, while with older BIOS I could boot up to 5.1GHz no trouble ... well, it took hell of vcore (1.63v under light load), so my chip is not too good per high clocking ... couldn't do 5.2GHz at higher volts, because BIOS was forcing me back to configuration with a message "CPU overvoltage error" LOL!
> as per my former 5GHz at 1.46v under load, it wasn't stable when I re-run IBT 10 rounds in standard mode and eventually it took 1.512v vcore under load to make it fully stable under IBT Max mode, good enough I'd say
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.1GHz booted to Windows with no errors (and no more WHEA warnings in logs while loading Windows) with a lot more vcore ... however I was using Ultra High 75% LLC with offsets, if that matters.


Most of us who are hitting 5.4 and higher are booting into windows with our reg 24/7 OC, and using what ever OC program to raise it. I'm pretty sure most if not all on Air/H2O would have trouble booting successfully with a high overclock. Mine did boot into 5.2 I think, but it was bad high VCORE to keep it stable in Boot up.


----------



## Valgaur

Okay I'm FINALLY back from work...and holy crap we make this thread move lol. I'll be ordering LP this week and getting some sand paper 500<1000<1500<2000 most likely for the smoothness.

@PC How about we do this for the format

For the submitting process of your temps use the following rules.

1. Get to 4.5 Ghz
2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program)
3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started)
4. Report your HIGHEST temp doesn't matter what core it is reported from.
5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)

Thanks again! This may be a ridiculous amount of info to be provided to join, but this is for research to see what we can show Intel eventually and how badly they messed up. (Yes I'm serious abort this part)

This is also for people looking into Delidding and seeing just how crazy their temps can decrease by Delidding.

Thanks yet again!


----------



## Valgaur

Also if I miss people's updates gonna read the last 6 pages lol just remind me on here


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay I'm FINALLY back from work...and holy crap we make this thread move lol. I'll be ordering LP this week and getting some sand paper 500<1000<1500<2000 most likely for the smoothness.
> @PC How about we do this for the format
> 
> For the submitting process of your temps use the following rules.
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program)
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started)
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp doesn't matter what core it is reported from.
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> Thanks again! This may be a ridiculous amount of info to be provided to join, but this is for research to see what we can show Intel eventually and how badly they messed up. (Yes I'm serious abort this part)
> This is also for people looking into Delidding and seeing just how crazy their temps can decrease by Delidding.
> Thanks yet again!


800 --> 1500 --> 2000 >-- 2500

And using that method my temp dropped 35c lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 800 --> 1500 --> 2000 >-- 2500
> And using that method my temp dropped 35c lol


Thanks I'll use those. how hard was it to lap the inside of the IHS


----------



## Hokies83

Easy outside is more important i do not think the inside does anything.

Just lay sand paper flat and put some water on it.. to make it perfect shiney your gonna need a piece of leather or something Car buffer etc lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Easy outside is more important i do not think the inside does anything.
> Just lay sand paper flat and put some water on it.. to make it perfect shiney your gonna need a piece of leather or something.


Yup thats what I was going to do


----------



## Valgaur

These are the peoples who I need their CPU-Z Validation links for their max OC's

daddyfatsax
beniroc (I swear I saw yours on here....but I can't find it now....GRRRRRR) Also need your temps drops

SonDa5

Thats it.

Ohh guys for my Second page of the Spreadsheet I will be trying to make a sheet involving what grain sand paper you use before after temps, OC will be set to 4500 Mhz for everyone since it's needed to show Intel how they messed up. (Yeah I'm serious about this I know it's a repeat but I want them to know they messed up and we can prove to them to change this issue and give us the credit)

Also I'm thinking of adding other things to the second spreadsheet but not sure exactly. Ideas would be awesome!

Thanks again guys and gals! (Not sure if we have any gals in this thread yet)


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Most of us who are hitting 5.4 and higher are booting into windows with our reg 24/7 OC, and using what ever OC program to raise it. I'm pretty sure most if not all on Air/H2O would have trouble booting successfully with a high overclock. Mine did boot into 5.2 I think, but it was bad high VCORE to keep it stable in Boot up.


I see








well, call me old school, but I don't truly trust those software OC methods LOL! when seeing voltage monitoring an adjustment screen I always see at least one voltage off a bit and when applying changes it seems like it alters that one too, never mind though probably it works fine (used that method for below 48x multi clocks once or twice).

anyways! I did another suicide run with my chip using my room AC outlet to serve as Cold Air Intake for my system hehe - mind that I calculate Dew Point when doing it and make sure I have around 4C safety cushion between calculated Dew Point temperature and lowest temperature of air inlet to my system (computer has a temp sensor on intake fan shroud).
it produced air intake temperature at front (internal) 360 radiator at 8-9C
water loop temperature dropped to 13-14C once stabilized at idle

results are ... well ... not great he he ... my chip sky rockets voltage demand past 5GHz to be stable and so I was able to stabilize 5.1GHz under IBT Standard 10 rounds (no whea warnings in logs), but it called for ...1.648v vcore under load ... it hit briefly 105C on one core a few times, but die downclocked only once at very end of test (round 10)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

did some benching with SuperPI 1.5, 3dmark11 & Vantage and all got improved except for 3dmark11 which kept getting me slightly lower score than with CPU at 5GHz ... hmmm...
http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4358506
at 5.1GHz SuperPI 1.5 32M calculation completed in 6m 35.064s


Then I went for 5.2GHz and since I couldn't stabilize with IBT (temps) I sort of guessed working vcore a bit, basically allows me to load Windows, run SuperPI or CPU-Z validation ... at 1.74v actual vcore ha ha! tried benching, but CPU craps out under load (more vcore needed) with WHEA in logs ... and I didn't dare to raise it further for sakes of safety of my CPU (and my sanity) ... it wasn't far away, but still ~1.775v for a stable 5.2GHz sounds like crap LOL! ...
at 5.2GHz SuperPI 1.5 32M calculation completed in 6m 28.494s


tried booting to 5.3GHz, but even with 1.75 it won't boot without crapping out, so no go. I guess I learned the voltage/clock limits of my CPU today, and since temperatures don't matter much anymore (even lapping IHS wouldn't help me much) I am officially done with need for speed and CPU modding for now hehe







was a fun ride though, enjoyed it thanks to this forums







:thumb:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well, call me old school, but I don't truly trust those software OC methods LOL! when seeing voltage monitoring an adjustment screen I always see at least one voltage off a bit and when applying changes it seems like it alters that one too, never mind though probably it works fine (used that method for below 48x multi clocks once or twice).
> anyways! I did another suicide run with my chip using my room AC outlet to serve as Cold Air Intake for my system hehe - mind that I calculate Dew Point when doing it and make sure I have around 4C safety cushion between calculated Dew Point temperature and lowest temperature of air inlet to my system (computer has a temp sensor on intake fan shroud).
> it produced air intake temperature at front (internal) 360 radiator at 8-9C
> water loop temperature dropped to 13-14C once stabilized at idle
> results are ... well ... not great he he ... my chip sky rockets voltage demand past 5GHz to be stable and so I was able to stabilize 5.1GHz under IBT Standard 10 rounds (no whea warnings in logs), but it called for ...1.648v vcore under load ... it hit briefly 105C on one core a few times, but die downclocked only once at very end of test (round 10)
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> did some benching with SuperPI 1.5, 3dmark11 & Vantage and all got improved except for 3dmark11 which kept getting me slightly lower score than with CPU at 5GHz ... hmmm...
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4358506
> at 5.1GHz SuperPI 1.5 32M calculation completed in 6m 35.064s
> 
> Then I went for 5.2GHz and since I couldn't stabilize with IBT (temps) I sort of guessed working vcore a bit, basically allows me to load Windows, run SuperPI or CPU-Z validation ... at 1.74v actual vcore ha ha! tried benching, but CPU craps out under load (more vcore needed) with WHEA in logs ... and I didn't dare to raise it further for sakes of safety of my CPU (and my sanity) ... it wasn't far away, but still ~1.775v for a stable 5.2GHz sounds like crap LOL! ...
> at 5.2GHz SuperPI 1.5 32M calculation completed in 6m 28.494s
> 
> tried booting to 5.3GHz, but even with 1.75 it won't boot without crapping out, so no go. I guess I learned the voltage/clock limits of my CPU today, and since temperatures don't matter much anymore (even lapping IHS wouldn't help me much) I am officially done with need for speed and CPU modding for now hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> was a fun ride though, enjoyed it thanks to this forums
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :thumb:


Just wait....Thats what i thought at 5.1

and ur updated


----------



## luciddreamer124

I really wish I hadn't seen this thread :/. I'm 16 so I can't really afford trashing my 3770k, but now that I see all these crazy results I am soooo tempted to try delidding haha.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just wait....Thats what i thought at 5.1
> and ur updated


thanks for an update








do you have some secret method for running stable at higher speeds? or my chip is going to mutate into something else in a few days?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> thanks for an update
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> do you have some secret method for running stable at higher speeds? or my chip is going to mutate into something else in a few days?


I used Aida a few times but then got them to run IBT it really is a tough thing to do set everything in bios to go for a good OC what mobo you got?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I used Aida a few times but then got them to run IBT it really is a tough thing to do set everything in bios to go for a good OC what mobo you got?


I have AIDA64, use it for comparing memory benchmarks between speeds & timings mostly and some sensor readings sometimes. where does it have a CPU stress tester, don't even know it had one LOL?
My board is asus maximus v extreme.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I have AIDA64, use it for comparing memory benchmarks between speeds & timings mostly and some sensor readings sometimes. where does it have a CPU stress tester, don't even know it had one LOL?
> My board is asus maximus v extreme.


Its in tools i believe its on the top of the page. and Thats a awesome OCing mobo man...built for it


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Its in tools i believe its on the top of the page. and Thats a awesome OCing mobo man...built for it


thanks and thanks


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> I really wish I hadn't seen this thread :/. I'm 16 so I can't really afford trashing my 3770k, but now that I see all these crazy results I am soooo tempted to try delidding haha.


Make sure you don't try this unless your mom and dad are ok with it.


----------



## PCWargamer

OK. With the new lower temps from lapping I wanted to try a new High OC and some benching. I was able to hit a new high OC with this new chip of 5.207GHz @ 1.576v:

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2552616

I was also able to bench
- Cinebench and IBT at 4.9GHz
- wPrime 32M and 1024M at 5.0GHz
- superPi 1M and 32M at 5.1GHz.

(I'll post the screensave proofs on the IVY Stable & Suicide thread)

My superPi 32M was 6m 40.572s - slower than *feniks* super maximus v extreme which did it in 6m 35.064s at 5.1GHz - good job there!











*Valgaur*, please update my n*ew high OC to 5.207GHZ*, and my *temp gain to 26C*.

Also, sandpaper I used for lapping was 400>600>800>1000. The 400 was very helpful with getting rid of the concave sinkhole on the top, and the convex bulge on the bottom of the IHS.









I have heard in multiple places that there is little to no gain from anything beyond 800. (Anyone have some links that I can check out that note otherwise? I'd be happy to learn more)


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> I really wish I hadn't seen this thread :/. I'm 16 so I can't really afford trashing my 3770k, but now that I see all these crazy results I am soooo tempted to try delidding haha.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Make sure you don't try this unless your mom and dad are ok with it.


*SonDa5* is not kidding - my first try destroyed my first 3770K and cost me $300 to replace it. This is not something to try unless you can cover the risk of loss as not a few people have lost chips from trying this.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> thanks and thanks


Yep it is what sets it Apart from every other board... it has setting to help with Ln2 Overclocking where the others do not.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> OK. With the new lower temps from lapping I wanted to try a new High OC and some benching. I was able to hit a new high OC with this new chip of 5.207GHz @ 1.576v:
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2552616
> I was also able to bench
> - Cinebench and IBT at 4.9GHz
> - wPrime 32M and 1024M at 5.0GHz
> - superPi 1M and 32M at 5.1GHz.
> (I'll post the screensave proofs on the IVY Stable & Suicide thread)
> My superPi 32M was 6m 40.572s - slower than *feniks* super maximus v extreme which did it in 6m 35.064s at 5.1GHz - good job there!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Valgaur*, please update my n*ew high OC to 5.207GHZ*, and my *temp gain to 26C*.
> Also, sandpaper I used for lapping was 400>600>800>1000. The 400 was very helpful with getting rid of the concave sinkhole on the top, and the convex bulge on the bottom of the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have heard in multiple places that there is little to no gain from anything beyond 800. (Anyone have some links that I can check out that note otherwise? I'd be happy to learn more)


Updated and I'll have to try this sometime!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yep it is what sets it Apart from every other board... it has setting to help with Ln2 Overclocking where the others do not.


Yeah its an amazing board


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> @PC How about we do this for the format
> 
> For the submitting process of your temps use the following rules.
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program)
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started)
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp doesn't matter what core it is reported from.
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> Thanks again! This may be a ridiculous amount of info to be provided to join, but this is for research to see what we can show Intel eventually and how badly they messed up. (Yes I'm serious abort this part)
> This is also for people looking into Delidding and seeing just how crazy their temps can decrease by Delidding.
> Thanks yet again!


Looks great! Add it in and lets get some good data on temps and TIMs!


----------



## feniks

PCWargamer, grats on those clocks









you seem to use kinda low vcore for your high clocks when compared to lower speeds and voltages you had before (and fully stable under IBT). I think the speed of your SuperPI 32M run at 5.1GHz, might be limited by error-correction (Ivy Bridge WHEA feature). can you check your Even Logs - Custom Views - Administrative Events if you are getting recent WHEA warnings after SuperPI run? higher vcore will fix it and it should speed up superpi even by 1-2 seconds too







seen it happening at 5.2GHz on my chip (using ungodly amount of vcore when trying to pass 3dmark) it dropped from 6m 31s down to 6m 28s when no WHEA occured during that run.

Valgaur, tried that stability tool from aida64, it's pretty cool! I don't know how I missed it ... for how long you usually run it when checking for stability?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> OK. With the new lower temps from lapping I wanted to try a new High OC and some benching. I was able to hit a new high OC with this new chip of 5.207GHz @ 1.576v:
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2552616
> I was also able to bench
> - Cinebench and IBT at 4.9GHz
> - wPrime 32M and 1024M at 5.0GHz
> - superPi 1M and 32M at 5.1GHz.
> (I'll post the screensave proofs on the IVY Stable & Suicide thread)
> My superPi 32M was 6m 40.572s - slower than *feniks* super maximus v extreme which did it in 6m 35.064s at 5.1GHz - good job there!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Valgaur*, please update my n*ew high OC to 5.207GHZ*, and my *temp gain to 26C*.
> Also, sandpaper I used for lapping was 400>600>800>1000. The 400 was very helpful with getting rid of the concave sinkhole on the top, and the convex bulge on the bottom of the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have heard in multiple places that there is little to no gain from anything beyond 800. (Anyone have some links that I can check out that note otherwise? I'd be happy to learn more)


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> PCWargamer, grats on those clocks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you seem to use kinda low vcore for your high clocks when compared to lower speeds and voltages you had before (and fully stable under IBT). I think the speed of your SuperPI 32M run at 5.1GHz, might be limited by error-correction (Ivy Bridge WHEA feature). can you check your Even Logs - Custom Views - Administrative Events if you are getting recent WHEA warnings after SuperPI run? higher vcore will fix it and it should speed up superpi even by 1-2 seconds too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> seen it happening at 5.2GHz on my chip (using ungodly amount of vcore when trying to pass 3dmark) it dropped from 6m 31s down to 6m 28s when no WHEA occured during that run.


You are correct *feniks*. WHEA errors at the time of the superPi run. But vcore is already at an very uncomfortable 1.56v for those 5.1GHz bench runs.

And yes, this second chip is odd in that it needs very high vcore to even boot 4.5GHz (~1.3v compared to my old chips 1.2V), and everything at 4.5-4.6GHz needs ~0.13v more to run - like prime95 and IBT. Yet the vcore wasn't as horrible as I thought it would be to bench around 5.0GHz. Higher than my old chip, but it could have been much much worse!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> PCWargamer, grats on those clocks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you seem to use kinda low vcore for your high clocks when compared to lower speeds and voltages you had before (and fully stable under IBT). I think the speed of your SuperPI 32M run at 5.1GHz, might be limited by error-correction (Ivy Bridge WHEA feature). can you check your Even Logs - Custom Views - Administrative Events if you are getting recent WHEA warnings after SuperPI run? higher vcore will fix it and it should speed up superpi even by 1-2 seconds too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> seen it happening at 5.2GHz on my chip (using ungodly amount of vcore when trying to pass 3dmark) it dropped from 6m 31s down to 6m 28s when no WHEA occured during that run.
> Valgaur, tried that stability tool from aida64, it's pretty cool! I don't know how I missed it ... for how long you usually run it when checking for stability?


Usually around 1-2 mins then i upped vcore a bit for IBT for 10 runs


----------



## VonDutch

IHS lapping ( 400 grit --> 800 grit --> 1000 grit). Read this composite pic from left-to-right and from top-to-bottom:

As evident in the photos, the IHS on this 3770K was quite concave, that is,
higher in the middle than elsewhere. "Flatness" was achieved in this case
when no more silver color remained on the IHS.


one uses wet/dry sandpaper and a flat surface (glass usually) to slowly and
iteratively grind an uneven surface. The goal of lapping is not be to make
a mirror surface, rather, it is to make flat surface.

waking up, g'morning







, and done some "info looting" while drinking my coffee








saw you guys talk about sanding ihs etc ..so ..i like pictures, easier then 1000 (grit) words right ..lol
i must say, most peeps say it didnt help much, i thought the same till now,
1-3C max difference, others saw no difference at all, so im surprised about the
extra 11C tempdrop..

.....................................................................................................

First, here is the sequence of pics taken during the various stages of lapping.
To determine if the IHS was initially convex (crowned in the middle) or concave (like a bowl),
I used a sharpie permanent marker to make an X across the surface of the IHS:



Then I did just a few strokes on 220 grit before inspecting it,
knowing that the portions of the original "X" would only be removed from the high spots on the IHS:



very clear indication that the IHS is/was concave (like a bowl, the center was low and not touched by the sand paper yet,
the edges were high and have already been sanded down a bit, enough to begin to remove the permanent pen markings)

A bit more sanding with 220 grit yielded the following "copper ring" expected for a concave IHS:


We want all the nickel removed, nickel has a lower thermal transfer rate than copper, so I finished sanding off all the nickel with 220 grit:


check out how it looks after going all the way up to 3000 grit, love it











if anyone is going to do this lapping thing,
note before and after results if you can,
might be usefull for others, we have this saying,
"one day of Sun, doesnt make a summer"..
so, results that one may have, wont mean others will have the same,

its like with the usage of different tim's on die,
took a while and results from different peeps, to be sure liquid pro/ultra are the best to use on die right









o, about the "bowl" effect on that pic with the green markings,
dont forget if you put down the bracket on it, it will get less by the pressure...i thought..

well, to make sure noone will sue me, lol,
these are the original links,
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2260582
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261219


----------



## Valgaur

WOW +rep for that. I will make a link of how to Lap on the main page to this very post.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> WOW +rep for that. I will make a link of how to Lap on the main page to this very post.


Yep. Good stuff VonDutch!

Here is a link with some good info and videos on lapping. Check it out to see if it is worth noting to others....

http://www.overclock.net/t/455498/lapping


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> WOW +rep for that. I will make a link of how to Lap on the main page to this very post.


nothing better then to start the day with a +REP, lol.. thanks bro!









(I like your new avatar btw, could have been me doing that hehe..)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep. Good stuff VonDutch!
> Here is a link with some good info and videos on lapping. Check it out to see if it is worth noting to others....
> http://www.overclock.net/t/455498/lapping


i think any(good) info about lapping we gather helps, us and others








thanks









just looked through it a bit, post 2 is a nice addition,
first vid and 4 and 5 arent available anymore, but thats ok, the others still work


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nothing better then to start the day with a +REP, lol.. thanks bro!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i think any(good) info about lapping we gather helps, us and others
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks


I linked right to your post VonDutch lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I linked right to your post VonDutch lol.










cool!


----------



## Notion

hey peeps, if BF3 doesn't render graphics correctly does that mean i have an issue with Overclock vCore, or is just a glitch in the game..

trying to determine if its the overclock or not?

Cheers


----------



## kgtuning

Looks like I will be lapping my IHS sooner then later.

@ Notion what did you do before to determine it was stable? Maybe it wasn't really stable. Just a thought.


----------



## Powermonkey500

The highest stable clock I could get on my 3570k while staying under 1.5v was 4.876GHz.... not terrible, not really that good. Is this just because 3570ks are lower binned than 3770ks?
Or did I just lose the chip lottery?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> The highest stable clock I could get on my 3570k while staying under 1.5v was 4.876GHz.... not terrible, not really that good. Is this just because 3570ks are lower binned than 3770ks?
> Or did I just lose the chip lottery?


Yes and yes ..lol
It is the same silicon as the 3770. It is just binned differently, has some L3 cache disabled, and has one feature disabled for market purposes.
the highest stable OC depends on the lottery








4.8ghz prime stable needed 1.420V vcore for my 3770k, 4.9ghz needed about 1.490-1.495V vcore
so, the voltage jump was big between those 2 OC's..i dont have a good voltage chip
but its coool!! ..haha


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> hey peeps, if BF3 doesn't render graphics correctly does that mean i have an issue with Overclock vCore, or is just a glitch in the game..
> trying to determine if its the overclock or not?
> Cheers


add some(0.005) vcore and try again?
maybe driver? or a glitch ..lol


----------



## Powermonkey500

I really wanted to hit that magical 5GHz, but I don't want to damage my chip with the voltage.
I am at exactly 1.5v at 4.88Ghz


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I really wanted to hit that magical 5GHz, but I don't want to damage my chip with the voltage.
> I am at exactly 1.5v at 4.88Ghz


Lets just call that 4.9ghz id mess with the blk so it says 4.9 tho lol

5.9ghz = 5.1 - 5.2 ghz sandy Plus you got all the features of the Z77 chipset


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Lets just call that 4.9ghz id mess with the blk so it says 4.9 tho lol
> 5.9ghz = 5.1 - 5.2 ghz sandy Plus you got all the features of the Z77 chipset


I can't quiiiiite hit 4.9GHz. So close, but no dice. I could if I wanted to slightly exceed the Intel recommended 1.52v though.

Edit: For some reason, it's rock stable or not at all. It'll run Prime for hours, but if I raise my BLCK but 0.2, all my apps start crashing left and right. It's a little strange. Tried messing with all my other voltages, but didn't make much of a difference... The PLL voltage bought me a few MHz.


----------



## VonDutch

Tried to do some testing on 4.5ghz today,
comparing temps only, after almost 3 weeks usage of liquid pro..
the so called "pumpeffect"?

didnt remember what offset ive used then, so i did a few different ones to compare with..

3 october, just finished installing, and running first tests


today, 22 october, this was the closest i got to the oc from weeks ago


offset is a bit higher(0.025V), tried 0.005V offset less, got about the same results.
so its somewhere near that, it jumped between the first pic voltage,
and what you see in the second one.

Ambient isnt that different, its a warm day(18C outside),
but the hallway is cool like always ..lol
i know, testmethods have to be exactly the same, ambient etc ...
it shows not much hotter then the first time i ran aida64,
will keep a eye on it in the coming weeks/months, to see if it gets "worse"









but looks like i dont have to worry about the pumpeffect yet,
or have to renew the compound soon,
CLP rules! ..haha


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I can't quiiiiite hit 4.9GHz. So close, but no dice. I could if I wanted to slightly exceed the Intel recommended 1.52v though.
> Edit: For some reason, it's rock stable or not at all. It'll run Prime for hours, but if I raise my BLCK but 0.2, all my apps start crashing left and right. It's a little strange. Tried messing with all my other voltages, but didn't make much of a difference... The PLL voltage bought me a few MHz.


i only could use blck upto 4.7ghz, 101blck, most i got was 101.45, after that is got very hard,4.8ghz no go,
so I had to back down again to 100, i dont mess with it, only if i oc a 4.5 or 4.6ghz, i sometimes use 101blck,
like always, some can go higher with blck, some cant at all ..lol

dinnertime


----------



## Hokies83

I try not to use blk at all it is not the best way to OC IB i only have it set to 100.03 cause if i set it to 100.00 it likes to drop to 99.5 which makes my OC look lower @[email protected]


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I try not to use blk at all it is not the best way to OC IB i only have it set to 100.03 cause if i set it to 100.00 it likes to drop to 99.5 which makes my OC look lower @[email protected]


I only use it to make fine adjustments, because I couldn't hit 4.9 after 4.8 so I wanted to find a middleground.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I only use it to make fine adjustments, because I couldn't hit 4.9 after 4.8 so I wanted to find a middleground.


I still say bump the voltage so u can get 4.9ghz im running at 1.53 24/7 How much can it really take to get 20mhz @[email protected]


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I still say bump the voltage so u can get 4.9ghz im running at 1.53 24/7


Under normal usage mine hits 1.5v, under IBT it hits 1.52v. I'll have to see just how much of a bump I need


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Under normal usage mine hits 1.5v, under IBT it hits 1.52v. I'll have to see just how much of a bump I need


Try 1.52.5 lol

Also the Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3 comes with the sound blaster x-fi titanium fatal1ty

May have made it bout the same price as the Asrock board.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Try 1.52.5 lol
> Also the Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3 comes with the sound blaster x-fi titanium fatal1ty
> May have made it bout the same price as the Asrock board.


I've had my X-Fi Titanium for years, I bought the ASRock board 1-2 months ago


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> I've had my X-Fi Titanium for years, I bought the ASRock board 1-2 months ago


Ah ok.


----------



## Lobsterman

Ok so have
Ic-Diamond CHECK
CL Liquid Ultra CHECK

Just ordered some sandpaper of ebay
1x220, 1x400, 1x800, 1x1500, 1x2500

now the cooler, will probably get this from amazon as it has excellent reviews for price/performance
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0068OI7T8/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&colid=2OHLZHU5M8YK7&coliid=IN1IJ6RMJVD6X&me=&seller=

what u think, don't really wanna spend more than £50 on one just for an extra degree or 2 so £25 seems good and can always put a second fan on it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ok so have
> Ic-Diamond CHECK
> CL Liquid Ultra CHECK
> Just ordered some sandpaper of ebay
> 1x220, 1x400, 1x800, 1x1500, 1x2500
> now the cooler, will probably get this from amazon as it has excellent reviews for price/performance
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0068OI7T8/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&colid=2OHLZHU5M8YK7&coliid=IN1IJ6RMJVD6X&me=&seller=
> what u think, don't really wanna spend more than £50 on one just for an extra degree or 2 so £25 seems good and can always put a second fan on it


That is the best Cheap cooler

The NH-D14 has been on sale for around 60$ USD and would yield much better results more like 5C +
If you want to do Highend overclocking that is the one u want.. it is just as good as an H-100 and in some cases better.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dcomputers&field-keywords=nh-d14


----------



## Lobsterman

yep I did consider that NH-D14 but its just over my budget, I will probably/no doubt be going watercooling next year so didn't wanna throw a lot of money at a cooler just now


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> yep I did consider that NH-D14 but its just over my budget, I will probably/no doubt be going watercooling next year so didn't wanna throw a lot of money at a cooler just now


it is 53 Euro not to far above the budget.

i know it says socket 1156 but socket 1156 and socket 1155 have the exact same mounting holes nothing diff.


----------



## kgtuning

Is anyone in here able to run 5 GHz 24/7 at a reasonable voltage? With a 3770k.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Is anyone in here able to run 5 GHz 24/7 at a reasonable voltage? With a 3770k.


What do you think reasonable is??

To me reasonable is Anything below 1.55V

And i do run it below that 24/7


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think that with the lowish temps we're seeing, using a bit higher voltage than advised in most Ivy oc guides and even Intel's spec should be fine...Warranty in a tube is cool too









The wait is getting long guys, I should call Gigabyte's RMA dept this Thursday, but I'm feeling really impatient now.
I'll be borrowing an old Asrock 775 board and a Celeron D 331 to have some benching fun in the mean time...That thing has a really high multi!
Not sure if the board has voltage regulation so I think I'll have to resort to a volt mod xD
I bet I can hit 6ghz with my Silver Arrow and ic diamond tim. (Not sure if the ihs is soldered on that one, if it's not I'll delid it too!)


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> What do you think reasonable is??
> To me reasonable is Anything below 1.55V
> And i do run it below that 24/7


Good call. Lol yeah I mean sub 1.50.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Good call. Lol yeah I mean sub 1.50.


That's baby V Core to me.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That's baby V Core to me.


Lmao. I hear you. I will be going for 5 GHz this week 24/7 just curious if anyone was running that clock speed with a lower voltage...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Lmao. I hear you. I will be going for 5 GHz this week 24/7 just curious if anyone was running that clock speed with a lower voltage...


Be fearfull of the Asrock fatali1y and it's voltage monitoring software..
You may want to get a volt regulator to be safe.

It may tell you that your running 1.52v but in truth it is 1.62v @[email protected]


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Is anyone in here able to run 5 GHz 24/7 at a reasonable voltage? With a 3770k.


I am currently running 4.9GHz daily with 1.42v vcore under load (I use offsets & Ultra High 75% LLC for daily clocks) with automatic VCCIO/VCSA and PLL lowered to 1.50V.
5GHz is not that whole far away, may bump it up to that clock this evening, last time I checked it took 1.512v vcore under load, but it called for automatic/1.80V PLL (otherwise it would restart randomly).

Valgaur, thanks for reply on that AIDA64 Stability tester. I used it for 3 mins last night just to see and it provides a whole lot of useful information, liking it very much. also the temps generated seem about 5-6C lower than standard IBT run does, so it could be an alternative for thermally borderline clocks where IBT shoots temps too high and prime95 takes too long.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I am currently running 4.9GHz daily with 1.42v vcore under load (I use offsets & Ultra High 75% LLC for daily clocks) with automatic VCCIO/VCSA and PLL lowered to 1.50V.
> 5GHz is not that whole far away, may bump it up to that clock this evening, last time I checked it took 1.512v vcore under load, but it called for automatic/1.80V PLL (otherwise it would restart randomly).
> Valgaur, thanks for reply on that AIDA64 Stability tester. I used it for 3 mins last night just to see and it provides a whole lot of useful information, liking it very much. also the temps generated seem about 5-6C lower than standard IBT run does, so it could be an alternative for thermally borderline clocks where IBT shoots temps too high and prime95 takes too long.


I still say Borderlands 2 is the best test to see if your stable or not.. It spit out my 7hr prime 95 stable clocks like they were nothing in like 10 mins...

I had to up Vcore to stop crashing to desk top lol.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Be fearfull of the Asrock fatali1y and it's voltage monitoring software..
> You may want to get a volt regulator to be safe.
> It may tell you that your running 1.52v but in truth it is 1.62v @[email protected]


Like I said before I'm not discussing that topic. It was whined about enough in that other thread.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Like I said before I'm not discussing that topic. It was whined about enough in that other thread.


For your systems safety is why i am pointing it out... You do get crazy lowwer V core for things then everybody else here..

And AnAndtech did confirm the issue.. A volt meter would give you piece of mind.

It was only the Asrock Model you have none of the others had the issue.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That's baby V Core to me.


Pfffffffffft lol 1.5 vcore........chumps change!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I still say Borderlands 2 is the best test to see if your stable or not.. It spit out my 7hr prime 95 stable clocks like they were nothing in like 10 mins...
> I had to up Vcore to stop crashing to desk top lol.


Also try folding that will really show stability especially when you play a game WHILE folding with your GPU and your CPU at 100% lol.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Can anyone comment on the VCore sensor accuracy of ASRock motherboards? I have a voltmeter I'd like to use to verify my VCore, but I don't know where to touch the leads.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Can anyone comment on the VCore sensor accuracy of ASRock motherboards? I have a voltmeter I'd like to use to verify my VCore, but I don't know where to touch the leads.


Yours is fine it was just the fatali1y was shown to be off.

http://www.anandtech.com/Show/Index/5842?cPage=3&all=False&sort=0&page=4&slug=asrock-fatal1ty-z77-professional-review-ide-and-floppy-on-z77


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I still say Borderlands 2 is the best test to see if your stable or not.. It spit out my 7hr prime 95 stable clocks like they were nothing in like 10 mins...
> I had to up Vcore to stop crashing to desk top lol.


LOL, I hear ya








Might get some Borderlands 2 demo and see what it does to my OCs hehe.


----------



## Valgaur

Lol why not fold?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yours is fine it was just the fatali1y was shown to be off.
> http://www.anandtech.com/Show/Index/5842?cPage=3&all=False&sort=0&page=4&slug=asrock-fatal1ty-z77-professional-review-ide-and-floppy-on-z77


What explains when they test all the boards
at 4700mhz my board is just about the same as the other boards? Just curious.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> What explains when they test all the boards
> at 4700mhz my board is just about the same as the other boards? Just curious.


I do not have your board to test with a Volt meter AnAndtech did that was what they found not me..

And if that does not concern you enough to check it then do not worry about it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Is anyone in here able to run 5 GHz 24/7 at a reasonable voltage? With a 3770k.


Check out the IVY Stable thread for a one at very low vcore (1.312v). Also, more at 4.8 & 4.9 at higher vcores.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet

I am hoping our IVY Delidding Club can produce some greater IVY Stable high OC entries - maybe some 5.0GHZ ones too!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not have your board to test with a Volt meter AnAndtech did that was what they found not me..
> And if that does not concern you enough to check it then do not worry about it.


I'm just saying in that review they state that at 4700mhz they were all way closer then .1 volt.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Tried to do some testing on 4.5ghz today,
> comparing temps only, after almost 3 weeks usage of liquid pro..
> the so called "pumpeffect"?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> didnt remember what offset ive used then, so i did a few different ones to compare with..
> 3 october, just finished installing, and running first tests
> 
> today, 22 october, this was the closest i got to the oc from weeks ago
> 
> offset is a bit higher(0.025V), tried 0.005V offset less, got about the same results.
> so its somewhere near that, it jumped between the first pic voltage,
> and what you see in the second one.
> Ambient isnt that different, its a warm day(18C outside),
> but the hallway is cool like always ..lol
> i know, testmethods have to be exactly the same, ambient etc ...
> it shows not much hotter then the first time i ran aida64,
> will keep a eye on it in the coming weeks/months, to see if it gets "worse"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but looks like i dont have to worry about the pumpeffect yet,
> or have to renew the compound soon,
> CLP rules! ..haha


Thanks for checking on this. I expect that CL PRO will be one of the best TIMs to avoid any problem with possible "pump out" effect.









I hope others note and report back if they start to see degragation of temp gains over time, or not, with their TIMs so that we can see if this is happening, and if so with which TIMs!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I am currently running 4.9GHz daily with 1.42v vcore under load (I use offsets & Ultra High 75% LLC for daily clocks) with automatic VCCIO/VCSA and PLL lowered to 1.50V.
> 5GHz is not that whole far away, may bump it up to that clock this evening, last time I checked it took 1.512v vcore under load, but it called for automatic/1.80V PLL (otherwise it would restart randomly).
> Valgaur, thanks for reply on that AIDA64 Stability tester. I used it for 3 mins last night just to see and it provides a whole lot of useful information, liking it very much. also the temps generated seem about 5-6C lower than standard IBT run does, so it could be an alternative for thermally borderline clocks where IBT shoots temps too high and prime95 takes too long.


how much offset do you use for that 4.9ghz feniks?

i used AIDA64 from the start, had no choice,
i really like the program, has about all the info you need,
and a kinda stability tester, which runs alot cooler then prime or ibt,

i would advice to anyone that hasnt de-lidded to use it, for first OC attempts
and just add 10-15C so you would know how the temps would be like in prime or ibt..
do first testruns with aida64, and if it looks good, then try prime for further testing, and temps.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for checking on this. I expect that CL PRO will be one of the best TIMs to avoid any problem with possible "pump out" effect.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope others note and report back if they start to see degragation of temp gains over time, or not, with their TIMs so that we can see if this is happening, and if so with which TIMs!


o, it was called pump out effect? ..o well,
didnt look back to the posts where we talked about it,
you know where it was mentioned, or where we started talking about it?
maybe i have a idea..lol, "need more input, need more input"......


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> how much offset do you use for that 4.9ghz feniks?


4.9GHz with Ultra High 75% LLC and Optimized Phase control it seems it runs fine with +0.200
mind that I use CPU VRM running at my board's max 500KHz manually (it stays cool enough) as opposed to automatic 300KHz (core unstable with it).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 4.9GHz with Ultra High 75% LLC and Optimized Phase control it seems it runs fine with +0.200
> mind that I use CPU VRM running at my board's max 500KHz manually (it stays cool enough) as opposed to automatic 300KHz (core unstable with it).


a, thanks,
i think cpu vrm on gigabyte z77x is called pwm phase control, i have 2 options there,
but hardly have to change it, mobo does most things well on auto, and i dont have to remember settings..lol

i was wondering about my 4.8ghz oc, and the offset i need for it to be stable,
i thought it was way to high, something like +0.1440v
and idle voltage goes up too with + offset..
so looks like im good right..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> a, thanks,
> i think cpu vrm on gigabyte z77x is called pwm phase control, i have 2 options there,
> but hardly have to change it, mobo does most things well on auto, and i dont have to remember settings..lol
> i was wondering about my 4.8ghz oc, and the offset i need for it to be stable,
> i thought it was way to high, something like +0.1440v
> and idle voltage goes up too with + offset..
> so looks like im good right..


possibly I mistake some of the names in ASUS Bios with some names I was used to in EVGA BIOS LOL! every board manufacturer uses slightly different nomenclature









here, take a look at ASUS Maximus BIOS, the Digi+ Power Control screen is where I have those options:
http://rog.asus.com/136402012/maximus-v-motherboards/maximus-v-formula-overclocking-guide/6/

CPU PWM (the one with KHz settings) is called CPU Voltage frequency (auto/manual 300-500KHz)
the CPU Phase Control is the one with settings like Standard/Optimized/Extreme/Manual etc. by default it was Extreme, but some Asus ROG guide for using offsets suggested switching it to Optimized, so I did, not sure what the difference is though he he









other than that, yeah offset alters all 4 stages of vcore: stabilized idle, before load (spike), stabilized under-load and after load (dip) vcore - so yeah it will increase idle voltage as well. hence why I stopped using Medium (25%) LLC at higher clocks, because the idle voltage was becoming simply too high (much higher offset needed for Med LLC as opposed to UH LLC).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> possibly I mistake some of the names in ASUS Bios with some names I was used to in EVGA BIOS LOL! every board manufacturer uses slightly different nomenclature
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> here, take a look at ASUS Maximus BIOS, the Digi+ Power Control screen is where I have those options:
> http://rog.asus.com/136402012/maximus-v-motherboards/maximus-v-formula-overclocking-guide/6/
> CPU VRM (the one with KHz settings) is called CPU Voltage frequency (auto/manual 300-500KHz)
> the CPU Phase Control is the one with settings like Standard/Optimized/Extreme/Manual etc. by default it was Extreme, but some Asus ROG guide for using offsets suggested switching it to Optimized, so I did, not sure what the difference is though he he
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> other than that, yeah offset alters both idle, before load and under load vcore, so yeah it will increase idle voltage as well. hence why I stopped using Medium (25%) LLC at higher clocks, because the idle voltage was becoming simply too high (much higher offset needed for Med LLC as opposed to UH LLC).


ok, so i used turbo setting LLC on mine, i have 1 other setting above it, extreme,
so youre saying, if i up that to extreme, i need less offset?
srry if im rambling on about it, but it bugs me for a while now,
ive asked before, but didnt get a real good answer, thanks









will try again with 4.8ghz, was stable at 1.420 fixed so,
wonder how it goes with offset 0.1440 , llc extreme, and if i can make it a daily oc again
because im curious also if it would degrade over time with that vcore, another long term test ..lol


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o, it was called pump out effect? ..o well,
> didnt look back to the posts where we talked about it,
> you know where it was mentioned, or where we started talking about it?
> maybe i have a idea..lol, "need more input, need more input"......


Well then, read through this whole thread as it is jam packed with lots of great stuff including: the gap issue instead of the TIM as the main IB temp problem, and the possible TIM "pump out" problem due to thermal dynamics over time, and much much more good stuff! Lots "more input" there for guys like you who love to learn! Well worth the time to read through IMHO.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well then, read through this whole thread as it is jam packed with lots of great stuff including: the gap issue instead of the TIM as the main IB temp problem, and the possible TIM "pump out" problem due to thermal dynamics over time, and much much more good stuff! Lots "more input" there for guys like you who love to learn! Well worth the time to read through IMHO.
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855


yea., went over there already ..lol
was on this page where he mentioned something about it, but now much..
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053262&postcount=572

i quote

Unfortunately we can't logic out our dilemma on that question because there are very reasonable rationale engineering reasons why the gap would be there on purpose, ranging from reduction to so called "pumping out" effects to reduction in thermal stress mismatch to simply building a buffer against variability in the IHS height (spec's cost money, loosen those specs and you can spend less money) and so on.

However we can test the question of "do temps rise over time because of the pumping-out effect" by way of using a TIM that purports to directly minimize and counteract such effects...and IC Diamond purports to accomplish exactly that.

end quote

and he responded to this quote,

quote
IC Diamond was originally designed as a high reliability T1 or T2compound for use between the IHS and CPU or between IHS and sink. IC Diamond is highly bulk loaded with over 92% micronized diamond particles, 94% fully bulk loaded counting other misc. particles. The highly loaded mix is required to limit pump out due to thermal cycling, basically the reasoning behind it is that it is harder to pump or bake out a solid than a lesser, lightly loaded liquid type compound grease.

Pictured below are some initial accelerated tests with some 3X10 glass slides, we are still roughing out procedures so take it for what it is. Attached picture of test result was run for 20 hours at 150C, the center picture ICD is IC Diamond. The others are commonly used retail performance pastes. Not a drop dead test but it does highlight the stability of ICD7. The competition compounds feature the formation of voids, and span the range of initial failure to complete failure. IC diamond was observed to have no visible points of failure under these conditions. The picture is back lighted so the void formation is clearly visible


end quote

i like to read over there, alot of useful info,
like here, ive learned alot over there too








but im still a baby compared to the knowledge others have,
but i learn fast








only a few months i really dig into ocing, my first ever intel processor, so happy with it ...lol

o, i dont know about the last quote, feels a bit like promo/marketing...idk..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea., went over there already ..lol
> was on this page where he mentioned something about it, but now much..
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053262&postcount=572
> i quote
> Unfortunately we can't logic out our dilemma on that question because there are very reasonable rationale engineering reasons why the gap would be there on purpose, ranging from reduction to so called "pumping out" effects to reduction in thermal stress mismatch to simply building a buffer against variability in the IHS height (spec's cost money, loosen those specs and you can spend less money) and so on.
> However we can test the question of "do temps rise over time because of the pumping-out effect" by way of using a TIM that purports to directly minimize and counteract such effects...and IC Diamond purports to accomplish exactly that.
> end quote
> and he responded to this quote,
> quote
> IC Diamond was originally designed as a high reliability T1 or T2compound for use between the IHS and CPU or between IHS and sink. IC Diamond is highly bulk loaded with over 92% micronized diamond particles, 94% fully bulk loaded counting other misc. particles. The highly loaded mix is required to limit pump out due to thermal cycling, basically the reasoning behind it is that it is harder to pump or bake out a solid than a lesser, lightly loaded liquid type compound grease.
> Pictured below are some initial accelerated tests with some 3X10 glass slides, we are still roughing out procedures so take it for what it is. Attached picture of test result was run for 20 hours at 150C, the center picture ICD is IC Diamond. The others are commonly used retail performance pastes. Not a drop dead test but it does highlight the stability of ICD7. The competition compounds feature the formation of voids, and span the range of initial failure to complete failure. IC diamond was observed to have no visible points of failure under these conditions. The picture is back lighted so the void formation is clearly visible
> 
> end quote
> i like to read over there, alot of useful info,
> like here, ive learned alot over there too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but im still a baby compared to the knowledge others have,
> only a few months i really dig into ocing, my first ever intel processor, so happy with it ...lol


Same here Von. Love my Little Franky.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Same here Von. Love my Little Franky.


yea, wished everyone who has a 3570k or a 3770k could just de-lid it,
and really enjoy this chip, its great..i think one of the best intel made till now.
4.8ghz after delid is something most can get out of it with not to much trouble,
and the best lottery chips can go much higher, im sure..5.0-5.1ghz? beat that sb ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, wished everyone who has a 3570k or a 3770k could just de-lid it,
> and really enjoy this chip, its great..i think one of the best intel made till now.
> 4.8ghz after delid is something most can get out of it with not to much trouble,
> and the best lottery chips can go much higher, im sure..5.0-5.1ghz? beat that sb ..lol


That's why I want to get all of our results and make a formal complaint to Intel saying they messed up and we can prove it. And make next generation chips better for everyone.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ok, so i used turbo setting LLC on mine, i have 1 other setting above it, extreme,
> so youre saying, if i up that to extreme, i need less offset?
> srry if im rambling on about it, but it bugs me for a while now,
> ive asked before, but didnt get a real good answer, thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will try again with 4.8ghz, was stable at 1.420 fixed so,
> wonder how it goes with offset 0.1440 , llc extreme, and if i can make it a daily oc again
> because im curious also if it would degrade over time with that vcore, another long term test ..lol


yes, you will need less offset with higher LLC.
extreme = 100% LLC, it overshoots under load, all others dip under load, but mind that it may (and probably will) overshoot voltage under load.
usually 75% LLC which is one step below max is the most "flat", causing only a tiny dip of vcore under load versus idle (before downclocking occurs, best to observe on a fixed vcore), no overshoot.
as per degradation, LOL, don't ask me, I'm the guy who thinks experienced a bit of core degradation (0.024v across all speeds) in recent past









EDIT:
just to make it easier to understand, try using fixed vcore (not offsets) with various LLC settings and have the cpu-z open and observe what happens to vcore at idle and under load and you will see what I am talking about. offsets make it only way more complicated to explain, because multiplier downclocks at idle to 16x along with dropping vcore to idle level and it all jumps up and down based on requested CPU load


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea., went over there already ..lol
> was on this page where he mentioned something about it, but now much..
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053262&postcount=572
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> i quote
> Unfortunately we can't logic out our dilemma on that question because there are very reasonable rationale engineering reasons why the gap would be there on purpose, ranging from reduction to so called "pumping out" effects to reduction in thermal stress mismatch to simply building a buffer against variability in the IHS height (spec's cost money, loosen those specs and you can spend less money) and so on.
> However we can test the question of "do temps rise over time because of the pumping-out effect" by way of using a TIM that purports to directly minimize and counteract such effects...and IC Diamond purports to accomplish exactly that.
> end quote
> and he responded to this quote,
> quote
> IC Diamond was originally designed as a high reliability T1 or T2compound for use between the IHS and CPU or between IHS and sink. IC Diamond is highly bulk loaded with over 92% micronized diamond particles, 94% fully bulk loaded counting other misc. particles. The highly loaded mix is required to limit pump out due to thermal cycling, basically the reasoning behind it is that it is harder to pump or bake out a solid than a lesser, lightly loaded liquid type compound grease.
> Pictured below are some initial accelerated tests with some 3X10 glass slides, we are still roughing out procedures so take it for what it is. Attached picture of test result was run for 20 hours at 150C, the center picture ICD is IC Diamond. The others are commonly used retail performance pastes. Not a drop dead test but it does highlight the stability of ICD7. The competition compounds feature the formation of voids, and span the range of initial failure to complete failure. IC diamond was observed to have no visible points of failure under these conditions. The picture is back lighted so the void formation is clearly visible
> 
> end quote
> 
> 
> i like to read over there, alot of useful info,
> like here, ive learned alot over there too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but im still a baby compared to the knowledge others have,
> but i learn fast
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only a few months i really dig into ocing, my first ever intel processor, so happy with it ...lol
> o, i dont know about the last quote, feels a bit like promo/marketing...idk..


Yep. that is one of the places in that thread where they talk about the issue, and I think it comes up in a few more places, but it will take some time to verify how big an issue it is and with which TIMs.

Users of CL PRO have yet to note any temp degradation, and the same is true of ICD users. The ones who did notice a problem were using other TIMs like AS5 or Tuniq TX-3 or some such otherwise good TIMs IIRC. Cool issue really, and always more to learn!


----------



## Hokies83

Seen the Pile Driver benches yet? lol it looks to be even with a i7 950 clock for clock... But they benched one vs a 3770k with ht off at stock vs one at 4.6ghz and it still Loses in half the bench marks lol

This is AMD'S last run of Desk top Cpus.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's why I want to get all of our results and make a formal complaint to Intel saying they messed up and we can prove it. And make next generation chips better for everyone.


not a bad idea..lol count me in to gather(more) evidence









but..come to think about what ive gathered so far,
intels targeting market isnt OC-ers, were only like 2% of the market,
the other 98% is the normal user market, they dont oc,
they use default clockspeeds, with stockcooler,
dont ever run prime or anything like that, and for that market the 3570 and 3770 is more then enough,

when you want to oc the K's. you can go upto 4.4-4.5ghz, with a decent cooler..
which is still a speedgain of about 25-30%..not bad for free..

so whats left is the 1-1.5% who really want to push it further,
which they cant if they dont de-lid..well, you can do a bit with waterloops etc..

that leaves the crazy ones like us, who just go ahead and pop the hood...lol
its a small group but growing ..haha, guess its because we have so much fun doing it, and the results ...wow!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not a bad idea..lol count me in to gather(more) evidence
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but..come to think about what ive gathered so far,
> intels targeting market isnt OC-ers, were only like 2% of the market,
> the other 98% is the normal user market, they dont oc,
> they use default clockspeeds, with stockcooler,
> dont ever run prime or anything like that, and for that market the 3570 and 3770 is more then enough,
> when you want to oc the K's. you can go upto 4.4-4.5ghz, with a decent cooler..
> which is still a speedgain of about 25-30%..not bad for free..
> so whats left is the 1-1.5% who really want to push it further,
> which they cant if they dont de-lid..well, you can do a bit with waterloops etc..
> that leaves the crazy ones like us, who just go ahead and pop the hood...lol
> its a small group but growing ..haha, guess its because we have so much fun doing it, and the results ...wow!


In short. We are awesome


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Seen the Pile Driver benches yet? lol it looks to be even with a i7 950 clock for clock... But they benched one vs a 3770k with ht off at stock vs one at 4.6ghz and it still Loses in half the bench marks lol
> This is AMD'S last run of Desk top Cpus.


You missed phoronix Linux testing results...I think it does pretty good overall, you can probably oc it further than 4.6ghz which would do fine for a budget rig.


----------



## beniroc

Valgaur here is my link http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2544198. Can't remember the temp drops because i only had the cpu for 1 day but what i remember id say 20C.


----------



## beniroc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay I'm FINALLY back from work...and holy crap we make this thread move lol. I'll be ordering LP this week and getting some sand paper 500<1000<1500<2000 most likely for the smoothness.
> @PC How about we do this for the format
> 
> For the submitting process of your temps use the following rules.
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program)
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started)
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp doesn't matter what core it is reported from.
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> Thanks again! This may be a ridiculous amount of info to be provided to join, but this is for research to see what we can show Intel eventually and how badly they messed up. (Yes I'm serious abort this part)
> This is also for people looking into Delidding and seeing just how crazy their temps can decrease by Delidding.
> Thanks yet again!


The hottest core was 56C. The ihs has been lapped top and inside and around the base. The sandpaper was 600 to 2000.


----------



## Valgaur

Updated Beniroc!







Thank you!


----------



## beniroc

Thanks max overclock needs updated. Good luck going over 5.5 I tried it one more time, I was at 1.8v no go. Done with suicide runs with this cpu 5ghz 24/7 is good enough.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> The hottest core was 56C. The ihs has been lapped top and inside and around the base. The sandpaper was 600 to 2000.


What was your ambient temperature?

Did you have Hyper Threading on or off?


----------



## y2kcamaross

Got my h100 in the mail, gonna replace this h50 when I get back from Georgia and put liquid pro on the ihs instead of mx4, 24/7 5.0ghz+ here I come!


----------



## y2kcamaross

On that note, what kind of temp differences can I expect going from mx4 to liquid pro on the ihs(keep in mind liquid pro is already on the CPU die)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> On that note, what kind of temp differences can I expect going from mx4 to liquid pro on the ihs(keep in mind liquid pro is already on the CPU die)


1- 5c lol. depending on how well you do it


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> On that note, what kind of temp differences can I expect going from mx4 to liquid pro on the ihs(keep in mind liquid pro is already on the CPU die)
> 
> 
> 
> 1- 5c lol. depending on how well you do it
Click to expand...

Pretty hard to mess it up, unless you lay it on too thick


----------



## Valgaur

How does my Sig look now guys? trying something different.


----------



## PCWargamer

*Liquid PRO users* - a question - is there any issues in taking the IHS off of the die, or HSF off of the IHS, once the Liquid PRO is applied?

I know using Ultra that is is very easy to use and clean up and nothing sticks to nothing - all easy to remove and pull apart etc.

If I put PRO on my die though, will it make it hard to remove the IHS later?

ALSO, is it easy to remove the PRO from the die???

Thanks for feedback and responding!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Liquid PRO users* - a question - is there any issues in taking the IHS off of the die, or HSF off of the IHS, once the Liquid PRO is applied?
> I know using Ultra that is is very easy to use and clean up and nothing sticks to nothing - all easy to remove and pull apart etc.
> If I put PRO on my die though, will it make it hard to remove the IHS later?
> ALSO, is it easy to remove the PRO from the die???
> Thanks for feedback and responding!


You can get it off from Hsf and IHS.. but all u can do with DIE is put more on.. unless u want to take the risk of scratching the die...

But you should never have the need to remove the stuff from the Die as LP is the best on the die.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Liquid PRO users* - a question - is there any issues in taking the IHS off of the die, or HSF off of the IHS, once the Liquid PRO is applied?
> I know using Ultra that is is very easy to use and clean up and nothing sticks to nothing - all easy to remove and pull apart etc.
> If I put PRO on my die though, will it make it hard to remove the IHS later?
> ALSO, is it easy to remove the PRO from the die???
> Thanks for feedback and responding!


You can get it off from Hsf and IHS.. but all u can do with DIE is put more on.. unless u want to take the risk of scratching the die...

But you should never have the need to remove the stuff from the Die as LP is the best on the die.

WOAH!!!

Just noticed a 2600k is 10$ more then a 3770k and a 2700k is 20$ more  Newegg must be just about out of them..

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115095&name=Processors-Desktops
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115070&name=Processors-Desktops
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116501&Tpk=3770k


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Liquid PRO users* - a question - is there any issues in taking the IHS off of the die, or HSF off of the IHS, once the Liquid PRO is applied?
> I know using Ultra that is is very easy to use and clean up and nothing sticks to nothing - all easy to remove and pull apart etc.
> If I put PRO on my die though, will it make it hard to remove the IHS later?
> ALSO, is it easy to remove the PRO from the die???
> Thanks for feedback and responding!


this might be helpful,
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?162440-Coollabs-Liquid-Pro-Investigated!-Easiest-possible-way-to-remove-included.-56k-warnin

i still have to try it myself, want to wait till it "hardens" some more,
if i ever need to take it apart again, i will write about it here,
but then im gonna use the cleaning set coollabs sells , the one with the 3 bottles in it,
think theres enough to last for years in that set.

removing the ihs later should be no problem, of course, after 1 year usage, it will be a bit harder,
but remember when we delidded, it was not like when we cut through the black adhesive,
the IHS just fell off, i needed to twist it a bit, guess it will do the same with other tim's, over time,

i just read another thing, gallium has a low melting point? like if you putt some on your hand, the temp
is already enough to melt it, so heating the chip before remove might help too..
(hours later)funny, found this vid where a guy actually lets it melt in his hand,




use a hair dryer when you clean it? hot air..
will try find more info about it today, prolly not much info out there yet, using/cleaning it on the die etc..

read somewhere else you can re-use it, like hookies said, add some more instead of cleaning it, and apply a new layer..
i just finished contacting coollaboratory with these questions, so now have to wait for their response,
cant find that much info, except the remarks of peeps that its hard to remove,
about as many times as peeps saying its hard to apply or to work with ..lol
this, "preclean" might help, just let it soak in high alcohol based cleaner,
isopropyl alcohol, if possible above 90%

quote
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/thermal-interface-roundup_8.html

Although this is a fairly small syringe, it should last you for at least 5 cooler installations provided you apply the compound the right way.
The application procedure is very simple, just squeeze a small drop into the center of degreased processor heat-spreader
and spread it evenly with a cotton ball or soft cloth over the entire surface. *Besides, I would also recommend doing the same thing to the cooler base*:



*When both surfaces have been prepped like that and run through several heating/cooling cycles,
they get a better "grip" than in case thermal interface has been only applied to one of them.*
Now that they included rough porous pad for compound removal (I don't know its exact name),
it has become a very easy to remove Liquid Pro from the surfaces.
It will take you less than a minute to clean it off, although you will have to forget about nice polishing.
Remember, Liquid Pro shouldn't be used with aluminum surfaces.

The manufacturer promises thermal conductivity of 82 W/(m·K).
Liquid pro should remain fully functional at operational temperatures between -273°C and +1200°C.
If it is true, it is truly impressive, but I doubt that anyone needs such a wide temperature range.
and quote

see, it confirms what i already figured, when using it on all sides, also inside IHS, and on Die,
just a sidenote tho ..lol

"official" coollabsresponse to a question about removing it on youtube,
http://www.youtube.com/all_comments?v=qFhbqiFh9Us

The Liquid Pro can be wiped off, residues which are hardend can be removed﻿ with metal polish.
*Small residues can stay on the surface and will possibly upgrade the performance of other pastes*.
Coollaboratory in reply to daniellikahong (Show the comment) 4 months ago

now i wonder what metal polish will do to the die, will it scratch?

Yes, the Liquid Pro is also usable on GPUs.
But it is possible that there is a *bigger﻿ gap between the contact surfaces, for that we would rather recommend the Liquid Ultra*.
Coollaboratory in reply to ZTOID (Show the comment) 4 months ago

interesting remark..

The content﻿ of the Liquid Pro syringe is enough for 10 to 15 CPUs, depends on the amount you apply on the surfaces.
You just need a really small amount, as you see in the video.

10 To 15 cpu's?.﻿ That also counts for liquid ultra?
kledder2 in reply to Coollaboratory (Show the comment) 1 year ago

No the Liqud Ultra is pasty and you will need some more of it the get a smooth contact surface.
We recommend to use 3 or 4 scale lines, therefore the amount is enough for approx. 5 cpu size surfaces.
The exact amount depends on the size of Heatspreader, on the evenness of﻿ the contact areas and the thickness of the gap.

well, im done info looting for today ...LOL, this post is (to) getting long again


----------



## beniroc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> What was your ambient temperature?
> Did you have Hyper Threading on or off?


Couldn't tell you the ambient temps but most likely around the temp the weather gadget show. No trees for shade and no AC on. Also nothing turned off hyper threading was on.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> The hottest core was 56C. The ihs has been lapped top and inside and around the base. The sandpaper was 600 to 2000.


Good run. Good voltages too, wish my chip was even close.

Also, loved your screen background. What city is that. And did you find that on the web? If so, where if you remember?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Liquid PRO users* - a question - is there any issues in taking the IHS off of the die, or HSF off of the IHS, once the Liquid PRO is applied?
> I know using Ultra that is is very easy to use and clean up and nothing sticks to nothing - all easy to remove and pull apart etc.
> If I put PRO on my die though, will it make it hard to remove the IHS later?
> ALSO, is it easy to remove the PRO from the die???
> Thanks for feedback and responding!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this might be helpful,
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?162440-Coollabs-Liquid-Pro-Investigated!-Easiest-possible-way-to-remove-included.-56k-warnin
> i still have to try it myself, want to wait till it "hardens" some more,
> if i ever need to take it apart again, i will write about it here,
> but then im gonna use the cleaning set coollabs sells
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> , the one with the 3 bottles in it,
> think theres enough to last for years in that set.
> removing the ihs later should be no problem, of course, after 1 year usage, it will be a bit harder,
> but remember when we delidded, it was not like when we cut through the black adhesive,
> the IHS just fell off, i needed to twist it a bit, guess it will do the same with other tim's, over time,
> i just read another thing, gallium has a low melting point? like if you putt some on your hand, the temp
> is already enough to melt it, so heating the chip before remove might help too..
> (hours later)funny, found this vid where a guy actually lets it melt in his hand,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> use a hair dryer when you clean it? hot air..
> will try find more info about it today, prolly not much info out there yet, using/cleaning it on the die etc..
> read somewhere else you can re-use it, like hookies said, add some more instead of cleaning it, and apply a new layer..
> i just finished contacting coollaboratory with these questions, so now have to wait for their response,
> cant find that much info, except the remarks of peeps that its hard to remove,
> about as many times as peeps saying its hard to apply or to work with ..lol
> this, "preclean" might help, just let it soak in high alcohol based cleaner,
> isopropyl alcohol, if possible above 90%
> quote
> http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/thermal-interface-roundup_8.html
> Although this is a fairly small syringe, it should last you for at least 5 cooler installations provided you apply the compound the right way.
> The application procedure is very simple, just squeeze a small drop into the center of degreased processor heat-spreader
> and spread it evenly with a cotton ball or soft cloth over the entire surface. *Besides, I would also recommend doing the same thing to the cooler base*:
> 
> *When both surfaces have been prepped like that and run through several heating/cooling cycles,
> they get a better "grip" than in case thermal interface has been only applied to one of them.*
> Now that they included rough porous pad for compound removal (I don't know its exact name),
> it has become a very easy to remove Liquid Pro from the surfaces.
> It will take you less than a minute to clean it off, although you will have to forget about nice polishing.
> Remember, Liquid Pro shouldn't be used with aluminum surfaces.
> The manufacturer promises thermal conductivity of 82 W/(m·K).
> Liquid pro should remain fully functional at operational temperatures between -273°C and +1200°C.
> If it is true, it is truly impressive, but I doubt that anyone needs such a wide temperature range.
> and quote
> see, it confirms what i already figured, when using it on all sides, also inside IHS, and on Die,
> just a sidenote tho ..lol
> "official" coollabsresponse to a question about removing it on youtube,
> http://www.youtube.com/all_comments?v=qFhbqiFh9Us
> The Liquid Pro can be wiped off, residues which are hardend can be removed﻿ with metal polish.
> *Small residues can stay on the surface and will possibly upgrade the performance of other pastes*.
> Coollaboratory in reply to daniellikahong (Show the comment) 4 months ago
> now i wonder what metal polish will do to the die, will it scratch?
> Yes, the Liquid Pro is also usable on GPUs.
> But it is possible that there is a *bigger﻿ gap between the contact surfaces, for that we would rather recommend the Liquid Ultra*.
> Coollaboratory in reply to ZTOID (Show the comment) 4 months ago
> interesting remark..
> The content﻿ of the Liquid Pro syringe is enough for 10 to 15 CPUs, depends on the amount you apply on the surfaces.
> You just need a really small amount, as you see in the video.
> 10 To 15 cpu's?.﻿ That also counts for liquid ultra?
> kledder2 in reply to Coollaboratory (Show the comment) 1 year ago
> No the Liqud Ultra is pasty and you will need some more of it the get a smooth contact surface.
> We recommend to use 3 or 4 scale lines, therefore the amount is enough for approx. 5 cpu size surfaces.
> The exact amount depends on the size of Heatspreader, on the evenness of﻿ the contact areas and the thickness of the gap.
> 
> 
> well, im done info looting for today ...LOL, this post is (to) getting long again


Thanks for the info *VonDutch*. I have some PRO on order that I am going to compare to the Ultra. Concerned that once going forward there would be no way back!


----------



## beniroc

Could not tell you the city. Got it in a wallpaper pack.


----------



## VonDutch

its Hong Kong..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its Hong Kong..


Huh wut?! Ive been to Hong Kong... China's Vegas place is lit up like a Christmas tree really cool place to fly into at night.


----------



## leppie

Has anyone had any success with alternative delidding techniques? Eg: plastic card, dental floss, thread?

What about slightly heating the edge up with a soldering iron?

Hmm, if the soldering iron is not too hot, but hot enough to unbind the glue/sealant, it might be 'easy' as desoldering a QFP chip


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Huh wut?! Ive been to Hong Kong... China's Vegas place is lit up like a Christmas tree really cool place to fly into at night.


yea, i recognised that building on the wallpaper they talked about on the last page,


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for the info *VonDutch*. I have some PRO on order that I am going to compare to the Ultra. Concerned that once going forward there would be no way back!


oki, still thinking and looking into brasso,
went shopping today and look for it,

they have silver polish too, i just thought of something,
to use it on glass first, and look how much it would scratch,
saw another product like it, 2 in 1 solution, and on the side it said, you could use it on glass too,
if i have money, ill buy some, and try it on the window....from the neighbours that is ...LOL..shht..

there is a grinding pad, cleaning tissues in the Liquid Pro package,
problem is, will the grinding pad, after using the cleaning tissue,
incase the cleaning is worst case scenario,
do the job getting the leftover residues off without scratching the Die?

then theres the, "Small residues can stay on the surface and will possibly upgrade the performance of other pastes."


----------



## Valgaur

Ordering my Liquid Pro today and going to get some sand paper as well! I want my 50 bucks from my folding win to come in so I can think of other things to buy.........


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Has anyone had any success with alternative delidding techniques? Eg: plastic card, dental floss, thread?
> What about slightly heating the edge up with a soldering iron?
> Hmm, if the soldering iron is not too hot, but hot enough to unbind the glue/sealant, it might be 'easy' as desoldering a QFP chip


we talked about different ways if delidding, i came up with a thin card, plastic,
someone else mentioned dentalfloss.. but were still looking for someone to
do so, its not like we have 10 peeps a day doing delid ...lol
but euhm ...you still need to de-lid? ...just asking









my mum use to have some black thread, that was very strong,
i was just looking at this,

its waxed black thread, they use it to fasten buttons etc..very strong.
and thin/sharp enough to cut through the black adhesive, and can go between the IHS and pcb easily i think,
and i dont think it can harm the pcb..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ordering my Liquid Pro today and going to get some sand paper as well! I want my 50 bucks from my folding win to come in so I can think of other things to buy.........


50 bucks ..win? folding? ..tell tell..


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> oki, still thinking and looking into brasso,
> went shopping today and look for it,
> 
> they have silver polish too, i just thought of something,
> to use it on glass first, and look how much it would scratch,
> saw another product like it, 2 in 1 solution, and on the side it said, you could use it on glass too,
> if i have money, ill buy some, and try it on the window....from the neighbours that is ...LOL..shht..
> there is a grinding pad, cleaning tissues in the package,
> problem is, will the grinding pad, after using the cleaning tissue,
> incase the cleaning is worst case scenario,
> do the job getting the leftover residues off without scratching the Die?
> then theres the, "Small residues can stay on the surface and will possibly upgrade the performance of other pastes."


hmmm, well I think when reading up on lapping that they mentioned specifically not to use any kind of polish as it would actually reduce thermal conductivity from residues. I would rather lap/sand away left over PRO, but not try polish. On the die, though, I am not sure what to do if I want to remove the PRO, although I think some heat and soaking with alcohol might soften it up enough to remove.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 50 bucks ..win? folding? ..tell tell..


LoL you will lose that much paying your electric bill.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i recognised that building on the wallpaper they talked about on the last page,


Hong Kong is a pretty city at night - that's why I liked *beniroc's* wallpaper...thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hong Kong is a pretty city at night - that's why I liked *beniroc's* wallpaper...thanks


Picture does not do it justice at all..

It is a Bay area with Peaks surrounding it with lights everywhere..

Watch all this video.. place is lit up lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> hmmm, well I think when reading up on lapping that they mentioned specifically not to use any kind of polish as it would actually reduce thermal conductivity from residues. I would rather lap/sand away left over PRO, but not try polish. On the die, though, I am not sure what to do if I want to remove the PRO, although I think some heat and soaking with alcohol might soften it up enough to remove.


o, i was talking about getting it off the Die, after long time use, and having residues ..lol

on the IHS, is not a big problem ..i would still try to get it cleaned normal,
and try/see what they said, if youre gonna use another compound,
"Small residues can stay on the surface and will possibly upgrade the performance of other pastes"
no polish on the ihs, ive read that too somewhere, it will fill the little gaps with residue too..not good.
first use the stuff that comes with the package,
but i see no reason to change compound if you use CLP,
its still one of the best out there, where ever you use it, on die, on ihs ...lol
(mild)lapping is the only way to make sure youll get it clean, if theres a problem with the other ways of cleaning it,
but that nice and shiny ihs looks great, so i prolly go all the way next time it comes off,

and having a nice flat ihs cant hurt ..lol


----------



## beniroc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hong Kong is a pretty city at night - that's why I liked *beniroc's* wallpaper...thanks


Will send a pm when I get off work.


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> but euhm ...you still need to de-lid? ...just asking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..


Yes









I am keen to try some ideas. eg dental floss, for a plastic card, and old el cheapo screen protector might have a rough enough edge to cut through the glue. Also the soldering iron idea


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL you will lose that much paying your electric bill.


Nope I don't have an electric bill ^.^

Lovely College pays for that (Thank God)

I won 50 bucks from the top folders because of my efforts last month I was in the top 10 for Nvidia folders. and i got picked!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nope I don't have an electric bill ^.^
> Lovely College pays for that (Thank God)
> I won 50 bucks from the top folders because of my efforts last month I was in the top 10 for Nvidia folders. and i got picked!


With 1 card LoL? College folders must be getting Lazy lol.. Your and your free power bills >.>


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> With 1 card LoL? College folders must be getting Lazy lol.. Your and your free power bills >.>


You are only allowed one card sir. And currently I'm covering the i7 slot with my 3770K and ding the Nvidia slot with my 680 as well. So.....you could say I've been stress testing for about 4 weeks now lol. I also play video games while folding...thats tough.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You are only allowed one card sir. And currently I'm covering the i7 slot with my 3770K and ding the Nvidia slot with my 680 as well. So.....you could say I've been stress testing for about 4 weeks now lol. I also play video games while folding...thats tough.


Shame kepler has no compute you could Mine for real money then...

Thats how they got the power consumption so low.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, a 570 whoops kepler arse, folding wise...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Shame kepler has no compute you could Mine for real money then...
> Thats how they got the power consumption so low.


Thought about it but it's way to shady lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thought about it but it's way to shady lol.


You can not mine with Kepler it has no Compute on the die.. you would lose more money in electric bills then u would make.

I hope they bring it back with the 780.. id like to be able to pay for up grades with my Gpus lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can mine btc with amd cards...folding for money doesn't seem right to me. But that's just me. EVGA pays you evga bucks I think.


----------



## kgtuning

Just a teaser... photo from my phone..



I'll post a real screen shot at the 24 hour mark...


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just a teaser... photo from my phone..
> 
> I'll post a real screen shot at the 24 hour mark...


Want to trade chips? I'm 4.9GHz at 1.52v...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Want to trade chips? I'm 4.9GHz at 1.52v...


lol. pretty lucky i guess.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Has anyone had any success with alternative delidding techniques? Eg: plastic card, dental floss, thread?
> What about slightly heating the edge up with a soldering iron?
> Hmm, if the soldering iron is not too hot, but hot enough to unbind the glue/sealant, it might be 'easy' as desoldering a QFP chip


Using a one-sided razor blade in so easy, I'd not worry about another way. Try each corner, to see which one works well, then once you get your first corner done you will know all you need to do the rest of the chip. Hardest part is getting up the guts to try. It is not hard to do after that.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> How does my Sig look now guys? trying something different.


Anyone notice your new Sig yet? Seems it is a bit different somehow......


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> Will send a pm when I get off work.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Anyone notice your new Sig yet? Seems it is a bit different somehow......


You need to change your to Vice Captain as well mister!


----------



## Hokies83

o_o 3770k Cinnebench score at 5.1ghz.. Nipping at the heals of Xeon @[email protected]


----------



## neopunx

I think I will change my SiG to just "Delidded", there by declaring we are all crazy to try this Mod. Crazy like a Fox!

Edit: or maybe "De-lid, pop that top"


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You need to change your to Vice Captain as well mister!


...updated as requested Sir!









....maybe we should just change the name of the club to "The Delided Crew 3x70K"....?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> o_o 3770k Cinnebench score at 5.1ghz.. Nipping at the heals of Xeon @[email protected]


Good run *Hokies83*. My best Cinebench was at 4.9GHz....5.0 just would not fly....

You guys should take your delided IBs and start doing some high (& cool) OC benches to start to post into the Ivy Bridge Stable "Ivy Benchmark / Suicide Runs" spreadsheet!









We can do 5.0+ runs of superPi 1M & 32M, wPrime 32M & 1024M (use v1.55), and of course, Cinebench! Lots of fun to see if you can get your system stable enough at high OC's to be able to get good runs of these. And then submit then to the thread above so we can start to fill up that spreadsheet with something, as it is mainly empty right now. No need wasting our high OC (and higher vcore) runs without leaving a mark somewhere! Its not like we are likely to have any temp limitations with these delidded chips.....







I'd think it would be cool to see what these chips can do on this thread.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I think I will change my SiG to just "Delidded", there by declaring we are all crazy to try this Mod. Crazy like a Fox!
> Edit: or maybe "De-lid, pop that top"


That would be true! Also, I loved your high OC benches you submitted to the "Ivy Benchmark / Suicide Runs" spreadsheet! They look good and all proper to me. Great job *neopunx*!


----------



## Valgaur

I've thought about re-naming this thread to "The Delidded Crew" so we can allow any chips in as well. Might get more traffic that way lol. I'm currently right behind your wprime run PC barely short by .006 seconds lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I think I will change my SiG to just "Delidded", there by declaring we are all crazy to try this Mod. Crazy like a Fox!
> Edit: or maybe "De-lid, pop that top"


I like that idea for the sig as well....I'll debate it for a bit and see what others think.


----------



## Hokies83

I still say we provide de Lidding Services.... for Novice users. Applying the LP to the die for them..

And somebody needs to glue there IHS back on and try to RMA to intel to confirm how that goes aswell..

That way if there is a failure we can replace ppl's chips..

Also make sure u have no Cores parked... I had 3 threads parked i un parked them and performance is way up.

http://www.coderbag.com/Programming-C/Disable-CPU-Core-Parking-Utility


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I've thought about re-naming this thread to "The Delidded Crew" so we can allow any chips in as well. Might get more traffic that way lol. I'm currently right behind your wprime run PC barely short by .006 seconds lol
> I like that idea for the sig as well....I'll debate it for a bit and see what others think.


Cool. Maybe something like *"The Delidded Crew XXXX"*would allow anyone to add in their particular chip type.....


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Also make sure u have no Cores parked... I had 3 threads parked i un parked them and performance is way up.
> http://www.coderbag.com/Programming-C/Disable-CPU-Core-Parking-Utility


Interesting. I have never noticed CPU's being parked in the last 3/4 years since i7/Win7.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Cool. Maybe something like *"The Delidded Crew XXXX"*would allow anyone to add in their particular chip type.....


Or "The Delidded CPU Crew" instead


----------



## feniks

LOL







so what's the verdict on the club sig? I am using some older one now, like the devils in flames surrounding it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so what's the verdict on the club sig? I am using some older one now, like the devils in flames surrounding it


I'm thinking about updating it. make it more appealing.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Or "The Delidded CPU Crew" instead


That would work too!

Hey, new *update for OC gained* (from none to 152MHz) with new high OC of 5.252 @ 1.616v

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2554883



Also, new superPi 1M run @ 5.178GHz - score = 7.088s


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Interesting. I have never noticed CPU's being parked in the last 3/4 years since i7/Win7.


all you have to do in win7 to "unpark" cores forcefully is to go to Control Panel - Power options and toggle from balanced mode to High Performance mode, that's it. use HP mode for benhcmarking and Blaanced for daily running (if using offsets, because it's all nearly meaningless with a fixed vcore).


----------



## VonDutch

First thing i do when i install a fresh copy of winfdows, is set power options to High Performance,
and uncheck Remote Assistance ..lol

so, whats today gonna be, just doing some new OC's with super "pie"?..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Or "The Delidded CPU Crew" instead


i still think there should be Ivy in the name, to be a specific delid crew..
i mean, that is what were doing, delid the ivy's, not many other chip's can delid,
because they are soldered..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i still think there should be Ivy in the name, to be a specific delid crew..
> i mean, that is what were doing, delid the ivy's, not many other chip's can delid,
> because they are soldered..


Lets try less multiple posts guys lol.

But yeah Von I think we could go with that as well and if any other CPU's wanna join we can have them put the sig on but replace IVY with theirs. I would like more input before we decide if we should even decide









Ohh heres some benchies and Von you got a monster run on cinebench man...so jelly.


----------



## VonDutch

thanks, almost beat up a xeon ..lol

arent we supposed to post them in, The Ivy Bridge Stable / Suicide Club ..

its gettng cold later this week, expected 0C this weekend


----------



## kgtuning

figured i would share this..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks, almost beat up a xeon ..lol
> arent we supposed to post them in, The Ivy Bridge Stable / Suicide Club ..
> its gettng cold later this week, expected 0C this weekend


Bleh u forget mine?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bleh u forget mine?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


no, i didnt ..lol..beat you too







... jk jk

wonder if i can get 10.35-10.40 points, would be something to get past the xeon's ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> figured i would share this..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Very nice







gratz, jealous on youre vcore


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> figured i would share this..


Golden. I wish I could get my vcore that low for 5GHZ.


----------



## chronicfx

1.368 is my bios voltage for my 4.8 overclock on my 3570k. Very good chip indeed.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> First thing i do when i install a fresh copy of winfdows, is set power options to High Performance,
> and uncheck Remote Assistance ..lol


just so you know, all the benefit of daily running CPU on offsets is nullified when you run High Performance mode at all times ... fixed vcore would be better choice then.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Golden. I wish I could get my vcore that low for 5GHZ.


sweet vcore ... mine calls for 1.56V under load now at 5GHz LOL!


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> sweet vcore ... mine calls for 1.56V under load now at 5GHz LOL!


You and I are in the same boat.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> sweet vcore ... mine calls for 1.56V under load now at 5GHz LOL!


Thanks guys. But without this thread it wouldn't be anywhere here 5 GHz.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> no, i didnt ..lol..beat you too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... jk jk
> wonder if i can get 10.35-10.40 points, would be something to get past the xeon's ..lol


Show me your Cinnebench that one is one of the Highest ive ever seen on IB.. and comes from having 2500mhz ram

Cause that was a 24/7 OC i can go Higher


----------



## Ervin87

whow, 1.5....1.6Vcore on a 3770k?!?!







Isn't that a bit.......unsafe?


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ervin87*
> 
> whow, 1.5....1.6Vcore on a 3770k?!?!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't that a bit.......unsafe?


1.52v is Intel recommended max on air/water, so yeah - a little.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ervin87*
> 
> whow, 1.5....1.6Vcore on a 3770k?!?!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't that a bit.......unsafe?


No i run 1.53.5 24/7 And can not break 80c









I would not go past 1.55v 24/7 tho


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ervin87*
> 
> whow, 1.5....1.6Vcore on a 3770k?!?!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't that a bit.......unsafe?


Check my 5.4 Ghz run. Along with VonDutch's....... Lol I tried for 5.5 Ghz lasy night as well.......I got reeeeeeealy close but no go.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> 1.368 is my bios voltage for my 4.8 overclock on my 3570k. Very good chip indeed.


What about 5GHZ?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> You and I are in the same boat.


ehh, mine used to be better, only 1.46V @ 5GHz 2 weeks ago ... then 1.51v and now 1.56v ... my CPU is degrading and actually I know why (it started before a suicide run & deliding) ... not sure if I can say that here yet (waiting for confirmation from another fellow member), but it might been actually damaged by my former faulty MB ... two chips from different batches, both degrading in a same manner in the same given time ... and on this CPU I actually found a brown spot on the terminal side ... will try RMA'ing it in 2 weeks under intel's overclocking protection plan.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ehh, mine used to be better, only 1.46V @ 5GHz 2 weeks ago ... then 1.51v and now 1.56v ... my CPU is degrading and actually I know why (it started before a suicide run & deliding) ... not sure if I can say that here yet (waiting for confirmation from another fellow member), but it might been actually damaged by my former faulty MB ... two chips from different batches, both degrading in a same manner in the same given time ... and on this CPU I actually found a brown spot on the terminal side ... will try RMA'ing it in 2 weeks under intel's overclocking protection plan.


Have you been monitoring temps over the last 2 weeks?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> What about 5GHZ?


I would need to delid. I am at 95 degrees doing 8k ffts right now with that vcore. I obviously can't use IBT. I am saving to cover a new chip in case of disaster, I estimate mid november. Hope I am still welcome to follow the thread







Although I do have my liquid ultra and razor blades sitting in my PSU box already.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would need to delid. I am at 95 degrees doing 8k ffts right now with that vcore. I obviously can't use IBT. I am saving to cover a new chip in case of disaster, I estimate mid november. Hope I am still welcome to follow the thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although I do have my liquid ultra and razor blades sitting in my PSU box already.


95C is way too hot.









Do you feel confident and ready to delid?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ehh, mine used to be better, only 1.46V @ 5GHz 2 weeks ago ... then 1.51v and now 1.56v ... my CPU is degrading and actually I know why (it started before a suicide run & deliding) ... not sure if I can say that here yet (waiting for confirmation from another fellow member), but it might been actually damaged by my former faulty MB ... two chips from different batches, both degrading in a same manner in the same given time ... and on this CPU I actually found a brown spot on the terminal side ... will try RMA'ing it in 2 weeks under intel's overclocking protection plan.


No looks more like it degraded from non Stable overclocks...

If you run a non stable overclock Cpu for any long period of time it will degrade fast... Why i put some much effort in making sure i was stable..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would need to delid. I am at 95 degrees doing 8k ffts right now with that vcore. I obviously can't use IBT. I am saving to cover a new chip in case of disaster, I estimate mid november. Hope I am still welcome to follow the thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although I do have my liquid ultra and razor blades sitting in my PSU box already.


I should say that even though I cannot IBT it without temps creeping towards 105 and me stopping it. I am at 4.8GHz and 1.368v with the 3570k. The OC seems pretty stable and happy for the past month or so I have been running it. No events in the event log, it wakes from sleep without issues, and the highest temps it sees from gaming are 64-65 degrees, and it passed an overnight prime 27.7 ~10 hours at 8 min per fft with 80% of my ram. Thats where I get my max temp from. I know it should be longer but I am not seeing problems yet to speak of and my wife uses the computer to work from home during the day, so 12 hours + is tough for me. This is again not-delidded and on air. And LOL if the computer ever started crashing or freezing while she were working and she lost a spreadsheet or something I would definitely hear it!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Have you been monitoring temps over the last 2 weeks?


yes. The symptoms both chips followed (used in different manner on same "faulty" board at first) are like this:
a) sudden increase in CPU core temps at same voltage, reaching up to +10C for no apparent reason
b) shortly after vcore demand starts growing, by around 0.03v every week at higher clocks (e.g. 4.7GHz+)

chip A was used mildly at 4.6-4.7GHz daily, max clock was 4.8GHz.
chip B was used more suicidal, but still in reasonable temp range and vcore before deliding, then totally suicidal afterwards. also chip B carries a faint brownish spot (burn mark?) on terminal side since I removed it from Z77 FTW board, at first I thought it was some dirt, but it cannot be rubbed off or cleaned off.

The "faulty" MB I mentioned was the EVGA Z77 FTW which caused me lots of grief and was considered as a "bad batch", e.g. not allowing to use Integrated Graphics at above stock CPU clocks (POST code lockup 9A), even at stock CPU clocks with Integrated Graphics enabled some voltages in BIOS were messed up and out of whack, giving awful memory compatibility issues (POST code lockups 23 & 55), also having numerous bugs in BIOS (even on good batches) often resulting in BIOS corruption and a need to reflash, eventually I gave up on it and returned to manufacturer.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yes. The symptoms both chips followed (used in different manner on same "faulty" board at first) are like this:
> a) sudden increase in CPU core temps at same voltage, reaching up to +10C for no apparent reason
> b) shortly after vcore demand starts growing, by around 0.03v every week at higher clocks (e.g. 4.7GHz+)
> chip A was used mildly at 4.6-4.7GHz daily, max clock was 4.8GHz.
> chip B was used more suicidal, but still in reasonable temp range and vcore before deliding, then totally suicidal afterwards. also chip B carries a faint brownish spot (burn mark?) on terminal side since I removed it from Z77 FTW board, at first I thought it was some dirt, but it cannot be rubbed off or cleaned off.
> The "faulty" MB I mentioned was the EVGA Z77 FTW which caused me lots of grief and was considered as a "bad batch", e.g. not allowing to use Integrated Graphics at above stock CPU clocks (POST code lockup 9A), even at stock CPU clocks with Integrated Graphics enabled some voltages in BIOS were messed up and out of whack, giving awful memory compatibility issues (POST code lockups 23 & 55), also having numerous bugs in BIOS (even on good batches) often resulting in BIOS corruption and a need to reflash, eventually I gave up on it and returned to manufacturer.


Ah do not buy Evga Mbs there whole MB Engineering Team quit on them and went somewhere else..

Why it took Evga so long to release a Z77 MB..

Stick with Asus And Gigabyte for peace of mind.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would need to delid. I am at 95 degrees doing 8k ffts right now with that vcore. I obviously can't use IBT. I am saving to cover a new chip in case of disaster, I estimate mid november. Hope I am still welcome to follow the thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although I do have my liquid ultra and razor blades sitting in my PSU box already.


Feel free to browse! Thats what its here for so you can decide very carefully.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I should say that even though I cannot IBT it without temps creeping towards 105 and me stopping it. I am at 4.8GHz and 1.368v with the 3570k. The OC seems pretty stable and happy for the past month or so I have been running it. No events in the event log, it wakes from sleep without issues, and the highest temps it sees from gaming are 64-65 degrees, and it passed an overnight prime 27.7 ~10 hours at 8 min per fft with 80% of my ram. Thats where I get my max temp from. I know it should be longer but I am not seeing problems yet to speak of and my wife uses the computer to work from home during the day, so 12 hours + is tough for me. This is again not-delidded and on air. And LOL if the computer ever started crashing or freezing while she were working and she lost a spreadsheet or something I would definitely hear it!


That seems very stable actually. I have one heck of a sturdy chip. 1.87Vcore i pumped in last night.......Shhhhhhhhh. Yes Little Franky is more than fine he's been folding all night happily. I believe I have done some pumping out of my px-3. Temps hit 61C for highs now instead of 58C. LP is on the way however!!









Okay I think to be fair to everyone who either wants to change the Sig or keep it the same should say so. If you wanna change it post it on here (Make it look like the actual sig not the code so we can actually see it) and then we can do some voting for it. I'd like to see everyone happy and not confused lol.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ah do not buy Evga Mbs there whole MB Engineering Team quit on them and went somewhere else..
> Why it took Evga so long to release a Z77 MB..
> Stick with Asus And Gigabyte for peace of mind.


yes, I learned it the hard way ... upgraded from my old good evga 790 Ultra (was awesome for a few years) to EVGA Z68 FTW and considered it unfinished and limited in both design and BIOS support, so upgraded to latest Z77 platform (Z77 FTW) ... geeez, what a failure ... what a nightmare, never again ... Asus MB it is for me now and I feel like in heaven


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No looks more like it degraded from non Stable overclocks...
> If you run a non stable overclock Cpu for any long period of time it will degrade fast... Why i put some much effort in making sure i was stable..


nope, not it absolutely, 100% sure.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yes. The symptoms both chips followed (used in different manner on same "faulty" board at first) are like this:
> a) sudden increase in CPU core temps at same voltage, reaching up to +10C for no apparent reason
> b) shortly after vcore demand starts growing, by around 0.03v every week at higher clocks (e.g. 4.7GHz+)r.


Sounds like possible pump out of TIM as well.

When your TIM pumps out and doens't work very well the heat increases and you need more voltage to get the same effect on the CPU stability because of the added electrical resistance caused by the heat.


----------



## shremi

Does anybody here know if i can practice on a Celeron 478 chip ???? i have a couple of them in the office that i am not using at all


----------



## chronicfx

I am seeing the term pump-out used alot. Whats the explaination on that?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Sounds like possible pump out of TIM as well.
> When your TIM pumps out and doens't work very well the heat increases and you need more voltage to get the same effect on the CPU stability because of the added electrical resistance caused by the heat.


you mean the stock Intel factory TIM pump out? maybe, it was poor quality (and fried crispy), I don't know, really what was first, the egg or the chicken.
what is interesting though is that soon after that, voltage degradation always occurred on chips from 2 different batches (Costa Rican week 19 and week 24) ... and that burned brown spot under CPU ... either Intel doesn't know anymore how to make good CPUs (highly unlikely) or EVGA doesn't know how to make boards anymore (very likely) ...
also even after I replaced the TIM under IHS of current CPU which lowered the temps of cores by good 30C, it did nothing to voltage requirements and the chip keeps degrading further, so ... I don't think that chip temperature has that whole lot to do with vcore degradation in normal usage.

EVGA boards stink like rotten eggs nowadays and I won't touch another one even with a 10 foot pole, never again.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am seeing the term pump-out used alot. Whats the explaination on that?


Basic concept

"Large and fast decreases in temperature when coupled with HLT instructions. A usage pattern that alternates between full idle and full load conditions will cause die temps to swing WIDE AND FAST, particularly with overclocked/overvolted CPUs.

This thermal cycling causes TIM pump-out, wherein the TIM gets ejected and displaced by air, which is of course not a good thing.

Greases also creep, again worsening the situation."

I think this happens more often with IB because of how quick it heats up and cools off. The die contact area is so small with such drastic temperatures is another reason.


----------



## chronicfx

Anyone know if liquid ultra is ok for the base of an NH-D14? Reviewers say it is nickel material and not aluminum on the bottom. I know that the coollabs TIM is incompatible with some metals. Also is it true that the liquid ultra does not "bond" like the liquid pro does. I would like to be able to switch to water at some point and that would require my D14 and chip not becoming one mass. If not I will just go with regular Noctua TIM on top of the IHS.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Anyone know if liquid ultra is ok for the base of an NH-D14? Reviewers say it is nickel material and not aluminum on the bottom. I know that the coollabs TIM is incompatible with some metals. Also is it true that the liquid ultra does not "bond" like the liquid pro does. I would like to be able to switch to water at some point and that would require my D14 and chip not becoming one mass. If not I will just go with regular Noctua TIM on top of the IHS.


They claim that Ultra does not harden like Pro did.
It is safe for use on nickel and copper.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am seeing the term pump-out used alot. Whats the explaination on that?


Here's a quick one basically.

Take a TIM put it on your IHS and push your heat sink on it. after a while it starts to "spread" or pump out from the middle of the IHS and onto the sides causing temps to go up. I have actually experienced this very recently as my Max's for temps went up. not from vcore or anything same settings and ambients. it went up 4C.

I think this could also be applied very well to benching. For example you apply a lot of heat to lets say a candle (Shut up it's a bad example let me be)











You heat up the top of it and it melts making it more fluid and able to move. you then let it cool thus hardening. then you repeat for a while and eventually the melted wax overflows the side and drips. the same can be said with this pump out saying. as it heats it and and makes it more fluid and moves to the outer areas of the IHS or even the die of your CPU's. This also correlates to the amount of pressure you have on the IHS and the TIM from your heatsink as that pushes the material and makes it move. so the more pressure the better temps but higher chance of pumping out the TIM in the process of better temps.

I think it's longer than short


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> TIM drys out and loses ability to transfer heat.


Thanks. I didn't know that was possbile in such a short time or that there were so many volatiles in TIM that helped transfer heat.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> They claim that Ultra does not harden like Pro did.
> It is safe for use on nickel and copper.


It is definitely not safe with aluminium. This is why:






I assume that stuff includes at least a small amount of mercury.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Anyone know if liquid ultra is ok for the base of an NH-D14? Reviewers say it is nickel material and not aluminum on the bottom. I know that the coollabs TIM is incompatible with some metals. Also is it true that the liquid ultra does not "bond" like the liquid pro does. I would like to be able to switch to water at some point and that would require my D14 and chip not becoming one mass. If not I will just go with regular Noctua TIM on top of the IHS.


Unless you delid you wont see real temp drops...unless your using sandy bridge I would recommend some IX if the base of the D-14 is completely flat with no bare pipes and such. that stuff rocks

(yes I'm still in the process of doing my review get off my back peoples!)

Sorry for the double post!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Thanks. I didn't know that was possbile in such a short time or that there were so many volatiles in TIM that helped transfer heat.


Not really drys out but more pumps its greast/contact area away from the contact area of die and block. I think over clocked IB see this problem more than other CPUs because of how small the die is. Just not alot of contact area.

Read my corrected post above. http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1490#post_18442408


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> They claim that Ultra does not harden like Pro did.
> It is safe for use on nickel and copper.


I wouldn't use Liquid Pro on a nickel plated Copper block.


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I wouldn't use Liquid Pro on a nickel plated Copper block.


"Coollaboratory Liquid Pro is especially recommend for nickel-plated copper."

Directly from their website. Grammar and all.

Plus, the CPU's IHS is exactly that - nickel plated copper.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh Lapp that Nickle off and get to the coppers!


----------



## Valgaur

Everyone just passes my posts..........


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Everyone just passes my posts..........


Welcome to the pass my post club yo..


----------



## Powermonkey500

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Everyone just passes my posts..........


Happens to everyone, especially in a fast-moving thread such as this.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welcome to the pass my post club yo..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Happens to everyone, especially in a fast-moving thread such as this.


w00t people didnt pass it!!

Check a page back for the full explanation to pumping out guys. I think I did a good job describing it.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Unless you delid you wont see real temp drops...unless your using sandy bridge I would recommend some IX if the base of the D-14 is completely flat with no bare pipes and such. that stuff rocks
> (yes I'm still in the process of doing my review get off my back peoples!)
> Sorry for the double post!


Yes this is for de-lidding. Since the $200 I am saving is for chip replacement, I will only be able to order a water cooling kit (maybe an XSPC RS360 or RX240, but will post to the water cooling guys if they can put something together I don't have to cut my arm off to buy) after I am finished and "tested".

which means I will be remounting my D14 for a little bit.

My question in my mind is: do I use the Ultra on die and on IHS or just on the die then use Noctua paste between the D14 and the IHS. I would think if the ultra is compatible with the D14 base material it would yield better temps right? and if it turns out I don't need need water at all then maybe I will save the $$ for something else. But I am pretty sold on the fun of putting together a loop.. even just to do it. I am not going to direct die, even if I go water. I just don't feel comfortable cranking down on a bare die.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yes this is for de-lidding. Since the $200 I am saving is for chip replacement, I will only be able to order a water cooling kit (maybe an XSPC RS360 or RX240, but will post to the water cooling guys if they can put something together I don't have to cut my arm off to buy) after I am finished and "tested".
> which means I will be remounting my D14 for a little bit.
> My question in my mind is: do I use the Ultra on die and on IHS or just on the die then use Noctua paste between the D14 and the IHS. I would think if the ultra is compatible with the D14 base material it would yield better temps right? and if it turns out I don't need need water at all then maybe I will save the $$ for something else. But I am pretty sold on the fun of putting together a loop.. even just to do it. I am not going to direct die, even if I go water. I just don't feel comfortable cranking down on a bare die.


Once you delid get rid of all the black glue which makes the gap (heat problem) go away and then you will use liquid pro or ultra up to you as a user to pick, on just the die not the IHS you can use noctua TIM on the IHS but id use some pk3 or something along that. Don't use liquid pro or ultra. Indigo xtreme should yeild the best results but I can test until I get my liquid pro!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> They claim that Ultra does not harden like Pro did.
> It is safe for use on nickel and copper.


I read the same thing. Hence I decided not to go with LPRO under the nickel IHS (if that's nickel plated) because I was afraid to fail dping it the 1st attempt (my fears came true LOL!).
Pro is not suitable for aluminum is a warning I saw on Cool Laboratory LPRO specs page, but they claim it's perfect for nickel plated copper (like IHS is I think):
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/
I think both Pro & Ultra share similar real world thermal conductivity abilities, only real difference is method of application and removal ... and the fact that PRO hardens to nearly solid metal over time...

I really like Ultra paste, pity I ran out of it already I need to re-order ... interesting that SideWinder Computers which used to sell it at $13 shipped is out of stock by now he he


----------



## Powermonkey500

Valgaur, I love your avatar.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> Valgaur, I love your avatar.


Thank you sir!

So amny people have commented on it lol. I love finding these funny guys.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I should say that even though I cannot IBT it without temps creeping towards 105 and me stopping it. I am at 4.8GHz and 1.368v with the 3570k. The OC seems pretty stable and happy for the past month or so I have been running it. No events in the event log, it wakes from sleep without issues, and the highest temps it sees from gaming are 64-65 degrees, and it passed an overnight prime 27.7 ~10 hours at 8 min per fft with 80% of my ram. Thats where I get my max temp from. I know it should be longer but I am not seeing problems yet to speak of and my wife uses the computer to work from home during the day, so 12 hours + is tough for me. This is again not-delidded and on air. And LOL if the computer ever started crashing or freezing while she were working and she lost a spreadsheet or something I would definitely hear it!


the way you use you comp, daily usage, you wont have any problem,
i would prolly run 4.7ghz, then you should be good with prime too..
4.9 and higher need alot more vcore if i look around..
very nice oc for not-delidded chip..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Does anybody here know if i can practice on a Celeron 478 chip ???? i have a couple of them in the office that i am not using at all


it is in this list,

IHS Not Soldered To Die

Hyperthreading/Single Cores

-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
-(S-478) Celeron
-(S-775) Celeron
-Celeron 420
-Celeron 430
-Celeron 440
-AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)


----------



## ivanlabrie

I have a 775 single core Celeron D 331...wonder if that's glued ihs too. It seems so.









A friend borrowed it and he cannot find it now :/ Hope he does find it soon so I can have some fun with that chip's 20x multi, IC Diamond and a Silver Arrow


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thank you sir!
> So amny people have commented on it lol. I love finding these funny guys.















I gots lotsa good ones @[email protected]


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Basic concept
> _"Large and fast decreases in temperature when coupled with HLT instructions_. A usage pattern that alternates between full idle and full load conditions will cause die temps to swing WIDE AND FAST, particularly with overclocked/overvolted CPUs.
> This thermal cycling causes TIM pump-out, wherein the TIM gets ejected and displaced by air, which is of course not a good thing.
> Greases also creep, again worsening the situation."
> *I think this happens more often with IB because of how quick it heats up and cools off.* The die contact area is so small with such drastic temperatures is another reason.


thats a good point you have there , thanks..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Silly silly hokies!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Silly silly hokies!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No looks more like it degraded from non Stable overclocks...
> If you run a non stable overclock Cpu for any long period of time it will degrade fast... Why i put some much effort in making sure i was stable..


what makes you say that, explain








high temps, to much voltage ok, i understand that..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> the way you use you comp, daily usage, you wont have any problem,
> i would prolly run 4.7ghz, then you should be good with prime too..
> 4.9 and higher need alot more vcore if i look around..
> very nice oc for not-delidded chip..


Thanks. I have a saved setting for 4.7 as well. I also have a validation for 5GHz at this same voltage but it would be far from stable I am thinking. Although I did play skyrim for 20 minutes with it at 5GHz and 1.45v.

My 5GHz 3570k validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2500438


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what makes you say that, explain
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> high temps, to much voltage ok, i understand that..


13 years of doing this and 10 years of overclocking...

Just google what hapend when u run for long periods of time with an Un Stable OC.. it is well documented.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Thanks. I have a saved setting for 4.7 as well. I also have a validation for 5GHz at this same voltage but it would be far from stable I am thinking. Although I did play skyrim for 20 minutes with it at 5GHz and 1.45v.
> My 5GHz 3570k validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2500438


your temps wont sky rocked with skyrim, or any other game,
prime is very hot as you know..
wauw, imagine you could have that oc all the time and play skyrim etc ..lol
you prolly need about 1.4V for 4.9?
i can understand why you want to de-lid ..

i couldnt even run 4.5ghz prime ..hit 100+C in seconds..lol
that was my reason to de-lid, glad i did, even if mine is bad with voltages..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> your temps wont sky rocked with skyrim, or any other game,
> prime is very hot as you know..
> wauw, imagine you could have that oc all the time and play skyrim etc ..lol
> you prolly need about 1.4V for 4.9?
> i can understand why you want to de-lid ..
> i couldnt even run 4.5ghz prime ..hit 100+C in seconds..lol
> that was my reason to de-lid, glad i did, even if mine is bad with voltages..


You need faster gpu.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 13 years of doing this and 10 years of overclocking...
> Just google what hapend when u run for long periods of time with an Un Stable OC.. it is well documented.


will look for it, i didnt know that, thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> will look for it, i didnt know that, thanks


New guys









Man there is sooo much stuff out there it is crazy.. Back in the 1366 Days Forums were jumping like crazy.. Cpu was fun to OC 1155 took the fun away and made it easy for all.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Powermonkey500*
> 
> "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro is especially recommend for nickel-plated copper."
> Directly from their website. Grammar and all.
> Plus, the CPU's IHS is exactly that - nickel plated copper.


Thanks.

I have nickel plated heat-kller water block on my HD7950. I have been thinking about putting some Liquid Pro on the die and block.

Do you think it will be a good match? Right now I have IC diamond on it.


----------



## 4thKor

You guys get the prize for "Most Active Club"! WOW!


----------



## Sevada88

I don't mean to break the conversation in this thread but I have a slightly off-topic question and I think you folks might be able to help me.

I disassembled my laptop to clean it. I want to replace the thermal paste on the CPU, although I am not sure if I can use rubbing alcohol or some other similar product to clean the chip (since it doesn't have an IHS, I just want to make sure I don't damage it).
Here is a photo of my motherboard, with the CPU and GPU: http://i47.tinypic.com/1658w2.jpg. Can I use rubbing alcohol on the "shiny" part and how do I clean the rest of the thermal paste?

Also, would it be recommended to replace the thermal pads used for the GPU by thermal paste?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sevada88*
> 
> I don't mean to break the conversation in this thread but I have a slightly off-topic question and I think you folks might be able to help me.
> I disassembled my laptop to clean it. I want to replace the thermal paste on the CPU, although I am not sure if I can use rubbing alcohol or some other similar product to clean the chip (since it doesn't have an IHS, I just want to make sure I don't damage it).
> Here is a photo of my motherboard, with the CPU and GPU: http://i47.tinypic.com/1658w2.jpg. Can I use rubbing alcohol on the "shiny" part and how do I clean the rest of the thermal paste?
> Also, would it be recommended to replace the thermal pads used for the GPU by thermal paste?


If that was my MB, I'd have no problem using 70-90% alcohol on it.

On the GPU, some have experienced improved temps by using a high-quality TIM on them if they are having temp problems with original TIM.


----------



## kgtuning

I have used 70% on my laptop before without any issue.


----------



## kgtuning

IBT at 5ghz with HT on.


----------



## PCWargamer

Great IBT run *Kgtuning*! I have only been able to do it at 4.9GHz so far, but note the vcore and temps required to do so!!!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great IBT run *Kgtuning*! I have only been able to do it at 4.9GHz so far, but note the vcore and temps required to do so!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Still... not a bad run for 4.9. I have seen many worse then that.


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys what should someone charge another to delid their chip........


----------



## ivanlabrie

$10 bucks? xD


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> $10 bucks? xD


what about doing the lapping and thermal paste and benching as well........yeah its not for just a person....but for a site lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Lapping should cost more...$15 more, testing and stuff $20 more (includes cost for the Liquid Pro)


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what about doing the lapping and thermal paste and benching as well........yeah its not for just a person....but for a site lol.


whole hell alot more then 10$... how much is your time worth? what is the risk? are you offering a service that they cannot?


----------



## chronicfx

He's in argentina and you are in New Hampshire. Prices may vary. Anyways I would probably let someone de-lid my chip, I would bring beer and my good sense of humor... for afterwards of course during benching, no drinking and de-lidding please!


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it is in this list,
> IHS Not Soldered To Die
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)


Thanks man + REP

I got a hold of a Celeron and a Pentium 4 so i can practice and if it is easy ill move into my ivy.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> He's in argentina and you are in New Hampshire. Prices may vary. Anyways I would probably let someone de-lid my chip, I would bring beer and my good sense of humor... for afterwards of course during benching, no drinking and de-lidding please!


I understand that. sorry It wasnt meant to sound mean..lol . If I were doing it for someone I knew it would be different but doing a service for people I think it changes the ball game. you know what I mean?


----------



## Valgaur

Yeah I do lol. Im thinking about trying fishing line as well to see how it works. And ktung. Its that person you recommended me lol. Hush hush lol. And yeah you gotta make everything clear before hand like I have been.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I do lol. Im thinking about trying fishing line as well to see how it works. And ktung. Its that person you recommended me lol. Hush hush lol. And yeah you gotta make everything clear before hand like I have been.


cool hope it works well...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> cool hope it works well...


It should me and my stable hands. He wants me to bench the puppy as well for him. Nuff said lol I wanna see a 5ghz at 1.4 lol


----------



## chronicfx

Great idea with the fishing line. Maybe try something like this?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It should me and my stable hands. He wants me to bench the puppy as well for him. Nuff said lol I wanna see a 5ghz at 1.4 lol


Well thanks for helping him out.


----------



## PCWargamer

Finally was able to do a superPi at 5.2GHz!









I also got OC to 5.3, but it died before I could validate....









*new superPi 1M run using 5.207GHz @ 1.600v - score = 7.041s*


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Great idea with the fishing line. Maybe try something like this?


Y have a similar idea. tie the line around my legs and make it tight and use both of my hands to maneuver the chip slowly. I think it will be better since I can control the chip and the tension in the line as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Well thanks for helping him out.


No prb does he really work for Perfomance pc?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Finally was able to do a superPi at 5.2GHz!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also got OC to 5.3, but it died before I could validate....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *new superPi 1M run using 5.207GHz @ 1.600v - score = 7.041s*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


LOL COME ON!!!!! Beat my under 7 seconds run!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Ran a Video encode bench mark to crush the 8350 over rated hype...

This takes like 30 mins to finish..
Has you encode Large 1920x1080 Video files. Works in Dos.

x264 HD BENCHMARK 5.0 RESULTS

Please do NOT compare it with older versions of the benchmark!
Please copy/paste everything below the line to to report your data
to http://forums.techarp.com/reviews-articles/26957-x264-hd-benchmark-5-0-a.html

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Results for x264.exe r2200
x264 Benchmark: 64-bit
==========================

Pass 1

encoded 11812 frames, 90.04 fps, 7754.21 kb/s
encoded 11812 frames, 90.13 fps, 7754.07 kb/s
encoded 11812 frames, 90.31 fps, 7754.08 kb/s
encoded 11812 frames, 91.36 fps, 7754.02 kb/s


----------



## y2kcamaross

Ugh, can't wait to slap that liquid pro on the ihs and the h100 on my ivy, all you 5.0+ghz chips are making me jealous!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> Ugh, can't wait to slap that liquid pro on the ihs and the h100 on my ivy, all you 5.0+ghz chips are making me jealous!!


*cough* *cough*

I'm not using LP......


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *cough* *cough*
> I'm not using LP......


Didn't mean to imply that you were, I'm using it on the die but mx4 on the ihs, gonna rectify that Sunday!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Finally was able to do a superPi at 5.2GHz!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also got OC to 5.3, but it died before I could validate....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *new superPi 1M run using 5.207GHz @ 1.600v - score = 7.041s*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL COME ON!!!!! Beat my under 7 seconds run!!!
Click to expand...

Well, if I could just get my chip to get to 5.3, stay there to validate, and then hold on for a run or two of superPi 1M, then, then I'd take that 6.942s down buddy!!!


----------



## feniks

OMG ... I think either I am unlucky with Intel CPUs or the former faulty ("bad batch") EVGA Z77 FTW was the culprit responsible for eff**ing up both of my CPUs ... my fellow EVGA forums member replied and confirmed my fears, he experienced the exact same problem with temps rising and CPU degradation (he also noticed a single brown/burned spot under both of his CPUs) while using 3770K on Z77 FTW, but yet he doesn't know what caused the problem (either Intel CPU batch or EVGA Z77 FTW batch) ... below is the message, edited out for privacy purposes:

"Hey Feniks,

Sorry about the late reply, was busy with ever-changing life, especially now!! I've had the exact issue with the 3770K CPUs. Temps increasing and more voltage required even at stock (I've seen max of 1.2v)!!! Now, I don't know if its specific to Z77 FTW boards!! Also the 3226B912 Costa batch of 3770K was fresh used with MVE and then came the Lxx Malay Batch, with both I noticed high volt requirements but with the former the temps were high too where's for the latter temps were decent at high volts. So again, conflicting data!!
[cut]
So Ll I can say is, I think somewhere there's some sort of problem. It's Z77FTW or i7 3770K, dunno which one or both!! But let's start fresh, like mine and see how you go. My Malay batch was brand new and was used first with MVE now with WS board, I'll see how this goes and update u!!!

Cheers buddy "

... I guess I should really start fresh with CPU on MVE board or I will never know what the problem is ... chances are it was the Z77 FTW damaging the CPUs, both mine and his ... hopefully Intel takes back my delided chip (I did a good job on that one, can't notice!) and problem will be ultimately solved. contacting Intel RMA after the weekend.


----------



## Hokies83

Maybe it was reporting Voltage way off or something? or was not correctly supplying voltage?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Maybe it was reporting Voltage way off or something? or was not correctly supplying voltage?


definitely something off with voltages, but general opinion of EVGA tech support was it's just a misreport in BIOS ... but they took physical readings off a GOOD BATCH and weren't even able to replicate the same issues that my fellow member and I experienced .. until more and more people started showing up and reporting the exact same issues (they were not CPU related at first like a bunch of POST code lockups, BIOS bugs, etc.).
problems were related to AXG voltage (dropping to near zero) and other voltage, I believe VCCSA increasing up to 2.1V whenever the Integrated Graphics was enabled at stock CPU clocks ...

worth mentioning also that I lost 2 backup hard drives 1 month apart when using with that evil board (same Intel native SATA2 port was used), each drive was same batch of WD Caviar Green 1.5TB, both ended up in WD RMA and were replaced.

god damn! screw you EVGA! what did I do to deserve this crap... welcome to Intel RMA ... again ... 1 week down time at least.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> definitely something off with voltages, but general opinion of EVGA tech support was it's just a misreport in BIOS ... but they took physical readings off a GOOD BATCH and weren't even able to replicate the same issues that my fellow member and I experienced .. until more and more people started showing up and reporting the exact same issues (they were not CPU related at first like a bunch of POST code lockups, BIOS bugs, etc.).
> problems were related to AXG voltage (dropping to near zero) and other voltage, I believe VCCSA increasing up to 2.1V whenever the Integrated Graphics was enabled at stock CPU clocks ...
> worth mentioning also that I lost 2 backup hard drives 1 month apart when using with that evil board (same Intel native SATA2 port was used), each drive was same batch of WD Caviar Green 1.5TB, both ended up in WD RMA and were replaced.
> god damn! screw you EVGA! what did I do to deserve this crap... welcome to Intel RMA ... again ... 1 week down time at least.


You have your Warranty in a Tube ready?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You have your Warranty in a Tube ready?


it's been already applied







all looks perfectly stock







will go bold about this RMA using Intel's overclocking protection plan as I don't want to hide it was overclocked.


----------



## Silkworm75

I can confirm that you can RMA delidded chip as long as you make cpu look like stock. I did it a while back. (I did not kill cpu from delid, it was for different reason)

I can explain step by step if you guys are interested, Or should I start a different thread. Let me know OP.

PS: I did want to make to much noise about this issue because I am thinking intel RMA might catch on.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silkworm75*
> 
> I can confirm that you can RMA delidded chip as long as you make cpu look like stock. I did it a while back. (I did not kill cpu from delid, it was for different reason)
> I can explain step by step if you guys are interested, Or should I start a different thread. Let me know OP.
> PS: I did want to make to much noise about this issue because I am thinking intel RMA might catch on.


Intel is not going to delid every chip to make sure the stock tim is on them it is not cost effective

It would be nice to have the info for the OP.. for those who warranty concerns.


----------



## Silkworm75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> *Intel is not going to delid every chip* to make sure the stock tim is on them it is not cost effective
> It would be nice to have the info for the OP.. for those who warranty concerns.


This is exactly what I thought about Intel RMA.


----------



## Swag

They don't delid to inspect if it was delidded. They delid it however so they can take it apart and recycle it to be able to re-sell it after they remake it basically.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silkworm75*
> 
> I can confirm that you can RMA delidded chip as long as you make cpu look like stock. I did it a while back. (I did not kill cpu from delid, it was for different reason)
> I can explain step by step if you guys are interested, Or should I start a different thread. Let me know OP.
> PS: I did want to make to much noise about this issue because I am thinking intel RMA might catch on.


PM me or add it on here so people can read it. eaither way I will mostelikely add it to the main page as we have to RMA these things thanks to Intels idot moves on using TIM this time around....it bugs me....a freaking lot man!


----------



## Silkworm75

So it's common knowledge people know delided chip can be RMA? I read in here people have doubts. There should be no doubt as I did it. I am sure I am not the only one who RMA'ed delided chip


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silkworm75*
> 
> So it's common knowledge people know delided chip can be RMA? I read in here people have doubts. There should be no doubt as I did it. I am sure I am not the only one who RMA'ed delided chip


So far....you are lol. No one has commentedto tell us at all so we have just been in the dark waiting to be told..... Now thanks to you we finally know!! PC AND FENIKS DO IT NOW!!!!!!!!!! AND ALL THE OTHER PEOPLE I FORGOT!!!!!! im very very tired......


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So far....you are lol. No one has commentedto tell us at all so we have just been in the dark waiting to be told..... Now thanks to you we finally know!! PC AND FENIKS DO IT NOW!!!!!!!!!! AND ALL THE OTHER PEOPLE I FORGOT!!!!!! im very very tired......


will do it Monday morning







need a working system over the weekend







... it still runs 5GHz daily, not sure if stable anymore though, crap degrades and I can't stress test it anymore at normal room temps at this speed coz of temps under load. will not forget to mention to intel tech support that it WAS used on Z77 FTW....


----------



## Silkworm75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> will do it Monday morning
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> need a working system over the weekend
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... it still runs 5GHz daily, not sure if stable anymore though, crap degrades and I can't stress test it anymore at normal room temps at this speed coz of temps under load. will not forget to mention to intel tech support that it WAS used on Z77 FTW....


Have no fear, as long as your cpu looks like stock. The IHS line up exactly as it was before delid.


----------



## VonDutch

check some pic's, and make sure the IHS is aligned the same as before,
and dont let any glue stick out from under the ihs..
i might return it too, just before the warranty is expired ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Thanks man + REP
> I got a hold of a Celeron and a Pentium 4 so i can practice and if it is easy ill move into my ivy.


Thanks!







and GL


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great IBT run *Kgtuning*! I have only been able to do it at 4.9GHz so far, but note the vcore and temps required to do so!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


no fun with our voltages huh...

5.0ghz with HT, 1.5V vcore in bios


5.0ghz without HT, 1.5V vcore in bios


----------



## VonDutch

is it time already to start the "5.0Ghz ivy bridge club" ? ..lol


----------



## hollowtek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silkworm75*
> 
> I can confirm that you can RMA delidded chip as long as you make cpu look like stock. I did it a while back. (I did not kill cpu from delid, it was for different reason)
> I can explain step by step if you guys are interested, Or should I start a different thread. Let me know OP.
> PS: I did want to make to much noise about this issue because I am thinking intel RMA might catch on.


Hah just keep quiet on the matter and let us have our RMA's while everyone else is stuck with a bad chip


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> definitely something off with voltages, but general opinion of EVGA tech support was it's just a misreport in BIOS ... but they took physical readings off a GOOD BATCH and weren't even able to replicate the same issues that my fellow member and I experienced .. until more and more people started showing up and reporting the exact same issues (they were not CPU related at first like a bunch of POST code lockups, BIOS bugs, etc.).
> problems were related to AXG voltage (dropping to near zero) and other voltage, I believe VCCSA increasing up to 2.1V whenever the Integrated Graphics was enabled at stock CPU clocks ...
> worth mentioning also that I lost 2 backup hard drives 1 month apart when using with that evil board (same Intel native SATA2 port was used), each drive was same batch of WD Caviar Green 1.5TB, both ended up in WD RMA and were replaced.
> god damn! screw you EVGA! what did I do to deserve this crap... welcome to Intel RMA ... again ... 1 week down time at least.


Sue em!
fckd up man, but im glad it seems not to be from degradation,
i think my windows install is messed up from all the bsod and other oc's again ..grmbl,
i hate reinstalling, takes like half a day with all the updates etc etc,
did a full backup with windows backup when i finished installing,
but thats screwed up too...lol..o well..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silkworm75*
> 
> Have no fear, as long as your cpu looks like stock. The IHS line up exactly as it was before delid.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> check some pic's, and make sure the IHS is aligned the same as before,
> and dont let any glue stick out from under the ihs..
> i might return it too, just before the warranty is expired ..lol


According to pics I have it looks same, so I will see how it goes with Intel


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Sue em!
> fckd up man, but im glad it seems not to be from degradation,
> i think my windows install is messed up from all the bsod and other oc's again ..grmbl,
> i hate reinstalling, takes like half a day with all the updates etc etc,
> did a full backup with windows backup when i finished installing,
> but thats screwed up too...lol..o well..


LOL, I know what you mean about a backup of corrupted OS, been there a few times ... then the backup (if still can be read, sometimes it can't LOL) is for restoring Saved Games and Documents and full re-install is still in order









I am seriously considering to start a thread about potential CPU damage caused by certain batches of Z77 FTW boards in their EVGA forums ... will have to contact a few more members to confirm things and see if they want to push the issue further as well or not ... it will cause lots of fuss in evga forums for sure ... but I believe people should be warned. it's no fun to loose components (sometimes out of warranty) just because of EVGA board hardware/BIOS failures ...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> no fun with our voltages huh...
> 5.0ghz with HT, 1.5V vcore in bios
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.0ghz without HT, 1.5V vcore in bios
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Yep. Our high OC voltages are horrible compared to lots of these other guy's chips...... but our temps are still great!!!! Got to love delidding!


----------



## Valgaur

I want 5.5 Ghz........


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want 5.5 Ghz........


Why?

Just wait for haswell 5.2ghz haswell = 5.5ghz Ivy @[email protected]

Don't fry your cpu and MB for no reason...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Why?
> Just wait for haswell 5.2ghz haswell = 5.5ghz Ivy @[email protected]
> Don't fry your cpu and MB for no reason...


I want to do it so when haswell comes out i can just get that silly ^.^ might as well push the snot out of it when you upgrade.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL, I know what you mean about a backup of corrupted OS, been there a few times ... then the backup (if still can be read, sometimes it can't LOL) is for restoring Saved Games and Documents and full re-install is still in order
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am seriously considering to start a thread about potential CPU damage caused by certain batches of Z77 FTW boards in their EVGA forums ... will have to contact a few more members to confirm things and see if they want to push the issue further as well or not ... it will cause lots of fuss in evga forums for sure ... but I believe people should be warned. it's no fun to loose components (sometimes out of warranty) just because of EVGA board hardware/BIOS failures ...


can i come with you? ill be youre backup, and only say things like,
"yeah yeah, i saw it with my own 2 eyes"..









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> Yep. Our high OC voltages are horrible compared to lots of these other guy's chips...... but our temps are still great!!!! Got to love delidding!


Yeppers!








no degradation for us caused by high temps ..lol
and 4.7ghz with 1.320V vcore daily oc aint that bad, think i could even run it 4.8ghz with 1.420V vcore long time,
but theres to many conflicting opinions out there, and no real data yet about degradation,
ivy is more resilliant then sandy, "they say" ..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want 5.5 Ghz........


not on air you dont ...lol, what would you need, at least 1.9V vcore?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want to do it so when haswell comes out i can just get that silly ^.^ might as well push the snot out of it when you upgrade.


curious if its soldered or not, and how temps are gonna be with OCing, if they use tim again
shame they use another socket, so have to buy another mobo too..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> curious if its soldered or not, and how temps are gonna be with OCing, if they use tim again
> shame they use another socket, so have to buy another mobo too..


Flipping Hardware is easy... Get 35 rep before Haswell is here so u can post on the OCN market place..

Go get 200 Posts on AnAndtech so u can use there market place same with Evga.. i USES THEM ALL!!!


----------



## ketxxx

I wish the 3770K wasn't so expensive here :/ I want to replace my 2500K but the upgrade isn't worth £240 to me. Maybe when Haswell comes around the 3770K will come down to a decent price. Unless theres some kind of amazing performance gain with Haswell I'm happy to stick with my 1155 rig for a while yet.


----------



## martinhal

I finally did it to my 3770K. Have been thinking about it for a few weeks. I got home told myself don't think about it, don't talk about it just do it&#8230;. Half an hour later done. I have lost 13 degrees on all cores running prime 95 @ 4.9 GHz Using AS5. Will try other TIM later, just wanted to get the cutting out the way. Can I join the club ? I must say it was surprisingly easy to do .
CN name: martinhal
CPU: i7 3770K
on die-TIM: AS5
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 200 Hhz
OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
Temp drops: 13
CPU-Z validation of max OC 
Sorry about the poor picture quality


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I finally did it to my 3770K. Have been thinking about it for a few weeks. I got home told myself don't think about it, don't talk about it just do it&#8230;. Half an hour later done. I have lost 13 degrees on all cores running prime 95 @ 4.9 GHz Using AS5. Will try other TIM later, just wanted to get the cutting out the way. Can I join the club ? I must say it was surprisingly easy to do .
> CN name: martinhal
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 200 Hhz
> OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
> Temp drops: 13
> CPU-Z validation of max OC
> Sorry about the poor picture quality


GJ Nice mother board!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> can i come with you? ill be youre backup, and only say things like,
> "yeah yeah, i saw it with my own 2 eyes"..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeppers!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no degradation for us caused by high temps ..lol
> and 4.7ghz with 1.320V vcore daily oc aint that bad, think i could even run it 4.8ghz with 1.420V vcore long time,
> but theres to many conflicting opinions out there, and no real data yet about degradation,
> ivy is more resilliant then sandy, "they say" ..
> not on air you dont ...lol, what would you need, at least 1.9V vcore?


I pushed all the way to 1.88vcore.........lol. I wanted 5.4 Ghz with 102 bclk and it wasnt happy with it lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> curious if its soldered or not, and how temps are gonna be with OCing, if they use tim again
> shame they use another socket, so have to buy another mobo too..


It better now be TIM again....I'll make another thread to yell at them again.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I finally did it to my 3770K. Have been thinking about it for a few weeks. I got home told myself don't think about it, don't talk about it just do it&#8230;. Half an hour later done. I have lost 13 degrees on all cores running prime 95 @ 4.9 GHz Using AS5. Will try other TIM later, just wanted to get the cutting out the way. Can I join the club ? I must say it was surprisingly easy to do .
> CN name: martinhal
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 200 Hhz
> OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
> Temp drops: 13
> CPU-Z validation of max OC
> Sorry about the poor picture quality


Accepted!


----------



## martinhal

Thanks guys . Im going to shot for 5 Ghz now.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Thanks guys . Im going to shot for 5 Ghz now.


Yeah man the 5ghz mark is where the E-Peen is at.. i whip mine out everywhere..


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah man the 5ghz mark is where the E-Peen is at.. i whip mine out everywhere..


I know what you maen 3 7970's do just not cut it...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I know what you maen 3 7970's do just not cut it...


I had 4 Gtx 680s does not do as much for E-Peen as my 5ghz + Ivy Bridge


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I finally did it to my 3770K. Have been thinking about it for a few weeks. I got home told myself don't think about it, don't talk about it just do it&#8230;. Half an hour later done. I have lost 13 degrees on all cores running prime 95 @ 4.9 GHz Using AS5. Will try other TIM later, just wanted to get the cutting out the way. Can I join the club ? I must say it was surprisingly easy to do .
> CN name: martinhal
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 200 Hhz
> OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
> Temp drops: 13
> CPU-Z validation of max OC
> Sorry about the poor picture quality
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


13C with AS5. Just wait untill you get a some CL PRO or ULTRA between the die and IHS. I'd expect yout overall temp gain will be closer to 20C.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> 13C with AS5. Just wait untill you get a some CL PRO or ULTRA between the die and IHS. I'd expect yout overall temp gain will be closer to 20C.


Just placed my order


----------



## Valgaur

Still waiting for mine.....


----------



## martinhal

Life is good... delid . Oc to 5 Ghz with 84 degrees load temps and AMD 12.11 driver is working











http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/4756769


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Life is good... delid . Oc to 5 Ghz with 84 degrees load temps and AMD 12.11 driver is working
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/4756769


Nice benchmark score for 3dmark11.

What kind of load temps are those for your delidded 3770k?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I finally did it to my 3770K. Have been thinking about it for a few weeks. I got home told myself don't think about it, don't talk about it just do it&#8230;. Half an hour later done. I have lost 13 degrees on all cores running prime 95 @ 4.9 GHz Using AS5. Will try other TIM later, just wanted to get the cutting out the way. Can I join the club ? I must say it was surprisingly easy to do .
> CN name: martinhal
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 200 Hhz
> OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
> Temp drops: 13
> CPU-Z validation of max OC


Congrats!

I thought about it for months. Planned out my execution. Waited for some parts. Waited... stopped waiting and performed the deed. Extremely rewarding.









Liquid Pro TIM works great.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Congrats!
> I thought about it for months. Planned out my execution. Waited for some parts. Waited... stopped waiting and performed the deed. Extremely rewarding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Liquid Pro TIM works great.


Delidding is very rewarding.....actually makes me glad Intel did use TIM. This has been much more fun than SB, and I thought that was fun!

So ICD did well for you too, but do you think that CL PRO is the same, or better now that you have tried both?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> can i come with you? ill be youre backup, and only say things like,
> "yeah yeah, i saw it with my own 2 eyes"..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeppers!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no degradation for us caused by high temps ..lol
> and 4.7ghz with 1.320V vcore daily oc aint that bad, think i could even run it 4.8ghz with 1.420V vcore long time,
> but theres to many conflicting opinions out there, and no real data yet about degradation,
> ivy is more resilliant then sandy, "they say" ..
> not on air you dont ...lol, what would you need, at least 1.9V vcore?


LOL, feel free to sign up on EVGA forums, I'll let you know if such a thread ever gets started








trying to get a hold of a few fellow members, but that EVGA Z77 section is pretty much dead nowadays ... most of folks I know who owned Z77 FTW migrated to ASUS ROG LOL! only a few left, but those are "loyalists"







.. however even them are not posting anything anymore ... silence before the storm? ... or rather that section is currently within the eye of a hurricane







... time will tell ...









hey, I'm running that 5GHz daily with 1.56V vcore and it holds so far after 3 days, re-tested stability today (ambient temps dropped) and it looks good, no WHEA coming back so far, wondering for how long haha ...

Tonight I might try booting up to 5.3GHz without my super secret AC/CAI cooling "mod", just to see if I can, won't stress test it though ... only for kicks, and CPU-Z validation ... and maybe SuperPI run if possible


----------



## ivanlabrie

He already reported LP is better than ICD.









EDIT: So late! xD

Tomorrow I'll phone the Gigabyte rma guy to see how my board is doing...so wish me luck!


----------



## feniks

5.3GHz


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Delidding is very rewarding.....actually makes me glad Intel did use TIM. This has been much more fun than SB, and I thought that was fun!
> So ICD did well for you too, but do you think that CL PRO is the same, or better now that you have tried both?


I had much better results with CL Pro.
With IC Diamond 24 average temp of each core was 73C under IBT load. With Liquid Pro average temp of each core is at 61C!! under IBT load. [email protected]

Post about the comparison here: http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2752833&postcount=160


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I had much better results with CL Pro.
> With IC Diamond 24 average temp of each core was 73C under IBT load. With Liquid Pro average temp of each core is at 61C!! under IBT load.
> Post about the comparison here: http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2752833&postcount=160


That's right. I have seen your post on the improvement before. So may posts I forgot!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 5.3GHz


Holy voltage! You made it to 5.3!









I'm thinking it would take something like that for me to make it too. I think I was at 1.66v when I got my chip to 5.3, but it did not hold long enough for a validation.....


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Holy voltage! You made it to 5.3!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm thinking it would take something like that for me to make it too. I think I was at 1.66v when I got my chip to 5.3, but it did not hold long enough for a validation.....


LOL! my chip seems worse than yours at higher clocks, it won't boot windows with this voltage (BSOD upon logon), so I use a trick with the MB software to alter multiplier and voltage while sitting in windows with Firefox opened ... gives me enough time to save validation ha ha! try it this way









my chip needed something around 1.73V to even boot successfully to win7 with 5.2GHz (52x multi) and 4 sticks of ram running 2200MHz









trying to hit 5.4GHz, but it's a no go, it crashes before validation and I'm already at 1.825V ... trying to see what I can get with multi 53x and BCLK, but so far no luck either ... maybe +50MHz would work ... and that would be it ... crappy chip it is ... at least now after it was used on (in)famous Z77 FTW ...


----------



## feniks

OK, that's the highest I can do without going past 1.825V vcore ... 5.39GHz


----------



## Firelance

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys what should someone charge another to delid their chip........


I'll drive to ND and give ya $15


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> OK, that's the highest I can do without going past 1.825V vcore ... 5.39GHz


Great job pushing that chip, but 1.825v is scary! Probably giving *Valgaur* some bad ideas.....

You got a fluke validation at 1.246v though, so I guess your are doing fine....







Probably was dying at the moment of validation or something....


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great job pushing that chip, but 1.825v is scary! Probably giving *Valgaur* some bad ideas.....
> You got a fluke validation at 1.246v though, so I guess your are doing fine....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Probably was dying at the moment of validation or something....


yeah, it is scary, I'm shaking







... sending it to RMA anyways on Monday








validation was rejected at first then went through, but in deed the vcore reported was bad.

here's the max valid I could achieve up to 1.85V vcore no matter what settings I chose, be it 101.6 BCLK x 53 multi or 100.0 BCLK x 54 multi, always resulting in same clock of 5.384GHz:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, it is scary, I'm shaking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... sending it to RMA anyways on Monday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> validation was rejected at first then went through, but in deed the vcore reported was bad.
> here's the max valid I could achieve up to 1.85V vcore no matter what settings I chose, be it 101.6 BCLK x 53 multi or 100.0 BCLK x 54 multi, always resulting in same clock of 5.384GHz:


Accepted and Updated!









I pushed way past that vcore 2 days ago actually........







I went to 1.9 vcore......Little Franky loved it.......for some apparent reason lol! I need some Ln2....Little Franky doesn degrade....at freaking all, kinda scares me lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted and Updated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I pushed way past that vcore 2 days ago actually........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went to 1.9 vcore......Little Franky loved it.......for some apparent reason lol! I need some Ln2....Little Franky doesn degrade....at freaking all, kinda scares me lol


thanks and LOL! bro, your chip scares me too ... what is it made of LOL! it's a monster!!







... let me get a replacement for mine and see what I can push it at


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted and Updated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I pushed way past that vcore 2 days ago actually........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went to 1.9 vcore......Little Franky loved it.......for some apparent reason lol! I need some Ln2....Little Franky doesn degrade....at freaking all, kinda scares me lol


Pfft dude u do not need LN2 your H100 can pull off - 19c temps! http://www.overclock3d.net/articles/cases_cooling/ultimate_h100_cooling_mod/1

I been over on Overclock3D talking to Tom Logan Nice guy..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Pfft dude u do not need LN2 your H100 can pull off - 19c temps! http://www.overclock3d.net/articles/cases_cooling/ultimate_h100_cooling_mod/1
> I been over on Overclock3D talking to Tom Logan Nice guy..


LOL! you mean that guy using 40 fans or something like that for H100?







... lots of money for fans that is ...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL! you mean that guy using 40 fans or something like that for H100?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... lots of money for fans that is ...


Yeah i been talking to him about 8350 vs i5 3570k To get real info instead of hyped crap.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> thanks and LOL! bro, your chip scares me too ... what is it made of LOL! it's a monster!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... let me get a replacement for mine and see what I can push it at


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Pfft dude u do not need LN2 your H100 can pull off - 19c temps! http://www.overclock3d.net/articles/cases_cooling/ultimate_h100_cooling_mod/1
> I been over on Overclock3D talking to Tom Logan Nice guy..


LOL that video was funny. What temps does the liwuid in the H100 freeze???


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> LOL that video was funny. What temps does the liwuid in the H100 freeze???


I donno he was - 19 c and it did not freeze lol.


----------



## VonDutch

how bout this for a casemod ...LOL


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> LOL that video was funny. What temps does the liwuid in the H100 freeze???


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno he was - 19 c and it did not freeze lol.


You guys do know it was a joke - right?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> how bout this for a casemod ...LOL


Now that what I'm talking about!!!! Valgaur needs one of those for Franky!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I finally did it to my 3770K. Have been thinking about it for a few weeks. I got home told myself don't think about it, don't talk about it just do it&#8230;. Half an hour later done. I have lost 13 degrees on all cores running prime 95 @ 4.9 GHz Using AS5. Will try other TIM later, just wanted to get the cutting out the way. Can I join the club ? I must say it was surprisingly easy to do .
> CN name: martinhal
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 200 Hhz
> OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
> Temp drops: 13
> CPU-Z validation of max OC
> Sorry about the poor picture quality
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Gratz, and welcome


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *You guys do know it was a joke* - right?


Lies!!! this is the best mod ever!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Now that what I'm talking about!!!! Valgaur needs one of those for Franky!!!


yea, i tried to find a cpu frozen in a ice cube for him ...lol
did find this site tho, maybe useful,
http://www.squidoo.com/sub-zero-cool-your-computer


----------



## Valgaur

That video of 40 fan h100 is fake!?









I want to get some dry ice and see what i could do....but I'm curious what temps the liquid in the h100's freeze at.


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Just placed my order


Mine took about 2 weeks to arrive from Europe (to South Africa).

Still pondering the deed ;p

My CPU wont go stable @ 5Ghz even at 1.5V.

Instant BSOD when starting Prime blend.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That video of 40 fan h100 is fake!?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to get some dry ice and see what i could do....but I'm curious what temps the liquid in the h100's freeze at.


Here is the actual spec

Storage Temp: -20 to 70 C
Ambient Operating Temp: 5 to 50 C (In chassis)

so, im guessing when it goes under -20C ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Mine took about 2 weeks to arrive from Europe (to South Africa).
> Still pondering the deed ;p
> My CPU wont go stable @ 5Ghz even at 1.5V.
> Instant BSOD when starting Prime blend.


yea, voltages really go up with 4.9ghz and higher,
i needed 1.420V vcore for 4.8ghz prime stable, but needed about 1.5V to get 4.9ghz stable.,
no way i can get 5.0ghz prime stable within voltage specs etc..
did some testing with 5.0 tho, but thats different then 12/18/24H prime stable...lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Here is the actual spec
> Storage Temp: -20 to 70 C
> Ambient Operating Temp: 5 to 50 C (In chassis)
> so, im guessing when it goes under -20C ?


I'm guessing lol I want to put it over a box of dry ice and let the cold air flow through from the fans.


----------



## shremi

What do you think is it dead ??????


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> What do you think is it dead ??????
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


only one way to find out really,
you have to try








scratching the pcb a bit, wont always mean its dead..
the one in the upper corner looks worse,
not sure if anyone tried it yet, but a drip of nail polish to fill up might help ?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> What do you think is it dead ??????


That thing isn't dead from what I can see. You probably hit the die a bit. The scratch on the top wouldn't do anything because that part of the CPU isn't an important part. It's basically empty.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> What do you think is it dead ??????


The bottom is black gunk from the glue that will come off the top looks like a lane was cut but look at the first page I made in this thread it shows an even worse case and that chips is still running. go read that first. As for myself I eould put some black automotive glue over it (just the gold spot so use the smallest amount you can and put your IHS back on and try it and see if it posts if so then it runs fine.









Good Luck sir we are hoping and waiting for good news!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> What do you think is it dead ??????


Bottom 100% no

Top one Maybe id say no it is pretty tiny.. ive seen alot worse.

Kinda looks like you tried to enter the glue with the Blade not Flat.

If dead here is your warranty back..


----------



## shremi

Thanks for the quick answers I really tried my best .....

Since this is a chip that I purchased just in case I screwed up I can't test it right now because I need to take apart my loop ...

I'll try it out this weekend and see if it posts...

Btw the die is intact is just a reflection


----------



## Swag

Glad my black adhesive tip is causing people exploit Intel.







Give them dead chips because they messed with us!







They should know how anal we get with temps.


----------



## SonDa5

Just got done tweaking my delidded 3570k *NO IHS* mount.

I added Fujipoly Extreme .5 mm in thickness around the die.










DT SNIPER nice and snug.










Added some lock washers to my bolts on the fron side of the mother board to keep my DT SNIPEr mount bolts nice and firm when I put it back in the case. Also I am using a EK S115X TRUE back plate which works out great for this mount.










Still haven't booted. Once I get my loop back together I will see if it boots. I tried the Fujiploy Extreme last week with 1 mm thickness and the CPU would not post. So hopefully .5mm thickness on the sides will work out better.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno he was - 19 c and it did not freeze lol.


That IS fake, but check ocn, a guy put his h80 rad in ice water. Works good!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That video of 40 fan h100 is fake!?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to get some dry ice and see what i could do....but I'm curious what temps the liquid in the h100's freeze at.


Dry ice will go -78c and freeze it. Cold air won't help really...submerge rad in salty ice water.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Just got done tweaking my delidded 3570k *NO IHS* mount.
> I added Fujipoly Extreme .5 mm in thickness around the die.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DT SNIPER nice and snug.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Added some lock washers to my bolts on the fron side of the mother board to keep my DT SNIPEr mount bolts nice and firm when I put it back in the case. Also I am using a EK S115X TRUE back plate which works out great for this mount.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still haven't booted. Once I get my loop back together I will see if it boots. I tried the Fujiploy Extreme last week with 1 mm thickness and the CPU would not post. So hopefully .5mm thickness on the sides will work out better.


Lookin good! You plan on being the coolest guy around? Good luck


----------



## munaim1

*Club made official. Keep up the good work Valgaur and everyone else participating in this thread.*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *munaim1*
> 
> *Club made official. Keep up the good work Valgaur and everyone else participating in this thread.*


Yes finally! Took a while to read I bet!


----------



## Lobsterman

Just ordered my new HSF, the Phanteks PH-TC14PE in red, I wanted the blue but its almost £30 more expensive!!! ah well looks like a got a good deal on the red as its at the lowest price its ever been at £57. Can't wait to receive it and get meesin with some real clocks on this lid-flippin cpu!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *munaim1*
> 
> *Club made official. Keep up the good work Valgaur and everyone else participating in this thread.*


Awesome! thanks..


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: remember to use these tags for low bandwidth ppl
> 
> 
> 
> Just got done tweaking my delidded 3570k *NO IHS* mount.
> I added Fujipoly Extreme .5 mm in thickness around the die.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DT SNIPER nice and snug.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Added some lock washers to my bolts on the fron side of the mother board to keep my DT SNIPEr mount bolts nice and firm when I put it back in the case. Also I am using a EK S115X TRUE back plate which works out great for this mount.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still haven't booted. Once I get my loop back together I will see if it boots. I tried the Fujiploy Extreme last week with 1 mm thickness and the CPU would not post. So hopefully .5mm thickness on the sides will work out better.


looks nice.

btw a question for you all.









I have an extra i5-2500k which I'm going to reuse for a side mini-pc-portable-gaming type build.







Now, I've been thinking of changing it up for a i5-3570k after selling the 2500k for ~150 (maybe a bit cheap but oh well). I really need to stop dwelling on this kuz the longer I think about it the more I think I should grab another motherbaord for cheap and a i5-3570k and just make two of these... ivy and sandy pair

only reason I'm asking here kuz if I get the 3570 i'd delid it in a heartbeat


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *munaim1*
> 
> *Club made official. Keep up the good work Valgaur and everyone else participating in this thread.*


Very cool *munaim1*! Thanks! We are now officially official!









...we are the coolest delidding club on OCN.....


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *munaim1*
> 
> *Club made official. Keep up the good work Valgaur and everyone else participating in this thread.*


nice!


----------



## chronicfx

That IS fake, but check ocn, a guy put his h80 rad in ice water. Works good!

It's not cool until he tries putting his rad in ice water with push/pull fans on it!


----------



## Hokies83

Is This you Valguar?? room got so hot from 1.8v 3770k you had to go cool off.. and tell the world off..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> That IS fake, but check ocn, a guy put his h80 rad in ice water. Works good!
> It's not cool until he tries putting his rad in ice water with push/pull fans on it!


Wouldn't that short out the fans?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Is This you Valguar?? room got so hot from 1.8v 3770k you had to go cool off.. and tell the world off..


..............Maybe......no I'm not from Germany lol........my arse!


----------



## chronicfx

Yes it would short out the fans. I was just kidding around.

But what a sick setup that would be having waterproof push/pull fans on a rad in a 10 gallon fishtank of ice water.

But on a serious note, congrats on the official club and also when do you think you will be trying to de-lid using fishing line. I really do like that idea and feel it could work. With less chance of slicing up your pcb or die.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yes it would short out the fans. I was just kidding around.
> But what a sick setup that would be having waterproof push/pull fans on a rad in a 10 gallon fishtank of ice water.
> But on a serious note, congrats on the official club and also when do you think you will be trying to de-lid using fishing line. I really do like that idea and feel it could work. With less chance of slicing up your pcb or die.


Use a Fishtank of Baby Oil.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yes it would short out the fans. I was just kidding around.
> But what a sick setup that would be having waterproof push/pull fans on a rad in a 10 gallon fishtank of ice water.
> But on a serious note, congrats on the official club and also when do you think you will be trying to de-lid using fishing line. I really do like that idea and feel it could work. With less chance of slicing up your pcb or die.


it will most likely be next week gotta wait for the clients paycheck to ship it and then once it's here im going to try it....but im wondering what poundage of fishing line to use.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol

That german dude...OUCH! xD

Valgaur we're official man, you made it!







Now freeze that h100 man!!!


----------



## kgtuning

lapped the IHS ...

before temps... at 77 degrees F ambient.


after temps... same room temp...


3 degrees celcuis difference from highest to highest.


----------



## feniks

LOL @ the guy from Germany trying to jump into a frozen pool, LMAO!!! funny


----------



## shremi

So my friend is going to let me try my chip on his motherboard .... so i wont have to take a part my loop









So i am just basically looking for a post right ???? If it posts will it be safe or do you recommend me to stress test it for a while ????

he just got all of his parts so his computer isn't up and running yet


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> So my friend is going to let me try my chip on his motherboard .... so i wont have to take a part my loop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So i am just basically looking for a post right ???? If it posts will it be safe or do you recommend me to stress test it for a while ????
> he just got all of his parts so his computer isn't up and running yet


If it posts it is fine..

However some reported it took afew installs to get it to post so if it does not the first time keep trying.


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> lapped the IHS ...


Sick voltage and temps.









Got some nice thin blades today, itching to do the deed tomorrow.


----------



## chronicfx

Try 100lb test. It's not gonna be easy to pull fishing line through the glue. Thats why I suggested using the bars to pull on. I think you will find that the fishing line may start hurting hand before you pull it through the glue, but give it a try.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, a minute of silence for my dead z77x-ud5h-wb.
...
Now to get a cheap z77 board.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, a minute of silence for my dead z77x-ud5h-wb.
> ...
> Now to get a cheap z77 board.


ouch, sorry to hear that. what happened to it?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> lapped the IHS ...
> 
> 3 degrees celcuis difference.


Nice little tweak.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Nice little tweak.


yeah not bad. figured it was only going to be like 1c lol but pleasantly surprised with 3c. I have a few other little things I'll get to next week that should help out.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> So my friend is going to let me try my chip on his motherboard .... so i wont have to take a part my loop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So i am just basically looking for a post right ???? If it posts will it be safe or do you recommend me to stress test it for a while ????
> he just got all of his parts so his computer isn't up and running yet


I would just make sure that it posts. If you can get into the BIOS and it operates normally I think you are good to go.

When I did mine the first time it posted fine with IC Diamond but when I switched to Liquid Pro I did 5 mounts before I got a good mount. I had an error 55 on my mb LED which means the cpu wasn't sitting properly in socket. My mount is more tricky than most because I am using direct DIE mount with *NO IHS*.

My advice on the loop is to make tubing run with slack on CPU block so that the block can be removed with the tubing connected. This will allow you to tweak your mount and redo TIM if necessary without breaking down the loop.

My Water block set up with slack on tubing to remove without breaking down the loop.


----------



## kgtuning

Just realized if I average out the core temps it isnt 3 c difference... its 11 c. how interesting.

before.. 71 79 79 73= 302
after.. 68 75 76 72=291
averaged difference=11 degrees celsius.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ouch, sorry to hear that. what happened to it?


Dead socket...I'll have to get an OC Formula, IF they cover me warranty wise, despite buying from abroad.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just realized if I average out the core temps it isnt 3 c difference... its 11 c. how interesting.
> before.. 71 79 79 73= 302
> after.. 68 75 76 72=291
> averaged difference=11 degrees celsius.


Did you change your TIM?

Amazing results for just lapping the IHS. May be that you didn't have a very good mount before.

Good job.


----------



## kgtuning




----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just realized if I average out the core temps it isnt 3 c difference... its 11 c. how interesting.
> before.. 71 79 79 73= 302
> after.. 68 75 76 72=291
> averaged difference=11 degrees celsius.


don't want to be anal LOL, but my math disagrees ... it's nowhere near 11C improvement, because you forgot to divide by 4 LOL!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Dead socket...I'll have to get an OC Formula, IF they cover me warranty wise, despite buying from abroad.


dang, dead socket sounds bad enough, hopefully the CPU survived it?
Asus Maximus V Formula sounds like a good deal nowadays or Asus V Gene if you don't mind smaller form factor and just 2 PCIe slots, all of them carry quite impressive BIOS.
if you need something real cheap then maybe give Asrock a shot?


----------



## kgtuning

rofl.... thats what I get for doing too many things at once.... you are correct Feniks.


----------



## Hokies83

Valguar Reaches 5.5ghz!! Video below!

And his system rewards him with a 4th of July fireworks show!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> don't want to be anal LOL, but my math disagrees ... it's nowhere near 11C improvement, because you forgot to divide by 4 LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dang, dead socket sounds bad enough, hopefully the CPU survived it?
> Asus Maximus V Formula sounds like a good deal nowadays or Asus V Gene if you don't mind smaller form factor and just 2 PCIe slots, all of them carry quite impressive BIOS.
> if you need something real cheap then maybe give Asrock a shot?


I like the MVG a lot, but I'm afraid to risk it with their crappy RMA dept...They're a-holes, a friend had a bad mobo and they charged him just to SEE the board, and they didn't assure they COULD repair the board or replace it for free. He had to buy a new one. And it wasn't user error to begin with.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valguar Reaches 5.5ghz!! Video below!


I lol'd, that brought a smile to my face, thanks man xD


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> rofl.... thats what I get for doing too many things at once.... you are correct Feniks.


LOL, I know the feeling








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valguar Reaches 5.5ghz!! Video below!
> And his system rewards him with a 4th of July fireworks show!


LMAO!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valguar Reaches 5.5ghz!! Video below!
> And his system rewards him with a 4th of July fireworks show!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


*me* Its okay Franky. They are just jealous.....

*Franky* I'll show 'em!!!

*Me*.......

*Franky* bzzzztztztztztztzt......nevermind bro.......can't do 5.5 Ghz......vcore kinda tickled though!

*me*


----------



## neopunx

Custom PC has a "How to..." Guide on delidding the IB in the December issue. I foresee this thread EXPLODING with new additions on the next 40 day. Merry Xmass Delid Crew!

Edit: Holy Crap, almost 170 pages we've consumed in three weeks. Wowza.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just realized if I average out the core temps it isnt 3 c difference... its 11 c. how interesting.
> before.. 71 79 79 73= 302
> after.. 68 75 76 72=291
> averaged difference=11 degrees celsius.


divide by four....


----------



## feniks

... quick update on my part.

so far my daily 5.0GHz @ 1.56V vcore seems to be holding up very well!








I tried hitting on 5.4GHz validation again, this time with 1.90V vcore, but it was a no go still, I believe my chip refuses to run faster than 5.38GHz and that is it.

as per Intel RMA (under tuning protection plan), it will have to wait until Wednesday probably ... I have just learned today that US Mid-Atlantic and North-East regions have some warnings about a nasty hurricane coming in in a few days (Monday/Tuesday) ... the funniest part is that the hurricane was named ... "Sandy" LOL! it's hilarious to me ... Sandy Bridge now sending wraths and natural disasters on me? LOL!







... I thought I was past Sandy already!









... can't wait the "Ivy" hurricane


----------



## PCWargamer

All, I have *posted the last couple of weeks of benches on the IVY Stable thread* for you to look over and make sure I have included yours.....

Please redo the ones that were missing your OCN name in the screensave and/or CPU-Z OC or vcore proof!

And feel free to post some more benches there! We have the most kick-ass cool delided chips around and we ought to own the top spots on the benching spreadsheet on that thread!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> *me* Its okay Franky. They are just jealous.....
> *Franky* I'll show 'em!!!
> *Me*.......
> *Franky* bzzzztztztztztztzt......nevermind bro.......can't do 5.5 Ghz......vcore kinda tickled though!
> *me*


Nevermind...

Little Franky's at it again boys and girls!!!

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nevermind...
> Little Franky's at it again boys and girls!!!
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


----------



## Master__Shake




----------



## Valgaur

Lol at least people love me here lol....ugh its hard to move my fingers lol that's how cold I am!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lol at least people love me here lol....ugh its hard to move my fingers lol that's how cold I am!


grats, on 5.5GHz







what's your ambient room temp at?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> grats, on 5.5GHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what's your ambient room temp at?


0C lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 0C lol


Valguar threw the fridge out cause he was like.. Hmm i can OC + keep food fresh by opening window..

Hmmm i can get heated blanket and it is pure win...

Then Valguar and his roomie invites there ladies over and Party !!!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 0C lol


LOL! hehe, don't get sick man ha ha! nice ambient for benchmarking, loving the temp level you have








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valguar threw the fridge out cause he was like.. Hmm i can OC + keep food fresh by opening window..
> Hmmm i can get heated blanket and it is pure win...
> Then Valguar and his roomie invites there ladies over and Party !!!


LOL!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nevermind...
> Little Franky's at it again boys and girls!!!
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


Yeah man! That's the way it is done! Just think what you and Franky will be able to do when you get some dice or LN2!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valguar threw the fridge out cause he was like.. Hmm i can OC + keep food fresh by opening window..
> Hmmm i can get heated blanket and it is pure win...
> Then Valguar and his roomie invites there ladies over and Party !!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


It's my possy!!! (people that follow you) ((dont think i misstyped at all you people!!!))


----------



## martinhal

Could I use Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on the die ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Could I use Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on the die ?


No that only has 8.3 w/mK. You want that to be as high as possible.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Could I use Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on the die ?


Cool Labs Liquid Metal pro is 100k w/mK to compare.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Could I use Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on the die ?


You could, but I wouldn't if I were you. Use CL PRO or CL Ultra for best results.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Could I use Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on the die ?


Remember this IS your CPU's die the physical processor. you want the best stuff on this thing to make the best thermal dissipation possible!


----------



## shremi

Guys !!!!!!

Its Aliveeeeeee the chip posted fine i thought it was dead.... now the fun begins


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Guys !!!!!!
> Its Aliveeeeeee the chip posted fine i thought it was dead.... now the fun begins


Good news man , gratz!


----------



## VonDutch

5.5ghz on air, thanks to the cold last nite ..lol

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558354


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 5.5ghz on air, thanks to the cold last nite ..lol
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558354


you too? I'm jealous ...







grats!








.. damn, my room ambient is at nearly 28C at night with windows opened (uncontrollable heating in this stupid building) ...


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Guys !!!!!!
> Its Aliveeeeeee the chip posted fine i thought it was dead.... now the fun begins


Congrats! Feels great coming back to life after being delidded!









Get your Liquid Pro ready!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Guys !!!!!!
> Its Aliveeeeeee the chip posted fine i thought it was dead.... now the fun begins



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 5.5ghz on air, thanks to the cold last nite ..lol
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558354



NICE!!! Thanks what we do! lol







*High Five*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> you too? I'm jealous ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> grats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .. damn, my room ambient is at nearly 28C at night with windows opened (uncontrollable heating in this stupid building) ...


Yeah my lows were are like 4-8C area lol


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Congrats! Feels great coming back to life after being delidded!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Get your Liquid Pro ready!!!


Yeah now I can try it on my good chip .... But I guess I'll mess around with this one and give you guys the results with liquid ultra

One thing I noticed is that the ihs moved a bit down when I was testing the chip did anyone noticed this ??? I only applied some crappy tim to see if it posted maybe the liquid ultra will provide a better grip with the ihs


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> One thing I noticed is that the ihs moved a bit down when I was testing the chip did anyone noticed this ??? I only applied some crappy tim to see if it posted maybe the liquid ultra will provide a better grip with the ihs


no, it will do the same, you have to keep that in mind the next time,
and put the ihs a bit more to the back, and let the bracket "slide"
it into right spot ..
(if i understand right what you where saying with "moved a bit down")


----------



## Lobsterman

Wow, 5.5 with a H100, u live in a Igloo?

I guess 5ghz shud be easy when then my Phanteks PH-TC14PE arrives, was -5 here last night outside.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Guys !!!!!!
> Its Aliveeeeeee the chip posted fine i thought it was dead.... now the fun begins


Yesss! Great job *shremi*! We can all relate to that feeling after we delid and try firing-up the system for the first time wondering what will happen and if it will even POST!

Feels great when it does - and even better once you start to check on your temps....

....and if you mean by down the IHS sliding when you clamp it in, then you need to hold it in place or place it back a little so that it slides into the correct place upon clamping. If by down you mean lower, then that is the great thing about delidding, as the IHS is now lower and fully in contact with the die with no more gap to hinder temp flow out to the HSF.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Wow, 5.5 with a H100, u live in a Igloo?
> I guess 5ghz shud be easy when then my Phanteks PH-TC14PE arrives, was -5 here last night outside.


did my 5.5ghz with my Scythe Mugen 2 Rev. B ..lol

i love that new phantek cooler, almost tempted to buy it,
about time for a new cooler that can go up against the Noctua NH-D14
cost a bit to much for me tho, about 80/85 euro where i live,
i paid about 35 euro for my Scythe Mugen..


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 5.5ghz on air, thanks to the cold last nite ..lol
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558354


Wow. First *Valgaur* - and now you at 5.5GHz! You two keep pushing up the bar around here! Wish my chip could keep up with the fun!

And *Valgaur*, *VonDutch* has managed to top you once again by a wide margin! What are you and Franky going to do???


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Wow. First *Valgaur* - and now you at 5.5GHz! You two keep pushing up the bar around here! Wish my chip could keep up with the fun!
> And *Valgaur*, *VonDutch* *has managed to top you once again* by a wide margin! What are you and Franky going to do???


Mean while at Valguar command...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good point with the whole 'ihs moving whenn I clamp down the bracket on the mobo'...If I had known how to deal with that my mobo would still live guys.
You should put some tips covering that issue in the front page, it could save some guy's socket or even pcb.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Mean while at Valguar command...


Good one *Hokies83*. That's what I am picturing happened when *Valguar* saw what *VonDutch* had done!!! LOL


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good point with the whole 'ihs moving whenn I clamp down the bracket on the mobo'...If I had known how to deal with that my mobo would still live guys.
> You should put some tips covering that issue in the front page, it could save some guy's socket or even pcb.


Sorry to hear that *ivanlabrie*. So you think it was the shifting of the IHS while it was being clamped down that damaged your MB?

*Valgaur*, I do think this would be a good hint/tip to add to the front page. And maybe we should create a small hint/tip section anyway for this info and more? We can ask the delid community on here to supply everyone with a few hints to share and help others who will come and want to try this too.

(You can think about this after you have a chance to get what *VonDutch* did out of your system....)


----------



## leppie

Tried to delid this morning, but the blade (really thin Stanley razor blade) seemed too thick.

Seems like mine has a real good join







Almost no gap to get it in.

Will probably need to get those thin shaving blades or a surgical blade.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Tried to delid this morning, but the blade (really thin Stanley razor blade) seemed too thick.
> Seems like mine has a real good join
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Almost no gap to get it in.
> Will probably need to get those thin shaving blades or a surgical blade.


Try the single-sided razor blades you can get from a hardware store. Then work on one corner (try all to see which) and go slow. Once you can work the blade into the first corner the rest is very easy. Its the first corner that is the toughest.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Tried to delid this morning, but the blade (really thin Stanley razor blade) seemed too thick.
> Seems like mine has a real good join
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Almost no gap to get it in.
> Will probably need to get those thin shaving blades or a surgical blade.


razor blade should do it tho,
but yea, to get it between pcb and ihs takes some effort,
for me was the hardest part,

i used this, think its even thicker then a razor blade,


just be careful and take your time


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> razor blade should do it tho,
> but yea, to get it between pcb and ihs takes some effort,
> for me was the hardest part,
> i used this, think its even thicker then a razor blade,
> 
> just be careful and take your time


I am glad that worked for you VonDutch, but when I used something similar to that I nicked my PCB and killed my 3770K! I will never use something like that again. And the razor blades do such a great job that nothing else is needed. IMHO


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I am glad that worked for you VonDutch, but when I used something similar to that I nicked my PCB and killed my 3770K! I will never use something like that again. And the razor blades do such a great job that nothing else is needed. IMHO


Where is that 3770k at now yo? you gonna pqatch it and try and rma or let me try an fixor it?


----------



## neopunx

So I have recently started folding since I am at work so much, and it is a shame to waste this computer. I can not for the life of me figure out how to set up my GPUs to fold as well. Any master class folders on here that can help me out one on one? I figure I would post here, since you guys are a bitt nutty like and in general are always willing to help me out.

P.S. Thanks VonDutch and Valgur, Now I HAVE to hit that 5.5 Not cool guys. Not Cool.


----------



## VonDutch

one tip after you done delidding and putting your processor back,
we noticed, that if you put down the bracket again, the IHS will slide a bit forward,

it will do so whatever tim you use,
except if you use a new/other adhesive/glue also

The trick is to start a bit more to the back when placing the IHS back, i think about 0.5- 1mm will do..
lower the load plate until it sits loosely on the top of the CPU package, check if its all good
Now lower it careful until you can snap it under
the stub holder on the side of the socket.
Lowering the lever takes a bit of force because you are compressing the load plate,
which in turn forces the CPU down tightly on the landing pins.

i held it with my finger in the middle if the IHS, but dont forget to clean it again
after youre done(fingerprints)









really, i tried to move it with a screwdriver afterwards, but could not move it,
so you have to get it right, before the lever is under the stub..

hope this is helpful


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I am glad that worked for you VonDutch, but when I used something similar to that I nicked my PCB and killed my 3770K! I will never use something like that again. And the razor blades do such a great job that nothing else is needed. IMHO


yea i know/understand PCWargamer,
lucky for us there enough different ways to de-lid in this thread,
of course, what works for me, or for you, doenst mean it will work for others..like usually..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Most important is to take your time and take a break if you hard starts to hurt .
And you get tired and get careless.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Most important is to take your time and take a break if you hand starts to hurt .
> And you get tired and get careless.


true that








being impatient and want to go to fast killed most chips till now i think, to much force is no good too..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> true that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> being impatient and want to go to fast killed most chips till now i think, to much force is no good too..


LoL i took like 3-4 breaks like after i gained access to each corner.. I was 100% fresh for each step of the process...


----------



## TSXmike

curious...

so i found another core2 to practice on (lot of them tossed away here at work).

both e6300.. both out of the same seires machines.

1 die was soldered on, 1 die wasnt.

was there a transition time when the went from soldering the spreader on to when they just started using TIM?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where is that 3770k at now yo? you gonna pqatch it and try and rma or let me try an fixor it?


I lapped the IHS for it and am using it now. I am considering possible ideas to fix it, but even if I don't fix it I am keeping it as a conversation-piece and a memory of what can go wrong if I don't take my time!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Most important is to take your time and take a break if you hard starts to hurt .
> And you get tired and get careless.


That is probably the most important thing to remember!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry to hear that *ivanlabrie*. So you think it was the shifting of the IHS while it was being clamped down that damaged your MB?
> *Valgaur*, I do think this would be a good hint/tip to add to the front page. And maybe we should create a small hint/tip section anyway for this info and more? We can ask the delid community on here to supply everyone with a few hints to share and help others who will come and want to try this too.
> (You can think about this after you have a chance to get what *VonDutch* did out of your system....)


Yeah, I'm 100% sure...when I tried booting some pins got shorted and desoldered some pads in the back of the socket, making it impossible to repair, so, yeah...I say it's something very Important to mention in the OP.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, I'm 100% sure...when I tried booting some pins got shorted and desoldered some pads in the back of the socket, making it impossible to repair, so, yeah...I say it's something very Important to mention in the OP.


Did you send it back to Gigabyte for repairs?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, I'm 100% sure...when I tried booting some pins got shorted and desoldered some pads in the back of the socket, making it impossible to repair, so, yeah...I say it's something very Important to mention in the OP.


Sorry to hear about your MB. Funny enough that was my no 2 concern about deliding ... bending the pins when putting the CPU back.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Did you send it back to Gigabyte for repairs?


Sure did, but they couldn't repair it despite replacing the socket two times...the contact pads were molten and desoldered, and they were almost impossible to repair.
I cann't repair them myself either, so listed it in fleabay as parts...30 bucks sttarting bid. I got some interestt already...so wish me luck!
My next board will be either an MVG or an OC formula.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sure did, but they couldn't repair it despite replacing the socket two times...the contact pads were molten and desoldered, and they were almost impossible to repair.
> I cann't repair them myself either, so listed it in fleabay as parts...30 bucks sttarting bid. I got some interestt already...so wish me luck!
> My next board will be either an MVG or an OC formula.


G1 Sniper 3 does same things as both those boards at is a heck of alot cheaper.


----------



## Valgaur

Check the OP guys I put VonDutches info int their as well. Its getting crowded in there lol I might clean it up later tonigh.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> G1 Sniper 3 does same things as both those boards at is a heck of alot cheaper.


I'm not so sure it does...I do like gb boards and their warranty policy, but I wanna try something else. Check hwbot, I haven't seen gb boards (z77 that is) doing as well as maximus v and oc frmulas...
Plus the price on the mvg is 199 and the oc formula goes for 239, though I'm a bit wary of the pwm circuitry, gotta fesearch more.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm not so sure it does...I do like gb boards and their warranty policy, but I wanna try something else. Check hwbot, I haven't seen gb boards (z77 that is) doing as well as maximus v and oc frmulas...
> Plus the price on the mvg is 199 and the oc formula goes for 239, though I'm a bit wary of the pwm circuitry, gotta fesearch more.


Have you considered the MSI Z77 MPower? Very good writeup in the recent theovercloker issue below:

http://issuu.com/theoverclocker/docs/theoverclocker_issue_21?mode=window&viewMode=doublePage

Another good review here:

http://www.pureoverclock.com/Review-detail/msi-z77-mpower/15/

Looks like it may be a good contender to me for around $199.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm not so sure it does...I do like gb boards and their warranty policy, but I wanna try something else. Check hwbot, I haven't seen gb boards (z77 that is) doing as well as maximus v and oc frmulas...
> Plus the price on the mvg is 199 and the oc formula goes for 239, though I'm a bit wary of the pwm circuitry, gotta fesearch more.


Onlything the Maximus V does is have more options for overclocking to extreme like with LN2.

The g1 Sniper has more gamer options. As far has phases and how well built the boards are there equal .
I donno about the prices there but a G1 Sniper 3 is 120$ cheaper then the Maximus v here.
Im best buds with the guy that Reviews them I know what is up with all the boards bro..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm not so sure it does...I do like gb boards and their warranty policy, but I wanna try something else. Check hwbot, I haven't seen gb boards (z77 that is) doing as well as maximus v and oc frmulas...
> Plus the price on the mvg is 199 and the oc formula goes for 239, though I'm a bit wary of the pwm circuitry, gotta research more.


Asus makes really good mobo's, no doubt,
but for less money, i can buy a gigabyte,
that performs not to bad compared to asus.

o, the world record OC with a 3770k, was done with a gigabyte mobo ..lol
(GIGABYTE breaks Core i7 3770K OC World Record at 7102MHz







)

but yea, if i have enough money for my next build, ill prolly buy me one








a de-lidded haswell, heavy overclocked, with a asus mobo ..yeah! haha..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Asus makes really good mobo's, no doubt,
> but for less money, i can buy a gigabyte,
> that performs not to bad compared to asus.
> o, the world record OC with a 3770k, was done with a gigabyte mobo ..lol
> (GIGABYTE breaks Core i7 3770K OC World Record at 7102MHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> but yea, if i have enough money for my next build, ill prolly buy me one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> a de-lidded haswell, heavy overclocked, with a asus mobo ..yeah! haha..


not anymore bro








the new world record belongs to ASUS ROG team and is 7184MHz








http://rog.asus.com/tag/world-record/
http://rog.asus.com/164362012/overclocking/7184-3mhz-rog-breaks-i7-3770k-frequency-world-record-more/

most boards (except evga z77 ftw) are more or less equal and reliable, gigabyte is agreat brand, but I went with asus rog simply because I needed to keep the same black&red color theme, my wires were already sleeved red and the choice of fans and case paint was already done









I am loving asus BIOS, really, that thing rocks ... well maybe except the latest update 1309 for MVE which doesn't work right for me hehe, but 704 is perfect here ... and I really enjoy the added benefits of stuff like BlueTooth and Wifi and 2 PLX bridges for up to quad-SLI if I ever wanted to use it this way







... well for now I run a single 670 LOL! and SLI is good on any board (even without PLX chip), but I hope I would be getting a third card somewhere next year for some fun ... that is if I don't go bankrupt before LOL.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> not anymore bro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the new world record belongs to ASUS ROG team and is 7182MHz


Pffft me and VonDutch will show them a thing or two!


----------



## Hokies83

SHHHHH!!

The Hokie is at work with HTPC..

Going to OC it to 4.2ghz and throw a gtx 560 ti i had in the closet into it.. And bench it VS a 8350 in gaming. I bet i wins by Land slide.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool, what case will you use Hokies?

Thanks for the input guys, I'm torn between the Maximus boards, oc formula and perhaps an up5 or g1 sniper 3...but I'd rather get the Asus board. I'll buy it from Newegg or wherever;s cheaper, like Microcenter, I can ask a friend to pick it up for me.
Sory for the typos but I'm using my tablet with a usb kb attached to it, and it doesn't work too well.

There's one thing I know, and that is I won't buy an Msi board, there's something I don't like about that brand...at all. I wouldn't feel good spending big bucks on an msi product







It's something irrational I know, but you can't choose who you like, be it boys or girls, or in this case Msi stuffs. XD

I WILL bench with my board, so I WANT THE ABSOLUTE BEST, and my max budget would be 300 shipped (shipping costs 50 bucks).


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool, what case will you use Hokies?
> Thanks for the input guys, I'm torn between the Maximus boards, oc formula and perhaps an up5 or g1 sniper 3...but I'd rather get the Asus board. I'll buy it from Newegg or wherever;s cheaper, like Microcenter, I can ask a friend to pick it up for me.
> Sory for the typos but I'm using my tablet with a usb kb attached to it, and it doesn't work too well.
> There's one thing I know, and that is I won't buy an Msi board, there's something I don't like about that brand...at all. I wouldn't feel good spending big bucks on an msi product
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's something irrational I know, but you can't choose who you like, be it boys or girls, or in this case Msi stuffs. XD
> I WILL bench with my board, so I WANT THE ABSOLUTE BEST, and my max budget would be 300 shipped (shipping costs 50 bucks).


Unless your Benching on Ln2 The Maximus V is no beter then the formula or the G1 Sniper.. G1 Sniper has more options even has an Onboard 150$ Audio card.. Sounds great i love it lol.

That case is a Silverstone Sugo02


----------



## ivanlabrie

Really nice! Love Silverstone cases...Such a shame I can't get any of those locally. My cm 690 II advanced is more than enough, but I'd like a mitx rig eventually xD

I'll scout for prices during this month and get the board mid November. I'll be using headphones, and I loved my ud5h's headphone amp, nice feature, so I'll look into that as well...Thanks again for the support.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Really nice! Love Silverstone cases...Such a shame I can't get any of those locally. My cm 690 II advanced is more than enough, but I'd like a mitx rig eventually xD
> I'll scout for prices during this month and get the board mid November. I'll be using headphones, and I loved my ud5h's headphone amp, nice feature, so I'll look into that as well...Thanks again for the support.


Cant wait to see what that chip can do baby!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Cant wait to see what that chip can do baby!!


Just booted it back up with the Antec 620 Avg Core temp is 25c...

Now overclocking an i5 750 Is not easy mode like Sb/IB i have to OC the the BLK to a multi ratio .


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just booted it back up with the Antec 620 Avg Core temp is 25c...
> Now overclocking an i5 750 Is not easy mode like Sb/IB i have to OC the the BLK to a multi ratio .


Ugh I hate doing all my crap for just my stuff...ugh bugs me man!

Tried to beat you Von!!!

Didnt do it lol got super super close with BCLK at 100.1 it did 5507.9 for a few secs then i click validate and was like....mmmmm...how bout NO









So I think we hit our wall's VonDutch!


----------



## andressergio

Well after all guys i have to tell you that i resisted to use liquid ultra cauz basically i though it was the same as using MX2 or MX4 or whatever tim
Today i couldnt belive my eyes really i even remounted CPU cauz i tought somthing was not ok

*ALL TESTS SAME AMBIENT TEMP*










this is the *BEFORE* with IHS removed and using MX2 at [email protected] 1.336 LOAD and 2800CL11 mem










this is the AFTER with IHS removed second time with liquid ultra at 4.8HT 1.360 LOAD and 2800CL11mem

*running...*










*passed...*










U can see the amazing drop on temps i just cant believe it but its true

*And here the process*

chip with MX2 inside and out










IHS removed it was already loose










ALL Cleaned ready to take the new liquid ultra



















Starting the job with liquid...










Finished







CPU glued with light UHU cement on 2 points only just to make easy the mount inside case without taking mobo appart










some more pics for fun



























hope you guys like and benchers go ahead use this its so amazing :yepp:

REAL WORLD aint this amazing ? :up:


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ugh I hate doing all my crap for just my stuff...ugh bugs me man!
> Tried to beat you Von!!!
> Didnt do it lol got super super close with BCLK at 100.1 it did 5507.9 for a few secs then i click validate and was like....mmmmm...how bout NO
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I think we hit our wall's VonDutch!


WUT?!! My little " HTPC That Could " is now faster then Any 8350 in any game besides BF3... lmao.. all 3 generations old of her.... 1400mhz OC so far shooting for 200mhz more..



Wheres the love fellas? it is like 100x Harder to get a Lynnfield to 4ghz then it is an IB to 4.7ghz lol

I mean i have no direct voltage control i had to do it with an Over voltage % IOH and cpu / vttt lol

This is on a P7P55-M Asus Mini Atx board really not made for extreme Overclocking...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool, what case will you use Hokies?
> Thanks for the input guys, I'm torn between the Maximus boards, oc formula and perhaps an up5 or g1 sniper 3...but I'd rather get the Asus board. I'll buy it from Newegg or wherever;s cheaper, like Microcenter, I can ask a friend to pick it up for me.
> Sory for the typos but I'm using my tablet with a usb kb attached to it, and it doesn't work too well.
> There's one thing I know, and that is I won't buy an Msi board, there's something I don't like about that brand...at all. I wouldn't feel good spending big bucks on an msi product
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's something irrational I know, but you can't choose who you like, be it boys or girls, or in this case Msi stuffs. XD
> I WILL bench with my board, so I WANT THE ABSOLUTE BEST, and my max budget would be 300 shipped (shipping costs 50 bucks).


Yeah, I go Asus MBs myself, just thought you'd like another option! Let us know once you get one and which one you choose! We are looking forward to some great OC freqs and some good bench scores to go with them!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> WUT?!! My little " HTPC That Could " is now faster then Any 8350 in any game besides BF3... lmao.. all 3 generations old of her.... 1400mhz OC so far shooting for 200mhz more..
> 
> Wheres the love fellas? it is like 100x Harder to get a Lynnfield to 4ghz then it is an IB to 4.7ghz lol
> I mean i have no direct voltage control i had to do it with an Over voltage % IOH and cpu / vttt lol
> This is on a P7P55-M Asus Mini Atx board really not made for extreme Overclocking...


I am so much happier OCing SB and IB chips.....good job though with that chip....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I am so much happier OCing SB and IB chips.....good job though with that chip....


LoL yeah but SB / IB were made noob OC friendly Lynnfield and bloomfield are not.

I got the powwa


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> WUT?!! My little " HTPC That Could " is now faster then Any 8350 in any game besides BF3... lmao.. all 3 generations old of her.... 1400mhz OC so far shooting for 200mhz more..
> 
> 
> Wheres the love fellas? it is like 100x Harder to get a Lynnfield to 4ghz then it is an IB to 4.7ghz lol
> I mean i have no direct voltage control i had to do it with an Over voltage % IOH and cpu / vttt lol
> This is on a P7P55-M Asus Mini Atx board really not made for extreme Overclocking...


Push it until the silicon pops!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Push it until the silicon pops!!!


see post above i got it to 4.2ghz which is like getting 5ghz on IB with out de lidding...

i can not blow it up lol htpc still worth like 500$ and my kid watches mickey mouse on it.. Just did this to show the amd ppl how bad there gaming performance is losing to a old i5 lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Only advantage the 8320 commands is price. If you do multithreaded work they're good forthe price and more of a challenge to oc.
Plus you can freeze those and go for world record cpu-z








Piledriver fx8350 oced to 4.5 is on par with a 2600k except for single thread obviously. They clock ram nicely too.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Only advantage the 8320 commands is price. If you do multithreaded work they're good forthe price and more of a challenge to oc.
> Plus you can freeze those and go for world record cpu-z
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Piledriver fx8350 oced to 4.5 is on par with a 2600k except for single thread obviously. They clock ram nicely too.


I donno ram is IB butter with 2800mhz kits..

My i5 750 +mb + ram cost me 140$ so that is ubber price for performance lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Been reported.






Don't quote Spam @[email protected]


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Don't quote Spam @[email protected]


Don't care I quoted it for you guys to know. Just in case you skipped it or something. Don't say that you wouldn't of because people do, including myself. It doesn't matter if you quote a spammer anyways. a quote is a quote nothing more nothing less.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Tried to beat you Von!!!
> Didnt do it lol got super super close with BCLK at 100.1 it did 5507.9 for a few secs then i click validate and was like....mmmmm...how bout NO
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I think we hit our wall's VonDutch!


All good Val.. i think were both champions ..lol









or is "daredevils" a better name for us haha..

5.5ghz + 7% = 5.885ghz for a sandy ...lol

dont think thats gonna happen with one of those on air ..no way


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *andressergio*
> 
> Well after all guys i have to tell you that i resisted to use liquid ultra cauz basically i though it was the same as using MX2 or MX4 or whatever tim
> Today i couldnt belive my eyes really i even remounted CPU cauz i tought somthing was not ok
> *ALL TESTS SAME AMBIENT TEMP*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
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> 
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> 
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> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Starting the job with liquid...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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> 
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> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> hope you guys like and benchers go ahead use this its so amazing :yepp:
> REAL WORLD aint this amazing ? :up:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I finely received my Liquid Pro, exactly how much Liquid Pro do I need to get good contact between the processor die and the IHS? Why is one of your pictures of temperatures only at 6% load?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I finely received my Liquid Pro, exactly how much Liquid Pro do I need to get good contact between the processor die and the IHS? Why is one of your pictures of temperatures only at 6% load?


I used half a grain of rice size on the die and about the same on the underside of the IHS.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used half a grain of rice size on the die and about the same on the underside of the IHS.


but you could prolly use less then that too, but doing die and underside ihs is good..

dont have a good cpu sample to show, but did some vidcards from my son and me yesterday,
even that little blob i thought was to much, i sucked some up again using the seringe..

you dont want to see it "flow" to thick on it, using little as possible

will not make it push it out to the sides, like this old tim


this looked pretty good, i just tried my vidcard, under load my temps dropped about 5-10C in cinebench

o, and if you look at the official vid from coollaboratory, its like hes painting it on,
i just tried circular motion to spread it, and it worked very well ..


----------



## ChaosAD

I just delidded my cpu. It was dead easy although i had the fear of destorying it







I used Liquid Pro on die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme between IHS and cpu block. I booted the pc just to see that my temps were ONLY 5C better than before while crunching at 4.42ghz @ 1.2v Max temp Before Delid 83-84-83-81 and After Delid 79-79-79-77. I dont know what i did wrong and only have such a low drop


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I just delidded my cpu. It was dead easy although i had the fear of destorying it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used Liquid Pro on die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme between IHS and cpu block. I booted the pc just to see that my temps were ONLY 5C better than before while crunching at 4.42ghz @ 1.2v Max temp Before Delid 83-84-83-81 and After Delid 79-79-79-77. I dont know what i did wrong and only have such a low drop


Did you try taking the lid off again and checking how well its contacting the die? If its not making good contact then you may need to add a tiny bit of cl pro.


----------



## neopunx

@ Chaos, Did you make sure to remove ALL the black adhesive from the PCB? If not, you might not be making good contact with pro. It's amazing TIM, but that crap they had on before was gooped on thick, and you might need to add another layer of CLP while it's fresh.

P.S. VonDutch and Valgaur, I had 5.5 last night, hit validate and it was rejected...then crashed. I'm coming for you guys...I'll see your 5.5 soon! So close!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, I settled with the Maximus V Gene, and I'll be getting it in less than a month :/

140 IS awesome value for your HTPC Hokies, you know it









I think the only challenge with SB/IB is binning for a golden chip, benching wise...you only need deep pockets and some bravery if you wanna bench on air (to delid)


----------



## neopunx

Are any of you on active Folding Teams? Any of you guys willing to help out the new guy?


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Did you try taking the lid off again and checking how well its contacting the die? If its not making good contact then you may need to add a tiny bit of cl pro.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> @ Chaos, Did you make sure to remove ALL the black adhesive from the PCB? If not, you might not be making good contact with pro. It's amazing TIM, but that crap they had on before was gooped on thick, and you might need to add another layer of CLP while it's fresh.


Thanx for your answers, so you think the only problem is this black intel thing not letting ihs sit tight on the die? i have to check again then...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Thanx for your answers, so you think the only problem is this black intel thing not letting ihs sit tight on the die? i have to check again then...


Yes, die to IHS contact seems to be the problem. At least it sounds it to me.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Are any of you on active Folding Teams? Any of you guys willing to help out the new guy?


PM me and ill help ya out!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yes, die to IHS contact seems to be the problem. At least it sounds it to me.


Yup I lost 12 C with using pk3 and I need to get rid of all of the black goop still I need to get sand paper today as well since my lp is finally here YES! Then ill posts my results of temp drops and such for each OC.....yet again lol another long time for temps woo....hoo lol









Must show INTEL what's up.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I just delidded my cpu. It was dead easy although i had the fear of destorying it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used Liquid Pro on die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme between IHS and cpu block. I booted the pc just to see that my temps were ONLY 5C better than before while crunching at 4.42ghz @ 1.2v Max temp Before Delid 83-84-83-81 and After Delid 79-79-79-77. I dont know what i did wrong and only have such a low drop


Put tim on thicker... You can put LP ontop of LP so do not worry about that.. just put another coat on top of it..


----------



## y2kcamaross

Alright installed the h100 and liquid pro on the ihs, [email protected] 4.9 and 1.386 volts, after an hour of prime small ffts max temp was 74 on 1 core, the other 3 were 70


----------



## y2kcamaross

I got rid of all the black goop on my ihs but hardly any on the pcb itself, I'm still noticing massive temp differences


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> Alright installed the h100 and liquid pro on the ihs, [email protected] 4.9 and 1.386 volts, after an hour of prime small ffts max temp was 74 on 1 core, the other 3 were 70


those temps 70-74C for 4.9ghz running prime are about right..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> I got rid of all the black goop on my ihs but hardly any on the pcb itself, I'm still noticing massive temp differences


massive differences, you mean the 4C diff you mentioned above?
theres always a bit difference between cores temp wise,
one reason could be what they call the "sleeping core",
i had 10-15C diff before delid, now its about 6-7C

not sure if you gonna take it off again to get rid of some more
adhesive on the pcb, if you do, and put it back together again,
take note of that black retangle

if you put down the lever, dont let the IHS slide to much on there,
because of the adhesive is mostly gone now, that thing there
is high as a mountain..lol best is to get it a bit more to the back..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Thanx for your answers, so you think the only problem is this black intel thing not letting ihs sit tight on the die? i have to check again then...


yea, i think it could be something the others mentioned,
and that black intel thing could be one of them too, read above ..lol

most of us see a temp drop of at least 15-20C,
the others see 20C+

you should have at least 15C difference.. right "crew" ?


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> Alright installed the h100 and liquid pro on the ihs, [email protected] 4.9 and 1.386 volts, after an hour of prime small ffts max temp was 74 on 1 core, the other 3 were 70
> 
> 
> 
> those temps 70-74C for 4.9ghz running prime are about right..
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> I got rid of all the black goop on my ihs but hardly any on the pcb itself, I'm still noticing massive temp differences
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> massive differences, you mean the 4C diff you mentioned above?
> theres always a bit difference between cores temp wise,
> one reason could be what they call the "sleeping core",
> i had 10-15C diff before delid, now its about 6-7C
> 
> not sure if you gonna take it off again to get rid of some more
> adhesive on the pcb, if you do, and put it back together again,
> take note of that black retangle
> 
> if you put down the lever, dont let the IHS slide to much on there,
> because of the adhesive is mostly gone now, that thing there
> is high as a mountain..lol best is to get it a bit more to the back..
Click to expand...

No,i meant massive temp differences before and after deliddig even while leaving some black adhesive on the pcb, before delidding I'd hit 100 [email protected] 4.8 and 1.33 v


----------



## kgtuning

For sure..... from highest temp before to the highest temp after delid for me was 24c but I average it out over all cores it was 22.25c.


----------



## D7my

guys do i have to remove that black glue on the IHS AND the PCB ?
i dont know how to get rid of it ,, i thought of using razor but ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Only advantage the 8320 commands is price. If you do multithreaded work they're good forthe price and more of a challenge to oc.
> Plus you can freeze those and go for world record cpu-z
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Piledriver fx8350 oced to 4.5 is on par with a 2600k except for single thread obviously. They clock ram nicely too.


the fx8350 is gonna be cheaper then the 2600k from the start,
i can prolly buy the fx8350 here under 200 euro,
the 2600k is still at 270 euro, the 2500k about 190 euro..cheapest i could find at this moment

only thing is, it the 8350 is using alot more watts, 200W at least normal use,
if you really gonna overclock it ..safe some money for the electric bill ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> No,i meant massive temp differences before and after deliddig even while leaving some black adhesive on the pcb, before delidding I'd hit 100 [email protected] 4.8 and 1.33 v


yea, i was to fast with answering..again,
english is not my native language, so (sometimes) i have to read things like 10x..lol srry








i know, i hit 105C with 4.5ghz, thats why i delidded, took weeks before i did it,
but knew for sure within 1 week of buying it ..lol


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D7my*
> 
> guys do i have to remove that black glue on the IHS AND the PCB ?
> i dont know how to get rid of it ,, i thought of using razor but ..


I used my finger nails and 91% isoproply alcohol on the PCB.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D7my*
> 
> guys do i have to remove that black glue on the IHS AND the PCB ?
> i dont know how to get rid of it ,, i thought of using razor but ..


i would say, at least get rid of it on the IHS, use fingernails or something else,
its not like , if you make a scratch in that eara, its gonna harm you temps or
something else..
could/would you try a install with the adhesive left on the pcb only?
im wondering about something after y2kcamaross's remark..

o, the normal situation after cleaning would be like my avatar,
the IHS can spin freely on the die


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used my finger nails and 91% isoproply alcohol on the PCB.


yeppers ...lol









ill shut it now, gonna read forums, everyone with questions are in good hands
with the crew ...haha


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *D7my*
> 
> guys do i have to remove that black glue on the IHS AND the PCB ?
> i dont know how to get rid of it ,, i thought of using razor but ..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i would say, at least get rid of it on the IHS, use fingernails or something else,
> its not like , if you make a scratch in that eara, its gonna harm you temps or
> something else..
> could/would you try a install with the adhesive left on the pcb only?
> im wondering about something after y2kcamaross's remark..
> 
> o, the normal situation after cleaning would be like my avatar,
> the IHS can spin freely on the die
Click to expand...

T
I did remove the higher parts of the adhesive on the pcb, just didn't bother getting rid of all of it, but my ihs when i put it back on was dang near touching the pcb so i think i did a good enough job


----------



## ChaosAD

I give up, i cant make it work







Opened cpu again, cleaned all remaining black thing, reapplied LP and temps suck bad. I really dont know what my problem is. Checked ihs and have exactly the die shape with LP, so i assume it sits perfectly. Temps didnt drop 1C.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I give up, i cant make it work
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Opened cpu again, cleaned all remaining black thing, reapplied LP and temps suck bad. I really dont know what my problem is. Checked ihs and have exactly the die shape with LP, so i assume it sits perfectly. Temps didnt drop 1C.


Maybe its the paste between the IHS and block? Other then that idk.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> T
> I did remove the higher parts of the adhesive on the pcb, just didn't bother getting rid of all of it, but my ihs when i put it back on was dang near touching the pcb so i think i did a good enough job


seems to work so ..the risk is always in hitting the pcb somehow,
if it makes no difference, temp wise,
the force from the bracket if prolly enough to make contact with the die,
pressing the leftover adhesive down..

if we can tell peeps to leave some on, its ok, and save some chips that way, great..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I give up, i cant make it work
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Opened cpu again, cleaned all remaining black thing, reapplied LP and temps suck bad. I really dont know what my problem is. Checked ihs and have exactly the die shape with LP, so i assume it sits perfectly. Temps didnt drop 1C.


just noticed, you use a XSPC Raystorm ?
man, you should see a great temp drop with that..
dont give up..
lets assume you got it right this time, the contact between die and ihs,
could it be the contact between the ihs and your cooler?


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just noticed, you use a XSPC Raystorm ?
> man, you should see a great temp drop with that..
> dont give up..
> lets assume you got it right this time, the contact between die and ihs,
> could it be the contact between the ihs and your cooler?


I am right there with you. i dont want t give up but i have no clue what to do ftom here. I fold right now at [email protected] (22C ambient) and my temps are 68-70C and the only thing i can think right now is to throw it to the wall. You have (damn cpu) a dedicated high end wc setup ffs


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used my finger nails and 91% isoproply alcohol on the PCB.


Yip thats the way to do it.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I am right there with you. i dont want t give up but i have no clue what to do ftom here. I fold right now at [email protected] (22C ambient) and my temps are 68-70C and the only thing i can think right now is to throw it to the wall. You have (damn cpu) a dedicated high end wc setup ffs


I would take a break from it and come back to it and try it again in a little while after you relaxed. you may see something after that you didn't see before.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used my finger nails and 91% isoproply alcohol on the PCB.


i didnt even touch it, but used my

worked for me ...LOL


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I am right there with you. i dont want t give up but i have no clue what to do from here. I fold right now at [email protected] (22C ambient) and my temps are 68-70C and the only thing i can think right now is to throw it to the wall. You have (damn cpu) a dedicated high end wc setup ffs


It would be more helpful with pictures, you must be doing something wrong with low volts for such a small overclock. Even if you were air cooling I'd expect better results! My ambient is a bit higher than yours (air cooling) and I'm at 4.5GHz with 1.28 Vcore and your temps are only a tiny bit lower than mine.


----------



## kgtuning

@ Von lmao


----------



## Systemlord

So what's the consensus with everyone on that pumping effect, did they ever say which TIM is causing it and if any users experience it with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro? I plan on delidding in the next couple of days and want to get as much info as possible before my attempted!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> So what's the consensus with everyone on that pumping effect, did they ever say which TIM is causing it and if any users experience it with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro? I plan on delidding in the next couple of days and want to get as much info as possible before my attempted!


Im using LP and have not had this issue. I do not see how a Pure metal tim can pump tho.


----------



## Valgaur

Sorry guys my phone doesn't like me doing multi quotes so here goes lol. Okay. For the guy with the xspc kit having heat issues please supply us pictures this is a great and easy way for us to diagnos this issues. I wanna bet that it is your IHS itself honestly. If it is really concave or anything it doesn't mater what you do to it unless you lap that baby down. Also in word to that with the black glue I just thought of a way to avoid using our nails and such to get the stuff off of the pcb. We could just lap the standing part of the IHS really really good and shave it down making the middle actually support all of the weight like it is in VonDutchs avatar. This would avoid the hassle and make better contact along with lapping the bottom and top of the IHS.

Okay for the "crew" lol I like that name idea the more I hear it what you guys think??

Ohh another idea for the xspc guy. What tim are you using on the IHS? That could be limmiting you as well. But I truly think its your IHS being the unnatural shape and such. Keep these questions coming! I shall answerz themz allz!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Raystorm guy: push your chip man!! What the...?
You'll never see big differences on a 4.3 1.15v oc! Trust me. It's like comparing heatsinks with low tdp cpu's, you need an i7 950 to see a difference.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I just delidded my cpu. It was dead easy although i had the fear of destorying it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used Liquid Pro on die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme between IHS and cpu block. I booted the pc just to see that my temps were ONLY 5C better than before while crunching *at 4.42ghz @ 1.2v Max temp Before Delid 83-84-83-81 and After Delid 79-79-79-77.* I dont know what i did wrong and only have such a low drop


maybe the problem was already there before you delidded, and we're looking wrong?
concave block? or ihs?
not sure what a raystorm would normally do with a 4.4ghz oc and that voltage,
crew/guys, you think the temps are bit high already before delid?

and ChaosAD, what program are you using to crunch?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> maybe the problem was already there before you delidded, and we're looking wrong?
> concave block? or ihs?
> not sure what a raystorm would normally do with a 4.4ghz oc and that voltage,
> crew/guys, you think the temps are bit high already before delid?
> and ChaosAD, what program are you using to crunch?


My temps were pretty close using those voltages.. like within 5 c.


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> It would be more helpful with pictures, you must be doing something wrong with low volts for such a small overclock. Even if you were air cooling I'd expect better results! My ambient is a bit higher than yours (air cooling) and I'm at 4.5GHz with 1.28 Vcore and your temps are only a tiny bit lower than mine.


I know that something is wrong, thats what i m trying to figure out. I can do easily [email protected] but temps are at high 90s.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Sorry guys my phone doesn't like me doing multi quotes so here goes lol. Okay. For the guy with the xspc kit having heat issues please supply us pictures this is a great and easy way for us to diagnos this issues. I wanna bet that it is your IHS itself honestly. If it is really concave or anything it doesn't mater what you do to it unless you lap that baby down. Ohh another idea for the xspc guy. What tim are you using on the IHS? That could be limmiting you as well. But I truly think its your IHS being the unnatural shape and such. Keep these questions coming! I shall answerz themz allz!


Just tell me what pics you need and you ll have them in no time. Thats nice, now i also have to lap the ihs







I have never done that before, but i also had not delidded a cpu till today, lol! I use LP for die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme for ihs-cpu block.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Raystorm guy: push your chip man!! What the...?
> You'll never see big differences on a 4.3 1.15v oc! Trust me. It's like comparing heatsinks with low tdp cpu's, you need an i7 950 to see a difference.


I also tried [email protected], temps drop from 105c to 97c
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> maybe the problem was already there before you delidded, and we're looking wrong?
> concave block? or ihs?
> not sure what a raystorm would normally do with a 4.4ghz oc and that voltage,
> crew/guys, you think the temps are bit high already before delid?
> and ChaosAD, what program are you using to crunch?


I would aslo like to see temps of a similar to mine pc, but thats no so easy to find. if anyone has some info feel free to help me








I run 4c/8t WCG for crunching!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> My temps were pretty close using those voltages.. like within 5 c.


Do you use a cpu only loop with a triple rad and a raystorm? Can you plz check the same speed with the same vcore if possible?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Thats nice, now i also have to lap the ihs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have never done that before, but i also had not delidded a cpu till today, lol! I use LP for die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme for ihs-cpu block.


i wrote something about lapping, (p)ages ago ..lol
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749
its on page 1 also..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i wrote something about lapping, (p)ages ago ..lol
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749
> its on page 1 also..


man, i love myself so much, i start quoting myself..hahaha..

double post, sorry


----------



## Hokies83

LoL somebody wants to trade a I Pad 3 for my HTPC...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Trade it and sell tthe ipad 3! PROFIT









Raystorm guy, wow, that's odd...sounds like a concave ihs or block.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Trade it and sell tthe ipad 3! PROFIT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Raystorm guy, wow, that's odd...sounds like a concave ihs or block.


HTPC is worth about the same as the i pad 3.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I know that something is wrong, thats what i m trying to figure out. I can do easily [email protected] but temps are at high 90s.
> Just tell me what pics you need and you ll have them in no time. Thats nice, now i also have to lap the ihs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have never done that before, but i also had not delidded a cpu till today, lol! I use LP for die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme for ihs-cpu block.
> I also tried [email protected], temps drop from 105c to 97c
> I would aslo like to see temps of a similar to mine pc, but thats no so easy to find. if anyone has some info feel free to help me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I run 4c/8t WCG for crunching!
> Do you use ta cpu only loop with a triple rad and a raystorm? Can you plz check the same speed with the same vcore if possible?


Okay take pictures of you WC loop I need to see what you are using for cooling. Your IHS die and your case with fans and such. Shoot even your WC loops pump will help even. You shouldn't get even close to those temps with that hardware man. I pump 1.3vcore in at 4.5 and im barely above 55C for 4 days folding and only using an H100.

Hey guys do you want a mirror finish on the IHS or not after lapping???


----------



## neopunx

I'm not sure it matters either way. I made mine mirror, but everywhere I read says it's not important, especially if you're using quality tim. But why wouldn't you? It looks so nice!


----------



## Hokies83

The goal is not mirror but perfectly Flat.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The goal is not mirror but perfectly Flat.


Highest I can find is 1000 grit


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I know that something is wrong, thats what i m trying to figure out. I can do easily [email protected] but temps are at high 90s.
> Just tell me what pics you need and you ll have them in no time. Thats nice, now i also have to lap the ihs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have never done that before, but i also had not delidded a cpu till today, lol! I use LP for die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme for ihs-cpu block.
> I also tried [email protected].3v, temps drop from 105c to 97c
> I would aslo like to see temps of a similar to mine pc, but thats no so easy to find. if anyone has some info feel free to help me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I run 4c/8t WCG for crunching!
> Do you use a cpu only loop with a triple rad and a raystorm? Can you plz check the same speed with the same vcore if possible?


I have a swiftech 360 radiator with a Dangerden M6 block but I can run 4.4ghz , hang on....


----------



## kgtuning

4.4 ghz at 1.176volts is 55c


----------



## kgtuning

4.6 @ 1.300 is 63c
oh and Im using IBT with HT ON with ALL these tests.


----------



## kgtuning

So the last few were just pluging in what ChaosAD wanted to see here is MY stablity numbers for
4.9 @ 1.305 is 67degrees celcuis


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> So the last few were just pluging in what ChaosAD wanted to see here is MY stablity numbers for
> 4.9 @ 1.305 is 67degrees celcuis


Dude....OC the poop out of that thing! Or else I will!!!!!


----------



## kgtuning

and here is my 5 ghz @ 1.376volts with a temp of 75 C


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Highest I can find is 1000 grit


Ebay has 2500 = 3000 grit.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ebay has 2500 = 3000 grit.


The highest I have seen at a store was 2000... ebay has that 2500, 3000 grit huh? interesting.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> The highest I have seen at a store was 2000... ebay has that 2500, 3000 grit huh? interesting.


I have 2500 grit myself via Ebay. 2500 / 3000 grit is wet sanding grit u have to get it from an Auto part store.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have 2500 grit myself via Ebay. 2500 / 3000 grit is wet sanding grit u have to get it from an Auto part store.


Yeah all the sand paper I have that is above 600 is wet


----------



## 4thKor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah all the sand paper I have that is above 600 is wet


I use 600 wet (with water) then go to 1000, then 1500 both dry, even though they are wet-sand automotive papers. Works like a dream and is a lot faster and neater. I found that trick on a forum somewhere and tried it and it works well. Never went above 1500, but should be the same end result dry as with water.


----------



## Systemlord

Hay can I use Arctic Clean Thermal Material Remover or Nail Polish Remover on the die without harming the processors PCB? I'm about to go under the knife tonight, any last words of caution?


----------



## Swag

I'd just use normal 99% Isopropyl Alcohol. Best cleaning liquid.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Hay can I use Arctic Clean Thermal Material Remover or Nail Polish Remover on the die without harming the processors PCB? I'm about to go under the knife tonight, any last words of caution?


That your time - its not a race. Single-sided razor blades worked great for me. Try each corner, find the easiest, once you get the first one going the rest is very easy. Hardest part is getting the guts to try to do it and your already there! Good luck!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have 2500 grit myself via Ebay. 2500 / 3000 grit is wet sanding grit u have to get it from an Auto part store.


I got 1000 grit didnt feel like going to multiple stores since they were closed today (oRiellies) I got 400, and 1000 grits


----------



## neopunx

Yeah, I got my high grit sand paper at the local auto part store. The higher stuff is almost like cloth. Ive heard people use a buffling attachment on a dremel tool, but I would not want uneven wear on my IHS. But damn does it shine! Make sure to change directions often, I fliped my IHS around every few minutes to make sure I was getting even break down accross the top. I kind of wish I had lapped the bottom lip that sits on the PCB for a millimeter or so. I still think mine is a little high. Bet I would get dumb and dumber temps if I had done that!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Yeah, I got my high grit sand paper at the local auto part store. The higher stuff is almost like cloth. Ive heard people use a buffling attachment on a dremel tool, but I would not want uneven wear on my IHS. But damn does it shine! Make sure to change directions often, I fliped my IHS around every few minutes to make sure I was getting even break down accross the top. I kind of wish I had lapped the bottom lip that sits on the PCB for a millimeter or so. I still think mine is a little high. Bet I would get dumb and dumber temps if I had done that!


So is 1000 grit good enough? if not ill go get 2000 or something from oreilys


----------



## neopunx

1000 will be fine, you probably wont see any gains with 2000 grit. Mine was an impulse buy, and then my OCD kicked in and I had to make it look like gold.

Edit: Meant to do this before. REP + to Valgaur. You might not be the first delidder, but you gave us a home.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> 1000 will be fine, you probably wont see any gains with 2000 grit. Mine was an impulse buy, and then my OCD kicked in and I had to make it look like gold.


See...thats what i want lol.


----------



## neopunx

I wonder how many people have been able to acheive a 5.5 ghz on the 3770k on just air/water. I havent seen any others out there, except for our members.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So is 1000 grit good enough? if not ill go get 2000 or something from oreilys


From what I have read, you get no temp gains from lapping beyond 800 grit, so 1000 will be fine and more than enough.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I wonder how many people have been able to acheive a 5.5 ghz on the 3770k on just air/water. I havent seen any others out there, except for our members.


Yep. The delidding crew rules with top OC on air/water!









Are you still working on your 5.5 *neopunx*? I think you are real close.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Hay can I use Arctic Clean Thermal Material Remover or Nail Polish Remover on the die without harming the processors PCB? I'm about to go under the knife tonight, any last words of caution?


Thats what i use.


----------



## neopunx

^ This is also what I use ^

@ PCWargamer - Yes, althoguh I am pulling 24 hour duty as we write, so I have to wait for another 14 hours and 30 minutes before I can again try to lay waste to the current records!!!!


----------



## Silkworm75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Hay can I use Arctic Clean Thermal Material Remover or Nail Polish Remover on the die without harming the processors PCB? I'm about to go under the knife tonight, any last words of caution?


Test your cpu and make sure it works the way it should before going under the knife. It would suck to find out you delid a defective cpu. Murphy's law


----------



## Systemlord

Well I'm still here after the delidding process, success! Using a double sided paper thin blade (strange cutouts in center of blade) I remove all of the black glue and could believe how easily it wipe away using just my finger nail, I used the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the processor die. I hope that didn't harm my results, I used MX4 on top of the IHS and my air cooler until the middle of next month when I install my Supremacy together with my ultra high-end water cooling loop..

My ambient temps before delidding was between 22C, my ambient temps at the time of the Prime 95 test picture below after delidding is about 21C, did using the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the die screw with my results? I mean how do you compare 10 minutes of Prime 95 with 25 hours? I will try to create the environment of when I tested before delidding.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Well I'm still here after the delidding process, success! Using a double sided paper thin blade (strange cutouts in center of blade) I remove all of the black glue and could believe how easily it wipe away using just my finger nail, I used the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the processor die. I hope that didn't harm my results, I used MX4 on top of the IHS and my air cooler until the middle of next month when I install my Supremacy together with my ultra high-end water cooling loop..
> My ambient temps before delidding was between 22C, my ambient temps at the time of the Prime 95 test picture below after delidding is about 21C, did using the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the die screw with my results? I mean how do you compare 10 minutes of Prime 95 with 25 hours? I will try to create the environment of when I tested before delidding.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


first ...gratz!









"I used the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the processor die"

thats prolly to much, you dont want it to run out from between the die and ihs, by the pressure,
you can use the seringe to suck some away again..
i used mine to do all sides, die, underside ihs, on ihs and base plate cooler,
all very thin layers
this weekend i did 2 vid cards with it, 1 card twice,
which needed a thick(er) layer because of poor contact, and still have some left









if you run prime 30-40min, thats about the temps you get,
it will go up a bit more after hours run, but not much.. 3-5C max

dont have prime with 4.5ghz,
this is 4.7ghz, to compare temps with,

it stayed under 65C after 30 min prime


----------



## Silkworm75

Systemlord, hope you save stock TIM. You might need it later. And good work


----------



## neopunx

Congrats Brother!


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> first ...gratz!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "I used the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the processor die"
> thats prolly to much, you dont want it to run out from between the die and ihs, by the pressure,
> you can use the seringe to suck some away again..
> i used mine to do all sides, die, underside ihs, on ihs and base plate cooler,
> all very thin layers
> this weekend i did 2 vid cards with it, 1 card twice,
> which needed a thick(er) layer because of poor contact, and still have some left
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you run prime 30-40min, thats about the temps you get,
> it will go up a bit more after hours run, but not much.. 3-5C max
> dont have prime with 4.5ghz,
> this is 4.7ghz, to compare temps with,
> 
> it stayed under 65C after 30 min prime


My readings at a little higher room temperature is 57C, 70C, 68C, 71C! Notice core 2, 3 and 4, pretty darn even! In the future if for some reason I need to separate the IHS from the processor die, how difficult will it be to wipe off all LP?

Also how much better should my temps be going from a Zalman heatsink with a 92mm fan versus an EK Supremacy, 2x EK-FC480GTX blocks, two D5's in serial using two 560 radiators running GT15's at 1850rpms (check build log below)?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silkworm75*
> 
> Systemlord, hope you save stock TIM. You might need it later. And good work


I don't understand what you mean, why do I need the stock TIM?


----------



## Valgaur

Ohh boy time to write lol.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> 1000 will be fine, you probably wont see any gains with 2000 grit. Mine was an impulse buy, and then my OCD kicked in and I had to make it look like gold.
> Edit: Meant to do this before. REP + to Valgaur. You might not be the first delidder, but you gave us a home.


That really means a lot and I thank you for that I really want this place to be very informative but lax unlike some places were you can only posts results and that's about it. I hope everyone is all enjoying it so far and if so then GOOD! if not then let me know and we can make *magic* happen









I also really really like you sig for the delidded crew lol. You should PM me the code line and we can ask members on here what they think!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I wonder how many people have been able to acheive a 5.5 ghz on the 3770k on just air/water. I havent seen any others out there, except for our members.


So far yes me and VonDutch are the only people to get this high...(CPU frequency wise that is....you silly peoples you!







) on just air and H2O. Everyone else has been resorting to DICE or Ln2 to get beyond on...BUT I will hopefully be getting a DICE pot soon along with a Ln2 pot later on. I plan on going to the next Ln2 event with the HWbot group and either benching Little Franky until I max him out or until he gets to cold to want to.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> From what I have read, you get no temp gains from lapping beyond 800 grit, so 1000 will be fine and more than enough.


Sweet....but what about shine? I kinda want it to look pretty....lol yes I'm ADHD and OCD. Bad combo I know








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep. The delidding crew rules with top OC on air/water!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you still working on your 5.5 *neopunx*? I think you are real close.


He better be!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> ^ This is also what I use ^
> @ PCWargamer - Yes, althoguh I am pulling 24 hour duty as we write, so I have to wait for another 14 hours and 30 minutes before I can again try to lay waste to the current records!!!!


I expect good results!!!! also if you can't afford a dead chip....don't risk it. (I can't and went for it but I knew the risks and had everything plotted out so think carefully about it. the vcore jump is crazy this time around.)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silkworm75*
> 
> Test your cpu and make sure it works the way it should before going under the knife. It would suck to find out you delid a defective cpu. Murphy's law


I completely agree with this guys we NEED to make sure stuff works before saying meh i'll make it better my way.

*FURTHERMORE ALL RMA INFORMATION WILL NOT BE TOLERATED IF IT IS POSTED ON HERE, THIS IS DUE TO AVOIDING GETTING CAUGHT WITH OUR WAY OF RETURNING OUR ACTUAL CHIPS AND SUCH. TO LET US KNOW DO US ALL A FAVOR AND PM ME VALGAUR PERSONALLY LETTING ME KNOW ALL THE INFO AND I'LL GET IT OUT PROPERLY!!! YOUR COOPERATION IS VERY APPRECIATED!*








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Well I'm still here after the delidding process, success! Using a double sided paper thin blade (strange cutouts in center of blade) I remove all of the black glue and could believe how easily it wipe away using just my finger nail, I used the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the processor die. I hope that didn't harm my results, I used MX4 on top of the IHS and my air cooler until the middle of next month when I install my Supremacy together with my ultra high-end water cooling loop..
> My ambient temps before delidding was between 22C, my ambient temps at the time of the Prime 95 test picture below after delidding is about 21C, did using the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the die screw with my results? I mean how do you compare 10 minutes of Prime 95 with 25 hours? I will try to create the environment of when I tested before delidding.


What cooler are you running at the moment? if it's a custom WC kit...then those temps arent right unless you have a CPU and GPU on the same loop.

Okay now for my post lol. I sadly can't lap my IHS yet or even do my LP and IX review yet either. I am going to wait until I get this other 3770K to delid and then test on both his first then mine so i can just let it run for about 7 months without changing anything. Sorry to delay it more but it MIGHT be sometime this week.

Anyways I'm glad that everyone is enjoying the club and hope to see more success stories and even better information than usual!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> My readings at a little higher room temperature is 57C, 70C, 68C, 71C! Notice core 2, 3 and 4, pretty darn even! In the future if for some reason I need to separate the IHS from the processor die, how difficult will it be to wipe off all LP?
> Also how much better should my temps be going from a Zalman heatsink with a 92mm fan versus an EK Supremacy, 2x EK-FC480GTX blocks, two D5's in serial using two 560 radiators running GT15's at 1850rpms (check build log below)?


yea, thats gonna improve your temps, of course i cant say how much,
what zalman cooler are you using now?

we dont have any good data yet, how LP will clean after, lets say a year, under the hood..lol
my guess is, within a half year, should still be easy clean, if you order new, you might consider
liquid ultra, its almost as good as pro, we have members with good results in here,
but its easier to clean..

the difference in core temps you have,14C, are a bit to much if you ask me,
thats what i had before delid, 10-15C between hottest and coolest core,
now i have a difference about 5-6C max between hottest /coolest core, under load,
thats ok tho, one core they call the sleepy core, its just a lazy one if you ask me ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> My readings at a little higher room temperature is 57C, 70C, 68C, 71C! Notice core 2, 3 and 4, pretty darn even! In the future if for some reason I need to separate the IHS from the processor die, how difficult will it be to wipe off all LP?
> Also how much better should my temps be going from a Zalman heatsink with a 92mm fan versus an EK Supremacy, 2x EK-FC480GTX blocks, two D5's in serial using two 560 radiators running GT15's at 1850rpms (check build log below)?
> I don't understand what you mean, why do I need the stock TIM?


HA your temps will go to the 50-40 range i bet....your gonna own on temps man. especially if you rig up a passive DICE setup in your case where you have a container of Dry Ice (DICE fr those who don't know) ((just sayin)) and then let the cool air build up and let your rads pump that nice cold air through and super chill your computer to close to the 10-15C range i bet. shoo i'd even say the 5-10C range when idle and such things!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, thats gonna improve your temps, of course i cant say how much,
> what zalman cooler are you using now?
> we dont have any good data yet, how LP will clean after, lets say a year, under the hood..lol
> my guess is, within a half year, should still be easy clean, if you order new, you might consider
> liquid ultra, its almost as good as pro, we have members with good results in here,
> but its easier to clean..
> the difference in core temps you have,14C, are a bit to much if you ask me,
> thats what i had before delid, 10-15C between hottest and coolest core,
> now i have a difference about 5-6C max between hottest /coolest core, under load,
> thats ok tho, one core they call the sleepy core, its just a lazy one if you ask me ..lol


Theres a way to turn those off....give me a bit to remember how...i just did it to....

HAHA found it!

http://www.coderbag.com/Programming-C/Disable-CPU-Core-Parking-Utility

click the *executable file link* not the source code.


----------



## Systemlord

I'm running a Zalman CNPS9500A LED at max fan speed without speed controller (2500rpms in BIOS), I will be using IX under my Supremacy. Remember that I'm using the iGPU so you would expect my temps to drop further, right?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I'm running a Zalman CNPS9500A LED at max fan speed without speed controller (2500rpms in BIOS), I will be using IX under my Supremacy. Remember that I'm using the iGPU so you would expect my temps to drop further, right?


if your using the chip's graphics then you dont need 2 560 rads.......one thick 560 will do very nicely. but it is your build remember you can't get colder than ambient temps.


----------



## ChaosAD

If i have a contact problem between die and ihs, do you think lapping the IHS lip that contacts the PCB would help any? Just a thought i read on another forum.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Theres a way to turn those off....give me a bit to remember how...i just did it to....
> HAHA found it!
> http://www.coderbag.com/Programming-C/Disable-CPU-Core-Parking-Utility
> click the *executable file link* not the source code.


did you try, or anyone else?
and noticed the temp difference was gone after?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I'm running a Zalman CNPS9500A LED at max fan speed without speed controller (2500rpms in BIOS), I will be using IX under my Supremacy. Remember that I'm using the iGPU so you would expect my temps to drop further, right?


yes


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if your using the chip's graphics then you dont need 2 560 rads.......one thick 560 will do very nicely. but it is your build remember you can't get colder than ambient temps.


I'll be adding two high-end Nvidia graphics cards maybe three, full coverage motherboard water blocks and of course the EK Supremacy. I wanted to over rad my loop so I can have the capability to go ultra quiet, or max for benching!









I swear by that super thin double sided blade, it didn't even bend the PCB when going into the corners, even though it bends easily, once under the IHS it has little chance of scraping the PCB!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> If i have a contact problem between die and ihs, do you think lapping the IHS lip that contacts the PCB would help any? Just a thought i read on another forum.


i still think its something else that messes up your temps..


i mean, you tried it more then once to reseat, no gain, nothing changed..
try find out if block or ihs is concave or not ..

with the adhesive gone, the ihs should rest on the die,
it can even spin freely on the die , like you see with my avatar,
you said it looked good when you got it off again the first time,
tim on the inside ihs , and contact with die..

srry, have to ask, what lip exactly?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I swear by that super thin double sided blade, it didn't even bend the PCB when going into the corners, even though it bends easily, once under the IHS it has little chance of scraping the PCB!


pic of the blade would be helpful








im a visual guy ..lol


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> If i have a contact problem between die and ihs, do you think lapping the IHS lip that contacts the PCB would help any? Just a thought i read on another forum.


Not sure that is good for the die, but if yours is able to move easily (or not) should give you an indication on how much space you have in there. Also, you could get electronic calipers and do the math. LOTS of space is bad, but don't go overboard with lapping or else you will crush the die when you apply pressure with your Heat Sink/Water Block.


----------



## ChaosAD

I havent checked if the ihs spin freely on the die tbh, but yes, even the first time i applyed LP the contact seemed to be fine. I have to check if the ihs is flat. As far as i remember raystorm blocks have a little bow at the middle to have better contact with the cpu, but i m not 100% sure.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> pic of the blade would be helpful


Bought ten blades at CVS Pharmacy.


----------



## neopunx

I didnt think of it till after I cut the ever living **** out of my fingers, but put dome duct tape on the side not used for seperation to remove the risk to your typing digits.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I didnt think of it till after I cut the ever living **** out of my fingers, but put dome duct tape on the side not used for seperation to remove the risk to your typing digits.


If you pinch tightly with both thumbs and work slowly you shouldn't loose any finger tips!


----------



## neopunx

K, well good luck with it then.


----------



## kgtuning

I go to sleep and by the time I get up there is 30 posts.... wow. I got up and it was actually only 70 degrees F in my house, the coolest its been in my house this year. So I ran IBT to get so temps......

5.0 ghz @ 1.376 volts at theses temps : 67,72,73,69 they were the highest I saw at the end of 10 runs. going to lap my water block today or tomorrow and see what happens.


----------



## andressergio

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I finely received my Liquid Pro, exactly how much Liquid Pro do I need to get good contact between the processor die and the IHS? Why is one of your pictures of temperatures only at 6% load?


i prime at 60C at 4.8HT mate will show some pics i lost my raid and data gone









use a tiny drop will go perfect for die and IHS inside

40C is magic

left pic i cause finished mate but realtemp recorded max temps on the righ was still runing


----------



## Valgaur

Wow didn't expect 19 posts in 5 hours since I posted at 4 am and then crawled to bed. Woke up at 8 and went geez 19 already?

I just really wanna lap my IHS today....but I do have homework...and missing sleep and sickness....totally worth the illness to have gotten franky to 5.5 Ghz though.


----------



## kgtuning

very fast moving thread!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Well I'm still here after the delidding process, success! Using a double sided paper thin blade (strange cutouts in center of blade) I remove all of the black glue and could believe how easily it wipe away using just my finger nail, I used the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the processor die. I hope that didn't harm my results, I used MX4 on top of the IHS and my air cooler until the middle of next month when I install my Supremacy together with my ultra high-end water cooling loop..
> My ambient temps before delidding was between 22C, my ambient temps at the time of the Prime 95 test picture below after delidding is about 21C, did using the entire syringe of Liquid Pro on the die screw with my results? I mean how do you compare 10 minutes of Prime 95 with 25 hours? I will try to create the environment of when I tested before delidding.


I used LP and i have put it on 2 gps 2 apps on the die and 1 on the IHS and still have about 2 apps left lol.


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I used LP and i have put it on 2 gps 2 apps on the die and 1 on the IHS and still have about 2 apps left lol.


How many degrees did it bring down your GPUS? Thinking about applying it to my reference 680s


----------



## neopunx

Yes, how are temps on the GPUs? I'm about to WC my cards and wanted to use CL P on them when I switch over. Only about 500.00 out.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Yes, how are temps on the GPUs? I'm about to WC my cards and wanted to use CL P on them when I switch over. Only about 500.00 out.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1315215/polished-galaxy-gtx-680-4gb-heatsink-cool-labs-liquid-pro-tim/0_20#post_18357130


----------



## Valgaur

OP is updated!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> How many degrees did it bring down your GPUS? Thinking about applying it to my reference 680s


i did 2 vidcards this weekend, mine and my son's,
temps got down by about 8-10C playing bf3 lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> very fast moving thread!


yea, especially if peeps keep posting things like this ...LOL.. jk jk

but youre right, every morning i wake up, i have to read through about 3 pages


----------



## kgtuning

hmm... waterblock lapped... no change in temps. guess the DD M6 is pretty flat. Maybe I'll try CL pro between the IHS and block.


----------



## ivanlabrie

If the gpu has an exposed die you get massive temp drops with CLP...As Hokies posted above. DO IT!


----------



## Hokies83

I made a whole thread about it lol

Hoped to get alot of ppl talking about it and get 10 or so rep out of it.. But thread was kinda ignored and got 0 Rep.. lmao

http://www.overclock.net/t/1315215/polished-galaxy-gtx-680-4gb-heatsink-cool-labs-liquid-pro-tim/0_20#post_18357130


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, that sucks...I had a massive temp drop aswell. Nobody payed much attention to my temps, even though I surpassed guys on water whilst running a higher oc lol


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I made a whole thread about it lol
> Hoped to get alot of ppl talking about it and get 10 or so rep out of it.. But thread was kinda ignored and got 0 Rep.. lmao
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1315215/polished-galaxy-gtx-680-4gb-heatsink-cool-labs-liquid-pro-tim/0_20#post_18357130


Nice Thread

About the REP don't worry LOL i got your back bro !!!


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I used LP and i have put it on 2 gps 2 apps on the die and 1 on the IHS and still have about 2 apps left lol.


When I turned on computer this morning I forgot to run IBT after delidding, my results were even more incredible. Before delidding my max temps during IBT spiked to 95C - 98C, now after delidding I didn't even break 80C, it hovered around 75C with only very quick spikes to 80 and didn't stay there more than a few milliseconds!

Remember I'm using the iGPU folks!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> When I turned on computer this morning I forgot to run IBT after delidding, my results were even more incredible. Before delidding my max temps during IBT spiked to 95C - 98C, now after delidding I didn't even break 80C, it hovered around 75C with only very quick spikes to 80 and didn't stay there more than a few milliseconds!
> Remember I'm using the iGPU folks!


Im using the IGPU aswell and im running 1.55v and those are a mirror image of my temps.
But after 7 Hrs of Prime95
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Nice Thread
> About the REP don't worry LOL i got your back bro !!!


Thx bro lol


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i did 2 vidcards this weekend, mine and my son's,
> temps got down by about 8-10C playing bf3 lol


After the great success of putting CL Ultra on my cpu, I am also thinking about how well if could work on my GPUs too! So I am thinking about doing some CL PRO on my GPUs soon to give it a try with hopes of good temp drops on them like yours.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> After the great success of putting CL Ultra on my cpu, I am also thinking about how well if could work on my GPUs too! So I am thinking about doing some CL PRO on my GPUs soon to give it a try with hopes of good temp drops on them like yours.


You won't see a big difference unless you delid them! Fermi cores have an IHS glued to them. There's a thread about that here in OCN (I think Sonda5 did it too...pm him)


----------



## Valgaur

Wow....must have been sick i took a 5 hour nap.... now time to try and get a hold of HWBot team.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> After the great success of putting CL Ultra on my cpu, I am also thinking about how well if could work on my GPUs too! So I am thinking about doing some CL PRO on my GPUs soon to give it a try with hopes of good temp drops on them like yours.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You won't see a big difference unless you delid them! Fermi cores have an IHS glued to them. There's a thread about that here in OCN (I think Sonda5 did it too...pm him)


cant hurt anyways,
but like ivanlabrie says, if it has a ihs , the difference prolly wont be that big,
my 6850 doesnt have a ihs on it, neither did my son's 5770..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Wow....must have been sick i took a 5 hour nap.... now time to try and get a hold of HWBot team.


feeling better bro?
my youngest was sick like a dog this weekend.. flu..
bummer, always when my kids are feeling better again,
i get sick after them ..lol so not feeling to well today..


----------



## y2kcamaross

Anyone know if galaxy and zotacs reference 680s have stickers or anything that gets pierced when you take the cooler off i.e. to void the warranty


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> Anyone know if galaxy and zotacs reference 680s have stickers or anything that gets pierced when you take the cooler off i.e. to void the warranty


My 670 didn't have any sticker...not sure on reference cards, but I doubt that.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> Anyone know if galaxy and zotacs reference 680s have stickers or anything that gets pierced when you take the cooler off i.e. to void the warranty


No and Galaxy will still warranty the card as long as YOU do not damage it by removing heat sink and tim.


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> Anyone know if galaxy and zotacs reference 680s have stickers or anything that gets pierced when you take the cooler off i.e. to void the warranty
> 
> 
> 
> No and Galaxy will still warranty the card as long as YOU do not damage it by removing heat sink and tim.
Click to expand...

:beer:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> :beer:


EVGA covers this as well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> EVGA covers this as well.


Meh @ Evga i may have some Evga posters and such but after learning the truth about Gpus there really is no reason to get an Evga card besides there Customer service..

I mean Evga for gods sake are all Ref cards but the Classy and there all Ref cooled but the Sig 2 lol..

And what in gods name is with the having 10 diff gpus with a diff name chargeing diff prices.. it is like OH we can write in this gpu bios it is 10mhz clocked higher then the other card lets charge 20$ more! Seems like a gimmick sale / scam to me..

I have moved past Evga and will not buy there products until they can build cards as good as Msi / Asus / Galaxy " Non Ref design / Cooling "
And not try and gimmick sale / Scam people with ref cards with 10mhz jumps written in the bios lol.

Let me put it this way "as being somebody on the inside and knowing "

The Pcbs are all made in the same place in Taiwan And PNY makes all the coolers Nvidia Provides the GPU.... sooo Buying a Ref designed card ... there all made in the same place with a different name on it lol..

If you want something not done like this you have to get a NON Ref design...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh @ Evga i may have some Evga posters and such but after learning the truth about Gpus there really is no reason to get an Evga card besides there Customer service..
> I mean Evga for gods sake are all Ref cards but the Classy and there all Ref cooled but the Sig 2 lol..
> And what in gods name is with the having 10 diff gpus with a diff name chargeing diff prices.. it is like OH we can write in this gpu bios it is 10mhz clocked higher then the other card lets charge 20$ more! Seems like a gimmick sale / scam to me..
> I have moved past Evga and will not buy there products until they can build cards as good as Msi / Asus / Galaxy " Non Ref design / Cooling "
> And not try and gimmick sale / Scam people with ref cards with 10mhz jumps written in the bios lol.
> Let me put it this way "as being somebody on the inside and knowing "
> The Pcbs are all made in the same place in Taiwan And PNY makes all the coolers Nvidia Provides the GPU.... sooo Buying a Ref designed card ... there all made in the same place with a different name on it lol..
> If you want something not done like this you have to get a NON Ref design...











wasnt arguing on the cards here....just saying EVGA covers the same thing......


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wasnt arguing on the cards here....just saying EVGA covers the same thing......


I know just seen it as a chance to provide the Infos about GPU'S


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I know just seen it as a chance to provide the Infos about GPU'S


Okay because I was like...uh oh I got hokies riled up again....uuuugh lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

I bought a 670 FTW cause it was 325 shipped lol
You're right on, Ref 680 pcb, which for a 670 is good IMHO.
Asus makes awesome products, even Gigabyte does...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I bought a 670 FTW cause it was 325 shipped lol
> You're right on, Ref 680 pcb, which for a 670 is good IMHO.
> Asus makes awesome products, even Gigabyte does...


Gigabyte is still using Ref Pcbs but with After market coolers.

The DCII is not a Ref pcb.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, save for a few...7970 oc windforce 3x comes to mind.


----------



## dalastbmills

Just ordered some Liquid Ultra TIM. Will be joining this club this week/early next week depending on shipping and stupid Superstorm Sandy.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, save for a few...7970 oc windforce 3x comes to mind.


No idea about Amd/Ati cards im only a rep for Nvidia.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No idea about Amd/Ati cards im only a rep for Nvidia.


Oh, just sayin'
I like Asus build quality and non ref designs, really solid stuff...That's why I decided to settle on the MVG, cheaper whilst being as solid as the other high end boards.

Hey Hokies, what happened with your htpc?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Oh, just sayin'
> I like Asus build quality and non ref designs, really solid stuff...That's why I decided to settle on the MVG, cheaper whilst being as solid as the other high end boards.
> Hey Hokies, what happened with your htpc?


Still working on trade deal..

I backed the clock down to 4ghz cause 4.2ghz was a bit to much volts the board is not the best overclocking board.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, sounds reasonable, 4.2ghz on a not so great 1156 board is epic lol

Trade sounds good, the Ipad 3 is a nice device, but kinda pricey. It may carry better resale value over time though.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, sounds reasonable, 4.2ghz on a not so great 1156 board is epic lol
> Trade sounds good, the Ipad 3 is a nice device, but kinda pricey. It may carry better resale value over time though.


Well im getting an ipad 2 64 gb for 180$ and trading for an i Pad3.. I also have a Pan digatal ebook which im giving to my kid.. The ipad 2 is for the wife.. I pad 3 is MINES


----------



## ivanlabrie

Awesome! MOAR ppi








I'd like to try one for comic reading, I have a 7" Nook color, which I like, but it's kinda old now.
I gave it to my gf as a gift, so yeah, happens in the best families.


----------



## Valgaur

Sheesh look where the topic got off to!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Sheesh look where the topic got off to!!!


Shhh before i link my I PAds and pwn your 3770k


----------



## bao28

I have now bought my 'heavy duty knife' and 'liquid pro'. Now to wait for the liquid pro to arrive, cant wait to cut my cpu in half... And more importantly, hit 5Ghz. I like this club


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bao28*
> 
> I have now bought my 'heavy duty knife' and 'liquid pro'. Now to wait for the liquid pro to arrive, cant wait to cut my cpu in half... And more importantly, hit 5Ghz. I like this club


Welcome! And we like this club too!!! Your going to love having a delidded chip. Nice cool OCing. Make sure you look over the instructions/guides and take your time. Looking forward to see your before and after 4.5GHz IBT temps!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think I'll apply ic diamond and a penny over my phone's cpu lol
I'll shoot for 2ghz
(Droid pro)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think I'll apply ic diamond and a penny over my phone's cpu lol
> I'll shoot for 2ghz
> (Droid pro)


DO IT!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think I'll apply ic diamond and a penny over my phone's cpu lol
> I'll shoot for 2ghz
> (Droid pro)


Make sure you get before and after temps!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

yeah, I'll see if I can get to the SOC easily
If not I won't...xD
I already stripped my Nook color and it wasn't fun! Too tiny for my hands...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Read this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?s=e38b22ca79d5e30ef668e48f6eda47a1&t=1571647

Sorry but OCN is dying on me, I can't open spoilers nor use the buttons to post links and so on...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Read this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?s=e38b22ca79d5e30ef668e48f6eda47a1&t=1571647
> Sorry but OCN is dying on me, I can't open spoilers nor use the buttons to post links and so on...


huh lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Dang, I'm getting hard locks at 1.5ghz...no go








I need this thing to live, it's my daily driver.


----------



## Valgaur

I'm lost...your having OCN troubles? if so it could be the srever and if not that your internet provider all the way to your browser ex Google Chrome. if it's that then just re install it again then it should work.


----------



## ivanlabrie

No sweat...it's my work pc lol
I was having some trouble going past 1.4ghz on my Droid pro actually xD


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Read this: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?s=e38b22ca79d5e30ef668e48f6eda47a1&t=1571647
> Sorry but OCN is dying on me, I can't open spoilers nor use the buttons to post links and so on...


I had that happen to me in E9, so I switched to Chrome and/or Fierfox and it works fine. Still can't get E9 to work again even after uninstall-reinstall and even a system restore..... Anyone have any ideas?


----------



## Stay Puft

Any good instructions on using the credit card method?


----------



## shremi

I am currently trying to find out how many mhz i gained from deliding my not so good chip









But here is a little preview .... Im using Liquid ultra on the die and MX-4 on the IHS



I know i did not run prime for the full 12 hours so it is not fair to compare this temps but i am dying to see my max stable clock first.

When i am done with everything i will provide the right info with the submission form but i wanted to show my progress so far .

BTW I love to be a part of the delided crew


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> Any good instructions on using the credit card method?


I havent personally seen it but very carefully wiggle it int is all i really have you could PM VonDutch for more info he posted a video a while back.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> I am currently trying to find out how many mhz i gained from deliding my not so good chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But here is a little preview .... Im using Liquid ultra on the die and MX-4 on the IHS
> 
> I know i did not run prime for the full 12 hours so it is not fair to compare this temps but i am dying to see my max stable clock first.
> When i am done with everything i will provide the right info with the submission form but i wanted to show my progress so far .
> BTW I love to be a part of the delided crew


Then hurry up and submit your info so you can use the new sig!!!









Nice temps so far though!!!


----------



## Systemlord

Maximum temps under IBT 65C, 77C, 76C and 77C. Using Zalman CNPS9500A LED @2500rpm, just wait till water cooling.

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2562210

*OCN name:* Systemlord
*CPU:* Core i7 3770K @4.5GHz
*On die-TIM:* Liquid Pro
*IHS-TIM:* MX4
*Mhz gained:* Not attempted yet
*OC after delid:* Same
*Temp drops:*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Maximum temps under IBT 65C, 77C, 76C and 77C. Using Zalman CNPS9500A LED @2500rpm, just wait till water cooling.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2562210
> *OCN name:* Systemlord
> *CPU:* Core i7 3770K @4.5GHz
> *On die-TIM:* Liquid Pro
> *IHS-TIM:* MX4
> *Mhz gained:* Not attempted yet
> *OC after delid:* Same
> *Temp drops:*


Rejected.

Your CPU-Z need to say your OCN name please! Then ill accept ya:thumb:


----------



## Hokies83

Man u can get an I pad 3 for 379$ free shipping and 1 year warranty from apple store...

Refurbished iPad with Wi-Fi 16GB - White (3rd generation)
Available to ship: 1-2 Business days
Delivers Nov 5 - Nov 6 via Standard Shipping

$379 Free Shipping

1 year apple care plan limited Warranty

http://store.apple.com/us/product/FD328LL/A/refurbished-ipad-with-wi-fi-16gb-white-3rd-generation


----------



## shremi

Ok so while my bad chip is still priming I decided to go ahead and delid my good one









This time around I approached the process in a different way . First I looked for the easiest corner and once I got inside I never took the blade off again until the ihs came off. This time around a perfect delid not even a single scratch to the pcb .

I think what I did wrong the first time was that I tried to break into all of the corners first and then work on the sides of the ihs and with so much taking out the blade and putting it back inside the pcb scratched a bit as you can see in my pic in an earlier post.

So my advice for anyone who is still trying to figure out how to do this is to walk your way into the first corner and then go from there don't take the blade out until the ihs is out.... This might be a more dangerous way to scratch the die but in my experience it was the best approach .

I can't upload a pic from mi iPad but I'll get one in a few.

5.0 here I come
















Edit : Here is the pic and my new avatar


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Rejected.
> Your CPU-Z need to say your OCN name please! Then ill accept ya:thumb:


How do I do that?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> How do I do that?


open cpuz and click validate. Then in the top two white slots type your OCN name in the first. Then and email in the second. Then press your enter key (makes it easier and faster trust me lol) then just stress the cpu enough to show your clock on it and click validate again. This will email you the link and will bring up a webpage for you as well on your OC.


----------



## Systemlord

Using Zalman CNPS9500A LED @2500rpm, just wait till water cooling. IGPU in use!



*OCN name:* Systemlord
*CPU:* Core i7 3770K @4.5GHz
*On die-TIM:* Liquid Pro
*IHS-TIM:* MX4
*Mhz gained:* Not attempted yet
*OC after delid:* Same
*Temp drops:*


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Using Zalman CNPS9500A LED @2500rpm, just wait till water cooling. IGPU in use!
> 
> *OCN name:* Systemlord
> *CPU:* Core i7 3770K @4.5GHz
> *On die-TIM:* Liquid Pro
> *IHS-TIM:* MX4
> *Mhz gained:* Not attempted yet
> *OC after delid:* Same
> *Temp drops:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


nice job Systemlord, gratz








youre planning to buy a dedicated gpu or ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Ok so while my bad chip is still priming I decided to go ahead and delid my good one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This time around I approached the process in a different way . First I looked for the easiest corner and once I got inside I never took the blade off again until the ihs came off. This time around a perfect delid not even a single scratch to the pcb .
> I think what I did wrong the first time was that I tried to break into all of the corners first and then work on the sides of the ihs and with so much taking out the blade and putting it back inside the pcb scratched a bit as you can see in my pic in an earlier post.
> So my advice for anyone who is still trying to figure out how to do this is to walk your way into the first corner and then go from there don't take the blade out until the ihs is out.... This might be a more dangerous way to scratch the die but in my experience it was the best approach .
> I can't upload a pic from mi iPad but I'll get one in a few.
> 5.0 here I come
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit : Here is the pic and my new avatar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


good tip, heard several times now about the "easy corner" to start with,
will keep it in mind for others.. thanks, and good job ..lol









working on my son's ( hes 13 years old) comp today,
bought a cooler master Z11 case for him ..lol
looks very nice..


so my kid has a Athlon X2 5200+ 45nm 2.3GHz AM3 unlocked to Phenom FX-5200 quadcore,
but its a gamble with unlocking, 1 core gave up after a year usage, so had to set it to a dualcore again,
now i got it to work again, so its a quadcore at this moment, but ...well
looking for a replacement..

any of you guys have a old amd quad core laying around?
i can buy a AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition for about 80 euro,
not a bad prize i thought..


----------



## Phobos223

Hey all! So I got a 3770K on the way and I have been reading about de-lidding these guys all over the place... I am familiar with the process as I used to do this to old Opteron chips. My question is, as you guys reapplying the TIM and replacing the IHS, or just running de-lidded? If so, are you guys using shims? Has anyone mounted a waterblock straight to the core?

Like I said, I am getting mine on Thursday, and am debating whether or not to just do this right out of the gate!

Sorry for asking questions that I'm sure are redundant, I just haven't had time to dig around this thread for all the answers!

Thanks in advance!


----------



## leppie

Still pondering if I should try delid again.

Currently 4.5 @1.25V peaking at 84 deg C.

For 4.6, I will require around 1.35V.

At 1.325V my temps jump around 10-12 deg C @ 4.5.

Also a single multiplier change is about 3 deg C too.

Quick maths tells me for 4.6 @ 1.135V I should hit around 102-104 deg C.

Now given the average drop in temps is 20 deg C, I wonder if all this is worth it for an extra 100MHz.

I am not a folder/bencher and that would be the only reason it would mind.

A 15 deg C drop at 4.5 would be nice though









PS: Just to show how crap this bond is. My water/air delta at idle is 3 deg C. My water/air delta at load is 5 deg C. And my setup is extremely basic and got a GPU block (cant make that thing bring up temp either, but had to use water as the air fan was noisey and very crap).

In perspective, my i7 860 would easily raise the water/air delta to 12-15 deg C. I could probably get by with a single RAD currently ;p


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Hey all! So I got a 3770K on the way and I have been reading about de-lidding these guys all over the place... I am familiar with the process as I used to do this to old Opteron chips. My question is, as you guys reapplying the TIM and replacing the IHS, or just running de-lidded? If so, are you guys using shims? Has anyone mounted a waterblock straight to the core?
> Like I said, I am getting mine on Thursday, and am debating whether or not to just do this right out of the gate!
> Sorry for asking questions that I'm sure are redundant, I just haven't had time to dig around this thread for all the answers!
> Thanks in advance!


most of us use the IHS again after delid,
Sonda5 is expert without ihs and using waterblock direct on the die,
i would first give it a try without delid, and see what temps are and voltages etc..

np bout the asking, this thread is getting to big to read through fast,
but (almost) all the info you need is here..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Still pondering if I should try delid again.
> Currently 4.5 @1.25V peaking at 84 deg C.
> For 4.6, I will require around 1.35V.
> At 1.325V my temps jump around 10-12 deg C @ 4.5.
> Also a single multiplier change is about 3 deg C too.
> Quick maths tells me for 4.6 @ 1.135V I should hit around 102-104 deg C.
> Now given the average drop in temps is 20 deg C, I wonder if all this is worth it for an extra 100MHz.
> I am not a folder/bencher and that would be the only reason it would mind.
> A 15 deg C drop at 4.5 would be nice though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS: Just to show how crap this bond is. My water/air delta at idle is 3 deg C. My water/air delta at load is 5 deg C. And my setup is extremely basic and got a GPU block (cant make that thing bring up temp either, but had to use water as the air fan was noisey and very crap).
> In perspective, my i7 860 would easily raise the water/air delta to 12-15 deg C. I could probably get by with a single RAD currently ;p


for normal daily use, and play games etc you wont note a very big difference
going up from 4.5 to 4.6ghz..about 2-3% speedgain, less or nothing in games..

is that 84C if youre running prime or ibt ?
you prolly never see that high temps with normal daily usage..

i couldnt even run prime at 4.5ghz, without hitting 105C,
my mind was made up within a week of buying it...delid..lol
i think you would see a bigger temp drop then 15C with youre cooling


----------



## kgtuning

Can the spreadsheet be changed? I ditched the IC Diamond between the IHS and Waterblock. running liquid pro for on the die and the waterblock now.

temps are better by a bit..



considering my ambient air temp is 77 F. a 4 degree celcius drop....probably a mix of mounting and the liquid pro.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Can the spreadsheet be changed? I ditched the IC Diamond between the IHS and Waterblock. running liquid pro for on the die and the waterblock now.
> temps are better by a bit..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> considering my ambient air temp is 77 F. a 4 degree celcius drop....probably a mix of mounting and the liquid pro.


still nice 4C,








but like we already thought, not a big difference between tim's between ihs and cooler,
liquid pro/ultra is still one of the best, wherever you use it, on die, on ihs ...lol


----------



## kgtuning

I was just happy to get any drop.. lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I was just happy to get any drop.. lol


And that was Liquid pro vs Liquid Ultra on the die? 2=5c is what i kinda expect between the two under IHS.


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> for normal daily use, and play games etc you wont note a very big difference
> going up from 4.5 to 4.6ghz..about 2-3% speedgain, less or nothing in games..
> is that 84C if youre running prime or ibt ?
> you prolly never see that high temps with normal daily usage..
> i couldnt even run prime at 4.5ghz, without hitting 105C,
> my mind was made up within a week of buying it...delid..lol
> i think you would see a bigger temp drop then 15C with youre cooling


84 deg C with Prime small FFT (cpu/water delta was 51 deg C)
86 deg C with IBT (using the method described in OP) (cpu/water delta was 52 deg C)

I noted today I was running an older version of IBT.

The new version makes the temps more inline with what I get via Prime.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And that was Liquid pro vs Liquid Ultra on the die? 2=5c is what i kinda expect between the two under IHS.


going from IC diamond to pro between the IHS and waterblock.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Using Zalman CNPS9500A LED @2500rpm, just wait till water cooling. IGPU in use!
> 
> *OCN name:* Systemlord
> *CPU:* Core i7 3770K @4.5GHz
> *On die-TIM:* Liquid Pro
> *IHS-TIM:* MX4
> *Mhz gained:* Not attempted yet
> *OC after delid:* Same
> *Temp drops:*


Accepted!








Now slap that sig on your sig area there!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Still pondering if I should try delid again.
> Currently 4.5 @1.25V peaking at 84 deg C.
> For 4.6, I will require around 1.35V.
> At 1.325V my temps jump around 10-12 deg C @ 4.5.
> Also a single multiplier change is about 3 deg C too.
> Quick maths tells me for 4.6 @ 1.135V I should hit around 102-104 deg C.
> Now given the average drop in temps is 20 deg C, I wonder if all this is worth it for an extra 100MHz.
> I am not a folder/bencher and that would be the only reason it would mind.
> A 15 deg C drop at 4.5 would be nice though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS: Just to show how crap this bond is. My water/air delta at idle is 3 deg C. My water/air delta at load is 5 deg C. And my setup is extremely basic and got a GPU block (cant make that thing bring up temp either, but had to use water as the air fan was noisey and very crap).
> In perspective, my i7 860 would easily raise the water/air delta to 12-15 deg C. I could probably get by with a single RAD currently ;p


I run 4.5 for folding and my temps rarely spike to 66C but I believe I've had pumping out of my TIM sadly so I have to wait for the other chip to get here so i can put LP on both. You will see w very very nice temp drop I'm assuming your IHs is actually a bit higher then most and this space is causing these crazy temps so if you delid make sure to look at how much TIM is on the die.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> for normal daily use, and play games etc you wont note a very big difference
> going up from 4.5 to 4.6ghz..about 2-3% speedgain, less or nothing in games..
> is that 84C if youre running prime or ibt ?
> you prolly never see that high temps with normal daily usage..
> i couldnt even run prime at 4.5ghz, without hitting 105C,
> my mind was made up within a week of buying it...delid..lol
> i think you would see a bigger temp drop then 15C with youre cooling


I saw about a 20C when I did it but I averaged all of my temp drops per clock. I know I need to redo this lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Can the spreadsheet be changed? I ditched the IC Diamond between the IHS and Waterblock. running liquid pro for on the die and the waterblock now.
> temps are better by a bit..
> 
> considering my ambient air temp is 77 F. a 4 degree celcius drop....probably a mix of mounting and the liquid pro.


Updated!


----------



## kgtuning

@ Valgaur... Thank you sir!


----------



## Valgaur

Okay....who knows electric engineering?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay....who knows electric engineering?


Sin0822 He is getting his masters in electric engineering at GT

I know Hardware engineering


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sin0822 He is getting his masters in electric engineering at GT
> I know Hardware engineering


Lol I'm taking and EE course and I'm kinda lost on decoders lol!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lol I'm taking and EE course and I'm kinda lost on decoders lol!


Ask him not me lol

If you want to know how to configure a 200 Station server ask me lmao.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ask him not me lol
> If you want to know how to configure a 200 Station server ask me lmao.


I will lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

We have some bright fellows onboard xD
I wish I could study hardware engineering, here the choice is really limited.
I can either learn Systems engineering (which sucks and is about programming and such, mostly planning stuff on paper) and Electronic engineering which is too advanced for my math skills...
Other than that, I can do those Cisco networking courses, or Microsoft stuff.
I got some free ram to bench today, but I don't have a mobo yet.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> We have some bright fellows onboard xD
> I wish I could study hardware engineering, here the choice is really limited.
> I can either learn Systems engineering (which sucks and is about programming and such, mostly planning stuff on paper) and Electronic engineering which is too advanced for my math skills...
> Other than that, I can do those Cisco networking courses, or Microsoft stuff.
> I got some free ram to bench today, but I don't have a mobo yet.


used to learn for Microsoft Certified System Engineer(MCSE),
got A+ certificate, professional computer technician certification.
did some Novell..and am Microsoft Certified Professional (MCP)

in the years i was studying, i had to get certificates like 3x,
because of changes, new operating systems..

decided not to keep on learning, felt like a never ending (learn) story..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> We have some bright fellows onboard xD
> I wish I could study hardware engineering, here the choice is really limited.
> I can either learn Systems engineering (which sucks and is about programming and such, mostly planning stuff on paper) and Electronic engineering which is too advanced for my math skills...
> Other than that, I can do those Cisco networking courses, or Microsoft stuff.
> I got some free ram to bench today, but I don't have a mobo yet.


I'll test the ram!


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice job Systemlord, gratz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> youre planning to buy a dedicated gpu or ?


Hay thanks! I have a GTX 480 with an EK-FC480 water block (EK Supremacy) sitting next to me, I will install my high-end water cooling loop sometime next month. Waiting for EK MVE full coverage waterblock to come out.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now slap that sig on your sig area there!
> I run 4.5 for folding and my temps rarely spike to 66C but I believe I've had pumping out of my TIM sadly so I have to wait for the other chip to get here so i can put LP on both. You will see w very very nice temp drop I'm assuming your IHs is actually a bit higher then most and this space is causing these crazy temps so if you delid make sure to look at how much TIM is on the die.
> I saw about a 20C when I did it but I averaged all of my temp drops per clock. I know I need to redo this lol
> Updated!


How do I do that, it won't show up in my sig for some reason...?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Hay thanks! I have a GTX 480 with an EK-FC480 water block (EK Supremacy) sitting next to me, I will install my high-end water cooling loop sometime next month. Waiting for EK MVE full coverage waterblock to come out.
> How do I do that, it won't show up in my sig for some reason...?


Go to the first post (mine) and copy the code into your sig then it will be there.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Go to the first post (mine) and copy the code into your sig then it will be there.


Your going to have to be more specific as it says, "Delidded Crewman". Where does my CPU-Z link go, I'm lost here! I'm an EXTREME noob here when it comes to this stuff.


----------



## chronicfx

Crappiest news ever... Was making trips to bring my 2 babies stuff from my house to my parents house because we have no power from Hurricane Sandy and I went 1 second late through a light and saw a flash go off twice... So I guess I am waiting for a ticket now and thats a big setback for having money for my backup chip incase de-lidding goes bad.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ordering MVG atm...II'll test my ram myself Valgaur, thanks


----------



## neopunx

Just saw that you're using that code I sent you, Valgaur. Liking it!







How come VonDucth is only listed at 5.4? I thought he hit 5.5 also?


----------



## ivanlabrie

*hint: he doesn't wanna update it to be king...*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Crappiest news ever... Was making trips to bring my 2 babies stuff from my house to my parents house because we have no power from Hurricane Sandy and I went 1 second late through a light and saw a flash go off twice... So I guess I am waiting for a ticket now and thats a big setback for having money for my backup chip incase de-lidding goes bad.


Hate to hear that but I had something like this as well and sometimes it's just a traffic monitoring system so just wait and see what happens i guess! but don't always assume the worst in things try to think around it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Just saw that you're using that code I sent you, Valgaur. Liking it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How come VonDucth is only listed at 5.4? I thought he hit 5.5 also?


I love this new sig look. Thnaks again bud.....Ugh I better update him I guess huh?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> *hint: he doesn't wanna update it to be king...*


........


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ordering MVG atm...II'll test my ram myself Valgaur, thanks


LOL - but he is only wanting to help a fellow delidder!









*Valgaur* - you forgot that we are official!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ah decisions, I postponed my MVG purchase...

I'll have to wait till Friday to order it.

Look at this:


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ah decisions, I postponed my MVG purchase...
> I'll have to wait till Friday to order it.
> Look at this:


That could just be a variance between boards.....w/other MVGs doing better than that.....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> LOL - but he is only wanting to help a fellow delidder!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Valgaur* - you forgot that we are official!!!


Crap your right!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That could just be a variance between boards.....w/other MVGs doing better than that.....


Yeah, thought so...I'll get an MVG even despite a bit higher vcore, I want to oc my ram and gb bios are broken with 30nm Samsung ram. They just won't cut it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, thought so...I'll get an MVG even despite a bit higher vcore, I want to oc my ram and gb bios are broken with 30nm Samsung ram. They just won't cut it.


I'm getting gskill 2400 Mhz ram very very soon...I hope lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Electroneng*
> 
> Delidding a 3770k or a 3570K seems to greatly degredate the cpu. Search HWbot and Xtreme systems for more info.




Seems like False Info to me

I do not see in any way shape or form how de lidding a Chip degrades it...

There degrading cause of what Valgaur likes to do with his 1.85v @[email protected]


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> Seems like False Info to me
> I do not see in any way shape or form how de lidding a Chip degrades it...
> There degrading cause of what Valgaur likes to do with his 1.85v @[email protected]


Yeah, how does that work? changing the TIM and it starts to degrade...lol. Hokies I'm with you on this one...voltage does it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah, how does that work? changing the TIM and it starts to degrade...lol. Hokies I'm with you on this one...voltage does it.


Thats a Mod.. he then said he does not like Ivy Bridge..

And said i was trolling because i said Ib and 8350 seems to Overlock to just about the same max Mhz.. But de lidded IB chips will go higher.

I thought this was an Over clocking forum where any information is welcome.. heh i may have to start posting less here and more over on [H]

There is alot of insecure Amd Fan boys over there you gotta post and check it twice before you hit submit are they will whine rage and troll you like the worlds is coming to an end.


*And all i want is information on the chip*.. and make sure there not giving noobs false information heh.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've seen some comments like those, from green folk too...they're people after all.









Anyway, Valgaur, get 2133mhz ram and overclock it! Look for x series psc stuff, or in case you can't get any of those get hinyx stuff, they clock over 2600mhz easily, not as tight timings as powerchip ic's though.
You can google which ram has which ic's easily, if not there's a thread here. (ram addict club)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> Seems like False Info to me
> I do not see in any way shape or form how de lidding a Chip degrades it...
> There degrading cause of what Valgaur likes to do with his 1.85v @[email protected]


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah, how does that work? changing the TIM and it starts to degrade...lol. Hokies I'm with you on this one...voltage does it.


And he is right ktung. mainly because distributing heat better can't damage anything. think of it as cooling your car engine. your driving in 105 heat and your heat meter is at lets say 230 (just go with it







) and you dump water on your engine to cool it....nothing happens except the temp goes down!







obviously nothing happens tot he engine. it's the same thing for your CPU heat dissipation has nothing to do with it. UNTIL you realize like me and VonDutch that we can go even high on our OC's because the heat limitation is gone now. so bring on those volts!!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I've seen some comments like those, from green folk too...they're people after all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, Valgaur, get 2133mhz ram and overclock it! Look for x series psc stuff, or in case you can't get any of those get hinyx stuff, they clock over 2600mhz easily, not as tight timings as powerchip ic's though.
> You can google which ram has which ic's easily, if not there's a thread here. (ram addict club)


first off not sorry for the double post lol.

Anyways I need tight timing ram for my HWbot runs. my 1600 Mhz is poopy stuff.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> first off not sorry for the double post lol.
> Anyways I need tight timing ram for my HWbot runs. my 1600 Mhz is poopy stuff.


Best efficiency is at 2400mhz-2500mhz with cl9 timings...and properly tweaked secondary and tertiary timings.
HIgher than that scores less, compare your different timing/mhz settings with Maxxmem single threaded, that should net you the best results in benchmarks, except for max dram clocks ofc.


----------



## Hokies83

Just read about 25 pages on Extreme Systems And they all say the IB is much tougher chip then SB and SB-E and not one are reporting any degrading.

but he added more lol..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Electroneng*
> 
> I totally disagree with the delidding aspect as it causes some damage to the CPU in most cases! Most of the time, degrading is not only due to voltage.
> Also, the quoting of Intel maximums, frequencies, etc. in AMD forums or Vice versa without having a question asked is usually conveyed as trolling, Especially on such a historically heated topic.
> You definitely are well aware of this aspect!!
> Anyway, lets stay on topic.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just read about 25 pages on Extreme Systems And they all say the IB is much tougher chip then SB and SB-E and not one are reporting any degrading.
> but he added more lol..


Which XS thread were you checking out?

Edit: Is this the link to the thread you are talking about?

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280892-3770k-IHS-Removals-CPU-temp-dropped-from-79C-to-71C/page23

And the two major things that can damage a cpu are voltage and heat. I think we can all agree that lowering the temps of the cpu will not hurt the cpu. Delidding accomplishes that in a very effective way. That guy most be short a few brain cells or have some other agenda to think this degrades a cpu. If he really believes that, then the burden is on him to provide the proof.


----------



## Swag

Actually there is some truth the the fact that delidding will degrade your CPU.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually there is some truth the the fact that delidding will degrade your CPU.


If so, I am all ears. How does it do it? Really, I am interested in knowing how and why it would degrade a cpu. I know that delidded chips do poorly with LN2, but that's another issue and not degrading a chip. Can you explain and/or do you have a link or two I can read? - thanks!


----------



## Swag

I remember this from memory when I asked around about delidding. It doesn't do a constant degrade that it will degrade slowly forever. It will however limit your max OC. That's how it degrades. Let's say that the max OC your chip would do pre-delid is 6.0GHz, almost more than likely, you won't reach it again after delid even though you have lower temps.


----------



## Hokies83

But we just re did what intel did... they had them de lidded to... Then they glued one on and put some tim on it..

All we are doing is removing there glue and putting better tim on it and putting the Lid back on.. i do not see how it hurts anything.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I remember this from memory when I asked around about delidding. It doesn't do a constant degrade that it will degrade slowly forever. It will however limit your max OC. That's how it degrades. Let's say that the max OC your chip would do pre-delid is 6.0GHz, almost more than likely, you won't reach it again after delid even though you have lower temps.


You are correct - that I agree with. If we define degrade as losing some ability of the chip as a one time event, then yep, a delidded chip often seems to no longer reach the same high OC with extreme cooling like LN2. That can be a bummer for those few who want their cpu to be able to do that.

But the other type of degrade definition of having a delidded chip start to need higher voltage to reach the same OCs over time with air/water does not seem to be a problem. I think a delidded chip is less likely to degrade this second way and will probably last longer then a lidded cpu when run at 4.5-5+GHz on air/water. And I think that is the more common and likely way to define degrading a cpu. IMHO.


----------



## Swag

I personally don't consider the max OC being lower degrade but to some it is.Although, yes. The lower temps do fight against the normal degrade which is a HUUUUUGE plus.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I personally don't consider the max OC being lower degrade but to some it is.Although, yes. The lower temps do fight against the normal degrade which is a HUUUUUGE plus.


Yep. HUUUUUGE plus!!!

You know *Swag*, there must be something in your sig you can do without to add in the Delidding Crew so you can show everyone that you are one of us!!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I personally don't consider the max OC being lower degrade but to some it is.Although, yes. The lower temps do fight against the normal degrade which is a HUUUUUGE plus.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yep. HUUUUUGE plus!!!
> 
> You know *Swag*, there must be something in your sig you can do without to add in the Delidding Crew so you can show everyone that you are one of us!!!
Click to expand...

Got it done. I just changed it a bit.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I personally don't consider the max OC being lower degrade but to some it is.Although, yes. The lower temps do fight against the normal degrade which is a HUUUUUGE plus.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep. HUUUUUGE plus!!!
> You know *Swag*, there must be something in your sig you can do without to add in the Delidding Crew so you can show everyone that you are one of us!!!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Got it done. I just changed it a bit.


LAWL and I care about those max OC's I AM VALGAUR!!! Nah I'm just a guy who likes to bench and OC a lot.


----------



## leppie

I still call BS on 'electronic' degradation. Mechanical/physical yes.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> I still call BS on 'electronic' degradation. Mechanical/physical yes.


What do you mean by electronic degradation?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> I still call BS on 'electronic' degradation. Mechanical/physical yes.


So do i he seemed to be an SB / Amd Fan boy as he said he did not like IB and he rather have a 8350 then a 3570k.. When a 3570k clock for clock destroys a 8350..

I know someone will say multi threaded tasks 8 cores vs 4..

But before you do...

Anything sub 4 cores the 3570k beats it by atleast 30% clock for clock...

NOw multi threaded tasks when both are clock for clock are with in 10%.....

So in those words look at it like this...

Hmm ima buy a Cpu with older tech to get 5-10% multi threaded performance and get destoryed in everything else?

Now the 8350 looks like a bad choice does it not?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I remember this from memory when I asked around about delidding. It doesn't do a constant degrade that it will degrade slowly forever. It will however limit your max OC. That's how it degrades. Let's say that the max OC your chip would do pre-delid is 6.0GHz, almost more than likely, you won't reach it again after delid even though you have lower temps.
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct - that I agree with. If we define degrade as losing some ability of the chip as a one time event, then yep, a delidded chip often seems to no longer reach the same high OC with extreme cooling like LN2. That can be a bummer for those few who want their cpu to be able to do that.
> But the other type of degrade definition of having a delidded chip start to need higher voltage to reach the same OCs over time with air/water does not seem to be a problem. I think a delidded chip is less likely to degrade this second way and will probably last longer then a lidded cpu when run at 4.5-5+GHz on air/water. And I think that is the more common and likely way to define degrading a cpu. IMHO.
Click to expand...

FYI - OK. Found a link I once read about some guys testing their delidded IB's on LN2 - and most had lower OC on LN2 after delidding:

http://hwbot.org/forum/showthread.php?t=47539&page=7

"From reading results in this thread:

Success
Der8auer 6293 --> 6385 MHz
wp1024 chip dead on air, connection?

Fail
Rosty/Zozolio 6400 --> 6200 MHz Spi 32M
tosunermc 6640 --> 6420 MHz Spi 1M
Karandiru 6740 --> 6600 MHz Spi 1M
BenchBRos 6700 --> 6400 MHz Spi 1M
Splave 6527 --> 6325 MHz Spi 1M
DOM. no increase, possibly damaged chip when removing IHS"

BUT, most, if not all, of us are just looking for much lower temps for our 4.5-5+GHz OCing on air/water and are finding great results from delidding. Our chips are now no longer temp limited - only vcore limited - and if you consider what *Valgaur* and *VonDutch* have done, maybe not even vcore limited!!!









And, great job *Swag* on finally getting your sig right!!! Now you are more fully one of the crew!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> FYI - OK. Found a link I once read about some guys testing their delidded IB's on LN2 - and most had lower OC on LN2 after delidding:
> http://hwbot.org/forum/showthread.php?t=47539&page=7
> "From reading results in this thread:
> Success
> Der8auer 6293 --> 6385 MHz
> wp1024 chip dead on air, connection?
> Fail
> Rosty/Zozolio 6400 --> 6200 MHz Spi 32M
> tosunermc 6640 --> 6420 MHz Spi 1M
> Karandiru 6740 --> 6600 MHz Spi 1M
> BenchBRos 6700 --> 6400 MHz Spi 1M
> Splave 6527 --> 6325 MHz Spi 1M
> DOM. no increase, possibly damaged chip when removing IHS"
> BUT, most, if not all, of us are just looking for much lower temps for our 4.5-5+GHz OCing on air/water and are finding great results from delidding. Our chips are now no longer temp limited - only vcore limited - and if you consider what *Valgaur* and *VonDutch* have done, maybe not even vcore limited!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And, great job *Swag* on finally getting your sig right!!! Now you are more fully one of the crew!


Okay I'll take my swing at this. I think it's not chip or delidded strictly related at all. Think about what we had to do in order to delid our chips. we had our hands all over the thing, and a lot of people didn't use rubber gloves like SonDa5 and myself did (I'm saying such since we are the only ones I know of and read on here). Now for the people that are impatient and like to use there hands and say meh it wont affect anything. That's where you are wrong actually. The human skin has oil on it at all times unless you dunk it into pure alcohol for 4 minutes to let the alcohol soak in and kill the bacteria. That oil tarnishes the gold plated pads on the bottom of the CPU, which in end can result in a worse connection for the processors pads. I really think this is the reason, I took my time to avoid this and I didn't even touch the back of my CPU heck the only thing that did was a perfectly clean piece of white paper.

Furthermore we all know that we have electricity in our bodies, this could make micro-static shocks. You might not think much of them but they can do things to sensitive hardware like processors and such. We don't feel them but they happen from time to time. Also, when showing those crazy OC's from HWbot, VonDutch's and myself show how sturdy these chips are, but I have gotten to all of my OC's the exact same without any issues at all. Now time for the real fun.

Take into account the information PC gave us about those guys from HWbot. Look at the shear craziness of those OC's the silicon can only handle so much stress before itself becomes damaged. The multi's are all the way to the MAX of the freaking CPU. Don't tell me that doesn't harm the delicate transistor's mechanics inside that thing at all, it does, that's why heat is our enemy. Those crazy OC's also are doing suicide runs at those clocks where the CPU doesn't just have the even crazier vcore going through them but it has to work at full throttle with all of that current pumping through it. Transistor mechanics can only take so much before they say enough is enough. We know we can go higher on the OC's after delidding thanks to the temperature ceiling going away completely, but we get carried away by going over the vcore max's and pushing these chips this is the damaging part of the cycle here. So There are many things to look at not just "Ohh hey i cut the lid off didn't scratch a thing and I can't clock as high as that 6.6 Ghz run yesterday...... Ugh I think delidding did it."

You have to consider what people are doing with these chips and what damage they take during it. People can't just assume that taking a heat ceiling away from a marvelous thing makes it just start being stupid and not running the same it's preposterous honestly. I monitor my bench constantly with temps and my vcore and my multi, along with my frequency which the HWbot people beat the snot out of for the records they try to go for.

Hope this helps people think in another direction, and try to see the whole picture!


----------



## PCWargamer

Well I think delidding is great! Very glad I did it, and I would do it again (I am even thinking about getting an extra 3570K just to do it on for the fun of it again!







). I'm glad Intel used TIM on the IB - Just so I could delid the sucker! (see our moto!)

But the only rub I have found or heard about was the problem some had with delidding damaging their chip (which I sure know about!







) and that not a few LN2 dudes said they had poor results with it when they tried it. I was not there when they delidded or know if something else besides delidding damaged their chips. I expect they weren't noobs though and probably knew what they were doing. If delidding worked and helped them to get higher bench and OC results, then they would sure all be doing it by now and we would hear about it. That's not happening so far.

But, there might be other data over time that comes in to change the LN2 perception of being worse from delidding. Only data I've seen so far is like what I posted above. I do hope you get to prove them wrong when you finally get to put Franky under the LN2!

And once again, I am a big fan of delidding and I'd recommend it to any typical OC'er who wants to make their IB perform as it always ought to have performed. Delidding is the way to go for a whole lot of OC'ers! If anyone wants to remove the big issue related to IB's (too high OC temps), then delidding is the answer they have been looking for!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well I think delidding is great! Very glad I did it, and I would do it again (I am even thinking about getting an extra 3570K just to do it on for the fun of it again!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). I'm glad Intel used TIM on the IB - Just so I could delid the sucker! (see our moto!)
> But the only rub I have found or heard about was the problem some had with delidding damaging their chip (which I sure know about!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and that not a few LN2 dudes said they had poor results with it when they tried it. I was not there when they delidded or know if something else besides delidding damaged their chips. I expect they weren't noobs though and probably knew what they were doing. If delidding worked and helped them to get higher bench and OC results, then they would sure all be doing it by now and we would hear about it. That's not happening so far.
> But, there might be other data over time that comes in to change the LN2 perception of being worse from delidding. Only data I've seen so far is like what I posted above. I do hope you get to prove them wrong when you finally get to put Franky under the LN2!
> And once again, I am a big fan of delidding and I'd recommend it to any typical OC'er who wants to make their IB perform as it always ought to have performed. Delidding is the way to go for a whole lot of OC'ers! If anyone wants to remove the big issue related to IB's (too high OC temps), then delidding is the answer they have been looking for!


You know while reading this even made another thought into my head. A good chunk of us are using liquid pro right. So follow me here on this. metal contracts when it gets cold now take the soft squishy TIM Intel had on the IB chips to begin with. Now put the METAL on their and this super chilling could be affecting the movement of the transistors and possibly putting strain on the die making higher OC's harder to get to. Unlike the TIM originally that could just squeeze in on itself and be more elasticy. I'm just trying to think this out here mainly gotta think through all the gates....need foresight need foresight!









Also Very glad to hear you love delidding so much PC! I really want to get another 3770K just for either every day or benching depends on OC's and vcore and the such. But first will be Franky's show, he's proven himself more than once. Hey VonDutch! Whats your chips name!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You know while reading this even made another thought into my head. A good chunk of us are using liquid pro right. So follow me here on this. metal contracts when it gets cold now take the soft squishy TIM Intel had on the IB chips to begin with. Now put the METAL on their and this super chilling could be affecting the movement of the transistors and possibly putting strain on the die making higher OC's harder to get to. Unlike the TIM originally that could just squeeze in on itself and be more elasticy. I'm just trying to think this out here mainly gotta think through all the gates....need foresight need foresight!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also Very glad to hear you love delidding so much PC! I really want to get another 3770K just for either every day or benching depends on OC's and vcore and the such. But first will be Franky's show, he's proven himself more than once. Hey VonDutch! Whats your chips name!


From what I recall, the LN2 gang could not use the CL PRO/Ultra type TIMs due to thermal limits - they can not work at ~-160C (I think they only works up to ~-20C?) So they were using other TIMs more like the original Intel TIM. I forget which ones. They have tried several. But they could not use the liquid metal types of TIM that we can.


----------



## PCWargamer

*Valgaur*, when you get a chance, can you update my data to show "200" MHz gained instead of "none". Delidding allowed my chip to OC further then when it was lidded. And the gain of 26C didn't hurt either!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> From what I recall, the LN2 gang could not use the CL PRO/Ultra type TIMs due to thermal limits - they can not work at ~-160C (I think they only works up to ~-20C?) So they were using other TIMs more like the original Intel TIM. I forget which ones. They have tried several. But they could not use the liquid metal types of TIM that we can.


i went to the Coollaboratory site, and asked them about the temperatures,
if it still works well with -160C etc..

i dont think anyone can say something about degradation yet, its to early in the game,
we're still collecting data on that, maybe in 6-8 months, if most of us run ivy for about 1 year,
all i know till now, i dont see any kind of degradation with my chip, still running exactly the same
vcore/settings for my oc's

if peeps ask again about this, we could warn or ask them of they plan on using ln2/ice,
and tell them what we've heard..its not conclusive tho..
if its just 1 or 2 peeps that "say" delidding didnt work for them,on every 100,
does that mean it doesnt work for anyone else?

if 1 on 100 notice degradation, does that mean everyone elses chips will degrade ...nope..
to many factors that can cause chips to degrade right, maybe the chip already was a "bad" one to start with..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> But first will be Franky's show, he's proven himself more than once. Hey VonDutch! Whats your chips name!


not yet ,how bout ... "BamBam" ..lol
my first name is Fred ..o, and i once had a gf, her name was Wilma...imagine the laughs my friends had ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Valgaur*, when you get a chance, can you update my data to show "200" MHz gained instead of "none". Delidding allowed my chip to OC further then when it was lidded. And the gain of 26C didn't hurt either!


while you at it, change mine to 5.5ghz ...or did you just forget me, and wanted to be the only one on the sheet with 5.5ghz on air? ...hmmm ...LOL

5502mhz and 1000mhz gain









that list really starts to look.. impressive !


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What do you mean by electronic degradation?


Exactly why it was quoted ;p

But what I meant was 'degradation of digital signals'.

Edit: It is more than likely just physical damage to the circuitry. This is not degradation, but real damage.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Exactly why it was quoted ;p
> But what I meant was 'degradation of digital signals'.


I'd agree with that... Sort of... Obviously signals don't just go bad; it's got to be from physical damage to the chip. That damage could easily be caused by temperature and current though!

Also, I just delidded my new Ivy the other day, running some regular TIM on it right now. It's given me an extra 10c or so, but I'm going to go to Coolaboratory Ultra as soon as it gets here. How long, in your experience, has it taken for you guys to get it shipped from their online store? I hope I'm not waiting too long! I'll post results when it gets here!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I'd agree with that... Sort of... Obviously signals don't just go bad; it's got to be from physical damage to the chip. That damage could easily be caused by temperature and current though!
> Also, I just delidded my new Ivy the other day, running some regular TIM on it right now. It's given me an extra 10c or so, but I'm going to go to Coolaboratory Ultra as soon as it gets here. How long, in your experience, has it taken for you guys to get it shipped from their online store? I hope I'm not waiting too long! I'll post results when it gets here!


i had to wait 4-5 days, but there was a weekend,
depends on if youre online dealer has it on stock or not too,
some here had to wait more then a week i think,
Coolaboratory is a german company, could take a a while to ship it to usa or australia..
germany is our neighbour country, so should ship a bit faster to me i guess,
i live about 15km from the border..


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i had to wait 4-5 days, but there was a weekend,
> depends on if youre online dealer has it on stock or not too,
> some here had to wait more then a week i think,
> Coolaboratory is a german company, could take a a while to ship it to usa or australia..
> germany is our neighbour country, so should ship a bit faster to me i guess,
> i live about 15km from the border..


I really should have ordered this when I got the rest of my rig! Oh well. I can wait a week or so.


----------



## Valgaur

Vom you and BamBam are updated did it last night pc ill update you after my classes. Just remind me.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Vom you and BamBam are updated did it last night pc ill update you after my classes. Just remind me.


thanks







..BamBam ...yea, i like it..
now stop calling me Vom....Vam...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I really should have ordered this when I got the rest of my rig! Oh well. I can wait a week or so.


i hated the waiting, every day of it ..lol,
when i ordered, the site said it was in stock, within 24 H delivery,
then i ordered, and it changed to, "in stock at supplier" ...grmbl..

dang, i need a +rep, im at 13 ..........








anyone need info?? lol
ask me, and ill find you the best answer...


----------



## Ervin87

I'm running 4.8Ghz stable. I can't wait to delid my CPU but am kind of hesitant about the whole process and the horror stories I've seen over here. I'll just go for it


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ervin87*
> 
> I'm running 4.8Ghz stable. I can't wait to delid my CPU but am kind of hesitant about the whole process and the horror stories I've seen over here. I'll just go for it


The vast majority of the attempts work just fine, and you can learn from the few mistakes. If you study and take your time, it is more than likely going to work just fine for you too. Let us know how it goes and don't forget to get your before and after 4.5GHz IBT temps!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ervin87*
> 
> I'm running 4.8Ghz stable. I can't wait to delid my CPU but am kind of hesitant about the whole process and the horror stories I've seen over here. I'll just go for it


Just go slow and be patient... goodluck. let us know how it goes.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Vom you and BamBam are updated did it last night pc ill update you after my classes. Just remind me.


LOL Really?! Like how hard could have been to type in a "200" into a cell when you were at it with the other two dudes info above???

Well, consider this your reminder!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> LOL Really?! Like how hard could have been to type in a "200" into a cell when you were at it with the other two dudes info above???
> Well, consider this your reminder!!!


Your updated skipping my 10 am class because it's boring an dI have a 100% in it.......far to easy.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your updated skipping my 10 am class because it's boring an dI have a 100% in it.......far to easy.


----------



## neopunx

200 Pages in less than a month. Either we are awesome and have the coolest thread going. Or we have no life. I know I don't!


----------



## Lobsterman

So my Phanteks arrived a few hours and im more than Impressed!


max temp 56 on BattleField 3!!








Im in awe still!!

Hows 1.416v compare to others at same clock speed?
I will be able to drop that down further with more tweakage.

*edit*
oh forgot to say put Liquid Ultra between IHS and Die and HSF + IHS


----------



## TSXmike

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> IHS lapping ( 400 grit --> 800 grit --> 1000 grit). Read this composite pic from left-to-right and from top-to-bottom:
> 
> As evident in the photos, the IHS on this 3770K was quite concave, that is,
> higher in the middle than elsewhere. "Flatness" was achieved in this case
> when no more silver color remained on the IHS.
> 
> one uses wet/dry sandpaper and a flat surface (glass usually) to slowly and
> iteratively grind an uneven surface. The goal of lapping is not be to make
> a mirror surface, rather, it is to make flat surface.
> waking up, g'morning
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , and done some "info looting" while drinking my coffee
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saw you guys talk about sanding ihs etc ..so ..i like pictures, easier then 1000 (grit) words right ..lol
> i must say, most peeps say it didnt help much, i thought the same till now,
> 1-3C max difference, others saw no difference at all, so im surprised about the
> extra 11C tempdrop..
> .....................................................................................................
> First, here is the sequence of pics taken during the various stages of lapping.
> To determine if the IHS was initially convex (crowned in the middle) or concave (like a bowl),
> I used a sharpie permanent marker to make an X across the surface of the IHS:
> 
> Then I did just a few strokes on 220 grit before inspecting it,
> knowing that the portions of the original "X" would only be removed from the high spots on the IHS:
> 
> very clear indication that the IHS is/was concave (like a bowl, the center was low and not touched by the sand paper yet,
> the edges were high and have already been sanded down a bit, enough to begin to remove the permanent pen markings)
> A bit more sanding with 220 grit yielded the following "copper ring" expected for a concave IHS:
> 
> We want all the nickel removed, nickel has a lower thermal transfer rate than copper, so I finished sanding off all the nickel with 220 grit:
> 
> check out how it looks after going all the way up to 3000 grit, love it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if anyone is going to do this lapping thing,
> note before and after results if you can,
> might be usefull for others, we have this saying,
> "one day of Sun, doesnt make a summer"..
> so, results that one may have, wont mean others will have the same,
> its like with the usage of different tim's on die,
> took a while and results from different peeps, to be sure liquid pro/ultra are the best to use on die right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, about the "bowl" effect on that pic with the green markings,
> dont forget if you put down the bracket on it, it will get less by the pressure...i thought..
> well, to make sure noone will sue me, lol,
> these are the original links,
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2260582
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261219






gonna try some testing on a 3570k this weekend.
stock -> lapped -> de-lid+lapped. all under the H100


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> So my Phanteks arrived a few hours and im more than Impressed!
> 
> max temp 56 on BattleField 3!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im in awe still!!
> Hows 1.416v compare to others at same clock speed?
> I will be able to drop that down further with more tweakage.


Well im running 5.1ghz at 1.55v 24/7


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> So my Phanteks arrived a few hours and im more than Impressed!
> 
> max temp 56 on BattleField 3!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im in awe still!!
> Hows 1.416v compare to others at same clock speed?
> I will be able to drop that down further with more tweakage.
> *edit*
> oh forgot to say put Liquid Ultra between IHS and Die and HSF + IHS


I'll tarde chips for that insane 5 Ghz vcore


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> So my Phanteks arrived a few hours and im more than Impressed!
> 
> max temp 56 on BattleField 3!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im in awe still!!
> Hows 1.416v compare to others at same clock speed?
> I will be able to drop that down further with more tweakage.
> *edit*
> oh forgot to say put Liquid Ultra between IHS and Die and HSF + IHS


very nice Lobsterman








youre vcore? wish i had 5ghz with 1.416V vcore ...lol
im at 4.8ghz 1.420V vcore absolutely stable..
did you run it with prime for longer time?

really like that phantek cooler,
its my new #1 aircooler for sure,
i hope price will drop some more..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TSXmike*
> 
> gonna try some testing on a 3570k this weekend.
> stock -> lapped -> de-lid+lapped. all under the H100


cool








make some pics if you can..


----------



## Lobsterman

Havn't run Prime (properly*) yet, still enjoying BF3

*Ran it for 10 mins saw max temp of 60
Which test is it I need to do and for how long?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Havn't run Prime (properly*) yet, still enjoying BF3
> *Ran it for 10 mins saw max temp of 60
> Which test is it I need to do and for how long?


I personally run prime for 24 hours....at like 17-20 minute mark is when the temps jack up a bit.


----------



## Lobsterman

Is it the First option then? Small FFT's?


----------



## TSXmike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> cool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> make some pics if you can..


pics are a must









will be testing at 4.5 @1.25 (this i know it will do and is stable), but will also try testing at 4.8 and 5.0.

just gotta wait for the rest of the parts to arrive.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Is it the First option then? Small FFT's?


I use blend


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I use blend


Small FFT's gives me max temp within a minute of running it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Havn't run Prime (properly*) yet, still enjoying BF3
> *Ran it for 10 mins saw max temp of 60
> Which test is it I need to do and for how long?


lol, i hear ya, funny thing is, with my first oc's,
i had some good stable oc's after doing some testing,
then i wanted to play bf3 and it bsod later on ..lol
games are a good test for stability too, bf3 makes good use of cores ..lol
30-40% load i think on mine..

what you can do now, is look for WHEA errors in eventviewer,
thats one little indication that there could be something wrong,
or a bad oc..

Start, Control Panel, Administrative Tools, Event Viewer, Costum views, Administrative Events..


----------



## Valgaur

All of my Whea errors are only 20......its kinda creepy.

No idea what they are meaning either lol.


----------



## shremi

Valgur i am done testing my max overclock so i can update my info but this info is on my first chip.... is there a way i can have 2 entries on the spreadsheet one for each chip ???

Cant wait to wear the sig


----------



## Lobsterman

1 hour straight on P95 Small FFT's @ 5000mhz, max temp 70C, 1.408 vcore, loving this cooler!!!


----------



## kgtuning

4 workers? Did I miss something? shouldn't you have 8?


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> 4 workers? Did I miss something? shouldn't you have 8?


He turned off HT


----------



## kgtuning

that makes sense.


----------



## Hokies83

Oh i can do that with HT off to but with HT on needs LOTS more volts...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Oh i can do that with HT off to but with HT on needs LOTS more volts...


Yeah I was assuming he had HT on...I was rather jealous.


----------



## Hokies83

Oh and Happy Halloween!!!


----------



## Lobsterman

ahh, stupid me, ok running again with HT on...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> ahh, stupid me, ok running again with HT on...


I did the same thing a while back. testing with both HT on and off in IBT. I submitted a validation with HT off.


----------



## ivanlabrie

HT benefits folding or heavily multi threaded applications, which games are NOT








I ran HT on cause it didn't affect my vcore all that much for my 4.7ghz 24/7 oc. I have a delidded chip with liquid ultra but no mobo yet








Cannot wait!

EDIT: I forgot to add that I think the worse ln2 results those guys were facing are cause of their choice of tim. I doubt any of them used liquid pro on the die...or did they?


----------



## Lobsterman

Ok, 15 mins in, lookin good so far, bumped voltage up to 1.408, 4 degrees increase









and it crashed.... lol back to the drawing board


----------



## kgtuning

if it crashed <20 minutes it's probably going to take more then a small bump in voltage.


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> if it crashed <20 minutes it's probably going to take more then a small bump in voltage.


Ye, I will continue with my quest tomorrow, need food.
Will try 1.45


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ye, I will continue with my quest tomorrow, need food.
> Will try 1.45


Goodluck man.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Valgur i am done testing my max overclock so i can update my info but this info is on my first chip.... is there a way i can have 2 entries on the spreadsheet one for each chip ???
> Cant wait to wear the sig


Yup just submit them and I'll add both of you








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ye, I will continue with my quest tomorrow, need food.
> Will try 1.45


mmmm foooood....Nah I need monies to keep Frank happy!!!

Thanks Hokies for the Halloween wishes you to sir!


----------



## Lobsterman

Hokies, what vcore did u need for 5.5 btw?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Hokies, what vcore did u need for 5.5 btw?


Ive never went that high ..

Highest ive went was 5.2ghz and that was 1.63v


----------



## shremi

OK valgur here it goes

Chip # 1

*OCN name*:*Shremi*
*CPU*: *3570k*
*on die-TIM*: *Collaboratory Liquid Ultra*
*ihs-TIM*: *MX-4*
*Mhz gained*:*200*
*OC after delid*: *4.9*
*Temp drops*:*22°-22°-21°-21°*
*CPU-Z validation of max OC*: *http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2564473*

*Temp Drops*



*Prime 95 Stable 12 hrs @ 4.9*



Now can i wear my sig ????


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive never went that high ..
> Highest ive went was 5.2ghz and that was 1.63v


hey hokies








just checking, you run 5.2 ghz wtih 1.55V vcore 24/7 right ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey hokies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just checking, you run 5.2 ghz wtih 1.55V vcore 24/7 right ?


No 5.1ghz with 1.55v core.

5.2ghz was the highest i was able to boot into and run prime 95 for 15mins with no issues.

But i do not like going past 1.6v for a 24/7 OC so i use the 5.1ghz as the 24/7.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> OK valgur here it goes
> Chip # 1
> *OCN name*:*Shremi*
> *CPU*: *3570k*
> *on die-TIM*: *Collaboratory Liquid Ultra*
> *ihs-TIM*: *MX-4*
> *Mhz gained*:*200*
> *OC after delid*: *4.9*
> *Temp drops*:*22°-22°-21°-21°*
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: *http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2564473*
> *Temp Drops*
> [
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> IMG ALT=""]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1107266/width/350/height/700[/IMG]
> 
> 
> *Prime 95 Stable 12 hrs @ 4.9*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now can i wear my sig ????


you can wear 2, if it was up to me ...lol

gratz shremi , very nice


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Hokies, what vcore did u need for 5.5 btw?










Thats VonDutch and myself lol we are the only ones to go that far.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> OK valgur here it goes
> Chip # 1
> *OCN name*:*Shremi*
> *CPU*: *3570k*
> *on die-TIM*: *Collaboratory Liquid Ultra*
> *ihs-TIM*: *MX-4*
> *Mhz gained*:*200*
> *OC after delid*: *4.9*
> *Temp drops*:*22°-22°-21°-21°*
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: *http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2564473*
> *Temp Drops*
> 
> *Prime 95 Stable 12 hrs @ 4.9*
> 
> Now can i wear my sig ????


Yup your in! Accepted!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey hokies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just checking, you run 5.2 ghz wtih 1.55V vcore 24/7 right ?


I think it's 5.1 hes running...or 5.0 not sure.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> HT benefits folding or heavily multi threaded applications, which games are NOT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I ran HT on cause it didn't affect my vcore all that much for my 4.7ghz 24/7 oc. I have a delidded chip with liquid ultra but no mobo yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cannot wait!
> EDIT: I forgot to add that I think the worse ln2 results those guys were facing are cause of their choice of tim. I doubt any of them used liquid pro on the die...or did they?


On the LN2 - IIRC they could not use CL PRO/Ultra due to temp limits - they do not work at ~-160C. They have tried a bunch of other good TIMs that do go to that temp, but not so good for delidded chips as Intels original TIM so far.... - yep, its odd.









But not much of a concern for the rest of us regular OC'ers who do not use LN2! CL PRO/Ultra are fine for us, as are our great new low temps!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> On the LN2 - IIRC they could not use CL PRO/Ultra due to temp limits - they do not work at ~-160C. They have tried a bunch of other good TIMs that do go to that temp, but not so good for delidded chips as Intels original TIM so far.... - yep, its odd.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But not much of a concern for the rest of us regular OC'ers who do not use LN2! CL PRO/Ultra are fine for us, as are our great new low temps!


I'm highly considering talking with KingPin and asking for a pot to do testing on all the TIM's out there.....that will take some serious time though...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm highly considering talking with KingPin and asking for a pot to do testing on all the TIM's out there.....that will take some serious time though...


I bet you would have some serious fun though too!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Hokies, what vcore did u need for 5.5 btw?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats VonDutch and myself lol we are the only ones to go that far.


forgive him bro, hes still new here, he'll learn..LOL jk jk








tell him about Dumb and Dumber


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> forgive him bro, hes still new here, he'll learn..LOL jk jk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tell him about Dumb and Dumber


http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184

Thats the vcore needed for both of our 5.5 Ghz okay Von's is a tiny bit lower.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> On the LN2 - IIRC they could not use CL PRO/Ultra due to temp limits - they do not work at ~-160C. They have tried a bunch of other good TIMs that do go to that temp, but not so good for delidded chips as Intels original TIM so far.... - yep, its odd.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But not much of a concern for the rest of us regular OC'ers who do not use LN2! CL PRO/Ultra are fine for us, as are our great new low temps!


I bet we can do dice just fine, and probably have better results than regular stock cpus...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm highly considering talking with KingPin and asking for a pot to do testing on all the TIM's out there.....that will take some serious time though...


Do so! He may have some useful insight on this matter.


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184
> Thats the vcore needed for both of our 5.5 Ghz okay Von's is a tiny bit lower.


Ah cheers, I knew it was one of you lot lol, just need to polish my balls of steel now and work my way upto 1.8v:thumb:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ah cheers, I knew it was one of you lot lol, just need to polish my balls of steel now and work my way upto 1.8v:thumb:


just make sure you get cold...and real cold. don't just jump the vcore gotta do it in steps and do it carefully. make sure everything is all leveled out so it works nice and clean.


----------



## kgtuning

finally got my living room down to 70 F/ 21 C


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> finally got my living room down to 70 F/ 21 C


not cold enough!


----------



## kgtuning

lmao, Its still 55F outside so If i'm going to do any crazy runs I'm going to have to wait.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> lmao, Its still 55F outside so If i'm going to do any crazy runs I'm going to have to wait.


Use the AC!!!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Mod your ac unit into a single stage phase change cooler or a water chiller (easier)
Just need to put the evaporator inside the water reservoir, and use no rad in a water cooling loop. Use anti freeze and distilled mix and insulate the board and ram slots (use the mother flat on a test bench or whatever)


----------



## kgtuning

This is why I love this group....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Here you go:

'A/C to Chiller conversion
I felt I should start a thread on my project due to all the interest I see in the A/C chillers & (cough)minifridge modding. I chose the A/C for its ability to dissipate large heat loads(CPU,GPU & Chipset) while maintaining low temps 24/7. They are also cheap, even a new one(5200BTU/$79-$98). The unit I'm modding is a GE 5200 BTU Room A/C-Digital Thermostat w/remote control. Model #ASW05LB. I bought it at Walmart last Friday for $98. There is a stripped down version for $79 but should do fine. They also had a 5150 BTU for $69 but were physically much smaller for 50 BTU less. Here are some quick dimensions: W16.75" H12.5" D12.5"/530watts~2cents/hr. Noise Level= less than a 92mm Tornado'

Source.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mod your ac unit into a single stage phase change cooler or a water chiller (easier)
> Just need to put the evaporator inside the water reservoir, and use no rad in a water cooling loop. Use anti freeze and distilled mix and insulate the board and ram slots (use the mother flat on a test bench or whatever)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> This is why I love this group....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Here you go:
> 'A/C to Chiller conversion
> I felt I should start a thread on my project due to all the interest I see in the A/C chillers & (cough)minifridge modding. I chose the A/C for its ability to dissipate large heat loads(CPU,GPU & Chipset) while maintaining low temps 24/7. They are also cheap, even a new one(5200BTU/$79-$98). The unit I'm modding is a GE 5200 BTU Room A/C-Digital Thermostat w/remote control. Model #ASW05LB. I bought it at Walmart last Friday for $98. There is a stripped down version for $79 but should do fine. They also had a 5150 BTU for $69 but were physically much smaller for 50 BTU less. Here are some quick dimensions: W16.75" H12.5" D12.5"/530watts~2cents/hr. Noise Level= less than a 92mm Tornado'
> Source.


Awesome!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Here you go:
> 'A/C to Chiller conversion
> I felt I should start a thread on my project due to all the interest I see in the A/C chillers & (cough)minifridge modding. I chose the A/C for its ability to dissipate large heat loads(CPU,GPU & Chipset) while maintaining low temps 24/7. They are also cheap, even a new one(5200BTU/$79-$98). The unit I'm modding is a GE 5200 BTU Room A/C-Digital Thermostat w/remote control. Model #ASW05LB. I bought it at Walmart last Friday for $98. There is a stripped down version for $79 but should do fine. They also had a 5150 BTU for $69 but were physically much smaller for 50 BTU less. Here are some quick dimensions: W16.75" H12.5" D12.5"/530watts~2cents/hr. Noise Level= less than a 92mm Tornado'
> Source.


It's winter, good time to find cheap or free AC units on CL. I made one last year for the cost of antifreeze & some tubing, free AC, old picnic cooler & pond pump. Have only used it for gpus so far, ln2 is still more fun but does cost more...

freezing some antifreeze


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's winter, good time to find cheap or free AC units on CL. I made one last year for the cost of antifreeze & some tubing, free AC, old picnic cooler & pond pump. Have only used it for gpus so far, ln2 is still more fun but does cost more...
> freezing some antifreeze


I like this guy.


----------



## dalastbmills

My liquid ultra has arrived and will be in my mail box tomorrow!!! Decided to run IBT now and delid my chip now.

Not sure what my ambient temps are, but my PC is setup in my basement so I'm guessing low 70's/high 60's F.

Hottest cores are as follows:

Core 0: 75
Core 1: 83
Core 2: 84
Core 3: 76

3770K -> 4.5GHz @ 1.288-1.304v

I'm going to watch some tutorials and read up on delidding one last time. The next time I start up my PC, I will have a delidded 3770K or a 2600K XD

PS: When testing stability I used IBT very high settings, and I remember getting a much higher Speed (GFlops) for my same clock. I am getting ~98 GFlops for the basic testing while I score 101+ for Very High. Anyone know why??

Edit: I'm still not 100% about cleaning the die. Is it safe to apply 99% Isopropyl Alcohol to the die itself?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Edit: I'm still not 100% about cleaning the die. Is it safe to apply 99% Isopropyl Alcohol to the die itself?


It is , I did with no ill effects.

Just wish my liquid pro would arrive.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> My liquid ultra has arrived and will be in my mail box tomorrow!!! Decided to run IBT now and delid my chip now.
> 
> Not sure what my ambient temps are, but my PC is setup in my basement so I'm guessing low 70's/high 60's F.
> 
> Hottest cores are as follows:
> 
> Core 0: 75
> Core 1: 83
> Core 2: 84
> Core 3: 76
> 
> 3770K -> 4.5GHz @ 1.288-1.304v
> 
> I'm going to watch some tutorials and read up on delidding one last time. The next time I start up my PC, I will have a delidded 3770K or a 2600K XD
> 
> PS: When testing stability I used IBT very high settings, and I remember getting a much higher Speed (GFlops) for my same clock. I am getting ~98 GFlops for the basic testing while I score 101+ for Very High. Anyone know why??
> 
> Edit: I'm still not 100% about cleaning the die. Is it safe to apply 99% Isopropyl Alcohol to the die itself?


Sounds like your going to have some fun! Good that your reading up, and take your time.

The IBT score will be low with HT enabled. Disable HT in BIOS and then run your IBT and your scores will be higher. Seems IBT does not like HT for some reason....

The alcohol is fine for cleaning your PCB and die. I used and use it!

Good luck - and we look forward to hearing about how it goes and your new temps!


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> My liquid ultra has arrived and will be in my mail box tomorrow!!! Decided to run IBT now and delid my chip now.
> Not sure what my ambient temps are, but my PC is setup in my basement so I'm guessing low 70's/high 60's F.
> Hottest cores are as follows:
> Core 0: 75
> Core 1: 83
> Core 2: 84
> Core 3: 76
> 3770K -> 4.5GHz @ 1.288-1.304v
> I'm going to watch some tutorials and read up on delidding one last time. The next time I start up my PC, I will have a delidded 3770K or a 2600K XD
> PS: When testing stability I used IBT very high settings, and I remember getting a much higher Speed (GFlops) for my same clock. I am getting ~98 GFlops for the basic testing while I score 101+ for Very High. Anyone know why??
> Edit: I'm still not 100% about cleaning the die. Is it safe to apply 99% Isopropyl Alcohol to the die itself?


How interesting, I also need 1.288-1.304V for 4.5GHz, as it stands now at 4.7GHz I need 1.384-1.392V after 2.5 hours on Prime95. I'm about at the max Vcore to where I feel comfortable and I will not attempt anything beyond 1.4V for a 24/7 overclock! Is there another setting I can use to overclock higher without using more Vcore like PLL? This should improve stability, right?

I can't wait until I no longer need the iGPU!


----------



## bao28

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> How interesting, I also need 1.288-1.304V for 4.5GHz, as it stands now at 4.7GHz I need 1.384-1.392V after 2.5 hours on Prime95. I'm about at the max Vcore to where I feel comfortable and I will not attempt anything beyond 1.4V for a 24/7 overclock! Is there another setting I can use to overclock higher without using more Vcore like PLL? This should improve stability, right?
> I can't wait until I no longer need the iGPU!


Even more interesting I also need 1.288V for 4.5 ghz, now i really wanna hear some OCing to 5ghz requirements


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Ok so while my bad chip is still priming I decided to go ahead and delid my good one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This time around I approached the process in a different way . First I looked for the easiest corner and once I got inside I never took the blade off again until the ihs came off. This time around a perfect delid not even a single scratch to the pcb .
> I think what I did wrong the first time was that I tried to break into all of the corners first and then work on the sides of the ihs and with so much taking out the blade and putting it back inside the pcb scratched a bit as you can see in my pic in an earlier post.
> So my advice for anyone who is still trying to figure out how to do this is to walk your way into the first corner and then go from there don't take the blade out until the ihs is out.... This might be a more dangerous way to scratch the die but in my experience it was the best approach .
> I can't upload a pic from mi iPad but I'll get one in a few.
> 5.0 here I come


Hi all, great thread!
shremi> Thx a lot for that how to! What kind of blade are you using?

Do you all put Liquid Pro On die and MX4 on IHS?

Did anyone try to cut the IHS sides, 1-2 mm above the PCB, with a dremel?
That doesn't look that hard and should be riskless.
Plus, the depth of the dremel will remove some metal of the IHS which will be less high. Then, when reinstalled, the IHS will lay directly on the die without any gap between them.
What do you think about it?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Hi all, great thread!
> shremi> Thx a lot for that how to! What kind of blade are you using?
> Do you all put Liquid Pro On die and MX4 on IHS?
> Did anyone try to cut the IHS sides, 1-2 mm above the PCB, with a dremel?
> That doesn't look that hard and should be riskless.
> Plus, the depth of the dremel will remove some metal of the IHS which will be less high. Then, when reinstalled, the IHS will lay directly on the die without any gap between them.
> What do you think about it?


Hi BaK2BaK









most of us use liquid pro/ultra in the die, any other (good) compound will do for ihs/cooler,
i personally did all sides with liquid pro, die, inside ihs, on ihs, base plate cooler, very thin layers,
had a 25C+ temp drop afterwards..and that wasnt even compared with intels tim, but with AS5..

when you delid, and take of all the black adhesive, the ihs will spin freely in the die already,
like you see in my avatar..

no dremel examples yet , well, not that i know off anyways.. you might be the first









i used this to delid


this seems to work well too,


idontcare over at anand's forum did all the measurements

The math tells us the IHS is sitting on top of the CPU, held aloft and creating a gap some 0.14mm to the PCB.

Now I can verify by eye that a gap between the IHS and the PCB does indeed exist, but it is an extremely small gap (as the number would indicate) and attempts to take a photo detailing the gap is pretty challenging. I took a lot of different pics, varied the lighting, etc, and here is the best I could come up with:


----------



## BaK2BaK

Wow, thx a lot for those very interesting pieces of info!

I am a little puzzled with the gap position.
I think I have read somewhere on that thread that the heat problem with Ivy Bridge finally didn't come from the bad quality TIM used by Intel, but from the gap inbetween the die and the IHS that doesn't let the heat spread.
I must be wrong with that according to the idontcare's schema...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Wow, thx a lot for those very interesting pieces of info!
> I am a little puzzled with the gap position.
> I think I have read somewhere on that thread that the heat problem with Ivy Bridge finally didn't come from the bad quality TIM used by Intel, but from the gap inbetween the die and the IHS that doesn't let the heat spread.
> I must be wrong with that according to the idontcare's schema...


its both,
the delidders "crew"







proved, that using a very high w/mk tim is the way to go on the die,
intels tim has a w/mk of about 3-4 i think,
compare to liquid pro with 82 w/mk, its a very big difference,

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources and post #216 in this thread)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

fluxless solder/solder has a w/mk of 40 to 60,
thats even less then CLP see..
i bet even sandy would have temp drops if they where to use CLP on the die,
but its soldered so .. i cant prove that..


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its both


I guess you mean it is both the bad quality TIM and the gap in between the die and the IHS. Right?

If that's the case, how could there be a gap in between the die and the IHS AND a gap in between the the PCB and the IHS. Is the latter levitating?








It must be something like that?


----------



## kgtuning

yeah and the "glue" wouldn't let it sit all the way down. I sanded that lip WAY down. I think the gap was half the problem.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> I guess you mean it is both the bad quality TIM and the gap in between the die and the IHS. Right?
> If that's the case, how could there be a gap in between the die and the IHS AND a gap in between the the PCB and the IHS. Is the latter levitating?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It must be something like that?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


yea, i do mean both, srry









i think its the adhesive creating the gap too, like this



all i know about this is,

that black retangle there, can create a new gap, because its higher then the pcb,
and putting back the pressure/bracket on, it can levitate a little, like in your pic,
it might be just a little, but could explain some peeps have a bigger temp difference between
hottest/coolest core, have to be carefull with that if you put it back together,
but thats just one thing that might give temp difference between cores tho..


----------



## BaK2BaK

Ok I see, thx!
Maybe using a dremel could solve all those 'gap issues' and we will be sure the IHS is sitting properly on the die...
But I guess putting enough TIM on the die will do it also!


----------



## Systemlord

I forgot to ask a very important question after delidding, since the CPU die is at the same level of the IHS do we need to be concerned with how much mounting pressure is applied?

A Dremel doesn't belong anywhere near a CPU, if you feel like you need to bring down the IHS put it flat on a table with some sand paper.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I forgot to ask a very important question after delidding, since the CPU die is at the same level of the IHS do we need to be concerned with how much mounting pressure is applied?
> A Dremel doesn't belong anywhere near a CPU, if you feel like you need to bring down the IHS put it flat on a table with some sand paper.


Not really you can take your normal mounting pressure right back onto the baby. just don't try and super do the pressure for better results...thats not needed at all.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I forgot to ask a very important question after delidding, since the CPU die is at the same level of the IHS do we need to be concerned with how much mounting pressure is applied?


only if you have your ihs like this, when putting the retention bracket back on,
and lever down ...LOL


but..not really, like Valgaur says


----------



## VonDutch

just looking at the Thermaltake CLW0217 Water 2.0 Extreme


normal cost $139.99 now with 32% rebate $94.99, thats about 73 euro,

was thinking, thats a real good price for what it does..
i pay about 140 euro($181) for it over here ,dang..
newegg doesnt ship to where i live..

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835106190R

srry, offtopic


----------



## ivanlabrie

You need Valgaur to buy it for you and mail it via first class...


----------



## Hokies83

I paid 70$ for my H-100 ..

I also shipped a Gtx 680 to ireland.. cost dude 50$ more me to ship it there but i did lol.


----------



## ChaosAD

Just took my pc apart again to check my temp issues after deliding. My cpu block and my ihs are completely flat after having a look at them as u suggested. I attach a foto of my chip in case you have any idea if something is wrong.










Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need Valgaur to buy it for you and mail it via first class...


im sure if i ask, he would









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I paid 70$ for my H-100 ..
> I also shipped a Gtx 680 to ireland.. cost dude 50$ more me to ship it there but i did lol.


wauw , thats cheap, the H100 is about 100-110 euro (cheapest) over here, $129..
thins is, to ship things to Holland, is expensive, i just looked for it
for a min, $25 and up ..depending on weight etc..
living in the wrong country, when it comes to buying parts ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Just took my pc apart again to check my temp issues after deliding. My cpu block and my ihs are completely flat after having a look at them as u suggested. I attach a foto of my chip in case you have any idea if something is wrong.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


first impression..way to much tim..

when you apply, you dont want to see it "floating" like you see in the red cirkel

its more what you see above the cirkel, it should look like,
real thin layers you want

the adhesive left overs should be no problem,
you could clean it some more,
when you put everything back together again,
beware of that little black square on the pcb,
dont let the ihs slide to much on it, when putting the lever down ..

i like this pic, shows how "high" that black thing on the pcb is..
when undelidded, it doesnt matter that much, the adhesive prolly is higher then that
"tag", can i call it that?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Like Yoda you just typed...hrrrmmm










Hey VonDutch, shipping via first class or priority mail is cheap and makes up for the price difference when buying from the US vs Europe or anywhere else, so I think it's worth it. Only if you skip customs tax or it is low already...


----------



## Hokies83

If person passes up insurance it is 50$ auto on international shipping...

Ship as gift and make value below 50$ and there is no fee's.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If person passes up insurance it is 50$ auto on international shipping...
> Ship as gift and make value below 50$ and there is no fee's.


QFT! Mid flat rate box with no insurance (with limited tracking) is 47,95, so yeah...good deal.Takes ten days to get there.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> QFT! Mid flat rate box with no insurance (with limited tracking) is 47,95, so yeah...good deal.Takes ten days to get there.


You can just go to Mexico follow them across the border..

Get a P.O box in a Texas Border town lol... then cross back and forth to get your stuff lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can just go to Mexico follow them across the border..
> Get a P.O box in a Texas Border town lol... then cross back and forth to get your stuff lol.


Say wha???









Didn't follow you there cowboy...I live in Argentina, which is in South America just in case you missed something. xD


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Say wha???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't follow you there cowboy...I live in Argentina, which is in South America just in case you missed something. xD


Meh...

It means Go to Mexico... Following the Mexican sneaking across the border...

Go to a US Post office Open a P.O box there to ship all your stuff to....

Then when your stuff gets there go back to Mexico cross again get into P.O box then go back with your Hardware.

It's a Bad joke @[email protected]

Anyone from any country can go to Mexico and Sneak across the border..

Heck when i was trying to get my Vietnamese wife here... I considered flying her to Mexico and sneaking her across lol.

It is a poke at the US border Control being a Failure lol.


----------



## ChaosAD

Ok thin layer on the die and thin layer under ihs. Does it sit ok in the socket?










Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh...
> It means Go to Mexico... Following the Mexican sneaking across the border...
> Go to a US Post office Open a P.O box there to ship all your stuff to....
> Then when your stuff gets there go back to Mexico cross again get into P.O box then go back with your Hardware.
> It's a Bad joke @[email protected]
> Anyone from any country can go to Mexico and Sneak across the border..
> Heck when i was trying to get my Vietnamese wife here... I considered flying her to Mexico and sneaking her across lol.
> It is a poke at the US border Control being a Failure lol.


Oh gotcha! lol
Yeah, I bet I could sneak in easily, after years of Bujinkan training xD

Vietnamese wife? wow, she speaks english right?
You could have bought one of those russian wives, and you would skip her talking at all







(hope she doesn't read that)








You know, a smiling wife that can only say 'yes' or 'hi' would be fun lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Ok thin layer on the die and thin layer under ihs. Does it sit ok in the socket?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Yes maybe a little turned but that wont matter for how small it looks.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Oh gotcha! lol
> Yeah, I bet I could sneak in easily, after years of Bujinkan training xD
> Vietnamese wife? wow, she speaks english right?
> You could have bought one of those russian wives, and you would skip her talking at all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (hope she doesn't read that)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know, a smiling wife that can only say 'yes' or 'hi' would be fun lol


LoL she is not a Mail order bride..

I met her on my Trip to SE Asia 5 Years ago.

I met alot of others to but they were only good for a night she was a keeper.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL she is not a Mail order bride..
> I met her on my Trip to SE Asia 5 Years ago.
> I met alot of others to but they were only good for a night she was a keeper.


Awesome man, so romantic snif...Congrats on the catch!









Hey, have you seen that Colorful card? (one with humongous uber useless heatsink...)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Like Yoda you just typed...hrrrmmm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey VonDutch, shipping via first class or priority mail is cheap and makes up for the price difference when buying from the US vs Europe or anywhere else, so I think it's worth it. Only if you skip customs tax or it is low already...


tax is crazy here, they just upped it to 21%
yea, all i need is the cheapest way to ship it here,
think theres ways to get around the tax when sending it here..shht


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> tax is crazy here, they just upped it to 21%
> yea, all i need is the cheapest way to ship it here,
> think theres ways to get around the tax when sending it here..shht


Yep, you can easily skip tax...you call 21% crazy? Here it's 50% on the value plus 50% on the shipping cost. So don't be a crybaby








Do as Hokies said, declare a 100 or less value (50 would be optimal) and mark it as a gift.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Ok thin layer on the die and thin layer under ihs. Does it sit ok in the socket?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!












and? ....we're waiting, good news?..lol


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and? ....we're waiting, good news?..lol


You ll tell me if news are good or not











Crunching with WCG for 30 mins


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> You ll tell me if news are good or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Crunching with WCG for 30 mins










Now go for 5ghz


----------



## kgtuning

Looks good so far


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yep, you can easily skip tax...you call 21% crazy? Here it's 50% on the value plus 50% on the shipping cost. So don't be a crybaby
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do as Hokies said, declare a 100 or less value (50 would be optimal) and mark it as a gift.


im not crying..lol 50%! dang...thats alot..see, im smiling








kk, now i need somone whos willing to send me parts..lol.. Vaaaallll!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> You ll tell me if news are good or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Crunching with WCG for 30 mins


i only have to look at youre smiley to know its good ..lol nice man









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now go for 5ghz


dont listen to Hokies...
go for 5.1ghz!! ...haha...


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now go for 5ghz


I need 1.3v for 4.62Ghz, so with 1.5+v that will be np









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Looks good so far


Just good? What do you want to be satisfied?


----------



## ivanlabrie

There're some good fellas down in the US, I have a friend in Texas to whom I own so much...a really nice guy. He helped me out so many times, bet Valgaur can do the same for ya, he seems like a good guy, though not 100% sane xD


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> There're some good fellas down in the US, I have a friend in Texas to whom I own so much...a really nice guy. He helped me out so many times, bet Valgaur can do the same for ya, he seems like a good guy, though not 100% sane xD


Valguar Sane noway?


----------



## ivanlabrie

So much truth...xD Brave fellow nonetheless, give the man some credit!


----------



## Ali Man

Hey guys, I also delidded my 3570K and am getting temps <70C @ 5Ghz. But now as I'm selling it, although it has no warranty (which is obvious because it's voided), shouldn't it have a better price than a normal used 3570K due to the temp issue being totally removed?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Hey guys, I also delidded my 3570K and am getting temps <70C @ 5Ghz. But now as I'm selling it, although it has no warranty (which is obvious because it's voided), shouldn't it have a better price than a normal used 3570K due to the temp issue being totally removed?


It should sell the same as a new chip, price wise...perhaps a bit less? Not sure.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I need 1.3v for 4.62Ghz, so with 1.5+v that will be np
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just good? What do you want to be satisfied?


I can't wait to see it at higher clocks and vcore.


----------



## Hokies83

Rawr my adventures last night with croc buy...


----------



## ivanlabrie

No costumes here...some coworkers came dressed as random movie chars, but not me.
Seems you and your family had fun


----------



## ChaosAD

A little update, now that is some serious fun









Almost an hour of WCG and temps below 50c


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> A little update, now that is some serious fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Almost an hour of WCG and temps below 50c
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]


NICE temps! isn't nice being that low?


----------



## ChaosAD

Thats is pure happiness. I just cant believe what i see. I dropped vcore to 1.28v and saved another 2-3c







Now i let it crunch all night to see if its stable. No whea errors after 20 mins, so i guess i ll be fine.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Thats is pure happiness. I just cant believe what i see. I dropped vcore to 1.28v and saved another 2-3c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now i let it crunch all night to see if its stable. No whea errors after 20 mins, so i guess i ll be fine.


Goodluck, hope to see it stable in the morning.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> A little update, now that is some serious fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Almost an hour of WCG and temps below 50c


That is impressive temps there *ChaosAD*. Looks like you have it all correct now and getting the temps you wanted. Good to see.


----------



## luciddreamer124

So quick question. I just got some liquid pro. Do you put a half a grain of rice on the die as well as the underside of the IHS? And how much do you spread it on the underside?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> So quick question. I just got some liquid pro. Do you put a half a grain of rice on the die as well as the underside of the IHS? And how much do you spread it on the underside?


Use just half a grain on the die and spread it out.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> You ll tell me if news are good or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Crunching with WCG for 30 mins


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> So quick question. I just got some liquid pro. Do you put a half a grain of rice on the die as well as the underside of the IHS? And how much do you spread it on the underside?


I used the entire contents of Liquid Pro on my processor die, now I won't ever need to apply it again, $15 dollars for reducing my load temps by more than 25C. I would have paid $100 dollars for a magical TIM to get the temps I have now, remember I risked damaging my $329 dollar processor.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> So quick question. I just got some liquid pro. Do you put a half a grain of rice on the die as well as the underside of the IHS? And how much do you spread it on the underside?


Here is a quick video on how it is done....

http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> So quick question. I just got some liquid pro. Do you put a half a grain of rice on the die as well as the underside of the IHS? And how much do you spread it on the underside?


with half the size of a rice grain, you prolly can do the die and underside ihs








underside ihs you spread out as big as the die ..but thin layer too..

thanks to chaosad we have a pic of whats to much ..lol









inside that red cirkel , is way to much. more like above the red cirkel is good..
you can use the seringe to suck up whats to much, you dont want to see it floating like that,
on die or ihs..i still say 2 thin layers on die and ihs is the best way..

It already starts filling all those microscopic imperfection on the inside ihs when you apply it,
i noticed when i touched it with the q-tip, after i started applying it,
it wanted to stick/join together again,
so i figured it would do the same when you use it on die and ihs..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Lol, here you go man +rep


LOL ..thanks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> LOL ..thanks


sigh... lol


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Goodluck, hope to see it stable in the morning.


It was stable AND with 50c max temp, cores were running between 45-48c. Now i ll check again when i get back ftom work.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That is impressive temps there *ChaosAD*. Looks like you have it all correct now and getting the temps you wanted. Good to see.


Its nice to see my water setup running as it should








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks to chaosad we have a pic of whats to much ..lol


Ok, stop embarassing me and give me rep for my foto


----------



## Hokies83

Huh!? rep i likes rep..

CPU PLL Overvoltage allows for less clipping of voltage. It can also reduce the lifespan of the CPU, but nothing noticeable.

I have it on do joo?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Huh!? rep i likes rep..
> CPU PLL Overvoltage allows for less clipping of voltage. It can also reduce the lifespan of the CPU, but nothing noticeable.


thanks, guess i use it to get that +rep ...LOL
beat you to it...haha

1 min later......... is that all the info, or you have more i can copy/past ....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks, guess i use it to get that +rep ...LOL
> beat you to it...haha


Man i had 35 rep in my first month lol...

It is easy....

Just go to Home... see new threads go into threads help ppls..

Heck ive even got 3 rep from the AMD fan boi thread


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Man i had 35 rep in my first month lol...
> It is easy....
> Just go to Home... see new threads go into threads help ppls..
> Heck ive even got 3 rep from the AMD fan boi thread


not sure, think im about 5-6 weeks member now,
think its not to bad the +reps i got till now,
im not thread hopping for it, i only try to find the best answers for others,
really, sometimes im busy for hours to find them,
then i still have to find the words to translate it to good english ..


----------



## Valgaur

We can't just hand reps out sp easily. This kinda bugs me to, especially as an Eagle scout where I went through 14 years of training to earn that right. Rep to me is kind of the same thing now something to just be handed out but to be earned. I rarely rep people because they don't provide much info really. I once had a 100 message long pm talk with a member a while back and he asked if he should rep me and what it means. I told him that basically rep to me means that you will vouch that the information they gave you actually helped you gain better knowledge you didn't have before and that its a personal look of whether you think they deserve it.

Rep isn't to just be handed out, its ment to be an honor, not Halloween candy.









Sorry to be strict but that's how I am.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> rep to me means that you will vouch that the information they gave you actually helped you gain better knowledge you didn't have before and that its a personal look of whether you think they deserve it.
> Rep isn't to just be handed out, its ment to be an honor, not Halloween candy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry to be strict but that's how I am.


besides the messing around,
i think almost all my reps were from giving good answers








and yea, im proud/honored when someone gives one when i do ..


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> We can't just hand reps out sp easily. This kinda bugs me to, especially as an Eagle scout where I went through 14 years of training to earn that right. Rep to me is kind of the same thing now something to just be handed out but to be earned. I rarely rep people because they don't provide much info really. I once had a 100 message long pm talk with a member a while back and he asked if he should rep me and what it means. I told him that basically rep to me means that you will vouch that the information they gave you actually helped you gain better knowledge you didn't have before and that its a personal look of whether you think they deserve it.
> Rep isn't to just be handed out, its ment to be an honor, not Halloween candy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry to be strict but that's how I am.


I have received all of my rep points by just being myself, friendly and helpful. I'll even return the favor if I feel a member is really going out of their way to help me out.









I still have a lot of Halloween candy to give out, time to see a Dentist!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I have received all of my rep points by just being myself, friendly and helpful.


yeah









well, not gonna joke about it anymore, to get +rep's ...all serious now ...lol
if i get one for a good answer ..ok/cool/great..if i dont get one ...well, guess ill just sit here crying ..haha..


----------



## Lobsterman

gettin there


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gettin there


awesome! The highest I can boot is 5.3 ghz. tried 5.4 last night but I got to 1.630 volts and still no go but I got too scared to go any further.


----------



## Lobsterman

5.4


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> 5.4










holy ....


----------



## Hokies83

Anywho... upped the Igpu chache and freq an scored a 10.20 in Cinebench ....

Im trying to over take that Bottom Xeon processor lol.

I tried to lower Ram timings but doing so gave me Vcore Bsod codes.. which is strange needed vcore for ram.. so im thinking it may be something else that needs more voltage.


----------



## VonDutch

got close with 5.1ghz...10.23 points, wanted to get past that Xeon too ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> got close with 5.1ghz...10.23 points, wanted to get past that Xeon too ..lol


That was 5ghz ..

You must have that Ram OC cause im running 2400mhz ram which should easy = 5.1ghz in cinebench...

If i could lower timings id beat the Xeon Cpu.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That was 5ghz ..
> You must have that Ram OC cause im running 2400mhz ram which should easy = 5.1ghz in cinebench...
> If i could lower timings id beat the Xeon Cpu.


my ram is 1600mhz, and its at default/auto in bios 9-10-10-25, cant do much other things with my ram, i tried tho,
way harder then ocing my chip.. xmp doesnt work, setting default factory 9-9-9-24
by hand, dont work well either, saving money for other ram,
i just leave it be, upped voltage a little to 1.520V, thought thats better, because i run 101 bclk..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> 5.4


What chip is that? the one you already submitted or the other one lol. Nice vcore by the way.


----------



## Lobsterman

Ye the only 1 I have lol. Kinda hit a wall at 5.4, what page are your settings on in this thread (for 5.5) do you know? Need to mess with spread-spectrum and all the Power Settings a bit more I think.


----------



## Hokies83

Heck i lowered timing to Cas 7 7-8-8-24 @ 1600mhz and it was worse then Cas 10 10-12-12-32 2400mhz.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heck i lowered timing to Cas 7 7-8-8-24 @ 1600mhz and it was worse then Cas 10 10-12-12-32 2400mhz.


really? very interesting. good to know.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ye the only 1 I have lol. Kinda hit a wall at 5.4, what page are your settings on in this thread (for 5.5) do you know? Need to mess with spread-spectrum and all the Power Settings a bit more I think.


I dont have a page for setting of 5.5.....just set everything to max....and start cranking that vcore.....its gonna jump....a lot I had to pump 1.86 vcore in Franky to get it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heck i lowered timing to Cas 7 7-8-8-24 @ 1600mhz and it was worse then Cas 10 10-12-12-32 2400mhz.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> really? very interesting. good to know.


Here's why. High speed RAM can't really out speed a low timing RAM because of the binning in the timings. the lower the timings the better the RAM it doesn't fully matter on the Mhz that it runs at, but the timings. now for benching if you can crazy OC and super low your timings you will own any benchmark unlike before.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Anywho... upped the Igpu chache and freq an scored a 10.20 in Cinebench ....
> Im trying to over take that Bottom Xeon processor lol.
> I tried to lower Ram timings but doing so gave me Vcore Bsod codes.. which is strange needed vcore for ram.. so im thinking it may be something else that needs more voltage.


If you wanna beat that score test your ram efficiency using Maxxmem single threaded test.
2400mhz cl9 or cl8 should do best. Try 1.75v for dram voltage, 1.1v for vtt and 1.095v for imc...That should do the trick!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heck i lowered timing to Cas 7 7-8-8-24 @ 1600mhz and it was worse then Cas 10 10-12-12-32 2400mhz.


Then again, compare using maxxmem. Have fun and Godspeed!


----------



## 4thKor

Has this thread gone viral or something?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That was 5ghz ..
> You must have that Ram OC cause im running 2400mhz ram which should easy = 5.1ghz in cinebench...
> If i could lower timings id beat the Xeon Cpu.


kk, looked into it again, ram voltage up to 1.6V

9-8-8-21 1600mhz

that looks good? can i go from "stock" voltage 1.5V to 1.6V ?
you said once that i could oc this ram easy to 2000mhz?,
i have no clue when it comes to ocing ram ..lol

tried Maxxmem too where Ivan talked about,





Corsair Vengeance CML8GX3M2A1600C9 Low Profile

to stay on topic, i think im gonna delid my ram








any tips??


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *4thKor*
> 
> Has this thread gone viral or something?


Nope, lotsa interest, but only a few who has the balls to do it ;p I'm still scratching mine.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> kk, looked into it again, ram voltage up to 1.6V
> 
> 9-8-8-21 1600mhz
> that looks good? can i go from "stock" voltage 1.5V to 1.6V ?
> you said once that i could oc this ram easy to 2000mhz?,
> i have no clue when it comes to ocing ram ..lol
> tried Maxxmem too where Ivan talked about,
> 
> 
> 
> Corsair Vengeance CML8GX3M2A1600C9 Low Profile
> to stay on topic, i think im gonna delid my ram
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any tips??


Easy peasy...OC that thing to 2133mhz NAO









Use this timings: cl10-11-10-28-1T, 1.65v dram voltage, 1.1v vtt, 1.095v imc.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leppie*
> 
> Nope, lotsa interest, but only a few who has the balls to do it ;p I'm still scratching mine.


it starts with a itch ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Easy peasy...OC that thing to 2133mhz NAO
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Use this timings: cl10-11-10-28-1T, 1.65v dram voltage, 1.1v vtt, 1.095v imc.


youre not kidding right? hate to reset everything again ...lol
so 2000mhz should work too with those settings?
if im not back in 5 min ...well









i know/learned vtt and imc should be within 0.005V from each other,
thats about it


----------



## Hokies83

This is stock ill try lowering timings more later..



From looking at reviews lowing timings makes this kit jump in performance by a massive amount.
And Btw.. this kit is only 69$


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like that kit, it fits nicely under any heatsink, like my Samsung ram...
Nice results, now tighten them more and run Cinebench at 5.1ghz


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wanna bench this chip:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2280387

15 bucks...NO anand username though


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I like that kit, it fits nicely under any heatsink, like my Samsung ram...
> Nice results, now tighten them more and run Cinebench at 5.1ghz


I will try what u said.. But like i said before when ever i touched the ram it wanted ALOT more Vcore.. Which confuses me... why ram needs Vcore.. maybe it is the IMC that needs more?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This is stock ill try lowering timings more later..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From looking at reviews lowing timings makes this kit jump in performance by a massive amount.
> And Btw.. this kit is only 69$


i know, like i said, saving money for other ram, this one .....pfff

well, i used ivan's settings, didnt even go to the bios screen,
yea, had to reset everything ..lol
nvm, everytime i mess with my ram settings, it only goes bad ..
ill leave it be, using the 1.6V and the 9-8-8-21 timings ..that all

kk, back to the bios, and redo my oc settings ..haha..laters peeps


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I will try what u said.. But like i said before when ever i touched the ram it wanted ALOT more Vcore.. Which confuses me... why ram needs Vcore.. maybe it is the IMC that needs more?


Yes it may need more vcore except dram when you push your ram. Thats because the IMC is intergrated into the cpu. But like cpu overclocking, not all cpu IMCs are the same.

I also have a minor update








Happily crunching


----------



## Hokies83

LoL there attacking me in the 8350 thread for posting my Ram score lol.


----------



## chronicfx

I decided to try to delid today since I had no power still from sandy and not too much else to do. Not sure if it is because of how tight my d14 mount was but I could only enter on one corner of the chip. I was using cvs one sided razor blades that came in a 10 pack but with no money to back up a dead chip I had to quit and just put the chip back in. I did change the Tim to liquid ultra hopefully I can get a couple degrees off of just doing that. My original plan was to delid and if the chip died i could blame it on the power surge to my wife but like I said I couldn't get the blade under the other three corners. I will try again when the money is available to replace the chip. Still able to run at 4.8 which serves my needs but would be nice to see 5 or 5.1 ghz.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I decided to try to delid today since I had no power still from sandy and not too much else to do. Not sure if it is because of how tight my d14 mount was but I could only enter on one corner of the chip. I was using cvs one sided razor blades that came in a 10 pack but with no money to back up a dead chip I had to quit and just put the chip back in. I did change the Tim to liquid ultra hopefully I can get a couple degrees off of just doing that. My original plan was to delid and if the chip died i could blame it on the power surge to my wife but like I said I couldn't get the blade under the other three corners. I will try again when the money is available to replace the chip. Still able to run at 4.8 which serves my needs but would be nice to see 5 or 5.1 ghz.


I just entered one corner and moved around using that.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That seems like the best way to go around it...Enter a corner and wiggle your way through the rest. Safer for the pcb, specially with a plastic sharp and thin object.


----------



## chronicfx

I thought about doing that but the corner I was able to enter was a top corner and as I turned the blade it kept knicking into the notch which kind of worried me.

Question.. If you tilt the blade up in the middle do the outer edges of the blade stay up too? Like using thumb on top and index finger underneath tilting the blade upwards and wiggling back and forth I wasn't worried about the middle of the blade but the outer edges I felt concerned about plowing into the pcb.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That seems like the best way to go around it...Enter a corner and wiggle your way through the rest. Safer for the pcb, specially with a plastic sharp and thin object.


What's an example of a plastic sharp and thin object? Did you do he fishing line yet Val?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> What's an example of a plastic sharp and thin object? Did you do he fishing line yet Val?


not yet waiting on the guy to pm me about sending me his. but the pcb will be fine as long as your careful I can't stress that enough lol.


----------



## kzim9

I did mine tonight after getting it in the mail. Never even ran it. Pretty easy and took no time but still have to clean it up and lap the lid. Will post pics


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> I did mine tonight after getting it in the mail. Never even ran it. Pretty easy and took no time but still have to clean it up and lap the lid. Will post pics


Thats what im talking about does not even test it de lid that sucker and go!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> I did mine tonight after getting it in the mail. Never even ran it. Pretty easy and took no time but still have to clean it up and lap the lid. Will post pics


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Thats what im talking about does not even test it de lid that sucker and go!


Yup thats what we do here...and say screw those vcore barries and go way beyond them!








Good job delidding it!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I decided to try to delid today since I had no power still from sandy and not too much else to do. Not sure if it is because of how tight my d14 mount was but I could only enter on one corner of the chip. I was using cvs one sided razor blades that came in a 10 pack but with no money to back up a dead chip I had to quit and just put the chip back in. I did change the Tim to liquid ultra hopefully I can get a couple degrees off of just doing that. My original plan was to delid and if the chip died i could blame it on the power surge to my wife but like I said I couldn't get the blade under the other three corners. I will try again when the money is available to replace the chip. Still able to run at 4.8 which serves my needs but would be nice to see 5 or 5.1 ghz.


Sounds like you are closer than you think if you got one corner started already. I think you can slowly work it down one or the other sides toward another coner - just take your time. Also, consider getting it (and the glue) warmer before you try again. Most of the time it is the first coner thats the toughest one - and you already have that one done!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> I did mine tonight after getting it in the mail. Never even ran it. Pretty easy and took no time but still have to clean it up and lap the lid. Will post pics


Talk about someone who knows what they want and is ready to do what it takes to make it happen!

Let us know how it goes as soon as you get it running!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> We can't just hand reps out sp easily. This kinda bugs me to, especially as an Eagle scout where I went through 14 years of training to earn that right. Rep to me is kind of the same thing now something to just be handed out but to be earned. I rarely rep people because they don't provide much info really. I once had a 100 message long pm talk with a member a while back and he asked if he should rep me and what it means. I told him that basically rep to me means that you will vouch that the information they gave you actually helped you gain better knowledge you didn't have before and that its a personal look of whether you think they deserve it.
> 
> Rep isn't to just be handed out, its ment to be an honor, not Halloween candy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry to be strict but that's how I am.


yep


----------



## Hokies83

Bring it on Fellas!

http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1235577

Download it here http://browser.primatelabs.com/


----------



## Hokies83

I got bad news about Crysis 3 boys....

Game maxxed out.. 20fps... And that was only on my 1080i monitor....

LoL unless they do some hella work to it that is....

Was a Slide show i could not play it.. and that was only a game with 12 ppl in it...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bring it on Fellas!
> 
> http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1235577
> 
> Download it here http://browser.primatelabs.com/


I gave it a try at 5GHz and 1866 9-9-9-24 1T RAM - just below your score.....

http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1235808

What OC were you running it at?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I gave it a try at 5GHz and 1866 9-9-9-24 1T RAM - just below your score.....
> 
> http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1235808
> 
> What OC were you running it at?


5.1ghz 2400mhz ram 10-12-12-31 t2

Not much diff i seen one of a 4.8ghz 3770k and it was only like 200 points diff.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bring it on Fellas!
> http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1235577
> Download it here http://browser.primatelabs.com/


???


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ???


Bench mark it takes 40 seconds and runs a bunch.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bench mark it takes 40 seconds and runs a bunch.


hmm


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I thought about doing that but the corner I was able to enter was a top corner and as I turned the blade it kept knicking into the notch which kind of worried me.
> Question.. If you tilt the blade up in the middle do the outer edges of the blade stay up too? Like using thumb on top and index finger underneath tilting the blade upwards and wiggling back and forth I wasn't worried about the middle of the blade but the outer edges I felt concerned about plowing into the pcb.


I never let either edge of the blade enter under the IHS, I did quite a bit of prying it off the PCB.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ???
> 
> 
> 
> Bench mark it takes 40 seconds and runs a bunch.
Click to expand...

Its a pretty cool benchmark - worth the download and running for fun. Show us your score for 5GHz.


----------



## midniteboss

This is after applying Liquid Pro on the die.

Keep in mind that I'm running 8k Small FFT's on Prime so my temperatures are a lot hotter then if I was running just regular blend. 

Here are my idle temps.


I already know that I am 100% stable, that's why I didn't run Prime any longer. Just wanted a quick show of my temperatures. Before I did this my temperatures were all over the place and they were also 10 degrees hotter.

I'm using 1.265 volts with an offset voltage.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *midniteboss*
> 
> This is after applying Liquid Pro on the die.
> 
> Keep in mind that I'm running 8k Small FFT's on Prime so my temperatures are a lot hotter then if I was running just regular blend.
> 
> Here are my idle temps.
> 
> I already know that I am 100% stable, that's why I didn't run Prime any longer. Just wanted a quick show of my temperatures. Before I did this my temperatures were all over the place and they were also 10 degrees hotter.
> 
> I'm using 1.265 volts with an offset voltage.


Nice low temps *midniteboss* - good job there!


----------



## feniks

huh ... played with Cinebench 11.5 and realized that while it keeps CPU pretty cool during the benchmarking run it stresses the hell out of it ... way more than OBT in MAX mode ... and all that in what 1-2 minutes? LOL! needed to revise my 4.9GHz for WHEA occurrences under Cine ... unfortunately 5.0GHz slipped out of my grasp now due to (cinebench'es) higher vcore needs and my hot ambient room temp reaching 30C at computer inlet ... backed down to daily 4.9Ghz ... thinking that Cinebench will become my new primary OC stress tester on a new CPU - it's very fast, not too hot and pretty effective









anyhow, that's my 3770K running 5.0GHz (with WHEA warnings during Cine) with 2x4GB RAM @ 2400MHz 10-12-11-31 2T @ 1.65V, scored 10.10










Uploaded with ImageShack.us

you guys need faster RAM to beat that Xeon score, especially that you can actually run Cinebench at 5.1 GHz (I can't temps too high and/or cine crash).


----------



## Valgaur

Thats what i got. got my memory to do 8-8-8-24 at 1600 Mhz but couldn't get it any lower or faster.

http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1236083

Also.....Little Franky did it again!!!

Nah just kidding I tried for 5.6Ghz but after getting to *1.960* vcore lol......I decided 2 tries was enough. I did however try to make some runs of wprime at 8-8-8-24 ram and I got 4.76 seconds on the 32M run. Also did some Cinebenches again as well. we are all so close to those xeons lol. I can't wait for my new RAM I truly can't I want it so badly.


Heres what i do to bench


----------



## ivanlabrie

What's with all the amd style ram ocs??
Cl9 or even 10 and 2200mhz should be easy for an ivy chip.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> What's with all the amd style ram ocs??
> Cl9 or even 10 and 2200mhz should be easy for an ivy chip.


?????


----------



## VonDutch

5.0ghz geekbench
http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1236284


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ?????


Ivy loves the speed, higher mem frequency opens up the bandwidth.

Not delidded but a GB run I did with ivy a few months ago to compare


----------



## VonDutch

guys, you think a bad/corrupt windows can affect OC's?
or voltages used to get to a oc?

if i start cinebench, my screen/desktop freezes for 20-30 sec,
if i open textdoc's, it freezes, doesnt show text in it etc..same,
have to wait for 10-15 sec, then it shows up..

2 days ago, my (second) hdd was "gone", windows didnt see it anymore,
yesterday it only showed that error, no problems yet today with that error

Ntfs, event ID 55
The file system structure on the disk is corrupt and unusable.
Please run the chkdsk utility on the volume drive.

1 more Q. about degradation,
does it affect all OC's,
or could it be the lower, 4.5-4.8ghz stay the same,
but need more Vcore for the 4.9-5.3+ghz oc's?


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> guys, you think a bad/corrupt windows can affect OC's?
> or voltages used to get to a oc?
> if i start cinebench, my screen/desktop freezes for 20-30 sec,
> if i open textdoc's, it freezes, doesnt show text in it etc..same,
> have to wait for 10-15 sec, then it shows up..
> 2 days ago, my (second) hdd was "gone", windows didnt see it anymore,
> yesterday it only showed that error, no problems yet today with that error
> Ntfs, event ID 55
> The file system structure on the disk is corrupt and unusable.
> Please run the chkdsk utility on the volume drive.
> 1 more Q. about degradation,
> does it affect all OC's,
> or could it be the lower, 4.5-4.8ghz stay the same,
> but need more Vcore for the 4.9-5.3+ghz oc's?


It's the other way around, I'm pretty sure if your overclock isn't stable Windows will end up corrupted!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> It's the other way around, I'm pretty sure if your overclock isn't stable Windows will end up corrupted!


yea, i have no problem with my normal daily oc, nice n stable,
i still have no changes in the Vcore needed for my daily oc,
but my feeling says, with higher oc's i start to need more vcore, especially above 5.1ghz,
5.0ghz and lower is still the same with vcore..thats why i asked about the degradation..

its when i do benching, high oc's, and get bsod's etc, when windows start to act crazy..lol
and i cant reset that, currupt is corrupt..even going back a few days with backup and restore,
still the same problem..


----------



## chronicfx

My power here is still not on but I feel concerned about my choice of Tim now. I put liquid ultra between the ihs and my d14 has anyone removed a heat sink from liquid ultra yet? Not pro. Has anyone tried to remove after a few weeks or a month? I am going to try to delid again but it may not be for a little while.


----------



## bao28

Hi, i'm just wondering would a knife like this one be ok to delid the cpu?

Last time I played with a light duty knife, i lightly poked a hole on my finger and it slowly spurted out like a fountain... this ones a heavy duty...

I am just waiting on my liquid pro which should arrive next week sometime, hopefully monday before I cut my cpu open.

Getting a bit nervous now @@ as the time before putting my $200 at risk is coming closer


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I got bad news about Crysis 3 boys....
> Game maxxed out.. 20fps... And that was only on my 1080i monitor....
> LoL unless they do some hella work to it that is....
> Was a Slide show i could not play it.. and that was only a game with 12 ppl in it...


Im in the process of downloading it. That sucks, hopefully they work somthign out so that those up us without quad fire/SLI can play it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bao28*
> 
> 
> 
> Hi, i'm just wondering would a knife like this one be ok to delid the cpu?
> 
> Last time I played with a light duty knife, i lightly poked a hole on my finger and it slowly spurted out like a fountain... this ones a heavy duty...
> 
> I am just waiting on my liquid pro which should arrive next week sometime, hopefully monday before I cut my cpu open.
> 
> Getting a bit nervous now @@ as the time before putting my $200 at risk is coming closer


I would not use that, although some would. I would use a single-sided razor blade instead. I feel the razor blade would provide for more control and thus be safer (in every way!).


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> It's the other way around, I'm pretty sure if your overclock isn't stable Windows will end up corrupted!
> 
> 
> 
> yea, i have no problem with my normal daily oc, nice n stable,
> i still have no changes in the Vcore needed for my daily oc,
> but my feeling says, with higher oc's i start to need more vcore, especially above 5.1ghz,
> 5.0ghz and lower is still the same with vcore..thats why i asked about the degradation..
> 
> its when i do benching, high oc's, and get bsod's etc, when windows start to act crazy..lol
> and i cant reset that, currupt is corrupt..even going back a few days with backup and restore,
> still the same problem..
Click to expand...

We know that with OC'ing we get many BSODs and programs crashing and such which do corrupt the OS over time. You have to reload your windows after awhile as these events accumulate. You may just be there now, and it is what I would do at this point if that was my system to see if that fixes the problem(s).

On the chip degradation, it would be good to see how it runs after the OS reload, but I don't think you or any of us would be too surprised if it does end up degraded a little after what we put these chips through! I hope not, but that is one of the risks we take in doing this fun stuff - part of the price for the fun!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats what i got. got my memory to do 8-8-8-24 at 1600 Mhz but couldn't get it any lower or faster.
> 
> http://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench2/1236083
> 
> Also.....Little Franky did it again!!!
> 
> Nah just kidding I tried for 5.6Ghz but after getting to *1.960* vcore lol......I decided 2 tries was enough. I did however try to make some runs of wprime at 8-8-8-24 ram and I got 4.76 seconds on the 32M run. Also did some Cinebenches again as well. we are all so close to those xeons lol. I can't wait for my new RAM I truly can't I want it so badly.
> 
> Heres what i do to bench


Looks like your RAM, their settings, or your IB IMC is the issue. Hope it is just your RAM as that will fix the problem and we will see better scores for lots of your benches. If it is the IMC, then you will need a new chip!

Wow - on that vcore....! Franky is one tough chip!

Do you have a roommate? Because he might think you are crazy! LOL


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ?????
> 
> 
> 
> Ivy loves the speed, higher mem frequency opens up the bandwidth.
> 
> Not delidded but a GB run I did with ivy a few months ago to compare
Click to expand...

Impressive, as always - good chip


----------



## Valgaur

I can't wait for my 2400 mhz gskill memory. I want to see those speeeds and better benches!


----------



## jprovido

how dangerous is delidding the cpu? my i5 3570k runs so hot but when I ouch my NH-D14 it's not getting hot at all lol. i want more oc headroom on my chip


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> how dangerous is delidding the cpu? my i5 3570k runs so hot but when I ouch my NH-D14 it's not getting hot at all lol. i want more oc headroom on my chip


Well if you don't take your time or go slow you could end up with a expensive keychain. but if you follow the guide in the beginning of this thread carefully you shouldn't have any issues.


----------



## Lil-Diabo

I'd like to join...

OCN name: Lil-Diabo
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Shin-Etsu X23-7783D
Mhz gained: Still Testing
OC after delid: No Current OC
Temp drops: 6 Degrees
CPU-Z validation of max OC: None Yet
http://img835.imageshack.us/i/img4217w.jpg


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lil-Diabo*
> 
> I'd like to join...
> 
> OCN name: Lil-Diabo
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Shin-Etsu X23-7783D
> Mhz gained: Still Testing
> OC after delid: No Current OC
> Temp drops: 6 Degrees
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: None Yet
> http://img835.imageshack.us/i/img4217w.jpg


Welcome - we are happy to have you! We hope you can enjoy high OCs with nice low temps like the rest of us!

Note: The temp drop you see so far is very small due to your not running with an OC yet. If you had done an IBT run at 4.5GHz before delidding and compared that to a 4.5GHz run after delidding, then you would have seen a much larger temp gain than just 6C.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> how dangerous is delidding the cpu? my i5 3570k runs so hot but when I ouch my NH-D14 it's not getting hot at all lol. i want more oc headroom on my chip


Risk is low if you take your time. Plenty of good info here and elsewhere on how to do it right, yet there is always a risk. The temp gains are very worth it though if you like to OC and want/need to remove the IB temp barrier to go further. If your not going to OC, then maybe the low risk is not worth it. I'm happy I delidded and would do it again!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I can't wait for my 2400 mhz gskill memory. I want to see those speeeds and better benches!


I'm looking forward to them too - just to see how much better your benching will be and if they make franky happy!


----------



## Valgaur

I shall be updating the information like the person who submitted later tonight since im at work lol. PPwargamer...quit posting 4 times in a row


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I shall be updating the information like the person who submitted later tonight since im at work lol. PPwargamer...quit posting 4 times in a row


You talk to Dwood yet?


----------



## kzim9

I can't believe the concave on this IHS. Still working at it....

Just the pics like I said I would post


----------



## chronicfx

So I decided to take the chip out and push a bit harder this time.. I am officially de-lidded!!!! I have some pics but I won't be able to post them until my power is back on. I can use intel burntest 2.54 at 5.0ghz on air now and stay just below 100. Which is awesome, did not like the 1.47ish voltage for a 24/7 thing so I am priming 4.9 to see if it is happy at 1.416v. Just passed the 8k and the max temp is 89 degrees. Very nice improvement and now I can run 4.9 as a 24/7 on air. What more could you ask for?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So I decided to take the chip out and push a bit harder this time.. I am officially de-lidded!!!! I have some pics but I won't be able to post them until my power is back on. I can use intel burntest 2.54 at 5.0ghz on air now and stay just below 100. Which is awesome, did not like the 1.47ish voltage for a 24/7 thing so I am priming 4.9 to see if it is happy at 1.416v. Just passed the 8k and the max temp is 89 degrees. Very nice improvement and now I can run 4.9 as a 24/7 on air. What more could you ask for?


Ivy is good to 1.52 And past that we do not know yet.. I run 1.55V 24/7.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lil-Diabo*
> 
> I'd like to join...
> OCN name: Lil-Diabo
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Shin-Etsu X23-7783D
> Mhz gained: Still Testing
> OC after delid: No Current OC
> Temp drops: 6 Degrees
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: None Yet
> http://img835.imageshack.us/i/img4217w.jpg


Accepted!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I'm looking forward to them too - just to see how much better your benching will be and if they make franky happy!


I know\. soon next week.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You talk to Dwood yet?


Yes we are talking back and forth getting stuff figured out.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So I decided to take the chip out and push a bit harder this time.. I am officially de-lidded!!!! I have some pics but I won't be able to post them until my power is back on. I can use intel burntest 2.54 at 5.0ghz on air now and stay just below 100. Which is awesome, did not like the 1.47ish voltage for a 24/7 thing so I am priming 4.9 to see if it is happy at 1.416v. Just passed the 8k and the max temp is 89 degrees. Very nice improvement and now I can run 4.9 as a 24/7 on air. What more could you ask for?


NICE! can't wait for pics and such!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know\. soon next week.
> *Yes we are talking back and forth getting stuff figured out.*
> NICE! can't wait for pics and such!










i had to Rep you for that









Now start a Thread with Dwood .... " Dwood Mods Cosmos2" Suggestions ideas etc..


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ivy is good to 1.52 And past that we do not know yet.. I run 1.55V 24/7.


Since i use my 3770k for crunching 24/7 i am a little sceptical whether i could use such a high vcore. I need 1.32v for 4.7ghz (50c max) and 1.36v for 4.8ghz (55c max) and i was thinking to settle for 4.7ghz. If you use your pc just for gaming thats another story though. Ofc crunching at 5ghz would be damn sick







But temps are not a concern, high vcore is.


----------



## Blueberryjr

Will my cpu die at 100c? just wanted to know, the temps are around 95-97


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blueberryjr*
> 
> Will my cpu die at 100c? just wanted to know, the temps are around 95-97


are those high temps? is that from Prime or gaming?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Since i use my 3770k for crunching 24/7 i am a little sceptical whether i could use such a high vcore. I need 1.32v for 4.7ghz (50c max) and 1.36v for 4.8ghz (55c max) and i was thinking to settle for 4.7ghz. If you use your pc just for gaming thats another story though. Ofc crunching at 5ghz would be damn sick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But temps are not a concern, high vcore is.


I video edit all the time..

I would say 1.5v to be extra safe if your have 100% Cpu use for long periods of time.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ivy is good to 1.52 And past that we do not know yet.. I run 1.55V 24/7.


What clockspeed needs 1.55? I am priming at 1.5v right now for 5ghz. Temps after 8k ffts was 103 but didnt log. Hopefully it will still be priming when i get home tonight. Is motherboard ok for that voltage? People say it isnt.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> What clockspeed needs 1.55? I am priming at 1.5v right now for 5ghz. Temps after 8k ffts was 103 but didnt log. Hopefully it will still be priming when i get home tonight. Is motherboard ok for that voltage? People say it isnt.


Nobody overclcoks on the same volts but 1.55v is 5.1ghz

I donno about ASRock.. PPL swear by them.. But they have to be cutting costs of the board somewhere to sell them so cheap.. I heard it was in Power phases and such.. You would have to ask Sin0822 about it..


----------



## Blueberryjr

FROM prime, Gaming never really goes over 70c even when xsplit is on but on prime i get around 100c-102c is that safe?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Nobody overclcoks on the same volts but 1.55s 5.1ghz
> I donno about ASRock.. PPL swear by them.. But they have to be cutting costs of the board somewhere to sell them so cheap.. I heard it was in Power phases and such.. You would have to ask Sin0822 about it..


What i remember reading from sin was that he didnt beleive the power phases were really digital like asrock claimed. He also felt it was doomed to fail eventually. I know he knows his stuff like you said he is doing his masters a georgia tech in elec. Eng. Thats not easy. But is it possible he is being hard on them from personal opinion for having the name asrock?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> What i remember reading from sin was that he didnt beleive the power phases were really digital like asrock claimed. He also felt it was doomed to fail eventually. I know he knows his stuff like you said he is doing his masters a georgia tech in elec. Eng. Thats not easy. But is it possible he is being hard on them from personal opinion for having the name asrock?


No Sin and i are good friends and he is not Bias in anyway he Speaks the truth when ever he speaks.

He tests Many boards and if it is great he will say it is no matter what the brand is.

But on a side note.. The z77 line of boards make you feel sorry for the AM3+ people those boards are really sad lol.. And there not failing left and right.. So as far as failing goes i donno.


----------



## Valgaur

For all the people priming at 100C please stop doing so. I know the tjmax is higher but heat damages the hardware just as badly as vcore does. So do your chip a favor and. Let it cool down. That's far far to hot to do stability runs on guys. Love and respect your chips. Could you operate fully at 212 degrees farenheit??


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blueberryjr*
> 
> FROM prime, Gaming never really goes over 70c even when xsplit is on but on prime i get around 100c-102c is that safe?


I wouldn't run it more then 95c personally. but how long do you run prime for?

@ Hokies, as far as the Asrock boards... imagine if they started failing? that would suck. lol. Considering how much cheaper they are compared to others, who knows where they cut costs...i don't want to know. lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I wouldn't run it more then 95c personally. but how long do you run prime for?
> @ Hokies, as far as the Asrock boards... imagine if they started failing? that would suck. lol. Considering how much cheaper they are compared to others, who knows where they cut costs...i don't want to know. lol.


LoL why i just buy the higher end gigabyte / Asus which ever is best price per performance ratio at the time.. no need to worry lol.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL why i just buy the higher end gigabyte / Asus which ever is best price per performance ratio at the time.. no need to worry lol.


I don't worry but could you imagine? I'm going to run this rig til it blows up. haha


----------



## JQuantum

Give me maybe a month or two but I'll probably be getting a i5-3570k to pair with my i7-3770k .... or should I wait lol. These things aren't difficult to delid after the first so I wouldn't mind IB headroom so far


----------



## maestrobg

after 2 weeks a have delidded my 3770k , temps started to raise about 30 c!!!

i opened the socket and remove ihs again... my noctua NTH 1 was spreaded all over cpu and the center of cpu was without thermal paste at all!!!

then i decide to pun Coollaboratory liquid ultra....

and boom!!!

I get this results 140 gflops! vcore was 1.52 v!!! and even with that high vcore my temps in linx were max 90 C which is very good!



p.s. i think that this sample of 3770k is not so good , maybe with some other cpu i colud get 5ghz stable in linx with this vcore 1.52v, but i am satisfied because BEFORE REMOVING IHS , I CUOLDNT GET LINX STABLE WHEN VCORE WAS OVER 1.25V !!! AND MY TEMPS WENT TO 100 C !!!


----------



## Lil-Diabo

Has anyone had any adverse results after delidding?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maestrobg*
> 
> after 2 weeks a have delidded my 3770k , temps started to raise about 30 c!!!
> i opened the socket and remove ihs again... my noctua NTH 1 was spreaded all over cpu and the center of cpu was without thermal paste at all!!!
> then i decide to pun Coollaboratory liquid ultra....
> and boom!!!
> I get this results 140 gflops! vcore was 1.52 v!!! and even with that high vcore my temps in linx were max 90 C which is very good!
> 
> p.s. i think that this sample of 3770k is not so good , maybe with some other cpu i colud get 5ghz stable in linx with this vcore 1.52v, but i am satisfied because BEFORE REMOVING IHS , I CUOLDNT GET LINX STABLE WHEN VCORE WAS OVER 1.25V !!! AND MY TEMPS WENT TO 100 C !!![/quohear
> 
> That's what I like to hear!
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Lil-Diabo*
> 
> Has anyone had any adverse results after delidding?
> 
> 
> 
> None so far. Been over a month and physically and technically speaking mechanics wise there shouldn't be any at all.
Click to expand...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> For all the people priming at 100C please stop doing so. I know the tjmax is higher but heat damages the hardware just as badly as vcore does. So do your chip a favor and. Let it cool down. That's far far to hot to do stability runs on guys. Love and respect your chips. Could you operate fully at 212 degrees farenheit??


Just got a call (computer is at my dads cause he has power) p95 application stopped working about 3 hours in. Would you say that 5ghz is out of reach for me since i cannot burn it or prime it or should i raise the vcore 2 notches and use it normally until i notice instability?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Just got a call (computer is at my dads cause he has power) p95 application stopped working about 3 hours in. Would you say that 5ghz is out of reach for me since i cannot burn it or prime it or should i raise the vcore 2 notches and use it normally until i notice instability?


What are your temps? If not reaching 90s then yeah bump vcore by .02 or even .03


----------



## SimpleTech

Just tried delidding my 3770K and I'm getting a DRAM error on my Asus P8Z77-V Deluxe. Put in my i3-3225 and was able to POST.

_/sigh_


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What are your temps? If not reaching 90s then yeah bump vcore by .02 or even .03


Temps in prime will log 105 for a core if i bump my
Vcore up. But gaming is the most strenuous thing i do and that will stay below 70. Any advice?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> Just tried delidding my 3770K and I'm getting a DRAM error on my Asus P8Z77-V Deluxe. Put in my i3-3225 and was able to POST.
> _/sigh_


Take pics of your chip if its having issues so we can help. If its dram try reseating your RAM somtimes we make sillys.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Temps in prime will log 105 for a core if i bump my
> Vcore up. But gaming is the most strenuous thing i do and that will stay below 70. Any advice?


Don't prime it then. Its not worth frying your chip to say yeah it WAS stable at 5 for 12 hours. Just do a 4.8 or something. And if you really wanna say you did 5.0 prime stable then your gonna have to delid that baby. Temps are your enemy this round guys. Not vcore.


----------



## Lil-Diabo

I was lucky

I delidded mine and I think I must have done something to the CPU cos now I can't use my 2nd Ram slot

Sorry to hear about your chip thou


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lil-Diabo*
> 
> I was lucky
> I delidded mine and I think I must have done something to the CPU cos now I can't use my 2nd Ram slot
> Sorry to hear about your chip thou


Sure it isn't a bent pin or heatsink clamped down too tight? I think it's something with z77 motherboards, at least the ones I've used make it easy to take out a memory channel. My asus board will lose a channel if the heatsink is on a bit too tight, another just has a dead channel now, gotten one new in box with a dead channel. In all my cases it wasn't the cpu, but the board/socket.


----------



## SimpleTech

Got some good news. Turns out I didn't kill my CPU. Luckily I had a spare board and was able to get it to POST. So I'm thinking that maybe there might be a socket pin that is slightly misaligned which is probably the case anyways since I bought it from a seller who repairs computer parts.


----------



## Lil-Diabo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sure it isn't a bent pin or heatsink clamped down too tight? I think it's something with z77 motherboards, at least the ones I've used make it easy to take out a memory channel. My asus board will lose a channel if the heatsink is on a bit too tight, another just has a dead channel now, gotten one new in box with a dead channel. In all my cases it wasn't the cpu, but the board/socket.


I actually posted something in the Intel CPU thread about it.
Ive got a asrock z77 extreme4-M
Ever since I delidded and remounted the specific ram slot hasn't worked. I did slightly nick the wafer. But nothing extreme.
I did clamp down the heatsink as tight as I could. I hope that's the case. Will definitely try and remount again

Thanks!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lil-Diabo*
> 
> I actually posted something in the Intel CPU thread about it.
> Ive got a asrock z77 extreme4-M
> Ever since I delidded and remounted the specific ram slot hasn't worked. I did slightly nick the wafer. But nothing extreme.
> I did clamp down the heatsink as tight as I could. I hope that's the case. Will definitely try and remount again
> Thanks!


kinda odd. my waterblock is a Dangerden M6.. I tighten it down by hand until the thumb nuts are within a millimeter of bottoming out. I'd be scared to tighten anymore.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Don't prime it then. Its not worth frying your chip to say yeah it WAS stable at 5 for 12 hours. Just do a 4.8 or something. And if you really wanna say you did 5.0 prime stable then your gonna have to delid that baby. Temps are your enemy this round guys. Not vcore.


[email protected] stays under 90 in prime. I will go with that for 24/7.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Really considering this for the holidays.. I'm new to anything like this at all.

I'd love to test it on an older CPU.. But I don't have any TIM ones, they're all soldered I think.

I've got two E2140's and access to some form of Celeron, and some other E6xxx CPU's if I really need to, are any of these TIM'd..?


----------



## SimpleTech

Got about a 13.75°C average drop! Used MX-2 on both the die and IHS.

*Before:* 76 - 89 - 83 - 78



*After:* 62 - 71 - 71 - 67


----------



## kzim9

I was just going to try MX-4 for both, but I think I will see better drops with Cool Lab Pro. I need this chip running for the Folding Wars so I may have to do the MX-4


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> I was just going to try MX-4 for both, but I think I will see better drops with Cool Lab Pro. I need this chip running for the Folding Wars so I may have to do the MX-4


Yup same here I am getting ready for it man. whats funny is that I can fold at 4.5 Ghz easily and be at 50 C with just pk-3 on my die and my IHs. I have Indigo Xtreme ready for when I have time to be DIY lol.


----------



## jprovido

i hate my i5 3570k/ it runs so hot and my NH-d14 isn't even getting warm. I even tried opening my side panel and tried touching the heatpipes close to the cpu and it's not even warm









im running prime95 right now. 4.5ghz @ 1.28v and 5 minutes in my hottest core maxed out already at 90 degrees (the rest are low 80's). what is the safe temperature for stress testing anyway? I'm getting really frustrated I'm really considering delidding this stupid thing


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> i hate my i5 3570k/ it runs so hot and my NH-d14 isn't even getting warm. I even tried opening my side panel and tried touching the heatpipes close to the cpu and it's not even warm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im running prime95 right now. 4.5ghz @ 1.28v and 5 minutes in my hottest core maxed out already at 90 degrees (the rest are low 80's). what is the safe temperature for stress testing anyway? I'm getting really frustrated I'm really considering delidding this stupid thing


Yeah, I'm in a similar boat except my 3570k is a bit less superior to yours.
My $100 SB-E doesn't even get warm.. I can turn the fans off and it only gains a few c in temps. I can do 4.4GHz at 1.31c and de-lidding will lower this because the core operates better at lower temps.. It depends how badly it has been TIM'd to the IHS.


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> i hate my i5 3570k/ it runs so hot and my NH-d14 isn't even getting warm. I even tried opening my side panel and tried touching the heatpipes close to the cpu and it's not even warm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im running prime95 right now. 4.5ghz @ 1.28v and 5 minutes in my hottest core maxed out already at 90 degrees (the rest are low 80's). what is the safe temperature for stress testing anyway? I'm getting really frustrated I'm really considering delidding this stupid thing


I say just do it. I also have a NH-D14 and was dumbfounded how hot mine got before. Now I'm within comfortable levels and have a little room for more if I ever need wish to.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> i hate my i5 3570k/ it runs so hot and my NH-d14 isn't even getting warm. I even tried opening my side panel and tried touching the heatpipes close to the cpu and it's not even warm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im running prime95 right now. 4.5ghz @ 1.28v and 5 minutes in my hottest core maxed out already at 90 degrees (the rest are low 80's). what is the safe temperature for stress testing anyway? I'm getting really frustrated I'm really considering delidding this stupid thing


Keep in mind your heat from the cores can't reach the heatsink because of one reason. the amount of TIM on the die and the crapiness of the die. when the bad stuff is gone and better stuff is in....you will feel the heat then. Your IHS is basically locking it in lol.


----------



## jprovido

encourage me more please. I'm this close in doing it right now. ima create a thread just to even out the playing field for the adventurous enthusaists and the conservative ones lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Really considering this for the holidays.. I'm new to anything like this at all.
> I'd love to test it on an older CPU.. But I don't have any TIM ones, they're all soldered I think.
> I've got two E2140's and access to some form of Celeron, and some other E6xxx CPU's if I really need to, are any of these TIM'd..?


775 celerons are glued...I think, if they are single core ones ofc.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Keep in mind your heat from the cores can't reach the heatsink because of one reason. the amount of TIM on the die and the crapiness of the die. when the bad stuff is gone and better stuff is in....you will feel the heat then. Your IHS is basically locking it in lol.


QFT


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> encourage me more please. I'm this close in doing it right now. ima create a thread just to even out the playing field for the adventurous enthusaists and the conservative ones lol




How about that? does that make you want to do it?

or maybe this one...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 775 celerons are glued...I think, if they are single core ones ofc.
> QFT


Thanks +rep
I almost have an unlimited supply of those.. I'll take a look tomorrow or thursday.. Could be interesting. Maybe I could test with it and the OEM HS/F?









EDIT: It was defiently a single core.. I'll see if i can nab a couple for testing. I just need a blade now.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> 
> How about that? does that make you want to do it?
> or maybe this one...


That makes me want water cooling... Badly.


----------



## jprovido

http://www.overclock.net/t/1323797/my-hot-3570k-to-delid-or-not-to-delid-that-is-the-question/0_30

thread that I just made.

damn I can't even run Intel Burn Test on my i5 3570k. the temps make me go "yikes its too damn high". I'm fooling myself saying I only use my pc in gaming so i dont neet IBT but deep inside I know this is nor normal


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> That makes me want water cooling... Badly.


That just makes me wanna try again and get a better cpu


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> That makes me want water cooling... Badly.


BY the way thats 24 hour prime stable.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Just ran my 3570k on my SB-E with the fans of.. 90c full load with IBT. Heatpipes get REALLY hot which is what it should be doing anyway.









EDIT: Holy wow.. I just took the fans off because I noticed they were dusty! Big mistake..
One of the clips fell off onto the 7950 and then the screen went black and then "VRRRR" it started going on full speed (The 7950's fan).

It booted fine once I reverted the BIOS back to "Defaults"... hmm I'll try a graphic load once the fans are back on. Wow I was so scared.


----------



## Arm3nian

Well, I delided mine, now i'm running a raystorm and two 480 rads. Getting about 90c on the hottest core at 4.7ghz @1.32v. My cpu is stable at 4.7 at 1.32 but fails at the same clock speed at anything higher lol... I used mx-4 on the die and heatsink, my temps still seem pretty high. On air I use to get 80c at 4.5ghz @1.25v with out deliding. Now on water and delided I don't think I got much of an improvement.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well, I delided mine, now i'm running a raystorm and two 480 rads. Getting about 90c on the hottest core at 4.7ghz @1.32v. My cpu is stable at 4.7 at 1.32 but fails at the same clock speed at anything higher lol... I used mx-4 on the die and heatsink, my temps still seem pretty high. On air I use to get 80c at 4.5ghz @1.25v with out deliding. Now on water and delided I don't think I got much of an improvement.


That definitely doesn't seem right, I have better temps at higher volts on an H80! I think I'd be looking for issues there.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well, I delided mine, now i'm running a raystorm and two 480 rads. Getting about 90c on the hottest core at 4.7ghz @1.32v. My cpu is stable at 4.7 at 1.32 but fails at the same clock speed at anything higher lol... I used mx-4 on the die and heatsink, my temps still seem pretty high. On air I use to get 80c at 4.5ghz @1.25v with out deliding. Now on water and delided I don't think I got much of an improvement.


Thats far to hot sir. did you remove the black glue? if not do so. and use good tim like LP. also does your WC loop have sli or crossfire in it? if so that will heat the whole line up for more than 480's can handle.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats far to hot sir. did you remove the black glue? if not do so. and use good tim like LP. also does your WC loop have sli or crossfire in it? if so that will heat the whole line up for more than 480's can handle.


He'd need a lot more than SLI or CF to overwhelm two 480's! He could cool two entire rigs, both running crossfire or SLI with that much radiator on it!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> He'd need a lot more than SLI or CF to overwhelm two 480's! He could cool two entire rigs, both running crossfire or SLI with that much radiator on it!


Exactly lol then by no means should his chip be so hot lol. I can't wait to get my loop going on this baby. get some really good stuff on here!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats far to hot sir. did you remove the black glue? if not do so. and use good tim like LP. also does your WC loop have sli or crossfire in it? if so that will heat the whole line up for more than 480's can handle.


I removed the black glue on the heatsink, well most of it at least, but it is still there on the pcb, I did not think that would affect temps. I'm running a 690, sold my other 690 to go water. And I think 2x480rads is enough, not many people have that much rad. My case allows me to have 4-5 more 480rads, seems like a waste though right now. I was really planning to hit 5ghz, but at [email protected] I was hitting 103c. I will remount it and see if it yields better temps.


----------



## Swag

After re-seating my CPU again, I re-installed my entire PC again. Should I use Avast or Avira or MSE? I was just wondering.


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I removed the black glue on the heatsink, well most of it at least, but it is still there on the pcb, I did not think that would affect temps. I'm running a 690, sold my other 690 to go water. And I think 2x480rads is enough, not many people have that much rad. My case allows me to have 4-5 more 480rads, seems like a waste though right now. I was really planning to hit 5ghz, but at [email protected] I was hitting 103c. I will remount it and see if it yields better temps.


It seems we have an identical cpu. I also need 1.32v for 4.7ghz but 1.36v for 4.8ghz. Try that. Also change your die tim from mx4 with LP or Phobya LM. These are the best for the die. Is your raystorm new? It may sound silly but have you removed the protection film at the bottom of the cpu block?


----------



## VonDutch

i got a really disturbing mail this morning









*quote* from mail

"If your read the TOS of the site, *it's outlined that what you are doing in the Delidded Ivy Club is against TOS.*

This is a verbal warning sent to you and the others involved. Please do not discuss rep in the forums. Next time it will be infractions."

*end quote*

TOS:

You may NOT:

Discuss any form of Piracy or DMCA violations (for additional information click here)
Create multiple accounts for any reason
*Give rep to anyone else who shares a computer with you or that you personally know
Give rep to someone for the purposes of artificially inflating their rep or for any other reason other than to reward a post that benefits the forum and its members*
Misrepresent yourself as being staff from Overclock.net or anyone else who you are not
You are not to make your login credentials or other sensitive account information available to others by any means, for any reason.
Use profanity. This includes the use of symbols, abbreviations, or acronyms to circumvent the no profanity rule.
Post personally identifiable information or anything else that may jeopardize your privacy and/or safety or that of others
Post questions/remarks relating to a member being banned from the Overclock.net forum or game server. Please contact overclock.net staff directly.
Post questions/remarks pertaining to infractions, warnings or deleted posts. Please contact overclock.net staff directly.
Partake in discussions about politics, race or religion or promote your own views in this area through any other means
Have a signature that exceeds 8 lines in length, or use larger than # 3 font in signatures.
Ask for price appraisals outside of the Appraisals forum. This is viewed as circumventing the forum's For Sale/Trade rules.
*Ask for reputation
Offer reputation for any reason*
Post external links in your profile or signature
Negatively comment on products or prices of the products posted in the For Sale section
Discuss the circumvention of security-related applications
Discuss any other action, substance, or product that is deemed to be illegal in either the US/Canada or the municipality in which you reside.
Ask for free parts or services. (No cyber begging)
PM members with the intent to sell items or services.
Mass edit/delete your own posts. Overclock.net reserves the right to revert any edited post.

if its about the 2 bold lines ..well..didnt know a joke could lead to this,
if forumpeeps think i was doing wrong, please take away my +reps..

EDIT,
nvm..i think they deleted my posts where i "asked" for rep, as a joke!
curious if they delete this one too..

anyways...thanks all for all the info, and everything ive learned,
it was alot, i learned how to OC my chip here, but im done with ocing now,
think i know what my chip can do and cant do ..lol
you guys are great









a "virtual" +rep for everyone


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> After re-seating my CPU again, I re-installed my entire PC again. Should I use Avast or Avira or MSE? I was just wondering.


i like outpost security suite free edition.. all you need for free, and very good protection..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> It seems we have an identical cpu. I also need 1.32v for 4.7ghz but 1.36v for 4.8ghz. Try that. Also change your die tim from mx4 with LP or Phobya LM. These are the best for the die. Is your raystorm new? It may sound silly but have you removed the protection film at the bottom of the cpu block?


met one guy once who really forgot to take off the protection film..funny.


----------



## Hokies83

You may want to edit the warning post from the mod...


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> met one guy once who really forgot to take off the protection film..funny.


I have also done it once. I was so excited to finish my water loop and start overclocking that i totally missed it. Temps sucked and i blamed the poor cpu. LOL. Now you know one more guy


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You may want to edit the warning post from the mod...


im done,
let them do what they want with it ...prolly get deleted too, and another warningmail ..pff


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> After re-seating my CPU again, I re-installed my entire PC again. Should I use Avast or Avira or MSE? I was just wondering.


Avast is very good, I like it's user interface and it's #2 in Anti Virus (that's the free version too)
MSE is terrible and I've never heard of Avira....
Avast is also good if you have a few computers or put it on friends as you can sync it all to an account and it'll tell you if you get a virus on a PC. It also never picks up "virus'" on my "E:" drive which I store all my steam games and such on.. hehe


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im done,
> let them do what they want with it ...prolly get deleted too, and another warningmail ..pff


ROFL... just shrug it off.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Lil question about TIM as I've seen several deliders here using a specific TIM for the die/IHS and another one for the IHS/heatsink.
Why dont you use COOLLABORATORY Liquid Pro for both?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Lil question about TIM as I've seen several deliders here using a specific TIM for the die/IHS and another one for the IHS/heatsink.
> Why dont you use COOLLABORATORY Liquid Pro for both?


Liquid Pro can be difficult to remove. A lot of people still use it on the Heatsink, but some just put it on the die where it will not need to be removed and put a more standard paste on the heatsink.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Liquid Pro can be difficult to remove. .


Oh I see, didn't know that!
Will it even resist to some aceton?

What paste do you recommend for the heatsink then, still AS5?


----------



## kgtuning

I use liquid pro on the die and under my waterblock. you just wipe it off, its not that hard to clean.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Oh I see, didn't know that!
> Will it even resist to some aceton?
> What paste do you recommend for the heatsink then, still AS5?


It's resistant to all chemicals, you need to scrape it off essentially. They may have fixed the issue though, or it may be more prone after long usage, but that's the basic reason.

Also, I'm not really up on the latest TIMs, but I wouldn't recommend AS5 to anyone these days. It is dated and ineffective compared to modern pastes, especially given the burn-in time.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It's resistant to all chemicals, you need to scrape it off essentially. They may have fixed the issue though, or it may be more prone after long usage, but that's the basic reason.
> Also, I'm not really up on the latest TIMs, but I wouldn't recommend AS5 to anyone these days. It is dated and ineffective compared to modern pastes, especially given the burn-in time.


I'm not sure for long term yet but after many weeks of use I took my waterblock off and took the IHS off and the liquid pro was like when I put it on. If you don't want to use that on your heatsink use IC Diamond. I had pretty good luck with it.


----------



## maestrobg

you saw my results.....

i put Liquid ultra on die and noctua nth 1 on ihs....


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I'm not sure for long term yet but after many weeks of use I took my waterblock off and took the IHS off and the liquid pro was like when I put it on. If you don't want to use that on your heatsink use IC Diamond. I had pretty good luck with it.


I think you meant to respond to the guy above me. I never said I had a problem with it, in fact I will be using it when I get mine, I was simply stating the reason for people's choices not to use it on top of the IHS.


----------



## chris-br

I'm really thinking on doing this but i am in Brazil.. Stores here dont have that special tim you guys talk about.... I do have mx-4... Is worth it even with mx-4?









If i try to get to 4.6 temps goes over 90c on ibt........ on prime 14hours stable no whea erros with 76-79-78-71 temps with 4.5oc @ 1,320volts...

you can see here:


And that with ambient temp of 26C.

I'm really afraid of losing this baby in the process.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I think you meant to respond to the guy above me. I never said I had a problem with it, in fact I will be using it when I get mine, I was simply stating the reason for people's choices not to use it on top of the IHS.


oh sorry, I was just saying I haven't had any issues cleaning mine and liquid pro isn't that hard to clean. but I guess time will tell, maybe next year I'll be cursing myself out.. haha.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Thx for the proposals!
No IC Diamond available here, but MX4 yes.
I will first check how hard is it to clean Liquid Pro, and in case it's hard to get rid of it, will use the Noctua paste I will get with the NH-C14. Then MX4 if I think I could improve my temps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Thx for the proposals!
> No IC Diamond available here, but MX4 yes.
> I will first check how hard is it to clean Liquid Pro, and in case it's hard to get rid of it, will use the Noctua paste I will get with the NH-C14. Then MX4 if I think I could improve my temps.


You could use liquid ultra remember that guys. If you don't wanna deal with huss and fuss of the pro. Use ultra.

By the way. Im happy we are getting this much interest in this thread but we gotta stop the multiple posts guys. VonDutch and PcWargamer. Im talking to you guys!


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You could use liquid ultra remember that guys. If you don't wanna deal with huss and fuss of the pro. Use ultra.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources and post #216 in this thread)
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> fluxless solder/solder has a w/mk of 40 to 60,


How could the Ultra be as good as the Pro with barely half its thermal conductivity?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> How could the Ultra be as good as the Pro with barely half its thermal conductivity?


because no one has done a side by side comparison and if you want something better than mx-4 or such than be able to CLEAN the darn stuff off then ultra is your best bet. HOWEVER lol pro is the best. as of what we know. Since no one on here has compared unless I'm being dumb!


----------



## un-nefer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> How could the Ultra be as good as the Pro with barely half its thermal conductivity?


I think the guy you quoted just meant that the LP Ultra is not as much of a PITA to apply and clean (hence his huss and fuss comment)









Having used both, I can say that the Ultra is much less PITA due to it's ability to be cleaned easier - but i still prefer LP pro over it for outright performance










Saying the above, if you are the type of person who constantly pulls your rig apart and/or you remove heatsinks/waterblocks every few months - then I'd suggest you use LP Ultra anyway.


----------



## chris-br

guess I'm getting ignored here.









EDIT. also, if I'm able to get, should i get the PRO or ULTRA.. I saw in other threads that the pro is a pain to remove, if that's true, how do you remove it?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> guess I'm getting ignored here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT. also, if I'm able to get, should i get the PRO or ULTRA.. I saw in other threads that the pro is a pain to remove, if that's true, how do you remove it?


I would go with Pro but thats my opinion. I haven't had an issue cleaning it off anything, but I also haven't had it on anything for more then a month or so. I can't comment on the MX4, I have never used it. I used q tips and paper towel to remove the pro.


----------



## Phobos223

For what its worth I have a tube of the LP Ultra coming in this week and plan to test it out on my 3770K. I have always used AS5 and MX4, so will be fun to see how it stacks up. If anyone has any questions about it feel free to PM me

I have not de-lidded my CPU yet but will be doing so later this week.


----------



## chris-br

Anyone here using mx-4 on both sides?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Anyone here using mx-4 on both sides?


let me check the spreadsheet. also guys on the first posts I have info from TIM to temp drops to OC's and such on a spreadsheet so if you want to know who is using what and their temp drops look there!


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> Got about a 13.75°C average drop! Used MX-2 on both the die and IHS.
> 
> *Before:* 76 - 89 - 83 - 78
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1115435/
> 
> *After:* 62 - 71 - 71 - 67
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1115436/


Just wanted to reiterate on my previous post. Turns out that the sensors were reading my 3770K incorrectly after I did the delid because I was using a 2500K prior so it was using the wrong TJ Max.

Here is what I got running it overnight:



A 10°C on the hottest core isn't half bad IMO. I will order some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro in the coming week. I'm about to bin some 3570K's.


----------



## chris-br

Well. Has anyone in some point used the mx-4 on both sides before going liquid pro or ultra?

edit: i can see that Schmuckley and martinhal are using AS5, so is save to assume that mx-4 will yield better results?

Edit 2: Schmuckley is under water and martinhal doesn't show.. so I'm curious about that 13c drop.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Anyone here using mx-4 on both sides?


You can get Liquid Pro where your at you just order it direct from Cool Labs..

http://coollaboratory.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/3/osCsid/4ad9def99d54567ac3cb7104bb2fc271


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Thanks +rep
> I almost have an unlimited supply of those.. I'll take a look tomorrow or thursday.. Could be interesting. Maybe I could test with it and the OEM HS/F?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: It was defiently a single core.. I'll see if i can nab a couple for testing. I just need a blade now.


Awesome man! You can go for a cpu-z world record with them








Delid and bin xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm really thinking on doing this but i am in Brazil.. Stores here dont have that special tim you guys talk about.... I do have mx-4... Is worth it even with mx-4?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If i try to get to 4.6 temps goes over 90c on ibt........ on prime 14hours stable no whea erros with 76-79-78-71 temps with 4.5oc @ 1,320volts...
> you can see here:
> 
> And that with ambient temp of 26C.
> I'm really afraid of losing this baby in the process.


If you have the original purchase receipt you should be covered...








I live in Argentina and I ordered my Liquid Ultra from Sidewinder computers. Use USPS First Class international shipping and wait for it to arrive, if you aren't too patient use priority mail.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> guess I'm getting ignored here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT. also, if I'm able to get, should i get the PRO or ULTRA.. I saw in other threads that the pro is a pain to remove, if that's true, how do you remove it?


Get PRO! Don't be afraid of it...No need to clean it off.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can get Liquid Pro where your at you just order it direct from Cool Labs..
> http://coollaboratory.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/3/osCsid/4ad9def99d54567ac3cb7104bb2fc271


I'd use Sidewinder computers, much closer to him than a european site, and also cheaper, cause of the money conversion. (Euros, ouch)


----------



## Hokies83

Ocn kinda slow on iPad but if he can not get it shipped there cool labs will.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Well. Has anyone in some point used the mx-4 on both sides before going liquid pro or ultra?
> edit: i can see that Schmuckley and martinhal are using AS5, so is save to assume that mx-4 will yield better results?
> Edit 2: Schmuckley is under water and martinhal doesn't show.. so I'm curious about that 13c drop.


I changed to Mx4 both sides , still only 13 degress drop


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If you have the original purchase receipt you should be covered...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


What are you talking about?

edit: i got it.. very very funny.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I changed to Mx4 both sides , still only 13 degress drop


13c drop still very good. thanks for the answer. +rep for ya

edit 2: are you under water or air cooling?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> What are you talking about?
> edit: i got it.. very very funny.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 13c drop still very good. thanks for the answer. +rep for ya
> edit 2: are you under water or air cooling?


You got that hopefully...I don't have a receipt, so I'll probably will have to ship my cpu back the US in case my delidding went wrong.

Trust me, buy from Sidewinder computers, they do ship to South America and their price is good. Use first class international (takes between 10 and 30 days)


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You got that hopefully...I don't have a receipt, so I'll probably will have to ship my cpu back the US in case my delidding went wrong.
> Trust me, buy from Sidewinder computers, they do ship to South America and their price is good. Use first class international (takes between 10 and 30 days)


I hope you're not expecting to be able to return it if you screw up... I think you will find yourself extremely disappointed.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You got that hopefully...I don't have a receipt, so I'll probably will have to ship my cpu back the US in case my delidding went wrong.
> Trust me, buy from Sidewinder computers, they do ship to South America and their price is good. Use first class international (takes between 10 and 30 days)


Well. My father is going to Florida this week, so he will bring one for me, and i decided on the PRO.. Is even cheaper.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool!

And, yeah, I hope my chip lived...I won't be able to get a new cpu for a month or two. And that would SUCK!


----------



## chris-br

I'll be doing this ONLY after christmas. I'm a teacher here and end of the year is crazy busy for me.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'll be doing this ONLY after christmas. I'm a teacher here and end of the year is crazy busy for me.


I need to find tim eto lap my IB.....I'm the leader here. I need to show it lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Oh, too bad...guess you are a bit hard on your students if you're so busy huh?


----------



## chris-br

2 schools, 29 classes per week and like 950 students......


----------



## ivanlabrie

Dang! Oh, that sounds harsh...but well, have fun while you're at it, the wait will make the reward much better in the end.


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need to find tim eto lap my IB.....I'm the leader here. I need to show it lol.


What you (we) need to be doing is convincing people in all the recent delid threads that 5ghz is actually very easy on Ivybridge and not a pipedream like many non-believers are saying. Theres a lot of mis-information being spread around in various threads and as usual its from people that don't even own an Ivy


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> What you (we) need to be doing is convincing people in all the recent delid threads that 5ghz is actually very easy on Ivybridge and not a pipedream like many non-believers are saying. Theres a lot of mis-information being spread around in various threads and as usual its from people that don't even own an Ivy


Sandy Fan Bois.. And Amd fails Again tards you mean lol..

Ive seen some quite stupid stuff in that thread... People selling 1366 rigs and getting 8350s When in single threaded performance 1366 beats 8350 and clock for clock multi threaded is with in 5% down the line lol.

When i ask them... Why!? They say because the 8350 shows being faster in a benchmark.. and i got to LoL @ that... As the bench shows a i7 950 at 3ghz vs a 8350 @ 4ghz.. Overclock the i7 920 and it makes up for that and them some...

This shows only an 800mhz gap look at it.. it is pretty Sad that amd can only match Intels 3 generation old Cpus... In multi threaded but still get spanked in single threaded.. http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/697?vs=45

4 cores vs 4 cores 3 generation old i5 lol http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/700?vs=191
AMD = 

Also if they check the 5ghz Club IB is king.....

http://www.overclock.net/t/678487/5ghz-overclock-club/0_20


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> What you (we) need to be doing is convincing people in all the recent delid threads that 5ghz is actually very easy on Ivybridge and not a pipedream like many non-believers are saying. Theres a lot of mis-information being spread around in various threads and as usual its from people that don't even own an Ivy










silly people. Man I hate rumors.


----------



## un-nefer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Also if they check the 5ghz Club IB is king.....
> http://www.overclock.net/t/678487/5ghz-overclock-club/0_20


If you " check the 5ghz Club" the IB is actually not the king at all - even a lowly celeron has clocked higher in that club


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *un-nefer*
> 
> If you " check the 5ghz Club" the IB is actually not the king at all - even a lowly celeron has clocked higher in that club


not in the OC but the number of IB in there.


----------



## un-nefer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not in the OC but the number of IB in there.


Hmm, I must be looking at the wrong page or reading things wrong? There are less IB in that club then SB?

Regardless, that club does not reflect anything more then the people in it who have reached 5Ghz on their chosen platform - it shouldn't even be used to suggest one platform is a better platform then the other


----------



## ivanlabrie

Gentlemen, unsheath your e-peens and start battling nao xD

lol

I had a 2600k that did 5.3ghz on air, pretty nice actually, but my current 3770k did 5.2ghz on air without delidding. That is better performance than a 5.3ghz SB cause of the ipc improvements...
Plus I got to use the shiny high ram multipliers and all


----------



## Agoniizing

Hey guys, I just installed windows 8 and bought an H100. I have a 3770k OC'd to 4.5GHz with a 1.26 vcore. When I would run prime95 in windows 7 I would fail after 30mins. But now when I run prime in windows 8 I got no error after 12hrs. All the same settings. Do you think this is because of windows 8, or the H100?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *un-nefer*
> 
> Hmm, I must be looking at the wrong page or reading things wrong? There are less IB in that club then SB?
> Regardless, that club does not reflect anything more then the people in it who have reached 5Ghz on their chosen platform - it shouldn't even be used to suggest one platform is a better platform then the other


SB is old and slower IB is Newer and Faster.

Your SB is gonna lose in this thread all of us are faster then you.

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2363021

vs

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2178551

" opens can of Whoop Arse "




And im not Even the fastest









*Checks E-Peen.. Yup still pretty Big* in the 4 core 8 threaded world


----------



## un-nefer

hahaha, I was not doubting IB was the faster/better platform - I was clearly replying to remarks that were not entirely correct


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> Hey guys, I just installed windows 8 and bought an H100. I have a 3770k OC'd to 4.5GHz with a 1.26 vcore. When I would run prime95 in windows 7 I would fail after 30mins. But now when I run prime in windows 8 I got no error after 12hrs. All the same settings. Do you think this is because of windows 8, or the H100?


Can anyone answer this? Im confused on how it failed on windows 7 but not windows 8.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> Can anyone answer this? Im confused on how it failed on windows 7 but not windows 8.


LoL me to... This may be what makes me get Windows 8 if u can clock on it with less v core lmao.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL me to... This may be what makes me get Windows 8 if u can clock on it with less v core lmao.


Definitely a reason to consider it. I'm happy with Windows 7 but if Windows 8 over clocks better I'm there.









Would be good to see some load temps on same system with same BIOS settings with Windows 8 and Windows 7. Also would be good to see how Intel Burn Test glop performance compares between both operating systems on same system settings.


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Definitely a reason to consider it. I'm happy with Windows 7 but if Windows 8 over clocks better I'm there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would be good to see some load temps on same system with same BIOS settings with Windows 8 and Windows 7. Also would be good to see how Intel Burn Test glop performance compares between both operating systems on same system settings.


But im wondering if its windows 8 or the fact that I just got a H100.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL me to... This may be what makes me get Windows 8 if u can clock on it with less v core lmao.
> 
> 
> 
> Definitely a reason to consider it. I'm happy with Windows 7 but if Windows 8 over clocks better I'm there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would be good to see some load temps on same system with same BIOS settings with Windows 8 and Windows 7. Also would be good to see how Intel Burn Test glop performance compares between both operating systems on same system settings.
Click to expand...

All I have heard about Windows 8 in terms of overclockability and everything is that it is a whole lot faster than Windows 7. I have a Win 8 Pro copy and I have tried it. My PC was not able to OC better but it however got annoying with the Metro style. That is my personal preference though.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> 2 schools, 29 classes per week and like 950 students......


Unions wouldn't put up with that in the USA.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> All I have heard about Windows 8 in terms of overclockability and everything is that it is a whole lot faster than Windows 7. I have a Win 8 Pro copy and I have tried it. My PC was not able to OC better but it however got annoying with the Metro style. That is my personal preference though.


I heard u can change from a Tablet OS make to the Win7 style if u like..

Just wanting for some UN bias opinions.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> All I have heard about Windows 8 in terms of overclockability and everything is that it is a whole lot faster than Windows 7. I have a Win 8 Pro copy and I have tried it. My PC was not able to OC better but it however got annoying with the Metro style. That is my personal preference though.
> 
> 
> 
> I heard u can change from a Tablet OS make to the Win7 style if u like..
> 
> Just wanting for some UN bias opinions.
Click to expand...

Yea, you can. Just turn off the Metro style.







I would keep it but I still don't see the point in actually using the Win8. I only got it because my dad has a corporate license for a lot of PCs for his company and they had some extras.


----------



## Hokies83

give me a key







ill load it on my HTPC and give it a try


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> give me a key
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ill load it on my HTPC and give it a try


I wish I could. I was planning to do a giveaway but not a Win8. I was planning to giveaway some things like Carbon Fiber mats.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wish I could. I was planning to do a giveaway but not a Win8. I was planning to giveaway some things like Carbon Fiber mats.


Bah and look i was gonna do it the honest way.. Internet free discounted version it is then lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wish I could. I was planning to do a giveaway but not a Win8. I was planning to giveaway some things like Carbon Fiber mats.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bah and look i was gonna do it the honest way.. Internet free discounted version it is then lol.
Click to expand...

Just use the Developers preview. It lasts until August of next year I believe and it is the same build as the on they sell in the store.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just use the Developers preview. It lasts until August of next year I believe and it is the same build as the on they sell in the store.


link?


----------



## Swag

http://care.dlservice.microsoft.com//dl/download/5/3/C/53C31ED0-886C-4F81-9A38-F58CE4CE71E8/9200.16384.WIN8_RTM.120725-1247_X64FRE_ENTERPRISE_EVAL_EN-US-HRM_CENA_X64FREE_EN-US_DV5.ISO

That is the 64-bit version assuming that you aren't some weird backwards person who still uses 32-bit.







No product key needed but you have to reinstall it every 90 days which isn't bad because it lasts till August next year.


----------



## Hokies83

Been playing games on my Ipad 3.. i mean there is no Epic games for it.. but there are fun games..

Like the Oregon settler Which is the 2nd part of the Oregon trail i used to play on PC'S in School back in 1989/1990 lol


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Been playing games on my Ipad 3.. i mean there is no Epic games for it.. but there are fun games..
> Like the Oregon settler Which is the 2nd part of the Oregon trail i used to play on PC'S in School back in 1989/1990 lol


I think you may have been typing in the wrong window!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I think you may have been typing in the wrong window!


Nope this is diff the right one


----------



## Swag

Anyone here good at programming? I want to make a mini web-browser, not too fancy, just read websites for my programming class. Any ideas? Java by the way.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone here good at programming? I want to make a mini web-browser, not too fancy, just read websites for my programming class. Any ideas? Java by the way.


I have this ill sellya.. https://post.craigslist.org/manage/3385331079


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> Hey guys, I just installed windows 8 and bought an H100. I have a 3770k OC'd to 4.5GHz with a 1.26 vcore. When I would run prime95 in windows 7 I would fail after 30mins. But now when I run prime in windows 8 I got no error after 12hrs. All the same settings. Do you think this is because of windows 8, or the H100?


Off hand I would say its your new cooler. But since you didn't state your previous cooler(that I saw, and I'm running on 24 hours awake so I might have missed it) or your previous and post temps, it's hard to tell. But if you were using Air before AND had crappy fans, or God forbid







*STOCK COOLING*









Then you probably will notice improved performance and temps with the H100.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Off hand I would say its your new cooler. But since you didn't state your previous cooler(that I saw, and I'm running on 24 hours awake so I might have missed it) or your previous and post temps, it's hard to tell. But if you were using Air before AND had crappy fans, or God forbid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *STOCK COOLING*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then you probably will notice improved performance and temps with the H100.


performance to a limit (mainly benching or folding) but in temps range heck yes but depends on TIM and all sorts of silly things. *So many variables lol.*


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I got bad news about Crysis 3 boys....
> Game maxxed out.. 20fps... And that was only on my 1080i monitor....
> LoL unless they do some hella work to it that is....
> Was a Slide show i could not play it.. and that was only a game with 12 ppl in it...


I finally downloaded it, and im avg 60 fps? What are you running? Two 680 right? Somthing seems off there. All my settings are maxed in game. Are yours maxed through another program?


----------



## theshowerhead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I finally downloaded it, and im avg 60 fps? What are you running? Two 680 right? Somthing seems off there. All my settings are maxed in game. Are yours maxed through another program?


My 7950 gets about 40fps on max settings. It probably doesn't work well with SLI yet, maybe?


----------



## Lobsterman

Add me to the 5.5 club!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Add me to the 5.5 club!


sorry m8, you "only" have 5499.97 MHz... jk jk

do we have a 5.5ghz club?? didnt know that ...hmm..
do have a 2ghz club, if youre oc is 2ghz over stock..

fantastic work Lobsterman


----------



## Lobsterman




----------



## neopunx

5.5! Arggg. Why wont you let me go higher Eddie!!!! What were your ambients?


----------



## Lobsterman

Ambient 22C but I dont think that matters much because you only get like 3 seconds to click validate b4 bsod or complete lock-up.


----------



## neopunx

oh. hmm, well i just had to reinstall windows casue of my 5.4 attempts, but what the heck! 5.5 you will be mine, BSODS be damned!!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ambient 22C but I dont think that matters much because you only get like 3 seconds to click validate b4 bsod or complete lock-up.


then you know i was starting to sweat, when i oced to 5.5ghz,
booted, and saw i didnt have installed cpu-z yet ...LOL
but installed it, validated etc ..np ..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh. hmm, well i just had to reinstall windows casue of my 5.4 attempts, but what the heck! 5.5 you will be mine, BSODS be damned!!!!


had to reinstall windows 4x now ..lol
go get that 5.5ghz punx, join the,"Ivy 5.5ghz crazies club"


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> then you know i was starting to sweat, when i oced to 5.5ghz,
> booted, and saw i didnt have installed cpu-z yet ...LOL


I been doin all overclocking in Windows via AiSuite so you get plenty of time to prepare everything before clicking the self destruct button, I meen "apply" button


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I finally downloaded it, and im avg 60 fps? What are you running? Two 680 right? Somthing seems off there. All my settings are maxed in game. Are yours maxed through another program?


Does not support SLI atm..

That was maxxed out in game with 12 ppl... with high res textures on.


----------



## Arm3nian

Is CL ultra worth it? MX-4 seems a bit average, will I be able to use on the die? I mean the pcb is really close and ultra seems conductive. I will also use it on my 690 cores and die. I just hope it doesn't actually ruin the die or chips or blocks. If I resell my items in the future I don't want it to look like crap.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Is CL ultra worth it? MX-4 seems a bit average, will I be able to use on the die? I mean the pcb is really close and ultra seems conductive. I will also use it on my 690 cores and die. I just hope it doesn't actually ruin the die or chips or blocks. If I resell my items in the future I don't want it to look like crap.


Mx-4 sucks as TIm.. on the DIE I do not see any Point in DE liding just to get Meh results.. to save 15$...
I mean if your poor and can not get it yeah.. but if you can and your just being cheap... well get the Liquid Ultra insanely better then mx-4
I have cool Labs Liquid pro on both my Gtx 680s.. die and heatsink.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Is CL ultra worth it? MX-4 seems a bit average, will I be able to use on the die? I mean the pcb is really close and ultra seems conductive. I will also use it on my 690 cores and die. I just hope it doesn't actually ruin the die or chips or blocks. If I resell my items in the future I don't want it to look like crap.


cl ultra/pro is deffo worth i on the die, i would advice anyone to use it for that,
on the ihs you can use mx-4 or any good compound

np with the pcb(i think), the electric is protected my the green layer,
only if you scratch the pcb somehow, and spill some on it,maybe then,
if im wrong about the green layer, someone correct me please









i did my son's vid card and mine last week, with cl pro tho,
and saw a 10C temp drop after playing bf3 for more then a hour,
i bet thats a good one to tell the buyers if you gonna sell them..lol
bet they will be happy too with a card like that..

thin layer(s) is the key, then there will be no pushed out tim..
like you see on the just delidded chips, with the intel compound,


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have cool Labs Liquid pro on both my Gtx 680s.. die and heatsink.


what was youre temp drop on the 680's?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what was youre temp drop on the 680's?


15c on Avg


----------



## Phobos223

I am planning on de-lidding and using LP Ultra this weekend. will post some results. Does anyone have any results with a real watercooling setup? Sorry H100 guys, just curious what kind of temps come out of, say, a 360mm rad?


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 15c on Avg


Was this over factory TIM, or MX4?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Was this over factory TIM, or MX4?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1315215/polished-galaxy-gtx-680-4gb-heatsink-cool-labs-liquid-pro-tim/0_20#post_18489004

Prolly would have been an easy 10 over MX-4 as i see it not much better then stock tim.. i have a ton of it... i only use it on builds for other people... not good enough for my own stuff.


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1315215/polished-galaxy-gtx-680-4gb-heatsink-cool-labs-liquid-pro-tim/0_20#post_18489004
> Prolly would have been an easy 10 over MX-4 as i see it not much better then stock tim.. i have a ton of it... i only use it on builds for other people... not good enough for my own stuff.


Nice, thanks for the info. I'm gonna be waterblocking my 670s as well, will go with the LP ultra on them as well


----------



## Arm3nian

Idk I just plan on getting good thermal paste when I remount my gpu waterblock and cpu block, currently I am getting air results, probably because I failed to put a normal amount of paste and mx-4 is average. And on my gpu I think I failed to mount the thermal pads on correctly which makes the pressure unequal and the chips are probably making bad contact with the block.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Nice, thanks for the info. I'm gonna be waterblocking my 670s as well, will go with the LP ultra on them as well


Just ordered some Liquid Pro...my last Liquid Ultra syringe lasted for a day or two lol, granted I got some awesome results on my 670 ftw die.
You're gonna love it


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Just ordered some Liquid Pro...my last Liquid Ultra syringe lasted for a day or two lol, granted I got some awesome results on my 670 ftw die.
> You're gonna love it


Sweet dude, good to hear! I'll post some results next week... but they will be hard to baseline.. my ambients are hot as hell still!

Am curious how delidding with a waterblock and a 360mm rad will do. Right now, before delidding, there is no difference in temp at full load between my 360GTX rad and my 120GTX rad... At full load the rad doesn't even warm up... to me that just proves that all that heat is trapped in the stock TIM! Can't wait to crack it open and see what happens


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> I am planning on de-lidding and using LP Ultra this weekend. will post some results. Does anyone have any results with a real watercooling setup? Sorry H100 guys, just curious what kind of temps come out of, say, a 360mm rad?


Well here are my results with a full CPU/GPU loop @ 4.9 Ghz with liquid pro ambient is around 15°C


And here is another chip with liquid ultra ambient were around 22°


I hope this helps


----------



## Phobos223

^^ Awesome, thank you for the info. My ambient is like 25+ so if I can get close to your 22 temps that would be good!


----------



## chris-br

My ambient temps here now are 28c+ and I'm on air. ;P


----------



## ivanlabrie

You're in Brazil, you got some benefits despite the higher ambients...lol
Me on the other hand, have to face 31c ambients and my mobo is dead. xD


----------



## Phobos223

Here in Texas it's only about 26C, but in my house, upstairs in my office is so hot... especially with rigs working full time for OCN Boinc event.. I bet ambient in that room is close to 30-32... its pretty bad!

Hopefulyl with winter coming soon it will get cold this year, then I will be good under summer! (> 40C) <-- not looking forward to that :-/


----------



## luciddreamer124

So I recently received my Liquid Pro, and when my friend saw it he was shocked. Pulling out his insulin shot for diabetes, we saw it was exactly the same syringe XD. Wouldn't want to get that mixed up would we now?


----------



## Valgaur

Okay guys ln2/dice pot or RAM first. Its annoying me here.....


----------



## Phobos223

What kind of RAM are you looking for?

LN2 pot sounds fun


----------



## Coolwaters

i put back my IHS because i think theres too much pressure and the pcb was getting warped...gave me a bad memory code.
but loosing it didnt give me any contact.

well i ordered a silicone thermal pad .5mm think (the height of the die) and hopefully that'll reinforce the chip and aid in the thermal dissipation.

i'll upload pics and results. once the pad comes. also going to be doing this at ~13C ambient (got to love fall/winter temps







)

what thermal paste should i use for direct die contact to waterblock?


----------



## Phobos223

What kind of temps were you getting direct die? I was thinking about doing this... Used to do it back in the old Opteron days and was great with a waterblock... Am kind of scared though with the Intel retention system..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get a good ln2 pot...it'll last some time. Grab some psc x ram then.


----------



## Valgaur

What's this psc x ram stuff....im not a ram person lol


----------



## Phobos223

If you guys are looking for some low latency RAM I have some Corsair Dominator GT DDR1600 that does 7-7-7-18-11 @ 1T. Am about to post it up on the marketplace.


----------



## Agoniizing

My temps after I delided my 3770k. Its at 4.5GHz @ 1.24v. This is good right?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice, probably Hypers...

Valgaur, PSC is Powerchip, a brand of ram chips or IC's. There's also stuff by Samsung, Hynix, Elpida and Micron to name a few.
PSC kits with tight timings and high clocks are the best for Ivy benching, they don't require too much voltage and they go high and tight, similarly to Hypers but with less vdimm. (Hypers are good on cold and for other platforms, not so much IB, but only if you're extremely picky







)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> So I recently received my Liquid Pro, and when my friend saw it he was shocked. Pulling out his insulin shot for diabetes, we saw it was exactly the same syringe XD. Wouldn't want to get that mixed up would we now?


It would be kinda cool to turn yourself into wolverine though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay guys ln2/dice pot or RAM first. Its annoying me here.....


Just to confuse you more there's phase cooling too. No need to leave the house for ln2 or dice, just have to flick a switch. Initial investment is a bit more & it isn't quite as fun as ln2, but very handy & convenient. I was testing a new 3770k last night, benching 3d at 6Ghz, no ln2, dice or delidding required.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What's this psc x ram stuff....im not a ram person lol


PSC is awesome if memory voltages don't scare you. Newer memory is higher stock speed but the samsung & hynix run more like 2600 9-11-11, feed some good PSC 1.8V or so & 2600 7-11-7 is faster.


----------



## mdrn28

Hi all, long time lurker, first time poster.

Thanks for the great de-lidding info. I was partially successful on my first attempt with a single-sided razor blade, but I made a tiny scrape on the PCB. Turns out that chip only runs in single-channel RAM mode now







but ran great at 4.5 for a week folding at 30k PPD. Highest load temp generally about 80C pre-delid and 60C post-delid.

My second attempt went much better, and I'm back in dual-channel RAM mode now. Running 4.5GHz with a 0.05v offset and folding at 36k PPD or slightly higher. This chip is running a bit cooler at about 59C. Using a Megahalems Rev B with 38mm San Ace fan.

If anyone wants a 3770k that only runs in single-channel mode, I've got one I can sell you cheap!









*OCN name:* mdrn28
*CPU:* 3770k
*on die-TIM:* Cool Labs Liquid Metal Pro
*ihs-TIM:* Gelid GC-Extreme
*Mhz gained:* none yet, running much cooler at 4.5GHz
*OC after delid:* 4.5GHz
*Temp drops:* 20C

Sorry, don't have pics as I was trying to focus on what I was doing and not screw it up a second time!


----------



## Valgaur

Wha??


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mdrn28*
> 
> Hi all, long time lurker, first time poster.
> Thanks for the great de-lidding info. I was partially successful on my first attempt with a single-sided razor blade, but I made a tiny scrape on the PCB. Turns out that chip only runs in single-channel RAM mode now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but ran great at 4.5 for a week folding at 30k PPD. Highest load temp generally about 80C pre-delid and 60C post-delid.
> My second attempt went much better, and I'm back in dual-channel RAM mode now. Running 4.5GHz with a 0.05v offset and folding at 36k PPD or slightly higher. This chip is running a bit cooler at about 59C. Using a Megahalems Rev B with 38mm San Ace fan.
> If anyone wants a 3770k that only runs in single-channel mode, I've got one I can sell you cheap!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* mdrn28
> *CPU:* 3770k
> *on die-TIM:* Cool Labs Liquid Metal Pro
> *ihs-TIM:* Gelid GC-Extreme
> *Mhz gained:* none yet, running much cooler at 4.5GHz
> *OC after delid:* 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops:* 20C
> Sorry, don't have pics as I was trying to focus on what I was doing and not screw it up a second time!


Are you running in the same MB? I was screwing with mine last week and bent one of the pins on the inner most row and I had that single channel memory issue!

Once I fixed that it was all good.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mdrn28*
> 
> Hi all, long time lurker, first time poster.
> Thanks for the great de-lidding info. I was partially successful on my first attempt with a single-sided razor blade, but I made a tiny scrape on the PCB. Turns out that chip only runs in single-channel RAM mode now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but ran great at 4.5 for a week folding at 30k PPD. Highest load temp generally about 80C pre-delid and 60C post-delid.
> My second attempt went much better, and I'm back in dual-channel RAM mode now. Running 4.5GHz with a 0.05v offset and folding at 36k PPD or slightly higher. This chip is running a bit cooler at about 59C. Using a Megahalems Rev B with 38mm San Ace fan.
> If anyone wants a 3770k that only runs in single-channel mode, I've got one I can sell you cheap!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* mdrn28
> *CPU:* 3770k
> *on die-TIM:* Cool Labs Liquid Metal Pro
> *ihs-TIM:* Gelid GC-Extreme
> *Mhz gained:* none yet, running much cooler at 4.5GHz
> *OC after delid:* 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops:* 20C
> Sorry, don't have pics as I was trying to focus on what I was doing and not screw it up a second time!


I may need that chip eventually...hopefully my chip is alive! I wouldn't mind it running single channel, if it runs








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Are you running in the same MB? I was screwing with mine last week and bent one of the pins on the inner most row and I had that single channel memory issue!
> Once I fixed that it was all good.


Could be the mobo, who knows...


----------



## mdrn28

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Are you running in the same MB? I was screwing with mine last week and bent one of the pins on the inner most row and I had that single channel memory issue!
> Once I fixed that it was all good.


Yes, same motherboard, an Asus P8Z77-V Pro. I made sure to check the socket when I was swapping CPUs, and all the pins look nice and straight. I did notice a small flake of the black glue stuff on the bottom of the first CPU, so that might have caused the problem as well. Might try and test that first CPU before I sell it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Give it a go...otherwise let me know how much you want. Hopefully everything's good for the two of us and our chips.


----------



## chris-br

HUmm, so how not to damage the pins on the mobo?????

Edit: if the cpu part was not already scary enough, now the socket too?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> HUmm, so how not to damage the pins on the mobo?????
> Edit: if the cpu part was not already scary enough, now the socket too?


Remove mb Lay cpu in it.. put Ihs on it line it up// Clamp down...

Same can be done by laying a case on it's side.


----------



## chris-br

Most likely i will remove the mobo cuz i wanna apply the liquid pro on my gpu too


----------



## mdrn28

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> HUmm, so how not to damage the pins on the mobo?????
> Edit: if the cpu part was not already scary enough, now the socket too?


Well, in 20-ish years of working on computers, I don't think I've ever had a problem with the socket. If you're careful to put the CPU in flat and not let it drop in sideways, things seem to turn out ok. Also, probably try to minimize the number of times you latch down the retaining clip as things do move around a bit when you do that.

Used to be that the pins were on the bottom of the chip itself, which meant that you had to be even more careful about putting it in the right way. But these days the pins are on the other side and the socket is keyed so you can only put it in one way, making the whole process a bit simpler.

ivanlabrie, I'll re-test that other CPU and let you know how it goes.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool, thanks man...

Valgaur: I pm'd you.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool, thanks man...
> Valgaur: I pm'd you.


SWEET!!! Thanks buddy!


----------



## ivanlabrie

NP, good luck with that! I'll be getting some after I test my greenies, in case they suck with the MVG. *IF my cpu lives that is xD


----------



## dalastbmills

Hey guys, I posted here about a week ago. I delidded my 3770K the night before my Liquid Ultra arrived. The reason I have taken so long is because, in my excitement, I ended up *accidently* bending quite a few CPU pins on my motherboard, thus rendering it useless. I have set up an RMA with ASRock and have since purchased, received, and installed a z77 Extreme4, which also needs to be RMA'ed due to a bad RAM slot. However, the board is still fine and working with my delidded CPU. So far, my idle temps seem to be about the same if not a degree or 2 lower. Getting ready to benchmark, just wanted to post here.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Hey guys, I posted here about a week ago. I delidded my 3770K the night before my Liquid Ultra arrived. The reason I have taken so long is because, in my excitement, I ended up *accidently* bending quite a few CPU pins on my motherboard, thus rendering it useless. I have set up an RMA with ASRock and have since purchased, received, and installed a z77 Extreme4, which also needs to be RMA'ed due to a bad RAM slot. However, the board is still fine and working with my delidded CPU. So far, my idle temps seem to be about the same if not a degree or 2 lower. Getting ready to benchmark, just wanted to post here.


Seriously what is up with all these bent pin stories I mean seriously. This shouldn't even be an issue lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

The ihs sliding on the die does that, when you press on the latch...happened to me too.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The ihs sliding on the die does that, when you press on the latch...happened to me too.


First that I have heard of this. Good info.

For those that are de-lidding and using IHS seems like a good idea to glue the IHS to the PCB again to avoid this from happening.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, or making sure it doesn't move when pressing the latch down (someone suggested placing the ihs off center to let it slide back in position but I wouldn't want to risk it)


----------



## dalastbmills

In my case, I tried to put the CPU in while my motherboard/PC was sitting upright (the way it normally sits) instead of laying the motherboard flat. One of my few "kid on Christmas morning" moments.

As far as temps go, my temps seem a little high.

@ 4.5GHz at 1.304 (quick offset with a new board, overclock isn't 100% fine-tuned)
I seem to be getting the same temps, with one core skyrocketing to 74.

I think I have too much TIM on the die. Would/could this cause high temps? Does the Liquid Ultra need time to cure?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Coolwaters*
> 
> i put back my IHS because i think theres too much pressure and the pcb was getting warped...gave me a bad memory code.
> but loosing it didnt give me any contact.
> well i ordered a silicone thermal pad .5mm think (the height of the die) and hopefully that'll reinforce the chip and aid in the thermal dissipation.
> i'll upload pics and results. once the pad comes. also going to be doing this at ~13C ambient (got to love fall/winter temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> what thermal paste should i use for direct die contact to waterblock?


Liquid Metal Pro will work great for bare die with water block. With Liquid Metal Pro you don't need to rely on high contact pressure. Just a little squeeze down keeping pressure low. I put a light coat of Liquid Metal pro on the die and the block. All I needed was a small drop of it and it covered both the die and block very easily.

I'm have been experimenting with thermal pads around the die as well. Put a .5mm pad around the die over a week ago. Haven't had time to put my water loop back together but will probably get it done soon and post results as well.

I added Fujipoly Extreme .5 mm in thickness around the die.



Also I am using a EK S115X TRUE back plate which works out great for this mount.



I tried the Fujiploy Extreme lwith 1 mm thickness and the CPU would not post. So hopefully .5mm thickness on the sides will work out better.

DT SNIPER lightly mounted nice and snug with Liquid Pro TIM.



Hope to get this up and running ASAP. Just haven't had time to work on it.


----------



## chronicfx

Here is my submission:

After De-lidding:



After Cleaning:



Before-Delidding temps:



After De-lidding temps:



New max overclock:


----------



## chronicfx

CPU-Z validation for 5GHz

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2500438


----------



## FtW 420

Might take my crappiest clocking 3770k & give it the treatment. Useless for benching, only thing it has going for it is a decent IMC. Need to set up a daily driver rig anyway to use for a heater in the LR.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Here is my submission:
> After De-lidding:
> 
> After Cleaning:
> 
> Before-Delidding temps:
> 
> After De-lidding temps:
> 
> New max overclock:


Nice results so far. The right mount with the right TIM is very important to getting lowest temps.

Your i5 3570k seems to operate like mine.... extremely hot and not very over clock friendly. I'm just wating to see if micro center will have some awesome deals on 3770k on black friday and I might get one. 3770k seems to over clock alot better.


----------



## dalastbmills

I went back to my original post a week ago and it seems my temps have dropped quite a bit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Hottest cores are as follows:
> Core 0: 75
> Core 1: 83
> Core 2: 84
> Core 3: 76
> 3770K -> 4.5GHz @ 1.288-1.304v


My new temps:

Core 0: 54
Core 1: 66
Core 2: 72
Core 3: 59

Most of the time during the IBT, it sat at 60.


































OCN name: dalastBMills
CPU: i7 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: none yet
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: 21-17-12-17
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2572882


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Nice results so far. The right mount with the right TIM is very important to getting lowest temps.
> Your i5 3570k seems to operate like mine.... extremely hot and not very over clock friendly. I'm just wating to see if micro center will have some awesome deals on 3770k on black friday and I might get one. 3770k seems to over clock alot better.


It is hotter than I thought. This was actually my second mounting and re-application of the liquid ultra to the die and my first one was about 3 degrees better but I thought 18 degrees wasn't good enough so I tried again and got 15 degrees lol. I could still get more gains by switching to water. I am not sure I want to spend a couple hundred dollars on what could amount to another 100MHz.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> It is hotter than I thought. This was actually my second mounting and re-application of the liquid ultra to the die and my first one was about 3 degrees better but I thought 18 degrees wasn't good enough so I tried again and got 15 degrees lol. I could still get more gains by switching to water. I am not sure I want to spend a couple hundred dollars on what could amount to another 100MHz.


I do wonder if perhaps the NH-D14 isn't quite the best cooler to put liquid pro on the base of since the D14 tends to have a rather rough base, by design, and the liquid pro may not be substantial enough to fill those gaps as traditional pastes are. Pro is one of those TIMs which work better on very smooth surfaces. Have you applied it to both the IHS AND the base of the D14 beforehand?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I do wonder if perhaps the NH-D14 isn't quite the best cooler to put liquid pro on the base of since the D14 tends to have a rather rough base, by design, and the liquid pro may not be substantial enough to fill those gaps as traditional pastes are. Pro is one of those TIMs which work better on very smooth surfaces. Have you applied it to both the IHS AND the base of the D14 beforehand?


Works fine i have tested it when i had an NH-D14... also u could always lapp the bottom of the nh-D14..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I do wonder if perhaps the NH-D14 isn't quite the best cooler to put liquid pro on the base of since the D14 tends to have a rather rough base, by design, and the liquid pro may not be substantial enough to fill those gaps as traditional pastes are. Pro is one of those TIMs which work better on very smooth surfaces. Have you applied it to both the IHS AND the base of the D14 beforehand?


Actually I am using Noctua NT-H1 between the ihs and D14. I was thinking of trying the ultra but I don't want to have that "welding effect" incase I want to switch to water. Are there others in this thread that are on air that are getting much better temps at that clock and voltage? Curious if water is the huge advantage.


----------



## chronicfx

Also are you guys usng the brush to apply the liquid pro/ultra or doing your regular pea or rice method on the die? I used the brush but it makes me wonder about air trapping under the ihs contributing to the higher temps.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Actually I am using Noctua NT-H1 between the ihs and D14. I was thinking of trying the ultra but I don't want to have that *"welding effect"* incase I want to switch to water. Are there others in this thread that are on air that are getting much better temps at that clock and voltage? Curious if water is the huge advantage.


That is Liquid Pro and it takes along time for that to happen.. Ultra does not do that.. it is like any other tim...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That is Liquid Pro and it takes along time for that to happen.. Ultra does not do that.. it is like any other tim...


Where did you hear that liquid ultra does not bond? I have been searching to high hell for that confirmation.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Where did you hear that liquid ultra does not bond? I have been searching to high hell for that confirmation.


We all know that here.. That is why Cool labs made Liquid Ultra... so that would not happen like it does with Pro or there would be no Reason for Ultra to have been created ... It is a User friendly Version of Pro.. while Pro does a tad better.. u have to sand it off stuff when ur done with it...

Ultra u remove like any other tim.


----------



## PCWargamer

Hey all, I'm thinking of getting another IB to delid and OC some, but I was also thinking about a new MB for it and was wondering what thoughts people here have on the Asus Sabertooth Z77? I want to do lots of OCing on it (but not dice or ln2).

My Microcenter here does not have many good Z77 MBs besides that one and I hope to get the $50 off bundle deal.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Also are you guys usng the brush to apply the liquid pro/ultra or doing your regular pea or rice method on the die? I used the brush but it makes me wonder about air trapping under the ihs contributing to the higher temps.


With Liquid Pro I used a small drop on the center of the die and spread it with a cotton swab. With the same drop I also covered the contact area of my DT Sniper water block. IB Die is very small and it takes very little liquid pro to cover it. Liquid Pro works very well for bare die to block mount, the key is to make complete contact between block and die surface contact area and mount pressure doesn't need to be very tight. Just a light and easy snug, even mount.

Cleaning Liquid Pro off can be done but it is a pain in the ass.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?162440-Coollabs-Liquid-Pro-Investigated!-Easiest-possible-way-to-remove-included.-56k-warnin

Liquid Pro works great.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey all, I'm thinking of getting another IB to delid and OC some, but I was also thinking about a new MB for it and was wondering what thoughts people here have on the Asus Sabertooth Z77? I want to do lots of OCing on it (but not dice or ln2).
> 
> My Microcenter here does not have many good Z77 MBs besides that one and I hope to get the $50 off bundle deal.


MSI Z77 Mpower is great board, local Micro Center in Tustin, California carries it.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Here is my submission:
> After De-lidding:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After Cleaning:
> 
> Before-Delidding temps:
> 
> After De-lidding temps:
> 
> New max overclock:


Nice!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey all, I'm thinking of getting another IB to delid and OC some, but I was also thinking about a new MB for it and was wondering what thoughts people here have on the Asus Sabertooth Z77? I want to do lots of OCing on it (but not dice or ln2).
> 
> My Microcenter here does not have many good Z77 MBs besides that one and I hope to get the $50 off bundle deal.
> 
> 
> 
> MSI Z77 Mpower is great board, local Micro Center in Tustin, California carries it.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestion *SonDa5*.

That Mpower looks like it is made for OCing. None at Houston MC, but Fry's has it for $185. I'll read some reviews. Any experience on it yourself?

Also, anything good or bad to note about the sabertooth? I do like the MC bundle idea.

I plan on new MB being for a 3570K that I will delid and OC on my H80 for now. Probably also see how my delidded 3770K does on it too.


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion *SonDa5*.
> 
> That Mpower looks like it is made for OCing. None at Houston MC, but Fry's has it for $185. I'll read some reviews. Any experience on it yourself?
> 
> Also, anything good or bad to note about the sabertooth? I do like the MC bundle idea.
> 
> I plan on new MB being for a 3570K that I will delid and OC on my H80 for now. Probably also see how my delidded 3770K does on it too.


I have the Sabertooth, and I think it works great for everything I use it for currently. I wish it had one more PCIe-3 but oh well. What exactly do you want to know? It's a lot of fun, it looks sharp in and out of the case. And has wee little fans for doing something, not sure what though.







the customer support for me has sucked, and it wasn't even a big deal about the Mobo, it was fine. But I never got a reply for my question from their CS department(which by the way is a MF to fill out and ask a question). It supports a wide range of RAM, but make sure yours is on the list! There is also several good threads here on OCN about it. Any questions, PM me.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> I went back to my original post a week ago and it seems my temps have dropped quite a bit.
> My new temps:
> Core 0: 54
> Core 1: 66
> Core 2: 72
> Core 3: 59
> Most of the time during the IBT, it sat at 60.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: dalastBMills
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: none yet
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: 21-17-12-17
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2572882


Accepted!









Also on another note I finally got to Lap my IHS and everything LOL I love these temps I can do 5Ghz at 1.5 vcore and run 20 times IBT and stay under 80C!!! I love LP lol and I have Indigo Xtreme on the IHS easiest application ever.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also on another note I finally got to Lap my IHS and everything LOL I love these temps I can do 5Ghz at 1.5 vcore and run 20 times IBT and stay under 80C!!! I love LP lol and I have Indigo Xtreme on the IHS easiest application ever.


You still need to get an LN2 pot! so we can see you take Franky to 6GHz and beyond!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> You still need to get an LN2 pot! so we can see you take Franky to 6GHz and beyond!


I know I'm trying to find one lol.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, or making sure it doesn't move when pressing the latch down (someone suggested placing the ihs off center to let it slide back in position but I wouldn't want to risk it)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> My liquid ultra has arrived and will be in my mail box tomorrow!!! Decided to run IBT now and delid my chip now.
> Not sure what my ambient temps are, but my PC is setup in my basement so I'm guessing low 70's/high 60's F.
> Hottest cores are as follows:
> Core 0: 75
> Core 1: 83
> Core 2: 84
> Core 3: 76
> 3770K -> 4.5GHz @ 1.288-1.308v
> I'm going to watch some tutorials and read up on delidding one last time. The next time I start up my PC, I will have a delidded 3770K or a 2600K XD
> PS: When testing stability I used IBT very high settings, and I remember getting a much higher Speed (GFlops) for my same clock. I am getting ~98 GFlops for the basic testing while I score 101+ for Very High. Anyone know why??
> Edit: I'm still not 100% about cleaning the die. Is it safe to apply 99% Isopropyl Alcohol to the die itself?


I pulled my motherboard tray out and set it onto my table, when I aligned the IHS on top of the die I held it in place with my finger to keep from sliding forward.

dalastbmills our chips are very close except for temperatures with iGPU, 3770K @ 4.5GHz 1.272-1.304V using Zalman CNPS9500A air cooler. I also used the entire contents Liquid Pro and pooled in on top of the processor die, my load temps seem the same across a large gain in either Vcore and MHz!!


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey all, I'm thinking of getting another IB to delid and OC some, but I was also thinking about a new MB for it and was wondering what thoughts people here have on the Asus Sabertooth Z77? I want to do lots of OCing on it (but not dice or ln2).
> 
> My Microcenter here does not have many good Z77 MBs besides that one and I hope to get the $50 off bundle deal.


Do you really need it to be ATX???

I have the maximus formula and i love it i am currently on my last 5 hours to be 12 hours stable in prime @ 5.0

But i also heard good things about the Gene


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hey all, I'm thinking of getting another IB to delid and OC some, but I was also thinking about a new MB for it and was wondering what thoughts people here have on the Asus Sabertooth Z77? I want to do lots of OCing on it (but not dice or ln2).
> 
> My Microcenter here does not have many good Z77 MBs besides that one and I hope to get the $50 off bundle deal.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you really need it to be ATX???
> 
> I have the maximus formula and i love it i am currently on my last 5 hours to be 12 hours stable in prime @ 5.0
> 
> But i also heard good things about the Gene
Click to expand...

No, but rather. Also, running SLI. I have heard good things about the maximus formula and the gene. Neither at MC, but formula at Frys here for $290.


----------



## SonDa5

Z77 MPower is great MB for the money. Asrock formula z77 looks awesome as well. I have MPower and like it. There is an MPower club in the Mother board forum here. I might get deal on CPU and z77 MB combo at MC. If I can help you get good deal on MB for small fee send pm.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> PS: When testing stability I used IBT very high settings, and I remember getting a much higher Speed (GFlops) for my same clock. I am getting ~98 GFlops for the basic testing while I score 101+ for Very High. Anyone know why??
> Edit: I'm still not 100% about cleaning the die. Is it safe to apply 99% Isopropyl Alcohol to the die itself?


gflops are overrated..lol, someone said to me my flops where very low for a 3770k,
i had about 105, seems its all ok tho, depends more/also on ram you have, how much you use running ibt etc,
and i noticed when i started a program while running ibt, it dropped a few too,
could be just a service in the background or a program,
doing some work or checking for updates etc that causes the little gflop drop..








when i disabled HT , it went up to 125 gflops,

yes, you can use Isopropyl Alcohol to clean the die,
np at all, just dont pour half the bottle on it ..lol
a little on a paper towl will do, if you see it evaporate almost instantly is good .


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The ihs sliding on the die does that, when you press on the latch...happened to me too.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Seriously what is up with all these bent pin stories I mean seriously. This shouldn't even be an issue lol.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> First that I have heard of this. Good info.
> For those that are de-lidding and using IHS seems like a good idea to glue the IHS to the PCB again to avoid this from happening.


C'mon you guys, i hope/thought were experienced enough to put back a cpu in its socket,
blaming the movement of the ihs while putting down the lever again, isnt the issue
if you ask me, if it does happen, it prolly was seated wrong already,
think about it,
putting back the cpu in its socket..then the ihs back on,
gently/carefully lever down...what can go wrong with that,
the little pressure from the bracket already holds it in place,
only the ihs will slide a bit, but not the cpu, because of the pins in the socket.

try this,
putting it all back together, then if you start putting down the lever,
hold a finger in the middle of the ihs, to dont let it slide to much,
again, it should not be a problem at all..

o, and yes, i did bent some pins once, but that was with a amd 1100T,
which has real pins on the underside of the cpu..

i bent all the pins left to the red, because i didnt seat it good in the first place,
it took me 3 hours to get them all straight again, with a pincet..lol
got it to work again, and it still runs well in my son's comp..

even went to a watchmaker with it, and he said, he didnt want to try,
because the pins where soooo little..o well..lol..
i was very happy when i saw my 3770k didnt have those pins anymore


----------



## Hokies83

I always hated pins on the cpu...

Just makes me want to post this since amd has never changed it lol...


----------



## ivanlabrie

At least you can fix broken cpu pins whereas broken intel mb pins require a new socket installation.
VonDutch, don't call me stupid


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> At least you can fix broken cpu pins whereas broken intel mb pins require a new socket installation.
> VonDutch, don't call me stupid


100x easyer to break amd cpu pins then intel MB pins.

Also it cost more to replace a cpu on avg then a mb.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Accepted!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also on another note I finally got to Lap my IHS and everything LOL I love these temps I can do 5Ghz at 1.5 vcore and run 20 times IBT and stay under 80C!!! I love LP lol and I have Indigo Xtreme on the IHS easiest application ever.


Hi Valgaur. What grit sandpaper did you use to lap your ihs? Also did you the top and the bottom? I delidded but I feel like my temps are still high unless there is just a monster difference between the d14 and the water cooling loops. Btw my delidding and temps are on page 239 if you get a chance to look.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> At least you can fix broken cpu pins whereas broken intel mb pins require a new socket installation.
> VonDutch, don't call me stupid


nah ..LOL


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Here is my submission:
> After De-lidding:
> 
> After Cleaning:
> 
> Before-Delidding temps:
> 
> After De-lidding temps:
> 
> New max overclock:


I Lapped the bottom of the IHS lip along with the top of the IHS very very well. I spent an hour on the top of the IHs with 400 grit sandpaper and I used that on the bottom as well. I then went to 1000 grit sandpaper and stayed in one spot on the paper and made it nice and shiny. not mirror finish but you can clearly see yourself in it.


----------



## dalastbmills

Since my last post, I am comfortably sitting at 4.7 at about 1.368v. During the IBT extreme tests, only 1 core broke 80c and it was only for a second









Might try for 4.8 ( my 24/7 clock on my 2600k) but I'm not sure how safe it is to take IB above 1.4v. I did read someone pushing theirs in the ballpark of 1.412. Is that safe for 24/7 use?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Since my last post, I am comfortably sitting at 4.7 at about 1.368v. During the IBT extreme tests, only 1 core broke 80c and it was only for a second
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Might try for 4.8 ( my 24/7 clock on my 2600k) but I'm not sure how safe it is to take IB above 1.4v. I did read someone pushing theirs in the ballpark of 1.412. Is that safe for 24/7 use?


Yes I ran mine at 1.4 vcore for 3 months


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Since my last post, I am comfortably sitting at 4.7 at about 1.368v. During the IBT extreme tests, only 1 core broke 80c and it was only for a second
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Might try for 4.8 ( my 24/7 clock on my 2600k) but I'm not sure how safe it is to take IB above 1.4v. I did read someone pushing theirs in the ballpark of 1.412. Is that safe for 24/7 use?


yes, still within intel's specs.. 1.52V max.
but whats safe right, for some its staying within 1.3-1.35V vcore,
for others 1.45V vcore or more is ok








ivy is more resilliant to temps and higher voltages so, should be np,
i even asked intel about this, the answer was something like,
"if you keep voltages within the specs, there should be no "damage" or degradation
running it longer times"

hokies is our voltage experiment..lol,
what was it, 5.1ghz 24/7, with 1.55 vcore?
something crazy like that
lets wait and see what his chip does in say, 6 months orso ..lol

4.8ghz took me 1.420V vcore to make it prime stable,
so i backed down a bit to 4.650ghz and 1.300ish vcore for daily use,
but thats just me


----------



## dalastbmills

What about going above 1.4? I'm almost positive I will need more to get 4.8.

1.368 for me at 4.7 is not even 100% stable yet, so I might need to increase my offset.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can go up to 1.55v if the temps are in check...Check Hokies cpu or Valgaurs!








I'll surely do so once I get my board, going for 5ghz or more 24/7 WITH ht on.








I used to run 5ghz bench stable with 1.48v, and HT on, so I guess I can go higher than that easily...with better temps.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> What about going above 1.4? I'm almost positive I will need more to get 4.8.
> 1.368 for me at 4.7 is not even 100% stable yet, so I might need to increase my offset.


heres your answer ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can go up to 1.55v if the temps are in check...Check Hokies cpu or Valgaurs!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll surely do so once I get my board, going for 5ghz or more 24/7 WITH ht on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used to run 5ghz bench stable with 1.48v, and HT on, so I guess I can go higher than that easily...with better temps.


im using offset too,
but going from 4.7 to 4.8ghz,
was going from offset 0.040 to offset 0.160V,
i was like dang, thats alot, ive asked others about it, its np they said,
but idle voltage goes up alot too, i didt like that to much,
but again, thats just me ..lol









i bet you can run 1.4-1.45V vcore for years,
and dont run into any problems, if temps are in check
you have to try/decide for yourself whats good,
im happy with my oc, i mean, i got like 30% more speed then at stock for free! ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> What about going above 1.4? I'm almost positive I will need more to get 4.8.
> 1.368 for me at 4.7 is not even 100% stable yet, so I might need to increase my offset.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Hokies take the vcore back use 5 Ghz and use blck of 102 lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hokies take the vcore back use 5 Ghz and use blck of 102 lol


This is not 1366 socket im not touching blk XD

I also heard socket 1150 "Haswell" will once again overclock with Blk.. so the noob friendly overclocking is going away again lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, heard that and I'm excited about it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This is not 1366 socket im not touching blk XD
> I also heard socket 1150 "Haswell" will once again overclock with Blk.. so the noob friendly overclocking is going away again lol.


Big baby lol. I use my blck all the time.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, heard that and I'm excited about it


Same here I'm ready for a new challenge lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bclk ain't for pussies eh Valgaur?







*wink*

102 won't harm a fly, I use it, and it's useful once you go cold and aim for 7ghz lol


----------



## dalastbmills

Damn. Are you using some sort of in-line chiller?

Can't imagine anyone using an all-in-one cooler at 1.54 successfully









Anyways, I asked a question in the ASRock overclocking section but I still haven't gotten a response.

Since getting my new board, my CPU doesn't seem to downclock itself when idle. The vcore drops, but the multi stays at 47.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition

As far as I know, I have just about the same settings as my P67 board and that board would lower vcore and multi and run at .9v at 1.6GHz when idle.

I have tried enabling/disabling Speedstep, C3/6, spread spectrum thingy and I haven't pinpointed the problem.

Any ideas?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Damn. Are you using some sort of in-line chiller?
> Can't imagine anyone using an all-in-one cooler at 1.54 successfully
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyways, I asked a question in the ASRock overclocking section but I still haven't gotten a response.
> Since getting my new board, my CPU doesn't seem to downclock itself when idle. The vcore drops, but the multi stays at 47.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition
> As far as I know, I have just about the same settings as my P67 board and that board would lower vcore and multi and run at .9v at 1.6GHz when idle.
> I have tried enabling/disabling Speedstep, C3/6, spread spectrum thingy and I haven't pinpointed the problem.
> Any ideas?


H-100 max temps 80 c... 25c from TJ Max excellent temps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> H-100 max temps 80 c... 25c from TJ Max excellent temps.


Same temps for me Hokies.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Same temps for me Hokies.


LoL Same case Same cooler and same fans on cooler..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Oh, I foresee a threesome between you guys and VonDutch lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL Same case Same cooler and same fans on cooler..










hmmmm who could ahve thought of such nonsense!!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hmmmm who could ahve thought of such nonsense!!!!!


My Avatar once Again Pwns yours.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Looks quite yummy lol
Hope your missus doesn't see it lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This is not 1366 socket im not touching blk XD
> I also heard socket 1150 "Haswell" will once again overclock with Blk.. so the noob friendly overclocking is going away again lol.


bclk isn't that scary.









Got a 3770k delidded, while I had the razor blade checked the IHS & it was slightly concave so decided to lap it, forgot how long it can take to do a nice job so still on that. I'll grab some pics when done.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good man, we're in company of heroes now...Now freeze that sucker and use liquid pro to compare results.
I want someone to disprove that myth (if it is a myth)


----------



## holgate

first i have to say this is my first intel system and i love it, now if anybody here is thinking about delidding JUST DO IT. read the thru the forum and read/watch the guides from OP, You guys are awesome, im so happy i found this thread.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> first i have to say this is my first intel system and i love it, now if anybody here is thinking about delidding JUST DO IT. read the thru the forum and read/watch the guides from OP, You guys are awesome, im so happy i found this thread.


Grats and Welcome to the SB butt kickers club!


----------



## holgate

going to try to shoot for 5.0ghz this weekend, i dunno yet, but the temp drops so far are crazy


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> bclk isn't that scary.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a 3770k delidded, while I had the razor blade checked the IHS & it was slightly concave so decided to lap it, forgot how long it can take to do a nice job so still on that. I'll grab some pics when done.


Whats did you use to get that BLCK so high? I want to go higher but I don't know what to use for my BCLK volts. and the Higher multi i use the less BCLK it seems it likes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good man, we're in company of heroes now...Now freeze that sucker and use liquid pro to compare results.
> I want someone to disprove that myth (if it is a myth)


Yes please!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> first i have to say this is my first intel system and i love it, now if anybody here is thinking about delidding JUST DO IT. read the thru the forum and read/watch the guides from OP, You guys are awesome, im so happy i found this thread.


Your Welcome sir!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> going to try to shoot for 5.0ghz this weekend, i dunno yet, but the temp drops so far are crazy


Go higher than that you pansy!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Whats did you use to get that BLCK so high? I want to go higher but I don't know what to use for my BCLK volts. and the Higher multi i use the less BCLK it seems it likes.
> Yes please!
> Your Welcome sir!
> Go higher than that you pansy!


I donno but uping the Blk on 1366 u had to up the IMC voltage and the VTT.


----------



## ivanlabrie

He's on phase change there...and yeah, vtt and imc help.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This is not 1366 socket im not touching blk XD
> I also heard socket 1150 "Haswell" will once again overclock with Blk.. so the noob friendly overclocking is going away again lol.
> 
> 
> 
> bclk isn't that scary.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a 3770k delidded, while I had the razor blade checked the IHS & it was slightly concave so decided to lap it, forgot how long it can take to do a nice job so still on that. I'll grab some pics when done.
Click to expand...

Awesome bclk. I found that my IB IHS was also concave. Seems to be true of many so far, so I think lapping is often the way to go after delidding.

Is there a good guide on IB memory OCing you can point us to?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> first i have to say this is my first intel system and i love it, now if anybody here is thinking about delidding JUST DO IT. read the thru the forum and read/watch the guides from OP, You guys are awesome, im so happy i found this thread.


We are happy to have it too, and happy you decided to delid and joine us! Great job!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> He's on phase change there...and yeah, vtt and imc help.


I know the vtt stuff but where is the IMC stuff exactly?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I know the vtt stuff but where is the IMC stuff exactly?


VTT = Vccio

IMC = Vccsa


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Z77 MPower is great MB for the money. Asrock formula z77 looks awesome as well. I have MPower and like it. There is an MPower club in the Mother board forum here. I might get deal on CPU and z77 MB combo at MC. If I can help you get good deal on MB for small fee send pm.


That is very kind of you *SonDa5*. I am still reading reviews, thinking, and waiting for my B'day later this month (good way to justify this to my wife!). I'll let you know if you helping to get the Mpwr will help.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I know the vtt stuff but where is the IMC stuff exactly?
> 
> 
> 
> VTT = Vccio
> 
> IMC = Vccsa
Click to expand...

My Asus BIOS has no vccsa - does it have another name or symbol?


----------



## ivanlabrie

System agent?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> VTT = Vccio
> IMC = Vccsa


I use both already...but apparently I could go higher than 1.3 right?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not a good idea on ambient cooling...Don't go past 1.3v and 1.295v, it's pushing it really. You might degrade your memory controller.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Whats did you use to get that BLCK so high? I want to go higher but I don't know what to use for my BCLK volts. and the Higher multi i use the less BCLK it seems it likes.
> Yes please!
> Your Welcome sir!
> Go higher than that you pansy!


Just upped the bclk in bios, make sure the memory can do the clocks it ends up at, might have to drop the multi if not. I generally do at least 104 bclk when it's cold (-100 or colder) to keep the cold boot bug away.
Would have to double check for voltages, but I think the vccio was at 1.11 or 1.13V, vccsa was on auto on the mpower.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just upped the bclk in bios, make sure the memory can do the clocks it ends up at, might have to drop the multi if not. I generally do at least 104 bclk when it's cold (-100 or colder) to keep the cold boot bug away.
> Would have to double check for voltages, but I think the vccio was at 1.11 or 1.13V, vccsa was on auto on the mpower.


Ive always wanted to cool with phase... how is it?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Phase is really cool...less cold than dice, but good for light benching, ram ocing with cold imc.
I'd go phase if I had cash for the initial investment on a good unit.
Bet you could mod an AC unit Hokies, and make a water chiller at least, that's easier.


----------



## holgate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Whats did you use to get that BLCK so high? I want to go higher but I don't know what to use for my BCLK volts. and the Higher multi i use the less BCLK it seems it likes.
> Yes please!
> Your Welcome sir!
> Go higher than that you pansy!


i will, i will, im still learning how to overclock intel ships, ive had AMD systems since high school, although its a lot easier to oc an ivy bridge chip than it is an 1090t


----------



## chronicfx

My new 24/7 overclock since de-lidding: Thanks for the help guys!



By the way did I make the club?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> My new 24/7 overclock since de-lidding: Thanks for the help guys!
> 
> By the way did I make the club?


Dang what a vcore for that clock.....

Accepted!









Accepted you a few hours back just forgot to tell you!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive always wanted to cool with phase... how is it?


Very handy. Ln2 is still more fun & holds the temps better, but also requires more preparation & constant monitoring /pouring.
With phase you just have to flip the switch on, wait a few minutes & get overclocking. I have a few phase units, the -20° & -40° could be used for 24/7 (I don't normally, but been running the 2600k at -40° for almost a week now), the -100° cascade isn't really 24/7 but can be used as a daily driver for a guy who works all day & gets on the machine for a few hours after work. For temps the cascade is similar to using DICE.

Man the lapping is taking forever, should have gone out for some rough emory cloth to start instead of 400 grit.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Very handy. Ln2 is still more fun & holds the temps better, but also requires more preparation & constant monitoring /pouring.
> With phase you just have to flip the switch on, wait a few minutes & get overclocking. I have a few phase units, the -20° & -40° could be used for 24/7 (I don't normally, but been running the 2600k at -40° for almost a week now), the -100° cascade isn't really 24/7 but can be used as a daily driver for a guy who works all day & gets on the machine for a few hours after work. For temps the cascade is similar to using DICE.
> Man the lapping is taking forever, should have gone out for some rough emory cloth to start instead of 400 grit.


Id love to have a 24/7 Phase cooled chip







where did u get those units at?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Id love to have a 24/7 Phase cooled chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where did u get those units at?


http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g30/c367/list/p1/Liquid_Cooling-Computer_Phase_Change_Cooling.html


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g30/c367/list/p1/Liquid_Cooling-Computer_Phase_Change_Cooling.html


Gonna see if he knows where they are for less then 1200$ @[email protected]

Man there is a guy wanting to pay 150$ more for a 8350 with crappyer parts then a 3570k with better parts for a gaming build...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g30/c367/list/p1/Liquid_Cooling-Computer_Phase_Change_Cooling.html
> 
> 
> 
> Man there is a guy wanting to pay 150$ more for a 8350 with crappyer parts then a 3570k with better parts for a gaming build...
Click to expand...

There are people who say more cores (AMD) will always beat less cores. Hell, our dual-cores beat AMDs nowadays. They can't match up anymore in general. Of course, people will always buy what is marketed better.







My friend recently built a PC that cost him $1400 and he sold it for $2100 to an unsuspecting kid. I think it's sad.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> There are people who say more cores (AMD) will always beat less cores. Hell, our dual-cores beat AMDs nowadays. They can't match up anymore in general. Of course, people will always buy what is marketed better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My friend recently built a PC that cost him $1400 and he sold it for $2100 to an unsuspecting kid. I think it's sad.


The thing is he can get a 3770k for the same price as the 8350 build .. which wipes a 8350 off the planet in ever aspect..

He is a new guy some im trying to coach him...

http://www.overclock.net/t/1324605/new-amd-gaming-build-suggestions/20_20#post_18553680


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Man the lapping is taking forever, should have gone out for some rough emory cloth to start instead of 400 grit.


I also started with 400 grit, and depending on how concave the IHS is it can take forever to get it flat...it went much faster after that was done.....but a very slow start


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I also started with 400 grit, and depending on how concave the IHS is it can take forever to get it flat...it went much faster after that was done.....but a very slow start


Yeah I think some of my "higher than others" de-lidded temps may be due to some need for lapping. Do you put the sand paper onto a flat block with a grip or do you just hold it in your hand? Also do you lap it down to the copper underneath or is that way to much or hard to do?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Z77 MPower is great MB for the money. Asrock formula z77 looks awesome as well. I have MPower and like it. There is an MPower club in the Mother board forum here. I might get deal on CPU and z77 MB combo at MC. If I can help you get good deal on MB for small fee send pm.


The more I read about the Mpower the better it looks. Also looks like MSI has really up'ed their interest in the OC community - that alone is almost enough to want to get the board, but there are many other good reasons too. Thanks for the heads-up on that MB *SonDa5* as it is really something to consider.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I also started with 400 grit, and depending on how concave the IHS is it can take forever to get it flat...it went much faster after that was done.....but a very slow start
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I think some of my "higher than others" de-lidded temps may be due to some need for lapping. Do you put the sand paper onto a flat block with a grip or do you just hold it in your hand? Also do you lap it down to the copper underneath or is that way to much or hard to do?
Click to expand...

I taped the sand paper to a glass plate and then held the IHS in my hands. Check out the link below for more info that should help:

http://www.overclock.net/t/455498/lapping


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> U mad brah? its all good brah.
> Seriously though even in those reviews you posted it says the 3570K gets slain in most multi threaded benches by 8350. lmao
> Also, games just started using 4 core? where yu at brah? All new heavy graphics games are using 6 plus cores. Metro 2033, Battlefield 3, Crysis 2, upcoming crysis 3. Im willing to bet in those games your little quad core will get smacked down. I should know I actually owned a 3570k recently and see no loss in frames going to a 6300.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I taped the sand paper to a glass plate and then held the IHS in my hands. Check out the link below for more info that should help:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/455498/lapping


im sure i made a post somewhere about lapping ihs..with pics , links etc,
if anyone comes across it ..lemmi know pls


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Id love to have a 24/7 Phase cooled chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where did u get those units at?


i saw some nice info/articles somewhere about using a cheap, ($80-90) AC and rebuild it,
will look for it today, hope i can find it again


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yeah I think some of my "higher than others" de-lidded temps may be due to some need for lapping. Do you put the sand paper onto a flat block with a grip or do you just hold it in your hand? Also do you lap it down to the copper underneath or is that way to much or hard to do?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im sure i made a post somewhere about lapping ihs..with pics , links etc,
> if anyone comes across it ..lemmi know pls


my name wouldnt be VonDutch, if i couldnt find the answer ..lol.. jk jk

IHS lapping ( 400 grit --> 800 grit --> 1000 grit). Read this composite pic from left-to-right and from top-to-bottom:

As evident in the photos, the IHS on this 3770K was quite concave, that is,
higher in the middle than elsewhere. "Flatness" was achieved in this case
when no more silver color remained on the IHS.


one uses wet/dry sandpaper and a flat surface (glass usually) to slowly and
iteratively grind an uneven surface. The goal of lapping is not be to make
a mirror surface, rather, it is to make flat surface.

waking up, g'morning







, and done some "info looting" while drinking my coffee








saw you guys talk about sanding ihs etc ..so ..i like pictures, easier then 1000 (grit) words right ..lol
i must say, most peeps say it didnt help much, i thought the same till now,
1-3C max difference, others saw no difference at all, so im surprised about the
extra 11C tempdrop..

.....................................................................................................

First, here is the sequence of pics taken during the various stages of lapping.
To determine if the IHS was initially convex (crowned in the middle) or concave (like a bowl),
I used a sharpie permanent marker to make an X across the surface of the IHS:



Then I did just a few strokes on 220 grit before inspecting it,
knowing that the portions of the original "X" would only be removed from the high spots on the IHS:



very clear indication that the IHS is/was concave (like a bowl, the center was low and not touched by the sand paper yet,
the edges were high and have already been sanded down a bit, enough to begin to remove the permanent pen markings)

A bit more sanding with 220 grit yielded the following "copper ring" expected for a concave IHS:


We want all the nickel removed, nickel has a lower thermal transfer rate than copper, so I finished sanding off all the nickel with 220 grit:


check out how it looks after going all the way up to 3000 grit, love it











if anyone is going to do this lapping thing,
note before and after results if you can,
might be usefull for others, we have this saying,
"one day of Sun, doesnt make a summer"..
so, results that one may have, wont mean others will have the same,

its like with the usage of different tim's on die,
took a while and results from different peeps, to be sure liquid pro/ultra are the best to use on die right









o, about the "bowl" effect on that pic with the green markings,
dont forget if you put down the bracket on it, it will get less by the pressure...i thought..

well, to make sure noone will sue me, lol,
these are the original links,
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2260582
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261219

(omg, i need to make a new post asap, Posts: 666..lol)


----------



## shremi

Im starting to like this suicide runs









But i am a total noob here.....

Got any tips for me ???


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey VonDutch, I posted a guide on ac unit modding to build a cheap water chiller. Look it up here, I'm on the phone atm.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Im starting to like this suicide runs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But i am a total noob here.....
> Got any tips for me ???


suicide would be going for 5.6ghz ..lol

found this tip somewhere, might be useful,
i see many ask for how to remove the glue..

"The IHS will come off easily once you have completed severing the glue
which is removed with *gentle scraping with credit card or finger nails*; isopropyl alcohol doesn't help much. "


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey VonDutch, I posted a guide on ac unit modding to build a cheap water chiller. Look it up here, I'm on the phone atm.


oki








doing it that way, saves alot money,
i mean, $1900 for a prebuild one ..wow


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Im starting to like this suicide runs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But i am a total noob here.....
> Got any tips for me ???


I'll snag that i5 off you that sound good? okay!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> suicide would be going for 5.6ghz ..lol
> found this tip somewhere, might be useful,
> i see many ask for how to remove the glue..
> "The IHS will come off easily once you have completed severing the glue
> which is removed with *gentle scraping with credit card or finger nails*; isopropyl alcohol doesn't help much. "


We need his chip Von.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll snag that i5 off you that sound good? okay!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We need his chip Von.


we need to know where he lives! ..lol jk
but yea, hes got a very nice chip there,
imagine what it would do under cold ...wow

how's the pot buying business going ?
already decided on what it gonna be, ram or pot?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we need to know where he lives! ..lol jk
> but yea, hes got a very nice chip there,
> imagine what it would do under cold ...wow
> how's the pot buying business going ?
> already decided on what it gonna be, ram or pot?


I have been waiting on the RAM to see if a pot comes up....there is a 90 dollar Dice pot available....but it's a home made one...I'm not sure man.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I have been waiting on the RAM to see if a pot comes up....there is a 90 dollar Dice pot available....but it's a home made one...I'm not sure man.


hmm, homemade, you think we can make one ourselfs for less then $90?
if i knew what materials are needed and such, i know some peeps that are handy


----------



## Hokies83

Ask Dwood to make u one he has all the l cutting and fab stiff.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hmm, homemade, you think we can make one ourselfs for less then $90?
> if i knew what materials are needed and such, i know some peeps that are handy


Theres a guy selling his... I'm considering it
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ask Dwood to make u one he has all the l cutting and fab stiff.


Dwood doesn't make these I'm sure because OCN already does and they look amazing.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1211191/marksman-pot-pictures-retail-now


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Dwood doesn't make these I'm sure because OCN already does and they look amazing.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1211191/marksman-pot-pictures-retail-now


they really do look great ..wauw

my new desktop background ...LOL


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Theres a guy selling his... I'm considering it
> Dwood doesn't make these I'm sure because OCN already does and they look amazing.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1211191/marksman-pot-pictures-retail-now


LoL if u do not have money for LN put Dry ice in it @[email protected]


----------



## FtW 420

Slowly coming along. After taking the pic I see I should pause & clean the keyboard...










I got my phase units from gray mole, got a great deal but he's kinda disappeared lately so can't really recommend him for building right now. Sdumper is a forum member who does good work, he's the local rep for the CM units they have at frozencpu & does custom work as well.
I've always liked littledevil's phasers, great looking stuff but he's at the high end of the price scale.

Both the single stages in action, 2600k & gt 210 in the current OCN benching comp









Cascade


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL if u do not have money for LN put Dry ice in it @[email protected]


duh but I dont have that kind of money for that pot. I have 170 bucks


----------



## Arm3nian

How come some of those with CL ultra/pro only put it in the die or only on the top of the IHS, why not both? It would yield better temps I am guessing. I ordered mine on tuesday so it should come (ultra). I plan on putting it on the 2 cores of my 690 and the die in the middle, and also the die and the IHS of my 3770k. I am using thick copper blocks for both, would it destroy the blocks?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How come some of those with CL ultra/pro only put it in the die or only on the top of the IHS, why not both? It would yield better temps I am guessing. I ordered mine on tuesday so it should come (ultra). I plan on putting it on the 2 cores of my 690 and the die in the middle, and also the die and the IHS of my 3770k. I am using thick copper blocks for both, would it destroy the blocks?


The ppl who used ultra should have..

Those who used pro maynot because u have to sand pro back off... i did however cause my IHS is already lapped.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Slowly coming along. After taking the pic I see I should pause & clean the keyboard...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got my phase units from gray mole, got a great deal but he's kinda disappeared lately so can't really recommend him for building right now. Sdumper is a forum member who does good work, he's the local rep for the CM units they have at frozencpu & does custom work as well.
> I've always liked littledevil's phasers, great looking stuff but he's at the high end of the price scale.
> Both the single stages in action, 2600k & gt 210 in the current OCN benching comp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cascade


Very nice man! Now show us some temps







and be sure to compare your max oc on cold with it after delidding and using liquid metal paste.








Good info on the phase units, might come in handy in the future, thanks.


----------



## Raven.7

Been reading some numbers...wow, Intel REALLY screwed up on this one.

My 3570K has core 1 and core 2 on a complete difference range of temperatures, as high as 81C unload load with my H100 at 4.4Ghz compared to 71-74C on core 0 and core 3.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raven.7*
> 
> Been reading some numbers...wow, Intel REALLY screwed up on this one.
> My 3570K has core 1 and core 2 on a complete difference range of temperatures, as high as 81C unload load with my H100 at 4.4Ghz compared to 71-74C on core 0 and core 3.


See why we've taken so much time invested here talking about every single way we can make it easier on people? I'm still getting all of my data straight to take up to Intel to make a formal complaint.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raven.7*
> 
> Been reading some numbers...wow, Intel REALLY screwed up on this one.
> My 3570K has core 1 and core 2 on a complete difference range of temperatures, as high as 81C unload load with my H100 at 4.4Ghz compared to 71-74C on core 0 and core 3.


81 c is 24c below TJmax You have plenty of room..

Also core 4 should always be the hottest core in most cases Re mount the cooler.. H-100 does not spread tim very well.. you may have to put a little extra...

Or use some cool labs Liquid ultra for a perfect app.

Also i noticed the Line method with a Ivy Chip + H-100 always got me the best results.


----------



## Raven.7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> See why we've taken so much time invested here talking about every single way we can make it easier on people? I'm still getting all of my data straight to take up to Intel to make a formal complaint.


What bothers this me the most, is that all this trouble was probably caused in an attempt to save a dollar or two at the production line.

Sigh...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 81 c is 24c below TJmax You have plenty of room..
> Also core 4 should always be the hottest core in most cases Re mount the cooler.. H-100 does not spread tim very well.. you may have to put a little extra...
> Or use some cool labs Liquid ultra for a perfect app.
> Also i noticed the Line method with a Ivy Chip + H-100 always got me the best results.


Unless you use IX which gives a perfect seat every time.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raven.7*
> 
> What bothers this me the most, is that all this trouble was probably caused in an attempt to save a dollar or two at the production line.
> Sigh...


Exactly. Thats why I'm doing that.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Unless you use IX which gives a perfect seat every time.
> Exactly. Thats why I'm doing that.


I donno about your IC Diamond.. maybe mine is old.. but i have to use 3x the needed amount with the H-100 to get a good mount and use line method cause the stuff is just to thick.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno about your IC Diamond.. maybe mine is old.. but i have to use 3x the needed amount with the H-100 to get a good mount and use line method cause the stuff is just to thick.


He meant Indigo Xtreme...not IC Diamond. I needed to use a big drop with mine too btw.


----------



## Lobsterman

Hey Valgaur or VonDutch, which one of you was it that contacted Intel Tech to ask about the max vcore and what post number please? Im trying to find some concrete evidence that its 1.52v max vcore recommended by Intel.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Hey Valgaur or VonDutch, which one of you was it that contacted Intel Tech to ask about the max vcore and what post number please? Im trying to find some concrete evidence that its 1.52v max vcore recommended by Intel.


Its Vondutch and its 1.52vcore


----------



## Lobsterman

Ye Im just looking for the official word from Intel on this or the transcript that Vondutch had as I have someone on another forum claiming that this 1.52v is an "Urban Myth"







so I want some hard evidence to present before I call him out on it.


----------



## luciddreamer124

Finally got the balls to delid my 3770k and... SUCCESS! I didn't kill it (although I was terrified the whole time) and the second I dropped it in was -22C. Will be posting all my info to join the club soon


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Finally got the balls to delid my 3770k and... SUCCESS! I didn't kill it (although I was terrified the whole time) and the second I dropped it in was -22C. Will be posting all my info to join the club soon


Awesome, congrats! look forward to seeing your results.


----------



## Arm3nian

Is there a point in lapping for CL ultra? Seems like it would hurt the resale value, maybe improve it i'm not sure.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't lap the ihs myself, unless it's extremely concave and hurting temps real bad.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ye Im just looking for the official word from Intel on this or the transcript that Vondutch had as I have someone on another forum claiming that this 1.52v is an "Urban Myth"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so I want some hard evidence to present before I call him out on it.


I think it is more like 1.58 are something and that anything below 1.56 is safe...

Nobody has degraded any of these chips yet with this voltage and it has been 7 months already..

Sin082 told me 1.6...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I think it is more like 1.58 are something and that anything below 1.56 is safe...
> Nobody has degraded any of these chips yet with this voltage and it has been 7 months already..
> Sin082 told me 1.6...


I've seen the official chart from intel. Its 1.52vcore


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I've seen the official chart from intel. Its 1.52vcore


Thats what Intel says and this is what i say







There always gonna put wiggle room in what they say is the Max safest.. thre not gonna say the Maximum safest voltage truly is.. because they do not want u to think it is something higher and u go over it and RMA..

And the voltage fear is all because Sandy was Trash with voltage.. However Ivy Bridge Loves voltage.. and from the 5ghz club you know this









Nvidia also says 1.75v is max for kepler to.. but ppl have been running them at 1.3v for months now.

Ima keep my current oc another 30days and if no issues im going to push another 100mhz...so a 5.3ghz 24/7 OC


----------



## luciddreamer124

Okay here's my info:
OCN name: luciddreamer124
CPU: i7 3770k
On die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: MX4
mhz gained: 300mhz
OC after delid: 4.9ghz
Temp drops: 18 C

Before delid 4.5ghz:


After delid 4.5 ghz:


Max OC (for now) validation:


I really wanna reach 5 ghz, but it seems like I'll need too much voltage. From 4.8 to 4.9 I went from 1.41v to 1.51 v








Hope I didn't forget anything!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Okay here's my info:
> OCN name: luciddreamer124
> CPU: i7 3770k
> On die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX4
> mhz gained: 300mhz
> OC after delid: 4.9ghz
> Temp drops: 18 C
> Before delid 4.5ghz:
> 
> After delid 4.5 ghz:
> 
> Max OC (for now) validation:
> 
> I really wanna reach 5 ghz, but it seems like I'll need too much voltage. From 4.8 to 4.9 I went from 1.41v to 1.51 v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope I didn't forget anything!


Your Accepted.....but I need you CPU-Z of your 4.9 Ghz run.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Finally got the balls to delid my 3770k and... SUCCESS! I didn't kill it (although I was terrified the whole time) and the second I dropped it in was -22C. Will be posting all my info to join the club soon


That's an excellent temp reduction, fear is the number one thing holding other's back! Well a little fear is important otherwise you'll think you chip is invincible, my advice is use this super thin blade if you want to make things easier for yourself!


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I've seen the official chart from intel. Its 1.52vcore


Word!

If anyone is getting degraded chips I believe it's because of the TIM + the gap issue with Intel's cheapness, Intel would have had better reviews if it had been soldered. There are member's using more than 1.45V on Sandy Bridge-E and haven't heard a word about degrading chips, Ivy Bridge is volt friendly.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your Accepted.....but I need you CPU-Z of your 4.9 Ghz run.


A suggestion, it would be nice if member's would take a snapshot of their temps while under *100% load*!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ye Im just looking for the official word from Intel on this or the transcript that Vondutch had as I have someone on another forum claiming that this 1.52v is an "Urban Myth"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so I want some hard evidence to present before I call him out on it.


I do not think Intel has said exactly or offically what the max vcore is, but IIRC I have seen in one of their docs a VID table that only went as far as 1.52v and I think that may be where people have gleaned the idea that that was the max.

But, we have been OCing our IBs for months now at 1.6v and beyond (1.7v, 1.8v and some [hint valgaur] has even gone beyond 1.9v on water)! So far no burt-out chips or even reported degragation. The IB chips are much tougher than sandy bridge.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Finally got the balls to delid my 3770k and... SUCCESS! I didn't kill it (although I was terrified the whole time) and the second I dropped it in was -22C. Will be posting all my info to join the club soon


Welcome aboard mate! Good to see another delidded crewman with the balls to do it! And your temp rewards are worth it too. Good job!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I've seen the official chart from intel. Its 1.52vcore
> 
> 
> 
> Word!
> 
> If anyone is getting degraded chips I believe it's because of the TIM + the gap issue with Intel's cheapness, Intel would have had better reviews if it had been soldered. There are member's using more than 1.45V on Sandy Bridge-E and haven't heard a word about degrading chips, Ivy Bridge is volt friendly.
Click to expand...

*Systemlord*, I think that table is from sin's guide that he made? And it is a very good and useful table, but not an offical one from Intel.

Your point about the IB's being voltage friendly is very true. And so far I have not heard anyone complaining about degraded IBs, while by this time period, when we were all using SBs, we had heard many stories of degraded SBs. IBs are much tougher. I have been amazed by what some of our guys here have done in the 5GHz club with their voltage on air/water.

PS - while I have heard about the "degraded" LN2 capability of delided chips for some, but that is not the typical degradation from temp or vcore which does not seem to be happening much if at all.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> A suggestion, it would be nice if member's would take a snapshot of their temps while under *100% load*!


You can see these in the max temp line on real temp. so its all good.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You can see these in the max temp line on real temp. so its all good.


It is time to start the 5ghz IB club... Gimmie ur template


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is time to start the 5ghz IB club... Gimmie ur template


Wait until we hit 25 members so 2 more people.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Ye Im just looking for the official word from Intel on this or the transcript that Vondutch had as I have someone on another forum claiming that this 1.52v is an "Urban Myth"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so I want some hard evidence to present before I call him out on it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yes, i contacted intel support about the max voltages few weeks ago,
> because its such a hot item for everyone, asking about it etc..
> we/he went through their spec sheets to get those numbers,
> he showed me where to find it on the sheets,
> (dang, just noticed i didnt copy it, srry)
> well, in the end, he told me , if i really wanted to go in depth,
> i had to contact one of their engineers, gave me link etc,
> but i was happy with the answers/help he gave me already,
> so i went with the 1.52V vcore max from that day on..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.5V vcore, is still under that 1.52, but with little fluctuations you might hit it ..
> and when i asked intel about that and degradation/damage on the long run,
> he said, if you keep voltages within the specs, there should be no problem at all..
> o, someone commented me on this graph,
> from sin0822 guide, said that was all wrong, and how i got that 1.52V number,
> intel doesnt state that etc etc..same story as you tell me now..
> thats why i contacted intel support about it, i hate being wrong, or not well informed..
> 
> "quote"
> Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers
> provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because
> of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max.
> "end quote"
> you can see that sin0822 even states 1.55V max on air,
> o well, i still tell peeps to stay in the 1.3-1.35V vcore range,
> max 1.4V, to be on the "safe" side..if they ask about safe vcores
> it prolly would live long if you hit it with 1.45 - 1.5V, 24/7
> if it doesnt, and it degrades fast or anything, it was a bad chip already to start with..
> Hours later.....
> found it, its in sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
> Symbol Parameter Min Typ Max Unit Note
> VID VID Range 0.2500 - 1.5200 V 1
> im not that technical etc, i see they talk about VID, and VID range, max 1.52V,
> not max vcore, or its the same thing, not im not sure anymore either ..lol,
> guess thats why the intel support guy said to contact a engineer


the official data , you can find it here,
sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Hello Sin0822
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup,
> many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore
> should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max.
> in regard to this post i made,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition/1860#post_18501975
> can you tell me where you got the info from, the statement you made
> about intel's recommended max is 1.52V?
> a few times now peeps comment on me using the 1.52V as max vcore,
> i did contact intel support about it, weeks ago, and he showed me datasheet 1,
> sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
> im not that technical etc, i see they talk about VID, and VID range, max 1.52V,
> not max vcore..
> just want to make sure i can explain well to others,
> and the why and where etc ...you know how it goes,
> "we need proof"..other wise its bs ...lol
> thanks in advance for helping,
> or anyone else who can help me with this


i didnt get a answer from Sin0822, me asking him where he got the "official" 1.52V from,
or what he calls "Intel Rec. Max"..
the 1.55V he mentions in his graph, is his own idea off the max vcore on air..

then DaClownie gave me this answer, i think its a very good one

I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered the
maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild for consumer usage.
LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you should operate
in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting.


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Wait until we hit 25 members so 2 more people.


Do you just need a cpuz screen or something more. Count me in during weekend. So we need one more


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Do you just need a cpuz screen or something more. Count me in during weekend. So we need one more


One of these. and W00T!

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


----------



## shremi

I'll be adding my second chip info tomorrow so that makes 25


----------



## VonDutch

wauw, almost 25 members ..








we need to get out there, and have more peeps delid..hahaha aim for 100


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> my advice is use this super thin blade if you want to make things easier for yourself!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Do you all confirm this thin blade is the right tool to use?
Trying to insert it under the IHS on one corner and them moves it around?
Or only insert it under the IHS on one corner to make a 'hole' and then insert/move a non cutting tool in between the PCB and IHS trying to break the glue?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Do you all confirm this thin blade is the right tool to use?
> Trying to insert it under the IHS on one corner and them moves it around?
> *Or only insert it under the IHS on one corner to make a 'hole' and then insert/move a non cutting tool in between the PCB and IHS trying to break the glue?[*/quote]
> 
> Id try that way and report to us how it goes.


----------



## VonDutch

go easy with putting to much force on the pcb tho, while trying to break the adhesive..
you could bent it..

and keep the razor blade strait, dont want to bent that too,
its easy, because its so thin, just saying









but you could tape one side, saves bleeding fingers if something goes wrong ..lol

thats why i like this one,


"a non cutting tool in between the PCB and IHS trying to break the glue?"

what are you gonna use for that?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> go easy with putting to much force on the pcb tho, while trying to break the adhesive..
> 
> "a non cutting tool in between the PCB and IHS trying to break the glue?"
> what are you gonna use for that?


I used this one. very good control with it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> I used this one. very good control with it.


yea, youre right about that, i like the cap on it, doesnt bent alot that way









i used this one,

but to be honest, i dont think the blade used is very important,
its HOW you use it ...lol

time to hit the shower n shave, i look like a barbarian haha,
laters peeps


----------



## BaK2BaK

Yeah, I know those blades bend very easily, the one with the handler side looks great! Thx for the pic!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> "a non cutting tool in between the PCB and IHS trying to break the glue?"
> what are you gonna use for that?


I was thinking of a thin metal piece, like a non cutting side of the thin blade, in order not to scrap the PCB. Something that would just push/divide the adhesive apart.
But that way will require more force to go around the IHS, as VonDutch said, and could bend the PCB...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Yeah, I know those blades bend very easily, the one with the handler side looks great! Thx for the pic!
> I was thinking of a thin metal piece, like a non cutting side of the thin blade, in order not to scrap the PCB. Something that would just push/divide the adhesive apart.
> But that way will require more force to go around the IHS, as VonDutch said, and could bend the PCB...


Use a Razor on all 4 Corners.. There very easy to break into there.. Just hold the blade flat tot he PCB... Then see if you can take a Credit card and finish the job.

This would be something we can show others to do and be more safe.. to help to stop fails.


----------



## Systemlord

Just use a seesaw motion keeping the corners of the blade from going under the IHS, this should prevent these scratches on the PCB. Once you insert the ultra thin blade under the IHS it can't bend to much, the thinner blade being flexible is less likely to scratch the PCB.

Fast forward to time index 3:30


----------



## ketapang

Successfully delid my 3570k.










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







































8 hours stable prime95:









OCN name: ketapang
CPU: i5 3570k
on die-TIM: Deepcool TIM
ihs-TIM: Deepcool TIM
Mhz gained: 100Mhz
OC after delid: 4500Mhz
Temp drops: 9c-10c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2574826


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Successfully delid my 3570k.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: ketapang
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: Deepcool TIM
> ihs-TIM: Deepcool TIM
> Mhz gained: 100Mhz
> OC after delid: 4500Mhz
> Temp drops: 9c-10c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2574826


Gratz on the successful delid ketapang, and welcome








bet you can drop those temps alot more tho








what cooler are you using?


----------



## ketapang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Gratz on the successful delid ketapang, and welcome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bet you can drop those temps alot more tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what cooler are you using?


Thx bro.







Its NH-D14. Yeah i plan to replace those cheap deepcool tim with liquid ultra. But even those cheap deepcool tim manage to improve my load up to 10c.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Thx bro.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its NH-D14. Yeah i plan to replace those cheap deepcool tim with liquid ultra. But even those cheap deepcool tim manage to improve my load up to 10c.


Yw







, yea, that cooler is very nice,
you prolly lose another 10C or more when using liquid ultra,
but you already know that i see ..lol


----------



## Agoniizing

Here are my temps after I delided my 3770k overclocked to 4.5GHz 1.24 vcore.

9hrs stable prime95


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> Here are my temps after I delided my 3770k overclocked to 4.5GHz 1.24 vcore.
> 9hrs stable prime95
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


looks very good Agoniizing, temp and vcore wise


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks very good Agoniizing, temp and vcore wise


Are these temps good for deliding?


----------



## Lobsterman

Could have sworn I already submitted, but can't find it now, anyway

*OCN name:* Lobsterman
*CPU:* 3770k
*on die-TIM:* Coollabs Liquid Ultra
*ihs-TIM:* Coollabs Liquid Ultra
*Mhz gained:* 600
*OC after delid:* 5.5 Max, 5.0 Daily
*Temp drops:* ~20C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2572213


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> Are these temps good for deliding?


to be honest, could be better, but it isnt bad,
i dont have 4.5ghz examples, this one is 4.8ghz and running prime 12 hours


maybe you already said so,
but what tim are you using, and cooler?


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> to be honest, could be better, but it isnt bad,
> i dont have 4.5ghz examples, this one is 4.8ghz and running prime 12 hours
> 
> maybe you already said so,
> but what tim are you using, and cooler?


Im using liquid pro on the die, Pk-1 on IHS. And H100


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is time to start the 5ghz IB club... Gimmie ur template
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wait until we hit 25 members so 2 more people.
Click to expand...

Great idea. I think it would be good to see the delidded IBs in their own chart.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> go easy with putting to much force on the pcb tho, while trying to break the adhesive..
> 
> "a non cutting tool in between the PCB and IHS trying to break the glue?"
> what are you gonna use for that?
> 
> 
> 
> I used this one. very good control with it.
Click to expand...

My fav tool too! Effective with lots of good control and no bloody fingers









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wauw, almost 25 members ..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> we need to get out there, and have more peeps delid..hahaha aim for 100


Yep! It would be great to see more IB'ers with delidded chips and low temps! And after 100, then to 1000!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> Im using liquid pro on the die, Pk-1 on IHS. And H100


with a H100 you shoud have lower temps if you ask me,
tim is ok, np there, maybe re-apply/reseat?


----------



## neopunx

So I got tired of seeing all of you with your temps so damn low, and that I think my first seating of my TIM and or Heat Sink was bad. So im going to break it all down this weekend and apply my NEW CL PRO! and Indigo X! that I got in the mail yesterday, W00T! Ill run a 4.5 IBT, snap some picks both pre and post operation, and see if I cant fix my whole not dropping temps issue I originally had. If all works out, I plan on smashing the 5.5/5.6 sometime soon. Wish me luck. Im going in.


----------



## SonDa5

*You are in control.

You know you want to De-Lid.

Just do It*!*


_*A friendly not for profit IB cooling delidding message. Be careful when Delidding._


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> So I got tired of seeing all of you with your temps so damn low, and that I think my first seating of my TIM and or Heat Sink was bad. So im going to break it all down this weekend and apply my NEW CL PRO! and Indigo X! that I got in the mail yesterday, W00T! Ill run a 4.5 IBT, snap some picks both pre and post operation, and see if I cant fix my whole not dropping temps issue I originally had. If all works out, I plan on smashing the 5.5/5.6 sometime soon. Wish me luck. Im going in.


Good luck!

Took me many mounts and TIM applications before I figured out my mount and I am still tweaking it.


----------



## chronicfx

My temps aren't that awesome to be honest. Do you think there is a big difference between liquid ultra and liquid pro for the die? currently applied ultra. should I switch?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> My temps aren't that awesome to be honest. Do you think there is a big difference between liquid ultra and liquid pro for the die? currently applied ultra. should I switch?


From everything that I have read Liquid Pro works better on the die and on the heat sink surface. I think that if you decided to run it on the die you might as well run it on the surface of the heat sink. It's going to be tough clean off later on if you want to clean it off.

Are you now using Liquid Ultra between IHS and DIE and between IHS and heat sink surface?


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> *You are in control.
> You know you want to De-Lid.
> Just do It*!*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _*A friendly not profit IB cooling delidding message. Be careful when Delidding._


I like the whole "Just Do It" message. I posted simiarly on this thread:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1323797/my-hot-3570k-to-delid-or-not-to-delid-that-is-the-question

They did not seem to appreciate me very much. LOL. I retired myself from that thread, but Hokies took up my slack and got the Troll to chase him for a while! Evryone should head over there and tell that Guy (or Girl?) they should delid. Fun times.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I like the whole "Just Do It" message. I posted simiarly on this thread:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1323797/my-hot-3570k-to-delid-or-not-to-delid-that-is-the-question
> They did not seem to appreciate me very much. LOL. I retired myself from that thread, but Hokies took up my slack and got the Troll to chase him for a while! Evryone should head over there and tell that Guy (or Girl?) they should delid. Fun times.


ROGER.










You know I think our club is one of the premier TRUE over clocking clubs. Any serious IB over clocker is going to think about de-lidding at some point in time. IMO it's a right of passage event.


----------



## martinhal

Best thing I have done in a while. Going to push the little sucker as soon as my CLP arrives. Going to OC the snot out of it and give Haswell a skip .


----------



## ZeVo

I wish I had the guts to do this, but I can't. I however do like reading the before and after temps as some of them are really surprising.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZeVo*
> 
> I wish I had the guts to do this, but I can't. I however do like reading the before and after temps as some of them are really surprising.


Do it , it is easy


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> From everything that I have read Liquid Pro works better on the die and on the heat sink surface. I think that if you decided to run it on the die you might as well run it on the surface of the heat sink. It's going to be tough clean off later on if you want to clean it off.
> Are you now using Liquid Ultra between IHS and DIE and between IHS and heat sink surface?


No, ultra on the die and NT-H1 (noctua D14 paste) on the ihs. I have been thinking of using the ultra on the heatsink as well. But I wouldn't use pro for the ihs because I don't really want to lap, it just seems like a pain in the ass.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> No, ultra on the die and NT-H1 (noctua D14 paste) on the ihs. I have been thinking of using the ultra on the heatsink as well. But I wouldn't use pro for the ihs because I don't really want to lap, it just seems like a pain in the ass.


I didn't lap my DT Sniper water block and I had a very nice drop in temps going from IC Diamond. From what I have read UItra is about 2-3C hotter than Liquid Pro so gains may not be as much.

I would definitely run the liquid Ultra on all contact surface areas.

I would definitely lap flat the IHS and surface of the heat sink(only if needed on the heat sink some heat sinks are nice and flat)

I didn't lap my DT sniper water block but I did a contact paper pressure test with it directly on my die and I know I have good contact so I don't think I need to lap my DT sniper block.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I didn't lap my DT Sniper water block and I had a very nice drop in temps going from IC Diamond. From what I have read UItra is about 2-3C hotter than Liquid Pro so gains may not be as much.
> I would definitely run the liquid Ultra on all contact surface areas.
> I would definitely lap flat the IHS and surface of the heat sink(only if needed on the heat sink some heat sinks are nice and flat)
> I didn't lap my DT sniper water block but I did a contact paper pressure test with it directly on my die and I know I have good contact so I don't think I need to lap my DT sniper block.


why don't people realize they can use indigo xtreme like me its amazing stuf and super easy to do....UGH


----------



## chronicfx

Going to order it now Val.


----------



## chris-br

I did it, finally, but now when running Prime a worker stop everytime.. was stable before.







Bios has same settings. Temps are 10c less than before

EDIT: still using mx-4 on die and ihs


----------



## chronicfx

You can't put indigo xtreme on the die though can you? What is it? Is it some kind of pad that has the thermal material in it?


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I did it, finally, but now when running Prime a worker stop everytime.. was stable before.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bios has same settings. Temps are 10c less than before
> EDIT: still using mx-4 on die and ihs


How long did you run it before? Using at least 90% memory?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> How long did you run it before? Using at least 90% memory?


I was stable for 14 hours before.

EDIT:


----------



## SimpleTech

How quickly did one of the workers fail? Give your vcore a little bump and see if that helps.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> How quickly did one of the workers fail? Give your vcore a little bump and see if that helps.


Minutes.. I'm ahead of you. ) added just a tap on the vcore, temps still good, lets see, running prime for 12minutes now.

Edit: liquid pro is already in my father's hands, but he is on Florida and will be back only 2 weeks from now, so i will have to wait.


----------



## Raven.7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> *You are in control.
> You know you want to De-Lid.
> Just do It*!*
> 
> _*A friendly not for profit IB cooling delidding message. Be careful when Delidding._


NO! STOP IT! Don't you dare tempt me!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raven.7*
> 
> NO! STOP IT! Don't you dare tempt me!


Tempts you..


----------



## chris-br

well. 30 minutes running custon prime max temps are 63 64 67 61. over 10c lower than before and with just mx-4.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> why don't people realize they can use indigo xtreme like me its amazing stuf and super easy to do....UGH


I don't use IHS.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> well. 30 minutes running custon prime max temps are 63 64 67 61. over 10c lower than before and with just mx-4.


That is a good sign.









What is your PLL voltage set at? I have mine set at 1.55v with vcore at 1.15v at 4.5GHZ. I think you might be able to lower your vcore and lower temps as well. Vcore seems a high for 4.5GHZ.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raven.7*
> 
> NO! STOP IT! Don't you dare tempt me!


Not tempting anybody. Just motivating those who want to do it but are a little scared.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> That is a good sign.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What is your PLL voltage set at? I have mine set at 1.55v with vcore at 1.15v at 4.5GHZ. I think you might be able to lower your vcore and lower temps as well. Vcore seems a high for 4.5GHZ.


i believe is set to 1.60, using offset, but yes, can run lower then 1.32 volts

EDIT. that vcore is really low, damn, mine came running stock at 1.25


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> why don't people realize they can use indigo xtreme like me its amazing stuf and super easy to do....UGH


IX has less w/mk than Liquid Pro man, and costs a gazillion dollars!








Did they pay you or what? xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> i believe is set to 1.60, using offset, but yes, can run lower then 1.32 volts
> EDIT. that vcore is really low, damn, mine came running stock at 1.25


Try a fixed vcore, sounds like your oc wasn't 100% stable.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> why don't people realize they can use indigo xtreme like me its amazing stuf and super easy to do....UGH


Can you use it on the die ? If so how ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> You can't put indigo xtreme on the die though can you? What is it? Is it some kind of pad that has the thermal material in it?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> IX has less w/mk than Liquid Pro man, and costs a gazillion dollars!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did they pay you or what? xD
> Try a fixed vcore, sounds like your oc wasn't 100% stable.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Can you use it on the die ? If so how ?


It comes ina package little pad that you melt by running prime or IBT. Then you let it fit perfectly to the heatsink and IHS. Its super easy to do comes off super easily. Yeah its no liquid pro but liquid pro is ment for smaller areas like the die. I mentioned this way back like 150 pages ago and no one listened.

Indigo Xtreme is very effective over other tim.

I have heard that it is able to apply to the die as well. You just need to take a chunk off and apply it on the die and let it heat up and such but that's to much work. LP for small areas like dies then IX for IHS.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It comes ina package little pad that you melt by running prime or IBT. Then you let it fit perfectly to the heatsink and IHS. Its super easy to do comes off super easily. Yeah its no liquid pro but liquid pro is ment for smaller areas like the die. I mentioned this way back like 150 pages ago and no one listened.
> Indigo Xtreme is very effective over other tim.
> I have heard that it is able to apply to the die as well. You just need to take a chunk off and apply it on the die and let it heat up and such but that's to much work. LP for small areas like dies then IX for IHS.


I ordered a tube of liquid pro to replace my liquid ultra for the die (i figure I can use the ihs if switch to water anyways since the LP conducts like a boss) and I ordered a single pack of indigo extreme. I am hoping you are right and this will make my temps more in line with the temps I am seeing from others. I pictured mid 70's pushing 1.45v,, instead I am seeing upper 90's.


----------



## neopunx

^_______________________________________________^
Me too! The V brothers have me on a quest to be the best! LOL


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I ordered a tube of liquid pro to replace my liquid ultra for the die (i figure I can use the ihs if switch to water anyways since the LP conducts like a boss) and I ordered a single pack of indigo extreme. I am hoping you are right and this will make my temps more in line with the temps I am seeing from others. I pictured mid 70's pushing 1.45v,, instead I am seeing upper 90's.


I think liquid ultra will work better than indigo extreme but you have to make sure you have good surface contact on your mount.

I would try remounting with Liquid ultra only on all surfaces and see if your temps drop. If you get a good mount just subract 2-3C from that and that is what you would see with Liquid Pro.

Liquid pro is a must have for bare die mounts with no IHS. It doesn't require much block pressure to work great which is safe for bare die.

I think Indigo Extreme is pricey for what it is. I would rather use Liquid Ultra or Liquid Pro. Again think about lapping your IHS and block surface for a nice flat surface for best contact.

IB IHS has been reported to be concave by many so lapping it flat will help alot.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll give bare die a try with Liquid pro...I don't trust my IHS nor my fingers, don't wanna kill my MVG lol


----------



## chronicfx

LOL. After my $30 purchase you tell me what I have is fine.. Anyways I am still gonna go through with the plan, I am now absolutely drawn to the cool reflow procedure.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Give it a go!









Post back with results...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll give bare die a try with Liquid pro...I don't trust my IHS nor my fingers, don't wanna kill my MVG lol


i wouldnt advice doing that if you have a aircooler tho,
i figured it will give to much pressure on one side of the die..

its different with a water cooler block,
the pressure is more even, and not as high
over time a aircoolers downward weight might crush the die

maybe im seeing it totally wrong tho ..lol
if youre using the Thermalright Silver Arrow with 3 ty-140's
thats in your build


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll give bare die a try with Liquid pro...I don't trust my IHS nor my fingers, don't wanna kill my MVG lol


For me I put a very light coat on DIE and water block area that comes in contact with die. All I needed was one small drop on die and it was enough for both the die and the water block.

You don't need to torque it down. Just a snug light pressure mount.

Too tight and you run risk of cracking die.
Too lose and it wont boot.

Has to be just right. Mine feels snug but not tight.

My bare die no IHS mount with 3570k and DT Sniper water block. This is how I have mine set up.

Side view mounted.



Some Fujipoly Extreme .5mm thickness thermal pad around die on PCB to provide stability and help with cooling.


EK TRUE 115X back plate for stability.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i wouldnt advice doing that if you have a aircooler tho,
> i figured it will give to much pressure on one side of the die..
> its different with a water cooler block,
> the pressure is more even, and not as high
> over time a aircoolers downward weight might crush the die
> maybe im seeing it totally wrong tho ..lol
> if youre using the Thermalright Silver Arrow with 3 ty-140's
> thats in your build


I'm using the SA but with 2 ty-140s now...was lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> For me I put a very light coat on DIE and water block area that comes in contact with die. All I needed was one small drop on die and it was enough for both the die and the water block.
> You don't need to torque it down. Just a snug light pressure mount.
> Too tight and you run risk of cracking die.
> Too lose and it wont boot.
> Has to be just right. Mine feels snug but not tight.


Exactly that, I'll play with the amount of mounting pressure, I can regulate it with the pressure vault. Thermalright's mounting mechanism is awesome!
I'll try to place shims around the die to level the pressure...that sounds ok, right SonDa5?
After re-thinking what went wrong, I came to the conclusion that bare die would be better for me. I won't need to lap the IHS and I'll only need a bit of Liquid Pro on the die and heatsink base. I'll test for contact pressure and lap the cooler's base if needed (doubt I'll need to do that though)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> For me I put a very light coat on DIE and water block area that comes in contact with die. All I needed was one small drop on die and it was enough for both the die and the water block.
> You don't need to torque it down. Just a snug light pressure mount.
> Too tight and you run risk of cracking die.
> Too lose and it wont boot.
> Has to be just right. Mine feels snug but not tight.


yea, i saw idontcare try different pressure on his, and he also noticed differences
in the pressure related to tempdrop etc ..funny, has to be just right for the best results..


----------



## Birthday

OCN name: Birthday
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: Antec 7
ihs-TIM: Antec 7
Mhz gained: 100-200
OC after delid: 4532 MHz
Temp drops: 5*C idle, 10*C load
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2576433

Oh my, I was skeptical about how this process would work for me, considering the fact that I had less than optimal cooling and motherboard options on hand. Apparently though, my fears were unfounded. Using my _fantastic_ CM TPC 812 cooler, with _amazing_ Antec 7 thermal paste, on my _wonderfu_l Asus P8Z77-V LX board... I am getting 4500 MHz at 71*C (23*C ambient) in prime95. 4600 MHz is seeming possible with temps in the high 70's, but that's going to take a little more work, especially with this motherboard.

Here's a photo of my adventures:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## neopunx

OOOOHHHH Carefull with your chip!!!! Any peice of grit or anything abrasive and it is litereally a case of between a rock( your counter) and a hard place(You Chips bottom!)...and your chip is not that hard!!! Make sure you ground yourself before you touch that thing again.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thermalright's mounting mechanism is awesome!
> I'll try to place shims around the die to level the pressure...that sounds ok, right SonDa5?


I don't use shims. My DT Sniper block has springs and I just have them snug like in the photo I posted above.
I think a water block is better choice for bare die mount because they have low center gravity and not a lot of pressure on die. With a large heat sink that sticks out there is alot of weight hanging. Good luck with it. I hope it works great for you. I haven't seen bare die done with a air heat sink.

Birthday congrats!


----------



## Birthday

You know, I had that very same thought a split second _after_ I set it down there.

I do have lovely counters though.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd use a shim to surround the die, to avoid getting too much pressure on it. I'll play with the mounting pressure as well, hopefully it'll boot just fine.


----------



## neopunx

You do have lovely counters. And hopefully a fully mission capable chip!


----------



## Birthday

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> You do have lovely counters. And hopefully a fully mission capable chip!


Well, so far so good! Everything appears to be working better than ever.

That said, I am a straight razor enthusiast and have a fantastic set of hones that go up to around 15k grit. I will attempt to lap sometime next week, and will NOT repeat using my lovely countertops as a backdrop for photos when I do.


----------



## scutzi128

Just bought a 3770k and I am going to delid this weekend. I was wondering though what is the difference in temperature from using the ihs with glue removed and better tim or just mounting to the bare die?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> LOL. After my $30 purchase you tell me what I have is fine.. Anyways I am still gonna go through with the plan, I am now absolutely drawn to the cool reflow procedure.


I posted on post #2558 what I thought you should do. http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2558#post_18566312

Anyhow I really am not up to speed on the reflow procedure or Indigo extreme. I will read up on it. I do know that Indigo Extreme seems expensive and I don't think it can be used more than one application.

Seems complicated to install as well. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=how%20many%20times%20and%20indigo%20xtreme%20be%20mounted%3F&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CD4QFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.indigo-xtreme.com%2Fdocs%2Findigoxtremeinstallation-1155-1156xtremeclean.pdf&ei=-76dUIGYH8ybjAK5xYHoDg&usg=AFQjCNHRGZSm2yDSWfd6CV_Y0IeRvE_Nrw

I doubt it would work for direct die application as well.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Too much of a hassle, and after seeing the w/mk data, Liquid Pro is the winner for me.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scutzi128*
> 
> Just bought a 3770k and I am going to delid this weekend. I was wondering though what is the difference in temperature from using the ihs with glue removed and better tim or just mounting to the bare die?


It's easier to mount with IHS on but from what I have read a properly mounted bare die application works better. I never tried it with the IHS but I was able to lower my temps a little over 26C per core under load on my overclocked i5-3570k at 4.5GHZ with a bare die to water block direct mount. (NO IHS)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I ordered a tube of liquid pro to replace my liquid ultra for the die (i figure I can use the ihs if switch to water anyways since the LP conducts like a boss) and I ordered a single pack of indigo extreme. I am hoping you are right and this will make my temps more in line with the temps I am seeing from others. I pictured mid 70's pushing 1.45v,, instead I am seeing upper 90's.


Tell me when you get it and ill help you out with it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> ^_______________________________________________^
> Me too! The V brothers have me on a quest to be the best! LOL


The V brothers??
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Birthday*
> 
> OCN name: Birthday
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: Antec 7
> ihs-TIM: Antec 7
> Mhz gained: 100-200
> OC after delid: 4532 MHz
> Temp drops: 5*C idle, 10*C load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2576433
> Oh my, I was skeptical about how this process would work for me, considering the fact that I had less than optimal cooling and motherboard options on hand. Apparently though, my fears were unfounded. Using my _fantastic_ CM TPC 812 cooler, with _amazing_ Antec 7 thermal paste, on my _wonderfu_l Asus P8z770v LX board... I am getting 4500 MHz at 71*C (23*C ambient) in prime95. 4600 MHz is seeming possible with temps in the high 70's, but that's going to take a little more work, especially with this motherboard.
> Here's a photo of my adventures:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Ill update you here in a sec Im doing some benches and getting closer to my goals on my 680 I need this sucker cold yet again.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I posted on post #2558 what I thought you should do. http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2558#post_18566312
> Anyhow I really am not up to speed on the reflow procedure or Indigo extreme. I will read up on it. I do know that Indigo Extreme seems expensive and I don't think it can be used more than one application.
> Seems complicated to install as well. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=how%20many%20times%20and%20indigo%20xtreme%20be%20mounted%3F&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CD4QFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.indigo-xtreme.com%2Fdocs%2Findigoxtremeinstallation-1155-1156xtremeclean.pdf&ei=-76dUIGYH8ybjAK5xYHoDg&usg=AFQjCNHRGZSm2yDSWfd6CV_Y0IeRvE_Nrw
> I doubt it would work for direct die application as well.


Do you guys want me to explain the reflow process??


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Successfully delid my 3570k.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 8 hours stable prime95:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: ketapang
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: Deepcool TIM
> ihs-TIM: Deepcool TIM
> Mhz gained: 100Mhz
> OC after delid: 4500Mhz
> Temp drops: 9c-10c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2574826


Accepted!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Could have sworn I already submitted, but can't find it now, anyway
> *OCN name:* Lobsterman
> *CPU:* 3770k
> *on die-TIM:* Coollabs Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Coollabs Liquid Ultra
> *Mhz gained:* 600
> *OC after delid:* 5.5 Max, 5.0 Daily
> *Temp drops:* ~20C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2572213


Accepted!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> *You are in control.
> You know you want to De-Lid.
> Just do It*!*
> 
> _*A friendly not for profit IB cooling delidding message. Be careful when Delidding._


Nice lol


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Do you guys want me to explain the reflow process??


If its easy to explain in simple terms please do.


----------



## FtW 420

Does anyone here run memory at 2600Mhz +? Playing with the delidded chip a bit, temps are down on air like I would expect, but this chip used to be able to boot 2600Mhz on air, & after delidding won't boot 2600Mhz strap anymore. Dual channel still OK, booting at 2400mhz I can still tighten timings down fine. I still have to run it colder & see if it still hits the higher straps with better temps.
This wasn't a benching chip so not really an issue, just wondering if anyone else has seen the IMC affected by delidding.


----------



## neopunx

The V brothers = Valgaur and VonDutch, as in 2/3s of the 5.5GHZ group, as in:










*You!!!!*

Found This. Perfect.

Valgaur
VonDutch

EDIT: Not sure on the rules.....so oh well.


----------



## martinhal

^^^ Nice one.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Does anyone here run memory at 2600Mhz +? Playing with the delidded chip a bit, temps are down on air like I would expect, but this chip used to be able to boot 2600Mhz on air, & after delidding won't boot 2600Mhz strap anymore. Dual channel still OK, booting at 2400mhz I can still tighten timings down fine. I still have to run it colder & see if it still hits the higher straps with better temps.
> This wasn't a benching chip so not really an issue, just wondering if anyone else has seen the IMC affected by delidding.


What MB? Possible MB cold bug due to lower temps?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> If its easy to explain in simple terms please do.


You lay your pc flat. heat up your processor and you leave your cooler OFF to ensure heat is there. wait until it's in the 80-90's for a bit and then put your pc upright. My tempos were in the 90's then I put pc upright they went down to 40........ it's so cool. there is an initial drop in the 90 when it melts and "reflows" then you stand your comp up like normal and you get the real results.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> What MB? Possible MB cold bug due to lower temps?


Was just going to post that I have to test it properly, could be an issue with mounting pressure. I just stuck a stock heatsink on it until I can find the mounting ring for the h50 (used that with IBT before delid so should use it to compare), but it isn't mounted, literally just placed on top of the cpu with no pressure. Forgot it wasn't properly mounted so jumped the gun a bit on my previous post.


----------



## feniks

huh! my CPU was accepted at Intel and new one is on its way








... hopefully it turns out better than the old one ... I'm sure it will be he he considering that former one was screwed up by my previous faulty board (evga Z77 FTL if anybody wonders)









hopefully by the end of next week I will have something to show (benchmarks), see you soon crew!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

do most of you put the IHS back on, or run bare-die ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> do most of you put the IHS back on, or run bare-die ?


most put ihs back on, it has its function of course
Sonda5 is our bare die specialist


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> most put ihs back on, it has its function of course
> Sonda5 is our bare die specialist


I actually put the one I jacked up back on bare-die by taking the holding part off the mobo (1 allen key on my mobo) and I just tightened my cooler down till it was tight. I didn't damage the chip any further and it was amazing low temps. I think I'm gonna have to de-lid this one but not run bare-die.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> The V brothers = Valgaur and VonDutch, as in 2/3s of the 5.5GHZ group, as in:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *You!!!!*
> Found This. Perfect.
> 
> Valgaur
> VonDutch
> EDIT: Not sure on the rules.....so oh well.


lol..

beats Dumb and Dumber,
have to say, they dont look much smarter tho ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> huh!


Erase that Feniks I don't want Intel catching on. Nice info but erase it please. and test the CPU before delidding it please!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Erase that Feniks I don't want Intel catching on. Nice info but erase it please. and test the CPU before delidding it please!


then you erase it also , from the quote....lol


----------



## Swag

Sorry, who's here is taking programming? I believe they were using Python but I forget.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scutzi128*
> 
> Just bought a 3770k and I am going to delid this weekend. I was wondering though what is the difference in temperature from using the ihs with glue removed and better tim or just mounting to the bare die?


theres not much difference, but much more trouble if you ask me,
because of the mounting direct on the die, the ihs has a protection function too..
its not like you gain another 5-10C if you dont use the ihs


----------



## neopunx

I am seriously considering semoving the bracket and IHS. Besides the whole "Destroying Your Die" and "Ruining a Good Chip" What are the cons? Did any of ya'll get temps before you direct mounted it for comparison?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I am seriously considering semoving the bracket and IHS. Besides the whole "Destroying Your Die" and "Ruining a Good Chip" What are the cons? Did any of ya'll get temps before you direct mounted it for comparison?


I haven't really seen a person destroy their die if they take proper precautions. You have to buy tiny washers so you can just put it where the screws are going to go. That way you don't crush your die.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

man I wish one of you guys lived near me so I could get you to de-lid my chip. im pretty sure I could do it successfully this time since I know what i did wrong before. I just can't afford to waste 200 again. I used a razor knife, the clickity click kind instead of just a razor blade. ARGHRGRHRGRH I wanna do it so bad now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I am seriously considering semoving the bracket and IHS. Besides the whole "Destroying Your Die" and "Ruining a Good Chip" What are the cons? Did any of ya'll get temps before you direct mounted it for comparison?


dude I ran the chip I nicked the pcb on, bare-die with my HS tightened down ALOT, and it did not damage it any further than I already had ( still just ran in single channel mem mode )


----------



## neopunx

Where do you live. Not that I want to stalk you or anything.....unless youre Natalie Portman.....then no promises.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> I actually put the one I jacked up back on bare-die by taking the holding part off the mobo (1 allen key on my mobo) and I just tightened my cooler down till it was tight. I didn't damage the chip any further and it was amazing low temps. I think I'm gonna have to de-lid this one but not run bare-die.


maybe its just me being to cautious
i really thought about doing it myself, remove the bracket etc
but then i got this pic in my head,
that my cooler is to heavy, about 1 Kilo, and it could/would damage the die
over longer time, by the pressure on one side,
like i said before, maybe its just me, and im totally wrong ..lol


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Where do you live. Not that I want to stalk you or anything.....unless youre Natalie Portman.....then no promises.


HAHAHA there are alot hotter chicks than natalie btw. I live in pittsburgh pennsylvania









i wonder how much further I could push my chip, right now i'm at 1.290 vcore / 4.5 ghz / 85c in IBT. I mean if I'm only gonna get to 4.7 by de-lidding the risk ain't worth it. I mean, nothing raises my temps high except prime/ibt anyway so right now temps aren't a real issue... I just wan't to be able to oc as high as possible like everyone else on this thread


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> man I wish one of you guys lived near me so I could get you to de-lid my chip. im pretty sure I could do it successfully this time since I know what i did wrong before. I just can't afford to waste 200 again. I used a razor knife, the clickity click kind instead of just a razor blade. ARGHRGRHRGRH I wanna do it so bad now.


practice some on old pentium's, i mean, i pay like a few bucks over here for those,
doesnt even have to be a working one too








we have a list that has some on it, that arent soldered..

i used a box cutter, others use that very thin razor blade,
i saw vid's that used a thick normal knife ..lol crazy, but it worked..
its still a matter of how to use it, not what you use..

haha, i found it, check this with a little sound on, bam bam bam ..lol


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> HAHAHA there are alot hotter chicks than natalie btw. I live in pittsburgh pennsylvania
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i wonder how much further I could push my chip, right now i'm at 1.290 vcore / 4.5 ghz / 85c in IBT. I mean if I'm only gonna get to 4.7 by de-lidding the risk ain't worth it. I mean, nothing raises my temps high except prime/ibt anyway so right now temps aren't a real issue... I just wan't to be able to oc as high as possible like everyone else on this thread











She is a godess and the Mother Of Luke! You take that back!

Good Day Sir







I said Good Day!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She is a godess and the Mother Of Luke! You take that back!
> Good Day Sir
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I said Good Day!


Someone is a huge star wars fan







don't get me wrong, i'd do her but trust me, much hotter chicks exist. katy perry is top of my list. Can't mention what i'd do to her here.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I met a girl from Costa Rica today...took my razor firmly and slit her glue in a single cut lol
She was a celeron 1.7 478 chip.
Not a single scratch and took me about 3 minutes, best advice ever:
Do it in a single motion using a razor, flexible double sided gillette.
I feel super confident now, I'd delid a 3970x if it were possible lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Erase that Feniks I don't want Intel catching on. Nice info but erase it please. and test the CPU before delidding it please!


edit the post erasing sensitive expressions from it









I am still going to delid it before install though. it's just such a PITA to clean my block (while connected to the loop), that I want to do all in one shot. Intel sends out the replacement cpus as tested. only risk I am taking is I end up with a bad clocker (with good temps LOL!).


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I met a girl from Costa Rica today...took my razor firmly and slit her glue in a single cut lol
> She was a celeron 1.7 478 chip.
> Not a single scratch and took me about 3 minutes, best advice ever:
> Do it in a single motion using a razor, flexible double sided gillette.
> I feel super confident now, I'd delid a 3970x if it were possible lol


Need to stress how forgiving these flexible blades are when delidding, a stiff blade isn't going to flex once in-between the IHS and the die! This is where the scratches come from, a flexible blade is well flexible and least likely to scratch your CPU's PCB.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Need to stress how forgiving these flexible blades are when delidding, a stiff blade isn't going to flex once in-between the IHS and the die! This is where the scratches come from, a flexible blade is well flexible and least likely to scratch your CPU's PCB.


what kind of blade exactly? post a pic?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> what kind of blade exactly? post a pic?




others say this works well


i used this..lol


edit:
removed a bad idea, sorry..


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> others say this works well
> 
> i used this..lol
> 
> this looks crazy, but i think it could work too,
> 
> that might look like a bad idea but really it is just a tack hammer and I was doing very very light taps with it,
> far gentler and more controlled than I was able to press on the razor blade with my hands.
> Maybe I'm just clumsy with my hands, in any event the hammer did the job and got the
> blade through all that adhesive all the way around the IHS without destroying the CPU.


yea, the one you used is the one I used and ruined my chip, I think the hammer idea looks really good. I have a whole pack of those triangle shaped blades and a rubber mallet. I just can't decide if I wanna try this again......


----------



## ivanlabrie

I vouch for the single motion cut, never removing the razor from the glue...can't go wrong unless you ruin it with static.


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4391159


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I vouch for the single motion cut, never removing the razor from the glue...can't go wrong unless you ruin it with static.


so basically you put the razor in one of the corners and never take it out? Just using your hands to push it in or, saw back and forth?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> yea, the one you used is the one I used and ruined my chip, I think the hammer idea looks really good. I have a whole pack of those triangle shaped blades and a rubber mallet. I just can't decide if I wanna try this again......


i think all of them work,
like that link i posted earlier, the one using a knife,
i would have thought a "normal" knife would be to thick,
but it worked for him tho..

if you have any doubt...dont do it,
its also a matter of being confident about doing it,
if you have any doubts, or only think "it might go wrong" or "what if.."
the chance you mess up is much bigger too









i just woke up one day, and thought, ..yes, today is the day, delid..
i felt confident that day about doing it, and it worked out,
even with the box cutter,
take your time is another tip i can give,
take a break if needed, or if your fingers/arm starts to cramp,
think about your next step carefully while taking a break, relax..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> so basically you put the razor in one of the corners and never take it out? Just using your hands to push it in or, saw back and forth?


Never use a hammer or other item to move the blade. it might hurt your hands but use your hands. you will have full control and feel everything.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

So the question is, what could I expect to gain if I do it successfully ? I think i'd just try with the triangle shaped razor blade in the single motion idea...

Maybe 200-500mhz extra? lower temps obviously.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Never use a hammer or other item to move the blade. it might hurt your hands but use your hands. you will have full control and feel everything.


edit,
removed a bad idea, sorry


----------



## neopunx

A hammer? Really? Lord help us.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> A hammer? Really? Lord help us.


lol,
yea, theres so many ways of doing the delid,
its a matter of finding the way thats works best for you..


----------



## Systemlord

The very first blade is the one that made it oh so easy!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> check idc's vid, hes using a tac hammer i bit further 1.18 min


GAH why the hammer!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> So the question is, what could I expect to gain if I do it successfully ? I think i'd just try with the triangle shaped razor blade in the single motion idea...
> Maybe 200-500mhz extra? lower temps obviously.


yes, yes ..and yes..
i delid because of the very high temps i had,
at 4.5ghz temps would go up to 105C within a few sec of running prime,
now i can run 4.8ghz easy 24/7, not limited in any way by temps anymore,
if i wasnt limited by vcore, my chip isnt that good, i could run 5ghz with np too,
like others with a better vcore chip


----------



## HardwareDecoder

omg... and that dude didn't break his chip and I did and I was so much more careful than he was


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> GAH why the hammer!!!


its just one(other) way of delidding, thought i mention it for others,
maybe they feel more confident if the are carpenter or anything like that ..haha


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its just one(other) way of delidding, thought i mention it for others,
> maybe they feel more confident if the are carpenter or anything like that ..haha


I have done a good bit of demolition work, a hammer is good for driving nails, removing them. and generally destroying stuff. I would probably use a rubber mallet instead, if you slip and hit something like your finger you will do alot less damage, and it will have the same effect of pushing the razor in to the glue....


----------



## Systemlord

Any even considering anything other than a blade quite frankly should just forget about delidding, seriously folks! I did mine in less than ten minutes and it did not require much effort, slid the double sided blade under each corner and slid the blade along the sides making notes on staying very near the edge. You won't believe how easy the double sided blade slices through the black glue, finger power is all that you need.


----------



## neopunx

Dear God take the hammer picture down! We are going to have idiots trying it and then telling everyone we told them to do it. Then we are going to get a bad rep, the mods will swoop down on us like angles of death, and I will loose my favorite thread!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> I have done a good bit of demolition work, a hammer is good for driving nails, removing them. and generally destroying stuff. I would probably use a rubber mallet instead, if you slip and hit something like your finger you will do alot less damage, and it will have the same effect of pushing the razor in to the glue....


demolition work..destroying stuff??

man, now i regret i even mentioned it ..lol
(wheres that delete button?)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Dear God take the hammer picture down! We are going to have idiots trying it and then telling everyone we told them to do it. Then we are going to get a bad rep, the mods will swoop down on us like angles of death, and I will loose my favorite thread!


that will happen anyways, one dead chip,
and they all over us, saying delidding is bad, bla bla bla..

we dont have this on page 1 for nothing,

*Disclaimer
delidding is a very dangerous process! Only delid if you truly believe you are ready after reading
and watching and viewing all the necessary materials that apply to delidding and getting all necessary equipment ready as well!*

its more us always talking so positive about delidding is easy to do, which it is,
the actual process isnt hard at all, we know that.. that makes peeps think too that its easy..
wish we could find a way that is easy, a way without any chance to damage the pcb in any way ...

still trying to find a very thin, credit card like thing to use, plastic is a good option, better then metal..
you know those machines that can put foil around paper or cards for protection ..laminator



you could use that, using a thin card and laminate it, credit cards are to thick to start with


----------



## VonDutch

Did anyone ever think about to use a substance that can dissolve the adhesive?
use a seringe like liquid pro, to get it between the pcb and ihs,
let it soak for a while, then pop it of?


----------



## neopunx

Not sure how good of an idea to put ANYTHING that could disolve that cement onto the the PCB would be. If it even has a chance of eating through the protecitve coat....youwell and truely F'd. What kind of chemical were you thinking of...I think battery acid might work on the glue...not sure how the chipwould fair though....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Not sure how good of an idea to put ANYTHING that could disolve that cement onto the the PCB would be. If it even has a chance of eating through the protecitve coat....youwell and truely F'd. What kind of chemical were you thinking of...I think battery acid might work on the glue...not sure how the chipwould fair though....


im really not sure, just a idea i just had, of course it shouldnt dissolve the pcb..lol
the pcb is made from other material then the adhesive..
i have a old pentium here now, if its the same adhesive they use on the 3770k,
i could open it, and try find something that only dissolves that..
trying to think about other/safe ways of delidding here, thats all..


----------



## neopunx

Thats actually a good idea from a testing stand point. Maybe watered down Vinegar? You could ball up some glue, get 5 shot glasses, mix diff levels/mixtures of vinegar/water and see if any desolve the glue. Maybe try some goo gone also? Same type of test. Then try the best mixes on the PCB. Let them sit as long as it takes to dissolve the glue( if they do) and then thourghly clean the chip. Then let chip dry overnight/for a day, check it out with a magnifying glass and see if there is any damage. Then again, Im a dumb Army grunt, so maybe you should ask one of these college grads if Im speaking out of my A**.

EDIT: Sorry about the spelling...read again dumb army grunt...


----------



## Systemlord

I think it would be a good idea if the OP linked a few delidding YouTube videos as this shows any newcomer how to really do it safely the first time.


----------



## neopunx

Yes, videos would be good. I went off of some japanese web site that wasnt even in english, no videos, and most the stuff was drawings if I remember correctly. But I figured, what the hell. it worked out for me.


----------



## VonDutch

just killed a soldered pentium..lol
we tried various ways, one that was nice using a fishing line,
attached to 2 screwdrivers..it worked, but you need 4 hands for that...
we did everything really rough, when i popped off, we didnt even had 1 scratch on the pcb..

will look into it some more using sewing thread thats strong enough,
the fishline very worked, but is to "smooth"..sewing thread is different,
takes more time of course then using razor blades etc, but surely is a safe way









o, and ive let my kid do almost all the work, working around the edges with the boxcutter,
i only explained what he had to do..like i said, not 1 scratch on the pcb later ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I think it would be a good idea if the OP linked a few delidding YouTube videos as this shows any newcomer how to really do it safely the first time.


np, will work on getting all the vid's together and post them,the best ones, for OP


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just killed a soldered pentium..lol
> we tried various ways, one that was nice using a fishing line,
> attached to 2 screwdrivers..it worked, but you need 4 hands for that...
> we did everything really rough, when i popped off, we didnt even had 1 scratch on the pcb..
> will look into it some more using sewing thread thats strong enough,
> the fishline very worked, but is to "smooth"..sewing thread is different,
> takes more time of course then using razor blades etc, but surely is a safe way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, and ive let my kid do almost all the work, working around the edges with the boxcutter,
> i only explained what he had to do..like i said, not 1 scratch on the pcb later ..


Hot Dang! You sir are trying to Get the Nobel Prize for Planitary Unification/Delidding. Keep up the fun experiments!


----------



## Lobsterman

Hey well I used a tack hammer , like the 1 shown in the vid on the previous page. Found it very effective for along the straight edges as you just let the weight of the hammer do the work for you for you, very light taps is all you need.
Obvuiously if your not comfortable with it don't do it that way


----------



## VonDutch

well, we just finished the second pentium,
we even got the soldered ihs off, with little effort really ..lol









we used just a lighter you see on the next pic, so funny

we still have 1 pentium left now, i think were gonna record the whole process for you all









we did put the 2 razorblades between the ihs and pcb, hung it upside
down between 2 drinking glasses, taped , and all we did was holding
the lighter under it, just 1-2 seconds everytime, after about 3 min doing so, it just fell off,
one funny experiment that was, and easy to do ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Hey well I used a tack hammer , like the 1 shown in the vid on the previous page. Found it very effective for along the straight edges as you just let the weight of the hammer do the work for you for you, very light taps is all you need.
> Obvuiously if your not comfortable with it don't do it that way


yea, you still have to cut the corners first, like i said,
it could work for others ..but got to many comments, so wanted to take it off again..lol
but thanks for confirming it worked well for you


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im really not sure, just a idea i just had, of course it shouldnt dissolve the pcb..lol
> the pcb is made from other material then the adhesive..
> i have a old pentium here now, if its the same adhesive they use on the 3770k,
> i could open it, and try find something that only dissolves that..
> trying to think about other/safe ways of delidding here, thats all..


If you are serious about this I can tell you the best way to go about it. Scrape the adhesive off of the pcb and save it. Then line up several test tubes full of potential solvents (I honestly think the ones that work easily would be difficault for you to get your hands on because they are also carcinogenic and not just anyone can buy them, besides acetone which is nail polish remover, you could try paint thinner also I guess but it would need to be washed off with another volatile solvent instead of air dried) and put a little glob of the black glue in each test tube and let it soak for 10 minutes. If the glue breaks up or dissolves you are onto your next test, will it harm the pcb (obviously you would want a donated killed chip for this one, I am sure with your 5.7GHz overclocks on air you have one or two of these around







). If you need anymore tips I am a chemist, just don't ask me to send you solvents because that is obviously not legal. One guy said a weak acetic acid solution (diluted vinegar), the functional group has a shot at working but I would think acetone would cover similar ground. Anways good luck


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If you are serious about this I can tell you the best way to go about it. Scrape the adhesive off of the pcb and save it. Then line up several test tubes full of potential solvents (I honestly think the ones that work easily would be difficault for you to get your hands on because they are also carcinogenic and not just anyone can buy them, besides acetone which is nail polish remover, you could try paint thinner also I guess but it would need to be washed off with another volatile solvent instead of air dried) and put a little glob of the black glue in each test tube and let it soak for 10 minutes. If the glue breaks up or dissolves you are onto your next test, will it harm the pcb (obviously you would want a donated killed chip for this one, I am sure with your 5.7GHz overclocks on air you have one or two of these around
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). If you need anymore tips I am a chemist, just don't ask me to send you solvents because that is obviously not legal. One guy said a weak acetic acid solution (diluted vinegar), the functional group has a shot at working but I would think acetone would cover similar ground. Anways good luck


great , would love to work with you on this,
you know what could work if your a chemist,
i can get almost anything i need where i live,
in the chemical dep. that is ..lol

i will save all the adhesive coming from the pentiums tho, and experiment on that,

and no...i didnt kill any chip yet, i only have the one i delidded, my BamBam ..
left alone i have money to replace ..lol

i practice on old pentiums i found laying around,
and let my kid( hes just 15 years old) do the work, so he can learn some things too,
delidding etc ...


----------



## ivanlabrie

My dad used to give me some pc parts to build, connectors to plug. and the like when I was 7. Built my first rig at age 14 with minor help from him. It was a pentium 3 600mhz b with a voodoo 3 3500 agp and 128mb rdram lol
That's quality time there VonDutch! Props...
Nice find onn the fishing linne, and godspeed with the experiments.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> My dad used to give me some pc parts to build, connectors to plug. and the like when I was 7. Built my first rig at age 14 with minor help from him. It was a pentium 3 600mhz b with a voodoo 3 3500 agp and 128mb rdram lol
> That's quality time there VonDutch! Props...
> Nice find onn the fishing linne, and godspeed with the experiments.


we just bought some "iron" yarn, my mum used to use it,
i thought it would be great to cut through the adhesive..

didnt work well tho, not strong enough, snapped after a few times, but it started to cut through the corners already,
next try would be with a thin steel wire, kiddo is on it ..lol

i teached them chess on age 4-5 lol,
and alot about computers, now they are 14 and 15,
and they know so much more then other kids








when your so young, you pick up things very quick see..
well, you know what i mean, you had a dad like that ...lol


----------



## chris-br

OCN name: Chris-br
CPU: i5 3570k
on die-TIM: MX-4
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: same 4500Mhz
Temp drops: 10c-12c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2577252

Once i get the Liquid PRO, I will post the new results.







But for now I'm in the club.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Chris-br
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: MX-4
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: same 4500Mhz
> Temp drops: 10c-12c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2577252
> Once i get the Liquid PRO, I will post the new results.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But for now I'm in the club.


Welcome chris-br, looks good..nice job delidding








what did you use? razor blade or.?


----------



## chris-br

Yeah, those old style razor blades, very flexible and double edge, very dangerous cuz you can cut your self, but they are really good cuz you dont scratch the pcb.









EDIT Funny thing is that noe core #3 is the hottest, like 5c above the lower one.


----------



## chris-br

Now where do i get that sig with the fire burning on the little devil's head?


----------



## Birthday

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Yeah, those old style razor blades, very flexible and double edge, very dangerous cuz you can cut your self


Those double-edge razor blades are designed to snap in half along the center groove. It's a lot safer, and allows slightly more control.


----------



## chris-br

VonDutch, i want the same sig as you. where to i get it?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> VonDutch, i want the same sig as you. where to i get it?


Its on the front page.


----------



## Birthday

The one with the devils, like VonDutch has, is on the third page of this thread. Post #26.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Birthday*
> 
> The one with the devils, like VonDutch has, is on the third page of this thread. Post #26.


Oh I see. Lol. You'll have to edit your SIG and just delete the skulls and put the devils in its place. When he first put that SIG up it was that way then they changed it to its current style.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

wondering about using a razor blade but with scotch ( the brown paperish tape) on it, so it isnt sharp enough to scratch the pcb.


----------



## neopunx

My fault!


----------



## chris-br

Ok, thanks, now im happy. ;P


----------



## Birthday

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> wondering about using a razor blade but with scotch ( the brown paperish tape) on it, so it isnt sharp enough to scratch the pcb.


If you're really worried about scratching the PCB, you can try (very slightly) rounding off the corners of your razor blade with either a sharpening stone or some sandpaper. A right angle is far more likely to nick the PCB.

Another thing to do is avoid moving forward after the blade has come to a halt. Ceasing forward motion allows the edge to settle into the PCB, and you lose the advantage of a noticeable change in resistance to your cut.


----------



## VonDutch

well, we had dinner, but before that my kiddo started with a delid,

i will make it 1 movie later, but heres just a first part, where he cuts one corner,
took him about 2 min




somehow if i use video(), it shows but doesnt play on this site, so i only have the link..

we used a old pentium again, a soldered one, and really , it was hard to cut through the adhesive..lol,
because it was a old..

i also recorded our way to get a soldered ihs off, easy really,
and..we did 2 sides with the hammer technique, i will post it all later


----------



## chris-br

Add me to the list.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Add me to the list.


sup with the long face chris?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ok, got two 775 chips and a gigabyte 775 945 mobo...might have some fun tonight lol


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> sup with the long face chris?


You didn't say.... "accepted" and my name is not on the list.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> You didn't say.... "accepted" and my name is not on the list.


Valgaur has to do it we can not


----------



## chris-br

OOPS.. sorry


----------



## kzim9

So I couldn't wait for the Cool Labs to get here, and just put some MX-4 on the die and used stock TIM from the H80.

Just started to OC the chip.

3770K w/ H80

4.8GHz @ 1.300v

Not seeing anything higher than 72'c, and my H80 is not even ramped up. This rig is actually very quiet and its been an hour just about running AIDA64.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> So I couldn't wait for the Cool Labs to get here, and just put some MX-4 on the die and used stock TIM from the H80.
> Just started to OC the chip.
> 3770K w/ H80
> 4.8GHz @ 1.300v
> Not seeing anything higher than 72'c, and my H80 is not even ramped up. This rig is actually very quiet and its been an hour just about running AIDA64.


nice








did you make some before and after delid temps etc?
yea, i didnt have coolabs, and used AS5 at first,
didnt have the money at first to buy some,
but as5 already got temps down by about 10C..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Did anyone ever think about to use a substance that can dissolve the adhesive?
> use a seringe like liquid pro, to get it between the pcb and ihs,
> let it soak for a while, then pop it of?


I have thought about that a lot lately actually along with other ways to do this. I bet we could even use very thin piano wire and since it's slightly rough we could just move it back and forth and voila!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> great , would love to work with you on this,
> you know what could work if your a chemist,
> i can get almost anything i need where i live,
> in the chemical dep. that is ..lol
> i will save all the adhesive coming from the pentiums tho, and experiment on that,
> 
> and no...i didnt kill any chip yet, i only have the one i delidded, my BamBam ..
> left alone i have money to replace ..lol
> i practice on old pentiums i found laying around,
> and let my kid( hes just 15 years old) do the work, so he can learn some things too,
> delidding etc ...


Nice! Quit beating me in my own thread!! Well I guess we are the V brothers lol.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Chris-br
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: MX-4
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: same 4500Mhz
> Temp drops: 10c-12c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2577252
> Once i get the Liquid PRO, I will post the new results.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But for now I'm in the club.


Accepted!







And welcome!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Yeah, those old style razor blades, very flexible and double edge, very dangerous cuz you can cut your self, but they are really good cuz you dont scratch the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT Funny thing is that noe core #3 is the hottest, like 5c above the lower one.


I agree thats why I don't like the double bladed ones I don't want to see members getting fingers nearly sliced off. I highly suggest we don't rewcommend those even if they are good at their job I don't want people losing limbs!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Now where do i get that sig with the fire burning on the little devil's head?


You got it from VonDutch silly!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, we had dinner, but before that my kiddo started with a delid,
> i will make it 1 movie later, but heres just a first part, where he cuts one corner,
> took him about 2 min
> 
> 
> 
> 
> somehow if i use video(), it shows but doesnt play on this site, so i only have the link..
> we used a old pentium again, a soldered one, and really , it was hard to cut through the adhesive..lol,
> because it was a old..
> i also recorded our way to get a soldered ihs off, easy really,
> and..we did 2 sides with the hammer technique, i will post it all later


I said quit beating me!!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Add me to the list.


You are now silly head!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valgaur has to do it we can not



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> So I couldn't wait for the Cool Labs to get here, and just put some MX-4 on the die and used stock TIM from the H80.
> Just started to OC the chip.
> 3770K w/ H80
> 4.8GHz @ 1.300v
> Not seeing anything higher than 72'c, and my H80 is not even ramped up. This rig is actually very quiet and its been an hour just about running AIDA64.


Nice!

On the side note I work for 7 hours today woo hoo.... BUT on the side note I'm a fully fledged RAZER representative now. Thats why I've been so busy these last few days. Took lots of time and I'm doing lots of benching for OCN team. I'll be more frequent in here now lol.







but for now I gtg lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> OOPS.. sorry


hes captain of the delidded crew so,
i will apply for a chief position, then next time i can say "youre accepted!!"..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I have thought about that a lot lately actually along with other ways to do this. I bet we could even use very thin piano wire and since it's slightly rough we could just move it back and forth and voila!
> Nice! Quit beating me in my own thread!! Well I guess we are the V brothers lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I said quit beating me!!!!


you know i mean wel V bro ..right?









i will look into the piano wire, we have a music store here...good idea..


----------



## lilchronic

this is what i did to mine ruined


----------



## VonDutch

@lilchronic, that doesnt look good at all man..dang,
did you even try put it back and boot it?

Hammertime!





my 15 year old on his first delid


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> @lilchronic, that doesnt look good at all man..dang,
> did you even try put it back and boot it?
> Hammertime!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my 15 year old on his first delid


Here is why ... look at tools used .. http://www.overclock.net/t/1321779/3570k-golden-chip/100_20#post_18573354


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Here is why ... look at tools used .. http://www.overclock.net/t/1321779/3570k-golden-chip/100_20#post_18573354


yea chronic you must have been blazed when you did that, that knife you used doesn't even look sharp.....

I know I screwed one up but mine looked NOTHING like yours lol.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> yea chronic you must have been blazed when you did that, that knife you used doesn't even look sharp.....
> I know I screwed one up but mine looked NOTHING like yours lol.


Only good thing that came out of that was that he got lucky with an awesome Golden 3570k replacement.


----------



## Hokies83

I donno using that blade to de lid a cpu,,,, kinda looks like this....



Might as well went Indian style on that mofo lol


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno using that blade to de lid a cpu,,,, kinda looks like this....
> 
> Might as well went Indian style on that mofo lol


LOL.. True, with that blade.............. you want the thinest and sharpest blade possible.. That is why i did use a razor blade.


----------



## Phobos223

Alrighty! Make me official!!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Alrighty! Make me official!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Awesome, nice job.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Alrighty! Make me official!!


Grats!

Now you just have to wait for Valguar to finish watching Porn ..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Grats!
> Now you just have to wait for Valguar to finish watching Porn ..


If onlyi could at work.


----------



## lilchronic

nice kiit but blades werent long enough the tip of the blade dug into the pcb


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Only good thing that came out of that was that he got lucky with an awesome Golden 3570k replacement.


its the macro shot lol
made it look real bad maybe i need glasses


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> @lilchronic, that doesnt look good at all man..dang,
> did you even try put it back and boot it?
> Hammertime!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my 15 year old on his first delid


yea it just wouldnt boot


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> yea chronic you must have been blazed when you did that, that knife you used doesn't even look sharp.....
> I know I screwed one up but mine looked NOTHING like yours lol.


lol did u take a macro? mine didnt look that bad before i took a pic once i saw it real close omg what did i do


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol did u take a macro? mine didnt look that bad before i took a pic once i saw it real close omg what did i do


Again mine looks nothing like yours. That's why mine still functions perfectly, except only in single channel memory mode. Honestly dude you butchered that chip. I wouldn't do another one if i was you.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Again mine looks nothing like yours. That's why mine still functions perfectly, except only in single channel memory mode. Honestly dude you butchered that chip. I wouldn't do another one if i was you.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


hahahah. Yea it really kills me being lumped together with him as people who have failed at de-lidding atleast once. I mean honestly his chip looks like it was tortured. I'd post a pic of my chip but my buddy is using it perfectly fine as a nice upgrade from his athlon 6400 X2 or whatever that old POS machine he had was.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> hahahah. Yea it really kills me being lumped together with him as people who have failed at de-lidding atleast once. I mean honestly his chip looks like it was tortured. I'd post a pic of my chip but my buddy is using it perfectly fine as a nice upgrade from his athlon 6400 X2 or whatever that old POS machine he had was.


lmao i no i butcherd it. its the pos razor kit i used


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lmao i no i butcherd it. its the pos razor kit i used


I used the wrong razor too, the clicky type razor knife was stupid. the flat square/triangle shaped blade is def the way to go. With patience and not hammers.

Oh well I won't be doing this chip since I am happy with 4.5 ghz and my temps are fine + I don't have $200 to spend right now I've spent $1000 getting a new puppy/vet bills already. My temps are fine anyway, they only get high from prime/IBT and even then they are well under TJMAX. Bottom line I'd probably not see any better FPS in gaming which is basically all I do with my pc so why bother, I wish I never did the first one as it was already at least a 'silver' chip if not gold.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> I used the wrong razor too, the clicky type razor knife was stupid. the flat square/triangle shaped blade is def the way to go. With patience and not hammers.
> Oh well I won't be doing this chip since I am happy with 4.5 ghz and my temps are fine + I don't have $200 to spend right now I've spent $1000 getting a new puppy/vet bills already. My temps are fine anyway, they only get high from prime/IBT and even then they are well under TJMAX. Bottom line I'd probably not see any better FPS in gaming which is basically all I do with my pc so why bother, I wish I never did the first one as it was already at least a 'silver' chip if not gold.


my first chip was the worst 3570k ever made 4.5ghz @ 1.325v temps 90-95
thats as high as it would go but i never went past 1.45v to check so who knows
POS


----------



## Valgaur

Okay thats it. for all the delidders and future delidders I am making a rule of what blades to use and thats final. If one does not have either of these blades that we agree on one should not be delidding in the first place. that we we can all be confident in the blade and the user.

Please tell me your guy's responses and *DON'T MAKE SUGGESTIONS YET*

If we are going to truly provide the best recommendations to our future members and other people out their we CANNOT recommend shoty equipment. We must decide as a group and be able to prove who has use it and who recommends it. This club isn't here to just talk about delidding and have fun and poke at people but to provide the best information that we can must on delidding and how to do it safely. If we say the rewards are so worth it why don't we make this the best guide out there for the Ivy Bridge family members!

Thanks again guys!









P.S. VonDutch I agree with you being my chief but I'll make you my other Vice-Captain as well. Haven't seen PC in a while (people get busy)









P.S.S. Anyone see my earlier post about RAZER and me?







Just want to say that I'm somewhat getting recognized in the gaming industry and Might be applying as a hardware rep for them as well for here.

P.S.S.S I "Think" I found a pot as well lol.


----------



## Hokies83

1. Break Corners with a Thin Razor..

2. Finish with Sturdy Credit card...

Seems the Safest Method imo..


----------



## Phobos223

Well finally got to test out my rig after de-lidding... I didn't really OC it at all before I de-lidded, but running at 3.9GHz with full BOINC load it would be up in the high 50s...

This it with a 25C ambient @ 4.8Ghz... am running 5.01 Ghz right now Prime 95 and temps are almost identical to this!



Amazing difference.. and this is with a single BI GTX 120mm rad!!


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay thats it. for all the delidders and future delidders I am making a rule of what blades to use and thats final. If one does not have either of these blades that we agree on one should not be delidding in the first place. that we we can all be confident in the blade and the user.
> Please tell me your guy's responses and *DON'T MAKE SUGGESTIONS YET*
> If we are going to truly provide the best recommendations to our future members and other people out their we CANNOT recommend shoty equipment. We must decide as a group and be able to prove who has use it and who recommends it. This club isn't here to just talk about delidding and have fun and poke at people but to provide the best information that we can must on delidding and how to do it safely. If we say the rewards are so worth it why don't we make this the best guide out there for the Ivy Bridge family members!
> Thanks again guys!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S. VonDutch I agree with you being my chief but I'll make you my other Vice-Captain as well. Haven't seen PC in a while (people get busy)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S.S. Anyone see my earlier post about RAZER and me?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just want to say that I'm somewhat getting recognized in the gaming industry and Might be applying as a hardware rep for them as well for here.
> P.S.S.S I "Think" I found a pot as well lol.


Ok
1# I use a box cutter.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Well finally got to test out my rig after de-lidding... I didn't really OC it at all before I de-lidded, but running at 3.9GHz with full BOINC load it would be up in the high 50s...
> This it with a 25C ambient @ 4.8Ghz... am running 5.01 Ghz right now Prime 95 and temps are almost identical to this!
> 
> Amazing difference.. and this is with a single BI GTX 120mm rad!!


Grats!


----------



## Birthday

Old fashioned double-edged razor blades are just classy.

As a razor enthusiast, they get my vote.


----------



## Phobos223

Ok last run of the night... still can't believe how good the delid + LP Ultra did...

5Ghz @ 1.472V



I don't even need this much voltage for 5Ghz, but was curious how hot it would get.... What the safe max on these chips? 1.5ish?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Ok last run of the night... still can't believe how good the delid + LP Ultra did...
> 5Ghz @ 1.472V
> 
> I don't even need this much voltage for 5Ghz, but was curious how hot it would get.... What the safe max on these chips? 1.5ish?


I think i used the most voltage here for a 24/7 OC 5.1ghz 1.55v but Vdroops to 1.53 at idle.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Ok last run of the night... still can't believe how good the delid + LP Ultra did...
> 5Ghz @ 1.472V
> 
> I don't even need this much voltage for 5Ghz, but was curious how hot it would get.... What the safe max on these chips? 1.5ish?


I thought it was 1.4 via intel...


----------



## neopunx

Well, I switched over to CL Pro and Indigo X. Only got a 4 degree drop. Shoot. Oh well. Maybe it will bake in a little and drop a few more deg. On a side not, CL Ultra left some crazy stuff on all the metal surfaces, like small bonded patches, and turned my super shinny copper IHS and WB Silver. I had to relap them, not do to the color, but because of the Bonded elements and groves that were now on both. Crazy. See Below for the pitting.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> I thought it was 1.4 via intel...


1.52 Via Intel

Anywho.. since ppl have been putting 1.95v into these things on H-100s multi times with no ill effects I tend to think it may be safe to even up to 1.6v...

No reports of any degrading chips on Ivy..

However When Sandy was new People will killing chips and degrading with 1.5v.. so that just tells us how much better these Ivy Chips take Volts.. they seem to love it.


----------



## neopunx

I recommend the double sided razor blade with duct tape on one side for saftey.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I recommend the double sided razor blade with duct tape on one side for saftey.


Yea man thats what I kinda meant when I said a razor w/ like scotch tape on it. God you mofos make me wont to de-lid


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Yea man thats what I kinda meant when I said a razor w/ like scotch tape on it. God you mofos make me wont to de-lid


You know you wanna.. you cant even stand still you want to so bad..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.52 Via Intel
> Anywho.. since ppl have been putting 1.95v into these things on H-100s multi times with no ill effects I tend to think it may be safe to even up to 1.6v...
> No reports of any degrading chips on Ivy..
> However When Sandy was new People will killing chips and degrading with 1.5v.. so that just tells us how much better these Ivy Chips take Volts.. they seem to love it.


*cough* *cough* 1.98 VCORE thank you very much.

I can't wait until I can get Franky under the Dice or even Ln2!!!! SUPER PUMPED!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You know you wanna.. you cant even stand still you want to so bad..


Dude thats exactly how I feel. Like I was some tweaker junky or something....

I need someone local who is a de-lid pro i'd even pay like $10 bucks or something lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *cough* *cough* 1.98 VCORE thank you very much.
> I can't wait until I can get Franky under the Dice or even Ln2!!!! SUPER PUMPED!


Hahahaha you named your chip franky? Awesome.


----------



## Birthday

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I recommend the double sided razor blade with duct tape on one side for saftey.


You can also snap them in half easily, so as to have a less dangerous grip. I broke mine in half for initially penetrating the corners, then switched to a whole one for continued slicing.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Dude thats exactly how I feel. Like I was some tweaker junky or something....
> I need someone local who is a de-lid pro i'd even pay like $10 bucks or something lol.
> Hahahaha you named your chip franky? Awesome.


You can do it!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Dude thats exactly how I feel. Like I was some tweaker junky or something....
> I need someone local who is a de-lid pro i'd even pay like $10 bucks or something lol.
> Hahahaha you named your chip franky? Awesome.


Heck ya I did you gotta believe in your equipment!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> others say this works well
> 
> i used this..lol
> 
> edit:
> removed the hammer method as a bad idea, sorry..


morning, reading through the posts from last night,
so we can agree about the 3 pics i posted earlier,
to be the most safe to use?

using one of those should do it, as best/proven methods ?
and in the order shown above,
addition can be made later, if we find more or even better ways to delid,

about cleaning the adhesive on pcb and underside ihs,
1. use fingernails
2. use a creditcard
3. rubbing alcohol or spiritus, to clean die, and/or the last bits of adhesive

altho the rubbing alcohol wont clean the adhesive when its still untouched,
just after delid..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1. Break Corners with a Thin Razor..
> 2. Finish with Sturdy Credit card...
> Seems the Safest Method imo..


yes, but a normal credit card is a bit thick, could bent the pcb,
still looking for something like a credit card, but thinner,(about half as thick or less)
and easy to get/find for everyone..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> I thought it was 1.4 via intel...


i looked into this, because it isnt clear for everyone or some peeps,
and got comments from peeps when i used 1.52V vcore max.

this graph from sin0822 guide says 1.52V vcore as Intel's max recommended..

but intel doesnt state this anywhere , except in their data sheets,
but there they talk about Max. VID..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Hello Sin0822
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup,
> many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore
> should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*.
> in regard to this post i made,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition/1860#post_18501975
> can you tell me where you got the info from, the statement you made
> about intel's recommended max is 1.52V?
> a few times now peeps comment on me using the 1.52V as max vcore,
> *i did contact intel support about it, weeks ago, and he showed me datasheet 1,
> sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4*
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
> im not that technical etc, i see they talk about VID, and VID range, max 1.52V,
> not max vcore..
> just want to make sure i can explain well to others,
> and the why and where etc ...you know how it goes,
> "we need proof"..other wise its bs ...lol
> thanks in advance for helping,
> or anyone else who can help me with this


sin didnt answer yet, but someone else said this,

I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered
the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
for consumer usage. LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting.

so, after doing all this "research", if anyone asking me about max. vcore , i will say 1.52V
for the "safe" vcores, 1.3-1.45V


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> I recommend the double sided razor blade with duct tape on one side for saftey.


Cough... Cough ^^

Successful delidder's should post what worked for them and compare notes with all of the other successful delidder's, this way we have what actually worked. What do you think *Valgaur*?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i looked into this, because it isnt clear for everyone or some peeps,
> and got comments from peeps when i used 1.52V vcore max.
> 
> this graph from sin0822 guide says 1.52V vcore as Intel's max recommended..
> but intel doesnt state this anywhere , except in their data sheets,
> but there they talk about Max. VID..
> sin didnt answer yet, but someone else said this,
> I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered
> the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
> for consumer usage. LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
> should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting.
> so, after doing all this "research", if anyone asking me about max. vcore , i will say 1.52V
> for the "safe" vcores, 1.3-1.45V


I still say 1.55

There is no degrading going on...

It could also depend on how good of a MB u have to regulate that voltage to..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I still say 1.55
> There is no degrading going on...
> It could also depend on how good of a MB u have to regulate that voltage to..


i know,
and the graph says also,
sin's idea of max, 1.55V on air/h2o..
bet you can up that some more, say 1.560-1.570 without running into problems,
its just that i wouldnt remommend it to everyone/anyone, if asked about max. vcores..
1.52V what ive seen used most when i looked into this, so i will go with that









like i said before about delid, and using a hammer for the long sides, after cutting in the corners,
it works, but its not recommended..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i know,
> and the graph says also,
> sin's idea of max, 1.55V on air/h2o..
> bet you can up that some more, say 1.560-1.575 without running into problems,
> its just that i wouldnt remommend it to everyone/anyone, if asked about max. vcores..
> 1.52V what ive seen used most when i looked into this, so i will go with that


Sin told me to not go past 1.6v.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I agree on the 1.6v max...on ambient cooling.
I think Hokie has a solid idea I'd like to expand:

-begin by breaking into a corner using a double edgge razor, but do it like this!
Bend the razor holding it from each end and pressing upwards, making a U shape to sort of hook the ihs over the pcb.
That's the absolute best and safer way to do the initial break in through the glue (specially if your chip was uinder a silver arrow like mine)
-once you do this you have two choices:
1)either make sure to be paralell tto the pcb and straighten the blade again and cut around the ihs in a single motion
Or 2)use a credit card or something similar and thinner.
3)remove glue carefully using fingernails, but only with not too sharp nails.
4)be extra careful with the mount...
5) Have fun!!!


----------



## VonDutch

i disagree with the 1.6V, sorry..

its based on 1 person saying so,
and another agreeing with him,

if 1 person says, its like this, is it the absolute truth?,
while every other info i could find, and people i talked to about it, says otherwise,
even intels own data sheets?
ok now you can argue with me, it isnt specific said so in the intel datasheets..

we all know our chips can take alot if it comes to Vcores we can run through it, np..
I think Valgaur , hokies, some others proved that by now..

1.52V vcore is what i will use as max. recommended on air when asked








with a side note saying, "some"(like sin) say 1.55V as max


----------



## Hokies83

I will say 1.55v







cause i been runing it a month 30hrs of stress test 225hrs of gaming and 20 hrs of benching.. And computer being on 24/7 7 days a week for over a month with Zero issues.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> morning, reading through the posts from last night,
> so we can agree about the 3 pics i posted earlier,
> to be the most safe to use?
> using one of those should do it, as best/proven methods ?
> and in the order shown above,
> addition can be made later, if we find more or even better ways to delid,
> about cleaning the adhesive on pcb and underside ihs,
> 1. use fingernails
> 2. use a creditcard
> 3. rubbing alcohol or spiritus, to clean die, and/or the last bits of adhesive
> altho the rubbing alcohol wont clean the adhesive when its still untouched,
> just after delid..
> yes, but a normal credit card is a bit thick, could bent the pcb,
> still looking for something like a credit card, but thinner,(about half as thick or less)
> and easy to get/find for everyone..


I like this idea the most really. keeps it nice and clean and goes with what we have been thinking and saying for a while. and those three blades I agree with as well.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Cough... Cough ^^
> Successful delidder's should post what worked for them and compare notes with all of the other successful delidder's, this way we have what actually worked. What do you think *Valgaur*?


YES
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I agree on the 1.6v max...on ambient cooling.
> I think Hokie has a solid idea I'd like to expand:
> -begin by breaking into a corner using a double edgge razor, but do it like this!
> Bend the razor holding it from each end and pressing upwards, making a U shape to sort of hook the ihs over the pcb.
> That's the absolute best and safer way to do the initial break in through the glue (specially if your chip was uinder a silver arrow like mine)
> -once you do this you have two choices:
> 1)either make sure to be paralell tto the pcb and straighten the blade again and cut around the ihs in a single motion
> Or 2)use a credit card or something similar and thinner.
> 3)remove glue carefully using fingernails, but only with not too sharp nails.
> 4)be extra careful with the mount...
> 5) Have fun!!!


Same idea.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

OCN name:Socks Keep You Warm
CPU:3770K
on die-TIM:Gelid GC Extreme
ihs-TIM:Gelid GC Extreme
Mhz gained:+0Mhz
OC after delid:5.1Ghz
Temp drops:15-20C per core.


----------



## SonDa5

I just completed my loop upgrades along with adding a layer around the die of Fujipoly Extreme .5mm thermal pad for support and to help cool.
I'm very happy with my initial results.
Just a quick and dirty standard run of Intel Burn Test right now.

Ambient Temp 17.6C
[email protected] 1.14V
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578618



Minumum temps
16C 19C 16C 11C

Maximum temps
43C 47C 46C 40C


----------



## leppie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> [email protected] 1.14V


Very nice VCORE and temps!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I just completed my loop upgrades along with adding a layer around the die of Fujipoly Extreme .5mm thermal pad for support and to help cool.
> I'm very happy with my initial results.
> Just a quick and dirty standard run of Intel Burn Test right now.
> Ambient Temp 17.6C
> [email protected] 1.14V
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578618
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Minumum temps
> 16C 19C 16C 11C
> Maximum temps
> 43C 47C 46C 40C


That vcore is insane low... NICE, i have to put 1.33 for 4.5 oc on mine.

EDIT: What is sad... My chip came stock(i mean on first boot) @ 1.210volts.... so, i dont know how yours is at 1.14 now.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I just completed my loop upgrades along with adding a layer around the die of Fujipoly Extreme .5mm thermal pad for support and to help cool.
> I'm very happy with my initial results.
> Just a quick and dirty standard run of Intel Burn Test right now.
> Ambient Temp 17.6C
> [email protected] 1.14V
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578618
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Minumum temps
> 16C 19C 16C 11C
> Maximum temps
> 43C 47C 46C 40C


Little bit cold in your house? 17.6 lol...brr How is it below ambient temps?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Little bit cold in your house? 17.6 lol...brr How is it below ambient temps?


I'm in my cave/office/storage room. I have the window open and it is cold for California.









I only have water cooling. Not sure if you have been following my posts but I just upgraded my radiator to single Alphacool NexXxos UT 60 420mm and added the Fujipoly Extreme Thermal Pad .5mm around the die for support and to help cool.


----------



## Socks keep you warm




----------



## ketapang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> That vcore is insane low... NICE, i have to put 1.33 for 4.5 oc on mine.
> EDIT: What is sad... My chip came stock(i mean on first boot) @ 1.210volts.... so, i dont know how yours is at 1.14 now.


I know how you feel bro. Mine also need 1.32v for 4.5 & 1.4v for 4.6.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*


Golden. I wish my 3570k could do that.

Delidded?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I'm in my cave/office/storage room. I have the window open and it is cold for California.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only have water cooling. Not sure if you have been following my posts but I just upgraded my radiator to single Alphacool NexXxos UT 60 420mm and added the Fujipoly Extreme Thermal Pad .5mm around the die for support and to help cool.


I have been following. I like the alphacool stuff. I was just curious how your idle temps were below ambient. but I see your probably getting colder air then the 63 F if your window is open.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Golden. I wish my 3570k could do that.
> Delidded?


Delidded and its a 3770K with Hyperthreading.
I may have another go at TIM in between the Die and IHS see if i can get lower.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Delidded and its a 3770K with Hyperthreading.
> I may have another go at TIM in between the Die and IHS see if i can get lower.


Yeah man nice temps and volts! how long did you run prime for? what board are you using?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah man nice temps and volts! how long did you run prime for? what board are you using?


I'm using the Asrock z77 Oc Formula, i tested it for 4 hours only, i may leave it on tonight until morning! Around 12 hours.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I'm using the Asrock z77 Oc Formula, i tested it for 4 hours only, i may leave it on tonight until morning! Around 12 hours.


ohh, how do you like it? nice looking board. wish I had waited for that board.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> My chip came stock(i mean on first boot) @ 1.210volts.... so, i dont know how yours is at 1.14 now.


I set the voltage in my BIOS.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> ohh, how do you like it? nice looking board. wish I had waited for that board.


It' an amazing board and has everything an overclocker needs


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> It' an amazing board and has everything an overclocker needs


I like that board and the MSI Z77 Mpower.









I notice you run your ram at 1600mhz on your 5GHZ over clock. Have you tried running 2400mhz CL10 at 5GHZ?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I like that board and the MSI Z77 Mpower.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I notice you run your ram at 1600mhz on your 5GHZ over clock. Have you tried running 2400mhz CL10 at 5GHZ?


My ram is only rated at 1333mhz i cant boot at 1866 lol need a new pair but it isn't urgent lol.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> My ram is only rated at 1333mhz i cant boot at 1866 lol need a new pair but it isn't urgent lol.


I was just curious if your CPU could pull off the fantastic low voltage speeds with faster ram speeds.

I am going to set my ram to your RAM settings and see how it reacts to over clocking. (Not now but some time soon will post results when I get around to trying it out).


----------



## kgtuning

the best I could do with my ram is 2133 on my ripjaws. it seems fine running with the cpu at 5 ghz


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I set the voltage in my BIOS.


I know that!!!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I know that!!!


Just checking....


----------



## ChaosAD

I just overclocked my ram from 2133 to 2400 without touching vcore. Only raised DRAM from 1.55v to 1,65v. Same [email protected], [email protected] and [email protected] Maybe if i find some spare time to try to lower these voltages a little more. But i m already low so i m happy







Using 95% of my ram at full load (4x1500mb of memtest 4.0 at 200% atm) and sticks are cold to the touch.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> I just overclocked my ram from 2133 to 2400 without touching vcore. Only raised DRAM from 1.55v to 1,65v. Same [email protected], [email protected] and [email protected] Maybe if i find some spare time to try to lower these voltages a little more. But i m already low so i m happy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Using 95% of my ram at full load (4x1500mb of memtest 4.0 at 200% atm) and sticks are cold to the touch.


You never need to touch Vcore to overclock ram....


----------



## Phobos223

One thing to keep in mind with all this degrading talk, is that it has been my experience that it doesn't happen over night, it happens over a longer period of time. I really can't speak with the Ivy chips as I have only had mine for a few weeks, but I have seen in the past that chips that I run excessive volt through start to require more voltage to maintain the same clocks over the course of a year or more.

That being said I think I will crank up my volts to 1.6ish today and see what I can do


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I was just curious if your CPU could pull off the fantastic low voltage speeds with faster ram speeds.
> I am going to set my ram to your RAM settings and see how it reacts to over clocking. (Not now but some time soon will post results when I get around to trying it out).


That was a reply to this post. That may not need to increase vcore for ram oc.


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Cough... Cough ^^
> Successful delidder's should post what worked for them and compare notes with all of the other successful delidder's, this way we have what actually worked. What do you think *Valgaur*?


I don't get what you mean by this post? I used the double side razor for my delid, it worked well, and cut the crap out of my fingers. So now I say use a little bit of tape. Are you implying that it happened to you or that I haven't delidded?


----------



## Lobsterman

Another 1 here with below ambient temps, like 9 degrees below ambient, even with my Phanteks fans not running. Seems not right.


----------



## SonDa5

Victory at last!!!









Ambient Temps 18.6C
IBT quick and dirty standard run

[email protected]

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578924



Idle Temps

21C 24C 21C 18C

Maximum Temps

62C 70C 67C 62C


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Another 1 here with below ambient temps, like 9 degrees below ambient, even with my Phanteks fans not running. Seems not right.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


yeah kinda odd. maybe a bug with real temp?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Victory at last!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ambient Temps 18.6C
> IBT quick and dirty standard run
> [email protected]
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578924
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Idle Temps
> 21C 24C 21C 18C
> Maximum Temps
> 62C 70C 67C 62C


Nice job!


----------



## SonDa5

Quick and dirty 5GHZ 3dMarkl11 run with single HD7950 over P1100!









http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/4909584


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You know you wanna.. you cant even stand still you want to so bad..


stop it lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I really think that the best way to do it is ensure that you don't bend the blade at all
> be very careful and take your time with breaks, make sure that you know what it looks like underneath


im with you on that one, im trying to find a way to make it visual,
with pic's or somehow..photo or drawing ..all good
its easier for peeps to look at a few pic's , and understand,
then reading through post that are long..lol..like mine









yea, taking brakes, my son and i delidded a few pentiums this weekend
but i let him do the delidding, hes 15 years old, good practice ..lol
but with chip 2, after doing corner 6, and and the fiirst all delidded, and perfect too








his hands started to cramp a bit, and then it starts to shake a little..
we took a brake..
heres a short vid, how hes cutting a corner with a box cutter,






this is the first one, after normal delid, and then after removing the IHS which was soldered








we put the 2 blades between 2 sides after delid, also to protect the pcb some more, and as handles,
then we hanged it upside down, and slowly heated around the center IHS with that lighter..
popped of after 2-3min,
same with the third one ..lol

edit:
thought it should be posted here too,
its all about delidding see


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I just completed my loop upgrades along with adding a layer around the die of Fujipoly Extreme .5mm thermal pad for support and to help cool.
> I'm very happy with my initial results.
> Just a quick and dirty standard run of Intel Burn Test right now.
> Ambient Temp 17.6C
> [email protected] 1.14V
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578618
> 
> Minumum temps
> 16C 19C 16C 11C
> Maximum temps
> 43C 47C 46C 40C


wow those temps are amazing


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Victory at last!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ambient Temps 18.6C
> IBT quick and dirty standard run
> [email protected]
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578924
> 
> Idle Temps
> 21C 24C 21C 18C
> Maximum Temps
> 62C 70C 67C 62C


ive had below ambient temps also


http://imgur.com/JABP2


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive had below ambient temps also
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/JABP2


did you try coretemp?
maybe a wrong setting in realtemp?
uninstall, re-install, could help..


----------



## lilchronic

well ran this last night temps not to high but i look at some of the temps in here and i just want to delid mine again. (properly thou)


http://imgur.com/3j1hj


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/JABP2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well ran this last night temps not to high but i look at some of the temps in here and i just want to delid mine again. (properly thou)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/3j1hj


well, this is the delidded club,
who am i to say you shouldnt delid ..lol

o, can you somehow use more little pic's,
i had to search for what you wanted to say ...haha


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> did you try coretemp?
> maybe a wrong setting in realtemp?
> uninstall, re-install, could help..


well that was my old chip havent had it happen to my new 1 yet


----------



## lilchronic




----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*


oooohhhhhhh ok this is how i should do it huh


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well that was my old chip havent had it happen to my new 1 yet


oops, sorry, guess i miss understood your post ..lol








bit tired, kids are gone to their mum again..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> OCN name:Socks Keep You Warm
> CPU:3770K
> on die-TIM:Gelid GC Extreme
> ihs-TIM:Gelid GC Extreme
> Mhz gained:+0Mhz
> OC after delid:5.1Ghz
> Temp drops:15-20C per core.


Rejected!







Need your CPU-Z sir.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> oops, sorry, guess i miss understood your post ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bit tired, kids are gone to their mum again..


COme one man push through the sleepiness!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> oooohhhhhhh ok this is how i should do it huh


way better,
i can right click on it, open in a new tab,
then i see it full screen/big


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> COme one man push through the sleepiness!


drinking strong coffee now, captain


----------



## lilchronic

ok i just want to know has any1 in here messed up there chip . got a new 1 and delidded it again and not screw it up. im sure that i can do it right this time im just not ready to do it yet idk im scared. i need to stop visiting this thread or something lol


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I have been following. I like the alphacool stuff. I was just curious how your idle temps were below ambient. but I see your probably getting colder air then the 63 F if your window is open.


I don't think owner's of Ivy Bridge should take idle temperatures seriously as there not reliable, load temps are what we should pay attention to.









I have a pentium 4 that's just asking for a delid, is it soldered or using paste?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I don't think owner's of Ivy Bridge should take idle temperatures seriously as there not reliable, load temps are what we should pay attention to.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a pentium 4 that's just asking for a delid, is it soldered or using paste?


mine seems reliable. and I think we should pay attention to them because they are off why should you trust at load temps?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I don't think owner's of Ivy Bridge should take idle temperatures seriously as there not reliable, load temps are what we should pay attention to.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a pentium 4 that's just asking for a delid, is it soldered or using paste?


load temps are more important for ocing then idle , true..

i know the pentiums i delidded this weekend where all soldered,
so after practicing normal delid, we did some soldered ihs removal too ..lol
you want to reuse them or ?
heres a old list with soldered and not soldered pentiums,
http://www.overclock.net/t/305443/ihs-removals-how-to-do-it-should-i-do-it-and-the-facts

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> mine seems reliable. and I think we should pay attention to them because they are off why should you trust at load temps?


my coldest core at idle is always 1-2C above ambient, using real temp


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok i just want to know has any1 in here messed up there chip . got a new 1 and delidded it again and not screw it up. im sure that i can do it right this time im just not ready to do it yet idk im scared. i need to stop visiting this thread or something lol


yea, there a few that did..
scared/unsure/doubt is not a good way to delid, feel confident, then go for it..
take your time, read some more, ask, watch some vid's etc ..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> load temps are more important for ocing then idle , true..
> i know the pentiums i delidded this weekend where all soldered,
> so after practicing normal delid, we did some soldered ihs removal too ..lol
> you want to reuse them or ?
> my coldest core at idle is always 1-2C above ambient, using real temp


ok so I guess we will just ignore sub ambient temps at idle? I don't care about idle temps personally but when they are wrong then I question it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> ok so I guess we will just ignore sub ambient temps at idle? I don't care about idle temps personally but when they are wrong then I question it.


whats sub ambient? sorry ..
i care about idle when its freezing outside,
love to see real temp looking like -5, -7,-4,-2 or lower ..lol
cant wait for winter, and -15, -20C

o w8, sub is lower then -0C ? (feels stupid)...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> whats sub ambient? sorry ..
> i care about idle when its freezing outside,
> love to see real temp looking like -5, -7,-4,-2 or lower ..lol
> cant wait for winter, and -15, -20C
> o w8, sub is lower then -0C ? (feels stupid)...










a few pages back a couple guys were getting idle temps below their ambient air temps. I only care about 100% load temps but those temps stuck out to me as wrong. But the point I was making was if the idle temps are wrong then how can you trust under load temps. know what I mean?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> a few pages back a couple guys were getting idle temps below their ambient air temps. I only care about 100% load temps but those temps stuck out to me as wrong. But the point I was making was if the idle temps are wrong then how can you trust under load temps. know what I mean?


yea, somehow missed those, bit tired (i blame my kids..lol)
will read up in the morning, after a good nights sleep








always late when my kiddo's are here (after my bedtime)









i thought this was funny,

someone said he saw different corespeeds all the time,
so i messed him up some more, showing 3 different corespeeds with 3 proggies...LOL
"you cant trust any of them"
1600, 2220 and 3650mhz.. just kidding of course








then cpu-z went all the way down to 1100 mhz, which surprised me too btw ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

my first thoughts after delidding those pentiums this weekend

what do you guys think about saying to new delidders,
to start with one of these corners,

my son said, in his experience those where the easiest to cut through

why,
because theres less adhesive on that side(i think),

the pentiums had the opening, with no adhesive in the middle,
its a opening to let hot air out, ivy has them too..


----------



## kgtuning

Thats where I started on the chip.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> load temps are more important for ocing then idle , true..
> i know the pentiums i delidded this weekend where all soldered,
> so after practicing normal delid, we did some soldered ihs removal too ..lol
> you want to reuse them or ?
> heres a old list with soldered and not soldered pentiums,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/305443/ihs-removals-how-to-do-it-should-i-do-it-and-the-facts
> my coldest core at idle is always 1-2C above ambient, using real temp


I found similar on an h50, 1 core was idling right at the ambient, others all 5 - 10° higher. With gulftown it wasn't abnormal to have cores idling lower than the ambient in realtemp, but loaded temps are what counts.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> whats sub ambient? sorry ..
> i care about idle when its freezing outside,
> love to see real temp looking like -5, -7,-4,-2 or lower ..lol
> cant wait for winter, and -15, -20C
> o w8, sub is lower then -0C ? (feels stupid)...


Sub zero is lower than 0°, sub ambient is lower than room temperature.









Also see that the IMC on my chip isn't what it used to be. Put it on some cold & 2600Mhz memory just doesn't go anymore.








Also checked out win7 spi for the avx thing (never bothered with it since I use nothing that uses avx), it's a chip cooker. 4.5Ghz on a stock intel cooler without avx = same temps as on the h50 with avx. It made a 15 - 20° difference. with H50 (push/pull 1800rpm fans) at 4.5Ghz 1.22V temps hit 86° in IBT.
Here's some 5Ghz IBT I did on the ss when testing the IMC


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Temps are closer to accurate near TJMAX.


----------



## SimpleTech

Not going to lie, it is pretty darn cold in my basement.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> Not going to lie, it is pretty darn cold in my basement.


I know the feeling, delidded this chip to get a folding rig going again soon for a heater. The living room doesn't get up to 20° in the day anymore & gets pretty chilly at night. Roommates think I'm a weirdo when everyone is putting on the sweaters & I'm running air conditioners to cool the machines.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Rejected!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Need your CPU-Z sir.
> COme one man push through the sleepiness!


Wow i'm stupid
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578562


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my first thoughts after delidding those pentiums this weekend
> what do you guys think about saying to new delidders,
> to start with one of these corners,
> 
> my son said, in his experience those where the easiest to cut through
> why,
> because theres less adhesive on that side(i think),
> 
> the pentiums had the opening, with no adhesive in the middle,
> its a opening to let hot air out, ivy has them too..


I had a much better experience starting on the opposite side!
That side was STUCK couldn't get the blade under. But the other side just slithered in


----------



## Ali Man

May I ask that who has the highest frequency on air/water of a de-lidded 3570K/3770k ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> May I ask that who has the highest frequency on air/water of a de-lidded 3570K/3770k ?


5.5 Ghzer's

Myself
VonDutch
Shermi
Lobsterman

5.7 Ghz'ers
Schmuckley


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Wow i'm stupid
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578562


Acepted!


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Acepted!











I will now start overclocking further i want to reach 5.5Ghz


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> May I ask that who has the highest frequency on air/water of a de-lidded 3570K/3770k ?


I donno do you mean just A cpu or a 24/7 OC? i run 5.1ghz 24/7


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will now start overclocking further i want to reach 5.5Ghz


Make sure your ready to see some vcore jumps lol. it gets kinda crazy.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Make sure your ready to see some vcore jumps lol. it gets kinda crazy.


Pump will be 100% and all fans should be able to stay under 1.8V for some screenies.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> mine seems reliable. and I think we should pay attention to them because they are off why should you trust at load temps?


How can you confirm they are reliable, where's a reference? If idle temps are showing up well below ambient there not to be trusted.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> How can you confirm they are reliable, where's a reference? If idle temps are showing up well below ambient there not to be trusted.


Idle can never be below the ambient temp(Dry Ice, Phase,LN2). Idle temps are untrusted. How can a CPU be cooler then the air around you when air cooling?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 5.5 Ghzer's
> Myself
> VonDutch
> Shermi
> Lobsterman
> 5.7 Ghz'ers
> Schmuckley


thats crazy what were ur guys voltage for that


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thats crazy what were ur guys voltage for that


check the spreadsheet on page one. the CPU-z's are their they range a bit but I've gotten to almost 2 vcore.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> check the spreadsheet on page one. the CPU-z's are their they range a bit but I've gotten to almost 2 vcore.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


hokies loves animated gifs.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> How can you confirm they are reliable, where's a reference? If idle temps are showing up well below ambient there not to be trusted.


? What are you talking about? Never once did I say my idle temps are below ambient. I assume they are reliable. They are usually 10c over ambient on my rig.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I donno do you mean just A cpu or a 24/7 OC? i run 5.1ghz 24/7


I mean that just a CPU. The reason I ask is because I see people hitting till 5.5Ghz, 5.7Ghz frequencies and from obvious knowledge, these frequencies are only possible on LN2, dice, SS, etc. (particularly for a 3770k)

You're running 5.1Ghz on what cpu, cooling & volts ?


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 5.5 Ghzer's
> Myself
> VonDutch
> Shermi
> Lobsterman
> 5.7 Ghz'ers
> Schmuckley


5.7Ghz on water?

Any pic of his rig apart from the CPU-z validation?


----------



## SonDa5

Before Delid
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> SonDa5 - 6m 45.790s - Ivy Bridge 3570k @ 5000mhz / MSI Mpower Z77/ Gskill Trident X @ 2400 10-12-11-30 1T / DT SNIIPER Block (water cooled)
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2518087[


After Delid



http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2579528


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Before Delid
> After Delid
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2579528


What is your on DIE Paste?
I'm water cooled also but am receiving piss poor temps still.
70C at 5Ghz and your at bloody 50! I hate you sir.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> What is your on DIE Paste?
> I'm water cooled also but am receiving piss poor temps still.
> 70C at 5Ghz and your at bloody 50! I hate you sir.


No IHS.



Direct Die contact with Coolaboratory Liquid Pro TIM to DT Sniper water block.
Have .5mm thickness support/heat transfer blanket of Fujipoly Extreme Thermal pad around the die. I haven't seen anyone else do this. It is working good so far. Started a thread about this idea at XS about a little over a month ago.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?283300


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> 5.7Ghz on water?
> Any pic of his rig apart from the CPU-z validation?


Those 5.5ghz are on An H-100 and the other guy has a Air cooler.

I run 5.1ghz 100% perfect Stable at 1.55v With 30hrs of stress testing 230gaming and 30 of benching.. 24/7 7 days a week for over a month now.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Those 5.5ghz are on An H-100 and the other guy has a Air cooler.
> I run 5.1ghz 100% perfect Stable at 1.55v With 30hrs of stress testing 230gaming and 30 of benching.. 24/7 7 days a week for over a month now.


What's your voltage at 5 ghz? With ht on.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> What's your voltage at 5 ghz? With ht on.


1.43..

I stated i needed a Massive jump from 5ghz to 5.1ghz early in the club XD

But i was prime 95 Stable 7 hrs with 1.51v @ 5.1ghz but BL2 booted it out in seconds i neded 1.55v for BL2 not to crash XD


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.43..
> I stated i needed a Massive jump from 5ghz to 5.1ghz early in the club XD
> But i was prime 95 Stable 7 hrs with 1.51v @ 5.1ghz but BL2 booted it out in seconds i neded 1.55v for BL2 not to crash XD


Yeah I know you said before what your voltage was but I didn't want to search as I am on my phone at work. Lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah I know you said before what your voltage was but I didn't want to search as I am on my phone at work. Lol.


Ah









Not to worried selling chip when Haswell is released and my Guy has a MB rdy for me









I donno i think i should be abl to get atleast 280$ for it then XD and 200$ for the MB...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not to worried selling chip when Haswell is released and my Guy has a MB rdy for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I donno i think i should be abl to get atleast 280$ for it then XD and 200$ for the MB...


Yeah I want to jump up to 5.1 but I don't know if I want to run at much voltage. Probably just keep it where it is. I'm going to do a has well build later next year as well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah I want to jump up to 5.1 but I don't know if I want to run at much voltage. Probably just keep it where it is. I'm going to do a has well build later next year as well.


Im going to send my friend to Microcenter for the Chip.. And get a board 50% off so all is good i should just about break even.

Back to Watching Iron fist.. LOL it is like those old dubbed 70s chinese Kung Fu flicks but done in 2012 @[email protected]


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok i just want to know has any1 in here messed up there chip . got a new 1 and delidded it again and not screw it up. im sure that i can do it right this time im just not ready to do it yet idk im scared. i need to stop visiting this thread or something lol


I have delidded and messed up my first attempt and then delidded again and did it right the 2nd time.

It was really easy the second time because I knew exactly what I was doing and what I had done wrong the first time.

And I am thinking about getting another chip to bench and will be delidding it too. No fear of doing it wrong again.


----------



## Hokies83

Hmmmmm

I have something cool here....

After 6 months of playing around with stuff....

I think i have a True Safe Full PC part Anti Dust spray...

I sprayed the MB HS ram gpu hdd psu complete case .... "covering up The dimm slots cpu socket pci-e slots etc.. i do not trust it in there lol...

But it seems to repel 90% of dust.. My back up system "test System" has been sprayed with it going on 50 days.. with no cleaning and almost has no Dust at all in the case....

I made this with.. Minerals and some Plant Extracts "to bond to objects" and distilled water...

Going to continue testing...

Also i need guinea pig's







if you want a free guinea pig sample PM me XD


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Idle can never be below the ambient temp(Dry Ice, Phase,LN2). Idle temps are untrusted. How can a CPU be cooler then the air around you when air cooling?


This is the post I was referring to.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Another 1 here with below ambient temps, like 9 degrees below ambient, even with my Phanteks fans not running. Seems not right.


----------



## PCWargamer

Ok, I have been busy working on my system the last few days.

On the question of which tool I would recommend it would be the single-sided razor-blade, but a single-sided (with tape) would be good too.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Here are some pics showing what CL Ultra looks like after a month of use between the die and IHS, and the IHS and the HSF. Interesting - It was still liquid on the die, but it had dried out between the IHS and the HSF.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!










I am now using CL Pro and it is about ~2C better temps than CL Ultra:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Ok, I have been busy working on my system the last few days.
> On the question of which tool I would recommend it would be the single-sided razor-blade, but a single-sided (with tape) would be good too.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here are some pics showing what CL Ultra looks like after a month of use between the die and IHS, and the IHS and the HSF. Interesting - It was still liquid on the die, but it had dried out between the IHS and the HSF.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am now using CL Pro and it is about ~2C better temps than CL Ultra:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I also tried out a new mother board, the MSI MPower Z77. It is a very good board I would recommend for OCing, but it ended up not being enough of an improvement over my older Z68 to justify the cost to use as an upgrade for my existing system so I returned it after lots tests and benching fun. I would consider it again for a new build.


Yah it tends to be 2c - 5c

But heck the difference between 2c is the same as a difference between a 40$ cooler and an 80$ cooler so it is pure win imo..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> What is your on DIE Paste?
> I'm water cooled also but am receiving piss poor temps still.
> 70C at 5Ghz and your at bloody 50! I hate you sir.


Super pie doesnt load cpu 100%,
i just checked, its about 16-17% with mine,


5ghz, hottest core 45C


5.2ghz, hottest core 55C

my daily oc, 4646mhz, i just did this super pie run, 7.15am

hottest core 42C, ambient is about 12C atm

if you run super pi, and its 70C ..thats not very good


----------



## PCWargamer

I also tried out a new mother board, the *MSI MPower Z77*.

It is a very good board and I would recommend it for OCing, but it ended up not being enough of an improvement over my older Z68 to justify the cost for an upgrade of my existing system - so I returned it after lots tests and benching fun finding this out. But I would consider it again for a new system build.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Hokies83

Msi is not to well known for all that good of Mbs.. There Gpu guys lol.

Asus And Gigabyte and you can not go wrong in the MB dept... And if on a Tight budget Asrock.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I also tried out a new mother board, the *MSI MPower Z77*.
> It is a very good board and I would recommend it for OCing, but it ended up not being enough of an improvement over my older Z68 to justify the cost for an upgrade of my existing system - so I returned it after lots tests and benching fun finding this out. But I would consider it again for a new system build.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [IMG ALT="Try New MB - Some improvement, but not enough...so returned
> Not a bad board at all, and very good looking!
> Good choice for a new build, but not as an upgrade for my current system."]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1125284/width/500/height/1000[/IMG]
> [IMG ALT="Try New MB - Some improvement, but not enough...so returned
> Not a bad board at all, and very good looking!
> Good choice for a new build, but not as an upgrade for my current system."]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1125283/width/500/height/1000[/IMG]


yea, thats a good looking mobo, this is inside my case,


i took out the lower part for hdd's, so the front fan can blow in air better without obstruction from that hdd cage..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Msi is not to well known for all that good of Mbs.. There Gpu guys lol.
> Asus And Gigabyte and you can not go wrong in the MB dept... And if on a Tight budget Asrock.


yea hokies, gigabyte and asus, i really like asus too,
might be my next mobo, till not i only had gigabyte tho..
i payed about 120 euro for my Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H
Asus P8Z77-V LE costs 10 euro more


----------



## DirektEffekt

Has anyone here tried a direct-die mount on a H100 or H80 by any chance?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Msi is not to well known for all that good of Mbs.. There Gpu guys lol.
> 
> Asus And Gigabyte and you can not go wrong in the MB dept... And if on a Tight budget Asrock.


I have had very good experience with Asus MB's and mainly buy their MB's, but MSI went all out on this new MPower and it shows.

This was the first MSI MB I every bought or even really considered. I will note that Asus BIOS is still much better than MSI's.

This MSI board was as good as the reviewers noted and the board performed well and looked great too! But not enough to justify the upgrade over my existing Asus P8Z68-V/Gen 3.


----------



## Zantrill

So, on an H100/3570K, is it worth the Delid? and what tim is suggested if so?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I have had very good experience with Asus MB's and mainly buy their MB's, but MSI went all out on this new MPower and it shows.
> This was the first MSI MB I every bought or even really considered. I will note that Asus BIOS is still much better than MSI's.
> This MSI board was as good as the reviewers noted and the board performed well and looked great too! But not enough to justify the upgrade over my existing Asus P8Z68-V/Gen 3.


Ive got to say.. Before i went Gigabyte with Z77 i had almost only owned Asus Mbs..

I like the Bios of Gigabyte better then Asus Bios.. it is like noob sauce easy lol the 3D bios.. i mean come on... u ca not go wrong.. lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zantrill*
> 
> So, on an H100/3570K, is it worth the Delid? and what tim is suggested if so?


depends on what oc you want, and temps,
best tim to use on die, is liquid pro/ultra,
on ihs any good performing tim will do


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive got to say.. Before i went Gigabyte with Z77 i had almost only owned Asus Mbs..
> I like the Bios of Gigabyte better then Asus Bios.. it is like noob sauce easy lol the 3D bios.. i mean come on... u ca not go wrong.. lol


the F5 bios that came with my gigabyte sckd big time tho,
but they did alot of updates in a short time,
running F15 now, its ok ..


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zantrill*
> 
> So, on an H100/3570K, is it worth the Delid? and what tim is suggested if so?


Depends on what you do with it. If you OC high and have temp issues, then yes. If just gaming and lower OC without temp problems, then no.

And CL Pro or CL Ultra for TIMs.


----------



## VonDutch

lol PCW









showertime, everyone is in good hands








laters peeps...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive got to say.. Before i went Gigabyte with Z77 i had almost only owned Asus Mbs..
> I like the Bios of Gigabyte better then Asus Bios.. it is like noob sauce easy lol the 3D bios.. i mean come on... u ca not go wrong.. lol
> 
> 
> 
> the F5 bios that came with my gigabyte sckd big time tho,
> but they did alot of updates in a short time,
> running F15 now, its ok ..
Click to expand...

Hmmm...I'll have to consider them too then if their BIOS is good.....which boards do they have that are comperable (price & performance) to the Asus Sabertooth or MSI Mpower that I have been considering?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol PCW
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> showertime, everyone is in good hands
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> laters peeps...


I guess we think alike! - good night to you and your family!


----------



## Swag

Anyone here running Windows 8? I'm gonna give it another shot since I can disable the Metro UI. Anyone have any benchmarks in which is faster?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone here running Windows 8? I'm gonna give it another shot since I can disable the Metro UI. Anyone have any benchmarks in which is faster?


I have not tried it but I have had some friends who have and they say it is faster booting up and such - no benching though.

If you do try it I think we would all love to know if it benches better or not. It would be worth putting up with the UI if it at least benches better.....


----------



## VonDutch

MSI Big Bang MPower Z77 , 177 euro
Asus Sabertooth Z77 , 198 euro
compared to a GB,
Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UP4 TH , 175 euro
Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD5H (rev. 1.0), 192 euro

GB's ud5h is very good, the up4 th i dont know well..

and its prizes on first search, if i would buy,
im hunting deals or cheaper of course ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone here running Windows 8? I'm gonna give it another shot since I can disable the Metro UI. Anyone have any benchmarks in which is faster?


its overall a bit faster then 7, snappier, and it boots alot faster , that i know,
gonna wait it out, maybe ill install later, win 7 runs good enough for now,
its "easy" to disable metro, you can even get start button back with some tweaks
then it look like win 7 again ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hmmm...I'll have to consider them too then if their BIOS is good.....which boards do they have that are comperable (price & performance) to the Asus Sabertooth or MSI Mpower that I have been considering?


UP5 / UD5H

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128559

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Ok, I have been busy working on my system the last few days.
> On the question of which tool I would recommend it would be the single-sided razor-blade, but a single-sided (with tape) would be good too.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here are some pics showing what CL Ultra looks like after a month of use between the die and IHS, and the IHS and the HSF. Interesting - It was still liquid on the die, but it had dried out between the IHS and the HSF.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am now using CL Pro and it is about ~2C better temps than CL Ultra:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Exactly how much CL Pro did you use, rice, pee size?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Has anyone here tried a direct-die mount on a H100 or H80 by any chance?


I've wanted to but I haven't taken the initiative of fear of crushing my Little Franky. I will need the latch system installed anyways for my future CPU pot.

Hey guys I'm running some benches tonight tell me if you want me to run anything specific for loads and such!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone here running Windows 8? I'm gonna give it another shot since I can disable the Metro UI. Anyone have any benchmarks in which is faster?
> 
> 
> 
> I have not tried it but I have had some friends who have and they say it is faster booting up and such - no benching though.
> 
> If you do try it I think we would all love to know if it benches better or not. It would be worth putting up with the UI if it at least benches better.....
Click to expand...

You can take off the UI on Windows 8 though and it just goes straight into the classic Windows look rather than booting up into the Metro UI and completely putting all the UI into a start button.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

I want to try direct Die contact cooling,
The Asrock Z77 Oc Formula's retention bracket is metal, if that touches the CPU and it turns on would it cause a short?
Cause i would expect much better temps..


----------



## Zantrill

Hey! Socks DO keep ME warm!

I know, I know....


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Exactly how much CL Pro did you use, rice, pee size?


Rice size, but for that stuff a little goes a long ways. PITA to apply though. I tried to use the q-tip, but ended up having better effect with the brush I got from the CL Ultra.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can take off the UI on Windows 8 though and it just goes straight into the classic Windows look rather than booting up into the Metro UI and completely putting all the UI into a start button.


I am very glad to hear that as I like that better for a desktop system. Maybe for a tablet I'd like the other UI.

I do hope it benches better though and hope you can let all of us know if it does for you or not. Cool info to know....


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I want to try direct Die contact cooling,
> The Asrock Z77 Oc Formula's retention bracket is metal, if that touches the CPU and it turns on would it cause a short?
> Cause i would expect much better temps..


You've actually got to remove the entire retention bracket from the MB otherwise the CPU will be too low to make contact.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> You've actually got to remove the entire retention bracket from the MB otherwise the CPU will be too low to make contact.


How on earth do i do that.....


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> How on earth do i do that.....


There are a couple of allen/star key screws towards the hinge of the retention bracket which should allow you to lift the bracket off.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> There are a couple of allen/star key screws towards the hinge of the retention bracket which should allow you to lift the bracket off.


Yeah i know that but like where do you get the allen keys from?


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Rice size, but for that stuff a little goes a long ways. PITA to apply though. I tried to use the q-tip, but ended up having better effect with the brush I got from the CL Ultra.
> I am very glad to hear that as I like that better for a desktop system. Maybe for a tablet I'd like the other UI.
> I do hope it benches better though and hope you can let all of us know if it does for you or not. Cool info to know....


Darn I used all of my CL Pro on one application, it probably spread out over the entire underside of the IHS!


----------



## Zantrill

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Rice size, but for that stuff a little goes a long ways. PITA to apply though. I tried to use the q-tip, but ended up having better effect with the brush I got from the CL Ultra.
> I am very glad to hear that as I like that better for a desktop system. Maybe for a tablet I'd like the other UI.
> I do hope it benches better though and hope you can let all of us know if it does for you or not. Cool info to know....
> 
> 
> 
> Darn I used all of my CL Pro on one application, it probably spread out over the entire underside of the IHS!
Click to expand...


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Yeah i know that but like where do you get the allen keys from?


Anywhere that sells tools really. In my garage we have probably 10 sets just floating around!


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Anywhere that sells tools really. In my garage we have probably 10 sets just floating around!


Alright cool i will have a look around my house


----------



## Valgaur

I think my rooms a tad bit cold.... don't you guys?







benchies for the night lol and yes it is snowing outside lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Exactly how much CL Pro did you use, rice, pee size?


really, this drop on this IHS is already more then enough to do the entire ihs

so about half of that( or less) is enough to cover all the die

a brush is good to use,

i did it with the Q-tip that came with the package,

i did all sides, die , underside ihs, on ihs, base plate cooler,
did 2 vid cards with it as well, and still have some left,
try get thin layers, you dont want any looking like it floats,

i noticed making circular motion to spread it,
was a better way then shown in the official vid from coollabatory,
which i tried first




hes doing a good job applying it tho, guess his boss was watching over his shoulder ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Darn I used all of my CL Pro on one application, it probably spread out over the entire underside of the IHS!


you could just clean it , shouldnt be a biggie if you do it now, instead of in a year orso..
if you apply to much, which happened to me, you can use the seringe to suck some up again..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> [IMG
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ALT=""]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1125503/width/500/height/1000[/IMG]
> 
> 
> I think my rooms a tad bit cold.... don't you guys?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> benchies for the night lol and yes it is snowing outside lol.


looks good to me








had my coldest core at 0C to with the crazy oc's ..lol ( -2C outside, open door..brrr)


just saw a big group of geese flying over when i was outside,
most of the times it means its getting cold.. again ...yesss..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks good to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> had my coldest core at 0C to with the crazy oc's ..lol ( -2C outside, open door..brrr)
> 
> just saw a big group of geese flying over when i was outside,
> most of the times it means its getting cold.. again ...yesss..


think i fully corrupted windows lol.... oppsies


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> think i fully corrupted windows lol.... oppsies


i reinstalled like 3x during all the benches and learning to oc, in 7-8 weeks time
bsod and windows dont mix well ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i reinstalled like 3x during all the benches and learning to oc, in 7-8 weeks time
> bsod and windows dont mix well ..lol


Yeah it'll boot into windows and such no problem but the desktop is all black nothing on it at all. So new install for tomorrow. Was worth it for some good pcmark05 scores.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah it'll boot into windows and such no problem but the desktop is all black nothing on it at all. So new install for tomorrow. Was worth it for some good pcmark05 scores.


Happens to me after unsuccessful overclock, just wait a minute it pops up.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Happens to me after unsuccessful overclock, just wait a minute it pops up.


how long of a wait exactly?? If an6thing im at 4.5 and using 1.3vcore just to be super stable.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Happens to me after unsuccessful overclock, just wait a minute it pops up.


heya Socks, i see youre having fun with your new oc's? ...lol

on his socks, Intel Overclocks
5Ghz 1.375V 24/7Stable http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578562
5.1Ghz 1.41Vhttp://valid.canardpc.com/2577950
5.2Ghz 1.46Vhttp://valid.canardpc.com/2579347


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> how long of a wait exactly?? If an6thing im at 4.5 and using 1.3vcore just to be super stable.


Just wait a while it will pop up, just trust me! haha
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> heya Socks, i see youre having fun with your new oc's? ...lol
> on his socks, Intel Overclocks
> 5Ghz 1.375V 24/7Stable http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2578562
> 5.1Ghz 1.41Vhttp://valid.canardpc.com/2577950
> 5.2Ghz 1.46Vhttp://valid.canardpc.com/2579347


I'm loving this chip 1st delid resulted in burnt processor and FUDGED up mobo.
This chip does 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V Other chip was 1.235V!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Just wait a while it will pop up, just trust me! haha
> I'm loving this chip 1st delid resulted in burnt processor and FUDGED up mobo.
> This chip does 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V Other chip was 1.235V!!!


yea, i saw, "live and learn" right







..any update on the other mobo, about the repair?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i saw, "live and learn" right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..any update on the other mobo, about the repair?


ASRock haven't got back to me, the motherboard is firing up as you know!
I do not want to place my New CPU in the socket in case it frys so i am buying a celeron processor to test.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> ASRock haven't got back to me, the motherboard is firing up as you know!
> I do not want to place my New CPU in the socket in case it frys so i am buying a celeron processor to test.


This seems to becoming a trend in this club... how many celerons are go in to be sacrificed in the pursuit Ivy deliding ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> This seems to becoming a trend in this club... how many celerons are go in to be sacrificed in the pursuit Ivy deliding ?


i rather sacrifice some pentiums, celerons etc. first, and learn from that,
then go for the real delid right away, and learn that way from a/my mistake..lol

if you can do 1 or 2 pentium, celeron etc first, working or not, doesnt matter,
you learn alot more from that, then any post or vid will..
i can buy them here for a few bucks, even asking in a populair computersite
over here, for broken ones ..lol

edit,
im master in miss reading posts, sorry..
but what i said is ok i guess ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

3770k 229$ at MicroCenter !!!

http://www.microcenter.com/product/388575/Core_i7_3770K_35GHz_LGA_1155_Processor


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3770k 229$ at MicroCenter !!!
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/388575/Core_i7_3770K_35GHz_LGA_1155_Processor


dang, cheapest i can find here, is 299 euro, thats $380









o hokies, what was it that makes 1 core run hotter,
the one next to the imc or vid card?


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3770k 229$ at MicroCenter !!!
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/388575/Core_i7_3770K_35GHz_LGA_1155_Processor


Yea it's crazy cheap... suck you have to go in store only... Where I used to live I had Microcenter right next door... now the closest one is 3 hours away!


----------



## Hokies83

Hey valguar found LN2 pot in your budget http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1708702


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3770k 229$ at MicroCenter !!!
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/388575/Core_i7_3770K_35GHz_LGA_1155_Processor


awesome deal, right?







noticed it too in my morning e-mails ... this price is just sweet.

I should be getting my CPU from RMA on Tuesday, hopefully something good.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> awesome deal, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> noticed it too in my morning e-mails ... this price is just sweet.
> I should be getting my CPU from RMA on Tuesday, hopefully something good.


 llmao


----------



## neopunx

^Like^


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hey valguar found LN2 pot in your budget http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1708702


I already got one in mind and the guy is pretty cool.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> think i fully corrupted windows lol.... oppsies
> 
> 
> 
> i reinstalled like 3x during all the benches and learning to oc, in 7-8 weeks time
> bsod and windows dont mix well ..lol
Click to expand...

*Quick question* (to you or anybody who knows really). When you reinstall W7 onto a system with it already loaded onto, does it just erase and reload the OS, or does it write over the old stuff? And what happens to the registry?

And I expext that the W7 reinstall leaves all the personal data and games files OK, but do I have to reinstall all the games and software to get it back into the registry? Or did all your SW work after the OS was reloaded?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I already got one in mind and the guy is pretty cool.


Just showing 2 that are in your Budget.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> llmao


True story.

By the way you forgot to mention the Cheap TIM Company PLC results , sales up in line with Intel chips.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> llmao


LOL!







are you suggesting that I am causing that 2.5% drop in Intel sales "somehow"?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Quick question* (to you or anybody who knows really). When you reinstall W7 onto a system with it already loaded onto, does it just erase and reload the OS, or does it write over the old stuff? And what happens to the registry?
> And I expext that the W7 reinstall leaves all the personal data and games files OK, but do I have to reinstall all the games and software to get it back into the registry? Or did all your SW work after the OS was reloaded?


AFAIK, re-install in place (without format) will just write fresh files over existing system (it will reset registry), so yeah all files, saved games and such will be in place, however you most likely won't be able to login into old profile (different GUIDs), so you will have to create a new one and copy files between profiles. all apps and games will need re-installing as well.

other option is to make a Repair Install, but I personally never had good luck with that ever. Personally I'd recommend copying your documents, pics and saved games to a safe location (different partition), backing up Firefox profile and then format the OS partition and install it fresh and restore files from backup / other location. a fresh partition and fresh install of OS is always my choice when re-installing, no repairs, no over-installs.


----------



## Hokies83

I know one thing.... Since i posted the 229$ 3770k deal at 9am roughly 6 hrs ago.. There has not been one post in the 8350/8320 thread... On the norm there is 20+ posts in that thread in an Hour lol.

Those boys are running to Microcenter to return those Snail powered rigs to Grab a 229$ 3770k lmao...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Quick question* (to you or anybody who knows really). When you reinstall W7 onto a system with it already loaded onto, does it just erase and reload the OS, or does it write over the old stuff? And what happens to the registry?
> And I expext that the W7 reinstall leaves all the personal data and games files OK, but do I have to reinstall all the games and software to get it back into the registry? Or did all your SW work after the OS was reloaded?


it doesnt delete the old windows if you install over the old one,
it will tell you it will create a folder, called windows old..
registry will be overwritten/deleted as far as i know,
even if you would be able to keep it, and use it after new install,
it will look for the old entries, prolly getting confused doing so ..lol

i like to do clean install's, format when i install,
make good backup's when i installed windows and all programs/games i use,
saves alot of time when something goes worng later on..
you could try going back a few days or more with system restore..

edit,
nvm, feniks explains alot better...lol









@ feniks,
do you have the same name on another forum?
was looking for info about whea errors,
think i read a nice post from you about them ..


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3770k 229$ at MicroCenter !!!
> 
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/388575/Core_i7_3770K_35GHz_LGA_1155_Processor


Thanks for the head's-up *Hokies83*. I went to the Micro Center at lunch to get one, but they were already sold out!

Big bummer. At that price I was going to get another 3770K to play with! Sale started today salesman said, and already sold out before lunch.....

So I picked up a 3570K instead to see how they will do. Still only $170 for one of them at a MC. Hope this one is a winner!

Also picked up a Asus Sabertooth Z77 to play with and see if it is better than the MSI MPower I tried last week. And with the 3570K I got the $40 off the MB, and if the 3770K special had worked out for me I would have had to pay full price for it. So it worked out OK in the end. $400 for a new 3570K and the Sabertooth!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for the head's-up *Hokies83*. I went to the Micro Center at lunch to get one, but they were already sold out!
> Big bummer. At that price I was going to get another 3770K to play with! Sale started today salesman said, and already sold out before lunch.....
> So I picked up a 3570K instead to see how they will do. Still only $170 for one of them at a MC. Hope this one is a winner!
> Also picked up a Asus Sabertooth Z77 to play with and see if it is better than the MSI MPower I tried last week. And with the 3570K I got the $40 off the MB, and if the 3770K special had worked out for me I would have had to pay full price for it. So it worked out OK in the end. $400 for a new 3570K and the Sabertooth!


They could restock and stay on sale awhile donno..

Good thing about MC u can return anything with in 14 days no questions asked


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I know one thing.... Since i posted the 229$ 3770k deal at 9am roughly 6 hrs ago.. There has not been one post in the 8350/8320 thread... On the norm there is 20+ posts in that thread in an Hour lol.
> Those boys are running to Microcenter to return those Snail powered rigs to Grab a 229$ 3770k lmao...


hahaha


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for the head's-up *Hokies83*. I went to the Micro Center at lunch to get one, but they were already sold out!
> Big bummer. At that price I was going to get another 3770K to play with! Sale started today salesman said, and already sold out before lunch.....
> So I picked up a 3570K instead to see how they will do. Still only $170 for one of them at a MC. Hope this one is a winner!
> Also picked up a Asus Sabertooth Z77 to play with and see if it is better than the MSI MPower I tried last week. And with the 3570K I got the $40 off the MB, and if the 3770K special had worked out for me I would have had to pay full price for it. So it worked out OK in the end. $400 for a new 3570K and the Sabertooth!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They could restock and stay on sale awhile donno..
> 
> Good thing about MC u can return anything with in 14 days no questions asked
Click to expand...

Then I'll do some OC testing of the 3570K and see how it does! - Maybe return it for a 3770K if they restock soon. How long will MC have the special price????

>>> Also (to whoever knows), if I replace only the motherboard in a system, and first unload all the drivers, and then boot up the new MB and load its drivers and all the other device drivers fresh, will I need to reload the W7 OS???


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Quick question* (to you or anybody who knows really). When you reinstall W7 onto a system with it already loaded onto, does it just erase and reload the OS, or does it write over the old stuff? And what happens to the registry?
> And I expext that the W7 reinstall leaves all the personal data and games files OK, but do I have to reinstall all the games and software to get it back into the registry? Or did all your SW work after the OS was reloaded?


I didnt lose files but I lost some info like my benchmarks.. uuuuugh
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just showing 2 that are in your Budget.


Yeah no problem but those pots are for GPU's not CPU's
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it doesnt delete the old windows if you install over the old one,
> it will tell you it will create a folder, called windows old..
> registry will be overwritten/deleted as far as i know,
> even if you would be able to keep it, and use it after new install,
> it will look for the old entries, prolly getting confused doing so ..lol
> i like to do clean install's, format when i install,
> make good backup's when i installed windows and all programs/games i use,
> saves alot of time when something goes worng later on..
> you could try going back a few days or more with system restore..
> edit,
> nvm, feniks explains alot better...lol


yeah feniks beat us lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yeah feniks beat us lol.


haha ..for sure








and he explains well too,
the little education i have about windows etc,
was like 15 years ago ..lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I know one thing.... Since i posted the 229$ 3770k deal at 9am roughly 6 hrs ago.. There has not been one post in the 8350/8320 thread... On the norm there is 20+ posts in that thread in an Hour lol.
> Those boys are running to Microcenter to return those Snail powered rigs to Grab a 229$ 3770k lmao...


LMAO!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> edit,
> nvm, feniks explains alot better...lol


thanks








years of practice







... man I am so bored of my profession (IT Systems Admin) that I normally don't even pick up on such conversations anymore LOL!
Quote:


> @ feniks,
> do you have the same name on another forum?
> was looking for info about whea errors,
> think i read a nice post from you about them ..


yes, on EVGA forums I use the same user name and avatar. I have also a profile (same username and avatar again) on ROG forums, but there is not much going on, used it only to figure out some ASUS specific things or give my opinion on new BIOS and such.


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for the head's-up Hokies83. I went to the Micro Center at lunch to get one, but they were already sold out because of all the AMD fanbois trading in their crappy chips that had been queuing all night round the block.


No? I'll get my coat...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for the head's-up Hokies83. I went to the Micro Center at lunch to get one, but they were already sold out because of all the AMD fanbois trading in their crappy chips that had been queuing all night round the block.
> 
> 
> 
> No? I'll get my coat...
Click to expand...

LOL. That's what I was really wondering! They must have seen Hokies83's post or something because they were all gone! By lunch!

So anyone have any ideas on this last question I asked? Different than the first as it's not about a reinstall of the OS onto the same system, but a replacement of hardware - the motherboard!

>>> So, when I replace only the motherboard in a system, and first unload all the drivers, and then boot up the new MB and load its drivers and all the other device drivers fresh, will I need to reload the W7 OS???

I'd like to think that all that needs to be changed with a new MB is the drivers and not the OS, yet my last attempt at this left the OS acting odd and off some, yet mainly functional....

Any help on this guys?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> LOL. That's what I was really wondering! They must have seen Hokies83's post or something because they were all gone! By lunch!
> So anyone have any ideas on this last question I asked? Different than the first as it's not about a reinstall of the OS onto the same system, but a replacement of hardware - the motherboard!
> >>> So, when I replace only the motherboard in a system, and first unload all the drivers, and then boot up the new MB and load its drivers and all the other device drivers fresh, will I need to reload the W7 OS???
> I'd like to think that all that needs to be changed with a new MB is the drivers and not the OS, yet my last attempt at this left the OS acting odd and off some, yet mainly functional....
> Any help on this guys?


Noipe if your OS is in a SSD or HDD its there until you take it off. hence the benhcies of HWbot having XP on SSD's and just carrying them for that and benches.

speaking of which how does one get and OS onto a HDD from a flashdrive?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Noipe if your OS is in a SSD or HDD its there until you take it off. hence the benhcies of HWbot having XP on SSD's and just carrying them for that and benches.
> speaking of which how does one get and OS onto a HDD from a flashdrive?


By booting from removeable device







:


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmmmmm
> I have something cool here....
> After 6 months of playing around with stuff....
> I think i have a True Safe Full PC part Anti Dust spray...
> I sprayed the MB HS ram gpu hdd psu complete case .... "covering up The dimm slots cpu socket pci-e slots etc.. i do not trust it in there lol...
> But it seems to repel 90% of dust.. My back up system "test System" has been sprayed with it going on 50 days.. with no cleaning and almost has no Dust at all in the case....
> I made this with.. Minerals and some Plant Extracts "to bond to objects" and distilled water...
> Going to continue testing...
> Also i need guinea pig's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you want a free guinea pig sample PM me XD


Sounds fishy...but interesting!
I may have a spare rig to test on...first class envelope FTW lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Hmmm...I'll have to consider them too then if their BIOS is good.....which boards do they have that are comperable (price & performance) to the Asus Sabertooth or MSI Mpower that I have been considering?


Hokies named a few, but I'd stick to Asus (MVG/MVF, nothing lesser than those two...and Sabertooth ain't worth the price), if not get a Gigabyte up5* or an Asrock OC formula...
*up5 is good but Gb has some ram overclocking issues, so if you are into that and need to bench their boards may make your life harder. It's a trend I've seen a few times already...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> LOL. That's what I was really wondering! They must have seen Hokies83's post or something because they were all gone! By lunch!
> So anyone have any ideas on this last question I asked? Different than the first as it's not about a reinstall of the OS onto the same system, but a replacement of hardware - the motherboard!
> >>> So, when I replace only the motherboard in a system, and first unload all the drivers, and then boot up the new MB and load its drivers and all the other device drivers fresh, will I need to reload the W7 OS???
> I'd like to think that all that needs to be changed with a new MB is the drivers and not the OS, yet my last attempt at this left the OS acting odd and off some, yet mainly functional....
> Any help on this guys?


I'll be honest with you as I did that a few dozen times (and still I don't recommend it) - I do that when I get lazy and don't want to spend nearly 2 days on re-installing the OS, installing all apps, updating all the crap and everything and customizing all to my flavor ... it *should* work this way (uninstall all drivers before the MB swap, then install new ones) ... but there is ALWAYS 1 or 2 small tiny glitches that will stay there forever and you will not ever be able to fix them without a re-installation. why? because Windows creates a Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) at the time of installation, and as much it can alter it, it can't re-write it entirely. Problem is that components between motherboards differ even between same chipsets, and some components on new MB will not fit into hardware "strings" the OS assigned for them. That being said, things failing most often are Marvel devices and USB 3.0 controllers (especially the 3rd party ones), sometimes even intel native drivers will cause you grief after such swap, been there done that. most of things you will fix eventually, but I assure you there will be that little something that you won't be able to fix and it will drive you nuts over time ha ha!

TL;DR - it *should* work and keep you going until you find time to make a clean re-install with a partition re-format


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sounds fishy...but interesting!
> I may have a spare rig to test on...first class envelope FTW lol
> Hokies named a few, but I'd stick to Asus (MVG/MVF, nothing lesser than those two...and Sabertooth ain't worth the price), if not get a Gigabyte up5* or an Asrock OC formula...
> *up5 is good but Gb has some ram overclocking issues, so if you are into that and need to bench their boards may make your life harder. It's a trend I've seen a few times already...


To be Honest the King of Z77 1155 In the Gigabyte UP7 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569&Tpk=UP7

The G1 Sniper 3 pretty much samething As MVG/MVF with more gamer options.. and less money.

But the UP7 has moved ahead of the Pack to be crowned King...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> To be Honest the King of Z77 1155 In the Gigabyte UP7 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569&Tpk=UP7
> The G1 Sniper 3 pretty much samething As MVG/MVF with more gamer options.. and less money.
> But the UP7 has moved ahead of the Pack to be crowned King...


there is only one king







and it comes up cheaper than UP7








... last time I checked it was Asus MVE








http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858
http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1155/Maximus_V_Extreme/
(Maximus V Extreme King of Z77 overclocking boards with native Intel® Thunderbolt™)

... I'm not really serious, just teasing coz I'm bored and wanna go home (still at work LOL!)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> there is only one king
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and it comes up cheaper than UP7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... last time I checked it was Asus MVE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858
> http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1155/Maximus_V_Extreme/
> (Maximus V Extreme King of Z77 overclocking boards with native Intel® Thunderbolt™)
> ... I'm not really serious, just teasing coz I'm bored and wanna go home (still at work LOL!)


the Rampage Series are kings Maximus... not so much so.. i had a Rampage extreme III


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> the Rampage Series are kings Maximus... not so much so.. i had a Rampage extreme III


have you see the V....I want it lol. dual 8 pin cpu plugs. crazy Ln2 possibilities for franky lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> have you see the V....I want it lol. dual 8 pin cpu plugs. crazy Ln2 possibilities for franky lol.


Duel cpu plugs = Worthless Trust me my RE III had them.. your Cpu does not draw half the power of 1 plug with 1.8v..









It is like an Ash tray in a car for a guy who does not smoke lol.




Pics of my Sexy RE III and my 5ghz i7 930...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> To be Honest the King of Z77 1155 In the Gigabyte UP7 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569&Tpk=UP7
> The G1 Sniper 3 pretty much samething As MVG/MVF with more gamer options.. and less money.
> But the UP7 has moved ahead of the Pack to be crowned King...


This might come in handy...If someone wishes to go Gb. Give it a look!

I think Gigabyte is a bit behind in ram performance that's all. Their VRM is from another planet, easily wiping the floor with anything else (talking UP7 here).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> the Rampage Series are kings Maximus... not so much so.. i had a Rampage extreme III


You turned into an x79 fanboi now?







lol jk

EDIT: Just in case...I know that's an x58 board eh.







(and 5ghz 930...NICE!)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> This might come in handy...If someone wishes to go Gb. Give it a look!
> I think Gigabyte is a bit behind in ram performance that's all. Their VRM is from another planet, easily wiping the floor with anything else (talking UP7 here).
> You turned into an x79 fanboi now?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol jk
> EDIT: Just in case...I know that's an x58 board eh.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (and 5ghz 930...NICE!)


Ram performance is so close to call a real winner.

Options And Vrams go to Gigabyte.. Why they sell the most Mbs in the world and Asus is #2









But other then the KIng the UP7....

The MVE MVF G1 Sniper 3 are all so close... just get which ever is cheaper has the options and color combo you want..

Can not really say one stands out from the others they all have there perks.

Can you tell im a Friend of Sin0822 Since 2010? lol

We have like 5000 PM's between us since 2010 lol... talk daily heh


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ram performance is so close to call a real winner.
> Options And Vrams go to Gigabyte.. Why they sell the most Mbs in the world and Asus is #2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But other then the KIng the UP7....
> The MVE MVF G1 Sniper 3 are all so close... just get which ever is cheaper has the options and color combo you want..
> Can not really say one stands out from the others they all have there perks.
> Can you tell im a Friend of Sin0822 Since 2010? lol
> We have like 5000 PM's between us since 2010 lol... talk daily heh


He seems like a nice down to earth guy, like you lol








I can't imagine talking out of your behind like some other folk around here, who like to brag and defend their purchases xD

Anyway, yeah, I agree with the color scheme part...I'm having some trouble figuring what to do with my cm690 II advanced once I get the board.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i rather sacrifice some pentiums, celerons etc. first, and learn from that,
> then go for the real delid right away, and learn that way from a/my mistake..lol
> if you can do 1 or 2 pentium, celeron etc first, working or not, doesnt matter,
> you learn alot more from that, then any post or vid will..
> i can buy them here for a few bucks, even asking in a populair computersite
> over here, for broken ones ..lol
> edit,
> im master in miss reading posts, sorry..
> but what i said is ok i guess ..lol


Exactly! First time i had no clue on the glue density, how easy it was to slip in etc... The second delid i was easily able to avoid the glue coming off and slipping the knife in.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> LOL. That's what I was really wondering! They must have seen Hokies83's post or something because they were all gone! By lunch!
> So anyone have any ideas on this last question I asked? Different than the first as it's not about a reinstall of the OS onto the same system, but a replacement of hardware - the motherboard!
> >>> So, when I replace only the motherboard in a system, and first unload all the drivers, and then boot up the new MB and load its drivers and all the other device drivers fresh, will I need to reload the W7 OS???
> I'd like to think that all that needs to be changed with a new MB is the drivers and not the OS, yet my last attempt at this left the OS acting odd and off some, yet mainly functional....
> Any help on this guys?
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be honest with you as I did that a few dozen times (and still I don't recommend it) - I do that when I get lazy and don't want to spend nearly 2 days on re-installing the OS, installing all apps, updating all the crap and everything and customizing all to my flavor ... it *should* work this way (uninstall all drivers before the MB swap, then install new ones) ... but there is ALWAYS 1 or 2 small tiny glitches that will stay there forever and you will not ever be able to fix them without a re-installation. why? because Windows creates a Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) at the time of installation, and as much it can alter it, it can't re-write it entirely. Problem is that components between motherboards differ even between same chipsets, and some components on new MB will not fit into hardware "strings" the OS assigned for them. That being said, things failing most often are Marvel devices and USB 3.0 controllers (especially the 3rd party ones), sometimes even intel native drivers will cause you grief after such swap, been there done that. most of things you will fix eventually, but I assure you there will be that little something that you won't be able to fix and it will drive you nuts over time ha ha!
> 
> TL;DR - it *should* work and keep you going until you find time to make a clean re-install with a partition re-format
Click to expand...

Yep. Excellent answer *feniks* and just what I thought and was afraid was true! Bummer really, as it "should" work, but never completely does and there is always that something not right bugging me. You explained it well. Thanks!

So, I'll have to put in a couple days of reloading everything! And then re-modding all my games, so more than a couple of days really.... Not much fun when I really just want to play games and music and bench with my system while at the same time as having fun upgrading and adjusting it!

Maybe with it being another Asus board it won't be soooo bad that I have to do it too soon! Bench with it some before deciding if I keep the board anyway.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> the Rampage Series are kings Maximus... not so much so.. i had a Rampage extreme III


why so harsh








Maximus V platform is a sweet board series, pretty much flawless and seems to have a very low DOA % (can't say that about my former favorite manufacturer)
really, good and even holding the highest world record on 3770K nowadays








http://rog.asus.com/164362012/overclocking/7184-3mhz-rog-breaks-i7-3770k-frequency-world-record-more/

Maximus V Gene is especially one of the best bangs for the buck if one doesn't need more than 2 PCIe slots and needs a beautiful board with solid components, for LN2 is perfect... and relatively inexpensive if things go wrong and board doesn't survive the session







... not that I play with LN2 no, I don't, just saying.
I know folks who went with V Formula or V Maximus (as myself) and none of them can say a bad word about it, really ...

Rampage III Extreme was a very decent platform according to felow members (never owned it) and perhaps they were kings of the past, but evga x58 board was also very good (missing some BIOS functionality though as EVGA always did and nowadays they suck terribly in that field) and back in the day the highest world records were nicely done by kingpin on evga board







.

I agree that Sniper G1 and MVE are very similar quality and pretty much same good, so yeah just take whatever fits the color theme of your build and fits the wallet, goes on promo, etc.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> have you see the V....I want it lol. dual 8 pin cpu plugs. crazy Ln2 possibilities for franky lol.


there is 1x 8-pin + 1x 4-pin, not dual 8-pin (that I had on Z77 FTW and it was useless for me LOL!) ... anyways, Ivy Bridge will never call for more power than can go through a single 8-pin socket, so don't bother with that








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Duel cpu plugs = Worthless Trust me my RE III had them.. your Cpu does not draw half the power of 1 plug with 1.8v..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is like an Ash tray in a car for a guy who does not smoke lol.
> 
> 
> Pics of my Sexy RE III and my 5ghz i7 930...


yup, that is








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep. Excellent answer *feniks* and just what I thought and was afraid was true! Bummer really, as it "should" work, but never completely does and there is always that something not right bugging me. You explained it well. Thanks!
> So, I'll have to put in a couple days of reloading everything! And then re-modding all my games, so more than a couple of days really.... Not much fun when I really just want to play games and music and bench with my system while at the same time as having fun upgrading and adjusting it!
> Maybe with it being another Asus board it won't be soooo bad that I have to do it too soon! Bench with it some before deciding if I keep the board anyway.


yup, take that shortcut you mentioned just to get you going without much downtime, but please reserve a weekend for the total and clean re-install, you will appreciate it afterwards ... then take a backup of fully loaded and updated (uncorrupted!) Windows and keep it safe for restoration in future









PM'd that to Valgaur just now as he asked me some questions, but will post it here too below as I think it's useful for extreme overclockers who tend to eff up the system because of unstable overclocks (especially memory overclocking does that quickly if unstable):
f you have at least one WD harddrive in your system (external or internal) then get yourself a copy of Acronis True Image WD Edition, install it on fresh fully updated and loaded (with your programs of choice) system and back it up to some other non-OS hard drive. then once you f**k up your windows because of unstable overclocks, just boot to Acronis CD/USB tool and restore that windows image from backup in under 10 minutes wink.gif
http://support.wdc.com/product/downloaddetail.asp?swid=119


----------



## ivanlabrie

Thanks for the link! I have a wd640aaks...so it'll come in handy.








Rep+


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thanks for the link! I have a wd640aaks...so it'll come in handy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rep+


no probs! I thought it's a handy tool, been using it for years!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I used to use Norton ghost back then...never bothered with that again since building my new rig. But it's definitely the best way to go about it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> why so harsh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maximus V platform is a sweet board series, pretty much flawless and seems to have a very low DOA % (can't say that about my former favorite manufacturer)
> really, good and even holding the highest world record on 3770K nowadays
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://rog.asus.com/164362012/overclocking/7184-3mhz-rog-breaks-i7-3770k-frequency-world-record-more/
> Maximus V Gene is especially one of the best bangs for the buck if one doesn't need more than 2 PCIe slots and needs a beautiful board with solid components, for LN2 is perfect... and relatively inexpensive if things go wrong and board doesn't survive the session
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... not that I play with LN2 no, I don't, just saying.
> I know folks who went with V Formula or V Maximus (as myself) and none of them can say a bad word about it, really ...
> Rampage III Extreme was a very decent platform according to felow members (never owned it) and perhaps they were kings of the past, but evga x58 board was also very good (missing some BIOS functionality though as EVGA always did and nowadays they suck terribly in that field) and back in the day the highest world records were nicely done by kingpin on evga board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> I agree that Sniper G1 and MVE are very similar quality and pretty much same good, so yeah just take whatever fits the color theme of your build and fits the wallet, goes on promo, etc.
> there is 1x 8-pin + 1x 4-pin, not dual 8-pin (that I had on Z77 FTW and it was useless for me LOL!) ... anyways, Ivy Bridge will never call for more power than can go through a single 8-pin socket, so don't bother with that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yup, that is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yup, take that shortcut you mentioned just to get you going without much downtime, but please reserve a weekend for the total and clean re-install, you will appreciate it afterwards ... then take a backup of fully loaded and updated (uncorrupted!) Windows and keep it safe for restoration in future
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PM'd that to Valgaur just now as he asked me some questions, but will post it here too below as I think it's useful for extreme overclockers who tend to eff up the system because of unstable overclocks (especially memory overclocking does that quickly if unstable):
> f you have at least one WD harddrive in your system (external or internal) then get yourself a copy of Acronis True Image WD Edition, install it on fresh fully updated and loaded (with your programs of choice) system and back it up to some other non-OS hard drive. then once you f**k up your windows because of unstable overclocks, just boot to Acronis CD/USB tool and restore that windows image from backup in under 10 minutes wink.gif
> http://support.wdc.com/product/downloaddetail.asp?swid=119


The UP7 is on a whole nother Level then the g1 Sniper 3 MVF MVE Maximus is not Asus Cream of the crop the Rampage is









http://www.overclock.net/t/1312630/the-gigabyte-z77x-up7-preview-the-oc-board-and-the-ud9-meet/0_20 Stare at God of z77 MB 32 phases of whoop arse....

And just a quick and dirty LN2 run takes the top spot... http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2540994


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zantrill*


I hope I never have to remove my 3770K, unless my MB dies in the future. Someday I will know how the CL Pro spread out, just not today!


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, should I return my OC back to 4.8 or stay with 4.5? I was just wondering since I'm extremely board right now.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, should I return my OC back to 4.8 or stay with 4.5? I was just wondering since I'm extremely board right now.


Buy a new chip and motherboard! LOL

My new 3570K is not a winner so far. Around 1.264v for 4.5GHz IBT run.

And only able to get to 5GHz at 1.552v and no further at that vcore.

http://valid.canardpc.com/2580899



I sure hope the new sabertooth board can do better with it.....









But at least I am not bored!!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, should I return my OC back to 4.8 or stay with 4.5? I was just wondering since I'm extremely board right now.
> 
> 
> 
> Buy a new chip and motherboard! LOL
> 
> My new 3570K is not a winner so far. Around 1.264v for 4.5GHz IBT run.
> 
> And only able to get to 5GHz at 1.552v and no further at that vcore.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2580899
> 
> 
> 
> I sure hope the new sabertooth board can do better with it.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But at least I am not bored!!!
Click to expand...

I don't have enough money for that.








http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2464143


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, should I return my OC back to 4.8 or stay with 4.5? I was just wondering since I'm extremely board right now.
> 
> 
> 
> Buy a new chip and motherboard! LOL
> 
> My new 3570K is not a winner so far. Around 1.264v for 4.5GHz IBT run.
> 
> And only able to get to 5GHz at 1.552v and no further at that vcore.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2580899
> 
> 
> 
> I sure hope the new sabertooth board can do better with it.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But at least I am not bored!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't have enough money for that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2464143
Click to expand...

You will one day after you finish school! Until then, just bench and OC what you got!









And your 3570K vcore for 5GHz makes my new chip look even worse than it did to me already......


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, should I return my OC back to 4.8 or stay with 4.5? I was just wondering since I'm extremely board right now.
> 
> 
> 
> Buy a new chip and motherboard! LOL
> 
> My new 3570K is not a winner so far. Around 1.264v for 4.5GHz IBT run.
> 
> And only able to get to 5GHz at 1.552v and no further at that vcore.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2580899
> 
> 
> 
> I sure hope the new sabertooth board can do better with it.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But at least I am not bored!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't have enough money for that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2464143
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You will one day after you finish school! Until then, just bench and OC what you got!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And your 3570K vcore for 5GHz makes my new chip look even worse than it did to me already......
Click to expand...

Haha.







Glad to have made it worse. Jk! I plan to get a lot of benching things like a torture rack and some really nice OCN pot.







That'll make my day so much. Until then, I just OCed my CPU to 4.8.


----------



## VonDutch

see, when i said i saw geese flying away, it would get colder,
this is forcast for thursday night.. yesss...


i live in the east, way up north ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Okay guys tinny bit of an update. After freaking 8 REINSTALLS of w7 and xp. I "THINK" I may have gotten xp and w7 working together in a somewhat happy maner. Will update later with superpi results.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> others say this works well
> 
> i used this..lol
> 
> edit:
> removed the hammer method as a bad idea, sorry..


morning, reading through the posts from last night,
so we can agree about the 3 pics i posted earlier,
to be the most safe to use?

using one of those should do it, as best/proven methods ?
and in the order shown above,
addition can be made later, if we find more or even better ways to delid,

about cleaning the adhesive on pcb and underside ihs,
1. use fingernails
2. use a creditcard
3. rubbing alcohol or spiritus, to clean die, and/or the last bits of adhesive

altho the rubbing alcohol wont clean the adhesive when its still untouched,
just after delid..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1. Break Corners with a Thin Razor..
> 2. Finish with Sturdy Credit card...
> Seems the Safest Method imo..


yes, but a normal credit card is a bit thick, could bent the pcb,
still looking for something like a credit card, but thinner,(about half as thick or less)
and easy to get/find for everyone..

edit:
*heating up the cpu before delid seems to help also*,
let it run prime for a 15-20min, or put it in the oven (80C) someone said,
dont know about that, DONT put it in a microwave tho ...lol

i remember a woman who put a little cat in a microwave to dry after a bath,
she sued the company that made it,
because they didnt mention it in the manual that you cant dry animals in a microwave...splat! ...lol


----------



## Systemlord

Is it me or is it not easy to remove the black glue from the PCB after delidding? After reading through this thread before delidding, it came off ridiculously easy for me! Is that not the same for everyone?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Is it me or is it not easy to remove the black glue from the PCB after delidding? After reading through this thread before delidding, it came off ridiculously easy for me! Is that not the same for everyone?


not that same for everyone i guess,
i used this side of my box cutter to scrape the glue off,

but very careful of course








wouldnt recommend it to anyone now, with what ive learned so far..lol

i think credit card is a good way to scrape it off, but theres always peeps that screw that up too,
after this weekend, practice on the old pentiums, i cant imagine anyone messing up the pcb, or delid,
but maybe its just me thinking its easy..idk, my 15 year old kid did 3 cpu's without even touching/scratching the pcb,

some say the box cutter i used is bad, i say, its not what you use, but how you use it..





little vid we made during the delids this weekend, my kiddo doing a corner








he said this one was really hard compared to the others he did..

what i found is very important to keep in mind during delid

dont let the blade you use go in any direction,
keep it 100% right-angled ALL the time when cutting through the edges, or doing the long sides

if you have a dremel, it could work too, to clean the ihs/pcb

with a, soft, Polishing Wheel on..


----------



## ketapang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Is it me or is it not easy to remove the black glue from the PCB after delidding? After reading through this thread before delidding, it came off ridiculously easy for me! Is that not the same for everyone?


Mine came off easy too & it was my 1st time. If you use the right tools & gave the right pressure, you will easily remove the ihs without damaging the processor. I might go for another one later but i will see 1st if my budget allows.









EDIT:
Here's my attempt on 4.6Ghz, 10hours of prime95 with 90% usage ram. Hitting 102c on highest core... Will ordered Liquid Pro soon and shave another 10c.











Abit off topic here, how do i make my rig below the signature to be visible?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i remember a woman who put a little cat in a microwave to dry after a bath,
> she sued the company that made it,
> because they didnt mention it in the manual that you cant dry animals in a microwave...splat! ...lol


Funniest thing i have read all day, just thinking of her going OMG F*** the cat blew up.


----------



## rainbowhash

Would there be some similar temperature reductions in the i5 2500k? Well, not as extreme of course, but like 3-5C would be an extreme change in my climate; Plus i could probably push it to 5Ghz on air since there seems to be a lot of headroom already with the max stock i've gotten to stable was like 4.7 or something without seeing to go further.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rainbowhash*
> 
> Would there be some similar temperature reductions in the i5 2500k? Well, not as extreme of course, but like 3-5C would be an extreme change in my climate; Plus i could probably push it to 5Ghz on air since there seems to be a lot of headroom already with the max stock i've gotten to stable was like 4.7 or something without seeing to go further.


The 2500K is soldered to the IHS. I have never seen anyone successfully delid one. I have seen a couple of attempts but the chip failed to work in all attempts. I believe the fact that this is not applicable to Sandy is mentioned in the op.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Abit off topic here, how do i make my rig below the signature to be visible?


click on your name in the upper right corner, takes you to your profile,
scroll all the way down to "Your Rigs", click "Create a new rig"















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Here's my attempt on 4.6Ghz, 10hours of prime95 with 90% usage ram. Hitting 102c on highest core... Will ordered Liquid Pro soon and shave another 10c.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


really?, 102C..
i wouldnt do that if i where you, at 102C one of my cores shut down to protect the chip,
at 105C the other cores started to throttle down to about 80% load..
i know it prolly only touched the 102C with peaks, but still, 102C is very close to trouble








at least the oc looks stable ...lol


----------



## rainbowhash

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> The 2500K is soldered to the IHS. I have never seen anyone successfully delid one. I have seen a couple of attempts but the chip failed to work in all attempts. I believe the fact that this is not applicable to Sandy is mentioned in the op.


"

Damn, and yeah i missed that, suffering from the tired-cannot read well syndrome


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rainbowhash*
> 
> "
> Damn, and yeah i missed that, suffering from the tired-cannot read well syndrome


haha, i hear ya, happens to me all the time ...lol

i did take some soldered ihs of this weekend, old pentiums,
just to try if i could, but i cant check if they still work..
but the solder on yours is really good, has a high w/mk,
i dont think it will improve temps alot if you would take it off,
and use other/better tim


----------



## Phobos223

Overnight full BOINC load @ 4.8Ghz 1.376v, ambient about 17C



Hottest core only hit 62C... God bless delidding


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *rainbowhash*
> 
> Would there be some similar temperature reductions in the i5 2500k? Well, not as extreme of course, but like 3-5C would be an extreme change in my climate; Plus i could probably push it to 5Ghz on air since there seems to be a lot of headroom already with the max stock i've gotten to stable was like 4.7 or something without seeing to go further.
> 
> 
> 
> The 2500K is soldered to the IHS. I have never seen anyone successfully delid one. I have seen a couple of attempts but the chip failed to work in all attempts. I believe the fact that this is not applicable to Sandy is mentioned in the op.
Click to expand...

*Valgaur* - we might need to make a much bigger note in the first page *that this will not work for sandy's* as we seem to get one of these questions every week or so!!! LOL


----------



## ketapang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> scroll all the way down to "Your Rigs", click "Create a new rig"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/SIZE]
> really?, 102C..
> i wouldnt do that if i where you, at 102C one of my cores shut down to protect the chip,
> at 105C the other cores started to throttle down to about 80% load..
> i know it prolly only touched the 102C with peaks, but still, 102C is very close to trouble
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> at least the oc looks stable ...lol


Ive already hit 105c twice or more b4 delid. As i already void the warranty, might as well just go with it.







And most of my usage is not really that intensive, temperature when gaming only goes around 60 and CS:GO around low 70s. So i think im okay with it.









Anway, anyone already done direct die with air-cooling?


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Anway, anyone already done direct die with air-cooling?


If you try this, make sure you don't have a cooler with exposed heatpipes on the base! Will not work well and could damage your core!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I used to use Norton ghost back then...never bothered with that again since building my new rig. But it's definitely the best way to go about it.


Also, for Seagate users, there is also a free edition (out dated however) of Acronis Seagate edition (called Disc Wizard), which requires a Seagate drive in system instead:
http://www.seagate.com/support/downloads/discwizard/

IMHO, if you can use the WD edition then stick to it, it's newer and more intelligent (often resizing partition being restored on the fly so it fits right even if originally it was bigger/smaller, DiscWizard can't do that).

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The UP7 is on a whole nother Level then the g1 Sniper 3 MVF MVE Maximus is not Asus Cream of the crop the Rampage is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1312630/the-gigabyte-z77x-up7-preview-the-oc-board-and-the-ud9-meet/0_20 Stare at God of z77 MB 32 phases of whoop arse....
> And just a quick and dirty LN2 run takes the top spot... http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2540994


Yeah, X79 is the cream ... only problem with it that it's been made from a fouled sour cream LOL! ... I was considering this platform as an upgrade from 790 Ultra, but passed on it ... too many BIOS issues and some unlucky hardware solutions ... still 40 native lanes for GPUs is something admirable that 1155 can't achieve natively (possible only via a lagging switching chips like PLX). So far however there is no Ivy Bridge-E chip with native PCIe 3.0 support and the one currently available for 2011 socket (Sandy Bridge-E) is supporting only some "beta PCI-e 3.0" which doesn't work correctly with latest nvidia drivers (for older drivers it's working only with a special patch) ... besides 2011 chips are darn expensive ... great if anyone really needs 6 cores though









anywho, I like Z77 platform so far and staying with it, lots of fun!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Also, for Seagate users, there is also a free edition (out dated however) of Acronis Seagate edition (called Disc Wizard), which requires a Seagate drive in system instead:
> http://www.seagate.com/support/downloads/discwizard/
> IMHO, if you can use the WD edition then stick to it, it's newer and more intelligent (often resizing partition being restored on the fly so it fits right even if originally it was bigger/smaller, DiscWizard can't do that).
> Yeah, X79 is the cream ... only problem with it that it's been made from a fouled sour cream LOL! ... I was considering this platform as an upgrade from 790 Ultra, but passed on it ... too many BIOS issues and some unlucky hardware solutions ... still 40 native lanes for GPUs is something admirable that 1155 can't achieve natively (possible only via a lagging switching chips like PLX). So far however there is no Ivy Bridge-E chip with native PCIe 3.0 support and the one currently available for 2011 socket (Sandy Bridge-E) is supporting only some "beta PCI-e 3.0" which doesn't work correctly with latest nvidia drivers (for older drivers it's working only with a special patch) ... besides 2011 chips are darn expensive ... great if anyone really needs 6 cores though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anywho, I like Z77 platform so far and staying with it, lots of fun!


1366 The 4 core / 8 thread i7s got to use the Rampage...... Asus was not so nice this time..


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Also, for Seagate users, there is also a free edition (out dated however) of Acronis Seagate edition (called Disc Wizard), which requires a Seagate drive in system instead:
> http://www.seagate.com/support/downloads/discwizard/
> IMHO, if you can use the WD edition then stick to it, it's newer and more intelligent (often resizing partition being restored on the fly so it fits right even if originally it was bigger/smaller, DiscWizard can't do that).
> Yeah, X79 is the cream ... only problem with it that it's been made from a fouled sour cream LOL! ... I was considering this platform as an upgrade from 790 Ultra, but passed on it ... too many BIOS issues and some unlucky hardware solutions ... still 40 native lanes for GPUs is something admirable that 1155 can't achieve natively (possible only via a lagging switching chips like PLX). So far however there is no Ivy Bridge-E chip with native PCIe 3.0 support and the one currently available for 2011 socket (Sandy Bridge-E) is supporting only some "beta PCI-e 3.0" which doesn't work correctly with latest nvidia drivers (for older drivers it's working only with a special patch) ... besides 2011 chips are darn expensive ... great if anyone really needs 6 cores though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anywho, I like Z77 platform so far and staying with it, lots of fun!


If anyone wants to backup a drive just use a linux live-usb and learn how to use the command DD. it can do full HD backups/single partition backups. It is free and much better than any acronis junk.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I used to use Norton ghost back then...never bothered with that again since building my new rig. But it's definitely the best way to go about it.


always used ghost, loved that little backup proggie back then,
never went wrong with it









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Ive already hit 105c twice or more b4 delid. As i already void the warranty, might as well just go with it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And most of my usage is not really that intensive, temperature when gaming only goes around 60 and CS:GO around low 70s. So i think im okay with it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anway, anyone already done direct die with air-cooling?


yea same here, few times, didnt know what prime and ibt etc. did
to oced chips temp wise ..lol,
and i didnt know the proggies yet, so i clicked wrong too to stop,
thats how i know about the 102C core shutdown, and 105C throttle ..lol
happened within a few seconds, you should have seen the look on my face,
i really thought i killed it ..lol

with normal use, you never gonna see those temps,
still thought i should say watch it tho ..lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1366 The 4 core / 8 thread i7s got to use the Rampage...... Asus was not so nice this time..


yeah, I hear ya man. I personally skipped the whole x58 fun (was enjoying my 790 setup for a few years), but I heard and read a lot about it on evga forums back in the day. lots of folks were complaining on asus back then ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> If anyone wants to backup a drive just use a linux live-usb and learn how to use the command DD. it can do full HD backups/single partition backups. It is free and much better than any acronis junk.


Acronis IT is actually a very sophisticated software and even the limited free edition from WD does work very well. you can make a USB bootable tool with it too, to backup/restore outside of Windows (that USB bootable Acronis is linux based).

other than that one could use tools like Clonezilla or some other linux bootable solutions. GParted is great for copying partitions (I use i for resizing mostly), but that's not a real backup, more like a direct copy of it. there is plenty others too, haven't played around much with them personally.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, I hear ya man. I personally skipped the whole x58 fun (was enjoying my 790 setup for a few years), but I heard and read a lot about it on evga forums back in the day. lots of folks were complaining on asus back then ...
> Acronis IT is actually a very sophisticated software and even the limited free edition from WD does work very well. you can make a USB bootable tool with it too, to backup/restore outside of Windows (that USB bootable Acronis is linux based).
> other than that one could use tools like Clonezilla or some other linux bootable solutions. GParted is great for copying partitions (I use i for resizing mostly), but that's not a real backup, more like a direct copy of it. there is plenty others too, haven't played around much with them personally.


Im am Also on Evga forums...

I do not post there to much not a real fan of there All ref Approach to Gpus.. kinda robs the consumer imo..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Valgaur* - we might need to make a much bigger note in the first page *that this will not work for sandy's* as we seem to get one of these questions every week or so!!! LOL


It does work though thats the thing. however for Sandys the process to delid is much more delicate and you need balls of steel and some good heat to pull it off and get it just right. It isn't worth it though for Sandy's in my opinion that fluxless TIM is pretty amazing already.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

DD is the best tool for making backups 1. command is all you need its so powerful.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im am Also on Evga forums...
> I do not post there to much not a real fan of there All ref Approach to Gpus.. kinda robs the consumer imo..


yeah, me neither ... not fond of their MB lineup after x58 glory they went downhill ... can't say a terrible thing about their GPUs though, had a very good luck with 570 and 670 cards. however I understand you well about plain reference designs being well ... plain reference hehe. They also have not bad FTW designs, but not everybody likes paying extra for those ... I stick to reference besides for various reasons...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> DD is the best tool for making backups 1. command is all you need its so powerful.


DD? a link?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, me neither ... not fond of their MB lineup after x58 glory they went downhill ... can't say a terrible thing about their GPUs though, had a very good luck with 570 and 670 cards. however I understand you well about plain reference designs being well ... plain reference hehe. They also have not bad FTW designs, but not everybody likes paying extra for those ... I stick to reference besides for various reasons...
> DD? a link?


Haha clearly you have never used linux, which is fine just saying. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dd_(Unix)

Basically to copy one HD to a file on another HD you can restore later is

(input hd if specifies the HD/file being copied) dd if=/dev/sdaX dd of=/dev/sdaX (another HD) OR dd of=/path/to/save/point/file.whatever extension you want

so basically to copy one HD to another = dd if=/dev/sdaX of=/dev/sdaX (sdaX changes to sda1 etc based on what the device is..)

To copy an HD to a file you can restore later using DD = dd if=/dev/sdaX of=/path/to/file. bs=1M (the BS=1M just makes the block size 1M for faster copying)

To restore an HD from a file just reverse the if/of like so: dd if=/path/to/saved/image of=/dev/sdaX

So the uses are endless for this basically saving an image of my windows 7 install was one command, then flashing the HD back to that image after trying windows 8 and hating it was one command... Nothing beats that.

as you see in the link DD has many other uses also such as writing zer0's or random data to a hard disk thus making it safe to sell/give away is just one more use of DD


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> dd if=/dev/sdaX dd of=/dev/sdaX (another HD) HD to another = dd if=/dev/sdaX of=/dev/sdaX (sdaX changes to sda1 etc
> HD DD = dd if=/dev/sdaX of=/path/to/file. bs=1M (the BS=1M 1M)
> if/of like so: dd if=/path/to/saved/image of=/dev/sdaX


what country did you say you lived again??...

lol, jk jk ..laters peeps


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Haha clearly you have never used linux, which is fine just saying. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dd_(Unix)
> Basically to copy one HD to a file on another HD you can restore later is
> (input hd if specifies the HD/file being copied) dd if=/dev/sdaX dd of=/dev/sdaX (another HD) OR dd of=/path/to/save/point/file.whatever extension you want
> so basically to copy one HD to another = dd if=/dev/sdaX of=/dev/sdaX (sdaX changes to sda1 etc based on what the device is..)
> To copy an HD to a file you can restore later using DD = dd if=/dev/sdaX of=/path/to/file. bs=1M (the BS=1M just makes the block size 1M for faster copying)
> To restore an HD from a file just reverse the if/of like so: dd if=/path/to/saved/image of=/dev/sdaX
> So the uses are endless for this basically saving an image of my windows 7 install was one command, then flashing the HD back to that image after trying windows 8 and hating it was one command... Nothing beats that.
> as you see in the link DD has many other uses also such as writing zer0's or random data to a hard disk thus making it safe to sell/give away is just one more use of DD


LOL, I used Linuxes briefly, Debian, Fedora, RedHat (servers), Ubuntu desktop/netbook ... but I prefer GUI, not that command line bull **** LOL!









thanks for commands, will never memorize them though ha ha!

but honestly, how big files are you getting by saving a partition backup to a file like this? is this sector by sector (file size equals partition size) or data size only? ... as I said, Acronis is easier, GUI under Linux and very smart backup/restore (with automatic resizing), zero problems ...


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL, I used Linuxes briefly, Debian, Fedora, RedHat (servers), Ubuntu desktop/netbook ... but I prefer GUI, not that command line bull **** LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for commands, will never memorize them though ha ha!
> but honestly, how big files are you getting by saving a partition backup to a file like this? is this sector by sector (file size equals partition size) or data size only? ... as I said, Acronis is easier, GUI under Linux and very smart backup/restore (with automatic resizing), zero problems ...


It is only easier to you because you can't be bothered to use the command line









I can see why you only used linux briefly, it is not like windows you must learn to use the command line at some point..

none of that was meant as an insult fyi linux/command line isn't for everyone.


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o hokies, what was it that makes 1 core run hotter,
> the one next to the imc or vid card?


Was this ever answered? I did a quick jump through the pages between this post and the last page and didn't see it. I am very curious. Stock IHS seating, 2 of my buddies and myself both have much higher temps on the "middle" cores (1 and 2) as opposed to the "outside" (0 and 3). After delidding, my core 2 still reaches high 80's during IBT, while the others hit high 60's/low 70's. I'm very tempted to open my IHS and see if I maybe have too much Liquid Ultra over one section, but I'd rather not go open my case and such if it's unnecessary.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Was this ever answered? I did a quick jump through the pages between this post and the last page and didn't see it. I am very curious. Stock IHS seating, 2 of my buddies and myself both have much higher temps on the "middle" cores (1 and 2) as opposed to the "outside" (0 and 3). After delidding, my core 2 still reaches high 80's during IBT, while the others hit high 60's/low 70's. I'm very tempted to open my IHS and see if I maybe have too much Liquid Ultra over one section, but I'd rather not go open my case and such if it's unnecessary.


Lap the ihs because if its concave it will push your tim right off the cores.


----------



## chris-br

With me also, my higher temps come from the core 1 and 2.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lap the ihs because if its concave it will push your tim right off the cores.


Is that what you recommend for me too?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Was this ever answered? I did a quick jump through the pages between this post and the last page and didn't see it. I am very curious. Stock IHS seating, 2 of my buddies and myself both have much higher temps on the "middle" cores (1 and 2) as opposed to the "outside" (0 and 3). After delidding, my core 2 still reaches high 80's during IBT, while the others hit high 60's/low 70's. I'm very tempted to open my IHS and see if I maybe have too much Liquid Ultra over one section, but I'd rather not go open my case and such if it's unnecessary.


Igpu makes it hotter and causes up to a 00.5v Vcore needed to power it.


----------



## dalastbmills

Funny you should mention that; I've been working a couple days at my mother's work, where we make gaskets and such, and I found a "lapping manual" laying around and it definitely made me smile.


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Igpu makes it hotter and causes up to a 00.5v Vcore needed to power it.


Even if we aren't using the iGPU, it still causes higher temps? This was was also happening on my P67 board, which does not support the iGPU or even mention it in the BIOS.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Even if we aren't using the iGPU, it still causes higher temps? This was was also happening on my P67 board, which does not support the iGPU or even mention it in the BIOS.


If it is not on in the bios and you did not install the drivers for it..

Then it should not be making much a difference at all.


----------



## dalastbmills

So then it looks like I have to either lap my IHS or remove it from the equation. Does anyone know if it's possible to place the Corsiar AIO block directly on the die? Or do the screws not go low enough?

Also, what type of liquid is in the lines and can they freeze? I'm thinking of building some sort of intake from the window above my PC, similar to a dryer vent, to bring in cold air from outside. I don't want to freeze the line or cause it to break/leak. Any ideas?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> So then it looks like I have to either lap my IHS or remove it from the equation. Does anyone know if it's possible to place the Corsiar AIO block directly on the die? Or do the screws not go low enough?
> Also, what type of liquid is in the lines and can they freeze? I'm thinking of building some sort of intake from the window above my PC, similar to a dryer vent, to bring in cold air from outside. I don't want to freeze the line or cause it to break/leak. Any ideas?


bad idea, one word: condensation.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> So then it looks like I have to either lap my IHS or remove it from the equation. Does anyone know if it's possible to place the Corsiar AIO block directly on the die? Or do the screws not go low enough?
> Also, what type of liquid is in the lines and can they freeze? I'm thinking of building some sort of intake from the window above my PC, similar to a dryer vent, to bring in cold air from outside. I don't want to freeze the line or cause it to break/leak. Any ideas?


Not sure on the direct die method using your cooler, but the coolant is propylene glycol, and it freezes below 0c actually, something like -28c or close to that.


----------



## Arm3nian

Dam, I can't decide if I should buy liquid ultra again. I used the entire tube but failed on both my cpu and gpu, and have idle temps of 70c at 3500mhz! I can't even use my computer, that's how hot it gets, its almost like there is 0 contact.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Dam, I can't decide if I should buy liquid ultra again. I used the entire tube but failed on both my cpu and gpu, and have idle temps of 70c at 3500mhz! I can't even use my computer, that's how hot it gets, its almost like there is 0 contact.


Did you delid or what? Buy Liquid Pro...I did. Last time I got Liquid Ultra, which worked GREAT for my gpu btw...I don't feel like replacing it though, but I'll use it for my die and ihs probably. I guess I'll have to lap the ihs aswell...won't touch the Silver Arrow's base though.


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> bad idea, one word: condensation.


I figured as much. Was a rather long shot anyways. I'm set up in the basement and it's already pretty chill down here. Dropped 10C just by moving down here.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not sure on the direct die method using your cooler, but the coolant is propylene glycol, and it freezes below 0c actually, something like -28c or close to that.


Can anyone confirm if it's possible to get a Corsair AIO directly on the die. Anyone who is familiar with these kits knows that (for Intel anyway) you use:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!















I'm curios if that screw has enough clearance to settle the block on the die...


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> I figured as much. Was a rather long shot anyways. I'm set up in the basement and it's already pretty chill down here. Dropped 10C just by moving down here.
> Can anyone confirm if it's possible to get a Corsair AIO directly on the die. Anyone who is familiar with these kits knows that (for Intel anyway) you use:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm curios if that screw has enough clearance to settle the block on the die...


Yea i'd like to move down to the basement my self to keep temps down but then i'd have to be cold too


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> I'm curios if that screw has enough clearance to settle the block on the die...


Hey dude, if you want a safe way to test this, get some contact paper from walmart or an office supply store. Think of the pink or yellow part of a receipt. if you cut a small square of that paper, and then place that on the die of your CPU. Then mount the block (no TIM obviously), but be sure to use equal pressure. Be careful cuz if you crack the corners of the core you're toast. Once you get it all the way down, remove the block and inspect the contact paper. If you see a nice, even, dark rectangle where the core was, then I think its worth a shot with TIM!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

dalast I bet you'd be ok, on the chip I made only run in single channel mode from a crappy de-lid attempt I said screw it, it is alrdy damaged and I direct mounted my 212 evo and screwed it down all the way and it did not crack the die... the chip functioned just as it had before the process but that contact paper idea is a good one..


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> dalast I bet you'd be ok, on the chip I made only run in single channel mode from a crappy de-lid attempt I said screw it, it is alrdy damaged and I direct mounted my 212 evo and screwed it down all the way and it did not crack the die... the chip functioned just as it had before the process but that contact paper idea is a good one..


Did you notice any better results without the IHS on there?

BTW Tool rocks


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> bad idea, one word: condensation.
> 
> 
> 
> I figured as much. Was a rather long shot anyways. I'm set up in the basement and it's already pretty chill down here. Dropped 10C just by moving down here.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not sure on the direct die method using your cooler, but the coolant is propylene glycol, and it freezes below 0c actually, something like -28c or close to that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Can anyone confirm if it's possible to get a Corsair AIO directly on the die. Anyone who is familiar with these kits knows that (for Intel anyway) you use:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm curios if that screw has enough clearance to settle the block on the die...
Click to expand...

I have those same screws for my Corsair H80, and I am sure they would not allow it to rest on the die without the IHS between them.

I ended up lapping my IHS and that solved the problem for me.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Did you notice any better results without the IHS on there?
> BTW Tool rocks


Yes, Yes they do.

Unfortunately I don't remember if the temps were better but I don't think more than a few degree Celsius ( don't think it was even 5C ) or i'd remember. I was so mad about jacking up the chip lol.

Lol i've been posting in this thread the most lately and I don't even have a *fully functioning* de-lidded chip and have decided it isn't worth the risk for me on my new chip as 4.5 ghz is enough for a gamer.

I am fairly confident I could do it now though with a triangle shaped razor blade...







lol that pic hokies posted fits me perfectly.


----------



## chris-br

guess my question was too stupid to be answered.


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I have those same screws for my Corsair H80, and I am sure they would not allow it to rest on the die without the IHS between them.
> I ended up lapping my IHS and that solved the problem for me.


Guess I'll have to either mod my setup or lap. Off the top of your hear (or anyone), do you know if those are 6/32 threadded screws? I have a ton of 2"+ screws I picked up when I thought I was going to be getting a Rasa kit. I could just swap them out. But it might be easier/better/safer to lap. What's the best method for this?

By doing this, I will have to revert to MX-4 on the top of my IHS as I used up all my Liquid Ultra








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Yes, Yes they do.
> Unfortunately I don't remember if the temps were better but I don't think more than a few degree Celsius ( don't think it was even 5C ) or i'd remember. I was so mad about jacking up the chip lol.
> Lol i've been posting in this thread the most lately and I don't even have a *fully functioning* de-lidded chip and have decided it isn't worth the risk for me on my new chip as 4.5 ghz is enough for a gamer.
> I am fairly confident I could do it now though with a triangle shaped razor blade...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol that pic hokies posted fits me perfectly.


Triangle-shaped razor blade? What for?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Guess I'll have to either mod my setup or lap. Off the top of your hear (or anyone), do you know if those are 6/32 threadded screws? I have a ton of 2"+ screws I picked up when I thought I was going to be getting a Rasa kit. I could just swap them out. But it might be easier/better/safer to lap. What's the best method for this?
> By doing this, I will have to revert to MX-4 on the top of my IHS as I used up all my Liquid Ultra
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Triangle-shaped razor blade? What for?




like a triangle with no top







the kind that go in a razor knife, only im thinking it is the best tool to use but not with the razor knife, just a pair of gloves so you don't get cut somehow.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lap the ihs because if its concave it will push your tim right off the cores.
> 
> 
> 
> Is that what you recommend for me too?
Click to expand...

Sorry if you feel ignored, sometimes that happens to all of us.

If you are still having temp problems after delidding, then maybe lapping applies to you. Hold a razor-blade over your IHS in front of a light to see if the top is concave or convex or flat. If no light shines through the blade were it contacts the IHS, then it is flat and lapping might still help a little (1-3C), but if you see lots of light, then lapping can help much more for your temps (5-10C+).


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> 
> like a triangle with no top
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the kind that go in a razor knife, only im thinking it is the best tool to use but not with the razor knife, just a pair of gloves so you don't get cut somehow.


^ Would have saved me from quite a few cuts...


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> ^ Would have saved me from quite a few cuts...


Yea I got a ton of them like that, just the corners aren't rounded. I am almost thinking a piece of duct-tape on the bottom part of the razor so that it can't possible scrape the PCB just the edge cutting the glue. Sound stupid or...?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry if you feel ignored, sometimes that happens to all of us.
> If you are still having temp problems after delidding, then maybe lapping applies to you. Hold a razor-blade over your IHS in front of a light to see if the top is concave or convex or flat. If no light shines through the blade were it contacts the IHS, then it is flat and lapping might still help a little (1-3C), but if you see lots of light, then lapping can help much more for your temps (5-10C+).


So, i gonna wait until my liquid pro arrives, so that i do it all at once.


----------



## Arm3nian

Do you guys actually use liquid pro on dies? Who would actually lap the die...


----------



## neopunx

Where did you get that we lap the die?

How do you disable/ kill the iGPU?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Where did you get that we lap the die?
> How do you disable/ kill the iGPU?


How else would you get the liquid pro off? And I think it is disabled by default if you have a discrete gpu and nothing connected to the motherboard (dvi,hdmi) that provides output.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Where did you get that we lap the die?
> How do you disable/ kill the iGPU?


Well From what i read in the Bios.. or by not installing the IGpu drivers. But that is where u get your Media Encoding power from...


----------



## HardwareDecoder

you can switch igpu off in the bios by selecting multi-monitor: off


----------



## dalastbmills

I haven't messed with my iGPU settings, so mine should be off. So my high temps must be from a need to lap my IHS.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> I haven't messed with my iGPU settings, so mine should be off. So my high temps must be from a need to lap my IHS.


nah pretty sure it is enabled by default broseph.


----------



## kgtuning

My igpu was enabled by default too.


----------



## dalastbmills

Well then. I'll be right back.


----------



## neopunx

Weird, I think I tried to turn mine off, and it cut off the signal to my monitor. Its doubly weird because I have my DVI plugged in my master CF 7970 and not into the mobo. Oh well, Ill try it again. Hope I don't have to clear the bios again.. that's annoying. They need to make a freaking switch or something.


----------



## dalastbmills

You guys were right. I disabled my iGPU. Wonder how much (if any) my temps drop...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Weird, I think I tried to turn mine off, and it cut off the signal to my monitor. Its doubly weird because I have my DVI plugged in my master CF 7970 and not into the mobo. Oh well, Ill try it again. Hope I don't have to clear the bios again.. that's annoying. They need to make a freaking switch or something.


There IS a switch...your Sabertooth should have a cmos button or something.


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> You guys were right. I disabled my iGPU. Wonder how much (if any) my temps drop...


No drop in temps


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> It is only easier to you because you can't be bothered to use the command line
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can see why you only used linux briefly, it is not like windows you must learn to use the command line at some point..
> none of that was meant as an insult fyi linux/command line isn't for everyone.


no probs buddy, I understand. I do use command line (bash) a bit, but I am so used to Windows cmd that I often make mistake in linux bash (different command names or switches) and it utterly pisses me off LOL! in deed I would need to finally learn and memorize linux commands by heart to enjoy it instead of aiding myself with GUI always when possible








other than that I need google to use linux command lines hehe









no offense taken.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> With me also, my higher temps come from the core 1 and 2.


mine were same, always 2 middle cores are higher by a few up to 15C higher than others (outer ones) depending on speed of clocks, voltage and load. most likely as mentioned, the IHS has a concave in it and only lapping it (warranty void for good) would fix the trouble.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> no probs buddy, I understand. I do use command line (bash) a bit, but I am so used to Windows cmd that I often make mistake in linux bash (different command names or switches) and it utterly pisses me off LOL! in deed I would need to finally learn and memorize linux commands by heart to enjoy it instead of aiding myself with GUI always when possible
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> other than that I need google to use linux command lines hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no offense taken.
> mine were same, always 2 middle cores are higher by a few up to 15C higher than others (outer ones) depending on speed of clocks, voltage and load. most likely as mentioned, the IHS has a concave in it and only lapping it (warranty void for good) would fix the trouble.


Yea i've been using linux as a home server / music player for awhile now, i've learned alot just by fixing issues that have arisen.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> So then it looks like I have to either lap my IHS or remove it from the equation. Does anyone know if it's possible to place the Corsiar AIO block directly on the die? Or do the screws not go low enough?
> Also, what type of liquid is in the lines and can they freeze? I'm thinking of building some sort of intake from the window above my PC, similar to a dryer vent, to bring in cold air from outside. I don't want to freeze the line or cause it to break/leak. Any ideas?


be careful with that! you would NEED to calculate the Dew Point for inside computer conditions and compare calculated dew point temperature with outside temp to make it safe! however to keep it short, it won't work if temperature difference is too big, condensation will occur and it could destroy your system overnight (moisture on motherboard circuits and components).

look here in my old thread when I was playing around and using my room AC as computer Cold Air Intake, explains it all after some dude enlightened me








http://www.overclock.net/t/1309732/need-to-shave-off-a-few-more-c-degress-with-water-cooling-upgrades-need-opinions-please


----------



## neopunx

My cores were wonkie too. I just redid my TIM with CLP, an I must have done a better job this time, because the cores are all even now at idle(before 2 were 5-10 c off) and within 6c under load. Did you all try re-applying your TIM on the die/under the IHS? Worked for me.


----------



## Hokies83

With me Core 4 "next to Igpu" is 10c hotter then the other 3 at idle and 5 c hotter at load.

The otheres are with in 2-3c of each other at idle and 1c at load.


----------



## dalastbmills

After 50 minutes of P95:

Hottest temps by core: 73-83-97-83

That damn Core 2...

Failed at 4.7 @ ~1.4 so I dropped down to 46 x 101.1 = 4.65 ish sitting about 1.4-1.408

Edit: Just heard my buddy killed his 3570k trying to delid. It won't boot


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> After 50 minutes of P95:
> Hottest temps by core: 73-83-97-83
> That damn Core 2...
> Failed at 4.7 @ ~1.4 so I dropped down to 46 x 101.1 = 4.65 ish sitting about 1.4-1.408
> Edit: Just heard my buddy killed his 3570k trying to delid. It won't boot


What paste you using? And sorry to hear about your buddies chip man.


----------



## dalastbmills

I have Liquid Ultra on the die and a little bit of it on the IHS and a little bit of MX4 as well.

Edit: I should note that I just noticed that the front fan on my radiator does not start without help. I sprayed it with some air in a can and it started spinning just fine, but it didn't seem to bring the temps down all that much, if any at all.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> After 50 minutes of P95:
> Hottest temps by core: 73-83-97-83
> That damn Core 2...
> Failed at 4.7 @ ~1.4 so I dropped down to 46 x 101.1 = 4.65 ish sitting about 1.4-1.408
> Edit: Just heard my buddy killed his 3570k trying to delid. It won't boot


did you use black glue (silicone RTV) under IHS? are you certain the IHS position is correct? I had such effect when I was positioning the IHS a tad too low (too close towards the black tag on PCB) and using black glue without leaving a gap in that area. took me 4 times to get it right, then those temps were MUCH better, especially on core 2 ....

.. care to open it up again and re-apply the TIM, also a thinner layer works better I noticed (try half the amount you used, that's what I did and it was near perfect).


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> did you use black glue (silicone RTV) under IHS? are you certain the IHS position is correct? I had such effect when I was positioning the IHS a tad too low (too close towards the black tag on PCB) and using black glue without leaving a gap in that area. took me 4 times to get it right, then those temps were MUCH better, especially on core 2 ....
> .. care to open it up again and re-apply the TIM, also a thinner layer works better I noticed (try half the amount you used, that's what I did and it was near perfect).


I'm pretty sure I have a little too much Liquid Ultra on the bottom section of the die. I'll reopen it later this week, Also, I want to lap the IHS. I have done very little research. What grit sandpaper do I need? What other tools do I need?


----------



## Hokies83

Lookie what i found @[email protected]

http://allthingsd.com/20121113/amd-exploring-options-including-breakup-sale/
http://www.cnbc.com/id/49813803
That's basically AMD admitting they don't have sufficient funds on their own to carry through with their future growth strategy. The worst thing that could happen now is consumers get nervous that AMD will go bankrupt, stop buying their products, resulting in a self-fulfilling prophecy. The company is running into a cash crunch. With a market value of about $1.4 billion, it also has long-term debt and capital lease obligations of about $2 billion.

Also, once JPMorgan steps in, and AMD's operations could be disrupted as management is unlikely to spend money on current projects or be as focused on working on projects if they feel the company is going to be split apart, or its patent portfolios are purchased and the firm is wound down like Nortel.

I guess all those people who called AMD's buyout of ATI the worst possible move for both companies will be validated, but in the process we will end up with Intel/NV and essentially no competition in the PC enthusiast market segment unless those firms are split up. Even if someone buys AMD, will Intel be willing to renegotiate the x86 license?


----------



## Arm3nian

I think cl is a scam, they probably send us insulators. I got better temps with mx-4, not great but decent. I cant even use my computer thats how bad my cpu and gpu temps are. How badly did I possibly mount it to get that. Pressure equals contact and even if i didnt put any tim i would have gotten better temps.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> After 50 minutes of P95:
> Hottest temps by core: 73-83-97-83
> That damn Core 2...
> Failed at 4.7 @ ~1.4 so I dropped down to 46 x 101.1 = 4.65 ish sitting about 1.4-1.408


youre temps are to high for that oc anyways, concave ihs or not,
disabled igpu or not..
didnt say it was THE reason, thats why i asked hokies about his remark elsewhere,
its not confirmed by others see..
also, theres no "proof" that lapping ihs is gonna make the cores more even temp wise..

i did not lap mine, i did not disable igpu, the difference between my cores was 10-15C
before delid, when i got it all perfect, the difference was about 6C,
so prolly you will have some difference whatever you do..
didnt see anyone yet, that had all cores the same temps..

1 core is sometimes called, the "sleepy core",
another core takes on the lower loads(1-3% load), or little work,
before the others wake up to help, that could be another reason
that one core is always a bit hotter then the others









and i always wondered about the bios auto setting on the cores,
arent they like, 37-38-38-39 multiplier?
is that a hard setting from factory?
could that mean, even if you use 1 multi for all cores,
theres always the hardware setting from factory, that keeps this difference?

heres a 24H prime @ 4.8ghz,

69-76-76-71C core temperature

see, even with a higher oc, my temps are lower then yours,
thats why i thought, its something else that makes yours run so hot..


come to think of it, and looking at the layout, could it be because 1 core is next to the IMC controller?
thats one thing that always works, or is busy..

another thing is, ive said this before, is that little black square on the pcb,

no problem before delid, the adhesive is higher then that, after delid tho,
and putting it all back together, its different, then that little black square is like the mount everest..lol
if you let the ihs slide to much on that, it will lift it a bit, making the core close to it, having less contact..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I think cl is a scam, they probably send us insulators. I got better temps with mx-4, not great but decent. I cant even use my computer thats how bad my cpu and gpu temps are. How badly did I possibly mount it to get that. Pressure equals contact and even if i didnt put any tim i would have gotten better temps.


i think we proofed that using clp or clu on the die, works best,
if it doesnt give you at least 10C tempdrop,
theres something else wrong, bad mount etc etc,
clp should easely outperform mx'4 .. if used on the die, on ihs its good enough..

on average liquid pro/ultra gives you a temp drop of about 20C..


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> I have Liquid Ultra on the die and a little bit of it on the IHS and a little bit of MX4 as well.
> Edit: I should note that I just noticed that the front fan on my radiator does not start without help. I sprayed it with some air in a can and it started spinning just fine, but it didn't seem to bring the temps down all that much, if any at all.


you gotta be careful with that because you can spin it faster than it is designed for and damage it.

Also having one core that is 23c hotter than your lowest core seems like something is off...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I think cl is a scam, they probably send us insulators. I got better temps with mx-4, not great but decent. I cant even use my computer thats how bad my cpu and gpu temps are. How badly did I possibly mount it to get that. Pressure equals contact and even if i didnt put any tim i would have gotten better temps.


LOL. if you are getting worse temps with liquid pro you did something wrong.. I mean it is actual metal (gallium I think) so of course it is going to be the best tim material I have used it on a de-lid chip it works just fine....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I think cl is a scam, they probably send us insulators. I got better temps with mx-4, not great but decent. I cant even use my computer thats how bad my cpu and gpu temps are. How badly did I possibly mount it to get that. Pressure equals contact and even if i didnt put any tim i would have gotten better temps.


Cool labs Liquid Pro is the best your are the only one reporting this issue.

I run 1.55v with LP and barely touch 80c..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I think cl is a scam, they probably send us insulators. I got better temps with mx-4, not great but decent. I cant even use my computer thats how bad my cpu and gpu temps are. How badly did I possibly mount it to get that. Pressure equals contact and even if i didnt put any tim i would have gotten better temps.


what is "cl"? pro or ultra? you probably applied it all wrong ... those are both two possibly best "pastes" on the planet, even better than a solder flux ...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> you gotta be careful with that because you can spin it faster than it is designed for and damage it.
> Also having one core that is 23c hotter than your lowest core seems like something is off...
> LOL. if you are getting worse temps with liquid pro you did something wrong.. I mean it is actual metal (gallium I think) so of course it is going to be the best tim material I have used it on a de-lid chip it works just fine....


yea, its Gallium, its amazing.. melts in your hand ..really cool..


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, its Gallium, its amazing.. melts in your hand ..really cool..


Yea i've seen it in action like I said it is pretty amazing stuff.


----------



## Arm3nian

Well I know I applied it wrong, but THAT wrong? Lol.

And how the hell is hokies running 1.55 with an h100 ***. Thats impossible with a custom loop, it would give temps well over 100c.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well I know I applied it wrong, but THAT wrong? Lol.
> And how the hell is hokies running 1.55 with an h100 ***. Thats impossible with a custom loop, it would give temps well over 100c.


I bench at 5.3 and 5.4 Ghz on a H100 lol and with close to 1.8 Vcore at that lol.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I bench at 5.3 and 5.4 Ghz on a H100 lol and with close to 1.8 Vcore at that lol.


1.8 VCORE?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well I know I applied it wrong, but THAT wrong? Lol.
> And how the hell is hokies running 1.55 with an h100 ***. Thats impossible with a custom loop, it would give temps well over 100c.


it isnt really, i can run IBT @ 5.0ghz,

hottest core 84C, with just a simple air cooler ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I bench at 5.3 and 5.4 Ghz on a H100 lol and with close to 1.8 Vcore at that lol.


lol








now tell em about the 1.9V vcore ...hahaha,

yea, i did some benching with 1.85V vcore too..


----------



## Arm3nian

You guys are trolling right...


----------



## VonDutch

k, not i need to know,
whats "trolling" ??

is that following someone, and say the same things or?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You guys are trolling right...


No.. 80c 1.55v is pretty easy with an H100 with a De lidded IB chip........


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> k, not i need to know,
> whats "trolling" ??
> is that following someone, and say the same things or?


Its joking around.

Well since 1.9v core is possible on air I guess ill break the 10ghz mark lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Its joking around.
> Well since 1.9v core is possible on air I guess ill break the 10ghz mark lol


That is just for a cpu-z... Do not go past 1.55v for a 24/7 OC.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Its joking around.
> Well since 1.9v core is possible on air I guess ill break the 10ghz mark lol


i see, thanks, so we have a whole bunch of troll's in here ...haha


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now tell em about the 1.9V vcore ...hahaha,
> yea, i did some benching with 1.85V vcore too..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You guys are trolling right...


No Im not trolling I've even gone to 1.98 for a 5.6 Ghz submit but couldnt get it. chip wasnt cold enough.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

I'm the purple haired one.


----------



## Arm3nian

Haha









Anyways, I read 1.42 is max for 24/7 w/o degrading the chip. My chip is really weird though, I can do 4.7 at 1.32, have not tried lower, but I can't do 4.7 at 1.38 for example. When I actually apply the pro correctly, 20c would put me at 50-60, so I think I will have headroom, really going for a 24/7 5ghz.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> 
> I'm the purple haired one.


im the orange haired one ..lol

click on my link for the validation,
needed 1.750V vcore for the 5.4ghz..
but it was a cold night then, like -2C- -3C

i opened my front door to let the cold in before i did my attempts

Val and i where messing around with our highest oc's,
5.3, 5.4 and 5.5ghz, took me 1.850V vcore to get to 5.5ghz,
no trolling,
but thats only for the cpu-z validations,
only need to boot for it, and click validate..then it can crash or not ..lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyways, I read 1.42 is max for 24/7 w/o degrading the chip. My chip is really weird though, I can do 4.7 at 1.32, have not tried lower, but I can't do 4.7 at 1.38 for example. When I actually apply the pro correctly, 20c would put me at 50-60, so I think I will have headroom, really going for a 24/7 5ghz.


it's actually 1.52v absolute vcore (idle or under load, absolute is absolute) per Intel specs in white paper (google "intel ark 3770K").
once you apply it correctly under IHS and on IHS (under cooling block) you should see around 20-30C drop in temps under load versus stock paste under IHS and whatever you used to use under block (MX-2, MX-4, AS5, PK-3 whatever, they are all nearly same).


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im the orange haired one ..lol
> click on my link for the validation,
> needed 1.750V vcore for the 5.4ghz..
> Val and i where messing around with our highest oc's,
> 5.3, 5.4 and 5.5ghz, took me 1.850V vcore to get to 5.5ghz,
> no trolling,
> but thats only for the cpu-z validations,
> only need to boot for it, and click validate..then it can crash or not ..lol


I hate you all


----------



## feniks

cinebench vcore demand is killing me ...









thought I had just stabilized 4.6GHz under IBT 10 quick rounds no WHEA crap and I though it took a lot of vcore (1.272v under load) ... now stabilized it under Cinebench 11.5 x64 at same clocks again no WHEA warnings and I am at 1.296v vcore under load ...









I think Intel send me some crap chip (batch 3228B) in revenge LOL!







anyways, need to delid it over weekend coz I can't go past 4.6GHz ha ha! already hitting lower 90's with PK-3 under cooling block. a cruel joke... CL Ultra is waiting on the desk ... and blades ... and dremel with buffing pad (helps quickly remove glue residue once soaked in alcohol).

wondering if this chip is even capable of running 5.0GHz LOL! ... slightly doubtful at this point ... need to get some sleep, g'nite crew!








worst thing worst, will get a new one at $229 and sell this crap on ebay after successful deliding ha ha!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> cinebench vcore demand is killing me ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thought I had just stabilized 4.6GHz under IBT 10 quick rounds no WHEA crap and I though it took a lot of vcore (1.272v under load) ... now stabilized it under Cinebench 11.5 x64 at same clocks again no WHEA warnings and I am at 1.296v vcore under load ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think Intel send me some crap chip (batch 3228B) in revenge LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways, need to delid it over weekend coz I can't go past 4.6GHz ha ha! already hitting lower 90's with PK-3 under cooling block. a cruel joke... CL Ultra is waiting on the desk ... and blades ... and dremel with buffing pad (helps quickly remove glue residue once soaked in alcohol).
> wondering if this chip is even capable of running 5.0GHz LOL! ... slightly doubtful at this point ... need to get some sleep, g'nite crew!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> worst thing worst, will get a new one at $229 and sell this crap on ebay after successful deliding ha ha!


If Intel was not releasing Haswell Next year id be buying 2 r 3 3770ks and keeping hte best clocker and selling the rest XD.


----------



## Arm3nian

Disable one of the cores for 666 and troll with that lol. And dude, I have one of those guys with the clothes on, red hair I think or orange, will post tomorrow


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> I hate you all


we love you too man















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyways, I read 1.42 is max for 24/7 w/o degrading the chip.


i always liked this graph from sins guide as a reference,

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Disable one of the cores for 666 and troll with that lol. And dude, I have one of those guys with the clothes on, red hair I think or orange, will post tomorrow


for the 5.5ghz i had to disable 2 cores,
i couldnt go any higher with vcore then 1.850V
anything higher then that, and bios jumped back to Auto..
someone said i needed to look for a jumper on my mobo somewhere..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> 
> I'm the purple haired one.


Im the ring leader with the white hair lol.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Im the ring leader with the white hair lol.


haha you are getting old my friend, old indeed.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> haha you are getting old my friend, old indeed.


nah, his hair turned white, *after* we did all those crazy oc's ...lol
i was actually sweating with the 0C over here, got worse when
i discovered i didnt have cpu-z installed yet with the 5.5ghz run haha..

enough (of my) trolling for today ..laters peeps


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> haha you are getting old my friend, old indeed.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nah, his hair turned white, *after* we did all those crazy oc's ...lol


Yup you got it


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> cinebench vcore demand is killing me ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thought I had just stabilized 4.6GHz under IBT 10 quick rounds no WHEA crap and I though it took a lot of vcore (1.272v under load) ... now stabilized it under Cinebench 11.5 x64 at same clocks again no WHEA warnings and I am at 1.296v vcore under load ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think Intel send me some crap chip (batch 3228B) in revenge LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways, need to delid it over weekend coz I can't go past 4.6GHz ha ha! already hitting lower 90's with PK-3 under cooling block. a cruel joke... CL Ultra is waiting on the desk ... and blades ... and dremel with buffing pad (helps quickly remove glue residue once soaked in alcohol).
> wondering if this chip is even capable of running 5.0GHz LOL! ... slightly doubtful at this point ... need to get some sleep, g'nite crew!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> worst thing worst, will get a new one at $229 and sell this crap on ebay after successful deliding ha ha!


Probably could run 5Ghz with good water, delidded chip I'm running now needs 1.32V vcore for 4.6Ghz , it could do 5Ghz under 1.5V but just too hot for the h50 or TRUE 120.

Been folding at 4.6 almost 2 days now on the TRUE, hottest core has gotten to 80°.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nah, his hair turned white, *after* we did all those crazy oc's ...lol
> i was actually sweating with the 0C over here, got worse when
> i discovered i didnt have cpu-z installed yet with the 5.5ghz run haha..


yea you guys are something







somehow I found my zen with not de-lidding by just being here basking in you guys glory. I will just take the $200 i'll save from not screwing another chip and buy something nice


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we love you too man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i always liked this graph from sins guide as a reference,
> 
> for the 5.5ghz i had to disable 2 cores,
> i couldnt go any higher with vcore then 1.850V
> anything higher then that, and bios jumped back to Auto..
> someone said i needed to look for a jumper on my mobo somewhere..


Interesting guide, although I would put the ln2 max at infinity since the chip will most likely die in a week anyway lol, ive seen 2.2+. My bios goes to 1.9 I think I cant remember off the top of my head. Do you have to raise any voltage to get ram speeds higher than 1600, my ram crashes at anything higher and is rated at 2133 1.5v, running it at 1600 now with loose timings.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Interesting guide, although I would put the ln2 max at infinity since the chip will most likely die in a week anyway lol, ive seen 2.2+. My bios goes to 1.9 I think I cant remember off the top of my head. Do you have to raise any voltage to get ram speeds higher than 1600, my ram crashes at anything higher and is rated at 2133 1.5v, running it at 1600 now with loose timings.


if i use xmp profile, with tight timings, i need to up ram voltage from 1.5 to 1.6V,
and my bclk is 101, cant really oc it to higher mhz, i leave it at 1600, timings 9-8-8-21,
but mine's rated 1600 so..
gonna buy 2400 or higher ram if i have the money, others know alot about ram, voltage, timings etc..
you should be able to run it at 2133 tho..youre using the xmp profile ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Interesting guide, although I would put the ln2 max at infinity since the chip will most likely die in a week anyway lol, ive seen 2.2+. My bios goes to 1.9 I think I cant remember off the top of my head. Do you have to raise any voltage to get ram speeds higher than 1600, my ram crashes at anything higher and is rated at 2133 1.5v, running it at 1600 now with loose timings.


A chip can last a long time benching at high volts. My 990x has seen many hours (easily 100+) at 1.8V + & is still kicking, but I don't go too hard on conventional cooling. My favorite chips never see as high as 60°.

For memory at 2133 it should just be vdimm, have you tried bumping up the voltage?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> yea you guys are something
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> somehow I found my zen with not de-lidding by just being here basking in you guys glory. I will just take the $200 i'll save from not screwing another chip and buy something nice


No problem glad we can make you smile. And you don't have to delid we are here purely for your sake and info and such.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Interesting guide, although I would put the ln2 max at infinity since the chip will most likely die in a week anyway lol, ive seen 2.2+. My bios goes to 1.9 I think I cant remember off the top of my head. Do you have to raise any voltage to get ram speeds higher than 1600, my ram crashes at anything higher and is rated at 2133 1.5v, running it at 1600 now with loose timings.


You should chat with ivan from the crew. He's a ram nutcase








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if i use xmp profile, with tight timings, i need to up ram voltage from 1.5 to 1.6V,
> and my bclk is 101, cant really oc it to higher mhz, i leave it at 1600, timings 9-8-8-21,
> but mine's rated 1600 so..
> gonna buy 2400 or higher ram if i have the money, others know alot about ram, voltage, timings etc..
> you should be able to run it at 2133 tho..youre using the xmp profile ?


Same to you sir!


----------



## SonDa5

*Updating my my delidding temps for the chart.
*

*Before delidding*

Ambient Temp 26C

TIM IC Diamond 24 DT Sniper water block

Temps under LinX load *83C 93C 89C 84C*










http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2531026

*
After delidding*

Ambient Temp 20C

TIM CL Liquid Pro with Fujipoly Xtreme thermal pad around die direct contact mount with DT Sniper water block

Temps Intel Burn Text same memory tested as with Linx *49C 54C 52C 49C*



http://valid.canardpc.com/2582088

*Average core of before delidding is 87.25C
*

*Average core of after delidding is 51C
*

Ambient temps diffrence of 6C added to after equals 56C aproximation of difference. 87.25-56C = average drop on each core of *31.25C average!!*


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Also, for Seagate users, there is also a free edition (out dated however) of Acronis Seagate edition (called Disc Wizard), which requires a Seagate drive in system instead:
> http://www.seagate.com/support/downloads/discwizard/
> IMHO, if you can use the WD edition then stick to it, it's newer and more intelligent (often resizing partition being restored on the fly so it fits right even if originally it was bigger/smaller, DiscWizard can't do that).
> Yeah, X79 is the cream ... only problem with it that it's been made from a fouled sour cream LOL! ... I was considering this platform as an upgrade from 790 Ultra, but passed on it ... too many BIOS issues and some unlucky hardware solutions ... still 40 native lanes for GPUs is something admirable that 1155 can't achieve natively (possible only via a lagging switching chips like PLX). *So far however there is no Ivy Bridge-E chip with native PCIe 3.0 support and the one currently available for 2011 socket* (Sandy Bridge-E) *is supporting only some "beta PCI-e 3.0" which doesn't work correctly with latest nvidia drivers* (for older drivers it's working only with a special patch) ... *besides 2011 chips are darn expensive* ... great if anyone really needs 6 cores though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anywho, I like Z77 platform so far and staying with it, lots of fun!


This is why I pasted up X79, no official support for PCIe 3.0. Nvidia isn't obligated to support PCIe 3.0 in anyway in their drivers, I wasn't willing to hold out hope that they would.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lap the ihs because if its concave it will push your tim right off the cores.


Does this mean the underside of the IHS is uneven like the top?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Igpu makes it hotter and causes up to a 00.5v Vcore needed to power it.


Really .5 volts? If so that's quite a bit, can't wait to put my custom water cooling loop together!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> *Updating my my delidding temps for the chart.
> *
> *Before delidding*
> Ambient Temp 26C
> TIM IC Diamond 24 DT Sniper water block
> Temps under LinX load *83C 93C 89C 84C*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2531026
> *
> After delidding*
> Ambient Temp 20C
> TIM CL Liquid Pro with Fujipoly Xtreme thermal pad around die direct contact mount with DT Sniper water block
> Temps Intel Burn Text same memory tested as with Linx *49C 54C 52C 49C*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2582088
> *Average core of before delidding is 87.25C
> *
> *Average core of after delidding is 51C
> *
> Ambient temps diffrence of 6C added to after equals 56C aproximation of difference. 87.25-56C = average drop on each core of *31.25C average!!*


woot, thats great Sonda 31.25C!..







gratz


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You should chat with ivan from the crew. He's a ram nutcase
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same to you sir!


yea, already talked to ivan about it, and hokies,
but whatever i did, was no go, thats why i decided to buy 2400+ ram soonish...
already glad (finally) i got the xmp profile to work,
but i hear ivy is more sensitive to higher mhz with ram, then timings?


----------



## VonDutch

Captain Val,
can we get these post somewhere on page 1,
for others to read about what blades to use etc?
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18590943
maybe this one too,
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18591057

not saying this because i made the posts, but they/info get lost in this thread getting so big,
you can adjust/delete all the blablabla from me ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

my inet failed, lol..
forgot i got more speed today, and had to change my modem,
worked at once, now i have Upload to 3 Mb/s, Download to 30 Mb/s
for 20 euro(25 U.S. dollars) a month ..


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my inet failed, lol..
> forgot i got more speed today, and had to change my modem,
> worked at once, now i have Upload to 3 Mb/s, Download to 30 Mb/s
> for 20 euro(25 U.S. dollars) a month ..


That's F********* cheap. Wish i could get something like that where i live.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, already talked to ivan about it, and hokies,
> but whatever i did, was no go, thats why i decided to buy 2400+ ram soonish...
> already glad (finally) i got the xmp profile to work,
> but i hear ivy is more sensitive to higher mhz with ram, then timings?


There are some good 2400c9 trident x kits that come with the ram cooler for extra bling, 99usd at Newegg.
Samsung ic, so they won't run much ttighter timings, but perhaps some higher mhz like 2666mhz or more.
That's one of the best bang/buck kits out there atm.

As for the mhz thing, the answer is no. Ivy can go faster than older chips, that's all, and they outperform similarly clocked amd or sb chips with the same timings.
Maxxmem single threaded bencch or winsatmem command ran in cmd are good for comparing ram timings/clocks.
The best of both worlds is cl8I 2400mhz, but 2600 or higher with looser timings offers better latency in ns (losing in every bench though)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> There are some good 2400c9 trident x kits that come with the ram cooler for extra bling, 99usd at Newegg.
> Samsung ic, so they won't run much ttighter timings, but perhaps some higher mhz like 2666mhz or more.
> That's one of the best bang/buck kits out there atm.
> As for the mhz thing, the answer is no. Ivy can go faster than older chips, that's all, and they outperform similarly clocked amd or sb chips with the same timings.
> Maxxmem single threaded bencch or winsatmem command ran in cmd are good for comparing ram timings/clocks.
> The best of both worlds is cl8I 2400mhz, but 2600 or higher with looser timings offers better latency in ns (losing in every bench though)


thanks for the answer ivan, always appriciated, ram nerd ..lol jk jk

thing is, we dont have newegg, or the other one with the nice deals etc,
did some searching tho over here, found these, Kingston HyperX KHX24C11T2K2/8X
for only 45 euro, 8gb..

not sure if this works(the link), but heres the Dutch site im always using to find deals, or the cheapest dealer for my hardware,
http://tweakers.net/categorie/545/geheugen-intern/producten/#filter:q1bKL0pJLXLLTM1JUbJSKijKzCpW0oEIBucXlQDFEouTgSJAmeRU38w8JSsDHaXigtRkt8ycktSiYiWraiVTCxBZlpijZBWtZGJgYaEUW1tbCwA

the G.Skill F3-2400C10D-8GTX i can buy for 67 euro, 8gb

those 2 are the cheapest i can find, the ones above are like 70-80 euro and up..

yea,. saw someone saying that on another forum,
that ivy was more sensitive to mhz, and amd was more sensitive to timings..
thought it made sense, so im glad you corrected me on that









you think ill notice (big enough) improvement, 1600 or 2400+mhz?

i wanted to buy ram that is on the list gigabyte has, that supported ram list,
not sure how important that is..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Captain Val,
> can we get these post somewhere on page 1,
> for others to read about what blades to use etc?
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18590943
> maybe this one too,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18591057
> not saying this because i made the posts, but they/info get lost in this thread getting so big,
> you can adjust/delete all the blablabla from me ...lol


Once im on my computer


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Once im on my computer


cool..thanks








think it might help to answer first questions peeps have,
most of us agreed about the blades etc after i posted it,
and its just a recap of things to use etc we talked about in earlier posts..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks for the answer ivan, always appriciated, ram nerd ..lol jk jk
> thing is, we dont have newegg, or the other one with the nice deals etc,
> did some searching tho over here, found these, Kingston HyperX KHX24C11T2K2/8X
> for only 45 euro, 8gb..
> not sure if this works(the link), but heres the Dutch site im always using to find deals, or the cheapest dealer for my hardware,
> http://tweakers.net/categorie/545/geheugen-intern/producten/#filter:q1bKL0pJLXLLTM1JUbJSKijKzCpW0oEIBucXlQDFEouTgSJAmeRU38w8JSsDHaXigtRkt8ycktSiYiWraiVTCxBZlpijZBWtZGJgYaEUW1tbCwA
> the G.Skill F3-2400C10D-8GTX i can buy for 67 euro, 8gb
> those 2 are the cheapest i can find, the ones above are like 70-80 euro and up..
> yea,. saw someone saying that on another forum,
> that ivy was more sensitive to mhz, and amd was more sensitive to timings..
> thought it made sense, so im glad you corrected me on that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you think ill notice (big enough) improvement, 1600 or 2400+mhz?
> i wanted to buy ram that is on the list gigabyte has, that supported ram list,
> not sure how important that is..


Hmmm, I'd go for a Hynix cfr kit then, cause Samsung ic's have some problems hitting 2400mhz on gb z77 boards.
Avoid Patriot and Kingston and CRUCIAL; try to get a Team xtreem, geil or gskill kit. Most 2x4gb 2400mhz kits are samsung or hynix these days. There are some cheap ggeneric samsungs with hch9 in the part name, those should work good. (1600mhz 2x4gb kits, green tall pcb)

Edit: forgot adata and avexir! Corsair should be avoided unless you can get the gtx3 rev2.1's which cost a LOT...dominator gt's)


----------



## ChaosAD

Other than benching you will not notice any difference at all. But althought i know that i had to run 2400 min









On another note i run some Cinebench R11.5 x64 tests to check performance difference per 100Mhz. So i got:

4.8Ghz @ 1.36v - 9.57pts
4.9Ghz @ 1.41v - 9.81pts
5.0Ghz @ 1.49v - 10.02pts
5.1Ghz tried up to 1.55v but got an error

Anyone tried at 5.1Ghz+ and at what vcore?


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Other than benching you will not notice any difference at all. But althought i know that i had to run 2400 min
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On another note i run some Cinebench R11.5 x64 tests to check performance difference per 100Mhz. So i got:
> 4.8Ghz @ 1.36v - 9.57pts
> 4.9Ghz @ 1.41v - 9.81pts
> 5.0Ghz @ 1.49v - 10.02pts
> 5.1Ghz tried up to 1.55v but got an error
> Anyone tried at 5.1Ghz+ and at what vcore?


I got up to 5.1 but It did take like 1.56v.

My chip seems to top out around 5150Mhz. I have not done much fine tuning, but it will not remain stable @5.2 even at 1.65v which is the highest I have gone.

I did score 10.15 on that run, but I think running my memory @ 2400Mhz helped a tad


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Other than benching you will not notice any difference at all. But althought i know that i had to run 2400 min
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On another note i run some Cinebench R11.5 x64 tests to check performance difference per 100Mhz. So i got:
> 4.8Ghz @ 1.36v - 9.57pts
> 4.9Ghz @ 1.41v - 9.81pts
> 5.0Ghz @ 1.49v - 10.02pts
> 5.1Ghz tried up to 1.55v but got an error
> Anyone tried at 5.1Ghz+ and at what vcore?


5.0ghz @ 1.480V vcore


5.1ghz @ 1.60V vcore ..lol

o, just noticed theres no vcore proggie in this,
but i called the pic "cinebench 5.1ghz 1.6V" so ...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hmmm, I'd go for a Hynix cfr kit then, cause Samsung ic's have some problems hitting 2400mhz on gb z77 boards.
> Avoid Patriot and Kingston and CRUCIAL; try to get a Team xtreem, geil or gskill kit. Most 2x4gb 2400mhz kits are samsung or hynix these days. There are some cheap ggeneric samsungs with hch9 in the part name, those should work good. (1600mhz 2x4gb kits, green tall pcb)
> Edit: forgot adata and avexir! Corsair should be avoided unless you can get the gtx3 rev2.1's which cost a LOT...dominator gt's)


Hynix cfr kit?

you know im a ram noob.. gskill is what hokies is always talking about too, i think


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 5.0ghz @ 1.480V vcore
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.1ghz @ 1.60V vcore ..lol
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, just noticed theres no vcore proggie in this,
> but i called the pic "cinebench 5.1ghz 1.6V" so ...


wow right on the heels of that Xeon...


----------



## chronicfx

Von Dutch. What thermal interface material are you using on your die, and above your ihs? I am running a D14 with CL liquid ultra under the ihs and Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste above the ihs and I am getting mid 90's at 1.42v and 4.9GHz with small ffts. I am going to change to CL liquid pro under the ihs and Indigo extreme above the ihs soon when I swap my mainboard to one with cooler mosfets. I am just thinking that a D14 should outperform a mugen. Are you lapped? Something maybe that is making this difference that I don't know about? Can two chips operating at the same v core output two totally different amounts of heat? I can't seem to put my finger on why your chip is running at such a low temp compared to mine.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> wow right on the heels of that Xeon...


yea, thought i would beat that one with 5.1ghz, that was my plan ...LOL
cant do 5.2ghz tho for cinebench, vcore would be crazy ..lol


----------



## Arm3nian

My ram is rated at 2133mhz @1.5v. Ive tried xmp, but it does not boot half the time, sometimes it will after 5 resets, it seems stable once it boots however. I also tried setting the values manually, no luck, can't even get 1866 out of it. Ive tried 1.65v no luck. My phenom before this had a memory problem where I could not run dual channel, and now this with my ivy. Ive tried gskill trident x also rated at 2400mhz 1.65v, no luck there either, I even tried 1.85v on that ram and same problem. i rma'd and newegg sent all 4 dimms back 100% broken, did not even boot, and they ignored my emails... i am quite unlucky with ram


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Von Dutch. What thermal interface material are you using on your die, and above your ihs? I am running a D14 with CL liquid ultra under the ihs and Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste above the ihs and I am getting mid 90's at 1.42v and 4.9GHz with small ffts. I am going to change to CL liquid pro under the ihs and Indigo extreme above the ihs soon when I swap my mainboard to one with cooler mosfets. I am just thinking that a D14 should outperform a mugen. Are you lapped? Something maybe that is making this difference that I don't know about? Can two chips operating at the same v core output two totally different amounts of heat? I can't seem to put my finger on why your chip is running at such a low temp compared to mine.


im Liquid Pro all the way, on die, underside ihs, on ihs, base plate cooler,
but all very thin layers..very ..lol
i didnt lap my IHS, its prolly concave like most of them









did my sons, and my vid cards with it too, about 10C temp drop playing bf3
still have some left, just to say how little liquid pro you need..

the Noctua NT-H1 is a good tim,
theres not much difference in using tim's on the IHS,
on ihs and base plate cooler any top/good tim will do..

yea, same vcore, but different temps,
but we have a totally different setup,
with my mugen, i outperform watercoolers,
not sure why, but it makes me smile tho









this is after 1 hour prime, 4.9ghz, 1.475V vcore, 79C hottest core


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If Intel was not releasing Haswell Next year id be buying 2 r 3 3770ks and keeping hte best clocker and selling the rest XD.


ehhh, I think I might pass on Haswell ... don't want to replace the MB again or go through the early BIOS BS problems again ... might stay with IB 1155 and drive it to the ground hehe








how does intel call the next generation of 14nm chips? that's what I might wait for with major system upgrade next time.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ehhh, I think I might pass on Haswell ... don't want to replace the MB again or go through the early BIOS BS problems again ... might stay with IB 1155 and drive it to the ground hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how does intel call the next generation of 14nm chips? that's what I might wait for with major system upgrade next time.


10-20% performance clock for clock is plenty upgrade for me


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Von Dutch. What thermal interface material are you using on your die, and above your ihs? I am running a D14 with CL liquid ultra under the ihs and Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste above the ihs and I am getting mid 90's at 1.42v and 4.9GHz with small ffts. I am going to change to CL liquid pro under the ihs and Indigo extreme above the ihs soon when I swap my mainboard to one with cooler mosfets. I am just thinking that a D14 should outperform a mugen. Are you lapped? Something maybe that is making this difference that I don't know about? Can two chips operating at the same v core output two totally different amounts of heat? I can't seem to put my finger on why your chip is running at such a low temp compared to mine.


Dude use the ultra you have between the die and IHS and the IHS and heatsink. That is what I am using, and it works fantastic. I used a tiny drop and the little brush to apply to both the die AND the underside of the IHS, and the same thing on the other side. The key is just a thin, thin coating!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, thought i would beat that one with 5.1ghz, that was my plan ...LOL
> cant do 5.2ghz tho for cinebench, vcore would be crazy ..lol


So it would probably take 5.2 then. lol, just out of reach without a bit too much voltage.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Probably could run 5Ghz with good water, delidded chip I'm running now needs 1.32V vcore for 4.6Ghz , it could do 5Ghz under 1.5V but just too hot for the h50 or TRUE 120.
> Been folding at 4.6 almost 2 days now on the TRUE, hottest core has gotten to 80°.


will see about that after deliding. former one gave me good results (31C temps drop) and could push it up to 5GHz daily stable .. however that chip was broken (former faulty board screwed it up) so it ended up in RMA. this one now is different, hoping it requires less vcore jump between clocks as former one did (was awful past 4.9GHz).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Interesting guide, although I would put the ln2 max at infinity since the chip will most likely die in a week anyway lol, ive seen 2.2+. My bios goes to 1.9 I think I cant remember off the top of my head. Do you have to raise any voltage to get ram speeds higher than 1600, my ram crashes at anything higher and is rated at 2133 1.5v, running it at 1600 now with loose timings.


do you have 2x 8GB sticks or 4x4GB ones? if the later then that's your problem. try using 2 sticks only and see if they run correctly at XMP. other than that, many boards dislike Vengance 1.5V kits, especially the 4-stick ones are more designed for X79 then for Z77 in fact. Z77 likes best the 2-stick kits, 4-stick kits on this platform require some compromise in either timings or voltage or speed (or all of them together).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Other than benching you will not notice any difference at all. But althought i know that i had to run 2400 min
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On another note i run some Cinebench R11.5 x64 tests to check performance difference per 100Mhz. So i got:
> 4.8Ghz @ 1.36v - 9.57pts
> 4.9Ghz @ 1.41v - 9.81pts
> 5.0Ghz @ 1.49v - 10.02pts
> 5.1Ghz tried up to 1.55v but got an error
> Anyone tried at 5.1Ghz+ and at what vcore?


I had 10.10 @ 5.0GHz with 2200MHz ram running 10-11-10-30 2T 4x4GB








5.1GHz called for way too much vcore on my former chip (between 1.65-1.70V).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> My ram is rated at 2133mhz @1.5v. Ive tried xmp, but it does not boot half the time, sometimes it will after 5 resets, it seems stable once it boots however. I also tried setting the values manually, no luck, can't even get 1866 out of it. Ive tried 1.65v no luck. My phenom before this had a memory problem where I could not run dual channel, and now this with my ivy. Ive tried gskill trident x also rated at 2400mhz 1.65v, no luck there either, I even tried 1.85v on that ram and same problem. i rma'd and newegg sent all 4 dimms back 100% broken, did not even boot, and they ignored my emails... i am quite unlucky with ram


have you tried running MemTest86+ on 1 stick at a time at XMP settings to see if it passes? could be a bad stick (or more) in that kit of yours.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 10-20% performance clock for clock is plenty upgrade for me


now after you said it ... I will think about







, but I think I'd need to hit a lotto before I upgrade the MB+CPU+RAM so early again ... could wait a few months after its release for some better price drops and mature MB BIOS to avoid extra expenses and bumpy ride in early adopters time frame ... it's tempting though


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ehhh, I think I might pass on Haswell ... don't want to replace the MB again or go through the early BIOS BS problems again ... might stay with IB 1155 and drive it to the ground hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how does intel call the next generation of 14nm chips? that's what I might wait for with major system upgrade next time.


same here, didnt "Intel" say the same about Sandy and Ivy, 10-20% improvement..
haswell will have a "great" improvement on the igpu, compared to ivy, but i dont use that so ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> So it would probably take 5.2 then. lol, just out of reach without a bit too much voltage.


yea, but you know me, if its cold enough outside, -15 to -20C, i might just give it another try,
whatever vcore i need, i want to beat that Xeon's 10.33 points cinebench ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> same here, didnt "Intel" say the same about Sandy and Ivy, 10-20% improvement..
> haswell will have a "great" improvement on the igpu, compared to ivy..


Haswell is the Matured 22nm Chip..10-20% is very likely and 5ghz Overclocks on Air are also...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, but you know me, if its cold enough outside, -15 to -20C, i might just give it another try,
> whatever vcore i need, i want to beat that Xeon's 10.33 points cinebench ..lol


lol, I hear you. and I'll be watching for you to beat it!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Haswell is the Matured 22nm Chip..10-20% is very likely and 5ghz Overclocks on Air are also...


we'll see








i can only say something about it, if they are on the market for a while..
up till now, whats being said all around, yea, the matured 22nm..
but theres no really big improvements, they will make us (ivy owners) go ..wow!!
except the igpu, that way they will serve the big market more,
and they get closer to the amd on board igpu's..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we'll see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i can only say something about it, if they are on the market for a while..
> up till now, whats being said all around, yea, the matured 22nm..
> but theres no really big improvements, they will make us (ivy owners) go ..wow!!
> except the igpu, that way they will serve the big market more,
> and they get closer to the amd on board igpu's..


10 - 20% clock for clock + Higher overclocking Is Huge improvement IMO...

Not to mention a whole new socket with all new tech..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Dude use the ultra you have between the die and IHS and the IHS and heatsink. That is what I am using, and it works fantastic. I used a tiny drop and the little brush to apply to both the die AND the underside of the IHS, and the same thing on the other side. The key is just a thin, thin coating!


I think that may be my problem. Not doing both surfaces. I did use a thin layer of the CL liquid Ultra but only on the die, not the underside of the IHS. Around thanksgiving I am going to try to get a slightly better motherboard open box from microcenter. They have a the v-pro's open box for $160 and the UD5H for $140 and it says "complete package" with 15 day return. I may give one of those a try and at that point I will re-apply the TIM to the die too.


----------



## Arm3nian

Is it recommended to use liquid pro for gpu blocks to. I don't want my little 690 die and chips to get rip offed if I take it off lol. I kind of want of want my die to be "Soldered" with the pro onto the ihs, but not anything else, should I just get another liquid ultra?


----------



## Phobos223

I can confirm that the Liquid Ultra cleans up easy with alcohol


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> I can confirm that the Liquid Ultra cleans up easy with alcohol


alcohol removes liquid ultra ? I thought since it was metal it would not.. Don't you have to be very careful about getting any alcohol on the chips pcb ?


----------



## Phobos223

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> alcohol removes liquid ultra ? I thought since it was metal it would not.. Don't you have to be very careful about getting any alcohol on the chips pcb ?


Yup, removes it just fine. I actually cleaned the little application brushes with alcohol with ease. It is safe for PCB, just be sure you use isopropyl alcohol, > 90% and it will work just fine. Just a small dab on a paper towel and you are good to go. The alcohol will evaporate almost instantly leaving no trace behind







I have been building computers for almost 15 years, and have used this method 100s of time with no issues so don't worry


----------



## luciddreamer124

Here is my validation for 5ghz: http://valid.canardpc.com/2582709


----------



## chris-br

Would be nice to have some directions on liquid pro application on die and ihs(but from ppl in this club doing it)... A video would be even better.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Would be nice to have some directions on liquid pro application on die and ihs(but from ppl in this club doing it)... A video would be even better.


Put on Die same as this fellow puts it on IHS...


----------



## Socks keep you warm

5.2Ghz http://valid.canardpc.com/2579347


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> 5.2Ghz http://valid.canardpc.com/2579347


Woah... i need 1.6v to be stable at 5.2ghz...


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Woah... i need 1.6v to be stable at 5.2ghz...


I love this chip, im at 5Ghz 1.375V, but my everyday overclock is 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I love this chip, im at 5Ghz 1.375V, but my everyday overclock is 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V


Meh if that is far as ur gonna push it.. trade me so i can bench it...

Id run that chip 5.3ghz 24/7... Heck ill throw in 30$


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh if that is far as ur gonna push it.. trade me so i can bench it...
> Id run that chip 5.3ghz 24/7...


I will be trying to bench for a few days to come, gonna try and hit 5.8Ghz on water.
If i can't i'll buy a pot.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh if that is far as ur gonna push it.. trade me so i can bench it...
> Id run that chip 5.3ghz 24/7... Heck ill throw in 30$


lol

But yeah, totally with you on that one.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> But yeah, totally with you on that one.


Bear in mind i just got this chip last week.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I love this chip, im at 5Ghz 1.375V, but my everyday overclock is 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V


That's pretty awesome. Wish mine was that good.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Bear in mind i just got this chip last week.


No prob! Just feeling jelly...it's a truly golden chip man.








Your board should be able to push it like it deserves







(only thing a bit poor is your ram :/)


----------



## Arm3nian

Sorry to ask this here but I didn't get responses anywhere else and too lazy to start a thread.

Would this pump top: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16419/ex-pmp-198/EK_D5_X-Top_Acetal_Pump_Top_CSQ_-_Laing_D5_and_Swiftech_MCP-650655_EK-D5_X-TOP_CSQ_-_Acetal.html?id=N26TbbWT&mv_pc=729

Work with this tube res: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/11180/ex-res-227/EK-MultiOption_RES_X2_-_250_Basic_-_Liquid_Cooling_Reservoir_4_Total_Ports.html?id=N26TbbWT&mv_pc=854

I'm sure it will fit on it but how would I install g 1/4 male to male fittings extenders, i'm confused on the in n out (tasty)


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I love this chip, im at 5Ghz 1.375V, but my everyday overclock is 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V


My 3570k runs similar but doesn't have as much over head for over clocking much higher than 5.2GHZ.

I run my 3570k 4.5GHZ 24/7 wtih 1.15v.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Sorry to ask this here but I didn't get responses anywhere else and too lazy to start a thread.
> Would this pump top: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16419/ex-pmp-198/EK_D5_X-Top_Acetal_Pump_Top_CSQ_-_Laing_D5_and_Swiftech_MCP-650655_EK-D5_X-TOP_CSQ_-_Acetal.html?id=N26TbbWT&mv_pc=729
> Work with this tube res: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/11180/ex-res-227/EK-MultiOption_RES_X2_-_250_Basic_-_Liquid_Cooling_Reservoir_4_Total_Ports.html?id=N26TbbWT&mv_pc=854
> I'm sure it will fit on it but how would I install g 1/4 male to male fittings extenders, i'm confused on the in n out (tasty)


I think you could get it to fit with the proper connections but IMO you are better off spacing it apart and using tubing to connect to keep vibration noise down and wear and tear from vibration on it.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> alcohol removes liquid ultra ? I thought since it was metal it would not.. Don't you have to be very careful about getting any alcohol on the chips pcb ?


alcohol easily removes it when fresh ( < day) ... but after 2 weeks it was not the case







hence why CL included the scotch brite (rubbing pad) for such occasions hehe. alcohol still does remove mos of it but some rubbing is needed.
also on a side note! that scratch/rubbing pad removes the writings from the CPU! so be careful and do NOT use it if you care for CPU warranty








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> 5.2Ghz http://valid.canardpc.com/2579347


wow!! grats man! a golden chip!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I will be trying to bench for a few days to come, gonna try and hit 5.8Ghz on water.
> If i can't i'll buy a pot.


Let me oc it. You can trust me!


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Let me oc it. You can trust me!


hahah! You'd be surprised how many people have asked me to send me *MY* chip.
I would love to but it's fantastic i don't want it fudged.
My other 3770k was a dud it did 4.4Ghz @ 1.235V!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Alright guys. I got my CL Ultra in the mail today and I have no idea what I did wrong. I'm getting worse temps than before. I re-applied it twice and no change. I can't even try it again because the tube I got was damaged somewhere along the line and leaked a fair bit of it so I have to wait to get a replacement. :/

I wonder if there was some kind of bad batch or something. I'm running a H80 and at 4.6 with 1.34v I've seen over 90c. Something is definitely not right.


----------



## SonDa5

If it spreads thin like CL Liquid Pro your surface contact areas have to be perfectly flat to make proper contact. Any bowing and it will not be as forgiving as regular thermal paste because it spreads so thin.


----------



## Arm3nian

How do you know when it is flat if using sandpaper, I already screwed up the cpu text with a wool wire so might well.

Btw, anyone anyone think it would be possible to solder the die to the ihs lol.


----------



## DirektEffekt

That could be it. I applied a thin coat on both surfaces and I don't think it was too bowed. Maybe I shall try applying regular TIM on top of the IHS later and see if it helps.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How do you know when it is flat if using sandpaper, I already screwed up the cpu text with a wool wire so might well.
> 
> Btw, anyone anyone think it would be possible to solder the die to the ihs lol.


Use a razor blade to hold on top of it in front of a light to see if any light can be seen between the blade and the IHS top. If light, then not flat. That might be your problem as several of the peps here have had non-flat IHS's including me. Lapping fixes the problem.

Do the sanding (lapping) on a peice of glass to make sure it is done flat. Use tape to hold the sandpaper down. 400>600>800>1000 grit is what I used. Also used water on the first three, and dry on the last 1000 grit. You can get the sandpaper at a auto parts store.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I will be trying to bench for a few days to come, gonna try and hit 5.8Ghz on water.
> If i can't i'll buy a pot.
> 
> 
> 
> Let me oc it. You can trust me!
Click to expand...

Yeah! Send it to Valgaur! You can trust that he will make sure it is tested to its limit (and maybe beyond)!!!


----------



## SonDa5

I'll add that the block surface may bow a little under pressure when you torque it down to mount so take that into consideration as well.

Before I mounted my DT Sniper water block on bare die of 3570k I did a dry mount with contact paper to see if proper contact was being made.

My contact pressure test paper results.The pink area shows good contact right on die.



Same block with the IHS on shows not very good contact against IHS.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> *Updating my my delidding temps for the chart.
> *
> *Before delidding*
> Ambient Temp 26C
> TIM IC Diamond 24 DT Sniper water block
> Temps under LinX load *83C 93C 89C 84C*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2531026
> *
> After delidding*
> Ambient Temp 20C
> TIM CL Liquid Pro with Fujipoly Xtreme thermal pad around die direct contact mount with DT Sniper water block
> Temps Intel Burn Text same memory tested as with Linx *49C 54C 52C 49C*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2582088
> *Average core of before delidding is 87.25C
> *
> *Average core of after delidding is 51C
> *
> Ambient temps diffrence of 6C added to after equals 56C aproximation of difference. 87.25-56C = average drop on each core of *31.25C average!!*


wow thats amazing if i could drop my chip 30 degrees omg


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Alright guys. I got my CL Ultra in the mail today and I have no idea what I did wrong. I'm getting worse temps than before. I re-applied it twice and no change. I can't even try it again because the tube I got was damaged somewhere along the line and leaked a fair bit of it so I have to wait to get a replacement. :/
> I wonder if there was some kind of bad batch or something. I'm running a H80 and at 4.6 with 1.34v I've seen over 90c. Something is definitely not right.


We need pictures, it's difficult to imagine how you are applying the TIM. If you are not using enough CL Ultra there's no way for us to determine whether you are doing it correctly.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> We need pictures, it's difficult to imagine how you are applying the TIM. If you are not using enough CL Ultra there's no way for us to determine whether you are doing it correctly.


I believe it was a contact issue. I may have applied it too thinly. Unfortunately because of the damaged syringe I got I couldn't try again, but I re-applied the block with standard paste and it appears to be working fine. I have much better temps with the Ultra under the hood. In future I think I will either do it this way or I will go direct-die. Probably when I get my new board in I'll prop up the back plate so there is enough pressure for a direct mount.

I'll post some pics with temps in a second.

EDIT: Here are some temps on an overclock I tried before the CL Ultra, with just regular paste on the die and IHS, which resulted in peaks of 102-104 across the cores when I stupidly let it run.



So that's a good 20c off. And not to mention that, except for the peaks on the hottest p95 runs, it only sits around 70c quite consistently.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How do you know when it is flat if using sandpaper, I already screwed up the cpu text with a wool wire so might well.
> Btw, anyone anyone think it would be possible to solder the die to the ihs lol.


No, it must be done before the CPU is ever turned on, plus it must be fluxless.


----------



## VonDutch

why even bother with soldering it ,
solder has a lower w/mk then the liquid pro most of us use on the die..lol


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> why even bother with soldering it ,
> solder has a lower w/mk then the liquid pro most of us use on the die..lol


It's easier to maintain and it's cheaper if you already have an iron. Solder is like $2 for a reel.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> It's easier to maintain and it's cheaper if you already have an iron. Solder is like $2 for a reel.


ive heard about peeps trying to get a soldered ihs off,
i did a few myself last weekend,
but never heard of someone trying to solder one on again ..lol








i could try tho, still have those pentiums that where soldered..
use a iron you say?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ive heard about peeps trying to get a soldered ihs off,
> i did a few myself last weekend,
> but never heard of someone trying to solder one on again ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i could try tho, still have those pentiums that where soldered..
> use a iron you say?


Soldering iron, not iron, just to clarify....
You could try but i don't believe it would work due to the fact that the CPU may burn out.
But we need guinea pigs anyway!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Soldering iron, not iron, just to clarify....
> You could try but i don't believe it would work due to the fact that the CPU may burn out.
> But we need guinea pigs anyway!


lol...

thought you where talking about this, haha

saw someone taking a ihs off with it..

yea, next time if my kiddos are here, we'll think about soldering it on again ...LOL
kids sometimes can come up with simple solutions/answers


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol...
> thought you where talking about this, haha
> 
> saw someone taking a ihs off with it..
> yea, next time if my kiddos are here, we'll think about soldering it on again ...LOL
> kids sometimes can come up with simple solutions/answers


HAHA!It'll be a great learning experience all you need to do is use a little solder, do not hold the Soldering iron onto the die for more then 3-4 seconds it will reach 700-900F very fast and burn out


----------



## ketapang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I believe it was a contact issue. I may have applied it too thinly. Unfortunately because of the damaged syringe I got I couldn't try again, but I re-applied the block with standard paste and it appears to be working fine. I have much better temps with the Ultra under the hood. In future I think I will either do it this way or I will go direct-die. Probably when I get my new board in I'll prop up the back plate so there is enough pressure for a direct mount.
> I'll post some pics with temps in a second.
> EDIT: Here are some temps on an overclock I tried before the CL Ultra, with just regular paste on the die and IHS, which resulted in peaks of 102-104 across the cores when I stupidly let it run.
> 
> So that's a good 20c off. And not to mention that, except for the peaks on the hottest p95 runs, it only sits around 70c quite consistently.


Wow nice one bro.







What cooler are you using? I think we have the same proc here, need at least 1.45v for 4.8Ghz. I'm really into ex240 for direct die cooling. Should i go for it or 7950? Owh and i wanna ask which gives better performance, Liquid Pro or Ultra? Ultra is available at my place. For Liquid Pro, i need to order from their site. Will take 2 weeks to arrive at my place.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Wow nice one bro.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What cooler are you using? I think we have the same proc here, need at least 1.45v for 4.8Ghz. I'm really into ex240 for direct die cooling. Should i go for it or 7950? Owh and i wanna ask which gives better performance, Liquid Pro or Ultra? Ultra is available at my place. For Liquid Pro, i need to order from their site. Will take 2 weeks to arrive at my place.


I'm only on a H80. It doesn't take that much to cool Ivy since it uses so much less power than Sandy. I would say you're better off with a 7950 though, definitely a more noticeable difference.

As for the different TIMs, I would say go for Ultra, at best you'd only see a few degrees in it. Once I get some more Coollaboratory liquid I'm going to modify the backplate a little and go direct die on this thing!


----------



## ketapang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I'm only on a H80. It doesn't take that much to cool Ivy since it uses so much less power than Sandy. I would say you're better off with a 7950 though, definitely a more noticeable difference.
> As for the different TIMs, I would say go for Ultra, at best you'd only see a few degrees in it. Once I get some more Coollaboratory liquid I'm going to modify the backplate a little and go direct die on this thing!


You gonna do direct die with your h80? If that's what you mean then i will be looking forward for it.








Yeah its been a while since i upgrade my gpu, now still with my 5770. But its still a good card though. Too bad my ambient here is quiet high, around 40c. My proc idle temp is around 39-43..


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> You gonna do direct die with your h80? If that's what you mean then i will be looking forward for it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah its been a while since i upgrade my gpu, now still with my 5770. But its still a good card though. Too bad my ambient here is quiet high, around 40c. My proc idle temp is around 39-43..


Yup, that's the plan! Provided I can work out a way to prop the mounting bracket back a little for some extra pressure! But yeah, those ambients would be a killer! I still say the 7950 would be a better choice. It will kill that 5770 in everything. Especially anything with a lot of textures to handle.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> I'm really into ex240 for direct die cooling. Should i go for it or 7950? Owh and i wanna ask which gives better performance, Liquid Pro or Ultra? Ultra is available at my place. For Liquid Pro, i need to order from their site. Will take 2 weeks to arrive at my place.


go 7950! ..lol
go for ultra, pro is better if you ask me, but we saw some good results with ultra too,
on the die that is..and its easier to clean later on..


----------



## flv1333

Hey hey!

Yeah So I decided to do the same! was at 78°c whilst running Prime95 (after a 30 Minute run) now my max is 66! Love it! Only problem is that my friend saw the results and now he wants me to do his as well







... I was ok to do it on MY chip... but someone elses? mmmmmm...



OCN name: Flv1333
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: MX2
Mhz gained: NA
OC after delid: 4500 Mhz
Temp drops: A nice 12°c!!!
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2583512


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flv1333*
> 
> Hey hey!
> Yeah So I decided to do the same! was at 78°c whilst running Prime95 (after a 30 Minute run) now my max is 66! Love it! Only problem is that my friend saw the results and now he wants me to do his as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... I was ok to do it on MY chip... but someone elses? mmmmmm...
> 
> OCN name: Flv1333
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: MX2
> Mhz gained: NA
> OC after delid: 4500 Mhz
> Temp drops: A nice 12°c!!!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: 4500Mhz


Don't forget the link to your CPU-z Validation


----------



## flv1333

Ok I'll need to do that tonight... for some odd reason the site is blocked here at work... Damn company firewalls.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flv1333*
> 
> Ok I'll need to do that tonight... for some odd reason the site is blocked here at work... Damn company firewalls.


they prolly afraid you gonna OC and/or delid the company computers ...lol

welcome









like you say, 12C is "nice"..
maybe its just me expecting everyone to have 20C+ temp drops,
ultra should do better as far as i know when used on the die,
i had 10C temp drop with using AS5 on the die/ihs etc..
but i only used pro, so cant really say whats the (temp) difference between the 2..


----------



## ketapang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Yup, that's the plan! Provided I can work out a way to prop the mounting bracket back a little for some extra pressure! But yeah, those ambients would be a killer! I still say the 7950 would be a better choice. It will kill that 5770 in everything. Especially anything with a lot of textures to handle.


All the best for your plan bro. I've been searching if any people done that, but most of them are running custom loop. Alrite 7950 it is.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> go 7950! ..lol
> go for ultra, pro is better if you ask me, but we saw some good results with ultra too,
> on the die that is..and its easier to clean later on..


That's what bother me actually about pro, hard to clean. But i think ultra is okay for me, 20c is a huge drop.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> they prolly afraid you gonna OC and/or delid the company computers ...lol
> welcome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like you say, 12C is "nice"..
> maybe its just me expecting everyone to have 20C+ temp drops,
> ultra should do better as far as i know when used on the die,
> but i only used pro, so cant really say whats the (temp) difference between the 2..


Other way around. Pro is the more thermally conductive, Ultra is easier to spread.

But they should only be within 2 or 3c.

I suspect, though, that people with under maybe 15c drops either got very lucky with their stock TIM or they may have slightly messed up their TIM application, perhaps letting the IHS slide over the sticker or something similar.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Other way around. Pro is the more thermally conductive, Ultra is easier to spread.
> But they should only be within 2 or 3c.
> I suspect, though, that people with under maybe 15c drops either got very lucky with their stock TIM or they may have slightly messed up their TIM application, perhaps letting the IHS slide over the sticker or something similar.


yep








biggest temp drops i saw so far , using ultra,
are feniks, 31C, and pcwargamer, 26C, they both used it on die and ihs..
still have to wait for months, to see how hard pro is to remove after, 7-8+ months

have to go, laterz peeps


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> 
> I'm the purple haired one.


Trololololol..


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> biggest temp drops i saw so far , using ultra,
> are feniks, 31C, and pcwargamer, 26C, they both used it on die and ihs..
> still have to wait for months, to see how hard pro is to remove after, 7-8+ months
> have to go, laterz peeps


Well, I found that, while making multiple attempts at removing my ultra, even after a short period, removing it was a complete pain, it took a lot of effort to remove from the IHS and cooler base and even then I couldn't get it all. It did seem to improve the surface though so I'm not sure it's a bad thing.

I would just say not to expect it to come off completely.


----------



## flv1333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Other way around. Pro is the more thermally conductive, Ultra is easier to spread.
> But they should only be within 2 or 3c.
> I suspect, though, that people with under maybe 15c drops either got very lucky with their stock TIM or they may have slightly messed up their TIM application, perhaps letting the IHS slide over the sticker or something similar.


@VonDutch
You know whats funny? I did try to OC my Desktop, but the Dell BIOS has no such function... at least that I know of!









Well, my IHS did slide as I pushed down the retention clip. Might that cause it?

If I was to redo the application... how can I clean the die and IHS?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flv1333*
> 
> @VonDutch
> You know whats funny? I did try to OC my Desktop, but the Dell BIOS has no such function... at least that I know of!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, my IHS did slide as I pushed down the retention clip. Might that cause it?
> If I was to redo the application... how can I clean the die and IHS?


If it slid over the little black sticker it may have. The die will wipe clean easily. The IHS, just wipe as much as you can off with a clean, lint free, towel and any small amounts left on the surface will be of no consequence. Actually, even if it is still shiny but not wet it should be perfect for re-application. You can scrub with some steel wool or something if you really want to get more off, but you don't necessarily have to.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Well, I found that, while making multiple attempts at removing my ultra, even after a short period, removing it was a complete pain, it took a lot of effort to remove from the IHS and cooler base and even then I couldn't get it all. It did seem to improve the surface though so I'm not sure it's a bad thing.
> I would just say not to expect it to come off completely.


yep,
i think its even mentioned on the coollaboratory site,
that it can "upgrade" other tims.. dont think its a big deal if theres some leftovers ..

in my search for delidding without using blades, but to dissolve the adhesive somehow,
i just bought this

HG sticker and sticky label remover allows for the simple removal of stickers, sticker adhesive, *rubber adhesive*,
adhesive tape, tar splashes, greasy patches, oil, heel marks and many other problems, from virtually all surfaces.

i saved all the adhesive from the pentiums, so i can try it on that,
ill put some on the pcb too, to see if it damages that in any way,
i wanted to buy nail polish remover, or aceton, couldnt get aceton(yet),
but it might just work well too..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flv1333*
> 
> @VonDutch
> You know whats funny? I did try to OC my Desktop, but the Dell BIOS has no such function... at least that I know of!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, my IHS did slide as I pushed down the retention clip. Might that cause it?
> If I was to redo the application... how can I clean the die and IHS?


yea, could be one reason, theres a little guide, its on page 1,
how to put back the ihs again, not to let it slide on that black sticker
that little black thingy there, is like the mount everest..lol
i tried to take it off completely, but it was very hard to remove,
so i just let it be..

i posted this elsewhere before, about cleaning,
if you have a 10 bucks to spend, its enough to go a long way..

The set contains three components, which provide an excellent cleaning when using correctly.
Phase 1: Preparation
Phase 2: Cleaner
Phase 3: Metal Cleaner
The Liquid Cleaning Set - Phase 3 was designed especially for metallic surfaces (copper, nickel, aluminum etc.)

http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-cleaning-set/

if i have money, i will buy a set, and see how it works with my liquid pro after months of usage,


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> biggest temp drops i saw so far , using ultra,
> are feniks, 31C, and pcwargamer, 26C, they both used it on die and ihs..
> still have to wait for months, to see how hard pro is to remove after, 7-8+ months
> have to go, laterz peeps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I found that, while making multiple attempts at removing my ultra, even after a short period, removing it was a complete pain, it took a lot of effort to remove from the IHS and cooler base and even then I couldn't get it all. It did seem to improve the surface though so I'm not sure it's a bad thing.
> 
> I would just say not to expect it to come off completely.
Click to expand...

Both CL Ultra and Pro are a pain to apply and to remove compaired to other TIMs, but they are both very good for temps - especially between the die and IHS where they are, so far, the best TIM to use.

I have tried both now, and Ultra is easier to apply. I also found Ultra is harder to remove than other TIMs after some use (besides Pro), but I was able to remove it without too much trouble using the scrub pad they provide and 91% alcohol. I have not had to remove much PRO yet, but I expect it will require lapping the IHS and HSF to get it all off.

I do not know if the die will be as hard to remove as the surface there is not metal, and at least for the Ultra, it remained more liquid there even after a month of use compared to between the IHS and the HSF where it was dried out and harder to remove after that.

Pro does seem to run ~1-3C lower than Ultra, but I will probably buy more Ultra instead of Pro as I find it much easier to use and clean off, and I do end up having to do this multiple times as I change system parts and processors and make system adjustments. It's not like my system is set up to just work and then remain static very long.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Both CL Ultra and Pro are a pain to apply and to remove compaired to other TIMs, but they are both very good for temps - especially between the die and IHS where they are, so far, the best TIM to use.
> I have tried both now, and Ultra is easier to apply. I also found Ultra is harder to remove than other TIMs after some use (besides Pro), but I was able to remove it without too much trouble using the scrub pad they provide and 91% alcohol. I have not had to remove much PRO yet, but I expect it will require lapping the IHS and HSF to get it all off.
> I do not know if the die will be as hard to remove as the surface there is not metal, and at least for the Ultra, it remained more liquid there even after a month of use compared to between the IHS and the HSF where it was dried out and harder to remove after that.
> Pro does seem to run ~1-3C lower than Ultra, but I will probably buy more Ultra instead of Pro as I find it much easier to use and clean off, and I do end up having to do this multiple times as I change system parts and processors and make system adjustments. It's not like my system is set up to just work and then remain static very long.


I suspect that the reason it is easier to remove from the die is because it is not rough like the IHS or HS. It is, in fact, very smooth and pretty much as close as you would get to polished. It helps that it's not metal as well but I suspect it is mostly to do with the surface finish.


----------



## chris-br

Yes, took it off the HSF and IHS and was able to confirm that my IHS is concave, so will lap that **** once my liquid pro arrives.


----------



## neopunx

I had an issue when I removed my CL Ultra last week. It bonded with the metal on the IHS, and on both the die and the IHS, it left little metalic peices that were also bonded to the DIE/IHS. I relapped my IHS to get it flat again(those peices were big enough that I was worried I would have poor contact). On the DIE I used the cleaner/prepper that I got with the CL Ultra and went to town for a while with a cotton swab and a few swipes of my finger nails. They are a freaking head ache to remove, but thay are worth it!


----------



## chris-br

Should I lap the d14 too?


----------



## flv1333

Ok So ill try an reseat the IHS on the weekend.

I also posted mv Validation in the original entry

and here for those of you who care: http://valid.canardpc.com/2583512


----------



## Arm3nian

What actually bows with pressure? My raystorm has two pressure fittings, first one for mobo and second for the actual block, but most say the first is enough, I tightened both all the way maybe that was my problem. Does not explain the gpu though, however I did slide it and take it off a little while mounting.


----------



## neopunx

@Chris, does the d14 have a solid block base or does it have exposed pipes? If it has exposé pipes, then no. They are thin and you run the risk of wearing through and ruining it.

@Arm3nian, I have that same block, and I haven't noticed any bowing. What exactly are you talking about? If you put to much pressure(which is hard to do) you can warp the Mobo over a long period of time. If you are talking about the IHS, then supposedly the pressure some how magically makes the concaved portion of the IHS better. I don't really beleive in magic, hence I lapped mine. If after you put your TIM on the die/IHS, while you were mounting the block, you caused the IHS slipped, it's possible that you smeared the TIM and lost your good contact. The only way to check is reverse the process carefully, inspect as you disassemble, and reapply if you find it messed up. If it is messed up, do it over again, but be more careful while mounting the block to not slide the IHS, and liberally apply some TIM on the Under side of the IHS to mitigate the disruption of the tim during mounting.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flv1333*
> 
> Hey hey!
> Yeah So I decided to do the same! was at 78°c whilst running Prime95 (after a 30 Minute run) now my max is 66! Love it! Only problem is that my friend saw the results and now he wants me to do his as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... I was ok to do it on MY chip... but someone elses? mmmmmm...
> 
> OCN name: Flv1333
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: MX2
> Mhz gained: NA
> OC after delid: 4500 Mhz
> Temp drops: A nice 12°c!!!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2583512


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flv1333*
> 
> Ok So ill try an reseat the IHS on the weekend.
> I also posted mv Validation in the original entry
> and here for those of you who care: http://valid.canardpc.com/2583512


Your in!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> @Chris, does the d14 have a solid block base or does it have exposed pipes? If it has exposé pipes, then no. They are thin and you run the risk of wearing through and ruining it.


Nope, is a solid block of nickel plated cooper i believe. But some say it's really straight and true.


----------



## Hokies83

Wow i had a guy offer me 150$ for my Htpc lol

i5 750
Asus p7p55-m
Samsung 160gb hdd
Antec 620
Galaxy Gt 240
Enermax 600 watt psu
Blue ray drive
8gb dd3
And a retail copy of Windows 7 home perm 64 bit..
In a Silverstone Sugo 02 Case..

I asked him for what ever he was Smokin cause he must be some good stuff..
LOL https://post.craigslist.org/manage/3351020151


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Wow i had a guy offer me 150$ for my Htpc lol
> i5 750
> Asus p7p55-m
> Samsung 160gb hdd
> Antec 620
> Galaxy Gt 240
> Enermax 600 watt psu
> Blue ray drive
> 8gb dd3
> And a retail copy of Windows 7 home perm 64 bit..
> In a Silverstone Sugo 02 Case..
> I asked him for what ever he was Smokin cause he must be some good stuff..
> LOL https://post.craigslist.org/manage/3351020151


Gotta love CL. The only place a $50 P4 system gets listed at $500, & where a $1000 system listed for $500 gets offers for $50.


----------



## ivanlabrie

The case alone costs close to that xD
People these days...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Well, I found that, while making multiple attempts at removing my ultra, even after a short period, removing it was a complete pain, it took a lot of effort to remove from the IHS and cooler base and even then I couldn't get it all. It did seem to improve the surface though so I'm not sure it's a bad thing.
> I would just say not to expect it to come off completely.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Both CL Ultra and Pro are a pain to apply and to remove compaired to other TIMs, but they are both very good for temps - especially between the die and IHS where they are, so far, the best TIM to use.
> I have tried both now, and Ultra is easier to apply. I also found Ultra is harder to remove than other TIMs after some use (besides Pro), but I was able to remove it without too much trouble using the scrub pad they provide and 91% alcohol. I have not had to remove much PRO yet, but I expect it will require lapping the IHS and HSF to get it all off.
> I do not know if the die will be as hard to remove as the surface there is not metal, and at least for the Ultra, it remained more liquid there even after a month of use compared to between the IHS and the HSF where it was dried out and harder to remove after that.
> Pro does seem to run ~1-3C lower than Ultra, but I will probably buy more Ultra instead of Pro as I find it much easier to use and clean off, and I do end up having to do this multiple times as I change system parts and processors and make system adjustments. It's not like my system is set up to just work and then remain static very long.


same here, after merely 2 weeks of 24/7 running/use of CL ULTRA I had to scrub the bottom of my Raystorm cooling block and use plenty of alcohol to remove it, some still stayed like kinda fused into copper LOL (yet very flat)









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Wow i had a guy offer me 150$ for my Htpc lol
> i5 750
> Asus p7p55-m
> Samsung 160gb hdd
> Antec 620
> Galaxy Gt 240
> Enermax 600 watt psu
> Blue ray drive
> 8gb dd3
> And a retail copy of Windows 7 home perm 64 bit..
> In a Silverstone Sugo 02 Case..
> I asked him for what ever he was Smokin cause he must be some good stuff..
> LOL https://post.craigslist.org/manage/3351020151


haha, that's a low blow ... tell that guy he'd better buy some lottery tickets instead ...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The case alone costs close to that xD
> People these days...


Yah it is like the sleekest Htpc/Shuttle Case.. fits in with TV etc etc.. And small.. it is like 15x7x8

I have a 3d gen ipad and a Nexus 7 now.. so i have no need for the htpc.. heh.. but there does come that point in money it is worth more to me keeping then selling...

The thing about the i5 750 is it runs as good if not better in gaming then a 8350...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah of course...it's still a killer rig, and if you overclock it BAM! xD


----------



## luciddreamer124

Hey guys is there a stock limit put in place for voltage on the 3770k? Whenever I try to put it at 1.55v or higher it says there is a CPU overvoltage error.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Hey guys is there a stock limit put in place for voltage on the 3770k? Whenever I try to put it at 1.55v or higher it says there is a CPU overvoltage error.


Yeah, max vid is 1.52v. You should disable an overvoltage warning in your bios. Look around, it should be there.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Hey guys is there a stock limit put in place for voltage on the 3770k? Whenever I try to put it at 1.55v or higher it says there is a CPU overvoltage error.


you need to go to BIOS and disable the Press F1 warning (enabled by default). CPU overvoltage error message will stay, but it will boot normally without bothering you anymore. ASUS BIOS has it on the 4th or 5th BIOS screen tab.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah it is like the sleekest Htpc/Shuttle Case.. fits in with TV etc etc.. And small.. it is like 15x7x8
> I have a 3d gen ipad and a Nexus 7 now.. so i have no need for the htpc.. heh.. but there does come that point in money it is worth more to me keeping then selling...
> The thing about the i5 750 is it runs as good if not better in gaming then a 8350...


A high clocked core 2 duo beats the new amd cpu's lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> A high clocked core 2 duo beats the new amd cpu's lol.


Doubt that...perhaps in single thread superpi runs xD


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Doubt that...perhaps in single thread superpi runs xD


Most benchmarks scale linearly with cores, but I was talking about games.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Most benchmarks scale linearly with cores, but I was talking about games.


Nowadays Alot of games use 4 cores... So the core 2 duo only having 2 will lose to the 8350.

But Even the quad loses to it.. Not by alot mind you but it loses.. the i5 750 is what replace the core2quad.. Which was then replace by the i5 2500k


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, max vid is 1.52v. You should disable an overvoltage warning in your bios. Look around, it should be there.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> you need to go to BIOS and disable the Press F1 warning (enabled by default). CPU overvoltage error message will stay,
> but it will boot normally without bothering you anymore. ASUS BIOS has it on the 4th or 5th BIOS screen tab.


you guys know what i have to do/disable (jumper?) on my Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H mobo,
to get passed 1.850V vcore?
if i put 1.855V vcore or higher in there, it jumpes back to Auto..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you guys know what i have to do/disable (jumper?) on my Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H mobo,
> to get passed 1.850V vcore?
> if i put 1.855V vcore or higher in there, it jumpes back to Auto..


LoL you playing with fire with that board.. it was not designed for that kinda Vcore XD that is what the UDH and UP were designed for XD


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL you playing with fire with that board.. it was not designed for that kinda Vcore XD that is what the UDH and UP were designed for XD


yea, i understand..thnks hokies








dang, now im thinking of buying a new mobo..lol
i never gonna finish this build









i need,
1 ssd, 128/256gb
new/other ram, 2400mhz+, 8/16gb
a Gigabyte GV-R787OC-2GD
another 1/2tb hdd
thermaltake water 2.0 extreme

thats about it i think ..lol


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL you playing with fire with that board.. it was not designed for that kinda Vcore XD that is what the UDH and UP were designed for XD
> 
> 
> 
> yea, i understand..thnks hokies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dang, now im thinking of buying a new mobo..lol
> i never gonna finish this build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i need,
> 1 ssd, 128/256gb
> new/other ram, 2400mhz+, 8/16gb
> a Gigabyte GV-R787OC-2GD
> another 1/2tb hdd
> thermaltake water 2.0 extreme
> 
> thats about it i think ..lol
Click to expand...

If you are going to buy a new MB, then you may want to consider that MSI MPower as it is very good at OCing and has lots of features for the price on top of that. I am trying out a new Asus Sabertooth right now and comparied to the MPower last week it is not as good of a OC'er. MPower has lower vcore per OC for same chips and better SSD/HDD and memory benches. Both are very stable though. MPower has more features like BT and wireless. Very good reviews.

One major advantage for the sabertooth for me though is that it did not require a reload of the OS when I installed it - maybe due to going from one Asus board to another. Real smooth install. Yet when I did the same steps for the MPower the OS started acting strange - I could not run many programs like CPU-Z, as well as many other issues - although I could run W7 and installed all the drivers. I was going to have to reinstall the OS.

Do let us know whatever you do!!!

PS - this 3570 I got to try out is not worthy of delidding. I'm probably going to take it back and try to get another 3770K...


----------



## VonDutch

yea, windows can get pretty confused if you change anything,
mine even start to (re) install new drivers when i change the same hardware
to another usb port ..lol,
"yeah!! i found something new, lets install!!"

i dont have alot of money, so that list i mentioned is my plan for next year,
my mobo is good enough for the oc i run daily,

i dont go over 1.85V vcore that often hahaha








its just in case Val is going at it again...lol
already decided, if i do, its got to be at least -5C to -10C outside,
or whatever is needed to get all cores below 0C

edit,
isnt the 3570k a binned 3770k?
so you need even more luck to find a good one?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, windows can get pretty confused if you change anything,
> mine even start to (re) install new drivers when i change the same hardware
> to another usb port ..lol,
> "yeah!! i found something new, lets install!!"
> 
> i dont have alot of money, so that list i mentioned is my plan for next year,
> my mobo is good enough for the oc i run daily,
> i dont go over 1.85V vcore that often hahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its just in case Val is going at it again...lol


And we all know Val is not afraid to go to 1.9v+! LOL


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> And we all know Val is not afraid to go to 1.9v+! LOL


i was about to do the same when he did,
but then i ran into the max vcore for my mobo,
guess that limit isnt for nothing, like hokies said,
my mobo isnt build to do such crazy oc's ..vcore wise ..lol


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> edit,
> isnt the 3570k a binned 3770k?
> so you need even more luck to find a good one?


The 3770K's are better than the 3570K's due to binning, so yep, I'd needed more luck to get a good one.

Why I got it though was because they ran out of the 3770K's when they went on sale for $229! Sale started that morning, and by the time I could get there at lunchtime they had sold them all!

Since I really wanted a new chip to try, and I wanted to get a new MB (with MicroCenter combo discount if you buy a i5 and a MB), I decided to give a 3570K a try! Wish I had got lucky, but no go....


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, windows can get pretty confused if you change anything,
> mine even start to (re) install new drivers when i change the same hardware
> to another usb port ..lol,
> *"yeah!! i found something new, lets install!!"*
> i dont have alot of money, so that list i mentioned is my plan for next year,
> my mobo is good enough for the oc i run daily,
> i dont go over 1.85V vcore that often hahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its just in case Val is going at it again...lol
> already decided, if i do, its got to be at least -5C to -10C outside,
> or whatever is needed to get all cores below 0C
> edit,
> isnt the 3570k a binned 3770k?
> so you need even more luck to find a good one?


Yeah that's pretty much right which sucks for mid-range users. I'm considering swapping to a 3770k and de-lidding.
My windows does that ALL the time by the way, so I've gotten into a habit of using the same two USB ports for most of the time as it's rather annoying. I only use the others when I need more then 2 ports.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i understand..thnks hokies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dang, now im thinking of buying a new mobo..lol
> i never gonna finish this build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i need,
> 1 ssd, 128/256gb
> new/other ram, 2400mhz+, 8/16gb
> a Gigabyte GV-R787OC-2GD
> another 1/2tb hdd
> thermaltake water 2.0 extreme
> thats about it i think ..lol


Why get a 7870? A "Good" 7870 is the same as decent 7950 most of the time and you get an extra game in the states? Don't know why you'd limit yourself to a 7870 if you can afford all that extra hardware








I'd suggest a 128GB SSD as 256GB is really not essential if you have mechanical HDD's to put photos/music/videos on and even some bigger things like games. I'm doing fine on my 64GB drive wtith 25.5GB free!








I personally don't like CLC's but haven't really heard much of the Thermaltake Water Extreme, I'd personally suggest a nice air cooler such as a NH-D14 or just settle with a custom loop from the money on the SSD saved








I'd suggest a 2TB Green drive if you're not using it for programs too, maybe even a 3TB just to save rack space if you need more HDD space.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The 3770K's are better than the 3570K's due to binning, so yep, I'd needed more luck to get a good one.
> Why I got it though was because they ran out of the 3770K's when they went on sale for $229! Sale started that morning, and by the time I could get there at lunchtime they had sold them all!
> Since I really wanted a new chip to try, and I wanted to get a new MB (with MicroCenter combo discount if you buy a i5 and a MB), I decided to give a 3570K a try! Wish I had got lucky, but no go....


Ouch, that would suck. I wish I got a 3770k for the price of my 3570k!







Might have to see if I can arrange dads friend to get one on sale..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, windows can get pretty confused if you change anything,
> mine even start to (re) install new drivers when i change the same hardware
> to another usb port ..lol,
> "yeah!! i found something new, lets install!!"
> i dont have alot of money, so that list i mentioned is my plan for next year,
> my mobo is good enough for the oc i run daily,
> i dont go over 1.85V vcore that often hahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its just in case Val is going at it again...lol
> already decided, if i do, its got to be at least -5C to -10C outside,
> or whatever is needed to get all cores below 0C
> edit,
> isnt the 3570k a binned 3770k?
> so you need even more luck to find a good one?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> And we all know Val is not afraid to go to 1.9v+! LOL


If I get another 0C core night again I'm gonna try for 5.6 Ghz I think.


----------



## SonDa5

Personal best on standard run for IBT.

http://valid.canardpc.com/2584111


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Personal best on standard run for IBT.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2584111


NICE!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> And we all know Val is not afraid to go to 1.9v+! LOL


Ive seen 7ghz stable at that voltage. Prob can go higher if chip doesnt blow up and bios allows it, ln2 temps arnt going anywhere lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Why get a 7870? A "Good" 7870 is the same as decent 7950 most of the time and you get an extra game in the states? Don't know why you'd limit yourself to a 7870 if you can afford all that extra hardware
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd suggest a 128GB SSD as 256GB is really not essential if you have mechanical HDD's to put photos/music/videos on and even some bigger things like games. I'm doing fine on my 64GB drive wtith 25.5GB free!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I personally don't like CLC's but haven't really heard much of the Thermaltake Water Extreme, I'd personally suggest a nice air cooler such as a NH-D14 or just settle with a custom loop from the money on the SSD saved
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd suggest a 2TB Green drive if you're not using it for programs too, maybe even a 3TB just to save rack space if you need more HDD space.
> Ouch, that would suck. I wish I got a 3770k for the price of my 3570k!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Might have to see if I can arrange dads friend to get one on sale..


i choose the Gb 7870, because its already OCed from factory, 100mhz more then reference,
it runs at 1.1ghz, thats already about 10% more speed(highest 7870 factory oc out there)
so that bump only should get me close to performance with the 7950, which is about 50-60 euro more expensive where i live








and i have headroom to oc it more if i want, i like the 3 fan design also..runs cool and quiet
i know the 7950 has 1gb more ram, but im not planning more monitors anywhere soon..for games it doesnt offer alot more performance, 1 gb more ram


i did some research on prefab watercoolers, i like the , no messing around with tubes, liquids etc,
and if i build one myself, its way more expensive too..at least 100 euro more..
the thermaltake water extreme 2.0 isnt well known yet, but it outperforms the H100, or the D-14
check some reviews/benchmarks, and youll see









i like the way it looks









i wont but, if i had to choose another aircooler, i deffo go for the new Phantek,
especially with higher oc's and/or heat/watts, it performs ..very good









(feels like some salesman now)

128gb ssd should do for now..but djeez, my kid asked me last time, can i install max paine 3?
i said, sure, how big is it?.....eerr well...about 60 GB,( my face







) games are getting really big,
thats why i try to buy a 256gb..but for OS and some proggies etc,
128gb is more then enough for me personally, dang kids...lol

yea , i collect movies, series etc, but now moving to full HD movies,
so im going from 7-800mb movies, to 2-3gb per movie..
my secondary hdd, a 1TB is almost full..
i use a 500gb for OS etc..

o wait, i didnt say i can afford it..lol, its my wishlist for next year,
it will take me about a year to save the money to buy it all ..


----------



## Lobsterman

I was looking at that ThermalTake VonDutch when I was scouting round for cooling, thing that put me off it was the crappy plastic backplate/clippings/brackets they use, they may have fixed that by now but it was enough to put me off it and go with the Phanteks.


----------



## Matt-Matt

That's a pretty good CLC.
Wow 60GB!







But yeah generally you don't put games on the SSD especially if it's 60GB








The 7950 is better out of the box at 800MHz core then a 7870 at 1GHz, overclocking the 7950 to 1.1GHz+ will make it a lot better, that with the wider memory bus + extra 1GB vRAM will come in handy eventually.

I know it's a bit more, but it's worth it I personally think. Especially if you ever do get into multi-monitor setups.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> That's a pretty good CLC.
> Wow 60GB!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But yeah generally you don't put games on the SSD especially if it's 60GB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The 7950 is better out of the box at 800MHz core then a 7870 at 1GHz, overclocking the 7950 to 1.1GHz+ will make it a lot better, that with the wider memory bus + extra 1GB vRAM will come in handy eventually.
> I know it's a bit more, but it's worth it I personally think. Especially if you ever do get into multi-monitor setups.


yea, think it was total space when downloaded, but,
"the minimum system requirements list of Max Payne 3, published by Rockstar Games,
asks for *at least 35 GB* of free space *on the installation drive*."

o yea, if i had the money, i would go for a 7970 ..lol 7990! haha.


----------



## wholeeo

Delidded a old P4 last night for practice. Wonder if I should put my 3570k under the knife before doing the 3770k.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> Delidded a old P4 last night for practice. Wonder if I should put my 3570k under the knife before doing the 3770k.
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


I'd just do the 3770k and if the 3770k goes bad you've got a 3570k to fall back on till you can fix/replace the 3770k rather then either getting the 3570k then ruining the 3770k.
Just see if you can grab another P4 or Single Core Celeron or even a cheap E21xx etc. E7x00's were pasted too. The P4's that were 2GHz - 3GHz area were pasted (I've done a couple now).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> I was looking at that ThermalTake VonDutch when I was scouting round for cooling, thing that put me off it was the crappy plastic backplate/clippings/brackets they use, they may have fixed that by now but it was enough to put me off it and go with the Phanteks.


yea, same here, when the phantek came out, i was yess...that one i want,
better then the D-14? ...wauw, that says it all right..
but i already had my mugen 2 rev b,
my next step should be water, not another aircooler,
and who knows what new watercoolers will enter the market next year,
the extreme rev.1 ? ...lol.. with better backplate ..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, same here, when the phantek came out, i was yess...that one i want,
> better then the D-14? ...wauw, that says it all right..
> but i already had my mugen 2 rev b,
> my next step should be water, not another aircooler,
> and who knows what new watercoolers will enter the market next year,
> the extreme rev.1 ? ...lol.. with better backplate ..


The H100i if it's decent! It looks it!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> The H100i if it's decent! It looks it!


yea, didnt see yet they had a new one, the h100 successors , H100*i*
thought the *i* was a typo from you ..lol
have to wait and see if its better, will look out for reviews/benchmarks etc..
magnetic backplate?, thats new..

i quote
"Corsair says these latest models both feature "new, more efficient" copper cold plates and "improved" manifolds. The company claims to have improved the fan design "significantly," as well. The H80i and H100i both ship with 120-mm SP120L fans based on Corsair's retail SP120 offerings. (The SP120L is rated for operation at up to 2700 RPM with up to 77 CFM of airflow and a noise level of 37.68 dBA.) The new coolers also have tubes made of a more flexible composite rubber than their predecessors, and Corsair has included its new magnetic mounting bracket to make the installation process simpler."
end quote

idk, but i think i can find lower rpm fans, with about the same cfm, so lower noise too
wonder what the air pressure is..
the Scythe Slip Stream SY1225SL12LM-P, 120mm i use on my cooler, cfm 74, rpm 1300, noise lvl 26 dba

think i just wait for the new, thermaltake extreme water 2.0 *Ti*


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'd just do the 3770k and if the 3770k goes bad you've got a 3570k to fall back on till you can fix/replace the 3770k rather then either getting the 3570k then ruining the 3770k.
> Just see if you can grab another P4 or Single Core Celeron or even a cheap E21xx etc. E7x00's were pasted too. The P4's that were 2GHz - 3GHz area were pasted (I've done a couple now).


Yeah, that makes sense. Just purchased some 2500K's from the crazy MC deal so I'll have a backups if anything goes wrong. Just waiting on the liquid pro now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, same here, when the phantek came out, i was yess...that one i want,
> better then the D-14? ...wauw, that says it all right..
> but i already had my mugen 2 rev b,
> my next step should be water, not another aircooler,
> and who knows what new watercoolers will enter the market next year,
> the extreme rev.1 ? ...lol.. with better backplate ..


I heard coolermaster is making a bit beefier version of an H100 basically but I don't know name or anything yet let me look into it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I heard coolermaster is making a bit beefier version of an H100 basically but I don't know name or anything yet let me look into it.


LoL alot more then that...

A much better cooler...

A cooler you can Add more rads / blocks to.. etc.. should cream an H100


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL alot more then that...
> A much better cooler...
> A cooler you can Add more rads / blocks to.. etc.. should cream an H100


Stock setup of the Eisberg creams all other CLC's by 4 degrees C. If you change the glycol for distilled water you basically get a custom loop and much better performance.
You can buy the pump/reservoir/waterblock ensemble alone for 100 bucks, which is a bargain, and then add whatever rads you like and voila! It's a very powerful eheim pump.
That's my next cooling upgrade, that and some Joujye Twin Turbo's for my eventual 240 rad.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL alot more then that...
> A much better cooler...
> A cooler you can Add more rads / blocks to.. etc.. should cream an H100


Eisberg

they also have the Seagate as well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Eisberg
> they also have the Seagate as well.


But.. i think ima Snag one of these.. Pump has 4x the power and it is a better block...

" this will cool my Haswell System"

http://www.swiftech.com/ApogeeDrive2.aspx

Pair it with one of these 80mm monsters..

http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p1030_Alphacool-NexXxoS-Monsta-360.html

You have the clean look of a closed loop but performance of highend water...

There is 90mm outside the cosmos 2 top under the cover. in the lowest point. Meaning i can do Lowdba fans in push in the inside.. and low dba fans in pull in 2 of 3 locations outside..

I will drill 2 holes and line them with rubber Grommets so everything stays in the inside.


----------



## wholeeo

Man, waiting on this liquid pro to arrive is







, should I just delid and use ac5 / shin etsu / mx4 for the time being while I wait for the liquid pro to arrive?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> Man, waiting on this liquid pro to arrive is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , should I just delid and use ac5 / shin etsu / mx4 for the time being while I wait for the liquid pro to arrive?


Makes it more hassle.. but that is up to you.


----------



## neopunx

No, I would wait. The less you play, the less likely it is to get destroyed! But seriously, cleaning it is a b****.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Wrong Thread. Delete


----------



## kzim9

Well I have been running 4.8 @ 1.376v with MX-4 on die and stock H80 TIM 24/7 durning the FFW's and temps are 75'C solid. Ambient temps are 80'C with my windows open and all 12 rigs running in a 10'x10' area









Still waiting on the Cool Labs Pro to arrive, but really don't know if it would be worth it to switch. What do you guys think?

I also still have to post a cpuid for offical club entry.... After FFW tho....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> Well I have been running 4.8 @ 1.376v with MX-4 on die and stock H80 TIM 24/7 durning the FFW's and temps are 75'C solid. Ambient temps are 80'C with my windows open and all 12 rigs running in a 10'x10' area
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still waiting on the Cool Labs Pro to arrive, but really don't know if it would be worth it to switch. What do you guys think?
> I also still have to post a cpuid for offical club entry.... After FFW tho....


It WILL be worth it...you'll get 10c less easy.


----------



## Arm3nian

Would I need multiple types of sandpaper to lap? For example, 500, then move to 1500, then 2500, or something like that.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Would I need multiple types of sandpaper to lap? For example, 500, then move to 1500, then 2500, or something like that.


Yep, that's the way to go about it. You just need a flat surface like a glass to rest your ihs on. Put some tape under it (double-sided works best) and the proceed to lap it with progressively thinner sandpapers.


----------



## chris-br

I already got, 600, can´t find 800 here in my town(very small town)1000, 1500 and 2000 sand paper.. just waiting on the liquid pro now.
Then, lapping will start.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Great! I have them grits at home but never bothered to lap anything








Bought them when I had a Thermalright XP-90, so go figure!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I already got, 600, can´t find 800 here in my town(very small town)1000, 1500 and 2000 sand paper.. just waiting on the liquid pro now.
> Then, lapping will start.


Ebay.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I bet he can find if he goes to a proper hardware store...I could find all kinds of sandpaper (the ones you submerge in water first) locally, and I live in Buenos Aires, Argentina.


----------



## wholeeo

Do you guys think delidding these CPU's takes away from their resale value? I'm not one to keep processors very long being that I live near a MC,


----------



## chris-br

Think I'm good with what i already have...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> Do you guys think delidding these CPU's takes away from their resale value? I'm not one to keep processors very long being that I live near a MC,


Id say it adds 10%


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, it should be fine...Lapping can be time consuming but rewarding depending on the case.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Id say it adds 10%


I dunno.. I was watching a de-lidded 3570k on eBay and it didn't have many bids compared to a non-de-lidded one. I can't find the link now though..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I dunno.. I was watching a de-lidded 3570k on eBay and it didn't have many bids compared to a non-de-lidded one. I can't find the link now though..


Thats with Ebay noobs...

I sell on here Anandtech and Hardocp.. 10% more then a stock chip is what they go for.. sometimes more...

The performance guy is gonna look at it like this....

Pay 300$ for a cool running chip that does 5ghz 24/7

Or Pay 280$ for a chip close to TJmax that only does 4.8ghz...

The performance minded person will pay 300$ all day and twice on sunday...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Thats with Ebay noobs...
> I sell on here Anandtech and Hardocp.. 10% more then a stock chip is what they go for.. sometimes more...
> The performance guy is gonna look at it like this....
> Pay 300$ for a cool running chip that does 5ghz 24/7
> Or Pay 280$ for a chip close to TJmax that only does 4.8ghz...
> The performance minded person will pay 300$ all day and twice on sunday...


Yeah I suppose so, I normally sell my stuff on eBay though as it has higher yields.. I'll probably sell my 3570k on here within a couple of years for your reasoning if I de-lid that is.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah I suppose so, I normally sell my stuff on eBay though as it has higher yields.. I'll probably sell my 3570k on here within a couple of years for your reasoning if I de-lid that is.


Anything performance Enhanced sell on an Computer forum.. ppl will pay for the performance..

People on Ebay are just looking for a deal and do not really care.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Anything performance Enhanced sell on an Computer forum.. ppl will pay for the performance..
> People on Ebay are just looking for a deal and do not really care.


Yeah, I guessed that. But for standard parts just sell them on there


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Thats with Ebay noobs...
> I sell on here Anandtech and Hardocp.. 10% more then a stock chip is what they go for.. sometimes more...
> The performance guy is gonna look at it like this....
> Pay 300$ for a cool running chip that does 5ghz 24/7
> Or Pay 280$ for a chip close to TJmax that only does 4.8ghz...
> The performance minded person will pay 300$ all day and twice on sunday...


There are some people on ebay who realize the great deal, probably not a lot though.

I agree I would actually pay more for a delid ivy, its basically sandy cooling but better since pastes like pro seem to give better conductivity than solder. I plan to upgrade to haswell extreme editions, might even be 8 cores who knows, i'll sell my delid there and i'm sure it I would get the same price as a new ivy since it would be used. The only resale drawback I see is no warranty, but if it survives a year and a half it would probably survive more...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> Well I have been running 4.8 @ 1.376v with MX-4 on die and stock H80 TIM 24/7 durning the FFW's and temps are 75'C solid. Ambient temps are 80'C with my windows open and all 12 rigs running in a 10'x10' area
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still waiting on the Cool Labs Pro to arrive, but really don't know if it would be worth it to switch. What do you guys think?
> I also still have to post a cpuid for offical club entry.... After FFW tho....


80C huh??
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> There are some people on ebay who realize the great deal, probably not a lot though.
> I agree I would actually pay more for a delid ivy, its basically sandy cooling but better since pastes like pro seem to give better conductivity than solder. I plan to upgrade to haswell extreme editions, might even be 8 cores who knows, i'll sell my delid there and i'm sure it I would get the same price as a new ivy since it would be used. The only resale drawback I see is no warranty, but if it survives a year and a half it would probably survive more...


Oh silly selling peoples.


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I dunno.. I was watching a de-lidded 3570k on eBay and it didn't have many bids compared to a non-de-lidded one. I can't find the link now though..


eBay is the worst place to sell a CPU or motherboard. I've been selling and buying stuff there for years and noticed a trend with certain computer parts. Basically, video cards (EVGA, XFX, MSI), HDDs/SSDs, and a few others I can't quite thing of at the top of my head sell the easiest. But PSUs, motherboards, CPU coolers (including water cooling), monitors, and CPUs are either harder to sell or you'll end up selling them for less if you do an auction. Although some CPUs such as a Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 have a higher resale value due to it being EOL and having a performance boost with LGA 775.


----------



## Hokies83

LoL ive noticed the most common systems on Local C list Pent 4s and Core 2 duos..

So when they get an i5 quad they do not know what to do with it lol.

Hmm can you find Valguar in this picture?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> eBay is the worst place to sell a CPU or motherboard. I've been selling and buying stuff there for years and noticed a trend with certain computer parts. Basically, video cards (EVGA, XFX, MSI), HDDs/SSDs, and a few others I can't quite thing of at the top of my head sell the easiest. But PSUs, motherboards, CPU coolers (including water cooling), monitors, and CPUs are either harder to sell or you'll end up selling them for less if you do an auction. *Although some CPUs such as a Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 have a higher resale value due to it being EOL and having a performance boost with LGA 775.*


My Q9400 went for more then what people are selling Q9550's here for, it was $135. My EP45-UD3P also went for $100 but the bidder didn't pay.. So I ended up selling it here for $105 + shipping to the states.
6GB of DDR2 (two kits) sold for a total of $99, it was also cheaper then what i'd planned on shipping and made some money off that too. A 4GB kit of Corsair XMS2 800 wouldn't have sold for $66 here, someone would have wanted that for less then $40.

Have I proven my point?
Oh I also sold an E8500 for $90


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> My Q9400 went for more then what people are selling Q9550's here for, it was $135. My EP45-UD3P also went for $100 but the bidder didn't pay.. So I ended up selling it here for $105 + shipping to the states.
> 6GB of DDR2 (two kits) sold for a total of $99, it was also cheaper then what i'd planned on shipping and made some money off that too. A 4GB kit of Corsair XMS2 800 wouldn't have sold for $66 here, someone would have wanted that for less then $40.
> Have I proven my point?
> Oh I also sold an E8500 for $90


Damn and i can not sell a 500$ i5 Quad system for 365$ @[email protected]


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> My Q9400 went for more then what people are selling Q9550's here for, it was $135. My EP45-UD3P also went for $100 but the bidder didn't pay.. So I ended up selling it here for $105 + shipping to the states.
> 6GB of DDR2 (two kits) sold for a total of $99, it was also cheaper then what i'd planned on shipping and made some money off that too. A 4GB kit of Corsair XMS2 800 wouldn't have sold for $66 here, someone would have wanted that for less then $40.
> Have I proven my point?
> Oh I also sold an E8500 for $90


Exactly. Those older systems, especially LGA 775, still hold some value. I remember a few years ago trying to flip a BNIB Core i7 930 that I got at Micro Center for $200 (+tax). I ended up selling it for $217+$8 shipping.









Phenom II X6 CPUs are also valued chips on eBay.


----------



## SonDa5

Found a sweet spot for 24/7 5ghz.

Ambient Temps 24C
RAM 2133mhz CL 9-11-10-27 1T @1.5v
[email protected] with 1.376v

http://valid.canardpc.com/2585171










Coud not have been possible without delidding.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Found a sweet spot for 24/7 5ghz.
> Ambient Temps 24C
> RAM 2133mhz CL 9-11-10-27 1T @1.5v
> [email protected] with 1.376v
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2585171
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coud not have been possible without delidding.


Great result sonda









im maxed out with 5.0ghz, my vcore sckd,

1.5V vcore, temps are still good tho..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Found a sweet spot for 24/7 5ghz.
> Ambient Temps 24C
> RAM 2133mhz CL 9-11-10-27 1T @1.5v
> [email protected] with 1.376v
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2585171
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coud not have been possible without delidding.


WOW those are great temps ive been running prime for a while now here are my temps
highest voltage is 1.376


i dont think i can run IBT without goin over 100c i need to delid my baby


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> WOW those are great temps ive been running prime for a while now here are my temps
> highest voltage is 1.376
> 
> i dont think i can run IBT without goin over 100c i need to delid my baby


Your temps are awesome as well. What speed is your ram at?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Sonda5, not even xmp speeds there!?
You mad bro?








Other than that, NICE!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Sonda5, not even xmp speeds there!?
> You mad bro?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Other than that, NICE!


Not mad at all just tweaking.
Getting closer to 2600mhz.



http://valid.canardpc.com/2585308


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Not mad at all just tweaking.
> Getting closer to 2600mhz.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2585308


Yeah, seen that.
That's more like it
 






grats!


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I bet he can find if he goes to a proper hardware store...I could find all kinds of sandpaper (the ones you submerge in water first) locally, and I live in Buenos Aires, Argentina.


The only place I have found 2000-3000 grit sandpaper is eBay, I still have some from years ago. The best surface for lapping is tempered glass is as flat as it gets! At this high grit sandpaper it lasts a long time, there's a specialty hardware store near me that sells everything and non of the stuff is available anywhere on the planet! They even have allen head bolts that are as wide as a pie and weigh over 100 pounds, probably use for something larger that a street light post.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> Do you guys think delidding these CPU's takes away from their resale value? I'm not one to keep processors very long being that I live near a MC,


Consider that most don't have the balls to lap a processor you are adding to the value and greatly decrease the amount of TIM needed, this give the user a better chance at a great successful mount!


----------



## LoneWolf121188

Hey folks! About to take the plunge...got a couple questions though:

1) Liquid Ultra should not be used on aluminum surfaces, right? What's the IHS made out of? Nickel plated copper or something?
2) Can I use Liquid Ultra on both the die-IHS interface and the IHS-waterblock interface? My only other TIM is a 5 year old tube of AS5. Liquid Ultra on both would be better than that, right? Any reason I _really_ should order a tube of Pro?
3) What kind of voltages are people running? My 3770K is currently at 48x100MHz, 1.465 vcore, and it's hitting 95C and failing Prime95 after about 15-20 min. I'm kinda scared to go too much higher on the voltage...but I don't plan on using the CPU for more than a year, so degradation isn't really a concern. But I want to avoid sudden failure. I've seen CPUz screenshots of people pushing 1.7+V...are those just quick validations, or are those Prime stable?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Not mad at all just tweaking.
> Getting closer to 2600mhz.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2585308


Nice! The new kit is doing better, glad it isn't the IMC.
I thought I might have degraded the IMC on the chip I delidded, but it just got really picky with the mount. 3 different heatsinks & 5 mounts later it boots 2600 & 2800Mhz memory again, thought it was done when I tried it cold & still didn't boot over 2400Mhz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> Hey folks! About to take the plunge...got a couple questions though:
> 1) Liquid Ultra should not be used on aluminum surfaces, right? What's the IHS made out of? Nickel plated copper or something?
> 2) Can I use Liquid Ultra on both the die-IHS interface and the IHS-waterblock interface? My only other TIM is a 5 year old tube of AS5. Liquid Ultra on both would be better than that, right? Any reason I _really_ should order a tube of Pro?
> 3) What kind of voltages are people running? My 3770K is currently at 48x100MHz, 1.465 vcore, and it's hitting 95C and failing Prime95 after about 15-20 min. I'm kinda scared to go too much higher on the voltage...but I don't plan on using the CPU for more than a year, so degradation isn't really a concern. But I want to avoid sudden failure. I've seen CPUz screenshots of people pushing 1.7+V...are those just quick validations, or are those Prime stable?


1) correct, & IHS is nickel plated copper.
2) should be OK for both surfaces, not really sure about ultra or pro, haven't tried either yet, waiting on a tube of ultra to arrive myself.
3) it varies, the chip I delidded wasn't great, running 4600Mhz at 1.32 now, it did 4.5Ghz at 1.22, going over 4.5Ghz it starts needing big voltage bumps. People pushing 1.7V on air & water are for quick validations, temps would likely go through the roof under load unless more extreme cooling is used.


----------



## LoneWolf121188

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 1) correct, & IHS is nickel plated copper.
> 2) should be OK for both surfaces, not really sure about ultra or pro, haven't tried either yet, waiting on a tube of ultra to arrive myself.
> 3) it varies, the chip I delidded wasn't great, running 4600Mhz at 1.32 now, it did 4.5Ghz at 1.22, going over 4.5Ghz it starts needing big voltage bumps. People pushing 1.7V on air & water are for quick validations, temps would likely go through the roof under load unless more extreme cooling is used.


Thanks. What about FSB OCing? I know you can't do much on IB, but +4MHz would get me to 5GHz.







Possible? Does it need a PLL voltage boost or something? You don't need more vcore when you bump up the FSB, right?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> Thanks. What about FSB OCing? I know you can't do much on IB, but +4MHz would get me to 5GHz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Possible? Does it need a PLL voltage boost or something? You don't need more vcore when you bump up the FSB, right?


104 bclk shouldn't be an issue, & shouldn't need much if any extra voltage (it does increase the speed a bit, so might). Every once in a while you come across pci-e devices (HDD, graphics card, etc.) that don't work well with increased pci-e but those are pretty rare, haven't had anything myself that had issues under 110 bclk.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> Hey folks! About to take the plunge...
> 3) What kind of voltages are people running? My 3770K is currently at 48x100MHz, 1.465 vcore, and it's hitting 95C and failing Prime95 after about 15-20 min.


If it were me I wouldn't delid that 3770k. I would sell it and get another. Why? It just doesn't seem like a good over clocker and if you are going to go through the trouble of delidding a IB cpu to improve perofromance I think its wiser to do it on a stronger IB cpu.

If you can run Prime95 stable for 24 hours with no more than 1.2v on Vcore with 3770k at 4.5GHZ then I think the CPU is worth delidding for maximum performance.

Delidding and fixing IHS should cool it down but it wont guarantee over clocking stability.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> What kind of voltages are people running? My 3770K is currently at 48x100MHz, 1.465 vcore, and it's hitting 95C and failing Prime95 after about 15-20 min. I'm kinda scared to go too much higher on the voltage...but I don't plan on using the CPU for more than a year, so degradation isn't really a concern. But I want to avoid sudden failure. I've seen CPUz screenshots of people pushing 1.7+V...are those just quick validations, or are those Prime stable?


A high Vcore with high temps isn't good in my book, you either need to clock it down and reduce Vcore or delid your chip to get lower temps and see what your chip is made of!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I bet he can find if he goes to a proper hardware store...I could find all kinds of sandpaper (the ones you submerge in water first) locally, and I live in Buenos Aires, Argentina.
> 
> 
> 
> The only place I have found 2000-3000 grit sandpaper is eBay, I still have some from years ago. The best surface for lapping is tempered glass is as flat as it gets! At this high grit sandpaper it lasts a long time, there's a specialty hardware store near me that sells everything and non of the stuff is available anywhere on the planet! They even have allen head bolts that are as wide as a pie and weigh over 100 pounds, probably use for something larger that a street light post.
Click to expand...

Try an auto parts store for good sandpaper selection. That's what I found here anyway.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> it varies, the chip I delidded wasn't great, running 4600Mhz at 1.32 now, it did 4.5Ghz at 1.22, going over 4.5Ghz it starts needing big voltage bumps. People pushing 1.7V on air & water are for quick validations, temps would likely go through the roof under load unless more extreme cooling is used.


hey, bro it seems my new 3770K chip is very similar to yours. 1.22v for 4.5GHz and around 1.30v for 4.6GHz ... what is your batch? mine is 3228B
have you clocked it higher after deliding to see how fat it can go? I plan to delid this one on tomorrow and use CL Ultra (had great results with it on former chip).


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hey, bro it seems my new 3770K chip is very similar to yours. 1.22v for 4.5GHz and around 1.30v for 4.6GHz ... what is your batch? mine is 3228B
> have you clocked it higher after deliding to see how fat it can go? I plan to delid this one on tomorrow and use CL Ultra (had great results with it on former chip).


The delidded chip is L221B598. I haven't run it too far yet, put it on the ss to try out the IMC when it was giving me trouble & ran some IBT at 5Ghz. 1.44V. I do have some liquid ultra coming (was hoping for the weekend since I need the 7970 shim coming with it) & will try it on the cascade again to see if it does as well or better, it did 5500 @ 1.64V before the delid.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The delidded chip is L221B598. I haven't run it too far yet, put it on the ss to try out the IMC when it was giving me trouble & ran some IBT at 5Ghz. 1.44V. I do have some liquid ultra coming (was hoping for the weekend since I need the 7970 shim coming with it) & will try it on the cascade again to see if it does as well or better, it did 5500 @ 1.64V before the delid.


5ghz @ 1.44ghz??? how come? if 4.6ghz calls for 1.3v ... I am now at 1.38v (1.366v under load) for 4.7GHz, I can't see it happening at 1.44v @ 5GHz LOL!
anyways, mine is a different batch and plant, so will see. for now I'm not impressed with my new chip and Cinebench vcore demand he he ...

i'm only running it under water, so deliding will be a must for me if I want to even think about 5GHz ...


----------



## Arm3nian

I see many of you running IBT. How are temps and stability validation compared to prime 95 small ftt's?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I see many of you running IBT. How are temps and stability validation compared to prime 95 small ftt's?


Within 10 c running prime on blend for me. So 24 hours of prime high temp would be 75 c or so and IBT would be 65c . Ambient air temp at 21 c


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I see many of you running IBT. How are temps and stability validation compared to prime 95 small ftt's?


I personally always find IBT running in Max Mode (all mem used) generating temps higher than the latest Prime95 27.7 SmallFFT. also IBT seems to achieve the same goal much faster than Prime95 does (a few hours versus 1 day or so).
however, quite recently I learned that actually a simple CPU rendering test called Cinebench (11.5 x64 here) verifies vcore stability cruelly and finds instabilities in seconds where both Prime and IBT confirmed it stable ... also the Cinebench test seems to generate mild temps when compared to IBT. Currently I use only Cinebench for stability testing, then on end I confirm it with something else like IBT 2.54 in Max mode 20-30 rounds.


----------



## Shaldome

So finally read through all 3200+ posts in this thread and I am getting giddy trying this myself next year. If I don't change my mind until the beginning of next month, when I will be ordering my parts for my new rig and go back to the 3820 build I had planned before.








Although I guess I have to do a lot of rereading, when the time comes. Which I have to do anyway as I want to do it when I build in my water loop.


----------



## Notion

Hey peeps,

I have got my Lid off for some time but i am wondering as i am hitting the voltage wall for overclocking the chip.. 5ghz, 1.52V , how do i get the voltage down but get the Ghz up as i have head room on the cooling.. only hitting 74c.. but the voltage is holding me back...

Is there a way to get higher Ghz with less voltage.. but running higher temps?

Cheers


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Hey peeps,
> I have got my Lid off for some time but i am wondering as i am hitting the voltage wall for overclocking the chip.. 5ghz, 1.52V , how do i get the voltage down but get the Ghz up as i have head room on the cooling.. only hitting 74c.. but the voltage is holding me back...
> Is there a way to get higher Ghz with less voltage.. but running higher temps?
> Cheers


Imo Voltage wall is 1.6v and max with good temps is 1.55v.. 1.52 is plenty safe...

My 24/7 Overclock... http://valid.canardpc.com/2586770


----------



## Hokies83

Her e is a review of me playing with Gpu's again @[email protected]

http://www.overclock.net/t/1328510/digging-into-a-gtx-275-lets-see-what-stock-tim-looks-like-4-years-later/0_20


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 5ghz @ 1.44ghz??? how come? if 4.6ghz calls for 1.3v ... I am now at 1.38v (1.366v under load) for 4.7GHz, I can't see it happening at 1.44v @ 5GHz LOL!
> anyways, mine is a different batch and plant, so will see. for now I'm not impressed with my new chip and Cinebench vcore demand he he ...
> i'm only running it under water, so deliding will be a must for me if I want to even think about 5GHz ...


I was running 4.5 & 4.6Ghz on air, I put the ss (single stage phase) on to test the IMC so the cpu was colder for the 5Ghz at 1.44V. Even on the ss IBT at 5Ghz was driving core temps up to the 50s.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I was running 4.5 & 4.6Ghz on air, I put the ss (single stage phase) on to test the IMC so the cpu was colder for the 5Ghz at 1.44V. Even on the ss IBT at 5Ghz was driving core temps up to the 50s.


oh wow! 50C under IBT and SS sounds crazy high, it definitely confirms an issue with stock TIM under IHS and perhsp shape of IHS itself, shame on intel ...

well, I have just delided my new chip, not too shabby, 20C improvements in temps under IBT load at 4.6GHz (~72C), will see how it goes for further clocking, trying to find a wall for daily running, perhaps 4.9GHz will do the trick if vcore demand is not too high. wish me luck


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> oh wow! 50C under IBT and SS sounds crazy high, it definitely confirms an issue with stock TIM under IHS and perhsp shape of IHS itself, shame on intel ...
> well, I have just delided my new chip, not too shabby, 20C improvements in temps under IBT load at 4.6GHz (~72C), will see how it goes for further clocking, trying to find a wall for daily running, perhaps 4.9GHz will do the trick if vcore demand is not too high. wish me luck


72 c? What voltage? Seems a bit high. I'm at 5 GHz at 1.44 volts at 68-70c in IBT. I probably should ask what is your cooling is.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> So finally read through all 3200+ posts in this thread and I am getting giddy trying this myself next year. If I don't change my mind until the beginning of next month, when I will be ordering my parts for my new rig and go back to the 3820 build I had planned before.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although I guess I have to do a lot of rereading, when the time comes. Which I have to do anyway as I want to do it when I build in my water loop.


Reading all the post up to here is quite a feat *Shaldome*!









Good job, and we hope you learned some good info. If you want to delid later I do not think you will need to reread it all, just go through the info gathered on the 1st post of the thread.

Hope you can join our community soon!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> 72 c? What voltage? Seems a bit high. I'm at 5 GHz at 1.44 volts at 68-70c in IBT. I probably should ask what is your cooling is.


yeah my current chip sucks:
4.6GHz @ 1.30v, 72C under IBT load at 27C air intake temp (for rads)
this vcore makes it stable under Cinebench,
My former one could do 4.8GHz at such vcore ...

This one max can do stable is 4.7GHz with nearly 1.39v (needs this vcore for Cinebench run) under load and 85C under IBT with same vcore and that is after deliding (before deliding it was hitting thermal limits already) ... great chip, thank you intel for this wonderful replacement ...








it was stable at 4.8GHz for an hour, but not anymore. tried 4.9GHz, but cannot get it stable even with 1.57V, what a freaking joke it is ...

I guess tomorrow I will get another from Microcenter and sell this one on ebay. that's my luck








I am using water cooling here, it's in my sig


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah my current chip sucks:
> 4.6GHz @ 1.30v, 72C under IBT load at 27C air intake temp (for rads)
> this vcore makes it stable under Cinebench,
> My former one could do 4.8GHz at such vcore ...
> This one max can do stable is 4.7GHz with nearly 1.39v (needs this vcore for Cinebench run) under load and 85C under IBT with same vcore and that is after deliding (before deliding it was hitting thermal limits already) ... great chip, thank you intel for this wonderful replacement ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it was stable at 4.8GHz for an hour, but not anymore. tried 4.9GHz, but cannot get it stable even with 1.57V, what a freaking joke it is ...
> I guess tomorrow I will get another from Microcenter and sell this one on ebay. that's my luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am using water cooling here, it's in my sig


Oh man, sorry to hear. Hopefully the next one is better.







. Wow even with that cooling setup its still that hot? Idk man, something seems funny, that voltage I think should be cooler. But your air going in is pretty warm too so maybe that's why.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Oh man, sorry to hear. Hopefully the next one is better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Wow even with that cooling setup its still that hot? Idk man, something seems funny, that voltage I think should be cooler. But your air going in is pretty warm too so maybe that's why.


yes, the very warm air in the room makes it look worse than it does. Before heating season it generally used to be much better, even 10C less under load temps with only a few C less ambient room temps.
I even recently opened my Raystorm CPU block and cleaned it up (found a tiny bot of gunk), but it didn't help temps at all. Flow is strong in the loop, around 7psi according to MartinsLiquidLab calculator ... and flow around 1.7gpm (D5 Strong 24V pump here) ... so I don't under stand myself, water to ambient delta looks great, 1C at idle, around 3-4C under CPU load, together with GPU under load maybe another 2-3C warmer, but that's about it.
I have push pull fans on both rads too, so air flow in case (from internal rad) is not a problem either ...

I think this is just a cursed chip. With former one I could run it at 5GHz daily at 1.56V and even run IBT whenever ambient was a tad lower than now (e.g. at 23C versus 27C now). But this chip seems to hit a stability wall past 4.7GHz and even 4.8GHz is problematic and calls for way too much vcore than supposed to, not to even mention 4.9 or 5GHz ...

Tomorrow after work I will pick up another 3770K from Microcenter, they have this $229 deal now, so it's good with me (and my wallet) and will ebay this one. It looks like a stinky batch - 3228B...


----------



## feniks

ha ha! all right, got the 4.8GHz stable at nearly 1.50v vcore !! what a crap chip it is OMG ... temps under IBT reached 98C (27C ambient), 1.488v actual vcore per CPU-Z under IBT load at such settings (making Cinebench stable with no WHEA warnings) ... now I see why 4.9GHz was a no go ... it seems like it would probably need past 1.60V to get it fully stable LOL! the worst batch of 3770K I ever had ...

Cinebench yielded 9.70 points:


guys, keep your lucky fingers crossed for me please, tomorrow will get another chip, but I NEED your luck to help me get a good one ... please think about me tomorrow


----------



## kgtuning

Good luck!


----------



## LoneWolf121188

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Imo Voltage wall is 1.6v and max with good temps is 1.55v.. 1.52 is plenty safe...
> My 24/7 Overclock... http://valid.canardpc.com/2586770


Wow, 1.548v? And only using an H100? What are your temps like under Prime or IBT?

I've been scared to go past 1.45v...this gives me hope to hitting 5GHz. Currently 4.8GHz with 1.45v or so and it's not quite prime stable...


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> guys, keep your lucky fingers crossed for me please, tomorrow will get another chip, but I NEED your luck to help me get a good one ... please think about me tomorrow


Fingers crossed for you and for me.
Since MC has so many good deals going on I'm going to pick up a 2500k, 3570k, AsRock Formula MB, and a 3770k.

Going to sell most of it for a little profit but I do want to keep the 3770k to see how it does against my 3570k. If it runs cool with low voltage and can do 4.5GHZ with about 1.15v with cooler temps than my 3570k did before I delidded it I will keep it.

I hope I get a golden one so keep your fingers crossed for me as well. Post your batch number when you get it. My local MC is going to have a new shipment of fresh Inel 3770ks so the batch will be very new.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> Wow, 1.548v? And only using an H100? What are your temps like under Prime or IBT?
> I've been scared to go past 1.45v...this gives me hope to hitting 5GHz. Currently *4.8GHz with 1.45v* or so and it's not quite prime stable...


IBT 74c Prime 95 after 8 hrs 80c..

I can do 4.8ghz with 1.3v 4.9 with 1.35 5ghz needs 1.47 5.1ghz 1.54v 5.2ghz 1.61v.. Have not tried to get anything stable higher then that.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ha ha! all right, got the 4.8GHz stable at nearly 1.50v vcore !! what a crap chip it is OMG ... temps under IBT reached 98C (27C ambient), 1.488v actual vcore per CPU-Z under IBT load at such settings (making Cinebench stable with no WHEA warnings) ... now I see why 4.9GHz was a no go ... it seems like it would probably need past 1.60V to get it fully stable LOL! the worst batch of 3770K I ever had ...
> Cinebench yielded 9.70 points:
> 
> guys, keep your lucky fingers crossed for me please, tomorrow will get another chip, but I NEED your luck to help me get a good one ... please think about me tomorrow


I've bought 4 retails, first was the best (but not a great one), the rest kept going downhill from there. I finally broke down & got a binned chip for benching, then delidded the worst of the bunch which is the one I've talked about here.

Good luck!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Fingers crossed for you and for me.
> Since MC has so many good deals going on I'm going to pick up a 2500k, 3570k, AsRock Formula MB, and a 3770k.
> Going to sell most of it for a little profit but I do want to keep the 3770k to see how it does against my 3570k. If it runs cool with low voltage and can do 4.5GHZ with about 1.15v with cooler temps than my 3570k did before I delidded it I will keep it.
> I hope I get a golden one so keep your fingers crossed for me as well. Post your batch number when you get it. My local MC is going to have a new shipment of fresh Inel 3770ks so the batch will be very new.


let's make a deal, I will keep my fingers crossed for you while you do the same for me, given we have a third person (FTW) also crossing fingers for both us it should give us golden chips easily






















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've bought 4 retails, first was the best (but not a great one), the rest kept going downhill from there. I finally broke down & got a binned chip for benching, then delidded the worst of the bunch which is the one I've talked about here.
> Good luck!


interesting ... I had 3 chips so far, all costa rican, while only the middle one was so so (highest achievable clock was only 5.38GHz with 1.9V), the rest was crap, especially the week 28 (lot B) which I have now, a total disappointment ... someone will get it on ebay from me







... will feel like a bad santa when I sell it ...


----------



## OcN13

Such a good thread, info, and fun times lol. You guys show how much it is worth it to delid.














One question I have is would it be worth it to use liquid pro/ultra just on ihs>die? I know it has a higher w/mk than what came with my hyper 212+ but how much temp drop do you think it would bring?

Keep up the good work and all of you need to fold.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OcN13*
> 
> Such a good thread, info, and fun times lol. You guys show how much it is worth it to delid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One question I have is would it be worth it to use liquid pro/ultra just on ihs>die? I know it has a higher w/mk than what came with my hyper 212+ but how much temp drop do you think it would bring?
> Keep up the good work and all of you need to fold.


15c over the CM tim.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OcN13*
> 
> Such a good thread, info, and fun times lol. You guys show how much it is worth it to delid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One question I have is would it be worth it to use liquid pro/ultra just on ihs>die? I know it has a higher w/mk than what came with my hyper 212+ but how much temp drop do you think it would bring?
> 
> Keep up the good work and all of you need to fold.


I think delidding is an amazing experience and that alone made it worth it for me. The temp drops are extremely worth it if you are concerned about temps or you don't like how it limits you. I can OC to 5.0 and my temps are only 3C higher than my 4.5.







It's amazingly worth it. If you have friends or people around you that like to build PCs, you can earn some money like me.







I delid for the price of $30 and I guarantee a working chip. I check the chip in front of them in my rig so they don't come back to me when they make a mistake and blame it on me.


----------



## OcN13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 15c over the CM tim.


Seriously?!? That would be amazing. Thanks for the quick reply. Where is the best/cheapest place to buy from?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OcN13*
> 
> Seriously?!? That would be amazing. Thanks for the quick reply. Where is the best/cheapest place to buy from?


You can use Ultra on Die and Ihs..

http://www.buy.com/prod/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-cleaning-kit/228314449.html?listingId=201497992


----------



## OcN13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can use Ultra on Die and Ihs..
> http://www.buy.com/prod/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-cleaning-kit/228314449.html?listingId=201497992


Thanks for the link. Im assuming its safe to order from there







. Also only ihs for me as I have sandy.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OcN13*
> 
> Thanks for the link. Im assuming its safe to order from there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Also only ihs for me as I have sandy.


Wait it is cheaper here.. buy.com shipping is a rip off...

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/coliul.html


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can use Ultra on Die and Ihs..
> http://www.buy.com/prod/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-cleaning-kit/228314449.html?listingId=201497992


http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/coliul.html
@12.99 + $2.99 shipping (used to be $10.99+s/h a month ago)

edit:
sorry Hokies83, posted before reading your reply.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Wait it is cheaper here.. buy.com shipping is a rip off...
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/coliul.html


Maybe put it in the OP..

I just snagged a Tube since i already have LP on the die..

Used my Last on this massive die...


----------



## King4x4

Mind If I joined ?

OCN name: King4x4
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Noctua NH-1
ihs-TIM: Noctua NH-1
Mhz gained: No idea
OC after delid: 5Ghz (Not yet stability tested waiting for new ram)
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Didn't have the balls to test it yet... soon!

Equipment Layout... Yes it's a brand new CPU:


Horror movie!


Delided!


Scratched it:


Booted nicely though!


Max OC... chickened out after that... need to use the CPU a bit


----------



## VonDutch

i dont mind









looks good King4x4, pity you nicked the pcb a bit, glad it still works tho








would be a very nice oc, if you can run it at that vcore.. i needed 1.420V vcore, to make 4.8ghz stable,
4.9 and higher was a big vcore jump for me..


----------



## Valgaur

Good luck you guys at microcenter!!!! wishi could give another 3770k pot luck again. But oh well. Get a good one for me so I can take it! Anyways 4x4 ill add you tomorrow after my RAZER certification.

Have a good night guys!


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Imo Voltage wall is 1.6v and max with good temps is 1.55v.. 1.52 is plenty safe...
> My 24/7 Overclock... http://valid.canardpc.com/2586770


KK all good then.. thought there was talk previously that the limit was 1.52 v max with IB.. thought it was an official response from Intel.. don't quote me on it but i thought i read it somewhere..

Thanks for the reply though..

Cheers


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Mind If I joined ?
> OCN name: King4x4
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> Mhz gained: No idea
> OC after delid: 5Ghz (Not yet stability tested waiting for new ram)
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Didn't have the balls to test it yet... soon!
> Equipment Layout... Yes it's a brand new CPU:
> 
> Horror movie!
> 
> Delided!
> 
> Scratched it:
> 
> Booted nicely though!
> 
> Max OC... chickened out after that... need to use the CPU a bit


you are a lucky man glad it still boots after that nick.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> KK all good then.. thought there was talk previously that the limit was 1.52 v max with IB.. thought it was an official response from Intel.. don't quote me on it but i thought i read it somewhere..
> Thanks for the reply though..
> Cheers


and youre right,
Intel's max svid for 3770k is 1.52V , stated in their data sheets
which is considered to be the max vcore for ivy..
sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html


thats why hokies says, "IMO" 1.6V and 1.55V
i still wouldnt advice going over the 1.52V vcore, for 24/7 oc's that is,
i think most of us wont








the recommended range in sin's guide is 1.3-1.45V vcore, as you can see in his graph..

http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/820#post_18502748
i like DaClownie answer, as response to that post,
quote,
"I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID
from the factory was considered the maximum voltage for the processor.
Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild for consumer usage.
LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum
you should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting."
end quote


----------



## gizmo83

i need 1.30v llc turbo = 1.27v for 4.5ghz stable with my delidded 3770k. temps are 70º on the hottest core. i think that i can lower voltage if i change my corsair vengeange 1.5v cl9 ram with a g.skill. is a good idea? or i must change my cpu with another 3770k?

Inviato dal mio GT-N7000 con Tapatalk 2


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> i need 1.30v llc turbo = 1.27v for 4.5ghz stable with my delidded 3770k. temps are 70º on the hottest core. i think that i can lower voltage if i change my corsair vengeange 1.5v cl9 ram with a g.skill. is a good idea? or i must change my cpu with another 3770k?
> Inviato dal mio GT-N7000 con Tapatalk 2


The RAM won't really effect your CPU and it's overclock. Only unless you're running anything below 1600MHz ram will you find problems with the RAM (I had problems with a set of 1333 that I borrowed off someone). I'd say you either have a bad chip, OR you didn't put the paste on properly/well, 1.3v is alright for 4.5GHz but you shouldn't be getting those temps. I'd say too much thermal paste under the IHS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Mind If I joined ?
> OCN name: King4x4
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> Mhz gained: No idea
> OC after delid: 5Ghz (Not yet stability tested waiting for new ram)
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Didn't have the balls to test it yet... soon!
> Equipment Layout... Yes it's a brand new CPU:
> 
> Horror movie!
> 
> Delided!
> 
> Scratched it:
> 
> Booted nicely though!
> 
> Max OC... chickened out after that... need to use the CPU a bit


Holy crap! You're so lucky it works still!








What sort of voltage did you give it for the 5GHz run?


----------



## King4x4

5ghz on 1.42v.

Tested it for an hour on Prime95 and it was stable.


----------



## guriga

@ SonDa5

ive got a question for you man

Do you measure how much is the height in mm,from motherboard pcb to die?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OcN13*
> 
> Thanks for the link. Im assuming its safe to order from there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Also only ihs for me as I have sandy.


Wait a sec,,, do you have a sandybridge chip? if so, don't do it.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Well, I was tossing up between going full custom WC or not and have decided to stick with my H80 for now, but I have bought an EK mounting kit which I think I can use to mount the H80 directly on the die.

I have also been told that my replacement CL Ultra has been sent out due to my last one being damaged so I shall post pics when they all get here!


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Well, I was tossing up between going full custom WC or not and have decided to stick with my H80 for now, but I have bought an EK mounting kit which I think I can use to mount the H80 directly on the die.
> I have also been told that my replacement CL Ultra has been sent out due to my last one being damaged so I shall post pics when they all get here!


Whenever you think custom, just do it! It's easy, and is worth the money.


----------



## King4x4

My WC loop cost me an arm and a leg but I bought the best parts and could have costed me half of what I paid now.

But to be honest.... it was worth every penny I spent!

CPU [email protected]'C max core
GPUs [email protected]'C
GPU [email protected]'C

I couldn't be happy.... most important thing... NO FAN WHINE!


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> My WC loop cost me an arm and a leg but I bought the best parts and could have costed me half of what I paid now.
> But to be honest.... it was worth every penny I spent!
> CPU [email protected]'C max core
> GPUs [email protected]'C
> GPU [email protected]'C
> I couldn't be happy.... most important thing... NO FAN WHINE!


Sounds about the same as mine, except the GPU hits 55C, AMD and its heat


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Whenever you think custom, just do it! It's easy, and is worth the money.


I've done it before, but at the price it would cost me, I'm not sure I can justify it when I can already run 1.45v on my H80. So realistically I'd be lucky to get anymore than an extra 100MHz out of a custom loop.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I've done it before, but at the price it would cost me, I'm not sure I can justify it when I can already run 1.45v on my H80. So realistically I'd be lucky to get anymore than an extra 100MHz out of a custom loop.


This is IVY though, Any kind of cooling will do almost the same job due to Different TIM, and \space between the DIE and IHS, if HASWELL is soldered i am willing to bet at least a 10C drop from a closed loop system( including A GPU).


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Well, I was tossing up between going full custom WC or not and have decided to stick with my H80 for now, but I have bought an EK mounting kit which I think I can use to mount the H80 directly on the die.
> I have also been told that my replacement CL Ultra has been sent out due to my last one being damaged so I shall post pics when they all get here!


How is a tube of thermal paste "Damaged"?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> How is a tube of thermal paste "Damaged"?


It was missing the needle and had leaked out in the packaging. I'm not sure it was damaged as such... It just never had a needle attached.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Good luck you guys at microcenter!!!! wishi could give another 3770k pot luck again. But oh well. Get a good one for me so I can take it! Anyways 4x4 ill add you tomorrow after my RAZER certification.
> Have a good night guys!


wishing you good luck with the exam








hope youll get it..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It was missing the needle and had leaked out in the packaging. I'm not sure it was damaged as such... It just never had a needle attached.


Haha, that sucks. It's amazing that you can "RMA" it though


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Haha, that sucks. It's amazing that you can "RMA" it though


Actually, it was quite nice of them. All I did was send CL an email with a picture of what happened and they sent one out right away. No questions asked. Definitely the best CS I have had the pleasure to experience!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> 5ghz on 1.42v.
> Tested it for an hour on Prime95 and it was stable.


Do you plan on testing it for longer? 1 hour in prime doesn't prove stability.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Good luck you guys at microcenter!!!! wishi could give another 3770k pot luck again. But oh well. Get a good one for me so I can take it! Anyways 4x4 ill add you tomorrow after my RAZER certification.
> Have a good night guys!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wishing you good luck with the exam
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hope youll get it..
Click to expand...

Yep - what *VonDutch* says - Good luck on the exam *Valgaur*!

...and finger's crossed for you guys buying new chips today!







- I'm going to try to take back the poor 3570K I got to MC today if I can....no fun getting a bad chip again....and not sure I want to try again as every chip I have gotten since the first one I had has been worse....


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep - what *VonDutch* says - Good luck on the exam *Valgaur*!
> ...and finger's crossed for you guys buying new chips today!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I'm going to try to take back the poor 3570K I got to MC today if I can....no fun getting a bad chip again....and not sure I want to try again as every chip I have gotten since the first one I had has been worse....


What speed and volts are you getting? Cus i'm very happy with 4.5 @ 1.32.

Edit: If after i try it out liquid pro and still not able to reach 5ghz, is all fine with me...


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Mind If I joined ?
> OCN name: King4x4
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> Mhz gained: No idea
> OC after delid: 5Ghz (Not yet stability tested waiting for new ram)
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Didn't have the balls to test it yet... soon!
> Equipment Layout... Yes it's a brand new CPU:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Horror movie!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delided!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Scratched it:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Booted nicely though!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Max OC... chickened out after that... need to use the CPU a bit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I'm guessing the reason why your chip works is because you didn't remove a critical amount of copper from the PCB and the area where you nicked it wasn't very sensitive. When I performed my delid I help the PCB up to a bright light and noticed there are traces of circuits everywhere on the PCB, even on the corners.

A nicked CPU and 5GHz, your so very lucky!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Mind If I joined ?
> OCN name: King4x4
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NH-1
> Mhz gained: No idea
> OC after delid: 5Ghz (Not yet stability tested waiting for new ram)
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Didn't have the balls to test it yet... soon!
> Equipment Layout... Yes it's a brand new CPU:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Horror movie!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delided!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Scratched it:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Booted nicely though!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Max OC... chickened out after that... need to use the CPU a bit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm guessing the reason why your chip works is because you didn't remove a critical amount of copper from the PCB and the area where you nicked it wasn't very sensitive. When I performed my delid I help the PCB up to a bright light and noticed there are traces of circuits everywhere on the PCB, even on the corners.
> 
> A nicked CPU and 5GHz, your so very lucky!
Click to expand...

You are lucky dude! I wished my nicked pcb would even run.....much less 5GHz! Good for you!


----------



## Hokies83

*AMD Kills off Big Cores, Kaveri,
Steamroller, and Excavator,
*
http://semiaccurate.com/2012/11/19/amd-kills-off-big-cores-kaveri-steamroller-and-excavator/

Once Again


----------



## JQuantum

I couldn't wait till black friday nor boxing day... so I bought an i5-3570k lol... to be delidded after i get some data on this one and muster some courage to do it with a not so great knife.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I couldn't wait till black friday nor boxing day... so I bought an i5-3570k lol... to be delidded after i get some data on this one and muster some courage to do it with a not so great knife.


Knife??? are you insane?


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Knife??? are you insane?


Someone did it with it, I don't have the razor I used the first time nor do I have time... there's this other one I might use but I'm worried it migh t be too blunt.

--
EDIT: wow didn't really realize that these were going to be 70C at stock lol (on stock cooler though so I guess)...


----------



## OcN13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Wait a sec,,, do you have a sandybridge chip? if so, don't do it.


Yes I do. I should have been more clear. I meant only on top of the ihs for me. Thanks for the concern though.


----------



## Shaldome

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Reading all the post up to here is quite a feat *Shaldome*!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good job, and we hope you learned some good info. If you want to delid later I do not think you will need to reread it all, just go through the info gathered on the 1st post of the thread.
> Hope you can join our community soon!


Thank you.







As I said I hope I do not change my mind again regarding CPU und motherboard. But I think my mind is set on the 3770k now and the decision will last until next week, when my pay check arrives.








As a nice side effect I gather a lot of titbits about other interesting topics like overclocking. Keep up the good work guys and gals!


----------



## King4x4

Update...

My cpu died suddenly!

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OcN13*
> 
> Yes I do. I should have been more clear. I meant only on top of the ihs for me. Thanks for the concern though.


Was about to say. if you delid you got kahunas buddy and won't see hardly any drops. but yeah on the IHS it's good for the w/km
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As I said I hope I do not change my mind again regarding CPU und motherboard. But I think my mind is set on the 3770k now and the decision will last until next week, when my pay check arrives.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As a nice side effect I gather a lot of titbits about other interesting topics like overclocking. Keep up the good work guys and gals!


No Problem! glad you cam to swing by!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Update...
> My cpu died suddenly!
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Your chip or someone elses?


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> and youre right,
> Intel's max svid for 3770k is 1.52V , stated in their data sheets
> which is considered to be the max vcore for ivy..
> sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
> 
> thats why hokies says, "IMO" 1.6V and 1.55V
> i still wouldnt advice going over the 1.52V vcore, for 24/7 oc's that is,
> i think most of us wont
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the recommended range in sin's guide is 1.3-1.45V vcore, as you can see in his graph..
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/820#post_18502748
> i like DaClownie answer, as response to that post,
> quote,
> "I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID
> from the factory was considered the maximum voltage for the processor.
> Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild for consumer usage.
> LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum
> you should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting."
> end quote


Aaaah there we go.. thought i had seen it somewhere .. thanks for clearing that one up VonDutch!

So that brings me back to original Q.. is it possible to get higher Ghz with less Voltage, yet Higher temps...

Does anyone know of any resource for overclocking the BKLC.. Is it straight forward?

Thanks

4x4 sorry to hear it died


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep - what *VonDutch* says - Good luck on the exam *Valgaur*!
> ...and finger's crossed for you guys buying new chips today!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I'm going to try to take back the poor 3570K I got to MC today if I can....no fun getting a bad chip again....and not sure I want to try again as every chip I have gotten since the first one I had has been worse....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What speed and volts are you getting? Cus i'm very happy with 4.5 @ 1.32.
> 
> Edit: If after i try it out liquid pro and still not able to reach 5ghz, is all fine with me...
Click to expand...

The 3570K I tried would do 4.5GHz stable at 1.3v+ and only OC up to 5GHz at 1.52v and no higher. Not good enough as I already have a 3770K that is better than that.

So, I returned the 3570K to MC today, and they still have the $229 deal going on for the 3770K's today and even had three left! Good thing I went before lunch as they were going fast!

I also picked up some new memory to play with - Kingston Hyper X Predator 2133 - hope they OC good, my Crucial Ballistic Tactical 1866 went up to 2133 before I stopped trying....




I will see if this 3770K is delid worthy once I get a chance to install and test it out! Hope I finally get a decent chip, but sadly it has the 322... batch numbers that have not been very good chips so far for me...and I went through all three they had left and they were all the same...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I couldn't wait till black friday nor boxing day... so I bought an i5-3570k lol... to be delidded after i get some data on this one and muster some courage to do it with a not so great knife.
> 
> 
> 
> Knife??? are you insane?
Click to expand...

Please - wait for a razor blade - we do not want you to lose your chip! No need to rush.....

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Update...
> 
> My cpu died suddenly!
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


I am so sad for you. Maybe it is just the IHS touching the nick, or some other small adjustment...hope so.

Look it over to see if you can get it running again and let us know what you find and how it goes....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The 3570K I tried would do 4.5GHz stable at 1.3v+ and only OC up to 5GHz at 1.52v and no higher. Not good enough as I already have a 3770K that is better than that.
> So, I returned the 3570K to MC today, and they still have the $229 deal going on for the 3770K's today and even had three left! Good thing I went before lunch as they were going fast!
> I also picked up some new memory to play with - Kingston Hyper X Predator 2133 - hope they OC good, my Crucial Ballistic Tactical 1866 went up to 2133 before I stopped trying....
> 
> 
> I will see if this 3770K is delid worthy once I get a chance to install and test it out! Hope I finally get a decent chip, but sadly it has the 322... batch numbers that have not been very good chips so far for me...and I went through all three they had left and they were all the same...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please - wait for a razor blade - we do not want you to lose your chip! No need to rush.....
> I am so sad for you. Maybe it is just the IHS touching the nick, or some other small adjustment...hope so.
> Look it over to see if you can get it running again and let us know what you find and how it goes....


for your ram you can go to 1.7 volts for it. Push those things and get tight timings. Then run wprime and show me results im very eager. Good luck on the chip!









Also! ( gots the RAZER job woohoooooooo!!!!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Aaaah there we go.. thought i had seen it somewhere .. thanks for clearing that one up VonDutch!
> 
> So that brings me back to original Q.. is it possible to get higher Ghz with less Voltage, yet Higher temps...
> 
> (


Normally, higher GHz requires more voltage and results in higher temps.

We all want to optimize our voltage settings by trying to find just enough vcore to allow our chips to remain stable at a given OC freq. - Thus, too little vcore and the system is not stable, yet too much vcore is a waste and adds extra temp. Lots of time can be put into trying to find the optimum voltage settings.

As to your question of "is it possible to get higher Ghz with less Voltage, yet Higher temps..." I'd think not likely, and only if the voltage was not yet optimized for the given OC and your cooling system was going bad at the same time! LOL If you lower your vcore and can still get higher OC, then your temps will most likely be the same or going down.

A further note, as a chip runs cooler it can handle more vcore and also obtain even higher OC freqs.

Hope we have answered your questions, and if others have a better answer I'm all ears!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Val! what's up buddy?

Ordered some ram myself...3x2gb ripjaws 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24 (PSC) yummy


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> for your ram you can go to 1.7 volts for it. Push those things and get tight timings. Then run wprime and show me results im very eager. Good luck on the chip!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also! ( gots the RAZER job woohoooooooo!!!!


Great to hear *Valgaur*! Way to go!!!









question to everyone - is it OK to run mem chips beyond 1.65v on a Z77 without any special cooling?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great to hear *Valgaur*! Way to go!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> question to everyone - is it OK to run mem chips beyond 1.65v on a Z77 without any special cooling?


Yeah, you can go all the way up to 1.82v safely on most ram sticks even without heatsinks. Not all ram chips scale past 1.7v (like some Samsung chips, hyk0, hch9 to name a few), and some need cold to go further (like Elpida BBSE/Hypers, up to 2v lol)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Val! what's up buddy?
> Ordered some ram myself...3x2gb ripjaws 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24 (PSC) yummy


I want those ripjaws so badly.... but I had to buy 60 bucks in gas....im broke now.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great to hear *Valgaur*! Way to go!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> question to everyone - is it OK to run mem chips beyond 1.65v on a Z77 without any special cooling?


I know I can't wait to get their stuff and do reviews!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, you can go all the way up to 1.82v safely on most ram sticks even without heatsinks. Not all ram chips scale past 1.7v (like some Samsung chips, hyk0, hch9 to name a few), and some need cold to go further (like Elpida BBSE/Hypers, up to 2v lol)


What he said. He's the ram nut for now


----------



## nijikon5

@ Work right now, but got it done this weekend with my i7 3770k.

Liquid Ultra inside and MX-2 outside.

I was running about Low 60s ( gotta check SSs at home ) before the the Delid @ 4.2ghz.

Seems to be at around 48-53 now after the delid. I'm running a CM 212 so it's a pretty mild cooling setup.

I'll post some Pics when I get home or later this week during the break.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nijikon5*
> 
> @ Work right now, but got it done this weekend with my i7 3770k.
> Liquid Ultra inside and MX-2 outside.
> I was running about Low 60s ( gotta check SSs at home ) before the the Delid @ 4.2ghz.
> Seems to be at around 48-53 now after the delid. I'm running a CM 212 so it's a pretty mild cooling setup.
> I'll post some Pics when I get home or later this week during the break.


Very nice! Congrats on your succesful delid








Now, push it higher than that, you won't see a big gain unless you clock it higher


----------



## King4x4

Well my cpu officially down under.

Got me 5.4ghz before dying..... was well worth the price to see these numbers.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## nijikon5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Very nice! Congrats on your succesful delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, push it higher than that, you won't see a big gain unless you clock it higher


Thanks! I know.. I was a bit lazy and procrastinated. I wanted to push my pre-delid setup to see how far it could go.

Oh well, I only got SS's of it at 4.2 without CPU-Z turned on -_-;

Tried Liquid Ultra out/in but it didnt seem to make good contact with the 212.

Tried LMU in / MX-2 seemed to do pretty good.

Tried MX-2 / MX-2 not as good as #2 or #1.

Went back to LMU in / MX-2 out again and now I'm here.

I think I should be able to get to 4.8ghz pretty stable ( Hoping for high 60s-low 70s, but we'll see ).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Well my cpu officially down under.
> Got me 5.4ghz before dying..... was well worth the price to see these numbers.
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


What vcore did you go up to?? And gratz on t,he score! Did you get a validation?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nijikon5*
> 
> Thanks! I know.. I was a bit lazy and procrastinated. I wanted to push my pre-delid setup to see how far it could go.
> Oh well, I only got SS's of it at 4.2 without CPU-Z turned on -_-;
> Tried Liquid Ultra out/in but it didnt seem to make good contact with the 212.
> Tried LMU in / MX-2 seemed to do pretty good.
> Tried MX-2 / MX-2 not as good as #2 or #1.
> Went back to LMU in / MX-2 out again and now I'm here.
> I think I should be able to get to 4.8ghz pretty stable ( Hoping for high 60s-low 70s, but we'll see ).


Nice!! Keep it going and keep us informed.


----------



## wholeeo

Well, consider me a member now.











That liquid pro stuff was quite a surprise. I wasn't expecting it to behave like mercury.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The 3570K I tried would do 4.5GHz stable at 1.3v+ and only OC up to 5GHz at 1.52v and no higher. Not good enough as I already have a 3770K that is better than that.
> So, I returned the 3570K to MC today, and they still have the $229 deal going on for the 3770K's today and even had three left! Good thing I went before lunch as they were going fast!
> I also picked up some new memory to play with - Kingston Hyper X Predator 2133 - hope they OC good, my Crucial Ballistic Tactical 1866 went up to 2133 before I stopped trying....


Well. if im able to get stable at [email protected] 1.52 after liquid pro and temps are not over 85c, i will be very very happy.


----------



## NamesLucky

Another delidder here! I have to thank this thread for giving guidance (and confidence) to get this done! Unfortunately I did not overclock before the delid, but I did see a 11C drop in loaded temps at stock speeds under Prime95 load. After looking at everything online I figured I would go ahead and delid before even starting to OC. With my custom cooler, my load temps at stock went from 19C to 8C averages on my hottest core. I used Gelid extreme both on die and replaced IHS.
I'm currently in process of OCing CPU, now at 4.9Ghz. I cannot remember voltage setting for my life right now (at work) but I believe it is around 1.3-1.32, but I'm only at 38C max on load so I think I have some more room to go higher. I can only wonder what the temps would of been without delidding, as I've heard at high voltages the stock space/TIM made great coolers ineffective. Again, thank you guys/girls!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Well. if im able to get stable at [email protected] 1.52 after liquid pro and temps are not over 85c, i will be very very happy.


Good luck2 and you should along eith possible lower vcore. Mess with you pll to see if you can get it.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NamesLucky*
> 
> Another delidder here! I have to thank this thread for giving guidance (and confidence) to get this done! Unfortunately I did not overclock before the delid, but I did see a 11C drop in loaded temps at stock speeds under Prime95 load. After looking at everything online I figured I would go ahead and delid before even starting to OC. With my custom cooler, my load temps at stock went from 19C to 8C averages on my hottest core. I used Gelid extreme both on die and replaced IHS.
> I'm currently in process of OCing CPU, now at 4.9Ghz. I cannot remember voltage setting for my life right now (at work) but I believe it is around 1.3-1.32, but I'm only at 38C max on load so I think I have some more room to go higher. I can only wonder what the temps would of been without delidding, as I've heard at high voltages the stock space/TIM made great coolers ineffective. Again, thank you guys/girls!


38c at 100% load? at that voltage? that would be a great temp. when you get a chance please post a screen shot.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great to hear *Valgaur*! Way to go!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> question to everyone - is it OK to run mem chips beyond 1.65v on a Z77 without any special cooling?
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, you can go all the way up to 1.82v safely on most ram sticks even without heatsinks. Not all ram chips scale past 1.7v (like some Samsung chips, hyk0, hch9 to name a few), and some need cold to go further (like Elpida BBSE/Hypers, up to 2v lol)
Click to expand...

So *ivanlabrie*, your are saying that 1.82v is safe - wow, did not think about going that high unless something was cooling something better than normal!

How about vccsa? I was thinking going up to 1.1v, but is 1.2v, or even 1.25v OK on a regular Z77 (sabertooth) without anything special for it too?

Also, anything else I can adjust in Asus BIOS to bring my ram to their highest? And should I run under XMP or manual and do my own timing?

Thanks!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Well my cpu officially down under.
> 
> Got me 5.4ghz before dying..... was well worth the price to see these numbers.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Good to hear about the great OC, but sad about your chip.... Did you get a validation before it died?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NamesLucky*
> 
> Another delidder here! I have to thank this thread for giving guidance (and confidence) to get this done! Unfortunately I did not overclock before the delid, but I did see a 11C drop in loaded temps at stock speeds under Prime95 load. After looking at everything online I figured I would go ahead and delid before even starting to OC. With my custom cooler, my load temps at stock went from 19C to 8C averages on my hottest core. I used Gelid extreme both on die and replaced IHS.
> I'm currently in process of OCing CPU, now at 4.9Ghz. I cannot remember voltage setting for my life right now (at work) but I believe it is around 1.3-1.32, but I'm only at 38C max on load so I think I have some more room to go higher. I can only wonder what the temps would of been without delidding, as I've heard at high voltages the stock space/TIM made great coolers ineffective. Again, thank you guys/girls!


Glad we are here to help OC'ers like you!!!


----------



## NamesLucky

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> 38c at 100% load? at that voltage? that would be a great temp. when you get a chance please post a screen shot.


Will Do! Hope I'm right about my voltage and not too far off, but I am confident about the temp for 4.9Ghz. BTW I have a 8000btu AC chilling my liquid loop.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> So *ivanlabrie*, your are saying that 1.82v is safe - wow, did not think about going that high unless something was cooling something better than normal!
> How about vccsa? I was thinking going up to 1.1v, but is 1.2v, or even 1.25v OK on a regular Z77 (sabertooth) without anything special for it too?
> Also, anything else I can adjust in Asus BIOS to bring my ram to their highest? And should I run under XMP or manual and do my own timing?
> Thanks!
> Good to hear about the great OC, but sad about your chip.... Did you get a validation before it died?
> Glad we are here to help OC'ers like you!!!


1.82v for benching, for 24/7 I wouldn't pass the 1.7v mark for dram voltage.
As for Vccsa/imc volts, be careful, you can degrade your cpu integrated memory controller. I'd say 1.15v to be extra safe.
You don't really need to touch vccsa/imc or vccio/vtt normally, Ivy's imc is top notch!
If your ram settings don't boot or are unstable the cause is most likely a bad sub timing configuration or lack of vdimm/dram.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NamesLucky*
> 
> Will Do! Hope I'm right about my voltage and not too far off, but I am confident about the temp for 4.9Ghz. BTW I have a 8000btu AC chilling my liquid loop.


lol well then, temps are ALOT different for you then.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> So *ivanlabrie*, your are saying that 1.82v is safe - wow, did not think about going that high unless something was cooling something better than normal!
> How about vccsa? I was thinking going up to 1.1v, but is 1.2v, or even 1.25v OK on a regular Z77 (sabertooth) without anything special for it too?
> Also, anything else I can adjust in Asus BIOS to bring my ram to their highest? And should I run under XMP or manual and do my own timing?
> Thanks!
> Good to hear about the great OC, but sad about your chip.... Did you get a validation before it died?
> Glad we are here to help OC'ers like you!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.82v for benching, for 24/7 I wouldn't pass the 1.7v mark for dram voltage.
> As for Vccsa/imc volts, be careful, you can degrade your cpu integrated memory controller. I'd say 1.15v to be extra safe.
> You don't really need to touch vccsa/imc or vccio/vtt normally, Ivy's imc is top notch!
> If your ram settings don't boot or are unstable the cause is most likely a bad sub timing configuration or lack of vdimm/dram.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your help *ivanlabrie* as always!

+Rep


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks for your help *ivanlabrie* as always!
> +Rep


No sweat...Always a pleasure, got to do something with my time while I wait for my MVG.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Val! what's up buddy?
> Ordered some ram myself...3x2gb ripjaws 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24 (PSC) yummy


I have a kit of PSC tridents with the same timings, 2400 9-11-9 1.67V on air. I was binning through the PSC kits I have yesterday & night before, have 2 decent kits (decent for me, sam would spit on them before rejecting. I'd like to get some of his rejects).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I have a kit of PSC tridents with the same timings, 2400 9-11-9 1.67V on air. I was binning through the PSC kits I have yesterday & night before, have 2 decent kits (decent for me, sam would spit on them before rejecting. I'd like to get some of his rejects).


Sam is in another league lol
I'd be happy with 2400mhz cl8...I have a BBSE kit to test, my green samsungs, another 1866 cl9 elpida kit as well as the new 3x2gb kit.
Can't wait to get my MVG


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The 3570K I tried would do 4.5GHz stable at 1.3v+ and only OC up to 5GHz at 1.52v and no higher. Not good enough as I already have a 3770K that is better than that.
> So, I returned the 3570K to MC today, and they still have the $229 deal going on for the 3770K's today and even had three left! Good thing I went before lunch as they were going fast!
> I also picked up some new memory to play with - Kingston Hyper X Predator 2133 - hope they OC good, my Crucial Ballistic Tactical 1866 went up to 2133 before I stopped trying....
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will see if this 3770K is delid worthy once I get a chance to install and test it out! Hope I finally get a decent chip, but sadly it has the 322... batch numbers that have not been very good chips so far for me...and I went through all three they had left and they were all the same...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please - wait for a razor blade - we do not want you to lose your chip! No need to rush.....
> I am so sad for you. Maybe it is just the IHS touching the nick, or some other small adjustment...hope so.
> Look it over to see if you can get it running again and let us know what you find and how it goes....


does MC return (for a refund) policy include an open box?

I just tested my new 3770K and it was batch 3226C (26th week, lot C) and it's same crap, max clock with voltage below 1.52V is still 4.8GHz (1.400v under load), while 4.9GHz calls already for something like 1.56V ... I think I will return it and take my chances again LOL!

ehh, so far 4 chips tried in recent months (all costa rican, batches 3219B, 3224B, 3226C and 3228B), none was really good... only one among them (3224B) could do 5GHz fully stable at something like 1.56V (which is still crap in my book), but that one was ran on a faulty MB ... so it could have been degraded already when I got there, crap crap crap. so annoyed.

***.

wondering what batches other people received from MC recently ... so far production weeks 26 and 28 are stinky ones. not sure what to do ... perhaps I should start selling chips I dislike on ebay as delided ones and make some money while looking for a better batch LOL! I'm pissed off...


----------



## kzim9

As you mention the your bad batches makes me wonder why I never looked to see which batch mine was. I am hoping for 5 GHz club status.

One another note my Cool Labs Pro came today. I am kinda thinking that I don't want to use this and instead get the Ultra. I really don't feel like sanding the die if I ever need to change the TIM.

What are other people thoughts? Is it really just a one shot deal?

I could use it between the H80 as I have already lapped it and the chip......


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> does MC return (for a refund) policy include an open box?
> I just tested my new 3770K and it was batch 3226C (26th week, lot C) and it's same crap, max clock with voltage below 1.52V is still 4.8GHz (1.400v under load), while 4.9GHz calls already for something like 1.56V ... I think I will return it and take my chances again LOL!
> ehh, so far 4 chips tried in recent months (all costa rican, batches 3219B, 3224B, 3226C and 3228B), none was really good... only one among them (3224B) could do 5GHz fully stable at something like 1.56V (which is still crap in my book), but that one was ran on a faulty MB ... so it could have been degraded already when I got there, crap crap crap. so annoyed.
> ***.
> wondering what batches other people received from MC recently ... so far production weeks 26 and 28 are stinky ones. not sure what to do ... perhaps I should start selling chips I dislike on ebay as delided ones and make some money while looking for a better batch LOL! I'm pissed off...


Batches can be a reference but there can be golden or crappy chips with the same batch #. For quick testing, 3770s that can boot 5Ghz & be fine at desktop with 1.3V or less are generally the better ones.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> does MC return (for a refund) policy include an open box?
> I just tested my new 3770K and it was batch 3226C (26th week, lot C) and it's same crap, max clock with voltage below 1.52V is still 4.8GHz (1.400v under load), while 4.9GHz calls already for something like 1.56V ... I think I will return it and take my chances again LOL!
> ehh, so far 4 chips tried in recent months (all costa rican, batches 3219B, 3224B, 3226C and 3228B), none was really good... only one among them (3224B) could do 5GHz fully stable at something like 1.56V (which is still crap in my book), but that one was ran on a faulty MB ... so it could have been degraded already when I got there, crap crap crap. so annoyed.
> ***.
> wondering what batches other people received from MC recently ... so far production weeks 26 and 28 are stinky ones. not sure what to do ... perhaps I should start selling chips I dislike on ebay as delided ones and make some money while looking for a better batch LOL! I'm pissed off...


Woudln't sell on eBay as de-lidded..
To start off with try and return the non-de-lidded ones. If they won't accept them try and sell them on eBay as "As New". That will net you the most profit. (You'll probably get close to 90% of what you bought them for)

Also how do you know what week etc? What would mine be? *L204B588* it's not a great clocker, it needs 1.32v for 4.4GHz and 1.42 for 4.6GHz, 4.7 was stableish at 1.44v from what I remember.

EDIT: At 4.7GHz it'd hit 95c+ quite fast and still BSOD after 10 minutes.. The 4.6GHz run was nice and stable.







I'm considering just selling this at a loss and getting a new 3570k but knowing my luck i'll get a worse chip.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Woudln't sell on eBay as de-lidded..
> To start off with try and return the non-de-lidded ones. If they won't accept them try and sell them on eBay as "As New". That will net you the most profit. (You'll probably get close to 90% of what you bought them for)
> Also how do you know what week etc? What would mine be? *L204B588* it's not a great clocker, it needs 1.32v for 4.4GHz and 1.42 for 4.6GHz, 4.7 was stableish at 1.44v from what I remember.
> EDIT: At 4.7GHz it'd hit 95c+ quite fast and still BSOD after 10 minutes.. The 4.6GHz run was nice and stable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm considering just selling this at a loss and getting a new 3570k but knowing my luck i'll get a worse chip.


Wow that is a really bad chip, mine does 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Batches can be a reference but there can be golden or crappy chips with the same batch #. For quick testing, 3770s that can boot 5Ghz & be fine at desktop with 1.3V or less are generally the better ones.


yeah I agree, but with my luck even if I get a golden batch that chip would still suck ... boot 5GHz with 1.3v? LOL! never had one like that ... I agree that simple test would prove the chip is worthy. I think I will ebay both of my chips (both delided at this point LOL!) and keep shopping ...

wondering if maybe newegg sells better batches than MC ...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Woudln't sell on eBay as de-lidded..
> To start off with try and return the non-de-lidded ones. If they won't accept them try and sell them on eBay as "As New". That will net you the most profit. (You'll probably get close to 90% of what you bought them for)
> Also how do you know what week etc? What would mine be? *L204B588* it's not a great clocker, it needs 1.32v for 4.4GHz and 1.42 for 4.6GHz, 4.7 was stableish at 1.44v from what I remember.
> EDIT: At 4.7GHz it'd hit 95c+ quite fast and still BSOD after 10 minutes.. The 4.6GHz run was nice and stable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm considering just selling this at a loss and getting a new 3570k but knowing my luck i'll get a worse chip.


read the batch as this, first letter is the plant (C is costa rica, L is malay), second digit is year (2=2012), 3rd & 4th digits are production week, next is the lot, etc.
yours is 4th week of 2012, made in malaysia.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Wow that is a really bad chip, mine does 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V...


I didn't think it was that bad.. Most other people's chips do 4.5GHz at 1.30v so I figured 1.32 wasn't so bad for 4.4. I have seen people here with worse chips though.. Some guy had one that needed 1.4v for 4.4GHz and it wouldn't post much past that.. They should bin chips for $20 more as I'd buy that to have a guarantee of a decent chip. Like a 2600k/2700k I guess?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Read the batch as this, first letter is the plant (C is costa rica, L is malay), second digit is year (2=2012), 3rd & 4th digits are production week, next is the lot, etc.
> yours is 4th week of 2012, made in malaysia.


Ah yes, so it was one of the first batches then? No wonder it's so bad








It's the earliest I've seen then, even on the Ivy Bridge owners thread I think I'm one of two-three people with CPU's from L204. Also is Malaysia better/worse then Costa Rica or does it make no difference?

Cheers +Rep


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah I agree, but with my luck even if I get a golden batch that chip would still suck ... boot 5GHz with 1.3v? LOL! never had one like that ... I agree that simple test would prove the chip is worthy. I think I will ebay both of my chips (both delided at this point LOL!) and keep shopping ...
> wondering if maybe newegg sells better batches than MC ...


i got my i5 3570k from newegg . 4.8 @1.26v 24/7

ran this for 8 hrs and then it crashed on me


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> thing is that my way of deliding is that good that even Intel takes them for warranty (shhh), can't tell by looking at them ha ha! that being said I may sell them as used "cool running chips".
> read the batch as this, first letter is the plant (C is costa rica, L is malay), second digit is year (2=2012), 3rd & 4th digits are production week, next is the lot, etc.
> yours is 4th week of 2012, made in malaysia.


my batch # is really different #3233B499 made in costa rica


----------



## NamesLucky

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> 38c at 100% load? at that voltage? that would be a great temp. when you get a chance please post a screen shot.


Just got home, here is that screenshot. It's just at 10min. Hopefully it will be higher than 4.9Ghz by then end of tonight!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I didn't think it was that bad.. Most other people's chips do 4.5GHz at 1.30v so I figured 1.32 wasn't so bad for 4.4. I have seen people here with worse chips though.. Some guy had one that needed 1.4v for 4.4GHz and it wouldn't post much past that.. They should bin chips for $20 more as I'd buy that to have a guarantee of a decent chip. Like a 2600k/2700k I guess?
> Ah yes, so it was one of the first batches then? No wonder it's so bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's the earliest I've seen then, even on the Ivy Bridge owners thread I think I'm one of two-three people with CPU's from L204. Also is Malaysia better/worse then Costa Rica or does it make no difference?
> EDIT: How did you manage to get warranty from Intel after de-lidding?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers +Rep


yeah, I'm just disappointed with my luck, 2 recent chips and same crap ... had a good one though but lost it due to degradation (I believe it was started by my former faulty MB, my luck) ... perhaps I will stay with my chip for now, forget about extreme oc'ing and stick to 4.8Ghz with nice temps daily and be done with it ... for now.

http://www.harborfreight.com/3-oz-rtv-silicone-black-90024.html
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i got my i5 3570k from newegg . 4.8 @1.26v 24/7
> 
> ran this for 8 hrs and then it crashed on me
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I don't believe in Prime. I prefer running a quick Cinebench 11.6 x64 test on CPU which so far proves all other tests I know valid, that's because Cinebench requires much more vcore than IBT does for stability. so when IBT proves something stable, Cinebench might prove unstable in 30 seconds and vice versa when it's stable under Cinebench then it most likely will be stable under IBT and Prime ... YMMV ... just saying what I recently use with great luck.

good chip though!







might go with 3570k eventually if I get bored with 3770K (and my luck with them) ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my batch # is really different #3233B499 made in costa rica


wow, that's is the newest one I've seen, 33th week of 2012, how is it and where did you get it from?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think batches are totally random, from what I've seen so far...no conclusive evidence of a better batch, but rather pure 'silicon lottery'.

I like the idea of gluing the ihs back, might try that in case I need to replace my chip *cough*


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think batches are totally random, from what I've seen so far...no conclusive evidence of a better batch, but rather pure 'silicon lottery'.
> I like the idea of gluing the ihs back, might try that in case I need to replace my chip *cough*


yeah, I am starting to think the same ... found some thread in xtremesystems forums and one of guys had my batch, vastly different from what I have here ...
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280668-Ivy-Bridge-i5-3570K-i7-3770K-batch-and-o-c-results/page20

unless, I no longer know how to overclock ... my chip (3226C) seems to hit a wall at 4.9GHz, tried as high as 1.57V vcore and it still was unstable under Cinebench ...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Not going to quote you feniks.. But wow that is an amazing idea! Might have to try it after a couple of weeks if my de-lidding goes well. Selling them like that on eBay wouldn't technically be illegal as you're advertising a product that's true to what it says. But I'm convinced you're in a grey area


----------



## feniks

editing former posts to keep this thread safe. who was supposed to read, they read already








please, whoever quoted me, remove that quote.


----------



## gbsn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Not going to quote you feniks.. But wow that is an amazing idea! Might have to try it after a couple of weeks if my de-lidding goes well. Selling them like that on eBay wouldn't technically be illegal as you're advertising a product that's true to what it says. But I'm convinced you're in a grey area


Not illegal, as long as he doesn't claim they have full warranty and are new :b


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> editing former posts to keep this thread safe. who was supposed to read, they read already
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> please, whoever quoted me, remove that quote.


Done








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gbsn*
> 
> Not illegal, as long as he doesn't claim they have full warranty and are new :b


Yeah, it'd still be frowned upon. Such as selling a "Working" 8800GT that has been baked, the product is technically "tampered with". I have no reason against it, just mentioning that you might want to be careful in the way that you're wording it.


----------



## Valgaur

Remember guy. batch number and place of make doesn't prove squat about chips at all. it just shows where when and who made it.

This is in relation to the silicone not just the makers. Think of it like snowflakes.

Every single on is different in the crystalline properties. you can't "make" them all perfect. or at least not yet with our silicone technologies. You can only hope that you get a good chip that has good silicone properties and takes the electricity just right. Thats how you get the vcores for your chips guys. It's not the fact that it just wont take it. it's the silicones resistance to it. so the more you pump in the more you "force" the chip basically. but those rare golden chips have the crystals lined up just right and are like hell yeah I'll take the vcore like a boss and love it the entire time and not use any. Thats why you don't go by batch number for reference look at VonDutches, and myself's. 2 different batches. 2 different contries. Darn close to the same crystalline properties.

It's never just that it wont do it. it's just that it doesn't like it is all. The silicone is the key not the PCB the batch the lanes no nothing. it's all in the silly little stone is all.

And that is the real Chip Lottery boys and girls.

Enjoy Ladies and Gents.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, I'm just disappointed with my luck, 2 recent chips and same crap ... had a good one though but lost it due to degradation (I believe it was started by my former faulty MB, my luck) ... perhaps I will stay with my chip for now, forget about extreme oc'ing and stick to 4.8Ghz with nice temps daily and be done with it ... for now.
> http://www.harborfreight.com/3-oz-rtv-silicone-black-90024.html
> [/spoiler]
> I don't believe in Prime. I prefer running a quick Cinebench 11.6 x64 test on CPU which so far proves all other tests I know valid, that's because Cinebench requires much more vcore than IBT does for stability. so when IBT proves something stable, Cinebench might prove unstable in 30 seconds and vice versa when it's stable under Cinebench then it most likely will be stable under IBT and Prime ... YMMV ... just saying what I recently use with great luck.
> good chip though!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> might go with 3570k eventually if I get bored with 3770K (and my luck with them) ...
> wow, that's is the newest one I've seen, 33th week of 2012, how is it and where did you get it from?


i ran this before i tested prime


----------



## JQuantum

Running my i5-3570k at 4.2GHz at stock offset voltages >< 4.3 causes some errors.

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2588192

Currently, idle 40-36-37-40, load gets around 70-77 iirc.

I'm going to pop the top tomorrow after I grab some more thermal paste. Coollabs - IHS - AS5 probably for now on a stock cooler >< lol just gonna check some numbers first before switching coolers.

EDIT: prior while testing 4.2GHz, something caused an error and cpuz read this before everything froze and locked up 

very annoying to have it seem normal and then go on a fritz lol.


----------



## nijikon5

Quick Update:

I tried 4.6ghz first, it actually runs about the same as 4.2 on RealTemp. My 4.2 vcore is set at 1.125. Ran 4.6ghz at 1.25.

Decided to go 5.0ghz and tried it at about 1.45 to start and it seems to have been a bit more stable at 1.48. Temps were about 72-80-80-74 running IBT.

This is all on a CM 212, so it's a pretty mild cooling setup. Ambient temps are about 65F right now. I'll provide screenshots and run some longer tests this weekend.

Big thanks to Valgaur, Von Dutch and all the other De-Lidders who's awesome results made de-lidding just too tempting to resist!


----------



## King4x4

For those asking.

I think that when I scratched the PCB I scratched the memory controller part of it. I couldn't boot with more then 1 stick of ram and dual channel was non-existant.

Get some epic numbers out of that chip thought... oh well one expensive key ring I guess


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember guy. batch number and place of make doesn't prove squat about chips at all. it just shows where when and who made it.
> This is in relation to the silicone not just the makers. Think of it like snowflakes.
> Every single on is different in the crystalline properties. you can't "make" them all perfect. or at least not yet with our silicone technologies. You can only hope that you get a good chip that has good silicone properties and takes the electricity just right. Thats how you get the vcores for your chips guys. It's not the fact that it just wont take it. it's the silicones resistance to it. so the more you pump in the more you "force" the chip basically. but those rare golden chips have the crystals lined up just right and are like hell yeah I'll take the vcore like a boss and love it the entire time and not use any. Thats why you don't go by batch number for reference look at VonDutches, and myself's. 2 different batches. 2 different contries. Darn close to the same crystalline properties.
> It's never just that it wont do it. it's just that it doesn't like it is all. The silicone is the key not the PCB the batch the lanes no nothing. it's all in the silly little stone is all.
> And that is the real Chip Lottery boys and girls.
> Enjoy Ladies and Gents.


I understand now.. But there is the possiblity of a "Bad" batch that hasn't been prepared as well or something? I'm sure there'd be other factors too?

I love the explanation though! Hilarious


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I understand now.. But there is the possiblity of a "Bad" batch that hasn't been prepared as well or something? I'm sure there'd be other factors too?
> I love the explanation though! Hilarious


Bad batch possibly based on the silicone deposit and the refinery they use.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Bad batch possibly based on the silicone deposit and the refinery they use.


Ah yes, I thought there'd be something to factor in a bad overall batch. +Rep for the good explanation too.
I just noticed you're the OP, great source of information and good idea for a "Club". It makes the decision easier and makes it easier to discuss results rather then in the general Ivy Bridge thread.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> For those asking.
> I think that when I scratched the PCB I scratched the memory controller part of it. I couldn't boot with more then 1 stick of ram and dual channel was non-existant.
> Get some epic numbers out of that chip thought... oh well one expensive key ring I guess


Sell it on eBay as just that? Say that it only works with one stick in a single channel..








Someone will buy it for either a keyring or for their parents PC with a single 4GB stick of RAM. That sort of thing would actually be great for my sister with just a 4GB RAM stick.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> For those asking.
> I think that when I scratched the PCB I scratched the memory controller part of it. I couldn't boot with more then 1 stick of ram and dual channel was non-existant.
> Get some epic numbers out of that chip thought... oh well one expensive key ring I guess


i Buy those Key rings


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Ah yes, I thought there'd be something to factor in a bad overall batch. +Rep for the good explanation too.
> I just noticed you're the OP, great source of information and good idea for a "Club". It makes the decision easier and makes it easier to discuss results rather then in the general Ivy Bridge thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sell it on eBay as just that? Say that it only works with one stick in a single channel..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone will buy it for either a keyring or for their parents PC with a single 4GB stick of RAM. That sort of thing would actually be great for my sister with just a 4GB RAM stick.


Exactly gotta know the facts. thats what stinks with computers your at the rocks will not man lol. if it was mans will the guy with the most money could get the World Record chip every time.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i ran this before i tested prime


nice buddy.








just a quick question (since I don't run prime usually unless I need to), have you ever had to raise vcore further on top of what Cinebench run demanded? just curious.


----------



## wholeeo

OCN name: wholeeo
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 100 mhz
OC after delid: 4.8 GHZ
Temp drops: 18-25c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2588266

4. 68C
5. 63C


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> nice buddy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just a quick question (since I don't run prime usually unless I need to), have you ever had to raise vcore further on top of what Cinebench run demanded? just curious.


not sure i really understand your question but i need a higher v core to run prime 95 for 12 +hrs at 5ghz . i can run cina bench @5ghz over and over and not crash at the same settings i used for prime 95 but crashed after 8 hours of testing


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> OCN name: wholeeo
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 100 mhz
> OC after delid: 4.8 GHZ
> Temp drops: 18-25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2588266
> 4. 68C
> 5. 63C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice! Convertible edition! haha I love it!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> i Buy those Key rings


u want mine


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> not sure i really understand your question but i need a higher v core to run prime 95 for 12 +hrs at 5ghz . i can run cina bench @5ghz over and over and not crash at the same settings i used for prime 95 but crashed after 8 hours of testing


ok, gotcha, thanks for confirmation, was just checking something regarding my own stability. I am just trying to minimize the time on stress testing, so I run only quick testers while quickly OC'ing like one chip a day recently LOL. thanks.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> OCN name: wholeeo
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 100 mhz
> OC after delid: 4.8 GHZ
> Temp drops: 18-25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2588266
> 4. 68C
> 5. 63C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Accepted!!









Slappa that Sig Man!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> u want mine


Send me pics







via PM


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> not sure i really understand your question but i need a higher v core to run prime 95 for 12 +hrs at 5ghz . i can run cina bench @5ghz over and over and not crash at the same settings i used for prime 95 but crashed after 8 hours of testing


Explanation time again!

For vcore demands on CPU's you have to take into account the actual work that goes into prime95 runs over time you get some tough runs.

For example take a weight lifter. he lifts 100 Lbs to start then 150 then 200 and so on well on the later ones it get "harder" to do those work loads. so it needs more "energy" of vcore to do that work and if you don't have enough "energy" to do something you either can't do it or your quit midway.

Love my explanations today!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Explanation time again!
> For vcore demands on CPU's you have to take into account the actual work that goes into prime95 runs over time you get some tough runs.
> For example take a weight lifter. he lifts 100 Lbs to start then 150 then 200 and so on well on the later ones it get "harder" to do those work loads. so it needs more "energy" of vcore to do that work and if you don't have enough "energy" to do something you either can't do it or your quit midway.
> Love my explanations today!


Another great explanation for the novice user! +Rep


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The 3570K I tried would do 4.5GHz stable at 1.3v+ and only OC up to 5GHz at 1.52v and no higher. Not good enough as I already have a 3770K that is better than that.
> So, I returned the 3570K to MC today, and they still have the $229 deal going on for the 3770K's today and even had three left! Good thing I went before lunch as they were going fast!
> I also picked up some new memory to play with - Kingston Hyper X Predator 2133 - hope they OC good, my Crucial Ballistic Tactical 1866 went up to 2133 before I stopped trying....
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will see if this 3770K is delid worthy once I get a chance to install and test it out! Hope I finally get a decent chip, but sadly it has the 322... batch numbers that have not been very good chips so far for me...and I went through all three they had left and they were all the same...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please - wait for a razor blade - we do not want you to lose your chip! No need to rush.....
> I am so sad for you. Maybe it is just the IHS touching the nick, or some other small adjustment...hope so.
> Look it over to see if you can get it running again and let us know what you find and how it goes....
> 
> 
> 
> does MC return (for a refund) policy include an open box?
> 
> I just tested my new 3770K and it was batch 3226C (26th week, lot C) and it's same crap, max clock with voltage below 1.52V is still 4.8GHz (1.400v under load), while 4.9GHz calls already for something like 1.56V ... I think I will return it and take my chances again LOL!
> 
> ehh, so far 4 chips tried in recent months (all costa rican, batches 3219B, 3224B, 3226C and 3228B), none was really good... only one among them (3224B) could do 5GHz fully stable at something like 1.56V (which is still crap in my book), but that one was ran on a faulty MB ... so it could have been degraded already when I got there, crap crap crap. so annoyed.
> 
> ***.
> 
> wondering what batches other people received from MC recently ... so far production weeks 26 and 28 are stinky ones. not sure what to do ... perhaps I should start selling chips I dislike on ebay as delided ones and make some money while looking for a better batch LOL! I'm pissed off...
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear about your bad luck today. Yes, MC does take back opened IB's if returned within 15 days. I returned my 3570K today for a full refund.









I then bought a new 3770K for $229 - another 322xxxxx batch (all they had), which was as good as all the other 322xxxxx batch I have bought from MC. That's not too good....









Interesting though is that the IMC on this new 3770K is much better then the IMC on my older delidded 3770K. Even the 3570K I returned today had a better IMC, yet my delidded 3770K can OC to 5.2GHz while the other 3770K and 3570K were only 5-5.1GHz chips.

Found this when bringing my 1866 mem to 2133 on the 3570K, while it will only do 1866 on the delidded 3770K. And then my new 2133 mem can also only do 1866 on my old delidded 3770K while doing the full 2133 on my new 3770K.

So now I have to decide if I want to stay with the delidded 3770K that OC's a bit better, but has a IMC that will not allow mem to go beyond 1866, or delid the newer 3770K so that I can use my 2133 mem sticks, but have lower OC's (and no return of the $229).

I really wanted to have both - higher OC with new 2133 mem - but have to decide - I gues smartest thing would be to return the new 3770K and the new 2133 mem and just stay with the delidded 3770K and the 1866 mem......bummed.......


----------



## VonDutch

4 pages to read up ..man..
gratz Val, for getting the exam








sorry for the chips we lost, hate when it happens,
makes me want to find a safe way to delid even harder..
and wooot to the ones who delidded without killing the chip


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry to hear about your bad luck today. Yes, MC does take back opened IB's if returned within 15 days. I returned my 3570K today for a full refund.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I then bought a new 3770K for $229 - another 322xxxxx batch (all they had), which was as good as all the other 322xxxxx batch I have bought from MC. That's not too good....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting though is that the IMC on this new 3770K is much better then the IMC on my older delidded 3770K. Even the 3570K I returned today had a better IMC, yet my delidded 3770K can OC to 5.2GHz while the other 3770K and 3570K were only 5-5.1GHz chips.
> Found this when bringing my 1866 mem to 2133 on the 3570K, while it will only do 1866 on the delidded 3770K. And then my new 2133 mem can also only do 1866 on my old delidded 3770K while doing the full 2133 on my new 3770K.
> So now I have to decide if I want to stay with the delidded 3770K that OC's a bit better, but has a IMC that will not allow mem to go beyond 1866, or delid the newer 3770K so that I can use my 2133 mem sticks, but have lower OC's (and no return of the $229).
> I really wanted to have both - higher OC with new 2133 mem - but have to decide - I gues smartest thing would be to return the new 3770K and the new 2133 mem and just stay with the delidded 3770K and the 1866 mem......bummed.......


thanks PCW,

I am still thinking on the plan of action for myself ...

could you be more specific about your batches? like first 5 letters? 322x means pretty much "Costa Rica - Year 2012 and production weeks between 20 and 29" - that's a lot of possibilities and at least 1 golden batch in those numbers








also the lot number (usually B or C - 5th digit/letter) also have meaning as they differ, sometimes vastly hehe









anyways, I think I will return my current chip (3226C) to MC in a week, nothing good of it despite promising results at first, can't get stable 4.9GHz <1.52v vcore, even though it's fully stable at 4.8Ghz at 1.40v under load (Cine, IBT) and it can boot 5GHz with 1.40v+

The one I received from Intel (3228B) I could either send back under another overclockers warranty or sell it as is.

Kinda sucks to have two brand new 3770K chips of different batches and none of them can do even 4.9GHz ... sad.

I personally never had a problem with weak IMC, but it could be my memory operating it differently. among all 4 of my 3770K chips I had, I can always run 4 sticks at 2200MHz or 2 sticks at 2400Mhz. my memories were rated at 2000Mhz @ 1.65v though, it's an older type (Mushkin 996990). I am still waiting for some decent memory to show up on the market, preferably something like 2x8GB @ 2400MHz @ 1.50V ... at a decent price


----------



## ChaosAD

@PCW Its hard to believe a 3770K can't run 2133 mem. These have strong IMCs and usually are good up to 2200. Maybe a wrong setting or something? Have you tryed to up VCCSA/VCCIO a little to see if it helps? If i had to choose between higher cpu oc or mem speed, i would go for cpu speed ofc









@Feniks, if you go for speed i would get some 2x4gb 2800+C8 sticks







2400 is too mainstream


----------



## Leyaena

My Coollaboratory Liquid Pro is on the way, delidding my chip this weekend!


----------



## Systemlord

A bit off topic but looks like Haswell will be difficult to delid if they come with TIM instead of solder, those little square resistors that are gathered on the bottom middle are now under the IHS! Definitely take a lot more skill to delid if Intel uses the cheap TIM again, they got zero competition so I'm guess they will.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> @PCW Its hard to believe a 3770K can't run 2133 mem. These have strong IMCs and usually are good up to 2200. Maybe a wrong setting or something? Have you tryed to up VCCSA/VCCIO a little to see if it helps? If i had to choose between higher cpu oc or mem speed, i would go for cpu speed ofc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Feniks, if you go for speed i would get some 2x4gb 2800+C8 sticks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2400 is too mainstream


Ivan is the RAM man here. he knows what he talks about for RAM right Ivan?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> My Coollaboratory Liquid Pro is on the way, delidding my chip this weekend!


NICE! be careful! and Good luck!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> A bit off topic but looks like Haswell will be difficult to delid if they come with TIM instead of solder, those little square resistors that are gathered on the bottom middle are now under the IHS! Definitely take a lot more skill to delid if Intel uses the cheap TIM again, they got zero competition so I'm guess they will.


I'll do it anyways!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> A bit off topic but looks like Haswell will be difficult to delid if they come with TIM instead of solder, those little square resistors that are gathered on the bottom middle are now under the IHS! Definitely take a lot more skill to delid if Intel uses the cheap TIM again, they got zero competition so I'm guess they will.


only pic i could find so far, you mean like this right?

o, it wasnt only the tim intel used, it isnt a bad tim , but also the distance between ihs and die,
that makes the temps go up that high..


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> 
> That liquid pro stuff was quite a surprise. I wasn't expecting it to behave like mercury.


At 4700 and 1.32v i have less than 70w power draw (around 68w if i remember correctly). What vcore do use and you are so hing on power?

@Valguar, I m sorry for my response, i just had an idea and thought i could help.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> let's make a deal, I will keep my fingers crossed for you while you do the same for me


Picked up new 3770k today.

Batch 3226C840 Hope it is worthy of delidding.

What batch number did you get?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> read the batch as this, first letter is the plant (C is costa rica, L is malay), second digit is year (2=2012), 3rd & 4th digits are production week, next is the lot, etc.
> yours is 4th week of 2012, made in malaysia.


Couldn't a single chip from any lot be golden and the rest turds? I think Gold can be found in just about any lot and getting a good over clocking chips is really just luck of finding that particular chip of the lot. I think discrediting an entire batch based on the week of the year isn't a good way to go for finding golden chips.

The chip that I got today was supposed to be a fresh batch from Intel but after reading your explanation on batch numbers it appears my chip was made in the last week of June 2012 in Costa Rica.
Batch 3226C840 I7-3770k

I'm thinking about not even opening it and returning it for the newest batch that was supposed to be shipped to MC today. The Tustin, Orange County MicroCenter WEB site shows that there are no 3770ks in stock. Looks like my local MC is selling old batches right now. I really wanted a new batch from week 45 (1st week of November).

My other theory for picking up a June chip is that Intel has a crap load of chips sitting in storage waiting to be shipped out to vendors.

I also picked up a new i5-3570k which is an even older batch 3222B248.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ivan is the RAM man here. he knows what he talks about for RAM right Ivan?
> NICE! be careful! and Good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll do it anyways!


You should have a pot by then, delidded or not you should get 200 - 300° of headroom before hitting tjmax depending on what you fill the pot with!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Couldn't a single chip from any lot be golden and the rest turds? I think Gold can be found in just about any lot and getting a good over clocking chips is really just luck of finding that particular chip of the lot. I think discrediting an entire batch based on the week of the year isn't a good way to go for finding golden chips.
> The chip that I got today was supposed to be a fresh batch from Intel but after reading your explanation on batch numbers it appears my chip was made in the last week of June 2012 in Costa Rica.
> Batch 3226C840 I7-3770k
> I'm thinking about not even opening it and returning it for the newest batch that was supposed to be shipped to MC today. The Tustin, Orange County MicroCenter WEB site shows that there are no 3770ks in stock. Looks like my local MC is selling old batches right now. I really wanted a new batch from week 45 (1st week of November).
> My other theory for picking up a June chip is that Intel has a crap load of chips sitting in storage waiting to be shipped out to vendors.
> I also picked up a new i5-3570k which is an even older batch 3222B248.


Yes, could be a single golden chip in a batch, or none, or all. Pretty much random, although a couple of batches out there have had a better than average chance of getting a great chip like the 3218C batch for 3770k.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You should have a pot by then, delidded or not you should get 200 - 300° of headroom before hitting tjmax depending on what you fill the pot with!
> Yes, could be a single golden chip in a batch, or none, or all. Pretty much random, although a couple of batches out there have had a better than average chance of getting a great chip like the 3218C batch for 3770k.


Yep, this. Some batches are just better done somehow








That being said, remember that don't de-lid if you're going for sub zero! I read somewhere that it was either killing chips (Moisture on the actual core itself?) or it was netting less results.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Couldn't a single chip from any lot be golden and the rest turds? I think Gold can be found in just about any lot and getting a good over clocking chips is really just luck of finding that particular chip of the lot. I think discrediting an entire batch based on the week of the year isn't a good way to go for finding golden chips.
> The chip that I got today was supposed to be a fresh batch from Intel but after reading your explanation on batch numbers it appears my chip was made in the last week of June 2012 in Costa Rica.
> Batch 3226C840 I7-3770k
> I'm thinking about not even opening it and returning it for the newest batch that was supposed to be shipped to MC today. The Tustin, Orange County MicroCenter WEB site shows that there are no 3770ks in stock. Looks like my local MC is selling old batches right now. I really wanted a new batch from week 45 (1st week of November).
> My other theory for picking up a June chip is that Intel has a crap load of chips sitting in storage waiting to be shipped out to vendors.
> I also picked up a new i5-3570k which is an even older batch 3222B248.


From what I've seen so far.. I'd say your theory of "Intel having stockpiles of older batches" is about right, everyone that has posted their batch #'s from the MC $229 deal has had week/batch #322 or older. (Mostly #322's)

You should try it and if it clocks bad with voltage return it to be honest, you might just happen to have the golden chip of that week.


----------



## kgtuning

Mine is 3128B . I always wondered about batch numbers. Mine does 5ghz at 1.445 volts 24 hour stable. No golden chip but at least it runs decent.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Mine is 3128B . I always wondered about batch numbers. Mine does 5ghz at 1.445 volts 24 hour stable. No golden chip but at least it runs decent.


That would be from 2011???


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yep, this. Some batches are just better done somehow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That being said, remember that don't de-lid if you're going for sub zero! I read somewhere that it was either killing chips (Moisture on the actual core itself?) or it was netting less results.
> From what I've seen so far.. I'd say your theory of "Intel having stockpiles of older batches" is about right, everyone that has posted their batch #'s from the MC $229 deal has had week/batch #322 or older. (Mostly #322's)
> You should try it and if it clocks bad with voltage return it to be honest, you might just happen to have the golden chip of that week.


MC did tell me that they just received a huge shipment early in the day Monday. (yesterday) I was told they are not on the WEB site just yet but will be soon. My guess is there will be a hot deal for Black Friday. I haven't found many newer batches either so Intel could be sitting on a bunch of old chips.

It may be golden. Think I will wait till after Black Friday to see if a better deal pops up. Right now it is sitting nice and snug new in its box.


----------



## kgtuning

Lol sorry 3218B.


----------



## guriga

3570kbarewithLPnFujipolyextremeonPCB.jpg 270k .jpg file
@ SonDa5

ive got a question for you man

Do you measure how much is the height in mm,from motherboard pcb to die?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *guriga*
> 
> 3570kbarewithLPnFujipolyextremeonPCB.jpg 270k .jpg file
> @ SonDa5
> ive got a question for you man
> Do you measure how much is the height in mm,from motherboard pcb to die?


No. No washers or bushings.
With cl liquid pro TIM a light pressure mount is best. The fujipoly thermal pad helps provide support for the die and pcb. Its a gentle msnug mount.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm no expert, if anyything I have a clue but that's about it. Our good friend ftw420 is the man when it comes to ram ocing here, being a more experienced bencher.
Anyhow, I'd venture to say most 3770k's will do 2133 with stock imc/vtt unless using 4 sticks or not having an xmp profile for your ram.
If that's tthe case you have to manually input each and every ram timing cause auto won't cut it.
Sometimes secondary and tertiary timings prevent you from going higher ram wise, you should all check the ocn ram addict thread or ask sam-ocx, he's baws.

Edit: stupid phone


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> @PCW Its hard to believe a 3770K can't run 2133 mem. These have strong IMCs and usually are good up to 2200. Maybe a wrong setting or something? Have you tryed to up VCCSA/VCCIO a little to see if it helps? If i had to choose between higher cpu oc or mem speed, i would go for cpu speed ofc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Feniks, if you go for speed i would get some 2x4gb 2800+C8 sticks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2400 is too mainstream


yeah hehe you're right buddy. but I'd like 16GB, so waiting for 2x8GB kit at 1.50V and something like 2600MHz, however all of them are 1.65V still and 2x8GB at decent speed is still rare or non-existent past 2400MHz even at 1.65V... besides I have no cash for such an upgrade now, so still sticking to my old memory, actually planning to sell one kit (2x4GB Mushkin 996990 2000MHz, can run 2400MHz with 10-12-11-31 @ 1.65V) to recover some money.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Picked up new 3770k today.
> Batch 3226C840 Hope it is worthy of delidding.
> What batch number did you get?


same, near exactly same (mine is 3226C836) and my chip is a weak clocker ... max i can do is 4.8GHz at 1.40v vcore and it won't stabilize 4.9GHz no matter what vcore I try ... went up up to 1.57V and nada. it can boot 5GHz with 1.40v+, which still gives nothing. I will be returning it in a week or so.
hopefully you get a better one than I did.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Couldn't a single chip from any lot be golden and the rest turds? I think Gold can be found in just about any lot and getting a good over clocking chips is really just luck of finding that particular chip of the lot. I think discrediting an entire batch based on the week of the year isn't a good way to go for finding golden chips.
> The chip that I got today was supposed to be a fresh batch from Intel but after reading your explanation on batch numbers it appears my chip was made in the last week of June 2012 in Costa Rica.
> Batch 3226C840 I7-3770k
> I'm thinking about not even opening it and returning it for the newest batch that was supposed to be shipped to MC today. The Tustin, Orange County MicroCenter WEB site shows that there are no 3770ks in stock. Looks like my local MC is selling old batches right now. I really wanted a new batch from week 45 (1st week of November).
> My other theory for picking up a June chip is that Intel has a crap load of chips sitting in storage waiting to be shipped out to vendors.
> I also picked up a new i5-3570k which is an even older batch 3222B248.


yeah, even a golden batch doesn't guarantee a golden chip, it can still be a bad clocker .... it's just it raises the chances high enough to make it worthy hunting for it.
I'm sad because my MC is full stocked (10+) with 3770K chips, so I think I will just return it for a refund and wait another time for some promo over there or take my chances with amazon/newegg...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Lol sorry 3218B.


that is very close to be golden, this batch is praised by many all over the web...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> that is very close to be golden, this batch is praised by many all over the web...


This is the first chip I have ever bought, actually first computer I have ever built. The 1.445 volts is measured with a fluke dmm and not cpuz.


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> At 4700 and 1.32v i have less than 70w power draw (around 68w if i remember correctly). What vcore do use and you are so hing on power?
> @Valguar, I m sorry for my response, i just had an idea and thought i could help.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition/2000_50#post_18613462

All 100% loads are not created equal.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> This is the first chip I have ever bought, actually first computer I have ever built. The 1.445 volts is measured with a fluke dmm and not cpuz.


awesome! grats on that bro, you had a very good luck with it, keep it safe


----------



## VonDutch




----------



## VonDutch

OCZ Vertex 4 128GB

just happy, today i bought my first SSD








i had to laugh so hard, when i installed windows again,
and the fist times i booted...rebooted...rebooted again...LOL

i think ive booted like 20 times, just for fun, its so fast ..wow


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> awesome! grats on that bro, you had a very good luck with it, keep it safe


Yeah I want to keep this setup a while so that is one of the reasons I tested it with a dmm. All the rumors of the fatal1ty mobo showing the wrong voltage finally spooked me... glad I tested it. This is as far as I will push it. I may try 5.1ghz but I think the voltage will be too high. Either way I'm very happy. So glad I stumbled upon this thread when it first started.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> At 4700 and 1.32v i have less than 70w power draw (around 68w if i remember correctly). What vcore do use and you are so hing on power?
> @Valguar, I m sorry for my response, i just had an idea and thought i could help.


No problem man. sorry it sounded snappy!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm no expert, if anyything I have a clue but that's about it. Our good friend ftw420 is the man when it comes to ram ocing here, being a more experienced bencher.
> Anyhow, I'd venture to say most 3770k's will do 2133 with stock imc/vtt unless using 4 sticks or not having an xmp profile for your ram.
> If that's tthe case you have to manually input each and every ram timing cause auto won't cut it.
> Sometimes secondary and tertiary timings prevent you from going higher ram wise, you should all check the ocn ram addict thread or ask sam-ocx, he's baws.
> Edit: stupid phone


Is XMP mode the best or normal mode?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah hehe you're right buddy. but I'd like 16GB, so waiting for 2x8GB kit at 1.50V and something like 2600MHz, however all of them are 1.65V still and 2x8GB at decent speed is still rare or non-existent past 2400MHz even at 1.65V... besides I have no cash for such an upgrade now, so still sticking to my old memory, actually planning to sell one kit (2x4GB Mushkin 996990 2000MHz, can run 2400MHz with 10-12-11-31 @ 1.65V) to recover some money.


Good luck finding those lol. gonna be hard to grab.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition/2000_50#post_18613462
> All 100% loads are not created equal.


^ yup
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> OCZ Vertex 4 128GB
> just happy, today i bought my first SSD
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i had to laugh so hard, when i installed windows again,
> and the fist times i booted...rebooted...rebooted again...LOL
> i think ive booted like 20 times, just for fun, its so fast ..wow


I LOVE my Vertex 4 it's an amazing SSD. crazy read and write times.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah I want to keep this setup a while so that is one of the reasons I tested it with a dmm. All the rumors of the fatal1ty mobo showing the wrong voltage finally spooked me... glad I tested it. This is as far as I will push it. I may try 5.1ghz but I think the voltage will be too high. Either way I'm very happy. So glad I stumbled upon this thread when it first started.


Thats good to hear! and nice on the boot vcore!


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> OCZ Vertex 4 128GB
> just happy, today i bought my first SSD
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i had to laugh so hard, when i installed windows again,
> and the fist times i booted...rebooted...rebooted again...LOL
> i think ive booted like 20 times, just for fun, its so fast ..wow


Just be aware that you'll never want to go back to a mechanical hard drive.









I have a SSD for all of my 8 rigs (plus a few spare). Still need to upgrade my sister's laptop and my parents computer with one.


----------



## kgtuning

Thanks Valgaur!


----------



## Arm3nian

I got my liquid pro today, I will lap my ihs when I get sandpaper later today, is there any rule of thumb when applying pro?
Like how to know if thickness is enough, and ways to apply on die and ihs. My raystorm has lots of pressure options, should I go light pressure? I'm redoing my loop so i dont want to screw up like last time and get unbootable temps.


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Normally, higher GHz requires more voltage and results in higher temps.
> We all want to optimize our voltage settings by trying to find just enough vcore to allow our chips to remain stable at a given OC freq. - Thus, too little vcore and the system is not stable, yet too much vcore is a waste and adds extra temp. Lots of time can be put into trying to find the optimum voltage settings.
> As to your question of "is it possible to get higher Ghz with less Voltage, yet Higher temps..." I'd think not likely, and only if the voltage was not yet optimized for the given OC and your cooling system was going bad at the same time! LOL If you lower your vcore and can still get higher OC, then your temps will most likely be the same or going down.
> A further note, as a chip runs cooler it can handle more vcore and also obtain even higher OC freqs.
> Hope we have answered your questions, and if others have a better answer I'm all ears!


Thanks for the answer it does answer my question good and proper, but with all questions another has arisen..

I am trying to see if it was worth the money i spent on the cooling.. nothing to special, but set me back £150 (ish). Raystorm XSPC kit.. so i can get good temp since the delid.. 60-64c @4.8Ghz 1.36V, but
for 5Ghz is sucks the voltage @1.52V so if the temps are ok is 'theorically' able to handle more vCore.. so if i was to go beyond the so called 1.52V it should be ok..

Can't afford a new chip at the mo.. so not going to try it.. just annoyed with getting the extra cooling before the delidding of the little fella.. as temps would of been fine with previous air cooler..

So If i was to clocker BKLC up to 102- 3mhz would the vCore require more voltage or would it require less?

I have tried to use a ET6 setting then just adjusting the multiplier and setting the voltage to a previous voltage setting when only over clocking the chip.. but all crashes out..

Is best to increase the voltage or would it require less?

sorry if these seem trivial questions.. just new to over clocking..and love how easy it is to get a good overclock with just the multiplier.. but i want to try and push everything









thanks


----------



## ivanlabrie

XMP is a default profile that the board/ram manufacturers make in order to go above the JEDEC standard, which goes up to 1333mhz...Otherwise some kits can't work with auto timings properly (in case your board doesn't have an XMP profile for your particular kit)
Someone else can probably explain it better, but in a nutshell it's something like that...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Thanks Valgaur!


No problem!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I got my liquid pro today, I will lap my ihs when I get sandpaper later today, is there any rule of thumb when applying pro?
> Like how to know if thickness is enough, and ways to apply on die and ihs. My raystorm has lots of pressure options, should I go light pressure? I'm redoing my loop so i dont want to screw up like last time and get unbootable temps.


You won't need much TIM at all really just a little dribble and then spread it out!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I got my liquid pro today, I will lap my ihs when I get sandpaper later today, is there any rule of thumb when applying pro?
> Like how to know if thickness is enough, and ways to apply on die and ihs. My raystorm has lots of pressure options, should I go light pressure? I'm redoing my loop so i dont want to screw up like last time and get unbootable temps.


i applied on the die, thin layer, then put the ihs on, little pressure with hand,
took it off again, to see the dimension of the die on ihs, then i applied another
very thin leyer inside the ihs..
think ive read on their site somewhere, thickness of about a page from a newspaper,
so the 2 layers,on the die, and inside ihs, should both be about half of that









i would go with light pressure first, and see how it does,
if youre not happy with the result , you can always tighten it some more..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> OCZ Vertex 4 128GB
> just happy, today i bought my first SSD
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i had to laugh so hard, when i installed windows again,
> and the fist times i booted...rebooted...rebooted again...LOL
> i think ive booted like 20 times, just for fun, its so fast ..wow


lmao


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> XMP is a default profile that the board/ram manufacturers make in order to go above the JEDEC standard, which goes up to 1333mhz...Otherwise some kits can't work with auto timings properly (in case your board doesn't have an XMP profile for your particular kit)
> Someone else can probably explain it better, but in a nutshell it's something like that...


ivan, whats with the xmp profile setting the timings higher then
what the manufacturer says, mine is rated 9-9-9-24,
profile sets it to, 9-8-8-21,
auto sets it to, 10-10-10-27 or 28 i think..


just did a rerun with my new ssd, and my vid card in cinebench,

a massive 1 fps more ..lol, how is my old 6850 doing compared to your guys







103.88 fps i have..

what do you guys think if my first readings with my new ssd,

do i have to tweak something? i have the latest firmware installed








so far i disabled windows search, i know where to find things ..lol.
disabled indexing C:, disabled windows defragmentation..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ivan, whats with the xmp profile setting the timings higher then
> what the manufacturer says, mine is rated 9-9-9-24,
> profile sets it to, 9-8-8-21,
> auto sets it to, 10-10-10-27 or 28 i think..
> 
> just did a rerun with my new ssd, and my vid card in cinebench,
> 
> a massive 1 fps more ..lol, how is my old 6850 doing compared to your guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 103.88 fps i have..
> what do you guys think if my first readings with my new ssd,
> 
> do i have to tweak something? i have the latest firmware installed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so far i disabled windows search, i know where to find things ..lol.
> disabled indexing C:, disabled windows defragmentation..


That's odd...I'd go with the timings in the sticker for main and the rest as the XMP sets them. Run memtest86+ in a thumbdrive at boot for a few passes. If you get errors tweak some more.
If I were you I'd overclock the hell out of those, but hey, that's me xD


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's odd...I'd go with the timings in the sticker for main and the rest as the XMP sets them. Run memtest86+ in a thumbdrive at boot for a few passes. If you get errors tweak some more.
> If I were you I'd overclock the hell out of those, but hey, that's me xD


if i only knew how, hokies and you told me some things before, 2000mhz maybe possible?
but it crashes very fast if i change anything,
already happy i can do 101blck, so it oc a little,
and run the xmp profile too, the 9-8-8-21 timings are good right?
ram voltage upped from 1.5 to 1.6V


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if i only knew how, hokies and you told me some things before, 2000mhz maybe possible?
> but it crashes very fast if i change anything,
> already happy i can do 101blck, so it oc a little,
> and run the xmp profile too, the 9-8-8-21 timings are good right?
> ram voltage upped from 1.5 to 1.6V


I'd go with 1866mhz cl8-9-8-24 and 1.65v, give that a try.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go with 1866mhz cl8-9-8-24 and 1.65v, give that a try.


I'm getting that RAM btw!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Awesome man! so glad someone got it...it was too good to be true








You're gonna have some fun and a nice boost with your superpi 32m scores


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go with 1866mhz cl8-9-8-24 and 1.65v, give that a try.


1 hard reset, 1 bsod, 1 hang in windows logo,
several tries to get in bios again ...nope ..no go ...LOL

im saving money for 2400/2600mhz ram, and oc that a little
now you know why








i dont have a clue about ram ocing really,
bios puzzles me too, but must say, i never really
looked into it, till i saw you guys talk about ocing ram,
i didnt know i could oc 1600mhz ram, thought the 1600mhz means oced ..lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 1 hard reset, 1 bsod, 1 hang in windows logo,
> several tries to get in bios again ...nope ..no go ...LOL


Easy, go with 9-9-9-24-1T 1.65v 1866mhz


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Easy, go with 9-9-9-24-1T 1.65v 1866mhz


i only have 1800 and then 2000 in my bios, if i set by hand, it jumps to either one,
i just did 9-10-9-24, 1.65V 1800mhz..same ..no go, back to what i had before...lol

edit,
just saw you saying 1T, i have 2T set, makes big difference?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ivan, whats with the xmp profile setting the timings higher then
> what the manufacturer says, mine is rated 9-9-9-24,
> profile sets it to, 9-8-8-21,
> auto sets it to, 10-10-10-27 or 28 i think..
> 
> just did a rerun with my new ssd, and my vid card in cinebench,
> 
> a massive 1 fps more ..lol, how is my old 6850 doing compared to your guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 103.88 fps i have..
> what do you guys think if my first readings with my new ssd,
> 
> do i have to tweak something? i have the latest firmware installed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so far i disabled windows search, i know where to find things ..lol.
> disabled indexing C:, disabled windows defragmentation..


forget about XMP.
go to BIOS (clear CMOS if you can't now), then set memory frequency/speed manually, set timings in DDR configuration to whatever your manufacturer specified and lastly set the VDIMM (DDR voltage) to whatever it's supposed to be. reboot and see.

also in cinebench, why not run the CPU test? that's what I usually run, it's a rendering test on CPU cores, faster memory gives it a little boost, but don't expect miracles hehe.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i only have 1800 and then 2000 in my bios, if i set by hand, it jumps to either one,
> i just did 9-10-9-24, 1.65V 1800mhz..same ..no go, back to what i had before...lol
> edit,
> just saw you saying 1T, i have 2T set, makes big difference?


you may not see all options for memory frequency if memory divider is manually set at 100, other options will require 133, so either keep the divider on auto (100/133) or select the correct one. 1867 falls into 133 divider (same as 2133 does).
1T is usually good up to 2133MHz, above that 2T, but it can depend on sticks too, for now leave the Command Rate on auto and check what it is being set to.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i only have 1800 and then 2000 in my bios, if i set by hand, it jumps to either one,
> i just did 9-10-9-24, 1.65V 1800mhz..same ..no go, back to what i had before...lol
> edit,
> just saw you saying 1T, i have 2T set, makes big difference?


Gigabyte is having some issues with ram overclocking in general with their z77 lineup, from what I've seen/experienced.
So yeah, discard the xmp thing and set timings manually...You're gonna have to fiddle with secondary/tertiary timings to go higher it seems.
Sin has a couple of screenshots of his ram tweakit and bios screens showing all the timings manually set. Use that as a model and go for 2000mhz with his settings and 1.65v dram, and 1.1v vtt / 1.095v imc to see if it gets any better.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> forget about XMP.
> go to BIOS (clear CMOS if you can't now), then set memory frequency/speed manually, set timings in DDR configuration to whatever your manufacturer specified and lastly set the VDIMM (DDR voltage) to whatever it's supposed to be. reboot and see.
> also in cinebench, why not run the CPU test? that's what I usually run, it's a rendering test on CPU cores, faster memory gives it a little boost, but don't expect miracles hehe.


lol, only wanted to see if my vid card score would be higher,
i always use cinebench for first look if a oc is good or not,
if it hangs, closes, or anything, you dont have to look further with other proggies..lol
but saw you mention it elsewhere a few times, so nvm









yea., will look into it again tommz, getting late over here,
thanks for the help again









i know about the little boost, but i see that also as a way of tweaking my comp,
thats why my next step is getting much higher rated ram, and 16gb
make full use of ivy's good imc..
then my new vidcard, think its gonna be the 7950, 3gb card..
think then my build is about ready ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Gigabyte is having some issues with ram overclocking in general with their z77 lineup, from what I've seen/experienced.
> So yeah, discard the xmp thing and set timings manually...You're gonna have to fiddle with secondary/tertiary timings to go higher it seems.
> Sin has a couple of screenshots of his ram tweakit and bios screens showing all the timings manually set. Use that as a model and go for 2000mhz with his settings and 1.65v dram, and 1.1v vtt / 1.095v imc to see if it gets any better.


copied it to text doc, will try more tomorrow


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome man! so glad someone got it...it was too good to be true
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're gonna have some fun and a nice boost with your superpi 32m scores


I can't wait for these bad boys!


----------



## 316320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conquistador SW*
> 
> OCN name: *Conquistador SW*
> CPU: *3770K*
> On-die TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Pro*
> IHS TIM: *MX4*
> Mhz gained: *+100MHz (for now)*
> OC after delid: *I'm at 4.7GHz http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2533967 (higher overclock coming when I have time)*
> Temp drops: *On average dropped ~25C with the hottest core dropping 30C*
> Pictures:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Might I suggest we add that you have to state which TIM you used under the IHS?


What cpu cooler were you using at the time?


----------



## JQuantum

Not gonna submit an official entry for this one yet







but I think this was a success, I nicked the corner though (not even where the glue was, I nicked it kuz my oh-so-unsteady hands hit the corner before the IHS =_= so lame







.

Durr... ignore the mess...

Before I start

Finally off after 40 minutes, easier than the first time but still was trying to be careful, only 2 corners wanted to come off easily the other two I fought to get out









Some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on it, first attempt (not enough was on it, and it wasn't creating a good contact so I had to take it off reapply and scrub the IHS - I probably need to sand it down but I don't ahve a good means to do it easily... well I have a rotary tool with a sanding bit but I'll pass on using that).


After I put it back in, my entire computer went haywire >< guhh... my fault for forgetting to set to default, but more or less it didn't seem to like my RAM at
1.5v - 2133MHz - 10-10-10-27-2T for my Samsung ram (2x4gb)

After trying to get it back to normal (kept booting at 100x48 @ 1.48v no matter what I set it to...), I get the same 4.2GHz (42x100) at similar temps (paste isn't set yet obviously which is why I'm not submitting till it's set in a bit more.

P.S. I think the first time I applyed the tim I didn't set do it right kuz it kept crashing etc. I took it off, wiped it clean, used the gritty steel wool like thingy, and more or less tryed to scrap the IHS down as much as I could and it seemed to have worked ok.

Currently, I'm just testing some new settings but it seems to like my ram at 2133MHz, 10-11-10-1T at 1.375v, cpu it's stable at 4.2GHz and 3.8GHz fine but still needs testing and nothing set in stone yet just posting for now though.

N.B.. the pictures are grainy because I wasn't paying attention and my ISO was set to 6400 +_+ oops, i obviously don't pay attention to photographs...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ivan, whats with the xmp profile setting the timings higher then
> what the manufacturer says, mine is rated 9-9-9-24,
> profile sets it to, 9-8-8-21,
> auto sets it to, 10-10-10-27 or 28 i think..
> 
> just did a rerun with my new ssd, and my vid card in cinebench,
> 
> a massive 1 fps more ..lol, how is my old 6850 doing compared to your guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 103.88 fps i have..
> what do you guys think if my first readings with my new ssd,
> 
> do i have to tweak something? i have the latest firmware installed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so far i disabled windows search, i know where to find things ..lol.
> disabled indexing C:, disabled windows defragmentation..


This, will help a lot. You'll save space and gain performance also. As for the RAM use the BIOS F17a, it's the most stable I've found for my rev 1.0 board and it lets my RAM run at 2000 stable. You might want to add a bit of voltage on the IMC if you're running more then 2 sticks. (I run at 0.975)

Oh and yes, my board likes to try and run the sticks at 11-11-11-30 with 2T and at 1.5v even though it specifically says 1.375..








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Gigabyte is having some issues with ram overclocking in general with their z77 lineup, from what I've seen/experienced.
> So yeah, discard the xmp thing and set timings manually...You're gonna have to fiddle with secondary/tertiary timings to go higher it seems.
> Sin has a couple of screenshots of his ram tweakit and bios screens showing all the timings manually set. Use that as a model and go for 2000mhz with his settings and 1.65v dram, and 1.1v vtt / 1.095v imc to see if it gets any better.


Yeah, Gigabyte are having issues. I recently updated to the beta BIOS F17a and my sticks will now boot at 2000 10-10-10-28 2T at 1.5v. That's for 16GB of the Samsung RAM which I assume the OP has?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Not gonna submit an official entry for this one yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but I think this was a success, I nicked the corner though (not even where the glue was, I nicked it kuz my oh-so-unsteady hands hit the corner before the IHS =_= so lame
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> Durr... ignore the mess...
> 
> Before I start
> 
> Finally off after 40 minutes, easier than the first time but still was trying to be careful, only 2 corners wanted to come off easily the other two I fought to get out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on it, first attempt (not enough was on it, and it wasn't creating a good contact so I had to take it off reapply and scrub the IHS - I probably need to sand it down but I don't ahve a good means to do it easily... well I have a rotary tool with a sanding bit but I'll pass on using that).
> 
> After I put it back in, my entire computer went haywire >< guhh... my fault for forgetting to set to default, but more or less it didn't seem to like my RAM at
> 1.5v - 2133MHz - 10-10-10-27-2T for my Samsung ram (2x4gb)
> After trying to get it back to normal (kept booting at 100x48 @ 1.48v no matter what I set it to...), I get the same 4.2GHz (42x100) at similar temps (paste isn't set yet obviously which is why I'm not submitting till it's set in a bit more.
> P.S. I think the first time I applyed the tim I didn't set do it right kuz it kept crashing etc. I took it off, wiped it clean, used the gritty steel wool like thingy, and more or less tryed to scrap the IHS down as much as I could and it seemed to have worked ok.
> Currently, I'm just testing some new settings but it seems to like my ram at 2133MHz, 10-11-10-1T at 1.375v, cpu it's stable at 4.2GHz and 3.8GHz fine but still needs testing and nothing set in stone yet just posting for now though.
> N.B.. the pictures are grainy because I wasn't paying attention and my ISO was set to 6400 +_+ oops, i obviously don't pay attention to photographs...


Nice.. So you mean to say that the controller seems to have degraded? That nick might have been near/on the controller and degraded it slightly if that's even possible.


----------



## gizmo83

lapping the cpu delidded give any advantage on temps?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Nice.. So you mean to say that the controller seems to have degraded? That nick might have been near/on the controller and degraded it slightly if that's even possible.


He could have cut a crucial circuit, obviously there's more then 1, and now it has less voltage running through to the particular component.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> lapping the cpu delidded give any advantage on temps?


Yes makes the IHS flat to make more contact with the HS giving more heat transfer.

Id test your chip first make sure it works.. because once u lap there is no chance for an RMA.


----------



## 316320

What is an respectable temp drop when delidding?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gregg1494*
> 
> What is an respectable temp drop when delidding?


Using regular tim on the IHS 10 - 15c Using Cool Labs liquid pro / ultra 20 - 30c


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey guys, I was thinking of something we could do to impress the folks here, particularly to help get more 'believers'.

Someone with a decent 5ghz chip should try a passive setup using a big air cooler...that would convince most people that Ivy is an improvement over SB









What do you think?
I guess I could get away with 18hs of prime at 4.7ghz passively with my Silver Arrow, not sure on higher clocks though, haven't run it delidded yet for obvious reasons.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey guys, I was thinking of something we could do to impress the folks here, particularly to help get more 'believers'.
> Someone with a decent 5ghz chip should try a passive setup using a big air cooler...that would convince most people that Ivy is an improvement over SB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you think?
> I guess I could get away with 18hs of prime at 4.7ghz passively with my Silver Arrow, not sure on higher clocks though, haven't run it delidded yet for obvious reasons.


Not worth proving stuff everybody should already know lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Using regular tim on the IHS 10 - 15c Using Cool Labs liquid pro / ultra 20 - 30c


Check the front page as well. The spreadsheet has temp drops for a reason.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey guys, I was thinking of something we could do to impress the folks here, particularly to help get more 'believers'.
> Someone with a decent 5ghz chip should try a passive setup using a big air cooler...that would convince most people that Ivy is an improvement over SB
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you think?
> I guess I could get away with 18hs of prime at 4.7ghz passively with my Silver Arrow, not sure on higher clocks though, haven't run it delidded yet for obvious reasons.


You mean take the fans off and just use it as a giant heatsink huh?? You can give it a go man!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Check the front page as well. The spreadsheet has temp drops for a reason.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You mean take the fans off and just use it as a giant heatsink huh?? You can give it a go man!


Of course I'll give it a go...and Hokies don't be so gay, what's up with that? xD
You aren't up for a challenge?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Of course I'll give it a go...and Hokies don't be so gay, what's up with that? xD
> You aren't up for a challenge?


It has already been proved







no reason to abuse ur chip for no reason.

They only people who think SB is as good as IB or SB Fan Boi's in Denial..

The Amd fan Bois are alot worse tho..


----------



## ivanlabrie

It wouldn't be abusing it, if you use a hefty cooler like said Silver Arrow...


----------



## Arm3nian

Got done lapping to 2000grit and the ihs isnt flat, its actually less flat than before. Also lots of scratches and isnt shiny. Dam this frustrating, deliding was 100x easier


----------



## neopunx

@Hokies83,
Thought you might get a kick out of this. This was published by CustomPC Magazine JAN 2013 Edition pages 40-41. It was in a review of the upcoming FX-8350 series that AMD is launching and it is not getting such great reviews. I loved reading your posts with the fanboys and have them trying to tell you that their 8 cores were better at everything because they had 8. Welll guess what. They were wrong!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> @Hokies83,
> Thought you might get a kick out of this. This was published by CustomPC Magazine JAN 2013 Edition pages 40-41. It was in a review of the upcoming FX-8350 series that AMD is launching and it is not getting such great reviews. I loved reading your posts with the fanboys and have them trying to tell you that their 8 cores were better at everything because they had 8. Welll guess what. They were wrong!


LoL if i was not already on thin Ice for owning the Fan boys i would post that in the 8350/8320 owners club lol..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Got done lapping to 2000grit and the ihs isnt flat, its actually less flat than before. Also lots of scratches and isnt shiny. Dam this frustrating, deliding was 100x easier


You need to keep the IHS on the same spot for a while and let the pores fill with copper dust this makes it smoother as your sand making it flater and even more mirror like.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> @Hokies83,
> Thought you might get a kick out of this. This was published by CustomPC Magazine JAN 2013 Edition pages 40-41. It was in a review of the upcoming FX-8350 series that AMD is launching and it is not getting such great reviews. I loved reading your posts with the fanboys and have them trying to tell you that their 8 cores were better at everything because they had 8. Welll guess what. They were wrong!


okay.....now that's really funny. And holy mother of god the load watts!


----------



## neopunx

You could start you own thread. 1000 and 1 reasons Intel is better than AMD, and have an open forum. So much fun.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> You could start you own thread. 1000 and 1 reasons Intel is better than AMD, and have an open forum. So much fun.


You could almost start your own site...








I think Piledriver is definitely a step forward.. Like look at the power consumption! It would have fared well when Sandy was new but unfortunately for AMD Intel is already onto the Haswell boat.


----------



## FtW 420

My liquid ultra finally got here, looks like the customs guys tried it out though, was at the 1cc line before the first drop came out.

For memory it doesn't hurt to load the XMP profile & see where it sets all the timings, then redo it manually with lower voltages. XMP is made to work with all chips, so if you have the worst IMC ever it should set the voltages close to what it needs, if it isn't the worst IMC it is likely getting more than it needs with xmp.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> He could have cut a crucial circuit, obviously there's more then 1, and now it has less voltage running through to the particular component.


I don't think i cut a circuit but I might be exposing it causing EMI or resonance to screw it up with the higher memory voltage... oh well I don't know for sure yet. It's running right now same speeds with slightly less voltage required for memory (but that probably has to do with the timings I'm using now). My temperature change is non-existent though







I need some sand paper to lower my IHS or it's just the stock cooler being well stock.


----------



## Hokies83

You happen to have the rest of that PC Mag 2013 article?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> My liquid ultra finally got here, looks like the customs guys tried it out though, was at the 1cc line before the first drop came out.
> For memory it doesn't hurt to load the XMP profile & see where it sets all the timings, then redo it manually with lower voltages. XMP is made to work with all chips, so if you have the worst IMC ever it should set the voltages close to what it needs, if it isn't the worst IMC it is likely getting more than it needs with xmp.


That sucks.. I should be ordering a tube of Pro and a Tube of Ultra tomorrow when I get the cash. I'll let you guys know if I lose any.








EDIT: Only because I made $30 in petrol money off people in the past 2-3 days. Which I ended up putting $55 in the tank and now it's on 3/4 almost!








Won't need fuel for a week or two now.

Why do drug dealers have to make us true overclockers lose thermal paste?


----------



## JQuantum

I didn't realize you got so much of the liquid pro relative to how much you need... lol I've used like 3 tiny tiny squeezes of the needle... and that was two applications lol... I wonder what I'll do with my second tube.


----------



## FtW 420

Should have done a test run first, put on the ultra, glued the IHS back on, then discover I went a bit too thin on one side. At least I think so, core 1 running a couple degrees hotter, core 2 about the same as before, cores 3 & 4 running a fair bit cooler at least.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> ...snip...
> 
> So If i was to clocker BKLC up to 102- 3mhz would the vCore require more voltage or would it require less?
> 
> I have tried to use a ET6 setting then just adjusting the multiplier and setting the voltage to a previous voltage setting when only over clocking the chip.. but all crashes out..
> 
> Is best to increase the voltage or would it require less?
> 
> sorry if these seem trivial questions.. just new to over clocking..and love how easy it is to get a good overclock with just the multiplier.. but i want to try and push everything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks


Normally takes me more vcore for when I ramp up the bclk as the overall cpu freq. goes up. Probably why you are crashing too when doing it.


----------



## 316320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Check the front page as well. The spreadsheet has temp drops for a reason.


... I was actually looked at that I guess I just blank stared at it lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Do you actually need to soak the sandpaper before using? Would that make a performance difference. Using 3m wetordry


----------



## 316320

Would delidding be worth it if water cooling?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gregg1494*
> 
> Would delidding be worth it if water cooling?


Yes, it is very worth it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Someone had wanted my batch numbers some pages ago (and this thread does move quickly) LOL

So here they are with some brief info on each:

*1st 3770K* - 3219D383 -> max OC 5.246 @ 1.62v -> stable 4.5 @ 1.248v -> cincebench 4.9 -> no mem OCing
-> died delidding - RIP

*2nd 3770K* - 3220D988 -> max OC 5.252 @ 1.61v -> stable 4.5 @ 1.28v -> cincebench 4.9 -> mem 1866 (and no higher)
-> delidded and using (love those low temps!)

*3rd 3770K* - 3224B035 -> max OC 5.0 @ 1.55v -> stable 4.5 @ 1.288v -> cincebench 4.8 -> mem 1866 to 2200 (highest)
-> returned to MC

*1st 3570K* - 3223B084 -> max OC 5.0 @ 1.55v -> stable 4.5 @ 1.3v -> cincebench 4.8 -> mem 1866 to 2133 (highest)
-> returned to MC

My MC only has 322xxxxx chips these days and I have not liked my luck with them so far - keep hoping for a golden chip! (and would even like a decent one...)

My delidded 3770K I am using has the worst IMC of the lot. Using the same boards and memory's for each cpu I can't get anything to run past 1866 on it.

Even no go for the Hyper X Predator 2133 with vccsa to 1.15v and dram to 1.75v and loosened timings to 13-13-13-36 (when the 2133 XMP was 11-12-11-30 [IIRC] - and the other chips could get them to run at 10-11-10-28 1.6v). These would only run at 1866 too on it.

Also, both the 3570K and the last 3770K could get my 1866 up to 2133 too, but not my current 3770K. Best I can do with it is tighten the timings from 9-9-9-27 2T to 8-9-8-24 1T. But no higher than 1866! Bad IMC I guess.

Last note - I have also tried three MBs - Asus P8Z68-V/Gen3, MSI MPower Z77, and Asus Sabertooth Z77 - all good stable boards - but the best OC'er was the MPower which did have the lowest vcore/OC of the three, but it is still having some teething problems as a new board with new BIOS issues. MPower will be the best of these three MBs for OC'ing once it is stable.


----------



## Systemlord

Wet sanding when lapping your CPU is better than dry sanding IMO, it gives you a slicker surface that acts like lubrication.


----------



## Arm3nian

Do your guys's ihs look different on the 4 corners? Mine seem a bit bent down, could be from pressure of waterblock. The rest of my ihs is perfectly flat, just the corners seem bent down a bit, and also the color is different, light doesn't reflect as much as the middle. I mean i've lapped with 220, 400, 800, 1000, 1500, 2000 for about 2 hours... I think I might go 2500/3000 for the shiny, too many scratches atm and doesn't look as clean as I think I can get it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Do your guys's ihs look different on the 4 corners? Mine seem a bit bent down, could be from pressure of waterblock. The rest of my ihs is perfectly flat, just the corners seem bent down a bit, and also the color is different, light doesn't reflect as much as the middle. I mean i've lapped with 220, 400, 800, 1000, 1500, 2000 for about 2 hours... I think I might go 2500/3000 for the shiny, too many scratches atm and doesn't look as clean as I think I can get it.


like I said. With your 2000 grit paper just move in circles in one spot. keep going even if its red on it. You will be filling the grit spots and then makeing it a finer grit the more you use that area. Which in turn makes it shinier and more mirror like. I did it with my 1000grit paper.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> like I said. With your 2000 grit paper just move in circles in one spot. keep going even if its red on it. You will be filling the grit spots and then makeing it a finer grit the more you use that area. Which in turn makes it shinier and more mirror like. I did it with my 1000grit paper.


Okay thanks I will try that. I know that 1000grit is enough to sand/polish steel so it should be enough for copper as it is softer, I guess the technique was just off


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL if i was not already on thin Ice for owning the Fan boys i would post that in the 8350/8320 owners club lol..


Well cant say anything about x79, extreme will always be extreme. However, the sandy owners give the usual "heat from ivy limits the oc and therefore makes up for the 20% gain, but this club basically prooves ivy cools better than sandy with a delid and good tim.

And amd owners just say their chips dont bottleneck high end gpus and are better at multithreaded tasks, but the reality is they all suck lmao.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well cant say anything about x79, extreme will always be extreme. However, the sandy owners give the usual "heat from ivy limits the oc and therefore makes up for the 20% gain, but this club basically prooves ivy cools better than sandy with a delid and good tim.
> And amd owners just say their chips dont bottleneck high end gpus and are better at multithreaded tasks, but the reality is they all suck lmao.


I have a Phenom II X4 955BE with my 7970, and in Sleeping dogs i saw about a 5fps gain from when i changed to Intel, it's not as bad as people make it out to be.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I have a Phenom II X4 955BE with my 7970, and in Sleeping dogs i saw about a 5fps gain from when i changed to Intel, it's not as bad as people make it out to be.


Sleeping dogs is a horribly optimized game, we went over it 100x in the 690 club, both cpu and gpu. And I also had that exact cpu, and I saw a massive difference. Also, we were referring to mostly bulldozer and piledriver, which most can agree was a train wreck.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Sleeping dogs is a horribly optimized game, we went over it 100x in the 690 club, both cpu and gpu. And I also had that exact cpu, and I saw a massive difference. Also, we were referring to mostly bulldozer and piledriver, which most can agree was a train wreck.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Sleeping dogs is a horribly optimized game, we went over it 100x in the 690 club, both cpu and gpu. And I also had that exact cpu, and I saw a massive difference. Also, we were referring to mostly bulldozer and piledriver, which most can agree was a train wreck.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Sleeping dogs is a horribly optimized game, we went over it 100x in the 690 club, both cpu and gpu. And I also had that exact cpu, and I saw a massive difference. Also, we were referring to mostly bulldozer and piledriver, which most can agree was a train wreck.


Yeah it was a train wreck, but as i stated when Gaming there is not a huge difference in the processor as long as it has the right amount of cores you're fine.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Yeah it was a train wreck, but as i stated when Gaming there is not a huge difference in the processor as long as it has the right amount of cores you're fine.


I think that really depends on the game. And it certainly has nothing to do with the number of cores. Barely any games are multithreaded at all. But I used to have a 1090t with crossfire. While, in some games, it worked perfectly fine, there were plenty of times where it was completely choked by either it's ability to handle multiple GPUs or it's single core performance.

It all depends on the game. While a lot of games will get by just fine on AMD there are some exceptions and a lot of the time you will notice a HUGE difference although often it is from something like 60 FPS to 100 FPS or so and then it's not going to be noticed by the end user anyway.


----------



## Leyaena

Getting a tiny little bit nervous about my upcoming delid, I sure hope I don't mess up my cpu in the process ^^
Just two quick questions:

- I've heard CL Liquid pro is the best TIM to apply under the IHS, and I've got some coming in by the weekend, but how about on top? Is the liquid pro still the top choice there?

- Considering I'll be using the liquid pro, would it be worth it to lap the IHS and my NH-D14, or would that probably not make any real difference temperature-wise?

Thanks!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Getting a tiny little bit nervous about my upcoming delid, I sure hope I don't mess up my cpu in the process ^^
> Just two quick questions:
> - I've heard CL Liquid pro is the best TIM to apply under the IHS, and I've got some coming in by the weekend, but how about on top? Is the liquid pro still the top choice there?
> - Considering I'll be using the liquid pro, would it be worth it to lap the IHS and my NH-D14, or would that probably not make any real difference temperature-wise?
> Thanks!


I use Indigo Xtreme on my IHS. But as long as the tim has high w/mk you will be fine. I would want cl on top as its a pain in the rear to clean off. Requiring sanding (dependent on the person and application size). Don't worry about the D14s butt. It will be about as flat as can be. The IHS is the issue here. So just lap that nice and good. The IHSMs really don't need to be mirror finish a little bit of scratchyness to it makes it better actually. Or atleast it seems that way to me.

Good luck!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I use Indigo Xtreme on my IHS. But as long as the tim has high w/mk you will be fine. I would want cl on top as its a pain in the rear to clean off. Requiring sanding (dependent on the person and application size). Don't worry about the D14s butt. It will be about as flat as can be. The IHS is the issue here. So just lap that nice and good. The IHSMs really don't need to be mirror finish a little bit of scratchyness to it makes it better actually. Or atleast it seems that way to me.
> Good luck!


Although it is a pain to clean, I don't think it's actually necessary since the residue from the Pro is supposed to enhance the surface for other TIMs anyway. But yes, I would say do not use the CL Pro on top unless you are lapped. I made the mistake of using the Ultra, which is thicker, on an unlapped IHS and it gave worse temperatures than stock paste did by 30c or so.


----------



## Leyaena

Okay, I've got some leftover Noctua NT-H1 I could use on top, sounds like I'm best off using that one then, right?
I might just end up lapping my IHS, sure it's a bit of extra work, but I'm sure it wouldn't hurt my temperatures.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Okay, I've got some leftover Noctua NT-H1 I could use on top, sounds like I'm best off using that one then, right?
> I might just end up lapping my IHS, sure it's a bit of extra work, but I'm sure it wouldn't hurt my temperatures.


Plus, if you lap it then you can use CL Pro. It might not get you more than maybe a couple of degrees, but every bit helps! Also, if you by any chance have a horizontally mounted motherboard you could go direct-die mount if you're feeling brave!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I use Indigo Xtreme on my IHS. But as long as the tim has high w/mk you will be fine. I would want cl on top as its a pain in the rear to clean off. Requiring sanding (dependent on the person and application size). Don't worry about the D14s butt. It will be about as flat as can be. The IHS is the issue here. So just lap that nice and good. The IHSMs really don't need to be mirror finish a little bit of scratchyness to it makes it better actually. Or atleast it seems that way to me.
> Good luck!


Hey did we ever figure out if the inside of the IHS should be lapped? Of course you'd have to sand down the lip around the outside then lap it. But wonder has anyone of us done that?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I would ensure everything works fine after delidding.before lapping anything...just in case


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Okay, I've got some leftover Noctua NT-H1 I could use on top, sounds like I'm best off using that one then, right?
> I might just end up lapping my IHS, sure it's a bit of extra work, but I'm sure it wouldn't hurt my temperatures.
> 
> 
> 
> Plus, if you lap it then you can use CL Pro. It might not get you more than maybe a couple of degrees, but every bit helps! Also, if you by any chance have a horizontally mounted motherboard you could go direct-die mount if you're feeling brave!
Click to expand...

How much lapping will help depends on your IHS and to what extent it is concave or convex. Many IHS are not flat so it is often a good idea to lap - at least 1-3C better even if flat, and 10-12C better if it was not flat. I'd recommend lapping.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I use Indigo Xtreme on my IHS. But as long as the tim has high w/mk you will be fine. I would want cl on top as its a pain in the rear to clean off. Requiring sanding (dependent on the person and application size). Don't worry about the D14s butt. It will be about as flat as can be. The IHS is the issue here. So just lap that nice and good. The IHSMs really don't need to be mirror finish a little bit of scratchyness to it makes it better actually. Or atleast it seems that way to me.
> Good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey did we ever figure out if the inside of the IHS should be lapped? Of course you'd have to sand down the lip around the outside then lap it. But wonder has anyone of us done that?
Click to expand...

You are right *kgtuning*, it is tough to lap the inside of the IHS becaue of the lip, but I did my best anyways as I knew mine was convex after I found out the top was concave! It seems to have helped my system temps. I think it would mainly be good to do for those in the same situation.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I would ensure everything works fine after delidding.before lapping anything...just in case


A very good idea *ivanlabrie*, although it may end up with him needing to redo cooling mounts. Safer though. But, if you just delid and see what your temps are and see if they are sufficiantly lower, then you are good - and if not, then lap and remount and retest and see how much better the temps are from lapping.

That's what I did so that I now know that lapping added 10-12C better temps for my IHS and system then just delidding alone.


----------



## Leyaena

Very helpful info, all of you, thanks!
I think you all deserve a +rep


----------



## kgtuning

@ PCWargamer... If I get a chance this weekend I'll sand the lip off the IHS and lap the underside of the IHS.... oh wait, I have the IHS from a celeron cpu... maybe I sand and lap that and use that. hmm.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> @ PCWargamer... If I get a chance this weekend I'll sand the lip off the IHS and lap the underside of the IHS.... oh wait, I have the IHS from a celeron cpu... maybe I sand and lap that and use that. hmm.


Sounds like a good idea *kgtuning*!







Let us know how it works - maybe even some before and after temps with IBT @ 4.5GHz so we can give better recommendations to those who ask in the future!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sounds like a good idea *kgtuning*!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let us know how it works - maybe even some before and after temps with IBT @ 4.5GHz so we can give better recommendations to those who ask in the future!


4.5 in IBT with before and after temps. you got it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> @ PCWargamer... If I get a chance this weekend I'll sand the lip off the IHS and lap the underside of the IHS.... oh wait, I have the IHS from a celeron cpu... maybe I sand and lap that and use that. hmm.


That's some out of the box thinking! great idea...I have 2 Pentium 4 IHS' to lap and use on my 3770k, whilst keeping my serial number intact humph


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's some out of the box thinking! great idea...I have 2 Pentium 4 IHS' to lap and use on my 3770k, whilst keeping my serial number intact humph


Well I'm assuming the IHS are very similar. when I pull my 3770k's IHS off to lap the inside I'll compare the two of them. if you were to sand down the lip I bet they are just about identical.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll sand down the lip on the p4 ihs and lap it to mirror finish on both sides xD
I have plenty of time to wait for my MVG to get here (like 2 weeks)


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll sand down the lip on the p4 ihs and lap it to mirror finish on both sides xD
> I have plenty of time to wait for my MVG to get here (like 2 weeks)


hopefully it will yield 1-3 celcius, that would be awesome.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll do it for the heck of it...not gonna loose my only possibility of replacing the chip in case it dies.


----------



## JQuantum

sighs, i wanna go to home hardware and grab some sand paper... yet I dont' want to leave the house +_+ lol.

laziness oh how I loathe thee.. sighs.


----------



## ChaosAD

Tested with lower vcore, didnt want to torture my chip more, now back to folding








Check the power draw, 1720w







Normal power draw under linx is 90w and under boinc is 71w.



Edit: I checked Event viewer and i had some whea errors, but stable other than that.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Tested with lower vcore, didnt want to torture my chip more, now back to folding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Check the power draw, 1720w
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Normal power draw under linx is 90w and under boinc is 71w.
> Edit: I checked Event viewer and i had some whea errors, but stable other than that.


But those whea erros dont corrupt windows?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not likely...ram caused instability does corrupt the OS and pretty fast.
WHEA just slows down stuff, by recalculating stuff.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not likely...ram caused instability does corrupt the OS and pretty fast.
> WHEA just slows down stuff, by recalculating stuff.


really?? so i should be able to get my OC volts down a bit.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Depends on your preference really, but I don't like random crashes.








After succesfully running prime95 blend with 90% of your ram for 18hs straight I suggest testing with games and applications that you use regularly.
Not every load is the same, and sometimes lighter loads can make your rig crash.


----------



## JQuantum

You know you are doing it wrong when... after taking some sand paper to the ihs and reapplying the Coollaboratory Pro and your temps are higher than before







I'm a failure... sighs.

I think that's the extent of stock cooling lol... if stock don't bother with this. Gonna grab an h100i/h80i this Friday and and probably grab some screws and nuts to custom mount it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good call..you can test the h100i for us too xD
Curious to see how it performs.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know you are doing it wrong when... after taking some sand paper to the ihs and reapplying the Coollaboratory Pro and your temps are higher than before
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a failure... sighs.
> I think that's the extent of stock cooling lol... if stock don't bother with this. Gonna grab an h100i/h80i this Friday and and probably grab some screws and nuts to custom mount it.


It's quite possible that the stock cooler is convex to accommodate the concave IHS so you may have done nothing wrong. Just wait until you get a real cooler to judge.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good call..you can test the h100i for us too xD
> Curious to see how it performs.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It's quite possible that the stock cooler is convex to accommodate the concave IHS so you may have done nothing wrong. Just wait until you get a real cooler to judge.


Lol I just hope I didn't break it in my inpatients. Friday come faster... If either the H80i or 100i aren't on sale I'll be moderately upset lol... My only reasoning in choosing them over the older models is the corsair link being built in and thicker tubes.







but after a few weeks I'll be cutting them open anyways


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Lol I just hope I didn't break it in my inpatients. Friday come faster... If either the H80i or 100i aren't on sale I'll be moderately upset lol... My only reasoning in choosing them over the older models is the corsair link being built in and thicker tubes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but after a few weeks I'll be cutting them open anyways


What will you be cutting open??
I think the link built in should have been there in the first place, like Antec kuhlers...


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> What will you be cutting open??
> I think the link built in should have been there in the first place, like Antec kuhlers...


The tubes in the cooler. the block is goign to be used for something







I don't think the Antec 620's have them though which is the only antec version I have.

i missed out kuz I bought 2 H40's and 1 620 for my build a few days before the h100i was announced


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Hey did we ever figure out if the inside of the IHS should be lapped? Of course you'd have to sand down the lip around the outside then lap it. But wonder has anyone of us done that?


Honestly I think if you take the lip right off....that will be bad. All that pressure will be right on the die. You gotta take it easy guys. You have one IHS..... that's it!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> sighs, i wanna go to home hardware and grab some sand paper... yet I dont' want to leave the house +_+ lol.
> laziness oh how I loathe thee.. sighs.


Ohh thiy laziness why you make it so easy!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> What will you be cutting open??
> I think the link built in should have been there in the first place, like Antec kuhlers...


I think the hoses? No idea lol


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Honestly I think if you take the lip right off....that will be bad. All that pressure will be right on the die. You gotta take it easy guys. You have one IHS..... that's it!


This is what I think too. If you take the lip off you may as well run it direct die since I can't see the risk being much, if any, different and you'd get better temps with direct contact!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm not so sure about that, cause the ihs can spin freely on the die with the lip there.


----------



## feniks

what's the point of taking the lip off and lapping the whole IHS if the lip doesn't normally sit directly on the PCB ... (you can spin it on the die if glue is removed) ... either lap the IHS and keep it there or remove it altogether running cooling block directly on the die and don't bother removing the lip! just my 2 cents


----------



## Valgaur

Remember the pcb bends a bit guys. So if the lip is their it WILL touch the pcb due to the pressure providing The best best contact. With no contact on the pcb it will put all pressure on the die. Sonda took lots of time to get his pressure just right on his die.


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835104015

Mysterious cheap fans...


----------



## 316320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> what's the point of taking the lip off and lapping the whole IHS if the lip doesn't normally sit directly on the PCB ... (you can spin it on the die if glue is removed) ... either lap the IHS and keep it there or remove it altogether running cooling block directly on the die and don't bother removing the lip! just my 2 cents


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember the pcb bends a bit guys. So if the lip is their it WILL touch the pcb due to the pressure providing The best best contact. With no contact on the pcb it will put all pressure on the die. Sonda took lots of time to get his pressure just right on his die.


Was thinking that too, looks like a got my answer


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gregg1494*
> 
> Was thinking that too, looks like a got my answer


No problem. Its what we are here for!


----------



## ivanlabrie

No interest in 100cfm 2500rpm fans?







come on!

EDIT: grab some of these then...220cfm and massive static pressure!

Nidec Beta-v (same oem of the Gentle Typhoons)


----------



## wholeeo

How risky would direct to die be?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> How risky would direct to die be?


It's risky, i wouldn't do it. YOu need to take of the CPU latch to do it, the CPU is free and not held down when direct-die.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> How risky would direct to die be?


No worry about the die... its the mobos pins is the caution.


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> It's risky, i wouldn't do it. *YOu need to take of the CPU latch to do it,* the CPU is free and not held down when direct-die.


Nevermind then,









What method is everyone using for applying liquid pro? I'd really like to figure out the best way to apply it if I ever have to change something. I spread a thin layer over the die with my finger wearing a nitrile glove. I'm assuming the rice grain method is impossible with this paste being that it behaves like mercury.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> Nevermind then,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What method is everyone using for applying liquid pro? I'd really like to figure out the best way to apply it if I ever have to change something. I spread a thin layer over the die with my finger wearing a nitrile glove. I'm assuming the rice grain method is impossible with this paste being that it behaves like mercury.


It comes with q tips to spread it with.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Honestly I think if you take the lip right off....that will be bad. All that pressure will be right on the die. You gotta take it easy guys. You have one IHS..... that's it!
> Ohh thiy laziness why you make it so easy!
> I think the hoses? No idea lol


I have two IHS....no worries. The reason to take the lip off would be to lap the inside of the IHS.


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It comes with q tips to spread it with.


I didn't use em due to the potential of cotton fibers coming off the qtip and mixing into the paste. I'm glad to see you're supposed to manually spread it though.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> I didn't use em due to the potential of cotton fibers coming off the qtip and mixing into the paste. I'm glad to see you're supposed to manually spread it though.


I used toilet paper >.> 4 attempts.... the cleaning solution is just rubbing alcohol as well. When I applied it the third time it was really fail... it was stuck for some reason and suddenly squirted a bunch of it out all over the CPU PCB . Wetted my toilet paper with rubbing alcohol and wiped it off clean... then it dripped onto my pants +_+ ... fail... I was more concerned about the pcb for the most part though.

I found I got the best layer when I spread the liquid pro and then dabbed it to create a layer across the entire surface otherwise it'd clump up again using toliet paper there was no sigificant removal of fibers because the liquid pro doesn't like sticking to the toilet paper either (cottonelle 2ply if interested ...) it also worked to clean off any overflow liquid pro.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I used toilet paper >.> 4 attempts.... the cleaning solution is just rubbing alcohol as well. When I applied it the third time it was really fail... it was stuck for some reason and suddenly squirted a bunch of it out all over the CPU PCB . Wetted my toilet paper with rubbing alcohol and wiped it off clean... then it dripped onto my pants +_+ ... fail... I was more concerned about the pcb for the most part though.
> I found I got the best layer when I spread the liquid pro and then dabbed it to create a layer across the entire surface otherwise it'd clump up again using toliet paper there was no sigificant removal of fibers because the liquid pro doesn't like sticking to the toilet paper either (cottonelle 2ply if interested ...) it also worked to clean off any overflow liquid pro.


Why the hell would use you toilet paper LOL


----------



## Arm3nian

Got done sanding, looks like ****. Lots of scratches and corners are still bent down, if I don't get normal temps with pro I'm not even gonna bother with it anymore and just go mx-4, not worth 3 weeks without a comp.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Got done sanding, looks like ****. Lots of scratches and corners are still bent down, if I don't get normal temps with pro I'm not even gonna bother with it anymore and just go mx-4, not worth 3 weeks without a comp.


What grit did you go to?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Honestly I think if you take the lip right off....that will be bad. All that pressure will be right on the die. You gotta take it easy guys. You have one IHS..... that's it!
> Ohh thiy laziness why you make it so easy!
> I think the hoses? No idea lol


Any News with Dwood and side door?

Valguar Valguar hes our man if he can't do it nobody can!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> What grit did you go to?


2000. At like an 87degree angle its a dam mirror, but straight at it omg so many scratches.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Why the hell would use you toilet paper LOL


I figured Q-tips -> Cotton tips -> cotton balls -> cotton -> cottonelle... well close enough.

Like I said laziness. I used all 3 of the q-tips they gave you and i already threw away the first two from yesterday... with lack of motivation to get more and an urgancy to get the liquid pro off the PCB ASAP I grabbed some toilet paper. I assume kleenex would be the same but with my allergies being really bad the past 3 days I have tons in stock since it's cheaper than a box of tissues.

And hey it worked better than the q-tips they gave which left furries everywhere.

The only thing I hate about this liquid pro stuff is that when you go to take it off, it feels/sounds like nails on a chalk board to me and if you aren't careful you'll scratch the top of the die.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I figured Q-tips -> Cotton tips -> cotton balls -> cotton -> cottonelle... well close enough.


Lmao, looks good on paper, but ultra was so picky that it made my computer unusable. I can't even imagine pro, which is why i'm going through sanding the ihs to make it work.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Lmao, looks good on paper, but ultra was so picky that it made my computer unusable. I can't even imagine pro, which is why i'm going through sanding the ihs to make it work.


I actually realized sanding my IHS lip did absolutely nothing... it officially starts spinning now =_+... however, I sanded the inside where the die will make contant with 600 grit sand paper lol (the max I could find in 1 sheet) and on the top. Not a mirror finish but it's not too bad. Still no difference in temps for me but that again I'm blaming the stock cooler.

The only thing to note is that I know there is pressure and contact on the IHS and die (since it spins it must be on it) I don't know how even it is...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I actually realized sanding my IHS lip did absolutely nothing... it officially starts spinning now =_+... however, I sanded the inside where the die will make contant with 600 grit sand paper lol (the max I could find in 1 sheet) and on the top. Not a mirror finish but it's not too bad. Still no difference in temps for me but that again I'm blaming the stock cooler.
> The only thing to note is that I know there is pressure and contact on the IHS and die (since it spins it must be on it) I don't know how even it is...


I'm not even worried about that. What I'm worried about is actually mounting my raystorm, I still don't understand why someone hasn't made an easy way to mount it to the mobo, I have to get it perfect w/o moving it a millimeter to get good results.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I actually realized sanding my IHS lip did absolutely nothing... it officially starts spinning now =_+... however, I sanded the inside where the die will make contant with 600 grit sand paper lol (the max I could find in 1 sheet) and on the top. Not a mirror finish but it's not too bad. Still no difference in temps for me but that again I'm blaming the stock cooler.
> The only thing to note is that I know there is pressure and contact on the IHS and die (since it spins it must be on it) I don't know how even it is...


Just out of curiosity, did you use a piece of glass as your flat surface?


----------



## lilchronic

ok so im waiting for my cl liguid ultra and i dont think i can drop my temps 20c from what there at now and i still dont no if i want to delid mine yet. but then i look at all the ppl that did and there results and im like ***.
anyway these are my temps now @4.8ghz with 1.265v 12hrs of prime

now this is what i imagine my temps could be if i delid and use liquid ultra
50c 57c 53c 48c

it just cant be.lolz


----------



## kgtuning

If you don't try it you won't know. Lol







. I'm at 1.445 volts 5ghz and my temps are pretty close to yours.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> If you don't try it you won't know. Lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I'm at 1.445 volts 5ghz and my temps are pretty close to yours.


the thing is i tried already and failed horribly


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the thing is i tried already and failed horribly


Understandable. Its a lot of money to be risking.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok so im waiting for my cl liguid ultra and i dont think i can drop my temps 20c from what there at now and i still dont no if i want to delid mine yet. but then i look at all the ppl that did and there results and im like ***.
> anyway these are my temps now @4.8ghz with 1.265v 12hrs of prime
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now this is what i imagine my temps could be if i delid and use liquid ultra
> 50c 57c 53c 48c
> it just cant be.lolz


it wouldnt surprise me if temps would go down by that much, after delid,
even if you only use 15C temp drop, it still would be nice..

but looking at your oc, and the temps/vcore you have now, i prolly wouldnt delid..
except if you want to go higher with your oc of course, but 4.9ghz and above,
most of the time means a big jump in vcore, and temps..
again, nice oc, temp and vcore wise


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Any News with Dwood and side door?
> Valguar Valguar hes our man if he can't do it nobody can!


He has the panel and is messing with it now lol. just gotta wait there slick!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I actually realized sanding my IHS lip did absolutely nothing... it officially starts spinning now =_+... however, I sanded the inside where the die will make contant with 600 grit sand paper lol (the max I could find in 1 sheet) and on the top. Not a mirror finish but it's not too bad. Still no difference in temps for me but that again I'm blaming the stock cooler.
> The only thing to note is that I know there is pressure and contact on the IHS and die (since it spins it must be on it) I don't know how even it is...


Please..... lose the stock cooler. please for yourself and your CPU get an aftermarket one.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just out of curiosity, did you use a piece of glass as your flat surface?


^ Yeah.... I originally dipped my corners as well and found it was my surface. moved to a flat one and much better results.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok so im waiting for my cl liguid ultra and i dont think i can drop my temps 20c from what there at now and i still dont no if i want to delid mine yet. but then i look at all the ppl that did and there results and im like ***.
> anyway these are my temps now @4.8ghz with 1.265v 12hrs of prime
> 
> now this is what i imagine my temps could be if i delid and use liquid ultra
> 50c 57c 53c 48c
> it just cant be.lolz


It's a matter of your own wants. we can't persuade you. it's your own mental battle is all. We can only provide information








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Understandable. Its a lot of money to be risking.


The risk is worth it, but only if you are ready for it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it wouldnt surprise me if temps would go down by that much, after delid,
> even if you only use 15C temp drop, it still would be nice..
> but looking at your oc, and the temps/vcore you have now, i prolly wouldnt delid..
> except if you want to go higher with your oc of course, but 4.9ghz and above,
> most of the time means a big jump in vcore, and temps..
> again, nice oc, temp and vcore wise


ive been tryn to get 5ghz but i cant. im so close thou my temps get to hot and vcore to high around 1 .375v and temps 90c 95c. im eventually going to do it with cl liquid ultra sitting on my desk for a couple weeks lookin at me. lol
Quote:


> i prolly wouldnt delid..


lmao u got the ihs spinning on the die


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive been tryn to get 5ghz but i cant. im so close thou my temps get to hot and vcore to high around 1 .375v and temps 90c 95c. im eventually going to do it with cl liquid ultra sitting on my desk for a couple weeks lookin at me. lol
> lmao u got the ihs spinning on the die


That's how Von teases others lol.

I cant wait for my CAS 7 RAM!!!!!!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive been tryn to get 5ghz but i cant. im so close thou my temps get to hot and vcore to high around 1 .375v and temps 90c 95c. im eventually going to do it with cl liquid ultra sitting on my desk for a couple weeks lookin at me. lol
> lmao u got the ihs spinning on the die


thats when you run prime, custom, 80/90% ram used right?
if you dont do folding, or something similar, youll prolly never see those temps,
run AIDA64, cinebench, play some games(bf3), use comp as normal,
keep a eye on whea errors in event viewer, could be a indication if youre stable or not,
just to name a few things to see if 5.0ghz is stable or not, without running into the high temps prime gives you,
even then, running prime 12/18/24H with temps hitting 90-95C with peaks, no problem..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's how Von teases others lol.


LOL..shhht


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's how Von teases others lol.
> I cant wait for my CAS 7 RAM!!!!!!!!


I turned my 2400mhz ram down to Cas 7 1600mhz was quite a bit slower then Cas 9 2400mhz.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I turned my 2400mhz ram down to Cas 7 1600mhz was quite a bit slower then Cas 9 2400mhz.


This is cas 7 2133 ram. And they haven't even been ocd yet. Ooh the fun in these rare stix! Just ask ivan. He about crapped himself lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> This is cas 7 2133 ram. And they haven't even been ocd yet. Ooh the fun in these rare stix! Just ask ivan. He about crapped himself lol.


Hmm Show me link to2133 Cas 7 kit....

Im not going to invest into Ram anymore with ddr4 not to far down the road.. bet meh it is worth a look..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmm Show me link to2133 Cas 7 kit....
> Im not going to invest into Ram anymore with ddr4 not to far down the road.. bet meh it is worth a look..


Its on the ocn market. Money has already been sent. Its a gskill set. Ill link it here in a sec.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1326207/fs-mive-and-memory


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmm Show me link to2133 Cas 7 kit....
> Im not going to invest into Ram anymore with ddr4 not to far down the road.. bet meh it is worth a look..


So DDR4 is an actual thing?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> So DDR4 is an actual thing?


its real ..lol

Top DRAM makers like Samsung, Micron and Nanya have already started shipping test units of the memory. Integrated Device Technology two weeks ago announced it was shipping test units of DDR4 memory with error correction features, which typically go into servers.

The proposed transfer speed of DDR4 is expected to top off at 3.2 gigatransfers per second, while JEDEC has said that DDR3 exceeded its expected maximum speed of 1.6 gigatransfers per second. DDR4 DRAM will consume 1.2 volts, compared to 1.5 volts for DDR3. The memory bus speed will start at 2133MHz, which is a boost from the average bus speed of 1333MHz and 1666MHz for DDR3.

The jury is still out on when DDR4 DRAM will end up in computers, but *it could be as early as next year*. The memory makers are pushing chip makers like Intel to bring chipset support for DDR4 quickly, Wong said.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2010589/new-ddr4-specification-sets-the-stage-for-new-dram-in-computers.html


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Its on the ocn market. Money has already been sent. Its a gskill set. Ill link it here in a sec.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1326207/fs-mive-and-memory


Nice kit, that should do well!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its real ..lol
> Top DRAM makers like Samsung, Micron and Nanya have already started shipping test units of the memory. Integrated Device Technology two weeks ago announced it was shipping test units of DDR4 memory with error correction features, which typically go into servers.
> The proposed transfer speed of DDR4 is expected to top off at 3.2 gigatransfers per second, while JEDEC has said that DDR3 exceeded its expected maximum speed of 1.6 gigatransfers per second. DDR4 DRAM will consume 1.2 volts, compared to 1.5 volts for DDR3. The memory bus speed will start at 2133MHz, which is a boost from the average bus speed of 1333MHz and 1666MHz for DDR3.
> The jury is still out on when DDR4 DRAM will end up in computers, but *it could be as early as next year*. The memory makers are pushing chip makers like Intel to bring chipset support for DDR4 quickly, Wong said.
> http://www.pcworld.com/article/2010589/new-ddr4-specification-sets-the-stage-for-new-dram-in-computers.html


Nice! Sigh though, the second I get lots of DDR3.. DDR4 is just round the corner. Same thing happened with DDR2 to DDR3.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That psc x kit can likely put out some 2400mhz cl7 love...it's gonna blow youur mind








That's e-peen done right and not some stupid x79 bragging


----------



## JQuantum

tbh i'll be midly upset if the corsair coolers aren't on sale lol kuz i waited only because I thought I could wait a week lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Just out of curiosity, did you use a piece of glass as your flat surface?


I should've but no. I used my plastic table with random depressions etc.... didn't work left random gouges, so then I used my lenovo T520 lid lol which left a much smoother surface on the ihs. use glass if you can, the laptop lid has flex on it so it wasn't that great - wood surfaces are nice too.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> tbh i'll be midly upset if the corsair coolers aren't on sale lol kuz i waited only because I thought I could wait a week lol.
> I should've but no. I used my plastic table with random depressions etc.... didn't work left random gouges, so then I used my lenovo T520 lid lol which left a much smoother surface on the ihs. use glass if you can, the laptop lid has flex on it so it wasn't that great - wood surfaces are nice too.


Oh man. Gotta use glass as it is super flat. Maybe that is some of your problem.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> tbh i'll be midly upset if the corsair coolers aren't on sale lol kuz i waited only because I thought I could wait a week lol.
> I should've but no. I used my plastic table with random depressions etc.... didn't work left random gouges, so then I used my lenovo T520 lid lol which left a much smoother surface on the ihs. use glass if you can, the laptop lid has flex on it so it wasn't that great - wood surfaces are nice too.


made this post about lapping the ihs a while ago,
might be helpful









http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749


----------



## chris-br

I'm for sure will lap my ihs, it's concave. But not sure about my D14....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd keep the hsf intact...you can resell it easily that way


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> made this post about lapping the ihs a while ago,
> might be helpful
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Oh man. Gotta use glass as it is super flat. Maybe that is some of your problem.


lol i know, but i wasn't being patient nor thinking while doing it.

I', finding that when working w electronics and devices with voltage runnin through them i stop thinking. lol... maybe it's being electricuted a few too many times kicking in


----------



## wholeeo

What glue would one use for sticking the IHS back to the PCB?


----------



## ivanlabrie

RTV Black sealant?
It should help keep the ihs in place when pressing the socket latch in place


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd keep the hsf intact...you can resell it easily that way


resell my d14???? NEVER... That will stay with me... as that original link shows, the d14 is very flat from factory. So maybe if just to have cooper on cooper with Liquid PRO on them... I would love to see the temps... Humm, delidded with liquid pro+ lapped (ihs and hs) with liquid pro also...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> resell my d14???? NEVER... That will stay with me... as that original link shows, the d14 is very flat from factory. So maybe if just to have cooper on cooper with Liquid PRO on them... I would love to see the temps... Humm, delidded with liquid pro+ lapped (ihs and hs) with liquid pro also...


It's nickel plated copper so I wouldn't bother, plus you risk getting corrosion with bare copper parts


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice kit, that should do well!


Thank you sir! I can't wait for them!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That psc x kit can likely put out some 2400mhz cl7 love...it's gonna blow youur mind
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's e-peen done right and not some stupid x79 bragging


?? Wha?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's nickel plated copper so I wouldn't bother, plus you risk getting corrosion with bare copper parts


#hat he said. The heatsink are made almost perfectly flat. About as close as you can get honestly for mass production.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thank you sir! I can't wait for them!
> ?? Wha?
> #hat he said. The heatsink are made almost perfectly flat. About as close as you can get honestly for mass production.


I meant that YOUR kit (psc x-based IC) can more than likely run cl7 at 2400mhz with 1.75v or 1.8v perhaps.
That completely beats the new 2666mhz c10 kits for superpi and most benches, like maxxmem. Overall, except in latency perhaps...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I meant that YOUR kit (psc x-based IC) can more than likely run cl7 at 2400mhz with 1.75v or 1.8v perhaps.
> That completely beats the new 2666mhz c10 kits for superpi and most benches, like maxxmem. Overall, except in latency perhaps...


That's why im so excited for them!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hehehe, shame you can no longer find those easily...same as the Hypers, they don't make them anymore.








Samsung is getting some nice IC's lately too, same as Hynix, so perhaps we might see some better bins in the future. Who knows?


----------



## Hokies83

Heads up for anybody looking for great speakers for there computer...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882117405


----------



## Axehand

After reading many pages of this club, what is the best TIM to be used for the die and IHS? I'm thinking either Liquid Pro or Ultra...


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Axehand*
> 
> After reading many pages of this club, what is the best TIM to be used for the die and IHS? I'm thinking either Liquid Pro or Ultra...


Everybody is saying liquid pro or ultra, *BUT*
I looked in some my ASrock box and found TIM that came with it called GELID GC Extreme, Apparently it's good for overclocking and sub zero temps. I have seen a 20-30C drop on cores using this.


----------



## 316320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Everybody is saying liquid pro or ultra, *BUT*
> I looked in some my ASrock box and found TIM that came with it called GELID GC Extreme, Apparently it's good for overclocking and sub zero temps. I have seen a 20-30C drop on cores using this.


That TIM has got good revirw a from what I have seen.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gregg1494*
> 
> That TIM has got good reviews from what I have seen.


Yeah i didn't read the reviews but i decided to give it a try, and it's awesome, it's smooth and easy to remove, not like ultra and pro


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Everybody is saying liquid pro or ultra, *BUT*
> I looked in some my ASrock box and found TIM that came with it called GELID GC Extreme, Apparently it's good for overclocking and sub zero temps. I have seen a 20-30C drop on cores using this.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gregg1494*
> 
> That TIM has got good revirw a from what I have seen.


That stuff is a must for Ln2 cooling.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Axehand*
> 
> After reading many pages of this club, what is the best TIM to be used for the die and IHS? I'm thinking either Liquid Pro or Ultra...


Pro on the die and IX on the IHS that's what I use.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Isn't it liquid metal too?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Isn't it liquid metal too?


I'm not sure, I'll have a look.
w/mk is 8.5
It doesn't even list on the site what it contains.
http://www.gelidsolutions.com/products/index.php?lid=1&cid=3&id=42&tab=1


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Everybody is saying liquid pro or ultra, *BUT*
> I looked in some my ASrock box and found TIM that came with it called GELID GC Extreme, Apparently it's good for overclocking and sub zero temps. I have seen a 20-30C drop on cores using this.


Then u would have 25 - 35 c with liquid pro.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Then u would have 25 - 35 c with liquid pro.


But then there is the pain of taking it off. For 5 more degrees it should be alright.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> But then there is the pain of taking it off. For 5 more degrees it should be alright.


Why would u ever have to take LP off the die there is no reason to.


----------



## 316320

I wanna see more of indigo extreme.


----------



## FtW 420

Gelid extreme isn't liquid metal, not sure just what it is but doesn't turn to powder when frozen with ln2 like most paste. Stocked up on gelid at the same time I ordered the liquid ultra, at least the gelid blister packs were sealed so the customs guys left it alone.


----------



## Axehand

I was thinking about using Liquid pro on the die and indigo extreme on the IHS?

Indigo Extreme vs Coolaboratory Liquid Pro


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Why would u ever have to take LP off the die there is no reason to.


Don't you have to remove it on remounts? if so how does one remove it without damaging the die?


----------



## JQuantum

as long as it isn't hard, just wipe it off using rubbing alcohol. Comes off easily using it. I've done this wthin 24 hours okay. I don't think I'l lbe taking it off past 24 hours though... it might just be easily as turn the pc on for a bit make sure it's warmed up trhen wipe off after turning off adn removing. I used cotton cloth aka toilet paper to do so but Q-tips will be fine. The cleaning solution it comes iwth is more or less a cotton wipe.


----------



## jprovido

is it worth it to delid even without the liquid pro tim?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Might be, if you remove the black glue, and your ihs is not too concave.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> is it worth it to delid even without the liquid pro tim?


You will still get 5-15 c drops which is still worth it.


----------



## neopunx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> is it worth it to delid even without the liquid pro tim?


You started a whole thread to answering whether you should delid. We said yes. Why would you come back and ask again? YES.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> is it worth it to delid even without the liquid pro tim?


yes.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Should i try to hit 4.8Ghz with the CPU first and then delidded or delidded and see if i can get 4.8Ghz. I need 1.3625v for 4.6Ghz so i will need 1.43-1.45v for 4.8Ghz.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Should i try to hit 4.8Ghz with the CPU first and then delidded or delidded and see if i can get 4.8Ghz. I need 1.3625v for 4.6Ghz so i will need 1.43-1.45v for 4.8Ghz.


First try 4.8Ghz, Screenshot temps, then delid and screenshot temps again, and then you should also be able to run less volts for oc.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Should i try to hit 4.8Ghz with the CPU first and then delidded or delidded and see if i can get 4.8Ghz. I need 1.3625v for 4.6Ghz so i will need 1.43-1.45v for 4.8Ghz.


Absolutely. Put your vcore to the max that you think you would run it and see what multi you can boot at, while your at it see if your stable enough to surf the internet and open up some apps. Just watch your temps but with that low stress they shouldn't have any issue.. Because If you were to jack up your voltage to 1.5v and then only were able to boot at 4.7 I would say don't bother de-lidding, but if you have a semi stable 4.9 , 5 or 5.1 go for it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> First try 4.8Ghz, Screenshot temps, then delid and screenshot temps again, and then you should also be able to run less volts for oc.


The less volts is a lie. It happens rarely. But you can try man.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The less volts is a lie. It happens rarely. But you can try man.


That's what i meant, like he can try works for some. Not for me though!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats when you run prime, custom, 80/90% ram used right?
> if you dont do folding, or something similar, youll prolly never see those temps,
> run AIDA64, cinebench, play some games(bf3), use comp as normal,
> keep a eye on whea errors in event viewer, could be a indication if youre stable or not,
> just to name a few things to see if 5.0ghz is stable or not, without running into the high temps prime gives you,
> even then, running prime 12/18/24H with temps hitting 90-95C with peaks, no problem..


i used prime 95 blend test


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I'm not sure, I'll have a look.
> w/mk is 8.5
> It doesn't even list on the site what it contains.
> http://www.gelidsolutions.com/products/index.php?lid=1&cid=3&id=42&tab=1


only on the die liquid pro or ultra is better then the other tim's,
one reason is the small area the heat needs to be transfered from,
the ihs is a much bigger area, so a lesser w/mk tim will do fine

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources and post #216 in this thread)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

for example, i first used Arctic Silver 5 on the die and ihs, which has about 8 w/mk,
i had a temp drop of about 10-12C,
after that ive used liquid pro, on all sides, 25+C temp drop

this is using AS5,


this is using liquid pro,


----------



## Valgaur

Okay I'm gonna settle this stability thing right now.

Wanna know the best stability program out on the market?

FOLD. I kid you not. I got work units that lasted 30 hours once. if it can never submitted it though, had to test fold stability) fold one of those......it wont crash. I did a 4.8 Ghz run for the prime guys and I went 48 hrs stable . I let it fold......3 hours later it crashed.

Okay, I may be being a little harsh but if you want something stable. Do it.

I think of stability this way. take a 300 lb log. now lift it. How are you going to lift it? just grab it in the middle and pull? no your going to lift one side and work at it. Now take a weight lifter bar that weighs 300 lbs. your obviously going to grab it in the middle and lift it. that's what the CPU has to do with all of the codes that go into them.

Give it try and see what happens.

BTW Happy gobbler day for the US folks!









Have a good one as well UK guys and gals!


----------



## Leyaena

Okay, so I've got everything set up to delid and lap my cpu!
Glass underground, sanding paper all the way up to 3000 grit, various thicknesses of box cutters / razor blades, a bottle of isopropyl alcohol, except...
My liquid pro still hasn't arrived yet









Looks like I'll have to postpone until next week...


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Okay, so I've got everything set up to delid and lap my cpu!
> Glass underground, sanding paper all the way up to 3000 grit, various thicknesses of box cutters / razor blades, a bottle of isopropyl alcohol, except...
> My liquid pro still hasn't arrived yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like I'll have to postpone until next week...


You could just delid now and use a regular TIM as a placeholder till the pro gets here. That's what I did!







You'll still get 10-15 degrees out of it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Okay, so I've got everything set up to delid and lap my cpu!
> Glass underground, sanding paper all the way up to 3000 grit, various thicknesses of box cutters / razor blades, a bottle of isopropyl alcohol, except...
> My liquid pro still hasn't arrived yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like I'll have to postpone until next week...


yea, like directeffekt says,
use a tim you have now, or can get easy, i first used AS5 because i had to wait for my liquid pro,
look at the post i made earlier on this page..
if you feel like you can do it today..do it..
took my about 1 month to prepare for delid, that much reading i did, and watch vid's etc,
but woke up one morning, and had the, "today is the day to delid" , feeling..lol

Belgium, you couldnt order it in Holland? or did you?
could have been faster maybe









edit,
nvm, dont see any store that has some in the house..lol
http://azerty.nl/producten/product_detail/83/79514/coollaboratory-liquid-pro.html
is the fastest/cheapest, still 2-3 days


----------



## Leyaena

Well, Coollaboratory themselves are located in Germany, so I guessed that would be the quickest way to get some, seeing as you can't seem to get the pro here in Belgium... (Alternate has the Ultra, but apparently they don't do the pro xD). Didn't think there'd be much of a difference between ordering from Holland and ordering from Germany, but apparently they still haven't even received my payment, despite the fact that my bank says they did the transaction on monday...

I might just delid today though, like you said, I have a good feeling about doing it today, and I don't think I'll ever be more ready than I am right now. If worst comes to worst and I mess up my 3570k, though, I've got some money put aside so I can get myself a 3770k. Else I wouldn't risk it, but this 3570k I've got now isn't exactly what you'd call a golden chip, needing 1.34v to get stable on 4.5GHz and temps spiking to the 90's on IBT...

Just trying to convince myself to go for it now ^^


----------



## VonDutch




----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*


Okay. That's epic. I might have to make this my avatar.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay. That's epic. I might have to make this my avatar.
Click to expand...

would be nice to photoshop it, and let it cut through a ivy corner ...lol
i dont have a photoshop copy anymore..

was actually looking for the Nike slogan, "just do it" for Leyaena,
when i saw this one , i was like ..wow..exactly what i need..lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Well, Coollaboratory themselves are located in Germany, so I guessed that would be the quickest way to get some, seeing as you can't seem to get the pro here in Belgium... (Alternate has the Ultra, but apparently they don't do the pro xD). Didn't think there'd be much of a difference between ordering from Holland and ordering from Germany, but apparently they still haven't even received my payment, despite the fact that my bank says they did the transaction on monday...
> I might just delid today though, like you said, I have a good feeling about doing it today, and I don't think I'll ever be more ready than I am right now. If worst comes to worst and I mess up my 3570k, though, I've got some money put aside so I can get myself a 3770k. Else I wouldn't risk it, but this 3570k I've got now isn't exactly what you'd call a golden chip, needing 1.34v to get stable on 4.5GHz and temps spiking to the 90's on IBT...
> Just trying to convince myself to go for it now ^^


Just take your time and follow the guide, its actually helpful lol.

It's the sanding and applying pro that will make you want to suicide. Ive sanded my ihs so much that there is barely any material on it.... and it still isnt shiny or completely flat.


----------



## VonDutch

finally i found a good example on how little liquid pro you need to cover the ihs

this is how it looked like after its done

i wouldnt want to see the little "drops" on the lower part ihs tho,
anything thats to much, suck it up again using the seringe, easy..









if you use the Q-tip that comes with the package,
use the same part all the time, it will making it spread out easier too..
using circle motion helps too i noticed..

The Liquid Pro manual suggests the use of a Q-Tip, artist's brush,
rubber gloves, or the tip of the syringe for spreading the compound.
on the pic's above, the seringe is used to spread the tim..

not sure what this one did, but obviously using to much,

we had a member here that used the whole seringe, pity i didnt copy his pic's ..lol


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> finally i found a good example on how little liquid pro you need to cover the ihs
> this is how it looked like after its done
> 
> i wouldnt want to see the little "drops" on the lower part ihs tho,
> anything thats to much, suck it up again using the seringe, easy..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you use the Q-tip that comes with the package,
> use the same part all the time, it will making it spread out easier too..
> using circle motion helps too i noticed..
> The Liquid Pro manual suggests the use of a Q-Tip, artist's brush,
> rubber gloves, or the tip of the syringe for spreading the compound.
> on the pic's above, the seringe is used to spread the tim..
> not sure what this one did, but obviously using to much,
> 
> we had a member here that used the whole seringe, pity i didnt copy his pic's ..lol


there's actually a youtube video on how to properly apply liquid pro. ive known this for a long time now


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> there's actually a youtube video on how to properly apply liquid pro. ive known this for a long time now


yep,
but not everyone is watching it, or knows













So i just repeat things every now and then


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep,
> but not everyone is watching it, or knows
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So i just repeat things every now and then


I think they cheated a little in that video though, if you look at the IHS at the start, it has some dark patches like you get after cleaning off Pro or Ultra and having had it previously applied makes it quite a bit easier to apply again!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Leyaena, do yourself a favor and practice on at least two socket 478 celerons...they cost close to nothing and are glued.
Try to the cut in a single motion using a thin gillette razor, but wear some gloves (like Valgaur did)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I think they cheated a little in that video though, if you look at the IHS at the start, it has some dark patches like you get after cleaning off Pro or Ultra and having had it previously applied makes it quite a bit easier to apply again!


it is their own product of course..lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Leyaena, do yourself a favor and practice on at least two socket 478 celerons...they cost close to nothing and are glued.


i think this tip should be on page 1 too,
practice on some old celeron/pentium first,
doesnt matter if they are soldered or not


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Leyaena, do yourself a favor and practice on at least two socket 478 celerons...they cost close to nothing and are glued.
> Try to the cut in a single motion using a thin gillette razor, but wear some gloves (like Valgaur did)


I'm sure they cost close to nothing, as you say, but I don't have an easy way to get my hands on some, unfortunately









I'll be home in 20 minutes or so, I'm planning to go for it then, after running some benches and writing down my current temps ^^

How would I best go about spreading regular tim on the die? just a half rice grain-sized blob in the middle, and let the pressure from the IHS spread it out? Or is it best to spread it out myself beforehand?


----------



## wholeeo

@ VonDutch's AV...


----------



## BaK2BaK

Hi guys

Dunno if you already answered that in the last 50 pages, d4mn hard to keep up with that thread!









You say the IHS could be concave sometimes, which could explain a core being hotter than the others, and needs to be lapped. I guess the purpose of lapping is to have the whole surface of the die touching the IHS, right?
Then why do you lap the upper side of the IHS? From what I see this will improve the IHS / heatsink contact, but won't do anything for the die / IHS interface...









What do you guys use to lap? Hand + sand paper?
Would that work for the under side of the IHS too?

How do you do to have a 100% flat and horizontal surface? Any pics or videos?

After delidding, would it be good to glue back the IHS to the PCB (one or two small points of glue), to avoid the IHS moving on to the lil black square that will lift it a bit?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Hi guys
> Dunno if you already answered that in the last 50 pages, d4mn hard to keep up with that thread!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You say the IHS could be concave sometimes, which could explain a core being hotter than the others, and needs to be lapped. I guess the purpose of lapping is to have the whole surface of the die touching the IHS, right?
> Then why do you lap the upper side of the IHS? From what I see this will improve the IHS / heatsink contact, but won't do anything for the die / IHS interface...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you guys use to lap? Hand + sand paper?
> Would that work for the under side of the IHS too?
> How do you do to have a 100% flat and horizontal surface? Any pics or videos?
> After delidding, would it be good to glue back the IHS to the PCB (one or two small points of glue), to avoid the IHS moving on to the lil black square that will lift it a bit?


here your answer about lapping.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> made this post about lapping the ihs a while ago,
> might be helpful
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Hi guys
> Dunno if you already answered that in the last 50 pages, d4mn hard to keep up with that thread!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You say the IHS could be concave sometimes, which could explain a core being hotter than the others, and needs to be lapped. I guess the purpose of lapping is to have the whole surface of the die touching the IHS, right?
> Then why do you lap the upper side of the IHS? From what I see this will improve the IHS / heatsink contact, but won't do anything for the die / IHS interface...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you guys use to lap? Hand + sand paper?
> Would that work for the under side of the IHS too?
> How do you do to have a 100% flat and horizontal surface? Any pics or videos?
> After delidding, would it be good to glue back the IHS to the PCB (one or two small points of glue), to avoid the IHS moving on to the lil black square that will lift it a bit?


I think most people recommend a very flat surface like a piece of Glass. You'll use the processors own weight whilst lapping, all you use your hand for is to guide it up and down on the sand paper applying as little downward force as possible, I lapped a Q9550 once, didn't turn out half bad, took me about 4 hours or so though lol


----------



## Silkworm75

Valgaur,

YGPM. I don't want to say, "I told you so!"

BUT, I told you so!!!!!!!! hahahaha


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> You say the IHS could be concave sometimes, which could explain a core being hotter than the others, and needs to be lapped.
> After delidding, would it be good to glue back the IHS to the PCB (one or two small points of glue), to avoid the IHS moving on to the lil black square that will lift it a bit?


Helpful tips about putting your Delided CPU back in the socket! (page 1)
you could glue it too, but its not necessary









about the 1 core being hotter then the others,
1 core is next to the igpu, hokies said a while ago

but when i thought about it, most of us have it disabled,
so i figured it could also be the core next to the imc, which is used always,
so heats up a bit too, and ..1 core is always doing the lighter loads, even at idle,
windows is always "busy" in the background..


----------



## JQuantum

oh my...







I put an H100i on it and my temps are only 1C better at idle and 5C higher at load









I did somethign wrong for sure... I really want to try it without the liquid pro and see if it helps or go direct die... or screw the mounting brackets and use screws.... I know this isn't right because my H100 is doing really well on my i7-3770k that was delidded... It is very very likely that there is insufficient pressure//contact to the IHS... sighs I think I'll go direct die in a few weeks...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> oh my...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I put an H100i on it and my temps are only 1C better at idle and 5C higher at load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did somethign wrong for sure... I really want to try it without the liquid pro and see if it helps or go direct die... or screw the mounting brackets and use screws.... I know this isn't right because my H100 is doing really well on my i7-3770k that was delidded...


Remount and be careful with the paste application on the ihs.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Remount and be careful with the paste application on the ihs.


I dont' think remount will help at this point. I need a new mount is probably better. Comparing my stock cooler's contact area. For the amount of paste I used, it normally should've spread more IMO. It also gets more dense on teh outside verses the inside meaning it didn't spread because it's not making contact.... I think either supporting the IHS would help on this particular one to even the pressure out... or direct die would help since then teh entire cooling pad would work as the heat spreader no?


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's odd really...Direct die will help only if your mounting mechanism allows you to keep the cpu doing proper contact with the pins.
I'd skip that unless you're too confident and wanna tinker wih that.
Are you using the same fans as before?


----------



## sliflex

OCN name: *SLIFLEX*
CPU: *3770K*
On-die TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid ultra*

IHS TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid ultra*
Mhz gained: *+100MHz (for now)*
OC after delid:* got 5338mhz validaded*
Temp drops: -*20 celsius average*

 http://valid.canardpc.com/2586175



my temps delided hottest core 78 C before 98 C

before i could runintelBurn test 45x100 with high 90s

now its high 70s...... /me happy







add me pls??


----------



## Leyaena

Ok, got everything set up and ready.
Plan for tonight: delidding, applying placeholder NT-H1 until my CL Liquid Pro comes in.
Plan when LP comes in: lapping down my IHS, applying liquid pro on the die and on the IHS...

Wish me luck guys!
As an aside, these are my temperatures now, 10 runs of IBT;


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sliflex*
> 
> OCN name:
> *SLIFLEX*
> 
> CPU:
> *3770K*
> 
> On-die TIM:
> *Coollaboratory Liquid ultra*
> 
> IHS TIM:
> 
> *Coollaboratory Liquid ultra*
> 
> Mhz gained:
> *+100MHz (for now)*
> 
> OC after delid:* got 5338mhz validaded*
> 
> Temp drops: -
> *20 celsius average*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2586175
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1140160/
> 
> 
> my temps delided hottest core 78 C before 98 C
> 
> before i could runintelBurn test 45x100 with high 90s
> now its high 70s...... /me happy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> add me pls??


bet youre happy with the results..great job









but come to think about it, 4.5ghz with 78C hottest core, is still high,
heres a 4.7ghz after running prime 30min,

63C hottest core

what where you running, ibt, prime ?

edit:
my bad, you used ibt,
4646mhz running ibt, max ram used

59C hottest cores

the 60C and 78C is a (to big) temp difference also, for a delidded chip,
before delid mine where about 10-15C, after delid, about 5-6C


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Ok, got everything set up and ready.
> Plan for tonight: delidding, applying placeholder NT-H1 until my CL Liquid Pro comes in.
> Plan when LP comes in: lapping down my IHS, applying liquid pro on the die and on the IHS...
> Wish me luck guys!
> As an aside, these are my temperatures now, 10 runs of IBT;


i wish you luck








hope to wake up in the morning, and read youre positive post


----------



## ivanlabrie

VonDutch, you have lower temps than most peeps don't forget that


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> VonDutch, you have lower temps than most peeps don't forget that


haha








im reminded every day ..LOL

but even then, 78C hottest core after delid, for 4.5ghz? using a H100..
and the temp difference between cores is big(18C),
and i need to go to bed ..lol,
kids are here this weekend too, tommz going to the Zoo ..


----------



## Leyaena

Ok, first of all, it's aliiiiive!

gonna run some tests now!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Great news!!!








Go for it


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Helpful tips about putting your Delided CPU back in the socket! (page 1)
> you could glue it too, but its not necessary
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> about the 1 core being hotter then the others,
> 1 core is next to the igpu, hokies said a while ago
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but when i thought about it, most of us have it disabled,
> so i figured it could also be the core next to the imc, which is used always,
> so heats up a bit too, and ..1 core is always doing the lighter loads, even at idle,
> windows is always "busy" in the background..


I've thought about that, and I think the hot core may actually be one of the middle ones. The outside cores will have extra surface area where their heat will spread to and dissipate from (IMC and GPU, neither of which use much power compared to the main cores) which could account for the couple of degrees variance that is seen on the dellidded CPUs.


----------



## Leyaena

*IBT after:*


Looks like I managed to ditch anywhere between 10 and 15 degrees with my placeholder heatpaste, not lapped.
I'm thrilled even with these results, and I can only imagine that after lapping and applying my Coollaboratory Liquid Pro these temps will go down even further!


----------



## wholeeo

So I was bored and removed the liquid pro from the die and reapplied a better more even layer onto it. First remount when terribly wrong though as I didn't use enough thermal paste. One of my cores had went up to 98 delidded! When I had removed the IHS there wasn't even a spec of paste residue on it. I then redid everything with a bit more liquid pro, enough to leave a mirror like reflection over the die.




My temps are more even now across cores and I dropped about 6c overall.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sliflex*
> 
> OCN name:
> *SLIFLEX*
> 
> CPU:
> *3770K*
> 
> On-die TIM:
> *Coollaboratory Liquid ultra*
> 
> IHS TIM:
> 
> *Coollaboratory Liquid ultra*
> 
> Mhz gained:
> *+100MHz (for now)*
> 
> OC after delid:* got 5338mhz validaded*
> 
> Temp drops: -
> *20 celsius average*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2586175
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1140160/
> my temps delided hottest core 78 C before 98 C
> 
> before i could runintelBurn test 45x100 with high 90s
> now its high 70s...... /me happy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> add me pls??


Accepted!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Ok, got everything set up and ready.
> Plan for tonight: delidding, applying placeholder NT-H1 until my CL Liquid Pro comes in.
> Plan when LP comes in: lapping down my IHS, applying liquid pro on the die and on the IHS...
> Wish me luck guys!
> As an aside, these are my temperatures now, 10 runs of IBT;


YOU CAN DO IT!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Ok, first of all, it's aliiiiive!
> gonna run some tests now!


TOLD YOU!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> IHS lapping ( 400 grit --> 800 grit --> 1000 grit). Read this composite pic from left-to-right and from top-to-bottom:
> 
> As evident in the photos, the IHS on this 3770K was quite concave, that is,
> higher in the middle than elsewhere. "Flatness" was achieved in this case
> when no more silver color remained on the IHS.
> 
> one uses wet/dry sandpaper and a flat surface (glass usually) to slowly and
> iteratively grind an uneven surface. The goal of lapping is not be to make
> a mirror surface, rather, it is to make flat surface.
> waking up, g'morning
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , and done some "info looting" while drinking my coffee
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saw you guys talk about sanding ihs etc ..so ..i like pictures, easier then 1000 (grit) words right ..lol
> i must say, most peeps say it didnt help much, i thought the same till now,
> 1-3C max difference, others saw no difference at all, so im surprised about the
> extra 11C tempdrop..
> .....................................................................................................
> First, here is the sequence of pics taken during the various stages of lapping.
> To determine if the IHS was initially convex (crowned in the middle) or concave (like a bowl),
> I used a sharpie permanent marker to make an X across the surface of the IHS:
> 
> Then I did just a few strokes on 220 grit before inspecting it,
> knowing that the portions of the original "X" would only be removed from the high spots on the IHS:
> 
> very clear indication that the IHS is/was concave (like a bowl, the center was low and not touched by the sand paper yet,
> the edges were high and have already been sanded down a bit, enough to begin to remove the permanent pen markings)
> A bit more sanding with 220 grit yielded the following "copper ring" expected for a concave IHS:
> 
> We want all the nickel removed, nickel has a lower thermal transfer rate than copper, so I finished sanding off all the nickel with 220 grit:
> 
> check out how it looks after going all the way up to 3000 grit, love it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if anyone is going to do this lapping thing,
> note before and after results if you can,
> might be usefull for others, we have this saying,
> "one day of Sun, doesnt make a summer"..
> so, results that one may have, wont mean others will have the same,
> its like with the usage of different tim's on die,
> took a while and results from different peeps, to be sure liquid pro/ultra are the best to use on die right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, about the "bowl" effect on that pic with the green markings,
> dont forget if you put down the bracket on it, it will get less by the pressure...i thought..
> well, to make sure noone will sue me, lol,
> these are the original links,
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2260582
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261219


How long did this take to do?









EDIT: Ordering some liquid pro + liquid ultra today. Got one week left of school. (I go to two campus' and one has actually finished, I think i aced my exams without studying much!







)

Should I get one tube of each? Ultra for under the IHS, and Pro for contact with the cooler/top of CPU?
After I de-lid I may lap it too, I'll be using some mere MX-2 to see what the temperature drop is like until my coolabs stuff gets here (It'll probably be a while). I've decided I may lap the IHS so I won't be sealing it just yet, if that's the case I need to make the call before I use the coolabs stuff. Has anyone de-lidded then lapped? I'm assuming the best way would be to take the IHS off and just do that and leave the CPU sepoarately (and away from where I am lapping it)

EDIT2: Just figured that it's Euros and not Pounds..







That saves me $5 at least.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Looks like a 3 hour job...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Looks like a 3 hour job...


Anything for performance eh?


----------



## ivanlabrie

OFC!

Guys...I want an UMPC, someone find me one that runs Windows XP and Half Life 2. (Samsung Q1 Ultra is the one I want :/ )
I wanna play mmo's on the go, or while I run superpi 32m lol


----------



## Arm3nian

I just stabbed my thumb with the cl pro needle and some of it basically went in, I aint gonna die right...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I just stabbed my thumb with the cl pro needle and some of it basically went in, I aint gonna die right...


It's not really good for you... no, it shouldn't kill you. But I'd try and squeeze your thumb to see if you can get any out. I'm not certain that it won't *kill you* but I reckon you may just get sick from it.

EDIT: I Google'd around, I take what I said back. It's fine, they actually use gallium to test for cancer etc so it must be safe. linky.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol








It's Gallium, not mercury, doubt you'd die cause of it.
Take a glass, put some alcohol inside it, light a match and light the alcohol on fire. Just afterwards put the glass over your thumb, creating a vacuum effect.
Should remove everything! (works for most disgusting stuff on your skin too lol)


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's Gallium, not mercury, doubt you'd die cause of it.
> Take a glass, put some alcohol inside it, light a match and light the alcohol on fire. Just afterwards put the glass over your thumb, creating a vacuum effect.
> Should remove everything! (works for most disgusting stuff on your skin too lol)


lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

It should work...you could use one of those tweezers dermathologists use to remove blackheads.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's Gallium, not mercury, doubt you'd die cause of it.
> Take a glass, put some alcohol inside it, light a match and light the alcohol on fire. Just afterwards put the glass over your thumb, creating a vacuum effect.
> Should remove everything! (works for most disgusting stuff on your skin too lol)


That is crazy.. So I could put a dash of vodka in a glass, light it then put it on my nose to remove blackheads/pimples/puss or whatever else is in there?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's Gallium, not mercury, doubt you'd die cause of it.
> Take a glass, put some alcohol inside it, light a match and light the alcohol on fire. Just afterwards put the glass over your thumb, creating a vacuum effect.
> Should remove everything! (works for most disgusting stuff on your skin too lol)


Or you know... suck out all of your blood.

Okay guys we got my mandatory 30 people I wanted for the formal complaint against Intel for their mistake. Whose all in?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's Gallium, not mercury, doubt you'd die cause of it.
> Take a glass, put some alcohol inside it, light a match and light the alcohol on fire. Just afterwards put the glass over your thumb, creating a vacuum effect.
> Should remove everything! (works for most disgusting stuff on your skin too lol)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> It's not really good for you... no, it shouldn't kill you. But I'd try and squeeze your thumb to see if you can get any out. I'm not certain that it won't *kill you* but I reckon you may just get sick from it.
> EDIT: I Google'd around, I take what I said back. It's fine, they actually use gallium to test for cancer etc so it must be safe. linky.


I squeezed the blood out, it was actually discolored... the spot is now brown but seems closed. I stabbed myself with a THICK led pencil in 3rd grade, like 10, compared to 0.5 led, and it basically stayed in there I think. Now I have lead and gallium and in my bloodstream, maybe by a few later i'll end up being a cyborg -.-


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, it creates a vacuum cause you burn the O2 in there...It's really strong so be careful. You'd need a really small glass for your nose. Tweezers work best for that.


----------



## UNOE

I like this thread


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I just stabbed my thumb with the cl pro needle and some of it basically went in, I aint gonna die right...


Your are going to have trouble at the airports


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I squeezed the blood out, it was actually discolored... the spot is now brown but seems closed. I stabbed myself with a THICK led pencil in 3rd grade, like 10, compared to 0.5 led, and it basically stayed in there I think. Now I have lead and gallium and in my bloodstream, maybe by a few later i'll end up being a cyborg -.-


I actually did this in second grade too.. One of those massive learner pencils, someone pulled the chair out from under me and I fell on the floor, the pencil (which I'd just sharpened) fell off the table and landed in my wrist, I never got the end of the pencil out and it was nowhere to be found. Now that I look I think i may have a slight possible mark from where it was, I'm unsure.

Anyway, should I order one tube of each? Liquid Pro/Ultra? Which one is the stick one that's hard to remove?


----------



## wholeeo

in third grade i stabbed Rafael in the shoulder with a pencil cause he was annoying me,


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I actually did this in second grade too.. One of those massive learner pencils, someone pulled the chair out from under me and I fell on the floor, the pencil (which I'd just sharpened) fell off the table and landed in my wrist, I never got the end of the pencil out and it was nowhere to be found. Now that I look I think i may have a slight possible mark from where it was, I'm unsure.
> Anyway, should I order one tube of each? Liquid Pro/Ultra? Which one is the stick one that's hard to remove?


I had to sand to get my ultra off the copper. However I removed it with 91% alchohol from the die of my cpu and gpu. I applied pro on my gpu now, gonna do it to my ihs next, already did the die, i think it was actually easier to apply pro than ultra, but to remove people say pro is harder but I had to lap the copper anyway with ultra.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I had to sand to get my ultra off the copper. However I removed it with 91% alchohol from the die of my cpu and gpu. I applied pro on my gpu now, gonna do it to my ihs next, already did the die, i think it was actually easier to apply pro than ultra, but to remove people say pro is harder but I had to lap the copper anyway with ultra.


So the "Pro" would be better suited to the core itself and the ultra on the IHS? I might end up doing my 7950 (Definitely the VRM's) if that's the case.







+rep

EDIT: Bit the bullet and got one of each.. I shall do a review on it as I can't seem to find many.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> So the "Pro" would be better suited to the core itself and the ultra on the IHS? I might end up doing my 7950 (Definitely the VRM's) if that's the case.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +rep
> EDIT: Bit the bullet and got one of each.. I shall do a review on it as I can't seem to find many.


The pro would be suited better for the die since it gives a bit more temp drop, and also "solders" itself to the die, which can actually help if no glue. I had both, and prefer the pro because it sticks which helps mounting blocks without it sliding. I used it on my cpu die and ihs, my raystorm, my 2 690 cores, chip, and on my 690 water block, just to ensure contact because last time I applied 1 of my cores wasnt making contact with the block. If you want use ultra on the ihs to waterblock because it should be easier to remove. Just remember removing paste from die is much easier than removing from copper blocks.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Or you know... suck out all of your blood.
> Okay guys we got my mandatory 30 people I wanted for the formal complaint against Intel for their mistake. Whose all in?


Eh hem.......

Also what magazine has the delidded section coming up in the future? If I hear the name ill email them this thread and get intel to see that people are taking there failures into their own hands.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> *IBT after:*
> 
> Looks like I managed to ditch anywhere between 10 and 15 degrees with my placeholder heatpaste, not lapped.
> I'm thrilled even with these results, and I can only imagine that after lapping and applying my Coollaboratory Liquid Pro these temps will go down even further!


good news to wake up with, nice job Leyaena








what tim are you using now?
o, lapping can help, i wouldnt lap ihs if its not needed tho,
except if temps still dont go down much, or not enough compared to others..
1-3C is what some see , some dont notice a difference at all, very few had a 10+C drop,
those are the ones that prolly had a concave ihs, or just a bad mount ..lol


----------



## DirektEffekt

I'd like to point out again, to all those people concerned about cleaning off CL Ultra or Pro: The residue WILL NOT negatively effect any future performance. You can leave what you can't wipe off there and, if anything, it will improve the performance of other pastes. All that is really being left behind are traces of metal stuck in imperfections in the material.

It's actually a feature listed in the product specs and I see no reason not to believe it. Logically it's only filling microscopic grooves in the metal with more metal!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I'd like to point out again, to all those people concerned about cleaning off CL Ultra or Pro: The residue WILL NOT negatively effect any future performance. You can leave what you can't wipe off there and, if anything, it will improve the performance of other pastes. All that is really being left behind are traces of metal stuck in imperfections in the material.
> It's actually a feature listed in the product specs and I see no reason not to believe it. Logically it's only filling microscopic grooves in the metal with more metal!


Yes!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I just stabbed my thumb with the cl pro needle and some of it basically went in, I aint gonna die right...


i just wonder, do you feel "cooler" now ??


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Or you know... suck out all of your blood.
> Okay guys we got my mandatory 30 people I wanted for the formal complaint against Intel for their mistake. Whose all in?


i back you up all the way bro,
this is what you wanted all the time right,
gather all the info, then do a formal complaint against Intel


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i just wonder, do you feel "cooler" now ??


Lol. Now that's funny.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i back you up all the way bro,
> this is what you wanted all the time right,
> gather all the info, then do a formal complaint against Intel


Yup. Now the question of how to go about it mainly.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I've thought about that, and I think the hot core may actually be one of the middle ones. The outside cores will have extra surface area where their heat will spread to and dissipate from (IMC and GPU, neither of which use much power compared to the main cores) which could account for the couple of degrees variance that is seen on the dellidded CPUs.


if that was true, then 2 cores would run hotter then the other ones..
not sure if theres still running voltage through the igpu if disabled, and no drivers installed etc,
thats why i said , it could be the core next to the imc, which runs at about 1V all the time,
depending on "load" it will be/get hotter..
after delid, most/and I have a difference of about 5-6C, which is normal
before my delid, i had 10-15C difference between hottest and coolest core..
would be a nice question to ask intel about tho..i always like to know the why etc


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lol. Now that's funny.
> Yup. Now the question of how to go about it mainly.


first thing would be to have a good contact over there,
its of no use if we do this, and only some low level employee is reading it, who cant do anything about it anyways..

a brief introduction,
then go bullet style telling our findings,
outro with what we expect from intel..

short story's from our members,
link to the thread in this forum..

.................................................................

im not at all good in these things, but this is what i came up with for now,
im more a," im going over there to talk", kind of guy ..lol
i personally like to see all the chips we lost delidding, replaced, without any questions asked..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> first thing would be to have a good contact over there,
> its of no use if we do this, and only some low level employee is reading it, who cant do anything about it anyways..
> a brief introduction,
> then go bullet style telling our findings,
> outro with what we expect from intel..
> short story's from our members,
> link to the thread in this forum..
> .................................................................
> im not at all good in these things, but this is what i came up with for now,
> im more a," im going over there to talk", kind of guy ..lol
> i personally like to see all the chips we lost delidding, replaced, without any questions asked..


Now that's a question...and a darn good one at that.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i just wonder, do you feel "cooler" now ??


Now that I think of it yes.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Now that I think of it yes.


lollol
















just found this, about the use of gallium with scans

There is a small risk of complications from radiation exposure, but it is less than the risk involved with X-rays or CT scans.
The risk increases if you have many gallium scans over time.
*Your body will eliminate the gallium naturally*, though a trace amount may remain in your tissues for a few weeks.

and

Gallium is an element found in the body, but it occurs in a very small amount. For example, in a person with a mass of seventy kilograms,
there are 0.7 milligrams of gallium in the body. If this amount of gallium was condensed into a cube,
the cube would only be 0.49 millimeters long on one side. It has no proven benefit towards the function of the body,
and it most likely is only present due to small traces in the natural environment, in water, and in residue on vegetables and fruits.
Several vitamins and commercially distributed waters have been known to contain trace amounts of gallium with less than
one part per million. Pure gallium is not a harmful substance for humans to touch. It has been handled many times
only for the simple pleasure of watching it melt by the heat emitted from a human hand.
However, it is known to leave a stain on hands. Even the gallium radioactive compound, gallium [67Ga] citrate,
can be injected into the body and used for gallium scanning without harmful effects.

no worries right


----------



## Leyaena

Now that all of that is over, I'd very much like to join the crew!

*OCN name:* Leyaena
*CPU:* i5-3570k
*on die-TIM:* Noctua NH-T1 (for now)
*ihs-TIM:* Noctua NH-T1 (for now)
*Mhz gained:* None, so far
*OC after delid:* 4.5GHz
*Temp drops:* ~15-20 degrees
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* link


Spoiler: Before and after pics



*BEFORE:*


*AFTER:*


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Now that all of that is over, I'd very much like to join the crew!
> *OCN name:* Leyaena
> *CPU:* i5-3570k
> *on die-TIM:* Noctua NH-T1 (for now)
> *ihs-TIM:* Noctua NH-T1 (for now)
> *Mhz gained:* None, so far
> *OC after delid:* 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops:* ~15-20 degrees
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* link
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Before and after pics
> 
> 
> 
> *BEFORE:*
> 
> *AFTER:*


you're in








Val will at you later to the sheet


----------



## chris-br

My father is coming back from US today... so this week i should be getting the liquid pro here.







Can´t wait....


----------



## Swag

Anyone here have an iPhone 5? If you do please PM me.

Sorry if this is bad.







I can't find a place at all where people would post help for this type of thing and this is the only thread that gets a lot of attention nowadays.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone here have an iPhone 5? If you do please PM me.
> Sorry if this is bad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't find a place at all where people would post help for this type of thing and this is the only thread that gets a lot of attention nowadays.


I have an Ipad 3 with IOS 6.1


----------



## VonDutch

just bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro








so next week i can start delidding again, and look for a better way to delid









thinking about using a vise, and somehow weld 2 razorblades 90 degrees between it,
then cpu between the blades, the long sides, and let the vise do its work,
it will cut, and use pressure to get through the adhesive see,
well, at least thats my theory ..lol

only first thoughts, but i think i can make it work, and bet it never would
touch pcb, the blades would always be 100% right angle,
picture of how it should look is in my head already..
no, i didnt smoke anything..lol













parts i need..its a one time setup, after that, i can delid any chip,
hardest part would be welding blades


----------



## Leyaena

First that guy with the hammer... now this


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so next week i can start delidding again, and look for a better way to delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thinking about using a vise, and somehow weld 2 razorblades 90 degrees between it,
> then cpu between the blades, the long sides, and let the vise do its work,
> it will cut, and use pressure to get through the adhesive see,
> well, at least thats my theory ..lol
> only first thoughts, but i think i can make it work, and bet it never would
> touch pcb, the blades would always be 100% right angle,
> picture of how it should look is in my head already..
> no, i didnt smoke anything..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> parts i need..its a one time setup, after that, i can delid any chip,
> hardest part would be welding blades


What you could do is try 2 blades first on the chip and with the two blades have them on either side. And here's the kicker puth the chip upside down. So that the connector facings are up. With this you could use the chips weight to keep the blades in lane with the pcb not scratching it. Then just tighten and let the vice work it. Then repeat for the other sides.

Im on a 5 hour car ride so shoot ideas my way through here or pm and we can make a sure fire plan buddy!


----------



## Leyaena

We could call it... the Delidicator!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> We could call it... the Delidicator!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> We could call it... the Delidicator!


Made by the V bros. Inc


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Made by the V bros. Inc


The v bros? Then people would think we all have female genitalia lmao


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> The v bros? Then people would think we all have female genitalia lmao


Not once they see what we did to our chips lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Not once they see what we did to our chips lol


Vag with balls that is scary lol.


----------



## kgtuning

ROFL. this is why I love this group.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> ROFL. this is why I love this group.


Good! I made it to be that way!


----------



## kzim9

One day I will post my verifaction stuff. Stupid PSU decided it wanted to go back to NCIX/Seasonic because it would not shut off.....









On a side note to that, I posted a few pages back about a concern I had with Cool Lab Pro. Is this stuff pretty much a one time deal? I've read you have to sand it off you you need to re-apply?

Should I just pick up the ultra?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> One day I will post my verifaction stuff. Stupid PSU decided it wanted to go back to NCIX/Seasonic because it would not shut off.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note to that, I posted a few pages back about a concern I had with Cool Lab Pro. Is this stuff pretty much a one time deal? I've read you have to sand it off you you need to re-apply?
> Should I just pick up the ultra?


I have no experience removing it again, since mine is still on the way, but I did see on their website they're selling a special kit to remove it again. That's some cunning economics, right there!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> ROFL. this is why I love this group.
> 
> 
> 
> Good! I made it to be that way!
Click to expand...

That whole thing gave me a much-needed laugh, thanks guys!








I bet no other club on OCN has this much fun


----------



## feniks

long time no see!









finally 3 chips later, I again received the same good batch as I used to have (damaged by former MB) and I am now at 5GHz with 1.56V under load, not bad









(delided)


----------



## ivanlabrie

very nice Feniks!
My board will get here in ten days, so I guess I should have similar results with mine.
I could bench at 5ghz and 1.48v, so hopefully prime stabiity won't be far away vcore-wise.
We defiitely are the best club ocn has


----------



## SimpleTech

For those using Real Temp, a new version came out a few days ago: http://www.techinferno.com/downloads/?did=53

Might want to give that a try.


----------



## lilchronic

lmao. you guys are too much. definetly the best club on ocn and im a noob here lol. wish i new about this club before i tried joining with my old chip
the only thing i new about deliding was from a few youtube videos.
thanks to u guys i have learned alot about the deliding and think ready to go throu with it the right way. not sure there really is a rite way but what the hell this thread is great and taught me a lot thanks guys.
lmao im talkin like this and i still havent got my liguid ultra in the mail yet


----------



## Faelore

Just wondering really quick when I delid how often am I gonna have to change the paste? and what paste the liquid pro or liquid ultra (i hear the pro is hell to remove but the ultra is easy as pie)

I also hear that it degrades very quickly after a Delid like every 6 months it will need a change which tbh is quite often to have to take it out static free while risking the destruction of the chip every 6 months after a delid isnt that bad since I have already risked the destruction of the chip by deliding it kinda sucks knowing I gotta re apply paste every 6 months


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Just wondering really quick when I delid how often am I gonna have to change the paste? and what paste the liquid pro or liquid ultra (i hear the pro is hell to remove but the ultra is easy as pie)
> I also hear that it degrades very quickly after a Delid like every 6 months it will need a change which tbh is quite often to have to take it out static free while risking the destruction of the chip every 6 months after a delid isnt that bad since I have already risked the destruction of the chip by deliding it kinda sucks knowing I gotta re apply paste every 6 months


The Metal paste tims should never degrade.

If you apply Metal pro your gonna get the best results.. and should never have to remove it..

If you use ULtra you will get maybe 3-5 c less then Pro but you can remove it "for what ever reason u may want to"


----------



## Hokies83

dbl post


----------



## Faelore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The Metal paste tims should never degrade.
> If you apply Metal pro your gonna get the best results.. and should never have to remove it..
> If you use ULtra you will get maybe 3-5 c less then Pro but you can remove it "for what ever reason u may want to"


So real quick

The ultra will drop the temps 3-5c more then the pro? meaning its better?

Does the ultra not have to be removed as well?

On a side note I have seen some before and afters of the Pro and lets just say 7 months in it looks like someone went krusty crab on that paste cause it was solid and flaky and probably wasnt doing its job but idk maybe thats how its suppose to be?


----------



## Arm3nian

Im on my last tubing to end my loop and I cant find the ring on the compression fitting... just my dam luck.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> So real quick
> The ultra will drop the temps 3-5c more then the pro? meaning its better?
> Does the ultra not have to be removed as well?
> On a side note I have seen some before and afters of the Pro and lets just say 7 months in it looks like someone went krusty crab on that paste cause it was solid and flaky and probably wasnt doing its job but idk maybe thats how its suppose to be?


Pro is better then Ultra Temp wise.. but Ultra is easy remove


----------



## Faelore

Also just wondering what ends up being better a 5.5 ghz i7 3770k or a 4.4 ghz 3930k lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Also just wondering what ends up being better a 5.5 ghz i7 3770k or a 4.4 ghz 3930k lol


You would need a much higher clocked 3770k to beat a 3930k in benchmarks, it has 2 more physical and 4 more virtual cores. Plus more cache, however in anything besides benchmarks or rendering and such, 3770k would destroy it in, such as games.


----------



## Faelore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You would need a much higher clocked 3770k to beat a 3930k in benchmarks, it has 2 more physical and 4 more virtual cores. Plus more cache, however in anything besides benchmarks or rendering and such, 3770k would destroy it in, such as games.


Muahahaha good to know I was originally going to get the 3930k (sold at micro center for 399.99 which is a steal and a half plus I know a guy who works at one he gets some extra discount or some crap he saved me like 8 bucks on my i7 3770k but they were sold out so I was like fine ill grab a i7 2700k (which was 199.99 on sale) also sold out. So I was like fine ill grab a i5 2500k which was on sale for 99.99 which was also sold out. At that point I asked what he had that was actually on sale and in stock he said i5 3570k for 169.99 or the i7 3770k for 229.99







I sprung the extra scratch for the $100 off the i7 3770k. I am strictly gaming on this system gonna game on a good size screen idk what to get yet any suggestions are welcome


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Muahahaha good to know I was originally going to get the 3930k (sold at micro center for 399.99 which is a steal and a half plus I know a guy who works at one he gets some extra discount or some crap he saved me like 8 bucks on my i7 3770k but they were sold out so I was like fine ill grab a i7 2700k (which was 199.99 on sale) also sold out. So I was like fine ill grab a i5 2500k which was on sale for 99.99 which was also sold out. At that point I asked what he had that was actually on sale and in stock he said i5 3570k for 169.99 or the i7 3770k for 229.99
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sprung the extra scratch for the $100 off the i7 3770k. I am strictly gaming on this system gonna game on a good size screen idk what to get yet any suggestions are welcome


Not sure how screen size would affect performance, unless you mean resolution. If you have not bought anything yet I say the 3570k is enough for any game, especially since you can delid and overclock. 3770k is worth the extra imo but you probably wont see much of a difference in games. 3930k seems like a waste since ivy bridge e should come a bit later, and plus its overkill for games.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Actually clock for clock a 3770k is 7% faster than a 3930k in most benchmarks and specially games, except in heavy multithreaded appliccations, which is what it's built for.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Also just wondering what ends up being better a 5.5 ghz i7 3770k or a 4.4 ghz 3930k lol


In 90% of tasks a 3770k is faster then a 3930k. Clock for clock

3930k only wins in Heavy Multi threaded tasks / running multi tasks at once.


----------



## Faelore

:O good to know







Glad i got my i7 3770k then cant wait to get it up to 5 ghz









Plus blackfriday i7 3770k for 229.99 (the price of the Fx-8350) cant go wrong


----------



## Faelore

what chips can i practice on I will order some off ebay


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> :O good to know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glad i got my i7 3770k then cant wait to get it up to 5 ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Plus blackfriday i7 3770k for 229.99 (the price of the Fx-8350) cant go wrong


Yeah these Ivy's are amazing. tough as nails. but hot like ghost peppers.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> what chips can i practice on I will order some off ebay


old pentiums/celeron, i just bought 10 pentiums for 10 euro,
doesnt matter if they work or not, or are soldered or not,
the practicing is only to get the feeling on how to delid..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> old pentiums/celeron, i just bought 10 pentiums for 10 euro,
> doesnt matter if they work or not, or are soldered or not,
> the practicing is only to get the feeling on how to delid..


can i practice on this pos
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103886


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> old pentiums/celeron, i just bought 10 pentiums for 10 euro,
> doesnt matter if they work or not, or are soldered or not,
> the practicing is only to get the feeling on how to delid..
> 
> 
> 
> can i practice on this pos
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103886
Click to expand...

Just go online and buy some dead ones. The boneyard items because they cost like $5 for anything.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> can i practice on this pos
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103886


ima try anyway lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> So real quick
> The ultra will drop the temps 3-5c more then the pro? meaning its better?
> Does the ultra not have to be removed as well?
> On a side note I have seen some before and afters of the Pro and lets just say 7 months in it looks like someone went krusty crab on that paste cause it was solid and flaky and probably wasnt doing its job but idk maybe thats how its suppose to be?


i like what DirektEffekt said a few pages ago, he is right about that
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I'd like to point out again, to all those people concerned about cleaning off CL Ultra or Pro: The residue WILL NOT negatively effect any future performance. You can leave what you can't wipe off there and, if anything, it will improve the performance of other pastes. All that is really being left behind are traces of metal stuck in imperfections in the material.
> It's actually a feature listed in the product specs and I see no reason not to believe it. Logically it's only filling microscopic grooves in the metal with more metal!


i didnt take my cooler of again yet, im waiting a few more months, just to see how it will look after
7-8 months, i will make pic's by that time, and show how easy/hard it is to remove,
talking about liquid pro, which seems to be the hardest to remove of the 2..

besides the, it will "upgrade" other tim's,
if you use the same tim again, theres no problem at all
i see no reason to use another tim, pro and ultra have proven to be the best
tim's to use on a delidded chip, on the die that is

i dont think it will perform less in 6 months orso, why would they make a tim like that,
any tim will perform a bit less over time(years), and will harden more,
just look if you take off a cooler again after a long time, and how any other tim looks then









if you can take off 80-90% liquid pro/ultra off the normal way, using the cleaning set they sell on the coollaboratory site,
or just use a high % alcohol cleaner, like i use spiritus which is about 85% alcohol,
or rubbing alcohol, reapply tim, it should work just fine..

still have to prove it to myself like i said before, to make sure tho


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just go online and buy some dead ones. The boneyard items because they cost like $5 for anything.


i asked on a Dutch forum for old/broken pentiums for free ..lol
so yesterday i got this response from someone who had, at least, 10 pentiums laying around,
he wanted 10 euro for them, including sending cost etc, using a bubble envelope,
happy i can continue my experiments, already used 4 pentiums i had laying around myselfs ..lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just go online and buy some dead ones. The boneyard items because they cost like $5 for anything.
> 
> 
> 
> i asked on a Dutch forum for old/broken pentiums for free ..lol
> so yesterday i got this response from someone who had, at least, 10 pentiums laying around,
> he wanted 10 euro for them, including sending cost etc, using a bubble envelope,
> happy i can continue my experiments, already used 4 pentiums i had laying around myselfs ..lol
Click to expand...

Yea, I love boneyard things. I used some boneyard stuff from Airsoft to create myself a shooting range in our backyard.









I'm still in awe with the sunglasses I bought today.







(Very extravagant and probably not worth the price but I absolutely adore it!)


----------



## SonDa5

Will be testing my new 3770k later on today. If it looks golden I will delid it. It's brand new!


----------



## VonDutch

you guys ever seen the Ultimate Corsair H100 Cooling Mod?









skip to almost 10 min ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

I love that mod!!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:
Originally Posted by *VonDutch* 

you guys ever seen the Ultimate Corsair H100 Cooling Mod?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I like the cooler Master Boob mod much better..


thats for sure, saw youre post elsewhere, nice to wake up with ..hmmm.......lol


----------



## Leyaena

Still trying to get rid of the smell of spiritus in the room where I delidded








Then again, I guess it smells like... victory!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats for sure, saw youre post elsewhere, nice to wake up with ..hmmm.......lol


Hahahaha, I don't understand why companies do that.. Use women like that to advertise, they obviously have no idea what they're saying (Not so much with the eisberg review) but with others it is. I actually had to watch the review twice to get all of the information on the product. It'd be better to go to bed to though


----------



## Leyaena

TastyPC have some *really* interesting reviews and unboxings, I've noticed. You get to look at nice hardware while looking at nice hardware, know what I'm sayin'?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> TastyPC have some *really* interesting reviews and unboxings, I've noticed. You get to look at nice hardware while looking at nice hardware, know what I'm sayin'?


i hear ya ..








think its gonna be my favorite review site from now on...lol
wish i could "unbox" the girl someday ..hehe


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I like the cooler Master Boob mod much better..


I want to delid that next.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Hahahaha, I don't understand why companies do that.. Use women like that to advertise, they obviously have no idea what they're saying (Not so much with the eisberg review) but with others it is. I actually had to watch the review twice to get all of the information on the product. It'd be better to go to bed to though


o , didnt notice there was actually info in the vid ...lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Hmm Im not quite sure why im watching coolermaster boobs at 5am... when i wake up i will have my pc as i am leak testing overnight. If i get less than a 60c drop compared to before my comp is going out the window


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Hmm Im not quite sure why im watching coolermaster boobs at 5am... when i wake up i will have my pc as i am leak testing overnight. If i get less than a 60c drop compared to before my comp is going out the window


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Hmm Im not quite sure why im watching coolermaster boobs at 5am...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> coolermaster boobs


There's your reason!


----------



## Valgaur

*facepalm*

I wake up to this? Oh boy. Good thing my lovely girlfriend/future wife is just as good looking as her....and um......has been delidded.....*cough* *cough*


----------



## Leyaena

How would your girlfriend feel about doing hardware videos and unboxings?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *facepalm*
> I wake up to this? Oh boy. Good thing my lovely girlfriend/future wife is just as good looking as her....and um......has been delidded.....*cough* *cough*


Youngin..

Wait till your Married for 5+ years like me... Seeing the same women every night...

You will love to "look" and "want to touch" other women ...

But i stick to just looking







"ALOT"


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> How would your girlfriend feel about doing hardware videos and unboxings?


You know.... I've thought about it. I also want to be a product reviewer as well. Just need to get more Ln2 and dice stuff to give me an edge.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Youngin..
> Wait till your Married for 5+ years like me... Seeing the same women every night...
> You will love to "look" and "want to touch" other women ...
> But i stick to just looking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "ALOT"


Oh yeah. (Ve been with her for 3 years so far and I love to keep looking at her all the time lol. Not gonna deny other looks!


----------



## sliflex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> bet youre happy with the results..great job
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but come to think about it, 4.5ghz with 78C hottest core, is still high,
> heres a 4.7ghz after running prime 30min,
> 
> 63C hottest core
> what where you running, ibt, prime ?
> edit:
> my bad, you used ibt,
> 4646mhz running ibt, max ram used
> 
> 59C hottest cores
> the 60C and 78C is a (to big) temp difference also, for a delidded chip,
> before delid mine where about 10-15C, after delid, about 5-6C


yes i think i need 2 reseat the lid ..

the hottest core is high seventy....second is much cooler..



and this is on 1.2 volts 4500mhz...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You know.... I've thought about it. I also want to be a product reviewer as well. Just need to get more Ln2 and dice stuff to give me an edge.
> Oh yeah. (Ve been with her for 3 years so far and I love to keep looking at her all the time lol. Not gonna deny other looks!


You will get board .... Just do not put a Ring on her finger... Find an Asian women for that..









Unless she is in the 1% of the Good American women left in this country.

The other 99% are Hell..


----------



## sliflex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> bet youre happy with the results..great job
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but come to think about it, 4.5ghz with 78C hottest core, is still high,
> heres a 4.7ghz after running prime 30min,
> 
> 63C hottest core
> what where you running, ibt, prime ?
> edit:
> my bad, you used ibt,
> 4646mhz running ibt, max ram used
> 
> 59C hottest cores
> the 60C and 78C is a (to big) temp difference also, for a delidded chip,
> before delid mine where about 10-15C, after delid, about 5-6C


yes i think i need 2 reseat the lid ..

the hottest core is high seventy....second is much cooler..



and this is on 1.2 volts 4500mhz...

running 8gb ram on 1100mhz also


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You will get board .... Just do not put a Ring on her finger... Find an Asian women for that..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unless she is in the 1% of the Good American women left in this country.
> The other 99% are Hell..


Oh she's a good one trust me not those preppy idiot girls. She's a country kid like myself and understands many things, unlike the "shopper" girls out their.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Oh she's a good one trust me not those preppy idiot girls. She's a country kid like myself and understands many things, unlike the "shopper" girls out their.


LoL Not that..

Im talking about the "American Women After you Marry them"

Lazy
Bossy
Gold Digging
Mean and Nasty
Cheating
Buy me this or ill cheat on you with a man who will / or leave u for a man who will.

That is what kind im talking about..

I been married twice first was An American women.. Never again..


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, I know it might seem troll-y but look at what I got for my birthday!







So happy actually.



I would've gotten a computer piece but I wanted something I could bring with me on my vacation in the summer!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL Not that..
> Im talking about the "American Women After you Marry them"
> Lazy
> Bossy
> Gold Digging
> Mean and Nasty
> Cheating
> Buy me this or ill chat on you with a man who will / or leave u for a man who will.
> That is what kind im talking about..
> I been married twice first was An American women.. Never again..


I promise you she's not like that she hates people like that she loves me for my crazyness and myself lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL Not that..
> Im talking about the "American Women After you Marry them"
> Lazy
> Bossy
> Gold Digging
> Mean and Nasty
> Cheating
> Buy me this or ill chat on you with a man who will / or leave u for a man who will.
> That is what kind im talking about..
> I been married twice first was An American women.. Never again..


always thought my ex turned into a alien, now i know she was american, thanks hokies


----------



## Faelore

Lol awesome chat bravo


----------



## Swag

Asian-American girls are the best. I love Asian girls.







Maybe it's because I'm asian but they're just so cute and innocent-like. Innocent-like because they aren't that innocent when they're alone with you!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sliflex*
> 
> yes i think i need 2 reseat the lid ..
> the hottest core is high seventy....second is much cooler..
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1142523/
> 
> 
> and this is on 1.2 volts 4500mhz...
> 
> running 8gb ram on 1100mhz also


i had 10-15C between hottest/coolest core before delid,
now its about 5-6C, think thats the normal difference between core temps








delidded or not..

edit,
think i repeat myself, said about the same yesterday ..srry ..lol








guess i got distracted ..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I promise you she's not like that she hates people like that she loves me for my crazyness and myself lol.


My first wife was like that before i married her lol


----------



## Leyaena

Do you guys think it'd be worth it to sand down the bottom of the IHS just a little bit, in order to reduce the gap between the IHS and the die, thus decreasing temperatures?
I thought I'd read something about it a while back in this thread, but now I can't seem to find it.
If I remember correctly VonDutch did it, right? Did you see any big temperature decreases?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Do you guys think it'd be worth it to sand down the bottom of the IHS just a little bit, in order to reduce the gap between the IHS and the die, thus decreasing temperatures?
> I thought I'd read something about it a while back in this thread, but now I can't seem to find it.
> If I remember correctly VonDutch did it, right? Did you see any big temperature decreases?


Just sand the lip of the IHS not OFF but make it thinner. That will give you precious height reduction onto your die and not completely ruin the IHS I will be testing this december later on on lapping the inside of the IHS once I can get my hands on my dads equipment!


----------



## Arm3nian

Well dudes, I booted up and..... WOW. Gtx 690 cores idling at 21c, both cores identical temps. CPU on prime 95 small ftts 53c hottest core, lowest about mid to high 40s. This is at 4.7 @1.32v, I got my 60c drop compared To the first time applying ultra. I have like so much headroom I think I Can get 5ghz ez. This is with cl pro on everything. Also a very hot day for winter, room was 70faren, should be like 60 or below.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just sand the lip of the IHS not OFF but make it thinner. That will give you precious height reduction onto your die and not completely ruin the IHS I will be testing this december later on on lapping the inside of the IHS once I can get my hands on my dads equipment!


Lap it without taking the lip off?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well dudes, I booted up and..... WOW. Gtx 690 cores idling at 21c, both cores identical temps. CPU on prime 95 small ftts 53c hottest core, lowest about mid to high 40s. This is at 4.7 @1.32v, I got my 60c drop compared To the first time applying ultra. I have like so much headroom I think I Can get 5ghz ez. This is with cl pro on everything. Also a very hot day for winter, room was 70faren, should be like 60 or below.


Great to hear man, congrats!









I *can't wait* for my Liquid Pro to arrive, right now I've got Noctua NT-H1 as a placeholder TIM, but I'm hoping my temperatures will improve even more when I apply the Pro, like yours did.
Obviously not quite as much, since I don't have them under water, but still









I wish those Germans would hurry up and ship it already


----------



## Matt-Matt

***** UDATE *****

Won't be de-lidding anymore, I can't afford to take the loss right now.
Someone tried to break into my car and now the lock has been "popped", such a hassle because to open the car I have to go to the other side then unlock it like that. So freaking mad, I wish I could kill the pricks that did it or break into their house and scratch the crap out of their doors.

What a nice thing to freaking wake up to.

EDIT: Sorry if this post breaks TOS, i'm kind of mad and can you blame me? $120+ that's going into nothing. I can't be bothered even doing anything today and I've got many assesments to do also..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> ***** UDATE *****
> 
> Won't be de-lidding anymore, I can't afford to take the loss right now.
> Someone tried to break into my car and now the lock has been "popped", such a hassle because to open the car I have to go to the other side then unlock it like that. So freaking mad, I wish I could kill the pricks that did it or break into their house and scratch the crap out of their doors.
> 
> What a nice thing to freaking wake up to.
> 
> EDIT: Sorry if this post breaks TOS, i'm kind of mad and can you blame me? $120+ that's going into nothing. I can't be bothered even doing anything today and I've got many assesments to do also..


In America, anyone who touches someone else's property without consent can be shot upon.







I don't know anything about Australia though.

Sorry to hear about your car!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> In America, anyone who touches someone else's property without consent can be shot upon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know anything about Australia though.
> Sorry to hear about your car!


Eh, it's really annoying. I just spent $25 on Ultra + Pro and went out to the warehouse on the weekend (nightclub) and spent upwards of $40 on drinks. Sigh, I would shoot them or knife them here if it was legal..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> In America, anyone who touches someone else's property without consent can be shot upon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know anything about Australia though.
> Sorry to hear about your car!
> 
> 
> 
> Eh, it's really annoying. I just spent $25 on Ultra + Pro and went out to the warehouse on the weekend (nightclub) and spent upwards of $40 on drinks. Sigh, I would shoot them or knife them here if it was legal..
Click to expand...

Lol. Drink at home and it's 1/2 the price.







Why did you buy both the Ultra and Pro?


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> In America, anyone who touches someone else's property without consent can be shot upon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know anything about Australia though.
> Sorry to hear about your car!


Prime Minister Howard took all the guns away (that folks admitted to having) after the Port Arthur massacre, so no, us Aussies can't shoot them.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Prime Minister Howard took all the guns away (that folks admitted to having) after the Port Arthur massacre, so no, us Aussies can't shoot them.


then drag them behind your car by their nipples....


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Prime Minister Howard took all the guns away (that folks admitted to having) after the Port Arthur massacre, so no, us Aussies can't shoot them.


Doesn't mean that some of us don't still and just didn't declare their weapons..








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol. Drink at home and it's 1/2 the price.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why did you buy both the Ultra and Pro?


I normally don't go out, it was my first time I wanted to see what it was like and it was to celebrate exams being over. It was rather interesting in the fact that i woke up the next morning with some chicks stockings in my pocket? I knew whose they were but I can't 100% remember why I had them..

Bought both because shipping for me was almost as much as another tube and I had the cash so I just got both. I'm planning on using Pro on the core and ultra on the top. If that makes sense? Well I _was_ going to do that anyway.


----------



## ivanlabrie

makes sense, use ultra on the ihs for 95% of the performance with 5% of the hassle and pro on die.
Smart move if you ask me.


----------



## Arm3nian

Running IBT and getting a linpack error, doesn't even start, i'm at 5ghz with 1.45, just threw in some random voltage. Prime works though, 63 on hottest core.


----------



## Hokies83

Use Pro on the Die Ultra on the IHS for Least Hassle results.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> For those using Real Temp, a new version came out a few days ago: http://www.techinferno.com/downloads/?did=53
> Might want to give that a try.


is it legit?

AFAIK, I always downloaded it from Techpowerup and they still show 3.70 as the latest one:
http://www.techpowerup.com/realtemp/


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Running IBT and getting a linpack error, doesn't even start, i'm at 5ghz with 1.45, just threw in some random voltage. Prime works though, 63 on hottest core.


Do you have page file disabled?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> is it legit?
> AFAIK, I always downloaded it from Techpowerup and they still show 3.70 as the latest one:
> http://www.techpowerup.com/realtemp/


Of course it's legit.

From the master himself:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?179044-Real-Temp-New-temp-program-for-Intel-Core-processors&p=2809778


----------



## alancsalt

Good ol' unclewebb!
Great little prog, and that thread at XtremeSystems has some good info on how temp reading works..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> Do you have page file disabled?
> Of course it's legit.
> From the master himself:
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?179044-Real-Temp-New-temp-program-for-Intel-Core-processors&p=2809778


thanks! didn't know. will update soon


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> makes sense, use ultra on the ihs for 95% of the performance with 5% of the hassle and pro on die.
> Smart move if you ask me.


My idea exactly, I get confused as to which one "bonds" and is harder to remove and which one is easier to remove. But my idea was to get the 2-3c better performance with the better stuff that is hard to remove because it will help keep the IHS on the CPU. Which one is actually the stronger one?


----------



## feniks

BTW, hokies, I have beaten that damn Xeon in Cinebench


----------



## unclewebb

I came over here to share the new version with my friends at Overclock.net but no one bothered to give the thread a bump so it disappeared.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1330144/realtemp-t-i-edition

I am just checking out a few new features. I got a few new features I am thinking about before 3.80 is released. Enjoy.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> BTW, hokies, I have beaten that damn Xeon in Cinebench


Not sure what xeon that is or how that bench is run but I saw a xeon beat a 3960x at 5.5ghz by like 20 times lol.

And what about running over 1.52volts which is considered safe. I have very good temps, but worried about going above the recommended voltage.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *unclewebb*
> 
> I came over here to share the new version with my friends at Overclock.net but no one bothered to give the thread a bump so it disappeared.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1330144/realtemp-t-i-edition
> I am just checking out a few new features. I got a few new features I am thinking about before 3.80 is released. Enjoy.


Great!

This will make it very easy and accurate to measure before and after cooling performance when delidding.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> BTW, hokies, I have beaten that damn Xeon in Cinebench


Heh Your chip must be faster then mine then.. Cause i have 2400mhz ram same timing and at 5.1ghz best i can do is 10.20 score.

Costa Rica?

My 3770k is also from the Ivy Release day in April.. so maybe they refined them better or something? i donno.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Not sure what xeon that is or how that bench is run but I saw a xeon beat a 3960x at 5.5ghz by like 20 times lol.
> And what about running over 1.52volts which is considered safe. I have very good temps, but worried about going above the recommended voltage.


that xeon is most likely at stock clocks








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heh Your chip must be faster then mine then.. Cause i have 2400mhz ram same timing and at 5.1ghz best i can do is 10.20 score.
> Costa Rica?
> My 3770k is also from the Ivy Release day in April.. so maybe they refined them better or something? i donno.


heh, don't worry I wasn't able to repeat that at even higher vcore








my cpu wasn't stable when beating it, but oh well, score is score


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> then drag them behind your car by their nipples....


I always wanted to find a no trespassing sign that reads

Trespassers will be shot.
Survivors will be tortured.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heh Your chip must be faster then mine then.. Cause i have 2400mhz ram same timing and at 5.1ghz best i can do is 10.20 score.
> Costa Rica?
> My 3770k is also from the Ivy Release day in April.. so maybe they refined them better or something? i donno.


Could be the board difference too, some boards auto set subtimings better than others, or just benchmark higher in some things.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I always wanted to find a no trespassing sign that reads
> Trespassers will be shot.
> Survivors will be tortured.
> Could be the board difference too, some boards auto set subtimings better than others, or just benchmark higher in some things.


Yah i need to work on my Ram timings been lazy gaming.. And debating with Fan boys / Air heads..

Seems alot of are getting the G skill 2400mhz cas 10 kits... need to figure out how it likes being overclocked..

So far from what ive tried it hates it...


----------



## Faelore

So quick question does deliding and applying the pro/ultra help with all the 3770ks or just some? I have heard it both ways


----------



## Faelore

If it helps I have a Costa Rica 3770k batch number 322XXX


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> If it helps I have a Costa Rica 3770k batch number 322XXX


Drops temps 20-35 c

Only people it does not help are people who applied there tim wrong... Or did not remove the glue / put IHS back into the right place.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I always wanted to find a no trespassing sign that reads
> *Trespassers will be shot.
> Survivors will be tortured.*


Vice City Reference orrrr?
Also from Farcry 2 later on


----------



## kweechy

Don't feel like sifting through all 375 pages so I apologize here.

Has anyone had any results doing this to 3930/3960 chips at all? I read that it's really down to Intel's TIM application on the Ivy chips. Sandy might be soldered to the IHS for all I know and not possible to delid (sadly).


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kweechy*
> 
> Don't feel like sifting through all 375 pages so I apologize here.
> 
> Has anyone had any results doing this to 3930/3960 chips at all? I read that it's really down to Intel's TIM application on the Ivy chips. Sandy might be soldered to the IHS for all I know and not possible to delid (sadly).


Socket 2011 is soldered And More Volt limited then heat limited.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kweechy*
> 
> Don't feel like sifting through all 375 pages so I apologize here.
> 
> Has anyone had any results doing this to 3930/3960 chips at all? I read that it's really down to Intel's TIM application on the Ivy chips. Sandy might be soldered to the IHS for all I know and not possible to delid (sadly).


You can delid the bad boys.... but it's highly dangerous and not worth it. At all.

Like Hokies said vcore limits. not heat. Ivy is backwards on this.

For the Crew:

I have a customer build right now. How does one ship a 80 lb comp. without costing an arm and a leg?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You can delid the bad boys.... but it's highly dangerous and not worth it. At all.
> Like Hokies said vcore limits. not heat. Ivy is backwards on this.
> For the Crew:
> I have a customer build right now. How does one ship a 80 lb comp. without costing an arm and a leg?


Create Fedex account and Ship fedex ground.

20% off with account iv e shipped monitors for 25$ via Fedex.

Systems still selling for you?

I have not sold one for a month...

This guy ca not even sell this 2500$ rig for 1300$ in my Area..
http://roanoke.craigslist.org/sys/3422473072.html

And i can not even sell my HTPC for 350$ in my Area...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Create Fedex account and Ship fedex ground.
> 20% off with account iv e shipped monitors for 25$ via Fedex.
> Systems still selling for you?
> I have not sold one for a month...
> This guy ca not even sell this 2500$ rig for 1300$ in my Area..
> http://roanoke.craigslist.org/sys/3422473072.html
> And i can not even sell my HTPC for 350$ in my Area...


Not worth $2500, more like $2000 but yeah. The economy is worse there then it here and I'm amazed at how you guys live.


----------



## Valgaur

Yeah it's a $1500 rig. need to ship it over 5 states lol.

Fully buil;d and loaded. gonna kill my profit. not to badly I hope.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Not worth $2500, more like $2000 but yeah. The economy is worse there then it here and I'm amazed at how you guys live.


I eat once a day. Thats how I live. My computers gets better treatment than I do.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I eat once a day. Thats how I live. My computers gets better treatment than I do.


Wow.. Do you give it thermal paste more then once a day?








But yes, before I got my car and license etc. My computer had double the amount of money I spent on it then what I did on other things.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I eat once a day. Thats how I live. My computers gets better treatment than I do.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow.. Do you give it thermal paste more then once a day?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But yes, before I got my car and license etc. My computer had double the amount of money I spent on it then what I did on other things.
Click to expand...

Haha, I'm on the same boat as you now. I have to pay for my own insurance and since I'm still young, my premium is $450/month! Crazy! I think I might just get a secondary driver's insurance but we'll see!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, I'm on the same boat as you now. I have to pay for my own insurance and since I'm still young, my premium is $450/month! Crazy! I think I might just get a secondary driver's insurance but we'll see!


Lmao... But i can remember being 19 and paying 350$ a month for liability on a 1991 Honda Crx @[email protected]

I have 2 cars and my Insurance is 92$ a month full coverage with Rent a car and road side







Married and 29


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, I'm on the same boat as you now. I have to pay for my own insurance and since I'm still young, my premium is $450/month! Crazy! I think I might just get a secondary driver's insurance but we'll see!


just got mine...... 558.... so much for a 680...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, I'm on the same boat as you now. I have to pay for my own insurance and since I'm still young, my premium is $450/month! Crazy! I think I might just get a secondary driver's insurance but we'll see!
> 
> 
> 
> just got mine...... 558.... so much for a 680...
Click to expand...

Yea, I hate it. I have to pay like a $2000 deductible too which is what pisses me off. I'll see if I can do a secondary though. Supposedly it increases the primary's by only $50 - $75 if they're your parent or if they are significantly older like grandparents or something.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, I'm on the same boat as you now. I have to pay for my own insurance and since I'm still young, my premium is $450/month! Crazy! I think I might just get a secondary driver's insurance but we'll see!


Same, well my parents "sorted it all out" before. I've got nothing, I'm actually happy the lock shattered because if they had have taken it i'd have had no car.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> just got mine...... 558.... so much for a 680...


$558? Wow
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I hate it. I have to pay like a $2000 deductible too which is what pisses me off. I'll see if I can do a secondary though. Supposedly it increases the primary's by only $50 - $75 if they're your parent or if they are significantly older like grandparents or something.


Well yeah, I'm at the peak of the price for insurance so it's almost not worth it.. Especially when you're driving around a $2500 Audi with insurance premiums being $500+ a month! And then you have to do payouts. Third party is defiantly worth it, and it is illegal here to not have it. (I dunno about in the states?)

Just annoys me that they can be so discriminatory to young drivers. It should be an equal price to everyone, I.E Instead of $500+ for us young drivers and $90 for Mr and Mrs Brown who live down the road (They probably drive a newer car too). They should make it something like $280 for everyone. Maybe have fees for people that have had accidents themselves though.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I hate it. I have to pay like a $2000 deductible too which is what pisses me off. I'll see if I can do a secondary though. Supposedly it increases the primary's by only $50 - $75 if they're your parent or if they are significantly older like grandparents or something.


I hate insurance.


----------



## Swag

Problem with the idea that everyone gets the same price is that it becomes useless to be a safe driver and companies won't earn as much because young people tend to be the more irresponsible ones and cost them more money. Of course, there are those few adults who act like children and are sometimes even worse but the majority isn't.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I hate it. I have to pay like a $2000 deductible too which is what pisses me off. I'll see if I can do a secondary though. Supposedly it increases the primary's by only $50 - $75 if they're your parent or if they are significantly older like grandparents or something.
> 
> 
> 
> I hate insurance.
Click to expand...

I think all the young people and when it gets cheaper and you get into an accident, you love it. Especially in America where everyone sues each other for the smallest things! "Oh I hit you but I have whiplash so you're at fault and I'm going to sue you for thousands." Dumb!


----------



## 316320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You can delid the bad boys.... but it's highly dangerous and not worth it. At all.
> Like Hokies said vcore limits. not heat. Ivy is backwards on this.
> For the Crew:
> I have a customer build right now. How does one ship a 80 lb comp. without costing an arm and a leg?
> 
> 
> 
> Create Fedex account and Ship fedex ground.
> 
> 20% off with account iv e shipped monitors for 25$ via Fedex.
> 
> Systems still selling for you?
> 
> I have not sold one for a month...
> 
> This guy ca not even sell this 2500$ rig for 1300$ in my Area..
> http://roanoke.craigslist.org/sys/3422473072.html
> 
> And i can not even sell my HTPC for 350$ in my Area...
Click to expand...

That sounds terrible.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I always wanted to find a no trespassing sign that reads
> Trespassers will be shot.
> Survivors will be tortured.


I thought it was

Tresspassers will be shot
Survivors will be shot again

??


----------



## Arm3nian

Are you supposed to remove the black glue from the traces? I only removed from the ihs, getting amazing temps though, and you can rip my eyes out and I wont undo everything again, just wondering


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Are you supposed to remove the black glue from the traces? I only removed from the ihs, getting amazing temps though, and you can rip my eyes out and I wont undo everything again, just wondering


yea, normally you remove all the adhesive from ihs and pcb,
but if it works for you, "never change a winning team " right "


----------



## DirektEffekt

One thing I noticed over here about insurance on cars for young drivers is that you actually get charged LESS if you own a newer car! I think most of the money is for payouts they expect to make to OTHER road users and they think the younger people who pay more for their cars are probably less likely to wreck it. I know the insurance on a friend's 2007 car was less for full comprehensive than it was on another friend's $4000 banger for just third party!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Will be testing my new 3770k later on today. If it looks golden I will delid it. It's brand new!


Not delidded yet but it is behaving good enough to be delidded.









http://valid.canardpc.com/2595380
Not prime95\IBT stable but can game and pass 32m with decent temps.

Took me over 2 hours of polishing and cleaning to get CL Liquid PRo off my water block. Used the CL Liquid PRo Scrubber a little with Brasso to clean and used a micro fiber rag to clean and polish. Also used alcohol.

Photos of the cleaning.

Dirty



Clean


3770k with IC Diamond. (I used alcohol on my fingers to compact it as thin as possible before seating it)



Almost done testing then will delid.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> One thing I noticed over here about insurance on cars for young drivers is that you actually get charged LESS if you own a newer car! I think most of the money is for payouts they expect to make to OTHER road users and they think the younger people who pay more for their cars are probably less likely to wreck it. I know the insurance on a friend's 2007 car was less for full comprehensive than it was on another friend's $4000 banger for just third party!


in my country younger drivers, 18 to 24 years old,
pay more, and older peeps 64 years and above pay more,
some dont even give insurance to the old people ...aaww

a 18 year old, with a Peugeot 205 ('99), that drives about 8.000 km per year,
pays about 432 euro($559) per year car insurance, cheapest i could find just now..


----------



## SonDa5

Final testing for before delidding temps.

[email protected] vCore 1.15v
4.5GHZ
Watercooleed with UT-60 RAD and DT Sniper water block.
TIM IC Diamond
Not Delidded
Ambient Temps 21C
http://valid.canardpc.com/2595435

HT on



Package Min 26c Max 66C

HT off



Package Min 23C Max 66C


----------



## Leyaena

My coollaboratory liquid pro arrived!
Can't wait to get off work


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Final testing for before delidding temps.
> [email protected] vCore 1.15v
> 4.5GHZ
> Watercooleed with UT-60 RAD and DT Sniper water block.
> TIM IC Diamond
> Not Delidded
> Ambient Temps 21C
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2595435
> HT on
> 
> Package Min 26c Max 66C
> HT off
> 
> Package Min 23C Max 66C


Very nice! I hope you're not trying to direct die contact though? I've seen/heard quite a few horror stories with those.. That being said goodluck and nice loop!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> My coollaboratory liquid pro arrived!
> Can't wait to get off work


Nice!








I can't wait for mine to get here, after finding out that to get my car fixed it might be as little as $10 and a maximum in reality of $100ish I'm happyish about it. It looks like (To me) that the lock may just be unaligned and that it can be taken off and put back into place. I don't know though because I am not a locksmith. I did order the paste though.. It's christmas soon AND I do have a backup PC that will play rubbish games till christmas.


----------



## Leyaena

Expecting some income from Christmas gifts, are we?









That's one of the benefits of working, I guess, regular paychecks ^^
Especially in IT, I really can't complain about my wages


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Very nice! I hope you're not trying to direct die contact though?


Thanks.







Looks like a decent batch worthy of delidding and yes I am going to do direct die contact mount, it worked out great on my 3570k and I don't anticipate any problems that I haven't prepared myself for.


----------



## gizmo83

So. What is the best way to clean up liquid pro from the his?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> So. What is the best way to clean up liquid pro from the his?


I'm affraid there's no quick and easy way, this is how SonDa5 did it though, should work the same way for your IHS:

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Took me over 2 hours of polishing and cleaning to get CL Liquid PRo off my water block. Used the CL Liquid PRo Scrubber a little with Brasso to clean and used a micro fiber rag to clean and polish. Also used alcohol.
> 
> Photos of the cleaning.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Snip
> 
> 
> 
> Dirty
> 
> 
> 
> Clean


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> So. What is the best way to clean up liquid pro from the his?


use any other tim on the IHS,
we only use liquid pro/ultra on the die,
because it gives the best results..

top of the die is made of "glass", so its easier to clean,
if you ever need to change/renew it again









Sonda cleaned it really really good,
there no problem if theres some liquid pro left, after normal cleaning,
it could even upgrade the new/other tim you use on the die

edit,
thought his was a typo, and you mean ihs ..lol
yea, seems its hard to remove, ultra is easier then pro to remove,
cant wait to take my cooler of again, and see if i can clean pro easy or not








still have to wait a few more months, to let it "harden" some more, if it does..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Expecting some income from Christmas gifts, are we?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's one of the benefits of working, I guess, regular paychecks ^^
> Especially in IT, I really can't complain about my wages


IT has decent wages overall here, not the best but by far not the worst. Well that and I'll be able to save up more if I need to. I can probably complain to my grandmother/auntie that something broke and my _only_ computer is not useless. That and mum gets a government rebate thing for "Technology" so she will help me pay for it, it'll just mean I get a worse laptop but meh. It's only for Uni i'll end up getting an SSD later on either way








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like a decent batch worthy of delidding and yes I am going to do direct die contact mount, it worked out great on my 3570k and I don't anticipate any problems that I haven't prepared myself for.


Nice! Well in that case, what problems with direct die mounting?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> IT has decent wages overall here, not the best but by far not the worst. Well that and I'll be able to save up more if I need to. I can probably complain to my grandmother/auntie that something broke and my _only_ computer is not useless. That and mum gets a government rebate thing for "Technology" so she will help me pay for it, it'll just mean I get a worse laptop but meh. It's only for Uni i'll end up getting an SSD later on either way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice! Well in that case, what problems with direct die mounting?


He is watercooled, so he can control the pressure on the die.


----------



## Valgaur

Sonda. Not fair on the chip man. I want my i7 at those vcores. I love franky and all but not cool man.


----------



## wholeeo

Removing liquid pro off the die and bottom side of the heatsink was easier than I imagined. I wouldn't dare put it in between my cpu block and IHS though.


----------



## Leyaena

*sigh*

Just went to the hardware store to get some sandpaper in order to lap my IHS.
Apparently the highest grit they had was 600...
I don't suppose that'll do to properly lap your IHS?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> *sigh*
> Just went to the hardware store to get some sandpaper in order to lap my IHS.
> Apparently the highest grit they had was 600...
> I don't suppose that'll do to properly lap your IHS?


Auto parts store for a finer grit

Anyways
*
249$ 3770k Free Shipping GO Go Go*

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=2372989&sku=I69-3770K


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> *sigh*
> Just went to the hardware store to get some sandpaper in order to lap my IHS.
> Apparently the highest grit they had was 600...
> I don't suppose that'll do to properly lap your IHS?


600 to start, than go 1000, 2000 and if you want a mirror finish 3000


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Auto parts store for a finer grit


Guess lapping'll have to wait until tomorrow then, since the closest auto parts store closes in 2 minutes








Too bad, I was really itching to get everything finished tonight


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Guess lapping'll have to wait until tomorrow then, since the closest auto parts store closes in 2 minutes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too bad, I was really itching to get everything finished tonight


If it is not there lots of it on Ebay.


----------



## Hokies83

*Bare-die testing: A delidded 3770k, an H100, and 9 different TIMs*

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=34289321&posted=1#post34289321



Here is one for Valgaur..


----------



## Systemlord

Good God I hope I never have to remove my CPU from my motherboard socket, I used the entire syringe of CL Pro on my die! I'll be serving CL Pro pancakes, what are my chances of the die and IHS sticking together if I ever need to remove my CPU? Also will Indigo Xtreme easily come off my super shiny nickel plated cold plate?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Good God I hope I never have to remove my CPU from my motherboard socket, I used the entire syringe of CL Pro on my die! I'll be serving CL Pro pancakes, what are my chances of the die and IHS sticking together if I ever need to remove my CPU? Also will Indigo Xtreme easily come off my super shiny nickel plated cold plate?


Yes indigo Xtreme will literally peel off. mine did if not a blade will take it right off.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> *Bare-die testing: A delidded 3770k, an H100, and 9 different TIMs*
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=34289321&posted=1#post34289321
> 
> Here is one for Valgaur..


Nice try lol. I saw that comin miles away









it's hard to scare me now a days man.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Good God I hope I never have to remove my CPU from my motherboard socket, I used the entire syringe of CL Pro on my die! I'll be serving CL Pro pancakes, what are my chances of the die and IHS sticking together if I ever need to remove my CPU? Also will Indigo Xtreme easily come off my super shiny nickel plated cold plate?


die and ihs will always stick together a bit after a while,
whatever tim you use, with a little twist/pull it will come off tho..
you could do a remount, its easier to clean now, if its not that long under it,
never used indigo extreme, cant say how it comes off
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yes indigo Xtreme will literally peel off. mine did if not a blade will take it right off.


yea, remember you telling that,
didnt you haver a cool pic of it, with the mirror letters printed in the indigo extreme


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Good God I hope I never have to remove my CPU from my motherboard socket, I used the entire syringe of CL Pro on my die! I'll be serving CL Pro pancakes, what are my chances of the die and IHS sticking together if I ever need to remove my CPU? Also will Indigo Xtreme easily come off my super shiny nickel plated cold plate?


There is no reason to use that much CL Pro. All I use is a small drop for both the die and the block surface contact area.


----------



## martinhal

Sorry if this was asked before. Too lazy to look at all the pages. Do I apply CLP to the top of the die only or do I put some under the IHS too ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Sorry if this was asked before. Too lazy to look at all the pages. Do I apply CLP to the top of the die only or do I put some under the IHS too ?


You can do both. but thin do not over do it..

But if u do not no need to worry as u can add more LP to what is already there and spread it.


----------



## Shaldome

Man, I tomorrow cannot come fast enough with my pay check so that I can hit the order button with my 3770k. But this 3820 and RIVE are singing to me somehow...


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> Man, I tomorrow cannot come fast enough with my pay check so that I can hit the order button with my 3770k. But this 3820 and RIVE are singing to me somehow...


Don't forget to order a high quality razer to take the lid off.


----------



## Shaldome

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Don't forget to order a high quality razer to take the lid off.


Actually that feels like treason. As thanks for choosing the 3770k I will put a knife though her "rips".


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> Actually that feels like treason. As thanks for choosing the 3770k I will put a knife though her "rips".


She will more than thank you. trust me. it's better to make her better than have her suffer going through all the pain and heat that will be a down side to the chip. If you really want to love her. Show her love so she can love you right back.


----------



## bgineng

Well... after 6 months of me being a wimp, you guys have convinced me that it's time to take off the lid. Liquid Pro is on the way. Time for my H100 to show me what it's actually capable of.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> He is watercooled, so he can control the pressure on the die.


Yeah but it's still dangerous.


----------



## ivanlabrie

He's done it before, he knows his chops...I thought about doing a bare die mount but thinking it over I'll stick with a lapped Pentium 4 IHS on my die.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bgineng*
> 
> Well... after 6 months of me being a wimp, you guys have convinced me that it's time to take off the lid. Liquid Pro is on the way. Time for my H100 to show me what it's actually capable of.


6 months? the moment I found this club I delided lmao


----------



## bgineng

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 6 months? the moment I found this club I delided lmao


Well, about 6 months since I got my 3770k. Only 1.5 months since this thread exploded


----------



## Hokies83

Im Valguars Daddy.


----------



## bgineng

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Remember if u fail u can Rma.. if that helps with the worry..
> Id grab some black rubber glue to.


Yeah I remember seeing a post about that a while back. Hopefully it doesn't come to that. Is there a certain kind that seems to be the most identical to the original glue?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bgineng*
> 
> Yeah I remember seeing a post about that a while back. Hopefully it doesn't come to that. Is there a certain kind that seems to be the most identical to the original glue?


Yes


----------



## ivanlabrie

R.T.V. Black sealant...it's always good for those finicky mirror frames cough xD


----------



## stickg1

Can I use Antec Formula 7 in between the core and IHS? I have a bunch of it as the local best buy had it on clearance for $7 a tube. I remove my cooler a lot and go through thermal paste quite frequently.


----------



## bgineng

Good to know. You know. For those mirror frames... +rep to you guys.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Formula 7 is similar to IC Diamond, give it a go...Liquid Pro or Ultra are the best and second best though.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bgineng*
> 
> Good to know. You know. For those mirror frames... +rep to you guys.


----------



## Valgaur

Hokies is my father.....

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

We're jacks of all trades here, what you wanna know ask!








Even car repair or home related stuff lol


----------



## stickg1

After I remove the IHS, clean it, then what's the step by step?

1. Put chip in LGA socket
2. Apply thermal paste to core
3. Place and lock IHS to the chip with the socket locking arm
4. Apply thermal paste to IHS

Is that how it goes?

Also what about if I want to remove the chip from the socket, will the IHS stay on it and is it basically adhered by the thermal paste?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> After I remove the IHS, clean it, then what's the step by step?
> 1. Put chip in LGA socket
> 2. Apply thermal paste to core
> 3. Place and lock IHS to the chip with the socket locking arm
> 4. Apply thermal paste to IHS
> Is that how it goes?
> Also what about if I want to remove the chip from the socket, will the IHS stay on it and is it basically adhered by the thermal paste?


To make it much more easy remove MB when u put the chip back in..

Trying to hold chip and put on Ihs and lock it down has led afew ppl to Bend MB pins.

Why i advise to avoid the risk 100% by removing the mb.

And make sure you constantly Ground yourself cause ur touching the Cpu a lot..

1 Static shock and it is gone.. Take break if ur hands get tired and take ur time.


----------



## jprovido

I was blaming intel for my terrible temps with my i5 3570k. after replacing my NH-D14 with a corsair h100i my temps improved dramatically. now I'm a 4.8ghz and temps never go above 85 degrees. (a far cry fom my 4.5ghz that one core goes up to 90 degees after 24 hours of prime) as weird as it may sound now I have the urge of delidding it wayyy more than before. I'm getting a 4.8ghz overclock on a fairly low 1.34v and I assume I may have a golden one here. I'm gonna delid it in a few hours. ima post results asap!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not exactly golden, but pretty good. Mine did 1.37v for 4.7ghz...curious to see your h100i results.


----------



## chris-br

Now I'm curious too, cuz i do have a d14.









Edit: What about noise levels?


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not exactly golden, but pretty good. Mine did 1.37v for 4.7ghz...curious to see your h100i results.


I could prolly turn down the voltage a bit tbh but I wanted to get a rock solid stable setting first, I ran prime 18 hours and temps never went above 85 degrees(I thought I could get close to 5ghz without delidding) how far can I push the voltage btw? can I have it at 1.45v without any problem as long as I keep temps on check? sadly I have no means of getting a the liquid pro TIM from where I'm from. hopefully I can get at least a 10 degree improvement from a gelid GC extreme tim
Quote:


> Now I'm curious too, cuz i do have a d14.
> 
> Edit: What about noise levels?


it is a bit louder compared to my NH-D14 mainly because of the fans that I used (two silverstone FM121 fans I had lying around) I used the silverstone fans for push then the fans that came with it for pull. temps are great and the cooler looks awesome. im playing around with the fan profiles and I think I can have it work like on graphics cards that your fans will only rev up at a specific temp threshold. it doesn't need to stay loud 100% of the time. cool piece of software the corsair link is


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> I could prolly turn down the voltage a bit tbh but I wanted to get a rock solid stable setting first, I ran prime 18 hours and temps never went above 85 degrees(I thought I could get close to 5ghz without delidding) how far can I push the voltage btw? can I have it at 1.45v without any problem as long as I keep temps on check? sadly I have no means of getting a the liquid pro TIM from where I'm from. hopefully I can get at least a 10 degree improvement from a gelid GC extreme tim
> it is a bit louder compared to my NH-D14 mainly because of the fans that I used (two silverstone FM121 fans I had lying around) I used the silverstone fans for push then the fans that came with it for pull. temps are great and the cooler looks awesome. im playing around with the fan profiles and I think I can have it work like on graphics cards that your fans will only rev up at a specific temp threshold. it doesn't need to stay loud 100% of the time. cool piece of software the corsair link is


I think the free corsair link is the way it should have been with the h100 from scratch...but well.
Back on topic, you can do 1.52v as max but I wouldn't go over 1.45v without delidding.
And you CAN get Liquid Pro anywhere in the world shipped, for 17usd if you buy from www.sidewindercomputers.com , only thing you gotta do is select USPS International First Class shipping and own a credit card and/or paypal account.


----------



## FtW 420

I ended up delidding again to put a better coat of the ultra on the die, bit more this time did the trick. It was running at 4.6 @ 1.32V after the first ultra application maxing at 82°, now maxing at the same temps but 4.8Ghz at 1.4V air cooled. The superglue I used to glue the IHS on did pretty good, held the IHS in place fine for handling & locking it into the latch & just had to get the razor under one corner to pop it off (just used a tiny drop on each corner).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Very nice, and good idea...extra safe for your socket pins.


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think the free corsair link is the way it should have been with the h100 from scratch...but well.
> Back on topic, you can do 1.52v as max but I wouldn't go over 1.45v without delidding.
> And you CAN get Liquid Pro anywhere in the world shipped, for 17usd if you buy from www.sidewindercomputers.com , only thing you gotta do is select USPS International First Class shipping and own a credit card and/or paypal account.




omg + rep. trust me I've looked long and hard and I've never found a site that can ship it to me with reasonable shipping cost. 5.50USD shipping cost to Manila,Philippines is not bad at all! heck I'd spend even more than that for gas if I wanted to buy something from where I'm from. thanks man. just ordered one. ima hold off delidding till I get this. I want this to be a one-shot affair. if I delid it it's not going off my motherboard anymore.

i too am worried about the installing process. would you guys recommend gluing it like sir ftw 20 did?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> omg + rep. trust me I've looked long and hard and I've never found a site that can ship it to me with reasonable shipping cost. 5.50USD shipping cost to Manila,Philippines is not bad at all! heck I'd spend even more than that for gas if I wanted to buy something from where I'm from. thanks man. just ordered one. ima hold off delidding till I get this. I want this to be a one-shot affair. if I delid it it's not going off my motherboard anymore.
> i too am worried about the installing process. would you guys recommend gluing it like sir ftw 20 did?


Its up to you. I didn't bother gluing mine down. I haven't had any issues. I taken mine out 3 times so far and had no issues lining the IHS up each time.


----------



## FtW 420

I hope the customs guys in the Philippines are nicer than Canadian customs, the CA guys use way too much TIM. If I order again I'll have to get 2 so they save some for me...

Edit: I really only glued mine since I sometimes change cpus several times a day.


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I hope the customs guys in the Philippines are nicer than Canadian customs, the CA guys use way too much TIM. If I order again I'll have to get 2 so they save some for me...
> Edit: I really only glued mine since I sometimes change cpus several times a day.


what do you mean? they opened up the package and almost emptied up the syringe? afaik the customs here aren't that "strict". not good at all but I guess it's better for my luquid pro lol.

btw what's the difference between liquid pro and liquid ultra?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I hope the customs guys in the Philippines are nicer than Canadian customs, the CA guys use way too much TIM. If I order again I'll have to get 2 so they save some for me...
> Edit: I really only glued mine since I sometimes change cpus several times a day.


Sidewinder guys are nice, they'd issue a refund no sweat...totally trust them.
Heck, you can buy gpu's and water cooling stuff too! (bet it's cheaper than Ph too)


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sidewinder guys are nice, they'd issue a refund no sweat...totally trust them.
> Heck, you can buy gpu's and water cooling stuff too! (bet it's cheaper than Ph too)


one thing I like here in manila is it's good to be a pc enthusiast here. pc parts, watercooling stuff etc. are very well priced(close to retail price in the US) and it's all available within the city just a 15-30 minute drive. you can rma and get replacement on the same day too if you go directly to the distributors


----------



## ivanlabrie

Oh, that's great!
Here stuff costs 4x the US price...even used is 3x the cost.








I buy from the US, either at the marketplace or from etailers via a friend of mine (or Sidewinder)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> what do you mean? they opened up the package and almost emptied up the syringe? afaik the customs here aren't that "strict". not good at all but I guess it's better for my luquid pro lol.
> btw what's the difference between liquid pro and liquid ultra?


The blister pack wasn't sealed shut so they did open it up & squeeze some out, pics show it full to the 1.5g mark but i received it with the cap full of TIM & after squeezing out 2 drops it was a bit below the 1.0g mark. The customs guy pressed the plunger a bit hard.
Also stocked up on gelid extreme for ln2 cooling, those were sealed packs & I could see they tried to open the corners but left them alone after seeing they were factory sealed.


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Oh, that's great!
> Here stuff costs 4x the US price...even used is 3x the cost.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I buy from the US, either at the marketplace or from etailers via a friend of mine (or Sidewinder)


wow that's got to be hard. all my parts are bought from one store and it's just a few blocks away from where I'm from. I've been a long time customer and I even get "special treatment". I bought a 7970 Direct CU II for a friend of mine and the owner even let me test if it's voltage locked or not. the first card that was tested was voltage locked so they got me another one









btw what's the difference between liquid pro and liquid ultra?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ultra is half as good, but still better than all the other tims out there.
I'd go with Ultra on the IHS and Pro on the die, or if not Indigo Xtreme or IC Diamond on the IHS. Perhaps mx-4, or some other premium paste for the ihs/heatsink contact surface.
Liquid Pro eats through aluminum and is hard to remove, gotta lap to get a clean finish again, Ultra not that hard...you can wipe it with alcohol and some paper lol


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ultra is half as good, but still better than all the other tims out there.
> I'd go with Ultra on the IHS and Pro on the die, or if not Indigo Xtreme or IC Diamond on the IHS. Perhaps mx-4, or some other premium paste for the ihs/heatsink contact surface.
> Liquid Pro eats through aluminum and is hard to remove, gotta lap to get a clean finish again, Ultra not that hard...you can wipe it with alcohol and some paper lol


thanks for the info. so pro is for the die and ultra is for the IHS. I still have an almost un used gelid gc xtreme tube here. it's a fairly good tim so ima settle with that for the IHS. thanks agian


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, good call, use that...You won't see a big difference, maybe 3c.


----------



## Arm3nian

Can I get some responds to what voltage range I should be in for 5ghz. I know it varies but a general idea. I tried 1.52 but crashed, but my cpu is weird and is stable at lower voltages for the same clock speeds than at higher voltages. My cooling is really good, highest i've seen is 55c at 4.7, and this is coming from 90+ on my h100 before I went closed water and delided.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Can I get some responds to what voltage range I should be in for 5ghz. I know it varies but a general idea. I tried 1.52 but crashed, *but my cpu is weird and is stable at lower voltages for the same clock speeds than at higher voltages.* My cooling is really good, highest i've seen is 55c at 4.7, and this is coming from 90+ on my h100 before I went closed water and delided.


AFAIK that's actually normal with Ivy Bridge at least, mine does that too. At 4.4GHz it'll be unstable at say 1.5v but at 1.4v it's almost stable. (It needs something like 1.42v)


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Can I get some responds to what voltage range I should be in for 5ghz. I know it varies but a general idea. I tried 1.52 but crashed, but my cpu is weird and is stable at lower voltages for the same clock speeds than at higher voltages. My cooling is really good, highest i've seen is 55c at 4.7, and this is coming from 90+ on my h100 before I went closed water and delided.


what vcore is your stable (e.g. Cinebench run with no WHEA warnings in logs) overclock at 4.8 and 4.9GHz? the jump to fully stable 5GHz will be bigger than between 4.8 and 4.9GHz.

I can boot 5GHz with 1.30v vcore, but it takes 1.44v to get stable and this is a nice batch (3224B) that can do that ... I tried 3 other batches of chips and most of them maxed out at 4.8 or 4.9GHz under 1.52V ... YMMV.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> what vcore is your stable (e.g. Cinebench run with no WHEA warnings in logs) overclock at 4.8 and 4.9GHz? the jump to fully stable 5GHz will be bigger than between 4.8 and 4.9GHz.
> I can boot 5GHz with 1.30v vcore, but it takes 1.44v to get stable and this is a nice batch (3224B) that can do that ... I tried 3 other batches of chips and most of them maxed out at 4.8 or 4.9GHz under 1.52V ... YMMV.


Is cinebench enough to call it stable? Prime and ibt give completly different results, and it's annoying running them both. I'm downloading cinebench atm and will try. I got my ivy basically 1 minute after it was released at retailers, is that a good batch?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Can I get some responds to what voltage range I should be in for 5ghz. I know it varies but a general idea. I tried 1.52 but crashed, but my cpu is weird and is stable at lower voltages for the same clock speeds than at higher voltages. My cooling is really good, highest i've seen is 55c at 4.7, and this is coming from 90+ on my h100 before I went closed water and delided.


Okay but first. do these steps auto off manual on turn your LLC to 100% not 140% put PLL to 1.8 for now. Now what vcore for 4.7 or something close to % Ghz. take this very lightly on this next sentence. Each Ivy is very temperamental when it comes to some stabilities. I got 4.0 and .9 once. never got it again now it takes 1.0 basically. then 4.3 was at 1.1 then 4.7 was at 4.3 then 4.8 was at 1.4 for super stable. then 4.9 for 1.48 area. 5 at 1.510. then 5.1 was 1.55.

Heres where it gets infuriating. 5.2 was at 1.58, 5.3 at 1.63, 5.4 at 1.76, 5.5 at 1.86. no go for 5.6 at 1.98vcore. absolutely nothin.

We need more facts here.

BATCH NUMBER
VCORES FOR CLOCKS
COOLING (will help a bit)
WHAT VCORE YOU ARE LIMITING YOURSELF TO

Tell me those and we can get 5Ghz for you.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay but first. do these steps auto off manual on turn your LLC to 100% not 140% put PLL to 1.8 for now. Now what vcore for 4.7 or something close to % Ghz. take this very lightly on this next sentence. Each Ivy is very temperamental when it comes to some stabilities. I got 4.0 and .9 once. never got it again now it takes 1.0 basically. then 4.3 was at 1.1 then 4.7 was at 4.3 then 4.8 was at 1.4 for super stable. then 4.9 for 1.48 area. 5 at 1.510. then 5.1 was 1.55.
> Heres where it gets infuriating. 5.2 was at 1.58, 5.3 at 1.63, 5.4 at 1.76, 5.5 at 1.86. no go for 5.6 at 1.98vcore. absolutely nothin.
> We need more facts here.
> BATCH NUMBER
> VCORES FOR CLOCKS
> COOLING (will help a bit)
> WHAT VCORE YOU ARE LIMITING YOURSELF TO
> Tell me those and we can get 5Ghz for you.


Ugh where do I find the batch number? I don't have the box or the text on the cpu. And where can I find the errors for cinebench, if it finds 1 will it report?


----------



## IronDoq

Well just got around to lapping my 3570k. Been lurking here for a few weeks, so far I've read from pg. 150 to 320 (24 hours of driving in total for thanksgiving trip...). Temps are down 9c! It was so amazing to see how much it helped. Used 150 grit to 600, to 1000, to 1500, to 2000, to 2500. A bit overkill, but they all came in the pack that I bought from Ebay for $7... I'll take 9c for $7! Temps generated using a few hours of prime respectively.



On another note, ram slots 3 and 1 (the two right-most slots) refuse to allow the mobo to post, giving error code 51. This code reads, "Memory Initialization error occurs." Mind you that this is just after I re-installed the cpu, but I've done all the usual troubleshooting (tried different sticks in different slots, 4 and 2 work, optimized defaults, cleared CMOS). It'll have to wait until tomorrow to re-mount the CPU (gosh such a PITA







), but until then any quick fixes/ideas?

To make this relevant to this thread, I plan on delidding this weekend with LP arriving this Friday.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Well just got around to lapping my 3570k. Been lurking here for a few weeks, so far I've read from pg. 150 to 320 (24 hours of driving in total for thanksgiving trip...). Temps are down 9c! It was so amazing to see how much it helped. Used 150 grit to 600, to 1000, to 1500, to 2000, to 2500. A bit overkill, but they all came in the pack that I bought from Ebay for $7... I'll take 9c for $7! Temps generated using a few hours of prime respectively.
> 
> On another note, ram slots 3 and 1 (the two right-most slots) refuse to allow the mobo to post, giving error code 51. This code reads, "Memory Initialization error occurs." Mind you that this is just after I re-installed the cpu, but I've done all the usual troubleshooting (tried different sticks in different slots, 4 and 2 work, optimized defaults, cleared CMOS). It'll have to wait until tomorrow to re-mount the CPU (gosh such a PITA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), but until then any quick fixes/ideas?
> To make this relevant to this thread, I plan on delidding this weekend with LP arriving this Friday.


Grats!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Well just got around to lapping my 3570k. Been lurking here for a few weeks, so far I've read from pg. 150 to 320 (24 hours of driving in total for thanksgiving trip...). Temps are down 9c! It was so amazing to see how much it helped. Used 150 grit to 600, to 1000, to 1500, to 2000, to 2500. A bit overkill, but they all came in the pack that I bought from Ebay for $7... I'll take 9c for $7! Temps generated using a few hours of prime respectively.
> 
> 
> 
> On another note, ram slots 3 and 1 (the two right-most slots) refuse to allow the mobo to post, giving error code 51. This code reads, "Memory Initialization error occurs." Mind you that this is just after I re-installed the cpu, but I've done all the usual troubleshooting (tried different sticks in different slots, 4 and 2 work, optimized defaults, cleared CMOS). It'll have to wait until tomorrow to re-mount the CPU (gosh such a PITA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), but until then any quick fixes/ideas?
> 
> To make this relevant to this thread, I plan on delidding this weekend with LP arriving this Friday.


If you want even lower temps, lap the bottom part of the IHS and then also the bottom part of the lips on the side. This way, the IHS top is closer to the die and it'll transfer heat faster.


----------



## IronDoq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If you want even lower temps, lap the bottom part of the IHS and then also the bottom part of the lips on the side. This way, the IHS top is closer to the die and it'll transfer heat faster.


Mind you I haven't delidded yet, so I don't have access to the underside. At least I think so based on my understanding of your post. Any ideas on the ram issue? Testing with another set of ripjaws so I'll brb.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If you want even lower temps, lap the bottom part of the IHS and then also the bottom part of the lips on the side. This way, the IHS top is closer to the die and it'll transfer heat faster.
> 
> 
> 
> Mind you I haven't delidded yet, so I don't have access to the underside. At least I think so based on my understanding of your post. Any ideas on the ram issue? Testing with another set of ripjaws so I'll brb.
Click to expand...

Haven't had time to read your RAM issue so I can't comment. If you have time to tell me what's the problem, then maybe I can help.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Well just got around to lapping my 3570k. Been lurking here for a few weeks, so far I've read from pg. 150 to 320 (24 hours of driving in total for thanksgiving trip...). Temps are down 9c! It was so amazing to see how much it helped. Used 150 grit to 600, to 1000, to 1500, to 2000, to 2500. A bit overkill, but they all came in the pack that I bought from Ebay for $7... I'll take 9c for $7! Temps generated using a few hours of prime respectively.
> 
> On another note, ram slots 3 and 1 (the two right-most slots) refuse to allow the mobo to post, giving error code 51. This code reads, "Memory Initialization error occurs." Mind you that this is just after I re-installed the cpu, but I've done all the usual troubleshooting (tried different sticks in different slots, 4 and 2 work, optimized defaults, cleared CMOS). It'll have to wait until tomorrow to re-mount the CPU (gosh such a PITA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), but until then any quick fixes/ideas?
> To make this relevant to this thread, I plan on delidding this weekend with LP arriving this Friday.


Nice, I think you might have scratched the memory controller? Someone else who posted on here nicked the corner (not under the IHS) and it damaged the memory controller too.. Check CPU-Z to see if it's running in dual more or single. (It might not be?)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Mind you I haven't delidded yet, so I don't have access to the underside. At least I think so based on my understanding of your post. Any ideas on the ram issue? Testing with another set of ripjaws so I'll brb.


Yeah.. Going too far on the sides would be bad though. I'd be tempted to leave it at stock for most people.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Mind you I haven't delidded yet, so I don't have access to the underside. At least I think so based on my understanding of your post. Any ideas on the ram issue? Testing with another set of ripjaws so I'll brb.


LoL You bought that MB from me and i never had any ram issues.
Here are the slots i was using.. did you buy my old ram to? or just the MB?

I would ask in the Ud3H/Ud5h club or sin0822
If u need to rma and need an invoice are anything "which i do not think u do"
Just let me know.


----------



## FtW 420

Could be an issue with mounting pressure, you would have to loosen/tighten the mount to test that. Other than that, sounds like the only other change was removing & installing the cpu itself, a bent pin can cause funny things.


----------



## Hokies83

Yeah ive seen that error for a bent Pin before.. id take a close look.


----------



## IronDoq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Nice, I think you might have scratched the memory controller? Someone else who posted on here nicked the corner (not under the IHS) and it damaged the memory controller too.. Check CPU-Z to see if it's running in dual more or single. (It might not be?)
> Yeah.. Going too far on the sides would be bad though. I'd be tempted to leave it at stock for most people.


WOW it's possible that I might have become distracted and accidentally lifted my hand in such a way while sanding that the corner (of the PCB I'm guessing?) might have nicked the sand paper and become sanded.

Hokies. I've been using the same slots you are for quite some time now and no issues. Ram was bought from Newegg and hasn't caused any issues up until now. Could this possible be a problem with installation of the CPU or could it be the CPU/Mobo? Starting to freak out a bit now.


----------



## Arm3nian

I would test my voltages faster if windows 8 wasnt so bad. I'm getting 550mb reads on my raid 0 ssd, when I got 1055mb on windows 7, basically half speed. Sometimes I get 955, *** is going on.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> WOW it's possible that I might have become distracted and accidentally lifted my hand in such a way while sanding that the corner (of the PCB I'm guessing?) might have nicked the sand paper and become sanded.
> Hokies. I've been using the same slots you are for quite some time now and no issues. Ram was bought from Newegg and hasn't caused any issues up until now. Could this possible be a problem with installation of the CPU or could it be the CPU/Mobo? Starting to freak out a bit now.


It could be Cpu mb or ram.

Start with loosing up from Heat sink mount.

If no then remove the Cpu.. See if u have a bent pin.

Then try cpu in another board friend or someone and see if it happens in that board.


----------



## IronDoq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It could be Cpu mb or ram.
> Start with loosing up from Heat sink mount.
> If no then remove the Cpu.. See if u have a bent pin.
> Then try cpu in another board friend or someone and see if it happens in that board.


Thanks, +rep.
I do remember myself tightening the block fairly tight, I'll try and loosen it a bit. Tomorrow will be a time for checking bent pin (if loosening doesn't work). I'm actually the only computer-literate person I know, so borrowing from someone isn't much of an option.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Thanks, +rep.
> I do remember myself tightening the block fairly tight, I'll try and loosen it a bit. Tomorrow will be a time for checking bent pin (if loosening doesn't work). I'm actually the only computer-literate person I know, so borrowing from someone isn't much of an option.


LoL u could send it to FTW 420







for testing.

If u have a bent pin do not freak out not the end of the world..

Great eye sight a spot light and a razor blade / thin blade can fix it also tweezers.


----------



## IronDoq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL u could send it to FTW 420
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> for testing.
> If u have a bent pin do not freak out not the end of the world..
> Great eye sight a spot light and a razor blade / thin blade can fix it also tweezers.


Just pretty much loosened the block to not allow for contact, and still error code 51. I'll be able to undo the mounting and check the CPU/Mobo tomorrow, until then off to sleep.










Edit: I just remembered that i have a few i5 3450s coming in this week for some builds for the parents work, along with a few h77 boards with which I can test my cpu/mobo individually.
This is truly a thread that I would choose to embody the OCN community, you guys rock!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Just pretty much loosened the block to not allow for contact, and still error code 51. I'll be able to undo the mounting and check the CPU/Mobo tomorrow, until then off to sleep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I just remembered that i have a few i5 3450s coming in this week for some builds for the parents work, along with a few h77 boards with which I can test my cpu/mobo individually.
> This is truly a thread that I would choose to embody the OCN community, you guys rock!!!


Thank you sir!

I rally think more people come here for OC'ing help and everything else all the time.

What do you think crew?


----------



## jprovido

hey I just delidded my i5 3570k. I said I was gonna wait but I delidded it anyway. twas easier than I thought it would be. it's alive!!! haven't checked on the temps just yet. I used Gelid GC extreme on both the die and IHS. ima replace it when my liquid pro arrives


----------



## jprovido

so far so good. my temps are better even though I don't have my AC on atm (it's hot as eff in my room atm) really impressed! my temps right now at full load are at the low 70's without AC (again it's really hot right now) ima turn on my AC and leave prime running for a little longer.

Welcome me my brethren!









what temps are you guys getting at 5ghz with the liquid pro? ima try pushing for it now. im so happy I grew the balls to delid! i accidentally dropped my cpu on the motherboard pins earlier. had a mini heart attack but fortunately it still worked


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> so far so good. my temps are better even though I don't have my AC on atm (it's hot as **** in my room atm) really impressed! my temps right now at full load are at the low 70's without AC (again it's really hot right now) ima turn on my AC and leave prime running for a little longer.
> Welcome me my brethren!


Grats!


----------



## Swag

I just bought the Windows 8 Pro a while back and I have gotten around to check its bells and whistles and partially due to a benchmark. I can't seem to grasp something like this. I like the OS on my Surface but on a PC, it isn't desirable! Anyway, my SSD is so much slower now though. I don't know why! I even did a secure erase so it'll go back to stock speeds.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> so far so good. my temps are better even though I don't have my AC on atm (it's hot as eff in my room atm) really impressed! my temps right now at full load are at the low 70's without AC (again it's really hot right now) ima turn on my AC and leave prime running for a little longer.
> Welcome me my brethren!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what temps are you guys getting at 5ghz with the liquid pro? ima try pushing for it now. im so happy I grew the balls to delid! i accidentally dropped my cpu on the motherboard pins earlier. had a mini heart attack but fortunately it still worked


W00T.

Now first page submit like a real person!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> so far so good. my temps are better even though I don't have my AC on atm (it's hot as eff in my room atm) really impressed! my temps right now at full load are at the low 70's without AC (again it's really hot right now) ima turn on my AC and leave prime running for a little longer.
> Welcome me my brethren!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *what temps are you guys getting at 5ghz with the liquid pro?* ima try pushing for it now. im so happy I grew the balls to delid! i accidentally dropped my cpu on the motherboard pins earlier. had a mini heart attack but fortunately it still worked


first off, gratz









84C on hottest core running IBT at 5.0ghz

thats with a normal aircooler


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thank you sir!
> I really think more people come here for OC'ing help and everything else all the time.
> What do you think crew?


yep









besides the delidding, we have alot of knowledge here..great and fun group/crew we have


----------



## jprovido

can't get it stable above 4.8ghz whatever I do doesn't matter what voltage I add. fails on IBT in just a few minutes max oc still at 4.8ghz. help me! temps are significantly cooler. am I doing something wrong??


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> can't get it stable above 4.8ghz whatever I do doesn't matter what voltage I add. fails on IBT in just a few minutes max oc still at 4.8ghz. help me! temps are significantly cooler. am I doing something wrong??


prolly not, i needed 1.420V vcore to get 4.8ghz prime stable,
going up to 4.9ghz my vcore jumped to 1.510V vcore..
you could try lower cpu pll a bit, if you havent yet, it can sometimes make a oc stable,
what are you using for ram settings, xmp profile? can mess up a oc also..

whats the vcores youre using for 4.8, and where you at with the 4.9ghz?
4.9, 5.0ghz and above is where most ivy's start to ask for alot more vcore..


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> prolly not, i needed 1.420V vcore to get 4.8ghz prime stable,
> going up to 4.9ghz my vcore jumped to 1.510V vcore..
> you could try lower cpu pll a bit, if you havent yet, it can sometimes make a oc stable,
> what are you using for ram settings, xmp profile? can mess up a oc also..
> whats the vcores youre using for 4.8, and where you at with the 4.9ghz?


I have everything at auto except for the vcore. LLC is at extreme. my 4.8ghz overclock was stable with 1.34v ran prime95 18hours+ and about 30 runs of IBT. I even tried 1.4v on 4.9ghz and it still crashes wit IBT.

I have a manual overclock before (this is a 1866 kit)on my memory at first I even downclocked it to 1600 but it still crashes on IBT any tips on which settings I should change in the bos?


----------



## Arm3nian

I got [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] Now here comes the bs part. Went all the way up to 1.45, and cinebench failed. Now from 1.45 to 1.55 I couldnt even get into windows. Crashed on the loading screen. I tried going higher and got a cpu voltage error. After that, the bios kept freezing, and half the time i couldnt make it into the bios. i reset the cmos and couldnt even get my [email protected] which is my fallback clock. After a few restarts I finally got in at [email protected] I tried again and couldnt get [email protected], or 1.41. Also, my clock speed keeps changing in windows 8, with speed step disabled, and the min cpu state at 100%. Prob just the os though. Bios also resets to some stupid values like 103bclk, 41multiplier, ram at 1968... other times it just resets back to 140% for the current thing. garbage os? most likely. garbage mobo? most likely. garbage cpu? maybe


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> I have everything at auto except for the vcore. LLC is at extreme. my 4.8ghz overclock was stable with 1.34v ran prime95 18hours+ and about 30 runs of IBT. I even tried 1.4v on 4.9ghz and it still crashes wit IBT.
> I have a manual overclock before (this is a 1866 kit)on my memory at first I even downclocked it to 1600 but it still crashes on IBT any tips on which settings I should change in the bos?


set llc to Turbo, its the best setting to use for the way we oc,
its in the sin guide too..
put 100 blck in by hand, same with your ram, only put in multiplier,
you prolly need more vcore for the 4.9, try 1.45V vcore, if it works,
start lowering it by 0.005V, and see where it start to crash again,
then up it again by 1 up 2 notches, thats how i do it..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I got [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] Now here comes the bs part. Went all the way up to 1.45, and cinebench failed. Now from 1.45 to 1.55 I couldnt even get into windows. Crashed on the loading screen. I tried going higher and got a cpu voltage error. After that, the bios kept freezing, and half the time i couldnt make it into the bios. i reset the cmos and couldnt even get my [email protected] which is my fallback clock. After a few restarts I finally got in at [email protected] I tried again and couldnt get [email protected], or 1.41. Also, my clock speed keeps changing in windows 8, with speed step disabled, and the min cpu state at 100%. Prob just the os though. Bios also resets to some stupid values like 103bclk, 41multiplier, ram at 1968... other times it just resets back to 140% for the current thing. garbage os? most likely. garbage mobo? most likely. garbage cpu? maybe


keep blck at 100, by hand,
if my bios hangs or freezes, i know my oc isnt stable,
some parts of the bios give a 20-30% load on the processor,
so its kinda of a stability test too, i hate to reset/clear cmos tho ..lol

havent installed win8 yet, cant say how "good" it works ..
4.9ghz prolly needs more vcore, like i said in my other post,
4.9-5.0ghz is where most ivy's start to ask for alot more vcore..
just check reviews and such , and youll see most back down to 4.8ghz,
after trying to get 4.9ghz stable..

resets to those values?
did you ever use software to oc?
or still using/installed it in your os?


----------



## xTristinx

Ahaha you had a mini heart attack, i delidded a couple weeks ago and accidently stuck my thumb in my socket and bent a couple pins







. Although the computer still works, i have a hard time keeping a stable overclock and cant post with 2 dimm slots on my sabertooth z77.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> keep blck at 100, by hand,
> if my bios hangs or freezes, i know my oc isnt stable,
> some parts of the bios give a 20-30% load on the processor,
> so its kinda of a stability test too, i hate to reset/clear cmos tho ..lol
> havent installed win8 yet, cant say how "good" it works ..
> 4.9ghz prolly needs more vcore, like i said in my other post,
> 4.9-5.0ghz is where most ivy's start to ask for alot more vcore..
> just check reviews and such , and youll see most back down to 4.8ghz,
> after trying to get 4.9ghz stable..


Its stupid though, why the hell did I spend $1300 on watercooling if I cant use it. I could have gotten 4.8 with h100 or air after deliding and applying pro. I went water to get a huge oc on my 690 and keep it cool, which I have done. not the case for my cpu, I booted at 1.52 before and got 55c on the hottest core. our current technology should allow us to be limited by heat only not voltage which then results in current. seems like crap manufacturing if you ask me.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Its stupid though, why the hell did I spend $1300 on watercooling if I cant use it. I could have gotten 4.8 with h100 or air after deliding and applying pro. I went water to get a huge oc on my 690 and keep it cool, which I have done. not the case for my cpu, I booted at 1.52 before and got 55c on the hottest core. our current technology should allow us to be limited by heat only not voltage which then results in current. seems like crap manufacturing if you ask me.


not crap, dont forget intel isnt targeting the oc market,
but the normal daily user, who never oc's, thats about 95-98% of the market,
for them this is a great processor,
for ocers its the chip lottery,
before delid, its the lottery tempwise, after delid, its the lottery vcore wise,
still alot of ivy's can get to 4.5ghz with a decent cooler without delidding,
thats about 25-30% more speed over stock..for free


----------



## jay2nice000

Quote:


> yes, but a normal credit card is a bit thick, could bent the pcb,
> still looking for something like a credit card, but thinner,(about half as thick or less)
> and easy to get/find for everyone..


i know what you mean if anyone live in nyc theres a thing call metrocard they half the size of a cc and are very flexible and there pretty much everywhere for free. also if anyone played initial d the arcade verison i think the initial d cards are pretty thin and flexible and should work


----------



## xTristinx

INITIAL D ^ man i havent seen one of those machines in a while. Still have my cards though


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> i know what you mean if anyone live in nyc theres a thing call metrocard they half the size of a cc and are very flexible and there pretty much everywhere for free. also if anyone played initial d the arcade verison i think the initial d cards are pretty thin and flexible and should work


yea, been looking for a card thats (hard) plastic and alot thinner then a credit card,
it could work very well i think to use for delid..

i was thinking, if peeps have a laminator, or access to one,

you can choose a thin card, and laminate it

look, hes cutting the corners first, then he takes that (too flexible?) card to do the rest..







this vid gave me the idea back then to use a plastic card


----------



## Valgaur

ATTENTION TO YOU AND ALL NEW OVERCLOCKERS.

USE MANUAL. NO OFFSET AT ALL. AND NO AUTO EITHER!

Okay. Auto and offset are not needed auto is for stock at all times. Offset is when you have dialed in you necessary vcore needs and movement by going through and finding the necessary vcore for your chip clock for clock. You must do this through manual. Offset and auto will over volt it by far to much. Either pm me your issues or post on here more detailed information on your volts and everything else please.

Here Hope you like this as well since so many people are trying Offset nowa days.

Hey. You guys wanna know something really awesome.
Offset and manual have the exact same power draw over the course of a month. This is because of the offsets variances' with the vcore +'s and such. Your vcore fluctuates so much during offset that it evens out right around or barely under the demands of manual settings since manual is a tiny bit lower vcore required. This is because of when your on offset you cpu revs up with the multi and then asks you hey. Vcore me!. Which takes extra vcore and you need a higher offset for this under load unlike manual where the vcore is there all the time for it and ready so it doesn't have to ask at all.
That's my knowledge for everyone for today!


----------



## jprovido

I managed to get some sort of stability but I didn't like the vcore difference between 4.8ghz vs. 4.9ghz. It needed 1.43v to get stable in IBT (I'm not even sure if it's fully stable yet) and my 4.8ghz was on 1.34v. kinda dissapointed really. I thought I was temperature restricted. seems like 4.8ghz is the best OC setting for me to run 24/7.

it was fun to delid it tho. ima play around it for a bit. im gonna try to manually set it this time and not auto. be back in a bit


----------



## VonDutch

still, using fixed vcore, or offset, is a matter of personal preference,
the difference between fixed and offset isnt a very big one, depends on how you set it,
auto gives the biggest difference tho, uses way to much most of the time

i like to see vcore go down to less then 1.0V when idle,
instead of a fixed vcore, that will be the same all the time,
idle or not..
just my preference, not saying its better then fixed or anything








always use fixed vcore if you start ocing, then choose offset if you like after that..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> still, using fixed vcore, or offset, is a matter of personal preference,
> the difference between fixed and offset isnt a very big one, depends on how you set it,
> auto gives the biggest difference tho, uses way to much most of the time
> i like to see vcore go down to less then 1.0V when idle,
> instead of a fixed vcore, that will be the same all the time,
> idle or not..
> just my preference, not saying its better then fixed or anything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> always use fixed vcore if you start ocing, then choose offset if you like after that..


Perfect!


----------



## Leyaena

Wow, that was a bit of reading! 75 new posts overnight, when I clocked in at work








Spent about half an hour reading through all that (and totally not slacking off)








The best part is, just when I finished reading the thread, my supervisor came in to check on how far I was on an assignment, and he left complimenting me for how fast and well I work


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Wow, that was a bit of reading! 75 new posts overnight, when I clocked in at work
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spent about half an hour reading through all that (and totally not slacking off)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The best part is, just when I finished reading the thread, my supervisor came in to check on how far I was on an assignment, and he left complimenting me for how fast and well I work


We better not get blamed for your behind of work lol.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just bought the Windows 8 Pro a while back and I have gotten around to check its bells and whistles and partially due to a benchmark. I can't seem to grasp something like this. I like the OS on my Surface but on a PC, it isn't desirable! Anyway, my SSD is so much slower now though. I don't know why! I even did a secure erase so it'll go back to stock speeds.


Have you tried the "Performance Optimization" using Samsung's SSD Magician software version 3.2?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Its stupid though, why the hell did I spend $1300 on watercooling if I cant use it. I could have gotten 4.8 with h100 or air after deliding and applying pro. I went water to get a huge oc on my 690 and keep it cool, which I have done. not the case for my cpu, I booted at 1.52 before and got 55c on the hottest core. our current technology should allow us to be limited by heat only not voltage which then results in current. seems like crap manufacturing if you ask me.


Actually, I think you'll find that, from an engineering standpoint, that is an absolutely FANTASTIC sign in terms of manufacturing. In theory, if transistors were perfect you could run them at any voltage and you would generate zero heat. Obviously this is not possible. We have heat losses and these are caused by internal resistances and current leakage.

If we were always at a thermal limit it would be because the design was so poor as to allow huge amounts of leakage and unnecessary resistance. Ideally we want to get these leakage values as low as possible. This means generating as little heat as possible. Less leakage also means higher internal voltages which also means higher signal strengths and higher possible clocks.

By any measurement Ivy is an engineering success. This is even more impressive considering that it is Intel's first venture into 3D transistors.


----------



## SonDa5

The deed is done. My first 3770k delid.







This one was much tougher than my 3570k. Lid was tight. Worked 2 different razers to get the lid off.













No IHS bare die mount.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Its stupid though, why the hell did I spend $1300 on watercooling if I cant use it. I could have gotten 4.8 with h100 or air after deliding and applying pro. I went water to get a huge oc on my 690 and keep it cool, which I have done. not the case for my cpu, I booted at 1.52 before and got 55c on the hottest core. our current technology should allow us to be limited by heat only not voltage which then results in current. seems like crap manufacturing if you ask me.


It's just luck of the draw dude. If you have $1300 for cooling maybe you can buy a couple of Ivy chips and find the best clocker. Just because you have excellent cooling doesn't mean your CPU is going to magically be stable above 5.0GHz, it takes more than cooling, the other hardware has to be up for it as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> still, using fixed vcore, or offset, is a matter of personal preference,
> the difference between fixed and offset isnt a very big one, depends on how you set it,
> auto gives the biggest difference tho, uses way to much most of the time
> i like to see vcore go down to less then 1.0V when idle,
> instead of a fixed vcore, that will be the same all the time,
> idle or not..
> just my preference, not saying its better then fixed or anything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> always use fixed vcore if you start ocing, then choose offset if you like after that..


I prefer offset mode too because I like reduced voltages and clock speeds when idle. You do have to find your ideal voltage with manual and then try to work your offset to that voltage.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> The deed is done. My first 3770k delid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This one was much tougher than my 3570k. Lid was tight. Worked 2 different razers to get the lid off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Images
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No IHS bare die mount.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Images


Did you use any tape or anything as padding around the core or did you just mount it right on there? I seem to recall you using padding around the core previously but I can't seem to find the post.


----------



## LoneWolf121188

For those that are using CL Ultra on the die and got 20-30+ of temp drop, what application method did you use? I feel like having just a dab in the center and pressing down isn't the best idea, since the die isn't symmetrical. So....a few dabs? Credit card spreading? A single line?

Also, how much of a difference does bare-die make, vs having the IHS? I have an EK Supremacy waterblock, so I'm guessing it would be relatively easy to go bare-die? Anyone tried it with that block?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> For those that are using CL Ultra on the die and got 20-30+ of temp drop, what application method did you use? I feel like having just a dab in the center and pressing down isn't the best idea, since the die isn't symmetrical. So....a few dabs? Credit card spreading? A single line?
> Also, how much of a difference does bare-die make, vs having the IHS? I have an EK Supremacy waterblock, so I'm guessing it would be relatively easy to go bare-die? Anyone tried it with that block?


spread it all out








a thin layer is enough..
small dot like this for example on ihs


should look like this when you spread it all out, but your dont want to see it "floating" like what you
see on the lowerside from this pic, whats to much, you can suck up again using the seringe

same goes for the die, but you can use even less then on the ihs pic,
i did all sides with it, when i finished the die, i put on the ihs again, pressed a bit,
took it off, looked at the print it made on inside ihs,
and did a (very) thin layer on inside ihs also ..i had 25+C tempdrop

i would do bare die only with a water cooler,
i thought about it with my aircooler, but the thing weighs more then 1 kilo..lol
the difference isnt really big, the best/biggest tempdrop is by using liquid pro/ultra on the die, with ihs, or without
bare die gives some more tempdrop tho, Sonda5 is our specialist with that


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Did you use any tape or anything as padding around the core or did you just mount it right on there? I seem to recall you using padding around the core previously but I can't seem to find the post.


I used 5mm Fujipoly Exreme thermal pad around he die for PCB support and to help cool.



Lonewolf I don't think everyone is going to see 30C cooling improvements. My 3570k ran much hotter than the new 3770k that I just got. When I delidded the 3570k it was much easier to do because there was larger gap of glue between the PCB and IHS. With the 3770k I delidded the IHS was on much tighter and it was much more difficult to delid it. I'm stress testing the new delidded 3770k and right now the temps are better than lidded but not as good results as the 3570k that I did and I think its because the 3770k had a better IHS mount from the factory.

i think a better mounted IHS from factory is going to help keep the CPU cool.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> With the 3770k I delidded the IHS was on much tighter and it was much more difficult to delid it. I'm stress testing the new delidded 3770k and right now the temps are better than lidded but not as good results as the 3570k that I did and I think its because the 3770k had a better IHS mount from the factory.
> i think a better mounted IHS from factory is going to help keep the CPU cool.


did you test it before delid, did it run cooler? compared to other not delidded chips?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> i think a better mounted IHS from factory is going to help keep the CPU cool.


yea, if intel is gonna listen to Valgaur's letter he making, this problem will be solved soon ..lol
i only hope they dont decide to solder it tho ..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Is cinebench enough to call it stable? Prime and ibt give completly different results, and it's annoying running them both. I'm downloading cinebench atm and will try. I got my ivy basically 1 minute after it was released at retailers, is that a good batch?


yes, so far it's been for me. just mind that completing Cinebench without crash is only half of the story. you NEED to go to Windows Event Viewer - Custom Views - Administrative Events, and make sure there was no WHEA warnings during that Cinebench run, if they were then you are still unstable and should up the vcore until those warnings are gone. once there I cannot make such overclocks unstable under anything.

what's your CPU batch # ?


----------



## Leyaena

Tonight's the night, lads!
Got my CLP and my sanding paper ready, it's time to lap!








I'll report back with temperature differences after switching from NT-H1 to CLP on both the die and the IHS, and lapping it (might sand a little bit off the lip as well, so the IHS sits closer to the die)
See you guys soon (ish)


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yes, so far it's been for me. just mind that completing Cinebench without crash is only half of the story. you NEED to go to Windows Event Viewer - Custom Views - Administrative Events, and make sure there was no WHEA warnings during that Cinebench run, if they were then you are still unstable and should up the vcore until those warnings are gone. once there I cannot make such overclocks unstable under anything.
> what's your CPU batch # ?


I can't even get into windows over 1.45, which is most likely required for 5ghz. Even at 1.55 it crashed yesterday, at the loading screen. Resetting the cmos seems to help though when trying to find a voltage. And how do I find the batch number without box and lapped cpu?


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> And how do I find the batch number without box and lapped cpu?


You can't.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> You can't.


Well that can't be good lol. I thought real temp or cpuz would show something, guess not...

Anyways, can I remove the voltage limit in the bios. I'm going for 20ghz at 3volts.


----------



## Leyaena

From start (stock):


To placeholder TIM (delidded):


To Liquid Pro and lapped:


I'm baffled and excited!


----------



## Shaldome

Code:



Code:


-
Folgende Waren wurden mit diesem Paket von uns verschickt:

1 x SSD   256GB Samsung 830 Desktop Series 2.5" (6.4cm) SATA 6Gb/ MLC Toggle (MZ-7PC256D/EU)
1 x SOF Microsoft Windows 7 Professional SP1 64bit Deutsch SB/OEM
1 x CPU Intel Core i7 3770K 4x 3.50GHz So.1155 BOX
1 x MB Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UP5 TH Intel Z77 So.1155 Dual Channel DDR3 ATX Retail
1 x DVRA Asus DRW-24B5ST DVD-RW SATA 1.5Gb/s intern schwarz Bulk
1 x CPUK Phanteks PH-TC14PE CPU-Kühler silber

It is in German, bit I think you know what it means.







Only my Case seems to be delivered later...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I can't even get into windows over 1.45, which is most likely required for 5ghz. Even at 1.55 it crashed yesterday, at the loading screen. Resetting the cmos seems to help though when trying to find a voltage. And how do I find the batch number without box and lapped cpu?


make sure you have the PLL Internal Override enabled in BIOS, that helps with stability at higher clocks. other than that it's just vcore you need to up until stable. some chips are bad clockers though - had 2 batches (3228B & 3226C) that were very poor clockers, maxing out pretty much at 4.8GHz below 1.52V - I tried pushing 3226C higher and it needed 1.60V for stable 4.9GHz LOL!

Once lapped and no box handy, you won't be able to check the chip's batch ... only intel could have such information based on the codes and barcode/tag printed on CPU PCB (they would need to scan it most likely to know such information).


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> make sure you have the PLL Internal Override enabled in BIOS, that helps with stability at higher clocks. other than that it's just vcore you need to up until stable. some chips are bad clockers though - had 2 batches (3228B & 3226C) that were very poor clockers, maxing out pretty much at 4.8GHz below 1.52V.
> Once lapped and no box handy, you won't be able to check the chip's batch ... only intel could have such information based on the codes and barcode/tag printed on CPU PCB (they would need to scan it most likely to know such information).


I had that set to auto I think, would it be disabled if set to auto? I set the pll thing to 1.8v, and the current to 100% from 140%, but it just defaults back to it half the time.


----------



## Hokies83

Where is the 1.52 Intel spec thing at? "not Sin0822s chart"


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Anyways, can I remove the voltage limit in the bios. I'm going for 20ghz at 3volts.


thats not a setting in the bios,
its actually a jumper on your mobo you need to change,
i needed to change it also, when i did my 21ghz run, at 3.00005V vcore








was really hard to find that vcore, but it was stable.....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where is the 1.52 Intel spec thing at? "not Sin0822s chart"


you mean this?

sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html

from my post here,
http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/820#post_18502748


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I had that set to auto I think, would it be disabled if set to auto? I set the pll thing to 1.8v, and the current to 100% from 140%, but it just defaults back to it half the time.


never seen a WS mobo. that might be the issue set it to manual and try 1.48 vcore and try 49 multi.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> -
> Folgende Waren wurden mit diesem Paket von uns verschickt:
> 1 x SSD   256GB Samsung 830 Desktop Series 2.5" (6.4cm) SATA 6Gb/ MLC Toggle (MZ-7PC256D/EU)
> 1 x SOF Microsoft Windows 7 Professional SP1 64bit Deutsch SB/OEM
> 1 x CPU Intel Core i7 3770K 4x 3.50GHz So.1155 BOX
> 1 x MB Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UP5 TH Intel Z77 So.1155 Dual Channel DDR3 ATX Retail
> 1 x DVRA Asus DRW-24B5ST DVD-RW SATA 1.5Gb/s intern schwarz Bulk
> 1 x CPUK Phanteks PH-TC14PE CPU-Kühler silber
> 
> It is in German, bit I think you know what it means.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only my Case seems to be delivered later...


sieht gut aus..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> From start (stock):
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To placeholder TIM (delidded):
> 
> To Liquid Pro and lapped:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm baffled and excited!


is that about 30C tempdrop? great job man


----------



## Leyaena

Everyone just ignored me








Guess you guys don't like me after all!










Edit: Von just ninja'd me by 30 seconds, damn you!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you mean this?
> sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
> from my post here,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/820#post_18502748


Where is the one u got from the Intel Rep.. That just says VID not Vcore XD


----------



## Arm3nian

well nevermind then I guess vondutch has the datasheet bookmarked LOL


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> From start (stock):
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To placeholder TIM (delidded):
> 
> To Liquid Pro and lapped:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm baffled and excited!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that about 30C tempdrop? great job man
Click to expand...

Yep, I'm looking at about a 30c drop over stock








I'm so happy, you couldn't imagine ^^
I suppose I'll post another application template thingy so Valgaur can update my listing on the OP.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Everyone just ignored me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Guess you guys don't like me after all!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Von just ninja'd me by 30 seconds, damn you!


Sorry I like to read the new posts and forget to multi it lol. what ya need man?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where is the one u got from the Intel Rep.. That just says VID not Vcore XD


The first once is vcc aka vcore. And that chart doesn't even make sense. Recommended max 1.52 but max on h20 1.55... what will happen if its not under the recommended max. Doesn't mention degration anywhere.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> never seen a WS mobo. that might be the issue set it to manual and try 1.48 vcore and try 49 multi.


I was already stable at 1.4 for 4.9, but after a 15 restarts I wasnt, also I didn't have the enabled for the llc thing, and resetting the cmos helped. I think I can get it again.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Sorry I like to read the new posts and forget to multi it lol. what ya need man?


Nothing in particular, just bragging with my new and improved Intel Burn Test results after I lapped and delidded








Now, though, it would be really nice if you could add me to the OP listing, since I have my final results in ^^

*OCN name*: Leyaena
*CPU*: i5-3570k
*on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
*ihs-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
*Mhz gained*: 0 - so far!
*OC after delid*: 4.5GHz
*Temp drops*: 30°C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2596827


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where is the one u got from the Intel Rep.. That just says VID not Vcore XD


well, thats the thing hokies,
theres no real max vcore to find in any of those sheets,
anyone that refers to vcore in the sheet, is talking about the max SVID intel recomments..

i asked your friend sin about it in his thread, he didnt respond yet,
hes using it in this graph,

i quote,
On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*.
end quote,

then daclownie gave me this answer,

I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered
the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
for consumer usage. LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting.

confusing for me, but i go with the best answers i can find,
i think its safe to say intel recommended vcore max is 1.52V


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Nothing in particular, just bragging with my new and improved Intel Burn Test results after I lapped and delidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, though, it would be really nice if you could add me to the OP listing, since I have my final results in ^^
> *OCN name*: Leyaena
> *CPU*: i5-3570k
> *on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *Mhz gained*: 0 - so far!
> *OC after delid*: 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops*: 30°C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2596827


I am not on there yet either and its been a month or two


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Nothing in particular, just bragging with my new and improved Intel Burn Test results after I lapped and delidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, though, it would be really nice if you could add me to the OP listing, since I have my final results in ^^
> *OCN name*: Leyaena
> *CPU*: i5-3570k
> *on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *Mhz gained*: 0 - so far!
> *OC after delid*: 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops*: 30°C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2596827


Accepted!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am not on there yet either and its been a month or two


Where is it lol. I'll add ya.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am not on there yet either and its been a month or two


then you where here before the rest if us,
thread isnt even 2 months old yet ...haha









o, 2 months almost, and 55,433 views ...nice


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I had that set to auto I think, would it be disabled if set to auto? I set the pll thing to 1.8v, and the current to 100% from 140%, but it just defaults back to it half the time.


yeah, auto could have been actually disabled, never know until you manually toggle it to enabled








if it defaults back it could mean that overcock is unstable and BIOS reverts settings in order to boot, try higher vcore to see if it helps.
also make sure you are running Ultra High LLC.
140% current capability is what I run and it's enough for anything possible on air/water.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where is the 1.52 Intel spec thing at? "not Sin0822s chart"


here you go:
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
page 84

taht is for 3rd gen desktop i5/i7 series.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> The first once is vcc aka vcore. And that chart doesn't even make sense. Recommended max 1.52 but max on h20 1.55... what will happen if its not under the recommended max. Doesn't mention degration anywhere.


i asked about that too, when i spoke to the intel employee about the max vcore,
about ocing, using higher vcores etc, and degradation over time, he said,
"if the vcore is within the 1.52V, there should be no degradation at all over time"..
i was like what! ..lol, but i still recommend a max of 1.45V vcore is asked whats safe








hokies is our experiment when it comes to go over the recommended vcore,
hes running 1.50V vcore 24/7 ..lol

o, and about the sheet, he told me to ask a intel engineer to explain the why etc,
even gave me a link, but i figured i knew enough, im not that technical,
reading that sheet gave me a headeache..lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i asked about that too, when i spoke to the intel employee about the max vcore,
> about ocing, using higher vcores etc, and degradation over time, he said,
> "if the vcore is within the 1.52V, there should be no degradation at all over time"..
> i was like what! ..lol, but i still recommend a max of 1.45V vcore is asked whats safe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hokies is our experiment when it comes to go over the recommended vcore,
> hes running 1.50V vcore 24/7 ..lol
> o, and about the sheet, he told me to ask a intel engineer to explain the why etc,
> even gave me a link, but i figured i knew enough, im not that technical,
> reading that sheet gave me a headeache..lol


you have to keep in mind that Intel specs related ONLY to stock (turbo) speeds and vcore as well hehe. of course, you won't see a stock chip running 3.9GHz with 1.50v (hopefully!), but we use to read it that way as Intel rep cited, no degradation at all until you stay below absolute vcore (includes spikes, be it under load or idle, fixed or offset, extreme LLC or intel spec LLC) of 1.52V
the question if high speed alone could cause degradation over time is another matter, and heat of course (but we solved that one at least hehe)... so that being said, unless the MB power delivery is faulty there should be no trouble in a long run when staying below vcore of 1.52V

would higher vcore degrade it? over time yes, faster than "within spec" vcore for sure, but no one can answer how fast that would be, could be years, could be months or weeks, perhaps with some super weak CPU batches it could happen instantly. it's a lottery and we take the risks


----------



## Hokies83

So im Having A tumor removed from my Head tomrrow via Surgery ..

So who wants to Write my obituary if im not back by Friday ??


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> you have to keep in mind that Intel specs related ONLY to stock (turbo) speeds and vcore as well hehe. of course, you won't see a stock chip running 3.9GHz with 1.50v (hopefully!), but we use to read it that way as Intel rep cited, no degradation at all until you stay below absolute vcore (includes spikes, be it under load or idle, fixed or offset, extreme LLC or intel spec LLC) of 1.52V
> the question if high speed alone could cause degradation over time is another matter, and heat of course (but we solved that one at least hehe)... so that being said, unless the MB power delivery is faulty there should be no trouble in a long run when staying below vcore of 1.52V
> would higher vcore degrade it? over time yes, faster than "within spec" vcore for sure, but no one can answer how fast that would be, could be years, could be months or weeks, perhaps with some super weak CPU batches it could happen instantly. it's a lottery and we take the risks


as i understand it, sandy is weaker then ivy when it comes to degradation over time when oced right,
we only have to look at those, to see what ours will do over time, it wont be worse for sure,
still safe would be 1.45V max. is what i say, to be very safe, stay close to 1.3V vcore..then most can still have a nice oc


----------



## Valgaur

Holy poop Hokie.... be safe man! and good luck buddy.

I just got off the phone with Intel. time to complain.....a lot.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Holy poop Hokie.... be safe man! and good luck buddy.
> *I just got off the phone with Intel. time to complain.....a lot.*


LoL?


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> So im Having A tumor removed from my Head tomrrow via Surgery ..
> So who wants to Write my obituary if im not back by Friday ??


There are going to delid you,









On a serious note wish you the best. GL.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL?


Time for the real reason of this club lol. I am making a huge effort to make a formal news worth complaint against intel and their stupidity on their heat issues with Ivy. they need to know we want it fixed.


----------



## VonDutch

speak to you soon hokies, gl man


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> So im Having A tumor removed from my Head tomrrow via Surgery ..
> So who wants to Write my obituary if im not back by Friday ??


good luck man and see you Friday


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, auto could have been actually disabled, never know until you manually toggle it to enabled
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it defaults back it could mean that overcock is unstable and BIOS reverts settings in order to boot, try higher vcore to see if it helps.
> also make sure you are running Ultra High LLC.
> 140% current capability is what I run and it's enough for anything possible on air/water.
> here you go:
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
> page 84
> taht is for 3rd gen desktop i5/i7 series.


Wow changing those allowed me to boot at [email protected], and for the llc why ultra high and not extreme? there are also other things in the menu. should i leave it to 140%?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Follow Sin's guide for tweaking the GB bios...he has some good pointers there.

And Hokies, godspeed man, cya by Friday.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> Getting ready to take the razer to my first new 3770k.
> 
> Final testing before delidding..
> 
> Batch 3226C840 I7-3770k
> [email protected] vCore 1.15v
> 4.5GHZ
> Watercooleed with UT-60 420mm RAD and DT Sniper water block.
> TIM IC Diamond
> Not Delidded
> Ambient Temps 21C
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2595435
> 
> HT on
> 
> 
> 
> Package Min 26c Max 66C
> 
> HT off
> 
> 
> 
> Package Min 23C Max 66C
> 
> Time to see if a little delidding magic will happen. Wish me luck!


After delidding.
Ambient Temps 22C

Hyperthreading On



Hyperthreading Off



The temps on this 3770k were good to begin with so I'm glad temps dropped some. Delidding works.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Nothing in particular, just bragging with my new and improved Intel Burn Test results after I lapped and delidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, though, it would be really nice if you could add me to the OP listing, since I have my final results in ^^
> *OCN name*: Leyaena
> *CPU*: i5-3570k
> *on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *Mhz gained*: 0 - so far!
> *OC after delid*: 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops*: 30°C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2596827


Did you lapped the d14? Also, what is you ambient temps? Do you have the stock noctua fans?

sorry about the questions, but im about to recieve my CLP this week and I'm curious.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Did you lapped the d14? Also, what is you ambient temps? Do you have the stock noctua fans?
> 
> sorry about the questions, but im about to recieve my CLP this week and I'm curious.


I didn't lap the d14, from what I could tell it's surface was pretty darn flat to start with. But who knows, if I get bored enough I might just do it to see if my temps improve any. If I do it, I'll be sure to let you know









The d14 is running stock fans (pretty much the best you can put on there anyway) at ambients of around 20-21°C.

The 30°C drop came from:

- Delidding
- CL Liquid Pro on the die
- Lapping the IHS to 2000 grit
- CL Liquid Pro on the IHS

I ended up not sanding the lip on the IHS, so it's still the same distance from the die as it was at stock.
So, in short, your average delid, lap and CLP combo, it worked miracles with the NH-D14, as you can see








I hope you'll be getting similar results when your liquid pro arrives


----------



## chris-br

Yeah, you made me change my mind.. I will also put the CLP on the ihs and d14 now...







Didn't want to, but seeing your results;;;; Also, i pretty much leave my d14 alone on the cpu.. I just pull the fans out and blow compressed air to dust it off.










Thanks.


----------



## ivanlabrie

D14 is a very nice heatsink...
I got a Silver Arrow and I love it though, I have a thing with Thermalright heatsinks lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> D14 is a very nice heatsink...
> I got a Silver Arrow and I love it though, I have a thing with Thermalright heatsinks lol


Same!


----------



## Arm3nian

*OCN name*: Arm3nian
*CPU*: i7-3770k
*on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
*ihs-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
*Mhz gained*: 0
*OC after delid*: 4.5GHz
*Temp drops*: 45°C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2596998


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> *OCN name*: Arm3nian
> *CPU*: i7-3770k
> *on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *Mhz gained*: 0
> *OC after delid*: 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops*: 45°C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2596998


45c?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 45c?


Went from h100 to custom loop during delid.


----------



## chris-br

That's not fair, you have to test with the h100 first. lol

Edit: you are also running at a nice 1.248 volts.. I'm only able to get 4.5 stable at 1,315 volts.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> That's not fair, you have to test with the h100 first. lol


no way in hell i'm going to take off 4 layers of pro, undo my loop, take off rad, install h100, reapply pro, then take it off again, and install loop for a single number.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rog1121*
> 
> Ok, so I Just got off Live-Chat...
> What kind of glue would I use to fix my mirror frame? I heard of Black Epoxy but I'm not exactly sure on it.


You might want to edit that post...R.T.V. Black sealant. For mirror frames, right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ok, my actual temp drop is about 90c then when I failed to apply pro, that was with water. Good enough?


lol









You did cheat...no use in adding your data to the spreadsheet.


----------



## She loved E

i dropped 90C by turning my computer off. pls add to spreadsheet!


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> i dropped 90C by turning my computer off. pls add to spreadsheet!


Those are some pretty cold ambients you have there


----------



## She loved E

it was running at 120C


----------



## IronDoq

Think I killed it







. Mind you this is only done by lapping... minor scuff to the edge of the PCB as you can see and no bent pins in the mobo. Thursday I'll be getting a few mobos and 3450s to troubleshoot the problem further. Pretty much hinders me to using one stick of ram, locking me to 4gb for the time being. Should I just get an 8gb stick and rock single channel until I upgrade to Haswell, or should I just (after the problem is finally determined) get a nbew 3570k? Maybe delid this one as practice and sell it for benching only? Is single-channel ram performance bad enough so that I'll notice it when gaming (BF3, BO2, Skyrim, ect.).


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> 
> Think I killed it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Mind you this is only done by lapping... minor scuff to the edge of the PCB as you can see and no bent pins in the mobo. Thursday I'll be getting a few mobos and 3450s to troubleshoot the problem further. Pretty much hinders me to using one stick of ram, locking me to 4gb for the time being. Should I just get an 8gb stick and rock single channel until I upgrade to Haswell, or should I just (after the problem is finally determined) get a nbew 3570k? Maybe delid this one as practice and sell it for benching only? Is single-channel ram performance bad enough so that I'll notice it when gaming (BF3, BO2, Skyrim, ect.).


Why did your sandpaper get near that in the first place? And you won't even notice single vs dual vs quad channel ram in games.


----------



## IronDoq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Why did your sandpaper get near that in the first place? And you won't even notice single vs dual vs quad channel ram in games.


I honestly don't know. Like I said I wasn't giving it my fullest attention, and so as I was turning it it might have caught and the motion of my hand continued to scrape it until I noticed. Time will tell.


----------



## IronDoq

Just scored about 1000 lower in 3dmark with single channel at 15550 instead of 16550, so not too much of a difference. I'll make it after all









Edit: Could someone with 2133 ram post a 3dmark run so I can compare physics scores? Thanks


----------



## ivanlabrie

Use it and perhaps you can upgrade to Haswell and have more luck, or get a cheap 3770k later on.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Just scored about 1000 lower in 3dmark with single channel at 15550 instead of 16550, so not too much of a difference. I'll make it after all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Could someone with 2133 ram post a 3dmark run so I can compare physics scores? Thanks


3dmark does not affect much for gaming.. u may lose 5-10fps.. which ca n be made up for with 200mhz OC..

However ill give u 50$ for that chip


----------



## Arm3nian

Does anyone know of someone with my motherboard? Asus p8z77 ws. I think it's faulty, I can't do anything 4.5+, i've seriously tried 1.55volts and it just crashes on windows screen.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Does anyone know of someone with my motherboard? Asus p8z77 ws. I think it's faulty, I can't do anything 4.5+, i've seriously tried 1.55volts and it just crashes on windows screen.


Valguar has one of those over priced things lol .. I do not think he paid to much for his tho..


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't lap before delidding...for these sort of issues. Lap and bam, there goes your warranty.
> Easier to delid, replace the ihs with a lapped pentium 4 ihs and keep the original ihs just in case


That's a great idea, how well do the p4 IHS's fit on the ivy die?


----------



## jprovido

managed to get it stable at 4.9ghz at 1.38v not bad eh







I'm at work now and I left prime95 running. ima post max temps later when I get home


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> *OCN name*: Arm3nian
> *CPU*: i7-3770k
> *on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *Mhz gained*: 0
> *OC after delid*: 4.5GHz
> *Temp drops*: 45°C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2596998


Accepted!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> BTW, hokies, I have beaten that damn Xeon in Cinebench


Great job *feniks*!







Post that score in the Ivy Stable thread so that I can add it to the spreadsheet to be added to the bench scores there. Nice score to have posted there.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Just pretty much loosened the block to not allow for contact, and still error code 51. I'll be able to undo the mounting and check the CPU/Mobo tomorrow, until then off to sleep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I just remembered that i have a few i5 3450s coming in this week for some builds for the parents work, along with a few h77 boards with which I can test my cpu/mobo individually.
> This is truly a thread that I would choose to embody the OCN community, you guys rock!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you sir!
> 
> I rally think more people come here for OC'ing help and everything else all the time.
> 
> What do you think crew?
Click to expand...

*Valgaur*, I think this thread you started has attracted a whole lot of helpful and knowledgeable people who are able to assist lots of OC'ers with many issues! Its a very good thing to see...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am not on there yet either and its been a month or two
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> then you where here before the rest if us,
> thread isnt even 2 months old yet ...haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, 2 months almost, and 55,433 views ...nice
Click to expand...

*VanDutch*, your right about how short and how much! The thread grows very fast - I missed a few days and I had over 300 post to read through to catch up!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> So im Having A tumor removed from my Head tomrrow via Surgery ..
> 
> So who wants to Write my obituary if im not back by Friday ??


We are all wishing you the best *Hokies*! We will be looking forward to talking to you friday. Make sure you give us a post as soon as you can so we know you are all right!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't lap before delidding...for these sort of issues. Lap and bam, there goes your warranty.
> Easier to delid, replace the ihs with a lapped pentium 4 ihs and keep the original ihs just in case


Good idea *ivanlabrie*! Lapping is a good idea to further improve your deledded temps, but it sure ruins the IHS for any warranties.


----------



## FtW 420

Are you updating the ivy stable/suicide thread now? Been a long time since that one was updated, munaim1 hasn't been on the ball...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Are you updating the ivy stable/suicide thread now? Been a long time since that one was updated, munaim1 hasn't been on the ball...


I was asked to keep a spreadsheet for him, but I can't update the thread. munaim1 asked me for a copy of the spreadsheet around two weeks ago, so I sent it to him hoping the data would get to the thread, but no go so far. So I keep adding new stuff to the spreadsheet until he is ready to take that over again. Lots of stuff to add though, and it looks like he must be very busy with something. I expect I am not alone in wanting to see all the results posted!


----------



## FtW 420

Cool, at least he won't have to look through all the posts before updating. He's lucky you're around!


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I was asked to keep a spreadsheet for him, but I can't update the thread. munaim1 asked me for a copy of the spreadsheet around two weeks ago, so I sent it to him hoping the data would get to the thread, but no go so far. So I keep adding new stuff to the spreadsheet until he is ready to take that over again. Lots of stuff to add though, and it looks like he must be very busy with something. I expect I am not alone in wanting to see all the results posted!


PM sent.


----------



## Hokies83

Idontcare just did a Liquid Ultra App on the bare die..

Look how much he used.. like 4x to much XD


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I was asked to keep a spreadsheet for him, but I can't update the thread. munaim1 asked me for a copy of the spreadsheet around two weeks ago, so I sent it to him hoping the data would get to the thread, but no go so far. So I keep adding new stuff to the spreadsheet until he is ready to take that over again. Lots of stuff to add though, and it looks like he must be very busy with something. I expect I am not alone in wanting to see all the results posted!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PM sent.
Click to expand...

Thanks.


----------



## Swag

I don't know if it's the camera flash but that thing looks like just crap on a die. I'm not even exaggerating! Was it for an experiment or that's how he thought how to put it actually?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't know if it's the camera flash but that thing looks like just crap on a die. I'm not even exaggerating! Was it for an experiment or that's how he thought how to put it actually?


He made a thread of a Tim Show down with like 8 Tims... And that is how he used the ultra to compare to the others....

He gotta be losing 10c for using way way to much...

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595&page=3


----------



## DirektEffekt

I actually hope that Intel keeps using TIM on the die. I enjoy the extra tweaking in the form of delidding. It feels more challenging to get good clocks.

Hope your surgery goes wellt hough Hokie!

Also, I just got myself some custom water going to replace my H80!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I actually hope that Intel keeps using TIM on the die. I enjoy the extra tweaking in the form of delidding. It feels more challenging to get good clocks.
> Hope your surgery goes wellt hough Hokie!
> Also, I just got myself some custom water going to replace my H80!


What else do you guys think on Intel TIM usage? It will go into my letter to them. Also shoudl they make it easier to delid or keep it the way it is. and cover delidding?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> He made a thread of a Tim Show down with like 8 Tims... And that is how he used the ultra to compare to the others....
> He gotta be losing 10c for using way way to much...
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595&page=3


I enjoyed reading that and temps were kind of like what I was expecting.

CL Liquid Pro is a pain to clean of the copper block part so its not a good idea to spread it when cleaning. Just dab it and work small area to avoid spreading. It bonds to copper very fast. On the die Liquid Pro came off super easy for me with alcohol.

I think that review is great but at the same time may scare some people away from delidding.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What else do you guys think on Intel TIM usage? It will go into my letter to them. Also shoudl they make it easier to delid or keep it the way it is. and cover delidding?


They'll never cover de-lidding.. Ever
You should ask to buy them without the IHS though, that would be Interesting.. or maybe with it not stuck down?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> They'll never cover de-lidding.. Ever
> You should ask to buy them without the IHS though, that would be Interesting.. or maybe with it not stuck down?


Yeah, if they would sell bare ships, maybe with a rubber shim or something on the PCB to help avoid die damage from lopsided mounts, I'd buy one!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What else do you guys think on Intel TIM usage? It will go into my letter to them. Also should they make it easier to delid or keep it the way it is. and cover delidding?


if anything, they should make it easier to delid,
then they can still use their own tim, its not a bad tim, but not good enough to use on the die,
it only has a w/mk of about 3-4 i think..
the other thing intel can do, is solder the ihs to the die again, like sandy,(solder 30-60 w/mk)
maybe not optimal like when using liquid pro(82 w/mk) on the die, but better
then it is now, and saves us delidding it..

ask them their "secret" on how they delid, if they do,
maybe they know the safe/best way


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I enjoyed reading that and temps were kind of like what I was expecting.
> CL Liquid Pro is a pain to clean of the copper block part so its not a good idea to spread it when cleaning. Just dab it and work small area to avoid spreading. It bonds to copper very fast. On the die Liquid Pro came off super easy for me with alcohol.
> I think that review is great but at the same time may scare some people away from delidding.


we shouldnt recommend using liquid pro/ultra on the ihs/base plate cooler..
only on the die, we know it doesnt make much difference which tim to use on the ihs,
any good tim will do on the ihs, or base plate cooler..
but the top layer of the die is made of "glass" right,
so its much easier to remove liquid pro/ultra from that


----------



## Swag

Just spend about $200 - $250 on your mobo and you'll be able to OC to the max. Only time when you should spend more is either it has a feature you really need or it's on sale. Motherboards do affect the overall overclockability but it definitely does not limit it to the point you have to spend $300 on it. Full size vs mini makes a huge difference though. Pointing that out right now.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H is a entry lvl one(113 euro), i noticed they limited max vcore on it too, 1.85V was max,
> its not for nothing they do that of course,
> i should have bought a Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD5H ( but 193 euro),
> instead of the one i have now.. o well, live and learn


I've lost track of the number of times I've thought "Well, in hindsight, it would've been so much better for me to have bought that instead. I was an idiot back then".


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H is a entry lvl one(113 euro), i noticed they limited max vcore on it too, 1.85V was max,
> its not for nothing they do that of course,
> i should have bought a Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD5H ( but 193 euro),
> instead of the one i have now.. o well, live and learn


Yeah.. But who will be running their CPU at above 1.85v?








If you wanted to bench.. yes you should have gotten the UD5H for sure.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> At least your motherboard works lol. I bet I cant get 5ghz stable at 50000000x10^100000000 volts


just thought of this, did you update your bios?,
mine worked better when i changed the F5 that came with the mobo to F15 bios..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've lost track of the number of times I've thought "Well, in hindsight, it would've been so much better for me to have bought that instead. I was an idiot back then".


thats why i said, live and learn..lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah.. But who will be running their CPU at above 1.85v?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you wanted to bench.. yes you should have gotten the UD5H for sure.


didnt know at that time, i would go into ocing big time ..lol
not saying my mobo is bad tho, it does oc well, is rocksolid
i wanted to go above 1.85V vcore for benching..lol
to make a 5.5ghz run with 4 cores enabled,
because of the vcore limit, i only could run only run 5.5ghz with 2 cores hehe


----------



## Hokies83

Using my IPad I'm in per Op with I've"s in my arms


----------



## Leyaena

Not entirely sure what to make of it, but:

- In case you still need to go in: good luck in there man, got my fingers crossed for you








- In case you're back out again: Yay! You're okay! Awesome









There, that should cover all bases ^^
Get well soon Hokies!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Just a little bit of a bump from turning the system RAM from 1866 to 2133: http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5063838


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Using my IPad I'm in per Op with I've"s in my arms


That does not sound fun! Hurry back, we will be waiting to here to hear back from you as soon as you can!


----------



## bgineng

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Using my IPad I'm in per Op with I've"s in my arms


Posting to a forum while being prepped for surgery... That's dedication lol.

In all seriousness, best of luck and I hope all goes well!


----------



## Valgaur

Letter has been submitted to the receptionist of the editor of CustomPC. He will be reading soon. They should be reading this guide as well. So keep up the good work guys!


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Letter has been submitted to the receptionist of the editor of CustomPC. He will be reading soon. They should be reading this guide as well. So keep up the good work guys!


Well done Val


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Well done Val


Neopunx linked me the article I read it and was like....ummmm wrong tools lol. You will see more killed than survived.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Wow changing those allowed me to boot at [email protected], and for the llc why ultra high and not extreme? there are also other things in the menu. should i leave it to 140%?


great news then









yeah, stick to UH 75% LLC as it is at least not overshooting under load (it drops by 0.008-0.016v instead).
with Extreme LLC your vcore will get overshot under load up to +0.03V versus idle vcore, it's not good, easy to loose control over maximum vcore you are using and could be harmful at extreme clocks if things get out of control perhaps (was the case with older CPUs, not those new ones however) ... to be honest, it simply is not recommended to run extreme LLC daily.
yea, keep the rest settings same as you have, 140% is good, it's just a limiter.


----------



## wholeeo

So I will be switching motherboards today and took care not to remove the IHS off of the die while doing so. Do you guys think I should stick it into new mobo as is or redo liquid pro on die? The IHS may have turned a slight bit on top of the die when I removed it though so that's why I have my doubts.


----------



## kgtuning

Might as well change it if your right there, IMO.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we shouldnt recommend using liquid pro/ultra on the ihs/base plate cooler..


For no IHS bare die mounts I think CL Pro is the best way to go but you have to keep in mind the copper block will be tough to clean later on.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great job *feniks*!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Post that score in the Ivy Stable thread so that I can add it to the spreadsheet to be added to the bench scores there. Nice score to have posted there.


good idea, will re-post it soon over there. are we keeping spreadsheet for Cinebench results too in that thread now? I thought it was only for Prime95 & SuperPI?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Idontcare just did a Liquid Ultra App on the bare die..
> Look how much he used.. like 4x to much XD
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


LMAO!!! I used half or a third of that amount the first two times and it was still too much (splashed the TIM all over the PCB after the IHS went on it)! ... nowadays I just gently scrub/brush leftovers from the tip of CL Ultra syringe and apply/brush them on the die (super thin layer) and it brings very good results (no clots, smooth flat surface)


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> We shouldnt recommend using liquid pro/ultra on the ihs/base plate cooler..


Ah well, I was stubborn and went with Pro on the IHS anyway when I did mine.
True, it'll be a pain to clean off, and it might take ages, but then again, I've got time and I enjoy tinkering with my stuff








Besides, it's not like lapping my IHS was a 5 minute job either, and I've heard numerous times that any left-over traces of Liquid Pro'll only make the next TIM you apply perform better.

All in all, I'm happy with my choice








And I'm certainly not disappointed with the overall 30c drop in temps either ^^


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Ah well, I was stubborn and went with Pro on the IHS anyway when I did mine.
> True, it'll be a pain to clean off, and it might take ages, but then again, I've got time and I enjoy tinkering with my stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Besides, it's not like lapping my IHS was a 5 minute job either, and I've heard numerous times that any left-over traces of Liquid Pro'll only make the next TIM you apply perform better.
> All in all, I'm happy with my choice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I'm certainly not disappointed with the overall 30c drop in temps either ^^


If you lapped the top of the IHS then I don't see a problem using it. To remove Liquid Pro from top of IHS you can say good bye to any factory markings. Might as well lap it
then use Liquid Pro.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Ah well, I was stubborn and went with Pro on the IHS anyway when I did mine.
> True, it'll be a pain to clean off, and it might take ages, but then again, I've got time and I enjoy tinkering with my stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Besides, it's not like lapping my IHS was a 5 minute job either, and I've heard numerous times that any left-over traces of Liquid Pro'll only make the next TIM you apply perform better.
> All in all, I'm happy with my choice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I'm certainly not disappointed with the overall 30c drop in temps either ^^


I use CL Ultra on the IHS (and cooling block contacting it). it's OK. may take a while to clean the Pro off later on, but it provides awesome temps!!!















Ultra is much easier to rub off with paper towels and alcohol, on copper cooling block had to use the scratch pad (scotch brite?) to actually sand it off LOL, but it comes off from nickel IHS eaily with just alcohol after rubbing for a while with soft paper towels.

on lapped IHS it shouldn't matter anyways, since your markings are gone anyways


----------



## Leyaena

Hehe, good point lads, if I ever do need to remove the liquid pro, out comes the sandpaper ^^

In other news, I've been thinking of doing a bit of an overhaul of my rig, based around that new Corsair Link thingy that came out a while back.
Figured I'd get myself something nice for the holidays, especially as my power supply has been acting a bit wonkey lately...
On my wishlist for now are the corsair link module itself, the AX760i psu, and maybe a set of sleeved cables to go with it (It's damn near impossible to find cable sleeving around here, I discovered).

Was thinking of maybe getting a H100i as well, but I figured it probably wouldn't net me all that much performance over my current Noctua NH-D14... What do you guys think?
Some little sneaky money-spendey part in me still wants to shell out the money for a full custom WC-loop as well, but I think I'll hold off on that for now.

So... long story short, I've got a bit of money put aside and wanna get myself something nice, what would you guys do if you were me?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> For no IHS bare die mounts I think CL Pro is the best way to go but you have to keep in mind the copper block will be tough to clean later on.


yea, it is for sure, its still on the die you use it so, but most of us use the ihs,
so can use another tim between ihs and copper block, saves trouble of cleaning pro later,
on the die it doesnt get that much grip, since its made of "glass"
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Ah well, I was stubborn and went with Pro on the IHS anyway when I did mine.
> True, it'll be a pain to clean off, and it might take ages, but then again, I've got time and I enjoy tinkering with my stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Besides, it's not like lapping my IHS was a 5 minute job either, and I've heard numerous times that any left-over traces of Liquid Pro'll only make the next TIM you apply perform better.
> All in all, I'm happy with my choice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I'm certainly not disappointed with the overall 30c drop in temps either ^^


I used it on all sides, die, inside ihs, on ihs and a thin layer base plate cooler








i had almost the same result as you 25+C tempdrop,
i leave it as is for now, in a few months i will take it off,
and look for the best way to clean it, one thing im gonna do,
is buy that cleaning package from the coollaboratory,
and see if that works..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Hehe, good point lads, if I ever do need to remove the liquid pro, out comes the sandpaper ^^
> In other news, I've been thinking of doing a bit of an overhaul of my rig, based around that new Corsair Link thingy that came out a while back.
> Figured I'd get myself something nice for the holidays, especially as my power supply has been acting a bit wonkey lately...
> On my wishlist for now are the corsair link module itself, the AX760i psu, and maybe a set of sleeved cables to go with it (It's damn near impossible to find cable sleeving around here, I discovered).
> Was thinking of maybe getting a H100i as well, but I figured it probably wouldn't net me all that much performance over my current Noctua NH-D14... What do you guys think?
> Some little sneaky money-spendey part in me still wants to shell out the money for a full custom WC-loop as well, but I think I'll hold off on that for now.
> So... long story short, I've got a bit of money put aside and wanna get myself something nice, what would you guys do if you were me?


i finally got money next month for my next upgrade,
gigabyte 7950 windforce 3 ...woot ..lol
what do you guys think about that one?

corsair makes good psu's,
i like my XFX ProSeries 750W XXX Edition tho,
did very good in all kinds of tests back then,
and has Seasonic components in it,
i see alot of the top cpu have their components in it,
i think my next one, will be a seasonic cpu,
but they are costy..lol
Seasonic X-760 80+ Gold, not sure how it performs,
didnt look for reviews etc yet









i like that new H100i, but when i looked for a prefab waterloops,
i came across the thermaltake water 2.0 extreme,
most reviews show its even better then the H100,
not sure about the new H100i tho, and how it performs,
from what i read it was more some other little upgrades,
like tubing, noise reduction etc..

but my mugen can keep my chip cool easy,
im not in a hurry anymore to get another/better cooler for now,
changing my vid card will improve my rig alot more ...yesss...


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd go with the Eisberg really, or the new Swiftech kits...for a little stretch.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go with the Eisberg really, or the new Swiftech kits...for a little stretch.


are they prefab?
didnt see those yet, you have some links for me ivan?

o w8, eisberg, that was with the blond girl right,
the vid hokies showed us..lol, didnt really follow what the vid was about then


----------



## chris-br

i don't have space on my case for a 240 rad, unless i do it outside hanging on the back of the case... Or even a h80i.. but if Leyaena is getting these awsome temps with the same cooler i have, why would i change?? my d14 is impossible to hear it.

Those Eisberg kits are awsome, you can add blocks or rads.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i finally got money next month for my next upgrade,
> gigabyte 7950 windforce 3 ...woot ..lol
> what do you guys think about that one?
> corsair makes good psu's,
> i like my XFX ProSeries 750W XXX Edition tho,
> did very good in all kinds of tests back then,
> and has Seasonic components in it,
> i see alot of the top cpu have their components in it,
> i think my next one, will be a seasonic cpu,
> but they are costy..lol
> Seasonic X-760 80+ Gold, not sure how it performs,
> didnt look for reviews etc yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i like that new H100i, but when i looked for a prefab waterloops,
> i came across the thermaltake water 2.0 extreme,
> most reviews show its even better then the H100,
> not sure about the new H100i tho, and how it performs,
> from what i read it was more some other little upgrades,
> like tubing, noise reduction etc..
> but my mugen can keep my chip cool easy,
> im not in a hurry anymore to get another/better cooler for now,
> changing my vid card will improve my rig alot more ...yesss...


I would save more and go for a 7970 or 680, significant improvement over your current card and a 7950. 680 maxes everygame at 1080p, 7950 more like 30-40fps.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i like that new H100i, but when i looked for a prefab waterloops,
> i came across the thermaltake water 2.0 extreme,
> most reviews show its even better then the H100,
> not sure about the new H100i tho, and how it performs,
> from what i read it was more some other little upgrades,
> like tubing, noise reduction etc..


About the H100i and the difference with the H100...
For your viewing pleasure, by TastyPC


----------



## gizmo83

what do you think about my 4.7 ghz? Liquid pro on die and on his. Cooler noctua nh d14.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> About the H100i and the difference with the H100...
> For your viewing pleasure, by TastyPC


LOv her.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> what do you think about my 4.7 ghz? Liquid pro on die and on his. Cooler noctua nh d14.


Bad. Those temps are far far far to high for only 4.7. I can do 5.3 no problem and thats at 1.63 vcore, temps will sit around 90-103 range depending on core.


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Bad. Those temps are far far far to high for only 4.7. I can do 5.3 no problem and thats at 1.63 vcore, temps will sit around 90-103 range depending on core.


With what cooler? TBH those temps looks about right. Of course that one core is a wee bit too high but both of my CPUs have a core or two that run higher than the rest.


----------



## Hokies83

Welp im still alive...

Have no feeling in right arm so typeing with left hand plz excuse typos...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Awesome man!








Yeah, one handed touchscreens are rough...so it was a success?
Thanks God!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Using my IPad I'm in per Op with I've"s in my arms


Good luck man, hoping the upgrade to hokies 2.0 goes well!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Letter has been submitted to the receptionist of the editor of CustomPC. He will be reading soon. They should be reading this guide as well. So keep up the good work guys!


Hard call on this one, I would not sign a petition or letter about Ivy running hot even though I tried a delid just for lulz, ivy still works fine. I still think if people want extreme overclocks, just have to get more extreme cooling, like you are in the process of doing now. Ivy is pretty much the same now that cpus were before sandy, I wouldn't want intel to think we want sandy back...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> good idea, will re-post it soon over there. are we keeping spreadsheet for Cinebench results too in that thread now? I thought it was only for Prime95 & SuperPI?
> LMAO!!! I used half or a third of that amount the first two times and it was still too much (splashed the TIM all over the PCB after the IHS went on it)! ... nowadays I just gently scrub/brush leftovers from the tip of CL Ultra syringe and apply/brush them on the die (super thin layer) and it brings very good results (no clots, smooth flat surface)


superpi, cinebench, wprime, memory clock.. Have at the benchies! I like that he threw the suicide club in there for the people who would not run prime95.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> With what cooler? TBH those temps looks about right. Of course that one core is a wee bit too high but both of my CPUs have a core or two that run higher than the rest.


There should not be that kind of difference in temps though. At all. A lot of peoples are well within 10C not 20.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp im still alive...
> Have no feeling in right arm so typeing with left hand plz excuse typos...


Glad to have ya back buddy.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp im still alive...
> Have no feeling in right arm so typeing with left hand plz excuse typos...


We were worried they were gonna scramble something in your brain and you would come back the biggest AMD fanboi ever!

On a side note, I hear a lot of people mention using the IHS from a P4, will any P4 do? They made P4s for more than one socket, is there a specific version I should look for or do they all work?


----------



## ivanlabrie

478 single core celerons and p4s, and some single core 775 celeron.
478 is the way to go







They are cheaper and useless, 775 is still viable for benching.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh i got the good pain killers yah doctor says complete complete success

lol stick Doctor would have had to make me brain dead for that to happen.


----------



## Hokies83

i will be here till friday however lol... hard to talk 1 handed ivs and pan killers...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 478 single core celerons and p4s, and some single core 775 celeron.
> 478 is the way to go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are cheaper and useless, 775 is still viable for benching.


Dang I sold one of those on ebay for a few bucks a couple months ago. I knew I should have kept it around for something.

Maybe I can find one for a few bucks.


----------



## gizmo83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> what do you think about my 4.7 ghz? Liquid pro on die and on his. Cooler noctua nh d14.


at 4.7 i can't lower my vcore. I don't know if my ram limit my oc voltage stability.....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> at 4.7 i can't lower my vcore. I don't know if my ram limit my oc voltage stability.....


It's not your vcore, it's your pro application most likely. If you have to much it can't do the job. What vcore are you at as well?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Dang I sold one of those on ebay for a few bucks a couple months ago. I knew I should have kept it around for something.
> Maybe I can find one for a few bucks.


I got one for $2.50 shipped.


----------



## lilchronic

so i got my cl ultra today but dont think i can man up and do it yet. i will see how long i can look at it and my box of double sided razors on my desk before i get the job done. remember now i already messed 1 up not tryna do that again.

i also picked up sandpaper to to lap my ihs is it ok to use my old ihs that i got from my old 3570k chip and put it on my new chip cause i plan on lapping it for practice i guess(looks real simple thou) and have another reason to delid my chip










imagining my temps 20c -10c lower makes me want to do it now lol


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so i got my cl ultra today but dont think i can man up and do it yet. i will see how long i can look at it and my box of double sided razors on my desk before i get the job done. remember now i already messed 1 up not tryna do that again.
> i also picked up sandpaper to to lap my ihs is it ok to use my old ihs that i got from my old 3570k chip and put it on my new chip cause i plan on lapping it for practice i guess(looks real simple thou) and have another reason to delid my chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> imagining my temps 20c -10c lower makes me want to do it now lol


That is a pretty good chip...WORTH to delidded, for sure a 5ghz easy chip. VERY NICE.


----------



## Arm3nian

Wow ocn has a mobile version of the site now and it actually works quite well.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Wow ocn has a mobile version of the site now and it actually works quite well.


It does work pretty good. I think I could upload a picture from my phone now. I could before.


----------



## gizmo83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> prolly not, i needed 1.420V vcore to get 4.8ghz prime stable,
> going up to 4.9ghz my vcore jumped to 1.510V vcore..
> you could try lower cpu pll a bit, if you havent yet, it can sometimes make a oc stable,
> what are you using for ram settings, xmp profile? can mess up a oc also..
> whats the vcores youre using for 4.8, and where you at with the 4.9ghz?
> 4.9, 5.0ghz and above is where most ivy's start to ask for alot more vcore..


I have same ram. i suspect that they are a problem in terms of overclocking


----------



## ivanlabrie

I use the desktop flavor on my Dolphin browser, and it's sluggish but works.
I'm gonna try the mobile site when I get back home.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp im still alive...
> 
> Have no feeling in right arm so typeing with left hand plz excuse typos...


So good to hear the delidding was a success! You can now expect significantly lower temps for every system you will ever own!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Using my IPad I'm in per Op with I've"s in my arms
> 
> 
> 
> superpi, cinebench, wprime, memory clock.. Have at the benchies! I like that he threw the suicide club in there for the people who would not run prime95.
Click to expand...

Like *DtW 420* says "Have at the benchies!" *Munaim1* has given me spreadheet permissions on the Ivy Stable thread so I can start to add in the bench results for everyone. I'll get to it as I can (with work, family, Oc'ing and games







), but it will be great to see it finally get populated!!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so i got my cl ultra today but dont think i can man up and do it yet. i will see how long i can look at it and my box of double sided razors on my desk before i get the job done. remember now i already messed 1 up not tryna do that again.
> i also picked up sandpaper to to lap my ihs is it ok to use my old ihs that i got from my old 3570k chip and put it on my new chip cause i plan on lapping it for practice i guess(looks real simple thou) and have another reason to delid my chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> imagining my temps 20c -10c lower makes me want to do it now lol


The wallpaper looks like it should help with cooling.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> I have same ram. i suspect that they are a problem in terms of overclocking


Ram shouldn't really be an issue as long as it is stable, if it is fine with 35x multi should be fine with 45x. The memory would really only make an overclocking difference if it is at the limit & you were OCing with bclk (which OCs memory frequency as well).


----------



## lilchronic

so using a different ihs from another 3570k wouldent cause any problems would it?
the reason why im asking is because im currently lapping my old ihs now. and it seems like its going to take a while lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Should work just fine...if you have a spare better use that.


----------



## FtW 420

Should be fine, as long as the lip on the IHS is about the same height for the latch, & inside the IHS is also the same (die --> ihs). Put just a tiny dab of TIM on the die & put on the different IHS to make sure contact is good inside.


----------



## PCWargamer

*Ok everyone*, the IB Stable OP has allowed me to start updating the spreadsheet which I will do as I can. I do have another life!









*NOTE: Suicide Runs spreadsheet has just been updated with all the "Accepted" scores I could find.*

Please look them over to see if yours was included and what others have done. _And then see if you can beat their score_!!!









If yours is missing, please provide a post # to where you posted it on this thread. Remember to read the rules as if it is not done according to them it will not be "Accepted".

The prime stable spreadsheet will be updated later as I still have to look up some data for it, but you should have already had me tell you if you were accepted and I should already have you on my personal spreadsheet.

Thanks everyone for making this a great club for helping OCN OC'ers get their IB's stable and running fast!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Ok everyone*, the IB Stable OP has allowed me to start updating the spreadsheet which I will do as I can. I do have another life!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *NOTE: Suicide Runs spreadsheet has just been updated with all the "Accepted" scores I could find.*
> Please look them over to see if yours was included and what others have done. _And then see if you can beat their score_!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If yours is missing, please provide a post # to where you posted it on this thread. Remember to read the rules as if it is not done according to them it will not be "Accepted".
> The prime stable spreadsheet will be updated later as I still have to look up some data for it, but you should have already had me tell you if you were accepted and I should already have you on my personal spreadsheet.
> Thanks everyone for making this a great club for helping OCN OC'ers get their IB's stable and running fast!!!


Your welcome


----------



## OcN13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so i got my cl ultra today but dont think i can man up and do it yet. i will see how long i can look at it and my box of double sided razors on my desk before i get the job done. remember now i already messed 1 up not tryna do that again.
> i also picked up sandpaper to to lap my ihs is it ok to use my old ihs that i got from my old 3570k chip and put it on my new chip cause i plan on lapping it for practice i guess(looks real simple thou) and have another reason to delid my chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> imagining my temps 20c -10c lower makes me want to do it now lol


Wow that is a great temp and vcore man!! Very nice chip. What does it do 5GHZ at?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> what do you think about my 4.7 ghz? Liquid pro on die and on his. Cooler noctua nh d14.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> at 4.7 i can't lower my vcore. I don't know if my ram limit my oc voltage stability.....


4.7ghz temps after 30 min prime,

63C hottest core, thats almost 30C cooler then you..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gizmo83*
> 
> I have same ram. i suspect that they are a problem in terms of overclocking


they can be , if you use XMP profile at the same time as your oc, and get crashes,
thats why its recommended to leave ram at auto or only use multiplier till youre done ocing the cpu









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Dang I sold one of those on ebay for a few bucks a couple months ago. I knew I should have kept it around for something.
> Maybe I can find one for a few bucks.


i just bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro








i noticed some have a hole on top of the ihs ..
funny, all those old chips


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 4.7ghz temps after 30 min prime,
> 
> 63C hottest core
> i just bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i noticed some have a hole on top of the ihs ..
> funny, all those old chips


Yeah, both of mine do.. I plan to use a Pentium 4 IHS too and grab some sandpaper and lap them both before the CL stuff gets here. It was shipped off yesterday and I don't have tracking as "Destuch post" is having problems.









What kind of sanding paper is required? 400, 800, 1000, 2000 and then 3000? I won't be using bronze polish as it's a waste of money and apparently brings temps up.
Eh, considering lapping the bottom sides to make the IHS have better contact with the 3570k, how much do you guys suggest lapping of that?

EDIT: I'll be able to afford everything soon if I get this traineeship!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, both of mine do.. I plan to use a Pentium 4 IHS too and grab some sandpaper and lap them both before the CL stuff gets here. It was shipped off yesterday and I don't have tracking as "Destuch post" is having problems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What kind of sanding paper is required? 400, 800, 1000, 2000 and then 3000? I won't be using bronze polish as it's a waste of money and apparently brings temps up.
> Eh, considering lapping the bottom sides to make the IHS have better contact with the 3570k, how much do you guys suggest lapping of that?
> EDIT: I'll be able to afford everything soon if I get this traineeship!


i wouldnt lap the underside ihs, i would check if it spins freely on the die tho,
like in my avatar, after delid, and cleaning pcb/underside ihs, the ihs should
touch the die anyways..
made this post about lapping a while ago, might be helpfull,
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749

i think bronze polish fills the little gaps, what normally gets filled by the tim,
giving worse temps that way..
3000 if you want to have a morror finish, for making it flat only,
less grit is ok..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I would save more and go for a 7970 or 680, significant improvement over your current card and a 7950. 680 maxes everygame at 1080p, 7950 more like 30-40fps.


the 680 is out of my moneyrange,
the 7970, the cheapest is about 70-80 euro more then this one,
at first i wanted to buy the 7870, then saw the 7950 is 384 bit,
instead of 7870 256bit, so i started so safe money for that one ..lol
Gigabyte Radeon HD7950 WindForce 3 is already oced from factory, 100mhz,
and can be oced some more easy, got a nice cooler, closing the gap with the
7970 even more, for less money tho


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OcN13*
> 
> Wow that is a great temp and vcore man!! Very nice chip. What does it do 5GHZ at?


its around 1.35v for 5 ghz
ran prime 95 for 8 hours till it crashed max temps were 85 90c. havent really tested 5 ghz much.


----------



## lilchronic

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824

thats what im bout to get in a couple days. i no i dont need 4 gb vram but the hell with it









and if there is a game in the future that needs more than 2Gbs ive got it , i could also go sli and be good for atleast a few years


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
> thats what im bout to get in a couple days. i no i dont need 4 gb vram but the hell with it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and if there is a game in the future that needs more than 2Gbs ive got it , i could also go sli and be good for atleast a few years
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/quote
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125449
> 
> get that. or ask Hokies. hes the GPU man.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i wouldnt lap the underside ihs, i would check if it spins freely on the die tho,
> like in my avatar, after delid, and cleaning pcb/underside ihs, the ihs should
> touch the die anyways..
> made this post about lapping a while ago, might be helpfull,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749
> i think bronze polish fills the little gaps, what normally gets filled by the tim,
> giving worse temps that way..
> 3000 if you want to have a morror finish, for making it flat only,
> less grit is ok..
> the 680 is out of my moneyrange,
> the 7970, the cheapest is about 70-80 euro more then this one,
> at first i wanted to buy the 7870, then saw the 7950 is 384 bit,
> instead of 7870 256bit, so i started so safe money for that one ..lol
> Gigabyte Radeon HD7950 WindForce 3 is already oced from factory, 100mhz,
> and can be oced some more easy, got a nice cooler, closing the gap with the
> 7970 even more, for less money tho


Factory oc is 100% useless if youre gonna go above that. Also, bit size is meaningless, 680 is 256bit but would destroy 7950.

And for the other guy, no point in 4gb unless youre gonna run tripple screen, at which 1 card will not be enough, sli perhaps with a good oc. I got 200+ core and 700+ memory on my 690 because it is a beast overclocker,and with water and cl pro I am at less than 40c at 100%load on both cores. I am stuck at a single 1440p monitor though bcuz any higher res and I hit the vram wall.


----------



## Swag

My wish is that someone would be nice enough to give me another 1440p monitor. I've always wanted to try triple. It's awkward to play FPS games with dual screen.







I only have a single GPU so I don't play too much games and if I do, it usually is only counter-strike. Love that game!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My wish is that someone would be nice enough to give me another 1440p monitor. I've always wanted to try triple. It's awkward to play FPS games with dual screen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only have a single GPU so I don't play too much games and if I do, it usually is only counter-strike. Love that game!


You can find one for about 200, wont be pixel perfect though. I think a single monitor is too small for fps or racing games, good for everything else though.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Factory oc is 100% useless if youre gonna go above that. Also, bit size is meaningless, 680 is 256bit but would destroy 7950.
> And for the other guy, no point in 4gb unless youre gonna run tripple screen, at which 1 card will not be enough, sli perhaps with a good oc. I got 200+ core and 700+ memory on my 690 because it is a beast overclocker,and with water and cl pro I am at less than 40c at 100%load on both cores. I am stuck at a single 1440p monitor though bcuz any higher res and I hit the vram wall.


if everything is useless/meaningless as you say, why would we/they oc anything, or have cards with 384 or even 512 bit..
more bit, is more bandwith as i understand it, cant be a bad thing right









it does help to oc it some more tho,

its not a magic number if you oc it more, but it helps, comes close to the 7970 even

and youre comparinga 420+ euro card, with a 280 euro card, dont think that a good comparison,
of course the 680 will beat up a 7950, like i said, thats the max i can buy for my money,
im asking if my card is a good one, compared to other 7950's or in that prize class, not with 680


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Factory oc is 100% useless if youre gonna go above that. Also, bit size is meaningless, 680 is 256bit but would destroy 7950.
> And for the other guy, no point in 4gb unless youre gonna run tripple screen, at which 1 card will not be enough, sli perhaps with a good oc. I got 200+ core and 700+ memory on my 690 because it is a beast overclocker,and with water and cl pro I am at less than 40c at 100%load on both cores. I am stuck at a single 1440p monitor though bcuz any higher res and I hit the vram wall.


Bit size isn't meaningless. GTX680s don't destroy 7950s.


----------



## solar0987

Probably gonna do this really soon will putting the lid back on help with temps or should i go die to waterblock directly?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *solar0987*
> 
> Probably gonna do this really soon will putting the lid back on help with temps or should i go die to waterblock directly?


If you wanna do direct die, talk to SonDa5, he is doing it.


----------



## SonDa5

Low voltage 4GHZ 3770k Delid action



http://valid.canardpc.com/2598378


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> If you wanna do direct die, talk to SonDa5, he is doing it.


Only with Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro with a light coat on die and block surface area. Light pressure mount. CPU tightening nuts should have springs on them. It's a gentle mount.

If possible test for best contact pressure against the die and block with fujifilm contact pressure paper. Orient block for best contact.

It's alot of work. I have posted alot of info on it. Use search button if I am slow answering....


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Only with Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro with a light coat on die and block surface area. Light pressure mount. CPU tightening nuts should have springs on them. It's a gentle mount.
> If possible test for best contact pressure against the die and block with fujifilm contact pressure paper. Orient block for best contact.
> It's alot of work. I have posted alot of info on it. Use search button if I am slow answering....


Maybe you should write up a guide for direct die mounting. If I recall you practically already have one in this thread?

Maybe if you put it in it's own thread, then we could have a link to it in the OP and it would be easier to find when searching the forums.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Maybe you should write up a guide for direct die mounting. If I recall you practically already have one in this thread?
> Maybe if you put it in it's own thread, then we could have a link to it in the OP and it would be easier to find when searching the forums.


Too tired right now to think about that... but I think I'd rather not. Just pm me or search my posts. There is alot of info on it. I


----------



## chronicfx

Valguar: Page 239 Post#2389 for my submission. Thanks


----------



## chronicfx

I can't figure you out sonda5







You probably could have done that 4GHz overclock with the same temps not even de-lidded. I wanna see you crank that vcore up!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys those benches are outdated. 7950's and 7970's are the best single gpu's out there after 12.11 drivers. Go look for up to date benches...as Hokies would say, I like the truth to be spoken and not misinform people with fanboyistic claims. (I own a gtx670 ftw btw)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys those benches are outdated. 7950's and 7970's are the best single gpu's out there after 12.11 drivers. Go look for up to date benches...as Hokies would say, I like the truth to be spoken and not misinform people with fanboyistic claims. (I own a gtx670 ftw btw)


thanks ivan,
i thought i read something about them perform not so well in bf3,
and new drivers would improve that too ?
guess the 680 will still win, idk, but like i said,
its in a very different price class, about 120 euro more
for the cheapest i can find here, compared to the
Gigabyte Radeon HD7950 3Gb i want to buy..

Gigabyte Radeon HD7950 WindForce 3
900MHz
3GB
Rad. HD7950
€ 281,30

PNY GeForce GTX 680 PCI-E 2GB
1,006GHz
2GB
GF GTX 680
€ 437,90

only had money for this one,

Gigabyte GV-R787OC-2GD
Radeon HD7870 op 1,1GHz met 2GB GDDR5
1,1GHz
2GB
Rad. HD7870
€ 227,30

but you guys kept telling me nooo noo, safe some more money and go for the 7950...lol
so ii looked into it, and saw the 256 and 384 bit difference, between the 7870 and 7950,
and it has 1gb more memory, 3gb..
so..i sold my mother, but shes old, didnt get much for her,
but i only needed 60 euro so ....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Here is my submission:
> After De-lidding:
> 
> After Cleaning:
> 
> Before-Delidding temps:
> 
> After De-lidding temps:
> 
> New max overclock:


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> CPU-Z validation for 5GHz
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2500438


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Valguar: Page 239 Post#2389 for my submission. Thanks










Not the correct format lol. look on the first page and see the format. then I'll add ya lol.

Also for the GPU thingy here. the 7950 is an amazing card for the price it has basically the exact same fps as a 7970 but is cheaper. it's awesome and the 7970 are currently owning the bench marking world. but only because they are made to do that. where Nvidia is strictly on gaming alone


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, pretty much no compute, but optimized gaming performance on the kepler cards...GCN on the other hand is a beast in every possible scenario.
One of their clearest advantages is the ram bandwidth (which you can calculate easily like this:

((xHz * xbit wide bus * 2 ) / 8 bits per Byte ) / 1,073,741,824 Bytes per GB = ~ GB/sec bit rate )

I did get a 670 ftw but it was a bargain, and I enjoy challenges, like dealing with locked voltages and glued ihs' lol








No fun in buying the best to be the best.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not the correct format lol. look on the first page and see the format. then I'll add ya lol.
> Also for the GPU thingy here. the 7950 is an amazing card for the price it has basically the exact same fps as a 7970 but is cheaper. it's awesome and the 7970 are currently owning the bench marking world. but only because they are made to do that. where Nvidia is strictly on gaming alone


Its in the notepad of the last picture in the correct format. But if you need me to type it all over again I guess I will

OCN name: Chronicfx
CPU: 3570k
Die TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
IHS TIM: Nocuta NT-H1
MHz gained: 200
OC after: 4.9
Temp drops: 15
Validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2500438


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Factory oc is 100% useless if youre gonna go above that. Also, bit size is meaningless, 680 is 256bit but would destroy 7950.
> And for the other guy, no point in 4gb unless youre gonna run tripple screen, at which 1 card will not be enough, sli perhaps with a good oc. I got 200+ core and 700+ memory on my 690 because it is a beast overclocker,and with water and cl pro I am at less than 40c at 100%load on both cores. I am stuck at a single 1440p monitor though bcuz any higher res and I hit the vram wall.


http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?cs=19&c=us&l=en&sku=224-9949


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Its in the notepad of the last picture in the correct format. But if you need me to type it all over again I guess I will
> OCN name: Chronicfx
> CPU: 3570k
> Die TIM: CL Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: Nocuta NT-H1
> MHz gained: 200
> OC after: 4.9
> Temp drops: 15
> Validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2500438


your in....

BUT

You need to redo you CPUZ it doesn't ahve you OCN name on it.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys those benches are outdated. 7950's and 7970's are the best single gpu's out there after 12.11 drivers. Go look for up to date benches...as Hokies would say, I like the truth to be spoken and not misinform people with fanboyistic claims. (I own a gtx670 ftw btw)


After the 12.11 drivers? Gaming may be another story (I'm not a gamer), but for benches the gtx680 hasn't been too competitive in most 3d benchmarks (it does do well in 3dmark 05) since it first released. It started off behind & the new AMD drivers just widened the gap. ( I also have a couple gtx680s).


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if everything is useless/meaningless as you say, why would we/they oc anything, or have cards with 384 or even 512 bit..
> more bit, is more bandwith as i understand it, cant be a bad thing right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it does help to oc it some more tho,
> 
> its not a magic number if you oc it more, but it helps, comes close to the 7970 even
> and youre comparinga 420+ euro card, with a 280 euro card, dont think that a good comparison,
> of course the 680 will beat up a 7950, like i said, thats the max i can buy for my money,
> im asking if my card is a good one, compared to other 7950's or in that prize class, not with 680


Factory oc is a 100% stable overclock. They set the voltage, and the clock so you don't have to. But I'm pretty sure you have experience with oc'ing so you can do it yourself.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Bit size isn't meaningless. GTX680s don't destroy 7950s.


LOL. okay buddy, not sure why you get your information from. Go find me a benchmark that shows 7950 not getting destroyed by a 680.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?cs=19&c=us&l=en&sku=224-9949


No sane person would buy that unless they are doing PRO photo/video editing. I got mine for 350 off ebay with perfect pixels, with a color calibrator it's just as good as that overpriced thing.


----------



## Hokies83

< Galaxy rep via nvidia.

7950 is = to if not better then gtx 680.

7970 ghz ed is faster then a 680,


----------



## Valgaur

http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark11_-_performance/rankings#start=0#interval=20#cores=1#coolingType=1

There..... where are the 680's 7970's rule benches


----------



## ivanlabrie

Thanks buddy!

You single handedly typed the truth as usual


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thanks buddy!
> You single handedly typed the truth as usual


Ya i always do.. amd fan bois cannot handle the truth tho =/


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark11_-_performance/rankings#start=0#interval=20#cores=1#coolingType=1
> There..... where are the 680's 7970's rule benches


A chart with different overclocks on both cards all on stock cooling. How can you compare two cards when you overclock them if you don't overclock them equally or to their max.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ya i always do.. amd fan bois cannot handle the truth tho =/


You just said 7950>680 when it is priced much lower, amd fan bois cannot handle the truth? I don't actually see any amd fan bois here except your post LOL


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> A chart with different overclocks on both cards all on stock cooling. How can you compare two cards when you overclock them if you don't overclock them equally or to their max.


Easy, check hwbot rankings...680 only works good for Vantage and 3dm11, the rest no so much. And perhaps some particular 'the way it's meant to be played' titles.

Overclocking is not a warranty, not all cards oc the same. Stock even with the unfair Kepler boost, 7970 still trumps the 680, specially after 12.11 drivers.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Easy, check hwbot rankings...680 only works good for Vantage and 3dm11, the rest no so much. And perhaps some particular 'the way it's meant to be played' titles.
> Overclocking is not a warranty, not all cards oc the same. Stock even with the unfair Kepler boost, 7970 still trumps the 680, specially after 12.11 drivers.


The unfair kepler boost would be equal to the ghz edition as there isn't a factory oc'd 680. And 12.11 drivers would mean the cards were recently optimized for benchmarks, there are no signs of benchmark optimizations in the nvidia drivers. All i know is the 680 beats the 7970 in gaming.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thanks buddy!
> You single handedly typed the truth as usual


I'm rolling through all ofthe benchies that I do for competition points and 7970's are always in the tops. no matter what. my 680 is getting tough to beat them.

Again like I said, Nvidia = gaming cards. ITS WHAT THEY MAKE THEM FOR

AMD/ATI = benchers/gamers THEY ARE MENT FOR BENCHING AND BREAKING RECORDS.

just look all over http://hwbot.org/

you will see.


----------



## alancsalt

You mean:
Quote:


> The 3DMark11 - Performance world records. There are no rules in the worldrecord ranking, you can use unreleased hardware, engineering samples, etc.
> 
> 1. 29/06/12 *33190* marks Indonesia Hazzan
> GeForce GTX 680 @ MHz
> 
> 2. 09/01/12 *32728* marks Taiwan AndreYang
> Radeon HD 7970 @ 1530/1880MHz


?

Close.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> You mean:
> ?
> Close.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Easy, check hwbot rankings...*680 only works good for Vantage and 3dm11*, the rest no so much. And perhaps some particular 'the way it's meant to be played' titles.
> Overclocking is not a warranty, not all cards oc the same. Stock even with the unfair Kepler boost, 7970 still trumps the 680, specially after 12.11 drivers.


Now?










It's a well known fact, AMD is current king of the hill, like it or not. I don't care, and I AM a bencher, I do my homework before posting stuff.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm rolling through all ofthe benchies that I do for competition points and 7970's are always in the tops. no matter what. my 680 is getting tough to beat them.
> Again like I said, Nvidia = gaming cards. ITS WHAT THEY MAKE THEM FOR
> AMD/ATI = benchers/gamers THEY ARE MENT FOR BENCHING AND BREAKING RECORDS.
> just look all over http://hwbot.org/
> you will see.


Ya gaming cards, which is what people buy them for. Are you telling me you bought your gpu to sit at a computer and look at meaningless numbers all day? Idk what to say to that.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> < Galaxy rep via nvidia.
> 7950 is = to if not better then gtx 680.
> 7970 ghz ed is faster then a 680,


Bro, the highest clocked 7950 on that chart doesn't even beat the lowest clocked 680.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's a stronger card and it's fact...all around.

And yeah, I do buy stuff to sit at the computer and watch 'useless' numbers as you say, same as some folks leave their rigs running generating stupid points with [email protected] (I admit benching is kinda useless, but it's a passion for some people, folding on the other hand contributes to a greater cause...)
But gaming, isn't just for fun same as benching?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I detect a green fanboi...don't wanna dig up more benchies, but I might have to. In a while...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> You mean:
> ?
> Close.


you can't do Ln2 and multi gpu's Nvidia SLI system is better unlike AMD's for the bonus's per card thats how it's winning there. anyway This is for a gamer not a bench that has four of them you gotta look at 1x and stock cooling. you can't just go well Ln2 and play Bf3....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You just said 7950>680 when it is priced much lower, amd fan bois cannot handle the truth? I don't actually see any amd fan bois here except your post LOL


I own Nvidia cards i rep a nvidia partner company....

performance wise a 7950 = gtx 680.

i happen to be one of thr most well informed ppl on ocn in the gpu dept...

because i perfer nvidia does not mean im going to lie for them and say they are faster then they really are.

and by amd fan bois i mean vishera owners.... those guys live in a closed box and spread garbage around about there fail cpu.
they talk un knowing ppl into getting that fail cpu even when an intel cpu is in the budget.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> You mean:
> ?
> Close.


Depends on the overclocker, cpu, etc. as well. For example, no matter how good an AMD can be, it's gonna be a challenge to beat Vince with what he can do to an Nvidia card.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ya gaming cards, which is what people buy them for. Are you telling me you bought your gpu to sit at a computer and look at meaningless numbers all day? Idk what to say to that.


OCN has more gamers, but this argument can go both ways. I don't buy high end cards for gaming, I used to but I just have more fun testing out & pushing different hardware than staring at a game for hours.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ya gaming cards, which is what people buy them for. Are you telling me you bought your gpu to sit at a computer and look at meaningless numbers all day? Idk what to say to that.


i buy nvidia cause they give me free gpus i only had 2 buy 1 of my 680s 1 was free..
and i use 3d vision.

i use my 7970 to mine and make me money since it has compute on die.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Depends on the overclocker, cpu, etc. as well. For example, no matter how good an AMD can be, it's gonna be a challenge to beat Vince with what he can do to an Nvidia card.
> OCN has more gamers, but this argument can go both ways. I don't buy high end cards for gaming, I used to but I just have more fun testing out & pushing different hardware than staring at a game for hours.


Well said, I'm not that polite, sorry...and I'm thirsty as heck, so my mind is not 100% with me.
QFT


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> i buy nvidia cause they give me free gpus i only had 2 buy 1 of my 680s 1 was free..
> and i use 3d vision.
> i use my 7970 to mine and make me money since it has compute on die.


Mine and make money?????

EDIT. BTW, i do have a 6970 from powercolor, is clocked from factory @940 and still plays bf3 maxout no problems.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Mine and make money?????
> EDIT. BTW, i do have a 6970 from powercolor, is clocked from factory @940 and still plays bf3 maxout no problems.


It's not allowed to discuss Btc according to the TOS, so I'll only mention it without further comments.


----------



## Hokies83

ya u have to take mining to pm.


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.hwcompare.com/12350/geforce-gtx-680-vs-radeon-hd-7950/

Take a look at that.

Those stats show one thing very very clearly. pixel and texture rates are higher on the nvidia cards and mem speed with amd there.

Now lets just take a loo at Nvidia and at AMD/ATI here. what companies come out with more GAME drivers than others EVGA who use Nvidia. I get emails on updated drives every 2 weeks. AMD strictly goes for card performance, it's how the difference in the architecture differences between the two companies.

I'm a gamer and a future bencher I can already tell and I want a 7970 for benching because I simply CAN"T BEAT THE DAMN THING.

FTW Yeah Vince is kinda crazy...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.hwcompare.com/12350/geforce-gtx-680-vs-radeon-hd-7950/
> Take a look at that.
> Those stats show one thing very very clearly. pixel and texture rates are higher on the nvidia cards and mem speed with amd there.
> Now lets just take a loo at Nvidia and at AMD/ATI here. what companies come out with more GAME drivers than others EVGA who use Nvidia. I get emails on updated drives every 2 weeks. AMD strictly goes for card performance, it's how the difference in the architecture differences between the two companies.
> I'm a gamer and a future bencher I can already tell and I want a 7970 for benching because I simply CAN"T BEAT THE DAMN THING.
> FTW Yeah Vince is kinda crazy...


I don't understand how moving a slider to oc is fun lol... Maybe I have just lost interest since I have the worst motherboard in existence.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I don't understand how moving a slider to oc is fun lol... Maybe I have just lost interest since I have the worst motherboard in existence.


It won't be fun if all you do is move a slider lol
You don't need the best and most expensive gear, you can bench any hardware there is and get points for your 'skill' (and that word is key) overclocking each particular piece.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I don't understand how moving a slider to oc is fun lol... Maybe I have just lost interest since I have the worst motherboard in existence.


It's not just a slider.

I have all of my memory and clcok speeds memoirized per bench and m,y cpu has to be willing for each one along with RAM.

I like the challenge


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I don't understand how moving a slider to oc is fun lol... Maybe I have just lost interest since I have the worst motherboard in existence.


Moving the slider is as boring as pushing buttons. It's like when you are having a hard time finishing a level, you finally beat it & it feels great, much like finally passing with high clocks & getting the great score.
Extreme cooling is a blast in itself, it still gets my heart thumping when the mobo & cpu are all covered in ice & snow while running 2V through a cpu.


----------



## Arm3nian

You see guys, there is no overclocking with my motherboard. I enter 5ghz, it doesnt boot, i enter 4.7 it boots at 5. I enter 1.5v it boots at 1.1, I enter 1.65 I don't even boot. Then it randomly switches to ahci from raid so I cant even load the os. Stupidest piece of hardware in existence.


----------



## stickg1

I got my parts. Installing windows now...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You see guys, there is no overclocking with my motherboard. I enter 5ghz, it doesnt boot, i enter 4.7 it boots at 5. I enter 1.5v it boots at 1.1, I enter 1.65 I don't even boot. Then it randomly switches to ahci from raid so I cant even load the os. Stupidest piece of hardware in existence.


Sell it and get the gigabyte assassin 3. or get mine


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You see guys, there is no overclocking with my motherboard. I enter 5ghz, it doesnt boot, i enter 4.7 it boots at 5. I enter 1.5v it boots at 1.1, I enter 1.65 I don't even boot. Then it randomly switches to ahci from raid so I cant even load the os. Stupidest piece of hardware in existence.


To be fair, you could probably resell it, buy yourself a decent board, and still have some money left over








*Edit*: Damnit, Valgaur ninja'd me...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You see guys, there is no overclocking with my motherboard. I enter 5ghz, it doesnt boot, i enter 4.7 it boots at 5. I enter 1.5v it boots at 1.1, I enter 1.65 I don't even boot. Then it randomly switches to ahci from raid so I cant even load the os. Stupidest piece of hardware in existence.


Not too many results here with your board, at least 1 person has done 5500mhz with a sandy at 1.59V so the voltage can go up.
The next Ivy result is 4.7Ghz with a stock cooler, not too much help, but it can go over 4.5.
http://hwbot.org/hardware/motherboards#key=p8z77_ws


----------



## Arm3nian

Maybe I can sell it along with my ivy when 2011 ivy comes out and get that instead. I would need to put in an extra 200 probably though. That worth it?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You see guys, there is no overclocking with my motherboard. I enter 5ghz, it doesnt boot, i enter 4.7 it boots at 5. I enter 1.5v it boots at 1.1, I enter 1.65 I don't even boot. Then it randomly switches to ahci from raid so I cant even load the os. Stupidest piece of hardware in existence.


Are you using offset or static volts?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Are you using offset or static volts?


I tried everything bro. nothing works.


----------



## Arm3nian

WOOT. now my audio has stopped working. I love this motherboard so much, recommended to all.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Perhaps it's your cpu? Try it in a friend's board?

Also, what psu?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Perhaps it's your cpu? Try it in a friend's board?
> Also, what psu?


Its in my sig, ax1200. Now windows is telling me im on an amd64 machine LOL.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Your OS is dead man...lol








Athlon 64 ftw xD


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Its in my sig, ax1200. Now windows is telling me im on an amd64 machine LOL.


Lol, instant downgrade! I doubt it can be the cpu, I think you found a crackhead of a motherboard.


----------



## Arm3nian

I got it cuz it supported dual x16 slots for my quad sli 690. I should have gone 2011 or at least get a working 1155 motherboard.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, the Sniper Hokies has is good for that.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I got it cuz it supported dual x16 slots for my quad sli 690. I should have gone 2011 or at least get a working 1155 motherboard.


gigabyte g1 sniper 3 gigabytes high end gamer board,,, And best priced by a mile love this board.


----------



## stickg1

Anyone ever mess with the ASUS P8Z77-V Pro? Mine seems to have a mind of its own. I set 4.5GHz 45x100 in BIOS and I get to Windows and its 40x103??? Did I miss something? I'm going to update the BIOS right now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Anyone ever mess with the ASUS P8Z77-V Pro? Mine seems to have a mind of its own. I set 4.5GHz 45x100 in BIOS and I get to Windows and its 40x103??? Did I miss something? I'm going to update the BIOS right now.


If you did the auto overclcok through the ai suite it sets the bclk at 103 did it with mine when I was hunting for vcores. Just set manual and make everything your our own save file not auto tune it.


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Anyone ever mess with the ASUS P8Z77-V Pro? Mine seems to have a mind of its own. I set 4.5GHz 45x100 in BIOS and I get to Windows and its 40x103??? Did I miss something? I'm going to update the BIOS right now.


Either update the BIOS or check that EPU or TPU isn't enabled. My 2500K did a similar thing with my Deluxe where the BCLK would always default at 103. Then I found that one of those power saving switches was enabled and got it fixed. I just recently had an issue where I couldn't overclock my 3770K after switching out from a 3570K - kept defaulting to 3.9GHz. I fixed it by reflashing the BIOS.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If you did the auto overclcok through the ai suite it sets the bclk at 103 did it with mine when I was hunting for vcores. Just set manual and make everything your our own save file not auto tune it.


I'm trying to overclock in BIOS, didn't even install AISuite. I must be doing something wrong because when I disable C States, set LLC, manual RAM frequency, and manual CPU multiplier; it wont boot. I keep getting to windows screen and then it resets a few times and then when it boots up its on that 41x103 non-sense.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> Either update the BIOS or check that EPU or TPU isn't enabled. My 2500K did a similar thing with my Deluxe where the BCLK would always default at 103. Then I found that one of those power saving switches was enabled and got it fixed. I just recently had an issue where I couldn't overclock my 3770K after switching out from a 3570K - kept defaulting to 3.9GHz. I fixed it by reflashing the BIOS.


I just updated to the most recent and didn't have any luck. I just got this machine up and running 2 hours ago. I'll figure it out, I've just been reading these threads for a few days and was all giddy about finding a max OC. I guess I'll do it the more sensible way and start lower. I just thought 4.5GHz (what I've been trying) would be simple.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm trying to overclock in BIOS, didn't even install AISuite. I must be doing something wrong because when I disable C States, set LLC, manual RAM frequency, and manual CPU multiplier; it wont boot. I keep getting to windows screen and then it resets a few times and then when it boots up its on that 41x103 non-sense.
> I just updated to the most recent and didn't have any luck. I just got this machine up and running 2 hours ago. I'll figure it out, I've just been reading these threads for a few days and was all giddy about finding a max OC. I guess I'll do it the more sensible way and start lower. I just thought 4.5GHz (what I've been trying) would be simple.


What vcore you putting it on? 4.5 should easily boot at 1.3vcore. Try that


----------



## boogerlad

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/10-BLADES-x-NEW-FEATHER-HI-STAINLESS-DOUBLE-EDGE-DE-RAZOR-BLADES-made-in-japan-/121030615403?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c2dfca16b

Will that blade be sufficient for delidding? If so, I was wondering about this idea. What if a razor blade was used to make the initial incision at a corner of the cpu, but then thin plastic like overhead paper, a card, or plastic from a container lid was used to make the rest of the cut? Surely it would be safer and reduce the possibility of nicking.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, if you find a thin enough card go for it!
Be extra careful and follow the guide...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What vcore you putting it on? 4.5 should easily boot at 1.3vcore. Try that


K, I was trying 1.225v, prob not enough V. But I think I tried on Auto too. I booted 4.3GHz on Auto and its giving me 1.32v, seems a little high. I'm running a short Intel Burn Test, I just want to see temps. I haven't delidded yet, I also got lazy and didnt feel like lapping my Antec Kuhler 620 either. Right now 4.3GHz auto voltage of 1.32v and 70C on the hottest core.


----------



## Arm3nian

Just to mention, the 7970 might beat the 680 in benchmarks right now, but the 680 still gets about 4 more fps than the ghz edition with the new 12.11 drivers. But the 7970 has been out much longer than kepler, so we will see. And no i'm not a green fanboi, I hate every company in the world, have not found a close to PERFECT one yet, just amd has been dropping their game, cough cpu's cough.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boogerlad*
> 
> http://www.ebay.ca/itm/10-BLADES-x-NEW-FEATHER-HI-STAINLESS-DOUBLE-EDGE-DE-RAZOR-BLADES-made-in-japan-/121030615403?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c2dfca16b
> Will that blade be sufficient for delidding? If so, I was wondering about this idea. What if a razor blade was used to make the initial incision at a corner of the cpu, but then thin plastic like overhead paper, a card, or plastic from a container lid was used to make the rest of the cut? Surely it would be safer and reduce the possibility of nicking.


I'm sure the blades would work, if you don't have good callus' on your fingers I still think the blades at the hardware store that come with one edge covered are just easier on the fingers.
The thin plastic idea is good, just have to find something stiff enough to finish the job without folding up. Cut into each corner with the blade & the sides do go easier.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Just to mention, the 7970 might beat the 680 in benchmarks right now, but the 680 still gets about 4 more fps than the ghz edition with the new 12.11 drivers. But the 7970 has been out much longer than kepler, so we will see. And no i'm not a green fanboi, I hate every company in the world, have not found a close to PERFECT one yet, just amd has been dropping their game, cough cpu's cough.


it is not a stock vs stock performace it is a over clocked difference Amd cards voltage is unlocked .


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like combing the double edge blade into a U shape for doing a corner first...and then straighten it when I do the whole thing in a single movement.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> K, I was trying 1.225v, prob not enough V. But I think I tried on Auto too. I booted 4.3GHz on Auto and its giving me 1.32v, seems a little high. I'm running a short Intel Burn Test, I just want to see temps. I haven't delidded yet, I also got lazy and didnt feel like lapping my Antec Kuhler 620 either. Right now 4.3GHz auto voltage of 1.32v and 70C on the hottest core.


1.3v 45x100 is an avg 4.5ghz oc... tart there work up or down as needed.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Just to mention, the 7970 might beat the 680 in benchmarks right now, but the 680 still gets about 4 more fps than the ghz edition with the new 12.11 drivers. But the 7970 has been out much longer than kepler, so we will see. And no i'm not a green fanboi, I hate every company in the world, have not found a close to PERFECT one yet, just amd has been dropping their game, cough cpu's cough.


I just hope AMD can keep it up with gpus, makes nvidia work harder. I've always been an nvidia fanboy since I got started, nvidia has been in the performance lead for a while. This was the first time in a few years AMD came out ahead & nvidia couldn't quite answer it. AMD gpus got better, dunno WTH happened with thier cpus...
I don't look at stock clocks on either card, or Ghz edition/ normal 7970 (ghz is the pretty much the same as any 7970, with a new bios), just the numbers they put up overclocked.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.3v 45x100 is an avg 4.5ghz oc... tart there work up or down as needed.


I had to take it all the way up to 1.35v to boot on 4.5GHz but then BSOD as soon as I start IBT.

I dropped it down to 4.4GHz @ 1.3v and it's just fine. There might be a different setting I need to adjust. I'll look into it more tomorrow, or if you guys have any ideas leave them here and I'll check in the AM. I gotta pour a big ole' slab in the morning, its gonna be a long day.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I had to take it all the way up to 1.35v to boot on 4.5GHz but then BSOD as soon as I start IBT.
> I dropped it down to 4.4GHz @ 1.3v and it's just fine. There might be a different setting I need to adjust. I'll look into it more tomorrow, or if you guys have any ideas leave them here and I'll check in the AM. I gotta pour a big ole' slab in the morning, its gonna be a long day.


Do you have internal pll overvoltage enabled? If not do so...and run stock ram.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> it is not a stock vs stock performace it is a over clocked difference Amd cards voltage is unlocked .


So is nvidia's voltage, you can go up to a max, which can give you a major oc, anything beyond is basically unsafe. You can update the bios also to give you higher than recommended.


----------



## ivanlabrie

But still it's hard to beat 7950 and 7970's with whacky oc's doing the 1.21v max...You'd need more than that, and that would require hard modding and some NDA parts lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So is nvidia's voltage, you can go up to a max, which can give you a major oc, anything beyond is basically unsafe. You can update the bios also to give you higher than recommended.


only the lightnings and hardwired asus dctop

And they suffer from 256 bus and a wimpy 2 gb vram..

when over clocked a 7970 can pull as far away from a 680 a 20%


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I just hope AMD can keep it up with gpus, makes nvidia work harder. I've always been an nvidia fanboy since I got started, nvidia has been in the performance lead for a while. This was the first time in a few years AMD came out ahead & nvidia couldn't quite answer it. AMD gpus got better, dunno WTH happened with thier cpus...
> I don't look at stock clocks on either card, or Ghz edition/ normal 7970 (ghz is the pretty much the same as any 7970, with a new bios), just the numbers they put up overclocked.


Ya, intel is gonna be a monopoly for the consumer market in the next year or two if amd continues what they are doing now. ATI has always been relatively close. And I dont think its really that nvidia couldnt answer, i'm sure theyve had gk110 in the making for quite a while now, more like a market strategy.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> only the lightnings and hardwired asus dctop
> And they suffer from 256 bus and a wimpy 2 gb vram..
> when over clocked a 7970 can pull as far away from a 680 a 20%


20% seems highly exaggerated. And plus you can oc 680s, im not sure how much but I can oc my 690 by 50%. I havent tried yet, working on a new mobo first. I already flashed my bios and can raise voltage much higher than what you could with precision x alone. 30c at max load atm with 200+core 700+mem and 135% power.


----------



## SonDa5

NVIDIA GTX 600 cards are weak. Not designed to over clock. CApped bandwidth in memory interface and capped power from weak VRM. You get a much more enthusiast built card from the HD 79XX series cards. Way more bang per buck with the free games most AMD cards come with as well.

NVIDIA is all about the money this time around with 28nm cards IMO.

HD7950 IMO is the best value of all cards. For under $300 its an extremely powerful card. My last card was 40nm card was an NVIDIA card but AMD has clearly made a stand as offering the best video cards for the money with the 28nm cards.

My delidded 3770k is working great at 5GHZ right now for gaming.









All this video card talk is getting off track. Lets here and see more delidding action!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 20% seems highly exaggerated. And plus you can oc 680s, im not sure how much but I can oc my 690 by 50%. I havent tried yet, working on a new mobo first. I already flashed my bios and can raise voltage much higher than what you could with precision x alone. 30c at max load atm with 200+core 700+mem and 135% power.


Flashing the Bios on Kepler is a death wish... so many degraded cards all over the interweb.. Nvidia set those chips to the Maximum safe voltage from the Factory.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Flashing the Bios on Kepler is a death wish... so many degraded cards all over the interweb.. Nvidia set those chips to the Maximum safe voltage from the Factory.


Graphs from ati.... I saw an anandtech review giving the new drivers 2-3fps boost.


----------



## jprovido

7970 pawns the gtx 680 and everyone knows it. my gtx 680 is unlocked voltage via bios tweak but still can't keep up with 7970's. sad really


----------



## Systemlord

Please people let's stay on topic, GPU discussion in a Delidded Ivy Bridge Club...? Come-on!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Please people let's stay on topic, GPU discussion in a Delidded Ivy Bridge Club...? Come-on!


yea, c'mon guys..
so, you guys think i should DELID my new 7950?? ..LOL
jk, of course i will, using liquid pro on the other gpu's i have,
took down temps by about 10C








thanks for all the input tho, great









anyways, i got my 10 pentiums, if any of you have a idea about
a better way to delid, i can try some for you..

1. a hard but thin plastic card, after first cutting in the corners with normal boxcutter

2. using a sticker remover to dissolve the adhesive, already bought this one









HG sticker and sticky label remover allows for the simple removal of stickers, sticker adhesive, *rubber adhesive*, adhesive tape, tar splashes, greasy patches, oil, heel marks and many other problems, from virtually all surfaces.
or nail polish remover, "Aceton" is another i want to try..but have to be carefull it doesnt harm the pcb too..lol

3. using a vise, put 2. long blades between long sides of cpu/ihs, and slowly,
let pressure from vise cut through the adhesive,

4. a piano wire? or one from a guitar..

already tried with this, my mum used to use it, called "ijzergaren"(iron yarn)

but wasnt strong enough, broke all the time, but worked, could cut into the corners np..

5..... idk yet ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Welp here goes lol.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> K, I was trying 1.225v, prob not enough V. But I think I tried on Auto too. I booted 4.3GHz on Auto and its giving me 1.32v, seems a little high. I'm running a short Intel Burn Test, I just want to see temps. I haven't delidded yet, I also got lazy and didnt feel like lapping my Antec Kuhler 620 either. Right now 4.3GHz auto voltage of 1.32v and 70C on the hottest core.


Don't need to lap your 620. heat sinks are darn near perfectly flat.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'm sure the blades would work, if you don't have good callus' on your fingers I still think the blades at the hardware store that come with one edge covered are just easier on the fingers.
> The thin plastic idea is good, just have to find something stiff enough to finish the job without folding up. Cut into each corner with the blade & the sides do go easier.


I agree the one sided blades are the best truthfully. no user harm and perfect precision. what more could you have lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I had to take it all the way up to 1.35v to boot on 4.5GHz but then BSOD as soon as I start IBT.
> I dropped it down to 4.4GHz @ 1.3v and it's just fine. There might be a different setting I need to adjust. I'll look into it more tomorrow, or if you guys have any ideas leave them here and I'll check in the AM. I gotta pour a big ole' slab in the morning, its gonna be a long day.


Yeah we will help ya out.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Do you have internal pll overvoltage enabled? If not do so...and run stock ram.


Try PLL at around 1.6-1.7 I run at 4.5 with PLL at 1.6vcore
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So is nvidia's voltage, you can go up to a max, which can give you a major oc, anything beyond is basically unsafe. You can update the bios also to give you higher than recommended.


A lot of Nvidias cards are voltage locked. I called a couple of manufacturer's today and got this response to asking if I can vcore mod their cards. they just went. "It's already at it's limit, You can personally mod it and have a great chance of killing the card through the volt jumps. Also when you self rig it the card gets kinda cranky with the power draw and can actually short itself during a bench with Nvidia's new auto boost technology in them." I can only go to 1.175 vcore in my 680 superclocked+ and with that whats funny is when I was folding I ran it at stock and it auto clocked itself to 1230 core, but it jumped the vcore to 1.175. In game it does this as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 20% seems highly exaggerated. And plus you can oc 680s, im not sure how much but I can oc my 690 by 50%. I havent tried yet, working on a new mobo first. I already flashed my bios and can raise voltage much higher than what you could with precision x alone. 30c at max load atm with 200+core 700+mem and 135% power.


From benchs and such it's pretty darn close.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> 7970 pawns the gtx 680 and everyone knows it. my gtx 680 is unlocked voltage via bios tweak but still can't keep up with 7970's. sad really


powns* just sayin







like I said above about the vcore of the Nvidias
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, c'mon guys..
> so, you guys think i should DELID my new 7950?? ..LOL
> jk, of course i will, using liquid pro on the other gpu's i have,
> took down temps by about 10C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for all the input tho, great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways, i got my 10 pentiums, if any of you have a idea about
> a better way to delid, i can try some for you..
> 1. a hard but thin plastic card, after first cutting in the corners with normal boxcutter
> 2. using a sticker remover to dissolve the adhesive, already bought this one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HG sticker and sticky label remover allows for the simple removal of stickers, sticker adhesive, *rubber adhesive*, adhesive tape, tar splashes, greasy patches, oil, heel marks and many other problems, from virtually all surfaces.
> or nail polish remover, "Aceton" is another i want to try..but have to be carefull it doesnt harm the pcb too..lol
> 3. using a vise, put 2. long blades between long sides of cpu/ihs, and slowly,
> let pressure from vise cut through the adhesive,
> 
> 4. a piano wire? or one from a guitar..
> 
> already tried with this, my mum used to use it, called "ijzergaren"(iron yarn)
> 
> but wasnt strong enough, broke all the time, but worked, could cut into the corners np..
> 5..... idk yet ..lol


scrap 4 and 5 Von, instead use Spider Wire. This is an extremely strong fishing line that will stretch and bench unlike those other materials, especially piano wire. Then with the iron yarn it's just a very deeply threaded yarn thats very sturdy to pulls but not abbrasion. SpiderWire is really tough stuff get some 100lb test line and that will never break. the pole of you will break before that line. Heck 20 lb test line I have to cut it, I'll even pull the boat trying to break it, it's also cut my hands up once trying to slow a fish down lol.









Heres a link.

http://www.spiderwire.com/prod.php?k=557386&sk=50685&p=PURSUC10G-125%20(1275089)

The 65lb test ones.

*GPU talk time will be done for now. I will allow GPU talk in here, but not this kind of back and forth stuff. We are here as delidders for delidders. That's why there's a GPU part of OCN.*


----------



## Valgaur

OCN fix this double post issue please lol. it sits there for 20 seconds and nothing happens. then you click it again and it goes right away causing a double post.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> scrap 4 and 5 Von, instead use Spider Wire. This is an extremely strong fishing line that will stretch and bench unlike those other materials, especially piano wire. Then with the iron yarn it's just a very deeply threaded yarn thats very sturdy to pulls but not abbrasion. SpiderWire is really tough stuff get some 100lb test line and that will never break. the pole of you will break before that line. Heck 20 lb test line I have to cut it, I'll even pull the boat trying to break it, it's also cut my hands up once trying to slow a fish down lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heres a link.
> http://www.spiderwire.com/prod.php?k=557386&sk=50685&p=PURSUC10G-125%20(1275089)
> The 65lb test ones.
> *GPU talk time will be done for now. I will allow GPU talk in here, but not this kind of back and forth stuff. We are here as delidders for delidders. That's why there's a GPU part of OCN.*


thanks, will look into that one Val









srry Boss,my bad about the 7950 i was asking about,
didnt know there would that much talk about it after ..o well,
back to delidding..and find "spider wire"..lol,
now where did that spiderman live again?









showertime..laters peeps


----------



## BaK2BaK

'cleaned' VonDutch> Once I had to cut expansed polymer (sagex) and had success using the following kind of straw, coupled with a 4.5V battery to warm a metallic string (replacing the saw string). It was easy as cutting through butter.


The current running through the string will make it hot and maybe it could go through the glue easily.
If you try, better use a non-conductive handler!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> scrap 4 and 5 Von, instead use Spider Wire. This is an extremely strong fishing line that will stretch and bench unlike those other materials, especially piano wire. Then with the iron yarn it's just a very deeply threaded yarn thats very sturdy to pulls but not abbrasion. SpiderWire is really tough stuff get some 100lb test line and that will never break. the pole of you will break before that line. Heck 20 lb test line I have to cut it, I'll even pull the boat trying to break it, it's also cut my hands up once trying to slow a fish down lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heres a link.
> http://www.spiderwire.com/prod.php?k=557386&sk=50685&p=PURSUC10G-125%20(1275089)
> The 65lb test ones.


just looked if i can buy it in mu country,
dang, 13.50 euro for the cheapest Spiderwire Stealth Code Red 110m 0.10mm
will do alot, and spend some money even, to get a better way to delid,
this is to much tho, only need like 50cm of it..lol
will try to get some other fishing line tho, and try..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> 'cleaned' VonDutch> Once I had to cut expansed polymer (sagex) and had success using the following kind of straw, coupled with a 4.5V battery to warm a metallic string (replacing the saw string). It was easy as cutting through butter.
> 
> The current running through the string will make it hot and maybe it could go through the glue easily.
> If you try, better use a non-conductive handler!


good one, might work, and is cheap to do..thanks..
it cant hurt the chip, if theres running 4.5V throught the line?

so, a metal gitar string might work with this?
i thought its good because they look like this,

you can saw a bit with it, but its not sharp


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it cant hurt the chip, if theres running 4.5V throught the line?


I guess it could if the surface of the chip is conductive.
Maybe then just heat the string with a flame or something.
Dunno either if the PCB will suffer if being touched by the heated string...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so, a metal gitar string might work with this?
> you can saw a bit with it, but its not sharp


I would better use the thinest string as possible, and only try to make it penetrate through the glue thanks to its heat.


----------



## Arm3nian

... Cmon guys whats next a chainsaw or a jackhammer lol, I wasnt even that carefull and got it my first time with a blunt razor...


----------



## VonDutch

whats with the lapping underside ihs, im reading throughout the thread?
something i missed, dont all ihs rest on the die after delid, and cleaning adhesive from pcb and ihs?
i can imagine some want to lap the upperside of the ihs, because it can be concave..
i bet mine is too, most are, will check next time i take my cooler off again,

lapping ihs, is something you can do if the temps dont drop like expected after delid,
and if reseat doesnt help either, its not a, "i delidded, so now i have to lap"..
i didnt lap anything, but still had a 25+C tempdrop after delid..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> ... Cmon guys whats next a chainsaw or a jackhammer lol, I wasnt even that carefull and got it my first time with a blunt razor...


looking for a safe way to delid, that can be used with materials everyone has easy access to,
and yes, i had one technique involving a hammer, it worked well i think,
but the others said i was crazy posting it in here, peeps might actually do it..lol
so took that one off the list..

my son delidded a bunch of pentiums, didnt have 1 scratch anywhere,
he kept saying how easy it was, and couldnt imagine anything could go wrong,



heres hes cutting a corner , using just a normal box cutter..




another





if you might ask yourself about using a hammer, heres one of the few we did,




looks easy enough right..


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looking for a safe way to delid, that can be used with materials everyone has easy access to,
> and yes, i had one technique involving a hammer, it worked well i think,
> but the others said i was crazy posting it in here, peeps might actually do it..lol
> so took that one off the list..
> my son delidded a bunch of pentiums, didnt have 1 scratch anywhere,
> he kept saying how easy it was, and couldnt imagine anything could go wrong,
> 
> 
> 
> heres hes cutting a corner , using just a normal box cutter..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> another
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you might ask yourself about using a hammer, heres one of the few we did,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> looks easy enough right..


why would I use a hammer when I can use this?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> why would I use a hammer when I can use this?


pls post back your results, with before/after pic's ...LOL


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> pls post back your results, with before/after pic's ...LOL


Massive temp drop since I ended up deliding my house also lmao


----------



## stickg1

Okay so this morning I started messing with PLL voltage a little bit and now my CPU is stuck at 1.6GHz. No matter what I set it to in BIOS and with all C-States and speedstep disabled. I just loaded optimized defaults for now so I can at least have it at stock settings. I found an ASUS Z77 overclocking guide a couple days ago but forgot to bookmark it, I'll look for it after work.

EDIT: After loading optimized defaults my chip is still stuck at 1600MHz under load. Can't seem to get it out of idle states. This isn't fun...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Okay so this morning I started messing with PLL voltage a little bit and now my CPU is stuck at 1.6GHz. No matter what I set it to in BIOS and with all C-States and speedstep disabled. I just loaded optimized defaults for now so I can at least have it at stock settings. I found an ASUS Z77 overclocking guide a couple days ago but forgot to bookmark it, I'll look for it after work.
> EDIT: After loading optimized defaults my chip is still stuck at 1600MHz under load. Can't seem to get it out of idle states. This isn't fun...


----------



## stickg1

Thanks hokie, I'll check those out after work or on lunch break


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Thanks hokie, I'll check those out after work or on lunch break


NP!

I found a Bios overclock app from Gigabyte for my Ipad.. can not figure out how to get my computer to find my Ipad so i can use it yet lol.


----------



## stickg1

Should i use Asus software to find an on the fly overclock in windows? I've only ever overclocked in the bios. is the Asus software any good?


----------



## King4x4

Anybody said G1.Sniper 3 ?!



My hand is itching to retry delidding my new CPU (After my old delid failed on me







)

Had an old friend say heat up the razor and go smoothly and I was going... no way


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Should i use Asus software to find an on the fly overclock in windows? I've only ever overclocked in the bios. is the Asus software any good?


AI is something to test with then when u find ur oc set it in the bios.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> AI is something to test with then when u find ur oc set it in the bios.


Yup. Thats what I do all the time plus it's faster actually.


----------



## Jayjr1105

So I'm receiving an Ivy i7 3770K in a couple weeks here to replace my 2500K and was considering de-lidding. I was curious, when you delid, how does the retention mechanism clamp down on the CPU without the lid? Is the heatsink assembly then responsible for keeping the CPU clamped down in the socket for contact? Isn't the die extremely fragile to have the heatsink clamped down directly on it?

Thanks and sorry so many questions at once.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like fine tuning vcore in Windows after finding a vcore that boots for a given oc. Much faster to me...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So I'm receiving an Ivy i7 3770K in a couple weeks here to replace my 2500K and was considering de-lidding. I was curious, when you delid, how does the retention mechanism clamp down on the CPU without the lid? Is the heatsink assembly then responsible for keeping the CPU clamped down in the socket for contact? Isn't the die extremely fragile to have the heatsink clamped down directly on it?
> Thanks and sorry so many questions at once.


You still reuse the IHS unless you are going to direct die mount your heatsink but if you aren't wc it you can't due to undue stress. Also the IHS goes right back on since it disperses the heat and helps.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Anybody said G1.Sniper 3 ?!
> 
> My hand is itching to retry delidding my new CPU (After my old delid failed on me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> Had an old friend say heat up the razor and go smoothly and I was going... no way


What kind of problem did you have on your first delid?

I don't think heating up the razer is a good idea. I like holding blade in hand and carefully working it. Finger touch and feel is important to carefully do it IMO. Hot blade doesn't feel good on fingers.


----------



## King4x4

The CPU itself is okay... but I nicked the PCB and I damaged the memory controller.

Only accepts one piece of ram.

OCs like a nut though... got it to 5ghz on 1.4v!


----------



## SonDa5

King4x4 have you tried it in a different mother board?


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You still reuse the IHS unless you are going to direct die mount your heatsink but if you aren't wc it you can't due to undue stress. Also the IHS goes right back on since it disperses the heat and helps.


So the whole de-lid thing is just to replace the paste between the die and IHS? That makes a lot more sense







Do you have to re-glue the IHS back on or simply rely on the paste to hold it in place?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So the whole de-lid thing is just to replace the paste between the die and IHS? That makes a lot more sense
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have to re-glue the IHS back on or simply rely on the paste to hold it in place?


Add your favorite TIM and get the best mount possible.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So the whole de-lid thing is just to replace the paste between the die and IHS? That makes a lot more sense
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have to re-glue the IHS back on or simply rely on the paste to hold it in place?


No glueing required, you just put the IHS back onto the PCB, close the bracket holding the CPU in place, and it should latch onto the 2 lips sticking out a bit from the IHS, keeping the whole assembly locked into place tightly


----------



## stickg1

I cleared the CMOS, I have everything on stock values, I turned off EPU and TPU and my CPU is still stuck at 1.6GHz under load. I'm about to RMA motherboard and chip....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I cleared the CMOS, I have everything on stock values, I turned off EPU and TPU and my CPU is still stuck at 1.6GHz under load. I'm about to RMA motherboard and chip....


You followed everything on the guide?

If u give me ur IP i can tune ur Bios Via my Ipad









Cause u overclocked Vishera bro.. Ivy Bridge is overclocking Noob Sauce lol.

I do not have an Asus board or i could be more help..

Did u turn turbo boost off?

Have u tried overclocking with software from the desktop yet?


----------



## chris-br

reflash your bios


----------



## stickg1

I got it going but its looking like I need 1.375v for 4.5GHz


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You followed everything on the guide?
> If u give me ur IP i can tune ur Bios Via my Ipad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cause u overclocked Vishera bro.. Ivy Bridge is overclocking Noob Sauce lol.
> I do not have an Asus board or i could be more help..
> Did u turn turbo boost off?
> Have u tried overclocking with software from the desktop yet?


This BIOS is completely new to me so is the chip. Sandy was a breeze and AMD has been kind of the same deal for almost a decade so I have that down too. There's something small and stupid that I'm missing because 1.375v for 4.5GHz seems excessive. Granted my hottest core is 73C after 20 minutes of Prime95, I still think my voltage is out of control...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> This BIOS is completely new to me so is the chip. Sandy was a breeze and AMD has been kind of the same deal for almost a decade so I have that down too. There's something small and stupid that I'm missing because 1.375v for 4.5GHz seems excessive. Granted my hottest core is 73C after 20 minutes of Prime95, I still think my voltage is out of control...


Remember IB ur good to 95c TJ Max is 105c..

So do not think Amd numbers when u see that.

Lower your ram % and see if it helps...

4.5ghz should be doable with 1.25v Anything above 1.3 for 4.5ghz is a very bad chip...


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Remember IB ur good to 95c TJ Max is 105c..
> So do not think Amd numbers when u see that.
> Lower your ram % and see if it helps...
> 4.5ghz should be doable with 1.25v Anything above 1.3 for 4.5ghz is a very bad chip...


I can do 4,5 @ 1,315 on bios, cpuz shows 1.308.







So guess i have a bad chip then.

EDIT: i do see a 1,320 spike once in a while. but is stable.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Mine needs 1.37v for 4.7ghz, and 1.115v for 4.2ghz, 1.23v for 4.4ghz. Prime 18hs stable...Folding 24/7 stable.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mine needs 1.37v for 4.7ghz, and 1.115v for 4.2ghz, 1.23v for 4.4ghz. Prime 18hs stable...Folding 24/7 stable.


i believe i can do 4.6 with 1,355 v, but waiting on LP to be able to test it.. is very hot here right now. With my window wide open is a 28C; plus I'm sick, so no a/c for now.


----------



## Hokies83

i can do up to 4.3ghz stock volts 4.5ghz 1.19v


----------



## chris-br

Thats a very nice chip.









I do have a question for ya Hokies. No space for a h100 on my case, but i can fit a H80. Do you think is worth it to change from a D14?

EDIT2: I don't like fan noise


----------



## wholeeo

Welcome back Hokie


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Thats a very nice chip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do have a question for ya Hokies. No space for a h100 on my case, but i can fit a H80. Do you think is worth it to change from a D14?
> EDIT2: I don't like fan noise


No NH-D14 is better then the H-80.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> i can do up to 4.3ghz stock volts 4.5ghz 1.19v


Stock VID on my chip is 1.316v for some reason. I'm trying to work with offset mode instead of manual/fixed mode.


----------



## chris-br

In the future, like next year, i may get a hspc kit, if i get the change for a vacation in Miami for a family visit.. Got 2 nephews that i wanna see.








.. In Brazil, i can't buy those kits... the oly ones available are the Swiftech H20-220 Edge. very very expensive and wont fit my case.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Stock VID on my chip is 1.316v for some reason. I'm trying to work with offset mode instead of manual/fixed mode.


go fixed mode. I was doing ofset and the vcore was all over the place, now I'm on fixed and im stable on 1,308v with some little spikes at 1,320v once in while when gaming..

But never goes under 1,308v; That's what i really like.... BTw, i don't have any power saving on right now.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Chris, forget the H80i and the like...Check www.sidewindercomputers.com

You can buy nice kits for decent prices and they'll ship the stuff to you .
lol Looks like I'm being payed by them, but it's one of the few sites that got us foreign enthusiasts covered.


----------



## lilchronic

i can go up to 4.9 with every thing stock or auto.just put 49 in and bam 4.9
o i did disable all the c states except for C1E state enabled


----------



## stickg1

My voltage might be high but my temps are fine, since I barely hit 75C after 30 minutes of prime should I just roll with it? I'm cool with 4.5GHz, in terms of the performance in games that I play 4.5GHz on my i5-3570K is like what? 7.5GHz on my FX-8320?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My voltage might be high but my temps are fine, since I barely hit 75C after 30 minutes of prime should I just roll with it? I'm cool with 4.5GHz, in terms of the performance in games that I play 4.5GHz on my i5-3570K is like what? 7.5GHz on my FX-8320?


have u delided your chip yet


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> have u delided your chip yet


nope


----------



## Arm3nian

My motherboard is greatly pissing me off. The raid controller driver update doesn't do anything which my makes my raid 0 ssds run like a couple of 7200rpm hdd's. My audio doesn't work at ALL, tried every single nvidia driver, every single realtek driver. Can't run my ram at anything CLOSE to rated speeds. My cpu can't even be given proper voltage to oc. The fan controller on the motherboard is faulty. I can seriously go on and on all day.

GIVE ME recommendations FOR MOBOS THAT COST LESS OR ARE EQUAL TO WHAT I CAN SELL THIS JUNK FOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ASUS P8Z77 WS SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> nope


ok thats what i thought i havent done it yet either but i have all the the essential tools to get it done, except for that sticker remover stuff i could take a qu-tip with that on it and get the corners losend up maybe. i also have my motorcycle license that is made out of a really thin and strong laminante thiner that a credit card but just as strong i could use that to finish after i get all the corners


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> My motherboard is greatly pissing me off. The raid controller driver update doesn't do anything which my makes my raid 0 ssds run like a couple of 7200rpm hdd's. My audio doesn't work at ALL, tried every single nvidia driver, every single realtek driver. Can't run my ram at anything CLOSE to rated speeds. My cpu can't even be given proper voltage to oc. The fan controller on the motherboard is faulty. I can seriously go on and on all day.
> GIVE ME recommendations FOR MOBOS THAT COST LESS OR ARE EQUAL TO WHAT I CAN SELL THIS JUNK FOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> ASUS P8Z77 WS SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


GigaByte g 1 sniper 3 Gigabyte up5 and up7


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> My motherboard is greatly pissing me off. The raid controller driver update doesn't do anything which my makes my raid 0 ssds run like a couple of 7200rpm hdd's. My audio doesn't work at ALL, tried every single nvidia driver, every single realtek driver. Can't run my ram at anything CLOSE to rated speeds. My cpu can't even be given proper voltage to oc. The fan controller on the motherboard is faulty. I can seriously go on and on all day.
> GIVE ME recommendations FOR MOBOS THAT COST LESS OR ARE EQUAL TO WHAT I CAN SELL THIS JUNK FOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> ASUS P8Z77 WS SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


OK. so just get a ga-z77x-ud5h and you wil be happy.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> OK. so just get a ga-z77x-ud5h and you wil be happy.


yea i heard that this is 1 of the best benching board but what do i no im just a noob lol. thaks to u guys and talking about graphics cards the other day i decided to get a 670 ftw 2gb
thanks ivy bridge delided group


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Chris, forget the H80i and the like...Check www.sidewindercomputers.com
> 
> You can buy nice kits for decent prices and they'll ship the stuff to you .
> lol Looks like I'm being payed by them, but it's one of the few sites that got us foreign enthusiasts covered.


I do not think you are being paid by them *ivanlabrie*, they are just good to use and I recommend using them too. Great service, great prices, and great shipping. Can't ask for much more than that.









*Arm3nian* - avoid further frustration and get a new MB soon! We can feel your pain! LOL


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd say Maximus V Gene, or either of the Gb boards...but I'd go with the newer up5.
Or the Asrock OC Formula (only Asrock board I'd suggest...really good one!)


----------



## Bigdale7

I'm surprised! My P8z77 is an awesomw board! I'm running a 3570K at 4.7 ghz, less than 1.30 volts. I have 8gb of corsair vengence 1600 running at 1866, timings - 9,9,9,24 and stock 1.5 volts, I have run benchs at 5.3 ghz. Have no problem what so ever with this mobo.. sorry to hear your experience is a bad one.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> I'm surprised! My P8z77 is an awesomw board! I'm running a 3570K at 4.7 ghz, less than 1.30 volts. I have 8gb of corsair vengence 1600 running at 1866, timings - 9,9,9,24 and stock 1.5 volts, I have run benchs at 5.3 ghz. Have no problem what so ever with this mobo.. sorry to hear your experience is a bad one.


You have a p8z77-v, not ws lol.


----------



## Hokies83

I was ever a Big fan of Asus boards other then the ROG boards... I do however have a Asus M-ATX in my htpc.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, c'mon guys..
> so, you guys think i should DELID my new 7950?? ..LOL
> jk, of course i will, using liquid pro on the other gpu's i have,
> took down temps by about 10C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for all the input tho, great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways, i got my 10 pentiums, if any of you have a idea about
> a better way to delid, i can try some for you..
> 1. a hard but thin plastic card, after first cutting in the corners with normal boxcutter
> 2. using a sticker remover to dissolve the adhesive, already bought this one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HG sticker and sticky label remover allows for the simple removal of stickers, sticker adhesive, *rubber adhesive*, adhesive tape, tar splashes, greasy patches, oil, heel marks and many other problems, from virtually all surfaces.
> or nail polish remover, "Aceton" is another i want to try..but have to be carefull it doesnt harm the pcb too..lol
> 3. using a vise, put 2. long blades between long sides of cpu/ihs, and slowly,
> let pressure from vise cut through the adhesive,
> 
> 4. a piano wire? or one from a guitar..
> 
> already tried with this, my mum used to use it, called "ijzergaren"(iron yarn)
> 
> but wasnt strong enough, broke all the time, but worked, could cut into the corners np..
> 5..... idk yet ..lol





Try a blade with the adhesive remover on it? The wire won't work well because it'll damage the PCB of the chip too most likely,
Someone here posted that they used to use the blade to cut the corners then use the tip of it to cut alongways rather then pushing in. Which means if you slip you'll probably just jab your hand and not the CPU. I think the adhesive remover with a card/blade will work best, I don't know if it will damage the CPU though?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> My motherboard is greatly pissing me off. The raid controller driver update doesn't do anything which my makes my raid 0 ssds run like a couple of 7200rpm hdd's. My audio doesn't work at ALL, tried every single nvidia driver, every single realtek driver. Can't run my ram at anything CLOSE to rated speeds. My cpu can't even be given proper voltage to oc. The fan controller on the motherboard is faulty. I can seriously go on and on all day.
> GIVE ME recommendations FOR MOBOS THAT COST LESS OR ARE EQUAL TO WHAT I CAN SELL THIS JUNK FOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> ASUS P8Z77 WS SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Wow I can understand you're angry...
Don't sell it, RMA it and tell them that you didn't realize it was a workstation board and maybe offer to put a bit more money into a slightly better board? I dunno,
I'd say a UD5H, UD3H or D3H if you're desperate (and sell it). A UP7 is really nice, but costs a lot. I'd suggest the UD5H for what you want, it has a good RAID controller.

I have no idea with ASUS boards either way, I never really liked them.. Can you blame me?


----------



## Valgaur

Get mah mobo foo/!!!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp im still alive...
> Have no feeling in right arm so typeing with left hand plz excuse typos...


yay, hokies is back








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good luck man, hoping the upgrade to hokies 2.0 goes well!
> Hard call on this one, I would not sign a petition or letter about Ivy running hot even though I tried a delid just for lulz, ivy still works fine. I still think if people want extreme overclocks, just have to get more extreme cooling, like you are in the process of doing now. Ivy is pretty much the same now that cpus were before sandy, I wouldn't want intel to think we want sandy back...
> superpi, cinebench, wprime, memory clock.. Have at the benchies! I like that he threw the suicide club in there for the people who would not run prime95.


thanks! had no idea they extended club rules for so many benchies! I am no fan of prime95 at all ...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> i will be here till friday however lol... hard to talk 1 handed ivs and pan killers...


take it easy buddy, get some rest and let your body recover. the more you sleep/rest now the faster you come back in full throttle soon


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd say Maximus V Gene, or either of the Gb boards...but I'd go with the newer up5.
> Or the Asrock OC Formula (only Asrock board I'd suggest...really good one!)


+1 this!
probably the best bang for the buck (it's still ROG, carrying an awesome BIOS ... just not the latest one though hehe) if not planning to run more than 2 PCIe cards









... or get Gigabyte Z77 UD5, pretty good choice if you ask me


----------



## Faelore

I need to know what board to go with I was going to go with the Maximus V extreme (ill be going for 2x 780s in sli when they come out) but I just saw the sabertooth z77 for 229.99 which is $140 less then the maximus and all I need really is 2x pcie 3.0 slots for the 780s.

I am gonna be deliding







so wondering which will overclock better and trying to make sure if i go with the saber its worth the loss of bios/ other lanes i am losing thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> I need to know what board to go with I was going to go with the Maximus V extreme (ill be going for 2x 780s in sli when they come out) but I just saw the sabertooth z77 for 229.99 which is $140 less then the maximus and all I need really is 2x pcie 3.0 slots for the 780s.
> I am gonna be deliding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so wondering which will overclock better and trying to make sure if i go with the saber its worth the loss of bios/ other lanes i am losing thanks


Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3 is 249$ has a great Bios digi Vrams best onboard audio of all z77 boards and has very rich gamer features and supports pci-e 3.0 16x 16x or 8x8x8x8

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128552

With the Gigabyte G 1 sniper 3 your not losing much but you are gaining a great deal of features and get to keep 100$ in your pocket.

So a quick break down...

Do you save money? Yes.

Will this board hit 5ghz + Easy Yes

Do you get full 16x16x pci-e 3.0 Yes

Do you get a gamer feature rich board with a 150$ Audio card Yes.


----------



## Faelore

Hmm awesome board with those specs honestly its overkill for my use and makes the sabertooth look like a small kitty the G M3 even looks like it fits the bill with 16x + 8x pcie 3.0 I mean honestly a $139.99 board with 16x 8x is better then the sabertooth looks like asus really is just taking advantage of its name. I heard giga was terrible with mobos like a DOA rate of around 45%


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Hmm awesome board with those specs honestly its overkill for my use and makes the sabertooth look like a small kitty the G M3 even looks like it fits the bill with 16x + 8x pcie 3.0 I mean honestly a $139.99 board with 16x 8x is better then the sabertooth looks like asus really is just taking advantage of its name. I heard giga was terrible with mobos like a DOA rate of around 45%


Gigabyte makes the best built MBs in the world..

The gigabyte UP7 is king of all z77 boards.. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569&Tpk=up7 32+3+2 Phase CPU power design promises up to 2000W power output, while the all digital PWM design ensures the most accurate and precise power delivery to critical components, Has on Onboard LN2 Switch..
But that board is 400$ lol if your a gamer the best board to buy for the money is the G 1 Sniper 3.

Gigabyte is the number 1 selling MB brand in the world Asus is # 2

Im not a gigabyte fan boi i own both Asus boards and gigabyte boards..

As far as features go the G1 Sniper 3 wins out for 249$ it has no competition at that price point.


----------



## Faelore

I also heard the sabertooth is a joke with overclocking has trouble getting past like 4.8 lol


----------



## Faelore

so you think I should go with the Sniper 3 instead of the M3? i like both the features I mean I wouldnt be going tri sli ever I plan on getting a light graphics card till 780s are out


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> so you think I should go with the Sniper 3 instead of the M3? i like both the features I mean I wouldnt be going tri sli ever I plan on getting a light graphics card till 780s are out


Well the m3 is mini ATX so sli cards would be staked on each other.. the G1 Sniper 3 E-ATX has 3 slots between the cards to allow air flow for them to run cooler.

So it comes down if u want a E-ATX board with room between the cards or a Mini ATX board with them stacked on each other. your choice.




Nothing wrong with the Saber tooth as a board but it is over priced for what it is. " gimmick thermal armour"


----------



## Faelore

Thanks for the tip I am def going with the Sniper 3 E-Atx i just threw it in my newegg cart all i need for my rig to be up and running is 600 now it was at 720 with the maximus so you saved me $120







thanks a ton. Does it play nice with the noctua Nh d-14 I am going with aircooling for now until I get my 2x 780s then ill upgrade to a water system well thats my plan at least.


----------



## Faelore

To be clear im gonna wait for the noctua to go on sale (around the $60 dollar area that way ill have a back up if my watercooling ever kicks the bucket). I am thinking about what you suggested earlier and buying that custom pump set up







doing research atm


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> To be clear im gonna wait for the noctua to go on sale (around the $60 dollar area that way ill have a back up if my watercooling ever kicks the bucket). I am thinking about what you suggested earlier and buying that custom pump set up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> doing research atm


Ah yea im gonna get that myself..

NH-D14 fits fine on the Sniper 3.


----------



## Arm3nian

Some idiot at frys told me gigabyte sucked like 2 years ago when I was getting into computers...which is why I never bought any of their boards. I had a biostar one, maybe worse than the one I have now, and two asus, trouble with them both. I fixed my audio though it was a stupid service pack I had to install after I UPGRADED to windows 7 from 8. and my raid speed problem Im not sure if fixed but got good speeds after 3 restarts. Gigabyte looks really good though, except that creative onboard oh god... seems like a driver nightmare + bad sound. I use optical to my av receiver anyway since hdmi out from nvidia or ati never actually works.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Some idiot at frys told me gigabyte sucked like 2 years ago when I was getting into computers...which is why I never bought any of their boards. I had a biostar one, maybe worse than the one I have now, and two asus, trouble with them both. I fixed my audio though it was a stupid service pack I had to install after I UPGRADED to windows 7 from 8. and my raid speed problem Im not sure if fixed but got good speeds after 3 restarts. Gigabyte looks really good though, except that creative onboard oh god... seems like a driver nightmare + bad sound. I use optical to my av receiver anyway since hdmi out from nvidia or ati never actually works.


I have that board and the Audio on the board is Great.. sound is great.. i love it...
I have had 0 issues with it..
this is what is Onboard http://us.store.creative.com/Creative-Sound-Blaster-Recon3D-Fatal1ty-Professional/M/B00654PTT2.htm


Play it thru these bad boys...


----------



## Arm3nian

My amp doesnt have rca ins so i cant use a sound card anyway, maybe when I upgrade my setup, but I expect a good priced amp to have a good internal dac anyway.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> My amp doesnt have rca ins so i cant use a sound card anyway, maybe when I upgrade my setup, but I expect a good priced amp to have a good internal dac anyway.


The board has 2 Amps dedicated to the sound card.

But im just using this best sound per $...

I got these for 39$ shipped Black friday!








http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882117405

+ 1 of these
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0049P6OTI/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00

= Woah dude... i can hear a rat fart in Bf3 from the other side of a brick wall lmao.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The board has 2 Amps dedicated to the sound card.
> But im just using this best sound per $...
> I got these for 39$ shipped Black friday!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882117405
> + 1 of these
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0049P6OTI/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00
> = Woah dude... i can hear a rat fart in Bf3 from the other side of a brick wall lmao.


Ya those look like a good value. Im saving for a nice polk audio setup perhaps. looking at a 400watt sub and maybe 5.1/7.1 bookshelf speakers, i dont have much room next to my comp for floorstanding speakers.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Some idiot at frys told me gigabyte sucked like 2 years ago when I was getting into computers...which is why I never bought any of their boards. I had a biostar one, maybe worse than the one I have now, and two asus, trouble with them both. I fixed my audio though it was a stupid service pack I had to install after I UPGRADED to windows 7 from 8. and my raid speed problem Im not sure if fixed but got good speeds after 3 restarts. Gigabyte looks really good though, except that creative onboard oh god... seems like a driver nightmare + bad sound. I use optical to my av receiver anyway since hdmi out from nvidia or ati never actually works.


The UD5H has optical out.


----------



## lilchronic

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157328

theres no 16x by 16 x for pci 3,0 though


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157328
> theres no 16x by 16 x for pci 3,0 though


And its ugly. Although I guess people that buy Zotac GPU's finally found a matching motherboard.


----------



## Valgaur

My board does dual 16x 3.0


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> And its ugly. Although I guess people that buy Zotac GPU's finally found a matching motherboard.


lol now that u mentioned it it is pretty ugly u can always go with this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157322
i love my asrock board great value and good performance
i dont really care how my pc looks i like the performance


----------



## Swag

Repping the triple post there Valgaur?

Anyway, on any board right now, there is no dual 16x PCIE slot. The first one is always 16x and every consecutive is 8x. They may say it's 16x but it's limited to 8x.







No way to fix it. Don't worry though, the effects are marginal (to me).


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> And its ugly. Although I guess people that buy Zotac GPU's finally found a matching motherboard.


maybe if u had 2 gtx 680 lightnings it wouldnt look bad


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol now that u mentioned it it is pretty ugly u can always go with this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157322
> i love my asrock board great value and good performance
> i dont really care how my pc looks i like the performance


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> maybe if u had 2 gtx 680 lightnings it wouldnt look bad


I was going to get the ASRock Extreme6 but this ASUS P8Z77-V Pro went on sale for the same price and it seemed a little more feature rich and with better power phase. I doubt it would have made a difference either way. Part of me wishes I went wit hthe Extreme6 because it's black and I could have done any color lighting I wanted, with the ASUS that is blue, on blue, on blue, well my lighting choices are basically limited to blue.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol now that u mentioned it it is pretty ugly u can always go with this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157322
> i love my asrock board great value and good performance
> i dont really care how my pc looks i like the performance
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> maybe if u had 2 gtx 680 lightnings it wouldnt look bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I was going to get the ASRock Extreme6 but this ASUS P8Z77-V Pro went on sale for the same price and it seemed a little more feature rich and with better power phase. I doubt it would have made a difference either way. Part of me wishes I went wit hthe Extreme6 because it's black and I could have done any color lighting I wanted, with the ASUS that is blue, on blue, on blue, well my lighting choices are basically limited to blue.
Click to expand...

Blue, red, white.







I did that on my P6X58D-e.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was going to get the ASRock Extreme6 but this ASUS P8Z77-V Pro went on sale for the same price and it seemed a little more feature rich and with better power phase. I doubt it would have made a difference either way. Part of me wishes I went wit hthe Extreme6 because it's black and I could have done any color lighting I wanted, with the ASUS that is blue, on blue, on blue, well my lighting choices are basically limited to blue.


have u seen this think it just came out http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157344
i wish i got a better mother board than the asrock extreme 4 u cant go cheap on a mother board although i havent had 1 problem with it just should of spent more money for a better 1


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was going to get the ASRock Extreme6 but this ASUS P8Z77-V Pro went on sale for the same price and it seemed a little more feature rich and with better power phase. I doubt it would have made a difference either way. Part of me wishes I went wit hthe Extreme6 because it's black and I could have done any color lighting I wanted, with the ASUS that is blue, on blue, on blue, well my lighting choices are basically limited to blue.


im pretty sure msi 680 lightning are yellow
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127693
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127670


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Blue, red, white.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did that on my P6X58D-e.


That's not too bad of an idea...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> have u seen this think it just came out http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157344
> i wish i got a better mother board than the asrock extreme 4 u cant go cheap on a mother board although i havent had 1 problem with it just should of spent more money for a better 1


Yeah I'm still not sure what thunderbolt does. I googled it a few times and am still unsure.

I like the Extreme4, if you're good with 1 or 2 GPUs I think the extreme4 is great for $110. I picked it for my brother and overclocked him a couple months ago to 4.2GHz. I'm sure I could go higher but I would need to upgrade his cooling and airflow.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's not too bad of an idea...
> Yeah I'm still not sure what thunderbolt does. I googled it a few times and am still unsure.
> I like the Extreme4, if you're good with 1 or 2 GPUs I think the extreme4 is great for $110. I picked it for my brother and overclocked him a couple months ago to 4.2GHz. I'm sure I could go higher but I would need to upgrade his cooling and airflow.



i just wonder if i got a better board i would help my oc in any way


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> i just wonder if i got a better board i would help my oc in any way


If you have tried a few different IB with your MB and you have had poor OC results the problem might be the MB.


----------



## c2thew

I just delidded my 3770K and am pretty pleased with the results. This is honestly, my first time putting together a desktop computer and the process was pretty memorable/exciting! My previous computer was an old Pentium D from 2003 and I could barely get by with that computer editing video. (took 6 hours to edit a 10 minute clip). Anywho, I just wanted to share my findings. For some odd reason, my computer is posting weird temperatures for Core #1. It is consistently 14 degrees C cooler than the other 3 cores. I used MX-2 TIM paste using whitedragon's youtube video as a guide. I'm just curious why my cpu core is dramatically cooler on the middle core vs the outer cores.

my build
Antec 302 case
Antec 550 plus modular power supply (I don't intend to game much on this computer)
AS Rock extreme 4
Radeon 4670 HD 1gb (it handles games on medium to low settings)
Samsung 22nm memory (1866 1.35V, 9-9-9-24)
Hyper 3k 120gb SSD drive

To buy list
Coolermaster 212 evo
Radeon 7950
Catleap 27" Korean IPS monitor



Delidded using stock cooler 2219k .png file


----------



## Swag

My buy list has been brought down to only 3 things.









1. Car insurance
2. New keyboard
3. Date money

I don't have too much care for upgrading my PC anymore, it runs what I need it to do and I'm thinking of selling it so I can make an mini PC.


----------



## Arm3nian

Tried 4.5ghz at 1.21v and was stable, could probably go down more. Tried 4.5ghz at 1.52v and instant BSOD LOLOLOL!!!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My buy list has been brought down to only 3 things.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *1. Car insurance*
> 2. New keyboard
> *3. Date money*
> I don't have too much care for upgrading my PC anymore, it runs what I need it to do and I'm thinking of selling it so I can make an mini PC.


The two things in bold are what I need too.. well if I get a date


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My buy list has been brought down to only 3 things.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *1. Car insurance*
> 2. New keyboard
> *3. Date money*
> I don't have too much care for upgrading my PC anymore, it runs what I need it to do and I'm thinking of selling it so I can make an mini PC.
> 
> 
> 
> The two things in bold are what I need too.. well if I get a date
Click to expand...

Haha, get one. You probably will.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, get one. You probably will.


I could.. But she's so annoying and talks to LOTS of other guys. I don't care for her at all and I've actually got her block on my Facebook. I bet I could unblock her and act like nothing happened, anyone normal wouldn't re-add me.








I hate women, they're so stupid. It's always the ones that you don't want that want you and the ones that you do want don't want you..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Wow, OCN being buggy is annoying me so much lately..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, get one. You probably will.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could.. But she's so annoying and talks to LOTS of other guys. I don't care for her at all and I've actually got her block on my Facebook. I bet I could unblock her and act like nothing happened, anyone normal wouldn't re-add me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate women, they're so stupid. It's always the ones that you don't want that want you and the ones that you do want don't want you..
Click to expand...

Lol, not all the time. Spend time with the girl you really like and if it grows, then go with it, if it doesn't just leave. Relationship talk in a PC forum...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I could.. But she's so annoying and talks to LOTS of other guys. I don't care for her at all and I've actually got her block on my Facebook. I bet I could unblock her and act like nothing happened, anyone normal wouldn't re-add me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate women, they're so stupid. It's always the ones that you don't want that want you and the ones that you do want don't want you..


Not more stupid than the voltages I need to boot. Nothing is more stupid than that trust me.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Not more stupid than the voltages I need to boot. Nothing is more stupid than that trust me.


Haha, how much voltage???
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, not all the time. Spend time with the girl you really like and if it grows, then go with it, if it doesn't just leave. *Relationship talk in a PC forum...*


That's what I plan to do.. I think she has an idea of how I feel though.
There's nothing wrong with "Relationship talk" in a PC forum, we all have lives and most of us aren't the type to have lots of girlfriends etc.








It's just good (for myself) to let it all out as I don't feel safe telling many people IRL, I don't really trust anybody IRL much. That and it's good to get advice from a total stranger view rather then a biased view of a friend saying "Just go for it" because they don't think it'll happen.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, not all the time. Spend time with the girl you really like and if it grows, then go with it, if it doesn't just leave. *Relationship talk in a PC forum...*


That's what I plan to do.. I think she has an idea of how I feel though.
There's nothing wrong with "Relationship talk" in a PC forum, we all have lives and most of us aren't the type to have lots of girlfriends etc.








It's just good (for myself) to let it all out as I don't feel safe telling many people IRL, I don't really trust anybody IRL much. That and it's good to get advice from a total stranger view rather then a biased view of a friend saying "Just go for it" because they don't think it'll happen.[/quote]

Haha, really. Just talk to her, I talked to this one girl like once an entire year. This year, we talked everyday so far.


----------



## Arm3nian

Finished IBT at 4.8ghz at 1.33 bios voltage, did not try 1.325. I finished 4.7ghz at 1.265 bios voltage. Going for 4.9, next. I'm not even sure what a workstation motherboard is but I think it decided to work after I threatened to sell him


----------



## Hokies83

Any gamers in here?

I have been testing some new titles and it seems there are afew game engines taking Advantage of HT

Was wondering if anyone was interested in creating a list wit me?


----------



## LoneWolf121188

Hey folks, I had a sucsessful de-lid and managed to drop my temps by about 20C, but I'm struggling to get any more MHz out of this 3770K. Currently at 50x100MHz with 1.525 vcore (manual, not offset) and it's not Prime95 stable yet.







Any suggestions? I've got LLC to Ultra (75%) and CPU Current Capability at 150%. Anything else I should try? I'm kinda scared to go higher on the vcore...but I'm not even hitting 70C in Prime. It just crashes or blue screens (usually PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA) before going through 10 iterations of Prime.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Any gamers in here?
> I have been testing some new titles and it seems there are afew game engines taking Advantage of HT
> Was wondering if anyone was interested in creating a list wit me?


I would.. But no HT here.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 
> Finished IBT at 4.8ghz at 1.33 bios voltage, did not try 1.325. I finished 4.7ghz at 1.265 bios voltage. Going for 4.9, next. I'm not even sure what a workstation motherboard is but I think it decided to work after I threatened to sell him


I think the idea is to not be overclocked or it likes lots of voltage to add to stability? I dunno.. A "Workstation board" to me is one that doesn't want to be OC'd..









Also back on topic kind of: Does anyone know if you can use CL Pro/Ultra on Graphics cards VRM's? I'll defiantly be using it on the core, otherwise I'll wait and get some new thermal tape/pads for the VRM's.


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## Arm3nian

Got 4.9 at 1.395 bios voltage. Maybe all chips arnt meant to go 5ghz, temps at 55c max lol... I'll try 5 tomorrow but at 1.45 and up instead of getting a fail linpack error I just get a bsod i'm not sure why.


----------



## SimpleTech

^^^ Your GFlops are incredibly low. You should be getting at least 135 if not more at those speeds.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I would.. But no HT here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think the idea is to not be overclocked or it likes lots of voltage to add to stability? I dunno.. A "Workstation board" to me is one that doesn't want to be OC'd..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also back on topic kind of: Does anyone know if you can use CL Pro/Ultra on Graphics cards VRM's? I'll defiantly be using it on the core, otherwise I'll wait and get some new thermal tape/pads for the VRM's.


Seems useless to put on those, I wouldn't do it. I put pro on my 2 cores and the little chip, plus the copper block.



21c idle, I put on max voltage just to show you temps, mild overclock, highest I get in gaming is 35c lol at 100% load with a much higher oc, and this is with an ambient of 74faren, i've gotten much lower when my room is actually cool, cough global warming 74c in winter cough.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> ^^^ Your GFlops are incredibly low. You should be getting at least 135 if not more at those speeds.


Ugh what could be the problem their? going from 4.5 to 4.9 I got about 4gflops.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> ^^^ Your GFlops are incredibly low. You should be getting at least 135 if not more at those speeds.


You think so? It could be something to do with a workstation board?
I only get 107GFLOPS at 4.4GHz, is that bad too or what? I know that adding more can sometimes give you more GFLOPS, it can also lower your GFLOPS too.

I get 94 @ 4GHz.. SP1 is installed and running 2.54 of IBT. RAM is at 2000MHz 10-10-10-24 2T also.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Seems useless to put on those, I wouldn't do it. I put pro on my 2 cores and the little chip, plus the copper block.
> 
> 21c idle, I put on max voltage just to show you temps, mild overclock, highest I get in gaming is 35c lol at 100% load with a much higher oc, and this is with an ambient of 74faren, i've gotten much lower when my room is actually cool, cough global warming 74c in winter cough.


Okay cheers,


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ugh what could be the problem their? going from 4.5 to 4.9 I got about 4gflops.


SP1 installed? Using the latest Linpack? Try more than 1GiB of RAM.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> SP1 installed? Using the latest Linpack? Try more than 1GiB of RAM.


Ya sp1 installed. running IBT 2.54. I got 113glops at 13gigs of ram, but my ram is at 1600mhz 11-11-11-30, running really slow so I could make sure it wasn't interfering with my oc. Do you think that would lower the score by 30-40?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> Hey folks, I had a sucsessful de-lid and managed to drop my temps by about 20C, but I'm struggling to get any more MHz out of this 3770K. Currently at 50x100MHz with 1.525 vcore (manual, not offset) and it's not Prime95 stable yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any suggestions? I've got LLC to Ultra (75%) and CPU Current Capability at 150%. Anything else I should try? I'm kinda scared to go higher on the vcore...but I'm not even hitting 70C in Prime. It just crashes or blue screens (usually PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA) before going through 10 iterations of Prime.


I'd say up your vcore. it's the stability. when I say Mhz gained is from the new OC's you get from the new unlocked heights since heat is no longer an issue. so turn the vcore up a bit and keep trying.







Also apply to get in here man! get our sweet sig!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> SP1 installed? Using the latest Linpack? Try more than 1GiB of RAM.


I gte 1.7 tops in w7 fully updated and 8 gigs ram and I run at 5 Ghz.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'd say up your vcore. it's the stability. when I say Mhz gained is from the new OC's you get from the new unlocked heights since heat is no longer an issue. so turn the vcore up a bit and keep trying.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also apply to get in here man! get our sweet sig!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I gte 1.7 tops in w7 fully updated and 8 gigs ram and I run at 5 Ghz.


1.7 what?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 1.7 what?


lol 107Gflops


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> I just delidded my 3770K and am pretty pleased with the results. This is honestly, my first time putting together a desktop computer and the process was pretty memorable/exciting! My previous computer was an old Pentium D from 2003 and I could barely get by with that computer editing video. (took 6 hours to edit a 10 minute clip). Anywho, I just wanted to share my findings. For some odd reason, my computer is posting weird temperatures for Core #1. It is consistently 14 degrees C cooler than the other 3 cores. I used MX-2 TIM paste using whitedragon's youtube video as a guide. I'm just curious why my cpu core is dramatically cooler on the middle core vs the outer cores.
> my build
> Antec 302 case
> Antec 550 plus modular power supply (I don't intend to game much on this computer)
> AS Rock extreme 4
> Radeon 4670 HD 1gb (it handles games on medium to low settings)
> Samsung 22nm memory (1866 1.35V, 9-9-9-24)
> Hyper 3k 120gb SSD drive
> To buy list
> Coolermaster 212 evo
> Radeon 7950
> Catleap 27" Korean IPS monitor
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delidded using stock cooler 2219k .png file


first off, gratz on successful delid
















10-15C temp difference before delid is "normal",
i had thew same with mine, but after delidding,
temps should be more like 5.-7C difference,
youll always have some temp difference between cores..

you prolly need to reseat your cooler, o and use other tim on the die,
liquid pro/ultra gives the best results, on the ihs you can use any good tim you have..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol 107Gflops


about 105 gflops is normal/avarage for a 3770k,
its not only the cpu that gives higher or lower values,
but has to do with ram also, sonda5 once said the same to me,
my gflops are to low, was a little dicussion between him and someone about gflops,
overrated, dont mean a thing etc...
if i disable my HT, i go from about 105 to 125-130 gflops..

o, ocing to 5.0ghz, or run IBT at other speeds, dont make much difference too,

4646mhz, 107 gflops max

5.0ghz, 110 gflops max

5.0ghz without HT, 125 gflops max


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Any gamers in here?
> I have been testing some new titles and it seems there are afew game engines taking Advantage of HT
> Was wondering if anyone was interested in creating a list wit me?


That's interesting to know...I'm still trying to decide whether to purchase 3570 or 3770. Want to delid, but i don't wanna screw it up!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> ^^^ Your GFlops are incredibly low. You should be getting at least 135 if not more at those speeds.


nah, it's good for HT enabled... I get similar numbers for my daily clocks... that's how HT works, it lowers the score in IBT because there is 2 logical threads per 1 physical core and that is it. if you disable HT in BIOS then the score in IBT shoots up by 20-30 Gflops (like any 3570K would do or 3770K with HT disabled), nothing wrong with it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> That's interesting to know...I'm still trying to decide whether to purchase 3570 or 3770. Want to delid, but i don't wanna screw it up!


to be honest, go with 3770K if you want to have a chance with higher clocks and some insane OC's, because 3570K are binned lower by Intel, so max OC's are lower as well ... and then you have no option to use HT or not, it's just disabled by default and that is it (can't enable by design).


----------



## lilchronic

130 Gflops


----------



## VonDutch

seems updating my bios from F15 to F16 helped with my XMP profile somehow,
when i used it at first, xmp profile set timings way above factory adviced,
resulting in giving me a hard time to use it, crashes alot/to much,
most of the time i just left it on auto, which had even worse timings..lol,
10-11-10-27 something like that

before bios update(F15), using XMP profile, 9-8-8-21


after bios update(F16), using XMP profile, 9-9-9-24

like the factory setting is for my ram


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> seems updating my bios from F15 to F16 helped with my XMP profile somehow,
> when i used it at first, xmp profile set timings way above factory adviced,
> resulting in giving me a hard time to use it, crashes alot/to much,
> most of the time i just left it on auto, which had even worse timings..lol,
> 10-11-10-27 something like that
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> before bios update(F15), using XMP profile, 9-8-8-21
> 
> after bios update(F16), using XMP profile, 9-9-9-24
> 
> like the factory setting is for my ram


since it runs 1600MHz with common 9-9-9-24 @ 1.50V ... maybe you could try running 9-11-9-24 at 1867MHz? not sure what kind of sticks yours are, might need a bump in vdimm as well...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> since it runs 1600MHz with common 9-9-9-24 @ 1.50V ... maybe you could try running 9-11-9-24 at 1867MHz? not sure what kind of sticks yours are, might need a bump in vdimm as well...


tried several time ocing it, with help from hokies and ivan, 2000mhz should be possible with mine they said,
dont seem to work well with mine. its Corsair Vengeance CML8GX3M2A1600C9 Low Profile ,
after alot trial/error, any change result in crashes, 1800 or higher/lower,
i decided to safe money for faster ram..lol, 2400mhz i want now, prolly gskill's, and 16Gb instead of 8gb
for now i just use the xmp profile, and 1.55V


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> tried several time ocing it, with help from hokies and ivan, 2000mhz should be possible with mine they said,
> dont seem to work well with mine. its Corsair Vengeance CML8GX3M2A1600C9 Low Profile ,
> after alot trial/error, any change result in crashes, 1800 or higher/lower,
> i decided to safe money for faster ram..lol, 2400mhz i want now, prolly gskill's, and 16Gb instead of 8gb
> for now i just use the xmp profile, and 1.55V


I see ... well it's a common problem with corsair memory nowadays ... I personally wouldn't touch it with a 10ft pole ... running old (P67 design) mushkin sticks here, but I'd like 2x8GB @ 2400mhz from g.skill as well







just no money so I OC'ed mine to that speed, they run at 1.65-1.66v with CL10 timings, good for benchmarks, but not exactly 100% stable for daily running - give me 1-2 erros in memtest over night in test 7 always ...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I see ... well it's a common problem with corsair memory nowadays ... I personally wouldn't touch it with a 10ft pole ... running old (P67 design) mushkin sticks here, but I'd like 2x8GB @ 2400mhz from g.skill as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just no money so I OC'ed mine to that speed, they run at 1.65-1.66v with CL10 timings, good for benchmarks, but not exactly 100% stable for daily running - give me 1-2 erros in memtest over night in test 7 always ...


yea ..money ..grmbl, dont have enough of it to build a comp
in 1 go, have to safe money, then buy a new part, safe money, then the next ..blabla..
so, last thing i bought was a SSD, i love it..
next will be, a 7950 vid card, then ill look for ram again..prolly somewhere in may/june..
then my build is finished..finally..
after that, i will look what Haswell brings us, and decide if im gonna start a new build


----------



## stickg1

Hokie how's your noggin feeling bud?


----------



## Lobsterman

Hey folks, anyone know if Liquid Ultra is safe for using on a reference GTX 570 die and heatsink?
Did ask on EVGA forums but its like a ghost town in there lately.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Hey folks, anyone know if Liquid Ultra is safe for using on a reference GTX 570 die and heatsink?
> Did ask on EVGA forums but its like a ghost town in there lately.


I wouldn't, use something cheaper for the GPU since they do not run incredibly hot for the temps they can withstand.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Hey folks, anyone know if Liquid Ultra is safe for using on a reference GTX 570 die and heatsink?
> Did ask on EVGA forums but its like a ghost town in there lately.


Safe as any other tim i would say..lol
i did 2 vid cards a few weeks ago with liquid pro,
gave me about 10C tempdrop playing bf3,
my card blows the air into the casing, so the cooler the better i was thinking..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> I wouldn't, use something cheaper for the GPU since they do not run incredibly hot for the temps they can withstand.


only have AS5 and liquid pro in the house,
i would use pro first for anything nowadays ..lol
my gpu was running 60-65C playing bf3,
didnt really need to change tim's, but its nice to see it stays in the 50C now ..lol

btw,
nice list you got there, with the "Intel Overclocks" ..lol
5Ghz 1.375V 24/7Stable ..wauw


----------



## Lobsterman

I was meaning safe as in what are the heatsink and die made of, like it wouldn't be safe if it was aluminium but if copper then its safe lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> I was meaning safe as in what are the heatsink and die made of, like it wouldn't be safe if it was aluminium but if copper then its safe lol


i see, misunderstood, sorry















prolly still yes, but i dont have a gtx ..lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

100% safe! Copper and nickel plated copper ihs.
Delid that fermi core!

Guys, there's cheap bbse and psc in ebay atm for your ram needs. 2x8gb will suck for cloccks/timings. Most 8gb sticks won't oc at all!


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 100% safe! Copper and nickel plated copper ihs.
> Delid that fermi core!


Excellent, thanks. playing Far Cry 3, amazing game, really pushing my 570 with big overclock.


----------



## scutzi128

Holy crap I applied liquid ultra on my delidded 3770k (on both die and ihs) and my temps dropped 30*c . The replacement tim I was using on the delidded chip was tim consultants 0098 which is about on par with as5 I believe. Over the original non-delidded chip temps dropped about 40*c. I am amazed how well this stuff works. On top of the great temps it also makes mounting very consistent as long as you apply it correctly.


----------



## Gomi

Sorry if this have already been answered - I been reading through ALOT of the posts that already been made, but to be honest, 4268 posts is just a tad too much.

So I just ordered The Gigabyte Z77X-UD7 along with a whole setup for the MO-RA3 (9x140mm fans) - The 3770K I been using for a few of my projects needs a proper home (Does 5.0 at 1.38V ) so its getting nested in there.

For what I understand, since this 3770K already been used in a few builds, with various coolers (Water and Air), it might require a bit more force to take the PCB and IHS apart ?

I will be using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on the die - Is the procedure to put a proper "Half a rice" ball on it and let the pressure sort it out ?

Or.

Carefully apply the Coollaboratory Liquid Pro in an even layer across the die - like they show it on their webpage (Although, that shows it being applied to the IHS).

Will be using Indigo Xtreme on the IHS - Hopefully the combination will net me a small boost


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Sorry if this have already been answered - I been reading through ALOT of the posts that already been made, but to be honest, 4268 posts is just a tad too much.
> So I just ordered The Gigabyte Z77X-UD7 along with a whole setup for the MO-RA3 (9x140mm fans) - The 3770K I been using for a few of my projects needs a proper home (Does 5.0 at 1.38V ) so its getting nested in there.
> For what I understand, since this 3770K already been used in a few builds, with various coolers (Water and Air), it might require a bit more force to take the PCB and IHS apart ?
> I will be using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on the die - Is the procedure to put a proper "Half a rice" ball on it and let the pressure sort it out ?
> Or.
> Carefully apply the Coollaboratory Liquid Pro in an even layer across the die - like they show it on their webpage (Although, that shows it being applied to the IHS).
> Will be using Indigo Xtreme on the IHS - Hopefully the combination will net me a small boost


Deliding it should take as much force as any other chip. And no you d not use rice ball method lol, spread it evenly and thinly. If you do a good job on both you should get 20-35c drops.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Deliding it should take as much force as any other chip. And no you d not use rice ball method lol, spread it evenly and thinly. If you do a good job on both you should get 20-35c drops.


Thanks mate, had to be 100 % sure before I ventured into the de-lidding area









+REP!


----------



## IronDoq

So just delidded my 3570k (pics later), what would you say is the best way to remove the glue from the die? I'm really afraid to go at it with my fingernails, as previous fingernail attempts really don't move anything. Suggestions? I've actually read quite a bit of this thread and can't remember any info on removing glue from the die.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I will be using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on the die - Is the procedure to put a proper "Half a rice" ball on it and let the pressure sort it out ?


Don't over do it. Just a very small drop on the die about 1/4 the size of a bb ball is enough. Also after you cover the die I think it is a good idea to put a little on the bottom of the IHS where it makes contact with the die with the same small amount of TIM that was placed on the die.

If you have good contact between the top of the IHS and the block, CL Liquid Pro will work great there as well. Key is you need to have flat even contact area between all surfaces.

If you put it on your IHS or block it is tough to clean but possible. Your Intel markings will probably come off of top of IHS after cleaning if you use CL Liquid Pro on it.

Doesn't take very much pressure to mount using CL Liquid Pro which makes it great for bare die to block mounts. Low mount pressure works best with bare die mount to protect die. I use .5mm Fujipoly thermalpad around die to give some support to die and to increast thermal transfer contact area for my bare die mount.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> So just delidded my 3570k (pics later), what would you say is the best way to remove the glue from the die? I'm really afraid to go at it with my fingernails, as previous fingernail attempts really don't move anything. Suggestions? I've actually read quite a bit of this thread and can't remember any info on removing glue from the die.


we really need to hit this glue issue again don't we. we don't have the materials and such that we have been needing to try and get rid of the glue but havent had the chance. I haven't gotten rid of all of mine. but if you lightly scratch it over time it comes off.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> we really need to hit this glue issue again don't we. we don't have the materials and such that we have been needing to try and get rid of the glue but havent had the chance. I haven't gotten rid of all of mine. but if you lightly scratch it over time it comes off.


Dabbing the glue lightly with rubbing alcohol or Goo Off helps. Just takes time. I used microfiber cloth as well.


----------



## IronDoq

I honestly feel like I'm getting nowhere. All the rubbing and scraping with a cloth+alcohol and fingernails has gotten me nowhere. Can anyone link me to a guide perhaps? I don't really know how to go through with this.


----------



## LoneWolf121188

Add me to the club, folks!

OCN name: LoneWolf121188
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: 300MHz
OC after delid: 50x100Mhz
Temp drops: 20C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2602174


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> I honestly feel like I'm getting nowhere. All the rubbing and scraping with a cloth+alcohol and fingernails has gotten me nowhere. Can anyone link me to a guide perhaps? I don't really know how to go through with this.


I couldn't get all of the glue off either. no worries. just get the majority off.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> Add me to the club, folks!
> OCN name: LoneWolf121188
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 300MHz
> OC after delid: 50x100Mhz
> Temp drops: 20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2602174


Congrats!


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Dropped 20c..

Did an IBT 14000MB load to warm the cpu for deliding and for comparisons , take cpu out after that and it took me 2 minutes with that razor...
Most difficult part is to get that razor in one of the corners first without scratching the pcb after that everything went easy...

IBT 14000 load / Antec 620 / Prolimatech PK1 on both sides / VCore 1.27v

Before
97c

After
77c

Me gusta XD


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Dabbing the glue lightly with rubbing alcohol or Goo Off helps. Just takes time. I used microfiber cloth as well.


I really think the glue has different properties on certain chips I tried that on mine and it was hard as crap. I think glue batches could have been differently mixed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> I honestly feel like I'm getting nowhere. All the rubbing and scraping with a cloth+alcohol and fingernails has gotten me nowhere. Can anyone link me to a guide perhaps? I don't really know how to go through with this.


Don't do what Custom PC's magazine article says to use...... they are nuts. they said just use a blade and cut off the remaining glue with it.... I'm still livid at that article.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LoneWolf121188*
> 
> Add me to the club, folks!
> OCN name: LoneWolf121188
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 300MHz
> OC after delid: 50x100Mhz
> Temp drops: 20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2602174


Accepted!









Now slap that sick Sig on!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dropped 20c..
> Did an IBT 14000MB load to warm the cpu for deliding and for comparissions , take cpu out after that and it took me 2 minutes with that razor...
> Most difficult part is to get that razor in one of the corners first without scratching the pcb after that everything went easy...
> IBT 14000 load / Antec 620 / Prolimatech PK1 on both sides / VCore 1.27v
> Before
> 97c
> After
> 77c
> Me gusta XD


Nice work! congrats


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> 
> Dropped 20c..
> Did an IBT 14000MB load to warm the cpu for deliding and for comparissions , take cpu out after that and it took me 2 minutes with that razor...
> Most difficult part is to get that razor in one of the corners first without scratching the pcb after that everything went easy...
> IBT 14000 load / Antec 620 / Prolimatech PK1 on both sides / VCore 1.27v
> Before
> 97c
> After
> 77c
> Me gusta XD


You gonna apply to be a crewmen?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Doesn't take very much pressure to mount using CL Liquid Pro which makes it great for bare die to block mounts. Low mount pressure works best with bare die mount to protect die. I use .5mm Fujipoly thermalpad around die to give some support to die and to increast thermal transfer contact area for my bare die mount.


Never done bare die to block mounting, and truth be told it scares the hell out of me (Probably because I *HATE* being clueless).

I take it you remove the original Intel socket holder / hinge system (Real name eludes me, but we both know what I am meaning). But will this not void any use of the Backplate / Mounting system that the waterblock comes with ? Meaning, and not saying its too bothersome, I have to trek downhill to the hardware store and get nuts, bolts and spacers ?


----------



## zGunBLADEz

OCN name: zGunBLADEz
CPU: I7 3770k
on die-TIM: Prolimatech PK1
ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK1
Mhz gained: Just Wanted to drop my already overclock temps
OC after delid: Just Wanted to drop my already overclock temps
Temp drops: 20c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2602455

That?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> OCN name: zGunBLADEz
> CPU: I7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Prolimatech PK1
> ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK1
> Mhz gained: Just Wanted to drop my already overclock temps
> OC after delid: Just Wanted to drop my already overclock temps
> Temp drops: 20c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2602455
> That?


Yup Accepted!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I see ... well it's a common problem with corsair memory nowadays ... I personally wouldn't touch it with a 10ft pole ... running old (P67 design) mushkin sticks here, but I'd like 2x8GB @ 2400mhz from g.skill as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just no money so I OC'ed mine to that speed, they run at 1.65-1.66v with CL10 timings, good for benchmarks, but not exactly 100% stable for daily running - give me 1-2 erros in memtest over night in test 7 always ...


Corsair started binning thier mid range kits pretty tight, they just don't OC that great. Thier high end kits still do well but the high end kits are expensive...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 100% safe! Copper and nickel plated copper ihs.
> Delid that fermi core!
> Guys, there's cheap bbse and psc in ebay atm for your ram needs. 2x8gb will suck for cloccks/timings. Most 8gb sticks won't oc at all!


This, decent PSC kits may only be 2 x 2Gb but that is enough for most usage (great for all benchmarks), & can be cheap. I have a $40 (used) kit that does 2400Mhz 9-11-9, even the cheap samsung can't match that.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Sorry if this have already been answered - I been reading through ALOT of the posts that already been made, but to be honest, 4268 posts is just a tad too much.
> So I just ordered The Gigabyte Z77X-UD7 along with a whole setup for the MO-RA3 (9x140mm fans) - The 3770K I been using for a few of my projects needs a proper home (Does 5.0 at 1.38V ) so its getting nested in there.
> For what I understand, since this 3770K already been used in a few builds, with various coolers (Water and Air), it might require a bit more force to take the PCB and IHS apart ?
> I will be using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on the die - Is the procedure to put a proper "Half a rice" ball on it and let the pressure sort it out ?
> Or.
> Carefully apply the Coollaboratory Liquid Pro in an even layer across the die - like they show it on their webpage (Although, that shows it being applied to the IHS).
> Will be using Indigo Xtreme on the IHS - Hopefully the combination will net me a small boost


It can be harder from being mounted before from what I've heard.. If anyone is willing to ship me a new 3570k i'd be happy to test that though








As for application, 



 is how they suggest to do it, it's how I plan to do it.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Never done bare die to block mounting, and truth be told it scares the hell out of me (Probably because I *HATE* being clueless).
> But will this not void any use of the Backplate / Mounting system that the waterblock comes with ?


I was just giving out some extra information about using CL Liquid Pro for a bare die mount which does require more preparation and you do have to be very careful with the mount. I have DT Sniper Water block which is very light weight but works well. You have to be very careful if you choose to do a bare die mount. PM me if you have questions. I don't want people to get over their heads right of the bat doing a delid.

I replaced my stock S1155 back plate and water block heat sink back plate with a single back plate that works for my water block mount and the S1155 back plate. EK S115X TRUE back plate.

Some photos of my bare die mount.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Never done bare die to block mounting, and truth be told it scares the hell out of me (Probably because I *HATE* being clueless).
> I take it you remove the original Intel socket holder / hinge system (Real name eludes me, but we both know what I am meaning). But will this not void any use of the Backplate / Mounting system that the waterblock comes with ? Meaning, and not saying its too bothersome, I have to trek downhill to the hardware store and get nuts, bolts and spacers ?


Most of us don't go for the bare die setup, we just insert the IHS after you have put your choice of TIM on the die and pull the lever down to lock the CPU in place.


----------



## IronDoq

BooMotherf***ing yeah!! It was the greatest thing in the world to see these temp drops after sweating bullets putting it back into the socket. I'll post info to join the club later on













These things are sharp!! This fell less than a foot and embedded itself into the hardwood floor. Not to mention my fingers are a bit cut up














I'll go for 5ghz soon tonight!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> BooMotherf***ing yeah!! It was the greatest thing in the world to see these temp drops after sweating bullets putting it back into the socket. I'll post info to join the club later on
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These things are sharp!! This fell less than a foot and embedded itself into the hardwood floor. Not to mention my fingers are a bit cut up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll go for 5ghz soon tonight!


Grats Nice to see my old borad running 5ghz Again!


----------



## Arm3nian

What do you guys think I need for 5ghz? I got [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], which is what i'm at now. Temps are really not a concern.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> What do you guys think I need for 5ghz? I got [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], which is what i'm at now. Temps are really not a concern.


1.420


----------



## Hokies83

1.45v


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I couldn't get all of the glue off either. no worries. just get the majority off.


I have a cheap Chinese "dremel" with stock buffing pads for such purpose ... $8-10 in Harbor Freight Tools and it nicely removes all the glue residue from PCB. for IHS I simply scrape it off with the blade and clean with alcohol later








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> What do you guys think I need for 5ghz? I got [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], which is what i'm at now. Temps are really not a concern.


my guess is 1.51v
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.45v


mine is doing it at 1.46v







, what's your batch bro?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 1.420


that sounds kinda low, either a very good batch or different stability testing .. I use Cinebench only nowadays


----------



## IronDoq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I have a cheap Chinese "dremel" with stock buffing pads for such purpose ... $8-10 in Harbor Freight Tools and it nicely removes all the glue residue from PCB. for IHS I simply scrape it off with the blade and clean with alcohol later
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my guess is 1.51v
> mine is doing it at 1.46v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , what's your batch bro?
> that sounds kinda low, either a very good batch or different stability testing .. I use Cinebench only nowadays


Mine is about an hour in prime @5Ghz with 1.524v







Temps arent a concern (YAAAAAY) peaking in the high 70s, hopefully when I wake up in the morning it'll still be running. At these high voltages, are you guys running offset or manual? Reasons behind doing so? I've been doing offset @4.8, but because it needed such a high offset idle voltage was in the 1.2 range.


----------



## Hokies83

I have been running 1.55v for over 2 months now with Zero issues.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I have a cheap Chinese "dremel" with stock buffing pads for such purpose ... $8-10 in Harbor Freight Tools and it nicely removes all the glue residue from PCB. for IHS I simply scrape it off with the blade and clean with alcohol later
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my guess is 1.51v
> mine is doing it at 1.46v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , what's your batch bro?
> that sounds kinda low, either a very good batch or different stability testing .. I use Cinebench only nowadays


1.420v is kinda high for me at 5 ghz


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Mine is about an hour in prime @5Ghz with 1.524v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps arent a concern (YAAAAAY) peaking in the high 70s, hopefully when I wake up in the morning it'll still be running. At these high voltages, are you guys running offset or manual? Reasons behind doing so? I've been doing offset @4.8, but because it needed such a high offset idle voltage was in the 1.2 range.


not bad, have seen chips like that mostly or worse, even much worse actually ...
I'd stick to 4.8-4.9GHz daily with offsets though. for now I run 4.7GHz daily on offsets, haven't had time to stabilize 5GHz fully with offsets, even though neither vcore nor temps are a problem, had some trouble with MB stability in terms of manual VRM frequency, guessing that ASUS VRMs are poorer quality than EVGA's (used to those).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have been running 1.55v for over 2 months now with Zero issues.


yup, 1.55v seems perfectly safe for IB if temps are OK, my chips haven't degraded at all when running 5.1GHz benchmarking recently or some validations at 5.2Ghz, is OK!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 1.420v is kinda high for me at 5 ghz


nice chip, what is your batch? 3218B?


----------



## lilchronic

3233b499


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have been running 1.55v for over 2 months now with Zero issues.


what are your temps like ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what are your temps like ?




80ish c on hottest core after 8 hrs of prime 95.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> not bad, have seen chips like that mostly or worse, even much worse actually ...
> I'd stick to 4.8-4.9GHz daily with offsets though. for now I run 4.7GHz daily on offsets, haven't had time to stabilize 5GHz fully with offsets, even though neither vcore nor temps are a problem, had some trouble with MB stability in terms of manual VRM frequency, guessing that ASUS VRMs are poorer quality than EVGA's (used to those).
> yup, 1.55v seems perfectly safe for IB if temps are OK, my chips haven't degraded at all when running 5.1GHz benchmarking recently or some validations at 5.2Ghz, is OK!
> nice chip, what is your batch? 3218B?


lol think thats a test? check this out.

http://hwbot.org/submission/2332446_
http://hwbot.org/submission/2329164_
http://hwbot.org/submission/2327417_

Multi hour long tweaking sessions at crazy vcore for super stability. I run 5.4 Ghz at 1.94 just to make sure I don't crash. 5.3 at 1.82 for same reason.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 3233b499


nice!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 3233b499


ah, that batch







have read about it out on hwbot, it's one of the great ones, grats!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol think thats a test? check this out.
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2332446_
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2329164_
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2327417_
> Multi hour long tweaking sessions at crazy vcore for super stability. I run 5.4 Ghz at 1.94 just to make sure I don't crash. 5.3 at 1.82 for same reason.


with all do respect man, I refuse to run anything over 1.55V for daily running or prolonged benching just for the cause ... nice scores you have though








I want to enjoy my chip for some time and can't afford buying 20 of them to choose the best one








cinebench is good enough to prove daily stability since no other stress tester seem to crash that vcore ...but who does it on daily basis huh? pure benching for the records is not of my interest









nice GTX 680 you have, you should crank it up as my 670 is not far away behind you even teamed with 3770K @ 5.0-5.1GHz









some of my scores with evga 670 2gb reference:
vantage 37954 http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4358506
3dmark11 (cpu @ 5.0GHz) 10847 http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5097566


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ah, that batch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have read about it out on hwbot, it's one of the great ones, grats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> with all do respect man, I refuse to run anything over 1.55V for daily running or prolonged benching just for the cause ... nice scores you have though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to enjoy my chip for some time and can't afford buying 20 of them to choose the best one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cinebench is good enough to prove daily stability since no other stress tester seem to crash that vcore ...but who does it on daily basis huh? pure benching for the records is not of my interest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nice GTX 680 you have, you should crank it up as my 670 is not far away behind you even teamed with 3770K @ 5.0-5.1GHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> some of my scores with evga 670 2gb reference:
> vantage 37954 http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4358506
> 3dmark11 (cpu @ 5.0GHz) 10847 http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5097566


Heres the thing. those 3D runs are with my crappy RAM I haven't gotten to try my new G skills. I got 2400 with cas 8 I love them. Gonna see if I can get 2800 ^.^


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Heres the thing. those 3D runs are with my crappy RAM I haven't gotten to try my new G skills. I got 2400 with cas 8 I love them. Gonna see if I can get 2800 ^.^


I like your sticks ... best I can do with mine is 2400 @ CL10 ... CL8 would be a dream







, but I don't mind, usually I run them daily at 2000 XMP CL9 and don't bother. that translates into zero difference in gaming and daily use, and really I don't do world breaking record benching either LOL (unless someone wants to sponsor me, I'm broke!)!

by the end of the year I just want to hunt down another matching 670 reference on some x-mas promo and be done with upgrades for quite a while, I'm happy with what I've got









you will never beat the top10 unless you are very rich or have a corporation sponsoring your efforts, that's a fact, at some point it becomes a team work.

good luck with your projects Valgaur


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I like your sticks ... best I can do with mine is 2400 @ CL10 ... CL8 would be a dream
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , but I don't mind, usually I run them daily at 2000 XMP CL9 and don't bother. that translates into zero difference in gaming and daily use, and really I don't do world breaking record benching either LOL (unless someone wants to sponsor me, I'm broke!)!
> by the end of the year I just want to hunt down another matching 670 reference on some x-mas promo and be done with upgrades for quite a while, I'm happy with what I've got
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you will never beat the top10 unless you are very rich or have a corporation sponsoring your efforts, that's a fact, at some point it becomes a team work.
> good luck with your projects Valgaur


I would love to have corporate sponsoring on benching. I would probably die from excitement over the pure hardware. These stix are all thanks to Ivan though he found them and helped me out a lot. I owe ya one Ivan!









I hope I can get these stix to some really good OC's might lossen them way down to like 15-15-15 or something crazy and OC them. what you think guys? or go for 12 and see what happens?


----------



## VonDutch

How to apply liquid pro/ultra on die and ihs

if youre used to apply tim's with a line or a drop as big as a rice grain, its not needed

if you use liquid pro/ultra, you need about/less then half of that on the die..

Same goes for the ihs, this little drop here is more then enough to cover the whole ihs..


its not like other tim's, which you apply, then let the pressure of the cooler spread it out for you,
nope, you have to do that yourselfs for the best results, spread it out all the way,
using,
1. the Q-tip that comes with the package
2. use a plastic glove/bag to spread it,(1 finger)
3. a little paint brush works fine too

when youre finished spreading it out, it should look like this




hope this helps peeps who are asking about , how to apply, and how much to apply using liquid pro/ultra


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Sorry if this have already been answered - *I been reading through ALOT of the posts that already been made, but to be honest, 4268 posts is just a tad too much.*
> So I just ordered The Gigabyte Z77X-UD7 along with a whole setup for the MO-RA3 (9x140mm fans) - The 3770K I been using for a few of my projects needs a proper home (Does 5.0 at 1.38V ) so its getting nested in there.
> For what I understand, since this 3770K already been used in a few builds, with various coolers (Water and Air), it might require a bit more force to take the PCB and IHS apart ?
> I will be using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on the die - Is the procedure to put a proper "Half a rice" ball on it and let the pressure sort it out ?
> Or.
> Carefully apply the Coollaboratory Liquid Pro in an even layer across the die - like they show it on their webpage (Although, that shows it being applied to the IHS).
> Will be using Indigo Xtreme on the IHS - Hopefully the combination will net me a small boost


i feel the same way,
from the 4000+ posts, prolly half of it is about other things then delidding,
is there any way we can reduce the unnecessary posts, and make it a compact thread again,
with only posts about delidding, and related things ? (idk, start over and get the important/best posts over there?)

reduce the pic size on page 1, open some of the spoilers, that only have a link on it to other posts?
i have to click twice on it, to only see a link, we use spoilers for pic's,
its just that i notice peeps saying they read alot in the thread, but then later they didnt read
the posts/links on page 1, because they are kinda "hidden" .. just saying


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> How to apply liquid pro/ultra on die and ihs
> if youre used to apply tim's with a line or a drop as big as a rice grain, its not needed
> 
> if you use liquid pro/ultra, you need about/less then half of that on the die..
> Same goes for the ihs, this little drop here is more then enough to cover the whole ihs..
> 
> its not like other tim's, which you apply, then let the pressure of the cooler spread it out for you,
> nope, you have to do that yourselfs for the best results, spread it out all the way,
> using,
> 1. the Q-tip that comes with the package
> 2. use a plastic glove/bag to spread it,(1 finger)
> 3. a little paint brush works fine too
> when youre finished spreading it out, it should look like this
> 
> 
> hope this helps peeps who are asking about , how to apply, and how much to apply using liquid pro/ultra


Damn that guy who put that Liquid Ultra on that IHS has mad skills @[email protected]


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i feel the same way,
> from the 4000+ posts, prolly half of it is about other things then delidding,
> is there any way we can reduce the unnecessary posts, and make it a compact thread again,
> with only posts about delidding, and related things ? (idk, start over and get the important/best posts over there?)


I was thinking about that earlier. What we really need is someone with a LOT of spare time to condense all the information in this thread into *the ultimate delidding guide and information resource*.
Which is to say, gather all the best bits, and make a definitive guide on the subject of delidding. We've got a ton of knowledge in this thread, as well as a lot of knowledgeable people that frequent it regularly, but the thing is that a LOT of those 4000+ posts are questions that have been answered before, just because it's such a massive amount of posts to go through.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I was thinking about that earlier. What we really need is someone with a LOT of spare time to condense all the information in this thread into *the ultimate delidding guide and information resource*.
> Which is to say, gather all the best bits, and make a definitive guide on the subject of delidding. We've got a ton of knowledge in this thread, as well as a lot of knowledgeable people that frequent it regularly, but the thing is that a LOT of those 4000+ posts are questions that have been answered before, just because it's such a massive amount of posts to go through.


I know all about this stuff..

But my bread and butter is Gpu's... trying to snag a 570 for 80$ that needs baking right now @[email protected]


----------



## Leyaena

Lmao at the Garfield avatar.
That's how I feel right now, I hate monday mornings


----------



## Matt-Matt

So I just read a thread on here.. Whether or not I'm successful I shall be buying a 3770k after de-lidding, and de-lid that if I've been successful. Just waiting on the Liquid Ultra/Pro to arrive.


----------



## feniks

15 timings are a very bad idea, even 12 is
dont go above 11 for any reasonable perfomance coz speed gain even 200 mhz will be consumed by severely loosened timings. Also some sticks will simply refuse to boot above certain speeds no matter what timings or voltage. Use aida64 mem benchmark to monitor performance of mem OC.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would love to have corporate sponsoring on benching. I would probably die from excitement over the pure hardware. These stix are all thanks to Ivan though he found them and helped me out a lot. I owe ya one Ivan!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope I can get these stix to some really good OC's might lossen them way down to like 15-15-15 or something crazy and OC them. what you think guys? or go for 12 and see what happens?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would love to have corporate sponsoring on benching. I would probably die from excitement over the pure hardware. These stix are all thanks to Ivan though he found them and helped me out a lot. I owe ya one Ivan!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope I can get these stix to some really good OC's might lossen them way down to like 15-15-15 or something crazy and OC them. what you think guys? or go for 12 and see what happens?


You can probably do cl6-8-6-27-1t with 1.82v+ and a ram pot...at close to 3ghz, but depends on your imc.


----------



## Valgaur

So.... put it back at 2400 Mhz at 1.75 with 8-10-8-27. and I couldn't boot at all. I booted that the other day no problem. but now it doesn't even want to run stock 2133 either. this is pissing me off really badly.


----------



## ivanlabrie

How badly did you push the vtt/vccio and imc/vccsa voltage? Might have degraded the imc...


----------



## chris-br

Guess what just got here???? YES< MY LIQUID PRO.







See you guys after i lap the ihs and install everything back:thumb:

EDIT: All i can say is.... WOOOOOOOOOOOOOW, 30c drop on IBT runs.. I lapped following these: 600>1200>1500>2000. The middle of the IHS was the last place where the cooper showed up.., I did apply LP on the die>ihs>d14. AMAZING..


----------



## bgineng

Finally did it!!!

Look at the max temps:
Before:


After:


And here is my submission:

OCN name: bgineng
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.6 GHz (will push higher later)
Temp drops: 22c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2603428


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> How badly did you push the vtt/vccio and imc/vccsa voltage? Might have degraded the imc...


I only pushed the DDR vcore to 1.8 to try and max it loosend to 10-10-10 and 11-11-11-30 but nothing so I tried 2666 at 11-11-11-30 still nothing then I went back to 2400 and nothing... then stock. nothing.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I only pushed the DDR vcore to 1.8 to try and max it loosend to 10-10-10 and 11-11-11-30 but nothing so I tried 2666 at 11-11-11-30 still nothing then I went back to 2400 and nothing... then stock. nothing.


You shouldn't use more than 1.75v to test for max clocks on air, but I doubt that killed the ram.
No changes in vccio and vccsa then? Sounds odd...Try stock clocks and voltage but use vccio 1.2v and vccsa 1.15v


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bgineng*
> 
> Finally did it!!!
> Look at the max temps:
> Before:
> 
> After:
> 
> And here is my submission:
> OCN name: bgineng
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.6 GHz (will push higher later)
> Temp drops: 22c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2603428


Accepted!







Use our Big Crewmate sig now!


----------



## chris-br

UPDATE:

OCN name: Chris-br
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Pro
lapped ihs-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: 0
Running @4,5 still, will go higher later
Temp drops: 25/30c


I was hitting 90c on the middle cors with my ambient temps being 28c like right now.

EDIT: Also forgot to say that i did apply to the GPU also, I'm got a 15c drop in max temp. VERY happy


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So.... put it back at 2400 Mhz at 1.75 with 8-10-8-27. and I couldn't boot at all. I booted that the other day no problem. but now it doesn't even want to run stock 2133 either. this is pissing me off really badly.


Franky! Franky! Noooooooooooooooooooo! Tell me it aint so!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm worried about Franky too... :/
Doubt the psc sticks died on you, they are pretty resilient.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I only pushed the DDR vcore to 1.8 to try and max it loosend to 10-10-10 and 11-11-11-30 but nothing so I tried 2666 at 11-11-11-30 still nothing then I went back to 2400 and nothing... then stock. nothing.


I find on my asus board if I want to make big changes (mem multi change, primary timing change) I do best when I reset all timings to auto, boot up to windows, restart then go back to bios & make changes.
I'm still working on PSC, it can be tough to figure out. 2400 9-11-9 gets decent pi score, then try 8-11-8 & do better, but try 7-11-7 & can finish pi, but times get way slower...
I can boot 2600Mhz with it but have had no luck getting pi 32m stable there.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quick tip...try cl8-10-8








The tighter trcd the better with psc, hence why some prefer BBSE.


----------



## FtW 420

None of my kits seem to like tRCD 10 very much at 2400 or more.8-11-8 or 7-11-7 under 1.75V passes 32m, haven't even gotten to POST at tRCD 10 with 1.8V.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Too bad








cl7 seems slower accross the board with Ivy...from what I've seen asking around.


----------



## stickg1

After talk of maybe my motherboard being bad and not my chip, I purchased a multimeter to get a voltage reading straight from the source. I set the voltage to 1.325 in BIOS and after LLC it was 1.328v (I had prime95 running). The multimeter read 1.33v and is accurate to +/- .02v.

So I think these new batches of i5-3570k's must be a little different. I've found a few people that purchased one of these chips in the last few weeks that have higher than normal stock VID and require more voltage for average clocks (4.4-4.6GHz), while still maintaining temperatures similar to what someone with an older 3570K would get with 1.25v.

My stock voltage is 1.316v.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Intel's been doing their homework with the whole IHS/DIE contact and amount of tim, maybe reducing the height of the ihs with less glue?


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Too bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cl7 seems slower accross the board with Ivy...from what I've seen asking around.


AMD= Timings
Intel= Frequency.
Try and go for higher freqs not timings.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not so much...not straight forward like you put it btw








It's a balancing act, gotta check with Maxxmem single thread.


----------



## Valgaur

Gonna try auto and switch my lanes from 2 and 4 to 1 and 3 see if that changes anything. Will up vtt and vccio to 1.15 as well. I want 2400 again. I get get clock for clock no problem on Franky, but its just not making it past bios or just keeps looping turning off and on.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> AMD= Timings
> Intel= Frequency.
> Try and go for higher freqs not timings.


Both AMD & Intel do prefer more speed, the AMD chips I've used (955be, 1090t, 8150) did best when getting the frequency as high as possible then tightening timings, same as with intel.

Here is the best I've done with PSC & ivy so far


----------



## ivanlabrie

At least that's true for Spi32m and 2d benchies in general...so yeah, there you got it.
Perhaps for folding timings aren't that important, vs freq, same as for 3d benching.


----------



## feniks

valgaur, have you tried Restoring BIOS defaults or Clearing CMOS yet?
F5 - Load defaults, F10 - save & reboot, go back to BIOS set your stuff and again F10 and see if it boots up.
bad memory timings/speed/voltage combo could have been unstable and corrupted CMOS...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, don't give up like that lol
Benching is gonna wreck the heck out of your Os and stuff, tons of times lol
Also you'll have to reinstall stripped Os'es frequently on top of that.


----------



## Valgaur

Gonna update bios to the new 1604 that should reset the cmos if not i'll load defaults. it's at 1.65 at 2133 at 8-10-8-27 now just wanted to boot is all lol. but so far its stable. hmmmmm


----------



## ivanlabrie

I had tons of trouble with my Samsung sticks and my ud5h when fooling around with 2400mhz...booted 2400mhz cl11 once lol.
Max was 2200mhz cl9-12-12-21-1t with 1.75v







But lost some of the better configs I could find before, had to switch bios a couple of times.
Asus is much better for that, specially the ROG boards.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> After talk of maybe my motherboard being bad and not my chip, I purchased a multimeter to get a voltage reading straight from the source. I set the voltage to 1.325 in BIOS and after LLC it was 1.328v (I had prime95 running). The multimeter read 1.33v and is accurate to +/- .02v.
> So I think these new batches of i5-3570k's must be a little different. I've found a few people that purchased one of these chips in the last few weeks that have higher than normal stock VID and require more voltage for average clocks (4.4-4.6GHz), while still maintaining temperatures similar to what someone with an older 3570K would get with 1.25v.
> My stock voltage is 1.316v.


Ur temps are good Intel musta revised them and made the IHS closer to the cores.


----------



## feniks

damn it. for some reason when I stabilize 5GHz with offsets it calls for much higher vcore under load (Cinebench) than with fixed vcore ... kinda stumped on this, have never seen such a big difference between vcore in both modes on any of my chips so far ... all other chips called for nearly same vcore under load no matter if fixed mode or offset mode ... hmmm ....

Ultra High 75% LLC
1. fixed vcore 1.456v under load (per cpu-z and with IBT load) - fully stable under Cinebench
2. offset +0.320 resulting in 1.508v under load (per cpu-z and with IBT load) - only this makes Cinebench fully stable in offset mode .... grrrrrr....

screw it, made it my new daily, will see how it goes. since vcore is within absolute intel specs and temps are not an issue, then it should last, right?









... now I need to find out why my memory throws 1-2 single errors under memtest at 2400MHz with timings either 10-12-11-31 2T or 10-12-12-32 2T when tested over night ... never see this single error in first pass, occurs really randomly, sometimes on the 2nd pass, other times on the 7th (and 11-13th or so again) ... perhaps I should finally bump the memory voltage from stock 1.65V haha!


----------



## Hokies83

I just run fixed.. Ivy does not use much power t worry about it...

LoL us At 5ghz prolly uses less power then a stock Vishera chip.


----------



## feniks

nah, I am done with daily fixed vcore ... have been doing it for years on EVGA boards (790 Ultra & more recently Z68 FTW & Z77 FTW) since there was no other choice ... now trying to enjoy offsets and have been since I ever got this MVE board, it's so fun! saving power at idle (my rig runs 24/7) at high clock, potentially making it live longer, less electricity used and so on


----------



## ivanlabrie

Don't be a cry baby and use 1.7v on the ram, 1.1v vccio and 1.05v vccsa. Oh and do 1t cr, all ivy chips can handle that.
As for offsets, yeah, probably you're overshooting voltage. Try a low llc setting and fine tune that.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Don't be a cry baby and use 1.7v on the ram, 1.1v vccio and 1.05v vccsa. Oh and do 1t cr, all ivy chips can handle that.
> As for offsets, yeah, probably you're overshooting voltage. Try a low llc setting and fine tune that.


hmmm ... my chip/board does 1.15v on vccsa & 1.10v on vccio on auto settings ... kinda the other way around and higher LOL!
also this RAM doesn't like overvolting and 1.7v is absolute maximum Mushkin advised to use. will do some more testing in spare time. either way 5GHz on offsets turned out unstable after all LOL! some eff up somewhere ... wondering about MB BIOS ... using an older revision now, cause the newer version had some trouble with CPU effective multipliers past 48x, will check on that too. I smell something fishy about offsets programing in this BIOS revision







... now back to old daily 4.7GHz and playing XCOM


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hmmm ... my chip/board does 1.15v on vccsa & 1.10v on vccio on auto settings ... kinda the other way around and higher LOL!
> also this RAM doesn't like overvolting and 1.7v is absolute maximum Mushkin advised to use. will do some more testing in spare time. either way 5GHz on offsets turned out unstable after all LOL! some eff up somewhere ... wondering about MB BIOS ... using an older revision now, cause the newer version had some trouble with CPU effective multipliers past 48x, will check on that too. I smell something fishy about offsets programing in this BIOS revision
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... now back to old daily 4.7GHz and playing XCOM


How is Xcom? i wanted to Snag it but it did not have a good enough Sale on it black Friday.

Snagged AC3 for 20$
Sleeping dogs for 10$

I will not pay much for a game XD


----------



## SonDa5

Feniks I think your stability problem is with your RAM over clocked bandwidth caused by extreme CPU over clock. It may be rated for 2400mhz on a much lower speed IB CPU. AT 5 GHZ that ram is pusihing its limits. Try 1.2v on VCCIO voltage and see if helps stabilize it.

If not see how it reacts at CL 9 with your cpu at 5GHZ. At 2133mhz you should be able to lower VCCIO voltage to around 1.9v and possibly lower DRAM voltage to at least 1.6v. This may also alow you to lower your vcore a hair or two.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How is Xcom? i wanted to Snag it but it did not have a good enough Sale on it black Friday.
> Snagged AC3 for 20$
> Sleeping dogs for 10$
> I will not pay much for a game XD










it's awesome! I took it for $28 from greenmangaming during BF deal. kinda short if you make focus on research, in 40ish hours of game time I am attempting to finish the final mission (assaulting aliens mothership hovering over Earth), but for sure I will play it again on harder difficulty some other time. totally worth it, lots of fun! nice graphics with good cinematics, good background music, tons of fun








wondering if they make some DLC for it over time...

This game and Civ5 (plus expansion) are the highest priced games I bought







I usually get games on 75% sales only too LOL! still have a bunch of such that I haven't even touched (all Crysis games, AvP, still playing SC2, etc.)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Feniks I think your stability problem is with your RAM over clocked bandwidth caused by extreme CPU over clock. It may be rated for 2400mhz on a much lower speed IB CPU. AT 5 GHZ that ram is pusihing its limits. Try 1.2v on VCCIO voltage and see if helps stabilize it.
> If not see how it reacts at CL 9 with your cpu at 5GHZ. At 2133mhz you should be able to lower VCCIO voltage to around 1.9v and possibly lower DRAM voltage to at least 1.6v. This may also alow you to lower your vcore a hair or two.


I thought so too, but the problem happens also when running mem sticks at fully stable 2000MHz XMP - I use this or 2200Mhz daily, running 2400 only for benching (99.99% stable).

kinda lost, it could be MB acting up in offsets mode at multies above 48x ... or the chip itself this time .. LOL! it's honestly the second good chip I have (1st one got damaged by former board), all the rest (3) was garbage maxing out at 4.8GHz below 1.52V ... not sure. let me switch to other BIOS (latest), reset it and go from there - perhaps that's all it takes ...

I tried 1.20v on vccio before and it had no effect, funny also that problem happens only in offsets mode, the fixed vcore was OK last time I checked. ... I just hope it's not the MB acting up (VRMs) on physical level ... but I'd rather replace the CPU again first then go with board RMA through ASUS LOL!


----------



## SonDa5

On my 5GHZ 3770k 2666mhz RAM benchmarking settings I use 1.7v on DRAM and 1.25v on VCCIO voltage. PLL is at 1.65v.

I only run these settings for bench marking because I have to push my vcore to 1.5v to get this to stabilize. With XMP settings of 2400mhz CL 9 on my ram I can lower DRAM to 1.6v, VCIOO voltage to 1.09v and lower vcore to 1.44v. Big difference in voltages just by over clocking the ram.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> On my 5GHZ 3770k 2666mhz RAM benchmarking settings I use 1.7v on DRAM and 1.25v on VCCIO voltage. PLL is at 1.65v.
> I only run these settings for bench marking because I have to push my vcore to 1.5v to get this to stabilize. With XMP settings of 2400mhz CL 9 on my ram I can lower DRAM to 1.6v, VCIOO voltage to 1.9v and lower vcore to 1.44v. Big difference in voltages just by over clocking the ram.


I agree. seeing similar patterns here. overclocking just the RAM (especially on 4 sticks that I used to have, now running only 2x4GB) requires way more vcore for same stability of CPU. I was usually leaving vccio & vccsa on auto as those worked good on MVE, only adjusting them manually for 5.1GHz+ benchmarking ... but that was insane vcore anyways...

for 4.8 up to 4.9GHz on all 3770K chips I had (not all could do 4.9 with reasonable vcore however), the CPU PLL of 1.50V was perfectly stable.
5.0GHz (on those that could run it) was usually stable at 1.55V, not sure about this one yet, so I keep it on auto 1.80V for now, will optimize it down after clock is stable solid and not floating around like it was on former BIOS 704 (hopefully this was it).

good news for now, the latest 1408 BIOS correctly set the multi to 50x after CMOS reset (formerly was locked at some wierd low clocks while in Windows however properly showing in BIOS).
I will try 2666MHz @ 1.70V on RAM and CL11 timings after I make 5.0GHz stable on offsets, really want this clock for daily running if possible, it's such a nice number, isn't it?









let me see if I can make it stable with 75% LLC and maybe adjustments on CPU voltage frequency (auto 300KHz vs manual max 500KHz) and Phase type setting (can never decide between Extreme vs Optimized - can't really see the difference either).


----------



## junkerde

oh man, you guys make this seem tempting! maybe when I have enough money for backup, I will delid and overclock more, but not even sure if it's worth the 300mhz+ gain........


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I just run fixed.. Ivy does not use much power t worry about it...
> LoL us At 5ghz prolly uses less power then a stock Vishera chip.


I've never seen a Vishera fan boy boi lol. What is the purpose of defending something that bad anyway lmao.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I've never seen a Vishera fan boy boi lol. What is the purpose of defending something that bad anyway lmao.


Visit the Amd section there pretty hard core.. some will tell u a 8350 is faster then a 3770k


----------



## Valgaur

nuff said, and RAM is back on track at all regular settings.


----------



## feniks

no dice. cinebench starts passing at 0.295 offset @ 5GHz which is already higher than fully stable fixed vcore, but no matter what I try it always throws some WHEA warnings, meaning it's not fully stable and I don't see why. ASUS BIOS having an issue still?

went up to offset 0.305 while somewhere around 0.275-0.280 it should be stable (based on actual under load vcore comparison), but it's not... wondering if there is still something quirky about offsets at high multis in this BIOS ... it certainly is better as it no longer BSODs when vcore is unstable ... but those offsets and 49x+ multis seem to have an issue still ... might do 4.8 & 4.9GHz first tomorrow and see where those land exactly (fixed vs offset vcore under load) ... yeah, LOL! haven't tried those yet haha ... so far only was running 4.5, 4.6, 4.7, 5.0, 5.1 and 5.2







for now back to 4.7Ghz and good night


----------



## feniks

LMAO!!! This BIOS 1408 is bugged like hell!!! restored BIOS defaults 3 times and couldn't boot to Windows with known good 4.7Ghz config as it was either hanging on Windows logo or plain restarting ... then loaded BIOS defaults again and only switched my memory sticks to XMP because I wanted to run memtest, but before I found my usb stick Windows booted ... here is what CPU-Z shows ... mind that in BIOS the CPU was at stock intel spec settings:


CRAZY ASUS BIOS!!!
reverting back to 1309 tomorrow, if that doesn't solve BIOS issues I am down to 704 which has offsets issues at 50x multi for sure ... F.M.L...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LMAO!!! This BIOS 1408 is bugged like hell!!! restored BIOS defaults 3 times and couldn't boot to Windows with known good 4.7Ghz config as it was either hanging on Windows logo or plain restarting ... then loaded BIOS defaults again and only switched my memory sticks to XMP because I wanted to run memtest, but before I found my usb stick Windows booted ... here is what CPU-Z shows ... mind that in BIOS the CPU was at stock intel spec settings:
> 
> 
> Im using the brand new 1704 or 1709 ones. They are pretty good.
> CRAZY ASUS BIOS!!!
> reverting back to 1309 tomorrow, if that doesn't solve BIOS issues I am down to 704 which has offsets issues at 50x multi for sure ... F.M.L...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkerde*
> 
> oh man, you guys make this seem tempting! maybe when I have enough money for backup, I will delid and overclock more, but not even sure if it's worth the 300mhz+ gain........


Delidding is not just about the extra OC ability, and it's not just about the much better temps - even though those are great things it does do.

Delidding is a blast just to do! It's fun and an accomplishment worth doing on it's own rights that also comes with extra OC'ing and temp abilities!


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *junkerde*
> 
> oh man, you guys make this seem tempting! maybe when I have enough money for backup, I will delid and overclock more, but not even sure if it's worth the 300mhz+ gain........
> 
> 
> 
> Delidding is not just about the extra OC ability, and it's not just about the much better temps - even though those are great things it does do.
> 
> Delidding is a blast just to do! It's fun and an accomplishment worth doing on it's own rights that also comes with extra OC'ing and temp abilities!
Click to expand...

You better believe him








Never thought it'd be so much fun beforehand, but it really is a huge thrill!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Visit the Amd section there pretty hard core.. some will tell u a 8350 is faster then a 3770k












Fan bois crack me up.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I've never seen a Vishera fan boy boi lol. What is the purpose of defending something that bad anyway lmao.
> 
> 
> 
> Visit the Amd section there pretty hard core.. some will tell u a 8350 is faster then a 3770k
Click to expand...

Because it is!
Also, santa is real and I ride my unicorn to work every day


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I've never seen a Vishera fan boy boi lol. What is the purpose of defending something that bad anyway lmao.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Visit the Amd section there pretty hard core.. some will tell u a 8350 is faster then a 3770k


The FX chips aren't that bad. If you already had a 990FX board from your last AMD build it is a decent chip. I wouldn't build new with an AMD chip. The only way I would is if I couldn't afford an i7 and my workload was very multi-threaded.

Remember that enthusiast overclocking is a rich boy sport, but not everyone that wants to play is rich. All I do on my computer is browse and game, so an 8 "core" AMD chip is a waste for me. If you already have a decent 990FX motherboard, like most of the AMD FX owners do, then why sell it for a loss and spend $500 on a new mid to high tier Intel board and an i7? Is the Vishera worse than an i7? Yes. Does it cost less? Yes. Is it worse than an i5? In some cases, yes, but in other instances of multi-threaded workloads, no it excels. What is the price difference? Same price as the the flagship FX chip, or less for the lower binned models.

It doesn't always need to be "ZOMG MY CH1P PWNS J00 IN CINEBENCH!!!", who cares. I have a dream, that one day red and blue can coexist on this forum.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Delidding is not just about the extra OC ability, and it's not just about the much better temps - even though those are great things it does do.
> Delidding is a blast just to do! It's fun and an accomplishment worth doing on it's own rights that also comes with extra OC'ing and temp abilities!


+1 for that.. It took me 3 hours to lap and assemble my pc back together yesterday, but was worth every second. Couldn't be happier with the results.


----------



## chris-br

Valgaur, would you please update my info in the first page, please? It's on post #4325


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> no dice. cinebench starts passing at 0.295 offset @ 5GHz which is already higher than fully stable fixed vcore, but no matter what I try it always throws some WHEA warnings, meaning it's not fully stable and I don't see why. ASUS BIOS having an issue still?
> went up to offset 0.305 while somewhere around 0.275-0.280 it should be stable (based on actual under load vcore comparison), but it's not... wondering if there is still something quirky about offsets at high multis in this BIOS ... it certainly is better as it no longer BSODs when vcore is unstable ... but those offsets and 49x+ multis seem to have an issue still ... might do 4.8 & 4.9GHz first tomorrow and see where those land exactly (fixed vs offset vcore under load) ... yeah, LOL! haven't tried those yet haha ... so far only was running 4.5, 4.6, 4.7, 5.0, 5.1 and 5.2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> for now back to 4.7Ghz and good night


I do have to use a higher vcore on offset mode. Also, the vcore in offset more is not stable, goes up more. Kinda weird. but when is in idle, drops nicely.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The FX chips aren't that bad. If you already had a 990FX board from your last AMD build it is a decent chip. I wouldn't build new with an AMD chip. The only way I would is if I couldn't afford an i7 and my workload was very multi-threaded.
> Remember that enthusiast overclocking is a rich boy sport, but not everyone that wants to play is rich. All I do on my computer is browse and game, so an 8 "core" AMD chip is a waste for me. If you already have a decent 990FX motherboard, like most of the AMD FX owners do, then why sell it for a loss and spend $500 on a new mid to high tier Intel board and an i7? Is the Vishera worse than an i7? Yes. Does it cost less? Yes. Is it worse than an i5? In some cases, yes, but in other instances of multi-threaded workloads, no it excels. What is the price difference? Same price as the the flagship FX chip, or less for the lower binned models.
> It doesn't always need to be "ZOMG MY CH1P PWNS J00 IN CINEBENCH!!!", who cares. I have a dream, that one day red and blue can coexist on this forum.


ive build mine with Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD3, before 8150 came out, had it running my 1100T till then,
but when 8150 came out, it seemed my 1100T wasnt that bad compared to the 8150..lol
my kiddo is running the comp now, when i decided to go for intel..
atm im trying to sell the 1100T for minimum of 120 euro, and buy the FX8350 for him(184 euro),
i think (now) its a nice upgrade over the 1100T

like you say, if you already have the FX mobo, its a interesting upgrade, the 8150 wasnt good enough, compared to the 1100T
FX8350 looks good to me tho..and you know kids, they all like, more cores is better...lol
hes so proud of his real 6 cores now..even says , "you only have a quad core dad" ...lol
still a bit amd fanboy, idk what others think..lol, always had amd proc's till now
must say, not one day of regret since i changed to intel.. 3770k is great!

intels nearest chip prize wise is the 2500k for 195 euro, against 184 euro for the FX8350
i think the 8350 is very close to that one, or better/faster( onoooo!! ..lol) with some things in the reviews/benchmarks i saw..
still wouldnt recommend it for a new build tho..3570K is about 20 euro more ..so ...well..


----------



## VonDutch

so, anyone else already running liquid pro/ultra for about 3 months?

i notice my idle temps are getting just a bit higher, only about 1-2C tho..
it was about 5-6C temp difference at idle between cores when i started, now its about 7C difference


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so, anyone else already running liquid pro/ultra for about 3 months?
> 
> i notice my idle temps are getting just a bit higher, only about 1-2C tho..
> it was about 5-6C temp difference at idle between cores when i started, now its about 7C difference


Ask me that in 3 months.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Ask me that in 3 months.


LOL









think its ok tho, just ran AIDA64 for a few min,

still about 5-6C temp diff between cores under load.. i worry to much ...lol


----------



## chris-br

I know everyone said this and that about LP, but i still amazed by the temp difference and how well it holds there as i clock up the CPU... Still doing tests... Now i love even more my D14.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I know everyone said this and that about LP, but i still amazed by the temp difference and how well it holds there as i clock up the CPU... Still doing tests... Now i love even more my D14.


Told you you'd love it


----------



## Imprezzion

Do you guys think I should delid my 3570k?

I'm running the new H100i on a P8Z77-V Pro board and i got up to 4.6Ghz on 1.216v and I know it can do 4.8Ghz on 1.296v only it gets a tad hot then under max stress... As in 77-87-85-81 during LinX... Prime95 is about 2-3c less but still...

Is the combination of H100i + P8Z77-V Pro usable delidded? Or only with the IHS back on so I can just change the paste..


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Told you you'd love it


yeah, I'm glad i put the LP in the HS too....Don't care if is a pain to take it off, because it will stay there for a long long time.Don't plan in changing CPU's any time soon. Just got my 3570k a couple months ago.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Do you guys think I should delid my 3570k?
> I'm running the new H100i on a P8Z77-V Pro board and i got up to 4.6Ghz on 1.216v and I know it can do 4.8Ghz on 1.296v only it gets a tad hot then under max stress... As in 77-87-85-81 during LinX... Prime95 is about 2-3c less but still...
> Is the combination of H100i + P8Z77-V Pro usable delidded? Or only with the IHS back on so I can just change the paste..


That's a very nice chip you have there... wish i could use that vcore, but mine is at 4,5 and needs 1,320 to be stable.

Now, about the temps. delid that thing and get some LP for it, you will be amazed.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I know everyone said this and that about LP, but i still amazed by the temp difference and how well it holds there as i clock up the CPU... Still doing tests... Now i love even more my D14.


owyeah, i felt the same ...lol
still have to laugh, when i beat up watercoolers etc tempwise..lol, with my simple mugen 2

running IBT, 4.9ghz hottest core 76C ! ..hahaha..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> yeah, I'm glad i put the LP in the HS too....Don't care if is a pain to take it off, because it will stay there for a long long time.Don't plan in changing CPU's any time soon. Just got my 3570k a couple months ago.


gonna test it, when its under there for about 6 months, then ill take it apart again,
and look for easy ways to clean...about 3 months to go now


----------



## chris-br

heh, i did a 4.7 run last night @ 1,404v (yeah i know is high, but still unstable, getting WHEA erros) and temps never got to the 65 mark yet.

Oh yeah, update my info please Valgaur.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Do you guys think I should delid my 3570k?
> I'm running the new H100i on a P8Z77-V Pro board and i got up to 4.6Ghz on 1.216v and I know it can do 4.8Ghz on 1.296v only it gets a tad hot then under max stress... As in 77-87-85-81 during LinX... Prime95 is about 2-3c less but still...
> Is the combination of H100i + P8Z77-V Pro usable delidded? Or only with the IHS back on so I can just change the paste..


i wouldnt delid if not necessary, if you run into high temps with just a little oc, maybe then








i delidded because i couldnt even run prime at 4.5ghz, without hitting 105C,
i know what throtteling and shutting down core is first hand ..lol

your mobo and cooler are very nice to use, delidded or not








running prime at 4.8ghz, and hottest core about 80-85C is great really,
for not delidded chip that is









i would leave the ihs on after delid, no hassle..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> heh, i did a 4.7 run last night @ 1,404v (yeah i know is high, but still unstable, getting WHEA erros) and temps never got to the 65 mark yet.
> Oh yeah, update my info please Valgaur.


yea, looks a bit high to me too, you sure you have all settings right ?
could be something else messing up your oc?, is that using offset or fixed vcore?
are you using xmp profile for your ram?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, looks a bit high to me too, you sure you have all settings right ?
> could be something else messing up your oc?, is that using offset or fixed vcore?
> are you using xmp profile for your ram?


Fixed voltage and xmp profile for ram. I always do fixed vcore for testing new clocks. I noticed that vcore gets unstable as goes up.. LLC is on turbo. cpu pll @ 1,600.

EDIT: Well. After putting the CPU back on, should i reset bios? Because i didn't.

Edit2:
clock bios cpuz
4.5 1.315 1.308
4.6 1.35 1.344
4.7 1.4 1.392

That's from testing last night.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Fixed voltage and xmp profile for ram. I always do fixed vcore for testing new clocks. I noticed that vcore gets unstable as goes up.. LLC is on turbo. cpu pll @ 1,600.
> EDIT: Well. After putting the CPU back on, should i reset bios? Because i didn't.
> 
> Edit2:
> clock bios cpuz
> 4.5 1.315 1.308
> 4.6 1.35 1.344
> 4.7 1.4 1.392
> 
> That's from testing last night.


yea, i asked about the xmp profile, because i had some problems running it when i oced,
then they told me to leave it at auto, and i just puty in the 16x multi, after i was done ocing,
i tried to use the xmp profile again, got it to work now..
you could always try right








dont think you need to reset bios after getting cpu out , and putting it in again,
but sometimes i just like to start over with a oc, and do a clear cmos,
done all settings so many times now, takes just a few min to do a oc..

a while ago someone said to me, dont lower cpu pll with higher oc's, leave as is, 1.8V or auto..
it _can_ make a oc stable, and lower temps a bit, but thats not our worry anymore so ..

looking at testresults from last nite,
you might hit max when you do 4.8ghz, prolly close to 1.5V vcore to get it stable,
my chip isnt a very good one either, but can run 4.8ghz 1.420V vcore 24H prime stable,
need about 1.510V vcore for 4.9ghz..


----------



## crislink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Do you guys think I should delid my 3570k?
> I'm running the new H100i on a P8Z77-V Pro board and i got up to 4.6Ghz on 1.216v and I know it can do 4.8Ghz on 1.296v only it gets a tad hot then under max stress... As in 77-87-85-81 during LinX... Prime95 is about 2-3c less but still...
> Is the combination of H100i + P8Z77-V Pro usable delidded? Or only with the IHS back on so I can just change the paste..


sorry for intromission, but i cannot reply due to private messages limitations.
Please send me another way to communicate by PM


----------



## ivanlabrie

Feniks, I'd say you should do some research on the way timings and subs react to each other. Ram ocing is more a matter of thorough research and testing of a gazillion combinations of timings and clocks more than voltages. I've gone up to 1.9v on bbse sticks btw, 1.7v is baby vdimm lol just don't go over 1.2v vccio and 1.15v vccsa and use 1.7v if your ram is rated for 1.65v it's nothing really.
There's a good ram ocing guide at overclockers.com, check it out


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Feniks, I'd say you should do some research on the way timings and subs react to each other. Ram ocing is more a matter of thorough research and testing of a gazillion combinations of timings and clocks more than voltages. I've gone up to 1.9v on bbse sticks btw, 1.7v is baby vdimm lol just don't go over 1.2v vccio and 1.15v vccsa and use 1.7v if your ram is rated for 1.65v it's nothing really.
> There's a good ram ocing guide at overclockers.com, check it out


ivan ramboss in da house ...lol ..hey bud


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I've gone up to 1.9v on bbse sticks btw, 1.7v is baby vdimm lol just don't go over 1.2v vccio and 1.15v vccsa and use 1.7v if your ram is rated for 1.65v it's nothing really.
> There's a good ram ocing guide at overclockers.com, check it out


Sin0822 posted this.










Not sure if this chart was made with delidding in mind.


----------



## Hokies83

Whee just Snagged Gtx 570 for 75$


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Whee just Snagged Gtx 570 for 75$


I would have snagged 3-4 of them if I were u


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*


until last night the 1408 was the latest for my board. incredible that before going to sleep I reposted my problem on ASUS ROG forums and HiVizMan (mod over there) forwarded it to ASUS ROG team for review ... lo and behold, they released a new BIOS today! 1501:
http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1155/Maximus_V_Extreme/#download
incredible! with EVGA it was taking months (or never) to get BIOS issues fixed...

will give it a shot tonight.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I do have to use a higher vcore on offset mode. Also, the vcore in offset more is not stable, goes up more. Kinda weird. but when is in idle, drops nicely.


yeah, I usually needed a few nothces higher vcore in offset mode vs fixed, but usually not more than 4 notches up ... at 5GHz it called for like 0.060V more ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Feniks, I'd say you should do some research on the way timings and subs react to each other. Ram ocing is more a matter of thorough research and testing of a gazillion combinations of timings and clocks more than voltages. I've gone up to 1.9v on bbse sticks btw, 1.7v is baby vdimm lol just don't go over 1.2v vccio and 1.15v vccsa and use 1.7v if your ram is rated for 1.65v it's nothing really.
> There's a good ram ocing guide at overclockers.com, check it out


yeah, I need to do the homework on subs for my sticks, but for that I just contact Mushkin technician and he fills me in







however he usually says to stick to automatic board sub-timings if sticks are compatible with the platform.
will get there, once I get 5GHz stable on offsets. it's no priority now since my problems happen ONLY with CPU in offset mode AND at 5GHz clock, and it has nothing to do with memory at this point.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> owyeah, i felt the same ...lol
> still have to laugh, when i beat up watercoolers etc tempwise..lol, with my simple mugen 2
> 
> running IBT, 4.9ghz hottest core 76C ! ..hahaha..


Wow your chip is like identical to mine. I just need 1.395 for stable in bios i guess you need 1.4? Anyway, my idle is 23-28 with no speed step, 55c max hottest core, water ftw


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would have snagged 3-4 of them if I were u


LoL it needs Repair artifacts during game play.

On a side note my Idle temps have went up 10 c and load temps 5c..

I think i have a fan that has quit running.. but with out use of my Right arm im not gonna be able to mess with it for atleast another week.

Cores 1-3 idling 43-45c core 4 49c
before cores 1-3 were 32 = 35 c and core 4 was 39c.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL it needs Repair artifacts during game play.
> On a side note my Idle temps have went up 10 c and load temps 5c..
> I think i have a fan that has quit running.. but with out use of my Right arm im not gonna be able to mess with it for atleast another week.
> Cores 1-3 idling 43-45c core 4 49c
> before cores 1-3 were 32 = 35 c and core 4 was 39c.


Sorry to hear that. Try to underclock a bit or I hope you get warranty transfer and have an old card to hold you over.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Sorry to hear that. Try to underclock a bit or I hope you get warranty transfer and have an old card to hold you over.


I buy and fix Gpu's this is for fixing and resaling i use gtx 680s.

Buy for 75$ fix resale for 155$


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Wow your chip is like identical to mine. I just need 1.395 for stable in bios i guess you need 1.4? Anyway, my idle is 23-28 with no speed step, 55c max hottest core, water ftw


theres a difference between running IBT etc, and have it 24H prime stable,
i can do benches with lower vcore, no problem.
if i want to make 4.9ghz 24H prime stable, i need about 1.510V vcore








4.8ghz with 1.420V vcore is 24H prime stable,
i dont have the best oc-er i know, but its not a "bad" chip ..lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> theres a difference between running IBT etc, and have it 24H prime stable,
> i can do benches with lower vcore, no problem.
> if i want to make 4.9ghz 24H prime stable, i need about 1.510V vcore
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.8ghz with 1.420V vcore is 24H prime stable,
> i dont have the best oc-er i know, but its not a "bad" chip ..lol


im prime 95 stable for 10min, all ive tried lol. 24hours is useless for me, never crashed rendering, gaming, compressing, or folding.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> until last night the 1408 was the latest for my board. incredible that before going to sleep I reposted my problem on ASUS ROG forums and HiVizMan (mod over there) forwarded it to ASUS ROG team for review ... lo and behold, they released a new BIOS today! 1501:
> http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1155/Maximus_V_Extreme/#download
> incredible! with EVGA it was taking months (or never) to get BIOS issues fixed...
> will give it a shot tonight.
> yeah, I usually needed a few nothces higher vcore in offset mode vs fixed, but usually not more than 4 notches up ... at 5GHz it called for like 0.060V more ...
> yeah, I need to do the homework on subs for my sticks, but for that I just contact Mushkin technician and he fills me in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> however he usually says to stick to automatic board sub-timings if sticks are compatible with the platform.
> will get there, once I get 5GHz stable on offsets. it's no priority now since my problems happen ONLY with CPU in offset mode AND at 5GHz clock, and it has nothing to do with memory at this point.


Great! Nice that Mushkin does that for you lol Never tried contacting Gskill or Samsung xD
I normally ask a friend from OCF (Woomack) or our local guru Tapakah/Sam_ocx, or Luke at the ocn ram addict club.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> im prime 95 stable for 10min, all ive tried lol. 24hours is useless for me, never crashed rendering, gaming, compressing, or folding.


I'd still give a small fft's or custom blend with 90% ram size and test duration=5min for 30min and 6 hours respectively...but to each his own.








As Hokies would say Borderlands 2 gives your cpu a heck of a workout lol. Some say Cinebench does too but I haven't tested it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> until last night the 1408 was the latest for my board. incredible that before going to sleep I reposted my problem on ASUS ROG forums and HiVizMan (mod over there) forwarded it to ASUS ROG team for review ... lo and behold, they released a new BIOS today! 1501:
> http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1155/Maximus_V_Extreme/#download
> incredible! with EVGA it was taking months (or never) to get BIOS issues fixed...
> will give it a shot tonight.
> yeah, I usually needed a few nothces higher vcore in offset mode vs fixed, but usually not more than 4 notches up ... at 5GHz it called for like 0.060V more ...
> yeah, I need to do the homework on subs for my sticks, but for that I just contact Mushkin technician and he fills me in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> however he usually says to stick to automatic board sub-timings if sticks are compatible with the platform.
> will get there, once I get 5GHz stable on offsets. it's no priority now since my problems happen ONLY with CPU in offset mode AND at 5GHz clock, and it has nothing to do with memory at this point.


Great! Nice that Mushkin does that for you lol Never tried contacting Gskill or Samsung xD
I normally ask a friend from OCF (Woomack) or our local guru Tapakah/Sam_ocx, or Luke at the ocn ram addict club.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> im prime 95 stable for 10min, all ive tried lol. 24hours is useless for me, never crashed rendering, gaming, compressing, or folding.


I'd still give a small fft's or custom blend with 90% ram size and test duration=5min for 30min and 6 hours respectively...but to each his own.








As Hokies would say Borderlands 2 gives your cpu a heck of a workout lol. Some say Cinebench does too but I haven't tested it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> im prime 95 stable for 10min, all ive tried lol. 24hours is useless for me, never crashed rendering, gaming, compressing, or folding.


wauw, you did a whole 10 min run ..nice ...LOL
if data is very important to you, then i would suggest to do a at least 18H, optimal 24H prime run,
i think folding is important that way right?
theres more to instability then only crashes, data corruption is another for one ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd still give a small fft's or custom blend with 90% ram size and test duration=5min for 30min and 6 hours respectively...but to each his own.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As Hokies would say Borderlands 2 gives your cpu a heck of a workout lol. Some say Cinebench does too but I haven't tested it.


cinebench works for me too,
what do you mean with , "5min for 30min and 6 hours respectively" ?
how do you set that up, is it about the same as the longer prime runs, but shorter timewise?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wauw, you did a whole 10 min run ..nice ...LOL
> if data is very important to you, then i would suggest to do a at least 18H, optimal 24H prime run,
> i think folding is important that way right?
> theres more to instability then only crashes, data corruption is another for one ..


The only data that would suck to lose is if I was working on a paper and didn't save and it crashed, but word always has the recover feature. As for data corruption, almost everything coded well should have a return() command which would automatically stop the program if a value anything different than 0/1 came, which would basically be caused by a ram/cpu read/write error. For every oc i've ever done, on other chips as well including AMD, a 15min prime 95 of blend and small ftt's has never let me down in ANYTHING that used 100% cpu.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> cinebench works for me too,
> what do you mean with , "5min for 30min and 6 hours respectively" ?
> how do you set that up, is it about the same as the longer prime runs, but shorter timewise?


I mean set the test duration to 5 minutes, and run that custom blend for 6 hours, running all the tests but with a third of the 18hs duration.


----------



## Valgaur

Slept for only 13 hours and this is what happens when I leave you rambunksious group here without guidance?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Delidding is not just about the extra OC ability, and it's not just about the much better temps - even though those are great things it does do.
> Delidding is a blast just to do! It's fun and an accomplishment worth doing on it's own rights that also comes with extra OC'ing and temp abilities!


Exactly. It's about getting to know you chip more and have a more personal feel to your build than other do.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> You better believe him
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Never thought it'd be so much fun beforehand, but it really is a huge thrill!











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> +1 for that.. It took me 3 hours to lap and assemble my pc back together yesterday, but was worth every second. Couldn't be happier with the results.











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Valgaur, would you please update my info in the first page, please? It's on post #4325


I was asleep fool and yup updated.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> UPDATE:
> OCN name: Chris-br
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Pro
> lapped ihs-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 0
> Running @4,5 still, will go higher later
> Temp drops: 25/30c
> 
> I was hitting 90c on the middle cors with my ambient temps being 28c like right now.
> EDIT: Also forgot to say that i did apply to the GPU also, I'm got a 15c drop in max temp. VERY happy


I said Updated!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Do you guys think I should delid my 3570k?
> I'm running the new H100i on a P8Z77-V Pro board and i got up to 4.6Ghz on 1.216v and I know it can do 4.8Ghz on 1.296v only it gets a tad hot then under max stress... As in 77-87-85-81 during LinX... Prime95 is about 2-3c less but still...
> Is the combination of H100i + P8Z77-V Pro usable delidded? Or only with the IHS back on so I can just change the paste..


Thats an amazing chip. I'd delid it honestly. you coudl egt some crazy lower temps with great clocks.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> heh, i did a 4.7 run last night @ 1,404v (yeah i know is high, but still unstable, getting WHEA erros) and temps never got to the 65 mark yet.
> Oh yeah, update my info please Valgaur.


I said yes!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> until last night the 1408 was the latest for my board. incredible that before going to sleep I reposted my problem on ASUS ROG forums and HiVizMan (mod over there) forwarded it to ASUS ROG team for review ... lo and behold, they released a new BIOS today! 1501:
> http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1155/Maximus_V_Extreme/#download
> incredible! with EVGA it was taking months (or never) to get BIOS issues fixed...
> will give it a shot tonight.
> yeah, I usually needed a few nothces higher vcore in offset mode vs fixed, but usually not more than 4 notches up ... at 5GHz it called for like 0.060V more ...
> yeah, I need to do the homework on subs for my sticks, but for that I just contact Mushkin technician and he fills me in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> however he usually says to stick to automatic board sub-timings if sticks are compatible with the platform.
> will get there, once I get 5GHz stable on offsets. it's no priority now since my problems happen ONLY with CPU in offset mode AND at 5GHz clock, and it has nothing to do with memory at this point.


Yeah Thats ASUS for ya. I was updating last ngith and lo and behold they made an update yesterday lol. It's like they knew I had issues.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> im prime 95 stable for 10min, all ive tried lol. 24hours is useless for me, never crashed rendering, gaming, compressing, or folding.


If you can fold your stable. You can trust me on that.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wauw, you did a whole 10 min run ..nice ...LOL
> if data is very important to you, then i would suggest to do a at least 18H, optimal 24H prime run,
> i think folding is important that way right?
> theres more to instability then only crashes, data corruption is another for one ..


Folding stresses the CPU much more differently than prime does. it uses many different cycles and makes an even more complex blend than prime does.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> cinebench works for me too,
> what do you mean with , "5min for 30min and 6 hours respectively" ?
> how do you set that up, is it about the same as the longer prime runs, but shorter timewise?


No idea man.









I love EVGA's driver updates. Crazy game boostrs about every 1.5 weeks. I love them helps my HWbot scores as well. I keep getting higher marks every time I run them.

http://www.geforce.com/whats-new/articles/nvidia-geforce-310-70-drivers-released


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I'll install those whql drivers once I get the board here...you'll have some competition ahead Val







Watch out!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Slept for only 13 hours and this is what happens when I leave you rambunksious group here without guidance?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. It's about getting to know you chip more and have a more personal feel to your build than other do.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was asleep fool and yup updated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I said Updated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats an amazing chip. I'd delid it honestly. you coudl egt some crazy lower temps with great clocks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I said yes!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah Thats ASUS for ya. I was updating last ngith and lo and behold they made an update yesterday lol. It's like they knew I had issues.
> If you can fold your stable. You can trust me on that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Folding stresses the CPU much more differently than prime does. it uses many different cycles and makes an even more complex blend than prime does.
> No idea man.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love EVGA's driver updates. Crazy game boostrs about every 1.5 weeks. I love them helps my HWbot scores as well. I keep getting higher marks every time I run them.
> http://www.geforce.com/whats-new/articles/nvidia-geforce-310-70-drivers-released


Answer honestly, do you take a deep breath right before you start typing the half page replies LOL.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Answer honestly, do you take a deep breath right before you start typing the half page replies LOL.


Yeah at first I'll hop on and see the 30+ updates and just sigh then I take a deep breath after all of the multi's and then type away lol.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah at first I'll hop on and see the 30+ updates and just sigh then I take a deep breath after all of the multi's and then type away lol.


Active thread = good thread


----------



## ivanlabrie

Epic thread!









btw, have you guys seen the new Crucial 2x8gb Ballistix Tracer LP kit? 1600mhz cl8...I think I'll start reccomending those instead of the crappy Samsung 30nm ram, which isn't even binned as dual channel kits to begin with, and has random ic's with different capabilities in the same stick. (too random to be good)


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I know everyone said this and that about LP, but i still amazed by the temp difference and how well it holds there as i clock up the CPU... Still doing tests... Now i love even more my D14.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> owyeah, i felt the same ...lol
> still have to laugh, when i beat up watercoolers etc tempwise..lol, with my simple mugen 2
> 
> running IBT, 4.9ghz hottest core 76C ! ..hahaha..
Click to expand...

put more ram load and post again XD


----------



## UNOE

You guys can probably help answer this question best. I just put some liquid pro on my 3930K. How long do I have to wait before I fire this thing up ?
When can I site the computer upright again ?
And how long will it take for me to see cooling results ?

Three questions thanks in advance.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> put more ram load and post again XD


sure, running it now, takes a while tho ..lol
did custom with 7gb ram










4.9ghz, 1.4V vcore set in bios, 63-71-71-68C

i notice my Gflops are a bit higher, 2-3 more
is that because i use more ram, or thanks to my new SSD?


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can start it right away, it's just liquid metal...it will behave like mercury and it has no cure time like AS5 f.ex.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UNOE*
> 
> You guys can probably help answer this question best. I just put some liquid pro on my 3930K. How long do I have to wait before I fire this thing up ?
> When can I site the computer upright again ?
> And how long will it take for me to see cooling results ?
> Three questions thanks in advance.


you can fire it up right away, after putting it all back together again








liquid pro has no break in period as far as i know..

edit,
ivan ramninja me..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UNOE*
> 
> You guys can probably help answer this question best. I just put some liquid pro on my 3930K. How long do I have to wait before I fire this thing up ?
> When can I site the computer upright again ?
> And how long will it take for me to see cooling results ?
> Three questions thanks in advance.


It sounds like you are thinking of Indigo Xtreme that stuff takes some fiddling with you get it just right but you will get amazing results with it. but yeah fire that bad boy up man.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UNOE*
> 
> I just put some liquid pro on my 3930K. How long do I have to wait before I fire this thing up ?


You can do so straight away







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UNOE*
> 
> When can I site the computer upright again ?


As soon as you've reassembled everything again ^^
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UNOE*
> 
> And how long will it take for me to see cooling results ?


You should see instant temperature improvements









Grats on your CL Liquid Pro, hope your temps drop nicely


----------



## VonDutch

looks like this page answered his questions, like 5x!! ....LOL


----------



## UNOE

Thanks guys this thread has 100's of post everytime. I look at it I knew you guys would know. I have a 3770K on the way as well might be January though before I delid got it through a promotion, that's why shipping lagged. thanks and plus rep to all

Edit : Fired up now !

I expected about 2c-3c drop looks about 8c-12c drop this is awesome.

Off to try higher clocks...


----------



## ivanlabrie

NP man! Glad to help out fellow ocers...A friend might get those Intel Retail Edge deals next year, so I may get a couple of Haswell chips or gazillions of 3770k's lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> NP man! Glad to help out fellow ocers...A friend might get those Intel Retail Edge deals next year, so I may get a couple of Haswell chips or gazillions of 3770k's lol


Eh Hem.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

And all of those will be mineeee to bin







muehehehe


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Epic thread!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> btw, have you guys seen the new Crucial 2x8gb Ballistix Tracer LP kit? 1600mhz cl8...I think I'll start reccomending those instead of the crappy Samsung 30nm ram, which isn't even binned as dual channel kits to begin with, and has random ic's with different capabilities in the same stick. (too random to be good)


I have been eyeballing that kit for about 3 weeks a Neweggg since it first came out. I haven't seen any reviews on it or anyone over clocking it. Looks promising though.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Check the link with the review I posted at the ram addict club...seems decent for regular 24/7 rigs.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Great! Nice that Mushkin does that for you lol Never tried contacting Gskill or Samsung xD
> I normally ask a friend from OCF (Woomack) or our local guru Tapakah/Sam_ocx, or Luke at the ocn ram addict club.
> I'd still give a small fft's or custom blend with 90% ram size and test duration=5min for 30min and 6 hours respectively...but to each his own.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As Hokies would say Borderlands 2 gives your cpu a heck of a workout lol. Some say Cinebench does too but I haven't tested it.


yeah, Mushkin has good forums and mostly one Tech (Sean) over there who helps people who registered and posted a question







I could also call him up during business hours and talk, but I don't bother hehe. they tested lots of configs in house and help figuring out things, ebcause stuff like platform/BIOS incompatibility happens very frequently, especially on new platforms with immature BIOSes (Evga z77 ftw BIOS is still in infancy phase) ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah Thats ASUS for ya. I was updating last ngith and lo and behold they made an update yesterday lol. It's like they knew I had issues.
> 
> I love EVGA's driver updates. Crazy game boostrs about every 1.5 weeks. I love them helps my HWbot scores as well. I keep getting higher marks every time I run them.
> http://www.geforce.com/whats-new/articles/nvidia-geforce-310-70-drivers-released


LOL! watch out, they read your mind!








TBH, I I had a thread in asus rog forums about last 2 revisions causing stability problems and there was a bunch of other peiple also complaining on stuff since those new BIOSes (compatible with new feature: ROG Exchange) appeared... hopefully they finally fixed it, can't wait to test it out!

Hey, have you tested 310.70 beta yet? I am about to load it up tonight too, hoping for some performance improvements. some people reporting serious FPS increase at same clocks (and certain games of course).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> And all of those will be mineeee to bin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> muehehehe


I'll buy a few for no extra charge, hows that sounds.


----------



## chris-br

Here what happens.

At 1,4v stable on prime but with WHEA errors

It does pass on IBT standard test. But on prime gives me those erros, plus, IBT vcore drops alot on Prime stays doesn't.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll buy a few for no extra charge, hows that sounds.


Ha! we got a deal (?) ... NOT!








Hey Val, do me a favor, there's a guy at fleabay selling some awesome psc sticks for 35 bucks lol, I was about to buy them but cancelled...buy those before I repent lol
Check my pm out...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Here what happens.
> At 1,4v stable on prime but with WHEA errors
> It does pass on IBT standard test. But on prime gives me those erros, plus, IBT vcore drops alot on Prime stays doesn't.


IBT is not good as a stability test by itself...you should slowly bump vcore notch by notch till you have NO whea errors.


----------



## chris-br

yeah, that is what I am doing but 1,400v for 4,7 oc is a little too much. dont you think? I do have internal CPU PLL overvoltage enabled, all power saving option disabled. LLC on turbo.

BTW, prime is still running using 90% of the ram and doing 5 min for 21 minutes already. The weird is that the errors did stop after a little while


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ha! we got a deal (?) ... NOT!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Val, do me a favor, there's a guy at fleabay selling some awesome psc sticks for 35 bucks lol, I was about to buy them but cancelled...buy those before I repent lol
> Check my pm out...
> IBT is not good as a stability test by itself...you should slowly bump vcore notch by notch till you have NO whea errors.


again they are gone.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> again they are gone.....


Nope, they are not...I bought them, but cancelled. I know he still has them and was about to relist them, so message him. $35 is a steal for 2133 cl9-11-9-27-1t 1.65v ram lol


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks like this page answered his questions, like 5x!! ....LOL


Passive agressive question answering ^^
But really, this thread is just filled with helpful people


----------



## chris-br

Got no erros @1,405v.







But temps are not a problem.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Got no erros @1,405v.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But temps are not a problem.


There's nothing wrong with that. You just got a chip that needs more juice than others (like mine) As long as your temps are good and your system is completely stable you've done a good job


----------



## chris-br

Yeah. highest core is hitting the 64c mark.








I may be able to get 4,9 OC.

EDIT: How high can i go on the vcore?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nope, they are not...I bought them, but cancelled. I know he still has them and was about to relist them, so message him. $35 is a steal for 2133 cl9-11-9-27-1t 1.65v ram lol


Keep me in mind when you're passing up on good memory finds you come across too, I'm still looking for better PSC & BBSE kits!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I need to resist the urge to buy more ram, haven't even tested my current psc kit lol And I have an un tested bbdg kit, and a 2x2gb 7-7-7-24-1t 1.65v black ripjaws kit (not sure on ic) and a samsung 30nm kit lol


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> sure, running it now, takes a while tho ..lol
> did custom with 7gb ram
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.9ghz, 1.4V vcore set in bios, 63-71-71-68C
> i notice my Gflops are a bit higher, 2-3 more
> is that because i use more ram, or thanks to my new SSD?


You have 16gb? Put 14000 on custom XD


----------



## feniks

a pity those PSC sticks are always 2GB modules ... (2x2GB is too low for me) ... will try maxing out my Hynix sticks further, now back to BIOS upgrade and 5GHz offset hehe, wish me luck!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> sure, running it now, takes a while tho ..lol
> did custom with 7gb ram
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.9ghz, 1.4V vcore set in bios, 63-71-71-68C
> i notice my Gflops are a bit higher, 2-3 more
> is that because i use more ram, or thanks to my new SSD?


I just don't get how you are getting those temps on air... Thats like 20 degrees lower than me at the same vcore and I have a better cooler.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I just don't get how you are getting those temps on air... Thats like 20 degrees lower than me at the same vcore and I have a better cooler.


my ihs must be concave


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I just don't get how you are getting those temps on air... Thats like 20 degrees lower than me at the same vcore and I have a better cooler.


yeah and what's your ambient temps at?







his computer is located in a cold hallway


----------



## ivanlabrie

His ambient temps are really LOW and chilly, he's in Holland and his hall has some wicked old air from outside all the time.


----------



## Khaled G

ADD ME !!!

OCN Name: Khaled G
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Cooler Master Thermal Fusion 400
IHS-TIM: Cooler Master Thermal Fusion 400
MHz Gained: Not Tested yet.
OC After Delid: Not Tested Yet.
Temp Drops: 10°C , IBT (From 95 to 85, 4.6 GHz/1.29v/1.5 PLL)
Max OC: Not attemped yet.

I will Update this post later with all necessary data.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> His ambient temps are really LOW and chilly, he's in Holland and his hall has some wicked old air from outside all the time.


Old air?? whats that?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Old air?? whats that?


You know, when you are old the air around you rots fast...lmao

I meant cold man xD

EDIT: and man, sell that crappy overpriced board of yours and get either an MVG/MVF or an Asrock OC Formula like a real bencher


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You know, when you are old the air around you rots fast...lmao
> I meant cold man xD
> EDIT: and man, sell that crappy overpriced board of yours and get either an MVG/MVF or an Asrock OC Formula like a real bencher


shut up lol


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You know, when you are old the air around you rots fast...lmao
> I meant cold man xD
> EDIT: and man, sell that crappy overpriced board of yours and get either an MVG/MVF or an Asrock OC Formula like a real bencher


In his boards defense.. With what he has put that board through.. The fact that it still posts absolutely amazes me. I think you should buy a frame for it and put it on your wall.. Then buy a UP7


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> a pity those PSC sticks are always 2GB modules ... (2x2GB is too low for me) ... will try maxing out my Hynix sticks further, now back to BIOS upgrade and 5GHz offset hehe, wish me luck!


Have different kits, if doing something that needs more memory put in the bigger kit, if benching, use a fast kit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> In his boards defense.. With what he has put that board through.. The fact that it still posts absolutely amazes me. I think you should buy a frame for it and put it on your wall.. Then buy a UD7


That's what you do with a board when it dies, no frame, just nail it to a wall near the benching station as a warning for the new board to do better.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like the warning idea lol
And yeah, I favor the multi ram kit approach lol, or multi rig, or whatever...but well, we're sick ftw.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks like this page answered his questions, like 5x!! ....LOL
> 
> 
> 
> Passive agressive question answering ^^
> But really, this thread is just filled with helpful people
Click to expand...

Yeah, this thread does have lots of good helpful people - and it posts tons of messages! I'm always trying to keep up when I can't keep on it!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, I need to resist the urge to buy more ram, haven't even tested my current psc kit lol And I have an un tested bbdg kit, and a 2x2gb 7-7-7-24-1t 1.65v black ripjaws kit (not sure on ic) and a samsung 30nm kit lol


Maybe you should talk to someone about this issue of yours....LOL








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I just don't get how you are getting those temps on air... Thats like 20 degrees lower than me at the same vcore and I have a better cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> my ihs must be concave
Click to expand...

I think you should check that out, as that was my problem. Lapping got me an additional 12C as my IHS ended up being concave. I would encourage you to consider it bro.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> In his boards defense.. With what he has put that board through.. The fact that it still posts absolutely amazes me. I think you should buy a frame for it and put it on your wall.. Then buy a UP7


I'm gopnna run this oard until it either blows up or melts. one on the two, I will get the mve eventually but once I get Ln2 that is.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm gopnna run this oard until it either blows up or melts. one on the two, I will get the mve eventually but once I get Ln2 that is.


Ln2 is for noobs who want bad cooling. Get Liquid Helium instead


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah, this thread does have lots of good helpful people - and it posts tons of messages! I'm always trying to keep up when I can't keep on it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe you should talk to someone about this issue of yours....LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you should check that out, as that was my problem. Lapping got me an additional 12C as my IHS ended up being concave. I would encourage you to consider it bro.


12C for lapping the IHS? wow! I only got 3C lapping mine. Maybe I need to redo mine. lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ln2 is for noobs who want bad cooling. Get Liquid Helium instead


Ln2 is cheap He is crazy expensive from just the piping and tanks and everything.


----------



## ivanlabrie

He must be joking lol doubt he's ever seen some frost besides his fridge









Anyway, man, so bored at work








No new 5.2ghz+ ocs?


----------



## Arm3nian

He is quite colder than ln2, close to absolute 0. and no I havnt seen He but I have gotten my hand burned by alcohol with different solvents lit on fire. there were colorful flames all over my hand







I would not use that to cool my cpu though lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Have different kits, if doing something that needs more memory put in the bigger kit, if benching, use a fast kit.
> That's what you do with a board when it dies, no frame, just nail it to a wall near the benching station as a warning for the new board to do better.


Hahaha, great idea. Can't say I've killed any boards yet. *Touchwood*


----------



## ivanlabrie

Multi coloured flames ftw lol specially on your hands
















You need portal on a ti-83 calc now...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm gopnna run this oard until it either blows up or melts. one on the two, I will get the mve eventually but once I get Ln2 that is.


Green Hornet needs a g 1 sniper 3.


----------



## ivanlabrie

And VonDutch is Kato? lol

I doubt the g1 sniper 3 is a better benching board, specially for ram.


----------



## ripsaw

Is there anywhere in North America currently selling Liquid Pro? It is Liquid 'Pro' and not 'Ultra', correct? I can't seem to find any in stock anywhere in Canada/US. Any thoughts? Thanx in advance


----------



## ivanlabrie

As usual, I'm gonna have to reccomend Sidewindercomputers.com lol
They should send me some free LP man, they really should.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> And VonDutch is Kato? lol
> I doubt the g1 sniper 3 is a better benching board, specially for ram.


Price per performance can not be beat..

If u want a benching board get a Up7


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> As usual, I'm gonna have to reccomend Sidewindercomputers.com lol
> They should send me some free LP man, they really should.


Yes, i checked them, out of stock but i requested email notification when back in. Nobody seems to have stock


----------



## ivanlabrie

Oh, too bad man...sorry!









And Hokies, haven't seen much done on the UP7 and it costs a gazillion bucks (feel free to buy me one!







)
I feel more comfortable reccomending a known performer for half the price.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Yes, i checked them, out of stock but i requested email notification when back in. Nobody seems to have stock


http://www.frozencpu.com/

go there thats where I got mine.

and for the mobo the MVE is what I'm going to get as my benchers board mainly for the Ln2 abilities I don't give a crap about appearance I truly don't. performance is what I need and my mobo has the balls and the chest hair to do so and has many features that I want without having to get a server board. It's the ease of server motherboardness this one has that made me sold on it. Yes the sniper is good but not the best for a bencher. I can't be limited by a board or else iot will limit everything else, especially while everything is all balls to the wall and screaming for me to stop pouring Ln2 over it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Oh, too bad man...sorry!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And Hokies, haven't seen much done on the UP7 and it costs a gazillion bucks (feel free to buy me one!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> I feel more comfortable reccomending a known performer for half the price.


From reviews the Up7 Destroys the MVe in everyway there is no contest.. It even has Built in LN2 overclocking features...

MVE is not much better then the G1 Sniper 3.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858 369$ + 12$ shipping

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569&Tpk=up7 399$ + 8$ shipping

No Contest.

Ask Sib0822 about it.. I even asked him..

He said other then afew over clocking features the MVE has that the G1 Sniper 3 was the better board..

So by the love of god what do u think about the UP7 lmao.

31 phases
Vs
32+3+2

Up7 is king for a reason.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol No need for the MVE though, but it's not too badly priced. The MVG can do 95% of what the MVE can, and so can MVF.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I know a few people that would reccomend the MVG from a price/performance standpoint, and next the OC Formula, but if you have money to spare try both the UP7 and MVE...Gigabyte has some quirks with ram and their bios are more limited, ROG bios has some really useful features for benching. For regular use I'd go with an up board though. Warranties are nice!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol No need for the MVE though, but it's not too badly priced. The MVG can do 95% of what the MVE can, and so can MVF.


G1 Sniper 3 can do 99% of the MVE and is 260$

MVe is more like 85% of the UP7....


----------



## Valgaur

thats why I like the MVE it has all the bios features I am already used to.


----------



## ripsaw

So is there any difference between liquid pro and liquid ultra?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> thats why I like the MVE it has all the bios features I am already used to.


Meh don't noob up..

I can Use an Asus Bios a Gigabyte bios an Asrock Bios and Msi Bios... common sense bro..

There is a reason Gigabyte is Number 1 MB maker in the world and Asus is number 2...

They build a better product at a better price plain and simple... So if the UP7 is 399$ means if Asus was to make something equal to it they would want 469$ for it heh.

Ive owned them all i knows









Put it this way i was already to buy a MVE.. " my Build themes are always red and black..... Talked to SIn he told me the DL on what was up with both.. seen i could save over 100$ well boys i got a full red / black theme with a black / green MB @[email protected]


----------



## ivanlabrie

Lol








Still, you don't have as many timings and ram stuff to tweak with GB bioses...that's the weak link. And even the MVG does more than enough without having the uber awesome up7 vrm.
Anyway, I won't hesitate to buy any brand if they deliver the goods, but for now the top scores are all on asus/asrock, most of them at least...except for some max clocks stuff, but I'll never be able to compete on that front.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still, you don't have as many timings and ram stuff to tweak with GB bioses...that's the weak link. And even the MVG does more than enough without having the uber awesome up7 vrm.
> Anyway, I won't hesitate to buy any brand if they deliver the goods, but for now the top scores are all on asus/asrock, most of them at least...except for some max clocks stuff, but I'll never be able to compete on that front.


Up7 is new...









Also ive Owned a Rog board i know what the Bios looks like..

Gigabyte bios has a ton of settings for ram in it.. and Better Vrms...

Isa been doing this for 18 years yo









Giga Won X58 X68 and with the UP7 clearly wins Z77....

G1 Sniper 3 Vs MVE Your losing more options then your gaining honestly all u gain with the MVe is better LN2 support...

G 1 Sniper 3 has a 150$ Audio card on it and is 260$ @[email protected]


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah, this thread does have lots of good helpful people - and it posts tons of messages! I'm always trying to keep up when I can't keep on it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe you should talk to someone about this issue of yours....LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you should check that out, as that was my problem. Lapping got me an additional 12C as my IHS ended up being concave. I would encourage you to consider it bro.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 12C for lapping the IHS? wow! I only got 3C lapping mine. Maybe I need to redo mine. lol
Click to expand...

Yep. 12C. But my IHS was very concave. If yours was not, then your 3C gain was typical - and still worth it!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> As usual, I'm gonna have to reccomend Sidewindercomputers.com lol
> They should send me some free LP man, they really should.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, i checked them, out of stock but i requested email notification when back in. Nobody seems to have stock
Click to expand...

I'm with *ivanlabrie* in recommending sidewinders. I do not think they will be out of stock for long either.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> So is there any difference between liquid pro and liquid ultra?


Both are very good and what most of us use and recommend other deliders use. CL PRO will cool about 1-3C better than CL Ultra, but is harder to clean and remove if/when you need to do so.


----------



## King4x4

The G1.Sniper 3 is a beast!

Non-Lidded 3770k with Custom Water Cooling on it and I got it to pass Cinebench @ 4.9ghz @ 1.48v

Max core temp was 80'C!

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5120847

http://valid.canardpc.com/2603862


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I just don't get how you are getting those temps on air... Thats like 20 degrees lower than me at the same vcore and I have a better cooler.


guess now you know ..LOL









this was last nite temps

i live up North, near the border, the -2C with the snow..

resulting in this idle temp

thats without opening my frontdoor, -1C at my frontdoor now..

will open my frontdoor for 5 min, then check temps again...lol


after 5 min opening my frontdoor ..haha, how "cool" is that ey








love to see , "Distance to TJ Max 105" ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this was last nite temps
> 
> i live up North, near the border, the -2C with the snow..
> resulting in this idle temp
> 
> thats without opening my frontdoor, -1C at my frontdoor now..
> will open my frontdoor for 5 min, then check temps again...lol


Meh it was 18 C outside here today...

I just hope we get a winter this year last year we had no Winter...

Went Spring ---> Summer ---> fall ---> fall ----> Spring again @[email protected]


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh it was 18 C outside here today...
> I just hope we get a winter this year last year we had no Winter...
> Went Spring ---> Summer ---> fall ---> fall ----> Spring again @[email protected]


we can have winters that are -15 to -20C


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we can have winters that are -15 to -20C


We used to have Winter .. have not had one for 3 years...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still, you don't have as many timings and ram stuff to tweak with GB bioses...that's the weak link.


i think its to many ..lol

for me anyways


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i think its to many ..lol
> 
> for me anyways


LoL i <3 Gigabytes bios.. When u add the Advanced Bios with the 3D bios it is overall an outstanding Bios.

However Gigabytes in Windows Software easy tune 6 does suck ..>


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> You have 16gb? Put 14000 on custom XD


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> sure, running it now, takes a while tho ..lol
> did custom with 7gb ram
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.9ghz, 1.4V vcore set in bios, 63-71-71-68C
> i notice my Gflops are a bit higher, 2-3 more
> is that because i use more ram, or thanks to my new SSD?


i only have 8Gb








used custom 7Gb on that run

o, my coolest core is about 1 or 2C above ambient most of the time


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i think its to many ..lol
> 
> for me anyways


I have the exact same thing on my premium board just looks different. I want the Ln2 support thats what the name BENCH board means. I want cpua nd gpu Ln2 equipment not RAM equipment with the phase changers. Ln2 or nothing is my motto for benching.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I have the exact same thing on my premium board just looks different. I want the Ln2 support thats what the name BENCH board means. I want cpua nd gpu Ln2 equipment not RAM equipment with the phase changers. Ln2 or nothing is my motto for benching.


did you buy that pot a while ago, or went for the ram? i forgot ..
i think my mobo isnt good enough for it, and it limits me to 1.85V vcore max ..grmbl..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> did you buy that pot a while ago, or went for the ram? i forgot ..
> i think my mobo isnt good enough for it, and it limits me to 1.85V vcore max ..grmbl..


I went for the RAM sadly but worth it. the pot I'm gonna have to wait for again sadly. the MVE will be my benching board and the premium will not change as my balls to the wall rig board.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i <3 Gigabytes bios.. When u add the Advanced Bios with the 3D bios it is overall an outstanding Bios.
> However Gigabytes in Windows Software easy tune 6 does suck ..>


yea, i tried the easytune at first, dont understand why they use blck oc..
i could use the autotune feature, but only option 1 and 2, 3 was no go..

i think asus does better, it autotunes more after trial and error right?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I have the exact same thing on my premium board just looks different. I want the Ln2 support thats what the name BENCH board means. I want cpua nd gpu Ln2 equipment not RAM equipment with the phase changers. Ln2 or nothing is my motto for benching.


Then do not go half way in with a MVe go all the way in with The UP7.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1312630/the-gigabyte-z77x-up7-preview-the-oc-board-and-the-ud9-meet/0_20


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Then do not go half way in with a MVe go all the way in with The UP7.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1312630/the-gigabyte-z77x-up7-preview-the-oc-board-and-the-ud9-meet/0_20


currently watching reviews will ake decision later.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Then do not go half way in with a MVe go all the way in with The UP7.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1312630/the-gigabyte-z77x-up7-preview-the-oc-board-and-the-ud9-meet/0_20


360 euro where i live ..omg

MSI Radeon R7970-2PMD3GD5/OC € 330,-
its 1 month old, new prize is € 384,-

thats about 50 euro more then the GB 7950 oc (279 euro) i wanted to buy..
in doubt what to do, did pm the guy tho, first thing i want to know is,
why he sells it ..lol its alot of money for me, but i think i can get another 50 euro if needed


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> guess now you know ..LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this was last nite temps
> 
> i live up North, near the border, the -2C with the snow..
> ..lol




Live in valley between Lismore and Byron Bay that gets hotter than those places...37°C today........and not a drop of rain...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> wz_map_wzdist_n01.jpg 17k .jpg file
> 
> Live in valley that gets hotter than those places...37°C today........


pfft his temps arent even cold I'm at -5C right now lol. windows opena nd blowing air in. not benching either I just love the cold lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> wz_map_wzdist_n01.jpg 17k .jpg file
> 
> Live in valley that gets hotter than those places...37°C today........


we dont even have that (37C) on our hottest summerdays ..lol
last 2 summers we had like 1-3 days that where 35C, thats very hot for our country,
i like cold more then that heat ..pfff rather have -20 then +30 ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> pfft his temps arent even cold I'm at *-5C* right now lol. windows opena nd blowing air in. not benching either *I just love the cold lol.*


Bro
















did you see my new home?


this weekend saterday nite


----------



## Hokies83

Man 32 power phases Heatsinks on the back on board LN2 Switch Onboard overclocking
Sin got 2600mhz ram Overclocked to 3100mhz or so...
10 Layer PCB...

I mean jeez.. it has like 150$ in Phases on it lol.

3D Bios you can Select the areas of the board with your mouse...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we dont even have that (37C) on our hottest summerdays ..lol
> last 2 summers we had like 1-3 days that where 35C, thats very hot for our country,
> i like cold more then that heat ..pfff rather have -20 then +30 ..lol


lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Bro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> did you see my new home?


problem is... I'm not in the chair.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Man 32 power phases Heatsinks on the back on board LN2 Switch Onboard overclocking
> Sin got 2600mhz ram Overclocked to 3100mhz or so...
> 10 Layer PCB...
> I mean jeez.. it has like 150$ in Phases on it lol.
> 3D Bios you can Select the areas of the board with your mouse...


K hokies I like the up7 more mainly from the fact it's a better mve yes shoot ton of features but to me atleast looks like a better mve dual 8 pin like the mve really sold me though. I want Franky to do that golden 2v mark...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol
> problem is... I'm not in the chair.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> K hokies I like the up7 more mainly from the fact it's a better mve yes shoot ton of features but to me atleast looks like a better mve dual 8 pin like the mve really sold me though. I want Franky to do that golden 2v mark...


It is better then the MVE is every way..

UP7 has duel 8 pins to? err yah i just understood the msg 330am im sleepy and on Loratab 10s @[email protected]/


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is better then the MVE is every way..
> UP7 has duel 8 pins to?


Yup. Thats mainly why I want it now. Franky can do 1.98vcore. why not 2vcore lol read sins review or watch his youtube review it's good.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yup. Thats mainly why I want it now. Franky can do 1.98vcore. why not 2vcore lol read sins review or watch his youtube review it's good.


It is pretty much a 499$ board for 399$

So with there only 30$ between the UP7 and the MVe there is no contest.. Unless your an Asus Fan boi...

Anywho im going to sleep.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah, this thread does have lots of good helpful people - and it posts tons of messages! I'm always trying to keep up when I can't keep on it!


went to bed yesterdayeev ,this morning i read through 5-6 pages,
but idm, i always wake up, coffee, then read up on all the posts from last night..lol
if we dont mind its offtopic half the time, its ok with me








the crew can almost answer all questions


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is pretty much a 499$ board for 399$
> So with there only 30$ between the UP7 and the MVe there is no contest.. Unless your an Asus Fan boi...
> Anywho im going to sleep.


Looks over kill to me.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yeah, this thread does have lots of good helpful people - and it posts tons of messages! I'm always trying to keep up when I can't keep on it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> went to bed yesterdayeev ,this morning i read through 5-6 pages,
> but idm, i always wake up, coffee, then read up on all the posts from last night..lol
> if we dont mind its offtopic half the time, its ok with me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the crew can almost answer all questions
Click to expand...

Yep, this morning when I clocked in to the office there were about 68 new posts waiting for me in this thread








Took a while to read through all of them, too


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Yep, this morning when I clocked in to the office there were about 68 new posts waiting for me in this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Took a while to read through all of them, too


i hope for you your boss isnt a ocn member,
you might get into trouble if he reads your post ...lol








o well, at least you have something to read till first break ..hehe


----------



## Leyaena

Well, there's only a handful of Belgian people on OCN, and I sincerely doubt he's one of those.
Mainly because he's *cough* one of those people that think anything that's got a lowercase i tacked to the front of the name automatically is the pinnacle of human technology. I've got nothing against Apple, per se, but the blind faith of their fanboys that whatever product they release is the best you could possibly get, kinda gets on my nerves.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Well, there's only a handful of Belgian people on OCN, and I sincerely doubt he's one of those.
> Mainly because he's *cough* one of those people that think anything that's got a lowercase i tacked to the front of the name automatically is the pinnacle of human technology. I've got nothing against Apple, per se, but the blind faith of their fanboys that whatever product they release is the best you could possibly get, kinda gets on my nerves.


yea, would never buy one for the specs, i mean

iMac 27" Quad-core i5 3.2Ghz

• 27-inch Full-HD LED Display
• 3.2-GHz quad-core intel Core i5 (Turbo boost tot 3.2GHz)
• 8GB 1600-MHz geheugen
• 1TB (5400)harde schijf
• 1GB GDDR5 NVIDIA GeForce GTX 675M Graphics
• FaceTime HD camera

starts at € 2079,00

i can build a supercomp for that kind of money..easy, even with 2x 7950-7970 CF

a wile ago i posted something about,
me riding a Honda Goldwing, and what Harley Davidson riders used to say to me,
"thats not a bike, its japanees" ....lol
guess thats about the same..


----------



## VonDutch

you guys notice how many Q.'s are about CPU-Z not doing the correct readings?
for example,mine only shows max speed..thats why i dont use it ..lol


whats the most common reason?
bios not updated? anything else?


----------



## stickg1

I'm glad I put my worries to rest by checking the voltage manually with a multi-meter. My system has been much more enjoyable knowing that there is nothing wrong with it.

I think I may delid anyway despite having high voltages. My temps are still low for the high voltages though. If Intel did make better die/IHS contact on this batch do you think I should still try to delid? Or just leave her be?

With guys that have delidded the older batches what is the max average overclock for a cooling setup like mine after delid? (Antec Kuhler 620)

I currently have 4.5GHz with max temp of 77C after a few hours of Prime95.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm glad I put my worries to rest by checking the voltage manually with a multi-meter. My system has been much more enjoyable knowing that there is nothing wrong with it.
> I think I may delid anyway despite having high voltages. My temps are still low for the high voltages though. If Intel did make better die/IHS contact on this batch do you think I should still try to delid? Or just leave her be?
> With guys that have delidded the older batches what is the max average overclock for a cooling setup like mine after delid? (Antec Kuhler 620)
> I currently have 4.5GHz with max temp of 77C after a few hours of Prime95.


cant really say that, since every chip is so different,
delidders arent temp limited anymore, but vcore limited,
for example, my max oc would be 4.9ghz at 1.510V vcore,
thats pushing it really to the limit, for me..

4.8ghz at 1.420V vcore is my best..it can run 24/7 ..np,
my daily oc is "only" 4646mhz, 1.305V vcore, still a 25-30% speed gain over stock









your 4.5ghz and 77C hottest core running prime is really good,
you have a golden undelidded chip that way, tempwise,
i hit 105C within seconds running prime at 4.5ghz, before delid,
theres peeps out there that run a better cooler then you,
and have worse temps then you..undelidded that is..

i would say, on average, most delidded ivy's can do 4.7-4.8ghz easy for 24/7 oc's,
at 4.9+ghz most run into problems with (max) vcore,
my chip is a average one..


----------



## stickg1

I'm just worried that since I'm already at 1.37v for 4.5GHz and I know I need 1.4v for 4.6GHz if its even worth it. At 1.4v I hit 85C and I don't feel comfortable getting any hotter than that. I have an old P4 coming in the mail. I'll see how easy it is to delid and decide if it's worth doing for me, even if I keep it at 4.5GHz and just delid to reduce temps.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm just worried that since I'm already at 1.37v for 4.5GHz and I know I need 1.4v for 4.6GHz if its even worth it. At 1.4v I hit 85C and I don't feel comfortable getting any hotter than that. I have an old P4 coming in the mail. I'll see how easy it is to delid and decide if it's worth doing for me, even if I keep it at 4.5GHz and just delid to reduce temps.


yea, i understand your point..
practice on a old pentium will give you great experience, youll see,
i didnt know that back then, im sure i would have gotten a handfull old pentiums first,
since i didnt have money to replace my 3770k when it would go wrong..

if your lucky the jump vcore from 4.6 to 4.7ghz after delid, wont be very much,
i can run 4.6 and 4.7ghz at almost the same vcore/offset, from 4.7 to 4.8 the vcore bump was much more


----------



## chris-br

My problem is not run the higher clocks, i can do 4.7ghz no problems under 1,4v, but to be stable is another issues, i need 1,410v to be stable.


----------



## Gomi

Time to de-lid











(Special thanks to the frozen UPS guy that delivered this!)


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Time to de-lid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Special thanks to the frozen UPS guy that delivered this!)


NICE.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Time to de-lid


Good Luck with the delid Gomi







take youre time with it









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Special thanks to the frozen UPS guy that delivered this!)










yeah, thats not a bad mobo...LOL jk jk


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> My problem is not run the higher clocks, i can do 4.7ghz no problems under 1,4v, but to be stable is another issues, i need 1,410v to be stable.


yep, i can run IBT at 4.9ghz, 1.4V vcore..np

but need about 1.510V vcore to make it (24H) prime stable..

here prime fails after 1.30H, using the same vcore as above


----------



## ivanlabrie

Valgaur, Hokies, I'm gonna reiterate....for 175 or so the MVG is the best benching board for the money.
If you gonna go all out then the UP7 'might' do better, but I haven't seen many results yet so I'd wait before saying it's the second coming z77 wise








Wait a while buy an MVG and a pot for the same money as an mve/up7 and have fun I'd say, then you can sell the mvg and buy an up7 if it does deliver...or maybe sell that p8z77u thing you got and buy the up7 at a loss to compare, maybe do a review lol


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ln2 is for noobs who want bad cooling. Get Liquid Helium instead


LOL. I use liquid helium to keep the liquid nitrogen from evaporating on my NMR. Liquid helium wouldn't make it to the bottom of the pot without evaporating lol


----------



## feniks

LOL, my turn for the super long multi-reply







this thread grows fast haha, I barely keep up!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Have different kits, if doing something that needs more memory put in the bigger kit, if benching, use a fast kit.


Yup, been there done that, I know the drill man








it's just I'm totally broke nowadays, so I am selling all the stuff I don't need to get all the dimes & nickels back in the pocket (read: paying off credit cards debts LOL!). I might get that kit for benching some other time, for now I just am trying to hunt down a good promo on matching 670 for SLI and that completes my build ... until Summer probably.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I like the warning idea lol
> And yeah, I favor the multi ram kit approach lol, or multi rig, or whatever...but well, we're sick ftw.


LOL, true I like too, just not nowadays (CC companies are sucking me dry, need to get back to balance with them fast).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol No need for the MVE though, but it's not too badly priced. The MVG can do 95% of what the MVE can, and so can MVF.


MVE is not that badlu prices if you can get it from US Amazon and have some CC rewards point you can spent over there (they cooperate with Discover if anybody wonders) and use some Amazon gift cards (I get $5 one for free from MS Bing rewards every 2 months or so) ...
... that being said I got my MVE from them at final price of $350 shipped after all my discounts, could have been much lower if I haven't spent the rewards on other stuff before that purchase









I'm just used to big boards with multiple PCIe slots and this time wanted the extra goodies (WiFi, BT, mSATA option, 2 PLX switches on-board, etc.) that come with this board, not to mention ROG OC Key (which I don't normally use, but it works hehe) and such








But by all means MVG is an awesome deal if somebody doesn't mind having 2 PCIe slots, it's perfect!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> thats why I like the MVE it has all the bios features I am already used to.


Yes, I am in same boat now. Those BIOS options in ROG are awesome! especially after they finally implemented stability fixes in latest revisions, all back to normal. I used to use mostly EVGA MB Bioses and those are dull and feel XX century when compared to ROG BIOS that feel like from the future (relatively speaking)








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Bro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> did you see my new home?
> 
> this weekend saterday nite


haha LOL! That's nice








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i hope for you your boss isnt a ocn member,
> you might get into trouble if he reads your post ...lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o well, at least you have something to read till first break ..hehe


shhhh, *i'm in the same boat







... but as far as I know I am the only OCN member around here








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Valgaur, Hokies, I'm gonna reiterate....for 175 or so the MVG is the best benching board for the money.
> If you gonna go all out then the UP7 'might' do better, but I haven't seen many results yet so I'd wait before saying it's the second coming z77 wise
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wait a while buy an MVG and a pot for the same money as an mve/up7 and have fun I'd say, then you can sell the mvg and buy an up7 if it does deliver...or maybe sell that p8z77u thing you got and buy the up7 at a loss to compare, maybe do a review lol


MVG would be my benching board of choice as well! can't go wrong with that tiny (but strong!) bad boy


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Valgaur, Hokies, I'm gonna reiterate....for 175 or so the MVG is the best benching board for the money.
> If you gonna go all out then the UP7 'might' do better, but I haven't seen many results yet so I'd wait before saying it's the second coming z77 wise
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wait a while buy an MVG and a pot for the same money as an mve/up7 and have fun I'd say, then you can sell the mvg and buy an up7 if it does deliver...or maybe sell that p8z77u thing you got and buy the up7 at a loss to compare, maybe do a review lol


Up7 is the 2nd coming you can not compare the UP7 to A mini Atx board lol.

If your gonna Compare that ill Compare the MVG to th UD3H @[email protected]

That's the board people were braking 7ghz on at Ivy's Release.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You're missing the point...MVG has ROG bios and loads of ln2 features as well as gpu hot wiring stuff, and you can also control oc settings either from the board itself via buttons or through a laptop connected to it with a special port it has. Ud3h has none of those bells and whistles, it's just a VERY good all around cheap board with excellent vrm.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You're missing the point...MVG has ROG bios and loads of ln2 features as well as gpu hot wiring stuff, and you can also control oc settings either from the board itself via buttons or through a laptop connected to it with a special port it has. Ud3h has none of those bells and whistles, it's just a VERY good all around cheap board with excellent vrm.


Has Sub Par Vram.. And uh You can Control Any Gigabyte boards Bios Via Tablet..

LoL stop falling for ROG Gimmicks i had one to you know..

Lookie my Ipad 3 it be my Bios  no stupid thing to plug in just An App in the App Store lmao. 

O-O 2 devices at once Even on my 3 yearolds Ipod Touch..




I can overclock my Comp from the Moon if it had wifi heh.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Has Sub Par Vram.. And uh You can Control Any Gigabyte boards Bios Via Tablet..
> LoL stop falling for ROG Gimmicks i had one to you know..
> Lookie my Ipad 3 it be my Bios  no stupid thing to plug in just An App in the App Store lmao.


Uses "Gimmick" in reply...

Shows his Apple product...

trolololol


----------



## Valgaur

I will never own a tablet. Completely useless to me.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Uses "Gimmick" in reply...
> Shows his Apple product...
> trolololol


Ipad = pure win...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I will never own a tablet. Completely useless to me.


Do not knock it till you try it.

I have 3 tablets and i Love them lol


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I will never own a tablet. Completely useless to me.


would you buy a tablet if it could take a 2volt overclock?


----------



## Hokies83

The Tablet completely replaces The HTPC the Handheld gaming garbage things Psp etc..

It also replaces the lowend PC market...

Your local TV provider will have a App where u can watch any show / channel u have with your cable service anywhere on the planet..
Example i have Comcast..



It even has Graf on par with currant gen consoles..


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ipad = pure win...
> Do not knock it till you try it.
> I have 3 tablets and i Love them lol


I'm not saying the ipad sucks, i'm saying apple is all gimmicks lol. -isight, retina, quad core gaming graphics...

I had the new ipad, sold it, it was useless lmao. If I were to get one though I would get the new google one.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I'm not saying the ipad sucks, i'm saying apple is all gimmicks lol. -isight, retina, quad core gaming graphics...
> I had the new ipad, sold it, it was useless lmao. If I were to get one though I would get the new google one.


Heh i have the New ipad the retina Display is the best one out there Atm.. the Ipad 4beat the Nexus 10 pretty hard..
the 2k res screen is just sexy.. and have a Quad core graf processor makes a difference.. Play a Game on an Ipad 2 with duel core graf then on the ipad 3 with quad core.. 100x smoother.

Also i have a Nexus 7... which reviewers said was a better buy then the Nexus 10..

Comparing the Ipad 3 to the Nexus 7 is like comparing an Aveo to a Corvette.
Android seems to have some pretty hardcore Fanbois...

I went into the Tablet Market never using Ios or Android Os... And from using both i hate Androids OS.

And so does my wife.. she wants me to sell her Nexus 7 and get her an Ipad lol...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heh i have the New ipad the retina Display is the best one out there Atm.. the Ipad 4beat the Nexus 10 pretty hard..
> the 2k res screen is just sexy.. and have a Quad core graf processor makes a difference.. Play a Game on an Ipad 2 with duel core graf then on the ipad 3 with quad core.. 100x smoother.
> Also i have a Nexus 7... which reviewers said was a better buy then the Nexus 10..
> Comparing the Ipad 3 to the Nexus 7 is like comparing an Aveo to a Corvette.


The nexus 10 has a higher res screen than the ipad lol. And just like I said, quad core gaming graf is a gimmick. Are you saying that your "quad core" beats my 690 "dual core"? I hope not lol. Its better than the ipad 2 dual core because its the exact same thing just added 2 cores. Also, nexus 7 is 200 while the ipad is 500, so ya it is like comparting an aveo to a corvette because it has the price ratio, remember that. Nexus 10 is 400.

Google play market has nothing wrong with it, it has a more variety of good apps that apple doesn't support. And the old android os's did suck, jelly bean is really nice tho, have it on my phone.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> The nexus 10 has a higher res screen than the ipad lol. And just like I said, quad core gaming graf is a gimmick. Are you saying that your "quad core" beats my 690 "dual core"? I hope not lol. Its better than the ipad 2 dual core because its the exact same thing just added 2 cores. Also, nexus 7 is 200 while the ipad is 500, so ya it is like comparting an aveo to a corvette because it has the price ratio, remember that. Nexus 10 is 400.
> Google play market has nothing wrong with it, it has a more variety of good apps that apple doesn't support. And the old android os's did suck, jelly bean is really nice tho, have it on my phone.


Heh.... You can not compare 2 different types of graffic processors..

The Nexus 10 has higher res screen but it looks like crap.... When compared The Ipads screen brighter better colors better blacks..

Also... Nexus7 is 229$ my Ipad 3 was 375$ Refurb from Apple with 1 year warranty.. Cheaper and better then the Nexus 10 by a long shot.

And Take note it cost Apple 300$ to make a 16gb Ipad 3.. so getting it for 375$ shipped um yah...

Apples games / Apps are all designed just for the Ipad.. Android has 1000000 different devices none are designed for just 1 tablet..

My Ipad has 5ghz Wifi.. Nexus 7 2.4ghz.. i can stream movies with no stops.. my wife has to wait and let them load on her Nexus 7 @[email protected]

Android is price per performance of tablets kinda like amd..

Apple ur getting the best but it costs more..like Intel.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys so much OT goodness! lol

Hokies, come on!!! I won't buy a friggin Ipad to oc my comp lol Any cheapy laptop should do xD
And sub par vrm my...you know what.







Tell that to an Extreme 4 owner.

As for the tablet thing, no way in hell it can beat the GLORY that is a PSP man, you obviously never had one. Check my sig buddy








Go play Monster Hunter Freedom Unite and then compare that to them crappy Android/iOs crappy games with horrid touch controls.

Amen.

EDIT: and yeah, you're kinda right in the Apple vs Android thing...the software is way ahead. Only thing it is pricier and you lose out on tweaking stuff so much, but why bother tweaking a useless ARM cpu when you can do that on a real man's x86 chip? so yeah...there you got it.

EDIT2: yeah I said crappy twice in the same sentence when talking arm compatible games, and I could add a third and fourth too lmao


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys so much OT goodness! lol
> Hokies, come on!!! I won't buy a friggin Ipad to oc my comp lol Any cheapy laptop should do xD
> And sub par vrm my...you know what.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tell that to an Extreme 4 owner.
> As for the tablet thing, no way in hell it can beat the GLORY that is a PSP man, you obviously never had one. Check my sig buddy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go play Monster Hunter Freedom Unite and then compare that to them crappy Android/iOs crappy games with horrid touch controls.
> Amen.
> EDIT: and yeah, you're kinda right in the Apple vs Android thing...the software is way ahead. Only thing it is pricier and you lose out on tweaking stuff so much, but why bother tweaking a useless ARM cpu when you can do that on a real man's x86 chip? so yeah...there you got it.


I had a Psp Tablets win

An i pod is 100$ and will OC your comp where ever u go and fits in your pocket.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heh.... You can not compare 2 different types of graffic processors..
> The Nexus 10 has higher res screen but it looks like crap.... When compared The Ipads screen brighter better colors better blacks..
> Also... Nexus7 is 229$ my Ipad 3 was 375$ Refurb from Apple with 1 year warranty.. Cheaper and better then the Nexus 10 by a long shot.
> And Take note it cost Apple 300$ to make a 16gb Ipad 3.. so getting it for 375$ shipped um yah...
> Apples games / Apps are all designed just for the Ipad.. Android has 1000000 different devices none are designed for just 1 tablet..
> My Ipad has 5ghz Wifi.. Nexus 7 2.4ghz.. i can stream movies with no stops.. my wife has to wait and let them load on her Nexus 7 @[email protected]
> Android is price per performance of tablets kinda like amd..
> Apple ur getting the best but it costs more..like Intel.


I wasn't comparing the 690 to the quad core of the ipad I said just cause a gpu has 4 cores doesn't mean its automatically more amazing than anything with 2 cores. AKA A GIMMICK. And how can the display look any different they are both produced in the same factory in china. What you're comparing is contrast ratio which there is no sign in any spec sheet.

How can you compare a refurb price to the price of a new one, You can get a refurb nexus 10 off ebay for 200. 5ghz wifi is terrible on such devices because their network controller is weak compared to that of a laptop, reducing the range by A LOT. Also there is no difference in internet speed, only LAN speed, which 2.4ghz wifi goes all the way up to 150mbps, which is more than enough for ANYTHING you are doing on a tablet. If you are transfering big files like movies, eg. 5gb, do it by hardwire, will save you 10 min.

Intel prices are higher than AMD because their products are better and AMD is the ONLY other consumer market chip provider, intel can raise a 3770k price to 500 $2500 mac book pro doesn't mean you're getting the best laptop. I can find a better laptop for $1000, with a lower screen res ofc, 1080p, good luck gaming at 2880x whatever res the new pro is with a gt 650m lmao. And again, nexus 7 vs ipad 3 is like comparing a 7850 to a 7970ghz ed, even more.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Meh, to each their own I guess...you might want to dab into the whole hackintosh thing while you're at it








Gigabyte boards are Apple's choice so, you are covered.

I have an android tablet and find it useful for certain things but I wouldn't buy one again, unless it was a 500usd Surface Pro xD


----------



## stickg1

I'm supposed to be able to connect to my computer through a smartphone, tablet, or laptop with ASUS WiFi Go or some crap. Might check it out...

I told some dude in a different thread I would look into it and never got around to it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I wasn't comparing the 690 to the quad core of the ipad I said just cause a gpu has 4 cores doesn't mean its automatically more amazing than anything with 2 cores. AKA A GIMMICK. And how can the display look any different they are both produced in the same factory in china. What you're comparing is contrast ratio which there is no sign in any spec sheet.
> How can you compare a refurb price to the price of a new one, You can get a refurb nexus 10 off ebay for 200. 5ghz wifi is terrible on such devices because their network controller is weak compared to that of a laptop, reducing the range by A LOT. Also there is no difference in internet speed, only LAN speed, which 2.4ghz wifi goes all the way up to 150mbps, which is more than enough for ANYTHING you are doing on a tablet. If you are transfering big files like movies, eg. 5gb, do it by hardwire, will save you 10 min.
> Intel prices are higher than AMD because their products are better and AMD is the ONLY other consumer market chip provider, intel can raise a 3770k price to 500 $2500 mac book pro doesn't mean you're getting the best laptop. I can find a better laptop for $1000, with a lower screen res ofc, 1080p, good luck gaming at 2880x whatever res the new pro is with a gt 650m lmao. And again, nexus 7 vs ipad 3 is like comparing a 7850 to a 7970ghz ed, even more.


I see you have alot to Learn New guy =/

Not even going to reply to that utter non sense.


----------



## Valgaur

For me personally tablet's are still pointless they will eventually make laptops go obsolete but I ahve a super computer thus me not caring about tablets any time soon. smartphones are good enough anyways.

btw on the apple retina displays and their screens. since they pissed off Samsung.... they wont be having those amazing screens anymore. because you know who made them....... samsung. smart guy apple.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I see you have alot to Learn New guy =/
> Not even going to reply to that utter non sense.


That is your final statement against the facts I stated? Must be interesting being a rep with no knowledge of tech other than putting a comp together.


----------



## Valgaur

Come on guys lets stop bickering here.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, Val, smack dem fight pickers lol

No, really, there are kind and more polite ways to disagree, but it's always nice to bring up facts and explanations/quotes into the mix. But, really, as Hokies said there's no need to discuss that (and I add) 'here'.









EDIT: Hokies, check these out:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://hwbot.org/submission/2300316_splmann_memory_clock_ddr3_sdram_1657.8_mhz
http://hwbot.org/submission/2327898_topdog_memory_clock_ddr3_sdram_1418.7_mhz


----------



## tw33k

Finally got to delid my 3770K and the results are fantastic. I used Liquid Ultra on all 4 surfaces

*Before*


*After*


The delta temp dropped 22.5c!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, Val, smack dem fight pickers lol
> No, really, there are kind and more polite ways to disagree, but it's always nice to bring up facts and explanations/quotes into the mix. But, really, as Hokies said there's no need to discuss that (and I add) 'here'.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Hokies, check these out:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2300316_splmann_memory_clock_ddr3_sdram_1657.8_mhz
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2327898_topdog_memory_clock_ddr3_sdram_1418.7_mhz


I do to agree that this isn't the place to discuss apple vs other products, but you don't bring up an argument and then when someone responds personally insult them and act like the god of all tech knowledge. At the end of the day, none of us here are professional engineers who actually make these stuff, although that is why i'm in school to become one.


----------



## Valgaur

I Soooooooooooo........I think Franky died.... error code on mobo of 00... dun dun duuuuuuuun........ gonna tear her appart tonight and redo the install to see if he's alive or just cranky.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I agree he can be kind of a cocky guy but I like him lol
Let there be peace and understanding, and sort of on topic posts


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I Soooooooooooo........I think Franky died.... error code on mobo of 00... dun dun duuuuuuuun........ gonna tear her appart tonight and redo the install to see if he's alive or just cranky.


00? Crap...I would think the board crapped out, but not sure. I got a single digit 0 when my pins went whack.


----------



## Valgaur

Also my cpu led is on on the mobo.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Odd...cpu might have died, too much vcore man







It's surprising that it made it this far.
Glue it back, and you know what to do


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I Soooooooooooo........I think Franky died.... error code on mobo of 00... dun dun duuuuuuuun........ gonna tear her appart tonight and redo the install to see if he's alive or just cranky.


I get 00 on the asus board when pushing memory too hard, clr cmos usually fixes it up, d0 is the one you don't want to see.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Phew...guess that was close








Makes sense taking into account the ram that Val just got thanks to me lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> That is your final statement against the facts I stated? Must be interesting being a rep with no knowledge of tech other than putting a comp together.


loL that is my final statement vs a noob that Likes Android and does not care what the facts are.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I do to agree that this isn't the place to discuss apple vs other products, but you don't bring up an argument and then when someone responds personally insult them and act like the *god of all tech knowledge*. At the end of the day, none of us here are professional engineers who actually make these stuff, although that is why i'm in school to become one.


I am.

Also it is pretty easy to compare the two when u own them both you know?

Cause u have them both side by side.. so when somebody says something off the wall u know it is complete rubbish.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I guess we hit a sensible nerve with the whole apple thing...







lol
I think their software is ahead being a more restricted and controlled ecosystem, which is good for certain things, same as the huge app store.
I remember banging my head against the wall countless times whenever I wanted to use my 7" tablet to sight read music, finding out there wasn't a single application for that. Man has a point in that regard, but all the rest not sure, don't care either. This is the Delidded IVB Club after all.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I guess we hit a sensible nerve with the whole apple thing...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> I think their software is ahead being a more restricted and controlled ecosystem, which is good for certain things, same as the huge app store.
> I remember banging my head against the wall countless times whenever I wanted to use my 7" tablet to sight read music, finding out there wasn't a single application for that. Man has a point in that regard, but all the rest not sure, don't care either. This is the Delidded IVB Club after all.


He hit a Nerve for the fact that i own both have have hours and hours of using both to know better.
And tot he fact i am on lotsa pain killers and upset easily.

Meh im going to lay back down now.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah man, don't you die cause of a heart attack or something now...


----------



## junkerde

liquid pro is the best for delidding?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkerde*
> 
> liquid pro is the best for delidding?


It's all I use. On the die and IHS.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Liquid Pro is the best...yeah









For over the IHS and below the heatsink base too, but it's complicated to remove it, and may need lapping to go away. Which would erase your cpu's markings.


----------



## SonDa5

Hope Frankie didn't die but if he did it wouldn't surprise me. His life so far has been nothing but shock treatment.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Liquid Pro is the best...yeah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For over the IHS and below the heatsink base too, but it's complicated to remove it, and may need lapping to go away. Which would erase your cpu's markings.


I don't regret lapping my IHS, it was concave. Now i get even temps on all cores, like 5-7 difference. before was over 10-12 difference.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Only thing with lapping is losing the warranty...grab another IHS and use that instead. I will try that soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I get 00 on the asus board when pushing memory too hard, clr cmos usually fixes it up, d0 is the one you don't want to see.


Here's the fun part I cleared cmos..... and switched ram even. The cpu led is on as well..... where should I go now?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Phew...guess that was close
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Makes sense taking into account the ram that Val just got thanks to me lol


Yeah I was doing just that actually lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Hope Frankie didn't die but if he did it wouldn't surprise me. His life so far has been nothing but shock treatment.


Yeah....I want franky to live!


----------



## FtW 420

I had 00 a few times when trying to run tRCD 10 @2400Mhz memory, clearing cmos let me boot up again. When I did kill a 3770k it would show d0 on the asus boards.
Maybe try a single memory stick in the different channels? I have seen a dead memory channel on a couple z77 boards (usually 55 on the debug though). Or full clear, clear cmos, no psu power, pull battery to make sure settings are cleared.


----------



## alancsalt

We want you to live Franky! Fight for life!


----------



## Valgaur

Only 3 more hours until I can give franky some tender loving care....... grrrrr


----------



## tw33k

After delidding I started getting error code 55 on my board. Only 1 DIMM is working at the moment. A new 3770K should arrive tomorrow


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd suggest the whole power cycle as FtW said...worked for me when I had similar issues with my ud5h.


----------



## junkerde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> After delidding I started getting error code 55 on my board. Only 1 DIMM is working at the moment. A new 3770K should arrive tomorrow


ouch, things like this scare me


----------



## IronDoq

OCN name: IronDoq
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Noctua Nt-H1
Mhz gained: none (so far)
OC after delid: 4.8 (currently stabilizing 5)
Temp drops: 21c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2605760

Let it be known that lapping also dropped my temps by 9c (although my carelessness rendered my chip only usable in single-channel mode







)


----------



## feniks

Valgaur, don't give up yet! it still could be the flakey BIOS, you recently flashed it to the latest version, no?

try as suggested, doing a full power down, flip the rocker switch on PSU, unplug all cables from the MB (PSU ATX & EPS, USB devices, everything!), remove all PCIe devices and ram sticks, remove the 3.3V battery, hit the Clear CMOS reset button and hold it for good 2 minutes.

if that doesn't help then maybe remove the CPU and inspect for burn marks on the bottom side









on my part, I had (as suspected) hell of a trouble with unstable 5GHz on offsets at light and moderate loads (yet full stable at deep idle and full throttle) ... it was the rapid switching between power states (idle vs load) on CPU vcore vs multiplier not being synchronized somehow sometimes!

had to toggle a few things in BIOS (PLL backed down to 1.55v, C3&C6 disabled) and so far so good, but only next 24 hours will tell if random BSOD 124 at light load comes back... also have seen BSOD 0A once, so I manually adjusted vccio & vccsa (1.15v & 1.10v) for time being, so far so good with ram @ XMP 2000MHz. if that survives some gaming and 24 hours of running then I go with pushing memory back to where I want it


----------



## Arm3nian

Is frankie his mobo lol? And if so whats exactly the problem.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Is frankie his mobo lol? And if so whats exactly the problem.


"Frankie" is the nickname of his CPU ... kinda adequate to what it has been through








frankie=little frankenstein


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> "Frankie" is the nickname of his CPU ... kinda adequate to what it has been through
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> frankie=little frankenstein


All he needs to do now is ln2/helium cool it. Then it will transform into the complete frankenstein


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> After delidding I started getting error code 55 on my board. Only 1 DIMM is working at the moment. A new 3770K should arrive tomorrow


I had an error code the first time I delidded with my 3570k. Remounted and it worked fine. I don't think it was seated properly. Never had the problem again with that CPU and I am now using 3770k and have never had that problem. I think that problem is more common with bare die to block mounts. (NO IHS, what I have)


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> All he needs to do now is ln2/helium cool it. Then it will transform into the complete frankenstein


LOL! I bet


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> We want you to live Franky! Fight for life!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd suggest the whole power cycle as FtW said...worked for me when I had similar issues with my ud5h.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Valgaur, don't give up yet! it still could be the flakey BIOS, you recently flashed it to the latest version, no?
> 
> try as suggested, doing a full power down, flip the rocker switch on PSU, unplug all cables from the MB (PSU ATX & EPS, USB devices, everything!), remove all PCIe devices and ram sticks, remove the 3.3V battery, hit the Clear CMOS reset button and hold it for good 2 minutes.
> 
> if that doesn't help then maybe remove the CPU and inspect for burn marks on the bottom side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> on my part, I had (as suspected) hell of a trouble with unstable 5GHz on offsets at light and moderate loads (yet full stable at deep idle and full throttle) ... it was the rapid switching between power states (idle vs load) on CPU vcore vs multiplier not being synchronized somehow sometimes!
> 
> had to toggle a few things in BIOS (PLL backed down to 1.55v, C3&C6 disabled) and so far so good, but only next 24 hours will tell if random BSOD 124 at light load comes back... also have seen BSOD 0A once, so I manually adjusted vccio & vccsa (1.15v & 1.10v) for time being, so far so good with ram @ XMP 2000MHz. if that survives some gaming and 24 hours of running then I go with pushing memory back to where I want it


Do all of above suggested steps - and then try mouth-to-mouth if you have to....we can't lose Franky.....not now...not like this.....


----------



## Arm3nian

Was frankie the original delid? lol


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I had an error code the first time I delidded with my 3570k. Remounted and it worked fine. I don't think it was seated properly. Never had the problem again with that CPU and I am now using 3770k and have never had that problem. I think that problem is more common with bare die to block mounts. (NO IHS, what I have)


Yeah I tried remounting but no matter what only 1 DIMM will work. New chip arrives tomorrow so fingers crossed I get one with a nice low VID


----------



## VonDutch

hmm, dont have 55 or 00 in my errorcodes, never seen them(mention) before too,

the 0A feniks mentions i do have
0x0A = unstable RAM/IMC, increase QPI first, if that doesn't work increase vcore
and a 50 code,
0x50 = RAM timings/Frequency or uncore multi unstable, increase RAM voltage or adjust QPI/VTT, or lower uncore if you're higher than 2x

i hope frankie is ok,
my bambam did some (like frankie) crazy ocing also..1.85V vcore on it ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Was frankie the original delid? lol


yep..frankie and bambam are the chips that went all crazy with ocing/benching ..lol
with vcores upto 1.85-1.9V, 5.5ghz etc
















after that val and i got the "Dumb and Dumber" nicknames ..haha


----------



## Hokies83

You 2 may have those 5.5ghz Screenies i still gots the highest 24/7 OC yo.

At the end of the day dats what it is all about Dawg.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You 2 may have those 5.5ghz Screenies i still gots the highest 24/7 OC yo.
> At the end of the day dats what it is all about Dawg.


Sure


































woot, first snow is here, 5-10cm this morn

ever seen a elephant walk in the snow ...lol, we have a Zoo in the town where i live










he doesnt look to happy..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Sure


All delidded chips should run at a min of 4.8ghz XD it's about the E-peen bro.. How big is yours?

Cause mines...



Anywho ive figured out my Water loop..

Gonna sell some extra things wanna do it wit no out of pocket cash..


Pump block res and 360 rad up top..
+
80mm of goodness in the bottom..



Will Mount all my SSDs on the back side of the case.

Gonna remove all my Cougar fans which are 19dba and use all SilentX 15dba.. Which Suck for static pressure..
But that is what is soooo good about 80mm rads... ill get better performance with crappy fans on that 80mm in push/pull then i would with 1 35mm 480 rad with noisey monsters on it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> All delidded chips should run at a min of 4.8ghz XD it's about the E-peen bro.. How big is yours?
> Cause mines...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


o, i can run 4.8-4.9ghz 24/7, but i decided not to..








im not into E-peen, i oc whats good for me, thats it,
not to be better/faster/have higher oc's then others..lol

what val and i did, was big fun really, i had a good time,
that counts more then E-peen ..lol ( for me anyways)


----------



## Valgaur

It's dead Jim. I have a buddy who is building his pc tomorrow so I will be testing franky in it. Im going to call Intel tomorrow as well and speak truthfully to them and not lie. Maybe make headway onto my arguement against them.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It's dead Jim. I have a buddy who is building his pc tomorrow so I will be testing franky in it. Im going to call Intel tomorrow as well and speak truthfully to them and not lie. Maybe make headway onto my arguement against them.


Dang, hope it all works out bud ...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It's dead Jim. I have a buddy who is building his pc tomorrow so I will be testing franky in it. Im going to call Intel tomorrow as well and speak truthfully to them and not lie. Maybe make headway onto my arguement against them.


What your chip is dead? i thought u were just having a little ram issue?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It's dead Jim. I have a buddy who is building his pc tomorrow so I will be testing franky in it. Im going to call Intel tomorrow as well and speak truthfully to them and not lie. Maybe make headway onto my arguement against them.


We are all sorry to hear that.







Best of luck with your conversation with Intel. Maybe they will give you a new chip - Franky II!


----------



## Valgaur

Also hokies you can't just say that you run of barely over intels safety zone is the best runner in the line of cpus that went to the vcore limits of the motherboards they were in. And multiple times at that. Including more than 50 runs of 1.72 vcore at 5.3 for pure stability. 1.55 is nothing compared to what my chip did along with what Vons did.

You may be the one to be toting your e-peen around high. But I have the tote of the OCs and the vcore right alongside dumber here. Right Von.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Also hokies you can't just say that you run of barely over intels safety zone is the best runner in the line of cpus that went to the vcore limits of the motherboards they were in. And multiple times at that. Including more than 50 runs of 1.72 vcore at 5.3 for pure stability. 1.55 is nothing compared to what my chip did along with what Vons did.
> You may be the one to be toting your e-peen around high. But I have the tote of the OCs and the vcore right alongside dumber here. Right Von.


I could do 1.9v to and do that.. Im just not that dumb... for a screenie..

Anywho...

IS Your Chip DEAD?!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Also hokies you can't just say that you run of barely over intels safety zone is the best runner in the line of cpus that went to the vcore limits of the motherboards they were in. And multiple times at that. Including more than 50 runs of 1.72 vcore at 5.3 for pure stability. 1.55 is nothing compared to what my chip did along with what Vons did.
> You may be the one to be toting your e-peen around high. But I have the tote of the OCs and the vcore right alongside dumber here. Right Von.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could do 1.9v to and do that.. Im just not that dumb... for a screenie..
> 
> Anywho...
> 
> IS Your Chip DEAD?!
Click to expand...

Valgaur is not the first OC'er to have something die on him in the pursuit of performance. I think it was a valiant effort on Valgaur's part to better see where the limits of IB were. We now know they are tougher chips than SB ever was, but not indestructible.









It was an amazing run for a long time and we all enjoyed what he was doing, and we have all learned something from it. And Valgaur had a lot of fun!


----------



## Hokies83

So His chip is 100% dead?

Was he running at his 24/7 OC and it just die?

Or was he doing some of that crazy 1.9v stuff and kill it?


----------



## Khaled G

Too bad it died before trying to reach the 2 volts mark, it would've been a world record.


----------



## Unit Igor

Hey guys,i would like to know too what kind of RIDE did kill it.Sorry I didnt follow Valgaur work.Really like to become club member,but I am like Bear in the glass store,so i would probably broke something.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Khaled G*
> 
> Too bad it died before trying to reach the 2 volts mark, it would've been a world record.


World record you say?? But no I was trying for a 5.6 run and it wouldn't do it with ht off so I was resetting everything and I was messing with some dram options and it suddenly froze......in bios mind you. And im like okay ill just restart. Nothing. Full shut down. Hasn't turned on yet.

I personally believe Franky is dead but a buddy of mine is building a z77 platform tomorrow oh thy fate how thy loveth me! So gonna haul my mobo, along with my franky to him and see if its just the cpu or the mobo itself after some phone calls as well. That darn cpu led wont go away either. From my research it seems to be that franky is dead. But there is some hope in me.

Who knows. Franky 2.0 might have some really nice abilities









Also mobo has no issues at all. No mark nothing blown at all. Absolutely nothing. Hopefully Asus can help me out more, if not I will be saving my money week by week for that next i7. No more video games for a while lol. Its weird also, im sad but happy.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> World record you say?? But no I was trying for a 5.6 run and it wouldn't do it with ht off so I was resetting everything and I was messing with some dram options and it suddenly froze......in bios mind you. And im like okay ill just restart. Nothing. Full shut down. Hasn't turned on yet.
> *I personally believe Franky is dead* but a buddy of mine is building a z77 platform tomorrow oh thy fate how thy loveth me! So gonna haul my mobo, along with my franky to him and see if its just the cpu or the mobo itself after some phone calls as well. That darn cpu led wont go away either. From my research it seems to be that franky is dead. But there is some hope in me.
> Who knows. Franky 2.0 might have some really nice abilities
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also mobo has no issues at all. No mark nothing blown at all. Absolutely nothing. Hopefully Asus can help me out more, if not I will be saving my money week by week for that next i7. No more video games for a while lol. Its weird also, im sad but happy.


bad/sad day for the delidders..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Valgaur is not the first OC'er to have something die on him in the pursuit of performance. I think it was a valiant effort on Valgaur's part to better see where the limits of IB were. We now know they are tougher chips than SB ever was, but not indestructible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *It was an amazing run for a long time and we all enjoyed what he was doing, and we have all learned something from it. And Valgaur had a lot of fun!*


yeppers


----------



## SonDa5

I think Franky is ok. Sounds like your BIOS on your MB died.


----------



## Lobsterman

Speaking of flaky bios's, anyone else had trouble turning off/on HT after doing 5gz OC on their Ivy? Latest 2 bios's for my mobo won't turn HT on/off after a high overclock (4.8-5.5ghz), needs a cmos reset to work again, have reverted back to 1504 and it works fine again.


----------



## Rakunvar

Gonna be doing some more reading and investigating, but I think I may be trying this once I get my new chip. I got my I5-2500k to 5ghz on air at first but just was too warm, so H100 did it. Then I gave in and ordered myself the XSPC Rasa 750 kit, and Indigo Xtreme that I've been using. I just snagged a 3770k for $110 from the Intel Edge program that I'm waiting to get here currently.

I really want to push it like I did my 2500k, but with the heat issues Ivy has worried me. This may just solve all my issues.. We'll see what I can get from it first, then go from there.


----------



## chris-br

No more heat issues after delidding.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You 2 may have those 5.5ghz Screenies i still gots the highest 24/7 OC yo.
> At the end of the day dats what it is all about Dawg.


highest 24/7 oc? 5.2 ghz is what you are running right? how short of a prime did you run?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> highest 24/7 oc? 5.2 ghz is what you are running right? how short of a prime did you run?


7hrs i game hrs a day everyday







and encode video








Mesa just not scared of V coar!


----------



## martinhal

Just applied my CLP to die and MX4 IHS and did a IBT 5 Ghz run. Ambient at 26,5 C. Is this good or can I get better ? The chip is under water.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Just applied my CLP to die and MX4 IHS and did a IBT 5 Ghz run. Ambient at 26,5 C. Is this good or can I get better ? The chip is under water.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


very nice martinhal








those temps are great..
dont forget to dry it, when you take it out of the water again


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> very nice martinhal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> those temps are great..
> dont forget to dry it, when you take it out of the water again


Will do bud. I can now try my Indigo Xtreme woot woot.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I think Franky is ok. Sounds like your BIOS on your MB died.


You may be right *SonDa5*. Valgaur was playing with BIOS and doing Ram testing, and I think he recently upgraded his BIOS too, so there is still a good posibility that the problem is in the MB or BIOS and Franky is OK.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Just applied my CLP to die and MX4 IHS and did a IBT 5 Ghz run. Ambient at 26,5 C. Is this good or can I get better ? The chip is under water.


Nice 5GHz vcore and temps *martinhal*.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> You may be right *SonDa5*. Valgaur was playing with BIOS and doing Ram testing, and I think he recently upgraded his BIOS too, so there is still a good posibility that the problem is in the MB or BIOS and Franky is OK.
> Nice 5GHz vcore and temps *martinhal*.


Sadly I had to go to 1.452 v to get BF3 to start. That puts my IBT temps to 72 C. That is still good right ?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I think Franky is ok. Sounds like your BIOS on your MB died.


it could be, that's what I also suggested since he recently upgraded it ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> World record you say?? But no I was trying for a 5.6 run and it wouldn't do it with ht off so I was resetting everything and I was messing with some dram options and it suddenly froze......in bios mind you. And im like okay ill just restart. Nothing. Full shut down. Hasn't turned on yet.
> I personally believe Franky is dead but a buddy of mine is building a z77 platform tomorrow oh thy fate how thy loveth me! So gonna haul my mobo, along with my franky to him and see if its just the cpu or the mobo itself after some phone calls as well. That darn cpu led wont go away either. From my research it seems to be that franky is dead. But there is some hope in me.
> Who knows. Franky 2.0 might have some really nice abilities
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also mobo has no issues at all. No mark nothing blown at all. Absolutely nothing. Hopefully Asus can help me out more, if not I will be saving my money week by week for that next i7. No more video games for a while lol. Its weird also, im sad but happy.


it could your MB/BIOS bro, but it can also be your chip ... last time I was killing (on purpose) my first 3770K it behaved the same way on its way out - freezing in BIOS. I ran 1.92V vcore through it, pumped it up to 1.35v vccio & vccsa as well, it maxed out at 5.2GHz anyways LOL! it died soon after by freezing in BIOS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> You may be right *SonDa5*. Valgaur was playing with BIOS and doing Ram testing, and I think he recently upgraded his BIOS too, so there is still a good posibility that the problem is in the MB or BIOS and Franky is OK.
> Nice 5GHz vcore and temps *martinhal*.


it could be both or either one







more testing is needed, it's he's got a friend building a Z77 system, will be easy to swap parts and check.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> You may be right *SonDa5*. Valgaur was playing with BIOS and doing Ram testing, and I think he recently upgraded his BIOS too, so there is still a good posibility that the problem is in the MB or BIOS and Franky is OK.
> Nice 5GHz vcore and temps *martinhal*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sadly I had to go to 1.452 v to get BF3 to start. That puts my IBT temps to 72 C. That is still good right ?
Click to expand...

Still fine for that OC and vcore. Your doing fine.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> last time I was killing (on purpose) my first 3770K it behaved the same way on its way out - freezing in BIOS. *I ran 1.92V vcore through it*, pumped it up to 1.35v vccio & vccsa as well, it maxed out at 5.2GHz anyways LOL! it died soon after by freezing in BIOS.


val 1.9V, you 1.92V vcore ..
maybe i should be happy that my mobo didnt allow me to go over 1.85V vcore ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> last time I was killing (on purpose) my first 3770K it behaved the same way on its way out - freezing in BIOS. *I ran 1.92V vcore through it*, pumped it up to 1.35v vccio & vccsa as well, it maxed out at 5.2GHz anyways LOL! it died soon after by freezing in BIOS.


val 1.9V, you 1.92V vcore ..
maybe i should be happy that my mobo didnt allow me to go over 1.85V vcore ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Sadly I had to go to 1.452 v to get BF3 to start. That puts my IBT temps to 72 C. That is still good right ?


you just want to make us jealous right ..LOL








its still good..









just noticed, you have a 7970, how does it run BF3?
im sooo tempted to spend some more money,
to get a gigabyte 7970, instead of the 7950 see..
but it costs almost 80 euro more..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Just applied my CLP to die and MX4 IHS and did a IBT 5 Ghz run. Ambient at 26,5 C. Is this good or can I get better ? The chip is under water.


That overclock will give you incredible framerate improvement when your playing the sims.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> last time I was killing (on purpose) my first 3770K it behaved the same way on its way out - freezing in BIOS. *I ran 1.92V vcore through it*, pumped it up to 1.35v vccio & vccsa as well, it maxed out at 5.2GHz anyways LOL! it died soon after by freezing in BIOS.
> 
> 
> 
> val 1.9V, you 1.92V vcore ..
> maybe i should be happy that my mobo didnt allow me to go over 1.85V vcore ..lol
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Sadly I had to go to 1.452 v to get BF3 to start. That puts my IBT temps to 72 C. That is still good right ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> you just want to make us jealous right ..LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its still good..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just noticed, you have a 7970, how does it run BF3?
> im sooo tempted to spend some more money,
> to get a gigabyte 7970, instead of the 7950 see..
> but it costs almost 80 euro more..
Click to expand...

I really think you will be happier in the end if you get the 7950 *VonDutch*. I bet you will regreat not doing so if you settle for the 7950. But maybe not, really depends on you, your budget, and what you plan on doing with it. Just know I'd go for the 7970.


----------



## Shaldome

The shop were I ordered my parts messes up my address so DHL send the packet back. And my case is still making a tour to the DHL depots of Germany...








The shop said they will send me my ordered parts again. Worst case my parts arrive while my case is still on tour.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I really think you will be happier in the end if you get the 7950 *VonDutch*. I bet you will regreat not doing so if you settle for the 7950. But maybe not, really depends on you, your budget, and what you plan on doing with it. Just know I'd go for the 7970.


80 euro is alot, but i get 300 euro extra disabled money this month








once a year thing, have some other things i need to buy,
but tempted to spend it on the 7970 this year ...lol

i want to play bf3, and dont get to close to 30fps with highest settings








and have enough power to play the upcoming games next year, and after..
it should be enough for the next 3 years..

within 2 years i prolly start building my next computer so,
bet one of my kiddos will be very happy by then with Dad's "old" vid card ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> The shop were I ordered my parts messes up my address so DHL send the packet back. And my case is still making a tour to the DHL depots of Germany...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The shop said they will send me my ordered parts again. Worst case my parts arrive while my case is still on tour.


thats messed up indeed ..


----------



## Valgaur

How much is a 3770K from intel edge? And I hope its my bios. How would I replace it? I need my buddies board for a franky run lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> How much is a 3770K from intel edge? And I hope its my bios. How would I replace it? I need my buddies board for a franky run lol.


think i saw someone mention "intel edge" $110,
not sure tho, dont even know what it is,
but i was like, dang thats cheap..what is it ..lol

yea, sure hope its the bios, or something else man..
life wouldnt be the same without franky doing crazy stuff around here ..lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> val 1.9V, you 1.92V vcore ..
> maybe i should be happy that my mobo didnt allow me to go over 1.85V vcore ..lol


actually, 1.920v was what my former MB's BIOS allowed to set as max, but it was also running Extreme LLC as well, so the actual vcore could have been 1.95-1.96v actually.
worth mentioning that it started freezing only after I coupled it with 1.35v on VCCIO & VCCSA and then tried benchmarking it at thermal limits (throttling of course). still took me some time to kill it, wasted half of the evening on making it die, it took some effort.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's cruel man xD

I think I've same reports of Phenom II's being easily insta-killed when pushing the imc/cpu-nb voltage a lot, for what it's worth...
I wouldn't go past 1.2v and 1.15v at all.

Val, perhaps my buddy gets a job at Microcenter just in time for Haswell!







I want fsb/bclk overclocking to return







(have you heard about that? different bclk straps available independ of pci-e speeds technically)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> How much is a 3770K from intel edge? And I hope its my bios. How would I replace it? I need my buddies board for a franky run lol.


To be in intel edge you have to show proof you work for the PC industry.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's cruel man xD
> I think I've same reports of Phenom II's being easily insta-killed when pushing the imc/cpu-nb voltage a lot, for what it's worth...
> I wouldn't go past 1.2v and 1.15v at all.
> Val, perhaps my buddy gets a job at Microcenter just in time for Haswell!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want fsb/bclk overclocking to return
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (have you heard about that? different bclk straps available independ of pci-e speeds technically)


LOL, yeah, I know LOL it sounds like that!








thing is that it was my former board which degraded it severely to start with (with VERY gentle clocks and vcore!) ... not me ... I just finished it off ... and replaced it








however at that time I didn't know that it was my bad MB being the culprit, so I installed the replacement CPU (same batch as I have now) on same board ... then replaced the board, but process was already started ... so went through Intel RMA again (that time used paid extra warranty I had from Intel) ... huh. am I evil? I don't think so, just chose lesser evil, as manufacturer of the board (EVGA) completely ignored my messages about my board potentially being responsible for my chip failure (they do not support overclocking past 1600MHz memory speed nor past intel specs) and refuse to be responsible for anything that may happen, and it happened because of some MB hardware flaws (bad batch of board, there were more people with similar trouble) and archaic+bugged BIOS they sold with it ... total failure ... returned the board to them for a full retail price refund eventually ... thanks to local Microcenter I was able to find my lucky batch once again too, so it's all good now


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> val 1.9V, you 1.92V vcore ..
> maybe i should be happy that my mobo didnt allow me to go over 1.85V vcore ..lol
> you just want to make us jealous right ..LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its still good..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just noticed, you have a 7970, how does it run BF3?
> im sooo tempted to spend some more money,
> to get a gigabyte 7970, instead of the 7950 see..
> but it costs almost 80 euro more..


My 6970 does play BF3 maxout no problems.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> My 6970 does play BF3 maxout no problems.


Bf3 uses 99% of both my 680s 80% if i limit frames to 120.


----------



## ivanlabrie

High is more than enough, but Ultra takes some extra juice...I figure 6970's might perform ok with the new driver boosts and overclocked accordingly but doubt that you pass 40fps with that card.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> My 6970 does play BF3 maxout no problems.


sure, i wouldnt upgrade if i had one of those








im running a 6850 now, it plays bf3 30-40fps, but just..
i wouldnt buy a 7850 to replace it for now..

this is the last part of my build, i wanted the 7950,
but 7970 extra 1gb ram, and 384bit is more future proof i think,
and its faaast...lol
could buy a sapphire HD6990 4G GDDR5 today, 320 euro,
its faster (alot?) then the 7970 right? is it futureproof too?
warranty ends june 2013


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> sure, i wouldnt upgrade if i had one of those
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im running a 6850 now, it plays bf3 30-40fps, but just..
> i wouldnt buy a 7850 to replace it for now..
> this is the last part of my build, i wanted the 7950,
> but 7970 extra 1gb ram, and 384bit is more future proof i think,
> and its faaast...lol
> could buy a sapphire HD6990 4G GDDR5 today, 320 euro,
> its faster (alot?) then the 7970 right? is it futureproof too?
> warranty ends june 2013


4gb vram? you mean 2x 2gb and them marketing it as 4gb and only really having a useable 2gb?

690 does that to.. says it has 4gb Vram really only has 2gb..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not really faster...overclocked 7970 beats it. Draws tons of heat, and warranty is short, plus they oc little and they are HUGE.
I say order a 7970 from the US one of those crazy 279usd deals and have it shipped over there for 47.95 in retail packaging. Easy









EDIT: Hokies has a point, shared vram is like some sort of raid, you only get 2gb of those 4gb that are shared.


----------



## Hokies83

Sales Gimmicks heh Lets put 4gb Vram on box and Ad and get ppl to pay money for this over priced card... "yah you can only us 2gb of it but it is 2 gpus 2x 2gb = 4gb so we can say it has 4gb!"

Somebody really needs to make them stop that it is almost cheating "lying" to the buyer..

Evga is the King Pin of Lying and falsely leading buyers with there rubbish..
You almost could not give me an Evga gpu.. id sell it and get an Msi/Galaxy card everytime..

Ah i did get a Free Evga Gtx 560Ti... I traded my brother for his BFG Gtx 275 @[email protected]


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 4gb vram? you mean 2x 2gb and them marketing it as 4gb and only really having a useable 2gb?
> 690 does that to.. says it has 4gb Vram really only has 2gb..


isnt a 6990 the same as 2X 6970?
so 2x 2gb, i thought all those where like that,
same with the 7990, has 2X 3gb..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not really faster...overclocked 7970 beats it. Draws tons of heat, and warranty is short, plus they oc little and they are HUGE.
> I say order a 7970 from the US one of those crazy 279usd deals and have it shipped over there for 47.95 in retail packaging. Easy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Hokies has a point, shared vram is like some sort of raid, you only get 2gb of those 4gb that are shared.


yea, i see, gonna stick to the 7970,
was just wondering this afternoon when i saw the 6990 ..

youre idea would save me money for sure ivan, would be more then 100 euro with such a deal, with shipping
who wants to help me out ?









thanks guys


----------



## ivanlabrie

usable 3gb...so 3gb not 6gb.
And it's dual 6950.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> usable 3gb...so 3gb not 6gb.
> And it's dual 6950.


what does the other 3gb do then, being unusable?







jk
i always thought it was like a cf or sli on 1 pcb?
when i look at it your way and hokies,
its kinda of a marketing trick, and its more expencive most of the time then a cf or sli,
i saw a 7990 for 1000 euro today, rather have 2X 7970 then
more what hokies calls, E-peen? strangest word ive learned this year for sure, E-peen ..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what does the other 3gb do then, being unusable?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jk
> i always thought it was like a cf or sli on 1 pcb?
> when i look at it your way and hokies,
> its kinda of a marketing trick, and its more expencive most of the time then a cf or sli,
> i saw a 7990 for 1000 euro today, rather have 2X 7970 then
> more what hokies calls, E-peen? strangest word ive learned this year for sure, E-peen ..


Nah the 6gb / 4gb Vram with only useable 2/3gb is not E-Peen it is a marketing ploy or "Gimmick" like Amd did with the 8350 with the 4ghz factory clock.

A duel gpu card is just SLI on 1 PCB..

Think of it as gimped SLI as the duel gpus never perform nearly aswell as 2 separate cards there mostly for space saving.


----------



## VonDutch

E-peen










Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Nah the 6gb / 4gb Vram with only useable 2/3gb is not E-Peen it is a marketing ploy or "Gimmick" like Amd did with the 8350 with the 4ghz factory clock.
> A duel gpu card is just SLI on 1 PCB..
> Think of it as gimped SLI as the duel gpus never perform nearly aswell as 2 separate cards there mostly for space saving.


if i look at the pricing, they should perform better then 2 cards..

enough learned for today, thanks guys








ttyl


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> E-peen


Nah hot poor performing card that can very easy beat by 2 289$ each 7950s.

E-Peen would be Quad sli /Quad fire water cooled voltage unlocked with a 3960x cpu.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, or dual socket EVGA Sr-X (with locked) Xeons and quad channel 64gb ram and quad-sli 680 classifieds lol
Watercooled of course, with every component in the loop, including a waterblock for the power button too! xD
Useless but massive E-peen...I'm not into that.


----------



## Valgaur

So...... Im amazed at Intel after an hour long phone call they decided that after I told them that I overclocked it to the wall didn't tell them I popped das lid and sanded it. They went and said oh yeah we will just give you a new i7 3770K...........

Eat it AMD.

Also asus wont answer me lol. So ill get a hold of them later but yeah its amazing. I. Love. Intel.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Awesome man!







Good to hear...Asus can be more of a pain for rma's from what I've heard so far.
Hopefully they won't take long to answer, maybe you can get a refund and grab a new board lol


----------



## Valgaur

Lol I would enjoy that so much lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You never know...

I'm hunting for some value ram, too bored at work lol


----------



## FtW 420

I was hoping that cpu lived, every time I've seen 00 the chip lived to post another day. Have you tried it in a different board?


----------



## ivanlabrie

It seems he didn't really tried...but he got a replacement anyway.

EDIT: Hey FtW, that BBSE guy said 'express or nothing for foreign buyers' so I said screw him :/
Looking for dirt cheap generics atm lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You never know...
> I'm hunting for some value ram, too bored at work lol


Ohh btw. Intel told me that the cpu of the 3770Ks are only ment to use 1333 and 1600 mhz. Yeah I kid you not if your mobo supports higher ram good for the mobo the i7 wont. He explained it as clear as day on this as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I was hoping that cpu lived, every time I've seen 00 the chip lived to post another day. Have you tried it in a different board?


I get the other board shot in 4 hours.


----------



## junkerde

dude, so how are you gonna replace it when they find out you delidded when they recieve your dead cpu? doomed? idk man, idk.


----------



## ivanlabrie

who knows? maybe he'll flash them? (transexual Valgaur?) lmao










Some things are better left unsaid.

I shouldn't be looking for samsung ram for max clocks really, I'd need an am3+/fx8350 or an fm1/3870k for that lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkerde*
> 
> dude, so how are you gonna replace it when they find out you delidded when they recieve your dead cpu? doomed? idk man, idk.


A written letter saying that the nickle plating came off do to my thermal paste. Muhahahahahaha if not they send me mine right back right?









I will love intel forever.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ohh btw. Intel told me that the cpu of the 3770Ks are only ment to use 1333 and 1600 mhz. Yeah I kid you not if your mobo supports higher ram good for the mobo the i7 wont. He explained it as clear as day on this as well.
> I get the other board shot in 4 hours.


Tech support, most of them aren't PC enthusiasts & get thier info from the same specs & brochures everyday consumers see. I'm pretty sure most OCNers know more about the products than the tech support guys do.
Every once in a while you get one that actually does know his stuff, but it is rare.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *junkerde*
> 
> dude, so how are you gonna replace it when they find out you delidded when they recieve your dead cpu? doomed? idk man, idk.


As long as the IHS doesn't fall off when they look at it, they may not notice.
Valguar, draw a trollface under the IHS in case it does fall off.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Trollface under the IHS, pure win lmao









Hmmm I see all these guys obsessed with those newer 2600mhz + capable kits with Samsung or Hynix chips but I don't think those can beat any good psc/bbse kit at modpi32m...someone prove me wrong?


----------



## stickg1

Okay I got my P4 chip today. I delidded it in about 15 seconds. Probably be more careful with my i5-3570k, you know because the P4 was $2 and my Ivy is $220.

Anyway, are you guys sure I can use this IHS? It doesn't have the indentation for the locking mechanism.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ohh btw. Intel told me that the cpu of the 3770Ks are only ment to use 1333 and 1600 mhz. Yeah I kid you not if your mobo supports higher ram good for the mobo the i7 wont. He explained it as clear as day on this as well.
> I get the other board shot in 4 hours.


Glad mine is 1600 mhz c8.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Forget that...you can do whatever you want ram-wise lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Trollface under the IHS, pure win lmao
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmmm I see all these guys obsessed with those newer 2600mhz + capable kits with Samsung or Hynix chips but I don't think those can beat any good psc/bbse kit at modpi32m...someone prove me wrong?


With my 2600Mhz cl10 kit I got a 7:51:xxx time in 32m at 4Ghz, with PSC kits so far I'm at high 7:54:xxx.

But i think I might suck at overclocking PSC. Going to try some bbse soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Tech support, most of them aren't PC enthusiasts & get thier info from the same specs & brochures everyday consumers see. I'm pretty sure most OCNers know more about the products than the tech support guys do.
> Every once in a while you get one that actually does know his stuff, but it is rare.
> As long as the IHS doesn't fall off when they look at it, they may not notice.
> Valguar, draw a trollface under the IHS in case it does fall off.


Yeah im gonna have to do that. I can't pass that up at all. But honestly honesty is the best answer not being like ohh yeah I didn't even touch it. So I think that's why they worked so well and nicely with me I really do.

He said and quote. You overclocked it right? And I was like yup all the way to the motherboards limits along with ocing the ram. He was really cool about it as well.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> With my 2600Mhz cl10 kit I got a 7:51:xxx time in 32m at 4Ghz, with PSC kits so far I'm at high 7:54:xxx.
> But i think I might suck at overclocking PSC. Going to try some bbse soon.


Try cl8-11-7-24-1t at 2400mhz, that's ought to beat the other kit.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah im gonna have to do that. I can't pass that up at all. But honestly honesty is the best answer not being like ohh yeah I didn't even touch it. So I think that's why they worked so well and nicely with me I really do.
> He said and quote. You overclocked it right? And I was like yup all the way to the motherboards limits along with ocing the ram. He was really cool about it as well.


Honesty. "This piece of carp cpu couldn't even take more than 1.9V on air! Please check the replacement to make sure the IMC can do 3000Mhz memory with the cpu at 5ghz with no more than 1.24V vcore please."
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Try cl8-11-7-24-1t at 2400mhz, that's ought to beat the other kit.


Could not get boot with tRAS at 24, 26 was the limit for pi 32m, that was where I got 7:54.
Still working on subs though.


----------



## stickg1

Anyone? Help?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Honesty. "This piece of carp cpu couldn't even take more than 1.9V on air! Please check the replacement to make sure the IMC can do 3000Mhz memory with the cpu at 5ghz with no more than 1.24V vcore please."
> Could not get boot with tRAS at 24, 26 was the limit for pi 32m, that was where I got 7:54.
> Still working on subs though.


lol @ Valgaur's honesty xD

..and, that's odd. You're using the same timings I put there? I'm gonna have to research this further...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Honesty. "This piece of carp cpu couldn't even take more than 1.9V on air! Please check the replacement to make sure the IMC can do 3000Mhz memory with the cpu at 5ghz with no more than 1.24V vcore please."
> Could not get boot with tRAS at 24, 26 was the limit for pi 32m, that was where I got 7:54.
> Still working on subs though.


Exactly.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Anyone? Help?


Not sure you can use that IHS, p4's are good only for training on the delid, i believe.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I was considering using one of those to lap it and replace the original IHS...but I haven't tried yet.
Perhaps I can make a me a 3770k ihs necklace with it xD


----------



## alancsalt

Guys, RMA fraud is not allowed to be be discussed in the forums. Seriously.
Please ensure the whole group knows this.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Point taken.-


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Guys, RMA fraud is not allowed to be be discussed in the forums. Seriously.
> Please ensure the whole group knows this.


Sorry about that. Forgot my own rule.

I just got off the phone of ASUS as well and they really think its the bios chip is dead but he said its. a chance of the cpu. So due time will tell. Only 2 hours left.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd go with the mobo first...rma sell replacement buy rog board lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go with the mobo first...rma sell replacement buy rog board lol


Or get bios chip for 15 bucks.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Or get bios chip for 15 bucks.


Well, if you had a UD5H you could just use a switch and use the 2nd bios.


----------



## Valgaur

Yeah yeah yeah


----------



## stickg1

Has anyone in here delidded one of those P4's? That was extremely simple and if the i5-3570k is that easy I will do it right now. Just makes me a little nervous knowing that right now if I mess up my chip I cant afford to replace it.

The glue on the P4 cut really easy. I just cut the corners and the cut the two sides and it was off like a prom dress...


----------



## ivanlabrie

The 3570/3770k are equally easy to delid with a single edge razor (really sharp and thin ones)...specially if you cut through it in a single motion.


----------



## junkerde

lol yeah, the whole fraud thing.


----------



## kgtuning

How's that for Cinebench? today was the first time using it. Wish I had a gpu but I'll get one at some point.


----------



## Arm3nian

Speaking of ram.... this is [email protected] Lol

Sure beats my raid 0 ssds by about... 24 times


----------



## ivanlabrie

You set up a ram disk?








Nice! now you can run some pcmark05 with it.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quick question. Going to delid my i5 soon. I put coollaboratory liquid pro or ultra on the die. Do I also use it on the IHS? Or use my MX-4 on the IHS. On a lot of thermal paste round-ups coollabs isnt usually mentioned so im not sure if it is more of a specialty thermal paste. You gusy like pro or ultra?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Quick question. Going to delid my i5 soon. I put coollaboratory liquid pro or ultra on the die. Do I also use it on the IHS? Or use my MX-4 on the IHS. On a lot of thermal paste round-ups coollabs isnt usually mentioned so im not sure if it is more of a specialty thermal paste. You gusy like pro or ultra?


Pro for me, I use it on both the die and on ihs


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Quick question. Going to delid my i5 soon. I put coollaboratory liquid pro or ultra on the die. Do I also use it on the IHS? Or use my MX-4 on the IHS. On a lot of thermal paste round-ups coollabs isnt usually mentioned so im not sure if it is more of a specialty thermal paste. You gusy like pro or ultra?


Use pro on Die..

Do not use pro on IHS unless u do not mind lapping the IHS.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You set up a ram disk?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice! now you can run some pcmark05 with it.


I'm actually gonna install LoL on it at first, and troll people when I load basically instantly LOL. I mean with my raid 0 setup I've never been beaten in load, time for this.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Pro for me, I use it on both the die and on ihs


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Use pro on Die..
> Do not use pro on IHS unless u do not mind lapping the IHS.


thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> thanks


NP Enjoy


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ohh btw. Intel told me that the cpu of the 3770Ks are only ment to use 1333 and 1600 mhz. Yeah I kid you not if your mobo supports higher ram good for the mobo the i7 wont. He explained it as clear as day on this as well.
> I get the other board shot in 4 hours.


Intel officially supports memory up to 1600MHz on IB chips sam as officially they supported only 1333MHz on SB and yet everybody used mem kits up to 2133MHz (max allowed in BIOS) on Z68







and same as everybody uses 2400-2667mhz performance kits on z77 ... you overclocked the cpu to 5.5GHz, are you worried about the speed of ram being too high or what?









as per the other part, so wait ... wut? that chip killed another board in 4 hours or I am misreading you? glad you got it RMA'd, always pays off to try, it's not like Intel didn't calculate the costs of all RMAs anyways, they won't get poorer because of you for sure, there is a budget for that








... personally however I'd use Intel Performance Tuning Plan ($25 for 3770K replacement) for such replacements, at least would make my conscience clean








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Well, if you had a UD5H you could just use a switch and use the 2nd bios.


rog boards have 2 BIOSes as well ... I use BIOS1 for latest version testing and fallback to BIOS2 (old good 704 revision) if any serious trouble shows up








my former EVGA z77 FTW had 3 BIOSes, at some point I managed to corrupt BIOS1 & BIOS2 and had to use BIOS3 to recover the other two (yeah it's possible on those boards even if they do not boot up anymore on such corrupted BIOS).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> How's that for Cinebench? today was the first time using it. Wish I had a gpu but I'll get one at some point.


dude! you beat me







very nice, grats!








Now, you make me want to stabilize 5.2GHz under Cinebench just to see


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> How's that for Cinebench? today was the first time using it. Wish I had a gpu but I'll get one at some point.


How is you getting those scores.. ..>.>


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> How's that for Cinebench? today was the first time using it. Wish I had a gpu but I'll get one at some point.


Great job *kgtuning*! Post that on the IB Stable/Suicide thread and I can add it to the bench spreadsheet over there. It will be second best score!


----------



## Gomi

Right, just about to make the first "insertion" - Had a minor set-back as my brother came over with panic in his eyes - He found plasticizer in his build, and of course did not install a drain-pipe when he did his loop. God, that was a nightmare to empty out.

Anyhow, quick question from my Macbook (Yah! So I have one, I blame it on the wife who wanted something pretty and shiny!) - Are there any particular Ivybridge batch-numbers ? Been googling without luck.

Just saw that my 3770K is batch 3218B975, but that tells nothing.


----------



## Gomi

Done!

That took ... 10 minutes ?

Used:



They are so paper-thin you can actully flex/bend it with your fingers. It slipped right in, was easy to control and worked like a charm


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Anyhow, quick question from my Macbook (Yah! So I have one, I blame it on the wife who wanted something pretty and shiny!) - Are there any particular Ivybridge batch-numbers ? Been googling without luck.
> Just saw that my 3770K is batch 3218B975, but that tells nothing.


some say there are batches that are better then others,
Batch#: 3217B554 (Costa Rica) is mine, nothing special tho..lol
its still a lottery to get a good one, i think Feniks has one batch that he says is good..

Good luck with the delid Gomi








turn off the phone, door bell, and take your time









edit,
good job on the delid, Gratz..








make a pic of the delidded chip ?


----------



## Gomi

Picture comming up in 10 minutes (Just gonna edit this post).

In other news:

Holy batman!

That aint thermal paste Intel used, it feels more like the bathroom epoxy you use to mount sinks with. I actully had to use force with a fingernail to remove it, and then give it a PROPER turn with a lint free cloth. Its all gone now though, going to use the stuff that Indigo Xtreme comes with, that stuff cleans up everything.

As for the black "glue" - I managed to get 99.9 % of it off from the chip itself - For the IHS I used a Dremel, some 95 % alcohol and a coffee cup. End result:

A freely spinning IHS when placed on top of the chip









(Still abit left on the IHS, but as it is spinning freely when placed upon the chip, I will consider it job done).

Quick question:

Do I also put CL Pro on the the inside of the IHS, there seems to be conflicting reports about this ?
Personally I see no need, as the die is already making direct contact to the IHS (Because of the glue removal).
What did you guys do ?

Just: Die - TIM - IHS - TIM ?
Or: Die - TIM - TIM - IHS - TIM ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Picture comming up in 10 minutes (Just gonna edit this post).
> In other news:
> Holy batman!
> That aint thermal paste Intel used, it feels more like the bathroom epoxy you use to mount sinks with. I actully had to use force with a fingernail to remove it, and then give it a PROPER turn with a lint free cloth. Its all gone now though, going to use the stuff that Indigo Xtreme comes with, that stuff cleans up everything.
> As for the black "glue" - I managed to get 99.9 % of it off from the chip itself - For the IHS I used a Dremel, some 95 % alcohol and a coffee cup. End result:
> A freely spinning IHS when placed on top of the chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Still abit left on the IHS, but as it is spinning freely when placed upon the chip, I will consider it job done).


nice, gave using a dremel to clean ihs/pcb as a tip a while ago,
never used it myself tho, how did it work for you?

gotta love that freely spinning ihs on the die right ...lol


some leftover adhesive isnt bad, if it spins, its good enough,
just make sure there isnt any left on the sides,

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Quick question:
> Do I also put CL Pro on the the inside of the IHS, there seems to be conflicting reports about this ?
> Personally I see no need, as the die is already making direct contact to the IHS (Because of the glue removal).
> What did you guys do ?
> Just: Die - TIM - IHS - TIM ?
> Or: Die - TIM - TIM - IHS - TIM ?


i did very thin layers on die, inside ihs, on ihs, base plate cooler..
you dont have to tho, others have good results with single layers also..
but i figured it already starts to fill the gaps when applied, and the liquid tents to stick together again if it touches..
in other words, you can do both ..np


----------



## Valgaur

Welp. The long awaited verdict has flown upon us from heavenly or satanic winged beats from the nether world. Franky is done in this world. He tried to post on the other mobo and nothing sadly. Good news is that its not my mobo thaat isn't having issues. Mobo works fine just 00 means cpu for me apparently or just wont run since it had a dead cpu. I5 posted no probs on it. Oh well to the heavens for ye you powerful Frankstien!


----------



## Gomi

Still some black glue inside IHS, mainly in the grooves. Will clean that up with a toothpick.

Though, before I can even start putting on the CL Pro I have to get the motherboard ready (It is still boxed) and so forth.

Will have another update later today


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Welp. The long awaited verdict has flown upon us from heavenly or satanic winged beats from the nether world. Franky is done in this world. He tried to post on the other mobo and nothing sadly. Good news is that its not my mobo thaat isn't having issues. Mobo works fine just 00 means cpu for me apparently or just wont run since it had a dead cpu. I5 posted no probs on it. Oh well to the heavens for ye you powerful Frankstien!


guess he couldnt handle the voltage... R.I.P Franky


sorry for your loss Val, i would go crazy if anything would happen to my BamBam,
got no money to replace so ..that would hurt..no computer for months ..omg..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Still some black glue inside IHS, mainly in the grooves. Will clean that up with a toothpick.
> Though, before I can even start putting on the CL Pro I have to get the motherboard ready (It is still boxed) and so forth.
> Will have another update later today
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


looks good so far, nice n clean








yea, took of the adhesive in the grooves with backside boxcutter,
toothpick will be safer tho


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Welp. The long awaited verdict has flown upon us from heavenly or satanic winged beats from the nether world. Franky is done in this world. He tried to post on the other mobo and nothing sadly. Good news is that its not my mobo thaat isn't having issues. Mobo works fine just 00 means cpu for me apparently or just wont run since it had a dead cpu. I5 posted no probs on it. Oh well to the heavens for ye you powerful Frankstien!


NOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!









Sorry to hear.


----------



## Gomi

So far so good.

CLP on the die: _Looks like the spread is un-even on the picture, but it looked ok RL (Crappy mobile / weird flash)._



CLP on IHS: _Again, crap quality - Sorry!_



Block on: _Followed VonDutch and applied CLP as: Die - CLP - CLP - IHS - CLP - CLP - Block._



Everything in PC: _Just need to pull the wires and tubing, connect it all to the MO-RA3 and I should have temperatures later tonight







_


----------



## ivanlabrie

R.I.P. Franky...a good chip who led the way and helped spread the marvels of delidding on this site.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> So far so good.
> CLP on the die: _Looks like the spread is un-even on the picture, but it looked ok RL (Crappy mobile / weird flash)._
> 
> CLP on IHS: _Again, crap quality - Sorry!_
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Block on: _Followed VonDutch and applied CLP as: Die - CLP - CLP - IHS - CLP - CLP - Block._
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Everything in PC: _Just need to pull the wires and tubing, connect it all to the MO-RA3 and I should have temperatures later tonight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


cant really tell, but it looks like the CLP is floating on the die?

like this, its way to much see..thin layers is the key if you use it on all sides,
whats to much will get pushed out, like any tim btw, but CLP is more runny then most other tim's,
like you see in this pic,
you can use the seringe to suck it up again if its to much


----------



## Gomi

Thanks again VonDutch -

Will demount the block and re-do / check - Better safe than sorry.

And thanks for the tip about sucking it back up - If I made the error (And it looks like it) and there are areas where I *CANNOT* suck it back up, can I use the alcohol wipe and wipe it off ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Thanks again VonDutch -
> Will demount the block and re-do / check - Better safe than sorry.
> And thanks for the tip about sucking it back up - If I made the error (And it looks like it) and there are areas where I *CANNOT* suck it back up, can I use the alcohol wipe and wipe it off ?


Yw








yep, just wipe it off with alcohol..np.. or whats the word ..dap, dab ..pat? grrr some words ...lol(deppen is the dutch word)


----------



## Gomi

Ha ha, I understand









Thanks alot! Really thankful and relived a potential problem been averted before I attached all the tubing and filled "her" up.

Should I have CLP all over, I will post a few pictures - At least it can stand as a warning - This stuff is tricky to apply!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Welp. The long awaited verdict has flown upon us from heavenly or satanic winged beats from the nether world. Franky is done in this world. He tried to post on the other mobo and nothing sadly. Good news is that its not my mobo thaat isn't having issues. Mobo works fine just 00 means cpu for me apparently or just wont run since it had a dead cpu. I5 posted no probs on it. Oh well to the heavens for ye you powerful Frankstien!


Sorry to hear that, but at least you still have the mobo and have a new chip coming.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Ha ha, I understand
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks alot! Really thankful and relived a potential problem been averted before I attached all the tubing and filled "her" up.
> Should I have CLP all over, I will post a few pictures - At least it can stand as a warning - This stuff is tricky to apply!


Yeah, Must be really thin layer on die and on the IHS, very thin really... Just spread good and if ANY puddles, suck back up, it will look like it doesn't have enough but it will be enough, trust me. Also, since you are WCing, i would apply to the WC plate too, same as with the IHS.. will should gain another 5c doing that.

PS: send pics.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> So far so good.
> CLP on the die: _Looks like the spread is un-even on the picture, but it looked ok RL (Crappy mobile / weird flash)._
> 
> CLP on IHS: _Again, crap quality - Sorry!_
> 
> Block on: _Followed VonDutch and applied CLP as: Die - CLP - CLP - IHS - CLP - CLP - Block._
> 
> Everything in PC: _Just need to pull the wires and tubing, connect it all to the MO-RA3 and I should have temperatures later tonight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _


Holy UP7 Batman


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How is you getting those scores.. ..>.>


Magic....lol idk really. Its 5.2 GHz hit on, 2133mhz 16gb of ram. I will rerun it when I get home from work.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh i get 10.30 at 5.2ghz with 2400mhz ram.. u must have tight timings?


----------



## ivanlabrie

2400 cl11 sucks...you need to go for 2666 cl9-12-12 or tighten your subtimings.
What are your ram settings atm Hokies?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Right, just about to make the first "insertion" - Had a minor set-back as my brother came over with panic in his eyes - He found plasticizer in his build, and of course did not install a drain-pipe when he did his loop. God, that was a nightmare to empty out.
> Anyhow, quick question from my Macbook (Yah! So I have one, I blame it on the wife who wanted something pretty and shiny!) - Are there any particular Ivybridge batch-numbers ? Been googling without luck.
> Just saw that my 3770K is batch 3218B975, but that tells nothing.


LOLs on plasticizer







been there done that ... just swap the tubing to a different brand ... especially if it was Primochill Pro LRT (it does that) ... I went with Feser UV Active after such unpleasant discovery and never a problem since.

3218B is the golden batch, enjoy!


----------



## stickg1

I'm going to delid tonight. Any final pieces of advice? I'm going to use Antec Formula 7 inside and out. Do I need to spread it on the die or will grain of rice and pressure spread work?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm going to delid tonight. Any final pieces of advice? I'm going to use Antec Formula 7 inside and out. Do I need to spread it on the die or will grain of rice and pressure spread work?


Spreading it on the die is the best way. I used to use Antec Formula 7 before I got some Liquid Ultra. It's quite thick so what I did was put it in a zip lock bag and leave it in some boiling water for 10 mins or so. This will allow you to spread it more easily. It's also a good idea to tint the IHS and the CPU cooler base first. There's a link in my sig displaying my results after tinting


----------



## Hokies83

I have 2400mhz Cas 10


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Spreading it on the die is the best way. I used to use Antec Formula 7 before I got some Liquid Ultra. It's quite thick so what I did was put it in a zip lock bag and leave it in some boiling water for 10 mins or so. This will allow you to spread it more easily. It's also a good idea to tint the IHS and the CPU cooler base first. There's a link in my sig displaying my results after tinting


Dang, I hate spreading formula 7. It's so thick! I either blast the tube with a hot hair drier for a couple minutes or stick it in boiling water. I tried to spread on my 560ti, it was a nightmare.


----------



## tw33k

When I tinted my chip and heatsink, I wrapped cling wrap around my finger and spread the paste. Easy as


----------



## feniks

tinted a chip and heatsink?







what does it mean?


----------



## Hokies83

Meh guess ill have to wait for Haswell to try and top that top xeon chip in Cinebench.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> tinted a chip and heatsink?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what does it mean?


It means instead of just applying the paste in the normal manner ie: a dot or a line, you rub it in first; kind of stain the surface, then apply the paste


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> It means instead of just applying the paste in the normal manner ie: a dot or a line, you rub it in first; kind of stain the surface, then apply the paste


gotcha, thanks for explaining! didn't know it's called like that hehe ...


----------



## tw33k

There's a link in my sig to results I posted after I tinted my Phanteks in my AMD system. Temps dropped almost 8c after tinting


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh guess ill have to wait for Haswell to try and top that top xeon chip in Cinebench.


try 5.3ghz


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> It means instead of just applying the paste in the normal manner ie: a dot or a line, you rub it in first; kind of stain the surface, then apply the paste


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> gotcha, thanks for explaining! didn't know it's called like that hehe ...


see..rub it in is the way ...lol


----------



## Valgaur

I really hope von volts heim can take volts like franky did. If as well or just plain better. I really don't care to be honest. No computer for me at home for christmas though lol. Gonna take a while to get used to.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> see..rub it in is the way ...lol


true, rubbing in it must be and always has been








let's go rubbing!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really hope von volts heim can take volts like franky did. If as well or just plain better. I really don't care to be honest. No computer for me at home for christmas though lol. Gonna take a while to get used to.


I hope you get a better one too. I got three after my first just "OK" chip died, and they have all been worse than it! Yet *tw33k* just got a new one (after 4 tries I think) and it looks great!

Bummer about no computer for Christmas....


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOLs on plasticizer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> been there done that ... just swap the tubing to a different brand ... especially if it was Primochill Pro LRT (it does that) ... I went with Feser UV Active after such unpleasant discovery and never a problem since.
> 3218B is the golden batch, enjoy!


Ofc its my brand of tubing you mentioned... it fogged up in 1 sec of use and uv doesnt actually work. Blue looks nice tho.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ofc its my brand of tubing you mentioned... it fogged up in 1 sec of use and uv doesnt actually work. Blue looks nice tho.


Lol yah, my brother was using Primo aswell - Think he had it in for 2 weeks, tops, and it looked like cream cheese in there.

As a sidenote, for this build I was looking for some real good tubing - Every single topic I came across was loving the slightly expensive Tygon R3603 - So I bought 7 meters of it - Only to find new reports a few days after that this tubing leaches even worse than Primo.

*SIGH FACE*!

At least I got a real unique garden hose now


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Lol yah, my brother was using Primo aswell - Think he had it in for 2 weeks, tops, and it looked like cream cheese in there.
> As a sidenote, for this build I was looking for some real good tubing - Every single topic I came across was loving the slightly expensive Tygon R3603 - So I bought 7 meters of it - Only to find new reports a few days after that this tubing leaches even worse than Primo.
> *SIGH FACE*!
> At least I got a real unique garden hose now


The are all equally as bad lol. Masterkleer turns yellow, primo foggs, tygon and feser have plasticizer problems, and the rest all of em combined lmao.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have 2400mhz Cas 10


2133 with tighter timings and subs will beat ya...
Try cas9-11-11-21-1t at 1.75v and try to tighten twl, trrsr and twr at least.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh guess ill have to wait for Haswell to try and top that top xeon chip in Cinebench.


More core clock and tighter timings should do it really...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i get 10.30 at 5.2ghz with 2400mhz ram.. u must have tight timings?


sorry it took so long, I just got home from work... my timings are as follows. 10-11-10-28-2N Ram is 16 gbs of ripjaws


----------



## Hokies83

Think im 10-11-11-32 t2 2400mhz.

But after Valguar killed his chip messing with Ram ima leave the IMC alone >.>


----------



## chris-br

What do you guys think about this? 4.7 [email protected]


temps are still good on my point of view. And yes, i do need that much vcore to be stable without whea erros.

BTW: I'm in offset mode.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Think im 10-11-11-32 t2 2400mhz.
> But after Valguar killed his chip messing with Ram ima leave the IMC alone >.>


I'm happy with mine at 2133mhz. lol. I would have to loosen the timings too much to go any higher.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> What do you guys think about this? 4.7 [email protected]
> 
> temps are still good on my point of view. And yes, i do need that much vcore to be stable without whea erros.
> BTW: I'm in offset mode.


looks good, vcore can be more or less as you know, depending on the chip..np..
but i look at your pic of eventviewer, you sure you look in the right place for them?

its, custom views, administrative events..


----------



## chris-br

Yeah, no whea erros.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Yeah, no whea erros.


kk cool








just making sure ..lol


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> kk cool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just making sure ..lol


Also, i was getting close to 90c before LP on that test, now I'm running 200mhz more and temps still 20C less. lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Also, i was getting close to 90c before LP on that test, now I'm running 200mhz more and temps still 20C less. lol


4.4ghz was my max before delid,
4.5ghz prime hit 105C within seconds,
after delid, i could run 4.8ghz easy, 76C hottest core after 24H prime ..lol



G'nite all


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hokies: no need to worry, Val probably killed it for doing more than 1.6v on air....1.9 is TOO much, you need sub zero temps for that, heck it's even more than max dice (-78c) vcore!!!
Also, another way to instakill it would be to push over 1.35v vtt/imc volts on air, at least it would degrade the imc in no time.

Using up to 1.7v on dram and 1.2v/1.15v vtt/imc is plenty for benching modern sticks and REALLY safe.

As you wish though, it's your gear.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hokies: no need to worry, Val probably killed it for doing more than 1.6v on air....1.9 is TOO much, you need sub zero temps for that, heck it's even more than max dice (-78c) vcore!!!
> Also, another way to instakill it would be to push over 1.35v vtt/imc volts on air, at least it would degrade the imc in no time.
> Using up to 1.7v on dram and 1.2v/1.15v vtt/imc is plenty for benching modern sticks and REALLY safe.
> As you wish though, it's your gear.


I only had 1.98 vcore pumping in along with 1.15 vtt imc and 1.75 dram. Then he got tired lol


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I only had 1.98 vcore pumping in along with 1.15 vtt imc and 1.75 dram. Then he got tired lol


only 1.98 volts... wow just wow


----------



## stickg1

Well I didn't kill my chip. I don't think I did the best job though. I think I was a little heavy on the Formula 7 on top and inbetween. That stuff is hard to spread!

Anyway I did shave a few temps and I got the lid off without killing the CPU. Here's some results. I will order some Coolabs Pro soon...

*BEFORE*


*AFTER*


As you can see, 7C drop in temps. Which is better than nothing, but I think I could improve with a better paste application and just better paste period. Also I didn't quite get all the glue off, I got enough so the IHS could move freely though.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I only had 1.98 vcore pumping in along with 1.15 vtt imc and 1.75 dram. Then he got tired lol
> 
> 
> 
> only 1.98 volts... wow just wow
Click to expand...

holy moly....that's a lot of volts -> you electrocuted Franky!!!









but he died in the name of OC science and knowledge......few who knew Franky will forget his sacrifice.....brave brave Franky.....


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well I didn't kill my chip. I don't think I did the best job though. I think I was a little heavy on the Formula 7 on top and inbetween. That stuff is hard to spread!
> 
> Anyway I did shave a few temps and I got the lid off without killing the CPU. Here's some results. I will order some Coolabs Pro soon...
> 
> *BEFORE*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *AFTER*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see, 7C drop in temps. Which is better than nothing, but I think I could improve with a better paste application and just better paste period. Also I didn't quite get all the glue off, I got enough so the IHS could move freely though.


What you need to do to get the big temp drops is use CL PRO or CL Ultra. We see this happen often with attempts at other otherwise fine TIMS as they just don't do this job well.

I'd suggest trying some CL PRO or Ultra to see.

Also, might be concave IHS - which is only fixed through lapping the IHS - but can gain ~10C if it is the problem...


----------



## stickg1

Well one benefit is it seems to scale well at higher voltages. I got 4.6ghz running IBT right now on 1.41v and the temps are in the high 70s. I was in the mid 70s at 4.4 & 1.32v before delid.


----------



## Hokies83

try 4.8ghz 1.48v


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> try 4.8ghz 1.48v


That might get too hot, i hit 80C doing 1.42v (1.41v wasnt completely stable)

I'll try it in a few minutes.


----------



## SimpleTech

@stickg1, what is with your GFlops? SP1 installed? Using the latest Linpack? That is horribly low.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> @stickg1, what is with your GFlops? SP1 installed? Using the latest Linpack? That is horribly low.


I actually don't have SP1 nor do I have updated linpacks. I didnt install SP1 because it messed up my steam install on my last rig. Might have just been my glitchy all AMD system though. I'll try to install it now. I'll get an updated IBT also.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> try 4.8ghz 1.48v


I couldn't even get 4.7GHz stable at 1.49v. So...yeah, that sucks.


----------



## valkeriefire

I just got a 3770k on Black Friday, so I'm new to the delidding. I did a quick OC to 4.6ghz @1.3v (+0.7 offset) and all else stock. It was stable for everything I threw at it with temps up to 75-80c on a noctua nh-d14. I tried for 4.8 ghz on 1.33 but I had programs fail to open so knew it was unstable and would need more voltage.

Based on that, is there any advantage me delidding for me? Sounds like my chip is decent if many can't get pass 4.4 without delidding.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ofc its my brand of tubing you mentioned... it fogged up in 1 sec of use and uv doesnt actually work. Blue looks nice tho.


yeah, it happens nearly to everybody owning the newer batches of this tubing (mine was purchased from frozencpu on 06/06/2012) and was equally bad...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Lol yah, my brother was using Primo aswell - Think he had it in for 2 weeks, tops, and it looked like cream cheese in there.
> As a sidenote, for this build I was looking for some real good tubing - Every single topic I came across was loving the slightly expensive Tygon R3603 - So I bought 7 meters of it - Only to find new reports a few days after that this tubing leaches even worse than Primo.
> *SIGH FACE*!
> At least I got a real unique garden hose now


yeah, somehow I knew that








guys, just look at this thread, skim through it and you will understand how MANY people had this problem .. and yet Primochill denied everything plainly lying to our faces and claimed only 5% users have this problem ... yet they came up with new "problem-free" model of tubing called Advanced LRT ... wondering why if only "5%" had the issue to start with ... or rather the issue never existed (they even officially debunked that "myth" on their blog and yet they came up with a solution to a non-existent problem, huh) ... they are liars ...
http://www.overclock.net/t/1199158/plasticizer-problems-discussion-gallery
only 215 pages of complaining mostly on Primoflex Pro LRT ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> The are all equally as bad lol. Masterkleer turns yellow, primo foggs, tygon and feser have plasticizer problems, and the rest all of em combined lmao.


Tygoon own Duralene, both are slightly different, but Duralane seems to be the best clear tubing (excellent for using Mayhems dyes), while among colored tubing the Feser actually wins big time, all the rest are just cheap imposters including XSPC (terrible yellow clouding in 2 weeks) or Masterkleer whatever (yet better than Primo Pro LRT)








totally unknown is how well/poor the new Primo Advanced LRT performs, time will tell, but for sure their CEO (Brian) and Customer Service is picky in RMA and shunned many complainers from getting replacements (including me) because "we were NOT nice to them" (***, what again?) ... yeah ....


----------



## kgtuning

I have Tygon 3603 and it clouds within 3-4 weeks. sucks. flexibility is nice but it clouds.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That might get too hot, i hit 80C doing 1.42v (1.41v wasnt completely stable)
> I'll try it in a few minutes.


Your good to 95 c bro.


----------



## chris-br

I'm not worry about temps, but about vcore, what is the max on air?


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm not worry about temps, but about vcore, what is the max on air?


Most old school overclockers probably wouldn't breach 1.45v for 24/7 or 1.55v for suicide missions...based on what they've seen with older CPUs, but it's individual choice whether you go further (or don't even go that far!)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hokies: no need to worry, Val probably killed it for doing more than 1.6v on air....1.9 is TOO much, you need sub zero temps for that, heck it's even more than max dice (-78c) vcore!!!
> Also, another way to instakill it would be to push over 1.35v vtt/imc volts on air, at least it would degrade the imc in no time.
> Using up to 1.7v on dram and 1.2v/1.15v vtt/imc is plenty for benching modern sticks and REALLY safe.
> As you wish though, it's your gear.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm not worry about temps, but about vcore, what is the max on air?


You'll hit the temperature threshold before you hit the voltage threshold.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm not worry about temps, but about vcore, what is the max on air?
> 
> 
> 
> You'll hit the temperature threshold before you hit the voltage threshold.
Click to expand...

....unless you delid - then you'll hit voltage limit first....


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> You'll hit the temperature threshold before you hit the voltage threshold.


not after deliding ...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I actually don't have SP1 nor do I have updated linpacks. I didnt install SP1 because it messed up my steam install on my last rig. Might have just been my glitchy all AMD system though. I'll try to install it now. I'll get an updated IBT also.
> I couldn't even get 4.7GHz stable at 1.49v. So...yeah, that sucks.












You can not do 4.7ghz with almost 1.5v @[email protected] Dude that is like the worst ive seen.. Shouda Rmaed that thing


----------



## ripsaw

just ordered my 3770k, it'll be in tomorrow at the store.







Can anyone confirm that the p4 chip marked as SL5YR is pasted to IHS and not soldered? Found it in my basement, want to practice







Thanx in advance


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can not do 4.7ghz with almost 1.5v @[email protected] Dude that is like the worst ive seen.. Shouda Rmaed that thing


Too late for that! Besides even if I run it at 4.2GHz it's still plenty fast for my needs. I'm just having fun trying to OC it and delid.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> just ordered my 3770k, it'll be in tomorrow at the store.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can anyone confirm that the p4 chip marked as SL5YR is pasted to IHS and not soldered? Found it in my basement, want to practice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanx in advance


I have an SL5VJ and it delids. Try it out, a replacement is about $3 on ebay if you really need that chip and you mess it up. It has pins instead of pads on the bottom so if you do plan on using it after delid be careful not to bend any.

Question: How do I update my linpack for IBT? I've googled it a few different ways and haven't found anything.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Alan, what's with my quote?








Just sayin'...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> ....unless you delid - then you'll hit voltage limit first....


how do u no ur voltage limit


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Question: How do I update my linpack for IBT? I've googled it a few different ways and haven't found anything.


http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?197835-IntelBurnTest-The-new-stress-testing-program


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> how do u no ur voltage limit


Voltage limit is 1.52 according to intel. Or if you have a crap ass workstation motherboard like me about 1.45. I have amazing cooling. 50c @1.4v max load, but can't go any higher cause either I BSOD trying to get 5ghz or my mobo doesn't allow me.


----------



## SimpleTech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?197835-IntelBurnTest-The-new-stress-testing-program


He is asking how, not the program itself.

To update Linpack, first download the latest *here* (Windows package). Navigate to *benchmarks\linpack\* and you will find two of the needed files, labeled *linpack_xeon32.exe* and *linpack_xeon64.exe*.

Rename them to:

linpack32.exe
linpack64.exe

And replace them in the LinData folder.

Simple as that.

The Linpack version in the latest IBT 2.54 on XtremeSystems has a Stamp Date: *‎Wednesday, ‎June ‎06, ‎2012 4:04:24 PM*

The latest as of this post is ‎*Wednesday, ‎October ‎10, ‎2012 1:31:12 PM*


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> only 1.98 volts... wow just wow


Nothing wrong with 1.98V vcore. Just have to get the cpu temp close to -198° if you don't want to hurt it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Voltage limit is 1.52 according to intel. Or if you have a crap ass workstation motherboard like me about 1.45. I have amazing cooling. 50c @1.4v max load, but can't go any higher cause either I BSOD trying to get 5ghz or my mobo doesn't allow me.


ok thats when my fixed voltage turns RED in the bios. lol
and i only have the extreme4 by asrock i hit 5.2 at max voltage shouldent be that bad of a board compared to mine








http://valid.canardpc.com/2598115


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> He is asking how, not the program itself.
> To update Linpack, first download the latest *here* (Windows package). Navigate to *benchmarks\linpack\* and you will find two of the needed files, labeled *linpack_xeon32.exe* and *linpack_xeon64.exe*.
> Rename them to:
> linpack32.exe
> linpack64.exe
> And replace them in the LinData folder.
> Simple as that.
> The Linpack version in the latest IBT 2.54 on XtremeSystems has a Stamp Date: *‎Wednesday, ‎June ‎06, ‎2012 4:04:24 PM*
> The latest as of this post is ‎*Wednesday, ‎October ‎10, ‎2012 1:31:12 PM*


yeah, you made a point. however his linpack must be REAL old if it can't produce even the correct GFlops under load of his CPU ... aka the whole IBT was most likely old ... just saying ... IBT is no longer my stress tester of choice as despite the extreme temperatures it generates, it doesn't really prove any stability at all ... Cinebench 11.5 x64 does however, at MUCH lower temperatues and just 30 seconds ...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok thats when my fixed voltage turns RED in the bios. lol
> and i only have the extreme4 by asrock i hit 5.2 at max voltage shouldent be that bad of a board compared to mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2598115


Its not that bad of a board just terrible for oc to the point that we are. Over 1.45 i get instant bsod, and there is no switch to turn off overvoltage error over 1.55. 4.9 is good enough for me 24/7.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> not after deliding ...


lol...forgot I was in the delidded thread


----------



## snelan

Delidded, seeing core temps of about 90c max at 4.7GHz, 1.35VCore (all I tested up to before just going with 4.6GHz @ 1.31VCore.

I used MX4, but just ordered some Liquid Pro, I think then I will be able to use higher voltages without hitting 90c.

Thoughts?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Most old school overclockers probably wouldn't breach 1.45v for 24/7 or 1.55v for suicide missions...based on what they've seen with older CPUs, but it's individual choice whether you go further (or don't even go that far!)


Yup. Don't OC unless you know the consequences. I knew what I was getting into so don't do crazy things unless you have the thoughts that it could break.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> how do u no ur voltage limit


Its either a personal limit you set yourself. Or a motherboard limit. Or even a chip limit where you will need to bump the vcore up tremendously.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nothing wrong with 1.98V vcore. Just have to get the cpu temp close to -198° if you don't want to hurt it.


Yup I did 1.98 7 times before that guess number 8 wasn't nice to him.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Delidded, seeing core temps of about 90c max at 4.7GHz, 1.35VCore (all I tested up to before just going with 4.6GHz @ 1.31VCore.
> I used MX4, but just ordered some Liquid Pro, I think then I will be able to use higher voltages without hitting 90c.
> Thoughts?


Clean the glue off the pcb on the chip. If not that take a look at your ihs and see how concave or convex it is. Then get back to us.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Exactly my point! Juust don't blame the ram ocing or faeries lol








Ah, my mobo should get here soon...I decided to get a lesser 21.5" ips 1080 screen instead of the 1440 korean one's after a bad experience with dhl and customs.
I'll be spending 417usd after taz and shipping vs 711usd!
I can get a pot, dice and more ram xD or even one more 3770k!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm not worry about temps, but about vcore, what is the max on air?


1.52V vcore is what intel recommends as MAX vcore, its related to max VID in there datasheets,
Max. 1.55V vcore on air/h2o is what sin0822 says in his guide,
recommended range on air is 1.3- 1.45V vcore..

theres a difference between Max, and whats recommended


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> I just got a 3770k on Black Friday, so I'm new to the delidding. I did a quick OC to 4.6ghz @1.3v (+0.7 offset) and all else stock. It was stable for everything I threw at it with temps up to 75-80c on a noctua nh-d14. I tried for 4.8 ghz on 1.33 but I had programs fail to open so knew it was unstable and would need more voltage.
> Based on that, is there any advantage me delidding for me? Sounds like my chip is decent if many can't get pass 4.4 without delidding.


Depends, if you want to go higher with your oc's, youll run into max temps before max vcore,
looks to me you can run 4.7ghz as max without hitting to high temps,
if youre just looking for a very nice oc, like 4.6-4.7ghz, then i wouldnt delid it,
no need for that with your temps


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Delidded, seeing core temps of about 90c max at 4.7GHz, 1.35VCore (all I tested up to before just going with 4.6GHz @ 1.31VCore.
> I used MX4, but just ordered some Liquid Pro, I think then I will be able to use higher voltages without hitting 90c.
> Thoughts?


try again?
besides that your ihs can be concave, i would first remount again, and see if it helps,
90C is way to high, whatever tim you use, i used AS5 at first, but still saw a 10+C drop in temps

to get a first glance if its concave or not, is easy to do it like this, without lapping it, use a ruler,

couldnt find i pic with a ihs, but youll get my point i hope


----------



## snelan

Will reseat, and check for concave or convex. I did clean all the glue off the IHS.

Just for reference, I get about 58c max temp under full load at stock clocks delidded.

EDIT: Just reseated, cleaned everything, and re-applied all TIM. Seeing about a 7c drop in temps just from that. I believe I may have used too much TIM on the die last time. at 4.6GHz 1.308VCore, my max temps are about 79c-80c in RealTempGT. (Does this read core or die temp?)

Also, everything looked good, no concave on the die, IHS, or my D14.

EDIT 2: Just out of curiosity, is it just that Ivy is not as good of an overclocker as Sandy per volt, or that we think it is more sensitive to volts on the 22nm fab process so we just don't go as high on the voltage? I was going to say that the higher Ivy OC's I see without special cooling are around 4.7-4.8GHz 24/7, while Sandy was 5-5.1GHz. However, while writing this, I realized that most of us, including me, would bring our Sandy's to 1.5VCore, while with Ivy it seems 1.4 is the highest useful voltage until it starts getting pretty hot. I believe this 3770k could hit the same speeds if I pumped that much voltage into it.

It took 1.536VCore to stabilize my 2600k at 5GHz, and that was a bad overclocker, I estimate it would take about 1.5-1.51VCore to stabilize this 3700k at 5GHz.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?197835-IntelBurnTest-The-new-stress-testing-program


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SimpleTech*
> 
> He is asking how, not the program itself.
> To update Linpack, first download the latest *here* (Windows package). Navigate to *benchmarks\linpack\* and you will find two of the needed files, labeled *linpack_xeon32.exe* and *linpack_xeon64.exe*.
> Rename them to:
> linpack32.exe
> linpack64.exe
> And replace them in the LinData folder.
> Simple as that.
> The Linpack version in the latest IBT 2.54 on XtremeSystems has a Stamp Date: *‎Wednesday, ‎June ‎06, ‎2012 4:04:24 PM*
> The latest as of this post is ‎*Wednesday, ‎October ‎10, ‎2012 1:31:12 PM*


Thanks, my GFlops are around 100-120 range now.


----------



## snelan

Ok, so seeing pretty much the same temps as before again. ~88c at 4.7GHz, 1.355VCore. However, one core (Core 0) is just sitting at a happy 75c during these tests, while the others are at almost 90c!

Does this mean uneven TIM on the die?


----------



## chris-br

Most likely. You will see a BIG difference on temps when you use the Liquid pro. Trust me.









Edit: i did use mx-4 before using the LP, from the start the temps dropped 12c, but after a while i was getting worse and worse temps... Once i got the LP and went to apply, i saw that the mx-4 was kinda dry and hard... So after the LP, i got like 27C drop on temps... I highly recommended it.


----------



## snelan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Most likely. You will see a BIG difference on temps when you use the Liquid pro. Trust me.


Yea, I was just looking at the specs of Liquid Pro, it has a heat thermal conductivity rating of around 82w/Mk, while I believe MX-4 is about 9w/Mk, correct me if I am wrong. That's like using a rock vs an ice cube.


----------



## Gomi

Right, so temps are definately down, by alot - Will post a picture as soon as I figured out the BIOS and settled at a overclock, because the z77x-UD7 sure as f*** got a HUGE BIOS to work through.

Did a SUPER cut and slash 4.8 Ghz @ 1.385 (I know it can do it at less, but just wanted to check temps.) - Average temps at around 55C after 10 runs with IntelBurnTest, The MO-RA3 is running semi-passive (700RPM on the fans), lol.

So yah, delid is really the way to go


----------



## snelan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Right, so temps are definately down, by alot - Will post a picture as soon as I figured out the BIOS and settled at a overclock, because the z77x-UD7 sure as f*** got a HUGE BIOS to work through.
> Did a SUPER cut and slash 4.8 Ghz @ 1.385 (I know it can do it at less, but just wanted to check temps.) - Average temps at around 55C after 10 runs with IntelBurnTest, The MO-RA3 is running semi-passive (700RPM on the fans), lol.
> So yah, delid is really the way to go


Dude, you make me want to make another custom loop. I ran a Rasa loop with my 2600k, but if I tried 1.385v on this D14, I would be at around 100c lol.

Are you using Liquid Pro?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Dude, you make me want to make another custom loop. I ran a Rasa loop with my 2600k, but if I tried 1.385v on this D14, I would be at around 100c lol.
> Are you using Liquid Pro?


Yup - Liquid pro inside and outside


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Yup - Liquid pro inside and outside


Liquid Pro on the outside doesn't weld the IHS to your block/heatsink?


----------



## Gomi

Weld is a pretty strong way to describe it - But yes, it _adheres_ .

Worst case scenario, you have to twist the heatsink off with abit of force to seperate the heatsink from the IHS.

The Liquid Pro CAN be a pain to get off though - For some its worth it, for others it is not. Go with what you feel - Using CLP *WILL* give you a temp drop.


----------



## snelan

Hey, some may even think of the adhesion as a plus! You wouldn't have to redo the TIM on the die every time you take the CPU out!

(Or do you because there is the release of pressure?)


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Weld is a pretty strong way to describe it - But yes, it _adheres_ .
> Worst case scenario, you have to twist the heatsink off with abit of force to seperate the heatsink from the IHS.
> The Liquid Pro CAN be a pain to get off though - For some its worth it, for others it is not. Go with what you feel - Using CLP *WILL* give you a temp drop.


Cool. I'm definitely using CLP between the cores and IHS when I do my delid but I'm still debating between CLP and my regular TIM (AS5) between the IHS and my waterblock.


----------



## snelan

As someone stated above, the CLP is useful on the die because of the small surface area, but you can use what ever you want on the IHS->Cooler, because it's such a big surface area.


----------



## stickg1

I'm gonna order some liquid pro, I can still use my Antec Formula 7 inbetween the IHS and the Kuhler pump right? I dont want to sand my kuhler and IHS if I ever have to take it off some reason.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm gonna order some liquid pro, I can still use my Antec Formula 7 inbetween the IHS and the Kuhler pump right? I dont want to sand my kuhler and IHS if I ever have to take it off some reason.


yea, its only on the die where liquid pro/ultra gives the best results,
on IHS any good tim will do








not much difference in temps compared to liquid pro/ultra,
i did use liquid pro on all sides tho, gave me 25+C tempdrop


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, its only on the die where liquid pro/ultra gives the best results,
> on IHS any good tim will do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not much difference in temps compared to liquid pro/ultra,
> i did use liquid pro on all sides tho, gave me 25+C tempdrop


Yeah, I don't know if you guys remember my situation but I have a pretty crappy chip. I think my max OC will be 4.7GHz unless I want to break that 1.52v barrier. I can run 4.7GHz at 1.51v but my temps get into the low 90s. I would like those temps to be in the high 70s low 80s. I already shaved 7C with my double Antec Formula 7 application but I think I went a little heavy on the paste. Or I could just run at 4.5GHz because I probably wont see much difference in gaming/browsing performance. I just like to tinker so it looks like my next project will be liquid pro on the die.


----------



## krich

I delidded my 3770K yesterday and though its the first time ever, I followed all the great tips and advice and all was successful with no damage and a fully functioning CPU at the end of it









I've put MX4 on the die for now and then put the IHS back on - Temperatures so far are down 10 degrees Celsius on all the cores.

I've ordered some CLP today so looking forward to getting that on the die and the temperatures going down even more.

Before, I was like 1.30V for 4.9GHz and the temperatures were hitting 100 degrees Celsius with LinX on maximum memory mode. Now playing briefly with 5.0GHz at 1.40V and getting mid 90s so great results so far and surely even better temperatures to come once I get the CLP on.


----------



## snelan

Dude, you hava a Golden Chip there. I can only do 4.6GHz on 1.3v.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Dude, you hava a Golden Chip there. I can only do 4.6GHz on 1.3v.


And i can only do that @ 1,360.


----------



## snelan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> And i can only do that @ 1,360.


Well, for me, a small (well, 100MHz) step to 4.7GHz is only stable at 1.36VCore. So an extra .06v for 100MHz.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah, I don't know if you guys remember my situation but I have a pretty crappy chip. I think my max OC will be 4.7GHz unless I want to break that 1.52v barrier. I can run 4.7GHz at 1.51v but my temps get into the low 90s. I would like those temps to be in the high 70s low 80s. I already shaved 7C with my double Antec Formula 7 application but I think I went a little heavy on the paste. Or I could just run at 4.5GHz because I probably wont see much difference in gaming/browsing performance. I just like to tinker so it looks like my next project will be liquid pro on the die.


Even tho u have a bad clocker..
You still get this single threaded performance over the 8320 u had.. 60% clock for clock @[email protected]
So even a 5.2ghz which is the best 8350 i seen over there.. and i think is a false OC in dudes sig your still a massive 45% atleast above the best 8350.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Well, for me, a small (well, 100MHz) step to 4.7GHz is only stable at 1.36VCore. So an extra .06v for 100MHz.


For me to get 4.7 ghz, i need over 1,410v. lol

EDIT: I still trying to get stable on that clock... But I still happy with the 4.5ghz results.


----------



## krich

Yeah, I was unsure whether to delid it at first, as it is a great little clocker (and my first Ivy too!). Before the delid, I had 4.8GHz at 1.25V but the temperatures were almost hitting 90 degrees Celsius.

I came up from a Sandy i7-2700K so some might say a bit pointless, but I learned how to delid my first CPU and that wasn't something I'd even have dared to try before. The great clocks are the bonus


----------



## snelan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> For me to get 4.7 ghz, i need over 1,410v. lol
> EDIT: I still trying to get stable on that clock... But I still happy with the 4.5ghz results.


Yea, this kinda thing happened with my 2600k. The voltage above around 4.6GHz starts to grow exponentially.


----------



## PCWargamer

It's great seeing even more delidders finding what we found out, that delidding is the way to go with Ivy!!!









Fianlly getting the chip to do what it always should have been able to do if Intel had done it right in the first place.

But I'm glad they did it wrong now, as I would probably never have had the desire to diled if they did it right and would have missed all the fun of getting up the courage and doing it! Great fun that leads to great, and very tangable, results!









And using CL PRO/Ultra is the best way to go, as you have seen. Other good TIMs just don't perform as well for the die/IHS contact.

Congrats to all the latest deliders who have the balls to just do it and to your great temp results you can now enjoy!!!


----------



## Gomi

Here we go - Another "Low-end" overclock - Have only touched Multiplier and VCore (Still a newbie at this).

5.0 Ghz stable @ 1.38V



This is with the MO-RA3 barely running at all - Could probably shave another 5 - 10Coff if I bothered to turn the fans from 7V to 12V.

I left the GIGABYTE TweakLauncher open, just in case anyone spots something that is HORRIBLE wrong - As I said, I have no idea what 80 % of the stuff does (Yet!)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Here we go - Another "Low-end" overclock - Have only touched Multiplier and VCore (Still a newbie at this).
> 5.0 Ghz stable @ 1.38V
> 
> This is with the MO-RA3 barely running at all - Could probably shave another 5 - 10Coff if I bothered to turn the fans from 7V to 12V.
> I left the GIGABYTE TweakLauncher open, just in case anyone spots something that is HORRIBLE wrong - As I said, I have no idea what 80 % of the stuff does (Yet!)


If you do not understand the MB Trade me XD lol

I would of had that board if it was not so late to the z77 game..

I got my 3770k on Lauch day with a UD5H ..... then 4 months later then G1 Sniper 3 was released... Sold UD5H and got it...
Heh 4 months later UP7 comes out.. heh


----------



## Gomi

Will "Understand" it in time









Still reading up on all this - Used to building SFF builds and the motherboards in that category does not come with even 10 % of all the candy that these "big ones" do


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Will "Understand" it in time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still reading up on all this - Used to building SFF builds and the motherboards in that category does not come with even 10 % of all the candy that these "big ones" do


You have the best Z77 board lol. it is no normal board by any means... i mean the G1 sniper 3 is a great board with a million features.. "mostly gaming" yours has the Overclocking.. and the hardware to do it.

LoL and a 10 layer PCB.... you could screw that thing to a tree and tie a tire swing around it lol.


----------



## stickg1

I have pretty generic RAM, I got a kit on sale and with coupons it was $15: Crucial Ballistix Sport 2x4GB 1600MHz CL9. I can run it at 1600MHz 9-9-9-24-2 (obviously) but I can also run it at 1866 10-10-10-27-2. Which am I better off doing? Lower freq but tighter timings or higher freq looser timings? Here are AIDA64 tests:

*1600*


*1866*


----------



## Hokies83

lol thats the ram i use in my HTPC. it is not bad for the price.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> lol thats the ram i use in my HTPC. it is not bad for the price.


Yeah I just needed something cheap because I sold my FX-8320, 990FXA-UD3, Samsung low pro 8GB kit, and modded case for $460 and was trying to get my i5, v pro mobo, new case, and RAM within that same budget. (I went over budget) but I couldn't go anymore over budget and Newegg was sold out of the samsung RAM like they usually are. I like Crucial RAM though, they make quality products, and they're a good old American company.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah I just needed something cheap because I sold my FX-8320, 990FXA-UD3, Samsung low pro 8GB kit, and modded case for $460 and was trying to get my i5, v pro mobo, new case, and RAM within that same budget. (I went over budget) but I couldn't go anymore over budget and Newegg was sold out of the samsung RAM like they usually are. I like Crucial RAM though, they make quality products, and they're a good old American company.


If on tight Budget you should buy used my young Padawan.

If i was gonna do an Ivy Build this late into it's release i would have searched all the forums market places and would have came out with 3770k+Board+ram for about 400$


----------



## ivanlabrie

Higher read and copy is the most important for ram performance Stickg1.

Crucial uses d9 chips, those like tight timings and voltage, you can probably do 2000mhz 9-9-9-27-1t at 1.65v, have you tried?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If on tight Budget you should buy used my young Padawan.
> If i was gonna do an Ivy Build this late into it's release i would have searched all the forums market places and would have came out with 3770k+Board+ram for about 400$


That's okay, I like new with warranty. I ordered the cheap RAM with it because I wanted it all the same day.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Higher read and copy is the most important for ram performance Stickg1.
> Crucial uses d9 chips, those like tight timings and voltage, you can probably do 2000mhz 9-9-9-27-1t at 1.65v, have you tried?


I tried 1866 9-9-9-27 at 1.65v and it wouldnt post.


----------



## stickg1

I'm running 2000MHz but its at 10-11-10-30-2T. My AIDA scores are still even higher.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If on tight Budget you should buy used my young Padawan.
> If i was gonna do an Ivy Build this late into it's release i would have searched all the forums market places and would have came out with 3770k+Board+ram for about 400$


That's how I made my newest build









2600k + ASrock Z77 ITX + Samsung 8GB RAM for $360 ; RAM and Mobo were bought new!

Just found the 8GB Crucial 1.35v kits last night, I might have to buy a pair and sell my samsung ram. any takers?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm running 2000MHz but its at 10-11-10-30-2T. My AIDA scores are still even higher.


Can you post your Aida64 memory benchmark results? I'm curious to see how they compare to mine.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> That's how I made my newest build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2600k + ASrock Z77 ITX + Samsung 8GB RAM for $360 ; RAM and Mobo were bought new!
> Just found the 8GB Crucial 1.35v kits last night, I might have to buy a pair and sell my samsung ram. any takers?


Which samsung and how much you want for them? What type of freq and timings you run on it now and at what voltage?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Can you post your Aida64 memory benchmark results? I'm curious to see how they compare to mine.


Heres my 2000 10-11-10-30-2T run


----------



## tw33k

They're pretty good results. Mine are Crucial Ballistix Smart Tracer. The original sticks I got were DOA so I sent them back and they sent me new ones with the LEDs. I thought I'd switch the lights off but now I kinda like em


----------



## ivanlabrie

Those sticks are gorgeous









Shame you can't see the insides of my case...but well, I don't care either. As long as it's fast enough it's good.


----------



## tw33k

It performs really well. It goes toe-to-toe with my GSkill Ripjaws @ 2000MHz


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Can you post your Aida64 memory benchmark results? I'm curious to see how they compare to mine.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Which samsung and how much you want for them? What type of freq and timings you run on it now and at what voltage?
> Heres my 2000 10-11-10-30-2T run


Corsair Vengeance CML8GX3M2A1600C9 Low Profile

think mine isnt that bad right, can i improve the Memory Read somehow? Latency is low too, compared to you guys
running on 1.55V , thought it was better because i run 101 blck..


----------



## tw33k

You could try running it at a higher frequency like 1866 for starters


----------



## stickg1

Would this stuff overclock well like the Samsung low pro low volt kits?

Crucial Ballistix Sport 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 1600 Low Profile BLS2K4G3D1609ES2LX0
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148662

They also have the tactical in CL8









Crucial Ballistix Tactical 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Low Profile BLT2K4G3D1608ET3LX0
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148656


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Would this stuff overclock well like the Samsung low pro low volt kits?
> Crucial Ballistix Sport 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 1600 Low Profile BLS2K4G3D1609ES2LX0
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148662
> They also have the tactical in CL8
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Crucial Ballistix Tactical 8GB DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Low Profile BLT8G3D1608ET3LX0
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148655


It would overclock better, the latter is the kit I was thinking of upgrading to


----------



## Arm3nian

I bet even a 3770k at like 5ghz bottlenecks ram. My ram disk is faster than my ssd's, but not that much in real world. I mean at 25gbps everything should be basically instant, it isn't tho. Probably some other factors involved.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> It would overclock better, the latter is the kit I was thinking of upgrading to


Yeah it looks good, I don't like the yellow but it's so tiny you probably wouldn't even see it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's okay, I like new with warranty. I ordered the cheap RAM with it because I wanted it all the same day.
> I tried 1866 9-9-9-27 at 1.65v and it wouldnt post.


I Like used with warranty better and saving 40%


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I Like used with warranty better and saving 40%


+1

$1000 build, 2600k + ASrock Z77E-ITX + 7970 + 256 Samsung 840 + 8GB Samsung 30nm RAM

2600k cooled by h100, 7970 cooled by antec kuhler 920, seasonic x650 Gold modular PSU ... The list goes on


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm running 2000MHz but its at 10-11-10-30-2T. My AIDA scores are still even higher.
> 
> 
> 
> Can you post your Aida64 memory benchmark results? I'm curious to see how they compare to mine.
Click to expand...

Looks good tw33k!

I'd check mine out to compare but my Aida64 Extreme version was only 30 day trial and no longer works without paying like $40.

Is there a freeware or shareware version on the web somewhere, or are you guys paying to register it?


----------



## tw33k

I can't discuss where I got mine from in the forum


----------



## dmanstasiu

lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> lol


LoL your the guy who bought his Antec 920 from the guy who was selling a used one for 72 instead of buying my new one for 75 XD even with my massive one sided feedback advantage lol..

Selling that to fund my new Water cooling built @[email protected]


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL your the guy who bought his Antec 920 from the guy who was selling a used one for 72 instead of buying my new one for 75 XD even with my massive one sided feedback advantage lol..
> Selling that to fund my new Water cooling built @[email protected]


Nope. I bought an Antec 920 brand-new for $48 CAD


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I Like used with warranty better and saving 40%


That would be nice, all the used parts I ever bought weren't covered by the manufacturer because I couldn't produce the original invoice. Some companies like ASRock will replace your motherboard for $50 if its out of warranty or your the 2nd or 3rd owner which is nice.


----------



## Hokies83

Stick with companys that do when u buy used stuff ask for invoices to


----------



## lilchronic

ok im having a problem getting 5 ghz stable. i boot into windows at 1.3v but crashes. 1.35v i had stable for 8 hrs prime95 1.4 v crashes in first 5 min of prime 1.45v crashes in 5min of prime. all c states are disabled and im using fixed mode for v core
should i be upping my cpu pll and vccsa??? or is it my chip
im at 4.8 @ 1.26 offset mode +0.005 llc level1
C1E state enabled all others disabled
pretty much stock settings for 4.8 except for the c states disabled


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Stick with companys that do when u buy used stuff ask for invoices to


XFX +1


----------



## Swag

If you guys mind helping, can you answer this question for me on my other thread? It's irrelevant to CPU's but I trust the members of the Delidded IB Club more than the rest so yea.









http://www.overclock.net/t/1336079/iphone-5/0_50


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, its only on the die where liquid pro/ultra gives the best results,
> on IHS any good tim will do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not much difference in temps compared to liquid pro/ultra,
> i did use liquid pro on all sides tho, gave me 25+C tempdrop


I use Liquid Ultra on the IHS (to cooling block), it's pretty decent, not to hard to remove from IHS at all (alcohol does the trick) ... a bit harder to remove from copper cooling block though (had to use the scratch pad last time hehe) ... but to be honest I just leave it there on the cooling block and re-use it ... haven't noticed worse performance because of that and tried such approach a few times when swapping chips frequently some time ago ... all I needed to do was to re-brush it (and maybe add a lil bit of fresh Ultra on new chip IHS).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Dude, you hava a Golden Chip there. I can only do 4.6GHz on 1.3v.


ouch! I can do 4.7GHz with 1.20v... batch 3224B
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> And i can only do that @ 1,360.


equally ouch








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> For me to get 4.7 ghz, i need over 1,410v. lol
> EDIT: I still trying to get stable on that clock... But I still happy with the 4.5ghz results.


I'd replace that chip with point of purchase before 30 days passes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Here we go - Another "Low-end" overclock - Have only touched Multiplier and VCore (Still a newbie at this).
> 5.0 Ghz stable @ 1.38V
> 
> This is with the MO-RA3 barely running at all - Could probably shave another 5 - 10Coff if I bothered to turn the fans from 7V to 12V.
> I left the GIGABYTE TweakLauncher open, just in case anyone spots something that is HORRIBLE wrong - As I said, I have no idea what 80 % of the stuff does (Yet!)


5.0GHz @ 1.38V sounds awesome!!! that is the power of 3218B







mine (3224B) does that at 1.46V sadly ... still much better than lots of other batches I had.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If you guys mind helping, can you answer this question for me on my other thread? It's irrelevant to CPU's but I trust the members of the Delidded IB Club more than the rest so yea.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1336079/iphone-5/0_50


White/silver all my Apple devices are white/silver that is there trademark color i do not think t hey look right black.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Here we go - Another "Low-end" overclock - Have only touched Multiplier and VCore (Still a newbie at this).
> 5.0 Ghz stable @ 1.38V
> 
> This is with the MO-RA3 barely running at all - Could probably shave another 5 - 10Coff if I bothered to turn the fans from 7V to 12V.
> I left the GIGABYTE TweakLauncher open, just in case anyone spots something that is HORRIBLE wrong - As I said, I have no idea what 80 % of the stuff does (Yet!)


Stable as in what? intel burn test stable? or prime? Not trying to sound like a jerk, I'm just curious.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I use Liquid Ultra on the IHS (to cooling block), it's pretty decent, not to hard to remove from IHS at all (alcohol does the trick) ... a bit harder to remove from copper cooling block though (had to use the scratch pad last time hehe) ... but to be honest I just leave it there on the cooling block and re-use it ... haven't noticed worse performance because of that and tried such approach a few times when swapping chips frequently some time ago ... all I needed to do was to re-brush it (and maybe add a lil bit of fresh Ultra on new chip IHS).
> ouch! I can do 4.7GHz with 1.20v... batch 3224B
> equally ouch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd replace that chip with point of purchase before 30 days passes.
> 5.0GHz @ 1.38V sounds awesome!!! that is the power of 3218B
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mine (3224B) does that at 1.46V sadly ... still much better than lots of other batches I had.


Not all 3218b, I have a 3218b958 that is the worst 3770k I've seen yet. Have a dead one that did 4.5Ghz 1.176V, one that does 4.5 at 1.154V, 2 x 3770k that need 1.22V for 4.5Ghz & the 3218B958 that needs a whopping 1.27V for 4.5Ghz. (it's also the only 3770k I've had where the imc can not do 2666Mhz memory).
There are some great 3218B batches out there & that was why I hand picked this one, but it can have terrible chips in the same batch too.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not all 3218b, I have a 3218b958 that is the worst 3770k I've seen yet. Have a dead one that did 4.5Ghz 1.176V, one that does 4.5 at 1.154V, 2 x 3770k that need 1.22V for 4.5Ghz & the 3218B958 that needs a whopping 1.27V for 4.5Ghz. (it's also the only 3770k I've had where the imc can not do 2666Mhz memory).
> There are some great 3218B batches out there & that was why I hand picked this one, but it can have terrible chips in the same batch too.


How long do u hold onto these chips before you Sells them?


----------



## FtW 420

I don't always sell stuff, still have those chips. I'll probably keep 2 or 3 at least, I don't use my best stuff for daily rigs.
I should start someday though, the hardware racks are overflowing, can't bring myself to part with motherboards, gpus or memory kits either.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Stable as in what? intel burn test stable? or prime? Not trying to sound like a jerk, I'm just curious.


try Cinebench 11.5 x64 for stability testing, much lower temps generated than in IBT and way more vcore needed for rock solid stability (check for WHEA wartnings in Event logs and compensate for them until gone).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not all 3218b, I have a 3218b958 that is the worst 3770k I've seen yet. Have a dead one that did 4.5Ghz 1.176V, one that does 4.5 at 1.154V, 2 x 3770k that need 1.22V for 4.5Ghz & the 3218B958 that needs a whopping 1.27V for 4.5Ghz. (it's also the only 3770k I've had where the imc can not do 2666Mhz memory).
> There are some great 3218B batches out there & that was why I hand picked this one, but it can have terrible chips in the same batch too.


yeah, of course, not all








batches just give generally higher chance of success, not guaranteed by any means







sorry to hear about yours, it happens.


----------



## stickg1

I'm looking for cheap components to throw together a desktop for my kids to do homework and browser games on. They're 5 and 7 years old. So the computer doesn't have to be all that. So if anyone has any old AM2, AM3, socket 775, socket 1156, 1155 pentiums/celerons, or really anything they'd be looking to get rid of I'm very much interested. I would post in the marketplace but I don't have enough rep yet.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm looking for cheap components to throw together a desktop for my kids to do homework and browser games on. They're 5 and 7 years old. So the computer doesn't have to be all that. So if anyone has any old AM2, AM3, socket 775, socket 1156, 1155 pentiums/celerons, or really anything they'd be looking to get rid of I'm very much interested. I would post in the marketplace but I don't have enough rep yet.


I have a full 1156 rig im trying to sell for 350$

Small compact HTPC HDmi hooks to a TV..
Everything is wireless on it.


----------



## ripsaw

got my chip....core 2 hit 97c 3secs into IBT.....am i doing something wrong here?
EDIT: using a50 cooler. temps were max 75c w/ everything at stock....
EDIT: changed offset off auto to +05


----------



## FtW 420

Yes, you're running 1.4V vcore for 4.2Ghz. Try around 1.1V - 1.15V somewhere, should run cooler.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> got my chip....core 2 hit 97c 3secs into IBT.....am i doing something wrong here?
> EDIT: using a50 cooler. temps were max 75c w/ everything at stock....


Maybe it isn't seated properly

most likely volts though. A50 is average, and you're pumping 1.4v through Ivy which runs hot


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I can't discuss where I got mine from in the forum


Of course not, but can you tell me where all the other guys are getting theirs from? LOL


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Of course not, but can you tell me where all the other guys are getting theirs from? LOL


I wouldn't know


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Of course not, but can you tell me where all the other guys are getting theirs from? LOL
> 
> 
> 
> I wouldn't know
Click to expand...

me neither! but there are plenty of other programs i can use, so i'm good...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> got my chip....core 2 hit 97c 3secs into IBT.....am i doing something wrong here?
> EDIT: using a50 cooler. temps were max 75c w/ everything at stock....
> EDIT: changed offset off auto to +05


must be something else wrong, prolly not seated right,
if i compare both pic's,
in the first one you use 1.4V vcore, the second one 1.056V vcore, for the same 4.2ghz oc
and both give the same 97C hottest core temp result? cant be right..


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> must be something else wrong, prolly not seated right,
> if i compare both pic's,
> in the first one you use 1.4V vcore, the second one 1.056V vcore, for the same 4.2ghz oc
> and both give the same 97C hottest core temp result? cant be right..


Oddly enough, I know on EVGA forums one user's 3770k was at 98C when he was reflowing it for Indigo Xtreme... 98C was the exact temperature the CPU limited itself to

To Ripsaw, can you post a graph monitoring software that actively monitor's your CPU's frequency during the stability tests? I'd be interested to see if it runs at it's full frequency or if it's throttling


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Oddly enough, I know on EVGA forums one user's 3770k was at 98C when he was reflowing it for Indigo Xtreme... 98C was the exact temperature the CPU limited itself to
> To Ripsaw, can you post a graph monitoring software that actively monitor's your CPU's frequency during the stability tests? I'd be interested to see if it runs at it's full frequency or if it's throttling


thats the termal pad right, it needs to flow/reflow without cooler i think?

so both temps should be the same doing so..
the cpu doesnt limit itself at 98C, except if you hit tjmax, 105C,
have to say, mine shut down 1 core at 102C, and backed down the other 3 cores to 80% load at 105C


----------



## IronDoq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> OCN name: IronDoq
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Noctua Nt-H1
> Mhz gained: none (so far)
> OC after delid: 4.8 (currently stabilizing 5)
> Temp drops: 21c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2605760
> Let it be known that lapping also dropped my temps by 9c (although my carelessness rendered my chip only usable in single-channel mode
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Can I be accepted...?

Update for max OC: 5Ghz
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2606734


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Can I be accepted...?
> Update for max OC: 5Ghz
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2606734


You are accepted IronDoq








have to wait for Val to change/update you on first page tho


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Oddly enough, I know on EVGA forums one user's 3770k was at 98C when he was reflowing it for Indigo Xtreme... 98C was the exact temperature the CPU limited itself to
> To Ripsaw, can you post a graph monitoring software that actively monitor's your CPU's frequency during the stability tests? I'd be interested to see if it runs at it's full frequency or if it's throttling


Ive had mine up to 105c before i de lidded XD

My puter restarted lol.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Well just picked up my 3770K today and since I'm waiting for my CLP to arrive I figured I'd start OCing the chip before delidding it so I could compare after the fact. Right now it's taking me 1.388vcore for Windows to boot at 4.8Ghz (running Prime as we speak). It's appearing like I will hit my voltage limit before temps become an issue (after delidding that is). I was hoping to hit 5.0Ghz after delidding but I fear that will take an insane amount of juice considering how high I've had to raise it since 4.5Ghz seemed fine on stock voltage







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Well just picked up my 3770K today and since I'm waiting for my CLP to arrive I figured I'd start OCing the chip before delidding it so I could compare after the fact. Right now it's taking me 1.388vcore for Windows to boot at 4.8Ghz (running Prime as we speak). It's appearing like I will hit my voltage limit before temps become an issue (after delidding that is). I was hoping to hit 5.0Ghz after delidding but I fear that will take an insane amount of juice considering how high I've had to raise it since 4.5Ghz seemed fine on stock voltage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Anything under 1.48v for 5ghz is golden.

Do not think SB when clocking an IB chip.. SB are made of glass.. IB is steel..

I run 1.55v 24/7 with 0 issues.

So do not worry..

And remember bro 5ghz on a 3770k is 5.2ghz/5.3ghz on a 2700k Search OCN and see how many 24/7 5.2ghz 2700ks u see..
They can not take the volts.. SB is like glass with volts..

I bet u will end up with a 5ghz - 5.1ghz clocker there bro Grats on t man ur chip prolly better then mine lol.

Also if u do not like that one u can exchange it and get another.. these guys seem to be claiming 1 batch is better.. Ask which and go to MC and get one from that batch.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Well just picked up my 3770K today and since I'm waiting for my CLP to arrive I figured I'd start OCing the chip before delidding it so I could compare after the fact. Right now it's taking me 1.388vcore for Windows to boot at 4.8Ghz (running Prime as we speak). It's appearing like I will hit my voltage limit before temps become an issue (after delidding that is). I was hoping to hit 5.0Ghz after delidding but I fear that will take an insane amount of juice considering how high I've had to raise it since 4.5Ghz seemed fine on stock voltage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


This can't be stated enough, be darn sure when you place your IHS onto the die and latch it down that the IHS is perfectly centered so you don't bend your pins!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Well just picked up my 3770K today and since I'm waiting for my CLP to arrive I figured I'd start OCing the chip before delidding it so I could compare after the fact. Right now it's taking me 1.388vcore for Windows to boot at 4.8Ghz (running Prime as we speak). It's appearing like I will hit my voltage limit before temps become an issue (after delidding that is). I was hoping to hit 5.0Ghz after delidding but I fear that will take an insane amount of juice considering how high I've had to raise it since 4.5Ghz seemed fine on stock voltage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> Anything under 1.45v for 5ghz is golden.
> 
> Do not think SB when clocking an IB chip.. SB are made of glass.. IB is steel..
> 
> I run 1.55v 24/7 with 0 issues.
> 
> So do not worry..
> 
> And remember bro 5ghz on a 3770k is 5.2ghz/5.3ghz on a 2700k Search OCN and see how many 24/7 5.2ghz 2700ks u see..
> They can not take the volts.. SB is like glass with volts..
> 
> I bet u will end up with a 5.1 - 5.2ghz clocker there bro Grats on t man ur chip prolly better then mine lol.
Click to expand...

I fear i will have to up my voltage significantly to reach 5.0Ghz though considering the jumps I had to make from 4.6 > 4.7 > 4.8. If I keep it under 1.45 it will be a miracle. I am encouraged though that I dont have to worry so much about staying under 1.52.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I fear i will have to up my voltage significantly to reach 5.0Ghz though considering the jumps I had to make from 4.6 > 4.7 > 4.8. If I keep it under 1.45 it will be a miracle. I am encouraged though that I dont have to worry so much about staying under 1.52.


Yah man do not worry about voltage so much if you plan on keeping that chip for 5 years stay below 1.45v for 3 years 1.55v I upgrade every generation so i could care less. They just have to Last me a year lol.

And ill sell it as a 5ghz chip which should net me some extra $$$$

And remember u can exchange it for another if it is really bad. Bin those suckers


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> This can't be stated enough, be darn sure when you place your IHS onto the die and latch it down that the IHS is perfectly centered so you don't bend your pins!


Thanks I'll be sure to keep that in mind.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah man do not worry about voltage so much if you plan on keeping that chip for 5 years stay below 1.45v for 3 years 1.55v I upgrade every generation so i could care less. They just have to Last me a year lol.
> 
> And ill sell it as a 5ghz chip which should net me some extra $$$$
> 
> And remember u can exchange it for another if it is really bad. Bin those suckers


If looks like I may not even get chip stable at 4.8 under 1.45 vcore at this rate haha. But yea every 3 years is about right for when I upgrade usually. I really wanna hit 5.0 though but I guess I'll just have to see how high of a voltage Im willing to run once i delid.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I fear i will have to up my voltage significantly to reach 5.0Ghz though considering the jumps I had to make from 4.6 > 4.7 > 4.8. If I keep it under 1.45 it will be a miracle. I am encouraged though that I dont have to worry so much about staying under 1.52.


its more like, stay close/under to 1.52V vcore as max,
its no guarantee if you go over max vcore yours will do good too, like hokies..
eventho sin's guide says 1.55V vcore MAXIMUM on air/water,
he also says 1.3-1.45V vcore RECOMMENDED,


"Maximum vcore" and "Recommended vcore"(or safe) are 2 very different things


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its more like, stay close/under to 1.52V vcore as max,
> its no guarantee if you go over max vcore yours will do good too, like hokies..
> eventho sin's guide says 1.55V vcore MAXIMUM on air/water,
> he also says 1.3-1.45V vcore RECOMMENDED,
> 
> "Maximum vcore" and "Recommended vcore"(or safe) are 2 very different things


Quit trying to scare ppl with that crap bro really...

These chips have warrantys if u fry them with volts u can rma them









Truth is Sin does not know you do not know..

Use what ever voltage you want.. i say 1.55v iws fine 24/7.. and ima stick by it.. cause thats what i use and it is fine.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quit trying to scare ppl with that crap bro really...
> These chips have warrantys if u fry them with volts u can rma them


im not, and its no crap at all..bro, left alone im trying to scare people,
im just letting them/everyone know whats the consensus on the vcores used









its your 1 person's word against the rest that all say the same,
youre saying your "friend" sin0822 is wrong too? and all the rest, intel and everyone else?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im not, and its no crap at all..bro, left alone im trying to scare people,
> im just letting them/everyone know whats the consensus on the vcores used
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its your 1 person's word against the rest that all say the same,
> youre saying your "friend" sin0822 is wrong too? and all the rest, intel and everyone else?


That is the Max VDD not Vcore Idontcare busted that out.. that is the VDD range nothing about Vcore.
So yeah it is Crap. Only somebody using that Vcore can Claim it.. And only i am.. And im still here and i say it is fine.
Nobody knows Max Vcore and i say it is 1.55v cause ive tested it for long period of time.

Nobody else can say that.. I can.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That is the Max VDD not Vcore Idontcare busted that out.. that is the VDD range nothing about Vcore.
> Nobody knows Max Vcore and i say it is 1.55v cause ive tested it for long period of time.
> Nobody else can say that.. I can.


well, gratz on that,
im still gonna say the same to anyone who asks about max and recommended vcores








again, Sin states in his guide,

On Air/Water:
*Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating* for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*.

yes, i do know the max vcore is no where to find in the datasheets from intel,
its the max VID range..been there, tried to find the clear answer to eveyones question about max vcore..

daclownie gave me a good answer when i wanted to ask sin0822 about how he came to his max intel recommended vcore,

"I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered
the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
for consumer usage. LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting."


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, gratz on that,
> im still gonna say the same to anyone who asks about max and recommended vcores
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> again, Sin states in his guide,
> On Air/Water:
> *Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating* for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*.
> yes, i do know the max vcore is no where to find in the datasheets from intel,
> its the max VID range..been there, tried to find the clear answer to eveyones question about max vcore..
> daclownie gave me a good answer when i wanted to ask sin0822 about how he came to his max intel recommended vcore,
> "I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered
> the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
> for consumer usage. LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
> should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting."


Go post that over on Anandtech and they will tell you your dead wrong just like i am.

You have not tested Sin has not tested it.

I HAVE Plan And simple 1.55v and i will continue telling people that.

So quit contradicting me everytime i post it







see 4500 posts and 176 rep and leave it alone


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Go post that over on Anandtech and they will tell you your dead wrong just like i am.
> You have not tested Sin has not tested it.
> I HAVE Plan And simple 1.55v and i will continue telling people that.
> So quit contradicting me everytime i post it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> see 4500 posts and 176 rep and leave it alone


all good, you follow yours








i will keep doing it my way








but i dont see how its related to how many post and how many +reps you have hahaha...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> all good, you follow yours
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i will keep doing it my way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i dont see how its related to how many post and how many +reps you have hahaha...


Here is your reasoning getting de bunked
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285756&highlight=

You can not camp on 1 forum if you want to learn everything... Why im on 7 at all times.. taking in all the knowledge of many different people.


----------



## ripsaw

here's where im at now....what software can i use to graph cpu frequency? It is throttling, going as low as 1600mhz....


EDIT: ran prime blend for 10+ mins temps never went over 72c


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Here is your reasoning getting de bunked
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285756&highlight=
> You can not camp on 1 forum if you want to learn everything... Why im on 7 at all times.. taking in all the knowledge of many different people.


Also doesn't mean you could be down talk a phd in electrical engineering and a executive of intel now could you. Its the internet you never know. Besides the point everyone has their own values and set limits for myself personally on vcore 1.65 is my limit don't care what you say or think. It mine and only mine, I will tell people that as well and that each chip differs based on the silicons electrical impedence of resistence thus making either a better or worse ocer.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Also doesn't mean you could be down talk a phd in electrical engineering and a executive of intel now could you. Its the internet you never know. Besides the point everyone has their own values and set limits for myself personally on vcore 1.65 is my limit don't care what you say or think. It mine and only mine, I will tell people that as well and that each chip differs based on the silicons electrical impedence of resistence thus making either a better or worse ocer.


they prove that what is stated has nothing to do with max vcore.
I have a BD in Computer hardware engineering.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Idontcare;34296202*
> <- has BS in Materials Science Engineering and PhD in Chemical Physics, directly worked on process node development spanning 0.5um to 32nm at Texas Instruments
> 
> And? What does any of that have to do with the fact it is not Intel's official spec as falsely claimed?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Here is your reasoning getting de bunked
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285756&highlight=
> You can not camp on 1 forum if you want to learn everything... Why im on 7 at all times.. taking in all the knowledge of many different people.


I don't really see any evidence in that thread supporting your opinion. It's just another thread with an identical argument of you vs. everyone with everyone else arguing that the max. safe voltage is lower. In fact, they are stating that it is much lower than anyone here is proposing it to be.

EDIT: If you were referring to the part about the max VID. That doesn't exactly help your argument either.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I don't really see any evidence in that thread supporting your opinion. It's just another thread with an identical argument of you vs. everyone with everyone else arguing that the max. safe voltage is lower. In fact, they are stating that it is much lower than anyone here is proposing it to be.
> EDIT: If you were referring to the part about the max VID. That doesn't exactly help your argument either.


Where did u come from?

Guess u do not understand the Convo

They DE BUNKED THE 1.52v as not being it.

Nobody knows what it is.

The only way to *PROVE* What a good max Vcore is .. is for somebody to run a high Vcore bench it stress it.. and that is me...
I got 20hrs of stress testing 300hrs of gaming hundreds of hrs of benching and what 90 days at 1.55v with 0 issues.. Thats how u find a max Vcore you push it and test it.. "Not Guess at it"


----------



## ivanlabrie

Back on track...peace out guys xD

Guys, don't buy crucial ram for z77 cause it's better for amd/775/x58. Get samsung batch 1229 or newer and clock it to 2400 cl9-11-11-21-1t at 1.6v...also use maxxmem preview 1.99 not aida.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Stable as in what? intel burn test stable? or prime? Not trying to sound like a jerk, I'm just curious.


Not sounding as a jerk at all mate - I understand that peoples definition on "Stable" varies alot.

It holds IBT (10 runs), Cinebench, a handful of games I tried and a QUICK 15 minute Prime95 run.

Have *NOT* taken it through a 24 hour P95 test as of yet, neither have I looked at it with a cold and evil stare while screaming
"This is sparta!" - All will be done in due time, no doubt I can force it to "crack" at some point with enough work thrown at it


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where did u come from?
> Guess u do not understand the Convo
> They DE BUNKED THE 1.52v as not being it.
> Nobody knows what it is.
> The only way to *PROVE* What a good max Vcore is .. is for somebody to run a high Vcore bench it stress it.. and that is me...
> I got 20hrs of stress testing 300hrs of gaming hundreds of hrs of benching and what 90 days at 1.55v with 0 issues.. Thats how u find a max Vcore you push it and test it.. "Not Guess at it"


I'm not arguing with your method. However, one sample does NOT make a trend. Just because you can run at 1.55 does not make it safe. Every chip is different and that will include the effect of voltage on degradation. I just don't like your approach that because YOU did it ONCE with ONE chip that it is a stead fast value. It's what you're comfortable with and what you've had success with.

If we had dozens of people testing at that voltage in the long term then I would accept it as a safe value. Until that point in time I think we need to be a LOT more cautious about the maximum voltages which we are telling everyone is safe. In terms of statistics you have NO proof. You may have got lucky or your chip might be average. But we do not know so we should be leaning on the side of caution and not saying "You can run 1.55v 24/7, I guarantee it". While I know that may not be what you are saying, it sure sounds like it.

If you want to test your voltage theory on more chips then please, go ahead, and report back. But until that point I think it is unreasonable to label 1.55v as safe without further evidence. I think that may be what VonDutch was concerned about, that you were touting a set voltage as max with too little data to be considered proof.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I'm not arguing with your method. However, one sample does NOT make a trend. Just because you can run at 1.55 does not make it safe. Every chip is different and that will include the effect of voltage on degradation. I just don't like your approach that because YOU did it ONCE with ONE chip that it is a stead fast value. It's what you're comfortable with and what you've had success with.
> If we had dozens of people testing at that voltage in the long term then I would accept it as a safe value. Until that point in time I think we need to be a LOT more cautious about the maximum voltages which we are telling everyone is safe. In terms of statistics you have NO proof. You may have got lucky or your chip might be average. But we do not know so we should be leaning on the side of caution and not saying "You can run 1.55v 24/7, I guarantee it". While I know that may not be what you are saying, it sure sounds like it.
> If you want to test your voltage theory on more chips then please, go ahead, and report back. But until that point I think it is unreasonable to label 1.55v as safe without further evidence. I think that may be what VonDutch was concerned about, that you were touting a set voltage as max with too little data to be considered proof.


And i think it is dumb to say 1.55c is un safe with out any evidence saying it is not.

And my Chip is just AVG..









What little data i have is more then anyone else has.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Back on track...peace out guys xD
> Guys, don't buy crucial ram for z77 cause it's better for amd/775/x58. Get samsung batch 1229 or newer and clock it to 2400 cl9-11-11-21-1t at 1.6v...also use maxxmem preview 1.99 not aida.


There's nothing wrong with Crucial RAM (or Aida64 for that matter)


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And i think it is dumb to say 1.55c is un safe with out any evidence saying it is not.
> And my Chip is just AVG..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What little data i have is more then anyone else has.


It's a little thing called "Caution". There are many things that have no evidence to say something is bad, but you'd still be cautious about it. This should be one of those things where caution should be applied. Especially when your advice could have a damaging impact on people's hardware.

And being an average overclocker is nothing to do with it's "degradability" shall we call it.

But you have, in terms of statistics, one data point of a chip running at high voltage for long periods. That is all, one chip which has run at 1.55v. Not enough to call it safe and not enough to consider statistically significant information.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Back on track...peace out guys xD
> Guys, don't buy crucial ram for z77 cause it's better for amd/775/x58. Get samsung batch 1229 or newer and clock it to 2400 cl9-11-11-21-1t at 1.6v...also use maxxmem preview 1.99 not aida.


I just got the kit but my MB wont over clock it past 2133mhz....









I'm sure the sticks are up to the job but my Z77 Mpower BIOS doesn't support it.









Still the best set of ram I have had in terms of system over clockability with low voltage and tight timings.

Work great with my delidded 3770k at 5GHZ. 1T 9-10-10-24 1.5v DRAM voltage.

http://valid.canardpc.com/2609406

Batch 12/29



Really the best RAM I have ever owned.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Not sounding as a jerk at all mate - I understand that peoples definition on "Stable" varies alot.
> It holds IBT (10 runs), Cinebench, a handful of games I tried and a QUICK 15 minute Prime95 run.
> Have *NOT* taken it through a 24 hour P95 test as of yet, neither have I looked at it with a cold and evil stare while screaming
> "This is sparta!" - All will be done in due time, no doubt I can force it to "crack" at some point with enough work thrown at it


lol, "this is sparta!" love that movie. well if your vcore holds up under some longer testing I'd say you have a pretty awesome chip there. please let us know how it turns out.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Here we go - Another "Low-end" overclock - Have only touched Multiplier and VCore (Still a newbie at this).
> 5.0 Ghz stable @ 1.38V
> 
> This is with the MO-RA3 barely running at all - Could probably shave another 5 - 10Coff if I bothered to turn the fans from 7V to 12V.
> I left the GIGABYTE TweakLauncher open, just in case anyone spots something that is HORRIBLE wrong - As I said, I have no idea what 80 % of the stuff does (Yet!)


Nice clocks and temps. That MB looks awesome. Good job.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> There's nothing wrong with Crucial RAM (or Aida64 for that matter)


Is that the low voltage Crucial RAM we were talking about earlier?


----------



## flopper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where did u come from?
> Guess u do not understand the Convo
> They DE BUNKED THE 1.52v as not being it.
> Nobody knows what it is.
> The only way to *PROVE* What a good max Vcore is .. is for somebody to run a high Vcore bench it stress it.. and that is me...
> I got 20hrs of stress testing 300hrs of gaming hundreds of hrs of benching and what 90 days at 1.55v with 0 issues.. Thats how u find a max Vcore you push it and test it.. "Not Guess at it"


Give a huge hug to hokie and a cookie.

















run what your happy with I do.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

I will take the vcore as far my temps are below 90c XD

Taking in consideration the Intel fiasco with the thermal paste on the die plus the reference coolers an oem computers using this kind of configuration with stock cpus running way higher than it should be..

I think ill stick with that...


----------



## snelan

So I have two 3770k's, one delidded, the other not. I was planning to sell the other, but I really want to know if it does better than the delidded one, as I haven't used it yet. Now, my question is, can I try compare overclocks, or will the higher temperature of the non-delidded one skew the results?

With the delidded one I am getting 4.6GHz @ 1.31VCore, could probably drop to 1.3, is this considered good, or am I likely to do better with the lidded one?

EDIT: Nevermind, second seller sold me a 3770, guess he's getting no more business from me... Luckily I can still return it, unless someone wants a 3770 for $290 shipped.


----------



## chris-br

Test the other one first.. if you are able to get the same speed with less vcore, KEEP IT.
Temps will not make you use more or less vcore.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> So I have two 3770k's, one delidded, the other not. I was planning to sell the other, but I really want to know if it does better than the delidded one, as I haven't used it yet. Now, my question is, can I try compare overclocks, or will the higher temperature of the non-delidded one skew the results?
> With the delidded one I am getting 4.6GHz @ 1.31VCore, could probably drop to 1.3, is this considered good, or am I likely to do better with the lidded one?
> EDIT: Nevermind, second seller sold me a 3770, guess he's getting no more business from me... Luckily I can still return it, unless someone wants a 3770 for $290 shipped.


i dont think theres a big or noticeable difference between Vcore
before and after delid , so i would say yes, you can compare them








4.6ghz at 1.3V vcore is not bad, but not golden ..lol.
i need about the same, i dont have a very good ocing chip
compared to the others, but i can live with it tho









o, anyone know how i got that Flame under my forumname?
is it related to posts or rep's? or just because im a nice guy ...LOL


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I just want to thank Hokies and Direkt for their "debate." While you too are clearly have opposing opinions here I respect both and feel you've both provided enough insight for anyone to make their own decision. Personally for me, once I delid I think I will run my chip as fast as I can keeping temps below 90. I doubt very much I'll push much past 1.5vcore anyway with that in mind since I can barely keep a 4.8Ghz OC stable at 1.41vcore. My hopes of running 5.0Ghz on this chip seem a little far fetched at this point but if I can approach that it'll still be an improvement over my 3570K 4.5Ghz OC.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i dont think theres a big or noticeable difference between Vcore
> before and after delid , so i would say yes, you can compare them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.6ghz at 1.3V vcore is not bad, but not golden ..lol.
> i need about the same, i dont have a very good ocing chip
> compared to the others, but i can live with it tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, anyone know how i got that Flame under my forumname?
> is it related to posts or rep's? or just because im a nice guy ...LOL


No idea on the Flame, but I just repped you (And if I could do it a hundred times I would) for helping me through the de-lid.

Currently stable at 4.8Ghz @ 1.290 and 5.0Ghz @ 1.380 - And temps are so low that I still cant believe it!

Trying to overclock the memory, but just cant get it to post above 2666Mhz - Raised the VTT and IMC (Both to 1.2) - No luck.
(This is using Trident X 2666Mhz) - Had hopes for just a little headroom on them


----------



## snelan

You get your first flame at 25 reputation, or rep, points.

Also, does anyone know why core 0 is running about 8c cooler than the rest of the cores? I reseated 3 times, and am using MX-4 on the die and IHS. I'm not really worried about this, as I have Liquid Pro on the way, but if it's still the same kinda thing with the liquid pro, I will start investigating.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i dont think theres a big or noticeable difference between Vcore
> before and after delid , so i would say yes, you can compare them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.6ghz at 1.3V vcore is not bad, but not golden ..lol.
> i need about the same, i dont have a very good ocing chip
> compared to the others, but i can live with it tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, anyone know how i got that Flame under my forumname?
> is it related to posts or rep's? or just because im a nice guy ...LOL


A flame is for reps... think its 25 reps=1 flame, 100 for 2 flames, something like that


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> You get your first flame at 25 reputation, or rep, points.
> Also, does anyone know why core 0 is running about 8c cooler than the rest of the cores? I reseated 3 times, and am using MX-4 on the die and IHS. I'm not really worried about this, as I have Liquid Pro on the way, but if it's still the same kinda thing with the liquid pro, I will start investigating.


thanks







i like how it looks with 1 flame ..lol

its a normal thing with ivy, to have a temp difference between cores,
has to do with the layout of the die, 1 core is right next to the igpu..
before delid i had about 15C between hottest and coolest core,
after delid, about 6C, thats about what it should be, 8C is still fine tho









edit,
talk about missreading, youre saying/asking the opposit ..lol
thought you said 8C hotter then the other cores,
whats the temp of all cores then ?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> A flame is for reps... think its 25 reps=1 flame, 100 for 2 flames, something like that


i see, thanks


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> There's nothing wrong with Crucial RAM (or Aida64 for that matter)


I know for a fact the ic's used are micron's own and while they can do up to 2133-2200 with tighter timings than hynix or samsung (the other available ram chips found everywhere these days), they can't clock past 2200, maybe 2400mhz with some luck but with not so good timings...they are in fact better for chips with worse memory controllers where going past 2133 makes no difference but going tighter below that mark does: amd phenom/thuban/fx and 1366/1156/775 perhaps. In that regard they can be up to par with elpida hypers but are readily available and in 4gb stick size.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I just got the kit but my MB wont over clock it past 2133mhz....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sure the sticks are up to the job but my Z77 Mpower BIOS doesn't support it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still the best set of ram I have had in terms of system over clockability with low voltage and tight timings.
> Work great with my delidded 3770k at 5GHZ. 1T 9-10-10-24 1.5v DRAM voltage.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2609406
> Batch 12/29
> 
> Really the best RAM I have ever owned.


I figured msi had solved their issues with a new bios already...perhaps not so much, or your sticcks aren't the best? Unlikely cause you got some good clocks/timings with low volts


----------



## stickg1

About the temp difference. Before delidding I had about a 15C difference between the lowest and highest core, now cores 2-4 are really close in temp difference but core 1 is about 15-25C cooler than the rest. Is this uneven pasting?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i like how it looks with 1 flame ..lol
> its a normal thing with ivy, to have a temp difference between cores,
> has to do with the layout of the die, 1 core is right next to the igpu..
> before delid i had about 15C between hottest and coolest core,
> after delid, about 6C, thats about what it should be, 8C is still fine tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit,
> talk about missreading, youre saying/asking the opposit ..lol
> thought you said 8C hotter then the other cores,
> whats the temp of all cores then ?
> i see, thanks


hey here is the exact flame/rep setup....
http://www.overclock.net/t/1323273/what-is-a-flame


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It's a little thing called "Caution". There are many things that have no evidence to say something is bad, but you'd still be cautious about it. This should be one of those things where caution should be applied. Especially when your advice could have a damaging impact on people's hardware.
> And being an average overclocker is nothing to do with it's "degradability" shall we call it.
> But you have, in terms of statistics, one data point of a chip running at high voltage for long periods. That is all, one chip which has run at 1.55v. Not enough to call it safe and not enough to consider statistically significant information.


More info then you got.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> About the temp difference. Before delidding I had about a 15C difference between the lowest and highest core, now cores 2-4 are really close in temp difference but core 1 is about 15-25C cooler than the rest. Is this uneven pasting?


i got about the same most of the time, 1 "hottest" core, 2 cores about the same, 1 coolest core,
i just fired up aida64 stability test for a few min,

in this case 5C temp diff between hottest and coolest core..

if before delid you had about 15C diff, and after even more, then theres something not right i think,
it should become less after delid, not more, like me or others had too









can you make a pic showing the difference, and post it here?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> hey here is the exact flame/rep setup....
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1323273/what-is-a-flame


nice, thanks, only just noticed i had one,
guess that made me wonder like the guy in the post when he saw his for the first time ..lol


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That is the Max VDD not Vcore Idontcare busted that out.. that is the VDD range nothing about Vcore.
> So yeah it is Crap. Only somebody using that Vcore can Claim it.. And only i am.. And im still here and i say it is fine.
> Nobody knows Max Vcore and i say it is 1.55v cause ive tested it for long period of time.
> Nobody else can say that.. I can.


do u think ur chip will last 3-5 years like that??


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> do u think ur chip will last 3-5 years like that??


3 Easy 5 i donno i never kept a chip that long.

Point is in 5 months ill have Haswell. And if i have seen 0 signs of issue i will be selling this as a 5.1ghz 24/7 chip.
It is that persons baby then to do as they like.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> No idea on the Flame, but I just repped you (And if I could do it a hundred times I would) for helping me through the de-lid.
> Currently stable at 4.8Ghz @ 1.290 and 5.0Ghz @ 1.380 - And temps are so low that I still cant believe it!
> Trying to overclock the memory, but just cant get it to post above 2666Mhz - Raised the VTT and IMC (Both to 1.2) - No luck.
> (This is using Trident X 2666Mhz) - Had hopes for just a little headroom on them


Haha, thanks for the 1 rep then ..lol








glad i could help, i really like this thread, and the Crew








ivan knows memory like no other, think he can help you with that

5.0Ghz @ 1.380 , wheres that drool smile.. looks promising Gomi, very nice


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3 Easy 5 i donno i never kept a chip that long.
> Point is in 5 months ill have Haswell. And if i have seen 0 signs of issue i will be selling this as a 5.1ghz 24/7 chip.
> It is that persons baby then to do as they like.


who ever u sell it to its probably guna die on them lol
oh well


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> who ever u sell it to its probably guna die on them lol
> oh well


What it does 2 years after they buy it who cares.

They could choose to make the delid worthless and run 4.5ghz at 1.19v like my chip does for all we know.. cause it does 5.1ghz 24/7 does not mean there gonna do it..

I sold a i7 930 that i ran almost 2 years at 1.5v guy now runs it at 4.4ghz issue free...
1.5v on X58 is alot worse then 1.55v on Ivy.

Most important things about high volts are temps and by the love of god make sure it is stable..

Both chips are and were stable at those voltages and both had good temps..
" i had a custom loop" back then..


----------



## zGunBLADEz

I order some Liquid Ultra $18 and a corsair h100 for $70 on amazon with some store credit i already have..Not interested on Custom WC yet...
I read, it is recommended only on the cpu die and i have seen others using on the IHS also..

So what you guys think?

Another question... Have read that the liquid pro make it harder to remove blocks like it adheres to the metals....

If i use it on the die will have this problem too?


----------



## VonDutch

can we stop the, im right , youre not...

i joined intel today with the questions we have about max vcore etc, when i find new/better/other answers,
i will let you all know, i dont trust inet answers like you guys, all i have is the max SVID stated in the official data sheets from Intel,
everyone online that says max vcore is 1.52V, is talking about the max SVID, that ive learned so far,
thats what sin0822 states in his guide also..it seems hes using it in his graph too, naming it max vcore..

ok, i just saw someone saying this,

"Intel found﻿ that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."

you guys think theres some truth in that remark?
it makes sense to me..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> More info then you got.


More than him yes but compared to my statsistics, you fall behind. I have all of the vcores of every user on here per clock all written down right along with yours sir. You haven't been running 1.55v for 90 days because this thread hasn't been up this long. You ran it lower for a while about a little under 2 months. We aren't saying your data is wrong or flawed but that it is indeed not truthful yet. Take it this way. I had franky who took darn near 2 v no problem multiple times benched him at ungodly vcores for hundreds of hours and I didn't say anything about moving the max allowable vcore know why? Because I didn't want to be respnsible for any hardware damage, I knew Franky was getting tired due to a few boot bug that started a while back so I started just benching at certain vcore instead and notice degredation but very slight at that.

Yes your data is correct for your chip but compared to all the other chips out there its like saying my albino rabbit has red eyes so im gonna say that others should as well. And how do you know you have an AVG chip. Yeah you don't. You don't know the crystalline layout of all the chips or yours so quit tooting the wrong information around. Just for pure safety and still great performance for normal usage and even gaming I suggest we all fall on a good vcore of 1.45-1.5 no more than 1.5.

I say this for 2 reasons

1st no one knows about the 1.52 so its completely false then.

2nd I feel under 1.5v is a great place to sit for a non bencher who most people can still easily oc quite well even if they aren't delidded and if they are even better.

Hokies if you really want to compare data of all the vcores and clock per clock needs then I will rebuttle but get more data of more chips than come forward to correct people like intel. Not forum users you take these kind of things to heart when they are told by someone saying oh yeah you can do more vcore it doesn't hurt it then it suddenly kills their chip.

You have data, just simply not enough. If you want I can contact Intel and get real critical numbers from them but it will take time. If we want it done right we need it from the correct source, and make sure they aprove it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> More than him yes but compared to my statsistics, you fall behind. I have all of the vcores of every user on here per clock all written down right along with yours sir. You haven't been running 1.55v for 90 days because this thread hasn't been up this long. You ran it lower for a while about a little under 2 months. We aren't saying your data is wrong or flawed but that it is indeed not truthful yet. Take it this way. I had franky who took darn near 2 v no problem multiple times benched him at ungodly vcores for hundreds of hours and I didn't say anything about moving the max allowable vcore know why? Because I didn't want to be respnsible for any hardware damage, I knew Franky was getting tired due to a few boot bug that started a while back so I started just benching at certain vcore instead and notice degredation but very slight at that.
> Yes your data is correct for your chip but compared to all the other chips out there its like saying my albino rabbit has red eyes so im gonna say that others should as well. And how do you know you have an AVG chip. Yeah you don't. You don't know the crystalline layout of all the chips or yours so quit tooting the wrong information around. Just for pure safety and still great performance for normal usage and even gaming I suggest we all fall on a good vcore of 1.45-1.5 no more than 1.5.
> I say this for 2 reasons
> 1st no one knows about the 1.52 so its completely false then.
> 2nd I feel under 1.5v is a great place to sit for a non bencher who most people can still easily oc quite well even if they aren't delidded and if they are even better.
> Hokies if you really want to compare data of all the vcores and clock per clock needs then I will rebuttle but get more data of more chips than come forward to correct people like intel. Not forum users you take these kind of things to heart when they are told by someone saying oh yeah you can do more vcore it doesn't hurt it then it suddenly kills their chip.
> You have data, just simply not enough. If you want I can contact Intel and get real critical numbers from them but it will take time. If we want it done right we need it from the correct source, and make sure they aprove it.


You have no Data saying it is not.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> can we stop the, im right , youre not...
> i joined intel today with the questions we have about max vcore etc, when i find new/better/other answers,
> i will let you all know, i dont trust inet answers like you guys, all i have is the max SVID stated in the official data sheets from Intel,
> everyone online that says max vcore is 1.52V, is talking about the max SVID, that ive learned so far,
> thats what sin0822 states in his guide also..it seems hes using it in his graph too, naming it max vcore..
> ok, i just saw someone saying this,
> "Intel found﻿ that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."
> you guys think theres some truth in that remark?


I could see it from the heating and cooling thermodynamics of the smaller architecture compared to bigger chips. But I don't think anything else could effect it.
it makes sense to me.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You have no Data saying it is not.


And you have no data saying it is now do you.

Seriously if you want to get real results and data out to the general public then do it right get more information over more chips malaysia costa ricas and others. If yuo do that then I will agree but only if you have enough data.

That's why when you see a research project they ask hundreds if not thousands of people when they state their claims. You never see a research project ask one person and go. Yup he's right we are gonna go with him and ask no one else.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If you want I can contact Intel and get real critical numbers from them but it will take time. If we want it done right we need it from the correct source, and make sure they aprove it.


working on that as we speak Val








im sick and tired of the endless discussion every where about this issue..lol

"ill get to the bottom of this!"


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> working on that as we speak Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im sick and tired of the endless discussion every where about this issue..lol
> "ill get to the bottom of this!"


Thank you.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> "Intel found﻿ that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."
> you guys think theres some truth in that remark?
> it makes sense to me..
> 
> 
> 
> I could see it from the heating and cooling thermodynamics of the smaller architecture compared to bigger chips. But I don't think anything else could effect it.
> it makes sense to me.
Click to expand...

yea, i thought normal tim/compound still can go up and down a bit, more flexible, or just push it outward,
solder doesnt do that, so pressure could damage the die that way, the bigger the die, the better pressure gets spread out
been wondering about it for a while now, why they used tim this time, instead of solder,
and it answers one of our questions about, if Haswell will be soldered or not ..lol


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Is that the low voltage Crucial RAM we were talking about earlier?


Yeah...it runs at 1.5v


----------



## ripsaw

So do i just have a bad chip? or am i doing something wrong here?

4.4ghz, 1.3vcore

4.5ghz 1.350vcore

EDIT: using a50 cooler, need to get some TIM for h100.
I am following this guide: http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards


----------



## feniks

sry for the long wall of text, multi-reply here, can't follow the thread as it flows (too fast) ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Oddly enough, I know on EVGA forums one user's 3770k was at 98C when he was reflowing it for Indigo Xtreme... 98C was the exact temperature the CPU limited itself to
> To Ripsaw, can you post a graph monitoring software that actively monitor's your CPU's frequency during the stability tests? I'd be interested to see if it runs at it's full frequency or if it's throttling


IB 1155 have TJunctionMax set to 105C, not the 98C (this was for SB 1155 chips). I have seen it many times before on former chips (had like 5 of them), they start thermally throttling at 104C and for sure they will do that deeply once staying at 105C to beat the temps down.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive had mine up to 105c before i de lidded XD
> My puter restarted lol.


have never seen any of my 3770K restart at thermal limits and I was riding 2 of them at such for some time (before deliding)







restart could have been PLL voltage related (does that when set too low).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I fear i will have to up my voltage significantly to reach 5.0Ghz though considering the jumps I had to make from 4.6 > 4.7 > 4.8. If I keep it under 1.45 it will be a miracle. I am encouraged though that I dont have to worry so much about staying under 1.52.


my 2 chips from batch 3224B were doing 5GHz at 1.46v (fixed in BIOS, not offsets) and 4.8 around 1.28V, 4.9 around 1.36V
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Not sounding as a jerk at all mate - I understand that peoples definition on "Stable" varies alot.
> It holds IBT (10 runs), Cinebench, a handful of games I tried and a QUICK 15 minute Prime95 run.
> Have *NOT* taken it through a 24 hour P95 test as of yet, neither have I looked at it with a cold and evil stare while screaming
> "This is sparta!" - All will be done in due time, no doubt I can force it to "crack" at some point with enough work thrown at it


I usually run CB on CPU and up vcore until no more WHEA warnings in Event Logs, have yet to crash such vcore under IBT or Prime under full load, so far CB stability testing proves the best and it generates only mid-high temps (unlike IBT which is horrible temps wise).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> So do i just have a bad chip? or am i doing something wrong here?
> 4.4ghz, 1.3vcore
> 
> 4.5ghz 1.350vcore
> 
> EDIT: using a50 cooler, need to get some TIM for h100.
> I am following this guide: http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards


mine can do 4.7GHz at 1.21v ....


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> mine can do 4.7GHz at 1.21v ....


Are you using offset or manual mode? I can't seem to figure out offset mode, maybe i just need more practice.....







You have same board and chip as me, i must be doing someething wrong, or maybe i just have bad chip.....


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Are you using offset or manual mode? I can't seem to figure out offset mode, maybe i just need more practice.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have same board and chip as me, i must be doing someething wrong, or maybe i just have bad chip.....


Find out on what vcore you need on fixed mode first.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Are you using offset or manual mode? I can't seem to figure out offset mode, maybe i just need more practice.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have same board and chip as me, i must be doing someething wrong, or maybe i just have bad chip.....


both. at first I took it on fixed vcore with 75% LLC and it was 1.210v in BIOS (1.208 under load), then made it on offset and it took +0.025 (nearly same vcore under load).
currently I am running 4.9GHz on offset (+0.175 75% LLC) which is 1.360v under load and seems stable at light load (couldn't make it happen at 5GHz however wa scrashing sooner or later on light load) and heavy load as well (which is easy to achieve below 5GHz, just stabilize it under Cinebench with no WHEA warnings).

just as said above, stabilize it first with fixed vcore and observe the lowest vcore number as it gets to under load as reported in CPU-Z. that lowest observed vcore under load is what you need to achieve with offsets and that is pretty much all. maybe only that offsets usually call for 3-4 notches higher vcore at higher clocks (shouldn't be the case at 4.6-4.7 though) versus fixed mode.


----------



## Gomi

Giving up on the memory for now (This night) - How something so simple can give me such a headache is beyond me - Or maybe I simply hid a silicon wall.

IMC: 1.2
VTT: 1.2
VDDR: Tried from 1.65 (XMP default) -> 1.75.

Just wont post at anything above the rated 2666Mhz.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Giving up on the memory for now (This night) - How something so simple can give me such a headache is beyond me - Or maybe I simply hid a silicon wall.
> IMC: 1.2
> VTT: 1.2
> VDDR: Tried from 1.65 (XMP default) -> 1.75.
> Just wont post at anything above the rated 2666Mhz.


Imc should be below vtt...1.2v vtt needs 1.15v imc.
Anyways, either your imc is weak or (much more likely) you have single sided trident x sticks...look from the pins upward, and check if your pcb has ram chips on both sides or not. Should be easy to see under the heatsink.
Single sided ram uses more dense ram ic's which clock bad...kinda like most 8gb sticks, they do rated timings and nothing more.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Imc should be below vtt...1.2v vtt needs 1.15v imc.
> Anyways, either your imc is weak or (much more likely) you have single sided trident x sticks...look from the pins upward, and check if your pcb has ram chips on both sides or not. Should be easy to see under the heatsink.
> Single sided ram uses more dense ram ic's which clock bad...kinda like most 8gb sticks, they do rated timings and nothing more.


Cheers mate.

Have 8 gb of that Samsung "wonder" ram aswell - Might just stick those in and have a blast seeing how fast I can get those.

Will change the IMC and give it one last go on these Tridents - Its not like they are bad - Just wondered how far I could push them


----------



## chris-br

I really don't care about Ocing memory... The XMP setup is good enough for me.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I really don't care about Ocing memory... The XMP setup is good enough for me.


Oh no doubt mate - Just always a good laugh to see how far you can push things.

I was told this in the UD7 thread (A very empty thread btw!







) :
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NoGuru*
> 
> Don't be afraid to increase BCLK on this board, it can handle it no problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also this thread will probably get you answers a bit faster http://www.overclock.net/t/1239993/official-gigabyte-z77x-owners-discussion-information-support-thread-and-club-ud5h-ud3h-d3h-and-all


So guess I will have another good reading on how far BCLK can be pushed (105ish?).


----------



## snelan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> mine can do 4.7GHz at 1.21v ....


That's insane, I think mine takes around 1.36v for 4.7GHz.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's good enough for most people, cpu clock makes a bigger difference








BUT it is a fun thing to tweak, might get you into benching...high mhz and lower latency help for folding too.

Ram chips are very different and behave in different ways, it's like they have a personality of their own lol
Elpida Hypers/BBse are like big hot muscle cars draining tons of gas/volts for high clocks, whereas Samsung hyk0/hch9 are more like a japanese sportscar, much more efficient and fast, but not as much fun...xD


----------



## ripsaw

well that seems to be the best i can do with the a50 4.5 @ 1.350 vcore. temps getting too high though. think i have a bad batch chip i guess....









think ill go back to 4.4 @ 1.3 until i get some more TIM unless I'm missing something?. Thanx ppl


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> That's insane, I think mine takes around 1.36v for 4.7GHz.


1.244+/- for 4.7 on mine


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> That's insane, I think mine takes around 1.36v for 4.7GHz.


make sure you are using the same load line calibration as I do (75% LLC here), otherwise comparison is useless


----------



## snelan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> make sure you are using the same load line calibration as I do (75% LLC here), otherwise comparison is useless


Well I just look in CPU-Z when it's under load to get my numbers. I've still been messing around with the LLCs. On my motherboard "Extreme" pushes it over the set voltage when under load a bit, so I set 1.35VCore, and it pushes to 1.358 under load. At least according to CPU-Z.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Well I just look in CPU-Z when it's under load to get my numbers. I've still been messing around with the LLCs. On my motherboard "Extreme" pushes it over the set voltage when under load a bit, so I set 1.35VCore, and it pushes to 1.358 under load. At least according to CPU-Z.


No, LLc should be @ turbo. I have the same board as you. extreme will go over.. By alot.

turn off turbo and any energy saving features..., cpu pll put on 1.600


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> No, LLc should be @ turbo. I have the same board as you. extreme will go over.. By alot.
> turn off turbo and any energy saving features..., cpu pll put on 1.600


looks like im getting somewhere with the offset mode... offset to -.045 are you saying i should o/c without turbo?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> looks like im getting somewhere with the offset mode... offset to -.045 are you saying i should o/c without turbo?


Yeah... Turn off turbo... put LLC on turbo(not extreme) and CPU PLL @ 1,600(this will drop temps a little).


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I really don't care about Ocing memory... The XMP setup is good enough for me.


Don't always trust the XMP settings though. Ivy seems pretty good with XMP but not all chips/boards are, x58 & x79 XMP setting with some mem kits can put voltages in the danger zone, where cpu is almost certain to degrade.

Much battle about safe voltages. Overclocking isn't safe, if you want fully safe run stock. Chip HAS to last 10 years, don't overclock it very much. Don't care if it lasts a week, have fun & shoot for the moon.
Safe is what is safe for the user. 1.55V is safe for hokies, 1.2V is safe for someone else.
This isn't really the place for safe though, it's a club where people tear up the cpus...


----------



## chris-br

The XMP profile is exacly the specs of my ram. I did check.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Lol FtW xD spot on!
If you want it safe run stock, I'll go a bit further and say this IS ocn after all...but I do believe there's merit in the cientific method, but no one has a definite answer cause every chp's different, cause the manufacturing process is not 100% accurate.


----------



## FtW 420

Cooling makes a good difference also, custom water could run a higher vcore as safely as a stock cooled rig with lower vcore. Higher vcore with low temps, less risk. Low vcore with higher temps, less risk. High vcore with high temps, risk.
I spent about $1000 on coolers that make it safer to run high vcore daily, & then have really extreme cooling for when I want to do short bursts at 2V.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Don't always trust the XMP settings though. Ivy seems pretty good with XMP but not all chips/boards are, x58 & x79 XMP setting with some mem kits can put voltages in the danger zone, where cpu is almost certain to degrade.
> Much battle about safe voltages. Overclocking isn't safe, if you want fully safe run stock. Chip HAS to last 10 years, don't overclock it very much. Don't care if it lasts a week, have fun & shoot for the moon.
> Safe is what is safe for the user. 1.55V is safe for hokies, 1.2V is safe for someone else.
> This isn't really the place for safe though, it's a club where people tear up the cpus...


This is going to sound kinda pathetic but for me my safe zone for AMD is 0.1V
and for intel its 0.2V from stock.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Oh no doubt mate - Just always a good laugh to see how far you can push things.
> I was told this in the UD7 thread (A very empty thread btw!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) :
> So guess I will have another good reading on how far BCLK can be pushed (105ish?).


UD7 is expensive and really only worth it for extreme overclocking.. cause u can get the same results out of a 150$ MB if your not doing the extreme stuff.

So thats why not many people have them.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Don't always trust the XMP settings though. Ivy seems pretty good with XMP but not all chips/boards are, x58 & x79 XMP setting with some mem kits can put voltages in the danger zone, where cpu is almost certain to degrade.
> Much battle about safe voltages. Overclocking isn't safe, if you want fully safe run stock. Chip HAS to last 10 years, don't overclock it very much. Don't care if it lasts a week, have fun & shoot for the moon.
> Safe is what is safe for the user. 1.55V is safe for hokies, 1.2V is safe for someone else.
> This isn't really the place for safe though, it's a club where people tear up the cpus...


Yep if u want safe do not delid your cpu and run 4.2ghz..

If your gonna de lid your cpu why run 4.5ghz? if your gonna go thru all that to lower temps to show your an enthusiast then push it to it's limits are stay home..
I did not De lid my cpu to stay at the same mhz i was before but be 50 c below TJ Max i did it to overclock more... to me that is what it is all about.

I remember X58 everybody pushed things to there limits.. where did all those guys go?
If This was 2 years ago there would be 50 ppl running my Voltage 24/7 heh they all on ExtremeSystems now?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yep if u want safe do not delid your cpu and run 4.2ghz..
> If your gonna de lid your cpu why run 4.5ghz? if your gonna go thru all that to lower temps to show your an enthusiast then push it to it's limits are stay home..
> I did not De lid my cpu to stay at the same mhz i was before but be 50 c below TJ Max i did it to overclock more... to me that is what it is all about.
> I remember X58 everybody pushed things to there limits.. where did all those guys go?
> If This was 2 years ago there would be 50 ppl running my Voltage 24/7 heh they all on ExtremeSystems now?


Seriously, why would anyone even be in this thread if they were just going to play it safe? There are plenty of other "clubs" out there for you







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Seriously, why would anyone even be in this thread if they were just going to play it safe? There are plenty of other "clubs" out there for you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


You would be shocked.. how many delidded dropped 25 c and run the exact same OC they did before the de lid...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> This is going to sound kinda pathetic but for me my safe zone for AMD is 0.1V
> and for intel its 0.2V from stock.


Only sounds pathetic if you're wealthy & buy a new rig 4 times a year (or are trying to break world records







). If it's your only rig & you can't replace it for a long time if it breaks, better safe than sorry.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> UD7 is expensive and really only worth it for extreme overclocking.. cause u can get the same results out of a 150$ MB if your not doing the extreme stuff.
> So thats why not many people have them.


Yes, for average 24/7 overclocks pretty much any z77 board can do that. Spending more is just for looks, options & features. Many $150 boards can still do extreme stuff, may be more difficult or not go quite as far but they can be pretty capable.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> can we stop the, im right , youre not...
> i joined intel today with the questions we have about max vcore etc, when i find new/better/other answers,
> i will let you all know, i dont trust inet answers like you guys, all i have is the max SVID stated in the official data sheets from Intel,
> everyone online that says max vcore is 1.52V, is talking about the max SVID, that ive learned so far,
> thats what sin0822 states in his guide also..it seems hes using it in his graph too, naming it max vcore..
> ok, i just saw someone saying this,
> *"Intel found﻿ that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."*
> you guys think theres some truth in that remark?
> it makes sense to me..


Needs it's own thread so it can be discussed

You have a link to this claim?


----------



## ZealotKi11er

I have my 3570K under water.
It getting 81-88-88-81. Seems like the difference is a bit much.
4700Mhz @ 1.4v (1.38-1.3925v)
Do you guys think i should bother? All i want is higher OC but having 1.4v just for 4.7Ghz i probably need 1.45+ for 4.8Ghz and 5Ghz probably out of the question.
Temps dont mean much for me since the CPU does have 3 year warranty if anything goes wrong.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I have my 3570K under water.
> It getting 81-88-88-81. Seems like the difference is a bit much.
> 4700Mhz @ 1.4v (1.38-1.3925v)
> Do you guys think i should bother? All i want is higher OC but having 1.4v just for 4.7Ghz i probably need 1.45+ for 4.8Ghz and 5Ghz probably out of the question.
> Temps dont mean much for me since the CPU does have 3 year warranty if anything goes wrong.


Valguar told Intel he pumped 1.95v into his chip and killed it Amd there gonna Rma his chip. There for i say put all the voltage that is needed thru it u can to get the Max OC you can.

Unless u plan on keeping it 3+ years.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valguar told Intel he pumped 1.95v into his chip and killed it Amd there gonna Rma his chip. There for i say put all the voltage that is needed thru it u can to get the Max OC you can.
> Unless u plan on keeping it 3+ years.


Should wait till he gets a new one back to make sure. The rep he spoke to at intel might have a sense of humor.
"sure, send it in for RMA". Draws trollface on dead cpu & returns it...


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You would be shocked.. how many delidded dropped 25 c and run the exact same OC they did before the de lid...


Im running 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V after delid and before hated seeing it hit 70C on custom water. Now it hits 55C tops. That's why i did it.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Valguar told Intel he pumped 1.95v into his chip and killed it Amd there gonna Rma his chip. There for i say put all the voltage that is needed thru it u can to get the Max OC you can.
> Unless u plan on keeping it 3+ years.


I plan to keep it until something better comes out. If Haswell does not deliver i would probably go 2011. This CPU would probably run ~ 6 month with high voltage MAX then moderate OC since i would give it to my brother.
What the MAX save voltage? 1.52v like SB?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Yeah...it runs at 1.5v


Uuhhhhm what.

It's 1.35v

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148655


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Im running 4.4Ghz @ 1.08V after delid and before hated seeing it hit 70C on custom water. Now it hits 55C tops. That's why i did it.


70c is 35c from TJ Max.. lol your miles away from being hot..

Those Amd boys run there Chips AT TJMax... are with in 1-5c.. so umm yah 35c from TJMax....
As long as im 10 c away from it i am happy..
And that is where i was before De lid running 95c.. and i did it from April until October...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I plan to keep it until something better comes out. If Haswell does not deliver i would probably go 2011. This CPU would probably run ~ 6 month with high voltage MAX then moderate OC since i would give it to my brother.
> What the MAX save voltage? 1.52v like SB?


Nobody knows what Max safe is i run 1.55v but 6 months i do not see any issues running it above 1.5v for that time period.. then ur brother running it at whatever he wants.. Get the most out of it while you got it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I really don't care about Ocing memory... The XMP setup is good enough for me.
> 
> 
> 
> Don't always trust the XMP settings though. Ivy seems pretty good with XMP but not all chips/boards are, x58 & x79 XMP setting with some mem kits can put voltages in the danger zone, where cpu is almost certain to degrade.
> 
> Much battle about safe voltages. Overclocking isn't safe, if you want fully safe run stock. Chip HAS to last 10 years, don't overclock it very much. Don't care if it lasts a week, have fun & shoot for the moon.
> Safe is what is safe for the user. 1.55V is safe for hokies, 1.2V is safe for someone else.
> This isn't really the place for safe though, it's a club where people tear up the cpus...
Click to expand...

Love your comment *FtW 420*. As soon as we decided to do overclocking we left the land of safe, and so much more so to delid the things! If any of us wanted just safe we would/should not be on here! LOL

- Not to say we have to be foolish or anything, nor should we be careless in our advice to others - we can say what's good _for us_ and works _for us_ - fun and safety can be relative terms we can each define for ourselves and our own systems.....and we do not have to do what others suggest.

But safe? On here? LOL
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> can we stop the, im right , youre not...
> i joined intel today with the questions we have about max vcore etc, when i find new/better/other answers,
> i will let you all know, i dont trust inet answers like you guys, all i have is the max SVID stated in the official data sheets from Intel,
> everyone online that says max vcore is 1.52V, is talking about the max SVID, that ive learned so far,
> thats what sin0822 states in his guide also..it seems hes using it in his graph too, naming it max vcore..
> ok, i just saw someone saying this,
> *"Intel found﻿ that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."*
> you guys think theres some truth in that remark?
> it makes sense to me..
> 
> 
> 
> Needs it's own thread so it can be discussed
> 
> You have a link to this claim?
Click to expand...

I to would like the link to this *VonDutch*. Maybe there was a good reason for why Intel went no solder for IB. Seems they should have just stated it more clearly though if it is true.


----------



## Hokies83

People keep down playing Haswells performance...

I Still think 10-20%


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> People keep down playing Haswells performance...
> I Still think 10-20%


I really hope so. 15% increase and hopefully better OC i am getting one for sure 4770K this time.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> What it does 2 years after they buy it who cares.
> They could choose to make the delid worthless and run 4.5ghz at 1.19v like my chip does for all we know.. cause it does 5.1ghz 24/7 does not mean there gonna do it..
> I sold a i7 930 that i ran almost 2 years at 1.5v guy now runs it at 4.4ghz issue free...
> 1.5v on X58 is alot worse then 1.55v on Ivy.
> Most important things about high volts are temps and by the love of god make sure it is stable..
> Both chips are and were stable at those voltages and both had good temps..
> " i had a custom loop" back then..


yea my brother has the i7 920 @ 4.6 with 1.43v had it for like 3 years now


----------



## chris-br

Well. 4,8ghz is out for me... trying to get without whea errors i stopped @ 1,505vcore on bios... not going over that... and not keeping there either. So i may settle with 4,7ghz @ 1,416v no errors so far.

EDIT... Forgot to say that i'm running offset mode and hitting max 1,428v on cpuz. but stable so far and temps are not going over 65c.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yea my brother has the i7 920 @ 4.6 with 1.43v had it for like 3 years now


Yeah.. Nothing wrong with high volts if your stable and temps are fine.. if you go running some crazy volts un stable with high temps sure your gonna trash your cpu...
Be smart and do it the right way and enjoy it for years to come.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I really hope so. 15% increase and hopefully better OC i am getting one for sure 4770K this time.


Yeah me to.. but going to wait a lil longer this time till some better boards are out.. i jumped on Ivy at release day .


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Uuhhhhm what.
> It's 1.35v
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148655


That's not my RAM


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> That's not my RAM


Which "Low-voltage crucial RAM" were you talking about ?


----------



## Systemlord

I thought that *Flames Earned* meant how many times you have flamed (ridiculed) an OCN member!


----------



## ripsaw

Well i guess my o/c attempt wasnt stable, borderlands 2 kept crashing. Works fine at stock settings. MB Default settings give me this v core:


Now i really think i got a bad chip!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Well i guess my o/c attempt wasnt stable, borderlands 2 kept crashing. Works fine at stock settings. MB Default settings give me this v core:
> 
> Now i really think i got a bad chip!


1.25V at stock 3.9 turbo? hmmm, yeah it's not a golden one for sure








what batch is it? perhaps you should replace it in store that sold it to you if still within 30 days?

mine does stock 3.9 turbo at 1.12v, batch 3224B from a local Microcenter.


----------



## dmanstasiu

You can just ... replace it?


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought that *Flames Earned* meant how many times you have flamed (ridiculed) an OCN member!


groan.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 1.25V at stock 3.9 turbo? hmmm, yeah it's not a golden one for sure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what batch is it? perhaps you should replace it in store that sold it to you if still within 30 days?
> mine does stock 3.9 turbo at 1.12v, batch 3224B from a local Microcenter.


batch # 3228B157
is that returnable? i bought from a local store, I'll check with them tomorrow if i have time.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> batch # 3228B157
> is that returnable? i bought from a local store, I'll check with them tomorrow if i have time.


Feniks was just curious about your batch,
its returnable witin a specific time after buying it,
depends on the store where you bought it,
most of the time its on the receipt within what time you can return it..


----------



## tw33k

5GHz 1.42v



Before de-lidding I had to stop stress testing as temps hit 103c


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> 5GHz 1.42v
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before de-lidding I had to stop stress testing as temps hit 103c


very nice tw33k, wish i had vcore like that at 5.0ghz ..lol
i dont think i could boot 5.0ghz at that vcore








1.450V was lowest for me,

to boot, and run aida64 that is..


----------



## Ali Man

Almost everywhere other 3770K here on OCN does 5Ghz @ 1.4V, mine does it at 1.5V and can't get on 5.1Ghz at all.


----------



## everlast4291987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Yea i'd like to move down to the basement my self to keep temps down but then i'd have to be cold too


I live in the basement and my heater is my 50 inch plasma keep me warm


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 70c is 35c from TJ Max.. lol your miles away from being hot..
> Those Amd boys run there Chips AT TJMax... are with in 1-5c.. so umm yah 35c from TJMax....
> As long as im 10 c away from it i am happy..
> And that is where i was before De lid running 95c.. and i did it from April until October...
> Nobody knows what Max safe is i run 1.55v but 6 months i do not see any issues running it above 1.5v for that time period.. then ur brother running it at whatever he wants.. Get the most out of it while you got it.


How did you run 1.55v before deliding on an h100...

Unless you used pro or ultra. I was at 95c with an h100 without delid with mx-4 at 1.35


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> 5GHz 1.42v
> 
> Before de-lidding I had to stop stress testing as temps hit 103c


Nice , what are your ambient temps ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Almost everywhere other 3770K here on OCN does 5Ghz @ 1.4V, mine does it at 1.5V and can't get on 5.1Ghz at all.


around 1.4V vcore and 5.0ghz is very good tho,
its different doing some benching/testing, and to have it 24H prime stable,
im already maxed out at 4.9ghz 1.510V vcore prime stable,
1.52V vcore is my "personal" max vcore for ivy









i can run aida at 5.1ghz and 1.510V vcore

but dont think its prime stable, besides if i run prime/ibt, my temps would go over 90C for sure

running ibt at 5.0ghz 1.510V vcore is one of my best


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *everlast4291987*
> 
> I live in the basement and my heater is my 50 inch plasma keep me warm


Not cold enough. Its -15 here. Nice and warm.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> around 1.4V vcore and 5.0ghz is very good tho,
> its different doing some benching/testing, and to have it 24H prime stable,
> im already maxed out at 4.9ghz 1.510V vcore prime stable,
> 1.52V vcore is my "personal" max vcore for ivy


1.52 should be the max for all. Going above wont hurt but I wouldnt do it 24/7. Id take intels word over anyones on this fact.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Nice , what are your ambient temps ?


21.7c


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 1.52 should be the max for all. Going above wont hurt but I wouldnt do it 24/7. Id take intels word over anyones on this fact.


yea, going above it, i only do that for benching,
i just ran 1.620V vcore to make cinebench run at 5.1ghz,
to get a higher score ..lol, those things ( i think) cant really hurt,
most of the time its only for minutes, would never try run it for hours prime,
1.85V vcore was the highest i had running through mine, np..just me sweating it ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How did you run 1.55v before deliding on an h100...
> Unless you used pro or ultra. I was at 95c with an h100 without delid with mx-4 at 1.35


Um i did not?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 1.52 should be the max for all. Going above wont hurt but I wouldnt do it 24/7. Id take intels word over anyones on this fact.


Thats your opinion. there is no word from Intel ?


----------



## everlast4291987

lol it 5c in prov


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Um i did not?
> Thats your opinion. there is no word from Intel ?


You said you ran 1.55 for 6months lol.

And its not my opinion its in intels datasheet for the cpu on their site. Remember the little chart? You might be running 1.55 but I doubt youre folding 24/7, I wouldnt do anything over 1.52 but play low end games and browse the internet. There is a reason intel would put 1.52v on the graph, manufacturers dont put a limit unless there is one.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I to would like the link to this *VonDutch*. Maybe there was a good reason for why Intel went no solder for IB. Seems they should have just stated it more clearly though if it is true.


its not really a link to, i only read comments on a youtube vid about delidding 3770k yesterday,

Henry Young 2 weken geleden
"Intel found that at﻿ 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."





its way down in the comments, had to click 3x to open more comments








just thought it made sense thats all, thats why i asked what you guys thought about this remark,
dont know where this guy got that info from, or that its his own thinking..

its a question i had, and others too,
"why did intel use tim on ivy instead of solder like sandy?" ,
and what will the future bring with Haswell, and later die shrinks..solder or tim,
with this answer (if its correct), Haswell would use tim too, and every chip after that also


----------



## alancsalt

Hardly any Ivy entries in the BCLK Club, just two:

*i7-3770K @ bclk 116.95 MHz ~ Sin0822 ~ CPUZ Validation*
*i5-3570K @ bclk 110.5 MHz ~ battlecryawesome ~ CPUZ Validation*

Not trying?

I'm sure someone could beat at least the i5-3570K?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You said you ran 1.55 for 6months lol.
> And its not my opinion its in intels datasheet for the cpu on their site. Remember the little chart? You might be running 1.55 but I doubt youre folding 24/7, I wouldnt do anything over 1.52 but play low end games and browse the internet. There is a reason intel would put 1.52v on the graph, manufacturers dont put a limit unless there is one.


That chart has nothing to do with Vcore that is VCC range.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Idontcare;34296202*
> <- has BS in Materials Science Engineering and PhD in Chemical Physics, directly worked on process node development spanning 0.5um to 32nm at Texas Instruments
> 
> register range =/= Vcc range
> 
> Please stop equating the two. The max value for a register has nothing to do with the max safe core voltage
> 
> And? What does any of that have to do with the fact it is not Intel's official spec as falsely claimed?


VID range simply identifies what voltages can be set/measured. It has no bearing on what is safe.

For the non-technical or uninitiated, the VID is represented by 8 bits, which means a total range of 256 values (convenient, as this is also exactly 2 hexadecimal digits for a shorter representation). It goes up to 1.52 simply because of the range these bits can express and the size of the vcc steps per byte value (one of the 256 possible combinations).

The small size is necessary for better resolution (accurate representation of an analog phenomenon using digital means). Using steps of. 005, had Intel skimped on the VID transistors and only allotted 7 bits to the task, they will only be able to set/measure up to 0.88v (.005 x 126 + 0.25; all low bits are used for zero voltage, 000001 is the starting "lowest" vcore measured, hence we subtract 2 from 2^7 or 128, which is how we got 126). So they used one more bit to be able to set/measure more values, seeing as to how it would be useful to measure stuff like 1.0v and 1.2v. Of course, the addition of that one bit doubles the possible combinations, from 128 to 256, so you end up with values that are ******ed but measurable simply by nature of having bits enough to represent them.

That is why the VID range goes up to 1.52v, which does not seem at all like a round figure. It's simply the value when all available bits get used up.

"Vcc_max" in the table also does not mean what some think it means. It does not mean "this is the maximum vcore ivy can take." It means "this is the max vcore that these set of bits will represent" - remember, we are trying to digitally represent something analog, so the best you can do is set bounday, unless you plan on implementing infinite resolution using an infinite number of bits (I am exaggerating a bit, but it is very impractical to say the least).

I said i ran at 95c for 6months not 1.55v ?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Hardly any Ivy entries in the BCLK Club, just two:
> *i7-3770K @ bclk 116.95 MHz ~ Sin0822 ~ CPUZ Validation*
> *i5-3570K @ bclk 110.5 MHz ~ battlecryawesome ~ CPUZ Validation*
> Not trying?
> I'm sure someone could beat at least the i5-3570K?


I given up on the Tridents - Might try to tighten the timings later today, but cant really ask for more of these. Might try the Samsungs tonight if time permits.

Been dabbling in BCLK, will focus on it tonight - With the UD7 its crazy easy - Just did a quick few touches on the OC-buttons and did some runs at 105 BCLK just for a laugh.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Hardly any Ivy entries in the BCLK Club, just two:
> *i7-3770K @ bclk 116.95 MHz ~ Sin0822 ~ CPUZ Validation*
> *i5-3570K @ bclk 110.5 MHz ~ battlecryawesome ~ CPUZ Validation*
> Not trying?
> I'm sure someone could beat at least the i5-3570K?


for me, it had to do with this remark in Sin's guide,

i quote,
*Ivy Bridge Overclocking is almost identical to Sandy Bridge overclocking in that it is basically a CPU which is meant to be overclocked through the multiplier and not the base clock (BCLK).* Sandy Bridge overclocking brought a whole new level of simplicity to the overclocking realm, a user only needed to change a few voltages, and change some ratios and they were easily granted a huge performance increase. With Ivy Bridge things get a lot easier as the CPU overclocks a lot further with better cooling and is more optimized towards higher memory and base clock speeds, thus making ambient overclocking much simpler and easier for the average overclocker. There is almost no need to increase the secondary CPU voltages, such as VTT, with Ivy Bridge on air/water cooling as the memory controller can already push the memory up to its limits without this. The same thing goes for base clock, while with Sandy Bridge the max base clocks we saw were pretty limited, around 105-107 on average, almost all Ivy Bridge CPUs will do 110mhz easily with LN2 cooling, and will scale way above that with the cold.
end quote,

and im having a hard time with mine, to go above 101 blck at 4.7ghz and higher oc's,
i only have it at 101 blck, 46 multiplier, never looked into it any further, tried find the max,
101.40-101.45 blck was max for my 4.6ghz..

edit,
wait, his entry is at stock, and only using blck?
116.95 blck and 35 multiplier..

anything i need to know before i (might) go at it later today?
thought it was bad for mobo etc using high blck's?


----------



## alancsalt

It's a slightly different ballgame, but I'd be the first to admit I don't know what it takes for IB. I just know that SB was limited to around 105 and AFAIK Ivy usually tops out about 114? I'm sure *fTw 420* would know lots more than me too.....?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Well i guess my o/c attempt wasnt stable, borderlands 2 kept crashing. Works fine at stock settings. MB Default settings give me this v core:
> 
> Now i really think i got a bad chip!


You still have turbo on. But your stock settings does use more vcore than mine. I still think you can do 4.5.


----------



## VonDutch

dang, rerouted 4x already ...lol gonna make em sweat ....LOL

: : i have a question that alot of people are asking, in forum's etc... : What is the maximum Vcore a 3770K can run? 1.52V vcore?
: im trying to find a clear answer to that question, i have contacted intel support before asking the same, but the employee and i didnt get further then the sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4 where it states max SVID is 1.52V im using that number in a forum as maximum vcore for the 3770K, but people say that it is wrong, and SVID has nothing to do with Vcore, all i want is a clear answer to my question once and for all.. if any of the "official" intel people can help me with this, or anyone else that have understanding about the maximum vcore a 3770K can handle, and why
Venu Gopal: I will help you with complete details.
Venu Gopal: Please refer below web link.
Venu Gopal: http://ark.intel.com/products/65523
: i know that one, but it doesnt state anywhere what the maximum Vcore is for the 3770K
: i joined intel forum yesterday, with the same question,
: http://communities.intel.com/message/174944#174944
Venu Gopal: Please refer below web link.
Venu Gopal: http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/datasheets/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.pdf
Venu Gopal: For more information please refer above web link.
: sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
: where it states max SVID is 1.52V
: but it doesnt state clearly that the max Vcore is 1.52V
: its max SVID
Venu Gopal: Please refer page number :18
Venu Gopal: It gives core voltages.
: i dont see it sorry, i see vcore mentioned, but no voltage?
: VCore VR
Venu Gopal: Okay.
Venu Gopal: I have shared the details which we have, However I will transfer the chat to local support.
Venu Gopal: Please be online.
: will do, thanks for your help








Please wait while I transfer the chat to the best suited site operator.

this was on page 18,


grmbl.....

You are now chatting with 'Yaganah'

: hello Yaganah








There may be a problem communicating with Yaganah. Please wait while your chat is transferred to another operator.

You are now chatting with 'Jozias'
: Hi Jozias
Chat session has ended.

will give it another try tomorrow, more then 1 hour chat and wait, no answer ....hate it..


----------



## alancsalt

I doubt Intel would give a clear answer. They would hedge their bets.
You already know there are good chips and not so good chips, so I'd say the maximum vcore would depend on how good the silicon and all is in your chip. Maybe 1.52v or 1.55v, but really you cannot be sure. There might be some chips that would die at those volts. Probably not immediately... maybe after a few months. At the other end of the scale you have chips like Franky that handled vcores up to 1.9v (on air), but it did seem to shorten his life.

So in my opinion there isn't a definitive figure.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I doubt Intel would give a clear answer. They would hedge their bets.
> You already know there are good chips and not so good chips, so I'd say the maximum vcore would depend on how good the silicon and all is in your chip. Maybe 1.52v or 1.55v, but really you cannot be sure. There might be some chips that would die at those volts. Probably not immediately... maybe after a few months. At the other end of the scale you have chips like Franky that handled vcores up to 1.9v (on air), but it did seem to shorten his life.
> So in my opinion there isn't a definitive figure.


Yes, but still, for me/us its a important answer to that question,
if you have a ivy thats not delidded, you prolly never have to ask it,
since most run into max temps before "max" vcore..

"What is the Max Vcore a 3570K/3770K can handle?"

Its one of the Questions that are asked very often tho, after delid, in our thread,
now the temps arent the issue, but Vcore..
so i refer to Sin0882 guide, and the graph hes using, stating, Intel Rec. Max 1.52
but now it seems he, and many others using the 1.52V vcore as max are all wrong?
Sin is highly respected all around, so people take his remarks/reviews etc at heart,
i did so too..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Maybe 1.52v or 1.55v, but really you cannot be sure.
> There might be some chips that would die at those volts. Probably not immediately... maybe after a few months.
> So in my opinion there isn't a definitive figure.


At least the delid crew should have consensus about this,
before next time if asked , someone says,
"you can run 1.6V vcore 24/7, is youre chip is good he'll survive,
if not, you will know after a few months" ...lol

I for one say, Max Rec. Vcore is 1.52V vcore









not because i can prove it in any way,
but because of all the remarks all over the internet stating it is,
dispite other people saying its not true, you cant prove it..

and when someone gave me this answer, i thought that made sense,
thats why im using the SVID 1.52V thats in the intel sheet

"I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered
the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
for consumer usage. LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting."


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice work VonDutch, I doubt they'll provide us with further info cause they probably didn't test voltages over 1.52v, heck not even over 1.4v probably...They most likely limited the binning and testing to the usual figures for running stock clocks and turbo within thermal limits using the box cooler.
Anyway, I will limit myself to Sin's max 1.55v on air, till I get a pot and freeze my way to 7ghz or close


----------



## DOS_equis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> I'm curios if that screw has enough clearance to settle the block on the die...
> 
> 
> 
> Hey dude, if you want a safe way to test this, get some contact paper from walmart or an office supply store. Think of the pink or yellow part of a receipt. if you cut a small square of that paper, and then place that on the die of your CPU. Then mount the block (no TIM obviously), but be sure to use equal pressure. Be careful cuz if you crack the corners of the core you're toast. Once you get it all the way down, remove the block and inspect the contact paper. If you see a nice, even, dark rectangle where the core was, then I think its worth a shot with TIM!
Click to expand...

Or you could use this stuff that is designed for measuring tight clearances between to mating surfaces:

http://www.plastigaugeusa.com/how.html

or if you're just trying to see a contact pattern you can maybe use regular old modeling clay. The contact paper idea is a good one though if you know the two pieces are going to touch and you want to make sure it's touching all of the way around.


----------



## feniks

Microcenter allows returns for refunds in 14 days and returns for exchange in 30 days. other stores may have other policies (i.e. exchange only in 30 days, no refunds).
most online stores takes returns for exchange only, with exception of amazon (they do refunds as well).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> batch # 3228B157
> is that returnable? i bought from a local store, I'll check with them tomorrow if i have time.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Feniks was just curious about your batch,
> its returnable witin a specific time after buying it,
> depends on the store where you bought it,
> most of the time its on the receipt within what time you can return it..


----------



## Valgaur

Hokies what were you running to push your chip to 95C for 6 months?

And mr salt that exactly what I was saying. Its all based on theimpedence of the silicon, franky didn't degrade at all he just kinda stopped lol.


----------



## tw33k

I ran Aida64 for 1 hour with the chip at a range of clock speeds.


----------



## chris-br

@Valgaur -Do you think that pushing 1,510v on bios for 4.8ghz is too much for a 24/7?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hokies what were you running to push your chip to 95C for 6 months?
> And mr salt that exactly what I was saying. Its all based on theimpedence of the silicon, franky didn't degrade at all he just kinda stopped lol.


1.35v


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> @Valgaur -Do you think that pushing 1,510v on bios for 4.8ghz is too much for a 24/7?


No5 worth it. Take it back down 100 mhz not worth the 100 bonues really and its a very small performance difference, even if you are folding 4.5 still = 4.8
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.35v


What programs and yeah those temps are right for that voltage. Silly intel spacing.


----------



## martinhal

I did a 10 hour prime95 run @ 5 Ghz @ 1.452 v got Max 82 C on two cores. I'm using CLP on die and CM X1 Extreme Fusion on IHS. The X1 seems to be the best for the Tim's I have on hand. Are the temps OK ? Would I get better if I use CLP on IHS too. I know it is a hassle to get off so will it be worth it ?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> @Valgaur -Do you think that pushing 1,510v on bios for 4.8ghz is too much for a 24/7?


Your temps are nice for that voltage.

Any way you could tweak your voltage down to at least 1.45v?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Your temps are nice for that voltage.
> Any way you could tweak your voltage down to at least 1.45v?


On offset mode, i was able to get stable @ 1.488 for the 4,8ghz, but the temps are SO low on 4.5ghz.









When i say stable, is running prime custom with 6gb ram starting with min FFT size at 2688 and max FFT 4096 for 2 min each... i did that for 30mins and no whea erros. Also IBT ran with no whea errors. ofcourse I'm able to boot with less vcore, but with WHEA errors.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I did a 10 hour prime95 run @ 5 Ghz @ 1.452 v got Max 82 C on two cores. I'm using CLP on die and CM X1 Extreme Fusion on IHS. The X1 seems to be the best for the Tim's I have on hand. Are the temps OK ? Would I get better if I use CLP on IHS too. I know it is a hassle to get off so will it be worth it ?


not much, biggest temp difference is when using pro/ultra on the die,
maybe a few degrees..not sure how CM X1 Extreme Fusion compares to other tim's..
yea, temps are very nice, Vcore also


----------



## Lobsterman

5000 Woooooh!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> 5000 Woooooh!


Crap. I failed to see that.


----------



## stickg1

Is having my BCLK any higher than 100 bad for my PCIe GPU? Like even if its just 103? I'm just trying to figure out why ASUS Auto-Tune likes to mess with the BCLK if its a no-no...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bclk kills storage basically... do it on a spare windows install. Most benchers have stripped os installs anyways...


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bclk kills storage basically... do it on a spare windows install. Most benchers have stripped os installs anyways...


It's bad for HD's?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nope... it's actually bad for partitions and software like os' but not at a hardware level.


----------



## chris-br

Didn't know that. Good to know.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bclk kills storage basically... do it on a spare windows install. Most benchers have stripped os installs anyways...


I thought it was high PCI Express Frequency that was the gremlin there rather than bclk? My data damage (I thought) was more from crashes and bluescreens interrupting write processes? I haven't actually killed a drive yet from Ocing. My drive failures have been on work machines. Of course, I could just be lucky..


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Microcenter allows returns for refunds in 14 days and returns for exchange in 30 days. other stores may have other policies (i.e. exchange only in 30 days, no refunds).
> most online stores takes returns for exchange only, with exception of amazon (they do refunds as well).


Place i bought it said no refunds, it was special order, so i guess im stuck with it unless i can prove it is defective, as it stands right now, ill be lucky to hit 4.5 WITH a delid. Im kinda choked. Can i buy the Intel Performance plan AFTER purchasing chip? Then i could blow it up and get a new one lol....... oh, btw 1.80 manual vcore seems stable at stock speeds.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Place i bought it said no refunds, it was special order, so i guess im stuck with it unless i can prove it is defective, as it stands right now, ill be lucky to hit 4.5 WITH a delid. Im kinda choked. Can i buy the Intel Performance plan AFTER purchasing chip? Then i could blow it up and get a new one lol....... oh, btw 1.80 manual vcore seems stable at stock speeds.


Yes you can buy the plan after as far as I understand it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I thought it was high PCI Express Frequency that was the gremlin there rather than bclk? My data damage (I thought) was more from crashes and bluescreens interrupting write processes? I haven't actually killed a drive yet from Ocing. My drive failures have been on work machines. Of course, I could just be lucky..


They're linked so I'd venture to say they're one and the same...Thought it was common knowledge that Intel made 1155 behave that way to prevent locked multi chips from overclocking. You push fsb too far and bang, there goes stability and probably your os.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Just got my CLP in...to delid tonight or not? Hmmmm haha. From what I'm seeing from my chip so far it's not a good one. I can't even get 4.6Ghz stable (1 worker keeps failing) at 1.328vcore. It's gonna take me a lot of juice just to get to 4.8-4.9 even after delidding







.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just got my CLP in...to delid tonight or not? Hmmmm haha. From what I'm seeing from my chip so far it's not a good one. I can't even get 4.6Ghz stable (1 worker keeps failing) at 1.328vcore. It's gonna take me a lot of juice just to get to 4.8-4.9 even after delidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Thats is no big deal. you will see a real nice drop in temps..... mine is stable at 4.6 with 1,350/1.360 vcore


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> They're linked so I'd venture to say they're one and the same...Thought it was common knowledge that Intel made 1155 behave that way to prevent locked multi chips from overclocking. You push fsb too far and bang, there goes stability and probably your os.


Ah, knew the IGP was linked, but it hadn't sunk in the PEG and BCLK were the same....yes, does rather kill any extreme BCLK.

But top score in BCLK Klub for Ivy is only 116bclk and Sandy is only 110bclk... Isn't 115 generally considered the PCIe limit? (Could be digging a deeper hole for my memory wetware here









)
I wasn't expecting high numbers.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think so, at least that was as far as my former work's PC asrock board would go fsb- wise: 230mhz, and that was already pushing it... sound card would die randomly lol but my boss appreciated the performance boost xD


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bclk kills storage basically... do it on a spare windows install. Most benchers have stripped os installs anyways...
> 
> 
> 
> It's bad for HD's?
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nope... it's actually bad for partitions and software like os' but not at a hardware level.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I thought it was high PCI Express Frequency that was the gremlin there rather than bclk? My data damage (I thought) was more from crashes and bluescreens interrupting write processes? I haven't actually killed a drive yet from Ocing. My drive failures have been on work machines. Of course, I could just be lucky..
> 
> 
> 
> They're linked so I'd venture to say they're one and the same...Thought it was common knowledge that Intel made 1155 behave that way to prevent locked multi chips from overclocking. You push fsb too far and bang, there goes stability and probably your os.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> They're linked so I'd venture to say they're one and the same...Thought it was common knowledge that Intel made 1155 behave that way to prevent locked multi chips from overclocking. You push fsb too far and bang, there goes stability and probably your os.
> 
> 
> 
> Ah, knew the IGP was linked, but it hadn't sunk in the PEG and BCLK were the same....yes, does rather kill any extreme BCLK.
> 
> But top score in BCLK Klub for Ivy is only 116bclk and Sandy is only 110bclk... Isn't 115 generally considered the PCIe limit? (Could be digging a deeper hole for my memory wetware here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> I wasn't expecting high numbers.....
Click to expand...

I love hanging out on this thread as I never know what new thing I'm gunna learn!! Thanks for the info guys!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Me neither...best club around!









Those 600mhz fsb 775 results never cease to amaze me btw. I have some d9 and two 775 chips, I only lack a pot, dice and a good clocking board. Either a cheap ddr2 board or one of the p5q3 ones to pair it with my bbse kit


----------



## alancsalt

Try Single Stage Phase. (775 was good with FSB) I got 620MHz with DDR2 at 1240MHz, but if you had a good DDR3 board like ARandomOWl you could get 680MHz. His score slaughtered me....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Is having my BCLK any higher than 100 bad for my PCIe GPU? Like even if its just 103? I'm just trying to figure out why ASUS Auto-Tune likes to mess with the BCLK if its a no-no...


Everything ive read about it, its "safe" to use blck upto about 103,
im running 101 blck all the time, without any problem, wanted 102 blck,
because the jump with 102 blck is almost 100mhz, but was a no go with higher oc's
SSD's seem to be sensitive to blck oc's, even more then HDD's,
not the chance you gonna kill it, but data curruption etc..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Place i bought it said no refunds, it was special order, so i guess im stuck with it unless i can prove it is defective, as it stands right now, ill be lucky to hit 4.5 WITH a delid. Im kinda choked. Can i buy the Intel Performance plan AFTER purchasing chip? Then i could blow it up and get a new one lol....... oh, btw 1.80 manual vcore seems stable at stock speeds.


you can buy intel plan upto 1 year after purchase


----------



## Arm3nian

A month ago I couldnt get my ram to boot at 1866mhz when it was rated for 2133 11-11-11-30-2t. Now I boot at 2133 10-11-11-30-1T, I can go higher I havent even tried, can even go 1.65 on the voltage. Workstation motherboards never cease to suprise lol. It seems really reliable once you get it functioning, like if it seems stable it most likely is. But I would still recommend a non ws mobo for oc to the level we are however.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> 5000 Woooooh!


i hope youre not talking about Volts here ...LOL

gratz


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Everything ive read about it, its "safe" to use blck upto about 103,
> im running 101 blck all the time, without any problem, wanted 102 blck,
> because the jump with 102 blck is almost 100mhz, but was a no go with higher oc's
> SSD's seem to be sensitive to blck oc's, even more then HDD's,
> not the chance you gonna kill it, but data curruption etc..


I did a search on it... *These quotes are for mobos with unlinked PCIe and BCLK.*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CL3P20*
> 
> some CPU's are different and need more PCI-E clock to stabilize high bclk... Personally I have not had to exceed 108mhz to push over 240bclk.. but you may need to.
> **Max is in the upwards of 130mhz-150mhz PCI-E.. you'll likely corrupt your HDD pushing too much past 118-120mhz.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've corrupted the OS on an ssd with 112 pci-e before, but have also run 115 on an identical drive with no problems. Never had trouble with any HDDs.
> I only OC the pci-e for short periods, to get bclk over 220 or get a higher benchmark score. I have forgotten to lower it & left it up for a couple weeks though.


The impression I get is 112 for SSD, 115 for SATA and PCIe Express GPUs and maybe a little more if running a PCI GPU and PATA. A very small gain (1 to5 %) in graphics benchmarks may be found running above stock. Running an X58 chipset, raising slightly may help stabilise BCLK > 220MHz.

Thanks Ivan for stimulating the grey matter..


----------



## VonDutch

Guess its the same as ocing cpu,
i had to reinstall windows 4-5 times while learning to oc...lol
running more then 1.6V vcore through it etc..
idm for benching, i think the same can be said about blck oc's,
no problem for benching, but no go for 24/7 ?

im willing to give it a go, who's with me? ... Kyra? ...lol

so, back down to stock, then up blck till it crashes,
what do i need to up to make it stable again?

Quoting Sin's guide

On Ivy Bridge overclocking is done through the CPU Multiplier on a "K" series SKU like the 3770K and 3570K and the multiplier is multiplied by the base clock. *When you overclock the base clock you are overclocking the DMI and PCI-E busses as well, so you might damage or corrupt the devices hooked up to these busses such as your HDDs/SSDs and GPUs on the PCI-E bus.*

However with Ivy Bridge you shouldn't be i*ncreasing the Base Clock for Air/H2O overclocking as BCLK OC takes a toll on everything on the PCI-E bus including your GPUs and your SSD/HDDs,* so it is pretty much reserved for benching with colder temperatures.
end quote

eeerrr..








i better wait for -20C?..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> A month ago I couldnt get my ram to boot at 1866mhz when it was rated for 2133 11-11-11-30-2t. Now I boot at 2133 10-11-11-30-1T, I can go higher I havent even tried, can even go 1.65 on the voltage. Workstation motherboards never cease to suprise lol. It seems really reliable once you get it functioning, like if it seems stable it most likely is. But I would still recommend a non ws mobo for oc to the level we are however.


That's why I recommend mine. I love it and the stability with it is amazing. No matter what anyone says about it.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Guess its the same as ocing cpu,
> i had to reinstall windows 4-5 times while learning to oc...lol
> running more then 1.6V vcore through it etc..
> idm for benching, i think the same can be said about blck oc's,
> no problem for benching, but no go for 24/7 ?
> im willing to give it a go, who's with me? ... Kyra? ...lol
> so, back down to stock, then up blck till it crashes,
> what do i need to up to make it stable again?
> Quoting Sin's guide
> On Ivy Bridge overclocking is done through the CPU Multiplier on a "K" series SKU like the 3770K and 3570K and the multiplier is multiplied by the base clock. *When you overclock the base clock you are overclocking the DMI and PCI-E busses as well, so you might damage or corrupt the devices hooked up to these busses such as your HDDs/SSDs and GPUs on the PCI-E bus.*
> However with Ivy Bridge you shouldn't be i*ncreasing the Base Clock for Air/H2O overclocking as BCLK OC takes a toll on everything on the PCI-E bus including your GPUs and your SSD/HDDs,* so it is pretty much reserved for benching with colder temperatures.
> end quote
> eeerrr..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i better wait for -20C?..lol


Yeah, he should know. He has the 116MHz BCLK Klub Ivy record! I wouldn't want any of you guys to take any risks now would I?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Yeah, he should know. He has the 116MHz BCLK Klub Ivy record! I wouldn't want any of you guys to take any risks now would I?


116?? omg..

back to stock, upped blck to 105,

will up it with 1 at a time, and see where it stops..still need to know what else to change when it crashes

blck 107

upped ram voltage a bit, from 1.5 to 1.55V, dont think its needed tho ..lol

blck 109 crashed, blck 108 was hard to get,

even made it 107.981 in windows, but was set to 108 in bios..

guess that 3570K with 110 blck is very good then ..lol,
will try get 109 tho..
yea, 109 blck i cant get, did some fiddling around with settings , but no go,
wont even get to bootlogo.. need more input..more input ...lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Everything ive read about it, its "safe" to use blck upto about 103,
> im running 101 blck all the time, without any problem, wanted 102 blck,
> because the jump with 102 blck is almost 100mhz, but was a no go with higher oc's
> SSD's seem to be sensitive to blck oc's, even more then HDD's,
> not the chance you gonna kill it, but data curruption etc..


Yeah that's what I was thinking, maybe 101-103 is okay.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you can buy intel plan upto 1 year after purchase


What is this Intel protection plan? What does it offer and how do you get it? And do they let people that delid buy plans?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah that's what I was thinking, maybe 101-103 is okay.
> What is this Intel protection plan? What does it offer and how do you get it? And do they let people that delid buy plans?


yep, like i said, 101-102 is what i wanted to run ,
neopunx is one i know of running 103 blck without any problems so far,
but i havent seen him in a while around here ...hmmmm....LOL

Performance Tuning Protection Plan by Intel®
The Performance Tuning Protection Plan being offered by Intel is a chance for you to experiment with the overclocking features of your processor without the worries of what will happen if you push the processor too far. *The Plan allows you a single processor replacement, hassle-free, from our customer support.* This is in addition to your standard 3 year warranty. In other words, if it fails under normal usage, we will replace it under the standard warranty; *if it fails while running outside of Intel's specifications, we will replace it under the Performance Tuning Protection Plan.*

So what we are saying is this: Go ahead and push it, we've got your back.

http://click.intel.com/tuningplan/

about the delidded cpu's, nope..but i wouldnt go over there and say,
"Hello, i have a delidded chip, can i have 1 Tuning Protection Plan please"


----------



## alancsalt

Xtreme would have frozen it...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Xtreme would have frozen it...


now youre telling me ...LOL
guess im Xtreme without the freeze part ..lol
o well, now i know how far i can push mine with blck.. 108 blck isnt to bad,
for 109 blck or higher i need to know more about finetuning i think, lack of experience on my part..


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> now youre telling me ...LOL
> guess im Xtreme without the freeze part ..lol
> o well, now i know how far i can push mine with blck.. 108 blck isnt to bad,
> for 109 blck or higher i need to know more about finetuning i think, lack of experience on my part..


That is without touching the multi at all ?

And how much did you tinker with voltage ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Try Single Stage Phase. (775 was good with FSB) I got 620MHz with DDR2 at 1240MHz, but if you had a good DDR3 board like ARandomOWl you could get 680MHz. His score slaughtered me....


You tempt me...but no one makes those locally that I know of, pots yeah, and pretty cheap at 100usd for a copper pot.
Now that you bring that up, I forgot but to use more than 218mhz fsb on an m4a78 board and an athlon x2 regor I had to up pci-e freq over 100mhz! I had gone as far as 250mhz on the stock cooler but it wasn't completely stable with 125mhz pci-e and sata hdd's (onboard gpu though) also those asus bioses and some am3 7025 by gigabyte had a 'robust pci-e booster' that gave pci-e a 1% boost or so xD
Guess it's worth a shot, I'll ask around to see if I can get someone to build me an ss.

@VonDutch: change ram dividers and timings, loosen them up!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> That is without touching the multi at all ?
> And how much did you tinker with voltage ?


i went back to stock, reset to default settings and went from there
even tried 100mhz lower, but didnt make much difference,
lowered ram to 1333mhz instead of 1600..1.55V instead of 1.5V
upped vcore to 1.2V when i started to try the 109 blck..
the 105-107 was all done by not touching anything, only blck..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> @VonDutch: change ram dividers and timings, loosen them up!


did lower the mhz from 1600 to 1333, and timings to 10-10-10-25, instead of 9-9-9-24,
even tried 1066mhz..lol im not so good with timings etc. as you know


----------



## Gomi

This place is a friggin gold-mine, think I learned more in here over 3 days than the months I spent on forums, reading guides and what-not.

Still need to dig into memory and how it works. Sin advised for a VERY loose timing aswell, so might have to dig up just how loose a VERY loose timing is, lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i went back to stock, reset to default settings and went from there
> even tried 100mhz lower, but didnt make much difference,
> lowered ram to 1333mhz instead of 1600..1.55V instead of 1.5V
> upped vcore to 1.2V when i started to try the 109 blck..
> the 105-107 was all done by not touching anything, only blck..


Will give it a go - Might aswell use this wonderful day for something new and fun









As I understand it, the reason (one of a few) for pulling the multi on CPU and Memory down is to let the BCLK do the work ?

(Just read about a benchmark where people found out that it LOVES BCLK alot more than Multiplier, go figure ...).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> This place is a friggin gold-mine, think I learned more in here over 3 days than the months I spent on forums, reading guides and what-not.
> Still need to dig into memory and how it works. Sin advised for a VERY loose timing aswell, so might have to dig up just how loose a VERY loose timing is, lol.
> Will give it a go - Might aswell use this wonderful day for something new and fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As I understand it, the reason (one of a few) for pulling the multi on CPU and Memory down is to let the BCLK do the work ?
> (Just read about a benchmark where people found out that it LOVES BCLK alot more than Multiplier, go figure ...).


talk about alot of numbers to play with..lol

for me its still hard to understand ram ocing, first ,second and third timings ..pfft
"the 3rd timings are what provide that increased efficiency here, and they are changed to 8, but at stock they are 3."

its what sin says in his guide, blck ocing is for ln2 etc..
wonder how he got to the 116 blck..
yea, with higher oc's i cant use blck, or hardly,
4.6ghz and 101 blck, (daily oc)
4.7ghz 100.50-101blck
4.8ghz ..no go...


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> now youre telling me ...LOL
> guess im Xtreme without the freeze part ..lol
> o well, now i know how far i can push mine with blck.. 108 blck isnt to bad,
> for 109 blck or higher i need to know more about finetuning i think, lack of experience on my part..


So where's your validation for the BCLK Klub?

Ivan, the 775 Nvidia boards had linked PCIe? Not the Intel boards then though.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Are there any known good batch numbers of 3770K's I can look for? Thinking about taking my chip back to MC and exchanging it since it looks like a bad clocker. The more batch numbers I have to search for the better as they only have 10 in stock.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> So where's your validation for the BCLK Klub?
> Ivan, the 775 Nvidia boards had linked PCIe? Not the Intel boards then though.


haha, forgot to validate, was so busy with the process itself ..lol
will do a rerun when i know more, might even get the 109 blck to work
with a little help from my friends around here


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Are there any known good batch numbers of 3770K's I can look for? Thinking about taking my chip back to MC and exchanging it since it looks like a bad clocker. The more batch numbers I have to search for the better as they only have 10 in stock.


mine isnt a very good one,
Batch#: 3217B554 (Costa Rica)
4.8ghz 1.420V vcore prime stable is my max,
4.9ghz 1.510V vcore

even with the "good" batches, its stilll a lottery tho








how bad is yours?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> mine isnt a very good one,
> Batch#: 3217B554 (Costa Rica)
> 4.8ghz 1.420V vcore prime stable is my max,
> 4.9ghz 1.510V vcore
> even with the "good" batches, its stilll a lottery tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how bad is yours?


I haven't been able to get 4.6Ghz stable at 1.33vcore. Temps reach high 80's so I didn't want to go much higher before delidding. So it doesn't make any sense to try to get a certain batch that seems to OC well?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I haven't been able to get 4.6Ghz stable at 1.33vcore. Temps reach high 80's so I didn't want to go much higher before delidding. So it doesn't make any sense to try to get a certain batch that seems to OC well?


So keep it @ 4,5ghz for now and after delidding push that sucker up.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> So keep it @ 4,5ghz for now and after delidding push that sucker up.


Yea I guess that's my only option. 4.9-5.0 is probably out of the question but I guess if I could get to 4.8 I'd be happy.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I haven't been able to get 4.6Ghz stable at 1.33vcore. Temps reach high 80's so I didn't want to go much higher before delidding. So it doesn't make any sense to try to get a certain batch that seems to OC well?


im not sure, but i think feniks and sonda know of batches that are better then others,
but the same batches had lesser performing cpu's too..
theres not 1 batch thats good all the way..
im on offset, but my 4646mhz needs 1.310V vcore to be stable,
looking at yours, i dont think it can get worse if you trade it for another anyways ..lol
i would try while you still can trade it for another..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im not sure, but i think feniks and sonda know of batches that are better then others,
> but the same batches had lesser performing cpu's too..
> theres not 1 batch thats good all the way..
> im on offset, but my 4646mhz needs 1.310V vcore to be stable,
> looking at yours, i dont think it can get worse if you trade it for another anyways ..lol
> i would try while you still can trade it for another..


So you think I just just do a blind trade and ignore batch #'s?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> So you think I just just do a blind trade and ignore batch #'s?


wait till the others are here again, who know about the better batches,
but like i said, you prolly get a better one then you have now anyways


----------



## Leyaena

I've always thought that the batch number thing was mostly a gambling superstition.
I've heard of plenty of people who got a good chip from what was said to be a bad batch, and vice versa.

In the end, it's why they call it the silicon _lottery,_ there's no guarantees.
Wether you've won or you've lost, you won't know for sure until you plug it in and fire it up


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not much, biggest temp difference is when using pro/ultra on the die,
> maybe a few degrees..not sure how CM X1 Extreme Fusion compares to other tim's..
> yea, temps are very nice, Vcore also


Great I will let it be. Leave well alone as they say. Every time I put clumsy hands into the case I risk breaking something. The CM X1 Extreme Fusion beat MX 4 and Nano Diamond 7 . It has a rating of 9.5 vs 8.5 MX 4 vs N7 8.3.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've always thought that the batch number thing was mostly a gambling superstition.
> I've heard of plenty of people who got a good chip from what was said to be a bad batch, and vice versa.
> In the end, it's why they call it the silicon _lottery,_ there's no guarantees.
> Wether you've won or you've lost, you won't know for sure until you plug it in and fire it up


there "seem" to be better batches out there,
but your right..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I guess at this point I'm just trying to determine if my odds of getting a chip better than what I have now (unable to get 4.6 stable at 1.33vcore) are good if I exchange it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Great I will let it be. Leave well alone as they say. Every time I put clumsy hands into the case I risk breaking something. The CM X1 Extreme Fusion beat MX 4 and Nano Diamond 7 . It has a rating of 9.5 vs 8.5 MX 4 vs N7 8.3.


yea, never change a winning team , right








like i said, your temps, vcore and oc are looking very nice to me









edit,
youre the second one i see today who oced their 7970 to 1250mhz,
are they that easy to oc that high?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Yeah, he should know. He has the 116MHz BCLK Klub Ivy record! I wouldn't want any of you guys to take any risks now would I?


Im sure Franky ( RIP ) would have been up to the job.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, never change a winning team , right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like i said, your temps, vcore and oc are looking very nice to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit,
> youre the second one i see today who oced their 7970 to 1250mhz,
> are they that easy to oc that high?


They seem to be . I have had 6 so far 3 did 1300/1800 stable ( benched at 1325/1825) . Sold them here in SA to fund my 3770.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've always thought that the batch number thing was mostly a gambling superstition.
> I've heard of plenty of people who got a good chip from what was said to be a bad batch, and vice versa.
> In the end, it's why they call it the silicon _lottery,_ there's no guarantees.
> Wether you've won or you've lost, you won't know for sure until you plug it in and fire it up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> there "seem" to be better batches out there,
> but your right..
Click to expand...

Then again, maybe I'm just bitter because my 3570k is unimpressive at best, while my batch is said to be one of the best ones


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Place i bought it said no refunds, it was special order, so i guess im stuck with it unless i can prove it is defective, as it stands right now, ill be lucky to hit 4.5 WITH a delid. Im kinda choked. Can i buy the Intel Performance plan AFTER purchasing chip? Then i could blow it up and get a new one lol....... oh, btw 1.80 manual vcore seems stable at stock speeds.


you can always exchange it under whatever reason (e.g. performance below average) for another one and hope for a better batch, that's buyer's right. special order does sound like no refunds, exchange only.

you can purchase Intel Performance Protection Tuning Plan whenever you want (even before buying the chip, it's tied to model only, not to serial number), but keep in mind it takes 30 days to kick in. you can return a working chip under it, they don't care since you paid for it and there is pretty much no questions asked.


----------



## feniks

3218B, some report 5.0GHz @ 1.20V (not sure if fully stable though)
3224B I had 2 chips like that, both could do 5.0GHz @ 1.46V
3233
and a few others I forgot







google it, there was a few threads about it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Are there any known good batch numbers of 3770K's I can look for? Thinking about taking my chip back to MC and exchanging it since it looks like a bad clocker. The more batch numbers I have to search for the better as they only have 10 in stock.


----------



## chronicfx

Changed my TIM again and went with CLP on the die and CLU on the IHS and my temps dropped another 3 degrees at 4.5.. But dropped 12 degrees at 4.9







Anyways I have acceptable temps for me to run at 4.9. Now my question..

Has anyone figured out how to get sleep (not hibernate) to work with pll overvoltage enabled? My computer wakes up but the screen gets no signal and I have to do a hard reset. Sleep works fine at lower clocks.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 3218B, some report 5.0GHz @ 1.20V (not sure if fully stable though)
> 3224B I had 2 chips like that, both could do 5.0GHz @ 1.46V
> 3233
> and a few others I forgot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> google it, there was a few threads about it.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Are there any known good batch numbers of 3770K's I can look for? Thinking about taking my chip back to MC and exchanging it since it looks like a bad clocker. The more batch numbers I have to search for the better as they only have 10 in stock.
Click to expand...

See, that's what I mean...
My chip is a 3218B, 3218B726 specifically, according to pretty much all the rumours it should be one of the best batches.
Instead, it's not very impressive at all, needing a VCore of 1.328 to get a mild 4.5 GHz overclock stable, and hitting high 90's on IBT before delidding...
Also, going any higher than 4.8 I seem to hit a wall, it just doesn't boot regardless of voltage.


----------



## feniks

yeah, batches don't guarantee anything, they just raise your chances of getting a good chip, it's always a luck of a draw however ...
batch 3224B seems quite successful for many though and it's sold by Microcenter at $229 ...

I remember someone with latest batch 3233 reporting some awesome voltages as well!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> See, that's what I mean...
> My chip is a 3218B, 3218B726 specifically, according to pretty much all the rumours it should be one of the best batches.
> Instead, it's not very impressive at all, needing a VCore of 1.328 to get a mild 4.5 GHz overclock stable, and hitting high 90's on IBT before delidding...
> Also, going any higher than 4.8 I seem to hit a wall, it just doesn't boot regardless of voltage.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Yea I don't expect any guarantees if I get what others are reporting as a good batch. However I do kind of view it like having tickets in the raffle drawing.


----------



## iEATu

Where can you get the cooler master extreme fusion x1? Does it spread well? I need new TIM because my GELID GC-extreme ran out. Pretty good stuff and it would be nice to try something new if it spreads easily.


----------



## Hokies83

IMO does not get much more easy then Cool labs liquid ultra.

heh Enjoying my new Speakers.. 39$ for 2 pair Black Friday








One on the right are what was replaced..


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> See, that's what I mean...
> My chip is a 3218B, 3218B726 specifically, according to pretty much all the rumours it should be one of the best batches.
> Instead, it's not very impressive at all, needing a VCore of 1.328 to get a mild 4.5 GHz overclock stable, and hitting high 90's on IBT before delidding...
> Also, going any higher than 4.8 I seem to hit a wall, it just doesn't boot regardless of voltage.


Before delidding my 3570k was extremely hot and required higher than normal voltage from what I seen of other 3570k chips. After delidding my temps dropped a little over 30C and my chip began to over clock like a golden 3570k up to about 5GHZ.

Delidding and lowering temps can have a significant change in performance. My 3770k on the other hand came from the factory running some what cool compared to other 3770ks that I had seen. After delidding temps came down and performance went up. Resistance is the enemy of electrical conduction in any circuit and it manifests itself in heat. Lower heat and resistance goes down and electrical conduction improves.

To get a good idea of how good of a cpu you have try a low over clock like 4.5GHZ and see how low of voltage you can get it stable at. 1.2v and below without delidding for 4.5GHZ is usually a decent chip and when you delid the performance increases.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> To get a good idea of how good of a cpu you have try a low over clock like 4.5GHZ and see how low of voltage you can get it stable at. 1.2v and below without delidding for 4.5GHZ is usually a decent chip and when you delid the performance increases.


Yep, I'd definitely agree to that, the VCore I needed to get 4.5 stable decreased slightly after delidding.
Even after delidding, though, my chip still takes 1.328 to get stable, so definitely NOT what you'd like to see in a 3218B batch chip








All I was trying to say was that my chip is a good example of how getting one of the 'good' batches does not guarantee a good chip per se.
Regardless, though, from what I heard it's highly likely he'll get a better chip if he decides to trade it in, seeing as his current one seems to be a bit 'meh'.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Mine is 3224b micro center xd and can't do too much with it 4.6 @ 1.36v. Don't complain tho maybe next time xd.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Mine is 3224b micro center xd and can't do too much with it 4.6 @ 1.36v. Don't complain tho maybe next time xd.


That's about where I'm at. I'll check my batch when I get home though.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I guess that's my only option. 4.9-5.0 is probably out of the question but I guess if I could get to 4.8 I'd be happy.


I can get 4.8ghz but need 1.490v to be stable.







But temps are so nice.. 72c max.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Great I will let it be. Leave well alone as they say. Every time I put clumsy hands into the case I risk breaking something. The CM X1 Extreme Fusion beat MX 4 and Nano Diamond 7 . It has a rating of 9.5 vs 8.5 MX 4 vs N7 8.3.


Well. i did use LP on the HSF too...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Yep, I'd definitely agree to that, the VCore I needed to get 4.5 stable decreased slightly after delidding.
> Even after delidding, though, my chip still takes 1.328 to get stable, so definitely NOT what you'd like to see in a 3218B batch chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All I was trying to say was that my chip is a good example of how getting one of the 'good' batches does not guarantee a good chip per se.
> Regardless, though, from what I heard it's highly likely he'll get a better chip if he decides to trade it in, seeing as his current one seems to be a bit 'meh'.


Batch 3218B957 here 5 GHz @ 1.445 volts


----------



## Leyaena

Pretty good, that's about what I needed to get 4.8 stable.
Mind you, I couldn't get over 4.5 at all before delidding!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Pretty good, that's about what I needed to get 4.8 stable.
> Mind you, I couldn't get over 4.5 at all before delidding!


300mhz is a pretty decent jump.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Mine is a Batch 3227C. Haven't heard anything about them. Gonna try and exchange it and try my luck.


----------



## ripsaw

well a little more messing around (sick day today, cant slam up drywall, but can use keyboard







) I've got to here with stock settings and -.085 offset..looking a little better.


EDIT: Should i go even lower on vcore offset? Its going as low as .960 on idle.....

BTW, thankyou to everyone who has been responding to me...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Are there any known good batch numbers of 3770K's I can look for? Thinking about taking my chip back to MC and exchanging it since it looks like a bad clocker. The more batch numbers I have to search for the better as they only have 10 in stock.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Batch 3218B957 here 5 GHz @ 1.445 volts


There can be good & bad chips within batches. The 3218B957 right there is considerably better than my 3218B958, I can't get 5Ghz at 1.54V on it & it needs more than any of my other 3770k for 4.5Ghz.

There is a bit about batch results here: http://hwbot.org/forum/showthread.php?t=45387


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Somebody tried mounting a Corsair H100 (bare die) [NO IHS in another words] without going custom wc??

Was reading on here http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595
and bought me a H100 and some Liquid Ultra right away...


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Before delidding my 3570k was extremely hot and required higher than normal voltage from what I seen of other 3570k chips. After delidding my temps dropped a little over 30C and my chip began to over clock like a golden 3570k up to about 5GHZ.
> Delidding and lowering temps can have a significant change in performance. My 3770k on the other hand came from the factory running some what cool compared to other 3770ks that I had seen. After delidding temps came down and performance went up. Resistance is the enemy of electrical conduction in any circuit and it manifests itself in heat. Lower heat and resistance goes down and electrical conduction improves.
> To get a good idea of how good of a cpu you have try a low over clock like 4.5GHZ and see how low of voltage you can get it stable at. 1.2v and below without delidding for 4.5GHZ is usually a decent chip and when you delid the performance increases.


You actually just reminded me of a test that I had been curious about for a while. I would love if someone with extreme cooling could find out if using the same voltage at the same clocks under normal cooling and then extreme cooling would change power consumption. I figured that if extreme cooling lowers the resistance by any significant amount, which it should, that should mean more current at the same voltage and thus more power consumption!


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Now that you guys mention that... Looking at the h100 bare die mount... i found this pictures





Source: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855

The author also talks about that the tim is not the culprit of the excessive heat.. It is the gap between ihs and die..

Source: http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570


----------



## holgate

well guys looks like hit a wall, i though i would post this here first cause i learned a lot more here than any where else. i cant for the life of me get this thing to 4.7 stable, i stopped with 4.7 @ 1.45 and that still wasnt stable. seriously jealous of u guys being able to hit 4.5 with low vcore. i was reading a lot about the batch numbers thing so heres mine - 3224b151 costa rica, thinkin about sellin it and getting another one, AHHHH HELP ME


----------



## chas1723

Anyone have any experience with batch 3229a on a 3770k? Just got it and plan on running it stock for a few days. After that I think I will try to run bare die with my h100i and see what she can do.

Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> well guys looks like hit a wall, i though i would post this here first cause i learned a lot more here than any where else. i cant for the life of me get this thing to 4.7 stable, i stopped with 4.7 @ 1.45 and that still wasnt stable. seriously jealous of u guys being able to hit 4.5 with low vcore. i was reading a lot about the batch numbers thing so heres mine - 3224b151 costa rica, thinkin about sellin it and getting another one, AHHHH HELP ME


Try lower voltages like 1.35, 1.25, I can stable 4.7 at 1.26 but not 1.35 or anything higher lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

My chip is batch #3223B444, 1.37v for 4.7ghz 18hs prime stable and 24/7 folder...before delidding. Haven't testted yet, but I'll have the mobo next week


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Well I exchanged my 3770K today at MC for a different batch. All the others they had were batch 3230B370. So I just picked one up and am hoping for the best at this point. Testing 4.5 right now at 1.195 fixed vcore. Temps seem to be an issue as I've hit a high of 78 even at 1.195 which seems awfully high for such a low voltage. I think I'm going to be forced to delid this thing if I even want to test much further.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Well I exchanged my 3770K today at MC for a different batch. All the others they had were batch 3230B370. So I just picked one up and am hoping for the best at this point. Testing 4.5 right now at 1.195 fixed vcore. Temps seem to be an issue as I've hit a high of 78 even at 1.195 which seems awfully high for such a low voltage. I think I'm going to be forced to delid this thing if I even want to test much further.


Remember 95c is your wall.

Also it seems the older batches run hotter but clock higher and the newer batches run cooler but clock lower.

4.5ghz at 1.19v is what mine does and mine should be the Very first batch as i ordered it on release day.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Remember 95c is your wall.
> Also it seems the older batches run hotter but clock higher and the newer batches run cooler but clock lower.
> 4.5ghz at 1.19v is what mine does and mine should be the Very first batch as i ordered it on release day.


Yea I think I'm going to try to get this thing stable clocked as high as I can keeping temps under 95 before I delid to use as my reference. I'll just go from there. Since I won't be folding but mostly gaming and video rendering I'm not SUPER concerned with temps for daily use. Is 24hrs of prime stable the standard even if I won't be folding or is something like 12 hours sufficient?


----------



## Valgaur

There are actually 3-4 batches before release date. The L batch or malaysias like mine have 4 before release date and the Costa Ricas have 3 before release date. This is because manufactuerers got the plans from the heads at intel before others. They made early batches not just to stock up on them but to test them for around a month before hand before releasing them.

What I believe is happening is that the older batches are being dug into from supplies which yield lower temps mine was a week 22 batch and I had really good temps before delid I could get 4.9 easily and fold but temps were in the 90s.

These earlier batches or test batches as I call them have less glue under the IHS making better contact and I believe intel made a change with the glue amount of possible testing from manufacturers stating that after a lot of tim change the IHS became a bit movable to the point they could take them off. That's why these later batches have really good IMCs but don't clock as well. The manufacterers samples actually do clock higher and almost all of the test batches do this as well. I think they all used a good batch of silicon, or possibly controlled the manufacturing process a bit more in order to make sure everything was done correctly. Which is why we see a lot more glue and tim on these newer batches.


----------



## Valgaur

Grrrrrrr


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I think I'm going to try to get this thing stable clocked as high as I can keeping temps under 95 before I delid to use as my reference. I'll just go from there. Since I won't be folding but mostly gaming and video rendering I'm not SUPER concerned with temps for daily use. Is 24hrs of prime stable the standard even if I won't be folding or is something like 12 hours sufficient?


I run it 5-8hrs but rendering a Video should be enough to see if your stable lol.


----------



## feniks

mine is 3224B134
it does 4.7GHz Cinebench stable with 1.21V as set in BIOS (1.208 under load). chip is delidded though, so it could have been a tad higher with stock TIM.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> well guys looks like hit a wall, i though i would post this here first cause i learned a lot more here than any where else. i cant for the life of me get this thing to 4.7 stable, i stopped with 4.7 @ 1.45 and that still wasnt stable. seriously jealous of u guys being able to hit 4.5 with low vcore. i was reading a lot about the batch numbers thing so heres mine - 3224b151 costa rica, thinkin about sellin it and getting another one, AHHHH HELP ME


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> My chip is batch #3223B444, 1.37v for 4.7ghz 18hs prime stable and 24/7 folder...before delidding. Haven't testted yet, but I'll have the mobo next week


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Well I exchanged my 3770K today at MC for a different batch. All the others they had were batch 3230B370. So I just picked one up and am hoping for the best at this point. Testing 4.5 right now at 1.195 fixed vcore. Temps seem to be an issue as I've hit a high of 78 even at 1.195 which seems awfully high for such a low voltage. I think I'm going to be forced to delid this thing if I even want to test much further.


that is looking good! screw the temps, you will delid it anyways, right? vcore matters, if you could get 4.6-4.7GHz with 1.20V then it's good. the best test is to try booting (unstable) 5GHz with as low vcore as possible, up to 1.35V bootable 5GHz are all good chips, above it (remember, it's bootable, but NOT stable) are the weak ones.


----------



## holgate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> There are actually 3-4 batches before release date. The L batch or malaysias like mine have 4 before release date and the Costa Ricas have 3 before release date. This is because manufactuerers got the plans from the heads at intel before others. They made early batches not just to stock up on them but to test them for around a month before hand before releasing them.
> What I believe is happening is that the older batches are being dug into from supplies which yield lower temps mine was a week 22 batch and I had really good temps before delid I could get 4.9 easily and fold but temps were in the 90s.
> These earlier batches or test batches as I call them have less glue under the IHS making better contact and I believe intel made a change with the glue amount of possible testing from manufacturers stating that after a lot of tim change the IHS became a bit movable to the point they could take them off. That's why these later batches have really good IMCs but don't clock as well. The manufacterers samples actually do clock higher and almost all of the test batches do this as well. I think they all used a good batch of silicon, or possibly controlled the manufacturing process a bit more in order to make sure everything was done correctly. Which is why we see a lot more glue and tim on these newer batches.


interesting
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> My chip is batch #3223B444, 1.37v for 4.7ghz 18hs prime stable and 24/7 folder...before delidding. Haven't testted yet, but I'll have the mobo next week


ive delidded mine a couple months ago, so i assumed i would have better luck overclocking
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Try lower voltages like 1.35, 1.25, I can stable 4.7 at 1.26 but not 1.35 or anything higher lol.


i cant even boot into windows on 4.5 @ 1.3v


----------



## barretp

New to the club.

OCN name: barretp
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: coollab liquid pro
ihs-TIM: gelid gc-extreme (came with waterblock)
Mhz gained: unknown
OC after delid: 4.5 Ghz
Temp drops: unknown
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2612469


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> that is looking good! screw the temps, you will delid it anyways, right? vcore matters, if you could get 4.6-4.7GHz with 1.20V then it's good. the best test is to try booting (unstable) 5GHz with as low vcore as possible, up to 1.35V bootable 5GHz are all good chips, above it (remember, it's bootable, but NOT stable) are the weak ones.


I can boot Windows as low as 1.25vcore (read through CPU-Z and ASRock utility) so maybe that's a good omen?







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I can boot Windows as low as 1.25vcore (read through CPU-Z and ASRock utility) so maybe that's a good omen?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Boot in with 1.25v 5ghz?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Boot in with 1.25v 5ghz?


Yup. It's not stable obviously but it boots and I can log into Windows. Testing 4.8 at 1.246 (under load) with Prime as we speak, so far so good but temps reaching 89C. Can't wait to delid this baby.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I can boot Windows as low as 1.25vcore (read through CPU-Z and ASRock utility) so maybe that's a good omen?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Boot in with 1.25v 5ghz?


That is a good sign, sounds like a very nice chip!

3230B370 batch? I might have to go get more retail, my best chip right now can boot 5Ghz 1.25V but it has a cold boot bug... Still want more for ln2.
It will be sad to see a possible golden one delidded...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is a good sign, sounds like a very nice chip!
> 3230B370 batch? I might have to go get more retail, my best chip right now can boot 5Ghz 1.25V but it has a cold boot bug... Still want more for ln2.
> It will be sad to see a possible golden one delidded...


No clue if this is a good batch or just a good chip (if it even is it's obviously still early) but the MicroCenter near me had a lot of them (at least 20) in stock of the same exact batch. I'd be willing to pick one up for anyone willing to make it worth my while.


----------



## snelan

Guys keep in mind that batch does not matter as much as it seams. The wafers in the center of the platter tend to have less imperfections than the ones on the edge. Say I had a theoretical batch 100 CPU that did 5GHz @ 1.2VCore. That does not, in any way mean that another CPU from batch 100 will do the same. It may do 5.0GHz @ 1.6VCore if it was on the edge of the batch, and the other CPU was in the center. You can't just go by batch like most people like to do.

EDIT: If anyone wants to trade me their golden chip for mine, 4.6 @ 1.3V, 4.7 @ 1.36V, I have no objections! *cough* FTW *cough*


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Guys keep in mind that batch does not matter as much as it seams. The wafers in the center of the platter tend to have less imperfections than the ones on the edge. Say I had a theoretical batch 100 CPU that did 5GHz @ 1.2VCore. That does not, in any way mean that another CPU from batch 100 will do the same. It may do 5.0GHz @ 1.6VCore if it was on the edge of the batch, and the other CPU was in the center. You can't just go by batch like most people like to do.


Point well taken.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd buy an SS if I got one of those sub 1.4v 5ghz chips...I bet it can do 5.5ghz at 1.4v on cold.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I can boot Windows as low as 1.25vcore (read through CPU-Z and ASRock utility) so maybe that's a good omen?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


that sounds awesome, I smell a winner here


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yup. It's not stable obviously but it boots and I can log into Windows. Testing 4.8 at 1.246 (under load) with Prime as we speak, so far so good but temps reaching 89C. Can't wait to delid this baby.


I bet u can get it stable at 1.35 = 1.45v try it


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> that sounds awesome, I smell a winner here


Looks promising so far. Definitely happy I did the trade in.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I bet u can get it stable at 1.35 = 1.45v try it


Prime has been running for just over an hour at 4.8 with 1.245vcore under load and max temps are 89C. I want to get this thing stable and then delid before I start pushing higher because my temps will certainly surpass 95C if I go for 5.0Ghz stability without delidding.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Looks promising so far. Definitely happy I did the trade in.
> Prime has been running for just over an hour at 4.8 with 1.245vcore under load and max temps are 89C. I want to get this thing stable and then delid before I start pushing higher because my temps will certainly surpass 95C if I go for 5.0Ghz stability without delidding.


lol put case next to a window put fan in window then open window and side of case..

Bam! you have 5ghz Prime95 running


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> lol put case next to a window put fan in window then open window and side of case..
> Bam! you have 5ghz Prime95 running


Haha believe me I would if I could right now because boy am I anxious to give 5.0Ghz a try. Just not feasable at this moment. I do plan on delidding tomorrow though as I have the day off so I should be up and running and testing 5.0Ghz+ by tomorrow evening







.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> lol put case next to a window put fan in window then open window and side of case..
> Bam! you have 5ghz Prime95 running
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha believe me I would if I could right now because boy am I anxious to give 5.0Ghz a try. Just not feasable at this moment. I do plan on delidding tomorrow though as I have the day off so I should be up and running and testing 5.0Ghz+ by tomorrow evening
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

Great to see that you got a great chip *PuffinMyLye*. We look forward to hearing about what it can do with it as you figure that out, but it sure sounds like a good one. Glad you went back to get it.


----------



## Arm3nian

Here is my rig, obviously I am not done with all the cosmetics, including all front panels and cable management, but it is all hardware finished. And yes, that is a 12inch gpu dwarfed lol, the case is gigantic, it has an entire BACK side of it that just has the psu in it, can fit 4 more 480 60+mm rads in there plus more.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great to see that you got a great chip *PuffinMyLye*. We look forward to hearing about what it can do with it as you figure that out, but it sure sounds like a good one. Glad you went back to get it.


Thanks *PCWargamer*. I look forward to testing this chip's limits after delidding. This is also a fantastic thread full of great posters, very happy I found it. Stay tuned folks







.


----------



## barretp

Yalls chips must be insane. I couldn't get mine stable at 4.7 with 1.3 vcore. I'm new to ivy bridge, so I'm still learning what the best settings are.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *barretp*
> 
> Yalls chips must be insane. I couldn't get mine stable at 4.7 with 1.3 vcore. I'm new to ivy bridge, so I'm still learning what the best settings are.


You'd still need a fairly good chip to be able to get anything like that though. Mine does 4.9 at 1.512v!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Guys keep in mind that batch does not matter as much as it seams. The wafers in the center of the platter tend to have less imperfections than the ones on the edge. Say I had a theoretical batch 100 CPU that did 5GHz @ 1.2VCore. That does not, in any way mean that another CPU from batch 100 will do the same. It may do 5.0GHz @ 1.6VCore if it was on the edge of the batch, and the other CPU was in the center. You can't just go by batch like most people like to do.
> EDIT: If anyone wants to trade me their golden chip for mine, 4.6 @ 1.3V, 4.7 @ 1.36V, I have no objections! *cough* FTW *cough*


I have a good one, a couple half decent & one that sounds similar to yours. 4.5Ghz, 1.27V.

I know batches are no guarantee, but hoping to find another good chip in a proven batch is easier than random. Did have bad luck last time with the 3218B batch, so this time may get lucky...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd buy an SS if I got one of those sub 1.4v 5ghz chips...I bet it can do 5.5ghz at 1.4v on cold.


I'm gonna try my good one on the mvg with some ln2 tonight, have to test out some software overclocking to try to beat the coldbug.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

2+ hrs of Prime. Thinking this bad boy is stable but gonna let it run through the night. I think I have my reference point set now to compare my post-delidding results to.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good luck FtW, not like you really need it xD
I got like 2 bbse sets, and 1 psc kit, a delidded 3770k and my mvg is at customs...should get iit next week.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 2+ hrs of Prime. Thinking this bad boy is stable but gonna let it run through the night. I think I have my reference point set now to compare my post-delidding results to.


Good CPU. I would do 12 hours if you intend to up it more or 24 if you want that clock. 2 hours is really nothing. I got mine for 2 hours and i thought it was stable and games would crash.


----------



## lilchronic

i can boot 5 ghz @ 1.35 but cant seem to get it stable even at 1.45v . i run [email protected] 1.25 24/7 temps never go over 85c in prime

ran this for 12 hours but re installed my windows and lost the screen shot.


----------



## ivanlabrie

1.25v for 4.8ghz is GREAT! I bet that chip would do great cold, or delidded with LP on die...


----------



## lilchronic

http://valid.canardpc.com/2612731


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 1.25v for 4.8ghz is GREAT! I bet that chip would do great cold, or delidded with LP on die...


the thing is i cant get 5 ghz no matter what i do maybe i should just delid this sob and see if that will help


----------



## Valgaur

Pc im gonna need you to full fill your vice captain duties. I need you to keep a list of new entries. Since frankys down so am I. Im on a cell phone for the remainder of the time. Or atleast until I get home lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Pc im gonna need you to full fill your vice captain duties. I need you to keep a list of new entries. Since frankys down so am I. Im on a cell phone for the remainder of the time. Or atleast until I get home lol.


Ha! You know how I felt these last few months...xD
I'm using my gf's phenom 2 x4 955 at stock with mixed ic ripjaws 1600mhz cl9 ram at stock YUK!
But a pc is a pc, and an android phone is a PITA.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha believe me I would if I could right now because boy am I anxious to give 5.0Ghz a try. Just not feasable at this moment. I do plan on delidding tomorrow though as I have the day off so I should be up and running and testing 5.0Ghz+ by tomorrow evening
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


im glad it all worked out for you Puffin









on a sidenote,
im happy too, i gave my "old" amd computer to my kiddo, when i decided to build my first ever intel computer
but it has a gigabyte FX mobo and a 1100T, i build it for the FX chips that came out back then,
but the FX8150 wasnt a good upgrade compared to the 1100T,
the FX8350 is, i bought my 1100T for 165 euro back then, guess what...i just sold it for 140 euro! haha..
money is in the bank already








so i only need 40-45 euro to pay for the new FX8350, my kiddo is gonna be sooo happy when he hears this today ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im glad it all worked out for you Puffin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> on a sidenote,
> im happy too, i gave my "old" amd computer to my kiddo, when i decided to build my first ever intel computer
> but it has a gigabyte FX mobo and a 1100T, i build it for the FX chips that came out back then,
> but the FX8150 wasnt a good upgrade compared to the 1100T,
> the FX8350 is, i bought my 1100T for 165 euro back then, guess what...i just sold it for 140 euro! haha..
> money is in the bank already
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so i only need 40-45 euro to pay for the new FX8350, my kiddo is gonna be sooo happy when he hears this today ..lol


Kind of a side grade. 1100t Cores are faster per clock. but the FX chips OC higher and has the 2 extra cores.


----------



## VonDutch

o, how to determine if a chip is good, or if you should delid it or not,
without batch numbers etc, they suck anyways to know if a chip is good or not..(lottery)

what Sonda said yesterday is a very good way, i copied it to a textdoc,

"To get a good idea of how good of a cpu you have try a low over clock like 4.5GHZ
and see how low of voltage you can get it stable at. 1.2v and below without delidding for 4.5GHZ
is usually a decent chip and when you delid the performance increases."

thanks sonda,
i will use this to help others to determine if their chip is good or not,
thing is, almost every ivy can run 4.5ghz, before delid, tempwise that is








if 4.5ghz is under 1.2V vcore, its a good chip..
if you need more then 1.2, lets say 1.230-1.240 and above, its avarage..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Kind of a side grade. 1180t Cores are faster per clock. but the FX chips OC higher and has the 2 extra cores.


yea, i wouldnt upgrade to any amd now for a new build, except if you already have a FX mobo..
othwerwise, go intel ...my kid wants to OC, im learning them everything i know,
the 1100T isnt a very good one to oc, at least not the one i have, 4.2-4.3ghz
the FX8350 is better that way from what ive read about it


----------



## ivanlabrie

4.3ghz on a 1100t is actually very good! Close to the limit on air...


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the thing is i cant get 5 ghz no matter what i do maybe i should just delid this sob and see if that will help


Have you tried increasing the IMC voltage. On my 3570k I had to boost VCSSA to 1.15v to get it stable at 4.9 where at 4.7 it was fine with 1.1v.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 4.3ghz on a 1100t is actually very good! Close to the limit on air...


yea, if i remember right, i had it upto 4.2ghz, then i stopped,
can you imagine my face when i first fired up my 3770K,
and saw the temps it reached...lol..
1100T had a Tjmax of i think 65-67C ..lol,
really had to get used to intel with 105C Tjmax, never had one before,
but boy, am i glad i did buy one..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Have you tried increasing the IMC voltage. On my 3570k I had to boost VCSSA to 1.15v to get it stable at 4.9 where at 4.7 it was fine with 1.1v.


i dont have imc voltage unless its vtt on my board

but i will try doin that tommorow night if thats right and i ll also put the vccsa 1,107


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i dont have imc voltage unless its vtt on my board
> but i will try doin that tommorow night if thats right and i ll also put the vccsa 1,107


I believe it may be VTT on some boards. My board (ITX) doesn't have the option at all so all I could change was VCCSA, but it seemed to work for me! I believe that is the part to do directly with memory and VTT (Sometimes called IMC oddly enough) is the whole IO section but I'm not sure.


----------



## chris-br

PuffinMyLye, congrats on the new chip.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I believe it may be VTT on some boards. My board (ITX) doesn't have the option at all so all I could change was VCCSA, but it seemed to work for me! I believe that is the part to do directly with memory and VTT (Sometimes called IMC oddly enough) is the whole IO section but I'm not sure.


i think that might have been the trick
i taised the vccsa to 1.107v and vtt to 1.19


this is what i got so far temps really high but its raining out so i cant open my window to let the cold in and its guna be colder tommorow night so ill test some more then

as of now its time to sleep


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Have you tried increasing the IMC voltage. On my 3570k I had to boost VCSSA to 1.15v to get it stable at 4.9 where at 4.7 it was fine with 1.1v.


Well. now you got me thinking, i can boot 4.8ghz with lower vcore than what i need to be stable, alot lower, So that may help me get stable at that lower vcore?

Edit. Never touched the vtt or imc voltage


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Well. now you got me thinking, i can boot 4.8ghz with lower vcore than what i need to be stable, alot lower, So that may help me get stable at that lower vcore?
> Edit. Never touched the vtt or imc voltage


Yeah, this is the first time I have seen that behavior on a chip. Ivy is quite unusual, I think, that at higher core clocks the IMC etc. can require a considerable amount more voltage to stay stable.


----------



## VonDutch

i was reading this on a Dutch site this morning..
http://tweakers.net/nieuws/86066/namen-en-specificaties-intel-haswell-processors-gepubliceerd.html

"The possible details on Intel's next generation processors for desktop are published on the internet.
A Chinese website published the probable names and specifications of the new Core processors, codenamed Haswell"


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i was reading this on a Dutch site this morning..
> http://tweakers.net/nieuws/86066/namen-en-specificaties-intel-haswell-processors-gepubliceerd.html
> 
> "The possible details on Intel's next generation processors for desktop are published on the internet.
> A Chinese website published the probable names and specifications of the new Core processors, codenamed Haswell"


Yep, there's been a newspost on it for a little while now, I'll edit back with a link once I find it









Here it is:
[Guru3D] Intel Haswell Core i7 and Core i5 specs leak onto the web


----------



## VonDutch

and here i thought i had some news..o well..lol

edit,
hey Leyaena, you got a flame too!








25 Rep


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Yeah, this is the first time I have seen that behavior on a chip. Ivy is quite unusual, I think, that at higher core clocks the IMC etc. can require a considerable amount more voltage to stay stable.


I had to increase imc/vccsa to stabilize my 4.7ghz oc at 1.37v. Before doing that I couldn't get it to be stable and had to keep adding vcore way higher than what it could boot at (which was 1.33v)
I just leave vtt/vccio at 1.15v and imc/vccsa at 1.10v and call it day...Helps with ram overclocking which is always fun








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i was reading this on a Dutch site this morning..
> http://tweakers.net/nieuws/86066/namen-en-specificaties-intel-haswell-processors-gepubliceerd.html
> "The possible details on Intel's next generation processors for desktop are published on the internet.
> A Chinese website published the probable names and specifications of the new Core processors, codenamed Haswell"


Yep...notice the 84w tdp. (cause of that hd4600 igp most likely)
I want one lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Good CPU. I would do 12 hours if you intend to up it more or 24 if you want that clock. 2 hours is really nothing. I got mine for 2 hours and i thought it was stable and games would crash.


You were right, it crashed just before 3 hours. I upped the vcore a bit and have been running Prime now for 6 hours at 4.8 with a 1.255vcore. If it makes it to 12 hours I will call it stable and then delid.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im glad it all worked out for you Puffin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> on a sidenote,
> im happy too, i gave my "old" amd computer to my kiddo, when i decided to build my first ever intel computer
> but it has a gigabyte FX mobo and a 1100T, i build it for the FX chips that came out back then,
> but the FX8150 wasnt a good upgrade compared to the 1100T,
> the FX8350 is, i bought my 1100T for 165 euro back then, guess what...i just sold it for 140 euro! haha..
> money is in the bank already
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so i only need 40-45 euro to pay for the new FX8350, my kiddo is gonna be sooo happy when he hears this today ..lol


Thanks Dutch and congrats on the sale







.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> PuffinMyLye, congrats on the new chip.


Thanks chris. Delidding will hopefully be commencing this afternoon







.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> You were right, it crashed just before 3 hours. I upped the vcore a bit and have been running Prime now for 6 hours at 4.8 with a 1.255vcore. If it makes it to 12 hours I will call it stable and then delid.
> Thanks Dutch and congrats on the sale
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


looks promising








if it crashes after 3 H prime, you prolly need 0.010vcore more instead of 0.005,
12H is good, 18H prime runs everything, 24H is superstable, never have to look back again,
thats what i did with my 4.8ghz oc, 24H prime, hence the "The Ivy SUPER STABLE Club" in my sig









if it runs 12H, just up it 1 notch or 2, should be no problem with your vcore anyways ..lol
thats what i did with my daily oc..

yea man, the 1100T, bought it for 165, after using it for a long time, selling for 140 ...wow,
not a bad deal at all right..


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> and here i thought i had some news..o well..lol
> 
> edit,
> hey Leyaena, you got a flame too!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 25 Rep


Sorry about that








It looks pretty interesting though, if those are the real numbers









And yep, I am the _*flame master*_!
MUAHAHAHAHA


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks promising
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it crashes after 3 H prime, you prolly need 0.010vcore more instead of 0.005,
> 12H is good, 18H prime runs everything, 24H is superstable, never have to look back again,
> thats what i did with my 4.8ghz oc, 24H prime, hence the "The Ivy SUPER STABLE Club" in my sig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it runs 12H, just up it 1 notch or 2, should be no problem with your vcore anyways ..lol
> thats what i did with my daily oc..
> yea man, the 1100T, bought it for 165, after using it for a long time, selling for 140 ...wow,
> not a bad deal at all right..


yeah IMO 24 hours is the least amount time for an overclock. All of mine are stressed that long.


----------



## Leyaena

Yep, I ran 26 hours of prime on my overclock just to be sure.
After that, I figured that if it hadn't crashed then, it probably wouldn't afterwards either


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, I think I'm gonna build a ghetto dice pot and grab a 775 board to freeze some stuff...I'll try to delid whatever 775 chips I can and give them a shot cold.









Killing time before the MVG gets here lol

On the stability thing, I'd test whatever I will use the system with aswell, folding, gaming, see if it crashes, cause prime only tests heavy cpu loads, which are not the same as light loads for the cpu.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> On the stability thing, I'd test whatever I will use the system with aswell, folding, gaming, see if it crashes, cause prime only tests heavy cpu loads, which are not the same as light loads for the cpu.


yea, i was talking about that with my kid,
he was like, there should be a proggie like prime, that also does different loads, or combine the 2 somehow








bf3 is good to test with( 35-45% load for me), even my bios is a test, it loads 20-30% in some pages..
dispite if you run prime 24H, ive heard a few times, it crashed later on with game, or just browsing etc..
but its a very very small chance if you ask me..
lets say after 24H prime the OC is 99.999% stable forever..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, I think I'm gonna build a ghetto dice pot and grab a 775 board to freeze some stuff...I'll try to delid whatever 775 chips I can and give them a shot cold.


very nice ivan







or should i say, "Super Cool"....lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

xD Not exactly super cool, but rather 'really cold winter day at your place' cool...right?








I'm looking for cheapass components to freeze lol, the boredom.

I have a week and a half left of my vacation period, so I might as well get some boints in the meantime, huh? I have no money so I'm staying at home


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> he was like, there should be a proggie like prime, that also does different loads, or combine the 2 somehow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bf3 is good to test with( 35-45% load for me), even my bios is a test, it loads 20-30% in some pages..
> dispite if you run prime 24H, ive heard a few times, it crashed later on with game, or just browsing etc..
> but its a very very small chance if you ask me..


Indeed, that would be great. If only it were so simple. Those kind of crashes are only a problem with offset though, because of voltage changes. At least in my experience. People running with fixed voltage need not worry!


----------



## alancsalt

I remember when OCing the E8500 on an X48-DQ6 and a bunch of guys had a mad thread going (bit like this one) where they were enthusiastically trying to get a stable 533 FSB on the EP45-UD3P. Well one of them got his to pass 36 hours of Prime 95 only to have it crash next day at idle (No Cstates or Speedstepping enabled), and the response was that "*idling is the new stress testing!*" Crackup.

I used to run Prime for ages too, pass without failing, and then have games like GTA4 crash the OC. Don't have quite as much faith in stress testing as I used to.


----------



## ivanlabrie

hehe...same here. I just stress with whatever I'll be using, and rely on lower clocks for things like folding. (saves power too, no need to run 24hs of high volt oc's to test that much)
I normally reduce prime95 test duration when running blend to something like 5 min, makes the whole test last 6 hours. Good enough for me...
I then play some games, or leave it folding at a known lower oc. I don't test stability besides benchmarks for high overclocks at all.









Hey Alan, I'm gonna build a crappy dice pot with some plastic pipe/duct tape wrapped around a stock 775 cooler...any thoughts?
Figured it might make for a decent NB pot, not sure it can cool a cpu properly, though I've seen some guy hit -40c load on a dual core 775 chip. (spi32m and vantage, but maybe his temp readings were off...)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Indeed, that would be great. If only it were so simple. Those kind of crashes are only a problem with offset though, because of voltage changes. At least in my experience. People running with fixed voltage need not worry!


if offset is done right, there should be no problem with oc's,
i always use offset, never had a problem, maybe needs some more
fine tuning then fixed vcore, but thats about it
with my 4.8ghz oc i used 0.160V offset, i thought that was to much tho,
but anything i use(d) between 0.020 and 0.050V offset ..no problem at all..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I remember when OCing the E8500 on an X48-DQ6 and a bunch of guys had a mad thread going (bit like this one) where they were enthusiastically trying to get a stable 533 FSB on the EP45-UD3P. Well one of them got his to pass 36 hours of Prime 95 only to have it crash next day at idle (No Cstates or Speedstepping enabled), and the response was that "*idling is the new stress testing!*" Crackup.
> I used to run Prime for ages too, pass without failing, and then have games like GTA4 crash the OC. Don't have quite as much faith in stress testing as I used to.


lol









yea, best is to do a bit off all, play games, run ibt, prime and cinebench, even idle a while ..lol
maybe a idea for some programer to create a program that can run different load,
and do some stresstesting like prime









but still, 24H prime is a very stable oc,
and upping vcore a 1 notch or 2 after that, if possible, makes it even better


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if offset is done right, there should be no problem with oc's,
> i always use offset, never had a problem, maybe needs some more
> fine tuning then fixed vcore, but thats about it
> with my 4.8ghz oc i used 0.160V offset, i thought that was to much tho,
> but anything i use(d) between 0.020 and 0.050V offset ..no problem at all..
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea, best is to do a bit off all, play games, run ibt, prime and cinebench, even idle a while ..lol
> maybe a idea for some programer to create a program that can run different load,
> and do some stresstesting like prime
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but still, 24H prime is a very stable oc,
> and upping vcore a 1 notch or 2 after that, if possible, makes it even better


i agree, I run IBT like crazy then prime on blend for 24hrs and game then I call it a "good" overclock.


----------



## snelan

What are you're thoughts on just using Cinebench for stability testing? Some 12h stable Prime OC's have failed in seconds in Cinebench for me.

Also, is 1.36VCore for 4.7GHz a little high? I'm thinking I need to adjust something else, considering it only takes 1.315VCore for 4.6GHz.

I have tried:

47Multi @ 1.36VCore
1.2V CPU VTT
1.6V CPU PLL

No other voltage changes, aside from the LLC adjustments/etc.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks promising
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it crashes after 3 H prime, you prolly need 0.010vcore more instead of 0.005,
> 12H is good, 18H prime runs everything, 24H is superstable, never have to look back again,
> thats what i did with my 4.8ghz oc, 24H prime, hence the "The Ivy SUPER STABLE Club" in my sig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it runs 12H, just up it 1 notch or 2, should be no problem with your vcore anyways ..lol
> thats what i did with my daily oc..
> yea man, the 1100T, bought it for 165, after using it for a long time, selling for 140 ...wow,
> not a bad deal at all right..


I did up it 0.010vcore. I was originally testing it at 1.245 and it crashed after 3 hours. It's currently been running just about 10 hours at 1.255 with no issues so far. Actually it's more like 1.258 as that's what my mobo utility is reading it at and CPUZ jumps between 1.256 and 1.264.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> What are you're thoughts on just using Cinebench for stability testing? Some 12h stable Prime OC's have failed in seconds in Cinebench for me.
> Also, is 1.36VCore for 4.7GHz a little high? I'm thinking I need to adjust something else, considering it only takes 1.315VCore for 4.6GHz.
> I have tried:
> 47Multi @ 1.36VCore
> 1.2V CPU VTT
> 1.6V CPU PLL
> No other voltage changes, aside from the LLC adjustments/etc.


Thats what i need for 46x


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> What are you're thoughts on just using Cinebench for stability testing? Some 12h stable Prime OC's have failed in seconds in Cinebench for me.


i use Cinebench as first test, if it runs, and i dont have whea errors, very important to look for when using cinebench
i let IBT run 20x, if thats ok, i go to extended testing with prime,(custom, max ram etc)

but after what we talked about last pages, i dont do the 24H prime runs anymore ..lol,
18H, or like ivanlabrie does, shorter time, 10 or 5 min, instead of default 15 min,
it does shave of hours, and i dont think the results will be less then with 15min, not sure tho..
meanwhile browsing, start/close some proggies, play a game..of course









its in the combination of "tests" that makes a good and stable oc








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I did up it 0.010vcore. I was originally testing it at 1.245 and it crashed after 3 hours. It's currently been running just about 10 hours at 1.255 with no issues so far. Actually it's more like 1.258 as that's what my mobo utility is reading it at and CPUZ jumps between 1.256 and 1.264.


looks good








yea, readings can be off sometimes, just a little is ok.. same here,
my 1.305V vcore in bios reads as 1.308V in program..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i use Cinebench as first test, if it runs, and i dont have whea errors, very important to look for when using cinebench
> i let IBT run 20x, if thats ok, i go to extended testing with prime,(custom, max ram etc)
> but after what we talked about last pages, i dont do the 24H prime runs anymore ..lol,
> 18H, or like kgtuning always does, shorter time, 10 or 5 min, instead of default 15 min,
> it does shave of hours, and i dont think the results will be less then with 15min, not sure tho..
> meanwhile browsing, start/close some proggies, play a game..of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its in the combination of "tests" that makes a good and stable oc


lol, mine is probably way overkill.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I did up it 0.010vcore. I was originally testing it at 1.245 and it crashed after 3 hours. It's currently been running just about 10 hours at 1.255 with no issues so far. Actually it's more like 1.258 as that's what my mobo utility is reading it at and CPUZ jumps between 1.256 and 1.264.


If it took 3 hrs to crash ur like 99.9% stable to know u just need a tiny bump.

Now we see u have a great chip this is important...!

You have watched the de lidding videos are are 100% ready for this ?!

Take your time and take breaks if your hand is tired go onto something else not worth rushing it and messing it up..

Everytime u get up from your chair when you come back be4 touching the chip ground yourself everytime.. always wear latex gloves if u have them.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If it took 3 hrs to crash ur like 99.9% stable to know u just need a tiny bump.
> Now we see u have a great chip this is important...!
> You have watched the de lidding videos are are 100% ready for this ?!
> Take your time and take breaks if your hand is tired go onto something else not worth rushing it and messing it up..
> Everytime u get up from your chair when you come back be4 touching the chip ground yourself everytime.. always wear latex gloves if u have them.


I've read the guides but can you link me to these videos you speak of?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I remember when OCing the E8500 on an X48-DQ6 and a bunch of guys had a mad thread going (bit like this one) where they were enthusiastically trying to get a stable 533 FSB on the EP45-UD3P. Well one of them got his to pass 36 hours of Prime 95 only to have it crash next day at idle (No Cstates or Speedstepping enabled), and the response was that "*idling is the new stress testing!*" Crackup.
> I used to run Prime for ages too, pass without failing, and then have games like GTA4 crash the OC. Don't have quite as much faith in stress testing as I used to.


LOL! man ... same feeling here ... at certain clocks (mostly higher ones), offsets can be a light load stress tester







hence why usually stabilizing the OC on offset calls for a little more vcore than with a fixed voltage. not a real problem though ... until I tried stabilizing 5.0GHz on my 3770K to be rock solid for daily running on offsets ... impossible so far after nearly a week of tweaking ...

It's actually my first board supporting offsets. In past I used only EVGA boards and those are fixed vcore only ... I had to settle for 4.9GHz on offset and realy all automatic settings and no problem, once I go to 5.0GHz it starts randomly BSOD'ing (124) on light load, anywhere between 5 minutes or 22 hours from boot up LOL!
My latest impression is that actually it's the BIOS programming responsible for this behavior (lack of offset tweaking after certain multiplier is passed), why? because on older BIOS for my board it takes up to 1.52V offset vcore (some number like +0.340) to be mostly stable at 5GHz while on latest BIOS I can reach the same level at only 1.48V actual vcore under load (offset +0.295 or so). ... Mind that with fixed vcore it takes only 1.46V vcore to be stable at 5GHz on either of BIOSes ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if offset is done right, there should be no problem with oc's,
> i always use offset, never had a problem, maybe needs some more
> fine tuning then fixed vcore, but thats about it
> with my 4.8ghz oc i used 0.160V offset, i thought that was to much tho,
> but anything i use(d) between 0.020 and 0.050V offset ..no problem at all..
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea, best is to do a bit off all, play games, run ibt, prime and cinebench, even idle a while ..lol
> maybe a idea for some programer to create a program that can run different load,
> and do some stresstesting like prime
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but still, 24H prime is a very stable oc,
> and upping vcore a 1 notch or 2 after that, if possible, makes it even better


I thought so too, but it seems to be true for my board only up to 49x multi, above it is like forget it









I stress test the same way, CIne first, then IBT quick runs, then some max mode runs, some prime, gaming, daily using, etc. if no WHEA ever then it's all good








However, I am not a fan of running Prime95 for 24hrs ... got better things to do with my system








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> i agree, I run IBT like crazy then prime on blend for 24hrs and game then I call it a "good" overclock.


try cinebench, it takes only a minute and sometimes proves more stressfull than IBT and Prime95 both together LOL!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> What are you're thoughts on just using Cinebench for stability testing? Some 12h stable Prime OC's have failed in seconds in Cinebench for me.
> Also, is 1.36VCore for 4.7GHz a little high? I'm thinking I need to adjust something else, considering it only takes 1.315VCore for 4.6GHz.
> I have tried:
> 47Multi @ 1.36VCore
> 1.2V CPU VTT
> 1.6V CPU PLL
> No other voltage changes, aside from the LLC adjustments/etc.


Cinebench is my favorite stress tester







, usually when I make something Cine stable (with no WHEA in logs) then I have no trouble with any other stress tester or gaming or anything .. unless we are talking about offsets at 5GHz+ and light load BSOD LOL.


----------



## kgtuning

IDK Hokies, I have had overclocks fail at 18 hr and 23 hr in Prime. but to each their own.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL! man ... same feeling here ... at certain clocks (mostly higher ones), offsets can be a light load stress tester
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hence why usually stabilizing the OC on offset calls for a little more vcore than with a fixed voltage. not a real problem though ... until I tried stabilizing 5.0GHz on my 3770K to be rock solid for daily running on offsets ... impossible so far after nearly a week of tweaking ...
> It's actually my first board supporting offsets. In past I used only EVGA boards and those are fixed vcore only ... I had to settle for 4.9GHz on offset and realy all automatic settings and no problem, once I go to 5.0GHz it starts randomly BSOD'ing (124) on light load, anywhere between 5 minutes or 22 hours from boot up LOL!
> My latest impression is that actually it's the BIOS programming responsible for this behavior (lack of offset tweaking after certain multiplier is passed), why? because on older BIOS for my board it takes up to 1.52V offset vcore (some number like +0.340) to be mostly stable at 5GHz while on latest BIOS I can reach the same level at only 1.48V actual vcore under load (offset +0.295 or so). ... Mind that with fixed vcore it takes only 1.46V vcore to be stable at 5GHz on either of BIOSes ...
> I thought so too, but it seems to be true for my board only up to 49x multi, above it is like forget it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I stress test the same way, CIne first, then IBT quick runs, then some max mode runs, some prime, gaming, daily using, etc. if no WHEA ever then it's all good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> However, I am not a fan of running Prime95 for 24hrs ... got better things to do with my system
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> try cinebench, it takes only a minute and sometimes proves more stressfull than IBT and Prime95 both together LOL!
> Cinebench is my favorite stress tester
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , usually when I make something Cine stable (with no WHEA in logs) then I have no trouble with any other stress tester or gaming or anything .. unless we are talking about offsets at 5GHz+ and light load BSOD LOL.


take a look at the IVY stable thread and check the cinebench spreadsheet...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I've read the guides but can you link me to these videos you speak of?


First page in OP


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> First page in OP


Call me ******ed but I don't see any vids in the OP.

*Edit:* Are you referring to the ones on the Anandtech forums?

Btw here's my 12+ Hrs of Prime confirmation. Hope to delid this evening if I feel ready.


----------



## werds

Thread is too long to read all the posts at this point. I noticed in the first post it was mentioned that the IHS slips around every time unless a new adhesive or glue is used.

Has anyone come up with a best one to use? I Figured just putting it around the edges of the IHS and reinstalling would be a decent idea... but considering I won't be picking up my 3570k until next week I was wondering if someone had tried or could recommend something for it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Call me ******ed but I don't see any vids in the OP.
> *Edit:* Are you referring to the ones on the Anandtech forums?
> Btw here's my 12+ Hrs of Prime confirmation. Hope to delid this evening if I feel ready.


Yeah there is vids in the forum links.


----------



## ripsaw

whats the lowest offset vcore anyone has used? im at -.105 right now @stock and its still stable.....cpu-z reporting max of 1.160


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah there is vids in the forum links.


The only thing I'm a little unsure of is removing the adhesive glue from both the PCB and IHS. I see in one of the guides the guy used a dremel (which I don't have) and in this guide from OCN Swag talked about just using his thumbnail with some IPA. Can others share their experience with this part of the process as it's a little hard to go through 500+ pages.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> The only thing I'm a little unsure of is removing the adhesive glue from both the PCB and IHS. I see in one of the guides the guy used a dremel (which I don't have) and in this guide from OCN Swag talked about just using his thumbnail with some IPA. Can others share their experience with this part of the process as it's a little hard to go through 500+ pages.


Use your nails for the pcb and a tooth pick for the IHS. \also, after delid, check to see if the IHS is concave, if it is, consider on lapping.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Use your nails for the pcb and a tooth pick for the IHS. \also, after delid, check to see if the IHS is concave, if it is, consider on lapping.


Sounds good. Yea I was considering lapping the IHS regardless which is why I picked up a lapping kit with my CLP just in case.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> The only thing I'm a little unsure of is removing the adhesive glue from both the PCB and IHS. I see in one of the guides the guy used a dremel (which I don't have) and in this guide from OCN Swag talked about just using his thumbnail with some IPA. Can others share their experience with this part of the process as it's a little hard to go through 500+ pages.


I started with just using the thumbnail with some IPA - Then moved on to the Dremel and last I used a toothpick to gently remove the few bits from the corners.

This is way overkill though - You should focus on the stuff that is on the "top" of the IHS, around the frame so to speak - The goal is to make the IHS able to "spin" on the die (Dont go nuts, just a gentle push - it should spin freely) - Then you have direct contact









Side-question:

Anyone got a good recommendation on a PSU for Quad SLI GTX 680 ?

Think I been through 100´s of posts now, with no concrete "Get this - Will run it all just fine" - Was eyeing the Corsair AX1200i, but it only comes with 6 x 8 pin, and I would need 8 x 8 pin. So if any of you "G33ks" could give a friendly pointer, it would be greatly appreciated.

Ps. Know I should ask on the PSU section, but that place is so empty and seldom visited


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I started with just using the thumbnail with some IPA - Then moved on to the Dremel and last I used a toothpick to gently remove the few bits from the corners.
> This is way overkill though - You should focus on the stuff that is on the "top" of the IHS, around the frame so to speak - The goal is to make the IHS able to "spin" on the die (Dont go nuts, just a gentle push - it should spin freely) - Then you have direct contact
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Side-question:
> Anyone got a good recommendation on a PSU for Quad SLI GTX 680 ?
> Think I been through 100´s of posts now, with no concrete "Get this - Will run it all just fine" - Was eyeing the Corsair AX1200i, but it only comes with 6 x 8 pin, and I would need 8 x 8 pin. So if any of you "G33ks" could give a friendly pointer, it would be greatly appreciated.
> Ps. Know I should ask on the PSU section, but that place is so empty and seldom visited


Thanks for the tips.

In terms of the PSU, look at the PC Power & Cooling Silencer MKIII Series 1200watt. Comes with 6x6+2 GPU connecters. It's a fantastic unit.

EDIT: Whoops didn't read your post fully to see you need 8x8pin.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I started with just using the thumbnail with some IPA - Then moved on to the Dremel and last I used a toothpick to gently remove the few bits from the corners.
> This is way overkill though - You should focus on the stuff that is on the "top" of the IHS, around the frame so to speak - The goal is to make the IHS able to "spin" on the die (Dont go nuts, just a gentle push - it should spin freely) - Then you have direct contact
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Side-question:
> Anyone got a good recommendation on a PSU for Quad SLI GTX 680 ?
> Think I been through 100´s of posts now, with no concrete "Get this - Will run it all just fine" - Was eyeing the Corsair AX1200i, but it only comes with 6 x 8 pin, and I would need 8 x 8 pin. So if any of you "G33ks" could give a friendly pointer, it would be greatly appreciated.
> Ps. Know I should ask on the PSU section, but that place is so empty and seldom visited


The AX1200i is a great PSU and will power quad 680 SLI, corsair will send you an adapter for the 4th connector, if they're not putting it in the box now.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291057/jonnyguru-reviews-corsair-ax1200i-1200w/50


----------



## Gomi

Thanks for the PSU advice! Knew I could ask in here and get an answer within minutes *Grins*

Guess its back to the hardware dealers and get my fix - I managed to snag the last remaining 4 eVGA GeForce GTX 680 Classified Hydro Copper (4GB) ( I know - bla bla, should have saved money and put a block on them myself - What can I say, getting lazy and apparently managed to get on a first name basis with the UPS guy, telling me its time to stop ordering bits and pieces and just get it done, lol). - Should be here early next week


----------



## ripsaw

If money is no object, you could always get this too







http://ncix.com/products/?sku=77990&vpn=120-PG-1500-XR&manufacture=eVGA


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> If money is no object, you could always get this too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://ncix.com/products/?sku=77990&vpn=120-PG-1500-XR&manufacture=eVGA


That was my very first thought - But after reading the reviews from both JG and Hard, I quickly turned away and went to look for something else.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Thanks for the PSU advice! Knew I could ask in here and get an answer within minutes *Grins*
> Guess its back to the hardware dealers and get my fix - I managed to snag the last remaining 4 eVGA GeForce GTX 680 Classified Hydro Copper (4GB) ( I know - bla bla, should have saved money and put a block on them myself - What can I say, getting lazy and apparently managed to get on a first name basis with the UPS guy, telling me its time to stop ordering bits and pieces and just get it done, lol). - Should be here early next week


yeah. And you lost the opportunity to put some CLP on the cards also. I got 15C drop in temps on my videocard (air cooled).


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> yeah. And you lost the opportunity to put some CLP on the cards also. I got 15C drop in temps on my videocard (air cooled).












These are watercooled though mate, so hardly doubt that I will see any alarming temperatures, CLP or not


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> That was my very first thought - But after reading the reviews from both JG and Hard, I quickly turned away and went to look for something else.


Some people are having software issues with the 1200i so you may want to search on ocn about that. I have a 1200i but it hasn't been installed yet so I don't know if it has an issue .


----------



## Valgaur

Take a look at the evga super nova 1500 watt I know its stupid overkill but its braided and everything. Looks sweet.


----------



## Hokies83

Well ive raised the first 100$ for my 400$ Water clooling budget which will buy this..

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16236/ex-rad-410/Alphacool_NexXxoS_Monsta_Dual_120mm_Radiator_-_80mm_Thick.html?tl=g30c95s160


Now just 300$ more for this....

http://www.swiftech.com/h2o-x20-edge-hd-1.aspx


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These are watercooled though mate, so hardly doubt that I will see any alarming temperatures, CLP or not


From now on, I'll only use CLP. lol ON EVERYTHING> LOL


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Well ive raised the first 100$ for my 400$ Water clooling budget which will buy this..
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16236/ex-rad-410/Alphacool_NexXxoS_Monsta_Dual_120mm_Radiator_-_80mm_Thick.html?tl=g30c95s160
> 
> Now just 300$ more for this....
> http://www.swiftech.com/h2o-x20-edge-hd-1.aspx


GOOD... Now i have a question for ya....... Is that Block/pump thing any good? Is available for me here in brazil. OFCOURSE it cost an eye and a tooth price wise here.


----------



## Gomi

I actually have the Apogee Drive 2 Pump/Block - Its collecting dust though - Might sell it, or give it away, time will tell.

And no, its not bad - Its really good - Just did not fit my build very well, and I needed the power that the 35X2-pump delivers.

EDIT: chris-br --> Thinking about getting the Apogee Drive II ?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> From now on, I'll only use CLP. lol ON EVERYTHING> LOL


Used it between your IHS and heatsink/block as well?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I actually have the Apogee Drive 2 Pump/Block - Its collecting dust though - Might sell it, or give it away, time will tell.
> And no, its not bad - Its really good - Just did not fit my build very well, and I needed the power that the 35X2-pump delivers.
> EDIT: chris-br --> Thinking about getting the Apogee Drive II ?


You have what i listed above the block/pump ?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Used it between your IHS and heatsink/block as well?


Yes.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I actually have the Apogee Drive 2 Pump/Block - Its collecting dust though - Might sell it, or give it away, time will tell.
> And no, its not bad - Its really good - Just did not fit my build very well, and I needed the power that the 35X2-pump delivers.
> EDIT: chris-br --> Thinking about getting the Apogee Drive II ?


I'm really thinking on getting into WC. But is very very expensive here in Brazil.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These are watercooled though mate, so hardly doubt that I will see any alarming temperatures, CLP or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From now on, I'll only use CLP. lol ON EVERYTHING> LOL
Click to expand...

Words to live by!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm really thinking on getting into WC. But is very very expensive here in Brazil.


Just be forewarned, once you go water you don't go back. It's a lifestyle and it's oh so sweet







.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 2+ hrs of Prime. Thinking this bad boy is stable but gonna let it run through the night. I think I have my reference point set now to compare my post-delidding results to.


I always run IBT before running Prime95 because sometimes IBT finds instability quicker than Prime95, it will save you time! When I delidded I use my thumb nail inching forward rather than backwards, hope your delid goes smoothly!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> I always run IBT before running Prime95 because sometimes IBT finds instability quicker than Prime95, it will save you time! When I delidded I use my thumb nail inching forward rather than backwards, hope your delid goes smoothly!


How many runs? I ran IBT for 10 runs before testing with Prime.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just be forewarned, once you go water you don't go back. It's a lifestyle and it's oh so sweet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


So I heard, but i only have a GFX and the CPU, plus, not much space on the case i just got (raven 3), I love the layout.


----------



## Gomi

I got the following collecting dust:

Apogee Drive 2:

http://www.swiftech.com/apogeedrive2.aspx



*Phobya Xtreme 200:*

http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p9272_Phobya-Xtreme-200.html



*Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 240mm:
*
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p12343_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-240mm.html



*Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 120mm:*

http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p12338_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-120mm.html



Got Mayhems fluid, Ice Dragon Cooling Nanofluid Coolant (White) and more fittings and angle adapters than I can even count.

Might do a give-away - Honestly its all just rotting away on a shelf.

Even got this in my drawer:



Asrock Z77E-ITX - Comes with Chipset waterblock and a MIPS iceforce hf for the CPU (And not the RAM, lol).

A quick count tells me about 5 or 6 (most of them unused) reservoirs.

EDIT:

Oh, and a spare Block for the reference GTX 670. This one was actully the first one out of the mill and into a box - Pre-ordered it AGES ago...



And in case anyone was wondering - *MOST* of it came when I cannibalized my old Prodigy build "Fire Ant":

Version 1:


Version 2:


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> So I heard, but i only have a GFX and the CPU, plus, not much space on the case i just got (raven 3), I love the layout.


Yea not sure you could fit more than a 240 rad in that case which wouldn't be sufficient for a CPU + GPU loop. Might suffice for just your CPU though.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I got the following collecting dust:
> Apogee Drive 2:
> http://www.swiftech.com/apogeedrive2.aspx
> 
> *Phobya Xtreme 200:*
> http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p9272_Phobya-Xtreme-200.html
> 
> *Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 240mm:
> *
> http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p12343_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-240mm.html
> 
> *Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 120mm:*
> http://www.aquatuning.de/product_info.php/info/p12338_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-120mm.html
> 
> Got Mayhems fluid, Ice Dragon Cooling Nanofluid Coolant (White) and more fittings and angle adapters than I can even count.
> Might do a give-away - Honestly its all just rotting away on a shelf.
> Even got this in my drawer:
> 
> Asrock Z77E-ITX - Comes with Chipset waterblock and a MIPS iceforce hf for the CPU (And not the RAM, lol).
> A quick count tells me about 5 or 6 (most of them unused) reservoirs.


YGPM

I want that Apogee Drive 2 .. and 6 compression fittings








thats what im looking to do my WC build with in the first place lol.

I been saving for it for a month now.


----------



## chris-br

Just the cpu is fine. I could do 2 120 rad and a 240 rad in the botton. Dunno.

EDIT: yeah, that Apogee drive 2 would be a nice holiday gift. lol It would save me alot of money.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Call me ******ed but I don't see any vids in the OP.
> *Edit:* Are you referring to the ones on the Anandtech forums?
> Btw here's my 12+ Hrs of Prime confirmation. Hope to delid this evening if I feel ready.


take ur time on that delid bro i have every thing i need to do it but havent done it yet im taking my time or i just might be a p*ssy lol. i dont have another 220$ to spend on another chip, got a lot of bills this time of year. next month might be better. cause if i **** it up i can get another no problem.
Anyway this thread is great for learning what u need to get the job done if only i found it before my first attempt to delid, i rushed into it and didnt exactly no the correct way to do it


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Just the cpu is fine. I could do 2 120 rad and a 240 rad in the botton. Dunno.
> EDIT: yeah, that Apogee drive 2 would be a nice holiday gift. lol It would save me alot of money.


I think a 240 and a 120 would be plenty for just your CPU provided you have a good pump. I have just 2 GTX240's cooling my CPU and GPU in the same loop.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> take ur time on that delid bro i have every thing i need to do it but havent done it yet im taking my time or i just might be a p*ssy lol. i dont have another 220$ to spend on another chip, got a lot of bills this time of year. next month might be better. cause if i **** it up i can get another no problem.
> Anyway this thread is great for learning what u need to get the job done if only i found it before my first attempt to delid, i rushed into it and didnt exactly no the correct way to do it


I feel very confident in what NEEDS to be done, now it's just a matter of executing it. Once I actually set everything up to do it trust me I will def. take my time. I don't believe there is much more information though that I need to get the job done. Just time to buckle down







.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I feel very confident in what NEEDS to be done, now it's just a matter of executing it. Once I actually set everything up to do it trust me I will def. take my time. I don't believe there is much more information though that I need to get the job done. Just time to buckle down
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


very true indeed


----------



## Arm3nian

I shoudlve got a bigger case. 7 480 rads might not be future proof.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I shoudlve got a bigger case. 7 480 rads might not be future proof.


1 45mm 480 rad is enough for a cpu and 3 gpus.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> hehe...same here. I just stress with whatever I'll be using, and rely on lower clocks for things like folding. (saves power too, no need to run 24hs of high volt oc's to test that much)
> I normally reduce prime95 test duration when running blend to something like 5 min, makes the whole test last 6 hours. Good enough for me...
> I then play some games, or leave it folding at a known lower oc. I don't test stability besides benchmarks for high overclocks at all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Alan, I'm gonna build a crappy dice pot with some plastic pipe/duct tape wrapped around a stock 775 cooler...any thoughts?
> Figured it might make for a decent NB pot, not sure it can cool a cpu properly, though I've seen some guy hit -40c load on a dual core 775 chip. (spi32m and vantage, but maybe his temp readings were off...)


Haha, well it needs to hold acetone for dice, and some heatsinks might be a bit too deep.....either cut some off or use a shallow one....no friends with a metal lathe? (to do something in aluminium?) Copper best, but expensive. Don't know wher the plastic would get too brittle with sub zero? Guess you'd soon discover the problems....

Quick and dirty.....freeze spray


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1 45mm 480 rad is enough for a cpu and 3 gpus.


It probably is, I havent tested it though, especially with cpus and gpus become more efficient.


----------



## ripsaw

well i got 4.3 stable at 1.230, now 4.4 is going to be over 1.3.....temps'll get too high as well.....but it sips juice at stock....1.16....this sucks










Is there anything on this page i shoulld be changing? It all looks like this...

Last time i owned an intel, it was a 486dx lol!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> well i got 4.3 stable at 1.230, now 4.4 is going to be over 1.3.....temps'll get too high as well.....but it sips juice at stock....1.16....this sucks


Damn, any way to exchange it for another one?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> well i got 4.3 stable at 1.230, now 4.4 is going to be over 1.3.....temps'll get too high as well.....but it sips juice at stock....1.16....this sucks


Well, my chip is pretty mediocre as well, truth be told, but since delidding it I managed to squeeze some extra performance out of it. I could do 4.8 as a 24/7 now without any problem.
Concerning temperatures, that's something you won't soon have to worry about after delidding either









My advice, trade it in if you can.
If you can't, delid that sucker and see how far you can take it!


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Well, my chip is pretty mediocre as well, truth be told, but since delidding it I managed to squeeze some extra performance out of it. I could do 4.8 as a 24/7 now without any problem.
> Concerning temperatures, that's something you won't soon have to worry about after delidding either
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My advice, trade it in if you can.
> If you can't, delid that sucker and see how far you can take it!


Well according to the store i purchased it from, it was special order, so no returns, unless its defective and intel will take it back. Don't think its actually defective, so unless intel will exchange it, my other option is to purchase the performance tuning plan, and delid the replacement.







Any thoughts?


----------



## Hokies83

i <3 GOMI


----------



## holgate

ok still stuck, ive read the ivy bridge overclock guide and i understand the concept behind overclocking on this chip, but is there anything other thing that you guys do other than raising the vcore and lowering the pll?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> i <3 GOMI


Haha someone made a deal







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha someone made a deal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


No not yet =[


But that block/pump ive been planning on buying for months and have been looking for a used one on 6 forums market places for like 2 months now XD

Ive even posted it in this thread afew times..


----------



## sugarhell

Nice thread full of information. I cant resist to try it xd

What is the best method to use my liguid pro? die-ihs-ihs-heatsink or just die and ihs? Should i lap my ihs first or i can just use liquid pro directly on it?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> ok still stuck, ive read the ivy bridge overclock guide and i understand the concept behind overclocking on this chip, but is there anything other thing that you guys do other than raising the vcore and lowering the pll?


Where are you stuck? Ivy isn't like Sandy, it's brought back the tweaking aspect of overclocking. With Ivy you need to tweak all your voltages on the CPU. IMC, VTT, PLL and Internal PLL etc. and having ANY voltage too high can cause it to crash. If you give us more info we would easily be able to provide some more tailored advice.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No not yet =[
> But that block/pump ive been planning on buying for months and have been looking for a used one on 6 forums market places for like 2 months now XD
> Ive even posted it in this thread afew times..


Is it the look you're after or is it a really good performing pump? I've always heard that pump/block combos are less efficient. That's why I've always stuck with the D5 variable.


----------



## ripsaw

4.4 still not prime stable @1.30...temps hit 88 in IBT, but it passes, passes gaming session....am i missing something??


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Where are you stuck? Ivy isn't like Sandy, it's brought back the tweaking aspect of overclocking. *With Ivy you need to tweak all your voltages on the CPU. IMC, VTT, PLL and Internal PLL etc*. and having ANY voltage too high can cause it to crash. If you give us more info we would easily be able to provide some more tailored advice.


Hmm this I did not know. I didn't touch any of that when testing my chip. I guess I'll have to give those a closer look when I'm trying to suck more juice out of my chip after delidding tonight.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Is it the look you're after or is it a really good performing pump? I've always heard that pump/block combos are less efficient. That's why I've always stuck with the D5 variable.


For it's type of system it is the best performing I do not like pump block / res all up in my case i like the very clean look of this.


----------



## ripsaw

now im getting a 000050 bsod- ram? Maybe my ram kit is shot....going to diagnose that now..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> now im getting a 000050 bsod- ram? Maybe my ram kit is shot....going to diagnose that now..


Try other lanes or just re insert them. Mine did this a few times so don't worry.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> now im getting a 000050 bsod- ram? Maybe my ram kit is shot....going to diagnose that now..


Try increasing VCCSA and VTT. I've had all kinds of random BSODs at higher clocks from having those voltages too low.


----------



## FtW 420

Man this thread grows fast, get a few hours of sleep & it takes a while to catch up!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I started with just using the thumbnail with some IPA - Then moved on to the Dremel and last I used a toothpick to gently remove the few bits from the corners.
> This is way overkill though - You should focus on the stuff that is on the "top" of the IHS, around the frame so to speak - The goal is to make the IHS able to "spin" on the die (Dont go nuts, just a gentle push - it should spin freely) - Then you have direct contact
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Side-question:
> Anyone got a good recommendation on a PSU for Quad SLI GTX 680 ?
> Think I been through 100´s of posts now, with no concrete "Get this - Will run it all just fine" - Was eyeing the Corsair AX1200i, but it only comes with 6 x 8 pin, and I would need 8 x 8 pin. So if any of you "G33ks" could give a friendly pointer, it would be greatly appreciated.
> Ps. Know I should ask on the PSU section, but that place is so empty and seldom visited


Do you plan to volt up the 680s? With quad sli, a 1500w psu would not really be overkill. I've pulled just over 1000w from the wall with 2 x 680s & a 3770k at fairly average benching clocks (would have to find the post but think about 5Ghz cpu & gpus had an extra 100mV). 1200w might get the job done, but could be running it right at the max or beyond.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> For it's type of system it is the best performing I do not like pump block / res all up in my case i like the very clean look of this.


Gotcha.

OK. Operation Delid this MoFo is about to commence. I'll check back with you fellas later this evening with some pics.


----------



## holgate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Where are you stuck? Ivy isn't like Sandy, it's brought back the tweaking aspect of overclocking. With Ivy you need to tweak all your voltages on the CPU. IMC, VTT, PLL and Internal PLL etc. and having ANY voltage too high can cause it to crash. If you give us more info we would easily be able to provide some more tailored advice.


well so far all ive done was raise the multi 45 and raise vcore until it became stable, right now its at 4.5 with 1.34 vcore


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Man this thread grows fast, get a few hours of sleep & it takes a while to catch up!
> Do you plan to volt up the 680s? With quad sli, a 1500w psu would not really be overkill. I've pulled just over 1000w from the wall with 2 x 680s & a 3770k at fairly average benching clocks (would have to find the post but think about 5Ghz cpu & gpus had an extra 100mV). 1200w might get the job done, but could be running it right at the max or beyond.


Intresting - Yes, would do the voltmod on them (Might aswell - Been running with voltmod for a few months now and tbh. havent seen any degradation or what-ever people call it these days).

And you are right - Running the PSU at 1100~1200 would just be walking the line - Might aswell have some headroom.

So guess its off to find a 1500W - Modular and with 8 x 8 pins -


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> take a look at the IVY stable thread and check the cinebench spreadsheet...


sorry man, but I can't find it







all I can see is the prime95 spreadhseet LOL, maybe I am old & blind ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> whats the lowest offset vcore anyone has used? im at -.105 right now @stock and its still stable.....cpu-z reporting max of 1.160


mine does stock 3.9GHz turbo at 1.12v at stock intel offsets (0.000) and stock Intel spec LLC.
what's your's at default clock normally at?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> now im getting a 000050 bsod- ram? Maybe my ram kit is shot....going to diagnose that now..


sounds like a bad RAM kit ... or memory controller issue ... try raising VCCSA to 1.10v and VCCIO to 1.15v ... even though you shouldn't have to. is your ram memtest stable at stock CPU clock and XMP profile on memory?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Try increasing VCCSA and VTT. I've had all kinds of random BSODs at higher clocks from having those voltages too low.


weird ... I never had any of those even at 5.2GHz unless I overclock memory and it turns out unstable or vcore is way too low ... is your memory memtest stable over night at XMP?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> sorry man, but I can't find it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all I can see is the prime95 spreadhseet LOL, maybe I am old & blind ...
> mine does stock 3.9GHz turbo at 1.12v at stock intel offsets (0.000) and stock Intel spec LLC.
> what's your's at default clock normally at?
> sounds like a bad RAM kit ... or memory controller issue ... try raising VCCSA to 1.10v and VCCIO to 1.15v ... even though you shouldn't have to. is your ram memtest stable at stock CPU clock and XMP profile on memory?
> weird ... I never had any of those even at 5.2GHz unless I overclock memory and it turns out unstable or vcore is way too low ... is your memory memtest stable over night at XMP?


No big deal, I just going to show you I use cinebench.


----------



## ivanlabrie

@puffin: that pump combo thing hokies wants is an mcp35x, also best pump in the market or close with the vario d5 relatively close.
That thing can drive a big loop with two or even three radiators and water blocks cause it has massive head pressure.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> sorry man, but I can't find it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all I can see is the prime95 spreadhseet LOL, maybe I am old & blind ...
> mine does stock 3.9GHz turbo at 1.12v at stock intel offsets (0.000) and stock Intel spec LLC.
> what's your's at default clock normally at?
> sounds like a bad RAM kit ... or memory controller issue ... try raising VCCSA to 1.10v and VCCIO to 1.15v ... even though you shouldn't have to. is your ram memtest stable at stock CPU clock and XMP profile on memory?
> weird ... I never had any of those even at 5.2GHz unless I overclock memory and it turns out unstable or vcore is way too low ... is your memory memtest stable over night at XMP?


Now im getting this at 4.3 @1.235...it was stable before.....nvidia drivers?
121212-13728-02.dmp 12/12/2012 4:21:02 PM DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL 0x000000d1 00000000`036ab03c 00000000`00000002 00000000`00000000 fffff880`0ff13289 nvlddmkm.sys nvlddmkm.sys+239289 x64 ntoskrnl.exe+7efc0 C:\Windows\Minidump\121212-13728-02.dmp 8 15 7601 303,624


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Now im getting this at 4.3 @1.235...it was stable before.....nvidia drivers?
> 121212-13728-02.dmp 12/12/2012 4:21:02 PM DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL 0x000000d1 00000000`036ab03c 00000000`00000002 00000000`00000000 fffff880`0ff13289 nvlddmkm.sys nvlddmkm.sys+239289 x64 ntoskrnl.exe+7efc0 C:\Windows\Minidump\121212-13728-02.dmp 8 15 7601 303,624


Probably still CPU. CPU can cause anything to crash. It could be IMC. Try increasing the VCCSA and VTT slightly. Normally you wouldn't have to do it at such a low speed, but your chip seems to be fairly poor.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> sorry man, but I can't find it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all I can see is the prime95 spreadhseet LOL, maybe I am old & blind ...
> mine does stock 3.9GHz turbo at 1.12v at stock intel offsets (0.000) and stock Intel spec LLC.
> what's your's at default clock normally at?
> sounds like a bad RAM kit ... or memory controller issue ... try raising VCCSA to 1.10v and VCCIO to 1.15v ... even though you shouldn't have to. is your ram memtest stable at stock CPU clock and XMP profile on memory?
> weird ... I never had any of those even at 5.2GHz unless I overclock memory and it turns out unstable or vcore is way too low ... is your memory memtest stable over night at XMP?
> 
> 
> 
> Now im getting this at 4.3 @1.235...it was stable before.....nvidia drivers?
> 121212-13728-02.dmp 12/12/2012 4:21:02 PM DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL 0x000000d1 00000000`036ab03c 00000000`00000002 00000000`00000000 fffff880`0ff13289 nvlddmkm.sys nvlddmkm.sys+239289 x64 ntoskrnl.exe+7efc0 C:\Windows\Minidump\121212-13728-02.dmp 8 15 7601 303,624
Click to expand...

Looks more of a IMC/RAM issue. Probably should up the voltage on the CPU because IMC is a pain in the...


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> sorry man, but I can't find it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all I can see is the prime95 spreadhseet LOL, maybe I am old & blind ...
> mine does stock 3.9GHz turbo at 1.12v at stock intel offsets (0.000) and stock Intel spec LLC.
> what's your's at default clock normally at?
> sounds like a bad RAM kit ... or memory controller issue ... try raising VCCSA to 1.10v and VCCIO to 1.15v ... even though you shouldn't have to. is your ram memtest stable at stock CPU clock and XMP profile on memory?
> weird ... I never had any of those even at 5.2GHz unless I overclock memory and it turns out unstable or vcore is way too low ... is your memory memtest stable over night at XMP?


Theres my 'SToCK' voltage with it set to manual and auto...sucks.....


Found out it was still dropping frequency/voltage with all sleep states off and turbo off.....is this because of intel speedstep?should i turn that off?
edit: going to run memtest @stock clocks


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> No big deal, I just going to show you I use cinebench.


ah, awright







cinebench is very good


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Delidding of the IHS is complete. Adhesive glue removed from both the PCB and IHS. I can't seem to get the right lighting though to take a damn picture haha. Either the photo is coming out blurry or too dark. Any suggestions for good lighting?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Theres my 'SToCK' voltage with it set to manual and auto...sucks.....
> 
> Found out it was still dropping frequency/voltage with all sleep states off and turbo off.....is this because of intel speedstep?should i turn that off?
> edit: going to run memtest @stock clocks


ouch, that seems high at stock turbo ... but I had chips that did it even at 1.30V .. after they got damaged by my former board LOL.
yes, EIST and C1E are for dropping those. forgot which one is what, but one drops both multi & voltage (controlled by Windows) ... I think it was EIST, while the other drops multiplier at idle ... and that was C1E I think.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ah, awright
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cinebench is very good


Yeah 10.53 @ 5.2 GHz is my best
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Delidding of the IHS is complete. Adhesive glue removed from both the PCB and IHS. I can't seem to get the right lighting though to take a damn picture haha. Either the photo is coming out blurry or too dark. Any suggestions for good lighting?


Did you try the chip out yet to make sure it works still? I used the kitchen lights.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah 10.53 @ 5.2 GHz is my best
> Did you try the chip out yet to make sure it works still? I used the kitchen lights.


I haven't applied the CLP to the die yet. Was gonna take pics but I can't seem to get any decent pics so I guess I'll just apply the CLP and try and fire this baby back up.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ouch, that seems high at stock turbo ... but I had chips that did it even at 1.30V .. after they got damaged by my former board LOL.
> yes, EIST and C1E are for dropping those. forgot which one is what, but one drops both multi & voltage (controlled by Windows) ... I think it was EIST, while the other drops multiplier at idle ... and that was C1E I think.


Could eist be causing the crashes? Does anyone think Intel will exchange this dodgy voltage chip?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I haven't applied the CLP to the die yet. Was gonna take pics but I can't seem to get any decent pics so I guess I'll just apply the CLP and try and fire this baby back up.


Yeah man as soon as I delidded mine I the the IHS back on and fired it back up to make sure it still worked. Lol. But took it out right after to clean the glue and what not.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah man as soon as I delidded mine I the the IHS back on and fired it back up to make sure it still worked. Lol. But took it out right after to clean the glue and what not.


I guess that's probably a good idea. Here's the best photo I could get.


----------



## ripsaw

Passed Memtest86 at stock clocks


----------



## kgtuning

Nice! Good job. Better job cleaning the black glue then I did. Lol


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I guess that's probably a good idea. Here's the best photo I could get.


Ahhhh that looks good! Hopefully I can get one worthy of such treatment lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I found a FANTASTIC tool for getting the glue off the PCB and the IHS and I found it by dumb luck in my apartment. I'll post a pic of it in a little bit.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Intresting - Yes, would do the voltmod on them (Might aswell - Been running with voltmod for a few months now and tbh. havent seen any degradation or what-ever people call it these days).
> And you are right - Running the PSU at 1100~1200 would just be walking the line - Might aswell have some headroom.
> So guess its off to find a 1500W - Modular and with 8 x 8 pins -


Exactly id hate to see you limited with volts and not getting enough performance out of them. When I go quad im getting the evga supernova 1500. Its great and its braided cabling is amazing.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Ahhhh that looks good! Hopefully I can get one worthy of such treatment lol


I was lazy and just cleaned the chunks off I left a tiny aamoung of glue on it actually. But I lapped the bottom of the IHS holding area to compensate and it moves pretty freely.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Just did a quick AS5 apply to the die to fire my rig back up and make sure my CPU wasn't dead haha. All good on that front and after a quick run on IBT looks like temps are down about 8-9C. Hopefully they get go down even more after applying CLP to both the die and IHS. Also going to lap the IHS tonight so I'll check back in late tonight. Gotta get some food in me for now haha.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just did a quick AS5 apply to the die to fire my rig back up and make sure my CPU wasn't dead haha. All good on that front and after a quick run on IBT looks like temps are down about 8-9C. Hopefully they get go down even more after applying CLP to both the die and IHS. Also going to lap the IHS tonight so I'll check back in late tonight. Gotta get some food in me for now haha.


Awesome and congrats! Look forward to seeing the results.


----------



## ripsaw

well heres 15 mins prime, 10run IBT and quick gaming session stable.....thats as far as im going to get on this cooler.

Has anyone ever seen/used this stuff? Its all i got, and theres an h100 on kids computer thats mine









It says "ZP HEATSINK COMPOUNDS" on it and has a rating of 1.22W/m.k.
EDIT: also has label on bag from memory express, says "Elite S Silver Thermal Comp. 0.5g"


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Yeah 10.53 @ 5.2 GHz is my best


yeah, now I remember, I still have to try beating you







... however it seems that my chip would take around 1.67v to be stable at 5.2GHz under Cinebench ... not so eager to try that out anytime soon ... unless I could drop the ambient room temps to like 13C ... kinda hard to do in an apartment without heating control (building central heating in order).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Could eist be causing the crashes? Does anyone think Intel will exchange this dodgy voltage chip?


I doubt it is EIST really causing the crashes at such clock... but by all means try switching to a fixed vcore and disable EIST, C1E and all C states and see if it gets any better (it could).
Intel will replace anything if you buy the Intel Performance Tuning Protection Plan at $25 (kicks in after 30 days from purchase) and request a replacement under that Performance Tuning warranty... however last time I did that I received the worst possible clocker chip ever LOL!









you could be better off buying a n ewone in Microcenter and selling the old one on ebay. Microcenter takes returns for exchange for 30 days if you want some binning


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> well heres 15 mins prime, 10run IBT and quick gaming session stable.....thats as far as im going to get on this cooler.
> 
> Has anyone ever seen/used this stuff? Its all i got, and theres an h100 on kids computer thats mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It says "ZP HEATSINK COMPOUNDS" on it and has a rating of 1.22W/m.k.
> EDIT: also has label on bag from memory express, says "Elite S Silver Thermal Comp. 0.5g"


1.22W/mk is pretty bad, that is like thermal tape. Most TIM is about 8 W/mk or so (I think).
Wouldn't be a bad idea to get some new stuff.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, now I remember, I still have to try beating you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... however it seems that my chip would take around 1.67v to be stable at 5.2GHz under Cinebench ... not so eager to try that out anytime soon ... unless I could drop the ambient room temps to like 13C ... kinda hard to do in an apartment without heating control (building central heating in order).
> I doubt it is EIST really causing the crashes at such clock... but by all means try switching to a fixed vcore and disable EIST, C1E and all C states and see if it gets any better (it could).
> Intel will replace anything if you buy the Intel Performance Tuning Protection Plan at $25 (kicks in after 30 days from purchase) and request a replacement under that Performance Tuning warranty... however last time I did that I received the worst possible clocker chip ever LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you could be better off buying a n ewone in Microcenter and selling the old one on ebay. Microcenter takes returns for exchange for 30 days if you want some binning


Lucky US guys with microcenter, most of the world can't go there easily...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 1.22W/mk is pretty bad, that is like thermal tape. Most TIM is about 8 W/mk or so (I think).
> Wouldn't be a bad idea to get some new stuff.
> Lucky US guys with microcenter, most of the world can't go there easily...


Lol there is a micro center like 5 minutes from me right now at work (Cambridge,mass)


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, now I remember, I still have to try beating you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... however it seems that my chip would take around 1.67v to be stable at 5.2GHz under Cinebench ... not so eager to try that out anytime soon ... unless I could drop the ambient room temps to like 13C ... kinda hard to do in an apartment without heating control (building central heating in order).
> I doubt it is EIST really causing the crashes at such clock... but by all means try switching to a fixed vcore and disable EIST, C1E and all C states and see if it gets any better (it could).
> Intel will replace anything if you buy the Intel Performance Tuning Protection Plan at $25 (kicks in after 30 days from purchase) and request a replacement under that Performance Tuning warranty... however last time I did that I received the worst possible clocker chip ever LOL!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you could be better off buying a n ewone in Microcenter and selling the old one on ebay. Microcenter takes returns for exchange for 30 days if you want some binning


Alas, no microcenter for me, im in canada outside a smaller city (400,000). PTP is probably my best option. It just kinda sucks, I've been saving for 3 months for this processor! Oh well stock clocks are still faster than anything i've ever owned. Wish i had some quality TIM around here, might try that ZP stuff on h100 later...see how it goes....Rubber band mounting of liquid cooler, anyone?


----------



## feniks

I don't know how often you guys like doing trips to USA, but Fry's pricematches Microcenter. There is no Microcenter in Washington state, but surely there is Fry's in Renton, WA, 2.5hrs drive from Vancouver, BC








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 1.22W/mk is pretty bad, that is like thermal tape. Most TIM is about 8 W/mk or so (I think).
> Wouldn't be a bad idea to get some new stuff.
> Lucky US guys with microcenter, most of the world can't go there easily...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Alas, no microcenter for me, im in canada outside a smaller city (400,000). PTP is probably my best option. It just kinda sucks, I've been saving for 3 months for this processor! Oh well stock clocks are still faster than anything i've ever owned. Wish i had some quality TIM around here, might try that ZP stuff on h100 later...see how it goes....Rubber band mounting of liquid cooler, anyone?


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I don't know how often you guys like doing trips to USA, but Fry's pricematches Microcenter. There is no Microcenter in Washington state, but surely there is Fry's in Renton, WA, 2.5hrs drive from Vancouver, BC


Ya that's a 4 1/2 hour drive for me, plus hour forty five ferry ride, plus i have no vehicle right now. We do have NCIX in vancouver though. Thats still a 3-4 hour bus ride + 1:45 ferry trip = return trip of 12-14 hours...maybe after christmas, and if i can sell this thing for decent price.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

This is the tool (the little one) that I used to get the adhesive glue off the PCB and IHS. It was so incredibly easy with this this tool (and a little IPA) I couldn't believe it. Anyone looking to delid that wants to make it really easy on themselves I highly recommend it. Both the large and small one have tons of other uses for around the house as well.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Ya that's a 4 1/2 hour drive for me, plus hour forty five ferry ride, plus i have no vehicle right now. We do have NCIX in vancouver though. Thats still a 3-4 hour bus ride + 1:45 ferry trip = return trip of 12-14 hours...maybe after christmas, and if i can sell this thing for decent price.


You would probably be better off just ordering online, shipping & the couple day wait isn't bad compared to cost of gas + ferry (time too unless there is other stuff to get into Vancouver for).
Only thing online can't do is let you know what batches are there & give you the choice.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You would probably be better off just ordering online, shipping & the couple day wait isn't bad compared to cost of gas + ferry (time too unless there is other stuff to get into Vancouver for).
> Only thing online can't do is let you know what batches are there & give you the choice.


That's why I want to go in store- make sure i don't get the same batch number again







Plus I'm case shopping, and I need to FEEL and SEE my next case









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> This is the tool (the little one) that I used to get the adhesive glue off the PCB and IHS. It was so incredibly easy with this this tool (and a little IPA) I couldn't believe it. Anyone looking to delid that wants to make it really easy on themselves I highly recommend it. Both the large and small one have tons of other uses for around the house as well.


Good to know, i have a small spatula like that - came with a pack of gelid thermal paste which i can't find anymore......








Woohoo! I figured out how to use Multi-quote


----------



## ivanlabrie

Have feniks organize a microcenter group buy and call it a day xD


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Ya that's a 4 1/2 hour drive for me, plus hour forty five ferry ride, plus i have no vehicle right now. We do have NCIX in vancouver though. Thats still a 3-4 hour bus ride + 1:45 ferry trip = return trip of 12-14 hours...maybe after christmas, and if i can sell this thing for decent price.


ouch, that takes quite a while then ... you'd be better off shopping around for quite a few items at same time, whatever gets sold at much lower price than in Canada ... You could rent a van and do some one-time buying & selling business








but seriously, yeah, you'd be probably better off getting it online from NCIX or other online source as long as price is similar (considering the trip expenses).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You would probably be better off just ordering online, shipping & the couple day wait isn't bad compared to cost of gas + ferry (time too unless there is other stuff to get into Vancouver for).
> Only thing online can't do is let you know what batches are there & give you the choice.


yeah, it was just an idea, kinda like in case you were going there for something else or something .. or plan a one-time smuggling venture and make some money later on selling stuff online from such trip







(j/k)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> That's why I want to go in store- make sure i don't get the same batch number again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Plus I'm case shopping, and I need to FEEL and SEE my next case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good to know, i have a small spatula like that - came with a pack of gelid thermal paste which i can't find anymore......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Woohoo! I figured out how to use Multi-quote


true, nothing better than seeing & touching the stuff you really want ... kinda help avoid the potential disappointments related to online ordering LOL!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Have feniks organize a microcenter group buy and call it a day xD


that would be possible only if if Microcenter did not limit their CPU promo sales to 1 item per household only ... of course one could always take 1x 3570K and 1x 3770K .. and bring family and/or friends for shopping too, especially if they had some business to take care of in USA as well


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd go with fake id's, beards and some wigs lmao


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go with fake id's, beards and some wigs lmao


haha LOL! could work if paying in cash, yeah


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go with fake id's, beards and some wigs lmao


across the border? that would really be a hoot with the DHS!


----------



## DirektEffekt

You guys over in the US are lucky! $230 is what I paid for my 3570k, much less a 3770k!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I bet smuggling is against TOS xD
lol

buying online or having someone else buy for you and then q mailing is cheapest.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Geez this CLP is a pain to apply. I applied what I thought was a rice grain amount (may have been more as it came out like a small metal ball) to both the die and IHS. Booted up my machine and saw one of the cores was at 70 under load while the others were in the mid 40's. When I took off my block and the IHS I could see that not only did the CLP not apply evenly but it ran off to the sides and balled up in some places.

What's the best way to go about applying CLP evenly?


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Geez this CLP is a pain to apply. I applied what I thought was a rice grain amount (may have been more as it came out like a small metal ball) to both the die and IHS. Booted up my machine and saw one of the cores was at 70 under load while the others were in the mid 40's. When I took off my block and the IHS I could see that not only did the CLP not apply evenly but it ran off to the sides and balled up in some places.
> What's the best way to go about applying CLP evenly?


I used a q tip and painted it on the die then painted it on the underside of the ihs


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used a q tip and painted it on the die then painted it on the underside of the ihs


That is the correct way.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I used a q tip and painted it on the die then painted it on the underside of the ihs


Yea I just watched 



 video and that's exactly what they are showing. I'm gonna give that a go.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

All I have to say is WOW!!!! I expect temps to go up to maybe 60 based on what my temps usually do with Prime but this same clock and vcore was topping out at 90C before the delid! Best decision I ever made. Can't wait to shoot for 5.0Ghz+







.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Pc im gonna need you to full fill your vice captain duties. I need you to keep a list of new entries. Since frankys down so am I. Im on a cell phone for the remainder of the time. Or atleast until I get home lol.


*Valgaur* - Man, I have been reading forever to say - No Problem!!!









This thread is crazy fast. I was at zero post this morning, and then have to go through 157 post to respond to you!!!









And so much good stuff to read too, so it was not really a pain at all, just takes a lot of time every time a take time to, like, go to work! LOL

I'll keep an eye out for new member submissions untill you can get your system back in order.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> All I have to say is WOW!!!! I expect temps to up to maybe 60 based on what my temps usually do with Prime but this same clock and vcore was topping out at 90C before the delid! Best decision I ever made. Can't wait to shoot for 5.0Ghz+
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


That's exactly how we all felt after we delidded. Best decision we ever made on a computer too! Cool right. I mean literally cool!!!









Congrats to you *PuffinMyLye*! Now get the info together according to the first page OP so that we can get you offically joined up with us!!!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That's exactly how we all felt after we delidded. Best decision we ever made on a computer too! Cool right. I mean literally cool!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats to you *PuffinMyLye*! Now get the info together according to the first page OP so that we can get you offically joined up with us!!!


You guys weren't kidding! I will be testing my max OC over the next few days so I can see how many Mhz I've gained that way I can plug that into the info. I need that before submitting right?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That's exactly how we all felt after we delidded. Best decision we ever made on a computer too! Cool right. I mean literally cool!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats to you *PuffinMyLye*! Now get the info together according to the first page OP so that we can get you offically joined up with us!!!
> 
> 
> 
> You guys weren't kidding! I will be testing my max OC over the next few days so I can see how many Mhz I've gained that way I can plug that into the info. I need that before submitting right?
Click to expand...

That's good to know, but not essential to join. We can always update that later anyway, as many of us have to update our original info later as we keep finding new abilities in our delidded chips over time! Not a bad problem to have.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> You guys weren't kidding! I will be testing my max OC over the next few days so I can see how many Mhz I've gained that way I can plug that into the info. I need that before submitting right?


Id say that is easy a 5.2ghz 1.45 - 1.5v chip.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

*OCN name:* PuffinMyLye
*CPU:* 3770K
*on die-TIM:* CLP
*ihs-TIM:* CLP
*Mhz gained:*
*OC after delid:* 4.8Ghz
*Temp drops*: -28C



Before Delid Temps


After Delid Temps


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> *OCN name:* PuffinMyLye
> *CPU:* 3770K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* CLP
> *Mhz gained:*
> *OC after delid:* 4.8Ghz
> *Temp drops*: 28C


See why i Suggested the 3770k now.. No 2700k on the planet is gonna to touch the chip u have.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> See why i Suggested the 3770k now.. No 2700k on the planet is gonna to touch the chip u have.


I def. owe you mad props Hokies. Not only did you suggest I get the 3770k over the 2700k you also were the one who suggested I trade in my previous dud of a chip for a new one which netted me this bad boy. Big ups dude







.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> *OCN name:* PuffinMyLye
> *CPU:* 3770K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* CLP
> *Mhz gained:*
> *OC after delid:* 4.8Ghz
> *Temp drops*: -28C
> 
> 
> 
> Before Delid Temps
> 
> 
> After Delid Temps


Your Accepted dude!!! Now slap our banner on your sig!!!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Your Accepted dude!!! Now slap our banner on your sig!!!


Done!! And proud to be a member







.


----------



## Valgaur

My lord so many posts. I make a half way across the states drive and comeback to a swamp of updates good lord.

On the Franky update I will be sending him away to his resting place tomorrow or the next day. Just to make sure its epoxy glue right? Obviously black glue as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just did a quick AS5 apply to the die to fire my rig back up and make sure my CPU wasn't dead haha. All good on that front and after a quick run on IBT looks like temps are down about 8-9C. Hopefully they get go down even more after applying CLP to both the die and IHS. Also going to lap the IHS tonight so I'll check back in late tonight. Gotta get some food in me for now haha.


Food sounds very good right now. All I had today was pancakes and coffee. Im so tired from my 9 hour drive. Ugh.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> well heres 15 mins prime, 10run IBT and quick gaming session stable.....thats as far as im going to get on this cooler.
> 
> Has anyone ever seen/used this stuff? Its all i got, and theres an h100 on kids computer thats mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It says "ZP HEATSINK COMPOUNDS" on it and has a rating of 1.22W/m.k.
> EDIT: also has label on bag from memory express, says "Elite S Silver Thermal Comp. 0.5g"


Just burn that stuff. Its horrible.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 1.22W/mk is pretty bad, that is like thermal tape. Most TIM is about 8 W/mk or so (I think).
> Wouldn't be a bad idea to get some new stuff.
> Lucky US guys with microcenter, most of the world can't go there easily...


Yup most TIMs lately are in the 7-11 range in about the 8 to 12 buck range.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Lol there is a micro center like 5 minutes from me right now at work (Cambridge,mass)


I live in Grand forks and a microcenter is all of 5 hours away and the drive defeats the purpose of the deal sadly. Not fair.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Have feniks organize a microcenter group buy and call it a day xD


Hmmmm. Possibry in the summer. Where you live feniks? Wa?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> You guys over in the US are lucky! $230 is what I paid for my 3570k, much less a 3770k!


Yeah if your close enough. Unlike me eh hem.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Geez this CLP is a pain to apply. I applied what I thought was a rice grain amount (may have been more as it came out like a small metal ball) to both the die and IHS. Booted up my machine and saw one of the cores was at 70 under load while the others were in the mid 40's. When I took off my block and the IHS I could see that not only did the CLP not apply evenly but it ran off to the sides and balled up in some places.
> What's the best way to go about applying CLP evenly?


It kind of is yeah. But its all a matter of the q tips I believe. I used the blade I delidded it with which worked beautifully.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> All I have to say is WOW!!!! I expect temps to go up to maybe 60 based on what my temps usually do with Prime but this same clock and vcore was topping out at 90C before the delid! Best decision I ever made. Can't wait to shoot for 5.0Ghz+
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


That's why this thread is here and so popular. We aren't crazy just because we are crazy. Or is it because the OP is crazy








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Valgaur* - Man, I have been reading forever to say - No Problem!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This thread is crazy fast. I was at zero post this morning, and then have to go through 157 post to respond to you!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And so much good stuff to read too, so it was not really a pain at all, just takes a lot of time every time a take time to, like, go to work! LOL
> I'll keep an eye out for new member submissions untill you can get your system back in order.


Thanks bud, I agree I responded on here once while driving and was thinking. I can't even drive and quote. Not worth it at all.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> You guys weren't kidding! I will be testing my max OC over the next few days so I can see how many Mhz I've gained that way I can plug that into the info. I need that before submitting right?


Its not neccesary its just for my spreadsheet and form for a certain company, that's currently being very kind to me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I def. owe you mad props Hokies. Not only did you suggest I get the 3770k over the 2700k you also were the one who suggested I trade in my previous dud of a chip for a new one which netted me this bad boy. Big ups dude
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Dern hokies beating me in telling you to trade it in to. I was going to but since my rigs down I haven't been able to keep up on here at all hardly lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Done!! And proud to be a member
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Hope you enjoy the sig! Its got some personality to it. And a growing popularity as well.


----------



## VonDutch

omg really, 10 pages of posts since i went to bed and woke up! ....LOL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sugarhell*
> 
> Nice thread full of information. I cant resist to try it xd
> What is the best method to use my liguid pro? die-ihs-ihs-heatsink or just die and ihs? Should i lap my ihs first or i can just use liquid pro directly on it?


lapping IHS isnt (a real) a part of delidding, its only done of temps are still to far apart after delid,
or are still high,and if a ihs or base plate cooler is concave..




i used CLP on all sides, on die, inside ihs, on ihs, and base plate cooler,
because the cleaning can be hard, i would use it on the die/inside ihs only,
and use any good, high w/mk, tim on ihs..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> How many runs? I ran IBT for 10 runs before testing with Prime.


some say 50+ runs of IBT..
since yesterdays posts, i would say, 10-20X ibt, max ram etc
8-12H prime custom, alot ram, and adjust the 15 min to 10 or even 5 min cycles..
cinebench, browse, play games that make good use of cpu's, bf3 is my fav..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *holgate*
> 
> well so far all ive done was raise the multi 45 and raise vcore until it became stable, right now its at 4.5 with 1.34 vcore


thats in short how you OC ivy, bit boring if you ask me..lol
no need to change other settings(right away), till you run into instability
lowering CPU PLL might help, like sin says in his guide,

"With Ivy Bridge, you want to slowly increase the VCore as temperatures will hurt your max OC much more than voltage can stabilize it. I would go one multiplier at a time If you end up with too much heat then the logical thing would be to decrease the voltage, however at this point you can try to decrease the CPU PLL, and if that doesn't help much you can always decrease the VTT and System Agent (IMC) to levels where they are lower but still remain stable."

cpu pll can lower temps a bit, and help stabilize a oc..
theres not many settings i change with my oc's,
vcore, cpu pll and llc are the ones i use/adjust,
leaving most settings on Auto, most mobo's are optimized already anyways









"Please note that you do not need to set LLC to Extreme, nor the others to extreme for only 4.8GHz, most of these options I change by habit for extreme overclocking with liquid nitrogen. For 99% of Overclocking there is no need to change any setting other than LLC."

i did adjust these settings tho, almost always do,

If you decide to leave on power saving options, make sure that you increase the turbo current limits for the CPU within *the turbo settings list to 200A and 300W to totally maximize Intel Turbo limits*; however this might not be needed.

im always using offset, with some powersavings on..only C3/C6 disabled,
they are the deepest "sleep" states..

"EIST(desktop) dynamically increase/decrease its clock speed between its minimum clock and its normal operating frequency, as well as voltage, in order to optimize for power consumption.
in other words a performance reduction while using the system, the system may feel you don't need full power. drats just heard a drop out.

C1E Halt: while similar reduces Clock speed by adjusting the multiplier (Core clock to system bus ratio) and to some degree VID. (voltage) this is a more common occurrence with light use
or on today case of Multicore shutting down a core or 2.

C3, C6. This is a deeper sleep with a complete core(s) shut down (Gate off) and no voltage/Data at all. harder to recover from quickly, previous data is cached elsewhere and needs to be re-cached in L3 memory
to re initialize full muliticore, multithread use. Part of Core parking "


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Exactly id hate to see you limited with volts and not getting enough performance out of them. When I go quad im getting the evga supernova 1500. Its great and its braided cabling is amazing.


As I mentioned earlier, I been eyeing the PSU myself, but it got a beating over at [H] and JG was not too pleased with it himself - Apparently it got some issues on the 3.3 and there is a chance you get an earlier sample (Which apparently comes without screws, whatever that means, and it comes with a thin cable - Where the new version comes with a slightly thicker version).

Its really hard to weed out the "Gonna bash for lulz" from the really in-sight reviews / comments on the PSU - A boildown shows that the problems with the PSU is mostly due to the PSU being "tailored" for the EU and our power-outlets, where it fares a bit worse on the US power - Again, this have just been mentioned a few times - Nothing concrete.

The EVGA forum also got mixed comments - So I dont really know - Might just get one, try it out for a day and if its no good I will just send it back.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> omg really, 10 pages of posts since i went to bed and woke up! ....LOL


I know right, seems like this thread is getting more and more active every day.
I was doing some out-of-office work from thursday afternoon 'till saturday evening last week without checking up on OCN, you wouldn't believe how many posts there were waiting for me when I got back xD
The annoying thing was that it was all interesting enough to read through, that sure took a while


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> As I mentioned earlier, I been eyeing the PSU myself, but it got a beating over at [H] and JG was not too pleased with it himself - Apparently it got some issues on the 3.3 and there is a chance you get an earlier sample (Which apparently comes without screws, whatever that means, and it comes with a thin cable - Where the new version comes with a slightly thicker version).
> Its really hard to weed out the "Gonna bash for lulz" from the really in-sight reviews / comments on the PSU - A boildown shows that the problems with the PSU is mostly due to the PSU being "tailored" for the EU and our power-outlets, where it fares a bit worse on the US power - Again, this have just been mentioned a few times - Nothing concrete.
> The EVGA forum also got mixed comments - So I dont really know - Might just get one, try it out for a day and if its completely **** I will just send it back.
> Regarding my SURPLUS watercooling gear:
> I literary been blown away by the amounts of PM´s - Will put up an official topic later this week.
> But NOTE: *YOU* pay for ANY shipping charges, and the cheapest EU -> Global I can find is around 90USD.
> Also - Dont have your friends and dogs PM me (Honestly, I *NEVER* gotten this many PMs before) - This offer is for MEMBERS OF THIS THREAD *ONLY*.


See Avatar









Ax1200 is all anybody really needs Nowadays.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> See Avatar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ax1200 is all anybody really needs Nowadays.


Update: AX1200i. 20% more awesome!









EDIT: Budget allowing of course! I'd bet that one of those would run much more than 1200w before giving up!


----------



## Hokies83

I got the AX 1200 when it came out and a 7 year warranty i do not see any reason to do away with it until atleast 2017 when my warranty is up XD


----------



## lilchronic

should i let this run all night im pretty nervous about temps but want to see how stable it is


----------



## lilchronic

average temps aint so bad. lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> should i let this run all night im pretty nervous about temps but want to see how stable it is


i wouldnt,
after long hours, your temps will go up some more running prime, about 3-4C i think,
still under tjmax tho, but close to 90C or under it is better..
but would be more worried about the temp difference between cores,
you still have about 12-13C between hottest and coolest core,
should be less then 10C if you ask me.. 4-6C difference when idle, under load a bit more(7-9C tops)

shorten cycle time in prime? make it 10 or 5 min, instead of 15 min?
then its easier to keep a eye on, and saves alot of time..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i woudnt,
> after long hours, your temps will go up some more running prime, about 3-4C i think,
> still under tjmax tho, but close to 90C or under it is better..
> but would be more worried about the temp difference between cores,
> you still have about 12-13C between hottest and coolest core..


i have not delided my chip yet


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i have not delided my chip yet


my bad .sorry








so much going on in this thread, can keep track..lol
then the temp diff is "normal" for a undelidded chip,
but amazing how high oc you have without delidding it, tempwise..

before delid, 105C within seconds running prime at 4.5ghz for me,
almost 15C between hottest/coolest core..


----------



## Leyaena

Getting the upgrade itch again, but the annoying part is that I've had a look at my rig, and I can't really see anything I could upgrade that'd be worth spending the money for...
Guess I'll just have to wait until the next generation of gpu's / haswell comes out, and then go big on a (new?) build








Nevertheless, if you guys can see a worthwile upgrade path for my current rig, I'm more than open to suggestions, I've got the itch big-time!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Getting the upgrade itch again, but the annoying part is that I've had a look at my rig, and I can't really see anything I could upgrade that'd be worth spending the money for...
> Guess I'll just have to wait until the next generation of gpu's / haswell comes out, and then go big on a (new?) build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nevertheless, if you guys can see a worthwile upgrade path for my current rig, I'm more than open to suggestions, I've got the itch big-time!


You could go for water cooling and really push that 3570K. It's what I did (I really need to upgrade my sig rig) and I am pushing 4.9GHz at 1.512v 24/7 while barely breaking 70 so I am happy!


----------



## Leyaena

I've actually given that a bit of consideration. Trouble is, anything over 4.8 just won't seem to boot, while my temps don't exeed the high 60's...
So basically, temperatures are no problem with this chip, so I guess watercooling is out of the question for this generation, but it's definitely up for consideration on the next-gen build I might do


----------



## DirektEffekt

Have you tried changing the VTT and VCCSA? Those seem to be the killers on Ivy. They really seem to matter at high clocks.


----------



## Leyaena

Yep, had to do that to get 4.8 properly stable, but it still won't go any higher'n that








I suspect it might be my cheapo board holding me back, but with 1155 soon being deprecated, it doesn't really seem worthwile to invest in a new board either...


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Yep, had to do that to get 4.8 properly stable, but it still won't go any higher'n that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I suspect it might be my cheapo board holding me back, but with 1155 soon being deprecated, it doesn't really seem worthwile to invest in a new board either...


I must admit the current socket cycle of Intel is somewhat annoying. But I think in the long run it means we get more innovation... It works out worse for us tweakers though!


----------



## Leyaena

From what I've read, they're planning on moving away from LGA for Broadwell as well, which would make Haswell the only generation to use the 1150 socket -_-.
They're supposedly moving from Land Grid to Ball Grid Array (BGA), or to put it simply; soldering the CPU straight onto the motherboard...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> From what I've read, they're planning on moving away from LGA for Broadwell as well, which would make Haswell the only generation to use the 1150 socket -_-.
> They're supposedly moving from Land Grid to Ball Grid Array (BGA), or to put it simply; soldering the CPU straight onto the motherboard...


Bad rumor not gonna happen.

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/news/intel_says_company_committed_sockets2012


----------



## Leyaena

I sure hope so, I've always been a bit sceptical of it as well, but as far as rumors go, this sure is a stubborn one, it just keeps popping up...
From my point of view, it wouldn't really make sense for intel to introduce a new socket for Haswell alone, to then change to BGA sockets for Broadwell and beyond. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed either way, I can't see how less customisation options would be a good thing in any way, shape or form. Then again, if AMD continues floundering like this, Intel'll soon be able to do whatever it pleases...


----------



## krich

Right, got my CLP this afternoon and I've gone in with a q-tip and applied it to the die, and used MX4 for the IHS.

I'm currently going a custom 8K run on Small FFTs in Prime 95 with 5.1GHz and 1.45V and the hottest core is 80 Degrees Celsius and the coolest is 70 Degrees Celsius!

Before, delidding I was at 4.8GHz with 1.25V and almost 90 Degrees Celsius. After delidding and with MX4 on the die and IHS, I was in the mid 90s at 1.4V and 5GHz and now 5.1GHz and 1.45V and just touching 80 Degrees Celsius!

I've not touched any of the other voltages apart from VC mind you, so could probably tweak and drop some VC or get some more MHz.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I sure hope so, I've always been a bit sceptical of it as well, but as far as rumors go, this sure is a stubborn one, it just keeps popping up...
> From my point of view, it wouldn't really make sense for intel to introduce a new socket for Haswell alone, to then change to BGA sockets for Broadwell and beyond. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed either way, I can't see how less customisation options would be a good thing in any way, shape or form. Then again, if AMD continues floundering like this, Intel'll soon be able to do whatever it pleases...


Actually, while they are not moving to BGA any time soon, it wouldn't surprise me if they do very quickly move away from 1150. Intel is doing something with their sockets that AMD, refuses to do, mainly I think, because they don't want to upset their customers who have become accustomed to their backwards compatible sockets. Intel is trying to completely change the makeup of a CPU and move towards a more SOC design where only the VRMs and some external bits like extra SATA controllers and ethernet etc. are on the motherboard, completely removing the chipset. To do this Intel will be changing their socket every 2 generations or so as they have been now.


----------



## Leyaena

Well, the article with Intel's response linked in Hokies' post should cover the 'forseeable future' in any case, so that's one worry we can write off for now.
Thanks by the way, Hokies, I hadn't read anything about Intel responding to that rumor yet









Another thing, then, do you guys think Intel will solder their next Haswell and IB-e chips again, or stick with the TIM?
And would that be a good thing or a bad thing, do you think?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Well, the article with Intel's response linked in Hokies' post should cover the 'forseeable future' in any case, so that's one worry we can write off for now.
> Thanks by the way, Hokies, I hadn't read anything about Intel responding to that rumor yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another thing, then, do you guys think Intel will solder their next Haswell and IB-e chips again, or stick with the TIM?
> And would that be a good thing or a bad thing, do you think?


So far, we're thinking it will be TIM, which to me, at least, is a good thing. It makes it feel like I worked harder for the performance and it means there are more options, like running totally dellidded. There was also some mention earlier about the reason Intel dropped solder being because it could cause issues on the smaller design nodes, due to the more extreme heating and cooling. I'm not sure how accurate it is, I can't really see why it would be a problem given everything, but that's what we have to go on.


----------



## VonDutch

im sooo happy right now, my money came in, and i just bought the last part for my build,
the Gigabyte GV-R7970 OC-3GD

idc, ill pay the rent later ...hahaha...
but got lucky, they sell for about 370-380+ euro on avarage where i live,
and today i spotted one for 350 euro($457), thats with shipping, hah









i would have upgraded to water cooler as last,
but i dont really need one anymore after delid,
my temps are cray low with my aircooler so ..np there..
my next build will have a watercooler tho..


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im sooo happy right now, my money came in, and i just bought the last part for my build,
> the Gigabyte GV-R7970 OC-3GD
> idc, ill pay the rent later ...hahaha...
> but got lucky, they sell for about 370-380+ euro on avarage where i live,
> and today i spotted one for 350 euro($457), thats with shipping, hah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i would have upgraded to water cooler as last,
> but i dont really need one anymore after delid,
> my temps are cray low with my aircooler so ..np there..
> my next build will have a watercooler tho..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


If that's anything like the 7950 version, I can guarantee you will love that card! It runs so cool! Mine only hits 70c at 1.3v while benching at around 15c ambients!


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im sooo happy right now, my money came in, and i just bought the last part for my build,
> the Gigabyte GV-R7970 OC-3GD
> idc, ill pay the rent later ...hahaha...
> but got lucky, they sell for about 370-380+ euro on avarage where i live,
> and today i spotted one for 350 euro($457), thats with shipping, hah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i would have upgraded to water cooler as last,
> but i dont really need one anymore after delid,
> my temps are cray low with my aircooler so ..np there..
> my next build will have a watercooler tho..


Grats mate!









Im slightly humming aswell, as I found a place nearby selling the LEPA G1600 PSU - Which is the only one that been:

A) Getting RAVE reviews!

B) Have all the PCI-E cables I need

C) Is fully modular

Slight overkill on the Watts, but hey - With this thing in my hands, my PSU needs are pretty much settled for the next few years, lol.

Of course, the thought of having to sleeve cables again is making me cry a bit on the inside.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> So far, we're thinking it will be TIM, which to me, at least, is a good thing. It makes it feel like I worked harder for the performance and it means there are more options, like running totally dellidded. There was also some mention earlier about the reason Intel dropped solder being because it could cause issues on the smaller design nodes, due to the more extreme heating and cooling. I'm not sure how accurate it is, I can't really see why it would be a problem given everything, but that's what we have to go on.


yea, i used a remark from someone saying this,

"Intel found that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free﻿ solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."

its nothing official, but i thought it made sense,
made me think of, on thin ice its better to lay down, then to stand up,
youre pressure is more spread out see








shrinking die means more pressure on a smaller erea..

so they prolly use tim again on haswell,
but whos to know right, without "official" word


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i used a remark from someone saying this,
> "Intel found that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free﻿ solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."
> its nothing official, but i thought it made sense,
> made me think of, on thin ice its better to lay down, then to stand up,
> youre pressure is more spread out see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> shrinking die means more pressure on a smaller erea..
> so they prolly use tim again on haswell,
> but whos to know right, without "official" word


If that's the case I think the delidding crew is going to start to grow exponentially







.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> If that's anything like the 7950 version, I can guarantee you will love that card! It runs so cool! Mine only hits 70c at 1.3v while benching at around 15c ambients!


and, one of the first things im gonna do, is use liquid pro on it ..lol
yea, i think its the same windforce 3 cooler used on both..


----------



## Hokies83

Grats VonDutch


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> If that's the case I think the delidding crew is going to start to grow exponentially
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


man, that would mean reading 20 pages every morning, instead of the 10 pages now...lol
i hope i can keep up, but the delid crew is growing also,
so there should always be someone here to help out

and...maybe just maybe, intel knows by now theres something wrong
with the way they put the ihs (to much distance to die) on, and the low w/mk tim they used..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Grats VonDutch


thanks hokies,
youre on of the peeps here that got me over safe some more money to buying the 7970 instead of the 7950,
and now it seems i only payed 60 euro more then the 7950 to ..happy puppy here


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i used a remark from someone saying this,
> "Intel found that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free﻿ solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure, no future chips will use solder."
> its nothing official, but i thought it made sense,
> made me think of, on thin ice its better to lay down, then to stand up,
> youre pressure is more spread out see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> shrinking die means more pressure on a smaller erea..
> so they prolly use tim again on haswell,
> but whos to know right, without "official" word


It still doesn't make sense to me though. The first 775 chips to be soldered actually had a smaller surface area than Ivy does, so I struggle to believe that particular line.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Grats VonDutch
> 
> 
> 
> thanks hokies,
> youre on of the peeps here that got me over safe some more money to buying the 7970 instead of the 7950,
> and now it seems i only payed 60 euro more then the 7950 to ..happy puppy here
Click to expand...

Great to hear, congrats!
Hope you'll enjoy taking it appart, putting CLP where it matters, reassembling it, overclocking it and then benching it and gaming on it for a long, long time


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It still doesn't make sense to me though. The first 775 chips to be soldered actually had a smaller surface area than Ivy does, so I struggle to believe that particular line.


i know, thats why i asked what the others thought about it,
and i didnt know about the die size 775 chips had, thanks..
guess we'll just have to wait and see whats gonna happen then,
i hope its gonna be tim personally ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Great to hear, congrats!
> Hope you'll enjoy taking it appart, putting CLP where it matters, reassembling it, overclocking it and then benching it and gaming on it for a long, long time


thanks "neighbour"








yea, gonna be a fun project again,
my aim/hope is 10C off temps, 1200/6000 oc, instead of 1000/5500 it has now,
maybe a bit more








not gonna push it very hard tho, gotta run at least 3 years ..lol


----------



## Leyaena

Same, I would actually prefer the TIM, partly for the thrill of succesfully delidding your rather expensive chip, and partly because a properly delidded chip with CLP and maybe a good lapping just seems to make temperatures a non-issue on most ways of cooling. I actually like working a bit for my performance gains, and I've never done a mod that netted me more performance than the delid of my chip did


----------



## martinhal

I think I'm stable at 5 Ghz.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I think I'm stable at 5 Ghz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


nice job! what is your ambient temp?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Same, I would actually prefer the TIM, partly for the thrill of succesfully delidding your rather expensive chip, and partly because a properly delidded chip with CLP and maybe a good lapping just seems to make temperatures a non-issue on most ways of cooling. I actually like working a bit for my performance gains, and I've never done a mod that netted me more performance than the delid of my chip did


with my "simple" aircooler i can run IBT at 5.0ghz @ 1.5V vcore, ambient about 25C

and my "hottest" core is only 84C ..lol still about 20C below Tjmax ..np
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I think I'm stable at 5 Ghz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


i saw in the other thread, great job martinhal









edit,
double post srry, will del the first


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> nice job! what is your ambient temp?


27 C


----------



## martinhal

i saw in the other thread, great job martinhal









Thanks


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> i saw in the other thread, great job martinhal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks


thanking yourselfs now ey ...LOL jk jk


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanking yourselfs now ey ...LOL jk jk


Yes ! Editing error


----------



## stickg1

An Intel rep told a high voltage stock ivy victim like me that Ivy chips will take as high as voltage as you can go without maxing out the temps. I'll post the word for word PM when I get home, hard too do from a phone while im framing a roof system.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just burn that stuff. Its horrible.
> 
> Hmmmm. Possibry in the summer. Where you live feniks? Wa?


haha, I strongly agree, burn that crap with fire









nah, I live on the East Coast in New Jersey and work in NYC ... was just googling stores in WA to help our members from Vancouver area








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> An Intel rep told a high voltage stock ivy victim like me that Ivy chips will take as high as voltage as you can go without maxing out the temps. I'll post the word for word PM when I get home, hard too do from a phone while im framing a roof system.


you mean the Intel rep said the votlage doesn't matter as long as temps are under control? wondering if he knew how we take care of temps around here ...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im sooo happy right now, my money came in, and i just bought the last part for my build,
> the Gigabyte GV-R7970 OC-3GD
> idc, ill pay the rent later ...hahaha...
> but got lucky, they sell for about 370-380+ euro on avarage where i live,
> and today i spotted one for 350 euro($457), thats with shipping, hah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i would have upgraded to water cooler as last,
> but i dont really need one anymore after delid,
> my temps are cray low with my aircooler so ..np there..
> my next build will have a watercooler tho..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Grats mate!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im slightly humming aswell, as I found a place nearby selling the LEPA G1600 PSU - Which is the only one that been:
> A) Getting RAVE reviews!
> B) Have all the PCI-E cables I need
> C) Is fully modular
> Slight overkill on the Watts, but hey - With this thing in my hands, my PSU needs are pretty much settled for the next few years, lol.
> Of course, the thought of having to sleeve cables again is making me cry a bit on the inside.


Nice choice! I think it's not overkill, cause you will eventually freeze your stuff and bench it, I know it's in you muahahaha
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> and, one of the first things im gonna do, is use liquid pro on it ..lol
> yea, i think its the same windforce 3 cooler used on both..


Oh, that's gonna be great!








I did with my gtx 670 ftw and I can run oc's guys run with an AIO water cooler lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I think I'm stable at 5 Ghz.


Awesome man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> haha, I strongly agree, burn that crap with fire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nah, I live on the East Coast in New Jersey and work in NYC ... was just googling stores in WA to help our members from Vancouver area
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you mean the Intel rep said the votlage doesn't matter as long as temps are under control? wondering if he knew how we take care of temps around here ...


Sure sounds like it...let's wait till he chimes in again


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> If that's the case I think the delidding crew is going to start to grow exponentially
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Yes my my army even larger. Muhahahahahahahaha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Same, I would actually prefer the TIM, partly for the thrill of succesfully delidding your rather expensive chip, and partly because a properly delidded chip with CLP and maybe a good lapping just seems to make temperatures a non-issue on most ways of cooling. I actually like working a bit for my performance gains, and I've never done a mod that netted me more performance than the delid of my chip did


Same here I prefer TIM much more. You net much more performance and personal gain from delidding instead of being like well yeah I dropped my temps by 2 C! Im a boss! And here we go I dropped mine by 30! IM A GOD!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> An Intel rep told a high voltage stock ivy victim like me that Ivy chips will take as high as voltage as you can go without maxing out the temps. I'll post the word for word PM when I get home, hard too do from a phone while im framing a roof system.


Hmmm maybe I talked to him.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> haha, I strongly agree, burn that crap with fire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nah, I live on the East Coast in New Jersey and work in NYC ... was just googling stores in WA to help our members from Vancouver area
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you mean the Intel rep said the votlage doesn't matter as long as temps are under control? wondering if he knew how we take care of temps around here ...


Im debating telling them. In my return cpu letter that is.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im sooo happy right now, my money came in, and i just bought the last part for my build,
> the Gigabyte GV-R7970 OC-3GD
> idc, ill pay the rent later ...hahaha...
> but got lucky, they sell for about 370-380+ euro on avarage where i live,
> and today i spotted one for 350 euro($457), thats with shipping, hah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i would have upgraded to water cooler as last,
> but i dont really need one anymore after delid,
> my temps are cray low with my aircooler so ..np there..
> my next build will have a watercooler tho..


Puts some CLP on that and will drop like 10-15c on temps.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Puts some CLP on that and will drop like 10-15c on temps.


I'm wonderig if I should put CLP on my EK 670 full cover block. I wonder if I could do so without taking my loop apart...hmmmmmm







.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I'm wonderig if I should put CLP on my EK 670 full cover block. I wonder if I could do so without taking my loop apart...hmmmmmm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I'm air cooled and got 12c drop in temps, in some games even more.... For you under water it will be more i think.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah it's 100% worth it...you can easily replace the tim I guess. Not 100% sure with the waterblock thingie but it might be easy.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah it's 100% worth it...you can easily replace the tim I guess. Not 100% sure with the waterblock thingie but it might be easy.


I feel like it'd be tough with my setup.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I feel like it'd be tough with my setup.


Do it for the fun of it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Puts some CLP on that and will drop like 10-15c on temps.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> and, one of the first things im gonna do, is use liquid pro on it ..lol
> yea, i think its the same windforce 3 cooler used on both..


guess you missed that post later on.. lol,
but yea, one of the first things im gonna do,
had good results with mine and my kids vid cards, about 10C drop using liquid pro









this is how it looked when we took it apart,

i used AS5 before, little did i know, looking at it now, i applied way to much, right..

still saw some tempdrop 5-6C, but not 10C like with using CLP later..
that would mean total tempdrop before and after the original tim, is more then 10C..lol
cleaned,


Liquid Pro applied









runs about 10C cooler now then before while playing bf3..(15C







)


----------



## PuffinMyLye

25 runs of IBT @5.0Ghz with 1.330vcore under load. Start testing with Prime or just keep pushing higher?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 25 runs of IBT @5.0Ghz with 1.330vcore under load. Start testing with Prime or just keep pushing higher?


Very very nice!

Do a Cinebench test, at least before doing a Prime


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Very very nice!
> Do a Cinebench test, at least before doing a Prime


I have Cinebench but I've never used it. Any instructions on how to setup the test before doing so?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I have Cinebench but I've never used it. Any instructions on how to setup the test before doing so?


Just run it and click on the "RUN" besides the CPU icon









Takes a few minutes to complete.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Just run it and click on the "RUN" besides the CPU icon
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Takes a few minutes to complete.


Here you go







.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Here you go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Well, time to put the CPU in the oven and do some Prime.

Passing both Cinebench and IBT is a great sign though (Ok ok, I am really trying to control myself now! That chip looks worthy of a title







).


----------



## Valgaur

Give me that chip to bench. Please I beg of you.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 25 runs of IBT @5.0Ghz with 1.330vcore under load. Start testing with Prime or just keep pushing higher?


----------



## Gomi

Now now lads, lets not create fuss here ... *Tells PuffinMyLye to go hide in the woods, because every single bencher out there will be stalking him for that chip*.

Really, as I said - Trying to control myself - But that IS the very best 3770K I *EVER* seen.

EDIT:

If you aint a bencher, I would prob. get in touch (After a Prime of course) with a few benchers here on OCN - You could swap that chip for a good binned one (1.4 for 5Ghz) and still walk away with money in your pocket - Just saying.


----------



## Valgaur

Best one I've seen and that's including all the ones that are being benched right now. You sir make me and offer and ill comply. No joke.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Give me that chip to bench. Please I beg of you.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Now now lads, lets not create fuss here ... *Tells PuffinMyLye to go hide in the woods, because every single bencher out there will be stalking him for that chip*.
> Really, as I said - Trying to control myself - But that IS the very best 3770K I *EVER* seen.
> EDIT:
> If you aint a bencher, I would prob. get in touch (After a Prime of course) with a few benchers here on OCN - You could swap that chip for a good binned one (1.4 for 5Ghz) and still walk away with money in your pocket - Just saying.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Best one I've seen and that's including all the ones that are being benched right now. You sir make me and offer and ill comply. No joke.


Did not realize the stir this bad boy would cause haha. I guess I just never realized how big benching was...hmmmmm







.


----------



## Hokies83

The funny part about it is..

Done on a 100$ mother board..

I been saying it all along Z77 board does not matter so much unless your doing LN2.


----------



## Gomi

I give it less than 24 hours and that chip will have swapped owners *Grins*

But aye - If you aint putting that chip under LN2, I would probably look for a deal including a good binned 3770K and cash.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Here you go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


OMG, and he still has HT on.. AMAZING.... VERY VERY NICE.. Don't sell it. That low vcore for 5ghz is incredible .

EDIT. on that vcore I'm only ablr to get 4.5


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Here you go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


just out of curiosity have you checked voltage with a multimeter?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> just out of curiosity have you checked voltage with a multimeter?


I have not as I don't own one. I'm not a bencher so I've never needed one to be honest.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I have not as I don't own one. I'm not a bencher so I've never needed one to be honest.


No need u had the other chip which clocked below Avg on the same board..

I think those are 100% correct volts.

Now find out what 5.1 and 5.2ghz takes =p thats where u get into im a Bad mofo area there..


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No need u had the other chip which clocked below Avg on the same board..
> I think those are 100% correct volts.
> Now find out what 5.1 and 5.2ghz takes =p thats where u get into im a Bad mofo area there..


just wondering, that's all considering temps and voltage and Asrock.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Did not realize the stir this bad boy would cause haha. I guess I just never realized how big benching was...hmmmmm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Im not kidding. Im very serious. I will bin the crap out of my new chip for yours. With bonus cash as well. I could do amazing things with that thing under Ln2.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I give it less than 24 hours and that chip will have swapped owners *Grins*
> But aye - If you aint putting that chip under LN2, I would probably look for a deal including a good binned 3770K and cash.


Exactly my thoughts.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No need u had the other chip which clocked below Avg on the same board..
> I think those are 100% correct volts.
> Now find out what 5.1 and 5.2ghz takes =p thats where u get into im a Bad mofo area there..


Agreed its been confirmed with another chip so its all good.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Asrock fatality...which was the board famous for reading voltage too low.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Asrock fatality...which was the board famous for reading voltage too low.


lol there is another Asrock board that does it too.

thats why when I state my voltage its from my DMM.


----------



## chris-br

Now I'm wondering whats going on in the PM's.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Ok guys.. What do you think... Antec 620 XD...

Delided Prolimatech PK1 Die+IHS IBT 14,000 MB Load for MAX heat


Now
Delided CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra on Die+IHS IBT 14,000 MB Load for MAX heat


wonder if i can drop that vcore XD..

*ohhh definitely i gonna put this crap on my 7970* XD~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Now I'm wondering whats going on in the PM's.


Haha nothing going on through PM's...yet







. Still messing with this thing trying to see what I can do @ 5.2.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Im not kidding. Im very serious. I will bin the crap out of my new chip for yours. With bonus cash as well. I could do amazing things with that thing under Ln2.


Not sure I'd want to trade this thing for another chip. For cash MAYBE but IDK I've gone through a lot to get this thing over the past few weeks. For me the chase is the exciting part so just getting a chip that's already been tested and rated takes the fun out of it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha nothing going on through PM's...yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Still messing with this thing trying to see what I can do @ 5.2.
> Not sure I'd want to trade this thing for another chip. For cash MAYBE but IDK I've gone through a lot to get this thing over the past few weeks. For me the chase is the exciting part so just getting a chip that's already been tested and rated takes the fun out of it.


I would not give up your chip.

You wanted that and u got what u wanted so keep it







and show us the wonderful numbers..

So what is 5.2ghz taking Vcore wise?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 25 runs of IBT @5.0Ghz with 1.330vcore under load. Start testing with Prime or just keep pushing higher?


that is a beautifull chip









whats the batch #??


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Here's 10 runs of IBT at 5.2 and 1.456vcore. Not stable (ASRock utility gave me an error message) but just for reference purposes.

Under load


IBT 10 runs complete


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> that is a beautifull chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> whats the batch #??


3230B370 however I'm told batches don't mean as much as they used to.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 3230B370 however I'm told batches don't mean as much as they used to.


my batch # is similar but ive got 3570k @ 5ghz 1.375v on asrock board
#3233B499


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my batch # is similar but ive got 3570k @ 5ghz 1.375v on asrock board
> #3233B499


That is excellent for a 3570k. Sweet chip man







.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> I was just speaking with an intel tech over chat. Surprisingly they actually have chat support when I I was just looking around their site. After 20 min of conversing about my set-up, he told me this about the 3570k:
> 
> Daniel: any parameter between 0.8 and 1.4 V per core is considered normal and it will keep fluctuating in that range.
> You: Thank you very much but may I ask where you drew this information from?
> Daniel: our data base sir.
> 
> Kinda surprising that I got him to say that. So it's just the low voltage OC that our chips suck at?
> 
> wow this is kinda funny. He told me to run the "intel processor diagnostic tool" to make sure its within specifications.
> http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-031726.htm
> 
> kinda interesting, it's doing its own little stress test and everything...
> 
> according to this guy, you're processor is gonna be just fine at 1.53v as long as the temperatures are under control.
> 
> :yeah but I still don't know if this thing is gonna burn out at 1.35
> : I'm not sure I trust the datasheet
> Daniel: yes it supports really high voltages compare to previous ones
> Daniel: Ok.
> : so it seems like as long as temps are under control it's doing fine
> Daniel: correct
> : alright
> : great
> 
> Maybe you wanna bump it up a bit more...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> That is excellent for a 3570k. Sweet chip man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


wish it was the i7


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Here's 10 runs of IBT at 5.2 and 1.456vcore. Not stable (ASRock utility gave me an error message) but just for reference purposes.
> Under load
> 
> IBT 10 runs complete


1.48v


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.48v


You saying I should try 5.2 @ 1.48vcore?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 25 runs of IBT @5.0Ghz with 1.330vcore under load. Start testing with Prime or just keep pushing higher?


awesome! dude that sounds like a golden chip right there








now run some Cinebench, adjust the vcore as needed (up usually LOL!) and check for WHEA warnings in Event Logs and compensate for them too. then move up the multi








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Here's 10 runs of IBT at 5.2 and 1.456vcore. Not stable (ASRock utility gave me an error message) but just for reference purposes.
> Under load
> 
> IBT 10 runs complete


same procedure, double check with Cinebench against WHEA crap then move forward and up as long as temps are under control







I'd personally stop bothering with IBT when you start reaching 90C in core temps and stick to Cinebench and WHEA monitoring in event logs.
great chip, way better than most of ours good ones around here.
batch 3230B, you said right?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> same procedure, double check with Cinebench against WHEA crap then move forward and up as long as temps are under control
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd personally stop bothering with IBT when you start reaching 90C in core temps and stick to Cinebench and WHEA monitoring in event logs.
> great chip, way better than most of ours good ones around here.
> batch 3230B, you said right?


Yes batch 3230B, the MC by me had a bunch of them.

How many times should I be running Cinebench (assuming no WHEA errors) before moving on? One run only takes about 20 seconds.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yes batch 3230B, the MC by me had a bunch of them.
> How many times should I be running Cinebench (assuming no WHEA errors) before moving on? One run only takes about 20 seconds.


2-3 error free runs are enough for me to move up. dang if I had spare money I'd go pick up that 3230B ... nah, will stay with mine I guess, it's good enough hehe ... it's tempting though


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 2-3 error free runs are enough for me to move up. dang if I had spare money I'd go pick up that 3230B ... nah, will stay with mine I guess, it's good enough hehe ... it's tempting though


What vcore did you need for your 5.0Ghz OC? And yea I mean I exchanged a poor chip for the one I have now so no guarantees. However the one I returned was from a different batch.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Geez this CLP is a pain to apply. I applied what I thought was a rice grain amount (may have been more as it came out like a small metal ball) to both the die and IHS. Booted up my machine and saw one of the cores was at 70 under load while the others were in the mid 40's. When I took off my block and the IHS I could see that not only did the CLP not apply evenly but it ran off to the sides and balled up in some places.
> What's the best way to go about applying CLP evenly?


Your luck with receiving that golden chip is almost unbelievable, what are the odds? When I delidded my chip I wanted to make sure I had 100% contact with the die and IHS so I used up my entire syringe of CLP! Imagine putting that golden chip up for auction! $$$$$$


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Your luck with receiving that golden chip is almost unbelievable, what are the odds? When I delidded my chip I wanted to make sure I had 100% contact with the die and IHS so I used up my entire syringe of CLP! Imagine putting that golden chip up for auction! $$$$$$


Once I watched the youtube video CL made about applying it with a cotton swab it was easy as pie and I did it in one shot to both the die and IHS with no issues. When I'm done testing this chip for my own purposes I may just do that (put it up for auction). After all I'm not a bencher and I don't have any extreme cooling that I can test extra high clocks with. For me it's more just about the fun of the chase







.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Ran Cinebench 5 straight times this was directly after the 5th time. Vcore was 1.456 under load. HT was disabled. I have to bump the voltage up to almost 1.49vcore if HT is enabled.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What vcore did you need for your 5.0Ghz OC? And yea I mean I exchanged a poor chip for the one I have now so no guarantees. However the one I returned was from a different batch.


5.0GHz @ 1.46v under load when using fixed vcore.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ran Cinebench 5 straight times this was directly after the 5th time. Vcore was 1.456 under load. HT was disabled. I have to bump the voltage up to almost 1.49vcore if HT is enabled.


pure awesomeness


----------



## barretp

I seem to get slightly better voltages when I'm using offset voltages instead of fixed voltages. Anybody else? Maybe it's just because I'm using some power saving options too.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ran Cinebench 5 straight times this was directly after the 5th time. Vcore was 1.456 under load. HT was disabled. I have to bump the voltage up to almost 1.49vcore if HT is enabled.


1.49v with HT on is far more impressive then 1.45v HT off









Funny part about your Cinebench score is your matching / beating 5ghz 8350s with all 8 threads in Video rendering lol.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 5.0GHz @ 1.46v under load when using fixed vcore.


That's a real solid chip still. Wouldn't trade that in for a luck of the draw run at it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> pure awesomeness


Thanks







.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.49v with HT on is far more impressive then 1.45v HT off
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Funny part about your Cinebench score is your matching / beating 5ghz 8350s with all 8 threads in Video rendering lol.


Good to know. I think I'll try to find a stable 5.2 with HT on. Yours took 1.52 Hokies? I dont' know if I'll be able to beat that in terms of getting in 100% stable.


----------



## Arm3nian

Does anyone here know anything about ssd's... I can't find an answer anywhere. Anyway, my problem is that sometimes my raid 0 120gb intel 520 ssd's run at half speed. Sometimes in atto they get 1gbps, sometimes 500mbps. Before I switched to windows 8, I didn't format it manually, so I think that is the problem. I switched back to 7 and still half speed. Not only that, but I actually load slower than most people in games, 500mbps is still fast, but it does not seem i am getting that in games, before, I would always be the first, not the case anymore. I installed the drivers, and ya i'm running 6gbps intel ports with 6gbps cables. I think I need to secure erase or w/e its called... Any thoughts?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> That's a real solid chip still. Wouldn't trade that in for a luck of the draw run at it.
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> Good to know. I think I'll try to find a stable 5.2 with HT on. Yours took 1.52 Hokies? I dont' know if I'll be able to beat that in terms of getting in 100% stable.


5.2ghz takes 1.6v for me that is just my benching OC

my 24/7 OC is 5.1ghz 1.54v


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Once I watched the youtube video CL made about applying it with a cotton swab it was easy as pie and I did it in one shot to both the die and IHS with no issues. When I'm done testing this chip for my own purposes I may just do that (put it up for auction). After all I'm not a bencher and I don't have any extreme cooling that I can test extra high clocks with. For me it's more just about the fun of the chase
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Please tell me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Does anyone here know anything about ssd's... I can't find an answer anywhere. Anyway, my problem is that sometimes my raid 0 120gb intel 520 ssd's run at half speed. Sometimes in atto they get 1gbps, sometimes 500mbps. Before I switched to windows 8, I didn't format it manually, so I think that is the problem. I switched back to 7 and still half speed. Not only that, but I actually load slower than most people in games, 500mbps is still fast, but it does not seem i am getting that in games, before, I would always be the first, not the case anymore. I installed the drivers, and ya i'm running 6gbps intel ports with 6gbps cables. I think I need to secure erase or w/e its called... Any thoughts?


I really wanna say it's your mobo, if you have a link to the mobo exactly I could dig more into it but you never know sometimes with ssd's. with the W8 thing don't use it until SP1. it's full of issues.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 5.2ghz takes 1.6v for me that is just my benching OC
> my 24/7 OC is 5.1ghz 1.54v


I could do 5.2 benchable at right around 1.56vcore area, depended on the bench.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I'm going to be trying for a 12+ hr prime stability test @ 5.1 right now since 5.1-5.2 seems to require a big jump (although I'm no master OCer by any means so my settings could easily need tweaking). Right now I seem pretty stable at 5.1 with 1.424vcore. If anything it may require a small bump but I'm pretty sure I won't need much. Once I have that tested and stable and recorded I'll shoot for more temperature permitting.

Btw, what's considered a good Cinebench CPU score?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Please tell me.
> I really wanna say it's your mobo, if you have a link to the mobo exactly I could dig more into it but you never know sometimes with ssd's. with the W8 thing don't use it until SP1. it's full of issues.
> I could do 5.2 benchable at right around 1.56vcore area, depended on the bench.


Thats Stable i do not bench an un stable oc that = degrading


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Thats Stable i do not bench an un stable oc that = degrading


mine was stable 5.2 I just didnt need the little 200 Mhz boost. I'm fine with running 4.5 Ghz all day.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think our golden 5GHz with 1.3v on air give no guarantee of 6.5GHz+ and/or a good imc...according to many top benchers you won't know till you freeze those.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think our golden 5GHz with 1.3v on air give no guarantee of 6.5GHz+ and/or a good imc...according to many top benchers you won't know till you freeze those.


Just the beginning then the ccb cold boot bug comes into play and diferent per chip. Its a lot of factors.


----------



## Hokies83

Think if the 3770k had a true 8 core version of it.. with no HT.... Could you say 17 = 21 scores in Cinebench?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Think if the 3770k had a true 8 core version of it.. with no HT.... Could you say 17 = 21 scores in Cinebench?


I could easily see it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I could easily see it.




Clock for clock 59% faster IPC...

If Intel really show cased that with a true 8 core for around 400$ Amd would have a NUkE dropped in there Head quarters.


----------



## Valgaur

Man just imagining that for benching would be amazing oh man oh man.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Btw, what's considered a good Cinebench CPU score?


i think my cinebench at 5.1ghz, 10.32 points is very good ..lol

ivan beat me tho, with 10.33 points at 5.1ghz


----------



## Hokies83

Lucky scores XD


----------



## VonDutch

still think you cant compare a 300 euro chip with a 185 euro chip,

its like comparing the 7970 with a gtx680 or 690..
looking at prizes over here, but the 7970 and 670 are a closer/more fair comparison prisewise,

the fx8350 is close to the 2500K prizewise, i pay about 10 euro more for the 2500k, and 20 euro more for the 3570K,
i would still buy one of those over the 8350 for a new build ..
3770k is a beast right, even beats up much higher prized intel chips clock for clock..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Lucky scores XD


twice lucky then ..lol
10.25 to 10.30 points at 5.1ghz is normal/good?

o wait,. your daily 24/7 oc is 5.1ghz right, whats your score running cinebench?

this is my "official" one from Oct. 27,

10.23 points, like i said before, my oc skills improved hanging around this forum


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> still think you cant compare a 300 euro chip with a 185 euro chip,
> its like comparing the 7970 with a gtx680 or 690..
> looking at prizes over here, but the 7970 and 670 are a closer/more fair comparison prisewise,
> the fx8350 is close to the 2500K prizewise, i pay about 10 euro more for the 2500k, and 20 euro more for the 3570K,
> i would still buy one of those over the 8350 for a new build ..
> 3770k is a beast right, even beats up much higher prized intel chips clock for clock..


You can get a 3770k for 229$ here and a Fx8350 is 209$
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> twice lucky then ..lol
> 10.25 to 10.30 points at 5.1ghz is normal/good?
> o wait,. your daily 24/7 oc is 5.1ghz right, whats your score running cinebench?


10.20 cause mah ram.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can get a 3770k for 229$ here and a Fx8350 is 209$
> 10.20 cause mah ram.


3770k 300 euro, fx8350 182 euro..
omg, really, for buying parts its better to live in the states ..lol
wish we had a microcenter etc over here ..lol

yea, got some higher scores ocing my ram, and use tighter timings,
this is what xmp profile did with the timings, before last bios update ..lol

in that way i got lucky, couldnt do that before, thats why i "only" had 10.23 points back then
if i can, im gonna buy some 2400/2600mhz ram next ..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 3770k 300 euro, fx8350 182 euro..
> omg, really, for buying parts its better to live in the states ..lol
> wish we had a microcenter etc over here ..lol
> yea, got some higher scores ocing my ram, and use tighter timings..
> in that way i got lucky, couldnt do that before, thats why i "only" had 10.23 points back then
> if i can, im gonna buy some 2400/2600mhz ram next ..


You can order from Amazon.com cant you? or is there huge "import taxes"

May be the reason your stuff cost so much there.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can order from Amazon.com cant you? or is there huge "import taxes"
> May be the reason your stuff cost so much there.


yea, normal tax over here is 21% ..pfft
not sure what import taxes are ...lol, i think all in all i would pay the same,
there are ways around it tho, let one of you guys buy it for me,
wrap it in some nice looking christmas paper , send it as a gift?


----------



## Gomi

Know its not the correct CPU - But I need an honest and quick answer with some knowledge behind, and there is no place better than here to get it, with you guys being who you are.

I just got access to LOADS of 2700K, unfortunately a google-search does not come up with any batch number information - Only people stating that the 2700K is already a binner 2600K, and therefore batches are irrelevant. Could anyone chime in on this ? A few good batch-numbers would be nice, I could pillage my way through the mountain I am looking at and snag a few with me home to test.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Know its not the correct CPU - But I need an honest and quick answer with some knowledge behind, and there is no place better than here to get it, with you guys being who you are.
> I just got access to LOADS of 2700K, unfortunately a google-search does not come up with any batch number information - Only people stating that the 2700K is already a binner 2600K, and therefore batches are irrelevant. Could anyone chime in on this ? A few good batch-numbers would be nice, I could pillage my way through the mountain I am looking at and snag a few with me home to test.


Never heard of one batch 2700k being better then the other.

I do know the 2700k is the cream of the crop as far as binning goes with Sandy Bridge.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, normal tax over here is 21% ..pfft
> not sure what import taxes are ...lol, i think all in all i would pay the same,
> there are ways around it tho, let one of you guys buy it for me,
> wrap it in some nice looking christmas paper , send it as a gift?


Yeah u can do that somebody in the sates go to MC and buy u a 3770k remove chip from box and ship it to you and say value is 25$ international shipping auto gets 50$ insurance so it is all good.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I'm going to be trying for a 12+ hr prime stability test @ 5.1 right now since 5.1-5.2 seems to require a big jump (although I'm no master OCer by any means so my settings could easily need tweaking). Right now I seem pretty stable at 5.1 with 1.424vcore. If anything it may require a small bump but I'm pretty sure I won't need much. Once I have that tested and stable and recorded I'll shoot for more temperature permitting.
> 
> Btw, what's considered a good Cinebench CPU score?


*PuffinMyLye*, if you are going to do a 12hr prime95 run, then do it according to the (Official) Ivy Bridge Stable and Suicide Club:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet

That way you can get it recorded (if you follow it's rules on page 1/post #1) and be able to prove you have a stable OC'ed Ivy.

Also, check out the suicide bench scores in page 1/post #2 to see other benches and scores for benches like Cinebench.

If you follow the rules there too, I bet your chip would be able to post some tough bench scores to beat! Give it a try as it is tons of fun to do and to tune/tweek your system to get good scores!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can get a 3770k for 229$ here and a Fx8350 is 209$
> 10.20 cause mah ram.
> 
> 
> 
> 3770k 300 euro, fx8350 182 euro..
> omg, really, for buying parts its better to live in the states ..lol
> wish we had a microcenter etc over here ..lol
> 
> yea, got some higher scores ocing my ram, and use tighter timings,
> this is what xmp profile did with the timings, before last bios update ..lol
> 
> in that way i got lucky, couldnt do that before, thats why i "only" had 10.23 points back then
> if i can, im gonna buy some 2400/2600mhz ram next ..
Click to expand...

Looking forward to what you are going to do with those ram sticks too once you get them *VonDutch*!

I bet I will have to update some of your current bench scores once you do


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Looking forward to what you are going to do with those ram sticks too once you get them *VonDutch*!
> I bet I will have to update some of your current bench scores once you do


gonna take a while before i can, me buying that vidcard...im bankrupt for months now ..lol

SiComputers
Score: 4.5
Hoogvliet Rotterdam
€ 347,- ($454)
€ 352,95

AMMS Electronics
Score: 4.5
Pijnacker
€ 474,89 ($621)
€ 474,89

19 stores compared, this is the cheapest and the most expensive store
where i could buy my 7970.. crazy right.. about 130 euro ($170) difference


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> gonna take a while before i can, me buying that vidcard...im bankrupt for months now ..lol
> SiComputers
> Score: 4.5
> Hoogvliet Rotterdam
> € 347,- ($454)
> € 352,95
> AMMS Electronics
> Score: 4.5
> Pijnacker
> € 474,89 ($621)
> € 474,89
> 19 stores compared, this is the cheapest and the most expensive store
> where i could buy my 7970.. crazy right.. about 130 euro ($170) difference


Where is your Location from Denmark?

One of my wifes friends is going there to study to be a nurse.


----------



## chris-br

Crap. i just have to go to bed to wake up with over 50 new posts. lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where is your Location from Denmark?
> One of my wifes friends is going there to study to be a nurse.




im Dutch, from The Netherlands, Danmark is close, but not the same country ..lol
i could use a "nurse" tho ...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Crap. i just have to go to bed to wake up with over 50 new posts. lol


51







...lol


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Crap. i just have to go to bed to wake up with over 50 new posts. lol


Happens to all of us, amazes me every day ^^
Yesterday there were almost 100 posts for me to read through


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Thats Stable i do not bench an un stable oc that = degrading


I know I'm a bit late, but stability has nothing to do with whether it degrades or not. Degradation is all to do with voltage and heat. Physical quantities which have a dangerous effect on the material of which the die is made. Instability is due to incomplete switching of transistors at high speeds, this does not cause any physical damage.

I could run my chip at an unstable overclock for years and, provided the volts were fine and the temps were good, it would be just as good as the day I got it after all those years.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I know I'm a bit late, but stability has nothing to do with whether it degrades or not. Degradation is all to do with voltage and heat. Physical quantities which have a dangerous effect on the material of which the die is made. Instability is due to incomplete switching of transistors at high speeds, this does not cause any physical damage.
> I could run my chip at an unstable overclock for years and, provided the volts were fine and the temps were good, it would be just as good as the day I got it after all those years.


Not what i heard and have read in the past running your chip un stable destroys it.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Not what i heard and have read in the past running your chip un stable destroys it.


That's not true in the slightest. I have never heard that from anyone with any real understanding of the mechanisms at work inside the transistor or anyone with any practice in doing so. It is more likely that those people are simply inexperienced, ran it at the edge of "safe" for extended periods of time with it unstable, caused degradation due to voltage and heat and confused causation with correlation.

I'll to to explain the reason instability occurs, it might help explain why it doesn't cause damage.

Each transistor is essentially a switch, which causes the voltage across any transistor to go from high to low or vice versa. As with everything, although to us it seems instantaneous, it takes time. The time that this switching takes depends mainly on two things: voltage and heat. If it is cooler it will switch faster, taking less time and the same is true with higher driving voltages.

Instability occurs when, because of insufficient voltage or excessive temperature, the output of the transistor is used before it is allowed to complete it's switching cycle. Obviously this would occur as the frequency increases, this requiring lower switching times. If at the time the output of a transistor is sampled it's output level is below the sensitivity level to signal a given state then the transistor will appear to have it's previous state as it has not been able to move into it's new state. This causes data corruption which is seen as instability.

While it may appear that the incomplete switching is dangerous, it is important to remember that, even under stock situations, the chip is not designed to ever complete switching. The transistor is never truly 100% on or off, it will, in operation, always be somewhere in between. The key is whether or not it has moved past the threshold value as it always would at stock. When overclocking this threshold value may not be reached, which will cause data corruption, but the actual physical operation of the transistor is still completely normal.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've never seen anyone mention that till Hokies did here but it does sound fishy...I guess many benchers would have noticed already.

VonDutch, importing small stuff is ridiculously easy! Whatever fits in a bubble envelope or small flat rate box will go straight to your door without tax with appropriate labeling skills xD pm me if need be.


----------



## Hokies83

There is a reason people shoot to be stable if there was not.. everybody would be happy with "Kinda stable" FTW 420 would prolly know.. i have not heard much about un stable chips dieing from it since X58.


----------



## Leyaena

The main reason would probably be to never have to worry about your pc crashing due to instability, whatever you're doing


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> There is a reason people shoot to be stable if there was not.. everybody would be happy with "Kinda stable" FTW 420 would prolly know.. i have not heard much about un stable chips dieing from it since X58.


Instability is not a problem. It is a symptom. If it died while being unstable there was something else causing instability that also killed it. I have never heard of a chip dieing because of instability.

The reason people aim for stability is because if it is not completely stable then you almost certainly will eventually have some kind of random crash, frequently or not. Or, more severely, it could corrupt an update and ruin the OS. The whole idea is to avoid these problems which while, in a mostly stable system, have a 1 in 1000 chance of happening, in a rig used 8 hours a day, the problem will almost certainly happen eventually.

EDIT: I would prove that instability does not cause degradation, but I don't feel like putting up with a crashing system for however many months. I have run some mostly stable systems in the past (Failed prime after 2 hours or so) for extended periods of time, in the 1366 era to think of it, and that chip is still going strong in my family's PC.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah Idon't think that's very likely but well...stability is always good for ya can't argue with that xD


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> VonDutch, importing small stuff is ridiculously easy! Whatever fits in a bubble envelope or small flat rate box will go straight to your door without tax with appropriate labeling skills xD pm me if need be.


thanks Ivan, appreciated, will keep in mind, maybe when i buy my new ram?
its not to big, can fit in a envelope so..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i think my cinebench at 5.1ghz, 10.32 points is very good ..lol
> 
> ivan beat me tho, with 10.33 points at 5.1ghz


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> twice lucky then ..lol
> 10.25 to 10.30 points at 5.1ghz is normal/good?
> o wait,. your daily 24/7 oc is 5.1ghz right, whats your score running cinebench?
> this is my "official" one from Oct. 27,
> 
> 10.23 points, like i said before, my oc skills improved hanging around this forum


I got a 10.47 but that was at 5.2Ghz. Honestly since I got this chip I haven't tweaked anything except fixed voltage (RAM timings are very loose right now as well).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *PuffinMyLye*, if you are going to do a 12hr prime95 run, then do it according to the (Official) Ivy Bridge Stable and Suicide Club:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet
> That way you can get it recorded (if you follow it's rules on page 1/post #1) and be able to prove you have a stable OC'ed Ivy.
> Also, check out the suicide bench scores in page 1/post #2 to see other benches and scores for benches like Cinebench.
> If you follow the rules there too, I bet your chip would be able to post some tough bench scores to beat! Give it a try as it is tons of fun to do and to tune/tweek your system to get good scores!


Yea I'm aware of that thread so when I do get my chip stable it will be according to those rules, thanks for that. I need to learn more about what other settings to tweak other than fixed vcore (if there really are any that make a difference) before I start shooting for high clock stability.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah Idon't think that's very likely but well...stability is always good for ya can't argue with that xD


stability is sooo overrated, who cares when your comp crashes
every now and then.. haha







jk jk

stupid thing is, ive read it before too, that a system thats not stable,
will, be it slowly and a little, degrade the chip over time ..
tried to search for it, but cant find it anymore..
but who will notice when it happens over a period of 3 to 5 years ..lol
but to say cpu's die because of it ..nah..

whats left is, datacorruption, and a "slower" system if you have whea errors etc..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I got a 10.47 but that was at 5.2Ghz. Honestly since I got this chip I haven't tweaked anything except fixed voltage (RAM timings are very loose right now as well).


i have 1 word for you .... "Ihateyou!" .....LOL








gimmi that chip, gimmi that chip...ill trade you mine


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i have 1 word for you .... "Ihateyou!" .....LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gimmi that chip, gimmi that chip...ill trade you mine


I'll take that as a form of flattery, like a big game athlete getting booed on the road lol







.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I'll take that as a form of flattery, like a big game athlete getting booed on the road lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


of course







..lol

o and, $50 extra for that chip trade with mine


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..lol
> o and, $50 extra for that chip trade with mine


I appreciate the offer







. I've gotten more than a few PMs about this chip so far and I'll just tell you what I've told others. I'm not a big time bencher (frankly I don't have the high end hardware) or someone who really has a need to run a chip 5.0Ghz+ 24/7 (mostly just OC for gaming and some video rendering) so it's really just about the chase for me. That's really the fun part for me. Once I've gone as far as I can go (which won't be super far with my custom water (I'm thinking 5.2 stable tops)) I will probably "auction" off this chip for those who have the hardware and knowledge to push this bad boy to it's limits







. I won't be looking to trade for an already binned chip because I'd rather just pickup another chip myself and chase the next highest OC I can get with that one. I enjoy the mystery haha.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I appreciate the offer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I've gotten more than a few PMs about this chip so far and I'll just tell you what I've told others. I'm not a big time bencher (frankly I don't have the high end hardware) or someone who really has a need to run a chip 5.0Ghz+ 24/7 (mostly just OC for gaming and some video rendering) so it's really just about the chase for me. That's really the fun part for me. Once I've gone as far as I can go (which won't be super far with my custom water (I'm thinking 5.2 stable tops)) I will probably "auction" off this chip for those who have the hardware and knowledge to push this bad boy to it's limits
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I won't be looking to trade for an already binned chip because I'd rather just pickup another chip myself and chase the next highest OC I can get with that one. I enjoy the mystery haha.


im sure you gonna make more money then you payed for it if you do..
i would think twice tho, before selling it again, its just a good feeling to have
a chip like that, and you know what it can do, i can run 4.8-4.9ghz tops with mine, 1.420V and 1.510V vcore
but run only 4646mhz daily oc 1.310V offset.. benching is just so much fun to do, but i dont have a great chip that way.. to make cinebench run at 5.1ghz i needed 1.610V vcore see ..lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im sure you gonna make more money then you payed for it if you do..
> i would think twice tho, before selling it again, its just a good feeling to have
> a chip like that, and you know what it can do, i can run 4.8-4.9ghz tops with mine, 1.420V and 1.510V vcore
> but run only 4646mhz daily oc 1.310V offset.. benching is just so much fun to do, but i dont have a great chip that way.. to make cinebench run at 5.1ghz i needed 1.610V vcore see ..lol


You're absolutely right about how much fun it is. And by no means have I decided to sell it. Like I've said all along, it would probably take an offer I couldn't refuse. At this point I'm just enjoying what I've been blessed with







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can have more success doing 3do benchies cause CPU benches will be dominated by know2 users and our delidded chips would be a good thing to have...for good 3do scores you need a stronger CPU with whatever card you choose to be competitive


----------



## Hokies83

Great Haswell Read.. Can not wait to get mine!

http://www.anandtech.com/print/6355

Somebody is buying my zx10 Sunday i may get a new case i sooooo Want a 80mm 480 rad...





Question is what cases support a 80 mm 480 rad.. guess i better ask in case section...

prolly just sell my cosmos 2... CM dropping the Ball on the side window has made me not want to support them as a case anymore.. i have only owned CM case for like 6-8 years.....


----------



## chris-br

I was wondering... Since stable playing all my games, and surfing the net, do i really need to test with prime? I will NEVER EVER FOLD. so whats the point for me to test for 24hrs?

I have been playing WOT and BF3 for hours and nor whea erros or crashes.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I was wondering... Since stable playing all my games, and surfing the net, do i really need to test with prime? I will NEVER EVER FOLD. so whats the point for me to test for 24hrs?


If what he said is true i would not even bother if everything u do runs fine do not even worry about it lol.


----------



## chris-br

heh, running 4,7 @ 1,415v.









and temps didnt pass 55C while playing. lol


----------



## Shaldome

Woot! My parts arrived and only two weeks after I ordered them!







Case arrived today and the rest of the parts on Wednesday. Of course I had to put the parts in my old case to "test them".
So tomorrow they will move to their new home in the Switch 810. I only did a slight overclock of the 3770k to 4.2 GHz which was no issue. My memory is stubborn to boot at anything above 1600 MHz though. Might do some tweaking in the weekend maybe. Now the question of when to delid it...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> Woot! My parts arrived and only two weeks after I ordered them!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Case arrived today and the rest of the parts on Wednesday. Of course I had to put the parts in my old case to "test them".
> So tomorrow they will move to their new home in the Switch 810. I only did a slight overclock of the 3770k to 4.2 GHz which was no issue. My memory is stubborn to boot at anything above 1600 MHz though. Might do some tweaking in the weekend maybe. Now the question of when to delid it...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Lol that case is an absolute monster. I thought my switch 810 was big and heavy but...DAMN!


----------



## Hokies83

Switch 810 is a baby lol Even the Cosmos 2 makes it look tiny.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Switch 810 is a baby lol Even the Cosmos 2 makes it look tiny.


Haha this is true. I've had a Cosmos S before that thing was pretty big as well. I'm just talking about my own experience though I know there are some huge cases out there. I just built an emulator box in a Bitfenix Prodigy and gotta say I'm liking how little of space it takes up







.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> That's a real solid chip still. Wouldn't trade that in for a luck of the draw run at it.
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> Good to know. I think I'll try to find a stable 5.2 with HT on. Yours took 1.52 Hokies? I dont' know if I'll be able to beat that in terms of getting in 100% stable.


Thanks!








it's the best I had (had 2 same ones from same batch 3224B), I think I will stick to it as daily 4.9GHz is plenty for me and can still bench 5.2 which is good enough.

however for 5.2 ... I can barely get that one stable with HT on up to 1.65V or so ... so it's not so safe on my chip as it is on yours








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Does anyone here know anything about ssd's... I can't find an answer anywhere. Anyway, my problem is that sometimes my raid 0 120gb intel 520 ssd's run at half speed. Sometimes in atto they get 1gbps, sometimes 500mbps. Before I switched to windows 8, I didn't format it manually, so I think that is the problem. I switched back to 7 and still half speed. Not only that, but I actually load slower than most people in games, 500mbps is still fast, but it does not seem i am getting that in games, before, I would always be the first, not the case anymore. I installed the drivers, and ya i'm running 6gbps intel ports with 6gbps cables. I think I need to secure erase or w/e its called... Any thoughts?


you have to turn OFF the C-states in CPU power saving features (C3, C6, C7, C-package, etc.), most SSDs suffer halved speeds with those on. if your MB has them on auto then BIOS decides when they get turned on or off depending on CPU load and such.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Not what i heard and have read in the past running your chip un stable destroys it.


never heard of it and based on own experience call it BS. I was running barely stable OCs daily on Q9450 for a long time and never had degradation problems because of that. I did have ocassional crashes under full load, yeah, hence why I always push towards rock solid stability to avoid potential OS corruption or wasted time.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> The main reason would probably be to never have to worry about your pc crashing due to instability, whatever you're doing


this!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha this is true. I've had a Cosmos S before that thing was pretty big as well. I'm just talking about my own experience though I know there are some huge cases out there. I just built an emulator box in a Bitfenix Prodigy and gotta say I'm liking how little of space it takes up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Little u say?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Little u say?


Nice! However I compromised a little on size because being able to run Dolphin at max settings (increased internal resolution and AA) was important to me. Therefore I needed to be able to OC my 3750k to 4.2+ so size was an issue in regards to cooling. My Prodigy would still fit on that shelf though







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Nice! However I compromised a little on size because being able to run Dolphin at max setttings (increased internal resolution and AA) was important to me. Therefore I needed to be able to OC my 3750k to 4.2+ so size was an issue in regards to cooling.


Meh i had this i5 750 up to 4.2ghz from stock 2.6ghz






But ive had this mofo on C list for 2 months for 350$ and i still got it.. lol people in my area are ******ed...


----------



## Shaldome

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Nice, but I would have to buy an E-ATX board for this case and add some more cards, otherwise it would look a bit to empty for my taste.


----------



## chris-br

yeah, that case is a monster.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> Nice, but I would have to buy an E-ATX board for this case and add some more cards, otherwise it would look a bit to empty for my taste.


LoL that case is 850$ lol.

It can do like 8 480 rads and 4 PSus and hold 2 systems at once and crap lol.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh i had this i5 750 up to 4.2ghz from stock 2.6ghz


Nice. What emu's do you run or is that just a HTPC?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Nice. What emu's do you run or is that just a HTPC?


It is an HTPC but i could game on it if i wanted to XD i have like 600 games on my main system and i can not play all of those let alone Emus lol.

People on my Local C list like to offer me 150$ = 200$

Then get mad when i call them ******ed fools and give them links to all the parts used and it tallys up to over 700$ heh


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is an HTPC but i could game on it if i wanted to XD i have like 600 games on my main system and i can not play all of those let alone Emus lol.
> People on my Local C list like to offer me 150$ = 200$
> Then get mad when i call them ******ed fools and give them links to all the parts used and it tallys up to over 700$ heh


Haha yea that's ******ed. I wonder if I'd have better luck being in the NYC area (bigger pool of people).

I don't play any of today's console games so when I have people over I like to be able to play multiplayer legacy games like N64 (goldeneye, maria kart, etc) and Super Smash Brother for gamecube. When it comse to console gaming nothing beats the old classics to me.


----------



## VonDutch

Well, in my hunt for answers about max vcore ...1 answer from intel,

"Thank you for contacting Intel® Technical Support.

I cannot assist you overclocking your processor. *You are free to overclock it, but we cannot give you any particular voltages*. Please visit this web site http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/gaming/overclocking/overclocking-intel-processors.html where you find some guidance overclocking your processor.

Please replay back this email; do not send a new one.

If you don't replay in the following 72 hours we will assume the issue has been resolved and we will close the ticket.

Kind Regards,"

the link brings me to a, "Overclocking Intel® Processors" site, "guidance"..yea thanks








still have the question posted in their forum, 153 views, no response ..lol
is it already safe to say that noone really knows what the max vcore for ivy is?

but the question is, above what vcore does ivy start to degrade?,
above 1.55V vcore, i think chances increase by alot,
under 1.5V there should be no degradation at all,
thats what another intel rep i talked to told me a while ago..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha yea that's ******ed. I wonder if I'd have better luck being in the NYC area (bigger pool of people).
> I don't play any of today's console games so when I have people over I like to be able to play multiplayer legacy games like N64 (goldeneye, maria kart, etc) and Super Smash Brother for gamecube. When it comse to console gaming nothing beats the old classics to me.


Yeah i enjoy alot of those.. played theu all the old FF games back when i had my Amd thunder bird back in the day.

I want an Xbox 360 EMU so i can play All the New Halos i have not played halo since Halo 2


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah i enjoy alot of those.. played theu all the old FF games back when i had my Amd thunder bird back in the day.
> I want an Xbox 360 EMU so i can play All the New Halos i have not played halo since Halo 2


Any word on when there might be one?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Any word on when there might be one?


There are some that "claim" to be but ive never tried them myself.


----------



## kgtuning

So my VCCSA is set at .925 volts... I update my bios and now VCCSA is now at 1.200 volts. What effect does it have on my overclock/stability?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> So my VCCSA is set at .925 volts... I update my bios and now VCCSA is now at 1.200 volts. What effect does it have on my overclock/stability?


potentially a very big one for CPU memory controller running high speeds. 1.20V should be good up to 2600MHz or so. does it stay at such value also when you run memory at default clock of 1333MHz? that would be unnecessary....

also if you can check VCCIO, it's said when it stays 0.05V below VCCSA voltage is best per stability and overclocking results.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> potentially a very big one for CPU memory controller running high speeds. 1.20V should be good up to 2600MHz or so. does it stay at such value also when you run memory at default clock of 1333MHz? that would be unnecessary....
> also if you can check VCCIO, it's said when it stays 0.05V below VCCSA voltage is best per stability and overclocking results.


once I set it, it stays at that voltage. I'll check VCCIO. so should I set VCCSA back up to 1.200?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> once I set it, it stays at that voltage. I'll check VCCIO. so should I set VCCSA back up to 1.200?


I don't know what ram you use. I use automatic 0.9v vccsa (and 1.05v vccio) for up to 2200MHz RAM when using 2x4GB config (it should be higher for running 4 sticks), above that I switch to 1.15V & 1.20V or higher just to rule out mem controller instability issues - actually m working on making my sticks run 2600MHz with CL11


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I don't know what ram you use. I use automatic 0.9v vccsa (and 1.05v vccio) for up to 2200MHz RAM when using 2x4GB config (it should be higher for running 4 sticks), above that I switch to 1.15V & 1.20V or higher just to rule out mem controller instability issues - actually m working on making my sticks run 2600MHz with CL11


oh I see so higher speed= vccsa, vccio voltage... I have 4X4 gb of ripjaws 1866 but running them at 2133 but can't break 2200 even when pulling 2 sticks. would love to get 2400mhz to go. I just how it was funny how just from a Bios update the vccsa went from a default .925 to a default 1.200.


----------



## Hokies83

Guy on Hard forum selling 3770ks for 250$ each.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I don't know what ram you use. I use automatic 0.9v vccsa (and 1.05v vccio) for up to 2200MHz RAM when using 2x4GB config (it should be higher for running 4 sticks), above that I switch to 1.15V & 1.20V or higher just to rule out mem controller instability issues - actually m working on making my sticks run 2600MHz with CL11


i use 0.925vccsa for 2400mhz ram at 4.8ghz stable. if itry to go to 5 ghz with out upping the vccsa it wont be stable. so i put my vccsa up to 1.107v and ive been stable for a few day now ran cinebench prime 95 2 hours. plan to make another 12 hr run @ 5ghz this time for the ivy stable club after i delid


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL that case is 850$ lol.
> It can do like 8 480 rads and 4 PSus and hold 2 systems at once and crap lol.


Just get my TH10, It can hold 7 480 rads at any thickness without and mods, if you dont use a disc drive 8 480 rads, with an optional top 2 more, with a bottom 4 more, no case holds 14 480 any thickness rads with no mod and all internal LOL. Except something like the tx10 which is bigger than your dishwasher, mine comes close, and is really light...Also holds ant size mobo and 2 psus and all the room for ssds disc drives and water cooling stuff.

Plus a giant window, if you dont want that max 16 480rads... go to my profile to see it.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Guy on Hard forum selling 3770ks for 250$ each.


microcenter is still 229.00


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> microcenter is still 229.00


For the 75% of americans with NO mc with in an Hours drive


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> For the 75% of americans with NO mc with in an Hours drive


good point


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i use 0.925vccsa for 2400mhz ram at 4.8ghz stable. if itry to go to 5 ghz with out upping the vccsa it wont be stable. so i put my vccsa up to 1.107v and ive been stable for a few day now ran cinebench prime 95 2 hours. plan to make another 12 hr run @ 5ghz this time for the ivy stable club after i delid


I'm currently running 4 sticks of 1866Mhz G.Skill with 9-10-9-28 1t timings. If I purchase 2 x 8GB sticks of 2400-2600Mhz RAM, do you folks think I would be able to lower the voltage my 3770K needs @ 4.8Ghz? I just finished a 13 hour prime 27.7 run @ 4.8Ghz 1.32v. Thoughts?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can have more success doing 3do benchies cause CPU benches will be dominated by know2 users and our delidded chips would be a good thing to have...for good 3do scores you need a stronger CPU with whatever card you choose to be competitive


Run aquamark. That will show your cpu performance with video card as well. Or do pcmark 06 or something.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If what he said is true i would not even bother if everything u do runs fine do not even worry about it lol.


Exactly. If it runs what you want it to. Then good enough.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Switch 810 is a baby lol Even the Cosmos 2 makes it look tiny.


I love my cosmos 2. I really want to do a super build this summer in mine. Get some crazy water cooling going in this thing. Dual 60mm 240s in the bottom and a giant 80 mm in the top inlaid into the ceiling and spot welded nice and good in there, the put a 200 in the front for a intake as well then throw a dual super thick 120 or 140mm rad system on the exhaust and do a dual pump inlay system as well then have a nice frozenQ 250mm helix res with acid green uv tubes and my hosing will be uv green as well with uv lights everywhere making this thing look badass. All with my soon to be modded side panel with a window.

Lol you people and your 14 480 rads I can beat that any day. There's a case I saw a while back that I wanted to do a wc rig in and it could hold 43 480 80mm rads. Was amazing. Also if you really want a good wc rig. Then just get a 360x360 rad and do a mineral oil rig. It cools so freaking well and is perfect for gpus.

Or just get a table and put over 80 480s on it. Hokies if you want a few rads that pump wont do ot and if your getting a big case then get a mcp655 pump and get some real performance on it instead of the cpu based pump. But that's just me.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Run aquamark. That will show your cpu performance with video card as well. Or do pcmark 06 or something.
> Exactly. If it runs what you want it to. Then good enough.
> I love my cosmos 2. I really want to do a super build this summer in mine. Get some crazy water cooling going in this thing. Dual 60mm 240s in the bottom and a giant 80 mm in the top inlaid into the ceiling and spot welded nice and good in there, the put a 200 in the front for a intake as well then throw a dual super thick 120 or 140mm rad system on the exhaust and do a dual pump inlay system as well then have a nice frozenQ 250mm helix res with acid green uv tubes and my hosing will be uv green as well with uv lights everywhere making this thing look badass. All with my soon to be modded side panel with a window.
> Lol you people and your 14 480 rads I can beat that any day. There's a case I saw a while back that I wanted to do a wc rig in and it could hold 43 480 80mm rads. Was amazing. Also if you really want a good wc rig. Then just get a 360x360 rad and do a mineral oil rig. It cools so freaking well and is perfect for gpus.
> Or just get a table and put over 80 480s on it. Hokies if you want a few rads that pump wont do ot and if your getting a big case then get a mcp655 pump and get some real performance on it instead of the cpu based pump. But that's just me.


The pump in the Drive II is a monster bro.. it can hold up 2 80mm 480 rads no probs.

Motor type Electronically commutated, brushless DC, spherical motor
Nominal voltage 12 V DC
Operating voltage range 9 to 13.4 VDC
Max. nominal power (@12 V) 18 W
Max. nominal current (@12 V) 1.5 A
Max. nominal head (@12 V) 14.7 ft (4.4m)
Max nominal discharge (@12 V) ~ *4.75 GPM* (17.5 LPM)
Maximum pressure 22 PSI (1.5 BAR)
Temperature range Up to 140 °F (60 °C)
Electrical power connector Molex 4 pin
PWM + RPM Signals 4-pin connector
Speed adjustment range 1300 to 4500 rpm

Can pump almost 5 gallons a min lmao.

Still have not heard back from gomi...

Most likely ill get that a the 240 rad with built in res and get the MOnsta 240 80mm and call it a day.. use my 15 dba fans and run pump on Low..

It is enough for a cpu and 2 gpus easy.. im just going to cool the cpu with ot however.. i do not like having to deal with the cpu water blocks every gen.. When i can just lapp non Ref cards put Liquid ultra on them and drop temps 15 c heh.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The pump in the Drive II is a monster bro.. it can hold up 2 80mm 480 rads no probs.
> Motor type Electronically commutated, brushless DC, spherical motor
> Nominal voltage 12 V DC
> Operating voltage range 9 to 13.4 VDC
> Max. nominal power (@12 V) 18 W
> Max. nominal current (@12 V) 1.5 A
> Max. nominal head (@12 V) 14.7 ft (4.4m)
> Max nominal discharge (@12 V) ~ *4.75 GPM* (17.5 LPM)
> Maximum pressure 22 PSI (1.5 BAR)
> Temperature range Up to 140 °F (60 °C)
> Electrical power connector Molex 4 pin
> PWM + RPM Signals 4-pin connector
> Speed adjustment range 1300 to 4500 rpm
> Can pump almost 5 gallons a min lmao.
> Still have not heard back from gomi...
> Most likely ill get that a the 240 rad with built in res and get the MOnsta 240 80mm and call it a day.. use my 15 dba fans and run pump on Low..
> It is enough for a cpu and 2 gpus easy.. im just going to cool the cpu with ot however.. i do not like having to deal with the cpu water blocks every gen.. When i can just lapp non Ref cards put Liquid ultra on them and drop temps 15 c heh.


Okay just makin sure. Don't want to see 400 bucks not pumping right lol. Yeah 5 gpm is good. The mcp655 I want is around 8 or 13 I THINK complete balpark guess here on my end if im wrong welp I haven't looked at wc stuff for around 4 months.


----------



## kgtuning

http://www.frozencpu.com/images/awards/pumpchartpdf.pdf

5.28 gal/minute on my D5/ mcp655.....13 feet of head pressure


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/images/awards/pumpchartpdf.pdf
> 5.28 gal/minute on my D5/ mcp655.....13 feet of head pressure


Like I said I tried lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/images/awards/pumpchartpdf.pdf
> 5.28 gal/minute on my D5/ mcp655.....13 feet of head pressure


Like I said I tried lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay just makin sure. Don't want to see 400 bucks not pumping right lol. Yeah 5 gpm is good. The mcp655 I want is around 8 or 13 I THINK complete balpark guess here on my end if im wrong welp I haven't looked at wc stuff for around 4 months.


MCP: 3.9 gpm (= 240 gph) (100%)
MCP/Rad (custom*): 3.4 gpm (87%)
MCP/Storm/Rad: 1.6 gpm (40%)
MCP/Rad/MCP/Storm: 2.1 gpm (52%)

Setting v RPM data found on a German OC forum:
P1 = 1800 RPM
P2 = 2550 RPM
P3 = 3300 RPM
P4 = 4050 RPM
P5 = 4800 RPM

Its slower @[email protected]

Any ways u never want more then 1.5 GPM any who.

My loop i had on my X58 used a MCP355

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/images/awards/pumpchartpdf.pdf
> 5.28 gal/minute on my D5/ mcp655.....13 feet of head pressure


thats the new version,,

Still the Drive II pump is a monster and could prolly push 3 480 rads...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I know I'm a bit late, but stability has nothing to do with whether it degrades or not. Degradation is all to do with voltage and heat. Physical quantities which have a dangerous effect on the material of which the die is made. Instability is due to incomplete switching of transistors at high speeds, this does not cause any physical damage.
> I could run my chip at an unstable overclock for years and, provided the volts were fine and the temps were good, it would be just as good as the day I got it after all those years.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> There is a reason people shoot to be stable if there was not.. everybody would be happy with "Kinda stable" FTW 420 would prolly know.. i have not heard much about un stable chips dieing from it since X58.


I also don't think instability degrades or damages the cpu at all, it can put a hurting on the OS after a while. Most OCNers install an OS, set an overclock, & then never change anything until they get a new rig or hardware, makes sense for them to be completely stable so they can just use the machine & not have to worry about reinstalling windows in the future (if it is unstable enough to corrupt the OS).
Some of us tinker with the machines constantly, it makes little sense to run 24 hours of prime 95 for an overclock that will likely be changed less than 24 hours later.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm currently running 4 sticks of 1866Mhz G.Skill with 9-10-9-28 1t timings. If I purchase 2 x 8GB sticks of 2400-2600Mhz RAM, do you folks think I would be able to lower the voltage my 3770K needs @ 4.8Ghz? I just finished a 13 hour prime 27.7 run @ 4.8Ghz 1.32v. Thoughts?


With sandy & ivy memory clocks are pretty independent of cpu (unless changing bclk). With a better memory kit memory should clock better, but would probably make no difference to the vcore the cpu needs (cpu IMC might have different requirements). 4.8 at 1.32 is pretty good, chip I'm using right now is at 4.8 at 1.4V.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Guy on Hard forum selling 3770ks for 250$ each.
> 
> 
> 
> microcenter is still 229.00
Click to expand...

Does anyone know why Microcenter can price their CPUs so low???


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Does anyone know why Microcenter can price their CPUs so low???


There not making any money off them id say...

It is to get u into the door in hopes u buy other things...

You just have no Idea all the free advertising they get across the net for doing that... bet it pays for it's self 10 fold.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Does anyone know why Microcenter can price their CPUs so low???
> 
> 
> 
> There not making any money off them id say...
> 
> It is to get u into the door in hopes u buy other things...
> 
> You just have no Idea all the free advertising they get across the net for doing that... bet it pays for it's self 10 fold.
Click to expand...

That could be true, but they then have package deals where you can get a CPU at that lowest of low prices plus a motherboard at $40 or $50 off! And the price of the motherboard was already same or better than the Fry's here.

Just wondering how they do it because I like to take advantage of those deals and still do not find my regular shopping for other stuff there (HD, SDD, Mem) to be any higher than Fry's either.

Not complaining or anything, I just wonder how they do it.....


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That could be true, but they then have package deals where you can get a CPU at that lowest of low prices plus a motherboard at $40 or $50 off! And the price of the motherboard was already same or better than the Fry's here.
> Just wondering how they do it because I like to take advantage of those deals and still do not find my regular shopping for other stuff there (HD, SDD, Mem) to be any higher than Fry's either.
> Not complaining or anything, I just wonder how they do it.....


Yea I'd love to know as well but I guess I don't really care haha. I used to travel an hour to the one in Patterson, NJ but when the one in Yonkers, NY opened up it was a godsend as it's 15 minutes away. The only problem is the constant urge to swing by there for the hell of it. Not good for the wallet







.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/images/awards/pumpchartpdf.pdf
> 5.28 gal/minute on my D5/ mcp655.....13 feet of head pressure


That pump is amazing, and I got the 1 with speed control which is 1 step faster than the one without it. And my EK top added more head pressure, can't hear it at max speed.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> That pump is amazing, and I got the 1 with speed control which is 1 step faster than the one without it. And my EK top added more head pressure, can't hear it at max speed.


Completely agree. I've had my D5 running 24/7 for going on 5 years now and it's still running strong. Can't hear the thing at all really as the only sound coming from my case is some low noise from my AP-15's.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I'd love to know as well but I guess I don't really care haha. I used to travel an hour to the one in Patterson, NJ but when the one in Yonkers, NY opened up it was a godsend as it's 15 minutes away. The only problem is the constant urge to swing by there for the hell of it. Not good for the wallet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Yea that's rough, although you have to at least be happy you have the option to go on a road trip. Some people are just plain SOL.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I'd love to know as well but I guess I don't really care haha. I used to travel an hour to the one in Patterson, NJ but when the one in Yonkers, NY opened up it was a godsend as it's 15 minutes away. The only problem is the constant urge to swing by there for the hell of it. Not good for the wallet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

Yeah *PuffinMyLye*, I have the same problem!









Sorry about that *Hokies83*. I wish you had one too....









Still hoping someone on here has some good info on how they really do it, or is it true that they are just willing to lose money on them to get us into their stores...cause it sure works on me!!! LOL


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea that's rough, although you have to at least be happy you have the option to go on a road trip. Some people are just plain SOL.


Think ill just send u and have u mail it to me XD

Sin8022 used to do it for me..

Since hes went back to School at GA Tech he does not even talk to me that much anymore lol.. busy beaver now.


----------



## DADDYDC650

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I also don't think instability degrades or damages the cpu at all, it can put a hurting on the OS after a while. Most OCNers install an OS, set an overclock, & then never change anything until they get a new rig or hardware, makes sense for them to be completely stable so they can just use the machine & not have to worry about reinstalling windows in the future (if it is unstable enough to corrupt the OS).
> Some of us tinker with the machines constantly, it makes little sense to run 24 hours of prime 95 for an overclock that will likely be changed less than 24 hours later.
> With sandy & ivy memory clocks are pretty independent of cpu (unless changing bclk). With a better memory kit memory should clock better, but would probably make no difference to the vcore the cpu needs (cpu IMC might have different requirements). 4.8 at 1.32 is pretty good, chip I'm using right now is at 4.8 at 1.4V.


I always thought a Sandy/Ivy CPU needed a tiny bit more voltage when overclocking with 4 sticks of RAM installed.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Think ill just send u and have u mail it to me XD
> Sin8022 used to do it for me..
> Since hes went back to School at GA Tech he does not even talk to me that much anymore lol.. busy beaver now.


From now on whenever I make a MC run I'll try to make a quick post to see if anyone wants me to pick them up something. I'd be willing to pickup and ship out just about anything for those who are willing to make it worth my while (pay for shipping plus maybe a little extra for gas, etc.).


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> From now on whenever I make a MC run I'll try to make a quick post to see if anyone wants me to pick them up something. I'd be willing to pickup and ship out just about anything for those who are willing to make it worth my while (pay for shipping plus maybe a little extra for gas, etc.).


Yah will not cost much to ship to me maybe 2$ id just want the cpu in it's litle plastic cover lol maybe in a small bubble mailer lol.

I was trying to get some of those 99$ 2500ks heh.. Sin was MIA...

Was gona replace my 3770k with one and ride it out with that till Haswell lol.

get 300$ for 3770k minus 100$ for i5 2500k leaves me with 200$ for 4770k..

Buy 4770k re place 2500k sell 2500k for 140$ now id have 340$ for 4770k which should just about pay for it.. free cpu upgrade...

Sell g1 sniper 3 180$ buy the new 1150 UD5H keep same ram done.. free upgrade....

There is reason behind my madness....


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Still hoping someone on here has some good info on how they really do it, or is it true that they are just willing to lose money on them to get us into their stores...cause it sure works on me!!! LOL


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_leader


----------



## enigma7820

thinking about delidding again, but last time I used mx-4 on die and IHS and didn't have better temps at all. its seems I have a voltage hungry chip because I need 1.312 for 4.5 stable here is a screen shot, BTW I just order liquid pro ultra incase I do it again this time.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah will not cost much to ship to me maybe 2$ id just want the cpu in it's litle plastic cover lol maybe in a small bubble mailer lol.
> I was trying to get some of those 99$ 2500ks heh.. Sin was MIA...
> Was gona replace my 3770k with one and ride it out with that till Haswell lol.
> get 300$ for 3770k minus 100$ for i5 2500k leaves me with 200$ for 4770k..
> Buy 4770k re place 2500k sell 2500k for 140$ now id have 340$ for 4770k which should just about pay for it.. free cpu upgrade...
> Sell g1 sniper 3 180$ buy the new 1150 UD5H keep same ram done.. free upgrade....
> There is reason behind my madness....


Haha that sounded like a pretty good plan right there.

What I've been most pleasantly surprised about the last few times I've gone to MC is the amount of quality WC components they're starting stock, it's really come along.


----------



## stickg1

I got a free 7970 upgrade! Scored a bunch of parts for cheap sold most and sold my 7870 and came out with a 7970 and nothing out of pocket. Just a little investment up front!


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> thinking about delidding again, but last time I used mx-4 on die and IHS and didn't have better temps at all. its seems I have a voltage hungry chip because I need 1.312 for 4.5 stable here is a screen shot, BTW I just order *liquid pro ultra* incase I do it again this time.


There's no such thing. You either ordered Pro *or* Ultra. Which was it?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Still hoping someone on here has some good info on how they really do it, or is it true that they are just willing to lose money on them to get us into their stores...cause it sure works on me!!! LOL
> 
> 
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_leader
Click to expand...

Yeah. That's what Hokies83 was saying, and it does work for me going into their store. LOL But it sure is a big discount for that. They could still have effect with less of a discount. I thought maybe besides that, that they may also have a special relationship with Intel or something to still allow them to keep some margin. Was just wondering if there was someone who saw some business writeup on Micorcenter saying exactly what it was..... Probably just as your two noted.....


----------



## Hokies83

Most likely there selling them at cost and not losing anything on them.

I bet the Retail edge prices is what Vendors really pay for these chips.


----------



## enigma7820

I ordered the newer stuff the one you dont have to sand off the with the blue cap.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I ordered the newer stuff the one you dont have to sand off the with the blue cap.


Ultra.


----------



## Arm3nian

Still problems with my raid 0...

Secure erased with parted magic 3 times, deleted and created a new raid array 3 times, installed windows 8 this time, installed IRST which comes with the drivers, mobo bios is latest, ssd firmware is latest, optimized and defragged through the windows 8 thing, tweaked it, ssds are at 100% health according to intel ssd toolbox, using sata 6gbps cables on both, both connected to the gray intel sata ports. I have no idea what my problem is, it was working fine, then somehow boom half speeds at RANDOM times, the first time I booted windows 8 I got normal 1100mbps speeds, couple reboots later half speed. Just ***... and also, when they are running at full speed some of my games still load slower than the time where I didn't have this problem.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Still problems with my raid 0...
> Secure erased with parted magic 3 times, deleted and created a new raid array 3 times, installed windows 8 this time, installed IRST which comes with the drivers, mobo bios is latest, ssd firmware is latest, optimized and defragged through the windows 8 thing, tweaked it, ssds are at 100% health according to intel ssd toolbox, using sata 6gbps cables on both, both connected to the gray intel sata ports. I have no idea what my problem is, it was working fine, then somehow boom half speeds at RANDOM times, the first time I booted windows 8 I got normal 1100mbps speeds, couple reboots later half speed. Just ***... and also, when they are running at full speed some of my games still load slower than the time where I didn't have this problem.


What games? Because if your playing a game like LoL....that's all completely based on your connection speed.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I got normal 1100mbps speeds


No. Just no.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey what you doing here fellow ocf'er?
and your 2600k?


----------



## dmanstasiu




----------



## ivanlabrie

You plan on a sidegrade? I did it...from 2600k to 3770k (and it was actually a trade )


----------



## dmanstasiu

I'm considering it. If a 3770k appears for the right price


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> No. Just no.


Lol it is quite slow compared to l1 cache at 150gbps









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What games? Because if your playing a game like LoL....that's all completely based on your connection speed.


All of them man. I don't get what could be causing this. I mean its either driver related or the mobo itself.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Lol it is quite slow compared to l1 cache at 150gbps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All of them man. I don't get what could be causing this. I mean its either driver related or the mobo itself.


His point was that if you're playing games whose loading times depend on the speed of your internet, then the loading times could be completely irrelevant to your hardware and simply a latency issue


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> His point was that if you're playing games whose loading times depend on the speed of your internet, then the loading times could be completely irrelevant to your hardware and simply a latency issue


Ya but my internet speed didn't change. So I know my own loading times.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm currently running 4 sticks of 1866Mhz G.Skill with 9-10-9-28 1t timings. If I purchase 2 x 8GB sticks of 2400-2600Mhz RAM, do you folks think I would be able to lower the voltage my 3770K needs @ 4.8Ghz? I just finished a 13 hour prime 27.7 run @ 4.8Ghz 1.32v. Thoughts?


never heard of changing ram, can make your vcore lower for a oc,
only the difference between 2 and 4 sticks _might_ need some adjustments
to imc and vtt.. but i dont have 4 sticks yet, so can really tell..
and 1.32V vcore for 4.8ghz is very nice , no worries...

o, i was thinking about that, whats best,
running 2x8gb or 4x4gb ram?
could run into more "trouble" with 4 sticks?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> His point was that if you're playing games whose loading times depend on the speed of your internet, then the loading times could be completely irrelevant to your hardware and simply a latency issue


Exactly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ya but my internet speed didn't change. So I know my own loading times.


Its not the internet speed that the issue usually. Its the darn ping. The time for your info to travel basically. Farther you are from the hub the bigger the ping and also on the internet speed factors in as well. If your playing games like portal 2 and having long load times then id worry. But that is software driver as well sadly.

But for the hardware I bet you its the mobo. For a cheaper ws mobo I gaurantee you the raid drivers in them aren't the greatest of things. Raid inlaid mobo chips are exspensive little buggers. You could get a good raid card and have pcie 3.0 lane speed connections which is absolutely crazy, or just get a better mobo and get some great raid board really. What did you get the raid 0 going for anyways?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Exactly.
> Its not the internet speed that the issue usually. Its the darn ping. The time for your info to travel basically. Farther you are from the hub the bigger the ping and also on the internet speed factors in as well. If your playing games like portal 2 and having long load times then id worry. But that is software driver as well sadly.
> But for the hardware I bet you its the mobo. For a cheaper ws mobo I gaurantee you the raid drivers in them aren't the greatest of things. Raid inlaid mobo chips are exspensive little buggers. You could get a good raid card and have pcie 3.0 lane speed connections which is absolutely crazy, or just get a better mobo and get some great raid board really. What did you get the raid 0 going for anyways?


I have 14ping in games lol. Anyway, aren't the drivers in it by intel anyway. I got raid 0 because it's amazing. Fast installs, fast loads. People say you can't notice the difference in the real world... Trust me you can notice it a lot. Idc about failure rate doubling, its so fast I can reinstall everything LOL. I've formatted them like 20 times.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I have 14ping in games lol. Anyway, aren't the drivers in it by intel anyway. I got raid 0 because it's amazing. Fast installs, fast loads. People say you can't notice the difference in the real world... Trust me you can notice it a lot. Idc about failure rate doubling, its so fast I can reinstall everything LOL. I've formatted them like 20 times.


Thens it going to have to be the internal hardware chips on the mobob itselfs raid support strength. If its done it a few times then it makes it apparent it can do it. But just can't pump enough out to do it consistently. You running windows 8 or 7?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thens it going to have to be the internal hardware chips on the mobob itselfs raid support strength. If its done it a few times then it makes it apparent it can do it. But just can't pump enough out to do it consistently. You running windows 8 or 7?


I tried it on both same problem. It was always working fine before delid and watercooling thats the point.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thens it going to have to be the internal hardware chips on the mobob itselfs raid support strength. If its done it a few times then it makes it apparent it can do it. But just can't pump enough out to do it consistently. You running windows 8 or 7?


I tried it on both same problem. It was always working fine before delid and watercooling thats the point.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thens it going to have to be the internal hardware chips on the mobob itselfs raid support strength. If its done it a few times then it makes it apparent it can do it. But just can't pump enough out to do it consistently. You running windows 8 or 7?
> 
> 
> 
> I tried it on both same problem. It was always working fine before delid and watercooling thats the point.
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear about your troubles now. It may have happened during or after, but it may not have been caused by it. Probably something that happened during the process if anything. A delid should only affect temps unless the pcb was damaged, and that has only effected ability to POST or ram issues so far. Never heard of a problem like you are noting.

Have you done some basic diags? Run mem tests? Tested internet speed programs? Seen anything else besides what your noting to try to narrow the problem further? Change anything else besides just delid and cooling? Might be what you see is a symptom that further testing might uncover root cause. People here may need more data to help. What are we sure works, and what is everything it now has problems with?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> oh I see so higher speed= vccsa, vccio voltage... I have 4X4 gb of ripjaws 1866 but running them at 2133 but can't break 2200 even when pulling 2 sticks. would love to get 2400mhz to go. I just how it was funny how just from a Bios update the vccsa went from a default .925 to a default 1.200.


then your former BIOS was improperly adjusting VCCSA & VCCIO for the 4-stick configuration, I think.
Mine was using like 1.05v vccsa & 1.10 VCCIO whenever running 4 sticks, even at stock clocks and XMP.

how do you overclock them? just by increasing the speed and loosening timings? try also adding more vdimm (e.g. 0.05v more), also use 2-sticks for easier overclocking, timings for 4 sticks are usually different then for 2-stick config (or barely (un)stable at same config).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i use 0.925vccsa for 2400mhz ram at 4.8ghz stable. if itry to go to 5 ghz with out upping the vccsa it wont be stable. so i put my vccsa up to 1.107v and ive been stable for a few day now ran cinebench prime 95 2 hours. plan to make another 12 hr run @ 5ghz this time for the ivy stable club after i delid


yeah, but I'm running 4.9GHz daily, so I just up it manually ... don't want borderling stability errors coming god knows from where under memtest over night








I believe with my former daily 4.7 I was using automatic vccio & vccsa up to 2400mhz as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> For the 75% of americans with NO mc with in an Hours drive


Do you have Fry's nearby by any chance? they price match MC.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DADDYDC650*
> 
> I'm currently running 4 sticks of 1866Mhz G.Skill with 9-10-9-28 1t timings. If I purchase 2 x 8GB sticks of 2400-2600Mhz RAM, do you folks think I would be able to lower the voltage my 3770K needs @ 4.8Ghz? I just finished a 13 hour prime 27.7 run @ 4.8Ghz 1.32v. Thoughts?


4 stick setups over clock poorer than 2-stick setups, I'd definitely go for 2x8GB at stock high speed, because one also doesn't really know how those new 2x8GB OC (or how much of headroom they have, not much probably).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I'd love to know as well but I guess I don't really care haha. I used to travel an hour to the one in Patterson, NJ but when the one in Yonkers, NY opened up it was a godsend as it's 15 minutes away. The only problem is the constant urge to swing by there for the hell of it. Not good for the wallet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


hehe, the one in Paterson, NJ is where I come from time to time ... now I am thinking about going to "yours" for that 3230B chip haha ... nah I am trying to resist, my wife and my wallet do not agree with my wishes apparently







... hey they also opened up a new one in Long Island ... a 3rd MC within 1 hour drive [







]


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> then your former BIOS was improperly adjusting VCCSA & VCCIO for the 4-stick configuration, I think.
> Mine was using like 1.05v vccsa & 1.10 VCCIO whenever running 4 sticks, even at stock clocks and XMP.
> how do you overclock them? just by increasing the speed and loosening timings? try also adding more vdimm (e.g. 0.05v more), also use 2-sticks for easier overclocking, timings for 4 sticks are usually different then for 2-stick config (or barely (un)stable at same config).


I see and did not know that. this is my first build and first overclocking adventure. I bumped the speed up then loosen the timings then tighten them til it failed all while adding voltage. currently at 1.65 volts.


----------



## Hokies83

Closest thing i have is a Comp USa and that is still 2 hrs away lol and in another state...

Just snagged one of these for 90$ with compression fittings...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hehe, the one in Paterson, NJ is where I come from time to time ... now I am thinking about going to "yours" for that 3230B chip haha ... nah I am trying to resist, my wife and my wallet do not agree with my wishes apparently
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... hey they also opened up a new one in Long Island ... a 3rd MC within 1 hour drive [
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]


Yea I'm pretty lucky in that I have 3 within a 1 hour drive of me so I can go to whichever based on the stock they have available. I guess that's one of the advantages of living in the tri-state area







.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Closest thing i have is a Comp USa and that is still 2 hrs away lol and in another state...
> Just snagged one of these for 90$ with compression fittings...


What is it? Does it cook bacon? It'd be a lot cooler if it did.


----------



## snelan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What is it? Does it cook bacon? It'd be a lot cooler if it did.


http://www.swiftech.com/ApogeeDrive2.aspx

Considering it's integrated, I would just use that DC10(???) you have sitting there. Usually integrated pumps do not perform well. However, I have been out of the W/C world for quite a while now so I am speaking out of ignorance.

Also, I guess it's the only option if you don't have a stand alone block.

One again, out of ignorance.









EDIT: Oh, you can use it with a pump, forget everything I just said, that's pretty cool.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> http://www.swiftech.com/ApogeeDrive2.aspx
> Considering it's integrated, I would just use that DC10(???) you have sitting there. Usually integrated pumps do not perform well. However, I have been out of the W/C world for quite a while now so I am speaking out of ignorance.
> Also, I guess it's the only option if you don't have a stand alone block.
> One again, out of ignorance.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Oh, you can use it with a pump, forget everything I just said, that's pretty cool.


The pump it comes with does 5 gal a min it is almost as good as a mcp 655.. this thing is the real deal.... i will be using 3/4 tubing aswell..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What is it? Does it cook bacon? It'd be a lot cooler if it did.


----------



## stickg1

Hey that's pretty cool! Let us know how it works out.

I was hoping my Liquid Pro would get here today, I doesn't look like its going to happen. I was going to be switching PSUs today and wanted to finish everything at once while I already had my motherboard out. Oh well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hey that's pretty cool! Let us know how it works out.
> I was hoping my Liquid Pro would get here today, I doesn't look like its going to happen. I was going to be switching PSUs today and wanted to finish everything at once while I already had my motherboard out. Oh well.


Router should have been there today tho


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Router should have been there today tho


I didn't get that today either though.









USPS is flaky around here. There was one day I had a few things coming and I was home all day and the mail never even came. I went down to the post office the next day to complain and the lady said my mailman is subcontracted and if he doesn't show up to work I don't get my mail. The mail will come anytime between 11am and 7pm, its crazy.


----------



## Nyghtryder_9

I was wondering, is it normal to see a different amount of temp drop throughout the cores when it been delided? Reason I'm asking is I just did mine and after a 2hr run on prime blend I see a 15-16 drop on core 1-2, and a 4-6 drop on 3-4. I used Liquid pro ultra on the die and used IC diamond on the heatspreader ( same as when it wasnt delided ).


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nyghtryder_9*
> 
> I was wondering, is it normal to see a different amount of temp drop throughout the cores when it been delided? Reason I'm asking is I just did mine and after a 2hr run on prime blend I see a 15-16 drop on core 1-2, and a 4-6 drop on 3-4. I used Liquid pro ultra on the die and used IC diamond on the heatspreader ( same as when it wasnt delided ).


Seems not right. I'd check mount and TIM if that was my system.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Just to clarify, to everyone who is concerned, the pump in Hokies waterblock is the MCP35X, a PWM version of the DDC3.2. It is made by the same people as the D5 and it is considered better in high restriction loops because of it's higher head pressure. Although it can be slightly noisier and has been in the past less reliable because it isn't watercooled like a D5, but the heatsink solves that particular problem.


----------



## Nyghtryder_9

Well see thats what realtemp is showing ( I really dont like using that program ). But on Aida64 it shows all core within 1c and shows a consistent drop of 8c thru all cores from before. But why is real temp showing so much different?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I didn't get that today either though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> USPS is flaky around here. There was one day I had a few things coming and I was home all day and the mail never even came. I went down to the post office the next day to complain and the lady said my mailman is subcontracted and if he doesn't show up to work I don't get my mail. The mail will come anytime between 11am and 7pm, its crazy.


Out for Delivery

December 15, 2012, 11:55 am

BLUFFTON, SC 29910

lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Just to clarify, to everyone who is concerned, the pump in Hokies waterblock is the MCP35X, a PWM version of the DDC3.2. It is made by the same people as the D5 and it is considered better in high restriction loops because of it's higher head pressure. Although it can be slightly noisier and has been in the past less reliable because it isn't watercooled like a D5, but the heatsink solves that particular problem.


Heh now to figure out what brand tubing to go with.. i have not bought tubing in like 5 years lol.. And jeez 2 g 1/4 1/2 id 3/4 od fittings are almost 20$ wow...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Closest thing i have is a Comp USa and that is still 2 hrs away lol and in another state...
> Just snagged one of these for 90$ with compression fittings...


ouch! I thought Virginia is pretty well surrounded by all stores ... kinda sucks ... you have CompUSA still alive over there? ours bankrupted long time ago and were liquidated ... I thought they are online business only nowadays ...
that is a pretty cool kit you snagged








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I see and did not know that. this is my first build and first overclocking adventure. I bumped the speed up then loosen the timings then tighten them til it failed all while adding voltage. currently at 1.65 volts.


yup, when 1.65V is your stock XMP voltage, then you can safely add 0.05v to it and retest higher speed and loosened timings, some sticks are rated nearly at their OC'ing limits though (*cough*Corsair*cough*), but after you raise voltage and loosen timings you should find where it can go stable - always memtest them for at least 8-12 passes to make sure they won't corrupt your OS at such settings. the fact it boots Windows at such settings is meaningless ... trust only Memtest86+ 4.20 over night, nothing else.
if stock is 1.65V then probably 1.80V is max they can take, but google it first, check double-check and triple-check always before you do try that!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I'm pretty lucky in that I have 3 within a 1 hour drive of me so I can go to whichever based on the stock they have available. I guess that's one of the advantages of living in the tri-state area
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


yeah, that's pretty cool, I've never been to others though since I am living in NJ I'd have to pay the damn tunnel/bridge tolls ($12-$15) whenever going to those located in NY ... but I considered visiting them in past ...


----------



## snelan

Replaced the Die-IHS TIM with Liquid Pro, from MX-4

In summary:

Tests done at 4.6GHz, 1.308VCore

Die- > MX-4 -> IHS -> MX-4 -> D14 = 83c max

Die -> Liquid Pro -> IHS -> MX-4 -> D14 = 63c max

I would call that a sucess! 20c drops just from changing TIM even after delid!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nyghtryder_9*
> 
> I was wondering, is it normal to see a different amount of temp drop throughout the cores when it been delided? Reason I'm asking is I just did mine and after a 2hr run on prime blend I see a 15-16 drop on core 1-2, and a 4-6 drop on 3-4. I used Liquid pro ultra on the die and used IC diamond on the heatspreader ( same as when it wasnt delided ).


I bet you either have a messy IHS where its concave on the inside to convex on the top so that cores 3 and 4 will not have great connectivity. So for this take the IHS off again and take a pic of the TIM application for us to help you more. I bet you either have to to much or not enough TIM on the die.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nyghtryder_9*
> 
> Well see thats what realtemp is showing ( I really dont like using that program ). But on Aida64 it shows all core within 1c and shows a consistent drop of 8c thru all cores from before. But why is real temp showing so much different?


Realtemp is the best program that doesn temps without a prode. I have no idea as to how the programs do this


----------



## Hokies83

Looking at this tubing http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12807/ex-tub-840/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_PRO_LRT_Tubing_12ID_34OD_with_18_Wall_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_UV_Red_PFLEXP10-34-R.html?tl=g30c99s1614


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> Replaced the Die-IHS TIM with Liquid Pro, from MX-4
> In summary:
> Tests done at 4.6GHz, 1.308VCore
> Die- > MX-4 -> IHS -> MX-4 -> D14 = 83c max
> Die -> Liquid Pro -> IHS -> MX-4 -> D14 = 63c max
> I would call that a sucess! 20c drops just from changing TIM even after delid!


Thats why we all use it


----------



## Nyghtryder_9

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I bet you either have a messy IHS where its concave on the inside to convex on the top so that cores 3 and 4 will not have great connectivity. So for this take the IHS off again and take a pic of the TIM application for us to help you more. I bet you either have to to much or not enough TIM on the die.
> Realtemp is the best program that doesn temps without a prode. I have no idea as to how the programs do this


So I went back and redid it. The first go around I didnt put any liquid ultra on the ihs itself , so i thought that would be the culprit.
Heres a couple pics so you can tell me if I am going about it wrong ( although running prime right now and the temps are even lower than the last go around.





Forgot to take a pic of the IC diamond but i just put about a grain of rice worth along the center of the ihs.

Heres a screen shot of it stock at 4.6 after 2 hours prime blend



Heres at 4.6 after 2 hr prime first go around of deliding



Now Aida showed a -8 drop consistent while real temps all over the place from 15-16 drop to 4-6 drop on the second 2 hr pass.

Right now after 1hr running prime this time i am seeing even more of a drop. Aida shows 18-20 drop on the cores while real temp shows core 1-3 at 17 drop while 2-4 at a 21 drop from original. Dont get me wrong, I am happy with the results, but which should I trust more of the two programs? Either way well worth it


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Looking at this tubing http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12807/ex-tub-840/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_PRO_LRT_Tubing_12ID_34OD_with_18_Wall_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_UV_Red_PFLEXP10-34-R.html?tl=g30c99s1614


I have the blue 1 of that, it's not exactly UV because it fogs instantly after you put water inside, which makes the color much less vibrant.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry to hear about your troubles now. It may have happened during or after, but it may not have been caused by it. Probably something that happened during the process if anything. A delid should only affect temps unless the pcb was damaged, and that has only effected ability to POST or ram issues so far. Never heard of a problem like you are noting.
> Have you done some basic diags? Run mem tests? Tested internet speed programs? Seen anything else besides what your noting to try to narrow the problem further? Change anything else besides just delid and cooling? Might be what you see is a symptom that further testing might uncover root cause. People here may need more data to help. What are we sure works, and what is everything it now has problems with?


Well I was thinking unstable ram could cause it, so I went down to 1600mhz just incase. Still the same. The weird thing is that before my problem, I got my RATED speeds for seq reads/writes, 550mb reads and 500mb writes, together in raid 0 1100mb reads and 1000mb writes. But now, I get slightly less than that when it works properly, in the range of 30-40mb less for reads and writes. It can't be a sata 3/2 problem because when it does work it goes past the limit for sata 2. It's completely random and I have not yet seen a pattern to when it works properly or it doesn't. Windows 8 also just said restart to fix drive error, I did and nothing changed, have no idea what that error was. I think i'm missing something but can't see what it is...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I have the blue 1 of that, it's not exactly UV because it fogs instantly after you put water inside, which makes the color much less vibrant.


Gonna use this instead so i do not have that issue.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Gonna use this instead so i do not have that issue.


Is plasticizer no longer and issue with PrimoChill tubing? I know it was for a long time.


----------



## snelan

@ NyteRider

I used Liquid Pro, and could only get it to stick to the die. I actually tried spreading it on the inside of the IHS and it wouldn't stick, just ball up. So I just put it on the die.

Still works fine though, ~25c drops across the board with MX-4 on the top of the IHS.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snelan*
> 
> @ NyteRider
> I used Liquid Pro, and could only get it to stick to the die. I actually tried spreading it on the inside of the IHS and it wouldn't stick, just ball up. So I just put it on the die.
> Still works fine though, ~25c drops across the board with MX-4 on the top of the IHS.


I used it on both the die and IHS just like they show in the below video and it worked flawlessly. Temperature drop was 28C.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Is plasticizer no longer and issue with PrimoChill tubing? I know it was for a long time.


Not in the Advanced but 10foot is 25$ =/


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nyghtryder_9*
> 
> So I went back and redid it. The first go around I didnt put any liquid ultra on the ihs itself , so i thought that would be the culprit.
> Heres a couple pics so you can tell me if I am going about it wrong ( although running prime right now and the temps are even lower than the last go around.
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot to take a pic of the IC diamond but i just put about a grain of rice worth along the center of the ihs.
> Heres a screen shot of it stock at 4.6 after 2 hours prime blend
> 
> Heres at 4.6 after 2 hr prime first go around of deliding
> 
> Now Aida showed a -8 drop consistent while real temps all over the place from 15-16 drop to 4-6 drop on the second 2 hr pass.
> Right now after 1hr running prime this time i am seeing even more of a drop. Aida shows 18-20 drop on the cores while real temp shows core 1-3 at 17 drop while 2-4 at a 21 drop from original. Dont get me wrong, I am happy with the results, but which should I trust more of the two programs? Either way well worth it


Use realtemp. There is actual difference per core because of the sleeping cores early on in low idle and higher testing sometimes one core is used more than others and vice versa. So your temps look good on the real temp now finally. As the igpu of the intel architecture for Ivy is by those cores and sometimes they get a bit hotter.

Your all in the clear! So congratz sir!


----------



## Nyghtryder_9

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Use realtemp. There is actual difference per core because of the sleeping cores early on in low idle and higher testing sometimes one core is used more than others and vice versa. So your temps look good on the real temp now finally. As the igpu of the intel architecture for Ivy is by those cores and sometimes they get a bit hotter.
> Your all in the clear! So congratz sir!


Nice, time to work on 5.0 since temps arnt in the way now


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nyghtryder_9*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I bet you either have a messy IHS where its concave on the inside to convex on the top so that cores 3 and 4 will not have great connectivity. So for this take the IHS off again and take a pic of the TIM application for us to help you more. I bet you either have to to much or not enough TIM on the die.
> Realtemp is the best program that doesn temps without a prode. I have no idea as to how the programs do this
> 
> 
> 
> So I went back and redid it. The first go around I didnt put any liquid ultra on the ihs itself , so i thought that would be the culprit.
> Heres a couple pics so you can tell me if I am going about it wrong ( although running prime right now and the temps are even lower than the last go around.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot to take a pic of the IC diamond but i just put about a grain of rice worth along the center of the ihs.
> 
> Heres a screen shot of it stock at 4.6 after 2 hours prime blend
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heres at 4.6 after 2 hr prime first go around of deliding
> 
> 
> 
> Now Aida showed a -8 drop consistent while real temps all over the place from 15-16 drop to 4-6 drop on the second 2 hr pass.
> 
> Right now after 1hr running prime this time i am seeing even more of a drop. Aida shows 18-20 drop on the cores while real temp shows core 1-3 at 17 drop while 2-4 at a 21 drop from original. Dont get me wrong, I am happy with the results, but which should I trust more of the two programs? Either way well worth it
Click to expand...

Do not rely on Aida temps, they are always too low. RealTemp is the main temp program used by people who OC. Another good program is CoreTemp. But RealTemp is very good temp program and much better than most others that too often show temps below what they are, which is really not a good thing...









And your temps look good. Good job!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry to hear about your troubles now. It may have happened during or after, but it may not have been caused by it. Probably something that happened during the process if anything. A delid should only affect temps unless the pcb was damaged, and that has only effected ability to POST or ram issues so far. Never heard of a problem like you are noting.
> Have you done some basic diags? Run mem tests? Tested internet speed programs? Seen anything else besides what your noting to try to narrow the problem further? Change anything else besides just delid and cooling? Might be what you see is a symptom that further testing might uncover root cause. People here may need more data to help. What are we sure works, and what is everything it now has problems with?
> 
> 
> 
> Well I was thinking unstable ram could cause it, so I went down to 1600mhz just incase. Still the same. The weird thing is that before my problem, I got my RATED speeds for seq reads/writes, 550mb reads and 500mb writes, together in raid 0 1100mb reads and 1000mb writes. But now, I get slightly less than that when it works properly, in the range of 30-40mb less for reads and writes. It can't be a sata 3/2 problem because when it does work it goes past the limit for sata 2. It's completely random and I have not yet seen a pattern to when it works properly or it doesn't. Windows 8 also just said restart to fix drive error, I did and nothing changed, have no idea what that error was. I think i'm missing something but can't see what it is...
Click to expand...

Have you verified the problem with everything at stock? Also, check BIOS for changes and maybe put everything back to default except what is required to make it run (like raid). I do not think a delid would cause this problem, especially as it seems to be intermitent. Odd issue really. Hope others have ideas too....


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Have you verified the problem with everything at stock? Also, check BIOS for changes and maybe put everything back to default except what is required to make it run (like raid). I do not think a delid would cause this problem, especially as it seems to be intermitent. Odd issue really. Hope others have ideas too....


I don't think me scratching the pcb could cause the problem either, I mean I don't think I did... everything works fine lol. But it works sometimes on boot, and when it does it KEEPS working until a restart. I was thinking 1 of the drives maybe failed? But if it failed how does it still work, maybe a different kind of fail? I could rma but I really don't want to be with without my comp once again. Also I reset the cmos many times, do you think an updated bios could cause this? I think I had the problem before I updated but i'm not sure. The new bios is really weird, like if I go up from 4.9 to 5, and it crashes, and I try to go down to 4.9 again, the bios will say I changed it but CPUZ says its still at 5ghz, no idea what is happening there. And always after I reset cmos, and oc, the next time I boot everything has weird values, like REALLY weird values, so I just change it and next boot it works. I've never seen any of these problems before which is why it's really hard to fix.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I don't think me scratching the pcb could cause the problem either, I mean I don't think I did... everything works fine lol. But it works sometimes on boot, and when it does it KEEPS working until a restart. I was thinking 1 of the drives maybe failed? But if it failed how does it still work, maybe a different kind of fail? I could rma but I really don't want to be with without my comp once again. Also I reset the cmos many times, do you think an updated bios could cause this? I think I had the problem before I updated but i'm not sure. The new bios is really weird, like if I go up from 4.9 to 5, and it crashes, and I try to go down to 4.9 again, the bios will say I changed it but CPUZ says its still at 5ghz, no idea what is happening there. And always after I reset cmos, and oc, the next time I boot everything has weird values, like REALLY weird values, so I just change it and next boot it works. I've never seen any of these problems before which is why it's really hard to fix.


When your updating the mobo don't update only bios. Asus has set updates for different parts. Try the utility updates ALONG with other updates if your mobo has raid updates sometimes they do. So check that out as well.


----------



## VonDutch

hey, i have a little problem over here,
\tried to get a answer in the AMD cpu section of ocn,
but no answer yet, only answers to other posts after me...lol
(could it be because i have a intel build in my sig??)

"i bought a FX8350, on ga 990fxa d3,
installed it yesterday, but it wont boot,
vid card starts spinning, stops, starts spinning ..etc,
thought i did something wrong, so i took it all apart again,
putt together again, checked all cables like 5x, same problem,
hdd led blinks a few sec, vid card starts spinning, repeat...
no signal on monitor, wont even show bios or anything,
tried 2 different vid cards..

im puzzled, so im looking on the net, one answer was,
i need a bios update to make it work?
FX8350 doesnt work on my mobo?, it worked with the 1100T,
problem is i sold it, so cant check if its something else see..

i thought it was the old psu im using, its only 400Watt,
its a oldy tho, maybe it cant handle the startup power fx8350 needs?
not sure anymore what bios version is installed,
since i gave the comp to my son,
if it seems that its my bios, how can i get a new/latest one on?,
i dont have another cpu i can use for it..."
http://www.overclock.net/t/1318995/official-fx-8320-fx-8350-vishera-owners-club/5650#post_18836582

any idea what it can be, im sure some of you have amd's still ..lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey, i have a little problem over here,
> \tried to get a answer in the AMD cpu section of ocn,
> but no answer yet, only answers to other posts after me...lol
> (could it be because i have a intel build in my sig??)
> "i bought a FX8350, on ga 990fxa d3,
> installed it yesterday, but it wont boot,
> vid card starts spinning, stops, starts spinning ..etc,
> thought i did something wrong, so i took it all apart again,
> putt together again, checked all cables like 5x, same problem,
> hdd led blinks a few sec, vid card starts spinning, repeat...
> no signal on monitor, wont even show bios or anything,
> tried 2 different vid cards..
> im puzzled, so im looking on the net, one answer was,
> i need a bios update to make it work?
> FX8350 doesnt work on my mobo?, it worked with the 1100T,
> problem is i sold it, so cant check if its something else see..
> i thought it was the old psu im using, its only 400Watt,
> its a oldy tho, maybe it cant handle the startup power fx8350 needs?
> not sure anymore what bios version is installed,
> since i gave the comp to my son,
> if it seems that its my bios, how can i get a new/latest one on?,
> i dont have another cpu i can use for it..."
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1318995/official-fx-8320-fx-8350-vishera-owners-club/5650#post_18836582
> any idea what it can be, im sure some of you have amd's still ..lol


The power a comp draws when off load is like non existent, 150-300watt at max. Anyway, your problem sounds like 100% cpu 8pin lol. Could be ram. And to update bios, not sure if amd has this but you diwnload bios on usb stick and insert into the CORRECT slot, check manual, and press the button, you dont even need a cpu for that, runs off mobo chipset.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> The power a comp draws when off load is like non existent, 150-300watt at max. Anyway, your problem sounds like 100% cpu 8pin lol. Could be ram. And to update bios, not sure if amd has this but you diwnload bios on usb stick and insert into the CORRECT slot, check manual, and press the button, you dont even need a cpu for that, runs off mobo chipset.


thanks








so i can rule out the psu?
i dont think i can update my bios like that,
what do you mean with "your problem sounds like 100% cpu 8pin" ?

edit,
yes, theres a cable 4pin on the psu, i bought a 8 pin extension cable for it for my mobo to fit,
mobo needs a 8pin to, worked with the 100T tho ..


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey, i have a little problem over here,
> \tried to get a answer in the AMD cpu section of ocn,
> but no answer yet, only answers to other posts after me...lol
> (could it be because i have a intel build in my sig??)
> "i bought a FX8350, on ga ,
> installed it yesterday, but it wont boot,
> vid card starts spinning, stops, starts spinning ..etc,
> thought i did something wrong, so i took it all apart again,
> putt together again, checked all cables like 5x, same problem,
> hdd led blinks a few sec, vid card starts spinning, repeat...
> no signal on monitor, wont even show bios or anything,
> tried 2 different vid cards..
> im puzzled, so im looking on the net, one answer was,
> i need a bios update to make it work?
> FX8350 doesnt work on my mobo?, it worked with the 1100T,
> problem is i sold it, so cant check if its something else see..
> i thought it was the old psu im using, its only 400Watt,
> its a oldy tho, maybe it cant handle the startup power fx8350 needs?
> not sure anymore what bios version is installed,
> since i gave the comp to my son,
> if it seems that its my bios, how can i get a new/latest one on?,
> i dont have another cpu i can use for it..."
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1318995/official-fx-8320-fx-8350-vishera-owners-club/5650#post_18836582
> any idea what it can be, im sure some of you have amd's still ..lol


Yeah that thread has so many people in there now all sorts of points get skipped over.

But to answer your question, oddly enough the 8 core Vishera's are not on the support list for your motherboard. Dont ask me why they list the 4 and 6 core Visheras and the 8 core Zambezis but don't support the 8 core Vishera. That is beyond me.
http://www.gigabyte.com/support-downloads/cpu-support-popup.aspx?pid=3900

It doesn't look like you get any 8 core Vishera love. It might have to do with that 4+1 phase power, that would really struggle to overclock the Vishera. I would have a deal for you on a 8+2 phase board that does support that chip for like $50, but you live SO FAR AWAY. I don't think it would be cost effective to ship.

So here's the deal bro, you need something like this:
GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128514
however you must avoid Rev 1.0 because there's no LLC, Rev 1.1, 1.2, and 3.0 FTW

ASUS M5A97 R2.0 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131873

ASUS M5A99X EVO - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131754

ASUS M5A99FX PRO R2.0 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131851

This is what I have coming in the mail just to use with a Phenom chip though:
GIGABYTE GA-970A-UD3 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128519
It has the phase power but the LLC is lacking, only two options.

Anyway, I know it sucks, but your board likely wont run that chip. You either gotta step your son down to a 6 core or upgrade the motherboard. The motherboards I listed above are the cheapest I can recommend if you have intentions to overclock over 4.4GHz. It would obviously be best to get a Sabertooth, Crosshair V Formula, or UD7 but I understand if budget is a concern.


----------



## Stay Puft

Delided yesterday and it wasnt bad at all but I only have MX4 and my pro3 seems to be maxed at 4.8ghz. I can boot into windows at 5.1 but no stress tests whatsoever. Time for a new board


----------



## chas1723

Got my liquid pro in the mail. Guess it is time to try a direct mount with my h100i.

Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah that thread has so many people in there now all sorts of points get skipped over.
> But to answer your question, oddly enough the 8 core Vishera's are not on the support list for your motherboard. Dont ask me why they list the 4 and 6 core Visheras and the 8 core Zambezis but don't support the 8 core Vishera. That is beyond me.
> http://www.gigabyte.com/support-downloads/cpu-support-popup.aspx?pid=3900
> It doesn't look like you get any 8 core Vishera love. It might have to do with that 4+1 phase power, that would really struggle to overclock the Vishera. I would have a deal for you on a 8+2 phase board that does support that chip for like $50, but you live SO FAR AWAY. I don't think it would be cost effective to ship.
> So here's the deal bro, you need something like this:
> GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128514
> however you must avoid Rev 1.0 because there's no LLC, Rev 1.1, 1.2, and 3.0 FTW
> ASUS M5A97 R2.0 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131873
> ASUS M5A99X EVO - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131754
> ASUS M5A99FX PRO R2.0 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131851
> This is what I have coming in the mail just to use with a Phenom chip though:
> GIGABYTE GA-970A-UD3 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128519
> It has the phase power but the LLC is lacking, only two options.
> Anyway, I know it sucks, but your board likely wont run that chip. You either gotta step your son down to a 6 core or upgrade the motherboard. The motherboards I listed above are the cheapest I can recommend if you have intentions to overclock over 4.4GHz. It would obviously be best to get a Sabertooth, Crosshair V Formula, or UD7 but I understand if budget is a concern.


thanks for your answer stickg1, appreciated +rep for you








my kiddo was here this afternoon...aaww..not happy of course,
didnt play bf3 for a whole 2 days ...LOL..

but he said, hey dad, i have the black mobo,
i just checked, but its a GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 AM3+ AMD 990FX he has.. Rev 1.0,
starting to think i messed up the mobo while changing the cpu's,
i hope its the psu, i bought/gonna buy a used "Seasonic S12 Energy+650" for 50 euro with shipping..( good one ? )
he needs a better one anyways, you think it could be the bios needs a update to make it run?, already wrote gigabyte with the question also,
but it takes a few days before they respond..


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks for your answer stickg1, appreciated +rep for you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my kiddo was here this afternoon...aaww..not happy of course,
> didnt play bf3 for a whole 2 days ...LOL..
> but he said, hey dad, i have the black mobo,
> i just checked, but its a GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 AM3+ AMD 990FX he has.. Rev 1.0,
> starting to think i messed up the mobo while changing the cpu's,
> i hope its the psu, i bought/gonna buy a used "Seasonic S12 Energy+650" for 50 euro with shipping..( good one ? )
> he needs a better one anyways, you think it could be the bios needs a update to make it run?, already wrote gigabyte with the question also,
> but it takes a few days before they respond..


OHH, he has the black one, the UD3? Well it should just plain work. Unless the BIOS is so old that it doesn't even have Zambezi support yet. The chips are so similar (Bulldozer and Piledriver) that it should at least boot as long as it supports the bulldozer. Just might not be optimized. You need to get a burner chip, go snag a Sempron or something, or see if you can borrow a Phenom or Athlon from someone. Flash to F9 BIOS. I doubt the power supply is an issue, I ran a bulldozer chip with a Radeon 7770 on a Antec Earthwatts 380w for a few months. People say "ZOMG YOU NEED MORE POWERS", well it worked and it worked well so, w/e.

Unless you popped a VRM somehow, it should still boot up. I have a broken AM3 mobo right here that turns on for a few seconds then shuts back off, no post or anything. It's an MSI AMD board so 99% chance the VRMs popped. Does it keep restarting over and over by itself? Could be a grounding issue. Pull the chip out and make sure no old thermal paste got on the pins or socket holes. Make sure no pins on the CPU itself are missing or broke off. But really to put it all to rest you need to get BIOS version F9 on that motherboard.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> OHH, he has the black one, the UD3? Well it should just plain work. Unless the BIOS is so old that it doesn't even have Zambezi support yet. The chips are so similar (Bulldozer and Piledriver) that it should at least boot as long as it supports the bulldozer. Just might not be optimized. You need to get a burner chip, go snag a Sempron or something, or see if you can borrow a Phenom or Athlon from someone. Flash to F9 BIOS. I doubt the power supply is an issue, I ran a bulldozer chip with a Radeon 7770 on a Antec Earthwatts 380w for a few months. People say "ZOMG YOU NEED MORE POWERS", well it worked and it worked well so, w/e.
> Unless you popped a VRM somehow, it should still boot up. I have a broken AM3 mobo right here that turns on for a few seconds then shuts back off, no post or anything. It's an MSI AMD board so 99% chance the VRMs popped. Does it keep restarting over and over by itself? Could be a grounding issue. Pull the chip out and make sure no old thermal paste got on the pins or socket holes. Make sure no pins on the CPU itself are missing or broke off. But really to put it all to rest you need to get BIOS version F9 on that motherboard.


yea, the black one, gotta love how kids talk sometimes ..lol

yea figured that much after reading your reply, clicking link,
saw at gigabyte site, 8350 needs F9 bios..im sure it hasnt that one, didnt update bios for at least a year, wasnt necessary..

im not sure how it acts if the wrong bios is on it tho..
yea, its "booting",hdd led lights up for a sec, gpu spins harder at start, 4-5 seconds, then it repeats/loops,
but not till bios shows, doesnt show anything on monitor, tried with another vidcard also..
guess i will try to get a updated bios first ..man, i dont have another cpu here to try, and update bios,
i sold the 1100T that was in it ..lol

new chip, so no old tim on it, the old one didnt "push" any tim outside too,
but i did take it all apart again this morning,
just to make sure i connected everything ok, and to see if i seated it right,
no bent pins or anything, phew..lol, liquid pro all over the ihs, good contact, looked good..

o, and the psu im using is most likely 10 years old, maybe even older ..lol
Sempre bd-401ctp12, took it out a old pentium4 workstation..


----------



## chris-br

I'm pretty sure is the bios that is too old and doesn't see the new cpu., I had the same board and 1100t before moving to intel.. I do keep all my boards BIOS updated.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks for your answer stickg1, appreciated +rep for you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my kiddo was here this afternoon...aaww..not happy of course,
> didnt play bf3 for a whole 2 days ...LOL..
> but he said, hey dad, i have the black mobo,
> i just checked, but its a GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3 AM3+ AMD 990FX he has.. Rev 1.0,
> starting to think i messed up the mobo while changing the cpu's,
> i hope its the psu, i bought/gonna buy a used "Seasonic S12 Energy+650" for 50 euro with shipping..( good one ? )
> he needs a better one anyways, you think it could be the bios needs a update to make it run?, already wrote gigabyte with the question also,
> but it takes a few days before they respond..


If u killed the mb.. return that cpu and get your son real Cpu...

2500k +mb u have now and get yourself a better board for that 3770k


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> Delided yesterday and it wasnt bad at all but I only have MX4 and my pro3 seems to be maxed at 4.8ghz. I can boot into windows at 5.1 but no stress tests whatsoever. Time for a new board


what vcore are you at for 5.1ghz?
my mobo isnt that good either,entry level, but runs all oc's without to many problems,
found a max vcore limit on it, 1.85V ..lol, but thats about it..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm pretty sure is the bios that is too old and doesn't see the new cpu., I had the same board and 1100t before moving to intel.. I do keep all my boards BIOS updated.


i really hope so, im not even sure if i did ever update bios on it, could be still F1..lol
wasnt that important back then for me as it was now,
the bios that came with my own mobo was bad,
so i kept updating it everytime gigabyte released a new one,
and that at onetime was almost every week orso ..lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If u killed the mb.. return that cpu and get your son real Cpu...
> 2500k +mb u have now and get yourself a better board for that 3770k


for sure, i gave him my "old" mobo/cpu etc..
the mobo were talking about now, and that 1100T
wouldnt start a new build for him with amd, intel rules ..np,
2500k is about the same prize as the fx8350 where i live, 10-15 euro diff..
and the 3570K is just a bit more money ..well..

yea, if i had mo money , i would buy me another mobo for sure,
this one isnt bad at all, but for ocing and benching, it isnt that good..


----------



## stickg1

I was browsing that Vishera thread and I saw something that made me laugh really hard. Check out this excerpt from one of the members sigs...
Quote:


> There is a guy called Hokies83, ignore him, he does not respond to any reasonable proof provided to him and when he knows he is wrong he can't take it, he just throws outrageous graphs at you. His intention is to get any thread that shows his opinion in a bad light locked. God help you if he PM's you...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was browsing that Vishera thread and I saw something that made me laugh really hard. Check out this excerpt from one of the members sigs...


Trolls i tell you And Amd fan Bois are the worst...

Im the only one who has any proof...
and i post it from Many sources

Fan Bois can not be helped if they want to remain ignorant let them...

There the ones that can never back up anything and stoop to name calling cause they cant..

Those trolls need to do more then spend all there time in that one thread hearing everything they want to hear...
Cause when they hear the truth they can not take it... kinda like a KKK member living in a Cave for 40 years.. when they find out Obama is the president they cant take it lol.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what vcore are you at for 5.1ghz?
> my mobo isnt that good either,entry level, but runs all oc's without to many problems,
> found a max vcore limit on it, 1.85V ..lol, but thats about it..
> for sure, i gave him my "old" mobo/cpu etc..
> the mobo were talking about now, and that 1100T
> wouldnt start a new build for him with amd, intel rules ..np,
> 2500k is about the same prize as the fx8350 where i live, 10-15 euro diff..
> and the 3570K is just a bit more money ..well..
> yea, if i had mo money , i would buy me another mobo for sure,
> this one isnt bad at all, but for ocing and benching, it isnt that good..


Cpuz is reporting 1.49v for 5.1. I can putz around windows all day at 5.1 but ibt is an auto crash.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> Cpuz is reporting 1.49v for 5.1. I can putz around windows all day at 5.1 but ibt is an auto crash.


thats about max vcore, and other programs, can you run prime, cinebench etc,
and only ibt crashes? whea errors?
lower oc's are easier i noticed, the higher the oc, the more "finetuning" it needs,
you want to run it 24/7 , or just benching and see what your chip can do ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was browsing that Vishera thread and I saw something that made me laugh really hard. Check out this excerpt from one of the members sigs...


Oh i see who it is now...

Yeah that guy that was only comparing Multi threaded games 8350 to the 3570k

When i asked for a complete compare he had a fit and so did all the Amd fan bois...

I mean jeez dude your like convincing ppl to buy into amd cause itt akes all 8 cores of the 8350 to keep up with 4 cores of the 3570k in a multi threaded game..

Why not Show a more fair compare and also use some quad and single threaded games... The Amd fan Bois went nuts...



Single threaded performance 50% faster? So what do u think would happen in a game using threads like this?




I even gave the 8350 props for keeping up in the multi threaded games.. but still the compare was kinda Bias they were using only multi threaded games...


----------



## VonDutch

i read today amd is about 1 year behind on development compared to intel,
they stopped it for no known reason..

if you want really compare that way, pick the 2500k from the last generation,
then youll see, the fx8350 isnt that bad compared to the 2500k..
they cost about the same where i live, the 3770k is still about 300 euro, the fx8350 about 180 euro,
i know you can find a cheap 3770k somewhere hokies, i only say what i have to pay here,
and how the comparison should be made, still i think the 2500k would outperform the fx8350 on some things,
games, single threaded stuff.. to say fx8350 is a bad chip ...nah.. price/performance is good enough..
pitty they didnt get down the power usage more, bet they will make that better to in the future

"The new FX processors are based on four Piledriver modules, which is the second version of AMD's Bulldozer processor architecture. With Piledriver AMD manage to remove the main bottlenecks, and it can be said that *it became what Bulldozer was originally supposed to be from the start*."

just saying








bit like ivy and haswell right ..lol
dont get me wrong, im still happy every day i turned away from amd
and bought my first ever intel ..lol, i dont think i will go back to amd within 4-5 years..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i read today amd is about 1 year behind on development compared to intel,
> they stopped it for no known reason..
> if you want really compare that way, pick the 2500k from the last generation,
> then youll see, the fx8350 isnt that bad compared to the 2500k..
> they cost about the same where i live, the 3770k is still about 300 euro, the fx8350 about 180 euro,
> i know you can find a cheap 3770k somewhere hokies, i only say what i have to pay here,
> and how the comparison should be made, still i think the 2500k would outperform the fx8350 on some things,
> games, single threaded stuff.. to say fx8350 is a bad chip ...nah.. price/performance is good enough..


In the states it's price per performance is bad aswell.. You can get used 2600ks for 220-240$ and new 3770ks for 229$ if u have a MC and used from 250=260$

And it is about 2 1/2 years behind Intel "in multi threaded" And 5 behind in single threaded.

But 1 year in the cpu world is like 10 in the real world lol.

We are comparing core for core performance here..

Please take note the core 2 quad is at 3ghz and the 4300 is at 3.8ghz...
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/50?vs=700
Core2quad = 2008

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/49?vs=700
And the worst thing to note is Vishera IPC clock for clock is slower then Deneb / thubans Which really turned me on Vishera..

Earth to AMD.. New Cpu IPC is supposed to be faster then OLD cpu IPC what the hell are you doing?

Then comparing clock for clock performance VS BD...
Ignore the Intel ones just compare the 8150 to the 8350 clock for clock..


























Wide spread claims of 20% performance? No way it looks like BD is winning in alot of those benches... and when Vishera does win it is by a tiny bit..
Onlything Vishera really did was Use less power.. and it still uses 25% more then Intel.

Yes i know Ivys gains over Sandy were small aswell but atleast we got a better IMC and PCI-E 3.0 Vishera got none of that over BD.

Now if Vishera gave a true 20% clock for clock performance over BD and it's IPC was Faster then a 1090ts.. i would praise it.. But no.. Amd dropped the ball again.

Now some people may think im being mean or bias.. But i Invite you to go to another forum where truth is dominated and Fan bois just get banned..
HardOCP Overclock3d etc.. read there Amd sections and get back to me..


----------



## chris-br

Hey, i had my 1100T oced to 4ghz, same memory and same videocard..(just changed the mobo and cpu). But this 3570K kick its ass but alot. some games i got almost double of the fps......I'm very happy that i did the move to the BLUE side of the force. lol Don't think i will go AMD again.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Hey, i had my 1100T oced to 4ghz, same memory and same videocard..(just changed the mobo and cpu). But this 3570K kick its ass but alot. some games i got almost double of the fps......I'm very happy that i did the move to the BLUE side of the force. lol Don't think i will go AMD again.


same here, and i always had amd, but felt like this time i should go intel, they "won"...kinda








but this 3770K, after delid!!, is one amazing chip i have now, love it ..
1100T was my last too, but build it for the FX that where coming, hence the mobo,
but ..well, seems my 1100t was even better for the most part then the fx8150 back then








so, i made my kiddo very happy with it, but the fx8350 over the 1100t isnt a bad upgrade,
making full use off the fx mobo also, for oc its good enough,
i sold the 1100t for alot, 140 euro, so only needed 45 euro to buy the fx8350, not to bad
and i gave him my 6850, now i have the 7970








it should be here in 2 days ...cant wait..pff..


----------



## chris-br

I most likely will wait for the next gen. 8000 series


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I most likely will wait for the next gen. 8000 series


Next Gen is still a toss up..

If Nvidia does us right un locks voltage and gives us GK110 Nvidia is the sure winner...

If not and the HD8000 series gains atleast 10% on the HD7000 series it will be the way to go.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Think I may have found my 24/7 sweetspot.


----------



## Hokies83

What happened to 5.2ghz









If you just wanna run 4.8ghz ill trade you Chips









For me it is 5ghz + or nothing lol.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> What happened to 5.2ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you just wanna run 4.8ghz ill trade you Chips
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For me it is 5ghz + or nothing lol.


5.2Ghz puts my temps up in the high 80's low 90's wishing i had a CPU only loop right now lol) which isn't worth it for me since I just don't have use for that kind of power. I don't fold or do any really intense computing. I render video a few times a week and want to start gaming that's basically it. I can always just load up my 5.0Ghz and 5.2Ghz stable profiles when need be.

And trust me you're one of like 20 people who've asked me to trade chips with them haha. I've told everyone if I really can't find a use to run my chip above 5Ghz I may just put it up for auction. Not looking to trade for an already binned chip as I enjoy buying my own chips and testing myself. Plus I like the idea of possibly picking up another of the same batch just for comparison







.


----------



## Hokies83

Atleast run 5ghz for the E-Peen


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Atleast run 5ghz for the E-Peen


Haha does it matter what I DO run it at when I know that I CAN run it at that. I know I can run it at 5.2 on an average CPU + GPU water loop. That's good enough for my ego







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha does it matter what I DO run it at when I know that I CAN run it at that. I know I can run it at 5.2 on an average CPU + GPU water loop. That's good enough for my ego
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


LoL put 5.2ghz beside your 3770k in your sig so im no longer alone XD


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL put 5.2ghz beside your 3770k in your sig so im no longer alone XD


Shall we put our vcores as well?








.


----------



## chris-br

Double post


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Think I may have found my 24/7 sweetspot.


Damn, you are so lucky, 4.8ghz HT on with only 1.216v.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Damn, you are so lucky, 4.8ghz HT on with only 1.216v.


Yeah that's pretty sweet I had to use 1.30 for 4.8. I wish mine were as low as his.


----------



## Leyaena

Welp, I'm off to Indonesia for about 3 weeks, so if you don't hear from me for a while, that's why.
Hope you all enjoy the holidays, and have a great time!








See you guys when I get back


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Think I may have found my 24/7 sweetspot.


Have you tweaked your RAM speed yet? My 3770k can do 4.8 with 1.28 vcore with ram tweaked to 2133mhz CL9.







But will not do the 1.46v 5.2GHZ settings that you posted before. You have a very nice CPU and you MB is doing a good job with it. RAM tweaking will probably upset your stability though if you push your ram and you will have to retweak.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Have you tweaked your RAM speed yet? My 3770k can do 4.8 with same voltage settings.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But will not do the 1.46v 5.2GHZ settings that you posted before. You have a very nice CPU and you MB is doing a good job with it. RAM tweaking will probably upset your stability though if you push your ram and you will have to retweak.


Do you mean if I push my RAM timing or speed? I don't plan to OC my RAM but I will start tightening up the timings and then retesting.

Did I post something about doing 5.2 at 1.46vcore? I don't recall but I def. can't get 5.2 stable at that vcore. Once I get past 5.0Ghz I have to start upping my vcore a lot. I think it took me 1.52 to get 5.2Ghz fully stable I'll have check my settings again.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Do you mean if I push my RAM timing or speed? I don't plan to OC my RAM but I will start tightening up the timings and then retesting.
> Did I post something about doing 5.2 at 1.46vcore? I don't recall but I def. can't get 5.2 stable at that vcore. Once I get past 5.0Ghz I have to start upping my vcore a lot. I think it took me 1.52 to get 5.2Ghz fully stable I'll have check my settings again.


I'm sorry, I spoke to soon. I thought I could get 1.21v for 4.8 but I was mistaken. I can do 4.8GHZ with 1.288 vcore but with ram at 2133mhz CL 9-10-10-24 CR 1T DRAM 1.5v.

http://valid.canardpc.com/2618222

Your CPU is platinum. Awesome.

If you can get a nice 24/7 5GHZ stable OC at around 70C-low 80C under load I think that would be great to run 24/7.

I run 5GHZ 24/7 with vcore at 1.45v. You could probably get stable 5GHZ at under 1.4v with nice low temps.


----------



## Hokies83

Gigabyte UP7 hits 3rd ranked 3dmark01 Cpu Score on first try.. With a 6.7ghz 3770k...

And first place in the world in Gpu Scores..

Broke the world record in 3DMARK03 to.

And 3DMARK06.

I im sure soon it will hold the number one spot in Cpu aswell.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?283369-GIGABYTE-Z77X-UP7-Extreme-OC-session-with-Team.AU-boys-with-a-bunch-of-world-records


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I'm sorry, I spoke to soon. I thought I could get 1.21v for 4.8 but I was mistaken. I can do 4.8GHZ with 1.288 vcore but with ram at 2133mhz CL 9-10-10-24 CR 1T DRAM 1.5v.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2618222
> Your CPU is platinum. Awesome.
> If you can get a nice 24/7 5GHZ stable OC at around 70C-low 80C under load I think that would be great to run 24/7.
> I run 5GHZ 24/7 with vcore at 1.45v. You could probably get stable 5GHZ at under 1.4v with nice low temps.


This is my 24/7 5.0Ghz OC but I still need to tweak my RAM so I'm sure it will change.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey, i have a little problem over here,
> \tried to get a answer in the AMD cpu section of ocn,
> but no answer yet, only answers to other posts after me...lol
> (could it be because i have a intel build in my sig??)
> "i bought a FX8350, on ga 990fxa d3,
> installed it yesterday, but it wont boot,
> vid card starts spinning, stops, starts spinning ..etc,
> thought i did something wrong, so i took it all apart again,
> putt together again, checked all cables like 5x, same problem,
> hdd led blinks a few sec, vid card starts spinning, repeat...
> no signal on monitor, wont even show bios or anything,
> tried 2 different vid cards..
> im puzzled, so im looking on the net, one answer was,
> i need a bios update to make it work?
> FX8350 doesnt work on my mobo?, it worked with the 1100T,
> problem is i sold it, so cant check if its something else see..
> i thought it was the old psu im using, its only 400Watt,
> its a oldy tho, maybe it cant handle the startup power fx8350 needs?
> not sure anymore what bios version is installed,
> since i gave the comp to my son,
> if it seems that its my bios, how can i get a new/latest one on?,
> i dont have another cpu i can use for it..."
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1318995/official-fx-8320-fx-8350-vishera-owners-club/5650#post_18836582
> any idea what it can be, im sure some of you have amd's still ..lol


Is it a rev. 1 GB 990fxa-ud3? I had a rev. 1 ud5 that ate 2 cpus before I figured out that trying to start the machine up after clearing cmos was an instant cpu self destruct. Hopefully yours is the bios.
Had the same symptoms, everything spins up for a couple seconds then off & repeat.
Is there a shop nearby that can try putting in an older cpu to update the bios?

Tried freezing my delidded the other night, any extreme coolers out there, do not use liquid ultra (probably not pro either) at -40 or colder, it just doesn't work. Didn't overclock on air anymore the next day either.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Will check those out Hokies... I registered yesterday lol 1usd


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> This is my 24/7 5.0Ghz OC but I still need to tweak my RAM so I'm sure it will change.


I would stick with that for 24/7 gaming. Just a great low voltage cool OC for gaming.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I would stick with that for 24/7 gaming. Just a great low voltage cool OC for gaming.


Sounds like a plan







.


----------



## Arm3nian

what 1 restart can do...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Is it a rev. 1 GB 990fxa-ud3? I had a rev. 1 ud5 that ate 2 cpus before I figured out that trying to start the machine up after clearing cmos was an instant cpu self destruct. Hopefully yours is the bios.
> Had the same symptoms, everything spins up for a couple seconds then off & repeat.
> Is there a shop nearby that can try putting in an older cpu to update the bios?
> Tried freezing my delidded the other night, any extreme coolers out there, do not use liquid ultra (probably not pro either) at -40 or colder, it just doesn't work. Didn't overclock on air anymore the next day either.


yea, its a rev.1 , i really hope it didnt kill the chip, and its only the bios that needs flashing,
i cant remember i used another bios on it, so prolly still has the F1 bios, i need F9 for the fx8350 to work with this mobo,
yea, ive asked around on a dutch forum, could buy a sempron 140 that should work with this mobo, and bios F1..

ive asked coollaboratory a while ago about the minimum temperatures liquid pro/ultra stilll works,
they said i was good to go with extreme cooling, sub zero etc,
i asked them for you guys...dang.. hate when peeps just respond to questions with wrong answers,
especially "official" employees.. if you want i can look for the email, maybe i still have it


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> what 1 restart can do...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


didnt see the difference at first, dont know that proggie,
big difference tho ..


----------



## Stay Puft

Anyone looking to delid dont use a razor blade. I used these. Theyre from michaels and cheap .

www.testors.com/product/136943/8944T/_/Disposable_Hobby_Knives_%283%29


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, its a rev.1 , i really hope it didnt kill the chip, and its only the bios that needs flashing,
> i cant remember i used another bios on it, so prolly still has the F1 bios, i need F9 for the fx8350 to work with this mobo,
> yea, ive asked around on a dutch forum, could buy a sempron 140 that should work with this mobo, and bios F1..
> ive asked coollaboratory a while ago about the minimum temperatures liquid pro/ultra stilll works,
> they said i was good to go with extreme cooling, sub zero etc,
> i asked them for you guys...dang.. hate when peeps just respond to questions with wrong answers,
> especially "official" employees.. if you want i can look for the email, maybe i still have it


Could still be OK, mine was a weird board, I was extreme cooling & OCing a 955be when I had to clear cmos, & it just started for a few seconds where everything spun up then stopped & kept looping. Put in another cpu to test, did the same thing so thought it was the board & took it back to replace it, but the board worked fine, turned out it was just killing cpus.
Hopefully it was just whatever buggy bios I was using at the time.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> Anyone looking to delid dont use a razor blade. I used these. Theyre from michaels and cheap .
> www.testors.com/product/136943/8944T/_/Disposable_Hobby_Knives_%283%29


i used a box cutter like this one,

no problems using it to delid, my kids used it also to practice on old pentiums,
not a scratch anywhere


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Could still be OK, mine was a weird board, I was extreme cooling & OCing a 955be when I had to clear cmos, & it just started for a few seconds where everything spun up then stopped & kept looping. Put in another cpu to test, did the same thing so thought it was the board & took it back to replace it, but the board worked fine, turned out it was just killing cpus.
> Hopefully it was just whatever buggy bios I was using at the time.


the sempron will be send to me today (Monday), hope i will have it tommorrow so i can check whats up,
fingers crossed..lol
sounds like a horror movie, a mobo that kills cpu's








did they replace it, and compensate you in any way or?
pff, 3.30am is not a good time to wake up, and get out of bed, alot typos..lol ...o well.


----------



## Hokies83

So far...








X 6 
X6 

Still need the rad / res combo... waiting to sell one more thing to pay for it...
so far ive paid for everything by selling stuff i had laying around...


----------



## eBombzor

Does delidding work on Ivy Bridge i3s? i3 3220?

I saw this and got curious...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eBombzor*
> 
> Does delidding work on Ivy Bridge i3s? i3 3220?
> 
> I saw this and got curious...


Yes, but are you really having a temp problem with it?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i used a box cutter like this one,
> 
> no problems using it to delid, my kids used it also to practice on old pentiums,
> not a scratch anywhere


I used the same box cutter, worked great. I also used this to scrape the adhsesive off the PCB and it worked flawlessly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> So far...
> 
> Still need the rad / res combo... waiting to sell one more thing to pay for it...
> so far ive paid for everything by selling stuff i had laying around...


Looking good Hokies. Anxious to see the final product. Always awesome when you can upgrade without reaching into your wallet







.


----------



## Ali Man

I've de-lidded my 3770K and am thinking to install my CPU block directly onto the die. Currently it's through the IHS. So I had a few questions about it:
1) Would I need to take off the socket?
2) How can I install it when the die's height is lower than the socket?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> I've de-lidded my 3770K and am thinking to install my CPU block directly onto the die. Currently it's through the IHS. So I had a few questions about it:
> 1) Would I need to take off the socket?
> 2) How can I install it when the die's height is lower than the socket?


So you take off the socket. That is the most important part if you want to use straight onto the die. The second part, I recommend getting some washers so you do not crush the die.


----------



## eBombzor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *eBombzor*
> 
> Does delidding work on Ivy Bridge i3s? i3 3220?
> 
> I saw this and got curious...
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, but are you really having a temp problem with it?
Click to expand...

No, but the lower the temps the better









I would do just to see how low the temps could go. (Also using a Hyper Evo)


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So you take off the socket. That is the most important part if you want to use straight onto the die. The second part, I recommend getting some washers so you do not crush the die.


Thanks for the reply and yea that's actually what's stopping me, the fact that I can crush it.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So you take off the socket. That is the most important part if you want to use straight onto the die. The second part, I recommend getting some washers so you do not crush the die.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply and yea that's actually what's stopping me, the fact that I can crush it.
Click to expand...

I've tried it and I honestly did not see any difference so I went back to the IHS. Seemed a whole lot safer and it was easier to re-seat because I wasn't paranoid about it being killed.


----------



## xTristinx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> 
> Think I killed it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Mind you this is only done by lapping... minor scuff to the edge of the PCB as you can see and no bent pins in the mobo. Thursday I'll be getting a few mobos and 3450s to troubleshoot the problem further. Pretty much hinders me to using one stick of ram, locking me to 4gb for the time being. Should I just get an 8gb stick and rock single channel until I upgrade to Haswell, or should I just (after the problem is finally determined) get a nbew 3570k? Maybe delid this one as practice and sell it for benching only? Is single-channel ram performance bad enough so that I'll notice it when gaming (BF3, BO2, Skyrim, ect.).


Samething happened to me in regard to my ram. I can only use 2 dimms compared to all 4 on my mobo


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've tried it and I honestly did not see any difference so I went back to the IHS. Seemed a whole lot safer and it was easier to re-seat because I wasn't paranoid about it being killed.


Well that answers my curiosity perfectly then. Thanks again man.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've tried it and I honestly did not see any difference so I went back to the IHS. Seemed a whole lot safer and it was easier to re-seat because I wasn't paranoid about it being killed.
> 
> 
> 
> Well that answers my curiosity perfectly then. Thanks again man.
Click to expand...

Your welcome and good luck in whatever you choose to go. I would recommend using Coollaboratory no matter what you choose.


----------



## Valgaur

Hokies. Why do you need so many quick disconnectors? You really only need one for a loop maybe two (taking sets here you know 2 of the males and females)

You just disconnect one and pucker up and blow the rest out. As with the pump it will form a small vacuum and make it near impossible to get all of it out so you just blow air into it and viola! Its empty fairly fast.

Also if you can try and stay away from the additive stuff for the anti bio crap. The silver coils work amazingly. Just offerin info


----------



## ivanlabrie

Silver kill coil + PT nuke...

And someone slap Swag, we're gonna get shut down :/


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hokies. Why do you need so many quick disconnectors? You really only need one for a loop maybe two (taking sets here you know 2 of the males and females)
> You just disconnect one and pucker up and blow the rest out. As with the pump it will form a small vacuum and make it near impossible to get all of it out so you just blow air into it and viola! Its empty fairly fast.
> Also if you can try and stay away from the additive stuff for the anti bio crap. The silver coils work amazingly. Just offerin info


Looks baby.

Just gonna use a drop of the PT nuke and i have a silver Res plug


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good call...distilled only, right Hokies?

I think that pump/block thing is superb, I wanna get one eventually









On a side note, I was thinking on ways to get some endorsement.
I could always review stuff locally, but the local press sucks, and local forums and sites do too. I can't stand them normally, people is quite badly informed and too fanboyistic for my taste.
But well, guess I should become mainstream before someone notices me lol


----------



## dmanstasiu

Is there any advantage to Liquid Pro over Liquid Ultra?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good call...distilled only, right Hokies?
> I think that pump/block thing is superb, I wanna get one eventually
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, I was thinking on ways to get some endorsement.
> I could always review stuff locally, but the local press sucks, and local forums and sites do too. I can't stand them normally, people is quite badly informed and too fanboyistic for my taste.
> But well, guess I should become mainstream before someone notices me lol


Yah distilled only got the red tubing so no need to add dye.


----------



## ivanlabrie

A few degrees cooler...like 5c?
Harder to remove, but ideal for the die, cause you won't have that pumping effect and you get the absolute best TIM there is.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah distilled only got the red tubing so no need to add dye.


QFT!

I hate dyes, why hurt performance and risk having clogs form in your loop? What's the point of wc besides e-peen?








I'd do it for the quietness and performance mainly, looks second.

EDIT: btw, have you experimented with copper tubing?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> QFT!
> I hate dyes, why hurt performance and risk having clogs form in your loop? What's the point of wc besides e-peen?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd do it for the quietness and performance mainly, looks second.
> EDIT: btw, have you experimented with copper tubing?


NO never used any copper tubing.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> A few degrees cooler...like 5c?
> Harder to remove, but ideal for the die, cause you won't have that pumping effect and you get the absolute best TIM there is.


5ºC cooler from Ultra to Pro? Now I'm considering buying a 2nd tube









It's not for the die, this is just for my GPU lol, between GPU/shim and shim/Kuhler 920


----------



## ivanlabrie

That should work real good for a gpu die...buy as many as you can lol, you can never have enough LP!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Silver kill coil + PT nuke...
> And someone slap Swag, we're gonna get shut down :/


LOL, i was thinking the same


----------



## dmanstasiu

I have indigo Xtreme for my CPU, I only need a tiny bit of CLU for my GPU







Plus that stuff ain't cheap


----------



## ivanlabrie

great minds think alike...right Hokies?









Hey, we got all the delidders online, we should bench or something lol
I'm on my gf's stock clocked amd rig xD


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll post some spi32m for the heck of it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll post some spi32m for the heck of it.


what Ghz? might do a run too








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I have indigo Xtreme for my CPU, I only need a tiny bit of CLU for my GPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Plus that stuff ain't cheap


it goes a long way, i did my chip with it, ALL sides, my kids cpu, 2 videocards,
and used it on the new fx8350, still have some left...prolly enough to use on my new 7970
someone here used the whole seringe on the die, well yea, then it gets expensive for sure ...LOL
o, and we shaved of about 10C using it on the gpu's ..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what Ghz? might do a run too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it goes a long way, i did my chip with it, ALL sides, my kids cpu, 2 videocards,
> and used it on the new fx8350, still have some left...prolly enough to use on my new 7970
> someone here used the whole seringe on the die, well yea, then it gets expensive for sure ...LOL
> o, and we shaved of about 10C using it on the gpu's ..


I'm posting a quick 1m run I just did...3896mhz phenom II x4 955 be, with 2310mhz cpunb and 1680mhz ram xD
Don't wanna be caught so I kept it simple.

EDIT: Here it is ;p
Didn't tweak as much as I can, but it's pseudo decent lol on stock cooler.
Compare that to my 7.1s run using a 2600k.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm posting a quick 1m run I just did...3896mhz phenom II x4 955 be, with 2310mhz cpunb and 1680mhz ram xD
> Don't wanna be caught so I kept it simple.
> EDIT: Here it is ;p
> Didn't tweak as much as I can, but it's pseudo decent lol on stock cooler.
> Compare that to my 7.1s run using a 2600k.


nice, youre #274 with that one ..lol








not sure if its fair to let mine run , and compare it,
this is my daily oc, 4646mhz

not to good i think, right...o well..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quite good, but you need to tweak some stuff...but I won't discuss that here hehe
Also, you need as much cpu clock as possible.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what Ghz? might do a run too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it goes a long way, i did my chip with it, ALL sides, my kids cpu, 2 videocards,
> and used it on the new fx8350, still have some left...prolly enough to use on my new 7970
> someone here used the whole seringe on the die, well yea, then it gets expensive for sure ...LOL
> o, and we shaved of about 10C using it on the gpu's ..


Pro lasts so much longer than ultra. I used ultra on cpu and gpu and it was gone. I used pro on same stuff plus the blocks themselves and still have more than half left, plus some of it injected into my bloodstream lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quite good, but you need to tweak some stuff...but I won't discuss that here hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, you need as much cpu clock as possible.


oo, its like that now ey..not sharing your tweaks with me anymore ...LOL
you know im gonna beat you some day right








yea, didnt feel like ocing for the superduper pie run, so left it at me daily oc..

this one i made earlier date, 5.2ghz superpi, Oct. 25, but again nothing tweaked,
maybe i can get higher scores now i know more then then, will wait till your back on your own comp









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Pro lasts so much longer than ultra. I used ultra on cpu and gpu and it was gone. I used pro on same stuff plus the blocks themselves and still have more than half left, plus some of it injected into my bloodstream lol.


didnt know that, but never used liquid ultra,
went for pro right away..thought they where about the same
with how much to use ..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> oo, its like that now ey..not sharing your tweaks with me anymore ...LOL
> you know im gonna beat you some day right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> didnt know that, but never used liquid ultra,
> went for pro right away..thought they where about the same
> with how much to use ..


lol I have some top secret info, can't share it...or I get kicked from my team, I'm sure FtW would understand xD
I can say a few things: moar cpu clock, no need to use background programs and processes heh









My 7.100s 1m run was with a 5.3ghz 2600k and 2133mhz cl10 ram btw...


----------



## BaK2BaK

Just tried to delid an old pentium4 using a flexible razor, was easy thanx for all the tips provided here!








Prior to that, I let the CPU on top of my furnace so that it gets warmed to 60-70 °C. I guess it helped inserting the razor into the glue more easily.

I still see two risky things that could damage the CPU:

1) Insert the razor too deep and touch the die.
Could anyone tell what are the D1 and D2 (D1=D2?) measurements below?

So that I could draw a mark on the razor to check its insertion under the IHS.

2) Because of the height of the black rectangle, the razor will have to be inserted under the IHS with an angle (not parallel to the PCB), and then the razor could hurt the PCB. How does it went with yours?

VonDutch> I probably missed the page with your feedbacks... did you try any other methods that you proposed earlier?

Ultra and Pro have arrived, real delidding is for soon!


----------



## VonDutch

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18590943

thats the post we made together, after input from everyone









1) not sure about the D1 and D2 there, first i thought distance to inside ihs, but it isnt,
i think i saved a pic with lines on it ..wait....hmm, cant find it anymore srry..

just made this one, as example, think its about right

not much deeper then that..

2) first do the corners, then put blade back in a corner, and push it slowly in the longer sides,
always..always, keep the blade right angled to the pcb, or parallel, very important









dont let it move either way, or direction..

o, i came to think of this after delid,
but marking where the ihs is now, might help you later when putting it back together again








try have a mental picture in your head, where the die is, i looked at alot of pic's before i did mine,
and of course read everything , watched all vid's i could find ..lol

this pic i was looking for...found it ..hope it helps


----------



## chris-br

use pro on the die and ultra on the ihs with HSF


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> use pro on the die and ultra on the ihs with HSF


I will!

Thx VonDutch for the details!
I was more thinking about the methods of this page, especiall n° 1) and 2) : http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/4120#post_18716388

1) Ok for the mark on the razor, I guess 5mm deep is the max allowed.

2)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> always..always, keep the blade right angled to the pcb, or parallel, very important. dont let it move either way, or direction..


So the height of the black rectangle won't disturb me from keeping the blade parallel to the PCB, right?

3)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> but marking where the ihs is now, might help you later when putting it back together again


I will take a pic of the IHS position before delidding then! I guess the red rectangles of your last pic are here to highlight the IHS position...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> I will!
> Thx VonDutch for the details!
> I was more thinking about the methods of this page, especiall n° 1) and 2) : http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/4120#post_18716388
> 1) Ok for the mark on the razor, I guess 5mm deep is the max allowed.
> 2)
> So the height of the black rectangle won't disturb me from keeping the blade parallel to the PCB, right?
> 3)
> I will take a pic of the IHS position before delidding then! I guess the red rectangles of your last pic are here to highlight the IHS position...


yw









yea, i never came across a good plastic card to use, after doing the corners first,
creditcards are to thick, can bent the pcb a bit too..

5mm is to much for the sides where the short side of the die is i think tho,

more about 2 -3 mm tops for those sides..you dont have to go in very far..



the last pic in the other post is to show how far in you should go with the blade, no further then that, to make sure you dont hit the die anywhere..

2) nope..no worries about that,
only comes more important after delid, then its kinda of a height when putting the ihs back on..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> QFT!
> I hate dyes, why hurt performance and risk having clogs form in your loop? What's the point of wc besides e-peen?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd do it for the quietness and performance mainly, looks second.
> EDIT: btw, have you experimented with copper tubing?


Mayhems dyes do not clog or hurt performance. They are top notch, never had an issue with them.


----------



## BaK2BaK

VonDutch> Thx again +rep
Hopefully my next post will be for a delidding validation!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> VonDutch> Thx again +rep
> Hopefully my next post will be for a delidding validation!


i hope you will be successfull with the delid, good luck








take your time, take a brake if needed









thanks for the rep! (dances) 44,44,44,44,44...lol

i remember someone posting a black adhesive,
to use if you ever wanted to glue the ihs back on, what was that again?

i only found this, "black adhesive" bra.....


----------



## stickg1

I get my liquid pro today. I'll be sure to take pics this time around. My chip may be awful for overclocking but its going to run cool as hell!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I get my liquid pro today. I'll be sure to take pics this time around. My chip may be awful for overclocking but its going to run cool as hell!


hehe... Same here.


----------



## stickg1

MAN!! What a rip off!!! This Liquid Pro stuff doesn't even work!!! I mean I only shaved 25C off my load temps after delidding and applying it!! I feel robbed!!!

























*BEFORE DELID*


*AFTER DELID*


Mehehehe that was awesome!! Time to crank the voltage up and make this chip work it's little butt off!!!


----------



## chris-br

Your Gflops are kinda really low... ***???

BTW, congrats on a good delidd..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Your Gflops are kinda really low... ***???
> BTW, congrats on a good delidd..


Cuz he's just tesing with the standard 1GB of RAM instead of testing with 80-90% of RAM.

EDIT: Scratch that I got confused for a second. Those gflops are low indeed...


----------



## chris-br

Yeah, but i do that in 8secs on mine with over 100gflops


----------



## stickg1

Yeah this is a fresh install of windows with no SP1 and I have an old Intel Burn Test. I did this so I could replicate all my old settings for a 100% controlled experiment.

Last time after I updated my windows install I was getting around 100GFLops


----------



## chris-br

HERE?


----------



## stickg1

Read my previous post, I just explained it.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> HERE?


What speed are you running your CPU and RAM at?


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> MAN!! What a rip off!!! This Liquid Pro stuff doesn't even work!!! I mean I only shaved 25C off my load temps after delidding and applying it!! I feel robbed!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *BEFORE DELID*
> 
> *AFTER DELID*
> 
> Mehehehe that was awesome!! Time to crank the voltage up and make this chip work it's little butt off!!!


4.3 ghz? Crank that puppy up to 5ghz


----------



## stickg1

Yeah I was just trying to replicate my pre-delidding freq and voltage to compare temps. So far I have 4.7GHz but I need 1.52v to do it. Like I said before, my chip is really bad. I am at a max temp of about 75C in prime large FTT. I'll try to see what type of voltage I need for 4.8GHz.


----------



## LukeJoseph

I Delided my 3570k this past Saturday. I do have a few suggestions for those nervous, not sure what to do, etc.... This is the first time I have ever done a delid, but I do have a lot of experience with "similar" processes.

The number 1 thing I would suggest, a Heat Gun. You can pick one up from Walmart for cheap. Keep it on the low setting and don't ever hold the gun in one place, just move it left to fit about 8-10" away from the chip. Once warm enough the chip will be hot to the touch. Not burn your self hot, but I would suggest a glove (I used one of my mechanic gloves, as they are thin enough for good feel, but good for heat).

I have a slew of different style razor blades/exacto's and what I found best by far was just a standard plain ol razor. Problem with exacto's, or break away blades, is that are made to be held at the handle, away from the blade. When using a regular razor, you can actually lay the razor flat on th chip, and if you just bend it a tiny bit (like a U), you can almost ensure you will not nick the chip. And if you slip at all, the you should just hit th IHS. Oh and use a new blade, don't pull the blade out of your box cutter that has been sitting around for a year or two.

Of course, always cut away from yourself. I actually put the chip up on its side, and cut down.

The whole idea of the heat gun, is to get the glue soft. The softer the glue, the easier the cut. And the less force you use to cut, the less chance of something going wrong.

I personally did not see a large decrease in temps. But that may be due to the fact that I used AS5 on the die. I have ordered the liquid ultra. Once I get that I will take pics to verify.

My buddy is building a Ivy system here in a couple weeks, so I will make a proper tutorial video.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What speed are you running your CPU and RAM at?


Doing [email protected],416v My ram is running factory settings. 1600 8 8 8 24


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah I was just trying to replicate my pre-delidding freq and voltage to compare temps. So far I have 4.7GHz but I need 1.52v to do it. Like I said before, my chip is really bad. I am at a max temp of about 75C in prime large FTT. I'll try to see what type of voltage I need for 4.8GHz.


Ouch!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> I Delided my 3570k this past Saturday. I do have a few suggestions for those nervous, not sure what to do, etc.... This is the first time I have ever done a delid, but I do have a lot of experience with "similar" processes.
> The number 1 thing I would suggest, a Heat Gun. You can pick one up from Walmart for cheap. Keep it on the low setting and don't ever hold the gun in one place, just move it left to fit about 8-10" away from the chip. Once warm enough the chip will be hot to the touch. Not burn your self hot, but I would suggest a glove (I used one of my mechanic gloves, as they are thin enough for good feel, but good for heat).
> I have a slew of different style razor blades/exacto's and what I found best by far was just a standard plain ol razor. Problem with exacto's, or break away blades, is that are made to be held at the handle, away from the blade. When using a regular razor, you can actually lay the razor flat on th chip, and if you just bend it a tiny bit (like a U), you can almost ensure you will not nick the chip. And if you slip at all, the you should just hit th IHS. Oh and use a new blade, don't pull the blade out of your box cutter that has been sitting around for a year or two.
> Of course, always cut away from yourself. I actually put the chip up on its side, and cut down.
> The whole idea of the heat gun, is to get the glue soft. The softer the glue, the easier the cut. And the less force you use to cut, the less chance of something going wrong.
> I personally did not see a large decrease in temps. But that may be due to the fact that I used AS5 on the die. I have ordered the liquid ultra. Once I get that I will take pics to verify.
> My buddy is building a Ivy system here in a couple weeks, so I will make a proper tutorial video.


For the die, i would recommend Liquid Pro and use the Ultra for top of the IHS and HSF.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah I was just trying to replicate my pre-delidding freq and voltage to compare temps. So far I have 4.7GHz but I need 1.52v to do it. Like I said before, my chip is really bad. I am at a max temp of about 75C in prime large FTT. I'll try to see what type of voltage I need for 4.8GHz.


I,52v for 4.7 is already too much.. back down to 4,6.


----------



## LukeJoseph

Why the pro on the die? So I should order some of the "pro" too?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Why the pro on the die? So I should order some of the "pro" too?


Pro is better than ultra for the die. It's the closest thing you can get to actually soldering the IHS to the die like most chips. It's liquid metal.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> For the die, i would recommend Liquid Pro and use the Ultra for top of the IHS and HSF.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Why the pro on the die? So I should order some of the "pro" too?


I was wondering as well ... what are the specific advatnages of Ultra vs pro?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Pro is better than ultra for the die. It's the closest thing you can get to actually soldering the IHS to the die like most chips. It's liquid metal.


If Pro is liquid metal, then what's Ultra...

"Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material"

"Coollaboratory Liquid PRO Thermal Interface Material"


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Pro is better than ultra for the die. It's the closest thing you can get to actually soldering the IHS to the die like most chips. It's liquid metal.


Also, once you put the IHS back on, and the temps are good, you won't have to take it out ever again... So no need to clean. Now about the HSF, i put pro on it also, since I'm not taking my d14 from there anytime soon anyway... Like they say: " if you are winning, don't touch it!"


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> If Pro is liquid metal, then what's Ultra...
> "Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material"
> "Coollaboratory Liquid PRO Thermal Interface Material"


It's also liquid metal, but it's a thicker mix with lower thermal conductivity.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I was wondering as well ... what are the specific advatnages of Ultra vs pro?
> If Pro is liquid metal, then what's Ultra...
> "Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material"
> "Coollaboratory Liquid PRO Thermal Interface Material"


Well. since is a really small surface, you want the best of the best to transfer all heat to the IHS. After that you use even MX-4 on the HSF.


----------



## Stay Puft

So whats better to use on the die itself? Pro?


----------



## chris-br

yes


----------



## stickg1

Pro for the die. Ultra for the IHS. Ultra cleans off easier. I'm constantly taking my cooler off to move things around and I buy and sell parts like its my job. (Although no one is going to want my sorry 3570k that needs 1.53v for 4.7GHz, anyway...) You shouldn't ever have to clean and reapply to the die if you do it right.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Pro for the die. Ultra for the IHS. Ultra cleans off easier. I'm constantly taking my cooler off to move things around and I buy and sell parts like its my job. (Although no one is going to want my sorry 3570k that needs 1.53v for 4.7GHz, anyway...) You shouldn't ever have to clean and reapply to the die if you do it right.


Don't forget, if you're going to use any of the Coollaboratory stuff on the IHS you will need to lap it if it's even the tiniest bit concave or you will get terrible temps. These TIMs just aren't good at filling in larger gaps.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Don't forget, if you're going to use any of the Coollaboratory stuff on the IHS you will need to lap it if it's even the tiniest bit concave or you will get terrible temps. These TIMs just aren't good at filling in larger gaps.


True, I just used Antec Formula 7 nanodiamond on my IHS. Because A) I have 4 tubes of it in my drawer, and B) It cleans easy and I don't want to lap my heatspreader and I got minimal results last time I lapped the coldplate of my CLC.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Don't forget, if you're going to use any of the Coollaboratory stuff on the IHS you will need to lap it if it's even the tiniest bit concave or you will get terrible temps. These TIMs just aren't good at filling in larger gaps.


Maybe ill just stick with the MX4


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Hey Hokies, will 5.1 @ 1.414vcore suffice for the e-peen?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Hey Hokies, will 5.1 @ 1.414vcore suffice for the e-peen?


Yah it will do fastest 24/7 2700k ive seen was 5.1ghz / 5.2ghz that beats them both so it is pure win.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah it will do fastest 24/7 2700k ive seen was 5.1ghz / 5.2ghz that beats them both so it is pure win.


I'll stroke your e-peen (metaphorically of course) and let you have your 5.2.


----------



## feniks

hey, talking about daily clocks. are you guys able to make 5.0ghz+ stable on offsets? the highest I can go on offset (stable for days) is 4.9GHz... 5GHz gives me random BSOD 124 crashes at light load no matter what I try ... NOT memory related, it's strictly vcore too low at some point.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hey, talking about daily clocks. are you guys able to make 5.0ghz+ stable on offsets? the highest I can go on offset (stable for days) is 4.9GHz... 5GHz gives me random BSOD 124 crashes at light load no matter what I try ... NOT memory related, it's strictly vcore too low at some point.


Try using a lower LLC with a higher offset. This should give you higher voltages with low load but the same load voltages if you tune it right!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hey, talking about daily clocks. are you guys able to make 5.0ghz+ stable on offsets? the highest I can go on offset (stable for days) is 4.9GHz... 5GHz gives me random BSOD 124 crashes at light load no matter what I try ... NOT memory related, it's strictly vcore too low at some point.


That last screen I posted is with a .280 offset and tight RAM timings.

Btw I'm using Level 2 LLC as Direkt was alluding to.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> That last screen I posted is with a .280 offset and tight RAM timings.
> Btw I'm using Level 2 LLC as Direkt was alluding to.


ya, I understand, but does it last 2 days straight of idling and daily use (browsing, gaming, stress testing, etc.)?
mine was crashing with BSOD at light load (e.g. pressing a Check Mail button in Yahoo Mail) anywhere from 5 minutes from bootup up to 23 hours from bootup (next day after long idle for 18hrs).
I don't have that problem with 4.9GHz or anything below ... thinking that maybe it's a BIOS issue related to offsets programming at or above 50x multiplier in ROG boards.

saying only, because I don't run fixed vcore clocks daily, those I leave for benching only.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ya, I understand, but does it last 2 days straight of idling and daily use (browsing, gaming, stress testing, etc.)?


I'll have to get back to you on that. It lasted 12+ hrs prime and now I'm testing it again with tighter RAM timings and it's been running 4 hours so far. Once I'm done with this test I'll be using it throughout the week just as you described so I'll report back.


----------



## eBombzor

Wait, you gotta put the IHS back on after delidding? I just thought you put the heatsink on top of the die...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eBombzor*
> 
> Wait, you gotta put the IHS back on after delidding? I just thought you put the heatsink on top of the die...


You could but if you use the right thermal material on the die the temperature differences are negligible and not really worth the risk of crushing the die from direct contact pressure.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> I Delided my 3570k this past Saturday. I do have a few suggestions for those nervous, not sure what to do, etc.... This is the first time I have ever done a delid, but I do have a lot of experience with "similar" processes.
> 
> The number 1 thing I would suggest, a Heat Gun. You can pick one up from Walmart for cheap. Keep it on the low setting and don't ever hold the gun in one place, just move it left to fit about 8-10" away from the chip. Once warm enough the chip will be hot to the touch. Not burn your self hot, but I would suggest a glove (I used one of my mechanic gloves, as they are thin enough for good feel, but good for heat).
> 
> I have a slew of different style razor blades/exacto's and what I found best by far was just a standard plain ol razor. Problem with exacto's, or break away blades, is that are made to be held at the handle, away from the blade. When using a regular razor, you can actually lay the razor flat on th chip, and if you just bend it a tiny bit (like a U), you can almost ensure you will not nick the chip. And if you slip at all, the you should just hit th IHS. Oh and use a new blade, don't pull the blade out of your box cutter that has been sitting around for a year or two.
> 
> Of course, always cut away from yourself. I actually put the chip up on its side, and cut down.
> 
> The whole idea of the heat gun, is to get the glue soft. The softer the glue, the easier the cut. And the less force you use to cut, the less chance of something going wrong.
> 
> I personally did not see a large decrease in temps. But that may be due to the fact that I used AS5 on the die. I have ordered the liquid ultra. Once I get that I will take pics to verify.
> 
> My buddy is building a Ivy system here in a couple weeks, so I will make a proper tutorial video.


Good advice *LukeJoseph* for others who will want to do this. +Rep

Two things that can effect your temps not going down yet are the TIM, which you already know should be CL Pro or CL Ultra, and if that does not do it fully, check your IHS to see if it is concave or flat. If concave, then you will need to lap it to make it flat, upon which you will most likely see major temp improvements.

Good job delidding and congrats!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> I Delided my 3570k this past Saturday. I do have a few suggestions for those nervous, not sure what to do, etc.... This is the first time I have ever done a delid, but I do have a lot of experience with "similar" processes.
> I personally did not see a large decrease in temps. But that may be due to the fact that I used AS5 on the die. I have ordered the liquid ultra. Once I get that I will take pics to verify.
> My buddy is building a Ivy system here in a couple weeks, so I will make a proper tutorial video.


first, gratz on the successfull delid








ive used AS5 at first too, waiting for liquid pro to arrive,
saw a 5-10C tempdrop with AS5, later using liquid pro on the die etc another 15+C
looking forward to your tutorial


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I'll have to get back to you on that. It lasted 12+ hrs prime and now I'm testing it again with tighter RAM timings and it's been running 4 hours so far. Once I'm done with this test I'll be using it throughout the week just as you described so I'll report back.


please do. mine was passing everything at full load that I threw at it and could idle for hours ... and yet when I sometimes pressed a stupid button in a browser (checked with cpu-z it was causing a temporary jump from 16x to 50x multi) it would BSOD (124) sometimes. memory was not an issue, I have seen it with all memory clocks. what's worse it wasn't dependent also on neither PLL, VCCIO, VCCSA or actually anything I could find. it was just like sometimes the offset voltage was getting out of sync with multiplier and causing a rare crash.

interested if you see this too. I use ASUS MVE board with BIOS 704 (works best for me), but I have seen the same on latest BIOS 1501 as well, however this one was calling for lower offset to have this chip stable at very same 50x multi clock (not affecting clocks below this multi), which makes me think it IS a BIOS issue on my board.


----------



## LukeJoseph

Thanks all for the info. I now have some Pro on the way. To bad I can't buy it local. Or even find out exactly what it is made of and just make it myself, kind of surprised no one has yet lol.

Think I will just do the Pro on the Die and then some AS5 (or similar), between the IHS and heatsink. My IHS might be concave, I looked though, and it looked pretty damn flat, will put a straight edge on it to be sure. I have a Delta between Core 1 and Core 3 (3 being the hottest) of about 12-14 degrees. But only underload. At idle 3 is actually the coolest, but only my like 1-2c so that is fine.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Thanks all for the info. I now have some Pro on the way. To bad I can't buy it local. Or even find out exactly what it is made of and just make it myself, kind of surprised no one has yet lol.
> Think I will just do the Pro on the Die and then some AS5 (or similar), between the IHS and heatsink. My IHS might be concave, I looked though, and it looked pretty damn flat, will put a straight edge on it to be sure. I have a Delta between Core 1 and Core 3 (3 being the hottest) of about 12-14 degrees. But only underload. At idle 3 is actually the coolest, but only my like 1-2c so that is fine.


LP is actually made of Gallium...You can try to find some of it, not sure if it will be easy or cheaper.


----------



## alancsalt

AS5 has a longer "curing time" than other TIMs. It is not at full efficiency until it has been through 200 hours of "heat cycling". i haven't noticed any mention of that here, so just for those who didn't know, AS5 improves its cooling performance over a break in period. It used to tell you this in the instructions that came with it.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Hey Hokies, will 5.1 @ 1.414vcore suffice for the e-peen?


That is awsome....









EDIT: 400mhz more than me with the same vcore and HT on!!!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> I Delided my 3570k this past Saturday. I do have a few suggestions for those nervous, not sure what to do, etc.... This is the first time I have ever done a delid, but I do have a lot of experience with "similar" processes.
> The number 1 thing I would suggest, a Heat Gun. You can pick one up from Walmart for cheap. Keep it on the low setting and don't ever hold the gun in one place, just move it left to fit about 8-10" away from the chip. Once warm enough the chip will be hot to the touch. Not burn your self hot, but I would suggest a glove (I used one of my mechanic gloves, as they are thin enough for good feel, but good for heat).
> I have a slew of different style razor blades/exacto's and what I found best by far was just a standard plain ol razor. Problem with exacto's, or break away blades, is that are made to be held at the handle, away from the blade. When using a regular razor, you can actually lay the razor flat on th chip, and if you just bend it a tiny bit (like a U), you can almost ensure you will not nick the chip. And if you slip at all, the you should just hit th IHS. Oh and use a new blade, don't pull the blade out of your box cutter that has been sitting around for a year or two.
> Of course, always cut away from yourself. I actually put the chip up on its side, and cut down.
> The whole idea of the heat gun, is to get the glue soft. The softer the glue, the easier the cut. And the less force you use to cut, the less chance of something going wrong.
> I personally did not see a large decrease in temps. But that may be due to the fact that I used AS5 on the die. I have ordered the liquid ultra. Once I get that I will take pics to verify.
> My buddy is building a Ivy system here in a couple weeks, so I will make a proper tutorial video.


Im making a tutorial video once I get my second chip through RMA. Don't worry about it Ill be taking lots of pics and many different ways to delid. Video will probably be made as well. People tel to not watch videos, Ill still make one though, wont be pretty but it'll be one. Will include a short detail of liquid pro on the die. Along with the IHS concave and such info.

Thanks though for the info! I also completely agree on the normal blade. Exactos scare me with the handling on them, even with the scare of a blade snapping.

Gratz on the new successful delid and hope you enjoyed the info here. Now hurry up and give us your info so we can give you our amazing sig.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I was wondering as well ... what are the specific advatnages of Ultra vs pro?
> If Pro is liquid metal, then what's Ultra...
> "Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material"
> "Coollaboratory Liquid PRO Thermal Interface Material"


Ultra is liquid metal but with ultra and pro there are slight differences. With pro it is all about performance on the thermal conductivity. Now with Ultra you have great performance but not Pros amazing performance standard, BUT is much easier to remove. Honestly with the extra element in Ultra pro isn't that hard to remove.

Again to make it easy. Pro = best performance out there. Ultra = very good performance, and easier to remove.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eBombzor*
> 
> Wait, you gotta put the IHS back on after delidding? I just thought you put the heatsink on top of the die...


You can and this can result in crazy temp drops in one way only. That one way is a custom loop, with custom loops you have a much better heat dissipation area to your disposal so with items like the H100 you can't really do that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> first, gratz on the successfull delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ive used AS5 at first too, waiting for liquid pro to arrive,
> saw a 5-10C tempdrop with AS5, later using liquid pro on the die etc another 15+C
> looking forward to your tutorial


Like I said ill be making a couple diffferent versions.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> AS5 has a longer "curing time" than other TIMs. It is not at full efficiency until it has been through 200 hours of "heat cycling". i haven't noticed any mention of that here, so just for those who didn't know, AS5 improves its cooling performance over a break in period. It used to tell you this in the instructions that came with it.


Will remember this for the future.


----------



## I_shot

Please add me to the list









I delidded the chip with zalman zm-stg2 tim and for cooler surface i used zalman zm stg2 too. Here are the photos before and after;

Before Delidded room temp 23.2



After Delidded room temp 24.1



10 °C difference which is good for a 4.1 w/mk conductivity tim. i purchased alphacool 82 w/mk liquid metal which will arrive in 2 days. I'm getting excited maaan


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Please add me to the list
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I delidded the chip with zalman zm-stg2 tim and for cooler surface i used zalman zm stg2 too. Here are the photos before and after;
> Before Delidded room temp 23.2
> 
> After Delidded room temp 24.1


Nicely done, however you could probably lower temps even more if you used Liquid Pro. I'm of the belief that if anyone is going to put in the time and effort while risking damage to their CPU, why not get the absolute maximum benefit by using the best TIM you can.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Just ordered myself some Liquid Pro, hopefully it'll arrive on Thursday and I can get this delidded over the weekend, getting tired of seeing 80C at 4.5GHz.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Please add me to the list
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I delidded the chip with zalman zm-stg2 tim and for cooler surface i used zalman zm stg2 too. Here are the photos before and after;
> Before Delidded room temp 23.2
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After Delidded room temp 24.1
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 10 °C difference which is good for a 4.1 w/mk conductivity tim. i purchased alphacool 82 w/mk liquid metal which will arrive in 2 days. I'm getting excited maaan


where did you find the 82 w/mk of alphacool?
cant find it anywhere, if its true , it has the same w/mk as liquid pro, which is surprising to me,
would be a great addition to pro/ultra to use, maybe its easier to clean see..

could it be just another name for liquid pro?
the seringe really looks the same to me..

edit,
found another in the U.K.
Phobya Liquid Metal Thermal Compound LM (0.5g)
http://www.candccentral.co.uk/phobya-liquid-metal-thermal-compound-lm-0.5g-31001-1.html

Italy
Nanoxia Nano TF-1000 Liquid Metal Thermal Grease

if its not available in your country, look for liquid metal compound

another edit,
got the new amd 8350 to work, it was the bios that needed update








but my kiddo wants to use windows 8, i think all the temp readings are of,
doesnt matter what proggie i use to do the reading,
if i run prime, temps didnt go over 35C..lol
idle was 4-5C, but the temps in my hallway are higher, about 10C, so its not right


----------



## Hokies83

80c is pretty good 25c from TJ Max.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Please add me to the list
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I delidded the chip with zalman zm-stg2 tim and for cooler surface i used zalman zm stg2 too. Here are the photos before and after;
> Before Delidded room temp 23.2
> 
> After Delidded room temp 24.1
> 
> 10 °C difference which is good for a 4.1 w/mk conductivity tim. i purchased alphacool 82 w/mk liquid metal which will arrive in 2 days. I'm getting excited maaan


Nice sir! Just submit your info right and you'll be in (unless it was in the pocture then your all good but wait for pcwargamers approval im currently on mobile lol. But gratz!)


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Just ordered myself some Liquid Pro, hopefully it'll arrive on Thursday and I can get this delidded over the weekend, getting ****ed off seeing 80C at 4.5GHz.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 80c is pretty good 25c from TJ Max.


I assume your comment was directed at me?

While it may seem good, I'm also running a Full Custom Water Loop, consisting of an RX360 and RX240, thats quite a lot of rad to dissipate heat


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> I assume your comment was directed at me?
> While it may seem good, I'm also running a Full Custom Water Loop, consisting of an RX360 and RX240, thats quite a lot of rad to dissipate heat


Anything under 95c is good.


----------



## LukeJoseph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> LP is actually made of Gallium...You can try to find some of it, not sure if it will be easy or cheaper.


Yeah I read that, but that it also has tin and a few other elements in it. Just did a google search, and it might actually be Galinstan. So in theory one could crack open a thermometer or two. Hmmm anyone want me to try? Haha.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Yeah I read that, but that it also has tin and a few other elements in it. Just did a google search, and it might actually be Galinstan. So in theory one could crack open a thermometer or two. Hmmm anyone want me to try? Haha.


if it works, im gonna call you LuckyJoseph instead of LukeJoseph....lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

No way! Mercury is really dangerous unlike gallium...


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> where did you find the 82 w/mk of alphacool?
> cant find it anywhere, if its true , it has the same w/mk as liquid pro, which is surprising to me,
> would be a great addition to pro/ultra to use, maybe its easier to clean see..
> could it be just another name for liquid pro?
> the seringe really looks the same to me..
> edit,
> found another in the U.K.
> Phobya Liquid Metal Thermal Compound LM (0.5g)
> http://www.candccentral.co.uk/phobya-liquid-metal-thermal-compound-lm-0.5g-31001-1.html
> Italy
> Nanoxia Nano TF-1000 Liquid Metal Thermal Grease
> if its not available in your country, look for liquid metal compound
> another edit,
> got the new amd 8350 to work, it was the bios that needed update
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but my kiddo wants to use windows 8, i think all the temp readings are of,
> doesnt matter what proggie i use to do the reading,
> if i run prime, temps didnt go over 35C..lol
> idle was 4-5C, but the temps in my hallway are higher, about 10C, so its not right


i purchased this

http://www.firebal.net/asp/show_stock.asp?product=12716


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> i purchased this
> http://www.firebal.net/asp/show_stock.asp?product=12716


yea, found it, i see %100, 82 w/mk..metal...lol, im so multi language








thats why i already thought its the same as coollaboratory liquid pro , just another name, depending on the country?
Quote:


> To ensure the cooling and delivery of the world's best 100% Liquid Metal!! There is no way in all of silicon oxide or only liquid metal. There are no solid matter in any way. Liquid metal is nothing better than the incredible potential for cooling.
> Thermal conductivity value: 82 W / mK
> Weight: 0.5g
> 
> Price: 7.95 USD + KDV


how much is that in euro? i pay € 8,97 for 1 G.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, found it, i see %100, 82 w/mk..metal...lol, im so multi language
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thats why i already thought its the same as coollaboratory liquid pro , just another name, depending on the country?
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> To ensure the cooling and delivery of the world's best 100% Liquid Metal!! There is no way in all of silicon oxide or only liquid metal. There are no solid matter in any way. Liquid metal is nothing better than the incredible potential for cooling.
> Thermal conductivity value: 82 W / mK
> Weight: 0.5g
> 
> Price: 7.95 USD + KDV
> 
> 
> 
> how much is that in euro? i pay € 8,97 for 1 G.
Click to expand...

6 euro total for 0.5 gram


----------



## I_shot

OCN name:I_shot
CPU:i5 3570k
on die-TIM:Zalman ZM-STG2
ihs-TIM:Zalman ZM-STG2
Mhz gained: 200 mhz
OC after delid: 4.7 ghz
Temp drops:10
CPU-Z validation of max OC: not yet


----------



## Newfireorange

Hello. First time posting here. Been following you all. Decided to delid my 3570k today for the first time. I nicked a small spot next to the gold arrow on top of the PCB.

I would like your advice/opinion/flame.

Waiting on rest of PC to ship to me so I can't test it.

I warrantied it though at micro center for $20.


----------



## JoeTesla

So uh... getting mentally ready to try this again.

I understand Collaboratory's stuff is recommended between the chip and the IHS - but which ?

Pro ? Ultra ? one of their pads ?
link

Also, would you also recommend using it between the IHS and the waterblock? or is it better to go with Indigo ?

thanks


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> So uh... getting mentally ready to try this again.
> I understand Collaboratory's stuff is recommended between the chip and the IHS - but which ?
> Pro ? Ultra ? one of their pads ?
> link
> Also, would you also recommend using it between the IHS and the waterblock? or is it better to go with Indigo ?
> thanks


If you want the best temps use Pro on both. Ultra is easier to remove from the IHS/waterblock if you need to re-mount but Pro will give you the best temps from what I've seen.


----------



## I_shot

guys if you are gonna delid, you must be darn careful and patient. it is not so easy. some points you have to apply pressure and things go pretty ugly. you might cut the pcb and r.i.p chip. you should watch delidding videos and read guides. good luck


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Newfireorange*
> 
> Hello. First time posting here. Been following you all. Decided to delid my 3570k today for the first time. I nicked a small spot next to the gold arrow on top of the PCB.
> I would like your advice/opinion/flame.
> Waiting on rest of PC to ship to me so I can't test it.
> 
> I warrantied it though at micro center for $20.


doesnt look so deep. i think it's okay but you should put a ver very little Non-Electrical Conductive glue or something


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> No way! Mercury is really dangerous unlike gallium...


Modern thermometers don't tend to use Mercury in case someone were to drink it. A lot of them use Galinstan since it's non-toxic to humans. But even the mercury in thermometers is relatively safe, being pure metal, so long as you don't drink it of course.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh just bought 6 feet of led light strips 4 PCi-e UV reative extension cables Cpu/MB UV cables to.

Now i needs a side window @[email protected]


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Newfireorange*
> 
> Hello. First time posting here. Been following you all. Decided to delid my 3570k today for the first time. I nicked a small spot next to the gold arrow on top of the PCB.
> I would like your advice/opinion/flame.
> Waiting on rest of PC to ship to me so I can't test it.
> 
> I warrantied it though at micro center for $20.


Not only you lost manufacturer warranty, you also lost 20 bucks...


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Modern thermometers don't tend to use Mercury in case someone were to drink it. A lot of them use Galinstan since it's non-toxic to humans. But even the mercury in thermometers is relatively safe, being pure metal, so long as you don't drink it of course.


Mercury was never safe. Hatters used to use it during the process of turning fur into felt, absorb it, and get mercury poisoning which sends you "mad as a hatter" ( trembling (known as "hatters' shakes"), loss of coordination, slurred speech, loosening of teeth, memory loss, depression, irritability and anxiety). Some say you only have to handle it too frequently for this to happen, others say it is the "fumes", so either way mercury is not "safe" to handle AFAIK .....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Not only you lost manufacturer warranty, you also lost 20 bucks...


He still has all his warranty's

But we can not say how in public forum only PM.

And im not even sure about PM anymore i got an Infraction for providing information to a member in pm the other day aswell @[email protected]


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Trust me if i was behind the desk as a rep on microcenter returns section he would not get away with it... I only need to have in hand a magnifying glass and he would be mine in a couple of seconds XD..

I cannot condone from this kind of behaviors for alot of reasons when you can felt from this kind of practices as a customer yourself im sorry. Him from damaging product under warranty and microcenter for trying to resell a product as new...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Trust me if i was behind the desk as a rep on microcenter returns section he would not get away with it... I only need to have in hand a magnifying glass and he would be mine in a couple of seconds XD..


MC just going to rma it with intel why should MC even care if the Cpu looks undamaged and un modified why bother?

1 Lose customer = lose money

2 Rma with Intel keep customer make money.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

I dont even like when people go and try to cherry pick something and return it because it didnt make his expectations an come to this kind of places to openly say it..
Im sorry but no and mods should not allow this type of conduct in this place.... Like i said im very open to deliding or customizing hardware but (ON YOUR OWN RISK!!!!)

Not to come here and ask for guidance to get away with murder when you fail in doing so...


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Just got a 3770K. probably did not mount my CPU block correctly because same settings as 3570K i am getting 15C higher temps. Getting 97C under water 1.35v.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Just got a 3770K. probably did not mount my CPU block correctly because same settings as 3570K i am getting 15C higher temps. Getting 97C under water 1.35v.


How's the f15 bios?


----------



## Newfireorange

Thanks for the input. Think that little cut didn't do any damage. Can just barely feel it when I move my nail across it. And I don't think any lines are directly under it. If all else fails I'll just return it under warranty and get another.


----------



## Newfireorange

Circled the cut. I think some were looking too far up.


----------



## Nyghtryder_9

I would like to join the club




Highest core: 57c

OCN name: Nyghtryder_9
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CL Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: CL Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: 100mhz so far
OC after delid: 4.7
Temp drops: 21
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2620560

Cpu Lapped: 400, 800, 1000, 2000, 3000 grit


----------



## LuisGT

Waiting on my coollaboratory liquid ultra to arrive, which hopefully will be here tomorrow.












At the moment I have it with crappy arctic ceramique 2, will give a proper submission once the Liquid Ultra is on


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nyghtryder_9*
> 
> I would like to join the club
> Highest core: 57c
> OCN name: Nyghtryder_9
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CL Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: CL Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 100mhz so far
> OC after delid: 4.7
> Temp drops: 21
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2620560
> Cpu Lapped: 400, 800, 1000, 2000, 3000 grit


Nice, same thing i did. Congrats


----------



## Valgaur

Still waitin for dwood
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh just bought 6 feet of led light strips 4 PCi-e UV reative extension cables Cpu/MB UV cables to.
> Now i needs a side window @[email protected]


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Newfireorange*
> 
> 
> Circled the cut. I think some were looking too far up.


If still looks like is green on the scratch, you should be good to go.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> OCN name:I_shot
> CPU:i5 3570k
> on die-TIM:Zalman ZM-STG2
> ihs-TIM:Zalman ZM-STG2
> Mhz gained: 200 mhz
> OC after delid: 4.7 ghz
> Temp drops:10
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: not yet


*I_shot*, I keep looking for your pic of your delidded chip and have not found it. The rest of your info looks good though. Pleas post a delided chip pic so that you can be accepted!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Newfireorange*
> 
> Hello. First time posting here. Been following you all. Decided to delid my 3570k today for the first time. I nicked a small spot next to the gold arrow on top of the PCB.
> 
> I would like your advice/opinion/flame.
> 
> Waiting on rest of PC to ship to me so I can't test it.
> 
> I warrantied it though at micro center for $20.


I'd just give that chip a try as I think it will still work. Best of luck to you that it does *Newfireorange*!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nyghtryder_9*
> 
> I would like to join the club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Highest core: 57c
> 
> OCN name: Nyghtryder_9
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CL Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: CL Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 100mhz so far
> OC after delid: 4.7
> Temp drops: 21
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2620560
> 
> Cpu Lapped: 400, 800, 1000, 2000, 3000 grit


Looking good *Nyghtryder_9*! I think Valgaur would say you are accepted!









Congrats and enjoy your nice new temps!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Mercury was never safe. Hatters used to use it during the process of turning fur into felt, absorb it, and get mercury poisoning which sends you "mad as a hatter" ( trembling (known as "hatters' shakes"), loss of coordination, slurred speech, loosening of teeth, memory loss, depression, irritability and anxiety). Some say you only have to handle it too frequently for this to happen, others say it is the "fumes", so either way mercury is not "safe" to handle AFAIK .....


The elemental mercury in thermometers is just liquid metal though. It won't be absorbed by the skin. The mercury compounds that the hatters used and that are in fluorescent lights etc. are another story all together, however. I am not saying that mercury is SAFE, just that the mercury in thermometers is relatively safe to handle provided you do not eat it since the metal will not be absorbed through the skin.

That said, it's still best to leave them well alone.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> The elemental mercury in thermometers is just liquid metal though. It won't be absorbed by the skin. The mercury compounds that the hatters used and that are in fluorescent lights etc. are another story all together, however. I am not saying that mercury is SAFE, just that the mercury in thermometers is relatively safe to handle provided you do not eat it since the metal will not be absorbed through the skin.
> That said, it's still best to leave them well alone.


It's not bad. My father is a chemist and I am a chemist. I used to play with mercury when I was a kid. It was pretty fascinating how dense it is and fun to push globs of it around a table. Alot of people will say "that explains alot" haha. But I didn't suffer any ill efects and I can remember it being one of my favorite things to play with in his lab when I was a little kid.


----------



## alancsalt

I'm not convinced. I was always taught to keep away from it and not play with it.

Did a Google search just to see if science had changed its mind. They seem to be saying the vapor is the risk, and it evaporates at room temperature...quite a remarkable element.
Quote:


> Elemental mercury
> 
> Quicksilver (liquid metallic mercury) is poorly absorbed by ingestion and skin contact. It is hazardous due to its potential to release mercury vapor. Animal data indicate less than 0.01% of ingested mercury is absorbed through the intact gastrointestinal tract, though it may not be true for individuals suffering from ileus. Cases of systemic toxicity from accidental swallowing are rare, and attempted suicide via intravenous injection does not appear to result in systemic toxicity.[18] Though not studied quantitatively, the physical properties of liquid elemental mercury limit its absorption through intact skin and in light of its very low absorption rate from the gastrointestinal tract, skin absorption would not be high.[19] Some mercury vapor is absorbed dermally, but uptake by this route is only about 1% of that by inhalation.[20]
> 
> In humans, approximately 80% of inhaled mercury vapor is absorbed via the respiratory tract, where it enters the circulatory system and is distributed throughout the body.[21] Chronic exposure by inhalation, even at low concentrations in the range 0.7-42 μg/m3, has been shown in case control studies to cause effects such as tremors, impaired cognitive skills, and sleep disturbance in workers.[22][23]
> 
> Acute inhalation of high concentrations causes a wide variety of cognitive, personality, sensory, and motor disturbances. The most prominent symptoms include tremors (initially affecting the hands and sometimes spreading to other parts of the body), emotional lability (characterized by irritability, excessive shyness, confidence loss, and nervousness), insomnia, memory loss, neuromuscular changes (weakness, muscle atrophy, muscle twitching), headaches, polyneuropathy (paresthesia, stocking-glove sensory loss, hyperactive tendon reflexes, slowed sensory and motor nerve conduction velocities), and performance deficits in tests of cognitive function.[19]


Quote:


> Elemental mercury evaporates at room temperature and reacts with many elements to form salts, amalgams, and organo-mercury compounds. A number of these compounds are considered "highly hazardous" by the US EPA (P list) All mercury containing waste is considered hazardous and requires special disposal considerations.


Quote:


> Mercury is a liquid metal that is environmentally persistent and bioaccumulates in the food chain.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quite the amazing element indeed


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Mercury was never safe. Hatters used to use it during the process of turning fur into felt, absorb it, and get mercury poisoning which sends you "mad as a hatter" ( trembling (known as "hatters' shakes"), loss of coordination, *slurred speech, loosening of teeth, memory loss*, depression, irritability and anxiety). Some say you only have to handle it too frequently for this to happen, others say it is the "fumes", so either way mercury is not "safe" to handle AFAIK .....


i always wondered about the grey stuff my mother mixed in my dessert's, when i was a child ...LOL

guess now i know









i really like Gallium, melts in the hand..

Gallium is a silvery metal with atomic number 31. It's used in semiconductors and LEDs, but the cool thing about it is its melting point, which is only about 85 degrees Fahrenheit. If you hold a solid gallium crystal in your hand, your body heat will cause it to slowly melt into a silvery metallic puddle. Pour it into a dish, and it freezes back into a solid.

While you probably shouldn't lick your fingers after playing with it, gallium isn't toxic and won't make you crazy like mercury does. And if you get tired of it, you can melt it onto glass and make yourself a mirror.


----------



## stickg1

So is the gallium I put on my die in a liquid form all the time? I thought it would harden up. If its always a liquid then it would seem that my PC standing upright would let it all ooze off the die. I know there's pressure on the die but it just doesn't seem right. Do they add something to liquid pro to allow it to harden after it has been spread really thin?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So is the gallium I put on my die in a liquid form all the time? I thought it would harden up. If its always a liquid then it would seem that my PC standing upright would let it all ooze off the die. I know there's pressure on the die but it just doesn't seem right. Do they add something to liquid pro to allow it to harden after it has been spread really thin?


The process of heating and cooling hardens it, thats why you need to lap to get pro off, because it attaches itself to the block, ultra is different. It hardens, also very thin layer so nothing would EVER drip. Even if it did it wouldnt do anything ive booted with ultra on my cpu's pcb traces lol, pro I wouldnt want to get on a pcb >.>


----------



## VonDutch

its not 100% pure gallium, they at some other stuff as well,
and look at other compounds, they will harden also over time..


it will be pushed out if you put on to much tho, like this,

thin layers is the key ..

o , just found this,

"The liquid metal behaves similar to mercury. Application of the thermal compound should be done with a small, lint-free brush to distribute the compound evenly across processor or heat sink. After installation the *Liquid PRO will mature in 48 hours. It solidifies at that time* and achieves its optimal cooling performance."


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its not 100% pure gallium, they at some other stuff as well,
> and look at other compounds, they will harden also over time..
> 
> it will be pushed out if you put on to much tho, like this,
> 
> thin layers is the key ..
> o , just found this,
> "The liquid metal behaves similar to mercury. Application of the thermal compound should be done with a small, lint-free brush to distribute the compound evenly across processor or heat sink. After installation the *Liquid PRO will mature in 48 hours. It solidifies at that time* and achieves its optimal cooling performance."


I dont believe that Mature time... My cpu its on the same temps from the first time i fired up.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I dont believe that Mature time... My cpu its on the same temps from the first time i fired up.


Me neither, but i dont think it means the same as break-in period, like with AS5,
in this sentence it means in that time "It solidifies ",
what stickg1 was asking about in his post, if it hardens or not


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Trust me if i was behind the desk as a rep on microcenter returns section he would not get away with it... I only need to have in hand a magnifying glass and he would be mine in a couple of seconds XD..
> I cannot condone from this kind of behaviors for alot of reasons when you can felt from this kind of practices as a customer yourself im sorry. Him from damaging product under warranty and microcenter for trying to resell a product as new...


I had returned one delided chip to Microcenter before and exchanged it for another batch, the CS rep inspecting it never saw anything because there was nothing to see. If it's done right, then nobody will know ... even Intel ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> If still looks like is green on the scratch, you should be good to go.


I actually nicked my last (current) chip's PCB right by IHS, the green layer came off (exposing copper which was undamaged) on the length of around 1/4'' (5-6mm or so), very thin stripe (less than 0.5mm). I caused it because the way I handled the chip during the insertion of blade nicked it the moment the chip's PCB slipped in my other hand (holding it). TBH, I put some super thin layer of silicone on the exposed copper and then a tiny bit of TIM (I believe it was the one containing silver or aluminum particles), chip works perfectly fine, it's the one I've been using for nearly a month


----------



## stickg1

I get liquid pro all over the place the first application. I tried to do the die and the inside of the IHS. I tried to hold it still while I locked the socket clamp but it slid to much to the left and was way of center. So I took it all apart again and it was EVERYWHERE. I cleaned it up real good and reapplied as thin as I could on just the die.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I get liquid pro all over the place the first application. I tried to do the die and the inside of the IHS. I tried to hold it still while I locked the socket clamp but it slid to much to the left and was way of center. So I took it all apart again and it was EVERYWHERE. I cleaned it up real good and reapplied as thin as I could on just the die.


im looking for good pic's to use, to show how little you liquid pro you need on the die,
all i got so far is this one, its about that, or less..



on ihs


its easier to show a pic, then say "about this or that much" to peeps








if to much is applied, use the seringe to suck it up again, np ..


----------



## chas1723

Does liquid pro require any cure time?

Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I appled to both the die and IHS just as they show in this video and it worked flawlessly.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im looking for good pic's to use, to show how little you liquid pro you need on the die,
> all i got so far is this one, its about that, or less..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> on ihs
> 
> 
> 
> its easier to show a pic, then say "about this or that much" to peeps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if to much is applied, use the seringe to suck it up again, np ..


That's too much on the die though. It looks like there is more than the IHS. I haven't actually seen anyone post a pic with the appropriate amount on die before spreading.


----------



## chas1723

I must have messed up on the installation of pro. I have yet to delid but did lap my cpu. Temps are no better than the stock paste on my h100i. One day when I get time I will delid and see how it goes.
Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> That's too much on the die though. It looks like there is more than the IHS. I haven't actually seen anyone post a pic with the appropriate amount on die before spreading.


yea, thats why im asking, and not use those pic's to much, or all the time,
they just not good enough, they should be more the other way around like ...lol

so if anyone that still had to put liquid pro/ultra on the die,ihs etc,
can make some good pic's with the right amount, pls do,
they might be helpfull for others asking about the amount to apply








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chas1723*
> 
> I must have messed up on the installation of pro. I have yet to delid but did lap my cpu. Temps are no better than the stock paste on my h100i. One day when I get time I will delid and see how it goes.
> Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


you should see some improvement, but on the ihs only,
liquid pro performs as good as any other tim,
but you can always try a remount, see if it helps..


----------



## dalastbmills

Haven't been here in quite some time. How's everyone doing? How big is our following?

I was on here a week ago and saw some people running some pretty crazy overclocks with very little vcore. I was jumping back and forth betwen 4.6, 4.65, and 4.7 and have stopped on 4.7 at 1.408v. I saw some posts about people running similar or higher clocks with much less vcore. Been thinking about playing the lottery and going for another CPU.

Edit: Also asked for some gift cards to performance pcs so I can start building a custom loop. Will probably re-TIM my die, since I feel I have too much Ultra on it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im looking for good pic's to use, to show how little you liquid pro you need on the die,
> all i got so far is this one, its about that, or less..
> 
> on ihs
> 
> its easier to show a pic, then say "about this or that much" to peeps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if to much is applied, use the seringe to suck it up again, np ..


Should use my pictures for what to use on the IHS XD


----------



## stickg1

You know what I don't like though. The Q-Tip. What if one of the strands of cotton gets stuck in the metal. Wouldn't that hurt your heat transfer?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> You know what I don't like though. The Q-Tip. What if one of the strands of cotton gets stuck in the metal. Wouldn't that hurt your heat transfer?


Stuff coats it so Qtip is not making contact the tim is making contact with it's self

Ive put it on 4 r 6 things never an issue in those regards.

Also this is most likely the reason Cool Labs stresses using 1 side of the Q tip for the whole Ap.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, thats why im asking, and not use those pic's to much, or all the time,
> they just not good enough, they should be more the other way around like ...lol
> so if anyone that still had to put liquid pro/ultra on the die,ihs etc,
> can make some good pic's with the right amount, pls do,
> they might be helpfull for others asking about the amount to apply
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you should see some improvement, but on the ihs only,
> liquid pro performs as good as any other tim,
> but you can always try a remount, see if it helps..


I'll post some pics this Friday if my CPU is alive.
It has ultra atm but I'll replace it with pro on die. For the ihs I'll use ic diamond.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll post some pics this Friday if my CPU is alive.
> It has ultra atm but I'll replace it with pro on die. For the ihs I'll use ic diamond.


Use pro also.. You wont regret.

Btw. memory s arriving tomorow.







16GB ram here i go.


----------



## stickg1

I see...

Not that I need to buy is there any way to remove the liquid pro from the die or is that on there for good?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I see...
> Not that I need to buy is there any way to remove the liquid pro from the die or is that on there for good?


Martinm used it, and said it was fine. ("Fine" because he laps his CPU in between TIM tests anyways. Yes, it does require sandpaper)


----------



## Hokies83

I will be removing mine here soon to install my water loop..

Been on there a good while..

Il let u know how it goes..

However i will not be using sand paper on my Die lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Franky away today. Hope I get a good one!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Franky away today. Hope I get a good one!


Wow, that is taking a long time.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Wow, that is taking a long time.


I was being lazy lol. I put 2 day shipping. So I will have something pretty soon actually. Around end of next week.


----------



## Swag

I know some people will hate me for this but welcome my new headphones to Swag's family.







I got it for 50% off at Best Buy! Just in time for the Christmas season!


Spoiler: Sexy Headphones


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Martinm used it, and said it was fine. ("Fine" because he laps his CPU in between TIM tests anyways. Yes, it does require sandpaper)


To remove CLLP from die you don't need Sand Paper and I would never use sandpaper to clean DIE of CLLP. All I used to remove CLLP from die was alcohol. CPU is like glass and its not that hard to clean CLLP off of die.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know some people will hate me for this but welcome my new headphones to Swag's family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got it for 50% off at Best Buy! Just in time for the Christmas season!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Sexy Headphones


LoL you work at best buy ?

Anywho i had the really expensive Dr Dre ed of these there Alright. Sold them tho.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know some people will hate me for this but welcome my new headphones to Swag's family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got it for 50% off at Best Buy! Just in time for the Christmas season!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Sexy Headphones
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoL you work at best buy ?
> 
> Anywho i had the really expensive Dr Dre ed of these there Alright. Sold them tho.
Click to expand...

My first job actually.







It's a start so whatever.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My first job actually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a start so whatever.


Wut kinda discounts they give u there?

Best Buy is the only store of that type in my Area.. imo they keep dated old tech and over charge for everything and never have any good sales....


----------



## Matt-Matt

Got my liquid pro and ultra today! The same day I found out I got accepted into Uni!








Best day I've had in a while, not de-lidding today.. Probably not till after the break but I'm going to use the paste on my GPU.

Which one should I use and where should I use it? Just on the core, is it possible to use it on the VRM's somehow?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My first job actually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a start so whatever.
> 
> 
> 
> Wut kinda discounts they give u there?
> 
> Best Buy is the only store of that type in my Area.. imo they keep dated old tech and over charge for everything and never have any good sales....
Click to expand...

You can get any headphone/audio product for 50% off.







I'm going to buy these for a present: Speakers


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can get any headphone/audio product for 50% off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to buy these for a present: Speakers


No Gpus huh?

What kinda Amps they got there i could use a stronger amp for my speakers what do that got x4 ?

What im using now id like something with 3x the power..
http://www.amazon.com/Lepai-TRIPATH-TA2020-Stereo-Amplifier/dp/B003P534SW


----------



## ivanlabrie




----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can get any headphone/audio product for 50% off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to buy these for a present: Speakers
> 
> 
> 
> No Gpus huh?
> 
> What kinda Amps they got there i could use a stronger amp for my speakers what do that got x4 ?
> 
> What im using now id like something with 3x the power..
> http://www.amazon.com/Lepai-TRIPATH-TA2020-Stereo-Amplifier/dp/B003P534SW
Click to expand...

Haven't looked in the amps in Best Buy and I don't know why you should, better deals online.







And no, if you're referring to if we have sales on GPUs, you can but it's lower. It's like 20% or something. I don't remember fully.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know some people will hate me for this but welcome my new headphones to Swag's family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got it for 50% off at Best Buy! Just in time for the Christmas season!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Sexy Headphones


My soul was hurt.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know some people will hate me for this but welcome my new headphones to Swag's family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got it for 50% off at Best Buy! Just in time for the Christmas season!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Sexy Headphones
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My soul was hurt.
Click to expand...

Haha. I knew someone's soul was gonna be hurt or at least their heart was gonna be broken.







It was fairly cheap compared to the original price and they actually sound pretty good. I think by sound they're worth $150 but with their aesthetics combined, it was worth the $200.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haven't looked in the amps in Best Buy and I don't know why you should, better deals online.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And no, if you're referring to if we have sales on GPUs, you can but it's lower. It's like 20% or something. I don't remember fully.


LoL if u get 50% off ur gonna be cheaper.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know some people will hate me for this but welcome my new headphones to Swag's family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got it for 50% off at Best Buy! Just in time for the Christmas season!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Sexy Headphones


They're the same as the ones that get smashed in Die Antwoord's "I fink u freeky"?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know some people will hate me for this but welcome my new headphones to Swag's family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got it for 50% off at Best Buy! Just in time for the Christmas season!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Sexy Headphones
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They're the same as the ones that get smashed in Die Antwoord's "I fink u freeky"?
Click to expand...

I just watched it, those are the Beats Studios. I've been running this by some of my friends who hate Beats, but they said the Pros are the only ones worth listening through and they're pretty good for the price I got them at.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just watched it, those are the Beats Studios. I've been running this by some of my friends who hate Beats, but they said the Pros are the only ones worth listening through and they're pretty good for the price I got them at.


It's not that they're not worth listening to, I'm sure they are decent, but its more of "I can get something better for a cheaper price." Kinda like apple, the products are good, but you can get something better for cheaper. At half price you limit the market at which you can get something better, but you can still probably find something. All that matter's is if you like the sound, because audio is somewhat subjective, compared to some amd fanboy on youtube arguing his chip beats i7's and xeons at video encoding.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just watched it, those are the Beats Studios. I've been running this by some of my friends who hate Beats, but they said the Pros are the only ones worth listening through and they're pretty good for the price I got them at.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not that they're not worth listening to, I'm sure they are decent, but its more of "I can get something better for a cheaper price." Kinda like apple, the products are good, but you can get something better for cheaper. At half price you limit the market at which you can get something better, but you can still probably find something. All that matter's is if you like the sound, because audio is somewhat subjective, compared to some amd fanboy on youtube arguing his chip beats i7's and xeons at video encoding.
Click to expand...

Yea, price matters all the time. It's like paying 100G for a Toyota Camry. They're great, but they aren't worth the price (@100G).


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, price matters all the time. It's like paying 100G for a Toyota Camry. They're great, but they aren't worth the price (@100G).


Cars are kind of like audio, their specs mean something, but not everything lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Its like this. My 100 dollar headphones have the exxact same ohms.. er whatever the value is for the musical output I know its around ohms but I can't remember but anyways its the exact same value of 32. If you care about music get some 600 ohms headphones. But then you run into hardware output. If your using onboard soundcard many of them go to the 58 area. But pcie lane ones with up to 124 hertz there we go shesh. Imma go look im a curious cat now. Brb


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Its like this. My 100 dollar headphones have the exxact same ohms.. er whatever the value is for the musical output I know its around ohms but I can't remember but anyways its the exact same value of 32. If you care about music get some 600 ohms headphones. But then you run into hardware output. If your using onboard soundcard many of them go to the 58 area. But pcie lane ones with up to 124 hertz there we go shesh. Imma go look im a curious cat now. Brb


Learn more about it.







If you really want great sound, then you wouldn't connect your headphones into an onboard soundcard or soundcard at all.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Learn more about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you really want great sound, then you wouldn't connect your headphones into an onboard soundcard or soundcard at all.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Franky away today. Hope I get a good one!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Wow, that is taking a long time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was being lazy lol. I put 2 day shipping. So I will have something pretty soon actually. Around end of next week.
Click to expand...

You know we are all dying to hear about your new chip once you get it to know if you get a winner or not! Really hoping for a winner for you bud!!! Something worthy as a successor to Franky!


----------



## Swag

I honestly like speakers more than headphones, but I can't use them at night so I don't see a point in speakers anymore for me.


----------



## Valgaur

I was just referencing but yes ohms is right I thought so. But as ohms get higher you need amped output which some comps don't have for high output headphones.

It also completely depends on the manufacturers usage of parts. That's the main thing really. Have a 400 dollar pair with crappy parts. Or a 300 dollar pair with really good parts 300 one wins.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Should use my pictures for what to use on the IHS XD


i can use those 2, look good enough, together with this one,

should be good enough to show how much, or little, liquid pro you need on the IHS, thanks









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll post some pics this Friday if my CPU is alive.
> It has ultra atm but I'll replace it with pro on die. For the ihs I'll use ic diamond.


Thanks ivan, some pics with the right amount on the die i still need so ..great


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I honestly like speakers more than headphones, but I can't use them at night so I don't see a point in speakers anymore for me.



Nominal output power (total) 505 Watt
Max (RMS) output power (total) 1010 Watt
Response bandwidth 33 - 20000 Hz
Input impedance 8 KOhm
Signal-To-Noise ratio 100 dB
Output level (SPL) 115 dB
THX certified Yes
Audio amplifier Integrated
Connectivity technology Wired
Built-in decoders Dolby Digital,
DTS decoder,
DTS 96/24,
Dolby Pro Logic II

Features 4 x Satellite speaker - 62 Watt - Wired,
1 x Center channel speaker - 69 Watt - Wired,
1 x Subwoofer - 188 Watt - Wired
Driver details Satellite speaker : 1 x Full-range driver - 3 in - Aluminum
Driver details Center channel speaker : 1 x Full-range driver - 3" - Aluminum
Driver details Subwoofer : 1 x Subwoofer driver - 10"

i like my speakers ..lol 10 inches subwoofer = 25.4 centimeters
my neighbours hate me








do use "DFX Audio Enhancer" with it, works very good, would advice this proggie to anyone with a
speaker set connected to a computer..
http://www.fxsound.com/dfx/index.php


----------



## ivanlabrie

I use headphones too...regular ones, not too terrible sounding fed from the onboard soundcard atm.
Little apartment with stupid cranky old neighbors meh :/


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My first job actually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a start so whatever.


You must be the only Best Buy employee on the planet that has any enthusiast PC knowledge...

I go in fairly often to browse the small section of PC parts they carry. Every now and then there is a really good deal. For instance yesterday I snagged a PNY 560ti for $130. Anyway, I've had to help them help the customer a few times and it usually turns into the customer ditching the employee and just buying whatever I tell them. It's usually about CPU cooling, this one guy asked if the CM TX3 or Antec 620 would work on his CPU and the best buy guy said no, so I butt in and say, yes, yes it will. And get some of this too...(handed him a tube of Antec Formula 7). That was nothing though. I actually was asked to leave and never come back from the Savannah store because I got into an argument with the employee.

It started out just casually looking at GPUs, he came over and tried to sell me a 660ti, I was like "meh, for $350 (what they were charging at the time) I could go online and get a 7970." So he proceeded to tell me that a 660ti would smoke a 7970. I tried to not laugh too hard. Then this poor guy comes up and it turns out his problem was a broken fan blade on his CM 212 Evo he just got in one of those giant DIY Newegg bundles and he wanted to get up and running asap. Well the best buy employee was encouraging him to buy a new cooler, not just a cooler, a $120 H100. So knowing this employee is complete clown shoes I walk over to give my input. I told the guy all he needs is a new fan, I showed him on the TX3 they had how to mount his new fan, gave him a tube of paste and saved the poor guy $90. Also, the H100 wasn't even going to fit in his case (Antec 300). So I saved him the hassle of going home with a product that costs way too much and wont even work.

Well the Best Buy employee was like, "Dude, you don't work here, you can't tell people what they should buy." to which I replied, "Well apparently you can't either because that wasn't going to work and if you knew anything about computers you would know this H100 is massive and needs a 240mm rad mount, I saved that guy time and money, he will probably come back to this store some day without a bad taste in his mouth from the time you screwed him over." Then I forget what we said next but it got ugly and a couple employees escorted me out.

Bottomline, your coworkers need to step their game up or just stay in the nintendo section.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I use headphones too...regular ones, not too terrible sounding fed from the onboard soundcard atm.
> Little apartment with stupid cranky old neighbors meh :/


What's that young fella? Stop your mumbling! Turn the stereo down and speak up!









I heard that......!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I use headphones too...regular ones, not too terrible sounding fed from the onboard soundcard atm.
> Little apartment with stupid cranky old neighbors meh :/


still looking for some headphones, wireless with microphone etc,
expensive buggers they are tho..

my dream is to have one of these,

TRITTON's Warhead 7.1 Wireless Surround Headset is a truly wireless solution - - no need to connect a chat cable to your Xbox 360 gaming controller! A robust 5.8GHz wireless signal ensures interference-free operation from other 2.4GHz wireless devices and provides crystal-clear audio at a range of 33 feet. Hear immersive 7.1 Dolby Headphone surround sound through a pair of precision-tuned 50mm speakers featuring Neodymium magnets. With two rechargeable battery packs for 24/7 gaming, one battery always charging on the base station means you can simply swap in a fresh pack whenever the headset needs more energy.


Tritton 720+ 7.1 Surround Headset, or this one, but its wired..

my gigabyte 7970 windforce 3 will arrive within 2 hours from now ...whaaaaaaa!!! ...soooo excited ...lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Oh, we got some toys incoming! MVG comes tomorrow...
Alan, oh so funny









VonDutch, feed your kids man, it's not fair you go spending their food money on hardware lol


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> VonDutch, feed your kids man, it's not fair you go spending their food money on hardware lol


Especially as he makes them work all day delidding old P4! We have videos to proove that!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Oh, we got some toys incoming! MVG comes tomorrow...
> Alan, oh so funny
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VonDutch, feed your kids man, it's not fair you go spending their food money on hardware lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Especially as he makes them work all day delidding old P4! We have videos to proove that!


whaha
















thats why they live with their mum, so they get some food etc,
but when it comes to playing games, learn about computers etc, "I'm da man!!" ....LOL

djeez, is this oc easy or what..

1100 mhz, 1500 for the memory..didnt change anything yet.. looks good or?
whats strange, it isnt that much faster then my 6850 running cinebench ..lol
using the latest drivers, 12.11beta 11, and 12.11CAP



tempted to reinstall windows, i have like 3 different drivers for vid cards on it now,
windows wasnt to happy me uninstalling them, tried to re-install all the time ..grmbl..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah VonDutch...reinstall is in order xD
You got an ssd yet? It took 15 min to install Win7 64 on mine.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah VonDutch...reinstall is in order xD
> You got an ssd yet? It took 15 min to install Win7 64 on mine.


yea, im afraid so, dang..
yea, got my vertex 4, so reinstall should be fast,
servicepack is already on the cd too so ..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah VonDutch...reinstall is in order xD
> You got an ssd yet? It took 15 min to install Win7 64 on mine.


Yea installing Windows from a flash drive onto an SSD takes like 10-15 minutes tops these days, it's great.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool, should be done in a breeze...I bet that if you do a clean 12.11b install you'll see much better performance from your card.
You should be doing 1200mhz core and 1800mhz memory btw








Is that card voltage unlocked? Have you tried with afterburner/sapphire trixx?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool, should be done in a breeze...I bet that if you do a clean 12.11b install you'll see much better performance from your card.
> You should be doing 1200mhz core and 1800mhz memory btw
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that card voltage unlocked? Have you tried with afterburner/sapphire trixx?


nope, im open to suggestions, never had a card like this,
and it should be a good overclocker too, of what iver heard..
better use afterburner?
yea, im trying to get to 1200mhz..and at least (1500) 6000 for the memory, maybe more,
i noticed the oc for memory improves the card alot

anyways, first prepare to reinstall windows ..bbl


----------



## PuffinMyLye

If my computer shuts down completely while in the middle of a Prime run is that a signal of instability? I just want to be sure my system isn't shutting down automatically due to some temperature safety feature.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> If my computer shuts down completely while in the middle of a Prime run is that a signal of instability? I just want to be sure my system isn't shutting down automatically due to some temperature safety feature.


Yep, instability...probably it bsod and rebooted by itself without you seeing the bsod. There's a useful program that stores those in a log, it's in the ivy super stable club thread I think.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yep, instability...probably it bsod and rebooted by itself without you seeing the bsod. There's a useful program that stores those in a log, it's in the ivy super stable club thread I think.


Ok cool that's what I thought I just wanted to be sure. And yea I have that program I guess I should start using it







.


----------



## feniks

if it restarted (or shutdown) without BSOD then it could be your CPU PLL voltage too low, it does that under load.
if that was with offset vcore and 5GHz+ clock then it's not PLL, have seen the same thing a few times, so far don't know how to fix it, mine was happening at light load though (yet stable at full load).


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> if it restarted (or shutdown) without BSOD then it could be your CPU PLL voltage too low, it does that under load.
> if that was with offset vcore and 5GHz+ clock then it's not PLL, have seen the same thing a few times, so far don't know how to fix it, mine was happening at light load though (yet stable at full load).


Yea it definitely happens without a BSOD and it is with offset at 5.0+Ghz.


----------



## lilchronic

blue screen view
http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/blue_screen_view.html


----------



## VonDutch

i ran a passmark , performance test 8.0, all tests, got 5413 points








http://www.passmark.com/baselines/V8/display.php?id=2386913851
top 20 starts at 6101..lol
is the score any good?

oced my 7970 to 1150mhz, and 1500 on memory, but wouldnt run cinebench, blue screen 0x116
using msi afterburner, but i cant up voltage..,
so backed down to 1100mhz 1500 memory for now,
till i know how to up voltage..


----------



## ivanlabrie

You have to enable unofficial overclocking, search that here.
'afterburner unofficial overclocking'
That string should show you how to enable higher clocks and voltage in AB.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

How many of you tweak your CPU PLL voltage to help your max OC? I've never touched it (it's on auto) and I'm wondering if it helps with very high OC's.


----------



## feniks

I usually was dropping it down to 1.5V at 4.7GHz to save on temps... now at daily 4.9GHz I keep it at 1.6V ... for max clocks while benching I usually give it a little boost to 1.85V ... never tried higher.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I usually was dropping it down to 1.5V at 4.7GHz to save on temps... now at daily 4.9GHz I keep it at 1.6V ... for max clocks while benching I usually give it a little boost to 1.85V ... never tried higher.


So highering it can help with a max OC but will hurt your temps...good to know.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Same as Feniks, I had to raise mine to go really high...52x prior delid.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You have to enable unofficial overclocking, search that here.
> 'afterburner unofficial overclocking'
> That string should show you how to enable higher clocks and voltage in AB.


thanks, will look into it tommz








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> How many of you tweak your CPU PLL voltage to help your max OC? I've never touched it (it's on auto) and I'm wondering if it helps with very high OC's.


i used it with lower oc's, if you lower it then, it can help make a oc stable, and sometimes lower temps a bit,
i used 1.6-1.70ish, most of the time. with higher oc's they told me its best to leave it on 1.8V..

edit
or what the above guys said ...LOL


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I think if left on auto (which is what I've had it on since I haven't tweaked it yet) it sets it to 1.835 automatically. Is that too high? Should I manually set it? I'm trying to test 5.2Ghz+.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I think if left on auto (which is what I've had it on since I haven't tweaked it yet) it sets it to 1.835 automatically. Is that too high? Should I manually set it? I'm trying to test 5.2Ghz+.


not to high yet, i do put 1.8V manually always, i dont trust auto,
same with vcore on auto, most of the time way to much,
what feniks said, upto 1.85V should be no problem,
i think i saw val say once upto 1.9V..
personally i never used it above 1.8V, didnt see the need


----------



## chris-br

WOOHOO. memory is here, installed and all 4 sticks are working.







8 8 8 24 1T..


----------



## FtW 420

Picked up a retail batch 3229C, low voltage for average clocks in quick stability tests but runs pretty hot. Starts to crap out right after 4.7Ghz & have to pack on the voltage after that though, nothing special cold & not what I want...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yet voltage for 4.7ghz is so much better than mine...1.37v for full stability in my case.
Have you tested it cold?

Btw, if I have some luck I may get a pot soon...


----------



## FtW 420

Quick cold test, going up to 1.74v from here did not let it boot over 5700Mhz.


----------



## Valgaur

PLL is ment for just watching thr stability sdide of an OC its what really regulates vcore for auto. I have it manually set as well. When I was OCing I had it at 1.9 all the time. Then for like my 4.5 I had 1.5 then with 4.8 I only need 1.6 and 4.9 wanted 1.7 5.2 need 1.8 everything else wanted more and I just threw 1.9 at it.

Oh Von! Gratz on the new card buddy! Tell me what you get for some 3dmark11 scores then I can tell you if its good or not.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> PLL is ment for just watching thr stability sdide of an OC its what really regulates vcore for auto. I have it manually set as well. When I was OCing I had it at 1.9 all the time. Then for like my 4.5 I had 1.5 then with 4.8 I only need 1.6 and 4.9 wanted 1.7 5.2 need 1.8 everything else wanted more and I just threw 1.9 at it.
> Oh Von! Gratz on the new card buddy! Tell me what you get for some 3dmark11 scores then I can tell you if its good or not.


Thanks for the info.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh USPS got my Block/pump hung up somewhere... Thing should have been here the 19th.. but has not updated since the 18th heh...

At this rate the stuff i ordered from Cali a day later then it will be here before it lol...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh USPS got my Block/pump hung up somewhere... Thing should have been here the 19th.. but has not updated since the 18th heh...
> At this rate the stuff i ordered from Cali a day later then it will be here before it lol...


I've never had any luck with usps. I've shipped 1 time from them, it got their a week late, and i've gotten 2 shipments from them and both were lost the first time.


----------



## Hokies83

well dude did not insure it.. he gonna have to refund me if it is lost..

I insure everything that is more then 30$ insurance is like 1$....

Why i have perfect feed back XD


----------



## stickg1

I had a 7970, 5830, Gigabyte 970A-UD3, and Phenom II X3 B73 all in the same package supposed to arrive today. I made my ol lady stay home to answer the door. Well of course the one time she left the house to take the kids to school the FedEx guy came and left a notice at the door. At 8:15am, I didn't even know they came that early! I never got anything before noon....

She called FedEx and they said since its the holidays this guy is a subcontracted and wont return to the office until tomorrow morning. So he has my package still and we tried to get FedEx to let us meet up with him and he refused. I will never use FedEx again...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My first job actually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a start so whatever.
> 
> 
> 
> You must be the only Best Buy employee on the planet that has any enthusiast PC knowledge...
> 
> I go in fairly often to browse the small section of PC parts they carry. Every now and then there is a really good deal. For instance yesterday I snagged a PNY 560ti for $130. Anyway, I've had to help them help the customer a few times and it usually turns into the customer ditching the employee and just buying whatever I tell them. It's usually about CPU cooling, this one guy asked if the CM TX3 or Antec 620 would work on his CPU and the best buy guy said no, so I butt in and say, yes, yes it will. And get some of this too...(handed him a tube of Antec Formula 7). That was nothing though. I actually was asked to leave and never come back from the Savannah store because I got into an argument with the employee.
> 
> It started out just casually looking at GPUs, he came over and tried to sell me a 660ti, I was like "meh, for $350 (what they were charging at the time) I could go online and get a 7970." So he proceeded to tell me that a 660ti would smoke a 7970. I tried to not laugh too hard. Then this poor guy comes up and it turns out his problem was a broken fan blade on his CM 212 Evo he just got in one of those giant DIY Newegg bundles and he wanted to get up and running asap. Well the best buy employee was encouraging him to buy a new cooler, not just a cooler, a $120 H100. So knowing this employee is complete clown shoes I walk over to give my input. I told the guy all he needs is a new fan, I showed him on the TX3 they had how to mount his new fan, gave him a tube of paste and saved the poor guy $90. Also, the H100 wasn't even going to fit in his case (Antec 300). So I saved him the hassle of going home with a product that costs way too much and wont even work.
> 
> Well the Best Buy employee was like, "Dude, you don't work here, you can't tell people what they should buy." to which I replied, "Well apparently you can't either because that wasn't going to work and if you knew anything about computers you would know this H100 is massive and needs a 240mm rad mount, I saved that guy time and money, he will probably come back to this store some day without a bad taste in his mouth from the time you screwed him over." Then I forget what we said next but it got ugly and a couple employees escorted me out.
> 
> Bottomline, your coworkers need to step their game up or just stay in the nintendo section.
Click to expand...

Many idiots in the world and a lot of them don't want help from anyone else. Most of the PC workers usually just say, it has an i7 so it will be faster not knowing that each i7 is special and that there are different families. Like some think Sandy and Ivy are the same thing, just two different models of the CPU. I'm always in awe with these type of people.


----------



## Hokies83

Welp my Package was supposed to be here Wednesday Today was thursday and still not here...

2 Things i ordered a day later then it got here before it did...

The tracking has not changed since the 18th..

I called today and they said i could not open a case until Friday so ima open a case in the morning..

Kinda pissed... why could it not have been the fittings i ordered used ar 1/2 price missing? why did it have to be my block and pump?


----------



## stickg1

Because apparently the world hates PC enthusiasts this time of year...


----------



## dmanstasiu

Yup.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i ran a passmark , performance test 8.0, all tests, got 5413 points
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.passmark.com/baselines/V8/display.php?id=2386913851
> top 20 starts at 6101..lol
> is the score any good?
> 
> oced my 7970 to 1150mhz, and 1500 on memory, but wouldnt run cinebench, blue screen 0x116
> using msi afterburner, but i cant up voltage..,
> so backed down to 1100mhz 1500 memory for now,
> till i know how to up voltage..


Great to hear you got that card *VonDutch*!!! Real good card to. I bet you have some fun OCing it!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> WOOHOO. memory is here, installed and all 4 sticks are working.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 8 8 8 24 1T..


Sounds like some nice mem *chris-br*!









What are they?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My first job actually.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a start so whatever.
> 
> 
> 
> You must be the only Best Buy employee on the planet that has any enthusiast PC knowledge...
> 
> I go in fairly often to browse the small section of PC parts they carry. Every now and then there is a really good deal. For instance yesterday I snagged a PNY 560ti for $130. Anyway, I've had to help them help the customer a few times and it usually turns into the customer ditching the employee and just buying whatever I tell them. It's usually about CPU cooling, this one guy asked if the CM TX3 or Antec 620 would work on his CPU and the best buy guy said no, so I butt in and say, yes, yes it will. And get some of this too...(handed him a tube of Antec Formula 7). That was nothing though. I actually was asked to leave and never come back from the Savannah store because I got into an argument with the employee.
> 
> It started out just casually looking at GPUs, he came over and tried to sell me a 660ti, I was like "meh, for $350 (what they were charging at the time) I could go online and get a 7970." So he proceeded to tell me that a 660ti would smoke a 7970. I tried to not laugh too hard. Then this poor guy comes up and it turns out his problem was a broken fan blade on his CM 212 Evo he just got in one of those giant DIY Newegg bundles and he wanted to get up and running asap. Well the best buy employee was encouraging him to buy a new cooler, not just a cooler, a $120 H100. So knowing this employee is complete clown shoes I walk over to give my input. I told the guy all he needs is a new fan, I showed him on the TX3 they had how to mount his new fan, gave him a tube of paste and saved the poor guy $90. Also, the H100 wasn't even going to fit in his case (Antec 300). So I saved him the hassle of going home with a product that costs way too much and wont even work.
> 
> Well the Best Buy employee was like, "Dude, you don't work here, you can't tell people what they should buy." to which I replied, "Well apparently you can't either because that wasn't going to work and if you knew anything about computers you would know this H100 is massive and needs a 240mm rad mount, I saved that guy time and money, he will probably come back to this store some day without a bad taste in his mouth from the time you screwed him over." Then I forget what we said next but it got ugly and a couple employees escorted me out.
> 
> Bottomline, your coworkers need to step their game up or just stay in the nintendo section.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many idiots in the world and a lot of them don't want help from anyone else. Most of the PC workers usually just say, it has an i7 so it will be faster not knowing that each i7 is special and that there are different families. Like some think Sandy and Ivy are the same thing, just two different models of the CPU. I'm always in awe with these type of people.
Click to expand...

I remember something like this happening in a Best Buy last year when I was looking at two GPU's and I had bench results open on one of their computers to verify what I wanted, and one of the sales persons came up and said one of the cards would just smoke the other - I said no it won't. He said sure it would. I said, well I have the side-by-side benches right here - take a look. He did not even do so, just walked away. I have learned to never ask a Best Buy salesmen anything as I know they just don't know, but that never stops them from telling you what to buy! LOL


----------



## Hokies83

Anyways this is what i got in the mail today.

Still missing my Block/pump my 80mm thick 240 rad and my Swifttech 240 40mm rad/pump combo.

look at the lights those CoolerMaster losers will not give me a Side window for the Cosmos 2 And Dwood is being to slow so im going to make my own..

However i will still be saving to buy a Case Labs TH10...


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I remember something like this happening in a Best Buy last year when I was looking at two GPU's and I had bench results open on one of their computers to verify what I wanted, and one of the sales persons came up and said one of the cards would just smoke the other - I said no it won't. He said sure it would. I said, well I have the side-by-side benches right here - take a look. He did not even do so, just walked away. I have learned to never ask a Best Buy salesmen anything as I know they just don't know, but that never stops them from telling you what to buy! LOL


You gotta remember that the ones who don't know anything sell more stuff, whereas someone who knows will tell you what you don't need or recommend a cheaper product....tsk, tsk, bad for the business..


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I remember something like this happening in a Best Buy last year when I was looking at two GPU's and I had bench results open on one of their computers to verify what I wanted, and one of the sales persons came up and said one of the cards would just smoke the other - I said no it won't. He said sure it would. I said, well I have the side-by-side benches right here - take a look. He did not even do so, just walked away. I have learned to never ask a Best Buy salesmen anything as I know they just don't know, but that never stops them from telling you what to buy! LOL
> 
> 
> 
> You gotta remember that the ones who don't know anything sell more stuff, whereas someone who knows will tell you what you don't need or recommend a cheaper product....tsk, tsk, bad for the business..
Click to expand...

Sadly, you are spot on....


----------



## Hokies83

I do not shop in best buy lol they really bad on prices.

i did however go to afew PC shops looking for i5 750s / i5 760s.. and they were trying to sell me garbage used old dell crap....

i was like dude i just want the cpu.. and they said they do not just sell Cpus.. i was like ok thx bye.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Anyways this is what i got in the mail today.
> Still missing my Block/pump my 80mm thick 240 rad and my Swifttech 240 40mm rad/pump combo.
> look at the lights those CoolerMaster losers will not give me a Side window for the Cosmos 2 And Dwood is being to slow so im going to make my own..
> However i will still be saving to buy a Case Labs TH10...


Is that the NZXT sleeved LED lights? I like those, I've had a few different sets.

As far as the window goes, I would just cut my own. I've done it quite a few times.

This is my old old case, an Antec 300. Not the most exciting mod but it looked a whole lot cooler when I was done.





BEFORE

AFTER


----------



## Hokies83

Yeah there the Nzxt lights thought they were great for the price.


----------



## chas1723

Definitely did something wrong with my liquid pro install. My temps are now higher than with the stock h100i paste. Guess I have to reinstall this weekend.

Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah there the Nzxt lights thought they were great for the price.


They are priced very well. I actually have a red and a blue 1 meter set in my current case. I got a red, white, and blue theme going on. It looks a little better when I have a GPU installed because the bottom is clearly red and the top is clearly blue.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Many idiots in the world and a lot of them don't want help from anyone else. Most of the PC workers usually just say, it has an i7 so it will be faster not knowing that each i7 is special and that there are different families. Like some think Sandy and Ivy are the same thing, just two different models of the CPU. I'm always in awe with these type of people.


There is a shop like that here, not as bad but still..

I needed a 120mm coolermaster red LED fan to match my build, the guy goes "Sorry we have none in stock, but we have this 140mm Noctua for $38" which is almost 3 times what I was planning on spending. Their prices are okay on their lower end "Custom PC's" but the high end ones all use Noctua fans @ $38 or something a piece and cost a fortune. I overheard an employee saying to a customer that he needs to get rid of his 5850 and get a 6850 as it is the direct upgrade path and the 5850 is too slow to run newer games. I just chuckled and left









(This was about 12 months ago)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> They are priced very well. I actually have a red and a blue 1 meter set in my current case. I got a red, white, and blue theme going on. It looks a little better when I have a GPU installed because the bottom is clearly red and the top is clearly blue.


How did u secure the side window in that case? looks like it is in a rubber frame are something?

On the LEds i bought a 1 meter kit and a 2 meter kit..

Hope it is enough the 2 meter kit is to go all the way around the MB door frame..
The 1 meter kit is to high light the MB area etc etc.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How did u secure the side window in that case? looks like it is in a rubber frame are something?
> On the LEds i bought a 1 meter kit and a 2 meter kit..
> Hope it is enough the 2 meter kit is to go all the way around the MB door frame..
> The 1 meter kit is to high light the MB area etc etc.


My bet is on double-sided tape


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How did u secure the side window in that case? looks like it is in a rubber frame are something?
> On the LEds i bought a 1 meter kit and a 2 meter kit..
> Hope it is enough the 2 meter kit is to go all the way around the MB door frame..
> The 1 meter kit is to high light the MB area etc etc.


I tried laying a 1 meter light kit behind the motherboard once so it looked backlit and it didn't work.







It was drowned out by all the other LEDs from the fans.

The window, I used a u channel molding I got from eBay, it was like $6 for 5 feet or so. I don't think I can link it here but I can find it and pm it to you. I just did the molding because I was lazy and didn't want to file and touch-up paint all the semi-rough edges. I used a jigsaw to cut it out but I made a start cut with a dremel. I use jig-saws daily at work, with wood not metal, so it was much easier and faster for me.

Anyway, to secure the acrylic I just used some 20lb/inch double sided tape. It's surprisingly strong, I had planned on riveting it, but drilling through acrylic without risking putting cracks in it usually requires a special bit that my hardware store doesn't carry. And seeing as how I'm the king of impatience there's no way I could have waited a week for one to show up. I did cut the corners of the rubber molding joints at 45 degree angles to make a nice 90 degree turn. Or if you do rounded corners you can just do one piece. That can take some adjusting so if you have a 12x12 window I would go ahead and order twice as much molding as you need. I ended up using left over molding to line the edges of my motherboard tray holes and fan holes for a clean look and if I slide cables through it doesn't get hung up or cut with the rough edges of thin metal.


----------



## Hokies83

You can post Ebay links.

Only ones you cannot post is links to your own auctions.

How is the dbl sided tape holding the window in?
This U channel is what is holding it in correct?

I only have the two 200mm Led fans so my leds should be fine in those regards.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can post Ebay links.
> Only ones you cannot post is links to your own auctions.
> How is the dbl sided tape holding the window in?
> This U channel is what is holding it in correct?
> I only have the two 200mm Led fans so my leds should be fine in those regards.


The double-sided tape has one side applied to the inside of the side-panel, and the window extends past the "cut" and goes over the tape. You plan an extra 2" past the edge of the window

The u-channel just ... stays. i know it's weird, but it just does


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chas1723*
> 
> Definitely did something wrong with my liquid pro install. My temps are now higher than with the stock h100i paste. Guess I have to reinstall this weekend.
> Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


Provide pics then we can assist much better. Please it really is the best way.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> Nominal output power (total) 505 Watt
> Max (RMS) output power (total) 1010 Watt
> Response bandwidth 33 - 20000 Hz
> Input impedance 8 KOhm
> Signal-To-Noise ratio 100 dB
> Output level (SPL) 115 dB
> THX certified Yes
> Audio amplifier Integrated
> Connectivity technology Wired
> Built-in decoders Dolby Digital,
> DTS decoder,
> DTS 96/24,
> Dolby Pro Logic II
> Features 4 x Satellite speaker - 62 Watt - Wired,
> 1 x Center channel speaker - 69 Watt - Wired,
> 1 x Subwoofer - 188 Watt - Wired
> Driver details Satellite speaker : 1 x Full-range driver - 3 in - Aluminum
> Driver details Center channel speaker : 1 x Full-range driver - 3" - Aluminum
> Driver details Subwoofer : 1 x Subwoofer driver - 10"
> i like my speakers ..lol 10 inches subwoofer = 25.4 centimeters
> my neighbours hate me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> do use "DFX Audio Enhancer" with it, works very good, would advice this proggie to anyone with a
> speaker set connected to a computer..
> http://www.fxsound.com/dfx/index.php


How come Logitech isn't making anymore Z-5500's and/or a successor? They used to go for $299.99 and now there going for about $1000 dollars!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Oh Von! Gratz on the new card buddy! Tell me what you get for some 3dmark11 scores then I can tell you if its good or not.


can u tell me if my 670 ftw is good or not








http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5293164


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> can u tell me if my 670 ftw is good or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5293164


that's pretty good for a 670, similar to mine.
Nice work!


----------



## LukeJoseph

So I got my Liquid Ultra in today. My Liquid Pro was supposed to be here too, but lets just say USPS sucks.

Regardless I decided to do a test with the Ultra. I know the Pro is supposed to be the best way to go for the Die, but read the Ultra is easy to remove (just regular paste), so now I can do a direct comparative test between Ultra and Pro.

Don't pay attention to the volts I was running or anything like that. This is a new build and I JUST diagnosed a bad ram stick. But for the purposes of testing I didn't want to change anything at all.

Before I had AS5 (cured) on both the DIE and IHS. Now I have Ultra on the Die and AS5 on the IHS.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I tried laying a 1 meter light kit behind the motherboard once so it looked backlit and it didn't work.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It was drowned out by all the other LEDs from the fans.
> The window, I used a u channel molding I got from eBay, it was like $6 for 5 feet or so. I don't think I can link it here but I can find it and pm it to you. I just did the molding because I was lazy and didn't want to file and touch-up paint all the semi-rough edges. I used a jigsaw to cut it out but I made a start cut with a dremel. I use jig-saws daily at work, with wood not metal, so it was much easier and faster for me.
> Anyway, to secure the acrylic I just used some 20lb/inch double sided tape. It's surprisingly strong, I had planned on riveting it, but drilling through acrylic without risking putting cracks in it usually requires a special bit that my hardware store doesn't carry. And seeing as how I'm the king of impatience there's no way I could have waited a week for one to show up. I did cut the corners of the rubber molding joints at 45 degree angles to make a nice 90 degree turn. Or if you do rounded corners you can just do one piece. That can take some adjusting so if you have a 12x12 window I would go ahead and order twice as much molding as you need. I ended up using left over molding to line the edges of my motherboard tray holes and fan holes for a clean look and if I slide cables through it doesn't get hung up or cut with the rough edges of thin metal.


This?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Computer-Modding-Rubber-U-Channel-Rubber-Window-Fan-Molding-/200656775592?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eb81369a8
Guy wants 10$ for 5 feet gotta be somewhere cheaper...

2 sided tape i found seems to be foarm padded a bit.. is there a brand that is flat?

http://www.lowes.com/Search=2+sided+tape?storeId=10151&langId=-1&catalogId=10051&N=0&newSearch=true&Ntt=2+sided+tape


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This?
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Computer-Modding-Rubber-U-Channel-Rubber-Window-Fan-Molding-/200656775592?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eb81369a8
> Guy wants 10$ for 5 feet gotta be somewhere cheaper...


MNPC has it, FrozenCPU has it, PerformancePCs might have it


----------



## Hokies83

Meh i got it from the ebay guy 10 feet for 15$..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> How come Logitech isn't making anymore Z-5500's and/or a successor? They used to go for $299.99 and now there going for about $1000 dollars!


really?? time to sell mine then..lol
idk why, seems the successor(Logitech Z906) isnt as good as the "old" Z-5500

im trying to find answers guys, its hard to get them in the, [Official] AMD Radeon HD 7950/7970/7990 Owners Thread..
i will copy my last posts here, and hope one of you can help me out









I quote,

how did you guys unlock afterburner voltage?

i used, Getting Started with Radeon HD 7970 Overclocking on this forum,
http://www.overclock.net/a/getting-started-with-radeon-hd-7970-overclocking,
but it doesnt work, can anyone help me with this ?








got bsod 0x116 when i oced to 1150mhz, 1500 memory..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i used Catalyst Control Center at first, but had other drivers installed too,
> windows started messing up the install of the new drivers,
> 12.11beta11 and 12.11CAP, but got it to work, when i ran cinebench, i didnt get much higher as my old 6850 oc,
> 
> 
> decided to reinstall windows , then the new drivers etc,
> used afterburner this time, im upto 107fps now in cinebench,
> is that good, or am i still doing something wrong,
> also, looks like afterburner doesnt remember my settings,
> im using profile, then click apply.. but on next reboot settings are default again..
> i just used combuster to test my first oc
> 
> what can i use "power limit" in afterburner for? if i run into trouble with oc's?
> what i want is 1200mhz and 1600 on memory, if possible of course ..lol


already posted this a few pages ago, but you guys are soooo fast ..lol
some of the things i already solved, but to unlock the voltage in AB is a hard one

end quote

I quote
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stubass*
> 
> try clicking on settings in AB, on the first TAB "Geraral" check "unlock Voltage Control"


i did that,i also downloaded 2 dll's, like they said elsewhere, atipdl64, atipdlxx dll's
http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=359671
copy/past them in the AB folder etc..


checked all of these, changed the kernel mode to user also, when it didnt work, unchecked it again,
reboot, no go still..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theDTP*
> 
> Which 7970 do you have ?


its in my sig also, but its a Gigabyte GV-R797OC-3GD

my AB looks a bit different then the one i used above,


just did 3DMARK 11 (Performance) test, P10695
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5294244
is that a good score?

and i changed these 2 lines,
[ATIADLHAL]
UnofficialOverclockingMode=1
UnofficialOverclockingEULA=I confirm that I am aware of unofficial overclocking limitations and fully understand that MSI will not provide me any support on it

The cfg files are located at:
/MSI Afterburner/Profiles/MSIAfterburner.cfg
/MSI Afterburner/MSIAfterburner.cfg

at first only this one tho,
UnofficialOverclockingMode=1

then my screen got all messed up, black lines (desktop) all over the place, stuttering etc

end quote

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Oh Von! Gratz on the new card buddy! Tell me what you get for some 3dmark11 scores then I can tell you if its good or not.


TY!!







just did that test first time this morning, at 1100/1500

P10695
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5294244
is that a good score?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> can u tell me if my 670 ftw is good or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5293164


That's a pretty good score for a 670 man. Darn how good those things are for price to my 680. Ugh
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> really?? time to sell mine then..lol
> idk why, seems the successor(Logitech Z906) isnt as good as the "old" Z-5500
> im trying to find answers guys, its hard to get them in the, [Official] AMD Radeon HD 7950/7970/7990 Owners Thread..
> i will copy my last posts here, and hope one of you can help me out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I quote,
> how did you guys unlock afterburner voltage?
> i used, Getting Started with Radeon HD 7970 Overclocking on this forum,
> http://www.overclock.net/a/getting-started-with-radeon-hd-7970-overclocking,
> but it doesnt work, can anyone help me with this ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> got bsod 0x116 when i oced to 1150mhz, 1500 memory..
> already posted this a few pages ago, but you guys are soooo fast ..lol
> some of the things i already solved, but to unlock the voltage in AB is a hard one
> end quote
> I quote
> i did that,i also downloaded 2 dll's, like they said elsewhere, atipdl64, atipdlxx dll's
> http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=359671
> copy/past them in the AB folder etc..
> 
> checked all of these, changed the kernel mode to user also, when it didnt work, unchecked it again,
> reboot, no go still..
> its in my sig also, but its a Gigabyte GV-R797OC-3GD
> my AB looks a bit different then the one i used above,
> 
> just did 3DMARK 11 (Performance) test, P10695
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5294244
> is that a good score?
> and i changed these 2 lines,
> [ATIADLHAL]
> UnofficialOverclockingMode=1
> UnofficialOverclockingEULA=I confirm that I am aware of unofficial overclocking limitations and fully understand that MSI will not provide me any support on it
> The cfg files are located at:
> /MSI Afterburner/Profiles/MSIAfterburner.cfg
> /MSI Afterburner/MSIAfterburner.cfg
> at first only this one tho,
> UnofficialOverclockingMode=1
> then my screen got all messed up, black lines (desktop) all over the place, stuttering etc
> end quote
> TY!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just did that test first time this morning, at 1100/1500
> P10695
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5294244
> is that a good score?


That's a great score actually. Mess with the drivers and the OCs sometimes certain drivers give better results. Like for my 680 the beta drivers always seem to do better than the regular drivers.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This?
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Computer-Modding-Rubber-U-Channel-Rubber-Window-Fan-Molding-/200656775592?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eb81369a8
> Guy wants 10$ for 5 feet gotta be somewhere cheaper...
> 2 sided tape i found seems to be foarm padded a bit.. is there a brand that is flat?
> http://www.lowes.com/Search=2+sided+tape?storeId=10151&langId=-1&catalogId=10051&N=0&newSearch=true&Ntt=2+sided+tape


Yep that's the stuff, and I used the first tape on that listing, the 10lb/inch. It is kind of thick but its about the same thickness that the rubber u-channel will stand the glass off of the side panel. So it works perfect.

Keep that tape in a safe place. My three year old got his hands on it, I left the room for a few minutes and he laid it across the keyboard of my laptop and closed the screen down on it. When I pried it open the entire home row ripped off of the keyboard!! LOL. That kid is the devil...

EDIT: And yeah I forgot about the guy's $5 shipping. But MNPCtech and FrozenCPU have similar stuff although I don't like it as much and their 3 day shipping is $7 so I guess it works out better with the ebay guy. Do you have a dremel and a jigsaw? Also I used a framing square to mark out the window and a half roll of tape to make the two rounded corners. I didn't like the complete square window and I thought the 4 rounded corners looked too common so that's why I did the 2 90's and 2 rounded. It was my first case mod and when I was done I was quite proud of my work. I sold that system to a guy down the road for a G note.

i5-2500K @ 4.5GHz
ASUS Maximus IV Gene-Z68
Samsung Super RAM 2133 CL10
Kuhler 620
Sapphire 7870
Enermax Liberty 500w
Samsung 830 64GB
Seagate Barra 1TB
NZXT blue lighting
Bunch of decent fans

Sadly I couldn't use that money to buy a better rig, it had to go to looming debt. Still sad to see it go, he uses it as his office for a work computer and runs 5 monitors off of it. I stop by to see it from time to time. Makes me sad and happy at the same time. My one condition was that he had to put it on top of his desk for everyone to see it.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Great to hear you got that card *VonDutch*!!! Real good card to. I bet you have some fun OCing it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds like some nice mem *chris-br*!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What are they?


F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM 2 of these.... Working nice, had to up vtt to 1.15 and imc to 1.10 and vdimm to 1.55, now is all good and stable as before, but with 16gb ram.


----------



## beniroc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> really?? time to sell mine then..lol
> idk why, seems the successor(Logitech Z906) isnt as good as the "old" Z-5500
> im trying to find answers guys, its hard to get them in the, [Official] AMD Radeon HD 7950/7970/7990 Owners Thread..
> i will copy my last posts here, and hope one of you can help me out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I quote,
> how did you guys unlock afterburner voltage?
> i used, Getting Started with Radeon HD 7970 Overclocking on this forum,
> http://www.overclock.net/a/getting-started-with-radeon-hd-7970-overclocking,
> but it doesnt work, can anyone help me with this ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> got bsod 0x116 when i oced to 1150mhz, 1500 memory..
> already posted this a few pages ago, but you guys are soooo fast ..lol
> some of the things i already solved, but to unlock the voltage in AB is a hard one
> end quote
> I quote
> i did that,i also downloaded 2 dll's, like they said elsewhere, atipdl64, atipdlxx dll's
> http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=359671
> copy/past them in the AB folder etc..
> 
> checked all of these, changed the kernel mode to user also, when it didnt work, unchecked it again,
> reboot, no go still..
> its in my sig also, but its a Gigabyte GV-R797OC-3GD
> my AB looks a bit different then the one i used above,
> 
> just did 3DMARK 11 (Performance) test, P10695
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5294244
> is that a good score?
> and i changed these 2 lines,
> [ATIADLHAL]
> UnofficialOverclockingMode=1
> UnofficialOverclockingEULA=I confirm that I am aware of unofficial overclocking limitations and fully understand that MSI will not provide me any support on it
> The cfg files are located at:
> /MSI Afterburner/Profiles/MSIAfterburner.cfg
> /MSI Afterburner/MSIAfterburner.cfg
> at first only this one tho,
> UnofficialOverclockingMode=1
> then my screen got all messed up, black lines (desktop) all over the place, stuttering etc
> end quote
> TY!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just did that test first time this morning, at 1100/1500
> P10695
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5294244
> is that a good score?


Try deleting the MSIAfterburner.oem file in the program folder and restart afterburner. This worked on my ghz flashed 7970.


----------



## VonDutch

hey, im back couldnt get on the site for hours ..o well..

omg, playing battlefield 3 with my new beast!
all settings ultra with 4x msaa, full hd, fps, caspian border, 64 players server bla bla ...on avarage, 90-100 fps
















me happy ...hell yeah!! haha..i will try to unlock the voltage, not sure if its really needed yet,
got it upto 1100/1500 over the 1000/1375 oc.. my aim was 1200/1600 tho ..


----------



## stickg1

Can I put liquid pro on my 7970?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Can I put liquid pro on my 7970?


i did 3 vid cards with it, and gonna do my new 7970 also








the other cards gave about 10C tempdrop on avarage ..
i would say, yes you can ..lol


----------



## chris-br

I did on my 6970.


----------



## I_shot

guys finally i got the phobya liquid metal (it wasn't alphacool btw) which is a massive product , dropped temps minimum 5 degrees on load compare to zalman zm stg2. I just applied to cooler surface and boom. great great performance.i will try it on chip die . i would like to show you the delidded chip but the server seems to have a problem. i cant do it right now. link to phobya liquid metal

http://www.candccentral.co.uk/phobya-liquid-metal-thermal-compound-paste-lm-1g-31003.html


----------



## enigma7820

yea looks like pro and a great price. anyway I dropped 12c at load switching from icd7 on the die to liquid ultra on the die


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> Nominal output power (total) 505 Watt
> Max (RMS) output power (total) 1010 Watt
> Response bandwidth 33 - 20000 Hz
> Input impedance 8 KOhm
> Signal-To-Noise ratio 100 dB
> Output level (SPL) 115 dB
> THX certified Yes
> Audio amplifier Integrated
> Connectivity technology Wired
> Built-in decoders Dolby Digital,
> DTS decoder,
> DTS 96/24,
> Dolby Pro Logic II
> Features 4 x Satellite speaker - 62 Watt - Wired,
> 1 x Center channel speaker - 69 Watt - Wired,
> 1 x Subwoofer - 188 Watt - Wired
> Driver details Satellite speaker : 1 x Full-range driver - 3 in - Aluminum
> Driver details Center channel speaker : 1 x Full-range driver - 3" - Aluminum
> Driver details Subwoofer : 1 x Subwoofer driver - 10"
> i like my speakers ..lol 10 inches subwoofer = 25.4 centimeters
> my neighbours hate me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> do use "DFX Audio Enhancer" with it, works very good, would advice this proggie to anyone with a
> speaker set connected to a computer..
> http://www.fxsound.com/dfx/index.php
> 
> 
> 
> How come Logitech isn't making anymore Z-5500's and/or a successor? They used to go for $299.99 and now there going for about $1000 dollars!
Click to expand...

The Z-5500's have been replaced by the Logitech Z-906 for around $300. They are very simluar except that the 5500's have a better sub-woffer. Both are good for computer speakers. The 5500's are also rarer now and that is why their price is getting higher.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beniroc*
> 
> Try deleting the MSIAfterburner.oem file in the program folder and restart afterburner. This worked on my ghz flashed 7970.


tried it, didnt work, hard one , but read somewhere else the gigabyte cant be unlocked, its hardware locked?
on the other hand i see some peeps have success flashing it with the ghz 7970 bios?
even if it doesnt work, and still is locked, the voltage on the ghz 7970 is higher then mine, about 1.25V,
mine is about 1.170,


my temps where just a bit over 50C max while playing bf3 ,
was amazed on the fps, i figured it would do 50-60fps with bf3, ultra, msaa 4x etc..
90-100fps is crazy









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> The Z-5500's have been replaced by the Logitech Z-906 for around $300. They are very simluar except that the 5500's have a better sub-woffer. Both are good for computer speakers. The 5500's are also rarer now and that is why their price is getting higher.


would sell mine for $1000 right away,
heck, even $500 ..lol








when i first saw this set, i knew i wanted it,
even when you turn up the volume, the sound stays good..
its missing some of the middle tones, but using the DFX audio enhancer really
makes a big difference..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> guys finally i got the phobya liquid metal (it wasn't alphacool btw) which is a massive product , dropped temps minimum 5 degrees on load compare to zalman zm stg2. I just applied to cooler surface and boom. great great performance.i will try it on chip die . i would like to show you the delidded chip but the server seems to have a problem. i cant do it right now. link to phobya liquid metal
> http://www.candccentral.co.uk/phobya-liquid-metal-thermal-compound-paste-lm-1g-31003.html


yea , same here, couldnt/bad loggin for hours, or make a post etc
better now..
yea, i think they sell it in some countries under another name,
its the same as coollaboratory tho..


----------



## PCWargamer

"do use "DFX Audio Enhancer" with it, works very good, would advice this proggie to anyone with a
speaker set connected to a computer..
http://www.fxsound.com/dfx/index.php"

*VonDutch*, I checked out the link above. Do you use the free version of this, or did you pay for it. And does it really work and worth it?


----------



## Hokies83

Just waiting on the U molding now...





Santa delivered this in my mail box today..  @ thickness...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey, im back couldnt get on the site for hours ..o well..
> omg, playing battlefield 3 with my new beast!
> all settings ultra with 4x msaa, full hd, fps, caspian border, 64 players server bla bla ...on avarage, 90-100 fps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> me happy ...hell yeah!! haha..i will try to unlock the voltage, not sure if its really needed yet,
> got it upto 1100/1500 over the 1000/1375 oc.. my aim was 1200/1600 tho ..


bf3 maxed with a single 7970? Seems good, ima try it with sli disabled on my 690 lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just waiting on the U molding now...
> 
> 
> 
> Santa delivered this in my mail box today..  @ thickness...


hell yeah man! Cut her up!

Hey you guys will appreciate this, I took apart my 7970 and added liquid pro and I shaved 12-15C off the load temp. Tested using Unigine, before 77C, now 63C. Reference cooler.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Nice drops, I can't wait to put the Kuhler 920 with CLU on my 7970


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> hell yeah man! Cut her up!
> Hey you guys will appreciate this, I took apart my 7970 and added liquid pro and I shaved 12-15C off the load temp. Tested using Unigine, before 77C, now 63C. Reference cooler.


Pro is amazing man, works even better with water.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Nice drops, I can't wait to put the Kuhler 920 with CLU on my 7970


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Pro is amazing man, works even better with water.


I just put it on my GTX560ti that I use for 24/7 folding. Before after folding for several hours the temps would be between 65C-77C, I'll let you know in a few hours what happens with the 560ti. Looking good so far, only been a few minutes but in the 50s.


----------



## kgtuning

Hokies.... not sure if you found some but these guys have that u channel for super cheap.
http://www.bestbyte.net/merchant/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=BB&Category_Code=CACM


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Hokies.... not sure if you found some but these guys have that u channel for super cheap.
> http://www.bestbyte.net/merchant/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=BB&Category_Code=CACM


That stuff is so square :/ I prefer the rounded c-strip myself


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> That stuff is so square :/ I prefer the rounded c-strip myself


IDK it looks good on my friends case...

http://www.overclock.net/t/1234611/operation-freedom-mays-mod-of-the-month-thank-you-overclock-net/70#post_17146569

I never used any on my side panel.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> IDK it looks good on my friends case...
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1234611/operation-freedom-mays-mod-of-the-month-thank-you-overclock-net/70#post_17146569
> I never used any on my side panel.


That's a sexy side panel







nice cut. Did you repaint after or was the paint just untouched from the cut ?

Edit: I'm familiar with Freedom. I'm just saying I prefer C-strip which is completely subjective


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> That's a sexy side panel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nice cut. Did you repaint after or was the paint just untouched from the cut ?
> Edit: I'm familiar with Freedom. I'm just saying I prefer C-strip which is completely subjective


Thanks!
that side panel isn't even a factory piece, Its aluminum and intentionally painted flat black. think it is 1/16 inch thick.


----------



## juntzo

What's with all the OT posts? I've been lurking since page 1 and joined just recently to learn all about delidding before trying it myself.

Now it seems that only 10% of the posts are about delidding.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's the delidded club after all, tis where we hang out xD

Guys got my MVG today and I get a nice debug code 00 and it seems to boot, no strange loops at all.
I gotta get up really early to buy a dvi to vga converter though, gave mine away lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i did 3 vid cards with it, and gonna do my new 7970 also
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the other cards gave about 10C tempdrop on avarage ..
> i would say, yes you can ..lol


I put ultra on my 7950 and it didn't do much for temps. Idle dropped like 2c and loads was about 6c or so, not too sure if I applied it right though..
I spread it with the cotton tip on the core and not on the cooler, are you meant to do both or just one like I did?
Also the metal on my cooler is really rough, quite terrible actually.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I put ultra on my 7950 and it didn't do much for temps. Idle dropped like 2c and loads was about 6c or so, not too sure if I applied it right though..
> I spread it with the cotton tip on the core and not on the cooler, are you meant to do both or just one like I did?
> Also the metal on my cooler is really rough, quite terrible actually.


I did it on the die and block also because there isn't much pressure beside screws pressing the die to the block on the gpu, really different from the pressure the cpu die and ihs get, but I applied it to both on my cpu as well. I went from 50c load 34c idle on my 690 under water with mx-4 (crappy install) to 18c idle and 30c load with pro.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I did it on the die and block also because there isn't much pressure beside screws pressing the die to the block on the gpu, really different from the pressure the cpu die and ihs get, but I applied it to both on my cpu as well. I went from 50c load 34c idle on my 690 under water with mx-4 (crappy install) to 18c idle and 30c load with pro.


Might re-do it someday.. I'm only using ultra because I accidentally squirted out some pro and i've got about "1 Unit" left" customs took heaps too


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Might re-do it someday.. I'm only using ultra because I accidentally squirted out some pro and i've got about "1 Unit" left" customs took heaps too


Applying pro was much easier than ultra for me. Removing was the same because my ultra stuck on my cpu block so I had to lap it anyway. And couldn't you just soak it back up using the syringe? I always keep a good stock of pro, best stuff ever.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ultra has no needle thingie, I think...I found Pro to be easier to apply too. Ultra left an ugly grayish spot on my die and ihs/heatsink base.
I'm gonna have to lap my ihs at least, after I confirm the cpu works though xD
I can't believe I forgot I needed a dvi/vga dongle for my CRT lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juntzo*
> 
> What's with all the OT posts? I've been lurking since page 1 and joined just recently to learn all about delidding before trying it myself.
> Now it seems that only 10% of the posts are about delidding.


Well the thing is that many people have OT questions for us and then we help them. We have become more of general information and when people ask for delidding information they get it really quick and correct. Its all about delidding here but it all branches off.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> "do use "DFX Audio Enhancer" with it, works very good, would advice this proggie to anyone with a
> speaker set connected to a computer..
> http://www.fxsound.com/dfx/index.php"
> *VonDutch*, I checked out the link above. Do you use the free version of this, or did you pay for it. And does it really work and worth it?


well.euhm..i dont use the free version, but didnt pay for it ..








the free version only wont let you use the surround button,
and the adjustments go to 5 instead of all the way upto 10,
but even then youll notice the difference
and yes, its deffo worth it, im using it for years now,
if i install, play music etc, and hit the on/off button,
the difference in sound is big..really









the newest one integrates with your comp, so it will run on
anything that needs sound , movies, wmp, youtube etc etc..
the older versions, you needed to install for wmp only, then for another player also , not cool,
but the newest is really easy..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ultra has no needle thingie, I think...I found Pro to be easier to apply too. Ultra left an ugly grayish spot on my die and ihs/heatsink base.
> I'm gonna have to lap my ihs at least, after I confirm the cpu works though xD
> I can't believe I forgot I needed a dvi/vga dongle for my CRT lol




no needle








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juntzo*
> 
> What's with all the OT posts? I've been lurking since page 1 and joined just recently to learn all about delidding before trying it myself.
> Now it seems that only 10% of the posts are about delidding.


thats why we have most of the info on page 1








if anyone still has questions after reading through that,
they can just ask, and notice theres always someone here to help








o, if you really lurked since page 1, you should know more by now then most of us ..LOL


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Valgaur! Got my mobo...gonna have to challenge you to spi32m.
Your I7? Any news yet?


----------



## Swag

I just ordered another set of Coollaboratory Liquid Pro (5). If I decide to, I will host a giveaway.

I'll see if I can afford a 3770K and delid that and start doing some crazy benching.







Of course, I'm going to test the chip first before delidding so if I don't like it, I can always just return it or something and go back to my 3570k or take another round at the silicon lottery. I honestly haven't seen too many chips running around recently so I'm a bit wary of jumping on a 3770K.


----------



## tw33k

I just ordered some Pro so I can run a comparison against my results with Ultra. I need to know which is actually the better of the two.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I just ordered some Pro so I can run a comparison against my results with Ultra. I need to know which is actually the better of the two.


liquid pro








because it has a higher w/mk then ultra,

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

so it should outperform ultra, but i see nice tempdrops with ultra also


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> bf3 maxed with a single 7970? Seems good, ima try it with sli disabled on my 690 lol.


i was amazed how it ran bf3 really, didnt expect it to be this good,
but really, all maxed out, will try make a vid today for youtube,
to show the gameplay fps, settings etc..give you guys the link, as "proof"









at first i let the game handle settings, fps was about 120 on average








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hey you guys will appreciate this, I took apart my 7970 and added liquid pro and I shaved 12-15C off the load temp. Tested using Unigine, before 77C, now 63C. Reference cooler.


yea, gonna do my 7970 too, but never opened a big card like this before,
my older cards was just 4 screws, this one takes a bit more effort i think ..lol
but the older cards where about the same tempdrops, about 10C on average


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juntzo*
> 
> What's with all the OT posts? I've been lurking since page 1 and joined just recently to learn all about delidding before trying it myself.
> 
> Now it seems that only 10% of the posts are about delidding.


Well, the only reason to delid is if you are overclocking and run into temp issues.... So of course there is a ton of OC & OT posts on here silly! The two go together!









And then lots of other good stuff to talk about related to computers because lots of us like to hang out on this thread as it has many helpuful & cool people who like to hang out on this thread..... If you like to be helpful and cool, then you can hang out here too! There is always something to learn, and if you do have any delidding question ask away and someone will answer it quickly.









So that's why all the OT posts on here...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> "do use "DFX Audio Enhancer" with it, works very good, would advice this proggie to anyone with a
> speaker set connected to a computer..
> http://www.fxsound.com/dfx/index.php"
> *VonDutch*, I checked out the link above. Do you use the free version of this, or did you pay for it. And does it really work and worth it?
> 
> 
> 
> ... snip ...
> the free version only wont let you use the surround button,
> and the adjustments go to 5 instead of all the way upto 10,
> but even then youll notice the difference
> and yes, its deffo worth it, im using it for years now,
> if i install, play music etc, and hit the on/off button,
> the difference in sound is big..really
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the newest one integrates with your comp, so it will run on
> anything that needs sound , movies, wmp, youtube etc etc..
> the older versions, you needed to install for wmp only, then for another player also , not cool,
> but the newest is really easy..
Click to expand...

Sounds like it sounds good! Makes me want to try it out!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I just ordered some Pro so I can run a comparison against my results with Ultra. I need to know which is actually the better of the two.


I have tried both and both are very good. I found that PRO cools around 1-3C better for me. Both were about the same to apply and both are hard to remove compared to other TIMs, but PRO was harder than Ultra to remove.

Try them both yourself and let us know what you find.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> liquid pro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> because it has a higher w/mk then ultra,
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> so it should outperform ultra, but i see nice tempdrops with ultra also


I've seen those numbers and I don't know if I believe them so I'll see for myself when the Pro gets here


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> liquid pro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> because it has a higher w/mk then ultra,
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> so it should outperform ultra, but i see nice tempdrops with ultra also
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've seen those numbers and I don't know if I believe them so I'll see for myself when the Pro gets here
Click to expand...

I think it's more of that either one has surpassed the amount of heat anything can transfer if you get what I mean. Like not enough pull from the die to the IHS to use the full potential of either TIM or the HSF isn't pulling heat enough from the IHS for any difference between the two.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I've seen those numbers and I don't know if I believe them so I'll see for myself when the Pro gets here


of course, nothing better the to try it yourself, and "proof" it that way,
those numbers arent a lie tho, it is what it is, pro is the winner when it comes to w/mk,
my experience is only with AS5 and liquid pro so far, but dont feel the need to use another tim then pro anymore,
i dont mind the "hard" cleaning it later, im confident i will do it good, and using the same tim( liquid pro) on it again,
makes it easier to leave some on, which cant be cleaned, if so...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sounds like it sounds good! Makes me want to try it out!


i think you will be happily surprised, i had a "wow" felling back then for sure,
if you dont like it, just uninstall it again ..np








but my bet is you wont..lol


----------



## tw33k

Yeah...I know what you mean. I just don't see Pro performing any better than Ultra. On my AMD FX-8150 using a Phanteks cooler, I get a delta temp of 9.8c with an ambient temp of 23.7c. Water cooled systems would be hard pressed to have a delta temp under 10c. It's hard to believe that Pro could do a better job than this.


----------



## Hokies83

Heh removing 5.25 bays from cosmos 2 makes it where u can fit a 360 rad there ill get an external blurry drive and ill mount my fan controller into my side door.


----------



## juntzo

Quote:


> Well the thing is that many people have OT questions for us and then we help them. We have become more of general information and when people ask for delidding information they get it really quick and correct. Its all about delidding here but it all branches off.


Quote:


> thats why we have most of the info on page 1 smile.gif
> if anyone still has questions after reading through that,
> they can just ask, and notice theres always someone here to help thumb.gif
> o, if you really lurked since page 1, you should know more by now then most of us ..LOL


you're right actually. i've learned so much that i hardly have any more questions to ask. LOL
right now i'm just concerned on the longevity of a delidded ivy bridge since i'll be using this for work and not so much on gaming.
i do image rendering and right now i have 2 rigs with 2600k so i'm not in a rush to build a delidded 3770k rig.
although it's the next build before haswell.










i've ordered both the ultra and pro and i'm just waiting for some days off for i'm so much busy with work these days!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Valgaur! Got my mobo...gonna have to challenge you to spi32m.
> Your I7? Any news yet?


Well is the chip okay! Tell me the answers darn it phil!







and chip should have been there today but I think weather delayed its flight from siuox falls to lousiville kentucky....... it better not get lost I would cry so hard so fast.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juntzo*
> 
> you're right actually. i've learned so much that i hardly have any more questions to ask. LOL
> right now i'm just concerned on the longevity of a delidded ivy bridge since i'll be using this for work and not so much on gaming.
> i do image rendering and right now i have 2 rigs with 2600k so i'm not in a rush to build a delidded 3770k rig.
> although it's the next build before haswell.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i've ordered both the ultra and pro and i'm just waiting for some days off for i'm so much busy with work these days!


Great to hear! Hope so see some good temps for you as well sir!

Mentally prepared yet to delid that bad boy?


----------



## juntzo

Quote:


> Mentally prepared yet to delid that bad boy?


thanks to all of you, yes!









just waiting for a few straight days off


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Yeah...I know what you mean. I just don't see Pro performing any better than Ultra. On my AMD FX-8150 using a Phanteks cooler, I get a delta temp of 9.8c with an ambient temp of 23.7c. Water cooled systems would be hard pressed to have a delta temp under 10c. It's hard to believe that Pro could do a better job than this.


Not sure what you mean but I get a delta temp of less than 0.5c, that is the power of pro.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juntzo*
> 
> you're right actually. i've learned so much that i hardly have any more questions to ask. LOL
> right now i'm just concerned on the longevity of a delidded ivy bridge since i'll be using this for work and not so much on gaming.
> i do image rendering and right now i have 2 rigs with 2600k so i'm not in a rush to build a delidded 3770k rig.
> although it's the next build before haswell.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i've ordered both the ultra and pro and i'm just waiting for some days off for i'm so much busy with work these days!


You will love the stuff. I decided to put pro on IHS aswell. Got 5 C better temps. Can now do 5.1 Ghz ( 1.512 Vcore) Did IBT got 80 Max ( Ambient 28 C). Based on that I am going to give Haswell a miss.

Will do a 12 hour Prime run later. Would 1.512 be ok for 24/7 . I don't play benches so my max OC should be for 24/7 imho


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> bf3 maxed with a single 7970? Seems good, ima try it with sli disabled on my 690 lol.


well, took me a while to make a vid, and upload it to youtube,
recorded with bandicam, so fps is lower then playing without recording i noticed,
but fps is still great dispite that..without cam it does 90-100 fps average





you can see when started playing, all setting are maxed, ultra, with 4xmsaa etc..


----------



## stickg1

IDK, I figured this would happen. I got such a good deal on a reference 7970 even though I knew it would probably be too loud and I would hate it. So what should I do? Sell the thing and come out of pocket another $75 and get a better cooling solution version from one of the board partners? Or should I just mount a Kuhler 620 to it?

I will likely just use the Kuhler from my CPU. If you don't remember I lost pretty bad in the silicon lottery. Even after delidding I decided to just stay at 4.5GHz because it already takes 1.4v, 4.6GHz takes about 1.475v. Anyway at 1.4v my max temp is in the lows 60s. I might just get a $30-$40 air cooler and still be at comfortable temps. Then use this Antec Kuhler on my GPU and get rid of this vacuum cleaner cooler.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> You will love the stuff. I decided to put pro on IHS aswell. Got 5 C better temps. Can now do 5.1 Ghz ( 1.512 Vcore) Did IBT got 80 Max ( Ambient 28 C). Based on that I am going to give Haswell a miss.
> Will do a 12 hour Prime run later. Would 1.512 be ok for 24/7 . I don't play benches so my max OC should be for 24/7 imho


if you want to play it safe, try stay under 1.5V vcore,
taking in account vcore fluctuation's etc








we have no real proof yet about max vcore, (dont think were gonna find a clear answer also ..lol)
only the 1.52V SVID thats in the datasheets from intel,
what do you need if you run 5.0ghz, vcore wise?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> IDK, I figured this would happen. I got such a good deal on a reference 7970 even though I knew it would probably be too loud and I would hate it. So what should I do? Sell the thing and come out of pocket another $75 and get a better cooling solution version from one of the board partners? Or should I just mount a Kuhler 620 to it?
> I will likely just use the Kuhler from my CPU. If you don't remember I lost pretty bad in the silicon lottery. Even after delidding I decided to just stay at 4.5GHz because it already takes 1.4v, 4.6GHz takes about 1.475v. Anyway at 1.4v my max temp is in the lows 60s. I might just get a $30-$40 air cooler and still be at comfortable temps. Then use this Antec Kuhler on my GPU and get rid of this vacuum cleaner cooler.


if you can fit the antec cooler on the 7970, problem solved right,
any good aircooler is enough for a delidded ivy..


----------



## ivanlabrie

I vote Kuhler red mod...

And, I'll know in 30 min Val, gotta go buy a dvi/vga dongle for my CRT...But good thing is I'm not getting any of the debug led codes that indicate cpu failure, or no cpu, but rather the standard 00 when it boots normally.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I vote Kuhler red mod...
> And, I'll know in 30 min Val, gotta go buy a dvi/vga dongle for my CRT...But good thing is I'm not getting any of the debug led codes that indicate cpu failure, or no cpu, but rather the standard 00 when it boots normally.


get that **** working ASAP.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I vote Kuhler red mod...
> And, I'll know in 30 min Val, gotta go buy a dvi/vga dongle for my CRT...But good thing is I'm not getting any of the debug led codes that indicate cpu failure, or no cpu, but rather the standard 00 when it boots normally.


Cough cough over an hour.........


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Cough cough over an hour.........


EVEN MOAR. lol

EDIT: guess he's expending MOAR MONEYS. lol


----------



## chris-br

Is this good?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if you want to play it safe, try stay under 1.5V vcore,
> taking in account vcore fluctuation's etc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> we have no real proof yet about max vcore, (dont think were gonna find a clear answer also ..lol)
> only the 1.52V SVID thats in the datasheets from intel,
> what do you need if you run 5.0ghz, vcore wise?
> if you can fit the antec cooler on the 7970, problem solved right,
> any good aircooler is enough for a delidded ivy..


I need 1.488 to do 5 Ghz.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I need 1.488 to do 5 Ghz.


Thats stable?? If so, thats very good.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Thats stable?? If so, thats very good.


Yip 12 hours stable.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Is this good?


That is a fine score for games and everything else you will run on a regular basis *chris-br*. And not too bad for benching.

But not as good as you'd want for benching if you can make them faster. I would want to OC those mem sticks by increasing speed or through tighter timing. Although you do have some pretty good timings already.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if you want to play it safe, try stay under 1.5V vcore,
> taking in account vcore fluctuation's etc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> we have no real proof yet about max vcore, (dont think were gonna find a clear answer also ..lol)
> only the 1.52V SVID thats in the datasheets from intel,
> what do you need if you run 5.0ghz, vcore wise?
> if you can fit the antec cooler on the 7970, problem solved right,
> any good aircooler is enough for a delidded ivy..
> 
> 
> 
> I need 1.488 to do 5 Ghz.
Click to expand...

I agree with *VonDutch* *martinhal*. I'd personally keep my 24/7 below 1.5v, and probably even keep it below 1.4v if I could. Most people only need a 4.5GHz OC for about everything 24/7.

But for benching - I go over 1.5v for short periods of time. Just would not do too high a vcore for 24/7 myself. Personal choice though. Whatever you are good with.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Thats stable?? If so, thats very good.
> 
> 
> 
> Yip 12 hours stable.
Click to expand...

That is good *martinhal*. Nice chip and good work getting it there.


----------



## adamski07

Hey guys! I just delided my 3570k. What's the best thermal compound I can use? I ordered Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material since most of you all used this. Tho, I'll be using PK-1 as my IHS thermal compound. Thanks!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adamski07*
> 
> Hey guys! I just delided my 3570k. What's the best thermal compound I can use? I ordered Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material since most of you all used this. Tho, I'll be using PK-1 as my IHS thermal compound. Thanks!


Gratz on the delid, looks good to me








yea, Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is good to use on the die,
wont be much difference with using liquid pro on the die,
on the ihs any good tim will do..

you didnt harm the pcb there, maybe its just the photo but?


----------



## adamski07

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Gratz on the delid, looks good to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea, Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is good to use on the die,
> wont be much difference with using liquid pro on the die,
> on the ihs any good tim will do..
> you didnt harm the pcb there, maybe its just the photo but?


You scared me with that..







just checked it and it wasn't harmed in any way.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adamski07*
> 
> You scared me with that..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just checked it and it wasn't harmed in any way.


yea, already was in doubt if i should ask...sorry








photos can be a bit missleading that way,
glad i was wrong in this case


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adamski07*
> 
> You scared me with that..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just checked it and it wasn't harmed in any way.


good to see you here!
guess you want a prodigious oc and temps


----------



## ivanlabrie

Btw guys I'm not sure my cpu works so I'm on my way to pick up a g620 lol
Once I get back home I'll investigate some more before firing up the new processor...


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Not sure what you mean but I get a delta temp of less than 0.5c, that is the power of pro.


Do you even know what delta temp is? I doubt it otherwise you wouldn't make such a ridiculous claim. What you are saying is that the average core temp under load is only 0.5c higher than the ambient temp. Not possible


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Btw guys I'm not sure my cpu works so I'm on my way to pick up a g620 lol
> Once I get back home I'll investigate some more before firing up the new processor...


Why? is not booting up?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> still looking for some headphones, wireless with microphone etc,
> expensive buggers they are tho..
> my dream is to have one of these,
> 
> TRITTON's Warhead 7.1 Wireless Surround Headset is a truly wireless solution - - no need to connect a chat cable to your Xbox 360 gaming controller! A robust 5.8GHz wireless signal ensures interference-free operation from other 2.4GHz wireless devices and provides crystal-clear audio at a range of 33 feet. Hear immersive 7.1 Dolby Headphone surround sound through a pair of precision-tuned 50mm speakers featuring Neodymium magnets. With two rechargeable battery packs for 24/7 gaming, one battery always charging on the base station means you can simply swap in a fresh pack whenever the headset needs more energy.
> 
> Tritton 720+ 7.1 Surround Headset, or this one, but its wired..
> my gigabyte 7970 windforce 3 will arrive within 2 hours from now ...whaaaaaaa!!! ...soooo excited ...lol


I have the axpro model with optical cable to my sound card. Have been using them for a couple years and I like them a lot. The positional on them is nice and I can always find people I can't see with just a listen. Especially useful in farcry 3 when I say "where is that damn tiger. "


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've seen 8c deltas but only with 2x6000rpm fans and a huge air cooler.

Nothing shows on screen but there's also a known bug with my board and psc ram. I still have stuff to try... but I bought a spare chip cause I need to play on xmas lol

on my way home... I'll post from my PC be it an ivy quad or a Sandy dual xD
either chip will be tortured and benched and will still wipe the floor with older tech or AMD


----------



## I_shot

Guys, this phobya liquid metal is insane. i have applied both on cooler and chip die. temps dropped 21 degree celcius. i forgot to take print screen before delid i'm sorry that was stupid but i know what my temps were (ambient temp 18 , cores 74 85 88 82 )

Now look at the temps now (ambient temp 19 )



Funny thing is after delid ,cpu fan was not fully rotating







before delid 1560 rpm, after delid 1100 rpm









BTW i replaced my 3570k with costa rica chip. it's better 0.45V than the old one.i mean i don't need 1.360 V to keep it stable at 4.5 ghz.It's stable at 1.312V

Old 3570k



New one (sorry i forgot to take photos with delidded too)



Information ;

OCN name: I_shot
CPU: i5 3570K
on die-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal
ihs-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal
Mhz gained: 0.1 Ghz
OC after delid: 4.8 Ghz
Temp drops: 23 C max
CPU-Z validation of max OC: STABLE http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2624769


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I've seen 8c deltas but only with 2x6000rpm fans and a huge air cooler.
> Nothing shows on screen but there's also a known bug with my board and psc ram. I still have stuff to try... but I bought a spare chip cause I need to play on xmas lol
> on my way home... I'll post from my PC be it an ivy quad or a Sandy dual xD
> either chip will be tortured and benched and will still wipe the floor with older tech or AMD


nut you dont have other ram?


----------



## Bigdale7

Alrighty.. I haven't posted in quite a while, but I've been reading all the threads. I just got my tube of CLP in the mail and I am planning to delid my 3570K on Monday!

I have been able to stabilize 5.0 ghz at 1.42v for 24/7 usage, although due to high temps I can't use Prime95 or Intel Burn to test stability. It does fine with Cinebench and PC Mark 7. I also have my 16gb of Gskill memory running at 2200 and timings of 9-11-10 27 1T. Max temps I am currently getting are below 85 C.. but quickly it 100+ if I try to prime or intel burn it.

Sooo my next move should be to Delid.. Gulp I have a good chip I really don't want to hurt it, but we must progress...

I have taken before temp pics at 4.7 ghz (Prime 95 and Intel Burn) and will compare my temps after delid using 4.7.

Still haven't decided whether or not to use CLP on the IHS, I have H100 cooling. I also bought the needed sand paper to Lap, but will only do it if it looks like I need to. The last thought I have is I have been using this chip for 3 to 4 months and it's liable to de difficult to get a blade started due to compression.. I will take pictures to document and share my experience.


----------



## I_shot

tested with ambient temp 22 cpu fan full rpm 1560



that means after delid, max temperature difference *23* °C









Mission accomplished


----------



## chas1723

I feel so stupid. I took my cpu out and somehow bent a pin in the socket. I have tried everything to get the pin back to the correct position with no luck.

Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> tested with ambient temp 22 cpu fan full rpm 1560
> 
> 
> 
> that means after delid, max temperature difference *23* °C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mission accomplished


Congrats *I_Shot*!!! Great job in making that happen! And we all know you will enjoy the nice new temps!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Alrighty.. I haven't posted in quite a while, but I've been reading all the threads. I just got my tube of CLP in the mail and I am planning to delid my 3570K on Monday!
> 
> I have been able to stabilize 5.0 ghz at 1.42v for 24/7 usage, although due to high temps I can't use Prime95 or Intel Burn to test stability. It does fine with Cinebench and PC Mark 7. I also have my 16gb of Gskill memory running at 2200 and timings of 9-11-10 27 1T. Max temps I am currently getting are below 85 C.. but quickly it 100+ if I try to prime or intel burn it.
> 
> Sooo my next move should be to Delid.. Gulp I have a good chip I really don't want to hurt it, but we must progress...
> 
> I have taken before temp pics at 4.7 ghz (Prime 95 and Intel Burn) and will compare my temps after delid using 4.7.
> 
> Still haven't decided whether or not to use CLP on the IHS, I have H100 cooling. I also bought the needed sand paper to Lap, but will only do it if it looks like I need to. The last thought I have is I have been using this chip for 3 to 4 months and it's liable to de difficult to get a blade started due to compression.. I will take pictures to document and share my experience.


Feel free to ask here *Bigdale7* if you have any questions, but I expect you have read up on all the good info on the first page of this thread and are ready. Good luck! Take your time and you should do fine!


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Congrats *I_Shot*!!! Great job in making that happen! And we all know you will enjoy the nice new temps!


Thank you man







I still can't believe it. darn 23 C =)


----------



## tr1xst3r

Hey everyone, amazing thread...

I think I am ready to delid my CPU as my 4.5 GHz temps are in the mid 90's stable...

I was wondering if someone has a recommendation for the TIM to use from this link as I work for the company..

Thanks in advance.

http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?cPath=8_128


----------



## Bigdale7

Thanks for the encouragement/support PCWargamer... I have tried to educate myself and have set aside the time.. I actually feel pretty confident.. but I will be careful


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tr1xst3r*
> 
> Hey everyone, amazing thread...
> I think I am ready to delid my CPU as my 4.5 GHz temps are in the mid 90's stable...
> I was wondering if someone has a recommendation for the TIM to use from this link as I work for the company..
> Thanks in advance.
> http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?cPath=8_128


I would say.... NONE...lol

What you need is Coollaboratory Liquid PRO


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Thank you man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still can't believe it. darn 23 C =)


If you used cool labs LP or liquid ultra u could get another 5 to 13 c temp drop.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If you used cool labs LP or liquid ultra u could get another 5 to 13 c temp drop.


I don't think so. i already used LM. there can not be 13 c difference between liquid ultra and phobya lm


----------



## tr1xst3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I would say.... NONE...lol
> What you need is Coollaboratory Liquid PRO


I really have no other choices, the shipping charges + duties on something else is rape...


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tr1xst3r*
> 
> I really have no other choices, the shipping charges + duties on something else is rape...


so maybe the gelid stuff i think.

GELID GC Extreme (TC-GC-03-A) -- 3.5g Thermal Compound


----------



## tr1xst3r

Other options include:

http://www.ncix.com/products/?sku=27174&vpn=NT-H1&manufacture=Noctua

http://www.ncix.com/products/?sku=62333&vpn=Formula%207&manufacture=Antec


----------



## I_shot

go with gelid gc extreme unless liquid metal compound available


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> go with gelid gc extreme unless liquid metal compound available


YES, that.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> I don't think so. i already used LM. there can not be 13 c difference between liquid ultra and phobya lm


At the very least 5 c I'd say my temps dropped 30 to 35 c which is a good 10 c better then your results.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> At the very least 5 c I'd say my temps dropped 30 to 35 c which is a good 10 c better then your results.


This is my first attempt, i didn't make any adjustments. tomorrow i'll try different methods. maybe it'll be better than now. and yeah 5 C is acceptable but no 13


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> This is my first attempt, i didn't make any adjustments. tomorrow i'll try different methods. maybe it'll be better than now. and yeah 5 C is acceptable but no 13


My results are my first try.

3=13c is the least and most temps would drop with LP.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Do you even know what delta temp is? I doubt it otherwise you wouldn't make such a ridiculous claim. What you are saying is that the average core temp under load is only 0.5c higher than the ambient temp. Not possible


I was talking about gpu idle temps, i didnt mention full load did. Before pro my idle was 25c higher.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, took me a while to make a vid, and upload it to youtube,
> recorded with bandicam, so fps is lower then playing without recording i noticed,
> but fps is still great dispite that..without cam it does 90-100 fps average
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you can see when started playing, all setting are maxed, ultra, with 4xmsaa etc..


I just tried it with a single 690 core, so basically a little weaker 680, but I do have a bit of an OC on it, +120core and +400 mem. Got about an average of 116fps on the same map you were on with 64 players @1080p maxed out.

170fps maxed out with both cores but the gpu were at 70% load so that fps was meaningless, 1440p however stressed the cards much more, 120fps with both cores, but gpu were at 93% load, the higher resolutions really kill the fps because nvidia and their genius decided to make it 2gb vram and 256bit for a $1000 card lol. Still 120fps for a [email protected] monitor is more than enough...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> nut you dont have other ram?


I have 3 ram sets but after testing a few things I concluded I killed it. Probably the bent pins in my former socket gave it a shock or I wasn't properly grounded.
I'll replace it, I'll mail it to a friend in Tx and he'll do it for me (here they ask for a proof of purchase whereas in the US don't )
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chas1723*
> 
> I feel so stupid. I took my cpu out and somehow bent a pin in the socket. I have tried everything to get the pin back to the correct position with no luck.
> Sent from my ThunderBolt using Tapatalk 2


----------



## wholeeo

So what's max safe 24/7 voltage for these bad boys, I'm thinking about 5.0


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> So what's max safe 24/7 voltage for these bad boys, I'm thinking about 5.0


I think we still don't really know what is "safe". I run 5 ghz at 1.445 volts everyday and it is 24 hour prime stable at that voltage. There is a few others running higher voltages for 24/7 stuff. I don't think that enough time has gone by for us to know yet what max vcore is.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I was talking about gpu idle temps, i didnt mention full load did. Before pro my idle was 25c higher.


I'm not even going to bother


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I'm not even going to bother


To me that means a delta of 25...????

Anyway tw33k, you tried...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Guys, this phobya liquid metal is insane. i have applied both on cooler and chip die. temps dropped 21 degree celcius. i forgot to take print screen before delid i'm sorry that was stupid but i know what my temps were (ambient temp 18 , cores 74 85 88 82 )
> Now look at the temps now (ambient temp 19 )
> 
> Funny thing is after delid ,cpu fan was not fully rotating
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> before delid 1560 rpm, after delid 1100 rpm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW i replaced my 3570k with costa rica chip. it's better 0.45V than the old one.i mean i don't need 1.360 V to keep it stable at 4.5 ghz.It's stable at 1.312V
> Old 3570k
> 
> New one (sorry i forgot to take photos with delidded too)
> 
> Information ;
> OCN name: I_shot
> CPU: i5 3570K
> on die-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal
> ihs-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal
> Mhz gained: 0.1 Ghz
> OC after delid: 4.8 Ghz
> Temp drops: 23 C max
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: STABLE http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2624769


I just noticed your cute puppy background! lol, it looks like my little puppy.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I'm not even going to bother


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> To me that means a delta of 25...????
> Anyway tw33k, you tried...


Since neither of you can read let me explain.

When I say delta, in other words the "change in", it means: Temp of core - ambient temps, my gpu idled at 18c which was close to my room temperature at the moment, resulting in 0.5c difference between my gpu temp and ambient.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Since neither of you can read let me explain.
> When I say delta, in other words the "change in", it means: Temp of core - ambient temps, my gpu idled at 18c which was close to my room temperature at the moment, resulting in 0.5c difference between my gpu temp and ambient.


You cannot trust idle temp readings from any CPU! dude, one of my former chips had some cores idling a few C degrees below ambient ... that was with stock TIM too ... trust only full load temps and nothing else. also the DTS (Digital Temperature Sensors) in intel CPUs work the most correctly/precisely the closer they are to TJunctionMax value (a thermal throttling limit).


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Not sure what you mean but I get a delta temp of less than 0.5c, that is the power of pro.


Was not clear to me from post. Most idle temps are inaccurate. The method used for inferring temperatures from sensors is notoriously so. Only load temps really matter. Normal idle delta is 6 to 8 C AFAIK. On some AMD chips the sensors say the chip is cooler than ambient, but both that and an idle delta of .5C are impossible according to the "laws" of physics. No?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> You cannot trust idle temp readings from any CPU! dude, one of my former chips had some cores idling a few C degrees below ambient ... that was with stock TIM too ... trust only full load temps and nothing else. also the DTS (Digital Temperature Sensors) in intel CPUs work the most correctly/precisely the closer they are to TJunctionMax value (a thermal throttling limit).


I said GPU............................................. READ
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Was not clear to me from post. Most idle temps are inaccurate. The method used for inferring temperatures from sensors is notoriously so. Only load temps really matter. Normal idle delta is 6 to 8 C AFAIK. On some AMD chips the sensors say the chip is cooler than ambient, but both that and an idle delta of .5C are impossible according to the "laws" of physics. No?


Laws of thermodynamics say that an object cannot be cooler than the air surrounding it unless heat is taken away externally. I'm not saying my temps are COLDER than my ambient I'm saying they are VERY close. This is because most of the heat that my gpu creates at idle, which is very little, is mostly all dissipated into my water. My point is pro provides a very good conductivity for the heat to transfer from my gpu core to the water block and then to the water. Using mx-4, my idle was higher because it does not conduct heat as well as pro.

What WOULD be impossible is me saying my gpu temps are at the same temps or COLDER than my ambient, which would require me to have 100% heat transfer.


----------



## stickg1

Man, physics, reading, and math. My head hurts! Let's keep it simple. Liquid pro works. I used it all up on my i5, 7970, and 560ti. All of these applications resulted in double digit temperature drops! I'm going to start injecting it into my bloodstream during the summer months.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Man, physics, reading, and math. My head hurts! Let's keep it simple. Liquid pro works. I used it all up on my i5, 7970, and 560ti. All of these applications resulted in double digit temperature drops! I'm going to start injecting it into my bloodstream during the summer months.


Clearly that is impossible sir, your body tries as best as it can to maintain homeostasis (thermoregulation) to prevent shock. Injecting a heavy metal such as Liquid pro will likely result in major brain damage. Lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Clearly that is impossible sir, your body tries as best as it can to maintain homeostasis (thermoregulation) to prevent shock. Injecting a heavy metal such as Liquid pro will likely result in major brain damage. Lol.


Well there's one way to find out!


----------



## Valgaur

Oh lord. On a vacavtion and you people talk about this.....

And congratz on surviving the end of the world.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I said GPU............................................. READ
> Laws of thermodynamics say that an object cannot be cooler than the air surrounding it unless heat is taken away externally. I'm not saying my temps are COLDER than my ambient I'm saying they are VERY close. This is because most of the heat that my gpu creates at idle, which is very little, is mostly all dissipated into my water. My point is pro provides a very good conductivity for the heat to transfer from my gpu core to the water block and then to the water. Using mx-4, my idle was higher because it does not conduct heat as well as pro.
> What WOULD be impossible is me saying my gpu temps are at the same temps or COLDER than my ambient, which would require me to have 100% heat transfer.


OK, GPU then, still I say it's not like it appears to be... unless you are using a thermal probe mounted near the GPU IHS, do you?


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> A 10ºC difference (delta) between coolant and ambient air temperature is considered an average to work toward. Anything exceeding 15ºC means the loop is becoming overwhelmed, while a 5ºC delta (or less) is very efficient.


The Watercooling Guide, From A to Z - Tech Spot


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hehehe...I'm back!
I have an AMD buttkicker rig with a G620 dual core lol AND psc ram! lol









Best superpi 1m so far: 14.786s








Can't oc this little bugger at all, and the IMC sucks so bad. It can't even run XMP for my psc sticks! (which is 1000mhz cl9-9-9-27-1t at 1.6v, stock vccio/vccsa)


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Clearly that is impossible sir, your body tries as best as it can to maintain homeostasis (thermoregulation) to prevent shock. Injecting a heavy metal such as Liquid pro will likely result in major brain damage. Lol.


And now we get a Biology lesson too. I would think CLP in your body would also cause issues at Airports , going to get rubber gloved a lot..


----------



## ivanlabrie

It gets lonely at times...you can always go to the airport for some love if you do lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> The Watercooling Guide, From A to Z - Tech Spot


does this classification relate to (water to ambient) delta temps under load or at idle?
I have 2 thermal sensors installed, one in my water loop (in the drain splitter) and an intake air thermal sensor mounted on radiator fan shroud. at idle they usually both state exactly same temperature or within 2C (at hotter ambient past 28C), under CPU load I usually see up to 4-5C delta, but when I add GPU load to it then it rises further (probably another 5C higher).

... of course it doesn't mean my CPU or GPU are running AT water loop temps under load, of course not he he, I wish they were


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> OK, GPU then, still I say it's not like it appears to be... unless you are using a thermal probe mounted near the GPU IHS, do you?


I am fairly sure both the cpu and gpu readings from software is accurate, it isn't rocket science to include an internal heat sensing probe. How can you even measure it externally, you cant just put a probe on the gpu cores or cpu die that makes no sense.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well there's one way to find out!


I've done it, accidentally ofc, and I'm still here lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

He's come back stronger, and with higher blood w/mk


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I am fairly sure both the cpu and gpu readings from software is accurate, it isn't rocket science to include an internal heat sensing probe. How can you even measure it externally, *you cant just put a probe on the gpu cores or cpu die that makes no sense.*


Yes... yes you can


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> OK, GPU then, still I say it's not like it appears to be... unless you are using a thermal probe mounted near the GPU IHS, do you?
> 
> 
> 
> I am fairly sure both the cpu and gpu readings from software is accurate, it isn't rocket science to include an internal heat sensing probe. How can you even measure it externally, you cant just put a probe on the gpu cores or cpu die that makes no sense.
Click to expand...

I'm guessing you haven't seen the heat probes they use to accurately detect the temperature for heatsink benchmarks. It is possible and they are very common. The reason why we say it is inaccurate is because do you see an actual wire on top of your CPU or GPU? No, it reads it via software. Software is usually inaccurate. Just like how CPU-Z voltage readings are normally inaccurate, we have voltage meters to accurately see how much is actually being directed towards the CPU.


----------



## LukeJoseph

Code:

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Man, physics, reading, and math. My head hurts! Let's keep it simple. Liquid pro works. I used it all up on my i5, 7970, and 560ti. All of these applications resulted in double digit temperature drops! I'm going to start injecting it into my bloodstream during the summer months.


Sorry if you have already posted it, but do you have a before and after for your GPU? So far the only place I have been very impressed with the liquid metal compounds is for in between the IHS and die.

When I replaced my AS5 with ultra between the IHS and the CPU cooler there was MAYBE a 1c difference. When I did the same for my 7950 there was a 2c difference. So even though they are good, I call BS on "double digit" drops on anything other than between the IHS and die.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Thing is gpu dies are exposed*, so basically you'll see double digit drops same as with our cpus.

*at least current gen cards


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Was not clear to me from post. Most idle temps are inaccurate. The method used for inferring temperatures from sensors is notoriously so. Only load temps really matter. Normal idle delta is 6 to 8 C AFAIK. On some AMD chips the sensors say the chip is cooler than ambient, but both that and an idle delta of .5C are impossible according to the "laws" of physics. No?


This guy!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hehehe...I'm back!
> I have an AMD buttkicker rig with a G620 dual core lol AND psc ram! lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Best superpi 1m so far: 14.786s
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't oc this little bugger at all, and the IMC sucks so bad. It can't even run XMP for my psc sticks! (which is 1000mhz cl9-9-9-27-1t at 1.6v, stock vccio/vccsa)


Wow, just wow.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol I know, I know...xD

It's running quite nicely, with win7 in my ssd for a change.
Fiddling with AI Suite atm, going for some bclk fun.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm guessing you haven't seen the heat probes they use to accurately detect the temperature for heatsink benchmarks. It is possible and they are very common. The reason why we say it is inaccurate is because do you see an actual wire on top of your CPU or GPU? No, it reads it via software. Software is usually inaccurate. Just like how CPU-Z voltage readings are normally inaccurate, we have voltage meters to accurately see how much is actually being directed towards the CPU.


Voltage measurement with a multimeter is different than measuring with a heat probe. The points that you measure on are accurate because it is a central point where the electrons flow through, hard to get that accurate using software. Also, software as well as the bios takes vdroop in account, multimeter shows the raw voltage being put across. Heat on the other side is different because it measures the temperature inside the core/die, impossible to do externally. You might put a probe on it but how would you do that using pro, you have to be precise when applying pro, how is putting a probe between a core and a block when the actual probe is thicker than the thermal paste layer a viable option.

What you probably mean is the actual software like realtemp or hw monitor is not 100% accurate, and I can see that. However, the temperature that the probe inside the cpu or gpu core gives out is as accurate as you can get. Putting a probe between a die and a copper block probably has the same % error as the inaccuracy of the program you use to measure the temperature.

To sum it all up, my .5c delta temperature is valid, low heat coming from the gpu which gets transferred to my water. Also remember my 12inch gtx 690 and it's centimeter thick copper water block has much more room to dissipate heat than the small cpu. On full load it is a different story, you would need much higher tech gear to get a delta of .5c at 100% gpu or cpu load, but on idle, it is possible, and I have proved that using liquid pro.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey guys, I'm getting a nice Christmas gift!
1000w BFG psu lol
I'm gonna retire my trusty TX750, perhaps I can give it to my gf for her rig.
Now I need that 3770k replacement fast!


----------



## LukeJoseph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thing is gpu dies are exposed*, so basically you'll see double digit drops same as with our cpus.
> *at least current gen cards


Maybe in theory, but in reality it is incorrect. Show me one double digit drop on a GPU.

Everything I have read and personally witnessed on my own hardware (MSI 7950 Twin Frozr), Liquid Ultra while a good TIM is really no better than any other quality TIM.


----------



## Hokies83

Where I'm at so far my block pump should have been here the 19th still no updated tracking since the 18th....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I had a 25c drop on my gpu...but well, you should try reseating that application.
At least 10c sounds like a reasonable drop.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Where I'm at so far my block pump should have been here the 19th still no updated tracking since the 18th....


That's bad, I'm waiting for a 2600k I got for a friend...seems his christmas will be a sad one :/


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Maybe in theory, but in reality it is incorrect. Show me one double digit drop on a GPU.
> Everything I have read and personally witnessed on my own hardware (MSI 7950 Twin Frozr), Liquid Ultra while a good TIM is really no better than any other quality TIM.


You probably just failed to apply the ultra. I failed the first time also, then I tried pro and have 18c idle and 30c max load for 4 hours. This is with max power target and max voltage with a decent oc on my 690, I doubt you can find anyone that has my temps with just water cooling (non chilled) with a standard tim.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Maybe in theory, but in reality it is incorrect. Show me one double digit drop on a GPU.
> Everything I have read and personally witnessed on my own hardware (MSI 7950 Twin Frozr), Liquid Ultra while a good TIM is really no better than any other quality TIM.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I had a 25c drop on my gpu...but well, you should try reseating that application.
> At least 10c sounds like a reasonable drop.


yea, i did 2 vid cards with liquid pro, both cards had about 10C tempdrop,
you have to take our word on it Luke, i have no "proof", but i dont lie either, no need for that,
it is what it is









edit,
o wait, i forgot, i still want to do my new 7970 with liquid pro,
i will proof it to you with before and after temps


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i did 2 vid cards with liquid pro, both cards had about 10C tempdrop,
> you have to take our word on it Luke, i have no "proof", but i dont lie either, no need for that,
> it is what it is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit,
> o wait, i forgot, i still want to do my new 7970 with liquid pro,
> i will proof it to you with before and after temps


With your card are you using liqud ultra on just the core or just the heatsync of both?


----------



## She loved E

ruh roh guys i think i may have bricked my chip.







just delidded, reassembled & she won't boot.

there was one miniscule nick in the pcb right at one of the corners, which i touched up with paint pen to reduce the risk of shorting.

checked for bent pins, they all look good. cleared cmos, still nothing. it powers on for 2 seconds, then shuts off. its weird tho, the fan profile seemed to change when clearing cmos, does that mean somethings working (BIOS)? I hope I'm not the next guy to mess this up.

gonna go thru the thread to see if I can track down the problem... in the meantime can anyone help???


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> ruh roh guys i think i may have bricked my chip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just delidded, reassembled & she won't boot. check for bent pins, they all look good. cleared cmos, still nothing. its weird tho, the fan profile seemed to change when clearing cmos, does that mean somethings working (BIOS)? I hope I'm not the next guy to mess this up...
> 
> gonna go thru the thread to see if I can track down the problem... in the meantime can anyone help???


I'll help as much as I can, can you check your debug monitor? What does it say when it boots up? If it says the same thing if it booted up normally, it may be dead. If it indicates a CPU is not plugged in, it IS dead.


----------



## DirektEffekt

I honestly find the argument on here about the meaning of Delta to be quite funny. Technically, as pointed out, when used in the context of temperatures, delta means the difference between two temperatures. This could be the difference between ambient and load temperatures, the difference between water and ambient temperatures, the difference between load and idle temperatures, the difference between any two cores, and the list could go on and on. It's all about the context. It has, unless specified in such a way, no one, singular, correct meaning.


----------



## She loved E

thanks swag. think i figured it out. i removed a stick of ram and she boots. good news: i didn't kill it. bad news: looks like i'm rollin single channel


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I honestly find the argument on here about the meaning of Delta to be quite funny. Technically, as pointed out, when used in the context of temperatures, delta means the difference between two temperatures. This could be the difference between ambient and load temperatures, the difference between water and ambient temperatures, the difference between load and idle temperatures, the difference between any two cores, and the list could go on and on. It's all about the context. It has, unless specified in such a way, no one, singular, correct meaning.


I thought the entire argument was revolving around one person not believing the drop on a person's GPU with LP.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> thanks swag. think i figured it out. i removed a stick of ram and she boots. good news: i didn't kill it. bad news: looks like i'm rollin single channel


Glad it works, I'm guessing you nicked the PCB or scratched the die a bit. Don't worry too much, single channel vs dual channel has barely any effect and also, is that entire DIMM slot dead or is it just the RAM?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I thought the entire argument was revolving around one person not believing the drop on a person's GPU with LP.


I think it was about using idle temperatures instead of load. Then there was an argument about the use of the word delta. Then there was an argument about the accuracy of temperature readings. I just found the common belief that delta for some reason could only mean one thing the most entertaining.


----------



## She loved E

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Glad it works, I'm guessing you nicked the PCB or scratched the die a bit. Don't worry too much, single channel vs dual channel has barely any effect and also, is that entire DIMM slot dead or is it just the RAM?


dimm 2 is dead. tested various sticks and none works in that slot.

ah well, you win some you lose some. and some are a little of both. guess i'll check temps now...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I thought the entire argument was revolving around one person not believing the drop on a person's GPU with LP.
> 
> 
> 
> I think it was about using idle temperatures instead of load. Then there was an argument about the use of the word delta. Then there was an argument about the accuracy of temperature readings. I just found the common belief that delta for some reason could only mean one thing the most entertaining.
Click to expand...

Oh, I didn't get into it until the accuracy part, delta = triangle. Change of... I don't agree with the part that it has many different meanings, however, I do agree you can change its meaning many different ways by adding something to the end of it.







Change of temperature, change of state and the list goes on!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Glad it works, I'm guessing you nicked the PCB or scratched the die a bit. Don't worry too much, single channel vs dual channel has barely any effect and also, is that entire DIMM slot dead or is it just the RAM?
> 
> 
> 
> dimm 2 is dead. tested various sticks and none works in that slot.
> 
> ah well, you win some you lose some. and some are a little of both. guess i'll check temps now...
Click to expand...

2 DIMM setup is the max then, I'm not of a fan of 3 DIMM setups other than in X58 cases.


----------



## She loved E

its an itx board so there's only 1 left









you're not gonna believe this... after that test, i bolted the cpu block down and now i got no boot, even with only 1 dimm.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> its an itx board so there's only 1 left
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you're not gonna believe this... after that test, i bolted the cpu block down and now i got no boot, even with only 1 dimm.


So, the chips dead or did you damage another DIMM? I hope it's the latter so you can just RMA it quickly. I'm not sure the policy on damaged DIMMs but Asus exchanged mine with a damaged PCIE slot with no questions asked. I damaged it if you are wondering.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh, I didn't get into it until the accuracy part, delta = triangle. Change of... I don't agree with the part that it has many different meanings, however, I do agree you can change its meaning many different ways by adding something to the end of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Change of temperature, change of state and the list goes on!


Perhaps I should add that contextually it means change of. But yeas, it is also a letter of the Greek alphabet that looks like a triangle, the discriminant from the quadratic equation and many other things. But talking about temperatures none of those make much sense.









Also, about the bad DIMMs. Does it go back to normal when you loosen your block? I've read some weird things about the LGA sockets and over tightening. Just consider yourself lucky that it's just one chip/board though. I had my board KILL 2 chips before I realized it was the board and now I'm out two 3570Ks


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh, I didn't get into it until the accuracy part, delta = triangle. Change of... I don't agree with the part that it has many different meanings, however, I do agree you can change its meaning many different ways by adding something to the end of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Change of temperature, change of state and the list goes on!
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps I should add that contextually it means change of. But yeas, it is also a letter of the Greek alphabet that looks like a triangle, the discriminant from the quadratic equation and many other things. But talking about temperatures none of those make much sense.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, about the bad DIMMs. Does it go back to normal when you loosen your block? I've read some weird things about the LGA sockets and over tightening. Just consider yourself lucky that it's just one chip/board though. I had my board KILL 2 chips before I realized it was the board and now I'm out two 3570Ks
Click to expand...

Did you buy it online because normally, you can return the chips if that happens.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Did you buy it online because normally, you can return the chips if that happens.


Both chips were delidded and I'm not going to go gluing the IHSes back on and lie about it. I'm getting the board replaced though and going to see if I can get some kind of compensation through them, but based on what I have heard of ASUS' CS I'm not getting my hopes up.


----------



## Swag

I like Asus' CS but some people have had some problems with them. Really, it all depends on the rep you get.


----------



## She loved E

Wait so when ppl delid and they can only use 1 ram stick, it means they fried the board? If there's a short somewhere shouldn't I stop using the cpu? I guess I don't understand what I effed up by nicking the pcb.

I want to test again w/o the block to see if that's the problem, but of course i can't get the block off now because of a frozen screw. I've done enough damage for one day... time to go to bed.


----------



## martinhal

Best mod ever . Stable and good temps at 5.1 Ghz


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Best mod ever . Stable and good temps at 5.1 Ghz
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice job! makes me want to push for 5.1...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Clearly that is impossible sir, your body tries as best as it can to maintain homeostasis (thermoregulation) to prevent shock. Injecting a heavy metal such as Liquid pro will likely result in major brain damage. Lol.


Are we playing boulder dash?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Code:


Sorry if you have already posted it, but do you have a before and after for your GPU? So far the only place I have been very impressed with the liquid metal compounds is for in between the IHS and die.
When I replaced my AS5 with ultra between the IHS and the CPU cooler there was MAYBE a 1c difference. When I did the same for my 7950 there was a 2c difference. So even though they are good, I call BS on "double digit" drops on anything other than between the IHS and die.

I didn't take any before screenshots with either GPU. All I can tell you though is that before when playing Far Cry 3 with my 7970 @ 1125/1600 @ 1.25v I would easily push into the 72C-77C area, and that was with a high fan setting. Now I use a very modest fan setting because its reference cooler with a hoover vacuum attached, and at the same clocks and volts playing the same game I reside in the 59-63C region. With my GTX560ti I only use it for 24/7 Folding and before was 72C and now its at 60C. You don't have to believe me, I don't really have any reason to lie.

I will say I think you didn't do a very good job on your Ultra application to your 7950. Did you apply to both the chip and the heatsink?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> ruh roh guys i think i may have bricked my chip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just delidded, reassembled & she won't boot.
> there was one miniscule nick in the pcb right at one of the corners, which i touched up with paint pen to reduce the risk of shorting.
> checked for bent pins, they all look good. cleared cmos, still nothing. it powers on for 2 seconds, then shuts off. its weird tho, the fan profile seemed to change when clearing cmos, does that mean somethings working (BIOS)? I hope I'm not the next guy to mess this up.
> gonna go thru the thread to see if I can track down the problem... in the meantime can anyone help???


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> thanks swag. think i figured it out. i removed a stick of ram and she boots. good news: i didn't kill it. bad news: looks like i'm rollin single channel


I was going to say the 2 seconds and reboot has always been a tell-tale sign that there is a grounding error typically where two LGA pins are touching each other. But now it looks like that knick on your PCB damaged the IMC.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> With your card are you using liqud ultra on just the core or just the heatsync of both?


with the vid cards i only used CLP on the core,
not sure what im gonna do with my 7970 tho,
the 6850, 4770 and 5770 where easy to take apart ..lol
but my mind is set to do it, so i prolly will









the 5770 looked really bad when i took it apart ..djeez,


6850 almost ready to spread the liquid pro










i must say, after playing games this weekend with my kiddos,
the new 7970 didnt exceed 55C, bf3 , farcry 3 etc, everything maxed out, np,
curious what liquid pro can shave of,
i mean 45C tops playing any game?? ...LOL ..wauw,
fps in FC3 where good, lower then bf3, 80to 100+, only twice during the game it dipped for a sec to 55-57fps...i can live with that..
only found one problem till now, tearing in the game sometimes,
anyone know what i can do about that?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> thanks swag. think i figured it out. i removed a stick of ram and she boots. good news: i didn't kill it. bad news: looks like i'm rollin single channel


sorry to hear, yep, we seen more nicked pcb's,
that after it booted had one memory channel ..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Wait so when ppl delid and they can only use 1 ram stick, it means they fried the board? If there's a short somewhere shouldn't I stop using the cpu? I guess I don't understand what I effed up by nicking the pcb.


i think it means you damaged a circuit on the pcb, thats related to the memory controller from the cpu, so your board should be fine..
i think theres someone here that had the same, and still using the cpu, with 1 controller tho


----------



## stickg1

Yeah this reference cooler isnt enough for me, I debating on selling it. I have offers for $300 I was hoping for $325 though. I guess I should just wait on my dwoods bracket to come.


----------



## Matt26LFC

No delid results from as of yet guys, I haven't been able to remove the IHS! I think the pressure placed on it from being mounted in my system now for 4-5 Months has narrowed the gap a bit. One corner in particular has pretty much no gap to get a razor blade in there.

Put her all back together and she's working great, so thinking sell this 3570K and buy another and this time delid before I've mounted it.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> No delid results from as of yet guys, I haven't been able to remove the IHS! I think the pressure placed on it from being mounted in my system now for 4-5 Months has narrowed the gap a bit. One corner in particular has pretty much no gap to get a razor blade in there.
> Put her all back together and she's working great, so thinking sell this 3570K and buy another and this time delid before I've mounted it.


Mine was tough too, just keep working it slowly. Get it good and hot first to soften the glue.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> No delid results from as of yet guys, I haven't been able to remove the IHS! I think the pressure placed on it from being mounted in my system now for 4-5 Months has narrowed the gap a bit. One corner in particular has pretty much no gap to get a razor blade in there.
> Put her all back together and she's working great, so thinking sell this 3570K and buy another and this time delid before I've mounted it.


yep, only had mine in there for about a month,
but best is to do it right away, but after testing if delid is worth it,
what vcore do/did you need for 4.5ghz? or does it run to hot for that..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> with the vid cards i only used CLP on the core,
> not sure what im gonna do with my 7970 tho,
> the 6850, 4770 and 5770 where easy to take apart ..lol
> but my mind is set to do it, so i prolly will
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the 5770 looked really bad when i took it apart ..djeez,


My 7950 was easy as pie to take apart! My first card was a single slot 9800GT which was fairly easy, my second was a friends 5850 which was terrible (oh so many screws) and my 7950 was so easy to do! Just four screws and a slight twist and it came off!


----------



## PyroYuy

Just delidded it... only had it for a few days and I didn't like the temps.

OCN name: PyroYuy
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Cool Labs Liquid Metal Pro
ihs-TIM: Same
Mhz gained: no idea, didn't really run it that hard before
OC after delid: 4.9
Temp drops: used to run 65 on average before at 4.5, now I'm doing 55 at 4.9
CPU-Z validation of max OC: 4889.97

My biggest qualm with it right now is that it runs at 1.4 volts stable at this range, the only time I run 1.3ish is when I'm at 4.6. Should I reduce the load or does it not matter that much, and yes this rig is a 24/7.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep, only had mine in there for about a month,
> but best is to do it right away, but after testing if delid is worth it,
> what vcore do/did you need for 4.5ghz? or does it run to hot for that..


I was running 1.31v for 4.5GHz, it wasn't exactly roasting, was 80C on the hottest core, however I wanted to go higher, around 4.8GHz 24/7 and perhaps even 5GHz for Benching.

But considering I'm running an RX360 and RX240 its not that great, it feels like all this rad space is well... wasted.

I've even got an RX120 to go in, just because I want it really, I know it'll do next to nothing for temps


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PyroYuy*
> 
> Just delidded it... only had it for a few days and I didn't like the temps.
> OCN name: PyroYuy
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Cool Labs Liquid Metal Pro
> ihs-TIM: Same
> Mhz gained: no idea, didn't really run it that hard before
> OC after delid: 4.9
> Temp drops: used to run 65 on average before at 4.5, now I'm doing 55 at 4.9
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: 4889.97
> My biggest qualm with it right now is that it runs at 1.4 volts stable at this range, the only time I run 1.3ish is when I'm at 4.6. Should I reduce the load or does it not matter that much, and yes this rig is a 24/7.


4.9ghz at 1.4V ?
gratz, should be no problem to run 24/7,
of course, if vcore is lower is always better,
but what ive learned so far, ivy should be able to run upto 1.45V vcore 24/7,
without a chance of degradation over time,
i think the others here would agree..of course if temps are good also ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> I was running 1.31v for 4.5GHz, it wasn't exactly roasting, was 80C on the hottest core, however I wanted to go higher, around 4.8GHz 24/7 and perhaps even 5GHz for Benching.
> But considering I'm running an RX360 and RX240 its not that great, it feels like all this rad space is well... wasted.
> I've even got an RX120 to go in, just because I want it really, I know it'll do next to nothing for temps


yea, i needed 1.235V vcore for 4.5ghz stable,
i need 1.420V vcore for 4.8ghz, 24H prime stable,
thats about my highest oc for this chip, 4.9 ghz needed 1.510V vcore,
i think thats to risky to run 24/7..

im not saying yours will do worse, because you need more vcore then me at 4.5ghz,
im trying to gather info about 4.5ghz oc's, and vcore needed, prime stable that is,
compare that to the higher oc's those chips can run,
almost all ivy's can run 4.5ghz before delid, if the vcore needed for that oc can be a indication for higher oc's,
would be a great help to decide if its worth it, except the lower temps..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah this reference cooler isnt enough for me, I debating on selling it. I have offers for $300 I was hoping for $325 though. I guess I should just wait on my dwoods bracket to come.


arent there aircoolers you can buy for it?
Arctic Accelero Xtreme 7970


----------



## stickg1

I run mine at 1.7v 24/7 and poke at it with a stick periodically to get it really worked up!


----------



## PyroYuy

thanks, I just remember that running too high of voltage can be bad. But I find that at 4.8 I'm at 1.34 volts, so I think that I'll just take the very negligible performance hit for the much lower volts.

I'm happy with my new cooling loop, I'm running way too much radiators for my system, but more is better than less!


----------



## Gomi

Just stumbled across a post on the Danish "Overclock" forum.

Person used CLP on his HD6970, ran with it for about 3 months and upon re-doing his loop he wanted to redo / clean up his GPU application.

As expected, the block would not budge, so he had to twist it slightly counter-clockwise - Unfortunately his GPU looked like this when he removed the block:





Could this have been prevented by heating up the block before removal ? Probably - But this is just a small warning when removing your Block / IHS - Its fine on Block/IHS - But Block/Die and its abit trickier.

Before anyone starts flaming the poor guy, need to mention he is well-known here in Denmark for extreme cooling and as such, so its no "rookie" when it comes to alternative cooling and the adventures we go through


----------



## VonDutch

wow...should i wait a few months , and see how the removal on the older cards i have
done with liquid pro also..
should send those pics to coollaboratory, ask for refund ..LOL
yea, heating up before removing helps,
gallium has a low melting point, so it should help a bit at least..


----------



## kgtuning

WTH!? I can't imagine doing that.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PyroYuy*
> 
> thanks, I just remember that running too high of voltage can be bad. But I find that at 4.8 I'm at 1.34 volts, so I think that I'll just take the very negligible performance hit for the much lower volts.
> I'm happy with my new cooling loop, I'm running way too much radiators for my system, but more is better than less!


my daily vcore for 24/7 use, is 1.310V vcore..
it will last for years no problem, im sure ..lol
i can run mine on a aircooler now, upto 5.0ghz, maybe a bit higher..

so with the money i saved on buying a watercooler for this "ex-hothead",
was one of the reasons could buy my 7970


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Just stumbled across a post on the Danish "Overclock" forum.
> Person used CLP on his HD6970, ran with it for about 3 months and upon re-doing his loop he wanted to redo / clean up his GPU application.
> As expected, the block would not budge, so he had to twist it slightly counter-clockwise - Unfortunately his GPU looked like this when he removed the block:
> 
> Could this have been prevented by heating up the block before removal ? Probably - But this is just a small warning when removing your Block / IHS - Its fine on Block/IHS - But Block/Die and its abit trickier.
> Before anyone starts flaming the poor guy, need to mention he is well-known here in Denmark for extreme cooling and as such, so its no "rookie" when it comes to alternative cooling and the adventures we go through


OUCH. I Do have CLP on my 6970 now. But i don't plan in taking that off anytime soon... and now seeing this maybe EVER. lol


----------



## VonDutch

you think i can use the pics to send to coollaboratory,
and ask how to avoid this,see what they say?
heating up before taking it apart is one,
prolly best to do it with the cpu's also,
what a nightmare if that would happen to me..lol


----------



## Gomi

Another thing to remember is that this is caused because the CLP is directly between die (GPU) and the Block - If this also translates over to CPU (Die - IHS) one would need to heat it up slightly before removing it (If that situation should ever be needed).

But as already mentioned, the melting point of CLP is really low, so a quick 30 second with a hair-dryer should do the trick


----------



## chris-br

Well. If temps are really low means that you did a good applying CLP to the die, no need to remove it. Unless you changing to a better cpu.......Then i don't know. But the hair-dryer idiea is a smart one.


----------



## I_shot

I've reseated the cooler and put more tim on cooler surface and tested at the same settings. on second core i achieved *25* C difference no delid to delid. I believe i can drop temps by 1-2 C more but i'm tired to do it now


----------



## She loved E

man i hope i can get mine going to get temps like that.

so i got mine to boot again. out of 4 sticks I've tested in slot 1, only 1 of them will work.

is it possible for a botched delid to kill a stick of ram, or did i just damage the imc which makes it more sensitive to instable ram?

i haven't bolted the block back on yet... i'm trying to take it extra slow to get it right this time. i guess i'll try lightly bolting it down and booting before i tighten further? would love some more ideas if anyone has any...


----------



## ivanlabrie

You probably damaged the IMC...only way to damage the board is by booting with bent pins.


----------



## Swag

Sorry if this branches too far off but does anyone know if this is the new permanent low price for Corsair sleeved cables?

Corsair Sleeved Cables

I want to order them but I can't right now. I plan to 1 - 2 weeks after New Years, but I want them at this price!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> man i hope i can get mine going to get temps like that.
> so i got mine to boot again. out of 4 sticks I've tested in slot 1, only 1 of them will work.
> is it possible for a botched delid to kill a stick of ram, or did i just damage the imc which makes it more sensitive to instable ram?
> i haven't bolted the block back on yet... i'm trying to take it extra slow to get it right this time. i guess i'll try lightly bolting it down and booting before i tighten further? would love some more ideas if anyone has any...


The nick in the PCB is, more than likely, just in a trace that is part of the second memory channel. I doubt you have damaged the IMC or the RAM. Rather you just damaged one of the connections used to transmit data between the CPU and that RAM channel.

I don't have any ideas though, other than checking very carefully for bent pins.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I am fairly sure both the cpu and gpu readings from software is accurate, it isn't rocket science to include an internal heat sensing probe. How can you even measure it externally, you cant just put a probe on the gpu cores or cpu die that makes no sense.


please, you obviously don't know what you are talking about


----------



## Arm3nian

I vote for the person with the crappiest gpu to try and take the block off with pro on after 3 months, and its not gonna be me LOL.

Anyways, I applied pro to both the 2 cores and chip as well as the copper water block, so when I remove it the 2 layers of pro should seperate instead of a layer and a block.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> please, you obviously don't know what you are talking about


I corrected myself by explaining what I meant, this is the 2nd time you've failed to read my posts before replying.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> I am fairly sure both the cpu and gpu readings from software is accurate, it isn't rocket science to include an internal heat sensing probe.


Software voltage and temperature readings have never been particularly accurate, even if it isn't "rocket science".
Intel for example use a method of inferring temperatures from a chips throttling point, which will have the usual range of manufacturing variation.
http://www.overclock.net/t/476469/the-truth-about-temperatures-and-voltages
Unclewebb, creator of RealTemp has written at length about it.

I've sent Unclewebb a PM asking if he can give me some links on how Nvidia and ATI do it. I hope he can help because I'm interested in what method they use.
I didn't find anything useful in a Google search. Just got tons of How Good are my Temps posts....


----------



## LukeJoseph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I vote for the person with the crappiest gpu to try and take the block off with pro on after 3 months, and its not gonna be me LOL.
> Anyways, I applied pro to both the 2 cores and chip as well as the copper water block, so when I remove it the 2 layers of pro should seperate instead of a layer and a block.


And this is why ultra is nice. You don't need to worry about breaking anything when removing parts. I have pro between my IHS and die, but ultra everywhere else. I did test ultra on the die too (it came in a day before my pro did), and there was very little difference in temp reduction between ultra and pro.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey guys, I'm getting a nice Christmas gift!
> 1000w BFG psu lol
> I'm gonna retire my trusty TX750, perhaps I can give it to my gf for her rig.
> Now I need that 3770k replacement fast!


buddy, good luck with getting it up and running! so your 3770K died on former board (bent pins)? sory to hear, good luck with RMA in USA, should go through easily. in meantime enjoy the borrowed SB chip and have some Intel fun








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I honestly find the argument on here about the meaning of Delta to be quite funny. Technically, as pointed out, when used in the context of temperatures, delta means the difference between two temperatures. This could be the difference between ambient and load temperatures, the difference between water and ambient temperatures, the difference between load and idle temperatures, the difference between any two cores, and the list could go on and on. It's all about the context. It has, unless specified in such a way, no one, singular, correct meaning.


nah, we know what delta means in general (difference), it wasn't about that, trust me we are not morons ...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I think it was about using idle temperatures instead of load. Then there was an argument about the use of the word delta. Then there was an argument about the accuracy of temperature readings. I just found the common belief that delta for some reason could only mean one thing the most entertaining.


yup, this. "delta" mostly means the water to ambient temperature change under load, but of course we are open for other meanings of word "delta". idle temps are not precise or very far from it actually especially in software readers using integrated thermal probes on the die at idle - those sensors are designed to work most correctly when they are needed and that means close to dangerous thermal levels near thermally induced throttling or shutdown.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Just stumbled across a post on the Danish "Overclock" forum.
> Person used CLP on his HD6970, ran with it for about 3 months and upon re-doing his loop he wanted to redo / clean up his GPU application.
> As expected, the block would not budge, so he had to twist it slightly counter-clockwise - Unfortunately his GPU looked like this when he removed the block:
> 
> 
> Could this have been prevented by heating up the block before removal ? Probably - But this is just a small warning when removing your Block / IHS - Its fine on Block/IHS - But Block/Die and its abit trickier.
> Before anyone starts flaming the poor guy, need to mention he is well-known here in Denmark for extreme cooling and as such, so its no "rookie" when it comes to alternative cooling and the adventures we go through


wow! dude, that is SCARY! CL LP seems like a little risky way to me after seeing this ... will stick to Ultra personally ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> I've reseated the cooler and put more tim on cooler surface and tested at the same settings. on second core i achieved *25* C difference no delid to delid. I believe i can drop temps by 1-2 C more but i'm tired to do it now


25C is a very decent drop in temps! I'd leave it right there and enjoy it!
one way of knowing that you applied TIM under IHS (on die) wrong is when you see core2 being off by 15C versus others under full load and near 5GHz frequency, been there before. what works for me on the die is a very thin layer of TIM and proper placement of IHS (taking into consideration that it will move when clamping down in the socket).
on IHS I use double layer of Ultra, because it seems my CPU block is not perfectly flat and neither the stock IHS is, that works best for me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> man i hope i can get mine going to get temps like that.
> so i got mine to boot again. out of 4 sticks I've tested in slot 1, only 1 of them will work.
> is it possible for a botched delid to kill a stick of ram, or did i just damage the imc which makes it more sensitive to instable ram?
> i haven't bolted the block back on yet... i'm trying to take it extra slow to get it right this time. i guess i'll try lightly bolting it down and booting before i tighten further? would love some more ideas if anyone has any...


I've seen a bad delid pics & descriptions before and a few killed the IMC in process... only way to be sure is to test your ram stick on other system and rule them out this way or test another ram kit on your system.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I corrected myself by explaining what I meant, this is the 2nd time you've failed to read my posts before replying.


no I haven't failed. I just reply to them in order I read them, meaning you are reading my replies 10 pages back until I get back on tracks. I'm not a cyborg constantly hooked up to this thread ... some people actually have a real life and do christmas shopping for instance









your point of view was wrong and a few people tried convincing you about it and yet you kept flaming us for being right and it's actually you who failed to google the issue and solutions ahead of posting your own incorrect opinions. simple apology is usually in order among civilized people. happy holidays.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Software voltage and temperature readings have never been particularly accurate, even if it isn't "rocket science".
> Intel for example use a method of inferring temperatures from a chips throttling point, which will have the usual range of manufacturing variation.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/476469/the-truth-about-temperatures-and-voltages
> Unclewebb, creator of RealTemp has written at length about it.
> I've sent Unclewebb a PM asking if he can give me some links on how Nvidia and ATI do it. I hope he can help because I'm interested in what method they use.
> I didn't find anything useful in a Google search. Just got tons of How Good are my Temps posts....


Which is exactly what I stated in the post you didn't read lol.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> And this is why ultra is nice. You don't need to worry about breaking anything when removing parts. I have pro between my IHS and die, but ultra everywhere else. I did test ultra on the die too (it came in a day before my pro did), and there was very little difference in temp reduction between ultra and pro.


I got a 4c drop from ultra to pro so i'm fine. I lapped the water block anyway cause I was bored.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> no I haven't failed. I just reply to them in order I read them, meaning you are reading my replies 10 pages back until I get back on tracks. I'm not a cyborg constantly hooked up to this thread ... some people actually have a real life and do christmas shopping for instance
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> your point of view was wrong and a few people tried convincing you about it and yet you kept flaming us for being right and it's actually you who failed to google the issue and solutions ahead of posting your own incorrect opinions. simple apology is usually in order among civilized people. happy holidays.


My point of view was that using pro over other thermal pastes gave me a low delta, not that cpu and gpu idle temps from software is 100% accurate.

Given the low heat output when a gpu is on idle, plus a massive copper block to absorb heat, a good thermal compound to transfer to heat to moving water, getting a little above ambient temps is very possible. My original point. Happy Holidays to you to.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Heh, I'm folding on this little bugger doing gpu and smp, whilst browsing, and playing Ragnarok Online lol
G620 at stock clocks now, bclk was making my Os go bananas, and xmp profile for my PSC sticks. 1866mhz 9-9-9-27-3t 1.6v (this chip's imc is not too good and it's SB, so meh)
Got it for 60 bucks actually, it wasn't free, but it's a nice addition and a useful backup.


----------



## She loved E

the saga continues...

got the machine to boot w/o cpu block. when i fastened the block (changing NOTHING else) it won't boot.









does it make sense that its pressure-sensitive now that there's no adhesive between IHS & pcb? I'm using CLP on the die, btw.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> please, you obviously don't know what you are talking about


Don't bother man. You'll just get frustrated


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> the saga continues...
> got the machine to boot w/o cpu block. when i fastened the block (changing NOTHING else) it won't boot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> does it make sense that its pressure-sensitive now that there's no adhesive between IHS & pcb? I'm using CLP on the die, btw.


I have the exact same problem with one of my 3770Ks. I nicked the PCB and only 1 DIMM will work and I have to fiddle with the H100 mounting to get it to boot. I'm trying to get parts so I can set up a test bench to try to get this sorted.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> the saga continues...
> got the machine to boot w/o cpu block. when i fastened the block (changing NOTHING else) it won't boot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> does it make sense that its pressure-sensitive now that there's no adhesive between IHS & pcb? I'm using CLP on the die, btw.


Can you try with the stock cooler if you still have it? Or just leave the CPU block about half a turn looser than you otherwise normally would tighten it?


----------



## She loved E

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I have the exact same problem with one of my 3770Ks. I nicked the PCB and only 1 DIMM will work and I have to fiddle with the H100 mounting to get it to boot. I'm trying to get parts so I can set up a test bench to try to get this sorted.


ah good idea, sorry you've got the same problem (its maddening, isn't it?). i think right now for my sanity and [email protected] stats i'm going to swap in my good ol 2700K and shelve the 3770k until I can test it on a bench to get it to work consistently. mental note: never try to bench on an ITX rig.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Can you try with the stock cooler if you still have it? Or just leave the CPU block about half a turn looser than you otherwise normally would tighten it?


i thought about doing that or using passive cooling to fiddle with it but i don't have time to mess with it now unfortunately. maybe in a couple months i'll come back to it. i've got a couple more 3770Ks I could try delidding but for obvious reasons i'm a little gunshy now.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> the saga continues...
> got the machine to boot w/o cpu block. when i fastened the block (changing NOTHING else) it won't boot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> does it make sense that its pressure-sensitive now that there's no adhesive between IHS & pcb? I'm using CLP on the die, btw.


have you by any chance nicked the die with the blade? other than that I think the PCB flexes when you tight the cooler strong enough and that might expose or disturb the nick in the corner?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Don't bother man. You'll just get frustrated


yeah, I gave up, used the ignore list for the first time in these forums hehe.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I have the exact same problem with one of my 3770Ks. I nicked the PCB and only 1 DIMM will work and I have to fiddle with the H100 mounting to get it to boot. I'm trying to get parts so I can set up a test bench to try to get this sorted.


wondering, have you guys both nicked the PCB in exact same spot? or rather similar area in same (or maybe other) corner? wondering if PCB flexes just enough when tightening it "strong enough" to cause some trouble to copper track exposed under the nick.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Can you try with the stock cooler if you still have it? Or just leave the CPU block about half a turn looser than you otherwise normally would tighten it?


I think it might work, because the stock cooler brings a little pressure while most aftermarket coolers are able to tighten the CPU by a lot and I believe this can cause PCB flexing. just my 2 cents.
I have nicked the PCB on my last 3770K and exposed some length of copper along the IHS on the left side - haven't damaged the copper just scratched the protective layer above it somehow when fiddling with the blade. thankfully mine is not pressure sensitive after this and all seems to work perfectly fine after I used some silicone layer on the copper and then TIM.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm considering passing on delidding my next 3770k, and instead saving for a phase change unit or getting a pot.








(if it is a decent low volt chip that is)


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> My 7950 was easy as pie to take apart! My first card was a single slot 9800GT which was fairly easy, my second was a friends 5850 which was terrible (oh so many screws) and my 7950 was so easy to do! Just four screws and a slight twist and it came off!


The only screws for the 7950 were the backplate screws, correct?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> The only screws for the 7950 were the backplate screws, correct?


To get the fan off only the 4 around the gpu if I remember correctly.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> To get the fan off only the 4 around the gpu if I remember correctly.


Could you be more precise, possibly indicating on a picture which 4?


----------



## She loved E

ok this is getting weird. i swapped in my 2700K (known to work). it booted fine into windows w/both sticks of ram. then i restarted it and now its doing the same exact thing as when i put the delidded 3770K in.







. It tries to boot, but no picture to the monitor & no HDD activity. I wonder if there is a bent pin afterall, or a short somewhere? gonna tear down now... i'm too impatient to let it sit like this.


----------



## tw33k

I nicked mine right in the corner. It's the tiniest of nicks as well but if I look closely I can just see the copper


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> ok this is getting weird. i swapped in my 2700K (known to work). it booted fine into windows w/both sticks of ram. then i restarted it and now its doing the same exact thing as when i put the delidded 3770K in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . It tries to boot, but no picture to the monitor & no HDD activity. I wonder if there is a bent pin afterall, or a short somewhere? gonna tear down now... i'm too impatient to let it sit like this.


Well the good thing about your having the 2700 is that you can see if it was the 3770 issues or not - or the MB. Looks like the MB may be it. Hope you can find and fix the problem as it may be that the 3770 is OK if you do. Maybe. Sorry to hear you are having to go through all of this. I also nicked my first delid. Not good, but I learned and my second one went much better - and I love the low temps. Hope it all works out for you too.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> ok this is getting weird. i swapped in my 2700K (known to work). it booted fine into windows w/both sticks of ram. then i restarted it and now its doing the same exact thing as when i put the delidded 3770K in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . It tries to boot, but no picture to the monitor & no HDD activity. I wonder if there is a bent pin afterall, or a short somewhere? gonna tear down now... i'm too impatient to let it sit like this.


sounds like a tricky BIOS bugs playing havoc over there ... are you running the latest MB BIOS? if so the board might be having issues, so please check for spilled metallic/conductive TIM around socket or bent pins inside it. it might be your PSU as well especially during warm restart trouble...


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Sorry to hear you guys are having bad luck. It really takes only the tiniest of slips I'm afraid.
















Count me in the club house. Ivy is NEKKID!







For clarity, naked is being nude. Nekkid is being w/o clothes, with nefarious intent!


----------



## She loved E

Thanks a lot PCW







. It makes me feel better that I'm not the only one to deal w/this.

I think you're right about the mobo. I just found another thread where someone had the same symptoms (unrelated to a delid). Not sure yet if his issue is the mobo, But since I've now tried everything else I think that's what it has to be. It's from Microcenter so I can stop by there tomorrow on the way to my folks to see if they can put it on the bench to verify.

@tw33k - did you nick the pcb or die?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Sorry to hear you guys are having bad luck. It really takes only the tiniest of slips I'm afraid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Count me in the club house. Ivy is NEKKID!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For clarity, naked is being nude. Nekkid is being w/o clothes, with nefarious intent!


Well congrats *Teh Rav3n*! Fill out the info on the first page format and you can become one of the delided crew!!! Membership comes with a nice sig!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well congrats *Teh Rav3n*! Fill out the info on the first page format and you can become one of the delided crew!!! Membership comes with a nice sig!


Thanks! I'll fill out what I can, as the build is still a WIP. Tore everything down yesterday after a leak was discovered in the rotary joint of one of my 90° fittings during an extended 2nd leak test. Although the chip was tested before delidding, it was only on the OEM hsf, soooo...









OCN name: T3h Rav3n

CPU: i5 3570K

on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Pro

ihs-TIM: None, will be running direct to die w/ an Apogee Drive II

Mhz gained: untested

OC after delid: untested

Temp drops: untested

CPU-Z validation of max OC: untested -available after final assembly tomorrow.

Oh btw, a polishing wheel on a Dremel works wonders for removing that IHS's black adhesive. I'm sure someone's probably already discovered that, but it bears mentioning again.


----------



## lilchronic

i did it


----------



## lilchronic

before delid. i had my window open when i tested this


after delid

i only used mx4 on the die because when i opend my cl ultra it was all dried up and leaked all in the cap and it was just a mess looked like a bunch of drill bit shavings


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> before delid. i had my window open when i tested this
> 
> 
> after delid
> 
> i only used mx4 on the die because when i opend my cl ultra it was all dried up and leaked all in the cap and it was just a mess looked like a bunch of drill bit shavings


Congrats to you too *lilchronic*! Nice work. Do get some CL PRO or Ultra as your temp gains will be even better if you do. Also check to see if your IHS is flat or concave as we run into that often enough. Lapping will fix that and might give you another 10C or so if it is, and even give you 1-3C improvement if not.

Do fill in the info in the correct format so you can join the crew!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well congrats *Teh Rav3n*! Fill out the info on the first page format and you can become one of the delided crew!!! Membership comes with a nice sig!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! I'll fill out what I can, as the build is still a WIP. Tore everything down yesterday after a leak was discovered in the rotary joint of one of my 90° fittings during an extended 2nd leak test. Although the chip was tested before delidding, it was only on the OEM hsf, soooo...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: T3h Rav3n
> 
> CPU: i5 3570K
> 
> on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Pro
> 
> ihs-TIM: None, will be running direct to die w/ an Apogee Drive II
> 
> Mhz gained: untested
> 
> OC after delid: untested
> 
> Temp drops: untested
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: untested -available after final assembly tomorrow.
> 
> Oh btw, a polishing wheel on a Dremel works wonders for removing that IHS's black adhesive. I'm sure someone's probably already discovered that, but it bears mentioning again.
Click to expand...

Please do get the rest of the info in as soon as you can, but we do have your delided pic and the start of the info, so slap on our sig and welcome to the crew!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> The only screws for the 7950 were the backplate screws, correct?


Mine just had the 4 screws in the back of it, they had tiny springs sitting inbetween the PCB and the screws on the back to apply more pressure obviously. After taking them out and sitting them aside that was it the cooler came off. The rest of the screws on my card itself are to do with the cooler itself, the PCI bracket and the VRM cooling/support bar that is unique to my card. I can't really help you guys much apart from that. I can take photos if it really helps that much or just paint a photo of the same card.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Congrats to you too *lilchronic*! Nice work. Do get some CL PRO or Ultra as your temp gains will be even better if you do. Also check to see if your IHS is flat or concave as we run into that often enough. Lapping will fix that and might give you another 10C or so if it is, and even give you 1-3C improvement if not.
> Do fill in the info in the correct format so you can join the crew!


well i actually used the ihs that i got from my old chip and i already lapped it prior to deliding this chip. so i still have my new chips ihs just chillen not lapped







lolz

OCN name: Lilchronic
CPU: 3570K
On-die TIM: MX4
IHS TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: 0 for now
OC after delid: 4.8
Temp drops: -8c for now

and i dident even get all the glue off the pcb yet i just poped the top and put the other 1 on just to check if it still worked


----------



## lilchronic

hot

cool


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Thanks! I'll fill out what I can, as the build is still a WIP. Tore everything down yesterday after a leak was discovered in the rotary joint of one of my 90° fittings during an extended 2nd leak test. Although the chip was tested before delidding, it was only on the OEM hsf, soooo...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: T3h Rav3n
> CPU: i5 3570K
> on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: None, will be running direct to die w/ an Apogee Drive II
> Mhz gained: untested
> OC after delid: untested
> Temp drops: untested
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: untested -available after final assembly tomorrow.
> *Oh btw, a polishing wheel on a Dremel works wonders for removing that IHS's black adhesive*. I'm sure someone's probably already discovered that, but it bears mentioning again.


yep, ive used it before as a option to clean the adhesive,
not sure if its on page 1, ocn is loading bad again today, pfft
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18591057


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Please do get the rest of the info in as soon as you can, but we do have your delided pic and the start of the info, so slap on our sig and welcome to the crew!


Wilco. I have to fab a quartet of standoff shims for my AD II's backplate tomorrow (the die's just barely making contact w/ the block as it is, I just found), and finish the harness for the Aquaero 5 before dropping the mobo back in and reassembling the loop and leak testing. I'm going to press hard for tomorrow, but considering the holiday, don't hold me to it.

Posting from my home server ftw!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep, ive used it before as a option to clean the adhesive,
> not sure if its on page 1, ocn is loading bad again today, pfft
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18591057


Nice, I suppose it might have helped if I'd read that before delidding.









No biggie, this isn't my first rodeo popping an IHS.







Thanks for the heads up!


----------



## VonDutch

is it only me, or does ocn have trouble loading again?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Nice, I suppose it might have helped if I'd read that before delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No biggie, this isn't my first rodeo popping an IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the heads up!


np, heaving to read through almost 3000 posts to find it..well,
maybe it should be on page 1 also.., o . its is on there, finally could open it ..lol


----------



## Gomi

Just throwing in a quick "Merry Christmas!" - Hope you all get square, hard and pixel-licious presents under your tree, should there be a soft one in there, dont be afraid to ask for a receipt *Grins*









Oh, and a Happy New Year! Would advise anyone to steer clear of de-lidding January the 1st


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> The only screws for the 7950 were the backplate screws, correct?


I just take them all out because even when all the screws are out you still have to pry it open and its best if there are no screws left. On my reference 7970 I had to remove over a dozen screws to get to the GPU core. Take all the screws from the back of the card, then there should be one or two on the slot cover where the video outputs are.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Congrats to you too *lilchronic*! Nice work. Do get some CL PRO or Ultra as your temp gains will be even better if you do. Also check to see if your IHS is flat or concave as we run into that often enough. Lapping will fix that and might give you another 10C or so if it is, and even give you 1-3C improvement if not.
> Do fill in the info in the correct format so you can join the crew!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well i actually used the ihs that i got from my old chip and i already lapped it prior to deliding this chip. so i still have my new chips ihs just chillen not lapped
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lolz
> 
> OCN name: Lilchronic
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM: MX4
> IHS TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: 0 for now
> OC after delid: 4.8
> Temp drops: -8c for now
> 
> and i dident even get all the glue off the pcb yet i just poped the top and put the other 1 on just to check if it still worked
Click to expand...

I reused my old IHS too! I have it lapped and ready while the other one is chillen like yours. One of the few advantages of having a dead chip...









Looking good, so feel free to add the crew banner to your sig!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Just a bit of info for anyone planning on running their chip direct-to-die with an Apogee Drive II. I'd guess it's probably the same with an Apogee HD as well. Upon closer (not bleary eyed 4 a.m. so sleepy I felt ******ed inspection), it's the block bolts that are interfering. Just a quick touch w/ a grinder disc/cut wheel/what have you, to remove about 1.5 mm of material farther up the shank is perfect. Like so...

Sorry for the pic quality, the wifey's got the camera and visiting family out of state. Cell pics...



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> is it only me, or does ocn have trouble loading again?
> np, heaving to read through almost 3000 posts to find it..well,
> maybe it should be on page 1 also.., o . its is on there, finally could open it ..lol


I'm think it was just you. Not really certain, being that I'm posting from my home server (stock dual core Regor 270) and it didn't seem to load any slower than normal. Not that this thing doesn't crawl compared to everything else, but it's mostly due to the onboard vid. It works great for a file server though. Happy holiday!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Just throwing in a quick "Merry Christmas!" - Hope you all get square, hard and pixel-licious presents under your tree, should there be a soft one in there, dont be afraid to ask for a receipt *Grins*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and a Happy New Year! Would advise anyone to steer clear of de-lidding January the 1st


Thanks, & have a Happy Happy, and a Merry Merry yourself mate!







No need for asking here, my pixel filled gift was to myself. So I has all the receipts!









Curiosity is killing. Why no de-lidding on New Years? 20*13*?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I guess everybody is busy and all...I'm folding and browsing, and playing some mmo's with my gf. The joys of adult hood and no relatives (?) at least no friendly ones :/


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I guess everybody is busy and all...I'm folding and browsing, and playing some mmo's with my gf. The joys of adult hood and no relatives (?) at least no friendly ones :/


Heh heh, that's where my wife is. Hangin out with the hostiles







More time w/o kids underfoot, for modding & finishing my build.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I guess everybody is busy and all...I'm folding and browsing, and playing some mmo's with my gf. The joys of adult hood and no relatives (?) at least no friendly ones :/
> 
> 
> 
> Heh heh, that's where my wife is. Hangin out with the hostiles
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More time w/o kids underfoot, for modding & finishing my build.
Click to expand...

Yep. Holidays and family do make it harder to get away to do computer stuff right now for some of us....


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol, you gonna join them later?

I'll stay at home for Christmas and go visit my father-in-law for New Year's Eve (plus it's my mother-in-law's birthday...so gotta go)
I want to fiddle with my ram but my G620's imc sucks! Don't wanna bork my 24/7 Os too...
I won some more ram in a contest, some psc sticks, so I'm quite happy!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol, you gonna join them later?
> 
> I'll stay at home for Christmas and go visit my father-in-law for New Year's Eve (plus it's my mother-in-law's birthday...so gotta go)
> I want to fiddle with my ram but my G620's imc sucks! Don't wanna bork my 24/7 Os too...
> I won some more ram in a contest, some psc sticks, so I'm quite happy!


Congrats on the mem sticks. What did you do to win them?


----------



## ivanlabrie

It was a benching team thing...we gave each other presents lol (I'm a member of the OCF benching team btw)


----------



## Bigdale7

Alrighty! Finished my delid and the good news is it boots.. Pics and app to join will follow.. I used CLP on the die and between the IHS and my H100 block.. the problem is It didn't help lower temps much.. Using prime95 I saw the following

Core 1 - 10C drop
Core 2 - 7C drop
Core 3 4C drop
and Core 4 the same... frustrating.. I have reapplied once aready with no improvement.. what do you suggest?

Very happy I didn't nick the PCB or die.. went pretty well actually.. oh I also lapped the CPU IHS as it was definately concave


----------



## Hokies83

After a long wait 10 calls finding where it got lost at the post office it is here...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Man, that looks so sweet! It must be Santa's doing lol

Now that'll be a gorgeous system, I'm jealous! xD
Good to see you around btw.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Merry Christmas to everyone! Hope you get all those graphics cards and CPU's that you wanted


----------



## Swag

Merry Christmas ~ Feliz Navidad

Get to drinking soon!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Merry Christmas ~ Feliz Navidad
> Get to drinking soon!


Lucky haha, had all mine on the 21st. Well almost all of it...

Also yes, to everyone else here at mine it's just the three of us. (Mum, Dad and myself) gives me time to play games and such


----------



## ghulands

I delidded my 3770 on the weekend. It dropped temps 10 C at Idle and 5 C using the Intel Burn Test. I can post screenshots once I put the machine back together - waiting for some more connectors for water cooling it. But here is the chip without her top on.



http://imgur.com/GHQxY



I found the process to be very quick and easy. I used a razor blade and got it all done in under 15 minutes.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep. Holidays and family do make it harder to get away to do computer stuff right now for some of us....


That they definitely do! If it hadn't been for Christmas, I'd be sporting a 3770K & an R7970 Lightning in this build, instead of a 3570k & R7950 TF 3. Oh well, it's all worth it come tomorrow a.m. when those faces light up!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol, you gonna join them later?
> I'll stay at home for Christmas and go visit my father-in-law for New Year's Eve (plus it's my mother-in-law's birthday...so gotta go)
> I want to fiddle with my ram but my G620's imc sucks! Don't wanna bork my 24/7 Os too...
> I won some more ram in a contest, some psc sticks, so I'm quite happy!


Grats on the new sticks! Lol! Join them? Yeah, no.







They'll be home in a few hours, and hopefully I'll be leak testing (again) by then. Praying to the computer gods this replacement fitting doesn't leak too...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> After a long wait 10 calls finding where it got lost at the post office it is here...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Ah yeeeeessss, very nice! I have the AD II myself.







Did you put the IHS back in place, or are you running direct-to-die? If you're going direct-to-die, check out my post on the previous page for the fix you'll need to do for the block to make proper contact. Mine btw, with the shortest run of tube ever (I think).

Edit: Almost forgot, I was speaking w/ Gabe @ Swiftech a week ago, and while they wouldn't let me move the warranty sticker on the AD II, he said it was fine to paint/color over it/wrap it w/ vinyl. Unfortunately, the scrap of Dinoc I had wouldn't stick, even w/ a heat gun to help out.


----------



## Hokies83

Direct die is risky and not worth it just LP the IHS....


----------



## stickg1

Merry Christmas Delidded Crew!! I'm having a few brews with the fam, just had a couple items sell on ebay so I think I'm gonna pick up some of that Crucial CL8 1.35v RAM, what do you guys think??

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148656


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Direct die is risky and not worth it just LP the IHS....


I'll date myself pretty badly by saying so, but when I first started building, everything in AMD's performance lineup was direct to die (in the K7/Athlon XP days). It's not as big a deal as many make it out to be, you just have to pay more attention to what your doing.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Merry Christmas Delidded Crew!! I'm having a few brews with the fam, just had a couple items sell on ebay so I think I'm gonna pick up some of that Crucial CL8 1.35v RAM, what do you guys think??
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148656


They are good if you want a cheap 16gb kit...if you want really fast ram nope, only good for AMD systems or 775 maybe. xD
They eat vdimm and do tight timings but at lowish clocks, not bad for 8gb sticks.


----------



## stickg1

What do you recommend?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Alrighty! Finished my delid and the good news is it boots.. Pics and app to join will follow.. I used CLP on the die and between the IHS and my H100 block.. the problem is It didn't help lower temps much.. Using prime95 I saw the following
> 
> Core 1 - 10C drop
> Core 2 - 7C drop
> Core 3 4C drop
> and Core 4 the same... frustrating.. I have reapplied once aready with no improvement.. what do you suggest?
> 
> Very happy I didn't nick the PCB or die.. went pretty well actually.. oh I also lapped the CPU IHS as it was definately concave


*Merry Christmas to all!!!*























*Bigdale7*, seems your temp gains are smaller than expected. Sounds like you did everything right, but you might need to reapply TIM and remount again just to verify it is right or not as temp gain is normally much better than that.

First though, what are your temps for 4.5GHz @ your vcore now that you are delided. Let us have some data to see if they look good or not. Also, any before and after temp comparison at same clock and voltage. Real data - not just delta.

Maybe your chip was already running cool as the major issue with IB is not the Intel TIM, but the gap. If your chip had better glue application, maybe the IHS was not so high off of the die, and thus not as bad at temps than most IB chips are. If so, that would explain why you would see little gain through delidding.

But I would also strongly consider redoing all the TIM and mounting if it were my rig. I'd want some better temp drops for getting up the guts to delid!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What do you recommend?


I reccomend those for 16gb kits, but you normally don't need more than 8gb unless you are a graphics designer or do tons of editing.
I'd say one of the 2x4gb 2400mhz cl9 Ripjaws kit or cl10 for cheaper stuff, by G.Skill, Avexir or Team Xtreem.
this one's great and cheap!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Merry Christmas to all!!!*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Bigdale7*, seems your temp gains are smaller than expected. Sounds like you did everything right, but you might need to reapply TIM and remount again just to verify it is right or not as temp gain is normally much better than that.
> First though, what are your temps for 4.5GHz @ your vcore now that you are delided. Let us have some data to see if they look good or not. Also, any before and after temp comparison at same clock and voltage. Real data - not just delta.
> Maybe your chip was already running cool as the major issue with IB is not the Intel TIM, but the gap. If your chip had better glue application, maybe the IHS was not so high off of the die, and thus not as bad at temps than most IB chips are. If so, that would explain why you would see little gain through delidding.
> But I would also strongly consider redoing all the TIM and mounting if it were my rig. I'd want some better temp drops for getting up the guts to delid!!!


Same to you!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> I'll date myself pretty badly by saying so, but when I first started building, everything in AMD's performance lineup was direct to die (in the K7/Athlon XP days). It's not as big a deal as many make it out to be, you just have to pay more attention to what your doing.


Really no temp drops from it why I see no point in it.

Also I think I have the older version with the mcp 350 pump bought it used 90$ shipped with 2 1/2 3/4 compression fittings and 2 1/2 3/4 45s which are worth about 30$

So I got 60$ in the block/pump which I think is a killer deal.

Picture below showing how tall it is.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Mine just had the 4 screws in the back of it, they had tiny springs sitting inbetween the PCB and the screws on the back to apply more pressure obviously. After taking them out and sitting them aside that was it the cooler came off. The rest of the screws on my card itself are to do with the cooler itself, the PCI bracket and the VRM cooling/support bar that is unique to my card. I can't really help you guys much apart from that. I can take photos if it really helps that much or just paint a photo of the same card.


I guess it was different from my 7970 ... there's about 10 little screws (no springs) and then the 4 backplate ones. With all the screws removed (Except backplate), the heatsink still wont come off ...


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Really no temp drops from it why I see no point in it.
> Also I think I have the older version with the mcp 350 pump bought it used 90$ shipped with 2 1/2 3/4 compression fittings and 2 1/2 3/4 45s which are worth about 30$
> So I got 60$ in the block/pump which I think is a killer deal.
> Picture below showing how tall it is.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice score, especially at that price! Congrats







I paid full price for mine from Gary @ Sidewinders, but I'm covered if it fails & hoses my system. I guess I'm paying extra for peace of mind. Lol!









Btw, I've been leak testing for the last 2 hours, it's looking good so far. I don't want to get happy just yet. Because after an extended test the last time, when the pump was shut down, *THEN* it started dripping from the double rotary 90°.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I guess it was different from my 7970 ... there's about 10 little screws (no springs) and then the 4 backplate ones. With all the screws removed (Except backplate), the heatsink still wont come off ...


Can you get me a picture of the specific card and I'll have a look at it. I had to really twist mine to get the paste to allow the PCB to separate from the cooler.









EDIT: Also my GPU idle temps went up and load stayed the sameish. Will have to re-apply after christmas.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Can you get me a picture of the specific card and I'll have a look at it. I had to really twist mine to get the paste to allow the PCB to separate from the cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Also my GPU idle temps went up and load stayed the sameish. Will have to re-apply after christmas.


I had a similar thing with my 7950 cooler. I think the double sided thermal tape on the memory was sticking and it took a LOT more force than I would have liked to remove the HS to replace the TIM. Just slowly twist and wiggle the card while slowly and steadily prying it off and if it feels like it's flexing a bit then back off and try a different approach. A hair dryer might help loosen it up too!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Can you get me a picture of the specific card and I'll have a look at it. I had to really twist mine to get the paste to allow the PCB to separate from the cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Also my GPU idle temps went up and load stayed the sameish. Will have to re-apply after christmas.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I had a similar thing with my 7950 cooler. I think the double sided thermal tape on the memory was sticking and it took a LOT more force than I would have liked to remove the HS to replace the TIM. Just slowly twist and wiggle the card while slowly and steadily prying it off and if it feels like it's flexing a bit then back off and try a different approach. A hair dryer might help loosen it up too!


I guess I'll do that. I was pulling directly up, bending the PCB ... didn't go further. if the backplate doesn't need to be unscrewed, then that saves me quite a bit of headache

I'll try again tomorrow


----------



## VonDutch

Merry Christmas to everyone


----------



## feniks

merry x-mas everybody!


----------



## lilchronic

merry x mas


----------



## I_shot

Hell Yeah Babe


----------



## chronicfx

Merry Christmas everyone!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Hell Yeah Babe


looks shiny








first time you took it apart again or ?


----------



## I_shot

That's my second chip sir . I tried different combinations with the tim the result is the same. I didn't forget to take photos this time


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> That's my second chip sir . I tried different combinations with the tim the result is the same. I didn't forget to take photos this time


yea, i mean after applying the liquid pro, it is pro right? ..lol
Merry Christmas


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, my G620 is not that bad, but I can't seem to clock it from within Windows...stupid AISuite.
So far I got 1969mhz ram cl7-9-7-27-1t auto subs, latency boundary 1 and 105.5mhz bclk which translates into 2743mhz cpu clock.
Got 4th in UCbench2011 for my chip, which is not bad, but well...
Can't wait for my new 3770k!


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i mean after applying the liquid pro, it is pro right? ..lol
> Merry Christmas


it is phobya liquid metal







Happy new year


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, my G620 is not that bad, but I can't seem to clock it from within Windows...stupid AISuite.
> So far I got 1969mhz ram cl7-9-7-27-1t auto subs, latency boundary 1 and 105.5mhz bclk which translates into 2743mhz cpu clock.
> Got 4th in UCbench2011 for my chip, which is not bad, but well...
> Can't wait for my new 3770k!


yeah it's gonna be great fun. delid it and show the results


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> it is phobya liquid metal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Happy new year


yea, i forgot, youre the phobia guy...LOL jk jk


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sandy Bridge dually...soldered.
I'm running passive, maxing at 50c on load lol


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i forgot, youre the phobia guy...LOL jk jk


phobya was available lol


----------



## c2thew

This is a much better overclockable lower profile memory

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096

merry christmas everyone!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Depends on the batch...good for all around gaming builds though, and fits under whatever cooler you got.
I wouldn't reccomend it to benchers or guys with Gigabyte z77 boards, they don't clock good on them.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> This is a much better overclockable lower profile memory
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096
> merry christmas everyone!


Do you know that for a fact? It seems like the 1.35v ram that comes stock at cl8 would do better than stock cl11 ram. In theory it would seem that the crucial has better potential. I've had 4 different sets of the Samsung, I'm going to try the new Crucial stuff this time.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Crucial can't clock over 2400mhz with good timings, whereas SOME Samsung can, but they are limited by the slim pcb.
I posted a review showing a decent set, you get 16gb without straining your IMC that much and can do 2133mhz or 2400mhz with really good timings for 8gb modules, and more than enough for most people out there.

EDIT: Here it is...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Crucial can't clock over 2400mhz with good timings, whereas SOME Samsung can, but they are limited by the slim pcb.
> I posted a review showing a decent set, you get 16gb without straining your IMC that much and can do 2133mhz or 2400mhz with really good timings for 8gb modules, and more than enough for most people out there.
> EDIT: Here it is...


I just want stable 1866 CL8 or 2133 CL9, you think that's doable? Also I only need for 8GB for my PC usage. I don't do anything that's memory intensive.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Then you'll be fine with the Samsung ram, if you want cl9 at 2133mhz the Crucials might be better, but only worth it if you intend to go for 16gb in the future.
Look for batch 1229 and higher for Samsung ram, perhaps you got a local store where you can pick them up and check the batch no.?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Then you'll be fine with the Samsung ram, if you want cl9 at 2133mhz the Crucials might be better, but only worth it if you intend to go for 16gb in the future.
> Look for batch 1229 and higher for Samsung ram, perhaps you got a local store where you can pick them up and check the batch no.?


Naw no local stores, closest place is a 5 hour drive. I might just snag the crucial, haven't tried it before and dont know many people that have. Also my brother just sent me a $50 gift certificate for newegg so maybe I'll get the 4x4GB kit for $80. We'll see. But I don't need crazy frequencies just tight timings. Even the stock 1600 CL8 would make me happy, but 1866 CL8 would be even better!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get the 8gb 1.35v crucial sticks, or the led equipped 1866mhz ballistix tactical tracers if you want some gorgeous ram. Both clock good, but not as high mhz as Samsung.
Tacticals have leds and look GREAT xD


----------



## stickg1

can you link the tracers your talking about? they don't make those in 1.35v do they? I would buy whatever can get me 1866/2133 cl8/9.


----------



## ivanlabrie

All of those Crucials will do tight at 2133mhz...

Here you have different led colors:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148555

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148554

These have no leds and are 1.35v and really low profile:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148657 2x8gb

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148656 2x4gb


----------



## stickg1

I'm gonna get the 2x4GB low profile CL8. The LED ones are cool but I have about 6 LED fans and two LED light strips in my case, it's pretty much lit up like a christmas tree. Plus this stuff is cheaper and I can use the ASUS rebate card I have to get a decent air cooler and my $50 giftcard and not really come out of pocket at all.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool!

I'm running a used PSC kit, 2x2gb 2000c9, clocked them at 1866mhz cl7-9-7-24-2t with 1.65v, pretty decent for a G620 cpu.
So far gaming with tons of tabs open I don't go over 2gb ram usage, so I'd say ram size is overrated lol


----------



## Bigdale7

Okay I reapplied my CLP and have achieved better temps.. So here is my application for joining the delid club..

Bigdale7
i5 3570K
CLP on die and on the IHS (H100)
Can now run 5.0 as daily OC - 4.7 before delid + 300 mgz
haven't yet tested for max OC.. was 5.3
Lapped the IHS, finished with 1500 grit.
Tested before and after with Prime95 at 4.7 ghz
Hotttest core was 86C - Hotttest core now 78


http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2584502


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not bad, but it does look like a ton of CLP on die...I'd just run it like that though, no need to get extra picky.
Thing runs 5ghz 24/7, what more do you want? xD


----------



## Bigdale7

That photo was taken before I did it all again... tried to get less on it when I did it again.. Ya I'm pretty happy with my chip, but was hoping for a greater drop in the temps.. Thanks Ivanlabrie and Merry Christmas


----------



## ivanlabrie

You too man!
Congrats on that job!!! Many of us did not succeed...I'm not sure I'll delid my new 3770k, unless it's a complete dud and doesn't go over 4.5ghz like VonDutch's one, or the IMC sucks bad.
But then I would need to save for a new 3770k, for benching lol


----------



## lilchronic

ok so im sad that my temps werent that good only 8c temp drrop but hopefully my temps drop more when i put coolabs liguid pro the die and i can get -20c drop







i also want to say if ur as drunk as i am dont drive and merry christmas


----------



## ivanlabrie

Same to you bud!

You'll love your LP once you get it...I still regret not taking enough time to preparate and wrecking my board and my chip with it, but well.
Will decide what to do once I get another 3770k.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Congrats BigDale7!







And Merry Christmas everyone!









What a day! The new system is up & running, and temps are pretty awesome so far. Highest recorded was a momentary spike to 65 C running IBT w/ 1.5 Vcore @ 47 multi. Probably higher voltage than necessary, but the intent was more checking for cooling system effectiveness and looking for max cpu clock (and I was going to play w/ that Extreme Tuning Utility just to see). Haven't found it yet, running prime @ 4.7 Ghz in the background atm.









I had to lol at the people earlier though. I'd started testing my 7950 TF 3 before the cpu, and had the Vcore pumped up in anticipation of. So I totally changed my mind after booting @ 4.2, and started on the gpu first. I'm not certain that I've even run in the oc wall with it, but I got all sorts of excited once I reached 1300 core/1500 mem and started a thread about it.



*Warning: Rant ahead.*

Wouldn't you know most of the people were whining about me running a high Vcore? Holy... Seriously? You're staring down a (stable) uber oc with potentially more headroom on a R7950 under water, and you say nothing about it, but whine? What is this? IDon'tTakeRisks&GoOver1.25Vcore.net? The Pursuit of Performance, it bears keeping in mind. No balls, no glory...in a less elegant fashion.










*/end rant*

I'm not sure this 3570k is going to be a good/great oc'er though. After playing around, I popped into bios to set everything, and then missed turning off spread spectrum







, and it bsod'd on me the first time I ran IBT @ 4.7. Temps were still very good, but we'll see. I'm hoping it was just a bobble from spread spectrum...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Depends on the batch...good for all around gaming builds though, and fits under whatever cooler you got.
> I wouldn't reccomend it to benchers or guys with Gigabyte z77 boards, they don't clock good on them.


Yeah, I can second this. Max clock is 1866 at 9-9-9-24 and even then I'm not 100% sure it is stable. They did fix it on the UD5H though so I hope that soon they'll fix it on this, from what I've read it's only on Gigabyte Z77 boards too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> */end rant*
> I'm not sure this 3570k is going to be a good/great oc'er though. After playing around, I popped into bios to set everything, and then missed turning off spread spectrum
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , and it bsod'd on me the first time I ran IBT @ 4.7. Temps were still very good, but we'll see. I'm hoping it was just a bobble from spread spectrum...


Cheers for the Ivy specific table







+Rep
To be honest I don't like running too close to 1.5v for 24/7 as that's rather high just to gain an extra 200MHz or so but I know what you mean. I'm just more careful being a student


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, I can second this. Max clock is 1866 at 9-9-9-24 and even then I'm not 100% sure it is stable. They did fix it on the UD5H though so I hope that soon they'll fix it on this, from what I've read it's only on Gigabyte Z77 boards too.


Add a third to that list. I'm running the exact same sticks. Although I've not pushed the mem yet, 2000 mhz and above seems out of the question. I'll know more once I find a stable cpu multi, as 4.7 Ghz is definitely not in the cards. They seem happy @ 1866, but I've not played w/ the timings at all yet.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Cheers for the Ivy specific table
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +Rep
> To be honest I don't like running too close to 1.5v for 24/7 as that's rather high just to gain an extra 200MHz or so but I know what you mean. I'm just more careful being a student


All thanks go to Sin for the table, to give credit where it's due.







You're quite welcome none the less.









I'm comfortable with it as my loop temps are very nice, and there's quite a bit of headroom both in temps & max Vcore. We'll see concerning temps, once I stress the gpu & cpu simultaneously. Being on a single 240 rad, even an awesome performing one, may make a rather large difference w/ the gpu clocks I've got. I really don't have enough room to add another radiator in this Prodigy, without sacrificing my HDD's. That simply isn't happening. Lol!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Oh a Prodigy!







nice...I bet your gonna see some limitations cause of the board, so it may not be so bad a chip. Do you have any other board at hand to test it on?
You can always mod it to fit an MVG like Adamski07 did such gloriously


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Oh a Prodigy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nice...I bet your gonna see some limitations cause of the board, so it may not be so bad a chip. Do you have any other board at hand to test it on?
> You can always mod it to fit an MVG like Adamski07 did such gloriously


Thanks, I'm loving the Prodigy!







The board very well may be limiting me. I just switched camps from an AMD 1090T (@ 4.3 Ghz)/Giga 990FXA-UD5 (115 Mhz FSB, 3255 Mhz NB), so I'm afraid I don't have another board to test on. Honestly, I'm a bit disappointed w/ the lack of settings in the UEFI. There's a good bit of CPU related tweaks to eek that last little bit out that simply aren't there. I tried to dl that modded unlocked Z77e-itx bios, but the dl linky is dead unfortunately.

All in all, it's doing pretty well @ a 46 multi. I stopped Prime about 2 hours in to test at 47, and just restarted it at 46 again a little over an hour ago. I'll let it go overnight for an 8/9 hour run to be sure, but it's kicking along nicely. Then do the prerequisite IBT runs to post here for the final verification in the morning.









I <3 Adamski07's build, but I'd rather stick to a m-itx ff for myself. I've already been down every other road aside from e-atx, and I'm just ready for something sorta small-ish & portable.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I think itx is really cool, but I couldn't find an appropriate board for my needs...I had high hopes on the EVGA stinger but it wasn't as good as I expected it to be and clocks ram quite bad. The p8z77-i might be the best out there but it's pricey. That Asrock board might fit the bill for a gaming itx rig! I had no idea someone modded the bios...that's interesting, but I still think it would be vrm limited for higher overclocks.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, I think itx is really cool, but I couldn't find an appropriate board for my needs...I had high hopes on the EVGA stinger but it wasn't as good as I expected it to be and clocks ram quite bad. The p8z77-i might be the best out there but it's pricey. That Asrock board might fit the bill for a gaming itx rig! I had no idea someone modded the bios...that's interesting, but I still think it would be vrm limited for higher overclocks.


I want a mITX motherboard waterblock ...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I have the ASRock Z77E-ITX in a Prodigy I just put together for an emulator box a few weeks ago. Just waiting to delid my 3570K because I only have it on a 92mm air cooler since it's about all I could fit. I really love the Prodigy and I'm not expecting the board to hold me back (only going to be going for a 4.5-4.6Ghz OC anyway).


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I have the ASRock Z77E-ITX in a Prodigy I just put together for an emulator box a few weeks ago. Just waiting to delid my 3570K because I only have it on a 92mm air cooler since it's about all I could fit. I really love the Prodigy and I'm not expecting the board to hold me back (only going to be going for a 4.5-4.6Ghz OC anyway).


I'm currently on a Z77E-ITX sitting on 4.7GHz, heat limited


----------



## ivanlabrie

Itx case? 4.7ghz is plenty though, even for a 2600k


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Yea 4.7ghz is plenty indeed. I myself won't even need that much, not when I'm using it strictly for emulation. The only games that even require me to OC at all are certain GC and Wii games. I still want to delid though so I can get my temps down. Have plenty of CLP might as well put it to use.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah I heard Dolphin can be intensive cpu wise...You already delidded one, doubt the 3570k would go wrong.
You got Monster Hunter Tri?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Itx case? 4.7ghz is plenty though, even for a 2600k


Yeah but I've got a few [fixable] issues prohibiting me from going further

The H100 currently has AS5 (applied like a pig). I have Indigo Extreme waiting to go on.

As well, my LLC is stuck at level 1 and overshoots the Vcore in BIOS by 0.05V ... At least during Prime95 it's more or less stable (temperature-wise) but during IBT load temps go from 60C to 90C, in part due to thermal throttling

PS I'll be running [email protected] so every mhz of CPU and RAM speed is required







Competitive nature of [email protected] is crazy


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah I heard Dolphin can be intensive cpu wise...You already delidded one, doubt the 3570k would go wrong.
> You got Monster Hunter Tri?


I have all the games for all the emulators I will be running...don't ask me how







.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> As well, my LLC is stuck at level 1 and overshoots the Vcore in BIOS by 0.05V ... At least during Prime95 it's more or less stable (temperature-wise) but during IBT load temps go from 60C to 90C, in part due to thermal throttling


I use LLC level 2 on both my ASRock boards, I always stay away from level 1.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah 90 for a Sandy quad is too hot man...something's not right with your tim application, block mount or your case is starving of airflow.
How much vcore for that?

EDIT: I won't ask...I got Monster Hunter 3 for the psp, and a host of other cool games too lol
Actually Monster Hunter Freedom Unite is the most challenging and the best game of the series. Give it a try!


----------



## Belial

I'm aware clock for clock, IB>SB.

My question to all here, does a delidded IB reach higher overclocks than an SB? Or do both chips reach 4.5-5ghz generally? That's how I understand it right now...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I'm aware clock for clock, IB>SB.
> My question to all here, does a delidded IB reach higher overclocks than an SB? Or do both chips reach 4.5-5ghz generally? That's how I understand it right now...


In most cases heat is what holds back an IB OC. Delidding it helps put that issue to rest. From what I've seen from those who delid, IB's clock just as good if not higher than SB's and clock for clock they are faster as you alluded to.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I have all the games for all the emulators I will be running...don't ask me how
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> I use LLC level 2 on both my ASRock boards, I always stay away from level 1.


Yeah I need to experiment but I can't. I can't figure out why but the LLC levels never apply







So I'm stuck at 1 which is extreme
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah 90 for a Sandy quad is too hot man...something's not right with your tim application, block mount or your case is starving of airflow.
> How much vcore for that?
> EDIT: I won't ask...I got Monster Hunter 3 for the psp, and a host of other cool games too lol
> Actually Monster Hunter Freedom Unite is the most challenging and the best game of the series. Give it a try!


I know, but ... what can I do. It's open case right now, the rad is uninhibited ... as I said, I applied some AS5 like a pig just to make sure the H100 worked.

Vcore is set at 1.40v in the BIOS, but fluctuates between 1.432v and 1.448v in CPU-z


----------



## ivanlabrie

+1, IB clocks higher and has higher ram dividers as well as pcie 3.0 and lower power consumption when not extremely high clocked.
SB is better only if you got an extremely good chip, cause you can reach 5.6ghz on water for example with lowish vcore, which would be on par with a 5.2ghz IB more or less...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Yeah I need to experiment but I can't. I can't figure out why but the LLC levels never apply
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I'm stuck at 1 which is extreme


What BIOS version are you using?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Too much tim will hurt temps a lot...re apply a tiny rice grain size dot and try again.
Also that vcore swings too wildly, you gotta figure that out asap.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What BIOS version are you using?


1.70
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Too much tim will hurt temps a lot...re apply a tiny rice grain size dot and try again.
> Also that vcore swings too wildly, you gotta figure that out asap.


I'm working on it, the temps are just annoying


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> 1.70


Did you have this same issue before you updated? That version just came out like a week ago right?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Did you have this same issue before you updated? That version just came out like a week ago right?


I did not play with the LLC before I updated my bios :/ I was overclocking my RAM and noticed it wouldn't go above 2133. Another user suggested I update so I did (It still doesn't go above 2133 lol )

I figure I might as well explain the issue a bit more

So you guys know how the BIOS kind of works in a three column system?

Setting ||| Current Value ||| Value to be used subsequently

Well for the CPU Load-line calibration, it shows Level 1 as the Current value, but always shows level 2 or 3 ( whichever I choose) as the "to-be-used-value", even before I set it.

So when I boot up and enter BIOS, it would *ideally* look like this:

CPU Load-line calibration ||| Level 1 ||| Level 1

And if I change it to level 3, before rebooting it will be this:

CPU Load-line calibration ||| Level 1 ||| Level 3

But upon rebooting, it stays at that! The level 3 never goes into use and I'm not sure how to fix it.

I guess i should flash with an older BIOS ?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I did not play with the LLC before I updated my bios :/ I was overclocking my RAM and noticed it wouldn't go above 2133. Another user suggested I update so I did (It still doesn't go above 2133 lol )
> I figure I might as well explain the issue a bit more
> So you guys know how the BIOS kind of works in a three column system?
> Setting ||| Current Value ||| Value to be used subsequently
> Well for the CPU Load-line calibration, it shows Level 1 as the Current value, but always shows level 2 or 3 ( whichever I choose) as the "to-be-used-value", even before I set it.
> So when I boot up and enter BIOS, it would *ideally* look like this:
> CPU Load-line calibration ||| Level 1 ||| Level 1
> And if I change it to level 3, before rebooting it will be this:
> CPU Load-line calibration ||| Level 1 ||| Level 3
> But upon rebooting, it stays at that! The level 3 never goes into use and I'm not sure how to fix it.
> I guess i should flash with an older BIOS ?


Yea I'd at least flash it and see if it was just a BIOS glitch because that's what it sounds like. I rarely update my BIOS unless it's been out for at least a month or two anyway unless the fixes are specific to an issue/feature that relates to my needs.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I'd at least flash it and see if it was just a BIOS glitch because that's what it sounds like. I rarely update my BIOS unless it's been out for at least a month or two anyway unless the fixes are specific to an issue/feature that relates to my needs.


That WAS my case with the RAM







Oh well for now I'm running it 9-10-10-27 1N. I'll get around to that later once the CPU is at it's limit

I'll save some screenshots of the BIOS to illustrate what it shows when I go in

Oh and when I'm under load, vCore is now fluctuating between 1.32v and 1.448v, sporadically.

PS. Which BIOS would you suggest flashing to? 1.40 / 1.60 ?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I'd at least flash it and see if it was just a BIOS glitch because that's what it sounds like. I rarely update my BIOS unless it's been out for at least a month or two anyway unless the fixes are specific to an issue/feature that relates to my needs.
> 
> 
> 
> That WAS my case with the RAM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh well for now I'm running it 9-10-10-27 1N. I'll get around to that later once the CPU is at it's limit
> 
> I'll save some screenshots of the BIOS to illustrate what it shows when I go in
> 
> Oh and when I'm under load, vCore is now fluctuating between 1.32v and 1.448v, sporadically.
> 
> PS. Which BIOS would you suggest flashing to? 1.40 / 1.60 ?
Click to expand...

Are you monitoring vcore through CPUz or through the ASRock utility because CPUz always bounces around for me when under load but the ASRock utility stays pretty constant.

I would just go back to 1.60 and see if that fixes the LLC issue. If not try 1.40 but that's as far back as I'd test myself


----------



## ivanlabrie

BTW, if you have a 2600k, 2133mhz is the max ram multi SB has.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Are you monitoring vcore through CPUz or through the ASRock utility because CPUz always bounces around for me when under load but the ASRock utility stays pretty constant.
> I would just go back to 1.60 and see if that fixes the LLC issue. If not try 1.40 but that's as far back as I'd test myself


Flashed to 1.40 ...

When I entered the BIOS the 1st time, it was set at Level 5 LLC. I set it at level 3, rebooted. Back to level 1 -.- so it's stuck again. Are there any settings that could affect this ? PLL or some other stuff... The C states?

Monitoring through CPU-z, I'll give Asrock a try

Flashed to 1.40 ; no difference. Sticky LLC is still happening. Asrock utility crashes when I launch it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> BTW, if you have a 2600k, 2133mhz is the max ram multi SB has.










Thanks, that helps me a lot. I had no clue what was wrong with my motherboard. At least now I can concentrate on tightening the timings. Btw, 1N or 2N ?

I'm assuming you were monitoring via ASRock Extreme Tuning Utility ver:0.1.252 ?

Edit: The ASRock Utility is crashing, won't open

Using Hwinfo64, VCore is identical to CPU-z. VID is about 0.03v lower, constantly.

I just blackscreened







Means something changed


----------



## Matt-Matt

Feel like de-lidding tonight.. But my razor blade is rusted and the local hardware store is closed so I'll have to head down in the next couple of days.


----------



## Valgaur

*Merry Christmas!?......... Baaaaaaaaaa hum bug!!!!!*

















Just kiddin. Yeah I know I'm late for the merry merry party here! Anyways been away fromt he comp for all of ver 36 hours... and 120 posts..... seriously people we got issues lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> the saga continues...
> got the machine to boot w/o cpu block. when i fastened the block (changing NOTHING else) it won't boot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> does it make sense that its pressure-sensitive now that there's no adhesive between IHS & pcb? I'm using CLP on the die, btw.


Yeah I know im late to this but here ya go. This can be the case of pressure sometimes do to the architecture and the micro transistors being to far apart sometimes due to the pressure mounting on it. Try this instead, take the block off and latche the cpu in and just feel it with your hand and boot it. then if it works do the block but make the screws only finger tight.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Sorry to hear you guys are having bad luck. It really takes only the tiniest of slips I'm afraid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Count me in the club house. Ivy is NEKKID!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For clarity, naked is being nude. Nekkid is being w/o clothes, with nefarious intent!


NEKKID!!!! Well done sir!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> before delid. i had my window open when i tested this
> 
> after delid
> 
> i only used mx4 on the die because when i opend my cl ultra it was all dried up and leaked all in the cap and it was just a mess looked like a bunch of drill bit shavings


About







time!!!!






















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I guess everybody is busy and all...I'm folding and browsing, and playing some mmo's with my gf. The joys of adult hood and no relatives (?) at least no friendly ones :/


I'm here for ya buddy!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghulands*
> 
> I delidded my 3770 on the weekend. It dropped temps 10 C at Idle and 5 C using the Intel Burn Test. I can post screenshots once I put the machine back together - waiting for some more connectors for water cooling it. But here is the chip without her top on.
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/GHQxY
> 
> 
> I found the process to be very quick and easy. I used a razor blade and got it all done in under 15 minutes.


Razor blade all the way and Welcome sir!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i forgot, youre the phobia guy...LOL jk jk


LULz..... phobia guy.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Okay I reapplied my CLP and have achieved better temps.. So here is my application for joining the delid club..
> Bigdale7
> i5 3570K
> CLP on die and on the IHS (H100)
> Can now run 5.0 as daily OC - 4.7 before delid + 300 mgz
> haven't yet tested for max OC.. was 5.3
> Lapped the IHS, finished with 1500 grit.
> Tested before and after with Prime95 at 4.7 ghz
> Hotttest core was 86C - Hotttest core now 78
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2584502


Yes yes another joins my crew! the ship is getting full!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> BTW, if you have a 2600k, 2133mhz is the max ram multi SB has.


Good info!









Now for my bit!








Anyways here goes I suppose. For all the submissions that PC has been keeping and getting I can finally access a computer to where i can use my google spreadsheet.

*PC GIVE ME MOAR ENTRIES THROUGH PM!!!!!!!!!!*

Merry Christmas and everything for all the peoples of OCN and I'll try to be on here more often. been enjoying my break from college the big boy learny thingy majigger...... shut up.

Hope too be smack talkin with you guys real soon and hope you are having fun! Also will be re doing the OP when I get my new chip....(whenever that is......) Just waiting for today to end so Intel will accept my package, then ill know if i have a comp for a while or not for a few months lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Feel like de-lidding tonight.. But my razor blade is rusted and the local hardware store is closed so I'll have to head down in the next couple of days.


insert that blade into an orange overnight and let the acid eat at the rust then use steel wool on it. sometimes it works depending on the amount of rust.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> insert that blade into an orange overnight and let the acid eat at the rust then use steel wool on it. sometimes it works depending on the amount of rust.


Vinegar is also really quick at removing rust.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> insert that blade into an orange overnight and let the acid eat at the rust then use steel wool on it. sometimes it works depending on the amount of rust.


Good to know!








If we have any oranges I shall try that one!

So cut the orange in half and sort of encase the entire blade in it, put it in just half or don't cut the orange at all and just through it?


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *Snip* NEKKID!!!! Well done sir!


Muchas gracias! I'm running Prime now, and you'll get a pm from me tomorrow, as soon as she finishes the test, & I can run IBT.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> insert that blade into an orange overnight and let the acid eat at the rust then use steel wool on it. sometimes it works depending on the amount of rust.


A grey 3M Scotch Brite pad works wonders as well. My box of shop knife blades rusted in the humidity (in the garage), and that lil' tiny piece included in the CLP packaging worked very well. A good thing to, because I'm out of the green & grey pads atm. Red's would take all stinking day...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Vinegar is also really quick at removing rust.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Good to know!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If we have any oranges I shall try that one!
> So cut the orange in half and sort of encase the entire blade in it, put it in just half or don't cut the orange at all and just through it?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Muchas gracias! I'm running Prime now, and you'll get a pm from me tomorrow, as soon as she finishes the test, & I can run IBT.
> A grey 3M Scotch Brite pad works wonders as well. My box of shop knife blades rusted in the humidity (in the garage), and that lil' tiny piece included in the CLP packaging worked very well. A good thing to, because I'm out of the green & grey pads atm. Red's would take all stinking day...


Yup! and with the orange just push the blade in and let it sit inside the orange. dont cut it in half, or either way i suppose.


----------



## Swag

I'm gonna be burying my H100 in acetone because of this horrible paintjob I gave it. Will it destroy the block though?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm gonna be burying my H100 in acetone because of this horrible paintjob I gave it. Will it destroy the block though?


Acetone should not be recommended for degreasing or cleaning of copper or copper bearing alloys containing discrete copper rich intermetallic particles
http://www.stonybrook.edu/vescalab/research/research7.html

im not to technical, but if i understand this article right, acetone is bad for copper








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> LULz..... phobia guy.


you noticed...LOL








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Feel like de-lidding tonight.. But my razor blade is rusted and the local hardware store is closed so I'll have to head down in the next couple of days.


sandpaper,
thats what i did with mine, just a few times over it, and most rust was gone,
i couldnt wait either to get new blades..lol


----------



## Swag

I absolutely hate this paint-job, how do I get rid of it? Now I know why I always strayed away from buying crappy store-brand stuff. The tape I bought had so many leaks despite me making 4 layers of it. Awful!


----------



## alancsalt

Get rid of rust? OK, how *old* is this trick? Ask vintage car people. Get some feed grade black molasses from a farm supplies store and mix it with water. Mix it about 10:1 Put your rusty object in that mix for a few days. As you check it you'll see the rust disappear...


----------



## VonDutch

once i worked as a machine painter, making old machines new again,
we used a sand-blasting machine to clean parts

maybe you know peeps that do that kind of work? its so easy to clean parts from paint etc..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Get rid of rust? OK, how *old* is this trick? Ask vintage car people. Get some feed grade black molasses from a farm supplies store and mix it with water. Mix it about 10:1 Put your rusty object in that mix for a few days. As you check it you'll see the rust disappear...


he wants to delid NOW...lol ..but stores are closed last 2 days, so he cant get new blades 







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Feel like de-lidding tonight.. But my razor blade is rusted and the local hardware store is closed so I'll have to head down in the next couple of days.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> once i worked as a machine painter, making old machines new again,
> we used a sand-blasting machine to clean parts
> 
> maybe you know peeps that do that kind of work? its so easy to clean parts from paint etc..
> 
> he wants to delid NOW...lol ..but stores are closed last 2 days, so he cant get new blades


I think stuff is opening tomorrow but I'm busy tomorrow day so








It's mums birthday and we're going out for lunch and then it's getting too close to new years to do much testing if I leave it any later, going to some thing for uni on the 5th or so, I really need to get a move on


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I think stuff is opening tomorrow but I'm busy tomorrow day so
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's mums birthday and we're going out for lunch and then it's getting too close to new years to do much testing if I leave it any later, going to some thing for uni on the 5th or so, I really need to get a move on


Get check out your local high school's metal shop or automotive shop. Assuming you just graduated and might know the teachers they'd probably let you use their equipment for 20-30 mins


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Get check out your local high school's metal shop or automotive shop. Assuming you just graduated and might know the teachers they'd probably let you use their equipment for 20-30 mins


Yeah I did, but they'd all be away on holiday etc. It's actually where I got the blade from.. I asked a friend if he had anything like it and he just "took one from a drawer" haha. I'll see how the rusted one goes in the orange!


----------



## VonDutch

windows giving me a hard time, just did a system restore to yesterday,
after i did some updates, KB bla bla, if i open a text doc, it takes long time for it to appear,
upto 5 seconds, it opens without text at first, then the text shows later, it kinda freezes the system too..
anyone else having the same issue? did a fresh windows install after i got my new 7970,
did another install after i had the same problems, after getting all updates the issue started ..
i have some optional updates for ".net framework 4" i installed at first, not sure if they cause it tho..


----------



## I_shot

Originally Posted by Valgaur

LULz..... phobia guy.
you noticed...LOL

I'll change my nick name to Phobya Guy haha


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Val! buy a G620 like me so I can compete with ya lol
Mine was dirt cheap, I got one in an MVG lmao with psc ram too! 7-9-7-24-1t 1866mhz 1.65v


----------



## adamski07

Hey folks! My 3570k was delided few days ago. I got the CLU and PK-1 in hand right now. Tips and other stuffs I need to know before installing this on my mobo? Also, what's the difference on temp I could get by lapping the IHS?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adamski07*
> 
> Hey folks! My 3570k was delided few days ago. I got the CLU and PK-1 in hand right now. Tips and other stuffs I need to know before installing this on my mobo? Also, what's the difference on temp I could get by lapping the IHS?


gratz








dont use to much clu








on page 1 you find some other tips when placing it back etc
on average 1-3C tempdrop, some report no drop at all,
some very concave ones reported 10C..about..


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Welp, I definitely didn't win the silicone lottery with this entry. It's stable enough for 14.5 hours of Prime (got bored waiting on it! Lol!) 20 passes of Linx at max, and 10 runs of IBT. Damned shame too, I was hoping for the magical 5 Ghz chip. 4.6 Ghz will have to do. I still need to tweak my mem a bit to eek a little more out of her but...

*Validation:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2628983

OCN name: *Teh Rav3n*

CPU: *i5 3570K*

on die-TIM: *Coolabratory Liquid Pro*

ihs-TIM: *What IHS bossman? We doan need no STEENKIN IHS!*

Mhz gained: *1200 Mhz over the OEM HS*

OC after delid: *4.6 Ghz*

Temp drops: *No comparable data on AD II. Went from OEM HS @ 4.1 Ghz and stock
voltage to AD II @ 4.6 Ghz and 1.49v -brand new build. 37­° drop*

CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2628983



I'm going to drop her back to a 45, maybe a 44 multi to get the voltage a little bit lower into the 1.45v range. Hopefully Jonas will respond to my pm about that unlocked modded v.1.30 bios with all of the settings plugged back in & we can find out if it's the board, or just an average oc'ing chip. Time to play w/ the mem oc and see what I can get out of these Sammie lo-pro sticks.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Welp, I definitely didn't win the silicone lottery with this entry. It's stable enough for 14.5 hours of Prime (got bored waiting on it! Lol!) 20 passes of Linx at max, and 10 runs of IBT. Damned shame too, I was hoping for the magical 5 Ghz chip. 4.6 Ghz will have to do. I still need to tweak my mem a bit to eek a little more out of her but...
> *Validation:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2628983
> OCN name: *Teh Rav3n*
> CPU: *i5 3570K*
> on die-TIM: *Coolabratory Liquid Pro*
> ihs-TIM: *What IHS bossman? We doan need no STEENKIN IHS!*
> Mhz gained: *1200 Mhz over the OEM HS*
> OC after delid: *4.6 Ghz*
> Temp drops: *No comparable data on AD II. Went from OEM HS @ 4.1 Ghz and stock
> voltage to AD II @ 4.6 Ghz and 1.49v -brand new build. 37­° drop*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2628983
> 
> I'm going to drop her back to a 45, maybe a 44 multi to get the voltage a little bit lower into the 1.45v range. Hopefully Jonas will respond to my pm about that unlocked modded v.1.30 bios with all of the settings plugged back in & we can find out if it'
> 
> s the board, or just an average oc'ing chip. Time to play w/ the mem oc and see what I can get out of these Sammie lo-pro sticks.


Congrats on the great temp drop with the delid.

I think you are over shooting your voltage. Your voltage for your clocks is higher than any other IB CPU I have seen for your speeds. Try to get your voltage down to at least 1.2v for 4.5GHZ and you will see a huge drop in temps and stability.


----------



## VonDutch

its not even average, mine is ..lol, but yours is really below,
youre sure thats the minimum vcore you need to make 4.6ghz run ?
what do you need for 4.5ghz, vcore wise?


----------



## Hokies83

Avg is around 1.5v for 5ghz. 1.25v for 4.5ghz etc


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd say he can likely pull it of with less, but the board may be limiting the oc. I'd do 44 or 45x max on it, maybe it will need much less vcore for that.


----------



## TKFlight

I just delidded my 3570K but I am waiting on my Liquid Ultra to arrive, I had a pretty good OC at 4.5ghz with the cooler master thermal paste they give you with a Hyper 212 Evo. The temps were in the mid 70c range, hopefully with the delid and the Liquid Ultra I can get a better overclock. I know I'm using a 3770K but I have a 3570K I got from MC.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TKFlight*
> 
> I just delidded my 3570K but I am waiting on my Liquid Ultra to arrive, I had a pretty good OC at 4.5ghz with the cooler master thermal paste they give you with a Hyper 212 Evo. The temps were in the mid 70c range, hopefully with the delid and the Liquid Ultra I can get a better overclock. I know I'm using a 3770K but I have a 3570K I got from MC.


your avatar is gonna look like this, after applying ultra..lol


----------



## adamski07

Btw, this is my result before deliding. Unfortunately, it might take a while before I get my system up. Project Prodigious is still going through modifications so I won't be able to test it out yet.

12 Hrs of P95 Blend. Clocked at 4.9Ghz with 1.37 v maxing 82C on RealTemp.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adamski07*
> 
> Btw, this is my result before deliding. Unfortunately, it might take a while before I get my system up. Project Prodigious is still going through modifications so I won't be able to test it out yet.
> 12 Hrs of P95 Blend. Clocked at 4.9Ghz with 1.37 v maxing 82C on RealTemp.


That's pretty good. low vcore and 4.9ghz.







congrats on the silicon lottery.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Congrats on the great temp drop with the delid.
> I think you are over shooting your voltage. Your voltage for your clocks is higher than any other IB CPU I have seen for your speeds. Try to get your voltage down to at least 1.2v for 4.5GHZ and you will see a huge drop in temps and stability.


I'm still working with her, but she really doesn't want to boot w/ anything less than 1.49 Vcore @ 4.6 so far. I'll drop the multi and see if she'll boot @ 1.2v. But it's starting to look like I might have a bum chip according to what you guys are reporting.

I've been playing w/ mem & running gpu burn in's all day. The Sammie's are stable @ 2000 Mhz, but I haven't touched the timings yet. The great news is my R7950 TF3 is nearly verified as completely stable (no down clocking at all) @ 1300/1500 core/mem. I'm just about to run a 1 hour test on Heaven to verify stability one last time. I guess no one can win the silicone lottery twice.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its not even average, mine is ..lol, but yours is really below,
> youre sure thats the minimum vcore you need to make 4.6ghz run ?
> what do you need for 4.5ghz, vcore wise?


Yep, I'm certain. It froze on boot with anything less @ 4.6. I don't recall at 4.5, I'll get back to you after I make this Heaven run and try it again.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Avg is around 1.5v for 5ghz. 1.25v for 4.5ghz etc


Wow. My cpu sucks then.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd say he can likely pull it of with less, but the board may be limiting the oc. I'd do 44 or 45x max on it, maybe it will need much less vcore for that.


At this point, I'm not sure it will. I'm starting to think this 3570 is a bottom of the barrel binned chip.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can always keep it as a backup chip and save for another one, even better....get a 3770k


----------



## Valgaur

Welp..... box with my little Franky got delivered today....... now the wait begins. No news if I have one coming or not.....


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Welp..... box with my little Franky got delivered today....... now the wait begins. No news if I have one coming or not.....


Fingers crossed.


----------



## Matt-Matt

I'm in a rush right now, but to whoever suggested the orange it kind of worked? I scrubbed the blade and washed it at the same time and most of the rust started to come off. I re-inserted and now almost the entire blade is in there, should be fine to go ahead tomorrow if I'm not doing anything









Cheers,


----------



## ivanlabrie

R.I.P. Franky...think of it as a viking funeral thing.
Mine died aswell, and will face a similar funeral xD


----------



## Swag

I'm in Canada right now and OMG they have some good deals here. Today only I believe.









Anyway, guys, I'll let you guys choose:

Which one should I get?

Corsair C70 (Any color, you guys choose) + Silver Arrow Cooler

or

Corsair C70 + K60 Keyboard

Both end up same price.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd go with the SA combo...what was your current cooler?
The k60 might be nice if you already got a good but silent cooler...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go with the SA combo...what was your current cooler?
> The k60 might be nice if you already got a good but silent cooler...


I have the H100, but I did a paint job on it and it PISSES me off! Like I want to shred it but whatever.

I have a Ducky Shine II keyboard with Blues but I wanted to try out the K60 since it's so cheap. Although the SA combo is really good too and I heard it's quiet and will perform better than the H100. I have the Corsair 600T as my case but my mod on it failed and it looks like crap so I was thinking of just selling it for a cheap price! What do you guys think? Suck it up and go with the keyboard or just go ahead with the SA combo.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Stop wasting money and fix your mistakes


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Stop wasting money and fix your mistakes


I tried to but I even made it worse. I'm just gonna sell the case for 50% off.









Anyway guys, I wanted to change one of the combos:

C70 + SA is now C70 + NH-D14!


----------



## dmanstasiu

If you don't like the H100 then get the case + HS combo.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> If you don't like the H100 then get the case + HS combo.


So far, that ones winning so I'll go ahead and ask a question:

What color should I get for the case? I don't want white because my 600T looks awful after only a few months. Either Gunmetal Black or Green?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Case + SA > Case + D14...pwm stock fans, which perform GREAT and are quiet even at full tilt. And the color scheme is better too lol
Which Silver Arrow is it?

EDIT: I think the military green one looks better, and fits the style of the case itself...like an ammo crate


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Case + SA > Case + D14...pwm stock fans, which perform GREAT and are quiet even at full tilt. And the color scheme is better too lol
> Which Silver Arrow is it?
> 
> EDIT: I think the military green one looks better, and fits the style of the case itself...like an ammo crate


Thanks for the input. I may go green now! Anyway, The D14 is the SE2011 version that comes with PWM stock fans because I have the D14 backplate from my brother's! Woohoo!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Then it's a good idea...if it fits your colour scheme that is.
Both perform similarly and will fit the bill nicely, but Thermalright is now offering some really cool looking Silver Arrow variants, in black and white and what not.
Phanteks has a wicked good hsf too, and with tons of colors available, isn't that available?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Then it's a good idea...if it fits your colour scheme that is.
> Both perform similarly and will fit the bill nicely, but Thermalright is now offering some really cool looking Silver Arrow variants, in black and white and what not.
> Phanteks has a wicked good hsf too, and with tons of colors available, isn't that available?


Well, I have the Asus Maximus V Gene which is black/red and I have almost everything else white or red. Should I still go with the green? It may not look good.

No, sadly, only the SA or the D14 is available.


----------



## [CyGnus]

I have a few doubts hope you guys can help me









I am using my CPU at 1.17v @ 4500MHz (60ºc) for 4600 i need about 1.24v (71ºC) if i delid the cpu will it do the same oc with less volts or it uses the same voltage?
Are my current temps bad for the oc it has? Will i see a drop lets say 10-15ºc? (I only have MX-4 at the momment)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Regular SA...and MVG, I have that xD It looks good, but you can always replace the fans with black ones, or red led fans. I go for performance over looks normally, so I got some vicious 220cfm 120x38 fans
You can also paint the MVG's heatsinks, remove them and spray paint them to whatever color suits you...the Ty-140 fans are hard to dissasemble and paint.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can always keep it as a backup chip and save for another one, even better....get a 3770k


Looks like I'm going to be doing just that.







It's confirmed, this 3750k just suxxorz. Boots fine and passes 10 runs of IBT at a 44 multi and 1.2 Vcore. 45 multi takes a minimum of 1.35 Vcore to be stable. Last but not least, 46 will boot at no less than 1.48 Vcore. Stable at 4.9 with 1.49v.

I'll be leaving it at 4.5 Ghz for the duration. It's a little depressing after all of that work, and by that I mean de-lidding & getting it all assembled inside of this...

WIP cell pic.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I have a few doubts hope you guys can help me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am using my CPU at 1.17v @ 4500MHz (60ºc) for 4600 i need about 1.24v (71ºC) if i delid the cpu will it do the same oc with less volts or it uses the same voltage?
> Are my current temps bad for the oc it has? Will i see a drop lets say 10-15ºc? (I only have MX-4 at the momment)


I think that chip is perfectly fine as is...unless you wanna push for 5ghz 24/7 I wouldn't delid it.
You would see at least 10c if you push the oc a bit higher, cause 71c is nothing for an Ivy chip, with a tjmax of 105c.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Looks like I'm going to be doing just that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's confirmed, this 3750k just suxxorz. Boots fine and passes 10 runs of IBT at a 44 multi and 1.2 Vcore. 45 multi takes a minimum of 1.35 Vcore to be stable. Last but not least, 46 will boot at no less than 1.48 Vcore. Stable at 4.9 with 1.49v.
> I'll be leaving it at 4.5 Ghz for the duration. It's a little depressing after all of that work, and by that I mean de-lidding & getting it all assembled inside of this...
> WIP cell pic.


Crap, looks like so much work... :/
Nice setup btw


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Regular SA...and MVG, I have that xD It looks good, but you can always replace the fans with black ones, or red led fans. I go for performance over looks normally, so I got some vicious 220cfm 120x38 fans
> You can also paint the MVG's heatsinks, remove them and spray paint them to whatever color suits you...the Ty-140 fans are hard to dissasemble and paint.


I kinda want peace and quiet. I downclocked my CPU to 4.6 rather than 4.8 and now it runs on only 1.22vcore so I'm barely hitting 65C on my H100. H100 is so loud though and it gets annoying with the paint job I gave it. No more spray painting for me! I'll have it all done by a professional now! Anyway, I'll see what they have and get what looks best!


----------



## [CyGnus]

If it is not broke dont fix it right


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's my motto now...learned it the hard way xD
(hint: running a g620 in an MVG)


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Crap, looks like so much work... :/
> Nice setup btw


Thanks







Yeah, it was a bear to get the loop assembled in that tight space. Oh, I had a typo in that post you quoted. 1.49 Vcore for 4.6 Ghz stable. I wish it was a 49 multi, I'd be alright w/ that. :/


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, it was a bear to get the loop assembled in that tight space. Oh, I had a typo in that post you quoted. 1.49 Vcore for 4.6 Ghz stable. I wish it was a 49 multi, I'd be alright w/ that. :/


Eek. that blows


----------



## Swag

I went with the C70 and NH-D14 SE2011 combo. They ran out of the Silver Arrow.







I'll be taking pics as I rebuild my PC.







Also, will the D14 fit in this case?


----------



## ivanlabrie

That case is quite big, it will accomodate it just fine, same as the MVG it won't complain.


----------



## Kiros

I have just delidded my 3770K. It wasn't as hard as I thought. Well except for using my fingernail to remove the solder but that was it.


So I can't join the club just yet since I only have a CPU at the moment...motherboard, power supply and graphics card will be coming later lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'm in a rush right now, but to whoever suggested the orange it kind of worked? I scrubbed the blade and washed it at the same time and most of the rust started to come off. I re-inserted and now almost the entire blade is in there, should be fine to go ahead tomorrow if I'm not doing anything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,


Your welcome! love my acids!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> R.I.P. Franky...think of it as a viking funeral thing.
> Mine died aswell, and will face a similar funeral xD


Yeah..... oooopsies.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kiros*
> 
> I have just delidded my 3770K. It wasn't as hard as I thought. Well except for using my fingernail to remove the solder but that was it.
> 
> So I can't join the club just yet since I only have a CPU at the moment...motherboard, power supply and graphics card will be coming later lol


Nice! Hope it wen as smoothly as your pic looks, estimation on the time until the other parts arrive?


----------



## Kiros

So far I have the Samsung "Magic" Ram, Noctua thermal paste, and the power supply(which is at my parent's house.)
I just ordered the NH-D14 an hour ago for 69.99
The only thing I'm missing now is the mobo and a graphics card.

I'm lurking through the motherboard section and maybe I'll look into gigabyte UD3H
and for the graphics card I must have a 670 or 680 gtx! This PC must beat my current rig!

So I'll maybe have it running by the end of Febuary caseless


----------



## Swag

Case and RAM, the NH-D14 will arrive at my house back home in a week.







Yay! All in all, $140!


----------



## She loved E

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I know im late to this but here ya go. This can be the case of pressure sometimes do to the architecture and the micro transistors being to far apart sometimes due to the pressure mounting on it. Try this


Thx for the tips Valgaur... but its official. My CPU is dead







. It took my mobo with it but I was able to RMA and confirm today that the SB chip works, delidded IB don't







. Not knockin' the procedure of course but despite my best efforts I did it wrong. Just so others know here's where I eeffed up - I don't know which one killed it but it has to be one or a combination of a few of them:

Nicked PCB (very, very minor)
Used too aggressive a scraper for the renaming glue (spare piece of acrylic)... since I did it I've seen posts showing a dremel & polishing wheel works so I'd recommend that instead of any scraping method, as I saw copper peeking thru in areas I know I didn't hit with the razor.
Didn't adequately ground myself - I didn't use a bracelet so while I don't think this is how I killed it I can't rule it out 100%.
Bummed of course but glad I started with my weakest chip. Not sure if I'll try again as flushing $250 really stings







.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Thx for the tips Valgaur... but its official. My CPU is dead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . It took my mobo with it but I was able to RMA and confirm today that the SB chip works, delidded IB don't
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Not knockin' the procedure of course but despite my best efforts I did it wrong. Just so others know here's where I eeffed up - I don't know which one killed it but it has to be one or a combination of a few of them:
> 
> Nicked PCB (very, very minor)
> Used too aggressive a scraper for the renaming glue (spare piece of acrylic)... since I did it I've seen posts showing a dremel & polishing wheel works so I'd recommend that instead of any scraping method, as I saw copper peeking thru in areas I know I didn't hit with the razor.
> Didn't adequately ground myself - I didn't use a bracelet so while I don't think this is how I killed it I can't rule it out 100%.
> Bummed of course but glad I started with my weakest chip. Not sure if I'll try again as flushing $250 really stings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Yeah it sucks but it happens unfortunately. At least the SB till works right?


----------



## Swag

If I had failed to properly delid my CPU the first time, I wouldn't have had the guts to do it again. Especially how there was no guide back then, I definitely would not have done it again. The first time, it was so nerve-wracking not knowing where the die was or how to do it properly, the lack of this club too didn't help.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, true...
Swag, what ram is that?

Guess I'm getting old...I'm running stock and xmp for the first time, I even undervolted and underclocked my gtx 670 ftw to fold lol


----------



## Swag

G.Skill Ripjaws X 1866MHz 10-11-10-30


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ah, smells like Hynix CFR spirit...xD

Push those to 2800mhz cl12 now please. Thank you.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ah, smells like Hynix CFR spirit...xD
> 
> Push those to 2800mhz cl12 now please. Thank you.


Don't think that's possible. I tried OCing them already to 2100~ and it would crash in windows.







Disappointed to say the least! I love the price though so I can't complain. Only $35 for 16GB! And the case was so cheap too.







Amazing all in all!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I have a few doubts hope you guys can help me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am using my CPU at 1.17v @ 4500MHz (60ºc) for 4600 i need about 1.24v (71ºC) if i delid the cpu will it do the same oc with less volts or it uses the same voltage?
> Are my current temps bad for the oc it has? Will i see a drop lets say 10-15ºc? (I only have MX-4 at the momment)


prolly the same, havent heard of many delidded chips using less vcore,
mx-4 wont do bad, prolly would give you a 10C, maybe a bit more, tempdrop..
using liquid pro/ultra (on die) gives the biggest tempdrop tho,
youre temps, and vcore, look good to me, looks like you have a nice chip for delidding,
could do 4.8-4.9ghz with still a good vcore, 1.17V vcore for 4.5ghz is very nice


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I have a few doubts hope you guys can help me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am using my CPU at 1.17v @ 4500MHz (60ºc) for 4600 i need about 1.24v (71ºC) if i delid the cpu will it do the same oc with less volts or it uses the same voltage?
> Are my current temps bad for the oc it has? Will i see a drop lets say 10-15ºc? (I only have MX-4 at the momment)
> 
> 
> 
> prolly the same, havent heard of many delidded chips using less vcore,
> mx-4 wont do bad, prolly would give you a 10C, maybe a bit more, tempdrop..
> using liquid pro/ultra (on die) gives the biggest tempdrop tho,
> youre temps, and vcore, look good to me, looks like you have a nice chip for delidding,
> could do 4.8-4.9ghz with still a good vcore, 1.17V vcore for 4.5ghz is very nice
Click to expand...

I agree, it will probably not use less volts unless you were hitting the high temps prior. Mainly because if it were the latter, it would mean that lower temps + lower volts would probably have been better than higher temps + higher volts. So yea.

Also a question to all you peoples, where can I get sleeved cables for my Corsair PSU? I looked on the website and they sell them for $60 but so many other people have great sleeved cables and they've said it only cost them around $40 or so.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Doing it tonight while the parents are asleep.. Blade is a lot cleaner but not perfect. Testing it with a celeron and this blade thing i found in my computer toolkit, I feel like I have more control over it.

So I just paste the CPU core and then put the IHS on, I'm going to use pro on the die and ultra on the IHS as I have more also.











Hoping that leaving little bits of rubber on the bottom side of the IHS is okay.. I can't seem to get it all off properly.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Doing it tonight while the parents are asleep.. Blade is a lot cleaner but not perfect. Testing it with a celeron and this blade thing i found in my computer toolkit, I feel like I have more control over it.
> 
> So I just paste the CPU core and then put the IHS on, I'm going to use pro on the die and ultra on the IHS as I have more also.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hoping that leaving little bits of rubber on the bottom side of the IHS is okay.. I can't seem to get it all off properly.


Good luck! I wish you the bestest luck and Santa does too.







It sucks having a $250 paperweight so make that your motivation!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Doing it tonight while the parents are asleep.. Blade is a lot cleaner but not perfect. Testing it with a celeron and this blade thing i found in my computer toolkit, I feel like I have more control over it.
> So I just paste the CPU core and then put the IHS on, I'm going to use pro on the die and ultra on the IHS as I have more also.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hoping that leaving little bits of rubber on the bottom side of the IHS is okay.. I can't seem to get it all off properly.


toothpick might do the trick? its to soft to make scratches on the ihs..not that it matters alot but still ..lol
if you have Denatured alcohol or methylated spirits, let is soak in that for a while, should make it easier to get the left over adhesive of
i used the backside of my box cutter to scrape the adhesive of on the ihs..


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Eek. that blows


No doubt, but at least I have an epic 7950 on my hands to soften the blow. A few thought it may have been down clocking, but the question is completely eliminated. I just ran a few Heaven benches and it scaled @ 1300 core, and all the way up to 1750 mem. It scored right up there with the two fastest single gpu 7970's (-.5 & -1.3 fps respectively) in the Heaven 3.0 Top 30 thread. And just below (-.1 fps) a pair of GTX470's. Faster than every single gpu GTX 670 & 680 in Heaven *in that list*. I ain't mad about that.









http://www.overclock.net/t/1235557/official-top-30-heaven-benchmark-3-0-scores



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Thx for the tips Valgaur... but its official. My CPU is dead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . It took my mobo with it but I was able to RMA and confirm today that the SB chip works, delidded IB don't
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Not knockin' the procedure of course but despite my best efforts I did it wrong. Just so others know here's where I eeffed up - I don't know which one killed it but it has to be one or a combination of a few of them:
> 
> Nicked PCB (very, very minor)
> Used too aggressive a scraper for the renaming glue (spare piece of acrylic)... since I did it I've seen posts showing a dremel & polishing wheel works so I'd recommend that instead of any scraping method, as I saw copper peeking thru in areas I know I didn't hit with the razor.
> Didn't adequately ground myself - I didn't use a bracelet so while I don't think this is how I killed it I can't rule it out 100%.
> Bummed of course but glad I started with my weakest chip. Not sure if I'll try again as flushing $250 really stings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Man, I feel for you, seriously.







Yours may be dead, but mine just plain sucks. You have my deepest condolences *pours beer on the ground to honor the fallen*


----------



## Swag

I was thinking of picking up a 7950. It's only $350 right now, but unsure. I've already dropped so much cash into replacing my case and cooler because of this horrible mod I did. Anyway, is it worth the price or should I just wait? After my 560Ti's went away, I've been stuck with this old 5770! It clocks like a beast though.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> No doubt, but at least I have an epic 7950 on my hands to soften the blow. A few thought it may have been down clocking, but the question is completely eliminated. I just ran a few Heaven benches and it scaled @ 1300 core, and all the way up to 1750 mem. It scored right up there with the two fastest single gpu 7970's (-.5 & -1.3 fps respectively) in the Heaven 3.0 Top 30 thread. And just below (-.1 fps) a pair of GTX470's. Faster than every single gpu GTX 670 & 680 in Heaven *in that list*. I ain't mad about that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1235557/official-top-30-heaven-benchmark-3-0-scores


just did a run also, with the settings they use on the page 1,


edit
hmm, looks like i have to set tessellation like you did Teh Rav3n, nvm me ..lol
will do another run after im back from the grocery ..lol


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Swag, I can't guarantee that any one will be on this level. Because frankly, I just spanked the fastest 7950 in the top 30 list pretty badly. But even so, I was ecstatic with the performance over my 6950 w/ unlocked shaders even at stock clocks. Just with respect to contrast levels, clarity, and color saturation...the 7950 was a big step up.

Not to mention a good fps increase in my current favorite game MWO: Mercs. I even put down S.T.A.L.K.E.R. SoC w/ the StalkerSoup mod for it, and I love that game!







I've always been a Mech fan (just not a rabid one) from way back in Macross & BattleTech.









If it's not going to hurt you to do so, then do it. If there's even a question as to whether it will or not, then just hold out for the 8***'s release, and get one when the 7k's price drops. Btw, I got mine for $305, you might want to shop around for a better price.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just did a run also, with the settings they use on the page 1,
> 
> edit
> hmm, looks like i have to set tessellation like you did Teh Rav3n, nvm me ..lol
> will do another run after im back from the grocery ..lol


That extreme tess setting's a butt dragger for sure!







I'll have to check in later, it's way past time for me to catch some zzzzzz (it's 4:34 a.m. here). Have fun at the grocery!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Swag, I can't guarantee that any one will be on this level. Because frankly, I just spanked the fastest 7950 in the top 30 list pretty badly. But even so, I was ecstatic with the performance over my 6950 w/ unlocked shaders even at stock clocks. Just with respect to contrast levels, clarity, and color saturation...the 7950 was a big step up.
> 
> Not to mention a good fps increase in my current favorite game MWO: Mercs. I even put down S.T.A.L.K.E.R. SoC w/ the StalkerSoup mod for it, and I love that game!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've always been a Mech fan (just not a rabid one) from way back in Macross & BattleTech.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If it's not going to hurt you to do so, then do it. If there's even a question as to whether it will or not, then just hold out for the 8***'s release, and get one when the 7k's price drops. Btw, I got mine for $305, you might want to shop around for a better price.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just did a run also, with the settings they use on the page 1,
> 
> edit
> hmm, looks like i have to set tessellation like you did Teh Rav3n, nvm me ..lol
> will do another run after im back from the grocery ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> That extreme tess setting's a butt dragger for sure!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll have to check in later, it's way past time for me to catch some zzzzzz (it's 4:34 a.m. here). Have fun at the grocery!
Click to expand...

Could you perhaps tell me your GPU clocks and brand and model? Also, can the voltages on these be changed or no?


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Could you perhaps tell me your GPU clocks and brand and model? Also, can the voltages on these be changed or no?


Ofc!







I'm running one of the MSi R7950 TF 3's. On that run, my clocks were 1300 core/1750 mem. Technically, a better Vram oc than the 7970 that just barely bested my score. Same max core speed though. If AMD hadn't laser cut this die to turn it into a 7950...

Core/mem voltage is unlocked to a certain point (1300 Mv). Shader clocks & voltage isn't though. Bear in mind my card is under water too.









@ VonDutch: I went ahead and ran at the same settings as your run. I didn't raise the mem clocks again, and left them at 1500 Mhz instead. My results:



I have a Rav3n Lun/\tiC 7950, no doubt.







Now if I can only find a cpu to match.


----------



## Swag

What's that website that finds components at its cheapest? Anyone know if XFX cards are good? They look the best so I want one of those.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> @ VonDutch: I went ahead and ran at the same settings as your run. I didn't raise the mem clocks again, and left them at 1500 Mhz instead. My results:
> 
> I have a Rav3n Lun/\tiC 7950, no doubt.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now if I can only find a cpu to match.


nice, looks like yours is faster, i was running 1100/1500 on mine,
made a mistake when i bought it, i cant adjust voltages, my aim was 1200/1600,
so have to settle with the oc i have now, could maybe get it a bit higher, but at 1150mhz, i got bsod..
i can play any game maxed out , so im happy..coming from a 6850, this is a "wow" card for sure ...lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Good luck! I wish you the bestest luck and Santa does too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It sucks having a $250 paperweight so make that your motivation!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> toothpick might do the trick? its to soft to make scratches on the ihs..not that it matters alot but still ..lol
> if you have Denatured alcohol or methylated spirits, let is soak in that for a while, should make it easier to get the left over adhesive of
> i used the backside of my box cutter to scrape the adhesive of on the ihs..


Cheers guys! I'm posting off it now!








I didn't even remove the MX-2 because I remembered it's non conductive and there'd be more of a chance of me bending pins. Add me to the list! I'll put photos up soon!
So far ~10c idle drop

*Update*: Using a Pentium 4 IHS is a bad idea, it musn't have alligned up properly.. Looks like I'll have to tear the SB-E off it and re-do it tomorrow.. For now 50c idle will do for watching videos.

Running at stock clocks and voltage allows me to maintain a 30c idle temp and a 98c load temp for now. Thank goodness for stock!


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> prolly the same, havent heard of many delidded chips using less vcore,
> mx-4 wont do bad, prolly would give you a 10C, maybe a bit more, tempdrop..
> using liquid pro/ultra (on die) gives the biggest tempdrop tho,
> youre temps, and vcore, look good to me, looks like you have a nice chip for delidding,
> could do 4.8-4.9ghz with still a good vcore, 1.17V vcore for 4.5ghz is very nice


It already does 4.8GHz with 1.33v prime stable but it reaches 85ºC, i guess i dont have a defective IHS and just for the temp drop i dont see this worth it for me i use it at 4.5 with 1.17v (54ºc Folding) since is my sweet spot







now i am deciding in what VGA to get my 7770 oces good 1.25v 1200/1400 for 24/7 not bad at all but i bought it on a budget


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Just a heads up. Liquid Ultra its not that easy to remove like they show on the videos. I try alcohol and paper towels and no luck. So I jump into the big guns. Didn't have to scrape it tho.. A little bit of mother's polishing cream did the trick.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> It already does 4.8GHz with 1.33v prime stable but ir reeaches 85ºC, i guess i dont have a defective IHS and just for the temp drop i dont see this worth it for me i use it at 4.5 with 1.17v since is my sweet spot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now i am deciding in what VGA to get my 7770 oces good 1.25v 1200/1400 for 24/7 not bad at all but i bought it on a budget


yeah, i only delidded because running prime at 4.5ghz, i hit 105C in seconds ..lol
now im running 4646mhz 24/7, 1.305V vcore, using offset..nvm the temps of course haha..
4.8ghz is my highest oc for this chip, need 1.420V vcore for it,
4.9ghz needs 1.510V vcore, so no go for that..

wish i could run 1.25V on my 7970, then i could oc it more, its runs 1.170V max,
voltage is locked on my card ..grmbl..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Just a heads up. Liquid Ultra its not that easy to remove like they show on the videos. I try alcohol and paper towels and no luck. So I jump into the big guns. Didn't have to scrape it tho.. A little bit of mother's polishing cream did the trick.


the vid is smart, they put it on,
after that they made the vid cleaning it ...lol
its no problem if theres some left tho, it even "upgrades" other tims,
if you use the same tim, its np at all


----------



## Swag

They made a vid on how to properly remove the adhesive on the CPU? HOW??? LINK?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Photos of my de-lidding experience!


Took me a while to get the blade in, almost nicked the PCB trying to get it in first time but it eventually gave way!









Wayyyyyyy too much paste, way too much. Too much glue also!

All shiny! At this point I thought there was a nick in the PCB too but apparently not or it didn't matter. Also note on my phone the picture that someone uploaded a while back







was really useful.









The best Pentium 4 in Tasmania!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> They made a vid on how to properly remove the adhesive on the CPU? HOW??? LINK?


we where talking about removing ultra,
and the, easy looking, vid coollaboratory made removing it..
maybe a idea tho, to make a vid for others with easy ways to remove adhesive


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> They made a vid on how to properly remove the adhesive on the CPU? HOW??? LINK?
> 
> 
> 
> we where talking about removing ultra,
> and the, easy looking, vid coollaboratory made removing it..
> maybe a idea tho, to make a vid for others with easy ways to remove adhesive
Click to expand...

Yea, I'm scared to use my dremel right now. I have it here but I'm just too scared on trying it that way...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I'm scared to use my dremel right now. I have it here but I'm just too scared on trying it that way...


i would try if i had one,
few days ago someone here used it to remove the adhesive, worked very well he said,
got the idea from idontcare over at anandtech forum, he used one too..


o, i just found this free program to look for outdated drivers on your comp,
its really free, unlike other "free" driver programs, who search, but to use it , you have to pay,

this one finds, downloads, unzip's if needed, and installs them for you ...all free...very nice helpfull program,

http://download.cnet.com/SlimDrivers-Free/3000-18513_4-75279940.html
already updated all of my drivers using this program as you can see...lol


----------



## chronicfx

Never seen the de-lidded club get so low on the recent postings.. Wake up guys.. Just a question, anyone here running an xspc rasa kit with their chip? I was thinking of picking one up but I was wondering what size was required. I want to do 4.9 or 5ghz at 1.4-1.5v. A psu calculator put this at about 165watts. Is an RS240 good enough or should I go to an RX240 or RS360? and if so which of the latter two is better than the other using the stock fans that come with the kit.

Thanks!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Never seen the de-lidded club get so low on the recent postings.. Wake up guys.. Just a question, anyone here running an xspc rasa kit with their chip? I was thinking of picking one up but I was wondering what size was required. I want to do 4.9 or 5ghz at 1.4-1.5v. A psu calculator put this at about 165watts. Is an RS240 good enough or should I go to an RX240 or RS360? and if so which of the latter two is better than the other using the stock fans that come with the kit.
> Thanks!


I believe the 240 is enough, if is only for the cpu. I would get rx240.


----------



## [CyGnus]

1.5v is way to much voltage for 24/7 use....in my opinion...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> 1.5v is way to much voltage for 24/7 use....in my opinion...


I game for 2 to 3 hours a night and the rest of the day is web surfing at best. By the time it degrades I would imagine I will have something else newer.


----------



## [CyGnus]

well that is true







and we are OCN


----------



## Gomi

At this moment, my only problem is the "low" Vcore limit, lol.

I tried to see what my max temps would be at 1.55V (PLL 1.80) with a 5.2Ghz overclock - Just for funsies, after an hour of Prime Blend (I know, "ZOOOMG-LULZ0RZ that is not enough! MOAR!") I reached a max temp of 75C ... Meaning I still got a handful of them C to play around with.

Oh well - Might see where this chip is stable at 5.2Ghz - Been running 5.0Ghz (PLL 1.80) at 1.39Vcore for weeks now, no crashes.


----------



## Bigm

Scratched up my chip pretty bad but it still powers on and nothing catches on fire







. Of course with my luck I bent the pins on my mobo so I need to order a new one because I can't be bothered to fix it. Worse comes to worse I'll use this as an excuse to upgrade from a 3570k to a 3770k


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What's that website that finds components at its cheapest? Anyone know if XFX cards are good? They look the best so I want one of those.


Amazon, NewEgg, & NCIX.us is usually the best for low hardware prices (Amazon more often than not beats everyone else). Aside from specialty aircooled & wc gear, then check between Sidewinders, Performance PC's, SVC.com, KoolerTek for the best pricing.







XFX are pretty much bottom of the barrel AMD cards, quality wise. They're nowhere near what they used to be when they made nVidia gpu's, imo. Typically, Gigabyte/MSi/Asus have the best binned components on their AMD/ATi GPU's in my experience

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice, looks like yours is faster, i was running 1100/1500 on mine,
> made a mistake when i bought it, i cant adjust voltages, my aim was 1200/1600,
> so have to settle with the oc i have now, could maybe get it a bit higher, but at 1150mhz, i got bsod..
> i can play any game maxed out , so im happy..coming from a 6850, this is a "wow" card for sure ...lol


Thanks







I'm pretty freaked that the card is this good, honestly. I was only hoping to get one that performed at near 7970 levels, but it appears that this one would surpass all else if it hadn't been tossed in the 7950 bin. It's a shame really. I'm certain that with all of it's shader's intact, it would rip through the best 7970 scores in that thread. Supposedly, it's a 5% performance difference between the laser cut Tahiti 7950 die, and the fully intact 7970 die. So one can imagine the numbers mine might put up if all was equivalent...

How good are you with soldering? If you can solder SMD components by hand, a hard volt mod would definitely take care of those problems and likely get you to what you're looking for. Assuming the die & Vram is capable of such clocks ofc.









I know exactly what you mean, it's a night/day performance difference between my unlocked 6950 and this 7950, in every respect. Hell, I may just skip the 8*** series entirely, and I haven't skipped a generation since my HD 4870 x2

.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i would try if i had one,
> few days ago someone here used it to remove the adhesive, worked very well he said,
> got the idea from idontcare over at anandtech forum, he used one too..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That was me







Worked perfectly too.









@ Matt Matt: Congrats mate, well done!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigm*
> 
> Scratched up my chip pretty bad but it still powers on and nothing catches on fire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Of course with my luck I bent the pins on my mobo so I need to order a new one because I can't be bothered to fix it. Worse comes to worse I'll use this as an excuse to upgrade from a 3570k to a 3770k


Send it to me, i can fix it.


----------



## Legonut

I want to delid my 3770k, but the oinly good TIM i have is AS5. Should I just use that and order Liquid pro for later?


----------



## [CyGnus]

AS5 will work just fine


----------



## zGunBLADEz

My application was for like 2 weeks. The block was easy to remove from the ihs without issues. The problem came by when trying to remove the liquidultra out of the ihs. Had a fit with only alcohol and paper towels everytime i tried to clean it it make it worst. Mother's took it out no problems no need to sand nothing..

BtW One xspc rx240 is good for up to 2 blocks with decent temps..I love how people like to exagerate in here.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That depends on noise levels...people like to have tons of raddage though I agree lol
I decided to run my Silver Arrow passive till I can save for a water cooling kit (custom), so I can use my dual 220cfm fans on a nasty- bigass-fpi-monsta rad xD


----------



## Swag

Does anyone here know if you can apply the LP to an NH-D14? If not, I want to order some thermal pads!


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can but it will leave a mark there...same as with my Silver Arrow. I used Ultra and it stained the base.
I'd try with a good paste like mx-4 or whatever.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can but it will leave a mark there...same as with my Silver Arrow. I used Ultra and it stained the base.
> I'd try with a good paste like mx-4 or whatever.


you can remove it using a metal polish.it completely removes liquid metal from the surface


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone here know if you can apply the LP to an NH-D14? If not, I want to order some thermal pads!


I did...


----------



## Legonut

I'm in the middle of the delidding process, so far so good. I have a question:
How much of the adhesive do i have to remove? I've got if pretty smooth with my fingers and a credit card, but i dont want to risk scratching the pcb. If the IHS is compeltely clean, can i just leave a thin layer or adhesive?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Legonut*
> 
> I'm in the middle of the delidding process, so far so good. I have a question:
> How much of the adhesive do i have to remove? I've got if pretty smooth with my fingers and a credit card, but i dont want to risk scratching the pcb. If the IHS is compeltely clean, can i just leave a thin layer or adhesive?


Yes, if you used your fingers, thats good enough.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Metal polish? as in some sort of paste/cream thing?
I almost erased my batch number trying to clean it, so I won't try again.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Metal polish? as in some sort of paste/cream thing?
> I almost erased my batch number trying to clean it, so I won't try again.


Lol you delided the chip and you are worrying about erasing your batch number? Grab it from the [email protected] thingy from the case.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> prolly the same, havent heard of many delidded chips using less vcore,
> mx-4 wont do bad, prolly would give you a 10C, maybe a bit more, tempdrop..
> using liquid pro/ultra (on die) gives the biggest tempdrop tho,
> youre temps, and vcore, look good to me, looks like you have a nice chip for delidding,
> could do 4.8-4.9ghz with still a good vcore, 1.17V vcore for 4.5ghz is very nice


No one has had any drops in vcore as of yet. this is mainly due to the temperature drops needed to make vcore a necessary factor to drop. it takes one heck of a temp drop to really have any vcore changes. its really weird and dependent on every chip etc etc.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Never seen the de-lidded club get so low on the recent postings.. Wake up guys.. Just a question, anyone here running an xspc rasa kit with their chip? I was thinking of picking one up but I was wondering what size was required. I want to do 4.9 or 5ghz at 1.4-1.5v. A psu calculator put this at about 165watts. Is an RS240 good enough or should I go to an RX240 or RS360? and if so which of the latter two is better than the other using the stock fans that come with the kit.
> Thanks!


I'd rather have the 360 for the reason of extra cooling rather than not having enough. Thats my








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Legonut*
> 
> I want to delid my 3770k, but the oinly good TIM i have is AS5. Should I just use that and order Liquid pro for later?


Yup.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> My application was for like 2 weeks. The block was easy to remove from the ihs without issues. The problem came by when trying to remove the liquidultra out of the ihs. Had a fit with only alcohol and paper towels everytime i tried to clean it it make it worst. Mother's took it out no problems no need to sand nothing..
> BtW One xspc rx240 is good for up to 2 blocks with decent temps..I love how people like to exagerate in here.


Depends on the person ambients and everything. but yeah we do that here lol.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Metal polish? as in some sort of paste/cream thing?
> I almost erased my batch number trying to clean it, so I won't try again.


lol I lapped my IHs so yeah no numbers for intel.......


----------



## ivanlabrie

No box...no receipt.







Bought it from the US, traded my 2600k for it. Catch my drift?


----------



## Legonut

Success!
OCN name: Legonut
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: AS5
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: testing
OC after delid: testing
Temp drops: 8C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2630493

My temps aren't too good because my waterblock is really scratched (long story short: I'm a noob) and i plan on ordering some liquid pro.
Other than that, I'm so glad i didn't kill my i7!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone here know if you can apply the LP to an NH-D14? If not, I want to order some thermal pads!
> 
> 
> 
> I did...
Click to expand...

Did something happen to it?

Also, the mark it leaves, does it affect the HSF at all?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Did something happen to it?
> Also, the mark it leaves, does it affect the HSF at all?


Dunno, didn't take off yet, and i'm not touching for a long time...... as long my temps keep low, I'm not taking apart, get me?


----------



## ivanlabrie

It improves cooling performance if anything...it doesn't look particularly good but well.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Just re-applied! To my luck the pro/ultra was still not set (wet) and it removed mostly easy. Just had enough ultra left for the top of the IHS and probably put a drop too much on the core. Idles at 33c and load at 42c or so on stock. Very happy so far, it's stable too.









EDIT: From ~85c load to ~60c load at 1.4v. It's about the same sort of ambients but I can't be too sure.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It improves cooling performance if anything...it doesn't look particularly good but well.


Hmm, I wonder how it looks. Does it look ugly or anything? Like awful or you can live with it? But just to make sure, it will work and it won't eat up my new D14 right?

Are sleeved cables worth it? $60 for a set of red sleeved cables by Corsair. Worth it or no?


----------



## ivanlabrie

$60 is kinda too much...Bitfenix sells sleeved kits too, you might wanna check those out aswell.
You won't see the spot in your base normally and you can always lap it.


----------



## MunneY

I'm thinking of joining you guys... I've got so much to do to my new system (buy a gpu) but I'm thinking of doing it simply for the temp drops. I haven't really pushed my 3770k, but I'm gonna stress it more when I actually get the time..

I havent bothered to read through all 6300 post yet, but is this a worthwhile risk?


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can always skimp through the thread...lots of useful info here really. I've been here since post 1# lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I'm thinking of joining you guys... I've got so much to do to my new system (buy a gpu) but I'm thinking of doing it simply for the temp drops. I haven't really pushed my 3770k, but I'm gonna stress it more when I actually get the time..
> I havent bothered to read through all 6300 post yet, but is this a worthwhile risk?


It is, but i'd get a blade and some old pentium 4's/Pentium D's and test your skills on these first. I did four and my first successful attempt on my 3570k is good so far minus a bad thermal paste.
I dropped close to ~25c at load and 5c or so at idle which is nice too. You'll want a good cooler to increase gains in temperature though.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> $60 is kinda too much...Bitfenix sells sleeved kits too, you might wanna check those out aswell.
> You won't see the spot in your base normally and you can always lap it.


Mind linking some of it? All I've seen from them are the extensions and I don't want those.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think you are very much right...

https://www.google.com/search?hl=es&tbm=shop&q=bitfenix+sleeved+cables&oq=bitfenix+sleeved+cables&gs_l=products-cc.3...819.5425.0.5498.29.11.0.16.0.2.362.1622.5j4j1j1.11.0...0.0...1ac.1.v9N7OiYr6nE


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think you are very much right...
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?hl=es&tbm=shop&q=bitfenix+sleeved+cables&oq=bitfenix+sleeved+cables&gs_l=products-cc.3...819.5425.0.5498.29.11.0.16.0.2.362.1622.5j4j1j1.11.0...0.0...1ac.1.v9N7OiYr6nE


Yea, I have those because before I bought this PSU, I had just a normal one so I used those to make it look nice. GRR. I don't know what to do now. Are they worth the price? (The Corsair Ones) What do you think? Here's a link:

http://www.corsair.com/us/power-supply-units/psu-accessories-1/professional-series-ax850-ax750-ax650-individually-sleeved-modular-cables-red.html


----------



## Hokies83

What a pain in the butt not perfect yet but will get it there


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hmmm, I'm not sure...sleeving each one manually is definitely a pain though. Consider that, the price of paracord sleeving and the time spent.
I think I'll get the extensions eventually or switch psus, cause mine is not modular.

Edit: what do you mean Hokies?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> What a pain in the butt not perfect yet but will get it there
> [


What's not perfect?

@ivanlabrie - If you had $60, would you get them or no? I was just wondering if they're worth the money.

Also, how should I do a giveaway? I'm planning to give away a LP to a random delidder.


----------



## Hokies83

Look again lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can always skimp through the thread...lots of useful info here really. I've been here since post 1# lol


Actually I've been here since #1 hehehehehehehehehehe


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Look again lol
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Hokies83


I'm guessing either you haven't finished the cabling because the CPU cable looks like it is disconnected or that you are lacking yourself a GPU.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can always skimp through the thread...lots of useful info here really. I've been here since post 1# lol
> 
> 
> 
> Actually I've been here since #1 hehehehehehehehehehe
Click to expand...

I would've been #1 if you hadn't beat me making this club!







Good job on its success though.


----------



## feniks

to all new members of the club - congrats!















to all who have fallen - condolences ...








to everybody, late Meryy Christmas and Happy New Year















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I'm scared to use my dremel right now. I have it here but I'm just too scared on trying it that way...


don't be








I used a dremel with soft buffing pad/wheel for glue removal on the PCB of 4x 3770K, it works very well. it helps to soak the glue with 70-90% alcohol prior to "buffing" it out though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i would try if i had one,
> few days ago someone here used it to remove the adhesive, worked very well he said,
> got the idea from idontcare over at anandtech forum, he used one too..


I used a dremel with buffing pad to clean off PCB from glue on 4 chips, never any trouble








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can but it will leave a mark there...same as with my Silver Arrow. I used Ultra and it stained the base.
> I'd try with a good paste like mx-4 or whatever.


yes, CL Ultra stains, it did that to the copper base of my Raystorm. most of it came off after I used the scratch pad (scotch brite or something) they include with CLU, but some silver discoloration left, doesn't bother me much personally








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> you can remove it using a metal polish.it completely removes liquid metal from the surface


what kind of metal polish? that's interesting.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Metal polish? as in some sort of paste/cream thing?
> I almost erased my batch number trying to clean it, so I won't try again.


same here, I used the scratch pad included in CLU package to clean it off the first 3770K I used it with (IHS) ... and stopped just after I noticed I almost removed the top writing on IHS ... phew that chip was going to RMA ... so ... don't use that scratch pad if you need warranty LOL!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm guessing either you haven't finished the cabling because the CPU cable looks like it is disconnected or that you are lacking yourself a GPU.
> I would've been #1 if you hadn't beat me making this club!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good job on its success though.


Installed cosmos 2 side window...........


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm guessing either you haven't finished the cabling because the CPU cable looks like it is disconnected or that you are lacking yourself a GPU.
> I would've been #1 if you hadn't beat me making this club!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good job on its success though.
> 
> 
> 
> Installed cosmos 2 side window...........
Click to expand...

Oh...well work on the GPU part too.







Nice window, I want to add a bigger window on my new C70.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh...well work on the GPU part too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice window, I want to add a bigger window on my new C70.


2 4gb 680s are sitting on my desk my other rad and res gets here in the morning so I can get the water loop leak tested and running...

Rather not have my 1100$ Gpus sitting in there when I do that.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh...well work on the GPU part too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice window, I want to add a bigger window on my new C70.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2 4gb 680s are sitting on my desk my other rad and res gets here in the morning so I can get the water loop leak tested and running...
> 
> Rather not have my 1100$ Gpus sitting in there when I do that.
Click to expand...

Haha, of course. I wish I could afford even a 7870 or 660Ti. I'm poor right now.


----------



## ivanlabrie

There's a guy selling a very good clocking 670 ftw for whatever you offer him really...
General123, he's a nice fella, so shoot him with an offer.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> There's a guy selling a very good clocking 670 ftw for whatever you offer him really...
> General123, he's a nice fella, so shoot him with an offer.


What is generally considered a good clocking 670? Wondering how my 670 stacks up.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What is generally considered a good clocking 670? Wondering how my 670 stacks up.


Over 1300mhz core and 7500mhz ram is good...With modded bios something close to 1400mhz core is good.
Mine does 1293mhz easily, and I can bench with higher clocks using CLU on the die. I think I will replace it with Liquid Pro soonish, not sure if CLU will 'pump out' on me.


----------



## Hokies83

Hacked de grad Bios eww

Kepler really sucks ive seen Kepler chips degrade on stock volts with High Overclocks.. my Galaxy HOF Hall of fame did it... did stock 1380mhz/ +550 on the mem when i got it..

When i sold it would barely do 1300mhz...

Prolly gonna say to heck with 3d vision and Nvidia if 700 series has locked voltage and minimal performance gains,, Amd is just so much better now in performance and price.

And why no side window love guys? putting a side window in a cosmos 2 is no easy task dam door has layers and crap...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Over 1300mhz core and 7500mhz ram is good...With modded bios something close to 1400mhz core is good.
> Mine does 1293mhz easily, and I can bench with higher clocks using CLU on the die. I think I will replace it with Liquid Pro soonish, not sure if CLU will 'pump out' on me.


Mine does 1293 as well but this is also my first experience OCing a GPU so I'm a rookie when it comes to tinkering







. I also wanted to use CLP on the die but it would mean taking my whole loop apart which I just really don't feel like doing haha. Besides my GPU only got up to 38C when benching at 1293.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Mine does 1293 as well but this is also my first experience OCing a GPU so I'm a rookie when it comes to tinkering
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I also wanted to use CLP on the die but it would mean taking my whole loop apart which I just really don't feel like doing haha. Besides my GPU only got up to 38C when benching at 1293.


I do not like Evga Gpus over priced ref cards and i do not care if there RMA service gets there 5 days faster XD

Id only buy ref design for water cooling.

Even then it would be from a smaller company like Galaxy,,,

All Ref cards are the same just diffrent stickers on them.. no reason to give Evga the huge chuck of the market they do not deserve.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What is generally considered a good clocking 670? Wondering how my 670 stacks up.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Mine does 1293 as well but this is also my first experience OCing a GPU so I'm a rookie when it comes to tinkering
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I also wanted to use CLP on the die but it would mean taking my whole loop apart which I just really don't feel like doing haha. Besides my GPU only got up to 38C when benching at 1293.


how high can yours go?

I have a 670 that used to do 1302MHz max on vmodded BIOS (1260ish on stock BIOS), but latest NV drivers altered the clocks table, so max it can do is 1293Mhz nowadays (1306 means crash)... however I recently bought a matching 670 for SLI and together they can do 1280MHz for benching in SLI, that is with vmodded BIOS. common memory clock for both cards is 7012MHz. not a super-performer, but it's a decent set of cards, pretty happy with them both under water (I love silence).

... I have to admit that 670 SLI gives quite a kick ... I was already impressed by a single 670 in last few months, now I am awed with 2 of them.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> how high can yours go?
> I have a 670 that used to do 1302MHz max on vmodded BIOS (1260ish on stock BIOS), but latest NV drivers altered the clocks table, so max it can do is 1293Mhz nowadays (1306 means crash)... however I recently bought a matching 670 for SLI and together they can do 1280MHz for benching in SLI, that is with vmodded BIOS. common memory clock for both cards is 7012MHz. not a super-performer, but it's a decent set of cards, pretty happy with them both under water (I love silence).
> ... I have to admit that 670 SLI gives quite a kick ... I was already impressed by a single 670 in last few months, now I am awed with 2 of them.


Is modding the BIOS worth it? I've never tried.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Is modding the BIOS worth it? I've never tried.


1-2fps tops = if dies due to modding no warranty.

It is horrid imo...

However it is Nvidia's fault for giving us a gpu with a weak memory bus and *"Voltage Red lined from the factory"*

Be happy with what you got or sell it and get a 7950 with unlocked voltage and then see it whip up on a Msi Lighting 680...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And why no side window love guys? putting a side window in a cosmos 2 is no easy task dam door has layers and crap...


I like it Hok, very nice. I liked the Cosmos II when I was shopping for my case but couldn't justify the price...or the size for that matter







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You're on 310.70, right Feniks? I'm having similar issues now...but it technically performs marginally better so the 6mhz loss is not too terrible lol

And Hokies, that's some heavy work right there.

Swag, I think the 60usd cable bundle is neat, and saves you tons of hours of individually sleeving each cable. Time is money as Adam Smith put it (was it him? lol)

@Valgaur: Swag was #1 lol but you got a nice club going hehe


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I like it Hok, very nice. I liked the Cosmos II when I was shopping for my case but couldn't justify the price...or the size for that matter
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


You can have this one for 175$ if u come pick it up...

Im saving up from a Case Labs TH10 ... herh300$ down 300$ more to go...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can have this one for 175$ if u come pick it up...
> Im saving up from a Case Labs TH10 ... herh300$ down 300$ more to go...


Yea that case is a monster. But for me, if I change at any point it will be to go smaller. Since I build my emulator box in the Prodigy I'm loving SFF.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Me too...I want to save for the Sugo SG-09. That's my dream case, pseudo prodigy that fits a matx mobo *MVG


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Is modding the BIOS worth it? I've never tried.


you can unlock the card's core voltage up to 1.21V (as reported by precisionX, it's up to 1.24V actual if checked by multimeter), gives around 40-60MHz more, when coupled with high memory offset, it might give you that few more FPS depending on resolution.

if interested use this tool and instructions in that thread, it's the only thing which is quite simple:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1340182/online-600-series-firmware-modifier-version-0-7

other methods are horrible or limited or you would have to use BIOS modded by someone else.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Me too...I want to save for the Sugo SG-09. That's my dream case, pseudo prodigy that fits a matx mobo *MVG


Cool. I may even move my emulator box to this case since I don't need an add-in GPU after all. Then use my Prodigy for a future gaming build.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You're on 310.70, right Feniks? I'm having similar issues now...but it technically performs marginally better so the 6mhz loss is not too terrible lol


yup, 310.70, very solid drivers. I don't mind that clock table change (going in 13MHz increments now) causing a few MHz loss (it's nothing), since the driver performs very well in games I like








had to lower my clock a bit in SLI now, but oh man, I like SLI ... and missed it for a few long months!


----------



## Hokies83

Main system needs biggest badest case it can go in to have options for max performance..

My htpc is in a sugo 02 tho nice little case.. would never put my main system in something that small however...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Main system needs biggest badest case it can go in to have options for max performance..
> My htpc is in a sugo 02 tho nice little case.. would never put my main system in something that small however...


If space was no concern at all I'd subscribe to that line of thinking as well. But living in an apartment in Brooklyn...space matters.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> If space was no concern at all I'd subscribe to that line of thinking as well. But living in an apartment in Brooklyn...space matters.


make big case a shelf then XD

I have 2 computers rooms LOL and 4000 SQ Feet


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You're on 310.70, right Feniks? I'm having similar issues now...but it technically performs marginally better so the 6mhz loss is not too terrible lol
> 
> And Hokies, that's some heavy work right there.
> 
> Swag, I think the 60usd cable bundle is neat, and saves you tons of hours of individually sleeving each cable. Time is money as Adam Smith put it (was it him? lol)
> 
> @Valgaur: Swag was #1 lol but you got a nice club going hehe


Yea, it was Adam Smith. Also known as 'Father of Capitalism'.







Yea, I'm going to order the cables when I receive my NH-D14.







I think it'll make my build a whole lot more solid since I can't afford a better GPU! I'll save up afterwards and invest in a great GPU after that. Considering I've had this 5770 since 2009...Still rocks though. I can play all the games I frequently play on high. It OCs great too with the 990/1445!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> @Valgaur: Swag was #1 lol but you got a nice club going hehe


i was #1








when i joined ocn, and started talking about my delidded chip,
you guys wanted me to start this club, "vondutch, make a delid club/thread"..remember...lol
only reason i didnt, was because i felt a noob compared to you guys,
lack of experience with ocing etc..some things dont change ey ...lol

but..its not only about who started it, any club is only as good as its members,








if it wasnt for us, the members, this thread would be dead already haha...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Did something happen to it?
> Also, the mark it leaves, does it affect the HSF at all?


it "upgrades" other tim's if theres some left overs,
thought this was a interesting read,
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?162440-Coollabs-Liquid-Pro-Investigated!-Easiest-possible-way-to-remove-included.-56k-warnin


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Been reading this thread for about an hour, and it has me wanting to delid before i even get my computer together for the first time... Only thing stopping me is i figure ill appreciate the results more if i wait and go through the poor temps... Decisions!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> Been reading this thread for about an hour, and it has me wanting to delid before i even get my computer together for the first time... Only thing stopping me is i figure ill appreciate the results more if i wait and go through the poor temps... Decisions!


i would first wait and see how your new chip performs,
temp and vcore wise, decide then if its needed to delid or not








try run 4.5ghz to start with, if possible, to determine if its a good one to oc..
if you can run 4.5ghz stable with less then 1.2V, it prolly will do good with the higher oc's


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i would first wait and see how your new chip performs,
> temp and vcore wise, decide then if its needed to delid or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> try run 4.5ghz to start with, if possible, to determine if its a good one to oc..
> if you can run 4.5ghz stable with less then 1.2V, it prolly will do good with the higher oc's


Is 4.5 possible on the stock cooler? I am messing with cleaning my WC setup currently so that wont be installed for a week or so... Curious to see if this chip is a good one or not LOL

Edit: Also I've been looking around for the answer but this thread is large, A lot of people suggest Collab Pro for under the lid. Isn't that nearly impossible to get off after you apply it to a die?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> to all new members of the club - congrats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to all who have fallen - condolences ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to everybody, late Merry Christmas and Happy New Year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> don't be
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a dremel with soft buffing pad/wheel for glue removal on the PCB of 4x 3770K, it works very well. it helps to soak the glue with 70-90% alcohol prior to "buffing" it out though.
> I used a dremel with buffing pad to clean off PCB from glue on 4 chips, never any trouble
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yes, CL Ultra stains, it did that to the copper base of my Raystorm. most of it came off after I used the scratch pad (scotch brite or something) they include with CLU, but some silver discoloration left, doesn't bother me much personally
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what kind of metal polish? that's interesting.
> same here, I used the scratch pad included in CLU package to clean it off the first 3770K I used it with (IHS) ... and stopped just after I noticed I almost removed the top writing on IHS ... phew that chip was going to RMA ... so ... don't use that scratch pad if you need warranty LOL!


thanks feniks, same to you









yea, seems the dremel works well for peeps,
maybe we should make a section on page 1,
about how to apply liquid pro/ultra, and best ways to clean it later..
so many ask about it..

im not to sure about using metal polish really,
if i remember right, we talked about it somewhere,
it also fills up the gaps, and is a poor conductive material..
not sure tho..

still have to take mine apart again, liquid pro is under there for a couple of months now,
gonna wait a bit longer, see what i can come up with to clean it the best way...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> Is 4.5 possible on the stock cooler? I am messing with cleaning my WC setup currently so that wont be installed for a week or so... Curious to see if this chip is a good one or not LOL
> Edit: Also I've been looking around for the answer but this thread is large, A lot of people suggest Collab Pro for under the lid. Isn't that nearly impossible to get off after you apply it to a die?


prolly not, on stock cooler maybe 4.1-4.2 max,
depends on the chip of course, and how the ihs is making contact with die etc..

edit,
its not, "making contact with die", i mean , the "distance between die and ihs"..


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's pretty easy to get off your die, I removed ultra using a cotton swab with 96% alcohol...
But you wouldn't need to remove Pro from the die, it's the best tim there is lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's pretty easy to get off your die, I removed ultra using a cotton swab with 96% alcohol...
> But you wouldn't need to remove Pro from the die, it's the best tim there is lol


the die is made of" "glass", so its easier to remove there then from the ihs,
i dont even think about removing, only for the experiment, or if my temps
are getting worse again, till now, after a few months...no problem at all,
"never change a winning team" right...lol

would it be easier to remove, when you use a hairdryer to warm it up ?
not only for removing the cooler, but also to remove it easier from the ihs ..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, no good...

Well, I just crapped in my pants after playing Metro 2033 without any lights and with a headset. So I'm going to bed now lol


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

The main reason I ask is not because I would want to change it but if you ever had to remove the chip from the board the IHS is 'loose' on the PCB, Didn't know if you took the chip out if you would have problems resulting. Thanks for the responses all, sorry to beat a dead horse with that, just the posts I was reading didn't talk about it


----------



## conaman551

Hi can you please add me









OCN name: conaman551
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: 400mhz
OC after delid: 4900Mhz
Temp drops: >25c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2630805

Before De-lid:



After De-lid:


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> The main reason I ask is not because I would want to change it but if you ever had to remove the chip from the board the IHS is 'loose' on the PCB, Didn't know if you took the chip out if you would have problems resulting. Thanks for the responses all, sorry to beat a dead horse with that, just the posts I was reading didn't talk about it


if clp/ultra hardens a bit over time, it will kinda "glue" the ihs to the die,
so if youre carefull it should be no problem removing, and leave the ihs in place,
but i havent tried it myselfs yet so









Yw,
to many posts, hard to read through it all fast..lol
think we need to update first page again, with some new info,
makes it easier to find answers to first questions peeps might have..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *conaman551*
> 
> Hi can you please add me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: conaman551
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 400mhz
> OC after delid: 4900Mhz
> Temp drops: >25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2630805
> Before De-lid:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After De-lid:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


very nice, gratz.. and welcome


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

conaman, what kind of cooling are you using?


----------



## Systemlord

Hay it's been awhile since anybody has mentioned the issue with having the TIM pumping out from under the IHS, any updates?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Hay it's been awhile since anybody has mentioned the issue with having the TIM pumping out from under the IHS, any updates?


yea, i remember, i even copied this to a text doc. for later use...lol

....................................................................................
pump out effect

Basic concept

"Large and fast decreases in temperature when coupled with HLT instructions.
A usage pattern that alternates between full idle and full load conditions
will cause die temps to swing WIDE AND FAST, particularly with overclocked/overvolted CPUs.

This thermal cycling causes TIM pump-out, wherein the TIM gets ejected and displaced by air,
which is of course not a good thing.

Greases also creep, again worsening the situation."

I think this happens more often with IB because of how quick it heats up and cools off.
The die contact area is so small with such drastic temperatures is another reason.

......................................................................................
Valgaurs explanation









Take a TIM put it on your IHS and push your heat sink on it. after a while it starts to
"spread" or pump out from the middle of the IHS and onto the sides causing temps to go up.
I have actually experienced this very recently as my Max's for temps went up. not from
vcore or anything same settings and ambients. it went up 4C.

I think this could also be applied very well to benching. For example you apply a lot
of heat to lets say a candle (Shut up it's a bad example let me be)

You heat up the top of it and it melts making it more fluid and able to move.
you then let it cool thus hardening. then you repeat for a while and eventually
the melted wax overflows the side and drips. the same can be said with this pump
out saying. as it heats it and and makes it more fluid and moves to the outer areas
of the IHS or even the die of your CPU's. This also correlates to the amount of
pressure you have on the IHS and the TIM from your heatsink as that pushes the material
and makes it move. so the more pressure the better temps but higher chance of pumping
out the TIM in the process of better temps.
...........................................................................................

just found this,

2.1.4 Long-Term Stability and Reliability of the Material
The long-term stability and reliability of the thermal interface material is its ability to provide a
sufficient thermal conductance even after an extended time or extensive use of the computer (for
example, servers or personal computers that work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week). *Low-quality
compounds may harden or leak out over time (the pump-out effect)*, leading to overheating or
premature failure of the processor. High-quality compounds provide a stable and reliable thermal
interface material throughout the lifetime of the processor. *Thermal greases with higher viscosities
are typically more resistant to pump out effects on lidless processors*.
http://support.amd.com/us/Processor_TechDocs/26951.pdf


----------



## Swag

I have just updated the spreadsheet, conaman551 is now officially in the club.







Welcome!


----------



## Matt-Matt

*OCN name:* Matt-Matt
*CPU:* i5 3570k
*on Die-IHS:* Coolabatory Liquid Pro
*Ihs-Cooler:* Coolabatory Liquid Ultra
*Mhz gained:* 200MHz
*OC after delid:* 4.6GHz
*Temp drops:* ~25c
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Link

Additional Notes:

Quite possibly used too much Pro on the Die but at least it'll stick I suppose.
Liquid Ultra was flawless on the 3570k IHS.
Temperature has greater variances then before, I.E my temps were getting close to 85c with an IBT load when ambients were warmer and the fans on slow.
CPU Cooler actually works, it heats up the top of the case and the back of it. Still not hot to the touch though. (The cooler)
Pentium 4 IHS failed, *Don't* even bother trying. Unless you want to spend a while sanding the sides of it to make it fit (I have a feeling that the Pentium 4's IHS' were taller and therefore didn't make proper contact with my 3570k
4.7GHz was fine for Windows + Games and IBT but the second I loaded P95 for more then 10 minutes it failed.
My chip is terribad, needing 1.45v for 4.6GHz and more then 1.51v for 4.7GHz. Considering selling in the new year (Feb-March) ~$200 on eBay and getting a 3770k.

There she is, all shiny after a cotton but attacked it with metho. Came up rather nice I think.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> *OCN name:* Matt-Matt
> *CPU:* i5 3570k
> *on Die-IHS:* Coolabatory Liquid Pro
> *Ihs-Cooler:* Coolabatory Liquid Ultra
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHz
> *OC after delid:* 4.6GHz
> *Temp drops:* ~25c
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Link
> 
> Additional Notes:
> 
> Quite possibly used too much Pro on the Die but at least it'll stick I suppose.
> Liquid Ultra was flawless on the 3570k IHS.
> Temperature has greater variances then before, I.E my temps were getting close to 85c with an IBT load when ambients were warmer and the fans on slow.
> CPU Cooler actually works, it heats up the top of the case and the back of it. Still not hot to the touch though. (The cooler)
> Pentium 4 IHS failed, *Don't* even bother trying. Unless you want to spend a while sanding the sides of it to make it fit (I have a feeling that the Pentium 4's IHS' were taller and therefore didn't make proper contact with my 3570k
> 4.7GHz was fine for Windows + Games and IBT but the second I loaded P95 for more then 10 minutes it failed.
> My chip is terribad, needing 1.45v for 4.6GHz and more then 1.51v for 4.7GHz. Considering selling in the new year (Feb-March) ~$200 on eBay and getting a 3770k.


You should post a picture of your delidded happiness.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You should post a picture of your delidded happiness.


I did








I didn't take many pictures because I cut my hand with the blade multiple times and i was shivering with fear as I was de-lidding haha


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You should post a picture of your delidded happiness.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't take many pictures because I cut my hand with the blade multiple times and i was shivering with fear as I was de-lidding haha
Click to expand...

I didn't see it.







I'll be adding you right now!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I didn't see it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be adding you right now!


Cheers!
Yeah I posted and forgot to add it and it took my PC a while to edit it because I'm sitting at 100% CPU usage and 97% RAM usage.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I didn't see it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be adding you right now!
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers!
> Yeah I posted and forgot to add it and it took my PC a while to edit it because I'm sitting at 100% CPU usage and 97% RAM usage.
Click to expand...

Stress-testing?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Stress-testing?


Of course! I need to make sure that the new OC is good to go.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Stress-testing?
> 
> 
> 
> Of course! I need to make sure that the new OC is good to go.
Click to expand...

Oh, a new OC! Good luck! Push that chip even farther!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh, a new OC! Good luck! Push that chip even farther!


I actually can't as I said before. It needs 1.45v for 4.6GHz and that's not certainly stable but after 8 and a half hours of P95 it seems it.
1.51v will post for 4.7GHz which is IBT stable but not P95 stable.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh, a new OC! Good luck! Push that chip even farther!
> 
> 
> 
> I actually can't as I said before. It needs 1.45v for 4.6GHz and that's not certainly stable but after 8 and a half hours of P95 it seems it.
> 1.51v will post for 4.7GHz which is IBT stable but not P95 stable.
Click to expand...

Oh, then in that case, I'd go back to 4.5GHz!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh, then in that case, I'd go back to 4.5GHz!


4.5GHz isn't stable at all (Bad Multi?) and 4.4 was where I started and that needs 1.42v so 4.6 is the sweet spot for me


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh, then in that case, I'd go back to 4.5GHz!
> 
> 
> 
> 4.5GHz isn't stable at all (Bad Multi?) and 4.4 was where I started and that needs 1.42v so 4.6 is the sweet spot for me
Click to expand...

I wonder why. You should re-evaluate your settings because that doesn't sound right at all.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> What a pain in the butt not perfect yet but will get it there


Nice work Hokie! I like the shark fin detail on the left side, very cool and gives it a unique one of a kind look. Well done!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wonder why. You should re-evaluate your settings because that doesn't sound right at all.


I have, it's just a really early batch and a bad chip. Stock is ~1.175v depending on which BIOS I'm on (it changes a bit). Up to 4.1GHz it is fine at stock but the second I go to 4.2 it needs ~1.20v, 4.3 hasn't been tested, 4.4 needs 1.42v and 4.5 is a bad multi. 4.6 needs 1.45v. This is all with the LLC on Auto too.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Metal polish? as in some sort of paste/cream thing?
> I almost erased my batch number trying to clean it, so I won't try again.


yeah that's it


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> yeah that's it


guess i only talked about it in my head, thought i made a post ...lol (bad, i know..lol)

im almost sure ive read something about using polish, like this one for example,

wasnt a good idea, because the polish, after it cleans of pro/ultra, will also fill
gaps, but it isnt a good conductive material, so it will prolly harm your temps later on..


----------



## VonDutch

i hate intel, they just so vague with some answers peeps need..
any signs of degradation yet, with members running 1.45+V vcore 24/7?
tempted to go run my 4.8ghz at 1.420V, see how it goes in a year orso ..lol
just dont see the need for that oc, my 4646mhz at 1.305V vcore is fast enough..


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i hate intel, they just so vague with some answers peeps need..
> any signs of degradation yet, with members running 1.45+V vcore 24/7?
> tempted to go run my 4.8ghz at 1.420V, see how it goes in a year orso ..lol
> just dont see the need for that oc, my 4646mhz at 1.305V vcore is fast enough..


An Intel rep told me in chat support on their website that the 1.55v I needed for 4.8GHz would be fine for years as long as the chip wasn't overheating. He told me voltage isn't the problem, heat is, if heat is under spec then I can pump whatever voltage I want through it. Now it's hard to say if this guy knows his stuff or not but I'd like to think he does.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> An Intel rep told me in chat support on their website that the 1.55v I needed for 4.8GHz would be fine for years as long as the chip wasn't overheating. He told me voltage isn't the problem, heat is, if heat is under spec then I can pump whatever voltage I want through it. Now it's hard to say if this guy knows his stuff or not but I'd like to think he does.


Yeah... Well if he is advising people to run like that lets hope that he is right. I'm happy with 1.45v to be honest.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> An Intel rep told me in chat support on their website that the 1.55v I needed for 4.8GHz would be fine for years as long as the chip wasn't overheating. He told me voltage isn't the problem, heat is, if heat is under spec then I can pump whatever voltage I want through it. Now it's hard to say if this guy knows his stuff or not but I'd like to think he does.


and another intel rep told me, if i stayed under 1.5-1.52V vcore, there should be no degradation at all,
he isnt right about the heat tho, then he would say,
i can run my 5.4ghz oc for longer times, whatever vcore i needed, 1.750V in this case ...lol
if it stays cold enough, which isnt hard for me in this time of year,


----------



## Gomi

To be honest, with the wonder of de-lidding I cranked the Vcore up to 1.55 and started to find a stable multiplier - When I found that I simply started lowering the Vcore to where everything is stable.

Like a few others, my problem at the moment is not the heat, but the Vcore limit, what-ever it may be. Having a good 30C headroom is nice - But makes me shred a tear of the loss possibilites.

On other news: CLP is like crack - I just ordered two more tubes - So far I used it on all the laptops in the house and the folding rig. Amazing stuff!

And in completely other news: Just had a friend call me, asked if a 1200W PSU with an AC Input of 6Amps would draw those 6Amps all the time - Or if it simply only did that on 1200W - Personally I have no idea, so if any of you fellas know this, feel free to add


----------



## MunneY

I really need to get my Kraken x60 shipped so I can freaking put the h100 on my 3770k. After that, I'm gonna overclock my cpu a bit more and see what kinda damage she does. I REALLY wanna get to 5.0 ... That'd make me smile something fierce


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> To be honest, with the wonder of de-lidding I cranked the Vcore up to 1.55 and started to find a stable multiplier - When I found that I simply started lowering the Vcore to where everything is stable.
> Like a few others, my problem at the moment is not the heat, but the Vcore limit, what-ever it may be. Having a good 30C headroom is nice - But makes me shred a tear of the loss possibilites.
> On other news: CLP is like crack - I just ordered two more tubes - So far I used it on all the laptops in the house and the folding rig. Amazing stuff!
> And in completely other news: Just had a friend call me, asked if a 1200W PSU with an AC Input of 6Amps would draw those 6Amps all the time - Or if it simply only did that on 1200W - Personally I have no idea, so if any of you fellas know this, feel free to add


Yeah, I need to order some more myself!









Yes, the same goes for me. I'm not too keen on running much past 1.45v for 24/7 personally even after de-lidding, it did increase my overclock too and will increase longevity in the processor (and lower voltage needed)

I'm going to re-do my GPU when I get some more in the coming months I suppose. As for the PSU question I'm pretty sure it wouldn't as the components don't need the amperage all the time. I.E A GTX 670 needs 30 AMPS so the power supply would only technically be drawing the power it needs. That's the way I see it anyway


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> The main reason I ask is not because I would want to change it but if you ever had to remove the chip from the board the IHS is 'loose' on the PCB, Didn't know if you took the chip out if you would have problems resulting. Thanks for the responses all, sorry to beat a dead horse with that, just the posts I was reading didn't talk about it


I did, and I was using ultra. Just grab the chip by the edge of the pcb and ground yourself properly...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> *OCN name:* Matt-Matt
> *CPU:* i5 3570k
> *on Die-IHS:* Coolabatory Liquid Pro
> *Ihs-Cooler:* Coolabatory Liquid Ultra
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHz
> *OC after delid:* 4.6GHz
> *Temp drops:* ~25c
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Link
> Additional Notes:
> 
> Quite possibly used too much Pro on the Die but at least it'll stick I suppose.
> Liquid Ultra was flawless on the 3570k IHS.
> Temperature has greater variances then before, I.E my temps were getting close to 85c with an IBT load when ambients were warmer and the fans on slow.
> CPU Cooler actually works, it heats up the top of the case and the back of it. Still not hot to the touch though. (The cooler)
> Pentium 4 IHS failed, *Don't* even bother trying. Unless you want to spend a while sanding the sides of it to make it fit (I have a feeling that the Pentium 4's IHS' were taller and therefore didn't make proper contact with my 3570k
> 4.7GHz was fine for Windows + Games and IBT but the second I loaded P95 for more then 10 minutes it failed.
> My chip is terribad, needing 1.45v for 4.6GHz and more then 1.51v for 4.7GHz. Considering selling in the new year (Feb-March) ~$200 on eBay and getting a 3770k.
> 
> There she is, all shiny after a cotton but attacked it with metho. Came up rather nice I think.


Very nice man! Now, if only your chip wouldn't be such a dud








Hopefully your new 3770k will rock!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i hate intel, they just so vague with some answers peeps need..
> any signs of degradation yet, with members running 1.45+V vcore 24/7?
> tempted to go run my 4.8ghz at 1.420V, see how it goes in a year orso ..lol
> just dont see the need for that oc, my 4646mhz at 1.305V vcore is fast enough..


There is an Intel rep that has a Reddit AMA you guys should check out. I don't have a reddit account but I'm tempted to ask a few things, you may as well beat me to it.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, I need to order some more myself!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, the same goes for me. I'm not too keen on running much past 1.45v for 24/7 personally even after de-lidding, it did increase my overclock too and will increase longevity in the processor (and lower voltage needed)
> I'm going to re-do my GPU when I get some more in the coming months I suppose. As for the PSU question I'm pretty sure it wouldn't as the components don't need the amperage all the time. I.E A GTX 670 needs 30 AMPS so the power supply would only technically be drawing the power it needs. That's the way I see it anyway


Your psu won't be taking 1200w from the wall constantly, the components you plug to it will draw juice depending on load/usage.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> There is an Intel rep that has a Reddit AMA you guys should check out. I don't have a reddit account but I'm tempted to ask a few things, you may as well beat me to it.


link?
whats a raddit, some rabbit/addict mix? ..lol

o, and can we have a tip added on page 1,
"practice on some old pentiums, before the real attempt to delid a ivy"?

i bought 10 old pentiums over here, for 10 euro,
i think if you can do 2 at least, you have a good feel of how it is gonna go on
the real thing









think we should have a section with delidding tips from all members,
could be helpful for others


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> link?
> whats a raddit, some rabbit/addict mix? ..lol




__
https://www.reddit.com/r/15iaet/iama_cpu_architect_and_designer_at_intel_ama/c7mq2sd
 a nice sample of what I'm talking about.
He's an architect at Intel and knows plenty of interesting stuff those chat reps don't logically. You can ask the guy whatever and he will post an answer.
He delids his own k chips!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/15iaet/iama_cpu_architect_and_designer_at_intel_ama/c7mq2sd
> a nice sample of what I'm talking about.
> He's an architect at Intel and knows plenty of interesting stuff those chat reps don't logically. You can ask the guy whatever and he will post an answer.
> He delids his own k chips!


cool, did anyone ask him about max vcore yet for ivy? ..lol
guess i need to get over there, you coming over to ivan?









edit,
if he delids his chips, we should get him over here, and show him our clubhouse..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I did, and I was using ultra. Just grab the chip by the edge of the pcb and ground yourself properly...
> *Very nice man! Now, if only your chip wouldn't be such a dud
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully your new 3770k will rock!*


One can hope.. That's if I ever do. I'll be doing my first year uni so the budget may be tight, it's not financially viable to get a new CPU just for an extra few hundred mhz increase in performance and HT which I don't need. So I may not, it depends how it goes I guess.

And I knew my chip wasn't that good, I was hoping for 4.7GHz at ~1.45v and like 70-80c temps. But alas nothing is as good as expected









Also I got my 3570k out without the IHS on just fine. Just lift the latch up and lift it up by the side that is now touchable/visible. It's safe to touch the bottom of the CPU as long as you wipe it with a bit of metho to get rid of any oils etc from your skin. The same goes for the CPU's core, just make sure you clean it and don't bend the pins in the motherboard.

Also the previous thermal paste install had a bit too much and it squeezed out the side and got on the side of the CPU a bit fell on the bottom of the CPU as I was getting it out and some fell in the socket! Thank goodness it was only MX-2 and it works fine still without trying to remove it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Phew! If it was LP I'd be worried...

Hey, you don't really need more than stock really, 4.5 is a whole lotta cpu xD
I like to bench and I need the best cpu as possible to get good gpu scores and ram efficiency, but well, not for everyone out there.


----------



## I_shot

Nice to see that intel stock tim deniers are growing day by day









Today i opened the right side of the case and saw that one of the cpu mounting screw wasnt alligned . i had realized that something was wrong about it cause the cooler surface wasn't pressuring enough some areas. after that i fixed it and tested to see any improvements on temps. Well my no delid to delid performance was 23 C but now it is 26 C even with one fan







This improvement made my day folks







It keeps better and better . BTW i'm still not added to the list


----------



## Bigdale7

Hey I think you must have missed my submission to join this esteemed club.. Post #6110 as I don' t yet see my name on the list.. If there is something else I need to do please let me know... thanks


----------



## Hokies83

1.55v is safe 24/7 if your not gonna go past 1.4v then u wasted your time de lidding.


----------



## chronicfx

I am at 4.8 with 1.32v for my 24/7. It is the max overclock at which s3 sleep will work. Too impatient for hibernate.


----------



## conaman551

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I have just updated the spreadsheet, conaman551 is now officially in the club.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Welcome!


Thanks glad to be onboard!!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> conaman, what kind of cooling are you using?


Coolermaster 412s, pretty much the same as a 212 plus/evo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> very nice, gratz.. and welcome


Thank you


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> Is 4.5 possible on the stock cooler? I am messing with cleaning my WC setup currently so that wont be installed for a week or so... Curious to see if this chip is a good one or not LOL
> Edit: Also I've been looking around for the answer but this thread is large, A lot of people suggest Collab Pro for under the lid. Isn't that nearly impossible to get off after you apply it to a die?


No way. unless you have a heck of a chip man.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, no good...
> Well, I just crapped in my pants after playing Metro 2033 without any lights and with a headset. So I'm going to bed now lol


Yeah.... 2033 does that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *conaman551*
> 
> Hi can you please add me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: conaman551
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 400mhz
> OC after delid: 4900Mhz
> Temp drops: >25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2630805
> Before De-lid:
> 
> After De-lid:


Darn you Swag.... beat me to it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> *OCN name:* Matt-Matt
> *CPU:* i5 3570k
> *on Die-IHS:* Coolabatory Liquid Pro
> *Ihs-Cooler:* Coolabatory Liquid Ultra
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHz
> *OC after delid:* 4.6GHz
> *Temp drops:* ~25c
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Link
> Additional Notes:
> 
> Quite possibly used too much Pro on the Die but at least it'll stick I suppose.
> Liquid Ultra was flawless on the 3570k IHS.
> Temperature has greater variances then before, I.E my temps were getting close to 85c with an IBT load when ambients were warmer and the fans on slow.
> CPU Cooler actually works, it heats up the top of the case and the back of it. Still not hot to the touch though. (The cooler)
> Pentium 4 IHS failed, *Don't* even bother trying. Unless you want to spend a while sanding the sides of it to make it fit (I have a feeling that the Pentium 4's IHS' were taller and therefore didn't make proper contact with my 3570k
> 4.7GHz was fine for Windows + Games and IBT but the second I loaded P95 for more then 10 minutes it failed.
> My chip is terribad, needing 1.45v for 4.6GHz and more then 1.51v for 4.7GHz. Considering selling in the new year (Feb-March) ~$200 on eBay and getting a 3770k.
> 
> There she is, all shiny after a cotton but attacked it with metho. Came up rather nice I think.


Stop it Swag!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I really need to get my Kraken x60 shipped so I can freaking put the h100 on my 3770k. After that, I'm gonna overclock my cpu a bit more and see what kinda damage she does. I REALLY wanna get to 5.0 ... That'd make me smile something fierce


Just wait. you will get 5.0 and when you do you'll say I could do 5.1.... and 5.2... etc etc
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> link?
> whats a raddit, some rabbit/addict mix? ..lol
> o, and can we have a tip added on page 1,
> "practice on some old pentiums, before the real attempt to delid a ivy"?
> i bought 10 old pentiums over here, for 10 euro,
> i think if you can do 2 at least, you have a good feel of how it is gonna go on
> the real thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> think we should have a section with delidding tips from all members,
> could be helpful for others


PM me nd we can work on it together.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Hey I think you must have missed my submission to join this esteemed club.. Post #6110 as I don' t yet see my name on the list.. If there is something else I need to do please let me know... thanks


Found ya!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Okay I reapplied my CLP and have achieved better temps.. So here is my application for joining the delid club..
> Bigdale7
> i5 3570K
> CLP on die and on the IHS (H100)
> Can now run 5.0 as daily OC - 4.7 before delid + 300 mgz
> haven't yet tested for max OC.. was 5.3
> Lapped the IHS, finished with 1500 grit.
> Tested before and after with Prime95 at 4.7 ghz
> Hotttest core was 86C - Hotttest core now 78
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2584502


Gonna add you soon so slap the Sig on sir!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *conaman551*
> 
> Thanks glad to be onboard!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coolermaster 412s, pretty much the same as a 212 plus/evo
> Thank you


Welcome as well!


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No way. unless you have a heck of a chip man.
> Yeah.... 2033 does that.
> Darn you Swag.... beat me to it.
> Stop it Swag!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just wait. you will get 5.0 and when you do you'll say I could do 5.1.... and 5.2... etc etc
> PM me nd we can work on it together.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Found ya!
> Gonna add you soon so slap the Sig on sir!
> Welcome as well!


Yeah buddy... I got to 4.4 on multi only and my temps aren't bad under IBT... I'll play with it more when I get back from New Orleans for NYE....

I can't wait to try and achieve it... My 3930k I never even bothered to push it past 4.5, and thats where it sits


----------



## Bigdale7

Thanks Valgaur! I will wear my Sig proudly


----------



## Bigdale7

Got nothing to say.. Just wanted to show off my new Signature! Worth all the stress and anxiety... Just Do It


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Got nothing to say.. Just wanted to show off my new Signature! Worth all the stress and anxiety... *Just Do It*


welcome dale, finally in ..lol


----------



## Hokies83

Leak testing still got to put Gpus back in add another run of lights and mount bottom rad it is just sitting there ATM.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Got nothing to say.. Just wanted to show off my new Signature! Worth all the stress and anxiety... Just Do It


Rather than crowding your sig, use Huddler's integrated sig rig feature.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig#


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Got nothing to say.. Just wanted to show off my new Signature! Worth all the stress and anxiety... Just Do It


Also, sig cut off at bottom because there is a limit on number of lines in sig.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> I'm still working with her, but she really doesn't want to boot w/ anything less than 1.49 Vcore @ 4.6 so far. I'll drop the multi and see if she'll boot @ 1.2v. But it's starting to look like I might have a bum chip according to what you guys are reporting.


How did it behave before delidding?

With bare die you have to do a low pressure mount with CLP for good cooling and you have be certain you have good contact between the block surface and the die. A bad mount can immensely effect he performance characteristics.

Your MB may be the problem as well.


----------



## Bigdale7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Got nothing to say.. Just wanted to show off my new Signature! Worth all the stress and anxiety... Just Do It
> 
> 
> 
> Rather than crowding your sig, use Huddler's integrated sig rig feature.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig#
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip and link Dmanstasiu.. I've taken your advice and made the changes. I'm guessing you live in Vancouver Canada which is not far from where I live in Washington State..


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Thanks for the tip and link Dmanstasiu.. I've taken your advice and made the changes. I'm guessing you live in Vancouver Canada which is not far from where I live in Washington State..


Much cleaner. And yeah, I've gone down to Seattle before to visit OCN members


----------



## Swag

OCed my RAM to 2133! Didn't really need to change the timings but I wanted it to have some insurance so it went to 10-11-11 instead of stock 10-11-10.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Those sound like Hynix...you should keep the 10-11-10 figure, and go higher, perhaps 2400mhz 11-12-10-28-2t or something like that. Try the rog presets, Hynix ones.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Those sound like Hynix...you should keep the 10-11-10 figure, and go higher, perhaps 2400mhz 11-12-10-28-2t or something like that. Try the rog presets, Hynix ones.


Sorry, can you explain Hynix? Complete loss at that term.


----------



## dmanstasiu

What voltage are you at? You could definitely tighten those up. Here is my effortless OC.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> What voltage are you at? You could definitely tighten those up. Here is my effortless OC.


Samsung RAM is cheating! Haha, they are so good! I've only had them for a while before I had to give them back.







I'm at 1.50vdimm


----------



## MunneY

Alright... so I put prime 95 on at 4.4 and hit that 105 number... thats with no vcore adjustment or anything... but thats also under an NZXT Havik 120

Edit...

It passed prime 95 though with 0 errors or warnings...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Phew! If it was LP I'd be worried...
> Hey, you don't really need more than stock really, 4.5 is a whole lotta cpu xD
> I like to bench and I need the best cpu as possible to get good gpu scores and ram efficiency, but well, not for everyone out there.


Yeah, well 4.6 is now 20 hours P95 stable. Temperatures peaked at like 80c but sat at 60-65c most of the time. It's more for the bragging rights to me personally








And yes, i was crapping myself when I saw it drop in there, then I remembered that it's just MX-2 and the good thing about that is its non-conductive and decided to try it with the paste in there.

One happy de-lidder here


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry, can you explain Hynix? Complete loss at that term.


Hynix is a ram chip manufacturer, like Crucial/Micron, Samsung, Elpida, Powerchip, Nanya and others.
What you see in current kits is either Samsung stuff or Hynix.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> What voltage are you at? You could definitely tighten those up. Here is my effortless OC.


Those are hyk0 Samsung chips, they don't behave the same way.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Alright... so I put prime 95 on at 4.4 and hit that 105 number... thats with no vcore adjustment or anything... but thats also under an NZXT Havik 120
> Edit...
> It passed prime 95 though with 0 errors or warnings...


Wow! Delid that sucka!!! or remount your cooler, sounds awfully hot.
What vcore? Auto? Try manually setting it to 1.25v as a starting point.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, well 4.6 is now 20 hours P95 stable. Temperatures peaked at like 80c but sat at 60-65c most of the time. It's more for the bragging rights to me personally
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And yes, i was crapping myself when I saw it drop in there, then I remembered that it's just MX-2 and the good thing about that is its non-conductive and decided to try it with the paste in there.
> One happy de-lidder here










Great!!!
Glad to hear it's working good.

Guys, I was offered a trade for a 2600k lol
I can use that while I wait for my 3770k replacement, what do you think?
Pentium g620 + cash for 2600k?


----------



## Bigdale7

I live 110 miles east of Seattle... I get to Seattle now then.


----------



## ivanlabrie

too bad, guy backed out








Now I just gotta wait for my new chip...I'm sad now.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> too bad, guy backed out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I just gotta wait for my new chip...I'm sad now.


Ouch.. why'd he back out? How much cash was it that you were going to pay? Because there is a chance that the 2600k is a very good clocker and makes it better then a 3770k









Oh well, at least you won't waste your money on a 2600k now









EDIT: Yeah, I think something is up with my board/BIOS because my chip cant be this bad, and besides 1.45v de-lidded would be giving me higher temperatures then 65c surely? It only peaked at ~80 because I put the fan on a low speed during the day.


----------



## MunneY

Ok... so I tried again... and i got to 4.5 and ran prime for 15 minutes and never went above 90... still bad... but I'm not sure what to do.. keep pushing it?


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Ok... so I tried again... and i got to 4.5 and ran prime for 15 minutes and never went above 90... still bad... but I'm not sure what to do.. keep pushing it?


I would be happy with 4.5 if its approaching 90 degrees. You don't want the processor running over 85-90 for everyday. Otherwise double check your mount and apply a good thermal paste (not sure what your using now)


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> I would be happy with 4.5 if its approaching 90 degrees. You don't want the processor running over 85-90 for everyday. Otherwise double check your mount and apply a good thermal paste (not sure what your using now)


This, i'd try and knock it back to 4.4 to be honest. Are you de-lidded and what cooler are you using?
I'm running 4.7GHz right now with a max temp of 70c with a P95 blend.. 1.53v


----------



## shremi

My fellow crewman's i could use some help ...

Is anybody near a microcenter this weekend or has a plan to go ???/

Something came up and ill be needing a 3370k .... I had one for 250 but the person wasn't sure if he wanted to go with thw 3770k now i am stuck









Let me know....

Shremi


----------



## Matt-Matt

Hate to fill this thread with lots of offtopic questions and such, but what is a good setting for LLC with a good air cooler and a de-lidded CPU? High? (I assume that is 75%)


----------



## ivanlabrie

I can get you one...pm me.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, no good...
> Well, I just crapped in my pants after playing Metro 2033 without any lights and with a headset. So I'm going to bed now lol


Dude that game surely does that to everybody ... I nearly crapped myself until I got used to this game ... later on I got slightly stuck in first bandit station so I had to google some guide for ... well ... guidance







... I also learned to save the bullets and use throwing knives over there









Later on I really needed that guide (It's on IGN) for going through certain hard chapters like Front Lines and Black Station in stealth mode, was very helpful. not saying you should use the guide (it won't spoil the game atmosphere regardless, I promise), but at some points this game is so tuff (how do you spell that?) that you either go guns blazing (and waste precious ammo eventually shooting with golden bullets and later you can't buy stuff because of that) that glancing at a guide from time to time makes sense, especially if you are aiming at Enlightened Ending (I did that). have fun, it's a great game, can't wait for Metro 2034 Last Light!















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I actually can't as I said before. It needs 1.45v for 4.6GHz and that's not certainly stable but after 8 and a half hours of P95 it seems it.
> 1.51v will post for 4.7GHz which is IBT stable but not P95 stable.


Forget about Prime95 and IBT unless you point is testing the thermal capabilities of your cooling solution. Since a few weeks I use only Cinebench 11.5 x64 and couple that with WHEA warnings monitoring in Event Logs to set proper vcore at mdoerate temps and 30 sec runs, never a problem afterwards, such stable OC's pass IBT and prime95 as well, if you wanted to double check.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> guess i only talked about it in my head, thought i made a post ...lol (bad, i know..lol)
> im almost sure ive read something about using polish, like this one for example,
> 
> wasnt a good idea, because the polish, after it cleans of pro/ultra, will also fill
> gaps, but it isnt a good conductive material, so it will prolly harm your temps later on..


yeah, that's what I read somewhere too, still this is an option if one wanted to restore the block look to factory standard. I guess later you could use Arctic Cooling Remover & Purifier to make it super clean again for new TIM application. it's something.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i hate intel, they just so vague with some answers peeps need..
> any signs of degradation yet, with members running 1.45+V vcore 24/7?
> tempted to go run my 4.8ghz at 1.420V, see how it goes in a year orso ..lol
> just dont see the need for that oc, my 4646mhz at 1.305V vcore is fast enough..


nope, not here after I have gotten a new chip and used it only on MVE board, no degradation whatsoever and I run 4.9GHz on offsets daily and benchmark (well trying to) up to 5.2GHz with 1.65V.
I tried making 5GHz with 1.46V vcore my new daily offset, but I think my board's BIOS causes some instability when running offsets past 49x multiplier (random BSOD 124 or random shutdown sometimes no matter what).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> An Intel rep told me in chat support on their website that the 1.55v I needed for 4.8GHz would be fine for years as long as the chip wasn't overheating. He told me voltage isn't the problem, heat is, if heat is under spec then I can pump whatever voltage I want through it. Now it's hard to say if this guy knows his stuff or not but I'd like to think he does.


that's interesting and very re-assuring if Intel rep says something like that. I think Intel has gotten vcore safety levels right this time on IB chips and literally we are only limited by cooling. If only motherboard makers would catch up and properly program vcore offsets to work correctly past 49x multiplier for daily use, it would be sweet.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> To be honest, with the wonder of de-lidding I cranked the Vcore up to 1.55 and started to find a stable multiplier - When I found that I simply started lowering the Vcore to where everything is stable.
> Like a few others, my problem at the moment is not the heat, but the Vcore limit, what-ever it may be. Having a good 30C headroom is nice - But makes me shred a tear of the loss possibilites.
> On other news: CLP is like crack - I just ordered two more tubes - So far I used it on all the laptops in the house and the folding rig. Amazing stuff!
> And in completely other news: Just had a friend call me, asked if a 1200W PSU with an AC Input of 6Amps would draw those 6Amps all the time - Or if it simply only did that on 1200W - Personally I have no idea, so if any of you fellas know this, feel free to add


yeah, chips differ greatly, good average ones can do 5.0-5.1GHz stable with up to 1.55V, there's quite a few batches that do such which is a good thing. where did you land (what multi) with up to 1.55V vcore?
PSUs draw what they need only when they need it, they can idle at minimal wattage/amperage as long as you system requests no more, a good example is using a 600 series GPU coupled with modern CPU running daily vcore on offsets - mine (1050W Thermaltake Grand PSU here) draws only 160W at idle (or as I type this) while under full load of both 670's (in SLI) and 3770K it can pull up to 700W from the wall socket (I can see it on my APC UPS).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.55v is safe 24/7 if your not gonna go past 1.4v then u wasted your time de lidding.


I totally believe you and think the same thing ... however I just wish my MVE board (tested up to latest BIOS 1501) was properly allowing me to use daily vcore offset at 5.0GHz (50x multi) ... however the highest multi the offsets work correctly is 4.9GHz then it randomly craps out on light load. I don't like running fixed vcore daily (been there done tht for a few years with EVGA boards), vcore offsets save me a lot of money on my monthly power bills, especially now when using 670 SLI, those 2 cards at idle draw only 60W (or nearly 600W under full load when OC'ed)!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am at 4.8 with 1.32v for my 24/7. It is the max overclock at which s3 sleep will work. Too impatient for hibernate.


Sleep mode stops working after you enable the Internal PLL override in BIOS and that is required usually past 46x multiplier. I personally don't use Sleep Mode ever as my main rig has always been running 24/7, I just restart it when needed (updates, etc.). I personally prefer running low voltage/wattage/amperage components (vcore offsets, 600 series cards, etc.) to save on power than to deal with Sleep Mode issues ... especially that I aim at 5.0GHz daily clock hehe








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> OCed my RAM to 2133! Didn't really need to change the timings but I wanted it to have some insurance so it went to 10-11-11 instead of stock 10-11-10.


on my Mushkin Enahanced Blackline (Hynix chips) model 996990 that were rated at 2000MHz with 9-11-9-27 @ 1.65V I can do 2200MHz with timings of 9-11-10-28 1T @ 1.70V and Tight Hynix Preset (it's in ASUS ROG BIOS menu - DRAM timings).
Nowadays I run daily 2400MHz with 10-12-11-28 2T @ 1.70V using the Loose Hynix Preset, it's fully stable. I am actually working towards a stable 2600MHz for benchmarking needs, but it's hard ... I am seeing POST code 55 so often that I got tired of it, I know how to work around, but it's complicated to make things fully stable under MemTest for at least 1 full pass ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Those sound like Hynix...you should keep the 10-11-10 figure, and go higher, perhaps 2400mhz 11-12-10-28-2t or something like that. Try the rog presets, Hynix ones.


if that is in deed Hynix it should do 2400MHz with plain settings straight from the Loose Hynix preset (10-12-11-28 2T), all it needs is a vdimm bump most likely, but chips will vary among mem sticks. it's best to google the memory part number and try finding what IC chips it has, took me a while to figure out mine (Hynix BFR)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry, can you explain Hynix? Complete loss at that term.


google it or let us know, either Ivan or me can provide useful links, if you can't find what is what.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Not going to quote feniks but cheers! +Rep

Downloading cinebench now, does that test RAM/IMC too or just the CPU cores?

7.52 for CPU score, beats an i7 960! Nice.
It detects my CPU at 3.41GHz which is annoying, so just one run proves stability yes?


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> I would be happy with 4.5 if its approaching 90 degrees. You don't want the processor running over 85-90 for everyday. Otherwise double check your mount and apply a good thermal paste (not sure what your using now)


I'm not happy with 4.5 and want to keep pushing it...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This, i'd try and knock it back to 4.4 to be honest. Are you de-lidded and what cooler are you using?
> I'm running 4.7GHz right now with a max temp of 70c with a P95 blend.. 1.53v


I'm not currently de-lidded. I'm running a Havik 120 until I can get my hands on a Kraken x60 to replace the h100 on my 3930k, or for this i guess... I plan on delidding this next week after NYE trip.

BTW. I'm following the Asrock SB/IB overclocking guide... I dont believe I've adjusted the Vcore at all.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I'm not happy with 4.5 and want to keep pushing it...
> I'm not currently de-lidded. I'm running a Havik 120 until I can get my hands on a Kraken x60 to replace the h100 on my 3930k, or for this i guess... I plan on delidding this next week after NYE trip.
> BTW. I'm following the Asrock SB/IB overclocking guide... I dont believe I've adjusted the Vcore at all.


I'd suggest to not push it for now with that cooler and not de-lidding it..
Are you sure the Havik is mounted properly and tight? (Making proper contact) and you didn't use way too much paste (I'd assume you didn't)

I used to get 80+c load on a Hyper 212+ non-delidded at 4.2GHz on stock voltage, also to clarify "Stock voltage" what does it run at stock? 1.1v+? Mine personally runs 1.175 which is rather high and needs a lot of voltage compared with other chips.

I'd also ask what is your batch number? I know there isn't any correlation but I do think that the earlier batches needed more voltage _and_ had a worse TIM application underneath the IHS because mine was terrible.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Not going to quote feniks but cheers! +Rep
> Downloading cinebench now, does that test RAM/IMC too or just the CPU cores?
> 7.52 for CPU score, beats an i7 960! Nice.
> It detects my CPU at 3.41GHz which is annoying, so just one run proves stability yes?


yup, just one run is enough, but you NEED to check for WHEA Warnings in Event Logs, if they are there during the cinebench run then you need to adjust the vcore up until they go away







- that's what I do, after that I can pass IBT no trouble (pretty much stopped using it since then because it generates awful temps under load).


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'd suggest to not push it for now with that cooler and not de-lidding it..
> Are you sure the Havik is mounted properly and tight? (Making proper contact) and you didn't use way too much paste (I'd assume you didn't)
> I used to get 80+c load on a Hyper 212+ non-delidded at 4.2GHz on stock voltage, also to clarify "Stock voltage" what does it run at stock? 1.1v+? Mine personally runs 1.175 which is rather high and needs a lot of voltage compared with other chips.
> I'd also ask what is your batch number? I know there isn't any correlation but I do think that the earlier batches needed more voltage _and_ had a worse TIM application underneath the IHS because mine was terrible.


At 4.5 i'm running 1.26 on Vcore. Highest core at 89c (ranging from 82-89) Running consistently at 81ish. I am using AS5 thermal paste and I'm positive its mounted properly.

I'm not exactly sure what my stock volts are, seeing as since first post its run at a min of 4.3.


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> At 4.5 i'm running 1.26 on Vcore. Highest core at 89c (ranging from 82-89) Running consistently at 81ish. I am using AS5 thermal paste and I'm positive its mounted properly.
> I'm not exactly sure what my stock volts are, seeing as since first post its run at a min of 4.3.


He was talking about the voltage on your CPU. so the 1.26 number, which sounds like you must still be on auto? Mine goes up to 1.3 on auto which would read out high 1.2. You can run your system however you want, but everyone on here will recommend that you do not push it further. Bottom line is your temps are not great, and as you get to higher frequencies you need exponentially more voltage to get the minimal gains, more voltage means more heat, and your already above what most would like to run 24/7.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I'm thinking of joining you guys... I've got so much to do to my new system (buy a gpu) but I'm thinking of doing it simply for the temp drops. I haven't really pushed my 3770k, but I'm gonna stress it more when I actually get the time..
> 
> I havent bothered to read through all 6300 post yet, but is this a worthwhile risk?


Yes. To join you must first read all 6000+ post. There is also a test after that. And that is just the start! But it is worth it, and not really needed..., but lots of good stuff if you ever wanted to read through some of it.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Nice to see that intel stock tim deniers are growing day by day
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Today i opened the right side of the case and saw that one of the cpu mounting screw wasnt alligned . i had realized that something was wrong about it cause the cooler surface wasn't pressuring enough some areas. after that i fixed it and tested to see any improvements on temps. Well my no delid to delid performance was 23 C but now it is 26 C even with one fan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This improvement made my day folks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It keeps better and better . BTW i'm still not added to the list


Still not added? What post number did you fill in the needed info?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigdale7*
> 
> Hey I think you must have missed my submission to join this esteemed club.. Post #6110 as I don' t yet see my name on the list.. If there is something else I need to do please let me know... thanks


I see Valgaur alread got yours added. Sorry for the delay *Bigdale7*! Wellcome aboard!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'd suggest to not push it for now with that cooler and not de-lidding it..
> Are you sure the Havik is mounted properly and tight? (Making proper contact) and you didn't use way too much paste (I'd assume you didn't)
> I used to get 80+c load on a Hyper 212+ non-delidded at 4.2GHz on stock voltage, also to clarify "Stock voltage" what does it run at stock? 1.1v+? Mine personally runs 1.175 which is rather high and needs a lot of voltage compared with other chips.
> I'd also ask what is your batch number? I know there isn't any correlation but I do think that the earlier batches needed more voltage _and_ had a worse TIM application underneath the IHS because mine was terrible.
> 
> 
> 
> At 4.5 i'm running 1.26 on Vcore. Highest core at 89c (ranging from 82-89) Running consistently at 81ish. I am using AS5 thermal paste and I'm positive its mounted properly.
> 
> I'm not exactly sure what my stock volts are, seeing as since first post its run at a min of 4.3.
Click to expand...

Is that your before temps *MunneY*? Cause they are too high for a delided chip.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

One more thing on ram Feniks...there are different variants of Hynix chips which don't react quite the same.
The best are Hynix CFR and MFR, the former being capable of 2800mhz speeds with good timings on cold, and decent loose timings on air.
I say we gotta experiment with receiver and transmitter slew values in our ROG bioses, I found a useful guide which I can point you to if you wish.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yes. To join you must first read all 6000+ post. There is also a test after that. And that is just the start! But it is worth it, and not really needed..., but lots of good stuff if you ever wanted to read through some of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still not added? What post number did you fill in the needed info?
> I see Valgaur alread got yours added. Sorry for the delay *Bigdale7*! Wellcome aboard!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that your before temps *MunneY*? Cause they are too high for a delided chip.....


He's not delidded yet...


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blkdoutgsxr*
> 
> He was talking about the voltage on your CPU. so the 1.26 number, which sounds like you must still be on auto? Mine goes up to 1.3 on auto which would read out high 1.2. You can run your system however you want, but everyone on here will recommend that you do not push it further. Bottom line is your temps are not great, and as you get to higher frequencies you need exponentially more voltage to get the minimal gains, more voltage means more heat, and your already above what most would like to run 24/7.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yes. To join you must first read all 6000+ post. There is also a test after that. And that is just the start! But it is worth it, and not really needed..., but lots of good stuff if you ever wanted to read through some of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still not added? What post number did you fill in the needed info?
> I see Valgaur alread got yours added. Sorry for the delay *Bigdale7*! Wellcome aboard!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that your before temps *MunneY*? Cause they are too high for a delided chip.....


I've stated a couple of times I haven't de-lidded yet. I'm just trying to figure out where I stand as of right now. at 4.4 I'm completely stable and under 90c. at 4.5 here are the results.

After 10 minutes (ignore the timestamps on realtemp)


After 30 minutes (again ignore Realtemp time)


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I've stated a couple of times I haven't de-lidded yet. I'm just trying to figure out where I stand as of right now. at 4.4 I'm completely stable and under 90c. at 4.5 here are the results.
> After 10 minutes (ignore the timestamps on realtemp)
> 
> After 30 minutes (again ignore Realtemp time)


Max temps of 105?!??!?!?! Stop doing this to your chip!!!! LOL


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> One more thing on ram Feniks...there are different variants of Hynix chips which don't react quite the same.
> The best are Hynix CFR and MFR, the former being capable of 2800mhz speeds with good timings on cold, and decent loose timings on air.
> I say we gotta experiment with receiver and transmitter slew values in our ROG bioses, I found a useful guide which I can point you to if you wish.


yup budyy, I know about different kinds of those Hynix ICs ... was just saying how mine (BFR I think they are) react to overclocking on ROG BIOS. I totally admit we do need more experimenting hehe as always ... so far by adjusting Transceiver and Receiver slew values to suggested by Shamino & Kingpin I noticed much worse performance instead of improvements ... wondering to what those settings are set to on auto (can't see anywhere) if by setting the "tuned" values bandwidths suffered a loss ...

was using this guide (same one is published on kingpin forums):
http://rog.asus.com/109512012/maximus-v-motherboards/maximus-v-formula-ln2-ocing-preview-from-shamino-andre/3/

another good guide you PM'ed me some time ago was the one made by Woomack on ROG BIOSes:
http://www.overclockers.com/memory-overclocking-guide-ivy-bridge

how is your MVG doing? updated the BIOS to latest one yet? I have a thing to say about latest 3 BIOSes for MVE ... they seem to have a corrupted Load Defaults option (F5) ... on those BIOSes I need to Clear CMOS when I restore settings instead of Loading Defaults which causes some junk settings to appear in Tweak section and moreover Windows reports different things ... also those BIOSes have a weird stability issues above 49x multi if that happens just Clear CMOS and it should return to normal. still waiting on new revised BIOS for my board. The last "normal" BIOS before "stability improvements" was 704 on MVE.

by the way, here the Metro 2033 guide if you wondered what I was talking about before;
http://www.ign.com/wikis/metro-2033/Walkthrough

here's the one I personally used further in game for enlightened ending:
http://guides.gamepressure.com/metro2033/


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> At 4.5 i'm running 1.26 on Vcore. Highest core at 89c (ranging from 82-89) Running consistently at 81ish. I am using AS5 thermal paste and I'm positive its mounted properly.
> I'm not exactly sure what my stock volts are, seeing as since first post its run at a min of 4.3.


Yeah, auto will always apply too much voltage (it's a good thing for people that don't know what they're doing) because it stops them from clocking their processors too high and it also makes sure that it will always be stable up to a certain extent (1.3v+ so it seems for Ivy Bridge)

Munney: You should set your voltage to 1.20v manually and see if that is Intel Burn Test/Cinebench stable, if it's not move to 1.21 and see what happens and keep going till you're IBT/Cinebench stable.. This should reduce your temperature a lot if you can reduce the voltage needed. You may also like to play around with LLC and put it on medium (50%) or high (75%), this can reduce the vCore needed but will put more stress on the motherboard (which is okay to a certain extent).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yup, just one run is enough, but you NEED to check for WHEA Warnings in Event Logs, if they are there during the cinebench run then you need to adjust the vcore up until they go away
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - that's what I do, after that I can pass IBT no trouble (pretty much stopped using it since then because it generates awful temps under load).


I can't remember where the WHEA errors are located in the event viewer...








But so far at 4.6GHz with 2000MHz 10-10-10-28 with the Samsung RAM, anything over 2000 makes it unstable even at CAS11. Has anyone got any other advice for the Samsung RAM and overclocking with tertiary timings and such? I'm stuck at these settings now


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, auto will always apply too much voltage (it's a good thing for people that don't know what they're doing) because it stops them from clocking their processors too high and it also makes sure that it will always be stable up to a certain extent (1.3v+ so it seems for Ivy Bridge)
> Munney: You should set your voltage to 1.20v manually and see if that is Intel Burn Test/Cinebench stable, if it's not move to 1.21 and see what happens and keep going till you're IBT/Cinebench stable.. This should reduce your temperature a lot if you can reduce the voltage needed. You may also like to play around with LLC and put it on medium (50%) or high (75%), this can reduce the vCore needed but will put more stress on the motherboard (which is okay to a certain extent).
> I can't remember where the WHEA errors are located in the event viewer...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But so far at 4.6GHz with 2000MHz 10-10-10-28 with the Samsung RAM, anything over 2000 makes it unstable even at CAS11. Has anyone got any other advice for the Samsung RAM and overclocking with tertiary timings and such? I'm stuck at these settings now


That's the downside with this sticks, you don't get an xmp profile to base on for tweaking from there and some boards like my Gigabyte ud5h didn't play nice with them on auto.
I'd say take a look at someone else's mem tweakit screenshot and copy the timings, or use Sin0822 bios screenshots as a base. Normally you leave stuff on the value which auto puts it and tighten stuff individually till you get instability at a given clock rate.
There are a few things you need to know:
-These sticks favor this sort of timings 9-10-10-21-1t or even 9-9-10-21-1t. (higher clocks would net you 10-11-11-26 or 9-12-12-21-1t with more volts, or the most common 10-11-11-26-1t)
-They scale with voltage up to 1.7v more or less, but less is preferred. Sometimes voltage hinders your oc with these
-The Twl or twcl value should be a few notches away from the cas value, cause it determines the delay to write to cas again. You won't be able to boot with it in auto or you won't see performance increases with tighter cas if you don't tweak it. cl9 would need twcl 7, cl10 - twcl 8. (check techpowerup's Samsung ram ocing guide for more info on this)
-Depending on your cpu's ic and ram chips you may be able to get away with tighter tertiaries which boost your bandwidth significantly but also make the oc require more voltage (be it vdimm, vccsa/vccio or both)
-Have fun and test with memtest86+ at boot first to see if it passes a few rounds before going head on to Windows, and then test efficiency with maxxmem/aida/superpi32m or 8m


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's the downside with this sticks, you don't get an xmp profile to base on for tweaking from there and some boards like my Gigabyte ud5h didn't play nice with them on auto.
> I'd say take a look at someone else's mem tweakit screenshot and copy the timings, or use Sin0822 bios screenshots as a base. Normally you leave stuff on the value which auto puts it and tighten stuff individually till you get instability at a given clock rate.
> There are a few things you need to know:
> -These sticks favor this sort of timings 9-10-10-21-1t or even 9-9-10-21-1t. (higher clocks would net you 10-11-11-26 or 9-12-12-21-1t with more volts, or the most common 10-11-11-26-1t)
> -They scale with voltage up to 1.7v more or less, but less is preferred. Sometimes voltage hinders your oc with these
> -The Twl or twcl value should be a few notches away from the cas value, cause it determines the delay to write to cas again. You won't be able to boot with it in auto or you won't see performance increases with tighter cas if you don't tweak it. cl9 would need twcl 7, cl10 - twcl 8. (check techpowerup's Samsung ram ocing guide for more info on this)
> -Depending on your cpu's ic and ram chips you may be able to get away with tighter tertiaries which boost your bandwidth significantly but also make the oc require more voltage (be it vdimm, vccsa/vccio or both)
> -Have fun and test with memtest86+ at boot first to see if it passes a few rounds before going head on to Windows, and then test efficiency with maxxmem/aida/superpi32m or 8m


Cheers, well i'm 1Hr prime95 stable at 97% RAM usage with the above settings. I'll try 1T for now. I'll also try going to 9-9-19-21 first though. I'll have a look at the Twl/Twcl value too.
The IMC on an Ivy should be fine to do 2133 though yes?
+Rep all the way,

I don't like using bootable programs for memory testing.. I prefer stuff such as the windows based memtest but I'll give memtest x86 a go I suppose.


----------



## Valgaur

So... found my chip... Intel lost it.......


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So... found my chip... Intel lost it.......


So what actually happened?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> So what actually happened?


usps ays it was delivered... intel never got it. but called usps then they said a guy with such name from intel got it. called intel and told them who so they are doing a man hunt lol. Should be getting info right away either tomorrow or monday they will be giving me 2 day overnight shipping


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> usps ays it was delivered... intel never got it. but called usps then they said a guy with such name from intel got it. called intel and told them who so they are doing a man hunt lol. Should be getting info right away either tomorrow or monday they will be giving me 2 day overnight shipping


Haha wow, that's very odd.. At least you sorted it out!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> usps ays it was delivered... intel never got it. but called usps then they said a guy with such name from intel got it. called intel and told them who so they are doing a man hunt lol. Should be getting info right away either tomorrow or monday they will be giving me 2 day overnight shipping
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha wow, that's very odd.. At least you sorted it out!
Click to expand...

Intel has GREAT customer service and are very loyal to their customers.









What Vdimm should I run my RAM at? 1.50, 1.60, 1.65, or 1.70?


----------



## PCWargamer

@ *ivanlabrie* ,*feniks*, a question. On the link feniks posted (http://www.overclockers.com/memory-overclocking-guide-ivy-bridge) it noted the following:

- *VCCSA* ( IMC / System Agent ) - memory controller voltage , can be helpful above 2400+ or while setting really low timings, I haven't seen any difference above 1.35V for 3000+ memory clock.
- *VCCIO* ( VTT / QPI ) - main voltage to play with while overclocking memory, Intel's safe is also max MVG value - 1.4V for sub zero cooling, hard to say how much you will need for max clocks but it shouldn't be more than ~1.35V for DDR3-2800.
- *VDIMM* / Memory voltage - this is quite clear, max for most kits is about 1.9V ( like PSC ) but some IC may need 2V+ to make max clocks or low timings on higher clocks ( BBSE, Micron D9 ) and also will need sub zero cooling.

My question: I have had several MBs for SB and IB and none of them has had the VCCIO adjustment. The other two, yes. But not the VCCIO which he notes as "main voltage to play with while overclocking memory" which is a problem for me.

I can, and have, adjusted the other two and acheived some limited success doing so, but I always wanted to do better and I keep seeing that VCCIO setting I can't find or adjust as maybe the answer to the problem of doing better at mem OCing.

So, if my BIOSs does not have it, then those boards with that kind of BIOS just can't do serious mem OCing? Or is there something else I can do?

Thanks bros!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> @ *ivanlabrie* ,*feniks*, a question. On the link feniks posted (http://www.overclockers.com/memory-overclocking-guide-ivy-bridge) it noted the following:
> - *VCCSA* ( IMC / System Agent ) - memory controller voltage , can be helpful above 2400+ or while setting really low timings, I haven't seen any difference above 1.35V for 3000+ memory clock.
> - *VCCIO* ( VTT / QPI ) - main voltage to play with while overclocking memory, Intel's safe is also max MVG value - 1.4V for sub zero cooling, hard to say how much you will need for max clocks but it shouldn't be more than ~1.35V for DDR3-2800.
> - *VDIMM* / Memory voltage - this is quite clear, max for most kits is about 1.9V ( like PSC ) but some IC may need 2V+ to make max clocks or low timings on higher clocks ( BBSE, Micron D9 ) and also will need sub zero cooling.
> My question: I have had several MBs for SB and IB and none of them has had the VCCIO adjustment. The other two, yes. But not the VCCIO which he notes as "main voltage to play with while overclocking memory" which is a problem for me.
> I can, and have, adjusted the other two and acheived some limited success doing so, but I always wanted to do better and I keep seeing that VCCIO setting I can't find or adjust as maybe the answer to the problem of doing better at mem OCing.
> So, if my BIOSs does not have it, then those boards with that kind of BIOS just can't do serious mem OCing? Or is there something else I can do?
> Thanks bros!


I know this question was not aimed at me, but in the BIOS VCCIO can be reffered to at VTT (Pretty sure that's what Gigabyte has it on all boards) and QPI is a possibility on other boards.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yes. To join you must first read all 6000+ post. There is also a test after that. And that is just the start! But it is worth it, and not really needed..., but lots of good stuff if you ever wanted to read through some of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that your before temps *MunneY*? Cause they are too high for a delided chip.....
> 
> 
> 
> I've stated a couple of times I haven't de-lidded yet. I'm just trying to figure out where I stand as of right now. at 4.4 I'm completely stable and under 90c. at 4.5 here are the results.
> 
> After 10 minutes (ignore the timestamps on realtemp)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After 30 minutes (again ignore Realtemp time)
Click to expand...

Sorry I missed that you were not delided yet. Yep, great idea to get before temps so you can see the improvement - makes it even better once you have delidded as you know just how much better you are for doing it!

And looking at your temps for 4.5GHz you really will be better off once you are delidded! Enough testing as you are already hitting TJMax of 105C - not good for your chip, so no need to do it anymore. Your chip will benefit from a delid! Looking forward to seeing your temps for the same OC once you are delidded!!!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> @ *ivanlabrie* ,*feniks*, a question. On the link feniks posted (http://www.overclockers.com/memory-overclocking-guide-ivy-bridge) it noted the following:
> - *VCCSA* ( IMC / System Agent ) - memory controller voltage , can be helpful above 2400+ or while setting really low timings, I haven't seen any difference above 1.35V for 3000+ memory clock.
> - *VCCIO* ( VTT / QPI ) - main voltage to play with while overclocking memory, Intel's safe is also max MVG value - 1.4V for sub zero cooling, hard to say how much you will need for max clocks but it shouldn't be more than ~1.35V for DDR3-2800.
> - *VDIMM* / Memory voltage - this is quite clear, max for most kits is about 1.9V ( like PSC ) but some IC may need 2V+ to make max clocks or low timings on higher clocks ( BBSE, Micron D9 ) and also will need sub zero cooling.
> My question: I have had several MBs for SB and IB and none of them has had the VCCIO adjustment. The other two, yes. But not the VCCIO which he notes as "main voltage to play with while overclocking memory" which is a problem for me.
> I can, and have, adjusted the other two and acheived some limited success doing so, but I always wanted to do better and I keep seeing that VCCIO setting I can't find or adjust as maybe the answer to the problem of doing better at mem OCing.
> So, if my BIOSs does not have it, then those boards with that kind of BIOS just can't do serious mem OCing? Or is there something else I can do?
> Thanks bros!
> 
> 
> 
> I know this question was not aimed at me, but in the BIOS VCCIO can be reffered to at VTT (Pretty sure that's what Gigabyte has it on all boards) and QPI is a possibility on other boards.
Click to expand...

There is no problem with anyone who has something to add answering on this thread *Matt-Matt*!







We are a community here with lots of OC'ers who know all kinds of good OCing stuff! Anyone who knows something that might help another OCer is wellcome to answer. So thanks!

I have looked for the alternate names and have not found them either. I just wonder if some BIOS has better mem OCing support than others, as I know some of my MBs BIOS did have better or worse CPU OCing options. And maybe all of the MBs I am using just do not have the best mem OCing options in their BIOS - particularly the VCCIO. Hope there is more to it than that and something else I can do....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Cheers, well i'm 1Hr prime95 stable at 97% RAM usage with the above settings. I'll try 1T for now. I'll also try going to 9-9-19-21 first though. I'll have a look at the Twl/Twcl value too.
> The IMC on an Ivy should be fine to do 2133 though yes?
> +Rep all the way,
> I don't like using bootable programs for memory testing.. I prefer stuff such as the windows based memtest but I'll give memtest x86 a go I suppose.


I meant it's better to start with that instead of borking your Os install, but if you have an SSD reinstalling Windows ain't such a big deal lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Intel has GREAT customer service and are very loyal to their customers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What Vdimm should I run my RAM at? 1.50, 1.60, 1.65, or 1.70?


I'd try 1.65v and see what I can get with that, max 1.75v for benching on air and 1.7v for some safe but more 'extreme' overclocks.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> @ *ivanlabrie* ,*feniks*, a question. On the link feniks posted (http://www.overclockers.com/memory-overclocking-guide-ivy-bridge) it noted the following:
> - *VCCSA* ( IMC / System Agent ) - memory controller voltage , can be helpful above 2400+ or while setting really low timings, I haven't seen any difference above 1.35V for 3000+ memory clock.
> - *VCCIO* ( VTT / QPI ) - main voltage to play with while overclocking memory, Intel's safe is also max MVG value - 1.4V for sub zero cooling, hard to say how much you will need for max clocks but it shouldn't be more than ~1.35V for DDR3-2800.
> - *VDIMM* / Memory voltage - this is quite clear, max for most kits is about 1.9V ( like PSC ) but some IC may need 2V+ to make max clocks or low timings on higher clocks ( BBSE, Micron D9 ) and also will need sub zero cooling.
> My question: I have had several MBs for SB and IB and none of them has had the VCCIO adjustment. The other two, yes. But not the VCCIO which he notes as "main voltage to play with while overclocking memory" which is a problem for me.
> I can, and have, adjusted the other two and acheived some limited success doing so, but I always wanted to do better and I keep seeing that VCCIO setting I can't find or adjust as maybe the answer to the problem of doing better at mem OCing.
> So, if my BIOSs does not have it, then those boards with that kind of BIOS just can't do serious mem OCing? Or is there something else I can do?
> Thanks bros!


I think your question has been answered, albeit partially...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> There is no problem with anyone who has something to add answering on this thread *Matt-Matt*!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We are a community here with lots of OC'ers who know all kinds of good OCing stuff! Anyone who knows something that might help another OCer is wellcome to answer. So thanks!
> I have looked for the alternate names and have not found them either. I just wonder if some BIOS has better mem OCing support than others, as I know some of my MBs BIOS did have better or worse CPU OCing options. And maybe all of the MBs I am using just do not have the best mem OCing options in their BIOS - particularly the VCCIO. Hope there is more to it than that and something else I can do....


Some bioses DO have better ram overclocking ability, that's why I got my Maximus V Gene, it's pretty much one of the best at that, and everything that has to do with overclocking in general whilst being relatively cheap. The Sabertooth z77 has been known to have some issues overclocking and is a bit pricey for what it does, but well...I still find it odd that it has no qpi/vtt/vccio voltage to change.
Gigabyte has relatively decent ram overclocking, and Asrock OC Formula a bit better, but Asus ROG boards are still the best (or Crosshair V Z am3+ paired with an fx8150/fx8350 for absolute max clocks)


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I meant it's better to start with that instead of borking your Os install, but if you have an SSD reinstalling Windows ain't such a big deal lol
> )


I have NEVER had a problem with the RAM corrupting my Windows 7 install.. Call me lucky I guess?








Using it now anyway, good program to test just the RAM itself seeing as I know my CPU is 20 hours P95 stable.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry, can you explain Hynix? Complete loss at that term.


Hynix is one of the many companies who make the actually memory ICs on the various available sticks.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Some bioses DO have better ram overclocking ability, that's why I got my Maximus V Gene, it's pretty much one of the best at that, and everything that has to do with overclocking in general whilst being relatively cheap. The Sabertooth z77 has been known to have some issues overclocking and is a bit pricey for what it does, but well...I still find it odd that it has no qpi/vtt/vccio voltage to change.
> Gigabyte has relatively decent ram overclocking, and Asrock OC Formula a bit better, but Asus ROG boards are still the best (or Crosshair V Z am3+ paired with an fx8150/fx8350 for absolute max clocks)


Thanks *ivanlabrie*. I was hoping for better, but that's what I figured.







And the Sabertooth, although not a bad board, has been a dissapointment when it comes to OC ability. Mainly with mem and the missing VCCIO I would expect from this board. Overpriced for what it does is correct. I will look for another board next time.

MVG is a great board for OCing, but I do SLI and have a soundcard, so not enough slots.

When do you get your new chip and/or MB back? It seems it is taking forever.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, just experimented with nvidia inspector and downsampling a higher resolution to force some fullscreen antialiasing in all games...wow! My 1280x1024 crt looks amazing now lol
Metro 2033 slowed down with some hiccups into the 25fps area but it's mostly smooth. (and btw thanks for the guide Feniks...)


----------



## HardwareDecoder

hey it seems I can run 4.7ghz on a 212 evo not de-lidded @ 1.4 V max temp is 100c on one core in IBT (hottest app on the planet) other cores are 90 97 93.

I know even prime95 as far as I can remember never gets it this hot.

So my question is since I will just be gaming 99% of the time and never reach anywhere near 100c is this safe for every day use or should I just go back down to 4.6 @ 1.350 or 4.5 @ 1.290? I am not planning on delidding cause I can't afford a new processor should something bad happen.


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> hey it seems I can run 4.7ghz on a 212 evo not de-lidded @ 1.4 V max temp is 100c on one core in IBT (hottest app on the planet) other cores are 90 97 93.
> I know even prime95 as far as I can remember never gets it this hot.
> So my question is since I will just be gaming 99% of the time and never reach anywhere near 100c is this safe for every day use or should I just go back down to 4.6 @ 1.350 or 4.5 @ 1.290? I am not planning on delidding cause I can't afford a new processor should something bad happen.


If you are just gaming, from what I've read 4.5 is more than enough. The returns you get from 4.5-4.6 are hardly noticeable in a non benching scenario. Cooler temps until games demand more


----------



## LukeJoseph

So I debating selling my 3570k on CL for a slight loss and getting another. I am pretty sure I have the worst one I have read about on here. It takes a 1.5 vcore for 4.6 stable. Heat isn't a issue, it's all vcore. I am stable at 1.36 @ 4500.....

Opinions?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> So I debating selling my 3570k on CL for a slight loss and getting another. I am pretty sure I have the worst one I have read about on here. It takes a 1.5 vcore for 4.6 stable. Heat isn't a issue, it's all vcore. I am stable at 1.36 @ 4500.....
> Opinions?


sell it and get a 3770k if you are gonna bother replacing it I'd say go big or go home. Just my 2 cents


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yep, try to get a discounted 3770k and a board from Microcenter...upgrade the board and sell your current stuff as a bundle for profit.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, auto will always apply too much voltage (it's a good thing for people that don't know what they're doing) because it stops them from clocking their processors too high and it also makes sure that it will always be stable up to a certain extent (1.3v+ so it seems for Ivy Bridge)
> Munney: You should set your voltage to 1.20v manually and see if that is Intel Burn Test/Cinebench stable, if it's not move to 1.21 and see what happens and keep going till you're IBT/Cinebench stable.. This should reduce your temperature a lot if you can reduce the voltage needed. You may also like to play around with LLC and put it on medium (50%) or high (75%), this can reduce the vCore needed but will put more stress on the motherboard (which is okay to a certain extent).
> I can't remember where the WHEA errors are located in the event viewer...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But so far at 4.6GHz with 2000MHz 10-10-10-28 with the Samsung RAM, anything over 2000 makes it unstable even at CAS11. Has anyone got any other advice for the Samsung RAM and overclocking with tertiary timings and such? I'm stuck at these settings now


check for WHEA warnings by going to Windows Event Viewer. either type "eventvwr.msc" (without quotation marks and hit enter) from Taskbar Run/Search or r-click Computer, select Manage, select Event Logs, then Custom View and finally Administrative View - WHEA warnings will be logged in there if they occurred.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, just experimented with nvidia inspector and downsampling a higher resolution to force some fullscreen antialiasing in all games...wow! My 1280x1024 crt looks amazing now lol
> Metro 2033 slowed down with some hiccups into the 25fps area but it's mostly smooth. (and btw thanks for the guide Feniks...)


no probs! have fun








I am currently playing STALKER Shadow of Chernobyl with hi-res texture pack (and some other mods) ...







awesome game after I set everything to max details and quality. recently purchased the whole series on Steam during Summer Sale event, but didn't have time to play. SOC is the first oldest part, glad I haven't played it without the mod pack! now it's awesome, MUCH better than stock game


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> usps ays it was delivered... intel never got it. but called usps then they said a guy with such name from intel got it. called intel and told them who so they are doing a man hunt lol. Should be getting info right away either tomorrow or monday they will be giving me 2 day overnight shipping


LOL! so intel employee misplaced a returned chip? LMAO ... something like that happened to me in Western Digital after I sent them both WD Caviar Green drives for replacement, they lost one, so after a week of zero progress on that RMA case (in meantime received already the replacement for another one) I asked what up with that and sent them UPS tracking saying it was delivered ... they sent out a replacement right away ... I bet they never found the one which got lost LOL. anyways, good luck with RMA


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I can't remember where the WHEA errors are located in the event viewer...












so i was playing bf3 with my new 7970, maxed out settings (ultra etc) but i saw tearing,
didnt know to high fps could cause that, was looking for a answer online,
1 option was, enable vsync in game, worked very well, no more tearing,
but fps now stays close to 60fps... pity to have a great vid card, running only 60 fps,
is there something else i can do, and still have high fps?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

you can even set up even viewer to pop up a box on the desktop when it has a whea error. Makes it pretty easy to know when you are getting them. You basically right click on a whea error, hit attach task to this event and then tell it to display a message.

I have mine say: NOT AGAIN!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> @ *ivanlabrie* ,*feniks*, a question. On the link feniks posted (http://www.overclockers.com/memory-overclocking-guide-ivy-bridge) it noted the following:
> - *VCCSA* ( IMC / System Agent ) - memory controller voltage , can be helpful above 2400+ or while setting really low timings, I haven't seen any difference above 1.35V for 3000+ memory clock.
> - *VCCIO* ( VTT / QPI ) - main voltage to play with while overclocking memory, Intel's safe is also max MVG value - 1.4V for sub zero cooling, hard to say how much you will need for max clocks but it shouldn't be more than ~1.35V for DDR3-2800.
> - *VDIMM* / Memory voltage - this is quite clear, max for most kits is about 1.9V ( like PSC ) but some IC may need 2V+ to make max clocks or low timings on higher clocks ( BBSE, Micron D9 ) and also will need sub zero cooling.
> My question: I have had several MBs for SB and IB and none of them has had the VCCIO adjustment. The other two, yes. But not the VCCIO which he notes as "main voltage to play with while overclocking memory" which is a problem for me.
> I can, and have, adjusted the other two and acheived some limited success doing so, but I always wanted to do better and I keep seeing that VCCIO setting I can't find or adjust as maybe the answer to the problem of doing better at mem OCing.
> So, if my BIOSs does not have it, then those boards with that kind of BIOS just can't do serious mem OCing? Or is there something else I can do?
> Thanks bros!


Yeah, that's what I heard about some (cheaper) boards' BIOS ... I used only ASUS ROG & EVGA FTW models with modern chips and both of those have all the mentioned voltages in there. Sometimes manufacturers just name things differently and VCCIO is same as VTT or QPI on other boards ... other than that I heard about (I think it was Asrock) one company swapping the names for VCCIO & VCCSA







in their BIOS ... after you said ... I think I read once about somebody complaining in forums that Sabertooth didn't have VCCIO adjustment? kinda sucks if true ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I know this question was not aimed at me, but in the BIOS VCCIO can be reffered to at VTT (Pretty sure that's what Gigabyte has it on all boards) and QPI is a possibility on other boards.


yup, it's a mess, however I think some boards plainly don't have that voltage adjustment at all ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I have NEVER had a problem with the RAM corrupting my Windows 7 install.. Call me lucky I guess?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Using it now anyway, good program to test just the RAM itself seeing as I know my CPU is 20 hours P95 stable.










I did many times in past ... since then I am always running MemTest86+ 4.20 for at least 1 full pass before I even boot to Windows on altered memory settings ... for daily use I prefer an overnight run under MemTest and if I see even a single red error I never use it for daily running, it either needs tweaking (until error free) or is only good for short term benching ... or OS gets corrupted ... eventually ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks *ivanlabrie*. I was hoping for better, but that's what I figured.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And the Sabertooth, although not a bad board, has been a dissapointment when it comes to OC ability. Mainly with mem and the missing VCCIO I would expect from this board. Overpriced for what it does is correct. I will look for another board next time.
> MVG is a great board for OCing, but I do SLI and have a soundcard, so not enough slots.
> When do you get your new chip and/or MB back? It seems it is taking forever.....


Sorry to hear, so no VCCIO or anything similar in this BIOS? it must suck terribly without VCCIO adjustment ... if that is a new board maybe return it to the store and get MVG instead? MVG is actually an awesome board and personally I am very impressed with ROG family BIOSes ... they do have their hiccups here and there, but generally it feels like XXI century finally ... can't say that about EVGA FTW BIOSes I used not long ago (felt like XIX century) ...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> you can even set up even viewer to pop up a box on the desktop when it has a whea error. Makes it pretty easy to know when you are getting them. You basically right click on a whea error, hit attach task to this event and then tell it to display a message.
> I have mine say: NOT AGAIN!


that is SO COOL IDEA!







thanks man, never thought of that! rep+


----------



## Swag

I just finished trying out all different possibilities for my RAM config and it seems that 2133 is my golden speed.







2400 will only pass if I use 1.65vdimm and I don't want that.

Also, I personally think that WHEA errors are a complete waste of time to even acknowledge.


----------



## Hokies83

Damn got everything finished went to boot up and gigabyte error code 51... time to see what that is..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn got everything finished went to boot up and gigabyte error code 51... time to see what that is..


What happened? Did you re-assemble your PC and now you got that error?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> that is SO COOL IDEA!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks man, never thought of that! rep+


thanks yea I forget how I stumbled on to that knowledge but i'm pretty sure it was just me fumbling around with stuff when I used to get tons of whea errors learning to OC ivy bridge. Luckily I have no seen a whea error in several months it is a good feeling









bad part is I have several other things set up to pop up boxes also and I am always scared for a sec its a whea error lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn got everything finished went to boot up and gigabyte error code 51... time to see what that is..


let me know what you find about code 51, i dont have it in my error code list..only 0x50
0x50 = RAM timings/Frequency or uncore multi unstable, increase RAM voltage or adjust QPI/VTT, or lower uncore if you're higher than 2x


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just finished trying out all different possibilities for my RAM config and it seems that 2133 is my golden speed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2400 will only pass if I use 1.65vdimm and I don't want that.
> Also, I personally think that WHEA errors are a complete waste of time to even acknowledge.


there is a potential risk of running 1.65V on RAM if it was rated at 1.50V, I'd leave it for benching only and settle lower as well for daily use. mine were rated at 1.65V so for daily use I stay at 1.70V max.

Man, you are so wrong on WHEA warnings ... I guess when you ignore them then you will have occasional crashes in demanding games (BF3 is a great example) sometimes and will start messing with drivers, re-installing the game (since only that title causes trouble, etc. etc.) and half of the OS before you realize it's been your unstable CPU OC all along







have seen that at least a dozen times in EVGA forums ... you should be glad that with Ivy Bridge you have such warning delivered to you in Windows, it's like the chip itself saying "Your overclock sucks, give me more vcore or I will crap out!"









WHEA stands for Windows Hardware Error Architecture. it means that CPU discovered a recoverable error during some computation and corrected itself, so the software relying on that computation haven't even noticed, without it that would be a crash (if that was unrecoverable error).
The other downside of running a CPU OC with WHEA warnings present is lowered performance which is perfectly visible in erratic or rather varying by a lot scores or plainly lower than expected scores, since the CPU is wasting its time on correcting itself many times.


----------



## Hokies83

I left the cpu in.. hs may be to tight gonna loosen it up.

i get 15 to 51 which is north bridge to ram.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I left the cpu in.. hs may be to tight gonna loosen it up.
> i get 15 to 51 which is north bridge to ram.


just found this,

"Hi guys,

I've just bought a new Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD5H and an i5-3570K. I have 2x4GB DDR3 Kingston KHX1866C9D3/4G.

My problem is that I'm *getting the error code 51* when I connect a memory at the slots 1 or 3 of my MOBO. I know that this problem it's about Memory initialization error, but I'm not really getting it!

*When I plug the memorys at the slots 2 or 4 everything runs well*. I've tried to connect an extra DDR3 at slots 1 ou 3 and the error happened again!

Can you pleaze help me with this? Thanks"

http://www.overclock.net/t/1278969/gigabyte-ga-z77x-ud5h-error-code-51


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just finished trying out all different possibilities for my RAM config and it seems that 2133 is my golden speed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2400 will only pass if I use 1.65vdimm and I don't want that.
> Also, I personally think that WHEA errors are a complete waste of time to even acknowledge.
> 
> 
> 
> there is a potential risk of running 1.65V on RAM if it was rated at 1.50V, I'd leave it for benching only and settle lower as well for daily use. mine were rated at 1.65V so for daily use I stay at 1.70V max.
> 
> Man, you are so wrong on WHEA warnings ... I guess when you ignore them then you will have occasional crashes in demanding games (BF3 is a great example) sometimes and will start messing with drivers, re-installing the game (since only that title causes trouble, etc. etc.) and half of the OS before you realize it's been your unstable CPU OC all along
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have seen that at least a dozen times in EVGA forums ... you should be glad that with Ivy Bridge you have such warning delivered to you in Windows, it's like the chip itself saying "Your overclock sucks, give me more vcore or I will crap out!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WHEA stands for Windows Hardware Error Architecture. it means that CPU discovered a recoverable error during some computation and corrected itself, so the software relying on that computation haven't even noticed, without it that would be a crash (if that was unrecoverable error).
> The other downside of running a CPU OC with WHEA warnings present is lowered performance which is perfectly visible in erratic or rather varying by a lot scores or plainly lower than expected scores, since the CPU is wasting its time on correcting itself many times.
Click to expand...

Actually, I've had WHEA errors on some of my OCs (not my current one), and it has made no effect on anything. I still produced the same benchmark results and had no errors on anything.


----------



## ivanlabrie

To Feniks: Check out this thread...
I'm testing out the games I have and MAN it makes a difference, Mass Effect 1 for example looks AMAZING! lol


----------



## Hokies83

LoL yah man my ram was in the right slots =p

When i remove one from the slots it boots which leads me to think the HS is to tight.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually, I've had WHEA errors on some of my OCs (not my current one), and it has made no effect on anything. I still produced the same benchmark results and had no errors on anything.


Well here is the question, were you getting constant whea errors or were you getting like 2-3 a day type whea errors? if you were only getting 2-3 a day then you were 'almost' stable as in 1-2 vcore bumps were probably going to solve it. So basically the proc was only correcting its self 2-3 times a day.

If you were getting constant whea errors then you were 100% mathematically speaking..... losing performance because like feniks said the proc was doing the same math atleast twice.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL yah man my ram was in the right slots =p
> When i remove one from the slots it boots which leads me to think the HS is to tight.


I had that issue with a chip I FAILED at delidding and I damaged the memory controller (my only attempt at delidding







) so this chip could have a damaged memory controller or one of the mobo pins could be bent? Just throwing ideas out


----------



## c2thew

overclock attempt at 4.4 success but the temperatures are kinda high.

overclock attempt at 4.7 failed. windows crashed.

Help! I'm completely new to overclocking as my computer is actually my first cpu build from parts. I did the delid and have been happy with the lower idle temperatures, however I need some advice on how to overclock my cpu to 4.6ghz since I will be overclocking using a hyper 212 evo cooler. I've only tweaked the memory speeds, but i'm not quite sure how to tweak the cpu speeds other than to change the multiplier to 46. I attached screenshots of my two tests.

the data also suggests that the core 1 and core 3 temperatures are vastly different. Perhaps i didn't apply the TIM evenly on the cpu die?

i'm willing to try different settings, but i don't quite understand what voltage offset is.

Motherboard/bios = asrock extreme 4 z77 latest bios.
Cpu cooler hyper 212 evo
TIM = mx-4

any help would be awesome!


----------



## Hokies83

chip has been de lidded for 2 months with ram running fine.

did not remove cpu from cpu bracket when i changed to my water loop.

i just think the Water block is to tight i got it down as hard as i could get it heh...

anywho here is some pics...

*I dub thee the Valguar why you mad bro? Re build.*.


----------



## ivanlabrie

He delidded it fine...I think the WB is clamped down TOO tight.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually, I've had WHEA errors on some of my OCs (not my current one), and it has made no effect on anything. I still produced the same benchmark results and had no errors on anything.
> 
> 
> 
> Well here is the question, were you getting constant whea errors or were you getting like 2-3 a day type whea errors? if you were only getting 2-3 a day then you were 'almost' stable as in 1-2 vcore bumps were probably going to solve it. So basically the proc was only correcting its self 2-3 times a day.
> 
> If you were getting constant whea errors then you were 100% mathematically speaking..... losing performance because like feniks said the proc was doing the same math atleast twice.
Click to expand...

I don't want to start a WHEA war again, but I've tried both cases and they both resulted in very similar benchmark results. Considering that if the CPU has to do the same math twice, it should be significantly slower. I have also contacted the Microsoft WHEA team pertaining to OCs and this error and they have informed me that it may result in a bad OC but this is no way to determine efficiency.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> overclock attempt at 4.4 success but the temperatures are kinda high.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> overclock attempt at 4.7 failed. windows crashed.
> Help! I'm completely new to overclocking as my computer is actually my first cpu build from parts. I did the delid and have been happy with the lower idle temperatures, however I need some advice on how to overclock my cpu to 4.6ghz since I will be overclocking using a hyper 212 evo cooler. I've only tweaked the memory speeds, but i'm not quite sure how to tweak the cpu speeds other than to change the multiplier to 46. I attached screenshots of my two tests.
> the data also suggests that the core 1 and core 3 temperatures are vastly different. Perhaps i didn't apply the TIM evenly on the cpu die?
> i'm willing to try different settings, but i don't quite understand what voltage offset is.
> Motherboard/bios = asrock extreme 4 z77 latest bios.
> Cpu cooler hyper 212 evo
> TIM = mx-4
> any help would be awesome!


ahh same mobo + cooler + chip as me.

your temps @ 4.4 look fine to me on a 212 I'm curious what your vcore is though. i guess you said you de-lid so maybe they are a bit high idk.

Well for one thing core temps being different is completely normal. How did you apply the tim? best method is the single dot in the middle ( i use less than a grain of rice my self)

Second I don't know if most would agree with me but I prefer to use fixed voltage mode to overclock. Which LLC level are you using? I recommend level 3


----------



## Hokies83

I need some led fans to put on the 80mm 240 rad in the bottom XD


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> To Feniks: Check out this thread...
> I'm testing out the games I have and MAN it makes a difference, Mass Effect 1 for example looks AMAZING! lol


interesting!







will take a look tomorrow and see what I can do with it in older titles I am playing (Stalker:SOC or Crysis1).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL yah man my ram was in the right slots =p
> When i remove one from the slots it boots which leads me to think the HS is to tight.


it could be something simple as you said (overtightened cooler), but it can also mean something wrong with the board (check for bent pins first in CPU socket; also dead DIMM slots are possible) or something wrong with CPU's memory controller if it can't run Dual Channel ...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> overclock attempt at 4.4 success but the temperatures are kinda high.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> overclock attempt at 4.7 failed. windows crashed.
> Help! I'm completely new to overclocking as my computer is actually my first cpu build from parts. I did the delid and have been happy with the lower idle temperatures, however I need some advice on how to overclock my cpu to 4.6ghz since I will be overclocking using a hyper 212 evo cooler. I've only tweaked the memory speeds, but i'm not quite sure how to tweak the cpu speeds other than to change the multiplier to 46. I attached screenshots of my two tests.
> the data also suggests that the core 1 and core 3 temperatures are vastly different. Perhaps i didn't apply the TIM evenly on the cpu die?
> i'm willing to try different settings, but i don't quite understand what voltage offset is.
> Motherboard/bios = asrock extreme 4 z77 latest bios.
> Cpu cooler hyper 212 evo
> TIM = mx-4
> any help would be awesome!


your temps look high to me,
maybe try a remount, see if it improves temps?
what tim are you using on the die?

if everything is good, the difference between cores should be about 4 to 6C,
your cooler should be enough to keep it cool now, after delid,
mine is more then enough too..

best is to let your memory at default settings, if you oc your chip,
to rule out crashes from ram..
try 1.3V vcore for the 4.6ghz oc, if it works , work your way down till it crashes again,
you can try adjust some other settings, like cpu pll, its default at 1.8V,
some take it down to 1.5V, it could help make your oc stable,
i use 1.65-1.7V most of the time

first find your stable vcore with fixed vcore,
if you have that, you can use offset, its a bit harder to understand,
took me some time to understand it ..lol


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> your temps look high to me,
> maybe try a remount, see if it improves temps?
> what tim are you using on the die?
> if everything is good, the difference between cores should be about 4 to 6C,
> your cooler should be enough to keep it cool now, after delid,
> mine is more then enough too..
> best is to let your memory at default settings, if you oc your chip,
> to rule out crashes from ram..


my cores some times have 10c difference from the lowest to the hottest. This has never changed from numerous tim applications (even though each tim application is 99% the same since I just put a dot in the middle)

I think it is one of those each chip is a bit different things. Although 15-20c difference would likely indicate an issue.'
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> interesting!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will take a look tomorrow and see what I can do with it in older titles I am playing (Stalker:SOC or Crysis1).
> it could be something simple as you said (overtightened cooler), but it can also mean something wrong with the board (check for bent pins first in CPU socket; also dead DIMM slots are possible) or something wrong with CPU's memory controller if it can't run Dual Channel ...


yep! everything I said basically but good point about simply dead dimm slots I forgot about the simple answer


----------



## c2thew

i'll take some pictures of my setup in the a.m. to see what the issue might be for my temperatures.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> my cores some times have 10c difference from the lowest to the hottest. This has never changed from numerous tim applications (even though each tim application is 99% the same since I just put a dot in the middle)
> I think it is one of those each chip is a bit different things. Although 15-20c difference would likely indicate an issue.'


ever tried to look if your ihs or base plate cooler is concave?
10C and above difference between cores is to much if you ask me,
before delid mine where about 10-15C apart also,
now its more like 4-6C..
not saying every chip is the same, but thats what i see around here..

some say the difference in core temps has to do with the cpu/die layout,
1 core is next to the igpu..

not sure if its true tho


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ever tried to look if your ihs or base plate cooler is concave?
> 10C and above difference between cores is to much if you ask me,
> before delid mine where about 10-15C apart also,
> now its more like 4-6C..
> not saying every chip is the same, but thats what i see around here..


i don't think anything is concave. Nothing I could really do about it anyway right?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> i don't think anything is concave. Nothing I could really do about it anyway right?


lapping it, is one solution, made a post about it a while ago,
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lapping it, is one solution, made a post about it a while ago,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749


Oh, nah that is certainly not for me I might as well just delid if I am going to do that since grinding away the writing on the ihs voids warranty. I'm not trying to void my warranty on this chip ( I know that is blasphemy around here )

Also I Just realized that 10c difference I only know for sure I saw that much on my recent trip in to 1.4v / 4.7ghz land.

It may be less difference at lower vcore / frequency/temps


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Oh, nah that is certainly not for me I might as well just delid if I am going to do that since grinding away the writing on the ihs voids warranty. I'm not trying to void my warranty on this chip ( I know that is blasphemy around here )
> Also I Just realized that 10c difference I only know for sure I saw that much on my recent trip in to 1.4v / 4.7ghz land.
> It may be less difference at lower vcore / frequency/temps


my bad, thought you where talking about a delidded one ..lol
then 10C temp difference is "normal", or more even, like my 15C difference before delid


----------



## Hokies83

Meh loosened HS till it was near falling off.. stiff code 51..

However i can run the 2 far right in single channel with out issue.

I never removed the CPU during this whole HS swap..

So 2 things must have happened...

1.. I tightened the HS so tight i bent a pin.

2 i tightened the Cpu so tight i damaged the pcb.

I was over due for a noob mistake and im fine running running single channel till Haswell "not like it is a big "performance loss or anything"
At that time i will trouble shoot the issue and see what it it.

I will also send a PM to Sin0822.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh loosened HS till it was near falling off.. stiff code 51..
> However i can run the 2 far right in single channel with out issue.
> I never removed the CPU during this whole HS swap..
> So 2 things must have happened...
> 1.. I tightened the HS so tight i bent a pin.
> 2 i tightened the Cpu so tight i damaged the pcb.
> I was over due for a noob mistake and im fine running running single channel till Haswell "not like it is a big "performance loss or anything"
> At that time i will trouble shoot the issue and see what it it.
> I will also send a PM to Sin0822.


Oh geez man I really think you damaged the IMC on the chip your situation is exactly like the one I damaged....I got an error on bootup and it would only run in single channel mode. Gave it to a friend for a budget pc build. I hear that single channel vs dual channel doesn't matter for gaming on the good news side...

Well not exactly like the one I damaged I clearly removed some green and copper from the chip i screwed


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh loosened HS till it was near falling off.. stiff code 51..
> However i can run the 2 far right in single channel with out issue.
> I never removed the CPU during this whole HS swap..
> So 2 things must have happened...
> 1.. I tightened the HS so tight i bent a pin.
> 2 i tightened the Cpu so tight i damaged the pcb.
> I was over due for a noob mistake and im fine running running single channel till Haswell "not like it is a big "performance loss or anything"
> At that time i will trouble shoot the issue and see what it it.
> I will also send a PM to Sin0822.


dang








hope its not the cpu..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh loosened HS till it was near falling off.. stiff code 51..
> 
> However i can run the 2 far right in single channel with out issue.
> 
> I never removed the CPU during this whole HS swap..
> 
> So 2 things must have happened...
> 
> 1.. I tightened the HS so tight i bent a pin.
> 
> 2 i tightened the Cpu so tight i damaged the pcb.
> 
> I was over due for a noob mistake and im fine running running single channel till Haswell "not like it is a big "performance loss or anything"
> At that time i will trouble shoot the issue and see what it it.
> 
> I will also send a PM to Sin0822.


Have you tried reassembling your entire PC again? Like how it was from the box. Just take everything apart. Also make sure the RAM is fully inserted (rookie mistake but I make it all the time)!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ever tried to look if your ihs or base plate cooler is concave?
> 10C and above difference between cores is to much if you ask me,
> before delid mine where about 10-15C apart also,
> now its more like 4-6C..
> not saying every chip is the same, but thats what i see around here..
> some say the difference in core temps has to do with the cpu/die layout,
> 1 core is next to the igpu..
> 
> not sure if its true tho


I'm pretty sure that lower temp on core0 (first one as reported in monitoring software) is the one right by iGPU, it always run cooler by significant degrees on every SB/IB chip I've seen.
other differences are most likely related to IHS concave (nearly all have them more or less) or bad TIM application on the die or wrong IHS placement (poor contact on last core) if chip was delided - did that twice on one single chip, my first deliding experience, had to redo it 3 times to make it all right, with the silicone sealant and all.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Oh, nah that is certainly not for me I might as well just delid if I am going to do that since grinding away the writing on the ihs voids warranty. I'm not trying to void my warranty on this chip ( I know that is blasphemy around here )
> Also I Just realized that 10c difference I only know for sure I saw that much on my recent trip in to 1.4v / 4.7ghz land.
> It may be less difference at lower vcore / frequency/temps


the differences grow under load the higher the frequency. most visible they are at or above 4.9-5GHz range if you can get there, they surely are minimized below 4.8GHz and are nearly non-existent at stock clocks. If chip wasn't delided that is most likely caused by both poor Intel TIM (some of those application I've seen were horrible) or IHS concave (yep, only lapping on both sides can fix it). don't worry about it if it's not too bad.


----------



## Hokies83

I have removed the ram about 10x trying all slots and dimms alone and as a pair.

Both will only work in the 2 far right slots.

Should of known no more glue the pcb has no protection from IHS so over tight = ouch.. heh


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have removed the ram about 10x trying all slots and dimms alone and as a pair.
> 
> Both will only work in the 2 far right slots.
> 
> Should of known no more glue the pcb has no protection from IHS so over tight = ouch.. heh


Actually, the brackets were put there so as long as the CPU slightly goes over the brackets (this is the normal so you can have contact IHS - CPU), the IHS will not crush the CPU. Of course, the motherboard is not made to withstand such a curve. Like with such a tight IHS, the motherboard will start curving and it may crack or break. That might be where your problem lies.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I'm pretty sure that lower temp on core0 (first one as reported in monitoring software) is the one right by iGPU, it always run cooler by significant degrees on every SB/IB chip I've seen.
> other differences are most likely related to IHS concave (nearly all have them more or less) or bad TIM application on the die or wrong IHS placement (poor contact on last core) if chip was delided - did that twice on one single chip, my first deliding experience, had to redo it 3 times to make it all right, with the silicone sealant and all.
> the differences grow under load the higher the frequency. most visible they are at or above 4.9-5GHz range if you can get there, they surely are minimized below 4.8GHz and are nearly non-existent at stock clocks. If chip wasn't delided that is most likely caused by both poor Intel TIM (some of those application I've seen were horrible) or IHS concave (yep, only lapping on both sides can fix it). don't worry about it if it's not too bad.


i think this chip has pretty decent tim/dye application but who knows right? I am happy at 4.5ghz under 90c. I forget what my max is let me try a quick ibt.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have removed the ram about 10x trying all slots and dimms alone and as a pair.
> Both will only work in the 2 far right slots.
> Should of known no more glue the pcb has no protection from IHS so over tight = ouch.. heh


hmmm ... that would mean both problems, no dual channel AND first pair of slots (closest to CPU) being a problem on either board or memory controller. could mean a cpu problem ...

have you tried almost completely loosening the cooling block or running with stock HSF?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hmmm ... that would mean both problems, no dual channel AND first pair of slots (closest to CPU) being a problem on either board or memory controller. could mean a cpu problem ...
> have you tried almost completely loosening the cooling block or running with stock HSF?


Aha.... he said he can't use both slots closest to the cpu? My issue was slightly different, I could use any slots just not dual channel..... and mine was certainly a damaged cpu IMC. I guess his could just be damaged differently. Lets hope for a dead dimm slot or a bent pin though!


----------



## Hokies83

Well ima buy a 2500k and test that.

If they is a no go ill RMA the board.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Well ima buy a 2500k and test that.
> 
> If they is a no go ill RMA the board.


Good luck and I actually hope it's the board! That way you won't have the problem with the delidded CPU.







Not sure how Gigabyte RMA service is because I've only tried it once on my X58 board. It was quick and they got it to me 3 days earlier than they had even expected.









Also, here's my new cooler!


----------



## She loved E

@hokies - i feel your pain. IF i try to delid again I think I'll reglue the ihs back on so i don't have to worry bout over tightning.

Love that noctua. Modern performance in.a retro 90s box


----------



## She loved E

2x


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> @hokies - i feel your pain. IF i try to delid again I think I'll reglue the ihs back on so i don't have to worry bout over tightning.
> 
> Love that noctua. Modern performance in.a retro 90s box


I think it's beautiful.







Finally gonna get rid of this loud, obnoxious H100!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think it's beautiful.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Finally gonna get rid of this loud, obnoxious H100!


you looking to sell it lol? I kind of want one.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think it's beautiful.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Finally gonna get rid of this loud, obnoxious H100!
> 
> 
> 
> you looking to sell it lol? I kind of want one.
Click to expand...

Let me fix it first then I'll see if it works after my craziness. I need to strip off the paint I put on it so if it survives, I'll be selling it here most likely!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> i think this chip has pretty decent tim/dye application but who knows right? I am happy at 4.5ghz under 90c. I forget what my max is let me try a quick ibt.


I could do 4.8 folding with the original TIM max temps with it folding 24/7 were right at the mid 80s zone.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think it's beautiful.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Finally gonna get rid of this loud, obnoxious H100!


Always been a fan of the NH-D14.

With the delidding I really thin we should leave a very thin layer of remnant glue on the PCB just as a protective barrier. I did this and had no heat issues at all. especially once I lapped the underside of the IHS including the lips a bit, not much but with 400 grit it goes fast.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think it's beautiful.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Finally gonna get rid of this loud, obnoxious H100!
> 
> 
> 
> Always been a fan of the NH-D14.
> 
> With the delidding I really thin we should leave a very thin layer of remnant glue on the PCB just as a protective barrier. I did this and had no heat issues at all. especially once I lapped the underside of the IHS including the lips a bit, not much but with 400 grit it goes fast.
Click to expand...

Really it all depends on your paranoia. The reason why we can't have a CPU's with the IHS on crushed is because of the bracket. If you have a non-delidded CPU and you put in the heaviest, tightest HSF on, you will see that the glue will become virtually nothing after a month or two. The bracket however prevents the CPU from getting crushed and therefore the effect of the HSF on the CPU is limited to before the CPU being crushed.


----------



## Shikaka

Hey All,

Are there any other older CPU's which can be de-lidded in the same way as the Ivy's?

The reason i ask is that i want to practice de-lidding on some older CPU's before going onto my 3570k. I have access to tons of old CPU's you see... so ruining them is not a problem.

Thank You


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shikaka*
> 
> Hey All,
> 
> Are there any other older CPU's which can be de-lidded in the same way as the Ivy's?
> 
> The reason i ask is that i want to practice de-lidding on some older CPU's before going onto my 3570k. I have access to tons of old CPU's you see... so ruining them is not a problem.
> 
> Thank You


Intel Core 2 Quad I believe. Some people here practice on other CPUs first before jumping into their Ivy.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shikaka*
> 
> Hey All,
> Are there any other older CPU's which can be de-lidded in the same way as the Ivy's?
> The reason i ask is that i want to practice de-lidding on some older CPU's before going onto my 3570k. I have access to tons of old CPU's you see... so ruining them is not a problem.
> Thank You


IHS *Not Soldered* To Die

Hyperthreading/Single Cores

-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
-(S-478) Celeron
-(S-775) Celeron
-Celeron 420
-Celeron 430
-Celeron 440
-AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)

Dual Cores

-AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
-Celeron Dual Core E1200
-Celeron Dual Core E1400
-Pentium Dual Core E2140
-Pentium Dual Core E2160
-Pentium Dual Core E2180
-Pentium Dual Core E2200
-Pentium Dual Core E2210
-Pentium Dual Core E2220
-Pentium Dual Core E6300
-Core 2 Duo E4300
-Core 2 Duo E4400
-Core 2 Duo E4500
-Core 2 Duo E4600
-Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E7200
-Core 2 Duo E7300
-Core 2 Duo E7400
-Core 2 Duo E7500
-Core 2 Duo E7600

practice is a good thing to do before doing the real attempt,
even when the ihs is soldered, its about getting the feel on how to delid








these are soldered ones,

IHS *Soldered To Die*

Hyperthreading/Single Cores

-(S-775) Pentium 4 HT
-(S-775) Celeron D*
-(S-478) Celeron D*
-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Prescott Core)
-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "C" Core)*

Dual Cores

-(S-775) Pentium 4 Extreme Edition
-(S-775) Pentium D
-Pentium Dual Core E5200*
-Pentium Dual Core E5300*
-Pentium Dual Core E5400*
-Core 2 Duo E4700*
-Core 2 Duo E6300 (B2 stepping)
-Core 2 Duo E6320
-Core 2 Duo E6400 (B2 stepping)
-Core 2 Duo E6420
-Core 2 Duo E6540
-Core 2 Duo E6550
-Core 2 Duo E6600
-Core 2 Duo E6700
-Core 2 Duo E6750
-Core 2 Duo E6850
-Core 2 Duo Extreme X6800
-Core 2 Duo E8190
-Core 2 Duo E8200
-Core 2 Duo E8300
-Core 2 Duo E8400
-Core 2 Duo E8500
-Core 2 Duo E8600
-Xeon 3040 (L2 stepping)*
-Xeon 3040 (B2 stepping)
-Xeon 3050 (L2 stepping)*
-Xeon 3040 (B2 stepping)
-Xeon 3060
-Xeon 3070
-Xeon L3110
-Xeon E3110
-Xeon E3120
-Xeon E5502
-AMD Athlon X2 6000+

Tri Cores

-AMD Phenom X3*

Quad Cores

-Core 2 Quad Q6600
-Core 2 Quad Q6700
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX6700
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX6800
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX6850
-Core 2 Quad Q8200
-Core 2 Quad Q8300
-Core 2 Quad Q8400
-Core 2 Quad Q8400S
-Core 2 Quad Q9300
-Core 2 Quad Q9400
-Core 2 Quad Q9400S
-Core 2 Quad Q9450
-Core 2 Quad Q9550
-Core 2 Quad Q9550S
-Core 2 Quad Q9650
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX9650
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX9770
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX9775
-Xeon X3210
-Xeon X3220
-Xeon X3230
-Xeon X3320
-Xeon X3350
-Xeon X3360
-Xeon L3360
-Xeon X3370
-Core i5 750
-Core i7 860
-Core i7 870
-Core i7 920
-Core i7 940
-Core i7 950
-Core i7 Extreme Edition 965
-Core i7 Extreme Edition 975
-AMD Phenom X4*


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Intel Core 2 Quad I believe. Some people here practice on other CPUs first before jumping into their Ivy.


Yes! I am very happy that I did personally because it gave me experience and good techniques, I practiced on four because I had them laying around/accessible to me for free. I actually tested one and it worked fine apart from bad temps (Paste wouldn't come off?) I can't test the Socket 478 ones and the other 775 one I didn't test because I did my 3570k straight after.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> check for WHEA warnings by going to Windows Event Viewer. either type "eventvwr.msc" (without quotation marks and hit enter) from Taskbar Run/Search or r-click Computer, select Manage, select Event Logs, then Custom View and finally Administrative View - WHEA warnings will be logged in there if they occurred.
> no probs! have fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am currently playing STALKER Shadow of Chernobyl with hi-res texture pack (and some other mods) ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> awesome game after I set everything to max details and quality. recently purchased the whole series on Steam during Summer Sale event, but didn't have time to play. SOC is the first oldest part, glad I haven't played it without the mod pack! now it's awesome, MUCH better than stock game


Cheers! What do they appear as in the event viewer? "WHEA error" or is there some other codename or something? I see none







+rep also
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> you can even set up even viewer to pop up a box on the desktop when it has a whea error. Makes it pretty easy to know when you are getting them. You basically right click on a whea error, hit attach task to this event and then tell it to display a message.
> I have mine say: NOT AGAIN!


Awesome, doing that when I can find one.







+Rep

EDIT: Found one from ages ago and setup the message to popup. Mine says "Needs moar voltage!" haha


----------



## VonDutch

o matt-matt, now you gave HardwareDecoder and feniks twice a +rep ...LOL (double post)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Cheers! What do they appear as in the event viewer? "WHEA error" or is there some other codename or something? I see none
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +rep also


whea errors look like this in event viewer,


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o matt-matt, now you gave HardwareDecoder twice a +rep ...LOL
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/6470#
> whea erros look like this in event viewer,


I did?









EDIT: I thought I uploaded this?

Got this after about 4 hours of Memtest x86.. I was dessing a couple of girls for a bit.
It passed two fine, but I don't know what happened after that.

When I got back it showed this, pretty sure it means the memory isn't 100% stable yes?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I did?


lol, maybe its me and my old eyes, i see 2x the same post


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol, maybe its me and my old eyes, i see 2x the same post


Yeah for some reason I keep double posting... sigh


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> chip has been de lidded for 2 months with ram running fine.
> did not remove cpu from cpu bracket when i changed to my water loop.
> i just think the Water block is to tight i got it down as hard as i could get it heh...
> anywho here is some pics...
> *I dub thee the Valguar why you mad bro? Re build.*.


That looks great!

@ivan - This crucial 1.35v cl8 is okay. So far I can only get stable 2000MHz 9-10-9-30-1T @ 1.5v. Any ideas?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn got everything finished went to boot up and gigabyte error code 51... time to see what that is..


memory initialization error

Bah, someone already said that.


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, auto will always apply too much voltage (it's a good thing for people that don't know what they're doing) because it stops them from clocking their processors too high and it also makes sure that it will always be stable up to a certain extent (1.3v+ so it seems for Ivy Bridge)
> Munney: You should set your voltage to 1.20v manually and see if that is Intel Burn Test/Cinebench stable, if it's not move to 1.21 and see what happens and keep going till you're IBT/Cinebench stable.. This should reduce your temperature a lot if you can reduce the voltage needed. You may also like to play around with LLC and put it on medium (50%) or high (75%), this can reduce the vCore needed but will put more stress on the motherboard (which is okay to a certain extent).
> I can't remember where the WHEA errors are located in the event viewer...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But so far at 4.6GHz with 2000MHz 10-10-10-28 with the Samsung RAM, anything over 2000 makes it unstable even at CAS11. Has anyone got any other advice for the Samsung RAM and overclocking with tertiary timings and such? I'm stuck at these settings now


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry I missed that you were not delided yet. Yep, great idea to get before temps so you can see the improvement - makes it even better once you have delidded as you know just how much better you are for doing it!
> And looking at your temps for 4.5GHz you really will be better off once you are delidded! Enough testing as you are already hitting TJMax of 105C - not good for your chip, so no need to do it anymore. Your chip will benefit from a delid! Looking forward to seeing your temps for the same OC once you are delidded!!!


Yeah, I'm gonna pull it out on Wednesday when I get back. I really wanna try it with the h100 on it, and see if it makes any difference.... I'm also gonna try and drop the vcore down as suggested and see what happens.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Yeah, I'm gonna pull it out on Wednesday when I get back. I really wanna try it with the h100 on it, and see if it makes any difference.... I'm also gonna try and drop the vcore down as suggested and see what happens.


It won't make too much difference, especially with a Havik to a H100.. Going from a Hyper 212+ to a Thermalright SB-E dropped me roughly ~5-7c or so. (Was a lot quieter though), this is with fans on full too. The difference between a Hyper 212+ to a SB-E is a bigger jump compared to a Havik to a H100.

You'll get 2c tops less I'm guessing. That is my honest opinion.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Yeah, I'm gonna pull it out on Wednesday when I get back. I really wanna try it with the h100 on it, and see if it makes any difference.... I'm also gonna try and drop the vcore down as suggested and see what happens.


It won't make too much difference, especially with a Havik to a H100.. Going from a Hyper 212+ to a Thermalright SB-E dropped me roughly ~5-7c or so. (Was a lot quieter though), this is with fans on full too. The difference between a Hyper 212+ to a SB-E is a bigger jump compared to a Havik to a H100.

You'll get 2c tops less I'm guessing. That is my honest opinion.


----------



## King4x4

Can't take it anymore!!!! Second delidd is happening on my second 3770k after I made the first one into a single channel folding pc!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Can't take it anymore!!!! Second delidd is happening on my second 3770k after I made the first one into a single channel folding pc!


Good luck King4x4


----------



## King4x4

Time to clean it!

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## derWalter

something wrong with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro?

i would use it inside and outside of the heatspreader.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derWalter*
> 
> something wrong with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro?
> i would use it inside and outside of the heatspreader.


Nope, nothing wrong with it.

Maybe except the fact they must have drained it from virgin unicorns on a full moon night, its that good - Give me a month and I will probably be using it to polish shoes and do the kids lunchbox.

Trust me, if CLP was a real person, it would be the kind of person that you hang around with - chilling TV with and drinking brews with. Heck, I do that now already, though the conversations are kind of one-way.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derWalter*
> 
> something wrong with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro?
> i would use it inside and outside of the heatspreader.


i used it on all sides, on die, inside ihs, on ihs etc,
what you mean with, something wrong?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Nope, nothing wrong with it.
> Maybe except the fact they must have drained it from virgin unicorns on a full moon night, its that good - Give me a month and I will probably be using it to polish shoes and do the kids lunchbox.
> Trust me, if CLP was a real person, it would be the kind of person that you hang around with - chilling TV with and drinking brews with. Heck, I do that now already, though the conversations are kind of one-way.


whaha










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*





Time to clean it!
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

looking good king







, how did it go?


----------



## King4x4

Great success!

Only using Noctua TIM on both IHS and CPU and I got a very nice drop of 14'C!!!



Time to try for 5ghz!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Intel Core 2 Quad I believe. Some people here practice on other CPUs first before jumping into their Ivy.


No go...soldered. P4 478 xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That looks great!
> @ivan - This crucial 1.35v cl8 is okay. So far I can only get stable 2000MHz 9-10-9-30-1T @ 1.5v. Any ideas?


It's nice...check this link out.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Nope, nothing wrong with it.
> Maybe except the fact they must have drained it from virgin unicorns on a full moon night, its that good - Give me a month and I will probably be using it to polish shoes and do the kids lunchbox.
> Trust me, if CLP was a real person, it would be the kind of person that you hang around with - chilling TV with and drinking brews with. Heck, I do that now already, though the conversations are kind of one-way.


Awesome! I would do that too, but the missus would slap me lol
It erases your batch number on the ihs, so I'd rather not use it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Great success!
> Only using Noctua TIM on both IHS and CPU and I got a very nice drop of 14'C!!!
> 
> Time to try for 5ghz!


Cool man! Go for it


----------



## King4x4

Voltage limited... 1.47v stable on 4.9ghz.

Time to tweak for the magical 5ghz stable club.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd run that or 5ghz 24/7 with those kind of volts...Unless you fold on your cpu, that would be too much strain me thinks.


----------



## King4x4

Custom water cooled and I won't worry.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh loosened HS till it was near falling off.. stiff code 51..
> 
> However i can run the 2 far right in single channel with out issue.
> 
> I never removed the CPU during this whole HS swap..
> 
> So 2 things must have happened...
> 
> 1.. I tightened the HS so tight i bent a pin.
> 
> 2 i tightened the Cpu so tight i damaged the pcb.
> 
> I was over due for a noob mistake and im fine running running single channel till Haswell "not like it is a big "performance loss or anything"
> At that time i will trouble shoot the issue and see what it it.
> 
> I will also send a PM to Sin0822.


Sad to hear this *Hokies83*. Can you try your IB in another MB?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Well ima buy a 2500k and test that.
> 
> If they is a no go ill RMA the board.


This would work too.....









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Can't take it anymore!!!! Second delidd is happening on my second 3770k after I made the first one into a single channel folding pc!


We know how you feel!!!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Great success!
> 
> Only using Noctua TIM on both IHS and CPU and I got a very nice drop of 14'C!!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time to try for 5ghz!


Great to hear about your delidding success *King4x4*!!! Always easier the second time if the first time did not work. Get some CL PRO or Ultra and I expect even better temp drops than 14C. and congrats to a job well done dude!!!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Voltage limited... 1.47v stable on 4.9ghz.
> 
> Time to tweak for the magical 5ghz stable club.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Good vcore for 4.9GHz. You may be able to do a stable 5GHz with that chip. I know I would try too!!!









Also, can you get all the info together according to the first page post so that we can add you to our club now that you have succeeded. And then you can get the thread banner on you sig!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Can't take it anymore!!!! Second delidd is happening on my second 3770k after I made the first one into a single channel folding pc!


ahh another single channel chip. Atleast you succeeded in your second attempt I am too much of a ...... to try it again lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yes! I am very happy that I did personally because it gave me experience and good techniques, I practiced on four because I had them laying around/accessible to me for free. I actually tested one and it worked fine apart from bad temps (Paste wouldn't come off?) I can't test the Socket 478 ones and the other 775 one I didn't test because I did my 3570k straight after.
> Cheers! What do they appear as in the event viewer? "WHEA error" or is there some other codename or something? I see none
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +rep also
> Awesome, doing that when I can find one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +Rep
> EDIT: Found one from ages ago and setup the message to popup. Mine says "Needs moar voltage!" haha


look/filter for Event ID 19 or by name it's WHEA-Logger. if you don't see them at time of stress tester run then it means good








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I did?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: I thought I uploaded this?
> Got this after about 4 hours of Memtest x86.. I was dessing a couple of girls for a bit.
> It passed two fine, but I don't know what happened after that.
> When I got back it showed this, pretty sure it means the memory isn't 100% stable yes?


yeah LOL! that memory is totally unstable ha ha!!! normally it looks "normal" just throws red errors listed in bottom part of screen with the name/number of Test it failed and such.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Voltage limited... 1.47v stable on 4.9ghz.
> Time to tweak for the magical 5ghz stable club.
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Pretty good results for both the chip and TIM used during deliding. You'd get better temps with CL Ultra or Pro however, up to 30C drop or so. 4.9GHz should be fairly stable on vcore offsets for daily running with low power consumption at idle


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's nice...check this link out.


Oh cool, thanks for the link. I didn't get quite the same scores but I did get higher scores with 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T and it was 30 minutes stable in IBT max. Going to run a Prime95 custom blend with max RAM now to make sure...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Oh cool, thanks for the link. I didn't get quite the same scores but I did get higher scores with 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T and it was 30 minutes stable in IBT max. Going to run a Prime95 custom blend with max RAM now to make sure...


Those are very good scores...that ram works good for 2133 up to 2400mhz with decent timings, depending on the kit.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome! I would do that too, but the missus would slap me lol
> It erases your batch number on the ihs, so I'd rather not use it.


Batch numbers ?!

We dont need no stinking batch numbers!









Trying to dodge Whea-errors atm. Never knew about this stuff - But my overclock, stable in CineBench / IntelBurnTest and P95 is making the Whea log light up like christmas morning - MOAR VCORE!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Oh cool, thanks for the link. I didn't get quite the same scores but I did get higher scores with 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T and it was 30 minutes stable in IBT max. Going to run a Prime95 custom blend with max RAM now to make sure...


memtest it over night to make sure it is error free. and I mean like 12 passes at least. I had two former memory OC's at 2200MHz and 2400Mhz with automatic sub-timings set by the board, they had very high bandwidth and were stable under IBT Max and so on ... it came up that each of them were throwing 1-4 errors, especially in Test#7 in MemTest over night, usually in 2nd and 7th pass or so, but sometimes at 11th too. you don't want to run memory that randomly throws errors ...


----------



## Hokies83

Lol did a prime 95 @ stock with my loop temps were not much higher then idle lol.

Cores 1 = 3 were like 32 c and core 4 39 c lol.


----------



## Hokies83

*Update*

Removed water block tried to boot it still same code.

Then removed cpu cleaned it up re installed it with out water block again and it posted.

So now ima re install the water block and hope all is well..

So good news for the *" Valguar why you mad bro re build "*


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> *Update*
> Removed water block tried to boot it still same code.
> Then removed cpu cleaned it up re installed it with out water block again and it posted.
> So now ima re install the water block and hope all is well..
> So good news for the *" Valguar why you mad bro re build "*


That is good news! Man that thing looks sweet with that red glow...Good job on the windows, feels good don't it?

If I can get my arse away from FC3 I'm gonna cut up this rosewill challenger this weekend. It's not looking like its gonna happen. I spent so long messing with this 7950, my new RAM, and this little 740BE chip that its already 5 o'clock and I got a bunch of cleaning to do before my lady comes home and chews me out!!

I'm running memtest on my RAM right now. We'll see how it goes.


----------



## Hokies83

Got it to post! yay duel channel ram again....

Anywho...

@ Stick... You wanna buy my Cosmos 2? 175$ local pick up


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Got it to post! yay duel channel ram again....
> Anywho...
> @ Stick... You wanna buy my Cosmos 2? 175$ local pick up


No thank you! I'm a mid tower man myself.

Grrrr USPS banged up the 7970 I sold and the guy wants a refund now. Good thing I purchased insurance on the package.


----------



## Hokies83

does the 7970 still work and is un damaged? If so u do not have to refund him because the cond of the box.

Been running prime 95 30 mins temps barely touch 40c lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, if it works no need for a refund...it's USPS' fault and he knew shipping hardware may have some risk, yet decided to go through with the purchase.
I buy stuff like that and I take the risk cause locally stuff is 3x the US price.
Now if he never had gotten it, that's a different story, I would ask for a refund in that case.


----------



## stickg1

He says the two prongs on the slot plate that the video outputs are on is bent and he cant get it into his case to see if it works. I mean, even if it did get bent which is almost impossible with the way I packaged it, just bend it straight with some pliers. It's not like it is 5 inch thick forged steel, its a dinky piece of plate....


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> He says the two prongs on the slot plate that the video outputs are on is bent and he cant get it into his case to see if it works. I mean, even if it did get bent which is almost impossible with the way I packaged it, just bend it straight with some pliers. It's not like it is 5 inch thick forged steel, its a dinky piece of plate....


Buyers remorse... plain and simple


----------



## ivanlabrie

That sounds like a blatant lie man...I don't know. He might try to screw ya, forget the refund.


----------



## ivanlabrie

He can ship it back and then you can refund it...but I'd keep the money.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

^^ Wow! That sucks Stickg1. Sound's like you have a useless person who purchased your card, or someone who's trying to scam you. Either way, he should file a claim w/ UPS, shipping damage is not your responsibility.

@ Hokies83: The Cosmos is looking nice! GL w/ the block reinstall, I hope it works out for you mate.









On another note: I haz teh sad. Someone forgot to list me in the spreadsheet...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> He says the two prongs on the slot plate that the video outputs are on is bent and he cant get it into his case to see if it works. I mean, even if it did get bent which is almost impossible with the way I packaged it, just bend it straight with some pliers. It's not like it is 5 inch thick forged steel, its a dinky piece of plate....


Ask for pictures and really, don't accept a refund. He may have damaged it himself or as MunneY said, Buyers Remorse. There is no point in entertaining his request.


----------



## Hokies83

Welp from H-100 to custom loop 15c temp drops.

And i can lover my V core 00.5 it seems... so i can run 1.5v instead of 1.55v


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Buyers remorse... plain and simple


That's what I think, he got the card, it didn't clock as well as he wanted, its a reference card so its loud as hell, temps aren't an issue because I put CLP on it and the temps are about the same as my new Sapphire Vapor-X. But he got the card and then found a better deal and wants out...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> He can ship it back and then you can refund it...but I'd keep the money.


Well I definitely wont refund it until I get it returned to me and check it out myself. I will likely just bend it back straight and resell it to someone that's not a moron.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> ^^ Wow! That sucks Stickg1. Sound's like you have a useless person who purchased your card, or someone who's trying to scam you. Either way, he should file a claim w/ UPS, shipping damage is not your responsibility.
> @ Hokies83: The Cosmos is looking nice! GL w/ the block reinstall, I hope it works out for you mate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On another note: I haz teh sad. Someone forgot to list me in the spreadsheet...


I'm filing a claim with USPS when I get the card back.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ask for pictures and really, don't accept a refund. He may have damaged it himself or as MunneY said, Buyers Remorse. There is no point in entertaining his request.


He's taking pictures and sending them to me and then I will tell him what his best move is. I don't have $300 to send him so I will have to get reimbursed by USPS or I will fix it and resell it to a more competent buyer. This is why I hate ebay. I wish I could sell here on OCN where people know how to use hardware. I had some offers on Tom's should have just taken them.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, forums are much better for selling, though you can make more money at fleabay...


----------



## Swag

@stickg1

If you took pictures of the piece of hardware when packaging it, it will be much easier to prove to the guy it is not your fault and he has to file a claim with UPS.


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's what I think, he got the card, it didn't clock as well as he wanted, its a reference card so its loud as hell, temps aren't an issue because I put CLP on it and the temps are about the same as my new Sapphire Vapor-X. But he got the card and then found a better deal and wants out...
> Well I definitely wont refund it until I get it returned to me and check it out myself. I will likely just bend it back straight and resell it to someone that's not a moron.
> I'm filing a claim with USPS when I get the card back.
> He's taking pictures and sending them to me and then I will tell him what his best move is. I don't have $300 to send him so I will have to get reimbursed by USPS or I will fix it and resell it to a more competent buyer. This is why I hate ebay. I wish I could sell here on OCN where people know how to use hardware. I had some offers on Tom's should have just taken them.


What card was it exactly? I might be interested in it if it isn't busted


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @stickg1
> If you took pictures of the piece of hardware when packaging it, it will be much easier to prove to the guy it is not your fault and he has to file a claim with UPS.


I have pictures of it before I mailed it if that's what you mean, before it got beat up. I didn't take any as I was packing it. I might make him file the claim. If he cant put on his man pants and bend it straight with pliers then let him play secretary and get on the phone and track down his refund. Although it might be nice if USPS pays him back and I get the card back and fix it. Free 7970, lol.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> ^^ Wow! That sucks Stickg1. Sound's like you have a useless person who purchased your card, or someone who's trying to scam you. Either way, he should file a claim w/ UPS, shipping damage is not your responsibility.
> 
> @ Hokies83: The Cosmos is looking nice! GL w/ the block reinstall, I hope it works out for you mate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On another note: I haz teh sad. Someone forgot to list me in the spreadsheet...


Sorry about that *Teh Rav3n*. Can you note the post number and/or repost the info and pic so we can get you into the spreadsheet?


----------



## ivanlabrie

That would rock lol Screw USPS xD
(actually I love them, never failed to deliver anything lol)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> What card was it exactly? I might be interested in it if it isn't busted


VisionTek 900491 Radeon HD 7970 3GB
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129204

I bought it used from a member here on OCN for $315. It clocks at 1125/1750 all day on 1.25v. I took it apart and put CLP on the die and dropped temps about 10-15C on full load while gaming and benching. It was a good card but it was loud and I got a good deal on a 7950 so I sold the 7970, bought a 7950 and bought some other stuff.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have pictures of it before I mailed it if that's what you mean, before it got beat up. I didn't take any as I was packing it. I might make him file the claim. If he cant put on his man pants and bend it straight with pliers then let him play secretary and get on the phone and track down his refund. Although it might be nice if USPS pays him back and I get the card back and fix it. Free 7970, lol.


That's the spirit! I utterly detest useless humans. If he can't sweep the sand out of his own man-gi... I might better stop right there.







I wish you the best of luck good sir.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry about that *Teh Rav3n*. Can you note the post number and/or repost the info and pic so we can get you into the spreadsheet?


No problem at all, I don't get butt hurt over the small stuff. Lol!







And after my ex-wife, everything's small stuff









It's probably easier on everyone for me to just post it again.









OCN name: *Teh Rav3n*

CPU: *i5 3570K*

on die-TIM: *Coolabratory Liquid Pro*

ihs-TIM: *What IHS bossman? We doan need no STEENKIN IHS!*

Mhz gained: *1200 Mhz over the OEM HS*

OC after delid: *4.6 Ghz*

Temp drops: *No comparable data on AD II. Went from OEM HS @ 4.1 Ghz and stock
voltage to AD II @ 4.6 Ghz and 1.49v -brand new build. 37­° drop*

CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2628983


----------



## Swag

Whoever had the pictures with the dremel to take off the glue, can you re-post them? I want to see if I have the wheel.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Whoever had the pictures with the dremel to take off the glue, can you re-post them? I want to see if I have the wheel.


I used one like this, except the larger diameter version. It's just the standard felt polishing wheel found in nearly every dremel accessory kit.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Whoever had the pictures with the dremel to take off the glue, can you re-post them? I want to see if I have the wheel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used one like this, except the larger diameter version. It's the standard felt polishing wheel.
Click to expand...

Did it work properly and should I buy a larger diameter one?


----------



## Swag

Which one of these should I use?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Which one of these should I use?


The bigger one would be easier. Go low RPM's and make sure to soak it in alcohol first. When you're done you can come polish my shoes!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Which one of these should I use?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The bigger one would be easier. Go low RPM's and make sure to soak it in alcohol first. When you're done you can come polish my shoes!
Click to expand...

Why soak it in alcohol?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why soak it in alcohol?


Because it takes the glue off, otherwise if its dry it's just going to turn black and not clean the glue off. At least not very effectively.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why soak it in alcohol?
> 
> 
> 
> Because it takes the glue off, otherwise if its dry it's just going to turn black and not clean the glue off. At least not very effectively.
Click to expand...

Ok, and it won't hurt the PCB at all. Like file it or take off anything?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ok, and it won't hurt the PCB at all. Like file it or take off anything?


It would be much worse for the PCB if you did it with the dry buffing wheel.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ok, and it won't hurt the PCB at all. Like file it or take off anything?
> 
> 
> 
> It would be much worse for the PCB if you did it with the dry buffing wheel.
Click to expand...

So I can assume it is 100% safe and it won't kill my CPU?


----------



## c2thew

if you use the small buffing wheel without any alcohol, the dry buffing wheel will melt the PCB, even at the lowest speeds (well at least for my dremmel). Depending on what model dremmel you have, the lowest speeds is not sufficient enough for me to polish off the pcb. I'd rather not melt the board and be stuck with a paper weight or not be able to have dual channel memory. Personally, I feel that polishing the motherboard to get rid of the residue is as risky as delidding the IHS.

I reset the heat sink on my IHS and also the hyper 212 evo cooler and I still have very different temperature differences between core 1 and core 3. I must have a lopsided board IHS or something.

I still am confused at how to overclock as i've been letting the cpu handle the voltages.

tested at 4.5


----------



## Hokies83

Welp pc shut down and error code 51 again..

Seems the Apongee drive 2 is to heavy and is pushing the pins on my mb to touch.

After talking to Sin0822..

I am going to try and get the smaller version of the Apongee drive 2.. see if it helps..
If not looks like ima have to pay gigabyte 50$ to replace the socket meh owell.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp pc shut down and error code 51 again..
> Seems the Apongee drive 2 is to heavy and is pushing the pins on my mb to touch.
> After talking to Sin0822..
> I am going to try and get the smaller version of the Apongee drive 2.. see if it helps..
> If not looks like ima have to pay gigabyte 50$ to replace the socket meh owell.


Put the pc on its side and see if stops


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Did it work properly and should I buy a larger diameter one?


The larger diameter version is certainly easier to work with imo. Denatured alcohol is best, but off the shelf isopropyl alcohol will work fine to.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp pc shut down and error code 51 again..
> Seems the Apongee drive 2 is to heavy and is pushing the pins on my mb to touch.
> After talking to Sin0822..
> I am going to try and get the smaller version of the Apongee drive 2.. see if it helps..
> If not looks like ima have to pay gigabyte 50$ to replace the socket meh owell.


Oh that seriously sucks. :*(


----------



## c2thew

i'm still a novice overclocker, and i'm having very large temperature discrepancies between core 1 and the other 3 cores.

and now.... a wave of pictures.


My first application was with arctic MX-2 but i also purchased mx-4 and noticed a 2-3 degrees drop in difference.

applying arctic MX-4 note: i did not use alcohol to remove the previous grease. I just cleaned it as best as i could with a tissue.

some strange patterns underneath the IHS. maybe this is why my cpu chip has one core that is 10 degrees difference than another one while under load.

redoing the arctic MX-4 in hopes of getting better, even temperatures.... nope. I did get a cooler core 2, but the other 3 cores are still higher.


re-cleaned and reapplied arctic mx-4

amount of TIM i used on the cpu die


amount used on the IHS and the hyper 212 evo.

4.6 1.272 68 76 80 77
4.7 1.368 78 90 93 89
4.7 1.368 78 90 93 90 run #2

I'm pretty much just putting 45,46,47 in the cpu bios and then running intel burn tests rather than doing a fixed voltage to overclock. Will the cpu achieve an overclock if you use a fixed voltage say 1.19 @ 47 or will it crash? still very confused about the terminology about the asrock bios.

i am tempted though to get some collaboratory liquid ultra, but it's an added cost and i'm not getting even temperatures across the board like others have been getting.


----------



## Cool Mike

Just completed my new build. Updating my system profile soon. Hated the high temps. So did the delid with no problems. Looks like I have a better than average 3770K. Before delid, hit 4.8Ghz Intel burn stable. Highest core at 1.37V (CPUz reading) was hitting 91C. After delid highest temp at 1.37V (CPUz reading) was 73C. Now at 5.1Ghz @ 1.472V (CPUz reading) my highest core temp is 84C. Another great bonus here is i'm running 16GB memory @ 2666 with timings 10-12-12-31.









http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633042






OCN name: Cool Mike

CPU: i7 3770K

on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Ultra

ihs-TIM: GELID GC Extreme

Mhz gained: 300 Mhz over the OEM HS

OC after delid: 5.1 Ghz

Temp drops: No comparable data. Did not record electronic data before delid. OEM @ 4.8 Ghz at 1.37(CPUz reading) core temp was 91C, after delid temps dropped to 73C @ 4.8 Ghz at 1.37 (CPUz reading) Highest core = 18­° drop. Running all four cores with hyper threading at 5.1 Ghz at 1.472V core (CPUz reading) highest core temp 84C.

CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633042


----------



## stickg1

That last picture looks like a massive amount of TIM, I use about a 3rd of that. Pretty much I use the same amount you put on your die on my IHS.


----------



## xTristinx

Well it seems like with a lot of trial and error i got a 5.0ghz overclock. Seems pretty stable too.

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633115


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> 
> i'm still a novice overclocker, and i'm having very large temperature discrepancies between core 1 and the other 3 cores.
> and now.... a wave of pictures.
> 
> My first application was with arctic MX-2 but i also purchased mx-4 and noticed a 2-3 degrees drop in difference.
> 
> applying arctic MX-4 note: i did not use alcohol to remove the previous grease. I just cleaned it as best as i could with a tissue.
> 
> some strange patterns underneath the IHS. maybe this is why my cpu chip has one core that is 10 degrees difference than another one while under load.
> 
> redoing the arctic MX-4 in hopes of getting better, even temperatures.... nope. I did get a cooler core 2, but the other 3 cores are still higher.
> 
> 
> re-cleaned and reapplied arctic mx-4
> 
> amount of TIM i used on the cpu die
> 
> 
> amount used on the IHS and the hyper 212 evo.
> 4.6 1.272 68 76 80 77
> 4.7 1.368 78 90 93 89
> 4.7 1.368 78 90 93 90 run #2
> I'm pretty much just putting 45,46,47 in the cpu bios and then running intel burn tests rather than doing a fixed voltage to overclock. Will the cpu achieve an overclock if you use a fixed voltage say 1.19 @ 47 or will it crash? still very confused about the terminology about the asrock bios.
> i am tempted though to get some collaboratory liquid ultra, but it's an added cost and i'm not getting even temperatures across the board like others have been getting.


I think you put way too much TIM everywhere ... either try 1/10th of what you use and spread it on the die







or use at most a quarter of what you put... with CLU on the die I use a tiny bit, literally quarter of rice grain or even less ... CLU contains a nice brush, make it easy to spread it evenly on the die and IHs.

you need to switch to Ultra High LLC (75%), I think that is Level 2 in Asrock BIOS and then manually up the vcore (either fixed or vcore offset) until stable for the given multiplier. Try using Cinebench 11.5 x64, makes it much quicker and actually calls for more vcore than IBT does and yet Cinebench doesn't generate such horrible temps as IBT does. scroll back a few pages and find how to check for WHEA warnings, when you see them in Windows Event Logs then you need to up the vcore further until no such warnings occur during stress testing.


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTristinx*
> 
> Well it seems like with a lot of trial and error i got a 5.0ghz overclock. Seems pretty stable too.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633115


How long did you run prime for in the picture? From what I can tell it's at 5 min or so. How long did you test it and what were your max temps?


----------



## Cool Mike

Yes, first time working with Ultra. I ended up removing the ultra and placing it on again. Used less before seating the lid. I will run 3Dmark11 and see what my Physics score is.


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Have many people tried IX as a compound after delid? Curious because I will have an extra one but its quite a pain to rip the MB out to put this stuff on...


----------



## xTristinx

Still Testing it currently. Highest core temp is 76. Had a weird freeze so stepped my voltage up to 1.54

EDIT: 20 minute mark hit a high of 86


----------



## xTristinx

Whats peoples preferences on using the IHS.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTristinx*
> 
> Whats peoples preferences on using the IHS.


Pretty sure most of us are using them. I am and lapped it as well.


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cool Mike*
> 
> Just completed my new build. Updating my system profile soon. Hated the high temps. So did the delid with no problems. Looks like I have a better than average 3770K. Before delid, hit 4.8Ghz Intel burn stable. Highest core at 1.37V (CPUz reading) was hitting 91C. After delid highest temp at 1.37V (CPUz reading) was 73C. Now at 5.1Ghz @ 1.472V (CPUz reading) my highest core temp is 84C. Another great bonus here is i'm running 16GB memory @ 2666 with timings 10-12-12-31.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633042
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Cool Mike
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: GELID GC Extreme
> Mhz gained: 300 Mhz over the OEM HS
> OC after delid: 5.1 Ghz
> Temp drops: No comparable data. Did not record electronic data before delid. OEM @ 4.8 Ghz at 1.37(CPUz reading) core temp was 91C, after delid temps dropped to 73C @ 4.8 Ghz at 1.37 (CPUz reading) Highest core = 18­° drop. Running all four cores with hyper threading at 5.1 Ghz at 1.472V core (CPUz reading) highest core temp 84C.
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633042


Bro! Do you have a Devil 13?


----------



## c2thew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I think you put way too much TIM everywhere ... either try 1/10th of what you use and spread it on the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or use at most a quarter of what you put... with CLU on the die I use a tiny bit, literally quarter of rice grain or even less ... CLU contains a nice brush, make it easy to spread it evenly on the die and IHs.
> you need to switch to Ultra High LLC (75%), I think that is Level 2 in Asrock BIOS and then manually up the vcore (either fixed or vcore offset) until stable for the given multiplier. Try using Cinebench 11.5 x64, makes it much quicker and actually calls for more vcore than IBT does and yet Cinebench doesn't generate such horrible temps as IBT does. scroll back a few pages and find how to check for WHEA warnings, when you see them in Windows Event Logs then you need to up the vcore further until no such warnings occur during stress testing.


wow, you are right about the amount of TIM i put on the cpu die. I'll go ahead and disassemble everything again and put less tim and report back.

http://cdn.overclock.net/9/90/90ed2070_IMG_0045.jpeg

reseated my ihs and heat sink again and used less TIM.... results = temperatures got worse.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> wow, you are right about the amount of TIM i put on the cpu die. I'll go ahead and disassemble everything again and put less tim and report back.
> http://cdn.overclock.net/9/90/90ed2070_IMG_0045.jpeg


that amount looks about right if you spread it with some spatula. I am unsure how it will spread if you simply slap the IHS back on (could be it won't reach the far edges).
also when replacing the IHS on the PCB/DIE, make sure to position it a tiny bit towards the top (opposite of the black tag at bottom of PCB), because it will slide by around 2mm when you clamp it down in the socket. FYI, if it was positioned correctly and it slid when clamping down then usually the IHS is sitting at angle on the die and making poor contact with bottom portion of it. Note the black tag area is elevated on the PCB, that's why IHS stops on it when it slides during clamping down.

anyways, good luck!


----------



## Cool Mike

Yes thats my Devil 13. Cleaned my billfold out.







Purchased it from Newegg about 6 weeks ago. Best card Ive ever owned. Nice looking and powerful. Running 1175 on both cores and 1675 on Memory with a very slight voltage bump on memory. GPU voltage is stock (1.256V)

My 3770K is pushing the Devil 13 just fine. ~19,500 3Dmark11 graphics score, ~12,600 physics score running 3770K at 5.1Ghz. Total score ~16750. Performance settings.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I think you put way too much TIM everywhere ... either try 1/10th of what you use and spread it on the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or use at most a quarter of what you put... with CLU on the die I use a tiny bit, literally quarter of rice grain or even less ... CLU contains a nice brush, make it easy to spread it evenly on the die and IHs.
> you need to switch to Ultra High LLC (75%), I think that is Level 2 in Asrock BIOS and then manually up the vcore (either fixed or vcore offset) until stable for the given multiplier. Try using Cinebench 11.5 x64, makes it much quicker and actually calls for more vcore than IBT does and yet Cinebench doesn't generate such horrible temps as IBT does. scroll back a few pages and find how to check for WHEA warnings, when you see them in Windows Event Logs then you need to up the vcore further until no such warnings occur during stress testing.


I used cotton buds, it wastes a bit as the tip has to absorb a bit. But once it's done it spreads great and so thin! IBT will make your cores hotter then anything else at all, it's good for a quick test but 90c is fine with IBT.

For reference my de-lidded 3570k @ 4.6GHz with 1.45v usually sits on ~60c with Prime95 over 24 hours, (peaked to about ~65c). The second I loaded IBT I get 80c almost instantly.
Even Prime95 temps aren't going to happen in real world really, so this is good news for you. I do think that the Coolabs stuff is worth the $20 or so because it will last longer on the core before having to replace, better temps and it can also make the IHS stick to the core which is what you really want. Besides $20 is nothing when comparing it to how much you've already spent.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have pictures of it before I mailed it if that's what you mean, before it got beat up. I didn't take any as I was packing it. I might make him file the claim. If he cant put on his man pants and bend it straight with pliers then let him play secretary and get on the phone and track down his refund. Although it might be nice if USPS pays him back and I get the card back and fix it. Free 7970, lol.
> 
> 
> 
> That's the spirit! I utterly detest useless humans. If he can't sweep the sand out of his own man-gi... I might better stop right there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish you the best of luck good sir.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Sorry about that *Teh Rav3n*. Can you note the post number and/or repost the info and pic so we can get you into the spreadsheet?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No problem at all, I don't get butt hurt over the small stuff. Lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And after my ex-wife, everything's small stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's probably easier on everyone for me to just post it again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> CPU: *i5 3570K*
> 
> on die-TIM: *Coolabratory Liquid Pro*
> 
> ihs-TIM: *What IHS bossman? We doan need no STEENKIN IHS!*
> 
> Mhz gained: *1200 Mhz over the OEM HS*
> 
> OC after delid: *4.6 Ghz*
> 
> Temp drops: *No comparable data on AD II. Went from OEM HS @ 4.1 Ghz and stock
> voltage to AD II @ 4.6 Ghz and 1.49v -brand new build. 37­° drop*
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2628983
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...

Got ya on the spreadsheet now!!! Thanks for being patient with us during the holidays *Teh Rav3n* . You are now completely official!!!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cool Mike*
> 
> Just completed my new build. Updating my system profile soon. Hated the high temps. So did the delid with no problems. Looks like I have a better than average 3770K. Before delid, hit 4.8Ghz Intel burn stable. Highest core at 1.37V (CPUz reading) was hitting 91C. After delid highest temp at 1.37V (CPUz reading) was 73C. Now at 5.1Ghz @ 1.472V (CPUz reading) my highest core temp is 84C. Another great bonus here is i'm running 16GB memory @ 2666 with timings 10-12-12-31.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633042
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Cool Mike
> 
> CPU: i7 3770K
> 
> on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Ultra
> 
> ihs-TIM: GELID GC Extreme
> 
> Mhz gained: 300 Mhz over the OEM HS
> 
> OC after delid: 5.1 Ghz
> 
> Temp drops: No comparable data. Did not record electronic data before delid. OEM @ 4.8 Ghz at 1.37(CPUz reading) core temp was 91C, after delid temps dropped to 73C @ 4.8 Ghz at 1.37 (CPUz reading) Highest core = 18­° drop. Running all four cores with hyper threading at 5.1 Ghz at 1.472V core (CPUz reading) highest core temp 84C.
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2633042


Great job deliding *Cool Mike*!!! 5.1Ghz @ 1.472V is very nice. Wish my IB would do that.... Your on the spreadsheet and official member of the crew!!! Feel free to add the banner to your sig as you have earned it!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I used cotton buds, it wastes a bit as the tip has to absorb a bit. But once it's done it spreads great and so thin! IBT will make your cores hotter then anything else at all, it's good for a quick test but 90c is fine with IBT.
> For reference my de-lidded 3570k @ 4.6GHz with 1.45v usually sits on ~60c with Prime95 over 24 hours, (peaked to about ~65c). The second I loaded IBT I get 80c almost instantly.
> Even Prime95 temps aren't going to happen in real world really, so this is good news for you. I do think that the Coolabs stuff is worth the $20 or so because it will last longer on the core before having to replace, better temps and it can also make the IHS stick to the core which is what you really want. Besides $20 is nothing when comparing it to how much you've already spent.


I think you are referring to older version of prime95? latest IBT 2.54 and latest prime95 27.7, both with AVX extensions, should generate similar temps. IBT higher a bit, but the prime95 is not far behind (maybe 5C lower during Small FFT), just saying. I know your reply was directed to the guy I quoted









CLU is the best TIM I ever used, never bothered with Pro as in case I wanted to remove things in future I don't want to deal with its soldering properties


----------



## FtW 420

My first delidded chip never recovered from being frozen with CL ultra between the die & IHS & doesn't post anymore, so did a different one. Still needed a big voltage bump to get 4.8 but temps are much better now, slightly lower temps than 4.6Ghz was at 1.18V before the delid using the same NH-D14 cooler (different mobo & memory)

pre delid


Trying to get 16Gb of this samsung green ram stable at 2133mhz on a z77 ud3h is quite a challenge...
post delid


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I used cotton buds, it wastes a bit as the tip has to absorb a bit. But once it's done it spreads great and so thin! IBT will make your cores hotter then anything else at all, it's good for a quick test but 90c is fine with IBT.
> For reference my de-lidded 3570k @ 4.6GHz with 1.45v usually sits on ~60c with Prime95 over 24 hours, (peaked to about ~65c). The second I loaded IBT I get 80c almost instantly.
> Even Prime95 temps aren't going to happen in real world really, so this is good news for you. I do think that the Coolabs stuff is worth the $20 or so because it will last longer on the core before having to replace, better temps and it can also make the IHS stick to the core which is what you really want. Besides $20 is nothing when comparing it to how much you've already spent.
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are referring to older version of prime95? latest IBT 2.54 and latest prime95 27.7, both with AVX extensions, should generate similar temps. IBT higher a bit, but the prime95 is not far behind (maybe 5C lower during Small FFT), just saying. I know your reply was directed to the guy I quoted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU is the best TIM I ever used, never bothered with Pro as in case I wanted to remove things in future I don't want to deal with its soldering properties
Click to expand...

I agree *feniks* with both you comments, although I have tried some PRO just to see the difference. Then ordered some more ultra! Pro was 1-3C lower temps, but ultra is much easier to work with for me. Others are allowed to disagree!









*Matt-Matt*, check to see if you are using prime95 v27.7 _AND_ that you have the W7 SP1 installed to gain the AVX instruction set. If you do, then you will start to see some higher than expected prime95 temps! IBT used to be much higher temps than prime95 for me, but not as much anymore once prime starts to use AVX instruction set. After an hour or so you will see some much higher temps than you ever saw prime do before.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> My first delidded chip never recovered from being frozen with CL ultra between the die & IHS & doesn't post anymore, so did a different one. Still needed a big voltage bump to get 4.8 but temps are much better now, slightly lower temps than 4.6Ghz was at 1.18V before the delid using the same NH-D14 cooler (different mobo & memory)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> pre delid
> 
> 
> Trying to get 16Gb of this samsung green ram stable at 2133mhz on a z77 ud3h is quite a challenge...
> post delid


I don't know how you do it *FtW 420* - you get great vcore on your chips for the OCs you do. Are those known binned chips you buy? Or do you juct have a stack of them you go through until you find these great chips. Maybe its you super OC abilites.... Anyway, nice OC vcores.

On the dead chip, I have heard that PRO and Ultra are no good for ln2, but how did it kill the chip? Not cooling it enough for the vcore used, or some type of physical damage?

And sorry about the loss.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I think you are referring to older version of prime95? latest IBT 2.54 and latest prime95 27.7, both with AVX extensions, should generate similar temps. IBT higher a bit, but the prime95 is not far behind (maybe 5C lower during Small FFT), just saying. I know your reply was directed to the guy I quoted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU is the best TIM I ever used, never bothered with Pro as in case I wanted to remove things in future I don't want to deal with its soldering properties


Fair enough with the whole CLU thing,
I'm running 27.9 and it has AVX for sure. Maximum I get in Prime95 is ~65c but IBT will get up to 80c easily. I'll check my temps now and test IBT now.

EDIT: Custom blend this is.. All cores are on 62-66c (Warm day and my bedroom door was closed), IBT is getting ~75c. A bit less difference then what I said before but still. This is just starting IBT though I know it gets hotter with more RAM and after ~20 runs or so. Prime was running for about an hour when I got 65c temps too.

I'm running SP1 since ages ago, I didn't even know about AVX for a while. Lets just say I don't usually get Windows updates for a reason..








2.54 of IBT
and 27.9 of Prime95 and it even says "AVX test"

Using HWMonitor to check temps too, Speccy does report the same thing though.
Also package temps doesn't matter as much as cores does it?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I think you are referring to older version of prime95? latest IBT 2.54 and latest prime95 27.7, both with AVX extensions, should generate similar temps. IBT higher a bit, but the prime95 is not far behind (maybe 5C lower during Small FFT), just saying. I know your reply was directed to the guy I quoted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU is the best TIM I ever used, never bothered with Pro as in case I wanted to remove things in future I don't want to deal with its soldering properties
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fair enough with the whole CLU thing,
> I'm running 27.9 and it has AVX for sure. Maximum I get in Prime95 is ~65c but IBT will get up to 80c easily. I'll check my temps now and test IBT now.
> 
> EDIT: Custom blend this is.. All cores are on 62-66c (Warm day and my bedroom door was closed), IBT is getting ~75c. A bit less difference then what I said before but still. This is just starting IBT though I know it gets hotter with more RAM and after ~20 runs or so. Prime was running for about an hour when I got 65c temps too.
> 
> I'm running SP1 since ages ago, I didn't even know about AVX for a while. Lets just say I don't usually get Windows updates for a reason..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2.54 of IBT
> and 27.9 of Prime95 and it even says "AVX test"
Click to expand...

Well then. I guess you do have AVX and just get low prime95 temps compared to IBT! Most do not seem to, and I sure noticed a diff, but systems do vary! Just wanting to make sure you were running the good stuff, and you are!







And yes, IBT is still the hottest of the two!


----------



## Hokies83

My water loop does not break 65c with 1.5v in an 80 degree room....

Shame about my 250$ MB tho lol.

When my New Apongee Drive 2 gets here ill see if it fixes it..

And a word to the wise the block/pump is 136$ shipped at Side winder right now...

This is one of the best performing blocks out there right now to.

I mean look atthe size difference between mine and the new version..
New version has to be half the weight.

 VS 

Twice the size...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Delidded the 3570K in my emulator box this evening. Didn't bother taking any pics as I did in a pretty short amount of time (30 minutes total to delid, clean, apply CLP, and remount HSF). Temps dropped 23C which has allowed me to get an extra 400Mhz. I will never own another non-delidded Ivy chip








.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Delidded the 3570K in my emulator box this evening. Didn't bother taking any pics as I did in a pretty short amount of time (30 minutes total to delid, clean, apply CLP, and remount HSF). Temps dropped 23C which has allowed me to get an extra 400Mhz. I will never own another non-delidded Ivy chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


You need a Monsta 360 rad on top of that 810.. 80mm rad things are boss...

I know where one is for 95$


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You need a Monsta 360 rad on top of that 810.. 80mm rad things are boss...
> I know where one is for 95$


Haha, I think I'm alright with the 2 GTX240's I've got. 480mm of rad cooling should suffice for my needs







.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Fair enough with the whole CLU thing,
> I'm running 27.9 and it has AVX for sure. Maximum I get in Prime95 is ~65c but IBT will get up to 80c easily. I'll check my temps now and test IBT now.
> EDIT: Custom blend this is.. All cores are on 62-66c (Warm day and my bedroom door was closed), IBT is getting ~75c. A bit less difference then what I said before but still. This is just starting IBT though I know it gets hotter with more RAM and after ~20 runs or so. Prime was running for about an hour when I got 65c temps too.
> I'm running SP1 since ages ago, I didn't even know about AVX for a while. Lets just say I don't usually get Windows updates for a reason..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2.54 of IBT
> and 27.9 of Prime95 and it even says "AVX test"
> Using HWMonitor to check temps too, Speccy does report the same thing though.
> Also package temps doesn't matter as much as cores does it?


Blend Test is the reason why you are not seing elevated temps. it usually starts off the Large FFT portion and it takes at least 30 mins (or so, can't remember, it's been a while since I used it) until it gets to Small FFT. just run the DSmall FFT for 30 mins and you should see some high temps. Small FFT operates on data chunks that fit the CPU cache (without using memory, not much communication through board circuits). large FFT is for testing general stability, while Small FFT should be used solely for testing CPU stability only with minimal use of RAM.

HWmonitor reported me some quirky temps on various boards in past and missed some sensors/inputs. Use RealTemp TI (gogle it, it's posted on OCN some time ago).


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha, I think I'm alright with the 2 GTX240's I've got. 480mm of rad cooling should suffice for my needs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hokies my man, you make me wanna get a loop but I can't afford one atm...I hate ya


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hokies my man, you make me wanna get a loop but I can't afford one atm...I hate ya


Welp u can buy my block/pump combo 80$ + shipping

Then pm Wermad about the Monsta 360... You can run it would out a res if u like.

You could end up with a kind pin loop for under 250$.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Blend Test is the reason why you are not seing elevated temps. it usually starts off the Large FFT portion and it takes at least 30 mins (or so, can't remember, it's been a while since I used it) until it gets to Small FFT. just run the DSmall FFT for 30 mins and you should see some high temps. Small FFT operates on data chunks that fit the CPU cache (without using memory, not much communication through board circuits). large FFT is for testing general stability, while Small FFT should be used solely for testing CPU stability only with minimal use of RAM.
> HWmonitor reported me some quirky temps on various boards in past and missed some sensors/inputs. Use RealTemp TI (gogle it, it's posted on OCN some time ago).


Will do when I'm not so busy!








Like I said custom blend was going for almost 24 hours and HWmontior recorded the max temp of like ~65c and every time I checked it, it was on ~60c.









Thanks for the help though, +Rep

EDIT: Just ran small FFT quickly before I got.. Already clost to IBT temps. Cheers for that.








Still ~75c is good for a 4.6GHz OC at 1.45v and i'm happy with that.


----------



## Hokies83

errr... i forgot the fittings.. i have all bits power there expensive but if you do not need any 90s or 45s regular compression fittings if you get Enzotech can be pretty cheap.

Just one Bits power 90 is like 19$.. you can get a 4 pack of enzotechs for like 14$.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Got ya on the spreadsheet now!!! Thanks for being patient with us during the holidays *Teh Rav3n* . You are now completely official!!!


Oh no, no worries at all. I t'was just giving you guys a hard time, all in good fun. Thanks Wargamer!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Oi! It's an awesome one for sure, but I had to settle on the UT-60 myself. Roof mounting in a Prodigy kinda limits the space, dontcha know?







I had to clearance the rad a bit to allow space for the fittings on my gpu. The Monsta, no matter what, just wouldn't fit. Otherwise, I'd have one.







See...



You can see the notch I cut in the rad housing to clear the fittings here:



I need to quit benching, and finish up the build. It's a sad little addiction, bench marking.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Will do when I'm not so busy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Like I said custom blend was going for almost 24 hours and HWmontior recorded the max temp of like ~65c and every time I checked it, it was on ~60c.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the help though, +Rep
> EDIT: Just ran small FFT quickly before I got.. Already clost to IBT temps. Cheers for that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still ~75c is good for a 4.6GHz OC at 1.45v and i'm happy with that.


Told ya








thanks for rep! at this pace I should be finally able to sell in OCN Market in a few months









here's the link to RealTemp TI (it's the latest version, Techpowerup still shows old 3.70 - an older edition):
http://www.overclock.net/t/1330144/realtemp-t-i-edition


----------



## Hokies83

Yeah im all done shame i got to drain the loop and replace the MB tho heh...

Im trying to save to get a Case Labs TH10 with the 84mm roof ,,,, 630$......

I was like 100$ away before i bought another Apongee drive 2..







However i just sold my H-100 for 65$ and if i sell this Apongee drive ill be back at where i was before.

If i get enough... ima put this cosmos 2 up for 200$ Shipped...

Im full Cooler Master boycott mode after there failure with this case and support for a side window.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I don't know how you do it *FtW 420* - you get great vcore on your chips for the OCs you do. Are those known binned chips you buy? Or do you juct have a stack of them you go through until you find these great chips. Maybe its you super OC abilites.... Anyway, nice OC vcores.
> On the dead chip, I have heard that PRO and Ultra are no good for ln2, but how did it kill the chip? Not cooling it enough for the vcore used, or some type of physical damage?
> And sorry about the loss.


I have one binned, & I keep trying retails. The one above does great volts at 4.7Ghz & lower, but needs big bumps for more. 4.8 at 1.34V, 4.9 at 1.41V, 5ghz at 1.53V. It wasn't bad at -100° but nothing special.
When I froze the one with ultra it started off OK, but then temps just skyrocketed. When I opened it up it was like all the tim had crawled off the IHS, tried it with normal tim in a couple different mobos but doesn't POST anymore.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp u can buy my block/pump combo 80$ + shipping
> Then pm Wermad about the Monsta 360... You can run it would out a res if u like.
> You could end up with a kind pin loop for under 250$.


It sounds neat, but I need to replace my 3770k first and save for a monitor...I want a 1080p IPS screen, like 22".
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> errr... i forgot the fittings.. i have all bits power there expensive but if you do not need any 90s or 45s regular compression fittings if you get Enzotech can be pretty cheap.
> Just one Bits power 90 is like 19$.. you can get a 4 pack of enzotechs for like 14$.


I'll keep that in mind, perhaps I can gather some cash and end up with two 3770k's, one from rma (which I'll delid and water cool) and a retail sample to bench on cold.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Oh no, no worries at all. I t'was just giving you guys a hard time, all in good fun. Thanks Wargamer!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oi! It's an awesome one for sure, but I had to settle on the UT-60 myself. Roof mounting in a Prodigy kinda limits the space, dontcha know?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had to clearance the rad a bit to allow space for the fittings on my gpu. The Monsta, no matter what, just wouldn't fit. Otherwise, I'd have one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See...
> 
> You can see the notch I cut in the rad housing to clear the fittings here:
> 
> I need to quit benching, and finish up the build. It's a sad little addiction, bench marking.


I'm with ya on that one!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah im all done shame i got to drain the loop and replace the MB tho heh...
> Im trying to save to get a Case Labs TH10 with the 84mm roof ,,,, 630$......
> I was like 100$ away before i bought another Apongee drive 2..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> However i just sold my H-100 for 65$ and if i sell this Apongee drive ill be back at where i was before.
> If i get enough... ima put this cosmos 2 up for 200$ Shipped...
> Im full Cooler Master boycott mode after there failure with this case and support for a side window.


Cooler Master makes OK products, nothing special or completely polished. I like the cm 690 II, it's a nice cheap case which has some modding potential.
But their stock fans suck, same as their cheap psu's.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I have one binned, & I keep trying retails. The one above does great volts at 4.7Ghz & lower, but needs big bumps for more. 4.8 at 1.34V, 4.9 at 1.41V, 5ghz at 1.53V. It wasn't bad at -100° but nothing special.
> When I froze the one with ultra it started off OK, but then temps just skyrocketed. When I opened it up it was like all the tim had crawled off the IHS, tried it with normal tim in a couple different mobos but doesn't POST anymore.


Sad to hear


----------



## Hokies83

Thing with case labs is if you get 84mm extended roof when u buy the case it is 45$..

If you buy it afterwards it is 199$... lol so ima buy it with the case lol.


----------



## King4x4

Hookies how does that apogee compare to the EK blocks?

Thinking of doing an order from performance-pcs before years end for some kinky stuff!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Hookies how does that apogee compare to the EK blocks?
> Thinking of doing an order from performance-pcs before years end for some kinky stuff!


Id say close or better.. It is the best Swiftech has to offer.
I got mine up for 80$ Shipped in the market place









It out performs the Apongee HD.




Motor type Electronically commutated, brushless DC, spherical motor
Nominal voltage 12 V DC
Operating voltage range 9 to 13.4 VDC
Max. nominal power (@12 V) 18 W
Max. nominal current (@12 V) 1.5 A
Max. nominal head (@12 V) 14.7 ft (4.4m)
Max nominal discharge (@12 V) ~ 4.75 GPM (17.5 LPM)
Maximum pressure 22 PSI (1.5 BAR)
Temperature range Up to 140 °F (60 °C)
Electrical power connector Molex 4 pin
PWM + RPM Signals 4-pin connector
Speed adjustment range 1300 to 4500 rpm
RoHS Compliant
MTBF 50,000 Hours


----------



## xTristinx

Anyone know how to get rid of the 1.55v limit on the Sabertooth Z77?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTristinx*
> 
> Anyone know how to get rid of the 1.55v limit on the Sabertooth Z77?


What 1.55v limit *xTristinx*? I have had my Sabertooth over 1.6v for vcore, and I think it can go over 1.9v for vcore. What voltage are you refering to?


----------



## King4x4

The reason I am asking hookies I got the EK and my chip is going at 80'C [email protected] and 4.9ghz.

Wanna reach 5ghz stable but it is harsh :<

4.7ghz and 1.36v seems more resnoable at the moment.


----------



## xTristinx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> What 1.55v limit *xTristinx*? I have had my Sabertooth over 1.6v for vcore, and I think it can go over 1.9v for vcore. What voltage are you refering to?


my vcore i believe. hWhenever i go over it tells me the the voltage is too high and to press F1 to go to setup


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTristinx*
> 
> my vcore i believe. hWhenever i go over it tells me the the voltage is too high and to press F1 to go to setup


That's a security feature...it should be under health or whatever tab, something like halt on error, disable that. It stops you from booting if it detects abnormal stuff like no cpu fan and so on. I always deactivate that.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> The reason I am asking hookies I got the EK and my chip is going at 80'C [email protected] and 4.9ghz.
> Wanna reach 5ghz stable but it is harsh :<
> 4.7ghz and 1.36v seems more resnoable at the moment.


Dam im 1.5v 5ghz 65c lol.


----------



## xTristinx

Was it something like "wait for F1...
EDIT: Nvm found it. Had to go to monitor and go to cpu voltage and hit it to pull up the drop down menu


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Dam im 1.5v 5ghz 65c lol.


what's your ambient room temp at?


----------



## King4x4

Mine is about 23'C and coolant is about 28'C.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> what's your ambient room temp at?


78-80 degrees.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> The reason I am asking hookies I got the EK and my chip is going at 80'C [email protected] and 4.9ghz.
> Wanna reach 5ghz stable but it is harsh :<
> 4.7ghz and 1.36v seems more resnoable at the moment.


i can run IBT at 5ghz with my aircooler, and have the same 80C temps as you,
yours should be better


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTristinx*
> 
> Was it something like "wait for F1...
> EDIT: Nvm found it. Had to go to monitor and go to cpu voltage and hit it to pull up the drop down menu


Cool!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 78-80 degrees.


that's impressive!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Well I'm rolling the die again. I had a problem appear tonight out of the blue. Audio's rapid fire stuttering, random crashes and such. It's not oc related at all, it's doing it at with everything @ stock clocks. I've been running memtest on the ram in another box for the past 6 hours, and while running another stick in a single slot (which I know to be good, tested both slots), it is still crashing & stuttering.

I've got some Loctite 5900 flange adhesive sealant, which incidentally looks exactly like the goop Intel applies when dried (and about the same consistency), actually I wouldn't be surprised if that's what Intel actually uses. It's some pretty pricey stuff for what it is.

Anyway, I'll have my replacement 3750k on Thursday, and then back to Amazon the original goes. Wish me luck, I very well might just need it.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Well I'm rolling the die again. I had a problem appear tonight out of the blue. Audio's rapid fire stuttering, random crashes and such. It's not oc related at all, it's doing it at with everything @ stock clocks. I've been running memtest on the ram in another box for the past 6 hours, and while running another stick in a single slot (which I know to be good, tested both slots), it is still crashing & stuttering.
> 
> I've got some Loctite 5900 flange adhesive sealant, which incidentally looks exactly like the goop Intel applies when dried (and about the same consistency), actually I wouldn't be surprised if that's what Intel actually uses. It's some pretty pricey stuff for what it is.
> 
> Anyway, I'll have my replacement 3750k on Thursday, and then back to Amazon the original goes. Wish me luck, I very well might just need it.


Sorry if this seems dumb but 3750k is the 3570k right? I assume it is just a typo? Also, good luck with the chip.







Sad when a chip goes bad!


----------



## VonDutch

Good luck Teh Rav3n








i bet your next chip will be a better one,
but thats not hard...lol


----------



## Teh Rav3n

@ Swag: Lol! Yeah, my bad. I was typing fast in my frustration and missed that typo entirely.









Oh, and you guys can just call me Raven. I'll know you're talking to me, it's my tag across gaming & it's a part of my Halloween haunt. So everyone calls me by the name. Even my neighbors!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Well I'm rolling the die again. I had a problem appear tonight out of the blue. Audio's rapid fire stuttering, random crashes and such. It's not oc related at all, it's doing it at with everything @ stock clocks. I've been running memtest on the ram in another box for the past 6 hours, and while running another stick in a single slot (which I know to be good, tested both slots), it is still crashing & stuttering.
> I've got some Loctite 5900 flange adhesive sealant, which incidentally looks exactly like the goop Intel applies when dried (and about the same consistency), actually I wouldn't be surprised if that's what Intel actually uses. It's some pretty pricey stuff for what it is.
> Anyway, I'll have my replacement 3750k on Thursday, and then back to Amazon the original goes. Wish me luck, I very well might just need it.


Good luck with it!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> @ Swag: Lol! Yeah, my bad. I was typing fast in my frustration and missed that typo entirely.


No problem at all, I was just wondering because it seems I see a lot of people type it like that and I'm beginning to think Intel released a 3750k in a covert op.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Thanks guys







I should have figured something was going wrong from the outset with such a crap oc. Oh well, at least it's within the return grace period.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> No problem at all, I was just wondering because it seems I see a lot of people type it like that and I'm beginning to think Intel released a 3750k in a covert op.


ROFL! I just fell out of my chair laughing so hard.







Thanks, it's been a frustrating evening. I needed a lol!









I'ma quote this earlier edit so everyone can see.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Oh, and you guys can just call me Raven. I'll know you're talking to me, it's my tag across gaming & it's a part of my Halloween haunt. So everyone calls me by the name. Even my neighbors!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Thanks guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I should have figured something was going wrong from the outset with such a crap oc. Oh well, at least it's within the return grace period.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> No problem at all, I was just wondering because it seems I see a lot of people type it like that and I'm beginning to think Intel released a 3750k in a covert op.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ROFL! I just fell out of my chair laughing so hard.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks, it's been a frustrating evening. I needed a lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'ma quote this earlier edit so everyone can see.
Click to expand...

That's why OCN has the best clubs.







Everyone needs a laugh at the end of the day! I keep OCN on one of my monitors all the time for these type of things! Anyway, good luck with the process, it should be fairly easy and quick!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> @ Swag: Lol! Yeah, my bad. I was typing fast in my frustration and missed that typo entirely.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and you guys can just call me Raven. I'll know you're talking to me, it's my tag across gaming & it's a part of my Halloween haunt. So everyone calls me by the name. Even my neighbors!


in that case, just call me VonDutch


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That's why OCN has the best clubs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone needs a laugh at the end of the day! I keep OCN on one of my monitors all the time for these type of things! Anyway, good luck with the process, it should be fairly easy and quick!


True, true on all counts. Still, thanks







Amazon's amazing when it comes to RMA's. Hell, I bet I could send them a P4 and they would be like...OKAY!







APPROVED!!!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> in that case, just call me VonDutch


Lol! I can't call you Von Deutsch?









You're probably right, it sure won't take much luck to get a better oc'ing chip than this one.







Otoh, I was actually referring to the risk of RMA'ing of a de-lidded chip. Hopefully they'll just toss it in garbage bin @ Intel.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That's why OCN has the best clubs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone needs a laugh at the end of the day! I keep OCN on one of my monitors all the time for these type of things! Anyway, good luck with the process, it should be fairly easy and quick!
> 
> 
> 
> True, true on all counts. Still, thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon's amazing when it comes to RMA's. Hell, I bet I could send them a P4 and they would be like...OKAY!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> APPROVED!!!
Click to expand...

They probably wouldn't be able to tell whether or not it was an Ivy or P4. I think they just check if there is a CPU in the box and just send it back in the line.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> They probably wouldn't be able to tell whether or not it was an Ivy or P4. I think they just check if there is a CPU in the box and just send it back in the line.


*sends in de-lidded i3 3220 with i7 IHS*

*gets i7 3770k*


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> They probably wouldn't be able to tell whether or not it was an Ivy or P4. I think they just check if there is a CPU in the box and just send it back in the line.


*sends in intentionally broken de-lidded i3 3220 with i7 IHS*

*gets i7 3770k*


----------



## Swag

Yea! They would just accept it. I'm not even joking! That's how nice they are!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Lol! Whether they'd notice or not, I couldn't. I put to much emphasis on an old concept, honor. I don't feel bad about rma'ing a 2 week old chip when I know that I did nothing to make fail. If I had though, I'd eat the cost myself.

Actually, it's pretty amazing. My first venture since P3 with Intel, and it's a bobo cpu. What are the odds of that? No lottery tickets for me today...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Lol! Whether they'd notice or not, I couldn't. I put to much emphasis on an old concept, honor. I don't feel bad about rma'ing a 2 week old chip when I know that I did nothing to make fail. If I had though, I'd eat the cost myself.
> 
> Actually, it's pretty amazing. My first venture since P3 with Intel, and it's a bobo cpu. What are the odds of that? No lottery tickets for me today...


Don't think that Intels are bad.







Just bad luck! Your bad luck! You probably fell in love with your broken chip.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't think that Intels are bad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just bad luck! Your bad luck! You probably fell in love with your broken chip.


Oh crap, now you have me thinking this is gonna be like my marriages! Wife 1.0 was great to begin with, and then she broke! Wife ver. 2.1 is freaking sweeeeeet and perfect. Lol!

To be honest, this is prolly Intel's revenge for me being so anti-Intel over the last decade.







Well, if AMD hadn't deceived us over Bulldozer, and taken 3 steps backwards. I'd still be with them. Hey! Another great ex-wife analogy!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't think that Intels are bad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just bad luck! Your bad luck! You probably fell in love with your broken chip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh crap, now you have me thinking this is gonna be like my marriages! Wife 1.0 was great to begin with, and then she broke! Wife ver. 2.1 is freaking sweeeeeet and perfect. Lol!
> 
> To be honest, this is prolly Intel's revenge for me being so anti-Intel over the last decade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, if AMD hadn't deceived us over Bulldozer, and taken 3 steps backwards. I'd still be with them. Hey! Another great ex-wife analogy!
Click to expand...

Revisions are great.







Haha! My brother had bought a Bulldozer and he said it'll perform better than my 3570k. After OCing and everything we benchmarked and I won. He sold the BD and bought a SB-E. Lol!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Revisions are great.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha! My brother had bought a Bulldozer and he said it'll perform better than my 3570k. After OCing and everything we benchmarked and I won. He sold the BD and bought a SB-E. Lol!










I was a 990FX early adopter, I bought that line of bull John Fruehe was selling hook, line, and sinker. Purchased the 990FXA-UD5 as soon as Newegg had them on site, then the delays. Then the benchmarks at the review sites... And then I was p!ssed. Not that I expected a completely equivalent IPC to Sandy, but close to it. After all, that's what we'd been led to believe. I left my 1090T in it instead of buying that power hungry slow pile of...well it was aptly named for sure.

I'll still support their gpu division, but until they are on par w/ Intel's current i5/i7 series for IPC, no more AMD cpu's in my main machines. Home servers & HTPC's on the cheap? Ok. No problem. Otherwise, in my desktop, no thanks. -_-

Holy hell, I just realized what time it is. Off to bed before someone wakes up and realizes I'm not there.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was a 990FX early adopter, I bought that line of bull John Fruehe was selling hook, line, and sinker. Purchased the 990FXA-UD5 as soon as Newegg had them on site, then the delays. Then the benchmarks at the review sites... And then I was p!ssed. Not that I expected a completely equivalent IPC to Sandy, but close to it. After all, that's what we'd been led to believe. I left my 1090T in it instead of buying that power hungry slow pile of...well it was aptly named for sure.
> I'll still support their gpu division, but until they are on par w/ Intel's current i5/i7 series for IPC, no more AMD cpu's in my main machines. Home servers & HTPC's on the cheap? Ok. No problem. Otherwise, in my desktop, no thanks. -_-
> Holy hell, I just realized what time it is. Off to bed before someone wakes up and realizes I'm not there.


same here, i had a 1100T, and bought a 990FXA-UD3 till 8150 came out, 1100T was better on most parts then 8150..lol
after that, i decided to buy intel 3770K, man , im still happy i did, best choice ever,
gave my old rig to my kiddo, did buy a 8350 for him a few weeks ago,
i thought the difference between 1100T and 8350 was good enough,
if you already have a mobo, hes so happy now with his 8 cores..kids









anyways, sleep well raven, vondeutch is a no go ...lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Revisions are great.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha! My brother had bought a Bulldozer and he said it'll perform better than my 3570k. After OCing and everything we benchmarked and I won. He sold the BD and bought a SB-E. Lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was a 990FX early adopter, I bought that line of bull John Fruehe was selling hook, line, and sinker. Purchased the 990FXA-UD5 as soon as Newegg had them on site, then the delays. Then the benchmarks at the review sites... And then I was p!ssed. Not that I expected a completely equivalent IPC to Sandy, but close to it. After all, that's what we'd been led to believe. I left my 1090T in it instead of buying that power hungry slow pile of...well it was aptly named for sure.
> 
> I'll still support their gpu division, but until they are on par w/ Intel's current i5/i7 series for IPC, no more AMD cpu's in my main machines. Home servers & HTPC's on the cheap? Ok. No problem. Otherwise, in my desktop, no thanks. -_-
> 
> Holy hell, I just realized what time it is. Off to bed before someone wakes up and realizes I'm not there.
Click to expand...

Yes yes, I do agree that AMD GPUs are still competing. They are the cheaper alternative too. Their CPUs however suck so much. They can't do anything anymore and I hate that. No competition = no great releases by Intel! Anyway, I just don't like how my drivers been failing. I know some people say the drivers have been fixed but really, I still have so much problems with them! (AMD Drivers)


----------



## Gomi

CPU-Z stopped reporting my Vcore - Been trying with OC settings and Default settings, same stuff - Its stuck at 1.056 in CPU-Z.

Not that it bothers me alot - Just seems weird that it stopped working out of the blue. Got a Multimeter strapped to the motherboard now.


----------



## Matt-Matt

This is totally offtopic but I was just thinking about this today while I was shaving..

How old is the average de-lidder? I like to think i'm one of the younger ones though being 18 and a half


----------



## kzone75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yes yes, I do agree that AMD GPUs are still competing. They are the cheaper alternative too. Their CPUs however suck so much. They can't do anything anymore and I hate that. No competition = no great releases by Intel! Anyway, I just don't like how my *drivers been failing*. I know some people say the drivers have been fixed but really, I still have so much problems with them! (AMD Drivers)


User error for sure..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This is totally offtopic but I was just thinking about this today while I was shaving..
> How old is the average de-lidder? I like to think i'm one of the younger ones though being 18 and a half


im above average when it comes to age, like the vcore on my ivy








im 49


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzone75*
> 
> User error for sure..


she has a nice voice, lights,
downloading some albums as we speak, thanks








album, the listening, i like more then the second album


----------



## Swag

@Kzone, I tried to make it work but it seems like it doesn't like my card. I'm not sure if it's my card or if it's the driver. I have a dated card.









When I delidded, I was 16, now I'm 17.







Younger than you I guess. I probably dealt with my first delid when I was fairly young with my dad being a computer modder/OCer too.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im above average when it comes to age, like the vcore on my ivy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im 49


Hahaha








It's weird when you think about forums, you don't know who you could be talking to or giving advice to. I'm just re-capping from a similar conversation I had with a 50 year old guy who was getting back into flight sims


----------



## kzone75

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *kzone75*
> 
> User error for sure..
> 
> 
> 
> she has a nice voice, lights,
> downloading some albums as we speak, thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> album, the listening, i like more then the second album
Click to expand...

She's truly, very, really good.







Enjoy her music.







If you want to join the fan club (if your not already there) let me know.







Need more peeps and a lot more posts.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Hahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's weird when you think about forums, you don't know who you could be talking to or giving advice to. I'm just re-capping from a similar conversation I had with a 50 year old guy who was getting back into flight sims


i remember playing on a commodore64 with my older brother,
took minutes "loadtime" before you could play a game..



working with tapes..lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yes yes, I do agree that AMD GPUs are still competing. They are the cheaper alternative too. Their CPUs however suck so much. They can't do anything anymore and I hate that. No competition = no great releases by Intel! Anyway, I just don't like how my drivers been failing. I know some people say the drivers have been fixed but really, I still have so much problems with them! (AMD Drivers)


I think both camps can be picky at times, but so far my Nvidia experience(I somehow thought of Jimi holding a 670 and trying to smoke it lol, then smashing it on an amp xD)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This is totally offtopic but I was just thinking about this today while I was shaving..
> How old is the average de-lidder? I like to think i'm one of the younger ones though being 18 and a half


27 puts me in between so far.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzone75*
> 
> She's truly, very, really good.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enjoy her music.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you want to join the fan club (if your not already there) let me know.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Need more peeps and a lot more posts.


I keep seeing her pop up now and then...I listened to a few songs, pretty cool but not my style. A coworker got an instant crush on her when peeping at my screen though lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i remember playing on a commodore64 with my older brother,
> took minutes "loadtime" before you could play a game..
> 
> 
> working with tapes..lol


Oldest console was my original american Nes, and I do hold an original copy of Monkey Island 1 in cd.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i remember playing on a commodore64 with my older brother,
> took minutes "loadtime" before you could play a game..
> 
> 
> working with tapes..lol


Yeah, my IT teacher bought in an old PC similar to that. Actually I think it was a Commodore 64? Anyway it costed him like $12,000 back in the day or something crazy, it still works!








That screen reminds me of vice city too








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think both camps can be picky at times, but so far my Nvidia experience(I somehow thought of Jimi holding a 670 and trying to smoke it lol, then smashing it on an amp xD)
> 27 puts me in between so far.
> I keep seeing her pop up now and then...I listened to a few songs, pretty cool but not my style. A coworker got an instant crush on her when peeping at my screen though lol
> Oldest console was my original american Nes, and I do hold an original copy of Monkey Island 1 in cd.


I played the escape to monkey island?! Rather interesting game for its time!








I is teh youngest sah far!


----------



## King4x4

I almost had a heart attack today... came back from work and found the 3770k I delidded yesterday was 100'C!!! (Left it folding).

Tried troubleshooting it and the only thing that came to mind was the TIM dried off.

Replaced the TiM and I can do 4.8ghz on 1.4v and the temperatures never go over 65'C.

Used a different type of TiM though... had some gelid extreme laying around.

From [email protected] of 85'C to [email protected] of 65'C!!!!

Yup first application was meh!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I just put like 20 games in my GOG.com wishlist lol
Ah, the nostalgia...anyway, some of those games should be in everyone's hdd (like Postal 1 and Blood 1?)


----------



## chris-br

I'm 41. ;P


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> same here, i had a 1100T, and bought a 990FXA-UD3 till 8150 came out, 1100T was better on most parts then 8150..lol
> after that, i decided to buy intel 3770K, man , im still happy i did, best choice ever,
> gave my old rig to my kiddo, did buy a 8350 for him a few weeks ago,
> i thought the difference between 1100T and 8350 was good enough,
> if you already have a mobo, hes so happy now with his 8 cores..kids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways, sleep well raven, vondeutch is a no go ...lol


Heheh! I gave my son my old system, and he loves it. He's finally old enough to appreciate the difference between his xbox & the computer.







I think I'm going to upgrade it to an 8350 for his birthday in a couple of months. Hopefully the IMC improvements will give a little room for pushing my old benching ram (SuperTalent Project X 2000 Mhz sticks), which are stuck at 1744 Mhz 5-5-5-16 1T. A better IMC could push them to a lot higher freq's, but not on Thuban. I really wish I could run 1.8v (that's where they really start to shine) on the mem w/ Ivy & Sandy, those sticks would seriously dominate.









Thanks for the well wishes, I slept very well thank you. I bid you the same.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yes yes, I do agree that AMD GPUs are still competing. They are the cheaper alternative too. Their CPUs however suck so much. They can't do anything anymore and I hate that. No competition = no great releases by Intel! Anyway, I just don't like how my drivers been failing. I know some people say the drivers have been fixed but really, I still have so much problems with them! (AMD Drivers)


Agreed, aside from driver issues. Honestly, the only driver issues I had in...idk, since the actual ATi days before AMD bought them, was running a set of crossfire R5770 Hawk's in my HTPC. I really doubt in retrospect that it was indeed a driver issue, and I think it was more pcb design related, because few others had the same issue (and I looked extensively). The problems were in the old Q3 engine games. Ground textures disappearing on all but the first set of drivers. A shame really, because I was playing Wolfenstein: ET competitively back then. I sold them and replaced with an E6 5870 2 Gb, and my problems disappeared.









I don't even want to talk about nVidia. Still mad over a certain driver that killed my 8800...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> CPU-Z stopped reporting my Vcore - Been trying with OC settings and Default settings, same stuff - Its stuck at 1.056 in CPU-Z.
> Not that it bothers me alot - Just seems weird that it stopped working out of the blue. Got a Multimeter strapped to the motherboard now.


Uh oh! :/ I'd rather have my MM on the board anyway.







I wish they'd put a few plugs for probes on board instead of just test points. Maybe a BNC with switchable outputs on the psu for plugging in an O-scope too. One can wish.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This is totally offtopic but I was just thinking about this today while I was shaving..
> How old is the average de-lidder? I like to think i'm one of the younger ones though being 18 and a half


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im above average when it comes to age, like the vcore on my ivy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im 49


VonDutch has a few years on me, but not many at all. Me'self? I'm 44.







Oh and Comode 64's...as depressing as Colecovision.







My very first console was Atari Pong btw. Lol! This one...



Idc what the kids think, the 70's and early 80's weren't even cool back then.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Heheh! I gave my son my old system, and he loves it. He's finally old enough to appreciate the difference between his xbox & the computer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I'm going to upgrade it to an 8350 for his birthday in a couple of months. Hopefully the IMC improvements will give a little room for pushing my old benching ram (SuperTalent Project X 2000 Mhz sticks), which are stuck at 1744 Mhz 5-5-5-16 1T. A better IMC could push them to a lot higher freq's, but not on Thuban. I really wish I could run 1.8v (that's where they really start to shine) on the mem w/ Ivy & Sandy, those sticks would seriously dominate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the well wishes, I slept very well thank you. I bid you the same.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agreed, aside from driver issues. Honestly, the only driver issues I had in...idk, since the actual ATi days before AMD bought them, was running a set of crossfire R5770 Hawk's in my HTPC. I really doubt in retrospect that it was indeed a driver issue, and I think it was more pcb design related, because few others had the same issue (and I looked extensively). The problems were in the old Q3 engine games. Ground textures disappearing on all but the first set of drivers. A shame really, because I was playing Wolfenstein: ET competitively back then. I sold them and replaced with an E6 5870 2 Gb, and my problems disappeared.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't even want to talk about nVidia. Still mad over a certain driver that killed my 8800...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Uh oh! :/ I'd rather have my MM on the board anyway.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish they'd put a few plugs for probes on board instead of just test points. Maybe a BNC with switchable outputs on the psu for plugging in an O-scope too. One can wish.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VonDutch has a few years on me, but not many at all. Me'self? I'm 44.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh and Comode 64's...as depressing as Colecovision.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My very first console was Atari Pong btw. Lol! This one...
> 
> Idc what the kids think, the 70's and early 80's weren't even cool back then.


You CAN run 1.8v, up to 1.95v on z77...thing is you won't max the oc on hypers or other higher volt rated chips cause those need cold and over 2v for best results.
For Ivy PSC or uber high binned Samsung on air or Hynix for cold. (you'd need 2800mhz c9 to beat 2600mhz 8-11-7-28-1t psc)
It's always worth a shot, see how far they clock with your ib.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You CAN run 1.8v, up to 1.95v on z77...thing is you won't max the oc on hypers or other higher volt rated chips cause those need cold and over 2v for best results.
> For Ivy PSC or uber high binned Samsung on air or Hynix for cold. (you'd need 2800mhz c9 to beat 2600mhz 8-11-7-28-1t psc)
> It's always worth a shot, see how far they clock with your ib.


Really? Everyone's saying 1.65v limit for Ivy from everything I've seen so far, good to know! Thanks & repped.







Yup, I love my MGH-E's, but unfortunately with the Apogee Drive II, I'm limited to only one DIMM because of the necessary pump arrangement. Both on the Z77e-itx due to cpu socket placement (too close to the pci-e), and because of the placement of the UT-60 in the Prodigy it resides in. Only low profile memory fits in slot 1, so I have the Sammie green "Miracle" sticks, which I've managed 2000 Mhz 10-11-10-24-1N with so far. Still testing them though.

However, no more testing until the new cpu gets here... I'm posting from my NAS box atm.


----------



## King4x4

Thinking of making my BCLK go constant 102mhz full time..... Must... get... to.... 5ghz....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Really? Everyone's saying 1.65v limit for Ivy from everything I've seen so far, good to know! Thanks & repped.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup, I love my MGH-E's, but unfortunately with the Apogee Drive II, I'm limited to only one DIMM because of the necessary pump arrangement. Both on the Z77e-itx due to cpu socket placement (too close to the pci-e), and because of the placement of the UT-60 in the Prodigy it resides in. Only low profile memory fits in slot 1, so I have the Sammie green "Miracle" sticks, which I've managed 2000 Mhz 10-11-10-24-1N with so far. Still testing them though.
> However, no more testing until the new cpu gets here... I'm posting from my NAS box atm.


I'd go up to 1.75 or perhaps 1.7v as 24/7 voltages, depending on the ram ic...1.8v and up for benching.
Anyway, all the ram I have is for benching purposes so I'm not a good example lol


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go up to 1.75 or perhaps 1.7v as 24/7 voltages, depending on the ram ic...1.8v and up for benching.
> Anyway, all the ram I have is for benching purposes so I'm not a good example lol


Rofl! Yeah, mine too. The Samsung's are the sole non-dedicated benching set I have. Even the old sticks in my NAS box are CL 4 Patriot Extreme DDR2 800. Lol! I have 8 Gb of 2000 Mhz CL 8 Dominator GT's w/ the NMH-E Hyper's tucked away in a box too, prolly one of the few set's still alive actually. The Project X's are the 4 Gb kit of CL 7 2000 Mhz MGH-E's, I should've gotten 8 gig's though. Retrospect...


----------



## ivanlabrie

haha! nice...I have two Crucial D9's in a bag in my drawer lol
(and more bbse and psc)








Sold my Samsung greenies cause they clocked bad (for my taste)
My next upgrade will be a liquid cooling loop or a pot, depending on how good my new 3770k ends up being. If the imc is half decent but it doesn't clock as high with low volts I'll delid and water cool it, sell my gpu after the new 89xx and 7xx series come out and grab one of those or a cheaper 7970 matrix lol


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Nice! I don't have time for much benching any more, teenager's & pre-teen's in the house will do that to ya







I still get the thrill, and it prolly shows. I have a 8500 BTU window AC sitting around, that I started to convert to a phase change cooler. But then, the kids come first in everything, and it's been collecting dust ever since. I only need the lines & block, and some day I'll get around to it. Not today though.

I'd have to dig through boxes in the garage to find the Dom's, but here's my STT Hypers & Patriots Extreme's.







My bad, the STT's were (2) 2 x 1 kit's, I could've sworn they were a matched kit. I distinctly remember ordering them that way from SuperBiiz... -_-


----------



## Bigdale7

Hummm I'm willing to bet I am the oldest member of this club.. rather new to this hobby/sport but have been walking this earth for 0ver 60 years now.


----------



## martinhal

What is safe max vcore on water just to do validation ? Mine will post at 1.525 @ 5.4 but Windows crashes on startup.


----------



## c2thew

This is how NOT to apply arctic Mx-4/over-applying TIM. I also mounted the evo 212 to face upwards rather than blowing out the back. I reversed it so now it blows out the back.



I also came to the conclusion that since the copper heatsink should be parallel with the cpu die to maintain maximum thermal transfer. When the evo 212 heatsink was positioned horizontally, the copper pipes didn't necessarily have full contact with the heat spreader.


Idle temperatures (can't believe 1 core is at 1 degrees celsius

4.7 overclock using stock bios settings. (just changed the frequency timer to 47 and enabled turbo asrock extreme 4 bios) ambient temperature is 60 degrees so I think 4.7 is the max i can push this chip on air cooling before hitting tjmax

ok so after the 6th time i've reseated the IHS and my hyper 212 evo cooler using arctic mx-4 I finally came to the realization of what I was doing wrong.


----------



## c2thew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> I used one like this, except the larger diameter version. It's just the standard felt polishing wheel found in nearly every dremel accessory kit.





I tried the eraser method. It didn't get all of the residue off, but i did have more control without the fear of melting the pcb.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> What is safe max vcore on water just to do validation ? Mine will post at 1.525 @ 5.4 but Windows crashes on startup.


No need to post with such a high multi, post with 5ghz and slowly work your way up changing multiplier and eventually bclk and voltage from within Windows. That's the way to do a proper validation!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Nice! I don't have time for much benching any more, teenager's & pre-teen's in the house will do that to ya
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still get the thrill, and it prolly shows. I have a 8500 BTU window AC sitting around, that I started to convert to a phase change cooler. But then, the kids come first in everything, and it's been collecting dust ever since. I only need the lines & block, and some day I'll get around to it. Not today though.
> I'd have to dig through boxes in the garage to find the Dom's, but here's my STT Hypers & Patriots Extreme's.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My bad, the STT's were (2) 2 x 1 kit's, I could've sworn they were a matched kit. I distinctly remember ordering them that way from SuperBiiz... -_-


hehehe! Nice...I always wanted to mod an AC into a single stage or a water chiller (the latter being much easier) but I never did get to do it. I still have plenty of time to save, perhaps I can build a custom loop first and then turn it into a chiller








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> 
> 
> I tried the eraser method. It didn't get all of the residue off, but i did have more control without the fear of melting the pcb.


I used a cotton swab with alcohol and my fingernails...


----------



## stickg1

So back to the 7970 that the ebay guy wants a refund on. He finally sent me a picture, and this is what he wants a $300 refund for...



I mean come on, just bend it back, you could probably do it with your hands...


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol he is a criminal...come on, gimme a break! lmao

No way in hell man, screw that.


----------



## stickg1

I told him he has a few options.

1. Fix it yourself, with your hands or a set of vise-grips, pliers, or anything really.
2. Send it back to me and I will fix it, but you have to pay to and from shipping costs.
3. Send it back to me, wait for me to resell it, then you can have your refund but the shipping cost is on you.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So back to the 7970 that the ebay guy wants a refund on. He finally sent me a picture, and this is what he wants a $300 refund for...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean come on, just bend it back, you could probably do it with your hands...


If that was me, personally, and he was asking for a refund, I'd just tell him exactly where to shove it. That's just ridiculous!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So back to the 7970 that the ebay guy wants a refund on. He finally sent me a picture, and this is what he wants a $300 refund for...
> 
> I mean come on, just bend it back, you could probably do it with your hands...


Why i avoid Ebay XD


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So back to the 7970 that the ebay guy wants a refund on. He finally sent me a picture, and this is what he wants a $300 refund for...
> 
> I mean come on, just bend it back, you could probably do it with your hands...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol he is a criminal...come on, gimme a break! lmao
> No way in hell man, screw that.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I told him he has a few options.
> 1. Fix it yourself, with your hands or a set of vise-grips, pliers, or anything really.
> 2. Send it back to me and I will fix it, but you have to pay to and from shipping costs.
> 3. Send it back to me, wait for me to resell it, then you can have your refund but the shipping cost is on you.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> If that was me, personally, and he was asking for a refund, I'd just tell him exactly where to shove it. That's just ridiculous!


Dude, I told you it was buyers remorse... What a freaking tard...

I bought an OB GPU from Newegg once, i had that, contacted them, they gave me a 20% discount and let me keep it... Like come on... My fiance with 0 computer knowledge knows how to fix that.


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So back to the 7970 that the ebay guy wants a refund on. He finally sent me a picture, and this is what he wants a $300 refund for...
> 
> I mean come on, just bend it back, you could probably do it with your hands...


It took me a second to understand what exactly he was complaining about even with the picture... But now that I saw it....







The whole card is obviously pretty much worthless


----------



## Hokies83

I bet he did it thinking u would give him money off....


----------



## stickg1

Well now his excuse is it wont boot. And I gave him some troubleshooting tips and havent heard back from him yet. So its either fixed and hes trying to come up with an excuse or hes just dumb and trying to figure out how to clear his CMOS and thinking "*** IS A POWER SUPPLY?!!"


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I bet he did it thinking u would give him money off....


THIS...


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So back to the 7970 that the ebay guy wants a refund on. He finally sent me a picture, and this is what he wants a $300 refund for...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean come on, just bend it back, you could probably do it with your hands...


LOL what a joke this is. My 5 year old told me what was wrong with it and how to fix it


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Yeah, scammer. No doubt. "OMG! That thin easily bent metal can't be straightened out!" I wish I had pics of all of the cars/trucks, crushed beer can style, that I've brought back to as good as new over the years. I restore them for my other hobby, & sometimes for profit.









What a useless monkey, with toe jam no less. :/ I would use a scanner, to scan teh finger...


----------



## xTristinx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This is totally offtopic but I was just thinking about this today while I was shaving..
> How old is the average de-lidder? I like to think i'm one of the younger ones though being 18 and a half


Im only 16....... but I do already have a job at a consulting and IT company so you can say im ahead.


----------



## Swag

@stickg1

I would definitely not consider a refund at all. He may have damaged it himself because he just wants a refund. Tell him if it is damaged, deal with the company's RMA service.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @stickg1
> I would definitely not consider a refund at all. He may have damaged it himself because he just wants a refund. Tell him if it is damaged, deal with the company's RMA service.


Yeah the only problem is I'm the 2nd owner and he is the 3rd. I tried going to Visiontek's website and it has been hijacked and is now a site that sells erectile disfunction pills, lol... www.visiontek.com/

So I'm going to file a claim with USPS. If they can't reimburse me, I can't afford to reimburse him back myself so eBay is going to have to step in and do something.

EDIT: The visiontek site seems to be working now...


----------



## luciddreamer124

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTristinx*
> 
> Im only 16....... but I do already have a job at a consulting and IT company so you can say im ahead.


16 here as well


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @stickg1
> I would definitely not consider a refund at all. He may have damaged it himself because he just wants a refund. Tell him if it is damaged, deal with the company's RMA service.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah the only problem is I'm the 2nd owner and he is the 3rd. I tried going to Visiontek's website and it has been hijacked and is now a site that sells erectile disfunction pills, lol... www.visiontek.com/
> 
> So I'm going to file a claim with USPS. If they can't reimburse me, I can't afford to reimburse him back myself so eBay is going to have to step in and do something.
> 
> EDIT: The visiontek site seems to be working now...
Click to expand...

Yea, it looked fine a second ago.







I hate when sites get hacked, I tried to get onto my favorite streams and nothing showed up other than a screen saying you have a virus... Just file a claim with USPS, if they can't, tell the new owner to deal with Ebay or something else. It was obviously not your fault and since he already showed the picture of it bent, it means he bent it back. With this, you can just claim that he may have damaged it during that bending and it is completely not your fault. Ebay will either reimburse you or him. Probably you if you decide to take back to GPU.


----------



## stickg1

I'm going to RMA my P8Z77-V Pro. The sound chip is dead and my overall experience has been really buggy. And from my research I'm not the only one. So I'm going to get a new motherboard, I will use it while my ASUS is in RMA and when I get the ASUS back I will likely sell it and keep the new motherboard I'm about to buy.

IDK what to get though. My budget would be $125-$225. I value the opinions in the thread, so throw some ideas out for me.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm going to RMA my P8Z77-V Pro. The sound chip is dead and my overall experience has been really buggy. And from my research I'm not the only one. So I'm going to get a new motherboard, I will use it while my ASUS is in RMA and when I get the ASUS back I will likely sell it and keep the new motherboard I'm about to buy.
> 
> IDK what to get though. My budget would be $125-$225. I value the opinions in the thread, so throw some ideas out for me.


Maximus V Gene or Sabertooth Z77

I like only those 2 boards, maybe if you to the higher priced, the EVGA board is good too.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This is totally offtopic but I was just thinking about this today while I was shaving..
> How old is the average de-lidder? I like to think i'm one of the younger ones though being 18 and a half


33yrs old here, married


----------



## xTristinx

When I first joined this club when delidding and putting my cpu back in my socket..... I bent a few pins like a ******. Well that days is in the past as I spend some time today and bent the pins back in place and got my 2 dimm slots back.







now its time to really use my delidded cpu to its max


----------



## chronicfx

I am 35 yrs old. I would have de-lidded if I were 18 too though, in fact I would not have even thought twice about risking the chip.

Question guys.. I want to buy an rs360 xspc rasa kit (I know the RX is better I just love the price on the rs360 tho) anyways I am running a 3570k at 4.8ghz at 1.32v and my highest temp in prime 95 is 71 degrees C and my highest temps gaming are 54 degrees C using my D14. I have no desire to spend $200+ on a pair of GPU blocks before anyone says it. But, I always wanted to put together a water cooling kit because it looks fun, but at $170 shipped..Am I just being impulsive?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i remember playing on a commodore64 with my older brother,
> took minutes "loadtime" before you could play a game..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> working with tapes..lol


LOL! that reminds me of my Atari 800XL, also with tapes haha! it took ages to load a game and everybody had to tip toe around it or the loading process would crap out ha ha!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Really? Everyone's saying 1.65v limit for Ivy from everything I've seen so far, good to know! Thanks & repped.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yup, I love my MGH-E's, but unfortunately with the Apogee Drive II, I'm limited to only one DIMM because of the necessary pump arrangement. Both on the Z77e-itx due to cpu socket placement (too close to the pci-e), and because of the placement of the UT-60 in the Prodigy it resides in. Only low profile memory fits in slot 1, so I have the Sammie green "Miracle" sticks, which I've managed 2000 Mhz 10-11-10-24-1N with so far. Still testing them though.
> However, no more testing until the new cpu gets here... I'm posting from my NAS box atm.


I did 1.7V a few times on my current chip and zero degradation so far. on former chips (damaged by my faulty former MB) I was going up to 1.9V LOL since I didn't care, chips were going for RMA/exchange anyways.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd go up to 1.75 or perhaps 1.7v as 24/7 voltages, depending on the ram ic...1.8v and up for benching.
> Anyway, all the ram I have is for benching purposes so I'm not a good example lol


yeah, same here, trying no to exceed 1.7V, however I have weird stability problems even at 5.1GHz @ 1.6V, I keep getting BSOD 124 in middle of 3dmark11 even though it passes Cinebench without WHEA. tried upping VCCIO, helped a bit but still happens grrrrr .... can't bench past 5.0GHz
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> What is safe max vcore on water just to do validation ? Mine will post at 1.525 @ 5.4 but Windows crashes on startup.


need more vcore like hell ... what's the last stable multiplier and vcore you tried?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> 
> 
> I tried the eraser method. It didn't get all of the residue off, but i did have more control without the fear of melting the pcb.


interesting alternative! thanks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Why i avoid Ebay XD


that claim is ridicolous, I can't see in no way how that would get damaged during shipping without crushing the whole backplate side of card ...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm going to RMA my P8Z77-V Pro. The sound chip is dead and my overall experience has been really buggy. And from my research I'm not the only one. So I'm going to get a new motherboard, I will use it while my ASUS is in RMA and when I get the ASUS back I will likely sell it and keep the new motherboard I'm about to buy.
> IDK what to get though. My budget would be $125-$225. I value the opinions in the thread, so throw some ideas out for me.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Maximus V Gene or Sabertooth Z77
> I like only those 2 boards, maybe if you to the higher priced, the EVGA board is good too.


Ev ga is still a bit behind with the BIOS. The maximus V gene is good (just... small), the MSI mpower & Asrock OC formula are also great boards in the price range.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm going to RMA my P8Z77-V Pro. The sound chip is dead and my overall experience has been really buggy. And from my research I'm not the only one. So I'm going to get a new motherboard, I will use it while my ASUS is in RMA and when I get the ASUS back I will likely sell it and keep the new motherboard I'm about to buy.
> IDK what to get though. My budget would be $125-$225. I value the opinions in the thread, so throw some ideas out for me.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Maximus V Gene or Sabertooth Z77
> I like only those 2 boards, maybe if you to the higher priced, the EVGA board is good too.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ev ga is still a bit behind with the BIOS. The maximus V gene is good (just... small), the MSI mpower & Asrock OC formula are also great boards in the price range.
Click to expand...

I haven't been a fan of MSI or Asrock after I've tried them. My brother's Asrock X79 board that he paid a premium for, broke on its first run. Like, constant crashes. The MVG is the best board out there for the price I think. Not because I have one, but because my experience with one has been nothing but astounding! It's just the best board for the price. The power it packs in such a small size is amazing too. Also, I've called Asus many times pertaining my board and everything, they even shipped me out a new board first before I shipped mine back!


----------



## Hokies83

In that price range id say the GigaByte UP5.

I was gonna snag one till i seen it used realtec onboard audio.. so id have to spend an extra 100$ on a audio card XD


----------



## Valgaur

Holy crap peoples! in 36 hours we had over 200 posts.









Well done!









I will be making changes to the front page with all the info with VonDutch here either today or tomorrow. Vondutch as well I need your Gmail if you have one so I can let you into my spreedsheet. I'll PM you.

*I would very much like input from you guys the members on the current OP so I can either make it easier to read or more user friendly. For instance do you guys like the multiple spoilers to clean it up or make it just all the information on the front page? This club is not just mine but yours and for all the people looking for the information, so lets make it that way!







*

Okay long winded time now.

@ Hokies! mr. Valgaur can take my new window and eat it. It's looking good man! I hate to say this about the apoggee pump HS you got but I kinda saw that coming with the amount of weight sitting on that mb\obo socket. Thats why I will be using a regular block, I will also be doing a WC loop this summer with I believe it was 6 or 7 rads. 1 because it's OCN. 2. because I want 2 or 3 680's in my comp and never have to upgrade it again. I will also be using a monsta 80m 360 in the roof. Kinda wanna mod it and squeeze the 480 in that bad boy. Plus with all the parts I'll have extra's for future builds which is why I'm going overkill on it.

@ Raven yes I paid attention to the posts where you said what to call you!







Welcome and enjoy all the information that is here.







Looking forward to see your contributions as well!

@ 4X4 Well done sir with the new delid as well!!!









@ the man who is using Artic TIM Good luck with the gelid now that TIM has a much better viscosity so you "shouldnt" have any issues witht he TIM really. Good to see that you had those temp drops as well!

Sorry I wasn't here today at all like I proclaimed the other day! Had an emergency happen and I should be good for a while now lol. Had to shoot to Nebraska for the day but it's okay









Also tot he man who used his pencil eraser! you sir are going on the front page sir!







Well done with that thought on that, I will be trying this on my new chip..... whenever it freaking gets to me!









Yeah that 7970 (taking a guess here) that has the fleabay and bent slots, tell that guy that if he can't bend those back into place he doesn't deserve to have a 7970 in the first place. Plain and simple.

All other issues and cranky panssy's let me know and I'll complain about it as well!









Sorry kinda groggy from my no sleep days and 17 hours of driving. but I'm still alive I suppose.


----------



## Rakhasa

What are the downsides of delidding? Anything towards CPU life span?? It looks scary as hell, but those drops in temps make it very tempting..


----------



## ivanlabrie

You gotta be extra careful, and you lose your warranty.

@chronicfx: I too will be building a custom loop. I opted to pick the parts myself, if I were you I'd go with a really custom loop, but the xspc rasa kits are a good start, though the raystorm ones are much better.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> What are the downsides of delidding? Anything towards CPU life span?? It looks scary as hell, but those drops in temps make it very tempting..


You will not be able to achieve the absolute max clock. Like let's say your chips maximum clock (regardless of vcore!) is 7GHz, after delid, you won't be able to reach that. Of course, if you aren't an extreme overclocker, then you don't need to worry about it because it doesn't affect the normal clocks. Normal clocks will actually require lower vcore because of the lower temps.


----------



## Rakhasa

so if you delid the cpu.. where does the thermal paste go? Or do you not even need a cooler after?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> What are the downsides of delidding? Anything towards CPU life span?? It looks scary as hell, but those drops in temps make it very tempting..


Only thing I see is it is a pita to put in the socket if the mb is still in the case and not flat.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> What are the downsides of delidding? Anything towards CPU life span?? It looks scary as hell, but those drops in temps make it very tempting..


No downsides except if you aren't careful you could damage your CPU very easily, that's about it really, you just have to make sure all of your marbles are in line and ready.

No damage to life span based on what actually takes place to the CPU. All you are doing is reducing a height issue that limits the TIM from Intel and you are making better contact as well as better TIM for more thermal passage thus lower temps. its really not the scary once you look at all the info and see all the knowledge that we have here.

Don't be scared, we all were at one point, even I was! And I'd rather be scared to be careful than be charging ahead confident and not worried and damage it. When one worries they take things slowly and focus on that one thing!

Just tell us your issues and questions if you have any and we will be right here for ya!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> so if you delid the cpu.. where does the thermal paste go? Or do you not even need a cooler after?


You clean it up like how you would with the IHS and apply your own thermal paste. The most recommended TIM is the Coollaboratory Liquid Pro. Yes you need a cooler after it. It just fixes the temps, not completely gets rid of it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Only thing I see is it is a pita to put in the socket if the mb is still in the case and not flat.


I never took my mobo out......... at all. Was really easy actually


----------



## Rakhasa

will practice on an old cpu i no longer use.. this is scary but seems veryyy interesting.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> will practice on an old cpu i no longer use.. this is scary but seems veryyy interesting.


We can all help. When it was like 3 of us who delidded, it was hard for people to get into it because there wasn't much help. Now, so many of us are here to help that it'll be easier. Don't think it's easy and definitely don't be careless! Like OCing, patience is key to delidding!


----------



## Hokies83

Also i already had bent pins I repaired before this thing is heavy enough to push it down so they touch..

Why I justbsoldnit and ordered the new version of it which is half it's size and one of the best blocks out there.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> What are the downsides of delidding? Anything towards CPU life span?? It looks scary as hell, but those drops in temps make it very tempting..


if anything,
lower temps = longer lifespan








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> will practice on an old cpu i no longer use.. this is scary but seems veryyy interesting.


i bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro, practice on some of those will give you a good feel
on how to delid


----------



## ivanlabrie

I opted for the xspc raystorm instead...and a separate mcp35x plus a res/top combo thingie which increases the pumps performance and is easier to bleed/fill/drain.
I'm already saving for my loop


----------



## King4x4

Coming from a guy who destroyed one 3770k and successfully delidded another... ITS WORTH THE RISK!

My first 3770k can only work with one piece of ram but it is all ready doing 4.7ghz on a noctua [email protected]'C

Second one is stable on 4.9ghz (Only 20mhz less then the magical 5000







)@1.45v on EK [email protected]'C

Made the 3770k go crazy on the benchmark where I was the second 3770k to enter the Top 30 Unigine benchmarks in Overclock.net


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I opted for the xspc raystorm instead...and a separate mcp35x plus a res/top combo thingie which increases the pumps performance and is easier to bleed/fill/drain.
> I'm already saving for my loop


you won't regret the Raystorm choice







I love mine! it provides good temps and also tends to look awesome with acrylic bracket and LEDs (2 of them come standard). MCP35x is a very decent choice with the huge head pressure it gives, however for Raystorm even a standard D5 works great. I use a D5 Strong here at 24V, that coupled with 2x 670 Razor blocks and RX240+EX360 rads. can't complain, this setup performs awesome (if not for my hot room ambient temps) and looks amazing too









Don't go with RS series rads, they are cheap and thin with a high fins count, that means you will NEED high speed fans for them and that means hella loud setup. Take RX (very thick, low FPI count at 8) or EX (half the thickness, FPI count in teens). I don't know the latest AX series, not sure what it provides.

A friendly advice, flush the XSPC rads before use! I failed to do this and RX rad was spilling some whitish stuff into the loop during initial use ... also never go wtih Primochill's Primoflex LRT tubing, it plasticizes like hell (ask me how I know), if you want colored tubing (e.g. UV reactive) then go with (German) Feser UV Active or new (they seem to fix the problem) Primochill's Advanced LRT (only UV Blue at the moment, other colors are solid and non-UV reactive).

I would definitely go with reservoir above the pump, even though you could run some setups without a res, it's highly recommended to have a fill port right above the pump, so it never runs dry (it damages the pump after a few uses on dry air).

good luck!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm going to RMA my P8Z77-V Pro. The sound chip is dead and my overall experience has been really buggy. And from my research I'm not the only one. So I'm going to get a new motherboard, I will use it while my ASUS is in RMA and when I get the ASUS back I will likely sell it and keep the new motherboard I'm about to buy.
> 
> IDK what to get though. My budget would be $125-$225. I value the opinions in the thread, so throw some ideas out for me.
> 
> 
> 
> Maximus V Gene or Sabertooth Z77
> 
> I like only those 2 boards, maybe if you to the higher priced, the EVGA board is good too.
Click to expand...

Well *stickg1*, I own a Sabertooth and they are not bad boards - Stable with good performance and 5 year Warranty. But if you want something to get better OCing with, then I'd recommend the MSI MPower. I have tried both, still have the Sabertooth, but would go with the MPower if I could do it over as it ended up a better benching and OCing board.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This is totally offtopic but I was just thinking about this today while I was shaving..
> How old is the average de-lidder? I like to think i'm one of the younger ones though being 18 and a half
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 33yrs old here, married
Click to expand...

I'm 52 and married with teenagers.....one about to start college.....









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xTristinx*
> 
> When I first joined this club when delidding and putting my cpu back in my socket..... I bent a few pins like a ******. Well that days is in the past as I spend some time today and bent the pins back in place and got my 2 dimm slots back.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now its time to really use my delidded cpu to its max


Great going *xTristinx*! Good to hear that you fixed it up!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Rakhasa*
> 
> will practice on an old cpu i no longer use.. this is scary but seems veryyy interesting.
> 
> 
> 
> We can all help. When it was like 3 of us who delidded, it was hard for people to get into it because there wasn't much help. Now, so many of us are here to help that it'll be easier. Don't think it's easy and definitely don't be careless! Like OCing, patience is key to delidding!
Click to expand...

It is scary and that is because there is a risk, but most good things in life that are worth a dam have risk! And the results are worth it to all of us on here who have done it. Great temps.









Plus, as *Swag* has noted, we have a ton of good info on how to do it right and lots of support if/when you have any questions. So you are not alone.









Read up on the info we have collected on the first page. Look at a video or two. _Then take your time_. It ends up much easier than it looks once you do it. And the second time (or more) is so easy after the first time.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I opted for the xspc raystorm instead...and a separate mcp35x plus a res/top combo thingie which increases the pumps performance and is easier to bleed/fill/drain.
> I'm already saving for my loop


Raystorm is meh. you kinda paid more money for less performance US prices wise.

raystorm is a good deal if u just want it and no more..

If you want more not so great.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Raystorm is meh. you kinda paid more money for less performance US prices wise.


I still love my DT Sniper...it's sexy







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> you won't regret the Raystorm choice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love mine! it provides good temps and also tends to look awesome with acrylic bracket and LEDs (2 of them come standard). MCP35x is a very decent choice with the huge head pressure it gives, however for Raystorm even a standard D5 works great. I use a D5 Strong here at 24V, that coupled with 2x 670 Razor blocks and RX240+EX360 rads. can't complain, this setup performs awesome (if not for my hot room ambient temps) and looks amazing too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't go with RS series rads, they are cheap and thin with a high fins count, that means you will NEED high speed fans for them and that means hella loud setup. Take RX (very thick, low FPI count at 8) or EX (half the thickness, FPI count in teens). I don't know the latest AX series, not sure what it provides.
> A friendly advice, flush the XSPC rads before use! I failed to do this and RX rad was spilling some whitish stuff into the loop during initial use ... also never go wtih Primochill's Primoflex LRT tubing, it plasticizes like hell (ask me how I know), if you want colored tubing (e.g. UV reactive) then go with (German) Feser UV Active or new (they seem to fix the problem) Primochill's Advanced LRT (only UV Blue at the moment, other colors are solid and non-UV reactive).
> I would definitely go with reservoir above the pump, even though you could run some setups without a res, it's highly recommended to have a fill port right above the pump, so it never runs dry (it damages the pump after a few uses on dry air).
> good luck!


I won't get a kit...I'll buy stuff in batches to save on shipping/tax.

Not sure on the rad, but I like the look of the Monsta 80mm thick one. And for the high fpi thing, I wanna get the maximum cooling potential, I don't care for noise and I already got two 220cfm fans man. I'm a hardcore bencher


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I still love my DT Sniper...it's sexy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


That's the block I looked at a while back, I think I'll be getting that one honestly.


----------



## King4x4

Do it like an extreme bencher who hates noise... Get more rads LOL!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not sure on the block choice or rad choice or nothing really...I want the absolute best and thickest rad, perhaps black ice gtx stuff or the thickest/heaviest chunk of copper available.
I wanna make it as cheap as possible, but the best performing stuff, and noise is not a concern.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I haven't been a fan of MSI or Asrock after I've tried them. My brother's Asrock X79 board that he paid a premium for, broke on its first run. Like, constant crashes. The MVG is the best board out there for the price I think. Not because I have one, but because my experience with one has been nothing but astounding! It's just the best board for the price. The power it packs in such a small size is amazing too. Also, I've called Asus many times pertaining my board and everything, they even shipped me out a new board first before I shipped mine back!


I haven't been an asrock fan either, I do want to try an OC Formula but that is the only asrock board to date I would pay money for. I have an mvg too, great board but it really is just a bit too small, can't use a ram fan since the clips touch the back of the gpu, get a big aircooler & it's like playing tetris trying to get a gpu & heatsink in the same place at the same time...
I've killed my share of MSI boards, they do take a pretty good beating before I win. The mpower has been great so far.

I forgot to add Gigabyte z77 in there, playing on a z77 ud3h right now. Good board so far, just wish the clear cmos button was a bit further away from the reset & it had at least 1more USB port that doesn't use the VIA controller.


----------



## Hokies83

Nexxos 80mm 480 is king.. all copper...

I still would have got the better cpu block...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's the block I looked at a while back, I think I'll be getting that one honestly.


You won't regret it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I haven't been an asrock fan either, I do want to try an OC Formula but that is the only asrock board to date I would pay money for. I have an mvg too, great board but it really is just a bit too small, can't use a ram fan since the clips touch the back of the gpu, get a big aircooler & it's like playing tetris trying to get a gpu & heatsink in the same place at the same time...
> I've killed my share of MSI boards, they do take a pretty good beating before I win. The mpower has been great so far.
> I forgot to add Gigabyte z77 in there, playing on a z77 ud3h right now. Good board so far, just wish the clear cmos button was a bit further away from the reset & it had at least 1more USB port that doesn't use the VIA controller.


I have two ASRock Z77 boards, both have had no issues and give high OC's ([email protected] and [email protected]). I think it's just personal experience in terms of if you've had buggy/faulty boards.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Nexxos 80mm 480 is king.. all copper...
> I still would have got the better cpu block...


Not the Monsta then? That's a higher fpi rad?
And better cpu block, being the one that comes with the 35x pump? That might save me a few bucks too vs wb+pump.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not the Monsta then? That's a higher fpi rad?
> And better cpu block, being the one that comes with the 35x pump? That might save me a few bucks too vs wb+pump.


Yeah comes with the m5X pump.. that block is Swiftechs very best block better then the Apongee HD.

And yes the Nexxos Monsta 80mm 480 rad. When i get my Case Labs TH 10 ima put 4 of those in it for fun XD...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah comes with the m5X pump.. that block is Swiftechs very best block better then the Apongee HD.
> And yes the Nexxos Monsta 80mm 480 rad. When i get my Case Labs TH 10 ima put 4 of those in it for fun XD...


Awesome!!!









I think I'll go with that block and get a 5.25 bay res, with water level indicator.
For rad I'll most likely go with the one with highest FPI to take advantage of my 220cfm fans, probably these: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_457_667_200&products_id=20983


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I'll go with that block and get a 5.25 bay res, with water level indicator.
> For rad I'll most likely go with the one with highest FPI to take advantage of my 220cfm fans, probably these: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_457_667_200&products_id=20983


Meh http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_457_667_1075&products_id=34505

It is 80mm thick so u can use more silent fans and still get as good or better results then 60mm and under rads with noisey monsters on them.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not sure on the block choice or rad choice or nothing really...I want the absolute best and thickest rad, perhaps black ice gtx stuff or the thickest/heaviest chunk of copper available.
> I wanna make it as cheap as possible, but the best performing stuff, and noise is not a concern.


I always play around the 1400-1800 rpm fan limit... thats the max I would go on my fans.





The thickest is the RX360 (63mm) (Main reason I went with my Danger Den case is because I found it cheap localy (250$) and the mofo can fit of these rads with two in the push/pull config and I just love THICK rads).

Second best is the SR-1 from hardware labs (54mm) and looks the sexiest but reason I went for the RX was there was a $20 premium between them.

Best compermise though seems to be the XSPC EX360 with it being 34mm thick and about 10~15% less performance at the same RPM. The thing about it is that it scales very well with RPM and if you are debating whether to go with RX360 in a single push config or an EX360 in push/pull config the EX will win.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_457_667_1075&products_id=34505
> It is 80mm thick so u can use more silent fans and still get as good or better results then 60mm and under rads with noisey monsters on them.


Hokies I haven't looked into rads in the past year or so, are there any performance tests comparing that Rad with the other top performers?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I won't get a kit...I'll buy stuff in batches to save on shipping/tax.
> Not sure on the rad, but I like the look of the Monsta 80mm thick one. And for the high fpi thing, I wanna get the maximum cooling potential, I don't care for noise and I already got two 220cfm fans man. I'm a hardcore bencher


here's the thing. if you get a kit you pay actually less, only drawback is that you get 7/16'' compression fittings and most folks (inlucding me) opt in for 1/2'' x 3/4'' tubing, so 7/16'' x 5/8'' compressions would be useless for you... and the stock tubing is garbage.

anyways, as per rads ... it's actually the thinner EX line outperforming RX (thick 62mm or so) line at higher fan speeds (and static pressure, that's what matters for fans ... and their bearings for longevity). however at low/silent fan speeds up to 1,400rpm the RX line outperforms the EX line. hope you understand what I'm saying. I use a fan controller and for daily use those fans on both rads (push-pull setup here) spin at merely 40% of max speeds (1,900rpm) bumping up only when CPU gets hot (over 70C) thanks to my RheoSmart controller. I have actually both thick and thin (RX+EX) rads here, but if I were to buy them over again, I'd go with 2x EX line or some other brand, e.g. BlackIce or aCool.

either way XSPC RS line sucks and stay away from it LOL! take any rad(s) that fits you!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Hokies I haven't looked into rads in the past year or so, are there any performance tests comparing that Rad with the other top performers?


There is and i have read them but do not remember where to find them..

I do remember the Nexxos Monsta 80mm rads coming out on top by a good margin..

Thats why i went with them and will be staying with them.

Material internal: Mostly copper
Material casing: Side panels steel, threads brass, copper chambers
Colour: Black
Dimensions (LxWxH): 522 x 124 x *86mm*
Connection threads: 6x1/4"
Outlet Connection threads: 1x1/4"
Mounting thread size: M3
Pressure tested: 1.5bar

LoL the Monsta is 86 mm thick .


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> here's the thing. if you get a kit you pay actually less, only drawback is that you get 7/16'' compression fittings and most folks (inlucding me) opt in for 1/2'' x 3/4'' tubing, so 7/16'' x 5/8'' compressions would be useless for you... and the stock tubing is garbage.
> anyways, as per rads ... it's actually the thinner EX line outperforming RX (thick 62mm or so) line at higher fan speeds (and static pressure, that's what matters for fans ... and their bearings for longevity). however at low/silent fan speeds up to 1,400rpm the RX line outperforms the EX line. hope you understand what I'm saying. I use a fan controller and for daily use those fans on both rads (push-pull setup here) spin at merely 40% of max speeds (1,900rpm) bumping up only when CPU gets hot (over 70C) thanks to my RheoSmart controller. I have actually both thick and thin (RX+EX) rads here, but if I were to buy them over again, I'd go with 2x EX line or some other brand, e.g. BlackIce or aCool.
> either way XSPC RS line sucks and stay away from it LOL! take any rad(s) that fits you!


While the EX360 in push/pull will beat the RX360 in push config... The RX360 in push/pull is whole other story!

But Good luck finding a case that will fit it


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> There is and i have read them but do not remember where to find them..
> I do remember the Nexxos Monsta 80mm rads coming out on top by a good margin..
> Thats why i went with them and will be staying with them.
> Material internal: Mostly copper
> Material casing: Side panels steel, threads brass, copper chambers
> Colour: Black
> Dimensions (LxWxH): 522 x 124 x *86mm*
> Connection threads: 6x1/4"
> Outlet Connection threads: 1x1/4"
> Mounting thread size: M3
> Pressure tested: 1.5bar
> LoL the Monsta is 86 mm thick .


Hokies likes them big, black, and THICK







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> While the EX360 in push/pull will beat the RX360 in push config... The RX360 in push/pull is whole other story!
> But Good luck finding a case that will fit it


This one will fit 8-10 86 mm 480 rads in push pull with 38mm fans..
If you add the 84mm raised roof option.




http://www.caselabs-store.com/magnum-th10-case/
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Hokies likes them big, black, and THICK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


There is a white nexxos monsta to


----------



## Swag

Anyone here have a spare LGA 1155 mounting kit for the NH-D14? I will purchase it if any of you have one. Thanks!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This one will fit 8-10 86 mm 480 rads in push pull with 38mm fans..
> If you add the 84mm raised roof option.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.caselabs-store.com/magnum-th10-case/


Lol Hok...your'e living in a dream world if you think most people have the space for a case like that







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Lol Hok...your'e living in a dream world if you think most people have the space for a case like that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I have space for about 25 of them









There are alot of people who do not live in 200 sqft city lofts lol. Also think outside of the box... use it as a TV stand or something lol.

i got 2000 sqft of country quiet living and im 20 mins from the center of the city.


----------



## Valgaur

https://frozenqshop.com/index.php/lf250-1.html

I want these res's they are sooooo sick. plus with my green theme, gonna make it a toxic look. I think for the rads I will mod a push pull feature into my Cosmos 2 case and squeeze a 360 or 480 80 mm low fpi rad for better transfer since thick rads with high fpi means you need crazy fans. Then with that top rads I'll have either 2 240mm with thickness's of 60mm or 2 80mm in the bottom. then bring this up to the CPU then take a dive out of the case for a dual system of either 60mm or 80mm low fpi 120mm rads on my exhaust port and tie them together then go to the GPU's then bring it all back to m either 250mm or 400mm res by frozenQ. All UV acid green tubing and jet black compressions fittings and 1 quick disconnect.

If I can get my big 80mm thick rad in the tops mod right...... I'll have push and pull no problem, will require some crazy cutting and metal work but I'm up to it for this summer. Gotta do something besides work right?

All in all I'll have a CPU and either 2 or 3 gpu's cooled..... it's gonna be an amazing WC setup but it's gonna be tight in there, but I'll make it all fit just right.









Even gonna try and hide the pump as well. Ohh might even throw a nice odd ball 200mm rad in there as well. right in the intake


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> There is and i have read them but do not remember where to find them..
> I do remember the Nexxos Monsta 80mm rads coming out on top by a good margin..
> Thats why i went with them and will be staying with them.
> Material internal: Mostly copper
> Material casing: Side panels steel, threads brass, copper chambers
> Colour: Black
> Dimensions (LxWxH): 522 x 124 x *86mm*
> Connection threads: 6x1/4"
> Outlet Connection threads: 1x1/4"
> Mounting thread size: M3
> Pressure tested: 1.5bar
> LoL the Monsta is 86 mm thick .


In that case an RX360 in push/pull will beat it's pants off easy LOL

Nexxos Monsta Push/Pull (136mm) > RX120 Push/Pull (113mm) > EX120 Push/Pull (84mm)=~ Nexxos Monsta Push (111mm)> RX120 Push (88mm) > EX120 Push (59mm)


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have space for about 25 of them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are alot of people who do not live in 200 sqft city lofts lol. Also think outside of the box... use it as a TV stand or something lol.
> i got 2000 sqft of country quiet living and im 20 mins from the center of the city.


I actually have quite a spacious 1br apartment in Brooklyn but I don't couldn't think of a single place I'd put that case. I love computers but don't want them being the center of attention in my home. I'm sure there is a percentage of people that have the space for it, but I'd be willing to bet the percentage is small







.


----------



## Swag

Sorry guys but I'm having some of that buyer's remorse thing.

Was the case + cooler I bought worth it when I already have one?

I just bought a C70 (Military Green) + NH-D14 for $120. Was it worth it? Should I return them?

I planned to sell the H100 and my old case but I don't know now. Should I just return my new hardware?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I actually have quite a spacious 1br apartment in Brooklyn but I don't couldn't think of a single place I'd put that case. I love computers but don't want them being the center of attention in my home. I'm sure there is a percentage of people that have the space for it, but I'd be willing to bet the percentage is small
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


i dont have mine in the living room, but in the hallway, no noise at all..and very cool









door behind my comp is from the livingroom..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> In that case an RX360 in push/pull will beat it's pants off easy LOL
> Nexxos Monsta Push/Pull (136mm) > RX120 Push/Pull (113mm) > EX120 Push/Pull (84mm)=~ Nexxos Monsta Push (111mm)> RX120 Push (88mm) > EX120 Push (59mm)


RX360 sucks. cheapo rad =/

Monsta 86mm in push/pull will destroy it. not even on the same planet.

RX 360 in push/pull prolly pretty similar to my Monsta 240 in push/pull.

The Nexxos Monsta are almost always sold out.. everybody is switching over to them.


----------



## Valgaur

Squeeze this



Into here....



But with this it wont be hanging on the ceiling like an H100 or something like that. nor will it be on the top either. It's going to be inside the frame aka. cut a hole and fill that hole with the rad itself and make custom brackets to fit it and then have the fans right on it for the thickest rad to fit.... and not ruin the case's integrity.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Hokies likes them big, black, and THICK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Yeah, me too







yummy lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This one will fit 8-10 86 mm 480 rads in push pull with 38mm fans..
> If you add the 84mm raised roof option.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.caselabs-store.com/magnum-th10-case/
> There is a white nexxos monsta to


No need for a bigger case, my cm 690 II is up to the task for 2 240 rads with 38mm fans in push.
I can always build a 'pedestal' to fit the second rad or whatever I want under the case.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> https://frozenqshop.com/index.php/lf250-1.html
> I want these res's they are sooooo sick. plus with my green theme, gonna make it a toxic look. I think for the rads I will mod a push pull feature into my Cosmos 2 case and squeeze a 360 or 480 80 mm low fpi rad for better transfer since thick rads with high fpi means you need crazy fans. Then with that top rads I'll have either 2 240mm with thickness's of 60mm or 2 80mm in the bottom. then bring this up to the CPU then take a dive out of the case for a dual system of either 60mm or 80mm low fpi 120mm rads on my exhaust port and tie them together then go to the GPU's then bring it all back to m either 250mm or 400mm res by frozenQ. All UV acid green tubing and jet black compressions fittings and 1 quick disconnect.
> If I can get my big 80mm thick rad in the tops mod right...... I'll have push and pull no problem, will require some crazy cutting and metal work but I'm up to it for this summer. Gotta do something besides work right?
> All in all I'll have a CPU and either 2 or 3 gpu's cooled..... it's gonna be an amazing WC setup but it's gonna be tight in there, but I'll make it all fit just right.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even gonna try and hide the pump as well. Ohh might even throw a nice odd ball 200mm rad in there as well. right in the intake


Try the pedestal thing...seems like your build will be quite cool








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry guys but I'm having some of that buyer's remorse thing.
> Was the case + cooler I bought worth it when I already have one?
> I just bought a C70 (Military Green) + NH-D14 for $120. Was it worth it? Should I return them?
> I planned to sell the H100 and my old case but I don't know now. Should I just return my new hardware?


Nah, keep them, sell the old stuff!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i dont have mine in the living room, but in the hallway, no noise at all..and very cool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> door behind my comp is from the livingroom..


We got the same case!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i dont have mine in the living room, but in the hallway, no noise at all..and very cool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> door behind my comp is from the livingroom..


I guess I'm just OCD about these things, I like things to look clean, organized, and to match the rest of my stuff







.


----------



## Valgaur

Ivan, completely forgot about the pedestal!







now throw a 480 80mm rad in as well. along with all the other rads!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> While the EX360 in push/pull will beat the RX360 in push config... The RX360 in push/pull is whole other story!
> But Good luck finding a case that will fit it


LOL, true! hence the reason why I haven't gone with it LOL! I could only fit thin (EX) 360 in intake area of my case with fans in push-pull. I also hung the thick RX240 on the rear of the case using a swiftech radbox!
While front one you can't see in pic, it's there, what you can see is the RX240










here's my whole system (old pics, now it has a second 670 in the loop too):

this pic is even older, it shows former motherborad and older tubing (infamouse Primoflex LRT ha ha, looks same as Feser UV Blue LOL):

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> https://frozenqshop.com/index.php/lf250-1.html
> I want these res's they are sooooo sick. plus with my green theme, gonna make it a toxic look. I think for the rads I will mod a push pull feature into my Cosmos 2 case and squeeze a 360 or 480 80 mm low fpi rad for better transfer since thick rads with high fpi means you need crazy fans. Then with that top rads I'll have either 2 240mm with thickness's of 60mm or 2 80mm in the bottom. then bring this up to the CPU then take a dive out of the case for a dual system of either 60mm or 80mm low fpi 120mm rads on my exhaust port and tie them together then go to the GPU's then bring it all back to m either 250mm or 400mm res by frozenQ. All UV acid green tubing and jet black compressions fittings and 1 quick disconnect.
> If I can get my big 80mm thick rad in the tops mod right...... I'll have push and pull no problem, will require some crazy cutting and metal work but I'm up to it for this summer. Gotta do something besides work right?
> All in all I'll have a CPU and either 2 or 3 gpu's cooled..... it's gonna be an amazing WC setup but it's gonna be tight in there, but I'll make it all fit just right.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even gonna try and hide the pump as well. Ohh might even throw a nice odd ball 200mm rad in there as well. right in the intake


I have a 160mm version of this res







beautiful reservoirs! order them straight form manufacturer, this way you can have side ports (I took it, very handy!) and can choose from black caps or ice caps .. or even translucent caps nowadays I think. check FQPC facebook page, Alex often has a 10% off coupon over there whenever his fan page likes go past an even number like 50k, 100k or so








i also took the dual color helix (UV blue + UV red) to match my crazy color theme in the case









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> RX360 sucks. cheapo rad =/
> Monsta 86mm in push/pull will destroy it. not even on the same planet.
> RX 360 in push/pull prolly pretty similar to my Monsta 240 in push/pull.
> The Nexxos Monsta are almost always sold out.. everybody is switching over to them.


hehe, good rads go at high price ... and there is always good demand for those








I opted in for cheaper easy to get EX360 inside case and thick RX240 outside (had it inside before while using Dual Bay reservoir). XSPC rads are very decent performers, but it's true they won't beat the best out there. and yeah, they are cheap, but it only helps the price vs performacne ratio!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Squeeze this
> 
> Into here....
> 
> But with this it wont be hanging on the ceiling like an H100 or something like that. nor will it be on the top either. It's going to be inside the frame aka. cut a hole and fill that hole with the rad itself and make custom brackets to fit it and then have the fans right on it for the thickest rad to fit.... and not ruin the case's integrity.


I can't see it happening without some case modding... unless you want to install it on the top might need to drill tube ports) or hang it on the outside in the rear using a swiftech radobx like I did with RX240









Swiftech Radbox ($12 from perofrmance-pcs last time I checked):


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I have a 160mm version of this res
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beautiful reservoirs! order them straight form manufacturer, this way you can have side ports (I took it, very handy!) and can choose from black caps or ice caps .. or even translucent caps nowadays I think. check FQPC facebook page, Alex often has a 10% off coupon over there whenever his fan page likes go past an even number like 50k, 100k or so
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also took the dual color helix (UV blue + UV red) to match my crazy color theme in the case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hehe, good rads go at high price ... and there is always good demand for those
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I opted in for cheaper easy to get EX360 inside case and thick RX240 outside (had it inside before while using Dual Bay reservoir). XSPC rads are very decent performers, but it's true they won't beat the best out there. and yeah, they are cheap, but it only helps the price vs performacne ratio!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't see it happening without some case modding... unless you want to install it on the top might need to drill tube ports) or hang it on the outside in the rear using a swiftech radobx like I did with RX240


Kind of that idea with the rad but, you cut the fan slots ou and insert the rad into the actualy frame of the top itself so the rad is part of the case. which will then give you plenty of fan room unlike the original case features. Then have all the pumping and such go as I please muhahahahahaha. but I think I'll have to do a dual pump system you?

total rad count is 8 if I go bonkers on it. a 80mm 360 dual 60mm 240's then dual/single 80mm 120 a 200mm rad and a 80mm 480 as well..... and 2-3 gpu full blocks and a cpu block and all compression fitting and not sure on the tube sizing yet gonna have to re look at that.....

found it!

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/13732/ex-tub-988/Danger_Den_DreamFlex_Value_Pack_-_Tubing_Clamps_Tube_Cutter_12ID_x_34OD_-_UV_Green.html?tl=g30c99s1614


----------



## c2thew

HELP! (i recorded this video when people were sleeping so i had to keep my voice down)






I can't get windows to boot past 4.5ghz anymore. I ran a few tests at 4.6 and 4.7 but now i'm getting windows BSOD's every time I change the frequency to 4.6. I think the previous attempts shortened the cpu chip life since I pushed it to around 93C. I even reinstalled windows to see if that would fix the issue, but it didn't. I did run memtest 64 and there were no failed memory errors. thanks

Error message: page fault in non page area. All i did was reseat my IHS and cpu cooler. I haven't touched the ram. I did tighten the cpu cooler much more this time, I just hope that I didn't damage the pcb on the 3770K.


----------



## King4x4

I won't trust that radbox to a Nexxos Monsta 360... NO WAY... It will break eventually!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL, true! hence the reason why I haven't gone with it LOL! I could only fit thin (EX) 360 in intake area of my case with fans in push-pull. I also hung the thick RX240 on the rear of the case using a swiftech radbox!
> While front one you can't see in pic, it's there, what you can see is the RX240
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> here's my whole system (old pics, now it has a second 670 in the loop too):
> 
> this pic is even older, it shows former motherborad and older tubing (infamouse Primoflex LRT ha ha, looks same as Feser UV Blue LOL):
> 
> I have a 160mm version of this res
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> beautiful reservoirs! order them straight form manufacturer, this way you can have side ports (I took it, very handy!) and can choose from black caps or ice caps .. or even translucent caps nowadays I think. check FQPC facebook page, Alex often has a 10% off coupon over there whenever his fan page likes go past an even number like 50k, 100k or so
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also took the dual color helix (UV blue + UV red) to match my crazy color theme in the case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hehe, good rads go at high price ... and there is always good demand for those
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I opted in for cheaper easy to get EX360 inside case and thick RX240 outside (had it inside before while using Dual Bay reservoir). XSPC rads are very decent performers, but it's true they won't beat the best out there. and yeah, they are cheap, but it only helps the price vs performacne ratio!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't see it happening without some case modding... unless you want to install it on the top might need to drill tube ports) or hang it on the outside in the rear using a swiftech radobx like I did with RX240
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Swiftech Radbox ($12 from perofrmance-pcs last time I checked):


Hmm id be interested if there was a way to mount a 86mm 480 rad on the back of my case @[email protected]


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Kind of that idea with the rad but, you cut the fan slots ou and insert the rad into the actualy frame of the top itself so the rad is part of the case. which will then give you plenty of fan room unlike the original case features. Then have all the pumping and such go as I please muhahahahahaha. but I think I'll have to do a dual pump system you?
> total rad count is 8 if I go bonkers on it. a 80mm 360 dual 60mm 240's then dual/single 80mm 120 a 200mm rad and a 80mm 480 as well..... and 2-3 gpu full blocks and a cpu block and all compression fitting and not sure on the tube sizing yet gonna have to re look at that.....
> found it!
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/13732/ex-tub-988/Danger_Den_DreamFlex_Value_Pack_-_Tubing_Clamps_Tube_Cutter_12ID_x_34OD_-_UV_Green.html?tl=g30c99s1614


so how many rads you say? thick 360 + thickish 240 + thick 120 + 480???? you mad bro? LOL! the rule of a thumb is 120 rad space per component plus 120 or 240 extra for CPU oc'ing (GPU's won't mind unless they are nuclear hot 480's) ... for what you mentioned, yeah you 'd need 2 pumps, but why not go with 2x 360 with a single D5 Strong pump (plus a 24V controller) and be done with it?

Do NOT take that tubing!!! that is a knock off based on Primoflex LRT! and that one is VERY BAD for you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> HELP! (i recorded this video when people were sleeping so i had to keep my voice down)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't get windows to boot past 4.5ghz anymore. I ran a few tests at 4.6 and 4.7 but now i'm getting windows BSOD's every time I change the frequency to 4.6. I think the previous attempts shortened the cpu chip life since I pushed it to around 93C. I even reinstalled windows to see if that would fix the issue, but it didn't. I did run memtest 64 and there were no failed memory errors. thanks
> Error message: page fault in non page area.


try Clearing CMOS and starting over. the reset button should be on the back of motherboard where the rear I/O panel is. shutdown, press it for 20 seconds and enter BIOS to restore some of your settings for CPU and MEM.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> HELP! (i recorded this video when people were sleeping so i had to keep my voice down)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't get windows to boot past 4.5ghz anymore. I ran a few tests at 4.6 and 4.7 but now i'm getting windows BSOD's every time I change the frequency to 4.6. I think the previous attempts shortened the cpu chip life since I pushed it to around 93C. I even reinstalled windows to see if that would fix the issue, but it didn't. I did run memtest 64 and there were no failed memory errors. thanks
> Error message: page fault in non page area. All i did was reseat my IHS and cpu cooler. I haven't touched the ram. I did tighten the cpu cooler much more this time, I just hope that I didn't damage the pcb on the 3770K.


I bet it's your RAM. 16 gigs is kinda hard to keep all the sticks at and hope they all can do it. also what is your RAM rated to as well?

If not are you doing an different vcore with 4.6 and 4.7 or are they staying at the 4.5 vcore? then with offset......... seriously .005v offset means nothing just use manual for goodness sake. if the offset was like .1 then id say keep using it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> so how many rads you say? thick 360 + thickish 240 + thick 120 + 480???? you mad bro? LOL! the rule of a thumb is 120 rad space per component plus 120 or 240 extra for CPU oc'ing (GPU's won't mind unless they are nuclear hot 480's) ... for what you mentioned, yeah you 'd need 2 pumps, but why not go with 2x 360 with a single D5 Strong pump (plus a 24V controller) and be done with it?
> Do NOT take that tubing!!! that is a knock off based on Primoflex LRT! and that one is VERY BAD for you.
> try Clearing CMOS and starting over. the reset button should be on the back of motherboard where the rear I/O panel is. shutdown, press it for 20 seconds and enter BIOS to restore some of your settings for CPU and MEM.


yeah I figured 2 pumps would be necessary.... but I have the perfect place for both right under a HDD spot right now. then what UV green tubing should I use? it's been a while since I've looked at tubing.


----------



## feniks

new night shot of my system (open door)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> HELP! (i recorded this video when people were sleeping so i had to keep my voice down)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't get windows to boot past 4.5ghz anymore. I ran a few tests at 4.6 and 4.7 but now i'm getting windows BSOD's every time I change the frequency to 4.6. I think the previous attempts shortened the cpu chip life since I pushed it to around 93C. I even reinstalled windows to see if that would fix the issue, but it didn't. I did run memtest 64 and there were no failed memory errors. thanks
> Error message: page fault in non page area. All i did was reseat my IHS and cpu cooler. I haven't touched the ram. I did tighten the cpu cooler much more this time, I just hope that I didn't damage the pcb on the 3770K.


Error message: page fault in non page area, is that with a 0x50 error code?
it points to ram problems if it is..(0x50 = RAM timings/Frequency or uncore multi unstable, increase RAM voltage or adjust QPI/VTT, or lower uncore if you're higher than 2x)
do you use xmp profile for your ram maybe?
thought this is a interesting read,
http://ohonei.hubpages.com/hub/What-Is-Page-Fault-in-Nonpaged-Area
maybe helpfull to understand why it happens


----------



## Hokies83

Get the PrimoChill *l ADVANCED* LRT Unless you want your tubes changing colors and having build up and looking chalky...
Even comes with a bottle of system prep all u need is it and a kill coil.

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17888/ex-tub-1622/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_Advanced_LRT_Tubing_12ID_x_34_OD_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_Bloodshed_Red_PFLEXA10-34-R_w_Free_Sys_Prep.html?tl=g30c99s1614
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> new night shot of my system (open door)


What size tubing is that?

I have 1/2 ID 3/4 OD and your tubing looks thicker.

Could be your case is smaller tho i donno.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yeah I figured 2 pumps would be necessary.... but I have the perfect place for both right under a HDD spot right now. then what UV green tubing should I use? it's been a while since I've looked at tubing.


I think you are over doing the amount of rads ... but it's okay with me if you want that he he








anyways, one pump should be fine, MCP35x for whatever you plan doing









there used to be a great estimator on pump flow and pressure on Martin's Labs page, but it seems no more. can email you my copy if you want (excel file), PM me if interested.

also, if you really wanna be safe with tubing, just go with excellent German quality Feser UV Active Green tubing and be happy








other than that I'd only recommend going with clear tubing (Duralene or Tygoon or Masterkleer) and Mayhems or Feser UV Green dyes (comparison here), but clear tubing clouds (all of them do) over time and dyes like to stain components inside a bit too. Personally I run only colored tubing, plain distilled water and silver kill coil (anti-microbial agent), nothing more, no dyes for me.


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17585/ex-tub-1577/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_Advanced_LRT_Tubing_12ID_x_34_OD_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_Clear_PFLEXA10-34.html?tl=g30c99s1614

UV green coolant would work I suppose just as long as the UV reactant doesn't mess with my toxic res.... but what coolant to get then... ugh


----------



## c2thew

i'll try removing 2 sticks (8gb) to see if that allows me to post. I'm using samsung low voltage 30nm ram.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17585/ex-tub-1577/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_Advanced_LRT_Tubing_12ID_x_34_OD_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_Clear_PFLEXA10-34.html?tl=g30c99s1614
> UV green coolant would work I suppose just as long as the UV reactant doesn't mess with my toxic res.... but what coolant to get then... ugh


Distilled water + mayhams dye


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Error message: page fault in non page area, is that with a 0x50 error code?
> it points to ram problems if it is..(0x50 = RAM timings/Frequency or uncore multi unstable, increase RAM voltage or adjust QPI/VTT, or lower uncore if you're higher than 2x)
> do you use xmp profile for your ram maybe?
> thought this is a interesting read,
> http://ohonei.hubpages.com/hub/What-Is-Page-Fault-in-Nonpaged-Area
> maybe helpfull to understand why it happens


could be RAM failure (if he memtested then it should be good) or CPU memory controller problem ... or simply it wants more VCCSA...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Get the PrimoChill *l ADVANCED* LRT Unless you want your tubes changing colors and having build up and looking chalky...
> Even comes with a bottle of system prep all u need is it and a kill coil.
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17888/ex-tub-1622/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_Advanced_LRT_Tubing_12ID_x_34_OD_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_Bloodshed_Red_PFLEXA10-34-R_w_Free_Sys_Prep.html?tl=g30c99s1614
> What size tubing is that?
> I have 1/2 ID 3/4 OD and your tubing looks thicker.
> Could be your case is smaller tho i donno.


yeah, my case is probably smaller, it is an ole good Thermaltake Armor VA8000 - full tower) modded to my needs, aka made cutouts in MB trays, drilled holes where I needed them and painted it all flat black









my tubing is 1/2'' ID x 3/4'' OD (Feser UV Active Blue). I don't trust Primochill at all nowadays, had my headaches with their Primoflex LRT in past ... lots of flushing, wasted time, tubing RMA, etc. have been using Feser for 3 months and zero trouble. I received the Advanced LRT (also UV BLue) from their RMA, but I don't use it, will wait for some user feedback in next 2-3 months


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Now that Ive had my fun with my chip I'm probably going to be selling it in the next week. Homeboy needs to upgrade his NAS RAID array







.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I still love my DT Sniper...it's sexy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's the block I looked at a while back, I think I'll be getting that one honestly.
Click to expand...

That does look good *PuffinMyLye*. I think you will like it *Valgaur* if you do get it, and it looks great.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry guys but I'm having some of that buyer's remorse thing.
> 
> Was the case + cooler I bought worth it when I already have one?
> 
> I just bought a C70 (Military Green) + NH-D14 for $120. Was it worth it? Should I return them?
> 
> I planned to sell the H100 and my old case but I don't know now. Should I just return my new hardware?


My opinion - Sell the old stuff and keep the new stuff *Swag*.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> i'll try removing 2 sticks (8gb) to see if that allows me to post. I'm using samsung low voltage 30nm ram.


Yes. Better to simplify your system when you run into such issues *c2thew*. 8GB can often be better than 16GB for high OC. Also consider vcore and vdimm levels that might need to be increased.


----------



## liamstears

Thought I would try to delid yesterday n gave up before I broke it

Seems like it's really on there, can't see much gap between ihs and chip, can barely see the glue

Tried using a Stanley blade n couldn't get it in there

Should I bother trying again? Can't afford to fry my chip


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Thought I would try to delid yesterday n gave up before I broke it
> Seems like it's really on there, can't see much gap between ihs and chip, can barely see the glue
> Tried using a Stanley blade n couldn't get it in there
> Should I bother trying again? Can't afford to fry my chip


If you're unsure whether you should do it, then I would say don't try. But if you do decide to do it again try and get a thinner blade. Stanley blades can be fairly thick in comparison to others.


----------



## blkdoutgsxr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Thought I would try to delid yesterday n gave up before I broke it
> Seems like it's really on there, can't see much gap between ihs and chip, can barely see the glue
> Tried using a Stanley blade n couldn't get it in there
> Should I bother trying again? Can't afford to fry my chip


Are you having problems with temps now? i would say if you can not afford to replace the chip i wouldn't risk it...


----------



## Swag

Okay, yea so with your inputs, I will stay with the new things. I will just sell the H100 and if no one is interested in buying the 600T, I will give it to my dad.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Thought I would try to delid yesterday n gave up before I broke it
> Seems like it's really on there, can't see much gap between ihs and chip, can barely see the glue
> Tried using a Stanley blade n couldn't get it in there
> Should I bother trying again? Can't afford to fry my chip


As already said, if you try again see if you can find the thinnest razor possible.

I used Gillette Platinum razor-blades myself, thinnest razor (Commercial bought) I could find - Slipped right in there and did what it had to do


----------



## King4x4

Hey I used a Gillette too!

Use caution when using it though... when you press it to cut the glue don't force it until it starts to bend. In my first delid attempt I forced it abit and it angled towards the PCB and it scratched it lightly (it was one scratch and that scratch made that chip into a lemon).


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry guys but I'm having some of that buyer's remorse thing.
> Was the case + cooler I bought worth it when I already have one?
> I just bought a C70 (Military Green) + NH-D14 for $120. Was it worth it? Should I return them?
> I planned to sell the H100 and my old case but I don't know now. Should I just return my new hardware?


I love my d14 man...... it's the best air cooler you can get.... Don't know about that case.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry guys but I'm having some of that buyer's remorse thing.
> Was the case + cooler I bought worth it when I already have one?
> I just bought a C70 (Military Green) + NH-D14 for $120. Was it worth it? Should I return them?
> I planned to sell the H100 and my old case but I don't know now. Should I just return my new hardware?
> 
> 
> 
> I love my d14 man...... it's the best air cooler you can get.... Don't know about that case.
Click to expand...

Have you seen the case or some nice pictures of it? I would like to get everyone's opinion on the decision. Also, how good is the D14? Does it perform better than the H100? That's what I have right now but unsure if I should sell it.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Have you seen the case or some nice pictures of it? I would like to get everyone's opinion on the decision. Also, how good is the D14? Does it perform better than the H100? That's what I have right now but unsure if I should sell it.
















The case is cool. Don't you like it?

Yes, is better than the h-100 and is really quiet.. i have my fans on max and i can't hear them.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Have you seen the case or some nice pictures of it? I would like to get everyone's opinion on the decision. Also, how good is the D14? Does it perform better than the H100? That's what I have right now but unsure if I should sell it.
Click to expand...

I already have the case, but what do you think? Should I return it or not? Should I sell my 600T and go with the C70 or stick with the 600T? So far, 2 people are in favor of going with the C70.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I already have the case, but what do you think? Should I return it or not? Should I sell my 600T and go with the C70 or stick with the 600T? So far, 2 people are in favor of going with the C70.


I did build a pc for a client of mine and i used the 550D, i did love that case.....very similar to the c70, but had acustic foam on all doors. Rest is almost the same..... I do like the removable drive cages.

In the end, is what you think f it.... do you like it???? KEEP IT, Don't you like it???? CHANGE IT.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I already have the case, but what do you think? Should I return it or not? Should I sell my 600T and go with the C70 or stick with the 600T? So far, 2 people are in favor of going with the C70.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did build a pc for a client of mine and i used the 550D, i did love that case.....very similar to the c70, but had acustic foam on all doors. Rest is almost the same..... I do like the removable drive cages.
> 
> In the end, is what you think f it.... do you like it???? KEEP IT, Don't you like it???? CHANGE IT.
Click to expand...

Well, the main reason why I hate my 600T was because I modded it a bit and I didn't like it. I plan to just use some U-channel and a bit more filing and make it look nice. Sell it for cheap or give it away to my dad or someone. I like the C70 for the looks and durability as well as how I can go water cooling in it. The price of it is affecting me too! $70 for the case! How could I pass up a deal like that? Anyway, I'm having some buyer's remorse so I want some outside views on it.

Does anyone have an answer to my D14 vs h100 question?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry guys but I'm having some of that buyer's remorse thing.
> Was the case + cooler I bought worth it when I already have one?
> I just bought a C70 (Military Green) + NH-D14 for $120. Was it worth it? Should I return them?
> I planned to sell the H100 and my old case but I don't know now. Should I just return my new hardware?


Yeah keep the new stuff, that's a good deal..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Now that Ive had my fun with my chip I'm probably going to be selling it in the next week. Homeboy needs to upgrade his NAS RAID array
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I figured I'd let peeps in here know first before I start contacting specific people who have shown interest.


Is that a 3570K? Someone just bought my backup rig and I want to pick up a new chip and mobo because my mine are teh sucks.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry guys but I'm having some of that buyer's remorse thing.
> Was the case + cooler I bought worth it when I already have one?
> I just bought a C70 (Military Green) + NH-D14 for $120. Was it worth it? Should I return them?
> I planned to sell the H100 and my old case but I don't know now. Should I just return my new hardware?
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah keep the new stuff, that's a good deal..
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Now that Ive had my fun with my chip I'm probably going to be selling it in the next week. Homeboy needs to upgrade his NAS RAID array
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I figured I'd let peeps in here know first before I start contacting specific people who have shown interest.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is that a 3570K? Someone just bought my backup rig and I want to pick up a new chip and mobo because my mine are teh sucks.
Click to expand...

Got you on the first part, that's 3 v 0 now.









Anyway guys, here is a tip to all the delidders or future delidders!
*Please OC your CPU first before you delid to see if it is limited by the temps or if it even performs well. Like if it sucks and it needs 1.4vcore for 4.5, then just return it and buy a new one before you delid!*


----------



## tw33k

The NH-D14 is not better than the H100. The Noctua is a good air cooler but doesn't beat the Phanteks cooler (http://www.kitguru.net/components/henry-butt/phanteks-ph-tc14pe-vs-noctua-nh-d14-cpu-cooler-review/5/) That's just one comparison but a quick Google search will confirm the Phanteks is superior.

I tested my H100 vs Phanteks vs Silver Arrow SB-E and the H100 was the clear winner (http://www.overclock.net/t/1260241/high-end-air-cooling-vs-closed-loop-water-cooling/0_50) Both these air coolers beat the NH-D14


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *Please OC your CPU first before you delid to see if it is limited by the temps or if it even performs well. Like if it sucks and it needs 1.4vcore for 4.5, then just return it and buy a new one before you delid!*


I already made that mistake, lol. I got too excited to cut the lid off that I did it anyway!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> The NH-D14 is not better than the H100. The Noctua is a good air cooler but doesn't beat the Phanteks cooler (http://www.kitguru.net/components/henry-butt/phanteks-ph-tc14pe-vs-noctua-nh-d14-cpu-cooler-review/5/) That's just one comparison but a quick Google search will confirm the Phanteks is superior.
> 
> I tested my H100 vs Phanteks vs Silver Arrow SB-E and the H100 was the clear winner (http://www.overclock.net/t/1260241/high-end-air-cooling-vs-closed-loop-water-cooling/0_50) Both these air coolers beat the NH-D14


How much is the H100 winning? My H100 sucks apparently. It can't hold down my temps at all! Anyway, I'll compare the temps with my NH-D14 and we will see how it performs. I will downclock it to 4.5 for this test though because it seems that on 4.8, IBT can bring my temps up to 88C! Crazy!


----------



## tw33k

The H100 is about 3c cooler than the top air coolers so that's between 4-5c better than the NH-D14


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> The H100 is about 3c cooler than the top air coolers so that's between 4-5c better than the NH-D14


BUT NO NOISE>>>>


----------



## Swag

I actually run the H100 on the lowest settings with the fans on the lowest settings too! I hate the sound. It's unbearably loud but I don't have too much cash to spend on fans. I just realized how expensive fans were.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I actually run the H100 on the lowest settings with the fans on the lowest settings too! I hate the sound. It's unbearably loud but I don't have too much cash to spend on fans. I just realized how expensive fans were.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1343860/toms-hardware-nh-d14-vs-4-closed-loop-water-aio-showdown/0_100

look what i just found.


----------



## VonDutch

i would choose the Phantek over the NH-D14, the higher you oc using the Phantek, the better it gets,
and the Thermaltake Water 2.0 Extreme over the H100








personal choice..
but, i dont have to be afraid for high temps, my Scythe Mugen 2 Rev. B is overkill
now, with my delidded ivy ...lol IBT 5.0ghz, 82C hottest core


----------



## martinhal

Have been going crazy trying to find the Ivy vcore spec sheet. Can someone link it for me please ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Have been going crazy trying to find the Ivy vcore spec sheet. Can someone link it for me please ?


this?

datasheet 1,
sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html

thats where it says VID is 1.52V, or VID range 0.2500-1.5200V
theres no "ivy vcore spec" anywhere to find tho, not in the datasheets from intel,


this is what everyone is talking about , when they say "max vcore intel states", or says..


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this?
> datasheet 1,
> sheet 1, page 84, 7.10.1, Table 7-4
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/3rd-gen-core-desktop-vol-1-datasheet.html
> thats where it says VID is 1.52V, or VID range 0.2500-1.5200V
> theres no "ivy vcore spec" anywhere to find tho, not in the datasheets from intel,
> 
> this is what everyone is talking about , when they say "max vcore intel states", or says..


Thanks but there was another table I saw that listed Vcore and PLL for air , water and LN2 , It could be an unofficial listing.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Thanks but there was another table I saw that listed Vcore and PLL for air , water and LN2 , It could be an unofficial listing.


this? ...LOL









http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end
my fav thread, learned alot from it about ocing ivy..
the specs are kinda unofficial, the "intel rec. max." (read my post above)


----------



## stickg1

I picked 5 motherboards, tell me which you guys would recommend:

GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545

GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128558

MSI Z77 MPOWER
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130660

ASRock Z77 Professional
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299

ASRock Z77 Extreme6
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157295


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I picked 5 motherboards, tell me which you guys would recommend:
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128558
> MSI Z77 MPOWER
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130660
> ASRock Z77 Professional
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299
> ASRock Z77 Extreme6
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157295


I have the first one.. ud5h.... and i love it, it never gets hot even doing 1.5v on the cpu


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> As already said, if you try again see if you can find the thinnest razor possible.
> I used Gillette Platinum razor-blades myself, thinnest razor (Commercial bought) I could find - Slipped right in there and did what it had to do


Same here, they bend nicely to fit in the first corner you're gonna cut...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> The NH-D14 is not better than the H100. The Noctua is a good air cooler but doesn't beat the Phanteks cooler (http://www.kitguru.net/components/henry-butt/phanteks-ph-tc14pe-vs-noctua-nh-d14-cpu-cooler-review/5/) That's just one comparison but a quick Google search will confirm the Phanteks is superior.
> I tested my H100 vs Phanteks vs Silver Arrow SB-E and the H100 was the clear winner (http://www.overclock.net/t/1260241/high-end-air-cooling-vs-closed-loop-water-cooling/0_50) Both these air coolers beat the NH-D14


D14 is more efficient with slower fans, Silver Arrow beats it and Phanteks too...Stock performance is good on the D14 though. No big difference really. Safer than an all in one which can leak on you and needs uber fast turbine fans to work good.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I picked 5 motherboards, tell me which you guys would recommend:
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128558
> MSI Z77 MPOWER
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130660
> ASRock Z77 Professional
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299
> ASRock Z77 Extreme6
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157295


I'd go with any of the Gigabytes in that list or the Msi Mpower, but I'm leaning more towards Gigabyte here.
UD5H has a headphone amp, but UP4 TH has better vrm and more polished overclocking features. The one you should get would be either an Up5 or an Asrock OC Formula for ATX, or an Asus Maximus V Gene if you don't mind the matx size.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I have the first one.. ud5h.... and i love it, it never gets hot even doing 1.5v on the cpu


Yeah, Gb vrm are top notch!


----------



## stickg1

The biggest board I can fit in my case is ATX. That's why I haven't mentioned any Extended ATX. I'm leaning towards the Giga's or the MPower.


----------



## MunneY

You guys need to slow down on the posting here... I can't keep up!


----------



## King4x4

Gonna try to hit stable on 5ghz today!!! wish me luck guys!!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Gonna try to hit stable on 5ghz today!!! wish me luck guys!!


Max i can do on mine is [email protected] 1,510v.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think the ud5h is a fine choice...even the ud3h would be fine. But the headphone amp is nice...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Gonna try to hit stable on 5ghz today!!! wish me luck guys!!


Good luck man!


----------



## stickg1

Whats the differences between the Ud5H and UD3H? Is the UD5H worth the extra money for just a 4.5-4.8GHz overclock?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Whats the differences between the Ud5H and UD3H? Is the UD5H worth the extra money for just a 4.5-4.8GHz overclock?


Not sure, up to you...Compare the features, the overclocking headroom will be the same really.

@Swag: http://www.overclock.net/t/1343860/toms-hardware-nh-d14-vs-4-closed-loop-water-aio-showdown


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> The H100 is about 3c cooler than the top air coolers so that's between 4-5c better than the NH-D14
> 
> 
> 
> BUT NO NOISE>>>>
Click to expand...

Yep! I think the H100 may be a little better cooling when set to high, but it is not quite! I have an H80 and it does a good job and I keep it on med fan settings which is not bad - unless I OC and bench, then to high fans and it is too loud for me. I hear D14 is quite and does a good job cooling. Ugly though. I much perfer the looks of a water cooler over the giant fins and fans all over my MB! LOL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I picked 5 motherboards, tell me which you guys would recommend:
> 
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545
> 
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128558
> 
> MSI Z77 MPOWER
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130660
> 
> ASRock Z77 Professional
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299
> 
> ASRock Z77 Extreme6
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157295


I have tried the MPower and it is a very good OCing board. Other good boards I would consider are the Extreme6 and the UD5H.


----------



## VonDutch

GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H









wished i saved some more money, would have bought it, instead of my GA-Z77X-D3H,
its not bad at all, but for high oc's, not very good..i have a 1.85V vcore limit..o well








this beer is 12% strong, i dont think i make it till 12...hahaha..


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Gonna try to hit stable on 5ghz today!!! wish me luck guys!!


Good luck man... I can't wait to get into mine.


----------



## stickg1

I might just save my money and get the Extreme6 or UD3H. Then save up for a new chip because mine sucks. I got it new from newegg a couple weeks back so I'm worried if I buy another new one from them it will be one of the recent batches with high voltages. I might have to buy a used one from somebody.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I might just save my money and get the Extreme6 or UD3H. Then save up for a new chip because mine sucks. I got it new from newegg a couple weeks back so I'm worried if I buy another new one from them it will be one of the recent batches with high voltages. I might have to buy a used one from somebody.


LoL ill sell you my G-1 sniper 3 for 100$ then u could run it on single channel ram.. or send it back to gigabyte to have the socket replaced for 50$..


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyway guys, here is a tip to all the delidders or future delidders!
> *Please OC your CPU first before you delid to see if it is limited by the temps or if it even performs well. Like if it sucks and it needs 1.4vcore for 4.5, then just return it and buy a new one before you delid!*


This should be on the OP







.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I sure do buy from OCN, but my main forum is OCF (I'm in the benching team) and their forum classifieds rules are much better. Less probably to get ripped off there (I did get ripped off here btw but paypal solved it)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL ill sell you my G-1 sniper 3 for 100$ then u could run it on single channel ram.. or send it back to gigabyte to have the socket replaced for 50$..


Take that offer...great board.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Easy to get post count up on AnAndtech..
> Just join in many of the AMD Sucks debates in the cpu section
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is no AMD Fan Bois like you have here the mods do not protect them from the truth over there..


Haha too funny







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I don't really get it, but well, to each their own. My g620 does great for gaming and costs 35 bucks, pair that with an h61 board, where's the value in AMD gaming rigs then? Unless you go APU on me there's no way it can beat a g620/i3 2100 + dedicated 7850/7770.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL ill sell you my G-1 sniper 3 for 100$ then u could run it on single channel ram.. or send it back to gigabyte to have the socket replaced for 50$..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Take that offer...great board.


It's huge and wont fit in my case. I'm kind of over broken boards. This ASUS really pissed me off.


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I don't really get it, but well, to each their own. My g620 does great for gaming and costs 35 bucks, pair that with an h61 board, where's the value in AMD gaming rigs then? Unless you go APU on me there's no way it can beat a g620/i3 2100 + dedicated 7850/7770.


I need to find me a 50$ processor for my fiance... I have been waiting on my buddy to upgrade his 2500k but no dice. whered you get one for 35$


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I need to find me a 50$ processor for my fiance... I have been waiting on my buddy to upgrade his 2500k but no dice. whered you get one for 35$


BNIB, a guy bought it for a customer build but never got to use it.








A g440 would be perfect for your needs, it's a single core but it's the cheapest sandy bridge chip atm. Works perfectly fine for a facebook machine, and you can later upgrade it to an i3 3220 or whatever you want. That's the beauty of it, and it also makes for a great backup chip.
I have a dead 3770k in the shelf, and can still play without bottlenecking my 670 ftw lol


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I actually run the H100 on the lowest settings with the fans on the lowest settings too! I hate the sound. It's unbearably loud but I don't have too much cash to spend on fans. I just realized how expensive fans were.


You don't have to spend a huge amount on fans to get great performance. Check out the Xinrullian fans (labled under XSPC's brand name, but they are made by Xinrullian in the PRC). Huge static pressure for their 2000 rpm 120 mm fans (3.0mm/H2O), and dirt cheap too. Not to mention, very quiet for 2000 rpm fans. Add a fan controller, and you're good to go.















Source

That's why I'm using them


----------



## ivanlabrie

True that...Sidewinder computers sells those for 5 bucks, free shipped lol
They look and perform quite close to a Scythe Gentle Typhoon (rip off?)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's huge and wont fit in my case. I'm kind of over broken boards. This ASUS really pissed me off.


It's not that big wish it was a little bigger XD

it bolts up to standard atx screw holes.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> *I need to find me a 50$ processor for my fiance.*.. I have been waiting on my buddy to upgrade his 2500k but no dice. whered you get one for 35$


youre so cheap sometimes MunneY, buy the girl a diamond









happy new year all









youre right about that oprah, for us overclockers ...LOL


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> True that...Sidewinder computers sells those for 5 bucks, free shipped lol
> They look and perform quite close to a Scythe Gentle Typhoon (rip off?)


Oh that sucks, I paid $3 more per from Gary...before X-mas though. Nah, they're not a GT rip off, completely different blade design. Really, more akin to a Yate D12-SH-12, but even higher performing. If you wanted to, you could spend a little extra and go direct to Xinrullian, where they have ball bearing versions as well. I may end up doing that for the 140mm that I'm using as a rear intake in the long run. The others are horizontally oriented, so they'll be fine w/ sleeve bearings for a long time.

I have an AP-181 as the front intake, w/ the Xinrullian 120mm 2000 rpm's pulling exhaust through the UT-60. Reasonably quiet even at a full head of steam, but definitely not silent until idle when loop temps reach equilibrium. Love the Aquaero 5!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Oh that sucks, I paid $3 more per from Gary...before X-mas though. Nah, they're not a GT rip off, completely different blade design. Really, more akin to a Yate D12-SH-12, but even higher performing. If you wanted to, you could spend a little extra and go direct to Xinrullian, where they have ball bearing versions as well. I may end up doing that for the 140mm that I'm using as a rear intake in the long run. The others are horizontally oriented, so they'll be fine w/ sleeve bearings for a long time.
> I have an AP-181 as the front intake, w/ the Xinrullian 120mm 2000 rpm's pulling exhaust through the UT-60. Reasonably quiet even at a full head of steam, but definitely not silent until idle when loop temps reach equilibrium. Love the Aquaero 5!


Ah, sorry! I confused those with the Swiftech fans then. Those are even (a bit) better lol
They ARE 5 bucks though, but I had the picture of the Swiftech helix in my head lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I just realized that I'm not a delidded crewman according to the spreadsheet in the OP







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol me neither...but mine never worked xD


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol me neither...but mine never worked xD


Ivan wait...you lost your delidded chip? When did this happen?


----------



## Swag

*@Everyone who answered my question about cooling*

Thanks!







Well, I only was able to get the NH-D14 SE2011 because it was so cheap. Only $50! I just had to request an LGA 1155 mounting kit from Noctua and alls good!

Anyway, I'm going to proceed with my Acrylic window mod for my C70, any pointers or suggestions?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Got you on the first part, that's 3 v 0 now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway guys, here is a tip to all the delidders or future delidders!
> *Please OC your CPU first before you delid to see if it is limited by the temps or if it even performs well. Like if it sucks and it needs 1.4vcore for 4.5, then just return it and buy a new one before you delid!*


Added!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I picked 5 motherboards, tell me which you guys would recommend:
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128558
> MSI Z77 MPOWER
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130660
> ASRock Z77 Professional
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157299
> ASRock Z77 Extreme6
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157295


ud5h
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> You guys need to slow down on the posting here... I can't keep up!


Yeah I know right!?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Gonna try to hit stable on 5ghz today!!! wish me luck guys!!


You can do it!!!!!!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wished i saved some more money, would have bought it, instead of my GA-Z77X-D3H,
> its not bad at all, but for high oc's, not very good..i have a 1.85V vcore limit..o well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this beer is 12% strong, i dont think i make it till 12...hahaha..


Oh lord........








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> This should be on the OP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .....


Yuppers!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> youre so cheap sometimes MunneY, buy the girl a diamond
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> happy new year all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> youre right about that oprah, for us overclockers ...LOL


Go drink more VonDutch!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I just realized that I'm not a delidded crewman according to the spreadsheet in the OP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


hmmmmmmm....... that don't seem right..... PM information while I look for ya!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ivan wait...you lost your delidded chip? When did this happen?


From the get go...never did fire it up delidded. Bent some pins while installing the cpu in the socket, cause the ihs slided when pressing on the latch. Didn't notice till it was too late cause I had already shorted the cpu and mobo and killed both instantly.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ah, sorry! I confused those with the Swiftech fans then. Those are even (a bit) better lol
> They ARE 5 bucks though, but I had the picture of the Swiftech helix in my head lol


Lol! No worries, it turns out I was misremembering. The 140mm version was $8. I still paid $6 per for my 120mm 2000 rpm versions though.


----------



## Swag

Those fans look tempting! Stop it guys!

Guys, I have a favor to ask you. I plan to etch something into my C70 Case window (I'm about to make it







), but I don't know what it should be. Any ideas? Also, is there anyone here who can make the image into a vector if I need to?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Perhaps a cool logo, or some sort of pattern like Hokies did. That looks cool...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> From the get go...never did fire it up delidded. Bent some pins while installing the cpu in the socket, cause the ihs slided when pressing on the latch. Didn't notice till it was too late cause I had already shorted the cpu and mobo and killed both instantly.


Awww man...RIP


----------



## Hokies83

Hmm i can get a G 1 Sniper M3 for 100$ shipped.. i can use if i can not fix the bent pins to send off to Gigabyte to have the socket replaced...


----------



## Swag

How about copying the words on this and put it in the corner or middle of the window? Middle or lower right corner?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> From the get go...never did fire it up delidded. Bent some pins while installing the cpu in the socket, cause the ihs slided when pressing on the latch. Didn't notice till it was too late cause I had already shorted the cpu and mobo and killed both instantly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awww man...RIP
Click to expand...

Yea, it was a sad story. We are still waiting on the replacement chip and MB.

Hows that going these days *ivanlabrie*? When you gunna be back in full operation with a IB?


----------



## PCWargamer

]

Some stuff I'd want to see would be a CPU-Z validation, of course, at high OC with good vcore with your OCN screen name (or what ever name they wanted). Also some screen shots of some benches such as superPi (1M and 32M) at high OC and lowest vcore to run them - with CPU-Z open to cpu, MB, mem screens and RealTemp. Maybe a good prime95 run with time and temps and OC/vcore. Mainly stuff that shows me the chip is as good as you claim. Plus some pics of the system it is in and the cooling you have used for it. But that is just me. Others may be happy with much less, or might want more. But these are some ideas for you anyway, and I think you have all of this already if needed.

I mean, I think you are not just trying to sell a 3770K, but a better than average 3770K, and I think you will want/have to provide proof to the buyer that it is what it is.

Although, those of us on here already know what it is....


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Some stuff I'd want to see would be a CPU-Z validation, of course, at high OC with good vcore with your OCN screen name (or what ever name they wanted). Also some screen shots of some benches such as superPi (1M and 32M) at high OC and lowest vcore to run them - with CPU-Z open to cpu, MB, mem screens and RealTemp. Maybe a good prime95 run with time and temps and OC/vcore. Mainly stuff that shows me the chip is as good as you claim. Plus some pics of the system it is in and the cooling you have used for it. But that is just me. Others may be happy with much less, or might want more. But these are some ideas for you anyway, and I think you have all of this already if needed.
> I mean, I think you are not just trying to sell a 3770K, but a better than average 3770K, and I think you will want/have to provide proof to the buyer that it is what it is.
> Although, those of us on here already know what it is....


Right I certainly plan on providing whatever proof I can. Thanks for the ideas. I'll try and spend the next day or 2 obtaining whatever verifications I dont' have saved.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> How much are you looking to get for it?


Enough to pickup 4 of these babies







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Enough to pickup 4 of these babies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


500$? 

Id say 400$ would be pushing it =p this is socket 1155 remember not socket 2011 XD


----------



## PuffinMyLye

He's my info Valgaur.

*OCN name:* PuffinMyLye
*CPU:* 3770K
*on die-TIM:* CLP
*ihs-TIM:* CLP
*Mhz gained:* 700Mhz
*OC after delid:* 5.5Ghz
*Temp drops:* 28C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2616764



Pre Delid



Post Delid


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Enough to pickup 4 of these babies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Good grief, does it do 5GHz on 1.1v or something? I guess I don't know what the market is for well binned 3770K's but $450-$500 seems a bit much.

Anyway, I'm in the market for an upgrade around $300. I did some wheeling and dealing and built a PC for the kids for about $180 out of pocket. I just sold it for $350. I'm not sure what to upgrade though. I was going to rebuild them something stronger but they seem more into the laptop anyway.

I could...

1. Get another 7950 Vapor-X for CF-X
2. Get a new motherboard and then when this P8Z77-V Pro gets back from RMA sell it and get a new chip
3. Get a 3770K or 3570K
4. Upgrade my storage, currently just use a 120GB Kingston SSD and 500GB Barracuda but neither of them are even half way full.
5. Build a budget rig just for kicks
6. Upgrade my cooling system and go full water.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 500$?
> Id say 400$ would be pushing it =p this is socket 1155 remember not socket 2011 XD


I've been offered $500 before when I first discovered this chip so we'll see if those bidders are still interested. Otherwise we'll just see where it all goes. I'm taking all offers.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How about copying the words on this and put it in the corner or middle of the window? Middle or lower right corner?




Just messed around with it a bit......not vector though....

47590833.psd 659k .psd file


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> He's my info Valgaur.
> *OCN name:* PuffinMyLye
> *CPU:* 3770K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* CLP
> *Mhz gained:* 700Mhz
> *OC after delid:* 5.5Ghz
> *Temp drops:* 28C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2616764
> 
> Pre Delid
> 
> Post Delid


Your in!

along with you I_shot!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yea, it was a sad story. We are still waiting on the replacement chip and MB.
> Hows that going these days *ivanlabrie*? When you gunna be back in full operation with a IB?


In two months I guess...I'll be buying my loop part by part asap.
And a monitor later on, ips 1080, 22" led.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How about copying the words on this and put it in the corner or middle of the window? Middle or lower right corner?


That would rock!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your in!
> along with you I_shot!


Nice







.


----------



## stickg1

C'mon guys I need your help spending my money...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Anyway, I'm in the market for an upgrade around $300. I did some wheeling and dealing and built a PC for the kids for about $180 out of pocket. I just sold it for $350. I'm not sure what to upgrade though. I was going to rebuild them something stronger but they seem more into the laptop anyway.
> I could...
> 1. Get another 7950 Vapor-X for CF-X
> 2. Get a new motherboard and then when this P8Z77-V Pro gets back from RMA sell it and get a new chip
> 3. Get a 3770K or 3570K
> 4. Upgrade my storage, currently just use a 120GB Kingston SSD and 500GB Barracuda but neither of them are even half way full.
> 5. Build a budget rig just for kicks
> 6. Upgrade my cooling system and go full water.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> C'mon guys I need your help spending my money...


Give me it.... problem solved!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How about copying the words on this and put it in the corner or middle of the window? Middle or lower right corner?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just messed around with it a bit......not vector though....
> 
> 47590833.psd 659k .psd file
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot Alan! I'll see if they can do it with this, but if they can't, I'll just have my dad change it to vector.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> C'mon guys I need your help spending my money...


I would, but I'm kind of biased at this moment







.


----------



## Swag

Does anyone know if a cutting wheel for plastic will work on the acrylic?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Theoretically ... just go slow


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone know if a cutting wheel for plastic will work on the acrylic?


I just use a jigsaw with a fine tooth blade. Medium speed setting.


----------



## Swag

1st attempt at cutting the acrylic, failed. Everything went fine, the edges were perfect, but I made a mistake when drilling the holes and it cracked.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Alright, my chip has been sold and my server HDD's will be ordered shortly. However, the question now remains. Do I go back to MC to pick up another 3770K and test my luck OR do I just pickup a 3570K for $170 since I've proven not to need more than that for my needs (most intensive stuff I do is gaming)? Decision time...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> You don't have to spend a huge amount on fans to get great performance. Check out the Xinrullian fans (labled under XSPC's brand name, but they are made by Xinrullian in the PRC). Huge static pressure for their 2000 rpm 120 mm fans (3.0mm/H2O), and dirt cheap too. Not to mention, very quiet for 2000 rpm fans. Add a fan controller, and you're good to go.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Source
> That's why I'm using them


Xinrulian fans? LOL! they have sleeve "bearings"! no better than Scythe Slipstreams ... as much as they provide excellent specs on paper they are weak, just loud. and they die silently in a few months, you will not even notice. I had a dozen of Slipstreams, near all of them died within 3-9 months, the last two I killed myself (gutted them, needed shrouds).

better go with Swiftech Helix (some magical Z-bearing, hell knows what that is) or just get Scythe GT Ap-15 1,850rpm with Sony Fluid Dynamic Bearings (lasts forever) and be done with it!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> True that...Sidewinder computers sells those for 5 bucks, free shipped lol
> They look and perform quite close to a Scythe Gentle Typhoon (rip off?)


LOL, no they don't!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ah, sorry! I confused those with the Swiftech fans then. Those are even (a bit) better lol
> They ARE 5 bucks though, but I had the picture of the Swiftech helix in my head lol


Swiftech Helix are the cheap way to get good rad fans, but since they are new nobody knows how long they survive in real life yet.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone know if a cutting wheel for plastic will work on the acrylic?


Just take the regular dremel cutting disc (good to cut anything up to steel, done that on my case MB tray), it should go through acrylic like through butter ... hell it went like through butter when I was making MB Tray cutouts and that was made out of thick steel!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 1st attempt at cutting the acrylic, failed. Everything went fine, the edges were perfect, but I made a mistake when drilling the holes and it cracked.


yeah, you can't angle it too much or the disc will crack. if you want rounded corners, then just drill them through and connect the outer edges with a straight cut. I used 3/4'' step drill bit for making round holes, then connected them with straight cuts on outer edge, like this:


final pic, project completed







:


----------



## feniks

most of all, HAPPY NEW YEAR PEEPS!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 1st attempt at cutting the acrylic, failed. Everything went fine, the edges were perfect, but I made a mistake when drilling the holes and it cracked.


Drilling holes in acrylic is a different story, you need a special bit to not risk cracking the acrylic.

http://www.bertram31.com/proj/tips/drill_acrylic.htm


----------



## Swag

Yea, I'm going to buy a plas-drill bit tomorrow and another sheet of acrylic. I want to get this window finished! It'll look amazing!







Does anyone know how to file or make the sides of the acrylic nice? Like after cutting them?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I'm going to buy a plas-drill bit tomorrow and another sheet of acrylic. I want to get this window finished! It'll look amazing!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does anyone know how to file or make the sides of the acrylic nice? Like after cutting them?


Not sure on that, I was thinking a router but you might want to test it first, it could crack the glass. Maybe a series of progressively finer sand papers or a fine file.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I'm going to buy a plas-drill bit tomorrow and another sheet of acrylic. I want to get this window finished! It'll look amazing!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does anyone know how to file or make the sides of the acrylic nice? Like after cutting them?


Is this helpful?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seanimus*
> 
> Decided to do some acrylic to switch things up a bit. Since I got the White Rouge Polishing compound and meguairs #17 and #10.
> In the garage so I can see the mailguy come by (waiting for package from MDPC).
> This is the cut on the smallest acrylic. Just going to do 2 sides and this has to get cut to fit into a 5.25 bay, if I ever get around to that.
> 
> Wet sanding, 60, 100, 220 and 600 and progression shots. Moved into the house at some point; was getting cold.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> White rouge ...hard as a brick.
> 
> Beginning to see lines much a little bit more clearly:
> 
> The Meguiars:
> 
> Much better...but something went wrong...should have been clear.
> 
> If I take a shot from top its still a bit hazy. Thought it was because the other side was not done:
> 
> Redid the 3 steps starting from white rouge. But this time (google is your friend), added vegetable oil to the white polishing compound and voila:
> 
> And this time a shot from the top, you can barely notice its there in the shot..Only reason you see it, is because the other side is not done:
> 
> Another shot:
> 
> Its so clear that you can see the glue on the masking tape which is stuck on the other side.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Happy new year folks! Cheers!!!


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Alright, my chip has been sold and my server HDD's will be ordered shortly. However, the question now remains. Do I go back to MC to pick up another 3770K and test my luck OR do I just pickup a 3570K for $170 since I've proven not to need more than that for my needs (most intensive stuff I do is gaming)? Decision time...


Hi, I've been up to date with this thread and your chip (congrats by the way) for a while now . In my experience, after more than half a dozen 3770k from MC (all Costa Rican) finding a chip like yours is not easy. Best one so far was a 3229B892 batch. 5Ghz at 1.46v. Whea-free, benchmark stable. Stock VID of 1.090. Worst chip had stock VID of 1.200v







So, whether its a 3570k or the 3770k, finding out what it can do will be equally exciting. Just have fun.







Also, this thread should be OCN thread of the year. Happy New Year OCN.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Alright, my chip has been sold and my server HDD's will be ordered shortly. However, the question now remains. Do I go back to MC to pick up another 3770K and test my luck OR do I just pickup a 3570K for $170 since I've proven not to need more than that for my needs (most intensive stuff I do is gaming)? Decision time...


Cool *PuffinMyLye*. I bet they will love having such a great chip. I'd love having one like it! Was it really enough to fund all the HDDs?

On thei5/i7 question, you really do not need a 3770K unless you just like having one. A 3570K works fine for most everything we do, especially games and web stuff. Never know what kind of performance any of them will do until you get it home and in a system to see.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Happy new year to all the de-lidders and virgin de-lidders!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> Hi, I've been up to date with this thread and your chip (congrats by the way) for a while now . In my experience, after more than half a dozen 3770k from MC (all Costa Rican) finding a chip like yours is not easy. Best one so far was a 3229B892 batch. 5Ghz at 1.46v. Whea-free, benchmark stable. Stock VID of 1.090. Worst chip had stock VID of 1.200v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, whether its a 3570k or the 3770k, finding out what it can do will be equally exciting. Just have fun.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, this thread should be OCN thread of the year. Happy New Year OCN.


Thanks for checking in and you're right, this thread kicks butt







.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Cool *PuffinMyLye*. I bet they will love having such a great chip. I'd love having one like it! Was it really enough to fund all the HDDs?
> On thei5/i7 question, you really do not need a 3770K unless you just like having one. A 3570K works fine for most everything we do, especially games and web stuff. Never know what kind of performance any of them will do until you get it home and in a system to see.


Here's the deal. I had $250 put aside from Xmas that I was going to combine with what I sold my chip for. With that total I wanted to get the 4 HDD's (roughly $500) and a new CPU to replace the one I'm selling. So if I go for the 3570K ($170+tax) I'm covered plus it leaves me a little extra money left to put towards a Dell Perc 6i RAID controller. I think I'm leaning towards that.

Btw, HAPPY NEW YEAR FELLOW DELIDDED CREWMEN!! Very happy to have joined you guys late in 2012 and look forward to BSing with you guys in 2013







.


----------



## Valgaur

New Year means New Gear!!!! can't wait for this summer have 2 builds planned along with my modding WC setup sooo pumped!!!!


----------



## Coolwaters

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh loosened HS till it was near falling off.. stiff code 51..
> However i can run the 2 far right in single channel with out issue.
> I never removed the CPU during this whole HS swap..
> So 2 things must have happened...
> 1.. I tightened the HS so tight i bent a pin.
> 2 i tightened the Cpu so tight i damaged the pcb.
> I was over due for a noob mistake and im fine running running single channel till Haswell "not like it is a big "performance loss or anything"
> At that time i will trouble shoot the issue and see what it it.
> I will also send a PM to Sin0822.


i found this post randomly not sure if u fixed the problem yet but.

i had the same problem. it was because the block wasnt on tight enough.

the problem with taking off the IHS is the fact that the contact point is so small and narrow so pushing down the die bows out the edges.

AMD didnt have heatspeaders on their old CPUs (bare die) they have rubber corner spacers.

i bought a .5mm silicone heat pad off ebay and filled up the spacer around the die.
i suggest everyone to do the same if they dont want to crack the edges of the die.

wished i took pictures but was in a hurry.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Happy New Years everyone!
















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Xinrulian fans? LOL! they have sleeve "bearings"! no better than Scythe Slipstreams ... as much as they provide excellent specs on paper they are weak, just loud. and they die silently in a few months, you will not even notice. I had a dozen of Slipstreams, near all of them died within 3-9 months, the last two I killed myself (gutted them, needed shrouds).
> better go with Swiftech Helix (some magical Z-bearing, hell knows what that is) or just get Scythe GT Ap-15 1,850rpm with Sony Fluid Dynamic Bearings (lasts forever) and be done with it!


I'm a little drunk so bear with me.







Sleeves are fine in a vertical orientation, and as long as you lube them well (I use Tri-Flow teflon light oil), sleeve bearings will last a good while horizontally mounted. Sure, they aren't ball bearing or whatever black magic fluid suspension method is currently in vogue. Although sleeve bushings are technically fluid (oil) suspension types too. However, they certainly don't seem loud to me. But then, I've ran 38mm Delta's/Mechatronics/etc many times in the past. That's subjective opinion though. They don't bother me a bit, & the Aquaero throttles them down very nicely at idle. At 50% fan rpm, the MCP-35X on my AD II is far, far louder even @ 15% of it's rated rpm. That said, I'd rather hear the fans than the high rpm ddc pump any day.

As for the durability: Idk yet, I'll get back to you on that one. Xinrulian makes quite a bit of fans, not just sleeve bushings (which is what they really are) models. Although the ones that XSPC markets are, the company that manufacture's them from makes many different models, and not just geared towards computers.

http://www.x-fan.com/doe/index.asp

As far as the specs, Ehume seems to think the world of them, and claims rated specs are accurate. Although he didn't test the static pressure rating, they do quite well according to him, outperforming the AP-15 for a pittance.

http://www.overclockers.com/xspc-xinruilian-fan

Not to mention they are pulling fine through my UT-60 right now, a rad with very high tube density & 9.6 FPI density. Finally, if they do in fact kick off, my Aquaero will auto shutdown the system while giving me a nice alarm for a warning. I still have a box full of Mechatronics BB 150 cfm 120 x 38's to back them up, just in case. Although, I really prefer the quiet environment that doesn't sound like a shopvac... No harm, no foul.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> ...snip... Also, this thread should be OCN thread of the year. Happy New Year OCN.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for checking in and you're right, this thread kicks @$$
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Cool *PuffinMyLye*. I bet they will love having such a great chip. I'd love having one like it! Was it really enough to fund all the HDDs?
> On thei5/i7 question, you really do not need a 3770K unless you just like having one. A 3570K works fine for most everything we do, especially games and web stuff. Never know what kind of performance any of them will do until you get it home and in a system to see.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Here's the deal. I had $250 put aside from Xmas that I was going to combine with what I sold my chip for. With that total I wanted to get the 4 HDD's (roughly $500) and a new CPU to replace the one I'm selling. I got $475 ($450 after paypal fees and shipping costs) so that's $700 total. So if I go for the 3570K ($170+tax) I'm covered plus it leaves me a little extra money left to put towards a Dell Perc 6i RAID controller. I think I'm leaning towards that.
> 
> Btw, HAPPY NEW YEAR FELLOW DELIDDED CREWMEN!! Very happy to have joined you guys late in 2012 and look forward to BSing with you guys in 2013
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

That worked out great *PuffinMyLye*. I think you will do fine with a 3570K. And you have already had the fun of having a 3770K, so no need to redo that if you really don't need it (and most of us don't). With your luck you will probably find a goulden 3570K too!

And Happy New Year to the CREW!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> New Year means New Gear!!!! can't wait for this summer have 2 builds planned along with my modding WC setup sooo pumped!!!!


And best wishes to all our new members and new gear in the New Year!!!! Lots more building and testing and benching and delidding fun for another year!!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Happy New Year, delid crew









my head hurts, not used to drinking beer anymore ..lol
first time ever i made a thread on ocn, " Happy New Year to all ocn members







"
and it gets closed , and is of topic ...LOL
i hope this year i wont make many TOS mistakes


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Happy New Year, delid crew
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my head hurts, not used to drinking beer anymore ..lol
> first time ever i made a thread on ocn, " Happy New Year to all ocn members
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "
> and it gets closed , and is of topic ...LOL
> i hope this year i wont make many TOS mistakes


Beer! Yuck!
Vodka, Whiskey and Bourbon is where it's at! Along with Apple cider, oh my one love


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Beer! Yuck!
> Vodka, Whiskey and Bourbon is where it's at! Along with Apple cider, oh my one love


i think if i drank all of that, i wouldnt be here yet ...lol
only had 3 bottles of beer, and i couldnt walk normal anymore haha,
they where 12% alcohol tho...very heavy beer, but very nice to drink, good taste..

Grolsch Kanon (grolsch canon)

to stay ontopic, i delidded some of those bottles...lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i think if i drank all of that, i wouldnt be here yet ...lol
> only had 3 bottles of beer, and i couldnt walk normal anymore haha,
> they where 12% alcohol tho...very heavy beer, but very nice to drink, good taste..
> 
> Grolsch Kanon (grolsch canon)
> *to stay ontopic, i delidded some of those bottles...lol*


Haha, nice








Some guy had some terrible cheap stuff that tastes dirty water mixed with beer.
Last night I had a mix of...

Jim Beam honey, (was nice but too sweet with coke) - Not the entire bottle, only a third or so.


A couple of these (a few friends got them cheap and gave them away)


And a couple of cans of CC's.


It sucked so much, because we were walking along the beach a bit after midnight and I cracked open a can of the vodka double black.. Turns out there were a heap of cops around the corner so I concealed the open can and then went to the bushes and skulled as much as I could then had to throw it away


----------



## ivanlabrie

That sucks...here you can go wine bottle in hand and no one will say a thing. In fact I tend to grab empty wine bottles when walking dark streets on my way home.








I look more intimidating that way xD


----------



## King4x4

Whats this beer you speak off?!









<== Muslim


----------



## VonDutch

where i live, cops leave us be, they dont like coming into our district when its new year eev...lol

we shoot with, not sure if its the right word, "churn", filled with carbide...BOOM!!

always so much fun





this one is a funny fail , bye bye windows,


----------



## Swag

I'm at our vacation house in Canada right now and no cops or the store owner bothered me when I went to get the alcohol! It's so chilly though.







I don't think they wanted to bother getting out of their car!


----------



## VonDutch

i left my comp idle a while yesterday evening,
when i got back, it restarted, with a error..


The bugcheck was: 0x0000007e 0xffffffffc0000005 bla bla..

was looking for a answer, found this somewhere,

This error (7E) is usually a driver issue and display adapter (video) driver is the most suspect though
it could be others. Antivirus/antispyware/security programs, hardware (heat) and major software
issues can also cause the error.

its great to have windows tell you that something is wrong,
but then gives a zillion options to what it could be, if it does that...LOL

i think it could be my ram tho, i upped voltage from 1.5V to 1.55V,
and using xmp profile again, which i couldnt use a while ago,
before my latest bios update, xmp profile would set to


now the F16 bios sets xmp profile to (thats the right factory settings for my ram)


at least i thought it did, lately it sets it different then before

it did work all the time, not sure why i got a bsod, or reboot, wanst here when it happened..

timings without xmp profile


i did oc my 7970 to 1100/1500 instead of factory oc 1000/1375, but cant change voltage,
its about 1.170V, still looking for a way to get around that, ive read somewhere peeps using the Ghz edition bios, that runs on 1.25V..you guys think i could do that with my card?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i left my comp idle a while yesterday evening,
> when i got back, it restarted, with a error..
> 
> The bugcheck was: 0x0000007e 0xffffffffc0000005 bla bla..
> was looking for a answer, found this somewhere,
> This error (7E) is usually a driver issue and display adapter (video) driver is the most suspect though
> it could be others. Antivirus/antispyware/security programs, hardware (heat) and major software
> issues can also cause the error.
> its great to have windows tell you that something is wrong,
> but then gives a zillion options to what it could be, if it does that...LOL
> i think it could be my ram tho, i upped voltage from 1.5V to 1.55V,
> and using xmp profile again, which i couldnt use a while ago,
> before my latest bios update, xmp profile would set to
> 
> now the F16 bios sets xmp profile to (thats the right factory settings for my ram)
> 
> at least i thought it did, lately it sets it different then before
> 
> it did work all the time, not sure why i got a bsod, or reboot, wanst here when it happened..
> timings without xmp profile
> 
> i did oc my 7970 to 1100/1500 instead of factory oc 1000/1375, but cant change voltage,
> its about 1.170V, still looking for a way to get around that, ive read somewhere peeps using the Ghz edition bios, that runs on 1.25V..you guys think i could do that with my card?


No idea! I'd say it's most likely a graphics card issue as what you have researched suggested. Try re-installing the drivers!







- It cant hurt can it?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That sucks...here you can go wine bottle in hand and no one will say a thing. In fact I tend to grab empty wine bottles when walking dark streets on my way home.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I look more intimidating that way xD


Haha, fair enough. Here you're allowed to carry drinks with you, just not opened ones and especially not drinking them in public!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> where i live, cops leave us be, they dont like coming into our district when its new year eev...lol
> we shoot with, not sure if its the right word, "churn", filled with carbide...BOOM!!
> 
> always so much fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this one is a funny fail , bye bye windows,


Haha, they were standing back last night actually. There were 14-17 year old kids smoking (That's illegal here) and lots of "Hook ups" were happening... :S
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm at our vacation house in Canada right now and no cops or the store owner bothered me when I went to get the alcohol! It's so chilly though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think they wanted to bother getting out of their car!


They never bother me because I look older, I was mistaken for being like 22 last night








All those years of not going to the bottleshop, sigh. I never get asked for ID nowadays.


----------



## ivanlabrie

xD I get people thinking I'm younger...luckily! lol


----------



## chris-br

HANGOVER

Well. HAPPY NEW YEAR FELLOW DELIDDEERS!!!!!!!!

Now i need to drink more to get over my hangover. lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> HANGOVER
> 
> Well. HAPPY NEW YEAR FELLOW DELIDDEERS!!!!!!!!
> 
> Now i need to drink more to get over my hangover. lol


It was there a bit earlier but I've been just drinking tea since so I'm feeling better now.









Also, should I take pictures of my paint-stripping off my H100 with Simple Green?


----------



## Swag

I've seen some people posting their amazing OCs, so I guess it's my turn.







Here's my beloved 3570k!



So far, this OC has lasted the initial 12h run I gave it when I first started this OC. This is a re-test of it but I got too lazy to run it for 12 hours with this goddamn H100 running in room. Really loud!









Forgot about this: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2635857


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've seen some people posting their amazing OCs, so I guess it's my turn.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's my beloved 3570k!
> 
> So far, this OC has lasted the initial 12h run I gave it when I first started this OC. This is a re-test of it but I got too lazy to run it for 12 hours with this goddamn H100 running in room. Really loud!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot about this: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2635857


WOW. Nice 3570 you have there!!!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Vondutch. The error you experience is in all likelihood from a crashed video card driver. Problem is, that could have easily been caused by a CPU or RAM instability. That's the problem with BSOD codes, since essentially the entire computer is co-dependent on each individual component a failure in one place can easily cause an error in another or an error which would appear to be from another. All we can do is go for a best guess and trial and error.

I would guess, though, that it was possibly memory. I've had more driver crashes when I have had memory issues as opposed to when I had CPU instability which generally seemed to cause more general crashes.


----------



## gamerguuy

Hi everyone!
I don't know if this question has been discussed here before or not, but hopefully I'll get some insights.
I was thinking, what would happen if, lets say the lid on the ivy brudge CPUs was completely replaced by a custom-made copper IHS? Would there be significant performance/temp gain?
I don't own an ivybridge but I would still love to see someone try it out!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've seen some people posting their amazing OCs, so I guess it's my turn.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's my beloved 3570k!
> 
> So far, this OC has lasted the initial 12h run I gave it when I first started this OC. This is a re-test of it but I got too lazy to run it for 12 hours with this goddamn H100 running in room. Really loud!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot about this: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2635857
> 
> 
> 
> WOW. Nice 3570 you have there!!!
Click to expand...

Thanks, I love my 3570k. It has proven to be a worthy upgrade from my i7 930!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamerguuy*
> 
> Hi everyone!
> I don't know if this question has been discussed here before or not, but hopefully I'll get some insights.
> I was thinking, what would happen if, lets say the lid on the ivy brudge CPUs was completely replaced by a custom-made copper IHS? Would there be significant performance/temp gain?
> I don't own an ivybridge but I would still love to see someone try it out!


I would but I'm too lazy.







I've pondered this before but I don't see a point in it, the IHS is already top-notch. It isn't the IHS's fault for Ivy's bad temps, it is the spacing between the die and IHS. Don't change what's not broken!


----------



## gamerguuy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks, I love my 3570k. It has proven to be a worthy upgrade from my i7 930!
> I would but I'm too lazy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've pondered this before but I don't see a point in it, the IHS is already top-notch. It isn't the IHS's fault for Ivy's bad temps, it is the spacing between the die and IHS. Don't change what's not broken!


It is but it's still an alloy of silver and copper( most likely). What i meant is pure copper-made IHS. Hmm...I'd do it if I had the resources, not to mention an ivybridge setup too.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Vondutch. The error you experience is in all likelihood from a crashed video card driver. Problem is, that could have easily been caused by a CPU or RAM instability. That's the problem with BSOD codes, since essentially the entire computer is co-dependent on each individual component a failure in one place can easily cause an error in another or an error which would appear to be from another. All we can do is go for a best guess and trial and error.
> I would guess, though, that it was possibly memory. I've had more driver crashes when I have had memory issues as opposed to when I had CPU instability which generally seemed to cause more general crashes.


good answer, thanks DirektEffekt








i took of the xmp profile again, see how it goes, if its still there, ill reinstall vid card drivers,
if not, i think i just put in everything by hand on the ram, 16x multi, and the 9-9-9-24 that it should run

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gamerguuy*
> 
> Hi everyone!
> I don't know if this question has been discussed here before or not, but hopefully I'll get some insights.
> I was thinking, what would happen if, lets say the lid on the ivy brudge CPUs was completely replaced by a custom-made copper IHS? Would there be significant performance/temp gain?
> I don't own an ivybridge but I would still love to see someone try it out!


i dont think so, or not by much, the ihs on ivy is made from nickel-plated copper,
nickel has a w/mk of about 90 w/mk, theres no tim you can use which matches that anyways..lol
a direct die mount, with a copperblock, doesnt make a night and day difference also..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Alright, got my new 3570K installed. Just applied a little AS5 on it and did a pre delid IBT test at 4.5. Temps are near where my delidded 3770K were at 5.0Ghz haha. Gonna do some OC testing over the next day to see if my chip is any good before I attempt to delid. This test was with a +.005 offset.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Alright, got my new 3570K installed. Just applied a little AS5 on it and did a pre delid IBT test at 4.5. Temps are near where my delidded 3770K were at 5.0Ghz haha. Gonna do some OC testing over the next day to see if my chip is any good before I attempt to delid. This test was with a +.005 offset.


DAMN.. You are a lucky guy.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Alright, got my new 3570K installed. Just applied a little AS5 on it and did a pre delid IBT test at 4.5. Temps are near where my delidded 3770K were at 5.0Ghz haha. Gonna do some OC testing over the next day to see if my chip is any good before I attempt to delid. This test was with a +.005 offset.


LOL you suck bro, you get two awesome CPUs and stuck with this crap 3570k that needs 1.4v for 4.5GHz....


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> LOL you suck bro, you get two awesome CPUs and stuck with this crap 3570k that needs 1.4v for 4.5GHz....


Exacly my point.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> LOL you suck bro, you get two awesome CPUs and stuck with this crap 3570k that needs 1.4v for 4.5GHz....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Exacly my point.


Lol sorry guys. Keep in mind though that just cuz I did a 10 run IBT at these settings doesn't mean I'm stable







.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Lol sorry guys. Keep in mind though that just cuz I did a 10 run IBT at these settings doesn't mean I'm stable
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Mine won't even boot at that vcore. lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Mine won't even boot at that vcore. lol


Haha touché. You think I just got lucky again or could it be my board possibly?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha touché. You think I just got lucky again or could it be my board possibly?


really don't know....


----------



## cirov

so i have a chip that can probably do 5.0 at around 1.5v 24/7 (after i delid of course)
i'd like to know if a custom loop would be enough to cool this cpu sufficiently


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cirov*
> 
> so i have a chip that can probably do 5.0 at around 1.5v 24/7 (after i delid of course)
> i'd like to know if a custom loop would be enough to cool this cpu sufficiently


It *can*. Depends on the CPU block, radiators, pump, fans, etc...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cirov*
> 
> so i have a chip that can probably do 5.0 at around 1.5v 24/7 (after i delid of course)
> i'd like to know if a custom loop would be enough to cool this cpu sufficiently


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> It *can*. Depends on the CPU block, radiators, pump, fans, etc...


As dmanstasiu said, it all depends but it's possible if you buy the right parts. Make sure you also use a good TIM like CLP between the die and IHS when you delid your CPU, it makes a big difference.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Cirov, what's your budget?


----------



## Swag

2nd acrylic sheet: Failure!

I just bought another acrylic sheet and along with it, I bought a jigsaw and the blade for acrylic glass. If this is a failure again, I will just service a handyman to do it for me...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 2nd acrylic sheet: Failure!
> I just bought another acrylic sheet and along with it, I bought a jigsaw and the blade for acrylic glass. If this is a failure again, *I will just service a handyman* to do it for me...


Hey Swag, no need to share all the details of your personal life







.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 2nd acrylic sheet: Failure!
> I just bought another acrylic sheet and along with it, I bought a jigsaw and the blade for acrylic glass. If this is a failure again, *I will just service a handyman* to do it for me...
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Swag, no need to share all the details of your personal life
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

Hahaha! I didn't even realize it sounded like that.







Anyway, just for this project, my dad has bought over $1000 in new tools. They'll come in handy though when we renovate our kitchen and bathroom.







Vertical saw, jigsaw, power drills, blades...! So many new things!

Anyway, when it comes out perfect, I'll take pictures of it!


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hahaha! I didn't even realize it sounded like that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, just for this project, my dad has bought over $1000 in new tools. They'll come in handy though when we renovate our kitchen and bathroom.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vertical saw, jigsaw, power drills, blades...! So many new things!
> Anyway, when it comes out perfect, I'll take pictures of it!


What is a 'vertical saw'? Circular saw is vertical if you hold it that way








When cutting that stuff with jigsaw, go easy on the trigger....slow speed, new high tooth count blade, you should be fine.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Happy New Years everyone!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a little drunk so bear with me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sleeves are fine in a vertical orientation, and as long as you lube them well (I use Tri-Flow teflon light oil), sleeve bearings will last a good while horizontally mounted. Sure, they aren't ball bearing or whatever black magic fluid suspension method is currently in vogue. Although sleeve bushings are technically fluid (oil) suspension types too. However, they certainly don't seem loud to me. But then, I've ran 38mm Delta's/Mechatronics/etc many times in the past. That's subjective opinion though. They don't bother me a bit, & the Aquaero throttles them down very nicely at idle. At 50% fan rpm, the MCP-35X on my AD II is far, far louder even @ 15% of it's rated rpm. That said, I'd rather hear the fans than the high rpm ddc pump any day.
> As for the durability: Idk yet, I'll get back to you on that one. Xinrulian makes quite a bit of fans, not just sleeve bushings (which is what they really are) models. Although the ones that XSPC markets are, the company that manufacture's them from makes many different models, and not just geared towards computers.
> http://www.x-fan.com/doe/index.asp
> As far as the specs, Ehume seems to think the world of them, and claims rated specs are accurate. Although he didn't test the static pressure rating, they do quite well according to him, outperforming the AP-15 for a pittance.
> http://www.overclockers.com/xspc-xinruilian-fan
> Not to mention they are pulling fine through my UT-60 right now, a rad with very high tube density & 9.6 FPI density. Finally, if they do in fact kick off, my Aquaero will auto shutdown the system while giving me a nice alarm for a warning. I still have a box full of Mechatronics BB 150 cfm 120 x 38's to back them up, just in case. Although, I really prefer the quiet environment that doesn't sound like a shopvac... No harm, no foul.


whatever works for you man







hopefully they last long, but honestly if you need to lube it so it keeps working then LOLS!

I did my homework with sleeve "bearings" and never going back to those even though they can offer fantastic specs on a sheet of paper (or manufacturer website) ... and I used Japanese Scythe Slipstreams, not some Chinese Xinrulians







... sleeve fans die, I used all of them vertically, as I said, first 2 died in 3 months, the other 5 in next 6 months, the last two I killed myself








I trust only ball bearings and S-FDB, nothing else. it's too much PITA to drain the loop, remove radiator and so on to replce dead fans, that I trust things that have worked for everybody for years, Scythe GT Ap-15 and Scytke S-Flex 1,900rpm (I have both kinds in use).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i left my comp idle a while yesterday evening,
> when i got back, it restarted, with a error..
> 
> The bugcheck was: 0x0000007e 0xffffffffc0000005 bla bla..
> was looking for a answer, found this somewhere,
> This error (7E) is usually a driver issue and display adapter (video) driver is the most suspect though
> it could be others. Antivirus/antispyware/security programs, hardware (heat) and major software
> issues can also cause the error.
> its great to have windows tell you that something is wrong,
> but then gives a zillion options to what it could be, if it does that...LOL
> i think it could be my ram tho, i upped voltage from 1.5V to 1.55V,
> and using xmp profile again, which i couldnt use a while ago,
> before my latest bios update, xmp profile would set to
> 
> now the F16 bios sets xmp profile to (thats the right factory settings for my ram)
> 
> at least i thought it did, lately it sets it different then before
> 
> it did work all the time, not sure why i got a bsod, or reboot, wanst here when it happened..
> timings without xmp profile
> 
> i did oc my 7970 to 1100/1500 instead of factory oc 1000/1375, but cant change voltage,
> its about 1.170V, still looking for a way to get around that, ive read somewhere peeps using the Ghz edition bios, that runs on 1.25V..you guys think i could do that with my card?


BSOD 7E stands for corrupted OS files, could be a result of running an unstable memory
please run from elevated (admin) Command Prompt "SFC /scannow" to see if al system files are intact, this command will restore corrupted libraries from backups if it can.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Alright, got my new 3570K installed. Just applied a little AS5 on it and did a pre delid IBT test at 4.5. Temps are near where my delidded 3770K were at 5.0Ghz haha. Gonna do some OC testing over the next day to see if my chip is any good before I attempt to delid. This test was with a +.005 offset.


good deal bro you made, I read before








enjoy your i5! so far looking good too







mind it should requrie less volts than i7 because there is no HyperThreading in it.


----------



## cirov

i would say 300€ max. But since i live in eastern Europe i don't have many parts to choose from.
i will buy some parts from another country but there are absolutely massive shipping fees.
For example this high performance thermnal paste you guys are talking about would cost me around 50€ if not more.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Cirov, what's your budget?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 2nd acrylic sheet: Failure!
> I just bought another acrylic sheet and along with it, I bought a jigsaw and the blade for acrylic glass. If this is a failure again, I will just service a handyman to do it for me...


Don't do that, the project has become highly personal, don't give up on it. You were cutting too fast and didn't have the acrylic clamped down enough.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Hey Swag, no need to share all the details of your personal life
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


LOL
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hahaha! I didn't even realize it sounded like that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, just for this project, my dad has bought over $1000 in new tools. They'll come in handy though when we renovate our kitchen and bathroom.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vertical saw, jigsaw, power drills, blades...! So many new things!
> Anyway, when it comes out perfect, I'll take pictures of it!


Keep trying, it will be much more meaningful if you do it yourself. And you will get your moneys worth out of those tools
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> What is a 'vertical saw'? Circular saw is vertical if you hold it that way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When cutting that stuff with jigsaw, go easy on the trigger....slow speed, new high tooth count blade, you should be fine.


I think the vertical saw he is referring to is what I would call a band saw. It has a large band like blade that cuts from top to bottom and is belt driven.


----------



## ripsaw

A band saw would be great for cutting acrylic, with the proper toothed blade/band on it. It's like having a table-jigsaw. Like the difference between ripping on a table saw or with a circ saw. Much better results on the table saw if done correctly.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> whatever works for you man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hopefully they last long, but honestly if you need to lube it so it keeps working then LOLS!
> I did my homework with sleeve "bearings" and never going back to those even though they can offer fantastic specs on a sheet of paper (or manufacturer website) ... and I used Japanese Scythe Slipstreams, not some Chinese Xinrulians
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... sleeve fans die, I used all of them vertically, as I said, first 2 died in 3 months, the other 5 in next 6 months, the last two I killed myself
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I trust only ball bearings and S-FDB, nothing else. it's too much PITA to drain the loop, remove radiator and so on to replce dead fans, that I trust things that have worked for everybody for years, Scythe GT Ap-15 and Scytke S-Flex 1,900rpm (I have both kinds in use).


Thanks for the input on your experience, hopefully mine will be a better one.

You might want to do a bit more research on ball bearing fans. It is very rare that they are equipped with sealed ball bearings, and the unsealed variety requires lubrication as well. It's not to keep them "running" by the way, but a preventive maintenance I do on all of them that aren't sealed. Whether unsealed ball or sleeve, I always lube fans before installing. The engine in every somewhat modern vehicle uses sleeve bushings as well. Aside from user error (lack of maintenance usually), they tend to last a very long time too. The PTFE additive in the light oil I use bonds on the molecular level in crevices of the grain of the metal. Giving it a (relatively) permanent lubricant that remains effective, even long after the oil itself has run out.

Honestly though,if manufacturers were truly interested in long life spans, they'd all be using magnetic "bearings" instead of balls/roller/needle/sleeves/rifle/"fluid" suspensions.

Just so you know, Nidec's (Scythe's parent co.) manufacturing bases are in Thailand, Malaysia, Vietnam, the Philippines & China. Only Nidec's Scythe division corporate offices are in Japan.

http://www.nidec.co.jp/english/corporate/network/network02.html


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Mine won't even boot at that vcore. lol
> 
> 
> 
> Haha touché. You think I just got lucky again or could it be my board possibly?
Click to expand...

It could be your board. I know when I tried an MSI MPower Z77 I was able to get 4.5GHz stable at .05v lower than my two other boards. Other factors can contribute too, but I good board goes a long way.

I wonder, do you know if the person who got your first great chip was able to get the same low vcore performance out of it as you did? (If not, tell him to get a better MB! No refund needed!)


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> It could be your board. I know when I tried an MSI MPower Z77 I was able to get 4.5GHz stable at .05v lower than my two other boards. Other factors can contribute too, but I good board goes a long way.
> I wonder, do you know if the person who got your first great chip was able to get the same low vcore performance out of it as you did? (If not, tell him to get a better MB! No refund needed!)


Well it's shipping out tomorrow to the UK so I won't know his results for quite some time, I'll make sure he keeps that in mind though







.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Haha touché. You think I just got lucky again or could it be my board possibly?


Interesting question.... I think i should try mine in some friends rigs....Nice that you got another good candidate for delid though!


----------



## feniks

to be honest man, heh, this discussion is OT and moot at some point








I am never going to lube fan bearings ever, same as I will never use again sleeve "bearings" of any kind ... just google user reported fan longevity of brands/models you like and I do and let's see for how long an "average user" (NOT the one who lubes bearings) enjoys them








S-FDB seems to live the longest while being very quiet (aka Scythe GT fans), then you have ball bearings (more noisy) with their long lifetime ... on the very end of that list are sleeve "bearings" the cheapest and crappiest of designs ... they die very quickly when compared to ball bearings or (S-)FDB ... I had sleeve fans on CPU heatsink (Xigmatek) before, it silently died when I was asleep, not fun to wake up in morning and see 90C+ temps on idle CPU - same goes with rads, my CPU (and GPU) life depends on it, I am not going to use el cheapo fans to save a few bucks and find them stalled or performing at half speed max when I need them most. my rig runs 24/7 and have always been no matter what parts are inside (they change over time), it's been many years like that, I need reliability for that.

by all means, keep lubing them, that is fine with me if it suits you, but it doesn't work for me LOL! if bearing starts stalling then it's done, unreliable, worn out and I replace it (e.g. in my car) or replace the whole fan assembly since it's relatively cheap ... and I don't want to spare my precious time on repeatedly fixing a $3-5 fan(s) every few months ...
I'm not going into discussion of locations of corporate factories around the globe, it's meaningless - what I meant it was the DESIGN (NIDEC) that matters most, not the factory assembling parts according to the design and specs (however that does matter to some extent too).









That being said we have a few Toyotas in family, and as long as they are Japanese designs (very reliable cars given proper maintenance since they are years 2000, 2002, etc.), the OEM/replacement parts come from Japan, Thailand, Canada and USA .. all that doesn't matter much as long as they are made to original Japanese specs









You don't have to agree with me, I don't have to agree with you, it's called democracy







to each its own!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Thanks for the input on your experience, hopefully mine will be a better one.
> You might want to do a bit more research on ball bearing fans. It is very rare that they are equipped with sealed ball bearings, and the unsealed variety requires lubrication as well. It's not to keep them "running" by the way, but a preventive maintenance I do on all of them that aren't sealed. Whether unsealed ball or sleeve, I always lube fans before installing. The engine in every somewhat modern vehicle uses sleeve bushings as well. Aside from user error (lack of maintenance usually), they tend to last a very long time too. The PTFE additive in the light oil I use bonds on the molecular level in crevices of the grain of the metal. Giving it a (relatively) permanent lubricant that remains effective, even long after the oil itself has run out.
> Honestly though,if manufacturers were truly interested in long life spans, they'd all be using magnetic "bearings" instead of balls/roller/needle/sleeves/rifle/"fluid" suspensions.
> Just so you know, Nidec's (Scythe's parent co.) manufacturing bases are in Thailand, Malaysia, Vietnam, the Philippines & China. Only Nidec's Scythe division corporate offices are in Japan.
> http://www.nidec.co.jp/english/corporate/network/network02.html


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> What is a 'vertical saw'? Circular saw is vertical if you hold it that way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When cutting that stuff with jigsaw, go easy on the trigger....slow speed, new high tooth count blade, you should be fine.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: stickg1
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 2nd acrylic sheet: Failure!
> I just bought another acrylic sheet and along with it, I bought a jigsaw and the blade for acrylic glass. If this is a failure again, I will just service a handyman to do it for me...
> 
> 
> 
> Don't do that, the project has become highly personal, don't give up on it. You were cutting too fast and didn't have the acrylic clamped down enough.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Hey Swag, no need to share all the details of your personal life
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> LOL
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hahaha! I didn't even realize it sounded like that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, just for this project, my dad has bought over $1000 in new tools. They'll come in handy though when we renovate our kitchen and bathroom.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vertical saw, jigsaw, power drills, blades...! So many new things!
> Anyway, when it comes out perfect, I'll take pictures of it!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Keep trying, it will be much more meaningful if you do it yourself. And you will get your moneys worth out of those tools
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> What is a 'vertical saw'? Circular saw is vertical if you hold it that way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When cutting that stuff with jigsaw, go easy on the trigger....slow speed, new high tooth count blade, you should be fine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I think the vertical saw he is referring to is what I would call a band saw. It has a large band like blade that cuts from top to bottom and is belt driven.
Click to expand...

I will persevere for this project! I will overcome this problem! I'm actually going to just do the entire project with my dremel and my trusty No. 561 multipurpose bit! It worked the first time, just the screw holes I have a problem with when using the dremel with that. Anyway, I cracked my 3rd piece of acrylic. The jigsaw was fine, but the drilling of the holes made the problem. Somehow the model I made for it moved and it pushed the drill to the corner causing it to crack. Tomorrow will be a different story. $40 down on acrylic alone already.







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> A band saw would be great for cutting acrylic, with the proper toothed blade/band on it. It's like having a table-jigsaw. Like the difference between ripping on a table saw or with a circ saw. Much better results on the table saw if done correctly.


I will show pictures of what I just purchased.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I will persevere for this project! I will overcome this problem! I'm actually going to just do the entire project with my dremel and my trusty No. 561 multipurpose bit! It worked the first time, just the screw holes I have a problem with when using the dremel with that. Anyway, I cracked my 3rd piece of acrylic. The jigsaw was fine, but the drilling of the holes made the problem. Somehow the model I made for it moved and it pushed the drill to the corner causing it to crack. Tomorrow will be a different story. $40 down on acrylic alone already.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will show pictures of what I just purchased.


If you have to drill near the edges of the acrylic then I would drill the holes first and then cut the piece to size. It is more likely to crack the closer to the edge of the acrylic.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I will persevere for this project! I will overcome this problem! I'm actually going to just do the entire project with my dremel and my trusty No. 561 multipurpose bit! It worked the first time, just the screw holes I have a problem with when using the dremel with that. Anyway, I cracked my 3rd piece of acrylic. The jigsaw was fine, but the drilling of the holes made the problem. Somehow the model I made for it moved and it pushed the drill to the corner causing it to crack. Tomorrow will be a different story. $40 down on acrylic alone already.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will show pictures of what I just purchased.
> 
> 
> 
> If you have to drill near the edges of the acrylic then I would drill the holes first and then cut the piece to size. It is more likely to crack the closer to the edge of the acrylic.
Click to expand...

Should I remove the plastic covering or leave it on when I'm doing the project?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Should I remove the plastic covering or leave it on when I'm doing the project?


Leave it on, help reduce scratches.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Should I remove the plastic covering or leave it on when I'm doing the project?
> 
> 
> 
> Leave it on, help reduce scratches.
Click to expand...

That's what I though, how can I make the edges better? Like sanding or what? Preferably something that is used on a dremel.


----------



## stickg1

Try using that sanding wheel to get it smooth followed by a buffing wheel with plastic polish on it.


----------



## Hokies83

Im with in 50$ of the Case Labs TH10 Again


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im with in 50$ of the Case Labs TH10 Again


Good luck! Don't spend the money again! That case is well worth it.









Anyone here prefer the look of the NH-D14 over a CLC/AIO? I do but I'm wondering if anyone else shares the same feelings!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Good luck! Don't spend the money again! That case is well worth it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone here prefer the look of the NH-D14 over a CLC/AIO? I do but I'm wondering if anyone else shares the same feelings!


I do as well. I don't like the look of the Corsair H series and others of that sort.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Good luck! Don't spend the money again! That case is well worth it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone here prefer the look of the NH-D14 over a CLC/AIO? I do but I'm wondering if anyone else shares the same feelings!
> 
> 
> 
> I do as well. I don't like the look of the Corsair H series and others of that sort.
Click to expand...

Yay! I'm not alone on this.







I was talking about this to some guy at the computer store and he said that the AIO perform the best and even rival custom water and look great. We argued for quite some time.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> @puffin: I suspect those extreme 4 boards misreport vcore, I wouldn't trust any Asrock board except for the OC Formula really, after that fatality fiasco thing. Hopefully that wasn't the case, otherwise some guy in Greece or whatever will hate ya.
> *****slap him...custom beats the crap out of aio wc, and a D14 or Silver Arrow look better, Phanteks even more so


I would argue that custom only beats it if you're doing it right. The guy would have bought a crappy pump, slim 120mm rad and tried to cool a CPU + GPU with it.

Altough yes, custom loops slap AIOs, and heatsinks look much sexier than AIOs


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> to be honest man, heh, this discussion is OT and moot at some point
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am never going to lube fan bearings ever, same as I will never use again sleeve "bearings" of any kind ... just google user reported fan longevity of brands/models you like and I do and let's see for how long an "average user" (NOT the one who lubes bearings) enjoys them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> S-FDB seems to live the longest while being very quiet (aka Scythe GT fans), then you have ball bearings (more noisy) with their long lifetime ... on the very end of that list are sleeve "bearings" the cheapest and crappiest of designs ... they die very quickly when compared to ball bearings or (S-)FDB ... I had sleeve fans on CPU heatsink (Xigmatek) before, it silently died when I was asleep, not fun to wake up in morning and see 90C+ temps on idle CPU - same goes with rads, my CPU (and GPU) life depends on it, I am not going to use el cheapo fans to save a few bucks and find them stalled or performing at half speed max when I need them most. my rig runs 24/7 and have always been no matter what parts are inside (they change over time), it's been many years like that, I need reliability for that.
> by all means, keep lubing them, that is fine with me if it suits you, but it doesn't work for me LOL! if bearing starts stalling then it's done, unreliable, worn out and I replace it (e.g. in my car) or replace the whole fan assembly since it's relatively cheap ... and I don't want to spare my precious time on repeatedly fixing a $3-5 fan(s) every few months ...
> I'm not going into discussion of locations of corporate factories around the globe, it's meaningless - what I meant it was the DESIGN (NIDEC) that matters most, not the factory assembling parts according to the design and specs (however that does matter to some extent too).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That being said we have a few Toyotas in family, and as long as they are Japanese designs (very reliable cars given proper maintenance since they are years 2000, 2002, etc.), the OEM/replacement parts come from Japan, Thailand, Canada and USA .. all that doesn't matter much as long as they are made to original Japanese specs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't have to agree with me, I don't have to agree with you, it's called democracy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to each its own!


A piece of advice if you run 24/7, and I do to. Get an Aquaero 5. Even the least expensive LT version will shut down your system w/ nothing more added than an inexpensive 12v relay if anything goes out of spec. From fans, to pumps, to just plain good old temps, it covers it all.









You're right, we're not going to change either person's mind. That wasn't the intent at all. Just expressing that your bad experience doesn't mirror everyone's experience. No doubt sleeve bushings aren't the best, but that doesn't make them a bad option either. I bought mine because they were the best spec fans I could get with a build I was running out of budget on. They are not a permanent solution for me. However, you made it sound like every sleeve bushed fan is going to fail in a matter of months. That is an exception, not the rule. If failure rates were as common as you imply, no one would ever buy them, including the OEM's that use them (sleeve bushing fans) all the time with little ill effect.

You take much liberty with what I said in exaggerations. There is no further maintenance aside from filling the oil well one time at the beginning of their service life. In case you missed it, that is the point of using a PTFE based lubricant entirely. My old home server is a perfect case in point, 4 yrs running a set of Yate Loon's, with no issue or extra maintenance. For the record, I toss any fan that gives me the first sign of trouble too.









To whit, I haven't seen any posts or articles complaining about these XSPC Xinrullian fans aside from yours. Google searches shows nothing that I have seen, aside from one person whose OEM pc had lost a fan, & not even the same model. Another claiming the the fans in OEM psu's were failing in 2003 (also without proof). So forgive me if I seem a little incredulous with an in absentia proof of failure, or performance being overstated, presented in a case you bring against these specific models. Without which, it is a moot point.

Consider the matter dropped. Good day sir, I truly wish you well in the new year.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey, is anyone experienced with rog connect bios flashback in the MVG or newer z77 boards?
My board stopped posting after fiddling with bclk a bit on air, nothing outrageous 106.9mhz.
Thing is I suspect the bios got corrupted or somehow the clear cmos doesn't work cause all I get is the power led blinking for a sec and then nothing fans stop spinning after this happens. (takes about 1sec for the whole process)


----------



## Gomi

I cannot get past 103 BCLK :-(


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I cannot get past 103 BCLK :-(


You don't overclock using BCLK....


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You don't overclock using BCLK....


AMD Overclockers


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You don't overclock using BCLK....
> 
> 
> 
> AMD Overclockers
Click to expand...

AMD Overclocking, what irony.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> AMD Overclocking, what irony.


AMD is beast at overclocking, it's just the performance that's lacking

Also, it's a paradox, not irony. Get your literary terms right


----------



## Hokies83

Amd overclocks pretty bad really 8350 normal best is 4.8ghz.... 1000mhz over stock... And uses almost the same power as a gpu lol....

3770k 4.8ghz 1300mhz overstock with using less power and being 59% faster per core XD

The thing that is funny but u see ppl with 350$ cases and 400$ water loops preaching price per performance With a 8350... But they onlything they went cheap on was there Cpu...

This is what is commonly known as stupid or Fan Boi..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You don't overclock using BCLK....


i tried once, to use blck only to oc









107 blck

108 blck

108 blck was the highest i got..not bad..yea, i had amd before intel too ..haha


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> AMD Overclocking, what irony.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AMD is beast at overclocking, it's just the performance that's lacking
> 
> Also, it's a paradox, not irony. Get your literary terms right
Click to expand...

Good thing English isn't going to be my major.


----------



## King4x4

Tried BCLK OCing... the highest was 102.5... and even then it was unstable!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You don't overclock using BCLK....


i tried once, to use blck only to oc









107 blck

108 blck

108 blck was the highest i got..not bad..yea, i had amd before intel too ..haha

theres a thread someone mentioned to me, its about the highest blck oc,
i think sin0822 was #1, with 115 blck, second one had 111 blck i think,
at first i thought i could get to 112blck ..but ..well, 108 blck was where it stopped for me,
but i didnt really spend mich time in trying to get higher,
i dont know how "bad" ocing with blck is for a mobo etc..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Tried BCLK OCing... the highest was 102.5... and even then it was unstable!


ive used 101blck for a while, upto 4.6-4.7ghz, above that is no go for any blck with my mobo,
4.7ghz 102blck ..no go..about 101.40 blck was max..


----------



## feniks

and peace to that man!









Just to clarify what I failed to say about googling on fan bearings and makes/models. in fact there's not much input on xinrulian fans, but mostly those are used by XSPC kit users AFAIK, not that many people buy them separately while Scythe brand is VERY popular among long time water coolers (same as Yate Loon is). I merely had in mind opinions of users (me included) on Scythe Slipstream vs Scythe GT or S-Flex series, those are most common to come across when googling.
As you said, probably I was unlucky, but then it does take a person aback to see over half a dozen sleeve fans die in same manner in just 3-9 months ... could be that Scythe Slipstreams are just so cheap and actually much worse than Yate Loon's ... maybe that's the case









That relay you mentioned to shutdown when else fails. I have actually similar idea of a built-in fail safe, however I had planned to this using BIOS sensor reporting. My water pump is plugged into motherboard's CPU_OPT fan header, so I can see the pump RPM in BIOS or Windows (reported as CPU FAN) ... have yet to find a way to force a (software commanded) system shutdown when this reading goes to zero for more than 10 seconds or so. initially thought that BIOS would have such feature, but it seems a thing of past where air coolers were popular and CPu fan RPM at zero would event prevent system from POST, not so much on ROG BIOS unless I just can't find something like that in this BIOS. would need a software solution running in Windows to take care of that.

Happy New Year too!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> A piece of advice if you run 24/7, and I do to. Get an Aquaero 5. Even the least expensive LT version will shut down your system w/ nothing more added than an inexpensive 12v relay if anything goes out of spec. From fans, to pumps, to just plain good old temps, it covers it all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're right, we're not going to change either person's mind. That wasn't the intent at all. Just expressing that your bad experience doesn't mirror everyone's experience. No doubt sleeve bushings aren't the best, but that doesn't make them a bad option either. I bought mine because they were the best spec fans I could get with a build I was running out of budget on. They are not a permanent solution for me. However, you made it sound like every sleeve bushed fan is going to fail in a matter of months. That is an exception, not the rule. If failure rates were as common as you imply, no one would ever buy them, including the OEM's that use them (sleeve bushing fans) all the time with little ill effect.
> You take much liberty with what I said in exaggerations. There is no further maintenance aside from filling the oil well one time at the beginning of their service life. In case you missed it, that is the point of using a PTFE based lubricant entirely. My old home server is a perfect case in point, 4 yrs running a set of Yate Loon's, with no issue or extra maintenance. For the record, I toss any fan that gives me the first sign of trouble too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To whit, I haven't seen any posts or articles complaining about these XSPC Xinrullian fans aside from yours. Google searches shows nothing that I have seen, aside from one person whose OEM pc had lost a fan, & not even the same model. Another claiming the the fans in OEM psu's were failing in 2003 (also without proof). So forgive me if I seem a little incredulous with an in absentia proof of failure, or performance being overstated, presented in a case you bring against these specific models. Without which, it is a moot point.
> Consider the matter dropped. Good day sir, I truly wish you well in the new year.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Did a little prime testing at 4.7 last night. I think I've got a good starting point to compare my temps now after I delid. Certainly no golden chip here that's for sure but I think I'll be able to do 4.8 which is all I was hoping for with this chip so for that I'm happy







.


----------



## VonDutch

strange, was doing some ocing this morning with 8bitclocker
to get to 5.2ghz..
i couldnt open my old cpuz validation files oc's anymore somehow, but got some back in the 5ghz club,

look what i had back then when i first oced to 5.2ghz, vcore wise,


this 5.2ghz i did this morning, 1.610V vcore i couldnt boot at

1.650V vcore i could boot, but i just took that vcore to be sure i could boot,
i disabled xmp profile as you can see with this run

the first 5.2ghz oc was done when it was -3C outside,
my comp is in the hallway, and i opened the frontdoor to let cold in, took a sidepanel off to lol
my coolest core idle was 0C,


today its almost 10C, so my coolest core is about 12-15C now
does that mean because of higher ambient temps, i need more vcore also, to get to the same oc?

im having this in mind,


my question is, is on air vcore lower also, if temps are way down?
if im wrong, could it be my chip is degrading?
ive done some crazy things with it, but not for long periods of time,
im thinking, temps where alot lower, and i did alot more finetuning all my settings,
to get lowest vcore to boot with..still strange i couldnt boot at 1.610V vcore


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Did a little prime testing at 4.7 last night. I think I've got a good starting point to compare my temps now after I delid. Certainly no golden chip here that's for sure but I think I'll be able to do 4.8 which is all I was hoping for with this chip so for that I'm happy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I need 1,420vcore for the same clock as you..... you may be able to get 5ghz on that baby.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> strange, was doing some ocing this morning with 8bitclocker
> to get to 5.2ghz..
> i couldnt open my old cpuz validation files oc's anymore somehow, but got some back in the 5ghz club,
> look what i had back then when i first oced to 5.2ghz, vcore wise,
> 
> this 5.2ghz i did this morning, 1.610V vcore i couldnt boot at
> 
> 1.650V vcore i could boot, but i just took that vcore to be sure i could boot,
> i disabled xmp profile as you can see with this run
> the first 5.2ghz oc was done when it was -3C outside,
> my comp is in the hallway, and i opened the frontdoor to let cold in, took a sidepanel off to lol
> my coolest core idle was 0C,
> 
> today its almost 10C, so my coolest core is about 12-15C now
> does that mean because of higher ambient temps, i need more vcore also, to get to the same oc?
> im having this in mind,
> 
> my question is, is on air vcore lower also, if temps are way down?
> if im wrong, could it be my chip is degrading?
> ive done some crazy things with it, but not for long periods of time,
> im thinking, temps where alot lower, and i did alot more finetuning all my settings,
> to get lowest vcore to boot with..still strange i couldnt boot at 1.610V vcore


When temps are below a certain threshold (depends on the chip) vcore will be much less for any ggiven clock.
That's why people freeze their chips for benching, it increases conductivity and thus you need less vcore.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> strange, was doing some ocing this morning with 8bitclocker
> to get to 5.2ghz..
> i couldnt open my old cpuz validation files oc's anymore somehow, but got some back in the 5ghz club,
> look what i had back then when i first oced to 5.2ghz, vcore wise,
> 
> this 5.2ghz i did this morning, 1.610V vcore i couldnt boot at
> 
> 1.650V vcore i could boot, but i just took that vcore to be sure i could boot,
> i disabled xmp profile as you can see with this run
> the first 5.2ghz oc was done when it was -3C outside,
> my comp is in the hallway, and i opened the frontdoor to let cold in, took a sidepanel off to lol
> my coolest core idle was 0C,
> 
> today its almost 10C, so my coolest core is about 12-15C now
> does that mean because of higher ambient temps, i need more vcore also, to get to the same oc?
> im having this in mind,
> 
> my question is, is on air vcore lower also, if temps are way down?
> if im wrong, could it be my chip is degrading?
> ive done some crazy things with it, but not for long periods of time,
> im thinking, temps where alot lower, and i did alot more finetuning all my settings,
> to get lowest vcore to boot with..still strange i couldnt boot at 1.610V vcore


I'd say a mix of both.. Mainly the CPU degrading though..
So clock it down I guess and don't play with the voltage past 1.45v or so..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> When temps are below a certain threshold (depends on the chip) vcore will be much less for any ggiven clock.
> That's why people freeze their chips for benching, it increases conductivity and thus you need less vcore.


yea, thought the cold i had was good too, wasnt sure if the same goes for oc's, vcores and our temps on air,
0C is cold tho..of course still hot compared to dice/ln2 etc
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'd say a mix of both.. Mainly the CPU degrading though..
> So clock it down I guess and don't play with the voltage past 1.45v or so..


yep, my daily oc is about 1.310V vcore, 4.7ghz..
but didnt notice i need more vcore for the lower oc's ..
still find it hard to believe its already degrading,
but maybe running 1.850V vcore through it, wasnt a good idea after all ...LOL


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> and peace to that man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just to clarify what I failed to say about googling on fan bearings and makes/models. in fact there's not much input on xinrulian fans, but mostly those are used by XSPC kit users AFAIK, not that many people buy them separately while Scythe brand is VERY popular among long time water coolers (same as Yate Loon is). I merely had in mind opinions of users (me included) on Scythe Slipstream vs Scythe GT or S-Flex series, those are most common to come across when googling.
> As you said, probably I was unlucky, but then it does take a person aback to see over half a dozen sleeve fans die in same manner in just 3-9 months ... could be that Scythe Slipstreams are just so cheap and actually much worse than Yate Loon's ... maybe that's the case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That relay you mentioned to shutdown when else fails. I have actually similar idea of a built-in fail safe, however I had planned to this using BIOS sensor reporting. My water pump is plugged into motherboard's CPU_OPT fan header, so I can see the pump RPM in BIOS or Windows (reported as CPU FAN) ... have yet to find a way to force a (software commanded) system shutdown when this reading goes to zero for more than 10 seconds or so. initially thought that BIOS would have such feature, but it seems a thing of past where air coolers were popular and CPu fan RPM at zero would event prevent system from POST, not so much on ROG BIOS unless I just can't find something like that in this BIOS. would need a software solution running in Windows to take care of that.
> Happy New Year too!


That could be it, I only ever had a problem with one Yate fan, and it was a defective cap that popped as soon as it was powered up. I strongly suspect it was made by one of the subcontracted companies they license manufacturing out to, and those subcontracted YL's are definitely much lower in quality. From the motor itself being physically smaller, to the components on the pcb's being substandard. Petra's is the only one that I know of off hand that deals direct w/ YL, and always has the high quality manufactured directly by YL versions. I haven't really much used Scythe, aside from their 128 in 1 card reader that's in my old system (Now my son's computer. I have a Akasa Baymaster S reader/2.5" dock for an external monitor stand/surround sound amp/dock project I've got going on).

Before I went custom water a few years back, I was all into high cfm/pressure Delta's, Pabst, & Mechatronics with my Megahalem's. Wind noise > bearing noise!







A few years of that got pretty old though. There's nothing like hearing your Delta MegaFast's running through a closed door, on the other end of the house while you're out in the garage! Lol!







I ran the MegaFast's both on the outside in p/p on a Silver Arrow later, with a gutted 140mm shrouding the middle. 4.4 Ghz stable on a 965 BE on air, but good god they were loud though!

I've been thinking along the same lines for years about fail safe's. That's the thing with the Aquaero 5's, it's not just simply a fan/pump controller. It's an onboard cooling system stand alone micro computer that interfaces real time with the OS, and with the built in mobo/cpu/gpu/rpm/pwm sensors. Not to mention having it's own wide array of available sensors itself. From flow rate, to water temp, to direct contact thermistor sensors, and even water level sensors. The auto shutdown failsafe is just the cherry on top. Imo, it's the pinnacle when it comes to fan control, no question. Plus, if you're running a pwm controlled pump like I am, there is no need for any PowerAdust add-on's. Simply plug the PWM in, and the power from the pump comes direct from the psu while the Aquaero controls it. The optional heatsink at bare minimum is the only accessory absolutely necessary to purchase additional to the the Aquaero 5 LT or Pro models when running PWM pumps. With the XT, it already comes equipped. Long story short: Highly recommended.









@ VonDutch: I won't say for certain, because my experience is quite limited w/ Ivy, but that's exactly what happened to my 3750k before it started ctd'ing and later, bsod'ing. It jumped from 1.35 to 1.40 to boot at 4.4, then 1.43 Vcore all in the course of 48 hours. 0X50e error codes. Even at stock, it's doing the same. A dying IMC I'm pretty certain, being that my memtest runs (2x) and Prime 95 came out fine on my sons comp w/ the Sammie ELV "miracle" mem installed.

Oh well, the new chip will be here tomorrow


----------



## Bigm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigm*
> 
> Scratched up my chip pretty bad but it still powers on and nothing catches on fire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Of course with my luck I bent the pins on my mobo so I need to order a new one because I can't be bothered to fix it. Worse comes to worse I'll use this as an excuse to upgrade from a 3570k to a 3770k


Little update on this, chip ended up giving me post code 00 so I had to order a new chip and mobo. Went with the 3570k again and glad I did. As soon as took it out of the box I put my blade to it and the IHS popped right off. Still waiting on the mobo so I'm trying to get a friend to let me test it in his rig mainly because I'm so excited to see the temp differences. Huge thanks to everyone on this thread for all the motivation that drove me to do it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Did a little prime testing at 4.7 last night. I think I've got a good starting point to compare my temps now after I delid. Certainly no golden chip here that's for sure but I think I'll be able to do 4.8 which is all I was hoping for with this chip so for that I'm happy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Still looks great to me *PuffinMyLye*! Can you use a voltmeter on your system to verify your vcore is correct? I have heard that some ASRocks MBs do read vcore too low. Would be nice to know if your vcore readings are correct or not.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> @ VonDutch: I won't say for certain, because my experience is quite limited w/ Ivy, but that's exactly what happened to my 3750k before it started ctd'ing and later, bsod'ing. It jumped from 1.35 to 1.40 to boot at 4.4, then 1.43 Vcore all in the course of 48 hours. 0X50e error codes. Even at stock, it's doing the same. A dying IMC I'm pretty certain, being that my memtest runs (2x) and Prime 95 came out fine on my sons comp w/ the Sammie ELV "miracle" mem installed.
> 
> Oh well, the new chip will be here tomorrow


Man, that must make *VonDutch* feel great! I sure hope it is not ture of your chip *VonDutch*!

And good luck on your new chip *Raven*!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigm*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Bigm*
> 
> Scratched up my chip pretty bad but it still powers on and nothing catches on fire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Of course with my luck I bent the pins on my mobo so I need to order a new one because I can't be bothered to fix it. Worse comes to worse I'll use this as an excuse to upgrade from a 3570k to a 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Little update on this, chip ended up giving me post code 00 so I had to order a new chip and mobo. Went with the 3570k again and glad I did. As soon as took it out of the box I put my blade to it and the IHS popped right off. Still waiting on the mobo so I'm trying to get a friend to let me test it in his rig mainly because I'm so excited to see the temp differences. Huge thanks to everyone on this thread for all the motivation that drove me to do it.
Click to expand...

That is great to hear *Bigm*! I guess that means you won't have any before temps to compare with to know how much of an improvment you made, but as long as it works and has good low temps it is a success! Let us know how it goes.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> @ VonDutch: I won't say for certain, because my experience is quite limited w/ Ivy, but that's exactly what happened to my 3750k before it started ctd'ing and later, bsod'ing. It jumped from 1.35 to 1.40 to boot at 4.4, then 1.43 Vcore all in the course of 48 hours. 0X50e error codes. Even at stock, it's doing the same. A dying IMC I'm pretty certain, being that my memtest runs (2x) and Prime 95 came out fine on my sons comp w/ the Sammie ELV "miracle" mem installed.
> Oh well, the new chip will be here tomorrow


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Man, that must make *VonDutch* feel great! I sure hope it is not ture of your chip *VonDutch*!


whaha









it was just something i noticed with the 5.2ghz oc's today,
prolly could have booted with lower vcore,
who knows why it didnt boot at 1.610V vcore,
and it did boot weeks ago with 1.575V

i will keep a eye on it, but im still running the same vcore, and offset then before,
with 4.6-4.7ghz, shouldnt all oc's need more vcore if theres degradation?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Still looks great to me *PuffinMyLye*! Can you use a voltmeter on your system to verify your vcore is correct? I have heard that some ASRocks MBs do read vcore too low. Would be nice to know if your vcore readings are correct or not.


Can one be gotten for cheap?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> @ VonDutch: I won't say for certain, because my experience is quite limited w/ Ivy, but that's exactly what happened to my 3750k before it started ctd'ing and later, bsod'ing. It jumped from 1.35 to 1.40 to boot at 4.4, then 1.43 Vcore all in the course of 48 hours. 0X50e error codes. Even at stock, it's doing the same. A dying IMC I'm pretty certain, being that my memtest runs (2x) and Prime 95 came out fine on my sons comp w/ the Sammie ELV "miracle" mem installed.
> Oh well, the new chip will be here tomorrow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Man, that must make *VonDutch* feel great! I sure hope it is not ture of your chip *VonDutch*!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> whaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it was just something i noticed with the 5.2ghz oc's today,
> prolly could have booted with lower vcore,
> who knows why it didnt boot at 1.610V vcore,
> and it did boot weeks ago with 1.575V
> 
> i will keep a eye on it, but im still running the same vcore, and offset then before,
> with 4.6-4.7ghz, shouldnt all oc's need more vcore if theres degradation?
Click to expand...

I'd think it would effect more than just one OC. But if it were to start at just one OC, I'd think it would be the top one.







But I really think your chip is OK and its just a settings or ambient temp issue.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Still looks great to me *PuffinMyLye*! Can you use a voltmeter on your system to verify your vcore is correct? I have heard that some ASRocks MBs do read vcore too low. Would be nice to know if your vcore readings are correct or not.
> 
> 
> 
> Can one be gotten for cheap?
Click to expand...

Yep. ~$30 or so. See quick google search link below:

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=les%3B&gs_rn=1&gs_ri=hp&pq=voltmeter&cp=12&gs_id=12&xhr=t&q=voltmeter+price&pf=p&tbo=d&sclient=psy-ab&oq=voltmeter+pr&gs_l=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1355534169,d.b2I&fp=c341db92e3d4d65d&bpcl=40096503&biw=1536&bih=760


----------



## omgmorebees

What's the cheapest IB CPU I could buy to try and practice delidding on? i.e. the lowest-end model that has the same IHS/die layout as a 3770k. Sorry if that's a stupid question, but I would be very embarrassed if I killed an i7 knowing I could've practiced first


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *omgmorebees*
> 
> What's the cheapest IB CPU I could buy to try and practice delidding on? i.e. the lowest-end model that has the same IHS/die layout as a 3770k. Sorry if that's a stupid question, but I would be _very_ embarrassed if I killed an i7 knowing I could've practiced first


practice on some old pentiums, they are very cheap, i bought 10 pentiums for 10 euro
we have a list somewhere ..wait....

IHS Not Soldered To Die

Hyperthreading/Single Cores

-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
-(S-478) Celeron
-(S-775) Celeron
-Celeron 420
-Celeron 430
-Celeron 440
-AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)

Dual Cores

-AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
-Celeron Dual Core E1200
-Celeron Dual Core E1400
-Pentium Dual Core E2140
-Pentium Dual Core E2160
-Pentium Dual Core E2180
-Pentium Dual Core E2200
-Pentium Dual Core E2210
-Pentium Dual Core E2220
-Pentium Dual Core E6300
-Core 2 Duo E4300
-Core 2 Duo E4400
-Core 2 Duo E4500
-Core 2 Duo E4600
-Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E7200
-Core 2 Duo E7300
-Core 2 Duo E7400
-Core 2 Duo E7500
-Core 2 Duo E7600

IHS Soldered To Die

Hyperthreading/Single Cores

-(S-775) Pentium 4 HT
-(S-775) Celeron D*
-(S-478) Celeron D*
-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Prescott Core)
-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "C" Core)*

Dual Cores

-(S-775) Pentium 4 Extreme Edition
-(S-775) Pentium D
-Pentium Dual Core E5200*
-Pentium Dual Core E5300*
-Pentium Dual Core E5400*
-Core 2 Duo E4700*
-Core 2 Duo E6300 (B2 stepping)
-Core 2 Duo E6320
-Core 2 Duo E6400 (B2 stepping)
-Core 2 Duo E6420
-Core 2 Duo E6540
-Core 2 Duo E6550
-Core 2 Duo E6600
-Core 2 Duo E6700
-Core 2 Duo E6750
-Core 2 Duo E6850
-Core 2 Duo Extreme X6800
-Core 2 Duo E8190
-Core 2 Duo E8200
-Core 2 Duo E8300
-Core 2 Duo E8400
-Core 2 Duo E8500
-Core 2 Duo E8600
-Xeon 3040 (L2 stepping)*
-Xeon 3040 (B2 stepping)
-Xeon 3050 (L2 stepping)*
-Xeon 3040 (B2 stepping)
-Xeon 3060
-Xeon 3070
-Xeon L3110
-Xeon E3110
-Xeon E3120
-Xeon E5502
-AMD Athlon X2 6000+

Tri Cores

-AMD Phenom X3*

Quad Cores

-Core 2 Quad Q6600
-Core 2 Quad Q6700
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX6700
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX6800
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX6850
-Core 2 Quad Q8200
-Core 2 Quad Q8300
-Core 2 Quad Q8400
-Core 2 Quad Q8400S
-Core 2 Quad Q9300
-Core 2 Quad Q9400
-Core 2 Quad Q9400S
-Core 2 Quad Q9450
-Core 2 Quad Q9550
-Core 2 Quad Q9550S
-Core 2 Quad Q9650
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX9650
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX9770
-Core 2 Quad Extreme QX9775
-Xeon X3210
-Xeon X3220
-Xeon X3230
-Xeon X3320
-Xeon X3350
-Xeon X3360
-Xeon L3360
-Xeon X3370
-Core i5 750
-Core i7 860
-Core i7 870
-Core i7 920
-Core i7 940
-Core i7 950
-Core i7 Extreme Edition 965
-Core i7 Extreme Edition 975
-AMD Phenom X4*

i think its not important if they are soldered or not,
its about getting the feel on how to delid,
and what happens if you start cutting the adhesive, force to use etc









proud dad,
heres my 15year old son doing a corner of a old pentium we bought to practice on,



this one was hard to delid he said, harder then the other one..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Practice on a pentium 4 478 socket...then go with your IB cpu of choice.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That's what I though, how can I make the edges better? Like sanding or what? Preferably something that is used on a dremel.


Use a torch, and lightly feather the edges with heat. If you don't have a torch, you may might try a heat gun or hair dryer on high too. Test on scrap first, get your technique/ timing..


----------



## omgmorebees

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> practice on some old pentiums, they are very cheap, i bought 10 pentiums for 10 euro
> we have a list somewhere ..wait....
> IHS Not Soldered To Die
> ...
> i think its not important if they are soldered or not,
> its about getting the feel on how to delid,
> and what happens if you start cutting the adhesive, force to use etc


Quote:



> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Practice on a pentium 4 478 socket...then go with your IB cpu of choice.


Thank you both very much! You've saved my poor 3770k from my unpracticed hands


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Use a torch, and lightly feather the edges with heat. If you don't have a torch, you may might try a heat gun or hair dryer on high too. Test on scrap first, get your technique/ timing..


I was going to ask this question.. If i hit the chip with a heat gun for a few seconds, i should be able to get it off pretty easily right?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't do that...if the heat gun goes beyond 200w of heat you might kill it. 105c is the max temp before it shuts down, and the max tdp these can get is around 200-250w when overclocking, hence my reasoning.

Just use a very sharp and thin gillette blade and do the motion in a single cut. Practice makes perfect, so get some pentiums.


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't do that...if the heat gun goes beyond 200w of heat you might kill it. 105c is the max temp before it shuts down, and the max tdp these can get is around 200-250w when overclocking, hence my reasoning.
> Just use a very sharp and thin gillette blade and do the motion in a single cut. Practice makes perfect, so get some pentiums.


I didn't mean while it was on :-D.

I was just gonna blast it for 5-10 seconds to heat it up and make the glue soft... I'm not trying to cook it :-D


----------



## VonDutch

put it 20 min in a oven, thats heated about 70-80C ?
think it could work better then holding a torch to it ..lol

another one could be,
heat up the blade a bit youre gonna use?

another one is,
send it to me, i will delid it for you ...LOL


----------



## Bigdale7

I used a hair dryer, high setting, and heated mine up until it was almost too warm to touch. It seemed to help alot. Also I reheated it about half way through the process..


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I was going to ask this question.. If i hit the chip with a heat gun for a few seconds, i should be able to get it off pretty easily right?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> put it 20 min in a oven, thats heated about 70-80C ?
> think it could work better then holding a torch to it ..lol
> another one could be,
> heat up the blade a bit youre gonna use?
> another one is,
> send it to me, i will delid it for you ...LOL


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I was going to ask this question.. If i hit the chip with a heat gun for a few seconds, i should be able to get it off pretty easily right?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I didn't mean while it was on :-D.
> I was just gonna blast it for 5-10 seconds to heat it up and make the glue soft... I'm not trying to cook it :-D


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I was going to ask this question.. If i hit the chip with a heat gun for a few seconds, i should be able to get it off pretty easily right?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't do that...if the heat gun goes beyond 200w of heat you might kill it. 105c is the max temp before it shuts down, and the max tdp these can get is around 200-250w when overclocking, hence my reasoning.
> Just use a very sharp and thin gillette blade and do the motion in a single cut. Practice makes perfect, so get some pentiums.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> I was going to ask this question.. If i hit the chip with a heat gun for a few seconds, i should be able to get it off pretty easily right?


I was talking about acrylic....
Hard as ever to keep up with this thread!








I wouldn't take a torch to my processor....i'd rather give it away lol


----------



## Bigm

Got my chip to boot at 5Ghz with a 1.5 vcore in my friend's pc. He doesn't have the best cooling (H80) and temps were still very good. Boots at 4.5 with a 1.2 vcore. Excited to see what I can do with my new system once I'm up and running.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigm*
> 
> Got my chip to boot at 5Ghz with a 1.5 vcore in my friend's pc. He doesn't have the best cooling (H80) and temps were still very good. Boots at 4.5 with a 1.2 vcore. Excited to see what I can do with my new system once I'm up and running.


That sounds like a good chip *Bigm*. Good job on the delid!


----------



## Valgaur

VonDutch your CPU list is on the OP tell me what you think.


----------



## Bigm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That sounds like a good chip *Bigm*. Good job on the delid!


Thanks mate, looking forward to what I can do with it when I get the parts and time to play around with it some more.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Yep. ~$30 or so. See quick google search link below:
> http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=les%3B&gs_rn=1&gs_ri=hp&pq=voltmeter&cp=12&gs_id=12&xhr=t&q=voltmeter+price&pf=p&tbo=d&sclient=psy-ab&oq=voltmeter+pr&gs_l=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1355534169,d.b2I&fp=c341db92e3d4d65d&bpcl=40096503&biw=1536&bih=760


I'll consider getting one the next time I have some spare money to work with. I've bought a LOT of stuff over the past few weeks







. Furthermore the first 3570K I bought (that I moved to my emulator box after picking up the 3770K) was just an average clocker with this same board. So maybe I have just gotten lucky with these past 2 chips.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, thought the cold i had was good too, wasnt sure if the same goes for oc's, vcores and our temps on air,
> 0C is cold tho..of course still hot compared to dice/ln2 etc
> yep, my daily oc is about 1.310V vcore, 4.7ghz..
> but didnt notice i need more vcore for the lower oc's ..
> still find it hard to believe its already degrading,
> but maybe running 1.850V vcore through it, wasnt a good idea after all ...LOL


Yeah.. Oh well now you know for next time!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Man, that must make *VonDutch* feel great! I sure hope it is not ture of your chip *VonDutch*!
> And good luck on your new chip *Raven*!


Lol! I wasn't trying to scare him...







Just a list of how mine kicked off, so if he ran into similar circumstance, he'd know what to expect.









...and thanks!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> whaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it was just something i noticed with the 5.2ghz oc's today,
> prolly could have booted with lower vcore,
> who knows why it didnt boot at 1.610V vcore,
> and it did boot weeks ago with 1.575V
> i will keep a eye on it, but im still running the same vcore, and offset then before,
> with 4.6-4.7ghz, shouldnt all oc's need more vcore if theres degradation?


IME, yes. Bumping the Vcore to maintain the same clocks that were previously stable is a sure sign of electromigration degradation. If it's still stable at the same everyday Vcore and offset, it should be fine, and there's nothing to worry about









Unless you did like I and swapped to a different board that has a lot of Vdroop, like my old Gigabyte 990FXA-UD5. Bad mistake, early adopting that one was. l lost 214 Mhz off my best stable oc because of that p.o.s. board. The NB oc'd much better though, 3255 Mhz. Still, it wasn't enough to overcome the slower fsb & cpu multi oc. I just wasn't willing to run 1.72 Vcore at idle to offset the droop. Yeah, .23 V sag under load. :/


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Lol! I wasn't trying to scare him...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just a list of how mine kicked off, so if he ran into similar circumstance, he'd know what to expect.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IME, yes. Bumping the Vcore to maintain the same clocks that were previously stable is a sure sign of electromigration degradation. If it's still stable at the same everyday Vcore and offset, it should be fine, and there's nothing to worry about
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unless you did like I and swapped to a different board that has a lot of Vdroop, like my old Gigabyte 990FXA-UD5. Bad mistake, early adopting that one was. l lost 214 Mhz off my best stable oc because of that p.o.s. board. The NB oc'd much better though, 3255 Mhz. Still, it wasn't enough to overcome the slower fsb & cpu multi oc. I just wasn't willing to run 1.72 Vcore at idle to offset the droop. Yeah, .23 V sag under load. :/


Yeah those 990FXA-UD# Rev 1.0s were not fun to work with. My UD3 Rev 1.1 did decent with my FX-8150 and the two FX-8320's I tried but I sold it to a professional photographer/videographer and built Team America.


----------



## Legonut

Add me!
Legonut
3770k
AS5
AS5
200
4.7Ghz
10C
http://valid.canardpc.com/2612302


----------



## j3st3r

What is the average drop in temp on average?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *j3st3r*
> 
> What is the average drop in temp on average?


Depends on what TIM you use. Those who use Coollaboratory Pro (CLP) seem to see temp drops of 20+C consistently. My chip dropped 28C.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Depends on what TIM you use. Those who use Coollaboratory Pro (CLP) seem to see temp drops of 20+C consistently. My chip dropped 28C.


Yeah, if you use the CLP or CLU (I used pro on the DIE to make the IHS stick). I got at least a 25c drop. If you're using say MX-2 etc the average drop is about ~15c, it depends on how bad the stock TIM was and what kind of cooler you have also oh and of course your skills with applying the CLP/CLU.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well good and bad news..I'll be getting a ton of 3770k's to bin and resell for free xD
Lucky me huh?

EDIT: ah the bad news...I suspect my g620 died a glorious death. gonna try changing bios settings via rog connect using a notebook though.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, if you use the CLP or CLU (I used pro on the DIE to make the IHS stick). I got at least a 25c drop. If you're using say MX-2 etc the average drop is about ~15c, it depends on how bad the stock TIM was and what kind of cooler you have also oh and of course your skills with applying the CLP/CLU.


CLP is supposed to make it stick? I put CLP on the die and between the IHS and waterblock and neither stuck. When I unmounted my block there was no tension and when removing my CPU from the socket the IHS was clearly loose.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well good and bad news..I'll be getting a ton of 3770k's to bin and resell for free xD
> Lucky me huh?
> EDIT: ah the bad news...I suspect my g620 died a glorious death. gonna try changing bios settings via rog connect using a notebook though.


Free 3770k's? That's awesome







.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, thought the cold i had was good too, wasnt sure if the same goes for oc's, vcores and our temps on air,
> 0C is cold tho..of course still hot compared to dice/ln2 etc
> yep, my daily oc is about 1.310V vcore, 4.7ghz..
> but didnt notice i need more vcore for the lower oc's ..
> still find it hard to believe its already degrading,
> but maybe running 1.850V vcore through it, wasnt a good idea after all ...LOL


Clear CMOS in BIOS first and try only a CPU overclock with no memory settings (leave at default) and other necessary adjustments. sometimes BIOS plays tricks ... or we just forget that one settings omitted somewhere which changes everything








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> That could be it, I only ever had a problem with one Yate fan, and it was a defective cap that popped as soon as it was powered up. I strongly suspect it was made by one of the subcontracted companies they license manufacturing out to, and those subcontracted YL's are definitely much lower in quality. From the motor itself being physically smaller, to the components on the pcb's being substandard. Petra's is the only one that I know of off hand that deals direct w/ YL, and always has the high quality manufactured directly by YL versions. I haven't really much used Scythe, aside from their 128 in 1 card reader that's in my old system (Now my son's computer. I have a Akasa Baymaster S reader/2.5" dock for an external monitor stand/surround sound amp/dock project I've got going on).
> Before I went custom water a few years back, I was all into high cfm/pressure Delta's, Pabst, & Mechatronics with my Megahalem's. Wind noise > bearing noise!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A few years of that got pretty old though. There's nothing like hearing your Delta MegaFast's running through a closed door, on the other end of the house while you're out in the garage! Lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I ran the MegaFast's both on the outside in p/p on a Silver Arrow later, with a gutted 140mm shrouding the middle. 4.4 Ghz stable on a 965 BE on air, but good god they were loud though!
> I've been thinking along the same lines for years about fail safe's. That's the thing with the Aquaero 5's, it's not just simply a fan/pump controller. It's an onboard cooling system stand alone micro computer that interfaces real time with the OS, and with the built in mobo/cpu/gpu/rpm/pwm sensors. Not to mention having it's own wide array of available sensors itself. From flow rate, to water temp, to direct contact thermistor sensors, and even water level sensors. The auto shutdown failsafe is just the cherry on top. Imo, it's the pinnacle when it comes to fan control, no question. Plus, if you're running a pwm controlled pump like I am, there is no need for any PowerAdust add-on's. Simply plug the PWM in, and the power from the pump comes direct from the psu while the Aquaero controls it. The optional heatsink at bare minimum is the only accessory absolutely necessary to purchase additional to the the Aquaero 5 LT or Pro models when running PWM pumps. With the XT, it already comes equipped. Long story short: Highly recommended.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @ VonDutch: I won't say for certain, because my experience is quite limited w/ Ivy, but that's exactly what happened to my 3750k before it started ctd'ing and later, bsod'ing. It jumped from 1.35 to 1.40 to boot at 4.4, then 1.43 Vcore all in the course of 48 hours. 0X50e error codes. Even at stock, it's doing the same. A dying IMC I'm pretty certain, being that my memtest runs (2x) and Prime 95 came out fine on my sons comp w/ the Sammie ELV "miracle" mem installed.
> Oh well, the new chip will be here tomorrow


ouch ... my former MB killed 2 chips that I used with, both in same manner degraded the core up to +0.1V within 2-3 weeks ... they were still stable at stock, but the stock VID went up to like 1.30V he he ... all higher clocks were degraded too ...

That is an interesting hardware thingy you mention, I will look it up, but for now I am trying to make my sensors work with something like AIDA64 or maybe SpeedFan or CoreFan or something ... I already have fan controllers and sensors plugged in where I need them and my water pump runs at constant 24V via a voltage controller ... all I need is a piece of software that could issue a command (e.g. "shutdown -s -t 01") when it detects lack of input on CPU FAN header ... still hoping to get it done this way.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Can one be gotten for cheap?


I use cheap Chinese multimeters by Centech from a local Harbor Freight Tools, they sell them at like $2-7 (depending on promotion) and those thingies are amazingly precise even the lowest ohm/volt settings. usual error is around 0.8 ohm (touch leads together and you will know):
http://www.harborfreight.com/7-function-digital-multimeter-92020.html
the cheapest ones have no screen backlite, the more expensive models do.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well good and bad news..I'll be getting a ton of 3770k's to bin and resell for free xD
> Lucky me huh?
> EDIT: ah the bad news...I suspect my g620 died a glorious death. gonna try changing bios settings via rog connect using a notebook though.


where from?







save one for me if it's any good








what happened to your G620? no boot now?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not so free...I gotta pay for them after I test them. But I can sell them for profit and thus bin for free.

EDIT: I'm so into benching that I'll sell my gtx 670 ftw and buy a custom loop and start saving for the next gen videocards and a decent monitor.








HD4000 will game alright at 1280x960 (current crt's res) till I get my loop going, meanwhile I can bench on older gpus like 8800/9800 vmodded cards lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I use cheap Chinese multimeters by Centech from a local Harbor Freight Tools, they sell them at like $2-7 (depending on promotion) and those thingies are amazingly precise even the lowest ohm/volt settings. usual error is around 0.8 ohm (touch leads together and you will know):
> http://www.harborfreight.com/7-function-digital-multimeter-92020.html
> the cheapest ones have no screen backlite, the more expensive models do.


$12 shipped on Amazon. Now that I can swing







.


----------



## ripsaw

Just looking at microcenter and i found this for anyone who needs the practice.....http://www.microcenter.com/search/search_results.aspx?N=4294966995+22&cat=%2410-and-less-%3a-Processors%2fCPUs-%3a-Computer-Parts-%3a-Micro-Center


----------



## Swag

Hey guys! The Corsair C70 Window mod is finally *DONE*!

Here are some pictures!


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys! The Corsair C70 Window mod is finally *DONE*!
> Here are some pictures!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Awesome! Looks Good!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys! The Corsair C70 Window mod is finally *DONE*!
> Here are some pictures!


That's a very nice looking case Swag. I'm a fan







.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys! The Corsair C70 Window mod is finally *DONE*!
> Here are some pictures!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome! Looks Good!
Click to expand...

Thanks! Took a while to finish. I found the best drill bit to be able to make the holes.







The 1/4 wood bore drill bit! But the dremel did a fantastic job cutting the acrylic and sanding it wasn't too hard.

Thanks puffin.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not so free...I gotta pay for them after I test them. But I can sell them for profit and thus bin for free.
> EDIT: I'm so into benching that I'll sell my gtx 670 ftw and buy a custom loop and start saving for the next gen videocards and a decent monitor.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HD4000 will game alright at 1280x960 (current crt's res) till I get my loop going, meanwhile I can bench on older gpus like 8800/9800 vmodded cards lol


I see







happy binning then!








he he, you selling the 670 FTW and building a loop now? nice, tough (I never know how to spell correctly this darn word hehe) decision, but for benching it will be a must








HD4000 is not bad, I liked it when testing it, at low res it was playing games just fine, maybe the eye candy had to be limited, but it was all right, good luck!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> $12 shipped on Amazon. Now that I can swing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


yeah, that's a good find, much better than driving from NY to NJ and paying tunnel/bridge tolls to get something cheap from NJ hehe... I believe they charge $12 nowadays for Lincoln Tunnel to NY ... not even mentioning the gas & traffic ... anyways, good luck!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Just looking at microcenter and i found this for anyone who needs the practice.....http://www.microcenter.com/search/search_results.aspx?N=4294966995+22&cat=%2410-and-less-%3a-Processors%2fCPUs-%3a-Computer-Parts-%3a-Micro-Center


that looks like awesome cheap source of victims for deliding practice hehe








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys! The Corsair C70 Window mod is finally *DONE*!
> Here are some pictures!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


very nicely done!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> I've been thinking along the same lines for years about fail safe's. That's the thing with the Aquaero 5's, it's not just simply a fan/pump controller. It's an onboard cooling system stand alone micro computer that interfaces real time with the OS, and with the built in mobo/cpu/gpu/rpm/pwm sensors. Not to mention having it's own wide array of available sensors itself. From flow rate, to water temp, to direct contact thermistor sensors, and even water level sensors. The auto shutdown failsafe is just the cherry on top. Imo, it's the pinnacle when it comes to fan control, no question. Plus, if you're running a pwm controlled pump like I am, there is no need for any PowerAdust add-on's. Simply plug the PWM in, and the power from the pump comes direct from the psu while the Aquaero controls it. The optional heatsink at bare minimum is the only accessory absolutely necessary to purchase additional to the the Aquaero 5 LT or Pro models when running PWM pumps. With the XT, it already comes equipped. Long story short: Highly recommended.


found it in AIDA64







... my software fail-safe right there!










it's quite simple in my case and the only prerequisite is having a water pump tacho wire (not all pumps have this) which needs to be connected to the MB fan header and seen by AIDA64








... then you can configure alerts like sending email out, shutting the system down, issuing a command, popping a display alert, etc. I tested it with CPU temp sensor and it works








other way is to tie a shutdown command with a CPU temperature sensor ... but that would be a PITA when benchmarking









... now off to configure some more alerts


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well good and bad news..I'll be getting a ton of 3770k's to bin and resell for free xD
> Lucky me huh?
> EDIT: ah the bad news...I suspect my g620 died a glorious death. gonna try changing bios settings via rog connect using a notebook though.


That G620.. Oh well you've got a supply of 3770k's to bench now so you should have fun








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> CLP is supposed to make it stick? I put CLP on the die and between the IHS and waterblock and neither stuck. When I unmounted my block there was no tension and when removing my CPU from the socket the IHS was clearly loose.
> Free 3770k's? That's awesome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


CLP is meant to be harder to remove then CLU, I was told that it'd get sligthly better temps but doing so would eventually make the contact removable.
I know that the CLU is easier to remove anyway and it makes sense to use it on the die for me anyway.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, that's a good find, much better than driving from NY to NJ and paying tunnel/bridge tolls to get something cheap from NJ hehe... I believe they charge $12 nowadays for Lincoln Tunnel to NY ... not even mentioning the gas & traffic ... anyways, good luck!


NYC rapes you on tolls these days it's disgusting. Thank god for EZ Pass so I don't have to feel bad at the moment I'm going through the toll....just at the end of the month







.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> That G620.. Oh well you've got a supply of 3770k's to bench now so you should have fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLP is meant to be harder to remove then CLU, I was told that it'd get sligthly better temps but doing so would eventually make the contact removable.
> I know that the CLU is easier to remove anyway and it makes sense to use it on the die for me anyway.


I know the CLP is harder to remove, I had to basically sand it off. However it didn't cause my IHS to become "soldered" to the cores unfortunately.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah those 990FXA-UD# Rev 1.0s were not fun to work with. My UD3 Rev 1.1 did decent with my FX-8150 and the two FX-8320's I tried but I sold it to a professional photographer/videographer and built Team America.


No doubt, Rev 1.0 UD's were terrible. I thought about RMA'ing mine, because it has a dead PCI. Dead from the factory even, but they didn't want to do an advanced RMA at all... I can't be w/o my main system for months, so that was a no go for me. My son has it now, and he's happy with it. For me though, it was a big disappointment coming from an Crosshair Formula IV.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well good and bad news..I'll be getting a ton of 3770k's to bin and resell for free xD
> Lucky me huh?
> EDIT: ah the bad news...I suspect my g620 died a glorious death. gonna try changing bios settings via rog connect using a notebook though.


Luuuuucky! Wanna trade a bnib 3570k?







J/k. Sorry about the g620, that always sucks losing one.







How hard were you pushing it?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ouch ... my former MB killed 2 chips that I used with, both in same manner degraded the core up to +0.1V within 2-3 weeks ... they were still stable at stock, but the stock VID went up to like 1.30V he he ... all higher clocks were degraded too ...
> That is an interesting hardware thingy you mention, I will look it up, but for now I am trying to make my sensors work with something like AIDA64 or maybe SpeedFan or CoreFan or something ... I already have fan controllers and sensors plugged in where I need them and my water pump runs at constant 24V via a voltage controller ... all I need is a piece of software that could issue a command (e.g. "shutdown -s -t 01") when it detects lack of input on CPU FAN header ... still hoping to get it done this way.


That exactly why I RMA'd the board too. I have no confirmation that the board did it (the chip never clocked well at all), but what happened to yours is a mirror image of mine. VID's at 1.31 at stock clocks after a full bios clear. Only thing I changed after that was running it in RAID config so I wouldn't lose my SRT array, and have to rebuild the cache files again. I tried booting at 4.5 just for s**t's and giggles earlier, and even w/ 1.6 V (I figured wth, the replacement will be here in the a.m.), & it's not having any of that. Not even at a 40 multi...









Oh and







The Aquaero's link with Speedfan/O.H.M./Aida 64, or any other software sensor monitor that you can enable shared memory space with, and write sensor values to WMI. Centech makes a very accurate & cheap digital caliper, but I prefer Fluke for my multimeter.









Before anyone asks: No, I don't have any ties to Aquacomputer, I just <3 the product.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I know the CLP is harder to remove, I had to basically sand it off. However it didn't cause my IHS to become "soldered" to the cores unfortunately.


Oh.. That's the impression that I was under. Oh well what's done is done now. I don't think I'll ever be removing the IHS from the CPU. If I do i won't be re-applying the IHS will just be going back on top.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> NYC rapes you on tolls these days it's disgusting. Thank god for EZ Pass so I don't have to feel bad at the moment I'm going through the toll....just at the end of the month
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I know bro, it's very sad to the point that we as family basically stopped traveling for pleasure with car across the NJ/NY border, it's just ridiculous how much money they want ... and parking in Manhattan efff that ... I once calculated that if I wanted to travel with my car daily to work in NYC (I take a NJTransit bus daily at $140 a month and then walk to work 15 minutes away from Port Authority) I'd need a second job LOL! it would cost around more monthly (gas + tolls + parking in the city) than I pay monthly for apartment rental in northern NJ (that ain't cheap either). it just sucks what they do...

the last cheap bridge to NY is I think Tappan Zee to White Plains area, it still costs like $5 ... but that's quite far away from where all the fun takes place








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> That exactly why I RMA'd the board too. I have no confirmation that the board did it (the chip never clocked well at all), but what happened to yours is a mirror image of mine. VID's at 1.31 at stock clocks after a full bios clear. Only thing I changed after that was running it in RAID config so I wouldn't lose my SRT array, and have to rebuild the cache files again. I tried booting at 4.5 just for s**t's and giggles earlier, and even w/ 1.6 V (I figured wth, the replacement will be here in the a.m.), & it's not having any of that. Not even at a 40 multi...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh and
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Aquaero's link with Speedfan/O.H.M./Aida 64, or any other software sensor monitor that you can enable shared memory space with, and write sensor values to WMI. Centech makes a very accurate & cheap digital caliper, but I prefer Fluke for my multimeter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before anyone asks: No, I don't have any ties to Aquacomputer, I just <3 the product.


did your board have LOTES CPU socket? mine did and it was faulty like hell (it wasn't even either, cooling block was making poor contact with IHS because of it), it was EVGA z77 FTW board, a big disappointment and utter failure at premium price ... sent it back to manufacturer for a full refund and went with long hated ASUS ... now I love ASUS again LOL! can't say a bad word about my beloved MVE, it even carries the same color theme as z77 ftw did


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> NYC rapes you on tolls these days it's disgusting. Thank god for EZ Pass so I don't have to feel bad at the moment I'm going through the toll....just at the end of the month
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> I know bro, it's very sad to the point that we as family basically stopped traveling for pleasure with car across the NJ/NY border, it's just ridiculous how much money they want ... and parking in Manhattan efff that ... I once calculated that if I wanted to travel with my car daily to work in NYC (I take a NJTransit bus daily at $140 a month and then walk to work 15 minutes away from Port Authority) I'd need a second job LOL! it would cost around more monthly (gas + tolls + parking in the city) than I pay monthly for apartment rental in northern NJ (that ain't cheap either). it just sucks what they do...
> 
> the last cheap bridge to NY is I think Tappan Zee to White Plains area, it still costs like $5 ... but that's quite far away from where all the fun takes place
Click to expand...

I grew up in White Plains and venture there often...its no NYC but it has its perks







. You're right though the Tappan Zee is the only reasonable bridge and Im sure that will go up soon too with the renovations.


----------



## VonDutch

The Delid Crew is like a little virus,
almost every post i see about (high) temps,
someone of the crew jumps in, saying delid is the way to go ...lol
















big thanks to everyone helping me with the 5.2ghz oc, and the vcore difference i noticed yesterday,
not gonna quote everyone, but i read all replies..thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Damn largest top cover case labs does is 85mm....

I want to put 2x Nexxos Monsta 86mm 480 rads up there...

And 86mm +25mm for a fan is 111mm.. i asked Jim if he could do a custom 115mm top cover for me..

I want it so only the fans are inside the case..

Also for future i could do.. 25mm fan --> 86mm 480 rad inside and above 86mm rad --> 25 mm fan since the fpi is like 8 on these rads even 172mm of rad 2 fans in push/pull should be enough


----------



## King4x4

OH YAAAAAAAAAAAAAH



Rock stable on 1.54v!


----------



## Swag

Anyone wanna help me create a list of what I need for water cooling?

1. CPU Only
2. 2 240 rads

I listed those out because I also want to know how many compression fittings I need too.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone wanna help me create a list of what I need for water cooling?
> 1. CPU Only
> 2. 2 240 rads
> I listed those out because I also want to know how many compression fittings I need too.


2 per component

CPU
Rad (2)
Pump
Res

So far, you would need 10

Btw if you give us a budget it would help ...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone wanna help me create a list of what I need for water cooling?
> 1. CPU Only
> 2. 2 240 rads
> I listed those out because I also want to know how many compression fittings I need too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2 per component
> 
> CPU
> Rad (2)
> Pump
> Res
> 
> So far, you would need 10
> 
> Btw if you give us a budget it would help ...
Click to expand...

I was thinking about $350 or something like that. Depending on how good it is, I may go up; and if it's better to go that way, cheaper.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> OH YAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
> 
> Rock stable on 1.54v!


Very nice King4x4








is that prime etc stable or ?
you want to run it 24/7?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was thinking about $350 or something like that. Depending on how good it is, I may go up; and if it's better to go that way, cheaper.


Are you comfortable with buying used parts?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was thinking about $350 or something like that. Depending on how good it is, I may go up; and if it's better to go that way, cheaper.
> 
> 
> 
> Are you comfortable with buying used parts?
Click to expand...

So long they are at tip-top shape and aren't damage at all.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So long they are at tip-top shape and aren't damage at all.


How much room u got?

Id suggest the Apongee kit i got with a res + the Monsta Nexxos 86mm 240 rad...

Or if u want to go cheap get the XPCS RX Kit..

Buy fittings used there really expensive... all of mine are used i think besides 4 of them.. i had to buy the 90s 18$ each =/


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So long they are at tip-top shape and aren't damage at all.


PM me if you want, or start a new thread. I'd be happy to help tomorrow


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So long they are at tip-top shape and aren't damage at all.
> 
> 
> 
> How much room u got?
> 
> Id suggest the Apongee kit i got with a res + the Monsta Nexxos 86mm 240 rad...
> 
> Or if u want to go cheap get the XPCS RX Kit..
> 
> Buy fittings used there really expensive... all of mine are used i think besides 4 of them.. i had to buy the 90s 18$ each =/
Click to expand...

I will look at the Apogee kit. I will be using my Corsair C70 case for it so room for 2 240 rads.







What I don't like about the XSPC is that it has a res/pump that goes in the drive bay. I like those tube type ones better and I really don't want to ruin the look of the C70 with a modern looking thing (the box res/pump) in an ammo can!


----------



## Hokies83

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/swapdriiwipu.html high end pump + high end block 136$ cant beat it..

+

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16236/ex-rad-410/Alphacool_NexXxoS_Monsta_Dual_120mm_Radiator_-_80mm_Thick.html?tl=g30c95s160 94$
Most normal rads are 34mm thick why not get an all copper 86mm thick in one? that is not much more money then a 34mm that is built aswell as it is.
+

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/biwataz150po.html 36$

+

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/bi1cofifor3o.html x6 48$

314$ done.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Throw in some duralene tubing and you're good to go


----------



## Hokies83

If u wanna go cheap...
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/xsra750rxwak.html

lessor pump lessor block lessor rad and thin hoses and barbs and not compression fittings..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/swapdriiwipu.html high end pump + high end block 136$ cant beat it..
> 
> +
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16236/ex-rad-410/Alphacool_NexXxoS_Monsta_Dual_120mm_Radiator_-_80mm_Thick.html?tl=g30c95s160 94$
> Most normal rads are 34mm thick why not get an all copper 86mm thick in one? that is not much more money then a 34mm that is built aswell as it is.
> +
> 
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/biwataz150po.html 36$
> 
> +
> 
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/bi1cofifor3o.html x6 48$
> 
> 314$ done.


How does the block compare to the RASA or Raystorm? Would it be better to buy a RX240 kit and just change the pump/res into one of those pump/res tube combos?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Throw in some duralene tubing and you're good to go


I actually jumped the gun and bought some Tygon tubing at a local store.







This is meant for a long-term goal and I don't want to rush it. Rushing it may end up in empty pockets and living off instant noodles (I already do, my favorite dinner)!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How does the block compare to the RASA or Raystorm? Would it be better to buy a RX240 kit and just change the pump/res into one of those pump/res tube combos?
> I actually jumped the gun and bought some Tygon tubing at a local store.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is meant for a long-term goal and I don't want to rush it. Rushing it may end up in empty pockets and living off instant noodles (I already do, my favorite dinner)!


Duralene is the best tubing you can buy


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How does the block compare to the RASA or Raystorm? Would it be better to buy a RX240 kit and just change the pump/res into one of those pump/res tube combos?
> I actually jumped the gun and bought some Tygon tubing at a local store.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is meant for a long-term goal and I don't want to rush it. Rushing it may end up in empty pockets and living off instant noodles (I already do, my favorite dinner)!
> 
> 
> 
> Duralene is the best tubing you can buy
Click to expand...

I still have the receipt, if that's true, I will return the Tygon.









It's either what *Hokies83* recommended or this:


Which one would be the better route? I have some cash from the holidays and I plan to get a job soon. Part-time that is, school first!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How does the block compare to the RASA or Raystorm? Would it be better to buy a RX240 kit and just change the pump/res into one of those pump/res tube combos?
> I actually jumped the gun and bought some Tygon tubing at a local store.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is meant for a long-term goal and I don't want to rush it. Rushing it may end up in empty pockets and living off instant noodles (I already do, my favorite dinner)!


Apongee drive II is Top of the line block... The very best swiftech makes better then the budget Raystorm stuff by afew C id say... The MCP 35X pump is amoung the very best pumps u can get,,

Also with The pump/block being in one it saves u having to buy 2 fittings.. so saves you 16$

It all depends do u want the best and get better results and have a pump/block that u can build are large loop from in the future.. Or do u just want a good enough loop that really cannot have much added to it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I still have the receipt, if that's true, I will return the Tygon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's either what *Hokies83* recommended or this:
> 
> Which one would be the better route? I have some cash from the holidays and I plan to get a job soon. Part-time that is, school first!


for 50$ more i bet mine will win by 5 c with a cpu and gpu in the loop vs that kit with just a cpu.

And you can add more rads MCP 35X is enough to push 2 480 rads...

Im already pushing 2 240 rads im getting ready to add 2 more 480 rads to it...
so 2 240s + 2 480s all from the 136$ Apongee drive 2 with 1/2id 3/4 OD tubing..

Ray storm kit comes with cheapo thin tubing..

Like i said it depends on what u want.. is this 240rad all your ever gonna do??? or do u want to add gpus to the loop add more rads to it?

if so the Raystorm is not for you.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I still have the receipt, if that's true, I will return the Tygon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's either what *Hokies83* recommended or this:
> 
> Which one would be the better route? I have some cash from the holidays and I plan to get a job soon. Part-time that is, school first!
> 
> 
> 
> for 50$ more i bet mine will win by 5 c with a cpu and gpu in the loop vs that kit with just a cpu.
> 
> And you can add more rads MCP 35X is enough to push 2 480 rads...
Click to expand...

Hmm, really? The max I'll be doing will probably be just 2 240 rads. That seems interesting. I will see how much it all costs.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> for 50$ more i bet mine will win by 5 c with a cpu and gpu in the loop vs that kit with just a cpu.
> And you can add more rads MCP 35X is enough to push 2 480 rads...


oh god. I'm getting a 655 to push through a 240 + 120


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hmm, really? The max I'll be doing will probably be just 2 240 rads. That seems interesting. I will see how much it all costs.


Get the thickest 240s u can fit measure how much room u have make sure to count 25mm for fans as well.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Get the thickest 240s u can fit measure how much room u have make sure to count 25mm for fans as well.


86mm Monsta Dual 120 rads with 2x25mm fans .... 136mm thick. Oh god


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> 86mm Monsta Dual 120 rads with 2x25mm fans .... 136mm thick. Oh god


LoL yeah but that 86 mm 240 rad = a 34mm 480 rad


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> 86mm Monsta Dual 120 rads with 2x25mm fans .... 136mm thick. Oh god
> 
> 
> 
> LoL yeah but that 86 mm 240 rad = a 34mm 480 rad
Click to expand...

I'd love to have 2 rads for my case because it'll look better. One on the top and one on the bottom. What do you guys think?


----------



## I_shot

Exactly . That's what i'm going to do


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'd love to have 2 rads for my case because it'll look better. One on the top and one on the bottom. What do you guys think?


Yeah ... I don't think a Monsta rad will be aesthetically pleasing in a 600T. That's just me though


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'd love to have 2 rads for my case because it'll look better. One on the top and one on the bottom. What do you guys think?
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah ... I don't think a Monsta rad will be aesthetically pleasing in a 600T. That's just me though
Click to expand...

I'm moving my entire build and will do the water cooling inside a Corsair C70.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I say be a man and get 4profit 38mm thick fans, san ace 2011 or pwm nidecs...undervolted/with pwm control tthey are quiet and still have way better airflow/pressure vs two 25mm ones.

I think the drive II with 35xour pump is great, gonna have to get that, I didn't think about the 2chips fittings saved!

Can't you use a res top to save two mmore fittings? Lol


----------



## Swag

How does this look? The Apogee Drive II as the pump/block. The top rad is a slimmer rad. The bottom rad is one of those 80mm rads. The dark red thing is the tube res. The slim red things are tubing.







Bad drawing but whatever!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I say be a man and get 4profit 38mm thick fans, san ace 2011 or pwm nidecs...undervolted/with pwm control tthey are quiet and still have way better airflow/pressure vs two 25mm ones.
> I think the drive II with 35xour pump is great, gonna have to get that, I didn't think about the 2chips fittings saved!
> Can't you use a res top to save two mmore fittings? Lol


With the rads of today 86mm those leaf blower fans almost make no difference 1-2 c maybe? and for un godly noise not worth it at all.. id rather add a 120mm rad to a loop and make up that 1-2 c difference and remain silent...

the days of needing leaf blowers for fans are over

i tested this myself with my San aces vs my 74 cfm 15dba fans... the difference 1c...

Next day i listed the San aces and sold them.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys! The Corsair C70 Window mod is finally *DONE*!
> Here are some pictures!


Nice work Swag!

I'm gonna pull the radiator from my Toyota Tundra, put two 27 inch fans in push/pull on it, and hook it up to my PC.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys! The Corsair C70 Window mod is finally *DONE*!
> Here are some pictures!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Pictures
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice work Swag!
> 
> I'm gonna pull the radiator from my Toyota Tundra, put two 27 inch fans in push/pull on it, and hook it up to my PC.
Click to expand...

That radiator bit is quite funny. Would be interesting if someone actually does it.









Thanks for the support. After spending $50 on acrylic sheets and so much more on tools, it's nice to have compliments. I did everything with my trusty dremel and used a belt sander to get the perfect edges.







A normal metal cutting wheel was the only thing I needed after all!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> With the rads of today 86mm those leaf blower fans almost make no difference 1-2 c maybe? and for un godly noise not worth it at all.. id rather add a 120mm rad to a loop and make up that 1-2 c difference and remain silent...
> the days of needing leaf blowers for fans are over
> i tested this myself with my San aces vs my 74 cfm 15dba fans... the difference 1c...
> Next day i listed the San aces and sold them.


Really? Using thhe monsta?
I like big arse fans so I'm going with a black ice gttx 360 and 240a myself...

What do you think about the res top thing? Is a separate res better? Waa save in fiittings lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Nice work Swag!
> I'm gonna pull the radiator from my Toyota Tundra, put two 27 inch fans in push/pull on it, and hook it up to my PC.


Awesome! There's a guide on modding ar rads, i can link it later...gonna go to bed now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That radiator bit is quite funny. Would be interesting if someone actually does it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the support. After spending $50 on acrylic sheets and so much more on tools, it's nice to have compliments. I did everything with my trusty dremel and used a belt sander to get the perfect edges.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A normal metal cutting wheel was the only thing I needed after all!


Swag, your build is cming along just fine...what about the d14? Gonna sell it?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> With the rads of today 86mm those leaf blower fans almost make no difference 1-2 c maybe? and for un godly noise not worth it at all.. id rather add a 120mm rad to a loop and make up that 1-2 c difference and remain silent...
> the days of needing leaf blowers for fans are over
> i tested this myself with my San aces vs my 74 cfm 15dba fans... the difference 1c...
> Next day i listed the San aces and sold them.


Really? Using thhe monsta?
I like big arse fans so I'm going with a black ice gttx 360 and 240a myself...

What do you think about the res top thing? Is a separate res better? Waa save in fiittings lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Nice work Swag!
> I'm gonna pull the radiator from my Toyota Tundra, put two 27 inch fans in push/pull on it, and hook it up to my PC.


Awesome! There's a guide on modding ar rads, i can link it later...gonna go to bed now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That radiator bit is quite funny. Would be interesting if someone actually does it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the support. After spending $50 on acrylic sheets and so much more on tools, it's nice to have compliments. I did everything with my trusty dremel and used a belt sander to get the perfect edges.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A normal metal cutting wheel was the only thing I needed after all!


Swag, your build is cming along just fine...what about the d14? Gonna sell it?


----------



## VonDutch

Cool Computer Cooling with Car Radiator Extreme




crazy


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That radiator bit is quite funny. Would be interesting if someone actually does it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the support. After spending $50 on acrylic sheets and so much more on tools, it's nice to have compliments. I did everything with my trusty dremel and used a belt sander to get the perfect edges.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A normal metal cutting wheel was the only thing I needed after all!
> 
> 
> 
> Swag, your build is cming along just fine...what about the d14? Gonna sell it?
Click to expand...

Once I finish my water cooling part I will. But I will take time with this water cooling. Car insurance first. I also want to buy 2 new GPUs. I think my 5770 has done its job and it's time to have another GPU to last me 4 years!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Really? Using thhe monsta?
> I like big arse fans so I'm going with a black ice gttx 360 and 240a myself...
> What do you think about the res top thing? Is a separate res better? Waa save in fiittings lol
> Awesome! There's a guide on modding ar rads, i can link it later...gonna go to bed now.
> Swag, your build is cming along just fine...what about the d14? Gonna sell it?


I think my monster 86mm with the 15 dba fans will render better temps.

Those dense rads are a thing of the past shocking that they still even sell rads like that anymore.


----------



## Swag

@*Valgaur*

I hate you!







My delid guide is dying! No one has posted in it for 4 weeks. It's like in page 20 on the Intel CPU page! Hahaha, great job in this club though. Making it into a success!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> did your board have LOTES CPU socket? mine did and it was faulty like hell (it wasn't even either, cooling block was making poor contact with IHS because of it), it was EVGA z77 FTW board, a big disappointment and utter failure at premium price ... sent it back to manufacturer for a full refund and went with long hated ASUS ... now I love ASUS again LOL! can't say a bad word about my beloved MVE, it even carries the same color theme as z77 ftw did


Good question, I really didn't bother to look to see who the socket manufacturer was. I'll get back to ya when I pull it apart. Whenever UPS decides to finally deliver them, that is...

Checked the tracking right before my last post late last night, and it showed scheduled for early morning delivery. Nothing by 10:30 a.m., so I checked again and now it says "by the end of the day", but it's been on the truck for delivery since 5:58 a.m. -_- I even took the day off. Freaking UPS wasting my time... *grumbles*









Edit: 100 posts! Yay?!?


----------



## MunneY

Hey guys, I have a question.

I had decided i wanted to de-lid my 3770k, but now its looking like instead of having a second system I'm gonna need to sell it and invest the money in some other stuff (youtube equipment).
My question is... should I go ahead and delid it and get the good OC outta it.... or should I sell it without doing it. My concern is the warranty and all to the new buyer


----------



## Leyaena

Came back from my holiday...
1406 new posts to read through









*ohgodwhy*


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn largest top cover case labs does is 85mm....
> I want to put 2x Nexxos Monsta 86mm 480 rads up there...
> And 86mm +25mm for a fan is 111mm.. i asked Jim if he could do a custom 115mm top cover for me..
> @ Swag: Nice job on the window mate. Rain's keeping me away from doing mine, and the aluminum front fascia atm. Going to do dual windows in the Prodigy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want it so only the fans are inside the case..
> Also for future i could do.. 25mm fan --> 86mm 480 rad inside and above 86mm rad --> 25 mm fan since the fpi is like 8 on these rads even 172mm of rad 2 fans in push/pull should be enough


Really? Fin density is that low (relatively speaking) on the Monsta's? UT-60's are 9.6 FPI by way of comparison. Good luck w/ the custom sized top cover, let us know what they say.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> OH YAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
> 
> Rock stable on 1.54v!


Grats!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone wanna help me create a list of what I need for water cooling?
> 1. CPU Only
> 2. 2 240 rads
> I listed those out because I also want to know how many compression fittings I need too.


The review linked on Swiftech's product page shows a -1° Δ from the Apogee HD to the Apogee Drive II (advantage: AD II). With the Koolance CPU-380 (best performing standalone block) being an average of .7° better temps than the Apogee HD, the AD II should pull off the win for the best block overall.

Plus, what everyone said about less parts and overall costs, is dead on accurate. Those are the exact reasons I'm using an AD II as well. Well, also for the tiny overall footprint, which is pretty convenient in a Prodigy.









If you're planning on a reservoir, a total of 8 fittings is the minimum. Using angled rotaries, that can double or triple depending on your routing needs. In other words, prices can skyrocket quickly if you use more than just compressions.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Came back from my holiday...
> 1406 new posts to read through
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *ohgodwhy*


hey "neighbour", how goes it, had a nice holiday?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Came back from my holiday...
> 1406 new posts to read through
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *ohgodwhy*
> 
> 
> 
> hey "neighbour", how goes it, had a nice holiday?
Click to expand...

I had, thanks, Indonesia is a wonderful country, had a damn good time when I was there








Know it's probably horribly cliché, but I got some pretty bad sunburn there, though, haven't been able to properly stand on my legs for the last 4 or so days









A bit more on topic then, while I was away 2 of my friends decided they wanted to delid their chips as well, though one of them really doesn't want to do it himself, guess I'll have to go over there and coax him into it/help him out over the weekend


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Yay! The replacement 3570k & mobo just arrived.







Too bad I'm in the middle of a flush on my boy's system, it'll have to wait until I'm done with that.

Quick question for you guys: I have both MasterKleer in UV/clear & UV/black. Which one would you guys choose in this?



I'm thinking the black, but I'd like second opinions if you please.

@ Leyaena: Wecome back! Hope you had a wonderful holiday


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Legonut*
> 
> Add me!
> Legonut
> 3770k
> AS5
> AS5
> 200
> 4.7Ghz
> 10C
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2612302


Your IN and welcome!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> OH YAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rock stable on 1.54v!


Nicely done sir
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @*Valgaur*
> I hate you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My delid guide is dying! No one has posted in it for 4 weeks. It's like in page 20 on the Intel CPU page! Hahaha, great job in this club though. Making it into a success!


I linked your guide right into this place lol. I kinda wanted to make this place a hub for people to ask then link them where to go on the main page in the early times of this club but then it just took off.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MunneY*
> 
> Hey guys, I have a question.
> I had decided i wanted to de-lid my 3770k, but now its looking like instead of having a second system I'm gonna need to sell it and invest the money in some other stuff (youtube equipment).
> My question is... should I go ahead and delid it and get the good OC outta it.... or should I sell it without doing it. My concern is the warranty and all to the new buyer


don't delid it for the customer just in case they break it OCing or anything. gotta be careful about that man. so stay on the safe side.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Came back from my holiday...
> 1406 new posts to read through
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *ohgodwhy*


Yeah......... and I have something to say at the end of my post about this as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Yay! The replacement 3570k & mobo just arrived.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too bad I'm in the middle of a flush on my boy's system, it'll have to wait until I'm done with that.
> Quick question for you guys: I have both MasterKleer in UV/clear & UV/black. Which one would you guys choose in this?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm thinking the black, but I'd like second opinions if you please.
> @ Leyaena: Wecome back! Hope you had a wonderful holiday


Black tubing.

Okay guys Congrats on the 700 Page mark!







But we seriously need to stop going way off topic here, I know it happens fast with all the super active members I just want us to stay with the officialness of your sig. We can't have people come in and see that we are talking about WC loops so much. I understand that we can talk about many thing off topic but 6 pages worth is kind of ridiculous! Not mad at anyone just scared about how fast off topic we get. So I would like to try and see us keep the







chat to between a page and 2 pages. tell me what you guys think of this, and we can sort it out as a group.

Valgaur


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I think my monster 86mm with the 15 dba fans will render better temps.
> Those dense rads are a thing of the past shocking that they still even sell rads like that anymore.


We'll have to see...I suspect the black ice gtx will be better in the same size category (240 vs 240). It will perform much better with each extra cfm it gets, from what I gather.
I like the build quality, looks and price and need to justify having 220cfm fans man! It would suck if I got the same performance doing 100cfm vs 220cfm with a rad. lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Yay! The replacement 3570k & mobo just arrived.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too bad I'm in the middle of a flush on my boy's system, it'll have to wait until I'm done with that.
> Quick question for you guys: I have both MasterKleer in UV/clear & UV/black. Which one would you guys choose in this?
> 
> I'm thinking the black, but I'd like second opinions if you please.
> @ Leyaena: Wecome back! Hope you had a wonderful holiday


Black UV!


----------



## MunneY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your IN and welcome!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nicely done sir
> I linked your guide right into this place lol. I kinda wanted to make this place a hub for people to ask then link them where to go on the main page in the early times of this club but then it just took off.
> don't delid it for the customer just in case they break it OCing or anything. gotta be careful about that man. so stay on the safe side.
> Yeah......... and I have something to say at the end of my post about this as well.
> Black tubing.
> Okay guys Congrats on the 700 Page mark!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But we seriously need to stop going way off topic here, I know it happens fast with all the super active members I just want us to stay with the officialness of your sig. We can't have people come in and see that we are talking about WC loops so much. I understand that we can talk about many thing off topic but 6 pages worth is kind of ridiculous! Not mad at anyone just scared about how fast off topic we get. So I would like to try and see us keep the
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> chat to between a page and 2 pages. tell me what you guys think of this, and we can sort it out as a group.
> Valgaur


Yea man... I was gonna do it... but to be honest, I need the money and prolly should just jump on getting it sold and prepare for an 8970-8990. I really wanted this system, but It's for the best ya know!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> We'll have to see...I suspect the black ice gtx will be better in the same size category (240 vs 240). It will perform much better with each extra cfm it gets, from what I gather.
> I like the build quality, looks and price and need to justify having 220cfm fans man! It would suck if I got the same performance doing 100cfm vs 220cfm with a rad. lol
> Black UV!


Black looks amazing


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> We'll have to see...I suspect the black ice gtx will be better in the same size category (240 vs 240). It will perform much better with each extra cfm it gets, from what I gather.
> I like the build quality, looks and price and need to justify having 220cfm fans man! It would suck if I got the same performance doing 100cfm vs 220cfm with a rad. lol
> Black UV!


Black ice will lose 240 vs 240 you do realize 86mm? more rad bbigger chambers etc..

You do not need Dense rads with 200cfm fans anymore. There a thing of the past... New designs out perform them... Most notably the Nexxos Monsta rads.

You can get same results with 74cfm fans.

I tested it myself.. You can only be so far from Delta no matter if the fan is 10cfm or 100000000000000 CFM.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Very nice King4x4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that prime etc stable or ?
> you want to run it 24/7?


Ran it on prime. Stable.

Super Pi. Stable (Getting a sweet 7seconds)

Cinebench. Stable. (It's my dirty bench... if it's stable on a fast run then I can run any benchy fast)

However, On Bonic I get a crash... Strange no?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay guys Congrats on the 700 Page mark!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But we seriously need to stop going way off topic here, I know it happens fast with all the super active members I just want us to stay with the officialness of your sig. We can't have people come in and see that we are talking about WC loops so much. I understand that we can talk about many thing off topic but 6 pages worth is kind of ridiculous! Not mad at anyone just scared about how fast off topic we get. So I would like to try and see us keep the
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> chat to between a page and 2 pages. tell me what you guys think of this, and we can sort it out as a group.
> Valgaur


Booo! I feel like all the delidded stuff is on the front page and if they have any questions then just ask and we get back on topic. I kind of like the chats we all have with each other about off topic stuff.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay guys Congrats on the 700 Page mark!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But we seriously need to stop going way off topic here, I know it happens fast with all the super active members I just want us to stay with the officialness of your sig. We can't have people come in and see that we are talking about WC loops so much. I understand that we can talk about many thing off topic but 6 pages worth is kind of ridiculous! Not mad at anyone just scared about how fast off topic we get. So I would like to try and see us keep the
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> chat to between a page and 2 pages. tell me what you guys think of this, and we can sort it out as a group.
> Valgaur


My bad, I've been contributing to a lot of the OT lately. Sorry about that







Maybe we can start a Delidded Not Quite on Topic thread


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Booo! I feel like all the delidded stuff is on the front page and if they have any questions then just ask and we get back on topic. I kind of like the chats we all have with each other about off topic stuff.


I have to agree that I like the "club" nature of this club. It's like delidding is what got us in the club but we don't have to only talk about delidding when we "meet" up. I think most of us who are regular posters have just grown to trust each other's opinions so we dont' feel the desire to go ask or discuss elsewhere. I will however defer to your instruction Valgaur, after all you created this kick ass hang out spot







.

Maybe we need to create a Delidded Crewmen's hangout thread







.


----------



## fskidd

OCN name: fskidd
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: 300 Mhz
OC after delid: 5000 Mhz
Temp drops: 30C +
CPU-Z validation of max OC: 

Still some head room for higher clock as the highest temp is only 75C. I am already very happy to achieve 5000 Mhz.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fskidd*
> 
> OCN name: fskidd
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 300 Mhz
> OC after delid: 5000 Mhz
> Temp drops: 30C +
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> Still some head room for higher clock as the highest temp is only 75C. I am already very happy to achieve 5000 Mhz.


Nice temps for that Vcore. What your ambient temp?


----------



## fskidd

20 degree of ambient temp.


----------



## martinhal

That explains it. Im max 80 at 29 ambient. Cant wait for winter


----------



## ivanlabrie

Very nice still Martinhal...far from tjmax and doing 5ghz









Grats on that delid fskidd!









@Hokies, thing is I doubt I can fit the Monsta rad and 38mm thick fans on the top of my case, perhaps I can get a second 240 for the bottom of the case and use the Monsta and two Gently Typhoons ap29 with pwm mod. Thanks for the suggestion though







That rig of yours is so baws xD

@Swag: any new updates man?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Booo! I feel like all the delidded stuff is on the front page and if they have any questions then just ask and we get back on topic. I kind of like the chats we all have with each other about off topic stuff.


I suppose. As long as everything deals in total with all the OT stuff I can continue to accept it. But I want your guy's opinions. so keep em comin! Thanks for the input you two.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fskidd*
> 
> OCN name: fskidd
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 300 Mhz
> OC after delid: 5000 Mhz
> Temp drops: 30C +
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> Still some head room for higher clock as the highest temp is only 75C. I am already very happy to achieve 5000 Mhz.


Your in the list but I need your CPUZ for that 5Ghz validation.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Very nice still Martinhal...far from tjmax and doing 5ghz


Thanks that's at 5.1


----------



## fskidd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I suppose. As long as everything deals in total with all the OT stuff I can continue to accept it. But I want your guy's opinions. so keep em comin! Thanks for the input you two.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your in the list but I need your CPUZ for that 5Ghz validation.


Here is the validation link http://valid.canardpc.com/2638928


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Thanks that's at 5.1


then stop complaning man! lol
I'm at 2.6ghz, and using a dual SB chip...I'll see if I can flash my bios again tomorrow, cause I think my flashdrive died cause my board doesn't post yet.


----------



## stickg1

In the month I've been hanging out here I never applied for membership...

OCN name: stickg1
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: CLLP
ihs-TIM: Antec Formula 7
Mhz gained: 400MHz
OC after delid: 4700MHz
Temp drops: 15C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2638945

BEFORE:


AFTER:




Sorry for the 4.3GHz reference testing, I never read that part of the OP and obviously its too late to test 4.5GHz temps on my chip pre-delidding

Also I can safely overclock to 4.7GHz now but I just run 4.5GHz for a daily because voltage is much lower and temps are nice. Also I think my temp difference is more like 20C, that first time I tested I did a crap job on the IHS TIM. I will retest later..


----------



## Faelore

So I am grabbing my air cooler net week with my MB just wondering one thing I am gonna get the noctua nh-d14 because honestly the price to performance is pretty nice I can pick it up for like $70 instead of $110 for an extra 3°. I am gonna go closed loop eventually but the noctua will hold me over till then. Anyway to my question, is the strain of the nh-d14 too much for a delid'ed chip any suggestions by anyone with this setup? and though I am looking at the g1 sniper I am open to other suggestions on mobos, I have heard alot of negatives about the sniper.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd get the Silver Arrow if I were you...or the Phanteks over the D14, except maybe the se2011 version with pwm fans.

As for the board, try your luck with the g1 sniper if you plan on going multi gpu, otherwise you can stick to other cheaper alternatives.
What are your goals and budget?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd get the Silver Arrow if I were you...or the Phanteks over the D14, except maybe the se2011 version with pwm fans.
> 
> As for the board, try your luck with the g1 sniper if you plan on going multi gpu, otherwise you can stick to other cheaper alternatives.
> What are your goals and budget?


Or just wait for amazing sales.







I picked up a NH-D14 SE2011 for only $50. Just paid for a new mounting kit from a fellow OCNer for $5 and good to go!


----------



## Swag

@*Valgaur*

I haven't seen a thread be closed or official status taken away just because it has been off-topic. I heard that the only way a thread will be closed or something like that will happen if the entire thread is just a troll thread and does nothing but troll.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey, and what about that loop of yours? What you gonna do with the D14?









I'm a sell my Silver Arrow locally for 225usd lol


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey, and what about that loop of yours? What you gonna do with the D14?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a sell my Silver Arrow locally for 225usd lol


225 USD ??


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey, and what about that loop of yours? What you gonna do with the D14?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a sell my Silver Arrow locally for 225usd lol
> 
> 
> 
> 225 USD ??
Click to expand...

I'd imagine, it's Argentina after all.







Hard and expensive to import things.

I will be using the NH-D14 for the time being until I save up enough for my water loop. After that, I will save up for my GPUs.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> 225 USD ??


Hell yeah man, do you know how expensive imported products are in Argentina/Brazil? It's crazy. I got a friend in Brazil that I might stay with if I can make it to the World Cup that told me to not bring clothes and just bring two laptops and a couple of smartphones (to sell) and I will have enough money to buy a whole new wardrobe, stay in the nicest hotels for a month and eat/drink like a king everyday, and pay for my plane ride back and probably still come home with money in my pocket.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hell yeah man, do you know how expensive imported products are in Argentina/Brazil? It's crazy. I got a friend in Brazil that I might stay with if I can make it to the World Cup that told me to not bring clothes and just bring two laptops and a couple of smartphones and I will have enough money to buy a whole new wardrobe, stay in the nicest hotels for a month and eat like a king everyday...


QFT!!!









(







)

Tech stuff pricing is outrageous down south...

BTW, I payed like 25usd for my SA (it was budled with some other stuff) lmao


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> QFT!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> Tech stuff pricing is outrageous down south...
> 
> BTW, I payed like 25usd for my SA (it was budled with some other stuff) lmao


It sounds like you still get yourself some stuff privately through individuals and not retailers without issue. But if I do come down and you can make it to Sao Paulo I'll bring you some gear if you want!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sao Paulo is SO far from here...I was in Brazil only once and only to the south, and the car trip took a couple of days. Almost a week or so. (I did stop to gamble at a casino and sleep at some hostels though)









Thanks for the offer though!
I already have a friend in Texas who helps me out with that stuff...only downside is paying a 50% import tax from time to time with bigger boxes.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hell yeah man, do you know how expensive imported products are in Argentina/Brazil? It's crazy. I got a friend in Brazil that I might stay with if I can make it to the World Cup that told me to not bring clothes and just bring two laptops and a couple of smartphones and I will have enough money to buy a whole new wardrobe, stay in the nicest hotels for a month and eat like a king everyday...
> 
> 
> 
> QFT!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Tech stuff pricing is outrageous down south...
> 
> BTW, I payed like 25usd for my SA (it was budled with some other stuff) lmao
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> QFT!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> Tech stuff pricing is outrageous down south...
> 
> BTW, I payed like 25usd for my SA (it was budled with some other stuff) lmao
> 
> 
> 
> It sounds like you still get yourself some stuff privately through individuals and not retailers without issue. But if I do come down and you can make it to Sao Paulo I'll bring you some gear if you want!
Click to expand...

Haha, I go down there every other year. I bring some stuff for a couple of my friends and they just give me some cash.







Nice place to visit though but it's too different from home!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sao Paulo is SO far from here...I was in Brazil only once and only to the south, and the car trip took a couple of days. Almost a week or so. (I did stop to gamble at a casino and sleep at some hostels though)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the offer though!
> I already have a friend in Texas who helps me out with that stuff...only downside is paying a 50% import tax from time to time with bigger boxes.


Where in Argentina are you? I'll travel wherever the US is playing (but if we fail to qualify I might not even go) and plan to see Italy play too if possible.

Brazil is huge though and so is Argentina. In fact I just had to give myself a quick Google Maps geography lesson to really see how massive the two countries are...


----------



## EoL RiNzleR

i think its about time i post in this thread....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> i think its about time i post in this thread....


Join the OT discussion. When Valgaur comes back, he'll be thinking "These guys..."


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where in Argentina are you? I'll travel wherever the US is playing (but if we fail to qualify I might not even go) and plan to see Italy play too if possible.
> Brazil is huge though and so is Argentina. In fact I just had to give myself a quick Google Maps geography lesson to really see how massive the two countries are...


Yeah totally huge...The US is damn big though







And has plenty more big cities, wish it was more like that here, you only have few alternatives on busy places to live and work. Which consequently causes the city to be overpopulated badly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> i think its about time i post in this thread....


Yeah, you're like the king of OT lol
You changed your avatar too...I only saw you in that 'rate this user recognizability' thread or something like that








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Join the OT discussion. When Valgaur comes back, he'll be thinking "These guys..."


xD Val's gonna be mad...

_Please, some mod move this whole thread to the OT section, thank you._


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where in Argentina are you? I'll travel wherever the US is playing (but if we fail to qualify I might not even go) and plan to see Italy play too if possible.
> Brazil is huge though and so is Argentina. In fact I just had to give myself a quick Google Maps geography lesson to really see how massive the two countries are...
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah totally huge...The US is damn big though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And has plenty more big cities, wish it was more like that here, you only have few alternatives on busy places to live and work. Which consequently causes the city to be overpopulated badly.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> i think its about time i post in this thread....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah, you're like the king of OT lol
> You changed your avatar too...I only saw you in that 'rate this user recognizability' thread or something like that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Join the OT discussion. When Valgaur comes back, he'll be thinking "These guys..."
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> xD Val's gonna be mad...
> 
> _Please, some mod move this whole thread to the OT section, thank you._
Click to expand...

About your US point, it's true but I like my quaint little town. I think it's better than living in LA. I live around 45 mins away (3hrs with traffic) and it's so much better. Some people say this isn't quaint or little because it's in OC but whatever. This is small to me.







LA is too smoggy and dirty that whenever I visit, I laugh at all the tourists who lay on the ground taking pictures with the stars in Hollywood. Dumb! Repping BP!

Also, we help the people asking delid questions immediately so we should be able to be OT when no one is asking any questions. Keeps the thread prospering and whenever I need an answer/opinion on anything, I come here for the quickest reply!


----------



## stickg1

Lol yeah I also just ask questions here because I get the best and fastest answer...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Lol yeah I also just ask questions here because I get the best and fastest answer...


Especially how diverse it is, there is someone bound to know what you are asking. We have case modders, water coolers, air coolers, Swag, awesome people, smart people, Swag 2.0. We have such a diverse community.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Especially how diverse it is, there is someone bound to know what you are asking. We have case modders, water coolers, air coolers, Swag, awesome people, smart people, Swag 2.0. We have such a diverse community.


And that's what makes this thread constantly entertaining, interesting and fun. And it provides lots of new information to both new members and old.

Has anyone here done the Kuhler / Hydro mod with an MSI 7970 ? (or a GPU with a square/cross backplate?)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Especially how diverse it is, there is someone bound to know what you are asking. We have case modders, water coolers, air coolers, Swag, awesome people, smart people, Swag 2.0. We have such a diverse community.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And that's what makes this thread constantly entertaining, interesting and fun. And it provides lots of new information to both new members and old.
> 
> Has anyone here done the Kuhler / Hydro mod with an MSI 7970 ? (or a GPU with a square/cross backplate?)
Click to expand...

I did it with the H50 before but not on the 7970. I didn't like the extra bulk so I just scrapped it. I don't think it's worth it.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I did it with the H50 before but not on the 7970. I didn't like the extra bulk so I just scrapped it. I don't think it's worth it.


How did you go about getting off the back-support with the tiny screws?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I did it with the H50 before but not on the 7970. I didn't like the extra bulk so I just scrapped it. I don't think it's worth it.
> 
> 
> 
> How did you go about getting off the back-support with the tiny screws?
Click to expand...

A tiny screwdriver did the job and then after that, I bought a custom backplate.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A tiny screwdriver did the job and then after that, I bought a custom backplate.


Ah. My screwdrivers are too big :/


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A tiny screwdriver did the job and then after that, I bought a custom backplate.
> 
> 
> 
> Ah. My screwdrivers are too big :/
Click to expand...

Cheap Precision Screwdriver Set

One of these will work wonders and will be constantly used in PC builds. When I only have short screws but want to use it to mount a fan to my H100, I use one of these to go through the first hole and be able to screw it in properly!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Cheap Precision Screwdriver Set
> One of these will work wonders and will be constantly used in PC builds. When I only have short screws but want to use it to mount a fan to my H100, I use one of these to go through the first hole and be able to screw it in properly!


I'd also recommend this set. I've had it for years and they are perfect. Built well, easy to use handles that turn as you hold the top. Couldn't ask for a better set







.


----------



## stickg1

You probably need a #0 and #1 Phillips head screw driver. I prefer magnetic so those tiny screws dont run away from you.


----------



## Swag

Yes, a magnetic set is 10x better. I have a magnetic set. It cost me a bit more but completely worth it. In fact, I actually gave away all my screwdrivers (manual ones) and bought all magnetic tipped screw drivers. The difference is incomparable.


----------



## EoL RiNzleR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, you're like the king of OT lol
> You changed your avatar too...I only saw you in that 'rate this user recognizability' thread or something like that


yeah i am the almighty lord of OT. but back on topic. i7 3770K....there i contributed to the thread.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Really itching to delid my 3570K so I can see what's it made of this weekend. 4.8Ghz is pretty much assured (passes a quick IBT at 1.3vcore) which makes me really happy. Softens the blow I felt letting go of my precious 3770K







.


----------



## Hokies83

I for one do not think speaking about water cooling is ot..

This thread is about what? Removing to IHS to get better temps correct well discussing what else u need to get the best temps seems to follow the topic IMO.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I for one do not think speaking about water cooling is ot..
> This thread is about what? Removing to IHS to get better temps correct well discussing what else u need to get the best temps seems to follow the topic IMO.


This post does not mention delidding in it...I therefore do not approve








.


----------



## FtW 420

As long as discussion is PC related it shouldn't really be off topic. It is a club & not just a delidding guide, so should be able to discuss the rest of the PC hardware around a delidded chip to get the most out of it.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> As long as discussion is PC related it shouldn't really be off topic. It is a club & not just a delidding guide, so should be able to discuss the rest of the PC hardware around a delidded chip to get the most out of it.


Bingo







.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> You probably need a #0 and #1 Phillips head screw driver. I prefer magnetic so those tiny screws dont run away from you.


I do have a set of precision screwdrivers, they're just all too big







I'll pick one up tomorrow


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> yeah i am the almighty lord of OT. but back on topic. i7 3770K....there i contributed to the thread.


You need to delid a gpu...try fermi. That would be cool, and a bit OT.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> As long as discussion is PC related it shouldn't really be off topic. It is a club & not just a delidding guide, so should be able to discuss the rest of the PC hardware around a delidded chip to get the most out of it.


Spot on!









BTW, I LOVE my magnetic screwdrivers xD
Screwing the Silver Arrow to the retention mechanism is a PITA without those.


----------



## Swag

This will be off-topic like crazy so I'm gonna phrase it so it won't be OT. I can't help people delid right now because I'm out buying a Fiat.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This will be off-topic like crazy so I'm gonna phrase it so it won't be OT. I can't help people delid right now because I'm out buying a Fiat.


Post pics, I love Fiats


----------



## EoL RiNzleR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need to delid a gpu...try fermi. That would be cool, and a bit OT.


waiting for kepler v2


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> waiting for kepler v2


It will probably come without a lid like kepler, but have to wait & see.


----------



## lilchronic

WOW 611 posts i just read . took me hours lol. just got back from vacation. kinda mad cause i orderd clp and ultra before i left to south Florida and there not here yet i was hoping to have it today.
anyway it also seems i dropped about 3c in temp from letting the mx-4 set on the die


----------



## EoL RiNzleR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It will probably come without a lid like kepler, but have to wait & see.


yeah. i feel the same thing will happen with the 400-500 series. the 400 was the base set of cards then the 500 series fermi ones was like a bigger and better version. so i will skip the GTX 670 and wait for a GTX 770


----------



## tx-jose

think i may have a candidate for a possible de-lid...

4.4Ghz @ 1.20V 100% STABLE

testing 4.5Ghz @ 1.20V right now.

5Ghz chip?????.....possibly higher??


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> WOW 611 posts i just read . took me hours lol. just got back from vacation. kinda mad cause i orderd clp and ultra before i left to south Florida and there not here yet i was hoping to have it today.
> anyway it also seems i dropped about 3c in temp from letting the mx-4 set on the die


Is it because the mx-4 set, though, or is it just because it got colder in the meantime, and your ambients dropped? ^^


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> yeah. i feel the same thing will happen with the 400-500 series. the 400 was the base set of cards then the 500 series fermi ones was like a bigger and better version. so i will skip the GTX 670 and wait for a GTX 770


If Nvidia Does that they might aswell shoot themsleves in the head..

15% performance will only make there Gpu's comparable to the 7970s now...

Means the 8970 will steam roll it..

Id expect to see atleast a 30% improvement are Nvidia might aswell give up Amd is miles Ahead.


----------



## VonDutch

5am is not a good time to get up ...pfft.....i feel like i am delidded...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> WOW 611 posts i just read . took me hours lol. just got back from vacation. kinda mad cause i orderd clp and ultra before i left to south Florida and there not here yet i was hoping to have it today.
> anyway it also seems i dropped about 3c in temp from letting the mx-4 set on the die


Wb lilchronic, hope you had a good vacation








maybe i should buy alot of pro/ultra, and send it all over the globe where needed ...lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> think i may have a candidate for a possible de-lid...
> 4.4Ghz @ 1.20V 100% STABLE
> testing 4.5Ghz @ 1.20V right now.
> 5Ghz chip?????.....possibly higher??


do some more testing on 4.5ghz, if its stable, let us know what vcore you need


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> think i may have a candidate for a possible de-lid...
> 4.4Ghz @ 1.20V 100% STABLE
> testing 4.5Ghz @ 1.20V right now.
> 5Ghz chip?????.....possibly higher??


I'd never bother testing anything below 4.5-4.6 in terms of long term stability because that's when the vcore jumps begin in most cases. Give 4.5-4.6 a test and check the vcore. Then you'll have a better idea where you stand. Good luck







.


----------



## tx-jose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Wb lilchronic, hope you had a good vacation
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maybe i should buy alot of pro/ultra, and send it all over the globe where needed ...lol
> do some more testing on 4.5ghz, if its stable, let us know what vcore you need


i will

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I'd never bother testing anything below 4.5-4.6 in terms of long term stability because that's when the vcore jumps begin in most cases. Give 4.5-4.6 a test and check the vcore. Then you'll have a better idea where you stand. Good luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


well that sux.. i though 4.4Ghz @ 1.20V was a good thing


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Really itching to delid my 3570K so I can see what's it made of this weekend. 4.8Ghz is pretty much assured (passes a quick IBT at 1.3vcore) which makes me really happy. Softens the blow I felt letting go of my precious 3770K
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


why would you leave a 3770k that does 5 Ghz + ?!


----------



## Swag

Noooooooooo!







They ran out of the Abarth! I will have to wait until they get some more!









Anyway, I just bought some more of this stuff and here is my window again. I re-bolted it.











Adds to the metal look, I think.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> i will
> well that sux.. i though 4.4Ghz @ 1.20V was a good thing


I't not necessarily a good or bad thing so don't fret yet. Your chip's true potential is still yet to be discovered. Enjoy the journey







.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> why would you leave a 3770k that does 5 Ghz + ?!


I had my fun with it, I just don't have a use for it really as I don't do anything more intense than gaming. I also really needed to upgrade my file server RAID array as I've been running low on space for almost a year now. With the money I made off the 3770k I was able do to that so it worked out. My 3570k is proving to be more than I'll ever need in it of itself so I'll enjoy chasing 5.0Ghz on with this one whether I get there or not







.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Is it because the mx-4 set, though, or is it just because it got colder in the meantime, and your ambients dropped? ^^


well i think its because it set, but i got some screen shots so lets see.
befor delid.



After delid.



1 week of being unpluged.

well darn i forgot to save my screen shot of it before i went to teting 5Ghz but i think they were like 60c 67c 69c 64c ??? lol
im restart now
also i have my computer by my window sucking in that ambient air


----------



## VonDutch

anyone know why my comp has a problem waking up after a while,
it turns of display after 1 hour, ive set it to that, sleep is set to never,
but if i move my mouse, or hit enter etc, it wont wake up?
i have to use ctrl/alt/delete to log out, then login again, and its ok..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> anyone know why my comp has a problem waking up after a while,
> it turns of display after 1 hour, ive set it to that, sleep is set to never,
> but if i move my mouse, or hit enter etc, it wont wake up?
> i have to use ctrl/alt/delete to log out, then login again, and its ok..


Are you using CPU PLL overvoltage in the BIOS?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Are you using CPU PLL overvoltage in the BIOS?


never used that before, so it prolly disabled, let me check......o, its set to Auto


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I't not necessarily a good or bad thing so don't fret yet. Your chip's true potential is still yet to be discovered. Enjoy the journey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> I had my fun with it, I just don't have a use for it really as I don't do anything more intense than gaming. I also really needed to upgrade my file server RAID array as I've been running low on space for almost a year now. With the money I made off the 3770k I was able do to that so it worked out. My 3570k is proving to be more than I'll ever need in it of itself so I'll enjoy chasing 5.0Ghz on with this one whether I get there or not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


man i was about to swap out my 3570k for a 3770k and pay the 100$ difference idk will i regret it ? i just wanna have an i7 just for the hell of it lol
but my chip is a bad over-clocker it needs 1.2v to do 4.2 only


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> never used that before, so it prolly disabled, let me check......o, its set to Auto


Try disabling it and see if that helps because it's been known to cause sleep issues. However it can help in getting a big 4.7+Ghz OC so it could make your high OC unstable.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> man i was about to swap out my 3570k for a 3770k and pay the 100$ difference idk will i regret it ? i just wanna have an i7 just for the hell of it lol
> but my chip is a bad over-clocker it needs 1.2v to do 4.2 only


Well if your chip is that poor you probably won't regret it but you have to determine if you need the extra speed for what you use your computer for. I felt the same way about having an i7 but then after having it for a few weeks realized I just had no use for it







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> think i may have a candidate for a possible de-lid...
> 4.4Ghz @ 1.20V 100% STABLE
> testing 4.5Ghz @ 1.20V right now.
> 5Ghz chip?????.....possibly higher??


Could be, but you gotta check how high you can go below 1.52v really, I needed 1.23v for 4.4, 1.37v for 4.7 and 1..48vv for 4.9, 5ghz demanded 1.56v I think, but was bench stable with less volts.....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 5am is not a good time to get up ...pfft.....i feel like i am delidded...lol


XD why so early man? Kids woke you up?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i think its because it set, but i got some screen shots so lets see.
> befor delid.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After delid.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1 week of being unpluged.
> well darn i forgot to save my screen shot of it before i went to teting 5Ghz but i think they were like 60c 67c 69c 64c ??? lol
> im restart now
> also i have my computer by my window sucking in that ambient air


well what do you guys think


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Try disabling it and see if that helps because it's been known to cause sleep issues. However it can help in getting a big 4.7+Ghz OC so it could make your high OC unstable.
> Well if your chip is that poor you probably won't regret it but you have to determine if you need the extra speed for what you use your computer for. I felt the same way about having an i7 but then after having it for a few weeks realized I just had no use for it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


i will trade mine for another used one so idk why it's being sold maybe because it's a bad overclocker ? lol idk i just feel like i want to put a top cpu in my rig just for the hell of it really....
what do they call that ? upgrade itch syndrome ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i think its because it set, but i got some screen shots so lets see.
> befor delid.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After delid.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1 week of being unpluged.
> well darn i forgot to save my screen shot of it before i went to teting 5Ghz but i think they were like 60c 67c 69c 64c ??? lol
> im restart now
> also i have my computer by my window sucking in that ambient air


i thought a break-in period for tim's, needs *several thermal cycles* to get to optimal performance?
so if you had it unplugged for a week, thats 1 cycle? ..lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i will trade mine for another used one so idk why it's being sold maybe because it's a bad overclocker ? lol idk i just feel like i want to put a top cpu in my rig just for the hell of it really....
> what do they call that ? upgrade itch syndrome ?


Not sure I understand your first question but I definitely understand getting the upgrade itch. Luckily I scratched it by picking up my 3770k, The itch went away and I picked up a 3570K instead. However if this chip turned out to be a poor OC'er I was planning on bringing it back to exchange it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Could be, but you gotta check how high you can go below 1.52v really, I needed 1.23v for 4.4, 1.37v for 4.7 and 1..48vv for 4.9, 5ghz demanded 1.56v I think, but was bench stable with less volts.....
> XD why so early man? Kids woke you up?


i had to pee...LOL
problem is, if i wake up, i cant go back to sleep, awake is awake kinda guy,
o well, i will survive the day, and i can talk to you guys some more,
when i wake up normal time, you guys(usa) are about to go to bed ...lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Try disabling it and see if that helps because it's been known to cause sleep issues. However it can help in getting a big 4.7+Ghz OC so it could make your high OC unstable.


will try, but running 4.7ghz now.. thanks


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i thought a break-in period for tim's, needs *several thermal cycles* to get to optimal performance?
> so if you had it unplugged for a week, thats 1 cycle? ..lol


i heard the liquid metal compound thing is the best to use if you are delidding but i don't have that available where i live , but i have some mx-4 and ocz freeze at hand now should i just use them if i go de-lidding or better off order the liquid metal compound from amazon and wait for it to arrive here ?is there a big difference between using mx-4 and liquid metal compound ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fskidd*
> 
> Here is the validation link http://valid.canardpc.com/2638928


Thank you and your in!








Slap the sig on like a real man!!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> In the month I've been hanging out here I never applied for membership...
> OCN name: stickg1
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: CLLP
> ihs-TIM: Antec Formula 7
> Mhz gained: 400MHz
> OC after delid: 4700MHz
> Temp drops: 15C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2638945
> BEFORE:
> 
> AFTER:
> 
> 
> Sorry for the 4.3GHz reference testing, I never read that part of the OP and obviously its too late to test 4.5GHz temps on my chip pre-delidding
> Also I can safely overclock to 4.7GHz now but I just run 4.5GHz for a daily because voltage is much lower and temps are nice. Also I think my temp difference is more like 20C, that first time I tested I did a crap job on the IHS TIM. I will retest later..


Accepted!







Slap that Sig on baby!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @*Valgaur*
> I haven't seen a thread be closed or official status taken away just because it has been off-topic. I heard that the only way a thread will be closed or something like that will happen if the entire thread is just a troll thread and does nothing but troll.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> i think its about time i post in this thread....


Tell us what you think of it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Join the OT discussion. When Valgaur comes back, he'll be thinking "These guys..."


Yup lol







but that's just how we are here.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I for one do not think speaking about water cooling is ot..
> This thread is about what? Removing to IHS to get better temps correct well discussing what else u need to get the best temps seems to follow the topic IMO.


Finally someone said it right, same with FtW420 below you. So OT's are welcomed!







just didn't wanna get slapped lol








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> As long as discussion is PC related it shouldn't really be off topic. It is a club & not just a delidding guide, so should be able to discuss the rest of the PC hardware around a delidded chip to get the most out of it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tx-jose*
> 
> think i may have a candidate for a possible de-lid...
> 4.4Ghz @ 1.20V 100% STABLE
> testing 4.5Ghz @ 1.20V right now.
> 5Ghz chip?????.....possibly higher??


Try for 4.7-4.8 area thats where Ivy gets cranky sometimes on chips but if it's good it'll take around 1.3-1.35 vcore for 4.8 area. Let us know.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> why would you leave a 3770k that does 5 Ghz + ?!


To let us benchers at it manly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Noooooooooo!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They ran out of the Abarth! I will have to wait until they get some more!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, I just bought some more of this stuff and here is my window again. I re-bolted it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Adds to the metal look, I think.


Love that look. keep it man.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> man i was about to swap out my 3570k for a 3770k and pay the 100$ difference idk will i regret it ? i just wanna have an i7 just for the hell of it lol
> but my chip is a bad over-clocker it needs 1.2v to do 4.2 only


junk it and get an i7. what you got to lose anyways?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i had to pee...LOL
> problem is, if i wake up, i cant go back to sleep, awake is awake kinda guy,
> o well, i will survive the day, and i can talk to you guys some more,
> when i wake up normal time, you guys(usa) are about to go to bed ...lol


Not me I pull long nights until darn near late late morning 6 am area and get up at 10am during my christmas break and at 8am at school yup 2-4 hours of sleep a night. Lovely insomnia!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i heard the liquid metal compound thing is the best to use if you are delidding but i don't have that available where i live , but i have some mx-4 and ocz freeze at hand now should i just use them if i go de-lidding or better off order the liquid metal compound from amazon and wait for it to arrive here ?is there a big difference between using mx-4 and liquid metal compound ?


only if you use it on the die liquid pro/ultra give the best results,
on the IHS any good,like mx4, will do..
where do you live?,
i discovered in some countries they have a different name,
not coollaboratory liquid pro, but its the same..
mx4 will still give you a nice tempdrop if you use it on the die etc,
not, sure, but 10, maybe 15C tops, liquid pro/ultra most of the time more then 20C,
i had a 25+C tempdrop, i used it on all sides, before that i used AS5, had to wait for clp to arrive,
and using that dropped temps about 10C

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Not me I pull long nights until darn near late late morning 6 am area and get up at 10am during my christmas break and at 8am at school yup 2-4 hours of sleep a night. Lovely insomnia!


o, i know that very well, use to go on for 50/60 hours, no sleep, just party for 2 days etc..lol, sleep a few hours, get up, and go on again,
could do that for a few months, then breakdown, sleep 2 nights normal, and start over again ...lol
if i do that now, im kaput for days ...LOL , thats the only thing about getting older i dont like








but yea, use to have enough if i slept 4-5H a nite, np..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> only if you use it on the die liquid pro/ultra give the best results,
> on the IHS any good,like mx4, will do..
> where do you live, i discovered in some countries they have a different name,
> not coollaboratory liquid pro, but its the same..


That phobya stuff right?


----------



## tw33k

I've only found Phobya liquid metal for sale in the UK. It's supposed to be on par with Liquid Ultra/Pro. In fact I saw a comparison where it beat Liquid Pro by 1 or 2c. I'll post a link if I can find it again


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I've only found Phobya liquid metal for sale in the UK. It's supposed to be on par with Liquid Ultra/Pro. In fact I saw a comparison where it beat Liquid Pro by 1 or 2c. I'll post a link if I can find it again


yea, Phobya was one of the different names i saw,
but i thought it was from the same manufacturer?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, Phobya was one of the different names i saw,
> but i thought it was from the same manufacturer?


No it's not. Phobya is the manufacturer


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Wb lilchronic, hope you had a good vacation
> maybe i should buy alot of pro/ultra, and send it all over the globe where needed ...lol


thanks my vacation was good.
and i would be testing right now with cl pro/ultra if u sent it to me. lol







they take forever. but there supposed to be sending me an extra tube of ultra since my first 1 only had enough for 1 application so i sent them an email befor i orderd more, and they said they would send me an extra 1 fo free


----------



## VonDutch

here's another,
Nanoxia Nano TF-1000 Liquid Metal Thermal Grease
http://www.dimastech.it/EN/c/nanoxia-nano-tf-1000-liquid-metal-thermal-grease/

yours,
Phobya Liquid Metal Thermal Compound LM
http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/Phobya-Liquid-Metal-Thermal-Compound--LM-05g-pid-9942.html

and the one we all know,
Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/

they all look very similar..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thanks my vacation was good.
> and i would be testing right now with cl pro/ultra if u sent it to me. lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> they take forever. but there supposed to be sending me an extra tube of ultra since my first 1 only had enough for 1 application so i sent them an email befor i orderd more, and they said they would send me an extra 1 fo free


thats nice of them








even tho germany is next to our country, still have to wait about 1 week for it to arrive here,
most shops dont have it on stock..
"niet op voorraad, normaliter binnen 5 werkdagen leverbaar"
(not in stock, normally within 5 working days available)


----------



## EoL RiNzleR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If Nvidia Does that they might aswell shoot themsleves in the head..
> 15% performance will only make there Gpu's comparable to the 7970s now...
> Means the 8970 will steam roll it..
> Id expect to see atleast a 30% improvement are Nvidia might aswell give up Amd is miles Ahead.


i've just never been into AMD cards. had a 4870 and a 5770 thats it. the rest have all been Nvidia cards.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> only if you use it on the die liquid pro/ultra give the best results,
> on the IHS any good,like mx4, will do..
> where do you live?,
> i discovered in some countries they have a different name,
> not coollaboratory liquid pro, but its the same..
> mx4 will still give you a nice tempdrop if you use it on the die etc,
> not, sure, but 10, maybe 15C tops, liquid pro/ultra most of the time more then 20C,
> i had a 25+C tempdrop, i used it on all sides, before that i used AS5, had to wait for clp to arrive,
> and using that dropped temps about 10C
> o, i know that very well, use to go on for 50/60 hours, no sleep, just party for 2 days etc..lol, sleep a few hours, get up, and go on again,
> could do that for a few months, then breakdown, sleep 2 nights normal, and start over again ...lol
> if i do that now, im kaput for days ...LOL , thats the only thing about getting older i dont like
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but yea, use to have enough if i slept 4-5H a nite, np..


i live in egypt i don't think we have that liquid metal compound available, so it will be mx-4 or i have to import the coollaboratory liquid pro from amazon or new egg, also if i get my i7 today i will want to delid it but i'm actually scared i might break it because i can't afford another one now actually , is there a big risk if i'm doing it for the first time ?


----------



## tw33k

They do all look similar. That Nanoxia is new


----------



## lilchronic

they have all kinds now i just found another
http://www.candccentral.co.uk/phobya-liquid-metal-thermal-compound-paste-lm-1g-31003.html


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> here's another,
> Nanoxia Nano TF-1000 Liquid Metal Thermal Grease
> http://www.dimastech.it/EN/c/nanoxia-nano-tf-1000-liquid-metal-thermal-grease/
> yours,
> Phobya Liquid Metal Thermal Compound LM
> http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/Phobya-Liquid-Metal-Thermal-Compound--LM-05g-pid-9942.html
> and the one we all know,
> Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/
> they all look very similar..
> thats nice of them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> even tho germany is next to our country, still have to wait about 1 week for it to arrive here,
> most shops dont have it on stock..
> "niet op voorraad, normaliter binnen 5 werkdagen leverbaar"
> (not in stock, normally within 5 working days available)


man you are so lucky all this is available to you guys, here max i could do is mx-4


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> they have all kinds now i just found another
> http://www.candccentral.co.uk/phobya-liquid-metal-thermal-compound-paste-lm-1g-31003.html


Yeah..we were talking about that earlier


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i live in egypt i don't think we have that liquid metal compound available, so it will be mx-4 or i have to import the coollaboratory liquid pro from amazon or new egg, also if i get my i7 today i will want to delid it but i'm actually scared i might break it because i can't afford another one now actually , is there a big risk if i'm doing it for the first time ?


if you can, practice on some old pentiums first,
theres a list on page 1 of this thread, which ones are soldered or not,
i bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro...no problem messing up one or two of them right,
theres always some risk involved if you delid, but if take your time to prepare well,
read up on the subject, watch all kinds of vid's on the net, use the right tools..it isnt hard,

i had the same problem, no money to buy another cpu, i spent almost all on my 3770, 310 euro,
didnt practice on old pentiums tho, didnt know that back then, but took my time to prepare,
about 1 month, then i just woke up one morning, and thought, "this is the day to delid my chip",
did it, np, took me about 20 minutes , for me personally it was very easy...

but if you have doubt, or are afraid to brake it, are nervous,
think "what if"...then dont do it till your confident you can..

if im right, you can order directly from their site too,
http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop/

if needed, i can help you out, and order some for you ..np









just found a nice pic on how little you need to cover a block,


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EoL RiNzleR*
> 
> i've just never been into AMD cards. had a 4870 and a 5770 thats it. the rest have all been Nvidia cards.


4770, 5770, 6850, and now a 7970


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if you can, practice on some old pentiums first,
> theres a list on page 1 of this thread, which ones are soldered or not,
> i bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro...no problem messing up one or two of them right..
> *if im right, you can order directly from their site too,
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop/*if needed, i can help you out, and order some for you ..np


You are right. I've done it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if you can, practice on some old pentiums first,
> theres a list on page 1 of this thread, which ones are soldered or not,
> i bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro...no problem messing up one or two of them right..
> *if im right, you can order directly from their site too,
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop/*if needed, i can help you out, and order some for you ..np
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are right. I've done it
Click to expand...

Yea, I ordered straight from them, but it has been a long time already and still no CLP.







I bought it on Dec 20 and I've been waiting! I ordered like 5 just in case.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> You are right. I've done it


Yeah, that's how I got mine too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I ordered straight from them, but it has been a long time already and still no CLP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I bought it on Dec 20 and I've been waiting! I ordered like 5 just in case.


I ordered mine on the 23rd of November and it came like the day before Christmas.. I'd say mid-late January or later due to christmas and shipping etc.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> You are right. I've done it
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, that's how I got mine too.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I ordered straight from them, but it has been a long time already and still no CLP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I bought it on Dec 20 and I've been waiting! I ordered like 5 just in case.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I ordered mine on the 23rd of November and it came like the day before Christmas.. I'd say mid-late January or later due to christmas and shipping etc.
Click to expand...

Grr! I ran out so I only have CLP on my die right now. I can't even reseat anything or clean out my mobo! Sucks...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Grr! I ran out so I only have CLP on my die right now. I can't even reseat anything or clean out my mobo! Sucks...


Yeah I only JUST had enough for the die.. I was like "wow"


----------



## VonDutch

like i said, i can get it within a week orso, i can send it anywhere if needed..
shoudnt take very much longer to send it from my home to Australia, California etc


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Grr! I ran out so I only have CLP on my die right now. I can't even reseat anything or clean out my mobo! Sucks...
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I only JUST had enough for the die.. I was like "wow"
Click to expand...

What do you mean? Like there was nothing in the syringe or it was just that they give so little?


----------



## Valgaur

SKYPE WHY YOU SO MEAN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!


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## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
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> SKYPE WHY YOU SO MEAN TO ME!!!!!!!!!!


Friends probably DDOS-ed you so they wouldn't have to play with you.







Hahahaha! Just kidding Val! Tell that Skype what's up.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if you can, practice on some old pentiums first,
> theres a list on page 1 of this thread, which ones are soldered or not,
> i bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro...no problem messing up one or two of them right,
> theres always some risk involved if you delid, but if take your time to prepare well,
> read up on the subject, watch all kinds of vid's on the net, use the right tools..it isnt hard,
> i had the same problem, no money to buy another cpu, i spent almost all on my 3770, 310 euro,
> didnt practice on old pentiums tho, didnt know that back then, but took my time to prepare,
> about 1 month, then i just woke up one morning, and thought, "this is the day to delid my chip",
> did it, np, took me about 20 minutes , for me personally it was very easy...
> but if you have doubt, or are afraid to brake it, are nervous,
> think "what if"...then dont do it till your confident you can..
> if im right, you can order directly from their site too,
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop/
> if needed, i can help you out, and order some for you ..np
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just found a nice pic on how little you need to cover a block,


thanks alot for the offer but how will i pay you for it ? i can't take nothing without paying for it in full !


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What do you mean? Like there was nothing in the syringe or it was just that they give so little?


Customs took about 1/4 of mine, (both tubes). So I only had 1.5g to start with. I accidentally sprayed some CLP out when I first got it (only wanted a little drop), I did the P4 IHS and that didnt work well so i did the 3570K IHS and that worked wonders.

I also ran out of CLU, I did my 7950 (not a good application







) and the IHS - Cooler twice and it's now empty. The CLP is almost empty, less then half a gram remains.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What do you mean? Like there was nothing in the syringe or it was just that they give so little?
> 
> 
> 
> Customs took about 1/4 of mine, (both tubes). So I only had 1.5g to start with. I accidentally sprayed some CLP out when I first got it (only wanted a little drop), I did the P4 IHS and that didnt work well so i did the 3570K IHS and that worked wonders.
> 
> I also ran out of CLU, I did my 7950 (not a good application
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and the IHS - Cooler twice and it's now empty. The CLP is almost empty, less then half a gram remains.
Click to expand...

Wow, how did customs take 1/4 of it?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wow, how did customs take 1/4 of it?


Yep, 1/4 of each tube..
There was some of the ultra over the cap too, they spilled a fair amount of that. Damn Australian Customs..
I bet it possibly went through two sets of customs also, probably Australian + German ones hence why so much was wasted.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> thanks alot for the offer but how will i pay you for it ? i can't take nothing without paying for it in full !


yw, im sure we can figure something out if needed,
but you could try order first from their website,
http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop/


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wow, how did customs take 1/4 of it?
> 
> 
> 
> Yep, 1/4 of each tube..
> There was some of the ultra over the cap too, they spilled a fair amount of that. Damn Australian Customs..
> I bet it possibly went through two sets of customs also, probably Australian + German ones hence why so much was wasted.
Click to expand...

I know for a fact that the German customs didn't do it. I've bought CLP before from them and nothing happened to it. Normally anything waived as below $20 is just passed through customs.


----------



## Faelore

To reply earlier I am planning on grabbing 2x 7950s or 7970s when the 8000 series comes out Due to the fact there should be a significant price drop of at least $20-30 a card. Then if they go on sale -$20 more paying around $230 for a 7950 3gb and ocing it past a 7970 = $460 dollars well spent. I am actually planning on modding the Noctua nh-d14 I am gonna take those silly pink fans off and put two of these

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835213001

That is if it will still fit in my thor v2, honestly I wish I had gone with the blackhawk ultra but the thor v2 was on sale for 89.99 no way i could pass that up. Thor v2 cant even fit a 240 rad without modding which is such bs.

But anyway modded Noctua nh-d14 should be okay i think cause the fans are 120 x 120 x 38 but the nh-d14 fits in a thor with 1 inch of clearance which the new fans shouldnt effect at all they should effect my Graphics card clearance/memory clearance but i plan on going with low profile ram anyway so if anyone has any idea if I can mod the nh-d14 to have 2x 120x 120x 38x fans instead of the 120x 120x 25x it comes with and not have it interfer with my graphics card I would greatly appreciate you letting me know now







.

I have heard from a few people who had thrown a delta same as mine on a evo 212 it dropped the temps by over 20☻


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know for a fact that the German customs didn't do it. I've bought CLP before from them and nothing happened to it. Normally anything waived as below $20 is just passed through customs.


Yeah, well then I don't know. It was only marked as $14..
Unless Australian customs are just rubbish.. That'd make sense, customs being similar to the rest of the government services....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> To reply earlier I am planning on grabbing 2x 7950s or 7970s when the 8000 series comes out Due to the fact there should be a significant price drop of at least $20-30 a card. Then if they go on sale -$20 more paying around $230 for a 7950 3gb and ocing it past a 7970 = $460 dollars well spent. I am actually planning on modding the Noctua nh-d14 I am gonna take those silly pink fans off and put two of these
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835213001
> That is if it will still fit in my thor v2, honestly I wish I had gone with the blackhawk ultra but the thor v2 was on sale for 89.99 no way i could pass that up. Thor v2 cant even fit a 240 rad without modding which is such bs.
> But anyway modded Noctua nh-d14 should be okay i think cause the fans are 120 x 120 x 38 but the nh-d14 fits in a thor with 1 inch of clearance which the new fans shouldnt effect at all they should effect my Graphics card clearance/memory clearance but i plan on going with low profile ram anyway so if anyone has any idea *if I can mod the nh-d14 to have 2x 120x 120x 38x fans instead of the 120x 120x 25x it comes with and not have it interfer with my graphics card* I would greatly appreciate you letting me know now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> I have heard from a few people who had thrown a delta same as mine on a evo 212 it dropped the temps by over 20☻


i dont see how it can interfere with you video card,
if only the thickness of the fans changes, and not the size..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know for a fact that the German customs didn't do it. I've bought CLP before from them and nothing happened to it. Normally anything waived as below $20 is just passed through customs.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, well then I don't know. It was only marked as $14..
> Unless Australian customs are just rubbish.. That'd make sense, customs being similar to the rest of the government services....
Click to expand...

Haha, I always hear Aussies loving Australia. Haven't heard someone complain about the government there ever.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i dont see how it can interfere with you video card,
> if only the thickness of the fans changes, and not the size..


It can affect it if you have an mATX board. For example, my MVG is barely getting away with it. If my GPU had some things protruding from the back, it will hit the D14.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It can affect it if you have an mATX board. For example, my MVG is barely getting away with it. If my GPU had some things protruding from the back, it will hit the D14.


i see, he didnt mention what mobo hes using tho..thanks


----------



## EoL RiNzleR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, I always hear Aussies loving Australia. Haven't heard someone complain about the government there ever.


its hilarious that's all i will say.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I'd never bother testing anything below 4.5-4.6 in terms of long term stability because that's when the vcore jumps begin in most cases. Give 4.5-4.6 a test and check the vcore. Then you'll have a better idea where you stand. Good luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


yeah, I never even bother checking anything below 1.20V ... what I do I set manual fixed 1.200v and check how high on multiplier it takes me (stable) ... then I set 1.520V and check again ... use Cinebench 11.5 x64 for quick stability testing with moderate temps, much better than IBT, especially before delid.
,y 2 chips form batch 3224B could do cinebench stable 4.7GHz with a tiny bot bump over 1.20V, something like 1210-1215mv or so. then they both did 5.0GHz stable at ~1.47V
but different batches scale differently, I've seen one that could do only 4.8GHz with 1.52V ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i had to pee...LOL
> problem is, if i wake up, i cant go back to sleep, awake is awake kinda guy,
> o well, i will survive the day, and i can talk to you guys some more,
> when i wake up normal time, you guys(usa) are about to go to bed ...lol
> will try, but running 4.7ghz now.. thanks


ha ha! my wife's like that








on contrary, I'm the kind of guy that can wake up half asleep with one eye opened when nature calls, go to toilet and then come back to bed and sleep for next 6 hours no trouble LOL!
... my only problem is the initial falling asleep ... hence why I am sitting here at 3:30am ... but once I do fall asleep then ... oh well, I usually oversleep








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yep, 1/4 of each tube..
> There was some of the ultra over the cap too, they spilled a fair amount of that. Damn Australian Customs..
> I bet it possibly went through two sets of customs also, probably Australian + German ones hence why so much was wasted.


customs took samples of the TIM from both syringes?? that's creepy ... what did they expect ... smuggling of a liquid plutonium or something LOL?

I have a question to anybody (water cooling) who actually succeeded in creating an XSPC LCD display with a Bitspower water temp fitting (soldering), started a thread on this here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1345433/xspc-lcd-display-bitspower-water-temperature-sensor-fitting

I failed twice (2 units dead) ... namely, the moment I unsolder the stock sensor wires from unit's PCB, the unit is dead and no longer displays anything (it lights up blank) ... anybody had such trouble? have anybody ever done this? I don't understand why this is happening, nothing was shorted, solder was clean ... it even happened on two different PCB designs/revisions with different components surrounding the soldering area, ***?
I needed to re-order the darn XSPC LCD display for the third time, this time I am gonna solder/splice the new sensor wires together with old ones, not touching the darn PCB anymore, XSPC makes cheap electronic devices ... those things are so fragile like hell (don't even want to go about this now, had to re-solder a few things after holding them stripped in hands)...

on a side note, a question ... Does XSPC Support even exist for North America???? I tried contacting those *******s 3 times over their stupid website contact form on 3 different issues and NEVER received any reply ever ... now wondering how helpful they would be if something happened to my Raystorm, Razors or XSPC rads ... go figure ... food for thought.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> ha ha! my wife's like that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> on contrary, I'm the kind of guy that can *wake up half asleep with one eye opened when nature calls, go to toilet and then come back to bed and sleep for next 6 hours no trouble* LOL!
> ... my only problem is the initial falling asleep ... hence why I am sitting here at 3:30am ... but once I do fall asleep then ... oh well, I usually oversleep


and my gf sounds like you...haha
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> customs took samples of the TIM from both syringes?? that's creepy ... what did they expect ... smuggling of a liquid plutonium or something LOL?


thats exactly what i thought, even tried to find if theres a liquid plutonium also ...LOL


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> and my gf sounds like you...haha
> thats exactly what i thought, even tried to find if theres a liquid plutonium also ...LOL


LOL, too funny








I doubt plutonium exists in liquid state in our atmospheric conditions ... wondering however why we both thought the same thing LOL!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL, too funny
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I doubt plutonium exists in liquid state in our atmospheric conditions ... wondering however why we both thought the same thing LOL!


Yeah it's solid. Just for reference


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> customs took samples of the TIM from both syringes?? that's creepy ... what did they expect ... smuggling of a liquid plutonium or something LOL?


Maybe.. Who knows? It was one of each to be fair (A Ultra and a Pro). Makes sense to me but still.. They took way too much. :/
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, I always hear Aussies loving Australia. Haven't heard someone complain about the government there ever.


Haha








It's not all that bad, it just annoys me the money that is wasted here and some of the stupid decisions.. Some of it makes sense to me but other things are just ridiculous. Like the fact that I'm going to get $522 (AUD) a fortnight for going to uni and doing nothing AND $6000 in bonus'... That is where Australia wastes its money. Most people could live with say a $1000 bonus or $2000 for books and a laptop etc, they should have it so rent is paid for straight away rather then giving the students the cash..

The $6000 bonus is way over the top, like way over the top I think. I'll take it because it's basically free money and I do need it personally but it's just a massive waste to think that most people I know that are getting it are spending it on stuff like computers etc, iPhones or even a new car. (When they have a perfectly fine car). Sigh, I'm putting mine into advance payments for rent personally.

The thing that really ticks me is the freaks that live here, the only two problems with our society (Here in Tasmania at least) is the narrow minded councils. Some big hardware store (Bunnings) wanted to make a store here, it would have made so many jobs and so much profit for the city. But the concil rejected it saying "Local business' will suffer". Toobad anyone smart enough can drive for a bit over an hour and go to the same store, it's cheaper in comparison that even if you buy 2-3 things at retail at both you'll be saving by the time you take fuel into account.

The other thing is the bogans, I see more and more people flunking out of college to get "Centrelink", it's actually a joke to some people. They put decals on their cars/computers (yes that low) to say "Sponsored by Centrelink", because they don't need a job. Centrelink just gives them money while they sit down and play games all day or shoot em' up and get as high as the empire state building!

Rant over!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yw, im sure we can figure something out if needed,
> but you could try order first from their website,
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop/


can't order from them directly they will not ship here i'm sure
i could see if i can get it from amazon but i think it will be expensive till i get it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> customs took samples of the TIM from both syringes?? that's creepy ... what did they expect ... smuggling of a liquid plutonium or something LOL?
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe.. Who knows? It was one of each to be fair (A Ultra and a Pro). Makes sense to me but still.. They took way too much. :/
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, I always hear Aussies loving Australia. Haven't heard someone complain about the government there ever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not all that bad, it just annoys me the money that is wasted here and some of the stupid decisions.. Some of it makes sense to me but other things are just ridiculous. Like the fact that I'm going to get $522 (AUD) a fortnight for going to uni and doing nothing AND $6000 in bonus'... That is where Australia wastes its money. Most people could live with say a $1000 bonus or $2000 for books and a laptop etc, they should have it so rent is paid for straight away rather then giving the students the cash..
> 
> The $6000 bonus is way over the top, like way over the top I think. I'll take it because it's basically free money and I do need it personally but it's just a massive waste to think that most people I know that are getting it are spending it on stuff like computers etc, iPhones or even a new car. (When they have a perfectly fine car). Sigh, I'm putting mine into advance payments for rent personally.
> 
> The thing that really ticks me is the freaks that live here, the only two problems with our society (Here in Tasmania at least) is the narrow minded councils. Some big hardware store (Bunnings) wanted to make a store here, it would have made so many jobs and so much profit for the city. But the concil rejected it saying "Local business' will suffer". Toobad anyone smart enough can drive for a bit over an hour and go to the same store, it's cheaper in comparison that even if you buy 2-3 things at retail at both you'll be saving by the time you take fuel into account.
> 
> The other thing is the bogans, I see more and more people flunking out of college to get "Centrelink", it's actually a joke to some people. They put decals on their cars/computers (yes that low) to say "Sponsored by Centrelink", because they don't need a job. Centrelink just gives them money while they sit down and play games all day or shoot em' up and get as high as the empire state building!
> 
> Rant over!
Click to expand...

Lol! If you are mad about that, think of it at least it's in education. In America, we give handouts to people who have no desire to be independent. Are you kidding me? So much money being funneled down to the lazy. The reason why we even have a capitalist economy is that so everyone is trying their best to be the best. If you give handouts, you take away the drive. Anyway, that's probably why I'm against the 20 million people that just got added to the welfare list.







Whatever, what's done is done!

Rant over!!! No politics in OCN!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> can't order from them directly they will not ship here i'm sure
> i could see if i can get it from amazon but i think it will be expensive till i get it


it does say on their site,
Here you can order our high-quality products with just a few clicks - *no matter where you're living in the world!
We are also offering very low shipping costs around the globe*

dang,.. 20 mill people, thats more then live in my country(17Million) ...lol
about 500.000 dont work...im one of them., but im disabled..o well..

21% tax on computer parts, thats what they should lower! ..

thats my only rant


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! If you are mad about that, think of it at least it's in education. In America, we give handouts to people who have no desire to be independent. Are you kidding me? So much money being funneled down to the lazy. The reason why we even have a capitalist economy is that so everyone is trying their best to be the best. If you give handouts, you take away the drive. Anyway, that's probably why I'm against the 20 million people that just got added to the welfare list.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever, what's done is done!
> Rant over!!! No politics in OCN!


Just to clarify I know a guy who is "Clinically depressed" so he gets along the lines of $700+ a fortnight for doing nothing. Whereas me, I'd get $250 a fortnight because I don't have any problems.. A friend is classed as a "Disability" because he can't smell (Since birth). It's actually so bad and unfair, I'm not complaining i'm just stating there politics here is messed up. Anyway yes, back onto de-lidding


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dang,.. 20 mill people, thats more then live in my country(17Million) ...lol
> about 500.000 dont work...im one of them., but im disabled..o well..
> 
> 21% tax on computer parts, thats what they should lower! ..
> 
> thats my only rant


They have a separate tax just for PC parts? Really? That should be taken out or something. That deserves a Civil War!







I don't mind disabled, remember the difference between the Lazy able body and the disabled body.


----------



## Valgaur

Anypne have skype where it starts up fine... but wont let you log in? login username and password bars are there but wont do anything.....


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Just to clarify I know a guy who is "Clinically depressed" so he gets along the lines of $700+ a fortnight for doing nothing. Whereas me, I'd get $250 a fortnight because I don't have any problems.. A friend is classed as a "Disability" because he can't smell (Since birth). It's actually so bad and unfair, I'm not complaining i'm just stating there politics here is messed up. Anyway yes, back onto de-lidding


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! If you are mad about that, think of it at least it's in education. In America, we give handouts to people who have no desire to be independent. Are you kidding me? So much money being funneled down to the lazy. The reason why we even have a capitalist economy is that so everyone is trying their best to be the best. If you give handouts, you take away the drive. Anyway, that's probably why I'm against the 20 million people that just got added to the welfare list.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever, what's done is done!
> Rant over!!! No politics in OCN!


I have a serious problem with this sort of Welfare / Unemployment insurance. I cannot fathom of taking money from the government when I don't truly need it.

I have been out of a job since early December but did not collect unemployment insurance which would have paid 50% of my wage I believe. Why? Because I don't *need* it. I like to believe that if we only took that which we need, we could have a much better world.

The people who take money like you're saying, and spend it for themselves... it saddens me. No, it doesn't sicken or anger me. It just saddens me. It saddens me that people would benefit themselves before the world.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> They have a separate tax just for PC parts? Really? That should be taken out or something. That deserves a Civil War!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't mind disabled, remember the difference between the Lazy able body and the disabled body.


not really seperate, its what we pay on most products, they just added a extra 2% for this year ..grmbl..
Intel Core i5 3570K / 3.4 GHz - 4 Cores, € 206,49 (€ 170,65 excl.21% BTW) its still alot..
206 Euros = 271.61 U.S. dollars


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Anypne have skype where it starts up fine... but wont let you log in? login username and password bars are there but wont do anything.....


Uhh... Try a re-install or a newer version maybe? Maybe try a 32/64 bit version if you haven't already...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> They have a separate tax just for PC parts? Really? That should be taken out or something. That deserves a Civil War!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't mind disabled, remember the difference between the Lazy able body and the disabled body.


Yeah, disabled is fair enough. But yes 21% is crazy! It's just fixed tax here, the only thing that is taxed more is fuel and stuff that needs it. I.E Stuff that would harm the environment or government servies. (Ciggarettes)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Anypne have skype where it starts up fine... but wont let you log in? login username and password bars are there but wont do anything.....


Yes, mine works fine.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Just to clarify I know a guy who is "Clinically depressed" so he gets along the lines of $700+ a fortnight for doing nothing. Whereas me, I'd get $250 a fortnight because I don't have any problems.. A friend is classed as a "Disability" because he can't smell (Since birth). It's actually so bad and unfair, I'm not complaining i'm just stating there politics here is messed up. Anyway yes, back onto de-lidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! If you are mad about that, think of it at least it's in education. In America, we give handouts to people who have no desire to be independent. Are you kidding me? So much money being funneled down to the lazy. The reason why we even have a capitalist economy is that so everyone is trying their best to be the best. If you give handouts, you take away the drive. Anyway, that's probably why I'm against the 20 million people that just got added to the welfare list.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever, what's done is done!
> Rant over!!! No politics in OCN!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I have a serious problem with this sort of Welfare / Unemployment insurance. I cannot fathom of taking money from the government when I don't truly need it.
> 
> I have been out of a job since early December but did not collect unemployment insurance which would have paid 50% of my wage I believe. Why? Because I don't *need* it. I like to believe that if we only took that which we need, we could have a much better world.
> 
> The people who take money like you're saying, and spend it for themselves... it saddens me. No, it doesn't sicken or anger me. It just saddens me. It saddens me that people would benefit themselves before the world.
Click to expand...

Yea, I agree. To make it not as much OT, it's like a delidded chip asking for more CLP when it *CLEARLY DOES NOT NEED IT!*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> They have a separate tax just for PC parts? Really? That should be taken out or something. That deserves a Civil War!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't mind disabled, remember the difference between the Lazy able body and the disabled body.


Yeah, disabled is fair enough. But yes 21% is crazy! It's just fixed tax here, the only thing that is taxed more is fuel and stuff that needs it. I.E Stuff that would harm the environment or government servies. (Ciggarettes)[/quote]

Okay, that would really need a coup or something. That's just plainly too high! I mean, I already hate paying 10% sales tax, doubling it would anger me to the point I'd start just travelling to other countries to buy them. (Places with no tax)


----------



## VonDutch

well, one thing ive learned here, is to ask one of you living in the states,
to buy the more little parts like ram, cpu, ssd for me, and ship it here,
it would still be cheaper, even with cost for shipping etc..

newegg
Intel Core i5-3570K $219.99
219 U.S. dollars = 166.09 Euros

cheapest Intel Core i5-3570K over here,€ 207,49
207 Euros = 272.92 dollar

about 40 euro difference, 40 Euros = 52.74 U.S. dollars

enough money for shipping, gets even better if you can find a good offer/rebate etc,
a combo deal, if anyone needs a mobo, then ill take the cpu... LOL


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, one thing ive learned here, is to ask one of you living in the states,
> to buy the more little parts like ram, cpu, ssd for me, and ship it here,
> it would still be cheaper, even with cost for shipping etc..
> newegg
> Intel Core i5-3570K $219.99
> 219 U.S. dollars = 166.09 Euros
> cheapest Intel Core i5-3570K over here,€ 207,49
> 207 Euros = 272.92 dollar
> about 40 euro difference, 40 Euros = 52.74 U.S. dollars
> enough money for shipping, gets even better if you can find a good offer/rebate etc..


It gets even better. Microcenter has it for $160


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, one thing ive learned here, is to ask one of you living in the states,
> to buy the more little parts like ram, cpu, ssd for me, and ship it here,
> it would still be cheaper, even with cost for shipping etc..
> 
> newegg
> Intel Core i5-3570K $219.99
> 219 U.S. dollars = 166.09 Euros
> 
> cheapest Intel Core i5-3570K over here,€ 207,49
> 207 Euros = 272.92 dollar
> 
> about 40 euro difference, 40 Euros = 52.74 U.S. dollars
> 
> enough money for shipping, gets even better if you can find a good offer/rebate etc..


Actually, if it's just a CPU, then you can just take it out of the box and put it in one of those manila envelopes and send it for cheaper. It'll weigh about 2 pounds so the price will be really cheap.


----------



## Swag

In one of those envelopes, a shipment from California to Netherlands would be only $17.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Anypne have skype where it starts up fine... but wont let you log in? login username and password bars are there but wont do anything.....


no problem here, restarted a comp a few times when messing with it, it logged in every time in past few hours no trouble.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not really seperate, its what we pay on most products, they just added a extra 2% for this year ..grmbl..
> Intel Core i5 3570K / 3.4 GHz - 4 Cores, € 206,49 (€ 170,65 excl.21% BTW) its still alot..
> 206 Euros = 271.61 U.S. dollars


21% tax? are you referring to VAT (Value Added Tax)? yeah it sucks ... Used to live in Poland, moved out from there like 8 years ago, because everything was too expensive for me and wages were way too low ... I heard Poland increased VAT recently to 23% ... how lame is that ... whoever invented VAT should serve a life sentence in prison ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, that would really need a coup or something. That's just plainly too high! I mean, I already hate paying 10% sales tax, doubling it would anger me to the point I'd start just travelling to other countries to buy them. (Places with no tax)


it's 23% in my former home country in EU ... imagine buying a new import car over there ... paying customs fees for it and then ... nearly 1/4 of it's value to the government because they are so awesome [email protected]#$%^&


----------



## PCWargamer

Cool! I finally got to the end of the back-log of posts - so I can post!







And its not that I mind as there is so much good stuff to read!

So *Valgaur*, I also like the idea of this being a club for us to hang out in - with delidding (for low temps to OC & bench) being the reason we ended up here. The delidding was/is cool, but it is a means to an end - to make our IBs and systems perform better.

And the "OT" stuff is also about this too. And we have ended up collecting a bunch of OCers here who know lots good stuff on lots of OC topics that are here to share what they know. And this is the first place I go to if I have a tough question - as others here know to do too. We always find someone here to help.









And we are always on top of and ready to help anyone who needs help with delidding. We also have lots of good delidding info already stored on the first page of the thread. So I am with the others who feel the thread is fine continuing to allow all the other topics surrounding what we all love to do!

And a thanks to all of the crew of OCers who come here to hang out and help others to delid and more as needed!!! You guys are the best and make this thread what it is!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> 21% tax? are you referring to VAT (Value Added Tax)? yeah it sucks ... Used to live in Poland, moved out from there like 8 years ago, because everything was too expensive for me and wages were way too low ... I heard Poland increased VAT recently to 23% ... how lame is that ... whoever invented VAT should serve a life sentence in prison ...
> it's 23% in my former home country in EU ... imagine buying a new import car over there ... paying customs fees for it and then ... nearly 1/4 of it's value to the government because they are so awesome [email protected]#$%^&


i think its the same yes, we call it BTW (Belasting op de Toegevoegde Waarde) they just upped it by 2%
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> In one of those envelopes, a shipment from California to Netherlands would be only $17.


my man!! ..thats great..yea, ivan offered to help me out too,
think its about the same where he lives , to send it here, thanks, will keep it in mind for my next build








wasnt a member here yet, when i build this one, wished i was tho..could have saved me money for sure..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> In one of those envelopes, a shipment from California to Netherlands would be only $17.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my man!! ..thats great..yea, ivan offered to help me out too,
> think its about the same where he lives , to send it here, thanks, will keep it in mind for my next build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wasnt a member here yet, when i build this one, wished i was tho..could have saved me money for sure..
Click to expand...

Might be better if ivan helped you out. Really unfamiliar with sending overseas.







I haven't done it at all other than sending these boxes that just go straight to a company that does all the work for me!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Cool! I finally got to the end of the back-log of posts - so I can post!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And its not that I mind as there is so much good stuff to read!
> So *Valgaur*, I also like the idea of this being a club for us to hang out in - with delidding (for low temps to OC & bench) being the reason we ended up here. The delidding was/is cool, but it is a means to an end - to make our IBs and systems perform better.
> And the "OT" stuff is also about this too. And we have ended up collecting a bunch of OCers here who know lots good stuff on lots of OC topics that are here to share what they know. And this is the first place I go to if I have a tough question - as others here know to do too. We always find someone here to help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And we are always on top of and ready to help anyone who needs help with delidding. We also have lots of good delidding info already stored on the first page of the thread. So I am with the others who feel the thread is fine continuing to allow all the other topics surrounding what we all love to do!
> And a thanks to all of the crew of OCers who come here to hang out and help others to delid and more as needed!!! You guys are the best and make this thread what it is!


to be honest, me being *cough*Vice-Captain*cough* here was sharing my concern with Val
about the thread sometimes going way off, or off topic.. this doesnt come from Val alone, just so you know

its something someone said a while ago, reading through our thread,
"ive been reading hundreds of posts here, but only 10% where really about delidding, this thread scks bla bla"..

but weve talked about it as crew members now, its safe to say, we dont change anything,
we are a club, in da clubhouse any topic can be adressed









case closed?









thats why we have page 1 also,
if you guys can take a look at it again,
see if it can be improved somehow, with tips, or to make it a easier read etc,
input is welcome, i like to see some more spoilers opened up?
people like to see/read things right away, withput clicking first, that i do know..
spoiler in spoiler, then click another link to a post related to the subject etc. not easy..

peeps say, "yea, been reading everything" and then ask questions that are answered on page 1 ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Might be better if ivan helped you out. Really unfamiliar with sending overseas.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't done it at all other than sending these boxes that just go straight to a company that does all the work for me!


lol.. no problem, ivan knows how to, thanks anyways


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yw, im sure we can figure something out if needed,
> but you could try order first from their website,
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop/


paypal is easy


----------



## King4x4

This chip is amazing!

U Mirin lads?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> This chip is amazing!
> U Mirin lads?


Mine did 5.2 at a lower vcore than that







, but any 5.0Ghz is sweet. Nicely done







.


----------



## Leyaena

I wouldn't exactly call 1.54V amazing, but it's nice you can get to 5GHz either way.
Personally wouldn't run it 24/7 at that voltage though...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Mine did 5.2 at a lower vcore than that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , but any 5.0Ghz is sweet. Nicely done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


after seeing your chip no chip is that good anything over that is bad lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> after seeing your chip no chip is that good anything over that is bad lol


Haha touché







.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> This chip is amazing!
> U Mirin lads?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


mine is only a 3570k thou


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> mine is only a 3570k thou


That chip is sick chronic. What vcore does it take you to reach 5.0Ghz?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> That chip is sick chronic. What vcore does it take you to reach 5.0Ghz?


i can boot into windows at 1.325v. i cant really get 5ghz stable since i only tested a few times but i ran 5ghz for 7-8 hrs of prime till it crashed @1.385v. and if i raise my vcore higher to like 1.420v it crashes even quicker


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i can boot into windows at 1.325v. i cant really get 5ghz stable since i only tested a few times but i ran 5ghz for 7-8 hrs of prime till it crashed @1.385v. and if i raise my vcore higher to like 1.420v it crashes even quicker


Interesting. And when you go above 1.42?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I would...it's running cool.









As for the international shipping, private couriers are a no go, just remember that. Express or priority is fine for most stuff (express only for bigger stuff)

Use www.sidewindercomputers.com for Liquid Pro, and select USPS Priority. bingo


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i can boot into windows at 1.325v. i cant really get 5ghz stable since i only tested a few times but i ran 5ghz for 7-8 hrs of prime till it crashed @1.385v. and if i raise my vcore higher to like 1.420v it crashes even quicker


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Interesting. And when you go above 1.42?


yea, makes me wonder too,
could it be something else messing it up?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, makes me wonder too,
> could it be something else messing it up?


i think that it could be my mobo i have the asrock extreme 4 but im not sure. i quess i need to wait till by bro gets the UP7 and ill slap my chip in that beast. maybe i wont slap it it but but n know







nicely


----------



## JQuantum

Weird question for you guys... after delidding and such, my chip has the oddest temperature spread

Idle at 0.92V it's 40-30-30-40 more or less, however, after some linx or w.e loading for IBT or Prime95 one of those those odd tests it goes to 70-86-86-80 at 1.345v (46 x 100). I don't have a good stock comparison but this is just weird isn't it (for day to day tasks it never exceeds 65 on any core btw so I'm thinking of making this my 24/7).

It's also really weird b/c if I run regular stuff and things like wPrime my cores are all within +/- 2C of each other. 61-61-61-61 to 61-63-64-62. Which is pretty good.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i think that it could be my mobo i have the asrock extreme 4 but im not sure. i quess i need to wait till by bro gets the UP7 and ill slap my chip in that beast. maybe i wont slap it it but but n know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nicely


yea, i had that on mind too,
UP7







..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Weird question for you guys... after delidding and such, my chip has the oddest temperature spread
> Idle at 0.92V it's 40-30-30-40 more or less, however, after some linx or w.e loading for IBT or Prime95 one of those those odd tests it goes to 70-86-86-80 at 1.345v (46 x 100). I don't have a good stock comparison but this is just weird isn't it (for day to day tasks it never exceeds 65 on any core btw so I'm thinking of making this my 24/7).
> It's also really weird b/c if I run regular stuff and things like wPrime my cores are all within +/- 2C of each other. 61-61-61-61 to 61-63-64-62. Which is pretty good.


load temps are more important then idle,
but 70-86-86-80 at load, looks like to big difference to me, 16C
i would trust the temps from running IBT and prime more tho,
higher load temps give more difference ..
did you try reseat your cooler?

at idle some cores can still do some work in the background, a service in windows thats checking something etc,


----------



## Hokies83

Anybody want a Cosmos 2 200$ shipped anywhere in the USA? Has a side window.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> load temps are more important then idle,
> but 70-86-86-80 at load, looks like to big difference to me, 16C
> i would trust the temps from running IBT and prime more tho,
> higher load temps give more difference ..
> did you try reseat your cooler?
> at idle some cores can still do some work in the background, a service in windows thats checking something etc,


I've reseated a bunch of times the last one I just did should be the best seating and it's tight. The only thing I can do at this point is take the retaining bracket on the motherboard off and do either direct die, since I'm still unsure the die is getting a good even spread.

I'll try direct die later on only because my a-typical usage doesn't include benching or using prime, but the 16 degree spread under prime/IBT is disturbing lol. Is there any cause for alarm though? like is having a spread like that bad ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I've reseated a bunch of times the last one I just did should be the best seating and it's tight. The only thing I can do at this point is take the retaining bracket on the motherboard off and do either direct die, since I'm still unsure the die is getting a good even spread.
> I'll try direct die later on only because my a-typical usage doesn't include benching or using prime, but the 16 degree spread under prime/IBT is disturbing lol. Is there any cause for alarm though? like is having a spread like that bad ?


yea, if i had that, i would surely try to do something about it,
one of the last things i would try, is a direct die tho ...lol
i didnt see your cooler in your sig..
did you check if anything is concave?

no , its not bad, only if you hit to high temps on a core, or cores,
its just that 16C difference under load for a delidded chip is to much,
4-8C is more like it, what we see around here after delid..

o, i just noticed, we past 100,000 views! ...LOL


----------



## 8bitclocker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Mine did 5.2 at a lower vcore than that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , but any 5.0Ghz is sweet. Nicely done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Also looked at your 5.5ghz validation.....only 1.616v vcore. God chip much?


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, if i had that, i would surely try to do something about it,
> one of the last things i would try, is a direct die tho ...lol
> i didnt see your cooler in your sig..
> did you check if anything is concave?
> no , its not bad, only if you hit to high temps on a core, or cores,
> its just that 16C difference under load for a delidded chip is to much,
> 4-8C is more like it, what we see around here after delid..
> o, i just noticed, we past 100,000 views! ...LOL


I'm using a now modded H100i, but it was the same for stock under stock after delid, and with the h100i unmodded. The H100i is bolted via individual M4 screws so I might just be me, but it was suffered issues prior to this. I've lapped both the IHS top, and bottom. I didn't really do the H100i copper piece though, but it doesn't look concave.

oh I had to stop using the LiquidPro, and using AS5 since it's thicker and easier to reapply quickly. The LP always gives me a nails on chalkboard feeling when I have to remove it, so I use a cotton swab with alcohol when I do (comes off quick if you do it this way).


----------



## Belial

I plan to buy an i5 next week and just delid it first thing (it should make it easier, as it wont have a huge nh-d14 sitting on it making the glue harder to cut through).

will just get some single sided razors at cvs for it. dont have any liquids so just will be using pk-3.


----------



## tw33k

I just bought an Acer Iconia W700. It runs an i5-3317U. Reckon I could open it up and de-lid the chip?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I plan to buy an i5 next week and just delid it first thing (it should make it easier, as it wont have a huge nh-d14 sitting on it making the glue harder to cut through).
> will just get some single sided razors at cvs for it. dont have any liquids so just will be using pk-3.


I had mine d14 on the chip for over a month before delidding, so the razor was nice cuz is really thin and flexible.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> I just bought an Acer Iconia W700. It runs an i5-3317U. Reckon I could open it up and de-lid the chip?


it's not like your going to overcock your laptop so why in the world would you delid it? Way too much risk to be worth it... there are better things you can do to drop temps.
Quote:


> I had mine d14 on the chip for over a month before delidding, so the razor was nice cuz is really thin and flexible.


Im sure it's possible but I'm just gonna delid it first thing.

On a side note, what's the deal with ram voltage on i5 system? Sorry, I come from AMD where there isn't any connection between the two, I just raised my ram voltage to 1.8v and maxed it out (ram is cheap, and 1.7-1.8 is considered generally the highest 24/7 limit, so 1.8 is a little bit extreme for 24/7 but whatever). Like it's okay to overvolt ram as long as you raise some other voltage within .5v of it? Hard to find a straight answer with a bunch of idiots saying "dont overvolt ram ever!" on search results on TH and such.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *8bitclocker*
> 
> Also looked at your 5.5ghz validation.....only 1.616v vcore. God chip much?


Yea I guess it was pretty godly







.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> it's not like your going to overcock your laptop so why in the world would you delid it? Way too much risk to be worth it... there are better things you can do to drop temps.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> I can't believe you thought I was serious (didn't you see the wink?) It won't have an IHS to remove anyway. I might open it up and see if I can clean off the paste and add some Liquid Ultra
Click to expand...


----------



## Hokies83

Wow Case labs is the best...

There making a 120mm roof for me @[email protected]

For my TH10..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I guess it was pretty godly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


if i had that i dont think i would of let it go for nothing under 500$


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I plan to buy an i5 next week and just delid it first thing (it should make it easier, as it wont have a huge nh-d14 sitting on it making the glue harder to cut through).
> will just get some single sided razors at cvs for it. dont have any liquids so just will be using pk-3.


Cool, go for it man! You can always buy some Liquid Pro from sidewindercomputers.com and voila.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I just bought an Acer Iconia W700. It runs an i5-3317U. Reckon I could open it up and de-lid the chip?


xD Perhaps it's already a direct die mount (?) Intel was known to do that for mobile chips in the past...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> it's not like your going to overcock your laptop so why in the world would you delid it? Way too much risk to be worth it... there are better things you can do to drop temps.
> Im sure it's possible but I'm just gonna delid it first thing.
> On a side note, what's the deal with ram voltage on i5 system? Sorry, I come from AMD where there isn't any connection between the two, I just raised my ram voltage to 1.8v and maxed it out (ram is cheap, and 1.7-1.8 is considered generally the highest 24/7 limit, so 1.8 is a little bit extreme for 24/7 but whatever). Like it's okay to overvolt ram as long as you raise some other voltage within .5v of it? Hard to find a straight answer with a bunch of idiots saying "dont overvolt ram ever!" on search results on TH and such.


You can overvolt ram no prob, thing is for 24/7 the imc might suffer a bit if you push it past 1.75v, and depends on the ram chip if it will scale with volts or not.
Give it a try see how far it goes with your desired voltage to see if it's worth it. Try a notch lower vdimm and see if it gets to the same oc, not such a big deal really.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> if i had that i dont think i would of let it go for nothing under 500$


I wouldn't sell it...period. xD


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't sell it...period. xD


We all have different priorities and bragging rights isn't high on the list for me







.


----------



## tw33k

It would be a direct mount I'd reckon. I might see if I can replace the paste with some Liquid Ultra. The tablet has fans but apparently it still gets "warm" I guess I'll wait and see


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Just got home and see that my mulimeter arrived. Can someone point me to a thread/guide on how to use one to test my voltages? Never used one before.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just got home and see that my mulimeter arrived. Can someone point me to a thread/guide on how to use one to test my voltages? Never used one before.


http://www.wikihow.com/Use-a-Multimeter


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> http://www.wikihow.com/Use-a-Multimeter


Thanks, but any guides specifically with measuring voltages on a motherboard? I'm not even sure how I'm going to reach my VRM's inside my case.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Thanks, but any guides specifically with measuring voltages on a motherboard? I'm not even sure how I'm going to reach my VRM's inside my case.


some boards have easy reading contact points close to edge, usually near the 24-pin socket. refer to your manual, I'd use only those read points and nothing else, you don't want to short things out and go shopping for a new board ... and CPU possibly too...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> some boards have easy reading contact points close to edge, usually near the 24-pin socket. refer to your manual, I'd use only those read points and nothing else, you don't want to short things out and go shopping for a new board ... and CPU possibly too...


Thanks I'll make sure I check my manual.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> We all have different priorities and bragging rights isn't high on the list for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I was stating my point of view, I WOULD sell my gtx 670 ftw though, cause gaming is not my priority nor bragging rights, but benching and competing at hwbot.org.








I owe my team mates so much, a great bunch of fellas...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just got home and see that my mulimeter arrived. Can someone point me to a thread/guide on how to use one to test my voltages? Never used one before.


http://www.multimeterwarehouse.com/usingamultimeter.htm

You can begin by testing your psu:

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/guides/testingPSU/


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was stating my point of view, I WOULD sell my gtx 670 ftw though, cause gaming is not my priority nor bragging rights, but benching and competing at hwbot.org.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I owe my team mates so much, a great bunch of fellas...
> http://www.multimeterwarehouse.com/usingamultimeter.htm
> You can begin by testing your psu:
> http://www.hardwareheaven.com/guides/testingPSU/


My gtx 670 ftw oc's to1359/3550mhz
im not selling it either i love it


----------



## ivanlabrie

hehehe, thing is I need the money, and I need a 775 ddr3 benching board, and money to pay my ln2 pot shipping cost (a team mate is giving me his Dragon F1 for free







), plus I owe 1200usd to the bank. And I only have a 1280x960 CRT atm, and no money for a better 1080p ips led monitor.
Gotta save for a custom loop, and I'd rather spend the money on that over the course of the year instead of spending money on gaming gear which will lead me to spend even MORE money in the long run.
(If I stick to the low res monitor I can game with my hd4000 and afford the other benching upgrades and paying off part of my debt.)


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was stating my point of view, I WOULD sell my gtx 670 ftw though, cause gaming is not my priority nor bragging rights, but benching and competing at hwbot.org.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I owe my team mates so much, a great bunch of fellas...
> http://www.multimeterwarehouse.com/usingamultimeter.htm
> You can begin by testing your psu:
> http://www.hardwareheaven.com/guides/testingPSU/


Thanks ivan for the links







.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> it's not like your going to overcock your laptop so why in the world would you delid it? Way too much risk to be worth it... there are better things you can do to drop temps.
> Im sure it's possible but I'm just gonna delid it first thing.
> On a side note, what's the deal with ram voltage on i5 system? Sorry, I come from AMD where there isn't any connection between the two, I just raised my ram voltage to 1.8v and maxed it out (ram is cheap, and 1.7-1.8 is considered generally the highest 24/7 limit, so 1.8 is a little bit extreme for 24/7 but whatever). Like it's okay to overvolt ram as long as you raise some other voltage within .5v of it? Hard to find a straight answer with a bunch of idiots saying "dont overvolt ram ever!" on search results on TH and such.


With x58 (never had an 1156 rig so didn't read up to see if it is the same), the IMC/VTT voltage had to be within 0.5V of the vdimm. So 1.8V on the memory should have at least 1.3V on the IMC.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I just bought an Acer Iconia W700. It runs an i5-3317U. Reckon I could open it up and de-lid the chip?


They dont have IHS's, put should still put some ultra or pro on it!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just got home and see that my mulimeter arrived. Can someone point me to a thread/guide on how to use one to test my voltages? Never used one before.


What motherboard? I taught myself how to do this a few weeks ago, I could help, maybe we'll do it by PM? PM me if you still need help!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> They dont have IHS's, put should still put some ultra or pro on it!!
> What motherboard? I taught myself how to do this a few weeks ago, I could help, maybe we'll do it by PM? PM me if you still need help!


ASRock Extreme4. Don't see any useful info in the manual about it.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> ASRock Extreme4. Don't see any useful info in the manual about it.


Well typically you can check your vCore from a VRM or MOFSET close to the CPU socket. On my P8Z77-V PRO I was able to get accurate readings from these contacts...



You need to be sure that the grounding probe (typically the black one) is properly grounded. What I do is stick it in one of the middle two prongs of a spare molex plug. Some people just ground it against their case. I find that if I stick it in the molex I have one more free hand.

Also you do run a risk of shorting the board or components, and this will happen if you manage to touch multiple contacts with the red probe. So just use a steady hand and try to make good contact with one of the mofset or VRM motherboard contacts.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> They dont have IHS's, put should still put some ultra or pro on it!!
> What motherboard? I taught myself how to do this a few weeks ago, I could help, maybe we'll do it by PM? PM me if you still need help!


If they don't have an ihs they will benefit greatly from LP on die







(15c temp drops or more lol)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> ASRock Extreme4. Don't see any useful info in the manual about it.


That could mean it doesn't have specific voltage read points, you might have to do it the old fashioned way.


----------



## stickg1

DUDES!!! MAMA STICK IS GONNA HOOK IT UP!!!

Okay, so my mom is going up to Tennessee to see her mother (we are in South Carolina), and in order to get there she has to go through Atlanta. So I jokingly told her to just pop into Micro Center and grab me a new i5-3570K and ASRock Extreme6. Well after I explained to her what those things were, she asked where it (Micro Center) was and it just so happens to be on the way of where she is going and she has seen the building before!! So she agreed to pick me up a chip and CPU and it will run me only $300!!!! So I pre-ordered and have it all ready for her to pick up on Sunday!

Hopefully I get a much better chip than this first one that needs 1.41v for 4.5GHz and I can RMA this faulty ASUS P8Z77-V Pro...


----------



## feniks

quick OT question ... if my rig sometimes shuts down on its own at idle (once or twice a day so far) and then the power button is unresponsive until I power cycle the rocker switch on PSU ... does it mean the PSU is going out? as far as I can tell all voltages are normal when it runs (checked with multimeter via various plugs also with thin backprobe leads on hot terminals). it's a 9 month old Thermaltake ToughPower Grand 1050M.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> quick OT question ... if my rig sometimes shuts down on its own at idle (once or twice a day so far) and then the power button is unresponsive until I power cycle the rocker switch on PSU ... does it mean the PSU is going out? as far as I can tell all voltages are normal when it runs (checked with multimeter via various plugs also with thin backprobe leads on hot terminals). it's a 9 month old Thermaltake ToughPower Grand 1050M.


I had that issue twice in my lifetime and once it was PSU and another time it was a motherboard issue. Sorry for the vague answer but I would try to switch out the PSU first and see if that works.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> DUDES!!! MAMA STICK IS GONNA HOOK IT UP!!!
> 
> Okay, so my mom is going up to Tennessee to see her mother (we are in South Carolina), and in order to get there she has to go through Atlanta. So I jokingly told her to just pop into Micro Center and grab me a new i5-3570K and ASRock Extreme6. Well after I explained to her what those things were, she asked where it (Micro Center) was and it just so happens to be on the way of where she is going and she has seen the building before!! So she agreed to pick me up a chip and CPU and it will run me only $300!!!! So I pre-ordered and have it all ready for her to pick up on Sunday!
> 
> Hopefully I get a much better chip than this first one that needs 1.41v for 4.5GHz and I can RMA this faulty ASUS P8Z77-V Pro...


Good job! Now ask her if she could buy me a 3770k and some new SSDs.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> DUDES!!! MAMA STICK IS GONNA HOOK IT UP!!!
> Okay, so my mom is going up to Tennessee to see her mother (we are in South Carolina), and in order to get there she has to go through Atlanta. So I jokingly told her to just pop into Micro Center and grab me a new i5-3570K and ASRock Extreme6. Well after I explained to her what those things were, she asked where it (Micro Center) was and it just so happens to be on the way of where she is going and she has seen the building before!! So she agreed to pick me up a chip and CPU and it will run me only $300!!!! So I pre-ordered and have it all ready for her to pick up on Sunday!
> Hopefully I get a much better chip than this first one that needs 1.41v for 4.5GHz and I can RMA this faulty ASUS P8Z77-V Pro...


Sick! I'm going to MC tomorrow myself, glad you're able to take advantage of their great deals







.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just got home and see that my mulimeter arrived. Can someone point me to a thread/guide on how to use one to test my voltages? Never used one before.


Sorry if someone already helped but this shows where to test vcore...
http://www.overclock.net/t/1318629/asrock-z77-extreme4-vcore-voltage-reading-points#post_18436045


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> DUDES!!! MAMA STICK IS GONNA HOOK IT UP!!!
> Okay, so my mom is going up to Tennessee to see her mother (we are in South Carolina), and in order to get there she has to go through Atlanta. So I jokingly told her to just pop into Micro Center and grab me a new i5-3570K and ASRock Extreme6. Well after I explained to her what those things were, she asked where it (Micro Center) was and it just so happens to be on the way of where she is going and she has seen the building before!! So she agreed to pick me up a chip and CPU and it will run me only $300!!!! So I pre-ordered and have it all ready for her to pick up on Sunday!
> Hopefully I get a much better chip than this first one that needs 1.41v for 4.5GHz and I can RMA this faulty ASUS P8Z77-V Pro...


Good luck man! That board seems pretty decent.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> quick OT question ... if my rig sometimes shuts down on its own at idle (once or twice a day so far) and then the power button is unresponsive until I power cycle the rocker switch on PSU ... does it mean the PSU is going out? as far as I can tell all voltages are normal when it runs (checked with multimeter via various plugs also with thin backprobe leads on hot terminals). it's a 9 month old Thermaltake ToughPower Grand 1050M.


I think it's most likely the psu, Tt units tend to suck (save for a few Toughpower XT units)
I normally skip Tt products myself








Doubt it's the board, but perhaps you can try flashing another bios, the beta bioses found at kingpincooling.com are the best.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Sick! I'm going to MC tomorrow myself, glad you're able to take advantage of their great deals
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


A friend lives pretty close to the one in Richardson. So I can get cheap stuff too...got my MVG there with the discount, and he got a 3570k with the combo lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Sorry if someone already helped but this shows where to test vcore...
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1318629/asrock-z77-extreme4-vcore-voltage-reading-points#post_18436045


Thank you very much!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Thank you very much!


no problem, as something to consider.... for my board, at idle software to digital multimeter was dead on. as the I overclocked higher and used more vcore the more "off" the software voltage became.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> no problem, as something to consider.... for my board, at idle software to digital multimeter was dead on. as the I overclocked higher and used more vcore the more "off" the software voltage became.


From that link you posted, it looks like I'd need to take my motherboard out to make contact with those pins on the back end of it. Is this the case? I don't see any other way I'm going to get to those contacts.

*EDIT:* I'm an idiot forgetting I can access that part of the motherboard by taking the ride side of my case off







.

So am I grounding the black probe and then touching one of the metal tips with the red to test the voltage while the CPU is on load or as it says in that link you gave me touching one of the metal tips with the black probe and touching it's pair with the red?


----------



## ivanlabrie

You mean ground? You can use whatever gnd contact you like really...I have 0 experience with the likes of the Extreme 4 though. All my z77 mobos were idiot proof


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Awww hell Stick, have your Mom pick up a 3770k for me too. I'm 3 hours away (6 hrs. round trip) from a MC....

Delid ver. 2.0





I'm seriously not going through all the trouble of draining my loop, taking everything apart, reassembling & refilling, testing, and then taking it back apart again to delid. Keep your fingers crossed that this ones a decent overclocker mates.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Awww hell Stick, have your Mom pick up a 3770k for me too. I'm 3 hours away (6 hrs. round trip) from a MC.
> 
> Delid ver. 2.0
> 
> 
> I'm seriously not going through all the trouble of draining my loop, taking everything apart, reassembling & refilling, testing, and then taking it back apart again to delid. Keep your fingers crossed that this ones a decent overclocker mates.


You didn't test your OC before delidding?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I had that issue twice in my lifetime and once it was PSU and another time it was a motherboard issue. Sorry for the vague answer but I would try to switch out the PSU first and see if that works.


I had lots of issues with PSUs in my life, but that mostly at work. here I used a few Tt units and only W0132RU gave me a headache when I tried using it on z68 ftw + 2600k ... had to RMA the PSU and replacement unit lasted 5 hours LOL! then RMA'd again and recived the model I have now, was trouble free for 9 months ...

problem is in my current setup it's a royal PITA to swap the PSU, so if I do that I will most likely buy a better PSU and stay with it, because I have to drain the loop and disconnect the front rad in order to pull the PSU out...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good luck man! That board seems pretty decent.
> I think it's most likely the psu, Tt units tend to suck (save for a few Toughpower XT units)
> I normally skip Tt products myself
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Doubt it's the board, but perhaps you can try flashing another bios, the beta bioses found at kingpincooling.com are the best.
> A friend lives pretty close to the one in Richardson. So I can get cheap stuff too...got my MVG there with the discount, and he got a 3570k with the combo lol


I'm too 99% sure it's the PSU, since this is the part I need to power cycle so Power Button starts working ... kinda hard to imagine it would be caused by the MB, since it has power at standby (afte one of such shutdowns), I just can't boot up like the Power button was disconnected, nothing happens when I press it (until I cycle the PSU).

will try one of those beta BIOSes I think, if I can find those over there ... or will try a known good 704 BIOS to see if that happens again, I keep it on BIOS2 position so I can always fall back to it when there is a problem with latest one on BIOS1 position.

also wondering if running AIDA64 in background might have something to do with it ... I unloaded it for time being and trying to see if that happens again without it on same PSU and same BIOS.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> You didn't test your OC before delidding?


Nope.jpg I don't have any board but my z77e-itx, nor a compatible air cooler to test with. The only air cooler, aside from the OEM pos, I have anymore, is an old S775 Tuniq Tower which has been in my junk parts bin for about 4 forevers.







I've been under water for years, and up until this build, AMD only since P3. No compatible water blocks either.

Take a look at my Prodigy build, and you'll see why I chose to delid first. It's no fun taking that apart, or putting it back together.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> You didn't test your OC before delidding?
> 
> 
> 
> Nope.jpg I don't have any board but my z77e-itx, nor a compatible air cooler to test with. The only air cooler, aside from the OEM pos, I have anymore, is an old S775 Tuniq Tower which has been in my junk parts bin for about 4 forevers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been under water for years, and up until this build, AMD only since P3. No compatible water blocks either.
> 
> Take a look at my Prodigy build, and you'll see why I chose to delid first. It's no fun taking that apart, or putting it back together.
Click to expand...

Raven, mind posting some nice pics of your Prodigy? I've always wanted to make a sexy ITX build and there's finally a case for it. My dad is looking for an HTPC so that might be the perfect excuse.


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Raven, mind posting some nice pics of your Prodigy? I've always wanted to make a sexy ITX build and there's finally a case for it. My dad is looking for an HTPC so that might be the perfect excuse.


Certainly







Always happy to help out







Don't mind the WIP pics, it's not finished by a long shot.















I have a couple extra of the black ones, to help out those that need parts (or modded parts). Since Bitfenix doesn't sell replacements and all that jazz.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Raven, mind posting some nice pics of your Prodigy? I've always wanted to make a sexy ITX build and there's finally a case for it. My dad is looking for an HTPC so that might be the perfect excuse.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Certainly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Always happy to help out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't mind the WIP pics, it's not finished by a long shot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a couple extra of the black ones, to help out those that need parts (or modded parts). Since Bitfenix doesn't sell replacements and all that jazz.
Click to expand...

That looks beautiful.







I'd tuck in the cables a bit more but that looks sexy. I want to do one in a white Prodigy. Whenever my dad mentions he wants an HTPC, I'll run this by him.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> From that link you posted, it looks like I'd need to take my motherboard out to make contact with those pins on the back end of it. Is this the case? I don't see any other way I'm going to get to those contacts.
> *EDIT:* I'm an idiot forgetting I can access that part of the motherboard by taking the ride side of my case off
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> So am I grounding the black probe and then touching one of the metal tips with the red to test the voltage while the CPU is on load or as it says in that link you gave me touching one of the metal tips with the black probe and touching it's pair with the red?


as it says on the link.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bad idea...not testing it before.
Also, no discussion of forbidden R M @ thingies here guys, keep it clean and follow the TOS


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That looks beautiful.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd tuck in the cables a bit more but that looks sexy. I want to do one in a white Prodigy. Whenever my dad mentions he wants an HTPC, I'll run this by him.


Thanks, I intend to very shortly. I had just finished rewiring the 24 pin after cutting to the exact length in those shots. I was just eager to get it up and running at that point. I'll be tucking it in an hour or so, once I get the mobo & cpu swapped out. I have to pull the drive cage to do that, and the 840 Pro sitting up on top of the cage isn't exactly easy to disconnect from the SATA & power cables.









Back to the question of the UV/Black vs. UV/Clear tubing. I think I might just stick with the UV/Clear, because the UV/Black looks...well, bad when under a black light. A bit of a grungy looking dark blue which the cfl's have to be reeeally close to, in order to get a reaction. My son likes it on his computer, but me? Not so much.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That looks beautiful.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd tuck in the cables a bit more but that looks sexy. I want to do one in a white Prodigy. Whenever my dad mentions he wants an HTPC, I'll run this by him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks, I intend to very shortly. I had just finished rewiring the 24 pin after cutting to the exact length in those shots. I was just eager to get it up and running at that point. I'll be tucking it in an hour or so, once I get the mobo & cpu swapped out. I have to pull the drive cage to do that, and the 840 Pro sitting up on top of the cage isn't exactly easy to disconnect from the SATA & power cables.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Back to the question of the UV/Black vs. UV/Clear tubing. I think I might just stick with the UV/Clear, because the UV/Black looks...well, bad when under a black light. A bit of a grungy looking dark blue which the cfl's have to be reeeally close to, in order to get a reaction. My son likes it on his computer, but me? Not so much.
Click to expand...

Yea, the UV/clear sounds like a better choice to me. Also, I'm finally going to be able to learn how to sleeve.







I'll be ordering paracord or something like that and I just bought a heatgun!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Awesome Swag! I have yet to do that...Might be a good idea cause my TX750 cables are kinda wonky, a couple of them have tape covering some sleeving attempt or something lol (bought it used for dirt cheap and it works)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome Swag! I have yet to do that...Might be a good idea cause my TX750 cables are kinda wonky, a couple of them have tape covering some sleeving attempt or something lol (bought it used for dirt cheap and it works)


Well, if it works, then all's good. I just bought an AX650 which I think performs great for the price I got it ($120). What I hate is that Corsair made it like you have to buy the cables from them. Like the special 24 pin head...


----------



## Valgaur

Intel..... quit giving me and my chip. My dear Franky, the run around.

Sincerely,
A very pissed off customer


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Intel..... quit giving me and my chip. My dear Franky, the run around.
> 
> Sincerely,
> A very pissed off customer


Why, what happened to Franky?


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bad idea...not testing it before.
> Also, no discussion of forbidden R M @ thingies here guys, keep it clean and follow the TOS


Well, I don't really have a choice. No friends w/ an 1155 board capable of oc'ing locally to test it before hand (most of them are on notebooks/ultrabooks/mac pro). I'm in the hole money wise atm, so buying a even a cheap HSF is out of the question until next month. I can't afford to be without my computer because of my business, and I have until Monday to be back up and running at the very latest. So yeah, not a great position to be in, and just making due with what I can.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, the UV/clear sounds like a better choice to me. Also, I'm finally going to be able to learn how to sleeve.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be ordering paracord or something like that and I just bought a heatgun!


When I get it completely wired, I'll put the UV/black up against it for a comparison. Without UV, the black definitely looks better though. Have fun with the sleeving







I just wanted a change, my last 4 systems have been individually sleeved. My old one (my boy's now), is. Except for the main 24 pin & cpu 8 pin, because I wanted to avoid voiding the warranty on the new PPC's Silencer just yet.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why, what happened to Franky?


They lost him..........


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They lost him..........


They WHAT?







<- which is, I'm pretty sure, exactly what you said too.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Crap man, that sucks...or not. Hopefully it will turn out good for you and Franky 2.0
I'll send Pikachu (only name that came to mind for my 3770k xD) to my buddy in Texas for a proper burial ceremony if you know what I mean








Gonna have to wait till I get a new 3770k, but I have my trusty G620 lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, the UV/clear sounds like a better choice to me. Also, I'm finally going to be able to learn how to sleeve.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be ordering paracord or something like that and I just bought a heatgun!
> 
> 
> 
> When I get it completely wired, I'll put the UV/black up against it for a comparison. Without UV, the black definitely looks better though. Have fun with the sleeving
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted a change, my last 4 systems have been individually sleeved. My old one (my boy's now), is. Except for the main 24 pin & cpu 8 pin, because I wanted to avoid voiding the warranty on the new PPC's Silencer just yet.
Click to expand...

Exactly why I opted for a full modular PSU! So much better!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why, what happened to Franky?
> 
> 
> 
> They lost him..........
Click to expand...

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Did you take a picture of the CPU and the package postage? If so, it will be 10x easier to request a replacement and normally, free of charge. And tell them to throw in the express shipping on it, after all, they lost your old chip!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They lost him..........


That might be even better, after the remorse of them losing a customer's $300+ CPU maybe they will rush a new out to you right away.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome Swag! I have yet to do that...Might be a good idea cause my TX750 cables are kinda wonky, a couple of them have tape covering some sleeving attempt or something lol (bought it used for dirt cheap and it works)


you don't have to sleeve the actual PSU wires if there is space in case to hide them. besides, that voids warranty in case you ever needed to replace the PSU. I usually just buy extensions for 24-pin, 8-pin and 6-pins and sleeve those with mdpc-x sleeving and their awesome heatshrink (one of best on the planet, none other has such heatshrinking capabilities).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They lost him..........


that sucks ... have you insured the UPS/Fedex package? claim the insurance then and buy a new chip in Fry's.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They lost him..........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That might be even better, after the remorse of them losing a customer's $300+ CPU maybe they will rush a new out to you right away.
Click to expand...

Yea exactly. They are very good at handling customers and they normally end up adding a lot of extra things. Like in my case, they gave me some Intel things after a supervisor yelled at me saying that they won't honor the warranty. I called a different one and told them what happened and all was good.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> you don't have to sleeve the actual PSU wires if there is space in case to hide them. besides, that voids warranty in case you ever needed to replace the PSU. I usually just buy extensions for 24-pin, 8-pin and 6-pins and sleeve those with mdpc-x sleeving and their awesome heatshrink (one of best on the planet, none other has such heatshrinking capabilities).
> that sucks ... have you insured the UPS/Fedex package? claim the insurance then and buy a new chip in Fry's.


Warranty? What? Bought a used Corsair unit overseas, I very, VERY much doubt that thing has any kind of remnant of a warranty.








Extensions sound good for new units though, I should inform myself to see if any other psu manufacturer besides EVGA has got me covered for international orders. :/


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> after seeing your chip no chip is that good anything over that is bad lol
> 
> 
> 
> Haha touché
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

Your chip did change our view of what a good chip was!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> This chip is amazing!
> U Mirin lads?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mine is only a 3570k thou
Click to expand...

That's I nice chip too!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *8bitclocker*
> 
> Also looked at your 5.5ghz validation.....only 1.616v vcore. God chip much?
> 
> 
> 
> Yea I guess it was pretty godly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

That is why I so much want to know if that voltage is correct. I mean I hope it is, but it is soooo good that I just want a real voltmeter to confirm it! As I know you do too.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Just got home and see that my mulimeter arrived. Can someone point me to a thread/guide on how to use one to test my voltages? Never used one before.


So cool! You got one! Great. Now we can soon see how good the programs read your vcore. Check your manual or do some web searches for the voltmeter reading points on your particular board. Some are easier than others to get to. Looking forward to what you find!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> DUDES!!! MAMA STICK IS GONNA HOOK IT UP!!!
> 
> Okay, so my mom is going up to Tennessee to see her mother (we are in South Carolina), and in order to get there she has to go through Atlanta. So I jokingly told her to just pop into Micro Center and grab me a new i5-3570K and ASRock Extreme6. Well after I explained to her what those things were, she asked where it (Micro Center) was and it just so happens to be on the way of where she is going and she has seen the building before!! So she agreed to pick me up a chip and CPU and it will run me only $300!!!! So I pre-ordered and have it all ready for her to pick up on Sunday!
> 
> Hopefully I get a much better chip than this first one that needs 1.41v for 4.5GHz and I can RMA this faulty ASUS P8Z77-V Pro...


That is so cool too *stickg1*! I hope she picks you out a winner!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They lost him..........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That might be even better, after the remorse of them losing a customer's $300+ CPU maybe they will rush a new out to you right away.
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear that *Valgaur*, but maybe it will end up better that way...









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They lost him..........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That might be even better, after the remorse of them losing a customer's $300+ CPU maybe they will rush a new out to you right away.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yea exactly. They are very good at handling customers and they normally end up adding a lot of extra things. Like in my case, they gave me some Intel things after a supervisor yelled at me saying that they won't honor the warranty. I called a different one and told them what happened and all was good.
Click to expand...

I hope they give you something extra for losing Franky! Please let us know as soon as you hear anything!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I plan to buy an i5 next week and just delid it first thing (it should make it easier, as it wont have a huge nh-d14 sitting on it making the glue harder to cut through).
> will just get some single sided razors at cvs for it. dont have any liquids so just will be using pk-3.


Mine had a SB-E on it for about 4 months... So hard to get through but I did. I'd try the NH-D14 for a bit or even just the stock cooler to see what you can do for a comparison. As long as you don't plan to leave it on for ages.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I just bought an Acer Iconia W700. It runs an i5-3317U. Reckon I could open it up and de-lid the chip?


Probably answered...
But most laptops don't have IHS and they just have the die. Well i'm pretty sure all laptops do, my i7 720QM and even the Radeon 5730M both did.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Cool, go for it man! You can always buy some Liquid Pro from sidewindercomputers.com and voila.


One day I might but I went with a 1.5g stick of PK-3 (and I got samples of pk1, pk2, and probably have 5 grams of thermal paste wiped off my gpu and doublewrapped in airtight bags for like junk applications when i re-tim'd my gpu...) because it seemed less extreme. I'm curious if liquid is even better than pk-3, I know it's better than pk-1 but pk-3 is significantly better than pk-1, like 3+ C* on just my phenom (which is 50's range, imagine with things like i5's where cpu is in the 80s, ie larger magnitudes of temps). You'd expect so, but given how much better pk3 is than pk1, I don't know if it's even a significant one.

Coollabotary's stuff is great but I know it's restrictive, from what I understand it damages aluminum (and I have a couple of those, and yes im aware that nickel plated copper or silver looking is not the same thing), so I went with a whole 1.5g (hey, that's like 10+ applications, it's a lifetime's supply basically) and I think it also damages copper (i might be wrong on that, but I think i read somewhere it does _minor_ copper damage) and also that it works well by melting things together (maybe im confusing it with indigo on that one)?

It's also very expensive (granted $22 for 2+ *C temp drops is actually a very fair price, especially given the quantity it's more like $2.20, although $20 for ~1.5g of TIM is ridiculously expensive for thermal paste but still cheap in the grand scheme of things, and 1.5g is still a lot of applications), whereas most 'standard' high performance pastes are like... $9 for a 5g tube, $4 for 1.5g tube, $7 for 3.5, kinda range. As I see it, I think PK-3 is the best 'normal' paste in that it doesn't have major issues, compability, or price issues. Not that you should be deterred if a paste is like conductive or anything, but just saying.

So maybe one day, or hell why not indigo extreme?, but the important thing, as I understand it, is rubbing off the glue, not what TIM you use.
Quote:


> quick OT question ... if my rig sometimes shuts down on its own at idle (once or twice a day so far) and then the power button is unresponsive until I power cycle the rocker switch on PSU ... does it mean the PSU is going out? as far as I can tell all voltages are normal when it runs (checked with multimeter via various plugs also with thin backprobe leads on hot terminals). it's a 9 month old Thermaltake ToughPower Grand 1050M.


Could be a million things, I've heard such issues when overclocking on i5. It could be an issue of idle/sleep voltages going too low to keep the CPU stable, for example (too high a vdroop or something, im not the expert on this). You could have faulty drivers too, power saving drivers, like AHCI version or s1/s3 sleep states. I'd start with bios, and/or stock settings.

PSUs can definitely fail, but in 9 months would be nothing short of a total lemon or some kind of manufacturing defect, and not normal. 1200w PSU is ridiculously overkill, even for SLI and overclock, a quality 550w+ should do fine on sli 670 + overclock (that would be the low end of it, granted, and you'd probably want a little more, but if you already have a quality 550w...).


----------



## feniks

Belial, don't use PK-3, it's a horrible paste when compared to CLU ... unless you want to delid it twice then go for it, otherwise, waste of time.

I used pk-3 on IHS under cooling block and it's no better than MX-2 was. there was around 10C temps drop just by using CLU on the IHS. now imagine what it means for the die (under IHS)...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Belial, don't use PK-3, it's a horrible paste when compared to CLU ... unless you want to delid it twice then go for it, otherwise, waste of time.
> I used pk-3 on IHS under cooling block and it's no better than MX-2 was. there was around 10C temps drop just by using CLU on the IHS. now imagine what it means for the die (under IHS)...


yea im waiting for cl pro/ ultra to get here currently have mx-4 on die and i plan on using pro on the die and ultra on ihs.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Could be a million things, I've heard such issues when overclocking on i5. It could be an issue of idle/sleep voltages going too low to keep the CPU stable, for example (too high a vdroop or something, im not the expert on this). You could have faulty drivers too, power saving drivers, like AHCI version or s1/s3 sleep states. I'd start with bios, and/or stock settings.
> PSUs can definitely fail, but in 9 months would be nothing short of a total lemon or some kind of manufacturing defect, and not normal. 1200w PSU is ridiculously overkill, even for SLI and overclock, a quality 550w+ should do fine on sli 670 + overclock (that would be the low end of it, granted, and you'd probably want a little more, but if you already have a quality 550w...).


I didn't have this problem before on same bIOS and same daily OC settings, it's something new, started less than a week ago. my rig pulls up to 800W under full load (e.g. folding on cpu + 2x 670) or when stress testing components at same time (e.g. IBT on CPU + Furmark on SLI in full screen) or benchmarking 3dmark11.

I want to stay below 80% max use of PSU nominal capacity (hence why I aim at 1050W), it helps to keep them strong for long even considering the capacitors aging, besides I might get a third 670 in a year or so instead of upgrading 670 SLI to 770 or so, hence why I need PSU wattage/amperage headroom and also am running tons of accessories (24V water pump, 12 fans, 3 cold cathodes, 4 LEDs, multiple USB devices powered from mainboard, etc.).

However I suspect somehow AIDA64 having something to do with those crashes (no BSOD, just a sudden shutdown) or my CPU not liking the 4.9GHz on offsets any longer (was no problem for a month) or PSU going out or something quirky going on in BIOS or on MB hardware ... quite a few possibilities ...

It started pretty much shortly after I did 3 things:
a) few days after I upgraded to 670 SLI (from a single 670)
b) started running AIDA64 in background at all times
c) swapped one of inverters for cold cathodes (I shorted the old one with spilled water).

Just to be sure, it happens only at idle and after some time the comp was left alone AND was in use for a few hours before. Just hoping it's not the MB ...


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> it's not like your going to overcock your laptop so why in the world would you delid it? Way too much risk to be worth it... there are better things you can do to drop temps.
> Im sure it's possible but I'm just gonna delid it first thing.
> On a side note, what's the deal with ram voltage on i5 system? Sorry, I come from AMD where there isn't any connection between the two, I just raised my ram voltage to 1.8v and maxed it out (ram is cheap, and 1.7-1.8 is considered generally the highest 24/7 limit, so 1.8 is a little bit extreme for 24/7 but whatever). Like it's okay to overvolt ram as long as you raise some other voltage within .5v of it? Hard to find a straight answer with a bunch of idiots saying "dont overvolt ram ever!" on search results on TH and such.
> 
> 
> 
> You can overvolt ram no prob, thing is for 24/7 the imc might suffer a bit if you push it past 1.75v, and depends on the ram chip if it will scale with volts or not.
> Give it a try see how far it goes with your desired voltage to see if it's worth it. Try a notch lower vdimm and see if it gets to the same oc, not such a big deal really.
Click to expand...

Yea I'm aware that RAM might not appreciate more than 1.65v so I'll see. I'm just planning to be okay with overvolting ram to the extreme limits for voltage for 24/7 overclock - RAM is so cheap, so I'm okay with doing a bit of damage or hurting it's life a bit. As I understand it, most ram is okay for 1.7-1.8v, and I know what IC it is makes a difference.

I'm currently looking to buy, for something like $18.99, the 2 x 2GB Crucial Ballstix Tactical Tracers (the ones with LED and slightly lower profile, not the obnoxious tacticals with huge, tall heatspreaders - even though the huge talls ones would be $1-2 cheaper and have 1866CL9 1.5v vs the 1600mhzCL8 1.5v of the tactical tracers, although those specs are basically the exact same thing anyways). I'll research more into them, but basically I'm okay with maxing their volts out if need be, even if it doesn't do much (if it does anything, im okay with it, basically).

So for the safety of the chip, don't go past 1.75 ram voltage, basically? There isn't something like you can raise IMC voltage and make things all okay? Kind of weird how that all works, coming from AMD where you can just ramp up the volts on ram and it won't damage the CPU in any way. I do plan to overvolt my vcore to like 1.5 - as I understand it, 1.4 is the limit for 24/7 but I'm okay with a little more (nh-d14 and delid should hopefully make it so temps aren't a limiting factor) and that 1.5 is somewhat okay or something.

For 24/7 overclocks, I mean. I'm not particularly into benching, just the most stability I can get for a 24/7 overclock and a 30+ hour prime95 blend test w/max ram.
Quote:


> Mine had a SB-E on it for about 4 months... So hard to get through but I did. I'd try the NH-D14 for a bit or even just the stock cooler to see what you can do for a comparison. As long as you don't plan to leave it on for ages.


The last few weeks I've reseated 3 heatsinks like 10 times each. I'm okay, delidding clearly provides such clear results that I don't think I need to worry about if the delid actually drops temps or not.

Now, I might lap the CPU (it doesnt sound like lapping results in significant cooling reduction, maybe just a couple degrees at best, and while I'm all for doing that kind of thing just for a degree or two, and it might even be a good idea to just go ahead and lap it while I'm at it, ie waiting a week for parts to come in and delidding the cpu before installation), and in that case, I'll probably try out the cpu before lapping.re


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Belial, don't use PK-3, it's a horrible paste when compared to CLU ... unless you want to delid it twice then go for it, otherwise, waste of time.
> 
> I used pk-3 on IHS under cooling block and it's no better than MX-2 was. there was around 10C temps drop just by using CLU on the IHS. now imagine what it means for the die (under IHS)...


I have a hard time believing that (i dont know much about mx-2, but as I understand it, it's worse than MX-4). The last few weeks, I've remounted pastes and done about 20 different thermal paste and heatsink tests, and how much paste you apply and how you apply it can have just as large an impact (or more specifically, adverse affect if you use too much or use the spread method vs small grain of rice or dot method). The best results I've had was like a 5*C drop using PK-3 over PK-2 (which is slightly better than PK-1, which itself seems to generally be above MX-4), while the worst results I had were actually using 2 grains of rice on pk-3 (note that 2 grains of rice was enough paste to barely cover the entire IHS, the best results occurred when the paste didn't completely spread out over the entire IHS).

Also, 10*C drops just by changing thermal paste, when using a performance paste (ie not a stock paste, even something as terrible and outdated as as5; and not including indigo extreme), sounds definitely like a seating problem, than a paste problem.

Now I know the liquids are really high end stuff, but they are still thermal pastes, they aren't like indigo extreme where it's 10*C+ consistently above the 2nd best out there, it's more like phobya hegrease and IC diamond and other compounds that are a bar above high end conventional performance paste. Liquid is definitely better than any other thermal paste, because it's more than just thermal paste, but it isn't going to be responsible for 10*C, at most it's like 1-5*C over the best standard pastes (as in, any sort of 'normal' paste, ie not made of metal and melts stuff and 4x more expensive).

As I understand it, even the stock intel paste is not that bad, and you'd get good results by just delidding, rubbing off that black glue (the true problem and why we delid), and keeping the stock paste instead of replacing it.

I'm sure one day I'll get some liquid, but I think pk-3 and a delid job should be sufficient cooling for a high end, pushing the limit, IB overclock. If not, well then I'll start sweating about a couple degrees (a 3rd fan, using 3x140mms on the nh-d14, better paste, lapping, etc).
Quote:


> I didn't have this problem before on same bIOS and same daily OC settings, it's something new, started less than a week ago. my rig pulls up to 800W under full load (e.g. folding on cpu + 2x 670) or when stress testing components at same time (e.g. IBT on CPU + Furmark on SLI in full screen) or benchmarking 3dmark11.


Well could be hardware degradation and you simply need to step up voltages to something to make up for it (as in your CPU, your IMC, your RAM, etc), but okay maybe it's your PSU.

Could totally be your PSU, but yea it sounds like something else given what you said. You should try troubleshooting - remove on of those GPUs, stop running AIDA64, see if you can rule something else out before you do something drastic like spend money.


----------



## Belial

http://www.overclock.net/t/1283797/ivy-bridge-3770k-de-lid-liquid-pro-as-5-tested-amazing-results/0_100

okay maybe liquid is worth it lol.

ill look into it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Yea I'm aware that RAM might not appreciate more than 1.65v so I'll see. I'm just planning to be okay with overvolting ram to the extreme limits for voltage for 24/7 overclock - RAM is so cheap, so I'm okay with doing a bit of damage or hurting it's life a bit. As I understand it, most ram is okay for 1.7-1.8v, and I know what IC it is makes a difference.
> I'm currently looking to buy, for something like $18.99, the 2 x 2GB Crucial Ballstix Tactical Tracers (the ones with LED and slightly lower profile, not the obnoxious tacticals with huge, tall heatspreaders - even though the huge talls ones would be $1-2 cheaper and have 1866CL9 1.5v vs the 1600mhzCL8 1.5v of the tactical tracers, although those specs are basically the exact same thing anyways). I'll research more into them, but basically I'm okay with maxing their volts out if need be, even if it doesn't do much (if it does anything, im okay with it, basically).
> So for the safety of the chip, don't go past 1.75 ram voltage, basically? There isn't something like you can raise IMC voltage and make things all okay? Kind of weird how that all works, coming from AMD where you can just ramp up the volts on ram and it won't damage the CPU in any way. I do plan to overvolt my vcore to like 1.5 - as I understand it, 1.4 is the limit for 24/7 but I'm okay with a little more (nh-d14 and delid should hopefully make it so temps aren't a limiting factor) and that 1.5 is somewhat okay or something.
> For 24/7 overclocks, I mean. I'm not particularly into benching, just the most stability I can get for a 24/7 overclock and a 30+ hour prime95 blend test w/max ram.
> The last few weeks I've reseated 3 heatsinks like 10 times each. I'm okay, delidding clearly provides such clear results that I don't think I need to worry about if the delid actually drops temps or not.
> Now, I might lap the CPU (it doesnt sound like lapping results in significant cooling reduction, maybe just a couple degrees at best, and while I'm all for doing that kind of thing just for a degree or two, and it might even be a good idea to just go ahead and lap it while I'm at it, ie waiting a week for parts to come in and delidding the cpu before installation), and in that case, I'll probably try out the cpu before lapping.re


Crucial makes fine ram sticks and has great support, but remember they don't scale past 2133 with good timings, 2400mhz with good luck is doable on the 1600c8 sticks. (I've seen it done on 8gb sticks at cl10-10-10-27-1t or something like that using 1.7v soo you might get a decent oc out of those or the 4gbsolder sticks. 2gb sticks not so sure)
you could always buy g.skill 2400c9 sticks or even samsung 1600 cl11 1.35v ram for less.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1283797/ivy-bridge-3770k-de-lid-liquid-pro-as-5-tested-amazing-results/0_100
> okay maybe liquid is worth it lol.
> ill look into it.


Yeah, totally worth it!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have a hard time believing that (i dont know much about mx-2, but as I understand it, it's worse than MX-4). The last few weeks, I've remounted pastes and done about 20 different thermal paste and heatsink tests, and how much paste you apply and how you apply it can have just as large an impact (or more specifically, adverse affect if you use too much or use the spread method vs small grain of rice or dot method). The best results I've had was like a 5*C drop using PK-3 over PK-2 (which is slightly better than PK-1, which itself seems to generally be above MX-4), while the worst results I had were actually using 2 grains of rice on pk-3 (note that 2 grains of rice was enough paste to barely cover the entire IHS, the best results occurred when the paste didn't completely spread out over the entire IHS).
> Also, 10*C drops just by changing thermal paste, when using a performance paste (ie not a stock paste, even something as terrible and outdated as as5; and not including indigo extreme), sounds definitely like a seating problem, than a paste problem.
> Now I know the liquids are really high end stuff, but they are still thermal pastes, they aren't like indigo extreme where it's 10*C+ consistently above the 2nd best out there, it's more like phobya hegrease and IC diamond and other compounds that are a bar above high end conventional performance paste. Liquid is definitely better than any other thermal paste, because it's more than just thermal paste, but it isn't going to be responsible for 10*C, at most it's like 1-5*C over the best standard pastes (as in, any sort of 'normal' paste, ie not made of metal and melts stuff and 4x more expensive).
> As I understand it, even the stock intel paste is not that bad, and you'd get good results by just delidding, rubbing off that black glue (the true problem and why we delid), and keeping the stock paste instead of replacing it.
> I'm sure one day I'll get some liquid, but I think pk-3 and a delid job should be sufficient cooling for a high end, pushing the limit, IB overclock. If not, well then I'll start sweating about a couple degrees (a 3rd fan, using 3x140mms on the nh-d14, better paste, lapping, etc).


AS5 still has a higher w/mk then the stock intel tim, it maybe outdated etc but still isnt that
bad tim compared to the other "newer" ones, you wont notice a very big difference when used on the ihs,
because of the bigger area, even using liquid pro ultra on the ihs, wont make a big difference compared to the other ones out there,
the whole "top15" tim's are within a range of 1-5C when used on the ihs..

the heat dissipation area on the die is alot smaller then the ihs,
thats where the w/mk kicks in, almost all "normal" tim's have about 2 to 10 w/mk,
where ultra has about 32, and pro about 82 w/mk
solder is somewhere between 30 and 60 w/mk, thats one of the reasons Sandy runs cooler then ivy,
besides the distance ihs/die on ivy..intels tim has about 1.5-2 w/mk if i remember right..

my personal experience is only with AS5 and liquid pro,
when i used AS5 on the die and ihs, i saw about 10C tempdrop, (reapplied twice)
when i used liquid pro after that, i saw another 15+C tempdrop


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Pre delid



Post delid



Difference of *29C*







.


----------



## Swag

*This is a message to all the delidders and future delidders!*

Valgaur and I are in the middle of trying to make this club better than now. I have suggested we put another spreadsheet in the OP for people who have failed their delid, how many times they have failed, and whether they have succeeded in a different attempt.

Would this be good or something that will not appreciated? Answers would like to be given quickly so we don't waste time making something that won't help anyone.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *This is a message to all the delidders and future delidders!*
> Valgaur and I are in the middle of trying to make this club better than now. I have suggested we put another spreadsheet in the OP for people who have failed their delid, how many times they have failed, and whether they have succeeded in a different attempt.
> Would this be good or something that will not appreciated? Answers would like to be given quickly so we don't waste time making something that won't help anyone.


i think we should, i see no reason not to put up fails, "we learn from mistakes" right,
i would also put up the reasons why it failed, i can name a few why's,
but its better to have the original delid fail owners tell their story ..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *This is a message to all the delidders and future delidders!*
> Valgaur and I are in the middle of trying to make this club better than now. I have suggested we put another spreadsheet in the OP for people who have failed their delid, how many times they have failed, and whether they have succeeded in a different attempt.
> Would this be good or something that will not appreciated? Answers would like to be given quickly so we don't waste time making something that won't help anyone.


I've had 3 successful delids so I can't say I'd mind it haha. However I'm not sure how others would feel about being labeled as one of those who "failed."


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *This is a message to all the delidders and future delidders!*
> Valgaur and I are in the middle of trying to make this club better than now. I have suggested we put another spreadsheet in the OP for people who have failed their delid, how many times they have failed, and whether they have succeeded in a different attempt.
> Would this be good or something that will not appreciated? Answers would like to be given quickly so we don't waste time making something that won't help anyone.
> 
> 
> 
> i think we should, i see no reason not to put up fails, "we learn from mistakes" right,
> i would also put up the reasons why it failed, i can name a few why's,
> but its better to have the original delid fail owners tell their story ..
Click to expand...

Yea, I mostly recommended this because there were some people who were PMing me how many people failed at this mod.


----------



## VonDutch

1. nervous
2. not confident, (what if)
3. not well prepared
4. working to fast, impatient
5. other reaosns, like socks and spilling fluid over ram etc..
6. using wrong equipment (pocket knife vid) ..lol
7. hmmmm..hmm, that about what comes to my mind


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I mostly recommended this because there were some people who were PMing me how many people failed at this mod.


If it's for the purpose of helping others decide whether or not they'd like to risk delidding their chip I don't see how it could be a bad thing







.


----------



## Belial

yea i dont know if liquid is worth getting if i already have pk-3 ($22 for 1.5g, ouch).

Given how paste application has such a huge impact on performance... im not really sure if CLU is really that much better than PK-3. All I can really find is that PK-1 is just barely behind CLU or P, and PK is vastly superior to PK3. Like I was getting a 3-5*C temp difference with pk-3 over pk-1 over multiple remounts, and this on just a temp range of 40s and 50s, not 70-80s.

I might buy liquid one day but I dont think I'll buy it now. I'm not sold if it'd be much better, or even if it would be better, than pk-3 with the right spread job.
Quote:


> Crucial makes fine ram sticks and has great support, but remember they don't scale past 2133 with good timings, 2400mhz with good luck is doable on the 1600c8 sticks. (I've seen it done on 8gb sticks at cl10-10-10-27-1t or something like that using 1.7v soo you might get a decent oc out of those or the 4gbsolder sticks. 2gb sticks not so sure)
> you could always buy g.skill 2400c9 sticks or even samsung 1600 cl11 1.35v ram for less.


Im not benching, just running a 24/7 overclock (even if im pushing it, im still staying within limits generally). I dont think any sort of 1600 or 1866mhz kit would get with 2133mhz no matter how much voltage you put on it?

I'm basically buying the cheapest 1.5v CL9 ram I can find. As it turns out, the cheapest 2x2gb RAM i can find are:
Crucial Ballistics @ $8.99 per 2gb stick 1866mhz CL9 1.5v (with the obnoxious tall heatspreaders, black)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148495

and the 2nd cheapest is:
Crucial Ballstics @ $9.99 per 2gb stick 1600mhz CL8 1.5v (with lower profile, LED sticks)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148513

As I understand it, 1866CL9 > 1600CL8, but just barely, as they are basically the same thing (you know, raising speed, lowering timing, same thing, like you could get 1333 CL9 ram to go 2000mhz if you dropped the timings low enough, but i think a step up in speed is slightly harder/more taxing than loosened timing, as I understand it). Probably the same ICs. But I'm okay with $2 price increase for 2x of them, even in the technically slower ram (it's not even slower, it's really the same thing right?) because the god those are some obnoxiously tall heatspreaders and I dont want that. I know you can push up the fan on a heatsink to help with ram spreaders but you can only push the fan up so far until it simply wont fit in the case anymore...
Quote:


> you could always buy g.skill 2400c9 sticks or even samsung 1600 cl11 1.35v ram for less.


I think given the sale these crucials are on, I don't think that's likely. I'm literally just trying to get dual channel 4gb 1.5v CL9 (or better, as the case turns out to be) for the cheapest possible. I'm only going with the 2nd cheapest because those heatspreaders seem too obtrusive...
Quote:


> AS5 still has a higher w/mk then the stock intel tim, it maybe outdated etc but still isnt that
> bad tim compared to the other "newer" ones, you wont notice a very big difference when used on the ihs,
> because of the bigger area, even using liquid pro ultra on the ihs, wont make a big difference compared to the other ones out there,
> the whole "top15" tim's are within a range of 1-5C when used on the ihs..


AS5 is terrible. It's so outdated. It's truly bad quality paste these days. it was the best when it came out, but it's so terribly inconvenient - not that should deter people like us looking for performance, but nowadays thermal pastes are so high quality that no one is looking to make pastes that are better at dissapating/transferring heat, they're trying to make the paste cheaper, easier to spread, less viscous, less conductive, easier to remove, less conductive. That, or ridiculous, like indigo extreme, ic diamond, coollaboratory.

AS5 is not only difficult to deal with, extremely difficult to deal with, but it's thermal properties are just terrible. I mean no one recommends you should get the i5-655k or 1st generation i5's. They were great when they were released, and in fact they still are pretty powerful.... but compared to the power savings, features, and downright power... not, it really isn't that great anymore. I mean if you got as5, use it, it's not so bad that you should throw it out, but given how cheap paste is, yea, I would recommend you spend $4 for 1.5g of PK-3 (or CLU even). Your gonna see 5*C+ improvement using any modern paste, even something like MX-4, the modern re-iteration of as5.

The only reason as5 is still around is because you have so many anecdotal reports of how great is is, so people searching the subject keep buying it. Meanwhile superior pastes like mx-4 just have less reviews because it hasn't been around as long, so people keep buying as5 and ignoring mx-4 (or pk3, or gc extreme, or even clu...). But performance wise it's bad, and yes, you will see a difference compared to modern pastes. MX-4 will net you a degree or two at least, which is what you generally expect when moving to a higher end thermal paste (short of something like CLU or indigo), and you'll get at least 5*C+ with a high quality paste like PK-3, IC diamond, Gelid extreme, Phobya hegrease, antec, and the many other high end pastes that are still standard performance pastes.

As5 is terrible nowadays. It's 5*C+ behind any modern paste. This is coming from someone who's tested it, and many thermal pastes. Even pk-1 is horribly outdated, and that is consistently ranked better than as5 by the tune of 1-2*C (which is a rather large margin when it comes to TIMs).


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have a hard time believing that (i dont know much about mx-2, but as I understand it, it's worse than MX-4). The last few weeks, I've remounted pastes and done about 20 different thermal paste and heatsink tests, and how much paste you apply and how you apply it can have just as large an impact (or more specifically, adverse affect if you use too much or use the spread method vs small grain of rice or dot method). The best results I've had was like a 5*C drop using PK-3 over PK-2 (which is slightly better than PK-1, which itself seems to generally be above MX-4), while the worst results I had were actually using 2 grains of rice on pk-3 (note that 2 grains of rice was enough paste to barely cover the entire IHS, the best results occurred when the paste didn't completely spread out over the entire IHS).
> Also, 10*C drops just by changing thermal paste, when using a performance paste (ie not a stock paste, even something as terrible and outdated as as5; and not including indigo extreme), sounds definitely like a seating problem, than a paste problem.
> Now I know the liquids are really high end stuff, but they are still thermal pastes, they aren't like indigo extreme where it's 10*C+ consistently above the 2nd best out there, it's more like phobya hegrease and IC diamond and other compounds that are a bar above high end conventional performance paste. Liquid is definitely better than any other thermal paste, because it's more than just thermal paste, but it isn't going to be responsible for 10*C, at most it's like 1-5*C over the best standard pastes (as in, any sort of 'normal' paste, ie not made of metal and melts stuff and 4x more expensive).
> As I understand it, even the stock intel paste is not that bad, and you'd get good results by just delidding, rubbing off that black glue (the true problem and why we delid), and keeping the stock paste instead of replacing it.
> I'm sure one day I'll get some liquid, but I think pk-3 and a delid job should be sufficient cooling for a high end, pushing the limit, IB overclock. If not, well then I'll start sweating about a couple degrees (a 3rd fan, using 3x140mms on the nh-d14, better paste, lapping, etc).
> Well could be hardware degradation and you simply need to step up voltages to something to make up for it (as in your CPU, your IMC, your RAM, etc), but okay maybe it's your PSU.
> Could totally be your PSU, but yea it sounds like something else given what you said. You should try troubleshooting - remove on of those GPUs, stop running AIDA64, see if you can rule something else out before you do something drastic like spend money.


you should try using CLU paste if you haven't done so already ... PK-3 is still within the same Celsius degree as all other "leading" soft TIMs out there, metal or non-metal, meaning it will give you 0.5C difference at best when compared directly to PK-2, PK-1 MX-2, MX-4 or whatever crap they are pushing out nowadays ... I use only IC Diamond or CLU on CPU IHS, really good results when compared to MX-2/MX-4 or PK-3 or whatever (they are all nearly same)...

CLU or CLP is a liquid metal, not a "paste" so to speak. IC Diamond is ... well just that, diamond dust particles (again, not a real "paste"). I utterly hate the PK-3 I bought for $15 from newegg recently, it's an overpriced marketing gimmick, totally not worth the price (if you can get CLU at $12+s/h from sidewindercomputers.com), nothing more.

as for my system, no hardware degradation anywhere under load, so why would there be one at idle? as far as I know anything you mention throws a BSOD or restarts when there is not enough voltage, while my problem is different - a shutdown at long idle and inability to power up until I cycle the rocker switch on PSU which makes me think this is just that, a bad PSU ... or the cursed latest BIOS has got something to do with it.

for now I am not using AIDA64 anymore (was running in background before since a few days) and will see if my rig shuts down when I sleep (it was doing it every night for last 4 days). I will laugh out loud if that is what caused the problem ...


----------



## VonDutch

i can come up with alot of other tests out there,
maybe some are biased idk, like i said, besides the,
its hard to spread out, or hard to work with, prize etc,
theres not much difference, when used on the ihs..

on die its a different story,
and the only stories/tests we have, is what we experienced as delidders around here,
and almost everyone of us has the same story/message,
liquid pro/ultra gives the best results when used on die, most of the time more then 10-15C difference
compared to any other tim out there..


----------



## feniks

LOL! LMAO! I love that comparison!







rep+
They used lipstick, butter, spray oil, toothpaste, mayonnaise and chocolate for comparison, awesome! ... and Rosewill thermal compound was worse than all those (except for chocolate) LOL!

However as per ICD (carat describes only size of syringe, nothing else), it could bean application problem, I personally spread it on the IHS with an old credit card, this way I was always getting around 5-8C better results then with any kind of application of MX-2. not sure why in this review it landed right by mayonnaise LOL!

CLU/CLP is beyond the scope honestly, too much depends on the application method I think since there is a big area to cover (IHS), I personally spread CLU with the included brush and it works great for me, not sure why people say it's not much better than PK-3 (which worked horribly for me on IHS, but worked well on GPU die - same good as CLU).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> i can come up with alot of other tests out there,
> maybe some are biased idk, like i said, besides the,
> its hard to spread out, or hard to work with, prize etc,
> theres not much difference, when used on the ihs..
> on die its a different story,
> and the only stories/tests we have, is what we experienced as delidders around here,
> and almost everyone of us has the same story/message,
> liquid pro/ultra gives the best results when used on die, most of the time more then 10-15C difference
> compared to any other tim out there..


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have a hard time believing that (i dont know much about mx-2, but as I understand it, it's worse than MX-4). The last few weeks, I've remounted pastes and done about 20 different thermal paste and heatsink tests, and how much paste you apply and how you apply it can have just as large an impact (or more specifically, adverse affect if you use too much or use the spread method vs small grain of rice or dot method). The best results I've had was like a 5*C drop using PK-3 over PK-2 (which is slightly better than PK-1, which itself seems to generally be above MX-4), while the worst results I had were actually using 2 grains of rice on pk-3 (note that 2 grains of rice was enough paste to barely cover the entire IHS, the best results occurred when the paste didn't completely spread out over the entire IHS).
> Also, 10*C drops just by changing thermal paste, when using a performance paste (ie not a stock paste, even something as terrible and outdated as as5; and not including indigo extreme), sounds definitely like a seating problem, than a paste problem.
> Now I know the liquids are really high end stuff, but they are still thermal pastes, they aren't like indigo extreme where it's 10*C+ consistently above the 2nd best out there, it's more like phobya hegrease and IC diamond and other compounds that are a bar above high end conventional performance paste. Liquid is definitely better than any other thermal paste, because it's more than just thermal paste, but it isn't going to be responsible for 10*C, at most it's like 1-5*C over the best standard pastes (as in, any sort of 'normal' paste, ie not made of metal and melts stuff and 4x more expensive).
> As I understand it, even the stock intel paste is not that bad, and you'd get good results by just delidding, rubbing off that black glue (the true problem and why we delid), and keeping the stock paste instead of replacing it.
> I'm sure one day I'll get some liquid, but I think pk-3 and a delid job should be sufficient cooling for a high end, pushing the limit, IB overclock. If not, well then I'll start sweating about a couple degrees (a 3rd fan, using 3x140mms on the nh-d14, better paste, lapping, etc).
> Well could be hardware degradation and you simply need to step up voltages to something to make up for it (as in your CPU, your IMC, your RAM, etc), but okay maybe it's your PSU.
> Could totally be your PSU, but yea it sounds like something else given what you said. You should try troubleshooting - remove on of those GPUs, stop running AIDA64, see if you can rule something else out before you do something drastic like spend money.
> 
> 
> 
> you should try using CLU paste if you haven't done so already ... PK-3 is still within the same Celsius degree as all other "leading" soft TIMs out there, metal or non-metal, meaning it will give you 0.5C difference at best when compared directly to PK-2, PK-1 MX-2, MX-4 or whatever crap they are pushing out nowadays ... I use only IC Diamond or CLU on CPU IHS, really good results when compared to MX-2/MX-4 or PK-3 or whatever (they are all nearly same)...
> 
> CLU or CLP is a liquid metal, not a "paste" so to speak. IC Diamond is ... well just that, diamond dust particles (again, not a real "paste"). I utterly hate the PK-3 I bought for $15 from newegg recently, it's an overpriced marketing gimmick, totally not worth the price (if you can get CLU at $12+s/h from sidewindercomputers.com), nothing more.
> 
> as for my system, no hardware degradation anywhere under load, so why would there be one at idle? as far as I know anything you mention throws a BSOD or restarts when there is not enough voltage, while my problem is different - a shutdown at long idle and inability to power up until I cycle the rocker switch on PSU which makes me think this is just that, a bad PSU ... or the cursed latest BIOS has got something to do with it.
> 
> for now I am not using AIDA64 anymore (was running in background before since a few days) and will see if my rig shuts down when I sleep (it was doing it every night for last 4 days). I will laugh out loud if that is what caused the problem ...
Click to expand...

I have done multiple tests and that is completely not true. I'm not talking about a single mounting here, I'm talking multiple mounts on multiple coolers, I found PK-3 to be above PK1 by about 3-5*C on average. And that's on an AMD chip running 40s and 50's, not an Intel chip running 80+ where heat differentials would be much larger.

There is actually a large difference between the older pastes and newer ones. Anything like Antec, GC extreme, IC diamond, PK-3, MX-4 even, is going to run at least 1-3*C cooler than outdated stuff like PK-1 and AS5 (which is already a few degrees behind PK-1).

pk-3 is not just within a degree of other pastes, and as5 is not just any other paste, nowadays it's just a terrible paste that's behind. There's very few pastes as good as PK-3 (or PK-1, for that matter, and even pk-1 has been surpassed significantly by modern pastes). It, like a select few other pastes, is far ahead of as5. Significantly. I'd say Pk3 would result in a larger cooling drop from as5 or stock paste than the difference between a hyper 212 and most mid-range air coolers or 120mm closed loops.

I'll consider CLU but I'm not sure if it's worth the price premium of $24. I think I'll just use pk-3 and if i need more, I'll get CLU.

Paying $15 for pk-3 is a bit of a rip-off. I got a free sample from prolimatech as a sponsorship for a benchmark, and on ebay you can find plenty of 1.5g and 3.5g tubes for super cheap. I think you can find pk-3, in general, cheaper than newegg... i dont know why people assume newegg is the cheapest for everything.
Quote:


> as for my system, no hardware degradation anywhere under load, so why would there be one at idle? as far as I know anything you mention throws a BSOD or restarts when there is not enough voltage, while my problem is different - a shutdown at long idle and inability to power up until I cycle the rocker switch on PSU which makes me think this is just that, a bad PSU ... or the cursed latest BIOS has got something to do with it.


Because of vdroop (im not an expert on intel, please stop asking me lol). You could have some sort of degradation of like your cpu or vrm/motherboard, which would cause voltage not being fed or requested properly or something... who knows what exactly your issue is, but it's definitely possible. It's a common problem that people have overclocking intels, that when the chip goes into idle or sleep it has issues, or it'll run on lower frequencies when it shouldn't, that kind of thing. It's because the voltage might be okay at the high end or on load, but when it idles it's way too low.

Maybe try raising your VID instead of offset, if you are doing so. Could be that when your system isnt on load, or is idling, it's just not getting enough voltage anymore, because of hardware degradation, when a few months ago or whatever, that much idle voltage was fine. Could also be your SLI, or aida64.

I think you should start with troubleshooting (runnign single card, stop using aida), before really asking on a forum (no offense). It'd help us, help you, a lot better.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 1. nervous
> 2. not confident, (what if)
> 3. not well prepared
> 4. working to fast, impatient
> 5. other reaosns, like socks and spilling fluid over ram etc..
> 6. using wrong equipment (pocket knife vid) ..lol
> 7. hmmmm..hmm, that about what comes to my mind


To add to that if they practiced on P4's and Celerons and the like is another factor to include for sure! It really boosts your confidence also.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i can come up with alot of other tests out there,
> maybe some are biased idk, like i said, besides the,
> its hard to spread out, or hard to work with, prize etc,
> theres not much difference, when used on the ihs..
> 
> on die its a different story,
> and the only stories/tests we have, is what we experienced as delidders around here,
> and almost everyone of us has the same story/message,
> liquid pro/ultra gives the best results when used on die, most of the time more then 10-15C difference
> compared to any other tim out there..


I love hardwaresecret's articles, but their benchmarks are total crap. You should know better than to trust a site that puts the Gamer Storm Assassin, consistently ranked as one of the best coolers in the world and OCN's own Moparman ranked as #2 heatsink in the world at stock and #1 in apples to apples, as one of the worst heatsinks in the world (as in 20*C+ behind other dual towers), or that Prolimatech Megahalems, a truly decent hsf for sure, as one of the best heatsinks in the world and better than the NH-D14, Frio, and 20, when it's peformance is consistenyly ranked as very slightly worse than a Corsair H50 at stock.

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cooler-Master-Hyper-612-PWM-CPU-Cooler-Review/1398/6

Please. I'd trust Tomshardware's benches before Hardwaresecrests. They got great reviews, great articles, really good information on how things work, but their benches are crap. They are like the opposite of Tomshardware, in that sense lol. But their benches are just as wacked out as Frostytech.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have done multiple tests and that is completely not true. I'm not talking about a single mounting here, I'm talking multiple mounts on multiple coolers, I found PK-3 to be above PK1 by about 3-5*C on average. And that's on an AMD chip running 40s and 50's, not an Intel chip running 80+ where heat differentials would be much larger.
> There is actually a large difference between the older pastes and newer ones. Anything like Antec, GC extreme, IC diamond, PK-3, MX-4 even, is going to run at least 1-3*C cooler than outdated stuff like PK-1 and AS5 (which is already a few degrees behind PK-1).
> pk-3 is not just within a degree of other pastes, and as5 is not just any other paste, nowadays it's just a terrible paste that's behind. There's very few pastes as good as PK-3 (or PK-1, for that matter, and even pk-1 has been surpassed significantly by modern pastes). It, like a select few other pastes, is far ahead of as5. Significantly. I'd say Pk3 would result in a larger cooling drop from as5 or stock paste than the difference between a hyper 212 and most mid-range air coolers or 120mm closed loops.
> I'll consider CLU but I'm not sure if it's worth the price premium of $24. I think I'll just use pk-3 and if i need more, I'll get CLU.
> Paying $15 for pk-3 is a bit of a rip-off. I got a free sample from prolimatech as a sponsorship for a benchmark, and on ebay you can find plenty of 1.5g and 3.5g tubes for super cheap. I think you can find pk-3, in general, cheaper than newegg... i dont know why people assume newegg is the cheapest for everything.
> Because of vdroop (im not an expert on intel, please stop asking me lol). You could have some sort of degradation of like your cpu or vrm/motherboard, which would cause voltage not being fed or requested properly or something... who knows what exactly your issue is, but it's definitely possible. It's a common problem that people have overclocking intels, that when the chip goes into idle or sleep it has issues, or it'll run on lower frequencies when it shouldn't, that kind of thing. It's because the voltage might be okay at the high end or on load, but when it idles it's way too low.
> Maybe try raising your VID instead of offset, if you are doing so. Could be that when your system isnt on load, or is idling, it's just not getting enough voltage anymore, because of hardware degradation, when a few months ago or whatever, that much idle voltage was fine. Could also be your SLI, or aida64.
> I think you should start with troubleshooting (runnign single card, stop using aida), before really asking on a forum (no offense). It'd help us, help you, a lot better.


I won't comment on TIM anymore, your findings are yours, mine are mine for my equipment and conditions I tested it with. to each its own








just try CLU on the die and you won't regret it as nobody among us ever did.... god, never met anybody so hard to convince ... have you seen the first page of this thread with deliding results (there is TIM used in it) ... be my guest to try PK-3, post back with your findings ... then compare with CLU or CLP...

*buddy please .... what you say about my problem doesn't make the slightest sense in scope of what I already have said*









too low vcore om Intel chips (be it idle or under load) would cause a BSOD (e.g. 101, 124, or whatever) and would RESTART, it wouldn't shutdown without ability to power back up! been there done that for a few years LOL! this system was perfectly stable for a month (it runs 24/7) and CPU is not a problem, it's stable, really he he.
The rest is a testing in progress. SLI I doubt is the case at idle (it would be under load however, but it's not)... PSU or BIOS or MB, those are really only options if it wasn't a software glitch caused by AIDA64 (testing this theory since afternoon)









And lastly, I never asked for YOUR advice personally in this thread, not sure why you are bashing me by repeating the stuff (that I myself mentioned in initial post) over and over LOL for a simple question targeted to ALL CLUB MEMBERS (knowing most of us are experienced in many different fields)!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> LOL! LMAO! I love that comparison!
> They used lipstick, butter, spray oil, toothpaste, mayonnaise and chocolate for comparison, awesome! ... and Rosewill thermal compound was worse than all those (except for chocolate) LOL!
> 
> However as per ICD (carat describes only size of syringe, nothing else), it could bean application problem, I personally spread it on the IHS with an old credit card, this way I was always getting around 5-8C better results then with any kind of application of MX-2. not sure why in this review it landed right by mayonnaise LOL!
> 
> CLU/CLP is beyond the scope honestly, too much depends on the application method I think since there is a big area to cover (IHS), I personally spread CLU with the included brush and it works great for me, not sure why people say it's not much better than PK-3 (which worked horribly for me on IHS, but worked well on GPU die - same good as CLU).


Also, they test full load on stock voltage. That's a useless test.

You do realize that idle temps mean nothing, right? In the same sense, stock voltage means nothing too. Custom water loops will lose to HDT heatsinks, according to testing methodologies used by HardwareSecrets (Hdt is really, really good at idle temps and lower temp ranges and cheap as crap but are terrible for performance, although their performance/price is awesome, hence, hyper 212, and water loops are worse at idle and lower temp ranges).

They also do not control ambient temps. A change of 1*C in ambient temp is very likely going to be responsible for at least 2-5*C change in load temps (depending on the heat delta, of course), due to the exponential relationship of increased ambient temp on increased load temp.

Also... why is a benchmark published by a manufacturer being used? lol, you realize that's not exactly an unbiased article, right? Although it is correct that as5 is crap and icdiamond is much much better than it (and to be fair that was a sampling, not a test). I'm not sure why you quoted that though, unless you are saying that to agree with me that as5 is terrible?

Anyways, spread method is terrible. That's why you had such a problem. Spreading causes air bubbles to pop up when you put on the heatsink. That's what glass plate pressure applications have shown (its on youtube somewhere). Maybe that isn't the reason exactly, maybe it is, I just know in my tests, and other's tests, you tend to get way higher temps with spread instead of dot application. In my experience, I've had the best results when the TIM didn't even spread out to reach the entire IHS, you just need a small dot in the middle, and smooshed down so it spreads out and no air can get trapped in it.

I wonder how well CLU would work if you just applied it like normal paste, with rice grain/dot method. I know it is a bit different, i mean considering it's just freaking metal...


----------



## She loved E

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I mostly recommended this because there were some people who were PMing me how many people failed at this mod.


IMO the time would be better spent on a more complete how-to. I didn't do much wrong but it was still enough to fry the chip. If I knew how easy it is to scratch the pcb I would have been more careful.

I'm happy to be added to a "fail" list... I posted my experience here so ppl could learn from it. But honestly a list is just gonna scare ppl away because they still won't have the info to do it properly.


----------



## feniks

I personally LOVE this review because they used mayonnaise, chocolate, lipstick, toothpaste, butter and spray oil in it. the best one I have ever seen, none others did









Have you ever used ICD? spread method is the ONLY method that actually works best with it, period.
also try dot in middle method with CLU or CLP, LMAO, good luck ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Also, they test full load on stock voltage. That's a useless test.
> You do realize that idle temps mean nothing, right? In the same sense, stock voltage means nothing too. Custom water loops will lose to HDT heatsinks, according to testing methodologies used by HardwareSecrets (Hdt is really, really good at idle temps and lower temp ranges and cheap as crap but are terrible for performance, although their performance/price is awesome, hence, hyper 212, and water loops are worse at idle and lower temp ranges).
> They also do not control ambient temps. A change of 1*C in ambient temp is very likely going to be responsible for at least 2-5*C change in load temps (depending on the heat delta, of course), due to the exponential relationship of increased ambient temp on increased load temp.
> Also... why is a benchmark published by a manufacturer being used? lol, you realize that's not exactly an unbiased article, right? Although it is correct that as5 is crap and icdiamond is much much better than it (and to be fair that was a sampling, not a test). I'm not sure why you quoted that though, unless you are saying that to agree with me that as5 is terrible?
> Anyways, spread method is terrible. That's why you had such a problem. Spreading causes air bubbles to pop up when you put on the heatsink. That's what glass plate pressure applications have shown (its on youtube somewhere). Maybe that isn't the reason exactly, maybe it is, I just know in my tests, and other's tests, you tend to get way higher temps with spread instead of dot application. In my experience, I've had the best results when the TIM didn't even spread out to reach the entire IHS, you just need a small dot in the middle, and smooshed down so it spreads out and no air can get trapped in it.
> I wonder how well CLU would work if you just applied it like normal paste, with rice grain/dot method. I know it is a bit different, i mean considering it's just freaking metal...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I wonder how well CLU would work if you just applied it like normal paste, with rice grain/dot method. I know it is a bit different, i mean considering it's just freaking metal...


If you've ever used CLP/CLU or seen it applied you'd realize it's a totally different animal. It comes out of the syringe in a ball and you can literally just move that ball around the heatsink without it losing it's shape unless you spread it. Simply putting a bit of it in the center of the IHS and then applying your heatsink would just force it off the IHS completely. It's too slick to be spread by heatsink pressure.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, liquid metal behaves differently. You GOTTA SPREAD IT, and ic diamond did the same thing for me. Had to heat up the syringe in boiling water, apply it and spread it a bit, let it cool down and mount the hsf.

Edit: go to sidewindercomputers.com and search for liquid pro there. It's much cheaper there.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I mostly recommended this because there were some people who were PMing me how many people failed at this mod.
> 
> 
> 
> IMO the time would be better spent on a more complete how-to. I didn't do much wrong but it was still enough to fry the chip. If I knew how easy it is to scratch the pcb I would have been more careful.
> 
> I'm happy to be added to a "fail" list... I posted my experience here so ppl could learn from it. But honestly a list is just gonna scare ppl away because they still won't have the info to do it properly.
Click to expand...

I've thought of how to make my guide a bit more in-depth, but unfortunately, without another chip, I'm at a loss. Have you seen my guide by the way?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 1. nervous
> 2. not confident, (what if)
> 3. not well prepared
> 4. working to fast, impatient
> 5. other reasons, like socks and spilling fluid over ram etc..
> 6. using wrong equipment (pocket knife vid) ..lol
> 7. hmmmm..hmm, that about what comes to my mind
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> To add to that if they *practiced on P4's and Celerons* and the like is another factor to include for sure! It really boosts your confidence also.
Click to expand...

yep, Val and i already put that one up on page 1


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL! LMAO! I love that comparison!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rep+
> They used lipstick, butter, spray oil, toothpaste, mayonnaise and chocolate for comparison, awesome! ... and Rosewill thermal compound was worse than all those (except for chocolate) LOL!
> However as per ICD (carat describes only size of syringe, nothing else), it could bean application problem, I personally spread it on the IHS with an old credit card, this way I was always getting around 5-8C better results then with any kind of application of MX-2. not sure why in this review it landed right by mayonnaise LOL!
> CLU/CLP is beyond the scope honestly, too much depends on the application method I think since there is a big area to cover (IHS), I personally spread CLU with the included brush and it works great for me, not sure why people say it's not much better than PK-3 (which worked horribly for me on IHS, but worked well on GPU die - same good as CLU).


lol, me too..really, chocolate...haha
i only noticed it after download and search for some tests,
those where the first i came across while searching,
thing is, we/they only have tests that are running undelidded chip's,

we are about the only "group" that know what happens when you run tim's on a delidded chip,
and the real difference between using "normal" tim's and the liquid metal tim's..
its easy to say those tets dont mean a thing, or they are biased,
but you can say that about our delidded crew,
i know i always answer truthful if asked anything..

why would you use a dot method with a tim , when the manual says to spread it,
why spread it, when manual says, use dot or line method








liquid pro/ultra need to be spread out, simple ..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I'm using a now modded H100i, but it was the same for stock under stock after delid, and with the h100i unmodded. The H100i is bolted via individual M4 screws so I might just be me, but it was suffered issues prior to this. I've lapped both the IHS top, and bottom. I didn't really do the H100i copper piece though, but it doesn't look concave.
> oh I had to stop using the LiquidPro, and using AS5 since it's thicker and easier to reapply quickly. The LP always gives me a nails on chalkboard feeling when I have to remove it, so I use a cotton swab with alcohol when I do (comes off quick if you do it this way).


i was wondering last nite, if you can use another cooler,
to check if it changes anything, if not,
then at least you know its not your H100i









how and where did you lap the bottom of the IHS?
you still have liquid pro on the die ?


----------



## She loved E

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've thought of how to make my guide a bit more in-depth, but unfortunately, without another chip, I'm at a loss. Have you seen my guide by the way?


Yeah I used it. For starters I'd add something about the sensitivity of the pcb and that ANY knicks can kill it. A recommended method for removing adhesive would also help (fingernail didn't work for me).

Generally, more links to tutorials (video for instance) woould be a plus.

It would also be good to add some content around tightening heatsinks after delid since multiple ppl have reported damage or other problems when overtightening.

I'd be happy to help compile these into more usable content if you want. I don't mean to criticise since your guide is good, but I think more detail would help.


----------



## Matt-Matt

I'd like to just post again with how happy I am with my de-lid. Today the ambients have been much higher then usual (it's really hot, like so hot I can't go outside for too long). So hot my 3570k is idling at ~45c all day, it usually idles at 30-35c depending on the time of day. The load of a quick IBT is ~70c. I'm still amazed at how much it helped.

I'd suggest it to anyone that is into overclocking and likes to tweak with hardware


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Pre delid
> 
> 
> 
> Post delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Difference of *29C*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Nice *PuffinMyLye*!

Did you every get to check your MB voltages?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *This is a message to all the delidders and future delidders!*
> 
> Valgaur and I are in the middle of trying to make this club better than now. I have suggested we put another spreadsheet in the OP for people who have failed their delid, how many times they have failed, and whether they have succeeded in a different attempt.
> 
> Would this be good or something that will not appreciated? Answers would like to be given quickly so we don't waste time making something that won't help anyone.


There may be some value in doing so depending on how it is done. The main thing that seems to kill chips is scratching the pcb. Next would be bad remounting of the IHS when the clip is pulled onto it. Maybe better to just collect some data on % of failuers by type with overall numbers of each, but not by name (as I would be stuck on that list myself!)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 1. nervous
> 2. not confident, (what if)
> 3. not well prepared
> 4. working to fast, impatient
> 5. other reaosns, like socks and spilling fluid over ram etc..
> 6. using wrong equipment (pocket knife vid) ..lol
> 7. hmmmm..hmm, that about what comes to my mind


For me it was #6. Using the exacto knife instead of the razor blade lead to a small scratch on the pcb. Although others (*VonDutch*!) seemed fine with the exacto knife thing! I only use razor blades now and they work great.

Maybe we can keep track of what successful attempts have used too or instead.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I mostly recommended this because there were some people who were PMing me how many people failed at this mod.
> 
> 
> 
> IMO the time would be better spent on a more complete how-to. I didn't do much wrong but it was still enough to fry the chip. If I knew how easy it is to scratch the pcb I would have been more careful.
> 
> I'm happy to be added to a "fail" list... I posted my experience here so ppl could learn from it. But honestly a list is just gonna scare ppl away because they still won't have the info to do it properly.
Click to expand...

These are good thoughts to consider by *She loved E*. A better and more complete how-to noting the best practices, as well as the major things to avoid doing. And if we are to show failed attempts, we need to consider how they are presented and in the context of all the successes too. People need to be aware of the risks (and we do tell them that even now), but we do not want to scare people off as it is really an easy process with such great results if done right. And we can find a way to teach then how to do it the right way better.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've thought of how to make my guide a bit more in-depth, but unfortunately, without another chip, I'm at a loss. Have you seen my guide by the way?
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I used it. For starters I'd add something about the sensitivity of the pcb and that ANY knicks can kill it. A recommended method for removing adhesive would also help (fingernail didn't work for me).
> 
> Generally, more links to tutorials (video for instance) woould be a plus.
> 
> It would also be good to add some content around tightening heatsinks after delid since multiple ppl have reported damage or other problems when overtightening.
> 
> I'd be happy to help compile these into more usable content if you want. I don't mean to criticise since your guide is good, but I think more detail would help.
Click to expand...

I think these are good comments to consider too.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'd like to just post again with how happy I am with my de-lid. Today the ambients have been much higher then usual (it's really hot, like so hot I can't go outside for too long). So hot my 3570k is idling at ~45c all day, it usually idles at 30-35c depending on the time of day. The load of a quick IBT is ~70c. I'm still amazed at how much it helped.
> 
> I'd suggest it to anyone that is into overclocking and likes to tweak with hardware


And so am I *Matt-Matt*! And everytime I use my system I love to see the delidded temps. Delidding is a great mod well worth the risk for many OCers, and I am glad I took the risk - twice!

And I'd do it again!


----------



## Swag

Wilco to all the suggestions.

From the start, I was kinda weary as to how people would look at the failures. If only we didn't live in such a judgmental world.


----------



## VonDutch

just did a 4.7ghz run using 0.055V offset, my new daily oc









65C hottest core







,
cpuz reports 1.296 and 1.320V vcore , real numbers are different tho,
while running ibt, the vid jumped between 1.2310 and 1.2510


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Nice *PuffinMyLye*!
> Did you every get to check your MB voltages?
> There may be some value in doing so depending on how it is done. The main thing that seems to kill chips is scratching the pcb. Next would be bad remounting of the IHS when the clip is pulled onto it. Maybe better to just collect some data on % of failuers by type with overall numbers of each, but not by name (as I would be stuck on that list myself!)
> For me it was #6. Using the exacto knife instead of the razor blade lead to a small scratch on the pcb. Although others (*VonDutch*!) seemed fine with the exacto knife thing! I only use razor blades now and they work great.
> Maybe we can keep track of what successful attempts have used too or instead.
> These are good thoughts to consider by *She loved E*. A better and more complete how-to noting the best practices, as well as the major things to avoid doing. And if we are to show failed attempts, we need to consider how they are presented and in the context of all the successes too. People need to be aware of the risks (and we do tell them that even now), but we do not want to scare people off as it is really an easy process with such great results if done right. And we can find a way to teach then how to do it the right way better.


Yes, maybe a guide on what to do with pictures and what to not do? And an extensive list of the right tools/equipment and such.
Along with places to buy CLP/CLU for different countries. etc.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I think these are good comments to consider too.
> And so am I *Matt-Matt*! And everytime I use my system I love to see the delidded temps. Delidding is a great mod well worth the risk for many OCers, and I am glad I took the risk - twice!
> And I'd do it again!


Yes, same








I'd do it again if I had to







Maybe with a newer less blunt blade though...


----------



## Valgaur

Remember guys when I get Franky 2.0 I'll be doing a ton of pictures on the process and using art to diagram everything correctly. This way we can have a very thorough guide here.

Swag wanna help me out with this as well?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember guys when I get Franky 2.0 I'll be doing a ton of pictures on the process and using art to diagram everything correctly. This way we can have a very thorough guide here.
> 
> Swag wanna help me out with this as well?


Give me the pictures and I'll update my guide and I'll probably try to make a video with my own chip. My chip, when I delidded it, actually had none of the glue visible. That is why I know even if it was flattened to the max, it is still possible to delid.







I will help the future delidders as much as I can so, yes I can help you with that!


----------



## VonDutch

think this is one of the best,









!


























how NOT to delid!










we could pick out the best from this lot, if needed i can find more i think


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> think this is one of the best,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how NOT to delid!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> we could pick out the best from this lot, if needed i can find more i think


I agree, the first one was the best.

Also, the very last link made me laugh so hard! Oh god. That kid deserved to have that chip die. I mean, did you see how he even handled the chip to test if the mobo was working or not. He basically threw it away!


----------



## Swag

Guys, does anyone know how to clean sleeved cables? Would it be fine to just bury them in mild soap and water and just let them dry overnight or a few days?


----------



## stickg1

So Mama Stick is getting me a new chip. I will be sure to test it thoroughly before delidding. The only problem is, if it does suck like my current one, its not like I can just take it back. The closest Micro Center is 5 hours way, hence me being excited that my mom is going to make a run for me on the way to Tennessee. I guess I will just remain hopeful. Also if I do keep the new chip over my old chip, what is a fair asking price for my delidded chip? I believe for someone that isn't an extreme OC enthusiast, they could care less if they need 1.53v for 4.7GHz because they will likely stay with 4.0-4.4GHz anyway right?

I will definitely mention that it is delidded, but should I tack the IHS onto the die with a couple drops of super glue to make it easier for the new owner to handle?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So Mama Stick is getting me a new chip. I will be sure to test it thoroughly before delidding. The only problem is, if it does suck like my current one, its not like I can just take it back. The closest Micro Center is 5 hours way, hence me being excited that my mom is going to make a run for me on the way to Tennessee. I guess I will just remain hopeful. Also if I do keep the new chip over my old chip, what is a fair asking price for my delidded chip? I believe for someone that isn't an extreme OC enthusiast, they could care less if they need 1.53v for 4.7GHz because they will likely stay with 4.0-4.4GHz anyway right?
> 
> I will definitely mention that it is delidded, but should I tack the IHS onto the die with a couple drops of super glue to make it easier for the new owner to handle?


To be honest, if it's delidded, just plop on some super glue and sell it same price as a normal chip. If they are normal users, I doubt you need to really mention the delid part (might drive them away anyway) because really, as long as it works, no point. Especially with glue on it already. Also super glue might burn the PCB so don't use that.


----------



## stickg1

I might just sell it discounted to one of my friends at Tom's. We trade stuff all the time so I'm fine with giving them a deal. If I secure the IHS for them they wont care either way. (Some of them are older guys and wouldn't want to be bothered with a loose IHS) Should I just use some of that black rubber adhesive then?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I might just sell it discounted to one of my friends at Tom's. We trade stuff all the time so I'm fine with giving them a deal. If I secure the IHS for them they wont care either way. (Some of them are older guys and wouldn't want to be bothered with a loose IHS) Should I just use some of that black rubber adhesive then?


Yea, any black epoxy glue would suffice. I recommend you using a tiny bit only so you are able to keep the new temps!


----------



## liamstears

Suppose you can add me to the club but at the same time I will share my experience

First of all, do I recommend deliding? NO!

Do I think people should delid? NO!

Heres my reason's

Firstly my Delid does seem to of been a success, everything seems to be working with no issues but I did make 2 tiny scratches to the pcb so I can see a little bit of gold instead of just green. Has this damaged anything? Who knows. It all seems to be working ok but I will prob never really know

Secondly, real world gains? For most of us NONE! Did it decrease temps? at a moderate overclock of 4.4? NO! I will do further testing though but considering I'm still hitting over 80C at only 4.4 I'm 99% sure this hasn't help

Will I ever delid again? NO!
Why? No real gains but can very easily damage a £240 CPU!

My advice for people who really feel the need to delid:

Make sure to use a very very thin blade that is very sharp
Be extremely careful and don't use any real force
Wiggle the blade gently and slowly, make sure it is flat to the PCB and in no way going to be pushed down towards the pcb
Still expect damage, It can very easily happen
Only really do it if you got the funds to replace it

Overall though I would not recommend this process to anyone, is it really worth the trouble for minimal gains? I would say no

The only people I would recommend to do it are those that can afford to replace if something goes wrong and only if there chip is able to do a moderate overclock at very low volts but still being hot

If you can do low volts and temps its fine leave it

If you can only do a low clock on high volts - get a different chip

My 2 cents


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> 
> Suppose you can add me to the club but at the same time I will share my experience
> First of all, do I recommend deliding? NO!
> Do I think people should delid? NO!
> Heres my reason's
> Firstly my Delid does seem to of been a success, everything seems to be working with no issues but I did make 2 tiny scratches to the pcb so I can see a little bit of gold instead of just green. Has this damaged anything? Who knows. It all seems to be working ok but I will prob never really know
> Secondly, real world gains? For most of us NONE! Did it decrease temps? at a moderate overclock of 4.4? NO! I will do further testing though but considering I'm still hitting over 80C at only 4.4 I'm 99% sure this hasn't help
> Will I ever delid again? NO!
> Why? No real gains but can very easily damage a £240 CPU!
> My advice for people who really feel the need to delid:
> Make sure to use a very very thin blade that is very sharp
> Be extremely careful and don't use any real force
> Wiggle the blade gently and slowly, make sure it is flat to the PCB and in no way going to be pushed down towards the pcb
> Still expect damage, It can very easily happen
> Only really do it if you got the funds to replace it
> Overall though I would not recommend this process to anyone, is it really worth the trouble for minimal gains? I would say no
> The only people I would recommend to do it are those that can afford to replace if something goes wrong and only if there chip is able to do a moderate overclock at very low volts but still being hot
> If you can do low volts and temps its fine leave it
> If you can only do a low clock on high volts - get a different chip
> My 2 cents


What paste did you use? Mine dropped at least 25c and probably closer to 30c..
Mine was my first de-lid, I didn't have the money for anything better then an i3 at the time (I still don't) and i used a partially rusted blade.. Works fine.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> 
> Suppose you can add me to the club but at the same time I will share my experience
> First of all, do I recommend deliding? NO!
> Do I think people should delid? NO!
> Heres my reason's
> Firstly my Delid does seem to of been a success, everything seems to be working with no issues but I did make 2 tiny scratches to the pcb so I can see a little bit of gold instead of just green. Has this damaged anything? Who knows. It all seems to be working ok but I will prob never really know
> Secondly, real world gains? For most of us NONE! Did it decrease temps? at a moderate overclock of 4.4? NO! I will do further testing though but considering I'm still hitting over 80C at only 4.4 I'm 99% sure this hasn't help
> Will I ever delid again? NO!
> Why? No real gains but can very easily damage a £240 CPU!
> My advice for people who really feel the need to delid:
> Make sure to use a very very thin blade that is very sharp
> Be extremely careful and don't use any real force
> Wiggle the blade gently and slowly, make sure it is flat to the PCB and in no way going to be pushed down towards the pcb
> Still expect damage, It can very easily happen
> Only really do it if you got the funds to replace it
> Overall though I would not recommend this process to anyone, is it really worth the trouble for minimal gains? I would say no
> The only people I would recommend to do it are those that can afford to replace if something goes wrong and only if there chip is able to do a moderate overclock at very low volts but still being hot
> If you can do low volts and temps its fine leave it
> If you can only do a low clock on high volts - get a different chip
> My 2 cents


My temps dropped 15C at a 4.3GHz overclock, so either you're doing it wrong or you used garbage TIM. Don't come in here and say that it doesn't work when 50 of us have seen 10-30C temp drops, that is just downright asinine.


----------



## Lobsterman

I guess he missed the part about using Coollabs Ultra/Pro


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My temps dropped 15C at a 4.3GHz overclock, so either you're doing it wrong or you used garbage TIM. Don't come in here and say that it doesn't work when 50 of us have seen 10-30C temp drops, that is just downright asinine.


Totally understand your point but I believe its all down to everyone's chips, each chip is different

I think I've made a 5C drop at 4.5 and that it, at 4.4 maybe a 2c drop

I'm using MX-4 so its a good paste and that's not the problem

I think though maybe I haven't removed enough of the glue, I removed it all from the shim and 99% of it from the pcb itself but there is still a very fine layer on the pcb as it didn't want to come off easy and I didn't want to damage the pcb anymore than the 2 lil scratches I have already got but to be fair I have removed the IHS again and done a re-paste and the paste is making a proper contact so I think this chip is just a DUD

Its a hot chip and needs quite a few volts to get it stable so I think I just have a dud, that's my reason for telling people to only do it if they have a good chip
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> I guess he missed the part about using Coollabs Ultra/Pro


Yeh I used MX-4, will it really make that much difference though?


----------



## Lobsterman

Have you read page 1 of this thread?


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Have you read page 1 of this thread?


Guess I will have to try Coollaboratory Liquid Pro

Does this stuff like stick like glue or will my IHS still slide when clamping in?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Totally understand your point but I believe its all down to everyone's chips, each chip is different
> I think I've made a 5C drop at 4.5 and that it, at 4.4 maybe a 2c drop
> I'm using MX-4 so its a good paste and that's not the problem
> I think though maybe I haven't removed enough of the glue, I removed it all from the shim and 99% of it from the pcb itself but there is still a very fine layer on the pcb as it didn't want to come off easy and I didn't want to damage the pcb anymore than the 2 lil scratches I have already got but to be fair I have removed the IHS again and done a re-paste and the paste is making a proper contact so I think this chip is just a DUD
> Its a hot chip and needs quite a few volts to get it stable so I think I just have a dud, that's my reason for telling people to only do it if they have a good chip
> Yeh I used MX-4, will it really make that much difference though?


Yeah actually it makes a huge difference on TIM. I used Antec Formula 7 at first and only lost 5C, then I used Cool Labs Liquid Pro and lost another 15C on top of that. I left a lot of the glue on too. So that's a 20C difference from stock, and a 15C difference from a conventional TIM. Antec Formula 7 is just as good as MX-4, so get yourself some liquid metal and you will definitely see a difference.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Guess I will have to try Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> Does this stuff like stick like glue or will my IHS still slide when clamping in?


It WILL slide, so you need to be careful and try to hold it in place while you clamp.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Totally understand your point but I believe its all down to everyone's chips, each chip is different
> I think I've made a 5C drop at 4.5 and that it, at 4.4 maybe a 2c drop
> I'm using MX-4 so its a good paste and that's not the problem
> I think though maybe I haven't removed enough of the glue, I removed it all from the shim and 99% of it from the pcb itself but there is still a very fine layer on the pcb as it didn't want to come off easy and I didn't want to damage the pcb anymore than the 2 lil scratches I have already got but to be fair I have removed the IHS again and done a re-paste and the paste is making a proper contact so I think this chip is just a DUD
> Its a hot chip and needs quite a few volts to get it stable so I think I just have a dud, that's my reason for telling people to only do it if they have a good chip
> Yeh I used MX-4, will it really make that much difference though?


yes it does a HUGE difference... Trust me, i did use mx-4 until i recieved the CLP... It's amazing.. GET IT NOW>


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It WILL slide, so you need to be careful and try to hold it in place while you clamp.


Ok sounds like I'm going with some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra or Pro

But which to go for?

Sounds like the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is a little less likely to damage things but the Pro is slightly better is that right?

I can get the Pro cheaper so should I go with that? Is it likely to damage anything as it sounds like quite an aggressive paste?

EDIT: Pro is £8.95, Ultra is £11.27


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Ok sounds like I'm going with some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra or Pro
> But which to go for?
> Sounds like the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is a little less likely to damage things but the Pro is slightly better is that right?
> I can get the Pro cheaper so should I go with that? Is it likely to damage anything as it sounds like quite an aggressive paste?
> EDIT: Pro is £8.95, Ultra is £11.27


get pro for the die and ultra to the HSF if you like, i only use pro.

edit: i would use pro all over since you have the same d14 as me.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Ok sounds like I'm going with some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra or Pro
> But which to go for?
> Sounds like the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is a little less likely to damage things but the Pro is slightly better is that right?
> I can get the Pro cheaper so should I go with that? Is it likely to damage anything as it sounds like quite an aggressive paste?
> EDIT: Pro is £8.95, Ultra is £11.27


its only aggresive against aluminum, so you can't use it on a cooler base plate thats made of that,
most are copper, or like the ihs, nickel plated copper

im pro all the way, i think its great, best thing to use on the die, which you dont change that much anyways,
what chris-br says, if you can afford it, buy both, and use pro on die, and ultra on ihs,
it easier to clean if you ever have to take your cooler of again..


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> get pro for the die and ultra to the HSF if you like, i only use pro.
> edit: i would use pro all over since you have the same d14 as me.


So its not recommended to use it only on die and use a thermal paste for ihs to hsf?

Best to use it on both die and heatsink?

Temp difference?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> So its not recommended to use it only on die and use a thermal paste for ihs to hsf?
> Best to use it on both die and heatsink?
> Temp difference?


I would just use pro on the die. On the IHS and heatsink just use a conventional paste. That's what I do because I change heatsinks and chips fairly often and the temp difference is negligible on the IHS. Unless of course you lap (or polish) the IHS. So my opinion is to get some Pro and use it on the die, and just use your MX-4 on the IHS. Pro is a pain in the buns to remove from the IHS and heatsink.


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I would just use pro on the die. On the IHS and heatsink just use a conventional paste. That's what I do because I change heatsinks and chips fairly often and the temp difference is negligible on the IHS. Unless of course you lap (or polish) the IHS. So my opinion is to get some Pro and use it on the die, and just use your MX-4 on the IHS. Pro is a pain in the buns to remove from the IHS and heatsink.


Ok will do this and report mid of next week hopefully

Thanks!


----------



## enigma7820

I dropped 3c using ultra on Ihs over mx4 and ultra cleans easy good luck


----------



## PuffinMyLye

I delidded my new 3570K last night and used CLP on both the die and IHS.

Here are my results. 29C drop ain't bad







.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Just forgot to ask before... Why is there a "32nm" section?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I delidded my new 3570K last night and used CLP on both the die and IHS.
> Here are my results. 29C drop ain't bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


This one was in your emulator box or your rig? Basically, water or air? And also what was your vcore during load for 4.7? I am assuming 1.04v is not it.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> This one was in your emulator box or your rig? Basically, water or air? And also what was your vcore during load for 4.7? I am assuming 1.04v is not it.


It's my main rig. Picked up a 3570k to replace the 3770k I just parted with. Vcore is 1.282 under load. And it's under water.


----------



## chronicfx

Nice. I have a 4.7 setting in bios and I am getting 65 degrees max with prime. So your temps are great, my vcore is 1.272v on load. But gaming it rarely cracks 50 degrees.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> I personally LOVE this review because they used mayonnaise, chocolate, lipstick, toothpaste, butter and spray oil in it. the best one I have ever seen, none others did
> 
> Have you ever used ICD? spread method is the ONLY method that actually works best with it, period.
> also try dot in middle method with CLU or CLP, LMAO, good luck ...
> Quote:


Yea dot method might not work too well with some of the specialty stuff like CLU/CLP, but in general it's much better than spreading.

They might have mayonnaise/chocolate/etc in their review, but their benches are terribly inaccurate so it doesn't mean anything. They also are testing stock voltages - the true heat profiles of compounds does not reveal itself until you push the higher temp ranges and powers. A Hyper 212 EVO is also going to be one of the best performing heatsinks in the world

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cooler-Master-Hyper-212-EVO-CPU-Cooler-Review/1407/6

Look, as consistent with the fact that HDT coolers outperform better coolers at lower temp ranges - they show the Hyper 212 Evo as being better than an NH-D14 (significanlty so) and Gamer Storm Assassin and Megahalems (which aren't great but still much better than 212)... When you start pushing higher temp ranges, the lower end products will fall by the wayside. Lipstick sounds okay in their benches, but if you put lipstick on a 4.5+ 1.3v+ sandy bridge your going to be sorry.
Quote:


> Edit: go to sidewindercomputers.com and search for liquid pro there. It's much cheaper there.


Thanks but out of stock.
Quote:


> why would you use a dot method with a tim , when the manual says to spread it,
> why spread it, when manual says, use dot or line method
> liquid pro/ultra need to be spread out, simple ..


Many companies say to use the spread method, it doesn't mean it's better. The spread method is terrible for thermal paste spreading, it's just idiot proof is all. But as I understand it CLU and other specialty pastes can't exactly be applied with dot method.
Quote:


> This is a message to all the delidders and future delidders!
> 
> Valgaur and I are in the middle of trying to make this club better than now. I have suggested we put another spreadsheet in the OP for people who have failed their delid, how many times they have failed, and whether they have succeeded in a different attempt.
> 
> Would this be good or something that will not appreciated? Answers would like to be given quickly so we don't waste time making something that won't help anyone.


Please do so, because I've been trying to figure out how people have failed and I can't find it through 73 pages x 100 posts...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> Secondly, real world gains? For most of us NONE! Did it decrease temps? at a moderate overclock of 4.4? NO! I will do further testing though but considering I'm still hitting over 80C at only 4.4 I'm 99% sure this hasn't help


yea at 4.4 ghz of course there's not going to be a difference if you delid...

Your also using a radial, low end cooler... being only in the 80's with basically a slightly improved stock cooler at 4.4ghz is pretty good.

It doesn't really sound like you know what you are doing, you shouldn't be making comments about how terrible delidding is if you can't do it right. Come back when you push 4.5+ ghz, 1.3v+, and get a decent tower, closed loop, or water cooling.

Also, MX-4 is not great paste. I wouldn't be surprised if the stock TIM was better. Why in the world would you use something as poor as MX-4 for a delid job. I'm getting a ton of crap just for saying I'm gonna use PK-3 instead of CLU/CLP for a delid job, and PK-3 is at least a few degrees better than MX-4.
Quote:


> Ok sounds like I'm going with some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra or Pro
> 
> But which to go for?


You should go for Ultra, not Pro. I don't know why anyone would recommend pro -_-

Ultra is literally just an updated version of pro. It's just superior, it's pro but much more convenient to use and the same, if not better, performance.


----------



## lilchronic

ok so i give up on trying to get 5ghz stable on my crappy asrock extrem4 dont get me wrong it is a good mobo for the price and all but its just not working out for me








ive done everything to try to get 5ghz stable it just cant . ive lasted longer @ 1.385v @5ghz than at 1.425v - 1.45v. @5ghz in prime and ibt







.
i dont no what to do but this is why i think my mobo is crap and i need a better 1. i been tryn to get this stable for weeks.

so now that i said that does any1 want to buy it 100$ shipped lol

or could it be just the chip i dont no

also i dont see my name on the spread sheet but thats ok because im only using mx-4 on die and and ihs
im still waiting for pro/ultra to get her and i ll be using pro on the die and ultra on the ihs then u can add me











after delid and my ambient temps were 5c-7c higher


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Many companies say to use the spread method, it doesn't mean it's better. The spread method is terrible for thermal paste spreading, it's just idiot proof is all. But as I understand it CLU and other specialty pastes can't exactly be applied with dot method.


this is pointed at me so,

show me "many companies" that say to use spread method?

i know of 1 company that advices to use the spreadmethod,
this is from their manual, i downloaded and read it when i bought mine,
you can download it here to check if you like,
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/

Instructions: How to use "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro"

How to apply "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro"

Now you may apply a small amount of "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" to the cooler surface's center. Do not use too
much, you will be amazed at how little you need. To begin with, do not use more than a little drop. Remember that
Liquid Metal's purpose is to fill tiny gaps, not to drip from the cooler. *Now spread out the "Coollaboratory Liquid
Pro" evenly across the cooler's surface from center to the sides.* You may use a thin paint brush, a "Q-Tip" cotton
swab or anything similar. Do not use your finger (greasy surface). Powder free rubber gloves may be used. Once
done with this work, your cooler's surface should shine like a mirror.

Note: You may also apply Liquid Metal to both the die or to the cooler's surface and the die. Make sure the
applied amount is not too large.

Please note: When applying Liquid Metal, a little more care is necessary compared to the application of
conventional pastes. But you are rewarded with a much better performance! Anyone without any experience in
dealing with computer hardware should pick another paste with a much poorer performance from other
manufacturers.

of course theres the youtube vid from the company,


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Please do so, because I've been trying to figure out how people have failed and I can't find it through 73 pages x 100 posts...
> yea at 4.4 ghz of course there's not going to be a difference if you delid...
> Your also using a radial, low end cooler... being only in the 80's with basically a slightly improved stock cooler at 4.4ghz is pretty good.
> It doesn't really sound like you know what you are doing, you shouldn't be making comments about how terrible delidding is if you can't do it right. Come back when you push 4.5+ ghz, 1.3v+, and get a decent tower, closed loop, or water cooling.
> Also, MX-4 is not great paste. I wouldn't be surprised if the stock TIM was better. Why in the world would you use something as poor as MX-4 for a delid job. I'm getting a ton of crap just for saying I'm gonna use PK-3 instead of CLU/CLP for a delid job, and PK-3 is at least a few degrees better than MX-4.
> You should go for Ultra, not Pro. I don't know why anyone would recommend pro -_-
> Ultra is literally just an updated version of pro. It's just superior, it's pro but much more convenient to use and the same, if not better, performance.


Umm people are recommending PRO because a lot of us have used both and get better results with PRO. Please do some research before coming in here and speaking your mind. You truly are digging yourself a deep hole and you have no credibility. You have no factual information backing up ANY of your statements.

Pro works better for on the bare die after delidding, Ultra works better on top of the IHS. This has been proven through actual USE!

In regards to the guy you said had terrible cooling, he has an $80 air cooler that outperforms many CLCs. That is not terrible cooling, and I did my reference test at 4.3GHz and still got a 20C drop in temps. So it doesn't matter what frequency or voltage, if you do it right, you get temperature drops.

And as far as failures go, there are multiple things that can go wrong when delidding a chip.

1. Accidently scratch the PCB of the CPU when removing the glue
2. Accidently nick the corner of the CPU
3. Accidently let the IHS slip when clamping the chip into place and damage your LGA pins
4. Accidently let the razor go too far and damage the die itself.

Just to name a few...

Please refer to the first page and look at the table, on average people that used PRO on the die have lower temperature difference than those who use ULTRA or anything else for that matter on the die.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Many companies say to use the spread method, it doesn't mean it's better. The spread method is terrible for thermal paste spreading, it's just idiot proof is all. But as I understand it CLU and other specialty pastes can't exactly be applied with dot method.
> 
> 
> 
> this is pointed at me so,
> 
> show me "many companies" that say to use spread method?
> 
> i know of 1 company that advices to use the spreadmethod,
> this is from their manual, i downloaded and read it when i bought mine,
> you can download it here to check if you like,
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/
> 
> Instructions: How to use "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro"
> 
> How to apply "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro"
> 
> Now you may apply a small amount of "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" to the cooler surface's center. Do not use too
> much, you will be amazed at how little you need. To begin with, do not use more than a little drop. Remember that
> Liquid Metal's purpose is to fill tiny gaps, not to drip from the cooler. *Now spread out the "Coollaboratory Liquid
> Pro" evenly across the cooler's surface from center to the sides.* You may use a thin paint brush, a "Q-Tip" cotton
> swab or anything similar. Do not use your finger (greasy surface). Powder free rubber gloves may be used. Once
> done with this work, your cooler's surface should shine like a mirror.
> 
> Note: You may also apply Liquid Metal to both the die or to the cooler's surface and the die. Make sure the
> applied amount is not too large.
> 
> Please note: When applying Liquid Metal, a little more care is necessary compared to the application of
> conventional pastes. But you are rewarded with a much better performance! Anyone without any experience in
> dealing with computer hardware should pick another paste with a much poorer performance from other
> manufacturers.
> 
> of course theres the youtube vid from the company,
Click to expand...

http://www.prolimatech.com/en/support/index.asp?itemid=20

http://www.arcticsilver.com/pdf/appmeth/int/ss/intel_app_method_surface_spread_v1.1.pdf

Bam.

I know the company might say one thing, but real world tests show the spread method to be terrible. I even did multiple spread and dot/line/rice testing and found spread was the worst (although not nearly as bad as using too much paste, and it's nearly impossible to use too little paste).

Now everyone says 'clu is different', and I'm sure it is. So I'm not sure about it. I would think dot/rice grain/etc method would be best for it too, but as I understand you cant do that with CLU.
Quote:


> Umm people are recommending PRO because a lot of use have used both and get better results with PRO. Please do some research before coming in here and speaking your mind. You truly are digging yourself a deep hole and you have no credibility. You have no factual information backing up ANY of your statements.


The coolaboratory website. Plenty of people have said Ultra is better.

There aren't many benches out there, but I think the company is a reliable source on this, especially given that Ultra is an update to Pro, rather than a completely new paste (although it is that too).

I think that's factual enough to back it up, as there aren't any benches out there on the matter. It would be like saying PK-2 is better than PK-1, even though test results (the few out there) show them to be basically identical, PK-2 is an update of PK-1 and, according to the company, is supposed to be slightly better.
Quote:


> Please refer to the first page and look at the table, on average people that used PRO on the die have lower temperature difference than those who use ULTRA or anything else for that matter on the die.


That is so not a reliable way to judge how a thermal paste compares to another thermal material lol...
Quote:


> In regards to the guy you said had terrible cooling, he has an $80 air cooler that outperforms many CLCs. That is not terrible cooling, and I did my reference test at 4.3GHz and still got a 20C drop in temps. So it doesn't matter what frequency or voltage, if you do it right, you get temperature drops.


You are right, it is an $80 cooler, but it is not a performance cooler. It's $80 because it's Noctua and low profile, not because it's performance cooling.

http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/noctua_nhc14_review/4.htm

I hope OC-club is a reliable source, I don't recall any issues with their tests.

20*C drop at your reference test at 4.3ghz simply means you got huge results. And was that strictly from delidding, or because you applied CLU on both the IHS and die, maybe changed coolers? It wouldn't be fair to compare a 20*C drop from using CLU on both your die and IHS, to someone using MX-4 on his die and IHS... You could probably get close to 10*C drop using CLU vs MX-4 just on the IHS.

I may not have delidded an i5 yet, but you don't need to be so disrespectful towards me. I have done a ****ton of thermal testing with varying pastes (granted, not CLU) and heatsinks over the last few weeks, I've been around for a while (been here longer than you...). I am not saying anything huge here by saying that Liquid Ultra is an update to the Liquid Pro, it's on the company website. There is hardly 'proof' of pro being better than ultra.


----------



## Belial

Also, I'll just have you know that the shortest drop in temps was from using Liquid Pro @ 6*C, while the largest was 31*C from Liquid Ultra.

And it's utterly insane to compare thermal materials based on who get bigger temp drops when delidding and applying one paste over another. Not all delids are equal, as not all CPUs are as screwed up, and that doesn't factor in changes in paste, ambient, etc...

If one is better than the other, that's fine, I'm more than up for hearing facts on the matter, but liquid ultra is 'supposed' to be better, in that it's just an update to Liquid Pro.

This isn't like saying PK-2 is better than MX-4. It's like saying PK2 is better than PK1, which I think would be generally accepted.


----------



## Valgaur

to the 32nm question lol. I just haven't gotten rid of it lol.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Nice. I have a 4.7 setting in bios and I am getting 65 degrees max with prime. So your temps are great, my vcore is 1.272v on load. But gaming it rarely cracks 50 degrees.


Very nice! I doubt when I game that my temps go above 45 at 4.7. I'm going to try pushing my OC up higher though when I get around to testing my actual voltage with the multimeter I just picked up.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Suppose you can add me to the club but at the same time I will share my experience
> 
> First of all, do I recommend deliding? NO!
> 
> Do I think people should delid? NO!
> 
> Heres my reason's
> 
> Firstly my Delid does seem to of been a success, everything seems to be working with no issues but I did make 2 tiny scratches to the pcb so I can see a little bit of gold instead of just green. Has this damaged anything? Who knows. It all seems to be working ok but I will prob never really know
> 
> Secondly, real world gains? For most of us NONE! Did it decrease temps? at a moderate overclock of 4.4? NO! I will do further testing though but considering I'm still hitting over 80C at only 4.4 I'm 99% sure this hasn't help
> 
> Will I ever delid again? NO!
> Why? No real gains but can very easily damage a £240 CPU!
> 
> My advice for people who really feel the need to delid:
> 
> Make sure to use a very very thin blade that is very sharp
> Be extremely careful and don't use any real force
> Wiggle the blade gently and slowly, make sure it is flat to the PCB and in no way going to be pushed down towards the pcb
> Still expect damage, It can very easily happen
> Only really do it if you got the funds to replace it
> 
> Overall though I would not recommend this process to anyone, is it really worth the trouble for minimal gains? I would say no
> 
> The only people I would recommend to do it are those that can afford to replace if something goes wrong and only if there chip is able to do a moderate overclock at very low volts but still being hot
> 
> If you can do low volts and temps its fine leave it
> 
> If you can only do a low clock on high volts - get a different chip
> 
> My 2 cents


*liamstears*, I am sad your delidding has yet to produce the results you wanted, but do continue to ask questions and work with us before posting that it is something no one should do. You may be dissappointed, but work with us some to see what can be done for a bit.

First off, do as others have suggested and get some CL PRO or Ultra. These TIMs do make a major difference in temps for delidding - better than any others we have tried so far.

Second, if that does not drop temps enough, consider lapping your IHS. Many of us have found that they are concave/convex and not flat enough to make good contact with the die and HSF. If the IHS is flat, lapping will improve temps 1-3C, but if the IHS is not flat, you could gain 10-12C by lapping!

Also, maybe consider modifying your post above until you find out if delidding really is something you would not want anyone to try!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> I personally LOVE this review because they used mayonnaise, chocolate, lipstick, toothpaste, butter and spray oil in it. the best one I have ever seen, none others did
> 
> Have you ever used ICD? spread method is the ONLY method that actually works best with it, period.
> also try dot in middle method with CLU or CLP, LMAO, good luck ...
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Yea dot method might not work too well with some of the specialty stuff like CLU/CLP, but in general it's much better than spreading.
> 
> They might have mayonnaise/chocolate/etc in their review, but their benches are terribly inaccurate so it doesn't mean anything. They also are testing stock voltages - the true heat profiles of compounds does not reveal itself until you push the higher temp ranges and powers. A Hyper 212 EVO is also going to be one of the best performing heatsinks in the world
> 
> http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cooler-Master-Hyper-212-EVO-CPU-Cooler-Review/1407/6
> 
> Look, as consistent with the fact that HDT coolers outperform better coolers at lower temp ranges - they show the Hyper 212 Evo as being better than an NH-D14 (significanlty so) and Gamer Storm Assassin and Megahalems (which aren't great but still much better than 212)... When you start pushing higher temp ranges, the lower end products will fall by the wayside. Lipstick sounds okay in their benches, but if you put lipstick on a 4.5+ 1.3v+ sandy bridge your going to be sorry.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: go to sidewindercomputers.com and search for liquid pro there. It's much cheaper there.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks but out of stock.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> why would you use a dot method with a tim , when the manual says to spread it,
> why spread it, when manual says, use dot or line method
> liquid pro/ultra need to be spread out, simple ..
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Many companies say to use the spread method, it doesn't mean it's better. The spread method is terrible for thermal paste spreading, it's just idiot proof is all. But as I understand it CLU and other specialty pastes can't exactly be applied with dot method.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> This is a message to all the delidders and future delidders!
> 
> Valgaur and I are in the middle of trying to make this club better than now. I have suggested we put another spreadsheet in the OP for people who have failed their delid, how many times they have failed, and whether they have succeeded in a different attempt.
> 
> Would this be good or something that will not appreciated? Answers would like to be given quickly so we don't waste time making something that won't help anyone.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Please do so, because I've been trying to figure out how people have failed and I can't find it through 73 pages x 100 posts...
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> Secondly, real world gains? For most of us NONE! Did it decrease temps? at a moderate overclock of 4.4? NO! I will do further testing though but considering I'm still hitting over 80C at only 4.4 I'm 99% sure this hasn't help
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> yea at 4.4 ghz of course there's not going to be a difference if you delid...
> 
> Your also using a radial, low end cooler... being only in the 80's with basically a slightly improved stock cooler at 4.4ghz is pretty good.
> 
> It doesn't really sound like you know what you are doing, you shouldn't be making comments about how terrible delidding is if you can't do it right. Come back when you push 4.5+ ghz, 1.3v+, and get a decent tower, closed loop, or water cooling.
> 
> Also, MX-4 is not great paste. I wouldn't be surprised if the stock TIM was better. Why in the world would you use something as poor as MX-4 for a delid job. I'm getting a ton of crap just for saying I'm gonna use PK-3 instead of CLU/CLP for a delid job, and PK-3 is at least a few degrees better than MX-4.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Ok sounds like I'm going with some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra or Pro
> 
> But which to go for?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should go for Ultra, not Pro. I don't know why anyone would recommend pro -_-
> 
> Ultra is literally just an updated version of pro. It's just superior, it's pro but much more convenient to use and the same, if not better, performance.
Click to expand...

@*Belial*. You will quickly lose all credibility on this thread if you keep speaking without any knowledge - even faster here than other threads. Many of the people here do not just read reviews, but actually test things for themselves, and then share what they learn with others. If someone comes on here talking nosense we catch on very fast.

You give some examples above. *So I can tell you why people on here recommend PRO over Ultra*. I have actually tried CL PRO. I have actually tried CL Ultra. PRO will cool temps by 1-3C better than Ultra when used between the die and IHS. Ultra is better for removing easier. I know this because I have tested it. Others on here have tested it. We have shared our results. Our information is not just from a review.

So please refrain from making your statements like the ones above until you have spent more time actually learning from testing and, more importantly, from others who may know more than you.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Also, I'll just have you know that the shortest drop in temps was from using Liquid Pro @ 6*C, while the largest was 31*C from Liquid Ultra.
> 
> And it's utterly insane to compare thermal materials based on who get bigger temp drops when delidding and applying one paste over another. Not all delids are equal, as not all CPUs are as screwed up, and that doesn't factor in changes in paste, ambient, etc...
> 
> If one is better than the other, that's fine, I'm more than up for hearing facts on the matter, but liquid ultra is 'supposed' to be better, in that it's just an update to Liquid Pro.
> 
> This isn't like saying PK-2 is better than MX-4. It's like saying PK2 is better than PK1, which I think would be generally accepted.


Dude, you really need to learn more before you talk......


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Also, I'll just have you know that the shortest drop in temps was from using Liquid Pro @ 6*C, while the largest was 31*C from Liquid Ultra.
> And it's utterly insane to compare thermal materials based on who get bigger temp drops when delidding and applying one paste over another. Not all delids are equal, as not all CPUs are as screwed up, and that doesn't factor in changes in paste, ambient, etc...
> If one is better than the other, that's fine, I'm more than up for hearing facts on the matter, but liquid ultra is 'supposed' to be better, in that it's just an update to Liquid Pro.
> This isn't like saying PK-2 is better than MX-4. It's like saying PK2 is better than PK1, which I think would be generally accepted.


Like I said Ultra is better on an IHS. Did Cool Lab's design this thermal material to specifically go in between the die of a CPU and IHS? No, probably not. What Ultra does better than liquid Pro is fill larger spaces. PRO is really only effective at filling tiny microscopic spaces. That's why they recommend lapping your CPU surface and heatsink surface in the manual. Because it works better the smaller the gap. Ultra was designed to be more uniform and fill gaps regardless of lapping. Granted if you did lap, as with any TIM, it would work better. The difference is the thermal conductivity rating (W/m*K) and the PRO is higher.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Nice. I have a 4.7 setting in bios and I am getting 65 degrees max with prime. So your temps are great, my vcore is 1.272v on load. But gaming it rarely cracks 50 degrees.
> 
> 
> 
> Very nice! I doubt when I game that my temps go above 45 at 4.7. I'm going to try pushing my OC up higher though when I get around to testing my actual voltage with the multimeter I just picked up.
Click to expand...

I am very much interested in when you get to actually test your voltages *PuffinMyLye*. Ihave considered a board like yours and want to know how close the vcore readings are to a multimeter, especially considering the great vcore you get with your chips. You have changed my idea of what a good chip is with your last 3770K! Any feedback from the new owner yet?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I delidded my new 3570K last night and used CLP on both the die and IHS.
> Here are my results. 29C drop ain't bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


great result







CLP all the way, hmm? hehe, nice, personally I wouldn't use it on the IHS (under cooling block) as it might be a pain to remove later on, but not necessarily so as some reported. anyways, nice result!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> It's my main rig. Picked up a 3570k to replace the 3770k I just parted with. Vcore is 1.282 under load. And it's under water.


not too shabby vcore, pretty fine for daily use. I guess it won't do 5GHz with 1.45V (or 1.38 as your former golden i7)? yeah, youre right, who cares about meaningless benching, if all we really do is use them daily while gaming or so heh.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Yea dot method might not work too well with some of the specialty stuff like CLU/CLP, but in general it's much better than spreading.
> They might have mayonnaise/chocolate/etc in their review, but their benches are terribly inaccurate so it doesn't mean anything. They also are testing stock voltages - the true heat profiles of compounds does not reveal itself until you push the higher temp ranges and powers. A Hyper 212 EVO is also going to be one of the best performing heatsinks in the world
> http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cooler-Master-Hyper-212-EVO-CPU-Cooler-Review/1407/6
> Look, as consistent with the fact that HDT coolers outperform better coolers at lower temp ranges - they show the Hyper 212 Evo as being better than an NH-D14 (significanlty so) and Gamer Storm Assassin and Megahalems (which aren't great but still much better than 212)... When you start pushing higher temp ranges, the lower end products will fall by the wayside. Lipstick sounds okay in their benches, but if you put lipstick on a 4.5+ 1.3v+ sandy bridge your going to be sorry.
> Thanks but out of stock.
> Many companies say to use the spread method, it doesn't mean it's better. The spread method is terrible for thermal paste spreading, it's just idiot proof is all. But as I understand it CLU and other specialty pastes can't exactly be applied with dot method.
> Please do so, because I've been trying to figure out how people have failed and I can't find it through 73 pages x 100 posts...
> yea at 4.4 ghz of course there's not going to be a difference if you delid...
> Your also using a radial, low end cooler... being only in the 80's with basically a slightly improved stock cooler at 4.4ghz is pretty good.
> It doesn't really sound like you know what you are doing, you shouldn't be making comments about how terrible delidding is if you can't do it right. Come back when you push 4.5+ ghz, 1.3v+, and get a decent tower, closed loop, or water cooling.
> Also, MX-4 is not great paste. I wouldn't be surprised if the stock TIM was better. Why in the world would you use something as poor as MX-4 for a delid job. I'm getting a ton of crap just for saying I'm gonna use PK-3 instead of CLU/CLP for a delid job, and PK-3 is at least a few degrees better than MX-4.
> You should go for Ultra, not Pro. I don't know why anyone would recommend pro -_-
> Ultra is literally just an updated version of pro. It's just superior, it's pro but much more convenient to use and the same, if not better, performance.


why so serious buddy?







we all know that about reviews bias this way or another, testing conditions and CPu OC thermal output being higher than at stock (variable between chips) volts, it's not the first TIM review we've seen, I just enjoyed this one best and it makes it my favorite







... we all did our own comparisons throughout years and used air cooling in past (personally I had 2 kinds of HDT before, were good but not great).

just chill out and enjoy the thread








make benches under load at some moderate OC before delid, then delid it, make more benches and come back with your results









honestly, try some CLU (again check sidewindercomputers.com for best price) if you can't find a decent pricde on CLP and you won't regret it, just use a VERY thin layer without any metallic bubbles on the CPU die and it will work great. have you checked the results on first page? really, it answers it all ... people get nearly same results with both CLP & CLU.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> @Belial. You will quickly lose all credibility on this thread if you keep speaking without any knowledge - even faster here than other threads. Many of the people here do not just read reviews, but actually test things for themselves, and then share what they learn with others. If someone comes on here talking nosense we catch on very fast.
> 
> You give some examples above. So I can tell you why people on here recommend PRO over Ultra. I have actually tried CL PRO. I have actually tried CL Ultra. PRO will cool temps by 1-3C better than Ultra when used between the die and IHS. Ultra is better for removing easier. I know this because I have tested it. Others on here have tested it. We have shared our results. Our information is not just from a review.
> 
> So please refrain from making your statements like the ones above until you have spent more time actually learning from testing and, more importantly, from others who may know more than you.


Okay, I stand corrected. I'm quite shocked that an update (ultra to the pro) would be worse, and that even the company recommends Ultra as better.
Quote:


> honestly, try some CLU (again check sidewindercomputers.com for best price) if you can't find a decent pricde on CLP and you won't regret it, just use a VERY thin layer without any metallic bubbles on the CPU die and it will work great. have you checked the results on first page? really, it answers it all ... people get nearly same results with both CLP & CLU.


I have no doubt that both CLU/CLP are great and better than pk-3. I appreciate your input when you said you got a 10*C drop from PK-3 to CLU/P. It seems a little hard to believe that such a large temp drop would occur with any paste over PK-3 (or a similar up to date, high end paste), but from what I've read it seems differences are further magnified by use on-die. Maybe it's a little bit of both in your case (maybe 5*C improvement with CL, then the other 5*C is just better paste job?).

I don't mean to doubt you or question your abilities, but it just kind of shocks me (in my experience, it's very easy to use too much paste, which really hurts temps, but too little is almost impossible).

I think for now I'll use PK-3. If temps become a limiting factor (i dont even have a single component for my new build yet, mind you), I'll consider buying some CL before I get a new fan or anything.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.prolimatech.com/en/support/index.asp?itemid=20
> http://www.arcticsilver.com/pdf/appmeth/int/ss/intel_app_method_surface_spread_v1.1.pdf
> *Bam.*
> I know the company might say one thing, but real world tests show the spread method to be terrible. I even did multiple spread and dot/line/rice testing and found spread was the worst (although not nearly as bad as using too much paste, and it's nearly impossible to use too little paste).


BamBam







(looks at his sig)

thank you, but only 2, thats not many companies









i used AS5 long time, and used it the way as described in their manual,
i never ran into problems using it, if anything goes wrong, i did something wrong right









pk-1 i dont know,
i would still say, follow the manual if it says so, or in this case the FAQ,


----------



## Belial

well that was just the results of a quick 20 second search.

I did tons of remounts and reseating and such with PK1, PK2, PK3, and some other pastes and heatsinks. Spread is significantly worse than just using dot/grain/etc method. Although what's most important is how much paste you use. I'm sure you've heard the whole air bubble thing with using spread method, I don't know how true that is but in my experience it seems likely because spread was always worse.

I even contacted Prolimatech about it, they said use spread method, it's the best, so on and so forth. Didn't hold true in multiple tests I did, on multiple heatsinks. I'll be throwing up a thread about it in a bit, with graphs and all.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 20*C drop at your reference test at 4.3ghz simply means you got huge results. And was that strictly from delidding, or because you applied CLU on both the IHS and die, maybe changed coolers? It wouldn't be fair to compare a 20*C drop from using CLU on both your die and IHS, to someone using MX-4 on his die and IHS... You could probably get close to 10*C drop using CLU vs MX-4 just on the IHS.
> I may not have delidded an i5 yet, but you don't need to be so disrespectful towards me. I have done a ****ton of thermal testing with varying pastes (granted, not CLU) and heatsinks over the last few weeks, I've been around for a while (been here longer than you...). I am not saying anything huge here by saying that Liquid Ultra is an update to the Liquid Pro, it's on the company website. There is hardly 'proof' of pro being better than ultra.


My testing was done with the same IHS TIM, the same cooler, on the same system, with the same CPU using the same frequency and voltages. That is how you have a control in your testing and get valid results to compare one thing to another.

My testing was Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on die vs CL PRO on die though where I got 15C. From stock intel TIM to Antec 7 I got 6C. So that is 21C difference from stock. But it's had to directly compare because I can't go back in time and test directly against stock.

It's hard not to get annoyed with you. This is not the first thread where you try to argue peoples ACTUAL experience as being false over your mere speculations. You have never delidded a CPU, you have never owned an Ivy CPU, you have never used CL ULTRA or PRO. Yet you speak as you are the leading authority on the matter. It's arrogant and will get you nowhere in a thread like this.

Yes you have been a member of OCN for longer than me. I am new to OCN, I am not new to being a PC enthusiast. You can find me on other forums as well.


----------



## VonDutch

@Belial,
can you quote with member names?, having a hard time knowing who's talking to you,
and who says what etc








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> well that was just the results of a quick 20 second search.
> I'm sure you've heard the whole air bubble thing with using spread method, I don't know how true that is but in my experience it seems likely because spread was always worse.
> I even contacted Prolimatech about it, they said use spread method, it's the best, so on and so forth. Didn't hold true in multiple tests I did, on multiple heatsinks. I'll be throwing up a thread about it in a bit, with graphs and all.


maybe you didnt spread it well then









i will be looking forward to that thread,
you having your own thread would be good..lol









im tired, laters peeps


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I am very much interested in when you get to actually test your voltages *PuffinMyLye*. Ihave considered a board like yours and want to know how close the vcore readings are to a multimeter, especially considering the great vcore you get with your chips. You have changed my idea of what a good chip is with your last 3770K! Any feedback from the new owner yet?


I'm curious too.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I am very much interested in when you get to actually test your voltages *PuffinMyLye*. Ihave considered a board like yours and want to know how close the vcore readings are to a multimeter, especially considering the great vcore you get with your chips. You have changed my idea of what a good chip is with your last 3770K! Any feedback from the new owner yet?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I'm curious too.


Check back in later tonight fellas. I'm going to test it out at a few different voltages tonight after the football games







. No word from the new owner yet but it was shipped to the UK so it probably won't get there till the end of next week.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> great result
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLP all the way, hmm? hehe, nice, personally I wouldn't use it on the IHS (under cooling block) as it might be a pain to remove later on, but not necessarily so as some reported. anyways, nice result!
> 
> not too shabby vcore, pretty fine for daily use. I guess it won't do 5GHz with 1.45V (or 1.38 as your former golden i7)? yeah, youre right, who cares about meaningless benching, if all we really do is use them daily while gaming or so heh..


Yea I've used CLP on the IHS with all 3 chips I've delidded and it's not too hard to get off. You just use the scrubber the CLP comes with to "sand" it off and then some IPA to finish it off, takes 2 minutes.

And yes this chip is certainly nowhere near my 3770K but it does appear to be an above average 3570 and that's all I was hoping for. I loved the "idea" of the 3770K but I was never going to put it to any real world use so I think I made the right decision especailly with the upgrade I really needed to make. If I can run this chip at 4.8Ghz 24/7 which looks promising especially considering my max temps of 54C at 4.7, I will be one happy man







.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Check back in later tonight fellas. I'm going to test it out at a few different voltages tonight after the football games
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . No word from the new owner yet but it was shipped to the UK so it probably won't get there till the end of next week.
> Yea I've used CLP on the IHS with all 3 chips I've delidded and it's not too hard to get off. You just use the scrubber the CLP comes with to "sand" it off and then some IPA to finish it off, takes 2 minutes.
> And yes this chip is certainly nowhere near my 3770K but it does appear to be an above average 3570 and that's all I was hoping for. I loved the "idea" of the 3770K but I was never going to put it to any real world use so I think I made the right decision especailly with the upgrade I really needed to make. If I can run this chip at 4.8Ghz 24/7 which looks promising especially considering my max temps of 54C at 4.7, I will be one happy man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


If the review is correct the vcore should be .04 to .06 low in Cpu-z on our boards. Hopefully it was just sins board that was off.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If the review is correct the vcore should be .04 to .06 low in Cpu-z on our boards. Hopefully it was just sins board that was off.


.040 to .060?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If the review is correct the vcore should be .04 to .06 low in Cpu-z on our boards. Hopefully it was just sins board that was off.


Yea I've seen Sins review and while I do expect the actual vcore to be somewhat higher than CPUz and the ASRock utility are reading, I'm hoping it's not THAT big of a difference.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Umm people are recommending PRO because a lot of us have used both and get better results with PRO. Please do some research before coming in here and speaking your mind. You truly are digging yourself a deep hole and you have no credibility. You have no factual information backing up ANY of your statements.
> Pro works better for on the bare die after delidding, Ultra works better on top of the IHS. This has been proven through actual USE!
> In regards to the guy you said had terrible cooling, he has an $80 air cooler that outperforms many CLCs. That is not terrible cooling, and I did my reference test at 4.3GHz and still got a 20C drop in temps. So it doesn't matter what frequency or voltage, if you do it right, you get temperature drops.
> And as far as failures go, there are multiple things that can go wrong when delidding a chip.
> 1. Accidently scratch the PCB of the CPU when removing the glue
> 2. Accidently nick the corner of the CPU
> 3. Accidently let the IHS slip when clamping the chip into place and damage your LGA pins
> 4. Accidently let the razor go too far and damage the die itself.
> Just to name a few...
> Please refer to the first page and look at the table, on average people that used PRO on the die have lower temperature difference than those who use ULTRA or anything else for that matter on the die.


I've yet to see anyone post actual comparisons between Ultra and Pro. If you have used both, as you claim, then can you post results? I personally don't believe Pro is better but am waiting for some to arrive so I can compare them both.

Some dude on the Xtreme Systems forums posts that Pro has a thermal conductivity of 82w/mk and Ultra has only 32w/mk and people believe it. He posted no sources to back his claim and most importantly Coollaboratory does not have this info on their website. I emailed them but they didn't reply. I found a webpage in German, where Coolabs are from which rates Ultra the same as Pro (http://www.pc-max.de/artikel/kuehlung/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/5863) Without official data from Coollabs we can't really say. The only way to know for sure is to test them, which is what I'll be doing once the Liquid Pro arrives


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I've seen Sins review and while I do expect the actual vcore to be somewhat higher than CPUz and the ASRock utility are reading, I'm hoping it's not THAT big of a difference.


lets hope. mine is off up to .068 off. yes I have a Fatal1ty board. Thats why when I give voltage its from my Fluke DMM not software values. I know of another Asrock board that acts just like mine does. I won't discuss it here because I do not have first hand experience with that board.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I've yet to see anyone post actual comparisons between Ultra and Pro. If you have used both, as you claim, then can you post results? I personally don't believe Pro is better but am waiting for some to arrive so I can compare them both.
> Some dude on the Xtreme Systems forums posts that Pro has a thermal conductivity of 82w/mk and Ultra has only 32w/mk and people believe it. He posted no sources to back his claim and most importantly Coollaboratory does not have this info on their website. I emailed them but they didn't reply. I found a webpage in German, where Coolabs are from which rates Ultra the same as Pro (http://www.pc-max.de/artikel/kuehlung/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/5863) Without official data from Coollabs we can't really say. The only way to know for sure is to test them, which is what I'll be doing once the Liquid Pro arrives


Yeah its hard to find legit documentation on it. I meant "us" like the delidded crew as a whole. I have only used PRO. I bought PRO after looking at the table and on the OP and it seemed to have the best results on average. But don't go by that, sounds like you will have the means to do a side by side comparison soon. We look forward to your results.


----------



## tw33k

Yeah, I can't wait for the Pro to arrive (will take a couple weeks unfortunately)

I just realised that I never posted my info to "officially" join:

OCN name: tw33k
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: 200MHz
OC after delid: 5GHz
Temp drops: 20.5c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2615429


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Yeah, I can't wait for the Pro to arrive (will take a couple weeks unfortunately)
> 
> I just realised that I never posted my info to "officially" join:
> OCN name: tw33k
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 200MHz
> OC after delid: 5GHz
> Temp drops: 20.5c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2615429


That's a helluva chip tweak! Assuming that's a prime stable? Not just a boot into windows


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Yeah, I can't wait for the Pro to arrive (will take a couple weeks unfortunately)
> 
> I just realised that I never posted my info to "officially" join:
> 
> OCN name: tw33k
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 200MHz
> OC after delid: 5GHz
> Temp drops: 20.5c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2615429


Have you added *tw33k*. Now slap our banner onto your sig - and officially welcome to the crew!


----------



## stickg1

I'm really hoping my new chip is better than this one. I will sell it for like $160 if anyone is interested. It wont get you crazy 5.0GHz+ OC's, but it is full functional and I do 4.5GHz all day under 75C with an Antec Kuhler.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm really hoping my new chip is better than this one. I will sell it for like $160 if anyone is interested. It wont get you crazy 5.0GHz+ OC's, but it is full functional and I do 4.5GHz all day under 75C with an Antec Kuhler.


Doubt you're gonna be able to sell it here in the delidded thread amonst people looking to push the limits but you'd probably have better luck just putting it in the for sale section.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If the review is correct the vcore should be .04 to .06 low in Cpu-z on our boards. Hopefully it was just sins board that was off.
> 
> 
> 
> Yea I've seen Sins review and while I do expect the actual vcore to be somewhat higher than CPUz and the ASRock utility are reading, I'm hoping it's not THAT big of a difference.
Click to expand...

Me too! I'm hoping your true voltage is very close to CPU-Z as I like your chip having been so good! It was cool seeing a IB that good!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Doubt you're gonna be able to sell it here in the delidded thread amonst people looking to push the limits but you'd probably have better luck just putting it in the for sale section.


Yeah I thought maybe someone had a backup machine or HTPC or something. But yeah I'll sell it over at Tom's. I dont have enough rep to sell here.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 20*C drop at your reference test at 4.3ghz simply means you got huge results. And was that strictly from delidding, or because you applied CLU on both the IHS and die, maybe changed coolers? It wouldn't be fair to compare a 20*C drop from using CLU on both your die and IHS, to someone using MX-4 on his die and IHS... You could probably get close to 10*C drop using CLU vs MX-4 just on the IHS.
> I may not have delidded an i5 yet, but you don't need to be so disrespectful towards me. I have done a ****ton of thermal testing with varying pastes (granted, not CLU) and heatsinks over the last few weeks, I've been around for a while (been here longer than you...). I am not saying anything huge here by saying that Liquid Ultra is an update to the Liquid Pro, it's on the company website. There is hardly 'proof' of pro being better than ultra.
> 
> 
> 
> My testing was done with the same IHS TIM, the same cooler, on the same system, with the same CPU using the same frequency and voltages. That is how you have a control in your testing and get valid results to compare one thing to another.
> 
> My testing was Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on die vs CL PRO on die though where I got 15C. From stock intel TIM to Antec 7 I got 6C. So that is 21C difference from stock. But it's had to directly compare because I can't go back in time and test directly against stock.
> 
> It's hard not to get annoyed with you. This is not the first thread where you try to argue peoples ACTUAL experience as being false over your mere speculations. You have never delidded a CPU, you have never owned an Ivy CPU, you have never used CL ULTRA or PRO. Yet you speak as you are the leading authority on the matter. It's arrogant and will get you nowhere in a thread like this.
> 
> Yes you have been a member of OCN for longer than me. I am new to OCN, I am not new to being a PC enthusiast. You can find me on other forums as well.
Click to expand...

No one said anything about using PK-3 and CLU/P in here, except one guy. I think his advice was very useful, but you aren't him, and he wasn't many people, he was one guy.

If you want to recall the P67/Z68 vs Z77 discussion, well it's irrelevant because MC has a $40 bundle deal on their Z77 boards so I've dropped the issue, but still no one has given me a good response on that issue since, like in this case, no one has actually commented on whether p67/z68 is any worse than a z77 at overclocking IB. I think someone brought up a useful comment saying that z77 is going to have the newest and best so it'll probably be smoother, but no one has brought up any anecdotal evidence of z68/p67 not overclocking as well as z77.

And isn't delidding, the main drop is from rubbing off the glue and reducing that gap, not from the paste? I dont think you can say you got a 21*C difference from stock, you got a 21*C difference from getting rid of the gap, the main reason why delidding is so successful, and switching the tim (im sure responsible for a few degrees too). I'm a bit confused on what you are saying though, like did you rub off the glue and try the stock tim, then antec 7, and then clu.... either way you dont really seem to have any evidence against what I've been talking about.

You are speculating just as much, and I don't think I'm speculating at all. I'm sure CL is great stuff, I have no doubt about that. It's proven that it's the best stuff out there. And it would probably be worth it to buy CLU or CLP for a delid job. I'm simply saying I'm going to delid first with pk3 and if I nee dmore, I'll get CLU/CLP. I dont think that's a crime. I'm aware it wont be as good as CLU/CLP but people have shown even delidding with the stock paste on has yielded significant results. If you have feedback on PK3 vs CLU/CLP, I'd love to hear it, otherwise please, don't speculate on the matter either.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vondutch*
> maybe you didnt spread it well then
> 
> i will be looking forward to that thread,
> you having your own thread would be good..lol


I've tried spread a few times and it was always terrible. it seems consistent with what others have had as results though.






I do think it's not really... real what they are doing here, but it's in line with what I've read, and in my experiences. Spread is disastrous.

1:50 for spread time btw.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346069/belials-heatsink-tim-comparison-and-reviews-hyper-212-h50-nh-d14-pk-1-pk-2-pk-3/0_100
my thread, comparing pk1/pk2/pk3 and hyper 212/h50/nh-d14.
Quote:


> Yeah its hard to find legit documentation on it. I meant "us" like the delidded crew as a whole. I have only used PRO. I bought PRO after looking at the table and on the OP and it seemed to have the best results on average. But don't go by that, sounds like you will have the means to do a side by side comparison soon. We look forward to your results.


surprise surprise, when you say clp > clu you were actually just speculating.

I think it's rather intuitive to believe the company who created both, and that clu is better than clp, since it's basically the same thing, but updated. Modern pastes are no longer about performance, it's all about ease of use, ie mx-4 vs mx-2, as5 being replaced by (i forget what), pk2 vs pk1, pk3 vs pk1, etc.

then again prolimatech says you should spread the paste so it wouldnt be the first time the company says something off

if anything i dont think there's evidence to say one way or the other on clp vs clu, if you really get down to it. it would be kind of odd if an update was worse than it's predecessor... although that's happened plenty of times in history.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> No one said anything about using PK-3 and CLU/P in here, except one guy. I think his advice was very useful, but you aren't him, and he wasn't many people, he was one guy.
> If you want to recall the P67/Z68 vs Z77 discussion, well it's irrelevant because MC has a $40 bundle deal on their Z77 boards so I've dropped the issue, but still no one has given me a good response on that issue since, like in this case, no one has actually commented on whether p67/z68 is any worse than a z77 at overclocking IB. I think someone brought up a useful comment saying that z77 is going to have the newest and best so it'll probably be smoother, but no one has brought up any anecdotal evidence of z68/p67 not overclocking as well as z77.
> And isn't delidding, the main drop is from rubbing off the glue and reducing that gap, not from the paste? I dont think you can say you got a 21*C difference from stock, you got a 21*C difference from getting rid of the gap, the main reason why delidding is so successful, and switching the tim (im sure responsible for a few degrees too). I'm a bit confused on what you are saying though, like did you rub off the glue and try the stock tim, then antec 7, and then clu.... either way you dont really seem to have any evidence against what I've been talking about.
> You are speculating just as much, and I don't think I'm speculating at all. I'm sure CL is great stuff, I have no doubt about that. It's proven that it's the best stuff out there. And it would probably be worth it to buy CLU or CLP for a delid job. I'm simply saying I'm going to delid first with pk3 and if I nee dmore, I'll get CLU/CLP. I dont think that's a crime. I'm aware it wont be as good as CLU/CLP but people have shown even delidding with the stock paste on has yielded significant results. If you have feedback on PK3 vs CLU/CLP, I'd love to hear it, otherwise please, don't speculate on the matter either.
> surprise surprise, when you say clp > clu you were actually just speculating.
> I think it's rather intuitive to believe the company who created both, and that clu is better than clp, since it's basically the same thing, but updated. Modern pastes are no longer about performance, it's all about ease of use, ie mx-4 vs mx-2, as5 being replaced by (i forget what), pk2 vs pk1, pk3 vs pk1, etc.
> then again prolimatech says you should spread the paste so it wouldnt be the first time the company says something off
> if anything i dont think there's evidence to say one way or the other on clp vs clu, if you really get down to it. it would be kind of odd if an update was worse than it's predecessor... although that's happened plenty of times in history.


What were the main problems people had with PRO in the first place?

1. It's difficult to remove without sanding the metals that contact it.
2. It doesn't fill larger gaps so lapping is required to get maximum performance.

So lets look at this from an economical/marketing stand-point. CoolLabs takes this feedback, spends money to develop a better product, they have to add more chemicals to said product, thus production cost rises. So now they have to sell this stuff for more than the PRO. Well if it's not better than the PRO but it costs more for the consumer, how do they sell it? I'll tell you how, market it as an updated version of the PRO. People say, "Wow, the PRO was pretty good but now they released the Ultra, it must be better." And in some cases with heatsink and IHS, it is better. But when you do a side by side comparison on a direct die, you get results like this guy:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *So I can tell you why people on here recommend PRO over Ultra*. I have actually tried CL PRO. I have actually tried CL Ultra. PRO will cool temps by 1-3C better than Ultra when used between the die and IHS. Ultra is better for removing easier. I know this because I have tested it. Others on here have tested it. We have shared our results. Our information is not just from a review.


I didn't remove the glue. Maybe that's why I only got a 20C drop...

I'm done with the pissing war. Cut your chip, put on your PK3, post your results.


----------



## chris-br

Oh boy...... no coments.. I'm too drunk to answer that, please someone?? lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

What are we even arguing about here? I think we have a pretty darn good sample size to prove that CLP is the way to go. It's like anything else, if there were other TIM's shown (through personal experience not reviews) by fellow members to perform better, clearly people would be using that TIM. This is the delidded crewman club, most of us are delidding because we are after top performance and we're not going to just use a product that is inferior strictly because others SAY it's good. The proof is in the pudding. If a few months from now I saw that a different TIM has been shown by fellow delidders to perform better than CLP, I'd be trying that on my next delid.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> So lets look at this from an economical/marketing stand-point. CoolLabs takes this feedback, spends money to develop a better product, they have to add more chemicals to said product, thus production cost rises. So now they have to sell this stuff for more than the PRO. Well if it's not better than the PRO but it costs more for the consumer, how do they sell it? I'll tell you how, market it as an updated version of the PRO. People say, "Wow, the PRO was pretty good but now they released the Ultra, it must be better." And in some cases with heatsink and IHS, it is better. But when you do a side by side comparison on a direct die, you get results like this guy:


Conspiracies! It's sure great you have such a deep understanding of how to manufacture thermal paste and the decisions the company goes through, surely it has nothing to do with the fact that maybe costs went down for one of many possible reasons (better technology, better equipment, easier to manufacturer, etc), that they figured out what they needed for high end thermal paste and how to make it better, etc. The price increase from CLP to CLU is also quite substantial, you think it costs Coollab $2 extra per tube for the extra goodies that they put in clu vs clp?

those bastards. they lie to us. now lets keep buying their paste. their probably republicans too.
Quote:


> What are we even arguing about here? I think we have a pretty darn good sample size to prove that CLP is the way to go. It's like anything else, if there were other TIM's shown (through personal experience not reviews) by fellow members to perform better, clearly people would be using that TIM. This is the delidded crewman club, most of us are delidding because we are after top performance and we're not going to just use a product that is inferior strictly because others SAY it's good. The proof is in the pudding. If a few months from now I saw that a different TIM has been shown by fellow delidders to perform better than CLP, I'd be trying that on my next delid.


For the longest time everyone said AS5 was the best, even though much better pastes came out long ago that significantly outperfomed it. As is the case with pc parts, takes a while for something to get popular. I dont think it's correct to say just because everyone uses something, that it's the best. It took years before people moved on from as5, i mean you still got people saying the best.

I'm not saying one way or the other CLU vs CLP, there doesnt seem to be any evidence on way or the other, but given that Coollab released CLU as an updated version of CLP, I would think it's better, or at least equal in performance but just easier to deal with. So most people in here have used CLP, that would make sense since CLP has been around longer... and you can't go by who got the most temp drops, or else it'd stand to say clp is terrible (the lowest result is CLP, at 6*C) and CLU is the best (31*C drop).

anyways im sure clu/clp >>> pk3. ill post results with pk3 and if i find i need more degrees ill buy some clp or clu first thing. maybe ill get lucky and get a chip that doesnt even need to be delidded.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What are we even arguing about here? I think we have a pretty darn good sample size to prove that CLP is the way to go. It's like anything else, if there were other TIM's shown (through personal experience not reviews) by fellow members to perform better, clearly people would be using that TIM. This is the delidded crewman club, most of us are delidding because we are after top performance and we're not going to just use a product that is inferior strictly because others SAY it's good. The proof is in the pudding. If a few months from now I saw that a different TIM has been shown by fellow delidders to perform better than CLP, I'd be trying that on my next delid.


Dude what are you talking about? Obviously PK3 is the only TIM that is worth a damn. Belial hasn't actually delidded a chip, nor does he own an Ivy, but obviously he knows everything there is to know about thermal conductivity...

I'm just going to do what ever he says because he posts links to review sites from over a year ago, unlike you guys that post your actual experiences which are clearly a hoax and you're all on the payroll from Cool Labs...


----------



## Swag

*This is a message to all Delidded enthusiasts/members*

After receiving an input on a certain matter, please use under your *own discretion* whether or not you want to take that piece of information. Please do not bombard this thread and fight against each other for something so small! This thread is supposed to be where people can help others get into delid and pass off information they have obtained from a different source (OT sometimes







)!

If you guys want to rant about whichever paste is better or why this is better, please go make your own thread about it. If you want to merely discuss specifications of products, then you can use this thread!

@*Belial*
I have seen you in my other thread and the same thing is occurring here. If you must rant or argue about specifics on pastes, please make your own thread. No need to fight in a club that isn't meant to argue about such minute things.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember guys when I get Franky 2.0 I'll be doing a ton of pictures on the process and using art to diagram everything correctly. This way we can have a very thorough guide here.
> Swag wanna help me out with this as well?


Val, you don't wanna delid your old chip man.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.prolimatech.com/en/support/index.asp?itemid=20
> http://www.arcticsilver.com/pdf/appmeth/int/ss/intel_app_method_surface_spread_v1.1.pdf
> Bam.
> I know the company might say one thing, but real world tests show the spread method to be terrible. I even did multiple spread and dot/line/rice testing and found spread was the worst (although not nearly as bad as using too much paste, and it's nearly impossible to use too little paste).
> Now everyone says 'clu is different', and I'm sure it is. So I'm not sure about it. I would think dot/rice grain/etc method would be best for it too, but as I understand you cant do that with CLU.
> The coolaboratory website. Plenty of people have said Ultra is better.
> There aren't many benches out there, but I think the company is a reliable source on this, especially given that Ultra is an update to Pro, rather than a completely new paste (although it is that too).
> I think that's factual enough to back it up, as there aren't any benches out there on the matter. It would be like saying PK-2 is better than PK-1, even though test results (the few out there) show them to be basically identical, PK-2 is an update of PK-1 and, according to the company, is supposed to be slightly better.
> That is so not a reliable way to judge how a thermal paste compares to another thermal material lol...
> You are right, it is an $80 cooler, but it is not a performance cooler. It's $80 because it's Noctua and low profile, not because it's performance cooling.
> http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/noctua_nhc14_review/4.htm
> I hope OC-club is a reliable source, I don't recall any issues with their tests.
> 20*C drop at your reference test at 4.3ghz simply means you got huge results. And was that strictly from delidding, or because you applied CLU on both the IHS and die, maybe changed coolers? It wouldn't be fair to compare a 20*C drop from using CLU on both your die and IHS, to someone using MX-4 on his die and IHS... You could probably get close to 10*C drop using CLU vs MX-4 just on the IHS.
> I may not have delidded an i5 yet, but you don't need to be so disrespectful towards me. I have done a ****ton of thermal testing with varying pastes (granted, not CLU) and heatsinks over the last few weeks, I've been around for a while (been here longer than you...). I am not saying anything huge here by saying that Liquid Ultra is an update to the Liquid Pro, it's on the company website. There is hardly 'proof' of pro being better than ultra.


Ultra is an improved more user friendly tim, not strictly liquid metal (100% gallium) like pro. Pro Is better but better for temps, not 'better'strictly for regular people who would put it on an ihs (the 99% of users, to whom the tim was aimed at in the first place)

And actually I didn't just say I thought z77 was better, but actually mentioned a few boards that couldn't clock ib chips past the 39x ratio.
spread for regular tims is worse, that's true







(except for ic diamond and other diamond compounds or liquid metal which behaves like mercury lol)


----------



## trn

I am NOT a member of this club.... I killed 2 3770k's trying to delid:


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sorry for the double post, mobile site here...

I was gonna add something:

Belial, it seems you like to be extra picky and cientific/methodical with your testing and everything







...do us a favor, when you get your IB cpu do the following:

-document your vcore, ambient, and core temps as displayed by real temp, for each core while running an IBT run as described on the first page (4.5ghz oc)
-calculate the delta temps of each core pre-delid.
-proceed to delid the chip and remove the glue.
-test temps with the stock intel tim without glue, calculate the delta and do the same with pk3. Try 3 applications or however you like for better accuracy, and calculate an average of the different attempts with each tim.
-use liquid ultra and do the same.
-use liquid pro and do the same.
(Use only pk3 for the ihs for ease of use)

That should give us really useful info with good methodology


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trn*
> 
> I am NOT a member of this club.... I killed 2 3770k's trying to delid:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Really big image!


Consider yourself a part of the club. I will add you myself into the club spreadsheet but your entries will just say, dead. Would that be fine?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sorry for the double post, mobile site here...
> 
> I was gonna add something:
> 
> Belial, it seems you like to be extra picky and cientific/methodical with your testing and everything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...do us a favor, when you get your IB cpu do the following:
> 
> -document your vcore, ambient, and core temps as displayed by real temp, for each core while running an IBT run as described on the first page (4.5ghz oc)
> -calculate the delta temps of each core pre-delid.
> -proceed to delid the chip and remove the glue.
> -test temps with the stock intel tim without glue, calculate the delta and do the same with pk3. Try 3 applications or however you like for better accuracy, and calculate an average of the different attempts with each tim.
> -use liquid ultra and do the same.
> -use liquid pro and do the same.
> (Use only pk3 for the ihs for ease of use)
> 
> That should give us really useful info with good methodology


I second this motion.







Anyone say yea or nay!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trn*
> 
> I am NOT a member of this club.... I killed 2 3770k's trying to delid:


Dang bro, you went ham on those 3770K's. What did you use? A steak knife?

Sorry not trying to be rude, but those are some deep scratches on the PCB and it looks like the core too...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I second this motion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone say yea or nay!


Sounds good to me, especially from our resident methodology guru, belial.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

This is as far my 3770k goes without going over 1.5v, oh well was a nice ride... cannot complaint.. canot said i was limited by "temps" XD
Ill upgrade before using this 4.8ghz lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I second this motion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone say yea or nay!


yea, I suggested it before as well


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> This is as far my 3770k goes without going over 1.5v, oh well was a nice ride... cannot complaint.. canot said i was limited by "temps" XD
> Ill upgrade before using this 4.8ghz lol


You can't get 4.9 stable without going over 1.5v huh?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trn*
> 
> I am NOT a member of this club.... I killed 2 3770k's trying to delid:


the one on left looks normal unless the bad stuff is hiding in shades









the one on right looks bad, I mean BAD ... have you used some kind of scratch/rubbing pad on the die and PCB? it also seem to have a nick in top left corner and scratched edge (this one doesn't mean much, I did similar on my former chip, it worked fine).


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> You can't get 4.9 stable without going over 1.5v huh?


Im on 1.48v for 4.8ghz stable (no whea errors) probably 4.9 would require another huge boost on volts...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> This is as far my 3770k goes without going over 1.5v, oh well was a nice ride... cannot complaint.. canot said i was limited by "temps" XD
> Ill upgrade before using this 4.8ghz lol


Did you turn on internal pll overvoltage? I find it hard to believe you can do 4.8 at that vcore and can't get 4.9 with a whole 0.23v to work with. Keep it at it. It's gotta be something.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Im on 1.48v for 4.8ghz stable (no whea errors) probably 4.9 would require another huge boost on volts...


Sorry I didn't see this one.. So what was 1.271v then?


----------



## lilchronic

im having trouble getting prime 95 for over 12 hrs.but when i raise my vcore higher it crashes even quicker in prime 95.
but can do this


----------



## chronicfx

Did you check the vcore yet using the DMM puffinmylye?


----------



## lilchronic

i really dont know what to do anymore guys its been weeks trying to get 5ghz


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Sorry I didn't see this one.. So what was 1.271v then?


Thats what just cpu-z reports "vid". it is actually 1.48v @ %75 LLC
Now im just playing on droping it at 1.45v with %100 LLC

Im aiming for a free whea errors log file also..

At 1.45v with 100% LLC i hit exactly 1.48v just whatt i wanted when the cpu needs it...

-3c's less XD

In this mobo ill always use 75% to find max vcore and cpu limit at the max vcore i want to use as it keep it stable (hours of playing with this baby XD) at the vcore i want, then i start to drop vcore using %100 llc.. My goal is between 1.42-1.43v with %100 llc


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Did you check the vcore yet using the DMM puffinmylye?


I will be when I get home in about an hour.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i really dont know what to do anymore guys its been weeks trying to get 5ghz


Your chip might just not have it in it buddy. 5Ghz for a 3570K is not exactly common. I'll be happy getting 4.8 stable on mine.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Your chip might just not have it in it buddy. 5Ghz for a 3570K is not exactly common. I'll be happy getting 4.8 stable on mine.


NO i dont belive that, lol it has to be able to, IT HAS TO .


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> And actually I didn't just say I thought z77 was better, but actually mentioned a few boards that couldn't clock ib chips past the 39x ratio.
> spread for regular tims is worse, that's true (except for ic diamond and other diamond compounds or liquid metal which behaves like mercury lol)


I think gigabyte boards had an issue with going past 39x on the bios that came out when IB first came out. I believe it's been fixed, but I'm not sure (search results dont exactly bring a flood of "it's fixed and everything is fine!"). I think the whole p67/z68 issue is irrelevant now since I'm close enough to MC who has the $40 bundle reduction, which just makes the whole thing irrelevant. I might still consider buying like a p67/z68 (or z77 for that matter) on the cheap with like bent pins or some defect and take a gamble on that, but for the most part I think the p67/z68 thing doesnt matter anymore. Now if the sale goes away or something, maybe we can come back to that headache, but I'll just let sleeping dogs lie








Quote:


> Belial, it seems you like to be extra picky and cientific/methodical with your testing and everything ...do us a favor, when you get your IB cpu do the following:
> 
> -document your vcore, ambient, and core temps as displayed by real temp, for each core while running an IBT run as described on the first page (4.5ghz oc)
> -calculate the delta temps of each core pre-delid.
> -proceed to delid the chip and remove the glue.
> -test temps with the stock intel tim without glue, calculate the delta and do the same with pk3. Try 3 applications or however you like for better accuracy, and calculate an average of the different attempts with each tim.
> -use liquid ultra and do the same.
> -use liquid pro and do the same.
> (Use only pk3 for the ihs for ease of use)
> 
> That should give us really useful info with good methodology


I'm thinking not bothering with even running it without a delid, but I've been convinced I should make sure it's not DOA, and its easier to delid once the chip is a bit warmer. I dont know if I should be lazy and just run the stock cooler, or just do it right, pk3, nh-d14 mount with some sort of overclock, ie [email protected] (and not worry about fine tuning it at least).

Besides, what you guys would probably be more interested in, is PK-3 vs CL, in which case, if I do need more temp reduction, I will definitely not hesitate to buy CL (i can actually get it on amazon for $12 including shipping lol) and run a proper comparison between the two.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *This is a message to all Delidded enthusiasts/members*
> 
> After receiving an input on a certain matter, please use under your *own discretion* whether or not you want to take that piece of information. Please do not bombard this thread and fight against each other for something so small! This thread is supposed to be where people can help others get into delid and pass off information they have obtained from a different source (OT sometimes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )!
> 
> If you guys want to rant about whichever paste is better or why this is better, please go make your own thread about it. If you want to merely discuss specifications of products, then you can use this thread!
> 
> @*Belial*
> I have seen you in my other thread and the same thing is occurring here. If you must rant or argue about specifics on pastes, please make your own thread. No need to fight in a club that isn't meant to argue about such minute things.


I have seen him on another post and he did the same thing there. Some pepole are not really after any information, they just like to argue.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sorry for the double post, mobile site here...
> 
> I was gonna add something:
> 
> Belial, it seems you like to be extra picky and cientific/methodical with your testing and everything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...do us a favor, when you get your IB cpu do the following:
> 
> -document your vcore, ambient, and core temps as displayed by real temp, for each core while running an IBT run as described on the first page (4.5ghz oc)
> -calculate the delta temps of each core pre-delid.
> -proceed to delid the chip and remove the glue.
> -test temps with the stock intel tim without glue, calculate the delta and do the same with pk3. Try 3 applications or however you like for better accuracy, and calculate an average of the different attempts with each tim.
> -use liquid ultra and do the same.
> -use liquid pro and do the same.
> (Use only pk3 for the ihs for ease of use)
> 
> That should give us really useful info with good methodology


Please *ivanlabrie*, don't invite him back!


----------



## lilchronic

i ran this for 15 hrs of prime LLC level 1 now im running it again with my LLC level 2 and my offset bumped up a little.


i gave up on 5ghz again


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Your chip might just not have it in it buddy. 5Ghz for a 3570K is not exactly common. I'll be happy getting 4.8 stable on mine.
> 
> 
> 
> NO i dont belive that, lol it has to be able to, IT HAS TO .
Click to expand...

We are pulling for you *lilchronic*! How high have been able to go and at what vcore? And what vcore have you already tried for 5GHz?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i ran this for 15 hrs of prime LLC level 1 now im running it again with my LLC level 2 and my offset bumped up a little.
> 
> 
> i gave up on 5ghz again


You do know *lilchronic*, that that is a nice vcore for 4.9GHz. Makes me wonder why you can't get to 5GHz???

Or is it 5GHz prime stable that is the problem?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> We are pulling for you *lilchronic*! How high have been able to go and at what vcore? And what vcore have you already tried for 5GHz?


i gotten up to 5.3 ghz. @1.55v for 5ghz my vcore ive tried is 1.325v -1.45v thats as high as ive gone for 5ghz


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> We are pulling for you *lilchronic*! How high have been able to go and at what vcore? And what vcore have you already tried for 5GHz?
> 
> 
> 
> i gotten up to 5.3 ghz. @1.55v for 5ghz my vcore ive tried is 1.325v -1.45v thats as high as ive gone for 5ghz
Click to expand...

Are you trying to just boot up or stress-test too?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> You do know *lilchronic*, that that is a nice vcore for 4.9GHz. Makes me wonder why you can't get to 5GHz???
> Or is it 5GHz prime stable that is the problem?


yea i cant get it prime 95 stable for 5 ghz


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Are you trying to just boot up or stress-test too?


im trying to get 5ghz prim95 stable


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Are you trying to just boot up or stress-test too?
> 
> 
> 
> im trying to get 5ghz prim95 stable
Click to expand...

What motherboard do you have?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What motherboard do you have?


asrock extreme 4 i think it could be my board
wish my brother would get the up7 he keeps talking about


----------



## chronicfx

Try 5.1ghz lil chronic. You might laugh but I have better stability at 4.9ghz than I do at 4.8ghz. Both can pass prime but the 4.8ghz setting freezes during stupid stuff like a couple times a week, giving 0x9c bsod sometimes. 4.9ghz I had no probs with, I just didn't like not having sleep function and needing to use hibernate.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> asrock extreme 4 i think it could be my board
> wish my brother would get the up7 he keeps talking about


My pro3 couldnt keep my 3770k stable over 4.9. The extreme4 should get you over 5. What are your board temps like?


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> asrock extreme 4 i think it could be my board
> wish my brother would get the up7 he keeps talking about


I got 5.1 and 5.2 stable on my Extreme4 but that was with a 3770k not a 3570k. Btw people, about to test my vcore with the DMM...stay tuned







.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What motherboard do you have?
> 
> 
> 
> asrock extreme 4 i think it could be my board
> wish my brother would get the up7 he keeps talking about
Click to expand...

Your board might be a limiting factor.

1. Internal PLL Overvoltage Enabled
2. Make LLC Extreme or 100%
3. Make RAM timings to 9-9-9-24 1600MHz (Less stress on IMC and will increase stability)

A note: I see your temps are fairly high, that may be the problem. Normally Ivy chips have problems at around 90C on high clocks. So basically, they fail much quicker at higher clocks with high temps.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> My pro3 couldnt keep my 3770k stable over 4.9. The extreme4 should get you over 5. What are your board temps like?


not bad 45c max


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Your board might be a limiting factor.
> 1. Internal PLL Overvoltage Enabled
> 2. Make LLC Extreme or 100%
> 3. Make RAM timings to 9-9-9-24 1600MHz (Less stress on IMC and will increase stability)
> A note: I see your temps are fairly high, that may be the problem. Normally Ivy chips have problems at around 90C on high clocks. So basically, they fail much quicker at higher clocks with high temps.


i do LLC extreme for 5ghz but 4.9 i have it at LLC 2
i tried with 1333mhz ram
when i run prime 95 max temps around 85c 87c


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Your board might be a limiting factor.
> 1. Internal PLL Overvoltage Enabled
> 2. Make LLC Extreme or 100%
> 3. Make RAM timings to 9-9-9-24 1600MHz (Less stress on IMC and will increase stability)
> A note: I see your temps are fairly high, that may be the problem. Normally Ivy chips have problems at around 90C on high clocks. So basically, they fail much quicker at higher clocks with high temps.
> 
> 
> 
> i do LLC extreme for 5ghz but 4.9 i have it at LLC 2
> i tried with 1333mhz ram
> when i run prime 95 max temps around 85c 87c
Click to expand...

I had problems reaching over 5.3 until I fixed my CPU temps by upping my cooling.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I had problems reaching over 5.3 until I fixed my CPU temps by upping my cooling.


coolabs is taking forever sending my pro/ultra maybe i can drop 10c or more


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I had problems reaching over 5.3 until I fixed my CPU temps by upping my cooling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> coolabs is taking forever sending my pro/ultra
Click to expand...

Wait until then, you'll probably have your problem fixed. Normally temps are the cause at higher clocks.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Try 5.1ghz lil chronic. You might laugh but I have better stability at 4.9ghz than I do at 4.8ghz. Both can pass prime but the 4.8ghz setting freezes during stupid stuff like a couple times a week, giving 0x9c bsod sometimes. 4.9ghz I had no probs with, I just didn't like not having sleep function and needing to use hibernate.


heres 5.1 for ya lol @offset 0.200 LLC 1


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Posting from my NAS ftl! Way to much going on last night, and I didn't have a chance to pull everything down to swap out the board & cpu. So I started it early today and...

The bad news: I almost murdered my boy earlier, I <3 that he always want's to help out but...







I left the room for just a minute while I was teaching him about DDC pump systems, priming them & all of that, and topping off the loop to get ready for testing. Wouldn't ya know he overflows the system and pours water all over my brand new Z77e-itx? Thankfully I use an external 12vdc 5A power supply for leak testing & priming, and don't jump the psu, so no damage done. Still, that'll make you wanna break a foot off, thigh deep in someone's...ahem.









Yeah, I'm sure you guys got the picture























I managed to get (I think) all of it soaked up, but I put it in front of a small space heater out in the garage w/ the MCP-35X still running to generate a little more localized heat around the socket to help dry anything I may have missed. I should be running Prime right now...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Ok so I tested my board with the DMM at the following voltages under load (as was detected in CPUz and mobo utility) as idle was too difficult because vcore jumps around with offset.

1.176
1.282
1.371
1.454

All the voltages detected were between .019-.021 lower than what was actually being read by the DMM and that was consistent regardless of how high or low I went on the vcore. So software is indeed reading them lower than actual voltage being sent to the chip. It's certainly not as bad as some other ASRock boards luckily so I don't feel TOO terrible about it but it is a little disappointing







. Luckily with my current chip my temps are so low that I'm not really concerned about it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wait until then, you'll probably have your problem fixed. Normally temps are the cause at higher clocks.


i hope so


----------



## chronicfx

Need an opinion..

Just found a $20 microcenter coupon in the 3770k for $229 thread. It expires on January 9th, is it worth it to upgrade to an extreme6 from my extreme4 for the better VRM then try to sell the extreme4 on ebay for like $75 or $100 something like that (I will check the going rate then make it a bit cheaper)? So the extreme6 would be $133 after tax. Basically looking at spending $50-$60 for better VRM's.. Is it worth it?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ok so I tested my board with the DMM at the following voltages under load (as was detected in CPUz and mobo utility) as idle was too difficult because vcore jumps around with offset.
> 1.176
> 1.282
> 1.371
> 1.454
> All the voltages detected were between .019-.021 lower than what was actually being read by the DMM and that was consistent regardless of how high or low I went on the vcore. So software is indeed reading them lower than actual voltage being sent to the chip. It's certainly not as bad as some other ASRock boards luckily so I don't feel TOO terrible about it but it is a little disappointing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Luckily with my current chip my temps are so low that I'm not really concerned about it.


are all those voltages different and higher overclocks?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Need an opinion..
> 
> Just found a $20 microcenter coupon in the 3770k for $229 thread. It expires on January 9th, is it worth it to upgrade to an extreme6 from my extreme4 for the better VRM then try to sell the extreme4 on ebay for like $75 or $100 something like that (I will check the going rate then make it a bit cheaper)? So the extreme6 would be $143 after tax. Basically looking at spending $75 for better VRM's.. Is it worth it?


I definitely would. I want a 3770k.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ok so I tested my board with the DMM at the following voltages under load (as was detected in CPUz and mobo utility) as idle was too difficult because vcore jumps around with offset.
> 
> 1.176
> 1.282
> 1.371
> 1.454
> 
> All the voltages detected were between .019-.021 lower than what was actually being read by the DMM and that was consistent regardless of how high or low I went on the vcore. So software is indeed reading them lower than actual voltage being sent to the chip. It's certainly not as bad as some other ASRock boards luckily so I don't feel TOO terrible about it but it is a little disappointing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Luckily with my current chip my temps are so low that I'm not really concerned about it.


Well, cool *PuffinMyLye*! Good to know they are not like .04-.06v off! Thats got to make you feel better.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I would skip the extreme 6 unless I had no other option. UD3h would be better, but I'd get an MVG (like I did...thing is immortal with that rog connect thingie lol)


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I would skip the extreme 6 unless I had no other option. UD3h would be better, but I'd get an MVG (like I did...thing is immortal with that rog connect thingie lol)


Need the slot layout so my pci sound card can fit between my GPU's and it hasd to have esata too. Although the onboard on the UD5h is supposedly enough that I can ditch my card, the onboard for the ud3h is not. The UD5h are out of stock at my microcenter and are $40 more.

Why would you skip the 6?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Need an opinion..
> Just found a $20 microcenter coupon in the 3770k for $229 thread. It expires on January 9th, is it worth it to upgrade to an extreme6 from my extreme4 for the better VRM then try to sell the extreme4 on ebay for like $75 or $100 something like that (I will check the going rate then make it a bit cheaper)? So the extreme6 would be $143 after tax. Basically looking at spending $75 for better VRM's.. Is it worth it?


i was thinking about that but more like getting the asrock oc edition board. then sell my h100 and join the big dogs with a custom loop


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ok so I tested my board with the DMM at the following voltages under load (as was detected in CPUz and mobo utility) as idle was too difficult because vcore jumps around with offset.
> 1.176
> 1.282
> 1.371
> 1.454
> All the voltages detected were between .019-.021 lower than what was actually being read by the DMM and that was consistent regardless of how high or low I went on the vcore. So software is indeed reading them lower than actual voltage being sent to the chip. It's certainly not as bad as some other ASRock boards luckily so I don't feel TOO terrible about it but it is a little disappointing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Luckily with my current chip my temps are so low that I'm not really concerned about it.


Good to know, thanks for the report







+1


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> That's a helluva chip tweak! Assuming that's a prime stable? Not just a boot into windows


I don't use Prime to test stability and never will. Aida64 is much more reliable because it is closer to real world usage. I've lost count of the number of times I've seen people run Prime for 12 hours+ and think their system is stable only to have it crash after gaming for a while. I've found that if my system can run Aida64 then it will run anything I will ever throw at it and I've been using it for a lot of years (back when it was Everest)


----------



## ivanlabrie

If you already have an extreme 4 an extreme 6 is not a big improvement,more like a sidegrade.
Get the OC Formula or the UD5H then, or MVF


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ok so I tested my board with the DMM at the following voltages under load (as was detected in CPUz and mobo utility) as idle was too difficult because vcore jumps around with offset.
> 1.176
> 1.282
> 1.371
> 1.454
> All the voltages detected were between .019-.021 lower than what was actually being read by the DMM and that was consistent regardless of how high or low I went on the vcore. So software is indeed reading them lower than actual voltage being sent to the chip. It's certainly not as bad as some other ASRock boards luckily so I don't feel TOO terrible about it but it is a little disappointing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Luckily with my current chip my temps are so low that I'm not really concerned about it.


Thanks for checking it out!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ok so I tested my board with the DMM at the following voltages under load (as was detected in CPUz and mobo utility) as idle was too difficult because vcore jumps around with offset.
> 1.176
> 1.282
> 1.371
> 1.454
> All the voltages detected were between .019-.021 lower than what was actually being read by the DMM and that was consistent regardless of how high or low I went on the vcore. So software is indeed reading them lower than actual voltage being sent to the chip. It's certainly not as bad as some other ASRock boards luckily so I don't feel TOO terrible about it but it is a little disappointing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Luckily with my current chip my temps are so low that I'm not really concerned about it.


hmmm, that's quite off ... 0.020v on average? you will need to compensate for that when thinking about actual vcore your chip runs under load ...

I just went ahead and measured my ROG MVE vcore, vccsa and vccio and they are all nearly spot on at 4.9GHz under load (IBT very high load):
cpu-z reports 1.368v vcore under load, DMM reads 1.366v (~0.002v off)
vccio and vccsa are both set in BIOS at 1.150v and they both read 1.145v or 1.446v (~0.005v off)


----------



## Swag

@tw33k

I approve of your new avatar!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Ok so I tested my board with the DMM at the following voltages under load (as was detected in CPUz and mobo utility) as idle was too difficult because vcore jumps around with offset.
> 1.176
> 1.282
> 1.371
> 1.454
> All the voltages detected were between .019-.021 lower than what was actually being read by the DMM and that was consistent regardless of how high or low I went on the vcore. So software is indeed reading them lower than actual voltage being sent to the chip. It's certainly not as bad as some other ASRock boards luckily so I don't feel TOO terrible about it but it is a little disappointing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Luckily with my current chip my temps are so low that I'm not really concerned about it.
> 
> 
> 
> hmmm, that's quite off ... 0.020v on average? you will need to compensate for that when thinking about actual vcore your chip runs under load ...
> 
> I just went ahead and measured my ROG MVE vcore, vccsa and vccio and they are all nearly spot on at 4.9GHz under load (IBT very high load):
> cpu-z reports 1.368v vcore under load, DMM reads 1.366v (~0.002v off)
> vccio and vccsa are both set in BIOS at 1.150v and they both read 1.145v or 1.446v (~0.005v off)
Click to expand...

Well, I think we knew his ASRock board would probably be off, but to be only off by .02v, although not a good thing, is much better than we feared it would be!









You are right, it is still off alot, and PuffinMyLye will have to figure it in now. Your readings are more what I expect of a MB like yours (MVE!). Much better!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @tw33k
> 
> I approve of your new avatar!


Yea. Good game tonight for GB!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @tw33k
> 
> I approve of your new avatar!
> 
> 
> 
> Yea. Good game tonight for GB!
Click to expand...

Did you watch it?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @tw33k
> I approve of your new avatar!


Go Pack Go!

I watched it. Not the best 4th quarter but we did enough to win so I'm happy


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well, cool *PuffinMyLye*! Good to know they are not like .04-.06v off! Thats got to make you feel better.


Yea I'm not that disappointed because I went in expecting worse, so in a way it was a pleasant surprise.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> are all those voltages different and higher overclocks?


Yes, each vcore I tested was with a higher OC that required at least that amount of voltage.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hmmm, that's quite off ... 0.020v on average? you will need to compensate for that when thinking about actual vcore your chip runs under load ...
> I just went ahead and measured my ROG MVE vcore, vccsa and vccio and they are all nearly spot on at 4.9GHz under load (IBT very high load):
> cpu-z reports 1.368v vcore under load, DMM reads 1.366v (~0.002v off)
> vccio and vccsa are both set in BIOS at 1.150v and they both read 1.145v or 1.446v (~0.005v off)


Yea it's certainly not ideal. However all it means was my last chip ran 5.1 stable at 1.434 instead of 1.414 which still isn't too shaby







. But at least now that I know the difference stays constant on all voltages I can just make the necessary adjustment. The good news is that this last delid went so well that my temps are really low, the bad news is that with this discrepancy I'll almost surely run into my voltage limit before my temps get too high.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @tw33k
> I approve of your new avatar!
> 
> 
> 
> Go Pack Go!
> 
> I watched it. Not the best 4th quarter but we did enough to win so I'm happy
Click to expand...

To me, it's one win closer.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Yes, each vcore I tested was with a higher OC that required at least that amount of voltage.


cool glad u understood my ?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @tw33k
> 
> I approve of your new avatar!
> 
> 
> 
> Yea. Good game tonight for GB!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Did you watch it?
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @tw33k
> I approve of your new avatar!
> 
> 
> 
> Go Pack Go!
> 
> I watched it. Not the best 4th quarter but we did enough to win so I'm happy
Click to expand...

I watched all but the 4th quarter as it looked like there was no way the Vikings were gunna catch up. Glad GB won. Did I miss anything?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea it's certainly not ideal. However all it means was my last chip ran 5.1 stable at 1.434 instead of 1.414 which still isn't too shaby
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . But at least now that I know the difference stays constant on all voltages I can just make the necessary adjustment. The good news is that this last delid went so well that my temps are really low, the bad news is that with this discrepancy I'll almost surely run into my voltage limit before my temps get too high.


yea, it doesn't change the fact that former chip was golden either way








was actually afraid your board was providing much higher vcore than just 0.020v off, it's still not bad, at least you know now.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> Posting from my NAS ftl! Way to much going on last night, and I didn't have a chance to pull everything down to swap out the board & cpu. So I started it early today and...
> The bad news: I almost murdered my boy earlier, I <3 that he always want's to help out but...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I left the room for just a minute while I was teaching him about DDC pump systems, priming them & all of that, and topping off the loop to get ready for testing. Wouldn't ya know he overflows the system and pours water all over my brand new Z77e-itx? Thankfully I use an external 12vdc 5A power supply for leak testing & priming, and don't jump the psu, so no damage done. Still, that'll make you wanna break a foot off, thigh deep in someone's...ahem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, I'm sure you guys got the picture
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I managed to get (I think) all of it soaked up, but I put it in front of a small space heater out in the garage w/ the MCP-35X still running to generate a little more localized heat around the socket to help dry anything I may have missed. I should be running Prime right now...


I got one kid on the way and I am all ready making sure to put all protective measures around my PC in motion (Guards, Guards, Meshs and more Guards)

Little bundle of joy but those little bundles of joy change into little bundles of terror soon enough


----------



## c2thew

Are you guys disabling c3, c6 states on your motherboards in order to overclock past 4.6ghz and also, what windows operating systems are you using? I've tried everything on my bios to overclock past 4.6 without windows 8 giving me the BSOD, however i feel that windows 8 64 bit might be the issue since I'm assuming most of you who are overclocking your processors past 5ghz are using windows 7.

I'm hoping it's the latter so that it's a windows 8 issue and not a motherboard issue. I also tried pulling the other 3 sticks of memory, leaving 1 stick in and i keep getting random BSOD errors.

Also, do you think it's a power/voltage issue? My computer is on a 8 plug power strip however none of the devices attached are power hungry. (postal scale, speakers, lamp, monitor, external 1.5tb drive)

errors include:
NTFS FILE SYSTEM
SYSTEM THREAD EXEPTION NOT HANDLED
KERNEL MODE EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
PAGE FAULT IN NON PAGED AREA
DRIVER IRQL NOT LESS THAN OR EQUAL TO

http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/kcs/document?docid=584512

TLR I get BSOD errors whenever i change the multipler from 45 to 47, 48....etc. 46 seems to be random crashes every once in awhile. Anything beyond won't get past windows 8.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Need an opinion..
> 
> Just found a $20 microcenter coupon in the 3770k for $229 thread. It expires on January 9th, is it worth it to upgrade to an extreme6 from my extreme4 for the better VRM then try to sell the extreme4 on ebay for like $75 or $100 something like that (I will check the going rate then make it a bit cheaper)? So the extreme6 would be $133 after tax. Basically looking at spending $50-$60 for better VRM's.. Is it worth it?


I believe it's a $10 coupon, and it's for anything, not just a 3770k. I believe it's $10 off if you spend over $50. I'm gonna get a $159 3570k with it, actually.

It would not be worth it. It'd be very unlikely you got 100mhz out of it, but even if you did, the price premium would not even be worth paying that much. you'd get much more performance upgrading something else for the same price (ssd, mouse, monitor, keyboard, graphics card, case... maybe even i7 instead of i5... i mean im sure there's something).

Check out this thread for discussion though, I believe the UD3h (or ud5h, as i understand it ud3h and ud5h are basically same board but extreme6 is better than extreme4, which isn't a great board but good for it's price i suppose, i think the asus and ud3h are better options). Someone who has had both the ud3h and extreme4 says how much better the ud3h is. I think the extreme6 is just an extreme4 with a different heatsink on the mosfets. Basically the guy talks about how much worse the extreme4 is, from the ud3h. I dont think there's much reason to get an extreme6/ud5h over extreme4/ud3h, or extreme4 over ud3h. If you already have a extreme4, just keep it, it's top 3.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1306963/asrock-z77-extreme4-or-ga-z77x-ud3h/0_100

i mean the extreme6 is just an extreme4 with a couple more ports, unless you got a ton of drives or something, there isn't really a reason to get anything more than the classic extreme4/ud3h/asus LK. I think the UD3h is generally agreed to be the best overclocking board to get - isn't gimped like the lower priced boards are, has SLI, has a half decent VRM. Biostar makes good budget boards but i think at the higher price range, at which you are looking at, or basically if you need a board with SLI, they just don't have the quality to compete with an asrock/asus/gigabyte that isn't neutered.

just upgrade something else in your system for more performance. or, you could get a bigger performance boost by buying a budget biostar and an i7 with the savings. not to say i recommend doing that, im just saying keep your extreme4.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I've yet to see anyone post actual comparisons between Ultra and Pro. If you have used both, as you claim, then can you post results? I personally don't believe Pro is better but am waiting for some to arrive so I can compare them both.
> Some dude on the Xtreme Systems forums posts that Pro has a thermal conductivity of 82w/mk and Ultra has only 32w/mk and people believe it. He posted no sources to back his claim and most importantly Coollaboratory does not have this info on their website. I emailed them but they didn't reply. I found a webpage in German, where Coolabs are from which rates Ultra the same as Pro (http://www.pc-max.de/artikel/kuehlung/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/5863) Without official data from Coollabs we can't really say. The only way to know for sure is to test them, which is what I'll be doing once the Liquid Pro arrives


i just contacted the Coollaboratory company in germany,
and ask what the w/mk are on ultra and pro








last time i contacted them, took about 1 week for a answer
i had the same info, and been using it ever since, this

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources )
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

i do remember i was looking for the "hard facts",
very confusing sometimes..lol
like here,
amazon rates pro like this,
Liquid metal thermal conductive paste ~ 40 W/mK - Content 1 g
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Liquid-metal-thermal-conductive-paste/dp/B001PE5XAC
or here,
Liquid ULTRA je nová verze vysoce výkonné Liquid PRO
# Revoluční teplovodivá pasta na bázi tekutého kovu
# *Vodivost 90 W/mK* (např. u konkurenční Arctic Silver je to 9 W/mK)
http://www.alphacool.cz/produkt/Coollaboratory_Liquid_Ultra.html
here,
Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
The manufacturer promises thermal conductivity of 82 W/(m·K).
Liquid pro should remain fully functional at operational temperatures between -273°C and +1200°C.
If it is true, it is truly impressive, but I doubt that anyone needs such a wide temperature range
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/thermal-interface-roundup_8.html

will let you know when i have a "official" answer ...lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I believe it's a $10 coupon, and it's for anything, not just a 3770k. I believe it's $10 off if you spend over $50. I'm gonna get a $159 3570k with it, actually.
> It would not be worth it. It'd be very unlikely you got 100mhz out of it, but even if you did, the price premium would not even be worth paying that much. you'd get much more performance upgrading something else for the same price (ssd, mouse, monitor, keyboard, graphics card, case... maybe even i7 instead of i5... i mean im sure there's something).
> Check out this thread for discussion though, I believe the UD3h (or ud5h, as i understand it ud3h and ud5h are basically same board but extreme6 is better than extreme4, which isn't a great board but good for it's price i suppose, i think the asus and ud3h are better options). Someone who has had both the ud3h and extreme4 says how much better the ud3h is. I think the extreme6 is just an extreme4 with a different heatsink on the mosfets. Basically the guy talks about how much worse the extreme4 is, from the ud3h. I dont think there's much reason to get an extreme6/ud5h over extreme4/ud3h, or extreme4 over ud3h. If you already have a extreme4, just keep it, it's top 3.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1306963/asrock-z77-extreme4-or-ga-z77x-ud3h/0_100
> i mean the extreme6 is just an extreme4 with a couple more ports, unless you got a ton of drives or something, there isn't really a reason to get anything more than the classic extreme4/ud3h/asus LK. I think the UD3h is generally agreed to be the best overclocking board to get - isn't gimped like the lower priced boards are, has SLI, has a half decent VRM. Biostar makes good budget boards but i think at the higher price range, at which you are looking at, or basically if you need a board with SLI, they just don't have the quality to compete with an asrock/asus/gigabyte that isn't neutered.
> just upgrade something else in your system for more performance. or, you could get a bigger performance boost by buying a budget biostar and an i7 with the savings. not to say i recommend doing that, im just saying keep your extreme4.


Yes this, I really don't like AsRock boards that much. Sure they look nice and perform okay at stock but the second you go over-the-top you start to get problems. The Z68 Extreme 3 Gen 3 that I used in a build also didn't feel as tough or strong as a Gigabyte P67 or even my Z77 board. (By far the toughest board I've dealt with), the next best board that I've ever seen/used was my EP45-UD3P, such good build quality. I always suggest Gigabyte boards, I mean sure they might not get the highest clocks on RAM and such like ASUS boards (from what I've seen) but they're more reliable and generally built better (I've never used an ASUS board though).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> Are you guys disabling c3, c6 states on your motherboards in order to overclock past 4.6ghz and also, what windows operating systems are you using? I've tried everything on my bios to overclock past 4.6 without windows 8 giving me the BSOD, however i feel that windows 8 64 bit might be the issue since I'm assuming most of you who are overclocking your processors past 5ghz are using windows 7.
> I'm hoping it's the latter so that it's a windows 8 issue and not a motherboard issue. I also tried pulling the other 3 sticks of memory, leaving 1 stick in and i keep getting random BSOD errors.
> Also, do you think it's a power/voltage issue? My computer is on a 8 plug power strip however none of the devices attached are power hungry. (postal scale, speakers, lamp, monitor, external 1.5tb drive)
> errors include:
> NTFS FILE SYSTEM
> SYSTEM THREAD EXEPTION NOT HANDLED
> KERNEL MODE EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
> PAGE FAULT IN NON PAGED AREA
> DRIVER IRQL NOT LESS THAN OR EQUAL TO
> http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/kcs/document?docid=584512
> TLR I get BSOD errors whenever i change the multipler from 45 to 47, 48....etc. 46 seems to be random crashes every once in awhile. Anything beyond won't get past windows 8.


If you're having memory problems boost the IMC voltage to 0.975v (From 0.925v), that helped me get my 4 sticks overclocked.
It seems that your memory is possibly overclocked or it just needs a drop more voltage, try adding a bit of voltage to the IMC as I suggested or maybe more vCore? I need 1.45v for 4.6GHz stable.

To add to that disabling power saving features could fix the problem.. But to me that would be unacceptable really.


----------



## Swag

I just finished watching an anime and this anime made me cry like a goddamn baby. :*( Oh god!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just finished watching an anime and this anime made me cry like a goddamn baby. :*( Oh god!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just finished watching an anime and this anime made me cry like a goddamn baby. :*( Oh god!
Click to expand...

Worse, I just got back into watching them and I had to watch this... Goddamn it!


----------



## VonDutch

do you guys know reliability monitor in windows?

handy tool, you should check it,
Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Action Center\Reliability Monitor
or open start, type Reliability in the searchbox

Reliability Monitor measures hardware and software problems and other changes to your computer.
More specifically, the stability index identifies when unexpected problems or other changes reduced the reliability of your system.
A graph identifies dates when problems began to occur, and a report provides details that you can use to troubleshoot the cause of any reduced reliability.
http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/window-on-windows/track-stability-in-windows-7-with-the-reliability-monitor/3108

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Worse, I just got back into watching them and I had to watch this... Goddamn it!


there..

lol








what are you watching Swag?


----------



## King4x4

Was wondering... any of you tried a TEC cooler on his ivy?

Thinking of doing it on my Hydra for the kicks!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> Are you guys disabling c3, c6 states on your motherboards in order to overclock past 4.6ghz and also, what windows operating systems are you using? I've tried everything on my bios to overclock past 4.6 without windows 8 giving me the BSOD, however i feel that windows 8 64 bit might be the issue since I'm assuming most of you who are overclocking your processors past 5ghz are using windows 7.
> I'm hoping it's the latter so that it's a windows 8 issue and not a motherboard issue. I also tried pulling the other 3 sticks of memory, leaving 1 stick in and i keep getting random BSOD errors.
> Also, do you think it's a power/voltage issue? My computer is on a 8 plug power strip however none of the devices attached are power hungry. (postal scale, speakers, lamp, monitor, external 1.5tb drive)
> errors include:
> NTFS FILE SYSTEM
> SYSTEM THREAD EXEPTION NOT HANDLED
> KERNEL MODE EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
> PAGE FAULT IN NON PAGED AREA
> DRIVER IRQL NOT LESS THAN OR EQUAL TO
> http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/kcs/document?docid=584512
> TLR I get BSOD errors whenever i change the multipler from 45 to 47, 48....etc. 46 seems to be random crashes every once in awhile. Anything beyond won't get past windows 8.


Have you tested your memory?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If you already have an extreme 4 an extreme 6 is not a big improvement,more like a sidegrade.
> Get the OC Formula or the UD5H then, or MVF


But is the extreme6 a bad board? I have Mama Stick about to grab one today from Micro Center. It's the board I originally wanted but I decided to pony up for the P8Z77-V PRO which has been nothing but a disappointment.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Yea I'm not that disappointed because I went in expecting worse, so in a way it was a pleasant surprise.
> Yes, each vcore I tested was with a higher OC that required at least that amount of voltage.
> Yea it's certainly not ideal. However all it means was my last chip ran 5.1 stable at 1.434 instead of 1.414 which still isn't too shaby
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . But at least now that I know the difference stays constant on all voltages I can just make the necessary adjustment. The good news is that this last delid went so well that my temps are really low, the bad news is that with this discrepancy I'll almost surely run into my voltage limit before my temps get too high.


Yeah it aint so bad. You still got two badass chips on your record.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> To me, it's one win closer.


Bring on the 49ers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I watched all but the 4th quarter as it looked like there was no way the Vikings were gunna catch up. Glad GB won. Did I miss anything?


Apart from a late Vikings touchdown you didn't miss much
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i just contacted the Coollaboratory company in germany,
> and ask what the w/mk are on ultra and pro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> last time i contacted them, took about 1 week for a answer
> i had the same info, and been using it ever since, this
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources )
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> i do remember i was looking for the "hard facts",
> very confusing sometimes..lol
> like here,
> amazon rates pro like this,
> Liquid metal thermal conductive paste ~ 40 W/mK - Content 1 g
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Liquid-metal-thermal-conductive-paste/dp/B001PE5XAC
> or here,
> Liquid ULTRA je nová verze vysoce výkonné Liquid PRO
> # Revoluční teplovodivá pasta na bázi tekutého kovu
> # *Vodivost 90 W/mK* (např. u konkurenční Arctic Silver je to 9 W/mK)
> http://www.alphacool.cz/produkt/Coollaboratory_Liquid_Ultra.html
> here,
> Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> The manufacturer promises thermal conductivity of 82 W/(m·K).
> Liquid pro should remain fully functional at operational temperatures between -273°C and +1200°C.
> If it is true, it is truly impressive, but I doubt that anyone needs such a wide temperature range
> http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/thermal-interface-roundup_8.html
> will let you know when i have a "official" answer ...lol


Good luck getting a response from Coollabs. They didn't respond when I asked them. There isn't any official data anywhere so if you do hear back from them it will be a first. All the info you posted is pure speculation and my guess is that it's pretty bad In the Xtreme Forums thread the guy claims he got that Ultra is "32 or 38w/mK from several web sources" but didn't link to single one. That's because they don't exist. He pulled the numbers out of his ass and people believed it.

I can't see how Pro could be rated 82w/mk and Ultra only 32w/mk. There's no way we'd be seeing the results we have with Ultra if it was so far behind Pro. I just want the Pro to arrive so I can run comparisons and will know for certain.


----------



## chronicfx

The extreme6 switches from dpak mosfets to higher quality mosfets. There is a review by sin in the mono section


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I got one kid on the way and I am all ready making sure to put all protective measures around my PC in motion (Guards, Guards, Meshs and more Guards)
> Little bundle of joy but those little bundles of joy change into little bundles of terror soon enough


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> The extreme6 switches from dpak mosfets to higher quality mosfets. There is a review by sin in the mono section


I just read that review, thanks. Yeah looks like Extreme6 is a good choice over the Extreme4. (Extreme4 was out of stock when I pre-ordered anyway).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Good luck getting a response from Coollabs. They didn't respond when I asked them. There isn't any official data anywhere so if you do hear back from them it will be a first. All the info you posted is pure speculation and my guess is that it's pretty bad In the Xtreme Forums thread the guy claims he got that Ultra is "32 or 38w/mK from several web sources" but didn't link to single one. That's because they don't exist. He pulled the numbers out of his ass and people believed it.
> I can't see how Pro could be rated 82w/mk and Ultra only 32w/mk. There's no way we'd be seeing the results we have with Ultra if it was so far behind Pro. I just want the Pro to arrive so I can run comparisons and will know for certain.


till now ive contacted them 3x, and got response to all of them, from 1 week til within 2 weeks,
maybe its because im Dutch..lol








what we know of it here, it that they work both work well,
and that theres not much difference in performance tempwise when used on the die,

Ultra is the follow up, the new Pro, its easier to spread blabla, you know,
but then, why would they change the w/mk also, to a lower one,
makes no sense to me

yesterday i made another post, and done some research for answers,
so i looked for the w/mk of pure gallium, it has a 29-41w/mk,
made me think about what makes Pro have such high w/mk,
the 32 or 38w/mk that Ultra supposed to have would be more in range of that..

Ultra contains,

COMPOSITION/INFORMATION ON CONSTITUENTS
2.1 Chemical characterization:
Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous, bismuth;
suspended in a graphite-copper matrix
http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf

Pro contains,

COMPOSITION/INFORMATION ON CONSTITUENTS
2.1 Chemical characterisation:
Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous.


----------



## VonDutch

isnt it the same as the "intel recommended max vcore" is 1.52V for ivy bridge story,
people pick up these things bacause they think, "if he says it, it must be true" i know i did at first..

theres no word from intel anywhere, regarding max vcores on ivy,
if asked directly, they say, "we cant give you specific vcores if you oc"..
so no max vcore either..

Did you know,
"Intel found that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the﻿ pressure, no future chips will use solder."

a sentence like that, can spread like wildfire when picked up by others, and gets repeated all over the place,
before anyone takes the time to check out if its true or not..lol


----------



## liamstears

Forgot to ask in my earlier post but what can I use to protect the 2 tiny area's of the PCB that I've scratched?

At the moment I've put a tiny amount of electrical tape over it as I don't want it to short out on the IHS or anything but that sticks out like a sore thumb, is there something else I could use?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Forgot to ask in my earlier post but what can I use to protect the 2 tiny area's of the PCB that I've scratched?
> At the moment I've put a tiny amount of electrical tape over it as I don't want it to short out on the IHS or anything but that sticks out like a sore thumb, is there something else I could use?


tiny drop of clear nail polish,
or ..i dont recall who used it and what exactly,
some silicone sealant stuff i think,
just found this,
SMD Epoxy red adhesive for PCB,
http://www.tradekorea.com/sell-leads-detail/S00044488/SMD%20Epoxy%20red%20adhesive%20for%20PCB.html


----------



## c2thew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Have you tested your memory?


yeah memtest seems ok. how many passes do you recommend to make sure the memory is stable?






permatex is what i believe i saw someone mentioned sometime earlier in this thread.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313&_nkw=Permatex+81158+3+Ounce+Black+RTV+Silicone+Adhesive+Sealant&_sacat=0&_from=R40


----------



## stickg1

Do we have a collection of batch numbers and max overclocks anywhere on this site? Or on any forum that you guys know of? The new 3570K has been picked up along with the Extreme6. I want to get the batch number so I know if I need to get really excited or just a little excited.


----------



## lilchronic

i would like to know who here has lapped the under side of the IHS and what methods u guys used to do it


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I got one kid on the way and I am all ready making sure to put all protective measures around my PC in motion (Guards, Guards, Meshs and more Guards)
> Little bundle of joy but those little bundles of joy change into little bundles of terror soon enough


Congrats!







Might I suggest a kiddie leash, a remote dog training collar, some duct tape & zip ties. Not to mention investing in stock of McNEIL-PPC (Benadryl's manufacturer. It really calms them down) Lol!







Kidding ofc.









My oldest, Kyle, is 14, about to turn 15 in February.







Omg, he'll be driving soooooon...







Nah, j/k. He's in 125cc shifter karts now, and he'll be fine. He really want's to go pro, but yeah, the odds of which are akin to winning the lottery twice consecutively. Hopefully, the bubble will burst when he's a little older and more capable of handling the disappointment of reality.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Was wondering... any of you tried a TEC cooler on his ivy?
> Thinking of doing it on my Hydra for the kicks!


I like TEC's in theory. In practice; they are hugely power hungry, need a relatively high power psu of their own (12 v will run them, but they are much better off efficiency wise w/ 24-32 V. Still grossly inefficient), require massive amounts of calculations to get right (assuming the manufacturers specs are accurate to begin with), and wouldn't be worth the trouble with an AIO to cool them. Additionally, you're still looking at condensation issues if it's powerful enough to reach temps below dew point. Which will require a conformal coat on the board as a protective measure.

If you're going that far, I'd suggest a single stage phaser over a TEC any day of the week. Cascaded if you really want to get into every day sub-zero cooling.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> isnt it the same as the "intel recommended max vcore" is 1.52V for ivy bridge story,
> people pick up these things bacause they think, "if he says it, it must be true" i know i did at first..
> theres no word from intel anywhere, regarding max vcores on ivy,
> if asked directly, they say, "we cant give you specific vcores if you oc"..
> so no max vcore either..
> Did you know,
> "Intel found that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the﻿ pressure, no future chips will use solder."
> a sentence like that, can spread like wildfire when picked up by others, and gets repeated all over the place,
> before anyone takes the time to check out if its true or not..lol


I have Intel's spec sheet on Ivy, and I can confirm it does in fact state 1.52 v as Ivy's max voltage. Usually they (chip manufacturers) are a bit on the conservative (safe) side when it comes to the ratings, but not always. I also have the recommended oc'ing max voltages for everything up to LN2/ He. I'll post them when I get my system back up and running, but I want to give it a few more hours before hitting lightly it w/ a heat gun to verify all of the water spilled has evaporated.

Where did you run across the statement about the lead-free solder, out of curiosity?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would like to know who here has lapped the under side of the IHS and what methods u guys used to do it


no need to lap the under side... only the top if is concaved.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> I have Intel's spec sheet on Ivy, and I can confirm it does in fact state 1.52 v as Ivy's max voltage. Usually they (chip manufacturers) are a bit on the conservative (safe) side when it comes to the ratings, but not always. I also have the recommended oc'ing max voltages for everything up to LN2/ He. I'll post them when I get my system back up and running, but I want to give it a few more hours before hitting lightly it w/ a heat gun to verify all of the water spilled has evaporated.
> Where did you run across the statement about the lead-free solder, out of curiosity?


well, that would be great, where can i find it?

i only found this one so far, with help of intel employee,

where it states VID, VID Range min 0.2500 max 1.52V
i wasnt to happy with this answer, because others told me i was wrong with the 1.52V vcore max,
and VID has nothing to do with vcore...so i kept searching...

and another intel employee said,
yea i found it, look here and here, hope this helped bla bla,

so i looked, i was like ..wait wait , all kinds of voltages there, EXCEPT where the vcore is...LOL

and i have a email somewhere, another try to get a answer,
where they say, that they cant give me a clear answer about max vcore,
and i have posted on the official intel forums asking about it,
no answer or any respons yet









so, im curious now , tel tell










the solders, i did several searches to find it,
compared them, and got the between 30 and 60 w/mk,
you thinking im wrong?


----------



## stickg1

@PufffinLye, whats the batch number on your chip? I figured since you just got it you might still have the box lying around...

My moms pulled through for me..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> @PufffinLye, whats the batch number on your chip? I figured since you just got it you might still have the box lying around...
> My moms pulled through for me..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


dont stare blind on batchnumbers,
the "good" batches have lesser ones in it, and the "bad "batches golden chips..cant really tell,
maybe Costa Rica chips are better then the Malasian ones..
best is to just try and see what the chip can do







Gratz


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dont stare blind on batchnumbers,
> the "good" batches have lesser ones in it, and the "bad "batches golden chips..cant really tell,
> maybe Costa Rica chips are better then the Malasian ones..
> best is to just try and see what the chip can do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gratz


She wont be home to Friday!!!









Oh well, that will give me some time to get up to 35 rep, hopefully.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> She wont be home to Friday!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh well, that will give me some time to get up to 35 rep, hopefully.


dang, i thought she was on her way home,
gl with the batch research and reps, you have time enough it seems..lol


----------



## PuffinMyLye

What do you guys think about voltage vs. temps in terms of safe levels for your chips? I know it's been discussed many times what the maximum safe voltage is to have running through your chips especially for 24/7 use but I don't believe we've ever gotten a definitive answer from Intel. Do you consider running higher voltages unsafe even if your temps are really low?

For example at 4.8Ghz @ 1.35vcore (DMM reading) my temps in Prime never go above 53C. Even if I up my vcore up to 1.45v my temps never go above the 66-67C. I know many people have mentioned 1.52 as the ceiling for vcore even though it's unofficial but I get the feeling I wouldn't reach my temp limits until well over 1.55+v. So I guess my question is, does voltage matter less when your temps are really low or should voltage be observed the same regardless of temps?


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, that would be great, where can i find it?
> i only found this one so far, with help of intel employee,
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where it states VID, VID Range min 0.2500 max 1.52V
> i wasnt to happy with this answer, because others told me i was wrong with the 1.52V vcore max,
> and VID has nothing to do with vcore...so i kept searching...
> and another intel employee said,
> yea i found it, look here and here, hope this helped bla bla,
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so i looked, i was like ..wait wait , all kinds of voltages there, EXCEPT where the vcore is...LOL
> and i have a email somewhere, another try to get a answer,
> where they say, that they cant give me a clear answer about max vcore,
> and i have posted on the official intel forums asking about it,
> no answer or any respons yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so, im curious now , tel tell
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the solders, i did several searches to find it,
> compared them, and got the between 30 and 60 w/mk,
> you thinking im wrong?


I must be losing my memory in my rapidly approaching old age







That was the exact chart I was thinking of, but the OC guide Sin posted (iirc) stated 1.52 Vcore as Intel's recommended max. On second thought, I'd rather have official confirmation on that myself.

I'll post Sin's chart, because I don't remember where I found it off the top of my head, in a few hours. I'm giving my Prodigy a little longer in front of the space heater to be sure it's dried out from what I'll lovingly refer to henceforth as "The overflow incident"







Oh wait, as I was typing out the last line, I remembered.



Under the "Settings" spoiler: Sauce

With his connection to Giga, I'd imagine that's the proper specs provided by Intel. But an official answer would definitely ease everyone's mind.

Oh no, I don't think your wrong about the leadless solder, I'd just like to read up on it myself to pass the time. I just have a voracious appetite for information...


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What do you guys think about voltage vs. temps in terms of safe levels for your chips? I know it's been discussed many times what the maximum safe voltage is to have running through your chips especially for 24/7 use but I don't believe we've ever gotten a definitive answer from Intel. Do you consider running higher voltages unsafe even if your temps are really low?
> For example at 4.8Ghz @ 1.35vcore (DMM reading) my temps in Prime never go above 53C. Even if I up my vcore up to 1.45v my temps never go above the 66-67C. I know many people have mentioned 1.52 as the ceiling for vcore even though it's unofficial but I get the feeling I wouldn't reach my temp limits until well over 1.55+v. So I guess my question is, does voltage matter less when your temps are really low or should voltage be observed the same regardless of temps?


I think voltage is important no matter what...well maybe less if at -200 something. I would think all electronics have a limit of how much voltage it can take before its fries itself.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I think voltage is important no matter what...well maybe less if at -200 something. I would think all electronics have a limit of how much voltage it can take before its fries itself.


So in other words I'll just have to live with my chip being at very low temps all the time? I guess that's not such a bad thing







.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> So in other words I'll just have to live with my chip being at very low temps all the time? I guess that's not such a bad thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


lol yup. or think of it this way... what happens when you give a speaker too much power? It may sound great but at a certain point it seizes or blows the voice coil.


----------



## VonDutch

in terms of degradation, heat is worse then running higher vcore, within vcore specs,
heat shortens lifespan more, i made a post about it somewhere, with a cool graph,
and a link to research..over a 3 year period

any vcore above 1.52V is getting more risky, 1.55 is absolute max on air/water,
i think we should trust the people who know alot, like sin0822 and others elsewhere,
we tent to use their findings, research/reviews and answers as true, to help others, but its not "official" sometimes..

above 1.6V vcore 24/7, things get really risky, for benching its no problem, at least i think it isnt,
then temps dont matter anymore too, then the only thing is extreem coolling..

o, and we do have a max for temps, 105C tjmax, but not really for vcore,
but 1.52V max for 24/7 oc seems reasonable so far..1.45V max for 24/7 i would advice if asked, for safe..


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> in terms of degradation, heat is worse then running higher vcore, within vcore specs,
> heat shortens lifespan more, i made a post about it somewhere, with a cool graph,
> and a link to research..over a 3 year period
> any vcore above 1.52V is getting more risky, 1.55 is absolute max on air/water,
> i think we should trust the people who know alot, like sin0822 and others elsewhere,
> we tent to use their findings, research/reviews and answers as true, to help others, but its not "official" sometimes..
> above 1.6V vcore 24/7, things get really risky, for benching its no problem, at least i think it isnt,
> then temps dont matter anymore too, then the only thing is extreem coolling..
> o, and we do have a max for temps, 105C tjmax, but not really for vcore,
> but 1.52V max for 24/7 oc seems reasonable so far..1.45V max for 24/7 i would advice if asked, for safe..


I'm going to have a hard time telling myself 1.52v is unsafe for 24/7 use if my temps never go above 75C with Prime, especially since I upgrade once every 2 years. I'll have to see where I stand when I test it







.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> I must be losing my memory in my rapidly approaching old age
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That was the exact chart I was thinking of, but the OC guide Sin posted (iirc) stated 1.52 Vcore as Intel's recommended max. On second thought, I'd rather have official confirmation on that myself.
> I'll post Sin's chart, because I don't remember where I found it off the top of my head, in a few hours. I'm giving my Prodigy a little longer in front of the space heater to be sure it's dried out from what I'll lovingly refer to henceforth as "The overflow incident"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh wait, as I was typing out the last line, I remembered.
> 
> Under the "Settings" spoiler: Sauce
> With his connection to Giga, I'd imagine that's the proper specs provided by Intel. But an official answer would definitely ease everyone's mind.
> Oh no, I don't think your wrong about the leadless solder, I'd just like to read up on it myself to pass the time. I just have a voracious appetite for information...


On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however ]while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*.When overclocking on air the only two voltages you should need to touch on an Ivy Bridge setup are the Vcore (which you increase) and the CPU PLL( which can be decreased to help temperatures).

if you read whats under the charts, youll see sin mention the same VID,
that i found in the datasheet from intel,
i used that same chart for a while when people asked me about max vcore,
then some peeps commented me on using 1.52V vcore as max vcore intel states,
"not true, intel doesnt state that anywhere, bs..bla etc"
so i started seaching, and found the chart in the datasheet,
then some others said, that VID has nothing to do with vcore ....LOL

"appetite for information"..yea, i know that ..


----------



## chronicfx

So I just got back from microcenter. I purchased an Asrock extreme6 motherboard based on it having the improved mosfets. I was sooo close to getting the Asrock Z77 OC formula lol.. Such a waste of $$ on air though and probably even a waste on water. No idea when I will get it installed and running as two kids and a wife are the dictating factor in that one. I would need a full day almost to swap, install OS,updates, programs and games. But I feel a bit better now about running an overclock for a couple years. I will keep you posted. It was $149 and I used a $20 coupon from the 3770k for $229 thread, so after 3.5% tax it was $134.. Same price as the extreme4 lol. Now to sell the extreme4.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So I just got back from microcenter. I purchased an Asrock extreme6 motherboard based on it having the improved mosfets. I was sooo close to getting the Asrock Z77 OC formula lol.. Such a waste of $$ on air though and probably even a waste on water. No idea when I will get it installed and running as two kids and a wife are the dictating factor in that one. I would need a full day almost to swap, install OS,updates, programs and games. But I feel a bit better now about running an overclock for a couple years. I will keep you posted. It was $149 and I used a $20 coupon from the 3770k for $229 thread, so after 3.5% tax it was $134.. Same price as the extreme4 lol. Now to sell the extreme4.


Oc formula is a beast.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So I just got back from microcenter. I purchased an Asrock extreme6 motherboard based on it having the improved mosfets. I was sooo close to getting the Asrock Z77 OC formula lol.. Such a waste of $$ on air though and probably even a waste on water. No idea when I will get it installed and running as two kids and a wife are the dictating factor in that one. I would need a full day almost to swap, install OS,updates, programs and games. But I feel a bit better now about running an overclock for a couple years. I will keep you posted. It was $149 and I used a $20 coupon from the 3770k for $229 thread, so after 3.5% tax it was $134.. Same price as the extreme4 lol. Now to sell the extreme4.


Nice, MC is about 5.5 hours away from me, 11 hour round trip. My mom just happened to be passing by there so I had her grab me an Extreme6 and a new 3570K.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Nice stickg1 want to see results out of that







(I have the impression i am the only one with the cheap asrock Z77 in the forum lol though capable of 4.8GHz nevertheless)


----------



## chronicfx

When i switch motherboards i will need to move my chip. Will i need to redo the liquid pro between the die and the ihs? If i try to pick the chip up gently is there enough of a bond that it should stay in one piece?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> When i switch motherboards i will need to move my chip. Will i need to redo the liquid pro between the die and the ihs? If i try to pick the chip up gently is there enough of a bond that it should stay in one piece?


Good question. i also wanna know this.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Nice stickg1 want to see results out of that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I have the impression i am the only one with the cheap asrock Z77 in the forum lol though capable of 4.8GHz nevertheless)


Well I originally planned on building with the Extreme4 or Extreme6 because I have liked 1155 ASRock boards I have used in the past. Between the Z68X-UD3, Maximus IV Gene-Z68, P67 Sabertooth, and Extreme3 Gen3 Z68 I got to use the Ext3 Gen3 was by far my favorite. Funny story how I got to use all the boards but thats besides the point.

Anyway when it came time to buy my Ivy build it was Black Friday and the P8Z77-V PRO looked awesome on paper, and with combo deals, discounts, and rebates I could get it for $155 so I thought it was a better choice than the cheaper ASRocks. Well it has been nothing but a disappointment and it is really buggy. The sound chip has already died (i've had it for about 45 days or less), the CMOS clears itself randomly, and its a crapshoot as to whether its going to recognize my boot drive when I turn the machine on.

So I'm hoping to have a fresh start with a new chip and motherboard. Also I can then RMA my V PRO while I use the Extreme6. Once the pro gets back and I test it as fully functional again I will sell it to pay for my new purchases.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> When i switch motherboards i will need to move my chip. Will i need to redo the liquid pro between the die and the ihs? If i try to pick the chip up gently is there enough of a bond that it should stay in one piece?


I'm wondering this too because I should probably order some new ULTRA or PRO now if I need to reapply.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Nice stickg1 want to see results out of that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I have the impression i am the only one with the cheap asrock Z77 in the forum lol though capable of 4.8GHz nevertheless)


I ran a pro3 with my 3770K for over 6 months @ 4.9 without a problem. Only reason I upgraded was because I was given a n amazon gift card


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well i am a believer on Silicon Lottery rather then expensive mobos with lots of CPU Phases if you get a good cpu it will oc good, but if have a crappy one no matter the board it cant do magic


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well i am a believer on Silicon Lottery rather then expensive mobos with lots of CPU Phases if you get a good cpu it will oc good, but if have a crappy one no matter the board it cant do magic


I totally agree. Pro3 had no issues at all. Board was rock solid for being only 89 dollars. Ivy doesnt eat a lot of power so super expensive boards arent needed for overclocking on air and water


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well i am a believer on Silicon Lottery rather then expensive mobos with lots of CPU Phases if you get a good cpu it will oc good, but if have a crappy one no matter the board it cant do magic


True, the main thing you need to overclock really well is a great chip. Although, a mobo can be the limiting factor after you have a great chip.

For example,

A great 3770k that should be able to run 5.0 @ 1.35 stable can run at that speed/vcore on a higher end mobo, but if you put it in an ITX mobo, will it run the same? Probably not.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> True, the main thing you need to overclock really well is a great chip. Although, a mobo can be the limiting factor after you have a great chip.
> For example,
> A great 3770k that should be able to run 5.0 @ 1.35 stable can run at that speed/vcore on a higher end mobo, but if you put it in an ITX mobo, will it run the same? Probably not.


How many 3770ks can actually do that tho? 1%?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> True, the main thing you need to overclock really well is a great chip. Although, a mobo can be the limiting factor after you have a great chip.
> For example,
> A great 3770k that should be able to run 5.0 @ 1.35 stable can run at that speed/vcore on a higher end mobo, but if you put it in an ITX mobo, will it run the same? Probably not.
> 
> 
> 
> How many 3770ks can actually do that tho? 1%?
Click to expand...

It was just an example.







I was just saying that a mobo may not determine how high the chip can actually go, but it can create a ceiling due to it being a bad board.


----------



## [CyGnus]

True


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would like to know who here has lapped the under side of the IHS and what methods u guys used to do it


I have. It is not easy *lilchronic*, but if you get something flat and small enough to get into the underside of the IHS that you can get the sandpaper onto, then you can get it to start to sand away by twisting and turning. Start with 200-400-600, then onto 800 at the end. You can check how flat it is with a razor blade to see if it is needed, and when it is flat emough.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would like to know who here has lapped the under side of the IHS and what methods u guys used to do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no need to lap the under side... only the top if is concaved.
Click to expand...

Well, wish so *chris-br*, but if the top is not flat, the underside is often not flat too! So a flat IHS just needs the top done, but if the top is concave, then the bottom will be convex and will need to be lapped to become flat too. You can see if it is needed on the top and the bottom by using a razorblade and see if either needs it though.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> I think voltage is important no matter what...well maybe less if at -200 something. I would think all electronics have a limit of how much voltage it can take before its fries itself.
> 
> 
> 
> So in other words I'll just have to live with my chip being at very low temps all the time? I guess that's not such a bad thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

Seems that before we IVY users deliddied we were limmited by temp *PuffinMyLye*, but since delidding we are limited by voltage. Not really a bad thing since temps degrade the chips real fast, so we have improved the longevity of our chips by delidding. Just that since we all like to bench and push our OC and performance alot, we now end up risking a shorter life for our cpus through overvoltage!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> in terms of degradation, heat is worse then running higher vcore, within vcore specs,
> heat shortens lifespan more, i made a post about it somewhere, with a cool graph,
> and a link to research..over a 3 year period
> 
> any vcore above 1.52V is getting more risky, 1.55 is absolute max on air/water,
> i think we should trust the people who know alot, like sin0822 and others elsewhere,
> we tent to use their findings, research/reviews and answers as true, to help others, but its not "official" sometimes..
> 
> above 1.6V vcore 24/7, things get really risky, for benching its no problem, at least i think it isnt,
> then temps dont matter anymore too, then the only thing is extreem coolling..
> 
> o, and we do have a max for temps, 105C tjmax, but not really for vcore,
> but 1.52V max for 24/7 oc seems reasonable so far..1.45V max for 24/7 i would advice if asked, for safe..


I agree with what *VonDutch* has shared above. 1.52v is VID and not vcore, but it is the best documented number we have. Still, it is not vcore. Yet we have been giving delidded IBs on here much more than that for months now. A few chips have died (poor Franky







), but many have survied way beyond what we though they would. And Little to no reports of degergation so far that I know of.

Although I still rather keep my 24/7 vcore at 1.4v or below. But that's just me. Others here do 24/7 at 1.5v and above. Everyone needs to determine what they are comfortable doing. And I do go up to 1.65v+ for high OC validations and some benching.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> When i switch motherboards i will need to move my chip. Will i need to redo the liquid pro between the die and the ihs? If i try to pick the chip up gently is there enough of a bond that it should stay in one piece?
> 
> 
> 
> Good question. i also wanna know this.
Click to expand...

Yes, good question *chronicfx* and *chris-br*. It depends. I have been able to just lift the delidded chip with Ultra or PRO right up and put it into a new MB without it coming apart and getting same temps after as before. I have also had them come apart.

When they come apart, sometimes the Ultra or PRO is still liquid enough that I can respread it with the brush that came with the Ultra. Other times I have been forced to clean it all off and start over.

The scrub brush with alcohol works good for cleaning, but sometimes I have had to bring out some 800 sandpaper to get it all off and ready again.Ultra was easier for me to clean off than PRO when I was forced to do so.


----------



## chronicfx

When you use the scrub brush do you use it on the die as well? I would be afraid that it is too abrasive.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> When you use the scrub brush do you use it on the die as well? I would be afraid that it is too abrasive.


No, I used a coffee filter to clean the TIM off the die. I would advise anything that scrapes...


----------



## feniks

this is unbelievable ... I found the culprit causing my system to make an unexpected shutdown at night (idle) and being unresponsive to power button later (needed to cycle the rocker switch on PSU to fire up) ... it was caused by latest AIDA64 running in background monitoring sensors ... what a joke ... now I think if in real it's a software glitch (BIOS problem??) or rather that software does something to my PSU somehow ... totally weird ... no aida64 running in background, no problem. my PSU might suck either way (though it gives proper +3.3, +5V and +12V voltages at exact middle range under load - checked with DMM).

anybody else running AIDA64 24/7 on MVE/MVF/MVG boards with 3770K? that's totally screwed up ... not even sure is AIDA64 alone *could* do such a (near hardware) failure to MB+PSU ... will need to double check with former revision of BIOS 704 (was now running latest 1501, but I don't like it).


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> When you use the scrub brush do you use it on the die as well? I would be afraid that it is too abrasive.


Nope. I just use alcohol and a coffee filter. But it comes off of the die much easier than off of the IHS or HSF.


----------



## dalastbmills

Hey guys!

Been awhile since I last posted here!

Spent all day yesterday replacing my H80 with a Rasa Extreme RX240 kit!


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!












I went through some noobie mistakes, like screwing too far and destroying the first radiator! I had to drive 2 hours to Microcenter in Mass to get a replacement!

I ran the loop for a couple hours to test for leaks and would have gone longer but the Houston/Cinncinati football game was boring and I just couldn't wait any longer to see how the results compared!

So, as it currently stand, my idle temps are the same however my load temps seem to have jumped quite a bit. My battlefield 3 gameplay temps have increased 10+ C and my IBT/P95 temps seem to have skyrocketed.

When installing the CPU block I convinced myself that I had too much Liquid Ultra on the die so I removed some. However, I then convinced myself that I removed too much and, being out of Ultra, put on some MX-4. Now, I am worried I put on too much! I have just enough to cover the entire die and have good contact with the IHS and I am all set on the IHS-CPU block contact.

Anyone have any imput? I'm under the impression that MX-4 doesn't need to cure. I'm almost ready to remove the IHS completely or go back to my 2600K and see if I can push 5GHz+.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Hey guys!
> 
> Been awhile since I last posted here!
> 
> Spent all day yesterday replacing my H80 with a Rasa Extreme RX240 kit!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went through some noobie mistakes, like screwing too far and destroying the first radiator! I had to drive 2 hours to Microcenter in Mass to get a replacement!
> 
> I ran the loop for a couple hours to test for leaks and would have gone longer but the Houston/Cinncinati football game was boring and I just couldn't wait any longer to see how the results compared!
> 
> So, as it currently stand, my idle temps are the same however my load temps seem to have jumped quite a bit. My battlefield 3 gameplay temps have increased 10+ C and my IBT/P95 temps seem to have skyrocketed.
> 
> When installing the CPU block I convinced myself that I had too much Liquid Ultra on the die so I removed some. However, I then convinced myself that I removed too much and, being out of Ultra, put on some MX-4. Now, I am worried I put on too much! I have just enough to cover the entire die and have good contact with the IHS and I am all set on the IHS-CPU block contact.
> 
> Anyone have any imput? I'm under the impression that MX-4 doesn't need to cure. I'm almost ready to remove the IHS completely or go back to my 2600K and see if I can push 5GHz+.


Looks good! Very nice. And thank you for using spoilers for the images.









How did you destroy the first radiator?


----------



## dalastbmills

I shrouded my h80 and was able to lower my temps. I did the same thing with the RX240, however the screws I had were too long and when I added water it all leaked out the radiator. At least I preinstalles the loop in an empty case. Hehe

By the way, I removed some of the TIM from my die and it brought my temps down a little bit during IBT. However, due to using MX-4 instead of Liquid Ultra, my temps are still higher then before.


----------



## dalastbmills

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Looks good! Very nice. And thank you for using spoilers for the images.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How did you destroy the first radiator?


Hehe! I took the pictures on my phone and when I uploaded them I realized they were huge. At first I just pasted the links but I then remembered the spoiler feature!


----------



## dalastbmills

Sorry about all the small short posts, but I've been going back and forth between my PC and phone. As I stated before, I lowered the temps a bit by removing some of the MX-4 on the die. Here's the thing: when I run IBT, the temps are great until right before it posts a pass of the test. Ever since upgrading to the loop, I've had great idle temps and all around temps, I just have large spikes and higher load temps. Is this normal? Is there anything I can do?

Edit: Just loaded up BF3 for a quick test and it seems my temps during gameplay are kinda back to normal. It just seems I am getting high temps during (extreme) benchmarking. Guess I can't really complain. Was really looking to see better performance out of this kit.


----------



## Swag

This is the color of the Fiat I got (Same model too, Fiat 500c).







$16,000! Brand new! Not bad for a first car.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This is the color of the Fiat I got (Same model too, Fiat 500c).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> $16,000! Brand new! Not bad for a first car.


I haven't seen one of those before, kind of a neat convertible top.

Bit small though, you'll need to keep an air mattress in there for dates.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This is the color of the Fiat I got (Same model too, Fiat 500c).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> $16,000! Brand new! Not bad for a first car.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't seen one of those before, kind of a neat convertible top.
> 
> Bit small though, you'll need to keep an air mattress in there for dates.
Click to expand...

HAHAHAHA, don't worry. I got that covered! The back seats fold down.







The top "folds". It's nice, you can open/close it while driving. Drives fairly quickly too but I'll probably be using my other car when I travel long distances because its max speed is 80mph so I can't be driving this on interstates!


----------



## Hokies83

Main rig is laid out on a table.

Cosmos 2 is rdy to sell 225$ shipped US 48..

Waiting on My Case Labs TH 10 now so i can re build my main system in it.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Main rig is laid out on a table.
> 
> Cosmos 2 is rdy to sell 225$ shipped US 48..
> 
> Waiting on My Case Labs TH 10 now so i can re build my main system in it.


I want that case. It's massive and I like cases that basically cover my entire room.


----------



## dalastbmills

Is that case bigger then the Antec 1200?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I want that case. It's massive and I like cases that basically cover my entire room.


225$ already modded for rads.. 75$ of it is for shipping lol..

send me a pm if ur interested.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I want that case. It's massive and I like cases that basically cover my entire room.


TX10-D?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I want that case. It's massive and I like cases that basically cover my entire room.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 225$ already modded for rads.. 75$ of it is for shipping lol..
> 
> send me a pm if ur interested.
Click to expand...

Too bad I just bought my new case. I would've bought it! We'll see if I can sell my new and old case before someone grabs it.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I want that case. It's massive and I like cases that basically cover my entire room.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TX10-D?
Click to expand...

Yes! I want that one! It's $850 though so I can't!


----------



## Teh Rav3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however ]while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*.When overclocking on air the only two voltages you should need to touch on an Ivy Bridge setup are the Vcore (which you increase) and the CPU PLL( which can be decreased to help temperatures).
> if you read whats under the charts, youll see sin mention the same VID,
> that i found in the datasheet from intel,
> i used that same chart for a while when people asked me about max vcore,
> then some peeps commented me on using 1.52V vcore as max vcore intel states,
> "not true, intel doesnt state that anywhere, bs..bla etc"
> so i started seaching, and found the chart in the datasheet,
> then some others said, that VID has nothing to do with vcore ....LOL
> "appetite for information"..yea, i know that ..


I'm good either way, it turns out. Regardless, I'm staying at 1.5 Vcore or less for a 24/7/365 oc. Which is exactly where I'm at right now @ 4.9 Ghz, and I'm not pushing any further for day to day use. 5 Ghz requires 1.56 Vcore for stability, and 100 Mhz for that kind of Vcore increase simply isn't worth it. Oh, right! Did I mention my new chip hits 5 Ghz!























I'll push it a bit more simply for cpu-z validations, because it will boot cleanly at 1.52 @ a 50 multi, but for now that's good enough. Although I got a weird temp spread across my cores, and I'm thinking I have a bad mount. I'll remount next weekend because I sure don't have the time to do it again. I need to order some more CLP to remount anyway. I ran out after the IHS-die application, and used Prolimatech Thermal Compound (not sure which one, they didn't label the one that came in my old Megahalem's back then. I assume it's pk-1), and I'll lap the IHS & AD II when I do to see if that improves temps.

Aside from the strange temp spread (10-11° C cooler on core 0 vs cores 1-2-3, which are running hotter), everything else is copacetic.







I still need to play with the PLL, to see if I can eek the temps down a bit more, I just left PLL overvolting set to disabled for these tests. But here's what I ended up with...

http://valid.canardpc.com/2643181


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> this is unbelievable ... I found the culprit causing my system to make an unexpected shutdown at night (idle) and being unresponsive to power button later (needed to cycle the rocker switch on PSU to fire up) ... it was caused by latest AIDA64 running in background monitoring sensors ... what a joke ... now I think if in real it's a software glitch (BIOS problem??) or rather that software does something to my PSU somehow ... totally weird ... no aida64 running in background, no problem. my PSU might suck either way (though it gives proper +3.3, +5V and +12V voltages at exact middle range under load - checked with DMM).
> anybody else running AIDA64 24/7 on MVE/MVF/MVG boards with 3770K? that's totally screwed up ... not even sure is AIDA64 alone *could* do such a (near hardware) failure to MB+PSU ... will need to double check with former revision of BIOS 704 (was now running latest 1501, but I don't like it).


I am not surprised at all. I was having freezes and other erratic behavior (gpu driver crashes) while running Aida 64 in the background when my monitor went into sleep mode. All of that ceased when I went to O.H.M. instead. Btw, I forgot to get back to you on the cpu socket question earlier. AsRock's using Foxconn sockets, at least on the Z77e-itx's, and I know they have a contract w/ Foxconn, so likely the rest of their boards do too.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> this is unbelievable ... I found the culprit causing my system to make an unexpected shutdown at night (idle) and being unresponsive to power button later (needed to cycle the rocker switch on PSU to fire up) ... it was caused by latest AIDA64 running in background monitoring sensors ... what a joke ... now I think if in real it's a software glitch (BIOS problem??) or rather that software does something to my PSU somehow ... totally weird ... no aida64 running in background, no problem. my PSU might suck either way (though it gives proper +3.3, +5V and +12V voltages at exact middle range under load - checked with DMM).
> anybody else running AIDA64 24/7 on MVE/MVF/MVG boards with 3770K? that's totally screwed up ... not even sure is AIDA64 alone *could* do such a (near hardware) failure to MB+PSU ... will need to double check with former revision of BIOS 704 (was now running latest 1501, but I don't like it).


I have Aida64 running all the time (have had for years even back when it was Everest) and have never had a problem


----------



## VonDutch

i use aida64 for a while now,
only use it if its needed tho, i dont have it running all the time,
when i start it, np, when i open stability test, it kinda freezes for 10-15 seconds,
if i move mouse, it start to jump a little, then everything is back to normal,
no other problems i can think of using it..


----------



## VonDutch

for my 4.7ghz oc, im using offset, 0.055V,
i have LLC set to Turbo on my gigabyte mobo,
which gives a bit vdroop, following sin's guide on it,
where it says,

"You will also want to set LLC which is under the 3D power menu, *the LLC should be set to Turbo for a slight droop, or Extreme for no droop at all.* The LLC on these boards is rock solid, what you set is what you get, and nothing other than that."
and
Load Line Calibration: This setting can be increased in intensity which will decrease the standard Vdroop setting for the voltages, the CPU VCore LLC is the most important, *and if you are OCing on air you should set Turbo* and if on LN2 you should set Extreme.


so im using Turbo as LLC setting all the time,
what if i set it to Extreme, no vdroop at all,
would it decrease my offset too?
like, wil it bring down my 0.055 offset to say 0.005 or less, or even negative?
whats the reason not to use the Extreme LLC setting ?
maybe im just seeing this wrong idk..

if i look at the graph, even Extreme still has some droop..


----------



## VonDutch

so i set LLC to extreme now, got offset down to 0.030V,
instead of 0.055V with LLC set to Turbo..

offset 0.025V didnt work, cinebench just closed on me ..lol
i prolly need 0.035V offset to make it run smooth,

LLC Extreme, 4.7ghz offset 0.035V
LLC Turbo, 4.7ghz offset 0.055V


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, I was wondering about the sound card in my motherboard.

I have the Maximus V Gene and as far as I'm concerned, the sound card is good enough for my use. When I use the jack in front of my case, will that use the sound card or will I need to use the jack in the back of my motherboard?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, I was wondering about the sound card in my motherboard.
> I have the Maximus V Gene and as far as I'm concerned, the sound card is good enough for my use. When I use the jack in front of my case, will that use the sound card or will I need to use the jack in the back of my motherboard?


if the frontjack connected to your mobo, it should use the onboard soundcard,
what else could it use..

you never told me yesterday, what you where watching?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teh Rav3n*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am not surprised at all. I was having freezes and other erratic behavior (gpu driver crashes) while running Aida 64 in the background when my monitor went into sleep mode. All of that ceased when I went to O.H.M. instead. Btw, I forgot to get back to you on the cpu socket question earlier. AsRock's using Foxconn sockets, at least on the Z77e-itx's, and I know they have a contract w/ Foxconn, so likely the rest of their boards do too.


glad your socket wasn't LOTES, those suck and should be avoided at all cost, CPU damage (me included) was reported on boards carrying those sockets.

another common thing I see then, it does happen only when monitor is in sleep mode or turned off as far as I can tell. Once it happened nearly right after monitor was turned on and it went to sleep, less than 5 minutes later the comp shut down unexpectedly and I couldn't turn it on until PSU rocker switch was cycled.

it does surprise me however! I still think this is not purely AIDA64 *causing* it. I believe this the darn bugged latest BIOS (last 3 revisions to be specific) that cause the MB voltage bug which gets only triggered by AIDA64 when it runs in background for long enough (happens at idle only).

Discovered this on the latest MVE BIOS 1501, but the fact is that this BIOS carries same bug (corrupted Load Defaults option in BIOS after it ran through a few different overclocks) as 2 other former revisions did - 1309 & 1408.
The latest "healthy" BIOS for this board with no such bug was 704, and I am running this one right now at exact same settings as on 1501 with AIDA64 in background for several hours and so far nothing happened. will see by evening if it returns ... going to work in 4 hours







... and god damn can't fall asleep LOL... it will be a tough day ahead of me ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I have Aida64 running all the time (have had for years even back when it was Everest) and have never had a problem


well, aida64 is no perfect and MVE board support was added to it not so long ago, I believe it could carry some slight conflict with latest BIOSes for this board ... or the latest BIOSes are a bunch of crap to start with ...
In past I found AIDA64 causing video playback lag on 790 Ultra platform when it was running in background, I believe it was related to sensor polling.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i use aida64 for a while now,
> only use it if its needed tho, i dont have it running all the time,
> when i start it, np, when i open stability test, it kinda freezes for 10-15 seconds,
> if i move mouse, it start to jump a little, then everything is back to normal,
> no other problems i can think of using it..


I used to run it on as needed basis as well, but recently configured it as a fail-safe for water pump RPM monitoring and executing a batch command to log the event in a text file and shutdown system if there is no input from water pump tacho. project succeeded, but my latest MB BIOS failed on it LOL!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so i set LLC to extreme now, got offset down to 0.030V,
> instead of 0.055V with LLC set to Turbo..
> offset 0.025V didnt work, cinebench just closed on me ..lol
> i prolly need 0.035V offset to make it run smooth,
> LLC Extreme, 4.7ghz offset 0.035V
> LLC Turbo, 4.7ghz offset 0.055V


Extreme LLC will not cause vdroop, but it WILL overshoot vcore under full load, sometimes as high as +0.05V when compared to idle with no vdroop. For daily running try using one step below (slightest possible vdroop), it works best especially with offsets and high clocks. For lower daily cloccks the moderate setting (High in your chart) should be best, but consider that you will need to compensate for deeper vdroop.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> I used to run it on as needed basis as well, but recently configured it as a fail-safe for water pump RPM monitoring and executing a batch command to log the event in a text file and shutdown system if there is no input from water pump tacho. project succeeded, but my latest MB BIOS failed on it LOL!
> Extreme LLC will not cause vdroop, but it WILL overshoot vcore under full load, sometimes as high as +0.05V when compared to idle with no vdroop. For daily running try using one step below (slightest possible vdroop), it works best especially with offsets and high clocks. For lower daily cloccks the moderate setting (High in your chart) should be best, but consider that you will need to compensate for deeper vdroop.


yea, i always run Turbo, give a slight vdroop,
was just wondering this morning about the extreme setting,
and why i should not use it, it did bring down offset by 0.020V it seems,
no change in temps looks like..just added some snapshots on that post ..


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i always run Turbo, give a slight vdroop,
> was just wondering this morning about the extreme setting,
> and why i should not use it, it did bring down offset by 0.020V it seems,
> no change in temps looks like..just added some snapshots on that post ..


yeah, it lowers the offset, because it brings the base voltage higher








temps looks same tho, maybe try running IBT in Max Mode for 5 runs and compare then?

I also keep CPu-Z open and look at vcore closely, it drops down to the lowest level the moment when 100% load on CPU is introduced (in max mode it will take a while to load up all memory with data) then it flattens at slightly higher level and occasionally only dips down to that "bottom under load" level. if it is stable throughout the test with no WHEA (double check with Cine) the such "bottom under load" voltage is the least your chip needs to run at such clocks, no matter if you use fixed vcore or different offsets - use it as a basis for quickly re-stabilizing CPU at same clock with different settings, it helps.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, it lowers the offset, because it brings the base voltage higher
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> temps looks same tho, maybe try running IBT in Max Mode for 5 runs and compare then?
> I also keep CPu-Z open and look at vcore closely, it drops down to the lowest level the moment when 100% load on CPU is introduced (in max mode it will take a while to load up all memory with data) then it flattens at slightly higher level and occasionally only dips down to that "bottom under load" level. if it is stable throughout the test with no WHEA (double check with Cine) the such "bottom under load" voltage is the least your chip needs to run at such clocks, no matter if you use fixed vcore or different offsets - use it as a basis for quickly re-stabilizing CPU at same clock with different settings, it helps.


thanks,
repforyou








you mentioned,

"Extreme LLC will not cause vdroop, but it WILL overshoot vcore under full load"

does it really matter if my vcore is about 1.3V, and it overshoots under load?
lets say it overshoots by 0.010V..

no wheas during cinebench, ran it 2x to make sure,
i always start with cinebench with new oc's, it only takes a minute orso,
and it shows whea errors very fast,
or it just stops working, like with the 0.025V offset i used just now..

will do some max mode testing later today









sorry i have to ask so much, trying to get a better understanding of the max llc,
or no vdroop, i just dont get it till now ...lol..i hate that, maybe its just because its monday morning


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> With the delidding I really thin we should leave a very thin layer of remnant glue on the PCB just as a protective barrier. I did this and had no heat issues at all. *especially once I lapped the underside of the IHS* including the lips a bit, not much but with 400 grit it goes fast.


So hard to keep up with that thread!
Could you please explain how to lap the underside of the IHS? Any Pics?

Sandpapers should arrive soon, 600 -> 3000 then I'll be ready to go with the delidding process!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dalastbmills*
> 
> Hey guys!
> Been awhile since I last posted here!
> Spent all day yesterday replacing my H80 with a Rasa Extreme RX240 kit!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went through some noobie mistakes, like screwing too far and destroying the first radiator! I had to drive 2 hours to Microcenter in Mass to get a replacement!
> I ran the loop for a couple hours to test for leaks and would have gone longer but the Houston/Cinncinati football game was boring and I just couldn't wait any longer to see how the results compared!
> So, as it currently stand, my idle temps are the same however my load temps seem to have jumped quite a bit. My battlefield 3 gameplay temps have increased 10+ C and my IBT/P95 temps seem to have skyrocketed.
> When installing the CPU block I convinced myself that I had too much Liquid Ultra on the die so I removed some. However, I then convinced myself that I removed too much and, being out of Ultra, put on some MX-4. Now, I am worried I put on too much! I have just enough to cover the entire die and have good contact with the IHS and I am all set on the IHS-CPU block contact.
> Anyone have any imput? I'm under the impression that MX-4 doesn't need to cure. I'm almost ready to remove the IHS completely or go back to my 2600K and see if I can push 5GHz+.


wait, you changed from H80 to the Rasa Extreme RX240 kit, reassembled it,
and saw the temps go up by 10C compared to the H80 using Ultra?


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


That looks dope Hok! Is this the case you've been talking about getting all along? It looked much bigger in the other pics you've posted.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> That looks dope Hok! Is this the case you've been talking about getting all along? It looked much bigger in the other pics you've posted.


LoL that is just the Psu side of the case and that is a 86mm 480 rad in push/pull and a 64mm rad in push/pull.

Also that is with out the 120mm Top so add another 120mm to it









Still waiting on Jim to finish the 120mm roof.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> That looks dope Hok! Is this the case you've been talking about getting all along? It looked much bigger in the other pics you've posted.


Which model is that one again?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Which model is that one again?


That is the TH10

Here is the ST10 see the 120mm roof? that is what im adding to my TH10.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That is the TH10
> Here is the ST10 see the 120mm roof? that is what im adding to my TH10.


I see yes. How much did the case run you? I thought you said something like $800+ but I see it on Case Labs site for $530.

*EDIT:* Oh you must be referring to the TX10? Damn that thing is a monster







.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> I see yes. How much did the case run you? I thought you said something like $800+ but I see it on Case Labs site for $530.
> *EDIT:* Oh you must be referring to the TX10? Damn that thing is a monster
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


TH10 gonna cost me around 625$.. You gotta add the options bro to get the price.. 530$ is just the base case lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> So hard to keep up with that thread!
> Could you please explain how to lap the underside of the IHS? Any Pics?
> Sandpapers should arrive soon, 600 -> 3000 then I'll be ready to go with the delidding process!


just saw this in another thread,
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Bigdale7* & *lilchronic* - Heres what I just posted on the delidding thread.... _if you get something flat and small enough to get into the underside of the IHS that you can get the sandpaper onto, then you can get it to start to sand away by twisting and turning. Start with 200-400-600, then onto 800 at the end. You can check how flat it is with a razor blade to see if it is needed, and when it is flat enough._


not many have lapped the inside ihs..seems almost impossible to do to me ...lol


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks,
> repforyou
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you mentioned,
> "Extreme LLC will not cause vdroop, but it WILL overshoot vcore under full load"
> does it really matter if my vcore is about 1.3V, and it overshoots under load?
> lets say it overshoots by 0.010V..
> no wheas during cinebench, ran it 2x to make sure,
> i always start with cinebench with new oc's, it only takes a minute orso,
> and it shows whea errors very fast,
> or it just stops working, like with the 0.025V offset i used just now..
> will do some max mode testing later today
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry i have to ask so much, trying to get a better understanding of the max llc,
> or no vdroop, i just dont get it till now ...lol..i hate that, maybe its just because its monday morning


nah, it doesn't matter much if temps under load don't shoot above former levels








some boards overshoot by a fair amount under load, much higher than you would expect, yours is very decent in that matter actually









I also always start new OC (or double check before use) with Cine and check for WHEA errors. It actually helps by A LOT to follow Hardware Decoder's advice and assign a task action for WHEA Waarning Event ID 19 (r-click it in Event Viewer on any entry from past), I assigned a pop-up window with warning, this way I see it whenever it happens, no need to even go to logs to check if it was clean









don't worry about vdroop to much if OC is stable and max temps are acceptable









it mostly matters at high clocks when one doesn't want to go past certain level of temperature or actual voltage, nothing else. cheers


----------



## stickg1

Dang hokie, that's one heck off a case.

Well good news. I got the money from the insurance claim on the 7970 that I sold on Ebay and was damaged in shipping. I also get the damaged card back today. I guided the buyer through straightening the bent slot plate, but he said the display outputs weren't working. Maybe the card will still work for crossfire...

We'll see when I get home from work..


----------



## ByeByeFive

hopefully this will encourage others to delid
step one delid
step two apply coollaboratory pro on bare bye
step three mount block on bare dye, please! no ihs! (you came this far)

highest temps do not surpass 81C
ambient temperature 18c~ 20c

*5.2ghz 3570k 100 IBT run stable*




I followed http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition

here are screen shots that may help you overclock








http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> hopefully this will encourage others to delid
> step one delid
> step two apply coollaboratory pro on bare bye
> step three mount block on bare dye, please! no ihs! (you came this far)
> highest temps do not surpass 81C
> ambient temperature 18c~ 20c
> *5.2ghz 3570k 100 IBT run stable*
> 
> I followed http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition
> here are screen shots that may help you overclock
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987


Are you WATERCOOLED?

EDIT: BTW, nice chip you have there.







congrats


----------



## feniks

congrats ByeByeFive, great results


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Are you WATERCOOLED?
> EDIT: BTW, nice chip you have there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> congrats


yes sir im on a xspc rasa rx360 with push and pull gentle typhoon ap15's configuration

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> congrats ByeByeFive, great results


thank you feniks~


----------



## lilchronic

this sucks its been a week and my coolabs havent left from {FRANKFURT AM MAIN, GERMANY Origin Post is Preparing Shipment} for a week!


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> this sucks its been a week and my coolabs havent left from {FRANKFURT AM MAIN, GERMANY Origin Post is Preparing Shipment} for a week!


i ordered mine from http://www.frozencpu.com/ took total of 3 days for it to be delivered.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> hopefully this will encourage others to delid
> step one delid
> step two apply coollaboratory pro on bare bye
> step three mount block on bare dye, please! no ihs! (you came this far)
> highest temps do not surpass 81C
> ambient temperature 18c~ 20c
> *5.2ghz 3570k 100 IBT run stable*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I followed http://www.overclock.net/t/1198504/complete-overclocking-guide-sandy-bridge-ivy-bridge-asrock-edition
> here are screen shots that may help you overclock
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987


very nice ByeByeFive, gratz









theres not much difference between bare die, or using the ihs tempwise, few degrees at most with a normal ihs(not to concave)
but its one thing more that can go wrong, crushed die would be the worst of them, the ihs also protects the die for that,
besides the bigger heat dispensing area..i wouldnt do it because i use a aircooler,
im thinking the weight might put to much pressure on one side of the die
just saying, before everyone is gonna do it..lol


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> i ordered mine from http://www.frozencpu.com/ took total of 3 days for it to be delivered.


dam i didnt no they had it anyway i got it from coolabs website and there sending me an extra 1 cause the first 1 they sent was busted


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> very nice ByeByeFive, gratz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> theres not much difference between bare die, or using the ihs tempwise, few degrees at most with a normal ihs(not to concave)
> but its one thing more that can go wrong, crushed die would be the worst of them, the ihs also protects the die for that,
> besides the bigger heat dispensing area..i wouldnt do it because i use a aircooler,
> im thinking the weight might put to much pressure on one side of the die
> just saying, before everyone is gonna do it..lol


Totally with you on that one. I'm just happy with my outcome so naturally I encourage everyone to go all the way. Obviously in the realm of knowing what they're doing and the risk that they are taking.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Thanx VonDutch!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if you get something flat and small enough to get into the underside of the IHS that you can get the sandpaper onto, then you can get it to start to sand away by *twisting and turning*.


That's how I was figuring to do it, I don't see any other way than turning when doing it manually.
And don't findany adequate tool to put in my Dremel...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not many have lapped the inside ihs..seems almost impossible to do to me ...lol


Difficult task indeed, I'll check if it's worth trying something or not.


----------



## Bigdale7

I received my 3770K chip today so I will be swapping chips next weekend and I think I'll try lapping the inside of the IHS on my 3570K. It was certainly concave as it took some effort to flatten the top. As I am having very uneven core temps it'll be worth the effort to try and flatten the inside of the IHS.. I'll also be testing my new chip to see what she'll do and if it is a good chip to delid. After doing my first two delids I seem to feel far more confident about doing another...


----------



## SonDa5

Just checking in guys. Props to all the succesfull delidders and those interested in learning how to do this. For me this was a major break through in cooling 3570k and 3770k and I have had a blast and learned alot from the whole experience.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good to see you around man








How are your chips and green ram doing btw?


----------



## Jaggar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Totally with you on that one. I'm just happy with my outcome so naturally I encourage everyone to go all the way. Obviously in the realm of knowing what they're doing and the risk that they are taking.


I agree with this, I haven't delidded any CPUs recently but if your gonna take off the IHS anyway just leave it off. I remember all the CPUs I installed back in the day were all heat sink right on the dye, at least until after the AMD Athlon XP series. The more changes in medium you have the more loss in temp exchange.


----------



## Valgaur

I want my chip.......


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want my chip.......


No answer yet?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want my chip.......


I want ANY chip, 1155 compatible lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well good news. I got the money from the insurance claim on the 7970 that I sold on Ebay and was damaged in shipping. I also get the damaged card back today. I guided the buyer through straightening the bent slot plate, but he said the display outputs weren't working. Maybe the card will still work for crossfire...
> We'll see when I get home from work..


I was able to revive the card. One of the two BIOSes got corrupt. I'm not sure what to do with it. It works fine in Crossfire and I tried it by itself and the HDMI and DVI ports work...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was able to revive the card. One of the two BIOSes got corrupt. I'm not sure what to do with it. It works fine in Crossfire and I tried it by itself and the HDMI and DVI ports work...


sounds like a card u will have to sell at 1/2 value via a forum market place letting everyonr know what issues it has.

Anywho while waiting for TH10...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was able to revive the card. One of the two BIOSes got corrupt. I'm not sure what to do with it. It works fine in Crossfire and I tried it by itself and the HDMI and DVI ports work...
> 
> 
> 
> sounds like a card u will have to sell at 1/2 value via a forum market place letting everyonr know what issues it has.
> 
> Anywho while waiting for TH10...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...

Is that the Alphacool radiator? That's huge, that won't fit in my case other than if I have it on the bottom but only pull.







I still don't know what to get for my WC upgrade.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Fire that thing up over the table xD


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Is that the Alphacool radiator? That's huge, that won't fit in my case other than if I have it on the bottom but only pull.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still don't know what to get for my WC upgrade.


Look at the Swiftech H220 loop for 139, I'm getting that and adding a res and rad for the gpu once I get the extra block.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> sounds like a card u will have to sell at 1/2 value via a forum market place letting everyonr know what issues it has.


I'll try to revive the other BIOS if I can. But I might just keep it and use it in crossfire with my 7950. Also I might tinker with it and slap my Antec Kuhler on it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Is that the Alphacool radiator? That's huge, that won't fit in my case other than if I have it on the bottom but only pull.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still don't know what to get for my WC upgrade.


Fits in bottom of cosmos 2 in push/pull and has room to spare.. lol

Should still perform better then most rads in just pull config tho.

Just think my TH 10 wil have 4 480s and that rad in it XD

You could also go with one of these..

http://www.swiftech.com/h2o-x20-edge-hd-1.aspx


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good to see you around man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How are your chips and green ram doing btw?


The Sammy ram is doing great. The chips are doing great. I have a delidded 3570k sitting in a box and a delidded 3770k in my sig rig. I will either sell this 3570k or build a water cooled 5ghz itx system in the next few months.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> The Sammy ram is doing great. The chips are doing great. I have a delidded 3570k sitting in a box and a delidded 3770k in my sig rig. I will either sell this 3570k or build a water cooled 5ghz itx system in the next few months.


I need a cpu man xD but have no monies yet...I listed my 670 for sale, along with older 775 stuff I got.









If you gonna do a water cooled itx, be sure to make a build log here


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Fits in bottom of cosmos 2 in push/pull and has room to spare.. lol
> Should still perform better then most rads in just pull config tho.
> Just think my TH 10 wil have 4 480s and that rad in it XD
> You could also go with one of these..
> http://www.swiftech.com/h2o-x20-edge-hd-1.aspx


What are you cooling with your 4 480's Hok? I can't see how that's not going to be total overkill even if you have 3 GPU's being cooled.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> What are you cooling with your 4 480's Hok? I can't see how that's not going to be total overkill even if you have 3 GPU's being cooled.


Cpu and 2 gpus in the future.

it is for looks case labs case needs rads.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cpu and 2 gpus in the future.
> it is for looks case labs case needs rads.


Two 480's would be plenty for that, 2 isn't enough for looks? Aren't two hidden anyway?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cpu and 2 gpus in the future.
> it is for looks case labs case needs rads.


You're crazy bro! I like it though..


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If you gonna do a water cooled itx, be sure to make a build log here


Will do.

Looking for a ITX case that I can fit a Alphacool NexXxoS UT60 Full Copper Dual 140mm radiator and small reservoir and pump to cool cpu and a water cooled video card.


----------



## ivanlabrie

He has to fill that overkill case aswell...gotta justify it, same as my 220cfm fans. I need a noisier denser rad for them lol

4 way sli? Perhaps he will slap 4 tecs on the cpu and freeze it 24/7 and same treatment for the gpus, but that would warrant two psus lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Fits in bottom of cosmos 2 in push/pull and has room to spare.. lol
> Should still perform better then most rads in just pull config tho.
> Just think my TH 10 wil have 4 480s and that rad in it XD
> You could also go with one of these..
> http://www.swiftech.com/h2o-x20-edge-hd-1.aspx
> 
> 
> 
> What are you cooling with your 4 480's Hok? I can't see how that's not going to be total overkill even if you have 3 GPU's being cooled.
Click to expand...

OCN = Overkill Club Nation. Obviously he will be overkilling! I hope all he uses those rads for are his CPU so it'll be extreme overkill.









Anyway, how about the Apogee Drive 2 + EX240 (I want it to fit the top and then I'll buy that 80mm one down the road for the bottom of the case) + tube res? How does that sound?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Two 480's would be plenty for that, 2 isn't enough for looks? Aren't two hidden anyway?


4 Monsta 86 mm 480s + the 2 240s i have now + a bunch of different Res for looks..

I plan to have like 3 res lol.. i want one of Cyberdruids Res.. + a 5.25 bay res + a water fall res.




TH10 gives me room for all this.. and even afew bags of chips...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 4 Monsta 86 mm 480s + the 2 240s i have now + a bunch of different Res for looks..
> I plan to have like 3 res lol.. i want one of Cyberdruids Res.. + a 5.25 bay res + a water fall res.
> 
> 
> 
> TH10 gives me room for all this.. and even afew bags of chips...


That res would be sick if it wasn't for the condensation.


----------



## stickg1

I'm gonna sneak a CPU loop onto hokies gear for my chip, he could keep me below 50C all the way down in South Carolina..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 4 Monsta 86 mm 480s + the 2 240s i have now + a bunch of different Res for looks..
> I plan to have like 3 res lol.. i want one of Cyberdruids Res.. + a 5.25 bay res + a water fall res.
> 
> 
> 
> TH10 gives me room for all this.. and even afew bags of chips...


Hahaha! so cool...









Hokies, get multiple high wattage peltiers and freeze your chip 24/7, you have enough raddage and psu for that.


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jaggar*
> 
> I agree with this, I haven't delidded any CPUs recently but if your gonna take off the IHS anyway just leave it off. I remember all the CPUs I installed back in the day were all heat sink right on the dye, at least until after the AMD Athlon XP series. The more changes in medium you have the more loss in temp exchange.


the problem is that more than half of the people are afraid that they will crush the dye, in reality its fine as long as you put even pressure on the dye. Something you should do for even distribution of heat.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm gonna sneak a CPU loop onto hokies gear for my chip, he could keep me below 50C all the way down in South Carolina..


Offer to trade that 7970 for a nice custom loop i bet somebody bites.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hahaha! so cool...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hokies, get multiple high wattage peltiers and freeze your chip 24/7, you have enough raddage and psu for that.


Thats not my only Psu i have 3 more lol 3 are 600 watt or better one is 350 watts .. Pump/fan tester..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Offer to trade that 7970 for a nice custom loop i bet somebody bites.
> Thats not my only Psu i have 3 more lol 3 are 600 watt or better one is 350 watts .. Pump/fan tester..


Awesome! you could put them to good use for some massive overkill and coolness








FtW 420 said that he killed a chip with CL Pro on die when freezing it though, be careful with that...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Offer to trade that 7970 for a nice custom loop i bet somebody bites.


That's not a bad idea. Three more rep to go, I'll go on a rep run tomorrow night. I did it this weekend and pulled up 10 or so in a few hours. Not everyone hits that rep button though when you help them. Oh well, a numbers game I suppose, the more help I provide the more potential of someone clicking that button.

The only place I have rep enough to sell is Tom's and that place is not exactly a hot spot...


----------



## Valgaur

well.... guess I'm getting Franky back. no RMA for me.... i kinda figured since the IHS was lapped.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> well.... guess I'm getting Franky back. no RMA for me.... i kinda figured since the IHS was lapped.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> well.... guess I'm getting Franky back. no RMA for me.... i kinda figured since the IHS was lapped.


Not too unexpected, kinda sucks that they misplaced your chip & made you wait to hear it though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome! you could put them to good use for some massive overkill and coolness
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FtW 420 said that he killed a chip with CL Pro on die when freezing it though, be careful with that...


I was using the ultra, I imagine pro would work similar. Went OK until I was overclocked & loaded it up, something with the hot die & cold IHS made the TIM go running off the die, temps went from frozen to fire really fast.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> well.... guess I'm getting Franky back. no RMA for me.... i kinda figured since the IHS was lapped.


Buy a lid from someone, it's not like it matter really.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> well.... guess I'm getting Franky back. no RMA for me.... i kinda figured since the IHS was lapped.


hmmm ... I'd say that is expected since it was lapped ... they need those numbers on IHS ... now warranty without it ... was surprised that you heard anything else over the phone with them ... oh well ... at least you tried.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hmmm ... I'd say that is expected since it was lapped ... they need those numbers on IHS ... now warranty without it ... was surprised that you heard anything else over the phone with them ... oh well ... at least you tried.


I put all the information from my IHS onto a sheet of paper and everything.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hmmm ... I'd say that is expected since it was lapped ... they need those numbers on IHS ... now warranty without it ... was surprised that you heard anything else over the phone with them ... oh well ... at least you tried.
> 
> 
> 
> I put all the information from my IHS onto a sheet of paper and everything.
Click to expand...

It's more like, they need the IHS to have the information because the people who process the CPU don't plug it into a system so you could buy some i3 and replace it with it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> hmmm ... I'd say that is expected since it was lapped ... they need those numbers on IHS ... now warranty without it ... was surprised that you heard anything else over the phone with them ... oh well ... at least you tried.
> 
> 
> 
> I put all the information from my IHS onto a sheet of paper and everything.
Click to expand...

We are all bummed for you Bro.....


----------



## FtW 420

Glue the paper to the IHS. "What do you mean denied? the information is right there on the IHS..."


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I put all the information from my IHS onto a sheet of paper and everything.


yeah, I understand, you were honest with them and AFAIK, they actually said no problem, right? this and fact they waited so long with final answer sucks ... you could have switched the IHS from a dead chip and send it in ... wondering if it went through ... not sure what the QR code on PCB says about batches and serials though (need to be matching with IHS I think).

either way, I'm sorry for you man ... at least you have a Microcenter nearby, so maybe try your luck with new chip from there and then figure out what to do with your deader ... or just swallow the bullet.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yeah, I understand, you were honest with them and AFAIK, they actually said no problem, right? this and fact they waited so long with final answer sucks ... you could have switched the IHS from a dead chip and send it in ... wondering if it went through ... not sure what the QR code on PCB says about batches and serials though (need to be matching with IHS I think).
> either way, I'm sorry for you man ... at least you have a Microcenter nearby, so maybe try your luck with new chip from there and then figure out what to do with your deader ... or just swallow the bullet.


microcenter is 6 hours away.

so I guess I'll have to save up and buy a new chip... but to wait for the i7 or just get an i5....


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> microcenter is 6 hours away.
> so I guess I'll have to save up and buy a new chip... but to wait for the i7 or just get an i5....


buddy, if it was about me and if money is tight then forget about i7 and just take i5 3570K, same daily performance, just no HT (good only for benchmarking or video encoding really ...) ... no friends/family passing by that MC store soon? you could order online "for them" so it could be picked up and brought to you ...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> buddy, if it was about me and if money is tight then forget about i7 and just take i5 3570K, same daily performance, just no HT (good only for benchmarking or video encoding really ...) ... no friends/family passing by that MC store soon? you could order online "for them" so it could be picked up and brought to you ...


no ones close to one lol. so yeah the i5 will be what I'm gonna get


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> buddy, if it was about me and if money is tight then forget about i7 and just take i5 3570K, same daily performance, just no HT (good only for benchmarking or video encoding really ...) ... no friends/family passing by that MC store soon? you could order online "for them" so it could be picked up and brought to you ...
> 
> 
> 
> no ones close to one lol. so yeah the i5 will be what I'm gonna get
Click to expand...

i5 is fine for most everything we do, so I think you will be good with it.


----------



## c2thew

here's a dumb question.

how does a cpu chip know when it is stable at higher overclock frequencies? Most of you know that i've been struggling to overclock to 4.8ghz on air with a delidded chip but have encountered BSOD until i lower the speed down to 4.6ghz and even then I get occasional BSOD's. It seems that stability comes with temperature throttles when the cpu chip is under load up until the chip reaches of which ivy bridge is 105 degrees celsius. So my question is what is stopping someone from putting 55 in the frequency that runs on air? will the operating system not handle the bios overclock? Or does a computer crash because of the thermal limits of the chip/chip degradation? Is it the actual physical chip/hardware that determines the limitation? i.e. good chips/bad chips based on production/quality control (costa rica vs malysia ivy chips).

i'm a novice here so i'm still getting to understand what everyone else is doing. From what i've seen, most people just tweak the cpu voltage (vcore) to either a fixed, offset for high overclocking but leave C states on in order to recapture the energy costs of not having your chip running at 5ghz whenever you power on your computer and surf the internet/, game, edit/handbrake videos, or do cpu folding. But the rest of the settings besides setting the ram timings seem to be left alone in the bios (fan speeds exception). i know that the bios layout/settings are different for every motherboard manufacturer but the core changeable items are still there.

so i suppose what i'm trying to get at is: is a high overclock dependent on ALL cpu core components? cpu chip, motherboard, memory or also on the peripheral components: video card, power supply, sata connectors, internal memory controllers (though i think that's motherboard related).

just thinking out loud.


----------



## lilchronic

just unlocked my 670ftw thought i wold share with every 1 1398mhz boost clock








http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5496681


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> here's a dumb question.
> how does a cpu chip know when it is stable at higher overclock frequencies? Most of you know that i've been struggling to overclock to 4.8ghz on air with a delidded chip but have encountered BSOD until i lower the speed down to 4.6ghz and even then I get occasional BSOD's. It seems that stability comes with temperature throttles when the cpu chip is under load up until the chip reaches of which ivy bridge is 105 degrees celsius. So my question is what is stopping someone from putting 55 in the frequency that runs on air? will the operating system not handle the bios overclock? Or does a computer crash because of the thermal limits of the chip/chip degradation? Is it the actual physical chip/hardware that determines the limitation? i.e. good chips/bad chips based on production/quality control (costa rica vs malysia ivy chips).
> i'm a novice here so i'm still getting to understand what everyone else is doing. From what i've seen, most people just tweak the cpu voltage (vcore) to either a fixed, offset for high overclocking but leave C states on in order to recapture the energy costs of not having your chip running at 5ghz whenever you power on your computer and surf the internet/, game, edit/handbrake videos, or do cpu folding. But the rest of the settings besides setting the ram timings seem to be left alone in the bios (fan speeds exception). i know that the bios layout/settings are different for every motherboard manufacturer but the core changeable items are still there.
> so i suppose what i'm trying to get at is: is a high overclock dependent on ALL cpu core components? cpu chip, motherboard, memory or also on the peripheral components: video card, power supply, sata connectors, internal memory controllers (though i think that's motherboard related).
> just thinking out loud.


i think so yes..dependent on all components,
the higher the oc, the more important it gets to finetune all settings in the bios,
it didnt stop me using 55 multi, and do some benching on air, but my mobo has a max 1.85V vcore limit,

so i had to disable 2 cores and HT to get the 5.5ghz running, because of the 1.85V limit..

the OS doesnt limit in any way, except if theres already something wrong with it, because of to many bsod etc..
thermal limit is the same for any oc, if it hits max, it will throttle, or shut down cores etc..
the quality of the components used on the mobo can limit your oc's also..

"how does a cpu chip know when it is stable at higher overclock frequencies? "

it doesnt, the owner knows







..lol ...jk


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just unlocked my 670ftw thought i wold share with every 1 1398mhz boost clock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5496681


great score


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> great score


i ran 1 more but its to late to keep goin
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5496830


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i ran 1 more but its to late to keep goin
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5496830


am i reading correct in the other thread, and you got 5.0ghz running?

i did some of those runs too,when i got my 7970,
think my highest was about 10300 something points in 3Dmark ...lol

saved this performance test tho,

not very good, but not bad either i think


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> am i reading correct in the other thread, and you got 5.0ghz running?
> i did some of those runs too,when i got my 7970,
> think my highest was about 10300 something points in 3Dmark ...lol
> saved this performance test tho,
> 
> not very good, but not bad either i think


i had 5 ghz i just cant get it prime 95 stable waiting for my clp and ultra to get here so i can do some more testing i hit 89c in primr 95 for about 6 hours till it crashes


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i had 5 ghz i just cant get it prime 95 stable waiting for my clp and ultra to get here so i can do some more testing i hit 89c in prime 95 for about 6 hours till it crashes


after 6H prime crash, youre almost there i think,
i upped vcore 2 notches when it crashed after about 3-4H prime, and it was all good,
doesnt mean it would work for you of course..lol
at least clp/ultra will help you get the temps down more..


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just unlocked my 670ftw thought i wold share with every 1 1398mhz boost clock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5496681


What's the voltage ?

My card is stable at 1375 mhz core without memory oc at 1.175 V







Very good results


----------



## Gomi

My "old" reference eVGA GTX 670 was a pure beast! - Got a new owner though, hope he is as happy with it as I was









Wish I tried a run with the 3770K at 5Ghz and not just 4.5Ghz - Oh well








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Still trying to break a barrier.
> Currently at 11330 points in 3DMark11 - Though CPU is only at 4.5 - Will squeeze it at the end for those final points.
> (Barrier consists of Windows 8 being a B**** and wanting me to restart after each failed 3DMark11 Benchmark - Getting tired).
> GPU:
> CORE: 1411Mhz
> Memory: 3758/7516Mhz
> REST:
> CPU (I7): 4.5Ghz
> Memory: 2666Mhz
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/4976206


----------



## VonDutch

11330 points in 3DMark11...wow,
thats very high right, i only can compare with mine, didnt do that much testing/tweaking, just hit the go button
it only just got over 10K, about 10300,
i only have 1600mhz memory, think that could be it?


----------



## stickg1

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5497799








This is my 7950/7970 CF-X.

IDK whats up with that though, it says my GPUs have 1GB RAM, says my CPU is at 0 MHz, and I have 0 RAM...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5497799
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my 7950/7970 CF-X.
> 
> IDK whats up with that though, it says my GPUs have 1GB RAM, says my CPU is at 0 MHz, and I have 0 RAM...


stick, wanna sell me that GPU?


----------



## Gomi

Just soldered the last EVBOT-port in - Gave the kid the rest of the bag (They come in a bag of 50) and he is currently using them as "dirt" for his excavator-toy-thingy.

Will toy around with the EVBOT and its settings and come up with with some quad benchies later this week.

And I have the camera standby - Switching waterblock early next week / late this week - Got ahold of the Koolance 380i and a waterblock for the UP7. Will be intresting to see how the CLP been behaving


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5497799
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my 7950/7970 CF-X.
> IDK whats up with that though, it says my GPUs have 1GB RAM, says my CPU is at 0 MHz, and I have 0 RAM...


still, great score....without ram, and 0mhz ....lol









just did a rerun with my daily oc settings

10716 points..


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> stick, wanna sell me that GPU?


I'm gonna try to flash that first bios, if so its fully functional. I don't need it though so I'd take a reasonable offer for it.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> stick, wanna sell me that GPU?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna try to flash that first bios, if so its fully functional. I don't need it though so I'd take a reasonable offer for it.
Click to expand...

Why? What was the problem? I'm debating whether to jump on a 670 for $40 off + a gift card I got from Christmas. If I can find a better deal, then I'll go with that and just push back my WC dream a bit longer.


----------



## BaK2BaK

I would like to check how good is the contact between the CPU IHS and the NH-C14, using a pressure contact film.
I have first to find what pressure range I need, in PSI or kg/cm2 units.

According to Intel, Heatsink static compressive load is:
min = 0 N [0 lbf]
max = 222 N [50 lbf]

http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/design-guides/3rd-gen-core-lga1155-socket-guide.pdf
_Page 36 / Table 5-3_

I am wondering what do mean those 50lbf? Per inch2, cm2, IHS whole surface?
What do you guys think?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why? What was the problem? I'm debating whether to jump on a 670 got $40 off + a gift card I got from Christmas. If I can find a better deal, then I'll go with that and just push back my WC dream a bit longer.


The guy claimed it was broken but when I got it back, one of the two bios on the card wasn't working. Maybe he tried to flash it and failed. Idk, but it works fine now. I'd probably let it go for like $275. Its a Visiontek reference 7970.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> I would like to check how good is the contact between the CPU IHS and the NH-C14, using a pressure contact film.
> I have first to find what pressure range I need, in PSI or kg/cm2 units.
> According to Intel, Heatsink static compressive load is:
> min = 0 N [0 lbf]
> max = 222 N [50 lbf]
> http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/design-guides/3rd-gen-core-lga1155-socket-guide.pdf
> _Page 36 / Table 5-3_
> I am wondering what do mean those 50lbf? Per inch2, cm2, IHS whole surface?
> What do you guys think?


if i read through it, looks like they mean the whole ihs,

Notes:
1. These specifications apply to uniform compressive loading in a direction perpendicular to the IHS top
surface.
2. This is the minimum and maximum static force that can be applied by the heatsink and its retention
solution to maintain the heatsink to IHS interface. This does not imply the Intel reference TIM is validated
to these limits

knowing intel, if they use a per inch or cm2, they would say so, or it would be in Notes...


----------



## derWalter

3770k @ 5ghz @ 1.35 @ 65C° [email protected] (all 4 rambanks are full, so i had to push the vcore by 0.04)
delidded, bare die mount, liquid pro, xspc raystorm 750 rs360 kit


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derWalter*
> 
> 3770k @ 5ghz @ 1.35 @ 65C° [email protected] (all 4 rambanks are full, so i had to push the vcore by 0.04)
> delidded, bare die mount, liquid pro, xspc raystorm 750 rs360 kit


Screenshots please, cpuz validaded with your OCN name. please.


----------



## derWalter

coming, still testing, its work in progress









think i ll end up at 1.36.

i also have to install my raiddisks, which dont work in the hotswap bays 
looks like this right now: http://tinypic.com/r/b652wy/6


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if i read through it, looks like they mean the whole ihs,
> knowing intel, if they use a per inch or cm2, they would say so, or it would be in Notes...


Ok, I trust your Intel knowledge, but no rep+ this time as you didn't do the maths!









According to the Processor Package Drawing on page 124 of the link above, IHS dimensions is:
C1= 32mm
C2= 34mm
So its surface is 1088mm2

Which makes:
222N / 1088mm2 = 0.204 N/mm2 = 29.594 PSI (pounds per square inch)

I think I'm good to go!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Ok, I trust your Intel knowledge, but no rep+ this time as you didn't do the maths!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> According to the Processor Package Drawing on page 124 of the link above, IHS dimensions is:
> C1= 32mm
> C2= 34mm
> So its surface is 1088mm2
> Which makes:
> 222N / 1088mm2 = 0.204 N/mm2 = 29.594 PSI (pounds per square inch)
> I think I'm good to go!


aaaawww no rep...LOL
well, i didnt read through the whole data sheet ..lol
good luck


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just unlocked my 670ftw thought i wold share with every 1 1398mhz boost clock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5496681


Quite the clocker!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> What's the voltage ?
> My card is stable at 1375 mhz core without memory oc at 1.175 V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very good results


Nice...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 11330 points in 3DMark11...wow,
> thats very high right, i only can compare with mine, didnt do that much testing/tweaking, just hit the go button
> it only just got over 10K, about 10300,
> i only have 1600mhz memory, think that could be it?


You need moar cpu clock and a higher oc on the gpu...Over 1200mhz would wipe the floor with the green guys if you run 5ghz and 2133mhz ram with it.
Also don't update 3dm11 once you download it! It gives lower scores, AND use 12.11b driver.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Just soldered the last EVBOT-port in - Gave the kid the rest of the bag (They come in a bag of 50) and he is currently using them as "dirt" for his excavator-toy-thingy.
> Will toy around with the EVBOT and its settings and come up with with some quad benchies later this week.
> And I have the camera standby - Switching waterblock early next week / late this week - Got ahold of the Koolance 380i and a waterblock for the UP7. Will be intresting to see how the CLP been behaving


Awesome man! Can't wait to see some classy action








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> still, great score....without ram, and 0mhz ....lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just did a rerun with my daily oc settings
> 
> 10716 points..


Awesome for daily usage








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Ok, I trust your Intel knowledge, but no rep+ this time as you didn't do the maths!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> According to the Processor Package Drawing on page 124 of the link above, IHS dimensions is:
> C1= 32mm
> C2= 34mm
> So its surface is 1088mm2
> Which makes:
> 222N / 1088mm2 = 0.204 N/mm2 = 29.594 PSI (pounds per square inch)
> I think I'm good to go!


Direct die right?
I wanna see your results...you're gonna use shims around the die too right?


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Direct die right?
> I wanna see your results...you're gonna use shims around the die too right?


I was planning to lap the IHS the best I can, mirror on the outside and maybe inside too if I find a good way to do it.

So no direct die, even though I see more and more people ignoring their IHS on the catch up of that thread... (I am on page 660 so far...)

I'm on air, Noctua NH-C14. Do you still think I should do without IHS? Try to convince me!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need moar cpu clock and a higher oc on the gpu...Over 1200mhz would wipe the floor with the green guys if you run 5ghz and 2133mhz ram with it.
> Also don't update 3dm11 once you download it! It gives lower scores, AND use 12.11b driver.
> Awesome man! Can't wait to see some classy action
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome for daily usage


yea, the 5ghz i can do if needed, saving money for 2600mhz ram








but my 7970 is voltage limited it seems at 1.170V, cant go much higher then 1100/1500,
over the 1000/1375 it runs from factory..grmbl..1150/1500 crashes
running the 12.11b driver of course, cant remember if i updated the program tho..


----------



## Valgaur

Anybody live close to a micro center and be willing to make a cpu run for old Valy? It wont be for a bit.


----------



## zerocraft

So is a safety razor (got a few gillette ones lying around) and credit card for the glue the best toolset for this ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zerocraft*
> 
> So is a safety razor (got a few gillette ones lying around) and credit card for the glue the best toolset for this ?


something like this you mean?

yea, that should do the job..

its what you are comfortable with using, i used a boxcutter when i delidded mine,
worked well for me,


i used fingernails, and a creditcard to remove the glue,
before you proceed, if you havent already, read page 1


----------



## [CyGnus]

VonDutch little bit off topic, but iended up with the 7870 from asus the V2 GHz version and lucky me not voltage locked. Still testing the new toy though but for now 1200/1400 with 1.25v


----------



## zerocraft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> something like this you mean?
> 
> yea, that should do the job..
> its what you are comfortable with using, i used a boxcutter when i delidded mine,
> worked well for me,
> 
> i used fingernails, and a creditcard to remove the glue,
> before you proceed, if you havent already, read page 1


Yeah thats the one I have, though it might prove to be too bendy. I'll try it first and just go with a boxcutter if that fails.

Also do I need anything special to clean the TIM off the die ? I usually go with coffee filters for cleaning heatsink/IHS but not sure if that may scratch the die surface or something


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> VonDutch little bit off topic, but i ended up with the 7870 from asus the V2 GHz version and lucky me not voltage locked. Still testing the new toy though but for now 1200/1400 with 1.25v
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


nice card, gratz








thats some oc already over "stock",
if only i would have known when i bought mine, i would have looked for another 7970,
i was reading reviews etc about it, and they all oced it, so i thought it was ok,
most of them can do 1200/1600, i really like the windforce cooler tho, cant get it over 55C whatever i do..

offtopic?
Delidded Ivy Bridge Club - we OC and OT alot [Official]







..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zerocraft*
> 
> Yeah thats the one I have, though it might prove to be too bendy. I'll try it first and just go with a boxcutter if that fails.
> Also do I need anything special to clean the TIM off the die ? I usually go with coffee filters for cleaning heatsink/IHS but not sure if that may scratch the die surface or something


yea, coffeefilters work well, im using it too, clean with Denatured alcohol or methylated spirits like usual
the die is harder then the heatsink/ihs, the top is made of "glass", no problem there,
you could tape one side of the razorblade, makes it more safe, and it bends less









o, and take your time, dont use to much force, take a break if needed,
took my about 15-20min for the whole process..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zerocraft*
> 
> Yeah thats the one I have, though it might prove to be too bendy. I'll try it first and just go with a boxcutter if that fails.
> Also do I need anything special to clean the TIM off the die ? I usually go with coffee filters for cleaning heatsink/IHS but not sure if that may scratch the die surface or something


You should be good with the filter. Just use some cleaning liquid of 90% alcohol or any other TIM cleaners really. But the filter can do it, just takes more time.


----------



## VonDutch

Echo echo echo echo hey Val









back to the movie,
Django Unchained ( Quentin Tarantino movie) laters peeps


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> What's the voltage ?
> My card is stable at 1375 mhz core without memory oc at 1.175 V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very good results


1.2v


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> What's the voltage ?
> My card is stable at 1375 mhz core without memory oc at 1.175 V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very good results


1.2v i had 1359 before i unlocked my bios i bet u can get 1400mhz if u unlock it


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> I was planning to lap the IHS the best I can, mirror on the outside and maybe inside too if I find a good way to do it.
> So no direct die, even though I see more and more people ignoring their IHS on the catch up of that thread... (I am on page 660 so far...)
> I'm on air, Noctua NH-C14. Do you still think I should do without IHS? Try to convince me!


I thought you were measuring that for direct die, no need for that unless you are water cooling, and even then I wouldn't do it. (unless my ihs were to be TOO concave, I'd rather not lap my batch no.)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Anybody live close to a micro center and be willing to make a cpu run for old Valy? It wont be for a bit.


I got a friend in Richardson, lemme know...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Echo echo echo echo hey Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> back to the movie,
> Django Unchained ( Quentin Tarantino movie) laters peeps


Django as in the awesome guitar player?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 1.2v i had 1359 before i unlocked my bios i bet u can get 1400mhz if u unlock it


Extraordinary cards


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Anybody live close to a micro center and be willing to make a cpu run for old Valy? It wont be for a bit.


There is a bunch on AnAndtech and Hardforum selling for 250$ = 275$


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 1.2v i had 1359 before i unlocked my bios i bet u can get 1400mhz if u unlock it


Yeah i had unlocked it a while it was a beast. no problems with 1410 mhz core with 3dmark2011. i don't know whether it is stable 4-5 hours bf3 or kombustor


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zerocraft*
> 
> Yeah thats the one I have, though it might prove to be too bendy. I'll try it first and just go with a boxcutter if that fails.
> Also do I need anything special to clean the TIM off the die ? I usually go with coffee filters for cleaning heatsink/IHS but not sure if that may scratch the die surface or something


Delidding is all about bending the PCB not the blade







so be careful . after you've done the edges get a thicker blade and try to bend to pcb to reach in easily. i mean if the pcb isn't bent you can't remove the ihs but don't worry it'll be ok as the cpu cooler pressing on it. i delidded 2 chips they were ok but the first one had a stratch on pcb cause the blade was bending too much . on second chip i was more careful and it took one hour to finish. resting, waiting bla bla. better safe that sorry =) i used a thin ( no bend)blade for the edges on second chip. after that i used a thicker blade to bend the pcb and reached easier all around the ihs. good luck with your chip and post the results


----------



## I_shot

Hey VonDutch , you had an instability problem with your chip . is it okay now ?it was vcore and cold boot problem as i remember


----------



## lilchronic

YEA







i just got my coolabs liguid pro and ulter with an extra liguid ultra


----------



## lilchronic

15c hotter ambient temps i always have my window open during winter time in florida


----------



## stickg1

The 7970 has two working BIOSes now. It's fully functional and I want it gone. If anyone has any interest in it PM me. I'm also looking for a cheap browsing laptop for my mother.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The 7970 has two working BIOSes now. It's fully functional and I want it gone. If anyone has any interest in it PM me. I'm also looking for a cheap browsing laptop for my mother.


Did I just see your ad on [H]?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Did I just see your ad on [H]?


Naw I just joined there a few weeks ago but have yet to post. I mostly just browse their for sale threads.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Naw I just joined there a few weeks ago but have yet to post. I mostly just browse their for sale threads.


Ah. An Ad just got posted with a 7970 with dual BIOS' that wanted a laptop in trade


----------



## ivanlabrie

I could use a 7970 lol

But I'd prefer a big wad of cash...Mastercard would prefer that aswell


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I could use a 7970 lol
> But I'd prefer a big wad of cash...Mastercard would prefer that aswell


I would've already bought another 7970 if my motherboard could accomodate it


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> 15c hotter ambient temps i always have my window open during winter time in florida


Our temps are almost exactly the same @ 4.8GHz (which is not surprising as I'm using a H100 as well)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I would've already bought another 7970 if my motherboard could accomodate it










yeah, I know...we're kinda sick lol
Once I clear my credit card debt I'll be getting a custom loop and then a proper monitor.
That should be good for some time for my 24/7 system, after that I'll resell my 670 and grab a 7970 or 8970 (I can get around 700usd for my gpu here lol)

You should start benching man, and I don't mean weight lifting








It's really fun...


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yeah, I know...we're kinda sick lol
> Once I clear my credit card debt I'll be getting a custom loop and then a proper monitor.
> That should be good for some time for my 24/7 system, after that I'll resell my 670 and grab a 7970 or 8970 (I can get around 700usd for my gpu here lol)
> You should start benching man, and I don't mean weight lifting
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's really fun...


I prefer the gym


----------



## stickg1

I cant seem to figure out how to post in the marketplace. Maybe I need to wait a while for the rep to register?


----------



## chronicfx

Swapping my extreme4 for my extreme6 now. See you tomorrow unless I decide to grab the iPad.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Swapping my extreme4 for my extreme6 now. See you tomorrow unless I decide to grab the iPad.


Good luck! I get my extreme6 soon!!! YAY!!!


----------



## chronicfx

About to put in the motherboard and since its larger it needs 3 more standoffs.. They are in my closet where my wife is sleeping with our 3 month old right next to her.... Guess I am done for tonight.


----------



## chronicfx

Well... They aren't actually sleeping in the closet.. But next to it. You get he idea I hope. Murphy's law 101. Was hoping to get my operating system on tonight. Guess not.


----------



## stickg1

Ah, bummer. It happens though. Does your baby usually sleep through the night? Wait until he/she wakes up for nursing and go for those standoffs!


----------



## lilchronic

this sucks i hate my extrem 4 i wont the oc formula.
i cant get 5 ghz stable i dont get it. i dont understand why i take my voltage past 1.420v offset +0.190 0.04 turbo i crash faster than i do @ 1.375v
prime95 is wack


----------



## lilchronic

chronic im think bout skipping 5ghz now since i got pro on the die. max temps 70c at @ 1.420v i need to get off that number and go higher. 5.1


----------



## mystiksinner

I want in



This chip is a terrible overclocker but at least it will be nice and cool while it fails to break 5GHz


----------



## lilchronic

OCN name: lilchronic
CPU: i5 3570k
on die-TIM: Ligud pro
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: not tested yet
OC after delid: 4.8ghz
Temp drops: 25c- 30c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2612731


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> I want in
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This chip is a terrible overclocker but at least it will be nice and cool while it fails to break 5GHz


hey mystiksinner,
gratz on the successful delid








we are a easy going club, but we do have a format required to join









Now for the requirements to join the club are as follows. Post a picture of you delidded chip and write your OCN name on a piece or something of the like. For those already running delidded chips and don't feel like taking them out and re-installing I understand so take a picture that you most likely took when you delidded it and use what every program you'd like to put your name somewhere on the picture.

For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Hey VonDutch , you had an instability problem with your chip . is it okay now ?it was vcore and cold boot problem as i remember


all good,
didnt have a cold boot problem tho, falcon26 has one..
and i thought for a few my chip was gegrading, but after checking with the guys around here,
i think it was just me being para about needing more vcore ..lol
nothing has really changed, it still runs at about the same vcore as before,
maybe the very high oc's need some more juice, 0.005-0.010V
but im talking about 5.2ghz etc
and different circumstances, so could have been that too ..


----------



## mystiksinner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey mystiksinner,
> gratz on the successful delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> we are a easy going club, but we do have a format required to join
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now for the requirements to join the club are as follows. Post a picture of you delidded chip and write your OCN name on a piece or something of the like. For those already running delidded chips and don't feel like taking them out and re-installing I understand so take a picture that you most likely took when you delidded it and use what every program you'd like to put your name somewhere on the picture.
> For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> OCN name:
> CPU:
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!


cool, sorry. can't get a picture of the chip w/ user name right now because it's in my machine. Also, I don't have a max OC yet (still tuning and stressing). I'm currently using pk3 on the die but it looks like the coollaboratories liquid pro is working well so I'm going to run to frozencpu tomorrow to pick some up. I'll resubmit once I have all my ducks in a row. thanks.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> cool, sorry. can't get a picture of the chip w/ user name right now because it's in my machine. Also, I don't have a max OC yet (still tuning and stressing). I'm currently using pk3 on the die but it looks like the coollaboratories liquid pro is working well so I'm going to run to frozencpu tomorrow to pick some up. I'll resubmit once I have all my ducks in a row. thanks.


yea, ultra or pro on the die gives the best results








take some screenies now using pk3, and compare it tommz with the use of liquid pro,
i already was delidded before the club started,
so i used my AS5 and liquid pro screenies to join later on, this,
first one was with AS5, the other with liquid pro...

Defore De-lid


After De-lid


----------



## mystiksinner

This is with the pk3



I'm going to let p95 run over night so i'm sure this is stable. I'll update tomorrow with the liquidpro.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> This is with the pk3
> 
> I'm going to let p95 run over night so i'm sure this is stable. I'll update tomorrow with the liquidpro.


cool thanks








that already looks very nice with the temps








i ended up with 1.420V vcore for 4.8ghz 24H prime stable..


----------



## mystiksinner

I'm excited to see how much more i can drop the temps. I tried direct die but didn't see much of a change in temps. its probably the pk3 holding me back. i'm tempted to try direct die with the liquid pro. I'm just worried about cracking the die. It takes a lot of force to properly socket the cpu without the bracket.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> I'm excited to see how much more i can drop the temps. I tried direct die but didn't see much of a change in temps. its probably the pk3 holding me back. i'm tempted to try direct die with the liquid pro. I'm just worried about cracking the die. It takes a lot of force to properly socket the cpu without the bracket.


like you said, didnt see big difference between direct die, or using the ihs,
same goes for using liquid pro, wont make a big difference using with or without ihs
its safer to use the ihs i think, yea, protects the die too..
well, you saw the diiference with me using AS5 and liquid pro on the die,
you will drop temps more, im almost sure about that









just a Q. for me,
i notice when i look at the "CURRENTLY VIEWING",
some peeps have a black name, if i hover my mouse over it, they show "overclocked".
how can i get that? anyone know ?


----------



## mystiksinner

unfortunately heat isn't my big problem on this chip. I can't seem to get 5GHz even close to stable. I started at 1.465v and inched it all the way to 1.6v and p95 and ibt would both freeze up within a minute or 2. I tried some extra pll voltage and I played with vtt a little bit but there just seems to be wall at 5GHz i cant break through. temps even at 1.6v never got over 90c.


----------



## lilchronic

before delid and it was cold had my window open

MX-4 on die

liguid pro on die ultra on ihs


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> unfortunately heat isn't my big problem on this chip. I can't seem to get 5GHz even close to stable. I started at 1.465v and inched it all the way to 1.6v and p95 and ibt would both freeze up within a minute or 2. I tried some extra pll voltage and I played with vtt a little bit but there just seems to be wall at 5GHz i cant break through. temps even at 1.6v never got over 90c.


after delid, temps arent a real problem anymore,
i can run 5ghz ibt, and not go over 82C with a "simple" aircooler ..lol
dont use 1.6V vcore for longer time tho, for benching(minutes) its no problem
but to try get it stable and have it run longer time...i wouldnt do that,
adjust your oc to 1.5V vcore max, or below..

showertime..lol ..laters peeps









edit,
just had to think of this,

"its not about what _you_ want your chip to do, its about what your chip _can_ do"


----------



## mystiksinner

I'm pretty sure 4.8 will be the magic number for 24/7. I was hoping to 5 for 24/7 but it doesn't look like it's in the cards for this chip. based on earlier tests, I had some success at 4.9 with 1.5v. I plan to keep my current settings so I have a fair comparison when I change out the tim, then maybe i'll take take another shot at 5.


----------



## lilchronic

hopefully i make it through the night


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> hopefully i make it through the night


I hope so. Great voltage on that over clock. Very nice chip.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> I'm pretty sure 4.8 will be the magic number for 24/7. I was hoping to 5 for 24/7 but it doesn't look like it's in the cards for this chip. based on earlier tests, I had some success at 4.9 with 1.5v. I plan to keep my current settings so I have a fair comparison when I change out the tim, then maybe i'll take take another shot at 5.


yea, 4.8ghz is what my chip can run 24/7, i need 1.420V vcore for 24H prime stable,
but im always running offset, 4.8ghz needs 0.160V offset, which i personally dont like..
4.9ghz needs about 1.510V vcore, so no go for that 24/7

my daily oc is 4.7ghz, using 0.035V now(about 1.3V vcore), i changed my LLC to from Turbo(little vdroop) to Extreme(no vdroop) this week,
and my offset went from 0.055 to 0.035V doing so ..runs very well this way


----------



## I_shot

Hey guys , i'll get my 3rd 3570k chip in a week and i'm very excited to see how good the chip and temps improvement after delid. I had two bad oc chips i hope this one is going to be hell of an overclocker


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Hey guys , i'll get my 3rd 3570k chip in a week and i'm very excited to see how good the chip and temps improvement after delid. I had two bad oc chips i hope this one is going to be hell of an overclocker


"Third time's the charm"









i hope its true for you


----------



## zerocraft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Hey guys , i'll get my 3rd 3570k chip in a week and i'm very excited to see how good the chip and temps improvement after delid. I had two bad oc chips i hope this one is going to be hell of an overclocker


Did you sell / rma / keep the first two







?


----------



## lilchronic

well i made it 9 hrs of prime95 1 of the workers stopped working lol so i upped my turbo v a notch and im running it again


----------



## ivanlabrie

You're gonna wreck that Extreme 4 of yours...
Any news with the new board?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You're gonna wreck that Extreme 4 of yours...
> Any news with the new board?


then ill have to get a better 1


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i made it 9 hrs of prime95 1 of the workers stopped working lol so i upped my turbo v a notch and im running it again


If you are just gaming and you made it 9 hours. Just go ahead and use it. It may never give you a problem.


----------



## VonDutch

dont you hate that,
new members coming here to ask about their new ivy,
they just spend alot of money to buy a K version,
in their mind thinking, i have a K version, so i can overclock it,
i thought the same back then, then they oc it, and get stuck on 4.4-4.5ghz because of temps...grmbl..

its just strange, picture you buy a car, a sportscar,. you know its fast ,
so you take it out for a spin, and the thing runs hot after a few miles driving 150mls/ph,
what would you do?..right , you go back to the garage, and tell them something is wrong..

man, if i wouldnt have delidded mine, i still would be stuck at 4.4..4.5ghz at most because of the to high temps,
105C within seconds at 4.5ghz running prime .. if i take the above example, we should have just send it back to intel,
asking for a better, cooler running sportscar...or let them do something about it, like the garage would have, they must help you with the problem,
its a new car after all...

grmbl, just a bit pizzed i guess ..sorry......

really, i hope intel learned from this mistake, thats what it is, and do something about it when they drop
Haswell on to the market, if not ...well.. im gonna warn people NOT to buy Haswell..

ok, im done ..lol ..

is it me, or do the lately ivy's even run worse then the first batches, vcore and tempwise


----------



## stickg1

The latest ivy batches are horrible. I can attest to that. 4.5ghz @ 1.41v


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The latest ivy batches are horrible. I can attest to that. 4.5ghz @ 1.41v


yeah, i think the 3770k is the way to go.... not cuz of HT but cuz they can do more with less volts.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zerocraft*
> 
> Did you sell / rma / keep the first two
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


rma first one
second one bought
third one is the replacement for first one =)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The latest ivy batches are horrible. I can attest to that. 4.5ghz @ 1.41v


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> yeah, i think the 3770k is the way to go.... not cuz of HT but cuz they can do more with less volts.


its a great cpu, dont get me wrong,
but today i feel like i want to throw a brick through the window at intels place ...lol
i mean, they must have know this before they dumped ivy on the market right,
they prolly thought, 98% of all ivy buyers never oc, they run at stock, with the el cheapo cooler we
ship them with ..no problemo, the other 2% die hard ocers ...who cares ...0.5% prolly delid it too...lol..


----------



## c2thew

here's my minidump files for my bsod's 4.6ghz and up. anyone notice any patterns?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> 
> here's my minidump files for my bsod's 4.6ghz and up. anyone notice any patterns?


It looks to me like your vcore is too low. Try raising it


----------



## VonDutch

System Service Exception BSOD. 0x3B
driver related, prolly graphic card..you have a few of them too,
System Service Exception in general,
It appears that each occasion of System Service Exception is caused by something different, depending on the codes relayed.
this was a answer in the microsoft forum,
This is usually a Video Driver issue though it could also be bad memory or even antivirus/antispyware/security
programs. Have you updated your video driver or other major driver about the time this started. Be sure to
look in Windows Updates to see if any drivers were updated there. Have you installed, changed, or uninstalled
any antivirus/antispyware/security programs?"

whea is almost always vcore..

windows,
it shows very good you have problems,
but you have to find the solutions yourselfs ..lol

i like this new toy i found few days ago in windows,
its very easy to see what changed, or what happened on your computer day by day

reliability monitor, check it, just type reliability in start and search box..


----------



## mystiksinner

OCN name: Mystiksinner
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.8 GHz
Temp drops: -14c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2646702



I don't have screenies from before I delidded but this is delidded with pk3 on die and lid



And this is the Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on die and lid



Thats an average drop of 7.5c from the pk3 to the liquid pro. and I dropped 7c when I delidded and went from stock paste to pk3. Thats almost a 14c drop. Looks like intel got really lazy (or cheap) with ivy bridge.

I had a thought. I don't have the stones to do this myself but someone out there might. What if you were to solder the lid to the die. You could try the reverse of the frying pan method that has been used to delid soldered cpu's. Put the lid upside down in a very hot frying pan with some solder on the inside of the lid. Once it starts to melt, place the cpu in the lid. Give it some time for the die to get hot enough to accept the solder, then let it cool. I would be curious to see what the results are.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dont you hate that,
> new members coming here to ask about their new ivy,
> they just spend alot of money to buy a K version,
> in their mind thinking, i have a K version, so i can overclock it,
> i thought the same back then, then they oc it, and get stuck on 4.4-4.5ghz because of temps...grmbl..
> 
> its just strange, picture you buy a car, a sportscar,. you know its fast ,
> so you take it out for a spin, and the thing runs hot after a few miles driving 150mls/ph,
> what would you do?..right , you go back to the garage, and tell them something is wrong..
> 
> man, if i wouldnt have delidded mine, i still would be stuck at 4.4..4.5ghz at most because of the to high temps,
> 105C within seconds at 4.5ghz running prime .. if i take the above example, we should have just send it back to intel,
> asking for a better, cooler running sportscar...or let them do something about it, like the garage would have, they must help you with the problem,
> its a new car after all...
> 
> grmbl, just a bit pizzed i guess ..sorry......
> 
> really, i hope intel learned from this mistake, thats what it is, and do something about it when they drop
> Haswell on to the market, if not ...well.. im gonna warn people NOT to buy Haswell..
> 
> ok, im done ..lol ..
> 
> is it me, or do the lately ivy's even run worse then the first batches, vcore and tempwise


Well, if Haswell is the same, then I'll still get one and delid it!







I actually like delidding and that IB needed to be delidded.









And I happen to think Haswell will be the same and have the same temp issues....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't get a lesser performing chip after a 3770k...even if it has a glued ihs again.


----------



## Swag

Guess what just came in the mail!










Spoiler: Nice


----------



## boogerlad

Can you still use pushpin coolers after you delid the cpu and remove the retention bracket?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boogerlad*
> 
> Can you still use pushpin coolers after you delid the cpu and remove the retention bracket?


Yes, you should still be able to align the holes on those pins. I would recommend washers a lot though. Push pin HSFs put a constant pressure no matter because you can't loosen the screws or anything so this will increase your chance of breaking the die. I also recommend fan grommets for the washers, they are soft and won't damage the mobo and they work equally as good. Just make sure you get a slightly "taller" one to account for the squishyness!


----------



## davwman

How would we go about running direct die?


----------



## mystiksinner

You mean like the stock cooler? No. The surface of the die sits lower than the surface of the lid so it won't make proper contact. Also, without the bracket, You will need extra downward force to properly socket the cpu.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> How would we go about running direct die?


Remove the brackets on the motherboard. Get washers or fan grommets to compensate for the lost height. Put on the HSF like any other one.







Not too hard actually but I will tell you this. The chance of you crushing the die or cracking the die will be very high if you don't properly research what you need and if you aren't patient! This is very important!


----------



## mystiksinner

Direct die is a dangerous process with little gain. I tried it and didn't see much of a benefit (3-4c). When I first tried it, the system wouldn't post. Turns out the cpu needs compression in the socket to make proper contact with the pins. usually the bracket takes care of that but without it, I had to really tighten down my waterblock to properly socket the cpu. It did post and I did some stress tests but I just didn't see enough of a benefit to justify cooling direct die so I put the lid back on.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> Direct die is a dangerous process with little gain. I tried it and didn't see much of a benefit (3-4c). When I first tried it, the system wouldn't post. Turns out the cpu needs compression in the socket to make proper contact with the pins. usually the bracket takes care of that but without it, I had to really tighten down my waterblock to properly socket the cpu. It did post and I did some stress tests but I just didn't see enough of a benefit to justify cooling direct die so I put the lid back on.


Yes, I didn't see too much of a difference in temps for my try as well. I got a 1C difference which is within the 3C error because it may have just been the ambient or some odd thing happening!


----------



## davwman

I'm used to amd delidding with direct die being easy. In any case, I think I'll lap the lid then remove and reapply tim and replace the lid


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> I'm used to amd delidding with direct die being easy. In any case, I think I'll lap the lid then remove and reapply tim and replace the lid


A tip is that if you want to lap, get a P4 lid and lap that instead. It will fit on the Ivy chips without you lapping the original lid!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A tip is that if you want to lap, get a P4 lid and lap that instead. It will fit on the Ivy chips without you lapping the original lid!


But can you clamp it down? I bought the P4 thinking I would do that and it doesn't have the lips on it to clamp down..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A tip is that if you want to lap, get a P4 lid and lap that instead. It will fit on the Ivy chips without you lapping the original lid!
> 
> 
> 
> But can you clamp it down? I bought the P4 thinking I would do that and it doesn't have the lips on it to clamp down..
Click to expand...

Don't need the lips.







Since you have the bracket still on, all you have to do is tighten the HSF on. It won't damage it at all and it's a better way than just losing your warranty over lapping!


----------



## zerocraft

Well it went quite smooth for me







I started with my gilette razer (duct taped one end to prevent bloody outcomes). It cut through that glue like butter ... I slightly cuvred the ends of the blade to prevent scratching, worked into the corners and then slid it into the sides paying attention to the 'die markers' from the OCN guide. It was a lot easier than I expected, took 5 minute to get a general idea of how to do 1 corner, then I did the rest in under a minute each. Lastly, prying it open wasnt working out with the bendy razer so I just used a box cutter to quickly widen the gaps and then pry open the IHS, worked like a charm. All in all took about 20 minutes ... and the result, 20C drop on my hottest core o_o

Haven't tested if I am able to push my current 4.4ghz OC any further, but the temps look promising to support doing so. This chip is a pretty crappy overclocker, but my main reason to do the delid was to keep temps under control during the summer when the ambients would push them 95+ easily at this freq. Ill post my membership stuff once Im done testing higher clocks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> OCN name: Mystiksinner
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.8 GHz
> Temp drops: -14c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2646702
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have screenies from before I delidded but this is delidded with pk3 on die and lid
> 
> 
> 
> And this is the Coollaboratory Liquid Pro on die and lid
> 
> 
> 
> Thats an average drop of 7.5c from the pk3 to the liquid pro. and I dropped 7c when I delidded and went from stock paste to pk3. Thats almost a 14c drop. Looks like intel got really lazy (or cheap) with ivy bridge.
> 
> I had a thought. I don't have the stones to do this myself but someone out there might. What if you were to solder the lid to the die. You could try the reverse of the frying pan method that has been used to delid soldered cpu's. Put the lid upside down in a very hot frying pan with some solder on the inside of the lid. Once it starts to melt, place the cpu in the lid. Give it some time for the die to get hot enough to accept the solder, then let it cool. I would be curious to see what the results are.


Your in! Now slap the Sig no baby!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't need the lips.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since you have the bracket still on, all you have to do is tighten the HSF on. It won't damage it at all and it's a better way than just losing your warranty over lapping!


Thats why I'm not gonna lap my next chip.

Also guys. I somewhat "found" 250 bucks lol so let me know if anybody is near a MC and wants to get an i5 for me and ship it to me. Box included, just incase for Intel lol.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> OCN name: lilchronic
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: Ligud pro
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: not tested yet
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz
> Temp drops: 25c- 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2612731
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


what about me


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> OCN name: lilchronic
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: Ligud pro
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: not tested yet
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz
> Temp drops: 25c- 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2612731
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Now your in!!! lol sorry bout that. my pages got mixed up!









BTW guys! we just hit 50 members!! CONGRATULATIONS TO THE CREW!


----------



## Swag

Goddamn it, a bad seat! Temps rose. Hahaha! Well, I guess I'll wait until I get my mounting kit for my NH-D14 and will do it again then. I don't want to waste the CLP, I accidentally spilled so much! Oh so much!


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, I just wanted to pass this along.

If you guys have Coollaboratory Liquid Pro, use a heat gun and point at it for just a bit and it will be 10x easier to spread.







I got so sick of the temps, I reseated and this worked the best!


----------



## She loved E

If u spill it u can also suck it back into the syringe


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> If u spill it u can also suck it back into the syringe


Let's say it sprayed.







I accidentally slipped and it sprayed around the area. I had such a problem having the CLP leave the tip of the syringe until I heated it a bit!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> OCN name: lilchronic
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: Ligud pro
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: not tested yet
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz
> Temp drops: 25c- 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2612731
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now your in!!! lol sorry bout that. my pages got mixed up!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW guys! we just hit 50 members!! CONGRATULATIONS TO THE CREW!
Click to expand...

Whoo Whoo! Great news *Valgaur*! And I am sure we are not done adding members too!

Keep up all the good support crew to all those who want to try, as we are here to help and we do a very good job at it!

And it is so much easier to delid nowadays then when it was first done, and having a club like this to support others who want to try is part of the reason why.


----------



## Valgaur

Ivan are you the sir that would snag a MC i5 for me?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your in! Now slap the Sig no baby!!!
> Thats why I'm not gonna lap my next chip.
> 
> Also guys. I somewhat "found" 250 bucks lol so let me know if anybody is near a MC and wants to get an i5 for me and ship it to me. Box included, just incase for Intel lol.


Hop over to Hard forum market place there is half a dozen BNIB 3770ks for 250$


----------



## VonDutch

50 members!!


----------



## Gankfest

Planning on doing this at the end of the month and had some questions. Is liquid pro better than Ultra and will lapping the inner/outer IHS along with lapping the NH-D14 give better temps? What about putting a thermal pad around the die on the PCB under the IHS?

specs:

CPU - Intel Core i7-3770K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor
CPU Fan - Noctua NH-D14 65.0 CFM CPU Cooler
MOBO - Asus SABERTOOTH Z77 ATX LGA1155 Motherboard
GPU - EVGA GeForce GTX 680 2GB Video Card
SSD - SAMSUNG 830 Series 2.5" 256GB SATA III MLC
Ram: G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1866

What I already have:

Case: COOLER MASTER HAF 932

PSU: CORSAIR Enthusiast Series CMPSU-850TX 850W

Windows x64 Ultimate


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> Direct die is a dangerous process with little gain. I tried it and didn't see much of a benefit (3-4c). When I first tried it, the system wouldn't post. Turns out the cpu needs compression in the socket to make proper contact with the pins. usually the bracket takes care of that but without it, I had to really tighten down my waterblock to properly socket the cpu. It did post and I did some stress tests but I just didn't see enough of a benefit to justify cooling direct die so I put the lid back on.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yes, I didn't see too much of a difference in temps for my try as well. I got a 1C difference which is within the 3C error because it may have just been the ambient or some odd thing happening!


this









why take the extra risk, for prolly little, or no gain at all..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> Planning on doing this at the end of the month and had some questions. Is liquid pro better than Ultra and will lapping the inner/outer IHS along with lapping the NH-D14 give better temps? What about putting a thermal pad around the die on the PCB under the IHS?
> 
> specs:
> 
> CPU - Intel Core i7-3770K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor
> CPU Fan - Noctua NH-D14 65.0 CFM CPU Cooler
> MOBO - Asus SABERTOOTH Z77 ATX LGA1155 Motherboard
> GPU - EVGA GeForce GTX 680 2GB Video Card
> SSD - SAMSUNG 830 Series 2.5" 256GB SATA III MLC
> Ram: G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1866
> 
> What I already have:
> 
> Case: COOLER MASTER HAF 932
> 
> PSU: CORSAIR Enthusiast Series CMPSU-850TX 850W
> 
> Windows x64 Ultimate


they both give about the same results on the die,
ultra is easier to work with, easier to clean later on..
im Pro all the way tho, 25+C tempdrop..

Lapping doesnt always make a difference, it depends on how concave the ihs is really,
but normally, lapping doesnt give a big tempdrop, if any at all..

the thermal pads idk about, i only saw a review somewhere, and they where like, hard to work with,
worse then the other tims they used for that review, no to little gains over other tim's,
but thats on the ihs, no delidding..personally i would just stick to Pro or Ultra on the die,
its has proven to be the best..at least by us









found that test/review about the liquid pads,
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/thermal-interface-roundup_7.html
scroll down a bit


----------



## Gankfest

Quote:


> Lapping doesnt always make a difference, it depends on how concave the ihs is really,
> but normally, lapping doesnt give a big tempdrop, if any at all..


I guess from what I read lapping is an issue of space, so I guess if using a good HSF and LP along with a sold ISH it wouldn't make a difference; I just thought Id ask because you guys have more knowledge than I do.

I've never took the ISH of a cpu before, but from reading a lot of guides and watching videos it seems a lot easier then what people make it out to be. Figure if I just use a carpenter razor(Razor in the guide) and take my time working the corners first it shouldn't be an issue. I've read/seen people doing it and killing their chips, but how many of them forced their way in and or didn't reaseach how to do it effectively.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> I guess from what I read lapping is an issue of space, so I guess if using a good HSF and LP along with a sold ISH it wouldn't make a difference; I just thought Id ask because you guys have more knowledge than I do.
> 
> I've never took the ISH of a cpu before, but from reading a lot of guides and watching videos it seems a lot easier then what people make it out to be. Figure if I just use a carpenter razor(Razor in the guide) and take my time working the corners first it shouldn't be an issue. I've read/seen people doing it and killing their chips, but how many of them forced their way in and or didn't reaseach how to do it effectively.


issue of space?

this is a example of a concave base plate cooler..


this is after lapping with i think a few strokes with 200/220 or 400 grit


----------



## Notion

lol i have had the same issue with xspc raystorm block.. same as yours... totall bummer.. been through 4 sheets of 2500grit and still not quite there..

good luck with it


----------



## Gankfest

Isn't that good since the middle will concentrate the pressure on the die and get the most contact?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> lol i have had the same issue with xspc raystorm block.. same as yours... totall bummer.. been through 4 sheets of 2500grit and still not quite there..
> good luck with it


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> Isn't that good since the middle will concentrate the pressure on the die and get the most contact?


guess it depends, i didnt lap mine, and have good temps(difference between cores), bet if i would take a good look, it would be a bit concave at least,
i would only look into lapping, if after delid the temp difference between cores is still big, like 12-15C or more..besides if its a bad mount..
lapping to drop the temps more, of what i see here, doesnt make, or very little, difference,
some just like the shiny mirror looks ..lol


----------



## Notion

Well before lapping i am getting 20+ temp increase at 4.8ghz, but this is with liquid pro on the die and ihs.. basically the water pump failed..blasted cheap thing supplied with the XSPC raystorm 240 kit.. 3rd pump now in 3 months.. but yeah i then noticed the darn thing was rounded.. haven't yet put the pump back in.. will be interesting to see the difference in temp though..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Well before lapping i am getting 20+ temp increase at 4.8ghz, but this is with liquid pro on the die and ihs.. basically the water pump failed..blasted cheap thing supplied with the XSPC raystorm 240 kit.. 3rd pump now in 3 months.. but yeah i then noticed the darn thing was rounded.. haven't yet put the pump back in.. will be interesting to see the difference in temp though..


djeez, thats some bad luck then.. 1 broken pump a month..


----------



## Gankfest

Quote:


> guess it depends, i didnt lap mine, and have good temps(difference between cores), bet if i would take a good look, it would be a bit concave at least


I'll test it out first with the delid and then decide if lapping is necessary. Reading this Guide shows that the placement of the IHS is directly on the DIE after delidding, so I figure the spacing can't to far at least for lapping the inside. I figure I need a very thing coat of Liquid Pro just to cover the surface?


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> djeez, thats some bad luck then.. 1 broken pump a month..


yeah sucks big time..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> I'll test it out first with the delid and then decide if lapping is necessary. Reading this Guide shows that the placement of the IHS is directly on the DIE after delidding, so I figure the spacing can't to far at least for lapping the inside. I figure I need a very thing coat of Liquid Pro just to cover the surface?


yep, my avatar is the ihs spinning freely on the die after delid,
took it from the idontcare guide, thought it was very funny,
i tried it myself, but couldnt take a vid..

i used a thin layer on the die, and a thin layer on the inside ihs..worked great for me,
i did the same on the ihs and base plate cooler..all very thin layers..

amazing how little you need, 1Gr in the seringe doesnt look like much,
but so far i did 3 gpu's with it, 2 cpu's, one cpu twice, and still have some left..


----------



## ian209

Delidded my 3770K. Was way easier than I thought. Took me less than 5 minutes.




Now running @ 4.6GHz, 1.25v - Prime 95 temps of 62*C average.
(XPSC Raystorm + MCP350 + EX240 Rad + EX120 Rad + EK-FC7970 Block)


----------



## Gankfest

Quote:


> i used thin a layer on the die, and a thin layer on the inside ihs..worked great for me,
> i did the same on the ihs and base plate cooler..all very thin layers..


Ya, was thinking of doing the same. Any tips that aren't in the guide to not break the chip while deliding. I just want to get all the pointers I can get...








Quote:


> Delidded my 3770K. Was way easier than I thought. Took me less than 5 minutes.


Ya... I think people make it out to be harder then it really is...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> Ya, was thinking of doing the same. Any tips that aren't in the guide to not break the chip while deliding. I just want to get all the pointers I can get...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ya... I think people make it out to be harder then it really is...


nothing comes to mind right now,
i think our page 1 is very complete with tips etc, still work in progress tho,
idontcare's guide is very helpfull too, i think you have it all covered so far,
if you come up with any other Q.'s, just ask them here, theres always one of us around to answer..

about how hard or easy, depends on the person who's delidding i guess,
and on the chip..for me, it was very easy..i used a box cutter to delid mine


----------



## I_shot

Attention new delidders !









if you use liquid pro,ultra or phobya liquid metal on the die or cooler, apply the tim on both sides. this is important . liquid metal isn't sticky like other general tims. applying both surfaces give you better results


----------



## stickg1

I need to order some more PRO or ULTRA, I think I will try Ultra this time. Whats the cheapest place to get it right now? I usually order from FrozenCPU but their shipping prices suck and you basically gotta order a bunch of crap to not get ripped on shipping.

EDIT: I ended up ordering from Sidewinder Computers. Anyone know how fast their Free US Shipping is?


----------



## davwman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I need to order some more PRO or ULTRA, I think I will try Ultra this time. Whats the cheapest place to get it right now? I usually order from FrozenCPU but their shipping prices suck and you basically gotta order a bunch of crap to not get ripped on shipping.


Performance PCs


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ivan are you the sir that would snag a MC i5 for me?


Ccould be, but not me...a friend in Richardson" Tx maybe.
as for the bnib chips Hokies suggested, those still may be cheaper. Just make sure they are in fact bnib and not binning rejects.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ccould be, but not me...a friend in Richardson" Tx maybe.
> as for the bnib chips Hokies suggested, those still may be cheaper. Just make sure they are in fact bnib and not binning rejects.


Some of the binning rejects might be alright though! Not golden for sure but for the price a decent mid-range chip could be okay, at least you're getting a guaranteed decent chip for a good price.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Well, if Haswell is the same, then I'll still get one and delid it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I actually like delidding and that IB needed to be delidded.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I happen to think Haswell will be the same and have the same temp issues....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't get a lesser performing chip after a 3770k...even if it has a glued ihs again.


yea, srry bout that, was just a bit upset yesterday ..lol
took my purple pills today, im feeling ok now


----------



## chronicfx

I
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> It looks to me like your vcore is too low. Try raising it


It says too much porn. (That is what the mini dump file says)


----------



## chronicfx

My extreme6 is installed and priming at 4.9ghz. First big difference from the extreme4 would be that the sleep function seems to work at 4.9ghz. Which is a criteria for me because I hate leaving it on. This alone makes the switch worth it to me. Also getting over 8 points in cinebench with a 3570k for me is sweet also. Priming at 1.38v per CPU-z which even with possible Miss reported vcore should be under Von dutch's 1.45v limit for safe vcore. Max temp from the 8k fft was 72 degrees.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> My extreme6 is installed and priming at 4.9ghz. First big difference from the extreme4 would be that the sleep function seems to work at 4.9ghz. Which is a criteria for me because I hate leaving it on. This alone makes the switch worth it to me. Also getting over 8 points in cinebench with a 3570k for me is sweet also. Priming at 1.38v per CPU-z which even with possible Miss reported vcore should be under *Von dutch's 1.45v limit for safe vcore*. Max temp from the 8k fft was 72 degrees.


lol, thats nice









but im not the only one, i trust sin0822 in this too,

next to it, is Max on air/h2o 1.55V, if you scroll down a bit in his guide,
he talks about "5.3GHz is *my maximum validation* on air:"

using about the max vcore that hes talking about earlier,
we all know theres a difference in running that high vcore 24/7 , or just use it for a validation


----------



## King4x4

I really need to get some CLP.... Think my noctua tim dries up over time... I am getting higher temperatures now









In other news got the Hydra stable on 4.8ghz on 1.4v (4.9ghz requires 1.48v and 5ghz requires 1.56v no thank you... 200mhz for 0.16 volt drop is worth it) and the rams on 2133mhz 10-10-10-28 T1 on 1.65v.

Think I am gonna run with this for the time being.... Until the OC itch hits again and I wanna tinker with it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ccould be, but not me...a friend in Richardson" Tx maybe.
> as for the bnib chips Hokies suggested, those still may be cheaper. Just make sure they are in fact bnib and not binning rejects.


Id prefer to bin the chip myself honestly. Much more fun. And just deciding if I really need the i7 honestly. What you guys think?


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Instead of lapping the IHS somebody has tried to get and already flat piece of copper a little bigger than the die and use it so you dont crush the die in the process (even pressure)?

So looking at this info here
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34287829&postcount=3

We would need a 2-3mm thick copper plate that would be better to lap it if need it on both sides..


----------



## stickg1

I get my new 3570k and extreme 6 today. I'm going to test the new chip out. If it can't do 4.5ghz below 1.3v I will just keep my crappy old chip (needs 1.4v) because it looks like a non-delidded chip is easier to sell. People that aren't in this club seem skeptical on the whole process.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I really need to get some CLP.... Think my noctua tim dries up over time... I am getting higher temperatures now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In other news got the Hydra stable on 4.8ghz on 1.4v (4.9ghz requires 1.48v and 5ghz requires 1.56v no thank you... 200mhz for 0.16 volt drop is worth it) and the rams on 2133mhz 10-10-10-28 T1 on 1.65v.
> 
> Think I am gonna run with this for the time being.... Until the OC itch hits again and I wanna tinker with it


Yes, the normal paste on the die drys up real quick and then there is a degradation in the temps.. meaning, the temps will go up...Think is because the die gets very hot pretty quick and the tim gets puch it out.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Id prefer to bin the chip myself honestly. Much more fun. And just deciding if I really need the i7 honestly. What you guys think?


I would get a 3770k... unless you get a for sure 5ghz 3570k (that's impossible)


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Instead of lapping the IHS somebody has tried to get and already flat piece of copper a little bigger than the die and use it so you dont crush the die in the process (even pressure)?
> 
> So looking at this info here
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34287829&postcount=3
> 
> We would need a 2-3mm thick copper plate that would be better to lap it if need it on both sides..


That would be the same thing as using a direct to die HSF... So thats a no no for me.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> That would be the same thing as using a direct to die HSF... So thats a no no for me.


It is not the same, as your using the copper shim to do even pressure on the die when mounting the block in top... Instead of trying to find a way to lap the inside of the IHS you just lap both sides of the shim ....

No need to remove the cpu socket clamps or nothing.. Place lapped copper shim on top of die with your tim of choice.. Put your block carefully in top of the copper shim and presto...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> yep, my avatar is the ihs spinning freely on the die after delid,
> took it from the idontcare guide, thought it was very funny,
> i tried it myself, but couldnt take a vid..


i did that to but i got 3 rotations with 1 spin lol mine would just keep spinning


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> I would get a 3770k... unless you get a for sure 5ghz 3570k (that's impossible)


not really impossible but u have to be extremely lucky
i think i got it stable now


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> not really impossible but u have to be extremely lucky
> i think i got it stable now but its pretty warm today


----------



## Valgaur

I think ill takes hokies hard link and see what the guy wants for the bnib chip. That means he hasn't used it right??


----------



## VonDutch

And lastly, lapping the H100 and the 2600K would appear to be mildly beneficial,
no more so than to the tune of *reducing loaded temps by ~3°C*.

So all we can conclude about *the results of the lapping are that (1) it sure looks pretty* , and (2) if the H100 factory stock TIM performs close to that of Noctua's NT-H1 then the results from lapping are that we shaved around 3°C off of our LinX temps.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=32293522&postcount=107

i mean, we already have great temps after we delidded our ivy's,
why go through all the trouble lapping, finding new ways to lap the inside ihs,
if it only shaves of another 3C, if any..

would i really benefit running 5.0ghz ibt,

and my hottest core went down from 84C to 81C , and that only during stresstesting..


----------



## captvizcenzo

I'm in! Using PK1 as my TIM, temps only drop around 5C from previous undelidded version.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> 
> 
> I'm in! Using PK1 as my TIM, temps only drop around 5C from previous undelidded version.


coolabs liquid pro/utra is where its at


----------



## Valgaur

UGH.... buy the i5 right now or wait for a chance at the i7.......... I need this chip soon. someone help me out lol. it's stressin me out here.


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> coolabs liquid pro/utra is where its at


Gonna get one of those in near future, school gonna start soon








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> UGH.... buy the i5 right now or wait for a chance at the i7.......... I need this chip soon. someone help me out lol. it's stressin me out here.


Get the i5, and the i7 later


----------



## lilchronic

i just want to thank the delided club for all the info in this thread and this would not be capable if u guys didnt teach me how to do it. its unbelievable my temps would be well in the 100c rannge probably 110c on a day like today its warm here


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Id prefer to bin the chip myself honestly. Much more fun. And just deciding if I really need the i7 honestly. What you guys think?


You NEED the I7, for benching AND folding.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think ill takes hokies hard link and see what the guy wants for the bnib chip. That means he hasn't used it right??


It should be the case...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> UGH.... buy the i5 right now or wait for a chance at the i7.......... I need this chip soon. someone help me out lol. it's stressin me out here.


Get the I7 man...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You NEED the I7, for benching AND folding.
> It should be the case...
> Get the I7 man...


UGH... but I wanna use my comp now......


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> UGH... but I wanna use my comp now......


if i could, i would help you Val ..really..
but where i live , its crazy prizes compared to you guys..

396 U.S. dollars for a 3770K ...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if i could, i would help you Val ..really..
> but where i live , its crazy prizes compared to you guys..
> 
> 396 U.S. dollars for a 3770K ...


me and fenix are makin a deal right now lol.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> me and fenix are makin a deal right now lol.


lol


----------



## chronicfx

Did u get 5 stable lil chronic?


----------



## chronicfx

Asrock extreme6 is chronics hardware recommended! I like this board already.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Asrock extreme6 is chronics hardware recommended! I like this board already.


Great to hear that man!








Post your results...go for 5ghz already


----------



## chronicfx

I am 12 hour stable at 4.9 with the same voltage I was using for 4.8 on the extreme4. Gonna lower 6 notches and prime again


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Great to hear that man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Post your results...go for 5ghz already


Agreed!

Now I just wait for next week to get my new 3770K thanks to Feniks!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool Val








Break a leg, and get 1.25v at 5ghz








Oh, and a usable 2933mhz ratio.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Break a leg, and get 1.25v at 5ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and a usable 2933mhz ratio.


Yeah lol.

I would freak if I got that great of a chip.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Did u get 5 stable lil chronic?


i got a bsod 0x000124 5hrs in,


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am 12 hour stable at 4.9 with the same voltage I was using for 4.8 on the extreme4. Gonna lower 6 notches and prime again


NO WAY! thats it extreme 4 is officially crap lol i need an upgrade


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> NO WAY! thats it extreme 4 is officially crap lol i need an upgrade


lol told ya! all of you








Cheap = Gigabyte
Mid range= Gigabyte perhaps Extreme 6 too







and MVG
High end= Asrock OC Formula, up7 or MVF/MVE


----------



## stickg1

So far it looks like 1.26v for 4.5GHz on the new chip, not awesome but much better than the 1.41v my old one needed...


----------



## chronicfx

Nice. I am priming 1.34v at 4.9 right now with the extreme6. Which would be sweet compared to the 1.42v to get it 12 hour stable on the extreme4. Btw 27.9 prime is out. I am using it now. It is probably a combo of misreporting and lower vcore, but since I don't have a dmm or even know how to use one. I would think that it probably isn't a whole .08 volts lower but I would imagine there is improvement between the two boards enough to warrant the upgrade.


----------



## stickg1

I'm still on the crappy ASUS board. I'm going to wait until Saturday to make the switch. I will have the house to myself for hours, no kids, no wife, and I want to take every fan out and every component and clean everything. It will take some time and I need to be able to spread everything out and not have a 3 year old run off with my $300 GPU or something crazy...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol told ya! all of you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Cheap = Gigabyte*
> Mid range= Gigabyte perhaps Extreme 6 too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and MVG
> High end= Asrock OC Formula, up7 or MVF/MVE


The 130$ UD3H has better Vrms the every Asus board besides the MVF and MVE


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm still on the crappy ASUS board. I'm going to wait until Saturday to make the switch. I will have the house to myself for hours, no kids, no wife, and I want to take every fan out and every component and clean everything. It will take some time and I need to be able to spread everything out and not have a 3 year old run off with my $300 GPU or something crazy...


but everyone knows that a 3 year old + a GPU = super child!







I need to do this as well soon...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm still on the crappy ASUS board. I'm going to wait until Saturday to make the switch. I will have the house to myself for hours, no kids, no wife, and I want to take every fan out and every component and clean everything. It will take some time and I need to be able to spread everything out and not have a 3 year old run off with my $300 GPU or something crazy...


lol, I would never have kids! I'd probably kill them if they touched or killed my stuff







(I'm the only one allowed to do that)


----------



## LukeJoseph

Shoot now I am debating if I should upgrade my board (Extreme 4). I am stable at 4.9 @ 1.4. But I cannot get stable at 5 at all.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Shoot now I am debating if I should upgrade my board (Extreme 4). I am stable at 4.9 @ 1.4. But I cannot get stable at 5 at all.


I think a board upgrade is quite good for that scenario...Can you sell yours?
I'd look into that first.

You already know which boards are good/better than your current one. I'd go at least Extreme 6, or ud3h...


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Agreed!
> 
> Now I just wait for next week to get my new 3770K thanks to Feniks!


no probs buddy








should be able to pick it up tomorrow evening and drop it off at post office on saturday, so by the end of next week you should have it


----------



## chronicfx

I would go for it. I plan to eBay my extreme4 to make up some of the upgrade cost. Since the extreme 4 was $85 in a microcenter bundle I do not think it will be hard to get that back.


----------



## stickg1

I've been running 4.6GHz on 1.32v for a few hours now. I think I can get this chip over 4.8GHz, I will keep this one and sell my old one. I will wait to delid once my CL Ultra shows, up. Yeah I'm going to try Ultra this time.


----------



## chronicfx

Use pro on the die. I got much better results than when I used ultra. I also had better results doing the die and the underside of the heatsink surface with pro.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Use pro on the die. I got much better results than when I used ultra. I also had better results doing the die and the underside of the heatsink surface with pro.


If my temp difference is less than 20C then I will order some pro also. I used pro before, I wanna experience ultra so when I recommend pro to people its not just me saying so because thats what everyone else says.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Shoot now I am debating if I should upgrade my board (Extreme 4). I am stable at 4.9 @ 1.4. But I cannot get stable at 5 at all.


im having the same rpoblem with my extreme 4


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> no probs buddy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> should be able to pick it up tomorrow evening and drop it off at post office on saturday, so by the end of next week you should have it












































































































































































Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> If my temp difference is less than 20C then I will order some pro also. I used pro before, I wanna experience ultra so when I recommend pro to people its not just me saying so because thats what everyone else says.


Thats a great idea!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> If my temp difference is less than 20C then I will order some pro also. I used pro before, I wanna experience ultra so when I recommend pro to people its not just me saying so because thats what everyone else says.


it's good to compare both the CLP vs CLU with hands-on experience. I actually will be ordering CLP at next PPC promo (beginning of Feb) together with a radiator upgrade







... wondering if I could achieve better results with CLP (hoping for lower & more even temps) on the die and Ultra on the IHS (need to re-tim it anyways, now running an old TIM under cooling block, from former CPU LOL!)

I need to improve my water loop temps further (radiator upgrade) ... my darn apartment is uncontrollably overheated and I hate that ... can't wait the Spring (no more heating).


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So far it looks like 1.26v for 4.5GHz on the new chip, not awesome but much better than the 1.41v my old one needed...


If it makes you feel any better I need 1.28V for my 3770K, well that's while using the iGPU. Does anyone know if Ivy overclocks better when not using the iGPU, I have no idea what to expect when I assemble my water cooling loop soon.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Use pro on the die. I got much better results than when I used ultra. I also had better results doing the die and the underside of the heatsink surface with pro.


Got proof?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Got milk?









I prefer Pro myself aswell...Ultra felt harder to apply in my case. I'll save mine for the new 3770k and use IC Diamond for the ihs.


----------



## ByeByeFive

i would love to join this club. one problem is that my chip is in the mobo, i can take a picture of thre ihs though, is this acceptable to join? i can take the cpu out if i really have to but i have it sat just right for my temps and i really would like to save my liquid pro


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Great to hear that man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Post your results...go for 5ghz already
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agreed!
> 
> Now I just wait for next week to get my new 3770K thanks to Feniks!
Click to expand...

This is so cool to hear *Valgaur*! Soon you will be OCing and Benching and folding like before!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Agreed!
> 
> Now I just wait for next week to get my new 3770K thanks to Feniks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no probs buddy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> should be able to pick it up tomorrow evening and drop it off at post office on saturday, so by the end of next week you should have it
Click to expand...

Thanks for helping our captian out with a 3770K *feniks*! We are going to love having him back and showing what his chip can do like no other!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> i would love to join this club. one problem is that my chip is in the mobo, i can take a picture of thre ihs though, is this acceptable to join? i can take the cpu out if i really have to but i have it sat just right for my temps and i really would like to save my liquid pro


Do you have any before and after temps screenshots to show the difference of before and after delidding?

Also some good current runs of IBT at high OC so we can see your present temps on your current cooler?


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Do you have any before and after temps screenshots to show the difference of before and after delidding?
> 
> Also some good current runs of IBT at high OC so we can see your present temps on your current cooler?


i dont have a before delid and after delid temp screenshot but i know what my before temps were.

however, i do have screenshots of stress tests i ran with ibt ranging from 4.9 to 5.2 all ibt stable 100 runs


----------



## ByeByeFive

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346732/3570k-5-2ghz-100ibt-run-stable-max-temp-81c#post_18992393


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Do you have any before and after temps screenshots to show the difference of before and after delidding?
> 
> Also some good current runs of IBT at high OC so we can see your present temps on your current cooler?
> 
> 
> 
> i dont have a before delid and after delid temp screenshot but i know what my before temps were.
> 
> however, i do have screenshots of stress tests i ran with ibt ranging from 4.9 to 5.2 all ibt stable 100 runs
Click to expand...

Post them. Let us know your cooler. System pics are good too. Remember to have your OCN screename in the sreenshoots.

We should be able to tell if your chip is delidded or not by your temps. And then you do not need to pull it all apart to get us a delidded chip pic!









Then whenever you do take it apart in the future you can give us a pic then.


----------



## ByeByeFive

OCN name:byebyefive
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: coollaboratory pro
ihs-TIM: no ihs
Mhz gained: 700mhz
OC after delid:5.2
Temp drops: 23c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346732/3570k-5-2ghz-100ibt-run-stable-max-temp-81c#post_18992393

im using a xspc rasa rx360 with push and pull gentle typhoons ap-15 on distilled water custom loop


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Post them. Let us know your cooler. System pics are good too. Remember to have your OCN screename in the sreenshoots.
> 
> We should be able to tell if your chip is delidded or not by your temps. And then you do not need to pull it all apart to get us a delidded chip pic!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then whenever you do take it apart in the future you can give us a pic then.


also wondering if the cpuz screenshots can be max overclock that can boot into Windows. i put the cpuz for my max stable oc at 5.2


----------



## Swag

Anyone here know if the Thermalright Silver Arrow is smaller than the NH-D14? It looked like the size of each block was smaller, is this true?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> also wondering if the cpuz screenshots can be max overclock that can boot into Windows. i put the cpuz for my max stable oc at 5.2


what do you mean ByeByeFive?
highest oc and be able to boot into windows, and get a validation for cpuz?


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> This is so cool to hear *Valgaur*! Soon you will be OCing and Benching and folding like before!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for helping our captian out with a 3770K *feniks*! We are going to love having him back and showing what his chip can do like no other!


good thing I reserved the chip for him in MC, because they ran out of stock within hours after that LOL! no sweat, he will be getting it! can't promise what the wins in the lottery though! ... so keeping my fingers crossed


----------



## ByeByeFive

*Okay this is my proper submission to my entry into the delidding club! im so excited to join you guys found these pics on my phone*






OCN name:byebyefive
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: coollaboratory pro
ihs-TIM: no ihs
Mhz gained: 700mhz
OC after delid:5.2
Temp drops: 23c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346732/3570k-5-2ghz-100ibt-run-stable-max-temp-81c#post_18992393

im using a xspc rasa rx360 with push and pull gentle typhoons ap-15 on distilled water custom loop


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> good thing I reserved the chip for him in MC, because they ran out of stock within hours after that LOL! no sweat, he will be getting it! can't promise what the wins in the lottery though! ... so keeping my fingers crossed


and he will have you to thank~


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> *Okay this is my proper submission to my entry into the delidding club! im so excited to join you guys found these pics on my phone*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name:byebyefive
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: coollaboratory pro
> ihs-TIM: no ihs
> Mhz gained: 700mhz
> OC after delid:5.2
> Temp drops: 23c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346732/3570k-5-2ghz-100ibt-run-stable-max-temp-81c#post_18992393
> 
> im using a xspc rasa rx360 with push and pull gentle typhoons ap-15 on distilled water custom loop


Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.







Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> *Okay this is my proper submission to my entry into the delidding club! im so excited to join you guys found these pics on my phone*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name:byebyefive
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: coollaboratory pro
> ihs-TIM: no ihs
> Mhz gained: 700mhz
> OC after delid:5.2
> Temp drops: 23c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346732/3570k-5-2ghz-100ibt-run-stable-max-temp-81c#post_18992393
> 
> im using a xspc rasa rx360 with push and pull gentle typhoons ap-15 on distilled water custom loop
> 
> 
> 
> Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?
Click to expand...

If you don't, I will! So make it so Swag!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> *Okay this is my proper submission to my entry into the delidding club! im so excited to join you guys found these pics on my phone*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name:byebyefive
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: coollaboratory pro
> ihs-TIM: no ihs
> Mhz gained: 700mhz
> OC after delid:5.2
> Temp drops: 23c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346732/3570k-5-2ghz-100ibt-run-stable-max-temp-81c#post_18992393
> 
> im using a xspc rasa rx360 with push and pull gentle typhoons ap-15 on distilled water custom loop
> 
> 
> 
> Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you don't, I will! So make it so Swag!
Click to expand...

Okay, I'll do it right now.


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?


Don't blame you. I've been meaning to switch out the tubing and the water in the loop for that matter, I actually haven't had the money or the time to do that but will be doing that soon


----------



## VonDutch

VC, yea..i was appointed a while ago, but you doing a better job then me it seems, go right ahead and update, im re-tired...lol


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?
> 
> 
> 
> Don't blame you. I've been meaning to switch out the tubing and the water in the loop for that matter, I actually haven't had the money or the time to do that but will be doing that soon
Click to expand...

*Swags* is taking care of you, but I wanted to say - Congrats *ByeByeFive*! Great to have us join our crew and we are happy to have you.









Feel free to slap our banner onto your sig!


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Swags* is taking care of you, but I wanted to say - Congrats *ByeByeFive*! Great to have us join our crew and we are happy to have you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Feel free to slap our banner onto your sig!


Thanks guys. Happy to be a part of it!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?
> 
> 
> 
> Don't blame you. I've been meaning to switch out the tubing and the water in the loop for that matter, I actually haven't had the money or the time to do that but will be doing that soon
Click to expand...

Yea, once you have some money for tubing, just get some clear ones and get a colored coolant. If you want to use distilled, then get white tubing. IMHO, I prefer the clear tubing + red coolant. The coolants nowadays have no problems and don't normally cause problems!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> VC, yea..i was appointed a while ago, but you doing a better job then me it seems, go right ahead and update, im re-tired...lol


We were just having a conversation in the spreadsheet.







Just do as much as you can, doesn't really matter if you wait a bit. People got to learn to be patient!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> VC, yea..i was appointed a while ago, but you doing a better job then me it seems, go right ahead and update, im re-tired...lol


Your not retired *VonDutch*! Tired maybe, but not retired! And no one can say we don't have some fast support on this thread!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> If it makes you feel any better I need 1.28V for my 3770K, well that's while using the iGPU. Does anyone know if Ivy overclocks better when not using the iGPU, I have no idea what to expect when I assemble my water cooling loop soon.


I really do think the iGpu would pull a bit moar volts lulz. but seriously it does make sense since it's putting more stress on the chip itself.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> i would love to join this club. one problem is that my chip is in the mobo, i can take a picture of thre ihs though, is this acceptable to join? i can take the cpu out if i really have to but i have it sat just right for my temps and i really would like to save my liquid pro


Nope you are good.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> This is so cool to hear *Valgaur*! Soon you will be OCing and Benching and folding like before!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for helping our captian out with a 3770K *feniks*! We are going to love having him back and showing what his chip can do like no other!


I know I'm so excited for that bad boy!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> i dont have a before delid and after delid temp screenshot but i know what my before temps were.
> 
> however, i do have screenshots of stress tests i ran with ibt ranging from 4.9 to 5.2 all ibt stable 100 runs


That works lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> good thing I reserved the chip for him in MC, because they ran out of stock within hours after that LOL! no sweat, he will be getting it! can't promise what the wins in the lottery though! ... so keeping my fingers crossed


Thank goodness!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> *Okay this is my proper submission to my entry into the delidding club! im so excited to join you guys found these pics on my phone*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name:byebyefive
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: coollaboratory pro
> ihs-TIM: no ihs
> Mhz gained: 700mhz
> OC after delid:5.2
> Temp drops: 23c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2643987
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346732/3570k-5-2ghz-100ibt-run-stable-max-temp-81c#post_18992393
> 
> im using a xspc rasa rx360 with push and pull gentle typhoons ap-15 on distilled water custom loop


Your In!! Now Slap that badarse Sig on that sig line!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?


almost entered it twice right Swag.... lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Looks nice, although I am not a fan of the carbon fiber thing in your case and sleeved tubing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is the VC here or do I have to do this update?
> 
> 
> 
> almost entered it twice right Swag.... lol
Click to expand...

We were having a conversation in the spreadsheet.


----------



## Valgaur

ByeBye with that tubing it actually looks like on the right side of your lower rad the tubing is having that nasty orange coloring problem from tubing so I recommend new tubing or flushing it out and cheacking it to see if its all good. Rather be safe than sorry!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ByeBye with that tubing it actually looks like on the right side of your lower rad the tubing is having that nasty orange coloring problem from tubing so I recommend new tubing or flushing it out and cheacking it to see if its all good. Rather be safe than sorry!


I just realized that, looks pretty bad actually. I would definitely check out to see the problem, did you mix metals or anything? Looks like some oxidation.


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ByeBye with that tubing it actually looks like on the right side of your lower rad the tubing is having that nasty orange coloring problem from tubing so I recommend new tubing or flushing it out and cheacking it to see if its all good. Rather be safe than sorry!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just realized that, looks pretty bad actually. I would definitely check out to see the problem, did you mix metals or anything? Looks like some oxidation.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ByeBye with that tubing it actually looks like on the right side of your lower rad the tubing is having that nasty orange coloring problem from tubing so I recommend new tubing or flushing it out and cheacking it to see if its all good. Rather be safe than sorry!


the problem is i havent replaced the water in it for about 2 years. I havent had problems with temps but i figure that once i replace the tubing and water it will drop the temps further. I definitely need to invest some money pronto. Im just really tight on budget right now. I liked the clear tubing with the red dye idea.
do you guys recommend red coolant water or just get a dye to make it red???
what items do you recommend? and where should i buy it? i buy most of my stuff from frozencpu


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just realized that, looks pretty bad actually. I would definitely check out to see the problem, did you mix metals or anything? Looks like some oxidation.


That's true as well. make sure all the blocks and rads are either copper or nickle plated copper. well technically that shouldn't do anything unless there is air in the system which can sit in rads and some blocks and pumps even. don't want air in there at all. if you do have one open your release value and drop the air pressure inside a bit.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ByeBye with that tubing it actually looks like on the right side of your lower rad the tubing is having that nasty orange coloring problem from tubing so I recommend new tubing or flushing it out and cheacking it to see if its all good. Rather be safe than sorry!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just realized that, looks pretty bad actually. I would definitely check out to see the problem, did you mix metals or anything? Looks like some oxidation.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ByeBye with that tubing it actually looks like on the right side of your lower rad the tubing is having that nasty orange coloring problem from tubing so I recommend new tubing or flushing it out and cheacking it to see if its all good. Rather be safe than sorry!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> the problem is i havent replaced the water in it for about 2 years. I havent had problems with temps but i figure that once i replace the tubing and water it will drop the temps further. I definitely need to invest some money pronto. Im just really tight on budget right now. I liked the clear tubing with the red dye idea.
> do you guys recommend red coolant water or just get a dye to make it red???
> what items do you recommend? and where should i buy it? i buy most of my stuff from frozencpu
Click to expand...

When I did it, I bought red coolant but many people say the Mayhems dye is the best way to go.


----------



## Valgaur

I really want to do a UV green colant and clear tubing now. then I can have my epic res. muhahahaha can't wait for this summer. gonna make this bad boy heavier than it already it lol.


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> When I did it, I bought red coolant but many people say the Mayhems dye is the best way to go.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's true as well. make sure all the blocks and rads are either copper or nickle plated copper. well technically that shouldn't do anything unless there is air in the system which can sit in rads and some blocks and pumps even. don't want air in there at all. if you do have one open your release value and drop the air pressure inside a bit.


yeah i figure its oxidation for having some air inside the tubing, the water in the res looks clean. I have a silver coil in there as well. But either way ill give that Mayhems dye a try. anywhere i can buy some nice tubing for cheap? you guys recommend?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> When I did it, I bought red coolant but many people say the Mayhems dye is the best way to go.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That's true as well. make sure all the blocks and rads are either copper or nickle plated copper. well technically that shouldn't do anything unless there is air in the system which can sit in rads and some blocks and pumps even. don't want air in there at all. if you do have one open your release value and drop the air pressure inside a bit.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> yeah i figure its oxidation for having some air inside the tubing, the water in the res looks clean. I have a silver coil in there as well. But either way ill give that Mayhems dye a try. anywhere i can buy some nice tubing for cheap? you guys recommend?
Click to expand...

Home Depot! Cheapest place and best tubing!


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Home Depot! Cheapest place and best tubing!


any certain kinds of brands i should look out for??


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Home Depot! Cheapest place and best tubing!
> 
> 
> 
> any certain kinds of brands i should look out for??
Click to expand...

I forgot what the others recommended me, they are here right now so they're going to answer soon!









I'll be learning how to pilot a helicopter soon.







I've been wanting to learn and now I can!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Best
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> yeah i figure its oxidation for having some air inside the tubing, the water in the res looks clean. I have a silver coil in there as well. But either way ill give that Mayhems dye a try. anywhere i can buy some nice tubing for cheap? you guys recommend?


Best tubing and price, I'd say sidewinder computers...free shipping and they sell 1.5usd per feet clear duralene tubing.


----------



## VonDutch

4.7ghz, hottest core 63C









its getting colder again outside, about 10C ambient in the hallway now


----------



## VonDutch

another Q.
i was thinking about (maybe) making a thread about stability testing,
programs to use, how to set up etc..

theres so much difference in using prime95 for example,
what is best, some say 10H, others 12H, i think 18H, others say 24H...

so, what is it, and whats the best procedure,
first test, cinebench, look for whea errors
second, 10-20x ibt, max ram
then prime, 12H, 18H and 24H

i think its the combination of tests that make a oc stable,
even playing a cpu intensive game like bf3,
click around in windows, do some browsing on the net etc, even after 24H prime,
a oc can still fail playing a game, or just browse the inet etc

i took this info from anandtech forum,

LinX (Intel burntest) is superior to Prime95 small FFT for determining CPU core logic stability.
Must run with the IBT thread count set equal to the physical core count of the CPU.
HT slows it down and reduces the ability to determine stability. Set to 4 threads on a 2600K.
Set memory to "All".
Stability Criterion: Must pass 5 cycles minimum, passing 20 cycles is preferred (considered gold standard)

Prime95 large FFT is superior to LinX for determining L3$/IMC stability.
Must use large FFT, blend is insufficient. <- reports indicate this is false for AMD stability tests, see post #4
HT is ok for this test.
Stability Criterion: Must pass 2 hours minimum, passing 12 hours is preferred (considered gold standard)

HCI memtest is superior to LinX, Prime (large or small), and memtest86+ for determining memory stability.
Launch one instance per thread supported by CPU (8 instances of HCI memtest for 2600K)
Set each HCI instance to use an appropriate fraction of the memory...16GB on a 2600K means each HCI instance (there will be 8 instances) are to use 2048 MB.
Stability Criterion: Must pass 200% coverage minimum, passing 1000% coverage is preferred (considered gold standard)

OCCT GPU test w/error checking enabled is superior to Kombustor for determining GPU stability. (updated link to OCCT 4.0.0, thanks NoobyDoo!)
Error checking MUST be enabled by the user (check the box), otherwise you are leaving it up to your eyes to detect visual artifacts which renders the test entirely subjective.
Stability Criterion: Must pass 20 minutes minimum, passing 1 hour is preferred (considered gold standard)

you guys think this is ok like it is, or can it be improved?
for prime i would say, 18H is gold..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> any certain kinds of brands i should look out for??


duralene for cheapness.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I forgot what the others recommended me, they are here right now so they're going to answer soon!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be learning how to pilot a helicopter soon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been wanting to learn and now I can!


Your gonna burn about 20K sir. but good luck to you! can't wait to help you with cross country planning and instruments and all!









Fellow pilot myself.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> another Q.
> i was thinking about (maybe) making a thread about stability testing,
> programs to use, how to set up etc..
> 
> theres so much difference in using prime95 for example,
> what is best, some say 10H, others 12H, i think 18H, others say 24H...
> 
> so, what is it, and whats the best procedure,
> first test, cinebench, look for whea errors
> second, 10-20x ibt, max ram
> then prime, 12H, 18H and 24H
> 
> i think its the combination of tests that make a oc stable,
> even playing a cpu intensive game like bf3,
> click around in windows, do some browsing on the net etc, even after 24H prime,
> a oc can still fail playing a game, or just browse the inet etc
> 
> i took this info from anandtech forum,
> 
> LinX (Intel burntest) is superior to Prime95 small FFT for determining CPU core logic stability.
> Must run with the IBT thread count set equal to the physical core count of the CPU.
> HT slows it down and reduces the ability to determine stability. Set to 4 threads on a 2600K.
> Set memory to "All".
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 5 cycles minimum, passing 20 cycles is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> Prime95 large FFT is superior to LinX for determining L3$/IMC stability.
> Must use large FFT, blend is insufficient. <- reports indicate this is false for AMD stability tests, see post #4
> HT is ok for this test.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 2 hours minimum, passing 12 hours is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> HCI memtest is superior to LinX, Prime (large or small), and memtest86+ for determining memory stability.
> Launch one instance per thread supported by CPU (8 instances of HCI memtest for 2600K)
> Set each HCI instance to use an appropriate fraction of the memory...16GB on a 2600K means each HCI instance (there will be 8 instances) are to use 2048 MB.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 200% coverage minimum, passing 1000% coverage is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> OCCT GPU test w/error checking enabled is superior to Kombustor for determining GPU stability. (updated link to OCCT 4.0.0, thanks NoobyDoo!)
> Error checking MUST be enabled by the user (check the box), otherwise you are leaving it up to your eyes to detect visual artifacts which renders the test entirely subjective.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 20 minutes minimum, passing 1 hour is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> you guys think this is ok like it is, or can it be improved?
> for prime i would say, 18H is gold..


I agree to that!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I forgot what the others recommended me, they are here right now so they're going to answer soon!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be learning how to pilot a helicopter soon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been wanting to learn and now I can!
> 
> 
> 
> Your gonna burn about 20K sir. but good luck to you! can't wait to help you with cross country planning and instruments and all!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fellow pilot myself.
Click to expand...

Lol! Well, I don't plan to do it in a year.







I just wanted to learn because it seemed really interesting to me. I still need to learn the basics. I was kept reading up on it but I guess I'll just wait for the first class before I do anything drastic!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! Well, I don't plan to do it in a year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to learn because it seemed really interesting to me. I still need to learn the basics. I was kept reading up on it but I guess I'll just wait for the first class before I do anything drastic!


when looking at headsets if they arent provided get David Clark's unless you need ear protection like me then get Lightspeeds. you'll spend 300+ on just a headset alone


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! Well, I don't plan to do it in a year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just wanted to learn because it seemed really interesting to me. I still need to learn the basics. I was kept reading up on it but I guess I'll just wait for the first class before I do anything drastic!
> 
> 
> 
> when looking at headsets if they arent provided get David Clark's unless you need ear protection like me then get Lightspeeds. you'll spend 300+ on just a headset alone
Click to expand...

Val, quick question. Are you trying to make me poor?

$600 for headsets?!?!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Val, quick question. Are you trying to make me poor?
> 
> $600 for headsets?!?!


Im not I promise. That's how much it costs to protect your ears from the ear splitting engines. Take a look at the bose headset they are over a grand annd I know more than 20 people who have them.

Just giving you a heads up mainly to the costs lol. Not steering or scaring you away but it adds up silly fast.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Val, quick question. Are you trying to make me poor?
> 
> $600 for headsets?!?!
> 
> 
> 
> Im not I promise. That's how much it costs to protect your ears from the ear splitting engines. Take a look at the bose headset they are over a grand annd I know more than 20 people who have them.
> 
> Just giving you a heads up mainly to the costs lol. Not steering or scaring you away but it adds up silly fast.
Click to expand...









Wow, is it worth it to invest in this then? I can just save up and do a whole new PC build with the money...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Got proof?


Yeah it's somewhere in the thread. Good luck


----------



## VonDutch

well, i asked the coollab guys for someone here, where to buy when you live in Canada, got answer..

Dear Mr. ****,

thanks for your mail. At this moment we have no distribution or seller contact in Canada,
*but we are working on it.*

For more information we are gladly at your disposal.

Sincerely yours,

Coollaboratory Support

nice guys,
now im waiting for the next answer to another Q. i asked them
the w/mk from both Ultra and Pro,
if i have that one, we know for sure what it is,
and not only this info,

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

several web sources isnt good enough right








sometimes they say, ultra has a w/mk of 82 ,
some sources are like above, 32 or 38 w/mk

all we know theres a little difference between ultra and pro,
pro's performance is a bit better overall, seems logic if the above w/mk's are correct..

what i did find out myself, is that pure gallium has a w/mk between 29 and 41w/mk
and the content of pro and ultra are a bit different,

Pro, Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous

Ultra, Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous,
*bismuth; suspended in a graphite-copper matrix*


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, i asked the coollab guys for someone here, where to buy when you live in Canada, got answer..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Dear Mr. ****,
> 
> thanks for your mail. At this moment we have no distribution or seller contact in Canada,
> *but we are working on it.*
> 
> For more information we are gladly at your disposal.
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Coollaboratory Support
> 
> nice guys,
> now im waiting for the next answer to another Q. i asked them
> the w/mk from both Ultra and Pro,
> if i have that one, we know for sure what it is,
> and not only this info,
> 
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> 
> several web sources isnt good enough right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sometimes they say, ultra has a w/mk of 82 ,
> some sources are like above, 32 or 38 w/mk
> 
> all we know theres a little difference between ultra and pro,
> pro's performance is a bit better overall, seems logic if the above w/mk's are correct..
> 
> what i did find out myself, is that pure gallium has a w/mk between 29 and 41w/mk
> and the content of pro and ultra are a bit different,
> 
> Pro, Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous
> 
> Ultra, Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous,
> *bismuth; suspended in a graphite-copper matrix*


You can buy Coollaboratory Products via their website store. I have had ordered a few Coollaboratory products through that website for my friend and they all reached him with no problems! Of course, the shipping did cost me 6 Euros, which is slightly more than the US shipping price. All in all, per order with the order being 1 CLP, $16 USD or 11 Euro.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can buy Coollaboratory Products via their website store. I have had ordered a few Coollaboratory products through that website for my friend and they all reached him with no problems! Of course, the shipping did cost me 6 Euros, which is slightly more than the US shipping price. All in all, per order with the order being 1 CLP, $16 USD or 11 Euro.


yea, thats what i tell peeps, if they cant find it in their country,
theres some more options, and it can have a different name in some country's,
cant remember what they where right now tho..
would be cheaper for shipping and arrival time if they had a place to buy it in Canada tho..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can buy Coollaboratory Products via their website store. I have had ordered a few Coollaboratory products through that website for my friend and they all reached him with no problems! Of course, the shipping did cost me 6 Euros, which is slightly more than the US shipping price. All in all, per order with the order being 1 CLP, $16 USD or 11 Euro.
> 
> 
> 
> yea, thats what i tell peeps, if they cant find it in their country,
> theres some more options, and it can have a different name in some country's,
> cant remember what they where right now tho..
> would be cheaper for shipping and arrival time if they had a place to buy it in Canada tho..
Click to expand...

True and I asked him to ask some local PC stores (a bit larger than local) and they told him they can't simply because of the import fees and not too many people want to use the product (or there isn't too much of a demand for it).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> True and I asked him to ask some local PC stores (a bit larger than local) and they told him they can't simply because of the import fees and not too many people want to use the product (or there isn't too much of a demand for it).


yea, same here, i can get it easy in my country, about 6 online stores have it, but its not in stock anywhere,
takes about 6-7 days to arrive at my place if i order it here


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> True and I asked him to ask some local PC stores (a bit larger than local) and they told him they can't simply because of the import fees and not too many people want to use the product (or there isn't too much of a demand for it).
> 
> 
> 
> yea, same here, i can get it easy in my country, about 6 online stores have it, but its not in stock anywhere,
> takes about 6-7 days to arrive at my place if i order it here
Click to expand...

Haha! Pretty nice to live in Europe. Since Coollaboratory is based in Germany, should be fairly quick to ship it and customs would be faster since it isn't overseas!


----------



## chronicfx

This is with the Asrock extreme6. It took 1.42v for this to make it 12 hours on the extreme4.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> 
> 
> This is with the Asrock extreme6. It took 1.42v for this to make it 12 hours on the extreme4.


Hey chronic, how's the extreme4? 1 - 10? How good?

Also, has anyone run their RAM on 1.65 - 1.70 for an extended amount of time?


----------



## Gomi

Sorry for the off-topic - Nearly wanted to firebomb eVGA or simply toss these hydro coppers out of the window. The in and outlet on these cards are so weird and non-standard - Yet again my project is on a standstill because the SLI connecters AGAIN did not fit *Sigh face*.

Ordered a new type - These SHOULD fit *Prays* - You have no idea how depressing it is to look at 3 x Classifieds 680 Hydro Coppers just collecting dust on a shelf and just running a single in the machine.

Rant over.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey chronic, how's the extreme4? 1 - 10? How good?
> 
> Also, has anyone run their RAM on 1.65 - 1.70 for an extended amount of time?


If you aren't pushing past 4.6 I would say its as good as a up7 without Bluetooth a third pcie and wifi


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> another Q.
> i was thinking about (maybe) making a thread about stability testing,
> programs to use, how to set up etc..
> 
> theres so much difference in using prime95 for example,
> what is best, some say 10H, others 12H, i think 18H, others say 24H...
> 
> so, what is it, and whats the best procedure,
> first test, cinebench, look for whea errors
> second, 10-20x ibt, max ram
> then prime, 12H, 18H and 24H
> 
> i think its the combination of tests that make a oc stable,
> even playing a cpu intensive game like bf3,
> click around in windows, do some browsing on the net etc, even after 24H prime,
> a oc can still fail playing a game, or just browse the inet etc
> 
> i took this info from anandtech forum,
> 
> LinX (Intel burntest) is superior to Prime95 small FFT for determining CPU core logic stability.
> Must run with the IBT thread count set equal to the physical core count of the CPU.
> HT slows it down and reduces the ability to determine stability. Set to 4 threads on a 2600K.
> Set memory to "All".
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 5 cycles minimum, passing 20 cycles is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> Prime95 large FFT is superior to LinX for determining L3$/IMC stability.
> Must use large FFT, blend is insufficient. <- reports indicate this is false for AMD stability tests, see post #4
> HT is ok for this test.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 2 hours minimum, passing 12 hours is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> HCI memtest is superior to LinX, Prime (large or small), and memtest86+ for determining memory stability.
> Launch one instance per thread supported by CPU (8 instances of HCI memtest for 2600K)
> Set each HCI instance to use an appropriate fraction of the memory...16GB on a 2600K means each HCI instance (there will be 8 instances) are to use 2048 MB.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 200% coverage minimum, passing 1000% coverage is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> OCCT GPU test w/error checking enabled is superior to Kombustor for determining GPU stability. (updated link to OCCT 4.0.0, thanks NoobyDoo!)
> Error checking MUST be enabled by the user (check the box), otherwise you are leaving it up to your eyes to detect visual artifacts which renders the test entirely subjective.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 20 minutes minimum, passing 1 hour is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> you guys think this is ok like it is, or can it be improved?
> for prime i would say, 18H is gold..


I think 18hs prime is to complete the blend test cycle...Other than that, sounds brilliant!
BTW, links?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey chronic, how's the extreme4? 1 - 10? How good?
> 
> Also, has anyone run their RAM on 1.65 - 1.70 for an extended amount of time?


I have, no problem whatsoever with running 1.65v, 1.7v did degrade my Samsung sticks a whee bit I think...But if the ic can be fed 1.7v the imc won't budge.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If you aren't pushing past 4.6 I would say its as good as a up7 without Bluetooth a third pcie and wifi


Sounds about right, though a bit optimistic


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think 18hs prime is to complete the blend test cycle...Other than that, sounds brilliant!
> BTW, links?


yea, tempted to start a , "Stability Stresstest how too" thread, something like that,
would be my first thread on ocn too ..lol

just thinking about it tho, not sure if its worth the trouble,
but could help alot of people who have questions about how to run, what to run etc...
gathering info in the coming days, then ill decide if i will or not,

was reading this thread on anandtech,
*What do you (in your opinion) consider a stable OC? Discuss.*
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?s=66abd730be59db417e7ef867a18485f6&t=2294928
then i clicked on a idontcare link(second post) and that took me here,
*Overclocking CPU/GPU/Memory Stability Testing Guidelines*
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2195063

i could use the info from there, and some other input from you guys,
i mean, we know what works and what not, when it comes to stability testing,
one would be, what feniks and i prefer,
run Cinebench first with a new oc, and check for Whea errors in eventviewer...

or how would AIDA64 work, it has a system stability test in it,
i had to use it back then because i couldnt run prime and ibt at 4.5ghz.. 105C
i think im not the only one having trouble with high temps undelidded,
but im not sure howlong it would have to run..

running heaven benchmark and prime95 together ?


----------



## Swag

@ivan

Good, I was wondering whether I should OC my ram to 2400 rather than 2133. If it can take 1.65, I'm sure my ram can take 1.60.


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, for my NH-D14, should I still have my rear fan or take it out?


----------



## chronicfx

On your case? Or the hs?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> On your case? Or the hs?


Wondering about the one in my case. Someone mentioned in the NH-D14 thread that the rear fan doesn't lower temps. Of course, I'm guessing this is only because the NH-D14 is huge and basically touches the rear fan grill (socket, forgot the term).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Swag, ditch the rear case fan if you're using three fans or placing them one in the middle and the second one doubling as case exhaust. That setup worked vvery good for my silver arrow. Only thing is you need to ditch the rear exhaust fan grill though...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, is it worth it to invest in this then? I can just save up and do a whole new PC build with the money...


Just ask the airport your thinking of for an estimate to get your liscense I think its around 30 flights but it depends on the standardization rules they are utilizing. Ask for hourly flight costs and see how that feels. For my single engine land liscence it was about 200 dollars an hour and I have over 100 hours. Yeah 20k for just that experience. It took me a little over 50 hours to get my actual liscence but I wanted my instrumen trating for bad weather flying. If you want nmore info just let me know!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> another Q.
> i was thinking about (maybe) making a thread about stability testing,
> programs to use, how to set up etc..
> 
> theres so much difference in using prime95 for example,
> what is best, some say 10H, others 12H, i think 18H, others say 24H...
> 
> so, what is it, and whats the best procedure,
> *first test, cinebench, look for whea errors*
> second, 10-20x ibt, max ram
> then prime, 12H, 18H and 24H
> 
> i think its the combination of tests that make a oc stable,
> even playing a cpu intensive game like bf3,
> click around in windows, do some browsing on the net etc, even after 24H prime,
> a oc can still fail playing a game, or just browse the inet etc
> 
> i took this info from anandtech forum,
> 
> *LinX (Intel burntest) is superior to Prime95 small FFT for determining CPU core logic stability.*
> Must run with the IBT thread count set equal to the physical core count of the CPU.
> HT slows it down and reduces the ability to determine stability. Set to 4 threads on a 2600K.
> Set memory to "All".
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 5 cycles minimum, passing 20 cycles is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> *Prime95 large FFT is superior to LinX for determining L3$/IMC stability.*
> Must use large FFT, blend is insufficient. <- reports indicate this is false for AMD stability tests, see post #4
> HT is ok for this test.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 2 hours minimum, passing 12 hours is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> *HCI memtest is superior to LinX, Prime (large or small), and memtest86+ for determining memory stability.*
> Launch one instance per thread supported by CPU (8 instances of HCI memtest for 2600K)
> Set each HCI instance to use an appropriate fraction of the memory...16GB on a 2600K means each HCI instance (there will be 8 instances) are to use 2048 MB.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 200% coverage minimum, passing 1000% coverage is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> *OCCT GPU test w/error checking enabled is superior to Kombustor for determining GPU stabilit*y. (updated link to OCCT 4.0.0, thanks NoobyDoo!)
> Error checking MUST be enabled by the user (check the box), otherwise you are leaving it up to your eyes to detect visual artifacts which renders the test entirely subjective.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 20 minutes minimum, passing 1 hour is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> you guys think this is ok like it is, or can it be improved?
> for prime i would say, 18H is gold..


I agree with all options listed (I bolded them) and detialed descriptions below. that's just how it works. I used t have a "OC Stability Guide" (written with Q9450 in mind back in the day) in EVGA forums, that could have been summed up to pretty much same guidelines and principles.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just ask the airport your thinking of for an estimate to get your liscense I think its around 30 flights but it depends on the standardization rules they are utilizing. Ask for hourly flight costs and see how that feels. For my single engine land liscence it was about 200 dollars an hour and I have over 100 hours. Yeah 20k for just that experience. It took me a little over 50 hours to get my actual liscence but I wanted my instrumen trating for bad weather flying. If you want nmore info just let me know!


Does spending about 20k in quarters on "Afterburner" at Pizza Hut count?


----------



## lilchronic

i can run cinebench no problems
i run 50 tests if ibt very high
then ran 9hrs of prime95 and when i got up and moved my mouse it crashed


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i can run cinebench no problems
> i run 50 tests if ibt very high
> then ran 9hrs of prime95 and when i got up and moved my mouse it crashed


I have had that happen before, usually if I try to check my event viewer mid run. It sucks not to know if it would have crashed anyways. But unstable is unstable.. Technically you should be able to use the internet and all that while prime95 is running if your are stable.


----------



## chronicfx

Also, you have sooo much temperature and voltage room. Why not just jack the voltage up to 1.38v or 1.4v and try a run just to see if its vcore related?


----------



## stickg1

Ugh, i want to install my extreme 6 tonight but the ol lady wants to go out. Oh well, tomorrow I guess


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have had that happen before, usually if I try to check my event viewer mid run. It sucks not to know if it would have crashed anyways. But unstable is unstable.. Technically you should be able to use the internet and all that while prime95 is running if your are stable.


i was using it for atleast 3 hrs last nigh before i went to bed then woke up this moring prime was still running but as soon as i hit the mouse and it crashed


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Ugh, i want to install my extreme 6 tonight but the ol lady wants to go out. Oh well, tomorrow I guess


New Motherboard installation > Sex.. Maybe thats the married man in me talking?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Also, you have sooo much temperature and voltage room. Why not just jack the voltage up to 1.38v or 1.4v and try a run just to see if its vcore related?


i bsod even quicker with higher volts


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i bsod even quicker with higher volts


Did your bro get the UP7 yet? Cause that will tell you if its your chip or not.


----------



## King4x4

Just ordered Some CoolLaboratory Ultra... lets see how this goes!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Did your bro get the UP7 yet? Cause that will tell you if its your chip or not.


no my brother is still thinken bout getting that because my i5 @ 5 ghz smokes his i7 920 @4.6 lol. and every he knows is moved on to ivy bridge he feels left behind. he just trying to save a lil more money. hes got got shopping carts full at newegg and other stores with the up7 and 3770k and he alway talkin bout that darn UP7. LOL


----------



## King4x4

I would wait for ivy bridge-e


----------



## Hokies83

Why would u wait for a 600$ cpu with slower threads then a 350$ Haswell chip?


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Best
> Best tubing and price, I'd say sidewinder computers...free shipping and they sell 1.5usd per feet clear duralene tubing.


1.5? i got it for .59 cents a foot..

price went up lol should have buy some while on sale i guess.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> And lastly, lapping the H100 and the 2600K would appear to be mildly beneficial,
> no more so than to the tune of *reducing loaded temps by ~3°C*.


Like adding an extra rad to the loop would require more money for the same amount of gains.. 3 to 5c...
So you prefer adding an extra rad or lapping the ihs and cooler..


----------



## Notion

Lol.. just lapped the IHS and gained a good 5+C.. and that is with arctic freeze 13.. lol can't wait to see the difference on the water cooling when D5 arrives!
did think lapping would have such a big effect!


----------



## martinhal

Did some IBT runs last night and results below. Pity we are in the middle of a heat wave 31 ambient at 10 o'clock last night.


----------



## martinhal

eek double post


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, is it worth it to invest in this then? I can just save up and do a whole new PC build with the money...
> 
> 
> 
> Just ask the airport your thinking of for an estimate to get your liscense I think its around 30 flights but it depends on the standardization rules they are utilizing. Ask for hourly flight costs and see how that feels. For my single engine land liscence it was about 200 dollars an hour and I have over 100 hours. Yeah 20k for just that experience. It took me a little over 50 hours to get my actual liscence but I wanted my instrumen trating for bad weather flying. If you want nmore info just let me know!
Click to expand...

Thanks val! I will ask you if I decide to go with it. I'll probably be asking today or when I have a bit more free time.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks val! I will ask you if I decide to go with it. I'll probably be asking today or when I have a bit more free time.


No problem.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks val! I will ask you if I decide to go with it. I'll probably be asking today or when I have a bit more free time.
> 
> 
> 
> No problem.
Click to expand...

Hey val, do you know if the Silver Arrow is smaller than the NH-D14?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Lol.. just lapped the IHS and gained a good 5+C.. and that is with arctic freeze 13.. lol can't wait to see the difference on the water cooling when D5 arrives!
> did think lapping would have such a big effect!


From H100 to Apongee Drive 2 with 1 35mm 240 rad and a 86mm 240 rad my temps dropped 15C


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> New Motherboard installation > Sex.. Maybe thats the married man in me talking?


Lol yeah, being married will do that to you.


----------



## chronicfx

Bought a multimeter today.. Didn't buy the 12v battery. ***


----------



## Gomi

Found myself a pretty good way to check for stability myself (And my system uses).

1. Make a message pop-up at WHEA ID 19 (Mine says NOM NOM!).

2. Make sure OC will pass a Cinebench and do so without any WHEA.

3. Start BOINC - Start number crunching - Make sure no NOM NOM! appears - If they do I just enter Gigabyte TweakLauncher and bump up the Vcore.

My OC is thereby stable for my uses ([email protected] and BOINC) - And its super easy to just bump the Vcore slightly while still on desktop.

No crashes yet


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Like adding an extra rad to the loop would require more money for the same amount of gains.. 3 to 5c...
> So you prefer adding an extra rad or lapping the ihs and cooler..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Lol.. just lapped the IHS and gained a good 5+C.. and that is with arctic freeze 13.. lol can't wait to see the difference on the water cooling when D5 arrives!
> did think lapping would have such a big effect!


"We already have great temps after we delidded our ivy's,
why go through all the trouble lapping, finding new ways to lap the inside ihs,
if it only shaves of another 3C, if any.. "

would i really benefit running 5.0ghz ibt,

and my hottest core went down from 84C to 81C , and that _only during stresstesting_,
the difference is even less if you use your comp normal..

no need to spend money on a extra loop after delid, or the time and effort to lap for little gain, or none
sure sometimes it _seems_ you have a extra tempdrop of 5C like notion,
but ambient could have changed, your mount could have been better then last time,
theres always a.. i think about 3C "error difference in temps too,"
could have been anything that makes the difference in temps after delid,

i dont need more tempdrop after delidding, i need lower vcore,
wish i would have a way to lap that off ...lol

of to bed, kids are here this weekend..


----------



## LukeJoseph

Hey guys, thanks for the responses regarding my Extreme 4 (doing a possible upgrade). It is hard to keep up with this thread! hahaah.

I can actually return my extreme 4 if I do it quick enough (purchased through Amazon during the holiday season, so extended return policy). But is the Extreme 6 that much better?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> Hey guys, thanks for the responses regarding my Extreme 4 (doing a possible upgrade). It is hard to keep up with this thread! hahaah.
> 
> I can actually return my extreme 4 if I do it quick enough (purchased through Amazon during the holiday season, so extended return policy). But is the Extreme 6 that much better?


It depends what you're trying to get out of your chip. Someone said earlier that it is a great board if you have no plans of going past 4.6-4.7GHz. And I would say that's pretty accurate.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey val, do you know if the Silver Arrow is smaller than the NH-D14?


I want to say it's thinner in general depth wise but with height it's either the same or a tiny bit bigger.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> "We already have great temps after we delidded our ivy's,
> why go through all the trouble lapping, finding new ways to lap the inside ihs,
> if it only shaves of another 3C, if any.. "
> 
> would i really benefit running 5.0ghz ibt,
> 
> and my hottest core went down from 84C to 81C , and that _only during stresstesting_,
> the difference is even less if you use your comp normal..
> 
> no need to spend money on a extra loop after delid, or the time and effort to lap for little gain, or none
> sure sometimes it _seems_ you have a extra tempdrop of 5C like notion,
> but ambient could have changed, your mount could have been better then last time,
> theres always a.. i think about 3C "error difference in temps too,"
> could have been anything that makes the difference in temps after delid,
> 
> i dont need more tempdrop after delidding, i need lower vcore,
> wish i would have a way to lap that off ...lol
> 
> of to bed, kids are here this weekend..


Well if you look my previous 4.8Ghz stable (this screen cap just testing my loop)








Dont think i need the IHS lap o block.. that screen is the *cpu volt @ 1.48v*

Just saying what we can do in search for performance...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey val, do you know if the Silver Arrow is smaller than the NH-D14?
> 
> 
> 
> I want to say it's thinner in general depth wise but with height it's either the same or a tiny bit bigger.
Click to expand...

It seemed smaller to me for some odd reason.







I'm actually kind of scared to use the CLP on my D14 because it'll stain the block. After I used the CLP on my IHS, my IHS has looked ugly and shoddy!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It seemed smaller to me for some odd reason.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm actually kind of scared to use the CLP on my D14 because it'll stain the block. After I used the CLP on my IHS, my IHS has looked ugly and shoddy!


Use IC Diamond or Indigo Extreme...IC Diamond is cheap and works really good on the ihs.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It seemed smaller to me for some odd reason.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm actually kind of scared to use the CLP on my D14 because it'll stain the block. After I used the CLP on my IHS, my IHS has looked ugly and shoddy!


Mothers cream my friend...
Oh my it do wonders dont worry.. Ill use that on my knives and samurai swords..


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Use IC Diamond or Indigo Extreme...IC Diamond is cheap and works really good on the ihs.


IC diamond actually can potentially damage the heatsink and IHS it actually scratch and nicks metals


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> IC diamond actually can potentially damage the heatsink and IHS it actually scratch and nicks metals


Naah, I used it and it left absolutely zero scratches on my Silver Arrow's base. It's better than most pastes and relatively cheap...Where I live it was cheaper than AS5


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It seemed smaller to me for some odd reason.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm actually kind of scared to use the CLP on my D14 because it'll stain the block. After I used the CLP on my IHS, my IHS has looked ugly and shoddy!
> 
> 
> 
> Mothers cream my friend...
> Oh my it do wonders dont worry.. Ill use that on my knives and samurai swords..
Click to expand...

Mothers cream? Sorry, it sounded kind of odd to me (like a dirty way). Can you provide a link?


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Mothers cream? Sorry, it sounded kind of odd to me (like a dirty way). Can you provide a link?


Here
http://www.amazon.com/Mothers-05101-Mag-Aluminum-Polish/dp/B0009H519Y/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1357947542&sr=8-6&keywords=mothers
thats what i used on CLUltra

They put it so easy to take out of the IHS on that video.. Bunch of liars...



That **** (pardon the language) is AWESOME!!!!!!
Use it for everything metal related...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Here
> http://www.amazon.com/Mothers-05101-Mag-Aluminum-Polish/dp/B0009H519Y/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1357947542&sr=8-6&keywords=mothers
> 
> That **** (pardon the language) is AWESOME!!!!!!
> Use it for everything metal related...


You sayin you can remove CLP with it?


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You sayin you can remove CLP with it?


Yep... It polish the metal my friend XD
It remove rust that says it all...

Remember any polishing cream would eat very tny (microscopic) quantity of metal in the process.. Dont get scare if you dont see for example your cpu/batch numbers gone...

*Of course it dont gonna make a hole thru the ihs lmao...*


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Mothers cream? Sorry, it sounded kind of odd to me (like a dirty way). Can you provide a link?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here
> http://www.amazon.com/Mothers-05101-Mag-Aluminum-Polish/dp/B0009H519Y/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1357947542&sr=8-6&keywords=mothers
> thats what i used on CLUltra
> 
> They put it so easy to take out of the IHS on that video.. Bunch of liars...
> 
> 
> 
> That **** (pardon the language) is AWESOME!!!!!!
> Use it for everything metal related...
Click to expand...

And it won't take off the IHS markings like the batch number and product info? I have some of that already.







Haha! I use it on my car time to time.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Mines are faint... But i didnt polish it good enough. I left on purpose some cl ultra on the ihs that didnt get out easy for better contact with future tims applications like the pk1 that im using right now..


----------



## Swag

Wait wait wait, what happens if the markings on your IHS goes away? Will Intel still honor the warranty?


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Looks at the topic, Delidded Ivy Bridge Club which requires physical alteration to the cpu which voids your warranty and you are worry about warranty.....

Not this again...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wait wait wait, what happens if the markings on your IHS goes away? Will Intel still honor the warranty?


We gonna get banned xD
And...use another tim on the ihs man, save the pain


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wait wait wait, what happens if the markings on your IHS goes away? Will Intel still honor the warranty?
> 
> 
> 
> We gonna get banned xD
> And...use another tim on the ihs man, save the pain
Click to expand...

No, I was just asking that even on a normal un-delidded CPU, will they honor the warranty if the markings are gone? If they aren't, they should at least find a way to have a different method of verification of the chip.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> No, I was just asking that even on a normal un-delidded CPU, will they honor the warranty if the markings are gone? If they aren't, they should at least find a way to have a different method of verification of the chip.


No, they won't honor it. And they don't have to do it either, you damaged the ihs yourself...It's pretty clear really, use a tim that won't damage the markings if you care for your warranty.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> No, I was just asking that even on a normal un-delidded CPU, will they honor the warranty if the markings are gone? If they aren't, they should at least find a way to have a different method of verification of the chip.
> 
> 
> 
> No, they won't honor it. And they don't have to do it either, you damaged the ihs yourself...It's pretty clear really, use a tim that won't damage the markings if you care for your warranty.
Click to expand...

Aww damn! I've been using the Indigo Xtreme pad so this is my first time using the CLP on my IHS so a question to all the people who are using CLP on your IHS, how are the markings on your IHS after a while? Have they become non-existent?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can buy Coollaboratory Products via their website store. I have had ordered a few Coollaboratory products through that website for my friend and they all reached him with no problems! Of course, the shipping did cost me 6 Euros, which is slightly more than the US shipping price. All in all, per order with the order being 1 CLP, $16 USD or 11 Euro.


Coming into Canada the customs guys like to squeeze some out for inspection, the 1.5CC that started in the tube arrives at 0.5CC, makes it really expensive with shipping & stuff.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey chronic, how's the extreme4? 1 - 10? How good?
> 
> Also, has anyone run their RAM on 1.65 - 1.70 for an extended amount of time?


I haven't run less than 1.65V except when playing with the samsung green stuff. Even tried that at 1.7V.
I do keep under 1.7V for 24/7 though.

This isn't becoming a prime95 stability club is it? So much prime95 chat, I wouldn't run it over an hour if I was paid to...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Aww damn! I've been using the Indigo Xtreme pad so this is my first time using the CLP on my IHS so a question to all the people who are using CLP on your IHS, how are the markings on your IHS after a while? Have they become non-existent?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Coming into Canada the customs guys like to squeeze some out for inspection, the 1.5CC that started in the tube arrives at 0.5CC, makes it really expensive with shipping & stuff.
> I haven't run less than 1.65V except when playing with the samsung green stuff. Even tried that at 1.7V.
> I do keep under 1.7V for 24/7 though.
> 
> This isn't becoming a prime95 stability club is it? So much prime95 chat, I wouldn't run it over an hour if I was paid to...


lol I normally stress test for what I'm gonna do with the rig...but I do think that stability routine suggested is decent for people who'd use the rig for other things than benching.

Dang, I need to get some black sealant for my car's windshield errr cough xD Thing is really expensive locally! Same price of shipping stuff from abroad.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can buy Coollaboratory Products via their website store. I have had ordered a few Coollaboratory products through that website for my friend and they all reached him with no problems! Of course, the shipping did cost me 6 Euros, which is slightly more than the US shipping price. All in all, per order with the order being 1 CLP, $16 USD or 11 Euro.
> 
> 
> 
> Coming into Canada the customs guys like to squeeze some out for inspection, the 1.5CC that started in the tube arrives at 0.5CC, makes it really expensive with shipping & stuff.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey chronic, how's the extreme4? 1 - 10? How good?
> 
> Also, has anyone run their RAM on 1.65 - 1.70 for an extended amount of time?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I haven't run less than 1.65V except when playing with the samsung green stuff. Even tried that at 1.7V.
> I do keep under 1.7V for 24/7 though.
> 
> This isn't becoming a prime95 stability club is it? So much prime95 chat, I wouldn't run it over an hour if I was paid to...
Click to expand...

When I send some more over, I'll ask him to take some pictures of what it looks like after it arrives. I'm not entirely sure whether they check the package all the time or only some of the times. I haven't heard of any complaints from him yet.









What do you use to stress-test? I'm guessing it is AIDA.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> When I send some more over, I'll ask him to take some pictures of what it looks like after it arrives. I'm not entirely sure whether they check the package all the time or only some of the times. I haven't heard of any complaints from him yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you use to stress-test? I'm guessing it is AIDA.


He probably uses Spi32m, and at 6.7ghz too xD


----------



## Swag

Oh yea, I forgot to show you guys and ask something:

Here is how much CLP I put on my die, is it too much or too little?


----------



## chronicfx

Holy shizzz.. I am putting the multimeter back in the box.. returning it and never testing my vcore again.. I made it spark and shut off the computer twice. Thank GOD it still works.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Holy shizzz.. I am putting the multimeter back in the box.. returning it and never testing my vcore again.. I made it spark and shut off the computer twice. Thank GOD it still works.


You shorted the wrong pins...or did it wrong. No need to be afraid, you might as well do some reading on how to do it properly. Might come in handy in the future.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You shorted the wrong pins...or did it wrong. No need to be afraid, you might as well do some reading on how to do it properly. Might come in handy in the future.


I did the ones highlighted by sin in a picture for the extreme4.. Should be the same ones for the extreme6 right? The double row of little ones behind the cpu? I used two of those that were in line and in the middle. They are so asmall and I am kind of crouching in a corner because all my wires are tied up tight and I don't have alot of space.. Made my hands a bit unsteady plus the multimeter was balancing on my knee...


----------



## chronicfx

I did these points

http://www.overclock.net/t/1318629/asrock-z77-extreme4-vcore-voltage-reading-points


----------



## Valgaur

Thanks for trying Feniks!

Yeah MC wouldn't let him grab me my i7..... oh well


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thanks for trying Feniks!
> 
> Yeah MC wouldn't let him grab me my i7..... oh well


Wouldn't have been possible for them to just call them and tell them to give it to him?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I did these points
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1318629/asrock-z77-extreme4-vcore-voltage-reading-points


Odd, I'm no expert, but perhaps you set the multimeter to read something else like ohms or whatnot?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thanks for trying Feniks!
> 
> Yeah MC wouldn't let him grab me my i7..... oh well


You can have my buddy's 3770k, unless he wants one for himself. Or his used 3570k lol

EDIT: Swag has a point! You can do the reservation yourself probably Val, can't you do that online and have someone else pick it up?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Odd, I'm no expert, but perhaps you set the multimeter to read something else like ohms or whatnot?
> You can have my buddy's 3770k, unless he wants one for himself. Or his used 3570k lol
> 
> EDIT: Swag has a point! You can do the reservation yourself probably Val, can't you do that online and have someone else pick it up?


I had it set for 2v on DC. That is in that same thread.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Odd...I'd try powering it on with the thing already touching those. :/
I think I killed my g620 with a short in my case, so I don't think it's a really good idea unless you're experienced with dmm's...As you said, perhaps it's not worth the risk.


----------



## davwman

Delidded the 3570k


----------



## davwman




----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> When I send some more over, I'll ask him to take some pictures of what it looks like after it arrives. I'm not entirely sure whether they check the package all the time or only some of the times. I haven't heard of any complaints from him yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you use to stress-test? I'm guessing it is AIDA.


Generally 10 runs of IBT max memory, 1/2 hour or so & never crashes doing daily stuff.
24h of prime95 is just a little overkill when I hardly ever keep the same settings & HW in the machine for 24 hours at a time. Used to do the prime95 thing a few years ago but didn't take long to discover it was a waste of time.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> When I send some more over, I'll ask him to take some pictures of what it looks like after it arrives. I'm not entirely sure whether they check the package all the time or only some of the times. I haven't heard of any complaints from him yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you use to stress-test? I'm guessing it is AIDA.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Generally 10 runs of IBT max memory, 1/2 hour or so & never crashes doing daily stuff.
> 24h of prime95 is just a little overkill when I hardly ever keep the same settings & HW in the machine for 24 hours at a time. Used to do the prime95 thing a few years ago but didn't take long to discover it was a waste of time.
Click to expand...

Lol, I can't stand knowing I went cheap on the stress-test but that's me!

BTW, how is this application? Seems like everyone ignored it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Generally 10 runs of IBT max memory, 1/2 hour or so & never crashes doing daily stuff.
> 24h of *prime95 is just a little overkill when I hardly ever keep the same settings & HW in the machine for 24 hours at a time*. Used to do the prime95 thing a few years ago but didn't take long to discover it was a waste of time.


QFT!








Ah, benchers...
One thing we'd need to stress test is our clear cmos button to see if it resists being pressed 30 times a day xD


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, I can't stand knowing I went cheap on the stress-test but that's me!
> 
> BTW, how is this application? Seems like everyone ignored it.


Looks good man, put some on the ihs' inside too...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, I can't stand knowing I went cheap on the stress-test but that's me!
> 
> BTW, how is this application? Seems like everyone ignored it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks good man, put some on the ihs' inside too...
Click to expand...

Ok, I just wanted to make sure, is it better to have some on the IHS too? I was wondering because my temps actually got worse after I re-seated.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Odd, I'm no expert, but perhaps you set the multimeter to read something else like ohms or whatnot?
> You can have my buddy's 3770k, unless he wants one for himself. Or his used 3570k lol
> 
> EDIT: Swag has a point! You can do the reservation yourself probably Val, can't you do that online and have someone else pick it up?


I'll do that I'll look it up quick and be back with notes!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, I can't stand knowing I went cheap on the stress-test but that's me!
> 
> BTW, how is this application? Seems like everyone ignored it.


It looks good from what I can see but the only way to know is to test it really.


----------



## chronicfx

It didn't take me long to get back on the horse.. Just like the first time I chickened out sticking the razor blade into my processor and ended up putting my computer back together only to retry succesfully a week later.

OK so here goes.. On the Asrock extreme6 motherboard, LLC set to 2 (second highest), turbo set to +0.004v (lowest setting), using fixed voltage values in bios, and measuring load voltage using a digital multimeter during prime95 ver.27.9 small ffts (12k)

Multiplier Used Bios setting CPU-Z 1.62 x64 Digital Multi-meter
____________ __________ ______________ _________________
36 1.100v 1.080v 1.117v
36 1.150v 1.128v 1.168v
36 1.200v 1.176v 1.220v
36 1.250v 1.224v 1.270v
36 1.300v 1.272v 1.322v
36 1.350v 1.320v 1.373v
36 1.400v 1.376v 1.426v
36 1.450v 1.416v 1.478v
49 1.450v 1.416v 1.488v
49 1.500v 1.464v 1.540v
49 offset= -0.010v ; turbo= +0.207v 1.368v 1.438v

You guys are welcome to take from this what you will. But it seems that the BIOS setting is more closely matched to what is going on than the CPU-z reading. Also when turbo offset is used the gap between CPU-z and the DMM seems increase.


----------



## chronicfx

Didn't format right but first column is multi, second is bios, third is CPU-z, and fourth is the DMM


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Didn't format right but first column is multi, second is bios, third is CPU-z, and fourth is the DMM


Ouch! quite a big difference...and interesting how turbo works. Really odd.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> QFT!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ah, benchers...
> One thing we'd need to stress test is our clear cmos button to see if it resists being pressed 30 times a day xD


I've been testing mine on the ud3h a lot lately, working too well. I really wish it was just a bit farther away from the reset button, I'm hitting the clear cmos by accident about half the time.

My best cpus never even get IBT, my 2600k has still never seen a 60° load temp. Good HW is for benching, if it is gonna degrade, it will be from vcore, not extended loading (wprime 1024m is the stress test for them).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've been testing mine on the ud3h a lot lately, working too well. I really wish it was just a bit farther away from the reset button, I'm hitting the clear cmos by accident about half the time.
> 
> My best cpus never even get IBT, my 2600k has still never seen a 60° load temp. Good HW is for benching, if it is gonna degrade, it will be from vcore, not extended loading (wprime 1024m is the stress test for them).


Ah, 1024m wprime...yeah, you're right. That sucker was slow on my G620 lol


----------



## Gankfest

I was changing my setup and going with water cooling instead of air cooling. Since I won't be putting the sealant back on the chip after delid their will be a smaller gap between the IHS and the DIE. Is this going to be a problem with pressure from the CPU water block after tightening the bolts? I don't want to shatter the die!









Using a Asus Maximus Formula V and a XSPC EX360 kit with a Raystorm CPU block.

Thanx!


----------



## FtW 420

As long as the IHS is there it should be OK, it'll help distribute the pressure on the die. Don't think I've heard of a delidder crushing the die here yet.


----------



## Gankfest

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> As long as the IHS is there it should be OK, it'll help distribute the pressure on the die. Don't think I've heard of a delidder crushing the die here yet.


I haven't either, besides when they do direct DIE contact... I just wanted to make sure. Thanx!


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It depends what you're trying to get out of your chip. Someone said earlier that it is a great board if you have no plans of going past 4.6-4.7GHz. And I would say that's pretty accurate.


I haven't had any experience with the latter but my experience with then extreme 4 has been nothing short of fantastic. Able to overclock stable 5.2GHz


----------



## stickg1

I sold the old chip for $150 here on OCN. The buyer wants me to tack the IHS down for him so it doesn't move in shipping or installation. A dab of the black silicon adhesive in each corner should do the trick right?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I sold the old chip for $150 here on OCN. The buyer wants me to tack the IHS down for him so it doesn't move in shipping or installation. A dab of the black silicon adhesive in each corner should do the trick right?


Yeah I used a toothpick for mine. made it much easier to spread it out.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I sold the old chip for $150 here on OCN. The buyer wants me to tack the IHS down for him so it doesn't move in shipping or installation. A dab of the black silicon adhesive in each corner should do the trick right?


150$ cause it is a bad clocker?

i5 2500ks go for 150$

3570ks go for 160$ + de lidded should take in 180$ easy unless u got less because u said how bad it clocks lol...

Heck i would have gave u 150$ for a 4.5ghz 3570k lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I sold the old chip for $150 here on OCN. The buyer wants me to tack the IHS down for him so it doesn't move in shipping or installation. A dab of the black silicon adhesive in each corner should do the trick right?
> 
> 
> 
> 150$ cause it is a bad clocker?
> 
> i5 2500ks go for 150$
> 
> 3570ks go for 160$ + de lidded should take in 180$ easy unless u got less because u said how bad it clocks lol...
> 
> Heck i would have gave u 150$ for a 4.5ghz 3570k lol.
Click to expand...

I am inclined to agree with you. A delidded Ivy Bridge that works should rake in evenly with the cost. I mean, lower temps and it clocks just as good as any other chip? This is OCN for a reason!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I am inclined to agree with you. A delidded Ivy Bridge that works should rake in evenly with the cost. I mean, lower temps and it clocks just as good as any other chip? This is OCN for a reason!


OCN Market place mods will not allow u to profit from any sales.. you can only lose money in the OCN market place now.

So u will find no binned chips on OCN for sale u have to go to other forums..

Also i bet any 3570k / 3770k they will close ur thread and make u provide proof of how much u paid for it... " happened to a Nexus 7 i was selling"

That is why u do not see any of those MicroCenter 3570ks / 3770ks for sale here and so many else where.. if u paid 229$ rules say u would have to sale it for 228$ which i find rather stupid..

Nobody here is gonna frown at a 250$ shipped BNIB 3770k.. it is a blessing that OCN members who do not use other forums are missing out on.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I am inclined to agree with you. A delidded Ivy Bridge that works should rake in evenly with the cost. I mean, lower temps and it clocks just as good as any other chip? This is OCN for a reason!
> 
> 
> 
> OCN Market place mods will not allow u to profit from any sales.. you can only lose money in the OCN market place now.
> 
> So u will find no binned chips on OCN for sale u have to go to other forums..
> 
> Also i bet any 3570k / 3770k they will close ur thread and make u provide proof of how much u paid for it... " happened to a Nexus 7 i was selling"
> 
> That is why u do not see any of those MicroCenter 3570ks / 3770ks for sale here and so many else where.. if u paid 229$ rules say u would have to sale it for 228$ which i find rather stupid..
> 
> Nobody here is gonna frown at a 250$ shipped BNIB 3770k.. it is a blessing that OCN members who do not use other forums are missing out on.
Click to expand...

Wow, that does sound dumb! I mean, why even make the OCN Market have that type of aura. I like the OCN Forums best and it beats all the other forums, but I guess it may change if all these changes and rules keep coming.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wow, that does sound dumb! I mean, why even make the OCN Market have that type of aura. I like the OCN Forums best and it beats all the other forums, but I guess it may change if all these changes and rules keep coming.


The people make OCN great not the staff. But i will say there are 5 great staff members on OCN that i talk to alot via PM those guys are a class act.

Then are some that just run people off.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wow, that does sound dumb! I mean, why even make the OCN Market have that type of aura. I like the OCN Forums best and it beats all the other forums, but I guess it may change if all these changes and rules keep coming.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The people make OCN great not the staff. But i will say there are 5 great staff members on OCN that i talk to alot via PM those guys are a class act.
> 
> Then are some that just run people off.
Click to expand...

Lol, yea, I PM a few mods/staff members.







I think they don't let the power get in their head and things.


----------



## FtW 420

Binning isn't cheap & already losing money on the ones that weren't good enough along the way, the great one should get a premium since someone usually ends up paying more for one than retail, even if the cpu itself was retail price.

When you buy a binned chip for $xxx, you can't just turn around & sell it on OCN for what you paid + more money, but you should be able to sell it for around the same or a bit less than what you paid (which may still be more than retail cost). Pretty sure you just can't profit out of the marketplace.

Not sure how delidded chips work for resale, I would think somewhere around typical used price, maybe a few bucks more since the risky part is done for someone who wants a delidded chip & doesn't want to take the risk himself.


----------



## VonDutch

Great news guys, a final answer about Liquid Ultra's W/mk from coollabs,

Dear Mr. ****,

thanks for your mail. *The heat conduction value for Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is 38,4 W/mk*.

For more information we are gladly at your disposal.

Sincerely yours,

Coollaboratory Support

that would mean the little list i/we use isnt that far off too,

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
*LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)*
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

so i can take out the 32W/mk and use the 38W/mk from now on,
and change "several web sources" to "Coollaboratory says so"...lol









LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
*LM Ultra = 38w/mK (Coollaboratory Info)*
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
everything else is less

or should it say, (Coollaboratory Helpdesk)?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> I haven't either, besides when they do direct DIE contact... I just wanted to make sure. Thanx!


Hey, man! You settled on the raystorm ex kit? Didn't like the h220 that much eh?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Great news guys, a final answer about Liquid Ultra's W/mk from coollabs,
> 
> Dear Mr. ****,
> 
> thanks for your mail. *The heat conduction value for Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is 38,4 W/mk*.
> 
> For more information we are gladly at your disposal.
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Coollaboratory Support
> 
> that would mean the little list i/we use isnt that far off too,
> 
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> *LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)*
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> 
> so i can take out the 32W/mk and use the 38W/mk from now on,
> and change "several web sources" to "Coollaboratory says so"...lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> *LM Ultra = 38w/mK (Coollaboratory Info)*
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> 
> or should it say, (Coollaboratory Helpdesk)?


And Pro!!!???


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> And Pro!!!???


like before, 82w/mk
thats the number we see everywhere,
but some sources i saw said ultra has 82w/mk also,
leads me to believe that at one point the w/mk doesnt matter much anymore used on the die,
not like pro has more then double the w/mk, but doesnt double the tempdrop..
we know theres little to nothing difference between Pro and Ultra,
pure performance wise Pro will win, but not with alot degrees..

well, if you really dont trust it,
the pro 82w/mk is used all around for years now(HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup),
i will contact them again and ask the w/mk Pro has ...lol


----------



## King4x4

Ultra seems much easier to use no?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Ultra seems much easier to use no?


yep, but i havent used it myself yet, so cant say from personal experience,
i will buy some next time, and use it,
i thought ivan said somewhere he had more trouble using ultra then pro,
ultra is easier to clean later on..thats about it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Ultra seems much easier to use no?
> 
> 
> 
> yep, but i havent used it myself yet, so cant say from personal experience,
> i will buy some next time, and use it,
> i thought ivan said somewhere he had more trouble using ultra then pro,
> ultra is easier to clean later on..thats about it
Click to expand...

Ultra behaves more like normal TIM so that's why it's easier to spread.







Imagine trying to spread water evenly across a surface vs doing the same with syrup. Syrup would be easier because it has higher viscosity.


----------



## King4x4

Ordered mine and lets see how it goes when it arrives.

Going for CLU on the die and Noraml Noctua TIM on the IHS... or do you think I just should go for ultra on both?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ultra behaves more like normal TIM so that's why it's easier to spread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Imagine trying to spread water evenly across a surface vs doing the same with syrup. Syrup would be easier because it has higher viscosity.


haha..
i dont think Pro and Ultra have a water and syrup difference to apply, you say its like night and day ...lol








from what i see, they look and apply about the same way...but i only know the online coollab vids from both,
will know better when i ordered and used it myself next time.. my Pro is under the hood for several months now,
so im getting curious about taking it apart and see how good/bad i can clean Pro..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Ordered mine and lets see how it goes when it arrives.
> 
> Going for CLU on the die and Noraml Noctua TIM on the IHS... or do you think I just should go for ultra on both?


Both, cant go wrong with that, but any good tim will do when used on the ihs,
ultra/pro needs to be used on the die for the big tempdrop,
the difference when used on the IHS is like with every other tim, most are just a few degrees apart, like online tests show


----------



## lilchronic

i used pro on die and under ihs then ultra on top ihs. i think thr pro was a lil bit easier to spread


----------



## alancsalt

None of you noticed this?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd run the chip stock and try OC it to see how good are your temp and OC before deciding to delid it, as one you do that you void the warranty and if your chip is a dud that would be a hudge waste.
> 
> 
> 
> Negative...
> 
> Every forum I go to someone has to give me their crap about why I shouldn't delid... I don't care to hear it, I don't want to try something else. It will be something I do right out of the box making sure the CPU is working to the best of my knowledge. Which btw is question number 4 for that very purpose. If you can't answer the questions or give some tips, personal info/experience, etc... about delid and lapping then don't post.
> 
> Being pro is all about taking risks... I wouldn't be where I'm at in life without the risks I chose to take!
> 
> Thanx!
Click to expand...

That's earlier. Right now, hiz talking radiators...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i used pro on die and under ihs then ultra on top ihs. i think thr pro was a lil bit easier to spread


maybe a tip,
put the seringe in 30-40C water for a while?
gallium "melts" at body temp...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Kinda like IC Diamond...The instructions say you should heat the syringe in boiling water first.

I saw GFest at OCF a while ago talking wc, hence the salute. Never noticed that post (?)


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> another Q.
> i was thinking about (maybe) making a thread about stability testing,
> programs to use, how to set up etc..
> 
> theres so much difference in using prime95 for example,
> what is best, some say 10H, others 12H, i think 18H, others say 24H...
> 
> so, what is it, and whats the best procedure,
> first test, cinebench, look for whea errors
> second, 10-20x ibt, max ram
> then prime, 12H, 18H and 24H
> 
> i think its the combination of tests that make a oc stable,
> even playing a cpu intensive game like bf3,
> click around in windows, do some browsing on the net etc, even after 24H prime,
> a oc can still fail playing a game, or just browse the inet etc
> 
> i took this info from anandtech forum,
> 
> LinX (Intel burntest) is superior to Prime95 small FFT for determining CPU core logic stability.
> Must run with the IBT thread count set equal to the physical core count of the CPU.
> HT slows it down and reduces the ability to determine stability. Set to 4 threads on a 2600K.
> Set memory to "All".
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 5 cycles minimum, passing 20 cycles is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> Prime95 large FFT is superior to LinX for determining L3$/IMC stability.
> Must use large FFT, blend is insufficient. <- reports indicate this is false for AMD stability tests, see post #4
> HT is ok for this test.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 2 hours minimum, passing 12 hours is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> HCI memtest is superior to LinX, Prime (large or small), and memtest86+ for determining memory stability.
> Launch one instance per thread supported by CPU (8 instances of HCI memtest for 2600K)
> Set each HCI instance to use an appropriate fraction of the memory...16GB on a 2600K means each HCI instance (there will be 8 instances) are to use 2048 MB.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 200% coverage minimum, passing 1000% coverage is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> OCCT GPU test w/error checking enabled is superior to Kombustor for determining GPU stability. (updated link to OCCT 4.0.0, thanks NoobyDoo!)
> Error checking MUST be enabled by the user (check the box), otherwise you are leaving it up to your eyes to detect visual artifacts which renders the test entirely subjective.
> Stability Criterion: Must pass 20 minutes minimum, passing 1 hour is preferred (considered gold standard)
> 
> you guys think this is ok like it is, or can it be improved?
> for prime i would say, 18H is gold..


I'm for it *VonDutch*! I'd think it would be a great thread with you running it, and I bet it would be useful to those wishing to learn about stability issues.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think 18hs prime is to complete the blend test cycle...Other than that, sounds brilliant!
> BTW, links?
> 
> 
> 
> yea, tempted to start a , "Stability Stresstest how too" thread, something like that,
> would be my first thread on ocn too ..lol
> 
> just thinking about it tho, not sure if its worth the trouble,
> but could help alot of people who have questions about how to run, what to run etc...
> gathering info in the coming days, then ill decide if i will or not,
> 
> was reading this thread on anandtech,
> *What do you (in your opinion) consider a stable OC? Discuss.*
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?s=66abd730be59db417e7ef867a18485f6&t=2294928
> then i clicked on a idontcare link(second post) and that took me here,
> *Overclocking CPU/GPU/Memory Stability Testing Guidelines*
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2195063
> 
> i could use the info from there, and some other input from you guys,
> i mean, we know what works and what not, when it comes to stability testing,
> one would be, what feniks and i prefer,
> run Cinebench first with a new oc, and check for Whea errors in eventviewer...
> 
> or how would AIDA64 work, it has a system stability test in it,
> i had to use it back then because i couldnt run prime and ibt at 4.5ghz.. 105C
> i think im not the only one having trouble with high temps undelidded,
> but im not sure howlong it would have to run..
> 
> running heaven benchmark and prime95 together ?
Click to expand...

And you already have some stuff to put in the initial thread post!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Great news guys, a final answer about Liquid Ultra's W/mk from coollabs,
> 
> Dear Mr. ****,
> 
> thanks for your mail. *The heat conduction value for Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is 38,4 W/mk*.
> 
> For more information we are gladly at your disposal.
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Coollaboratory Support
> 
> that would mean the little list i/we use isnt that far off too,
> 
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> *LM Ultra = 32 or 38w/mK (several web sources)*
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> 
> so i can take out the 32W/mk and use the 38W/mk from now on,
> and change "several web sources" to "Coollaboratory says so"...lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> *LM Ultra = 38w/mK (Coollaboratory Info)*
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m -c (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> 
> or should it say, (Coollaboratory Helpdesk)?


Good to have that as a known quantity *VonDutch*! Good work.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Kinda like IC Diamond...The instructions say you should heat the syringe in boiling water first.
> 
> I saw GFest at OCF a while ago talking wc, hence the salute. Never noticed that post (?)


The lid on the syringe doesn't seem to sealed, I'm kind of scared of putting it into water. I used my heat gun sparingly across the syringe and it worked fine.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The lid on the syringe doesn't seem to sealed, I'm kind of scared of putting it into water. I used my heat gun sparingly across the syringe and it worked fine.


Put it inside a bag? lol
Can't be too hard...The cap fits pretty tight on mine.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The lid on the syringe doesn't seem to sealed, I'm kind of scared of putting it into water. I used my heat gun sparingly across the syringe and it worked fine.


yea, was just a tip that came to mind, but a heatgun/hairdryer works too..
you could tape the seringe cap if your worried about it, seal it that way..just another thing that comes to mind ...lol
but i didnt do any of those things, and it worked for me, only trouble i had was getting the right amount on the die,
i had to use a bit of pressure to get it out of the seringe, then it came out to hard, and to much,
but then i used the seringe again to suck up the to much pro...no problem..


----------



## teamrushpntball

So just got my i7-3770k in and have been running prime for the last 20 minutes. Seems like a decent chip, albeit I have little experience on judging one. 4.5ghz with only a .04 turbo offset and has been stable for the last 25 minutes in prime.

Now I know I just mounted my water block on, but my temps are rather varied at the moment.
Core0-72
Core1-78
Core2-75
Core3-75

Which is making me somewhat inclined to go ahead and attempt to delid. Is it worth it with this chip or should I keep trying to see if I can get 4.7/4.8ghz without attempting it?

And Liquid Pro is just gallium? Does it not have issues spreading out then once applied and heat is added?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> So just got my i7-3770k in and have been running prime for the last 20 minutes. Seems like a decent chip, albeit I have little experience on judging one. 4.5ghz with only a .04 turbo offset and has been stable for the last 25 minutes in prime.
> 
> Now I know I just mounted my water block on, but my temps are rather varied at the moment.
> Core0-72
> Core1-78
> Core2-75
> Core3-75
> 
> Which is making me somewhat inclined to go ahead and attempt to delid. Is it worth it with this chip or should I keep trying to see if I can get 4.7/4.8ghz without attempting it?
> 
> And Liquid Pro is just gallium? Does it not have issues spreading out then once applied and heat is added?


we need to know your (stable) vcore at 4.5ghz, if its anything like 1.25-1.2V vcore or lower, it might be worth to delid,
the tempdifference is "normal"between cores, 6C is good..i had about 15C difference between hottest/coolest core before delid under load









liquid pro is not pure gallium, theres some others componenets in there too....wait...
pro contains, Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous.

it spreads like other tims once applied,
but doesnt seem to have the pump out effect thats reported sometimes using other tims on ivy,
because the temps go up and down very fast with ivy..


----------



## teamrushpntball

Hmm, thanks for the info. Chip has only been in for the last hour or so. Not quite sure how it's clocking. Probably doesn't help that I'm rather inexperienced









I'll see what VCore I'm stable at for 4.5ghz. Should I expect more out of my i7 than 4.5, or is that a pretty good point to settle in for day to day use on them?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Hmm, thanks for the info. Chip has only been in for the last hour or so. Not quite sure how it's clocking. Probably doesn't help that I'm rather inexperienced
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll see what VCore I'm stable at for 4.5ghz. Should I expect more out of my i7 than 4.5, or is that a pretty good point to settle in for day to day use on them?


If you're not de-lidded 4.5GHz is good and dandy. If you are i'd go for a higher overclock.. Most 3570k's/3770k's can do 4.5GHz fine without being de-lidded.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Hmm, thanks for the info. Chip has only been in for the last hour or so. Not quite sure how it's clocking. Probably doesn't help that I'm rather inexperienced
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll see what VCore I'm stable at for 4.5ghz. Should I expect more out of my i7 than 4.5, or is that a pretty good point to settle in for day to day use on them?


yw








4.5ghz for daily use, is a very nice oc..thats what i wanted when i joined here,
but i was limited by temps to do so, i hit 100+C running prime at 4.5ghz
4.5ghz is about 25% increase in speed over stock, not bad at all right ..lol

i would only delid if you have crazy temps for lower oc's,
or you want to push your chip to the limit, and need the drop in temps to get it..
i can run IBT now at 5.0ghz, and my hottest core is about 84C
i settled for 4.7ghz daily oc, at about 1.3V vcore


----------



## teamrushpntball

Well it seems I'm at 4.6ghz stable for the last 24 minutes using Prime on 1.28 vcore. As for temps my max is Core 1 at 83*C while Core 0 is at 72*C. seems my core temps are spreading the longer I go.

And I don't need to delid, I just want to. I didn't need a full custom water loop for my first system, I just wanted to. Why I love this site so much, it's all about _The pursuit of performance._









Just trying to gauge if this is a keeper chip or if I should drive the 70minutes back to Microcenter and roll the dice again.


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> "We already have great temps after we delidded our ivy's,
> why go through all the trouble lapping, finding new ways to lap the inside ihs,
> if it only shaves of another 3C, if any.. "
> 
> would i really benefit running 5.0ghz ibt,
> 
> and my hottest core went down from 84C to 81C , and that _only during stresstesting_,
> the difference is even less if you use your comp normal..
> 
> no need to spend money on a extra loop after delid, or the time and effort to lap for little gain, or none
> sure sometimes it _seems_ you have a extra tempdrop of 5C like notion,
> but ambient could have changed, your mount could have been better then last time,
> theres always a.. i think about 3C "error difference in temps too,"
> could have been anything that makes the difference in temps after delid,
> 
> i dont need more tempdrop after delidding, i need lower vcore,
> wish i would have a way to lap that off ...lol
> 
> of to bed, kids are here this weekend..


agreed there is definitely a margin of error when applying the TIM, but due to dip in the IHS only the edges were getting the pressure and contact.. I have de-lidded the IB beast and at 4.5ghz max temps with i13 freeze (basic cooler) 63-65 C.. lol can't wait to see the results with my water cooling back up.. have also lapped the water block as well so should be great contact.. oh and the temps are with Liquid ultra on the die and IHS then MX4 between IHS and i13 arctic freeze. will apply liquid ultra when adding the water cooler back in..

just returned my 3rd pump from XSPC kit .. do not under any circumstances get the XSPC kit nothing but trouble.. now buying a D5.. just a tip.

the way i see things 'look after the pennies and punds look after them selfs' i.e gain all the small C increases and they will add up to a lot.

but agreed once de-lidded the onl thing that holds you back is the voltage on the chip.. not the temps.. *sigh*


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Well it seems I'm at 4.6ghz stable for the last 24 minutes using Prime on 1.28 vcore. As for temps my max is Core 1 at 83*C while Core 0 is at 72*C. seems my core temps are spreading the longer I go.
> 
> And I don't need to delid, I just want to. I didn't need a full custom water loop for my first system, I just wanted to. Why I love this site so much, it's all about _The pursuit of performance._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just trying to gauge if this is a keeper chip or if I should drive the 70minutes back to Microcenter and roll the dice again.


looks good to me


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Well it seems I'm at 4.6ghz stable for the last 24 minutes using Prime on 1.28 vcore. As for temps my max is Core 1 at 83*C while Core 0 is at 72*C. seems my core temps are spreading the longer I go.
> 
> And I don't need to delid, I just want to. I didn't need a full custom water loop for my first system, I just wanted to. Why I love this site so much, it's all about _The pursuit of performance._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just trying to gauge if this is a keeper chip or if I should drive the 70minutes back to Microcenter and roll the dice again.


i like you already







"And I don't need to delid, I just want to" "_The pursuit of performance"_









if you can get it running at 4.6ghz with about 1.28 is a decent chip..
its hard to determine where the "wall" is for the higher oc's, some decent chips
hit it at 4.9 others a bit higher..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Well it seems I'm at 4.6ghz stable for the last 24 minutes using Prime on 1.28 vcore. As for temps my max is Core 1 at 83*C while Core 0 is at 72*C. seems my core temps are spreading the longer I go.
> 
> And I don't need to delid, I just want to. I didn't need a full custom water loop for my first system, I just wanted to. Why I love this site so much, it's all about _The pursuit of performance._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just trying to gauge if this is a keeper chip or if I should drive the 70minutes back to Microcenter and roll the dice again.


Perfect wording man! So far the chip looks good want to use a program called cpuz and let us see the stas on the cpu and mobo etc etc?

Also.. I hear your near a MC...... wanna hook a certain captain up if he doesn't get the right answer from another MC in 7 hours?


----------



## teamrushpntball

Live "kinda" near a Microcenter. Good 70 minute drive from my house, albeit straight highway so not too bad. What were you needing?

And yeah, anyway to capture an image of CPUZ?

Edit - Nevermind figured it out myself.

Here it is with Prime running -



http://valid.canardpc.com/2649662

CPU Z Validation Link


----------



## King4x4

That cpu is a keeper









Mine runs [email protected] just to be stable









DELID IT NOW!









And hit 5ghz with 1.45v


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> That cpu is a keeper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mine runs [email protected] just to be stable
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DELID IT NOW!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And hit 5ghz with 1.45v


That's the right attitude!


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> That cpu is a keeper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mine runs [email protected] just to be stable
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DELID IT NOW!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And hit 5ghz with 1.45v


Haha I fully intend to. Waiting on ppc's to get in my special fittings then I'll order my liquid ultra or pro.


----------



## logon2game

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> That cpu is a keeper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mine runs [email protected] just to be stable
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DELID IT NOW!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And hit 5ghz with 1.45v


----------



## Swag

I like tea.


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I like tea.


Much more of a coffee person myself, but on occasion will have some iced tea. On another note, stable going on 4.5 hours 4.6ghz @1.28 vcore.

Looks like in the next few weeks I'll be delidding.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Much more of a coffee person myself, but on occasion will have some iced tea. On another note, stable going on 4.5 hours 4.6ghz @1.28 vcore.
> 
> Looks like in the next few weeks I'll be delidding.


coffee all the way.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Much more of a coffee person myself, but on occasion will have some iced tea. On another note, stable going on 4.5 hours 4.6ghz @1.28 vcore.
> 
> Looks like in the next few weeks I'll be delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> coffee all the way.
Click to expand...

8:00AM - Coffee, and nobody dies........


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> 8:00AM - Coffee, and nobody dies........


lol, I know right. just finished mine. could go for another.


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> lol, I know right. just finished mine. could go for another.


I'll be the first to admit, I am VERY addicted to coffee. Simply do not feel good if some catastrophe prevents me from having coffee that day.


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> I'll be the first to admit, I am VERY addicted to coffee. Simply do not feel good if some catastrophe prevents me from having coffee that day.


lmao... without coffee catastrophic events will happen...


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> coffee all the way.


My usual avatar


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 150$ cause it is a bad clocker?
> 
> i5 2500ks go for 150$
> 
> 3570ks go for 160$ + de lidded should take in 180$ easy unless u got less because u said how bad it clocks lol...
> 
> Heck i would have gave u 150$ for a 4.5ghz 3570k lol.


Hey I said in here last week I would sell it for $150. But I had it listed for $160, I just wanted to sell it fast because I need the money. I will have a 2500K (hopefully today) that I got in a part trade part cash deal for my 7970 from a buddy over at Tom's. So is $150 a fair price for one of those?

Also whats the going rate on a XFX HD 6870 DoubleD? I guess I should just make an appraisal thread.


----------



## Hokies83

Damn plans changed! Found a mountain mods extended ascension for 230$ shipped that is powder coated lol would save me 400$ over case labs so think ima go with it lol.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn plans changed! Found a mountain mods extended ascension for 230$ shipped that is powder coated lol would save me 400$ over case labs so think ima go with it lol.


You didnt order the case labs yet?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> You didnt order the case labs yet?


No I have been waiting for them to release a 120mm roof for it.

The mm will fit 5 86mm 360s and 2 86mm 480s I can be happy with that for 230$ lol.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No I have been waiting for them to release a 120mm roof for it.
> 
> The mm will fit 5 86mm 360s and 2 86mm 480s I can be happy with that for 230$ lol.


Go for it then.
More money for other stuff.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Go for it then.
> More money for other stuff.


----------



## chris-br

If you like it, buy it.







case labs are very very expensive.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Go for it then.
> More money for other stuff.
Click to expand...

Wow. Now that's a case *Hokies83*! Is that what you are getting now?

And the coffee is almost ready.....


----------



## Hokies83

Yah for 230$ shipped im all over it.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah for 230$ shipped im all over it.


I can see why. Cool case *Hokies83*!

Coffee is good.....


----------



## Kolt21

I am currently stable (Based off of a 12 Hour Prime 95 Small FTT Torture Test) at 4.7 ghz / 1.300v on my Ivy Bridge I7 3770k.

Temps Are As Follows:

Max Temp Core 0 - 79c

Max Temp Core 1 - 86c

Max Temp Core 2 - 82c

Max Temp Core 3 - 81c

Is This To Hot Or Should I Delid?

I really wasnt shooting for any more than 4.7 but I dont want it to crap out on me prematurely due to high temps.

I used Stock H100i Thermal Compound that came with it and there was alot of sliding when seated.

Are my temps good? Is This Worth Delidding? Please help.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I am currently stable (Based off of a 12 Hour Prime 95 Small FTT Torture Test) at 4.7 ghz / 1.300v on my Ivy Bridge I7 3770k.
> 
> Temps Are As Follows:
> 
> Max Temp Core 0 - 79c
> 
> Max Temp Core 1 - 86c
> 
> Max Temp Core 2 - 82c
> 
> Max Temp Core 3 - 81c
> 
> Is This To Hot Or Should I Delid?
> 
> I really wasnt shooting for any more than 4.7 but I dont want it to crap out on me prematurely due to high temps.
> 
> I used Stock H100i Thermal Compound that came with it and there was alot of sliding when seated.
> 
> Are my temps good? Is This Worth Delidding? Please help.


Depends on what you use your computer for,
if your folding or anything like that and your computer is on 100% load 24/7..you might want to think about delidding it,
if you a normal daily user playing games, browsing OCN







, you wont see those temps ever again,
then i would say no..your good to go with your 4.7ghz tempwise and vcore, its a real nice oc for a not delidded chip,
you vcore is about the same i need for 4.7ghz, but 4.8ghz takes about 1.420V vcore for mine, 24H prime stable ..


----------



## Kolt21

Also, I am having a hell of a time finding Liquid Pro Available For Purchase On The Web. Newegg Says Discontinued. >.>

Where is the best cheapest place to buy it and Arctic Silver?


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Depends on what you use your computer for,
> if your folding or anything like that and your computer is on 100% load 24/7..you might want to think about delidding it,
> if you a normal daily user playing games, browsing OCN
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , you wont see those temps ever again,
> then i would say no..your good to go with your 4.7ghz tempwise and vcore, its a real nice oc for a not delidded chip,
> you vcore is about the same i need for 4.7ghz, but 4.8ghz takes about 1.420V vcore for mine, 24H prime stable ..


I will be using it for botting diablo 3.

16 Applications of the game running at one time + 16 Bot Programs Controlling the applications.

I Am hoping with 4.7 ghz I can stay at around 70% - 80% load with my setup.

And It will be 24 Hour. >.>


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Also, I am having a hell of a time finding Liquid Pro Available For Purchase On The Web. Newegg Says Discontinued. >.>
> 
> Where is the best cheapest place to buy it and Arctic Silver?


really? how about here.... http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Also, I am having a hell of a time finding Liquid Pro Available For Purchase On The Web. Newegg Says Discontinued. >.>
> 
> Where is the best cheapest place to buy it and Arctic Silver?


Check frozencpu.com


----------



## zGunBLADEz

You freaking guys work? lol
i went to bed at 11 yesterday i came back and 60 something messages wth really?


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> OCN Market place mods will not allow u to profit from any sales.. you can only lose money in the OCN market place now.
> 
> .


Yeah sure... lol dont make me laugh please... I have seen some sales over there which are very close to retail price, specially watercooling related stuff...

Ill make a couple of good deals tho like my 7950..

You open and use ANY electric/computer device to me ((it already lost 25% AUTOMATIC)) of its value depending on how long it is out on the market..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Yeah sure... lol dont make me laugh please... I have seen some sales over there which are very close to retail price, specially watercooling related stuff...
> 
> Ill make a couple of good deals tho like my 7950..
> 
> You open and use ANY electric/computer device to me ((it already lost 25% AUTOMATIC)) of its value depending on how long it is out on the market..


So a 3770k that does 5.3ghz with 1.5v is worth less then 300$? Cause i know where one is for 400$ right now..
You must have never shopped for binned chips?

Also you do not get to take advantage of the 250$ 3770ks because of this stupid rule...
Mods will ask for a reciept.. and the selling price has to be less then what they paid.

A demanded item that is sold out and will not be restocked for months is worth less?

I remember paying 500$ or so for a bunch of Xbox 360s / Ps3s i had reserved and re selling them for 1000$ ?

So yes please. I guess that is why i have over 300 Internet sales transactions heh..


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> So a 3770k that does 5.3ghz with 1.5v is worth less then 300$?
> You must have never shopped for binned chips?
> 
> A demanded item that is sold out and will not be restocked for months is worth less?
> 
> So yes please.


Hell no *i prefer playing the lottery* my friend.. If i win good if i dont the same.. I will never use all the chip power entirely anyway XD...
E-Pen dont work here XD
Whats the fun on buying prebinned stuff?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Hell no *i prefer playing the lottery* my friend.. If i win good if i dont the same.. I will never use all the chip power entirely anyway XD...
> E-Pen dont work here XD
> Whats the fun on buying prebinned stuff?


I guess it is above your user level to understand then..
"OCN tends to draw alot of the lower end user people"
On Extreme forums that is all everyone thinks about......

I remember on XtremeForum there being like 20 people binning 3770ks ?

There is a HUGE mass of people will will pay for that stuff

? Ive used 100% of my chip plenty of times.. it is to slow for me.. i want faster IPC









As long as i can hit 5ghz im happy if i get a chip that cannot do it it is for sale the same day ...

And i would look for a binned chip while i wait for that one to sell... If i did not find one then i would take my chances again..
Rinse and repeat.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I guess it is above your user level to understand then..
> *"OCN tends to draw alot of the lower end user people"*
> On Extreme forums that is all everyone thinks about......
> 
> I remember on XtremeForum there being like 20 people binning 3770ks ?
> 
> There is a HUGE mass of people will will pay for that stuff
> 
> ? Ive used 100% of my chip plenty of times.. it is to slow for me.. i want faster IPC
> 
> As long as i can hit 5ghz im happy if i get a chip that cannot do it it is for sale the same day ...
> 
> And i would look for a binned chip while i wait for that one to sell... If i did not find one then i would take my chances again..
> Rinse and repeat.


Who dont want faster IPC? By the time i end using my cpu other than benchmarks to show true potential... ill be upgrading again...

*Btw please dont rephrase my words...*

You open any electric device and you used, to me it already lost 25% of hes value automatic just for that..
You said theres a market out there. Yeah like everything but im not one of those that follow that market..
I like tinkering myself with the hardware and taking risks and dealing "LIKE A MAN" with GOOD or POOR results.. Like for example not doing cherry picking on hardware and returning the piece back to the store because it dont overclock that well..

That kind of talks should not be allow here in this forum, PERIOD!!!!
Another example: *Like gluing back delided cpus and returning them...*

Im not talking about reselling out of stock stuff or pre binned hardware...

Quote:


> Also you do not get to take advantage of the 250$ 3770ks because of this stupid rule...


I got my 3770k at Micro Center brand new for $230...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Who dont want faster IPC? By the time i end using my cpu other than benchmarks to show true potential... ill be upgrading again...


Amd users? There IPC = Core2Quad.......

Do you web surf or just game at 60fps?

If your a 120 FPS gamer such as me then there afew games that can bury a 5.1ghz 3770k....


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Also, I am having a hell of a time finding Liquid Pro Available For Purchase On The Web. Newegg Says Discontinued. >.>
> 
> Where is the best cheapest place to buy it and Arctic Silver?


you can buy it straight from their site,
http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop
but the shipping cost are a bit higher
the others may know where else to buy if your in the states,
but i dont know where you live so









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I will be using it for botting diablo 3.
> 
> 16 Applications of the game running at one time + 16 Bot Programs Controlling the applications.
> 
> I Am hoping with 4.7 ghz I can stay at around 70% - 80% load with my setup.
> 
> And It will be 24 Hour. >.>


if you dont want to delid, and use "high"load 24/7, i would go for 4.6ghz,
you wont notice a very big difference between the two, and it will be very safe to run, vcore, and tempwise


----------



## Gomi

Source: http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2090

6725mhz 950.00USD / best offer


And that is just one of them - There is a HUGE market for binned chips


----------



## stickg1

Installed updates and drivers on the Extreme6. So far my only gripe is that there are only 2 USB2.0 ports on the back of the board. The USB3.0 ports don't work until you get windows installed and their respective drivers installed. I use keyboard, mouse, and USB drives, one with windows, one with drivers. A little annoying but oh well. I have USB3.0 installed now so there are 6 working ports on the back of the board now.


----------



## chronicfx

I had the same issue when my mouse didn't work. We figured it out though.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Ultra seems much easier to use no?


They are the same to spread. Just pro is supposedly a pain. To get off.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Neater than my setup. Wonder what the boys over at "Rate my cables " will have to say ?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Neater than my setup. Wonder what the boys over at "Rate my cables " will have to say ?


That's what my "behind the motherboard" looks like lol my haf932 back door bulges out.


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you can buy it straight from their site,
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/shop
> but the shipping cost are a bit higher
> the others may know where else to buy if your in the states,
> but i dont know where you live so
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you dont want to delid, and use "high"load 24/7, i would go for 4.6ghz,
> you wont notice a very big difference between the two, and it will be very safe to run, vcore, and tempwise


That Settles It. I am going to delid. Ill be using Arctic Silver and liquid pro.

I Really cant afford to mess up so I will study this post thoroughly.

What is the BEST razorblade to use? Is there anything sharp enough to require NO pressure application?

Is half a rice grain the best method for liquidpro?

What is the best way to prevent sliding with arctic silver?

Also my chip seems to be on the better side.How much do I really stand to gain tempwise?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## Kolt21

Oops. Quoted the wrong post. meant to quote the guy saying 4.6 would be safer. Problem is, 4.6 was the same heat maybey hotter than 4.7. Id have to dial back to 4.5 to really gain a temp decrease and it would still be 70c+.


----------



## martinhal

I'm doing a degradation experiment .

http://www.overclock.net/t/1348694/i-7-3770-k-degradation-experiment/0_20#post_19034283

Feel free to add insights.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> That Settles It. I am going to delid. Ill be using Arctic Silver and liquid pro.
> 
> I Really cant afford to mess up so I will study this post thoroughly.
> 
> What is the BEST razorblade to use? Is there anything sharp enough to require NO pressure application?
> 
> *A normal box cutter. The ones that you can take out of the holder and they aren't breakable, take a look at page one for that info as well.
> *
> Is half a rice grain the best method for liquidpro?
> 
> *I used a bit more than half a grain and then spread it out a bit.*
> 
> What is the best way to prevent sliding with arctic silver?
> 
> On the IHS correct? and its really hard to avoid sliding. but you can hold the IHs still while you latch it down. and put the IHS a bit farther up to give you some room for that last little latching procedure.
> 
> Also my chip seems to be on the better side.How much do I really stand to gain tempwise?
> 
> Usually around 14C at least depending on the chip IHS and HS and the TIM in play.
> 
> Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well i finally Delidded my 3570K used MX-4 on die and IHS (was the one i had here) had a temp drop of 9/10c at the same voltage and clocks but that's it no matter what i do the CPU does not want to give more then 4.8GHz....
For 4.8 i need 1.33v for 4.9GHz i upped the voltage until 1.4v and BSOD allways with the same error 0x101. Guess i got to be happy with 4.8


----------



## Notion

you can still take the voltage higher.. I get 1.36 V @ 4.8ghz.. but then 1.52V for 5 ghz.. odd but it all depends on the chip.. also get some liquid pro/ultra.. makes a huge difference


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well i finally Delidded my 3570K used MX-4 on die and IHS (was the one i had here) had a temp drop of 9/10c at the same voltage and clocks but that's it no matter what i do the CPU does not want to give more then 4.8GHz....
> For 4.8 i need 1.33v for 4.9GHz i upped the voltage until 1.4v and BSOD allways with the same error 0x101. Guess i got to be happy with 4.8


mx-4 on die it will dry up over time and temps will go up.. so get some liquid pro.


----------



## [CyGnus]

If so i will get some CL Pro for now its ok i think here is a quick pic just to see temps:



Its normal a 10ºc difference in the cores?


----------



## stickg1

Why does it seem like everyone gets chips that run 4.8GHz at 1.35v and I can't get anywhere near that frequency at that voltage...


----------



## chris-br

maybe is not seated right?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Its well seated thats for sure, will test some more and see, for now it seems i only gained 100MHz and less 12ºc for 24/7 usage


----------



## stickg1

I'm messing with a 2500K I got in a trade right now. I'm plowing through IBT 4.9GHz @ 1.425v, temps in the high 70s. Not too bad...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm messing with a 2500K I got in a trade right now. I'm plowing through IBT 4.9GHz @ 1.425v, temps in the high 70s. Not too bad...


That's really good. I'd say to push it to 5.0, if it can do it below 1.47, it's a keeper!

YES! 2 more days until my backplate arrives!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Why does it seem like everyone gets chips that run 4.8GHz at 1.35v and I can't get anywhere near that frequency at that voltage...


I don't know man, me neither...my 3770k ran 4.7 at 1.37v :/
My 2600k before that ran 4.8ghz at 1.4v


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That's really good. I'd say to push it to 5.0, if it can do it below 1.47, it's a keeper!


Just passed 10 runs of IBT 5.0GHz @ 1.47v, hell I might keep this thing over my 3570K's...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I don't know man, me neither...my 3770k ran 4.7 at 1.37v :/
> My 2600k before that ran 4.8ghz at 1.4v


Yeah it sucks, lol...


----------



## Valgaur

I need like 30 bucks....... sad day


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need like 30 bucks....... sad day


Man up, I owe 1200usd to Mastercard. AND both my main and backup chip are dead!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That's really good. I'd say to push it to 5.0, if it can do it below 1.47, it's a keeper!
> 
> 
> 
> Just passed 10 runs of IBT 5.0GHz @ 1.47v, hell I might keep this thing over my 3570K's...
Click to expand...

I would keep it over your 3570k. If you plan to clock it at 4.8 or 5.0, then keep it. It will perform to about a 4.6 3570k.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need like 30 bucks....... sad day


For what?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Will buy some CL Pro tomorrow to see if it helps, I just Run IBT with Max mem and my 3570K reaches 90ºc at 4.8GHz and 1.34v.... how is this possible?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Will buy some CL Pro tomorrow to see if it helps, I just Run IBT with Max mem and my 3570K reaches 90ºc at 4.8GHz and 1.34v.... how is this possible?


Your old TIM must have dried up. If you are using Noctua NT-H1, they dry up around 2 weeks after seating if you run the CPU at 100% load 24/7. Tested this myself.







And it took a bit quicker when it was on normal load and shutdown during the nights.


----------



## [CyGnus]

I used MX-4 one hour ago.... in Prime 95 it goes to 77ºc IBT 90ºc.... well i am far from TJMax so no problems there and this is runing IBT lol in folding it goes to 64/65...
So with CL Pro i dont have the problem of dry TIM? How often will i have to replace it?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I used MX-4 1 hour ago....


Ugh, too much? Not sure actually, I haven't used a normal TIM in a while. I bought the IX ETI and have been using that until I got my CLP. I asked IX a while back (along with Val) about them making us some custom ETIs for the die, too bad not enough interest.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Maybe i will try direct die and see how it goes....


----------



## Valgaur

lol Trying to squeeze just enough money out of my pockets to afford this cpu lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Maybe i will try direct die and see how it goes....


I wouldn't honestly, it makes basically a zero difference.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol Trying to squeeze just enough money out of my pockets to afford this cpu lol.


Which CPU?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Just passed 10 runs of IBT 5.0GHz @ 1.47v, hell I might keep this thing over my 3570K's...
> Yeah it sucks, lol...


Sandy is easier, gets boring to play with overclocking though. You can find the max multi on air, & then that's it, nothing you do will ever make it clock higher than that.
For a 24/7 rig where you set an overclock & never change settings again it is nice for a well clocked rig though.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sandy is easier, gets boring to play with overclocking though. You can find the max multi on air, & then that's it, nothing you do will ever make it clock higher than that.
> For a 24/7 rig where you set an overclock & never change settings again it is nice for a well clocked rig though.


Whats the testing methodology for establishing what the max multi is, and is that methodology the same for Ivy Bridge?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sandy is easier, gets boring to play with overclocking though. You can find the max multi on air, & then that's it, nothing you do will ever make it clock higher than that.
> For a 24/7 rig where you set an overclock & never change settings again it is nice for a well clocked rig though.


I dont think either of these Ivy's I have will do those clocks. Although I've only got to play with my new Ivy for an hour or so. I think once I delid it, I will be good to go.

What's with all these people offering me $120 for the 2500K? Isn't that kind of low? I thought the $150 I was asking was perfectly fair...Hell I'd take $140 for it, but $120 is kind of offensive.

Also, one of the Ivy's is sold. The guy I sold it too knows its delidded and knows its a poor clocker but he asked me to tack the IHS back on for him. I used 4 tiny dabs of epoxy in each corner. The problem is, my temps rose about 10C. Do I need to reapply my liquid pro? It looked kind of wet still so I didnt re apply. Or is the epoxy standing the IHS off of the die just enough to cause problems?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Whats the testing methodology for establishing what the max multi is, and is that methodology the same for Ivy Bridge?


I was upping the multi & boot, adding vcore as needed (up to 1.55V on air, not loading it, just booting to desktop). Eventually pll overvoltage must be enabled (depends on the chip, some need it enabled for over 45x, some higher) you can usually get 4 or 5 multi higher after overvoltage is enabled. When booting & you get the blinking cursor instead of the windows loading screen, the last multi was the max.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I dont think either of these Ivy's I have will do those clocks. Although I've only got to play with my new Ivy for an hour or so. I think once I delid it, I will be good to go.
> 
> What's with all these people offering me $120 for the 2500K? Isn't that kind of low? I thought the $150 I was asking was perfectly fair...Hell I'd take $140 for it, but $120 is kind of offensive.
> 
> Also, one of the Ivy's is sold. The guy I sold it too knows its delidded and knows its a poor clocker but he asked me to tack the IHS back on for him. I used 4 tiny dabs of epoxy in each corner. The problem is, my temps rose about 10C. Do I need to reapply my liquid pro? It looked kind of wet still so I didnt re apply. Or is the epoxy standing the IHS off of the die just enough to cause problems?


Most people at least try to save a few bucks off the asking price, if it's a good asking price to start with the offers do get lowball. Better than CL at least.

I did tack down my first delidded chip, a dab of glue in each corner didn't affect temps though.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wouldn't honestly, it makes basically a zero difference.
> Which CPU?


i7 3770K


----------



## tw33k

I used some Sekisui #5760 double sided thermal tape to hold the IHS in place and it it made no difference to my temps. The stuff is ultra thin tho so wouldn't raise the IHS at all.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wouldn't honestly, it makes basically a zero difference.
> Which CPU?
> 
> 
> 
> i7 3770K
Click to expand...

Oh, I hope you a lot of luck. Seems that the past few occasions have been unfortunate.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Generally 10 runs of IBT max memory, 1/2 hour or so & never crashes doing daily stuff.
> 24h of prime95 is just a little overkill when I hardly ever keep the same settings & HW in the machine for 24 hours at a time. Used to do the prime95 thing a few years ago but didn't take long to discover it was a waste of time.


I no longer bother myself with neither Prime nor IBT/LinX LOL! I mean I do use Cinebench for stability testing quickly and later double-check with IBT if I have time ... but the thing is that I have yet to find settings that Cinebench proved right and IBT fails (never happened, tried dozens of times)








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> EDIT: Swag has a point! You can do the reservation yourself probably Val, can't you do that online and have someone else pick it up?


nope. as far as I know the person/account making the resrvation is the person expected (in person) to pick it up. I've seen an older Asian guy in MC picking something up and complaining the staff didn't give it to his kid (family living at same address!) earlier. policies, policies ... for same policies they will NOT sell two same CPUs during the same promotion (limit one per household) to the same person.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> OCN Market place mods will not allow u to profit from any sales.. you can only lose money in the OCN market place now.
> 
> So u will find no binned chips on OCN for sale u have to go to other forums..
> 
> Also i bet any 3570k / 3770k they will close ur thread and make u provide proof of how much u paid for it... " happened to a Nexus 7 i was selling"
> 
> That is why u do not see any of those MicroCenter 3570ks / 3770ks for sale here and so many else where.. if u paid 229$ rules say u would have to sale it for 228$ which i find rather stupid..
> 
> Nobody here is gonna frown at a 250$ shipped BNIB 3770k.. it is a blessing that OCN members who do not use other forums are missing out on.


now I see that I am not missing anything by not even having enough rep to sell over there ... what a joke ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> You freaking guys work? lol
> i went to bed at 11 yesterday i came back and 60 something messages wth really?


we work, but we barely sleep








... other times we don't work and sleep for most of time LOL!


----------



## [CyGnus]

OK did a remount applied Tim on Die and IHS again it seems better the difference from the cores is now just 6ºc (it was 11ºc before)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> EDIT: Swag has a point! You can do the reservation yourself probably Val, can't you do that online and have someone else pick it up?
> 
> 
> 
> nope. as far as I know the person/account making the resrvation is the person expected (in person) to pick it up. I've seen an older Asian guy in MC picking something up and complaining the staff didn't give it to his kid (family living at same address!) earlier. policies, policies ... for same policies they will NOT sell two same CPUs during the same promotion (limit one per household) to the same person.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I haven't actually seen to much of a problem, but you could always reserve one with the name of the picker-upper and have the actual guy pay for it or pay the picker. If you go to the MC in OC, I can probably ask my friend to hold one and let anyone pick it up for you. He is a friend though and if someone decides to steal the chip, I'd have to pay for it so he doesn't get in trouble so don't do that.
Click to expand...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ok, swiftech rep showed some ces results for the h220 kit. Temps are awesome, beats every aio handily, and there are some graphs showing temps using a 1.37v 4..6ghz 3770k with ht on. I'm really tempted by it but my 220cfm fans want a Monsta rad


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ok, swiftech rep showed some ces results for the h220 kit. Temps are awesome, beats every aio handily, and there are some graphs showing temps using a 1.37v 4..6ghz 3770k with ht on. I'm really tempted by it but my 220cfm fans want a Monsta rad


220CFM fans? Jesus I hope you've got a serious set of headphones. Back when I used to use 108CFM Sunon 120x38mm fans my room sounded like a jet taking off. I can't imagine what those 220's sound like. I'd want no part in that personally no matter how many degrees is shaved off my temps haha.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ok, swiftech rep showed some ces results for the h220 kit. Temps are awesome, beats every aio handily, and there are some graphs showing temps using a 1.37v 4..6ghz 3770k with ht on. I'm really tempted by it but my 220cfm fans want a Monsta rad


Nice, I'd use the deltas all the time & screw silence, but the roommates tend to yell at me (they have to or i don't hear them).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice, I'd use the deltas all the time & screw silence, but the roommates tend to yell at me (they have to or i don't hear them).


I love high cfm fans...I want to have the possibility of saturating a cooler if need be.
better safe than sorry







plus you need higgh cfm fans for subzero runs, they are useful to prevent ice formation on certain components.


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, would you recommend putting CLP on the die only or under the IHS as well?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, would you recommend putting CLP on the die only or under the IHS as well?


I did both, and I think it makes better contact that way.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, would you recommend putting CLP on the die only or under the IHS as well?
> 
> 
> 
> I did both, and I think it makes better contact that way.
Click to expand...

Which way?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Which way?


Both (die & IHS)


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Im wondering if somebody has test it or seen somebody reusing intel thermal paste once delided for testing??

As everybody blames the thermal paste and have read somewhere else that the main culprit is the contact between the die and ihs because of the glue intel uses. The die dont make a good contact with the ihs because of it...

I know of course with a better tim you are going to see better results.. But just for science!!!

Delid the chip and remove IHS carefully Clean the glue around chip and ihs...

Hoping it do a good contact again...Just for testing... I would have do it but didnt think about it back then...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Im wondering if somebody has test it or seen somebody reusing intel thermal paste once delided for testing??
> 
> As everybody blames the thermal paste and have read somewhere else that the main culprit is the contact between the die and ihs because of the paste intel uses...
> 
> I know of course with a better tim you are going to see better results.. But just for science!!!
> 
> Delid the chip and remove IHS carefully Clean the glue around chip and ihs...
> 
> Hoping it do a good contact again...Just for testing... I would have do it but didnt think about it back then...


I guess you could but with the paste being the way it is I wouldn't be surprised it isn't already dried. I wouldn't recommend it honestly.

With the CLP and the die and IHS coating for you Swag I just put it on the die as for the reason is that when you put it on the IHS underside you can have the possibility of it moving around and getting onto other parts of the PCB wasting it basically.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I guess you could but with the paste being the way it is I wouldn't be surprised it isn't already dried. I wouldn't recommend it honestly.
> 
> With the CLP and the die and IHS coating for you Swag I just put it on the die as for the reason is that when you put it on the IHS underside you can have the possibility of it moving around and getting onto other parts of the PCB wasting it basically.


I know that.. Mine was still wet i regret not testing it lol....

But im trying to find if intels tim is the problem perse or the glue used, making the die and ihs to not make a good contact or a combination of both problems...

Knowing how problematic is a bad seated cpu cooler im wondering this... Which is actually the same issues lol...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> I know that.. Mine was still wet i regret not testing it lol....
> 
> But im trying to find if intels tim is the problem perse or the glue used, making the die and ihs to not make a good contact or a combination of both problems...
> 
> Knowing how problematic is a bad seated cpu cooler im wondering this... Which is actually the same issues lol...


The problem isn't the TIM at all. it's the distance from the IHS and the die itself mainly. I guess you could say it is the glue mainly as thats what's making the IHS farther from the die because the glue hardend.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Im wondering if somebody has test it or seen somebody reusing intel thermal paste once delided for testing??
> 
> As everybody blames the thermal paste and have read somewhere else that the main culprit is the contact between the die and ihs because of the paste intel uses...
> 
> I know of course with a better tim you are going to see better results.. But just for science!!!
> 
> Delid the chip and remove IHS carefully Clean the glue around chip and ihs...
> 
> Hoping it do a good contact again...Just for testing... I would have do it but didnt think about it back then...
> 
> 
> 
> I guess you could but with the paste being the way it is I wouldn't be surprised it isn't already dried. I wouldn't recommend it honestly.
> 
> With the CLP and the die and IHS coating for you Swag I just put it on the die as for the reason is that when you put it on the IHS underside you can have the possibility of it moving around and getting onto other parts of the PCB wasting it basically.
Click to expand...

I was thinking, if you put it under the IHS too, it'll waste a lot of CLP and it introduces air bubbles! Thanks again Val! +rep and to you too PCWar!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I guess you could but with the paste being the way it is I wouldn't be surprised it isn't already dried. I wouldn't recommend it honestly.
> 
> With the CLP and the die and IHS coating for you Swag I just put it on the die as for the reason is that when you put it on the IHS underside you can have the possibility of it moving around and getting onto other parts of the PCB wasting it basically.
> 
> 
> 
> I know that.. Mine was still wet i regret not testing it lol....
> 
> But im trying to find if intels tim is the problem perse or the glue used, making the die and ihs to not make a good contact or a combination of both problems...
> 
> Knowing how problematic is a bad seated cpu cooler im wondering this... Which is actually the same issues lol...
Click to expand...

Actually, I did a test where once I delidded, I took off the TIM and applied a really crappy TIM (with the glue still there). Meaning that the gap made by the glue was still there.
Worst TIM out possible was what I used (went out of my way to get it too!) TIM Used
And used the same TIM for after I took out the glue:

Temps went down considerably after taking out the glue, sorry I didn't take pictures, I actually didn't expect delidding to become an enthusiast recognized thing with Ivy Bridge.







So many people now!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was thinking, if you put it under the IHS too, it'll waste a lot of CLP and it introduces air bubbles! Thanks again Val! +rep and to you too PCWar!
> Actually, I did a test where once I delidded, I took off the TIM and applied a really crappy TIM (with the glue still there). Meaning that the gap made by the glue was still there.
> Worst TIM out possible was what I used (went out of my way to get it too!) TIM Used
> And used the same TIM for after I took out the glue:
> 
> Temps went down considerably after taking out the glue, sorry I didn't take pictures, I actually didn't expect delidding to become an enthusiast recognized thing with Ivy Bridge.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So many people now!


That stuff isn't too bad for freezing (can pull the pot off a cpu at -180° & it wasn't stuck like glue or turned to powder), have never tried it for anything that wasn't subzero though. Probably like ceramique, fine for phase & DICE but not the best choice for air cooling.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Hey Ftw i have a question for you btw...

My coldest core is core1 as you see here in this picture

Why it idles higher temp as the other cores..

Now when i do a load on the cpu 100%
look at this


It just happens at those low temps tho...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was thinking, if you put it under the IHS too, it'll waste a lot of CLP and it introduces air bubbles! Thanks again Val! +rep and to you too PCWar!
> Actually, I did a test where once I delidded, I took off the TIM and applied a really crappy TIM (with the glue still there). Meaning that the gap made by the glue was still there.
> Worst TIM out possible was what I used (went out of my way to get it too!) TIM Used
> And used the same TIM for after I took out the glue:
> 
> Temps went down considerably after taking out the glue, sorry I didn't take pictures, I actually didn't expect delidding to become an enthusiast recognized thing with Ivy Bridge.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So many people now!
> 
> 
> 
> That stuff isn't too bad for freezing (can pull the pot off a cpu at -180° & it wasn't stuck like glue or turned to powder), have never tried it for anything that wasn't subzero though. Probably like ceramique, fine for phase & DICE but not the best choice for air cooling.
Click to expand...

Yea, I didn't try it at sub-zero, with sub-zero I used my trust Shin-Etsu.







How do you guys check your RAM OC? I just ran Cinebench and it passed so I assume it's working... 2400MHz!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Hey Ftw i have a question for you btw...
> 
> My coldest core is core1 as you see here in this picture
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why it idles higher temp as the other cores..
> 
> Now when i do a load on the cpu 100%
> look at this
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It just happens at those low temps tho...


Because software sucks at reading Idle temps, that's why. Only at load temps these programs are good enough to use.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was thinking, if you put it under the IHS too, it'll waste a lot of CLP and it introduces air bubbles! Thanks again Val! +rep and to you too PCWar!
> Actually, I did a test where once I delidded, I took off the TIM and applied a really crappy TIM (with the glue still there). Meaning that the gap made by the glue was still there.
> Worst TIM out possible was what I used (went out of my way to get it too!) TIM Used
> And used the same TIM for after I took out the glue:
> 
> Temps went down considerably after taking out the glue, sorry I didn't take pictures, I actually didn't expect delidding to become an enthusiast recognized thing with Ivy Bridge.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So many people now!


repped XD


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, would you recommend putting CLP on the die only or under the IHS as well?


Both, but thin layers, worked very well for me








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Im wondering if somebody has test it or seen somebody reusing intel thermal paste once delided for testing??
> 
> As everybody blames the thermal paste and have read somewhere else that the main culprit is the contact between the die and ihs because of the glue intel uses. The die dont make a good contact with the ihs because of it...
> 
> I know of course with a better tim you are going to see better results.. But just for science!!!
> 
> Delid the chip and remove IHS carefully Clean the glue around chip and ihs...
> 
> Hoping it do a good contact again...Just for testing... I would have do it but didnt think about it back then...


Intels tim is as good as any other tim, the w/mk isnt that bad, 3-4 w/mk i think it was,
someone did test it and reused the intel tim..let me see if i can find it again..


----------



## King4x4

Hey Swag... Cinebench is a very decent CPU test but never a ram test. Had my ram at 2400mhz CL10 T2 and it passed cinebench. Gave it a memtest for an hour found four errors







!

Run it through memtest (Best memory tester I used until now) in dos and check. My benchmark is that if the ram passes two passes from memtest it's okay initially. A full night test and it's fool proof. CPU is generally going all out crazy on BF3!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Hey Swag... Cinebench is a very decent CPU test but never a ram test. Had my ram at 2400mhz CL10 T2 and it passed cinebench. Gave it a memtest for an hour found four errors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> Run it through memtest (Best memory tester I used until now) in dos and check. My benchmark is that if the ram passes two passes from memtest it's okay initially. A full night test and it's fool proof. CPU is generally going all out crazy on BF3!


Ugh...I honestly don't want to re-test it using memtest. I use memtest only when I'm checking if my DIMMs are defective or my DIMM slots.


----------



## Hokies83

HMM lol

I wonder what my Cpu temps are going to look like with....

3x Monsta 86mm thick 360 rads "in pull config"

+

3x 86mm Monsta 480s "in pull config"

+ 2x monsta 86mm 240 rads XD

lmao...

I should be pretty close to room temp lol.

In about 2 weks i should be starting the " Valguar why you mad bro? Build log version 2 "


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, would you recommend putting CLP on the die only or under the IHS as well?
> 
> 
> 
> Both, but thin layers, worked very well for me
Click to expand...

I will try both ways, I bought so much CLP anyway.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> HMM lol
> 
> I wonder what my Cpu temps are going to look like with....
> 
> 3x Monsta 86mm thick 360 rads "in pull config"
> 
> +
> 
> 3x 86mm Monsta 480s "in pull config"
> 
> + 2x monsta 86mm 240 rads XD
> 
> lmao...
> 
> I should be pretty close to room temp lol.
> 
> In about 2 weks i should be starting the " Valguar why you mad bro? Build log version 2 "


my coolest core is about 2-3C above ambient/roomtemp most of the time










nothing special with my setup in fans, only the one in the upper case , which is blowing cold air in,
instead of pulling hot air out...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Hey Ftw i have a question for you btw...
> 
> My coldest core is core1 as you see here in this picture
> 
> Why it idles higher temp as the other cores..
> 
> Now when i do a load on the cpu 100%
> look at this
> 
> 
> It just happens at those low temps tho...


Think it is mostly the way idle temps are reported inaccurately by software, much more accurate under load. It can also be leakiness of cores, looking at one of my cpus core 1 was the lowest idle temp, highest load temp, & was a bit faster than the other cores in single thread benchies.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I didn't try it at sub-zero, with sub-zero I used my trust Shin-Etsu.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How do you guys check your RAM OC? I just ran Cinebench and it passed so I assume it's working... 2400MHz!


Superpi 32m, takes a few minutes & is a good quick test of memory stability. A few passes of IBT max memory or HCImemtest in windows does pretty well too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Because software sucks at reading Idle temps, that's why. Only at load temps these programs are good enough to use.


Correct
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Hey Swag... Cinebench is a very decent CPU test but never a ram test. Had my ram at 2400mhz CL10 T2 and it passed cinebench. Gave it a memtest for an hour found four errors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> Run it through memtest (Best memory tester I used until now) in dos and check. My benchmark is that if the ram passes two passes from memtest it's okay initially. A full night test and it's fool proof. CPU is generally going all out crazy on BF3!


Memtest86 is for checking to see if memory is defective, you can pass all day but instafail with overclocked memory in windows if it isn't stable. HCImemtest does better to check overclocked stability.


----------



## King4x4

Your weak point will be the waterblock.

My coolant temperature even with 3 [email protected] and a [email protected] is barely three degrees over room temperature.

at 15% PWM and 30% PWM on the pumps I see ZERO difference in temperature difference









I over engineered me thinks


----------



## dmanstasiu

King4x4, 3 degrees over room temp at load ?


----------



## Belial

So... did we ever figure out what was actually better, Coollaboratory Liquid Pro vs Ultra?

I have my 3570k from costa rica









What I'm missing:
- NH-D14 LGA1155 mount (can't noctua mail stuff from an american vendor instead?)
- Power supply (do i plan to SLI in 2 years with 460s? Should I not plan to ever sli? should i just get a ~300+w psu and figure it out later? oops, missed 3 ridiculously good deals already... ugh modular corsair psu for $24)
- RAM (crucial ballstix tactical tracers 2x2gb for $17.... i knew i should have bought them on my phone when driving instead of waiting to get home like a responsible person)

So i have time to get one or the other. I basically saved so much money from $17 case, $169 cpu, that I have like $50 extra. I could have gone with an i7, could have gone with 8gb instead of 4gb... but neither of those would do anything. So I'm going with some ridiculous CLU/CLP, case LED, and hopefully try to mod a clear side panel on this source 210.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Hey Swag... Cinebench is a very decent CPU test but never a ram test. Had my ram at 2400mhz CL10 T2 and it passed cinebench. Gave it a memtest for an hour found four errors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> Run it through memtest (Best memory tester I used until now) in dos and check. My benchmark is that if the ram passes two passes from memtest it's okay initially. A full night test and it's fool proof. CPU is generally going all out crazy on BF3!


I agree, I always test memory in memtest on new mem OC settings or if new BIOS gives me quirky behavior in OS (or if I suspect defective sticks or board). over night run in memtest86+ 4.20 (around 12 passes on 2x4GB kit) is what I need for daily stability.
for benchmarking I just check if it passes without errors for 1 pass.

Cinebench is for CPU alone, it doesn't test general system stability at all. IBT/LinX would stress CPU+RAM if that is RAM if you want to stress in Windows, but in return it puts less stress on vcore stability (it will mostly stress the CPU thermally, but it doesn't prove vcore is set correctly).


----------



## King4x4

Yup.

Got an ambient sensor in my Aerocool Fan Controller and my Swiftech Res. has a coolant temperature value.

Did a one hour run to stress the system (Had 99.9% activity on all parts) with 15% PWM (Dead silent I love it) at 24'C Ambient and the rad fans (Two rads in push config with 1500rpm Yate Loons and a third with three push Yate loons with 1500rpm and another pieces of CM 1700 rpm fans) and the max coolant temp recorded was 28'C and it drops to 27'C after a point.

Another test was done at 30% PWM at the same specs and ZERO change in the results.

Did a third with 15% PWM and all fans at 1000 RPM and the coolant temp increased by 7'C from ambient.

Three RX360s are nice!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Hey Swag... Cinebench is a very decent CPU test but never a ram test. Had my ram at 2400mhz CL10 T2 and it passed cinebench. Gave it a memtest for an hour found four errors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> Run it through memtest (Best memory tester I used until now) in dos and check. My benchmark is that if the ram passes two passes from memtest it's okay initially. A full night test and it's fool proof. CPU is generally going all out crazy on BF3!
> 
> 
> 
> I agree, I always test memory in memtest on new mem OC settings or if new BIOS gives me quirky behavior in OS (or if I suspect defective sticks or board). over night run in memtest86+ 4.20 (around 12 passes on 2x4GB kit) is what I need for daily stability.
> for benchmarking I just check if it passes without errors for 1 pass.
> 
> Cinebench is for CPU alone, it doesn't test general system stability at all. IBT/LinX would stress CPU+RAM if that is RAM if you want to stress in Windows, but in return it puts less stress on vcore stability (it will mostly stress the CPU thermally, but it doesn't prove vcore is set correctly).
Click to expand...

Got my RAM running at 2400 12-12-12-30! Passed Prime95 for 1H already!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Got my RAM running at 2400 12-12-12-30! Passed Prime95 for 1H already!


Also, use maxxmem or aida64 to check the different frequency/timing combinations to make sure it's doing better. Ivy likes higher frequency but loosening timings too much to get there can negate some of the speed gain.


----------



## Swag

@FtW, Thanks for the tip! I checked and my new specs are faster than the previous one.









Anyone wanna post their maxxmem scores so I can compare where mine stands!

edit: What do you guys think of the rear fan in the case? Should I still use one? I've heard it makes no difference with temps at all. Note this was only indicated when using the the NH-D14 and nothing else.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Here is mine


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Here is mine


Nice! Let me check it again without prime95.







I scored 26k with prime95 on so let's see what it'll do after prime!


----------



## King4x4

I did a quick analysis once. The equation is ((CL#/(Speed/2))*1000 = nS Response time (For normal use)

Fastest timing with regards to response time should be for the following and in this order (First line is CL, Second Line is Speed in Mhz and third line is response time):

9 2666 6.751687922
10 2800 7.142857143
9 2400 7.5
8 2133 7.501172058
10 2666 7.501875469
11 2800 7.857142857
11 2666 8.252063016
10 2400 8.333333333
9 2133 8.438818565
12 2800 8.571428571
8 1866 8.57449089
12 2666 9.002250563
11 2400 9.166666667
10 2133 9.376465073
9 1866 9.646302251
8 1600 10

If you go analyize this data you find that the fastest ram out at the moment (Corsair Dominators at CL12 2800mhz) is getting beaten by any ram doing CL10 2400mhz. This is at T2 settings I bet that when you find a ram that is T1 CL9 2133 it will beat it too.

My Samsung chips are currently doing CL10 2133 T1... thought about getting them to CL11 2400mhz but its just not that responsive.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Got my RAM running at 2400 12-12-12-30! Passed Prime95 for 1H already!
> 
> 
> 
> Also, use maxxmem or aida64 to check the different frequency/timing combinations to make sure it's doing better. Ivy likes higher frequency but loosening timings too much to get there can negate some of the speed gain.
Click to expand...

+rep, without this, I would've been running my RAM slower than my 2133!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Here is mine


Thanks a lot for this! I just went down to 2200MHz (golden speed for mine) @ 9-9-9-27! I can't believe how much of a difference it makes from 2400. 2400 kept scoring crappy stuff even at 2400 12-12-12-30!

By the way guys, what Vdimm are you guys running at? I keep hearing that anything above 1.50 is extremely bad for Ivy Bridge but I don't think so. As much as I've pushed so many voltages through this chip, nothing has happened!


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well for the safe side you can go to 1.575v, but since there is ram at 1.65v out of the box i would say go for that no issues


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Im wondering if somebody has test it or seen somebody reusing intel thermal paste once delided for testing??
> 
> As everybody blames the thermal paste and have read somewhere else that the main culprit is the contact between the die and ihs because of the glue intel uses. The die dont make a good contact with the ihs because of it...
> 
> I know of course with a better tim you are going to see better results.. But just for science!!!
> 
> Delid the chip and remove IHS carefully Clean the glue around chip and ihs...
> 
> Hoping it do a good contact again...Just for testing... I would have do it but didnt think about it back then...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Intels tim is as good as any other tim, the w/mk isnt that bad, 3-4 w/mk i think it was,
> someone did test it and reused the intel tim..let me see if i can find it again..



Compare all the "a" cases to the "b" cases, the only functional differences in these two test conditions is the CPU TIM. Notice that the Intel stock CPU TIM outperforms the NT-H1 replacement TIM once the CPU-to-IHS gap is identical

(all the "b" cases are ~2-3°C warmer than the "a" cases)

And if we remove the paper shim and drop that IHS down onto the CPU (not perfectly zero of course, there is still some NT-H1 CPU TIM there after all) reducing the gap to as close to zero as possible then we get the "c" cases...and the temperatures show the expected fantastic drops we have all come to expect from delidding our Ivy Bridge chips.

Conclusion: *The Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason Ivy Bridge's run hot, and replacing the Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason a delidded Ivy Bridge runs so much cooler* - the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well for the safe side you can go to 1.575v, but since there is ram at 1.65v out of the box i would say go for that no issues


I see, thanks! I'll stick to my 1.525!







It runs my RAM with no problem and with insurance since it's stable at 1.5000.


----------



## King4x4

I saw that Ivy can handle up to 1.75v on the ram voltage. I have mine running at 1.65v daily use for like... eternity!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> OK did a remount applied Tim on Die and IHS again it seems better the difference from the cores is now just 6ºc (it was 11ºc before)


Told ya, I was sure it was not seated right.


----------



## davwman

I apologize for the long winded post, but please be patient

Delidded my 3570k. Was priming last night custom with 90% available ram at 4.2ghz with 1.2v core and have llc at level 2 on an as rock z77 itx board which gives me about 1.207 volts in CPU z under load. I am running water with a 140mm rad and was pulling 60-65c across all cores which is roughly 20-25c difference from my cooler master evo With that said I woke up about an hour or two during the prime run to hear akasa vipers running at 100%(loud) which meant that fan control kicked in at 65c which its set to do. I was fine with this because it was working as intended and I went back to sleep. 6am this morning I find the fans silent, but running, and prime no longer testing. Sometime last night the thing rebooted and I'm not sure if its the overheat protection setup in core temp or if I don't have enough voltage. One would think with the temps I was pulling the 140.1 rad is enough for for 72watts which according to core temp was the wattage draw during prime. Is it possible another rad is needed and my temps shot up without me knowing? Thanks in advance


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Told ya, I was sure it was not seated right.


----------



## KaRLiToS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Compare all the "a" cases to the "b" cases, the only functional differences in these two test conditions is the CPU TIM. Notice that the Intel stock CPU TIM outperforms the NT-H1 replacement TIM once the CPU-to-IHS gap is identical
> 
> (all the "b" cases are ~2-3°C warmer than the "a" cases)
> 
> And if we remove the paper shim and drop that IHS down onto the CPU (not perfectly zero of course, there is still some NT-H1 CPU TIM there after all) reducing the gap to as close to zero as possible then we get the "c" cases...and the temperatures show the expected fantastic drops we have all come to expect from delidding our Ivy Bridge chips.
> 
> 
> 
> Conclusion: *The Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason Ivy Bridge's run hot, and replacing the Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason a delidded Ivy Bridge runs so much cooler* - the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS.
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570


So this mean the reason is because of the thick glue they used to glue the IHS to the PCB?

+rep, good to know this, saved in favorite to pass the info


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> Im wondering if somebody has test it or seen somebody reusing intel thermal paste once delided for testing??
> 
> As everybody blames the thermal paste and have read somewhere else that the main culprit is the contact between the die and ihs because of the glue intel uses. The die dont make a good contact with the ihs because of it...
> 
> I know of course with a better tim you are going to see better results.. But just for science!!!
> 
> Delid the chip and remove IHS carefully Clean the glue around chip and ihs...
> 
> Hoping it do a good contact again...Just for testing... I would have do it but didnt think about it back then...


I might try it with my new chip.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> I apologize for the long winded post, but please be patient
> 
> Delidded my 3570k. Was priming last night custom with 90% available ram at 4.2ghz with 1.2v core and have llc at level 2 on an as rock z77 itx board which gives me about 1.207 volts in CPU z under load. I am running water with a 140mm rad and was pulling 60-65c across all cores which is roughly 20-25c difference from my cooler master evo With that said I woke up about an hour or two during the prime run to hear akasa vipers running at 100%(loud) which meant that fan control kicked in at 65c which its set to do. I was fine with this because it was working as intended and I went back to sleep. 6am this morning I find the fans silent, but running, and prime no longer testing. Sometime last night the thing rebooted and I'm not sure if its the overheat protection setup in core temp or if I don't have enough voltage. One would think with the temps I was pulling the 140.1 rad is enough for for 72watts which according to core temp was the wattage draw during prime. Is it possible another rad is needed and my temps shot up without me knowing? Thanks in advance


It could just be voltage. Check your logs to see if you got a BSOD around that time.


----------



## davwman

Checked reliability monitor and it looks like windows installed updates and rebooted. No hardware failures, bsods, shutdowns reported. At 4.4 with 1.23v right now. Adding an alpha cool 120.2 anyway for $40.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KaRLiToS*
> 
> So this mean the reason is because of the thick glue they used to glue the IHS to the PCB?
> 
> +rep, good to know this, saved in favorite to pass the info


yes, its the distance between the die and ihs thats the no.1 cause of high temps with ivy








the tim used could have been better tho, hence the big difference if you use liquid pro/ultra,
the w/mk of the tim is important too we learned here when used on the die..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> Checked reliability monitor and it looks like windows installed updates and rebooted. No hardware failures, bsods, shutdowns reported. At 4.4 with 1.23v right now. Adding an alpha cool 120.2 anyway for $40.


i hate when that happens, windows always updates when youre working on something..lol
i have it set to, "_Check for updates but let me choose whether to download and install them_"
that way i only get a popup, which doesnt interrupt anything else that way..lol








Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Windows Update\Change settings


----------



## chronicfx

My results:



I am submitting this for gold and superstable. Not bad for a board that I shorted twice the night before. Takes a licking and keeps on ticking.. and superstably


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> My results:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am submitting this for gold and superstable. Not bad for a board that I shorted twice the night before. Takes a licking and keeps on ticking.. and superstably


you gonna run it 24/7 ?
i think you surely could, vcore, tempwise ..everything lol








very nice chronicfx


----------



## tzvia

I had suspected that there was a gap between the die and the IHS when I delidded mine and saw that the TIM was quite thick on the die. But I was in such a hurry to get that gunk off and get that sticky black crap off the PCB and IHS that I did not pursue that train of thought further. Intel's TIM was on so thick and it had cascaded down all four sides of the die so no way was I going to leave it on there. I wasn't too thorough in getting that glue stuff off, however, but it looked ok using AS5 with two test mounts before testing it. My temps only went down about 8c and were really not where I wanted them. I'm only watering my CPU with an rx360 kit with the copper Raystorm block, 4 SP Corsar fans and D5. Temps at 4.7, 1.33 vcore were hitting low to mid 70s on Prime small FFTs and IBT on Xtreme setting hit about 78. Before delidding, IBT hit mid 80s. Not happy.

My order of Liquid Ultra came in, so I popped off the block and IHS to discover my mount sucked for some reason. It looked like the TIM was about as thick on one end of the die as it was with the Intel paste. So I took the time to remove what remained of the Intel glue gunk on the IHS and PCB, and cleaned the die and IHS of all AS5 and carefully put the Ultra on there and on top of the IHS. No test mounts, I have come to the conclusion that as they don't show your actual mount, it's only worth doing once to see how well an untested paste spreads. Liquid Ultra is pre-spread and not a bit in the middle, so I saw no point in doing so. I just made sure the IHS sat flush against the PCB all the way around.

Well, not sure if I should just be applauding the Liquid Ultra, or also the removal of the remainder of that black glue stuff, but my temps on IBT Xtreme hit 61 on the hottest core last night. Primed a bit too and it hit 59 at one point. Still have about a 10c spread between cores. So that bad mount and gap had really messed up the temps.


----------



## chris-br

@chronicfx : yeah, vcore and temps are gold. congrats.


----------



## chronicfx

Thanks guys. I am gonna run it. It is the only overclock saved in the new bios and it shall stay that way I hope.


----------



## davwman

Xspc ex240 ordered to work with the 140.1 rad. Load temps are getting high with 4.5ghz @ 1.28 volts. Actually hit 90c using the water loop with a thermal right 140mm 1000rpm fan. Also using shinetsu tim, wondering if I should get some cool lab ultra? Also looking at my cores in core temp right now and 0,2,3 idle at 27, 27, 34 while 1 is always at 40c. Does this seem normal?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> I had suspected that there was a gap between the die and the IHS when I delidded mine and saw that the TIM was quite thick on the die. But I was in such a hurry to get that gunk off and get that sticky black crap off the PCB and IHS that I did not pursue that train of thought further. Intel's TIM was on so thick and it had cascaded down all four sides of the die so no way was I going to leave it on there. I wasn't too thorough in getting that glue stuff off, however, but it looked ok using AS5 with two test mounts before testing it. My temps only went down about 8c and were really not where I wanted them. I'm only watering my CPU with an rx360 kit with the copper Raystorm block, 4 SP Corsar fans and D5. Temps at 4.7, 1.33 vcore were hitting low to mid 70s on Prime small FFTs and IBT on Xtreme setting hit about 78. Before delidding, IBT hit mid 80s. Not happy.
> 
> My order of Liquid Ultra came in, so I popped off the block and IHS to discover my mount sucked for some reason. It looked like the TIM was about as thick on one end of the die as it was with the Intel paste. So I took the time to remove what remained of the Intel glue gunk on the IHS and PCB, and cleaned the die and IHS of all AS5 and carefully put the *Ultra on there and on top of the IBT*. No test mounts, I have come to the conclusion that as they don't show your actual mount, it's only worth doing once to see how well an untested paste spreads. Liquid Ultra is pre-spread and not a bit in the middle, so I saw no point in doing so. I just *made sure the IBT sat flush against the PCB* all the way around.
> 
> Well, not sure if I should just be applauding the Liquid Ultra, or also the removal of the remainder of that black glue stuff, but my temps on IBT Xtreme hit 61 on the hottest core last night. Primed a bit too and it hit 59 at one point. Still have about a 10c spread between cores. So that bad mount and gap had really messed up the temps.


IBT = IHS








when i was reading your post i got all confused ..lol

yea, i used AS5 at first after delid, got a bout the same tempdrop you had,
maybe a bit more, and after just a few weeks temps got higher again too


then my liquid pro arrived

and dropped temps alot (25C) more compared to AS5..

10C difference between cores under load is good,
most are somewhere between 4-8C, but the higher the oc, the bigger the difference gets again,
mine dropped from about 15C difference before delid, to 4-7C after delid, so that only was a big win for me..


----------



## davwman

^^^looks like I'll be ordering some liquid pro! I'm currently using shin etsu.

In addition to my last post, I thought I might add that under load temps are within 1-2°c of each other on all cores.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> ^^^looks like I'll be ordering some liquid pro! I'm currently using shin etsu.
> 
> In addition to my last post, I thought I might add that under load temps are within 1-2°c of each other on all cores.


oki, if its at idle, the difference between cores, no worries,
some program readings are a bit of when your chip is at idle i learned this week,
they are more precise under load,
and when the load is very low, only 1 core is used to do the work, thats another reason, i think
windows is always doing some stuff in the background, check for updates, a firewall checking things, a service thats running for a min etc..
and some think its because of the layout of the die, 1 core is next to the igpu

liquid pro/ultra is deffo the way to go on the die, on the ihs every good tim will do,
but i used liquid pro all the way, on die, inside ihs, on ihs, and base plate cooler, thin layers everywhere of course


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> Xspc ex240 ordered to work with the 140.1 rad. Load temps are getting high with 4.5ghz @ 1.28 volts. Actually hit 90c using the water loop with a thermal right 140mm 1000rpm fan. Also using shinetsu tim, wondering if I should get some cool lab ultra? Also looking at my cores in core temp right now and 0,2,3 idle at 27, 27, 34 while 1 is always at 40c. Does this seem normal?


you delidded your cpu davwman?
maybe i missed it, was busy weekend, so didnt follow everything in here








read my post above this one..lol


----------



## davwman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> Xspc ex240 ordered to work with the 140.1 rad. Load temps are getting high with 4.5ghz @ 1.28 volts. Actually hit 90c using the water loop with a thermal right 140mm 1000rpm fan. Also using shinetsu tim, wondering if I should get some cool lab ultra? Also looking at my cores in core temp right now and 0,2,3 idle at 27, 27, 34 while 1 is always at 40c. Does this seem normal?
> 
> 
> 
> you delidded your cpu davwman?
> maybe i missed it, was busy weekend, so didnt follow everything in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> read my post above this one..lol
Click to expand...

Yup delidded! I definitely think I put too much tim on also. Ill be buying cool lab based on reviews even though shinetsu is good.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> Compare all the "a" cases to the "b" cases, the only functional differences in these two test conditions is the CPU TIM. Notice that the Intel stock CPU TIM outperforms the NT-H1 replacement TIM once the CPU-to-IHS gap is identical
> 
> (all the "b" cases are ~2-3°C warmer than the "a" cases)
> 
> And if we remove the paper shim and drop that IHS down onto the CPU (not perfectly zero of course, there is still some NT-H1 CPU TIM there after all) reducing the gap to as close to zero as possible then we get the "c" cases...and the temperatures show the expected fantastic drops we have all come to expect from delidding our Ivy Bridge chips.
> 
> Conclusion: *The Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason Ivy Bridge's run hot, and replacing the Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason a delidded Ivy Bridge runs so much cooler* - the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS.
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570


+1 now i can go to sleep at night XD
add that to page 1 fo future reference..

Thats exactly the same one i read when looking the space between cooler and die contact..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> +1 now i can go to sleep at night XD


haha..sleep well









i have to add to that,
your temps will reduce after delid, using another tim..but
using Liquid Pro or Ultra on the die gives the best results,
no other tim like MX-* or shinetsu tim..you name one, gives these results

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 38w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
everything else is less

the die is small, the higher the w/mk is for any tim, the better it will transfer the heat,
when you use Pro/Ultra on the IHS, and compare it to other tim's, the difference is normal,
like tests show, they are all within 2-5C


----------



## Notion

wow good info there!! think i will change Ultra for pro then!

cheers for the good post


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> wow good info there!! think i will change Ultra for pro then!
> 
> cheers for the good post


thanks









i wouldnt go out right away and change Ultra to Pro tho,
Pro will win performance wise, beats Ultra..true,
but the difference in temps is not that big between the two,
i figured, once you come above a certain w/mk, the differences will be less,
then it doesnt matter anymore if a tim has say, 30-40, 80..or 150 w/mk..just a example ..lol


----------



## Notion

kk.. think i will keep in mind..just for curiosity purposed.. lets just hope its doesn't kill the 'cat'

Thanks though


----------



## Kolt21

I ran Prime 95 For 26 Hours On my 4.7 ghz 1.3v overvclock.

1 Thread on my coldest core had a hardware error at 22 hours and dropped to 50%load for the last 4 hours. No other issues. This was Small TFF's High Stress.

Am I Still Rock Solid Stable for 24/7 Use? I will not push to 100% Load in actual use but probably as high as 90.


----------



## Kolt21

Also is Liquid Pro Ultra better than Liquid Pro for delidding?


----------



## VonDutch

how did the batch numbers on ivy break down again, you know,
where its made, what month, week .etc?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I ran Prime 95 For 26 Hours On my 4.7 ghz 1.3v overvclock.
> 
> 1 Thread on my coldest core had a hardware error at 22 hours and dropped to 50%load for the last 4 hours. No other issues. This was Small TFF's High Stress.
> 
> Am I Still Rock Solid Stable for 24/7 Use? I will not push to 100% Load in actual use but probably as high as 90.


looks to me youre pretty stable , if prime ran 22H,
but all i know is, when a core drops load from 100% to 50%, is because its throttleling,
so that core hit tjmax, 105C, or theres another reason i dont know of..
4.7ghz at 1.3V vcore is about what i run/need too
try stay in the 80-85C range with temps, with a spike to 90C is np
need more info tho, mobo, cpu, ram, everything you can tell us helps








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Also is Liquid Pro Ultra better than Liquid Pro for delidding?


both are performing good when used on the die,
on the ihs any good tim will do


----------



## zGunBLADEz

If you are constantly changing coolers or moving hardware specially if you do watercooling i will avoid putting CLP/U on the IHS...


----------



## Kolt21

No it was my coolest core. max temp was 79c.

hottest core maxed at 86c but was usually 79-83c.


----------



## Kolt21

How much Coolabratory LiquidPro are you getting when purchased in the shot needle looking thing?

Enough for 2 Delids? 3? 4?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Thanks guys. I am gonna run it. It is the only overclock saved in the new bios and it shall stay that way I hope.


go for 5ghz @ 1.45v


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> How much Coolabratory LiquidPro are you getting when purchased in the shot needle looking thing?
> 
> Enough for 2 Delids? 3? 4?


10- 20 applications with liguid pro
ultra seems like u can only get around 10 applications


----------



## Edge Of Pain

I'm not sure if I'll do this when I get my 3770k simply because I don't want to risk £255 of my money, but I will practice on a £10 socket 939 Sempron (which has been replaced with a £15 Athlon 64 x2) if possible.

Do I have to put the IHS back on or can I run without it? Like Pentium 3s and Socket 754 CPUs. Also will MX-2 be OK to go directly onto the die?

EDIT:

Coincidence, I bring up really old CPUs and this happens to be the 8086th post in an Intel thread


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> I'm not sure if I'll do this when I get my 3770k simply because I don't want to risk £255 of my money, but I will practice on a £10 socket 939 Sempron (which has been replaced with a £15 Athlon 64 x2) if possible.
> 
> Do I have to put the IHS back on or can I run without it? Like Pentium 3s and Socket 754 CPUs. Also will MX-2 be OK to go directly onto the die?
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> Coincidence, I bring up really old CPUs and this happens to be the 8086th post in an Intel thread


8086...flashback in time ..lol

practice on some old pentiums is a good idea, i would have done that to if i knew back then
before i delidded mine ..o well, went well anyways ..lol
i did buy 10 old pentiums on a Dutch forum, for 10 euro,
just to do some fun projects with my kids, they are pro delidders now, 14 and 15 years old








heres one of the vid's we made, my kiddo doing a corner on a pentium





i would use the IHS after delid again, theres no real gain in temps going bare die, and the ihs
is a good protection for the die right









i said this about 3 times on 2 pages, Pro/Ultra you need to use on the die, to get the great results in tempdrop,
so, no use in using other then that tim's, it will drop your temps, but not as big as using liquid pro or ultra on the die








on the ihs, any good tim will do..

edit,
pls read our page 1, its full of info, and gives almost all answers to questions you have


----------



## Notion

dude you have no choice but to do it to the 3770k!! it is just not worth getting otherwise! go for the 2600k otherwise.. this has to be delidded and it is really simple.. just take time and go for it.. the temp drop is incredible.. I got water cooling system to get temps down but the heat just does not get transferred.. and temps kept high.. de lidded and can't get temp high now.. the only thing holding me back is the voltage on the chip.. 3770k has to be delidded or you have already wasted your money..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> dude you have no choice but to do it to the 3770k!! it is just not worth getting otherwise! go for the 2600k otherwise.. this has to be delidded and it is really simple.. just take time and go for it.. the temp drop is incredible.. I got water cooling system to get temps down but the heat just does not get transferred.. and temps kept high.. de lidded and can't get temp high now.. the only thing holding me back is the voltage on the chip.. 3770k has to be delidded or you have already wasted your money..


3770k is better then a 2600k / 2700k de lidded or not....

More features stronger IMC pci-e 3.0.. Lower TDP..

Onlytime the 2600k is worth it over the 3770k is if the 2600k is 50$ + cheaper..


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3770k is better then a 2600k / 2700k de lidded or not....
> 
> More features stronger IMC pci-e 3.0.. Lower TDP..
> 
> Onlytime the 2600k is worth it over the 3770k is if the 2600k is 50$ + cheaper..


I was quite flustered when I remembered that my 2600k doesn't support memory over 2133mhz, or PCI-e slots


----------



## Notion

maybe you are right i don't know.. but you wont get the overclocks though.. just runs too high temps.. the heat transfer fugly big time..


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> maybe you are right i don't know.. but you wont get the overclocks though.. just runs too high temps.. the heat transfer fugly big time..


If you have a 3770k and a 2600k side by side both at 4.5ghz, the 3770k will outperform your 2600k. Also, who cares about heat transfer when you can watercool


----------



## Notion

Well watercooling cost me an extra £200.. still awaiting a functioning pump.. been through 3 xspc 750's.. now buying the D5..
so yeah it costs to go Watercooling .. considering i bought the water cooling to get temps down but could not go above 4.5 due to temps.. before delidding.

I was initially running i5 2400.. then upgraded.. but initially had the i13 arctic freeze.. which just couldn't handle temps of the new i7 3770k.. so got the Watercooling wanting to make the most of the chip.. and low and behold could not go above 4.5ghz.. now i have delidded and using liquid ultra on die, with water cooling super cool and not above 60 c @4.8 ghz, but the arctic freeze 13 @ 4.5Ghz is hitting 63C max.. so if i had known the blasted thing needed delidding before spending £200 on water cooling.. then i would of stuck if £15 air fan.. so my conclusion is.. this chip has to be delidded to save on crazy water cooling setups.. having said that though.. water cooling is awesome and will not go back.. once i get the new pump shortly.. long story short.. i totally agree.. but the little ivy needs to be pimped what ever way you look at it..


----------



## zerocraft

is it wise to try and lapp my IHS? I have about a 8 degree delta on my hottest to coolest max core temps.


----------



## VonDutch

i can run mine now with a simple aircooler, mugen 2,
5ghz IBT, hottest core 84C









edit,
oyea .."proof"..lol

*whistles*


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zerocraft*
> 
> is it wise to try and lapp my IHS? I have about a 8 degree delta on my hottest to coolest max core temps.


I lappde my IHS ( not inside contact with die) side that meets cooling block and saw a 5c increase.. but i have big concave in mine.. took along time to get it out though.. some say its not worth it.. but hey i think every C counts.. its why we do what we do


----------



## Notion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can run mine now with a simple aircooler, mugen 2,
> 5ghz IBT, hottest core 84C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit,
> oyea .."proof"..lol
> 
> *whistles*


Lol nice one.. looks good


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Lol nice one.. looks good


yea, just to add to your story








i was planning to go water too, but i dont see the need now...maybe another time,
with money i saved for it, i could buy my gigabyte 7970 windforce 3


----------



## [CyGnus]

Same with me got a 7870 from asus







though your CPUs look much better i am at 4.7GHz 1.28v Prime 95 goes to 66/67c IBT 78c have to try with more volts and see if the temp rises much


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3770k is better then a 2600k / 2700k de lidded or not....
> 
> More features stronger IMC pci-e 3.0.. Lower TDP..
> 
> Onlytime the 2600k is worth it over the 3770k is if the 2600k is 50$ + cheaper..


It's worth it when it has a REAL high max multi on air/water. You know, those 5.6ghz 2600k/2500k chips.








If not, a 3770k any day of the week, and specially if you wanna bench with it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Same with me got a 7870 from asus
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> though your CPUs look much better i am at 4.7GHz 1.28v Prime 95 goes to 66/67c IBT 78c have to try with more volts and see if the temp rises much


not really better, im need about 1.3V vcore, with offset tho, to run 4.7ghz








not sure what temps are running ibt or prime at this speed ...wait

lucky, found a 4.7ghz 30min prime i did,

63C hottest core

4.8ghz, 1.420V vcore , 24H prime run

76C hottest cores

4.9ghz, 1.475V vcore, 1H prime, failed after 1H30min tho









79C hottest core,
needed to up my vcore to about 1.510V-1.520V to make this one run prime stable,
so no go for that one 24/7, 4.8ghz is my max for this chip..


----------



## [CyGnus]

I am starting to think that is my crappy board holding me back...

PS: Here is a pic of mine at 1.34v 4.8GHz, your is so much cooler then this one (though i am using MX-4 in Die and IHS)


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can run mine now with a simple aircooler, mugen 2,
> 5ghz IBT, hottest core 84C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit,
> oyea .."proof"..lol
> 
> *whistles*


whats the vcore used?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> whats the vcore used?


Maybe 1.51....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's worth it when it has a REAL high max multi on air/water. You know, those 5.6ghz 2600k/2500k chips.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If not, a 3770k any day of the week, and specially if you wanna bench with it.


Those 1 in a million 5.5ghz Sandy Chips that people all killed off in afew months with 1.45v? Sandy can not take any type of V core it dies very fast.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Maybe 1.51....


My cpuz reading just shows the vid not actual vcore.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I am starting to think that is my crappy board holding me back...
> 
> PS: Here is a pic of mine at 1.34v 4.8GHz, your is so much cooler then this one (though i am using MX-4 in Die and IHS)


guess that answers it then








go Pro/Ultra, or go higher temps..LOL
i bet you will drop temps more when you use pro/ultra on the die








check the memberlist on page 1, and compare the ones who used liquid pro, with the ones who used other tims on the die, youll see..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> whats the vcore used?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Maybe 1.51....


yep, around that vcore, i dont remember exactly, was a while ago, didnt note the exact vcore back then,
but the cpu-z reading should be about right..right


----------



## chronicfx

Looking into faster ram but I am too much of a ram overclocking noob to want to take that on..

...I have this Ram:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233186

Would this be alot faster?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231585

I noticed king was doing some latency comparisons a few pages back so hopefully this is still somewhat on the topic of the day.


----------



## lilchronic

ibt run after delid. ran 9 hrs of prime crashed with 0x000124 any lower voltage i crash with a bsod 0x000101 or 0x0003b any higher i crash faster i think for sure it my mobo will be upgrading by the end of the month
5ghz run with 2400mhz ram trident gskill 2x4gb


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Looking into faster ram but I am too much of a ram overclocking noob to want to take that on..
> 
> ...I have this Ram:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233186
> 
> Would this be alot faster?
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231585
> 
> I noticed king was doing some latency comparisons a few pages back so hopefully this is still somewhat on the topic of the day.


The second set will blow it out of the water. but if your gaming. doesnt do you any good at all. only benching will help with better RAM


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Those 1 in a million 5.5ghz Sandy Chips that people all killed off in afew months with 1.45v? Sandy can not take any type of V core it dies very fast.


Surely Ivy Bridge is easier to kill with high Vcore because it has even smaller transistors?

Also, I can't find any Liquid Pro or Ultra ;_;


----------



## davwman

Currently testing 4.5 @ 1.28v, temps are high though and I cancelled prime. The 140.1 rad is OK for anything up to 4.3 GHz at 1.2volts. Need my xspc ex 240 to get here and work with the 140 to get these temps down :banghead:


----------



## Valgaur

FOR EVERYONE HAVING ISSUES READING BATCH NUMBERS THIS IS HOW TO READ THEM!!!!!

Sorry I've only posted this a couple times!









http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?278-HOWTO-Read-an-Intel-CPU-FPO-Batch-Code

Enjoy!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Surely Ivy Bridge is easier to kill with high Vcore because it has even smaller transistors?
> 
> Also, I can't find any Liquid Pro or Ultra ;_;


Nope it's not look at my max OC on page one. I did around 10 hours of OC-ing with that and benching and it eventually died trying to do 5.6 Ghz on and H100 at 0C


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nope it's not look at my max OC on page one. I did around 10 hours of OC-ing with that and benching and it eventually died trying to do 5.6 Ghz on and H100 at 0C


I keep reading the OP and I'm always missing what everyone is saying is on page 1.









Also I've found some Liquid Pro/Ultra on Aria but apparently it kills aluminium heatsinks.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> FOR EVERYONE HAVING ISSUES READING BATCH NUMBERS THIS IS HOW TO READ THEM!!!!!
> 
> Sorry I've only posted this a couple times!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?278-HOWTO-Read-an-Intel-CPU-FPO-Batch-Code
> 
> Enjoy!


Hiya Boss, whats with the shouting?? ...LOL
thanks for the link tho









G'night guys, my "dayshift" is over......


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> I keep reading the OP and I'm always missing what everyone is saying is on page 1.


Sorry I made those spoilersfor a reason... mainly because page one its incredibly long without them....









Should I change that? I'm here for you guys. not the other way around.... if you know what I mean


----------



## VonDutch

*sneaks in again for a sec*... TOLD YA!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> *sneaks in again for a sec*... TOLD YA!


Go to bed Von. Your drunk. lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Surely Ivy Bridge is easier to kill with high Vcore because it has even smaller transistors?
> 
> Also, I can't find any Liquid Pro or Ultra ;_;


Other way around Above 1.4v with Sandy your playing with fire

With Ivy that same number is somewhere between 1.55v and 1.6v Sin0822 told me to not ever go past 1.6v with out LN2.

Ivy Is almost a year old and reports of it de grading is almost nill.

2 Months after Sandys release reports of degrading were every where and still pop up till this day.


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Sorry I made those spoilersfor a reason... mainly because page one its incredibly long without them....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Should I change that? I'm here for you guys. not the other way around.... if you know what I mean


No it's fine, it's just that I only read the essentials rather than reading in detail, my fault








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Other way around Above 1.4v with Sandy your playing with fire
> 
> With Ivy that same number is somewhere between 1.55v and 1.6v Sin0822 told me to not ever go past 1.6v with out LN2.
> 
> Ivy Is almost a year old and reports of it de grading is almost nill.
> 
> 2 Months after Sandys release reports of degrading were every where and still pop up till this day.


That's... counter intuitive.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Looking into faster ram but I am too much of a ram overclocking noob to want to take that on..
> 
> ...I have this Ram:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233186
> 
> Would this be alot faster?
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231585
> 
> I noticed king was doing some latency comparisons a few pages back so hopefully this is still somewhat on the topic of the day.


If you want better ram sell yours and get the 2400 cl9 trident x kits...even at stock it will improve your all around performance, and maybe net a few more fps in game, cause of the reduced ram latency (nothing too flashy, between 5 and 15fps)


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If you want better ram sell yours and get the 2400 cl9 trident x kits...even at stock it will improve your all around performance, and maybe net a few more fps in game, cause of the reduced ram latency (nothing too flashy, between 5 and 15fps)


Not gonna spend $100+


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Not gonna spend $100+


I'm pretty happy with this Crucial RAM I bought...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148656

I run it at 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T @ 1.55v no problem at all.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Going from 1600 to 2400 in games you gain maybe at most something like 2-3 fps, benchmarks sure will give you more points if you convert videos or that kind of stuff they will shave a few seconds off. If you want to play with ram get some samsung green cheap and good.
Now if you ask me if it is worth it i would say that is spending money 1600/1866 cl9 ram is good for every day task, the only reason to get better ram is if you have money to burn or if you like to squeeze every bit of performance possible out of a system


----------



## Swag

F &^*&%^&*^(*&! I can't believe GB lost to SF! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Not gonna spend $100+


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Not gonna spend $100+
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587
Click to expand...

Don't worry, there's this kit.









http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231473


----------



## chronicfx

Why is it faster than 2400 cas 10?


----------



## Valgaur

Great we are on RAM again. lol

Since we are on RAM DDR4 will be out this year I think from my sources and the speeds will be around the 3Gighertz range and the vcore for them is freakin ridiculous.

1.2v area is what I have been hearing. So for Overclocking and havignt he same 1.65v height we currently have that would be freaking insane wouldn't it? have kits starting at 2400 Mhz and with 1.2v and then oc them to 1.65 v and get them to 3000 Mhz.... that will be amazing for benching let me tell you.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Great we are on RAM again. lol
> 
> Since we are on RAM DDR4 will be out this year I think from my sources and the speeds will be around the 3Gighertz range and the vcore for them is freakin ridiculous.
> 
> 1.2v area is what I have been hearing. So for Overclocking and havignt he same 1.65v height we currently have that would be freaking insane wouldn't it? have kits starting at 2400 Mhz and with 1.2v and then oc them to 1.65 v and get them to 3000 Mhz.... that will be amazing for benching let me tell you.


Too bad you're going to need to upgrade basically your main components. Our motherboards and CPU can't support DDR4...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Too bad you're going to need to upgrade basically your main components. Our motherboards and CPU can't support DDR4...


Thats the downside.

I WAS tryign to be happy about it. Thanks for ruining that Swag.....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Too bad you're going to need to upgrade basically your main components. Our motherboards and CPU can't support DDR4...
> 
> 
> 
> Thats the downside.
> 
> I WAS tryign to be happy about it. Thanks for ruining that Swag.....
Click to expand...

Haha! Don't worry, I'm already going to be getting Haswell.







Some of my friends want me to do a review and make a guide for overclocking for it.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587


I had those and I had the CL9 kit as well. Both of them are great sets and for $69.99 for the CL10 and $99 for the CL9 2400mhz speed they both are nice but still a little pricey. You are paying for the over clock with these.

The Sammy green 2x4GB sticks offer fantastic over clock performance for around $40. They are what I run. People are over clocking them to crazy fast speeds. I got rid of my 2400mhz Gskill kits for the sammy greens.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096

Simply can't be beat for the money. I run them 2133mhz 1T CL 911-10-24 @ 1.45v with my 3770k at 5GHZ and my system is smooth, stable and fast.


----------



## [CyGnus]

what batch are they?


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha! Don't worry, I'm already going to be getting Haswell.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some of my friends want me to do a review and make a guide for overclocking for it.


Talk of Haswell, DDR4, and AMD's Radeon HD 8000 series all in one year. Is there any point getting a 3770k + 7970 at the end of this month?


----------



## [CyGnus]

well i got mt 7870 like 1 week ago and i am happy with it, haswell will use DDR3 not DDR4 if they are 2-3 months away just wait i guess, then check prices and see how they perform.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Talk of Haswell, DDR4, and AMD's Radeon HD 8000 series all in one year. Is there any point getting a 3770k + 7970 at the end of this month?


DDr4 will be server only at the end of this year.

Main stream DDR4 will not be until Broadwell.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha! Don't worry, I'm already going to be getting Haswell.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some of my friends want me to do a review and make a guide for overclocking for it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Talk of Haswell, DDR4, and AMD's Radeon HD 8000 series all in one year. Is there any point getting a 3770k + 7970 at the end of this month?
Click to expand...

Seriously, only reason why I'm getting Haswell is because I'm getting it for half-off... My friends are going to pay half of it.







Lol, of course there's a point. Good luck to you waiting a horrible 6 months of thinking, damn I should have just got Ivy! Haswell isn't going to be performing 100% better than Ivy because Intel has no competition. It's all lax right now. When Ivy was supposed to come out, it was supposed to be 10x better than Sandy and with the new architecture, it should atleast perform 25% better but look at it? Only 10% better than Sandy! Haswell will probably be 5% - 10% better than Ivy on its respective upgrade (3770k to 4770k or 3570k to 4570k)! Although, I'd recommend waiting for the GPU. I know it may seem a while but GPUs are the one thing I'd wait for since they are normally upgraded really quickly! I haven't changed my GPU since 2009! Once I get my paycheck, first thing I'm going to buy is a new GPU on OCN MP.


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> DDr4 will be server only at the end of this year.
> 
> Main stream DDR4 will not be until Broadwell.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Seriously, only reason why I'm getting Haswell is because I'm getting it for half-off... My friends are going to pay half of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol, of course there's a point. Good luck to you waiting a horrible 6 months of thinking, damn I should have just got Ivy! Haswell isn't going to be performing 100% better than Ivy because Intel has no competition. It's all lax right now. When Ivy was supposed to come out, it was supposed to be 10x better than Sandy and with the new architecture, it should atleast perform 25% better but look at it? Only 10% better than Sandy! Haswell will probably be 5% - 10% better than Ivy on its respective upgrade (3770k to 4770k or 3570k to 4570k)! Although, I'd recommend waiting for the GPU. I know it may seem a while but GPUs are the one thing I'd wait for since they are normally upgraded really quickly! I haven't changed my GPU since 2009! Once I get my paycheck, first thing I'm going to buy is a new GPU on OCN MP.


Thanks guys









Will definitely be getting a 3770k then... But the 8000 series looks promising. I've seen the 8770m vs the 7670m (it will be replacing the7670m) and performance has increase ~ 40 to 50% so I'm torn between deciding on a GPU.









Also I will probably be too scared to delid my 3770k







I guess I'll need a thin razor and I'll be good. I got one earlier and practised on a Pentium 4 prescott (3.8 stock). I got scared and stopped.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> DDr4 will be server only at the end of this year.
> 
> Main stream DDR4 will not be until Broadwell.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Seriously, only reason why I'm getting Haswell is because I'm getting it for half-off... My friends are going to pay half of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol, of course there's a point. Good luck to you waiting a horrible 6 months of thinking, damn I should have just got Ivy! Haswell isn't going to be performing 100% better than Ivy because Intel has no competition. It's all lax right now. When Ivy was supposed to come out, it was supposed to be 10x better than Sandy and with the new architecture, it should atleast perform 25% better but look at it? Only 10% better than Sandy! Haswell will probably be 5% - 10% better than Ivy on its respective upgrade (3770k to 4770k or 3570k to 4570k)! Although, I'd recommend waiting for the GPU. I know it may seem a while but GPUs are the one thing I'd wait for since they are normally upgraded really quickly! I haven't changed my GPU since 2009! Once I get my paycheck, first thing I'm going to buy is a new GPU on OCN MP.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will definitely be getting a 3770k then... But the 8000 series looks promising. I've seen the 8770m vs the 7670m (it will be replacing the7670m) and performance has increase ~ 40 to 50% so I'm torn between deciding on a GPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also I will probably be too scared to delid my 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess I'll need a thin razor and I'll be good. I got one earlier and practised on a Pentium 4 prescott (3.8 stock). I got scared and stopped.
Click to expand...

Pain is weakness leaving the body. Fear is pain. Do you want to be weak the rest of your life? Answer that!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> what batch are they?


Hyko Samsung 2x4GB kit from 12/29 batch.


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Pain is weakness leaving the body. Fear is pain. Do you want to be weak the rest of your life? Answer that!


Pistols at dawn?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Those 1 in a million 5.5ghz Sandy Chips that people all killed off in afew months with 1.45v? Sandy can not take any type of V core it dies very fast.


It can take the voltage, but have to run it cool. My 59x 2600k is still fine & rarely run under 1.58V, but it has never seen a 60° load temp before, usually somewhere under 0° (single stage is perfect for sandy).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Surely Ivy Bridge is easier to kill with high Vcore because it has even smaller transistors?
> 
> Also, I can't find any Liquid Pro or Ultra ;_;


Much harder to kill ivy. I've killed a sandy at 1.4V vcore before, testing memory found out the hard way not to try 1.25V on the IMC with a 2500k, ivy laughs at high vcore & 1.25V IMC.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Not gonna spend $100+


It kills me when people spend hundreds on watercooling to squeeze another 100 or 200 Mhz out of a cpu to run 1600mhz memory. May not help much for gaming (it does help anything crunching numbers), bit it is still the pursuit of performance...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Great we are on RAM again. lol
> 
> Since we are on RAM DDR4 will be out this year I think from my sources and the speeds will be around the 3Gighertz range and the vcore for them is freakin ridiculous.
> 
> 1.2v area is what I have been hearing. So for Overclocking and havignt he same 1.65v height we currently have that would be freaking insane wouldn't it? have kits starting at 2400 Mhz and with 1.2v and then oc them to 1.65 v and get them to 3000 Mhz.... that will be amazing for benching let me tell you.


Kits can hit 3000Mhz now, will be exciting to see what ddr4 can bring to the table!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Pain is weakness leaving the body. Fear is pain. Do you want to be weak the rest of your life? Answer that!
> 
> 
> 
> Pistols at dawn?
Click to expand...

I actually got it from "This Means War".


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Hyko Samsung 2x4GB kit from 12/29 batch.


mine are 12/14 i can only hit 2133 at 9-10-10 at 9-9-9 wont boot at all...


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I actually got it from "This Means War".


I was challenging you to pistols at dawn. 20 paces, on the 'morrow, choose your second.

My second shall be my trusty Athlon 64 x2.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I actually got it from "This Means War".
> 
> 
> 
> I was challenging you to pistols at dawn. 20 paces, on the 'morrow, choose your second.
> 
> My second shall be my trusty Athlon 64 x2.
Click to expand...

Oh, there I go being clueless.







How about real pistol at dawn.







Just like how the forefathers fought! And I mean we use muskets!


----------



## stickg1

Wait when is haswell being released?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Wait when is haswell being released?


Q3 2013


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Q3 2013


I'm guessing around mid to late july.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> mine are 12/14 i can only hit 2133 at 9-10-10 at 9-9-9 wont boot at all...


I tried a few different Samsung green kits before I found these which were the best performers of 4 different kits that I tried over the last year. 12/29 is a good batch. I have seen others do well with kits from this batch.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm guessing around mid to late july.


I wonder if I should just keep my busted 1.4v Ivy until then and sell the brand new one? IDK, I don't think I can live with 4.5GHz, I'm sure someone on eBay could though...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I wonder if I should just keep my busted 1.4v Ivy until then and sell the brand new one? IDK, I don't think I can live with 4.5GHz, I'm sure someone on eBay could though...


Why do you need more than 4.5?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I wonder if I should just keep my busted 1.4v Ivy until then and sell the brand new one? IDK, I don't think I can live with 4.5GHz, I'm sure someone on eBay could though...


i cant live with 4.8 i just want 5ghz stable lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Why do you need more than 4.5?


No logical reason.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587
> 
> 
> 
> I had those and I had the CL9 kit as well. Both of them are great sets and for $69.99 for the CL10 and $99 for the CL9 2400mhz speed they both are nice but still a little pricey. You are paying for the over clock with these.
> 
> The Sammy green 2x4GB sticks offer fantastic over clock performance for around $40. They are what I run. People are over clocking them to crazy fast speeds. I got rid of my 2400mhz Gskill kits for the sammy greens.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147096
> 
> Simply can't be beat for the money. I run them 2133mhz 1T CL 9-9-9-24 @ 1.45v with my 3770k at 5GHZ and my system is smooth, stable and fast.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> mine are 12/14 i can only hit 2133 at 9-10-10 at 9-9-9 wont boot at all...
> 
> 
> 
> I tried a few different Samsung green kits before I found these which were the best performers of 4 different kits that I tried over the last year. 12/29 is a good batch. I have seen others do well with kits from this batch.
Click to expand...

*SonDa5*, Sammy greens look like they come without heatsinks. Do you run that way even when OCed, or do you have add some heatsinks to them?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> No logical reason.


lol. as long as it's the pursuit of performance I suppose but if you don't have any warranties on your chip and it's OC'ed already, and you don't need the performance boost then why do you need the newest chip? If you aren't full utilizing the performance of it then why waste money upgrading to the newest platform from an already amazing platfrom. yes 4.5 isn't amazing but it does everything you could ever need does it not?

Along with that I understand it being a new build and starting off and such and with that i agree get the best you can for the money to make it last and perform beautifully, but to upgrade it all doesn't seem right. just for around 12% boosts.

Now if your just going to replace the i5 or i7 you have in the IKvy family and try for a better one then by all means go for it.

Maybe I'm confused as well lol. No idea after 3 hours of political science homework.... SO BORING


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Great we are on RAM again. lol
> 
> Since we are on RAM DDR4 will be out this year I think from my sources and the speeds will be around the 3Gighertz range and the vcore for them is freakin ridiculous.
> 
> 1.2v area is what I have been hearing. So for Overclocking and havignt he same 1.65v height we currently have that would be freaking insane wouldn't it? have kits starting at 2400 Mhz and with 1.2v and then oc them to 1.65 v and get them to 3000 Mhz.... that will be amazing for benching let me tell you.


Hokies beat me to it...and they are starting at 2133mhz 1.25v or so.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It can take the voltage, but have to run it cool. My 59x 2600k is still fine & rarely run under 1.58V, but it has never seen a 60° load temp before, usually somewhere under 0° (single stage is perfect for sandy).
> Much harder to kill ivy. I've killed a sandy at 1.4V vcore before, testing memory found out the hard way not to try 1.25V on the IMC with a 2500k, ivy laughs at high vcore & 1.25V IMC.
> It kills me when people spend hundreds on watercooling to squeeze another 100 or 200 Mhz out of a cpu to run 1600mhz memory. May not help much for gaming (it does help anything crunching numbers), bit it is still the pursuit of performance...
> Kits can hit 3000Mhz now, will be exciting to see what ddr4 can bring to the table!


Phase is epic win...or a water chiller perhaps.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> mine are 12/14 i can only hit 2133 at 9-10-10 at 9-9-9 wont boot at all...


Not all of them oc that good, that's why I reccomended the Trident X 2400mhz cl9 (cl10 ain't bad either)
Stock clocks on those WILL outperform 2133mhz cl9 Samsung greens, not sure why Sonda ditched those really.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol. as long as it's the pursuit of performance I suppose but if you don't have any warranties on your chip and it's OC'ed already, and you don't need the performance boost then why do you need the newest chip? If you aren't full utilizing the performance of it then why waste money upgrading to the newest platform from an already amazing platfrom. yes 4.5 isn't amazing but it does everything you could ever need does it not?
> 
> Along with that I understand it being a new build and starting off and such and with that i agree get the best you can for the money to make it last and perform beautifully, but to upgrade it all doesn't seem right. just for around 12% boosts.
> 
> Now if your just going to replace the i5 or i7 you have in the IKvy family and try for a better one then by all means go for it.
> 
> Maybe I'm confused as well lol. No idea after 3 hours of political science homework.... SO BORING


lol You drunk bro?
I'd upgrade if I managed to sell my z77 platform stuff and not end up losing money (which I'll probably will manage to do hehe:thumb


----------



## Kolt21

I cant find CL Liquid Pro ANYWHERE at a reasonable price.

6.99 Newegg.com (Discontinued)

18.99 Amazon

FrozenCpu - 13.99 + 1 million dollars shipping

CL Website - 5 million dollars shipping

ebay - never heard of liquid pro

techbargains - never heard of liquid pro

slickdeals - never heard of liquid pro

Doubleyouteeeff.

I wont pay those rediculous shipping prices. Amazon looks high but with free shipping its right on par with frozen cpu and cl website.

Why did newegg discontinue?

For the best die thermal ever... you would think it would be... I dont know available somewhere?

QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ

I just want to delid damnit.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol. as long as it's the pursuit of performance I suppose but if you don't have any warranties on your chip and it's OC'ed already, and you don't need the performance boost then why do you need the newest chip? If you aren't full utilizing the performance of it then why waste money upgrading to the newest platform from an already amazing platfrom. yes 4.5 isn't amazing but it does everything you could ever need does it not?
> 
> Along with that I understand it being a new build and starting off and such and with that i agree get the best you can for the money to make it last and perform beautifully, but to upgrade it all doesn't seem right. just for around 12% boosts.
> 
> Now if your just going to replace the i5 or i7 you have in the IKvy family and try for a better one then by all means go for it.
> 
> Maybe I'm confused as well lol. No idea after 3 hours of political science homework.... SO BORING


I upgrade every generation.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I cant find CL Liquid Pro ANYWHERE at a reasonable price.
> 
> 6.99 Newegg.com (Discontinued)
> 
> 18.99 Amazon
> 
> FrozenCpu - 13.99 + 1 million dollars shipping
> 
> CL Website - 5 million dollars shipping
> 
> ebay - never heard of liquid pro
> 
> techbargains - never heard of liquid pro
> 
> slickdeals - never heard of liquid pro
> 
> Doubleyouteeeff.
> 
> I wont pay those rediculous shipping prices. Amazon looks high but with free shipping its right on par with frozen cpu and cl website.
> 
> Why did newegg discontinue?
> 
> For the best die thermal ever... you would think it would be... I dont know available somewhere?
> 
> QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ
> 
> I just want to delid damnit.


www.sidewindercomputers.com
Free shipping within the US, stocks Ultra and Pro for 11usd or so.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I upgrade every generation.


Me too, I lose money when stuff becomes old otherwise...


----------



## Hokies83

LoL ya what ppl do not understand if u upgrade every gen you can sometimes almost break even.. or have very little into it.

You wait 2-3 generations your gonna be into it 300$-400$

Every gen it is 100 - 150$


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL ya what ppl do not understand if u upgrade every gen you can sometimes almost break even.. or have very little into it.
> 
> You wait 2-3 generations your gonna be into it 300$-400$
> 
> Every gen it is 100 - 150$


Exactly! You tell them bro








It's an investment, like buying a new car, it will lose value once it's older...

I actually earn money when I upgrade cause of the price differences lmao


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> www.sidewindercomputers.com
> Free shipping within the US, stocks Ultra and Pro for 11usd or so.
> Me too, I lose money when stuff becomes old otherwise...


I wanted to link that... but noooo my internet didnt want me too -.-

Hmmm.... might upgrade but only if the performance gians are really worth it.

I don't want speculations I will wait for it to come out and be tested chip to chip.

Dont care about it now either so don't through charts my way hokies


----------



## ivanlabrie

Valgaur likes losing money!








Sell your current crap mobo in fleabay to someone in Sri Lanka and get a 4770k


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Valgaur likes losing money!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sell your current crap mobo in fleabay to someone in Sri Lanka and get a 4770k


lol

After 30K into aviation classes.... yeah you see 100 bucks as almost a scarf really. I burned 1.5 grand in 3 hours of flying one day..... changed my money viewpoint lol.

But yes I understand the upgrade area just don't wanna think about it now is all. I just want to enjoy my components for now. Hence me naming my CPU lol.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL ya what ppl do not understand if u upgrade every gen you can sometimes almost break even.. or have very little into it.
> 
> You wait 2-3 generations your gonna be into it 300$-400$
> 
> Every gen it is 100 - 150$


Yes, exactly! People tell me I spend all my money on my computer...
Going from two 6850's to a single 7950 costed me along the lines of $60. That is defiantly worth it for less power/heat alone.
I don't plan on going Haswell so far.. Unless I do sell this entire rig off to someone then re-build a new rig.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Exactly! You tell them bro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's an investment, like buying a new car, it will lose value once it's older...
> 
> I actually earn money when I upgrade cause of the price differences lmao


Pretty much, I can't afford a new car though or even one thats a couple of years old








My theory for that is just use something thats older, as long as it goes from A to B.









As for the guy who was complaining about the CL shipping prices: I thought they were quite good? It was like $6 to Australia for me...? I can't even get it anywhere else so yeah.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> www.sidewindercomputers.com
> Free shipping within the US, stocks Ultra and Pro for 11usd or so.
> Me too, I lose money when stuff becomes old otherwise...


I should do this but can rarely talk myself into selling things so I end up hoarding it all. It does come in handy for future competitions & stuff but everything starts to stack up.
Guess it is good for troubleshooting at least, I can pretty much change out every component on any platform I have to test...


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, what do you guys think about the rear fan in my case?

Should I take out the rear fan? I was reading up on the NH-D14 and several people were saying that the rear fan doesn't do anything with lower temps when you have the NH-D14.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, what do you guys think about the rear fan in my case?
> 
> Should I take out the rear fan? I was reading up on the NH-D14 and several people were saying that the rear fan doesn't do anything with lower temps when you have the NH-D14.


I took mine out and it makes less noise now. The back fan barely pushed any air though compared to the HS/F's fans. Another thing to mention is it will make the rear fan wear out faster as it is being forced air. (Pressure).

There is really no point, you'll probably get a temperature drop by taking it out and even if you don't it'll be a 1c rise in temps at the most. You'd be better off mounting the fan on the back of the graphics card to draw the hot air out.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol
> 
> After 30K into aviation classes.... yeah you see 100 bucks as almost a scarf really. I burned 1.5 grand in 3 hours of flying one day..... changed my money viewpoint lol.
> 
> But yes I understand the upgrade area just don't wanna think about it now is all. I just want to enjoy my components for now. Hence me naming my CPU lol.


30k man, that's like double what I earn in a year lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I should do this but can rarely talk myself into selling things so I end up hoarding it all. It does come in handy for future competitions & stuff but everything starts to stack up.
> Guess it is good for troubleshooting at least, I can pretty much change out every component on any platform I have to test...


If you don't end up broke, why not?
I have very little space, I only collect ddr3 and buy or get borrowed stuff for benching.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, what do you guys think about the rear fan in my case?
> 
> Should I take out the rear fan? I was reading up on the NH-D14 and several people were saying that the rear fan doesn't do anything with lower temps when you have the NH-D14.


I'd take your rear case fan and attach it to the D14, but only after removing the rear exhaust fan grill...if you don't it won't move much air through it if at all.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol
> 
> After 30K into aviation classes.... yeah you see 100 bucks as almost a scarf really. I burned 1.5 grand in 3 hours of flying one day..... changed my money viewpoint lol.
> 
> But yes I understand the upgrade area just don't wanna think about it now is all. I just want to enjoy my components for now. Hence me naming my CPU lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 30k man, that's like double what I earn in a year lol
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I should do this but can rarely talk myself into selling things so I end up hoarding it all. It does come in handy for future competitions & stuff but everything starts to stack up.
> Guess it is good for troubleshooting at least, I can pretty much change out every component on any platform I have to test...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you don't end up broke, why not?
> I have very little space, I only collect ddr3 and buy or get borrowed stuff for benching.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, what do you guys think about the rear fan in my case?
> 
> Should I take out the rear fan? I was reading up on the NH-D14 and several people were saying that the rear fan doesn't do anything with lower temps when you have the NH-D14.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'd take your rear case fan and attach it to the D14, but only after removing the rear exhaust fan grill...if you don't it won't move much air through it if at all.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought, thanks guys!







I hate that rear fan, I already took it out of my C70 before I'm even going to start transferring my stuff in it.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 30k man, that's like double what I earn in a year lol
> If you don't end up broke, why not?


Really? I know this shouldn't be said but my parents were getting ~$30,000 a year from "Centrelink", being a Uni Student (Once I go) I'll be on about ~$11,000 a year for studying. Albeit most of that will go into food/rent/petrol/car services and such.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Really? I know this shouldn't be said but my parents were getting ~$30,000 a year from "Centrelink", being a Uni Student (Once I go) I'll be on about ~$11,000 a year for studying. Albeit most of that will go into food/rent/petrol/car services and such.


I'm in Argentina, a dollar equals 5 pesos. Plus everything but tech is cheaper here, which sucks! I'd rather have cheap hardware and not eat that much









I was wondering, I have two 220cfm 5300rpm fans...If I place them as bottom case exhausts on the floor of my cm 692, will it levitate? lol
Off to bed...ttyl guys


----------



## Belial

Cheapest place to get Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra right now is frozencpu and their 5.1% off coupon (ocn at checkout), depending on shipping, but including shipping, at least for me, it's cheapest. Amazon sometimes has it cheaper, but not right now.

Ebay has the coollaboratory liquids sometimes, go to 'completed listings' and you'll see. Right now no one is listing them on ebay, but they are usually up there.

I need some help picking out ram. I missed out on some great deals so now I'm stuck without any ram. I am just looking for 2x2gb RAM (please don't tell me '8gb is so cheap', yea, okay, id rather have CLU/CLP and 4gb of RAM than 8gb of ram that would never be utilized). I've heard a bit about samsungs, but i dont know anything about that... ram is so confusing, it being based on the ICs rather than the RAM. What would be good ram to buy?

I mean i was considering just the cheapest 1.5v CL9 or better 2x2gb ram, but considering the choices on the egg, i was wondering if any of the ram would be significantly better for slightly cheaper or anything like that (hey, I could buy $40 4gb of ram instead of $40 8gb slow ram).

Thanks.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Cheapest place to get Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra right now is frozencpu and their 5.1% off coupon (ocn at checkout), depending on shipping, but including shipping, at least for me, it's cheapest. Amazon sometimes has it cheaper, but not right now.
> 
> Ebay has the coollaboratory liquids sometimes, go to 'completed listings' and you'll see. Right now no one is listing them on ebay, but they are usually up there.
> 
> I need some help picking out ram. I missed out on some great deals so now I'm stuck without any ram. I am just looking for 2x2gb RAM (please don't tell me '8gb is so cheap', yea, okay, id rather have CLU/CLP and 4gb of RAM than 8gb of ram that would never be utilized). I've heard a bit about samsungs, but i dont know anything about that... ram is so confusing, it being based on the ICs rather than the RAM. What would be good ram to buy?
> 
> I mean i was considering just the cheapest 1.5v CL9 or better 2x2gb ram, but considering the choices on the egg, i was wondering if any of the ram would be significantly better for slightly cheaper or anything like that (hey, I could buy $40 4gb of ram instead of $40 8gb slow ram).
> 
> Thanks.


You want fast ram, and cheap...

Get these. You get a spare 2gb stick in case the pair you use dies or something, or if you need more than 4gb








Those have really good ic's, psc or bbse, they are the fastest out there, specially if you overclock them to 2400mhz cl8.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You want fast ram, and cheap...
> 
> Get these. You get a spare 2gb stick in case the pair you use dies or something, or if you need more than 4gb
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those have really good ic's, psc or bbse, they are the fastest out there, specially if you overclock them to 2400mhz cl8.


$25 shipped is pretty good for that kit, probably PSC judging by the 6-8-6 (I was recently eyeballing a mushkin 1600 6-7-6 bbse kit). Should do well, 2400 c9 under 1.7V at least.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> $25 shipped is pretty good for that kit, probably PSC judging by the 6-8-6 (I was recently eyeballing a mushkin 1600 6-7-6 bbse kit). Should do well, 2400 c9 under 1.7V at least.


LoL got pics of all this crazy stuff you have?

And do u have a quick list of all the hardware u got lol..

I know u have like 5 3770ks....


----------



## King4x4

Hey Hookies I like your PCs name...fitting name indeed.... Thinking of Naming mine "Hydra - Devourer of Visheras" since I smacked one noob AMD owner when he came bragging about LN2 making his FX-8350 into god mode or some crap.... Asked him to fire up Cinebench...

Long story short... 6Ghz Fishera (That name is fitting LOL) on LN2 getting eaten alive by a [email protected] 4.7ghz... Oh god the flaming that occured afterwards... Bumped it on my suicidal run 5ghz and gave him a


----------



## Belial

Rep'd. Thanks guys, I pmd the guy. Would those ram be better than the crucial ballstix tactical tracers at 1600 CL8 1.5v that I was eyeing earlier? I can't tell with this ram stuff what's worse or better.

I mean I have the ram in my profile, I just tightened them 2 steps (133mhz cl9 1.5v to 1333mhz cl7 1.6166vdimm). how are people reaching 2k mhz and such on ram?

on a side note isn't there some thing where with ram you can't push them too far on intel systems because it'll fry out the cpu? what's up with that?

I mean ram is so cheap, I'd be perfectly okay pushing the limit of ram (as i understand it, the limit volts on most ram is 1.7-1.8v) and oops, burnt out the ram, not a big deal, buy more for $20. But I dont want to damage the cpu, with my phenom ii build there wasnt any issue doing this.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL got pics of all this crazy stuff you have?
> 
> And do u have a quick list of all the hardware u got lol..
> 
> I know u have like 5 3770ks....


Just counting cpus, looks like 27 altogether, various amd, 775, 1366 , 1155 & 1 x 2011.

Some memory from later last year, I've added 6 more kits since then (3 dual kits & 3 triple kits of various PSC & BBSE)









A shot of the hardware racks, added at least 4 new boards & 6 more gpus since it was taken (a couple rigs weren't in the pic)









Some cooling for subzero that needs no ln2 or DICE, just have to plug it in & get overclocking.
cascade (gets to ~ -106°)









-40° single stage on the cpu & -15° single stage on the gpu









Quick list of the hardware wouldn't be very quick...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL got pics of all this crazy stuff you have?
> 
> And do u have a quick list of all the hardware u got lol..
> 
> I know u have like 5 3770ks....
> 
> 
> 
> Just counting cpus, looks like 27 altogether, various amd, 775, 1366 , 1155 & 1 x 2011.
> 
> Some memory from later last year, I've added 6 more kits since then (3 dual kits & 3 triple kits of various PSC & BBSE)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A shot of the hardware racks, added at least 4 new boards & 6 more gpus since it was taken (a couple rigs weren't in the pic)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some cooling for subzero that needs no ln2 or DICE, just have to plug it in & get overclocking.
> cascade (gets to ~ -106°)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -40° single stage on the cpu & -15° single stage on the gpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quick list of the hardware wouldn't be very quick...
Click to expand...


----------



## King4x4

I am jelly


----------



## Hokies83

Hmm i could see keeping the Boards cpus ram mbs around..

But you should sell your old Gpus









LoL looks like ill be adding *xspc res pump* Having an Extra pump and res for a big loop never hurts .. really when it is only 35$ lol


----------



## King4x4

Or he can put a nasty Swiftech Malesrtom with dual MCP35x2 pumps and just get rid of any other pump in the loop.

The one I have is working at 15% PWM and it's death silent!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just counting cpus, looks like 27 altogether, various amd, 775, 1366 , 1155 & 1 x 2011.
> 
> Some memory from later last year, I've added 6 more kits since then (3 dual kits & 3 triple kits of various PSC & BBSE)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A shot of the hardware racks, added at least 4 new boards & 6 more gpus since it was taken (a couple rigs weren't in the pic)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some cooling for subzero that needs no ln2 or DICE, just have to plug it in & get overclocking.
> cascade (gets to ~ -106°)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -40° single stage on the cpu & -15° single stage on the gpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quick list of the hardware wouldn't be very quick...


howd you pay for all that?

I want tons of hardware for benching liek that as well.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmm i could see keeping the Boards cpus ram mbs around..
> 
> But you should sell your old Gpus
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LoL looks like ill be adding *xspc res pump* Having an Extra pump and res for a big loop never hurts .. really when it is only 35$ lol


Problem is, every time a new cpu that does better & goes faster comes out, the gpus can be benched again for better points. There are also competitions with old hardware all the time where it can be used. I still have a few cards that haven't been benched yet.

Oddly enough, I still use an old 6800gt almost as much as the 680s & 7970s. Hardware gets to be like old friends...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Problem is, every time a new cpu that does better & goes faster comes out, the gpus can be benched again for better points. There are also competitions with old hardware all the time where it can be used. I still have a few cards that haven't been benched yet.
> 
> Oddly enough, I still use an old 6800gt almost as much as the 680s & 7970s. Hardware gets to be like old friends...


Thats my mind thought on my rig honestly. I'm relly happy I'm getting Franky back. Then I can get a necklace or something made from the IHS.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> howd you pay for all that?
> 
> I want tons of hardware for benching liek that as well.


Money trees!
I've won a fair bit of hardware & cash in benching competitions, for gpus I'm always looking on craigslist, some sellers there do understand depreciation & sell for normal prices.
I spend too much on hardware, but I'm bad with money & I know it, so at least with new hardware I have something to show for it after the weekend. I gotta have something to do when I'm supposed to be working & messing around with PC is something I enjoy.


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> www.sidewindercomputers.com
> Free shipping within the US, stocks Ultra and Pro for 11usd or so.
> Me too, I lose money when stuff becomes old otherwise...


15.99 + shipping.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Money trees!
> I've won a fair bit of hardware & cash in benching competitions, for gpus I'm always looking on craigslist, some sellers there do understand depreciation & sell for normal prices.
> I spend too much on hardware, but I'm bad with money & I know it, so at least with new hardware I have something to show for it after the weekend. I gotta have something to do when I'm supposed to be working & messing around with PC is something I enjoy.


Thats how I feel and thats why this summer I really wanna get some good boints and get back into it with you guys.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> www.sidewindercomputers.com
> Free shipping within the US, stocks Ultra and Pro for 11usd or so.
> Me too, I lose money when stuff becomes old otherwise...
> 
> 
> 
> 15.99 + shipping.
Click to expand...

Where do you live?


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Where do you live?


montana


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Money trees!
> I've won a fair bit of hardware & cash in benching competitions, for gpus I'm always looking on craigslist, some sellers there do understand depreciation & sell for normal prices.
> I spend too much on hardware, but I'm bad with money & I know it, so at least with new hardware I have something to show for it after the weekend. I gotta have something to do when I'm supposed to be working & messing around with PC is something I enjoy.


where can you compete in benching competitions?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> where can you compete in benching competitions?


go to OCN main page and look at the banner.

Missouri meet right FtW? Mopars venue and I still really wanna go. even though I wont have the best equipment but I still wanna try it!

Also there are online events as well. You can submit stuff at any time basically. But they have to be good to the rules and such.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> go to OCN main page and look at the banner.
> 
> Missouri meet right FtW? Mopars venue and I still really wanna go. even though I wont have the best equipment but I still wanna try it!
> 
> Also there are online events as well. You can submit stuff at any time basically. But they have to be good to the rules and such.


For me mostly online hwbot competitions for prizes. I don't win prizes in the OCN online bench competitions anymore (benchmarks editor now), but I used to get monthly prizes in them.
At the last OCN Grand Champion Series meet in Toronto there were great prizes, won enough to keep me in liquid nitrogen & hardware for a while. The rigs to bench on were even supplied there, one of the guys there for the lan grabbed an empty seat & got right into the ln2 benching for the first time, forgot all about the lan side ( think it was axipher?).
On a side note, playing with the last memory kit I got (2000Mhz 6-9-6 kit), finally found one that can do 2400Mhz 7-11-7 at 1.7V or less, will be fun to get it cold! (but I gotta shoot for 2600Mhz on air first...)


----------



## VonDutch

hey FtW 420









saw you talking about super pi etc,
just did a 32M run with my daily 4.7ghz oc, is it any good like this?
nice, bad, sell your comp? ..lol



-3C outside, my 6C idle looks good ...lol

just found this "old" 5.2ghz super pi, 1M tho
so i could push more, maybe a 5.3ghz max idk yet..


edit,
is running super pi any good for stability testing?
o, and is ramspeed very important to get good scores?
more then cpu speed i mean


----------



## King4x4

You need to up the speed on that ram!


----------



## Belial

http://www.overclock.net/t/1347337/fs-g-skill-2x2gb-ddr3-kit-crucial-2x2gb-ddr3/0_100
G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600MHz CL9 1.5V RAM, 2x2GB kit.
$15 shipped (does that mean including shipping?)

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
30nm
He's saying $40 for 2 of these kits, so he could maybe do $20 for one kit.... assuming he could, would this be better than the other choices?

Would either of these perform better than those mushkin radioactive?

How do they compare to those Crucial Tactical Ballistix Tracer 1600 CL8 1.5v?

my indecision is holding me back tt. i just need ram and psu to get my 3570k build going (will probably go with $29 cx500, maybe $39 rosewill green 630w... cx500 [email protected] should be enough for 3570 + 460 SLI all heavily overvolted to limits though... which im not doing yet and id worry about in the far future anywyas)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> You need to up the speed on that ram!


my ram .... to oc to higher speeds, only got it to 1866mhz once,
i tried several times with guidance from ivan and others here,
saving money for 2600mhz, when i have the money,
i will be back asking you guys what i should buy


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, I just dishwashed my keyboard, how long should I let it dry?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, I just dishwashed my keyboard, how long should I let it dry?


till its dry? ....LOL









takes only a few minutes tho, if you put it in a dryer


----------



## King4x4

Upside down outside for at least three days.

Then pray it works LOL!


----------



## Valgaur

Von. With Superpi and 32m and 1m runs you need good CPU and great RAM. so better RAM clocks wil help you out quiet a bit really in the 2D benching world. thats why I kept beating my Franky up...... that sounds wrong.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> what batch are they?


Sorry... I made a mistake. I thought they were at 9-9-9-24 1T with 1.45v on the Dram. They are at [email protected] 1.45dram voltage. I just tweaked them to 2200mhz CL 9-11-10-24 with 1.5vDRAM.

http://valid.canardpc.com/2652370

I think the MB BIOS is holding them back.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, I just dishwashed my keyboard, how long should I let it dry?


that's a terrible idea... why would you do that to a ducky ;/

You should give it an IPA rinse, stick it in a tub using 2 large bottles of 91% IPA, then give it a day or two. The water from the dishwasher isn't all going to dry out, even in front of a space heater.

This is coming from someone who just spilled mineral oil all over their ducky and still can't get the liquids out of it.


----------



## King4x4

SonDa5 I just noticed that you have no IHS in your sig... made any major difference in the temperature between no ihs and ihs?


----------



## Swag

I've done this before and it has always worked but I used to have a spare keyboard that I used and would forget the Ducky for about a month. Now since I sold that and only have my ducky, I hate this membrane keyboard and I want it ASAP!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey FtW 420
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> saw you talking about super pi etc,
> just did a 32M run with my daily 4.7ghz oc, is it any good like this?
> nice, bad, sell your comp? ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> -3C outside, my 6C idle looks good ...lol
> 
> just found this "old" 5.2ghz super pi, 1M tho
> so i could push more, maybe a 5.3ghz max idk yet..
> 
> 
> edit,
> is running super pi any good for stability testing?
> o, and is ramspeed very important to get good scores?
> more then cpu speed i mean


Not just the comp, a lot of it is the cooler. But many people have spent more on watercooling than I did on the phase, been running it all day from 5.3 to 5.6. Tried running IBT at 5.4ghz for a while but keeps stopping at the 6th loop, can't figure out which voltage it wants more or less of.
Superpi 32m is good for a quick test of memory stability, & ram speed/timings do make a difference in it. Only a few milliseconds in 1m, seconds in 32m. Benching superpi is like the olympics, milliseconds can make the difference between 1st & 50th place.
Cpu speed is generally better, but if the memory sucks & using the wrong OS people tweaking their system can do better with lower clockspeed

You can always check hwbot, just type 3770k in the search & then compare results in the different benchmarks with other 3770ks, page 24 is getting around the 4700Mhz speeds (dumo near the top, 4500mhz with fast ram beating others clocked higher)
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/superpi_-_32m/rankings?hardwareTypeId=processor_2493#start=260#interval=20


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Sorry... I made a mistake. I thought they were at 9-9-9-24 1T with 1.45v on the Dram. They are at [email protected] 1.45dram voltage. I just tweaked them to 2200mhz CL 9-11-10-24 with 1.5vDRAM.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2652370
> 
> I think the MB BIOS is holding them back.


Thanks for the info will try 2200 on mine too









PS: It worked i am with 1.51v though at 9-11-10-28 1T just changed the 10 in the middle for the 11 and give 2200MHz a go


----------



## Notion

lol.. that is next on my shopping list


----------



## Belial

http://www.overclock.net/t/1347337/fs-g-skill-2x2gb-ddr3-kit-crucial-2x2gb-ddr3/0_100
G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600MHz CL9 1.5V RAM, 2x2GB kit.
$15 shipped (does that mean including shipping?)

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
30nm
$20

http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Ballistix-Tactical-DDR3-1600-BLT2CP2G3D1608DT1TX0/dp/B006YG9A6Y/ref=sr_1_13?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358153459&sr=1-13&keywords=2gbx2+ddr3+ram
Crucial Ballistix Tactical 1600 CL8 1.5v 2x2
$23

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226123
Muskin Enhanced Ridgebacks 1600 CL6 1.65v
$20

http://www.overclock.net/t/1349191/lga-1366-system-asus-rampage-formula-iii-i7-950-mushkin-3-2gb-6gb/0_100
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226173
Mushkin Radioactive 1600 CL6 1.65v
$20

So... which of these ram are the best? I mean the ripjaws at $15 is the cheapest but I heard samsung is supposed to be really good? And then there's a bunch of super high end ram I think in this collection, would any be worth paying more for? It doesnt sound like the G Skills for $15 are special while there are 3 rams at $20 that seem pretty good... and then the crucial $23, lower specd but i dont know what IC it uses.

Thanks.... i cant figure out what ram to get, since it's 2nd hard prices go out the window and hard to figure out what's the best value.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not just the comp, a lot of it is the cooler. But many people have spent more on watercooling than I did on the phase, been running it all day from 5.3 to 5.6. Tried running IBT at 5.4ghz for a while but keeps stopping at the 6th loop, can't figure out which voltage it wants more or less of.
> Superpi 32m is good for a quick test of memory stability, & ram speed/timings do make a difference in it. Only a few milliseconds in 1m, seconds in 32m. Benching superpi is like the olympics, milliseconds can make the difference between 1st & 50th place.
> Cpu speed is generally better, but if the memory sucks & using the wrong OS people tweaking their system can do better with lower clockspeed
> 
> You can always check hwbot, just type 3770k in the search & then compare results in the different benchmarks with other 3770ks, page 24 is getting around the 4700Mhz speeds (dumo near the top, 4500mhz with fast ram beating others clocked higher)
> http://hwbot.org/benchmark/superpi_-_32m/rankings?hardwareTypeId=processor_2493#start=260#interval=20


cool thanks








man, im not even close to something nice, somewhere 200-300 ranking ...lol
must be very hard to get in the top, didnt even know about these things before i joined OCN,
how are you doing in that "olympic" world?
"Superpi 32m is good for a quick test", nice to know you can use super pi for this too, its faster and easier to use then memtest right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Von. With Superpi and 32m and 1m runs you need good CPU and great RAM. so better RAM clocks wil help you out quiet a bit really in the 2D benching world. thats why I kept beating my Franky up...... that sounds wrong.


i like a challenge, but looks like my comp .... to do anything like that,
im not afraid to run high oc's, and high vcores, but even then im nowhere close to a nice ranking looks like,
i need new ram first, giving the ram i have now to my kids...


----------



## Swag

My Ducky is now up and running! It survived the dishwasher!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1347337/fs-g-skill-2x2gb-ddr3-kit-crucial-2x2gb-ddr3/0_100
> G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600MHz CL9 1.5V RAM, 2x2GB kit.
> $15 shipped (does that mean including shipping?)
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
> SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
> 30nm
> $20
> http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Ballistix-Tactical-DDR3-1600-BLT2CP2G3D1608DT1TX0/dp/B006YG9A6Y/ref=sr_1_13?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358153459&sr=1-13&keywords=2gbx2+ddr3+ram
> Crucial Ballistix Tactical 1600 CL8 1.5v 2x2
> $23
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226123
> Muskin Enhanced Ridgebacks 1600 CL6 1.65v
> $20
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1349191/lga-1366-system-asus-rampage-formula-iii-i7-950-mushkin-3-2gb-6gb/0_100
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226173
> Mushkin Radioactive 1600 CL6 1.65v
> $20
> So... which of these ram are the best? I mean the ripjaws at $15 is the cheapest but I heard samsung is supposed to be really good? And then there's a bunch of super high end ram I think in this collection, would any be worth paying more for? It doesnt sound like the G Skills for $15 are special while there are 3 rams at $20 that seem pretty good... and then the crucial $23, lower specd but i dont know what IC it uses.
> Thanks.... i cant figure out what ram to get, since it's 2nd hard prices go out the window and hard to figure out what's the best value.


guess for the most part it depends what you gonna do with your ram,
if you want to start benching, then its important,
but for daily usage,. like me, i dont think it matters much what you run,
of what i hear here, 1600mhz with nice timings would be good enough for that..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My Ducky is now up and running! It survived the dishwasher!


haha..great







WB!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My Ducky is now up and running! It survived the dishwasher!
> 
> 
> 
> haha..great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WB!
Click to expand...

It actually feels so much better now. I added o-rings too (50A). The clicky tactileness of it is still there but without much of the sound. I like how it doesn't hurt the bottoming out too.







I can't want for my next Ducky which is Winter 2013! Too many keyboards if you ask me!


----------



## VonDutch

i hate my keyboard, was a bad buy if you ask me,
Microsoft wireless 1000...wireless, really, if my kids are here, my youngest i got him a ipad 4,
if hes here, i almost have to tape the wireless thingy to my keyboard to have a good connection ..lol,
not really wireless that way haha,
the logitech i had before tihs one was way better, could go to the kitchen with it, and still type from like -5-6 meters away..
hmm, my wishlist is growing again,
2400-2600mhz ram,
new keyboard


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i hate my keyboard, was a bad buy if you ask me,
> Microsoft wireless 1000...wireless, really, if my kids are here, my youngest i got him a ipad 4,
> if hes here, i almost have to tape the wireless thingy to my keyboard to have a good connection ..lol,
> not really wireless that way haha,
> the logitech i had before tihs one was way better, could go to the kitchen with it, and still type from like -5-6 meters away..
> hmm, my wishlist is growing again,
> 2400-2600mhz ram,
> new keyboard


Haha, Samsung RAM is amazing for overclocking so you can get that for almost dirt cheap. Also, new keyboard, I'd recommend a mechanical and non-wireless. Wireless is just awful!


----------



## King4x4

Thinking of ditching my G110 for a good keyboard... gimme options lads!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1347337/fs-g-skill-2x2gb-ddr3-kit-crucial-2x2gb-ddr3/0_100
> G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600MHz CL9 1.5V RAM, 2x2GB kit.
> $15 shipped (does that mean including shipping?)
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
> SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
> 30nm
> $20
> http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Ballistix-Tactical-DDR3-1600-BLT2CP2G3D1608DT1TX0/dp/B006YG9A6Y/ref=sr_1_13?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358153459&sr=1-13&keywords=2gbx2+ddr3+ram
> Crucial Ballistix Tactical 1600 CL8 1.5v 2x2
> $23
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226123
> Muskin Enhanced Ridgebacks 1600 CL6 1.65v
> $20
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1349191/lga-1366-system-asus-rampage-formula-iii-i7-950-mushkin-3-2gb-6gb/0_100
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226173
> Mushkin Radioactive 1600 CL6 1.65v
> $20
> So... which of these ram are the best? I mean the ripjaws at $15 is the cheapest but I heard samsung is supposed to be really good? And then there's a bunch of super high end ram I think in this collection, would any be worth paying more for? It doesnt sound like the G Skills for $15 are special while there are 3 rams at $20 that seem pretty good... and then the crucial $23, lower specd but i dont know what IC it uses.
> Thanks.... i cant figure out what ram to get, since it's 2nd hard prices go out the window and hard to figure out what's the best value.
> 
> 
> 
> guess for the most part it depends what you gonna do with your ram,
> if you want to start benching, then its important,
> but for daily usage,. like me, i dont think it matters much what you run,
> of what i hear here, 1600mhz with nice timings would be good enough for that..
Click to expand...

lets say i was benching.

i mean general usage... but i tend to push 24/7 overclocks very harshly, lots of volts and stuff like that. id prefer what overclocks best. The $15 1600cl9 1.5v im sure is fine, but 1600CL6 1.5v for $5 more sounds like a huge step up, probably worth the price, no? cant tell which of the mushkins are better, i do know heatspreaders dont mean much. then to make things confusing all the searches i find talk about how awesome samsung is for ram, whatever that means.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Thinking of ditching my G110 for a good keyboard... gimme options lads!


G510?








I actually do love mine.. But I'd say something along the lines of a G710 maybe? I dunno


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Thinking of ditching my G110 for a good keyboard... gimme options lads!


i bought my kiddo this,

Logitech Gaming Keyboard G510

hes a die hard BF3 player, he really likes this one


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> lets say i was benching.
> 
> i mean general usage... but i tend to push 24/7 overclocks very harshly, lots of volts and stuff like that. id prefer what overclocks best. The $15 1600cl9 1.5v im sure is fine, but 1600CL6 1.5v for $5 more sounds like a huge step up, probably worth the price, no? cant tell which of the mushkins are better, i do know heatspreaders dont mean much. then to make things confusing all the searches i find talk about how awesome samsung is for ram, whatever that means.


yea, saw some talks about those samsung green? good for ocing(hence awesome? )
im looking into Corsair Dominator Platinum CMD8GX3M2A2400C10,
i like the lights i guess, but it prolly s.... for ocing etc...lol
well, if i got the money, i will look into it some more, the guys here will help me with it when time comes,
im a ramnoob so, that way i cant really help you Belial, srry


----------



## King4x4

Hate the screens


----------



## [CyGnus]

Guess what the mail brought me


PS: after some prime95 i have almost the same temps i had with MX-4 on the die (less 2/3ºc with CLP)
Guess i will not change the mx-4 i have in the vga the card is around 45/50ºc gaming


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Guess what the mail brought me
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS: after some prime95 i have almost the same temps i had with MX-4 on the die (less 2/3ºc with CLP)
> Guess i will not change the mx-4 i have in the vga the card is around 45/50ºc gaming


huh..thats strange , you should have more tempdrop then that using pro on the die,
howmuch tempdrop did you see after delid, using mx-4?


----------



## [CyGnus]

I saw 11/12ºc Drop, but i found what is going on ehre i have 3 cores around 55ºc and one of them is at 67ºc weird already remounted the cooler same thing... maybe my IHS needs some lapping


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I saw 11/12ºc Drop, but i found what is going on ehre i have 3 cores around 55ºc and one of them is at 67ºc weird already remounted the cooler same thing... maybe my IHS needs some lapping


if i look at our memberlist, theres some in there that saw only a temdrop of 10-15C using liquid pro on the die,
your 11-12C + 2-3C is about that..still find it hard to believe tho,
same goes for the temp difference between the hottest and coolest core..
i would expect at least to have it under 10C, but most are between 4 and 8C,
could be a concave ihs or base plate cooler, did you check it ?

easy to see with a ruler or razor blade, and holding a flashlight behind it, or against a lamp/light ..


----------



## [CyGnus]

Will check because i have a temp difference of 16ºC from one core to all others its just too much maybe will apply the paste again, with mx-4 i did not have such a difference so this got to be a bad mount at that is all. will check and recheck all again


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Will check because i have a temp difference of 16ºC from one core to all others its just too much maybe will apply the paste again, with mx-4 i did not have such a difference


thats even more then i had before delid..lol mine was about 15C diff,
after delid 4-6C..must be something else, now im almost sure..

you cant get worse temp differences between cores or just a few degrees after using
a better tim then mx-4, at least on the die, not saying it has to drop another 20C, its possible tho,
but i expect at least 6-8C or more
try to do all sides, on die, inside ihs, on ihs, and base plate cooler, but thin layers,
if you havent already..

make sure the liquid doesnt flow or is to thick, like this here,

srry, made this fast with paint ..lol but you know what i mean with it i hope









wait, another thing comes to mind, be carefull to dont let the ihs slide to much toward the black retangle on the pcb,
now the adhesive is gone, thats can make your ihs go up a bit, and can cause the tempdifference also


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i bought my kiddo this,
> 
> Logitech Gaming Keyboard G510
> 
> hes a die hard BF3 player, he really likes this one


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Hate the screens


Your son sounds exactly like me! I use that keyboard too!








I'm also a pretty big die hard BF3 player, I don't play it anymore though.. The keyboard is really good for checking what song is playing and good for checking temperatures in game/FPS counters and CPU/RAM usage..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I saw 11/12ºc Drop, but i found what is going on here i have 3 cores around 55ºc and one of them is at 67ºc weird already remounted the cooler same thing... maybe my IHS needs some lapping


Yeah, that happens. Maybe re-apply the TIM on the IHS..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Your son sounds exactly like me! I use that keyboard too!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm also a pretty big die hard BF3 player, I don't play it anymore though.. The keyboard is really good for checking what song is playing and good for checking temperatures in game/FPS counters and CPU/RAM usage..


yea, with the backlight etc, i think it looks really cool, no wonder a 15year old loves it ..lol
and you can adjust about everything, only thing he said, he had to get used to the layout/dimensions, with all the G buttons on the left site,
and now, if hes here, hes having a hard time using my normal keyboard again ..lol


----------



## [CyGnus]

I think the problem is in my retention plate of the Antec 620 i cant get the screw all the way to the end it just spins and does nothing.... But even so i am with better temps then before


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I think the problem is in my retention plate of the Antec 620 i cant get the screw all the way to the end it just spins and does nothing....


getting closer..like i said, must be something else causing it..


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Will check because i have a temp difference of 16ºC from one core to all others its just too much maybe will apply the paste again, with mx-4 i did not have such a difference so this got to be a bad mount at that is all. will check and recheck all again


Again, is not seated right.. Have you applied LP on die and the underside of the IHS?


----------



## [CyGnus]

yes on die and ihs alright solved the problem on the plate but the temps are very similar maybe i used to much paste... not seeing any other option here.. Although i just put a drop and spread it...
Weird thing is i have the temps like this: 51/53/68/53 its just that one core that is being stupid


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if i look at our memberlist, theres some in there that saw only a temdrop of 10-15C using liquid pro on the die,
> your 11-12C + 2-3C is about that..still find it hard to believe tho,
> same goes for the temp difference between the hottest and coolest core..
> i would expect at least to have it under 10C, but most are between 4 and 8C,
> could be a concave ihs or base plate cooler, did you check it ?
> 
> easy to see with a ruler or razor blade, and holding a flashlight behind it, or against a lamp/light ..


I have a core that is always 5-10c ahead of my other cores... I wonder if mine is bent like that too.

How do you fix it?


----------



## Kolt21

Hey Guys, Probably a noob question but, If Liquid Pro is so rediculously awesome for the die.

Why would it not be significantly better than arctic silver for the heat sink as well?


----------



## Kolt21

also what do yous make of this. advertised as better than as 5 or your money back









http://www.ebay.com/itm/Thermal-Compound-outperforms-Arctic-Silver-5-Guaranteed-/330856877428?pt=US_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item4d089b4d74


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Hey Guys, Probably a noob question but, If Liquid Pro is so rediculously awesome for the die.
> 
> Why would it not be significantly better than arctic silver for the heat sink as well?


With clp you need smaller places and with some HS it can mess with the metal and erode it really badly. As in shread the metal slowly apart.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Hey Guys, Probably a noob question but, If Liquid Pro is so rediculously awesome for the die.
> 
> Why would it not be significantly better than arctic silver for the heat sink as well?


With clp you need smaller places and with some HS it can mess with the metal and erode it really badly. As in shread the metal slowly apart.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, with the backlight etc, i think it looks really cool, no wonder a 15year old loves it ..lol
> and you can adjust about everything, only thing he said, he had to get used to the layout/dimensions, with all the G buttons on the left site,
> and now, if hes here, hes having a hard time using my normal keyboard again ..lol


Yeah pretty much! I'm used to it now! But I rarely use the G-Keys.. Rarely!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> yes on die and ihs alright solved the problem on the plate but the temps are very similar maybe i used to much paste... not seeing any other option here.. Although i just put a drop and spread it...
> Weird thing is i have the temps like this: 51/53/68/53 its just that one core that is being stupid


yeah, you have to apply very little.. too much will not work as good. must be a very very thin layer on both sides... trust me, looks is not not enough, but it will work...If you put too much, you can use the syringe to suck up the excess.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I have a core that is always 5-10c ahead of my other cores... I wonder if mine is bent like that too.
> 
> How do you fix it?


no worries, your tempdifference between cores is "normal",
but 15C and higher is not good..only for un delidded ivy's thats "normal"...lol not all the time tho,
if a ihs is concave, or base plate cooler, you can lap it, i made a post about it a while ago, *its on page 1 too*








http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749
yea, i know, its hard to find in there .....lol ( Val







)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Hey Guys, Probably a noob question but, If Liquid Pro is so rediculously awesome for the die.
> 
> Why would it not be significantly better than arctic silver for the heat sink as well?


because of the bigger heat dispersion area,
then it dont matter much how high the w/mk is,
the die is alot smaller, thats where the high w/mk of liquid pro kicks in..better heat transfer then other tim's

well, exceptions there will always be i guess..( looks at CyGnus







)
pff, i hate when i cant solve problems.. wish CyGnus computer was here,
so i can take a good look at it all, its hard to determine whats up sometimes with only this line of communication ...


----------



## Kolt21

Can Prime 95 Small FTT's be used for joining the club?

I already did a 26 hour prime small ftt on my 4.7ghz 1.3v overclock.

Not really in the mood to download intel burn test but will if need be.

Also, Im trying to gather as much information as possible since ******* up is not an option for me.

So the IHS just floats ontop of the cpu when you are done? held only by the plate that holds the cpu in?

That brings me a terrifying thought, what if it isnt sitting exactly where it was before when you are done? 

Also if Liquid Pro Slides during this process, will it cause higher temps than if it didnt slide?

Im sincerely hoping that all of these "oops destroyed my i7 3770k trying to delid" posts on the net are from people who unknowingly fail at using a razorblade.

There is a high volume of oh **** dont try it youll slice the cpu in half. Then at the same time people saying, hey my kids can do it without a scratch.

my intuition tells me it is razorblade fail. I know someone who is great at alot of things tech wise but if you hand him something small that needs a delicate touch he will break it into a million pieces every single time with a dumbfounded look on his face, then say something like... this isnt easy at all.

I am so damn afraid of scratching the thing that I am sure it will take me 16 hours to delid it. I can see myself now. moving a half a cm at a time with no pressure at all. maybey the friction will melt it off.. rofl









This is because if i **** it up I am going to have to rob a local 7-11. lol


----------



## [CyGnus]

Fixed guess it as too much CLP on DIE reaplied everything and the results are more then good
Here is a quick pic of the temps (before one of the cores was around 70ºc just one)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Can Prime 95 Small FTT's be used for joining the club?
> 
> I already did a 26 hour prime small ftt on my 4.7ghz 1.3v overclock.
> 
> Not really in the mood to download intel burn test but will if need be.


Nope your good with prime 95 stuff. Just make sure everything is the same mainly.

We just like to have a comparison for our viewers.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Fixed guess it as too much CLP on DIE reaplied everything and the results are more then good
> Here is a quick pic of the temps (before one of the cores was around 70ºc just one)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


im glad now







cool man









edit,
dang, now you have better temps then me at 4.7ghz


----------



## [CyGnus]

Lol, well guess it turn out alright, i am very pleased with the results and got a bonus fixed the retention plate hehe.







will put some of this stuff on the 7870


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nope your good with prime 95 stuff. Just make sure everything is the same mainly.
> 
> We just like to have a comparison for our viewers.


excellent, the prime 95 results are on a notepad results file. how do I go about posting it here?

Update: ****, this results notepad has my 4.6 overclock with not enough voltage....... it didnt save the 26 hour run apparently?????? /cry

I guess im better off using intelburntest. it doesnt have to be 24 hour right?

The correct overclock is my 4.7ghz 1.3v. it ran for 26 hours and had 1 hardware failure at 22 hours on my coldest core (still dont know why that is) and that core dropped to 50% for the final 4 hours while everything else stayed at 100% and no problems. Max temp was 85c and that core did NOT fail. the 78c core failed.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Fixed guess it as too much CLP on DIE reaplied everything and the results are more then good
> Here is a quick pic of the temps (before one of the cores was around 70ºc just one)


Again........ TOLD YA.









Oh... woot.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Again........ TOLD YA.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice latency, here is my result at 4.7


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im glad now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cool man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit,
> dang, now you have better temps then me at 4.7ghz


is it hard to get the clp off the die without hurting it? what does one use?


----------



## [CyGnus]

i took off mine with Isopropyalkohol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> is it hard to get the clp off the die without hurting it? what does one use?


the die is made of "glass", so its easier to get it of that, then on the metal ihs surface,
thats why we recommend using another tim on the ihs, if you dont want to clean with a scrubbing pad,
that comes with the pro/ultra package, and maybe wipe of the intel numbers etc..
i have yet to test the cleaning myselfs tho, but im waiting 5-6months to do so, so its longer time under there,
making it even harder to remove, like others say, liquid ultra is easier to remove..
use Denatured alcohol or methylated spirits, the spiritus i use is about 90%
which is already in the package too, but 70%, higher is better i think

im not expecting big problems removing it tho, ill figure out a good way, im sure










94% denatured ethanol sold in a bottle for household use

alcoholics used to drink this stuff in my country, then they changed it a bit,
added some other things that makes you go







go crazy after a while ..lol


----------



## Jaggar

has anyone ever tried using indigo extreme between the die and ihs?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Again........ TOLD YA.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice latency, here is my result at 4.7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice
Click to expand...


----------



## VonDutch

i want to give my kiddo the PSU thats in my rig,
that old 400Watt thing isnt good enough ..lol,
he needs to downclock that watt hungry 8350 of his








my XFX ProSeries 750W XXX Edition should do it right, even when we start ocing it?

so i need a new one, thinking about buying the same one,
or the XFX ProSeries 850Watt XXX Edition..

what do you guys think, good, or should i look for another/better one?
if i ever decide to get me another 7970, i might need more power then 750Watt?
or is a 750 watt sufficient, with 80+, bronze /silver/gold


----------



## chronicfx

[quote name="[CyGnus]"
PS: after some prime95 i have almost the same temps i had with MX-4 on the die (less 2/3ºc with CLP)
Guess i will not change the mx-4 i have in the vga the card is around 45/50ºc gaming[/quote]

I got no temp improvement the first time as well. The second time I coated the bottom side of my ihs to mate with the coating of the die and my temps dropped almost 20 degrees. I think the layers need to be a tad thicker and since it conducts like a pure metal putting a little extra is no problem.


----------



## [CyGnus]

chronicfx already fixed the issue had a nice drop too


----------



## Kolt21

Question About Degradation.

I have 2 I7 3770k's.

1 for my wife's build and 1 for mine (Identical builds but hers has a 1tb hhd for pictures and video.

My CPU was a lot "luckier" than hers.

at 1.3v I can 24 hour prime stable (more or less) at 4.7ghz (Not amazing but i would say above average for an i73770k.

Hers was not so great. 4.4 at 1.3v and I havent even checked that for stability, her temps are also a bit higher. I am going to delid Both.

My worry is degradation.

We are already at 1.3v. which is widely considered the limit prior to hardware degradation.

I would be satisfied with a 4.7ghz overclock on 1.3v as long as my delid gets me out of the 80c range tempwise. (but knowing me I will push for 5) also why i need to know about hardware degradation)

But more importantly, she is at 4.4ghz at 1.3v. Delidding will drop temps but 4.4 isn't good enough for me. it makes me sad inside. I want to get 4.7 at the least. This is obviously going to require a lot of voltage since she got what i would call a underachieving chip.

My questions are as follows:

What is the average lifespan of an i7 3770k with 1.3v?

And for 1.35v?

And for 1.4v?

And for 1.45v?

And finally for 1.5v?

We are both using h100i Water cooling and I will be delidding and using CL LP on the die Artic Silver 5 on the IHS.

Another related question, I have my fans ramped from 75 factory default in mobo to 150 (max). It has made me noisier (Dont Care) but Is it really necessary? I dont want to wear them out for no reason if I could avoid it and be quieter (Quiet only really matters if doing it at all is a waste of time).

I am willing to let hardware degredation exist for a higher overclock as most of us here are. But I am having a hard time getting concrete information regarding this issue.

With more solid information on how much life I am taking from my chip I would be able to make an educated decision on how high I personally would want to push voltage.

Reliable Information is hard to come by on the internet. There is no shortage of people saying "Dude you can go 105c on hottest core, 1.5v NP, didnt you read intels information on the subject?"

And there is also no shortage of people saying "(Oh NOES go above 60c And you are FRYING YOUR CHIP DUDE!! FRYING IT! ( lol ) and STOCK VOLTAGE OR YOU ARE GOING TO BE BUYING A NEW ONE REAL SOON!!!

I am looking for either "concrete evidence of the truth" <- LOL

But more likely "an average consensus based on user reports" - Which I can then use to make a solid decision and then get on with my life. lol

And this is just speculative random conversation to add to my TLDR Text wall but, "Wouldn't Intel stand to gain by selling "Overachieving Chips" at a higher price point and thus allow the overclockers (SMALL percentage of the chip buying population) the opportunity to benefit from the better chips? I mean somewhere out there is like 100 noobs who dont know how to take off thier case running stock cooler stock settings on a chip that could overclock to 7ghz.... and that makes babies and small kittens cry.

And to be redundant and answer my own question, I will say, it makes sense that a company (Although a Great Company) that would knowingly sell "Hot" Chips to the masses instead of fixing a die issue, thus completely disregarding the overclocking population in the process, would not give two squigly ****s about how good those hot chips could be... lol.

I am anal so my personal opinion is that we should be able to send them to intel for delidding at intels cost. Or not void our warranty by delidding. They could see if there is damage and if there isnt warranty the chip... but that would require work.


----------



## [CyGnus]

VonDutch these XFX Pro are good PSU's price/performance, the 750w should do OK for 7970 CFX But take a look at Antec HCG 750w, SEASONIC BRONZE M12II-750 MODULAR and CORSAIR TX-750M MODULAR, if you can go for the Seasonic one


----------



## chronicfx

Psu question... My corsair hx850 is going on 2 years now. How long should you run these before thinking about replacement. I have sli gpu's and an overclocked processor. After I did my 24 hour prime my wife left the windows open in the room for the rest of the day saying there was a melty burnt smell coming from the computer. I could not smell it but it did make me think capacitor. Or wire laying on something hot? Not sure. Thoughts anyone?


----------



## Kolt21

Oh and one more thing.

I am using a TX650 Corsair.

Would a High Watt Overclock possibly run me into power issues?

If that is the case I should probably rma before its to late.


----------



## [CyGnus]

chronicfx PSU's are fine until they fail no problem in using it for 5/6years if it works ok it works simple as that.

Kolt21 Are you running SLI or CFX? If not no problems at all if you are maybe the PSU is not strong enough to sustain all the Overclock (CPU VGA's and Mem)


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> chronicfx PSU's are fine until they fail no problem in using it for 5/6years if it works ok it works simple as that.
> 
> Kolt21 Are you running SLI or CFX? If not no problems at all if you are maybe the PSU is not strong enough to sustain all the Overclock (CPU VGA's and Mem)


just running a normal gtx 660ti. dont plan to overclock or anything.

and isnt overclocking memory with a i7 3770k pointless except for cold benching?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> VonDutch these XFX Pro are good PSU's price/performance, the 750w should do OK for 7970 CFX But take a look at Antec HCG 750w, SEASONIC BRONZE M12II-750 MODULAR and CORSAIR TX-750M MODULAR, if you can go for the Seasonic one


yea, seasonic, i hear good things about them, and when i bought the XFX, and did some research,
alot of other psu's have parts from them in it also, they cost a bit more then the XFX tho ..thanks


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Question About Degradation.
> 
> I have 2 I7 3770k's.
> 
> 1 for my wife's build and 1 for mine (Identical builds but hers has a 1tb hhd for pictures and video.
> 
> My CPU was a lot "luckier" than hers.
> 
> at 1.3v I can 24 hour prime stable (more or less) at 4.7ghz (Not amazing but i would say above average for an i73770k.
> 
> Hers was not so great. 4.4 at 1.3v and I havent even checked that for stability, her temps are also a bit higher. I am going to delid Both.
> 
> My worry is degradation.
> 
> We are already at 1.3v. which is widely considered the limit prior to hardware degradation.
> 
> I would be satisfied with a 4.7ghz overclock on 1.3v as long as my delid gets me out of the 80c range tempwise. (but knowing me I will push for 5) also why i need to know about hardware degradation)
> 
> But more importantly, she is at 4.4ghz at 1.3v. Delidding will drop temps but 4.4 isn't good enough for me. it makes me sad inside. I want to get 4.7 at the least. This is obviously going to require a lot of voltage since she got what i would call a underachieving chip.
> 
> My questions are as follows:
> 
> What is the average lifespan of an i7 3770k with 1.3v?
> 
> And for 1.35v?
> 
> And for 1.4v?
> 
> And for 1.45v?
> 
> And finally for 1.5v?
> 
> We are both using h100i Water cooling and I will be delidding and using CL LP on the die Artic Silver 5 on the IHS.
> 
> Another related question, I have my fans ramped from 75 factory default in mobo to 150 (max). It has made me noisier (Dont Care) but Is it really necessary? I dont want to wear them out for no reason if I could avoid it and be quieter (Quiet only really matters if doing it at all is a waste of time).
> 
> I am willing to let hardware degredation exist for a higher overclock as most of us here are. But I am having a hard time getting concrete information regarding this issue.
> 
> With more solid information on how much life I am taking from my chip I would be able to make an educated decision on how high I personally would want to push voltage.
> 
> Reliable Information is hard to come by on the internet. There is no shortage of people saying "Dude you can go 105c on hottest core, 1.5v NP, didnt you read intels information on the subject?"
> 
> And there is also no shortage of people saying "(Oh NOES go above 60c And you are FRYING YOUR CHIP DUDE!! FRYING IT! ( lol ) and STOCK VOLTAGE OR YOU ARE GOING TO BE BUYING A NEW ONE REAL SOON!!!
> 
> I am looking for either "concrete evidence of the truth" <- LOL
> 
> But more likely "an average consensus based on user reports" - Which I can then use to make a solid decision and then get on with my life. lol
> 
> And this is just speculative random conversation to add to my TLDR Text wall but, "Wouldn't Intel stand to gain by selling "Overachieving Chips" at a higher price point and thus allow the overclockers (SMALL percentage of the chip buying population) the opportunity to benefit from the better chips? I mean somewhere out there is like 100 noobs who dont know how to take off thier case running stock cooler stock settings on a chip that could overclock to 7ghz.... and that makes babies and small kittens cry.
> 
> And to be redundant and answer my own question, I will say, it makes sense that a company (Although a Great Company) that would knowingly sell "Hot" Chips to the masses instead of fixing a die issue, thus completely disregarding the overclocking population in the process, would not give two squigly ****s about how good those hot chips could be... lol.
> 
> I am anal so my personal opinion is that we should be able to send them to intel for delidding at intels cost. Or not void our warranty by delidding. They could see if there is damage and if there isnt warranty the chip... but that would require work.


thats funny, ever wondered why intel gives a 3 year warranty, thats what they "guarantee" the chip will run...lol
anything after that, is over the expected life span..lol
ive read something about, degradation, high temps and vcore, high temps is worse when it comes to degradation, then vcore is..
lets see if i can find it again ...wait..

As soon as you concede that overclocking by definition reduces the useful lifetime of any CPU, it becomes easier to justify its more extreme application. It also goes a long way to understanding why Intel has a strict "no overclocking" policy when it comes to retaining the product warranty. *Too many people believe overclocking is "safe" as long as they don't increase their processor core voltage - not true. Frequency increases drive higher load temperatures, which reduces useful life.* Conversely, better cooling may be a sound investment for those that are looking for longer, unfailing operation as this should provide more positive margin for an extended period of time.

here you can see that the high temps over a long period of time will give more degration then the vcore at max specs, and a cooler running cpu will live longer then both ...lol

found it, heres a nice read guys,
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6

anyways, a delidded (hot ivy) chip is the best thing,
you can run it alot cooler, at higher vcores, and still have it for a long time..lol
about the vcore, well, its upto you really, intel doesnt give a specific max vcore,
but the VID range thats in the data sheets from intel, says 1.52V,
which is _considered_ to be the max vcore you can run 24/7, if temps permit,


like someone on this forum mentioned to me, when i was asking about max vcore etc,
and that it is nowhere to find in any data sheet from intel, he said,

"I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was considered
the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
for consumer usage. LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
should operate in a 24/7 environment, and that is obviously temperature permitting"

Sin0822 in his guide says,

On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm) *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max.* When overclocking on air the only two voltages you should need to touch on an Ivy Bridge setup are the Vcore (which you increase) and the CPU PLL( which can be decreased to help temperatures). You should not proceed to just apply the maximum voltage for the vcore, vtt, or system agent as you will heavily increase the temperature so much so that the CPU will throttle and can be damaged. Also if you start off with a higher temperature it is very hard to test stability, as you will probably be more unstable than if you used a lower VCore.

but the recommended range on air/water in the graph is 1.3-1.45V vcore ..see








keep it in that range and youll be fine for years to come, im sure, if temps permit of course,
lower temps=longer life








i dont care what others think haha









phew, thats a long post, but you started with a long one Kolt21,
hope this is enough info to help you decide what vcore you should run etc


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats funny, ever wondered why intel gives a 3 year warranty, thats what they "guarantee" the chip will run...lol
> anything after that, is over the expected life span..lol
> ive read something about, degradation, high temps and vcore, high temps is worse when it comes to degradation, then vcore is..
> lets see if i can find it again ...wait..
> 
> found this already, now the site
> 
> here you can see that the high temps over a long period of time will give more degration then the vcore at max specs, and a cooler running cpu will live longer then both ...lol


And this is why I am like ***....

You are saying temperature is the cause of degredation, and on this very same forum I read this huge ass post about, high temps arent going to cause degredation but going over 1.3v will definately cause it.


----------



## Kolt21

Hell, 3 years would be acceptable to me most likely.. I mean how expensive will this chip be in 3 years? 50$?

What kind of voltage can I push after delid and get 3+ years for certain?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> just running a normal gtx 660ti. dont plan to overclock or anything.
> 
> and isnt overclocking memory with a i7 3770k pointless except for cold benching?


This is OCN so nothing is ever pointless! Overclocking memory is like any other thing you overclock but for mem you dont notice much improvement but its there we just cant see it but benches can









About the life span of the CPU i never stay with the same CPU more then 1 year (until now the longest i stayed was 8 months) but these Ivy are amazing if the CPU allows it i can stay with it 2/3 years, bottom line comes to this how often you upgrade? What Overclock you want to use? even at 4.8/5GHz these CPU last 3/4 years easy


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Hell, 3 years would be acceptable to me most likely.. I mean how expensive will this chip be in 3 years? 50$?
> 
> What kind of voltage can I push after delid and get 3+ years for certain?


Stock ..LOL
dont forget, the minute you start to use your new chip, the degradation already starts, even at stock









o, i talked to several intel employee's about ocing and degradation, and vcore,
2 of them told me, if i keep the vcore within "specs", or under the 1.52V vcore,
there should be no degradation at all over time, i hope they where right about this,
so thats why i say, and others too, max 1.45V vcore..

man, this made me hungry, time to make dinner ...laters peeps


----------



## Kolt21

phew, thats a long post, but you started with a long one Kolt21,
hope this is enough info to help you decide what vcore you should run etc







[/quote]

It was helpful, thank you.

What kind of difference would I really see between 4.7 and 5.0ghz for 24/7 at high load?

I am leaning towards delidding my 4.7ghz 1.3v exclusively for a temperature drop as im at 86c on hot core.

Im not sure if I need more than 1.3v? one hardware fail on coldest core at 22 hour mark on prime95. all other cores made it to 26 hours at which point i stopped the program.

I notice you went with 1.305v vondutch.

Do you think the extra .005v would have prevented my coldest core hardware fail at 22 hour mark?

Do you think I should up my volts after delidding for my stable 4.7?

The information you have provided has almost completely made up my mind on what to do with our underperforming second chip.

I think I will volt up untill 4.7 is sustainable and deal with the higher voltage. After all it will be delidded and watercooled using as5 and cl lp. Thats alot of care right there.

Oh and nobody ever answered my previous question. I have bios set to ramp all my HAF X case fans (Stock) to max RPM from the 75 default.

Is that actually doing me any good at all? its noisier and likely my fans will croak faster. is it worth it?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Try to see what your CPU does mine for instance at 4.7 needs 1.28v but for 4.8 it needs 1.36v so its a very big jump just for 100MHz.... Not that temps worry me because its only 5ºc warmer comapred to 4.7







got to love this delidding thing


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Stock ..LOL
> dont forget, the minute you start to use your new chip, the degradation already starts, even at stock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, i talked to several intel employee's about ocing and degradation, and vcore,
> 2 of them told me, if i keep the vcore within "specs", or under the 1.52V vcore,
> there should be no degradation at all over time, i hope they where right about this,
> so thats why i say, and others too, max 1.45V vcore..
> 
> man, this made me hungry, time to make dinner ...laters peeps


DAMN YOU VON DUTCH!.

You said that.. and now all the little voices are telling me to push my 4.7 as high as 1.45v can take it after delid.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Try to see what your CPU does mine for instance at 4.7 needs 1.28v but for 4.8 it needs 1.36v so its a very big jump just for 100MHz.... Not that temps worry me because its only 5ºc warmer comapred to 4.7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> got to love this delidding thing


I need 1.320 just for 4,5 for 4,7 i need 1,430 and for 4,9 over 1,520

Lucky you.. i bet you can get 5ghz


----------



## [CyGnus]

well maybe i can reach 5GHz with 1.45v but i jsut think is too much vcore... will give it a try and see if i can get it stable at 5GHz


----------



## Kolt21

I have an observation to report.









all of you guys saying 1.450 stop at 1.3 on your rig.







Us >







< You


----------



## Gomi

Well - I settled my OC on the 3770K.

Been Folding for days now, not a single WHEA - Clears both CINEBENCH and IntelBurnTest.

4.8Ghz @ 1.308Vcore

Temps: 49-50-55-48

If I can be bothered I will make a run for 5Ghz later on in life - It does IBT stable at 1.390 but god knows the juice required for a non WHEA OC.


----------



## Hokies83

Max 1.55v core.. 1.45v is Avg V core for a 24/7 but hardly the Max...


----------



## [CyGnus]

Just tested mine it needs 1.47v for 5GHz (15min on Prime with 1792k FFT) i rather stay at 4.7 with 1.28v...


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, once you have some money for tubing, just get some clear ones and get a colored coolant. If you want to use distilled, then get white tubing. IMHO, I prefer the clear tubing + red coolant. The coolants nowadays have no problems and don't normally cause problems!
> We were just having a conversation in the spreadsheet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just do as much as you can, doesn't really matter if you wait a bit. People got to learn to be patient!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really do think the iGpu would pull a bit moar volts lulz. but seriously it does make sense since it's putting more stress on the chip itself.
> Nope you are good.
> I know I'm so excited for that bad boy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That works lol.
> Thank goodness!
> Your In!! Now Slap that badarse Sig on that sig line!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> almost entered it twice right Swag.... lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> We were having a conversation in the spreadsheet.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really do think the iGpu would pull a bit moar volts lulz. but seriously it does make sense since it's putting more stress on the chip itself.
> Nope you are good.
> I know I'm so excited for that bad boy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That works lol.
> Thank goodness!
> Your In!! Now Slap that badarse Sig on that sig line!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> almost entered it twice right Swag.... lol


this was the old setup

so i got around getting the tubing done here is a sneak peek of the project thus far got some new sleeving and attached my old block to the video card for a cpu video watercooling setup


i was 5.2ghz stable with my old setup with old hose and old water.


the highest temps at 5.2ghz doesnt go over 81 for 100 run ibt but ill do some more testing with the new setup and compare. it is 72 degrees outside today


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> DAMN YOU VON DUTCH!.
> You said that.. and now all the little voices are telling me to push my 4.7 as high as 1.45v can take it after delid.


i showed you the graph from sin0822's guide,
where he says, "recommended range on air/water 1.3-1.45V vcore"
besides all the other observations here, and elsewhere,
he knows what hes talking about really, so im also using his work to help others,
hes highly respected all around, most peeps who talk about the "maximum vcore Intel states is 1.52V" here and there for example,
are using his graph as reference, they dont know, they just repeat what theve read, or heard..

i did the same thing, but then a few peeps started to comment me on using the 1.52V intel states,
saying, intel doesnt state that anywhere, youre talking bs, proof it bla bla,
so i looked into this, and for weeks i looked for answers, others here know i did,
only to find out, that its true, intel doesnt give hard numbers about max vcore for ivy,
i can even show you a email i got from them, after contacting them through chat, forum etc..

Dear Fred,
Thank you for contacting Intel® Technical Support.
I cannot assist you overclocking your processor. You are free to overclock it, *but we cannot give you any particular voltages*. Please visit this web site http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/gaming/overclocking/overclocking-intel-processors.html where you find some guidance overclocking your processor.
Please replay back this email; do not send a new one.

they cant, because they dont have any max vcore stated anywhere..

so..its upto us, and peeps who really have knowledge to determine what the max ivy's can run








have you already heard of any kind of degradation on ivy's? i havent so far,
and we push our chips hard sometimes, i went all the way upto 1.85V vcore for benching,
only 1 chip died here so far, Val our captain, pushing it all the way upto 1.9V, on air/water, longer periods
Hokies runs his 1.55V 24/7 i think it was, no problem reported yet








mine still runs very well..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I have an observation to report.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all of you guys saying 1.450 stop at 1.3 on your rig.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Us >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> < You


yep,i can run 4.8ghz at 1.420V as max oc 24/7, its the super stable one in my sig,
4.9ghz needs 1.510-1.520V vcore, thats to much for me personally
i went from 4.5 to 4545, to 4645 to 4.7ghz, i settled there, not because im afraid to run the 4.8ghz tho








i know it will run for years if i would, but dont feel the need now, 4.7ghz is a great oc over stock..


----------



## Kolt21

I made that post for a laugh is all. First smiley is all hey man whats up, should I go 1.45v. second smiley is all, yea look over there at this information you totally can. rofl then the smiley kicking the smiley is a representation of that smiley not doing what he is saying.

Entertainment purposes only. I totally get what you guys are saying.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really do think the iGpu would pull a bit moar volts lulz. but seriously it does make sense since it's putting more stress on the chip itself.
> Nope you are good.
> I know I'm so excited for that bad boy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That works lol.
> Thank goodness!
> Your In!! Now Slap that badarse Sig on that sig line!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> almost entered it twice right Swag.... lol
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> We were having a conversation in the spreadsheet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really do think the iGpu would pull a bit moar volts lulz. but seriously it does make sense since it's putting more stress on the chip itself.
> Nope you are good.
> I know I'm so excited for that bad boy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That works lol.
> Thank goodness!
> Your In!! Now Slap that badarse Sig on that sig line!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> almost entered it twice right Swag.... lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> this was the old setup
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Images
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so i got around getting the tubing done here is a sneak peek of the project thus far got some new sleeving and attached my old block to the video card for a cpu video watercooling setup
> 
> 
> i was 5.2ghz stable with my old setup with old hose and old water.
> 
> 
> 
> the highest temps at 5.2ghz doesnt go over 81 for 100 run ibt but ill do some more testing with the new setup and compare. it is 72 degrees outside today
Click to expand...

As a member of the sleeving community, please tighten those cables! It'll look 10x better.







But aside from tucking those cables a bit more, that looks great!







I think you should take a full overview picture of it so we can see the entire thing.


----------



## Belial

You know, volts is worse than temps for cpu life and degradation. You've said mutiple times heat is the bigger problem but that isn't true. Hell, look at the graph you quote. You can clearly see turning that VID to 'mid' would cause the cpu to degrade sooooo much quicker then temps would, and that's assuming a similar exponential curve, which would more likely be steeper.

Didn't sin say 1.6vcore on ambient cooling ? There isnt isn'treally a max vcore for ivy because no one knows, they are hardy chips, and unlike sandy you dondon'thave many reports of degradation or killing the chip.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I made that post for a laugh is all. First smiley is all hey man whats up, should I go 1.45v. second smiley is all, yea look over there at this information you totally can. rofl then the smiley kicking the smiley is a representation of that smiley not doing what he is saying.
> 
> Entertainment purposes only. I totally get what you guys are saying.


just what we needed, another funny guy ..LOL








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> You know, volts is worse than temps for cpu life and degradation. You've said mutiple times heat is the bigger problem but that isn't true. Hell, look at the graph you quote. You can clearly see turning that VID to 'mid' would cause the cpu to degrade sooooo much quicker then temps would, and that's assuming a similar exponential curve, which would more likely be steeper.
> 
> Didn't sin say 1.6vcore on ambient cooling ? There isnt isn'treally a max vcore for ivy because no one knows, they are hardy chips, and unlike sandy you dondon'thave many reports of degradation or killing the chip.


pls show me where Sin says 1.6V vcore..
the highest he says if i look at his graph again, is 1.55V on air water.
1.6V and above on air/water is the killing zone..im not saying high temps are the only thing degrading your chip,
just want to make peeps aware that theres more to degradation then only high vcore..
but before we go into another useless round/pages full of discussion, i just let others decide if its of any use,
im not gonna debate this, at least not with you, i know you by now ...no thanks









"There isnt isn'treally a max vcore for ivy because no one knows,"

i think i said that in my other posts too, nice quote..


----------



## Hokies83

Some of us are Friends of Sin0822... Namely me and we have talked for years.. he replys to my PM...

Sin0822 said this plain as day... 1.55v is good 24/7 if your temps are fine.. never go past 1.6v unless your on LN2.

I find 1.45v Barely Worth De lidding for.. An h-100 is good till 1.4v if you did everything right....

A custom loop should be able to run 1.45v again if u did everything right.. you can get a loop to do that for 150$.. not much more then crappy eye sore air coolers..

I have 2 240 rads and 3 360 86mm rads atm heh...

Trying to find a " Giant " res as well.. Go big or stay home..


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Some of us are Friends of Sin0822... Namely me and we have talked for years.. he replys to my PM...
> 
> Sin0822 said this plain as day... 1.55v is good 24/7 if your temps are fine.. never go past 1.6v unless your on LN2.
> 
> I find 1.45v Barely Worth De lidding for.. An h-100 is good till 1.4v if you did everything right....
> 
> A custom loop should be able to run 1.45v again if u did everything right.. you can get a loop to do that for 150$.. not much more then crappy eye sore air coolers..
> 
> I have 2 240 rads and 3 360 86mm rads atm heh...
> 
> Trying to find a " Giant " res as well.. Go big or stay home..


How big is giant?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> How big is giant?


400mm or bigger

Would like one of Cyber druids res those things were sick XD

Here is my case see how the MB tray stops short?
im trying to cover that area with Res / rad to hide what is behind it lol "lotsa wires"


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1347337/fs-g-skill-2x2gb-ddr3-kit-crucial-2x2gb-ddr3/0_100
> G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600MHz CL9 1.5V RAM, 2x2GB kit.
> $15 shipped (does that mean including shipping?)
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
> SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
> 30nm
> He's saying $40 for 2 of these kits, so he could maybe do $20 for one kit.... assuming he could, would this be better than the other choices?
> 
> Would either of these perform better than those mushkin radioactive?
> 
> How do they compare to those Crucial Tactical Ballistix Tracer 1600 CL8 1.5v?
> 
> my indecision is holding me back tt. i just need ram and psu to get my 3570k build going (will probably go with $29 cx500, maybe $39 rosewill green 630w... cx500 [email protected] should be enough for 3570 + 460 SLI all heavily overvolted to limits though... which im not doing yet and id worry about in the far future anywyas)


Get the Radioactive kit man, they ARE better and overclock MUCH higher than the rest of the sticks you mentioned. Plus those Samsung sticks are not necesarily the same 4gb sticks everyone seems to love. (and those don't come even close to psc based ram) You will likely get 2400mhz 9-11-9-27-1t with 1.7v or less with them.








CX500 is solid, 460 sli is kinda meh, if you can get a 7850 and sell your old gpu.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my ram .... to oc to higher speeds, only got it to 1866mhz once,
> i tried several times with guidance from ivan and others here,
> saving money for 2600mhz, when i have the money,
> i will be back asking you guys what i should buy


Get that Radioactive kit for benching if Belial doesn't hehe
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> lets say i was benching.
> 
> i mean general usage... but i tend to push 24/7 overclocks very harshly, lots of volts and stuff like that. id prefer what overclocks best. The $15 1600cl9 1.5v im sure is fine, but 1600CL6 1.5v for $5 more sounds like a huge step up, probably worth the price, no? cant tell which of the mushkins are better, i do know heatspreaders dont mean much. then to make things confusing all the searches i find talk about how awesome samsung is for ram, whatever that means.


Those cl6 sticks are da bomb...What matters is the ram ic inside the ram stick, not the brand or voltage or whatever. But you need to know what to look for.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, saw some talks about those samsung green? good for ocing(hence awesome? )
> im looking into Corsair Dominator Platinum CMD8GX3M2A2400C10,
> i like the lights i guess, but it prolly s.... for ocing etc...lol
> well, if i got the money, i will look into it some more, the guys here will help me with it when time comes,
> im a ramnoob so, that way i cant really help you Belial, srry


Those use the same Samsung IC's in the green ram, but with a taller pcb and overclock a bit better. they look cool too xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i want to give my kiddo the PSU thats in my rig,
> that old 400Watt thing isnt good enough ..lol,
> he needs to downclock that watt hungry 8350 of his
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my XFX ProSeries 750W XXX Edition should do it right, even when we start ocing it?
> 
> so i need a new one, thinking about buying the same one,
> or the XFX ProSeries 850Watt XXX Edition..
> 
> what do you guys think, good, or should i look for another/better one?
> if i ever decide to get me another 7970, i might need more power then 750Watt?
> or is a 750 watt sufficient, with 80+, bronze /silver/gold


Seasonic is best, XFX uses Seasonic innards btw...850w is plenty. There's a reccomended psu list too...Get an NZXT Hale82 (modular) if you can.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> just running a normal gtx 660ti. dont plan to overclock or anything.
> 
> and isnt overclocking memory with a i7 3770k pointless except for cold benching?


Overclocking a 3770k is 'pointless' too...same as a gpu or whatever lol
Come on, crank those ram sticks don't be a wuss! xD


----------



## [CyGnus]

For me i think its too much voltage for 24/7 usage even if not always at 100% load. You say that there is no problem using 1.45-1.55v?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 400mm or bigger
> 
> Would like one of Cyber druids res those things were sick XD
> 
> Here is my case see how the MB tray stops short?
> im trying to cover that area with Res / rad to hide what is behind it lol "lotsa wires"


I don't get your problem then ... there's lots of 400, 450mL, and 880ml reservoirs


----------



## martinhal

Perhaps off the topic. Can I use CLP on my 7970's ? Is there much risk ?


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Perhaps off the topic. Can I use CLP on my 7970's ? Is there much risk ?


I did, dropped load temps 5-7 degrees


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Perhaps off the topic. Can I use CLP on my 7970's ? Is there much risk ?


Sure you can i used on my 7870 and the temps dropped a lot.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> I did, dropped load temps 5-7 degrees


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Sure you can i used on my 7870 and the temps dropped a lot.


Wow that was quick. Is there much risk of it running and causing a short. ?


----------



## meccros

Wow, i have to say that atm, I am super impressed with Liquid Pro. Just finished spreading it on my cpu

I Delidded my i7 3770k about 2 weeks ago for a couple dif reasons. One was the large temp differences between the cores (even after multiple reseats was still seeing 13-15 deg difference between core 0 and 3 ) and second was to see if i could lower my overall temps for a better overclock

I had MX-4 paste and reading that some people used that successfully, (while not understanding why Pro was better for on die TIM) I went ahead and used it anyways, Again after several reseats I seen virtually the same temps. Went and ordered some Liquid Pro because at this point i would have been happy with a 5 deg drop. I have a corsair h100i cooler and just felt that 88 highest temp was WAY too high to try and run









Now, up until i reseated today with Liquid Pro the highest i could possible see was a 4.6 oc at 1.36 vcore. that would set my temps around 86-88 on the highest cores with prime95. and intel burn test seen peaks of 95-96 (way way way too high temps, my eyeballs almost came out of my head when i seen that temp spike) and as far as testing i could hit 4.7 at 1.4 vcore with no real dif in temps (maybe a deg or 2 higher)

I have been running prime95 since the reseat with Liquid Pro as both on die TIM and on ihs and now see highs of 69 after about an hour (exact same settings as before) and intel burn test peaks at 73

On average a 20 deg drop for the highest temp cores









well now that my temps are under control I dont know if i should be happy with 4.6 or see how far i can push it and keep under 1.45 volts (as temps allow) not too overly worried about longterm lifespan


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I don't get your problem then ... there's lots of 400, 450mL, and 880ml reservoirs


where?

biggest im seeing is 400mm.

unless it is custom like cyberdruid but he quit doing it... shame real shame dude only lives 30 mins from me..


----------



## dmanstasiu

http://www.aquatuning.us/product_info.php/info/p15016_Aquacomputer-aqualis-base-for-pump-adaptor-880-ml.html

Why don't you just make your own panel and cover it in carbon fiber vinyl or something?


----------



## Belial

That's [EDIT: damn thread moves so fast, I was referring to the guy saying he talked to sin] what I was referring to when I said 1.6. I clearly stated the comment as if I wasn't 100% sure of it, too.

There is no argument here VonDutch. It's well known that voltage is much more damaging than temperature to CPU lifespan. You can even look at the graph you posted, what do you think would happen if that same line began at the "Mid VID" or "High VID" instead of "Low VID" (this isn't what I'm basing my comment on, I'm just saying how it's kinda goofy you show a graph to say temps are more dangerous than vcore when the graph pretty clearly shows that VID is the real killer, consistent with what everyone says and has shown).

You provide a lot of good information but you are wrong in saying temps are more dangerous than vcore. It would be more accurate if you just said "Higher temps can significanitly attribute to CPU degradation, even if you dont change your vcore".
Quote:


> "There isnt isn'treally a max vcore for ivy because no one knows,"
> 
> i think i said that in my other posts too, nice quote..


This is definitely true, but I think the general boundaries in regards to voltages have been mapped out.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Will check because i have a temp difference of 16ºC from one core to all others its just too much maybe will apply the paste again, with mx-4 i did not have such a difference so this got to be a bad mount at that is all. will check and recheck all again


recently I realized I have the same difference between core temps under load at 4.9-5.0GHz ... will be re-delidding it next time I break the water loop ... and checking for flatness ... chances are I wil be lapping the IHS (and possibly cooling block) too...


----------



## [CyGnus]

with me the problem was too much CLP in the die (even though i only put a tiny drop) re apply and all was good after


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> with me the problem was too much CLP in the die (even though i only put a tiny drop) re apply and all was good after


mine was good initially, but I re-used CLU on the cooling block and IHS a couple times LOL! probably a problem over there ... but I still need to check for flatness of IHS and bock ... and besides wanted to try CLOP on the die this time


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1347337/fs-g-skill-2x2gb-ddr3-kit-crucial-2x2gb-ddr3/0_100
> G.Skill Ripjaws DDR3 1600MHz CL9 1.5V RAM, 2x2GB kit.
> $15 shipped (does that mean including shipping?)
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
> SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
> 30nm
> He's saying $40 for 2 of these kits, so he could maybe do $20 for one kit.... assuming he could, would this be better than the other choices?
> 
> Would either of these perform better than those mushkin radioactive?
> 
> How do they compare to those Crucial Tactical Ballistix Tracer 1600 CL8 1.5v?
> 
> my indecision is holding me back tt. i just need ram and psu to get my 3570k build going (will probably go with $29 cx500, maybe $39 rosewill green 630w... cx500 [email protected] should be enough for 3570 + 460 SLI all heavily overvolted to limits though... which im not doing yet and id worry about in the far future anywyas)
> 
> 
> 
> Get the Radioactive kit man, they ARE better and overclock MUCH higher than the rest of the sticks you mentioned. Plus those Samsung sticks are not necesarily the same 4gb sticks everyone seems to love. (and those don't come even close to psc based ram) You will likely get 2400mhz 9-11-9-27-1t with 1.7v or less with them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CX500 is solid, 460 sli is kinda meh, if you can get a 7850 and sell your old gpu.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my ram .... to oc to higher speeds, only got it to 1866mhz once,
> i tried several times with guidance from ivan and others here,
> saving money for 2600mhz, when i have the money,
> i will be back asking you guys what i should buy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Get that Radioactive kit for benching if Belial doesn't hehe
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> lets say i was benching.
> 
> i mean general usage... but i tend to push 24/7 overclocks very harshly, lots of volts and stuff like that. id prefer what overclocks best. The $15 1600cl9 1.5v im sure is fine, but 1600CL6 1.5v for $5 more sounds like a huge step up, probably worth the price, no? cant tell which of the mushkins are better, i do know heatspreaders dont mean much. then to make things confusing all the searches i find talk about how awesome samsung is for ram, whatever that means.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Those cl6 sticks are da bomb...What matters is the ram ic inside the ram stick, not the brand or voltage or whatever. But you need to know what to look for.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, saw some talks about those samsung green? good for ocing(hence awesome? )
> im looking into Corsair Dominator Platinum CMD8GX3M2A2400C10,
> i like the lights i guess, but it prolly s.... for ocing etc...lol
> well, if i got the money, i will look into it some more, the guys here will help me with it when time comes,
> im a ramnoob so, that way i cant really help you Belial, srry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Those use the same Samsung IC's in the green ram, but with a taller pcb and overclock a bit better. they look cool too xD
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i want to give my kiddo the PSU thats in my rig,
> that old 400Watt thing isnt good enough ..lol,
> he needs to downclock that watt hungry 8350 of his
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my XFX ProSeries 750W XXX Edition should do it right, even when we start ocing it?
> 
> so i need a new one, thinking about buying the same one,
> or the XFX ProSeries 850Watt XXX Edition..
> 
> what do you guys think, good, or should i look for another/better one?
> if i ever decide to get me another 7970, i might need more power then 750Watt?
> or is a 750 watt sufficient, with 80+, bronze /silver/gold
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Seasonic is best, XFX uses Seasonic innards btw...850w is plenty. There's a reccomended psu list too...Get an NZXT Hale82 (modular) if you can.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> just running a normal gtx 660ti. dont plan to overclock or anything.
> 
> and isnt overclocking memory with a i7 3770k pointless except for cold benching?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Overclocking a 3770k is 'pointless' too...same as a gpu or whatever lol
> Come on, crank those ram sticks don't be a wuss! xD
Click to expand...

Thank you, you are very helpful. I'll worry about sli in the future, the idea is that older gen cards are extremely low priced on ebay - you can find a 460 right now on average at $60-80. A 7850, you'll be lucky to get it at $150. Even with opportunity costs and $10 more in a psu, 460 sli is cheaper.

But apparently there are issues with SLI and screen capture, ie streaming, so I won't be using SLI, as much as I'd like to take advantage of my SLI-capable board. maybe the software will be there in a few years, and then I sli, i wasn't planning to do this anytime soon anyways.

Isnt the radioactive and the mushkin enhanced ridgeback blackine ram the exact same ram?


----------



## Belial

As shown in my TIM review here:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346069/belials-heatsink-tim-comparison-and-reviews-hyper-212-h50-nh-d14-pk-1-pk-2-pk-3/0_100

How much paste you use has a huge impact on temps. It's nearly impossible to use too little paste, but it's so easy to use too much. Too much paste doesnt look like very much paste at all, there's pics in my review showing you how much TIM you are supposed to use, and what too much looks like (too much TIM doesnt look like too much at all, perfect amount of time actually doesnt even cover the entire IHS).

I imagine this issue is magnified many times over when using CLU/CLP where you are forced to use the spread method over ricegrain method, which is much much better way of spreading paste, and on-die jobs.

I'm currently looking into buying CLU/CLP but I'm not sure which to get. I dont think w/mk is everything when it comes to thermal paste performance (especially when the sources on clu/clp are 2 different tester).


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> As a member of the sleeving community, please tighten those cables! It'll look 10x better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But aside from tucking those cables a bit more, that looks great!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you should take a full overview picture of it so we can see the entire thing.


heres some full overview pictures you requested. didnt mean what you were refering when you said tighten the cables but i figures you were talking about my 24pin


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> As a member of the sleeving community, please tighten those cables! It'll look 10x better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But aside from tucking those cables a bit more, that looks great!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you should take a full overview picture of it so we can see the entire thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> heres some full overview pictures you requested. didnt mean what you were refering when you said tighten the cables but i figures you were talking about my 24pin
Click to expand...

Basically what you do is pull the cables from the back so it "tightens". That way it looks better and cleaner.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Thank you, you are very helpful. I'll worry about sli in the future, the idea is that older gen cards are extremely low priced on ebay - you can find a 460 right now on average at $60-80. A 7850, you'll be lucky to get it at $150. Even with opportunity costs and $10 more in a psu, 460 sli is cheaper.
> 
> But apparently there are issues with SLI and screen capture, ie streaming, so I won't be using SLI, as much as I'd like to take advantage of my SLI-capable board. maybe the software will be there in a few years, and then I sli, i wasn't planning to do this anytime soon anyways.
> 
> Isnt the radioactive and the mushkin enhanced ridgeback blackine ram the exact same ram?


Nope, not the same thing...forget about the model names and such. What matters is the ram chip, you can figure out which chip it is by serial number, timings/voltage/mhz or revision version for Corsair for example. 1600mhz cl6-8-6 with 1.5v is 100% sure PSC x series chip. Those scale all the way up to 1.85v, but I wouldn't go over 1.75v on air really...and clock till 2600mhz on air with fairly good timings. (only the best specimens) That kind of ram isn't made any more, and is by far the BEST ddr3 ram there is for overclocking (with Elpida BBSE and Hyper chips being second and third respectively...BBSE can be on par or better but it's harder to bin)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> That's [EDIT: damn thread moves so fast, I was referring to the guy saying he talked to sin] what I was referring to when I said 1.6. I clearly stated the comment as if I wasn't 100% sure of it, too.
> 
> There is no argument here VonDutch. It's well known that voltage is much more damaging than temperature to CPU lifespan. You can even look at the graph you posted, what do you think would happen if that same line began at the "Mid VID" or "High VID" instead of "Low VID" (this isn't what I'm basing my comment on, I'm just saying how it's *kinda goofy* you show a graph to say temps are more dangerous than vcore when the graph pretty clearly shows that VID is the real killer, consistent with what everyone says and has shown).
> 
> You provide a lot of good information but you are wrong in saying temps are more dangerous than vcore. It would be more accurate if you just said "*Higher temps can significanitly attribute to CPU degradation, even if you dont change your vcore*".
> This is definitely true, but I think the general boundaries in regards to voltages have been mapped out.



Goofy indeed, i think this calls for a, "i dare you"
lets do it like this,

you run your chip at 104C 24/7 over a period of lets say 3 years,
and i run mine at 1.510V vcore 24/7 but low temps, for the same period ok









why do i feel i already won ..hehe
then we compare our chips after that, and see who degraded more..

im just a simple man, so i use the words that i know, english is not my native language see








i cant even say the word "significanitly ", so why should i use it, to show peeps how smart i am ...nah..i would use "very" instead..lol
i think peeps here most of the time know what i mean, i know i can be a bit of sometimes when it comes to
explaining, sorry for that..i try hard tho









dang, now its starts to bug me anyways,

was i so wrong with this graph guys, and what Belial said that it isnt heat, but vid is degrading the cpu??
i dont see it tho..i see,
"accelerated wear-out due to elevated temperatures" and
"partially realized life improvement due to cooler operating temperatures"..
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6 to read the whole story if you like








i dont mind being wrong and to admit it, but i have to be sure i am, then i can adjust my answers too


----------



## Belial

Look up electromigration, i think that'd pull up results on this. There's some paper on that, and then you got some formula that shows that volts is a bigger problem than heat, but both are related and all...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Look up electromigration, i think that'd pull up results on this. There's some paper on that, and then you got some formula that shows that volts is a bigger problem than heat, but both are related and all...


no, im gonna wait for the answers from others here,
and like i said before in my other post im not gonna start another endless/useless discussion with you,
i leave it to others to decide if my info is useful or not,
all i wanted to show is that its not only vcore thats degrading a chip, but also high temps








people ask alot , whats the max vcore i can run, but they forget that high temps are bad too, maybe even worse then high vcore, get it?








like the anandtech post says,
"*Frequency increases drive higher load temperatures, which reduces useful life.*"
i think it was a good point with what he said there,
maybe you should go over there, and discuss this with the threadstarter








heres the link, http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6
scroll down for posting comments


----------



## Belial

you dont need to be nasty, i dont really care and I don't know the specifics 100%. I just know that voltage is more harmful than temperature, and it would be incorrect to say that heat is more damaging than volts. They are closely tied together - as you increase volts, you increase heat, running a higher temp all the time can be more harmful than a little extra voltage, etc - but very plainly, volts is worse than temps for cpu degradation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromigration

It looks like I might not be able to get the radioactives (for whatever reason he isnt replying, maybe hes just afk or something or already sold it).

I might go with those mushkin ridgeback 1600 cl6 1.65v instead.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> you dont need to be nasty, i dont really care.
> 
> It looks like I might not be able to get the radioactives (for whatever reason he isnt replying, maybe hes just afk or something or already sold it).
> 
> I might go with those mushkin ridgeback 1600 cl6 1.65v instead.


If they are cl6 they will be good...Good luck.

Here are some good resources:

_Ram ic lists and overclocking info below._


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://ramlist.i4memory.com/ddr3/
http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f13/g-skill-ddr3-ic-sammelthread-924433.html#l
http://i4memory.com/f94/ddr3-ic-list-submissions-8426/
http://www.ocaholic.ch/forum/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=4202



_Sam's binning method (Tapakah)_









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://www.ocxtreme.org/forumenus/showthread.php?t=6548
http://www.ocxtreme.org/forumenus/showthread.php?t=6549
http://www.ocxtreme.org/forumenus/showthread.php?t=6536


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> For me i think its too much voltage for 24/7 usage even if not always at 100% load. You say that there is no problem using 1.45-1.55v?


As stated before. as long temps are really under 85C i don't see a problem.. But try to keep it under 1.52 just to be save.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> you dont need to be nasty, i dont really care and I don't know the specifics 100%. I just know that voltage is more harmful than temperature, and it would be incorrect to say that heat is more damaging than volts. They are closely tied together - as you increase volts, you increase heat, running a higher temp all the time can be more harmful than a little extra voltage, etc - but very plainly, volts is worse than temps for cpu degradation.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromigration
> 
> It looks like I might not be able to get the radioactives (for whatever reason he isnt replying, maybe hes just afk or something or already sold it).
> 
> I might go with those mushkin ridgeback 1600 cl6 1.65v instead.


not nasty, im trying to help you, and give you the opportunity to talk about this with the original maker of that post,
im sure he can help you better then me








i know a while back you started talking like this in this same thread, and it only ended up in people here getting
agitated about your ways, and it filled about 10 pages with nonsense, and a moderator stopped it in the end,
so then i thought, i must be careful with this guy, dont get fooled , and do the same as the others,
and now look what happened, here i am, the others dont even respond, they learned their lesson...
guess thats why your own thread doesnt get alot of responses too








people try to help you, but ...well..maybe its just the way you are ..sorry, thats the way i feel right now..

G'night crew


----------



## Belial

k well il try to get those radioactives but if not ill settle for the ridgebacks ;/

youve been very helpful

if people dont want to discuss things because they are afraid of lively discussion, that's fine with me. there's a common purpose here and people get too offended instead of trying to make everyone more knowledgeable in the end. I don't know quantuum physics so i can't really say more than i already have about volts vs temps, but the stuff is out there and anything more I could say wouldn't be any more than what could be found out by anyone else searching the subject (i mean i don't recall exactly the sources) of electromigration.

practically, it just means high volts can be very damaging to your CPU, even if your temps are very low, but usually both volts and temps are related and you're just aware of pushing the envelope on either.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> k well il try to get those radioactives but if not ill settle for the ridgebacks ;/
> 
> youve been very helpful


No sweat man, I like ram lol xD
Hence the ram addict club in the sig...Be sure to check those links out, specially the last one and Sam's binning method.


----------



## Belial

There is no mention of you being addicted to RAM, or samsung, in your sig


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> There is no mention of you being addicted to RAM, or samsung, in your sig


Just edited it...forgot to add the link xD


----------



## Belial

http://www.overclock.net/t/1281823/foxconn-bloodrage-non-gti-i3-2100t-asus-p67-m-pro-ram/0_100

Some guy has the Gskill ripjaws X Blue 1600mhz. Im not sure what exactly, i think it's this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231443
1600 CL8 1.5v
$25

That isn't better is it? The problem with the muskin ridgebacks is that the guy is just a ~20 rep guy here on OCN (similar to my ratings and stuff, i guess), its not an OCN marketplace thread so it's not as... legit, i guess :X

A bit of a gamble but ram is cheap...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1281823/foxconn-bloodrage-non-gti-i3-2100t-asus-p67-m-pro-ram/0_100
> 
> Some guy has the Gskill ripjaws X Blue 1600mhz. Im not sure what exactly, i think it's this:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231443
> 1600 CL8 1.5v
> $25
> 
> That isn't better is it? The problem with the muskin ridgebacks is that the guy is just a ~20 rep guy here on OCN (similar to my ratings and stuff, i guess), its not an OCN marketplace thread so it's not as... legit, i guess :X
> 
> A bit of a gamble but ram is cheap...


Could be anything...forget the rep thing, that ram is great and will probably work alrght. If not get whatever's cheaper, but you'll lose on performance and overclockability.


----------



## [CyGnus]

chris-br I dont know e feel ok wit 4.7 at 1.28v but not so good for 4.8 at 1.36v and the temps are more then great, maybe its because i was used to the CPU before delidding i dont know


----------



## Hokies83

Ivy your good to go up to 95C

But if i had to choose between 95c and 1.4v

And 65c and 1.6v id take 65c and 1.6v all day and twice on Sunday.


----------



## stickg1

Well I thought I killed my new 3570K in the delidding process. The razor slipped and went in too far. I didn't do a good job with the CL Ultra because I rushed through so I could make sure the thing still works. The PC boots up, I'm running IBT, everything seems cool. I definitely hit the core though...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> k well il try to get those radioactives but if not ill settle for the ridgebacks ;/
> 
> youve been very helpful
> 
> if people dont want to discuss things because they are afraid of lively discussion, that's fine with me. there's a common purpose here and people get too offended instead of trying to make everyone more knowledgeable in the end. I don't know quantuum physics so i can't really say more than i already have about volts vs temps, but the stuff is out there and anything more I could say wouldn't be any more than what could be found out by anyone else searching the subject (i mean i don't recall exactly the sources) of electromigration.
> 
> practically, it just means high volts can be very damaging to your CPU, even if your temps are very low, but usually both volts and temps are related and you're just aware of pushing the envelope on either.


For me, the colder the cpu the more comfortable I am with pushing voltages depending on what I'm doing. I'll push 1.9V on ivy at -196° for validation or superpi run (single thread), but would still be wary of things that run 100% load on all cores if I want the chip to last a while. I'm not a believer in feeding a good chip 1.5V on air whether temps are good or not, but a lot of people here replace the cpu with every new generation & don't care if it lasts 5 years, so I don't criticize.
My best chips I try not to run on air at all & when I do, they stay at lower voltage & never see high temps. The chip I'm using right now isn't a particularly good one so it doesn't really bother me to feed it 1.6V +, but it still loads up without any cores going over 0°.

High temps & high voltage at the same time are where degradation really speeds up.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well I thought I killed my new 3570K in the delidding process. The razor slipped and went in too far. I didn't do a good job with the CL Ultra because I rushed through so I could make sure the thing still works. The PC boots up, I'm running IBT, everything seems cool. I definitely hit the core though...


Now you're playing the waiting game until the problem manifests itself


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For me, the colder the cpu the more comfortable I am with pushing voltages depending on what I'm doing. I'll push 1.9V on ivy at -196° for validation or superpi run (single thread), but would still be wary of things that run 100% load on all cores if I want the chip to last a while. I'm not a believer in feeding a good chip 1.5V on air whether temps are good or not, but a lot of people here replace the cpu with every new generation & don't care if it lasts 5 years, so I don't criticize.
> My best chips I try not to run on air at all & when I do, they stay at lower voltage & never see high temps. The chip I'm using right now isn't a particularly good one so it doesn't really bother me to feed it 1.6V +, but it still loads up without any cores going over 0°.
> 
> High temps & high voltage at the same time are where degradation really speeds up.


Well said...I wouldn't even worry about degradation if I'm planning to dissect an expensive cpu to begin with.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Now you're playing the waiting game until the problem manifests itself


Yeah im sure it will probably fail. I mean it chipped the glass from the looks of it. It works now though...Oh well, guess I'll be back on the hunt for a chip soon.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get a 3770k next time...

Guys, wish me luck with my 670 ftw sale. I need it gone or otherwise I won't be able to pay my rent worst case scenario.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ivy your good to go up to 95C
> 
> But if i had to choose between 95c and 1.4v
> 
> And 65c and 1.6v id take 65c and 1.6v all day and twice on Sunday.


Isn't ivy throttling by 95*C? Im not sure you can compare it like that, or those are equivalent... theres a formula for electromigration though, I'm sure it's possible to figure out what is equivalent and all that.

Practically it doesnt matter, volts and heat are bad mmkay. Technically, it's wrong to say that heat is worse than volts though. That's all. I dont care to carry on an unpractical conversation again unless there's something to be learned.
Quote:


> Could be anything...forget the rep thing, that ram is great and will probably work alrght. If not get whatever's cheaper, but you'll lose on performance and overclockability.


i think the mushkin enhanced ridgebacks bailed.

Let's move this convo to the RAM thread or PM. You or I can take our next reply to the ram addict thread (thanks for pointing that out, i find things only by the search engine). I think my best option now is that mystery ram (they are probably what i linked, based on pics and description) gskill ripjaws x blue 1600mhz:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231430

http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
30nm
$20

http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Ballistix-Tactical-DDR3-1600-BLT2CP2G3D1608DT1TX0/dp/B006YG9A6Y/ref=sr_1_13?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358153459&sr=1-13&keywords=2gbx2+ddr3+ram
Crucial Ballistix Tactical 1600 CL8 1.5v 2x2
$23

and i dont think those samsung ar ethe special ones.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Isn't ivy throttling by 95*C? Im not sure you can compare it like that, or those are equivalent... theres a formula for electromigration though, I'm sure it's possible to figure out what is equivalent and all that.
> 
> Practically it doesnt matter, volts and heat are bad mmkay. Technically, it's wrong to say that heat is worse than volts though. That's all. I dont care to carry on an unpractical conversation again unless there's something to be learned.
> i think the mushkin enhanced ridgebacks bailed.
> 
> Let's move this convo to the RAM thread or PM. You or I can take our next reply to the ram addict thread (thanks for pointing that out, i find things only by the search engine). I think my best option now is that mystery ram (they are probably what i linked, based on pics and description) gskill ripjaws x blue 1600mhz:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231430
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346421/fs-samsung-ddr3-2x2gb-two-kits-unopened/0_100
> SAMSUNG 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model MV-3V2G3D/US
> 30nm
> $20
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Ballistix-Tactical-DDR3-1600-BLT2CP2G3D1608DT1TX0/dp/B006YG9A6Y/ref=sr_1_13?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358153459&sr=1-13&keywords=2gbx2+ddr3+ram
> Crucial Ballistix Tactical 1600 CL8 1.5v 2x2
> $23
> 
> and i dont think those samsung ar ethe special ones.


I'd take the Crucial sticks over the blue random ripjaws, unless he tells you what serial number they got. Check the s/n with the ram addict thread ref. and voila.


----------



## [CyGnus]

ivanlabrie good luck with that man


----------



## stickg1

Belial, I'm telling you man, I got that 1333MHz Crucial kit for ya, $10 all day. According to your logic its the same as 1600MHz 1.65v RAM...


----------



## Belial

well is it? or what. i mean what ics tt.

il take a second look at that ram.

Im pretty sure the blue ripjaws are these:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231430
1600 CL7 1.5v.

By my logic that would make these cl6 ^^

The seller might be holding out for some bundle sale though, so might not be able to get it.

edit: its really hard to find ICs on 2gb ram.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> well is it? or what. i mean what ics tt.
> 
> il take a second look at that ram.
> 
> Im pretty sure the blue ripjaws are these:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231430
> 1600 CL7 1.5v.
> 
> By my logic that would make these cl6 ^^
> 
> The seller might be holding out for some bundle sale though, so might not be able to get it.


I'll tell ya what man. I will give you the crucial RAM for free if you just quit posting about RAM. LOL!!

I'm serious. PM me your address, the only condition is that your not allowed to ask or talk about RAM for 2 months in any thread that I frequent..


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> chris-br I dont know e feel ok wit 4.7 at 1.28v but not so good for 4.8 at 1.36v and the temps are more then great, maybe its because i was used to the CPU before delidding i dont know


Do what you feel confortable, just saying 1,36vcore is nothing if the temps are good... you can go as high as 1.45vcore easy, as long you have low temps under 85c.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'll tell ya what man. I will give you the crucial RAM for free if you just quit posting about RAM. LOL!!
> 
> I'm serious. PM me your address, the only condition is that your not allowed to ask or talk about RAM for 2 months in any thread that I frequent..


lol, now that's a good offer man









It's easy to tell the ic on ram, but normally stuff below 1866mhz is a gamble...the good stuff is at 2000mhz or higher. Specially for older stuff, they used random mixed ic's at times on 1333 and 1600mhz crap. If you see 1600mhz cl7 o 6 it's defnitely special.


----------



## Belial

well id be interested but i have a lot of questions in regards to that ram lol. ill quiet down, ive got what i need to figure everything out now.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> well id be interested but i have a lot of questions in regards to that ram lol. ill quiet down, ive got what i need to figure everything out now.


It's not the best RAM in the world, but it works.

Just use it until you find something else on the market place. No need to settle for something you don't actually want just because you need some RAM.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For me, the colder the cpu the more comfortable I am with pushing voltages depending on what I'm doing. I'll push 1.9V on ivy at -196° for validation or superpi run (single thread), but would still be wary of things that run 100% load on all cores if I want the chip to last a while. I'm not a believer in feeding a good chip 1.5V on air whether temps are good or not, but a lot of people here replace the cpu with every new generation & don't care if it lasts 5 years, so I don't criticize.
> My best chips I try not to run on air at all & when I do, they stay at lower voltage & never see high temps. The chip I'm using right now isn't a particularly good one so it doesn't really bother me to feed it 1.6V +, but it still loads up without any cores going over 0°.
> 
> High temps & high voltage at the same time are where degradation really speeds up.


You couldn't possibly be pointing your OC with high volts on ivy finger at me could you?????









VonDutch think about the Overclocking this way as well with stress to the transistors. as you mess with the multi you stress the transistors like a rubber band gets stressed. if you stretch the rubber band to far it gets permanently damaged from the stress itself. Just trying to help ya out lol. I think that along with trying for 5.6 is what did Franky in really.


----------



## Belial

Franky?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Franky?


Franky is my CPU's name.

and enjoy this goodness lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Franky?


Valguar's deceased chip. A friend to us all he was, sad sad days since his passing...


----------



## chronicfx

Franky is who used to talk to us.. But Franky doesn't talk amymore.


----------



## Hokies83

He died due to 1.95v with an H-100.... i knew it was coming.. should of took the 5.5ghz and been happy with it.


----------



## chronicfx

So I put in for the ducky keyboard. What is so awesome about mechanical keyboards?


----------



## chronicfx

I would have never thought to upgrade my keyboard


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Some of us are Friends of Sin0822... Namely me and we have talked for years.. he replys to my PM...
> 
> Sin0822 said this plain as day... 1.55v is good 24/7 if your temps are fine.. never go past 1.6v unless your on LN2.
> 
> I find 1.45v Barely Worth De lidding for.. An h-100 is good till 1.4v if you did everything right....
> 
> A custom loop should be able to run 1.45v again if u did everything right.. you can get a loop to do that for 150$.. not much more then crappy eye sore air coolers..
> 
> I have 2 240 rads and 3 360 86mm rads atm heh...
> 
> Trying to find a " Giant " res as well.. Go big or stay home..


Really? at 1.3v Im hitting 86c Hottest Core. Thats why I am here to delid.

h100i Closed Loop.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Valguar's deceased chip. A friend to us all he was, sad sad days since his passing...


All will miss frankys passing and he will remain in our hearts forever <3

LOL JK, he'll remain out of our CPU sockets forever


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Really? at 1.3v Im hitting 86c Hottest Core. Thats why I am here to delid.
> 
> h100i Closed Loop.


Can't wait to see the results!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You couldn't possibly be pointing your OC with high volts on ivy finger at me could you?????
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VonDutch think about the Overclocking this way as well with stress to the transistors. as you mess with the multi you stress the transistors like a rubber band gets stressed. if you stretch the rubber band to far it gets permanently damaged from the stress itself. Just trying to help ya out lol. I think that along with trying for 5.6 is what did Franky in really.


Not at all, just different viewpoints. I was actually happy to see more OCNers trying to push limits like that, I still think it's kinda crazy on air, but a lot of people think I'm nuts for pushing things the way I do too.

I was thinking more for the average OCNer who buy a new chip & want it to last a long time. I'd rather not kill stuff, but I do it fairly often because I also like to push limits.

I'll point a finger at you for being a guy who could use extreme cooling though, since you do try to overclock similar to the way I do at like -100° while you're cooled with water







.


----------



## stickg1

FRANK THE TANK! FRANK THE TANK! FRANK THE TANK!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Really? at 1.3v Im hitting 86c Hottest Core. Thats why I am here to delid.
> 
> h100i Closed Loop.


Something is not done right then i used to run a h-100 in p/p and i was Under TJ Max up until 1.4v.
Are you using the stock fans? if so change them there horrid...



Custom loop temps dropped 15c... my new loop should be even better.. more pumps and rads in a better case...



My new case from the for sale post...

Should be here middle of the week... then i got to measure the inside of it and see what i can fit..


----------



## stickg1

Why do they have so many sickle flows? I thought those were bad with rads.


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Something is not done right then i used to run a h-100 in p/p and i was Under TJ Max up until 1.4v.
> Are you using the stock fans? if so change them there horrid...
> 
> 
> 
> Custom loop temps dropped 15c... my new loop should be even better.. more pumps and rads in a better case...
> 
> 
> 
> My new case from the for sale post...
> 
> Should be here middle of the week... then i got to measure the inside of it and see what i can fit..


Stock fans cranked up to max rpm in the bios.

What should I replace them with?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Stock fans cranked up to max rpm in the bios.
> 
> What should I replace them with?


Either cougars or sickleflows!! Lol both great cfm and such and all the yada yada yada. I have the cougars and enjoy them quiet a lot and I use the sickles for great airflow into the case to help out mainly. Plus you get lighting effects.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You couldn't possibly be pointing your OC with high volts on ivy finger at me could you?????
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VonDutch think about the Overclocking this way as well with stress to the transistors. as you mess with the multi you stress the transistors like a rubber band gets stressed. if you stretch the rubber band to far it gets permanently damaged from the stress itself. Just trying to help ya out lol. I think that along with trying for 5.6 is what did Franky in really.
> 
> 
> 
> Not at all, just different viewpoints. I was actually happy to see more OCNers trying to push limits like that, I still think it's kinda crazy on air, but a lot of people think I'm nuts for pushing things the way I do too.
> 
> I was thinking more for the average OCNer who buy a new chip & want it to last a long time. I'd rather not kill stuff, but I do it fairly often because I also like to push limits.
> 
> I'll point a finger at you for being a guy who could use extreme cooling though, since you do try to overclock similar to the way I do at like -100° while you're cooled with water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

Those were some fun days back when *valgaur* was pushing Franky beyond what all of us though an IB could ever do. And others of us were inspired to see what our chips could do on air and water only. We had lots of fun on the 5GHz thread for a couple of months.

But none of us were too surprised when Franky finally died. Sad, yes. We all miss Franky and his many exploits. Good memories. And we don't point fingers at ya *valgaur* as it could have been any of us too! You were just a bit braver than the rest of us!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Those were some fun days back when *valgaur* was pushing Franky beyond what all of us though an IB could ever do. And others of us were inspired to see what our chips could do on air and water only. We had lots of fun on the 5GHz thread for a couple of months.
> 
> But none of us were too surprised when Franky finally died. Sad, yes. We all miss Franky and his many exploits. Good memories. And we don't point fingers at ya *valgaur* as it could have been any of us too! You were just a bit braver than the rest of us!


Thanks lol. Can't wait until this next chip! Gonna binn this sucker nice and quickly.


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Either cougars or sickleflows!! Lol both great cfm and such and all the yada yada yada. I have the cougars and enjoy them quiet a lot and I use the sickles for great airflow into the case to help out mainly. Plus you get lighting effects.


How much of a celcius difference could they make?

And since we are on the subject of fans.

Im using the HAF X Full Tower. Stock came with one top mount large fan, should I get a second? there is space for one.

Also there is that air duct thing in the middle and It can have a fan, should i have one there?

My fans are currently all maxed out in the bios. I didnt notice a different in temps on the CPU at all one bit from stock RPM to Maxed RPM.

What about these fans you are speaking of make them so good?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Those were some fun days back when *valgaur* was pushing Franky beyond what all of us though an IB could ever do. And others of us were inspired to see what our chips could do on air and water only. We had lots of fun on the 5GHz thread for a couple of months.
> 
> But none of us were too surprised when Franky finally died. Sad, yes. We all miss Franky and his many exploits. Good memories. And we don't point fingers at ya *valgaur* as it could have been any of us too! You were just a bit braver than the rest of us!


Lived fast, died young, & left a beheaded yet still good looking corpse.

It was good to see members really pushing things, most of the benchmarkers at OCN avoid the cpu section since it is mostly talk about stability, what is safe & what not, but I got to reading around in the section a lot more then. Usually with high voltage overclocks there is too much "but is that stable? if not what is the point blah blah blah".
It's refreshing to see people getting excited about extreme overclocks.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hahaha! Yeah I've seen those 'but3770k's what's the point if tthat ain't stable?'
It seems that we're only a handful of guys who bench in here...which is odd, having so many members!








what happened with the pursuit of performance motto?


----------



## FtW 420

Many of the extreme overclockers at OCN literally avoid this section of the forum. I was one of the few who still read in here & post once in a while, been more active in here since reading about valgaur & von dutch's exploits though. It's like they've turned a lot of guys onto pushing limits more.
Looking at my previous post about not pushing 1.5V or more on air, makes me remember I used to do just that before starting to get subzero cooling gear just so I could keep doing it & go higher voltage yet, to not kill stuff & keep overclocking higher.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lived fast, died young, & left a beheaded yet still good looking corpse.
> 
> It was good to see members really pushing things, most of the benchmarkers at OCN avoid the cpu section since it is mostly talk about stability, what is safe & what not, but I got to reading around in the section a lot more then. Usually with high voltage overclocks there is too much "but is that stable? if not what is the point blah blah blah".
> It's refreshing to see people getting excited about extreme overclocks.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hahaha! Yeah I've seen those 'but3770k's what's the point if tthat ain't stable?'
> It seems that we're only a handful of guys who bench in here...which is odd, having so many members!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what happened with the pursuit of performance motto?


And that's why I want to be able to bench! Any news on the missouri meet of mopar's FtW?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> And that's why I want to be able to bench! Any news on the missouri meet of mopar's FtW?


It's in the US, haven't really been following that one.
Looks like OCN is planning another one in Toronto though, I will have to try to get in on that one, last one was a blast!
My night even ended with a blast when the PSU I was using blew up, thing went off like a gunshot, made everyone jump.


----------



## Hokies83

Just Snagged 3 Monsta 86mm 360 rads and a xspc res / 700d pump for 270$ shipped

So i was able to buy MM case + 3 86 mm rads + another pump for 500$

Which is still 150$ less then the case labs case i was gonna get....

Now i just need to find an off the wall show piece of a Res....


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just Snagged 3 Monsta 86mm 360 rads and a xspc res / 700d pump for 270$ shipped
> 
> So i was able to buy MM case + 3 86 mm rads + another pump for 500$
> 
> Which is still 150$ less then the case labs case i was gonna get....
> 
> Now i just need to find an off the wall show piece of a Res....


cyberdruid waterfall res?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> cyberdruid waterfall res?


Cyber Druid does not make Res no more he has been gone for a year..


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cyber Druid does not make Res no more he has been gone for a year..


You could still find them floating around for sale every once in a while. If you offered a good enough price, I"m sure someone would part with it

Otherwise, there's always the typical FrozenQ stuff...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's in the US, haven't really been following that one.
> Looks like OCN is planning another one in Toronto though, I will have to try to get in on that one, last one was a blast!
> My night even ended with a blast when the PSU I was using blew up, thing went off like a gunshot, made everyone jump.


Toronto is in August right?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> You could still find them floating around for sale every once in a while. If you offered a good enough price, I"m sure someone would part with it
> 
> Otherwise, there's always the typical FrozenQ stuff...


FrozenQ over priced and i hear bad things...

think 100$ is enough for somebody to part with there Cyber Druid res?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Toronto is in August right?


There's a thread checking interest for mid march right now
http://www.overclock.net/t/1346967/10-000-prizing-interest-in-grand-champion-series-event-march-2013-toronto


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would have never thought to upgrade my keyboard


I know, right!

I would rather a mechanical keyboard and an i3/Phenom x4 computer, than an i5 computer with no mechanical keyboard. It's such a huge deal.

Best analogy I can think of is that it's a rumble pack for the computer. But it's way better than that, it makes everything on the computer fun. Typing is fun. I stayed up a few nights playing mavis beacon when i first got mine.

Unfortunately mine is sitting out right now, I spilled half a bottle of mineral oil on part of it (i know, i know, but i never do things like that, i never eat around my keyboard, and I even wash my hands before i ever touch my keyboard, every time, religiously, but I was lubing some fans up and just forgot to put the cap back on...) and no matter how many 91% IPA baths I've given it, there's like a certain part of the switch where the oil just won't come out (it's plate mounted PCB soldered switches, can't remove switches individually).

Right now the board is 'okay', but theres like 10 keys, where the spill was worst, where the switches are a bit off... like they are at 85% instead of 100% (they aren't as clacky, arent as loud, dont sound as light, they just sound a bit duller.. they are quieter i guess, they arent even typing or gaming keys, total other side of keyboard, the right side, and you wouldnt notice unless i told you, but it bugs me). I'm waiting for some Deoxit D5 to arrive in the mail to lube the switches, hopefully it'll fix it up.

Anyways...

So about franky and stuff... I'd love to see a list compiled of what voltages and such ivy's have degraded/died at. I would be totally okay pushing high end volts and potentially shortening the life of the cpu, I'll be upgrading in 2 years or a year anyways (i know im cheap, but i sell current build on craigslist and get a new one with extra cash in pocket or an upgrade with the sale money). I don't bench, but I like to push 24/7 overclocks... i'd love to push like 1.6v on air for a 24/7 overclock or something like that, or at least know the real limits.

ftw420, vaulgar, vondutch, others, what have you had or heard of that died, at what level, etc? I wish all the overclocking disasters that occurred were compiled somewhere, I mean you hear stuff like "dont push X volts or temps" on stuff but you never really know if those are conservative estimates or not.


----------



## King4x4

God I am debating whether to with a fourth 7950... just got myself a seasonic 1250watt PSU (Was planning to sell for some profit.. PSUs over 700watt are considered as a commoidity locally and retailers abuse customers so was thinking of making a fast 100$ profit) and debating if it's worth changing the gigabyte 1200watt one I have and smacking another 7950 with a waterblock (Checking forums daily for a deal).

I HATE PCs THEY MAKE ME LOSE MONEY!

My wife hates them too


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get a fourth card and bench! Or sell one, your psu and waterblocks and get a phase change unit.


----------



## VonDutch

woohaa, uits -5C outside, i just opened my frontdoor to let cold in, i want to see my coolest core hit -2, maybe even -3C

very important Question (for me) guys,

check this, i can buy a ln2 pot, 25 euro,
but if i look at the picks i dont know what to do..little help pls if i should buy or not..







looks like he made it himself, im not sure if its even thick enough, it looks dirty,
but that doesnt have to be a big problem right, what do you think?
buy, or leave it be ? 25 euro is like 33 dollar

cool, FtW is here ...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I know, right!
> 
> I would rather a mechanical keyboard and an i3/Phenom x4 computer, than an i5 computer with no mechanical keyboard. It's such a huge deal.
> 
> Best analogy I can think of is that it's a rumble pack for the computer. But it's way better than that, it makes everything on the computer fun. Typing is fun. I stayed up a few nights playing mavis beacon when i first got mine.
> 
> Unfortunately mine is sitting out right now, I spilled half a bottle of mineral oil on part of it (i know, i know, but i never do things like that, i never eat around my keyboard, and I even wash my hands before i ever touch my keyboard, every time, religiously, but I was lubing some fans up and just forgot to put the cap back on...) and no matter how many 91% IPA baths I've given it, there's like a certain part of the switch where the oil just won't come out (it's plate mounted PCB soldered switches, can't remove switches individually).
> 
> Right now the board is 'okay', but theres like 10 keys, where the spill was worst, where the switches are a bit off... like they are at 85% instead of 100% (they aren't as clacky, arent as loud, dont sound as light, they just sound a bit duller.. they are quieter i guess, they arent even typing or gaming keys, total other side of keyboard, the right side, and you wouldnt notice unless i told you, but it bugs me). I'm waiting for some Deoxit D5 to arrive in the mail to lube the switches, hopefully it'll fix it up.
> 
> Anyways...
> 
> So about franky and stuff... I'd love to see a list compiled of what voltages and such ivy's have degraded/died at. I would be totally okay pushing high end volts and potentially shortening the life of the cpu, I'll be upgrading in 2 years or a year anyways (i know im cheap, but i sell current build on craigslist and get a new one with extra cash in pocket or an upgrade with the sale money). I don't bench, but I like to push 24/7 overclocks... i'd love to push like 1.6v on air for a 24/7 overclock or something like that, or at least know the real limits.
> 
> ftw420, vaulgar, vondutch, others, what have you had or heard of that died, at what level, etc? I wish all the overclocking disasters that occurred were compiled somewhere, I mean you hear stuff like "dont push X volts or temps" on stuff but you never really know if those are conservative estimates or not.


Hard to say, my only ivy deaths were my first 3770k (my fault, turning on the PC while wet), & a delidded one. Not sure what happened to the delidded 3770k, the frozen IHS & hot die did something with the CL ultra on it.
Worked fine on air, froze it & all was good, loaded it up, cores were all under 0° then shot up faster than I'd ever seen. Pulled the plug.
When I took the IHS off all the tim was at the sides of the die instead of on it, redid the tim & tried it in 2 boards but didn't post anymore.

I haven't seen any degrading in an ivy yet..


----------



## King4x4

Time to find a good used reference 7950! Phase change is out of the question... love my water loop


----------



## VonDutch

here comes the tempdrop ...LOL





grmbl, cant get it under -0C..only 0C, does real temp read below -0C ?
brrr...im cold ..gonna shut the door now , maybe when its -10C outside it will work ..lol
-4C now, should have got up earlier , 6am is the best time i think...


----------



## Swag

Tomorrow I'm going to be hitting up the computer store and checking out which GPU I should buy. It's either the 7970 or 670, I like the 670 because I've never had a problem with Nvidia while AMD, a lot of problems (Don't know how they are now). Which one do you guys think? I will be overclocking I think, but if on stock, which one do you guys think?


----------



## King4x4

I am jelly


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Tomorrow I'm going to be hitting up the computer store and checking out which GPU I should buy. It's either the 7970 or 670, I like the 670 because I've never had a problem with Nvidia while AMD, a lot of problems (Don't know how they are now). Which one do you guys think? I will be overclocking I think, but if on stock, which one do you guys think?


my 7970 runs well, but i cant really compare, its the first big azz vid card i ever had,
could oc it from 1000/1375 to 1100/1500 without changing voltages,
seems mine is hardware locked
but running bf3 on ultra settings online was very nice fps wise,
bandicam did get fps down a bit tho,







fps running in the upper right corner


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Tomorrow I'm going to be hitting up the computer store and checking out which GPU I should buy. It's either the 7970 or 670, I like the 670 because I've never had a problem with Nvidia while AMD, a lot of problems (Don't know how they are now). Which one do you guys think? I will be overclocking I think, but if on stock, which one do you guys think?


Well for me AMD card's are more fun to overclock and drivers are really improving, with Nvidia you get what you pay for not much of an issue with drivers though they are more difficult to overclock then AMD in my point of view either way both are great cards cant go wrong with either of them.
On stock i would say that the 670 may behave better. But if you like to OC AMD is a winner i have a 7870 1000/1200 OCed to 1250/1500


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well for me AMD card's are more fun to overclock and drivers are really improving, with Nvidia you get what you pay for not much of an issue with drivers though they are more difficult to overclock then AMD in my point of view either way both are great cards cant go wrong with either of them.
> On stock i would say that the 670 may behave better. But if you like to OC AMD is a winner i have a 7870 1000/1200 OCed to 1250/1500


hey CyGnus, i see youre back as mod








WB!








(means i have to behave even more then before..LOL )


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> here comes the tempdrop ...LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> grmbl, cant get it under -0C..only 0C, does real temp read below -0C ?
> brrr...im cold ..gonna shut the door now , maybe when its -10C outside it will work ..lol
> -4C now, should have got up earlier , 6am is the best time i think...


Realtemp doesn't read under 0°, nor do a lot of motherboard sensors. Only -2° outside here, but might take the air cooled ivy out to try some cold water cooled 7970.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> woohaa, uits -5C outside, i just opened my frontdoor to let cold in, i want to see my coolest core hit -2, maybe even -3C
> 
> very important Question (for me) guys,
> 
> check this, i can buy a ln2 pot, 25 euro,
> but if i look at the picks i dont know what to do..little help pls if i should buy or not..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> looks like he made it himself, im not sure if its even thick enough, it looks dirty,
> but that doesnt have to be a big problem right, what do you think?
> buy, or leave it be ? 25 euro is like 33 dollar
> 
> cool, FtW is here ...


Filled with dice or ln2 it should do better than water, but looks kinda lightweight to get the most out of ivy. Heavier is better for hot running cpus.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Tomorrow I'm going to be hitting up the computer store and checking out which GPU I should buy. It's either the 7970 or 670, I like the 670 because I've never had a problem with Nvidia while AMD, a lot of problems (Don't know how they are now). Which one do you guys think? I will be overclocking I think, but if on stock, which one do you guys think?


For gaming both seem good, if submitting benchies to hwbot the 7970 would get higher scores in almost everything. AMD drivers have gotten better, I think nvidia has gone a bit downhill when pushing things. With drivers newer than 304.xx I've had corrupted drivers 3 times now (nvidia must have hired a guy who used to write the amd drivers








)


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hey CyGnus, i see youre back as mod
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WB!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (means i have to behave even more then before..LOL )


----------



## King4x4

I am behaving now... since I got two warnning until now... Oh mighty mods have mercy on us wee OCers


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Realtemp doesn't read under 0°, nor do a lot of motherboard sensors. Only -2° outside here, but might take the air cooled ivy out to try some cold water cooled 7970.
> Filled with dice or ln2 it should do better than water, but looks kinda lightweight to get the most out of ivy. Heavier is better for hot running cpus.


thanks FtW,
pity, wanted to see cores temps below -0C reading...o well..at least its running very low noise now









guess i better save more money for a better pot, thought it was to good to be true for that prize,
by heavier you mean, the sides should be alot thicker?
is your phase change cooler hard to make/build? cost alot or?,
and how expensive is it to run 24/7? (electric) or do you only run it when youre benching..
srry, asking alot..but my kids are also very eager to see how this works, would be a great next project to do with them
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I am behaving now... since I got two warnning until now... Oh mighty mods have mercy on us wee OCers


only 2?? ...haha
i take my chances, i know i have to think more before saying anything, and think, "is this ok to say, is it conform TOS ",
im just spontaneous, and i like to keep it that way ..lol


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Tomorrow I'm going to be hitting up the computer store and checking out which GPU I should buy. It's either the 7970 or 670, I like the 670 because I've never had a problem with Nvidia while AMD, a lot of problems (Don't know how they are now). Which one do you guys think? I will be overclocking I think, but if on stock, which one do you guys think?
> 
> 
> 
> Well for me AMD card's are more fun to overclock and drivers are really improving, with Nvidia you get what you pay for not much of an issue with drivers though they are more difficult to overclock then AMD in my point of view either way both are great cards cant go wrong with either of them.
> On stock i would say that the 670 may behave better. But if you like to OC AMD is a winner i have a 7870 1000/1200 OCed to 1250/1500
Click to expand...

i think it depends on the card. the 460 overclocks amazingly, while some AMD cards dont overclock at all. I dont think it's fair to say "AMD cards overclock better".

I dont really feel like overclocking GPUs is really overclocking, its not like RAM, IMC, or CPU overclocking. There isn't much to do (you can maybe replace tim but you basically buy the heatsink with the card and the tim is usually okay what is used anyways, although they use way too much, i usually just go back and wipe half of it off for better temps), and the most you can do is flash the bios... but ive never found increasing volts past the software induced voltage limits to be useful at all, and ive pushed some crazy gpu bios overvolts before...

what i mean is just like the excitement isn't there like it is with cpu or ram overclocking. its too easy, i guess. although it's probably more useful (i mean more useful than the fine tuning of a cpu once you got it in the right range, obviously 4.5 ghz from 3.3 is a big deal, but 4.5 to 5, notsomuch).


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks FtW,
> pity, wanted to see cores temps below -0C reading...o well..at least its running very low noise now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> guess i better save more money for a better pot, thought it was to good to be true for that prize,
> is your phase change cooler hard to make/build? cost alot or?,
> and how expensive is it to run 24/7? (electric) or do you only run it when youre benching..
> only 2?? ...haha
> i take my chances, i know i have to think more before saying anything, and think, "is this ok to say, conform TOS ",
> im just spontaneous, and i like to keep it that way ..lol


I got my phase units from a local builder, they can cost a fair bit new but I got a good deal.
The single stages don't use much power, the cascade can use a fair bit. It has to be the only thing on a 15 amp breaker to start up but running power isn't bad (I'll have to run the kill-a-watt on it next time I start up).
I am running the cascade as a daily machine right now, shutting down while sleeping but on for 12-16 hours a day the last couple days, helps with the heat in here (no actual heaters on the main floor, just electronics & space heaters for heat). I don't pay the hydro bill here though, I live at the house on the worksite, a couple thousand watts would never get noticed.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> i think it depends on the card. the 460 overclocks amazingly, while some AMD cards dont overclock at all. I dont think it's fair to say "AMD cards overclock better".
> 
> I dont really feel like overclocking GPUs is really overclocking, its not like RAM, IMC, or CPU overclocking. There isn't much to do (you can maybe replace tim but you basically buy the heatsink with the card and the tim is usually okay what is used anyways, although they use way too much, i usually just go back and wipe half of it off for better temps), and the most you can do is flash the bios... but ive never found increasing volts past the software induced voltage limits to be useful at all, and ive pushed some crazy gpu bios overvolts before...
> 
> what i mean is just like the excitement isn't there like it is with cpu or ram overclocking. its too easy, i guess. although it's probably more useful (i mean more useful than the fine tuning of a cpu once you got it in the right range, obviously 4.5 ghz from 3.3 is a big deal, but 4.5 to 5, notsomuch).


Gpus can be even harder than cpus to overclock. Most motherboards can give enough voltage, pretty much every card before the 400 series had to be hardmodded to get any voltage increase.
Even cards that do have software voltage can do better with hardmodding, bios modding & cooling.


----------



## VonDutch

i saw someone on youtube taking apart a 70-80 dollar AC unit,
he got it to work on the computer too,

was just looking at this phase change cooling on youtube .. looks very nice





and peltier? ever tried something like that,
this guy made one, for about 12.5 dollar,





i stop asking now ..lol thanks FtW


----------



## Swag

Okay, so reading your inputs, it seems like I'll probably be going down the 670 route. Since there really isn't a "clear" winner, I think I'll go with the manufacturer that has not failed me yet.







Now I have a different question, in regards to the 670, I plan to SLI in the future. Will my 3570k + MVG be able to handle the SLI? Any bottlenecking? On top of that, should I get the 2GB or 4GB version of the 670? Note the price for the 4GB 670 is only $30 shy of the 2GB 680.

I play ONLY on my center monitor for any game whatsoever (I hate triple monitor gaming), however, my full monitor build composes of 3 monitors each at 1440p.


----------



## FtW 420

Ivy & sb-e can still overpower a single stage when overclocked high & fully loaded, but will do much better than water for validations & lighter loads with higher clocks (single & double thread stuff, 3d, etc.).
The only tec cooling i've tried was a water chiller (got water about 5° under ambient). It would take a pretty hefty tec to tame ivy & would not be cheap (it'd take serious water gear just to cool a tec powerful enough).


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, so reading your inputs, it seems like I'll probably be going down the 670 route. Since there really isn't a "clear" winner, I think I'll go with the manufacturer that has not failed me yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I have a different question, in regards to the 670, I plan to SLI in the future. Will my 3570k + MVG be able to handle the SLI? Any bottlenecking? On top of that, should I get the 2GB or 4GB version of the 670? Note the price for the 4GB 670 is only $30 shy of the 2GB 680.
> 
> I play ONLY on my center monitor for any game whatsoever (I hate triple monitor gaming), however, my full monitor build composes of 3 monitors each at 1440p.


Sli works on the mvg, there is no breathing room between the slots with 2 slot coolers though.
Most recommend 4gb cards with 1440p monitors. Mostly read that the games with lots of high res mods just eat up the vram.
I'm not a gamer so can't be too helpful there.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, so reading your inputs, it seems like I'll probably be going down the 670 route. Since there really isn't a "clear" winner, I think I'll go with the manufacturer that has not failed me yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I have a different question, in regards to the 670, I plan to SLI in the future. Will my 3570k + MVG be able to handle the SLI? Any bottlenecking? On top of that, should I get the 2GB or 4GB version of the 670? Note the price for the 4GB 670 is only $30 shy of the 2GB 680.
> 
> I play ONLY on my center monitor for any game whatsoever (I hate triple monitor gaming), however, my full monitor build composes of 3 monitors each at 1440p.
> 
> 
> 
> Sli works on the mvg, there is no breathing room between the slots with 2 slot coolers though.
> Most recommend 4gb cards with 1440p monitors. Mostly read that the games with lots of high res mods just eat up the vram.
> I'm not a gamer so can't be too helpful there.
Click to expand...

I spent $900 on these monitors, I guess I can cough up a bit more for it to run properly. PS: My next venture after these cards, I'll be going water so it's fine with the cooling. I just heard about the 700-series being released in a few months, should I just wait for that? I can wait because there are no games that interest me right now. I plan to start playing a lot more when Day Z standalone comes out or some amazing MMOFPS comes out. I play Aion time to time though.


----------



## FtW 420

If you don't really need a card doesn't hurt to wait a bit & see what 700 series brings.
I just hope they drop the stupid boost thing. At least cpus let us turn off turbo & set the clocks where we want.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If you don't really need a card doesn't hurt to wait a bit & see what 700 series brings.
> I just hope they drop the stupid boost thing. At least cpus let us turn off turbo & set the clocks where we want.


What do you mean about the boost? Yea, any ETA on them? If it's within the near future, I will wait for that. I'm not in a huge rush right now since I don't play too many PC games. I plan to move back from XBOX to PC after new releases but for now, I'm using my xbox.


----------



## VonDutch

i know HT off or on gives a bit lower temps, and higher gflops,
but does it lower vcore too?
or does it stay the same, i havent tried it, just wondering,
if so, i could oc higher see









5.0ghz without HT


5.0ghz with HT

nvm the cpu-z reading, i think i used the same vcore for both that time, did both runs the same moment,
just to show the difference in gflops


----------



## FtW 420

Read somewhere we should be getting news about 700 series around march, not sure when actual launch might be.

Nvidia 600 series has the core speed boost, whatever clocks you set, there is a boost on top of that.










You can see the stock clocks in gpu-z, but with the boost it actually runs at 1200Mhz when loaded.
I'd like it better if I could just set 1200 & have it run at 1200 without having to leave something open & load it up just to see what the actual clocks are.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Read somewhere we should be getting news about 700 series around march, not sure when actual launch might be.
> 
> Nvidia 600 series has the core speed boost, whatever clocks you set, there is a boost on top of that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can see the stock clocks in gpu-z, but with the boost it actually runs at 1200Mhz when loaded.
> I'd like it better if I could just set 1200 & have it run at 1200 without having to leave something open & load it up just to see what the actual clocks are.


Oh, I got you. God, all this wait is making me want to just drop a lot of money to go water and just buy the GPUs later.


----------



## King4x4

If you thinking of going SLI then you might as well get two 7950s...OC them a bit and you get all of the benefits of increased ram and double the performance of a single 670.

Trust me when I say that wto 7950s clocked at 1100mhz gave me 70+ FPS on BF3 at 2560x1440 with 4xAA and full ultra settings.

Hell two of those can run a 7680x1440 system with a few options turned down (no aa and shadow on Medium).

Best Bang Per Buck = 7950s this generation.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> If you thinking of going SLI then you might as well get two 7950s...OC them a bit and you get all of the benefits of increased ram and double the performance of a single 670.
> 
> Trust me when I say that wto 7950s clocked at 1100mhz gave me 70+ FPS on BF3 at 2560x1440 with 4xAA and full ultra settings.
> 
> Hell two of those can run a 7680x1440 system with a few options turned down (no aa and shadow on Medium).
> 
> Best Bang Per Buck = 7950s this generation.


I will wait until the next generation. So it will be the 8000 series vs 700 series.







Ugh, I hate waiting for new stuff! I wish things were released to when I wanted them to.


----------



## King4x4

If it was a 1 month wait it would be nice.... but waiting for more then 5 months... thats just too much for me


----------



## VonDutch

haha, im a, "i want it, and i want it now" kinda guy,
sure i can wait for generation 9xxx, or for the intel 5770K, maybe they are better/faster etc, i just hate waiting..lol

brr, im still cold for having that frontdoor open this morning ..lol
-5C was nice tho for the cores







bet the coldest cores went under -0C, maybe -2 or -3C even
should have seen me, took a shawl, and was waving like a propeller with it in the hallway ..haha,
layed down the computer on its side, took of a sidepanel too








crazy? ..nah, just enthusiastic


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm sooo sooo tempted to de-lid....
If I find a proper blade...then I might give it a whirl + record a video.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i know HT off or on gives a bit lower temps, and higher gflops,
> but does it lower vcore too?
> or does it stay the same, i havent tried it, just wondering,
> if so, i could oc higher see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.0ghz without HT
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.0ghz with HT
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nvm the cpu-z reading, i think i used the same vcore for both that time, did both runs the same moment,
> just to show the difference in gflops


Intresting - Might have to try out a NON-HT overclock myself, see if it requires a lower VCore.

Currently eye-balling a LD phase-cooler *MUST RESIST TEMPTATION!*.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm sooo sooo tempted to de-lid....
> If I find a proper blade...then I might give it a whirl + record a video.


that would be cool, we could use some "OCN homemade delid vids"..lol
i have a bunch,
my kids doing some old pentiums, not sure if they are good enough to use here tho, as examples i mean








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Intresting - Might have to try out a NON-HT overclock myself, see if it requires a lower VCore.


me too, if i find time, and feel like it, i will surely try with my daily 4.7ghz oc








also wonder now, if it would be easier to get it stable without HT ..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> that would be cool, we could use some "OCN homemade delid vids"..lol
> i have a bunch,
> my kids doing some old pentiums, not sure if they are good enough to use here tho, as examples i mean
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> me too, if i find time, and feel like it, i will surely try with my daily 4.7ghz oc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also wonder now, if it would be easier to get it stable without HT ..


I know that a mate told me that on his i7 920 turning HT off increased stability, whether this was just due to less heat or what I'm unsure.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> that would be cool, we could use some "OCN homemade delid vids"..lol
> i have a bunch,
> my kids doing some old pentiums, not sure if they are good enough to use here tho, as examples i mean
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> me too, if i find time, and feel like it, i will surely try with my daily 4.7ghz oc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also wonder now, if it would be easier to get it stable without HT ..


There's one I found on YouTube, and that's very good, although I think leaving the processor on the table, then having a knife (rather than picking it up) is a better idea.
I' thinking of doing it for fun, and then applying Arctic MX4 inside and out.

Just a thought:
Most do the line method, swag did the dot method. (as I'm leaning towards the line)
Which do you suggest Dutch?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I know that a mate told me that on his i7 920 turning HT off increased stability, whether this was just due to less heat or what I'm unsure.


yea, i figured that much, no clue on the why tho








less threads, more stability?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> There's one I found on YouTube, and that's very good, although I think leaving the processor on the table, then having a knife (rather than picking it up) is a better idea.
> I' thinking of doing it for fun, and then applying Arctic MX4 inside and out.
> 
> Just a thought:
> Most do the line method, swag did the dot method. (as I'm leaning towards the line)
> Which do you suggest Dutch?


a rubber plate, works good, put a corner on it, then delid a corner,
the table we used is made of "deal wood"(strange word, but google tanslated that way..lol)
its soft wood so good to use as underground, wont slide that way,







heres my kiddo doing a corner on a pentium

endresult, we even delidded the soldered ones ..lol


nooo, no mx4 on the die , liquid pro or ultra! ...LOL

when i used AS5 on the die and ihs, i used the spread method, like the manual suggests,
i know theres more chance for airbubbles etc, but i never had trouble with it, and i used it for years..
i just twist it a bit in both directions, before tightening the cooler all the way

i think for ivy, because of the shape of the die, line might work best,
i watched several vids i could find, and compared them all, but cant really say,. that one works best,
depends on viscosity of the tim too, how it spreads with any tim you use..
i would just follow the makers manual, and look what they say whats the best way to apply their tim

liquid pro is the same, spread method works best..


----------



## Kolt21

For a super paranoid delider, is there any way to damage the IHS? I mean purposefully pointing the blade towards it slightly could almost completely prevent damages to the cpu.

EDIT: maybey I just need to watch a vid of someone cutting with the blade. do we have any of those?

Its one of those things, if nothing was on the line I would probably just calmly do it and succeed perfectly without even thinking about it. But since alot is at steak its in my head in a bad way.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> For a super paranoid delider, is there any way to damage the IHS? I mean purposefully pointing the blade towards it slightly could almost completely prevent damages to the cpu.
> 
> EDIT: maybey I just need to watch a vid of someone cutting with the blade. do we have any of those?
> 
> Its one of those things, if nothing was on the line I would probably just calmly do it and succeed perfectly without even thinking about it. But since alot is at steak its in my head in a bad way.


just posted one my kids and i made ..lol
got several of them ...

if your in doubt, or think , what if.....dont do it yet..
learn some more, watch more vid's etc, till you get the, "yeah, now im gonna do it", feeling








feeling confident is important too..


----------



## stickg1

I chipped the core on one last night and somehow the chip is fully functional...couldn't believe it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just posted one my kids and i made ..lol
> got several of them ...
> 
> if your in doubt, or think , what if.....dont do it yet..
> learn some more, watch more vid's etc, till you get the, "yeah, now im gonna do it", feeling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> feeling confident is important too..


ah ok!
And why the liquid pro over the MX4 in that respect







?
I know it is better in some aspects, but will that make a huge difference?
I know 1-2c difference is possible.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I chipped the core on one last night and somehow the chip is fully functional...couldn't believe it.


wow how did you chip it?
As in where? lol


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> ah ok!
> And why the liquid pro over the MX4 in that respect
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> I know it is better in some aspects, but will that make a huge difference?
> I know 1-2c difference is possible.


Huge difference... Like almost 20c less with liquid pro.... I did use mx-4 on die before using LP... After some time mx-4 was not cooling like the first boot up... Once i got the LP and took everything apart, the MX-4 paste was all dry up and hard. Think is because the die gets really hot too fast and the paste is not able to stand that kind of change... LP is different since is a liquid metal. I used LP in the die, in the botton on the ihs and also on top with HSF

EDIT: my temp difference was 27c from stock intel ****ty paste just using LP.

Edit2: if you want to delidd, i do recommend for you to use a thin razor blade.. its the best way.(that1s what i used).


----------



## I_shot

Including Coollab and phobya liquid metal and my fav. tim gelid extreme


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> ah ok!
> And why the liquid pro over the MX4 in that respect
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> I know it is better in some aspects, but will that make a huge difference?
> I know 1-2c difference is possible.


AS5, 80C hottest core


liquid pro, 55C hottest core


one could say, yea, but AS5 is a bad tim, hence the big difference,
it maybe old, but its still in the top15 tim's,
with not that much difference to the best ones, 4-5C at most









because the die is small, the w/mk of the tim is important,
when used on the IHS tho, theres not that much difference compared to other tim's..

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 38w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
everything else is less


----------



## Kolt21

Yea I just watched it von. Thank You.

it seems easy to an extent but I have a question.

From that video it looks like the blade is a really tight fit. Is it actually relatively hard to cut into the side? by just focusing on keeping the blade perfectly verticle a person going slowly and with attention to detail would it be easy to not cut anything but the glue?

And how much harder is it to do with just a box cutter blade. The actual box cutter I have doesnt potrude enough of the blade to really be confident in this application and is bulky and awkward and made of steel.


----------



## stickg1

On the die liquid pro or ultra is better by 10 to 15 degrees because it's the closest thing to actual solder. On the IHS it's only a few degrees better.

The razor slipped and went it too far and chipped the die. There was a lot of resistance and then all the sudden there was none, then oops!


----------



## Kolt21

And also, from what I have been hearing my h100i Is already underperforming prior to delid.

Would this be the best solution?






What kind of difference would I see?

Is there a better way?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Yea I just watched it von. Thank You.
> 
> it seems easy to an extent but I have a question.
> 
> From that video it looks like the blade is a really tight fit. Is it actually relatively hard to cut into the side? by just focusing on keeping the blade perfectly verticle a person going slowly and with attention to detail would it be easy to not cut anything but the glue?
> 
> And how much harder is it to do with just a box cutter blade. The actual box cutter I have doesnt potrude enough of the blade to really be confident in this application and is bulky and awkward and made of steel.


dont forget, were delidding old pentiums, that where in computers for like 10 years ..lol
its harder to get the blade into the corners that way,
thats why its best to delid your ivy as soon as possible, the longer its in there, the "harder"it is to get a blade into a corner..
the choice of blade is upto you, but most peeps here say, a razorblade works very well,
something like this,


this one works well too,

bit safer to work with, but you can also tape one side of the razor blade above

after doing all those pentiums with my kids,
we now say, "its not what you use to delid, its how you use it"

with any blade you use, you can mess the delid up,
i delidded mine before i joined here, theres so much more info now thanks to this thread

yea, keep the blade right angled all the time, and youll be fine ..

dont let it go to either side..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> And also, from what I have been hearing my h100i Is already underperforming prior to delid.
> 
> Would this be the best solution?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What kind of difference would I see?
> 
> Is there a better way?


yeah , i know the ultimate way to get the most out your H100




skip to 6-7 min...LOL

( i can do funny too sometimes Kolt21 ..LOL )
jk with ya


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yeah , i know the ultimate way to get the most out your H100
> 
> 
> 
> 
> skip to 6-7 min...LOL


HAHAHAHA, i saw that before, just insane.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Understood guys - I will get liquid pro or ultra if I actually de-lid.
Come to think of it, I couldn't find much difference between pro vs ultra:
Price wise identical:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-013-CL
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-005-CL

Although ULTRA seems easier to wipe off.

Then for THAT application, I saw on their site, it is a spread technique.
Thus for liquid pro/ultra, how do you guys apply it both on the die and above it.

Do you also apply liquid pro and/or suggest it for everything in that respect?
Or MX4 for the top, liquid pro at the "bottom"?

EDIT:
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/274824-11-thermal-compound-roundup-2011

Read that.
Seems like liquid pro is a bit dangerous when coming to removal?
As for MX4 on the top of the IHS - seems like there's no difference there.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Understood guys - I will get liquid pro or ultra if I actually de-lid.
> Come to think of it, I couldn't find much difference between pro vs ultra
> 
> Then for THAT application, I saw on their site, it is a spread technique.
> Thus for liquid pro/ultra, how do you guys apply it both on the die and above it.
> 
> Do you also apply liquid pro and/or suggest it for everything in that respect?
> Or MX4 for the top, liquid pro at the "bottom"?
> 
> EDIT:
> http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/274824-11-thermal-compound-roundup-2011
> 
> Read that.
> Seems like liquid pro is a bit dangerous when coming to removal?
> As for MX4 on the top of the IHS - seems like there's no difference there.


On the die, use pro.. On the ihs you can use mx-4 no problem..


----------



## [CyGnus]

Totally Dubbed mx-4 is pretty bad for the die even ceramique is better about 6/7ºc difference compared to mx-4. Try to order some CLP its really worth it for the IHS you can use MX-4 for the die stay away from it.


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yeah , i know the ultimate way to get the most out your H100
> 
> 
> 
> 
> skip to 6-7 min...LOL
> 
> ( i can do funny too sometimes Kolt21 ..LOL )
> jk with ya


Im gonna need a bigger case... alot of sleeving and.....alright you got me. That was actually hilarious. Especially when the guy says in a over excited european accent "Its Actually Quite Tidy" "And Its So Quiet" As you look at a rats nest of cords and hear what sounds like a twin turbo jet engine in the background taking off.

hahahaha

but on a serious note, do cougars provide the highest cfm?

is 2 on top 2 on bottom the optimal way to run h100i? (WITH IT STILL FITTIN IN THE CASE VON DUTCH) lol

And the BIG question I have is. What benefit am I going to see? I forget who said it but earlier someone said that my H100i is NOT performing optimally if its getting 86c pre-delid on 1.3v and that my problem is using stock fan setup.

And I would really like to light the **** up if possible without compromising on cooling. After all, Its more exciting to buy fans when they will bring more cool lighting effects to the table as well.


----------



## Kolt21

[quote name=

with any blade you use, you can mess the delid up,
i delidded mine before i joined here, theres so much more info now thanks to this thread

yea, keep the blade right angled all the time, and youll be fine ..

dont let it go to either side..[/quote]

I am feeling alot more confident about it but I hear nightmare stories of, "well yea it looked easy when I watched a vid so I just did it the same and for some reason when the glue finally gave my blade didnt stop like the videos, it just slammed right into the die."

And that is quite terrifying considering the pressure you obviously have to use. Your sons hand was clearly holding the cpu extremely tight, was he applying equal pressure with the blade or just moderate. I want my blade to just slide to a stop like that one did. And like I said I feel I may just be over thinking this way to much because of whats at stake..... but people keep saying the pressure required to cut the glue will send the blade soaring into the die like a bullet. Q_Q

EDIT: Wanted to clarify to all who are interested. My CLP and arctic silver is on its way, will be arriving in a day or two, I am delidding not one but TWO i7 3770k's. I will be delidding as soon as the package arrives. I cannot afford to **** up either CPU, I have 2 identical comps, whatever I do to one, I do to the other. So if I get new fans, they both get new fans, if I delid, they both get delidded.

I absolutely cannot afford to **** up either delid, and That is not going to stop be from delidding. I cant be talked out of it. What I am trying to do right now is get as much information as I can to not be crying on here later. lol

I plan to join the club so real soon ill need to do a test on my current Overclock that can be posted here for before and after. Prime95 didnt save my 26 hour small ftt test so I need to use something else. What is the fastest test for club joining purposes?

I will be posting Both computers in my sig as my 2 chips are wildly different in terms of overclockability. one seems above average, the other isnt such a lottery winner.

Ill get a cool avatar of my delid as well.

I am EVEN considerring making a vid of the delid. But no guarantees there. It would be helpful for noobs coming later in my boat wanting to see a first timer do it with everything at stake and no way to replace the cpu's. Its alot harder to work up the courage in my circumstances.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dont forget, were delidding old pentiums, that where in computers for like 10 years ..lol
> its harder to get the blade into the corners that way,
> thats why its best to delid your ivy as soon as possible, the longer its in there, the "harder"it is to get a blade into a corner..
> the choice of blade is upto you, but most peeps here say, a razorblade works very well,
> something like this,
> 
> 
> this one works well too,
> 
> bit safer to work with, but you can also tape one side of the razor blade above
> 
> after doing all those pentiums with my kids,
> we now say, "its not what you use to delid, its how you use it"
> 
> with any blade you use, you can mess the delid up,
> i delidded mine before i joined here, theres so much more info now thanks to this thread
> 
> yea, keep the blade right angled all the time, and youll be fine ..
> 
> dont let it go to either side..


Liking the good use of my photos!









Youtube has a lot of De-Lidding videos.. Some are really good ideas or "How to's" but some are just good examples of how to not do it!








I can say that you should practice on some old pentiums/Celerons or even some of the older AMD chips were glued.

The razors that VonDutch has suggested has lead you in the right direction, I'd also like to add practicing putting the thermal paste on the old Pentiums etc is good too, just use some generic stuff or MX-2/MX-4 or even toothpaste just to see/feel how much you really need. You might be lucky like me and get an entire 775 "Glued" system to test all your de-lidded chips in! Both of mine worked, so my success rate is 66% because I can't test the socket 478 Pentium 4's I found in my drawer. All in all it's not a hard task just be set to have an hour or more to re-build the system and such and expect problems. You also might like to have some money for a new i5/i7 if it breaks or even a i3 until you can afford a new CPU.

Uh, one last thing to add is do it soon or you'll be like me and have a tough time getting the blade in for the first time around. (I went around it 2-3 times gradually getting deeper cuts till it was lose.
Also for cleaning the chip, use your fingernails (Don't trim them for a few days







) or get a credit card. Do NOT use a knife/blade for this as I chipped a Pentium 4 by stuffing around with that.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> On the die, use pro.. On the ihs you can use mx-4 no problem..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Totally Dubbed mx-4 is pretty bad for the die even ceramique is better about 6/7ºc difference compared to mx-4. Try to order some CLP its really worth it for the IHS you can use MX-4 for the die stay away from it.


Understood for the die.
As for ON the IHS, seeing as if I order CLP/U, then i might as well apply it ON the IHS too correct?

And again, with application of CLP - is it a line, or a dot method on the die?
As on the IHS, it seems that the video the company provides is the spread method.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Im gonna need a bigger case... alot of sleeving and.....alright you got me. That was actually hilarious. Especially when the guy says in a over excited european accent "Its Actually Quite Tidy" "And Its So Quiet" As you look at a rats nest of cords and hear what sounds like a twin turbo jet engine in the background taking off.
> 
> hahahaha
> 
> but on a serious note, do cougars provide the highest cfm?
> 
> is 2 on top 2 on bottom the optimal way to run h100i? (WITH IT STILL FITTIN IN THE CASE VON DUTCH) lol
> 
> And the BIG question I have is. What benefit am I going to see? I forget who said it but earlier someone said that my H100i is NOT performing optimally if its getting 86c pre-delid on 1.3v and that my problem is using stock fan setup.
> 
> And I would really like to light the **** up if possible without compromising on cooling. After all, Its more exciting to buy fans when they will bring more cool lighting effects to the table as well.


push/pull works, i did that with my mugen, but it only shaved of a few degrees, not sure if it was worth the money spent on it,
its not only the high cfm, but also, i think for the radiator, the air pressure,

the Scythe Slip Stream SY1225SL12LM-P, 120mm that came with my cooler have a
Luchtstroom (m³/h) 126m³/h
Luchtstroom (CFM) 74cf/m
1300rpm
Geluidssterkte 26,6dB

i thought that was good, for that rpm, bought another later for the push/pull setup,
but after delid, i disabled 1, no need for that anymore, it runs cool enough..

the ones you showed me, are good, others may have better tips tho, on what to use best with a H100,
but dont expect a very big tempdrop,
its your "bad" die to ihs mount thats the cause of it running that hot..that is different also with ivy's, like the difference in vcores..
lottery on the temps..

have to go to the grocery ..laters


----------



## Kolt21

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> push/pull works, i did that with my mugen, but it only shaved of a few degrees, not sure if it was worth the money spent on it,
> its not only the high cfm, but also, i think for the radiator, the air pressure,
> 
> the Scythe Slip Stream SY1225SL12LM-P, 120mm that came with my cooler have a
> Luchtstroom (m³/h) 126m³/h
> Luchtstroom (CFM) 74cf/m
> 1300rpm
> Geluidssterkte 26,6dB
> 
> i thought that was good, for that rpm, bought another later for the push/pull setup,
> but after delid, i disabled 1, no need for that anymore, it runs cool enough..
> 
> the ones you showed me, are good, others may have better tips tho, on what to use best with a H100,
> but dont expect a very big tempdrop,
> its your "bad" die to ihs mount thats the cause of it running that hot..that is different also with ivy's, like the difference in vcores..
> lottery on the temps..


Thats what I was thinking, But someone (kicking myself for not remembering the name, I suppose I could not be lazy and sift through the last 50 pages to find it) said point blank, if your that hot BEFORE delidding your h100i is not setup correctly, if you are using stock fans, thats the problem.

@VonDutch - I would like your personal feedback on my last post on page 843. I trust your judgement.


----------



## Kolt21

Accidental Repost. Well since I accidently posted might as well make use of the space. lol

I will be giving you props in my video if I make it von dutch (And I think I will make one).

It will be a delidding video by an amatuer first time delidder for amatuer first time delidders. emphasizing that i am up **** creek with no paddle if it fails and failure is not an option. Im hoping it will help people on the fence due to financial reasons work up the guts to JUST do it.

Didnt know id get a valguar reference in there did you? haha


----------



## I_shot

Hey guys,

My cpu is not stable at 4.6 ghz 1.36V anymore. i did cinebenchtest but it gives errors including this

DebugMode: Off
}
Opened Scenes
{
Active Scene: 00000000087455C0 "D:\Overclock\CINEBENCH_11.529\plugins\bench\cpu\cpu.c4d"
}
Exception
{
ExceptionNumber = 0xC0000005
ExceptionText = "ACCESS_VIOLATION"
Address = 0x0000000140230FA3
Thread = 4232
Last_Error = 0x00000000


----------



## Totally Dubbed

You tried reinstalling the software and enabling hpet?
I had those problems with 3d mark


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If you don't really need a card doesn't hurt to wait a bit & see what 700 series brings.
> I just hope they drop the stupid boost thing. At least cpus let us turn off turbo & set the clocks where we want.


If you check the kboost box it will run at a fixed frequency. Look for it in precision.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> Thats what I was thinking, But someone (kicking myself for not remembering the name, I suppose I could not be lazy and sift through the last 50 pages to find it) said point blank, if your that hot BEFORE delidding your h100i is not setup correctly, if you are using stock fans, thats the problem.
> 
> *@VonDutch - I would like your personal feedback on my last post on page 843*. I trust your judgement.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kolt21*
> 
> I am feeling alot more confident about it but I hear nightmare stories of, "well yea it looked easy when I watched a vid so I just did it the same and for some reason when the glue finally gave my blade didnt stop like the videos, it just slammed right into the die."
> 
> *And that is quite terrifying considering the pressure you obviously have to use. Your sons hand was clearly holding the cpu extremely tight, was he applying equal pressure with the blade or just moderate. I want my blade to just slide to a stop like that one did. And like I said I feel I may just be over thinking this way to much because of whats at stake..... but people keep saying the pressure required to cut the glue will send the blade soaring into the die like a bullet.* Q_Q
> 
> EDIT: Wanted to clarify to all who are interested. My CLP and arctic silver is on its way, will be arriving in a day or two, I am delidding not one but TWO i7 3770k's. I will be delidding as soon as the package arrives. I cannot afford to **** up either CPU, I have 2 identical comps, whatever I do to one, I do to the other. So if I get new fans, they both get new fans, if I delid, they both get delidded.
> 
> I absolutely cannot afford to **** up either delid, and That is not going to stop be from delidding. I cant be talked out of it. What I am trying to do right now is get as much information as I can to not be crying on here later. lol
> 
> I plan to join the club so real soon ill need to do a test on my current Overclock that can be posted here for before and after. Prime95 didnt save my 26 hour small ftt test so I need to use something else. What is the fastest test for club joining purposes?
> 
> I will be posting Both computers in my sig as my 2 chips are wildly different in terms of overclockability. one seems above average, the other isnt such a lottery winner.
> 
> Ill get a cool avatar of my delid as well.
> 
> I am EVEN considerring making a vid of the delid. But no guarantees there. It would be helpful for noobs coming later in my boat wanting to see a first timer do it with everything at stake and no way to replace the cpu's. Its alot harder to work up the courage in my circumstances.


you mean that part of the post i assume?
have to ask who's the people who said that, did they delid a cpu too?

it takes some pressure of course, the wiggle method is a good one to use, as you could see in that vid,
told him to take his time with it, that it wasnt a competition who would be the fastest delidder..lol( 14 and 15 year old ..well )
you can see when the blade starts to go into the adhesive, thats the moment you put less pressure on it,
and let the wiggle and blade do its work..

i saw idontcare over at anandtech use a hammer method once,
i thought it was a good one to use, he said hes clumsy with his hands..lol, and it worked for him,
we did a few like that too, you can very precise use the force to cut through the glue,
i mentioned it here, but it got rejected, as being a bad method,
will show you the vids anyways ..lol just for fun








its a 2 man job if you want to do it right tho..

HAMMERTIME!








.

Kolt21, you should read his post about him delidding his ivy too,
its a great read, ive learned alot of it
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&highlight=delid

maybe i mentioned it before,
but can you get a or some old pentiums somehow?
i bought 10 for 10 euro over here on a forum,
great to practice on, and get the feel for it..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Liking the good use of my photos!


told you i could use them someday ..lol thanks again


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Nice one!
(I still have no feedback about my previous post







)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Nice one!
> (I still have no feedback about my previous post
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


reading back, just got home again, which post do you mean Totally Dubbed?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Understood for the die.
> As for ON the IHS, seeing as if I order CLP/U, then i might as well apply it ON the IHS too correct?
> 
> And again, with application of CLP - is it a line, or a dot method on the die?
> As on the IHS, it seems that the video the company provides is the spread method.


you can,
important is the use of clp/u on the die,
on the ihs, any good tim will do..im liquid pro all the way tho









thin layer on the die, spread method,
i did a thin layer on the die, then put the ihs back on, to get a print on the inside ihs,
and did another thin layer inside the ihs also..spread method,
then i did a thin layer on the ihs, spread method, seated my cooler to get a print on that too,
and applied another thin layer on the cooler too








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Understood guys - I will get liquid pro or ultra if I actually de-lid.
> Come to think of it, I couldn't find much difference between pro vs ultra:
> Price wise identical:
> http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-013-CL
> http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-005-CL
> 
> Although ULTRA seems easier to wipe off.
> 
> Then for THAT application, I saw on their site, it is a spread technique.
> Thus for liquid pro/ultra, how do you guys apply it both on the die and above it.
> 
> Do you also apply liquid pro and/or suggest it for everything in that respect?
> Or MX4 for the top, liquid pro at the "bottom"?
> 
> EDIT:
> http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/274824-11-thermal-compound-roundup-2011
> 
> Read that.
> Seems like liquid pro is a bit dangerous when coming to removal?
> As for MX4 on the top of the IHS - seems like there's no difference there.


i dont know about the dangerous, but its harder to remove they say,
on the other hand, when you cant remove all, and you use another tim next,
it can "upgrade" the lesser tim also(thanks to the high W/mk)

i dont see a problem, since i will use the same liquid again, if i remove the cooler, and/or ihs
some say, heat it up a bit before remove the cooler, hairdryer would do ..
gallium has a low melting point see, and is the biggest component in either ultra or pro,
so, in my case, today it was -5C, i would run prime or ibt for a while before removing..









in the package theres some goodies you can use also,


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> reading back, just got home again, which post do you mean Totally Dubbed?


thanks!
This:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/8430#post_19054974

and this:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/8420#post_19054877


----------



## Valgaur

Well screw you too phone.... ugh.

Remember guys im still planning on doing a nice indepth video for delidding and I can also use ole Franky for this diagram as well. For I believe Kolt and the cougar fans. They are the best cfm for rads but the price is high that's why I also recommended the sickles its really personal choices in my head.

FtW420. Are you going to Toronto? Its a 20 hour drive for me lol. Still planning on going but just curious if im all alone. Forever alone.... lol

Uuuuuuuuuuuuhm sorry very tired and on here in my art class. Woo freaking hoo right? If you got any questions let me know on here and ill try to respond lol. Darn you VonDutch and being able to be on here and more awake than me!!!!! :mad


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> thanks!
> This:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/8430#post_19054974
> 
> and this:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/8420#post_19054877


thanks ..lol








got it answered in the post above yours


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well screw you too phone.... ugh.
> 
> Remember guys im still planning on doing a nice indepth video for delidding and I can also use ole Franky for this diagram as well. For I believe Kolt and the cougar fans. They are the best cfm for rads but the price is high that's why I also recommended the sickles its really personal choices in my head.
> 
> Uuuuuuuuuuuuhm sorry very tired and on here in my art class. Woo freaking hoo right? If you got any questions let me know on here and ill try to respond lol.
> *Darn you VonDutch and being able to be on here and more awake than me!!!!!* :mad


i consider myself to be the day shift








when i sleep, you guys are here..gotta love timezones ...LOL
almost 6PM over here..

you really think kolt needs new fans, after delid i dont think he will need better ones ..lol
i know my simple aircooler can handle ivy now tempwise ..np


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i consider myself to be the day shift
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when i sleep, you guys are here..gotta love timezones ...LOL
> 
> you really think kolt needs new fans, after delid i dont think he will need better ones ..lol
> i know my simple aircooler can handle ivy now tempwise ..np


Never said he does but if he wants them you can. Honestly with Ivy the way it is delidding does more than enough as is. Fans shouldn't be and issue first. Solve Ivys heat distance issues then think if you need better fans. You know better tim yada yada yada.

Also with my video might try to make it OCNs official delid video as well. See if I can work with admin or one of the intel mods and see what they think.


----------



## VonDutch

lol, we go from photos , to video's...whats next ...live seminar on how to delid ? ...LOL

but i really like that idea Val.. "OCNs official delid video"


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i consider myself to be the day shift
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when i sleep, you guys are here..gotta love timezones ...LOL
> 
> you really think kolt needs new fans, after delid i dont think he will need better ones ..lol
> i know my simple aircooler can handle ivy now tempwise ..np


With that we could even try to make an OCN youtube channel lol. Then throw a good chuck of overclocking guides and such on there and make it much easier to link people our items.


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'll tell ya what man. I will give you the crucial RAM for free if you just quit posting about RAM. LOL!!
> 
> I'm serious. PM me your address, the only condition is that your not allowed to ask or talk about RAM for 2 months in any thread that I frequent..


LOL! that's a devil's pact







... god deal either way








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get a 3770k next time...
> 
> Guys, wish me luck with my 670 ftw sale. I need it gone or otherwise I won't be able to pay my rent worst case scenario.


GLWS man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Isn't ivy throttling by 95*C?


where did you see this information?
Sandy Bridge 1155 TJunctionmax was 98C
Ivy Bridge 1155 TJunctionMax is at 105C ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Many of the extreme overclockers at OCN literally avoid this section of the forum. I was one of the few who still read in here & post once in a while, been more active in here since reading about valgaur & von dutch's exploits though. It's like they've turned a lot of guys onto pushing limits more.
> Looking at my previous post about not pushing 1.5V or more on air, makes me remember I used to do just that before starting to get subzero cooling gear just so I could keep doing it & go higher voltage yet, to not kill stuff & keep overclocking higher.


LOL, this thread is insanely popular and actually one of my favorites on OCN








... wondering why others avoid it ...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Read somewhere we should be getting news about 700 series around march, not sure when actual launch might be.


Last time I heard, the 700 series was delayed until November, no? maybe I'm wrong, but I wouldn't hold my breath for 780 appearing in March ...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> got it answered in the post above yours


Thanks a lot for the response.
My my, that's a lot of spreading.

-Die only - within IHS die "print"
-Then top of IHS spread, and then bottom of cooler spread.

That's what I understand from CLP - it is a spreading type thing, rather than dot/line symbol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Thanks a lot for the response.
> My my, that's a lot of spreading.
> 
> -Die only - within IHS die "print"
> -Then top of IHS spread, and then bottom of cooler spread.
> 
> That's what I understand from CLP - it is a spreading type thing, rather than dot/line symbol.


yes, its a spreading type thingy ..lol









its upto you really,
others only applied it on die, and ihs,
or die only, and used another tim on the ihs..
i thought my way works well, thats all..

the spreading isnt a 1 hour job , took me just a few minutes to apply it all,
i used the Q-tip that came with the package,
and 1 time i tried with the needle from the seringe, worked,
i read thats one way of applying too(coollabs)
and 1 time using a chirurg glove, worked also

i tried different ways of applying see, to find out what works , and what not


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yes, its a spreading type thingy ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its upto you really,
> others only applied it on die, and ihs,
> or die only, and used another tim on the ihs..
> i thought my way works well, thats all..
> 
> the spreading isnt a 1 hour job , took me just a few minutes to apply it all,
> i used the Q-tip that came with the package,
> and 1 time i tried with the needle from the seringe, worked,
> i read thats one way of applying too(coollabs)
> and 1 time using a chirurg glove, worked also
> 
> i tried different ways of applying see, to find out what works , and what not


I find it interesting, and makes me curious, as to why people would use a different one for the top bit of the IHS?
If anyone has done this, could they say why







?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I find it interesting, and makes me curious, as to why people would use a different one for the top bit of the IHS?
> If anyone has done this, could they say why
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


I did for experimentation and testing.


----------



## Edge Of Pain

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I find it interesting, and makes me curious, as to why people would use a different one for the top bit of the IHS?
> If anyone has done this, could they say why
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


Maybe because they accept that Liquid Pro is the best thing to use on the die but still think that their particular thermal paste is more thermally conductive on top.

i.e., they believe their thermal paste is superior.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well i got a new find managed to get 2400MHz out of the samsung green, i only could get it stable at 2133/2200 but after delidding the CPU they run just fine so maybe the temp drops help a lot the IMC.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Maybe because they accept that Liquid Pro is the best thing to use on the die but still think that their particular thermal paste is more thermally conductive on top.
> 
> i.e., they believe their thermal paste is superior.


Nope. not at all actually. Finally on my computer for once.

Anyways we use TIM instead from the purpose that CLP is already doing for us on the DIE some see results others don't from on IHS applications of either CLP or TIM. this is due in part from the fact that CLP is much better thermally for smaller areas ie. the die of the i7 or i5 you have. So with the IHS we get really good TIM for myself I use Indigo Xtreme and have been testing it and man this stuff is awesome. I really like it. great thermal conductivity and perfect contact every time with the IHS and the Heat Sink or HS.

A lot of people if you look on page one just use the CLP or CLU everywhere lol. but others wanted to see their results and a lot are pretty darn close to each other mainly. This is also due to the fact that the IHS is serving a better purpose than just re distributing pressure over the PCB instead of just the CPU's die. The IHS is for a better distribution of heat from the die to make the heat easier to transfer to the HS and you don't need amazing TIM like CLP or CLU because it is already doing it's purpose moving the heat form the die to the IHS or better explaining this will be explaining the IHS itself. IHS = Integrated Heat Spreader. So normal mid to high range TIM do the job very well.

Hope that better explains things for you.


----------



## VonDutch

well, and i decided to start running my 4.8ghz oc again today, will run it for a while to see how it goes,
this is my 24H prime stable oc @ 1.420V vcore

nice one CyGnus, so i run into a problem i forgot about with my ram,
running at 4.8ghz, i cant use xmp profile with it..tried, didnt boot..without xmp, no problem..

i do use offset with this, using 0.160V offset,( i thought is was to much offset for a while tho? )
i upped ram voltage to 1.55V, its rated 1.5V,
should i up it to 1.6V, and see if it runs with xmp then? no harm if i do?

also, i have a, "internal cpu pll overvoltage", i never really used it before, is it any good to use with ocing?
what could it help if i enable it..


----------



## [CyGnus]

That internal PLL helps a lot high ram speeds above 2133mhz to be stable


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Edge Of Pain*
> 
> Maybe because they accept that Liquid Pro is the best thing to use on the die but still think that their particular thermal paste is more thermally conductive on top.
> 
> i.e., they believe their thermal paste is superior.


No....

ICLLP is best that I have used and I use it only between die and block. I don't use the IHS. Reason why people don't use it on top of IHS is because it is very difficult to clean off and when you do clean it of you need to use a scouring pad and it will scratch off markings on top of die. The other reason people don't use it on top is because the heat sink surface has to be pure copper if not it will eat through the block. Another reason people don't use it is because you have to have perfectly flat surfaces in contact with very thin coat of CLLP for it to work right. Seems like most IHS covers and blocks are not perfectly flat and the contact suffers because of that.


----------



## wholeeo

Has anyone done a direct to die mount with a Swiftech Apogee HD?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> That internal PLL helps a lot high ram speeds above 2133mhz to be stable


really, so it could help me with using xmp profile you think?
only run mine at rated 1600mhz tho..ocing it i can forget..
does it influence other things too?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, and i decided to start running my 4.8ghz oc again today, will run it for a while to see how it goes,
> this is my 24H prime stable oc @ 1.420V vcore
> 
> nice one CyGnus, so i run into a problem i forgot about with my ram,
> running at 4.8ghz, i cant use xmp profile with it..tried, didnt boot..without xmp, no problem..
> 
> i do use offset with this, using 0.160V offset,( i thought is was to much offset for a while tho? )
> i upped ram voltage to 1.55V, its rated 1.5V,
> should i up it to 1.6V, and see if it runs with xmp then? no harm if i do?
> 
> also, i have a, "internal cpu pll overvoltage", i never really used it before, is it any good to use with ocing?
> what could it help if i enable it..


Like Cy says it will help with your RAM try around 1.7 or 1,8 PLL I ran 1.5-1.8 for my everyday OC's depending on the Oc and such. give it a shot and see what happens really lol.


----------



## VonDutch

its called, "internal cpu pll overvoltage", you sure we talk about the same thing?
i can only enable, auto, or disable it

i wanna give it a shot ..np, but i need at least a bit info about what im doing ...LOL

wait, i have a CPU PLL, that i can adjust , but i know how that one works,
this is just another option i have in my bios, but never used it before..

a, they are related im guessing now,
it prolly just overshoots the 1.8V that its set to normally if needed?

think i understand it now, brb, will enable, and see if xmp profile runs..

EDIT,
woohaa, that went very bad,
all kinds of stripes on the windows startup screen, then a bsod,
i also upped my ram voltage to 1.6V..

well, i tried another boot to check, im here now, with the same settings...
not sure if i should leave it enabled, i could enable the xmp profile,
its running now


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> its called, "internal cpu pll overvoltage", you sure we talk about the same thing?
> i can only enable, auto, or disable it


Maybe it's your mobo again. I could adjust the voltage on mine for my OC's..... hmmmmmm


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well that Internal PLL helped me with my OC here are the results:


----------



## feniks

Internal PLL override is not same as CPU PLL voltage, actually they are 2 different things









the first one allows you to OC the CPu multi higher than without it (I use it daily above 47x) and can be auto/enabled/disabled while the latter is the voltage for Phase-Locked-Loop voltage for the CPU and allows for some fine tuning (useful at higher OC to bump it up by 0.05v or so, don't go above 1.9V tho), could be lowered by a lot below 5.0GHz on IB chips. I can use CPU PLL at 1.50V at 4.7GHz, 1.55-1.60V at 4.9-5.0GHz.. lower CPu PLL gives slightly better temps under load.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Maybe it's your mobo again. I could adjust the voltage on mine for my OC's..... hmmmmmm


i can adjust cpu pll, i used it alot with ocing, 1.65-1.75V ive used most of the time,
i think this extra option, internal cpu pll overvoltage, only ups it a bit more,
looks to me its the same as upping the normal cpu pll, got it set to 1.8V atm, maybe thats why it acted so strange when i booted ..lol

hmm, or it only ups it when needed, bit different then a fixed value?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> Internal PLL override is not same as CPU PLL voltage, actually they are 2 different things
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the first one allows you to OC the CPu multi higher than without it (I use it daily above 47x) and can be auto/enabled/disabled while the latter is the voltage for Phase-Locked-Loop voltage for the CPU and allows for some fine tuning (useful at higher OC to bump it up by 0.05v or so, don't go above 1.9V tho), could be lowered by a lot below 5.0GHz on IB chips. I can use CPU PLL at 1.50V at 4.7GHz, 1.55-1.60V at 4.9-5.0GHz.. lower CPu PLL gives slightly better temps under load.


i see, so i was thinking in the right direction, im just starting to run 4.8ghz again,
should i leave it enabled, with 1.8V cpu pll? or just leave it be, i mean, i always oced without using it..

it was acting really weird when i first booted, then it just bsod on me, now it seems to work, after second boot..

haha,. yea, better temps under load, just what i need ..LOL

will reboot a few times, see what happens..brb..


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Great explanations! Plus reps!
Understood then, if I choose to do it then I'll put mx4 at the top and clu on the ihs.
I've received my pack of arctic remover (liquid solution) so now I need a blade...first to check the temps of mx4 vs stock antec


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Great explanations! Plus reps!
> Understood then, if I choose to do it then I'll put mx4 at the top and clu on the ihs.
> I've received my pack of arctic remover (liquid solution) so now I need a blade...first to check the temps of mx4 vs stock antec


CL ultra is also a good choice for on top. It's easier to clean and you don't have to worry about it eating through impure metals. Also it is reported to cool nearly as good as CL LP. I have read about 3c hotter.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> CL ultra is also a good choice for on top. It's easier to clean and you don't have to worry about it eating through impure metals. Doesn't spread as think so you don't need perfect flat surfaces. Also it is reported to cool nearly as good as CL LP. I have read about 3c hotter.


----------



## Gomi

Well, started tinkering with the memory - 100 % noob when it comes to pushing sticks, and only did load the XMP settings and changed 2T -> 1T. System just gives me a memory error if I try and run it at 2800Mhz - Guess there is alot of reading up to do











Will do a HT on/off OC later tonight - Have to redo my loop first though and install the last 3 GPUs - And of course take it all through a 24 hour folding bonanza









NON-HT // Lowest 4.8 Vcore & PLL.

Steps:

Find find lowest Vcore not giving WHEA error (Or crash horribly) at 4.8 Ghz - DONE 1.28V

Find find lowest CPU PLL not giving WHEA error (Or crash horribly at 4.8 Ghz - DONE - 1.5V

Have both settings pass IBT - DONE

Fold for 12 hours -

P95 for 12 hours -

Temperatures are of course "lulz" - Have not passed 50C yet in folding.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can adjust cpu pll, i used it alot with ocing, 1.65-1.75V ive used most of the time,
> i think this extra option, internal cpu pll overvoltage, only ups it a bit more,
> looks to me its the same as upping the normal cpu pll, got it set to 1.8V atm,
> maybe thats why it acted so strange when i booted ..lol
> 
> hmm, or it only ups it when needed, bit different then a fixed value?
> i see, so i was thinking in the right direction, im just starting to run 4.8ghz again,
> should i leave it enabled, with 1.8V cpu pll? or just leave it be, i mean, i always oced without using it..
> 
> it was acting really weird when i first booted, then it just bsod on me, now it seems to work, after second boot..
> 
> haha,. yea, better temps under load, just what i need ..LOL
> 
> will reboot a few times, see what happens..brb..


seems to run, but feels a bit..idk yet..i like those ram timings like this tho



this is in my bios, so you all understand what settings i talk about



is it just that, "runs with a higher voltage"?
what use would that have, if i can adjust cpu pll by hand too?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Well, started tinkering with the memory - 100 % noob when it comes to pushing sticks, and only did load the XMP settings and changed 2T -> 1T. System just gives me a memory error if I try and run it at 2800Mhz - Guess there is alot of reading up to do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will do a HT on/off OC later tonight - Have to redo my loop first though and install the last 3 GPUs - And of course take it all through a 24 hour folding bonanza


yea, the HT off or on, im busy now with this oc, so might disable HT, and let it run prime for the night,
see if its still running in the morning


----------



## Solonowarion

I have my CL Ultra. I practiced delidding an AMD athlon 64 x2. Was pretty easy but the glue may have been old and not as strong. My i5 3570k is 1.32v at 4.7. Core 1 is the highest temp at 72. 12 hours prime. I need some convincing to delid.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Gomi something is wrong there with 2666 you should get better result's here are mine with 2400MHz cl11


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I have my CL Ultra. I practiced delidding an AMD athlon 64 x2. Was pretty easy but the glue may have been old and not as strong. My i5 3570k is 1.32v at 4.7. Core 1 is the highest temp at 72. 12 hours prime. *I need some convincing to delid.*




hope this helps ..lol









just kidding of course ..lol,
practice is good, looks like your chip runs about the same vcore as me at 4.7ghz..
your temps look good for a un-delidded chip at 4.7ghz tho..to be honest








the old pentiums we practiced on where alot harder to delid then my ivy..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I have my CL Ultra. I practiced delidding an AMD athlon 64 x2. Was pretty easy but the glue may have been old and not as strong. My i5 3570k is 1.32v at 4.7. Core 1 is the highest temp at 72. 12 hours prime. I need some convincing to delid.


So your temps are at 72C huh? try them at 50C area. yeah thats what delidding can do for you lol. But it all seriousness it really is worth it for Overclocks like yours. read all the entries on my original post and look at the spreadsheet and look at all of the temp drops.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Gomi something is wrong there with 2666 you should get better result's here are mine with 2400MHz cl11
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Yah, does seem kind of odd - Speeds are validated though and MEMTEST shows no errors (I ran one the other day, just to make sure nothing was off on the sticks). Could always poke Sin, since he uses the same mobo as me, and have him look it over.


----------



## Solonowarion

hope this helps ..lol







[/quote]

So your temps are at 72C huh? try them at 50C area. yeah thats what delidding can do for you lol. But it all seriousness it really is worth it for Overclocks like yours. read all the entries on my original post and look at the spreadsheet and look at all of the temp drops.[/quote]

Would you guys reccomend draining my loop? or just unscrewing my ek supremecy waterblock.


----------



## [CyGnus]

just take off the Block if you have the space to pick the cpu from the mobo


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Gomi something is wrong there with 2666 you should get better result's here are mine with 2400MHz cl11


I don't think anything is wrong with his ram. You are running the hyko Samsung green kit which runs very fast. I ditched my faster more expensive ram kits because the cheaper samsung green kits at slower speeds performed better at lower voltage. It's all about the timings (not just the first 4 timings).


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I have my CL Ultra. I practiced delidding an AMD athlon 64 x2. Was pretty easy but the glue may have been old and not as strong. My i5 3570k is 1.32v at 4.7. Core 1 is the highest temp at 72. 12 hours prime. I need some convincing to delid.


vcore 1.32v 4.9ghz


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Would you guys reccomend draining my loop? or just unscrewing my ek supremecy waterblock.[/SPOILER]
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Been there, done it - My experience:

Just unscrew the waterblock, looks like you have space enough on the picture and the tubing looks fine for "resting" on the backplate while you work.

No idea if your reservoir will hold, but if you could put the case down, so the motherboard becomes horizontal, it would make the job much easier (Think of the whole thing as your operating table).

Oh, and do remember lots and lots of light - Time (I made coffee, watched some TV, went to the toilet, went for a cigaret ..etc. TAKE YOUR TIME!) and STEADY hands


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> hope this helps ..lol


So your temps are at 72C huh? try them at 50C area. yeah thats what delidding can do for you lol. But it all seriousness it really is worth it for Overclocks like yours. read all the entries on my original post and look at the spreadsheet and look at all of the temp drops.[/quote]

Would you guys reccomend draining my loop? or just unscrewing my ek supremecy waterblock.

[/quote]

Looks like you have enough play in your block to just loosen the mount up and slide the chip out to work with. I did he same thing with my loop. Lay it on its side to work flat.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> vcore 1.32v 4.9ghz


I would LOVE to have your chip in my mobo.


----------



## Gomi

Google to the rescue!

Seems like my board likes the Voltage changes applied first - Then a save/quit and straight back into the BIOS to change memory multiplier.

Reached 2800Mhz (Which is big news for an memory newb like me, lol).



eVGA eleet is just to confirm present Vcore, as CPU-Z stopped reporting is properly (Yet again a well known problem according to google).


----------



## [CyGnus]

Its looking better try to lower those timings maybe 11-12-12-32 1T and see if it boots ok maybe they will need a little bump in the voltage


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I would LOVE to have your chip in my mobo.


i would like to have your motherboard with my chip


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> CL ultra is also a good choice for on top. It's easier to clean and you don't have to worry about it eating through impure metals. Also it is reported to cool nearly as good as CL LP. I have read about 3c hotter.


For safety I'll stick to mx4 on top. But cheers for the input


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> For safety I'll stick to mx4 on top. But cheers for the input


I run bare die with only CL LP and block no IHS. IMO that is the best mount but you have to make sure block and mount work right to do it.


----------



## [CyGnus]

My opinion is this, if you delide a cpu why are you worried if the TIM is harder to clean... And if you buy CLP for the die why not also use it on the IHS? Just my


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> My opinion is this, if you delide a cpu why are you worried if the TIM is harder to clean... And if you buy CLP for the die why not use it on the IHS to? Just my


That is what I would do if I ran the IHS. Since I don't run IHS no problem with IHS.

I would lap IHS and block to make sure nice and flat for CLLP if I used IHS.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> My opinion is this, if you delide a cpu why are you worried if the TIM is harder to clean... And if you buy CLP for the die why not also use it on the IHS? Just my


Because there's no model number on the die that is necessary for RMA ?


----------



## VonDutch

i would only think about lapping,
if after delid the temp difference between cores (still) where like 14-15C or more,
or something else is way off..compared to others that have delidded..

other then that, no need to lap, only for the , nice and shiny looks ...lol

day shift signing off...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, this is going be long...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, so reading your inputs, it seems like I'll probably be going down the 670 route. Since there really isn't a "clear" winner, I think I'll go with the manufacturer that has not failed me yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I have a different question, in regards to the 670, I plan to SLI in the future. Will my 3570k + MVG be able to handle the SLI? Any bottlenecking? On top of that, should I get the 2GB or 4GB version of the 670? Note the price for the 4GB 670 is only $30 shy of the 2GB 680.
> 
> I play ONLY on my center monitor for any game whatsoever (I hate triple monitor gaming), however, my full monitor build composes of 3 monitors each at 1440p.


AMD beats Nvidia this gen, even with lower clocks. (after 12.11b drivers) Get a 7970 or 7950.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, and i decided to start running my 4.8ghz oc again today, will run it for a while to see how it goes,
> this is my 24H prime stable oc @ 1.420V vcore
> 
> nice one CyGnus, so i run into a problem i forgot about with my ram,
> running at 4.8ghz, i cant use xmp profile with it..tried, didnt boot..without xmp, no problem..
> 
> i do use offset with this, using 0.160V offset,( i thought is was to much offset for a while tho? )
> i upped ram voltage to 1.55V, its rated 1.5V,
> should i up it to 1.6V, and see if it runs with xmp then? no harm if i do?
> 
> also, i have a, "internal cpu pll overvoltage", i never really used it before, is it any good to use with ocing?
> what could it help if i enable it..


Internal PLL ovevoltage is a MUST for high ram overclocking and multipliers higher than 47x.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> really, so it could help me with using xmp profile you think?
> only run mine at rated 1600mhz tho..ocing it i can forget..
> does it influence other things too?


It's gonna help getting things stable.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can adjust cpu pll, i used it alot with ocing, 1.65-1.75V ive used most of the time,
> i think this extra option, internal cpu pll overvoltage, only ups it a bit more,
> looks to me its the same as upping the normal cpu pll, got it set to 1.8V atm, maybe thats why it acted so strange when i booted ..lol
> 
> hmm, or it only ups it when needed, bit different then a fixed value?
> i see, so i was thinking in the right direction, im just starting to run 4.8ghz again,
> should i leave it enabled, with 1.8V cpu pll? or just leave it be, i mean, i always oced without using it..
> 
> it was acting really weird when i first booted, then it just bsod on me, now it seems to work, after second boot..
> 
> haha,. yea, better temps under load, just what i need ..LOL
> 
> will reboot a few times, see what happens..brb..


Not the same thing really, it's a different voltage altogether, despite the similar name.
It's not a thing you can change manually, but having it in Enabled helps so use it!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Because there's no model number on the die that is necessary for RMA ?


hehehe...you _CAN'T_ rma delidded chips, remember?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Because there's no model number on the die that is necessary for RMA ?


Are you serious? After a delid who worries with missing numbers on IHS of a CPU that cant be RMA?


----------



## VonDutch

cant sleep yet ....

this,

*Traditionally if you overclocked your Intel CPU you voided its warranty.* But with Intel increasingly selling CPUs and chipsets with unlocked clock speed and memory bus speed settings, the company has followed in the line of some high end graphics card makers (and a handful of gaming systems builders), who have guaranteed warranties on overclocked devices.

Intel will offer warranties on the Core i5 2500K for a one-time purchase of $20 USD, on the Core i7 2600K or 2700K for $25 USD, and on the Core i7 3930K or 3960X for $35 USD. In exchange if customers damage their CPU by overclocking it, they will get a one time replacement.

also, found a very nice read about ocing with gigabyte mobo's,
maybe helpfull for some








http://forum.giga-byte.co.uk/upload/files/Gigabyte%20Sandy%20Bridge%20Overclocking%20Guide.pdf
i know, its with a sandy bridge, but still , the even mention the internal cpu pll overvoltage...lol with higher oc's,
but with fixed vcore, guess it works the same with offset..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> cant sleep yet ....
> 
> this,
> 
> *Traditionally if you overclocked your Intel CPU you voided its warranty.* But with Intel increasingly selling CPUs and chipsets with unlocked clock speed and memory bus speed settings, the company has followed in the line of some high end graphics card makers (and a handful of gaming systems builders), who have guaranteed warranties on overclocked devices.
> 
> Intel will offer warranties on the Core i5 2500K for a one-time purchase of $20 USD, on the Core i7 2600K or 2700K for $25 USD, and on the Core i7 3930K or 3960X for $35 USD. In exchange if customers damage their CPU by overclocking it, they will get a one time replacement.
> 
> also, found a very nice read about ocing with gigabyte mobo's,
> maybe helpfull for some
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://forum.giga-byte.co.uk/upload/files/Gigabyte%20Sandy%20Bridge%20Overclocking%20Guide.pdf
> i know, its with a sandy bridge, but still , the even mention the internal cpu pll overvoltage...lol with higher oc's,
> but with fixed vcore, guess it works the same with offset..


Yea, I plan on purchasing that warranty with my next chip, cause that one will go subzero.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yea, I plan on purchasing that warranty with my next chip, cause that one will go subzero.


lol still have to get it, but i understand i can do that anytime, or at least upto 1 year after purchase?

yeah,

The Plan provides a one-time replacement: (i) only applicable to the replacement of Eligible Processors (defined below) and *(ii) only when the Plan is purchased within one (1) year of the purchase of the Eligible Processor*. The Plan may only be purchased from the Plan website (www.intel.com/go/tuningplan).

25 bucks for a 3770K ..bought mine in may/july i think ,better keep this in mind


----------



## Notion

has anyone noticed any degradation with the ivy bridge i7 3770k.. basically i have just reinstalled my water cooling and clocked it back to 4.8ghz.. expecting to use the same settings at 1.36v, but i am not finding that i have to go to 1.38v.. since having the water cooling out, i have lapped the IHS and water block... other wise i have been running it at 4.5ghz.. @ 1.25 V.. it seems that higher oveclocks are demanding more voltage.. anyone else noticed this.. or is my chip a load of proverbial Poop..


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> My opinion is this, if you delide a cpu why are you worried if the TIM is harder to clean... And if you buy CLP for the die why not also use it on the IHS? Just my


that is a very fair point - the only counter argument is:
What if you want to change cooler, or remove it for some reason.

More so, if one is easier to clean than the other, however the only difference is between 1-3c ON the IHS, then it's better going for the "safer" bet.

I actually checked in my drawers I have the MX-2 NOT the MX-4 I thought I had all along LOL

Oh good info about shapes and forms to put on your IHS/cooler:
http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=170&Itemid=1&limit=1&limitstart=4


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd rather have my cooler's base intact in case I need to resell my Silver Arrow really...but that's just me.


----------



## [CyGnus]

You guys now that difficult to clean is not the same as impossible right? But we are all free to do as we please







so everyone uses the tims they want to use


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, quick!

http://hwbot.org/submission/2345331_remiko_cinebench_r11.5_core_i7_2600k_10.57_points

See that? New bench at hwbot...no points but I know you all love cinebench xD


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If you check the kboost box it will run at a fixed frequency. Look for it in precision.


Just tried it, first with default k boost unchecked, then with k boost checked, exact same boost clocks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well screw you too phone.... ugh.
> 
> Remember guys im still planning on doing a nice indepth video for delidding and I can also use ole Franky for this diagram as well. For I believe Kolt and the cougar fans. They are the best cfm for rads but the price is high that's why I also recommended the sickles its really personal choices in my head.
> 
> FtW420. Are you going to Toronto? Its a 20 hour drive for me lol. Still planning on going but just curious if im all alone. Forever alone.... lol
> 
> Uuuuuuuuuuuuhm sorry very tired and on here in my art class. Woo freaking hoo right? If you got any questions let me know on here and ill try to respond lol. Darn you VonDutch and being able to be on here and more awake than me!!!!! :mad


Still planning on it, last time it was about 5 hours flight time + a few hours in airports changing planes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL! that's a devil's pact
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... god deal either way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GLWS man!
> where did you see this information?
> Sandy Bridge 1155 TJunctionmax was 98C
> Ivy Bridge 1155 TJunctionMax is at 105C ...
> LOL, this thread is insanely popular and actually one of my favorites on OCN
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... wondering why others avoid it ...
> Last time I heard, the 700 series was delayed until November, no? maybe I'm wrong, but I wouldn't hold my breath for 780 appearing in March ...


Doubt we will see it in march as well, but should get some news by then about specs, & hopefully news about when we can expect it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, this is going be long...
> *AMD beats Nvidia this gen*, even with lower clocks. (after 12.11b drivers) Get a 7970 or 7950.
> Internal PLL ovevoltage is a MUST for high ram overclocking and multipliers higher than 47x.
> It's gonna help getting things stable.
> Not the same thing really, it's a different voltage altogether, despite the similar name.
> It's not a thing you can change manually, but having it in Enabled helps so use it!
> hehehe...you _CAN'T_ rma delidded chips, remember?


Yeah followers of both camps are happy with gaming results, as far as overall performance, AMD. What wins at stock clocks has gone back & forth, for overclocked results the 600 series has been behind since release day.
Did this last night with the 3770k on air4 & 7970 on water

tesselation enabled, still beating my 1400/1800 680 for graphics score. only 200 points behind my ln2 cooled 1670/1800 680 graphics score









Tesselation off, 680 left in the dust.









Edit, just saw the cinebench record, beaten!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> has anyone noticed any degradation with the ivy bridge i7 3770k.. basically i have just reinstalled my water cooling and clocked it back to 4.8ghz.. expecting to use the same settings at 1.36v, but i am not finding that i have to go to 1.38v.. since having the water cooling out, i have lapped the IHS and water block... other wise i have been running it at 4.5ghz.. @ 1.25 V.. it seems that higher oveclocks are demanding more voltage.. anyone else noticed this.. or is my chip a load of proverbial Poop..


I ran 1.55v for awhile and alot of stress testing 0 degrading,

When i installed my custom loop and temps dropped 15c i was able to do the same OC at 1.5v

Also the guys talking about how hard CLP is to get off..

I sanded it smooth and keep the little bit of silver on it.. i think it fills in the micro holes.. then put more tim on it... And got excellent temps.

I cannot show any results cause that rig is on the table atm while i do a massive rebuild with 1400mm of 86mm rad LOL

more or less just for E Peen cause it fits in my Mountain mods case... And i got 3 360mm Monsta 86mm rads + XSPC res / pump for 270$ shipped..

To add to my 2 Monsta 240 86 mm rads and Apongee Drive 2 block / pump which has the MCP 35x pump in it.. lol should be an Amazing E Peen build...

Wonder if i can call it " Water loop E Peen Build Log" and the mods be ok with that build log name lol...

However i do like the " Valguar why you mad bro build log" lol.

My case should be here in the morning and my rads and extra pumps later in the week ill get pics..

Waiting to RMA my board.. and find a very sick Res..


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I ran 1.55v for awhile and alot of stress testing 0 degrading,
> 
> When i installed my custom loop and temps dropped 15c i was able to do the same OC at 1.5v
> 
> Also the guys talking about how hard CLP is to get off..
> 
> I sanded it smooth and keep the little bit of silver on it.. i think it fills in the micro holes.. then put more tim on it... And got excellent temps.
> 
> I cannot show any results cause that rig is on the table atm while i do a massive rebuild with 1400mm of 86mm rad LOL
> 
> more or less just for E Peen cause it fits in my Mountain mods case... And i got 3 360mm Monsta 86mm rads + XSPC res / pump for 270$ shipped..
> 
> To add to my 2 Monsta 240 86 mm rads and Apongee Drive 2 block / pump which has the MCP 35x pump in it.. lol should be an Amazing E Peen build...
> 
> Wonder if i can call it " Water loop E Peen Build Log" and the mods be ok with that build log name lol...
> 
> However i do like the " Valguar why you mad bro build log" lol.
> 
> My case should be here in the morning and my rads and extra pumps later in the week ill get pics..
> 
> Waiting to RMA my board.. and find a very sick Res..


RMA the board?? what happened?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> RMA the board?? what happened?


Bent pins

I have friends and can get my Board RMAed for free..

So i can resale for full value instead of much lower value with bent pins even tho fixxed id have to ask 25% less for it.

Im upgrading to haswell when it is released in Q2.

Which requires selling my 3770k+MB


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bent pins
> 
> I have friends and can get my Board RMAed for free..
> 
> So i can resale for full value instead of much lower value with bent pins even tho fixxed id have to ask 25% less for it.
> 
> Im upgrading to haswell when it is released in Q2.
> 
> Which requires selling my 3770k+MB


You have a very nice chip there......... why sell it?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bent pins
> 
> I have friends and can get my Board RMAed for free..
> 
> So i can resale for full value instead of much lower value with bent pins even tho fixxed id have to ask 25% less for it.
> 
> Im upgrading to haswell when it is released in Q2.
> 
> Which requires selling my 3770k+MB


I'll give you $50 for the whole setup. It's a good deal, take it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> You have a very nice chip there......... why sell it?


I don't keep dated tech.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'll give you $50 for the whole setup. It's a good deal, take it.


Add 400$ more and we can talk.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I don't keep dated tech.
> Add 400$ more and we can talk.


lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I don't keep dated tech.
> Add 400$ more and we can talk.


What all does $450 get me?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What all does $450 get me?


RVP


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Hokies, y no love for fans? you still using those led fans?


----------



## stickg1

I'm going to re-join the crew with my new chip...

BEFORE


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







AFTER


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What all does $450 get me?


De lidded Lapped i7 3770k that does 5ghz + And a G1 Sniper 3
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Hokies, y no love for fans? you still using those led fans?


I have the 86mm thick rads so i can use silent fans however i did just buy 12 of those cheap 45cfm CM fans lol for 10$ per 4 pack lol.

The Mountain mods case has like places for 30 fans and i needed afew more lmao.... A down side to this case is it has no fan filters..
And the cost of a filter is just to much so i will have to make my own.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> De lidded Lapped i7 3770k that does 5ghz + And a G1 Sniper 3


How bad are the pins? Take a picture.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> How bad are the pins? Take a picture.


Not bad im having it fixed before i sell.. but im not going to sell till Haswell is out lol.

Im sure i can fix it myself but there still bent fixed or not and i rather not sell something with bent fixed pins when i can have a new socket installed for the cost of shipping.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> RVP


Yeah I wish I could get Chicharito in there too.

I just hum "Let it Be" with these lyrics, all the time..

When I find myself in times of trouble, Chicharito scores for me, Javier Hernández, Little Pea.
And when we need a striker, Sir Alex turns to him. Go out and get the job done! Little Pea.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Not bad im having it fixed before i sell.. but im not going to sell till Haswell is out lol.
> 
> Im sure i can fix it myself but there still bent fixed or not and i rather not sell something with bent fixed pins when i can have a new socket installed for the cost of shipping.


I've fixed a lot worse than that. I just use something thin like a utility knife and line it back up with all the other ones. My dumbass friend dropped some TIM in the socket and tried to wipe it out and just mangled tens of twenties of pins. Got that one working in about 20 minutes. I bought a whole lot of Z68 boards with bent pins for $200 and sold them all for $75-$125 each, made about $575 profit on that one. But if you can get the socket replaced for cheap then go for it.


----------



## Hokies83

Whole RASA kit for sale in Cooling section for those who want a loop for cheap..

http://www.overclock.net/t/1349818/xspc-rasa-750-rx360-watercooling-kit-with-new-pump-reservoir-and-extras/0_20


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> De lidded Lapped i7 3770k that does 5ghz + And a G1 Sniper 3
> I have the 86mm thick rads so i can use silent fans however i did just buy 12 of those cheap 45cfm CM fans lol for 10$ per 4 pack lol.
> 
> The Mountain mods case has like places for 30 fans and i needed afew more lmao.... A down side to this case is it has no fan filters..
> And the cost of a filter is just to much so i will have to make my own.


Ah, yeah 30 fans can get expensive...I think you should get some Nidec fans or Adda. There are some really good but cheap oem fans out there in fleabay or some other water cooling site (ppc, sidewinder, frozen cpu, jab-tech)
If you're after silence and performance remember the AP-15's are the top-dog but I've seen plenty of report os noisy whining noises at certain RPMs. Perhaps a voltage controlled fan might be better for that. Gelid sells a very good yet cheap fan, called the Silent Wing. I bet you've seen Tator's results with it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Whole RASA kit for sale in Cooling section for those who want a loop for cheap..
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1349818/xspc-rasa-750-rx360-watercooling-kit-with-new-pump-reservoir-and-extras/0_20


Pretty good!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Whole RASA kit for sale in Cooling section for those who want a loop for cheap..
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1349818/xspc-rasa-750-rx360-watercooling-kit-with-new-pump-reservoir-and-extras/0_20


If I could fit that rad in my case I would be all over it.


----------



## Hokies83

Yes i had 2 buy 3 of these for all the fans lol..

I hate plugging stuff into MB takes away from neat look.. any this case only thing ima plug in is the power /reset
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> If I could fit that rad in my case I would be all over it.


Mount it up top or on the out side.. it will blow that Antec 620 away 10c temp drop im sure.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yes i had 2 buy 3 of these for all the fans lol..
> 
> I hate plugging stuff into MB takes away from neat look.. any this case only thing ima plug in is the power /reset


Cool! looks neat...Which fan controller you got?

Cheap yet good...

Drool...

Yikes!

Made of metal!


----------



## sivarthcaz

My 3770k was running super hot, even after 30 minutes of prime blend. I re-seated at least three times, just to get the same results. Here's what I got after delidding, obviously better







. Now I can actually do a full run and not worry about temps. I am using watercooling also.

Before:


After:


----------



## Hokies83

all to loud for me.

Above 18dba and i will not touch it. with my rads i do not need much i could prolly not even put fans on them lol..

But with a case with 30 fans .. really do not need much.. and i got 12 of these fans for 30$ shipped. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103052


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> all to loud for me.
> 
> Above 18dba and i will not touch it. with my rads i do not need much i could prolly not even put fans on them lol..
> 
> But with a case with 30 fans .. really do not need much.. and i got 12 of these fans for 30$ shipped. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103052


lol! I had one of those...they are dead silent, and move close to 10cfm xD
For your setup that's actually plenty.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> all to loud for me.
> 
> Above 18dba and i will not touch it. with my rads i do not need much i could prolly not even put fans on them lol..
> 
> But with a case with 30 fans .. really do not need much.. and i got 12 of these fans for 30$ shipped. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103052


I have two of these I'm trying to sell for cheap...

ENERMAX MAGMA
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835214001

Not sure how that helps you in your quest for 30 fans but its a start.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Also, Hokies...you can undervolt fans man, those fans I linked are quiet when needed


----------



## ivanlabrie

Give THIS guy some love!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yea, I plan on purchasing that warranty with my next chip, cause that one will go subzero.


Same with mine.









Ivan you going to Toronto event?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> has anyone noticed any degradation with the ivy bridge i7 3770k.. basically i have just reinstalled my water cooling and clocked it back to 4.8ghz.. expecting to use the same settings at 1.36v, but i am not finding that i have to go to 1.38v.. since having the water cooling out, i have lapped the IHS and water block... other wise i have been running it at 4.5ghz.. @ 1.25 V.. it seems that higher oveclocks are demanding more voltage.. anyone else noticed this.. or is my chip a load of proverbial Poop..


Nope you should be more than fine honestly. Sometimes your chips just get a bit fussy is all and require a bit more. might have sent a small static shock through it (it happens without you knowing trust me) and that might have done it. but .02 is nothing to worry about. anything over.5 or .7 id worry about. Keep us informed though and we can help ya out.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sivarthcaz*
> 
> My 3770k was running super hot, even after 30 minutes of prime blend. I re-seated at least three times, just to get the same results. Here's what I got after delidding, obviously better
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Now I can actually do a full run and not worry about temps. I am using watercooling also.
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Submit your info and join this great Crew!!!! and get an amazing Sig! What did you think of the information on page one?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Give THIS guy some love!


LOL


----------



## feniks

Hokies, I use similar 2 PCBs just 5-way each and for 3-pin fans (AP-15 + s-flex 1,900rpm) all with no pwm, but my fan controller has pwm sense which is enough








dead silent at idle (can be configured in BIOS - CPU FAN control options) and at full blast when needed









After your successful results with Monsta rad, I will be upgrading my RX240 to Monsta 240 in a few weeks ... later on maybe I will find a way of putting Monsta 360 in my case (in place of EX360).


----------



## sivarthcaz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Submit your info and join this great Crew!!!! and get an amazing Sig! What did you think of the information on page one?


Pretty much went by the links/info on the first page. Lots of good stuff. Time to try and get 5ghz after 4.8 is stable at a reasonable voltage.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have two of these I'm trying to sell for cheap...
> 
> ENERMAX MAGMA
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835214001
> 
> Not sure how that helps you in your quest for 30 fans but its a start.


How much?

Wanna trade for a Red led Cooler Master 200mm Mega flow?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103072


----------



## ivanlabrie

Val, u mad bro??? Toronto?
I should walk or swim to get there...or steal a truck. Gonna take me a few years to either save enough dough for plane ticket/food/stuff or to get there somehow


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Val, u mad bro??? Toronto?
> I should walk or swim to get there...or steal a truck. Gonna take me a few years to either save enough dough for plane ticket/food/stuff or to get there somehow


Hitchhike, looking at the middle of march, hurry up & get going man!
You would have a loooooong journey, would be cool though.


----------



## Hokies83

Ill go if somebody buys my plane ticket.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Hitchhike, looking at the middle of march, hurry up & get going man!
> You would have a loooooong journey, would be cool though.


The best way I can get there is suck it up and pay 400 bucks no food or drink on the way the entire time, then eat/drink until i either fall asleep on my keyboard or explode from food and then take a 45 hour long train ride back to Grand Forks lol. leave Sunday morning and get there early Tuesday morning.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Hitchhike, looking at the middle of march, hurry up & get going man!
> You would have a loooooong journey, would be cool though.


Yeah, definitely!
I actually saw the invite at OCF, not sure how many will assist but it would pretty cool indeed.









Hey FtW, I'm getting a pot by the time I get my new 3770k...gonna do some 2d damage hehe


----------



## FtW 420

What pot are you getting?
No need to stop after the 2d, faster cpu helps most 3d too!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> What pot are you getting?
> No need to stop after the 2d, faster cpu helps most 3d too!


True that.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> What pot are you getting?
> No need to stop after the 2d, faster cpu helps most 3d too!


Dragon F1...free.

And I'm selling my 670 which is no good for 3d. I can do some hd4000 boints with uber fast ram and cpu though, and borrow some older gpus to vmodd and freeze.


----------



## FtW 420

Good pot & free is a great price!
The older gpus can get better HW boints, although the 670 would get more global.
Catch 22 if you need to sell the 670 to get the 3770k though, the cpu matters more for most benches.
Get the best score you can in at least heaven bench with it before selling, it's about the least cpu dependent.


----------



## Swag

Oh my god! My PSU fried my goddamn chip! Went berserk after I plugged it in! Goddamn it! What the hell do I do now?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh my god! My PSU fried my goddamn chip! Went berserk after I plugged it in! Goddamn it! What the hell do I do now?


You dun goofed.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh my god! My PSU fried my goddamn chip! Went berserk after I plugged it in! Goddamn it! What the hell do I do now?


You cry and wait for your bank account to fill with enough money sadly.... did it fry the chip or the mobo?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh my god! My PSU fried my goddamn chip! Went berserk after I plugged it in! Goddamn it! What the hell do I do now?


You sure the chip is dead? I've killed a chip while killing the motherboard, but I've had PSUs blow up more than once & haven't had one damage a board or cpu yet.

How did it go berserk?


----------



## Hokies83

U call corsair get a new psu and wait 4 months for them to give u 150$ for your cpu.

We're u pulling to much for that 650 ? Why I go big on the psu ... Never have to worry about that.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> has anyone noticed any degradation with the ivy bridge i7 3770k.. basically i have just reinstalled my water cooling and clocked it back to 4.8ghz.. expecting to use the same settings at 1.36v, but i am not finding that i have to go to 1.38v.. since having the water cooling out, i have lapped the IHS and water block... other wise i have been running it at 4.5ghz.. @ 1.25 V.. it seems that higher oveclocks are demanding more voltage.. anyone else noticed this.. or is my chip a load of proverbial Poop..


my old 4.8ghz oc needed 1.420V vcore, but i ran it at 4.7ghz all the time, yesterday i decided to run it at 4.8ghz again,
i just put in the numbers again that i used back then, im not sure anymore if i ran it on offset back then also,
but i started prime95 before i went to bed, just woke up and its still running, i think it even runs better then back then,
even using xmp profile now ..lol, but no ...not difference at all..

kk, 7H isnt the same as the 24H prime i did back then, but this looks like it can run for days without problem








its still running in the background atm, 7H 30min now

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> that is a very fair point - the only counter argument is:
> What if you want to change cooler, or remove it for some reason.
> 
> *More so, if one is easier to clean than the other, however the only difference is between 1-3c ON the IHS*, then it's better going for the "safer" bet.
> 
> I actually checked in my drawers I have the MX-2 NOT the MX-4 I thought I had all along LOL


i feel the same about lapping, said that a few days ago too, does it really matter if i run IBT at 5.0ghz, and my hottest core is 84C, would it matter if i shave off 1-3C, if any, and my hottest core would be 81C ? all the trouble lapping, trying to find a way to lap the inside ihs also ..nah.. to each their own tho








what hokies says is true, thats why i said before, it can even "upgrade" other tims, but im using the same liquid pro again if im gonna take it apart again, no problem at all








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> *You guys now that difficult to clean is not the same as impossible right?*
> _But we are all free to do as we please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so everyone uses the tims they want to use_


yeppers








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I ran 1.55v for awhile and alot of stress testing 0 degrading,
> 
> Also the guys talking about how hard CLP is to get off..
> 
> *I sanded it smooth and keep the little bit of silver on it.. i think it fills in the micro holes.. then put more tim on it... And got excellent temps.*


ecactly what Hokies says








some say it leaves some stains, and then they already say, its impossible/hard to clean,
where i think, so what, its not like you gonna see it, except if you take it apart again..lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sivarthcaz*
> 
> My 3770k was running super hot, even after 30 minutes of prime blend. I re-seated at least three times, just to get the same results. Here's what I got after delidding, obviously better
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Now I can actually do a full run and not worry about temps. I am using watercooling also.
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


that looks very nice sivarthcaz, thats about 35C tempdrop there ? vn


----------



## Swag

The chip is officially dead! I tried it out on my other motherboad and it is dead. Something happened to my PSU and it turned on for a second and then poof! The motherboard starting flashing awkwardly and my chip was pronounced dead!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The chip is officially dead! I tried it out on my other motherboad and it is dead. Something happened to my PSU and it turned on for a second and then poof! The motherboard starting flashing awkwardly and my chip was pronounced dead!


Ouch, that is some bad luck right there. Hopefully it can get replaced...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ouch, that is some bad luck right there. Hopefully it can get replaced...


Agreed the PSU maker should replace that........... or atleast in my world they should.


----------



## King4x4

I have a 1200 watt Gigabyte PSU and it still shutdows on me sometimes when I am pushing extreme voltages... Never had a PSU blow up on me though... (Oh... I jinxed it now







)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The chip is officially dead! I tried it out on my other motherboad and it is dead. Something happened to my PSU and it turned on for a second and then poof! The motherboard starting flashing awkwardly and my chip was pronounced dead!
> 
> 
> 
> Ouch, that is some bad luck right there. Hopefully it can get replaced...
Click to expand...

Would they even if it is delidded?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Would they even if it is delidded?


Do they even need to know? You could always pull another dead CPU from the grave.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Would they even if it is delidded?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Do they even need to know? You could always pull another dead CPU from the grave.


No more of this in here guys.


----------



## VonDutch




----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*


And so are the mods lol. We have quite a few in here now now don't we Von?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I have a 1200 watt Gigabyte PSU and it still shutdows on me sometimes when I am pushing extreme voltages... Never had a PSU blow up on me though... (Oh... I jinxed it now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )




omg! thats a nightmare ...
i clean mine every now and then., i think it helps alot to prevent it,
the computer education i had, only said, never touch a psu, or start working on a monitor, dangerous ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> And so are the mods lol. We have quite a few in here now now don't we Von?


yeah! ..and they love us ...LOL
but still, we need to follow rules, some things we cant talk about, simple,
its not that they wont let us,
but its to make sure the forum itself doesnt get into trouble with company's etc...o well









come to think of it, maybe its not because they love us,
but to keep a extra eye(s) on us...LOL


----------



## Swag

I wasn't referring to RMA with Intel. I meant Corsair. I really want to talk to them about this!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wasn't referring to RMA with Intel. I meant Corsair. I really want to talk to them about this!


i would for sure..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No more of this in here guys.


Sorry..









Yes, I had no intentions of returning a dead chip to Intel. I meant just contacting Corsair about it with the $150 cashback or whatever.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*


Thats more like big sister is watching you


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Sorry..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I had no intentions of returning a dead chip to Intel. I meant just contacting Corsair about it with the $150 cashback or whatever.


all good, no worries, we have this saying in my country, but some things are hard to translate,
"voorkomen is beter dan genezen" or, "prevention is better than cure"..thats what google translate makes of it ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Thats more like big sister is watching you


LOL








should have searched for another one maybe,
but i didnt like this face


----------



## Swag

Who is the Corsair rep? I want to talk to them!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> all good, no worries, we have this saying in my country, but some things are hard to translate,
> "voorkomen is beter dan genezen" or, "prevention is better than cure"..thats what google translate makes of it ..lol


That sounds about right to me!








I noticed from your videos that you don't natively speak English, I guess I just assumed you would. What is your main language if that isn't a strange question


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> That sounds about right to me!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I noticed from your videos that you don't natively speak English, I guess I just assumed you would. What is your main language if that isn't a strange question


yea,. people sometimes forget that, i always have google translate open for checking some words that are hard to write








i have to read everything twice most of the time, to understand it ..

my native language is ...Dutch! ...lol ( Hollands, Nederlands)

i learned my english online, by chatting etc, few years ago i still had to ask alot, "is this correct? ", "how do you say this"..etc,
now i get compliments, peeps say i "talk" english better then some americans ...LOL


----------



## Joa3d43

What comes after 5.167 GHz ? De-lidding ? Un-lidding (IHS free) ? What about my voltages ?

As intro, these recent Sabertooth Z77 thread posts:
Quote:


> *PCWargamer wrote*...If you are interested in "un-lidding" Joa3d43, then there is an OCN thread with some good info and lots of support to assist in the endeavor. Feel free to join us and check it out


Quote:


> [/Thanks, will do...I already took a few peeks there and will be back for more
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....this one from today...http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2653300 voltages are still below my cut-off re. 1.45 absolute max, but getting there - seriously thinking about delidding...just not decided yet whether to keep it 'un-lid' and IHS-free


Quote:


> *PCWargamer wrote* Your chip looks real good Joa3d43. And if your temps are good to you don't need to delid or unlid. Just enjoy a great chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> But many of us still do it for the fun of it! One of the best and funest mods I have ever done!


Hello









I have been putting together a few Ivy Bridge systems for my work and play...one of them has a 3770K that already went past 4.833 GHz in a basic Asus P8Z77-V LK mobo w/32 GB of Trident-X Ram and an off-the-shelf Thermaltake Water 2 Extreme with excellent temps.

I then transferred that particular 3770K to a Sabertooth Z77...4.8 GHz was my daily setting and soon I pushed it a bit (Please see CPU-Z validation pics below). I add that I keep Intel SpeedStep enabled, as well as all the sleep / idle states as I need that unless I do a record run. Also, during all my runs below, SQL 2008 enterprise and a few other instances of SQL 2012 were active, as was IIS (all in 'Local Host')

I would like to get some advice please:

1.) My absolute voltage cut-off is 1.45v for record runs, 1.4 or less for daily use. To get beyond 5.167 GHz - and after watching the progression of voltages below per run - do I have to delid ? Even if I do not have to, it might be a fun project and I am curios, but I don't want to wreck the thing (and yes - I have studied the excellent guide provided here







).

2.) For the spring, I have been thinking about a custom water-loop that also includes the SLI GTX 670ies (not that the Thermatake Water 2 Extreme has let me down). Further, I would like to try an *'un-lidding (IHS free)*' approach, unless there are some experiences here that suggest otherwise. *De-lidding* vs un-lidding / pros and cons ?

3.) The current setup (and runs depicted below) were done with Artic MX-2...as I used the last of that on an other build, I now have a new tube of Artic MX4...which according to some tables I have seen on this thread is 'pretty good' - with 1 or 2 C of the exotic stuff ? Any experiences with Artic MX 4 ?

Thank you in advance for your feedback / advice and help


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Who is the Corsair rep? I want to talk to them!


CorsairGorge


----------



## VonDutch

your voltages? man, ill trade you my 3770k right away, and its delidded already too ...LOL
they are great!, even when temps would be ok, i would still delid it, you have a great chip to delid, vcore wise ..

1) i would anyways, imagine running those oc's, but with at least 15-20+C lower temps, whatever you run, ibt/prime at that speed









2) Thermatake Water 2 Extreme, my favorite over the H100..lol







, we know theres not much difference in running with or without IHS,
its more a personal preference, sonda5 is our un-lidded expert here, im running with ihs, because 1) i have a aircooler, 2) the ihs function isnt only
spreading heat, but also to protect the die from being crushed or anything like that, i would only advice if you have a watercooler tho (weight aircoolers)
also, its a bit more work to get it right, with ihs, you just pop back the cooler, and your good to go in most cases









3) not personally, ive used AS5 for a long time, but on the IHS, all tim's are good, even the "old/outdated" AS5 is within 2-5C from other tims in any of the reviews/tests online, the whole top15 tims is good enough to use on the ihs, that also is a personal preference...

on the die, we use liquid pro/ultra, its been proven here, thats the tim that works best, and gives amazing tempdrops over the other tim's,

AS5 on die, 80C hottest core


liquid pro on the die, 55C hottest core


25C difference


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> 
> omg! thats a nightmare ...
> i clean mine every now and then., i think it helps alot to prevent it,
> the computer education i had, only said, never touch a psu, or start working on a monitor, dangerous ..lol


Oooh, damn is that torched!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Who is the Corsair rep? I want to talk to them!
> 
> 
> 
> CorsairGorge
Click to expand...

Thanks, I just PMed him and I hope they honor it. I can't believe this. I actually went and bought this PSU for $140 (on the expensive side, I Know) because I have never had a problem with Corsair before. Most of my PSUs are from Corsair and this is actually the first time any PSU has died, let alone bringing others with it. Hell, the Deer PSU in my OEM machine still works, how the hell did this happen?

If they don't honor it, I will be extremely mad. Should I wait until what Corsair says or should I go ahead and RMA it with Asus and Intel? I'm not sure which one. I'll probably wait before getting my GPUs now to see how much I have to spend to fix this goddamn issue!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What comes after 5.167 GHz ? De-lidding ? Un-lidding (IHS free) ? What about my voltages ?
> 
> As intro, these recent Sabertooth Z77 thread posts:


That is an amazing 3770k you have. What batch is it? Have you done any stability testing on such as Intel Burn Test or Prime95? Do you have AVX updated on your OS? Is Hyper Threading enabled?

Looks very promising. Delidding should help. I run bare die to DT sniper water block (NO IHS) and cooling is great.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Systemlord* wrote: your voltages? man, ill trade you my 3770k right away, and its delidded already too ...LOL
> they are great!, even when temps would be ok, i would still delid it, you have a great chip to delid, vcore wise ..
> 
> 1) i would anyways, imagine running those oc's, but with at least 15-20+C lower temps, whatever you run, ibt/prime at that speed smile.gif
> 
> 2) Thermatake Water 2 Extreme, my favorite over the H100..lol thumb.gif , we know theres not much difference in running with or without IHS,
> its more a personal preference, sonda5 is our un-lidded expert here, im running with ihs, because 1) i have a aircooler, 2) the ihs function isnt only
> spreading heat, but also to protect the die from being crushed or anything like that, i would only advice if you have a watercooler tho (weight aircoolers)
> also, its a bit more work to get it right, with ihs, you just pop back the cooler, and your good to go in most cases smile.gif
> 
> 3) not personally, ive used AS5 for a long time, but on the IHS, all tim's are good, even the "old/outdated" AS5 is within 2-5C from other tims in any of the reviews/tests online, the whole top15 tims is good enough to use on the ihs, that also is a personal preference...
> 
> on the die, we use liquid pro/ultra, its been proven here, thats the tim that works best, and gives amazing tempdrops over the other tim's,
> Edited by VonDutch - Today at 12:08 am [


Thank you for the feedback







...if there is no appreciable difference between 'de-lid and un-lid' re temps, but the extra benefit of keeping the IHS as a protective shield, then de-lid sounds like the better option


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *SonDa5 wrote:* That is an amazing 3770k you have. What batch is it? Have you done any stability testing on such as Intel Burn Test or Prime95? Do you have AVX updated on your OS? Is Hyper Threading enabled?
> 
> Looks very promising. Delidding should help. I run bare die to DT sniper water block (NO IHS) and cooling is great.


Thanks for your reply. Yes, I have done Prime95 and other stability tests up to 5 GHz (4.8 and 5.0 are my daily settings...4.8 for programming, email and web, 5 for games). At 5, core temps creep up to 79 C to 82 C in stress testing. As to the 'batch', the chip is made in 'Costa Rica', batch # 3225B620 (pls don't ask me for the serial # though







)

EDIT - per CPUz pics, yes, Hyperthreading is always enabled (other than the last pic 4.8 run)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Oooh, damn is that torched!


i dont think so, i did a google search on exploded psu, just for fun,
but saw some more of pics from this one, looked very bad, but its real, no torching on it..
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/11/26/exploding_computer_vs_reg_reader/
quote
"Yesterday my son was sitting at his desk working on a school project, when he heard a loud bang.
He said it sounded like a large fire cracker. Immediately following the minor explosion, smoke rose out of the back of his desk. blabla etc."
end quote


----------



## FtW 420

I've had a couple PSU blow a cap, it does go like a gunshot. I avoid coolermaster now since the first on was a few month old 650 or 850w (can't remember), which couldn't handle a gtx 260 & i7 920.
The other was a brand new 1000w, maybe 4 hours use. Had an fx8150 at 7Ghz & was shooting for 7.2 when she blew.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thank you for the feedback
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...if there is no appreciable difference between 'de-lid and un-lid' re temps, but the extra benefit of keeping the IHS as a protective shield, then de-lid sounds like the better option


1-3C, besides exceptions , is what i see..but not even that sometimes, the ihs is copper made, the w/mk is about 380-400w/mk,
so the heatransfer is very big anyways, same goes for the blocks of course







you have to use a tim also, most tim's are somewhere between 2 and 10w/mk,
like this,

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 38w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
everything else is less



the bigger the heat transfer area, the less important it gets what the w/mk is for a tim,
thats why a high w/mk tim works that good on a smaller area, like the die


----------



## Swag

Don't you hate paying a premium for something better but it ends up being worse?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't you hate paying a premium for something better but it ends up being worse?


just unlucky swag, could have happened with any psu/mobo/cpu etc...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

That's my only concern to delid. If something else goes wrong, they'll think that that was me, and not the item going wrong...can't believe it was psu!


----------



## Joa3d43

...here is an updated pic (before all but the 4.8 CPUz were hyper-threaded); below on the left is hyper-threaded, on the right is not...I know I can voltages down just a bit more at that speed


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't you hate paying a premium for something better but it ends up being worse?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just unlucky swag, could have happened with any psu/mobo/cpu etc...
Click to expand...

Except it had to be mine.







I'll be trying to contact Asus, Intel, and Corsair!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> cant sleep yet ....
> 
> this,
> 
> *Traditionally if you overclocked your Intel CPU you voided its warranty.* But with Intel increasingly selling CPUs and chipsets with unlocked clock speed and memory bus speed settings, the company has followed in the line of some high end graphics card makers (and a handful of gaming systems builders), who have guaranteed warranties on overclocked devices.
> 
> Intel will offer warranties on the Core i5 2500K for a one-time purchase of $20 USD, on the Core i7 2600K or 2700K for $25 USD, and on the Core i7 3930K or 3960X for $35 USD. In exchange if customers damage their CPU by overclocking it, they will get a one time replacement.
> 
> also, found a very nice read about ocing with gigabyte mobo's,
> maybe helpfull for some
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://forum.giga-byte.co.uk/upload/files/Gigabyte%20Sandy%20Bridge%20Overclocking%20Guide.pdf
> i know, its with a sandy bridge, but still , the even mention the internal cpu pll overvoltage...lol with higher oc's,
> but with fixed vcore, guess it works the same with offset..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> That's my only concern to delid. If something else goes wrong, they'll think that that was me, and not the item going wrong...can't believe it was psu!


yea, but we/you already did that when you started ocing ...lol
guess for some company"s you could have a hard time to "proof" it was their faulty hardware that did it..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Except it had to be mine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be trying to contact Asus, Intel, and Corsair!


good idea, hope it works out for you swag ..really..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...here is an updated pic (before all but the 4.8 CPUz were hyper-threaded); below on the left is hyper-threaded, on the right is not...I know I can voltages down just a bit more at that speed


i didnt notice a big difference between HT on or off , tempwise, i tried it yesterday, about 2-3C max,
you show all cpu-z validations all the time,
did you try run programs for longer time, and stability too?
prime/ibt and such

for benching it wasnt hard for me to get validations see, my 5.4ghz was one of them, "easy" to get, takes 1-2 min to validate..
my 4.8ghz i run now needs about 1.410V vcore to make it run 24H prime stable,
but i bet i can run it alot lower if it was for validation only


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch wrote*
> 
> ...LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
> LM Ultra = 38w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
> everything else is less...


Thanks !







On a slightly different trajectory, I like to ask another question:

When I am building up the custom-loop later in the spring, I have been thinking to incorporate a SMALL Peltier / Seebeck effect cooler INSIDE the reservoir (or along the radiator) which in turn is mounted outside the case, along with the radiator, and running it with automotive anti-freeze. I don't actually want to freeze the system, but adjust the Peltier unit so that it drops the cooling medium to may be 5 C + or so ("Peltier 'light' ?!)

Assuming that is even possible / feasible, the resulting setup would still be below ambient and thus could generate some condensation along the pipes / hoses / metal fittings / elbows...are there some special insulation sleeves that can deal with that ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On a slightly different trajectory, I like to ask another question:
> 
> When I am building up the custom-loop later in the spring, I have been thinking to incorporate a SMALL Peltier / Seebeck effect cooler INSIDE the reservoir (or along the radiator) which in turn is mounted outside the case, along with the radiator, and running it with automotive anti-freeze. I don't actually want to freeze the system, but adjust the Peltier unit so that it drops the cooling medium to may be 5 C + or so ("Peltier 'light' ?!)
> 
> Assuming that is even possible / feasible, the resulting setup would still be below ambient and thus could generate some condensation along the pipes / hoses / metal fittings / elbows...are there some special insulation sleeves that can deal with that ?


lol, thats a crazy plan you have ..me likes ..lol
but cant help you there, i have no experience with those things(yet)
FtW420 is the specialist around here for those things..








but maybe one of the others know too..


----------



## [CyGnus]

Swag wish you the best of luck to solve your issue.

Hokies83 if you want good silent fans i suggest Enermax TB 120mm i have 6 of them and they are really good, 11DBA with 42CFM here in PT they go for 8.5€ each
UCTB12: http://www.enermax.com/home.php?fn=eng/product_a1_1_2&lv0=4&lv1=32&no=108


----------



## teamrushpntball

Best radiator fans are still gentle typhoon ap15's. outperform every other fan in cfm to decible testing.

That said, the enermax's will be quieter but will not have the air volume.


----------



## Swag

Thanks for the support guys... If I have to pay all the money again to rebuild this rig, I'm down another $1200... I don't even have close to that right now. I'll see tomorrow what the respective manufacturers can do.

Anyone know how good Intel, Asus, and Corsair RMA services are? I hope Corsair throws in some special things with my RMA...


----------



## Notion

Valgar: thanks.. will keep you posted..

What board is the new chip (Haswell) going to be running on? will it fit the 1155 socket?


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Valgar: thanks.. will keep you posted..
> 
> What board is the new chip (Haswell) going to be running on? will it fit the 1155 socket?


1150 i believe, gets its own socket.


----------



## Notion

shoot that means a whole new MOB.. damn.


----------



## [CyGnus]

But AP15 are a bit loud and if he does not need high rpm fans maybe the AP14's are enough but i think Hokies83 is searching for good and cheap and GT AP's are pricey specially when you are buying about 25/30 of them


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote:
> 
> i didnt notice a big difference between HT on or off , tempwise, i tried it yesterday, about 2-3C max,
> you show all cpu-z validations all the time,
> did you try run programs for longer time, and stability too?
> prime/ibt and such


...well, it is almost 2 am here, but below please find some answers for you re 100 % load on all cores, load voltages and temps at 4.8 GHz (5 is not dis-similar). I note that the 4.8 GHZ volt setting is still a bit higher than I know I can get it to even with full load.

...the other point is that this system also runs 32 GB, of which 10 GB is for MS SQL ENTERPRISE (a huge item w/big service foot print), along with 3 other instances of different versions of SQL, IIS and so forth, with continuous data-queries being executed in the background re the work I am involved in...this runs 24/7 - even during ALL the validation runs !


----------



## [CyGnus]

That is a great voltage for 4.8 mine need 1.36v and i just think is too much voltage since for my 4.7 i am using 1.28v...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea,. people sometimes forget that, i always have google translate open for checking some words that are hard to write
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have to read everything twice most of the time, to understand it ..
> 
> my native language is ...Dutch! ...lol ( Hollands, Nederlands)
> 
> i learned my english online, by chatting etc, few years ago i still had to ask alot, "is this correct? ", "how do you say this"..etc,
> now i get compliments, peeps say i "talk" english better then some americans ...LOL


Yes, I'd say you do because you've learned from people who know what they're typing! Can you speak any English or just type/read it?

That is really cool! You'll get better each time you check OCN I guess


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, it is almost 2 am here, but below please find some answers for you re 100 % load on all cores, load voltages and temps at 4.8 GHz (5 is not dis-similar). I note that the 4.8 GHZ volt setting is still a bit higher than I know I can get it to even with full load.
> 
> ...the other point is that this system also runs 32 GB, of which 10 GB is for MS SQL ENTERPRISE (a huge item w/big service foot print), along with 3 other instances of different versions of SQL, IIS and so forth, with continuous data-queries being executed in the background re the work I am involved in...this runs 24/7 - even during ALL the validation runs !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


lol ok, i had to ask/check, hope you understand,
saw peeps claiming the same, "check my low vcore when i run this or that",
but they didnt do any stability testing or anything..








that being said, i think you really have a great chip there, if it was mine, i would delid it for sure..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yes, I'd say you do because you've learned from people who know what they're typing! Can you speak any English or just type/read it?
> 
> That is really cool! You'll get better each time you check OCN I guess


yes, ive met quite a few peeps from english speaking country in my time,
thats how i learned to speak english, but writing it is very different ..lol
and im autodidact, so i learn fast if i think its interesting to know








i joined here 3 months ago, with little to no knowledge about intel processors and how to oc,
now im like a little database ...haha









i do have a accent if i speak out loud tho, but i think thats cool








never learned good english at school, i have little to no education that way, i was...lets just say,
i got kicked out of schools about 10-11 times when i was young









so, started working when i was about 15 years old, joined the Army when i was 16,
then work again , but with no education, most jobs are just fysical labour jobs, heavy lifting etc,
i ruined my body doing that for years, now i cant work anymore, worn out body, back, knees , even my toes dont have cartilage between them anymore ..lol, hurts like hell sometimes..

anyways, now you know why i can spent alot of time here..lol
im not really going anywhere, because i cant ..








gotta love the inet tho, great for peeps who are bound to home somehow,
they can still can "meet" great people worldwide...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch wrote*...lol ok, i had to ask/check, hope you understand,
> saw peeps claiming the same, "check my low vcore when i run this or that",


...no problemo - in fact you folks have to ask that question.

But before I got to bed, here is for your collective amusement a (3d mark 11) validated run I did at LOL







2,147,483,647 MHz







(check the processor speed)









...the 5 GHz list-keeper things that 'Schroedinger's cat' got loose again...may be so; I think that 3dMark11 got confused as I was bouncing it between a very fast RamDisk and SSD

http://www.overclock.net/t/678487/5ghz-overclock-club/3370#post_19038801


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...no problemo - in fact you folks have to ask that question.
> 
> But before I got to bed, here is for your collective amusement a (3d mark 11) validated run I did at LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2,147,483,647 MHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (check the processor speed)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...the 5 GHz list-keeper things that 'Schroedinger's cat' got loose again...may be so; I think that 3dMark11 got confused as I was bouncing it between a very fast RamDisk and SSD
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/678487/5ghz-overclock-club/3370#post_19038801


haha, with that speed, you be #1 for about 300 years ...LOL

sleep well for later Joa3d43, dream of a successful delid









only 11.30am here...


----------



## [CyGnus]

managed cas 10 at 2400 stable for 24/7 finally (Thanks FTW420)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> managed cas 10 at 2400 stable for 24/7 finally (Thanks FTW420)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Gratz CyGnus








now i know for sure i want other ram,
mine is sooo slow compared to you..lol

the memory latency doesnt run somehow?

time to do some things, ..laters...


----------



## King4x4




----------



## [CyGnus]

VonDutch and here they are at 5100MHz to give you an idea of the power of these greens:


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> VonDutch and here they are at 5100MHz to give you an idea of the power of these greens:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


you just want to make me







huh? ...lol

what vcore did you use to boot, and make maxmem run?
looks like you disabled things in windows, no aero etc?
i hate that i can do so little tweaking/ocing with my ram,
already happy it runs now with xmp profile and the 9-9-9-24 timings, but only with the rated 1600mhz


----------



## King4x4

I had the samsungs running at 8-8-8-21 1600mhz T1 for awahile


----------



## stickg1

I've been messing around with my newer 3570K, I have 4.9GHz now with 1.475v before LLC. I don't know if I can push for 5.0GHz though, the jump from 4.8 to 4.9 required .075v.


----------



## [CyGnus]

i was at 1.49v for 5.1GHz also did a wprime 1024mb for the competition that i am into here is a pic, 5.1 is stable enough it just uses too much vcore for my liking for 24/7 i just use 4.7GHz with 1.28v its my sweet spot



stickg1 nice overclock what are the temps with that voltage?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I had the samsungs running at 8-8-8-21 1600mhz T1 for awahile


you guys are so mean ..lol.
want to see something funny,
with and without xmp, before and after a bios update,

before bios update without xmp


before bios update, with xmp


with xmp profile, max i saw, ran into trouble with that one,

dont know why it changed suddenly..just did ..lol, i liked the timings tho









bios updated, xmp profile

what factory timings are

not sure what it sets to now, after updated bios, i think its better then before tho, will check in a min









without xmp, bios updated,


----------



## [CyGnus]

VonDutch that is just weird.... XMP changes with every bios update? I would Set the timings manually and you can run them at 1T easy


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> i was at 1.49v for 5.1GHz also did a wprime 1024mb for the competition that i am into here is a pic, 5.1 is stable enough it just uses too much vcore for my liking for 24/7 i just use 4.7GHz with 1.28v its my sweet spot
> 
> 
> 
> stickg1 nice overclock what are the temps with that voltage?


I ran prime95 through the night so after 9 hours it was 80C on the hottest core. But it looks like it averages around 75C. I'm pretty pleased with that. This is my 2nd delid. Monday when I first delidded this chip I thought I killed it so I slapped some Ultra on the die and put it in the PC to see if it was dead or not, it works fine but I only shaved like 10C. So yesterday I took it out and redid the TIM on the die and lost another 10C.

With my hasty first TIM job, I was running 4.8GHz @ 1.4v and maxing out at 81C and now I can run 4.9GHz @ 1.48v with the same 80C temps. So it was definitely a good move to redo it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> VonDutch that is just weird.... XMP changes with every bios update? I would Set the timings manually and you can run them at 1T easy


yea weird, thought it was very funny tho, thats why i post them here








i dont know about T2 or T1 ..or whats best, i do know my ram .... when it comes to changing anything..lol


----------



## stickg1

The only issue with my ASRock board is that the 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T I was running on my RAM with the ASUS board is unstable on my new ASRock board. I think it's in the sub-timings or something. Because I leave them all on auto because I don't know what appropriate values for them are. Maybe my ASUS board did a better job of adjusting those automatically?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I ran prime95 through the night so after 9 hours it was 80C on the hottest core. But it looks like it averages around 75C. I'm pretty pleased with that. This is my 2nd delid. Monday when I first delidded this chip I thought I killed it so I slapped some Ultra on the die and put it in the PC to see if it was dead or not, it works fine but I only shaved like 10C. So yesterday I took it out and redid the TIM on the die and lost another 10C.
> 
> With my hasty first TIM job, I was running 4.8GHz @ 1.4v and maxing out at 81C and now I can run 4.9GHz @ 1.48v with the same 80C temps. So it was definitely a good move to redo it.


changed to 4.8ghz again, with 1.420V vcore tho, 0.160V offset,
gonna run this looong time , if it works well during the next weeks orso..
see if it degrades in time or not









ran prime last night before i went to bed, was 7H running this morning ..no problems.. no whea etc..


----------



## [CyGnus]

stickg1 well asus boards have specific profiles and Asrock boards dont thats why, but try to up the TRFC a bit like more 10/16 and set your TWCL to 8 if it is on 7 and see how it goes let me know what happens.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> changed to 4.8ghz again, with 1.420V vcore tho, 0.160V offset,
> gonna run this looong time , if it works well during the next weeks orso..
> see if it degrades in time or not


I wish i could be like that, i just dont feel comfortable with so much voltage in the CPU... We need to know more about IVY degradation until then i wont risk it.
The weird thing is my ram is rated at 1.35v and i dont have any problem of using it with 1.65v 24/7 lol maybe i will give it a bump in the CPU for 4.8 i need 1.36v guess is not to much either


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good pot & free is a great price!
> The older gpus can get better HW boints, although the 670 would get more global.
> Catch 22 if you need to sell the 670 to get the 3770k though, the cpu matters more for most benches.
> Get the best score you can in at least heaven bench with it before selling, it's about the least cpu dependent.


Yep...I already got the best I could muster with my former 3770k. 5ghz cpu, 2200mhz cl9-12-12-21-1t Samsung greens and the highest I could go with modded bios on my 670. Got a few globals but that card isn't really global material, 7970s are SO much better.
I'm using the money of the sale to clear some debts too, and I can save part of it for a new gpu later on and/or a custom loop.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh my god! My PSU fried my goddamn chip! Went berserk after I plugged it in! Goddamn it! What the hell do I do now?


Hmm, I had the same thing but because of a short in my case. I'm getting artist's eraser to isolate stuff for cold and cause of my paranoia xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The chip is officially dead! I tried it out on my other motherboad and it is dead. Something happened to my PSU and it turned on for a second and then poof! The motherboard starting flashing awkwardly and my chip was pronounced dead!


Check the mobo with a cheap Pentium or Celeron, you can use your rig meanwhile...do you have a backup psu?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On a slightly different trajectory, I like to ask another question:
> 
> When I am building up the custom-loop later in the spring, I have been thinking to incorporate a SMALL Peltier / Seebeck effect cooler INSIDE the reservoir (or along the radiator) which in turn is mounted outside the case, along with the radiator, and running it with automotive anti-freeze. I don't actually want to freeze the system, but adjust the Peltier unit so that it drops the cooling medium to may be 5 C + or so ("Peltier 'light' ?!)
> 
> Assuming that is even possible / feasible, the resulting setup would still be below ambient and thus could generate some condensation along the pipes / hoses / metal fittings / elbows...are there some special insulation sleeves that can deal with that ?


Won't work...forget about peltiers, they were only good back in the Pentium 3 era or something, cause of the low tdp chips. They require a water loop to cool the hot side if you have a tec beefy enough for any kind of cpu cooling duty. Having a peltier in your res will cool the water by 1c maximum, and you'll need something hefty to cool the hot side, otherwise it won't work...it will overload and heat water instead and die. If you wanna cool the water in the res effectively you can later try modding an AC unit into a water chiller or maybe even go all the way and make it a single stage cooler.
Check the extreme cooling section here and at xtremesystems.org, there's a TON of good info there. You just have to see the dates those things were posted and on which hardware piece they were used.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> VonDutch and here they are at 5100MHz to give you an idea of the power of these greens:


Very nice man!








You had great luck, mine SUCKED...What batch are those?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I had the samsungs running at 8-8-8-21 1600mhz T1 for awahile


I had them do 1600mhz cas 5 lol 5-6-7-21-1t, 6-7-7-21-1t, 8-8-9-21-1t at 1866mhz, 8-9-8-21-1t at 2000mhz and 9-9-10-21-1t at 2133mhz, yet 2200mhz 9-12-12-21-1t performed best.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The only issue with my ASRock board is that the 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T I was running on my RAM with the ASUS board is unstable on my new ASRock board. I think it's in the sub-timings or something. Because I leave them all on auto because I don't know what appropriate values for them are. Maybe my ASUS board did a better job of adjusting those automatically?


Asus boards tend to clock ram better, specially the ROG boards...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> stickg1 well asus boards have specific profiles and Asrock boards dont thats why, but try to up the TRFC a bit like more 10/16 and set your TWCL to 8 if it is on 7 and see how it goes let me know what happens.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish i could be like that, i just dont feel comfortable with so much voltage in the CPU... We need to know more about IVY degradation until then i wont risk it.
> The weird thing is my ram is rated at 1.35v and i dont have any problem of using it with 1.65v 24/7 lol maybe i will give it a bump in the CPU for 4.8 i need 1.36v guess is not to much either


1.36v is nothing really, I wouldn't hesitate to go up to 1.45v for 24/7, even less being delidded.


----------



## [CyGnus]

The batch is 1214



About the OC on the cpu i find hard to explain to myself why use more 0.8v for just more 100MHz i guess my problem is that nothing else


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I wish i could be like that, i just dont feel comfortable with so much voltage in the CPU... We need to know more about IVY degradation until then i wont risk it.
> The weird thing is my ram is rated at 1.35v and i dont have any problem of using it with 1.65v 24/7 lol maybe i will give it a bump in the CPU for 4.8 i need 1.36v guess is not to much either


haha, and i dont like it when my ram is at 1.6V, like i have now (1.5V rated)
i dont mind running upto 1.45V vcore for daily use tho,
time will tell if my gut feeling is right or not,
but of what ive learned here so far, i dont see a problem really..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> The batch is 1214
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About the OC on the cpu i find hard to explain to myself why use more 0.8v for just more 100MHz i guess my problem is that nothing else


o, its not that i need the extra 100mhz, 4.7ghz runs perfect
its just a little "proof" to myself, and hopefully others in time,
that you can run 1.45V vcore max 24/7,
without degradation over a longer period of time..
its easy to say to others, but then running 1.3V myself isnt really fair,
thats why i run 1.420V vcore now, or try to, it looks stable so far tho


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> haha, and i dont like it when my ram is at 1.6V, like i have now (1.5V rated)
> i dont mind running upto 1.45V vcore for daily use tho,
> time will tell if my gut feeling is right or not,
> (its gut feeling right?, google translates to gut gevoel ..lol)
> but of what ive learned here so far, i dont see a problem really..


Ha! You know those ic's in your ram are probably rated for 1.65v with higher clocks in another set of sticks right?








Go with the gut, I know I do too...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ha! You know those ic's in your ram are probably rated for 1.65v with higher clocks in another set of sticks right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go with the gut, I know I do too...


at least i have xmp pfofile running now,9-9-9-24 timings, but upped ram voltage from 1.5 to 1.6V to get it,
the higher mhz still doesnt work good, 1800mhz ..blue screen etc..
for ram, i trust you more then my gut feeling







, for my bambam, i know what it can do and cant do ..np there









grocery...bbl


----------



## [CyGnus]

The sammys are 1.65v rated on gskill kits so why not







now cpus are a different thing


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> The sammys are 1.65v rated on gskill kits so why not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now cpus are a different thing


youre saying , because we dont know exactly what ivy's are rated at, you dont dare to go over a specific vcore?
what if they where rated at , lets say, 1.52V, would you run it at 1.45V 24/7?

still have a open thread at the intel support community(started Dec 11, 2012)..lol
no answers yet tho, i updated it this morning with a new post/reply, to bump it up again..lol
http://communities.intel.com/message/178052#178052

omg, and some peeps even go over the rated voltages for ram, 1.65V, but running at 1.7V or higher even..


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well intel says that 1.52v is the max for IVY right so i dont see a problem running 1.4/1.45v on them, i just dont see it worth it for the gains we have, more100/200/300MHz and much more voltage to achieve that little to no improvement. This is the way i think








Not to mention the wattage usage with that voltage. Electricity is not cheap now a days so i put all this together and my conclusion is my 24/7 clocks


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well intel says that 1.52v is the max for IVY right so i dont see a problem running 1.4/1.45v on them, i just dont see it worth it for the gains we have, more100/200/300MHz and much more voltage to achieve that little to no improvement. This is the way i think
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not to mention the wattage usage with that voltage. Electricity is not cheap now a days so i put all this together and my conclusion is my 24/7 clocks


fair enough








now you have me thinking to revert back to stock, to save a few bucks on yearly bases ....LOL

when i joined here, i wanted to achieve a 4.5ghz oc, i thought that was ...wow,
then i uppped to 4.6 ..4.7...and now 4.8ghz









i know i cant run 4.9ghz,
need 1.510V vcore to run stable, thats my personal limit for 24/7 use,
but i think if i would..hmm, it will run np for a few years..and prolly dont need more vcore by then to keep the same oc..


----------



## [CyGnus]

LOL that is not worth it but i will give you an example of mine:

Running Prime 95

4.7GHz @ 1.28v my kill-a-watt says i am using 164w from the wall
4.8GHz @ 1.36v my kill-a-watt says i am using 189w from the wall
4.9GHz @ 1.45v my kill-a-watt says i am using 217w from the wall

4.6 or lower the values are around 150w.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> LOL that is not worth it but i will give you an example of mine:
> 
> Running Prime 95
> 
> 4.7GHz @ 1.28v my kill-a-watt says i am using 164w from the wall
> 4.8GHz @ 1.36v my kill-a-watt says i am using 189w from the wall
> 4.9GHz @ 1.45v my kill-a-watt says i am using 217w from the wall
> 
> 4.6 or lower the values are around 150w.


so you safe about 25Watt between 4.7 and 4.8ghz..but thats measured at 100% load ?

with all the powersavings i have running with my offset, and my comp on for only about 16H a day,
what would i safe a year?
dont need exact numbers, but i think you understand what im aiming at ..lol

omg, i dont think ocing and trying to safe on electric go hand in hand









you know what safe's me the most money ...no gf! ...lol
they cost more then having a computer oced and run all year haha


----------



## Matt-Matt

I have a feeling my chip is degrading.. I keep getting WHEA error messages more and more often, this is the third I've had in total and the second I've had today.

One popped up while unzipping something, one popped up after I accidentally left a fan off (I assumed it was because it got too hot and needed more voltage) and then one came up just then while watching a video.. (like a 100mb file)


----------



## [CyGnus]

Maybe you are just not stable!? Lower 100MHz on it and you should be fine


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Maybe you are just not stable!? Lower 100MHz on it and you should be fine


Might just try an extra 0.1v or something small.. Hmm
I know that the 45x multi isn't stable no matter what, the 44x is what I was at before de-lidding. The 46x was 22 hour P95 stable (Two runs)


----------



## VonDutch

*downclocks to 4.5ghz at 1.230V vcore before answering matt-matt*

strange, what are you running atm? mhz/vcore..


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> haha, and i dont like it when my ram is at 1.6V, like i have now (1.5V rated)
> i dont mind running upto 1.45V vcore for daily use tho,
> time will tell if my gut feeling is right or not,
> but of what ive learned here so far, i dont see a problem really..
> o, its not that i need the extra 100mhz, 4.7ghz runs perfect
> its just a little "proof" to myself, and hopefully others in time,
> that you can run 1.45V vcore max 24/7,
> without degradation over a longer period of time..
> its easy to say to others, but then running 1.3V myself isnt really fair,
> thats why i run 1.420V vcore now, or try to, it looks stable so far tho


Heh, i need 1.420v for 4.7ghz.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I have a feeling my chip is degrading.. I keep getting WHEA error messages more and more often, this is the third I've had in total and the second I've had today.
> 
> One popped up while unzipping something, one popped up after I accidentally left a fan off (I assumed it was because it got too hot and needed more voltage) and then one came up just then while watching a video.. (like a 100mb file)


Are you sure is the cpu, could be ram or even a corrupted window install.... testing memory setting on windows will make windows corrupt it self... I had to reinstall windows once or twice because of that already...


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> *downclocks to 4.5ghz at 1.230V vcore before answering matt-matt*
> 
> strange, what are you running atm? mhz/vcore..


I'm running 4.7 right now. lol

But on all my games cpu temps dont pass 60c-65c.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Heh, i need 1.420v for 4.7ghz.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I'm running 4.7 right now. lol
> 
> But on all my games cpu temps dont pass 60c-65c.
> I had to reinstall windows once or twice because of that already...


yea, temps are no problem anymore after delidding, i can run ibt at 4,7ghz and only hit about 65C hottest core ,
games ..i can only smile about the temps...35-45C








but its wintertime here, im not there yet tempwise, still have to survive a summer with my oc's

scks to have a chip like that, vcore wise, thought mine wasnt that good also ..

only 2 times ..lol i think im at 10-15 times since i joined here, and had to learn how to oc this chip ..









tired, need to rest/chill , my eyes look like ive been smoking a big one ...lol..laters


----------



## chris-br

It's summer here now. lol But cuz of rain ambient temp is 25c.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Heh, i need 1.420v for 4.7ghz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you sure is the cpu, could be ram or even a corrupted window install.... testing memory setting on windows will make windows corrupt it self... I had to reinstall windows once or twice because of that already...


I haven't had any problems with windows prior to this.. Just randomly happens.
The RAM is solid and stable along with what I thought the CPU was, WHEA erorrs are CPU only or are they dependant on RAM failing too?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> *downclocks to 4.5ghz at 1.230V vcore before answering matt-matt*
> 
> strange, what are you running atm? mhz/vcore..


Lol









Like I said it was fine with the same settings back to 2-3 weeks ago. Same settings since..
From memory I'm running 46x Multi, 1.45v and 1.075v IMC Voltage. Everything else is on Auto/Manually set to whatever the "Normal" is.

Memory is at 9-10-10-21 1T @ 1866MHz with 1.525v or something, that is Prime95 stable too.. Same with the CPU.
I just get a few random WHEA errors in the mix because I made a pop-up box appear to give me a WHEA error. I'll try going to 1.452v soon and see what happens.. I'm kind of concerned.








I guess I should be more concerned when IBT/Prime start getting errors though, errors that I can re-produce.

Oh and to add my 7950 is at 1100/1250MHz @ 1.162v that makes no difference really though









Temps on the 3570k never go past 70c also.. Oh well on a boiling hot day they peak at about ~75c with IBT but that doesn't count at all haha.

+Rep to both of you!


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've had a couple PSU blow a cap, it does go like a gunshot. I avoid coolermaster now since the first on was a few month old 650 or 850w (can't remember), which couldn't handle a gtx 260 & i7 920.
> The other was a brand new 1000w, maybe 4 hours use. Had an fx8150 at 7Ghz & was shooting for 7.2 when she blew.


LOL, I know this sound, happened to two of my former older Thermaltake 1000W modular PSUs (W0132RU) ... it does sound like a gunshot LOL!
Sadly, I ve read enough about Corsair PSUs going haywire in recent months (I know the scale effect and fact that people mostly complain in troubleshooting forums) ... personally if my current PSU starts causing any trouble, I go with Seasonic next and nothing else.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> fair enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now you have me thinking to revert back to stock, to save a few bucks on yearly bases ....LOL
> 
> when i joined here, i wanted to achieve a 4.5ghz oc, i thought that was ...wow,
> then i uppped to 4.6 ..4.7...and now 4.8ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i know i cant run 4.9ghz,
> need 1.510V vcore to run stable, thats my personal limit for 24/7 use,
> but i think if i would..hmm, it will run np for a few years..and prolly dont need more vcore by then to keep the same oc..


I would go as far as running stock for daily use and pumping up the clocks if needed for benching or a VERY demanding game...Stock on these Ivy chips is good enough for 90% of the things we do.
Now, if you got a spare chip, the sky is the limit







Being without your rig can get hard at times








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL, I know this sound, happened to two of my former older Thermaltake 1000W modular PSUs (W0132RU) ... it does sound like a gunshot LOL!
> Sadly, I ve read enough about Corsair PSUs going haywire in recent months (I know the scale effect and fact that people mostly complain in troubleshooting forums) ... personally if my current PSU starts causing any trouble, I go with Seasonic next and nothing else.


Seasonic might be the smart thing to do, but Corsair does have a good customer support...Actually I would use whatever psu that had decent customer support and good price, whilst being tested as good by guys like Bobnova at OCF or JohnnyGuru/Oklahoma Wolf.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I would go as far as running stock for daily use and pumping up the clocks if needed for benching or a VERY demanding game...Stock on these Ivy chips is good enough for 90% of the things we do.
> Now, if you got a spare chip, the sky is the limit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Being without your rig can get hard at times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seasonic might be the smart thing to do, but Corsair does have a good customer support...Actually I would use whatever psu that had decent customer support and good price, whilst being tested as good by guys like Bobnova at OCF or JohnnyGuru/Oklahoma Wolf.


i know, but i bought this 3770*K* and choose the K version to have it oced 24/7,
not to have it run at stock, and only up speed for benching,
if you look at it that way, i should have bought a 3570 without K,
and save me some money for others parts..lol..

i was so angry at intel back then, when i couldnt oc it even to 4.5ghz,
my temps where very bad as you know, 105C within seconds running prime..
i was like , ive spend 300 euro, and cant even get a nice oc out of it, dang you Intel...

so i took a very big risk, delid, i didnt have money for another cpu,
never delidded before, didnt even know the word or what it was..
even now, if anything goes wrong, im screwed..

i want to give my psu to my kiddo with the powerhungry amd8350,
im tempted to buy the 850W version of the xfx i have now,
but really looking at a seasonic too, even if it takes a bit longer to get the money,
my xfx is a very good one, reviews/tests show that, thats why i bought it back then,
but thats partly because it has parts in it from seasonic,
like alot of other psu's have..

this one,
Seasonic M12II 850W 80+ Bronze or Seasonic X-750 V2 80 Plus Gold(about 30 euro more)
or,
XFX ProSeries 850W XXX Edition


----------



## Hokies83

Ups brings me stuff.. yay it is a real case.. owning a Cosmos2 it has been so long since i had a good case..


----------



## VonDutch

i see your kiddo is eager to start building it..lol..
cool hokies


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I haven't had any problems with windows prior to this.. Just randomly happens.
> The RAM is solid and stable along with what I thought the CPU was, WHEA erorrs are CPU only or are they dependant on RAM failing too?
> 
> Like I said it was fine with the same settings back to 2-3 weeks ago. Same settings since..
> From memory I'm running 46x Multi, 1.45v and 1.075v IMC Voltage. Everything else is on Auto/Manually set to whatever the "Normal" is.
> 
> Memory is at 9-10-10-21 1T @ 1866MHz with 1.525v or something, that is Prime95 stable too.. Same with the CPU.
> I just get a few random WHEA errors in the mix because I made a pop-up box appear to give me a WHEA error. I'll try going to 1.452v soon and see what happens.. I'm kind of concerned.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess I should be more concerned when IBT/Prime start getting errors though, errors that I can re-produce.
> 
> Oh and to add my 7950 is at 1100/1250MHz @ 1.162v that makes no difference really though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps on the 3570k never go past 70c also.. Oh well on a boiling hot day they peak at about ~75c with IBT but that doesn't count at all haha.


most of the time whea is vcore related as far as i know,
bet you are concerned, i would be too, but then i would just up vcore a notch to start with, and see if it solves the whea errors or not,
did you check Reliability Monitor for anything unusual?
Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Action Center\Reliability Monitor
or type stability in start, search box..

dinnertime


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *ivanlabrie wrote.*.....forget about peltiers, they were only good back in the Pentium 3 era or something, cause of the low tdp chips. They require a water loop to cool the hot side if you have a tec beefy enough for any kind of cpu cooling duty. Having a peltier in your res will cool the water by 1c maximum, and you'll need something hefty to cool the hot side, otherwise it won't work...it will overload and heat water instead and die. If you wanna cool the water in the res effectively you can later try modding an AC unit into a water chiller or maybe even go all the way and make it a single stage cooler.


Thanks







- I just started to look at Peltiers online, and it was a bit fishy that I seem to need s.th. like 500+ extra watts to make it work at the temps I was looking for, but I id not know enough about Peltiers

- Well, I better don't start mentioning 'oil-cooled' solutions, i.e. submerged in an aquarium of mineral oil...on the one hand, it has a fundamental advantage in that it gets to EVERYTHING on the board, PSU etc. On the other, I have actually seen it done and it involved prepping with a lot of silicon spray everywhere, and once it was filled, one pretty much had no options to exchange anything within reason

- That leaves the little ($90) Igloo mini-fridge idea, i.e run a switchable T-valve on the custom water loop to a 3/8th copper pipe coil and cooling fins inside the mini fridge, then back to the main rig. I have an extra Igloo fridge like that, and it even has a mini freezer on top that really will freeze a steak...


----------



## Joa3d43

Hello









Per earlier discussion, I had a chance to run some more stress and temp tests at 4.8, 4.9 and 5.0 GHz (pics below).

I know the voltages are 'good' to begin with and there may be a little bit left on the table...no excuses, but I loath BSODs, not least as my system has 32 GB which need to dump and both very large SQL DBs and also a RamDisk...and while I just added a SSD, I have not yet transferred the OS to it - all that means that after a BSOD, the system will rattle on rebuilding RamDisks etc for quite a while...and I already read 'War and Peace'









I like to add that I also took great care in the thermal design of the rig, especially as it is in a smaller case (Antec 302). I borrowed a construction contractor friend's LIDAR /Thermal Imaging camera a few months back and looked for hot spots with / without side panels. As a result - and may be you can use this as a tip - I installed a 120mm fan on the 'backside' of the MB - the ANtec 302 has a perfect opening there...the fan flows about as much as a Noctua NF-P12 (which sits on the other side panel cooling the SLI GPUs) but has less than half the depth...it shoots straight at the backside of the CPU PCB and also the VRMs from the back

Also, I use a slightly different method to set up the Bios etc., it is not quite finalized yet (and in any case, based on the superb Ivy OC guide on this site). Once I finalize my mods on that, I will share..

Thanks again for all your feedback so far


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> most of the time whea is vcore related as far as i know,
> bet you are concerned, i would be too, but then i would just up vcore a notch to start with, and see if it solves the whea errors or not,
> did you check Reliability Monitor for anything unusual?
> Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Action Center\Reliability Monitor
> or type stability in start, search box..
> 
> dinnertime


yes, WHEA is strictly related to vcore being too low for the stress at given moment. however there is one more variable to that - BIOS. I see that all newer ASUS MVE BIOSes are slightly less stable or "variable" between warm restarts. it may be (and probably is) that BIOS adjusts some automatic settings in a slightly different way during warm restart then it does during cold start, namely I am talking about "Skews" related to BCLK and CPU vcore. I believe adjusting those manually makes the floating stable vcore more stable ... or one could just up it a bit (2 notches is usually enough) to compensate for fluctuations and leave those settings on auto.

One thing to know if degradation occurred in real, is to shutdown the comp, cu the power let it discharge or even let components cool down a bit, then boot it up to lowest recorded OC config from past (I hope you all have notes with your OC configs and settings written down that made it stable under e.g. Cinebench) and compare at exactly same manner as recorded (that also implies using the same BIOS revision). degradation usually occurs at base voltage, which means across all OC speeds always calling for more vcore than in past.


----------



## Airrick10

I've been thinking about delidding but I get nervous about the static electricity messing my chip. Will it be safe to use medical latex gloves while delidding?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I just started to look at Peltiers online, and it was a bit fishy that I seem to need s.th. like 500+ extra watts to make it work at the temps I was looking for, but I id not know enough about Peltiers
> 
> - Well, I better don't start mentioning 'oil-cooled' solutions, i.e. submerged in an aquarium of mineral oil...on the one hand, it has a fundamental advantage in that it gets to EVERYTHING on the board, PSU etc. On the other, I have actually seen it done and it involved prepping with a lot of silicon spray everywhere, and once it was filled, one pretty much had no options to exchange anything within reason
> 
> - That leaves the little ($90) Igloo mini-fridge idea, i.e run a switchable T-valve on the custom water loop to a 3/8th copper pipe coil and cooling fins inside the mini fridge, then back to the main rig. I have an extra Igloo fridge like that, and it even has a mini freezer on top that really will freeze a steak...


You're naming a few ideas that people regularly have...yet they don't work. It's simple, a mini freezer is mostly based around a peltier, and is designed to cool stuff that doesn't actively emit heat, like a steak.








What happens when you put something hot that keeps emitting heat inside it? You overload it, and it dies...Same with a regular fridge: the compressor is not strong enough nor reliable to run 24/7, let alone a few hours really. You need an AC unit and modding it to cool the cpu directly or a reservoir. That's the only way around it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> I've been thinking about delidding but I get nervous about the static electricity messing my chip. Will it be safe to use medical latex gloves while delidding?


I think Hokies and Valgaur did that...I'd get one of those anti static wrist bands or try that method...Static can really wreck your chip.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> yes, WHEA is strictly related to vcore being too low for the stress at given moment. however there is one more variable to that - BIOS. I see that all newer ASUS MVE BIOSes are slightly less stable or "variable" between warm restarts. it may be (and probably is) that BIOS adjusts some automatic settings in a slightly different way during warm restart then it does during cold start, namely I am talking about "Skews" related to BCLK and CPU vcore. I believe adjusting those manually makes the floating stable vcore more stable ... or one could just up it a bit (2 notches is usually enough) to compensate for fluctuations and leave those settings on auto.
> 
> One thing to know if degradation occurred in real, is to shutdown the comp, cu the power let it discharge or even let components cool down a bit, then boot it up to lowest recorded OC config from past (I hope you all have notes with your OC configs and settings written down that made it stable under e.g. Cinebench) and compare at exactly same manner as recorded (that also implies using the same BIOS revision). degradation usually occurs at base voltage, which means across all OC speeds always calling for more vcore than in past.


yea, i was afraid of degradation too, a few weeks ago, thought i needed more vcore for high oc's,
but was just because of some other changes, all other lower oc's still run the same,
even the 4.8ghz i run now, needs ecaxtly the same vcore as a few months ago,
when i was looking for the stable vcore back then 1.420V ..np..

i only make notes of the vcoes i need, or offset's i use, but lazy i know,
but most settings are the same anyways, i know them in my mind,
thats what you get if you have to repeat them all the time,
can do a oc in 1 or 2 min from scratch








good tips tho, thanks feniks, rep you








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> I've been thinking about delidding but I get nervous about the static electricity messing my chip. Will it be safe to use medical latex gloves while delidding?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd get one of those anti static wrist bands or try that method...Static can really wreck your chip.


this







thats the official way ive learned








but the gloves work too, and a rubber matt under your work area helps too

were here to help, so if you have any other questions about your delid, pls ask,
better be safe then sorry right








start with our page 1, clcik all the spoilers there, theres alot of good info..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Sorry..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I had no intentions of returning a dead chip to Intel. I meant just contacting Corsair about it with the $150 cashback or whatever.


Gotcha just wanted to be clear is all lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Notion*
> 
> Valgar: thanks.. will keep you posted..
> 
> What board is the new chip (Haswell) going to be running on? will it fit the 1155 socket?


Yeah its not not55 but the 1150 socket. Keeping original I guess huh Intel?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> I've been thinking about delidding but I get nervous about the static electricity messing my chip. Will it be safe to use medical latex gloves while delidding?


Yup I used latex gloves. Much better protection than anti static stuff because it can still disscharge back into your body. But with rubber there it goes no where. I grounded myself about every 5 minutes as well.


----------



## VonDutch

wrong post.....blieb


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *ivanlabrie* wrote...
> You're naming a few ideas that people regularly have...yet they don't work. It's simple, a mini freezer is mostly based around a peltier, and is designed to cool stuff that doesn't actively emit heat, like a steak.


...thanks







...that's exactly the process I am following right now...trying not to reinvent the wheel by asking others who may already have been there







By the time I build my first-ever custom water loop (which is also when I will de-lid / unlid), I really want to have focused down on a practical if perhaps unusual solution...I have seen some unusual solutions work before with others...however, I realize that when it gets to heat exchange(r)s, there is no free lunch / 'perpetuum mobile'.

I am just wondering what is around my immediate electro-mechanical environment that cools stuff for a living I could piggy-back a bit on...may be drill into the wall of the high-rise and wrap around the cold-water pipes that always flow a lot in a 35 story-building







(ahh, may be not).

But seriously, the Thermaltake 2 extreme has been quite effective...looking at my temps during stress testing in a related post above...I'm more interested in a system-wide solution that also cools the SLI GPUs. Once I got this system the way I want it, there will be another build late this year with two 8-core Xeons which by then may be 22 nm...by that time and on those e units, I want to be done with experimenting.

One final quick question re heat: Re some of the other systems that are also running here but don't get as much of a work-out, is it better to boot down completely (i.e. for a day), or put it in ''sleep mode', or leave the system idling (SpeedStep enabled)...what do you guys do with your secondary systems?...I'm wondering about durability re repeated cold-to-hot cycles. Thanks


----------



## VonDutch

just read this in a post somewhere,

"Yes I saw the 2500K sale they had a month or so ago for $99.99 (IN STORE ONLY) and hated that the closest MicroCenter is like 4 hours from me."

talk about a cheap, and very good chip to build my second pc with ...wow


----------



## [CyGnus]

Hokies83 that case is simply Brutal, post some pics of the progress if possible


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Hokies83 that case is simply Brutal, post some pics of the progress if possible


Yeah, his build will be E P I C . lol


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...that's exactly the process I am following right now...trying not to reinvent the wheel by asking others who may already have been there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By the time I build my first-ever custom water loop (which is also when I will de-lid / unlid), I really want to have focused down on a practical if perhaps unusual solution...I have seen some unusual solutions work before with others...however, I realize that when it gets to heat exchange(r)s, there is no free lunch / 'perpetuum mobile'.
> 
> I am just wondering what is around my immediate electro-mechanical environment that cools stuff for a living I could piggy-back a bit on...may be drill into the wall of the high-rise and wrap around the cold-water pipes that always flow a lot in a 35 story-building
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (ahh, may be not).
> 
> But seriously, the Thermaltake 2 extreme has been quite effective...looking at my temps during stress testing in a related post above...I'm more interested in a system-wide solution that also cools the SLI GPUs. Once I got this system the way I want it, there will be another build late this year with two 8-core Xeons which by then may be 22 nm...by that time and on those e units, I want to be done with experimenting.
> 
> One final quick question re heat: Re some of the other systems that are also running here but don't get as much of a work-out, is it better to boot down completely (i.e. for a day), or put it in ''sleep mode', or leave the system idling (SpeedStep enabled)...what do you guys do with your secondary systems?...I'm wondering about durability re repeated cold-to-hot cycles. Thanks


I do turn off my system when i not gonna used for like 5 or 8 hours.. but is like 2 or 3 hours, i tend to log off for the trim work on my ssd.







But most of the time, i put the pc to sleep..... here in Brazil the electric bill is not cheap like in the US.


----------



## Hokies83

wow feels so good to have a real case again cosmos 2 was an over priced piece of garbage,,,


----------



## [CyGnus]

Very nice looking case







pitty i dont have the space for it


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...that's exactly the process I am following right now...trying not to reinvent the wheel by asking others who may already have been there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By the time I build my first-ever custom water loop (which is also when I will de-lid / unlid), I really want to have focused down on a practical if perhaps unusual solution...I have seen some unusual solutions work before with others...however, I realize that when it gets to heat exchange(r)s, there is no free lunch / 'perpetuum mobile'.
> 
> I am just wondering what is around my immediate electro-mechanical environment that cools stuff for a living I could piggy-back a bit on...may be drill into the wall of the high-rise and wrap around the cold-water pipes that always flow a lot in a 35 story-building
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (ahh, may be not).
> 
> But seriously, the Thermaltake 2 extreme has been quite effective...looking at my temps during stress testing in a related post above...I'm more interested in a system-wide solution that also cools the SLI GPUs. Once I got this system the way I want it, there will be another build late this year with two 8-core Xeons which by then may be 22 nm...by that time and on those e units, I want to be done with experimenting.
> 
> One final quick question re heat: Re some of the other systems that are also running here but don't get as much of a work-out, is it better to boot down completely (i.e. for a day), or put it in ''sleep mode', or leave the system idling (SpeedStep enabled)...what do you guys do with your secondary systems?...I'm wondering about durability re repeated cold-to-hot cycles. Thanks


Water cooling is your best bet albeit expensive...Do you have a portable ac unit or a window ac you can mod? You can duct cold ac air into your intake fans and keep your whole case cooler, but you gotta watch for condensation. If you have a disposable AC unit once you got your wc loop going you could do a water chiller. It involves distilled water with antifreeze to achieve a liquid coolant at -10c or something like that under load.
Works really good but you will need to isolate your components cause of possible condensation near water blocks. Vaseline and artist's eraser works wonders for this. (eraser is better, vaseline more messy...both work)

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?260667-sub-45-Homemade-chiller&highlight=water+chiller

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?30787-Water_Chiller-gallery&highlight=water+chiller


----------



## Joa3d43

that case is something else !









...it could perhaps even house this







http://devgurus.amd.com/thread/159833 though you probably only need two not four 7990s


----------



## megawatz

Will an intel xenon 1.7 work as a practice? I'm thinking about delidding it first before I try on my new ivy.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Will an intel xenon 1.7 work as a practice? I'm thinking about delidding it first before I try on my new ivy.


yea , practice is good before the real attempt, wish i knew that back then,
we have a list of pentiums etc on page 1, which are soldered or not.

i dont know if your xeon is soldered, but i dont think it matters for the practicing,
it about getting the feel how to delid, how much pressure, how to cut in a corner..
if you have no use the xeon later on ..yea, use it ..


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Will an intel xenon 1.7 work as a practice? I'm thinking about delidding it first before I try on my new ivy.


That was my most hardcore research session ever

Yes you can use that for practice, it uses Shin-etsu thermal grease

Proof:

http://download.intel.com/design/Xeon/applnots/24967301.pdf


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool, Shin Etsu?









This...Mind = blown


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool, Shin Etsu?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This...Mind = blown


thank you......... omg............ I mean... really..... its just so awesome....


----------



## megawatz

Delidded two 1.8Ghz Pentium 4 Processors in about 5 minutes. Used the rock n roll method (rock forward, then roll back







)



I think I'm ready.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Delidded two 1.8Ghz Pentium 4 Processors in about 5 minutes. Used the rock n roll method (rock forward, then roll back
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> I think I'm ready.


Looks good and clean man.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Btw - for the black contour glue:
I know you get rid of all of it, but do you use any sort of liquid?
By liquid I mean:
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-000-AC

As I'm going to use that for my IHS + cooler


----------



## [CyGnus]

well i just used my nails and in the end a paper with alcohol to clean it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Btw - for the black contour glue:
> I know you get rid of all of it, but do you use any sort of liquid?
> By liquid I mean:
> https://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-000-AC
> 
> As I'm going to use that for my IHS + cooler


I used my nails and some Isopropyl Alcohol 99%. If you want to get it real clean, use a dremel and a buffing wheel soaked in water. I used this method and it was great.


----------



## megawatz

So, after the IHS is removed, I'm assuming that you put it back on with TIM, as in putting TIM on the outsides of the IHS to make it stay there?
If so, how much do you use?

Should I go grab some sandpaper while I'm at it? Do I need to start like VonDutch did and get each grit and work my way up the grit number?


----------



## Vi0lence

i think im doing another 3770k tomorrow. ill snap some pics this time.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I used my nails and some Isopropyl Alcohol 99%. If you want to get it real clean, use a dremel and a buffing wheel soaked in water. I used this method and it was great.


ah ha- so no harm done on the die, nor chip for using any of the "chemicals"?
That's good


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> So, after the IHS is removed, I'm assuming that you put it back on with TIM, as in putting TIM on the outsides of the IHS to make it stay there?
> If so, how much do you use?
> 
> Should I go grab some sandpaper while I'm at it? Do I need to start like VonDutch did and get each grit and work my way up the grit number?


Nope, the IHS will stay on because we have the mounting bracket.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> ah ha- so no harm done on the die, nor chip for using any of the "chemicals"?
> That's good


i used this
http://www.amazon.com/Generic-FG610-Goof-Off/dp/B00009QP1T


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Nope, the IHS will stay on because we have the mounting bracket.


So the mounting bracket holds the IHS in place, and it's said to move the IHS a very small amount back because the mounting brackets will move it slightly forward?

Also, is removing the nickel with sandpaper really worth it? I hear people have no change at all, some say -3c. My chips runs 4.5Ghz at 1.33v, should I attempt?

Sorry for all the questions, i've been reading. Thinking of doing a live CPU IHS removal on G+, anyone interested? haahahhahaa.


----------



## [CyGnus]

well the main thing here is the black glue cleaned up and some CLP on die for the -20/-25ºc difference so its up to you if less 1 or 2c from 2 hours lapping are worth it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Nope, the IHS will stay on because we have the mounting bracket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So the mounting bracket holds the IHS in place, and it's said to move the IHS a very small amount back because the mounting brackets will move it slightly forward?
> 
> Also, is removing the nickel with sandpaper really worth it? I hear people have no change at all, some say -3c. My chips runs 4.5Ghz at 1.33v, should I attempt?
> 
> Sorry for all the questions, i've been reading. Thinking of doing a live CPU IHS removal on G+, anyone interested? haahahhahaa.
Click to expand...

Tell me when you are casting it, I might be able to help you and give you some pointers while you are doing it. Preferably text because my voice is known to be a little childish.







I don't see the point in lapping anymore, I used to do it all the time to all my CPUs especially the ones that were out of warranty! They don't give too much of a temp loss boost, maybe 1C, not even 1 normally. Lapping the underbelly of the IHS would be fine as long as those prints on the IHS itself is intact. Intel will accept my non-delidded CPU (wink wink) tomorrow.


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> well the main thing here is the black glue cleaned up and some CLP on die for the -20/-25ºc difference so its up to you if less 1 or 2c from 2 hours lapping are worth it


I'm going to use AS5, I see that the temp drops on the list are around 10-14c, and I'm not asking for 30c difference, just something to keep my temps a little low. I can always put CLP on later, right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Tell me when you are casting it, I might be able to help you and give you some pointers while you are doing it. Preferably text because my voice is known to be a little childish.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't see the point in lapping anymore, I used to do it all the time to all my CPUs especially the ones that were out of warranty! They don't give too much of a temp loss boost, maybe 1C, not even 1 normally. Lapping the underbelly of the IHS would be fine as long as those prints on the IHS itself is intact. Intel will accept my non-delidded CPU (wink wink) tomorrow.


I'll need to set up my camera, which could be done. I want to do it tonight. IDK, we'll find out. I think I'm just going to go ahead and de-lid. God I hope this 3570K is just as easy to delid as the P4s I just did.


----------



## Hokies83

bought all i can do for now...


----------



## stickg1

I don't practice delidding, I just use razor blades and sledgehammers. First I hit the chip a few times to let it know who's boss.

Next time I'm going to put the chisel bit on my jack hammer and go to work on that thing.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I don't practice delidding, I just use razor blades and sledgehammers. First I hit the chip a few times to let it know who's boss.
> 
> Next time I'm going to put the chisel bit on my jack hammer and go to work on that thing.


hahahahaha

Chip -> RVP in your pic


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *ivanlabrie wrote.*.. Water cooling is your best bet albeit expensive...Do you have a portable ac unit or a window ac you can mod? You can duct cold ac air into your intake fans and keep your whole case cooler, but you gotta watch for condensation. If you have a disposable AC unit once you got your wc loop going you could do a water chiller. It involves distilled water with antifreeze to achieve a liquid coolant at -10c or something like that under load.
> Works really good but you will need to isolate your components cause of possible condensation near water blocks. Vaseline and artist's eraser works wonders for this. (eraser is better, vaseline more messy...both work).


Thanks much !! The first step is more extensive water-cooling / de-lidding, then sub-ambient cooling (must also be long-term reliable)


----------



## stickg1

But for real, I did practice on a pentium first. But I did it so fast because in my mind I knew I only paid $2 for the thing so I just sliced it up. You're first 3570/3770 can be a little nerve-racking. Especially getting the first incisions on each corner and getting the sides with the lip on them. I only have used utility knife blades because I'm a construction worker and I have 100 in my truck's lock box and 50 of them in my garage. I didn't feel the need to go buy special blades for the job when I have tons of blades available. If you have to go out and buy blades anyway, I recommend you get one of those gillette blades people have been posting pics of, they look significantly thinner than the blades I use. The blades I use requires force because they have to wedge the IHS from the PCB to start cutting. My most recent delid I chipped the die because of my uncontrollable man-strength (







). The only problem I have noticed on my chip is that core #0 the temp will rapidly go up and down 10C while I'm loading. I think its just an error in the sensor or something. Other than that I'm fully functional.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Gillette razors 0.0?

http://maisonbisson.com/files/2011/01/B000BUUVTE.01.PT01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

Surely not...those blades?!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> well the main thing here is the black glue cleaned up and some CLP on die for the -20/-25ºc difference so its up to you if less 1 or 2c from 2 hours lapping are worth it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to use AS5, I see that the temp drops on the list are around 10-14c, and I'm not asking for 30c difference, just something to keep my temps a little low. I can always put CLP on later, right?
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Tell me when you are casting it, I might be able to help you and give you some pointers while you are doing it. Preferably text because my voice is known to be a little childish.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't see the point in lapping anymore, I used to do it all the time to all my CPUs especially the ones that were out of warranty! They don't give too much of a temp loss boost, maybe 1C, not even 1 normally. Lapping the underbelly of the IHS would be fine as long as those prints on the IHS itself is intact. Intel will accept my non-delidded CPU (wink wink) tomorrow.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'll need to set up my camera, which could be done. I want to do it tonight. IDK, we'll find out. I think I'm just going to go ahead and de-lid. God I hope this 3570K is just as easy to delid as the P4s I just did.
Click to expand...

The die is larger in the 3570k so watch out for that. Keep my guide open and see where you stop so you don't go by memory!


----------



## [CyGnus]

Hokies83 its looking good keep them coming we are


----------



## megawatz

Holy s#!t.

I did it. I cut myself a little, but I did it.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Holy s#!t.
> 
> I did it. I cut myself a little, but I did it.


Working?


----------



## [CyGnus]

pics or it didn't happen









Heres one of my cpu not the best looking 3570k lol


----------



## Swag

Steps:
1. Drink
2. Celebrate
3. Drink some more
4. Apply paste and turn that thing up
5. Celebrate some more

If working, do steps 1 - 5.
If not working, do steps 1 - 5, skip steps 2,4,5.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> So the mounting bracket holds the IHS in place, and it's said to move the IHS a very small amount back because the mounting brackets will move it slightly forward?
> 
> Also, is removing the nickel with sandpaper really worth it? I hear people have no change at all, some say -3c. My chips runs 4.5Ghz at 1.33v, should I attempt?
> 
> Sorry for all the questions, i've been reading. Thinking of doing a live CPU IHS removal on G+, anyone interested? haahahhahaa.


It's worth it if you want to change your chip.

people say that delidding isn't worth it, new TIM isn't worth it, lapping isn't worth it ... because they each only add 4-5 (Cept TIM change on Die)

But when you delid, change TIM on die, add CLP on IHS, and lap everything, you could be looking at a 30-35ºC drop.

I would definitely lap if you're on the pursuit of performance. Use Coollaboratory Ultra on the die, lap the IHS ... Then cooling can push you even further. Upgrading to a high-performance air heatsink, a watercooling AIO loop, to a custom water loop, to a phase change unit ...

You could end up running 5.5GHz at 24/7 at 0ºC if you're adventurous enough. The sky is [nearly] the limit


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Steps:
> 1. Drink
> 2. Celebrate
> 3. Drink some more
> 4. Apply paste and turn that thing up
> 5. Celebrate some more
> 
> If working, do steps 1 - 5.
> If not working, do steps 1 - 5, skip steps 2,4,5.


I have a meeting at 8PM to discuss a film project, so when I get back I'm going to do just that. Can I razorblade (very gently) the black crap off?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Steps:
> 1. Drink
> 2. Celebrate
> 3. Drink some more
> 4. Apply paste and turn that thing up
> 5. Celebrate some more
> 
> If working, do steps 1 - 5.
> If not working, do steps 1 - 5, skip steps 2,4,5.
> 
> 
> 
> I have a meeting at 8PM to discuss a film project, so when I get back I'm going to do just that. Can I razorblade (very gently) the black crap off?
Click to expand...

Would advise against it, one nick on the PCB could mean a dead chip or single channel memory or something even worse.


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Would advise against it, one nick on the PCB could mean a dead chip or single channel memory or something even worse.


Credit Card?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Credit Card?


Fingernails.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Would advise against it, one nick on the PCB could mean a dead chip or single channel memory or something even worse.
> 
> 
> 
> Credit Card?
Click to expand...

Filed nails or buffing wheel. You just need to lightly scrub it basically and avoid hitting the die. Seriously though, just use your fingernails.







That's what I did with my chip originally.


----------



## lilchronic

i did all the the corners with a razer blade then took my laminated motorcycle license and did the rest with that


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Filed nails or buffing wheel. You just need to lightly scrub it basically and avoid hitting the die. Seriously though, just use your fingernails.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's what I did with my chip originally.


OKay, got most of it off. Time to head to my meeting.

I'll keep you guys in the loop when I get back. ETA 1 hour.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Filed nails or buffing wheel. You just need to lightly scrub it basically and avoid hitting the die. Seriously though, just use your fingernails.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's what I did with my chip originally.


I'm still a little unclear of the cleaning process on the die then:
Finger nails and/or cleaning solution are A-OK correctomundo?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm still a little unclear of the cleaning process on the die then:
> Finger nails and/or cleaning solution are A-OK correctomundo?


Isoprophyl Alcohol and a q-tip to clean the old paste off the die. Fingernails to scrape the glue off the PCB. Razorblade to clean the glue off the IHS.

But I use a chainsaw and a belt-sander on mine.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> most of the time whea is vcore related as far as i know,
> bet you are concerned, i would be too, but then i would just up vcore a notch to start with, and see if it solves the whea errors or not,
> did you check Reliability Monitor for anything unusual?
> Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Action Center\Reliability Monitor
> or type stability in start, search box..
> 
> dinnertime


That is a really good tool!
No WHEAs in there? All I found was "Call of Duty was installed" blah blah blah. Oh and a few "Unexpected shutdowns", one was Crysis killed my graphics card (it was unstable after all this time!) and the other was me shorting out a USB port and making the circuit breaker do its job


----------



## FtW 420

So many pages since I went to bed, need an assistant to keep up on the reading & condense notes...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> LOL, I know this sound, happened to two of my former older Thermaltake 1000W modular PSUs (W0132RU) ... it does sound like a gunshot LOL!
> Sadly, I ve read enough about Corsair PSUs going haywire in recent months (I know the scale effect and fact that people mostly complain in troubleshooting forums) ... personally if my current PSU starts causing any trouble, I go with Seasonic next and nothing else.


I haven't had many issues with corsair, my first corsair psu (hx1000) is still kicking years later. has degraded a bit (can barely hold 1000w load spike), & had to chop off the 24 pin atx & solder in a new one when the original one failed (wires starting to wear from being moved too many times).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I would go as far as running stock for daily use and pumping up the clocks if needed for benching or a VERY demanding game...Stock on these Ivy chips is good enough for 90% of the things we do.
> Now, if you got a spare chip, the sky is the limit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Being without your rig can get hard at times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seasonic might be the smart thing to do, but Corsair does have a good customer support...Actually I would use whatever psu that had decent customer support and good price, whilst being tested as good by guys like Bobnova at OCF or JohnnyGuru/Oklahoma Wolf.


I do this, when running a 24/7 rig it is just mildly overclocked, gpus I don't overclock unless benching. I can run high overclocks, but don't really need it for daily stuff, more just for fun.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I just started to look at Peltiers online, and it was a bit fishy that I seem to need s.th. like 500+ extra watts to make it work at the temps I was looking for, but I id not know enough about Peltiers
> 
> - Well, I better don't start mentioning 'oil-cooled' solutions, i.e. submerged in an aquarium of mineral oil...on the one hand, it has a fundamental advantage in that it gets to EVERYTHING on the board, PSU etc. On the other, I have actually seen it done and it involved prepping with a lot of silicon spray everywhere, and once it was filled, one pretty much had no options to exchange anything within reason
> 
> - That leaves the little ($90) Igloo mini-fridge idea, i.e run a switchable T-valve on the custom water loop to a 3/8th copper pipe coil and cooling fins inside the mini fridge, then back to the main rig. I have an extra Igloo fridge like that, and it even has a mini freezer on top that really will freeze a steak...


Mini fridges aren't very good, those die easily just trying to keep beer cold. Full size fridges are better, but not made to handle any heatload.
I do have a tec cooled water chiller here, eats about 250w to get water about 5° under ambient. Under heavy load, doesn't take long to run like a regular (good) water loop.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> I've been thinking about delidding but I get nervous about the static electricity messing my chip. Will it be safe to use medical latex gloves while delidding?


I've never worn anything for static prevention, just ground yourself frequently. Changing hardware all the time & never had any issues with static charge.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> wow feels so good to have a real case again cosmos 2 was an over priced piece of garbage,,,


It's big!...
I do feel out of place with case talk. I always just use the case that comes with the motherboard, can't beat the airflow.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> It's worth it if you want to change your chip.
> 
> people say that delidding isn't worth it, new TIM isn't worth it, lapping isn't worth it ... because they each only add 4-5 (Cept TIM change on Die)
> 
> But when you delid, change TIM on die, add CLP on IHS, and lap everything, you could be looking at a 30-35ºC drop.
> 
> I would definitely lap if you're on the pursuit of performance. Use Coollaboratory Ultra on the die, lap the IHS ... Then cooling can push you even further. Upgrading to a high-performance air heatsink, a watercooling AIO loop, to a custom water loop, to a phase change unit ...
> 
> You could end up running 5.5GHz at 24/7 at 0ºC if you're adventurous enough. The sky is [nearly] the limit


You're on the right track!
Remembered to hook up the wattmeter to the cascade today, 1150w max to start up, runs with 850 - 925w so far just browsing ocn. Only at 5.4Ghz though, 5.5 is easy for bench stable but not easy to get stable stable, IBT never wants to keep going after loop 6..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> OKay, got most of it off. Time to head to my meeting.
> 
> I'll keep you guys in the loop when I get back. ETA 1 hour.


That hour is going to kill me lol.

And Hokies nice job on the case! makes me want to get one this summer!







and then throw in all 80mm rads. and only 80 mm rads.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That hour is going to kill me lol.
> 
> And Hokies nice job on the case! makes me want to get one this summer!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and then throw in all 80mm rads. and only 80 mm rads.


,_, why would you do that. that's torture


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> ,_, why would you do that. that's torture


make a dual pump system and have ambient temps all day long no matter what baby!!!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like the case that comes 'bundled' with the board concept...lol
I do that to check for shorts, but it works good if you have a spare benching room/man cave. In my place I don't, so I gotta have a semi decent looking rig/desk thing. I could hid some raddage/chiller or something under my keyboard tray though


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That hour is going to kill me lol.
> 
> And Hokies nice job on the case! makes me want to get one this summer!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and then throw in all 80mm rads. and only 80 mm rads.


Selling Cosmos 2 u take a beating i sold mine 200$ shipped and took afew weeks. means i got 140$ for it lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Selling Cosmos 2 u take a beating i sold mine 200$ shipped and took afew weeks. means i got 140$ for it lol.


might give the cosmos 2 to my parents lol.


----------



## jamonymo

can some one help me i was wondering why some peoples i7-3770k auto overclock settings lets say 4.5 there volts are around mine at stock ,
even when i ofset -60mvl its still not lower anouth on my board

my stock volts under load with -60mlv is 1.216 this seems to high also unless i use fixed voltage i cant change it t unless i use ofset mode even further , but anythink lower than -60mlv in ofset changes the voltage colour changes to red in the bios to make out its dangerous, is this even dangerous i dont think it realy is as its lowering the vcore but i needed some expert advice

my motherboard asus P8Z77-V seems to set a higher stock voltage than other boards will a bios update maby fix this or am i wrong

does any one understand my ramble please help

also even no i use the bios to change voltage asus turbo evo vcore slider sais 1.15 and the senser reads 1.214


----------



## megawatz

Nervous. I have a very tiny tiny chip in on the edge of the chip. It's barely noticeable, and it doesn't look like it will affect anything (hopefully)

If I have a dead chip, at this point, I'm just going to say screw it and buy another one. But damnit if I'm not going to give this one a try.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good luck!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Nervous. I have a very tiny tiny chip in on the edge of the chip. It's barely noticeable, and it doesn't look like it will affect anything (hopefully)
> 
> If I have a dead chip, at this point, I'm just going to say screw it and buy another one. But damnit if I'm not going to give this one a try.


How did you chip the chip







?


----------



## jamonymo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> 
> 
> Nervous. I have a very tiny tiny chip in on the edge of the chip. It's barely noticeable, and it doesn't look like it will affect anything (hopefully)
> 
> If I have a dead chip, at this point, I'm just going to say screw it and buy another one. But damnit if I'm not going to give this one a try.


are you changing tim , please tell me if the temps improove


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> How did you chip the chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


Lost control when I was holding it with my fingers and putting pressure to get through one of the corners.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> How did you chip the chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


Chipping chips in 2013...









Anyway, I hope the processor is okay. We can't have another funeral!


----------



## c2thew

just saw a video highlighting a new liquid cooler: H220 by swiftech. Beats the corsair h100 by 5 degrees celsius when OC'd to 4.6ghz. Price point is $134.99. I'm tempted to upgrade and mod my case


----------



## c2thew

Yeah, my asrock won't make post at 2133 10-10-10-28 at 1.5v or higher. Seems like I'm running into issues with the memory if i push it past 2000 10-10-10-28 1.45v I purchased 4 individual sticks.

http://www.overclockers.com/swiftech-h220-first-look


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamonymo*
> 
> can some one help me i was wondering why some peoples i7-3770k auto overclock settings lets say 4.5 there volts are around mine at stock ,
> even when i ofset -60mvl its still not lower anouth on my board
> 
> my stock volts under load with -60mlv is 1.216 this seems to high also unless i use fixed voltage i cant change it t unless i use ofset mode even further , but anythink lower than -60mlv in ofset changes the voltage colour changes to red in the bios to make out its dangerous, is this even dangerous i dont think it realy is as its lowering the vcore but i needed some expert advice
> 
> my motherboard asus P8Z77-V seems to set a higher stock voltage than other boards will a bios update maby fix this or am i wrong
> 
> does any one understand my ramble please help
> 
> also even no i use the bios to change voltage asus turbo evo vcore slider sais 1.15 and the senser reads 1.214


Okay I'll take a swing at this one for ya.

First off don't use offset as it makes it hard to find your needed voltage or (vcore) for the certain Overclock you are trying to use or trying to get. Now I bet what your CPU-z is showing is indeed the offset of the voltage of .06 vcore but you need to get rid of offset in the bios and use manual voltage. this will allow you to set the vcore or voltage to what you type in or move the slider to as well.

Okay lets say you are at 4.5 Ghz here. take in that your CPU-Z program shows 1.208 vcore and you have an offset of -.06 vcore. this means that your i7 will use less volts when it's not needed. but when it's needed it uses 1.208 vcore. when you set your motherboards bios voltage settings to manual you can set the voltage to 1.15 vcore (for example) and then be able to only have that voltage go to the CPU at that time. IF YOU ARE USING AUTO FOR OVERCLOCKING THAT IS NOT CORRECT.

Sorry not yelling at you just making a point is all. you never overclock a CPU using auto voltage. the chip will pull far to many volts for it.

So what I want you to do is go to Bios and change your settings int he CPU page from auto or offset voltage to manual voltage and then mess with the voltage slider in windows and see what CPU-Z shows you then. It should show in CPU-Z the same thing you have on your slider in AI Suite II.

Another thing. if you can make sure your LLC or (Load Line Calibration) is set for 100% not 120%. this regulates the amount of "extra" voltage you want the CPU to use. setting this to 100% might also solve this issue.

Let me know.









and don't put the voltage over 1.5 vcore.


----------



## megawatz

Chip is in, IHS is in, heatsink going in..and then finally, testing.

Everyone say a prayer.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Chipping chips in 2013...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, I hope the processor is okay. We can't have another funeral!


Chip chippity chip chipitty chip chip chiraaaa!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Chip is in, IHS is in, heatsink going in..and then finally, testing.
> Everyone say a prayer.


May the force be with you.
Hopefully not too much force


----------



## Airrick10

Is it alive and breathing???? The suspense is killing me!!! Lol


----------



## megawatz

Guys....

It's not doing so well....

It's doing AWESOME! It boots, recognized in BIOS, Windows boots up fine, running 1.31v at 4.5Ghz. Now, for the stress tests!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Guys....
> 
> It's not doing so well....
> 
> It's doing AWESOME! It boots, recognized in BIOS, Windows boots up fine, running 1.31v at 4.5Ghz. Now, for the stress tests!


I was waiting for a picture to load as my net has been acting like it's capped over the past few days









Awesome! Screen shots of the temps, oh and what paste did you end up using on the DIE + IHS?

Also another question.. Say I want to replace my heatsync or change motherboard, and the IHS comes off. Seeing as I've used liquid pro would I be better off just sitting the IHS back on or would I have to clean it down and re-apply?


----------



## jamonymo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay I'll take a swing at this one for ya.
> 
> First off don't use offset as it makes it hard to find your needed voltage or (vcore) for the certain Overclock you are trying to use or trying to get. Now I bet what your CPU-z is showing is indeed the offset of the voltage of .06 vcore but you need to get rid of offset in the bios and use manual voltage. this will allow you to set the vcore or voltage to what you type in or move the slider to as well.
> 
> Okay lets say you are at 4.5 Ghz here. take in that your CPU-Z program shows 1.208 vcore and you have an offset of -.06 vcore. this means that your i7 will use less volts when it's not needed. but when it's needed it uses 1.208 vcore. when you set your motherboards bios voltage settings to manual you can set the voltage to 1.15 vcore (for example) and then be able to only have that voltage go to the CPU at that time. IF YOU ARE USING AUTO FOR OVERCLOCKING THAT IS NOT CORRECT.
> 
> Sorry not yelling at you just making a point is all. you never overclock a CPU using auto voltage. the chip will pull far to many volts for it.
> 
> So what I want you to do is go to Bios and change your settings int he CPU page from auto or offset voltage to manual voltage and then mess with the voltage slider in windows and see what CPU-Z shows you then. It should show in CPU-Z the same thing you have on your slider in AI Suite II.
> 
> Another thing. if you can make sure your LLC or (Load Line Calibration) is set for 100% not 120%. this regulates the amount of "extra" voltage you want the CPU to use. setting this to 100% might also solve this issue.
> 
> Let me know.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and don't put the voltage over 1.5 vcore.


my old 1366 i7 050 did not have ofset so it confused me, yes u are right they always set auto volts way to high as my old cpu was set a hole 1.0mv to high, i will get back to u on changing my settings thanks


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I was waiting for a picture to load as my net has been acting like it's capped over the past few days
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome! Screen shots of the temps, oh and what paste did you end up using on the DIE + IHS?
> 
> Also another question.. Say I want to replace my heatsync or change motherboard, and the IHS comes off. Seeing as I've used liquid pro would I be better off just sitting the IHS back on or would I have to clean it down and re-apply?


I used AS5 on both. I'll get to CLP later on in life.

heatsink** (sorry, a bit of a grammar nazi)

and resetting it would be your best option. You can try and sit it back on, but I would reapply just in case.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I used AS5 on both. I'll get to CLP later on in life.
> 
> heatsink** (sorry, a bit of a grammar nazi)
> 
> and resetting it would be your best option. You can try and sit it back on, but I would reapply just in case.


I've seen it spelt both ways.. It's just in my typing vocabulary to type it like that. In my mind it's a "Heatsink" but i just commonly type it as "Heatsync" because I've seen it written/typed like that a lot.
I guess when the time comes I'll try making it so the IHS doesn't get taken off, I reckon it will though. My best bet is to try and re-seat it without applying though because that is the easy way out and it saves paste.









Cheers


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Guys....
> 
> It's not doing so well....
> 
> It's doing AWESOME! It boots, recognized in BIOS, Windows boots up fine, running 1.31v at 4.5Ghz. Now, for the stress tests!


Hurry up already!!!!!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamonymo*
> 
> my old 1366 i7 050 did not have ofset so it confused me, yes u are right they always set auto volts way to high as my old cpu was set a hole 1.0mv to high, i will get back to u on changing my settings thanks


No problem get back to me with the results.


----------



## megawatz

Running Prime95 to test temps. Wanted to do IBT, but thought, oh well.

Then again, I got to 4.8Ghz @ 1.41 and couldn't get stable at all.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Running Prime95 to test temps. Wanted to do IBT, but thought, oh well.
> 
> Then again, I got to 4.8Ghz @ 1.41 and couldn't get stable at all.


do 1.45 and give that a shot. also mess with PLL


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> do 1.45 and give that a shot. also mess with PLL


Pll us 75% right now


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *SonDa5* wrote: ...That is an amazing 3770k you have. What batch is it? Have you done any stability testing....


SonDa5...I hope you did not run out and buy up all the ones with that batch number I subsequently gave you...it turns out that the batch number was for an I7 3770 'non-K' (have two of those for a virtual machine, and the three boxes are all piled together). BTW, the one 3770 non-K I pushed is a great overclocker in its own right (also from Costa Rica), and at its absolute max multiplier and with a stable 108.1 BCLK with the Thermaltake 2 Extr., this ran great at 4560 MHz for over two months before I started the 'K' / Sabertooth Z77 build.

In any case, I got confused between three I7 3770 boxes and the correct 'K' batch number is ' 3229C447 ' / Costa Rica









Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote: ...did you try run programs for longer time, and stability too?


We already touched on an earlier stress test result for 4.8 GHz I posted, but I knew I could get 'v' down a bit more (to 1.312v). This additional post (I forgot to put your tag in then) has a 100% core / thread
stress load per Windows Resource Monitor, +CPU Z, plus CPU core temps at 4.8 GHz, 4.9 GHz and 5.0 Ghz http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/8640#post_19064152

---

And finally, a *general* question: What is the highest validated I7 3770K @ 1.5v or less / 100% load recorded and validated speed, excluding LNG, Liquid Helium etc (which would be running higher voltage anyhow) ?


----------



## captvizcenzo

OCN name: captvizcenzo
CPU: intel Core i7 3770K
on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: TBD
OC after delid: TBD
Temp drops: Around 25C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: TBD

I only keep my before delid temp for 4.6GHz @ 1.24V
Before:


After:


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> SonDa5...I hope you did not run out and buy up all the ones with that batch number I subsequently gave you...it turns out that the batch number was for an I7 3770 'non-K' (have two of those for a virtual machine, and the three boxes are all piled together). BTW, the one 3770 non-K I pushed is a great overclocker in its own right (also from Costa Rica), and at its absolute max multiplier and with a stable 108.1 BCLK with the Thermaltake 2 Extr., this ran great at 4560 MHz for over two months before I started the 'K' / Sabertooth Z77 build.
> 
> In any case, I got confused between three I7 3770 boxes and the correct 'K' batch number is ' 3229C447 ' / Costa Rica
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We already touched on an earlier stress test result for 4.8 GHz I posted, but I knew I could get 'v' down a bit more (to 1.312v). This additional post (I forgot to put your tag in then) has a 100% core / thread
> stress load per Windows Resource Monitor, +CPU Z, plus CPU core temps at 4.8 GHz, 4.9 GHz and 5.0 Ghz http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/8640#post_19064152
> 
> ---
> 
> And finally, a *general* question: What is the highest validated I7 3770K @ 1.5v or less / 100% load recorded and validated speed, excluding LNG, Liquid Helium etc (which would be running higher voltage anyhow) ?


3229c447, I have one of the exact same batch. Great low voltage chip up to 47x, after that needs big vcore bumps.
Still in search of my golden benching chip....

I'll have to test more at 1.5V, but for me with the 3770k I have running now looks like 5.3Ghz max without ln2, lhe or DICE. It is frozen, but just have to plug the cooler in, been using it as a daily rig for days like that.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420* wrote...3229c447, I have one of the exact same batch. Great low voltage chip up to 47x, after that needs big vcore bumps.
> Still in search of my golden benching chip....
> 
> I'll have to test more at 1.5V, but for me with the 3770k I have running now looks like 5.3Ghz max without ln2, lhe or DICE. It is frozen, but just have to plug the cooler in, been using it as a daily rig for days like that.


Four letters: NCIX ?


----------



## FtW 420

Yes, the coquitlam store, they only had some 3229 at the time, tried the C over the B batch they also had.
Got a 3230B chip in burnaby a couple days later, but not even as good as the 3229C...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Lost control when I was holding it with my fingers and putting pressure to get through one of the corners.


That's why I reccomend doing the cut in a singgle motion or using a less sharp object once a corner is penetrated.
you're really lucky


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420* wrote...Yes, the coquitlam store, they only had some 3229 at the time, tried the C over the B batch they also had.
> Got a 3230B chip in burnaby a couple days later, but not even as good as the 3229C...


...I thought so







...mine is from the Broadway store...I remember when they were still just called 'Netlink' up in Burnaby years back...they sure have grown


----------



## FtW 420

The burnaby branch has been best for me so far for finding golden chips (gotten a few out of them), although I haven't been lucky with ivy.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just saw a video highlighting a new liquid cooler: H220 by swiftech. Beats the corsair h100 by 5 degrees celsius when OC'd to 4.6ghz. Price point is $134.99. I'm tempted to upgrade and mod my case


I hope you're buying the triple 120mm model..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I thought so
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...mine is from the Broadway store...I remember when they were still just called 'Netlink' up in Burnaby years back...they sure have grown


Come say Hi one day, I work just down the street


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> OCN name: captvizcenzo
> CPU: intel Core i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: TBD
> OC after delid: TBD
> Temp drops: Around 25C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: TBD
> 
> I only keep my before delid temp for 4.6GHz @ 1.24V
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:


Your IN!!! Now Slap that nice and awesome Sig on baby!!! and Welcome to the crew!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's why I reccomend doing the cut in a singgle motion or using a less sharp object once a corner is penetrated.
> you're really lucky


Exactly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The burnaby branch has been best for me so far for finding golden chips (gotten a few out of them), although I haven't been lucky with ivy.


I haven't seen many lucky people either honestly.


----------



## VonDutch

*yawn* morning, not so fast guys...really, 9 pages of posts since i went to bed and waking up again ...LOL


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your IN!!! Now Slap that nice and awesome Sig on baby!!! and Welcome to the crew!


Yeay!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> Yeay!!


Welcome! captvizcenzo


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The burnaby branch has been best for me so far for finding golden chips (gotten a few out of them), although I haven't been lucky with ivy.


Haha, I can just imagine Intel.

"Where do we put all the Golden chips?"
"Eh, just sell them in burnaby.. no one will ever know"


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Welcome! captvizcenzo


Thanks VonDutch!









Now I gonna find the next 24/7 stable OC


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> Thanks VonDutch!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I gonna find the next 24/7 stable OC


is the, i7-3770K 4.6GHz @ 1.245V , in your sig stable?
thats a very nice vcore at that speed









o, ftw420, was it you that said somewhere liquid pro isnt good with zub zero temps?
omg, my brain is blurry today ...better dont answer to many questions ...lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Guys....
> 
> It's doing AWESOME! It boots, recognized in BIOS, Windows boots up fine, running 1.31v at 4.5Ghz. Now, for the stress tests!


Gratz megawatz..









that sounded good..lol

kk, 1 question i have on my mind since yesterday,
i remember when i started ocing, and first times i used offset, i had a negative offset,
its a + offset now, but i cant remember how i got it, i was thinking this morning,
maybe it was because i used less vdroop?
not that its a bad thing to have a negative offset, but at idle you could run into instability right?,
negative lowers your idle voltage also ...but im not sure anymore..lol
blurry brains today srry...


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> is the, i7-3770K 4.6GHz @ 1.245V , in your sig stable?
> thats a very nice vcore at that speed


Yes, it is stable. That's what I'm using 24/7


----------



## Hokies83

Well guess ill leave here for a bit waiting on more rads and another pump and still looking for a 400ML + show piece Res..

Not an issue of waiting as i have to mail off my g1 sniper 3 in the morning and wait to get it back from giga byte anywho..

I will post more pics when all my fans / rads are here next week..

Having this case is a dream come true over a standard type case like the Cosmos 2 it is a dream to do a build it with those wheels i just roll it back and forth lol
Hideing wires / leds is also easy and very well planned out in this case.. the onlything i can harp on it about is id like shorter 5.25 bays.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> Yes, it is stable. That's what I'm using 24/7


very nice








well, now that max temps is out of the way,
you can look at the max speed/vcore it does..lol
this is how ivy should have run in the first place, right Intel!, yea, you heard me








i needed about 1.3V vcore for 4.7ghz, curious what you can run it max..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Haha, I can just imagine Intel.
> 
> "Where do we put all the Golden chips?"
> "Eh, just sell them in burnaby.. no one will ever know"


Not all of them though, 2nd i7 920 was a great one, had to go through 4 or 5 2600k before getting one with a working 59x multi.
I did get a great 955be for my first ever AMD chip, still in the #1 spot here for k10 http://valid.canardpc.com/records.php
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> is the, i7-3770K 4.6GHz @ 1.245V , in your sig stable?
> thats a very nice vcore at that speed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, ftw420, was it you that said somewhere liquid pro isnt good with zub zero temps?
> omg, my brain is blurry today ...better dont answer to many questions ...lol
> Gratz megawatz..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that sounded good..lol
> 
> kk, 1 question i have on my mind since yesterday,
> i remember when i started ocing, and first times i used offset, i had a negative offset,
> its a + offset now, but i cant remember how i got it, i was thinking this morning,
> maybe it was because i used less vdroop?
> not that its a bad thing to have a negative offset, but at idle you could run into instability right?,
> negative lowers your idle voltage also ...but im not sure anymore..lol
> blurry brains today srry...


It was me, I was using liquid ultra on the die, I imagine pro would be similar.


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> very nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well, now that max temps is out of the way,
> you can look at the max speed/vcore it does..lol
> this is how ivy should have run in the first place, right Intel!, yea, you heard me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i needed about 1.3V vcore for 4.7ghz, curious what you can run it max..


Indeed, no more temp barrier to be concerned of.








1.3V for 4.7GHz isn't bad at all. Now I'm stressing the chip at 4.9GHz @ 1.41V. We'll see how it goes.

One WHEA error just came up though









The second one made me increase the voltage up a notch.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> is the, i7-3770K 4.6GHz @ 1.245V , in your sig stable?
> thats a very nice vcore at that speed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, ftw420, was it you that said somewhere liquid pro isnt good with zub zero temps?
> omg, my brain is blurry today ...better dont answer to many questions ...lol
> Gratz megawatz..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that sounded good..lol
> 
> kk, 1 question i have on my mind since yesterday,
> i remember when i started ocing, and first times i used offset, i had a negative offset,
> its a + offset now, but i cant remember how i got it, i was thinking this morning,
> maybe it was because i used less vdroop?
> not that its a bad thing to have a negative offset, but at idle you could run into instability right?,
> negative lowers your idle voltage also ...but im not sure anymore..lol
> blurry brains today srry...


lol yes though lower vcore with negative offset from idle can happen. which can make those stability issues.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It was me, I was using liquid ultra on the die, I imagine pro would be similar.


thanks, glad i remembered it, i just responded to a new delidder,
but he wants to run ice? he better not use pro/ultra then right








i need a rememberallball! ..lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> Indeed, no more temp barrier to be concerned of.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.3V for 4.7GHz isn't bad at all. Now I'm stressing the chip at 4.9GHz @ 1.41V. We'll see how it goes.
> 
> One WHEA error just came up though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The second one made me increase the voltage up a notch.


you still have some vcore room to play with, upto 1.45V should be no problem









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol yes though lower vcore with negative offset from idle can happen. which can make those stability issues.


cant remember how i turned my negative to a positive offset tho,
was it by using less vdroop?
when i started ocing, i had like a -0.040V offset, but that was at 4.4-4.5ghz..
i just dont understand what i did to turn it into a positive offset.. ( wheres that, :scratcheshead: smily) ..lol


----------



## Joa3d43

...was looking at this pic again







...which raises the question whether folks have tried to *delid 'GPUs'* (pic is for dual oc'ed watercooled Xeons running 4x 7990 dual GPU cards (







) , but would also apply to our machines with single / dual GPUs). Has any of you delidded a GPU, say a Nvidia ?



picture source link: http://devgurus.amd.com/thread/159833


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...was looking at this pic again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...which raises the question whether folks have tried to *delid 'GPUs'* (pic is for dual oc'ed watercooled Xeons running 4x 7990 dual GPU cards (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) , but would also apply to our machines with single / dual GPUs). Has any of you delidded a GPU, say a Nvidia ?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> picture source link: http://devgurus.amd.com/thread/159833


euhm, delid a gpu, you can take it apart anytime i think,
i did 3 vid cards i had ,4770, 5770 and a 6850, and changed tim to liquid pro , saw about 10C tempdrop on all of them








all i need to do now is my 7970, but the windforce 3 cooler keeps it under 55C all the time, doesnt matter what i do with it..


----------



## FtW 420

Haven't done it myself, but know of people who delidded 580s. The new cards now come bare die, wonder how hot they would run with lids...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...was looking at this pic again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...which raises the question whether folks have tried to *delid 'GPUs'* (pic is for dual oc'ed watercooled Xeons running 4x 7990 dual GPU cards (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) , but would also apply to our machines with single / dual GPUs). Has any of you delidded a GPU, say a Nvidia ?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> picture source link: http://devgurus.amd.com/thread/159833


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> euhm, delid a gpu, you can take it apart anytime i think,
> i did 3 vid cards i had ,4770, 5770 and a 6850, and changed tim to liquid pro , saw about 10C tempdrop on all of them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all i need to do now is my 7970, but the windforce 3 cooler keeps it under 55C all the time, doesnt matter what i do with it..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Haven't done it myself, but know of people who delidded 580s. The new cards now come bare die, wonder how hot they would run with lids...


are Nvidea cards glued then with adhesive like ivy's ? didnt know that..
should i be worried about my 7970, when i want to change the tim on it?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote...euhm, delid a gpu, you can take it apart anytime i think,
> i did 3 vid cards i had ,4770, 5770 and a 6850, and changed tim to liquid pro , saw about 10C tempdrop on all of them smile.gif
> all i need to do now is my 7970, but the windforce 3 cooler keeps it under 55C all the time, doesnt matter what i do with it..


...I'm in a similar boat; my SLI GTX 670ies Direct CU ii cooling combined with an auxiliary Noctua 120mm blowing directly between them keeps them down to the high 50's low 60's even after multiple 3d mark 11 / Vantage runs, Heaven etc ...that said, switching to a full custom water-loop that includes the GPUs might be the time to delid them as well...anything I have to watch out for re GTX 670ies to delid ?

BTW, can you imagine having to delid the machine depicted above ? 2 CPUs and 8 GPUs all in one setting - probably run out of your favourite TIM pretty quickly and get turned off delidding for a long time (overload)


----------



## Joa3d43

...just saw *FtW 420* post...
Quote:


> The new cards now come bare die, wonder how hot they would run with lids...


...does that include 670ies







? Sounds like it


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'm in a similar boat; my SLI GTX 670ies Direct CU ii cooling combined with an auxiliary Noctua 120mm blowing directly between them keeps them down to the high 50's low 60's even after multiple 3d mark 11 / Vantage runs, Heaven etc ...that said, switching to a full custom water-loop that includes the GPUs might be the time to delid them as well...anything I have to watch out for re GTX 670ies to delid ?
> 
> BTW, can you imagine having to delid the machine depicted above ? 2 CPUs and 8 GPUs all in one setting - probably run out of your favourite TIM pretty quickly and get turned off delidding for a long time (overload)


lol yea, but i did alot with my 1gr liquid pro tho,
3 gpu's, 3 cpu's, one cpu twice, and i still have some left in the seringe for another, maybe 2 times apply..

you prolly get tired before you done them all..









looks to me you can take the coolers of easy on his build,

not delidding them like ivy is glued i mean..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote...looks to me you can take the coolers of easy on his build


yup- and think of all the copper left over, probably can be resold for a profit and you can restock on liquid-pro ultra and then some


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> are Nvidea cards glued then with adhesive like ivy's ? didnt know that..
> should i be worried about my 7970, when i want to change the tim on it?


Not sure if 580 IHS is glued or not, but it doesn't come off easily, I wasn't really trying though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...just saw *FtW 420* post...
> ...does that include 670ies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? Sounds like it


I'm pretty sure it does, if the 680s & 7970s come bare die it is likely the rest do.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...was looking at this pic again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...which raises the question whether folks have tried to *delid 'GPUs'* (pic is for dual oc'ed watercooled Xeons running 4x 7990 dual GPU cards (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) , but would also apply to our machines with single / dual GPUs). Has any of you delidded a GPU, say a Nvidia ?
> 
> 
> 
> picture source link: http://devgurus.amd.com/thread/159833


Yes! De-lidding GPU's has been done before, if you've ever pulled apart any recent AMD GPU you'll see that it's the bare core to the cooler, much like the people who de-lid and direct mount the waterblock.
I re-pasted a friends GTX 570 the other day to see an IHS.. I did remember that I read a thread about some guy de-lidding a GTX 460 and to a huge success it dropped his temperatures 10c+, he did have to mod the cooler though and it's a really risky job because of all the components around the core.

EDIT: Here is the guys thread over at AnanTech.. Not sure if this breaks any rules, but it is indeed a good read/mod! link,

EDIT: WOW at that picture, I almost forgot about it... Wow
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not all of them though, 2nd i7 920 was a great one, had to go through 4 or 5 2600k before getting one with a working 59x multi.
> I did get a great 955be for my first ever AMD chip, still in the #1 spot here for k10 http://valid.canardpc.com/records.php
> It was me, I was using liquid ultra on the die, I imagine pro would be similar.


Wow! Very nice overclock on that K10!









Must be your lucky store! Do you just return the "not so good" chips when you've tested them.. or do you sell them at a small loss? I plan to do that one day, join the silicon lottery!


----------



## King4x4

Congrats Hookies on the new case!!

Looks like my Danger Den Double Wide... except.. more wider LOL!

Damn... 3x480 rads or 4x370 rads... thats a lot of rads in a case LOL!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Congrats Hookies on the new case!!
> 
> Looks like my Danger Den Double Wide... except.. more wider LOL!
> 
> Damn... 3x480 rads or 4x370 rads... thats a lot of rads in a case LOL!


As is i can mount 5 360 rads of any thickness and 3 480 rads of any thick ness

I could also mod the bottom to alloe for 2 more 360 rads making the total 7 360 rads and 3 480 rads XD

Got this case for 230$ shipped









That is why it pays to lurk on 5 forums at once









Valguar below


----------



## Totally Dubbed

FYI:
Here's my temps with IBT on my antec 920:
http://www.overclock.net/t/990111/antec-k-hler-h2o-620-920-club/3090#post_19070466

(offset of +0.045) and manual v1.265 @4.5ghz

I'm going to change the thermal paste of the cooler, see if I get a difference.
If I don't get much of an improvement...well de-lidding it is.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Matt-Matt* wrote...EDIT: WOW at that picture, I almost forgot about it... Wow


...yeah, I put it up again because every time I look at it, I figure this thing could be cooled just with the drool people drip all over it. Mind you, this is for OpenGL, and on top of that likely will never see Cross-Fire - just all those cuda cores will be busy doing compiling and rendering.

A friend and neighbor of mine is heading a development company that works on 4k video streaming in real time, and they build similar things (mind you, they use 7970ies). I have seen them put together 20 machines or so with Asus ROG Crosshair boards, stuffed to the gills with those cards - but none of them with Cross-Fire - all work, no play







(actually, there is one special machine based around X79 / LG2011 which has a bit more fun, but only sometimes).

Another point about the picture above is the '*industrial beauty*'...the solid elbow joints (look like brass?), the perfectly cut thick hoses (extra large for the CPUs), the diamond-edged thumb screws...no bling bling, just sheer, unadulterated horsepower...sort of like the SR 71 Black bird of cuda cores


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> FYI:
> Here's my temps with IBT on my antec 920:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/990111/antec-k-hler-h2o-620-920-club/3090#post_19070466
> 
> (offset of +0.045) and manual v1.265 @4.5ghz
> 
> I'm going to change the thermal paste of the cooler, see if I get a difference.
> If I don't get much of an improvement...well de-lidding it is.


"well de-lidding it is"







lol, what tim is under there now TD ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yeah, I put it up again because every time I look at it,
> *I figure this thing could be cooled just with the drool people drip all over it*. Mind you, this is for OpenGL, and on top of that likely will never see Cross-Fire - just all those cuda cores will be busy doing compiling and rendering.


haha, i had to laugh so hard, think the neighbours heard me ....LOL


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> "well de-lidding it is"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol, what tim is under there now TD ?


stock antec one man.
The one that comes with it here's pics:

http://cdn.overclock.net/2/28/28337d1d_54.jpeg
http://cdn.overclock.net/9/98/500x1000px-LL-98b94e3d_59.jpeg
http://cdn.overclock.net/e/ef/500x1000px-LL-ef6291f1_60.jpeg
http://cdn.overclock.net/3/3e/500x1000px-LL-3ef40779_76.jpeg

In other news, I'm going to redo my cable management...this isn't going to be a short thing lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> stock antec one man.
> The one that comes with it here's pics:
> 
> http://cdn.overclock.net/2/28/28337d1d_54.jpeg
> http://cdn.overclock.net/9/98/500x1000px-LL-98b94e3d_59.jpeg
> http://cdn.overclock.net/e/ef/500x1000px-LL-ef6291f1_60.jpeg
> http://cdn.overclock.net/3/3e/500x1000px-LL-3ef40779_76.jpeg
> 
> In other news, I'm going to redo my cable management...this isn't going to be a short thing lol.


i can tell you right now, wont be much difference,
that stock tim isnt that bad anyways, w/mk wise i mean,
if you see tempdrops, it prolly because you applied it better this time, something like that ...so..

"well de-lidding it is" lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can tell you right now, wont be much difference,
> that stock tim isnt that bad anyways, w/mk wise i mean,
> if you see tempdrops, it prolly because you applied it better this time, something like that ...so..
> 
> "well de-lidding it is" lol


haha







!
Yeah well the application of the Antec wasn't an easy one...

thing which gets me is others have reported much lower temps at higher volts - be it with the antec or air coolers.
So, something isn't quite right there. I think after the proper application I might see a consistency of 85-88c and nothing higher


----------



## VonDutch

omg, a gf is visiting in 15 min, how do i look guys, my hair ok like this?


BBL, i hope later later ...hehe...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> Yeah well the application of the Antec wasn't an easy one...
> 
> thing which gets me is others have reported much lower temps at higher volts - be it with the antec or air coolers.
> So, something isn't quite right there. I think after the proper application I might see a consistency of 85-88c and nothing higher


well, cant hurt to try right ..gl


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamonymo*
> 
> can some one help me i was wondering why some peoples i7-3770k auto overclock settings lets say 4.5 there volts are around mine at stock ,
> even when i ofset -60mvl its still not lower anouth on my board
> 
> my stock volts under load with -60mlv is 1.216 this seems to high also unless i use fixed voltage i cant change it t unless i use ofset mode even further , but anythink lower than -60mlv in ofset changes the voltage colour changes to red in the bios to make out its dangerous, is this even dangerous i dont think it realy is as its lowering the vcore but i needed some expert advice
> 
> my motherboard asus P8Z77-V seems to set a higher stock voltage than other boards will a bios update maby fix this or am i wrong
> 
> does any one understand my ramble please help
> 
> also even no i use the bios to change voltage asus turbo evo vcore slider sais 1.15 and the senser reads 1.214


I'd help you if you ditch the chelsea avatar








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Guys....
> 
> It's not doing so well....
> It's doing AWESOME! It boots, recognized in BIOS, Windows boots up fine, running 1.31v at 4.5Ghz. Now, for the stress tests!


Son of a....you had me going there. Good work!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...was looking at this pic again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...which raises the question whether folks have tried to *delid 'GPUs'* (pic is for dual oc'ed watercooled Xeons running 4x 7990 dual GPU cards (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) , but would also apply to our machines with single / dual GPUs). Has any of you delidded a GPU, say a Nvidia ?
> 
> 
> 
> picture source link: http://devgurus.amd.com/thread/159833


Newer GPUs are direct die anyway.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> Yeah well the application of the Antec wasn't an easy one...
> 
> thing which gets me is others have reported much lower temps at higher volts - be it with the antec or air coolers.
> So, something isn't quite right there. I think after the proper application I might see a consistency of 85-88c and nothing higher


RVP would be disappointed.

It's rumored that RVP doesn't need to use TIM because his components respect him too much to get hot.

Get some cool labs, cut the lid off, watch the temps drop 20C+


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> omg, a gf is visiting in 15 min, how do i look guys, my hair ok like this?
> 
> 
> BBL, i hope later later ...hehe...
> well, cant hurt to try right ..gl


hahaha "a gf" - so now I've met two players at OCUK -> both being de-lidders....
Wait a minute....does that mean if I de-lid women come running?

STRIP THAT IHS! haha
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's rumored that RVP doesn't need to use TIM because his components respect him too much to get hot.
> Get some cool labs, cut the lid off, watch the temps drop 20C+


Sir alex is playing on the defensive.


----------



## $ilent

Could I join this illustrious club? I dont have any pics (stupidly forgot to take one) and I cant show pre delid temps though.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hahaha "a gf" - so now I've met two players at OCUK -> both being de-lidders....
> Wait a minute....does that mean if I de-lid women come running?
> 
> STRIP THAT IHS! haha
> Sir alex is playing on the defensive.


peeps who delid, take risks, women love that kind of men ...LOL
o, had a lovely cup of tea this afternoon with her, she really liked the toppings on the cake


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Could I join this illustrious club? I dont have any pics (stupidly forgot to take one) and I cant show pre delid temps though.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


illustrious .. i like the sound of that ..lol
yea, i think you can join,
we do have a "official" format required to join tho, try use it as good as you can pls









Now for the requirements to join the club are as follows. Post a picture of you delidded chip and write your OCN name on a piece or something of the like. For those already running delidded chips and don't feel like taking them out and re-installing I understand so take a picture that you most likely took when you delidded it and use what every program you'd like to put your name somewhere on the picture.

For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!


----------



## $ilent

I bought this chip delidded though so I can't compare temps







so can I just do screenshot of the chip in windows with notepad?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> I bought this chip delidded though so I can't compare temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so can I just do screenshot of the chip in windows with notepad?


yea, just follow the format as good as you can, when our captain is back, he will decide








guess your one of the exceptions to the rules, because you bought a delidded chip








youre the first that i heard of buying a delidded chip..lol


----------



## $ilent

I'd prob rather buy a delidded CPU than delid one myself, knowing my luck I'd end up breaking it lol


----------



## jassilamba

Guys question for you regarding the setup on my Monster Rig in my sig.

I picked up a 3770K last week for $205 at micro center. I was able to take it to 5 GHZ (Validation) @ 1.5V, going to bring it down to to 1.4 to see where I can find a sweet spot. Anyways I'm going to delid the chip prolly this weekend or when the liquid pro comes in the mail. My temps are getting up to 90 (under water and under load), does that sound right for an ivy bridge or is that too hot (thinking if I should return it saying it runs too hot, ppl have done that and able to get a better chip).

If those temps sound okay, then I will go ahead an delid the CPU.

My ambient temps are around 22.78C

and here is how things look at idle:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Thanks guys and I apologize if other have already asked this.


----------



## $ilent

I think mostly over 1.3v results in high temps on ivy bridge so a delid would work well here.

From what I've read anyways.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jassilamba*
> 
> Guys question for you regarding the setup on my Monster Rig in my sig.
> 
> I picked up a 3770K last week for $205 at micro center. I was able to take it to 5 GHZ (Validation) @ 1.5V, going to bring it down to to 1.4 to see where I can find a sweet spot. Anyways I'm going to delid the chip prolly this weekend or when the liquid pro comes in the mail. My temps are getting up to 90 (under water and under load), does that sound right for an ivy bridge or is that too hot (thinking if I should return it saying it runs too hot, ppl have done that and able to get a better chip).
> 
> If those temps sound okay, then I will go ahead an delid the CPU.
> 
> My ambient temps are around 22.78C
> 
> and here is how things look at idle:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks guys and I apologize if other have already asked this.


thats a nice price for a 3770K, where i live , i almost pay double that, for the cheapset 3770K..dang









is that 90C at 4.5ghz under load with prime?
no need to return if youre planning to delid, your temps will drop alot after delid anyways,
only reason i can think of, if its a very bad ocer,
you could try test it first at 4.5ghz, run stability tests,
find your stable vcore for it, and compare that with others here









idle temps dont really count, load temps are more important


----------



## jassilamba

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats a nice price for a 3770K, where i live , i almost pay double that, for the cheapset 3770K..dang
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that 90C at 4.5ghz under load with prime?
> no need to return if youre planning to delid, your temps will drop alot after delid anyways,
> only reason i can think of, if its a very bad ocer,
> you could try test it first at 4.5ghz, run stability tests,
> find your stable vcore for it, and compare that with others here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> idle temps dont really count, load temps are more important


its 90C at 5.0 GHZ under full load with prime.I think its a decent ocer and was very easy to take it to 5.0 ghz (technically that was my first and only try). I had it running at 4.6 GHZ for about 8 hours on prime and the top was around 70 C.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jassilamba*
> 
> its 90C at 5.0 GHZ under full load with prime.I think its a decent ocer and was very easy to take it to 5.0 ghz (technically that was my first and only try). I had it running at 4.6 GHZ for about 8 hours on prime and the top was around 70 C.


nice







..just checking to make sure, the more info, the better the answers ..lol
looks like a chip to delid, and have high oc's with low temps, but i must say, you already have nice temps now..
not many ivy's can run prime at 5.0ghz, and only hit 90C, not delidded i mean of course ..lol
imagine running 5.0ghz, but with 60-70C temps


----------



## jassilamba

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..just checking to make sure, the more info, the better the answers ..lol
> looks like a chip to delid, and have high oc's with low temps, but i must say, you already have nice temps now..


Thanks mate, I say ever since I added a monsta rad in my loop, I would say that I have seen improvements in the load temps for both the GPU and CPU. I will delid and report back.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jassilamba*
> 
> Thanks mate, I say ever since I added a monsta rad in my loop, I would say that I have seen improvements in the load temps for both the GPU and CPU. I will delid and report back.


yw, yea, already checked your sig...very nice rig you have








take before and after screenies, and a nice one of the delidded chip if possible









not sure if you already checked our page 1,
theres alot of helpfull info there, just open the spoilers and read some,
you sound confident, thats good, but if you have a old pentium or something,
you could first practice on that, before the real attempt


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..just checking to make sure, the more info, the better the answers ..lol
> looks like a chip to delid, and have high oc's with low temps, but i must say, you already have nice temps now..
> not many ivy's can run prime at 5.0ghz, and only hit 90C, not delidded i mean of course ..lol
> imagine running 5.0ghz, but with 60-70C temps


like this lol im trying for 5ghz again started messin with the cpu PLL see if that will help get it stable


----------



## jassilamba

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yw, yea, already checked your sig...very nice rig you have
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> take before and after screenies, and a nice one of the delidded chip if possible
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not sure if you already checked our page 1,
> theres alot of helpfull info there, just open the spoilers and read some,
> you sound confident, thats good, but if you have a old pentium or something,
> you could first practice on that, before the real attempt


I already read that, the OP actually helped me go after the 3770K and the price I could not say no. Not sure if anyone else could have said no at the price. I can go to micro center, and get some old pentium chips they have em for around 5 bucks a pop.

Thanks again mate.


----------



## $ilent

They sell pentium CPUs for five dollars?


----------



## jassilamba

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> They sell pentium CPUs for five dollars?


The HT one yes unless i'm looking at the wrong one -


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Their CPU pricing is totally insane. www.microcenter.com and if you buy a CPU and a mobo together you get a 40 buck combo discount.


----------



## VonDutch

i bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro(13.34 U.S. dollars) on a forum here in Holland,
had big fun learning my kids(14 and 15 years old) how to delid


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> like this lol im trying for 5ghz again started messin with the cpu PLL see if that will help get it stable
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


nice example for jassilamba..lol
one thing, you gonna up pll or lower it?
someone said to me a while ago, for higher oc's, set it to 1.8V again, not lower it..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice example for jassilamba..lol
> one thing, you gonna up pll or lower it?
> someone said to me a while ago, for higher oc's, set it to 1.8V again, not lower it..


i raised it cause munually its at 1.832v i put it to 1.88v


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i raised it cause munually its at 1.832v i put it to 1.88v


oki, you prolly know this, but stay under 1.9V


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> oki, you prolly know this, but stay under 1.9V


yea 1.88 is as high as ill go and if this dont work im definetly getting a new mobo.
up5 or the asrock oc formula or msi power edition?
im not sure i need help


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> like this lol im trying for 5ghz again started messin with the cpu PLL see if that will help get it stable


1.376vcore still very low for 5ghz, thats an awsome chip you have there


----------



## lilchronic

just saw this thread
http://www.overclock.net/t/1156145/official-guide-modifying-removing-nvidia-gpu-heat-spreader-ihs#post_15514456


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I like that windows theme. anything special?


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...just saw *FtW 420* post...
> ...does that include 670ies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? Sounds like it


I just put a waterblock on my 670. It is a bare die. Which makes me think. Should I have used some my CL Ultra instead of mx-4?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I just put a waterblock on my 670. It is a bare die. Which makes me think. Should I have used some my CL Ultra instead of mx-4?


It would be better i did with mine also bare die


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> It would be better i did with mine also bare die


Alright I will wait until add a new card and add to my loop.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

To practice, shall I get this?

Is that a good practice one







?


----------



## jassilamba

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I like that windows theme. anything special?


Thats the Asus ROG theme on win 8. just google it if you want it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> To practice, shall I get this?
> 
> Is that a good practice one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


yea, should be ok, for 2.30 euro.. no problem right


----------



## VonDutch

i like my background










reminds me of ..me when i was little and reading books, i traveled everywhere in my mind, saw what i read ..lol imagination is a great thing..pity we loose it when we grow up, well most of us anyways









wow, talk about OT ...sorry haha, but it looks like the guy with the ax is gonna delid something


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, should be ok, for 2.30 euro.. no problem right


bought









Yeah no problem at all!
Btw, nice wallpaper - however, thing I don't like is that it is TOO dark - I light my eyes not to be stressed out when I'm looking at my pc

Here's mine - pick was taken in Yosemite National Park near San fran USA


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> bought
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah no problem at all!
> Btw, nice wallpaper - however, thing I don't like is that it is TOO dark - I light my eyes not to be stressed out when I'm looking at my pc
> 
> Here's mine - pick was taken in Yosemite National Park near San fran USA
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


thanks, and nice wallpaper too








how long does it take for the cpu to arrive at your place?


----------



## megawatz

Does anybody know or understand why that once you delid your processor that your vCore changed? I can't get stable at 1.33v anymore. I was stable at 1.33v for about 15hrs, and now I can't get past two hours. I'm concerned about this.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote...forum here in Holland,
> had big fun learning my kids(14 and 15 years old) how to delid


....good grief, now there will be a *whole nes*t of them


----------



## [CyGnus]

that is weird you should have the same vcore for the same OC the difference is about 25c cooler nothing else.... but give it a little bump and see if it is ok after all you delidded so temps should not be an issue


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> that is weird you should have the same vcore for the same OC the difference is about 25c cooler nothing else....


My cooling isn't even that great. About 5c


----------



## Knight26

Ok, I delidded my 3770K last weekend and I have been pretty disappointed in the results. The best stable overclock that I could get before delidding was 4.4ghz @ 1.295v. I was hitting upper 80's on the hottest core while the others stayed in the mid-70's using an Antec Kuhler 620 with push/pull fans. One core almost never reaches 70C. I didn't want to push anymore than that cause I didn't like the temps and I couldn't get 4.5ghz stable at the same voltage.



So I upgraded to a custom loop with 2 EK radiators, a cool stream XT 240 in the front and XT 120 in the back. I expected a decent drop in the temps with the upgrade, however I got the same temps with the same overclock, so I decided that delidding was the next step. I order in some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and popped the top off. Unfortunately, I didn't get the results that I was hoping for. My hottest core is still in the 80's and the temps range by 12C between my coolest and hottest core. At this point, I believe I was just unlucky with the silicon I got. I don't know what else I could done without a more extreme type of cooling.

I don't have any screenshots of my temps at the moment. I working on the road and I'm away from my gaming rig.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thanks, and nice wallpaper too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how long does it take for the cpu to arrive at your place?


Next week or so, as it is the slow delivery option.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> My cooling isn't even that great. About 5c


By cooling you mean you haven't noticed a difference since you did the change?
Might be due to the paste you have underneath?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Knight26*
> 
> Ok, I delidded my 3770K last weekend and I have been pretty disappointed in the results. The best stable overclock that I could get before delidding was 4.4ghz @ 1.295v. I was hSo I upgraded to a custom loop with 2 EK radiators, a cool stream XT 240 in the front and XT 120 in the back. I expected a decent drop in the temps with the upgrade, however I got the same temps with the same overclock, so I decided that delidding was the next step. I order in some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and popped the top off. Unfortunately, I didn't get the results that I was hoping for. My hottest core is still in the 80's and the temps range by 12C between my coolest and hottest core. At this point, I believe I was just unlucky with the silicon I got. I don't know what else I could done without a more extreme type of cooling.
> 
> I don't have any screenshots of my temps at the moment. I working on the road and I'm away from my gaming rig.
> ]


beepin' nice man!
Cheers for sharing!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Knight26*
> 
> Ok, I delidded my 3770K last weekend and I have been pretty disappointed in the results. The best stable overclock that I could get before delidding was 4.4ghz @ 1.295v. I was hitting upper 80's on the hottest core while the others stayed in the mid-70's using an Antec Kuhler 620 with push/pull fans. One core almost never reaches 70C. I didn't want to push anymore than that cause I didn't like the temps and I couldn't get 4.5ghz stable at the same voltage.
> 
> 
> 
> So I upgraded to a custom loop with 2 EK radiators, a cool stream XT 240 in the front and XT 120 in the back. I expected a decent drop in the temps with the upgrade, however I got the same temps with the same overclock, so I decided that delidding was the next step. I order in some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and popped the top off. Unfortunately, I didn't get the results that I was hoping for. My hottest core is still in the 80's and the temps range by 12C between my coolest and hottest core. At this point, I believe I was just unlucky with the silicon I got. I don't know what else I could done without a more extreme type of cooling.
> 
> I don't have any screenshots of my temps at the moment. I working on the road and I'm away from my gaming rig.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


i can tell you right now, theres something else wrong,
nothing to do with unlucky really








keep us posted, well figure it out, im sure,
nice pics btw, thanks, and gratz on the successful delid!









first thoughts, because the tempdifference between cores didnt change much too, concave ihs or block...
after delid, if everything is good, you should also see a drop in temp difference between cores,
mine before delid, about 15C diff, after delid 4-6C


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Knight26*
> 
> Ok, I delidded my 3770K last weekend and I have been pretty disappointed in the results. The best stable overclock that I could get before delidding was 4.4ghz @ 1.295v. I was hitting upper 80's on the hottest core while the others stayed in the mid-70's using an Antec Kuhler 620 with push/pull fans. One core almost never reaches 70C. I didn't want to push anymore than that cause I didn't like the temps and I couldn't get 4.5ghz stable at the same voltage.
> 
> 
> 
> So I upgraded to a custom loop with 2 EK radiators, a cool stream XT 240 in the front and XT 120 in the back. I expected a decent drop in the temps with the upgrade, however I got the same temps with the same overclock, so I decided that delidding was the next step. I order in some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and popped the top off. Unfortunately, I didn't get the results that I was hoping for. My hottest core is still in the 80's and the temps range by 12C between my coolest and hottest core. At this point, I believe I was just unlucky with the silicon I got. I don't know what else I could done without a more extreme type of cooling.
> 
> I don't have any screenshots of my temps at the moment. I working on the road and I'm away from my gaming rig.


have you put LP on the under side of the IHS also??
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can tell you right now, theres something else wrong,
> nothing to do with unlucky really
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> keep us posted, well figure it out, im sure,
> nice pics btw, thanks, and gratz on the successful delid!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> first thoughts, because the tempdifference between cores didnt change much too, concave ihs or block...
> after delid, if everything is good, you should also see a drop in temp difference between cores,
> mine before delid, about 15C diff, after delid 4-6C


Correct.. The ihs could be concave.. have you checked?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> My cooling isn't even that great. About 5c


All i can is that your HSF is not that good for ivy... You need something better even after delidded.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Even though he has the 212 evo with CLP on die and IHS the temps have to drop around 15/20 at least, i think he used AS5 on die so its normal the temps only got a 5ºc difference and that was possible *only* because you removed the glue of the IHS so the gap is smaller.
You need CLP on the die that is the main point of delidding


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> All i can is that your HSF is not that good for ivy... You need something better even after delidded.


idk about that one, my "simple" aircooler is more then enough now..
running IBT at 5.0ghz, 84C hottest core
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Even though he has the 212 evo with CLP on die and IHS the temps have to drop around 15/20 at least, i think he used AS5 on die so its normal the temps only got a 5ºc difference and that was possible *only* because you removed the glue of the IHS so the gap is smaller.
> You need CLP on the die that is the main point of delidding


yeppers









o, AS5 gave me about 10-12C tempdrop, when i used it on die , ihs,
but within 2 weeks i already saw my temps go up a bit again, pump out effect i think it was,
it looks alot like the tim intel used too..

the tim intel used isnt that bad, its the gap thats the biggest reason for it running so hot,
the intel tim has more pump out too, just look at pics of just delidded ivy's, there more tim around the die if you look at the inside ihs,
then on it ...lol

some notes,

Basic concept

"Large and fast decreases in temperature when coupled with HLT instructions.
A usage pattern that alternates between full idle and full load conditions
will cause die temps to swing WIDE AND FAST, particularly with overclocked/overvolted CPUs.

This thermal cycling causes TIM pump-out, wherein the TIM gets ejected and displaced by air,
which is of course not a good thing.

Greases also creep, again worsening the situation."

I think this happens more often with IB because of how quick it heats up and cools off.
The die contact area is so small with such drastic temperatures is another reason.

thats one other reason why you should use liquid pro/ultra on the die,
the pump out effect is less, because of the way its made, well, i think anyways ..lol


----------



## Belial

I have a question - anyone ever hear of "Wondershare"? It's for video editing?

I need to make my dad a video editing computer. I don't do video editing, and I'm not exactly sure what is needed in a video editing build. More RAM, that's it right? How much ram? Does a video editing computer use a GPU?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well get a 3770K and delidde it add 2x8GB samsung green and OC it to 2400 cl10/11, sure it uses a GPU but you dont need nothing extreme maybe the HD4000 is enough.


----------



## lilchronic

when i delidded my chip i put mx-4 and only dropped 10c. clp is the way to go. i didnt consider my chip delided till i put coolabs pro on die and dropped almost 30c


----------



## [CyGnus]

Knight26 Are those cougar vortex on your 620? How do they perform?


----------



## DiamondCut

Have any of you started to look into the major differences in IHS and no IHS? I am considering on doing this but I only see two people who have attempted this. Any additional thoughts or concerns of having no IHS?


----------



## [CyGnus]

well you have zero difference in temps and gain the ability of crushing the Die with the cooler's pressure


----------



## Knight26

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can tell you right now, theres something else wrong,
> nothing to do with unlucky really
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> keep us posted, well figure it out, im sure,
> nice pics btw, thanks, and gratz on the successful delid!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> first thoughts, because the tempdifference between cores didnt change much too, concave ihs or block...
> after delid, if everything is good, you should also see a drop in temp difference between cores,
> mine before delid, about 15C diff, after delid 4-6C


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> have you put LP on the under side of the IHS also??
> Correct.. The ihs could be concave.. have you checked?


I don't think I coated the underside of the IHS with LP. I could go back and reapply it. I don't recall seeing any gaps between the IHS and the edge of my razor blade as I was scraping the old glue and TIM off but I will double check it when I reapply the LP. Thanks for the tips guys.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> well you have zero difference in temps and gain the ability of crushing the Die with the cooler's pressure


LOL ..you







em CyGnus ...haha


----------



## [CyGnus]

LOL well i learned a lot in this thread now i am just doing


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have a question - anyone ever hear of "Wondershare"? It's for video editing?
> 
> I need to make my dad a video editing computer. I don't do video editing, and I'm not exactly sure what is needed in a video editing build. More RAM, that's it right? How much ram? Does a video editing computer use a GPU?


You don't necessarily need a GPU unless you're using After Effects (Amination or Special Effects), at least 8GB of RAM, and get an i7 if you can. Video editing is about about encoding and processing.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Let me put this short and sweet, I'll update again.
If I didn't open my antec to change the paste, in around 2 months I would be running on metal on metal.

Current temps are already 10c cooler. On idle and on ibt.
Results to follow soon....

Antec are going to fear my wrath.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Totally Dubbed did you delide it already? Or just swap TIM's?


----------



## Solonowarion

How much cooling difference is there between Pro and Ultra?


----------



## megawatz

Should I try and do the thermal paste again? I really don't care about getting CLP. If someone else with a 3570K using AS5 and gets temp drops using the same aspects they did, then why can't I?

What gives? I feel like this is a HUGE failure instead of a gain of delidding. I'm not seeing any effects of this yet.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well little bit off topic but did you guys know that 13.1 are out?





































http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=373737


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> How much cooling difference is there between Pro and Ultra?


Well pretty close to zero


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Totally Dubbed did you delide it already? Or just swap TIM's?


Only tim on ihs.
I posted here, simply because I was posting with dutch


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Should I try and do the thermal paste again? I really don't care about getting CLP. If someone else with a 3570K using AS5 and gets temp drops using the same aspects they did, then why can't I?
> 
> What gives? I feel like this is a HUGE failure instead of a gain of delidding. I'm not seeing any effects of this yet.


if you dont care about getting liquid pro/ultra, you have to live with the minor temp drops you have now,
yea, re apply AS5, maybe it will do better this time,
but read back on the last page, my post there, i used it too,
and said, it behaves about the same as intels tim,
in a few weeks, or month(s) you temps will go up again(pump out effect)...trust me, i know









another example,

using AS5,


using liquid pro,


25C difference between using AS5 and liquid pro!


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Should I try and do the thermal paste again? I really don't care about getting CLP. If someone else with a 3570K using AS5 and gets temp drops using the same aspects they did, then why can't I?
> 
> What gives? I feel like this is a HUGE failure instead of a gain of delidding. I'm not seeing any effects of this yet.


I am just about to delid but reading through most of this thread I feel confident in saying delidding and using CLP or CLU goes hand in hand. Anything other than Coolabs seems to just be a wishful thought that may get lucky.


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I am just about to delid but reading through most of this thread I feel confident in saying delidding and using CLP or CLU goes hand in hand. Anything other than Coolabs seems to just be a wishful thought that may get lucky.


But why though, Why does CLP make everything magically better? Yes, it's $20, but if I buy it and nothing happens, then I'm just screwed again.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> But why though, Why does CLP make everything magically better? Yes, it's $20, but if I buy it and nothing happens, then I'm just screwed again.


I would think it is due to its composition.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> But why though, Why does CLP make everything magically better? Yes, it's $20, but if I buy it and nothing happens, then I'm just screwed again.


heat transfer,

LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)
LM Ultra = 38w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
everything else is less

the die is small, then it is more important what the w/mk is of any tim used,
_you can use any good tim on the ihs_, but on the die, the liquids rule big time








it will be your best $20 spend really,
your smile wil be like this


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> But why though, Why does CLP make everything magically better? Yes, it's $20, but if I buy it and nothing happens, then I'm just screwed again.


Cl pro is the best Tim to put on the die, its due to fact it has high heat conductivity compared to other Tim.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> But why though, Why does CLP make everything magically better? Yes, it's $20, but if I buy it and nothing happens, then I'm just screwed again.


Look at the member chart first page. All the proof you need. We can't guarantee anything. Just like taking a chance cutting your cpu in half. But you will see better temps if you take the $20 chance.


----------



## Belial

megawatz, thanks for the reply. I think my dad is using some 2gb system or less right now for his work. It' s just family videos he does. Why not go over 8gb of ram? Or does he only need 8? And I think I'll probably go with an i5 3570k and just overclock it for him, im not sure he needs the power of a 3770k. It's not a big deal either way, I'll think about it though.

AS5 is as bad as stock pastes these days, and I'm pretty sure the stock paste used by intel under the IHS is better than AS5. It's over a decade old, it's horribly outdated. People got improvements using AS5 during delidding because reducing the gap by removing the glue is what drops temps, not replacing the paste.

AS5 is just some of the worst paste out there these days. It's so terribly dated. Problem is that it great 13 years ago, so people bought it, recommended it, and a vicious cycle continues because people generally get a single tube and that lasts them a lifetime of builds (or least 15+ years, ie 2-4 builds).

CLP/CLU would be a huge boost over AS5. I can't stress enough of how terrible AS5 is. Check out my review here of thermal pastes:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1346069/belials-heatsink-tim-comparison-and-reviews-hyper-212-h50-nh-d14-pk-1-pk-2-pk-3/0_100

I dont compare AS5, but I compare PK-1 to PK2/PK3. PK-1 is a bit dated too, but it generally is considered 1-5*C better than AS5 - a bit better, not much. In the tests I do, PK-1 gets blown away by a modern paste like PK-3. And with thermal pastes, a 1-2*C difference is considered extremely significant (its just paste after all), so the fact you'd see possibly 10*C difference in PK3 and AS5... i wouldn't be surprised in drops of over 15*C in CLU/CLP vs AS5.

TIM differences are also exagerrated under the IHS. What might be 'only' a 10*C+ difference that CLU/CLP has over AS5, would easily become 20*C+ when under the IHS.

It isn't so much that there's huge differences in pastes or CLU/CLP is so awesome (although it is, it's not a normal paste like PK3, Gelid GC extreme, NH-T1, Masscool, and other modern pastes that are at least 5-10*C better than as5), it's that as5 is junk.

It came out over 13 years ago. Think about how far along GPUs and CPUs have come in 13 years. If you don't want to drop $20 on CLU/CLP, buy an LED or something else you might need at frozencpu and use the 5.1% discount so you get free shipping and 5.1% off ship. You can also find a modern paste on Ebay in 1.5g quantity around $4 shipped, like PK-3, that is significantly better than AS5.

Let me put it this way - the difference between PK-3, and PK-1, a paste that is consistently ranked a couple degrees higher than AS5, is a larger temp drop than I got from going from a Hyper 212+ to Corsair H50 water cooling.


----------



## Belial

On a side note, I don't think w/mk is everything when it comes to thermal transfer to pastes. I'm still not sold CLP is better than CLU until I see a bench comparing the 2. I'll email Coollaboratory and see what they have to say. I mean Ultra is supposed to be Pro version 2.0, I still can't imagine it's a downgrade (wouldn't be the first time that's happened in history though).


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> On a side note, I don't think w/mk is everything when it comes to thermal transfer to pastes. I'm still not sold CLP is better than CLU until I see a bench comparing the 2. I'll email Coollaboratory and see what they have to say. I mean Ultra is supposed to be Pro version 2.0, I still can't imagine it's a downgrade (wouldn't be the first time that's happened in history though).


I've sent 3 emails to Coollaboratory asking them to confirm the heat conductivity values for both Pro and Ultra but they haven't replied. Hopefully you have more luck


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> On a side note, I don't think w/mk is everything when it comes to thermal transfer to pastes. I'm still not sold CLP is better than CLU until I see a bench comparing the 2. I'll email Coollaboratory and see what they have to say. I mean Ultra is supposed to be Pro version 2.0, I still can't imagine it's a downgrade (wouldn't be the first time that's happened in history though).


They made ultra on the note that pro was too hard to remove. The formula for ultra apparently is a little degraded compared to pro. There is such a small difference I just went for ultra to.


----------



## Valgaur

Oh man lots of info to be typed today.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> omg, a gf is visiting in 15 min, how do i look guys, my hair ok like this?
> 
> 
> BBL, i hope later later ...hehe...
> well, cant hurt to try right ..gl


Go get em boy!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hahaha "a gf" - so now I've met two players at OCUK -> both being de-lidders....
> Wait a minute....does that mean if I de-lid women come running?
> 
> STRIP THAT IHS! haha
> Sir alex is playing on the defensive.


Oh God why.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Could I join this illustrious club? I dont have any pics (stupidly forgot to take one) and I cant show pre delid temps though.


Yes you may as long as you fill out the OP required information as much as you can.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jassilamba*
> 
> Guys question for you regarding the setup on my Monster Rig in my sig.
> 
> I picked up a 3770K last week for $205 at micro center. I was able to take it to 5 GHZ (Validation) @ 1.5V, going to bring it down to to 1.4 to see where I can find a sweet spot. Anyways I'm going to delid the chip prolly this weekend or when the liquid pro comes in the mail. My temps are getting up to 90 (under water and under load), does that sound right for an ivy bridge or is that too hot (thinking if I should return it saying it runs too hot, ppl have done that and able to get a better chip).
> 
> If those temps sound okay, then I will go ahead an delid the CPU.
> 
> My ambient temps are around 22.78C
> 
> and here is how things look at idle:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks guys and I apologize if other have already asked this.


No problem on the repeat question. You are right by one thought that yes the temps are far to hot. and yes you should delid and like Von said the ambients don't really matter it's the load temps that we need.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> I think mostly over 1.3v results in high temps on ivy bridge so a delid would work well here.
> 
> From what I've read anyways.


Exactly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i raised it cause munually its at 1.832v i put it to 1.88v


Stay lower if possible move your vcore up instead of PLL. PLL is kinda scary near that 1.9 area.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> oki, you prolly know this, but stay under 1.9V


what Von said as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I just put a waterblock on my 670. It is a bare die. Which makes me think. Should I have used some my CL Ultra instead of mx-4?


Yes CLP is the best TIM out there it works on everything. except certain metals on the Heat sinks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i like my background
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> reminds me of ..me when i was little and reading books, i traveled everywhere in my mind, saw what i read ..lol imagination is a great thing..pity we loose it when we grow up, well most of us anyways
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wow, talk about OT ...sorry haha, but it looks like the guy with the ax is gonna delid something


I love that background! might have to throw that on mine once I get this baby running again!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Does anybody know or understand why that once you delid your processor that your vCore changed? I can't get stable at 1.33v anymore. I was stable at 1.33v for about 15hrs, and now I can't get past two hours. I'm concerned about this.


yes actually. There have been reports by a few people that I know where a slight static shock did it. but also instability can happen at any time. it really can. Stability is based on the current computers standing and background programs so any updates or program changes can completely change this if even slightly. but if the change in vcore is anything under .04-.05 vcore then don't worry it happens sometimes. if it's around .6 area then a slight static shock could have hit the golden pads on the bottom of the CPU. Keep me posted or PM me if you feel more work is needed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Knight26*
> 
> Ok, I delidded my 3770K last weekend and I have been pretty disappointed in the results. The best stable overclock that I could get before delidding was 4.4ghz @ 1.295v. I was hitting upper 80's on the hottest core while the others stayed in the mid-70's using an Antec Kuhler 620 with push/pull fans. One core almost never reaches 70C. I didn't want to push anymore than that cause I didn't like the temps and I couldn't get 4.5ghz stable at the same voltage.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I upgraded to a custom loop with 2 EK radiators, a cool stream XT 240 in the front and XT 120 in the back. I expected a decent drop in the temps with the upgrade, however I got the same temps with the same overclock, so I decided that delidding was the next step. I order in some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and popped the top off. Unfortunately, I didn't get the results that I was hoping for. My hottest core is still in the 80's and the temps range by 12C between my coolest and hottest core. At this point, I believe I was just unlucky with the silicon I got. I don't know what else I could done without a more extreme type of cooling.
> 
> I don't have any screenshots of my temps at the moment. I working on the road and I'm away from my gaming rig.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice setup! and with what everyone has said about the concave convexness of the metals, everyone here should remember this. Whenever you have two pieces of metal together like a WC loop's heatsink and a IHS that the IHs could be CONCAVE and the block could be CONCAVE as well. this will create the worst scenario as I like to call the bubble effect. this means you need more TIM in the space to actually move the heat away from the die. Also the Die might just have a bad crystaline alignment and be bad at moving heat away (very very unlikely)

Phew even more to read I know lol. Okay also with the CLP if your seeing large differences in temps per cores then the application went wrong. I bet you what most likely happened is that when you re installed the CPU back in and latched it down the IHS slid down onto the black number code for Intel on the PCB. This will create a gap in the die and the IHS's contact.

So after all of this I would recommend that after you get a chance to work on your perdy rig again would be to take the block off take the CPU out and check the application of CLP and try to even it out more if possible. then when you re install the chip wiht you hands hold the IHS up farther than normal and then when the latch comes down it will slide it back into it's normal place and seat evenly on all the cores. then check with a flat blade your blocks flatness and if it's concave or convex.

Good luck sir and let us know!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Knight26 Are those cougar vortex on your 620? How do they perform?


I love my Cougars! Wait what......








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Have any of you started to look into the major differences in IHS and no IHS? I am considering on doing this but I only see two people who have attempted this. Any additional thoughts or concerns of having no IHS?


There are some gains by doing no IHS but only if you have the WC loop to do it. doing no die mounting takes a lot of time and effort to get it just right on the pressure of the die and HS to be spread evenly and correctly. It's much easier and more beneficial to the rig and CPU to leave the IHS on for the intended purpose of the IHS which stand for Integrated Heat Spreader = IHS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> well you have zero difference in temps and gain the ability of crushing the Die with the cooler's pressure


This as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> How much cooling difference is there between Pro and Ultra?


Around 3-5C but it all depends on the CPU and the cooler. Honestly if your delidding then just get the CL Pro.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Should I try and do the thermal paste again? I really don't care about getting CLP. If someone else with a 3570K using AS5 and gets temp drops using the same aspects they did, then why can't I?
> 
> What gives? I feel like this is a HUGE failure instead of a gain of delidding. I'm not seeing any effects of this yet.


Okay. I got a challenge for you instead of a recommendation. Take your paste off and try a very thin line method and spread the paste before you put the IHS back on. then re-install and tell us what you see. if not better than try and use a different paste method. Also if you really want the best cooling you must do what the die needs, which is purely the best heat mover out there. AS5 may be a "good" paste but when you compare the WK/m of AS5 vs CL Pro it gets blown away. CLP is ment for small areas where there is high amounts of heat and moves the heat instantly away from the area.

Also some great info for all the people here and yourself. Have any of you realized that all of the thermal paste out there was made for the Sandy Birdge and 2011 sockets? Almost no one has come out with better TIM because of how SB worked with it's FLUXLESS SOLDER that it had under the IHS. So take that info and apply that to why only Cool Labs have made this TIM for Ivy and see these crazy results because it's replacing the TIM Intel used along with the distance of the die and IHS issue and look at these results.

So What we need is for TIM companies to make better WK/m TIM for Ivy Birdge. NOT latter generations.

Just my thought.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> They made ultra on the note that pro was too hard to remove. *The formula for ultra apparently is a little degraded compared to pro*. There is such a small difference I just went for ultra to.


What's your source? There is so much misinformation around Pro and Ultra it's not funny
Quote:


> Originally Posted by Solonowarion View Post
> 
> How much cooling difference is there between Pro and Ultra?
> 
> *Around 3-5C* but it all depends on the CPU and the cooler. Honestly if your delidding then just get the CL Pro.


Where did you get this from?

I wish the Pro I ordered would hurry up and arrive so I can finally compare the two and put an end to all the speculation


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> megawatz, thanks for the reply. I think my dad is using some 2gb system or less right now for his work. It' s just family videos he does. Why not go over 8gb of ram? Or does he only need 8? And I think I'll probably go with an i5 3570k and just overclock it for him, im not sure he needs the power of a 3770k. It's not a big deal either way, I'll think about it though.
> 
> AS5 is as bad as stock pastes these days, and I'm pretty sure the stock paste used by intel under the IHS is better than AS5. It's over a decade old, it's horribly outdated. People got improvements using AS5 during delidding because reducing the gap by removing the glue is what drops temps, not replacing the paste.
> 
> AS5 is just some of the worst paste out there these days. It's so terribly dated. Problem is that it great 13 years ago, so people bought it, recommended it, and a vicious cycle continues because people generally get a single tube and that lasts them a lifetime of builds (or least 15+ years, ie 2-4 builds).
> 
> CLP/CLU would be a huge boost over AS5. I can't stress enough of how terrible AS5 is. Check out my review here of thermal pastes:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346069/belials-heatsink-tim-comparison-and-reviews-hyper-212-h50-nh-d14-pk-1-pk-2-pk-3/0_100
> 
> I dont compare AS5, but I compare PK-1 to PK2/PK3. PK-1 is a bit dated too, but it generally is considered 1-5*C better than AS5 - a bit better, not much. In the tests I do, PK-1 gets blown away by a modern paste like PK-3. And with thermal pastes, a 1-2*C difference is considered extremely significant (its just paste after all), so the fact you'd see possibly 10*C difference in PK3 and AS5... i wouldn't be surprised in drops of over 15*C in CLU/CLP vs AS5.
> 
> TIM differences are also exagerrated under the IHS. What might be 'only' a 10*C+ difference that CLU/CLP has over AS5, would easily become 20*C+ when under the IHS.
> 
> It isn't so much that there's huge differences in pastes or CLU/CLP is so awesome (although it is, it's not a normal paste like PK3, Gelid GC extreme, NH-T1, Masscool, and other modern pastes that are at least 5-10*C better than as5), it's that as5 is junk.
> 
> It came out over 13 years ago. Think about how far along GPUs and CPUs have come in 13 years. If you don't want to drop $20 on CLU/CLP, buy an LED or something else you might need at frozencpu and use the 5.1% discount so you get free shipping and 5.1% off ship. You can also find a modern paste on Ebay in 1.5g quantity around $4 shipped, like PK-3, that is significantly better than AS5.
> 
> Let me put it this way - the difference between PK-3, and PK-1, a paste that is consistently ranked a couple degrees higher than AS5, is a larger temp drop than I got from going from a Hyper 212+ to Corsair H50 water cooling.


im not going into deep with your post, but will say one thing,

your " review" is testing with tim's on the IHS, not on die,
the difference in temps when you use liquid pro/ultra on the IHS isnt that big, compared to other tim's,
they are ALL, including AS5, within a 2-6C range from each other









check any review/test online, youll see









day shift signing off ..G'night guys


----------



## VonDutch

good timing, the Boss is here ...lol ..hey Captain Val







G'nite Cap


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I've sent 3 emails to Coollaboratory asking them to confirm the heat conductivity values for both Pro and Ultra but they haven't replied. Hopefully you have more luck


already have answer from them, no worries








the little list i posted about w/mk is updated, and shows the values


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> What's your source? There is so much misinformation around Pro and Ultra it's not funny
> Where did you get this from?
> 
> I wish the Pro I ordered would hurry up and arrive so I can finally compare the two and put an end to all the speculation


Well if you look at results on the first post. Peoples experience on this very thread. Temps are generally around 3-5 degrees different from Pro. There was some trade off in performance verse usability by creating an easier to remove ultra.

http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/

What missinformation?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> good timing, the Boss is here ...lol ..hey Captain Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G'nite Cap


Night sir! sleep with that lady in your head!


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Should I try and do the thermal paste again? I really don't care about getting CLP. If someone else with a 3570K using AS5 and gets temp drops using the same aspects they did, then why can't I?
> 
> What gives? I feel like this is a HUGE failure instead of a gain of delidding. I'm not seeing any effects of this yet.


My first, second, and third PK-1 application on the die and IHS were failures. Temps were worse even if compared to temps before delid. Not sure what I did wrong.

In the other hand my first application of liquid pro makes huge temp drop, around 25C!

Conclusion, go get liquid pro/ultra!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> the die is small, then it is more important what the w/mk is of any tim used,
> _you can use any good tim on the ihs_, but on the die, the liquids rule big time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it will be your best $20 spend really,
> your smile wil be like this


I didn't smile, I LOL at the temps that the liquid pro is giving me.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Should I try and do the thermal paste again? I really don't care about getting CLP. If someone else with a 3570K using AS5 and gets temp drops using the same aspects they did, then why can't I?
> 
> What gives? I feel like this is a HUGE failure instead of a gain of delidding. I'm not seeing any effects of this yet.


you have to use coolabs pro\ultra thats it


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Well if you look at results on the first post. Peoples experience on this very thread. Temps are generally around 3-5 degrees different from Pro. There was some trade off in performance verse usability by creating an easier to remove ultra.
> 
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/
> 
> What missinformation?


If you actually look at the temp differences on the first page they vary so much for both Ultra and Pro. I don't have the time to run the averages but just by looking at it they are pretty equal. I'm going to reserve my judgement til the Pro I ordered arrives and I've run tests with them both


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> If you actually look at the temp differences on the first page they vary so much for both Ultra and Pro. I don't have the time to run the averages but just by looking at it they are pretty equal. I'm going to reserve my judgement til the Pro I ordered arrives and I've run tests with them both


You must remember that every chip and IHS is different in composition and such. so the results cant really be true unless you have multiple people test it with the same chip and IHS and cooler and OC.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> already have answer from them, no worries
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the little list i posted about w/mk is updated, and shows the values


Your post still says "LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)" Has Coollabs confirmed this figure?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You must remember that every chip and IHS is different in composition and such. so the results cant really be true unless you have multiple people test it with the same chip and IHS and cooler and OC.


Which is why I'm going to wait until I am able to compare the 2 on my systems


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> If you actually look at the temp differences on the first page they vary so much for both Ultra and Pro. I don't have the time to run the averages but just by looking at it they are pretty equal. I'm going to reserve my judgement til the Pro I ordered arrives and I've run tests with them both


Ya fair enough. You're right there. I have ultra right now to so I will be doing the same thing.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Your post still says "LM Pro = 82w/mK (according to a HWBOT 2008 TIM roundup)" Has Coollabs confirmed this figure?
> Which is why I'm going to wait until I am able to compare the 2 on my systems


Okay as long as you have more than one. Let me know the results once you get them through PM first then we can discuss it and output the correct information as needed.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> I wouldn't mind delidding the chips for people but I wouldn't buy them a new chip. It's their risk, I am just the artisan....


I also need to say this as well. Phew lots of typing for the Captain today lol.

Okay with the crazy ability of Liquid Pro and Ultra has anyone here ever thought that we simply have gotten to the point where we aren't pumping enough heat out of the CPU to fully complement the Liquid Pro/Ultra. Also we need to look at the cooler people use. if we have an Air cooler that is taking all the heat that CL P/U is moving without reaching it's maximum heat transfer rate then maybe we are simply reaching the output rate of the IHS and the thermal absorbency of the Heat Sink which would then result in a build up of heat in the IHs and back to the die but will still be keeping the thermal levels lower than before with the Intel TIM and such.

Must keep thinking and look at all the angles guys.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay as long as you have more than one. Let me know the results once you get them through PM first then we can discuss it and output the correct information as needed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also need to say this as well. Phew lots of typing for the Captain today lol.
> 
> Okay with the crazy ability of Liquid Pro and Ultra has anyone here ever thought that we simply have gotten to the point where we aren't pumping enough heat out of the CPU to fully complement the Liquid Pro/Ultra. Also we need to look at the cooler people use. if we have an Air cooler that is taking all the heat that CL P/U is moving without reaching it's maximum heat transfer rate then maybe we are simply reaching the output rate of the IHS and the thermal absorbency of the Heat Sink which would then result in a build up of heat in the IHs and back to the die but will still be keeping the thermal levels lower than before with the Intel TIM and such.
> 
> Must keep thinking and look at all the angles guys.


Thats a good point, has anyone done testing on the actual TIM heat and see where the flow of heat is actually going...Maybe we could look into creating our own IHS out of copper? I am throwing a huge Tripple 120mm 80mm thick rad in my new system which should move a ton of heat at a fast rate. I think the actual voltages are what people are afraid of.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get a phase change cooler...problem solved. Works for future upgrades aswell.


----------



## jamonymo

I7 3770k does Turbo Boost disabewhen oc x m


----------



## $ilent

I'm currently running p95 for 5ghz at 1.36v max temp is 71C. Case less PC ftw!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> I'm currently running p95 for 5ghz at 1.36v max temp is 71C. Case less PC ftw!


haha that's how my PC is atm - as I plan on doing cable management tomorrow!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Thats a good point, has anyone done testing on the actual TIM heat and see where the flow of heat is actually going...Maybe we could look into creating our own IHS out of copper? I am throwing a huge Tripple 120mm 80mm thick rad in my new system which should move a ton of heat at a fast rate. I think the actual voltages are what people are afraid of.
> haha I was joking! good luck with that though!


See what it could really be is not the TIM limits at all..... but the coolers and the metals used in Heat sinks.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> haha that's how my PC is atm - as I plan on doing cable management tomorrow!


I've been running case less for months maybe even years, it doesn't cost anything and the temps I get are as good as wwatercooling


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, how does the un-delidded CPU look? (Wink wink







)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> I've been running case less for months maybe even years, it doesn't cost anything and the temps I get are as good as wwatercooling


But the dust mon ami!
MUCHOS DUST!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, how does the un-delidded CPU look? (Wink wink
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


That looks like a really good stock CPU, where did you buy it from? hehe


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, how does the un-delidded CPU look? (Wink wink
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


I said through PM but I guess it looks darn purdy......


----------



## $ilent

Yea the amount of dust is crazy, needs a compressed air blowout pftenn


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I said through PM but I guess it looks darn purdy......


You heard the man swag! haha


----------



## Swag

@*Chris*
Tell me when you are delidding, we should do a stream on it and up it onto YouTube for people to learn more!

Here's what my PC would have looked like if it hadn't died...







I even bought electrical tape for my D14!


Spoiler: Swag's C70 (Some large images)










As you can see, the Window mod looks 10X better with the nuts rather than the washers+screws. Pictures were taken with my iPhone so they aren't the best. My DSLR is irreparable apparently.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Very beautiful man!

And yeah - faw shaw I will record it etc if I de-lid....now to wait for that pentium 4 first.


----------



## $ilent

What happened swag?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> What happened swag?


A nasty muffin hurt his whole rig (PSU blew)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> What happened swag?
> 
> 
> 
> A nasty muffin hurt his whole rig (PSU blew)
Click to expand...

Yup, it was awful but Corsair will be replacing the PSU. I hope they throw in some extra stuff for this inconvenience!

Although this time without a PC gives me time to play my guitar.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Alright so I have another question. I know a lot of people are doubtful of delidding and don't do it for the sake of ruining their brand new chip. Me and my coworker are considering on opening our own little shop of delidded chips. So you would just buy a chip from us that comes delidded and lapped if requested. We could even throw in the CLP or CLU for a little extra. I think this would take the worry out of ruining CPUs, what do you guys think? Do you think there would be enough people who would be interested in that sort of option? The chips would obviously be tested and backed by us since we have experience in delidding. I just don't want to buy a bunch of chips and have no one buy them


Only issue I can see with the idea is that most buy the ivy bridge cpu, see how the temps are, & then look at delidding (when they have already bought a cpu).
There are some of the guys who research more & read up on delidding before they actually get a cpu, they would be the target consumers, but not sure how many that may be.
If you do come across golden chips in the binning procedure, benchers would snap those up, chips that can get to desktop & manage some light load (such as superpi32m, just loading single core) at like 5ghz under 1.3V on air, I want one (keep the lid on those ones







)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yup, it was awful but Corsair will be replacing the PSU. I hope they throw in some extra stuff for this inconvenience!
> 
> Although this time without a PC gives me time to play my guitar.


Hahaha! Same here, I sing a lot more and play guitar and use my psp more nowadays.
I got really good at singing over Jeff Scott Soto, I was more of a Ronnie James Dio clone before.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yup, it was awful but Corsair will be replacing the PSU. I hope they throw in some extra stuff for this inconvenience!
> 
> Although this time without a PC gives me time to play my guitar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hahaha! Same here, I sing a lot more and play guitar and use my psp more nowadays.
> I got really good at singing over Jeff Scott Soto, I was more of a Ronnie James Dio clone before.
Click to expand...

I can't sing.







I suck at it even at karaoke! Although, I love my guitars, they sound so much better after aging. The warm melody! My favorite song to play would probably be Johnny B. Goode. Love that song and the opening is amazing.


----------



## Joa3d43

*To FtW 420* , *Von Dutch* and others per earlier posts

...just did a still 'un-delidded' run at 5210.13 MHz at ""only"" 1.464v







http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2657034 (actually had an earlier run with lower 'v', but then I got so excited I spilled my coffee on the keyboard by accident







- which is why I keep several 'el cheapo' Certified Data keyboards handy, and also my machines well away from 'spill radius').

In any case, I am now at my 'personal max limit' of vCore for record runs (1.45v to 1.475v)...temps are not so much a concern as too much 'juice v' damaging / degrading the chip (per yesterday's posts, it's a Costa Rica 3229C series)

*Question 1*

Will delidding or IHS-free unlidding also lower my v-requirements at any given speed ?

*Question 2*

*a.)* The general consensus seems to be that as a TIM for the 'inside', I should use Coll.Liquid Pro or Ultra. Which one of those two, especially with an eye on longer-term coherence of the inside TIM ?
*
b.)* Does Coll.Liquid TIM affect the (Edit) surface on the die itself ? How about when also using it on the outside re a pure copper water block of my Thermaltake Water 2.0 Extreme ? As we all know, copper tends to easily be affected by variosu acids and also when in contact with other metals

*c.)* To *FtW 420*: As we live in the same metro area, where can I buy Coll. Liquid Pro / Ultra in town ? ...or just Mail-order ? (I checked their website, and there was nothing for Canada)

*Question 3*

While the Thermaltake close-loop system has exceeded my expectations, I am also interested to water-cool my SLI GPUs (after giving them so Coll.Liquid paste as well), and thus working on playing out the custom-loop approach. As a pump, I will use Swiftech's MPC655, but what is the best, most reliable water bloc for I7 3770k in your experience ?

Thanks in advance for the tips and feedback


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *To FtW 420* , *Von Dutch* and others per earlier posts
> 
> ...just did a still 'un-delidded' run at 5210.13 MHz at ""only"" 1.464v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2657034 (actually had an earlier run with lower 'v', but then I got so excited I spilled my coffee on the keyboard by accident
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - which is why I keep several 'el cheapo' Certified Data keyboards handy, and also my machines well away from 'spill radius').
> 
> In any case, I am now at my 'personal max limit' of vCore for record runs (1.45v to 1.475v)...temps are not so much a concern as too much 'juice v' damaging / degrading the chip (per yesterday's posts, it's a Costa Rica 3229C series)
> 
> *Question 1*
> 
> Will delidding or IHS-free unlidding also lower my v-requirements at any given speed ?
> 
> *Question 2*
> 
> *a.)* The general consensus seems to be that as a TIM for the 'inside', I should use Coll.Liquid Pro or Ultra. Which one of those two, especially with an eye on longer-term coherence of the inside TIM ?
> *
> b.)* Does Coll.Liquid TIM affect the metal on the die itself ? How about when also using it on the outside re a pure copper water block of my Thermaltake Water 2.0 Extreme ? As we all know, copper tends to easily be affected by variosu acids and also when in contact with other metals
> 
> *c.)* To *FtW 420*: As we live in the same metro area, where can I buy Coll. Liquid Pro / Ultra in town ? ...or just Mail-order ? (I checked their website, and there was nothing for Canada)
> 
> *Question 3*
> 
> While the Thermaltake close-loop system has exceeded my expectations, I am also interested to water-cool my SLI GPUs (after giving them so Coll.Liquid paste as well), and thus working on playing out the custom-loop approach. As a pump, I will use Swiftech's MPC655, but what is the best, most reliable water bloc for I7 3770k in your experience ?
> 
> Thanks in advance for the tips and feedback


Delidding shouldn't make a difference to the required vcore, it is more of a temp fix. For lower voltage at a given clock it pretty much takes subzero cooling.
Waiting for tweek to test both ultra & pro to compare, pro does look like the better choice for on the die. The die itself is basically glass, looks silvery but it isn't metal. I had to order the ultra from a US etailer (frozencpu), the customs guys had their way with it though & squeezed out at least half the tube... I emailed coollabs about a Canadian distributor & they are working on it, but isn't there yet. If they at least sealed up the blister pack it would get through customs without the rape, the gelid tubes I got at the same time had all the corners pried open a bit but they didn't open them right up.
Personally I haven't even used an actual 1155 waterblock yet, had an h50 & h100 on ivy, for custom loop I briefly used a 1366 koolance block. I haven't pushed a cpu on water though, not much point for me when I have better coolers to play with.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420* wrote....Delidding shouldn't make a difference to the required vcore...


Thanks for the info







I keep on hearing horror stories about the custom guys also







. I will wait to see what 'Tweek's' Coll.Liquids comparison will bring


----------



## $ilent

OK guys I need a new over clocking board for my new 3770k. For some reason my Asus 08p67 pro sucks at overclocking and needs a shed load more volts than what I know the chip needs.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> OK guys I need a new over clocking board for my new 3770k. For some reason my Asus 08p67 pro sucks at overclocking and needs a shed load more volts than what I know the chip needs.


Look into the 200 bucks range honestly go gigabyte asus or msi. thats about it......


----------



## $ilent

Hmm I saw an old thread where sin recommended the gigabyte ud5h?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Hmm I saw an old thread where sin recommended the gigabyte ud5h?


That board is great for the price. I recommend Asus products though.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That board is great for the price. I recommend Asus products though.


I do NOT recommend the P8Z77-V or P8Z77-V Pro, horrible miserable boards. I'm not the only one having problems with it. In fact I've seen about 6 people in one thread with the same problems. That's a small sample size for 6 people to have identical problems.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *$ilent* wrote...OK guys I need a new over clocking board for my new 3770k


...Asus Sabertooth Z77 can hit at the very least well over 5.2 GHz at 'relatively' low volts (per above post) and is around $220...has a very strong VRM and related controls...running 32GB of DDR3 2400 Ram with no problems

...Then there are the more expensive Asus ROG boards

...Gigabyte UDxh series, depending on your budget and need for options

...just make sure you get the latest gen boards from Asus or Gigabyte as their Dram lanes already conform to Hawell specs (even if the socket doesn't..., though may be Intel will bring out a Haswell 1155 after all, I heard)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I can't sing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I suck at it even at karaoke! Although, I love my guitars, they sound so much better after aging. The warm melody! My favorite song to play would probably be Johnny B. Goode. Love that song and the opening is amazing.


Check Complete Vocal Technique out...I teach using that method.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> OK guys I need a new over clocking board for my new 3770k. For some reason my Asus 08p67 pro sucks at overclocking and needs a shed load more volts than what I know the chip needs.


Z68 boards are known to have issues with Ivy chips, so no prob...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That board is great for the price. I recommend Asus products though.


It is great all around but sucks at ram overclocking, if you don't mind matx the Maximus V Gene is great and has one of the best bioses for overclocking. (most benchers use it...) Can't beat the price/perf ratio.
If not go with the Asrock Z77 OC Formula or the Z77x-up5 by Gigabyte.


----------



## $ilent

hmm the sabertooth is like 350 dollars over here, bit too expensive, what about the as rock extreme 4? That's quite cheap

What about the ud3h or gigabyte d3h?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> hmm the sabertooth is like 350 dollars over here, bit too expensive, what about the as rock extreme 4? That's quite cheap


Extreme6 is worth the extra money. I've found that overclocking RAM on the ASRock boards is a lot more difficult. It's doable but takes a lot more time messing with sub-timings when the only plus about my P8Z77-V Pro is it would adjust those sub timings automatically.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> hmm the sabertooth is like 350 dollars over here, bit too expensive, what about the as rock extreme 4? That's quite cheap
> 
> What about the ud3h or gigabyte d3h?


Look for the Maximus V Gene, Sabertooth is an overpriced POS.









Price low to high I'd reccomend:

-Extreme 6
-Z77X-UD3H
-Maximus V Gene
-OC Formula
-Maximus V Formula / UP5
-Maximus V Extreme
-UP7


----------



## Swag

I got the MVG for only $150. The $50 discount from MC + a coupon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I do NOT recommend the P8Z77-V or P8Z77-V Pro, horrible miserable boards. I'm not the only one having problems with it. In fact I've seen about 6 people in one thread with the same problems. That's a small sample size for 6 people to have identical problems.


take a wack at my mobo.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Look for the Maximus V Gene, Sabertooth is an overpriced POS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Price low to high I'd reccomend:
> 
> -Extreme 6
> -Z77X-UD3H
> -Maximus V Gene
> -OC Formula
> -Maximus V Formula / UP5
> -Maximus V Extreme
> -UP7


great list!


----------



## lilchronic

im bout to upgrade to the UP5 from the pos extreme4. i think thats the best board for the price range im lookin at even thou the msi z77 mpower looks pretty good







but i dont think its good enough for me


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im bout to upgrade to the UP5 from the pos extreme4. i think thats the best board for the price range im lookin at even thou the msi z77 mpower looks pretty good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i dont think its good enough for me


It's an okay board, like the UD5H...There are better things out there.


----------



## [CyGnus]

I would not go with asus board's only if it is a ROG Board otherwise skip them, try a Gigabyte Z77X-UD3H or UD5 or Asrock extreme4 / 6 cant go wrong with those.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> I would not go with asus board's only if it is a ROG Board otherwise skip them, try a Gigabyte Z77X-UD3H or UD5 or Asrock extreme4 / 6 cant go wrong with those.


I'd agree except on the Extreme 4...it's like a really budget cheapass board. I'd skip it if possible.


----------



## lilchronic

im starting to like the asus MVF. i might spend a little more than i should. lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's an okay board, like the UD5H...There are better things out there.


The mpower is my fav z77 so far of the few I've tried. Guys who use the offset voltage thing dislike the way mpower doesn't do it the same way, I prefer it like that though.
The ud3h is good, just a couple very minor issues, I hate the clear cmos location (not an issue if someone doesn't use the reset button much, but ud5h looks the same) & the way you only get 2 x usb ports without drivers, also not a big deal for non benchers, I try to install as few drivers as possible.
The mvg is also good, but just so small... makes it hard to set things up the way I'm used to (& not huge air cooler friendly if you have a gpu as well). No ps2 port is also a minus for me (I get much use out of ps2 still).

Can't really go wrong with the boards in ivan's list (not sure about extreme 6, the OC Formula is still the only asrock I would look at).


----------



## [CyGnus]

Asrock is pretty good actually i have the cheapest board from them z77 pro3 and can run 5.1GHz DDR 2400 cas 10 no problem at all (90€ board) so as far as board's go i would not spend premium money if i was going to use it with Air or wc...


----------



## FtW 420

This is true, I tend to look at sub zero cooled results when comparing boards & asrock just wasn't in there for a long time, but don't see many complaints from the users who do have them.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *ivanlabrie, FtW 420* re 'POS' Sabertooth


Well, just came back from dinner and I find a gang-up on the Sabertooth Z77 ? A ' POS







' ...oh, *what language* for my virgin ears - the humanity of it all









I am not sure how many of you actually run a Sabertooth Z77 at the moment, nor am I married to that board. I just authorize a lot of hardware re running a software company that is active globally, and as such have a pretty good relationship with our hardware sources both in this region and Europe where our main ops are. Up until four or five months ago, I was running an Abit board (please don't laugh) as my main personal rig, not least as I had gotten out of overclocking for a while after starting that back with my DX4 / 100 all those ions ago.

On the commercial front, we either run Intel or Asus in various configs with Xeons, and no, we don't overclock those - I am just happy if they keep on humming away, and have spares just in case they are not. But even there, water cooling is starting to make more inroads which is why I like to learn more about it myself.

Now, I actually wanted to build a few test machines around the LGA 2011 socket, but realized that with the ongoing move to 22 nm, I should wait until that has trickled down to 8 core+ Xeons (Q3+). So to get ready for those, I ordered a couple of basic Ivy Bridge machines to play around with - using the lowly Asus P8Z77-V LK boards ($120). One of those boards I pushed up to 4833 MHz with low voltage on the CPU, 32 GB of Ripjaw DDR3 1600 and without ever encountering a single BSOD...good enough for me.

I then asked my closest retailer here (as opposed to our main office in Europe), which Z77 board was a.) a good performer and b.) had the lowest RMA with them. Some Asus ROG boards came up, along with Gigabyte - and the Sabertooth Z77...there are those who suggest that it is very close to the Asus ROG Max V gene re features and components, and there is a table on 'Hardware Secrets' that supports that view (ie Sabertooth being an entry version of ROG).

Again, I don't consider myself a 'fan boy' nor an expert in this market segment, but many of the folks who sell those for a living also choose the Sabertooth Z77 for their own rigs - good enough for me, never mind the 5 year warranty. Also, just for fun I have done at least 10 runs between 5.1 and over 5.2 GHz over the last three days, just to fine tune some BIOS settings I treat differently than most of you, and the board has been flawless so far....we will see what it can really do once I delid and upgrade cooling.

All that said, do I think that Gigabyte boards are heavily represented in LNG and such top speed runs - and for good reason ? Sure, among the best.

The only brand that would concern me for now is Asrock - until a question is answered because I have been following this thread which appeared just a few days ago: http://www.overclock.net/t/1349216/is-asrock-really-cheating-us-on-software-voltage-readings


----------



## VonDutch

Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H









in its prize class, best mobo i think, it lets me do all the crazy things i want, its very reliable
only limit i found was the 1.85V vcore, but not many peeps use that anyways ...LOL


----------



## lilchronic

someone here can help me i think. i ran this 7 hrs prime95 and crashed with a bsod 0x000124 i dont no what im doing wrong im missing something here i think. what sould i do. i really think my mobo is holding me back. any suggestions on what to do to get 5ghz stable?


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sabertooth is too expensive and not that good compared to cheaper boards.
3 year warranty is plenty on the ROG boards btw.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> someone here can help me i think. i ran this 7 hrs prime95 and crashed with a bsod 0x000124 i dont no what im doing wrong im missing something here i think. what sould i do. i really think my mobo is holding me back. any suggestions on what to do to get 5ghz stable?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


go gigabyte ..lol..jk

0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT..

7H prime means its almost there,with those very high oc's every little setting becomes important, that i know,
but yea, maybe it is your mobo holding you back idk..
srry, woke up at 4.30am, 6.45am now, im kaputt , so dont remember now exactly, theres 2 voltages, that need to be in range with each other,
didnt really use them myselfs, only once, but see others mention it sometimes..euhm..pfft, cant think, im sure others know..
imc and cpu vtt?


----------



## Swag

I don't think the Asus Sabertooth is too bad of a board. I do recommend any Asus ROG board though, they are simply top-notch and cannot be beaten. What I don't recommend are the P-series board. They normally come with a lot of problems and one board was actually known to keep crashing no matter what BIOS and Asus did not replace it. I forgot the model number, sorry.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> go gigabyte ..lol..jk
> 
> 0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT..
> 
> 7H prime means its almost there,with those very high oc's every little setting becomes important, that i know,
> but yea, maybe it is your mobo holding you back idk..
> srry, woke up at 4.30am, 6.45am now, im kaputt , so dont remember now exactly, theres 2 voltages, that need to be in range with each other,
> didnt really use them myselfs, only once, but see others mention it sometimes..euhm..pfft, cant think, im sure others know..
> imc and cpu vtt?


vtt and cpu pll?


----------



## Valgaur

I love my mobo... even the price tag for it. truly fits it's features.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't think the Asus Sabertooth is too bad of a board. I do recommend any Asus ROG board though, they are simply top-notch and cannot be beaten. What I don't recommend are the P-series board. They normally come with a lot of problems and one board was actually known to keep crashing no matter what BIOS and Asus did not replace it. I forgot the model number, sorry.


The board itself is OK, I never see extreme results with them but don't see users complaining more than with any other board.
Just hard for me to like something with the gimmicky thermal armor, right up there with gun & bullet heatsinks. Personal thing though.
I did see something somewhere about the sabertooth getting worse bench results (can't remember in what bench) than other boards but don't remember any details, or if anything changed in bios updates.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't think the Asus Sabertooth is too bad of a board. I do recommend any Asus ROG board though, they are simply top-notch and cannot be beaten. What I don't recommend are the P-series board. They normally come with a lot of problems and one board was actually known to keep crashing no matter what BIOS and Asus did not replace it. I forgot the model number, sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> The board itself is OK, I never see extreme results with them but don't see users complaining more than with any other board.
> Just hard for me to like something with the gimmicky thermal armor, right up there with gun & bullet heatsinks. Personal thing though.
> I did see something somewhere about the sabertooth getting worse bench results (can't remember in what bench) than other boards but don't remember any details, or if anything changed in bios updates.
Click to expand...

I agree, for the best perf/cost ratio, it would probably be the MVG as the top mobo. Following would probably be the ROG line. I recommend Asus more than any other brand because well, they are the only motherboard that hasn't really caused me problems and if they do develop problems, Asus RMA is a one-step American service. Actually, Asus support are all people with thick southern accents.


----------



## VonDutch

funny








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> vtt and cpu pll?


its not those two, they are very far apart volts wise,

and its ME!! im so tired today, headeache, burning eyes, think im getting ill ...dang...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> funny


Sir, free space does not mean empty space. Even in a black and white world, there not only 2 colors.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sir, free space does not mean empty space. Even in a black and white world, there not only 2 colors.


lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sir, free space does not mean empty space. Even in a black and white world, there not only 2 colors.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
Click to expand...

Want to know why?


----------



## VonDutch

k, enough of the funny stuff, this is a serious thread....lol
taking it easy today guys...dd i mention my Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H is a nice mobo already









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Want to know why?


sure








maybe i even understand it..

is running super pi 1M, and gitting it under 7.0 sec considered good?

might want to give it a try again at 5.3ghz, see if i can get it







this one is at 5.2ghz..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> k, enough of the funny stuff, this is a serious thread....lol
> taking it easy today guys...dd i mention my Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H is a nice mobo already
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Want to know why?
> 
> 
> 
> sure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maybe i even understand it..
Click to expand...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*


im not , just tired.....


this is my list for today,


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I agree, for the best perf/cost ratio, it would probably be the MVG as the top mobo. Following would probably be the ROG line. I recommend Asus more than any other brand because well, they are the only motherboard that hasn't really caused me problems and if they do develop problems, Asus RMA is a one-step American service. Actually, Asus support are all people with thick southern accents.


Up5 and the Up7 is king....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im not , just tired.....
> 
> 
> this is my list for today,
Click to expand...

Something to stretch your mind.

Don't assume that in a black and white world, that if it isn't black, it's white. You're forgetting the bigger picture, there's grey.







Just like in a space, just cause it is free doesn't mean it is empty.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I agree, for the best perf/cost ratio, it would probably be the MVG as the top mobo. Following would probably be the ROG line. I recommend Asus more than any other brand because well, they are the only motherboard that hasn't really caused me problems and if they do develop problems, Asus RMA is a one-step American service. Actually, Asus support are all people with thick southern accents.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Up5 and the Up7 is king....
Click to expand...

Haven't tried GB boards in quite a while. I didn't like them after one of my boards died and the RMA service was HORRIBLE.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Up5 and the Up7 is king....


Up7 is right up there, the mvg & mve still hold more records, but have been around longer with more submissions.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Something to stretch your mind.
> 
> Don't assume that in a black and white world, that if it isn't black, it's white. You're forgetting the bigger picture, there's grey.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just like in a space, just cause it is free doesn't mean it is empty.




i always thought black isnt a real colour, in space its the absence of light that makes the "sky" look black at night,
and if you mix all colours, including white, it would be black too right?
black is the strangest "colour" i think


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Something to stretch your mind.
> 
> Don't assume that in a black and white world, that if it isn't black, it's white. You're forgetting the bigger picture, there's grey.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just like in a space, just cause it is free doesn't mean it is empty.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i always thought black isnt a real colour, in space its the absence of light that makes the "sky" look black at night
Click to expand...

Black absorbs all other colors, therefore there is no color present. However, black is not the same as darkness, where darkness is the absence of light.







You are correct though.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Black absorbs all other colors, therefore there is no color present. However, black is not the same as darkness, where darkness is the absence of light.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct though.


Wrong!

white absorbs all color because if any color gets into it you cant get white again!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Black absorbs all other colors, therefore there is no color present. However, black is not the same as darkness, where darkness is the absence of light.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are correct though.
> 
> 
> 
> Wrong!
> 
> white absorbs all color because if any color gets into it you cant get white again!
Click to expand...

White can't absorb any other color because white is every color.







Shine a white beam of light into a prism!


----------



## VonDutch

man, all this talk about colour, where am i? im tumbling into a "black" hole here ....LOL
talk about , stretching your mind, if you get closer and closer to it










A simulated example of subtractive color mixing

thats why i thought mixing all colours, would give black,
but im not really thinking well today, mabye i just see it wrong


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> man, all this talk about colour, where am i? im tumbling into a "black" hole here ....LOL


Yes our task is complete Swag!

Okay back to delidding. I need my new chip to add to my resume as well!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> man, all this talk about colour, where am i? im tumbling into a "black" hole here ....LOL
> 
> 
> 
> Yes our task is complete Swag!
> 
> Okay back to delidding. I need my new chip to add to my resume as well!
Click to expand...

He'll be thinking about some crazy stuff and drip into a comatose state when he finally realizes that reality isn't real but a shell our minds place us in.









When's your new chip arriving? And how much did it cost?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> He'll be thinking about some crazy stuff and drip into a comatose state when he finally realizes that reality isn't real but a shell our minds place us in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When's your new chip arriving? And how much did it cost?


No idea on the arrival or batch # (I believe in the Silicon lottery anyways)

It was for 305 with shipping and the guys fee which is understandable.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> He'll be thinking about some crazy stuff and drip into a comatose state when he finally realizes that reality isn't real but a shell our minds place us in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When's your new chip arriving? And how much did it cost?
> 
> 
> 
> No idea on the arrival or batch # (I believe in the Silicon lottery anyways)
> 
> It was for 305 with shipping and the guys fee which is understandable.
Click to expand...

Why didn't you just buy it from MC? I just picked up 2 3770Ks, planning to give them as presents to my dad and an old friend of mine.







Only $460 in total after taxes.

You're not alone on the silicon lottery, I have seen many people aim for the batch number that I had (the one that just died) and end up with a far worse chip than they could have ever imagined.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why didn't you just buy it from MC? I just picked up 2 3770Ks, planning to give them as presents to my dad and an old friend of mine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only $460 in total after taxes.
> 
> You're not alone on the silicon lottery, I have seen many people aim for the batch number that I had (the one that just died) and end up with a far worse chip than they could have ever imagined.


I'm getting one froma MC..... but I'm 6 hours from one. and the cost of gas would murder the reason to go. This is my best option other than newegg or ebay... icky


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> taking it easy today guys...
> 
> is running super pi 1M, and gitting it under 7.0 sec considered good?
> 
> might want to give it a try again at 5.3ghz, see if i can get it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this one is at 5.2ghz..


so, my question 2 pages b(l)ack still stands?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You're not alone on the silicon lottery, I have seen many people aim for the batch number that I had (the one that just died) and end up with a far worse chip than they could have ever imagined.


yea, thats why i say, "dont stare blind"on batchnumbers, we been through that already in here long time ago,
any batch gives good and bad chips, all we know is costa rica _seems_ to be better then the malaysia chips


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why didn't you just buy it from MC? I just picked up 2 3770Ks, planning to give them as presents to my dad and an old friend of mine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only $460 in total after taxes.
> 
> You're not alone on the silicon lottery, I have seen many people aim for the batch number that I had (the one that just died) and end up with a far worse chip than they could have ever imagined.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm getting one froma MC..... but I'm 6 hours from one. and the cost of gas would murder the reason to go. This is my best option other than newegg or ebay... icky
Click to expand...

Yea, don't buy parts from Ebay, I can't trust the people on that site anymore. I've seen how some people treat their hardware and they are always just tossing it randomly!

How do you guys think SLI would work on the MVG? It's so hard to fit the D14 + a GPU...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so, my question 2 pages b(l)ack still stands?


I got 6.9 in W7 on 5.3 Ghz with my crappy RAM.... Franky didnt really like SuperPi very much either. was weird.

Also the best one on air is currently just over ^ seconds flat. or 6.1 basically. So your good from what I see man!


----------



## Joa3d43

*naked Sabertooth*









...agree with the earlier comments re. Thermal Armour -while it seem to lower the temps of my hard drives by 2 to 3 degrees on an otherwise identical system, the drives were not running hot in the first place...I think the Thermal Armour is mostly for looks and folks who build machines with a lot of windows. I plan to remove it. Thermal Radar on the other hand is a really nice feature, especially during benchmarking...

...speaking of benchmarking, I know I had seen a nice summary at 'ocaholic' (a Swiss OC' site), and here is a comparison of major benchmarks and many of the mobos we're talking about: http://www.ocaholic.ch/xoops/html/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=806&page=6

Anyhow, what I liked most about the Sabertooth is the low RMA quotient my contacts pointed out, and the long warranty


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Only if my parents loved PCs as much as me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My dad does but my mom doesn't. She doesn't really support it because she says it's basically a money black hole!
> 
> I really want to do SLI but it looks hard on the MVG!
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I bet it does lol. what should I do though? a new comp case and super WC loop with tri or dual sli? or keep my Cosmos 2 and pimp it out.
Click to expand...

I would do the first one. New case + super WC loop + SLI? Can't be beat! I would definitely recommend that rather than keeping the Cosmos 2! Any case with water cooling will look amazing! Even a $100 case can look beautiful with the right lighting and imagination!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *naked Sabertooth*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...agree with the earlier comments re. Thermal Armour -while it seem to lower the temps of my hard drives by 2 to 3 degrees on an otherwise identical system, the drives were not running hot in the first place...I think the Thermal Armour is mostly for looks and folks who build machines with a lot of windows. I plan to remove it. Thermal Radar on the other hand is a really nice feature, especially during benchmarking...
> 
> ...speaking of benchmarking, I know I had seen a nice summary at 'ocaholic' (a Swiss OC' site), and here is a comparison of major benchmarks and many of the mobos we're talking about: http://www.ocaholic.ch/xoops/html/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=806&page=6
> 
> Anyhow, what I liked most about the Sabertooth is the low RMA quotient my contacts pointed out, and the long warranty


yea, i really like the looks, do they only come in brown?

gutt das ich auch deutch spreche ...LOL
if i take a quick look at the comparisons, they all within 1-2% from eachother in benches

edit,
nvm, found a black one too..

o, just found a note, my 5.2ghz super pi needed 1.6V to run..
afraid i need a big jump for 5.3ghz and windows boot/run Sp,
funny, at 5.1ghz i needed 1.6V also, to make cinebench(10.23 points) run ..lol

10.28 points with 1.610V vcore and tuning a bit,

BamBam ..hehe


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote...nvm, found a black one, too


...and this fellow who build this 'contraption' surely will paint it any colour you want







: http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/2012/12/23/mod-of-the-year-2012/4 ...the question is whether it will ' go sehr schnell ?!'


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and this fellow who build this 'contraption' surely will paint it any colour you want
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/2012/12/23/mod-of-the-year-2012/4 ...the question is whether it will ' go sehr schnell ?!'


nvm the schnell..lol that looks..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Agreed Thats what I do and my customers love my service! but due to time and customer flow we have to wait a lot.
> Yeah I bet it does lol. what should I do though? a new comp case and super WC loop with tri or dual sli? or keep my Cosmos 2 and pimp it out.


Get a real case cosmos 2 sux.


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i really like the looks, do they only come in brown?
> 
> gutt das ich auch deutch spreche ...LOL
> if i take a quick look at the comparisons, they all within 1-2% from eachother in benches
> 
> edit,
> nvm, found a black one too..
> 
> o, just found a note, my 5.2ghz super pi needed 1.6V to run..
> afraid i need a big jump for 5.3ghz and windows boot/run Sp,
> funny, at 5.1ghz i needed 1.6V also, to make cinebench(10.23 points) run ..lol
> 
> 10.28 points with 1.610V vcore and tuning a bit,
> 
> BamBam ..hehe


I have been trying to get my Cinebench score above 10. What's your RAM freq for that run VonDutch?

BTW, I needed 1.64V to get Superpi 1M run at 5.3GHz.

I must say deliding opens the gate to freedom for ivy chips


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> I have been trying to get my Cinebench score above 10. What's your RAM freq for that run VonDutch?
> 
> BTW, I needed 1.64V to get Superpi 1M run at 5.3GHz.
> 
> I must say deliding opens the gate to freedom for ivy chips


1600mhz,

9-9-9-24 for daily usage

yea, 5.3ghz 1.64V vcore, but mine isnt very good with oc's,
so i prolly am somewhere close to 1.7V to make windows boot etc...
i needed 1.750V vcore to make 5.4ghz run for a cpu-z validation..

i wanted to beat that Xeon with 10.33 points in cinebench, got close but ..o well..

lol, yea after delid, only limit is vcore, i dont even look at my temps anymore, whatever i do









o, this close i got...grmbl,

still at 5.1ghz







but more finetuning...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Von Dutch wrote: nvm the schnell..lol that looks..


...but if you want to go really, really very, very schnell [7102 MHz] with your OC 3770, it's still Gigabyte ?!


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> I have been trying to get my Cinebench score above 10. What's your RAM freq for that run VonDutch?
> 
> BTW, I needed 1.64V to get Superpi 1M run at 5.3GHz.
> 
> I must say deliding opens the gate to freedom for ivy chips


Your welcome then!









explore my friend!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...but if you want to go really, really very, very schnell [7102 MHz] with your OC 3770, it's still Gigabyte ?!


if i ever would have a setup like that, im one to be reckoned with, when i set my mind to something,
i turn into a freak...lol








of course you need a handpicked cpu for it too, i dont think my BamBam will go that high, prolly just 6.4-6.6ghz somewhere,
if it runs that even,
total noob at this moment when it comes to ln/2 etc, but when time comes, i will prolly know more then the guys doing it now ..lol

tired, needs rest ...bll


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> go gigabyte ..lol..jk
> 
> 0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT..
> 
> 7H prime means its almost there,with those very high oc's every little setting becomes important, that i know,
> but yea, maybe it is your mobo holding you back idk..
> srry, woke up at 4.30am, 6.45am now, im kaputt , so dont remember now exactly, theres 2 voltages, that need to be in range with each other,
> didnt really use them myselfs, only once, but see others mention it sometimes..euhm..pfft, cant think, im sure others know..
> imc and cpu vtt?


From Sins own Z77 OC guide:

"_The voltages you should change for high memory overclocking on Z77 on air is the DDR Voltage, and if you like you can try increasing the VCCIO(VTT) and VCCSA(IMC) the VCCIO (VTT) can help with memory OC, however you will also need to increase VCCSA along with it on these GIGABYTE Z77 boards (except on the Sniper M3). If you want to increase VTT you need to increase IMC voltage to within 0.005v below it, so 1.1v VTT would be 1.095v IMC on these GIGABYTE boards. However I didn't really need to change it much at all._"

*Source:* http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280517-Ivy-Bridge-Overclocking-Guide-(Extreme-LN2-Section-Guide-Included)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutc*h wrote.. total noob at this moment when it comes to ln/2.


...all I know about ln/2 is that I am not supposed to drink it







- though I wonder what Liquid Helium tastes like


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> From Sins own Z77 OC guide:
> 
> "_The voltages you should change for high memory overclocking on Z77 on air is the DDR Voltage, and if you like you can try increasing the VCCIO(VTT) and VCCSA(IMC) the VCCIO (VTT) can help with memory OC, however you will also need to increase VCCSA along with it on these GIGABYTE Z77 boards (except on the Sniper M3). If you want to increase VTT you need to increase IMC voltage to within 0.005v below it, so 1.1v VTT would be 1.095v IMC on these GIGABYTE boards. However I didn't really need to change it much at all._"
> 
> *Source:* http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280517-Ivy-Bridge-Overclocking-Guide-(Extreme-LN2-Section-Guide-Included)


a, there it is, thats what i was looking for when i talked to lilchronic this morning to get his 5.0ghz stable
not really related to oc, more for ram oc looks like, but i think i saw in his bios screenies, that he adjusted one of them also ..

thanks Gomi


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 1600mhz,
> 
> 9-9-9-24 for daily usage
> 
> yea, 5.3ghz 1.64V vcore, but mine isnt very good with oc's,
> so i prolly am somewhere close to 1.7V to make windows boot etc...
> i needed 1.750V vcore to make 5.4ghz run for a cpu-z validation..
> 
> i wanted to beat that Xeon with 10.33 points in cinebench, got close but ..o well..
> 
> lol, yea after delid, only limit is vcore, i dont even look at my temps anymore, whatever i do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, this close i got...grmbl,
> 
> still at 5.1ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but more finetuning...


You are close!









That's a very good score at 5.1GHz. Mine only went to 10.20 at 5.1GHz. Mind to tell me stuff that needs fine tuning?









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your welcome then!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> explore my friend!


I sure will!


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...all I know about ln/2 is that I am not supposed to drink it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - though I wonder what Liquid Helium tastes like


Apparently it does not have any taste! *LOL*

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_helium_have_a_taste

"_No. It is completely unreactive, so it won't set off your taste buds._"

Thanks to the person that apparently had absolutely NOTHING to do and added that to Wiki.answers.com *Even more LOL*.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *captvizcenzo*
> 
> 
> 
> You are close!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's a very good score at 5.1GHz. Mine only went to 10.20 at 5.1GHz. Mind to tell me stuff that needs fine tuning?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sure will!


i dont remember exactly what i did, was only focushed on that 10.33 back then,
was trial and error, try again with different setting, etc etc..
i go from 10.28, 10.29 to 10.32 and another 10.32, i left it at that,
i knew i couldnt get more out of it..

edit,
srry captvizcenzo, i saved that screenie as a 5.1ghz oc with that cinebench run,
i did some checking/reruns just now, but i think it was at 5.2ghz, not 5.1ghz, excuses,
i always try to be correct..o well, means im human right, we make mistakes ..lol
but im still proud of that score, even if i didnt beat that xeon








5.1ghz was 10.23 points max i had







5.2ghz 10.32 points max, yea, that sounds better..
just tried 5.3ghz with 1.670V vcore also, but was no go, im not really focushed today,
like i said earlier, i think i end up with about 1.7V vcore for 5.3ghz, and let cinebench run,
it stopped after a few seconds when i started it, says enough..


----------



## VonDutch

when i started Cinebench, windows froze for like 15 seconds, couldnt move mouse, nothing
thought maybe the one i have was corrupted somehow, downloaded a fresh copy,
but its still the same, anyone else ever experienced that?
i think its time for a new windows install...lol
to many unexpected shutdowns is not good, windows hates that, downside of ocing i guess


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> when i started Cinebench, windows froze for like 15 seconds, couldnt move mouse, nothing
> thought maybe the one i have was corrupted somehow, downloaded a fresh copy,
> but its still the same, anyone else ever experienced that?
> i think its time for a new windows install...lol
> to many unexpected shutdowns is not good, windows hates that, downside of ocing i guess


Did it freeze when you ran the program or the benchmark within Cinebench ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Did it freeze when you ran the program or the benchmark within Cinebench ?


only at startup,
i restarted it about 5-6 times when i did some benches,
everytime the same thing, if i open cine, everything froze for 10-15 seconds,
then back to normal, cinebench starts up..now running daily oc again, and its still the same,
so cant be bad oc..

the 5.3ghz with 1.670V vcore stopped cine after a few seconds ..lol
prolly needs 1.7V, gonna wait till it gets colder again, -10C









and,
i was wondering, is blck ocing bad if you have a SSD ?
i ran 101blck for a few months, not sure if a minor blck oc can cause data corruption,
how about 103blck, dangerzone? i run 100blck now..


----------



## $ilent

Finally got my overclock sorted after hours of overclocking yesterday! I know this cpu can do 5ghz at 1.344v, but mine took 1.38v...I think its just my motherboard crapping out









Onto folding now!


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> only at startup,
> i restarted it about 5-6 times when i did some benches,
> everytime the same thing, if i open cine, everything froze for 10-15 seconds,
> then back to normal, cinebench starts up..now running daily oc again, and its still the same,
> so cant be bad oc..
> 
> the 5.3ghz with 1.670V vcore stopped cine after a few seconds ..lol
> prolly needs 1.7V, gonna wait till it gets colder again, -10C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and,
> i was wondering, is blck ocing bad if you have a SSD ?
> i ran 101blck for a few months, not sure if a minor blck oc can cause data corruption,
> how about 103blck, dangerzone? i run 100blck now..


I tried BCLK overclocking, but did not get over 103 without the system shutting down - There is probably alot more to it than just upping the BCLK but to be honest I switched to Memory overclocking and the plethora of timings there are (The Memory section on the UP7 is like watching the screens in "The Matrix").

Though, getting validation on the UP7 was easy as flicking a lightswitch - Just put it in LN2 mode (Small switch on MOBO) - Up the BCLK by 1 or 0.1 (OC Touch buttons) and switch the the LN2 mode off again - Validate and back into LN2 mode (LN2 mode forces the CPU down to 1600Mhz).

Could anyone shine some light on just exactly WHY someone would ever use BCLK ? Does the CPU and RAM not still require an increase in Vcore when increasing the BCLK ? Pros in BCLK overclocking ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Finally got my overclock sorted after hours of overclocking yesterday! I know this cpu can do 5ghz at 1.344v, but mine took 1.38v...I think its just my motherboard crapping out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Onto folding now!


nice work $ilent








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I tried BCLK overclocking, but did not get over 103 without the system shutting down - There is probably alot more to it than just upping the BCLK but to be honest I switched to Memory overclocking and the plethora of timings there are (The Memory section on the UP7 is like watching the screens in "The Matrix").
> 
> Though, getting validation on the UP7 was easy as flicking a lightswitch - Just put it in LN2 mode (Small switch on MOBO) - Up the BCLK by 1 or 0.1 (OC Touch buttons) and switch the the LN2 mode off again - Validate and back into LN2 mode (LN2 mode forces the CPU down to 1600Mhz).
> 
> Could anyone shine some light on just exactly WHY someone would ever use BCLK ? Does the CPU and RAM not still require an increase in Vcore when increasing the BCLK ? Pros in BCLK overclocking ?


yea, blck stopped for me at about 4.7ghz, 101.40 was max
at 4.6ghz 102 max ..

i tried running once at stock, and got upto 108 blck


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice work $ilent
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea, blck stopped for me at about 4.7ghz, 101.40 was max
> at 4.6ghz 102 max ..
> 
> i tried running once at stock, and got upto 108 blck


What type of cooling setup are you using here and whats the ambient room temp?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> What type of cooling setup are you using here and whats the ambient room temp?


Scythe Mugen 2 Rev. B
ambient 12-13C, my coolest core is always about 3C above ambient

i think thats what my mobo can do, the 108blck, without any tweaking,
i set 108 in the bios, but it shows 107.981

the 107blck was much closer , 107.003


i dont know how i can tweak blck more, never really looked into it,
read that with ivy, you dont oc with blck, but with multi...


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Only if my parents loved PCs as much as me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My dad does but my mom doesn't. *She doesn't really support it because she says it's basically a money black hole!*
> 
> I really want to do SLI but it looks hard on the MVG!


thats just all women in general.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Scythe Mugen 2 Rev. B
> ambient 12-13C, my coolest core is always about 3C above ambient
> 
> i think thats what my mobo can do, the 108blck, without any tweaking,
> i set 108 in the bios, but it shows 107.981
> 
> the 107blck was much closer , 107.003
> 
> 
> i dont know how i can tweak blck more, never really looked into it,
> read that with ivy, you dont oc with blck, but with multi...


well I just assume thats normal because the blck will directly relate to the vcore so to hit 191 blck you kinda have to change the vcore.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> well I just assume thats normal because the blck will directly relate to the vcore so to hit 191 blck you kinda have to change the vcore.


191blck? bet i need more vcore then ..lol

a member here said theres a "competition" with highest blck,
thats why i looked into it, i think Sin0822 has 115 blck and another 111blck,
so i thought, that cant be so hard, lets go ...nah...108 for me..lol
but im a noob compared to sin ..haha


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 191blck? bet i need more vcore then ..lol
> 
> a member here said theres a "competition" with highest blck,
> thats why i looked into it, i think Sin0822 has 115 blck and another 111blck,
> so i thought, that cant be so hard, lets go ...nah...108 for me..lol
> but im a noob compared to sin ..haha


Yea you just gotta know whats important in the voltages. Its also a combination to the chip and motherboard.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea you just gotta know whats important in the voltages. Its also a combination to the chip and motherboard.


i dont remember how my setting where, i reverted back to stock speed, maybe i left vcore on auto,
thats why i said, i didnt tweak anything,maybe if i have some more pointers, i will try again,
but the stress on other componenets on the mobo is big, with those kind of blck's,
i only see (high) blck oc used with ln/2 etc, for coldbug and coldboot i think, and to get higher oc's of couse ..lol

redid 3D mark this afternoon,

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5610020
went from 10716 to 10790, not bad for my daily oc








prolly need faster ram if i ever want to break that 11000 right..


----------



## lilchronic

heres mine 670 FTW








http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5552910
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5496897


----------



## Matt26LFC

Ok guys I finally delided my chip! I have no pics however as I hit the Die with the razor and thought I'd killed it so I was in no mood to take photos









I did however finish cleaning it up (had to test it) and popped her back in, using Phoyba HeGrease on both die and IHS. I have liquid Pro however I didn't want to waste it on potential dead chip.

Anyway, here's a screen shot of a 1hr Prime95 27.7 with AVX @ 5500MB Custom Blend test.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Ok guys I finally delided my chip! I have no pics however as I hit the Die with the razor and thought I'd killed it so I was in no mood to take photos
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did however finish cleaning it up (had to test it) and popped her back in, using Phoyba HeGrease on both die and IHS. I have liquid Pro however I didn't want to waste it on potential dead chip.
> 
> Anyway, here's a screen shot of a 1hr Prime95 27.7 with AVX @ 5500MB Custom Blend test.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


looks good to me, so it works?
did you check the die, any sign of damage?
the die is made of harder material then the pcb,
so its harder to damage, 1 nick on the pcb most of the time means trouble..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Up7 is right up there, the mvg & mve still hold more records, but have been around longer with more submissions.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, don't buy parts from Ebay, I can't trust the people on that site anymore. I've seen how some people treat their hardware and they are always just tossing it randomly!
> 
> How do you guys think SLI would work on the MVG? It's so hard to fit the D14 + a GPU...


With wc it would be easy, otherwise it's really cramped in there...I have one.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I tried BCLK overclocking, but did not get over 103 without the system shutting down - There is probably alot more to it than just upping the BCLK but to be honest I switched to Memory overclocking and the plethora of timings there are (The Memory section on the UP7 is like watching the screens in "The Matrix").
> 
> Though, getting validation on the UP7 was easy as flicking a lightswitch - Just put it in LN2 mode (Small switch on MOBO) - Up the BCLK by 1 or 0.1 (OC Touch buttons) and switch the the LN2 mode off again - Validate and back into LN2 mode (LN2 mode forces the CPU down to 1600Mhz).
> 
> Could anyone shine some light on just exactly WHY someone would ever use BCLK ? Does the CPU and RAM not still require an increase in Vcore when increasing the BCLK ? Pros in BCLK overclocking ?


BCLK is for extreme oc using ln2* and to push ram higher while at it. Not all ratios work good so sometimes you need to use bclk to get to an intermediate oc that will work.
With ln2 or Dry ice you can easily hit 110mhz bclk or more.

*Max multi is 63...hint.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 191blck? bet i need more vcore then ..lol
> 
> a member here said theres a "competition" with highest blck,
> thats why i looked into it, i think Sin0822 has 115 blck and another 111blck,
> so i thought, that cant be so hard, lets go ...nah...108 for me..lol
> but im a noob compared to sin ..haha


Again, subzero...and my MVG for instance has some settings to fiddle with to get the best bclk oc as possible, not sure other mobos has them. UP7 must have something similar though.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks good to me, so it works?
> did you check the die, any sign of damage?
> the die is made of harder material then the pcb,
> so its harder to damage, 1 nick on the pcb most of the time means trouble..


Yeah its working, when I caught it I was 99.9% sure I'd killed it! I was so disappointed

There is visible damage to it. Perhaps 2morrow if I break her down again (to put Cool Labs Liquid Pro on it) I'll see if I can take a good photo of it with my Girlfriends DSLR and post it here

But yeah, quite happy so far. Was hoping my core temperatures would be a bit closer together afterwards too, bugs me seeing upto a 10C difference lol


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Yeah its working, when I caught it I was 99.9% sure I'd killed it! I was so disappointed
> 
> There is visible damage to it. Perhaps 2morrow if I break her down again (to put Cool Labs Liquid Pro on it) I'll see if I can take a good photo of it with my Girlfriends DSLR and post it here
> 
> But yeah, quite happy so far. Was hoping my core temperatures would be a bit closer together afterwards too, bugs me seeing upto a 10C difference lol


Don't worry, I did the same thing. I barely nicked the PCB when I was delidding and mine is fine and working..

BTW everyone I've taken a break from messing with my CPU to mod some LEDs in my Switch 810 case. Currently soldering


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Yeah its working, when I caught it I was 99.9% sure I'd killed it! I was so disappointed
> 
> There is visible damage to it. Perhaps 2morrow if I break her down again (to put Cool Labs Liquid Pro on it) I'll see if I can take a good photo of it with my Girlfriends DSLR and post it here
> 
> But yeah, quite happy so far. Was hoping my core temperatures would be a bit closer together afterwards too, bugs me seeing upto a 10C difference lol


bet you are happy, glad it works








yea, if you use liquid pro, its its good applied etc, the temp difference will be less, and your temps will go down some more too,
pics would be great


----------



## Valgaur

Holy crap guys...... we moved 100 pages in under a week..... it's been slightly over 5 days since page 800..... Man we are hoppin in here and all these smart people!!!









Lets keep this up guys!


----------



## stickg1

I can't figure out how to get my RAM at 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T like I had on the ASUS board









I got it to be stable for several hours by going up one or two notches in every sub timing but it made my AIDA scores really bad, similar to what they were using 1866. So I guess I have to go and adjust those timings one by one until I find the one thats messing me up!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I can't figure out how to get my RAM at 2133MHz 10-10-9-24-1T like I had on the ASUS board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got it to be stable for several hours by going up one or two notches in every sub timing but it made my AIDA scores really bad, similar to what they were using 1866. So I guess I have to go and adjust those timings one by one until I find the one thats messing me up!


That's the way I normally go about it...unless you had a ROG board you could base yourself on any of the ram presets, and tweak it from there.
Go from XMP profile and change the clocks to 2133mhz, and change your timings to the following: cl9-10-10-28-2t with 1.7v for dram and 1.2v for vccio and vccsa.
See how that goes...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's the way I normally go about it...unless you had a ROG board you could base yourself on any of the ram presets, and tweak it from there.
> Go from XMP profile and change the clocks to 2133mhz, and change your timings to the following: cl9-10-10-28-2t with 1.7v for dram and 1.2v for vccio and vccsa.
> See how that goes...


Is 1.7v cool for 1.35v RAM? Seems kind of high. Or is 1.35v RAM the same as 1.5v RAM but just better binned?

I'll mess with it tomorrow seeing as how I dont have a GPU so I cant game anyway. Right now I'm drinkin some cold ones and chattin on Steam. Same name as my OCN name if any of the reg's wanna hit me up!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Is 1.7v cool for 1.35v RAM? Seems kind of high. Or is 1.35v RAM the same as 1.5v RAM but just better binned?
> 
> I'll mess with it tomorrow seeing as how I dont have a GPU so I cant game anyway. Right now I'm drinkin some cold ones and chattin on Steam. Same name as my OCN name if any of the reg's wanna hit me up!


1.35v ram is the same 1.5 and 1.65v ram used for faster kits, just binned for low volt operation. Much like a 3770k it can operate between the full range of vcores we're used to see, no big deal.








Also, if you plan on running ram rated for 1600mhz at 1.35v at 2133 or 2400mhz you gotta pump that vdimm bro...same thing as the cpu vcore








My steam name is my username aswell, but I have no gaming rig yet


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 1.35v ram is the same 1.5 and 1.65v ram used for faster kits, just binned for low volt operation. Much like a 3770k it can operate between the full range of vcores we're used to see, no big deal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My steam name is my username aswell, but I have no gaming rig yet


Okay, and its starting to look like its just a voltage issue because I was trying to run at 1.55v. I have 1866MHz 9-9-9-24-1T @ 1.5v running now with no issues.

I'll up the vCore in a few minutes and try again.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Okay, and its starting to look like its just a voltage issue because I was trying to run at 1.55v. I have 1866MHz 9-9-9-24-1T @ 1.5v running now with no issues.
> 
> I'll up the vCore in a few minutes and try again.


Yeah, pretty much, first thing to try is increasing vdimm till you get no errors in hci memtest/superpi 32m/IBT max memory. If you go really high and still get errors bump vccio and vccsa, though it's always good to isolate the cpu from the equation as well as the integrated memory controller...I run stock cpu with auto vcore and leave vccio and vccsa at 1.2v each, then test the ram oc.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> lilchronic wrote...heres mine 670 FTW


...Great results !









I'm running a pair of 670ies in SLI (Asus Direct CU ii)...what are you boost and mem clocks ? How are you cooling them (water or air) ?


----------



## Swag

Who wants to join the OCN Delidded Group?

This group will not replace the Delidded Ivy Bridge Club, this thread will remain the main place for us delidders to mingle and talk OT stuff! I just wanted something that will show that I am part of this group whenever someone clicks on my profile page.







And it gets the word out about delidding other than being in the Intel CPU thread.

http://www.overclock.net/groups/show/2206/ocn-delidded


----------



## FtW 420

Only a few pages to catch up on today, what happened?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Who wants to join the OCN Delidded Group?
> 
> This group will not replace the Delidded Ivy Bridge Club, this thread will remain the main place for us delidders to mingle and talk OT stuff! I just wanted something that will show that I am part of this group whenever someone clicks on my profile page.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And it gets the word out about delidding other than being in the Intel CPU thread.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/groups/show/2206/ocn-delidded


I still think there should be a disclaimer to save the golden chips...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Only a few pages to catch up on today, what happened?
> I still think there should be a disclaimer to save the golden chips...


Where and I'll put it somewhere

As per Request of the almighty FtW420. he wants everyoe to save their golden chips and give them directly to him free of charge.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Only a few pages to catch up on today, what happened?
> I still think there should be a disclaimer to save the golden chips...


I agree, cold and delidding don't seem to go along well. It might be a good idea to try using shin etsu or gelid extreme paste on die and freezing the chip to see if it works just as good as pre delidded.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Where and I'll put it somewhere
> 
> As per Request of the almighty FtW420. he wants everyoe to save their golden chips and give them directly to him free of charge.


xD

He has subzero air cooling outside, so it might be a good idea.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Where and I'll put it somewhere
> 
> As per Request of the almighty FtW420. he wants everyoe to save their golden chips and give them directly to him free of charge.


Awesome idea, should have thought of that myself!
Please make it so!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I agree, cold and delidding don't seem to go along well. It might be a good idea to try using shin etsu or gelid extreme paste on die and freezing the chip to see if it works just as good as pre delidded.
> xD
> 
> He has subzero air cooling outside, so it might be a good idea.


I'm just looking for 1 great one though, guess I just need to keep an eye on the thread so when someone posts the screen of a nice looking chip asking if they should delid I can badger them in PM









Better yet if NCIX would just grab the right chip off the shelf for me. One of the sales guys wondered a bit when he was putting it in the computer & saw my recent purchases, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, etc.
If i go in more often they might start binning to make me go away...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420* wrote..Better yet if NCIX would just grab the right chip off the shelf for me. One of the sales guys wondered a bit when he was putting it in the computer & saw my recent purchases, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, etc.
> If i go in more often they might start binning to make me go away....


...was at NCIX (Broadway) twice today, once to see about another upcoming build mobo for x79 (Asus ROG vs Gigabyte) and the other time to see if they still had I7 3770K from my series (Costa Rica 3229C series)...sadly, no







...they just had a few 'B" series

...but given your voracious appetite for 3770K's







, couldn't you just go to their main warehouse (possibly Richmond?) and ask them to line up all the "C" series ?


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Awesome idea, should have thought of that myself!
> Please make it so!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just looking for 1 great one though, guess I just need to keep an eye on the thread so when someone posts the screen of a nice looking chip asking if they should delid I can badger them in PM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Better yet if NCIX would just grab the right chip off the shelf for me. One of the sales guys wondered a bit when he was putting it in the computer & saw my recent purchases, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, etc.
> If i go in more often they might start binning to make me go away...


New chip from the Intel RE program. Batch 3229B.









51x 1.475v bios


45x 1.10v bios


50x 1.40v bios


----------



## Vi0lence

i thought the batch ect didnt matter on the ivy chips

i wish i could get in on some of these chips. mine is ok. but i want to try and find better.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i thought the batch ect didnt matter on the ivy chips
> 
> i wish i could get in on some of these chips. mine is ok. but i want to try and find better.


^ this is correct. I have tried getting batches where others have found good chips & fail, along with other batches. One of these days have to really bin & just get a bunch of the same batch & go through em all.
I've just been kinda going on random luck. I have bought 1 binned chip, & while it's good for some things, not so much for others (does good 4 core for 3d, but not as good for high clocks & loading all 8 threads).


----------



## Vi0lence

yea i can get my chip through benchs on water at 5ghz, over that is a no go. wont do it. i would like i chip i can hit 5.2ghz with, maybe a little higher. but not sure how many chips i would have to buy to find the damn thing.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> New chip from the Intel RE program. Batch 3229B.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 51x 1.475v bios
> 
> 
> 45x 1.10v bios
> 
> 
> 50x 1.40v bios


See that looks like a pretty good chip. My 3229C does the 4.5Ghz at 1.12V (loaded volts), but kinda craps out after 4.8 & needs big voltage bumps to 1.54V for 5Ghz

josephimports, what is the minimum that one needs to boot 5Ghz to desktop & finish something light load like superpi 32m?


----------



## Vi0lence

i need to dl superpi, my chip can boot in 5.0ghz fairly low. but idk why i cant get through 3dmark11 higher then 5.04ghz. even at 1.6v or so.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420* and josephimports...4.8, 4.9 and 5.0 load voltages, delid question


...earlier, I had run some loads (Aida64 System Stability test) and posted the results with Windows Resource Meter (see Spoilers below), along with temps

4.8 GHz at 100% 4 core / 8 thread load, CPUz = 1.312v
4.9 GHz at 100% 4 core / 8 thread load, CPUz = 1.328v
5.0 GHz at 100% 4 core / 8 thread load, CPUz = 1.376v


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I have some Coll.Liquid Pro and Ultra coming from Europe (NewEgg is out and NCIX does not carry it) in early February via a biz visit, and need to decide soon whether this particular chip would gain by de-lidding. Apart from the odd top-speed run (5210 in 5 GHz club table), I really spend most of the time at 4.8 Ghz, or 5 GHz for gaming, with temps under control.

What would you do ? De-lid ? I think I will but then stay at 4.8 / 5.0 other than a few fun runs ? Debating between a Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UP7 E-ATX tri-SLI for this 3770K chip vs X79 build to get ready for next gen 6/8 core Sandy's at 22nm

Thanks for your feedback


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> See that looks like a pretty good chip. My 3229C does the 4.5Ghz at 1.12V (loaded volts), but kinda craps out after 4.8 & needs big voltage bumps to 1.54V for 5Ghz
> 
> josephimports, what is the minimum that one needs to boot 5Ghz to desktop & finish something light load like superpi 32m?


Ill download and test superpi soon. This was a quick boot test at 1.3v.


----------



## captvizcenzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...earlier, I had run some loads (Aida64 System Stability test) and posted the results with Windows Resource Meter (see Spoilers below), along with temps
> 
> 4.8 GHz at 100% 4 core / 8 thread load, CPUz = 1.312v
> 4.9 GHz at 100% 4 core / 8 thread load, CPUz = 1.328v
> 5.0 GHz at 100% 4 core / 8 thread load, CPUz = 1.376v
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have some Coll.Liquid Pro and Ultra coming from Europe (NewEgg is out and NCIX does not carry it) in early February via a biz visit, and need to decide soon whether this particular chip would gain by de-lidding. Apart from the odd top-speed run (5210 in 5 GHz club table), I really spend most of the time at 4.8 Ghz, or 5 GHz for gaming, with temps under control.
> 
> What would you do ? De-lid ? I think I will but then stay at 4.8 / 5.0 other than a few fun runs ? Debating between a Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UP7 E-ATX tri-SLI for this 3770K chip vs X79 build to get ready for next gen 6/8 core Sandy's at 22nm
> 
> Thanks for your feedback


That's a very low voltage and very low temps for those clocks.


----------



## FtW 420

Delidding will drop the temps considerably, but most are delidding to make a chip run cooler with higher frequency like yours does with the lid.

An x79 board will allow you to upgrade the cpu when IB-E does drop, that is still a little while off though, that ones a hard call if you hate waiting.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420* wrote...
> An x79 board will allow you to upgrade the cpu when IB-E does drop, that is still a little while off though, that ones a hard call if you hate waiting.


...well, I am just trying to get to the bottom of *ONE* question: Will a current X79 / lg 2011 socket board (i.e. Asus ROG, Gigabyte) actually run the next gen 22nm 6 or possibly 8 core IB-E/SB-E ?

IF SO, I can start building a system up with a 3930k, then swap chips when the time comes...I'm just worried that Intel will pull a 'fast one' and say that you need a new X79 board (or an x89 etc) to make it really run well.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> Ill download and test superpi soon. This was a quick boot test at 1.3v.


so this was just a boot into windows with no load on it or tests?


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, I am just trying to get to the bottom of *ONE* question: Will a current X79 / lg 2011 socket board (i.e. Asus ROG, Gigabyte) actually run the next gen 22nm 6 or possibly 8 core IB-E/SB-E ?
> 
> IF SO, I can start building a system up with a 3930k, then swap chips when the time comes...I'm just worried that Intel will pull a 'fast one' and say that you need a new X79 board (or an x89 etc) to make it really run well.


im running a up7, tri sli and a 3770k and im keeping up with x79 stuff. i was in the same debate. delid ivy runs very well. i run 4.8ghz daily, delid with liquid pro inside and out @1.375v and my chip isnt the best. tri sli 580's and i can clock them up to 1040-1050 depending on temps.

im adding 2666mhz memory tomorrow. which you cannot go that high on a x79 board either. for the price of the 2011 chips ill stay with 1155 ivy. can still run 4 way sli, less power, faster mem speeds ect.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, I am just trying to get to the bottom of *ONE* question: Will a current X79 / lg 2011 socket board (i.e. Asus ROG, Gigabyte) actually run the next gen 22nm 6 or possibly 8 core IB-E/SB-E ?
> 
> IF SO, I can start building a system up with a 3930k, then swap chips when the time comes...I'm just worried that Intel will pull a 'fast one' and say that you need a new X79 board (or an x89 etc) to make it really run well.


IB-E is _supposed_ to work with current x79 boards, I haven't seen anything that says it is guaranteed to work it yet though. p67 did work for ivy after bios updates even though z77 were the new boards with it.
I expect it should work, but at the same time I'm sure they will release new boards with the new cpu & can't say what new features or changes those may bring.


----------



## ivanlabrie

P67 and z68 runs IB but not without issues...I expect the same for x79 and ib-e.


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> New chip from the Intel RE program. Batch 3229B.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 51x 1.475v bios
> 
> 
> 45x 1.10v bios
> 
> 
> 50x 1.40v bios


I would settle for 5GHz @ 1.40V for a safe 24/7 overclock!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420 and ivanlabrie*


...you're *so right* ! My first machine was a DX 4 / 66 / 100 with a - and I quote - 'future-proof







Vesa 2.1' video bus; then there was the socket to end all sockets - socket 370 (I still actually have one of those which has kept working running a firewall loooong after its usefulness in everything else had expired; not to mention AGP 2x, 4x - the list is long of 'future proof tech'...

...otherwise I would build up a real nice X79 w/ 3930k, watercooling, tri-SLIs and all the goodies, then when ib-e is out just drop it in - but I know better...re Intel's upgrade path


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Vi0lence wrote...for the price of the 2011 chips ill stay with 1155 ivy. can still run 4 way sli, less power, faster mem speeds ect


yup - and until I see some reviews of the new x79 IB-Es when they are actually out, I'd rather stick with 3770K also


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> *FtW 420* wrote..Better yet if NCIX would just grab the right chip off the shelf for me. One of the sales guys wondered a bit when he was putting it in the computer & saw my recent purchases, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, 3770k, etc.
> If i go in more often they might start binning to make me go away....
> 
> 
> 
> ...was at NCIX (Broadway) twice today, once to see about another upcoming build mobo for x79 (Asus ROG vs Gigabyte) and the other time to see if they still had I7 3770K from my series (Costa Rica 3229C series)...sadly, no
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...they just had a few 'B" series
> 
> ...but given your voracious appetite for 3770K's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , couldn't you just go to their main warehouse (possibly Richmond?) and ask them to line up all the "C" series ?
Click to expand...

Seriously come see me, I work down the street at Frontier PC. At least come by and say hello, maybe bring me a coffee


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Yeah its working, when I caught it I was 99.9% sure I'd killed it! I was so disappointed
> 
> There is visible damage to it. Perhaps 2morrow if I break her down again (to put Cool Labs Liquid Pro on it) I'll see if I can take a good photo of it with my Girlfriends DSLR and post it here
> 
> But yeah, quite happy so far. Was hoping my core temperatures would be a bit closer together afterwards too, bugs me seeing upto a 10C difference lol


wondering how its going ?


----------



## liamstears

OCN name: liamstears
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: 200MHz for daily clock (still trying to get higher clocks stable)
OC before delid: 4.4GHz - Restricted by temps
OC after delid: 4.6GHz daily - Very low temps
Temp drops: 20C!
CPU-Z validation of max OC: still trying to get higher clocks stable

Attached pic of delid and 12 hour prime at 4.6GHz

Would like to get 4.8 stable but think I've hit a wall at 4.6, tried both 4.7 and 4.8 but cant seem to get stable, have tried volts up to just over 1.4 so far...


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> OCN name: liamstears
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 200MHz for daily clock (still trying to get higher clocks stable)
> OC before delid: 4.4GHz - Restricted by temps
> OC after delid: 4.6GHz daily - Very low temps
> Temp drops: 20C!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: still trying to get higher clocks stable
> 
> Attached pic of delid and 12 hour prime at 4.6GHz
> 
> Would like to get 4.8 stable but think I've hit a wall at 4.6, tried both 4.7 and 4.8 but cant seem to get stable, have tried volts up to just over 1.4 so far...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You have definitely hit a wall, it will take to many volts to get stable past 1.34V. I have hit a wall at 1.28V, hopefully when I add a discrete graphics card things will change! Me like you have tried 1.42V at 4.8GHz and it seems that might be out of the question, so far it seems our chips are from the same family.

What is your CPU PLL voltage set at?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *dmanstasiu* wrote...come by and say hello, maybe bring me a coffee


...I may do that, though it is usually a work-related reason why I end up doing a quick in-and-out run to NCIX


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's the way I normally go about it...unless you had a ROG board you could base yourself on any of the ram presets, and tweak it from there.
> Go from XMP profile and change the clocks to 2133mhz, and change your timings to the following: cl9-10-10-28-2t with 1.7v for dram and 1.2v for vccio and vccsa.
> See how that goes...


I tried those settings and it still doesn't work. I gotta try to mess with the sub timings I guess.


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> You have definitely hit a wall, it will take to many volts to get stable past 1.34V. I have hit a wall at 1.28V, hopefully when I add a discrete graphics card things will change! Me like you have tried 1.42V at 4.8GHz and it seems that might be out of the question, so far it seems our chips are from the same family.
> 
> What is your CPU PLL voltage set at?


Its on auto I think so around 1.8, will reboot in 10 check and update this post

I wonder though if maybe its memory causing too much strain? I'm at 2400 @ 1.560 2x8gb 11-12-11-34-2t


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wondering how its going ?


Hey, last night I didn't do much more than what I'd already posted, I felt as though I'd dodged a big bullet when my Chip was actually working so I was happy and didn't wanna play anymore after that lol

Hopefully I'll do some this afternoon/evening but been a bit busy this morn, mum came over with her laptop, nuff said there lol

But yeah hopefully later on I'll have an update with a photo or two








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Its on auto I think so around 1.8, will reboot in 10 check and update this post
> 
> I wonder though if maybe its memory causing too much strain? I'm at 2400 @ 1.560 2x8gb 11-12-11-34-2t


I found that dropping my memory down helped in booting in to Windows, can't hurt to give it a try.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> OCN name: liamstears
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 200MHz for daily clock (still trying to get higher clocks stable)
> OC before delid: 4.4GHz - Restricted by temps
> OC after delid: 4.6GHz daily - Very low temps
> Temp drops: 20C!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: still trying to get higher clocks stable
> 
> Attached pic of delid and 12 hour prime at 4.6GHz
> 
> Would like to get 4.8 stable but think I've hit a wall at 4.6, tried both 4.7 and 4.8 but cant seem to get stable, have tried volts up to just over 1.4 so far...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


gratz liamstears, nice tempdrop








is that vcore 1.4V for the 4.8ghz?

i need about 1.420V vcore for 4.8ghz,
your vcore at 4.6ghz is already 0.040V higher what i need for 4,6ghz..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Hey, last night I didn't do much more than what I'd already posted, I felt as though I'd dodged a big bullet when my Chip was actually working so I was happy and didn't wanna play anymore after that lol
> 
> Hopefully I'll do some this afternoon/evening but been a bit busy this morn, mum came over with her laptop, nuff said there lol
> 
> But yeah hopefully later on I'll have an update with a photo or two


thanks for the update anyways, keep us posted








gl with your mums latop ..lol


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> gratz liamstears, nice tempdrop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that vcore 1.4V for the 4.8ghz?
> 
> i need about 1.420V vcore for 4.8ghz,
> your vcore at 4.6ghz is already 0.040V higher what i need for 4,6ghz..


Thanks for the info could help in getting somewhere

I can boot into windows at 4.8 with just over 1.4v but dies after 20 seconds of a stress test


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> Thanks for the info could help in getting somewhere
> 
> I can boot into windows at 4.8 with just over 1.4v but dies after 20 seconds of a stress test


saw you talk about cpu pll, did you check?
if its on auto, at least set it by hand, default 1.8V, it could help your oc if you lower it a bit,
ive used between 1.65 and 1.750V most of the time, some go down to 1.5V,

what Matt26LFC said, you could try lower the mhz on your ram,
to rule out problems caused by it, if your dome ocing your cpu,
you can always start upping it again, dont use xmp profile for now if you do








but looks like your chip is vcore hungry, mine is average..


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> saw you talk about cpu pll, did you check?
> if its on auto, at least set it by hand, default 1.8V, it could help your oc if you lower it a bit,
> ive used between 1.65 and 1.750V most of the time, some go down to 1.5V,
> 
> what Matt26LFC said, you could try lower the mhz on your ram,
> to rule out problems caused by it, if your dome ocing your cpu,
> you can always start upping it again, dont use xmp profile for now if you do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but looks like your chip is vcore hungry, mine is average..


I don't use XMP - Took me a while to find my stable 2400 at 1.560

Anyway pll was auto, tried lowering it and going up to 1.480 vcore and set memory down to 1600 and still its a no go. It does pass a couple runs of IBT but still its not near stable and I was hitting 90C

So I've made a decision, I'm not going to bother trying for 4.7 or 4.8 I'm just going to tweak my 4.6 OC best I can and stick with it. At least its a slightly better performing than my last proc the 2700k which I had at 4.5


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> I don't use XMP - Took me a while to find my stable 2400 at 1.560
> 
> Anyway pll was auto, tried lowering it and going up to 1.480 vcore and set memory down to 1600 and still its a no go. It does pass a couple runs of IBT but still its not near stable and I was hitting 90C
> 
> So I've made a decision, I'm not going to bother trying for 4.7 or 4.8 I'm just going to tweak my 4.6 OC best I can and stick with it. At least its a slightly better performing than my last proc the 2700k which I had at 4.5


still strange, but like i said, look like you have a vcore hungry chip,
most i see around here are still able to do 4.7-4.8ghz at least,
think you made the right desicion, optimize your 4.6ghz,
it is what it is with vcore, temps you can do something about with delidding, thats for sure


----------



## liamstears

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> still strange, but like i said, look like you have a vcore hungry chip,
> most i see around here are still able to do 4.7-4.8ghz at least,
> think you made the right desicion, optimize your 4.6ghz,
> it is what it is with vcore, temps you can do something about with delidding, thats for sure


Its ok it doesn't bother me not being able to go higher than 4.6, 4.6 is more than enough for me and what I use it for

The way I see it is thanks to my h80 on my 7950 and all the extra I've lost temp wise thanks to the coollabratory liquid pro (lost 20C on cpu, 12-14C on gpu) I have a high performing comp that's near silent, I can run anything I like games etc with all fans on the absolute minimum so its really really quiet

Overall I'm pleased :-D

EDIT: as for optimizing the 4.6 it looks like I've managed to drop vcore a notch so its maxes at 1.352v and highest core is 72C so a little better but it hasn't done 12hours yet ;-)


----------



## Vi0lence

those chips once you get over 4.6ghz they need a ton of vcore. my chip can do the following. so you can see the increments it went up on mine.

daily [email protected] 1.3v stable
4.8ghz @1.375v
[email protected] through 3dmark11
[email protected] through 3dmark11

once you get up to 5, the vore comes into play. i wont run mine through benchmarks any faster then 5.0ghz from now on. dont feel like dumping tons of vcore into it. plus my temps stay under 65c at 1.5v, if i go higher temps climb. but that seems to be the norm for these chips. some lower then others, but once you hit 5ghz, the vcore goes up in large increments


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> those chips once you get over 4.6ghz they need a ton of vcore. my chip can do the following. so you can see the increments it went up on mine.
> 
> daily [email protected] 1.3v stable
> 4.8ghz @1.375v
> [email protected] through 3dmark11
> [email protected] through 3dmark11
> 
> once you get up to 5, the vore comes into play. i wont run mine through benchmarks any faster then 5.0ghz from now on. dont feel like dumping tons of vcore into it. plus my temps stay under 65c at 1.5v, if i go higher temps climb. but that seems to be the norm for these chips. some lower then others, but once you hit 5ghz, the vcore goes up in large increments


that also depends on the chip you have, and where you hit max safe vcore, liamstears is already at his max with 4.7-4.8ghz
4.5ghz needs 1.235-1.2440
4.6ghz needs 1.275V
4.7 ghz needs 1.3V
4.8ghz needs 1.420V my max safe vcore
4.9ghz needs 1.510-1.520V vcore , thats my max

my 4.6 and 4.7ghz vcore are close, then i need a big jump to get to 4.8ghz


----------



## Vi0lence

ive had my chip up to 1.75v for validations, 1.6v through benchmarks and the chip never went over 70c. still works fine. its all preference. if your fine with staying at 1.5v thats a good safe goal that will run solid for a long time.

thats why im staying at 5.0ghz. dont feel like killing my chip on water. ill leave this chip as a daily chip and be done with it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> ive had my chip up to 1.75v for validations, 1.6v through benchmarks and the chip never went over 70c. still works fine. its all preference. if your fine with staying at 1.5v thats a good safe goal that will run solid for a long time.
> 
> thats why im staying at 5.0ghz. dont feel like killing my chip on water. ill leave this chip as a daily chip and be done with it.


i needed 1.750V vcore for my 5.4ghz oc in my sig,
and 5.5ghz needed 1.850V ..lol

but my mobo is limited at 1.850V, so i had the disable HT, and 2 cores to make it run,
so i only have the 5.4ghz in my sig ..lol









theres a difference between benching and running a vcore 24/7,
1.5V as max i wouldnt even do 24/7,
for me the "safe" max is more about 1.45V for 24/7 OC, if temps permit..


----------



## Vi0lence

yea i did 5.55ghz at 1.762v on water LOL. did it for validation only. didnt even run a single program except my tuner and cpu-z. but i was lucky. it was 4 cores 8 threads.

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2596941


----------



## Hokies83

Max safe is 1.55v 24/7 ive ran it for months with no issues.

But when i installed my water loop it now allows me to run the same 5.1ghz OC at 1.5v 24/7


----------



## VonDutch

i wouldnt have done all the crazy things, if i hadnt delidded mine,
now i can run 4.8ghz daily and never see temps above 50C, normal daily usage ..


----------



## chris-br

I cant get 4.8 without going over 1.53 vcore, so i'm not doing it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Max safe is 1.55v 24/7 ive ran it for months with no issues.
> 
> But when i installed my water loop it now allows me to run the same 5.1ghz OC at 1.5v 24/7


really..thats strange..thought that would only happen with extreme cooling


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> I cant get 4.8 without going over 1.53 vcore, so i'm not doing it.


the warmer the chip the more unstable it will be. delid may help this by bringing the temps down.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> the warmer the chip the more unstable it will be. delid may help this by bringing the temps down.


for sure, before delid, your limited with temps, after delid your limit is vcore

i can run 5.0ghz IBT with a simple air cooler now

84C hottest core, but im limited by my vcore..


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> the warmer the chip the more unstable it will be. delid may help this by bringing the temps down.


Temps are not an issue here.









Didnt you see my name on the list?? Or even my sig?


----------



## Vi0lence

if thats the case. that chip hates clocking.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *liamstears*
> 
> OCN name: liamstears
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 200MHz for daily clock (still trying to get higher clocks stable)
> OC before delid: 4.4GHz - Restricted by temps
> OC after delid: 4.6GHz daily - Very low temps
> Temp drops: 20C!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: still trying to get higher clocks stable
> 
> Attached pic of delid and 12 hour prime at 4.6GHz
> 
> Would like to get 4.8 stable but think I've hit a wall at 4.6, tried both 4.7 and 4.8 but cant seem to get stable, have tried volts up to just over 1.4 so far...


Your in!!! Slap that sig on man! and throw that 1.44 volts on the chip to try for 4.8


----------



## VonDutch

question,
could it be my 7970 is getting unstable at higher cpu oc's?

i cant change the voltage on it, and its set at 1.270-1.2750V,
i oced it from 1000/1375 to 1100/1500 mhz
i need 1.420V vcore for 4.8ghz to be stable, using 0.160V offset,
i upped ram voltage from 1.5V default to 1.6V..
was thinking, all that power under high load, maybe sometimes my gpu gets a bit less


----------



## lilchronic

i can get 5.1 @ 1.46v 5.2ghz reguires more than1.52v and i will not go that high my mobo goes up to 1.7v but anything after 1.52v the voltages are red lol that means danger!


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i can get 5.1 @ 1.46v 5.2ghz reguires more than1.52v and i will not go that high my mobo goes up to 1.7v but anything after 1.52v the voltages are red lol that means danger!


really nice. NOW GIMME THAT CHIP. lol


----------



## Vi0lence

i still want to find a chip that will do 5.2ghz at 1.55v. i need to find that chip. then i will be in good shape.


----------



## chronicfx

Are you guys absolutely sure about 1.5v on a 3570k lasting more than 3 years? Max temp it would see is about 57 degrees gaming.. Been cine benching and burning at 5ghz and 1.51v i am thinking about priming it but I don't have money to replace the chip for haswell so it will have to last until skylake at minimum.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Max safe is 1.55v 24/7 ive ran it for months with no issues.
> 
> But when i installed my water loop it now allows me to run the same 5.1ghz OC at 1.5v 24/7


Really on the fence about getting an ex240 xspc kit although my d14 is doing very well with intel burn test maxing at 77 degrees.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Are you guys absolutely sure about 1.5v on a 3570k lasting more than 3 years? Max temp it would see is about 57 degrees gaming.. Been cine benching and burning at 5ghz and 1.51v i am thinking about priming it but I don't have money to replace the chip for haswell so it will have to last until skylake at minimum.


noone can say that for sure of course, the longer ivy runs, the more data we have on how it keeps up,
3 years, yea think it will, will it be safe..

look at it like this, tjmax is 105C, would it run 3 years at 103C, prolly,
safe would be, 80-85C max

1.52V is max vcore for ivy, would it run 3 years at 1.5V , yea,
safe would be, 1.3-1.45V vcore max..with low temps,
and it will prolly run longer then the 3 years, without degradation..

i never had a sandy, but how many did degade running higher oc's and vcores,
ivy is more resilient they say..


----------



## Faelore

My baby is up and running just wondering where I can download or possibly if its already on my computer the program that tells me the temps of my cores so i can start to overclock this badboy


----------



## Vi0lence

real temp. techpower up has it

http://www.techpowerup.com/realtemp/


----------



## Valgaur

well well well. guess what the mail man dropped off!



Oh Hey there Franky lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> My baby is up and running just wondering where I can download or possibly if its already on my computer the program that tells me the temps of my cores so i can start to overclock this badboy


real temp
core temp
cpu-z

for temps, vid, vcore etc..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> well well well. guess what the mail man dropped off!
> 
> 
> 
> Oh Hey there Franky lol.


he looks good for a dead one..








welcome home Franky!


----------



## kgtuning

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> well well well. guess what the mail man dropped off!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh Hey there Franky lol.


Its back? or a new "Franky"?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kgtuning*
> 
> Its back? or a new "Franky"?


The dead Franky lol. Once I get my new chip gonna try one last time to raise him from the dead lol. come on Frankenstein you can do it!


----------



## Vi0lence

if i had another board id like to try and get my 2600k working. but i SERIOUSLY doubt hes coming back LOL.

i feel your pain man. i feel your pain.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The dead Franky lol. Once I get my new chip gonna try one last time to raise him from the dead lol. come on Frankenstein you can do it!


You can at least use Franky as a warning to the new chips. 'you overclock high with low voltage, or you end up like Franky here...'


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Max safe is 1.55v 24/7 ive ran it for months with no issues.
> 
> But when i installed my water loop it now allows me to run the same 5.1ghz OC at 1.5v 24/7


What would you say for someone who games 2 hours a night and sometimes a bit more on the weekends the rest is internet or sleep. Do you feel 1.55v will probably never be an issue? Using offset and turbo over locking. Wondering if moving from 4.9 @ 1.42v up to 5ghz with x.xx volts is worth it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You can at least use Franky as a warning to the new chips. 'you overclock high with low voltage, or you end up like Franky here...'


Thats what I'm gonna do now lol.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You can at least use Franky as a warning to the new chips. 'you overclock high with low voltage, or you end up like Franky here...'


he also can use that lid on the new chip, since is already lapped.







Is it lapped, right?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> he also can use that lid on the new chip, since is already lapped.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it lapped, right?


That was the plan AFAIK








Saves a ton of work lol

Hey Swag, looky here: (you wanted dual gpu and MVG)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> he also can use that lid on the new chip, since is already lapped.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it lapped, right?
> 
> 
> 
> That was the plan AFAIK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Saves a ton of work lol
> 
> Hey Swag, looky here: (you wanted dual gpu and MVG)
Click to expand...

Good, I see it fits. Now all I need to do is put some electrical tape on the NH-D14 fan brackets so it doesn't short out my new GPUs!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats what I'm gonna do now lol.


You pump 1.9v through your Ivy chip, you're gonna have a bad time...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Good, I see it fits. Now all I need to do is put some electrical tape on the NH-D14 fan brackets so it doesn't short out my new GPUs!


Just pmed you lol
I gotta do the same so I can mount my SA the way I wanted too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> You pump 1.9v through your Ivy chip, you're gonna have a bad time...


If you are below -120c you're gonna have a blast


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Good, I see it fits. Now all I need to do is put some electrical tape on the NH-D14 fan brackets so it doesn't short out my new GPUs!
> 
> 
> 
> Just pmed you lol
> I gotta do the same so I can mount my SA the way I wanted too.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> You pump 1.9v through your Ivy chip, you're gonna have a bad time...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If you are below -120c you're gonna have a blast
Click to expand...

I've been eyeing this 670 with a backplate but I don't think it'll fit in the MVG + D14 thing...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've been eyeing this 670 with a backplate but I don't think it'll fit in the MVG + D14 thing...


Nope, the original backplate won't fit. I was planning on cutting a sheet of acrylic and put it there, to isolate the backside of the pcb from the Silver Arrow I got.
But I will probably sell my 670 before I get my new 3770k anyway


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've been eyeing this 670 with a backplate but I don't think it'll fit in the MVG + D14 thing...
> 
> 
> 
> Nope, the original backplate won't fit. I was planning on cutting a sheet of acrylic and put it there, to isolate the backside of the pcb from the Silver Arrow I got.
> But I will probably sell my 670 before I get my new 3770k anyway
Click to expand...

Why are you selling your 3770k again? Also, so I have to use the electrical tape thing?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why are you selling your 3770k again? Also, so I have to use the electrical tape thing?


The 670 plus Silver Arrow is an EXTREMELY tight fit, I had to mount it with fans pointing up, otherwise it would touch the backside of the pcb.
I'm selling my gtx 670 cause I need monies, and I'm gonna get a next gen gpu and a monitor at the same time later on. I have a 1280x960 CRT atm, no need for a discrete gpu.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why are you selling your 3770k again? Also, so I have to use the electrical tape thing?
> 
> 
> 
> The 670 plus Silver Arrow is an EXTREMELY tight fit, I had to mount it with fans pointing up, otherwise it would touch the backside of the pcb.
> I'm selling my gtx 670 cause I need monies, and I'm gonna get a next gen gpu and a monitor at the same time later on. I have a 1280x960 CRT atm, no need for a discrete gpu.
Click to expand...

If the PCB and that metal bracket were touching, it'd be bad, so can't we put some electrical tape on the bracket so it doesn't touch the pcb?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> You pump 1.9v through your Ivy chip, you're gonna have a bad time...


did it more than once as well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> noone can say that for sure of course, the longer ivy runs, the more data we have on how it keeps up,
> 3 years, yea think it will, will it be safe..
> 
> look at it like this, tjmax is 105C, would it run 3 years at 103C, prolly,
> safe would be, 80-85C max
> 
> 1.52V is max vcore for ivy, would it run 3 years at 1.5V , yea,
> safe would be, 1.3-1.45V vcore max..with low temps,
> and it will prolly run longer then the 3 years, without degradation..
> 
> i never had a sandy, but how many did degade running higher oc's and vcores,
> ivy is more resilient they say..


1.52v is not the max Vcore for Ivy it is the max Vid range.


----------



## stickg1

If intel sent me a chip that had a VID of 1.52v I would hurt someone!


----------



## Vi0lence

in the spring im going to hunt down a good chip. mine is ok. but it can be better.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> in the spring im going to hunt down a good chip. mine is ok. but it can be better.


Just yell at it and the throws Moar volts at it


----------



## Vi0lence

i threw 1.75v to it and got 5.55 ghz. 1.8 killed my sandy chip. and i need this chip until i can get another. so until then, its on probation.


----------



## Swag

What are some sites that you pick out the PC parts you want and it shows the prices of multiple sites and the cheapest option?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What are some sites that you pick out the PC parts you want and it shows the prices of multiple sites and the cheapest option?


pcpartpicker.com


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What are some sites that you pick out the PC parts you want and it shows the prices of multiple sites and the cheapest option?
> 
> 
> 
> pcpartpicker.com
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot man!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks a lot man!


That fits your description, but check www.techbargains.com regularly and slickdeals.net aswell...


----------



## Swag

Some pre-game drinking for the big games tomorrow!







I can't believe GB lost to SF! NOOOOOOOOOOO!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Some pre-game drinking for the big games tomorrow!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't believe GB lost to SF! NOOOOOOOOOOO!


Ha! You like Mexican beer?
I'm more of an English beer guy meself...and an Irish whiskey drinker aswell.

I was bored as heck so I decided to remove my front dust filters, I felt they were too restrictive...the cm 690 II front mesh cover should be enough lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Some pre-game drinking for the big games tomorrow!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't believe GB lost to SF! NOOOOOOOOOOO!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ha! You like Mexican beer?
> I'm more of an English beer guy meself...and an Irish whiskey drinker aswell.
> 
> I was bored as heck so I decided to remove my front dust filters, I felt they were too restrictive...the cm 690 II front mesh cover should be enough lol
Click to expand...

Where there are any fans (going in), add dust filters, if there aren't they just restrict airflow.









I'm actually a tequila drinker.







I have about 8 bottles of reserved tequila for events like the Superbowl. I spent about $1000 on tequila alone, helps my parents love tequila as well.







I like Belgium beer and Mexican beer. They tend to be a bit sweeter or "wetter" if you want to get technical.







This beer is actually pretty good, I'd highly recommend it if you want a sweeter beer. Also, it is fairly pale so if you like the really dark type, then don't even try it as you won't like it. Another note, by English beer, do you mean stout?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> to *Valgaur, Swag and friends*


...just posted a memory timing / tweak question over at Benchmarks / Cinebench...I figure 'delidders' might also know a thing or two about the 'black art of memory timings' and can provide tips







before my next build (without 'the lid')







:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1160043/top-30-cinebench-r11-5-cpu-scores/290#post_19091014


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Where there are any fans (going in), add dust filters, if there aren't they just restrict airflow.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm actually a tequila drinker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have about 8 bottles of reserved tequila for events like the Superbowl. I spent about $1000 on tequila alone, helps my parents love tequila as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like Belgium beer and Mexican beer. They tend to be a bit sweeter or "wetter" if you want to get technical.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This beer is actually pretty good, I'd highly recommend it if you want a sweeter beer. Also, it is fairly pale so if you like the really dark type, then don't even try it as you won't like it. Another note, by English beer, do you mean stout?


I concur on the tequila part, my drink of choice neat. Beer wise I much prefer IPAs, craft breweries are amazing.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> to *Valgaur, Swag and friends*
> 
> 
> 
> ...just posted a memory timing / tweak question over at Benchmarks / Cinebench...I figure 'delidders' might also know a thing or two about the 'black art of memory timings' and can provide tips
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> before my next build (without 'the lid')
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1160043/top-30-cinebench-r11-5-cpu-scores/290#post_19091014
Click to expand...

Only thing I see is either upping the Vdimm or changing the 4th timing entry from 31 --> 30. My mobo seemed to hate anything with 31 and it would crash any RAM when set to 31 so those are the only ones I can suggest. If you really want to do some crazy benching, I'd recommend upping the voltage and putting the CPU under LN2! Best way really. I bought the OCN pot and have loved it since. I'm letting a few friends borrow it here and they just pay me around $5 every time they use it, no matter how long.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Where there are any fans (going in), add dust filters, if there aren't they just restrict airflow.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm actually a tequila drinker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have about 8 bottles of reserved tequila for events like the Superbowl. I spent about $1000 on tequila alone, helps my parents love tequila as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like Belgium beer and Mexican beer. They tend to be a bit sweeter or "wetter" if you want to get technical.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This beer is actually pretty good, I'd highly recommend it if you want a sweeter beer. Also, it is fairly pale so if you like the really dark type, then don't even try it as you won't like it. Another note, by English beer, do you mean stout?
> 
> 
> 
> I concur on the tequila part, my drink of choice neat. Beer wise I much prefer IPAs, craft breweries are amazing.
Click to expand...

Hmm, yea love tequila. If you ever have a chance to visit Mexico, they have great tequila moon shine there.







Amazing, like runs down perfectly and doesn't burn!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> megawatz, thanks for the reply. I think my dad is using some 2gb system or less right now for his work. It' s just family videos he does. Why not go over 8gb of ram? Or does he only need 8? And I think I'll probably go with an i5 3570k and just overclock it for him, im not sure he needs the power of a 3770k. It's not a big deal either way, I'll think about it though.
> 
> AS5 is as bad as stock pastes these days, and I'm pretty sure the stock paste used by intel under the IHS is better than AS5. It's over a decade old, it's horribly outdated. People got improvements using AS5 during delidding because reducing the gap by removing the glue is what drops temps, not replacing the paste.
> 
> AS5 is just some of the worst paste out there these days. It's so terribly dated. Problem is that it great 13 years ago, so people bought it, recommended it, and a vicious cycle continues because people generally get a single tube and that lasts them a lifetime of builds (or least 15+ years, ie 2-4 builds).
> 
> CLP/CLU would be a huge boost over AS5. I can't stress enough of how terrible AS5 is. Check out my review here of thermal pastes:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1346069/belials-heatsink-tim-comparison-and-reviews-hyper-212-h50-nh-d14-pk-1-pk-2-pk-3/0_100
> 
> I dont compare AS5, but I compare PK-1 to PK2/PK3. PK-1 is a bit dated too, but it generally is considered 1-5*C better than AS5 - a bit better, not much. In the tests I do, PK-1 gets blown away by a modern paste like PK-3. And with thermal pastes, a 1-2*C difference is considered extremely significant (its just paste after all), so the fact you'd see possibly 10*C difference in PK3 and AS5... i wouldn't be surprised in drops of over 15*C in CLU/CLP vs AS5.
> 
> TIM differences are also exagerrated under the IHS. What might be 'only' a 10*C+ difference that CLU/CLP has over AS5, would easily become 20*C+ when under the IHS.
> 
> It isn't so much that there's huge differences in pastes or CLU/CLP is so awesome (although it is, it's not a normal paste like PK3, Gelid GC extreme, NH-T1, Masscool, and other modern pastes that are at least 5-10*C better than as5), it's that as5 is junk.
> 
> It came out over 13 years ago. Think about how far along GPUs and CPUs have come in 13 years. If you don't want to drop $20 on CLU/CLP, buy an LED or something else you might need at frozencpu and use the 5.1% discount so you get free shipping and 5.1% off ship. You can also find a modern paste on Ebay in 1.5g quantity around $4 shipped, like PK-3, that is significantly better than AS5.
> 
> Let me put it this way - the difference between PK-3, and PK-1, a paste that is consistently ranked a couple degrees higher than AS5, is a larger temp drop than I got from going from a Hyper 212+ to Corsair H50 water cooling.
> 
> 
> 
> im not going into deep with your post, but will say one thing,
> 
> your " review" is testing with tim's on the IHS, not on die,
> the difference in temps when you use liquid pro/ultra on the IHS isnt that big, compared to other tim's,
> they are ALL, including AS5, within a 2-6C range from each other
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> check any review/test online, youll see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> day shift signing off ..G'night guys
Click to expand...

Again with the snide comments, that's okay. I make perfectly clear in the review that I'm testing on the IHS, not on die, and in the post I specifically state that on-die is different than IHS, and that most likely, differences in thermal paste performance would be exaggerated when put on-die (vs standard IHS).

I have checked many review sites. Not a single site shows a difference between Ultra vs Pro, but for the most part, very few sites have even reviewed either CLU/CLP.

They are all NOT within 2-6*C range of eachother, including AS5. You are most likely looking at outdated benches from years ago. 10 years ago, all pastes were within 2-6*C of AS5, on the IHS, yes. Today, all high end pastes are within 2-6*C, sure - Gelic GC Extreme, NH-T1, PK-3, Shin Etsu.

However, all of today's high end pastes, are likely going to be 5-10*C+ over pastes like AS5.

Not to mention, AS5 was a terrible paste 5 years ago when most benchmarks were done (i mean, most are around 5-2 years old it seems).

Those are also the results of my own test. I found, consistently, in my testing, that PK-3 was 5*C better than PK-1. Which, consistently, is about 2-3*C better than AS5. You can do the math to figure out the difference between PK-3 and AS5. You can also probably do the math and figure out how AS5 compares to CLU/CLP, which are not conventional thermal pastes, but more in the line of Phobya Hegrease, IC Diamond, and Indigo Extreme - they are thermal 'applicants' of a different nature. Most basically, they are not ceramic based, and they are significantly higher in price (considering about 99% of pastes are under $10 for 5g, $8 for 3.5g, and $5 for 1.5g), and generally much more difficult to apply.

My results are hardly authoritative, but I'd bet money that AS5 is at least 10*C worse than CLU/CLP, _especially_ when put on-die. Yes, 1-3*C is a huge deal of difference when it comes to thermal pastes. You'd be hard pressed to find 1-3*C difference in modern pastes - nh-t1, gelid, hegrease even, pk2, pk3, mx-4, even clu/clp are close within that range on IHS applications. But AS5 is such a terrible thermal paste, being over a decade old after all, that it's much more than 5*C worse than modern pastes. That's how terrible it is, that stock paste performs better than it these days.

As I said before - look at how much CPUs and GPUs have evolved in the last 13 years. TIM has evolved just as much.

This thread moves insanely fast, but to the person using AS5 - get a modern paste (it'd be a great chance for you to get CLU/CLP right now, but any modern paste would be fine, you can get something like 1.5g of pk3 or masscool for under $4 shipped on ebay). You'll have significant temp drops, a more dramati temp drop using a good thermal paste, than if you switch from a hyper 212 to a 120mm closed loop/mid range cooler, or even something like an H60 vs nh-d14. It's not that getting a thermal paste will provide a dramatic drop in temps, it's that switching from a terrible paste like AS5 to a half decent one, would provide a dramatic drop in temps.

I'd bet money that the stock intel paste on the IHS is better than AS5.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Swag* wrote: Only thing I see is either upping the Vdimm or changing the 4th timing entry from 31 --> 30.


Thanks







- I'll try the 31 >> 30 setting....as to LN2, I am afraid that once I tried it, I would want to run it ALL THE TIME


----------



## Buzzin92

Not too bothered about joining the club, but I will support ya!

I performed the sacrilege earlier on...










Will probably lap the IHS, and re-lap my Silver arrow in the next week or so. Gonna try and get some liquid pro too! Gotta keep my dedicated folder as cool as possible!









Results were an average of 15*c - 20*c drop all round, very impressed.


----------



## Hokies83

Got fans?!


































Still waiting on my 3 360 rads afew fans a Res and my MB back from rma..

How ever building in a Mountain Mods case = best build exp ive ever had...

I can roll the case where ever i want... Bedroom pc room Family room and build on it anywhere i want lol..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Got fans?!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still waiting on my 3 360 rads afew fans a Res and my MB back from rma..
> 
> How ever building in a Mountain Mods case = best build exp ive ever had...
> 
> I can roll the case where ever i want... Bedroom pc room Family room and build on it anywhere i want lol..


You disappoint me Hokies... you should've gotten these!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You disappoint me Hokies... you should've gotten these!


I build for silence...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You disappoint me Hokies... you should've gotten these!
> 
> 
> 
> I build for silence...
Click to expand...

Lol, imagine a case full of those... The noise! It'll be like 9 blow driers running constantly! I do agree, silence is better than 2C in temps. I do like the GTs best though. Best fans out I think.


----------



## Belial

cool pics!

(2nd build) At first I thought those CMs were blademasters. Then you made that silence comment and i was like wth. i was a bit confused


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I build for silence...


yea silence went out the window with mine. not a mountain mods case but i had mine built. its like 28 fans all together i beleive. lesser cfm fans have a hard time moving the air across the case. mine are like 98cfm and it stays cold all the time. you get used to the noise. or buy a good headset and you dont even hear it LOL


----------



## King4x4

Pfft....I love liquid cooling of any kind... makes the liquid as medium so what it's temperature difference rises between it and the air (it heats up) the radiator cooling increases so if your system is like 3'C delta you can downturn the fans to like 50% of their speeds and you gonna get an 8'C delta and everything is still being cooled nicely... I love water









By the ways guys... anybody with crossfire setups SHOULD GO TO ATI DRIVERS AND DOWNLOAD THE LEAKED 13.2 BETAS OH MY GOD THEY ARE AWESOME!

Caps intended to prove a point.


----------



## megawatz

I bought AS5 based on recommendations. I had specified that I was getting CLP and moving to a water cooling system eventually. Thanks for the (kinda) facts.

On the other hand, I'm folding at a max of 66c @ 100% load.

EDIT: Also feel that you have to give AS5 time. It has a burn-in period of 200hrs if idled for that long. Under stress, it's going to be lower of a number. So, giving it a few days to see what temps are like then will help me determine what kind of drop I can see. and right now, I can see around a 20c drop. Used to fold/Prime95 at max 87c now I'm folding at max 66c.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...just posted a memory timing / tweak question over at Benchmarks / Cinebench...I figure 'delidders' might also know a thing or two about the 'black art of memory timings' and can provide tips
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> before my next build (without 'the lid')
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1160043/top-30-cinebench-r11-5-cpu-scores/290#post_19091014


I replied in there before looking here.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You disappoint me Hokies... you should've gotten these!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, imagine a case full of those... The noise! It'll be like 9 blow driers running constantly! I do agree, silence is better than 2C in temps. I do like the GTs best though. Best fans out I think.


The deltas are great, they can drown out the sound of annoying roomates, & the TV, the stereo, people at the door, etc.

Case is on wheels too, it would be cool to see how fast it goes across the floor. With 9 of them in that panel his case would probably 0 -90 faster than my car.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...just posted a memory timing / tweak question over at Benchmarks / Cinebench...I figure 'delidders' might also know a thing or two about the 'black art of memory timings' and can provide tips
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> before my next build (without 'the lid')
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1160043/top-30-cinebench-r11-5-cpu-scores/290#post_19091014
> 
> 
> 
> I replied in there before looking here.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You disappoint me Hokies... you should've gotten these!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, imagine a case full of those... The noise! It'll be like 9 blow driers running constantly! I do agree, silence is better than 2C in temps. I do like the GTs best though. Best fans out I think.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The deltas are great, they can drown out the sound of annoying roomates, & the TV, the stereo, people at the door, etc.
> 
> Case is on wheels too, it would be cool to see how fast it goes across the floor. With 9 of them in that panel his case would probably 0 -90 faster than my car.
Click to expand...

Wanted to rep you for that last part.







Just have a PC case race every other week. Make it look like your case it extremely heavy and no one bets on it and bets on the turtle or something. The whip out with those Deltas and you will win all their money!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Are you guys absolutely sure about 1.5v on a 3570k lasting more than 3 years? Max temp it would see is about 57 degrees gaming.. Been cine benching and burning at 5ghz and 1.51v i am thinking about priming it but I don't have money to replace the chip for haswell so it will have to last until skylake at minimum.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> noone can say that for sure of course, the longer ivy runs, the more data we have on how it keeps up,
> 3 years, yea think it will, will it be safe..
> 
> look at it like this, tjmax is 105C, would it run 3 years at 103C, prolly,
> safe would be, 80-85C max
> 
> 1.52V is max vcore for ivy, would it run 3 years at 1.5V , yea,
> safe would be, 1.3-1.45V vcore max..with low temps,
> and it will prolly run longer then the 3 years, without degradation..
> 
> i never had a sandy, but how many did degrade running higher oc's and vcores,
> ivy is more resilient they say..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.52v is not the max Vcore for Ivy it is the max Vid range.


i know that better then anyone hokies







, i used the 1.52V vcore max as example,
but i think its reasonable to use, and your friend Sin0822 does too,

i quote from Sin0822 guide,

On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm)
*it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*. When overclocking on air the only two voltages you should need to touch on an Ivy Bridge setup are the Vcore (which you increase) and the CPU PLL( which can be decreased to help temperatures). You should not proceed to just apply the maximum voltage for the vcore, vtt, or system agent as you will heavily increase the temperature so much so that the CPU will throttle and can be damaged. Also if you start off with a higher temperature it is very hard to test stability, as you will probably be more unstable than if you used a lower VCore.
end quote

another remark from a member here on ocn, that tried to help me answer the question about max vcore for ivy,
instead of only saying, youre wrong, proof it etc...

"I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was _considered_
the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
for consumer usage. *LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
should operate in a 24/7 environment,* and that is obviously temperature permitting."


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i know that better then anyone hokies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , i used the 1.52V vcore max as example,
> but i think its reasonable to use, and your friend Sin0822 does too,
> 
> i quote from Sin0822 guide,
> 
> On Air/Water: Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup, many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge, however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm)
> *it is max 1.52v here because of the SVID max*. When overclocking on air the only two voltages you should need to touch on an Ivy Bridge setup are the Vcore (which you increase) and the CPU PLL( which can be decreased to help temperatures). You should not proceed to just apply the maximum voltage for the vcore, vtt, or system agent as you will heavily increase the temperature so much so that the CPU will throttle and can be damaged. Also if you start off with a higher temperature it is very hard to test stability, as you will probably be more unstable than if you used a lower VCore.
> end quote
> 
> another remark from a member here on ocn, that tried to help me answer the question about max vcore for ivy,
> instead of only saying, youre wrong, proof it etc...
> 
> "I know for prior generations, the maximum allowable VID from the factory was _considered_
> the maximum voltage for the processor. Not that that max VID was ever really spotted in the wild
> for consumer usage. *LGA775 was max of 1.45V VID, and that was widely considered the maximum you
> should operate in a 24/7 environment,* and that is obviously temperature permitting."


His max is 1.55v quit being a soft core user and quit suggesting what is not true to users.

He said do not pass 1.6v on Air / Water making 1.55v plenty in the safe Zone.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Again with the snide comments, that's okay. I make perfectly clear in the review that I'm testing on the IHS, not on die, and in the post I specifically state that on-die is different than IHS, and that most likely, differences in thermal paste performance would be exaggerated when put on-die (vs standard IHS).
> 
> I have checked many review sites. Not a single site shows a difference between Ultra vs Pro, but for the most part, very few sites have even reviewed either CLU/CLP.
> 
> *They are all NOT within 2-6*C range of eachother, including AS5.* You are most likely looking at outdated benches from years ago. 10 years ago,
> *all pastes were within 2-6*C of AS5, on the IHS, yes.* Today, all high end pastes are within 2-6*C, sure - Gelic GC Extreme, NH-T1, PK-3, Shin Etsu.
> 
> However, all of today's high end pastes, are likely going to be 5-10*C+ over pastes like AS5.
> 
> Not to mention, AS5 was a terrible paste 5 years ago when most benchmarks were done (i mean, most are around 5-2 years old it seems).
> 
> Those are also the results of my own test. I found, consistently, in my testing, that PK-3 was 5*C better than PK-1. Which, consistently, is about 2-3*C better than AS5. You can do the math to figure out the difference between PK-3 and AS5. You can also probably do the math and figure out how AS5 compares to CLU/CLP, which are not conventional thermal pastes, but more in the line of Phobya Hegrease, IC Diamond, and Indigo Extreme - they are thermal 'applicants' of a different nature. Most basically, they are not ceramic based, and they are significantly higher in price (considering about 99% of pastes are under $10 for 5g, $8 for 3.5g, and $5 for 1.5g), and generally much more difficult to apply.
> 
> My results are hardly authoritative, *but I'd bet money that AS5 is at least 10*C worse than CLU/CLP, especially when put on-die.* Yes, 1-3*C is a huge deal of difference when it comes to thermal pastes. You'd be hard pressed to find 1-3*C difference in modern pastes - nh-t1, gelid, hegrease even, pk2, pk3, mx-4, even clu/clp are close within that range on IHS applications. But AS5 is such a terrible thermal paste, being over a decade old after all, that it's much more than 5*C worse than modern pastes. That's how terrible it is, that stock paste performs better than it these days.
> 
> As I said before - look at how much CPUs and GPUs have evolved in the last 13 years. TIM has evolved just as much.
> 
> This thread moves insanely fast, but to the person using AS5 - get a modern paste (it'd be a great chance for you to get CLU/CLP right now, but any modern paste would be fine, you can get something like 1.5g of pk3 or masscool for under $4 shipped on ebay). You'll have significant temp drops, a more dramati temp drop using a good thermal paste, than if you switch from a hyper 212 to a 120mm closed loop/mid range cooler, or even something like an H60 vs nh-d14. It's not that getting a thermal paste will provide a dramatic drop in temps, it's that switching from a terrible paste like AS5 to a half decent one, would provide a dramatic drop in temps.
> 
> I'd bet money that the stock intel paste on the IHS is better than AS5.


snide..right, not sure what it means, but how can i even start to respond to a post that has this in only 1 alinea,
besides the as5 reviews are outdated, as you think, it isnt a bad tim , as you make it out to be,
and you havent tested it in your own review, you only say its bad, its outdated, thats all, your own opinion,

you bet money, yea..but its the same thing i already say a long time if we talk about what tim to use on the die,
i know the difference from experience, like others here do too..

using AS5 on the die


using Liquid Pro on die


25C temp difference,
liquid pro beats any other tim, when used on the die,
the difference between ultra and pro arent that big, even tho theres a (big) difference in w/mk,
of which i think, there a kinda of a upperlimit with w/mk used on die,
pro's w/mk is 82w/mk, but i dont think a 150w/mk tim will give double the temp drop if compared, and if there was a tim like that,
from 30-40 w/mk and higher, the temp differences will get less..

intels tim has a lower w/mk then as5, i went to trouble once to find out what the w/mk was on intels tim,
if i remember right, it has about 2-3w/mk, artic silver 5 has a 8.7 w/m.k , which is not bad at all


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> His max is 1.55v quit being a soft core user and quit suggesting what is not true to users.
> 
> He said do not pass 1.6v on Air / Water making 1.55v plenty in the safe Zone.


dang, its a, lets pick on VonDutch day ...lol

you are all right, AS5 is bad, and 1.52V max vcore, is not correct either,
i leave it to others to decide whats best for them, and what the limits are,
i will keep on using the numbers i gathered so far tho,
if asked whats the best tim to use on die, or what is the max "safe" vcore for ivy, 1.3-1.45V vcore for me,
i think 95% of the users will agree.. for people personally, you can use 1.55V 24/7, upto you








theres a difference between Max vcore, and recommended or safe vcore..

so, hokies, how did you get that 1.55V vcore?
_pls provide any kind of other proof_..
or are you also only using/quoting the number Sin0822 suggests in his graph?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Pfft....I love liquid cooling of any kind... makes the liquid as medium so what it's temperature difference rises between it and the air (it heats up) the radiator cooling increases so if your system is like 3'C delta you can downturn the fans to like 50% of their speeds and you gonna get an 8'C delta and everything is still being cooled nicely... I love water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By the ways guys... anybody with crossfire setups SHOULD GO TO ATI DRIVERS AND DOWNLOAD THE LEAKED 13.2 BETAS OH MY GOD THEY ARE AWESOME!
> 
> Caps intended to prove a point.


yea, i saw those somewhere yesterday. you running them now ?
whats better in those?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Again with the snide comments, that's okay. I make perfectly clear in the review that I'm testing on the IHS, not on die, and in the post I specifically state that on-die is different than IHS, and that most likely, differences in thermal paste performance would be exaggerated when put on-die (vs standard IHS).
> 
> I have checked many review sites. Not a single site shows a difference between Ultra vs Pro, but for the most part, very few sites have even reviewed either CLU/CLP.
> 
> *They are all NOT within 2-6*C range of eachother, including AS5.* You are most likely looking at outdated benches from years ago. 10 years ago,
> *all pastes were within 2-6*C of AS5, on the IHS, yes.* Today, all high end pastes are within 2-6*C, sure - Gelic GC Extreme, NH-T1, PK-3, Shin Etsu.
> 
> However, all of today's high end pastes, are likely going to be 5-10*C+ over pastes like AS5.
> 
> Not to mention, AS5 was a terrible paste 5 years ago when most benchmarks were done (i mean, most are around 5-2 years old it seems).
> 
> Those are also the results of my own test. I found, consistently, in my testing, that PK-3 was 5*C better than PK-1. Which, consistently, is about 2-3*C better than AS5. You can do the math to figure out the difference between PK-3 and AS5. You can also probably do the math and figure out how AS5 compares to CLU/CLP, which are not conventional thermal pastes, but more in the line of Phobya Hegrease, IC Diamond, and Indigo Extreme - they are thermal 'applicants' of a different nature. Most basically, they are not ceramic based, and they are significantly higher in price (considering about 99% of pastes are under $10 for 5g, $8 for 3.5g, and $5 for 1.5g), and generally much more difficult to apply.
> 
> My results are hardly authoritative, *but I'd bet money that AS5 is at least 10*C worse than CLU/CLP, especially when put on-die.* Yes, 1-3*C is a huge deal of difference when it comes to thermal pastes. You'd be hard pressed to find 1-3*C difference in modern pastes - nh-t1, gelid, hegrease even, pk2, pk3, mx-4, even clu/clp are close within that range on IHS applications. But AS5 is such a terrible thermal paste, being over a decade old after all, that it's much more than 5*C worse than modern pastes. That's how terrible it is, that stock paste performs better than it these days.
> 
> As I said before - look at how much CPUs and GPUs have evolved in the last 13 years. TIM has evolved just as much.
> 
> This thread moves insanely fast, but to the person using AS5 - get a modern paste (it'd be a great chance for you to get CLU/CLP right now, but any modern paste would be fine, you can get something like 1.5g of pk3 or masscool for under $4 shipped on ebay). You'll have significant temp drops, a more dramati temp drop using a good thermal paste, than if you switch from a hyper 212 to a 120mm closed loop/mid range cooler, or even something like an H60 vs nh-d14. It's not that getting a thermal paste will provide a dramatic drop in temps, it's that switching from a terrible paste like AS5 to a half decent one, would provide a dramatic drop in temps.
> 
> I'd bet money that the stock intel paste on the IHS is better than AS5.
> 
> 
> 
> snide..right, not sure what it means, but how can i even start to respond to a post that has this in only 1 alinea,
> besides the as5 reviews are outdated, as you think, it isnt a bad tim , as you make it out to be,
> and you havent tested it in your own review, you only say its bad, its outdated, thats all, your own opinion,
> 
> you bet money, yea..but its the same thing i already say a long time if we talk about what tim to use on the die,
> i know the difference from experience, like others here do too..
> 
> using AS5 on the die
> 
> 
> using Liquid Pro on die
> 
> 
> 25C temp difference,
> liquid pro beats any other tim, when used on the die,
> the difference between ultra and pro arent that big, even tho theres a (big) difference in w/mk,
> of which i think, there a kinda of a upperlimit with w/mk used on die,
> pro's w/mk is 82w/mk, but i dont think a 150w/mk tim will give double the temp drop if compared, and if there was a tim like that,
> from 30-40 w/mk and higher, the temp differences will get less..
> 
> intels tim has a lower w/mk then as5, i went to trouble once to find out what the w/mk was on intels tim,
> if i remember right, it has about 2-3w/mk, artic silver 5 has a 8.7 w/m.k , which is not bad at all
Click to expand...

RIght... we're in agreement dude. CLU/CLP will be significantly better than AS5, especially on-die.

My review was only of PK1/PK2/PK3, but given the wealth of (outdated) benches done out there, like Skinnee's, I think it's fair to extrapolate that given PK-1 is ~1-4*C better than AS5 (as you pointed out, a huge difference when it comes to TIMs), and PK-3 is 5*C+ getter than PK-1, that CLU/CLP 5-10*C+ over AS5, especially on-die when TIM differences become exaggerated.

It's pretty commonly cited that PK-1 is a degree or few ahead of AS5, but nowadays you have a handful of ceramique pastes significantly ahead of PK-1. Given how 'bad' even PK-1 is compared to a modern paste like PK-3, it's not an unfair judgement to say AS5 is simply a terrible paste nowadays.

And I do have experience with AS5, actually. I just didn't cite it in the review I did. The tests I did in my review were remounted at least 3+ times each, but for the sake of integrity, I stated I only did them once, with a 2*C spread. I believe the results are accurate within a degree (I'd remount the same paste and get the exact same results, and then try a different paste, and get that same 2*C, or 5*C, or whatever, difference, very consistently, quite surprising actually since spread method can be a big factor but the conclusion I drew was that as long as you use around the right amount, you are good, and you don't spread it, and that it's very hard to use too little paste). I only mounted AS5 once, and it was a small bit someone used for me.

CLU/CLP isn't a ceramique based paste either, it's more in the league of indigo extreme or ic diamond than pk-3, as5, mx-4, etc, ie extremely expensive. It's $22+ for 1.5g, which is less than $5 for any standard paste.

Unless someone tests them, it would be pure conjecture to say one is better than the other. But it's pretty obvious to say that a 13 year old tim is horrible these days. No one says a pentium4 is a good cpu anymore. It may have been good at the time, but not anymore.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dang, its a, lets pick on VonDutch day ...lol
> 
> you are all right, AS5 is bad, and 1.52V max vcore, is not correct either,
> i leave it to others to decide whats best for them, and what the limits are,
> i will keep on using the numbers i gathered so far tho,
> if asked whats the best tim to use on die, or what is the max "safe" vcore for ivy, 1.3-1.45V vcore for me,
> i think 95% of the users will agree.. for people personally, you can use 1.55V 24/7, upto you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> theres a difference between Max vcore, and recommended or safe vcore..
> 
> so, hokies, how did you get that 1.55V vcore?
> _pls provide any kind of other proof_..
> or are you also only using/quoting the number Sin0822 suggests in his graph?


You have no proof.

Somebody who runs a 1.8v to get a cpu screenie scared to run Vcore kinda seems dumb to me.

Proof nobody has reported degrading yet. And i been around ALOT longer then you







been doing this a LONG time


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You have no proof.
> 
> Somebody who runs a 1.8v to get a cpu screenie scared to run Vcore kinda seems dumb to me.
> 
> Proof nobody has reported degrading yet. And i been around ALOT longer then you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> been doing this a LONG time


so, because your around longer then me, you are right?
maybe cause im new, i have other insight hehe









this is exactly what i say, you have no proof,. and i have no real proof,
im using numbers of people who know their stuff, who did testing etc,
i know im a noob compared to others here..

youre are right tho, about the degradation part, noone can say for sure,
ivy hasnt been running that long, but that i mentioned also in earlier posts








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> *RIght... we're in agreement dude*. CLU/CLP will be significantly better than AS5, especially on-die.
> 
> My review was only of PK1/PK2/PK3, but given the wealth of (outdated) benches done out there, like Skinnee's, I think it's fair to extrapolate that given PK-1 is ~1-4*C better than AS5 (as you pointed out, a huge difference when it comes to TIMs), and PK-3 is 5*C+ getter than PK-1, that CLU/CLP 5-10*C+ over AS5, especially on-die when TIM differences become exaggerated.
> 
> It's pretty commonly cited that PK-1 is a degree or few ahead of AS5, but nowadays you have a handful of ceramique pastes significantly ahead of PK-1. Given how 'bad' even PK-1 is compared to a modern paste like PK-3, it's not an unfair judgement to say AS5 is simply a terrible paste nowadays.
> 
> And I do have experience with AS5, actually. I just didn't cite it in the review I did. The tests I did in my review were remounted at least 3+ times each, but for the sake of integrity, I stated I only did them once, with a 2*C spread. I believe the results are accurate within a degree (I'd remount the same paste and get the exact same results, and then try a different paste, and get that same 2*C, or 5*C, or whatever, difference, very consistently, quite surprising actually since spread method can be a big factor but the conclusion I drew was that as long as you use around the right amount, you are good, and you don't spread it, and that it's very hard to use too little paste). I only mounted AS5 once, and it was a small bit someone used for me.
> 
> CLU/CLP isn't a ceramique based paste either, it's more in the league of indigo extreme or ic diamond than pk-3, as5, mx-4, etc, ie extremely expensive. It's $22+ for 1.5g, which is less than $5 for any standard paste.
> 
> Unless someone tests them, it would be pure conjecture to say one is better than the other. But it's pretty obvious to say that a 13 year old tim is horrible these days. No one says a pentium4 is a good cpu anymore. It may have been good at the time, but not anymore.


i thought that day would never come ...LOL
thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so, because your around longer then me, you are right?
> maybe cause im new, i have other insight hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this is exactly what i say, you have no proof,. and i have no real proof,
> im using numbers of people who know their stuff, who did testing etc,
> i know im a noob compared to others here..
> 
> youre are right tho, about the degradation part, noone can say for sure,
> ivy hasnt been running that long, but that i mentioned also in earlier posts
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i thought that day would never come ...LOL
> thanks


Im using numbers of Sin and my Own 18 years of Exp And the 8 forums im a member of with zero reports of degrading.

Your 24/7 OC i see no point of de lidding.

I do not have to copy paste everything and post it in this thread 500 times to prove what i already know.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im using numbers of Sin and my Own 18 years of Exp And the 8 forums im a member of with zero reports of degrading.
> 
> Your 24/7 OC i see no point of de lidding.
> 
> I do not have to copy paste everything and post it in this thread 500 times to prove what i already know.


my daily 4.8ghz at 1.420V vcore isnt worth delidding my chip for?

24H prime stable, hottest cores 76C

i couldnt even run 4.5ghz before delid.._thats_ why i delidded..
i still dont see what the difference in years experience has to do with anything regarding max vcore, and safe max vcore








its your word, where you claim, "i run my ivy at 1.,55V vcore for months" and using 1 man's graph to be the whole truth..
against my word, saying, _safe vcore_ for ivy would be the 1.3-1.45V, _max vcore_ 1.52V vcore on air/water,
using the same graph in Sin0822 guide..and what others _consider_ to be the max vcore, in regard to the VID range,
sin states that too, and the intel data sheets say/show the same thing


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my 4.8ghz at 1.420V vcore isnt worth delidding my chip for?,
> 
> 24H prime stable, hottest cores 76C
> 
> i couldnt even run 4.5ghz before delid.._thats_ why i delidded..
> i still dont see what the difference in years experience has to do with anything regarding max vcore, and safe max vcore
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its your word, where you claim, "i run my ivy at 1.,55V vcore for months" and using 1 man's graph to be the whole truth..
> against my word, saying, _safe vcore_ for ivy would be the 1.3-1.45V, _max vcore_ 1.52V vcore on air/water,
> using the same graph in Sin0822 guide..and what others _consider_ to be the max vcore, in regard to the VID range,
> sin states that too, and the intel data sheets say/show the same thing


Jesus dude quit with your copy pastes of somebody elses info..

You do not know jack and squat about V core.

Keep on posting that Vid range crap is just making you look dumb bro for real.

I suggest you go to Xtreme Systems or Anandtech and learn a little.. posting that stuff i just chuckle at you.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Jesus dude quit with your copy pastes of somebody elses info..
> 
> You do not know jack and squat about V core.
> 
> Keep on posting that Vid range crap is just making you look dumb bro for real.
> 
> I suggest you go to Xtreme ZSystems or Anandtech and learn a little.. posting that stuff i just chuckle at you.


well, sorry for being dumb then,
i shut it now....


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i saw those somewhere yesterday. you running them now ?
> whats better in those?


Gameplay is very smooth on most of the games I play (BF3 and Far Cry 3 <== This one night and day difference) and I gained another 50mhz on my OCs.

Not to mention that trifire is going to +90% in BF3.

In addition game profiles got an update in 13.2 when compared to 13.1:

3dMark Vantage (cfx)
Battle Forge (cfx)
Aliens Vs Predator (cfx)
Lost Planet 2 (cfx)
F1 2012 (cfx)
3DMark 11 (cfx)
Crysis 2 (cfx)
Battlefield 3 (cfx)
Dirt Showdown (cfx)
Crysis 3 (unreleased)
Medal of Honor: Warfighter (cfx)
Tomb Raider (unreleased)
Nexuiz (cfx)
Blacklight: Retribution (cfx)
FarCry 3 (single card)
Skyrim (cfx & single card)
GuildWars 2 (cfx & single card)
Borderlands 2 (cfx & single card)
Rise of the Triad (unreleased)


----------



## Swag

Sorry if this will sound like a "mod" way or anything like that but can we stop it right there? I don't want this tense feeling belonging in this club. I know it is a quarrel that 2 people can go on and on about saying one thing or the other but please limit it.

I'm saying this purely to save this club from looking like PoS that doesn't deserve any recognition or worse, recognized as a horrible club. I won't be picking sides on this fight either.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Jesus dude quit with your copy pastes of somebody elses info..
> 
> You do not know jack and squat about V core.
> 
> Keep on posting that Vid range crap is just making you look dumb bro for real.
> 
> I suggest you go to Xtreme Systems or Anandtech and learn a little.. posting that stuff i just chuckle at you.


Not really.. It is what Intel suggests and what they have tested it to.. Running more then 1.52v daily is unknown, even 1.5v is rather high for a daily OC. I remember there were people with Sandy Bridge that had their chips degrade at 1.52v 24/7, even on water.

Honestly, I personally don't go above 1.5v for day by day stuff on any setup. That is just crazy high.
Before you go saying that "Ivy is better then Sandy" you must remember that it is a similar architecture so there is quite the possibility that your chips are all slowly degrading. Mine possibly has even at 1.45v, because it now needs 1.46v for the same 24/7 OC.

And yes, even if you de-lid at run it at 4GHz it is worth it for the lower temps, 25c+ is a lot and will increase the life of your chip or the overclock on your cooler. I.E Someone with a Hyper 212+ can now OC to 4.6GHz as opposed to being forced to run at 4.3GHz because of heat.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, sorry for being dumb then,
> i shut it now....


Last time *VID RANGE Has Nothing to Do with V CORE*

Quit using it and preaching it like it's the bible.

We have no Idea what the Max safe Vcore for Ivy is...

*There are NO reports of degrading*.... There for im going with a *HIGH* number until a report says differently

Also i may be moody due to out of smokes and learning i have to buy 2 more 90 compression fittings things are 19$ each...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Not really.. It is what Intel suggests and what they have tested it to.. Running more then 1.52v daily is unknown, even 1.5v is rather high for a daily OC. I remember there were people with Sandy Bridge that had their chips degrade at 1.52v 24/7, even on water.
> 
> Honestly, I personally don't go above 1.5v for day by day stuff on any setup. That is just crazy high.
> Before you go saying that "Ivy is better then Sandy" you must remember that it is a similar architecture so there is quite the possibility that your chips are all slowly degrading. Mine possibly has even at 1.45v, because it now needs 1.46v for the same 24/7 OC.
> 
> And yes, even if you de-lid at run it at 4GHz it is worth it for the lower temps, 25c+ is a lot and will increase the life of your chip or the overclock on your cooler. I.E Someone with a Hyper 212+ can now OC to 4.6GHz as opposed to being forced to run at 4.3GHz because of heat.


See first line young fellow.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Gameplay is very smooth on most of the games I play (BF3 and Far Cry 3 <== This one night and day difference) and I gained another 50mhz on my OCs.
> 
> Not to mention that trifire is going to +90% in BF3.
> 
> In addition game profiles got an update in 13.2 when compared to 13.1:
> 
> 3dMark Vantage (cfx)
> Battle Forge (cfx)
> Aliens Vs Predator (cfx)
> Lost Planet 2 (cfx)
> F1 2012 (cfx)
> 3DMark 11 (cfx)
> Crysis 2 (cfx)
> Battlefield 3 (cfx)
> Dirt Showdown (cfx)
> Crysis 3 (unreleased)
> Medal of Honor: Warfighter (cfx)
> Tomb Raider (unreleased)
> Nexuiz (cfx)
> Blacklight: Retribution (cfx)
> FarCry 3 (single card)
> Skyrim (cfx & single card)
> GuildWars 2 (cfx & single card)
> Borderlands 2 (cfx & single card)
> Rise of the Triad (unreleased)


cool, thanks King4x4,
reading up on it now,

"The guys at Tech Report managed to get their hands on the Catalyst 13.2 beta driver and ran thorough tests with it. Using an MSI Radeon HD 7950, they compared the results with the previous beta version, the 12.11 beta 8.

Skyrim, Borderlands 2 and Guild Wars 2 were used as a test suite, with the resulting graph showing that the 13.2 beta will not improve the framerate but the frame time. Hence: a smoother graphics experience.

Tests revealed that the average FPS was approximately the same between the 12.11 beta 8 and the 13.2.

The obvious performance increase (as much as 27%) can be noticed where frame time is concerned, which dropped from 25.6 milliseconds to 18.6 while playing Skyrim.

Borderlands 2 scored a 7ms fall in frame time. There is also a 1 FPS average dip which is barely noticeable.

The compromise AMD made with the beta driver is best noticed in the performance graph from the Guild Wars 2 gameplay. With the 12.11 beta 8 driver, the average FPS was at 66 and the frame time at 34.7 ms. The 13.2 beta cuts the framerate by 5 and the frame time by an amazing 10.1ms."
http://news.softpedia.com/news/AMD-Catalyst-13-2-Beta-Driver-Benchmarks-Look-Promising-322097.shtml

so not a real improvement in fps, but faster frame times, so smoother game play right








will try find them, and install, see if i notice a difference too like you did

edit,
running into problems installing, i un-installed the old 12.11 cap2 drivers,
but on reboot, windows tried to install drivers again ..lol
got them installed now, but idk..CCC showing black on the left side, no buttons there,
only if i hover the mouse over them.. any tips?

another reboot, my drivers where gone, windows installed them again?
reboot, now windows hangs about 2 min upon logon desktop..grmbl..
me thinks its time to reinstall windows completely..


----------



## [CyGnus]

True 1.52v max Vid has nothing to do with max vcore for Ivy, no need to start a war here everyone has different opinions for Hokies83 lets give it voltage since there is no proof of degrading for me i use 1.3/1.4v for the simple reason that if i kill the cpu i dont have the cash to buy another, again i dont know if he will die since we dont know the max tolerance of ivy.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> True 1.52v max Vid has nothing to do with max vcore for Ivy, no need to start a war here everyone has different opinions for Hokies83 lets give it voltage since there is no proof of degrading for me i use 1.3/1.4v for the simple reason that if i kill the cpu i dont have the cash to buy another, again i dont know if he will die since we dont know the max tolerance of ivy.


A simple answer to that would be the Intel Tuning Plan.







Other than that, how can Intel really say it was overclocked?


----------



## [CyGnus]

But if they have that plan i think they have a certain assurance that these CPU's can take a lot, cause i dont see any other way for they to have a profit from that


----------



## VonDutch

well, now i know for sure something is wrong,
just did 3D mark run, giving me a P5516 score, instead of the 10790 i had before...LOL
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5634797

somehow my 7970 is running at 500/685, instead of the 1100/1500mhz oc ive set it to...haha
it was ok when i rebooted, not sure what happened...


----------



## [CyGnus]

what app do you use? MSI AB? Trixx? Sometimes i have to check them befor i lauch games or 3dmark cause the voltage does not rise to were i had set it


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> what app do you use? MSI AB? Trixx?


after burner, i checked when i booted, it was on the 1100/1500 i set it to,
then i ran 3D mark, and when it was finished, the very low settings showed,
so i opened AB again, and the settings where changed to 500/685..

will try again...

edit,
still the same problem on boot, windows freeze for 2 min on desktop login,
cant open anything.. ab shows 100/1500 now, will rerun 3D mark now..

better, P10848
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5635149

compare to the old 12.11 cap2 drivers, 10790


still leaves the boot problem i have now,
think i will go back a few days, and run the 12.11 drivers,
dont feel like re installing windows today ..lol


----------



## [CyGnus]

use that amd clean driver app they released days a go and give it another try with 13.2b


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> use that amd clean driver app they released days a go and give it another try with 13.2b


just installed fresh windows








think thats the best way after a while,
and changing/updating drivers, ocing with crashes etc to much,
so i go with the new drivers on a new windows,
i downloaded the 13.2b drivers from guru3d, thats ok right..
should i use another site to download from?
first install all updates from microsoft? sp1 is already pre-installed from cd


----------



## [CyGnus]

well i usually after win install follow this: Chip7 drivers, vga, lan, sound, office and all win updates


----------



## VonDutch

yea, thats done, first set updates microsoft installed,
vga is windows default now,
but i needed to separate download the .NET Framework 4.0 for the 12.11 drivers to run on a fresh copy, they are included in the new 13.2 driver i think ..nvm, will get it done ,

laterz









edit,
bit harder to install then " official" drivers,
but its up and running now









fresh install sure did good for my cinebench score ..lol

4.8ghz, 9.78 points cinebench


----------



## Matt26LFC

Ok guys, update here, I've removed the glue and put a lot less TIM on and at stock Core 0 is at 89C in Prime Load Core 4 is at 38-39C Prime load, so I've gone wrong somewhere.

Gonna strip down and try again

*EDIT*

Ok, stripped her down cleaned everything off and re did all the paste. Back to normal again. I did put a bit more paste on the DIE this time as the small dot in the middle I tried really didn't get good coverage. So I chose to go with a thin line down the middle of the DIE instead.

Also I have noticed that by removing the remaining glue from the PCB it has made positioning the IHS a little more tricky, I guess the glue added some resistance to the surfaces stopping the IHS moving around so easily so I took more care in positioning the IHS.

I also took more care in putting the WC block back on, since I'm not draining I'm sort of swinging the block around (its on rotary fittings) and as I swung it back into place it was pushing the paste around on the IHS, perhaps not the DIE though as thats quite fixed when the bracket is down.

Going to do another Prime run, however it looks like I'm still achieving around a 15C drop. Next step will be Liquid Pro.

I also took a couple photos, no idea how good they'll be, as it wasn't with the gf's DSLR and just a point and shoot, but I'll upload them, there also from the previous failure I didn't take new ones when I just re did everything.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

I have both TIMS and just for easy of use quantity/perf for your (($$$)) i prefer the PK1 on the IHS.. Specially for the ease of removal alone....

PK1 getting blowing away by 1C from CLP/U or INDIGO using it on the IHS is out of proportion (which can be gained down the line wth a better equipment on your cooling/case setup XD) and very exaggerated like almost anything i read in this forum related to ((COOLING STUFF)) my friend...

I do like CLP/U on the die tho XD.. Thats where it really woks best.


----------



## megawatz

I never actually put down my info for the "club". I was giving my chip a few days to set in with the thermal paste. So here's my recordings:

OCN name: MegaWatz
CPU: i5-3570K
on die-TIM: AS5
ihs-TIM: AS5
*Mhz gained: 0*
OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
*Temp drops: 0*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2660685
Photo of delidded crap chip:


Spoiler: Warning: Picture







With those stats does anyone want to donate some CLP/U? lol


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I never actually put down my info for the "club". I was giving my chip a few days to set in with the thermal paste. So here's my recordings:
> 
> OCN name: MegaWatz
> CPU: i5-3570K
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> *Mhz gained: 0*
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
> *Temp drops: 0*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2660685
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> With those stats does anyone want to donate some CLP/U? lol


How do you apply the tim?

Maybe you got one of the cpus with fixed gap between die and ihs and dont notice the difference like we did..


----------



## stickg1

You should still have a slight temp drop with AS5. Make sure you removed all the black glue, and perhaps you need to polish the lips of the IHS so it sits closer to the die. That's what I started doing and I get better results.

Also I'm a huge fan of the Antec Formula 7 TIM. Diamond based like the IC Diamond and its been widely available at local stores like Staples or Best Buy so if I run out theres no waiting. I put it on every GPU I get and experience 5-15C temp drops. It's very thick though and spreading is difficult so I usually just use the grain of rice in the center method.


----------



## zGunBLADEz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I build for silence...


+1

Dont see the point on water cooling when the crap is gonna sound worst that went you jumped from air cooling...


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zGunBLADEz*
> 
> How do you apply the tim?
> 
> Maybe you got one of the cpus with fixed gap between die and ihs and dont notice the difference like we did..


My CPUs (besides Core0) have been more consistent than ever. Core3 usually liked to roll with Core0 temps, but I guess they're not friends anymore.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> You should still have a slight temp drop with AS5. Make sure you removed all the black glue, and perhaps you need to polish the lips of the IHS so it sits closer to the die. That's what I started doing and I get better results.
> 
> Also I'm a huge fan of the Antec Formula 7 TIM. Diamond based like the IC Diamond and its been widely available at local stores like Staples or Best Buy so if I run out theres no waiting. I put it on every GPU I get and experience 5-15C temp drops. It's very thick though and spreading is difficult so I usually just use the grain of rice in the center method.


I removed as much of the black stuff as I could without damaging the chip. Then again, I don't have finger nails. I might try with a CC and see if that gets more off of it, but it looked to me like I removed most of it off.

No, seriously though, anyone want to donate some thermal paste? haha. I'll trade ya for some AS5


----------



## stickg1

I think I got a beat up tube of CL Ultra or it got messed up in shipping. There was only 10mL instead of the 15mL, it was all over the place in the packaging and in the cap. Plus with the Ultra there's no needle on the syringe and its much more difficult to control than the Pro. I only got 2 applications out of a $15 syringe, which sucks. With a syringe of Pro I got 2 chips and 3 gpus. One of the GPU's was a 560ti which has a HUGE IHS so that took about 2 or 3 times more than a regular die application. Not a fan of the Ultra...


----------



## ivanlabrie

I got more applications out of my Pro aswell, used one up and the tube is still relatively full. The syringe IS useful!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I got more applications out of my Pro aswell, used one up and the tube is still relatively full. The syringe IS useful!


Yeah and when your done with the Pro you can add the syringe to your collection of narcotic paraphernalia!


----------



## chronicfx

And 5 is stable...


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> And 5 is stable...


Nice, really nice.. Congratz.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> And 5 is stable...


nice !


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Ok guys, update here, I've removed the glue and put a lot less TIM on and at stock Core 0 is at 89C in Prime Load Core 4 is at 38-39C Prime load, so I've gone wrong somewhere.
> 
> Gonna strip down and try again
> 
> *EDIT*
> 
> Ok, stripped her down cleaned everything off and re did all the paste. Back to normal again. I did put a bit more paste on the DIE this time as the small dot in the middle I tried really didn't get good coverage. So I chose to go with a thin line down the middle of the DIE instead.
> 
> Also I have noticed that by removing the remaining glue from the PCB it has made positioning the IHS a little more tricky, I guess the glue added some resistance to the surfaces stopping the IHS moving around so easily so I took more care in positioning the IHS.
> 
> I also took more care in putting the WC block back on, since I'm not draining I'm sort of swinging the block around (its on rotary fittings) and as I swung it back into place it was pushing the paste around on the IHS, perhaps not the DIE though as thats quite fixed when the bracket is down.
> 
> Going to do another Prime run, however it looks like I'm still achieving around a 15C drop. Next step will be Liquid Pro.
> 
> I also took a couple photos, no idea how good they'll be, as it wasn't with the gf's DSLR and just a point and shoot, but I'll upload them, there also from the previous failure I didn't take new ones when I just re did everything.


*EDIT 2*

Ok just run Prime95 with AVX Custom Blend 5500MB and results are virtually identical to the previous run I did, quite literally, Core 0 and 3 where the only two cores that showed a slight temperature change, there where both 2C warmer than before, otherwise Core 1 and 2 where identical.

I think the next thing to would be just go for the Liquid Pro now, not sure whether I should apply to the DIE and the Inside of the IHS as I believe some have. I'll also probably stick with Phoyba HeGrease for IHS>Waterblock, I'll test that config and if afterwards I'll decide whether its worth putting Pro on the IHS also, that or Ultra. Not sure whats best to go for for IHS>Waterblock.

Anyway, that'll probably be all I do this weekend, maybe save the Liquid Pro tests for next weekend, keep me out of the pubs for another weekend









btw

Chronicfx, very nice OC!! I'm not too concerned about being 5GHz 24/7 stable, but I would like to be bench stable at 5-5.2GHz with nice temps









Think I'll be happy at 4.6GHz for 24/7 use


----------



## Vi0lence

you think that voltage will be ok for 24/7 use? i can do 5 stable also. but the voltage got me. wasnt sure if 1.475v is ok for daily.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> you think that voltage will be ok for 24/7 use? i can do 5 stable also. but the voltage got me. wasnt sure if 1.475v is ok for daily.


There was quite a debate about that just a few pages ago in this thread, perhaps check them out.

However what I took from it all is, Ivy hasn't been out for very long so know one truly knows whether those voltages are safe for the long term. So if you want to play it very safe stick with 1.3-1.4v if you want to live on the more dangerous side of things play with 1.4-1.55v and if your bat**** crazy anything upto 1.6v for 24/7! With the appropriate cooling of course.

That was my take anyway


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> what app do you use? MSI AB? Trixx? Sometimes i have to check them befor i lauch games or 3dmark cause the voltage does not rise to were i had set it


found the problem, it was After Burner, i installed it, oced my 7970 to 1100/1500 as before,
rebooted, and windows froze again on desktop load, had to wait 2 minutes before i could open anything,
and windows loaded the rest, i uninstalled AB now, after resetting to default,
opened CCC, set everything to 1100/1500 again, rebooted, everything is ok ..lol
have to do some more testing, but now i cant install 3d mark anymore








software...pff ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> And 5 is stable...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> *EDIT 2*
> 
> btw
> 
> Chronicfx, very nice OC!! I'm not too concerned about being 5GHz 24/7 stable, but I would like to be bench stable at 5-5.2GHz with nice temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Think I'll be happy at 4.6GHz for 24/7 use


but he runs it 5.0ghz at about 1.432V vcore, _and_ low temps,

thats about what i run with my 4.8ghz oc, 1.420V vcore ..lol
which i think is safe to run 24/7, i think i would run that 5.0ghz with that vcore, 24/7

great chip chronicfx


----------



## chronicfx

The vcore is actually 1.49v. My board reports CPU-z low. Measured by digital multi meter


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> but he runs it 5.0ghz at about 1.432V vcore, _and_ low temps,
> 
> thats about what i run with my 4.8ghz oc, 1.420V vcore ..lol
> which i think is safe to run 24/7, i think i would run that 5.0ghz with that vcore, 24/7
> 
> great chip chronicfx


Yeah those temps are pretty good, considering he's also Air cooling!

I more or less mean't for my own personal usage I wouldn't see any real performance difference going to 5GHz, to me its not worth the extra volts or power consumption. So I'd be happy at 4.6GHz with lower volts, lower power consumption and even better temps.

Like I say though I really want to be able to bench at 5.2GHz 3d and maybe even higher 2d with better temps hence another reason for my delid


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> The vcore is actually 1.49v. My board reports CPU-z low. Measured by digital multi meter


thats a bit high i think, but its upto you if you want to run it 24/7,
then i would run 4.8 or 4.9 with a nice vcore..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Yeah those temps are pretty good, considering he's also Air cooling!
> 
> I more or less mean't for my own personal usage I wouldn't see any real performance difference going to 5GHz, to me its not worth the extra volts or power consumption. So I'd be happy at 4.6GHz with lower volts, lower power consumption and even better temps.
> 
> Like I say though I really want to be able to bench at 5.2GHz 3d and maybe even higher 2d with better temps hence another reason for my delid


my 4.8ghz @ 1.420V is running well now,
i was so excited when i had it 24H prime stable etc back then,
i was like, i can run this for years!! haha..but ran 4.7ghz @ 1.3V vcore most of the time,
well see how this 4.8ghz/1.420V is gonna work over longer time period, im curious too ..lol


----------



## Vi0lence

ive got mine stable as a rock 4.8ghz @ 1.356v. i may try 5.0 stable @ 1.475v and see what happens. i know it can do it. but this 4.8 is rock stable.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> ive got mine stable as a rock 4.8ghz @ 1.356v. i may try 5.0 stable @ 1.475v and see what happens. i know it can do it. but this 4.8 is rock stable.


wauw..lol that 4.8ghz @ 1.356v is very nice for a 24/7 oc, mine isnt a very good ocer, but this 4.8ghz at 1.420V vcore i can run 24/7

5.0ghz needs 1.600-1.610V vcore, no go for me


----------



## chronicfx

The interesting thing is that I measured my vcore like 30 times last night. During IBT it was 1.51v, during prime it was at 1.49v and gaming on far cry 3 I measured several times in towns and out in scenery and places I thought the cpu might be under a bit more stress and my vcore was always between 1.37v and 1.39v. So maybe being at 5ghz isn't as bad as we think as I am under the impression the clockspeed will only be at what is needed for the task at hand and very few games/tasks will push it that high anyways.. Maybe I should state that in a thread and see what people say about it. But thats what I picked up was that during gaming my vcore was no-where near 1.5v and that is the most stressful thing I do from this point on. But the power is there if I ever shall need it.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> you think that voltage will be ok for 24/7 use? i can do 5 stable also. but the voltage got me. wasnt sure if 1.475v is ok for daily.


If you buy a UP7 then run anything less than 1.5v you should be punted off a bridge like that little dog in anchorman. Just my honest opinion.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If you buy a UP7 then run anything less than 1.5v you should be punted off a bridge like that little dog in anchorman. Just my honest opinion.


1.475 is close enough lol. love this board. i also want to test my new ram with these clocks when it comes in. want to see how it clocks with the 2666 in there instead of the 1866. which im guessing it wont to the 5.0 with the new ram in it. but may still do the 4.8:thumb:


----------



## lilchronic

i wish i could run a higher vcore than 1.375v i went to 4.8 wich i have stable but put 1.45v and it crashed with a bsod 0x000124 i dont no whats holding me back from upping my vcore could be my mobo or psu


----------



## martinhal

Is this a good score ? What is the max safe vcore for benching ?


----------



## chronicfx

just measured during a cinebench run and it was 1.475v.. Do you think a game would ever stress harder than cinebench?


----------



## chronicfx

Just had my mother-in law hold W to run through a stronghold in Far Cry 3 to get people shooting at her and measured the vcore to be 1.42v. So the CPU does seem to draw dependant on its needs. I honestly think I will be ok at 5ghz guys. It doesn't seem like my cpu will ever draw 1.5v except for in IBT.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Just had my mother-in law hold W to run through a stronghold in Far Cry 3 to get people shooting at her and measured the vcore to be 1.42v. So the CPU does seem to draw dependant on its needs. I honestly think I will be ok at 5ghz guys. It doesn't seem like my cpu will ever draw 1.5v except for in IBT.


...what a great idea - have your mother-in law run through a battle field for you ! This could have several advantages beyond measuring voltage









Quote:


> *Martinhal* wrote ...Is this a good score ? What is the max safe vcore for benching ?


...voltages seems very high, even for benching. I like to stay below 1.5v for now until I delid (verified to 5.21 GHz at CPUz @ 1.464v,)

Cinebench at 5 ghz well below 1.5 v with faster mem timings per tips from *Swag* and *FtW 420*










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







...but my run here at







*2,147,483,647 MHz*







(""verified""







at 3dmark 11) took *a few more mini-volts*







: http://www.overclock.net/t/678487/5ghz-overclock-club/3380#post_19038887 at


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Is this a good score ? What is the max safe vcore for benching ?


great score







what where your temps?

above 1.6V is entering the dangerzone, not that it will say plop and die on you, but changes of damaging the chip increase,
but for short benching i ran higher vcores, no problem yet with any of the lower oc's..that i need more vcore to be stable for them..


----------



## chronicfx

Lol. I needed my mother in law to take a bullet for me because I needed to hold the leads from the multimeter. I figured an action scene would be using more CPU than standing around. Besides when I got up off the floor she had already disabled all three alarms stealth killed two heavy flamers and had the sniper in the tower in her crosshairs. Not bad for a grandma.


----------



## Vi0lence

got through cinnabench @ 1.5v, wouldnt do 1.475 today for some reason. guess i got luck yesterday. but its 5.0ghz stable @1.5v. gonna try again tomorrow with the new ram in there.

cinnabench @5.0.png 3368k .png file


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *chronicfx* wrote...Lol. I needed my mother in law to take a bullet for me because I needed to hold the leads from the multimeter. I figured an action scene would be using more CPU than standing around. Besides when I got up off the floor she had already disabled all three alarms stealth killed two heavy flamers and had the sniper in the tower in her crosshairs. Not bad for a grandma.


...better don't mess with your mother-in law / grandma of the kids - at any voltage or speed


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> great score
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what where your temps?
> 
> above 1.6V is entering the dangerzone, not that it will say plop and die on you, but changes of damaging the chip increase,
> but for short benching i ran higher vcores, no problem yet with any of the lower oc's..that i need more vcore to be stable for them..


Just did this for temp check



24/7 is 5 @ 1.488v


----------



## Vi0lence

are you delid martin?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> are you delid martin?


No why ? Should I ?

Only kidding yes its off.


----------



## Vi0lence

lol nice which TIM did you use?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> lol nice which TIM did you use?


CLP on Die and IHS . EK Supremacy block . Ambient 24.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Just did this for temp check
> 
> 
> 
> 24/7 is 5 @ 1.488v


i already needed 1.6V vcore to make cinebench run at 5.1ghz ..lol

5.2ghz cinebench needs about 1.7V vcore for me..


----------



## Vi0lence

nice yea i did same. liquid pro inside and out and a EK supreme hf block. i love liquid pro. works so good.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i already needed 1.6V vcore to make cinebench run at 5.1ghz ..lol
> 
> 5.2ghz cinebench needs about 1.7V vcore for me..


tell me that wa son water? LOL


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i already needed 1.6V vcore to make cinebench run at 5.1ghz ..lol
> 
> 5.2ghz cinebench needs about 1.7V vcore for me..


I wanna see 10.40 in the morning when I get up. But then Fanky comes to mind.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I wanna see 10.40 in the morning when I get up


yea, great score, you beat that Xeon







, thanks ..lol i tried, but never succeeded, 10.32 pts was my max with cinebench


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> nice yea i did same. liquid pro inside and out and a EK supreme hf block. i love liquid pro. works so good.


Love the stuff got 3 unused left over. Gonna use it on my car soon...

Here is the rest of my loop.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Love the stuff got 3 unused left over. Gonna use it on my car soon...
> 
> Here is the rest of my loop.


heres my little cooler in push/pull









with my old 6850..lol, my son has it now..


----------



## martinhal

Darn you doing it on air.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Darn you doing it on air.


lol..yes ..but my temps arent that much higher then yours,
im also lucky with my ambient temps atm, i can open the frontdoor to let cold in,
my computer is in the hallway, we had -7C already last week








then my cores look like this


----------



## Vi0lence

yea this week my comps going into my garage and im letting the cold get to it. run some benchmarks ect. i think it will be 18f here this week. should stay pretty cold


----------



## chronicfx

Von Dutch did you read my post about gaming? My chip is clocked with offset turbo overclocking at 5ghz and 1.5v in intel burn test but gaming my multimeter only see a max draw of 1.4v when playing an intense fight scene in far cry 3. So the question is how much time actually is your vcore above the safe limit of 1.45v? I think possibly never to very little if you just game.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Von Dutch did you read my post about gaming? My chip is clocked with offset turbo overclocking at 5ghz and 1.5v in intel burn test but gaming my multimeter only see a max draw of 1.4v when playing an intense fight scene in far cry 3. So the question is how much time actually is your vcore above the safe limit of 1.45v? I think possibly never to very little if you just game.


Interesting, perhaps this article is still valid? I know its old, and I'm certainly no expert, just wondering if the rules have changed since the rules had changed


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Interesting, perhaps this article is still valid? I know its old, and I'm certainly no expert, just wondering if the rules have changed since the rules had changed


Don't think it's the same thing. My cinebench score would not keep going up. Also my temps are way in check (about 55 hottest core) and supposedly the extreme6 uses fairly good albeit analog vrms. They were probably running ALOT hotter at that clock.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Von Dutch did you read my post about gaming? My chip is clocked with offset turbo overclocking at 5ghz and 1.5v in intel burn test but gaming my multimeter only see a max draw of 1.4v when playing an intense fight scene in far cry 3. So the question is how much time actually is your vcore above the safe limit of 1.45v? I think possibly never to very little if you just game.


yea, i read them, thought it was very interesting







never looked at it that way,
but then you cant use a fixed vcore, because then the vcore doesnt drop,
what i learned from feniks i think, theres a maximum with using offset for very high oc's,
my 0.160V offset for 4.8ghz, i always thought was to high already ..lol
using it now tho, seems to work..
its the same with running IBT , and normal daliy usage, the temp differene,
maybe i should say, upto 1.5V vcore is absolutely safe with stability testing,
you never see those voltages in normal daily usage









and i want a multimeter to, seems like the only way to be sure about the voltages you use,
software is to much off, or wrong sometimes..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i read them, thought it was very interesting
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> never looked at it that way,
> but then you cant use a fixed vcore, because then the vcore doesnt drop,
> what i learned from feniks i think, theres a maximum with using offset for very high oc's,
> my 0.160V offset for 4.8ghz, i always thought was to high already ..lol
> using it now tho, seems to work..
> its the same with running IBT , and normal daliy usage, the temp differene,
> maybe i should say, upto 1.5V vcore is absolutely safe with stability testing,
> you never see those voltages in normal daily usage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i want a multimeter to, seems like the only way to be sure about the voltages you use,
> software is to much off, or wrong sometimes..


It only cost $20 whatever that is in your money I am not sure.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> It only cost $20 whatever that is in your money I am not sure.


yea, it where expensive monts, every 10 euro counts atm,
will get one eventually, other psu, then ram i want first..


----------



## chronicfx

Von Dutch I guess this quote straight from the specs makes sense of what I am seeing since I use turbo overclocking.

Ivy Bridge utilizes Intel's Turbo Boost technology. Turbo Boost dynamically adjusts the clock speed of each processor core according to the workload need and temperature limits. This technology is now also used on the chip's integrated graphics, allowing for the processor to adapt better to different workload situations. Along with Turbo Boost, some Ivy Bridge processors also perform hyper-threading, allowing each core to multitask and process two threads per core.


----------



## chronicfx

So set your CPU to 5ghz and if it is ever needed it will be used. If it is not needed then it won't. I feel a lot better about the longevity of the chip now.


----------



## Vi0lence

only thing i can see with mine is it isnt throttling down. not on cpu-z anyways. steady 5.0 all the time. even with eist enabled. idk if im reading it correctly though. or if cpu-z will see it throttle back.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> only thing i can see with mine is it isnt throttling down. not on cpu-z anyways. steady 5.0 all the time. even with eist enabled. idk if im reading it correctly though. or if cpu-z will see it throttle back.


How can you see CPU-z while gaming?


----------



## Vi0lence

i dont test while gaming. when i test its with cinnabench, mark11 and prime 95 with cpu-z and real temp open.

when i close prime and it goes into idle, it never throttles back. not sure its supposed to though.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i dont test while gaming. when i test its with cinnabench, mark11 and prime 95 with cpu-z and real temp open.
> 
> when i close prime and it goes into idle, it never throttles back. not sure its supposed to though.


Those are going to use your full clockspeed. Re-read my post again. It is not what I am talking about. Those benchmark programs draw full vcore but gaming did not. Thus reduced clockspeed because of less CPU demand.

9147,9152,9153 those are the post numbers


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i dont test while gaming. when i test its with cinnabench, mark11 and prime 95 with cpu-z and real temp open.
> 
> when i close prime and it goes into idle, it never throttles back. not sure its supposed to though.


Same.. I noticed this a while back but never got around to trying to fix it.. It idles warmer now too. Might try a "Default" reset or something later today.
Other programs report it clocking down, but CPU-Z used to... What version are you using?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> only thing i can see with mine is it isnt throttling down. not on cpu-z anyways. steady 5.0 all the time. even with eist enabled. idk if im reading it correctly though. or if cpu-z will see it throttle back.


are you talking about the anadtech article? I was talking about dynamic turbo clockspeed during gaming keeping vcore lower.


----------



## Valgaur

I really want Franky back and running. because of the temps outside right now. it's -25F and the wind chill is right at -50 area. take that dice take that.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really want Franky back and running. because of the temps outside right now. it's -25F and the wind chill is right at -50 area. take that dice take that.


So, are you going to delid Franky too or just let it run lidded for a while?


----------



## Vi0lence

put him back in and give it a shot. you never know. he might work.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really want Franky back and running. because of the temps outside right now. it's -25F and the wind chill is right at -50 area. take that dice take that.


Why are you naming the new chip the same name?


----------



## Belial

Hey VD I see you got the UD3H. I got one too. Still waiting on the RAM (en route from canada).

What do you think of the board? I can't seem to figure out if it has offset voltage options or just vid. Isn't offest voltage the better one to use anyways (so you can keep those eist, etc features)?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Why are you naming the new chip the same name?


I think he was referring to original franky, new one could be son of frankenstein through, franky jr.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Hey VD I see you got the UD3H. I got one too. Still waiting on the RAM (en route from canada).
> 
> What do you think of the board? I can't seem to figure out if it has offset voltage options or just vid. Isn't offest voltage the better one to use anyways (so you can keep those eist, etc features)?


Mine is bugging me with memory overclocking. Last night set a 2400Mhz memory clock, pi32m & IBT max mem pass, restarting while running benches, all good, shut down & went to bed.

Wake up, turn on PC, failed overclock. Loosen timings, fail. more vdimm, fail. Reset to 2133, boots, up to 2200 all good, 2400 at the same settings as it was when first starting, works now & reboots fine
Shut down for 15 minutes or so, start up, failed overclock...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Why are you naming the new chip the same name?
> 
> 
> 
> I think he was referring to original franky, new one could be son of frankenstein through, franky jr.
Click to expand...

Frankenweenie?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I think he was referring to original franky, new one could be son of frankenstein through, franky jr.
> Mine is bugging me with memory overclocking. Last night set a 2400Mhz memory clock, pi32m & IBT max mem pass, restarting while running benches, all good, shut down & went to bed.
> 
> Wake up, turn on PC, failed overclock. Loosen timings, fail. more vdimm, fail. Reset to 2133, boots, up to 2200 all good, 2400 at the same settings as it was when first starting, works now & reboots fine
> Shut down for 15 minutes or so, start up, failed overclock...


I was having trouble with my Extreme6 because it doesn't do well with AUTO on the sub-timings. Funny thing is 1866 works great, 2133 doesn't work, 2200MHz works great. So I set it to 2200MHz, same 10-10-10-24-1T and its stable as can be and scores better than 2133 on the old ASUS board so I guess its fixed. Still cant figure out 2133 doesnt work right, its one of those sub timings and I tried changing a few of them one at a time and couldn't get it.

@Belial - Your board has offset and fixed mode. I recommend finding your stable 24/7 overclock in fixed mode and once you have the voltage minimalised then go for that same voltage using offset. So for example if you find that you need 1.35v for 4.8GHz and your VID at 4.8GHz is 1.3v then you want an offset of ~+.05v


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So, are you going to delid Franky too or just let it run lidded for a while?


Lidded for a quick OC sesh and see how he/she runs








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Why are you naming the new chip the same name?


I'm not unless all of the Vcores are the same.....which would be creepy lol and FtW is right I'm referring to The dead chip gonna try one last time and see if he will live for one last chance at life.... been out of a mobo for over a month... who knows lol








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Frankenweenie?


Oh God why..... I'll name it that if it doesn't get good OC's yelling at it saying why aren't you like your father!!!!


----------



## chronicfx

Well make sure its 2.0volts when you start him up


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I never actually put down my info for the "club". I was giving my chip a few days to set in with the thermal paste. So here's my recordings:
> 
> OCN name: MegaWatz
> CPU: i5-3570K
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> *Mhz gained: 0*
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
> *Temp drops: 0*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2660685
> Photo of delidded crap chip:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Picture
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With those stats does anyone want to donate some CLP/U? lol


Your in now slap this awesome Sig into that signature of yours!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> only thing i can see with mine is it isnt throttling down. not on cpu-z anyways. steady 5.0 all the time. even with eist enabled. idk if im reading it correctly though. or if cpu-z will see it throttle back.


.
controll panel - power options- change plane settings-change advanced power options-processor power management- minimum processor state 1%


----------



## Vi0lence

ahh forgot about that. thats why it isnt throttling down. good call good call. i set mine to 100%. changed the power options.


----------



## megawatz

I need to look into overclocking my RAM now, only thing that's not OC'd right now. I've got my 7770 OC'd with MSI AB but not by much.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> ahh forgot about that. thats why it isnt throttling down. good call good call. i set mine to 100%. changed the power options.


Yeah fixed mine too.. Well now it's fluctuating like crazy! Going from 4600, to 1600 then to 2700, back to 2400. While idle... :s
Might try re-booting first before I investigate more, +rep either way.


----------



## Vi0lence

yea it will fluctuate like mad. thats the cpu running where it needs to be. thats a good thing.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> yea it will fluctuate like mad. thats the cpu running where it needs to be. thats a good thing.


Yeah.. This is too much







I think I may have changed a few BIOS related settings


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420, Valgaur, Swag, VonDutch* and the accomplished *delidders' crew* out there


...working on prepping for the delid and want to add a custom cooling solution...I hope to confirm / find out:

1.) what material the actual die is...I would think silicon but it seems it has a metal sheen to it (I am asking re different expansion rates of i.e. copper and silicon /glass, given what I am working on which would partially 'hug' the die)

2.) Once delidded - AND WITHOUT the original glue that added a bit of height to the IHS, what (if any) is the height difference between IHS (no glue) and the die ? Conversely, without the glue, does the IHS sit on the die (with only a bit of CLP/U in-between...or is the IHS still higher than the die measured from the top of the pcb

Thank you very much for your feedback


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> *FtW 420, Valgaur, Swag, VonDutch* and the accomplished *delidders' crew* out there
> 
> 
> 
> ...working on prepping for the delid and want to add a custom cooling solution...I hope to confirm / find out:
> 
> 1.) what material the actual die is...I would think silicon but it seems it has a metal sheen to it (I am asking re different expansion rates of i.e. copper and silicon /glass, given what I am working on which would partially 'hug' the die)
> 
> 2.) Once delidded - AND WITHOUT the original glue that added a bit of height to the IHS, what (if any) is the height difference between IHS (no glue) and the die ? Conversely, without the glue, does the IHS sit on the die (with only a bit of CLP/U in-between...or is the IHS still higher than the die measured from the top of the pcb
> 
> Thank you very much for your feedback
Click to expand...

So basically, it is made of silicon but I don't know the other specifics, I'd just recommend the CLP/CLU for the solution. Now for the 2nd part, the glue significantly raises the IHS away from the die, I believe it would be about half the height of the die that was lifted away from it so basically, imagine a 1 and 1/2 die planted on top of each other and that is the distance from the PCB to the base of the IHS.

I would just remove the glue and apply the CLP as it will bring the best results. Also, if you try to make your own custom solution, I'd recommend something really fine so you don't accidentally scratch the die.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...working on prepping for the delid and want to add a custom cooling solution...I hope to confirm / find out:
> 
> 1.) what material the actual die is...I would think silicon but it seems it has a metal sheen to it (I am asking re different expansion rates of i.e. copper and silicon /glass, given what I am working on which would partially 'hug' the die)
> 
> 2.) Once delidded - AND WITHOUT the original glue that added a bit of height to the IHS, what (if any) is the height difference between IHS (no glue) and the die ? Conversely, without the glue, does the IHS sit on the die (with only a bit of CLP/U in-between...or is the IHS still higher than the die measured from the top of the pcb
> 
> Thank you very much for your feedback


1. The IHS is only had out of Copper and then it is Nickel Plated aroudn the entire thing. The only metals that could get in there is a complete mystery as Intel hasn't released information involving the IHS make up. or so far as I have seen.

2. Nopw with the IHS and no glue at all the IHS sits directly on the die for a full contact. so if you apply glue you must be very very slim in the amount. Thats why I left a small amoutn of the original glue opn the PCB so the IHS didn't slide very much as well. So when you don't have the glue at all you can get great contact by the little bending of the PCB when the latch is pressed down onto the IHS that results some of the pressure going back onto the PCB from the bending. So no harm will come to the die at all.

If that didn't make sense I'll explain it differently if need be


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Swag and Valgaur* & Co


*..thank you* very much - very valuable information ! This is actually good news that the IHS sits on the die once the glue is out of the equation...and if the IHS is nickel-plated copper, all the better.









Basically, I am looking at three options

1.) run 'unlid' (no IHS), with 4 screws that hold the water-bloc down, making sure of a perfectly straight mount and thin 'drop' of CLP/U
or 1b) have a thin layer of pure extra soft copper sitting between the unlid die and the water-block

2.) cut the IHS to make it a 'convertible' if this makes any sense, with tiny vent holes drilled in *the sides* of the IHS (re trapped air). Not as good as 1, but a cabriolet version of the IHS may help to seat the CPU better

3.) much more involved: fabricate a custom water-block out of copper that not only sits on the die but is chamfered and basically 'encloses it half way' on teh die sides (sort of like a hat on a head)...this however is tricky, especially with different expansion rates in hot-cold cycles (can crack the die if not done right...I used to do a lot of metal work, but this requires a specialty shop with CNC...the advantage of a custom water block is that I can set it up multiple ways with different liquid 'and other' inlets outlets to experiment...again, what is critical with this approach is to know what the expansion rates are of the die

I appreciate your valuable insights







! Never having seen an exposed die (YouTube does not count) and touched it, it's great to communicate with folks who have...obviously there is very little room for error...and the pressure is even higher given that my 3770K runs very well (CPUz 5.210 4c/8t @ 1.464v), it seems to require slightly less volt at any given speed than average...if I screw that one up - oh dear


----------



## Vi0lence

i did 2 chips so far and didnt need any glue or anything between the chip and the ihs. put both back together with liquid pro and it fit perfectly. ihs from what i can see lapping it is copper plated in nickel like said above. it polishes up like a very high grade copper.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Vi0lence wrote.*...i did 2 chips so far and didnt need any glue or anything between the chip and the ihs. put both back together with liquid pro and it fit perfectly. ihs from what i can see lapping it is copper plated in nickel like said above. it polishes up like a very high grade copper.


Thanks







- the IHS basically being copper (nickel-plated or not) is good news for my plans


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> *Swag and Valgaur* & Co
> 
> 
> 
> *..thank you* very much - very valuable information ! This is actually good news that the IHS sits on the die once the glue is out of the equation...and if the IHS is nickel-plated copper, all the better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically, I am looking at three options
> 
> 1.) run 'unlid' (no IHS), with 4 screws that hold the water-bloc down, making sure of a perfectly straight mount and thin 'drop' of CLP/U
> or 1b) have a thin layer of pure extra soft copper sitting between the unlid die and the water-block
> 
> 2.) cut the IHS to make it a 'convertible' if this makes any sense, with tiny vent holes drilled in *the sides* of the IHS (re trapped air). Not as good as 1, but a cabriolet version of the IHS may help to seat the CPU better
> 
> 3.) much more involved: fabricate a custom water-block out of copper that not only sits on the die but is chamfered and basically 'encloses it half way' on teh die sides (sort of like a hat on a head)...this however is tricky, especially with different expansion rates in hot-cold cycles (can crack the die if not done right...I used to do a lot of metal work, but this requires a specialty shop with CNC...the advantage of a custom water block is that I can set it up multiple ways with different liquid 'and other' inlets outlets to experiment...again, what is critical with this approach is to know what the expansion rates are of the die
> 
> I appreciate your valuable insights
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ! Never having seen an exposed die (YouTube does not count) and touched it, it's great to communicate with folks who have...obviously there is very little room for error...and the pressure is even higher given that my 3770K runs very well (CPUz 5.210 4c/8t @ 1.464v), it seems to require slightly less volt at any given speed than average...if I screw that one up - oh dear
Click to expand...

Out of all those, I would probably go with the 2nd option, much easier, much quicker, and much safer!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *..thank you* very much - very valuable information ! This is actually good news that the IHS sits on the die once the glue is out of the equation...and if the IHS is nickel-plated copper, all the better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically, I am looking at three options
> 
> 1.) run 'unlid' (no IHS), with 4 screws that hold the water-bloc down, making sure of a perfectly straight mount and thin 'drop' of CLP/U
> or 1b) have a thin layer of pure extra soft copper sitting between the unlid die and the water-block
> 
> 2.) cut the IHS to make it a 'convertible' if this makes any sense, with tiny vent holes drilled in *the sides* of the IHS (re trapped air). Not as good as 1, but a cabriolet version of the IHS may help to seat the CPU better
> 
> 3.) much more involved: fabricate a custom water-block out of copper that not only sits on the die but is chamfered and basically 'encloses it half way' on teh die sides (sort of like a hat on a head)...this however is tricky, especially with different expansion rates in hot-cold cycles (can crack the die if not done right...I used to do a lot of metal work, but this requires a specialty shop with CNC...the advantage of a custom water block is that I can set it up multiple ways with different liquid 'and other' inlets outlets to experiment...again, what is critical with this approach is to know what the expansion rates are of the die
> 
> I appreciate your valuable insights
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ! Never having seen an exposed die (YouTube does not count) and touched it, it's great to communicate with folks who have...obviously there is very little room for error...and the pressure is even higher given that my 3770K runs very well (CPUz 5.210 4c/8t @ 1.464v), it seems to require slightly less volt at any given speed than average...if I screw that one up - oh dear


first off you don't need a custom WC for the die only. and you don't need to mod the IHS either. Copper is the best form metallically to transfer heat so in all the ways the IHS helps wiht the heat dissipation by spreading it over a bigger area. thats why a lot of us use it. but with SonDa5 (if I spelled it wong my bad buddy) so in other words use a normal mount of the IHs and you will still see great results.

Now if you really want to get some crazy results and go custom think about this. Make the IHs convertable but change it up and leave the latch on the mobo and put the modded IHS and tack weld it to the inside of the latch so when you close it it holds the die perfectly still with the correct amoutn of pressure. Then with the WC block make it so it has a loop or a curve on the bottom incase the LP or LU oozes out (I take no chances) then you can leave the sides open for air cooling as well to help with the thermal dissipation since air is a decent coolant passively. This way to will get great flat on flat contact and amazing pressure reditribution and one heck of a mean ass looking WC block. if you want I can take it into further detail in PM's So I don't confuse everyone lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i did 2 chips so far and didnt need any glue or anything between the chip and the ihs. put both back together with liquid pro and it fit perfectly. ihs from what i can see lapping it is copper plated in nickel like said above. it polishes up like a very high grade copper.


I love how it polishes up but the pain on your fingers man. freaking annoying. I had a sheet of sand paper and my hands to hold/move both took me around an hour.


----------



## Swag

Guys, imagine a company make a waterblock that surrounds the die, so basically, it is a normal water block except in the middle, there is an indentation exactly the size of the die and you just put it on. That would be amazing!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Guys, imagine a company make a waterblock that surrounds the die, so basically, it is a normal water block except in the middle, there is an indentation exactly the size of the die and you just put it on. That would be amazing!


what i just stated lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Guys, imagine a company make a waterblock that surrounds the die, so basically, it is a normal water block except in the middle, there is an indentation exactly the size of the die and you just put it on. That would be amazing!
> 
> 
> 
> what i just stated lol.
Click to expand...

I stared at the huge wall of text and I said to myself "Nah."


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I stared at the huge wall of text and I said to myself "Nah."


Sheesh thats just being lazy college boy


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I stared at the huge wall of text and I said to myself "Nah."
> 
> 
> 
> Sheesh thats just being lazy college boy
Click to expand...

I can't help it, when I see a block of text, I just pretend to have not seen it and ignore it! Even in politics, I just ignore all the handouts and just wing it during discussions.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Valgaur, Swag* and everyone who had input
> 
> ...Guys, imagine a company make a waterblock that surrounds the die, so basically, it is a normal water block except in the middle, there is an indentation exactly the size of the die and you just put it on. That would be amazing!
> 
> ...what i just stated lol


...well, that's what my option 3 is above ('hat on a head')...it increases the contact area for heat transfer...plus on the upper sections, one can have custom fittings 'for all kinds of ' experiments. There are a few smaller metal shops I see every day as I drive by...I'll see what they say after I make some drawings / CAD for them and may be show you "Godzilla' of cooling once it is down, or more likely the most hideous contraption you'll ever see on top of a CPU


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Hey VonDutch I see you got the UD3H. I got one too. Still waiting on the RAM (en route from canada).
> 
> What do you think of the board? I can't seem to figure out if it has offset voltage options or just vid.
> Isn't offest voltage the better one to use anyways (so you can keep those eist, etc features)?


i like it, for the prize i paid for it, its one of the best, compared to others with about the same prize,
it has offset, where you put in cpu vcore, you have to change that to Normal, and the offset will not be "greyed" out,

Dynamic Vcore(DVID)

yea, i think offset is the way to go, make full use of all the powersavings








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Mine is bugging me with memory overclocking. Last night set a 2400Mhz memory clock, pi32m & IBT max mem pass, restarting while running benches, all good, shut down & went to bed.
> 
> Wake up, turn on PC, failed overclock. Loosen timings, fail. more vdimm, fail. Reset to 2133, boots, up to 2200 all good, 2400 at the same settings as it was when first starting, works now & reboots fine
> Shut down for 15 minutes or so, start up, failed overclock...


FtW has a point here, i always thought my ram wasnt really good for ocing, and im not good ocing ram also lol,
could be my mobo too..idk for sure..

what bios are you using on that mobo FtW420?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...working on prepping for the delid and want to add a custom cooling solution...I hope to confirm / find out:
> 
> 1.) what material the actual die is...I would think silicon but it seems it has a metal sheen to it (I am asking re different expansion rates of i.e. copper and silicon /glass, given what I am working on which would partially 'hug' the die)
> 
> 2.) Once delidded - AND WITHOUT the original glue that added a bit of height to the IHS, what (if any) is the height difference between IHS (no glue) and the die ? Conversely, without the glue, does the IHS sit on the die (with only a bit of CLP/U in-between...or is the IHS still higher than the die measured from the top of the pcb
> 
> Thank you very much for your feedback


check my avatar, thats the IHS spinning freely on the die








the die is made of "glass" , the upper layer is..

Putting these data together, we can compute whether or not a gap exists between the CPU and the underside of the IHS or if the gap exists between the IHS and the PCB:


Now I can verify by eye that a gap between the IHS and the PCB does indeed exist, but it is an extremely small gap (as the number would indicate) and attempts to take a photo detailing the gap is pretty challenging. I took a lot of different pics, varied the lighting, etc, and here is the best I could come up with:


But perhaps the most compelling argument that I can make to support the assertion that the IHS is resting on top of the CPU once you delid the IHS and remove the black rubbery adhesive and CPU TIM is the following video I took in which I could freely rotate (spin) the IHS while it sits on top of the CPU and PCB...it wouldn't spin so freely if it were resting or contacting the PCB at any point.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?s=da99c2fb53f26e74f9473e7305656ae7&t=2261855


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, that's what my option 3 is above ('hat on a head')...it increases the contact area for heat transfer...plus on the upper sections, one can have custom fittings 'for all kinds of ' experiments. There are a few smaller metal shops I see every day as I drive by...I'll see what they say after I make some drawings / CAD for them and may be show you "Godzilla' of cooling once it is down, or more likely the most hideous contraption you'll ever see on top of a CPU


I'll find it more beautiful


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote..Putting these data together, we can compute whether or not a gap exists between the CPU and the underside of the IHS.


Thanks for the info and nice graphics...very helpful









BTW, just got off the phone with my office in Paris...apparently Europe has a deep freeze ? What a time for you to be doing a record run...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks for the info and nice graphics...very helpful
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, just got off the phone with my office in Paris...apparently Europe has a deep freeze ? What a time for you to be doing a record run...


lol, yea, things are looking good, but its been snowing last night,
thats not so good for very low temps, 10 cm snow does look good tho ..








later this week it will be colder again,

Friday









i live up North

my coldest core is about 3C above ambient, but i noticed a few days ago,
real temp only goes to 0C, not below it, this is when it was -6C outside..


----------



## Joa3d43

...from a Canadian point of view, that looks kind of balmy


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...from a Canadian point of view, that looks kind of balmy


Im in North dakota I know what you mean lol


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.overclock.net/t/1351729/thread-changes#post_19099016

Tell me how ya feel guys and gals.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...from a Canadian point of view, that looks kind of balmy


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Im in North dakota I know what you mean lol


yea, our winters are "only" about -15 to -20C max, most of the time just a few nights like that,
anyways, enough cold to run some benchies with frondoor open


----------



## VonDutch

how can i get to be a member over there Val?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> how can i get to be a member over there Val?


I'll invite you sir.







But you can press the Join Group if you want!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'll invite you sir.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But you can press the Join Group if you want!


trying to find the,"join group" button ..lol

edit,
nvm , found it..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> trying to find the,"join group" button ..lol
> 
> edit,
> nvm , found it..lol


oh you


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Guys, imagine a company make a waterblock that surrounds the die, so basically, it is a normal water block except in the middle, there is an indentation exactly the size of the die and you just put it on. That would be amazing!


Reminds me of DT Direct ( http://www.dtwaterblocks.com/dt-direct-2011-black/ ).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Reminds me of DT Direct ( http://www.dtwaterblocks.com/dt-direct-2011-black/ ).


Basically but for the die would require a very tiny....

Wait a minute instead of trying to find a better thermal interface material..... just make the die the thermal interface!

Okay so take the IHS off and just raise the water or fluid inlet higher so you have around a 1-2 mm distance from the outlet to the die then you have an outlet off to the side where you have a lowered down casting that holds all the water in!

Okay think of this.... make the IHS the waterblock itself and pump the water through a hole in it and have an outlet on the top as well. no thermal interface needed at all you'd just need a liquid that wouldn't eat the Silicon material (Gonna ask about this as well now) and then have a fluid that won't damage the PCB as well. That would be the best way of cooling. Say heck no to TIM and the IHS and just attach a block to the PCB and seal it is all.

Man I need sleep.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Guys, imagine a company make a waterblock that surrounds the die, so basically, it is a normal water block except in the middle, there is an indentation exactly the size of the die and you just put it on. That would be amazing!
> 
> 
> 
> Reminds me of DT Direct ( http://www.dtwaterblocks.com/dt-direct-2011-black/ ).
Click to expand...

Pretty much like that but for the die!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Pretty much like that but for the die!


again you ignored me


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Pretty much like that but for the die!
> 
> 
> 
> again you ignored me
Click to expand...

You keep posting at the same time and I don't want to refresh the page after starting to write a reply!







Too damn lazy to check if someone posted in the time I'm typing.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You keep posting at the same time and I don't want to refresh the page after starting to write a reply!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too damn lazy to check if someone posted in the time I'm typing.


I refresh the page about every 2 minutes.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You keep posting at the same time and I don't want to refresh the page after starting to write a reply!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too damn lazy to check if someone posted in the time I'm typing.
> 
> 
> 
> I refresh the page about every 2 minutes.
Click to expand...

I refresh my profile page every 10 seconds! I feel like I'm addicted to OCN...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I refresh my profile page every 10 seconds! I feel like I'm addicted to OCN...


lol just Overclock your braina nd you will begin to love the OCN be one of us Swag one of us one of us!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I refresh my profile page every 10 seconds! I feel like I'm addicted to OCN...
> 
> 
> 
> lol just Overclock your braina nd you will begin to love the OCN be one of us Swag one of us one of us!
Click to expand...

You know, I gained 1k of posts in a matter of a week in the summer! I was just addicted to this and posting... I wish I could OC my brain, that way I can process things that much faster.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I refresh my profile page every 10 seconds! I feel like I'm addicted to OCN...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol just Overclock your brain and you will begin to love the OCN be one of us Swag one of us one of us!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You know, I gained 1k of posts in a matter of a week in the summer! I was just addicted to this and posting... I wish I could OC my brain, that way I can process things that much faster.


i think im degrading guys,
my typing is really bad last week,
i have to recheck every post like 3 times, to get the typos out,
so watch out if you gonna OC your brain also...LOL
yea, im addicted to OCN too, but thats mainly because of the people here









time to clean the snow at the front of my house, and some of the street..bbl..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I refresh my profile page every 10 seconds! I feel like I'm addicted to OCN...
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol just Overclock your brain and you will begin to love the OCN be one of us Swag one of us one of us!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You know, I gained 1k of posts in a matter of a week in the summer! I was just addicted to this and posting... I wish I could OC my brain, that way I can process things that much faster.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> i think im degrading guys,
> my typing is really bad last week,
> i have to recheck every post like 3 times, to get the typos out,
> so watch out if you gonna OC your brain also...LOL
> yea, im addicted to OCN too, but thats mainly because of the people here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> time to clean the snow at the front of my house, and some of the street..bbl..
Click to expand...

Well, I'm off to dream land so I'll see you guys later as well.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Guys Im now wondering, what part of the DIE has the GPU in it? Perhaps thats the end I damaged? Is there a picture anywhere with a DIE and the internal parts overlayed on top of it?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Guys Im now wondering, what part of the DIE has the GPU in it? Perhaps thats the end I damaged? Is there a picture anywhere with a DIE and the internal parts overlayed on top of it?


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Cheers matey

Heres a picture of my Chip, its not great, but the DSLR needed charging.



Looks like its not on the GPU end of things, but whatever goes on in that other corner, whatever happens there.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> Cheers matey
> 
> Heres a picture of my Chip, its not great, but the DSLR needed charging.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like its not on the GPU end of things, but whatever goes on in that other corner, whatever happens there.


System agent and Memory Controller ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> Cheers matey
> 
> Heres a picture of my Chip, its not great, but the DSLR needed charging.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like its not on the GPU end of things, but whatever goes on in that other corner, whatever happens there.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> System agent and Memory Controller ?


yea, looks like it, compared to the layout pics,
but it is working ok right?


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> System agent and Memory Controller ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, looks like it, compared to the layout pics,
> but it is working ok right?


Yeah, thats what it looks like.

But yeah, all is working, CPUz reports all my RAM (8GB) installed and in Dual Channel mode, at the correct frequencies.

Not sure what else to check for, perhaps the other two DIMM slots on the motherboard warrant populating see if all is recognized.

But otherwise nothing wrong at all, think I've been quite lucky really


----------



## [CyGnus]

That looks bad...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Yeah, thats what it looks like.
> 
> But yeah, all is working, CPUz reports all my RAM (8GB) installed and in Dual Channel mode, at the correct frequencies.
> 
> Not sure what else to check for, perhaps the other two DIMM slots on the motherboard warrant populating see if all is recognized.
> 
> But otherwise nothing wrong at all, think I've been quite lucky really


not much other things you can check, been looking this morning for a cross section for a cpu,
and look how the layers are made/thickness etc, the top layer is " glass" ,
so im guessing you got lucky you didnt hit anything (important) underneath there..


i dont recall anyone here hitting the die


----------



## lilchronic

i did it


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i did it


Nice job lilchronic. Congrats on getting it stable.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> Nice job lilchronic. Congrats on getting it stable.


i reinstalled windows and there it is
chronicfx said
Quote:


> Lol. You broke windows overclocking.










lolz


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Gomi wrote...Reminds me of DT Direct ( http://www.dtwaterblocks.com/dt-direct-2011-black/ ).


...good related example, but when I originally proposed this, I was thinking surrounding the die itself - the water-block in essence 'becomes' the IHS...however, this almost would have to be custom-fitted to each die, and having seen pics of chipped corners of delidded dies...


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> Cheers matey
> 
> Heres a picture of my Chip, its not great, but the DSLR needed charging.
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like its not on the GPU end of things, but whatever goes on in that other corner, whatever happens there.


dont sweat that. mine did the same thing. minor knick in the corner. it wont hurt anything. mine has been running for a few months overclocked to a minumum or 4.6 like that.


----------



## VonDutch

so i was thinking about offset,

im running 4.8ghz, vcore 1.420V, using offset, 0.160V, LLC Turbo, which gives a slight vdroop,
ive changed my LLC to Extreme, or no vdroop, changed offset to 0.130V,
if i fire up ibt, its about the same vcore as before, so it should be good,
i know they say, extreme, or no vdroop is when you use ln/2 etc,
why is it so bad im using it with air? im thinking, less offset is better, any ideas?

i did some offset testing at 4.7ghz, with Turbo or Extreme settings,

LLC Turbo


LLC Extreme


using Extreme, i could lower my offset by 0.020V, vcore voltages in cpu-z show a bit higher i know








i cant lower my offset much using LLC Turbo, but using Extreme i can just drop it 0.020V,
and it feels better somehow in windows, snappier..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so i was thinking about offset,
> 
> im running 4.8ghz, vcore 1.420V, using offset, 0.160V, LLC Turbo, which gives a slight vdroop,
> ive changed my LLC to Extreme, or no vdroop, changed offset to 0.135V,
> if i fire up ibt, its about the same vcore as before, so it should be good,
> i know they say, extreme, or no vdroop is when you use ln/2 etc,
> why is it so bad im using it with air? im thinking, less offset is better, any ideas?


i use additional turbo voltage and leave my offset @+0.005
turbo voltage @ 0.145v
LLC-level 2


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Putting these data together, we can compute whether or not a gap exists between the CPU and the underside of the IHS or if the gap exists between the IHS and the PCB:
> 
> 
> Now I can verify by eye that a gap between the IHS and the PCB does indeed exist, but it is an extremely small gap (as the number would indicate) and attempts to take a photo detailing the gap is pretty challenging. I took a lot of different pics, varied the lighting, etc, and here is the best I could come up with:


How accurate do you feel these measurements are?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i use additional turbo voltage and leave my offset @+0.005
> turbo voltage @ 0.145v
> LLC-level 2


yea, thats different with asrock mobo's, you have 2 options, the normal offset, and additional turbo voltage,
still makes 0.150V offset together, dont know the difference it makes doing it like asrock


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> How accurate do you feel these measurements are?


i think very, idontcare knows his stuff, and knows how to do things,
he really put time and effort in that, of course the measurement can differ a bit between cpu's..


----------



## JQuantum

Good news! That IBT temperature spike is gone with my new raystorm CPU Block and going direct die.

New Idles: 35-28-30-34 (give or take)
New Standard loads (100%): 51-48-51-52
New IBT loads: 60-65-70-67

Previous before direct die with the raystorm
Idles: 40-32-32-38
Standard load: 60s
IBT loads: 85-104-105-90 (Was insane, I think it was just because I didn't put enough paste between the die and the IHS though)

Previous on modded h100i
Idles: 40-30-30-38
Standard: 60s
Loads: 70s-90s-90s-70s or something

CPU speed set to 46 x 100MHz at offset + 0.140v High LLC.

Although it was working before I think now that my temps are settled my delidding is officially a success


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Good news! That IBT temperature spike is gone with my new raystorm CPU Block and going direct die.
> 
> New Idles: 35-28-30-34 (give or take)
> New Standard loads (100%): 51-48-51-52
> New IBT loads: 60-65-70-67
> 
> Previous before direct die with the raystorm
> Idles: 40-32-32-38
> Standard load: 60s
> IBT loads: 85-104-105-90 (Was insane, I think it was just because I didn't put enough paste between the die and the IHS though)
> 
> Previous on modded h100i
> Idles: 40-30-30-38
> Standard: 60s
> Loads: 70s-90s-90s-70s or something
> 
> CPU speed set to 46 x 100MHz at offset + 0.140v High LLC.
> 
> Although it was working before I think now that my temps are settled my delidding is officially a success


gratz









New Idles: 35-28-30-34 (give or take)
New Standard loads (100%): 51-48-51-52
New IBT loads: 60-65-70-67

CPU speed set to 46 x 100MHz at offset + 0.140v High LLC.

that looks much better ..nice








how is your ambient?


----------



## Xinoxide

I have just ordered my 3770K and some coolaboratory liquid pro.

I have a fear of delidding with a razer as it took me a bit to scrounge up the cash for this project.

I do however have a heat-gun and a soldering gun.

I notice that the IHS is glued on with that black adhesive, do you think heating the IHS enough to loosen the adhesive will have an impact on the underlying cpu die if its not powered until cooled back down?

If this is deemed dangerous ill stick to the razer method after i save up enough to replace my 3770K.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> gratz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> New Idles: 35-28-30-34 (give or take)
> New Standard loads (100%): 51-48-51-52
> New IBT loads: 60-65-70-67
> 
> CPU speed set to 46 x 100MHz at offset + 0.140v High LLC.
> 
> that looks much better ..nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how is your ambient?


Same old same old, it's a comfortable warm since it's winter here (otherwise it'd be humid and boiling hot in here this room has a sauna effect...). Outside is -6C but this room is probably around 20-23 it's not cold but it's not warm unfortunately I have no thermometer.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I have just ordered my 3770K and some coolaboratory liquid pro.
> 
> I have a fear of delidding with a razer as it took me a bit to scrounge up the cash for this project.
> 
> I do however have a heat-gun and a soldering gun.
> 
> I notice that the IHS is glued on with that black adhesive, do you think heating the IHS enough to loosen the adhesive will have an impact on the underlying cpu die if its not powered until cooled back down?
> 
> If this is deemed dangerous ill stick to the razer method after i save up enough to replace my 3770K.


I'd probably stick to the razor, but what you could do is that if you heat the IHS a little bit (prob until it's warm to the touch) the glue will probably be easier to dig into. I found the IHS was warm by the time I could dig the razor in easier and it took forever to do it by hand lol but that was just me and don't take my word on it especially since I nicked my second one although wasn't significant (least I think/hope).

I definitely wouldn't use the soldering gun though, the heat gun would be probably best secondary tool, but with the level of heat I'd expect you'd want even a hot hair drier might work lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I have just ordered my 3770K and some coolaboratory liquid pro.
> 
> I have a fear of delidding with a razer as it took me a bit to scrounge up the cash for this project.
> 
> I do however have a heat-gun and a soldering gun.
> 
> I notice that the IHS is glued on with that black adhesive, do you think heating the IHS enough to loosen the adhesive will have an impact on the underlying cpu die if its not powered until cooled back down?
> 
> If this is deemed dangerous ill stick to the razer method after i save up enough to replace my 3770K.


with a tjmax of 105C, it can take a bit of heat,
yea should help a bit to loosen the adhesive if you make it warmer,
but a heatgun, isnt that like 5-600C? or can you adjust it?
75-85C max i would heat it up, but i havent done it myselfs so cant really tell









o, if its a new one, it should be easier to take the ihs of too,
would take her for a spin tho, see how well it does first


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Same old same old, it's a comfortable warm since it's winter here (otherwise it'd be humid and boiling hot in here this room has a sauna effect...). Outside is -6C but this room is probably around 20-23 it's not cold but it's not warm unfortunately I have no thermometer.


yea just checking, with your idle temps, looks ok then








my coolest core idles about 9-10C atm i think ..lol,
its about 6-7C in the hallway then


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea just checking, with your idle temps, looks ok then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my coolest core idles about 9-10C atm i think ..lol,
> its about 6-7C in the hallway then


I'd like to open my window now just to see where mine will idle at.... you know what why not let's see how cold this room gets with the computer on







will post later when I give up being cold.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> I'd like to open my window now just to see where mine will idle at.... you know what why not let's see how cold this room gets with the computer on
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will post later when I give up being cold.


hahaha great









this was me with -6C -7C outside









real temp doesnt show lower then 0C tho ..pity

imagine you walking the dog at 6.30am,

you see a frontdoor wide open, and some nutcase standing in the hallway
making propeller motion with a scarf to let the cold in.... haha..


----------



## c2thew

are most of you who are overclocking running windows 7 or windows 8? Just curious as most of the screenshots look like the aero theme on windows 7.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> are most of you who are overclocking running windows 7 or windows 8? Just curious as most of the screenshots look like the aero theme on windows 7.


sticking to win 7 for now, i rather spend more money on hardware, then a OS upgrade ..lol
im waiting for windows 9, the win 9 OC and win 9 gamers edition ...lol


----------



## Vi0lence

winning.


----------



## JQuantum

sighs... I wasn't being mindful of the amount of pressure i put on the die and forgot that on intel cpus the motherboard pins bend. I just lost 1 ram slot... D= At least it boots, however, there isn't a chance i can recover this at any point though








100% of my motherboard pins are bent, and 2% of them are bent weird and I think that's what's causing the second slot to be messed up.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> sighs... I wasn't being mindful of the amount of pressure i put on the die and forgot that on intel cpus the motherboard pins bend. I just lost 1 ram slot... D= At least it boots, however, there isn't a chance i can recover this at any point though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 100% of my motherboard pins are bent, and 2% of them are bent weird and I think that's what's causing the second slot to be messed up.


omg, thats bad ..it that the UD5 in your 2012 build?
to much pressure on the die?, what where you doing


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> Cheers matey
> 
> Heres a picture of my Chip, its not great, but the DSLR needed charging.
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like its not on the GPU end of things, but whatever goes on in that other corner, whatever happens there.


Yup you missed everything basically but just barely... your very luck you hit that null void upper corner where it has the Transistors farther down into the Silicon.... way to lucky man way to lucky.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I have just ordered my 3770K and some coolaboratory liquid pro.
> 
> I have a fear of delidding with a razer as it took me a bit to scrounge up the cash for this project.
> 
> I do however have a heat-gun and a soldering gun.
> 
> I notice that the IHS is glued on with that black adhesive, do you think heating the IHS enough to loosen the adhesive will have an impact on the underlying cpu die if its not powered until cooled back down?
> 
> If this is deemed dangerous ill stick to the razer method after i save up enough to replace my 3770K.


Don't use Heat guns. They can cause permanent damge as if you went to TJmax of 105C when it's running. so any type of heat over that will do damage so a nono to that sir!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> winning.


Is that you? if so nice mentioning the delidded chip







mention us next time eh hem....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> sighs... I wasn't being mindful of the amount of pressure i put on the die and forgot that on intel cpus the motherboard pins bend. I just lost 1 ram slot... D= At least it boots, however, there isn't a chance i can recover this at any point though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 100% of my motherboard pins are bent, and 2% of them are bent weird and I think that's what's causing the second slot to be messed up.


have an pictures of this? and are you running bare die or with IHS if with IHS then I want to see the pins and if possible how you think it happened.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> omg, thats bad ..it that the UD5 in your 2012 build?
> to much pressure on the die?, what where you doing


lol no it's the testing v2 one but, actually I just double checked. The pins are normally bent  from wiki. So, I was just thinking it was bad lol, but it's not. I have a few weird pins though might be the cause of the second slot being dead.

Anyways, I don't know what to do at the moment so I just took the ram out for now.

It was working fine until just a few moments ago until I opened the window









No pictures for now, but bleh...

okay so the ram slot isn't necessarily dead but something is wrong since as soon as i stick a stick of ram in it the computer won't boot and a DRAM light turns on (ASUS board), I tried using MemOK but doesnt' work. Right now I'm on stock settings so it's not a setting issue either. Also, when it stopped working it was very sudden and the machine just frankly stopped abruptly, so something broke or burnt out.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> lol no it's the testing v2 one but, actually I just double checked. The pins are normally bent  from wiki. So, I was just thinking it was bad lol, but it's not. I have a few weird pins though might be the cause of the second slot being dead.
> 
> Anyways, I don't know what to do at the moment so I just took the ram out for now.
> 
> It was working fine until just a few moments ago until I opened the window
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No pictures for now, but bleh...


Okay... was kinda having a heart attack here. Yeah the bins are self bent for some movement when latching the CPU down. but if you can you should try to use the delidding blade and straighten the others but thats a chance that you could try or you could RMA it. or whatever really lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> lol no it's the testing v2 one but, actually I just double checked. The pins are normally bent
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> from wiki. So, I was just thinking it was bad lol, but it's not. I have a few weird pins though might be the cause of the second slot being dead.
> 
> Anyways, I don't know what to do at the moment so I just took the ram out for now.
> 
> It was working fine until just a few moments ago until I opened the window
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No pictures for now, but bleh...
> 
> okay so the ram slot isn't necessarily dead but something is wrong since as soon as i stick a stick of ram in it the computer won't boot and a DRAM light turns on (ASUS board), I tried using MemOK but doesnt' work. Right now I'm on stock settings so it's not a setting issue either.


it took me about 3hours to "repair" the bent pins on my 1100T, everything left from the red line was bent

i used a little tweezers to bent them all back 1 by 1 ..lol maybe i idea for you? not sure if its easy to do on the mobo tho..


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it took me about 3hours to "repair" the bent pins on my 1100T, everything left from the red line was bent
> 
> i used a little tweezers to bent them all back 1 by 1 ..lol maybe i idea for you? not sure if its easy to do on the mobo tho..


I'd say puttign the pins back straight on an AMD cpu is almost 100x easier lol, unless i'm just fixing one pin. The problem is i think some of the pins are bent really oddly or burnt out, as there was a smear line across two pads on the bottom of the cpu which wasn't there before putting it on. I'll probably take a look later on, and I don't think ASUS will take it as an RMA







or I could just stick the single stick of ram and hope this is the only issue and get a 8gb stick.


----------



## Vi0lence

yea that was me. forgot to mention this section. had so much going through my head. im still sitting here thinking about the 19k score if i can get it or not. lol


----------



## DiamondCut

Yea, some of the 1155 boards were coming with bent pins and causing blue screens. I fixed this for my friend by taking a small flat head and adjusting the pins that were slighty out of place than the others. Its hard to explain but the pins are actually contacts pulled up at a 45 degree angle and once you place the chip in the socket it compresses all of the pins so if they are slightly out of place you will BSOD.

heres a picture of what an actual ruined board will look:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> yea that was me. forgot to mention this section. had so much going through my head. im still sitting here thinking about the 19k score if i can get it or not. lol


Dual 680's right? man I'm still tired lol. Good score though goign to records or just messing around?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea, some of the 1155 boards were coming with bent pins and causing blue screens. I fixed this for my friend by taking a small flat head and adjusting the pins that were slighty out of place than the others. Its hard to explain but the pins are actually contacts pulled up at a 45 degree angle and once you place the chip in the socket it compresses all of the pins so if they are slightly out of place you will BSOD.
> 
> heres a picture of what an actual ruined board will look:


easy to see what pins are bent, if you shine a light on it, they have the same glow on them, except the bent ones,
i would still try to repair it, but i dont have alot of money to replace parts so ..


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Dual 680's right? man I'm still tired lol. Good score though goign to records or just messing around?


teiple EVGA gtx580 classy ultras.









and i just set a goal for myself and try and go for it. i think i can get 19k. so close.


----------



## JQuantum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> easy to see what pins are bent, if you shine a light on it, they have the same glow on them, except the bent ones,
> i would still try to repair it, but i dont have alot of money to replace parts so ..


lol, I'll take a try later on though, for now 4GB will run windows 8 well enough.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> teiple EVGA gtx580 classy ultras.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i just set a goal for myself and try and go for it. i think i can get 19k. so close.


I need to get that 11K mark for my single 680... I was soooo close was away by like 20 points and just couldn't get it... all on air and water as well.... Hopefully this new chip will like the programs more.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I think he was referring to original franky, new one could be son of frankenstein through, franky jr.
> Mine is bugging me with memory overclocking. Last night set a 2400Mhz memory clock, pi32m & IBT max mem pass, restarting while running benches, all good, shut down & went to bed.
> 
> Wake up, turn on PC, failed overclock. Loosen timings, fail. more vdimm, fail. Reset to 2133, boots, up to 2200 all good, 2400 at the same settings as it was when first starting, works now & reboots fine
> Shut down for 15 minutes or so, start up, failed overclock...


I had the same behaviour with my UD5H, luckily I killed that dude...I love my MVG for ram ocing








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, that's what my option 3 is above ('hat on a head')...it increases the contact area for heat transfer...plus on the upper sections, one can have custom fittings 'for all kinds of ' experiments. There are a few smaller metal shops I see every day as I drive by...I'll see what they say after I make some drawings / CAD for them and may be show you "Godzilla' of cooling once it is down, or more likely the most hideous contraption you'll ever see on top of a CPU


Hmm, too much hassle, even delidding is hard and dangerous, but if you're gonna do something so extreme get a Hailea water chiller, the big A500 one. It can cool two high end gpus and a 3770k oced below 0c or close to 0c, I know a guy who has one. Or, get a couple of peltiers after doing some research and build a water loop to cool them. Or just get a nice ln2 pot and dry ice / ln2. I don't see that design having a definite advantage over regular solutions + delid to warrant the effort and cost.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> teiple EVGA gtx580 classy ultras.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i just set a goal for myself and try and go for it. i think i can get 19k. so close.


Oh, you gotta have an hwbot user...and freeze those for boints


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> winning.


That's a very loud pc. But cool.


----------



## Vi0lence

i dont have a hwbot thing. i dont know how to sign up. but honestly 19k will be the top ill max this thing out at.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i dont have a hwbot thing. i dont know how to sign up. but honestly 19k will be the top ill max this thing out at.


go to hwbot.org... and hit register lol. thats it poretty fun once you get a good score with other and see where you rank. gets addicting as well.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I met the #1 guy in the Argentina OC league yesterday...quite a nice fella!


----------



## Vi0lence

do i need a screenshot also?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it took me about 3hours to "repair" the bent pins on my 1100T, everything left from the red line was bent
> 
> i used a little tweezers to bent them all back 1 by 1 ..lol maybe i idea for you? not sure if its easy to do on the mobo tho..


With AMD chips with entire rows or several bent pins in a row I use a credit card to get them close to straight and then fine tune them with a razor or something.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> do i need a screenshot also?


Look up my name on there Valgaur

and see what I did for my most recent submissions. You have to give as much information as possible basically.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> do i need a screenshot also?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Look up my name on there Valgaur
> 
> and see what I did for my most recent submissions. You have to give as much information as possible basically.


There're sample screenshots...What you need to show normally is the following:

-CPU-Z (open two instances): Main tab and Memory tab
-GPU-Z
-benchmark finished
-copy the validation link
-take a photo of your case innards and attach it and make sure to check the correct option in the bottom, stating that you know the rules bla bla and you WANT points.


----------



## Vi0lence

yea i gotta run the test again. need a screenshot and for some reason it wouldnt let me enter graphics cards. i tried every which way possible. lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> yea i gotta run the test again. need a screenshot and for some reason it wouldnt let me enter graphics cards. i tried every which way possible. lol


don't enter the brand, type 580 and wait for the popup and select the appropriate models. also make sure to select the 3x cards option and the correct cpu count.


----------



## nagle3092

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Vi0lence

i could scream right now. im on it. thanx guys

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5652678


----------



## ivanlabrie

Awesome! does it live?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i could scream right now. im on it. thanx guys
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5652678


Gonna give you a bunch of points I guess...what kind of cooling do you have? Water?


----------



## Vi0lence

yea water cooling. cards never go above 35-40c ever. chip never goes over 66-68c. i dont run it that high daily. i can but id rather let it run cooler with less power.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Very nice system mate! Gotta love those 580 classy cards...did you ever get the EVbot? You should...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> yea i gotta run the test again. need a screenshot and for some reason it wouldnt let me enter graphics cards. i tried every which way possible. lol


When you're going to run a bench, it isn't a bad idea to look at a couple good recent subs on the bot, check the screens to see what is needed (some need more for validation, like 3dmark 03 has to have the details window open & resolution uncovered), & get an idea of what OS & driver the top guys are using.
The rules & screen requirements are all here http://hwbot.org/benchmarks (except maybe pcmark 05 where the rules change way too often for rules to be updated)


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> With AMD chips with entire rows or several bent pins in a row I use a credit card to get them close to straight and then fine tune them with a razor or something.


Using your skills from your college days?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> With AMD chips with entire rows or several bent pins in a row I use a credit card to get them close to straight and then fine tune them with a razor or something.
> 
> 
> 
> Using your skills from your college days?
Click to expand...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Using your skills from your college days?












shhhhhh!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> When you're going to run a bench, it isn't a bad idea to look at a couple good recent subs on the bot, check the screens to see what is needed (some need more for validation, like 3dmark 03 has to have the details window open & resolution uncovered), & get an idea of what OS & driver the top guys are using.
> The rules & screen requirements are all here http://hwbot.org/benchmarks (except maybe pcmark 05 where the rules change way too often for rules to be updated)


True dat! dem pcm05 rules...lol what a joke!
I don't even run that 'bench' anymore.


----------



## Swag

My new chip has just arrived from the Cross-ship service! I just sent in my old CPU, please god have them accept it!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My new chip has just arrived from the Cross-ship service! I just sent in my old CPU, please god have them accept it!


Why another lowly I5?









*congrats!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My new chip has just arrived from the Cross-ship service! I just sent in my old CPU, please god have them accept it!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why another lowly I5?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *congrats!
Click to expand...

If they accept mine, then I have no complaints. If they don't, I guess I'll just have to go to MC and buy a 3770k.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My new chip has just arrived from the Cross-ship service! I just sent in my old CPU, please god have them accept it!


CUT IT CUT IT CUT IT!!!!! And take pics.


----------



## Vi0lence

got it in. is this good? im new to this whole end of things.

http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347872_

thanx guys. if i didnt find this thread i probably would have never gone this far with it.


----------



## c2thew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


congrats on the delid!


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome! does it live?


Yeah took me like 5 min, don't know why I wait so long it was easy as hell with the shaving razors.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome! does it live?
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah took me like 5 min, don't know why I wait so long it was easy as hell with the shaving razors.
Click to expand...

Where did you get that razor blade?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> got it in. is this good? im new to this whole end of things.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347872_
> 
> thanx guys. if i didnt find this thread i probably would have never gone this far with it.


That's a VERY good result man!
Check the amount of points, so so runs give 0.1pts.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> got it in. is this good? im new to this whole end of things.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347872_
> 
> thanx guys. if i didnt find this thread i probably would have never gone this far with it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's a VERY good result man!
> Check the amount of points, so so runs give 0.1pts.


Agreed for that submission very good! heck you could join the OCN group as well.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> got it in. is this good? im new to this whole end of things.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347872_
> 
> thanx guys. if i didnt find this thread i probably would have never gone this far with it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's a VERY good result man!
> Check the amount of points, so so runs give 0.1pts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Agreed for that submission very good! heck you could join the OCN group as well.
Click to expand...

Valgaur, if you decide to delid your new chip, do you want to do a dualcast together? Although, might be kind of embarrassing as I look like I'm a kid.


----------



## Vi0lence

im down. how do i go about that? i bench all the damn time just messin around. would be cool to actually get points and stuff for it.

i do plan on a 3th 580 in the spring. then ill be maxed out.









oh PS, this ram wont do 2800. might have to buy 8gb of that lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Agreed for that submission very good! heck you could join the OCN group as well.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Valgaur, if you decide to delid your new chip, do you want to do a dualcast together? Although, might be kind of embarrassing as I look like I'm a kid.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> im down. how do i go about that? i bench all the damn time just messin around. would be cool to actually get points and stuff for it.
> 
> i do plan on a 3th 580 in the spring. then ill be maxed out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh PS, this ram wont do 2800. might have to buy 8gb of that lol


Grab used psc ram...2x2gb or 3x2gb cl7 kits is best. Check the marketplace regularly...and join the OCF benching team







lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> im down. how do i go about that? i bench all the damn time just messin around. would be cool to actually get points and stuff for it.
> 
> i do plan on a 3th 580 in the spring. then ill be maxed out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh PS, this ram wont do 2800. might have to buy 8gb of that lol


Good score!

I wouldn't worry about the2800mhz too much, more for memory benchmarks & pi 32m. For other 2d & 3d benching most use 2400-2600 area with tighter timings (usually with pi32m too).
Trying to do a stability balancing act with cpu, gpus & memory gets a bit much sometimes when 3d benching.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Grab used psc ram...2x2gb or 3x2gb cl7 kits is best. Check the marketplace regularly...*and join the OCF benching team*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol


You spelled OCN wrong man







If only I could edit in this section....


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Where did you get that razor blade?


Walmart shaving section, it was with the refill shaving heads. $1.37 for 10 I think it was. Now I just gotta order some CLP. Has anyone had there chips fuse to the IHS using it yet?


----------



## Vi0lence

no idea what psc is? i feel so newb man!

ill check out the ocn thing. gonna search for it now.

and yea i want a lower latency but i also want to be able to get the speed from it. thats the one area i hate is memory overclocking. i dont know anything about it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good score!
> 
> I wouldn't worry about the2800mhz too much, more for memory benchmarks & pi 32m. For other 2d & 3d benching most use 2400-2600 area with tighter timings (usually with pi32m too).
> Trying to do a stability balancing act with cpu, gpus & memory gets a bit much sometimes when 3d benching.
> You spelled OCN wrong man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If only I could edit in this section....


Ha! You wish








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> no idea what psc is? i feel so newb man!
> 
> ill check out the ocn thing. gonna search for it now.
> 
> and yea i want a lower latency but i also want to be able to get the speed from it. thats the one area i hate is memory overclocking. i dont know anything about it.


PSC is a ram ic chip...Powerchip made those, not made anymore. Only found in 2gb sticks and 1gb ddr3 1600 cl6-8-6-24-1t, 2000 cl9-9-9-24, 2133 cl7-11-7-27 and some higher binned ones which are costly. 2000cl9 is the sweetspot for used stuff, and they tend to clock well (2400mhz cl7-11-7-27-1t with 1.7v or something like that, and even higher) Beats most ram chips, specially the newer ones which can't do tight timings and only high megahurz.


----------



## nagle3092

I'm happy so far, before it would hit over 85c, now just gotta wait for some CLP.


----------



## Valgaur

FtW gonna benhc my lappy tonight wiht my i7 and my 6770M in there. I want my new chip... so I can get more points for use with a different batch number this time...... I want a good one.


----------



## DiamondCut

Do you guys know if you can see how many people are subscribed to your threads?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Do you guys know if you can see how many people are subscribed to your threads?


I cant remember right now.... I think you can though don't quote me.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I cant remember right now.... I think you can though don't quote me.


TOO LATE!


----------



## Vi0lence

vantage score submitted. damn i like this delid.

http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347910_


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> vantage score submitted. damn i like this delid.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347910_


Delidding is basically a great way to upgrade your current CPU.







Basically like overclocking your CPU.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> vantage score submitted. damn i like this delid.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347910_


You have beat the delidded crew captain already!








Told ya, them 580s are awesome for boints...clock that cpu higher man!
You're getting good scores without even trying, now add some good tweaks to it and BAM.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> vantage score submitted. damn i like this delid.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2347910_


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You have beat the delidded crew captain already!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Told ya, them 580s are awesome for boints...clock that cpu higher man!
> You're getting good scores without even trying, now add some good tweaks to it and BAM.


Yeah yeah shut up... just because I dont have the gpu's everyone is using right now.... Wanna help me get a list of parts going that I need for major boints overhaul? this summer is going to be very Ln2 filled I can tell you that for sure


----------



## Vi0lence

i wanna add in a 4th card and see what happens. and im limited on temps on the cpu right now. need to bring the cpu into the garage one night which is a 2 man job. cant lift it myself. which kinda sucks. if i got it colder i could get some good scores.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah yeah shut up... just because I dont have the gpu's everyone is using right now.... Wanna help me get a list of parts going that I need for major boints overhaul? this summer is going to be very Ln2 filled I can tell you that for sure


You want me to keep an eye out for u a MM case?

So far ive only found a UFO which is half the size of my case supports more rads then the cosmos 2 bur not enough to warrant it.

Thing about MM cases is there modular u can in very the MB anytime u want.. u can put it anyway u want it lol You can also put the fan panels however u like.. Im really digging this case...

Still waiting for my 3 360 monstas to get there... i also have a 400 ML and 250ML FrozenQ Red Fusion Helixes on the way lol.


----------



## davwman

Delidded 3570k. 4.8ghz with 1.45vcore and Llc at 75% under water on an as rock z77 itx. Am I safe with this 24/7?


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

So I have to ask if I can come hang out in the cook kids club?







I don't have an Ivy Bridge, nor is my system overclocked (for now, but the bug is starting to get to me), but I have really enjoyed reading up on this thread over the past couple of weeks when I have downtime at work. I read upto page 587 but you guys are so fast that it'll take me ages to catch up.







Haswell will be out before I have read this whole thread. Anyway, can I hang out with you guys? I don't expect to wear the badge or anything, but you seem like my kind of people.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> Delidded 3570k. 4.8ghz with 1.45vcore and Llc at 75% under water on an as rock z77 itx. Am I safe with this 24/7?


Temps?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey there, hop on, grab a cold one...








This thread will soon be moved to the OT section I tell ya


----------



## Vi0lence

anyone on here have teamspeak or anything? i have a teamspeak server. im always on just hangin out.


----------



## DiamondCut

Here are the cases I recommend for extreme water cooling:

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12727/cst-1093/XSPC_H2_Hive_Series_Tower_Enthusiast_Water_Cooling_Super_Chassis_10_PCI_Slots_-_Version_2.html?tl=g1c7s532#blank


http://www.frozencpu.com/products/6466/cst-628/Custom_Lian_Li_PC-343B_Full_Liquid_Cooling_Ready_Cube_Case_-_Black.html?tl=g1c7s532


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163178\


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> So I have to ask if I can come hang out in the cook kids club?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have an Ivy Bridge, nor is my system overclocked (for now, but the bug is starting to get to me), but I have really enjoyed reading up on this thread over the past couple of weeks when I have downtime at work. I read upto page 587 but you guys are so fast that it'll take me ages to catch up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haswell will be out before I have read this whole thread. Anyway, can I hang out with you guys? I don't expect to wear the badge or anything, but you seem like my kind of people.


I approve of your non-Delidded membership status, if you have an trouble with anyone, I will back you up. If you want to know my reason, it is because of the beautiful asian girl in your picture.







Taeyeon


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I approve of your non-Delidded membership status, if you have an trouble with anyone, I will back you up. If you want to know my reason, it is because of the beautiful asian girl in your picture.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Taeyeon


*Virtual High Five* Taeyeon is the best.









I know my i7 870 is getting a little long in the tooth and I was planning on doing a full new rig build this month, but I need money for a car right now and with Haswell on the horizon I decided to rather wait. Typically I've always tried to just have a stock/reliable daily PC and I only overclock its end of life just before I get a new one. I think that will change with my Haswell build or else I may have to get a 2nd PC purely for benching.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Here are the cases I recommend for extreme water cooling:
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12727/cst-1093/XSPC_H2_Hive_Series_Tower_Enthusiast_Water_Cooling_Super_Chassis_10_PCI_Slots_-_Version_2.html?tl=g1c7s532#blank
> 
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/6466/cst-628/Custom_Lian_Li_PC-343B_Full_Liquid_Cooling_Ready_Cube_Case_-_Black.html?tl=g1c7s532
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163178\


Those all stink for water cooling....

mine blows them away lol..

Mountain mods and Case labs for extreme water cooling this is well known








http://www.mountainmods.com/computer-cases-c-21.html
http://www.caselabs-store.com/cases/


----------



## Vi0lence

this will be my next case.


----------



## davwman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> Delidded 3570k. 4.8ghz with 1.45vcore and Llc at 75% under water on an as rock z77 itx. Am I safe with this 24/7?
> 
> 
> 
> Temps?
Click to expand...

Max hits 77c under custom prime 95. Also, these temps will drop once I add another set of fans for push/pull on a 120.2 rad. Currently just pull. Also have a push/pull 140.1 in my CPU loop.


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> Delidded 3570k. 4.8ghz with 1.45vcore and Llc at 75% under water on an as rock z77 itx. Am I safe with this 24/7?


After watching sin0822's video I bet your core is actually around 1.5v. In case you didn't see it here it is.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davwman*
> 
> Max hits 77c under custom prime 95. Also, these temps will drop once I add another set of fans for push/pull on a 120.2 rad. Currently just pull. Also have a push/pull 140.1 in my CPU loop.


yeah, good temps and the vcore is under 5v. I'm running mine @ 1.420 right now for a 4.7ghz OC


----------



## lilchronic

my brothers i7 920 @4.6ghz 3x gtx480s sli


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## DiamondCut

But no one wants a damn wind tunnel in their damn room you fools.


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my brothers i7 920 @4.6ghz 3x gtx480s sli


WOW haha that's an impressive radiator!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> But no one wants a damn wind tunnel in their damn room you fools.


put a headset on lol


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> After watching sin0822's video I bet your core is actually around 1.5v. In case you didn't see it here it is.


i will now be putting a multi meter on my board tomorrow to see how stable mine is. thats crazy.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> this will be my next case.


Thats just stupid... sorry.


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i will now be putting a multi meter on my board tomorrow to see how stable mine is. thats crazy.


Yeah I went and bought one and tested it on my mpower after watching that. I was happy to see though that my board was within 0.001v of the static voltage I set it to in the bios.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Thats just stupid... sorry.


I think all the cases u suggested are stupid aswell









Those Silver stones 750$ for that crap.. 750$ builds one bad as crap case labs case.. which has 10x the features built twice as good and supports 5x the rads









I paid 230$ for my case and i can support any thickness of rad 3x 480s 5x 360s..

i can change the top panel and mb panel and then support 9 480 rads any thickness + 4 360 rads any thickness.. " This is extreme water cooling" none of the cases u suggested offer extreme water cooling just an extreme price for a sub par product.



I may get that water barrel in the future.

Real cases..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i will now be putting a multi meter on my board tomorrow to see how stable mine is. thats crazy.


yea your up7 should be spot on with vcore. i would like to see results thou


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You want me to keep an eye out for u a MM case?
> 
> So far ive only found a UFO which is half the size of my case supports more rads then the cosmos 2 bur not enough to warrant it.
> 
> Thing about MM cases is there modular u can in very the MB anytime u want.. u can put it anyway u want it lol You can also put the fan panels however u like.. Im really digging this case...
> 
> Still waiting for my 3 360 monstas to get there... i also have a 400 ML and 250ML FrozenQ Red Fusion Helixes on the way lol.


Love those res's man. and yeah keep an eye out for one I wont be changing cases for a while though Gonna have to wait until this summer.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> So I have to ask if I can come hang out in the cook kids club?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have an Ivy Bridge, nor is my system overclocked (for now, but the bug is starting to get to me), but I have really enjoyed reading up on this thread over the past couple of weeks when I have downtime at work. I read upto page 587 but you guys are so fast that it'll take me ages to catch up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haswell will be out before I have read this whole thread. Anyway, can I hang out with you guys? I don't expect to wear the badge or anything, but you seem like my kind of people.


I suppose







Just try to keep on topic mainly as we try to with the crazyness of the informationt hat roles through here often we focus on delidding and the results of that and we talk about better modes of cooling for the Chip as well. so it can get a little OT occasionally. As long as you contribute to the information here then your welcome!







Also nice try on reading all the pages I know it adds up fast.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Here are the cases I recommend for extreme water cooling:
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12727/cst-1093/XSPC_H2_Hive_Series_Tower_Enthusiast_Water_Cooling_Super_Chassis_10_PCI_Slots_-_Version_2.html?tl=g1c7s532#blank
> 
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/6466/cst-628/Custom_Lian_Li_PC-343B_Full_Liquid_Cooling_Ready_Cube_Case_-_Black.html?tl=g1c7s532
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163178\


Not big enough for my plans.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> this will be my next case.


Now thats what I'm talking about!!!!! Vi1lence we could just implement a phase unit into the bottoma nd have the tubign go through the entire system would take some seriosu modding but I would love to see a self contained phase unit for GPU's and CPU's all in a loop!


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Thats just stupid... sorry.


gives you the ability to house the pumps, res, and rads in one box you can roll around. also enabled you to make that box pretty damn cold if you need to.









and yes i want to try phase change so bad. but i went the ln2 route instead. my electric bill wont go up with ln2, wont need fixin if something breaks i just buy a new pot worst case. or parts i fry


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I think all the cases u suggested are stupid aswell
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those Silver stones 750$ for that crap.. 750$ builds one bad as crap case labs case.. which has 10x the features built twice as good and supports 5x the rads
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I paid 230$ for my case and i can support any thickness of rad 3x 480s 5x 360s..
> 
> i can change the top panel and mb panel and then support 9 480 rads any thickness + 4 360 rads any thickness.. " This is extreme water cooling" none of the cases u suggested offer extreme water cooling just an extreme price for a sub par product.
> 
> 
> 
> I may get that water barrel in the future.
> 
> Real cases..


Dude if you really think three rads is necessary you are already not on a budget so why would a nice case make a difference.... And the case you showed just moves air in different directions, there is no static air pressure and no flow. It looks like someone took a cheese grader and called it a day....


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> gives you the ability to house the pumps, res, and rads in one box you can roll around. also enabled you to make that box pretty damn cold if you need to.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and yes i want to try phase change so bad. but i went the ln2 route instead. my electric bill wont go up with ln2, wont need fixin if something breaks i just buy a new pot worst case. or parts i fry


Two of the cases I posted have wheels and can fit quad rads on the bottom and plenty of space for other nonsense depending on the res set up.


----------



## Vi0lence

you would have one side suck in, one side suck out. then the top panel would blow air down and in between the radiator rows. back on the power supply blows air in also. same way i have my case setup now. works VERY well. i have 2 x 360mm rads just on my 3 580's. more surface area to disapate the heat brings more stable temps. heat builds up and it taken out quickly.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> you would have one side suck in, one side suck out. then the top panel would blow air down and in between the radiator rows. back on the power supply blows air in also. same way i have my case setup now. works VERY well. i have 2 x 360mm rads just on my 3 580's. more surface area to disapate the heat brings more stable temps. heat builds up and it taken out quickly.


I guess that would work, it just seems like such a big box that all that air will just get stale... I guess it depends on the room its in...


----------



## tw33k

Results are in (finally) Liquid Pro vs Liquid Ultra


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Dude if you really think three rads is necessary you are already not on a budget so why would a nice case make a difference.... *And the case you showed just moves air in different directions, there is no static air pressure and no flow. It looks like someone took a cheese grader and called it a day*....


Ah all i needed to read to know you have no clue what your talking about









You just dissed a MM case bro lol ppl dream of owning MM cases...

Anywho on a not so much noob topic..

My theme...

Yeah i got room to fit him to... gonna remove his stand and place him close to the 400ML frozen Q red helix should make is light saber glow @[email protected]




Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> you would have one side suck in, one side suck out. then the top panel would blow air down and in between the radiator rows. back on the power supply blows air in also. same way i have my case setup now. works VERY well. i have 2 x 360mm rads just on my 3 580's. more surface area to disapate the heat brings more stable temps. heat builds up and it taken out quickly.


Im using the one side panel to suck in and the top.
Rest are rads in pull config sucking out.

Im using Monstas so it is not so important.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> I guess that would work, it just seems like such a big box that all that air will just get stale... I guess it depends on the room its in...


my case has 24 fans in it setup like i just said. it moves enough air to create a draft in a 340sqft room. my fans are only 98cfm each. when you get alot of fans directing air one way, air will move. lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Results are in (finally) Liquid Pro vs Liquid Ultra


hmmmmmm interesting...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> my case has 24 fans in it setup like i just said. it moves enough air to create a draft in a 340sqft room. my fans are only 98cfm each. when you get alot of fans directing air one way, air will move. lol


He does not understand Air is pushed to holes no matter how big the case is..

" The bigger the area " allows heat to escape ..

Also when water cooling the fans on the rads sucking air out of the case are feed by these fans making a thing of perfection.


----------



## Hokies83

dbl post


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey there, hop on, grab a cold one...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This thread will soon be moved to the OT section I tell ya


What is the "OT" section *ivanlabrie*? Is it a good thing if we end up there? This thread moves so fast it is hard to keep up with it......








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I approve of your non-Delidded membership status, if you have an trouble with anyone, I will back you up. If you want to know my reason, it is because of the beautiful asian girl in your picture.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Taeyeon
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Virtual High Five* Taeyeon is the best.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know my i7 870 is getting a little long in the tooth and I was planning on doing a full new rig build this month, but I need money for a car right now and with Haswell on the horizon I decided to rather wait. Typically I've always tried to just have a stock/reliable daily PC and I only overclock its end of life just before I get a new one. I think that will change with my Haswell build or else I may have to get a 2nd PC purely for benching.
Click to expand...

I expect Haswell will end up using TIM too *teh_HyDr0iD*, so you can probably end up hanging out here to learn how to delid it when you do get one!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Results are in (finally) Liquid Pro vs Liquid Ultra


Thanks for the testing and results *tw33k*. Can you note how many TIM applications your attempted to get the results in case they are more about mounting issues than TIM differences. Most of us have found PRO to be 1-3C better than Ultra, so if you find it the opposit, then we will want more than one mounting attempt to be more sure of the data. If you have done multiple mounts, than the data results are something we will want to verify on other systems as that would change things. Good work with testing it though!


----------



## lilchronic

OT - off topic?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> What is the "OT" section *ivanlabrie*? Is it a good thing if we end up there? This thread moves so fast it is hard to keep up with it......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I expect Haswell will end up using TIM too *teh_HyDr0iD*, so you can probably end up hanging out here to learn how to delid it when you do get one!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the testing and results *tw33k*. Can you note how many TIM applications your attempted to get the results in case they are more about mounting issues than TIM differences. *Most of us have found PRO to be 1-3C better than Ultra*, so if you find it the opposit, then we will want more than one mounting attempt to be more sure of the data. If you have done multiple mounts, than the data results are something we will want to verify on other systems as that would change things. Good work with testing it though!


I would love to see the results people got after testing both because I've followed this thread since day 1 and nobody has posted actual results even tho they have claimed to have used both


----------



## chann3l

What Tim is recommended when delidding a 3770k


----------



## lilchronic

coolabs liguid pro/ultra


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i did it


Wow nice job!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea, some of the 1155 boards were coming with bent pins and causing blue screens. I fixed this for my friend by taking a small flat head and adjusting the pins that were slighty out of place than the others. Its hard to explain but the pins are actually contacts pulled up at a 45 degree angle and once you place the chip in the socket it compresses all of the pins so if they are slightly out of place you will BSOD.
> 
> heres a picture of what an actual ruined board will look:


Those pins look burnt, you know the blackened pins!


----------



## Swag

Hey guys,

What color sleeving do you guys think I should get? I wanted to initially buy from MDPC, but the hassle and time consuming-ness of custom sleeving, I had to stray away from that initial though.

The possible colors are here:
http://www.corsair.com/en/power-supply-units/psu-accessories-1.html


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> What color sleeving do you guys think I should get? I wanted to initially buy from MDPC, but the hassle and time consuming-ness of custom sleeving, I had to stray away from that initial though.
> 
> The possible colors are here:
> http://www.corsair.com/en/power-supply-units/psu-accessories-1.html


whats your computers colour scheme?

o man, sometimes i hate computers,
i had this freeze on startup/boot, everytime it hangs on desktop load for 2-3 min, then it goes on loading windows,
it shows desktop, if i click a program like real temp, it doesnt load, just hangs till windows resumes loading,
then everything i clicked opens too ..lol

did some looking around for a answer, it could be my 7970 isnt getting enough juice on startup? drivers problem?, faulty psu?
so i reset computer to default, no oc on the gpu, everything worked like normal, oced computer again, same problem..

dang, so i dissconnected everything, opened computer, looked at the connections to the gpu, it has a 8 pin and a 6 pin connection,
my psu is modulair, but both where connected with a fixed cable.. so i took a 8 pin modulair cable from the box, connected that one,
rebooted...and it seems to work now, no freeze on desktop load with 4.7ghz oc... i hope this solves it.. maybe the modulair cables are on another rail or something?

o, and im having a hard time to oc my 7970, it aint hard to oc, but both msi AB and CCC set the oc back to stock or default,
could it have to do with the problem i mentioned above?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> whats your computers colour scheme?


wut should i get


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> What color sleeving do you guys think I should get? I wanted to initially buy from MDPC, but the hassle and time consuming-ness of custom sleeving, I had to stray away from that initial though.
> 
> The possible colors are here:
> http://www.corsair.com/en/power-supply-units/psu-accessories-1.html


Does it have to be those corsair ones?

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?manufacturers_id=213&manufacturers_id=213&sort=20a&main_page=index&filter_id=1011


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Does it have to be those corsair ones?
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?manufacturers_id=213&manufacturers_id=213&sort=20a&main_page=index&filter_id=1011


Yeah i got those in..

2x power i/o
2x sata connector
1x sata power

My other stuff is Mod right UV reactive

2x pci-e 6pin
2x pci-e 8 pin
1x 24 pin
1x cpu power


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> wut should i get
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


purple? ....LOL


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> purple? ....LOL


----------



## Swag

Well I have a Corsair C70 in Military green so that would be what I'd base it on.









Also, are those extensions or the ones that actually connect to the PSU? And another note, I know that the Corsair AX PSUs have a different shape for the 24 pin connecting to the PSU so I'm not sure if those would work...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> Cheers matey
> 
> Heres a picture of my Chip, its not great, but the DSLR needed charging.
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like its not on the GPU end of things, but whatever goes on in that other corner, whatever happens there.


Wow, that is sooooo soooooo lucky! Looks like you just nicked the corner of the CPU slightly and took some of the glass off the top of the IMC









I would actually consider yourself one of the luckiest guys here.. haha. I do actually want some shots off the DSLR when you can because that is so interesting


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well I have a Corsair C70 in Military green so that would be what I'd base it on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, are those extensions or the ones that actually connect to the PSU? And another note, I know that the Corsair AX PSUs have a different shape for the 24 pin connecting to the PSU so I'm not sure if those would work...



http://www.moddiy.com/products/Deluxe-High-Density-Weave-Green-Cable-Sleeve-(3mm).html

its a bit darker green, the others a more "glow in the dark" light greenish ..lol
but you have to do the work yourselfs, you want already sleeved cables right?
they have 3, 4 and 10mm


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> whats your computers colour scheme?
> 
> o man, sometimes i hate computers,
> i had this freeze on startup/boot, everytime it hangs on desktop load for 2-3 min, then it goes on loading windows,
> it shows desktop, if i click a program like real temp, it doesnt load, just hangs till windows resumes loading,
> then everything i clicked opens too ..lol
> 
> did some looking around for a answer, it could be my 7970 isnt getting enough juice on startup? drivers problem?, faulty psu?
> so i reset computer to default, no oc on the gpu, everything worked like normal, oced computer again, same problem..
> 
> dang, so i dissconnected everything, opened computer, looked at the connections to the gpu, it has a 8 pin and a 6 pin connection,
> my psu is modulair, but both where connected with a fixed cable.. so i took a 8 pin modulair cable from the box, connected that one,
> rebooted...and it seems to work now, no freeze on desktop load with 4.7ghz oc... i hope this solves it.. maybe the modulair cables are on another rail or something?
> 
> o, and im having a hard time to oc my 7970, it aint hard to oc, but both msi AB and CCC set the oc back to stock or default,
> could it have to do with the problem i mentioned above?


so i set my 7970 to 1100/1500 again, using CCC, rebooted, and ..

its set to 1080/1480 ??

am i missing something, didnt know a program can just downclock,
could it be that the oc is to high? i cant change voltage on my 7970, its hardware locked if i understand right

edit
this is getting weird, ive set to 1100/1500 again, problem is back,
set it to 1080/1480, rebooted, opened CCC and its set to 1100/1500, and it works now ...lol

any help is welcome, do i have a ghost in my machine? ..lol i am using the latest 13.2 drivers now,
could it be that?


----------



## Blackopsje

hellow ppl







i am new on the forum i am not a total noob i guess , i am from the netherlands Vondutch is my dad







so its all in the family
but now i got a new processor the AMD FX-8350 my question is , is it soldered and is it word delidding ?

bij voorbaad dank as we say in dutch
thanks









dad check tweakers mail btw


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blackopsje*
> 
> hellow ppl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i am new on the forum i am not a total noob i guess , i am from the netherlands Vondutch is my dad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so its all in the family
> but now i got a new processor the AMD FX-8350 my question is , is it soldered and is it word delidding ?
> 
> bij voorbaad dank as we say in dutch
> thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dad check tweakers mail btw


dang kids! ...lol

hey kiddo, just so you know, youre in enemy territory with your talk about AMD ... lol








i hope Hokies went to bed by now









nah, youre no noob, your a pro delidder now, so very welcome in this thread








im afraid the 8350 is soldered, but with the liquid pro in it, it runs cool enough anyways right








have to wait and see how it overclocks when you have your new psu and how temps look like then,
now back to the classroom you,. before the teacher catches you ..hehe


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blackopsje*
> 
> hellow ppl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i am new on the forum i am not a total noob i guess , i am from the netherlands Vondutch is my dad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so its all in the family
> but now i got a new processor the AMD FX-8350 my question is , is it soldered and is it word delidding ?
> 
> bij voorbaad dank as we say in dutch
> thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dad check tweakers mail btw


Time to tell dad to get you a real cpu!

That cpu ipc is 50% slower then your dads! Steal his cpu / mb and give him yours








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dang kids! ...lol
> 
> hey kiddo, just so you know, youre in enemy territory with your talk about AMD ... lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i hope Hokies went to bed by now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nah, youre no noob, your a pro delidder now, so very welcome in this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im afraid the 8350 is soldered, but with the liquid pro in it, it runs cool enough anyways right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have to wait and see how it overclocks when you have your new psu and how temps look like then,
> now back to the classroom you,. before the teacher catches you ..hehe


Going to sleep now!


----------



## Blackopsje

Dang hookies ;P

wait a few years everything will be multi thread might want to think about "borrowing" it for a long time >:-D good night









@vondutch

:/ well it sucks that it is soldered i guess its not a good idea to try with a lighter like we did on the pentiums







, i hoped it was not becouse its always fun to delid xD
thanks for the answer ill go to the amd cave.









can you come on tweakers ? i reached my max mails here


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blackopsje*
> 
> hellow ppl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i am new on the forum i am not a total noob i guess , i am from the netherlands Vondutch is my dad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so its all in the family
> but now i got a new processor the AMD FX-8350 my question is , is it soldered and is it word delidding ?
> 
> bij voorbaad dank as we say in dutch
> thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dad check tweakers mail btw


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dang kids! ...lol
> 
> hey kiddo, just so you know, youre in enemy territory with your talk about AMD ... lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i hope Hokies went to bed by now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nah, youre no noob, your a pro delidder now, so very welcome in this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im afraid the 8350 is soldered, but with the liquid pro in it, it runs cool enough anyways right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have to wait and see how it overclocks when you have your new psu and how temps look like then,
> now back to the classroom you,. before the teacher catches you ..hehe


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Time to tell dad to get you a real cpu!
> 
> That cpu ipc is 50% slower then your dads! Steal his cpu / mb and give him yours
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to sleep now!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blackopsje*
> 
> Dang hookies ;P
> 
> wait a few years everything will be multi thread might want to think about "borrowing" it for a long time >:-D good night
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @vondutch
> 
> :/ well it sucks that it is soldered i guess its not a good idea to try with a lighter like we did on the pentiums
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , i hoped it was not becouse its always fun to delid xD
> thanks for the answer ill go to the amd cave.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can you come on tweakers ? i reached my max mails here


Welcome!







to bad it is soldered.... pfft say screw AMD and delid it anyways!!!!! and get better results even!







Thats usually how we roll in here! I expect good information from a pro delidder! Give me some kind of CPU delid and I'll add ya myself buddy!









Welcome aboard.

Truly,
Valgaur


----------



## Blackopsje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Welcome!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to bad it is soldered.... pfft say screw AMD and delid it anyways!!!!! and get better results even!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats usually how we roll in here! I expect good information from a pro delidder! Give me some kind of CPU delid and I'll add ya myself buddy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Welcome aboard.
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur


haha thx valgaur









well i have experience with delliding pentium 4's 




this is how we do it if it is soldered


----------



## teamrushpntball

So I've been wanting to delid my i7-3770k for a little while now but haven't gotten around to stripping my pc down. But, I'm about to be installing a new Maximus V Formula and will have my water loop disassembled anyway.

I have 2 questions, first how much of a performance hit will I get using Phobya HeGrease instead of Liquid Pro? Namely I intend to get Liquid Pro, but am waiting on PPC's to get in more of my fittings before I place one big order so it would just be a temporary usage.

And 2nd, I should probably verify my new board works before delidding so that I can rule out the board if an issue arises?


----------



## VonDutch

better redo the vid kiddo, i dont think it runs like that,
click video, then use ctrl v to get the vidlink in, works for me if i use it,
yea, i showed some of the vids we made on here already,
Val knows you can delid and have experience delidding, no worries ..lol
he just trying you to get to delid the 8350 ..haha,
i tell you right now, we not gonna do that! (dad talks







)

edit,
on the 7970 problems, i uninstalled the 13.2 drivers, installed 13.1 from the amd site,
seems to work now, but havent oced the gpu again, also just wrote the company i bought it from,
see if i can still change it to a 7970 that is voltage unlocked







can try right.. got it like 6 weeks now


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> So I've been wanting to delid my i7-3770k for a little while now but haven't gotten around to stripping my pc down. But, I'm about to be installing a new Maximus V Formula and will have my water loop disassembled anyway.
> 
> I have 2 questions, first how much of a performance hit will I get using Phobya HeGrease instead of Liquid Pro? Namely I intend to get Liquid Pro, but am waiting on PPC's to get in more of my fittings before I place one big order so it would just be a temporary usage.
> 
> And 2nd, I should probably verify my new board works before delidding so that I can rule out the board if an issue arises?


about 10C tempdrop if you use another tim on the die, maybe a bit more/less, depends..
Phobya HeGrease, Thermal conductivity: 8.5W/mK, thats about the same w/mk AS5 has i think

yea, i would check if everything works on the new mobo,
while you at it, do some temp runs, to have a before and after tempdrop, make screenies etc


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> better redo the vid kiddo, i dont think it runs like that,
> click video, then use ctrl v to get the vidlink in, works for me if i use it,
> yea, i showed some of the vids we made on here already,
> Val knows you can delid and have experience delidding, no worries ..lol
> he just trying you to get to delid the 8350 ..haha,
> i tell you right now, we not gonna do that! (dad talks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


And so does his wallet


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> about 10C tempdrop if you use another tim on the die, maybe a bit more/less, depends..
> Phobya HeGrease, Thermal conductivity: 8.5W/mK, thats about the same w/mk AS5 has i think
> 
> yea, i would check if everything works on the new mobo,
> while you at it, do some temp runs, to have a before and after tempdrop, make screenies etc


Seems reasonable, may just do without my desktop until the weekend and do it right the first time.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blackopsje*
> 
> haha thx valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well i have experience with delliding pentium 4's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this is how we do it if it is soldered


noooo, not the soldered cpu vid delid, now everyone want their +rep's back, that vid is bad for my reputation ...LOL








dang kids........







was great fun doing it tho, but its not a good way to delid a soldered cpu, that we know now,
the example we saw on youtube, im betting that cpu didnt work afterwards,




 ( poor i7 920)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> And so does his wallet










.


----------



## Swag

I've delidded for quite some time and have delidded some soldered CPUs, it is harder and much risker IMHO. Although, the results do speak for themselves. Even though they are soldered which is basically a metal contact to the IHS, there are little air bubbles that go in-between the solder and that's what makes the temps bad. I'd highly recommend delidding a soldered CPU!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've delidded for quite some time and have delidded some soldered CPUs, it is harder and much risker IMHO. Although, the results do speak for themselves. Even though they are soldered which is basically a metal contact to the IHS, there are little air bubbles that go in-between the solder and that's what makes the temps bad. I'd highly recommend delidding a soldered CPU!


yea, we just wanted to try, like the vid we saw on youtube,
im sure if we really would do our best, we can get it done, and it would still work afterwards too,
the guy in the vid said this in responses..

"maomaofilm 4 maanden geleden
It helps to decrease the core temperature by about 8-10 Celsius, I have it overclocked to 4GHz at 1.28V. Temperature is very good.﻿"

so it seems its still working..guess he didnt use liquid pro on the die then ..hehe..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've delidded for quite some time and have delidded some soldered CPUs, it is harder and much risker IMHO. Although, the results do speak for themselves. Even though they are soldered which is basically a metal contact to the IHS, there are little air bubbles that go in-between the solder and that's what makes the temps bad. I'd highly recommend delidding a soldered CPU!


Are we going to have the first delidded 8350?! I bettter make a new spreedsheet.

Okay guys I need my brain to fall asleep in my art class tomorrow so goodnight


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Are we going to have the first delidded 8350?! I bettter make a new spreedsheet.
> 
> Okay guys I need my brain to fall asleep in my art class tomorrow so goodnight


i like to be the first with things, but.. my kiddo's 8350 isnt running that hot anyways,
still have to see what it does when were gonna oc it..soon









sleep well Val, day shift is here so ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Seems reasonable, may just do without my desktop until the weekend and do it right the first time.


and chance to get a old pentium? great to practice on, before the real delid








to get the feel on how to delid..what to do etc..
i bought 10 old pentiums for 10 euro, for the delid project i did with my kids ..


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> After watching sin0822's video I bet your core is actually around 1.5v. In case you didn't see it here it is.


Very interesting, I have a multi meter so I may run similar test on my Z77 UD5H to see how much overshoot I get, I do prefer to use lower levels of LLC after reading that anand article a while back. I guess higher levels at lower clocks, vcore are ok etc, but for those wanting 5GHz 24/7 running nearly 1.45v-1.5v that overshoot could get nasty.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Wow, that is sooooo soooooo lucky! Looks like you just nicked the corner of the CPU slightly and took some of the glass off the top of the IMC
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would actually consider yourself one of the luckiest guys here.. haha. I do actually want some shots off the DSLR when you can because that is so interesting


So I keep hearing dude







When I did it I was 99.9% certain I'd killed it, couldn't believe it when it posted lol

Anyway, I'll be stripping her down over the weekend again, so will bust out the DSLR and try use the Macro lense on it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> So I've been wanting to delid my i7-3770k for a little while now but haven't gotten around to stripping my pc down. But, I'm about to be installing a new Maximus V Formula and will have my water loop disassembled anyway.
> 
> I have 2 questions, first how much of a performance hit will I get using Phobya HeGrease instead of Liquid Pro? Namely I intend to get Liquid Pro, but am waiting on PPC's to get in more of my fittings before I place one big order so it would just be a temporary usage.
> 
> And 2nd, I should probably verify my new board works before delidding so that I can rule out the board if an issue arises?


I've currently got Phoyba HeGrease on my 3570K and I've seen a 15C drop in temperatures. Be putting Liquid Pro on it over the weekend and I'll throw up my results.

May even invest in some Liquid Ultra for IHS>Waterblock.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Very interesting, I have a multi meter so I may run similar test on my Z77 UD5H to see how much overshoot I get, I do prefer to use lower levels of LLC after reading that anand article a while back. I guess higher levels at lower clocks, vcore are ok etc, but for those wanting 5GHz 24/7 running nearly 1.45v-1.5v that overshoot could get nasty.
> So I keep hearing dude
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When I did it I was 99.9% certain I'd killed it, couldn't believe it when it posted lol
> 
> Anyway, I'll be stripping her down over the weekend again, so will bust out the DSLR and try use the Macro lense on it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've currently got Phoyba HeGrease on my 3570K and I've seen a 15C drop in temperatures. Be putting Liquid Pro on it over the weekend and I'll throw up my results.
> 
> May even invest in some Liquid Ultra for IHS>Waterblock.


seems to be a problem with asrock mobo's, your UD5 should be better, but cant hurt to test it right








what anandtech article was that Matt26LFC?


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> seems to be a problem with asrock mobo's, your UD5 should be better, but cant hurt to test it right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what anandtech article was that Matt26LFC?


Correct about the issue being with Asrock boards.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> seems to be a problem with asrock mobo's, your UD5 should be better, but cant hurt to test it right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what anandtech article was that Matt26LFC?


Hopefully, but since I have the gear needed I'll do some tests at some point and publish my results with this board.

Be great if others could do the same thing with there boards and we can put all the data together, could be a nice little resource.

It was that article from 2007 when I learned of overshoot using LLC, no doubt LLC has gotten better since then, however I will always try OC using low amounts of LLC if I can. They also have an UD5H article where they reported strange goings on with the voltage readings.


----------



## chris-br

If you see here:

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/52/97190065.jpg/

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

you can see that sin already tested the ud5h.









Dunno if you saw this already, here is the thread where i got the image: http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/0_100


----------



## Gomi

God I love this place - Ever since I delidded the temps been beyond imagination.

Nearly 20 hours into Foldathon:

a. dont mind the GPU3 temperature - It is getting an RMA (Already approved by eVGA) right after this Foldathon (Reseated twice, same crap - First time I booted it up it shot straight to 101C, lol - Faulty block).

b. Running at a "measly" 4.8Ghz @ 1.32 Vcore, when it comes to folding its all about keeping heat down and even more important NO errors while folding - Loosing a 6 hour WorkUnit because of a WHEA or some fluke instability is a valid reason to grey hairs and frustration.


----------



## chris-br

Temps look really good. congrats

I'm dying to get one of these: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/15655/cst-1298/Phobya_WaCoolT_Test_Bench_-_Black_73364.html But the price of shipping to Brazil is prohibitive... almost 300 dollars... CRAZY!!!!


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> If you see here:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/52/97190065.jpg/
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> 
> you can see that sin already tested the ud5h.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dunno if you saw this already, here is the thread where i got the image: http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/0_100


Nice one, cheers matey, I'll have a look through it. Still may test, see if results are comparable.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Temps look really good. congrats
> 
> I'm dying to get one of these: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/15655/cst-1298/Phobya_WaCoolT_Test_Bench_-_Black_73364.html But the price of shipping to Brazil is prohibitive... almost 300 dollars... CRAZY!!!!


I want a test bench also, make life so much easier lol I'd prefer to build a dedicated benching rig also so I can hopefully play with sub zero down the line







Would like to try keep my everyday/gaming rig seperate tbh


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blackopsje*
> 
> Dang hookies ;P
> 
> wait a few years everything will be multi thread might want to think about "borrowing" it for a long time >:-D good night
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @vondutch
> 
> :/ well it sucks that it is soldered i guess its not a good idea to try with a lighter like we did on the pentiums
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , i hoped it was not becouse its always fun to delid xD
> thanks for the answer ill go to the amd cave.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can you come on tweakers ? i reached my max mails here


Only Amd fan boi clubs say that....

And you do know a 3770k is a 8 threaded cpu right? that is 50% faster ipc and uses less power while doing so?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Only Amd fan boi clubs say that....
> 
> And you do know a 3770k is a 8 threaded cpu right? that is 50% faster ipc and uses less power while doing so?


lol, Blackopsje was just here, on his way to his mum now








no worries, he knows the difference


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol, Blackopsje was just here, on his way to his mum now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no worries, he knows the difference


Tell him in Car terms.

Amd 8350 = That slow as heck bus that seats 8 people.

Intel 3770k = bus with super speed carry's 8 people to the same place 50% faster while using less gas.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Tell him in Car terms.
> 
> Amd 8350 = That slow as heck bus that seats 8 people.
> 
> Intel 3770k = bus with super speed carry's 8 people to the same place 50% faster while using less gas.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> for me, i always had amd before, going from amd to intel
> 
> felt like going from this
> 
> 
> to this
> 
> haha


i posted this last week orso in sin's guide ...lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i posted this last week orso in sin's guide ...lol


I do know new intel is over priced where your at.

In the states the difference in cost makes there no reason to buy Amd at all.

How is the used market there also the prices on 2600ks?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> coolabs liguid pro/ultra


Thanks hopefully I can find it in Vancouver so I dont have to wait


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've delidded for quite some time and have delidded some soldered CPUs, it is harder and much risker IMHO. Although, the results do speak for themselves. Even though they are soldered which is basically a metal contact to the IHS, there are little air bubbles that go in-between the solder and that's what makes the temps bad. I'd highly recommend delidding a soldered CPU!
> 
> 
> 
> Are we going to have the first delidded 8350?! I bettter make a new spreedsheet.
> 
> Okay guys I need my brain to fall asleep in my art class tomorrow so goodnight
Click to expand...

Well, I have no access to an AMD chip right now but I did use the torch method before.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do know new intel is over priced where your at.
> 
> In the states the difference in cost makes there no reason to buy Amd at all.
> 
> How is the used market there also the prices on 2600ks?


dont faint on me now but, the cheapest 2600k i can find here now,

Intel Core i7 2600K Boxed
Socket 1155 CPU van 3,4GHz
3,4GHz
3,8GHz
95W
€ 263,70 which is about 351 U.S. dollars ..omg

used cpu's, you have to be lucky to find a nice priced,
just did some checking, like this one isnt bad,

Intel Core i5 3570K Boxed, is used a few weeks, 160 euro, about 213 U.S. dollars

a new 3570K is about 200 euro, about 266 U.S. dollars, cheapest i can find atm

AMD FX-8350 Boxed
Socket AM3+ CPU van 4GHz
4GHz
4,2GHz
125W
€ 173,90

is close to a 3570 no K, that costs 182.60 euro


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> dont faint on me now but, the cheapest 2600k i can find here now,
> 
> Intel Core i7 2600K Boxed
> Socket 1155 CPU van 3,4GHz
> 3,4GHz
> 3,8GHz
> 95W
> € 263,70 which is about 351 U.S. dollars ..omg
> 
> used cpu's, you have to be lucky to find a nice priced,
> just did some checking, like this one isnt bad,
> 
> Intel Core i5 3570K Boxed, is used a few weeks, 160 euro, about 213 U.S. dollars
> 
> a new 3570K is about 200 euro, about 266 U.S. dollars, cheapest atm i can find


Looks to me ur better off having somebody get you one from MicroCenter and have it shipped to you as a gift with a low declared value.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Looks to me ur better off having somebody get you one from MicroCenter and have it shipped to you as a gift with a low declared value.


for sure, wish i meet you guys when i was building my rig ..lol
but will keep it in mind when i start my next build...euhm..next year ..lol
still want better, higher mhz ram tho, saving money for it now..

ow, what is past tense for "meet" ..met?


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> so i set my 7970 to 1100/1500 again, using CCC, rebooted, and ..
> its set to 1080/1480 ??
> 
> am i missing something, didnt know a program can just downclock,
> could it be that the oc is to high? i cant change voltage on my 7970, its hardware locked if i understand right
> 
> edit
> this is getting weird, ive set to 1100/1500 again, problem is back,
> set it to 1080/1480, rebooted, opened CCC and its set to 1100/1500, and it works now ...lol
> 
> any help is welcome, do i have a ghost in my machine? ..lol i am using the latest 13.2 drivers now,
> could it be that?


Use MSI afterburner to unlock the voltage tweak and only install the drivers from ATI, the one without CCC.

I got my 5870 to 900/1200 that way.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Temps look really good. congrats
> 
> I'm dying to get one of these: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/15655/cst-1298/Phobya_WaCoolT_Test_Bench_-_Black_73364.html But the price of shipping to Brazil is prohibitive... almost 300 dollars... CRAZY!!!!


Build your own!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> for sure, wish i meet you guys when i was building my rig ..lol
> but will keep it in mind when i start my next build...euhm..next year ..lol
> still want better, higher mhz ram tho, saving money for it now..
> 
> ow, what is past tense for "meet" ..met?


Yes, met is the correct terminology lol.

Have any of you guys seen my project in the sponsored threads? I'm trying to get more viewers on on it for my sponsors.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1299840/sponsored-project-black-ice


----------



## stickg1

I'm sure Von Dutch's son is more than happy to have a 8350 because it isn't that bad. Also it was given to him and in sure he's grateful. I had a issue with my 7 year old after I built a desktop for him and his mom to use he said "I wish I had an iPad" and it was really hard for me not to choke his little arse... But I said "hey you want an iPad? Fine, let's sell some of your toys and get one. He rounded up a bunch of his favorite stuff and it was only worth about $100 and he got really bummed out.


----------



## stickg1

double post


----------



## YarozeX

Hi, I am new here! Working on building my first PC and just delidded my Ivy Bridge 3570k. Waiting on the TIM to put it back together and in the motherboard. How does it look?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YarozeX*
> 
> Hi, I am new here! Working on building my first PC and just delidded my Ivy Bridge 3570k. Waiting on the TIM to put it back together and in the motherboard. How does it look?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


looks beautifull naked lol


----------



## lilchronic

just saw this video and this is the way i did mine got 1 corner with a razor blade then used a laminated card to do the rest worked great.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YarozeX*
> 
> Hi, I am new here! Working on building my first PC and just delidded my Ivy Bridge 3570k. Waiting on the TIM to put it back together and in the motherboard. How does it look?
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]


it looks ...HUGE! ...lol nice pics YarozeX,
but yea, it looks very nice and clean, keep us posted(with smaller pics pls ..lol)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm sure Von Dutch's son is more than happy to have a 8350 because it isn't that bad. Also it was given to him and in sure he's grateful. I had a issue with my 7 year old after I built a desktop for him and his mom to use he said "I wish I had an iPad" and it was really hard for me not to choke his little arse... But I said "hey you want an iPad? Fine, let's sell some of your toys and get one. He rounded up a bunch of his favorite stuff and it was only worth about $100 and he got really bummed out.


thanks, yea,. he is very happy, when i build my rig , we replaced his old computer(pentium4) with my parts,
i had a 1100T in it, we sold it for a very very nice prize, like 140 euro, and bought the 8350 for 185 euro








its Pebbles in my sig, thats his now, only need another psu, then its about done..

my youngest has another one of my old comps(amd quad core, 5770 gpu), then i changed electric/gas company, and got a free ipad4 for him! woot!..LOL
2 happy kids








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just saw this video and this is the way i did mine got 1 corner with a razor blade then used a laminated card to do the rest worked great.


yep, i know the vid, thats what gave me the idea of using some kind of card to do the job,
but its very hard to find for me, and a creditcard is way to thick, so gave up on the idea,
its still a good one tho, was thinking if someone has a laminate machine, to make your own (sturdy) card to use see








but were trying to find ways to delid, with things that almost everyone has, or can get easy ..
what card was that , which you used lilchronic?


----------



## YarozeX

Sorta what I did to mine, Used more razor blade on it thou.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> coolabs liguid pro/ultra
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks hopefully I can find it in Vancouver so I dont have to wait
Click to expand...

There's none in Vancouver, you have to order it in


----------



## DiamondCut

That slim card looks like more work that its worth. I would of use the blade to do every corner and then used the card to get the sides since there is more chance to gashing the pcb there.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> That slim card looks like more work that its worth. I would of use the blade to do every corner and then used the card to get the sides since there is more chance to gashing the pcb there.


my laminated motorcycle license worked great slid right threw the glue and all the way around just like the razor


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my laminated motorcycle license worked great slid right threw the glue and all the way around just like the razor


my motorcycle license is as thick as a normal credit card ..grmbl ..lol
a laminated card is very thin on the sides, thats good..and soft,
so prolly less chance to harm the pcb..


woop ,here it is, my new XFX ProSeries 850W XXX Edition , 80 Plus Silver









just ordered it,
my kiddo is getting my 750W XFX


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YarozeX*
> 
> Hi, I am new here! Working on building my first PC and just delidded my Ivy Bridge 3570k. Waiting on the TIM to put it back together and in the motherboard. How does it look?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


How did you remove the glue? Looks perfect otherwise.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> my motorcycle license is as thick as a normal credit card ..grmbl ..lol
> a laminated card is very thin on the sides, thats good..and soft,
> so prolly less chance to harm the pcb..
> 
> 
> woop ,here it is, my new XFX ProSeries 850W XXX Edition , 80 Plus Silver
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just ordered it,
> my kiddo is getting my 750W XFX


im still waiting on a damn blue power supply 1200w+.


----------



## chann3l

I'm going to delid my 3770k this weekend. I have seen some people running with direct die contact instead of the ihs. I have a raystorm waterblock should I run with or without ihs?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I'm going to delid my 3770k this weekend. I have seen some people running with direct die contact instead of the ihs. I have a raystorm waterblock should I run with or without ihs?


Depends how comfortable you are doing it. Just use the IHS, it isn't really a limiting factor, save ~1ºC


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Depends how comfortable you are doing it. Just use the IHS, it isn't really a limiting factor, save ~1ºC


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Depends how comfortable you are doing it. Just use the IHS, it isn't really a limiting factor, save ~1ºC


Ya I'll probably stick to the ihs too afraid of too much pressure on the doe otherwise. As far as putting on the Tim just half rice size and dont spread?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Ya I'll probably stick to the ihs too afraid of too much pressure on the doe otherwise. As far as putting on the Tim just half rice size and dont spread?


what tim are you using?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Build your own!


No way... i wouldn't know how and plus i'm too lazy and don't have time for those kind of projects.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> No way... i wouldn't know how and plus i'm too lazy and don't have time for those kind of projects.










Hire me! I started my own full acrylic build but I couldn't get hardware sponsors so I put it on hold









http://www.overclock.net/t/1285164/scratch-acrylic-case-project-diamond


----------



## GHADthc

I've got a quick question about delidding a 3570K, I've seen several processes of taking the IHS off of the chip, and then applying different TIM's to the die, what then do you do to re-attach the IHS back to the chip? some sort of adhesive?
Also one other question, should I bother sourcing myself some Liquid Pro/Ultra or just use some GC Extreme on it? (That I have laying around) Is there that big of a difference between the two? also has anyone bothered to lap their IHS after removal? or should I just not bother and use something like IX or Liquid Pro, GC Extreme for contact with my water block?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GHADthc*
> 
> I've got a quick question about delidding a 3570K, I've seen several processes of taking the IHS off of the chip, and then applying different TIM's to the die, what then do you do to re-attach the IHS back to the chip? some sort of adhesive?
> Also one other question, should I bother sourcing myself some Liquid Pro/Ultra or just use some GC Extreme on it? (That I have laying around) Is there that big of a difference between the two? also has anyone bothered to lap their IHS after removal? or should I just not bother and use something like IX or Liquid Pro, GC Extreme for contact with my water block?


the bracket will hold down the ihs when you place it back, no need for glueing it back on








use the liquid pro/ultra on the die, it has the highest w/mk, so it will work best,
on the ihs both tim's will perform good enough, because the heat dispensing area is bigger..
some here have lapped the ihs, but there no big difference in tempdrop doing so,
1-3C max, if any difference at all









if after delid, and everything is seated good, and you still have high temps,
or big difference in temps between cores,
then you should look into lapping, it could be the ihs is concave ..


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what tim are you using?


Going to use as5 its the best I can get locally and I've seen a delidding review done with it with good temps


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GHADthc*
> 
> I've got a quick question about delidding a 3570K, I've seen several processes of taking the IHS off of the chip, and then applying different TIM's to the die, what then do you do to re-attach the IHS back to the chip? some sort of adhesive?
> Also one other question, should I bother sourcing myself some Liquid Pro/Ultra or just use some GC Extreme on it? (That I have laying around) Is there that big of a difference between the two? also has anyone bothered to lap their IHS after removal? or should I just not bother and use something like IX or Liquid Pro, GC Extreme for contact with my water block?


Use CLP or Ultra but I recommend pro. Like the other guy said, no glue is needed at all. I plan on lapping my IHS just for the slight imperfections that may exist.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Going to use as5 its the best I can get locally and I've seen a delidding review done with it with good temps


yea np, ive used it too, had to wait for liquid pro to arrive,

AS5 used on the die


liquid pro used on the die


25C difference between using AS5 or liquid pro,
dont care about other reviews etc, i know that liquid pro beats all other tim's when used on the die









you can also order direct from their site, if you cant get it locally..
http://coollaboratory.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/26/osCsid/77214543f8f25f1d38dcf0837bd7dd63

another thing to note when using tim's like AS5, is the pump out effect that can happen, due to fast temp going up and down,
ever wondered why the tim on a just delidded ivy looks like this?

you see how much time is spread out on the ihs, its pumped out, making temps even worse after a while.
some notes,

pump out effect, basic concept

"Large and fast decreases in temperature when coupled with HLT instructions.
A usage pattern that alternates between full idle and full load conditions
will cause die temps to swing WIDE AND FAST, particularly with overclocked/overvolted CPUs.

This thermal cycling causes TIM pump-out, wherein the TIM gets ejected and displaced by air,
which is of course not a good thing.

Greases also creep, again worsening the situation."

I think this happens more often with IB because of how quick it heats up and cools off.
The die contact area is so small with such drastic temperatures is another reason.

liquid pro and ultra dont have pump out effect as much as other tims, another reason to use it on the die








k, enough of my babbling, i feel like a salesman..lol..G'night guys


----------



## Vi0lence

uh guys is this correct? i can do this benchmark again easily. i did it like 4 times to get this score. reran the test and got same score. im just making sure.

http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2348155_


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hire me! I started my own full acrylic build but I couldn't get hardware sponsors so I put it on hold
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1285164/scratch-acrylic-case-project-diamond


No, i want a steel test bench and has to be powder coated.. so the phobya is the choice. also,. can fit 2 360 rads one on each side.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GHADthc*
> 
> I've got a quick question about delidding a 3570K, I've seen several processes of taking the IHS off of the chip, and then applying different TIM's to the die, what then do you do to re-attach the IHS back to the chip? some sort of adhesive?
> Also one other question, should I bother sourcing myself some Liquid Pro/Ultra or just use some GC Extreme on it? (That I have laying around) Is there that big of a difference between the two? also has anyone bothered to lap their IHS after removal? or should I just not bother and use something like IX or Liquid Pro, GC Extreme for contact with my water block?


I left a small amount of glue on the PCB to keep it still but I was worried about the traces so don't be afraid and make that baby's butt shine!







Also with the Lapping don't do it just in case of a issue with the chip so you might be able to fix it. I loved IX for my IHS I have one more application left to and I'm very excited to use it again.

I really need to do that review of it as well. new chip should be here this week!.... im uuuuber excited








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Going to use as5 its the best I can get locally and I've seen a delidding review done with it with good temps


I don't like as5 look at the OP and check out the TIM list I added to there just look at the thermal movements of Liquid pro/ ultra vs as5 it's amazing stuff. That's why all of us use it!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> uh guys is this correct? i can do this benchmark again easily. i did it like 4 times to get this score. reran the test and got same score. im just making sure.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2348155_


looks like it, i can only get to 10.32 at that speed


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I left a small amount of glue on the PCB to keep it still but I was worried about the traces so don't be afraid and make that baby's butt shine!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also with the Lapping don't do it just in case of a issue with the chip so you might be able to fix it. I loved IX for my IHS I have one more application left to and I'm very excited to use it again.
> 
> I really need to do that review of it as well. new chip should be here this week!.... im uuuuber excited
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't like as5 look at the OP and check out the TIM list I added to there just look at the thermal movements of Liquid pro/ ultra vs as5 it's amazing stuff. That's why all of us use it!


we have such good timing, i go to bed, and you wake up ..hahaha








G'night boss


----------



## Vi0lence

i asked hwbot. if thats the case its a record from what the link says. i did it twice. same score. i can do it again too. if thats the case comp is going out in the garage and ill get it faster when its colder me thinks. i hops its true. id be super happy.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we have such good timing, i go to bed, and you wake up ..hahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G'night boss


I know great timing... until work comes lol!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i asked hwbot. if thats the case its a record from what the link says. i did it twice. same score. i can do it again too. if thats the case comp is going out in the garage and ill get it faster when its colder me thinks. i hops its true. id be super happy.


Already told ya buddy... you have the 4 core CPU world record right now on water. again... congratulations!!!!

I'm your competition now! along with half of the delidded crewman... consider yourself warned!!!!! we shall beat you!!!!









All in fun that is


----------



## Vi0lence

i just picked up some new ram that might get shipped out today that may help a bit. i can bring the comp in the garage too. tamps only got up to 72c that run at 1.625v.









im for it. its all in good fun. ill be excited for now. and im gonna try and knock off that 2600k.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> No, i want a steel test bench and has to be powder coated.. so the phobya is the choice. also,. can fit 2 360 rads one on each side.


I can fabricate metal and I can power coat







I can make sure to make it as compressible as possible for shipping too!


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep, i know the vid, thats what gave me the idea of using some kind of card to do the job,
> but its very hard to find for me, and a creditcard is way to thick, so gave up on the idea,
> its still a good one tho, was thinking if someone has a laminate machine, to make your own (sturdy) card to use see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but were trying to find ways to delid, with things that almost everyone has, or can get easy ..
> what card was that , which you used lilchronic?


I have this feeling we have a laminating machine hidden somewhere around the house. I think I'll have to try hunt it down tonight.







I also have a few old, dead 775 CPUs that I can practice delidding on.







I also live fairly near this PC store that is overpriced on all their new stuff, but they sell some really old CPUs in this box at the back corner. Might have to go in there and get some extras.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Going to use as5 its the best I can get locally and I've seen a delidding review done with it with good temps


Go to sidewindercomputers.com and order Liquid Pro and something small to compensate for shipping cost.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> uh guys is this correct? i can do this benchmark again easily. i did it like 4 times to get this score. reran the test and got same score. im just making sure.
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2348155_


Very nice man! no need to worry...also, that bench doesn't give out boints so run the other cpu benchies whenever you feel like it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> I can fabricate metal and I can power coat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can make sure to make it as compressible as possible for shipping too!


That sounds great! Wonder how much it'd cost.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> I have this feeling we have a laminating machine hidden somewhere around the house. I think I'll have to try hunt it down tonight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also have a few old, dead 775 CPUs that I can practice delidding on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also live fairly near this PC store that is overpriced on all their new stuff, but they sell some really old CPUs in this box at the back corner. Might have to go in there and get some extras.


Dead 775 sounds right, but most of em are soldered, save for a few like the Celeron d single cores. Socket 478 is your best bet, grab a board and you can bench it with ddr1







Doubt your score will be beaten on air with lp on die lol


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Dead 775 sounds right, but most of em are soldered, save for a few like the Celeron d single cores. Socket 478 is your best bet, grab a board and you can bench it with ddr1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Doubt your score will be beaten on air with lp on die lol


Haha yeah, I don't really plan to bench those, but I would like to give making my own laminated delidding card a shot. Maybe I can learn a thing or two to share with others about it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> Haha yeah, I don't really plan to bench those, but I would like to give making my own laminated delidding card a shot. Maybe I can learn a thing or two to share with others about it.


Sounds like a plan...


----------



## Vi0lence

i did superpi 1m but it wouldnt take my screenshot. gonna try it again later. got 5.3ghz in 1m. i think i can get it higher. i got some new ram i want to try for that also in the mail.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i did superpi 1m but it wouldnt take my screenshot. gonna try it again later. got 5.3ghz in 1m. i think i can get it higher. i got some new ram i want to try for that also in the mail.


5.3 is my highest ive gone on a 3570k to scared to go any higher vcore


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 5.3 is my highest ive gone on a 3570k to scared to go any higher vcore


Windows 7? If you have a spare HDD around, 32bit XP for 2d benches like superpi & wprime.
Just looking at the notepad, 5.2Ghz 1.52V, forgot to update it with the new clocks







.


----------



## Vi0lence

im on windows 7 64 bit also.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Windows 7? If you have a spare HDD around, 32bit XP for 2d benches like superpi & wprime.
> Just looking at the notepad, 5.2Ghz 1.52V, forgot to update it with the new clocks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


windows 7
lol yea i forgot to update note pad and i also need a little bit more vcore for 5.2ghz i get whea errors @1.52v and anything over that in my bios worries me but i have tried 5.4ghz with 1.65v once but it crased before i could get cpu-z to even validare it lol . wont try that again till i get a better mobo .


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> im on windows 7 64 bit also.


Getting into benching for hwbot you really do need a drive with XP. Using 580s most dx9 3d benching will do better than win7, as well as superpi, pifast, & wprime.


----------



## Vi0lence

can you even still buy copies of windows xp?


----------



## FtW 420

I'm not sure if you can still buy, MS has dropped support for it so doubt they still ship it. Tiny xp is still out there, all stripped & ready for benching.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> windows 7
> lol yea i forgot to update note pad and i also need a little bit more vcore for 5.2ghz i get whea errors @1.52v and anything over that in my bios worries me but i have tried 5.4ghz with 1.65v once but it crased before i could get cpu-z to even validare it lol . wont try that again till i get a better mobo .


Up to 1.55v is fine ive ran it 24/7 for a long time and have hundreds of hours of stress testing and gaming.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'm not sure if you can still buy, MS has dropped support for it so doubt they still ship it. Tiny xp is still out there, all stripped & ready for benching.


if i could find it id buy it. i have 2 ssd's in the closet i could see if they work.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> if i could find it id buy it. i have 2 ssd's in the closet i could see if they work.


Im sure you can just torrent it....


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Im sure you can just torrent it....


yup


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Windows 7? If you have a spare HDD around, 32bit XP for 2d benches like superpi & wprime.
> Just looking at the notepad, 5.2Ghz 1.52V, forgot to update it with the new clocks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


You like to help, right?








Give this guys a few pointers properly...I couldn't get them to join mah team lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Getting into benching for hwbot you really do need a drive with XP. Using 580s most dx9 3d benching will do better than win7, as well as superpi, pifast, & wprime.


Yup...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'm not sure if you can still buy, MS has dropped support for it so doubt they still ship it. Tiny xp is still out there, all stripped & ready for benching.


Ha, you can do better than that








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Im sure you can just torrent it....


Nope, I'm sure your buddy FtW could point you in the right direction, for a more barebones XP, right? Not gonna collaborate with yall more than that. xD

No need to activate your XP copies fellas, just install the thing bench, bork the Os with instability...format. Rinse and repeat.


----------



## Vi0lence

i thought i was the only one who said bork. lol


----------



## alancsalt

TinyXP rev5 - a cut down version for overclocking.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/26236097/TinyXP%20rev%205.iso


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You like to help, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Give this guys a few pointers properly...I couldn't get them to join mah team lol
> Yup...
> Ha, you can do better than that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nope, I'm sure your buddy FtW could point you in the right direction, for a more barebones XP, right? Not gonna collaborate with yall more than that. xD
> 
> No need to activate your XP copies fellas, just install the thing bench, bork the Os with instability...format. Rinse and repeat.


It can be tough to skirt the TOS when discussing such things in the open.
edit; I should leave that out & PM


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i thought i was the only one who said bork. lol


BORKED Os ain't funny lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It can be tough to skirt the TOS when discussing such things in the open.
> edit; I should leave that out & PM


Yep, but I bet not activating a copy isn't too bad, right? Plus it's rather legacy at this point, and it's what 99% of the guys at hwbot do.


----------



## Vi0lence

ill have to dl it later. i have a old socket 478 build i can try it on. if it will work.


----------



## bsofdth

Decided to delid my new 3770k today.

I just built this setup on Friday and was disappointed with the temps after overclocking to 4.6GHz @ 1.32V. At 4.7GHz I was reaching the 105 limit and at 4.6 I maxed out at 94.

During the process, I was scared to wiggle the razor from the corners to the side because it kept catching on the bottom of the IHS. I eventually got it in but I saw the copper orange color showing slightly under one one the edges with a lip. About an hour passes because I'm terrified of scratching the chip and I finally got the pieces separated. Turns out, the chip was 100% undamaged and I had chipped the bottom edge of the IHS.

After doing a quick test, my max temps have dropped by 22 degrees. I am happy. I even made an account to share my joy.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> ill have to dl it later. i have a old socket 478 build i can try it on. if it will work.


Delid the cpu first! Celeron chips clocked really well...My 3.2ee sl7b8 did 4ghz 24/7 without delidding, with an xp-90


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bsofdth*
> 
> Decided to delid my new 3770k today.
> 
> I just built this setup on Friday and was disappointed with the temps after overclocking to 4.6GHz @ 1.32V. At 4.7GHz I was reaching the 105 limit and at 4.6 I maxed out at 94.
> 
> During the process, I was scared to wiggle the razor from the corners to the side because it kept catching on the bottom of the IHS. I eventually got it in but I saw the copper orange color showing slightly under one one the edges with a lip. About an hour passes because I'm terrified of scratching the chip and I finally got the pieces separated. Turns out, the chip was 100% undamaged and I had chipped the bottom edge of the IHS.
> 
> After doing a quick test, my max temps have dropped by 22 degrees. I am happy. I even made an account to share my joy.


Congrats man! Great first post too...


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Delid the cpu first! Celeron chips clocked really well...My 3.2ee sl7b8 did 4ghz 24/7 without delidding, with an xp-90


there pentium 4 chips. one is a 2.44ghz and one is another one i forget which


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hmmm give them a go...delidded with CL Pro they should clock GREAT, even on stock cooling xD


----------



## Vi0lence

you can delid those?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ketapang*
> 
> Mine came off easy too & it was my 1st time. If you use the right tools & gave the right pressure, you will easily remove the ihs without damaging the processor. I might go for another one later but i will see 1st if my budget allows.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT:
> Here's my attempt on 4.6Ghz, 10hours of prime95 with 90% usage ram. Hitting 102c on highest core... Will ordered Liquid Pro soon and shave another 10c.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Abit off topic here, how do i make my rig below the signature to be visible?


I'm guessing you've probably tried lower volts but I am perfectly stable at 4.6 ghz at 1.26 volts 1.384 is a lot lol.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bsofdth*
> 
> Decided to delid my new 3770k today.
> 
> I just built this setup on Friday and was disappointed with the temps after overclocking to 4.6GHz @ 1.32V. At 4.7GHz I was reaching the 105 limit and at 4.6 I maxed out at 94.
> 
> During the process, I was scared to wiggle the razor from the corners to the side because it kept catching on the bottom of the IHS. I eventually got it in but I saw the copper orange color showing slightly under one one the edges with a lip. About an hour passes because I'm terrified of scratching the chip and I finally got the pieces separated. Turns out, the chip was 100% undamaged and I had chipped the bottom edge of the IHS.
> 
> After doing a quick test, my max temps have dropped by 22 degrees. I am happy. I even made an account to share my joy.


Congrats! What thermal paste did you use?









I forgot to quote: But yes you can de-lid most P4's, read the OP in this thread and you can verify if you can with your specific CPU or not. Pentium 4's are easier to de-lid too because there is no Graphics Processor in there so physically the core is smaller. (Therefore less likely to damage it)

De-lidded Pentium 4's will be amazing, what to be careful of is that from what I've done some of the CPU's I had ran with a solid-type paste that still comes off and it still works but you just can't remove it. The ones that this was on were Celerons, not Pentium 4's. They also have a solid copper square in the center (Where the core is). I can take photos if you guys like.









These were socket 775 Celerons from what I remember.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 5.3 is my highest ive gone on a 3570k to scared to go any higher vcore


pffffffft vcore vsmores crank it baby!!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'm not sure if you can still buy, MS has dropped support for it so doubt they still ship it. Tiny xp is still out there, all stripped & ready for benching.


I still don't understand why I couldn't get mine to work though..... I have no idea why server 2003 works fine.. but xp wont at all....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> if i could find it id buy it. i have 2 ssd's in the closet i could see if they work.


Send me one please! that way I can use it just to bench.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> TinyXP rev5
> 
> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/26236097/TinyXP%20rev%205.iso


Mr Salt to the rescue!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bsofdth*
> 
> Decided to delid my new 3770k today.
> 
> I just built this setup on Friday and was disappointed with the temps after overclocking to 4.6GHz @ 1.32V. At 4.7GHz I was reaching the 105 limit and at 4.6 I maxed out at 94.
> 
> During the process, I was scared to wiggle the razor from the corners to the side because it kept catching on the bottom of the IHS. I eventually got it in but I saw the copper orange color showing slightly under one one the edges with a lip. About an hour passes because I'm terrified of scratching the chip and I finally got the pieces separated. Turns out, the chip was 100% undamaged and I had chipped the bottom edge of the IHS.
> 
> After doing a quick test, my max temps have dropped by 22 degrees. I am happy. I even made an account to share my joy.


Now thats a first post I like to see!!!! quick question! did you get your delidding information from here?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> pffffffft vcore vsmores crank it baby!!!!


my mobo is crap im scared it my short out or somthing. my voltage in the bios goes red after 1.52v i dont know if that happens on the highend mobo's but i need 1 anyway. this is my second chip and ive heard what happend to franky


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Send me one please! that way I can use it just to bench.
> :


if it works more power to ya. there old corsair force 3 gt drives. idk if they work anymore. and that little L in the power socket thing broke.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> if it works more power to ya. there old corsair force 3 gt drives. idk if they work anymore. and that little L in the power socket thing broke.


Ah thing that holds the sata power connector in?

It also makes correct spacing had it happen to me and to do some rigging on an old HDD i had.


----------



## Vi0lence

no the L shape peice on the power connection. there is a little tab that hangs down. the corner of it broke off. i was pissed. i just fell apart. the drives ran good. but one day i had them in raid 0 and they just stopped working. idk if it was the windows install got borked, or the drive went. i got intel 520's and the problem went away so i just never hooked them back up. coulda been a bad sata cable too.


----------



## Hokies83

Id see if they work and sell / donate them to friends.


----------



## bsofdth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Congrats! What thermal paste did you use?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I forgot to quote: But yes you can de-lid most P4's, read the OP in this thread and you can verify if you can with your specific CPU or not. Pentium 4's are easier to de-lid too because there is no Graphics Processor in there so physically the core is smaller. (Therefore less likely to damage it)
> 
> De-lidded Pentium 4's will be amazing, what to be careful of is that from what I've done some of the CPU's I had ran with a solid-type paste that still comes off and it still works but you just can't remove it. The ones that this was on were Celerons, not Pentium 4's. They also have a solid copper square in the center (Where the core is). I can take photos if you guys like.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These were socket 775 Celerons from what I remember.


I used NT-H1. I was going to wait until I got some CL Pro, but I was too anxious and decided I can just clean the NT-H1 off when I get it.


----------



## bsofdth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Now thats a first post I like to see!!!! quick question! did you get your delidding information from here?


Yes, I did. I went through all the required reading, etc. Followed up by watching a few videos. No one told me the black tar was going to be harder than cement (or I just didn't see it).


----------



## teamrushpntball

So good news everybody!

Just laid my i7-3770k bare, Went great I think, unfortunately I won't be able to test it until my Liquid Pro arrives tomorrow or Thursday.

Pics:







Now I may have screwed up a bit here. The die itself is untouched, but it seems I scratched the PCB in the lower right corner as seen in this following pic. I apologise for the poor quality, they were taken with my Note2. Should I be worried about this scratch (less than 1mm in size), and is there a coating of something I may want to use to cover it up?

Here's a poor image of the scratch:


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> So good news everybody!
> 
> Just laid my i7-3770k bare, Went great I think, unfortunately I won't be able to test it until my Liquid Pro arrives tomorrow or Thursday.
> 
> Pics:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I may have screwed up a bit here. The die itself is untouched, but it seems I scratched the PCB in the lower right corner as seen in this following pic. I apologise for the poor quality, they were taken with my Note2. Should I be worried about this scratch (less than 1mm in size), and is there a coating of something I may want to use to cover it up?
> 
> Here's a poor image of the scratch:


ouch that sucks hopefully she still runs


----------



## teamrushpntball

Yeah only I can manage to scratch outside the area the IHS even sits. Don't even know how I nicked that area, talent I suppose.

Think I'll just dab on some sort of sealant that is non conductive. Not sure on what to use though, any suggestions from everyone here?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> OT - off topic?


Probably, but maybe something else? If so, then duhhh on me!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> What is the "OT" section *ivanlabrie*? Is it a good thing if we end up there? This thread moves so fast it is hard to keep up with it......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I expect Haswell will end up using TIM too *teh_HyDr0iD*, so you can probably end up hanging out here to learn how to delid it when you do get one!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the testing and results *tw33k*. Can you note how many TIM applications your attempted to get the results in case they are more about mounting issues than TIM differences. *Most of us have found PRO to be 1-3C better than Ultra*, so if you find it the opposit, then we will want more than one mounting attempt to be more sure of the data. If you have done multiple mounts, than the data results are something we will want to verify on other systems as that would change things. Good work with testing it though!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would love to see the results people got after testing both because I've followed this thread since day 1 and nobody has posted actual results even tho they have claimed to have used both
Click to expand...

You are right *tw33k*. Mainly just people trying stuff out together when we started the delidding thing and this club and all of us just sharing what we found with each other. Not systematic at all! But what we found seemed to be confirmed by what others were finding and we ended up with an opinion. An untested opinion.

Nice to see you do an actual test. Now we have to consider what you found based on our less sytematic results due to your findings being different. Which means, we need more systematic testing! So far we have too few samples of systematic tests and no verification of the original ad-hoc discoveries. Maybe time will tell which is better. Not much of a difference either way though as both PRO and Ultra are great between the die and IHS.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bsofdth*
> 
> Decided to delid my new 3770k today.
> 
> I just built this setup on Friday and was disappointed with the temps after overclocking to 4.6GHz @ 1.32V. At 4.7GHz I was reaching the 105 limit and at 4.6 I maxed out at 94.
> 
> During the process, I was scared to wiggle the razor from the corners to the side because it kept catching on the bottom of the IHS. I eventually got it in but I saw the copper orange color showing slightly under one one the edges with a lip. About an hour passes because I'm terrified of scratching the chip and I finally got the pieces separated. Turns out, the chip was 100% undamaged and I had chipped the bottom edge of the IHS.
> 
> After doing a quick test, my max temps have dropped by 22 degrees. I am happy. I even made an account to share my joy.


well done bsofdth







, dont forget to take some pictures









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Yeah only I can manage to scratch outside the area the IHS even sits. Don't even know how I nicked that area, talent I suppose.
> 
> Think I'll just dab on some sort of sealant that is non conductive. Not sure on what to use though, any suggestions from everyone here?


gratz on the delid teamrushpntball









blank nail polish,
and one other thing someone here used, cant remember what exactly,
the nail polish works tho, easy to use a very thin layer or drop, and it hardens..


----------



## Hokies83

Rads might be here in the morning...

Just think of the picture of 3 Monsta rads stacked on top of each other... Thats bigger then a Mini ATX case LOL

If i add the 4th i already have to the Stack i got a Mid tower in rads! muahhaha all Hail E-Peen!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> pffffffft vcore vsmores crank it baby!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> my mobo is crap im scared it my short out or somthing. my voltage in the bios goes red after 1.52v i dont know if that happens on the highend mobo's but i need 1 anyway. this is my second chip and ive heard what happend to franky
Click to expand...

Your MB is not as bad as you think *lilchronic*. And all of our BIOS show red after we go beyond 1.52v! Does that stop us? No way! We have been able to take IBs way beyond that for quick benches and validations. I'd say most of us have at least been in the 1.6v+ area on standard Air/Water.

Franky went to 1.9v+ on non-extreme cooling, and did so more than once. It lasted longer than you'd think doing so too. Tough chip he was. But I'd doubt you will be doing that! It is up to you, and only do what your comfortable doing, but I think you are board can do more with that great chip of yours. We like to encourage people to try as this is OCN, but do what you think best.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Rads might be here in the morning...
> 
> Just think of the picture of 3 Monsta rads stacked on top of each other... Thats bigger then a Mini ATX case LOL
> 
> If i add the 4th i already have to the Stack i got a Mid tower in rads! muahhaha all Hail E-Peen!


more surface area. LOL

if those dont cool idk what will.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> muahhaha all Hail E-Peen!



.
LOL...


----------



## Vi0lence

L M F A O!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 
> .
> LOL...


Do not forget...

i also have.... 650ML in FrozenQ fusion Helix Res lol..



And this 10 inch Sith guy fits in my case to


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Your MB is not as bad as you think *lilchronic*. And all of our BIOS show red after we go beyond 1.52v! Does that stop us? No way! We have been able to take IBs way beyond that for quick benches and validations. I'd say most of us have at least been in the 1.6v+ area on standard Air/Water.
> 
> Franky went to 1.9v+ on non-extreme cooling, and did so more than once. It lasted longer than you'd think doing so too. Tough chip he was. But I'd doubt you will be doing that! It is up to you, and only do what your comfortable doing, but I think you are board can do more with that great chip of yours. We like to encourage people to try as this is OCN, but do what you think best.


amazing what ivy can do with benching,

1,850V vcore in bios


the 5.4ghz in my sig was 1.750V vcore ..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And this 10 inch Sith guy fits in my case to


i really like that one hokies ..vn


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Do not forget...
> 
> i also have.... 650ML in FrozenQ fusion Helix Res lol..
> 
> 
> 
> And this 10 inch Sith guy fits in my case to


do they make a 650ML? I only heard of the 450... hmm time to check. or are you asking for a custom made one from Alex?


----------



## Vi0lence

yea i wont bench over 1.6v. im affraid of the heat killing it. i need this chip to last until i can get another. lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> do they make a 650ML? I only heard of the 450... hmm time to check. or are you asking for a custom made one from Alex?


LoL no i have 2 of them.... Paid 60$ each for them to...

250ML + a 400ML


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL no i have 2 of them.... Paid 60$ each for them to...
> 
> 250ML + a 400ML


Okay was making sure lol.

Also here some awesome video shot at 5K resolution.... yes 5K resolution. love my film industry buddy.

http://www.red.com/products/epic

scroll down a bit and you'll see the first video and thats it.... really cool, watched it on my 720p lappy and could see the difference (Yes I know about the catleaps hokies don't worry.

Also heres some 4K resolution video squashed into 1080 video as well. enjoy the watch, and look at those bubbles!






go to the gear for the video settings and click Original above 1080... takes a while to load but very cool.

I know it's OT but sooo worth it.









Enjoy


----------



## Hokies83

Im not using my Cat leap it is in my room turned off lol..

My main system is down hense the empty Mountain Mods case... I speak to you now from my 52 inch 1080i TV Via i5 750


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im not using my Cat leap it is in my room turned off lol..
> 
> My main system is down hense the empty Mountain Mods case... I speak to you now from my 52 inch 1080i TV Via i5 750


watch those videos dude... omg sooo cool


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> pffffffft vcore vsmores crank it baby!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *I still don't understand why I couldn't get mine to work though..... I have no idea why server 2003 works fine.. but xp wont at all....*
> Send me one please! that way I can use it just to bench.
> Mr Salt to the rescue!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now thats a first post I like to see!!!! quick question! did you get your delidding information from here?


You are remembering to set the sata to IDE for xp? socket 1155 has confounded my xp install more than once being AHCI at default.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Your MB is not as bad as you think *lilchronic*. And all of our BIOS show red after we go beyond 1.52v! Does that stop us? No way! We have been able to take IBs way beyond that for quick benches and validations. I'd say most of us have at least been in the 1.6v+ area on standard Air/Water.
> 
> Franky went to 1.9v+ on non-extreme cooling, and did so more than once. It lasted longer than you'd think doing so too. Tough chip he was. But I'd doubt you will be doing that! It is up to you, and only do what your comfortable doing, but I think you are board can do more with that great chip of yours. We like to encourage people to try as this is OCN, but do what you think best.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> amazing what ivy can do with benching,
> 
> 1,850V vcore in bios
> 
> 
> the 5.4ghz in my sig was 1.750V vcore ..
> i really like that one hokies ..vn


Although I like to see extreme overclocks & more OCNers pushing limits, you guys are still nuts


----------



## Gomi

Intresting article / guide on memory overclocking for the beginner:

http://www.overclockers.com/memory-overclocking-guide-ivy-bridge

Was especially stoked about this part:

_Below I added a table with all average results from all tests. Not all of these settings are perfectly stable. Settings here are more to show the differences on various settings and if it's worth it to push your memory to the limits on sometimes high voltage._



_Fast result comparison:
Best Maxxmem result:
- 2400 8-11-8-28 1T - 31538 Copy / 30400 Read / 27323 Write MB/s

Best ASUS Mem TweakIt result:
- 2400 7-11-7-28 1T - 42316

Best winsat result:
- 2200 8-10-8-28 1T - 40782.28 MB/s

From the above results we can pick 3 configurations for the next stage, which will be Spi32m test. I tested on 3770K @ 5.0GHz, which will give us a stable base to compare results. I also added 2600 8-12-8-28 1N to this comparison._

It is under the _Memory efficiency_ part.

So get your coffee ready, grab a pen and some paper and get doing!


----------



## Swag

So this is kind of irrelevant to the current topic but what color sleeving looks best with this scheme?



Also, I love my Catleap monitors.







1440p x 3 has never looked so beautiful! But unfortunately, I can't use them until I get my rig up and running so I'm using a crappy 1600x900 laptop!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You are remembering to set the sata to IDE for xp? socket 1155 has confounded my xp install more than once being AHCI at default.
> 
> Although I like to see extreme overclocks & more OCNers pushing limits, you guys are still nuts


Yup had IDE right off the bat.. still wouldn't boot would install just fine.. but kept getting boot manager not found... which means it wasn't a bootable drive.. my brain = totally lost.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Yeah only I can manage to scratch outside the area the IHS even sits. Don't even know how I nicked that area, talent I suppose.
> 
> Think I'll just dab on some sort of sealant that is non conductive. Not sure on what to use though, any suggestions from everyone here?


I would use Magpo black adhesive epoxy.



If you can use it like this I am sure you can use it to reseal a chip ahahaha


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Yeah only I can manage to scratch outside the area the IHS even sits. Don't even know how I nicked that area, talent I suppose.
> 
> Think I'll just dab on some sort of sealant that is non conductive. Not sure on what to use though, any suggestions from everyone here?
> 
> 
> 
> I would use Magpo black adhesive epoxy.
> 
> 
> 
> If you can use it like this I am sure you can use it to reseal a chip ahahaha
Click to expand...

Yup, we use that whenever we build chips for our projects in our robotics class.







I used it a while back with my Intel chip and have recommended it if you plan to re-glue the IHS back on for any reason. I just ran out of that when I put my IHS back on.


----------



## lilchronic

1.7v is as high as my mobo lets me go








http://valid.canardpc.com/2663954


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 1.7v is as high as my mobo lets me go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2663954


Very nice, you cant bump up the bus?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Very nice, you cant bump up the bus?


http://valid.canardpc.com/2663970


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Very nice, you cant bump up the bus?


at those speeds, on air/water, it gets very hard to use blck, talking about 100, 05/10/20 oc's that way,
at least for me it was, funny thing my mobo, if i set to 100, it shows 100.02 something like that,
when Valgaur and i did the crazy benches above 5.0ghz, i beat him every time with 2mhz! ...haha
so he had 5500.02, i had 5502.05 Mhz









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 1.7v is as high as my mobo lets me go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2663954


wauw, thats a nice one lilchronic,
yea, i know that, my mobo was 1.85V vcore max..thats why i couldnt get 5.5ghz with all cores, and HT enabled ..lol
but thinking back what happened with Franky at 1.9V vcore, maybe a good thing i was limited...lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Although I like to see extreme overclocks & more OCNers pushing limits, *you guys are still nuts*


TY, TY ...LOL







.


----------



## shremi

Went on vacation for a week 1460 unread posts it is nearly impossible to keep up with this thread ....

I got some goodies while I was away 3770k







passed 12hrs of prime with 4,6 and 1.260 vcore I couldn't wait for even a day and its delided now







currently testing my MHz gains but god do I love these 20c drops .....

Can I have another entry with a 3770k this time. .??


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Went on vacation for a week 1460 unread posts it is nearly impossible to keep up with this thread ....
> 
> I got some goodies while I was away 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> passed 12hrs of prime with 4,6 and 1.260 vcore I couldn't wait for even a day and its delided now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> currently testing my MHz gains but god do I love these 20c drops .....
> 
> Can I have another entry with a 3770k this time. .??


welcome back shremi







, hope you had a good time on vacation..

yea, you can have another entry, you know the drill right ..lol,
pics, right format page 1 etc

"12hrs of prime with 4,6 and 1.260 vcore",

that looks promising


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Went on vacation for a week 1460 unread posts it is nearly impossible to keep up with this thread ....
> 
> I got some goodies while I was away 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> passed 12hrs of prime with 4,6 and 1.260 vcore I couldn't wait for even a day and its delided now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> currently testing my MHz gains but god do I love these 20c drops .....
> 
> Can I have another entry with a 3770k this time. .??


----------



## Swag

Long time poster, first time reading. How are you guys today?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Long time poster, first time reading. How are you guys today?


lol








good good, waiting for this page to be full,
so i dont have to look at that nervous tick head hokies posted anymore ..pls answer with another post ...haha









waiting for a confirmation mail from the company i bought my new psu,
if its rated 80+ silver or not, XFX ProSeries 850W XXX Edition, says on the site i always use to find the cheapest reseller,
but not on the site where i bought it, not even a mention about it, it will arrive tommorrow if all goes well,
so i have to build it into mine, then friday my kids are here for the weekend, and have to build in my old psu into my kids comp,
gonna let him do most of the work tho, good lesson


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Long time poster, first time reading. How are you guys today?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> good good, waiting for this page to be full,
> so i dont have to look at that nervous tick head hokies posted anymore ..pls answer with another post ...haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waiting for a confirmation mail from the company i bought my new psu,
> if its rated 80+ silver or not, XFX ProSeries 850W XXX Edition, says on the site i always use to find the cheapest reseller,
> but not on the site where i bought it, not even a mention about it, it will arrive tommorrow if all goes well,
> so i have to build it into mine, then friday my kids are here for the weekend, and have to build in my old psu into my kids comp,
> gonna let him do most of the work tho, good lesson
Click to expand...

Why did you get an XFX PSU?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why did you get an XFX PSU?


why do you say







? ..lol
i know they are good, before i bought the xfx 750W 2 years ago, i looked at reviews/tests etc, and it came out very well,
good prize/performance, and its build with Seasonic parts, if i had the money, i would buy a Seasonic, but a 850W Seasonic with 80+ zilver/gold
it to expensive for me atm, and my kiddo's psu( old el cheapo 400W) is almost dead now, even under clocked his 8350, he cant play games etc or it hangs, so was a last minute buy, to help him out really







used the money i was saving for my new ram...o well

a, page is almost full


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why did you get an XFX PSU?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> why do you say
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ? ..lol
> i know they are good, before i bought the xfx 750W 2 years ago, i looked at reviews/tests etc, and it came out very well,
> good prize/performance, and its build with Seasonic parts, if i had the money, i would buy a Seasonic, but a 850W Seasonic with 80+ zilver/gold
> it to expensive for me atm, and my kiddo's psu( old el cheapo 400W) is almost dead now, even under clocked his 8350, he cant play games etc or it hangs, so was a last minute buy, to help him out really
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> used the money i was saving for my new ram...o well
> 
> a, page is almost full
Click to expand...

Lol, because I prefer Seasonic PSUs.







Great QC, unsure of XFX before. Are they good?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, because I prefer Seasonic PSUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great QC, unsure of XFX before. Are they good?


i think they are, heres a conclusion of just a little google test/review search i just did

The XFX Pro Series Core Edition power supplies *performed very well across the range*. The DC voltage load regulation was excellent from 20% to 100% DC loading and in combination with very low AC *ripple/noise levels means excellent DC quality* on all rails on all three power supplies. The 3V3 and 5V0 rails dipped a little lower than I would have liked but they still remained well within the limits set down by the ATX12V V2.2 specification and won't prove to be a problem when the biggest dip below ideal rail voltage was only 0.09V. Efficiency levels across the range are acceptable with the PRO850W proving marginally more efficient than the others and efficiencies in the low to middle eighties are on a par with other units in this class.

The only difference across the range is an extra three SATA connectors on the PRO850W so power supply selection at the build stage is important and is really graphic card dependent although any of the three power supplies could power a dual graphics configuration on a fairly standard PC. If the intended build involves powerful graphics cards, multiple hard disk drives, cooling fans, etc and a certain amount of overclocking, the PRO750W or PRO850W would be a more sensible choice.

The XFX Pro series power supplies are, as you'd expect, physically alike across the range and with good build quality and their unique styling will probably appeal to many enthusiasts. If you are in the market for a *high quality wired power supply, at a fair price, then I highly recommend* any of the XFX Pro Series Core Edition units.
_I have no hesitation in awarding all three XFX Pro Series Core Edition power supplies the OCC Gold award._
http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/xfx_core_edition/11.htm

i payed 115 euro for my 850W, with shipping.. but my next build will prolly have a Seasonic psu


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, because I prefer Seasonic PSUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great QC, unsure of XFX before. Are they good?
> 
> 
> 
> i think they are, heres a conclusion of just a little google test/review
> 
> The XFX Pro Series Core Edition power supplies *performed very well across the range*. The DC voltage load regulation was excellent from 20% to 100% DC loading and in combination with very low AC *ripple/noise levels means excellent DC quality* on all rails on all three power supplies. The 3V3 and 5V0 rails dipped a little lower than I would have liked but they still remained well within the limits set down by the ATX12V V2.2 specification and won't prove to be a problem when the biggest dip below ideal rail voltage was only 0.09V. Efficiency levels across the range are acceptable with the PRO850W proving marginally more efficient than the others and efficiencies in the low to middle eighties are on a par with other units in this class.
> 
> The only difference across the range is an extra three SATA connectors on the PRO850W so power supply selection at the build stage is important and is really graphic card dependent although any of the three power supplies could power a dual graphics configuration on a fairly standard PC. If the intended build involves powerful graphics cards, multiple hard disk drives, cooling fans, etc and a certain amount of overclocking, the PRO750W or PRO850W would be a more sensible choice.
> 
> The XFX Pro series power supplies are, as you'd expect, physically alike across the range and with good build quality and their unique styling will probably appeal to many enthusiasts. If you are in the market for a *high quality wired power supply, at a fair price, then I highly recommend* any of the XFX Pro Series Core Edition units.
> _I have no hesitation in awarding all three XFX Pro Series Core Edition power supplies the OCC Gold award._
> http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/xfx_core_edition/11.htm
> 
> i payed 115 euro for my 850W, with shipping.. but my next build will prolly have a Seasonic psu
Click to expand...

Go big or go home! Lol, I can't stand non-modular PSUs.







I plan to get a AX1200 soon because I can't believe this AX650 died on me!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Go big or go home! Lol, I can't stand non-modular PSUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I plan to get a AX1200 soon because I can't believe this AX650 died on me!



the green would look good in your army case







..lol

1200W ..wow, you planning to run triple or quad gpu??


----------



## lilchronic

this is what psu i want to get
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139041


----------



## VonDutch

that one looks great lilchronic

Corsair AX860i
860 watt modulaire voeding met 80-plus-certificering
860W
80 Plus Platinum
Modulair
€ 192,- ..pff, thats 255 U.S. dollars over here..mine was 115 euro(152 U.S. dollars) with shipping..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Go big or go home! Lol, I can't stand non-modular PSUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I plan to get a AX1200 soon because I can't believe this AX650 died on me!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the green would look good in your army case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..lol
> 
> 1200W ..wow, you planning to run triple or quad gpu??
Click to expand...

Looks great, do they sell a fully-modular version? I plan to run a dual-SLI build with WC.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> this is what psu i want to get
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139041


I may pick up the 760W version, but without the 'i' moniker.

I'll probably keep the HX1050 for now, since I want to build a dedicated benching rig, I'll need another PSU.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Looks great, do they sell a fully-modular version? I plan to run a dual-SLI build with WC.


not that i know off, but thats why we use cable management right,
in my case all the fixed cables are right beside my side panel, so i just tuck them in there..lol








fully modulair are more expensive too i think ..
yea, wanted the 850W just in case i buy another 7970 in 2 years orso..


----------



## stickg1

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207017
Looks like its silver rated..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, because I prefer Seasonic PSUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great QC, unsure of XFX before. Are they good?


Those higher end XFX PSU's are actually made by Seasonic, well the internal components are manufactured by Seasonic anyway. In fact Seasonic provides the internals for most of the top quality PSU's on the market; Corsair, Antec, XFX, they all have models that use Seasonic parts.

@VonDutch: you ever meet any famous footballers? I'd like to have a beer with Edwin van der Sar. He was awesome.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207017
> Looks like its silver rated..
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, because I prefer Seasonic PSUs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great QC, unsure of XFX before. Are they good?
> 
> 
> 
> Those higher end XFX PSU's are actually made by Seasonic, well the internal components are manufactured by Seasonic anyway. In fact Seasonic provides the internals for most of the top quality PSU's on the market; Corsair, Antec, XFX, they all have models that use Seasonic parts.
Click to expand...

Yea, that's why I want a Corsair PSU.







They have reliable and quick RMA service and they are basically all Seasonic other than the housing.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207017
> Looks like its silver rated..
> Those higher end XFX PSU's are actually made by Seasonic, well the internal components are manufactured by Seasonic anyway. In fact Seasonic provides the internals for most of the top quality PSU's on the market; Corsair, Antec, XFX, they all have models that use Seasonic parts.
> 
> @VonDutch: you ever meet any famous footballers? I'd like to have a beer with Edwin van der Sar. He was awesome.


yep, thats one of the reasons i have XFX, and they are cheaper then Seasonic ..lol









@stickg1 not in the way of, " hey Edwin, lets have a beer, im buying"

but close yes, i worked for, Heracles Almelo and some other footballclubs,
sometimes clubs like Ajax, came to practice, so got very close to some topplayers,
but not much more then a, "hello, how are ya" ..lol who cares about the man that only does the lawn, and does the lines ..

yea, Edwin van de Sar ...he was one of the best ever we had i think..


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep, thats one of the reasons i have XFX, and they are cheaper then Seasonic ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @stickg1 not in the way of, " hey Edwin, lets have a beer, im buying"
> 
> but close yes, i worked for, Heracles Almelo and some other footballclubs,
> sometimes clubs like Ajax, came to practice, so got very close to some topplayers,
> but not much more then a, "hello, how are ya" ..lol who cares about the man that only does the lawn, and does the lines ..
> 
> yea, Edwin van de SAr ...he was one of the best ever we had i think..


Lol, well hey it's better than nothing!

Yeah "Big Save Dave" De Gea is still a ways off from van der Sar status.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 80+ zilver/gold


Just to clear things up (assuming it's not just Google translate messing up







) It's Silver not "Zilver".


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 80+ zilver/gold
> 
> 
> 
> Just to clear things up (assuming it's not just Google translate messing up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) It's Silver not "Zilver".
Click to expand...

No, it's zilver. You may actually have dyslexia where you confuse letters...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Just to clear things up (assuming it's not just Google translate messing up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) It's Silver not "Zilver".


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> No, it's zilver. You may actually have dyslexia where you confuse letters...


sowwy, our dutch word for Silver is Zilver ..lol hence the little mistake,
our word for Gold is Goud.. would have noticed that one i think ..lol
there more words that look alike in dutch and (american)english
we once owned new york, which tranlates as Nieuw Amsterdam

The Bronx => This area of New York bears the name of a settler, Jonas Bronck, who
had a farm.
Haarlem => Harlem N.Y. It was founded in 1658 as New Haerlem by Peter Stuyvesant.
Vlissingen => Flushing (founded in 1645).
Breuckelen => Brooklyn-NY City and Brooklyn Heights (= original Breuckelen, founded in 1646).
States Country => Staten Island.
Groenwijck => Greenwich N.Y.
Groenwijck (the pine wood), was inhabited from 1629 and started as a tobacco plantation
Director Wouter van Twiller. It is now known as Greenwich Village.
Boswyck => Bushwick N.Y. (Founded in 1661).
Heemstede => Hempstead (founded in 1644).
New Utrecht => New Utrecht (founded in 1657).
Hoboken (Antwerp) => Hoboken N.Y.
Roodt Eylandt => Rhode Island.
The Bronx => refers to Jonas Bronck
Walstraat or Waalstraat => Wall Street
The Bouwerij => The Bowery. This part of New York has its name from the farm,
or bouwerij (Dutch in the 17th century), who Peter Stuyvesant
belonged.
Bouwerijlaan => Bowery Lane.
Breede weg => Broadway.
Brugstraat => Bridge Street.
Konijneneiland => Coney Island. Originally "Conyne Eylandt.
Lange Eylandt => Long Island (named by Adriaen Block, 1614)
Kattenkreek => Catskill N.Y. Originally 'Kats Kil' in Dutch. The other place
in the region ending kill are of Dutch origin.
Hellegat => Hell's Gate N.Y. Due to the treacherous currents became part of the East River
New York on a Dutch map from 1636 'Helle Gadt' called.
Zandhoek => Sandy Hook N.Y. The original Dutch name is "Sant Hoek".
Gowanus Bay => This refers to the Walloon roots of the first settlers. "Owanus' (= Latin) refers
to Ohain in Walloon Brabant.
Cape May => Refers to Cornelis Jacobsz May (also spelled Mey or Meij), the first governor
of the colony of New Netherlands. He was explorer and captain of his own ship.
With the Nieu-Nederlandt he departed on 30 March 1624 from Amsterdam to the place which is now
New York hot. He had thirty Walloon families on board, the first settlers.
"Cape May" is located in the south-east of the state of New Jersey.
Communipaw (Jersey City) => this is the contraction of Community or Peacock. Michel De Pauw, from Ghent
Staten Island has purchased from the Indians in 1630.
Peter Minuit Plaza => a park in the south of Manhattan. In honor of Pierre Minuit, the island
*Manhattan "purchased" from the Indians in exchange for trinkets and tools worth
of 60 guilders (approximately, $ 24).*

i love history








then the english came, and took it from us ..lol
end of history lesson for today...lets OC!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> No, it's zilver. You may actually have dyslexia where you confuse letters...


Not sure if trolling or just bad at English...

EDIT: VonDutch, don't be sowwy







(it's kind of cute though, it's how some girl I used to







said "sorry")








I was just pointing it out, so you could know and learn from your mistakes!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Not sure if trolling or just bad at English...
> 
> EDIT: VonDutch, don't be sowwy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (it's kind of cute though, it's how some girl I used to
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> said "sorry")
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was just pointing it out, so you could know and learn from your mistakes!


just so you know, i am a guy ok








yea, was a typo, wont happen again i hope,
i always have google translate open next to ocn,
i know how some peeps see and feel about typos,
they get all hyped about it, and miss the point of the post ..lol
not saying youre like that tho








i see them very fast too, when im on a Dutch forum,
but i dont bother, but sometimes here, when i quote someone,
i revise their words that arent written correct ..haha..
still have some things to learn myself..some words are very hard to write


----------



## VonDutch

boring today, we need more peeps who want to delid!
guess its another OT-day ..lol
downloaded a tv-show called "Fringe", watching it now ..i think its great..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just so you know, i am a guy ok
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea, was a typo, wont happen again i hope,
> i always have google translate open next to ocn,
> i know how some peeps see and feel about typos,
> they get all hyped about it, and miss the point of the post ..lol
> not saying youre like that tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i see them very fast too, when im on a Dutch forum,
> but i dont bother, but sometimes here, when i quote someone,
> i revise their words that arent written correct ..haha..
> still have some things to learn myself..some words are very hard to write


I know!








I'm just saying it reminds me of her and myself and our cute conversations and such haha. Amongst other things...
It really is a shame that she has a boyfriend now, hah anyways this is a hardware forum.. Not a "feelings and stuff" forum. Even though i'm being a hypocrite in saying so as I've made a thread about it and my rubbish love life.. hah

EDIT: Yes, i'm sure it would be. Like what is a hard word that you're trying to learn/remember? I guess that is a stupid question really though








How do you learn all your words anyway, putting them into Google translate or what?







and yes I know how you feel, as I said I was just pointing out a small typo so you know for later









What is "The Fringe" about? I'm too lazy to Google it


----------



## Jayjr1105

So I practiced this morning on a Celeron D 336 and sure enough, the sucker was soldered on the die. I'm pretty sure I didn't scratch the PCB or hit the die while delidding but the force I had to put on it to pry the IHS killed the cpu. The scratches you see in the pic came after I confirmed it dead, I was just scraping solder off of the die for fun.

Quote:


> Here is a list of CPU's that should be able to be delidded and some are very cheap so great for saving your chips.
> 
> IHS Not Soldered To Die
> 
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> 
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)


Apparently the "-(S-775) Celeron" doesn't apply to all socket 775 Celerons.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So I practiced this morning on a Celeron D 336 and sure enough, the sucker was soldered on the die. I'm pretty sure I didn't scratch the PCB or hit the die while delidding but the force I had to put on it to pry the IHS killed the cpu. The scratches you see in the pic came after I confirmed it dead, I was just scraping solder off of the die for fun.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Apparently the "-(S-775) Celeron" doesn't apply to all socket 775 Celerons.


yea, the list is a bit old, took it from a thread somewhere here on ocn,
its not complete, maybe theres some wrongs in it too..

but like i said before, its about getting the feel of delidding, how the blade behaves, force you use etc,
practice on some old pentiums/celeron's is way cheaper if it goes wrong, then damaging a $300 ivy ..lol
theres a saying, "practice makes perfect"








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> EDIT: Yes, i'm sure it would be. Like what is a hard word that you're trying to learn/remember? I guess that is a stupid question really though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How do you learn all your words anyway, putting them into Google translate or what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and yes I know how you feel, as I said I was just pointing out a small typo so you know for later


just now , in the other post, i used the word "revise", i didnt know it, "verbeteren" is our word for it,

google gives me the following options, but i thought revise was the best one to use (looking at context also)

improve -verbeteren, beter worden, vooruitgaan, beter maken, veredelen, bijwerken
better -verbeteren
ameliorate -verbeteren, beter maken, stijgen, beter worden
amend -amenderen, verbeteren, hervormen, zich beteren
correct -corrigeren, verbeteren, terechtwijzen, tuchtigen
rectify -herstellen, rectificeren, verbeteren, zuiveren, opnieuw overhalen, tot een rechte lijn herleiden
reform -hervormen, verbeteren, reformeren, bekeren, afschaffen, zijn leven beteren
reclaim -herwinnen, terugeisen, ontginnen, verbeteren, droogleggen, ontwoekeren
mend -herstellen, repareren, beteren, verbeteren, stoppen, lappen
perfect -perfectioneren, volmaken, voltooien, verbeteren, volvoeren
revise -herzien, corrigeren, verbeteren, nakijken, nazien, inspecteren
change for the better -verbeteren

its funny, revise looks alot like our word revisie,
when i google revisie in dutch, and translate to english,

revision -herziening, revisie, correctie, herziene uitgaaf
*revise*- herziening, revisie, controle, herziene uitgaaf, tweede correctie
overhaul -revisie, grondig onderzoek, inspectie, demontage, het nazien, het inhalen


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, the list is a bit old, took it from a thread somewhere here on ocn,
> its not complete, maybe theres some wrongs in it too..
> 
> but like i said before, its about getting the feel of delidding, how the blade behaves, force you use etc,
> practice on some old pentiums/celeron's is way cheaper if it goes wrong, then damaging a $300 ivy ..lol


I do have a Pentium E2180... that one is specifically on the list. Is there a chance that one is soldered on too?


----------



## megawatz

Under full load while Folding, my CPU has gotten to 65c max. But in IBT, it goes to 85c during testing.

So, essentially, I still haven't gained anything using AS5, but i did drop -2c, probably because it was freezing cold in my room.

I'm ordering CLP today.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Under full load while Folding, my CPU has gotten to 65c max. But in IBT, it goes to 85c during testing.
> 
> So, essentially, I still haven't gained anything using AS5, but i did drop -2c, probably because it was freezing cold in my room.
> 
> *I'm ordering CLP today.*


yeah!


----------



## megawatz

Where are people ordering from? I can't get my Prime shipping with Amazon.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Where are people ordering from? I can't get my Prime shipping with Amazon.


most order at frozencpu i think or Sidewinder

USA
FrozenCPU.com
CrazyPC
E Powerhouse PC
Performance-PCs.com
Sidewinder Computer Systems
Silicon Valley Compucycle (SVC.com)

or directly from their site,
http://coollaboratory.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/26/osCsid/f1fd90ef22c356333898fb84e76c4ba5


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> at those speeds, on air/water, it gets very hard to use blck, talking about 100, 05/10/20 oc's that way,
> at least for me it was, funny thing my mobo, if i set to 100, it shows 100.02 something like that,
> when Valgaur and i did the crazy benches above 5.0ghz, i beat him every time with 2mhz! ...haha
> so he had 5500.02, i had 5502.05 Mhz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wauw, thats a nice one lilchronic,
> yea, i know that, my mobo was 1.85V vcore max..thats why i couldnt get 5.5ghz with all cores, and HT enabled ..lol
> but thinking back what happened with Franky at 1.9V vcore, maybe a good thing i was limited...lol
> TY, TY ...LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Thats odd, on my 920 I have 191x20 on a closed loop. Was there a big change in the chips since then?

And since you are all talking about power supplies, I do agree with the fully modular PSUs aslong you can afford them haha. I have always gone with Corsair when building client builds but for my current build I had gone to MicroCenter and the best pick for me was a OCZ 850w Gold series. I wanted a platnium but they had just come out at the time and the actual box/housing was very oddly shaped and I knew I would have a bad time having to disassemble and paint. I didn't really have to consider the power cables because I am making my own cables from scratch.

Also I am really craving to do a liquid cooled bitfenix prodigy build...

Except I think it would be really cool if I were to mod it so you guys could fit a LN2 pot and ti would stick out the top haha.


----------



## TSXmike

you know... ive had this i5 up and running for a couple months now... stock.

think its time to change that!









just need to get me some CLP


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> I do have a Pentium E2180... that one is specifically on the list. Is there a chance that one is soldered on too?


this is where the list came from,
http://www.overclock.net/t/305443/ihs-removals-how-to-do-it-should-i-do-it-and-the-facts

yea, its in the not soldered section so ..but its started 3/12/08,
i really cant say how good the list is, howmuch effort the thread starter took to find out if everything was correct or not,
cant really find anything else about if its soldered or not when i search online..till now the list was right..
but hes only naming, -(S-775) Celeron, not specific what celerons..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Thats odd, on my 920 I have 191x20 on a closed loop. Was there a big change in the chips since then?


what do you mean, with ivy and the blck?








i know ivy uses 100blck, and multiplier to oc..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TSXmike*
> 
> you know... ive had this i5 up and running for a couple months now... stock.
> 
> think its time to change that!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just need to get me some CLP


what took you so long ...LOL


----------



## nagle3092

So could anyone tell me how does CLP cleanup? I kinda went







when I read about the metal grinding pad.


----------



## Hokies83

And then there was E-Peen..

Put a 35mm Rad infront of them to gauge the thickness of these rads XD
Then put a 120mm fan as well to help gauge..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And then there was E-Peen..
> 
> Put a 35mm Rad infront of them to gauge the thickness of these rads XD
> Then put a 120mm fan as well to help gauge..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


wow, that looks massive ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> So could anyone tell me how does CLP cleanup? I kinda went
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when I read about the metal grinding pad.


maybe a bit harder to clean then normal tim's, but when you use it on the die only, it wont be that hard,
the toplayer is made of glass, on the ihs you can use another tim,
if you dont want to use the pad that comes with the package, and scrub it of the ihs..

still waiting to take mine apart again, wanted to wait till its about 5-6 months under there,
and see how hard its to clean myselfs, and find the best way to clean it








some are afraid to lose the writings on the ihs when they clean it (scrub/lap) that way,
or dont like the stains it leaves behind, i dont really care about that,
its not like im looking at it all the time ..lol and leaving some residue isnt bad,
seems that doing so, it can upgrade other tim's also..but i dont feel the need to change tim's

o, and its not a metal grinding pad


----------



## DiamondCut

Man I really can't wait to get mine in!


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o, and its not a metal grinding pad


Now I'm trying to find where I read that part and I can't, go figure...
Thats good to know though, I will probably just use it on the die as I have a tube and a half of PK-1 sitting here that I need to use up.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Now I'm trying to find where I read that part and I can't, go figure...
> Thats good to know though, I will probably just use it on the die as I have a tube and a half of PK-1 sitting here that I need to use up.


yea, on the die liquid pro/ultra is best, on the ihs you pk-1 will do fine really








happens to me all the time, when i need to find something im talking about that ive read somewhere,
was not in this thread i think right?


----------



## nagle3092

No it was somewhere on one of the reviews/product sites I was looking at reading about CLP.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> at those speeds, on air/water, it gets very hard to use blck, talking about 100, 05/10/20 oc's that way,
> at least for me it was, funny thing my mobo, if i set to 100, it shows 100.02 something like that,
> when Valgaur and i did the crazy benches above 5.0ghz, i beat him every time with 2mhz! ...haha
> so he had 5500.02, i had 5502.05 Mhz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wauw, thats a nice one lilchronic,
> yea, i know that, my mobo was 1.85V vcore max..thats why i couldnt get 5.5ghz with all cores, and HT enabled ..lol
> but thinking back what happened with Franky at 1.9V vcore, maybe a good thing i was limited...lol
> TY, TY ...LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats odd, on my 920 I have 191x20 on a closed loop. Was there a big change in the chips since then?
> 
> And since you are all talking about power supplies, I do agree with the fully modular PSUs aslong you can afford them haha. I have always gone with Corsair when building client builds but for my current build I had gone to MicroCenter and the best pick for me was a OCZ 850w Gold series. I wanted a platnium but they had just come out at the time and the actual box/housing was very oddly shaped and I knew I would have a bad time having to disassemble and paint. I didn't really have to consider the power cables because I am making my own cables from scratch.
> 
> Also I am really craving to do a liquid cooled bitfenix prodigy build...
> 
> Except I think it would be really cool if I were to mod it so you guys could fit a LN2 pot and ti would stick out the top haha.
Click to expand...

Everybody craves WC'd Prodigy's







They're just so awesome haha


----------



## $ilent

What is the general consensus on applying liquid pro on the die? Little dot and leave it or little dot and smooth it out yourself? I used less liquid pro on my second mount and temps are much worse, on the first attempt I used a fair amount and smoothed it out so that it looked like a mirror finish.

I would prefer not having to smooth it out if its not necessary though.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> What is the general consensus on applying liquid pro on the die? Little dot and leave it or little dot and smooth it out yourself? I used less liquid pro on my second mount and temps are much worse, on the first attempt I used a fair amount and smoothed it out so that it looked like a mirror finish.
> 
> I would prefer not having to smooth it out if its not necessary though.


you need to do it like this


----------



## prest0

All right fellas, I have successfully delidded my 3570k, I tried like 1 million razor blades until I found the right one, I didn't knew it was gonna be so easy with the right razorblade. So my chip is, according to my friend's words, the worst made in the history of intel. Just days before delidding I needed 1.310 vcore for 4.5ghz and still couldn't run a full 12h prime test because the temp reached 100°C after the first 30 minutes. Right now I'm running prime blend test @4,4ghz and I'm still not happy, the hottest core is 85°C (delidded) and with 1,272 vcore I think is not stable yet, so I need to keep increasing the voltage.

I'm using the Hyper 212 EVO with the thermal paste that comes in the box (on ihs and die) I tried Arctic Silver 5 and got the same results. Should I go water cooling?

Sorry for my english, I know is really poor.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> All right fellas, I have successfully delidded my 3570k, I tried like 1 million razor blades until I found the right one, I didn't knew it was gonna be so easy with the right razorblade. So my chip is, according to my friend's words, the worst made in the history of intel. Just days before delidding I needed 1.310 vcore for 4.5ghz and still couldn't run a full 12h prime test because the temp reached 100°C after the first 30 minutes. Right now I'm running prime blend test @4,4ghz and I'm still not happy, the hottest core is 85°C (delidded) and with 1,272 vcore I think is not stable yet, so I need to keep increasing the voltage.
> 
> I'm using the Hyper 212 EVO with the thermal paste that comes in the box (on ihs and die) I tried Arctic Silver 5 and got the same results. Should I go water cooling?
> 
> Sorry for my english, I know is really poor.


You need cool laboratory liquid pro thermal paste dude, that's what makes a delidded CPU so cold.

Also your CPU cooler isn't the best, but before buying a new CPU cooler vuy some liquid pro.


----------



## Hokies83

I like3 making Valguar Angry


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> All right fellas, I have successfully delidded my 3570k, I tried like 1 million razor blades until I found the right one, I didn't knew it was gonna be so easy with the right razorblade. So my chip is, according to my friend's words, the worst made in the history of intel. Just days before delidding I needed 1.310 vcore for 4.5ghz and still couldn't run a full 12h prime test because the temp reached 100°C after the first 30 minutes. Right now I'm running prime blend test @4,4ghz and I'm still not happy, the hottest core is 85°C (delidded) and with 1,272 vcore I think is not stable yet, so I need to keep increasing the voltage.
> 
> I'm using the Hyper 212 EVO with the thermal paste that comes in the box (on ihs and die) I tried Arctic Silver 5 and got the same results. Should I go water cooling?
> 
> Sorry for my english, I know is really poor.


you should get coolabs liguid pro/ultra TIM youll drop 15c for sure.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> All right fellas, I have successfully delidded my 3570k, I tried like 1 million razor blades until I found the right one, I didn't knew it was gonna be so easy with the right razorblade. So my chip is, according to my friend's words, the worst made in the history of intel. Just days before delidding I needed 1.310 vcore for 4.5ghz and still couldn't run a full 12h prime test because the temp reached 100°C after the first 30 minutes. Right now I'm running prime blend test @4,4ghz and I'm still not happy, the hottest core is 85°C (delidded) and with 1,272 vcore I think is not stable yet, so I need to keep increasing the voltage.
> 
> I'm using the Hyper 212 EVO with the thermal paste that comes in the box (on ihs and die) I tried Arctic Silver 5 and got the same results. Should I go water cooling?
> 
> Sorry for my english, I know is really poor.


There's a problem with your cooling then ... maybe the 212 isn't mounted properly. But seriously, you shouldn't be reaching 100C...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I like3 making Valguar Angry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


dude thats a beast of a case and watercooling setup lol i want to see those temps


----------



## martinhal

This thread sure moves fast 200 odd posts since I visited. Saw some crazy vcores some pages back. Trying to figure out why I got a lecture when I was at 1.595 ????

Out of interest I have taken a few voltage readings from the measuring points on the Sniper . All readings are within +/- 0.003 v of the vcore reported by Cpuz.


----------



## Jayjr1105

Okay, second attempt today and voila! Confirmed the Pentium E2140 is not soldered on and it boots with RAM populated in all 4 slots! I think I'm ready to do my 3770K guys although I'm still nervous as heck. The die is twice as long on todays cpu's and these dinky little celerons and C2D's are easy since the die is so tiny. Anyways, I'll have to take a couple days off, my fingers are killing me.


----------



## Belial

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2297140

I've been trying to find a comparison of Liquid Ultra vs Pro for a while now, found this guy saying that they were both identical.

Pretty rare to find someone who blew $50 on thermal pastes, let alone just 2 of them (just imagine how many samples/1g/1.5g packets you can get for $50... you could try every ceramique out there... or maybe just 12 of them, but that's still enough to test every modern, high end ceramique).
Quote:


> To be honest, I wouldn't bother. They are so close in performance that I could have done a another round of testing and Pro came out on top. There's got to be room for error and a 3c difference doesn't leave a lot of room.
> 
> The reason I did this is because of the misinformation floating around (particularly on OCN) People are continually claiming that Pro performs better, they even throw up figures like they've run tests but never posting test results. I wanted to provide actual results


----------



## DiamondCut

Heres what I am going to try to use for my next delid, I hope this will help me grip the chip more and also help me gauge how far I actually need to cut in order to remove the IHS.


----------



## Hokies83

Welp this is all i can do till more parts come in!


----------



## dmanstasiu

What's with the derpy flow


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> Okay, second attempt today and voila! Confirmed the Pentium E2140 is not soldered on and it boots with RAM populated in all 4 slots! I think I'm ready to do my 3770K guys although I'm still nervous as heck. The die is twice as long on todays cpu's and these dinky little celerons and C2D's are easy since the die is so tiny. Anyways, I'll have to take a couple days off, my fingers are killing me.


good job Jayjr1105








bit nervous is good, makes you more alert..lol
when your hands starts shaking because youre nervous, ..well, no go yet








i just woke up one morning, and had the, "today is the day" feeling, and delidded mine the same day, all went easy/well
you want to see as much as possible adhesive on the pcb, then you know youre doing good..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> What's with the derpy flow


I do not want to use my 3 90s there and i have to make room for a 400ML FrozenQ res there.

I have 2 pumps and 2 Res lol


----------



## Belial

http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro/0_100

Looks like the guy is from OCN, and posted here first. I saw his article on anandtech forums first.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2297140
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> To be honest, I wouldn't bother. They are so close in performance that I could have done a another round of testing and Pro came out on top. There's got to be room for error and a 3c difference doesn't leave a lot of room.
> 
> The reason I did this is because of the *misinformation floating around (particularly on OCN)* People are continually claiming that Pro performs better, they even throw up figures like they've run tests but never posting test results. I wanted to provide actual results
> 
> 
> 
> I've been trying to find a comparison of Liquid Ultra vs Pro for a while now, found this guy saying that they were both identical.
> 
> Pretty rare to find someone who blew $50 on thermal pastes, let alone just 2 of them (just imagine how many samples/1g/1.5g packets you can get for $50... you could try every ceramique out there... or maybe just 12 of them, but that's still enough to test every modern, high end ceramique).
Click to expand...

ooo..misinformation, who said that! ...








i thought most of us say theres not much difference in performance..o well
but we love liquid pro ..hehe,
we do say liquid pro performs better then any other tim when used on the die,
maybe its just me giving good info then ..hahaha








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro/0_100
> 
> Looks like the guy is from OCN, and posted here first. I saw his article on anandtech forums first.


yea, he posted his results here first if i remember right,
think i even posted something in his thread

found it,
http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro

my post
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice test tw33k,
> thanks for taking the effort and time to do this,
> in general it seems liquid pro performs a bit better then liquid ultra in our delidded thread,
> keep in mind theres always a fault tolerance of about 2-3C, one time you apply the tim better then other times etc..
> 
> liquid ultra is the new pro, its easier to clean later on, thats what we do know, i contacted Coollaboratory
> again, to ask about the w/mk liquid pro has, we know for sure now the w/mk of liquid ultra, 38.4 w/mk,
> liquid pro has a w/mk of 82 as far as we know..
> my guess is, theres a " optimal" w/mk for use on the die,
> the difference in w/mk gets less when its over a certain point, tempwise that is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i dont think if there was a tim with 150 w/mk, it will drop temps by alot more then using liquid pro on the die
> theres a maximum in heat dispersion from the die to ihs, or to the cooler block(direct die)


o, about the w/mk of liquid pro,
i already contacted them again last week, to make sure if the w/mk is 82 or not


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> What's with the derpy flow
> 
> 
> 
> I do not want to use my 3 90s there and i have to make room for a 400ML FrozenQ res there.
> 
> I have 2 pumps and 2 Res lol
Click to expand...

But why isn't it going inlet to outlet? You don't want them in serial?


----------



## DiamondCut

Coollaboratory gave me two packages for sponsoring my build. I would do a comparison but I think I am convinced to go CLP everywhere on the build. And its obvious pro is better in our case due to the paste getting spread and thinned out over time. Ultra is just meant for easier removal and easier applicability.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> But why isn't it going inlet to outlet? You don't want them in serial?


It is going inlet outlet there is 3 rads there.. it goes into one then out to another.

The missing place on the first rad is where My Apongee Drive II MCP 35X will be pumping water.

On the 3rd Rad that empty place is where it will pump into the 400 ML res then fill the 700 D pump in the bottom.

It then flows to the 240 rad then into a 250ML res which will be mounting on top of the case which will fill the MCP 35X pump.


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> There's a problem with your cooling then ... maybe the 212 isn't mounted properly. But seriously, you shouldn't be reaching 100C...


That's what I think. The main reason for that I thinks is that the heatsink shouln't twist when I use some force to move it. The screws and the baseplate are tightened at its maximun but still slides. Should I try mounting the heatsink directly on top of the die?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> This thread sure moves fast 200 odd posts since I visited. Saw some crazy vcores some pages back. Trying to figure out why I got a lecture when I was at 1.595 ????
> 
> Out of interest I have taken a few voltage readings from the measuring points on the Sniper . All readings are within +/- 0.003 v of the vcore reported by Cpuz.


idk, was it because you wanted to run it longer time?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> That's what I think. The main reason for that I thinks is that the heatsink shouln't twist when I use some force to move it. The screws and the baseplate are tightened at its maximun but still slides. Should I try mounting the heatsink directly on top of the die?


nooo, i wouldnt do direct die mount with a aircooler,
the weight is much higher then the block from a watercooler/loop,
more risk to crush/damage the die that way see









its what dmanstasiu said, prolly not mounted right..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Heres what I am going to try to use for my next delid, I hope this will help me grip the chip more and also help me gauge how far I actually need to cut in order to remove the IHS.


that razor blade was to thick for me i didnt like using it but here is what i used my motorcyle license got beat up a little


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> that razor blade was to thick for me i didnt like using it but here is what i used my motorcyle license got beat up a little


better your license then the pcb ...lol
yea, that blade works well too, i want to get me one of those, and try on a old pentium,
just to see how it works..
i hear many saying a razorblade like this works very well,

they are so thin see..but i think i would cut my fingers with it ..lol
you could tape one side ..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Yeah only I can manage to scratch outside the area the IHS even sits. Don't even know how I nicked that area, talent I suppose.
> 
> Think I'll just dab on some sort of sealant that is non conductive. Not sure on what to use though, any suggestions from everyone here?


Test it first.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> idk, was it because you wanted to run it longer time?


Nope just a quick benchmark run


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Nope just a quick benchmark run


well, i for one dont see why not, for benching i did much higher vcores,
and alot around 1.6V vcore, because my chip likes vcore, bad ocer..
like i need 1.6450 at 5.2ghz

but i dont run those longer then 10-15 min tops

i looked for degradation when someone here said,
if it happens, youll notice it with every oc you did,
so i started again with the lowest 4.4ghz oc, worked my way up,
and used exactly the same vcores, ive written down , no problem anywhere


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So I practiced this morning on a Celeron D 336 and sure enough, the sucker was soldered on the die. I'm pretty sure I didn't scratch the PCB or hit the die while delidding but the force I had to put on it to pry the IHS killed the cpu. The scratches you see in the pic came after I confirmed it dead, I was just scraping solder off of the die for fun.
> 
> Apparently the "-(S-775) Celeron" doesn't apply to all socket 775 Celerons.


Really? My Celerons that were "Soldered" worked after being de-lidded and forcefully opened, both of them that is..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, the list is a bit old, took it from a thread somewhere here on ocn,
> its not complete, maybe theres some wrongs in it too..
> 
> but like i said before, its about getting the feel of delidding, how the blade behaves, force you use etc,
> practice on some old pentiums/celeron's is way cheaper if it goes wrong, then damaging a $300 ivy ..lol
> theres a saying, "practice makes perfect"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just now , in the other post, i used the word "revise", i didnt know it, "verbeteren" is our word for it,
> 
> google gives me the following options, but i thought revise was the best one to use (looking at context also)
> 
> improve -verbeteren, beter worden, vooruitgaan, beter maken, veredelen, bijwerken
> better -verbeteren
> ameliorate -verbeteren, beter maken, stijgen, beter worden
> amend -amenderen, verbeteren, hervormen, zich beteren
> correct -corrigeren, verbeteren, terechtwijzen, tuchtigen
> rectify -herstellen, rectificeren, verbeteren, zuiveren, opnieuw overhalen, tot een rechte lijn herleiden
> reform -hervormen, verbeteren, reformeren, bekeren, afschaffen, zijn leven beteren
> reclaim -herwinnen, terugeisen, ontginnen, verbeteren, droogleggen, ontwoekeren
> mend -herstellen, repareren, beteren, verbeteren, stoppen, lappen
> perfect -perfectioneren, volmaken, voltooien, verbeteren, volvoeren
> revise -herzien, corrigeren, verbeteren, nakijken, nazien, inspecteren
> change for the better -verbeteren
> 
> its funny, revise looks alot like our word revisie,
> when i google revisie in dutch, and translate to english,
> 
> revision -herziening, revisie, correctie, herziene uitgaaf
> *revise*- herziening, revisie, controle, herziene uitgaaf, tweede correctie
> overhaul -revisie, grondig onderzoek, inspectie, demontage, het nazien, het inhalen


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So I practiced this morning on a Celeron D 336 and sure enough, the sucker was soldered on the die. I'm pretty sure I didn't scratch the PCB or hit the die while delidding but the force I had to put on it to pry the IHS killed the cpu. The scratches you see in the pic came after I confirmed it dead, I was just scraping solder off of the die for fun.
> 
> Apparently the "-(S-775) Celeron" doesn't apply to all socket 775 Celerons.


Really? My Celerons that were "Soldered" worked after being de-lidded and forcefully opened, both of them that is..

Sorry for the double post guys.. I just got up.
Wow, all of your words end in "Ize", "Zien" or "Ren". That is really cool but off at the same time!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, the list is a bit old, took it from a thread somewhere here on ocn,
> its not complete, maybe theres some wrongs in it too..
> 
> but like i said before, its about getting the feel of delidding, how the blade behaves, force you use etc,
> practice on some old pentiums/celeron's is way cheaper if it goes wrong, then damaging a $300 ivy ..lol
> theres a saying, "practice makes perfect"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just now , in the other post, i used the word "revise", i didnt know it, "verbeteren" is our word for it,
> 
> google gives me the following options, but i thought revise was the best one to use (looking at context also)
> 
> improve -verbeteren, beter worden, vooruitgaan, beter maken, veredelen, bijwerken
> better -verbeteren
> ameliorate -verbeteren, beter maken, stijgen, beter worden
> amend -amenderen, verbeteren, hervormen, zich beteren
> correct -corrigeren, verbeteren, terechtwijzen, tuchtigen
> rectify -herstellen, rectificeren, verbeteren, zuiveren, opnieuw overhalen, tot een rechte lijn herleiden
> reform -hervormen, verbeteren, reformeren, bekeren, afschaffen, zijn leven beteren
> reclaim -herwinnen, terugeisen, ontginnen, verbeteren, droogleggen, ontwoekeren
> mend -herstellen, repareren, beteren, verbeteren, stoppen, lappen
> perfect -perfectioneren, volmaken, voltooien, verbeteren, volvoeren
> revise -herzien, corrigeren, verbeteren, nakijken, nazien, inspecteren
> change for the better -verbeteren
> 
> its funny, revise looks alot like our word revisie,
> when i google revisie in dutch, and translate to english,
> 
> revision -herziening, revisie, correctie, herziene uitgaaf
> *revise*- herziening, revisie, controle, herziene uitgaaf, tweede correctie
> overhaul -revisie, grondig onderzoek, inspectie, demontage, het nazien, het inhalen


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So I practiced this morning on a Celeron D 336 and sure enough, the sucker was soldered on the die. I'm pretty sure I didn't scratch the PCB or hit the die while delidding but the force I had to put on it to pry the IHS killed the cpu. The scratches you see in the pic came after I confirmed it dead, I was just scraping solder off of the die for fun.
> 
> Apparently the "-(S-775) Celeron" doesn't apply to all socket 775 Celerons.


Really? My Celerons that were "Soldered" worked after being de-lidded and forcefully opened, both of them that is..

Sorry for the double post guys.. I just got up.
Wow, all of your words end in "Ize", "Zien" or "Ren". That is really cool but off at the same time!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welp this is all i can do till more parts come in!


Lookin good Hokie. How old is your lil boy? I got three of them runnin around here myself.


----------



## Valgaur

just notices this but hokies... you should turn your rads around. right the inlets and outlets at the bottom air gets trapped in the upper parts of the inner rad tubing to if you want that out just flip the rads then the air will go right out of the tubing and into the res where it belongs


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2297140
> 
> I've been trying to find a comparison of Liquid Ultra vs Pro for a while now, found this guy saying that they were both identical.
> 
> *Pretty rare to find someone who blew $50 on thermal pastes*


Where did you get $50 from? I already had some Ultra and the Pro was like $13 plus shipping. (see what I mean about misinformation







)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> boring today, we need more peeps who want to delid!
> guess its another OT-day ..lol
> downloaded a tv-show called "Fringe", watching it now ..i think its great..


I've been watching it recently, good show, kinda like the old x-files. My niece is part of the production crew, sister got me started on it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Thats odd, on my 920 I have 191x20 on a closed loop. Was there a big change in the chips since then?
> 
> And since you are all talking about power supplies, I do agree with the fully modular PSUs aslong you can afford them haha. I have always gone with Corsair when building client builds but for my current build I had gone to MicroCenter and the best pick for me was a OCZ 850w Gold series. I wanted a platnium but they had just come out at the time and the actual box/housing was very oddly shaped and I knew I would have a bad time having to disassemble and paint. I didn't really have to consider the power cables because I am making my own cables from scratch.
> 
> Also I am really craving to do a liquid cooled bitfenix prodigy build...
> 
> Except I think it would be really cool if I were to mod it so you guys could fit a LN2 pot and ti would stick out the top haha.


There were big changes from i7 920 to sandy & ivy. Uncore is now tied to the cpu clock so runs at the same speed, & most everything else is tied to the bclk so it just runs from 100 - ~110 & most overclocking is done with the multis. Some of the walls that made it tough to get high overclocks with 920 have been torn down (besides being a bit faster clock for clock).

Hokies, will be interesting to see how the new build holds temps, that's a lot of radiator!


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> just notices this but hokies... you should turn your rads around. right the inlets and outlets at the bottom air gets trapped in the upper parts of the inner rad tubing to if you want that out just flip the rads then the air will go right out of the tubing and into the res where it belongs


my inlets are at the top also. the bleed themselves out easily. works good with them up top.


----------



## rhole

I just delidded my Core i5-3750K after a few weeks of thought in to it. Was much much easier than I anticipated. I used a razor blade that came with a wallpaper hanging pack. Thicker than a double edge blade but still thin enough.

Will post my findings on mine after I get my Liquid Pro which I only ordered today.

In the mean time, I put Prolima Tech PK-3 paste which I already had on the Die and on the top of the IHS.
Only just booted up set it to 4.6GHz in the Bios and put a Voltage of 1.340 on it and threw in to Prime95. I can run 4.6GHz at a lot lower voltage than that but wanted to see what kind of heat it would throw up at this voltage and speed as I tried this combination before.

Before, the 4 cores were hovering between 80 and 87 degrees in RealTemp.

Now, the 4 cores are hovering between 68 and 76 degrees in RealTemp.

Thats quite a healthy drop considering what it was before at that voltage, and with just PK-3. So, I'm really pleased so far. Can't wait for the Liquid Pro to arrive in a couple days (maybe monday with the weekend). Then I will see what it can really do speed and temp wise.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> just notices this but hokies... you should turn your rads around. right the inlets and outlets at the bottom air gets trapped in the upper parts of the inner rad tubing to if you want that out just flip the rads then the air will go right out of the tubing and into the res where it belongs


I might if my res does not fit.. Tubing is down there for looks..

On top of the rads there is another port i can un screw to correct any air trapped in them.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Thats odd, on my 920 I have 191x20 on a closed loop. Was there a big change in the chips since then?
> 
> And since you are all talking about power supplies, I do agree with the fully modular PSUs aslong you can afford them haha. I have always gone with Corsair when building client builds but for my current build I had gone to MicroCenter and the best pick for me was a OCZ 850w Gold series. I wanted a platnium but they had just come out at the time and the actual box/housing was very oddly shaped and I knew I would have a bad time having to disassemble and paint. I didn't really have to consider the power cables because I am making my own cables from scratch.
> 
> Also I am really craving to do a liquid cooled bitfenix prodigy build...
> 
> Except I think it would be really cool if I were to mod it so you guys could fit a LN2 pot and ti would stick out the top haha.


I like that pot idea xD though you would get lots of condensation in there without some good airflow...I was planning on running a pot passive with the cpu underclocked to fool around. I've seen a 3770k idle at 36c with only an SF3D pot on top. I also have my desk in front of a window, so I can easily do a custom loop with an external radiator to dump the heat out of the room. I could use a humongous rad like I've seen done before.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> better your license then the pcb ...lol
> yea, that blade works well too, i want to get me one of those, and try on a old pentium,
> just to see how it works..
> i hear many saying a razorblade like this works very well,
> 
> they are so thin see..but i think i would cut my fingers with it ..lol
> you could tape one side ..


Those razors are mean, they will laugh at your tape man...They slice cases like they were butter. I've cut a fair bit of stuff off my case with them








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I might if my res does not fit.. Tubing is down there for looks..
> 
> On top of the rads there is another port i can un screw to correct any air trapped in them.


Multi port rads are awesome


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2297140
> 
> I've been trying to find a comparison of Liquid Ultra vs Pro for a while now, found this guy saying that they were both identical.
> 
> *Pretty rare to find someone who blew $50 on thermal pastes*
> 
> 
> 
> Where did you get $50 from? I already had some Ultra and the Pro was like $13 plus shipping. (see what I mean about misinformation
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
Click to expand...

Including shipping, it's not common to find ultra/pro below $25 shipped. I mean sometimes, but I've been keeping tabs on ultra/pro prices and only a few places have it below $25 shipped for usually just one of them, and such place runs out of stock (ebay, amazon, sidewinder, etc).

At the cheapest, it's at least $40 shipped for both of them. Shipping is always a lot on these things. Sidewinder on ebay has ultra at $17 shipped right now but not the pro.


----------



## Swag

Honestly, where does everyone find those Gillette blades? I've been looking everywhere and I can't find them, I always delid with a box cutter blade like the one in my guide!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I like that pot idea xD though you would get lots of condensation in there without some good airflow...I was planning on running a pot passive with the cpu underclocked to fool around. I've seen a 3770k idle at 36c with only an SF3D pot on top. I also have my desk in front of a window, so I can easily do a custom loop with an external radiator to dump the heat out of the room. I could use a humongous rad like I've seen done before.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those razors are mean, they will laugh at your tape man...They slice cases like they were butter. I've cut a fair bit of stuff off my case with them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Multi port rads are awesome


Monsta rads have 7 ports lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Honestly, where does everyone find those Gillette blades? I've been looking everywhere and I can't find them, I always delid with a box cutter blade like the one in my guide!


box cutter blades don't cut yourself like the Gillettes lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

They sell them everywhere here...I got mine at a kiosk myself, but ymmv.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Monsta rads have 7 ports lol


I'm really sold on them, seems really convenient, and the performance scaling with cfm is good from what I gather.


----------



## Vi0lence

i have some swiftech rads i was going to switch to the thicker rads but unsure of how much i will gain from them for the cost.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Honestly, where does everyone find those Gillette blades? I've been looking everywhere and I can't find them, I always delid with a box cutter blade like the one in my guide!
> 
> 
> 
> box cutter blades don't cut yourself like the Gillettes lol
Click to expand...

You must be willing to sacrifice some blood to stop the oppression...(of the people of the Die)


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Including shipping, it's not common to find ultra/pro below $25 shipped. I mean sometimes, but I've been keeping tabs on ultra/pro prices and only a few places have it below $25 shipped for usually just one of them, and such place runs out of stock (ebay, amazon, sidewinder, etc).
> 
> At the cheapest, it's at least $40 shipped for both of them. Shipping is always a lot on these things. Sidewinder on ebay has ultra at $17 shipped right now but not the pro.


Wow.. I got both for $30 from their site delivered? It did take a month... But still.


----------



## DiamondCut

Just delidded a 3770k for a coworker.
Before the delid it was at 4.2ghz at 72c on load
After the delid it was 4.6ghz at the hottest core being at 59c on load.
Used CLU with a H100 cooler.


----------



## Vi0lence

nice. did you lap the IHS?


----------



## $ilent

I got a question re lapping. My IHS is a little lapped,but not down to the copper. Does getting to the copper matter and do you need to start on low grit or can you start at like 800?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> I got a question re lapping. My IHS is a little lapped,but not down to the copper. Does getting to the copper matter and do you need to start on low grit or can you start at like 800?


I lapped mine until i saw all cooper there.







And almost like a mirror finish.

Edit: My d14 is not lapped.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Including shipping, it's not common to find ultra/pro below $25 shipped. I mean sometimes, but I've been keeping tabs on ultra/pro prices and only a few places have it below $25 shipped for usually just one of them, and such place runs out of stock (ebay, amazon, sidewinder, etc).
> 
> At the cheapest, it's at least $40 shipped for both of them. Shipping is always a lot on these things. Sidewinder on ebay has ultra at $17 shipped right now but not the pro.


I got my Liquid ultra for $15 shipped from Sidewinder Computers and I got my Liquid Pro from FrozenCPU for $16 shipped IIRC. So yeah, $25 seems outrageous.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> I got a question re lapping. My IHS is a little lapped,but not down to the copper. Does getting to the copper matter and do you need to start on low grit or can you start at like 800?


i do 600 until i get through to the copper starts showing. 800 until i see copper completly, then 1200, then 1500, then 2000, then 3000, then i polish it up.


----------



## $ilent

Cool my local homebase only does like 600 max but I'm looking at an eBay kit it only starts at like 800 or something.

I know the objective is to get it flat as apposed to shiny but I think seeing copper makes a few degree difference too. What about lapping my prolimatech megahalem base?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Cool my local homebase only does like 600 max but I'm looking at an eBay kit it only starts at like 800 or something.
> 
> I know the objective is to get it flat as apposed to shiny but I think seeing copper makes a few degree difference too. What about lapping my prolimatech megahalem base?


Auto body supply places generally have a better selection of the really fine stuff. Found out by accident, was grabbing some new bulbs for the car at a hardware/home/auto place & saw that the 1000 - 2000 grit stuff was in the auto section & not with all the general sandpaper & emory cloth.


----------



## $ilent

Ah cool there's a car shop not far might have a drive up tomorrow.

Thanks pal


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Ah cool there's a car shop not far might have a drive up tomorrow.
> 
> Thanks pal


I got some up to 1800 at Harbor Freight, the local bigbox stores only had up to 600 and my local hardware store only has up to 320.


----------



## Belial

yea maybe your right. I think you can find liquid ultra or pro around $15-17 if your patient. But most places, most of the time, sell them at $23+. I mean sidewinder has a great deal right now but i dont think they always had a great deal.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sidewinder is my go to place for LP/LU...they offer free shipping in the US and sell cool stuff.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> nice. did you lap the IHS?


Nah, I am only lapping mine because of the slight imperfections and it looks cool. I just ordered the sandpaper 200,400,600,800, and 1000 grit.


----------



## Jayjr1105

I lapped a crappy Rosewill heatsink a couple years ago and I started with 600, then 800, then 1000 and honestly 1000-1200 is all the higher you need to go. Any more and you're just doing it for the mirrored look. Your not going to improve conductivity much past 1200.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> I lapped a crappy Rosewill heatsink a couple years ago and I started with 600, then 800, then 1000 and honestly 1000-1200 is all the higher you need to go. Any more and you're just doing it for the mirrored look. Your not going to improve conductivity much past 1200.


That's exactly my thought, especially when the higher the grit the more expensive this stuff gets...


----------



## lilchronic

wallmart has 600 800 1000 1500 2000grit autobody section


----------



## Vi0lence

advanced auto parts has the 3000 grit spunge paper thing. it works awesome.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> to *Valgaur* and the long-term delidders


...got not one but two orders of CoolLaboratory Liquid Pro and Ultra on the way (along with their ALPHEOS Liquid Cooler water block and related bits)...

1.) as prep for the 'delidding', has any of the *long-term users* of the CLP/CLU noticed any 'corroded' bits on either the die, the IHS or CPU cooler bottom ? I ask because I have seen some post in another thread on that, but they were likely referring to aluminum-bottomed coolers (which are not s.th. I would use anyhow)

3.) since I'm getting both CLP and CLU, I plan to *mix both* and then apply it to the die and also the CPU cooler (if I do not end up running 'unlidded'). Good idea ? Bad idea ?

Thanks for your feedback









...btw, re a new logo slogan for this group (I think I saw some posts on that), you might want to show a pic of the guillotine (French Revolution) with the slogan: "Off with their heads"







...well, just a thought


----------



## Vi0lence

dont mix both. one of the 2 is best suited for nickel plates surfaces. and as for corrosion no. i have my 2600k that has a slight film of ultra still on it for the 4 months it has been in a little cpu holder on my desk (dead chip) and it still looks just like the day i put it there.

ill actually do a test and put liquid ultra on a chip and leave it sit in my garage for a few months if someone wants to see it.


----------



## DiamondCut

Ultra should be fine even after being ran. Pro is the one that burns in and would require scrubbing for removal and re applying.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Vi0lence, DiamondCut*...


Thanks for the feedback


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sidewinder is my go to place for LP/LU...they offer free shipping in the US and sell cool stuff.


Indeed they do, that changes everything, since shipping for clu/clp is always $5-10.

Does CLU/CLP stain? I've read multiple, and conflicting reports, on this.

To the guy asking about lapping - technically copper transfers heat better than nickel, so theoretically lapping to copper would produce the best temp drops. In reality, nickel's thermal transferance is so damn close to copper, and nickel is many times over more durable, which is why you rarely see that copper-bronze color on heatsinks anymore. Everything is nickel-plated copper, in the real world you won't see any temp differences (i doubt youd see any difference from lapped cpu vs lapped to the copper cpu, that's beside the point that lapping doesn't exactly drop temps that much), and nickel is much more durable.

I'd rather not lap through to the copper due to that, but it's up to you. There's a reason everything is nickel plated these days, the loss far outweighs the gain. you really don't need to lap through to the copper. You just need to lap it so it's smooth, how smooth is up to you.
Quote:


> 3.) since I'm getting both CLP and CLU, I plan to mix both and then apply it to the die and also the CPU cooler (if I do not end up running 'unlidded'). Good idea ? Bad idea ?


Why don't you delid, try clp, then try clu, then try your mix of both and post the results. If I had both, I would try it if that idea ran through my head. Honestly I don't think it's a good idea... but it's not really a bad idea either. If you got a tube of the stuff, there's no reason not to try such things, see what happens. I know I've remounted PK1/PK2/PK3 many times on my system, just trying stuff out. I even took the excess paste from my gtx 460 when I re-TIMd it (there was so much excess tim on it, that I had more than a 1.5g tube of paste! i put it into a baggie) and tried it out (was pretty good actually).

It seems as more and more people test them though,they say they are both the same or within a margin of error of eachother, but more results is always better.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Ultra should be fine even after being ran. Pro is the one that burns in and would require scrubbing for removal and re applying.


the stuff left behind is small metal particles filling in the imperfections in the metal. on my lapped IHS thats BARELY an issue. mine almost comes completly off like regular tim. i dont even scrub it all the way off when i reapply. never have on probably 10 re seatings.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> the stuff left behind is small metal particles filling in the imperfections in the metal. on my lapped IHS thats BARELY an issue. mine almost comes completly off like regular tim. i dont even scrub it all the way off when i reapply. never have on probably 10 re seatings.


Ahh that would make sense. I haven't used it on a lapped chip yet


----------



## Vi0lence

yea its not nearly as bad on a lapped cpu. the stock ihs is pretty rough. isnt to smooth. on my EK block it comes right off the nickel with very little left behind. almost nothing.

and the lapped ihs is great to do as the 2 i have done on 3770k's were anything but flat. so uneven its not even funny. heres the last one i did.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...btw, re a *new logo slogan for this group (I think I saw some posts on that), you might want to show a pic of the guillotine (French Revolution) with the slogan: "Off with their heads"*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...well, just a thought


----------



## lilchronic

lap it till its flat. this was when i switched to 800 or 1000 girt i think


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lap it till its flat. this was when i switched to 800 or 1000 girt i think


pretty much what i do. same basic point. just to where there is a little of the nickel coating left. then ill take that off with the 800 and 1000 grits. i have this dead 2600k here i may make a video tomorrow of the lapping process i do. just because im bored during the day.


----------



## CroSsFiRe2009

I'm just going to put it out there for those trying to cheat and delid easily. Solvoplast adhesive remover is a BAD idea. Just use the razor and be done with it.. It's been mentioned as an easy solution but nobody has ever tried it before until I stupidly did.

Soaked the ihs/got some on the pads of the chip in solvoplast for 24 hours. Used a DE blade to attempt to delid. Went smoothly and finished. washed off the solvo with 99% iso. Used liquid pro on the die and mx2 on the hsf. Boots up but it can't get past the logo and doesnt show up any graphics at all in bios. Only thing that pops up is the boot menu. Using the integrated gpu causes artifacts to show up on screen. No nicks, no scrapes, it was a perfect delid but it's somehow dead. I'm going to leave it for a while to dry out I hope but I honestly don't have much hope for it. It was a retail edge 3770k so the $damage isn't so bad but I just feel dumb now


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CroSsFiRe2009*
> 
> I'm just going to put it out there for those trying to cheat and delid easily. Solvoplast adhesive remover is a BAD idea. Just use the razor and be done with it.. It's been mentioned as an easy solution but nobody has ever tried it before until I stupidly did.
> 
> Soaked the ihs/got some on the pads of the chip in solvoplast for 24 hours. Used a DE blade to attempt to delid. Went smoothly and finished. washed off the solvo with 99% iso. Used liquid pro on the die and mx2 on the hsf. Boots up but it can't get past the logo and doesnt show up any graphics at all in bios. Only thing that pops up is the boot menu. Using the integrated gpu causes artifacts to show up on screen. No nicks, no scrapes, it was a perfect delid but it's somehow dead. I'm going to leave it for a while to dry out I hope but I honestly don't have much hope for it. It was a retail edge 3770k so the $damage isn't so bad but I just feel dumb now


good to know, but bad for you CroSsFiRe2009..dang

i still have to do some testing with that method, ive saved all the adhesive of the delidded pentiums,
but first wanted to do it on a spoon, with only some of the adhesive, if it would dissolve it,
i was gonna do the same as you, let it soak for hours in the adhesive remover, and see if i could take the ihs off
without using a blade..
i didnt/dont know if it would harm the green on the pcb, still not sure, did you see anything ?

i bought this to test with, its very hefty stuff

removal of stickers, sticker adhesive, _rubber adhesive_, adhesive tape,
tar splashes, greasy patches, oil, heel marks and many other problems, from virtually all surfaces.


----------



## CroSsFiRe2009

I honestly wouldn't bother with the adhesive remover. I think the soaking is what screwed with something on the pad/mounted component side and something seeped in. The adhesive remover I used definitely helped but it didn't help as much as I thought it would. The resulting soft paste actually causes a bit of suction that hinders removal a bit

Bit more info here http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/overclocking-tweaking-benchmarking/54199-those-contemplating-ihs-removal-ivy.html


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CroSsFiRe2009*
> 
> I honestly wouldn't bother with the adhesive remover. I think the soaking is what screwed with something on the pad/mounted component side and something seeped in. The adhesive remover I used definitely helped but it didn't help as much as I thought it would. The resulting soft paste actually causes a bit of suction that hinders removal a bit
> 
> Bit more info here http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/overclocking-tweaking-benchmarking/54199-those-contemplating-ihs-removal-ivy.html


i see he says this,

"I used it allot back in my K7 days. I would stick the chip upside down in just enough to cover the adhesive in a tupperware container and put the lid on for 24 hours, then grab a double edge razor and I would be done 30 seconds later. Would be 10 seconds but I would take my time "

not worth it, so without using his method, it takes 5 to 20 minutes to remove the ihs,
and now we know it can go wrong too using the remover, still gonna do my experiment with it tho ..lol
i was looking for a way to take the ihs off _without_ using a blade see..

edit
just to make you guys a bit jealous..lol
my temps without opening my frontdoor this morning, -5C outside


----------



## CroSsFiRe2009

You're still going to need a prybar to get it off. Even when I had the entire thing separated with the razors, the TIM and the glue goop took quite a bit of effort to pop the ihs. Guess testing wouldn't hurt but that's just my 2cents


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CroSsFiRe2009*
> 
> You're still going to need a prybar to get it off. Even when I had the entire thing separated with the razors, the TIM and the glue goop took quite a bit of effort to pop the ihs. Guess testing wouldn't hurt but that's just my 2cents


yea, was just one of the crazy ideas i had a while ago, to find a way to take the ihs off without using a blade,
but like the guy said on the other site, he used it for years so..but yea, when i thought about it later,
when i bought the remover, mabye its not that good idea, guess thats why i still have the unopened bottle ..lol


----------



## tw33k

Finally got a response from Coollabs...
Quote:


> The heat conductivity value for Liquid Pro is 32,6 w/mk and for Liquid Ultra is 38,4 w/mk.


I knew the figures that people kept quoting were not correct and now we have confirmation (from the CEO no less)


----------



## Gomi

Yum yum!



To bad they are all 2700K, lol.

Only Batch number that is "different" is this one:



Will fire them up and do a quick bin later tomorrow









Oh, got RAM ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Finally got a response from Coollabs...
> I knew the figures that people kept quoting were not correct and now we have confirmation


great tw33k







,i just checked my mailbox,and i got a email from them too ...LOL

Dear Mr. Smit,

thanks for your mail. The value for Liquid Pro is approx. 32,6 W/mk.

For more information we are gladly at your disposal.

Sincerely yours,

Coollaboratory Support

right , now we got the numbers ...moving on...









heres the new info ,

LM Pro = 32,6 (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
LM Ultra = 38.4w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
everything else is less

have to say this tw33k, its not that we were all wrong, or giving misinformation ..lol
just do a google seach on w/mk liquid pro,
almost every review/test have the 82 w/mk for liquid pro..
its been used *for years* now, so we all thought it was right..right


----------



## tw33k

I never thought it was right.


----------



## Gomi

Guess I will have to order some ULTRA myself then - At least for testing purposes 









Getting a new waterblock anyways, so might aswell lap the new block + IHS and use ULTRA + ULTRA + ULTRA.

Going to be ... exciting ... to see how the PRO is going to behave when trying to remove it - I guess the "Scratch"-pad is to be used on the IHS and just alcohol and a lint-free cloth on the Die ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I never thought it was right.


well, thats why we like having you around , smart guy







jk jk

if 100's of people use that number, what would you do, believe its right i guess,
but its always good to doubt things, if you feel its not right









but thanks for the effort, funny we got the mail the same day ..lol

leaves the question some of us here think pro is better then ultra...hmm
wm/k wise, ultra should perform better, maybe not by much, but still









but thanks to you and your testing, and your doubts,
i mailed coollabs too, to ask about the w/mk of pro..

anyways, im happy now, i hate to be wrong, or giving peeps wrong info..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Guess I will have to order some ULTRA myself then - At least for testing purposes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Getting a new waterblock anyways, so might aswell lap the new block + IHS and use ULTRA + ULTRA + ULTRA.
> 
> Going to be ... exciting ... to see how the PRO is going to behave when trying to remove it - I guess the "Scratch"-pad is to be used on the IHS and just alcohol and a lint-free cloth on the Die ?


yea, im thinking the same now, i still have pro under it, for about 4 months now,
wanted to wait for 5-6 months, and see how it cleans after that time,
i think im gonna order Ultra now, see how that works, and how it cleans after 5-6 months


----------



## SonDa5

I really thought the CL LP had the better rating.

I think CL LP is still probably better because it easily spreads so thin. Thinner TIM layers seems to work the best I think.

I have alot of CL LP left in my syringe so I'm holding on to it for awhile.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, thats why we like having you around , smart guy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jk jk
> 
> if 100's of people use that number, what would you do, believe its right i guess,
> but its always good to doubt things, if you feel its not right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but thanks for the effort, funny we got the mail the same day ..lol
> 
> leaves the question some of us here think pro is better then ultra...hmm
> wm/k wise, ultra should perform better, maybe not by much, but still
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but thanks to you and your testing, and your doubts,
> i mailed coollabs too, to ask about the w/mk of pro..
> 
> anyways, im happy now, i hate to be wrong, or giving peeps wrong info..


It is funny we got the email on the same day. I'm just glad they finally replied and we could get the right info. People should come here if they want to know what's what


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I really thought the CL LP had the better rating.
> 
> I think CL LP is still probably better because it easily spreads so thin. Thinner TIM layers seems to work the best I think.
> 
> I have alot of CL LP left in my syringe so I'm holding on to it for awhile.


yea, i still have 1 or 2 times left in my seringe,
so have to order anyways soon, so Ultra it is..np









i was just thinking , isnt it the same with the hard belief about the so called max vcore,
" Intel says" , "intel states" max vcore is 1.52V
when enough peeps say it, and repeat because "people who know" say so ...after a while its accepted as being true right









i found this line somewhere, just for example ok ,

" Intel found that at 22nm and smaller that lead-free solder started to crack and crumble under the pressure,
no future chips will use solder."

if enough peeps think this is right, and start uing it all over the place...well


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> It is funny we got the email on the same day. I'm just glad they finally replied and we could get the right info. People should come here if they want to know what's what


here the one about Ultra, you can copy it, save it somewhere for later use if you like (proof







)

Dear Mr. Smit,

thanks for your mail. The heat conduction value for Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is 38,4 W/mk.

For more information we are gladly at your disposal.

Sincerely yours,

Coollaboratory Support


----------



## Coolwaters

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> here the one about Ultra, you can copy it, save it somewhere for later use if you like (proof
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Dear Mr. Smit,
> 
> thanks for your mail. The heat conduction value for Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is 38,4 W/mk.
> 
> For more information we are gladly at your disposal.
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Coollaboratory Support


so judging by those values theres a distinct limitation on the actual silicon die. used a lot of different kinds of paste (TX-4,MX-4,..ect)
theres barely any temp drop. but i still like the liquid ultra.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Coolwaters*
> 
> so judging by those values theres a distinct limitation on the actual silicon die. used a lot of different kinds of paste (TX-4,MX-4,..ect)
> theres barely any temp drop. but i still like the liquid ultra.


well, one thing we do know, liquid pro/ultra still beats other tim's, when used on the die


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not worth it, so without using his method, it takes 5 to 20 minutes to remove the ihs,
> and now we know it can go wrong too using the remover, still gonna do my experiment with it tho ..lol
> i was looking for a way to take the ihs off _without_ using a blade see..
> 
> edit
> just to make you guys a bit jealous..lol
> my temps without opening my frontdoor this morning, -5C outside


5 to 20 minutes to remove the IHS?!?! Or do you mean scraping all the glue off too? It takes me much less than that but I kinda boss through it. Go big or go home!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Finally got a response from Coollabs...
> I knew the figures that people kept quoting were not correct and now we have confirmation (from the CEO no less)


Nice
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> well, one thing we do know, liquid pro/ultra still beats other tim's, when used on the die


This is still true.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> 5 to 20 minutes to remove the IHS?!?! Or do you mean scraping all the glue off too? It takes me much less than that but I kinda boss through it. Go big or go home!


im talking about the averages that peeps need, some take longer, some are very fast , like you








i did it in 10-15min including cleaning the adhesive etc..
but..does it really matter howlong someone takes to get the ihs off?
its not a race who is the fastest...lol, its more important that all goes well..right ?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im talking about the averages that peeps need, some take longer, some are very fast , like you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i did it in 10-15min including cleaning the adhesive etc..
> but..does it really matter howlong someone takes to get the ihs off?
> its not a race who is the fastest...lol, its more important that all goes well..right ?


No, everything is a competition when you're a man! Me and the kids race to see who can get in the car and get the seat-belts on fastest. At work we pick equal sizes on a section of a roof and see who can plywood it the fastest. In reality we should probably be more concerned with safety, but "F" that, the loser has to buy lunch!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> No, everything is a competition when you're a man! Me and the kids race to see who can get in the car and get the seat-belts on fastest. At work we pick equal sizes on a section of a roof and see who can plywood it the fastest. In reality we should probably be more concerned with safety, but "F" that, the loser has to buy lunch!


yea, youre a real man if you race with your little kids to the car, to see whos fastest









just messing with ya stickg1








anyways,
i have to get my power supply out of my computer,
the new one will arrive within the hour,
my kiddo is here, and wants to take it with him to build it into his..kids..







impatient ...LOL


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, youre a real man if you race with your little kids to the car, to see whos fastest


It was actually a tactical move because my kids just love to screw around. They'll do everything BUT get in the car and get buckled up. They wander around the front yard "Hey whose cat is this, What's that thing? Why's this tree here?" and I'm like "GAAAHHHH GET IN THE CAR!!", so ever since I made the seat-belt race we don't have that problem. But now if I lose I have to listen to them sing about how I'm a princess fairy.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you need to do it like this


I initially used the q tip to apply the liquid pro to the die but then I was worried some of the small fibers from the tip would get mixed in with the die.

Anyone else got any ideas how we should apply this liquid pro to the die?


----------



## nagle3092

Im gonna use a nail polish brush, the wife has plenty of that crap anyways.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Finally got a response from Coollabs...
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> The heat conductivity value for Liquid Pro is 32,6 w/mk and for Liquid Ultra is 38,4 w/mk.
> 
> 
> 
> I knew the figures that people kept quoting were not correct and now we have confirmation (from the CEO no less)
Click to expand...

Cool. Both are very close and both do a great job. And the 1-3C diff most people find is within the typical window of difference. Especially when it is only done in an ad-hoc comparison way when switching between the two. Thanks for the effort to look into it!

BTY, I'm an Ultra man myself. I bought one Ultra, then a PRO to try, and when I reordered I bought two more Ultras as I liked it better than PRO. But others like PRO better which is fine as they both do a great job in this application. More systematic testing would be good to verify everything, but I expect them to be very close with no bad choice between them.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Cool. Both are very close and both do a great job. And the 1-3C diff most people find is within the typical window of difference. Especially when it is only done in an ad-hoc comparison way when switching between the two. Thanks for the effort to look into it!
> 
> BTY, I'm an Ultra man myself. I bought one Ultra, then a PRO to try, and when I reordered I bought two more Ultras as I liked it better than PRO. But others like PRO better which is fine as they both do a great job in this application. More systematic testing would be good to verify everything, but I expect them to be very close with no bad choice between them.


I agree 100%


----------



## $ilent

So what do we think is better to apply Tim on the die, small brush, a tip, other? And should you put enough on to make it like a mirror glass finish or just enough to conceal the grey glass on the die underneath?


----------



## tw33k

I like the little brush that comes with Ultra and you can see if you've used too much because it kind of "pools" in places (I don't know if that explains it properly)


----------



## Matt-Matt

I used the cotton buds that came with the pro, the brush didn't work very well for me.. I also used some generic coles branded cotton buds also for cleaning up the little bit of excess.


----------



## $ilent

alright im gonna go with q tips again


----------



## $ilent

Hey guys I'm cleaning my CPU up is it safe to use a citrus based Tim cleaner solvent to clean off the underside of the IHS?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Hey guys I'm cleaning my CPU up is it safe to use a citrus based Tim cleaner solvent to clean off the underside of the IHS?


No idea... Try just Metholated Spirits. (Metho), i used that and I've had no problems!


----------



## $ilent

OK I'm in bother. I'm cleaning liquid pro off the die and now there's loads small blotches of dried liquid pro on the die which rubbing doesn't get off. Should I use the included isopropylalkohol 70% that's included with the liquid pro or use my citrus based Tim cleaner or something else?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It was actually a tactical move because my kids just love to screw around. They'll do everything BUT get in the car and get buckled up. They wander around the front yard "Hey whose cat is this, What's that thing? Why's this tree here?" and I'm like "GAAAHHHH GET IN THE CAR!!", so ever since I made the seat-belt race we don't have that problem. But now if I lose I have to listen to them sing about how I'm a princess fairy.


yea, those little tricks work








they have fun doing it, and you get what you want, seatbelts on









o man, i just build in my new XFX ProSeries 850W XXX Edition 80 Plus Silver psu,
this thing is fast i tell ya!! beats the old 750W easy..........hehe


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> OK I'm in bother. I'm cleaning liquid pro off the die and now there's loads small blotches of dried liquid pro on the die which rubbing doesn't get off. Should I use the included isopropylalkohol 70% that's included with the liquid pro or use my citrus based Tim cleaner or something else?


use the stuff that came with the package,

citrus based tim cleaner, idk, does it have alcohol in it? like minimal 70%
if you gonna use pro or ultra again on the die, it doesnt have to be all shiny clean,
just get it of as good as possible, apply the tim again..done









Denatured alcohol or methylated spirits is best to use, the higher the % alcohol the better,
the spiritis i use is about 90%

94% denatured ethanol sold in a bottle for household use


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> OK I'm in bother. I'm cleaning liquid pro off the die and now there's loads small blotches of dried liquid pro on the die which rubbing doesn't get off. Should I use the included isopropylalkohol 70% that's included with the liquid pro or use my citrus based Tim cleaner or something else?


Following this close - When you are done cleaning the PRO off, mind describing how you did it ?

I dont see any problem with the IHS (Just use the pad included) - But the die is my big question. Your "Small blobs on the die" is just what I expected would happen, and have no clue on how to remove (Other than maybe get an syringe and suck them up?).


----------



## $ilent

The small blobs on the die are dried on, so I can use this wipe that came with the liquid pro to rub the actual die clean? And use the same die to clean the interior of the IHS?


----------



## Gomi

I dont have the "Pad" near me, but aint it a "Scratch" pad ? And if so, would it be wise to use on the die ?

Nevermind, we are talking about the alcohol wipe - Yah, you can use it on the die and the IHS - Just turn it around and use the clean side.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Following this close - When you are done cleaning the PRO off, mind describing how you did it ?
> 
> I dont see any problem with the IHS (Just use the pad included) - But the die is my big question. Your "Small blobs on the die" is just what I expected would happen, and have no clue on how to remove (Other than maybe get an syringe and suck them up?).


but if its hardened , you cant suck it up again, and why cant you use the included scrub pad on the die? its glass so..its harder then the metal ihs right









edit,
i just tried the scrubbing pad on a window, scrubbed _really_ hard on a small area,
cleaned it...it had (little) scratches ...so im thinking not good to use on the die,
or be careful when you use it..
makes me curious tho, to take mine apart again, and see how or whats the best way to get it of the die,
first need to order some new liquid, Ultra this time..also thinking to buy the cleaning kit from coollabs,
and try that with the pro..

The set contains three components, which provide an excellent cleaning when using correctly.
Phase 1: Preparation
Phase 2: Cleaner
Phase 3: Metal Cleaner
The Liquid Cleaning Set - Phase 3 was designed especially for metallic surfaces (copper, nickel, aluminum etc.)

costs 9.90 euro..


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> edit,
> i just tried the scrubbing pad on a window, scrubbed _really_ hard on a small area,
> cleaned it...it had (little) scratches ...so im thinking not good to use on the die,
> or be careful when you use it..


Why didnt I see this bit prior to using it on my die! It cleaned the tim off its got some small scratches on the surface of the die now, but its booted ok!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Why didnt I see this bit prior to using it on my die! It cleaned the tim off its got some small scratches on the surface of the die now, but its booted ok!


the toplayer is thick enough, so no harm done, when i tried on the window, the scratches werent deep,
and i rubbed really hard too..

sorry i didnt try on time, the idea just came to mind, when we talked about it
but you got it all off? with the scrubpad?

grocery..bbl..


----------



## $ilent

Yeah got all the LP off with the scrub pad then used the alcohol wipes to clean it off and cleaned the inside of the IHS too.

My temps seem strange, maybe its cause I'm using new prime95 with avx and its harder on the cpu. At 5ghz, 1.37v max temp 77c.


----------



## DiamondCut

So is the values telling us Ultra has a higher heat transfer rate than Pro or is it the lower the better for those values?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Yum yum!
> 
> 
> 
> To bad they are all 2700K, lol.
> 
> Only Batch number that is "different" is this one:
> 
> 
> 
> Will fire them up and do a quick bin later tomorrow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, got RAM ?


Can you briefly explain the process of binning and what the real goal and gain is for buying mass of components?

Thanks.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Yeah got all the LP off with the scrub pad then used the alcohol wipes to clean it off and cleaned the inside of the IHS too.
> 
> My temps seem strange, maybe its cause I'm using new prime95 with avx and its harder on the cpu. At 5ghz, 1.37v max temp 77c.


new? im using prime95 v277 atm, with avx i think
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> So is the values telling us Ultra has a higher heat transfer rate than Pro or is it the lower the better for those values?


higher w/mk is better


----------



## Jayjr1105

The Citrus based solvents are great (Goo Gone Spray gel is a favorite of mine), just make sure you then clean off the solvent with 90% or higher alcohol afterwards since the citrus solvents are mostly oil based.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> So is the values telling us Ultra has a higher heat transfer rate than Pro or is it the lower the better for those values?
> Can you briefly explain the process of binning and what the real goal and gain is for buying mass of components?
> 
> Thanks.


From HWBOT (And the way I do SB):

_*Binning Sandy Bridge is extremely easy.

- use HS fan with easy mounting
- set Vcore to 1.55V
- disable EIST, C1E and C-States
- disable HT and 2 cores (to not make it overheat with crappy HSF)
- increase multiplier

You just need to see the windows OS options, not actually boot into windows. If your CPU can show the different OS options, stability will just be function of Vcore and temperature. If it doesn't show the OS options, you will never get it stable anyways, so you might as well ditch the CPU.

Usually, it takes about 5 minutes to see if the CPU is good or not.

With some CPUs, you do have the issue that some multiplier is better than the other for stability. For instance, my current CPU can boot at 51x MAX (~ 5145MHz). When trying to run near this max speed, I have to use 49x instead of 50x multiplier because it's a lot more stable.

But, that's something you don't need to test. With BCLK adjustments, you'll never get 5200MHz going or so. Multiplier binning is the best way.*_

Mind you though, I dont sell these - I purely bin them as a hobby and nothing else.

People like Kingpin more or less lives of it though, or at least its a very profitable side-income. He just had a whole bunch of different binned 3770Ks for sale - Best one went for 999 USD and the lowest was around the 400 USD mark.


----------



## $ilent

Yeah 27.7 is one I got, I was using older one week ago


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> The Citrus based solvents are great (Goo Gone Spray gel is a favorite of mine), just make sure you then clean off the solvent with 90% or higher alcohol afterwards since the citrus solvents are mostly oil based.


isnt that doing twice the job, if you can just clean with 90% or higher alcohol the first time?
clean the cleaner ..lol








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> From HWBOT (And the way I do SB):
> 
> _*Binning Sandy Bridge is extremely easy.
> 
> - use HS fan with easy mounting
> - set Vcore to 1.55V
> - disable EIST, C1E and C-States
> - disable HT and 2 cores (to not make it overheat with crappy HSF)
> - increase multiplier
> 
> You just need to see the windows OS options, not actually boot into windows. If your CPU can show the different OS options, stability will just be function of Vcore and temperature. If it doesn't show the OS options, you will never get it stable anyways, so you might as well ditch the CPU.
> 
> Usually, it takes about 5 minutes to see if the CPU is good or not.
> 
> With some CPUs, you do have the issue that some multiplier is better than the other for stability. For instance, my current CPU can boot at 51x MAX (~ 5145MHz). When trying to run near this max speed, I have to use 49x instead of 50x multiplier because it's a lot more stable.
> 
> But, that's something you don't need to test. With BCLK adjustments, you'll never get 5200MHz going or so. Multiplier binning is the best way.*_
> 
> Mind you though, I dont sell these - I purely bin them as a hobby and nothing else.
> 
> People like Kingpin more or less lives of it though, or at least its a very profitable side-income. He just had a whole bunch of different binned 3770Ks for sale - Best one went for 999 USD and the lowest was around the 400 USD mark.


thats very interesting Gomi, i never knew that...thanks


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> isnt that doing twice the job, if you can just clean with 90% or higher alcohol the first time?
> thats very interesting Gomi, i never knew that...thanks


No, the goo gone stuff is much better at breaking down the tough adhesives. Straight alcohol also evaporates a lot quicker.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> From HWBOT (And the way I do SB):
> 
> _*Binning Sandy Bridge is extremely easy.
> 
> - use HS fan with easy mounting
> - set Vcore to 1.55V
> - disable EIST, C1E and C-States
> - disable HT and 2 cores (to not make it overheat with crappy HSF)
> - increase multiplier
> 
> You just need to see the windows OS options, not actually boot into windows. If your CPU can show the different OS options, stability will just be function of Vcore and temperature. If it doesn't show the OS options, you will never get it stable anyways, so you might as well ditch the CPU.
> 
> Usually, it takes about 5 minutes to see if the CPU is good or not.
> 
> With some CPUs, you do have the issue that some multiplier is better than the other for stability. For instance, my current CPU can boot at 51x MAX (~ 5145MHz). When trying to run near this max speed, I have to use 49x instead of 50x multiplier because it's a lot more stable.
> 
> But, that's something you don't need to test. With BCLK adjustments, you'll never get 5200MHz going or so. Multiplier binning is the best way.*_
> 
> Mind you though, I dont sell these - I purely bin them as a hobby and nothing else.
> 
> People like Kingpin more or less lives of it though, or at least its a very profitable side-income. He just had a whole bunch of different binned 3770Ks for sale - Best one went for 999 USD and the lowest was around the 400 USD mark.


So the goal is to basically to find the best chips of the group and sell them as high performing chips?

If you do it as a hobby what will you do with all of them if they are extremely good?

So heres my concern with binning, there is a local microenter near me and they are selling their 3770K's for almost $100 bucks less than newegg right now... Could it be that Intel is binning their chips and selling the lessor performing chips cheaper to smaller retailers?


----------



## Hokies83

From using both for long periods of time i can confirm both Stain your IHS/HS

I will not be using it on my Apongee Drive II HS.. to Expensive lol.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Yeah 27.7 is one I got, I was using older one week ago


The latest is 27.9 Build 1


----------



## chann3l

Delidding tonight wish me luck







I've read all the guides and have all the tools and a steady hand. Any tips before I dig in after work?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Dont rush it just let it go with time and you will be ok







that's my tip


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> isnt that doing twice the job, if you can just clean with 90% or higher alcohol the first time?
> clean the cleaner ..lol


The citrus cleaners really get in the pores and microscopic valleys and "cut the grease". Then the alcohol step is more of a _rinse_ factor.

Best stuff I have ever used. Breaks down even the crusted on paste and turns it to liquid (yes I know that sounded like a dish soap commercial)







...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Delidding tonight wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've read all the guides and have all the tools and a steady hand. Any tips before I dig in after work?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Dont rush it just let it go with time and you will be ok
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that's my tip


this









just have a good feeling to do it, no doubts, feel confident









edit,
o, and good luck


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> The citrus cleaners really get in the pores and microscopic valleys and "cut the grease". Then the alcohol step is more of a _rinse_ factor.
> 
> Best stuff I have ever used. Breaks down even the crusted on paste and turns it to liquid (yes I know that sounded like a dish soap commercial)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


i like the name ..lol
wonder how it would work on liquid pro/ultra, if it hardens a bit over time, i thought it would stay liquid so, did you try?
i know, cant compare it to normal tim's but..


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> So the goal is to basically to find the best chips of the group and sell them as high performing chips?
> 
> If you do it as a hobby what will you do with all of them if they are extremely good?
> 
> So here my concern with binning, there is a local microenter near me and they are selling their 3770K's for almost $100 bucks less than newegg right now... Could it be that Intel is binning their chips and selling the lessor performing chips cheaper to smaller retailers?


They go into government PCs and are forever nested beneath the crappy heat sinks that Intel provides them with - Only to yawn at the mundane work they are allowed to do under stock clocks and voltage - Yup, it is a sad thing, but at least I let them stretch their little legs before they enter that bleak future









I can guarantee you that no matter where you buy a sealed chip, the odds are the same - Some places sell them cheaper than other ? It is called competition, and a cheaper chip does not diminish your chances for a golden chip


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> They go into government PCs and are forever nested beneath the crappy heat sinks that Intel provides them with - Only to yawn at the mundane work they are allowed to do under stock clocks and voltage - Yup, it is a sad thing, but at least I let them stretch their little legs before they enter that bleak future
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can guarantee you that no matter where you buy a sealed chip, the odds are the same - Some places sell them cheaper than other ? It is called competition, and a cheaper chip does not diminish your chances for a golden chip


Gotcha









So where do people sell these golden chips? ocbay.net is broken for me, any idea why?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Delidding tonight wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've read all the guides and have all the tools and a steady hand. Any tips before I dig in after work?


i would say keep the pressure of the tip of the razer towards the ihs if that makes sense so if u do accidently slip or something u dont slip and hit the pcb u scratch the ihs.
i really kept that in mind on my second delid since my first was not so succesfull. I DID NOT WANT TO HIT PCB.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Gotcha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So where do people sell these golden chips? ocbay.net is broken for me, any idea why?


Well, not here on OCN with the "new" trading rules, that is for sure.

My best advice would be over at http://kingpincooling.com/ where "l33t" overclockers and "Xtreme"-cooling like to gather like flies around .....

Kingpins binned 3770Ks ( http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2090 ) - is just an example, these went faster than freshly baked bread on a sunday morning.

1 x 6725mhz 950.00USD
2 x 6700mhz 875.00USD
3 x 6625mhz 550.00USD
2 x 6600mhz 525.00USD

Total: 5400 USD for 8 chips - Not a bad deal, lol.

Genious wanna-be: _But what about the rest ? He must take a loss somewhere!_

Answer-man-to-the-rescue: _They are all returned in mint condition and swapped for new ones, if the shop rejects them they are simply sold for a MILD discount (50-100 USD)_

*And the camera slowly turns towards the man laughing on his way to the bank, counting his money.*


----------



## bsofdth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Delidding tonight wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've read all the guides and have all the tools and a steady hand. Any tips before I dig in after work?


Just take it slow. I didn't practice on anything, which was probably dumb. It took me an hour To delid mine because i Didn't want to apply any pressure. I also made sure to keep the blade flat or angled away from the chip. Turned out fine.


----------



## chann3l

Thanks everyone for the advice I'll make sure to keep the blade flat and watch my pressure. I'll post my results here later


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Well, not here on OCN with the "new" trading rules, that is for sure.
> 
> My best advice would be over at http://kingpincooling.com/ where "l33t" overclockers and "Xtreme"-cooling like to gather like flies around .....
> 
> Kingpins binned 3770Ks ( http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2090 ) - is just an example, these went faster than freshly baked bread on a sunday morning.
> 
> 1 x 6725mhz 950.00USD
> 2 x 6700mhz 875.00USD
> 3 x 6625mhz 550.00USD
> 2 x 6600mhz 525.00USD
> 
> Total: 5400 USD for 8 chips - Not a bad deal, lol.
> 
> Genious wanna-be: _But what about the rest ? He must take a loss somewhere!_
> 
> Answer-man-to-the-rescue: _They are all returned in mint condition and swapped for new ones, if the shop rejects them they are simply sold for a MILD discount (50-100 USD)_
> 
> *And the camera slowly turns towards the man laughing on his way to the bank, counting his money.*


Man, kingpin's products are so awesome... I had just thought about a ram pot the other day and hes already done it lmao. I think you guys are going to make me get addicted to this stuff....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*


where should we implement these?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Finally got a response from Coollabs...
> I knew the figures that people kept quoting were not correct and now we have confirmation (from the CEO no less)


Good! I'll switch the values right now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Coolwaters*
> 
> so judging by those values theres a distinct limitation on the actual silicon die. used a lot of different kinds of paste (TX-4,MX-4,..ect)
> theres barely any temp drop. but i still like the liquid ultra.


you haven't had any temp drops yet?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Following this close - When you are done cleaning the PRO off, mind describing how you did it ?
> 
> I dont see any problem with the IHS (Just use the pad included) - But the die is my big question. Your "Small blobs on the die" is just what I expected would happen, and have no clue on how to remove (Other than maybe get an syringe and suck them up?).


For this literally all you have to remember about this TIM is that it's liquid at room temperature so if your having issues just breath on it a few times and it will heat it up making it liquid yet again. then use a warm towel or something and it comes right off. the areas where it can't come off is from the microscopic pores being filled (already said just re informing is all) which makes next applications even better than before.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Delidding tonight wish me luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've read all the guides and have all the tools and a steady hand. Any tips before I dig in after work?


Seriously.... take you time If your afraid to do it thats good. One must be afraid to respect the issue and take ones time, if the is over confident then the shall rush and fail.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Dont rush it just let it go with time and you will be ok
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that's my tip


^ yup.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Thanks everyone for the advice I'll make sure to keep the blade flat and watch my pressure. I'll post my results here later


Good luck and let us know!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...btw, re a new logo slogan for this group (I think I saw some posts on that), you might want to show a pic of the guillotine (French Revolution) with the slogan: "Off with their heads"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...well, just a thought


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> where should we implement these?


idk, i was only (fun) responding to Joa3d43's post ..lol, not sure if we should change page 1 for it ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> idk, i was only (fun) responding to Joa3d43's post ..lol, not sure if we should change page 1 for it ..lol


What I would really like to do is make all of us personal gif. avatars. showing our OC and our temps and saying why aren't you delidding today?

but I'll have to look into that later lol. Or we could give the Captains and the Vice's special avatars and then the Crewmen special avatars as well.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What I would really like to do is make all of us personal gif. avatars. showing our OC and our temps and saying why aren't you delidding today?
> 
> but I'll have to look into that later lol. Or we could give the Captains and the Vice's special avatars and then the Crewmen special avatars as well.


avatar is to little to fit everything in there,
can we have a real banner in our sig? that would be cool..



haha


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> avatar is to little to fit everything in there,
> can we have a real banner in our sig? that would be cool..
> 
> 
> 
> haha


I approve!!! but lets make it after it say I laughed at my temps, put something that says we are making fun of there temps like and now I'm laughing at yours!!!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I approve!!! but lets make it after it say I laughed at my temps, put something that says we are making fun of there temps like and now I'm laughing at yours!!!!


yea, made that one in 2 minute orso..lol
used google to find a bannermaker online,
http://www.bannerfans.com/banner_maker.php
easy to use, and fast to make a banner


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> avatar is to little to fit everything in there,
> can we have a real banner in our sig? that would be cool..
> 
> 
> 
> haha


Nice


----------



## DiamondCut

I used to make forum signatures/avatars for forum members on one of my former gaming forums. I could throw something cool together when I get off work tonight? I just need some parameters so I can make something fancy. I also have 4d cinema.

Some of my previous work:


http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z296/bmxit247/Betascape.gif
http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z296/bmxit247/Jag2z.jpg


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> I used to make forum signatures/avatars for forum members on one of my former gaming forums. I could throw something cool together when I get off work tonight? I just need some parameters so I can make something fancy. I also have 4d cinema.
> 
> Some of my previous work:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z296/bmxit247/Betascape.gif
> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z296/bmxit247/Jag2z.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


yea, i used to have photoshop ..man, thats such a nice program to make things like that with,
only your imagination is the limit in what you can do with it..well, and some knowledge of how to work with it ..lol
those look very nice DiamondCut







would be great if you can make something for us all


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i used to have photoshop ..man, thats such a nice program to make things like that with,
> only your imagination is the limit in what you can do with it..well, and some knowledge of how to work with it ..lol
> those look very nice DiamondCut
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> would be great if you can make something for us all


Throw a Captain's pirate hat on a delidded 3d model for me and put a razor blade around it... pfft I'm a noob at 3d imaging and rendering software. don't desire to really get into it either. I do like tha banner idea though. so something along those lines would be pretty neat. but an avatar is perfect really.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Throw a Captain's pirate hat on a delidded 3d model for me and put a razor blade around it... pfft I'm a noob at 3d imaging and rendering software. don't desire to really get into it either. I do like tha banner idea though. so something along those lines would be pretty neat. but an avatar is perfect really.


but how can we use it?
thats why i asked, does OCN allow banners in the sig, is it possible even?
ill leave it to DiamondCut to make something nice, i bet hes better in it then me,
and i dont have photoshop anymore so..

yaaawn, im out ..G'night everyone


----------



## Vi0lence

got mine stable 4.6 @ 1.300 vcore. trying to see how low i can get it lol


----------



## Gomi

Draining my loop for the 7th time in 2 weeks ... *Sigh*.

4th GPU going back to eVGA for RMA - Think I have to send it without the backplate as I heard nightmare stories about people getting a new card back, nowhere near the same condition as the one they mailed (Their email regarding the RMA clearly states that the replacement will be a refurbished one.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> but how can we use it?
> thats why i asked, does OCN allow banners in the sig, is it possible even?
> ill leave it to DiamondCut to make something nice, i bet hes better in it then me,
> and i dont have photoshop anymore so..
> 
> yaaawn, im out ..G'night everyone


night man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> got mine stable 4.6 @ 1.300 vcore. trying to see how low i can get it lol


keep going man I got 4.7 at 1.3 really easily.


----------



## DiamondCut

Well like I said aslong as I am given some key parameters for a banner or avatar I can whip something quick up and build from there.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Well like I said aslong as I am given some key parameters for a banner or avatar I can whip something quick up and build from there.


something involving delidding either a blade or something... then put vice captain, captain, crewmen names stuff like that. uuuum kinda surprise me a little really.


----------



## Hokies83

Something with Valguar looking at my case and my rads and being Angry will do


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Something with Valguar looking at my case and my rads and being Angry will do


----------



## [CyGnus]

LOLOL another vote for a nice banner


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> LOLOL another vote for a nice banner


Then it can be something we have and no one else as well. What you think? obviously yes lol.


----------



## alancsalt

Flipping your lid?









(Don't think you can put images in sig, just site icons....?)


----------



## Vi0lence

4.6 @ 1.25v in bios, 1.236v on cpu-z. lol, i never though it would be that low. gona make myself a chart of different speeds in voltages. just for reference.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Flipping your lid?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Don't think you can put images in sig, just site icons....?)


he is correct, images just don't show up. I think its to save storage on the servers maybe or anti- advertisements...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> he is correct, images just don't show up. I think its to save storage on the servers maybe or anti- advertisements...


darn ..... then avatars it is lol


----------



## SmokeyMcBong

Evening Guys,

Sorry to hassle you with this question [which has no doubt been asked time and time again







]
would it be possible for a confirmation of whether these two products will indeed do the job at hand ..

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/110776447799

and

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271142546269

I just really wanted to make sure that the liquid Pro product on eBay is indeed the correct type needed for the de-lidding process, and knew you knowledgeable folk would know









any help will be greatly appreciated
thanks guys


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokeyMcBong*
> 
> Evening Guys,
> 
> Sorry to hassle you with this question [which has no doubt been asked time and time again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]
> would it be possible for a confirmation of whether these two products will indeed do the job at hand ..
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/110776447799
> 
> and
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271142546269
> 
> I just really wanted to make sure that the liquid Pro product on eBay is indeed the correct type needed for the de-lidding process, and knew you knowledgeable folk would know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any help will be greatly appreciated
> thanks guys


The blades heck yes. I used that blade and I love the movement of it. also witht he Pro/Ultra either one you buy is amazing stuff. but I wouldn't buy from ebay.... thats just me but if you feel comfortable from thee then by all means go for it man.


----------



## SmokeyMcBong

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The blades heck yes. I used that blade and I love the movement of it. also witht he Pro/Ultra either one you buy is amazing stuff. but I wouldn't buy from ebay.... thats just me but if you feel comfortable from thee then by all means go for it man.


Wow that was quick, went to get a coffee, come back and got the exact answer i needed







Thanks mate!!









I know what you mean with ebay mate, i'm always a bit apprehensive parting with money to someone ive never met before lol
i think i will have a good look around and if worst comes to worst i'll take the blind shot from flea-bay








lucky its pretty cold here at the moment so ambient's are not much of a problem, just cant imagine the kind of temp range this thing will get to during a nice hot summers day









Thanks again for the [very] quick response mate,

+rep for you kind sir !


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> So is the values telling us Ultra has a higher heat transfer rate than Pro or is it the lower the better for those values?
> Can you briefly explain the process of binning and what the real goal and gain is for buying mass of components?
> 
> Thanks.


For the cpus as said the goal is to find the 2700k with the best working multi (or best temps/voltage, depending what he is looking for).
I'm curious about the memory, those kits look like nanya under the heatsinks, no one bins that!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> avatar is to little to fit everything in there,
> can we have a real banner in our sig? that would be cool..
> 
> 
> 
> haha


Lol! Thinking about wiping the ultra off my delidded chip & try cold again, could probably make a good screen to go with it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokeyMcBong*
> 
> Evening Guys,
> 
> Sorry to hassle you with this question [which has no doubt been asked time and time again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]
> would it be possible for a confirmation of whether these two products will indeed do the job at hand ..
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/110776447799
> 
> and
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271142546269
> 
> I just really wanted to make sure that the liquid Pro product on eBay is indeed the correct type needed for the de-lidding process, and knew you knowledgeable folk would know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any help will be greatly appreciated
> thanks guys


Gotta like the username, I spent more on glass than on my car. Priorities....


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> got mine stable 4.6 @ 1.300 vcore. trying to see how low i can get it lol


Don't know what board you have but I have the mpower and im completely stable at 4.6 at 1.27 cpuz reads 1.264 tho


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Something came in today:

__
http://instagr.am/p/U4ixzeywYc%2F/

So...I shall play around with it


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For the cpus as said the goal is to find the 2700k with the best working multi (or best temps/voltage, depending what he is looking for).
> I'm curious about the memory, those kits look like nanya under the heatsinks, no one bins that!
> Lol! Thinking about wiping the ultra off my delidded chip & try cold again, could probably make a good screen to go with it.
> Gotta like the username, I spent more on glass than on my car. Priorities....


Glass!?

I sold my gpu finally!!







Ah, some financial relief...
Good multi with 2c/2t and no flashing cursor yeah. As for Nanya lol, WTH? Our good friend Chris-br has a nanya kit and it won't go over 2133mhz no matter what. No one in their right mind would bin those yeah


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokeyMcBong*
> 
> Wow that was quick, went to get a coffee, come back and got the exact answer i needed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks mate!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know what you mean with ebay mate, i'm always a bit apprehensive parting with money to someone ive never met before lol
> i think i will have a good look around and if worst comes to worst i'll take the blind shot from flea-bay
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lucky its pretty cold here at the moment so ambient's are not much of a problem, just cant imagine the kind of temp range this thing will get to during a nice hot summers day
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks again for the [very] quick response mate,
> 
> +rep for you kind sir !


probs if your in the US try FrozenCPU.com if not int he US I believe Sidewinder pc or something like that has it... Ivan always says it and I can never remember the name of it.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Don't know what board you have but I have the mpower and im completely stable at 4.6 at 1.27 cpuz reads 1.264 tho


well with these cpu's i dont think that board's are a big of an issue my cheap pro 3 does the same 4.6GHz with 1.236v


----------



## SmokeyMcBong

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> probs if your in the US try FrozenCPU.com if not int he US I believe Sidewinder pc or something like that has it... Ivan always says it and I can never remember the name of it.


lol








Unfortunatly i'm over the pond in the uk, found so many products listed from the usa but alot less from uk based companies.

i'll have a look for sidewinder pc [ive definitely heard of it, or something very similar before







]

Thanks again mate, i owe ya one!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Don't know what board you have but I have the mpower and im completely stable at 4.6 at 1.27 cpuz reads 1.264 tho


Mpower is a solid board. Still working to get max memory to pass, but getting there. This chip handles bclk pretty well too.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Glass!?
> 
> I sold my gpu finally!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ah, some financial relief...
> Good multi with 2c/2t and no flashing cursor yeah. As for Nanya lol, WTH? Our good friend Chris-br has a nanya kit and it won't go over 2133mhz no matter what. No one in their right mind would bin those yeah


Glass, like this attempt at a bong cooler.
edit: snipping for work safe

ram slots were in the way though.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Don't know what board you have but I have the mpower and im completely stable at 4.6 at 1.27 cpuz reads 1.264 tho


i went lower. right now im 100% stable 4.6gyhz @ 1.225v in bios, cpu-z says 1.236. and i have a Gigabyte up-7


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Mpower is a solid board. Still working to get max memory to pass, but getting there. This chip handles bclk pretty well too.
> 
> ram slots were in the way though.
> 
> 
> 
> Ah! gotcha...I'm a good boi lol no bong cooling for me. xD
> I thought you used regular water blocks and loops and replace the rad with a shower head thing and a big pipe thing for those.
Click to expand...

Wrong bong


----------



## chann3l

Delidding success just running ibt on max stress for my comparison than I'll post all the info.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Delidding success just running ibt on max stress for my comparison than I'll post all the info.


Hurry up! I want more members!!!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hurry up! I want more members!!!


would Pentium 4 count?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, what do you think of this program as a cpu+ram stability test? (it's a heavily threaded and ram intensive pi digit calculator)

http://www.numberworld.org/y-cruncher/


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> would Pentium 4 count?


For practice sure, but it is the Delidded Ivy Bridge Club.

Wonder when P4s will go up in price, they may get rare soon....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, what do you think of this program as a cpu+ram stability test? (it's a heavily threaded and ram intensive pi digit calculator)
> 
> http://www.numberworld.org/y-cruncher/


I'll try it out


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hehe well mine was £1.90


----------



## chann3l

Ok so here we go. Below are pictures of the process. I have to note that I used AS5 for nowe untill I can get some liquid pro and only saw an 8 degree drop in temps; However as5 has a 200hr burn in persiod and if temps drop in the next week I will update. I am running at 4.6 ghz at 1.27 volts although cpuz says 1.264. My ambient temps and water temps have not changed since delidding so ambient on idle is 23 and water temps idle are 24. Under load ambient is 25 and water temps max at 28. This is with IBT at max stress setting.





All Clean!!!

Safe at home

Pre delidding max temps under max stress in IBT after 10 runs

After delidding under same test scenario


----------



## lilchronic

congrats! and u got balls for using that razer lol. it was to thick for me pcb was bending or felt like it was bending too much


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> congrats! and u got balls for using that razer lol. it was to thick for me pcb was bending or felt like it was bending too much


Lol thanks man. It was real bendy in the corners. I was pretty terrified but I had it part way so I had to finish


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, what do you think of this program as a cpu+ram stability test? (it's a heavily threaded and ram intensive pi digit calculator)
> 
> http://www.numberworld.org/y-cruncher/


Tried it, here's my benchmark:

Code:



Code:


Validation Version:    1.1

Program:               y-cruncher - Gamma to the eXtReMe!!!     ( www.numberworld.org )
                       Copyright 2008-2011 Alexander J. Yee    ( [email protected] )

User:                  None Specified - You can edit this in "Username.txt".

Processor(s):          Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-3570K CPU @ 3.40GHz
Logical Cores:         4
Physical Memory:       17,131,114,496 bytes  ( 16.0 GB )
CPU Frequency:         3,400,096,735 Hz

Program Version:       0.5.5 Build 9180 (fix 2) (x64 AVX - Windows ~ Hina)
Constant:              Pi
Algorithm:             Chudnovsky Formula
Decimal Digits:        2,500,000,000
Hexadecimal Digits:    Disabled
Threading Mode:        4 threads
Computation Mode:      Ram Only
Swap Disks:            0
Working Memory:        11.2 GB

Start Date:            Thu Jan 24 22:15:17 2013
End Date:              Thu Jan 24 22:31:50 2013

Computation Time:      952.487 seconds
Total Time:            992.930 seconds

CPU Utilization:           388.82 %
Multi-core Efficiency:     97.20 %

Last Digits:
0917027898 3554136437 7123165188 3528593128 0032489094  :  2,499,999,950
9228502005 4677489552 2459688725 5242233502 7255998083  :  2,500,000,000

Timer Sanity Check:        Passed
Frequency Sanity Check:    Passed
ECC Recovered Errors:      0
Checkpoint From:           None

----

Checksum:   6dbe5a8cf490d21d0c77904f54a92e74a47bf4cc875e57441ab4bbf6940da85f


----------



## chann3l

Also which tag should go in my signature. The crewman one on the first page or the delidded ivy club one?


----------



## chann3l

Also heres my validation for 4.6 if needed to add me http://valid.canardpc.com/2666440


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Ok so here we go. Below are pictures of the process. I have to note that I used AS5 for nowe untill I can get some liquid pro and only saw an 8 degree drop in temps; However as5 has a 200hr burn in persiod and if temps drop in the next week I will update. I am running at 4.6 ghz at 1.27 volts although cpuz says 1.264. My ambient temps and water temps have not changed since delidding so ambient on idle is 23 and water temps idle are 24. Under load ambient is 25 and water temps max at 28. This is with IBT at max stress setting.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All Clean!!!
> 
> Safe at home
> 
> Pre delidding max temps under max stress in IBT after 10 runs
> 
> After delidding under same test scenario


chann3l, you did it, gratz!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Also which tag should go in my signature. The crewman one on the first page or the delidded ivy club one?


you can choose either one ..np


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> chann3l, you did it, gratz!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you can choose either one ..np


I like crewman better lol


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I like crewman better lol


Oh and thank you. And thanks for your advice and everyone else who helped me out


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I like crewman better lol


yea, that looks good ..lol
i first had the one with the devils, only recently added the crewman one








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Oh and thank you. And thanks for your advice and everyone else who helped me out


Yvmw!









or in the words of Hannibal from the A-team,

i love it when a plan comes together!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, that looks good ..lol
> i first had the one with the devils, only recently added the crewman one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yvmw!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or in the words of Hannibal from the A-team,
> 
> i love it when a plan comes together!


Lol that's bad ass


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Tried it, here's my benchmark:
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> Validation Version:    1.1
> 
> Program:               y-cruncher - Gamma to the eXtReMe!!!     ( www.numberworld.org )
> Copyright 2008-2011 Alexander J. Yee    ( [email protected] )
> 
> User:                  None Specified - You can edit this in "Username.txt".
> 
> Processor(s):          Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-3570K CPU @ 3.40GHz
> Logical Cores:         4
> Physical Memory:       17,131,114,496 bytes  ( 16.0 GB )
> CPU Frequency:         3,400,096,735 Hz
> 
> Program Version:       0.5.5 Build 9180 (fix 2) (x64 AVX - Windows ~ Hina)
> Constant:              Pi
> Algorithm:             Chudnovsky Formula
> Decimal Digits:        2,500,000,000
> Hexadecimal Digits:    Disabled
> Threading Mode:        4 threads
> Computation Mode:      Ram Only
> Swap Disks:            0
> Working Memory:        11.2 GB
> 
> Start Date:            Thu Jan 24 22:15:17 2013
> End Date:              Thu Jan 24 22:31:50 2013
> 
> Computation Time:      952.487 seconds
> Total Time:            992.930 seconds
> 
> CPU Utilization:           388.82 %
> Multi-core Efficiency:     97.20 %
> 
> Last Digits:
> 0917027898 3554136437 7123165188 3528593128 0032489094  :  2,499,999,950
> 9228502005 4677489552 2459688725 5242233502 7255998083  :  2,500,000,000
> 
> Timer Sanity Check:        Passed
> Frequency Sanity Check:    Passed
> ECC Recovered Errors:      0
> Checkpoint From:           None
> 
> ----
> 
> Checksum:   6dbe5a8cf490d21d0c77904f54a92e74a47bf4cc875e57441ab4bbf6940da85f


Awesome! Keep em comin'









Chann3l, congrats on your delid!


----------



## chann3l

I just noticed for someone who's 24, I write like a 5 year old lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I just noticed for someone who's 24, I write like a 5 year old lol


nah..i think you write like a ... 24 year old lol


----------



## lilchronic

how old do i write lol


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> how old do i write lol


all you young bloods out there stay in school and dont do drugs or you end up like this


----------



## chann3l

Lol I meant on the paper in my pics not my typing


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Lol I meant on the paper in my pics not my typing


lmao... ooohhh your sloppy ass hand writing you talking about







. see what i mean bout them drugs


----------



## FtW 420

Handy to have a keyboard, I can't do handwritten notes. I mean I can but it's like a secret code even I can't read.
But I was a sloppy writer before I even tried getting high.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Handy to have a keyboard, I can't do handwritten notes. I mean I can but it's like a secret code even I can't read.
> But I was a sloppy writer before I even tried getting high.


lol, same here, on the last part, and im writing left handed also..

woohoo, i got 2 flames i just noticed ..yesss


----------



## FtW 420

Nice, crossed the 100 rep line!
I can't remember how much I had, & can't even find the comments in my profile with huddler anymore.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice, crossed the 100 rep line!
> I can't remember how much I had, & can't even find the comments in my profile with huddler anymore.


Nice someone else from Vancouver....sorry had to point it out


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Lol I meant on the paper in my pics not my typing


I need you to fill out the necessary information for you to be added to the OP's spreadsheet. please do this. I prefer to keep tabs on this and keep it updated. if I missed it... then that's my bad lol!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice, crossed the 100 rep line!
> I can't remember how much I had, & can't even find the comments in my profile with huddler anymore.


must be alot, i always like your info etc,
already wondered a few times why you dont have rep's ? or why they dont show..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> must be alot, i always like your info etc,
> already wondered a few times why you dont have rep's ? or why they dont show..


When I became an editor the rep disappears. I didn't have all that much, somewhere in the 200 - 300s or something I think.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need you to fill out the necessary information for you to be added to the OP's spreadsheet. please do this. I prefer to keep tabs on this and keep it updated. if I missed it... then that's my bad lol!


Mosdt of it should be in my post with my pics but here goes
Hs: AS5
Die: AS5
Clock 4.6 ghz
Extra oc: Could go way higher before so haven't done additional testing
TEmp drop : 8 degrees (if it drops more after break in period I'll update)
IBT: used max stress setting not standard
CPU: 3770k
Cooling: Custom Water

Probably more info then you need but thats all of it and my pic with my name is in my original post...well my post a few pages back with all the pictures

heres cpuz 4.6 valifdation too : http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2666440


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> When I became an editor the rep disappears. I didn't have all that much, somewhere in the 200 - 300s or something I think.


not much he says ..LOL
i like getting rep's, for me its a sign im giving good answers, but have to thank everyone here for that,
you guys taught me (well), im just giving back to the community








and i like those flames under my name







, now i just want to stay ahead on Valgaur ..hehe







(hes jealous) hahaha..


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokeyMcBong*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunatly i'm over the pond in the uk, found so many products listed from the usa but alot less from uk based companies.
> 
> i'll have a look for sidewinder pc [ive definitely heard of it, or something very similar before
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]
> 
> Thanks again mate, i owe ya one!


You should order from the Coollabs website


----------



## VonDutch

im tempted to ask coollabs to send me a box with pro and ultra for use in this thread,
so i can send it to you guys right away if needed, but im not sure about the shipping costs
from Holland to anywhere on the globe..do they ask for shipping cost when ordered from their site directly too?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not much he says ..LOL
> i like getting rep's, for me its a sign im giving good answers, but have to thank everyone here for that,
> you guys taught me (well), im just giving back to the community
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i like those flames under my name
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , now i just want to stay ahead on Valgaur ..hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (hes jealous) hahaha..


watchin you....... -.- just kidding lol was cranky this morning is all. don't really care either I have to keep up with my school so I can't always be ready like you are


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im tempted to ask coollabs to send me a box with pro and ultra for use in this thread,
> so i can send it to you guys right away if needed, but im not sure about the shipping costs
> from Holland to anywhere on the globe..do they ask for shipping cost when ordered from their site directly too?


Ooo I'll take one please im in Canada


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> watchin you....... -.- just kidding lol was cranky this morning is all. don't really care either I have to keep up with my school so I can't always be ready like you are


yea, i have alot of time as you know, so can be here alot more then others,
and i like helping people..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Ooo I'll take one please im in Canada


yea, once i asked them where can i buy liqud pro/ultra when i live in Canada,
they said they where working on it, but gave no date of course









where i live, i can order at 5 online stores, but noone has it in stock, but it only takes 3-4 days to arrive at my home on average..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i have alot of time as you know, so can be here alot more then others,
> and i like helping people..
> yea, once i asked them where can i buy liqud pro/ultra when i live in Canada,
> they said they where working on it, but gave no date of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where i live, i can order at 5 online stores, but noone has it in stock, but it only takes 3-4 days to arrive at my home on average..


The problem with getting it in Canada is customs, the packaging it comes in can be opened, so they do & give that syringe a good squeeze, I don't think it matters where it comes from.
It can be random inspection, sucks when it happens though since they don't have a lot in the tube to start with.

Maybe they can seal the package it comes in, I had gelid extreme coming at the same time & I can see where customs pulled at the corner, but didn't open them up since it was sealed.


----------



## Hokies83

Wire Management for 34 Fans is a real PITA..


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i have alot of time as you know, so can be here alot more then others,
> and i like helping people..
> yea, once i asked them where can i buy liqud pro/ultra when i live in Canada,
> they said they where working on it, but gave no date of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where i live, i can order at 5 online stores, but noone has it in stock, but it only takes 3-4 days to arrive at my home on average..


Oh wow that's quick. I'll have to see where I can order from here


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Mosdt of it should be in my post with my pics but here goes
> Hs: AS5
> Die: AS5
> Clock 4.6 ghz
> Extra oc: Could go way higher before so haven't done additional testing
> TEmp drop : 8 degrees (if it drops more after break in period I'll update)
> IBT: used max stress setting not standard
> CPU: 3770k
> Cooling: Custom Water
> 
> Probably more info then you need but thats all of it and my pic with my name is in my original post...well my post a few pages back with all the pictures
> 
> heres cpuz 4.6 valifdation too : http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2666440


Your in!


----------



## DiamondCut

Sorry guys, I got really distracted when I got home and didn't spend much time on it and I havent worked with photoshop in a while.

This is what I came up with, just trying to spark some imagination with you guys maybe lol. Not much to work with here.


http://i.imgur.com/MF3ok8I.png

let me know what you guys think and if you guys really want I can throw something together in cinena 4d but that will be like opening a can of pickles at first....


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your in!


Sweet thanks man


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Sorry guys, I got really distracted when I got home and didn't spend much time on it and I havent worked with photoshop in a while.
> 
> This is what I came up with, just trying to spark some imagination with you guys maybe lol. Not much to work with here.
> 
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/MF3ok8I.png
> 
> let me know what you guys think and if you guys really want I can throw something together in cinena 4d but that will be like opening a can of pickles at first....


Wow that thing is awesome good work


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The problem with getting it in Canada is customs, the packaging it comes in can be opened, so they do & give that syringe a good squeeze, I don't think it matters where it comes from.
> It can be random inspection, sucks when it happens though since they don't have a lot in the tube to start with.
> 
> Maybe they can seal the package it comes in, I had gelid extreme coming at the same time & I can see where customs pulled at the corner, but didn't open them up since it was sealed.


been a while since i saw the package, but isnt it sealed?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Sorry guys, I got really distracted when I got home and didn't spend much time on it and I havent worked with photoshop in a while.
> 
> This is what I came up with, just trying to spark some imagination with you guys maybe lol. Not much to work with here.
> 
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/MF3ok8I.png
> 
> let me know what you guys think and if you guys really want I can throw something together in cinena 4d but that will be like opening a can of pickles at first....


me likes








the razor blade could be a bit more lighter maybe? or more metal like..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Wire Management for 34 Fans is a real PITA..


dang 34, thats must be a big bundle wires... lol

i had to laugh when i clicked a link in a post,
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271142546269
to buy Coollaboratory Liquid PRO

i scrolled down a bit, and saw,
" People who bought this item also bought"
Intel Socket LGA 1155/1156 CPU Cooler Heat Sink with Fan


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> been a while since i saw the package, but isnt it sealed?


I don't know if customs broke any seal, but it couldn't have been well sealed if so. The package just kinda snapped together.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> me likes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the razor blade could be a bit more lighter maybe? or more metal like..


Yea I was having a difficult time finding a good render that would be still realistic but nothing was good so I toned out the opacity a bit and came up with this.

Second go at it with some slight effects changed.... gunna catch some zzzzz's so ill work on something new this weekend.


http://i.imgur.com/c8lEF40.png


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I don't know if customs broke any seal, but it couldn't have been well sealed if so. The package just kinda snapped together.


im wondering if they scan it, and detect metal? maybe thats why they take a sample..
well, i can always mail them, and ask if they can seal it, because buyers in Canada lose
some of the content, when it has to go through customs..maybe its just them tho,
why dont they check it here..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea I was having a difficult time finding a good render that would be still realistic but nothing was good so I toned out the opacity a bit and came up with this.
> 
> Second go at it with some slight effects changed.... gunna catch some zzzzz's so ill work on something new this weekend.
> 
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/c8lEF40.png


cool, looking forward to it..sleep well ..zzzZZZzzz

im tired to, woke up at 4.30am, awake since ..9am now
and my kids are coming here today to spent the weekend ..lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea I was having a difficult time finding a good render that would be still realistic but nothing was good so I toned out the opacity a bit and came up with this.
> 
> Second go at it with some slight effects changed.... gunna catch some zzzzz's so ill work on something new this weekend.
> 
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/c8lEF40.png


I like it!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

i got more fans in the mail XD


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> i got more fans in the mail XD


1200 watt just for the fans lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1200 watt just for the fans lol.


2 psu's then?


----------



## Hokies83

Lol my system only uses like 700 watts under load heh..


----------



## Faelore

I settled on a modest overclock of 4.4ghz at 1.23v its prime stable and the hottest core after 24 hours was 62c biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif so I am pretty happy with it.
Anyway you guys think its worth delidding? I mean even clocked at 4.4ghz 24/7 no lowering down its 29-32c at gaming it peaked 50c at 4.4ghz


----------



## teamrushpntball

Uhm 34 fans is pulling at most, and i mean at most, 102 watts.


----------



## Faelore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Uhm 34 fans is pulling at most, and i mean at most, 102 watts.


I have three fans in my build that pull 30w a piece lol


----------



## Faelore

they also move 289 cfm per fan


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> I settled on a modest overclock of 4.4ghz at 1.23v its prime stable and the hottest core after 24 hours was 62c biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif so I am pretty happy with it.
> Anyway you guys think its worth delidding? I mean even clocked at 4.4ghz 24/7 no lowering down its 29-32c at gaming it peaked 50c at 4.4ghz


biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif ?? ..lol whats that?

depends on what you want, if your happy with a modest oc,
and your temps look good to me like it is now, nah, i wouldnt delid,

if you want to get the most out of your chip tho, like a 4.8+ghz oc, then you prolly have to delid,
i already ran into high temps at 4.4ghz, and 4.5ghz was no go for me, hit 105C in seconds running prime,
i wasnt happy with that, i wanted to oc higher, so i delidded, now i can run 4.8ghz no problem, with very nice temps








even 5.0ghz isnt a problem , i can run IBT and not hit 85C on the hottest core..lol


----------



## Faelore

you think i could clear 5.4 ghz if i delided? from what i can tell i got quite the golden chip


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> you think i could clear 5.4 ghz if i delided? from what i can tell i got quite the golden chip


can you run 4.5ghz, but has to be stable, then i can better tell you if its worth it,
been comparing for a while now with vcores needed at 4.5ghz..
5.4ghz ..nah, havent seen one yet that could do that within normal vcore range, on air/water that is








5.2ghz yes, theres some out there that can run that 24/7 np..

if it can run 4.5ghz with vcore lower then 1.25 or better under 1.2V, then you have a very nice chip, or golden ..lol


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea I was having a difficult time finding a good render that would be still realistic but nothing was good so I toned out the opacity a bit and came up with this.
> 
> Second go at it with some slight effects changed.... gunna catch some zzzzz's so ill work on something new this weekend.
> 
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/c8lEF40.png


This ones awesome!

In other news... I just ordered 4th Gigabyte 7950 and with an EK block and 4 EK 7950 backplates... OH YAH BABY QUADFIRE TIME!


----------



## alancsalt

The first post has no banner......

My crap effort at something for first post......



Diamond Cut is better at it..


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> can you run 4.5ghz, but has to be stable, then i can better tell you if its worth it,
> been comparing for a while now with vcores needed at 4.5ghz..
> 5.4ghz ..nah, havent seen one yet that could do that within normal vcore range, on air/water that is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.2ghz yes, theres some out there that can run that 24/7 np..
> 
> if it can run 4.5ghz with vcore lower then 1.25 or better under 1.2V, then you have a very nice chip, or golden ..lol


Dont know if true, my 3570K needs 1.18v for 4.5GHz 1.24v for 4.6GHz 1.29v for 4.7GHz 1.36v for 4.8GHz after that it just isnt stable for 24/7 no matter the voltage


----------



## mandrix

I have a 3770K I think is a good candidate for delidding. Running Prime 95 8K fft's @ 4.5GHz I see top core temp of 87C. That's with a D5, Raystorm block, an EX240 & RX360 radiators with push/pull fans running wide open. Voltage isn't too bad, but not the best, 1.272 Vcore with a spike to 1.296 from time to time during the testing.

When I first got this particular 3770K months ago I did some quick stress testing with the fans running low speed and was freaked to see the core temps almost hit 100C. After reseating the block and some time for the TIM to get settled I'm still in the high 80's, which is unacceptable to me since I'm temperature limited to x45 OC.

So anyway I have some Coollaboratory LIQUID PRO TIM on the way, and I need to pick up some razor blades.

Wanted to thank all you who have gone before, hope to be joining the club in the next few weeks.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Dont know if true, my 3570K needs 1.18v for 4.5GHz 1.24v for 4.6GHz 1.29v for 4.7GHz 1.36v for 4.8GHz after that it just isnt stable for 24/7 no matter the voltage


yea, that is a bit strange, maybe i should rethink what im trying to do,
was trying to find a way to see if a chip is worth delidding vcore wise,
by comparing good/high ocers with the vcores they need at 4.5ghz,
because almost all undelidded ivy's can run 4.5ghz,

mine needs 1.235V vcore to make 4.5ghz run stable, and its a average ocer,
at 4.8ghz i need 1.420V vcore
4.9ghz is a no go for me, needs about 1.510V vcore..

i thought 4.5ghz would be a nice one to use for comparison
besides the tempdrops if you do..
4.8ghz at 1.36V vcore is still very good, you still should be able to run 4.9ghz,
cant imagine you make a 0.160V vcore jump between 4.8 and 4.9ghz, and hit 1.52V vcore that way tho









dont know if this post makes sense, im (very)tired ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mandrix*
> 
> I have a 3770K I think is a good candidate for delidding. Running Prime 95 8K fft's @ 4.5GHz I see top core temp of 87C. That's with a D5, Raystorm block, an EX240 & RX360 radiators with push/pull fans running wide open. Voltage isn't too bad, but not the best, 1.272 Vcore with a spike to 1.296 from time to time during the testing.
> 
> When I first got this particular 3770K months ago I did some quick stress testing with the fans running low speed and was freaked to see the core temps almost hit 100C. After reseating the block and some time for the TIM to get settled I'm still in the high 80's, which is unacceptable to me since I'm temperature limited to x45 OC.
> 
> So anyway I have some Coollaboratory LIQUID PRO TIM on the way, and I need to pick up some razor blades.
> 
> Wanted to thank all you who have gone before, hope to be joining the club in the next few weeks.


yea, join the club..lol








yep, i know that, i hit 105C at 4.5ghz, just a shame if you have that kind of (great) cooling, and still be limited by temps..
you could start with reading page 1, theres alot of info under the spoilers, i took about 1 month to prepare for the delid, by reading,
and watching all vid's i could find


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> The first post has no banner......
> 
> My crap effort at something for first post......
> 
> 
> 
> Diamond Cut is better at it..


nice one alancsalt, keep em coming, the more we can choose from ..


----------



## Hokies83

First box is here


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mandrix*
> 
> I have a 3770K I think is a good candidate for delidding. Running Prime 95 8K fft's @ 4.5GHz I see top core temp of 87C. That's with a D5, Raystorm block, an EX240 & RX360 radiators with push/pull fans running wide open. Voltage isn't too bad, but not the best, 1.272 Vcore with a spike to 1.296 from time to time during the testing.
> 
> When I first got this particular 3770K months ago I did some quick stress testing with the fans running low speed and was freaked to see the core temps almost hit 100C. After reseating the block and some time for the TIM to get settled I'm still in the high 80's, which is unacceptable to me since I'm temperature limited to x45 OC.
> 
> So anyway I have some Coollaboratory LIQUID PRO TIM on the way, and I need to pick up some razor blades.
> 
> Wanted to thank all you who have gone before, hope to be joining the club in the next few weeks.


Quick tip or rather just a piece of knowledge for you. I have the same waterblock and because of how tight it sits it really pushed my ihs onto the PCB so it takes a bit of extra time and patience to get the blade in. Good luck im sure youll do fine


----------



## stickg1

I put some formula 7 on the CPU and GPU of my old C2D and 9800m GS in my laptop, dropped the temps about 20c in both then was able to OC both about 30%. The temps are still much lower than they were stock. Since they're both bare die I think I will put some CLU on there for even better temps. I'll post the validations later but I was pretty happy with the results. I was thinking of upgrading the CPU but they still go for almost $100 on Ebay. If I put an SSD in there it will be one heck of a couch browsing machine!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I put some formula 7 on the CPU and GPU of my old C2D and 9800m GS in my laptop, dropped the temps about 20c in both then was able to OC both about 30%. The temps are still much lower than they were stock. Since they're both bare die I think I will put some CLU on there for even better temps. I'll post the validations later but I was pretty happy with the results. I was thinking of upgrading the CPU but they still go for almost $100 on Ebay. If I put an SSD in there it will be one heck of a couch browsing machine!


see ur fans? lol


----------



## DiamondCut

The resolution for your avatar is not good vulgar lol... I need to find a new blade!


----------



## Valgaur

Today might be the day! Franky 2.0 should be here! Getting very impatient!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Today might be the day! Franky 2.0 should be here! Getting very impatient!


Watch it need 1.5v for 4.8ghz


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Watch it need 1.5v for 4.8ghz


Ill make it cry under my h100 then.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> see ur fans? lol


Nice! I used to have a bunch of those Silenx fans too, they're nice but I never see them mentioned in reviews or comparisons. Some of the best truly quiet yet high CFM fans I've ever used.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I love the idea of sub ambient cooling using a bong, but the humidity would kill my apartment. :/
> 
> Not to mention my GF killing me when she sees a 6ft tall Bong in our hall lol


It doesn't make a difference in humidity.


----------



## shremi

I thought I had a nice chip also ....









4.6 needs 1.260
4.7 needs 1.320

Working on 4.8 so far I am at 1.400 but getting whea while priming .... It is strange how these chips work ...

I need an advice

Which chip should I keep in my main rig and which one in my emulator box and htpc

3770k @ 4.8 maybe 4.9 I still don't know yet
3570k @ 5,0 golden 1.400 vcore

The main purpose for both rigs is gaming


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> I thought I had a nice chip also ....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.6 needs 1.260
> 4.7 needs 1.320
> 
> Working on 4.8 so far I am at 1.400 but getting whea while priming .... It is strange how these chips work ...
> 
> I need an advice
> 
> Which chip should I keep in my main rig and which one in my emulator box and htpc
> 
> 3770k @ 4.8 maybe 4.9 I still don't know yet
> 3570k @ 5,0 golden 1.400 vcore
> 
> The main purpose for both rigs is gaming


Your chip is better than mine. I have to run 1.32 for 4.5Ghz.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> I thought I had a nice chip also ....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.6 needs 1.260
> 4.7 needs 1.320
> 
> Working on 4.8 so far I am at 1.400 but getting whea while priming .... It is strange how these chips work ...
> 
> I need an advice
> 
> Which chip should I keep in my main rig and which one in my emulator box and htpc
> 
> 3770k @ 4.8 maybe 4.9 I still don't know yet
> 3570k @ 5,0 golden 1.400 vcore
> 
> The main purpose for both rigs is gaming


You hit a wall past 4.7 or at least I did where all of a sudden voltsges need to get boosted. I have 4.6 at 1.27 stable and I could go a bit lower. But I needed 1.38 for a stable 4.8. Try turning on ppl overvoltsge if you haven't already. And I'd go with the 3770k even at lower clocks ots still better then 3570 and hyperthreading. Games I don't notice because they don't use the extra threads. But encoding is faster same with extreme multi tasking


----------



## lilchronic

my chip is pretty good but ive seen better mainly because its only a i5
4.8 1.26v
4.9 1.31v
5.01.375v
all prime95 stable 12+hrs
i havent tested 5.1 with prime95 but i need 1.45v to run cinebench and IBT without whea errors


----------



## Vi0lence

you can run cinebench @ 5.1 w 1.45 vcore?


----------



## $ilent

hai guys









Still stress testing my chip unfortunately, but I moved it into my freezing cold conservatory overnight to rule out heat as an issue for stability.

Idle:


Load 1.36v at 5ghz:


Does anyone genuinely know if its safe to run this pc overnight in a conservatory where its so cold I can see my breathe?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> hai guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still stress testing my chip unfortunately, but I moved it into my freezing cold conservatory overnight to rule out heat as an issue for stability.
> 
> Idle:
> 
> 
> Load 1.36v at 5ghz:
> 
> 
> Does anyone genuinely know if its safe to run this pc overnight in a conservatory where its so cold I can see my breathe?


I dont see why not unless your on water and its below 0 and your running straight distilled. Even then tho as long as it's powered in it shouldn't freeze. Only other problem I could see is if there's a lot of moisture in the air.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> you can run cinebench @ 5.1 w 1.45 vcore?


i think the 8.49 score was @ 5.2 ghz and i got whea errors @ 1.52v i think. i forget lol


----------



## Vi0lence

yea mu fluid freezes at -8c, which is why i havent brought the comp in the garage. my chip would be at -2c right now. getting close.


----------



## Vi0lence

what settings are you running? i have to get up to around 1.6v to hit 5.1 with my chip. and i score over 10.4 with it that high


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> what settings are you running? i have to get up to around 1.6v to hit 5.1 with my chip. and i score over 10.4 with it that high


llc 1
fixed voltage 1.45v
pll overvoltage enabled
and a 10.4 with ht on i only have a 3570k


----------



## chann3l

So my 10 DEGREE delid drop with as5 isn't good enough for me it allowed my CPU to go from 4.6 to 4.8 before hitting my pre delid 4.6 hottest core temp in ibt max stress of 84 degrees. But I know if I push to 5 GHz I'll almost hit 90. Does anybody have experience ordering liquid pro from the states to Canada. Were there customs charges or anything like that and even better is there a Canadian store that sells it


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> hai guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still stress testing my chip unfortunately, but I moved it into my freezing cold conservatory overnight to rule out heat as an issue for stability.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Idle:
> 
> 
> Load 1.36v at 5ghz:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does anyone genuinely know if its safe to run this pc overnight in a conservatory where its so cold I can see my breathe?


i usually have my window open when i stress test and it is sometimes 0c outside so i dont see why not .


----------



## $ilent

Im not sure about us to CAN but in the UK if its under like £20 or something I dont think you get charged anything.

Lilchronic, ive done that before but thats just abit of cold air passing through, this whole room is really cold the only warm thing in there now is my pc sitting in the middle of it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Im not sure about us to CAN but in the UK if its under like £20 or something I dont think you get charged anything.
> 
> Lilchronic, ive done that before but thats just abit of cold air passing through, this whole room is really cold the only warm thing in there now is my pc sitting in the middle of it.


i have a patio with a tv out there i was thinking about taking my rig out on the patio 1 night and running some tests with 0c ambient temps







but i never did i still want to thou.
i dont think it would be that bad if u have all your fans blasting


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> So my 10 DEGREE delid drop with as5 isn't good enough for me it allowed my CPU to go from 4.6 to 4.8 before hitting my pre delid 4.6 hottest core temp in ibt max stress of 84 degrees. But I know if I push to 5 GHz I'll almost hit 90. Does anybody have experience ordering liquid pro from the states to Canada. Were there customs charges or anything like that and even better is there a Canadian store that sells it


I got mine from FrozenCPU, it worked fine

I just remembered I ordered it to a US address, nvm


----------



## Gomi

Damn .... I been too worried about condensation - But since you guys are all cool about running your chips that cold on "Winter air", how long a stretch would you dare to run it like that, non-insulated.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Damn .... I been too worried about condensation - But since you guys are all cool about running your chips that cold on "Winter air", how long a stretch would you dare to run it like that, non-insulated.


BAH. Who cares. Just insulate your parts. Oh and neoprene tubing.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I got mine from FrozenCPU, it worked fine
> 
> I just remembered I ordered it to a US address, nvm


Ya I was looking at it on their site. I'm just not sure if I will either be charged out the ass for customs. Or worse oy gets stuck at customs.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> BAH. Who cares. Just insulate your parts. Oh and neoprene tubing.


Ha ha, I hear you mate - I aint personally going through the "trouble" of insulating for the next few months (If that even) of winter air - Got my eyes on a LD Phase Change Unit, finally a plus of being from EU on this site and being a geek, the shipping is ultra cheap.


----------



## chann3l

Decided to order directly from coollaboratory.com. ordered ultra it came to 18 canadian with shipping. I chose the cheap 5 euro shipping so i'm sure it'll be here in a couple months







When I do get it how do I apply it. I know its not like regular tim


----------



## Valgaur

FINALLY MY CHIPS HERE!!!!!!!












finally im back in the game!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> FINALLY MY CHIPS HERE!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> finally im back in the game!


Nice man


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Nice man


Thanks! now time to rebuild the comp lol.... mobo was taken out to keep dust out of the socket and such.


----------



## Vi0lence

less typing more building. get that thing going so i can challenge you to beat my cinebench. lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> less typing more building. get that thing going so i can challenge you to beat my cinebench. lol


building as fast as I can!!!


----------



## MikeG

Has anybody delidded / relidded their chip for a second time? How do you remove the CLP from the die?

Before delidding my four core temperatures were uneven (e.g. 72-65-66-71). After delidding, my temperatures dropped at least 10 degrees and also my core temps were more even (e.g.58-56-57-57). Now after some abuse my core temps are uneven again (e.g. 51-46-45-50). I reapplied the TIM to my water block, but that didn't help. I was thinking about reapplying the TIM (Coolaboratory Liquid Pro) to the die.


----------



## Vi0lence

they will fluctuate. sometimes will be even sometimes wont. you will have one core that gets alot warmer then the others also. doing the TIM over again wont help much.

leave real temp open while surfing web pages also at idle. you will see it.


----------



## chann3l

Hey so when my ultra gets here and I replace my as5 how do I apply it on the die I heard it's not like applying regular tim?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Damn .... I been too worried about condensation - But since you guys are all cool about running your chips that cold on "Winter air", how long a stretch would you dare to run it like that, non-insulated.


tried to find something about it, seems theres a dewpoint calculator,
maybe its helpful Gomi, but to be honest, idk when i open my frontdoor to let the cold in








http://www.dpcalc.org/


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> building as fast as I can!!!


we are all waiting ! lol


----------



## megawatz

getting freezing rain here, opened a window. 14c idle temp on one core.

Also, testing new avatar.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hey so when my ultra gets here and I replace my as5 how do I apply it on the die I heard it's not like applying regular tim?


pro




ultra


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> tried to find something about it, seems theres a dewpoint calculator,
> maybe its helpful Gomi, but to be honest, idk when i open my frontdoor to let the cold in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.dpcalc.org/


very nice







i like this thing lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> FINALLY MY CHIPS HERE!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> finally im back in the game!


best news of the day, im happy for ya Bro..


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> tried to find something about it, seems theres a dewpoint calculator,
> maybe its helpful Gomi, but to be honest, idk when i open my frontdoor to let the cold in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.dpcalc.org/


Yah, its yet another reason I wish http://www.arqtik.com would open their business again - Their Controller for the QUAD TEC came with two chips (Easy to switch) one with Dew-point protection and one without - The controller simple measures humidity, temp on the cpu/block and ambient and stops the temperature from dropping to low - Easiest thing I ever seen and you would not have to insulate. The other chip of course allowed you to go beneath dew-point, but required insulation.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Valgaur congratz, now delidde that sucker and push it hehe


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> pro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ultra


Thank you


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> they also move 289 cfm per fan


289cfm with 30w, doubtful...Mine move 220cfm with 39w and 5300rpm...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> It doesn't make a difference in humidity.


It does when you get a lot of water inside a container evaporating, the point of the cooler is to have water evaporate inside, otherwise it won't work if you seal it. You need to push some air against the stream of water. Some of that humidity will go out of the loop into the air, thus the need to refill it.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> FINALLY MY CHIPS HERE!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> finally im back in the game!


Awesome man! About time







Don't delid it before testing it on cold...or at the very least binning it somehow. Test the imc aswell.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I got mine from FrozenCPU, it worked fine
> 
> I just remembered I ordered it to a US address, nvm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ya I was looking at it on their site. I'm just not sure if I will either be charged out the ass for customs. Or worse oy gets stuck at customs.
Click to expand...

I just got charged $30 shipping + $65 customs, for a $185 order from PPCS ... not impressed at all
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> It doesn't make a difference in humidity.
> 
> 
> 
> It does when you get a lot of water inside a container evaporating, the point of the cooler is to have water evaporate inside, otherwise it won't work if you seal it. You need to push some air against the stream of water. Some of that humidity will go out of the loop into the air, thus the need to refill it.
Click to expand...

I'm quite aware how a bong cooler works. What I'm saying is, it doesn't raise the humidity in the room any noticeable amount. Go ask the bong club


----------



## ivanlabrie

The constant refilling and huge tower thing would make my gf nervous so I can't really try it. Not in my house at least xD
And customs sucks! Off with their heads!!!


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hey so when my ultra gets here and I replace my as5 how do I apply it on the die I heard it's not like applying regular tim?


----------



## chann3l

So instead of putting the ultra on the die and letting it compress like with as5 I just put the same amount but brush the it over the whole die?


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## King4x4

Hokies you tease!


----------



## Valgaur

phew thank god it turns on lol. time to get my H100 on this bad lady and clock her! hoping for good things!!!


----------



## [CyGnus]

Are you already delidded?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Are you already delidded?


pffffft gotta test it first lol. see that Ghz if it's crazy Ghz with low vcore gonna save the chip for Ln2


----------



## [CyGnus]




----------



## Faelore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 289cfm with 30w, doubtful...Mine move 220cfm with 39w and 5300rpm...]
> 
> lol mine are bleeding edge tech. Not even sure if they are released to the public yet they are hella nice and hella loud


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 289cfm with 30w, doubtful...Mine move 220cfm with 39w and 5300rpm...]
> 
> lol mine are bleeding edge tech. Not even sure if they are released to the public yet they are hella nice and hella loud
> 
> 
> 
> Better blade design could allow higher cfm with that wattage
Click to expand...


----------



## Faelore

Lol i just checked right now deltas highest cfm avaible to the public is 240 and its a 30w lol.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835213001


----------



## ivanlabrie

There are higher cfm fans...not sure on Deltas, mine are Nidec. San Ace makes faster server fans (specifically a 260cfm 6600rpm or so 48v beast comes to mind)


----------



## JulioCesarSF

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Lol i just checked right now deltas highest cfm avaible to the public is 240 and its a 30w lol.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835213001


LOL 62db.


----------



## ivanlabrie




----------



## tjb433

So for those of you who have followed this thread for almost 1000 Pages (Holy Crap!). What percentages of Delidded 3770k's can hit what clocks at reasonable voltages?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Valgaur* wrote...finally im back in the game!


...I am starting a new game







- AFTER I *RMAed SANTA CLAUS*







, I got 'spoilered', per below...my beloved Sabertooth Z77 (hit over 5.3GHz twice) has been promoted to be the 'boss' in the VM setup so there was a MoBo job opening...

...still waiting for some deliveries from Europe (ie special delidders' wonder guck







from CoolLaboratory ) and won't be putting all of it together until mid-Feb re business commitments....got to love that Plex chip though, four GK110 Titan's would fit nicely







along with a delidded low-v Ivy


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## ivanlabrie

MVE? Nice!

Notice in the video I posted the guy is using voltage control instead of pwm...so he can't really slow the fan down.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Lol i just checked right now deltas highest cfm avaible to the public is 240 and its a 30w lol.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835213001


What were you saying?

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12690/fan-ac-33/Fantec_254_x_89mm_Dual_Ball_Bearing_AC_Fan_Kit_w_Grill_-_CAB_706_-_High_Speed_600_CFM.html?tl=g36c435s1109

hahahah


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tjb433*
> 
> So for those of you who have followed this thread for almost 1000 Pages (Holy Crap!). What percentages of Delidded 3770k's can hit what clocks at reasonable voltages?


It doesn't matter. Don't ask. Your chip's performance isn't based on statistics.

The fact that it's delidded changes nothing in terms of the clocks it can hit. We've had 5.4GHz chips and we've had chips who could barely push 4.5GHz (You know who you are







)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> Lol i just checked right now deltas highest cfm avaible to the public is 240 and its a 30w lol.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835213001
> 
> 
> 
> What were you saying?
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12690/fan-ac-33/Fantec_254_x_89mm_Dual_Ball_Bearing_AC_Fan_Kit_w_Grill_-_CAB_706_-_High_Speed_600_CFM.html?tl=g36c435s1109
> 
> hahahah
Click to expand...

1- 254mm is not a case fan size

2- 89mm is far from the standard fan depth

3- It's not a computer fan ...

4- It takes 110V, not 12.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
Click to expand...


----------



## Belial

Does anyone know if the UD5H is better than the UD3H (price totally out of the factor, and stuff like extra usb or sata ports out of the factor too). Basically, does it oc better, does it have a better vrm?

from what ive read, the ud3h has better mosfets but the ud5h has more phases. Im gonna trade in my ud3h at MC for a ud5h, and get $30 back, because the ud5h is actually $79 vs the $109 i got my ud3h for.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol but that's not a 120mm fan...and it's AC not DC 12v








I like it


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does anyone know if the UD5H is better than the UD3H (price totally out of the factor, and stuff like extra usb or sata ports out of the factor too). Basically, does it oc better, does it have a better vrm?
> 
> from what ive read, the ud3h has better mosfets but the ud5h has more phases. Im gonna trade in my ud3h at MC for a ud5h, and get $30 back, because the ud5h is actually $79 vs the $109 i got my ud3h for.


the ud5h is cheaper!? Then go for it!
It has better onboard sound and a headphone amp.








Same power delivery section.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*


Oh snap!

I nearly had coffee all over the place at the 2:18 minute mark when the fan just shoots across the table - EPIC! And the fact it did that at only 6-7V is just insane, lolololololol


----------



## Swag

@Valgaur

Tell me if you are interested in doing a dualcast delid with me!


----------



## Valgaur

Soo... this new chip.... freaking awesome im working on 4.8 Ghz right now but I got 4.7Ghz at 123vcore very easily and doing dirty ocing. If my internet would work id post something! Uuuugh...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Soo... this new chip.... freaking awesome im working on 4.8 Ghz right now but I got 4.7Ghz at 123vcore very easily and doing dirty ocing. If my internet would work id post something! Uuuugh...


Gimme! I want a chip like that!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Gimme! I want a chip like that!


Noo! Its mine! But the vcore jumps have been pretty smal too so I might get 5Ghz at 1.4 area im thinking... damn internet. I reeeeeally wanna delid this sucker but if he's this good... might hold back for this summer to Ln2 her


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Gimme! I want a chip like that!
> 
> 
> 
> Noo! Its mine! But the vcore jumps have been pretty smal too so I might get 5Ghz at 1.4 area im thinking... damn internet. I reeeeeally wanna delid this sucker but if he's this good... might hold back for this summer to Ln2 her
Click to expand...

Well, if I plan to delid my new chip (I named her Venus), I will be doing a livecast on it and will be explaining some Ivy Bridge CPU stuff, LN2 stuff, and a lot more goodie stuff! Also, I plan to, once I get more money, another giveaway for the Coollaboratory LP/LU.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Gimme! I want a chip like that!
> 
> 
> 
> Noo! Its mine! But the vcore jumps have been pretty smal too so I might get 5Ghz at 1.4 area im thinking... damn internet. I reeeeeally wanna delid this sucker but if he's this good... might hold back for this summer to Ln2 her
Click to expand...

To maintain 4.7, my 2600k is stuck at 4.40v







combination of bad chip & LLC stuck at highest level


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, if I plan to delid my new chip (I named her Venus), I will be doing a livecast on it and will be explaining some Ivy Bridge CPU stuff, LN2 stuff, and a lot more goodie stuff! Also, I plan to, once I get more money, another giveaway for the Coollaboratory LP/LU.


That sounds pretty fun. If I do delid her (no name yet) gonna do a dual delid with you man.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> To maintain 4.7, my 2600k is stuck at 4.40v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> combination of bad chip & LLC stuck at highest level


Oooph that vcore sounds nasty....


----------



## MikeG

Hey, can I join the club?

I'm sorry I did not document my process very well. I just found out about this club a few days ago and my chip has already been delidded, CLP applied, and sealed back up. I took it out from under the waterblock today so I could take some photos. As you can see the lid was replaced slightly to the left of center--proof that it really was delidded. You can also see from the side view that not much of a gap is left between the PCB and IHS as a result of the delidding process. The last photo shows my tools used--oops, I forgot to show the Coolaboratory Liquid Pro. It was pretty easy to do, and I was fortunate to have an old Pentium 4 that I practiced on. I used the "corner method", starting at each corner and wiggling the blade back and forth. I applied the CLP using the supplied cotton swab to both the die and the inside of the IHS. It is a good thing I applied it to both surfaces, because later when I attached the waterblock, I applied the CLP to one surface (the CPU only) and it did not bond very well. I had to re-lap to get it off, and this time decided to use PK-1 between the CPU and waterblock

OCN name:MikeG
CPU: I7-3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
Mhz gained: I don't know for sure as my before and after testing was done using the stock Intel heatsink. 4.4GHz before, 4.8Ghz after
OC after delid: 5.51GHz , 1.54V with water cooling
Temp drops: At least 10 degrees C.
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2666193


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Hey, can I join the club?
> 
> I'm sorry I did not document my process very well. I just found out about this club a few days ago and my chip has already been delidded, CLP applied, and sealed back up. I took it out from under the waterblock today so I could take some photos. As you can see the lid was replaced slightly to the left of center--proof that it really was delidded. You can also see from the side view that not much of a gap is left between the PCB and IHS as a result of the delidding process. The last photo shows my tools used--oops, I forgot to show the Coolaboratory Liquid Pro. It was pretty easy to do, and I was fortunate to have an old Pentium 4 that I practiced on. I used the "corner method", starting at each corner and wiggling the blade back and forth. I applied the CLP using the supplied cotton swab to both the die and the inside of the IHS. It is a good thing I applied it to both surfaces, because later when I attached the waterblock, I applied the CLP to one surface (the CPU only) and it did not bond very well. I had to re-lap to get it off, and this time decided to use PK-1 between the CPU and waterblock
> 
> OCN name:MikeG
> CPU: I7-3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
> Mhz gained: I don't know for sure as my before and after testing was done using the stock Intel heatsink. 4.4GHz before, 4.8Ghz after
> OC after delid: 5.51GHz , 1.54V with water cooling
> Temp drops: At least 10 degrees C.
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2666193
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You sir are in!!!! Slap that sig on! heck of a chip btw.... seriously.....not fair.

Also guys re doing windows because of issues ith internet.. plus want a nice clean slate to start off with i suppose.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Noo! Its mine! But the vcore jumps have been pretty smal too so I might get 5Ghz at 1.4 area im thinking... damn internet. I reeeeeally wanna delid this sucker but if he's this good... might hold back for this summer to Ln2 her


see what it does. after 4.8 mine needs crazy vcore per clock. if not. you got a winner.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> see what it does. after 4.8 mine needs crazy vcore per clock. if not. you got a winner.


I know im really hoping I almost got 4.9 at 1.3 so its a close one about the same amount of vcore per bump which is nice but ill have to see once I get it stable


----------



## Hokies83

Just waiting on afew things now.. 6 fans 4 fittings my 400ML Frozen Q res and my MB back from Rma lol.

You guys just do not know how Hot this is to have this res mounted like this in this case... nobody has done it..

Guess u will not know how sweet it is till the 400ML is in there lol..


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You sir are in!!!! Slap that sig on! heck of a chip btw.... seriously.....not fair.
> 
> Also guys re doing windows because of issues ith internet.. plus want a nice clean slate to start off with i suppose.


Thank you Valgaur. Oh, by the way as you can see my chip has been lapped. My temps actually got worse by 2 deg C after lapping. I lapped my cpu first before delidding. I was just using the stock Intel cooler which I lapped also, and my temps increased by 2 degrees. Later when I got my waterblock from Koolance, I had to lap that too because Koolance purposely makes their CPU-380I slightly convex to fit the slight concave of the Intel IHS.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just waiting on afew things now.. 6 fans 4 fittings my 400ML Frozen Q res and my MB back from Rma lol.


Its looking good so far! But is that red helix res in place with just one mount?


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I know im really hoping I almost got 4.9 at 1.3 so its a close one about the same amount of vcore per bump which is nice but ill have to see once I get it stable


4.9 is the start of the wall for most chips. im good up to like 1.325v @ 4.8, after that im over 1.45v, then 5.0 is 1.5v, 5.1 wasnt happening today on anything up to 1.6v


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Its looking good so far! But is that red helix res in place with just one mount?


Both mounts are on it look closer..

I have a HDD mount screwd to the rad behind it and the mount is mounted to that.


----------



## Vi0lence

which rads are those the alphas?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, that is a bit strange, maybe i should rethink what im trying to do,
> was trying to find a way to see if a chip is worth delidding vcore wise,
> by comparing good/high ocers with the vcores they need at 4.5ghz,
> because almost all undelidded ivy's can run 4.5ghz,
> 
> mine needs 1.235V vcore to make 4.5ghz run stable, and its a average ocer,
> at 4.8ghz i need 1.420V vcore
> 4.9ghz is a no go for me, needs about 1.510V vcore..
> 
> i thought 4.5ghz would be a nice one to use for comparison
> besides the tempdrops if you do..
> 4.8ghz at 1.36V vcore is still very good, you still should be able to run 4.9ghz,
> cant imagine you make a 0.160V vcore jump between 4.8 and 4.9ghz, and hit 1.52V vcore that way tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dont know if this post makes sense, im (very)tired ..lol


For binning it seems like most are using 5Ghz for a reference, getting to desktop & handling a light load (like single thread) at 1.3v & under are the great ones, more it needs the less great it is.
The chip I'm using now can run IBT max mem stable 4.5Ghz @ 1.128V, scales to 4.7Ghz at 1.224V, then needs big bumps, 5Ghz boots at 1.44V & needs 1.54V for stable. Not bad but not great or golden.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I dont see why not unless your on water and its below 0 and your running straight distilled. Even then tho as long as it's powered in it shouldn't freeze. Only other problem I could see is if there's a lot of moisture in the air.


Moisture in the air is really only a problem when the HW is colder than ambient. Same temp or warmer no condensation, sub-ambient cooling can start to get condensation issues.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> So my 10 DEGREE delid drop with as5 isn't good enough for me it allowed my CPU to go from 4.6 to 4.8 before hitting my pre delid 4.6 hottest core temp in ibt max stress of 84 degrees. But I know if I push to 5 GHz I'll almost hit 90. Does anybody have experience ordering liquid pro from the states to Canada. Were there customs charges or anything like that and even better is there a Canadian store that sells it


I did get some customs charges but got like $300 worth of stuff. No way I was paying $40 shipping for just some TIM, especially the way it arrived. $55 for 0.5G of liquid metal would have made me rage...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Soo... this new chip.... freaking awesome im working on 4.8 Ghz right now but I got 4.7Ghz at 123vcore very easily and doing dirty ocing. If my internet would work id post something! Uuuugh...


Sounds better than Franky, not bad!

Started this post much earlier when the power went out, had to go for gas to get the genny running.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> 4.9 is the start of the wall for most chips. im good up to like 1.325v @ 4.8, after that im over 1.45v, then 5.0 is 1.5v, 5.1 wasnt happening today on anything up to 1.6v


Shesh.. crazy jumps


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> which rads are those the alphas?


Alphacool Nexxos Monsta 86mm thick rads


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Alphacool Nexxos Monsta 86mm thick rads


cool thats what i thought. i might put one on my cpu. not sure if i want that or the magicool monsta rad.

yea i can boot into windows 100% stable and bench and game all day on 1.5v, going up to 5.1 is rough, but i can do the super pi 1m at 5.3 @ 1.6v abouts. cenebench will do 5.1 @ 1.6v with temps staying low. but cant get higher.

both chips i de-lid did the same. comparable to eachother, with only slight voltage differences. but seems they all hit a wall at 4.9 on the not so good ones.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, if I plan to delid my new chip (I named her Venus), I will be doing a livecast on it and will be explaining some Ivy Bridge CPU stuff, LN2 stuff, and a lot more goodie stuff! Also, I plan to, once I get more money, another giveaway for the Coollaboratory LP/LU.
> 
> 
> 
> That sounds pretty fun. If I do delid her (no name yet) gonna do a dual delid with you man.
Click to expand...

Kk, sounds like a plan! Tell me if you plan to, and I'll tell you if Intel verifies that my RMA went through. If it did, I will delid when you decide to.







If not, I'll see if I should still make the video.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> see what it does. after 4.8 mine needs crazy vcore per clock. if not. you got a winner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know im really hoping I almost got 4.9 at 1.3 so its a close one about the same amount of vcore per bump which is nice but ill have to see once I get it stable
Click to expand...

Comgrats on the new chip *valgaur*! And it looks like you got a winner so far. We are all looking forward to what she will do in your hands!


----------



## Hokies83

Wonder if i should trade my 4gb 680s for 7970s with water blocks on them? really no point is WC Kepler cards since voltage is locked heh.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Wonder if i should trade my 4gb 680s for 7970s with water blocks on them? really no point is WC Kepler cards since voltage is locked heh.


Get them if you plan to bench.. otherwise just keep the keplers


----------



## King4x4

Got all three of my 7950s from 1.09v all the way up to 1.25v and the cores from 900mhz to 1180mhz.

Yes... Throw away those voltage locked little punks!


----------



## Hokies83

Ive had 7970s they were both defective lol but did 1250mhz


----------



## FtW 420

My first reference 7970 was a bit of a dog, think it was artifacting by 1220 core with max software voltage. Had to hardmod it for voltage to really make it go.
The lightning 7970 is a pretty good one, 1270 - 1300 core at 1.25V stock cooled & 1365 on water at 1.3V. With chilly water ran 1400 core, can't wait till next week, have free time to finally bench the thing.

Gamers seem happy with either card, for benching the 7970 does better in the majority of them.


----------



## Valgaur

well.. after an hour and a half of installing windows... I realized I installed the 32 bit version... ***.


----------



## FtW 420

You has a 3d benching OS now


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You has a 3d benching OS now


32 bit works?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You sir are in!!!! Slap that sig on! heck of a chip btw.... seriously.....not fair.
> 
> Also guys re doing windows because of issues ith internet.. plus want a nice clean slate to start off with i suppose.


Fresh windows is good I reinstall mine every couple months lol I just love the feel of a clean slate


----------



## alancsalt

For overclocking only - technically invalid copy

TinyXP_Rev09


----------



## King4x4

Works just fine... just throw away one of your ram sticks.


----------



## Valgaur

Gonna be a late clocking night I can already tell lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh im just getting everything ready for my 4770k


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> My first reference 7970 was a bit of a dog, think it was artifacting by 1220 core with max software voltage. Had to hardmod it for voltage to really make it go.
> The lightning 7970 is a pretty good one, 1270 - 1300 core at 1.25V stock cooled & 1365 on water at 1.3V. With chilly water ran 1400 core, can't wait till next week, have free time to finally bench the thing.
> 
> Gamers seem happy with either card, for benching the 7970 does better in the majority of them.


I got lucky with my first and only HD7950.

Sapphire 950mhz Edition.

Have benched it with water block as high as 1370/1800.

1370/1800 3dMark11 run.

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5566083
__________________


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh im just getting everything ready for my 4770k


How much more performance do you think your system will get with it?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> How much more performance do you think your system will get with it?


10% = 15%

But it is the return of real over clocking







Sb / IB = noob friendly.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 10% = 15%
> 
> But it is the return of real over clocking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sb / IB = noob friendly.


If 4770k can be delidded then I will consider it a worthy upgrade to 3770k.


----------



## DiamondCut

Lapped and CLP'd my chip. Lots o pics!

I wont know what my chip ends up doing until maybe sunday









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 10% = 15%
> 
> But it is the return of real over clocking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sb / IB = noob friendly.
> 
> 
> 
> If 4770k can be delidded then I will consider it a worthy upgrade to 3770k.
Click to expand...

I think they say they willl all be so now. Something to do with the die size, heat, and solder issues IIRC.

I'm OK with that.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Lapped and CLP'd my chip. Lots o pics!
> 
> I wont know what my chip ends up doing until maybe sunday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice pics *DiamondCut*. Maybe a bit much CLP. If you have poor temp improvment, try taking some off. Hope not.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Lapped and CLP'd my chip. Lots o pics!
> 
> I wont know what my chip ends up doing until maybe sunday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That CPU mount looks great. Did the back plate come with the block? Have you thought about doing no IHS mount? You have a nice MB and block to do no IHS mount.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I got lucky with my first and only HD7950.
> 
> Sapphire 950mhz Edition.
> 
> Have benched it with water block as high as 1370/1800.
> 
> 1370/1800 3dMark11 run.
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5566083
> __________________


Good reference card!
Dunno why my link has a tesselation message, tess was enabled & yours doesn't have the message http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5576101

With tess off in the same bench session http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5699910


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good reference card!
> Dunno why my link has a tesselation message, tess was enabled & yours doesn't have the message http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5576101
> 
> With tess off in the same bench session http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5699910


Awesome score.

What was your CPU speed and memory speed for that benchmark?

Please pm me your CCC settings to get such high score.









My physics and GPU score seem kind of low compared to others on the leader boards at HWbot and my card is over clocking just as good as the best HD7950 there.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I got lucky with my first and only HD7950.
> 
> Sapphire 950mhz Edition.
> 
> Have benched it with water block as high as 1370/1800.
> 
> 1370/1800 3dMark11 run.
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5566083
> __________________
> 
> 
> 
> Good reference card!
> Dunno why my link has a tesselation message, tess was enabled & yours doesn't have the message http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5576101
> 
> With tess off in the same bench session http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5699910
Click to expand...

Nice scores. Don't know why you are getting the tess warning. Maybe related to the driver warning?

Also, looks like you only run 3Dmark11 with GPU OC'ed and CPU at 3.5GHz. Was wondering why? Or is the CPU OC'ed too?


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> That CPU mount looks great. Did the back plate come with the block? Have you thought about doing no IHS mount? You have a nice MB and block to do no IHS mount.


Yea it did. And I did consider it but Its too scary for me








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Nice pics *DiamondCut*. Maybe a bit much CLP. If you have poor temp improvment, try taking some off. Hope not.


Yea on the Die i put more than I usually would... I think it will help since I did sand a bit down on the inside of the IHS.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Soo... this new chip.... freaking awesome im working on 4.8 Ghz right now but I got 4.7Ghz at 123vcore very easily and doing dirty ocing. If my internet would work id post something! Uuuugh...










Great to hear Val!

I'm taking my gpu to the new owner's place tomorrow morning, he wanted me to test it for him and flash the original bios while at it, before paying me. I'm going with my father in law as a backup lol (and a knife...)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Awesome score.
> 
> What was your CPU speed and memory speed for that benchmark?
> 
> Please pm me your CCC settings to get such high score.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My physics and GPU score seem kind of low compared to others on the leader boards at HWbot and my card is over clocking just as good as the best HD7950 there.


Cpu was air cooled outdoors at about 0° ambient, gpu was on water with a universal block. the tess enabled run was at 5Ghz & 2600Mhz mem at 9-12-12 27 1t, didn't have memtweakit open for the secondary & tertiary timings, can't remember those. Clocked up to 5.1 for the tess disabled run, same memory settings..
In CCC the only change I make is the tess setting for hwbot. For the physics score, are you using 3d11 version 1.01? The physics does a bit better.

That is one hell of a 7950, thought it was a 7970 score when I first looked!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Nice scores. Don't know why you are getting the tess warning. Maybe related to the driver warning?
> 
> Also, looks like you only run 3Dmark11 with GPU OC'ed and CPU at 3.5GHz. Was wondering why? Or is the CPU OC'ed too?


Not sure if I ran tess disabled before re-enabling it, maybe I needed to restart the rig in between or something. Will have to play with that & see.
The futuremark link gets the speeds wrong a lot of the time. It's usually pretty good with cpu, but memory it just reads the JEDEC specs, so always 667 or 800Mhz no matter what the memory is clocked at.
For guys who have the cpu set to downclock at idle it usually reads the idle speed. Not sure what happened with mine, it read the stock speed.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> you think i could clear 5.4 ghz if i delided? from what i can tell i got quite the golden chip


Quote Faelore
I settled on a modest overclock of 4.4ghz at 1.23v its prime stable and the hottest core after 24 hours was 62c
end quote

i thought , not really golden see, thats why i asked him for a 4.5ghz oc to compare
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> can you run 4.5ghz, but has to be stable, then i can better tell you if its worth it,
> been comparing for a while now with vcores needed at 4.5ghz..
> 5.4ghz ..nah, havent seen one yet that could do that within normal vcore range, on air/water that is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.2ghz yes, theres some out there that can run that 24/7 np..
> 
> if it can run 4.5ghz with vcore lower then 1.25 or better under 1.2V, then you have a very nice chip, or golden ..lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Dont know if true, my 3570K needs 1.18v for 4.5GHz 1.24v for 4.6GHz 1.29v for 4.7GHz 1.36v for 4.8GHz after that it just isnt stable for 24/7 no matter the voltage


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, that is a bit strange, maybe i should rethink what im trying to do,
> was trying to find a way to see if a chip is worth delidding vcore wise,
> by comparing good/high ocers with the vcores they need at 4.5ghz,
> because almost all undelidded ivy's can run 4.5ghz,
> 
> mine needs 1.235V vcore to make 4.5ghz run stable, and its a average ocer,
> at 4.8ghz i need 1.420V vcore
> 4.9ghz is a no go for me, needs about 1.510V vcore..
> 
> i thought 4.5ghz would be a nice one to use for comparison
> besides the tempdrops if you do..
> 4.8ghz at 1.36V vcore is still very good, you still should be able to run 4.9ghz,
> cant imagine you make a 0.160V vcore jump between 4.8 and 4.9ghz, and hit 1.52V vcore that way tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dont know if this post makes sense, im (very)tired ..lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For binning it seems like most are using 5Ghz for a reference, getting to desktop & handling a light load (like single thread) at 1.3v & under are the great ones, more it needs the less great it is.
> The chip I'm using now can run IBT max mem stable 4.5Ghz @ 1.128V, scales to 4.7Ghz at 1.224V, then needs big bumps, 5Ghz boots at 1.44V & needs 1.54V for stable. Not bad but not great or golden.


so you guys think im on the wrong track with this?
comparing chip's at 4.5 ghz and see if its stable with vcores below 1.2V,
to see if its worth to delid, and have a good one to oc higher with nice vcores?

i did notice that even tho if it has a good vcore at 4.5ghz, with higher oc's you cant
really tell yet where it hits the "wall", can be at 4.7ghz or 4.9ghz, no way to tell,
except to try it, but theres not many un-delidded ivy's that can run that high oc's
just to test it, thats why i looked at the 4.5ghz and the vcores it needs there, since most can run that un-delidded..

mine makes a big jump going from 4.8 to 4.9ghz as you can see above..


----------



## Hokies83

So i have this Extra Highend 35mm Switchtech rad with a built in Res....

What should i do with it... it is not going into my Monsta Vishera Slayer system.. it only gets 86mm rads XD


----------



## King4x4

Puny Rad, Smack a pump on it and use it to water cool your smartphone.


----------



## Valgaur

Okay. finally got my OS right.. think I'm gonna take a wack at 5 Ghz and see where I can get.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does anyone know if the UD5H is better than the UD3H (price totally out of the factor, and stuff like extra usb or sata ports out of the factor too). Basically, does it oc better, does it have a better vrm?
> 
> from what ive read, the ud3h has better mosfets but the ud5h has more phases. Im gonna trade in my ud3h at MC for a ud5h, and get $30 back, because the ud5h is actually $79 vs the $109 i got my ud3h for.
> 
> 
> 
> the ud5h is cheaper!? Then go for it!
> It has better onboard sound and a headphone amp.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same power delivery section.
Click to expand...

What exactly is the headphone amp stuff (i use 2 crap speakers from some cd player system i got like 10 years ago, i mean they are just big speakers, they cant be bad though).

From what I read (in regards to Extreme4's alc898 vs UD3H), the alc898 is the same as VIA except in the 'midrange' in which case the VIA is slightly (unnoticeably) better (whatever that means, *** is mid-range).

I mean it's all the same, but from what I've read, the ud5h isn't really a better board than the ud3h. It's plainly just a ud3h with vrm heatsinks on the iGPU and a few other phases that dont need heatsinks on them (that top row), a doubler on lower quality mosfets (could be wrong on that, but i read that...somewhere, that ud5h uses lower quality mosfets) so it's not even a true 12+ phase (or is it? im a bit confused, doubler is the worse one right, ie extreme4 is 4+1 phase with a doubler), and some extra sata/usb ports (i dont use usb/sata 3.0 even, i use single ssd and thats it, and single gpu, as sli doesnt work for the programs i use to stream, any of them).

I mean sounds like for the price, the ud3h is a better value simply because ud5h isn't any improvement. I mean, pocketing $30, that's a no brainer, but I just wanted to make sure I wasn't downgrading or anything.

On a side note, I could just trade my UD3H for an extreme6 (since the extreme6 is $109 right now.. or is it extreme7, or 8, whatever, i do know the extreme4 is bad but the extreme6 or whatever is a high quality board and massive step up whereas the ud5h is not a massive step up from the ud3h, at least as i understand it). The one con with the ud5h though, that, unlike the ud3h, is does not have a ps/2 port. kind of a turn off.

On a side note, I'm gonna be binning 2 3570ks in the coming week. As I understand the way to 'bin' - set VID to 1.55, and push multi up, boot up into windows, dont even stress test just keep doing that until no more boot into windows. Then, do it again with next chip, compare results, one chip is better than the other. I happen to be making 2 3570k builds right now (ram is taking forever to arrive from canada, by the time it arrives the parts for this other build will all have arrived, not to mention that nh-d14 mount from austria so i'll probably have a cm v6gt @$25 and a full setup before then).

Also thinking of getting that $20 msi g41 for a build that will just be a minor oc on stock voltage or so (it's for someone else who is computer illiterate, im just gonna turn a quick 4.3+ ghz and whatever). that or the ud5h for $79.... might be a bit overkill for their needs.


----------



## DiamondCut

oh cmonnn

All of you didnt see my delid







I need more opinions like from you Vulgaur!

Also Vulg, do you have steam or something we can Im on?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> oh cmonnn
> 
> All of you didnt see my delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need more opinions like from you Vulgaur!
> 
> Also Vulg, do you have steam or something we can Im on?


lol, before you start calling me VunDotch, its Valgaur... or Val










srry i missed your delid post..what page?


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol, before you start calling me VunDotch, its Valgaur... or Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> srry i missed your delid post..what page?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/9920_20#post_19139389


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> oh cmonnn
> 
> All of you didnt see my delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need more opinions like from you Vulgaur!
> 
> Also Vulg, do you have steam or something we can Im on?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Lapped and CLP'd my chip. Lots o pics!
> 
> I wont know what my chip ends up doing until maybe sunday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


not much opinions to give i think, it all looks good to me DiamondCut











gotcha, now im confused, because you say, we didnt see your delid, what was it about, did you lap the ihs only, or delid and lapped?
its up and running now?
all i can see on the pics, it looks like alot of clp on the die, thats all, doesnt mean temps wont drop or anything ,
but i like thin layers, dont want to end up it looking like this when you take it apart again,


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> oh cmonnn
> 
> All of you didnt see my delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need more opinions like from you Vulgaur!
> 
> Also Vulg, do you have steam or something we can Im on?


Yeah I got Skype PM and I'll IM

Also....

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2667923

very dirty OC by the way.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> oh cmonnn
> 
> All of you didnt see my delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need more opinions like from you Vulgaur!
> 
> Also Vulg, do you have steam or something we can Im on?
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I got Skype PM and I'll IM
> 
> Also....
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2667923
Click to expand...


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> not much opinions to give i think, it all looks good to me DiamondCut
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gotcha, now im confused, because you say, we didnt see your delid, what was it about, did you lap the ihs only, or delid and lapped?
> its up and running now?
> all i can see on the pics, it looks like alot of clp on the die, thats all, doesnt mean temps wont drop alor or anything ,
> but i like thin layers, dont want to end up it looking like this when you take it apart again,


Yea I haven't put it all in yet, I just am letting it sit for now because I painted the screws for holding down the cpu waterblock anyways. It isn't as much as it looks.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Lapped and CLP'd my chip. Lots o pics!
> 
> I wont know what my chip ends up doing until maybe sunday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Since you wanted an opinion, here it is:

To scrutinize, I don't like the lapping finish you have. More of a preference but I like it a mirror finish so I know that I've gotten rid of virtually 99% of the "holes" that the TIM normally patches up. Also, that is waaaaay too much CLP! I mean, way too much. Do you see how it is globbing at the edges and even in the middle? That is a big sign of a no-no. Look for a matte mirror finish. So basically, a very tiny thin coat that just patches it up!

Other than that, that block looks amazingly sexy and that's the one where if you have a colored coolant, you can see it right?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea I haven't put it all in yet, I just am letting it sit for now because I painted the screws for holding down the cpu waterblock anyways. It isn't as much as it looks.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Since you wanted an opinion, here it is:
> 
> To scrutinize, I don't like the lapping finish you have. More of a preference but I like it a mirror finish so I know that I've gotten rid of virtually 99% of the "holes" that the TIM normally patches up.
> 
> Also, that is waaaaay too much CLP! I mean, way too much. Do you see how it is globbing at the edges and even in the middle? That is a big sign of a no-no. Look for a matte mirror finish. So basically, a very tiny thin coat that just patches it up!
> 
> Other than that, that block looks amazingly sexy and that's the one where if you have a colored coolant, you can see it right?


yea, like i said, cant say much about it really, it all looks good, except what i said about the clp kinda "floating" on the die


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Since you wanted an opinion, here it is:
> 
> To scrutinize, I don't like the lapping finish you have. More of a preference but I like it a mirror finish so I know that I've gotten rid of virtually 99% of the "holes" that the TIM normally patches up. Also, that is waaaaay too much CLP! I mean, way too much. Do you see how it is globbing at the edges and even in the middle? That is a big sign of a no-no. Look for a matte mirror finish. So basically, a very tiny thin coat that just patches it up!
> 
> Other than that, that block looks amazingly sexy and that's the one where if you have a colored coolant, you can see it right?


Correct, and I don't think I really took my time on the die. I was kinda nervous lol. If you see my IHS it has the thinnest layer ive ever done lol.

As far as the finish. I only got up to 1000 grit of sand paper and I did over 250 strokes on that and it was getting me no where and I was happy with the smoothness on my fingers.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Correct, and I don't think I really took my time on the die. I was kinda nervous lol. If you see my IHS it has the thinnest layer ive ever done lol.
> 
> As far as the finish. I only got up to 1000 grit of sand paper and I did over 250 strokes on that and it was getting me no where and I was happy with the smoothness on my fingers.


sand in circles. thius way the copper builds upo makign a finner grit thus making it a smoother finish over time. thats what I did with my 1000 grit and it was prettymirror like.

Also guys... my chip has rounded edges like the later sandys do... caught my eye and I was stumped for a bit.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Also guys... my chip has rounded edges like the later sandys do... caught my eye and I was stumped for a bit.


rounded edges? explain... or show if you can


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Since you wanted an opinion, here it is:
> 
> To scrutinize, I don't like the lapping finish you have. More of a preference but I like it a mirror finish so I know that I've gotten rid of virtually 99% of the "holes" that the TIM normally patches up. Also, that is waaaaay too much CLP! I mean, way too much. Do you see how it is globbing at the edges and even in the middle? That is a big sign of a no-no. Look for a matte mirror finish. So basically, a very tiny thin coat that just patches it up!
> 
> Other than that, that block looks amazingly sexy and that's the one where if you have a colored coolant, you can see it right?
> 
> 
> 
> Correct, and I don't think I really took my time on the die. I was kinda nervous lol. If you see my IHS it has the thinnest layer ive ever done lol.
> 
> As far as the finish. I only got up to 1000 grit of sand paper and I did over 250 strokes on that and it was getting me no where and I was happy with the smoothness on my fingers.
Click to expand...

Whenever I lap my IHS's, I always buy sand paper ranging from 400 - 3000. It might be overkill for the 3000, but I like the extra sexy mirror finish.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> rounded edges? explain... or show if you can




Thats what I mean.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> rounded edges? explain... or show if you can
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats what I mean.
Click to expand...

Hahaha, you know, that looks like a refurbed IHS.


----------



## VonDutch

imagine intel changed more then that, and started soldering the ihs again ...lol, better be careful Val









wauw, remember the pump out effect we talked about alot in the paste,
idc made another nice pic to use to explain to others what it is,
1 pic says more then

"pump out effect

Basic concept

"Large and fast decreases in temperature when coupled with HLT instructions.
A usage pattern that alternates between full idle and full load conditions
will cause die temps to swing WIDE AND FAST, particularly with overclocked/overvolted CPUs.

This thermal cycling causes TIM pump-out, wherein the TIM gets ejected and displaced by air,
which is of course not a good thing.

Greases also creep, again worsening the situation."

I think this happens more often with IB because of how quick it heats up and cools off.
The die contact area is so small with such drastic temperatures is another reason."

blabla etc ..lol


http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?s=b724a52ab3625ff45bb5c1ca48b3f764&p=33840660&postcount=249

same goes for the original tim intel used, as we can see on just delidded ivy's,

theres more tim around the die, then on it see that?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> imagine intel changed more then that, and started soldering the ihs again ...lol, better be careful Val


pfft still crappy temps really.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> My first reference 7970 was a bit of a dog, think it was artifacting by 1220 core with max software voltage. Had to hardmod it for voltage to really make it go.
> The lightning 7970 is a pretty good one, 1270 - 1300 core at 1.25V stock cooled & 1365 on water at 1.3V. With chilly water ran 1400 core, can't wait till next week, have free time to finally bench the thing.
> 
> Gamers seem happy with either card, for benching the 7970 does better in the majority of them.


i was wondering about that FtW,
is it hard to do a hardmod for the voltage,
my 7970 seems to be hardware locked..
max i can get it to is 1100/1500

was thinking about it, but got no clue yet on the how to..
can you give me some pointers, or a link ?


----------



## mandrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, join the club..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yep, i know that, i hit 105C at 4.5ghz, just a shame if you have that kind of (great) cooling, and still be limited by temps..
> you could start with reading page 1, theres alot of info under the spoilers, i took about 1 month to prepare for the delid, by reading,
> and watching all vid's i could find


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Quick tip or rather just a piece of knowledge for you. I have the same waterblock and because of how tight it sits it really pushed my ihs onto the PCB so it takes a bit of extra time and patience to get the blade in. Good luck im sure youll do fine


Thanks, guys. Received the TIM yesterday. Soon as I get through putting my SM8 back together I will give it my best shot.
I read everything posted over at Anandtech and quite a bit here about delidding. I will probably read it all again to make sure.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> imagine intel changed more then that, and started soldering the ihs again ...lol, better be careful Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pfft still crappy temps really.
Click to expand...

Did you get your before and after IBT @ 4.5GHz so we can compare temps? Seeing the changed IHS makes me hope they are making some improvments, but probably not.

Your 5GHz looked good at a decent vcore. I think you may have a better chip than Franky! (Wonder if it is as tough? - only one way to find out!).









Anyway congrats on having a new 3770K and it being a good one!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay. finally got my OS right.. think I'm gonna take a wack at 5 Ghz and see where I can get.


Cool! You need to strip the XP image a bit more, I'm sure FtW can guide you regarding that, right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> What exactly is the headphone amp stuff (i use 2 crap speakers from some cd player system i got like 10 years ago, i mean they are just big speakers, they cant be bad though).
> 
> From what I read (in regards to Extreme4's alc898 vs UD3H), the alc898 is the same as VIA except in the 'midrange' in which case the VIA is slightly (unnoticeably) better (whatever that means, *** is mid-range).
> 
> I mean it's all the same, but from what I've read, the ud5h isn't really a better board than the ud3h. It's plainly just a ud3h with vrm heatsinks on the iGPU and a few other phases that dont need heatsinks on them (that top row), a doubler on lower quality mosfets (could be wrong on that, but i read that...somewhere, that ud5h uses lower quality mosfets) so it's not even a true 12+ phase (or is it? im a bit confused, doubler is the worse one right, ie extreme4 is 4+1 phase with a doubler), and some extra sata/usb ports (i dont use usb/sata 3.0 even, i use single ssd and thats it, and single gpu, as sli doesnt work for the programs i use to stream, any of them).
> 
> I mean sounds like for the price, the ud3h is a better value simply because ud5h isn't any improvement. I mean, pocketing $30, that's a no brainer, but I just wanted to make sure I wasn't downgrading or anything.
> 
> On a side note, I could just trade my UD3H for an extreme6 (since the extreme6 is $109 right now.. or is it extreme7, or 8, whatever, i do know the extreme4 is bad but the extreme6 or whatever is a high quality board and massive step up whereas the ud5h is not a massive step up from the ud3h, at least as i understand it). The one con with the ud5h though, that, unlike the ud3h, is does not have a ps/2 port. kind of a turn off.
> 
> On a side note, I'm gonna be binning 2 3570ks in the coming week. As I understand the way to 'bin' - set VID to 1.55, and push multi up, boot up into windows, dont even stress test just keep doing that until no more boot into windows. Then, do it again with next chip, compare results, one chip is better than the other. I happen to be making 2 3570k builds right now (ram is taking forever to arrive from canada, by the time it arrives the parts for this other build will all have arrived, not to mention that nh-d14 mount from austria so i'll probably have a cm v6gt @$25 and a full setup before then).
> 
> Also thinking of getting that $20 msi g41 for a build that will just be a minor oc on stock voltage or so (it's for someone else who is computer illiterate, im just gonna turn a quick 4.3+ ghz and whatever). that or the ud5h for $79.... might be a bit overkill for their needs.


Mate, the UD5H uses the same vrm if not better, don't worry about that...And the onboard sound is better. It's a better board hence it being the 5 and not 3 model







I mean it! You even get some money so DO get it, be my guest.
As for the binning, that procedure will work with Sandy Bridge cpus not Ivy. Try to see the lowest possible vcore needed to boot 5ghz and run superpi 1m. That's it. Keep the lowest one and delid it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hahaha, you know, that looks like a refurbed IHS.


I actually now that chip's owner, hersounds from XS and a local Argentina forum.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Did you get your before and after IBT @ 4.5GHz so we can compare temps? Seeing the changed IHS makes me hope they are making some improvments, but probably not.
> 
> Your 5GHz looked good at a decent vcore. I think you may have a better chip than Franky! (Wonder if it is as tough? - only one way to find out!).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway congrats on having a new 3770K and it being a good one!


Yeah I can aida 64 that 5ghz but can't ibt it with the temps. atleast the temps are somewhat close to each other. I can get 4.5 at 1.2 vcore (still a dirty OC) but its dead on stable. Might play with it more this afternoon and see what I can get from it.

So far though a solid chip really. 4.7 at 1.23 vcore then 4.8 at right around 1.32 depends really. Then 4.9 at 1.4 area then 5ghz at that 1.43 but it doesn't like BCLK that much.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I regret to inform, I'll never be joining the de-lid club for the I7.

I got a video coming up - can't even delid a pentium 4 (knowing that I've already hit the die)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I regret to inform, I'll never be joining the de-lid club for the I7.
> 
> I got a video coming up - can't even delid a pentium 4 (knowing that I've already hit the die)


NOOOOOOOOOOOO

Jk just keeping things safe is a smart move.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> NOOOOOOOOOOOO
> 
> Jk just keeping things safe is a smart move.


You'll see what mean - I've engraved a smiley face on the Pentium 4 and will frame it as "the invincible"


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> You'll see what mean - I've engraved a smiley face on the Pentium 4 and will frame it as "the invincible"


Really? Does it still boot?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Really? Does it still boot?


I can't test a Pentium 4 lol - No idea.
Just wanted to play around with it to see if it would open up









As it doesn't open up, and must be bound with nuclear paste - it wins


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I can't test a Pentium 4 lol - No idea.
> Just wanted to play around with it to see if it would open up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As it doesn't open up, and must be bound with nuclear paste - it wins


Take a lighter to the IHS heats it up and then wiggle the ihs in a slight turning motion.

Man I wanna delid this bad lady but I need to OC more to find everything out....grrrrr


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Take a lighter to the IHS heats it up and then wiggle the ihs in a slight turning motion.
> 
> Man I wanna delid this bad lady but I need to OC more to find everything out....grrrrr


Et voila:
*Picture:*

__
http://instagr.am/p/U9DnveSwaN%2F/

*Video (many dirty jokes and puns said)*


----------



## King4x4

I LOLED!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I LOLED!


hehe
Twas the nerf gun right?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay. finally got my OS right.. think I'm gonna take a wack at 5 Ghz and see where I can get.
> 
> 
> 
> Cool! You need to strip the XP image a bit more, I'm sure FtW can guide you regarding that, right?
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> What exactly is the headphone amp stuff (i use 2 crap speakers from some cd player system i got like 10 years ago, i mean they are just big speakers, they cant be bad though).
> 
> From what I read (in regards to Extreme4's alc898 vs UD3H), the alc898 is the same as VIA except in the 'midrange' in which case the VIA is slightly (unnoticeably) better (whatever that means, *** is mid-range).
> 
> I mean it's all the same, but from what I've read, the ud5h isn't really a better board than the ud3h. It's plainly just a ud3h with vrm heatsinks on the iGPU and a few other phases that dont need heatsinks on them (that top row), a doubler on lower quality mosfets (could be wrong on that, but i read that...somewhere, that ud5h uses lower quality mosfets) so it's not even a true 12+ phase (or is it? im a bit confused, doubler is the worse one right, ie extreme4 is 4+1 phase with a doubler), and some extra sata/usb ports (i dont use usb/sata 3.0 even, i use single ssd and thats it, and single gpu, as sli doesnt work for the programs i use to stream, any of them).
> 
> I mean sounds like for the price, the ud3h is a better value simply because ud5h isn't any improvement. I mean, pocketing $30, that's a no brainer, but I just wanted to make sure I wasn't downgrading or anything.
> 
> On a side note, I could just trade my UD3H for an extreme6 (since the extreme6 is $109 right now.. or is it extreme7, or 8, whatever, i do know the extreme4 is bad but the extreme6 or whatever is a high quality board and massive step up whereas the ud5h is not a massive step up from the ud3h, at least as i understand it). The one con with the ud5h though, that, unlike the ud3h, is does not have a ps/2 port. kind of a turn off.
> 
> On a side note, I'm gonna be binning 2 3570ks in the coming week. As I understand the way to 'bin' - set VID to 1.55, and push multi up, boot up into windows, dont even stress test just keep doing that until no more boot into windows. Then, do it again with next chip, compare results, one chip is better than the other. I happen to be making 2 3570k builds right now (ram is taking forever to arrive from canada, by the time it arrives the parts for this other build will all have arrived, not to mention that nh-d14 mount from austria so i'll probably have a cm v6gt @$25 and a full setup before then).
> 
> Also thinking of getting that $20 msi g41 for a build that will just be a minor oc on stock voltage or so (it's for someone else who is computer illiterate, im just gonna turn a quick 4.3+ ghz and whatever). that or the ud5h for $79.... might be a bit overkill for their needs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Mate, the UD5H uses the same vrm if not better, don't worry about that...And the onboard sound is better. It's a better board hence it being the 5 and not 3 model
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean it! You even get some money so DO get it, be my guest.
> As for the binning, that procedure will work with Sandy Bridge cpus not Ivy. Try to see the lowest possible vcore needed to boot 5ghz and run superpi 1m. That's it. Keep the lowest one and delid it.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hahaha, you know, that looks like a refurbed IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I actually now that chip's owner, hersounds from XS and a local Argentina forum.
Click to expand...

so helpful. i mean getting money backs make it a no brainer, and it's not like im driving 2 hours just to trade, but rather because i need to get something else. thanks for the info on binning too, that's interesting.


----------



## _s3v3n_

Initial stress test using Nano Diamond 7. Still waiting for LM Ultra from Sidewinders.


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> For overclocking only - technically invalid copy
> 
> TinyXP_Rev09


Hey just downloaded this. I ran a Scan on it using MSE and its found something called HackTool:Win32/Cmdow.A

MSE say's its a potential threat, but since this is a played about with version of XP for benching I wasn't sure if its cool or not?

Any help appreciated matey.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I can aida 64 that 5ghz but can't ibt it with the temps. atleast the temps are somewhat close to each other. I can get 4.5 at 1.2 vcore (still a dirty OC) but its dead on stable. Might play with it more this afternoon and see what I can get from it.
> 
> So far though a solid chip really. 4.7 at 1.23 vcore then 4.8 at right around 1.32 depends really. Then 4.9 at 1.4 area then 5ghz at that 1.43 but it doesn't like BCLK that much.


congrats your chip is my chips twin. everything you decribed is my chip dead on.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Hey just downloaded this. I ran a Scan on it using MSE and its found something called HackTool:Win32/Cmdow.A
> 
> MSE say's its a potential threat, but since this is a played about with version of XP for benching I wasn't sure if its cool or not?
> 
> Any help appreciated matey.


Ill tell you if its safe or not... Give me a few mins to download

Edit:
2/35 is on okay ratio... still raises from flags.
https://www.virustotal.com/url/7f2517b3e4e9ea895175bfe8a3696aba519c1f286bd06df6d5ec0a61296875d4/analysis/1359226296/


----------



## IronDoq

Just looking back here on the front page I noticed I still haven't been added, maybe my post got buried?

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/4840#post_18783911

Thanks...


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronDoq*
> 
> Just looking back here on the front page I noticed I still haven't been added, maybe my post got buried?
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/4840#post_18783911
> 
> Thanks...


Got you added *Irondoq*. We are sorry about that and congrats!


----------



## chann3l

Dammit!!! I wish my ultra would get here isntantly. The as5 only lets me get to 4.8. I had 4.9 and in prime 95 hottest core hits 90. I ran IBT on standard and it had hottest core of 90 and than I got a 98 degree spike had to stop the test lol



I was at 1.4 in the bios cpuz read slightly off. On the bright side I have dropped my 4.6 from 1.275v to 1.27 and its still perfectly stable


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Dammit!!! I wish my ultra would get here isntantly. The as5 only lets me get to 4.8. I had 4.9 and in prime 95 hottest core hits 90. I ran IBT on standard and it had hottest core of 90 and than I got a 98 degree spike had to stop the test lol
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was at 1.4 in the bios cpuz read slightly off. On the bright side I have dropped my 4.6 from 1.275v to 1.27 and its still perfectly stable


good idea to stop ..lol
otherwise, looks very nice


----------



## King4x4

Just installed Windows 8 on my Hydra... pray for my soul lads...


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> good idea to stop ..lol
> otherwise, looks very nice


Ya I hadn't actually seen the 98 on the readings so it must have been for a plot second cause all of sudden maximums had a 98 in there lol. It just bugs be because im on custom water and delidded with as5 at 4.6 ibt max stress I dont break past the mid seventies. Oh no go to 4.9 and im in the danger zone. Although im proud my chip and mpower board can at least get me stable at 4.9. Just have to wait for my clu.


----------



## chann3l

Very strange. Something is not right with that AS5 on the die. It shouldn't experience punp out after 3 days should it? I have pics below of my tests and you'll see what i'm talking about

These are my max temps pre delid with IBT at 4.6 and 1.275 volts

AS5 on the die day one temps same voltage same test

AS5 on the die day 3. Voltage drop from 1.275 to 1.27. Temps have gone up almost to my predelid temps

I'm very confused here as the temps should go down with AS5's break in period. I did a proper apply of TIM both on the die and on my Ihs where the water block sits.









pre delid to day 3 delid temp difference order from left to right 1,2,3,6
pre delid to day 1 temp difference left to right is 9,8,5,8

Also i'm not even sure if the slight drop in voltage is actually holding that 1,2,3,6 temp difference although I ran IBT prior to the voltage drop with the same results.

***!!!!


----------



## megawatz

my AS5 didn't do much either. I have MAYBE a 5c decrease after delidding on Air.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ok, got back from my 670 ftw's new owner's house. Got the monies and a happy customer








I oced his cpu to 4.5 and tested stability briefly with cinebench, 3dm11 and far cry 3, and some Black Mesa. And left him my 670 clocked at 1293mhz core and stock ram with 100% power target. It performed really close to his former Msi 680 twin froz card which he's gonna sell now and get a pair of ssd's and noctua fans.








He was amazed with the gpu temps, mine overclocked had 10c less under 100% load vs his former twin frozr card!!! (mine's an EVGA ref card). I told him it was because of my Liquid Ultra application on die and he wanted to know where to order some in case he goes for a sli setup.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> my AS5 didn't do much either. I have MAYBE a 5c decrease after delidding on Air.


Ya but it shouldn't go up after its gone down like that unless the pump out effect on AS5 comes faster than its 200hr break in period...I just want my damn ultra to get here from europe. Then hopefully it'll drop significantly. Not sure if i'll need to lap the underside of my ihs with that stuff tho or even how to go about doing that if it is recommended


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> congrats your chip is my chips twin. everything you decribed is my chip dead on.


Yeah? gonna really see what this thing can do this afternoon. time for my lovely -10C idles from outside air lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Got you added *Irondoq*. We are sorry about that and congrats!


Sorry about that! sometimes things move to quickly in here! Glad to have you!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Very strange. Something is not right with that AS5 on the die. It shouldn't experience punp out after 3 days should it? I have pics below of my tests and you'll see what i'm talking about
> 
> These are my max temps pre delid with IBT at 4.6 and 1.275 volts
> 
> AS5 on the die day one temps same voltage same test
> 
> AS5 on the die day 3. Voltage drop from 1.275 to 1.27. Temps have gone up almost to my predelid temps
> 
> I'm very confused here as the temps should go down with AS5's break in period. I did a proper apply of TIM both on the die and on my Ihs where the water block sits.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pre delid to day 3 delid temp difference order from left to right 1,2,3,6
> pre delid to day 1 temp difference left to right is 9,8,5,8
> 
> Also i'm not even sure if the slight drop in voltage is actually holding that 1,2,3,6 temp difference although I ran IBT prior to the voltage drop with the same results.
> 
> ***!!!!


I've experienced pump out just after a day with my original crappy paste seriously didnt last longer than 8 hours and temps rose 10C. just wait for the CL stuff and wait to be amazed.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ok, got back from my 670 ftw's new owner's house. Got the monies and a happy customer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I oced his cpu to 4.5 and tested stability briefly with cinebench, 3dm11 and far cry 3, and some Black Mesa. And left him my 670 clocked at 1293mhz core and stock ram with 100% power target. It performed really close to his former Msi 680 twin froz card which he's gonna sell now and get a pair of ssd's and noctua fans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He was amazed with the gpu temps, mine overclocked had 10c less under 100% load vs his former twin frozr card!!! (mine's an EVGA ref card). I told him it was because of my Liquid Ultra application on die and he wanted to know where to order some in case he goes for a sli setup.


Nice dude! Also what do you guys think about asking Coolaboratory sponsoring us? or giving us CL pro and ultra. I mean we only recommend it to everyone we see lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Post 10,000. Nice job guys! Lets keep this pl;ace like it is and provide as much info to everyone that we can!

I truly didn't see this thread exploding like it did, very happy to have all the knowledge we have in here and the people that we have.

Proud of you all!









Truly,
Valgaur


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ok, got back from my 670 ftw's new owner's house. Got the monies and a happy customer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I oced his cpu to 4.5 and tested stability briefly with cinebench, 3dm11 and far cry 3, and some Black Mesa. And left him my 670 clocked at 1293mhz core and stock ram with 100% power target. It performed really close to his former Msi 680 twin froz card which he's gonna sell now and get a pair of ssd's and noctua fans.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He was amazed with the gpu temps, mine overclocked had 10c less under 100% load vs his former twin frozr card!!! (mine's an EVGA ref card). I told him it was because of my Liquid Ultra application on die and he wanted to know where to order some in case he goes for a sli setup.


hmmm i have a msi twin frozr 3 7950 at 1000 clock and 1300 mem and under full load it doesnt go over 54 degrees....Maybe when my ultra gets here ill see how much lower it will take it. Don't feel like adding it into my loop as of yet. I only have an ex 240 rad in my 500r and am getting an extra 120 for the rear soon but thats just for good measure on my cpu coooling and there are no other good spots for another rad. Can't put a 240 in the fron because it would just run hot air through the top rad defeating the purpose


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Post 10,000. Nice job guys! Lets keep this pl;ace like it is and provide as much info to everyone that we can!
> 
> I truly didn't see this thread exploding like it did, very happy to have all the knowledge we have in here and the people that we have.
> 
> Proud of you all!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur


Very happy this theread exists and for eveyone like you who got me through my delidding process. Now I can share what i've learned to others


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Very happy this theread exists and for eveyone like you who got me through my delidding process. Now I can share what i've learned to others


more than happy to have helped you! Now... time to OC this pretty lady Athena (name for her)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Very happy this theread exists and for eveyone like you who got me through my delidding process. Now I can share what i've learned to others
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> more than happy to have helped you! Now... time to OC this pretty lady Athena (name for her)
Click to expand...

Venus and Athena?







I see now Val...

Well, $80 down the tube. I just failed my drivers test...







Sad day to be me...


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Venus and Athena?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see now Val...
> 
> Well, $80 down the tube. I just failed my drivers test...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sad day to be me...


Damn your test is 5 dollars more than mine was up here 7 years ago lol. Although mine was 75 and then 25 if you pass and when you fail good buy 75 bucks


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Venus and Athena?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see now Val...
> 
> Well, $80 down the tube. I just failed my drivers test...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sad day to be me...
> 
> 
> 
> Damn your test is 5 dollars more than mine was up here 7 years ago lol. Although mine was 75 and then 25 if you pass and when you fail good buy 75 bucks
Click to expand...

Yea, I have to pay for it again. I have another test on Monday, I hope I pass! UGH!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I have to pay for it again. I have another test on Monday, I hope I pass! UGH!


Good luck


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Venus and Athena?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see now Val...
> 
> Well, $80 down the tube. I just failed my drivers test...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sad day to be me...


Roman goddesses sent from above lol. And good luck on the next one! read up son!


----------



## chann3l

MY 3d mark score with cpu at 4.6 if anyone is interested

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5709941


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I got Skype PM and I'll IM
> 
> Also....
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2667923
> 
> very dirty OC by the way.


Overclocks the same as my current delid chip. Probably won't break any records, but you could have done worse!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i was wondering about that FtW,
> is it hard to do a hardmod for the voltage,
> my 7970 seems to be hardware locked..
> max i can get it to is 1100/1500
> 
> was thinking about it, but got no clue yet on the how to..
> can you give me some pointers, or a link ?


Here's a pic of mine, used a 10K VR & this link has better pictures of the mod points. http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1553









Careful with the voltage, in last years MOA most were running 1.5 - 1.7V with the gpu frozen & quite a few people blew the bottom phase, that one gets toasty. Full cover water should be better for the VRMs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Hey just downloaded this. I ran a Scan on it using MSE and its found something called HackTool:Win32/Cmdow.A
> 
> MSE say's its a potential threat, but since this is a played about with version of XP for benching I wasn't sure if its cool or not?
> 
> Any help appreciated matey.


I've never checked any of them, never have a virus prog installed... When benching XP I've never had a rig connected to the net, or saved anything important on the drive though. I haven't had warnings about the screens or validation files I save on the flash drive.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> MY 3d mark score with cpu at 4.6 if anyone is interested
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5709941


Not bad, what you running the memory at? The physics score can still go up!


----------



## Matt26LFC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've never checked any of them, never have a virus prog installed... When benching XP I've never had a rig connected to the net, or saved anything important on the drive though. I haven't had warnings about the screens or validation files I save on the flash drive.


Cheers fella, I'll be putting XP on a spare drive eventually for a benching only rig anyway, no network connection or anything either for it, no real need.

For now I'll just burn the ISO to a CD, I'm sure it'll be safe to leave the original ISO on my little NAS drive.

Oh BTW guys, I'll be putting Liquid Pro on my Die 2morrow so hopefully I can improve upon the 15C drop in temps I have seen with Phoyba HeGrease and then I can get back to doing some Overclocking with this chip


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> MY 3d mark score with cpu at 4.6 if anyone is interested
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5709941


5.2 3570k 10000 cpu score








http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5552910


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Lapped and CLP'd my chip. Lots o pics!
> 
> I wont know what my chip ends up doing until maybe sunday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Dude, that's an amazingly clean pcb, what did you used to get all the glue off? I used my fingernails and accidently smashed the pcb a little, almost cried lol, but when I checked it worked I didn't want to keep scratching the glue.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 5.2 3570k 10000 cpu score
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5552910


Well you have me beat on everything but the combined and physics scores. Nicely done








For some reason it doesn't display my gpu ccore clock and mem clock correctly. It shows it as the idle clocks. But it is actually at 1000 on core and 1300 on mem


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> For overclocking only - technically invalid copy
> 
> TinyXP_Rev09
> 
> 
> 
> Hey just downloaded this. I ran a Scan on it using MSE and its found something called HackTool:Win32/Cmdow.A
> 
> MSE say's its a potential threat, but since this is a played about with version of XP for benching I wasn't sure if its cool or not?
> 
> Any help appreciated matey.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Cmdow.A is a hacking tool. Though these programs are legitimate and useful tools when they are appropriately used, a hacker could take advantage of them in order to carry out malicious actions.
> 
> Cmdow.A is a command line utility that does not need to be installed.
> 
> Cmdow.A allows several actions to be carried out on existing windows. It can move, resize and rename them. It can also hide or unhide, disable or enable, minimimize, maximize or restore, close or end them.
> 
> Additionally, although Cmdow.A only functions on Windows 2003/XP/2000/NT, when it is used on autorun CDs, it will also function on Windows ME/98/95 computers.
> 
> Cmdow.A does not pose a risk by itself, but it can be used to prevent the user from viewing the windows which are being opened, due to programs that are being run or installed. ...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Well you have me beat on everything but the combined and physics scores. Nicely done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For some reason it doesn't display my gpu ccore clock and mem clock correctly. It shows it as the idle clocks. But it is actually at 1000 on core and 1300 on mem












Overclock the system memory for the physics score.
Been digging for a screen & see one of your valids with memory at 1600Mhz, 2133mhz should get you around the 12k mark. The faster the better for 3dmark 11.


----------



## joker927

I don't post much but I do want to say thanks for the awesome opening post. It has great info and it's all in one place. I just upgraded from a C2Q to a 3770K and de-lidded it after only using it for a day thanks to this thread. Using a Water2.0 Pro, 3.9ghz load temps (stock) dropped from 65C to 50C with Liquid Ultra on all contact points. I'm still working on my final OC (~4.9Ghz) and I'm sure my temps would be a lot higher if it weren't for delidding.

Thanks


Spoiler: Pics or it didn't happen



Poked through the top green layer twice put all was good.


Iphone reflection from Liquid Ultra


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 5.2 3570k 10000 cpu score
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5552910


Nice i only needed 5GHz for 10k Plus in Physics hehe
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5573768


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Overclock the system memory for the physics score.
> Been digging for a screen & see one of your valids with memory at 1600Mhz, 2133mhz should get you around the 12k mark. The faster the better for 3dmark 11.


Nice thanks for the tip


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I have to pay for it again. I have another test on Monday, I hope I pass! UGH!
> 
> 
> 
> Good luck
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Venus and Athena?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see now Val...
> 
> Well, $80 down the tube. I just failed my drivers test...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sad day to be me...
> 
> 
> 
> Roman goddesses sent from above lol. And good luck on the next one! read up son!
Click to expand...

Thanks.







What I don't understand is, there are some instructors that want you to follow the flow of the road rather than the speed limit. It always confuses me. I will drive a maximum of 30 and at every point I'll make a complete stop.


----------



## teamrushpntball

So just got done spending all afternoon thinking I had failed at delidding, or that something just wasn't working.

I made the arrogant error of new GPU (Which I did ensure was working), Crossfire for the first time, tossing a water block on the new gpu, waterblock on the new Maximus V Formula and booting.

I had delidded earlier this week and tested it was working but all of a sudden, BAM, no dice. Keep getting random post errors. So I mess with my memory, pull and re seat the cpu, pull 1 then the other gpu. Nothing at all. Then I actually notice the screen says something weird, "USB Device Over Current Status Detected."

So yeah, spent 6-7 hours messing with everything else when all it was was a front panel header shorting. Kinda feel like an idiot.









I'll have all my temp and membership info in a few hours or so.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Overclock the system memory for the physics score.
> Been digging for a screen & see one of your valids with memory at 1600Mhz, 2133mhz should get you around the 12k mark. The faster the better for 3dmark 11.


One question tho xmp profile doesn't do anything it just. Sets my dhx pro dominators from 1066 to 1600 which they are supposed to be 1600 stock should I leave xmp on and set frequency up manually I have msi mpower board


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Nice i only needed 5GHz for 10k Plus in Physics hehe
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5573768


nice whats your mem oc'd to


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> One question tho xmp profile doesn't do anything it just. Sets my dhx pro dominators from 1066 to 1600 which they are supposed to be 1600 stock should I leave xmp on and set frequency up manually I have msi mpower board


If it is a 1600Mhz kit xmp will only set 1600Mhz, they would have to be overclocked in the bios without xmp. Hard to say what the sticks can do, corsair 1600Mhz can have any ICs. What is the rev. # on them? The Mpower is good with most memory, it doesn't like the low profile samsung very much though (2133 - 2200Mhz max).

There is normally some trial & error when overclocking memory, you can set 1.65V & keep upping the mem multi to see where it gets into windows with some stability (superpi 32m is a fairly quick test of mem stability, if it passes most benchies at least should work, true stability can take more work).
You might have top loosen off the timings as you go.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If it is a 1600Mhz kit xmp will only set 1600Mhz, they would have to be overclocked in the bios without xmp. Hard to say what the sticks can do, corsair 1600Mhz can have any ICs. What is the rev. # on them? The Mpower is good with most memory, it doesn't like the low profile samsung very much though (2133 - 2200Mhz max).
> 
> There is normally some trial & error when overclocking memory, you can set 1.65V & keep upping the mem multi to see where it gets into windows with some stability (superpi 32m is a fairly quick test of mem stability, if it passes most benchies at least should work, true stability can take more work).
> You might have top loosen off the timings as you go.


Ok so disable xmp and up the frequency and voltage? Also when loosening the timings would 11 11 11 24 work? Sorry I haven't much experience ocing memory only cpus and gpus lol


----------



## FtW 420

That is it, for timings just to find the max mem multi it will work with try 11-11-11 28, should be OK for a few multi, after 2133 multi might need looser tRCD & tRP, like 11-12-12.

After getting a higher speed then timings can get tightened.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is it, for timings just to find the max mem multi it will work with try 11-11-11 28, should be OK for a few multi, after 2133 multi might need looser tRCD & tRP, like 11-12-12.
> 
> After getting a higher speed then timings can get tightened.


Ok so if I set timings to 11 11 11 28 and get up to say 2133 I can then start tightening timings and test for stability as I tighten them?


----------



## FtW 420

Yep. Can you see the rev. # on the module sticker in the rig? That tells which brand ICs are in it, can make it easier to have an idea of what they might be capable of.
Under the barcode, something like '1600Mhz 7-8-7-20 1.6V ver7.1'


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yep. Can you see the rev. # on the module sticker in the rig? That tells which brand ICs are in it, can make it easier to have an idea of what they might be capable of.
> Under the barcode, something like '1600Mhz 7-8-7-20 1.6V ver7.1'


Ok it days 1600 99924 1.65v ver 2.12 im at 2133 in windows no problems with voltage at 1.64 the next step up is 1.655. My timings are still on auto and it pushed them in cpuz to 12 12 12 32


----------



## FtW 420

Elpida ICs, I think ver2.12 would be elpida BASE for ICs, I have none of those, will have to look up how they do for timings at that speed.


----------



## lilchronic

i just treid 2600mhz @1.7v on my trrident x 2400mhz 2x4gb kit and i didnt work


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Elpida ICs, I think ver2.12 would be elpida BASE for ICs, I have none of those, will have to look up how they do for timings at that speed.


Thanks I would appreciate that I have to figure out how to change timings on the mpower when I set it to manual it doesn't let me change them and it puts it at 7 7 7 20 and of course those are waaay to tight to boot. I must be missing something. When I click on the seven to change it my only option is 1 lol males no sense


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Thanks I would appreciate that I have to figure out how to change timings on the mpower when I set it to manual it doesn't let me change them and it puts it at 7 7 7 20 and of course those are waaay to tight to boot. I must be missing something. When I click on the seven to change it my only option is 1 lol males no sense


For manual you have to select link or unlink to get access to the advanced timings. Use link, that sets the timings for all the dimms together.
Reading a bit ver.2.12 can be any of several different elpida ICs, some are better than others. Good read here by sam (he knows his memory) http://www.ocxtreme.org/forumenus/showthread.php?t=6362


----------



## Valgaur

Hmm can't get my 2133 gskills to 2400 at 8 8 8 24 even at 1.7 volts and VCCIO and VCCSA at 1.1

Going for 4.5 Ghz at 1.2vcore


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hmm can't get my 2133 gskills to 2400 at 8 8 8 24 even at 1.7 volts and VCCIO and VCCSA at 1.1
> 
> Going for 4.5 Ghz at 1.2vcore


Being a bit too ambitious with the timings. A kit that does 2400Mhz 8-8-8 24 is like finding the 8Ghz 3770k.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I think Vagaur, you should add my video to the OP - of "how to de-lid using Nerf gun"


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Being a bit too ambitious with the timings. A kit that does 2400Mhz 8-8-8 24 is like finding the 8Ghz 3770k.


Ill try 9 9 9
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I think Vagaur, you should add my video to the OP - of "how to de-lid using Nerf gun"


Lol I did watch that and..... again use a lighter.. its soldered lol.


----------



## FtW 420

For 2400Mhz probably need that tRCD looser yet. 9-11-11, 9-12-12, 10-12-12 area. If it works, try tightening up the tRP a bit (9-11-10, etc).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For 2400Mhz probably need that tRCD looser yet. 9-11-11, 9-12-12, 10-12-12 area. If it works, try tightening up the tRP a bit (9-11-10, etc).


The volts are good though right? Ill try that as well


----------



## VonDutch

[Official] Delidded Ivy Bridge Club - *Page 1000*

Gratz everyone who made this a great thread
















we are moving so fast, it looks like this whole thread is oced!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> [Official] Delidded Ivy Bridge Club - *Page 1000*
> 
> Gratz everyone who made this a great thread


It's been great so far.







Everyone has been contributing so much that we get around 1k posts a week!

Also, Valgaur, I keep going to Intel CPU and looking for people needing help on overclocking. Seems like you're going on my turf.







Wanna start a turf war? I believe Venus will kick Athena's @**


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Here's a pic of mine, used a 10K VR & this link has better pictures of the mod points. http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1553
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Careful with the voltage, in last years MOA most were running 1.5 - 1.7V with the gpu frozen & quite a few people blew the bottom phase, that one gets toasty. Full cover water should be better for the VRMs.


that doesnt look so hard, im not very good at soldering, but i think i can do this,
thanks alot FtW








not gonna use that high voltage, maybe 1.25V, just want to have it run 1200/1600
instead of 1100/1500 oc with the (locked) stock voltage


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> ...YouTube vid comparing *CL Ultra, CL Pro and Arctic MX4*


...Hi Guys - ...was just about to swap in the Maximus V E when I did some YouTube browsing to confirm TIM methods (line, peas, credit card, Hi5,) and came across this vid (in foreign language, but a pic = 1000 words +) that compares C L Ultra with C L Pro and Arctic MX4...interesting results







, though I am not sure he has the perfect 'TIM application method', especially for C L


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...YouTube vid comparing *CL Ultra, CL Pro and Arctic MX4*
> 
> 
> 
> ...Hi Guys - ...was just about to swap in the Maximus V E when I did some YouTube browsing to confirm TIM methods (line, peas, credit card, Hi5,) and came across this vid (in foreign language, but a pic = 1000 words +) that compares C L Ultra with C L Pro and Arctic MX4...interesting results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , though I am not sure he has the perfect 'TIM application method', especially for C L
Click to expand...

PORTUGUESE! Well, I don't even want to bother acknowledging the information as the TIM application for the CLP/CLU are crap. I mean utter crap. He didn't spread it completely and he let it glob up in the middle...


----------



## Joa3d43

...I did notice that on his final test (C L Pro), while the lowest overall, it also did have the highest variance between cores, suggesting perhaps an air bubble or s.th.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I did notice that on his final test (C L Pro), while the lowest overall, it also did have the highest variance between cores, suggesting perhaps an air bubble or s.th.


i only watched his application of ultra, then i already knew thats not gonna work right ..lol


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> hmmm i have a msi twin frozr 3 7950 at 1000 clock and 1300 mem and under full load it doesnt go over 54 degrees....Maybe when my ultra gets here ill see how much lower it will take it. Don't feel like adding it into my loop as of yet. I only have an ex 240 rad in my 500r and am getting an extra 120 for the rear soon but thats just for good measure on my cpu coooling and there are no other good spots for another rad. Can't put a 240 in the fron because it would just run hot air through the top rad defeating the purpose


I would be interested in how much difference it makes. I tried it on one of my 7970's under a EK gpu block. Max temp @ 1.3 v with mx4 was 50 after an hour of gaming . After tearing down the loop and using CLP on gpu die the max temp is still the same .


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> that doesnt look so hard, im not very good at soldering, but i think i can do this,
> thanks alot FtW
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not gonna use that high voltage, maybe 1.25V, just want to have it run 1200/1600
> instead of 1100/1500 oc with the (locked) stock voltage


Looking at my scores from when I did that are kinda funny. At the time with 1560 core on the 7970 & 2600k at at 5880Mhz they were like top 10 scores, now I can beat it with cpu & gpu both on air. Drivers have come a long way.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i only watched his application of ultra, then i already knew thats not gonna work right ..lol


He does something right though, that's this guy http://www.hwbot.org/user/faster/
Does better with water than some guys do with more extreme cooling. The applications do look a bit funny, I just used the brush for the ultra & most don't spread normal TIM.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I would be interested in how much difference it makes. I tried it on one of my 7970's under a EK gpu block. Max temp @ 1.3 v with mx4 was 50 after an hour of gaming . After tearing down the loop and using CLP on gpu die the max temp is still the same .


i put ultra on my 670FTW air cooled and dropped 6c. i thought it probably would drop more under water... maybe ??


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For manual you have to select link or unlink to get access to the advanced timings. Use link, that sets the timings for all the dimms together.
> Reading a bit ver.2.12 can be any of several different elpida ICs, some are better than others. Good read here by sam (he knows his memory) http://www.ocxtreme.org/forumenus/showthread.php?t=6362


tha ks a lit for the help plus rep to you. I'll report back in a few days when I have more time to get the timings perfect let you know what I came out with.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking at my scores from when I did that are kinda funny. At the time with 1560 core on the 7970 & 2600k at at 5880Mhz they were like top 10 scores, now I can beat it with cpu & gpu both on air. Drivers have come a long way.
> He does something right though, that's this guy http://www.hwbot.org/user/faster/
> Does better with water than some guys do with more extreme cooling. The applications do look a bit funny, I just used the brush for the ultra & most don't spread normal TIM.


yea, gpu drivers can do alot, that ive learned so far..

o, this is my result with my daily oc, 1600mhz ram, and the 1100/1500 gpu oc,
saw you mention something about ram, so faster ram will get my score up,
you think i can hit 11000 points?
wonder how it will look if i do that voltage mod on my 7970,
bit nervous to do it tho, its a 350 euro card, even cost me more then my 3770K ..lol


with normal tim, i use whats sad in the manufactor manuals,
liquid takes a bit more work to apply the right way, coollabs has some vid's that show how,
i apply thin layers (liquid pro) on all sides, worked very well for me, i dont mind if it takes a bit longer to apply,
peeps sometimes forget that after you apply, its gonna be under there for months,
so why not take your time and do it right


----------



## Faelore

I hit 4.8 ghz at 1.33v but about 1 hour into prime my temps went from 79-85c(on 1 core) to 94c(on that same core) then about 90 minutes later that same core jumped to 102c while the others sat around 88c


----------



## teamrushpntball

Ok, here's my entry into this club









OCN Name: Teamrushpntball
CPU: I7-3770K
On die TIM: Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: Liquid Pro
Mhz Gain: 0 so far, still running my temperature comparison
OC after delid: 4.7ghz (So I have a comparison to before, don;t worry it'll go much higher)
Temp Drops: 18*C (Used 1.384v at 4.7 ghz both before and after, ran Prime95 2 hours running custom blend using 90% memory)
CPUz Validation: Linky

And here she is stripped nekked:



Well temp comparison is done, time for MOAR MHZES!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> I hit 4.8 ghz at 1.33v but about 1 hour into prime my temps went from 79-85c(on 1 core) to 94c(on that same core) then about 90 minutes later that same core jumped to 102c while the others sat around 88c


looks a bit high to me, same wtih the difference between the cores, like 14-15C ?
at least stay under 90C with stress testing..80-85C is better, i dont mind when a core only spikes to 90C orso


----------



## Faelore

I am not delided yet thats probably why its so high. Vcore wise is 1.33 good for 4.8? if not Im a just throttle it back down to 4.4 where highest temp hit was 60c after 24 hours of prime and 1.2v core


----------



## chann3l

There got my dominators to 2133 with 9 11 9 24 stable I'll post validation later


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Ok, here's my entry into this club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN Name: Teamrushpntball
> CPU: I7-3770K
> On die TIM: Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: Liquid Pro
> Mhz Gain: 0 so far, still running my temperature comparison
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz (So I have a comparison to before, don;t worry it'll go much higher)
> Temp Drops: 18*C (Used 1.384v at 4.7 ghz both before and after, ran Prime95 2 hours running custom blend using 90% memory)
> CPUz Validation: Linky
> 
> And here she is stripped nekked:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well temp comparison is done, time for MOAR MHZES!!


looks good to me Teamrushpntball








in the words of our famous Captain,

"You sir are in!!!! Slap that sig on!"


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> I am not delided yet thats probably why its so high. Vcore wise is 1.33 good for 4.8? if not Im a just throttle it back down to 4.4 where highest temp hit was 60c after 24 hours of prime and 1.2v core


how bout 4.7ghz or 4.6ghz, dont think you need to go all the way back to 4.4ghz,
your 1.33V vcore looks very nice for 4.8ghz, mine needs 1.420V..
yea, after delid, my temp difference on cores went from about 15C to 4-6C


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> Dude, that's an amazingly clean pcb, what did you used to get all the glue off? I used my fingernails and accidently smashed the pcb a little, almost cried lol, but when I checked it worked I didn't want to keep scratching the glue.


Just pure rubbing alcohol and a buffing wheel on my dremel. Thanks.


----------



## Valgaur

Finally my internet works!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Finally my internet works!!!


Now it is time to get a new case!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Now it is time to get a new case!


yeah lol. more like time to game on this new chip.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, gpu drivers can do alot, that ive learned so far..
> 
> o, this is my result with my daily oc, 1600mhz ram, and the 1100/1500 gpu oc,
> saw you mention something about ram, so faster ram will get my score up,
> you think i can hit 11000 points?
> wonder how it will look if i do that voltage mod on my 7970,
> bit nervous to do it tho, its a 350 euro card, even cost me more then my 3770K ..lol
> 
> 
> with normal tim, i use whats sad in the manufactor manuals,
> liquid takes a bit more work to apply the right way, coollabs has some vid's that show how,
> i apply thin layers (liquid pro) on all sides, worked very well for me, i dont mind if it takes a bit longer to apply,
> peeps sometimes forget that after you apply, its gonna be under there for months,
> so why not take your time and do it right


11k is doable. You should be able to get the physics score up pretty good & the combined a bit as well.
I have the 3930k & 7970 out in the garage for water cooled scores tonight, only supposed to get to 1 or 2° above 0, but better than room temp.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yeah lol. more like time to game on this new chip.


I get more fun out of building something nobody has done yet much more then gaming XD



Who else has a 250ML frozenQ res extended above there MB like that it is a OCN first!!! due to my Case having 9 inches above the MB tray !! lmao

VS the pure fail 50mm of the cosmos 2 =/



2 Inches XD


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Now it is time to get a new case!
> 
> 
> 
> yeah lol. more like time to game on this new chip.
Click to expand...

While your internet was down, you should've been busy OCing that chip!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> While your internet was down, you should've been busy OCing that chip!


waiting a bit on it letting the chi[ get used to me... then time to break the 1.5 vcore barrier I almost had 5.1 under 1.5 gonna play with it more tomorrow.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> While your internet was down, you should've been busy OCing that chip!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waiting a bit on it letting the chi[ get used to me... then time to break the 1.5 vcore barrier I almost had 5.1 under 1.5 gonna play with it more tomorrow.
Click to expand...

I take mine out for a drink so it doesn't b*tch and complain. Lol!







Good luck with the overvolting though, I'd recommend putting all the DIGI+ settings to max so it won't BSOD on you just because the temps get high!


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Faelore*
> 
> I am not delided yet thats probably why its so high. Vcore wise is 1.33 good for 4.8? if not Im a just throttle it back down to 4.4 where highest temp hit was 60c after 24 hours of prime and 1.2v core


I think 1.33v is good for 4.8Ghz....I spent all morning working on my 4.8Ghz OC and I too got high temps (the main reason i'm considering delidding







and ordering CLLU). I finally got it stable and my vcore was 1.352-1.360v. I ran Prime95 for about 2 hours.


----------



## shremi

I really want to start binning chips .... this one got stuck @4.9









What are the chances that in 5 chips one would be 5.0 stable ?????


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> I really want to start binning chips .... this one got stuck @4.9
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What are the chances that in 5 chips one would be 5.0 stable ?????


Considering most of the recent chips/batches are performing really bad, I'd say maybe in a 1/10 chance so you have a 10% chance to get one that will do 5.0 stable... Yea it sucks but that's how it works.


----------



## shremi

does anybody leave near a MC ????? I can offer some good moneys for buying me this chips


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> does anybody leave near a MC ????? I can offer some good moneys for buying me this chips


I do but I honestly don't have enough money to buy things right now.







Sorry, maybe one of the others can help! What are you looking for? A personal chip or for binning purposes?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Elpida ICs, I think ver2.12 would be elpida BASE for ICs, I have none of those, will have to look up how they do for timings at that speed.


They clock similarly to hypers but slower mhz...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Being a bit too ambitious with the timings. A kit that does 2400Mhz 8-8-8 24 is like finding the 8Ghz 3770k.


Val is nuts and doesn't listen to me at all...those are friggin psc man! Not hypers DUH! Try 8-11-8-28-1t with 1.75v dude...


----------



## glina

Please add me 

OCN name: Glina
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: 400 MHz
OC after delid: 4840 MHz
Temp drops: 22C
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

Delidded my 3770k. I also lapped down the IHS (180 / 400 / 800 grit) - it was very concave, and give a grit 800 finish to my Coolermaster 412S.

I was running 4.32GHZ @ 1.18V and peak IBT temps were up in the 86-89C. My OC was temperature limited as I was not comfortable going higher with voltage.
Now running 4.63 @ 1.25V and peak IBT temps are 72C. Tested in IBT, Farcry 3 and 12h prime stable.
New max o/c achieved 4.84 @ 1.34V, IBT stable and <80C. I think my mobo is no good for any higher clocks.


----------



## King4x4

I was happy with getting 9-9-9-24 2133mhz on my Samsungs lol.

It seems no matter what 4.9ghz is the highest my chip can go daily with 1.47v and requires 1.58v for 5ghz.

Stable [email protected] is better for daily use.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> Please add me
> 
> OCN name: Glina
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: 400 MHz
> OC after delid: 4840 MHz
> Temp drops: 22C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> Delidded my 3770k. I also lapped down the IHS (180 / 400 / 800 grit) - it was very concave, and give a grit 800 finish to my Coolermaster 412S.
> 
> I was running 4.32GHZ @ 1.18V and peak IBT temps were up in the 86-89C. My OC was temperature limited as I was not comfortable going higher with voltage.
> Now running 4.63 @ 1.25V and peak IBT temps are 72C. Tested in IBT, Farcry 3 and 12h prime stable.
> New max o/c achieved 4.84 @ 1.34V, IBT stable and <80C. I think my mobo is no good for any higher clocks.


You need pictures...


----------



## glina

Would that work?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For the physics score, are you using 3d11 version 1.01? The physics does a bit better.


Using 1.0.3 Newest one that is posted at Tehcpowerup.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> Would that work?


Do you have pictures of the delidded CPU?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Ok, here's my entry into this club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN Name: Teamrushpntball
> CPU: I7-3770K
> On die TIM: Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: Liquid Pro
> Mhz Gain: 0 so far, still running my temperature comparison
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz (So I have a comparison to before, don;t worry it'll go much higher)
> Temp Drops: 18*C (Used 1.384v at 4.7 ghz both before and after, ran Prime95 2 hours running custom blend using 90% memory)
> CPUz Validation: Linky
> 
> And here she is stripped nekked:
> 
> 
> 
> Well temp comparison is done, time for MOAR MHZES!!


Your in! Now slap that Sig on!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> Please add me
> 
> OCN name: Glina
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: 400 MHz
> OC after delid: 4840 MHz
> Temp drops: 22C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> Delidded my 3770k. I also lapped down the IHS (180 / 400 / 800 grit) - it was very concave, and give a grit 800 finish to my Coolermaster 412S.
> 
> I was running 4.32GHZ @ 1.18V and peak IBT temps were up in the 86-89C. My OC was temperature limited as I was not comfortable going higher with voltage.
> Now running 4.63 @ 1.25V and peak IBT temps are 72C. Tested in IBT, Farcry 3 and 12h prime stable.
> New max o/c achieved 4.84 @ 1.34V, IBT stable and <80C. I think my mobo is no good for any higher clocks.


Your in! Now slap that Sig on!!!









I need you CPUZ also. the validation.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Ok, here's my entry into this club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN Name: Teamrushpntball
> CPU: I7-3770K
> On die TIM: Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: Liquid Pro
> Mhz Gain: 0 so far, still running my temperature comparison
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz (So I have a comparison to before, don;t worry it'll go much higher)
> Temp Drops: 18*C (Used 1.384v at 4.7 ghz both before and after, ran Prime95 2 hours running custom blend using 90% memory)
> CPUz Validation: Linky
> 
> And here she is stripped nekked:
> 
> 
> 
> Well temp comparison is done, time for MOAR MHZES!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your in! Now slap that Sig on!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> Please add me
> 
> OCN name: Glina
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: 400 MHz
> OC after delid: 4840 MHz
> Temp drops: 22C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> Delidded my 3770k. I also lapped down the IHS (180 / 400 / 800 grit) - it was very concave, and give a grit 800 finish to my Coolermaster 412S.
> 
> I was running 4.32GHZ @ 1.18V and peak IBT temps were up in the 86-89C. My OC was temperature limited as I was not comfortable going higher with voltage.
> Now running 4.63 @ 1.25V and peak IBT temps are 72C. Tested in IBT, Farcry 3 and 12h prime stable.
> New max o/c achieved 4.84 @ 1.34V, IBT stable and <80C. I think my mobo is no good for any higher clocks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your in! Now slap that Sig on!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need you CPUZ also. the validation.
Click to expand...

I was thinking whether or not we need delidded CPU proof since you accepted that one guy without any pictures.


----------



## glina

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your in! Now slap that Sig on!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your in! Now slap that Sig on!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need you CPUZ also. the validation.


Thanks 

Here's the validation:
http://valid.canardpc.com/2669526


----------



## glina

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was thinking whether or not we need delidded CPU proof since you accepted that one guy without any pictures.


I can't show photos to prove I did it, so this will have to do:


I would hit 100C before delidding with these settings and my CPU - not that I ever tried as my safe limit was at 4.4GHz back then.


----------



## VonDutch

somehow i cant get 3DMark_11_v103 to work,
if i install, open it only crashes right away, "stopped working", funything is, if i uninstall it, it says the same "stopped working"
any ideas? wanted to do some benchingwith new settings .but prolly cant, redid the install/uninstall 3x now..











me likes the new frontpage







.


----------



## King4x4

I had the same issue.

Try the 32-bit version.

If it doesn't work.

Install the steam version.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I had the same issue.
> 
> Try the 32-bit version.
> 
> If it doesn't work.
> 
> Install the steam version.


yea, i didnt dl the steamversion, and did get the 64bit one, thanks will try both..


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> nice whats your mem oc'd to


2400MHz


----------



## Matt26LFC

Put some Liquid Pro on, doing some tests now.

This is my 3570K @ Stock - Ambient is around 19-20C (Technically not stock I've set Turbo to hit 38 across all cores at full load instead of 36 which is stock)



Next I'll do my quick dirty OC to 4.5GHz @ 1.3v and post results

I also took a couple shots of the DIE with a Macro lense, but they haven't come out too great, I'll pick the best and upload so people can see the damage. I'm not really much of a photographer at all, and I was using a D40 Body so I had no Auto focus which didn't help lol

*Shots of the DIE if I strip her down again for whatever reason I'll try again and hopefully do better.*





*Ok I've run Prime95 27.7 AVX Custom Blend (5.5GB) for a little over an hour, heres the result*



*OK temperature comparison time - All Temps are in Celsius*

Pre Delid Temps

70 - 83 - 77 - 73 (*Average across the cores was 75.75C*)

Delid with Phoyba HeGrease on DIE & IHS

55 - 66 - 62 - 57 (*Average across the cores was 60C*)

Delid with Liquid Pro on DIE - Phoyba HeGrease was used on IHS

51 - 55 - 54 - 51 (*Average across the cores was 52.75C*)

So based on Average temps that's approximately a 30.5% reduction in temps going from Pre Delid to Delid with Liquid Pro, Now that's not bad me thinks









Next job could be to replace the Phoyba HeGrease on the IHS with some Liquid Ultra see if I can shave just a couple more C's off







But first I think I need to start OC'ing again as with those temps I have way more headroom now


----------



## tzvia

Hmm, I see I hadn't posted a photo showing I had sliced and diced during the holiday break, so here it is.

Still messing with the OC though. Switched to offset vcore on my Maximus board and spent yesterday testing and am Priming now. Don't think this chip will be happy above 4.8ghz as it needs 1.423v to stop the WHEA errors. Oh well, I'm not benching (never saw the point of that) I'm gaming so I am happy with 4.8. Love that Liquid Ultra and Pro, my new fave TIMS.

Dropped about 24c total by delidding, giving me some overhead to go from 4.6ghz 1.3vcore to 4.8ghz 1.423vcore while still remaining some 15c lower. Yesss.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> Hmm, I see I hadn't posted a photo showing I had sliced and diced during the holiday break, so here it is.
> 
> Still messing with the OC though. Switched to offset vcore on my Maximus board and spent yesterday testing and am Priming now. Don't think this chip will be happy above 4.8ghz as it needs 1.423v to stop the WHEA errors. Oh well, I'm not benching (never saw the point of that) I'm gaming so I am happy with 4.8. Love that Liquid Ultra and Pro, my new fave TIMS.
> 
> Dropped about 24c total by delidding, giving me some overhead to go from 4.6ghz 1.3vcore to 4.8ghz 1.423vcore while still remaining some 15c lower. Yesss.


yea, for me its about the same, i run 4.8ghz with 1.420V vcore, with 0.160 offset








4.9ghz is a no go for me, needs 1.510-1.520V vcore, but im very happy with the 4.8ghz 24/7..lol
with low temps of course
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt26LFC*
> 
> Put some Liquid Pro on, doing some tests now.
> 
> This is my 3570K @ Stock - Ambient is around 19-20C (Technically not stock I've set Turbo to hit 38 across all cores at full load instead of 36 which is stock)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Next I'll do my quick dirty OC to 4.5GHz @ 1.3v and post results
> 
> I also took a couple shots of the DIE with a Macro lense, but they haven't come out too great, I'll pick the best and upload so people can see the damage. I'm not really much of a photographer at all, and I was using a D40 Body so I had no Auto focus which didn't help lol
> 
> *Shots of the DIE if I strip her down again for whatever reason I'll try again and hopefully do better.*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Ok I've run Prime95 27.7 AVX Custom Blend (5.5GB) for a little over an hour, heres the result*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OK temperature comparison time - All Temps are in Celsius*
> 
> Pre Delid Temps
> 
> 70 - 83 - 77 - 73 (*Average across the cores was 75.75C*)
> 
> Delid with Phoyba HeGrease on DIE & IHS
> 
> 55 - 66 - 62 - 57 (*Average across the cores was 60C*)
> 
> Delid with Liquid Pro on DIE - Phoyba HeGrease was used on IHS
> 
> 51 - 55 - 54 - 51 (*Average across the cores was 52.75C*)
> 
> So based on Average temps that's approximately a 30.5% reduction in temps going from Pre Delid to Delid with Liquid Pro, Now that's not bad me thinks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Next job could be to replace the Phoyba HeGrease on the IHS with some Liquid Ultra see if I can shave just a couple more C's off
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But first I think I need to start OC'ing again as with those temps I have way more headroom now


looks good Matt26LFC, temps good, core temp difference also..yea, time to see what your chip can do ..lol


----------



## megawatz

I tried doing an offset but wound up with BSODs. I had it set to manual at 1.32v, then ran Prime95, found my offset, set it in BIOS, and Win7 doesn't like it at all.

Any thoughts? my offset was .04


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I tried doing an offset but wound up with BSODs. I had it set to manual at 1.32v, then ran Prime95, found my offset, set it in BIOS, and Win7 doesn't like it at all.
> 
> Any thoughts? my offset was .04


finding you stable vcore for a oc, and that way your offset using the math,
doesnt always mean its right, i had a oc, and the math i did gave me 0.025V offset,
i ended up using 0.035-0.040V offset to make it run stable tho..
like with normal vcore, just up it till you good, i mean, theres no need to be afraid of high temps anymore so..lol
only high vcores now .. 1.32V vcore means you still have some room to play with to make it stable









chillin, kids are to their mum again ..laterz


----------



## megawatz

i have a stable manual vCore though. 1.32v is my stable, my VOD was 1.29v, so my offset should be .04. But when I set it, my vCore didn't even get near my 1.32v manual.


----------



## teamrushpntball

Anyone still have a link to the post in here about ideal ram overclocks? Namely the one showing which oc's would have certain performance factors?

Sorry I'm being so vague, can't remember it well enough to search for it. And this thread moves so fast I can barely keep up let alone sift through old posts.


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Anyone still have a link to the post in here about ideal ram overclocks? Namely the one showing which oc's would have certain performance factors?
> 
> Sorry I'm being so vague, can't remember it well enough to search for it. And this thread moves so fast I can barely keep up let alone sift through old posts.


Here's something I found that might help. http://www.overclock.net/t/1327143/ram-overclocking


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> i have a stable manual vCore though. 1.32v is my stable, my VOD was 1.29v, so my offset should be .04. But when I set it, my vCore didn't even get near my 1.32v manual.


hows your LLC ?

llc turbo


llc extreme


between those 2 i needed less offset, to archieve the same, i did some testing with it,
eventho they say dont use extreme llc, but it worked for me tho..
think its 75 or 100% on a asus mobo..you could try playing with those settings, and see if it works better








looks like you have to much vdroop..if you say, " didn't even get near my 1.32v manual."
then you have to compensate for it..


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hows your LLC ?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> llc turbo
> 
> 
> llc extreme
> 
> 
> 
> 
> between those 2 i needed less offset, to archieve the same, i did some testing with it,
> eventho they say dont use extreme llc, but it worked for me tho..
> think its 75 or 100% on a asus mobo..you could try playing with those settings, and see if it works better
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> looks like you have to much vdroop..if you say, " didn't even get near my 1.32v manual."
> then you have to compensate for it..


Yeah, i guess so. I'm on 75% LLC right now, not extreme. I might try extreme when I get back to my computer.


----------



## Cool Mike

Currently using CoolLab ultra on Die and Gelid GC Extreme on LID to H100i. At [email protected] 1.44V Core, two hours prime95 blend stable. Thinking of removing the Gelid and going to Ultra on the LID to H100i. Temps are currently 83C on hottest core. Adding Ultra between lid and closed loop H100i may get me to 5.1 or 5.2 Ghz if I can keep the Vcore below 1.52V. Any thoughts?

I can boot into win7 @ 5.2Ghz, but temps too hot under load. Requires 1.5V-1.52V for 5.2ghz.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cool Mike*
> 
> Currently using CoolLab ultra on Die and Gelid GC Extreme on LID to H100i. At [email protected] 1.44V Core, two hours prime95 blend stable. Thinking of removing the Gelid and going to Ultra on the LID to H100i. Temps are currently 83C on hottest core. Adding Ultra between lid and closed loop H100i may get me to 5.1 or 5.2 Ghz if I can keep the Vcore below 1.52V. Any thoughts?
> 
> I can boot into win7 @ 5.2Ghz, but temps too hot under load. Requires 1.5V-1.52V for 5.2ghz.


you can always try of coursae, but i think if you change the Gelid to Ultra, the temp difference wont be very big,
at least it wont drop enough to make your 5.2ghz run cool enough, besides the vcore you need to make it run stable
the 5ghz looks promising tho, vcore and tempwise







, would first look into that, making it stable etc..
have to test what 5.1ghz does, temp and vcore wise, to make it stable etc.. just testing, or looking for 24/7 oc?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Yeah, i guess so. I'm on 75% LLC right now, not extreme. I might try extreme when I get back to my computer.


i still dont understand why they didnt make llc with more increments, like 5% or 10%, instead of 25%,
would be much more helpful in finetuning llc..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Look for the ram guide at overclockers.com...
waiting for my chip is getting long in the tooth :/


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> waiting for my chip is getting long in the tooth :/


i bet it is..i hate waiting, any news on the arrival or?

omg, its so busy here,
" 30 Members, 186 Guests"
you guys think theres alot of potential delidders among the 186 guests? lol


----------



## chann3l

There oced my memory to 2133 at 10 11 10 28 and my physics score hit 11854








http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5720431


----------



## Vi0lence

put a dmm on my board and set my LLC. my chip is doing 4.6ghz @ an actual 1.225v on a multi meter. a fluke meter so its accurate. pretty snazzy.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> put a dmm on my board and set my LLC. my chip is doing 4.6ghz @ an actual 1.225v on a multi meter. a fluke meter so its accurate. pretty snazzy.


Thats really good I need 1.27 to be totally stable


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> put a dmm on my board and set my LLC. my chip is doing 4.6ghz @ an actual 1.225v on a multi meter. a fluke meter so its accurate. pretty snazzy.


what vcore you need for 4.7?


----------



## [CyGnus]

Need somebody to explain to me something weird.
I have my Overclock of 4.6Ghz with 1.246v (offset voltage) Now i have the offset set to +0.05v and turbo voltage +0.113v it gives me 1.23v and my CPU is rock stable (3h or prime95 and still running). How is it possible to be stable with less voltage? The only difference is that i switched offset with turbo voltage...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what vcore you need for 4.7?


to much!! ..lol

G'night boss









cant help you [CyGnus], no clue about the asrock with offset and turbo etc..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Need somebody to explain to me something weird.
> I have my Overclock of 4.6Ghz with 1.246v (offset voltage) Now i have the offset set to +0.05v and turbo voltage +0.113v it gives me 1.23v and my CPU is rock stable (3h or prime95 and still running). How is it possible to be stable with less voltage? The only difference is that i switched offset with turbo voltage...


I think it might be that when you use turbo voltage the chip will take that over the offset due to it actually using the turbo (as you set it in bios sometimes it takes your OC as the turbo) so resulting in less vcore... but I really don't know.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Those asrock boards have the weirdest vcore settings... :/

My buddy should be getting my dead *g620* soon, so he can rma it in the US. I don't have the purchase receipt and locally they ask for it .


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think it might be that when you use turbo voltage the chip will take that over the offset due to it actually using the turbo (as you set it in bios sometimes it takes your OC as the turbo) so resulting in less vcore... but I really don't know.


well no problem since its working fine with less voltage so its a plus


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what vcore you need for 4.7?


last i check was 1.284 but it may be a little different now. 1.284 was with extreme LLC and was probably more then it needed.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> last i check was 1.284 but it may be a little different now. 1.284 was with extreme LLC and was probably more then it needed.


I need about 1.28 maybe a little less for 4.7 also


----------



## Vi0lence

4.8 is a slight setp up, 4.9 is a bigger jump. 5.0 is a good size jump. 5.1 is almost impossible unless its pretty cold.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> 4.8 is a slight setp up, 4.9 is a bigger jump. 5.0 is a good size jump. 5.1 is almost impossible unless its pretty cold.


Ya 4.8 I need 1.35 and 4.9 I need 1.4 haven't gone higher than that


----------



## lilchronic

i need 1.25v for 4.8ghz


----------



## Gomi

Christian Ney from HWBOT had this chip:



It was sold on Ebay, no idea how much he got from it - My guess is ALOT.

Only took him 163 3770Ks to bin to find it, lol.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i need 1.25v for 4.8ghz


I think you need a multi meter.


----------



## chronicfx

I think a touch over 1.3v is fair estimate for 4.7 stable


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I think you need a multi meter.


it cant be that much higher with a multi reader probably .10v - .20v more


----------



## chronicfx

Last entry in Ivy stable club did 15 hours of 4.7 at 1.280v


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it cant be that much higher with a multi reader probably .10v - .20v more


Your a decimal off and still wrong lol. Mine is between .045 and .065 low in CPUZ

You really shouldn't be "estimating" if you want to run 5 or 5.1 ghz.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Your a decimal off and still wrong lol. Mine is between .045 and .065 low in CPUZ
> 
> You really shouldn't be "estimating" if you want to run 5 or 5.1 ghz.


5ghz @ 1.375 could be 1.425v with a multi reader. im good with that


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> There oced my memory to 2133 at 10 11 10 28 and my physics score hit 11854
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5720431


Nice.

What was stock speed?

Do you think running your ram at -2133mhz 9-11-10-24 1T would increase physics score?


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it cant be that much higher with a multi reader probably .10v - .20v more


cpu-z was showing me 1.28v and bios was 1.225v. yes it can read alot higher depending on LLC and so on.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> me likes the new frontpage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


It does look way cool! And I like it!










But first quick look had me wonder for a sec just what kind of performance enhancing - with the syringes and razor blade.....


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Nice.
> 
> What was stock speed?
> 
> Do you think running your ram at -2133mhz 9-11-10-24 1T would increase physics score?


Stock was 1600 gonna play with timings more later see how tight I can get them super pi 32m wouldn't run with 9 10 9 24


----------



## Swag

Ok guys, I just tested out my new AX650 with my Thermaltake Dr. Power II PSU tester and it checks out. Now all I have to do is wait for my motherboard and I'm ready to go.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good to hear Swag!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good to hear Swag!


Yup, so happy.

Does anyone know if this is only for today or lasts up till tomorrow?

http://www.corsair.com/en/professional-series-ax850-ax750-ax650-individually-sleeved-modular-cables-red.html


----------



## ivanlabrie

No clue man, I never bothered with ordering from their site cause of the expensive overseas shipping. :/ No usps love.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> No clue man, I never bothered with ordering from their site cause of the expensive overseas shipping. :/ No usps love.


Haha! Yea, but $45 is such a great price for all those cables!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha! Yea, but $45 is such a great price for all those cables!


Performance PC has them for 29$ And the bitfenix look better.


----------



## ivanlabrie

But bitfenix cables are not psu cables, rather extensions...

Hey guys, I'm gonna paint my cm 690 II. And probably cover my TY-140 frames with Vynil wrap.
Any ideas for a vinyl and white or something like that cm 690 build?
I got an MVG and black ripjaws sticks







And a Silver Arrow for the time being.
Gonna try doing a custom side window, gonna need some pointers from you guys.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> But bitfenix cables are not psu cables, rather extensions...
> 
> Hey guys, I'm gonna paint my cm 690 II. And probably cover my TY-140 frames with Vynil wrap.
> Any ideas for a vinyl and white or something like that cm 690 build?
> I got an MVG and black ripjaws sticks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And a Silver Arrow for the time being.
> Gonna try doing a custom side window, gonna need some pointers from you guys.


Yah but then do the same purpose to see the 6 inches of the cable that people see XD


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha! Yea, but $45 is such a great price for all those cables!
> 
> 
> 
> Performance PC has them for 29$ And the bitfenix look better.
Click to expand...

Link? I see them as 59.99.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Link? I see them as 59.99.


http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=specials&page=12


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Link? I see them as 59.99.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=specials&page=12
Click to expand...

Oh I thought you meant the Corsair ones. I would get the Bitfenix but they are extensions and I'm looking for the direct cables.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh I thought you meant the Corsair ones. I would get the Bitfenix but they are extensions and I'm looking for the direct cables.


I use all Extensions.. much better then the Corsair cables...

Unles u have a case where u can see the wires coming from the PSU?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh I thought you meant the Corsair ones. I would get the Bitfenix but they are extensions and I'm looking for the direct cables.
> 
> 
> 
> I use all Extensions.. much better then the Corsair cables...
> 
> Unles u have a case where u can see the wires coming from the PSU?
Click to expand...

Yea, I have a case where you can see the wires.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I have a case where you can see the wires.


Ah hate those cases XD


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I have a case where you can see the wires.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ah hate those cases XD
Click to expand...

Lol! I like my case.









I have my road test tomorrow, I hope I pass it! It's $80 a try!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! I like my case.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have my road test tomorrow, I hope I pass it! It's $80 a try!


It is not a bad looking Case but 169$! Corsair really Over charges for there cases...

Here is one the 900D is trying to copy... And people will pay 100$ extra cause they just do not know any better..
http://www.mountainmods.com/pinnacle-24-cyo-custom-computer-case-p-498.html


----------



## DiamondCut

So I just got done testing my leaks and all but I ran out of fluid


----------



## h2on0

In


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> So I just got done testing my leaks and all but I ran out of fluid


What's that milk in there? lol
I'd run only distilled really, silver kill coil and colored uv tubing.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2on0*
> 
> In


Any results yet? Congrats on the delid









@Hokies: that mmods case is amazing!!! 69usd only? Dang...I want one









EDIT: I see that those cost a fortune...Go cm 692


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> What's that milk in there? lol
> I'd run only distilled really, silver kill coil and colored uv tubing.
> Any results yet? Congrats on the delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Hokies: that mmods case is amazing!!! 69usd only? Dang...I want one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: I see that those cost a fortune...Go cm 692


Its called Ice Dragon Cooling. Its a nanofluid that outperforms water by 20%


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! I like my case.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have my road test tomorrow, I hope I pass it! It's $80 a try!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is not a bad looking Case but 169$! Corsair really Over charges for there cases...
> 
> Here is one the 900D is trying to copy... And people will pay 100$ extra cause they just do not know any better..
> http://www.mountainmods.com/pinnacle-24-cyo-custom-computer-case-p-498.html
Click to expand...

I actually love the 900D, of course, I'd rather spend the money on a Caselabs case.







The sexy huge one!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2on0*
> 
> In


Throw the results and required info my way and I'll add you.


----------



## Hokies83

Hopefully i will be finishing my Build Next week...


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Its called Ice Dragon Cooling. Its a nanofluid that outperforms water by 20%


you will like it. same fluid i run. works very good.


----------



## Hokies83

Hmmm Looks like im going to be getting afew Sponsors on my Build


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Its called Ice Dragon Cooling. Its a nanofluid that outperforms water by 20%


Doubt it outperforms distilled water








Manufacturer's specs aren't to be trusted normally, and even less with things we already know for a fact, like "water is the liquid with the highest heat capacity" see here...
But if you like it, fine, I'd rather use a proven thing that's guaranteed to work hassle-free with no kind of build up inside the loop.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmmm Looks like im going to be getting afew Sponsors on my Build


Awesome man!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Doubt it outperforms distilled water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Manufacturer's specs aren't to be trusted normally, and even less with things we already know for a fact, like "water is the liquid with the highest heat capacity" see here...
> But if you like it, fine, I'd rather use a proven thing that's guaranteed to work hassle-free with no kind of build up inside the loop.
> Awesome man!


Distilled water Wut 88 cent a gallon O_O?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Here it's even cheaper, and you can use it for them nasty gillete razor cuts lol


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> see here...
> 
> Awesome man!


so who's going to run ammonia as a coolant?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Distilled water Wut 88 cent a gallon O_O?


whats with your kid there Hokies,
its like hes saying, " i drank half the bottle " ....LOL







jk jk


----------



## bsofdth

I was reading Anandtech forums for something. I don't remember what for but I came across a post saying something about sanding the bottom of the IHS (the part that rests on the PCB) to reduce the gap between the die and the IHS. Personally, I would be concerned about making the IHS uneven and damaging the die as a result. Although, I could see a way around this by laying the grit on a flat surface and rubbing the entirety of the IHS face down (to clarify, face down meaning oriented in a way that sand the parts that touch the PCB). However, I have read that the IHS already doesn't sit on the PCB anyway, as evident by VonDutch's avatar. What are your thoughts on this?

Also, I'm waiting on my CL Ultra. Should be here tomorrow or Tuesday.. I will post pictures and relevant information once I get that stuff on and whatnot.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> whats with your kid there Hokies,
> its like hes saying, " i drank half the bottle " ....LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jk jk




wut?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> wut?


haha, that looks great








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bsofdth*
> 
> I was reading Anandtech forums for something. I don't remember what for but I came across a post saying something about sanding the bottom of the IHS (the part that rests on the PCB) to reduce the gap between the die and the IHS. Personally, I would be concerned about making the IHS uneven and damaging the die as a result. Although, I could see a way around this by laying the grit on a flat surface and rubbing the entirety of the IHS face down (to clarify, face down meaning oriented in a way that sand the parts that touch the PCB). However, I have read that the IHS already doesn't sit on the PCB anyway, as evident by VonDutch's avatar. What are your thoughts on this?
> 
> Also, I'm waiting on my CL Ultra. Should be here tomorrow or Tuesday.. I will post pictures and relevant information once I get that stuff on and whatnot.


yea, i would only look into that, if after delid, and cleaning ihs/pcb from adhesive,
if doing the ihs spinning freely on the die "test", doesnt work ..lol


----------



## glina

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bsofdth*
> 
> Although, I could see a way around this by laying the grit on a flat surface and rubbing the entirety of the IHS face down (to clarify, face down meaning oriented in a way that sand the parts that touch the PCB). However, I have read that the IHS already doesn't sit on the PCB anyway, as evident by VonDutch's avatar. What are your thoughts on this?


If you clean the adhesive carefully off both the IHS and the PCB, there should be no contact other than die-IHS. If there is, sand down the bottom of IHS until it spins freely. It's also a good moment to lap the top off your IHS. I used 200/400/800 grit and it was flat within 10 minutes.


----------



## VonDutch

just ran combuster for a while, looks good or ?
when i opened comB is froze desktop for a minute orso,
cant install 3D mark either, wont run..pff, another new windows install or what?


pity i cant adjust the voltage, 1.170V is max, at least i can run 1100/1500,
but the voltage mod FtW showed me, doesnt seem that hard,
except maybe taking that resistor of?
any others that did that already? im not very good with soldering tho..


----------



## King4x4




----------



## SmokeyMcBong

Afternoon guys,









Right, after my escapades trying to get 4.8 stable last night and seeing the ridiculous jump in both voltage and max temp trying to go from 4.7 - 4.8 . This has 100% convinced me to go ahead and De-lid this beauty, as I was only around 90% sure i wanted to do it........... before last night !









So.... 2x CLLU and a set of 10x razor blades have just been purchased from the bay








Going to have a mate round on wednesday while i'm doing it, not only take some pics, but also to stop me from doing anything stupid







[ his got a good eye for things like that lol ]

It will be an honor to join you guys in the quest to tame ivy !
Will also be doing away with my H100 and going down the full custom loop road, which will mean that i may have to get rid of my trusty 'Uber-dremel-cut' HAF 922, and do a short build log at some point soon, but thats another story lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokeyMcBong*
> 
> Afternoon guys,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right, after my escapades trying to get 4.8 stable last night and seeing the ridiculous jump in both voltage and max temp trying to go from 4.7 - 4.8 . This has 100% convinced me to go ahead and De-lid this beauty, as I was only around 90% sure i wanted to do it........... before last night !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.... 2x CLLU and a set of 10x razor blades have just been purchased from the bay
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to have a mate round on wednesday while i'm doing it, not only take some pics, but also to stop me from doing anything stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [ his got a good eye for things like that lol ]
> 
> It will be an honor to join you guys in the quest to tame ivy !
> Will also be doing away with my H100 and going down the full custom loop road, which will mean that i may have to get rid of my trusty 'Uber-dremel-cut' HAF 922, and do a short build log at some point soon, but thats another story lol


we be honored to have you








did you prepare well, done reading(like page1 in this thread) , watched vid's etc?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokeyMcBong*
> 
> Afternoon guys,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right, after my escapades trying to get 4.8 stable last night and seeing the ridiculous jump in both voltage and max temp trying to go from 4.7 - 4.8 . This has 100% convinced me to go ahead and De-lid this beauty, as I was only around 90% sure i wanted to do it........... before last night !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So.... 2x CLLU and a set of 10x razor blades have just been purchased from the bay
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to have a mate round on wednesday while i'm doing it, not only take some pics, but also to stop me from doing anything stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [ his got a good eye for things like that lol ]
> 
> It will be an honor to join you guys in the quest to tame ivy !
> Will also be doing away with my H100 and going down the full custom loop road, which will mean that i may have to get rid of my trusty 'Uber-dremel-cut' HAF 922, and do a short build log at some point soon, but thats another story lol


Good luck im sure you'll do just fine







take you time watch your pressure on the blade.


----------



## I_shot

I'll be back with lots of delidded chips. it's gonna be bloody awesome. WAIT FOR MEEEEEEE !


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> I'll be back with lots of delidded chips. it's gonna be bloody awesome. WAIT FOR MEEEEEEE !


what? you gonna rob a Intel warehouse somewhere?? LOL..jk jk
if you do, send me a good one








keep us posted, make pic's, screenies, vid's ..


----------



## I_shot

one of my customers asked me if i can do this mod to his chips , and i said SURE!







i'll be doin at least 4 chips (3570k) as we speak . unfortunately chips aren't sale. I would have never thought that delidding would make money for me







I'll apply phobya liquid metal on die as usual cause i'm the phobya guy, they're afraid of me


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> one of my customers asked me if i can do this mod to his chips , and i said SURE!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i'll be doin at least 4 chips (3570k) as we speak . unfortunately chips aren't sale. I would have never thought that delidding would make money for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll apply phobya liquid metal on die as usual cause i'm the phobya guy, they're afraid of me


thats really great








haha..phobia guy ...yeah








can you make some pics, or share your experiences about the delidding with us,
or you just do it the normal way, with razor blade etc ?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats really great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> haha..phobia guy ...yeah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can you make some pics, or share your experiences about the delidding with us,
> or you just do it the normal way, with razor blade etc ?


of course i'll share my experiences with you that's what i'm here for. I have done 2 chips by far. i used box cutter and very thin kitchen blade. box cutter for edges, blade for easy access between ihs and pcb. at some points you know pcb must be bent a litte.I like doing it the normal way. for the glue on pcb and die i use fingernail and credit card.scratch free









Oh i forgot to write the most important part









I apply Liquid metal on both cpu die and ihs. you know when you mount cpu on socket ihs starts sliding by adding more pressure to socket. to prevent this i apply liquid metal to a larger area on internal heatsink (facing cpu die) to make sure every point of the cpu die has a great contact with ihs, even you put your finger on ihs while pressuring socket bracket


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good luck phovya guy!


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good luck phovya guy!


Appreciated


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> of course i'll share my experiences with you that's what i'm here for. I have done 2 chips by far. i used box cutter and very thin kitchen blade. box cutter for edges, blade for easy access between ihs and pcb. at some points you know pcb must be bent a litte.I like doing it the normal way. for the glue on pcb and die i use fingernail and credit card.scratch free
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh i forgot to write the most important part
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I apply Liquid metal on both cpu die and ihs. you know when you mount cpu on socket ihs starts sliding by adding more pressure to socket. to prevent this i apply liquid metal to a larger area on internal heatsink (facing cpu die) to make sure every point of the cpu die has a great contact with ihs, even you put your finger on ihs while pressuring socket bracket


yea, the finger works well..lol, i have a post on page 1, that says the same








dont use to thick layers tho, when you do the ihs and die, i do all sides also, but not to much,
bit larger area on the inside ihs cant hurt i guess..
man, i want to delid some ivy's now..


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, the finger works well..lol, i have a post on page 1, that says the same
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dont use to thick layers tho, when you do the ihs and die, i do all sides also, but not to much,
> bit larger area on the inside ihs cant hurt i guess..
> man, i want to delid some ivy's now..


Yeah i use thin layer on both sides. otherwise LM overflows to pcb







maaan what a mess







even i put my finger on ihs while pressing socket bracket ,ihs moves a little bit so i apply LM to a bit larger area than normal to make sure every point on die has a good contact with ihs. Delidding makes me happy man i won't lie...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Yeah i use thin layer on both sides. otherwise LM overflows to pcb
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maaan what a mess
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> even i put my finger on ihs while pressing socket bracket ,ihs moves a little bit so i apply LM to a bit larger area than normal to make sure every point on die has a good contact with ihs. Delidding makes me happy man i won't lie...


i can feel your happiness over here, its contagious ..lol
well, just be careful, and dont let the ihs slide to much onto the black retangle
on the pcb, now the adhesive is all gone, the black retangle is like a mount everest








could give you temp differences between cores later on, you gonna test them all first right?

tempted to offer my services as delidder for the club


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can feel your happiness over here, its contagious ..lol
> well, just be careful, and dont let the ihs slide to much onto the black retangle
> on the pcb, now the adhesive is all gone, the black retangle is like a mount everest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> could give you temp differences between cores later on, you gonna test them all first right?


I'll be careful







I'll test the chips before i delid to see how these babies overclock. I'll post temps and vids for each chip and show delidded pictures. finally the best part before and after .


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i can feel your happiness over here, its contagious ..lol
> well, just be careful, and dont let the ihs slide to much onto the black retangle
> on the pcb, now the adhesive is all gone, the black retangle is like a mount everest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> could give you temp differences between cores later on, you gonna test them all first right?
> 
> *tempted to offer my services as delidder for the club*


VonDutch Delidding Services 24 Hrs of pure win..

Starting with meeting Mr VonDutch at the Air Port then Mr Von Dutch will take you Window Shopping in the Red Light Dist Followed by many laughs and later the Munchys in a Local "Home Grown Cafe"

Then you shall be es courted to Mr Von Dutches estate where he will perform a De lidding on your Chip....

" By this time you could care less after getting some lovin Via Red Light Dist And hrs of smoking and eating fun filled brownies"


----------



## ivanlabrie

lmao xD

Nice service, care to be the spokesman Hokies?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lmao xD
> 
> Nice service, care to be the spokesman Hokies?


As long as i get the first 2 services free of charge im in....


----------



## Gomi

Red Light just aint what it used to be


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Red Light just aint what it used to be


When you do not have one it is for us Americans lol.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> When you do not have one it is for us Americans lol.


lol, yah get what you mean


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> VonDutch Delidding Services 24 Hrs of pure win..
> 
> Starting with meeting Mr VonDutch at the Air Port then Mr Von Dutch will take you Window Shopping in the Red Light Dist Followed by many laughs and later the Munchys in a Local "Home Grown Cafe"
> 
> Then you shall be es courted to Mr Von Dutches estate where he will perform a De lidding on your Chip....
> 
> " By this time you could care less after getting some lovin Via Red Light Dist And hrs of smoking and eating fun filled brownies"


Hahaha


----------



## 47 Knucklehead

I am so temped to delid my 3770K, but like many, I am afraid of killing it. Is there anyone out there either selling their services or delidded 3770K? I am not new to modding things related to computers, but I do know my limitations, and I am sometimes like a bull in a China shop, and this to be something that is not the best thing to try for me.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *47 Knucklehead*
> 
> I am so temped to delid my 3770K, but like many, I am afraid of killing it. Is there anyone out there either selling their services or delidded 3770K? I am not new to modding things related to computers, but I do know my limitations, and I am sometimes like a bull in a China shop, and this to be something that is not the best thing to try for me.


i can, but im not selling my service...i do it for free , only for delid club members tho








im so mean ...LOL
i could sell you my delidded ivy, but you wont like the prize, not that i want to have more because its delidded,
but the prizes i pay over here are insane compared to the usa.. i payed 300 euro for mine back then, thats about 403 U.S. dollars,
i dont have to make profit..


----------



## ivanlabrie

I bet a few here would do it for ya, maybe for free...or for a beer


----------



## nagle3092

Hoping I can get this stable, working on a new 24/7 oc.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *47 Knucklehead*
> 
> I am so temped to delid my 3770K, but like many, I am afraid of killing it. Is there anyone out there either selling their services or delidded 3770K? I am not new to modding things related to computers, but I do know my limitations, and I am sometimes like a bull in a China shop, and this to be something that is not the best thing to try for me.


I'll do it for $10 and shipping


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *47 Knucklehead*
> 
> I am so temped to delid my 3770K, but like many, I am afraid of killing it. Is there anyone out there either selling their services or delidded 3770K? I am not new to modding things related to computers, but I do know my limitations, and I am sometimes like a bull in a China shop, and this to be something that is not the best thing to try for me.


Where you from maybe you are close enough to go to someone's house and de lid your chip with them. Also you would be in range to give them a swift backhand if they mess up


----------



## Swag

I passed my road test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## DiamondCut

Just got a sponsor from Ice Dragon Cooling! Wewt


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Just got a sponsor from Ice Dragon Cooling! Wewt


Nice I have performancePcs and I'm talking to frozenCpu and swift tech .


----------



## Gomi

I got my wallet!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I got my wallet!


AMEN BROTHA


----------



## ivanlabrie

I ain't got a dime lol

I sold my 670 and that goes to Mastercard...greedy bastards!


----------



## Vi0lence

yup i haz no sponsor. only the wallet, and my wife lol


----------



## Gomi

I bought some Gskill Perfect Storm 2133 9-9-9-24 (1.65v) 3x2GB (BBSE) and some Samsung "Wonder" ram.

Whichever performs the best is the keeper - The rest I will put in the internet PC or whatever.

I managed to get my Tridents (2666Mhz) down to 10-13-12-25 (With optimized subtimings aswell - Mem tweakIt reports DRAM Efficiency to a 44600 score), but the speed is REALLY nothing special - At all ...


----------



## Swag

Ok, I'm going to order the Corsair cables right now, what color should I get? Red, blue, white or black?

My *case* is the Corsair *C70* in *Military Green*.
My *Mobo* is the *Maximus V Gene*.
My *cooler* is a *NH-D14*.


----------



## chann3l

The best I could do with my dominator 1600s at 2133 is 10 11 10 28 @ 1.65v it'll boot fine at 9 11 9 28 but super pi gives me the sqr05 error wven bumped the volts to 1.7 same thing. Owell got 11899 in physics on mark 11 so im satisfied


----------



## Airrick10

So I bought some blades and ordered some liquid ultra today! Now all I need is the balls to delid once Ultra arrives! lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

I used my delidding razor to cut the stitches I had in my arm lol
Worked really well, cuts smoothly through metallic wire like it's butter.
Got a sexy 2cm scar now, lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just ran combuster for a while, looks good or ?
> when i opened comB is froze desktop for a minute orso,
> cant install 3D mark either, wont run..pff, another new windows install or what?
> 
> 
> pity i cant adjust the voltage, 1.170V is max, at least i can run 1100/1500,
> but the voltage mod FtW showed me, doesnt seem that hard,
> except maybe taking that resistor of?
> any others that did that already? im not very good with soldering tho..


If you aren't too handy with a soldering iron I wouldn't recommend a pricey new card for a guinea pig. I do it for bot scores, not as worthwhile taking the risk for gaming.
Doesn't hurt to find some cheap oldies on CL to practice on, kinda like delidding practice with old p4s. I have killed a month old $600 card before with a slip of the hand & it kinda hurts....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I passed my road test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Nice!
Now that the instructor/tester is out of the car time for death race to begin....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I bought some Gskill Perfect Storm 2133 9-9-9-24 (1.65v) 3x2GB (BBSE) and some Samsung "Wonder" ram.
> 
> Whichever performs the best is the keeper - The rest I will put in the internet PC or whatever.
> 
> I managed to get my Tridents (2666Mhz) down to 10-13-12-25 (With optimized subtimings aswell - Mem tweakIt reports DRAM Efficiency to a 44600 score), but the speed is REALLY nothing special - At all ...


Perfect storm should be fun, pretty well binned stuff. The samsung is great for the price. It won't be easy to beat the tridents though, ivy does like that speed, even with the looser timings. Others can match & beat it but it takes some work where the trident makes it easy.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> The best I could do with my dominator 1600s at 2133 is 10 11 10 28 @ 1.65v it'll boot fine at 9 11 9 28 but super pi gives me the sqr05 error wven bumped the volts to 1.7 same thing. Owell got 11899 in physics on mark 11 so im satisfied


Not bad at all, corsair bins some of thier midrange ram tight enough that it doesn't really overclock at all.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I used my delidding razor to cut the stitches I had in my arm lol
> Worked really well, cuts smoothly through metallic wire like it's butter.
> Got a sexy 2cm scar now, lol


I do that too. For staples kinda have to go back to the doc, always taken out my own stitches though.


----------



## chann3l

Ok awesome and thanks for all your help ftw.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I passed my road test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> Nice!
> Now that the instructor/tester is out of the car time for death race to begin....
Click to expand...

I drive ridiculously fast. Like whenever it is a 80mph zone, I drive at 100...


----------



## Swag

Oh so happy!







Congratulations gift to myself for passing my road test.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I drive ridiculously fast. Like whenever it is a 80mph zone, I drive at 100...


OOh please don't drive down to OC, I wana live lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I used my delidding razor to cut the stitches I had in my arm lol
> Worked really well, cuts smoothly through metallic wire like it's butter.
> Got a sexy 2cm scar now, lol


Utility knives are my surgical utensil of choice. In fact I get 2 splinters today working with some rough sawn cypress and nothing get's them out better than a utility knife. Sure you make the hole in your hand bigger but it doesn't hurt near as bad as having a chunk of wood stuck in your hand.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I drive ridiculously fast. Like whenever it is a 80mph zone, I drive at 100...


You have 80mph zones? Never seen one of those, highest I've seen is 70 around here.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I drive ridiculously fast. Like whenever it is a 80mph zone, I drive at 100...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OOh please don't drive down to OC, I wana live lol.
Click to expand...

You mean YOU don't drive to OC.







Newport is too upscale for me, I like my middle class area, people tend to look out for each other more. Tell me when you're visiting, I will personally come out myself.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I drive ridiculously fast. Like whenever it is a 80mph zone, I drive at 100...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have 80mph zones? Never seen one of those, highest I've seen is 70 around here.
Click to expand...

I mean 70mph.







Haha, sorry, I was too excited!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> So I bought some blades and ordered some liquid ultra today! Now all I need is the balls to delid once Ultra arrives! lol


I did it without the $$ to replace my chip.. All I needed was 6 days without power (Hurricane Sandy) and nothing to do.. Finally I just sat down and did it. I had to wait a while three days to see if it worked. It turned out to be a great decision! Good luck!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Utility knives are my surgical utensil of choice. In fact I get 2 splinters today working with some rough sawn cypress and nothing get's them out better than a utility knife. Sure you make the hole in your hand bigger but it doesn't hurt near as bad as having a chunk of wood stuck in your hand.
> You have 80mph zones? Never seen one of those, highest I've seen is 70 around here.


You're both lucky, here it's like 60mph on the freeway (some spots, 50mph in most), 30mph in the city & not really sure what 30kmh converts to for the slow zones like schools...


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You mean YOU don't drive to OC.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Newport is too upscale for me, I like my middle class area, people tend to look out for each other more. Tell me when you're visiting, I will personally come out myself.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean 70mph.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, sorry, I was too excited!


Lol, I just speed by people in my car. If anyone hits me they are writing me a check for the value of my car at the time because any damages done to it and It will be marked at totaled lol. I drive at 87 Prelude hahah


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I did it without the $$ to replace my chip.. All I needed was 6 days without power (Hurricane Sandy) and nothing to do.. Finally I just sat down and did it. I had to wait a while three days to see if it worked. It turned out to be a great decision! Good luck!


Thanks Chronicfx!







Yeah I'll eventually do it because my temps are kinda high @ 4.8Ghz around 90c after 2 hours of prime with 1.35-1.36v !


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You're both lucky, here it's like 60mph on the freeway (some spots, 50mph in most), 30mph in the city & not really sure what 30kmh converts to for the slow zones like schools...


1.6 km in a mile so our schoolzones at 30 km are about 20 there


----------



## lilchronic

im doin a hundred on the highway so if your do the speed limit get F#@K out of my way!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im doin a hundred on the highway so if your do the speed limit get F#@K out of my way!


Hmm i used to do 120 - 160mph to work every morning on this..





Got off at an Exit ramp stoped at the light... State troop whips in behind me draws his gun on me...

Charges me with.. Speeding Reckless driving reckless endangerment and eluding police...

Spend 5k on a Lawyer .... Get all charges dropped but speeding and reckless driving get 3k in count fines and ordered to spend 180 days in Jail...

Do take notice of the inspection Sticker from 2008.... this happend in 2007... I have not rode that thing since not worth the trouble.... all in all that stupid act cost me like 12.000$


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmm i used to do 120 - 160mph to work every morning on this..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got off at an Exit ramp stoped at the light... State troop whips in behind me draws his gun on me...
> 
> Charges me with.. Speeding Reckless driving reckless endangerment and eluding police...
> 
> Spend 5k on a Lawyer .... Get all charges dropped but speeding and reckless driving get 3k in count fines and ordered to spend 180 days in Jail...
> 
> Do take notice of the inspection Sticker from 2008.... this happend in 2007... I have not rode that thing since not worth the trouble.... all in all that stupid act cost me like 12.000$


lol i blew bast a cop on the highway doin 130 and i kept goin all the way home toped out @ 155mph he never caught up


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmm i used to do 120 - 160mph to work every morning on this..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got off at an Exit ramp stoped at the light... State troop whips in behind me draws his gun on me...
> 
> Charges me with.. Speeding Reckless driving reckless endangerment and eluding police...
> 
> Spend 5k on a Lawyer .... Get all charges dropped but speeding and reckless driving get 3k in count fines and ordered to spend 180 days in Jail...
> 
> Do take notice of the inspection Sticker from 2008.... this happend in 2007... I have not rode that thing since not worth the trouble.... all in all that stupid act cost me like 12.000$


You were going too slow, a car should never have been able to catch up!
When I first started driving it wasn't too hard to get away, but the police forces have grown too much, they have cars everywhere now & can't outrun the radio so better off not to try. They get real angry when you try & don't succeed, no state troopers here but I've heard stories from friends traveling in the US & would not want to piss them off.


----------



## lilchronic

i miss my CBR600RR


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i miss my CBR600RR


Thats the Master bike 2006 the Kawasaki Ninja ZX10 R.. heh


----------



## ivanlabrie

ZX 11 ftw!









I always wanted at least one of the el cheapo Ninjas, but never got to buy one. Can't afford it atm and would rather spend the dough on hardware


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Thats the Master bike 2006 the Kawasaki Ninja ZX10 R.. heh


lol i know my 600 was crazy enough


----------



## chann3l

I love how many random topics are in this thread now lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I passed my road test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


nice job man!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ok, I'm going to order the Corsair cables right now, what color should I get? Red, blue, white or black?
> 
> My *case* is the Corsair *C70* in *Military Green*.
> My *Mobo* is the *Maximus V Gene*.
> My *cooler* is a *NH-D14*.


was gonna say black... or white white would be cool... I need to get mine still.. but im broke so hard right now.. I have a total of 13 dollars through all my bank accounts... spent everything on my CPU... couldn't have been happier with the silicon I got as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> So I bought some blades and ordered some liquid ultra today! Now all I need is the balls to delid once Ultra arrives! lol


Yeah the kahunas take a while to grow







but you'll eventually see those temps and go.... Screw this! I'mma make it better than Intel can!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You were going too slow, a car should never have been able to catch up!
> When I first started driving it wasn't too hard to get away, but the police forces have grown too much, they have cars everywhere now & can't outrun the radio so better off not to try. They get real angry when you try & don't succeed, no state troopers here but I've heard stories from friends traveling in the US & would not want to piss them off.


http://www.terrafugia.com/

since I'm a pilot... yeah they wont catch me..... ever....








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol i know my 600 was crazy enough


All you bike fans.. sheesh... thinking a bike can out run cars.... my girlfriends dad has this car.


he drag races that and lets me drive that bad boy, pulls the wheels up every time, also has an agreement with my hometowns police that if he lets them watch he can practice on any street lol.

I want either of these cars when I can later.


If I can... I want to custom build myself this car though..


don't care what you think about the cars either I've been a chevy fan and always will be. I prefer a metal cage around me instead of falling off a bike and eating asphalt for 300+ feet at 100+ mph.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> All you bike fans.. sheesh... thinking a bike can out run cars.... my girlfriends dad has this car.


If you think that car can outrun a bike, you have no idea what you're talking about. A bike I was looking into for $6000-7000 (ABout the price of a classic muscle, I'd say) was the Ducati 1098S. 0-60 in under 3 seconds. Top speed of 180mph.. That heavy, 2-ton muscle will never catch up


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If I can... I want to custom build myself this car though..
> 
> 
> don't care what you think about the cars either I've been a chevy fan and always will be. I prefer a metal cage around me instead of falling off a bike and eating asphalt for 300+ feet at 100+ mph.


69 Camaro FTW!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nice job man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> was gonna say black... or white white would be cool... I need to get mine still.. but im broke so hard right now.. I have a total of 13 dollars through all my bank accounts... spent everything on my CPU... couldn't have been happier with the silicon I got as well.
> Yeah the kahunas take a while to grow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but you'll eventually see those temps and go.... Screw this! I'mma make it better than Intel can!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.terrafugia.com/
> 
> since I'm a pilot... yeah they wont catch me..... ever....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All you bike fans.. sheesh... thinking a bike can out run cars.... my girlfriends dad has this car.
> 
> 
> he drag races that and lets me drive that bad boy, pulls the wheels up every time, also has an agreement with my hometowns police that if he lets them watch he can practice on any street lol.
> 
> I want either of these cars when I can later.
> 
> 
> If I can... I want to custom build myself this car though..
> 
> 
> don't care what you think about the cars either I've been a chevy fan and always will be. I prefer a metal cage around me instead of falling off a bike and eating asphalt for 300+ feet at 100+ mph.


Those cars are no match for a 1000cc liter bike lmao.

I do own a corvette however


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> If you think that car can outrun a bike, you have no idea what you're talking about. A bike I was looking into for $6000-7000 (ABout the price of a classic muscle, I'd say) was the Ducati 1098S. 0-60 in under 3 seconds. Top speed of 180mph.. That heavy, 2-ton muscle will never catch up


http://572engine.com/engine-information/

dual turbo it and you have 1200 hp..... car will win.... you may have a fast start.. but i can hit things.... you cant







(not stating I drive cars into things)

Also... my buick lesabre with a 3800 v-6 can get to 120 mph with stock engine (with governor activated (darn government! ))... I can put a supercharger on it and get another 100 hp.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> 69 Camaro FTW!!!


I know... my girlfriends dad has a complete body and chassis of one.. I really wanna spend a summer with him and build it into a heck of a show/street/drag car. Love those things I saw a 71' camaro at a drag event I wanted to take it...


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> If you think that car can outrun a bike, you have no idea what you're talking about. A bike I was looking into for $6000-7000 (ABout the price of a classic muscle, I'd say) was the Ducati 1098S. 0-60 in under 3 seconds. Top speed of 180mph.. That heavy, 2-ton muscle will never catch up
> 
> 
> 
> http://572engine.com/engine-information/
> 
> dual turbo it and you have 1200 hp..... car will win.... you may have a fast start.. but i can hit things.... you cant
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (not stating I drive cars into things)
> 
> Also... my buick lesabre with a 3800 v-6 can get to 120 mph with stock engine (with governor activated (darn government! ))... I can put a supercharger on it and get another 100 hp.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> 69 Camaro FTW!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know... my girlfriends dad has a complete body and chassis of one.. I really wanna spend a summer with him and build it into a heck of a show/street/drag car. Love those things I saw a 71' camaro at a drag event I wanted to take it...
Click to expand...

Well you can also spend $8000 more on the bike and have one that's even faster...

Those cars aren't anywhere near stock ... not at 1200hp ... oh and the bike would still spank them


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I know... my girlfriends dad has a complete body and chassis of one.. I really wanna spend a summer with him and build it into a heck of a show/street/drag car. Love those things I saw a 71' camaro at a drag event I wanted to take it...


Lol I would too! That would be a sweet build....but if you start working on that car you would probably leave OCN for some MOPAR forum!







lol jk

Edit: You'll be telling your gf's dad...ok so if we put Liquid Pro on this and Liquid Pro on that, we can hit 1.2 jiggawatts at a cool 55c! Ha Ha


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Well you can also spend $8000 more on the bike and have one that's even faster...
> 
> Those cars aren't anywhere near stock ... not at 1200hp ... oh and the bike would still spank them


I said my car a buick lesabre can go 120 mph... didnt say it had 1200 horses.. that was the 604 incher in the dodge... wont fit in my car I measured it before lol. I'm not a fan of bikes really especially crotch rockets... to little safety measures I'd rather do what my dad has been doing over the last 3 years. he's been building his own tricycle. I need a picture of that thing. It's so awesome. if anything I'd get a cruiser bike something sporty but not biker dude things. I prefer cars, but that's just me lol.

Also.... here's this for you lol. I love snowmobiles as well.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> Lol I would too! That would be a sweet build....but if you start working on that car you would probably leave OCN for some MOPAR forum!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol jk


I'd make it a carputer.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Well you can also spend $8000 more on the bike and have one that's even faster...
> 
> Those cars aren't anywhere near stock ... not at 1200hp ... oh and the bike would still spank them
> 
> 
> 
> I said my car a buick lesabre can go 120 mph... didnt say it had 1200 horses.. that was the 604 incher in the dodge... wont fit in my car I measured it before lol. I'm not a fan of bikes really especially crotch rockets... to little safety measures I'd rather do what my dad has been doing over the last 3 years. he's been building his own tricycle. I need a picture of that thing. It's so awesome. if anything I'd get a cruiser bike something sporty but not biker dude things. I prefer cars, but that's just me lol.
> 
> Also.... here's this for you lol. I love snowmobiles as well.
Click to expand...

I agree that they're extremely unsafe







Just saying they're faster as well haha


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I agree that they're extremely unsafe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just saying they're faster as well haha


Yeah I spose.







just messing with you man,


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'd make it a carputer.


Awesome! Surfing OCN while dropping the hammer!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nice job man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> was gonna say black... or white white would be cool... I need to get mine still.. but im broke so hard right now.. I have a total of 13 dollars through all my bank accounts... spent everything on my CPU... couldn't have been happier with the silicon I got as well.
> Yeah the kahunas take a while to grow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but you'll eventually see those temps and go.... Screw this! I'mma make it better than Intel can!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.terrafugia.com/
> 
> since I'm a pilot... yeah they wont catch me..... ever....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All you bike fans.. sheesh... thinking a bike can out run cars.... my girlfriends dad has this car.
> 
> 
> he drag races that and lets me drive that bad boy, pulls the wheels up every time, also has an agreement with my hometowns police that if he lets them watch he can practice on any street lol.
> 
> I want either of these cars when I can later.
> 
> 
> If I can... I want to custom build myself this car though..
> 
> 
> don't care what you think about the cars either I've been a chevy fan and always will be. I prefer a metal cage around me instead of falling off a bike and eating asphalt for 300+ feet at 100+ mph.


A plane you can drive on the road, cool concept but would still suck in rush hour. If they make a helicopter that goes straight up when traffic gets heavy, I want one!

I also feel safer in a cage, bikes are better for getting the heart thumping though. A car may have more power, but the bikes just have more pick up & go.
Scariest moment on the road for me was riding a buddy's bike, first one I rode with turbo. When that kicked in it pulled me back really good & took me a moment to pull myself up enough to let off on the throttle, nearly soiled myself.
!


----------



## Swag

All you need is this car and you're set:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A plane you can drive on the road, cool concept but would still suck in rush hour. If they make a helicopter that goes straight up when traffic gets heavy, I want one!
> 
> I also feel safer in a cage, bikes are better for getting the heart thumping though. A car may have more power, but the bikes just have more pick up & go.
> Scariest moment on the road for me was riding a buddy's bike, first one I rode with turbo. When that kicked in it pulled me back really good & took me a moment to pull myself up enough to let off on the throttle, nearly soiled myself.
> !


I love the rush of having a 2 ton vehicle pulling you up into the air and making you look into the sky... makes me feel like I'm taking off every time.

Also..... here you go FtW

http://www.toxel.com/tech/2012/05/19/helicopter-car/


----------



## FtW 420

Looks like that one still needs a bit of runway but sounds like they are getting there!
I road rage much too easily these days. Years ago going for a drive was kinda calming, so much traffic on the road now it's the exact opposite affect.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks like that one still needs a bit of runway but sounds like they are getting there!
> I road rage much too easily these days. Years ago going for a drive was kinda calming, so much traffic on the road now it's the exact opposite affect.


That's why I keep a bike in my trunk. no joke. One day I said screw this parked my car in traffic and locked it and rode my bike past everyone. I had them tow my car to me.


----------



## DiamondCut

you all dont have anything on my 67 firebird







When we bought it was 700hp 1/4mile machine...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> you all dont have anything on my 67 firebird
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When we bought it was 700hp 1/4mile machine...


whats the time and speed?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> whats the time and speed?


Slower then a Liter bike









It takes a " Light car " about 1000 RWHP and from a roll to match / edge out a liter bike.

Then there is "turbo" which almost doubles the bikes power.. and those kits are about 4k...

So u could take a Used liter bike 6k put a turbo on it 4k = 10k and out run a million dollar car...


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> whats the time and speed?


Not a clue, we never raced it. We bought it to strip down to NOS and make it look all original but performance under the hood.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Slower then a Liter bike
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It takes a " Light car " about 1000 RWHP and from a roll to match / edge out a liter bike.
> 
> Then there is "turbo" which almost doubles the bikes power.. and those kits are about 4k...
> 
> So u could take a Used liter bike 6k put a turbo on it 4k = 10k and out run a million dollar car...


I still prefer cars though lol. I understand bikes are cheaper and are faster. But limited to what you can do to them compared to cars.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Not a clue, we never raced it. We bought it to strip down to NOS and make it look all original but performance under the hood.


Darn. Got any pictures? Man we are way OT now.


----------



## dmanstasiu

As we know this is the club that discusses everything so ... which fill-port would you guys recommend? It will be going to the top of my prodigy case. I just want something sleek and black. Low-profile preferably

*Must be available from PPCS

Any better suggestions over something like this?


----------



## VonDutch

honda goldwing 1200

i liked the boxer motor, smooth as can by

kawasaki Z900

fastest streetbike back then

honda 750

had several of those

Yamaha 1000 cc Chopper


had more then this, cant remember them all tho ..lol,
to long ago, my brain..well, its wasnt only about driving bikes, bikers are a crazy bunch LOL,
talking about 30 years ago, i started at 17-18 years old








when i was 6years, i drove my first moped into a iron door,
when i was 14, i got caught joyriding a car ..lol..the list is long ..haha


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I still prefer cars though lol. I understand bikes are cheaper and are faster. But limited to what you can do to them compared to cars.
> Darn. Got any pictures? Man we are way OT now.


Limited such as?


----------



## VonDutch

kk, G'morning guys








sup?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I passed my road test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Gratz Swag








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If you aren't too handy with a soldering iron I wouldn't recommend a pricey new card for a guinea pig. I do it for bot scores, not as worthwhile taking the risk for gaming.
> Doesn't hurt to find some cheap oldies on CL to practice on, kinda like delidding practice with old p4s. I have killed a month old $600 card before with a slip of the hand & it kinda hurts....


yea, thats the only thing holding me back to do it, my card was 350 euro (470. U.S. dollars)
but knowing me, i can get it done when i really want it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> So I bought some blades and ordered some liquid ultra today! Now all I need is the balls to delid once Ultra arrives! lol


good preperation is half the work








took me about a month to prepare, reading, watching vids over and over.....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> kk, G'morning guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sup?
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I passed my road test!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gratz Swag
Click to expand...

Thanks!







Can't wait to start going 100 on the road.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Limited such as?


engine limitations due to space and then body modifications are needed along with suspension upgrades can be a turd.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't wait to start going 100 on the road.


----------



## King4x4

USPS is being a ***** about delivering my fourth card to my US forward address (Newegg doesn't ship internationally so I forward it to this PO and it gets delivered to my door).

In other news I think my seasonic 1250watt PSU burned out the cable that was used on my previous gigabyte PSU LOL


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't wait to start going 100 on the road.


You mean the speed limit, right?


----------



## alex-tpc

Caught the delidding bug. Was hesitant to do it on a 3770K that's 5Ghz Lynx Stable @ 1.288v, SPI 32M [email protected] and Prime95 Stable @ 1.315v







. Figured got enough mileage on it already to risk it and wanted to get higher 24/7 settings. Practiced on a 3570K for another rig first though







. Here's the pic for the 3750K practice:


Here's the 3770K entry:
*OCN name:* alex-tpc
*CPU:* i7-3770K
*on die-TIM:* CL Ultra
*ihs-TIM:* IC Diamond
*Mhz gained:* 193Mhz (from previous max OC)
*OC after delid:* 5632.18 MHz (102.4 * 55 @1.6v 2C2T --- 1.575v on bios @ 100% LLC)
*Temp drops:* 9C (based on 5050Mhz Lynx test)
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2670416

Proc is now Prim95 5.147Ghz stable with 1.456v and Lynx stable @ 1.432v (using this setting 24/7 now)


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alex-tpc*
> 
> Caught the delidding bug. Was hesitant to do it on a 3770K that's 5Ghz Lynx Stable @ 1.288v, SPI 32M [email protected] and Prime95 Stable @ 1.315v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Figured got enough mileage on it already to risk it and wanted to get higher 24/7 settings. Practiced on a 3570K for another rig first though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Here's the pic for the 3750K practice:
> 
> 
> Here's the 3770K entry:
> *OCN name:* alex-tpc
> *CPU:* i7-3770K
> *on die-TIM:* CL Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* IC Diamond
> *Mhz gained:* 193Mhz (from previous max OC)
> *OC after delid:* 5632.18 MHz (102.4 * 55 @1.6v 2C2T --- 1.575v on bios @ 100% LLC)
> *Temp drops:* 9C (based on 5050Mhz Lynx test)
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2670416
> 
> Proc is now Prim95 5.147Ghz stable with 1.456v and Lynx stable @ 1.432v (using this setting 24/7 now)


excellent but you put too much LM on cpu die. be careful not to shortcut anything cause it will overflow from cpu die and pcb will be a LM lake


----------



## alex-tpc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> excellent but you put too much LM on cpu die. be careful not to shortcut anything cause it will overflow from cpu die and pcb will be a LM lake


Thanks. Pic was for the 3570K and I did put less on the 3770k and I did check for overflow. Was getting 20C improvement on the 3570k though so not sure if there wasn't enough on the 3770k or it was only 9C on the 3770K because it was based on a higher OC (with temps on Lynx with 5.050G on the 3770K versus 4.7Ghz on .the 3570K).


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alex-tpc*
> 
> Caught the delidding bug. Was hesitant to do it on a 3770K that's 5Ghz Lynx Stable @ 1.288v, SPI 32M [email protected] and Prime95 Stable @ 1.315v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Figured got enough mileage on it already to risk it and wanted to get higher 24/7 settings. Practiced on a 3570K for another rig first though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Here's the pic for the 3750K practice:
> 
> 
> Here's the 3770K entry:
> *OCN name:* alex-tpc
> *CPU:* i7-3770K
> *on die-TIM:* CL Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* IC Diamond
> *Mhz gained:* 193Mhz (from previous max OC)
> *OC after delid:* 5632.18 MHz (102.4 * 55 @1.6v 2C2T --- 1.575v on bios @ 100% LLC)
> *Temp drops:* 9C (based on 5050Mhz Lynx test)
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2670416
> 
> Proc is now Prim95 5.147Ghz stable with 1.456v and Lynx stable @ 1.432v (using this setting 24/7 now)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alex-tpc*
> 
> Thanks. Pic was for the 3570K and I did put less on the 3770k and I did check for overflow. Was getting 20C improvement on the 3570k though so not sure if there wasn't enough on the 3770k or it was only 9C on the 3770K because it was based on a higher OC (with temps on Lynx with 5.050G on the 3770K versus 4.7Ghz on .the 3570K).


was about to say the same as I_shot, he beat me to it ...lol

wauw alex-tpc, thats a nice chip you have there vcore wise, very nice








(so jealous right now!)








very nice looking entry for the club..thanks


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmm i used to do 120 - 160mph to work every morning on this..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got off at an Exit ramp stoped at the light... State troop whips in behind me draws his gun on me...
> 
> Charges me with.. Speeding Reckless driving reckless endangerment and eluding police...
> 
> Spend 5k on a Lawyer .... Get all charges dropped but speeding and reckless driving get 3k in count fines and ordered to spend 180 days in Jail...
> 
> Do take notice of the inspection Sticker from 2008.... this happend in 2007... I have not rode that thing since not worth the trouble.... all in all that stupid act cost me like 12.000$


Got my license ripped too... Sucks to pay lawyers just to plead guilty in the end.. Then get fined, probation and on top pay at risk driver rates for several years after all for dumb stuff. Seems like yesterday but it was more like 15 years ago.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> was about to say the same as I_shot, he beat me to it ...lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> was about to say the same as I_shot, he beat me to it ...lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*


ooo, i see how it is now ...just you wait ..LOL


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ooo, i see how it is now ...just you wait ..LOL


hahaa







BTW alex-tpc has a very nice chip. i'm glad to see there are luckier people than us







and also great for the club


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> hahaa
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW alex-tpc has a very nice chip. i'm glad to see there are luckier people than us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and also great for the club


i say we make him our PR man ..lol
yea, he has a great chip there..but i love mine anyways, 4.8ghz is good enough for me 24/7,
if its true what they say, its like running a Sandy bridge at 5.0-5.1ghz ..hehe









dinnertime ..bbl


----------



## I_shot

bon appetit


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> "Toms Hardware" The only way we can make AMD's FX-8350 look like a better gaming value than Intel's Core i7-3770K (specifically in the games and at the settings we used to test) is if the rest of the system is free. Because the rest of the system is never free, the FX-8350 never serves up better high-end gaming value.
> 
> From now on, we'll need to limit the use of AMD's flagship to systems already bottlenecked by their graphics cards. A less expensive CPU is more attractive when it isn't affecting performance negatively.
> 
> We were hoping that AMD's Piledriver update would break that trend, but even a handful of impressive advancements aren't enough to match the effectiveness of AMD's graphics team. Might Steamroller be the evolutionary step forward needed to unleash the GCN architecture's peak performance?


LoL


----------



## Totally Dubbed

This is not good for my brain - one side of me is strongly telling me to de-lid...and now it's for a good cause too...


----------



## chann3l

Ok so when my ultra gets here and I swap my as5 with it on the die I also plan on lapping my ihs on the outside and adding a 120mm rad for a total of 360mm of CPU cooling just for good measure. I have 200 400 600 and 1200 grot wet paper. Is that good enough? And can I just use a flat wood block and go in one direction till its flat?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> This is not good for my brain - one side of me is strongly telling me to de-lid...and now it's for a good cause too...


yea, we are that one side of your brain telling you to delid ...lol
maybe get another pentium somewhere to practice on, and dont mess up this time








its a serious thing delidding..can only do it wrong one time,
being impatient or treat it like a joke will lead to fail...

well, if youre really serious about delidding it, and you think you cant,
i will help you if needed, you know for friends i will do it for free..np


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Ok so when my ultra gets here and I swap my as5 with it on the die I also plan on lapping my ihs on the outside and adding a 120mm rad for a total of 360mm of CPU cooling just for good measure. I have 200 400 600 and 1200 grot wet paper. Is that good enough? And can I just use a flat wood block and go in one direction till its flat?


better use glass.. i have a post on page one that might be helpfull








its under a spoiler somewhere ..lol


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> better use glass.. i have a post on page one that might be helpfull
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its under a spoiler somewhere ..lol


Ok tha ks a glass block? I only have lexan or wood lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> This is not good for my brain - one side of me is strongly telling me to de-lid...and now it's for a good cause too...


Sometimes you have to ask yourself, "What would Wayne Rooney do? "


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Ok tha ks a glass block? I only have lexan or wood lol


if the lexan looks like this, i think thats ok too


you do have glass windows right









heres the link to my lapping post,
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, we are that one side of your brain telling you to delid ...lol
> maybe get another pentium somewhere to practice on, and dont mess up this time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its a serious thing delidding..can only do it wrong one time,
> being impatient or treat it like a joke will lead to fail...
> 
> well, if youre really serious about delidding it, and you think you cant,
> i will help you if needed, you know for friends i will do it for free..np


Well that's the thing - I took it very seriously (before recording the video) - and knew that once I started recording, I would be a little entertaining.
I do take de-lidding extremely seriously, or else I wouldn't have even bought the pent4 to practice on.

I don't mind sending it to someone to do it - however for me it would be a personal accomplishment to do it myself.

I might have forgotten but with CLultra, when it comes to application ON THE DIE, what do you do? Spread it on the die, or just peas sized dot ont he die?
Considering on the IHS, you have to spread it - correct me if I'm wrong.

As for blade - would this be better?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Sometimes you have to ask yourself, "What would Wayne Rooney do? "


hahaha


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if the lexan looks like this, i think thats ok too
> 
> 
> you do have glass windows right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> heres the link to my lapping post,
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749


Lol yes but I meant what to wrap the sand paper around or do you suggest laying the paper flat and rubbing the ihs across it instead of rubbing the paper across the ihs? Sorry I got a little confused


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Lol yes but I meant what to wrap the sand paper around or do you suggest laying the paper flat and rubbing the ihs across it instead of rubbing the paper across the ihs? Sorry I got a little confused


lol..np,
you rub the ihs onto the paper ,




that way, or make circulair motions, i think the others here said that who lapped theirs..


----------



## Hokies83

Yay Have all my front fans!

Now to install a seat ontop of it... Get an extension cord plug it in and ride my case around the house! muahah.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yay Have all my front fans!
> 
> Now to install a seat ontop of it... Get an extension cord plug it in and ride my case around the house! muahah.


haha, looks more its gonna fly you around the house...ready for takeoff


----------



## ivanlabrie

Your kid looks like my cousin when he was his age xD
He asked tons of questions and wanted me to teach him guitar, and drums...wonder what he's up to after all this years?

Loads of silenx fans! They used to be quite well known a few years ago, but their ratings are always off...


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol..np,
> you rub the ihs onto the paper ,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that way, or make circulair motions, i think the others here said that who lapped theirs..


Thanks I'll book mark that for reference later won't have to be quite as careful either since im already delidded no issues with static


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alex-tpc*
> 
> Caught the delidding bug. Was hesitant to do it on a 3770K that's 5Ghz Lynx Stable @ 1.288v, SPI 32M [email protected] and Prime95 Stable @ 1.315v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Figured got enough mileage on it already to risk it and wanted to get higher 24/7 settings. Practiced on a 3570K for another rig first though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Here's the pic for the 3750K practice:
> 
> 
> Here's the 3770K entry:
> *OCN name:* alex-tpc
> *CPU:* i7-3770K
> *on die-TIM:* CL Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* IC Diamond
> *Mhz gained:* 193Mhz (from previous max OC)
> *OC after delid:* 5632.18 MHz (102.4 * 55 @1.6v 2C2T --- 1.575v on bios @ 100% LLC)
> *Temp drops:* 9C (based on 5050Mhz Lynx test)
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2670416
> 
> Proc is now Prim95 5.147Ghz stable with 1.456v and Lynx stable @ 1.432v (using this setting 24/7 now)


You sir are in! Now slap that sig on!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> This is not good for my brain - one side of me is strongly telling me to de-lid...and now it's for a good cause too...


yup I'm more than likely going to delid this heck of a chip soon and get back into folding! FINALLY gonna show that Swag guy that I'm still in the lead here muhahahahahaha. especially now that my 680 can game and fold at the same time with the new drivers = amazing.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well that's the thing - I took it very seriously (before recording the video) - and knew that once I started recording, I would be a little entertaining.
> I do take de-lidding extremely seriously, or else I wouldn't have even bought the pent4 to practice on.
> 
> I don't mind sending it to someone to do it - however for me it would be a personal accomplishment to do it myself.
> 
> I might have forgotten but with CLultra, when it comes to application ON THE DIE, what do you do? Spread it on the die, or just peas sized dot ont he die?
> Considering on the IHS, you have to spread it - correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> As for blade - would this be better?
> hahaha


Yes that blade is the best.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well that's the thing - I took it very seriously (before recording the video) - and knew that once I started recording, I would be a little entertaining.
> I do take de-lidding extremely seriously, or else I wouldn't have even bought the pent4 to practice on.
> 
> I don't mind sending it to someone to do it - however for me it would be a personal accomplishment to do it myself.
> 
> I might have forgotten but with CLultra, when it comes to application ON THE DIE, what do you do? Spread it on the die, or just peas sized dot ont he die?
> Considering on the IHS, you have to spread it - correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> As for blade - would this be better?


well, you entertained me with it..i enjoyed watching it,
and yes, when you do the job yourself, it gives great satisfaction for sure









yep, on the die the same method, spread it, i like to do thin layer, and another one on the inside ihs..

that blade worked wel for others, i havent tried it myself, i used a boxcutter for all my delids so..


the one you showed is one of the 3 best we use around here,


and this one, because its so very thin,

it cuts though the corners easier when there little room between the pcb and ihs


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* pics


Thanks for the pics







- *very helpful* as I am starting to prep...CoolLab stuff was ordered a week ago via DHL, so I hope it arrives soon so I can delid and add a custom-water-loop...still with my current setup, as a 'stating point' http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2671862 with some (<50) load on CPU

Question: What happens if some CoolLab Ultra drips off the die and onto the PCB (and I can't see it as the lid would be back on) ? Short circuits ? Explosions ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks for the pics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - *very helpful* as I am starting to prep...CoolLab stuff was ordered a week ago via DHL, so I hope it arrives soon so I can delid and add a custom-water-loop...still with my current setup, as a 'stating point' http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2671862 with some (<50) load on CPU
> 
> Question: What happens if some CoolLab Ultra drips off the die and onto the PCB (and I can't see it as the lid would be back on) ? Short circuits ? Explosions ?


thats a first, i clicked your link, and google chrome blocked it, malware?? ...lol wauw

drips of the die...i dont think you should let that happen in the first place,
thats why i always say , use thin layers, its not like normal tim..
no, it wont explode in your face, it wont short anything, because the pcb has a protective layer on it








but you dont want it to look like this,

but it is conductive, so you have to keep that in mind if you use it..

i dont have a very good one of liquid on the die yet,
but check how little you need to do the ihs,


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks for the pics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - *very helpful* as I am starting to prep...CoolLab stuff was ordered a week ago via DHL, so I hope it arrives soon so I can delid and add a custom-water-loop...still with my current setup, as a 'stating point' http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2671862 with some (<50) load on CPU
> 
> Question: What happens if some CoolLab Ultra drips off the die and onto the PCB (and I can't see it as the lid would be back on) ? Short circuits ? Explosions ?


There isn't anything exposed on the PCB around the die, unless the pcb is scratched/nicked (exposing copper underneath) a bit of runoff shouldn't hurt anything if it happens.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats a first, i clicked your link, and google chrome blocked it, malware?? ...lol wauw
> 
> drips of the die...i dont think you should let that happen in the first place,
> thats why i always say , use thin layers, its not like normal tim..
> no, it wont explode in your face, it wont short anything, because the pcb has a protective layer on it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but you dont want it to look like this,


Looks like all validation links are doing that right now, just looked a a couple that didn't have that message before, & they do now.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks like all validation links are doing that right now, just looked a a couple that didn't have that message before, & they do now.


hope they know to over there, and do something about it, i trust google if it comes to dedecting malware sites,
not that its always right tho..but still

time for bed, been a long day, G'night guys


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> hope they know to over there, and do something about it, i trust google if it comes to dedecting malware sites,
> not that its always right tho..but still
> 
> time for bed, been a long day, G'night guys


Looks like they got it sorted, I don't get the warning message now.


----------



## DiamondCut

Oh yea btw I checked out my die after you guys said I put on too much but it had spread out and nothing went over the edges. My bottle of Ice Dragon will be shipping thursday


----------



## dmanstasiu

Any reason you bought Ice dragon over mayhems white?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Don't drink it...it sure looks like soy milk or something lol


----------



## mandrix

Well I popped the lid off the 3770K today, it was actually really easy and taking my time took about 30 minutes including cleaning up the old adhesive. No damage that I could see.

-I wonder though with the IHS sitting right on the chip how much pressure it will take.- I confirmed the IHS spins freely on the chip will all the adhesive removed.

Anyway I put a small amount of Liquid Pro on the chip, set the IHS back on, and installed it on the motherboard.

Would not boot, got that dreaded constant beeping. Pulled the cpu and found a bent pin in the cpu socket. Straightened that out and was getting tired so I put my other (stock) 3770K back in, filled the loop and purged the air and she fired right up.

So right now I'm hoping the bent pin was the only problem. Tomorrow or next day I will install the delidded cpu in my other rig and see how it goes.
I'll get some details up if everything goes well.

Here's a pic of the separated IHS. The second pic is with the Liquid Pro applied.


----------



## MikeG

I had some old Pentium 4's laying around, so I decided to cut one open. I wanted to apply some CLP to the die, then see how difficult it would be to remove. My razor blade cut through that black sealant like a hot knife through butter--this was way easier than cutting open my 3770K. Then I ran into trouble, I couldn't get the lid off--the dang thing was soldered! I was really surprised because the first Pentium 4 I did only had TIM on the die. I had a lighter handy, so I heated it up so hot I could not touch it, but the lid still would not come off. I ended up taking a couple of screwdrivers to it. The lid came off, but the die was still soldered to the lid!



So I got out the big guns--my 260W soldering iron and applied heat to the outside of the case:



The chip still would not come off, so I applied the soldering gun directly to the inside of the case, directly on the solder. It finally came off.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Dang, that was hard to remove...You can now place that p4 die as a coprocessor inside your brain


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Don't drink it...it sure looks like soy milk or something lol


mmmm soy milk and almond milk... I'm lactose intolrant so I cant haz milk anymore.... but I say screw it when it comes to food and layer on cheese and ice cream. take that dairy. actually building it back up as well, which has only taken 7 years....







darn gull bladder. had that taken out at 14 years old.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Dang, that was hard to remove...You can now place that p4 die as a coprocessor inside your brain


pffft I wouldn't limit my brain with that old thing... through in a 16 thread xeon man! or a 3770K. or ten of them...


----------



## ivanlabrie

lmao









I eat tons of eggs and eat/drink cream/milk/butter, all grass fed stuff. Heavy cream (L)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I had some old Pentium 4's laying around, so I decided to cut one open. I wanted to apply some CLP to the die, then see how difficult it would be to remove. My razor blade cut through that black sealant like a hot knife through butter--this was way easier than cutting open my 3770K. Then I ran into trouble, I ]


That explains why mine wouldn't come out easily....!
So I'm not the only one then.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Sooo... Just got back after being away for two days.. ~320 posts. Cooooooooooooooool.

Such a shame though, after the 4th-5th I won't be here at all really, because I'm undergoing moving out of home!

What new has happened recently on here, anything interesting in the way of de-lidding?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I had some old Pentium 4's laying around, so I decided to cut one open. I wanted to apply some CLP to the die, then see how difficult it would be to remove. My razor blade cut through that black sealant like a hot knife through butter--this was way easier than cutting open my 3770K. Then I ran into trouble, I ]
> 
> 
> 
> That explains why mine wouldn't come out easily....!
> So I'm not the only one then.
Click to expand...

I really think you will have no problem delidding an Ivy *Dubbed*. Read the info, watch the vids, and it is really very easy. The hardest part is getting up the nerve, the rest is much much easier.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I really think you will have no problem delidding an Ivy *Dubbed*. Read the info, watch the vids, and it is really very easy. The hardest part is getting up the nerve, the rest is much much easier.


I've got the nerve and definitely the patience.
But the risk is something else...

Just to confirm:
-Pea sized dot of CLP/U on the die AND behind the IHS
-Spread CLP/U ON the IHS AND the cooler

Correctomundo?


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I really think you will have no problem delidding an Ivy *Dubbed*. Read the info, watch the vids, and it is really very easy. The hardest part is getting up the nerve, the rest is much much easier.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've got the nerve and definitely the patience.
> But the risk is something else...
> 
> Just to confirm:
> -Pea sized dot of CLP/U on the die AND behind the IHS
> -Spread CLP/U ON the IHS AND the cooler
> 
> Correctomundo?
Click to expand...

Not a pea sized dot that's way to much, more like two pin heads worth a little goes a very long way. I just put it on the IHS first then spread it around then just start wiping on the die, whatever's on the qtip will transfer to the die just fine. If you need more just wipe around on the IHS more and go back to the die.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Also if your cooler isn't perfectly flat just use regular thermal paste. My havok 140 is slightly convex so it didn't work to well when I put on CLP.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Not a pea sized dot that's way to much, more like two pin heads worth a little goes a very long way. I just put it on the IHS first then spread it around then just start wiping on the die, whatever's on the qtip will transfer to the die just fine. If you need more just wipe around on the IHS more and go back to the die.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


ah cool - and so you put nothing on the BACK of the IHS?


----------



## nagle3092

I put it on the underside (part that makes contact with the die) bit I just used pk1 for contact between the IHS and my havok.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> ah cool - and so you put nothing on the BACK of the IHS?


you can do a thin layer on the inside of the ihs,
i did, actually i did all sides, die , inside ihs, on ihs, and a layer on the base plate cooler,
upto you really, my way worked well for me..

this is already more then enough, havent found a good on the die pic yet..

Mandrix application is close tho,


----------



## Valgaur

Swag... me you and Ivan should do a tri cast lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Swag... me you and Ivan should do a tri cast lol.


Lol! I don't mind. : p Although, I might end up getting a 3770k... If Intel rejects the IHS... since the CLP made it look ugly!

Also, Von, that is waaaay too much CLP!


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> I put it on the underside (part that makes contact with the die) bit I just used pk1 for contact between the IHS and my havok.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Not a pea sized dot that's way to much, more like two pin heads worth a little goes a very long way. I just put it on the IHS first then spread it around then just start wiping on the die, whatever's on the qtip will transfer to the die just fine. If you need more just wipe around on the IHS more and go back to the die.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
> 
> Also if your cooler isn't perfectly flat just use regular thermal paste. My havok 140 is slightly convex so it didn't work to well when I put on CLP.


^ This is exactly what I was thinking of doing if and when I delid my 3570K!


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Any reason you bought Ice dragon over mayhems white?


Mayhems is just a dye, nothing fancy to it and a lot of bs was going on about how he was just re-selling dye so I just went with ice dragon since its an awesome white and outperforms water!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Also, Von, that is waaaay too much CLP!


thats why i did say,

"this is already more then enough, havent found a good on the die pic yet.."

im looking for a good pic of liquid on the die, if one of you guys can help me with that,
i can say 1000 times how much, but a pic says more ...

this much on the IHS is good tho...right?


----------



## enigma7820

I found it easier to put a tiny amount directly on the brush and than apply it. that how I found the best way for me to do it was. but sorry no pictures you need just enough to cover the surface its about half of what you used von dutch


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I found it easier to put a tiny amount directly on the brush and than apply it. that how I found the best way for me to do it was. but sorry no pictures you need just enough to cover the surface its about half of what you used von dutch


ok, i wont be using the on the die pic anymore, till i have a better one,
any help of you guys with the right amount is appriciated,
im a very visual kinda guy, im sure pics work best for others to show howmuch is needed,
you can say, this or that much, but a pic is the best way to show it


----------



## enigma7820

I agree I don't know why I took a picture of my delid and not when I applied the LP


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I agree I don't know why I took a picture of my delid and not when I applied the LP


we never asked ...lol
only asked if peeps take delid pics








if i have money, i will order ultra, when my kids are here, i will make pics with the right amount,
my youngest has a new ipad, it makes very nice photos..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Mayhems is just a dye, nothing fancy to it and a lot of bs was going on about how he was just re-selling dye so I just went with ice dragon since its an awesome white and *outperforms water*!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Mayhems is just a dye, nothing fancy to it and a lot of bs was going on about how he was just re-selling dye so I just went with ice dragon since its an awesome white and *outperforms water*!
Click to expand...

My thoughts exactly haha


----------



## lilchronic

u guys playin crysis 3 multiplayer beta


----------



## Belial

Okay so I got a lot of stuff.

- My ram from canada came in. Still waiting on my noctua mounts from austria, should be here any day though.

- Also got my nzxt guardian for my video editing build for someone else (see sig rig). I'm still missing hsf, samsung 830 128gb, more ram for that (some crappy gskil 1600 cl9 ares, just were the cheapest 2x4gb). So I'll be putting it together since I'm not putting the ssd behind the motherboard panel like I did for my build, this is for someone else who is computer illiterate. I got a $19 MSI Z77A G41 for this build. I know, not a great motherboard, but it's for a stock volt/low volt overclock, that i'll just tune up and go with, its not my system, just a small overclock for a large value in performance is all.

I also got an nzxt sleeved blue 1m led for my case, and put in a window. took a bit of work, but it looks awesome, ill provide pics in a sec.

I'm not sure if I should delid tonight (dont crush my chip with the noctua cooler, just delid it, stick it back in socket and swap coolers as necessary since I wont be using anything other than pk-3 on die for a while) or wait until the nh-d14 comes.

Maybe I should do some sort of stress test to make sure the system is okay first, too. like prime95 on stock settings or something.


----------



## bsofdth

So, my CLU came in. I applied it and went down another 10C (from my NT-H1) to 65C at 4.7GHz AND I had to use less volts for the higher overclock than my original 4.6. Temperature wise, I could easily hit 4.8 or 4.9, but the jump from 4.7 to 4.8 was .1V and I didn't even get it stable. The temps were in the mid 70s with those voltages though, so not bad. I'm happy with 4.7 with good temps, I just wish the 4.8 jump wasn't so drastic.







So far, I've dropped about 30 degrees after I delidded.

Time to work on ram now.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay so I got a lot of stuff.
> 
> - My ram from canada came in. Still waiting on my noctua mounts from austria, should be here any day though.
> 
> - Also got my nzxt guardian for my video editing build for someone else (see sig rig). I'm still missing hsf, samsung 830 128gb, more ram for that (some crappy gskil 1600 cl9 ares, just were the cheapest 2x4gb). So I'll be putting it together since I'm not putting the ssd behind the motherboard panel like I did for my build, this is for someone else who is computer illiterate. I got a $19 MSI Z77A G41 for this build. I know, not a great motherboard, but it's for a stock volt/low volt overclock, that i'll just tune up and go with, its not my system, just a small overclock for a large value in performance is all.
> 
> I also got an nzxt sleeved blue 1m led for my case, and put in a window. took a bit of work, but it looks awesome, ill provide pics in a sec.
> 
> I'm not sure if I should delid tonight (dont crush my chip with the noctua cooler, just delid it, stick it back in socket and swap coolers as necessary since I wont be using anything other than pk-3 on die for a while) or wait until the nh-d14 comes.
> 
> Maybe I should do some sort of stress test to make sure the system is okay first, too. like prime95 on stock settings or something.


I'm getting my ram from the US lately









I'd at least fire it up & see how the cpu is before delidding, if it does turn out to be a low clocking voltage pig at least then you can do something with it, once delidded you're kinda stuck with it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bsofdth*
> 
> So, my CLU came in. I applied it and went down another 10C (from my NT-H1) to 65C at 4.7GHz AND I had to use less volts for the higher overclock than my original 4.6. Temperature wise, I could easily hit 4.8 or 4.9, but the jump from 4.7 to 4.8 was .1V and I didn't even get it stable. The temps were in the mid 70s with those voltages though, so not bad. I'm happy with 4.7 with good temps, I just wish the 4.8 jump wasn't so drastic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So far, I've dropped about 30 degrees after I delidded.
> 
> Time to work on ram now.


30C tempdrop is very good, gratz









yea, i have the same. big jump between 4.7 and 4.8ghz
going from 4.7ghz at 1.3V to 4.8ghz at 1.420V vcore, 4.9ghz needs about 1.510V ..


----------



## iwalkwithedead

Ah man, I want to try this so bad ... but I'm a derp, I just know I will botch it up.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Prior to delidding, I did a contact test between my 3570k IHS and Noctua NH-C14, see:

So concave, so bad!









As the Noctua base is almost flat, I guess it is worth lapping the IHS!

I have used Pressurex-micro Green contact film from Sensor product. I am not at all affiliated to them, only mentionning their name as they were kind enough to send me free samples. If anyone is interested, pm me and I'll give you direct contact infos.

Will do the same test after delidding between die and IHS, I hope not only the center of the die is touching the IHS...
Did anyone came up with an efficient way of lapping the under side of the IHS?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iwalkwithedead*
> 
> Ah man, I want to try this so bad ... but I'm a derp, I just know I will botch it up.


You can watch when we do our live stream of delidding.


----------



## iwalkwithedead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can watch when we do our live stream of delidding.


Nice, when?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can watch when we do our live stream of delidding.


We need to plan this out though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iwalkwithedead*
> 
> Nice, when?


Agreed when. Your chip is still a mystery.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can watch when we do our live stream of delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We need to plan this out though.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *iwalkwithedead*
> 
> Nice, when?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Agreed when. Your chip is still a mystery.
Click to expand...

Well, I will see if Intel will honor the warranty. If they do, we can do it soon, if they don't, I have to wait to save up some money and buy a 3770k.


----------



## Hokies83

Got a BitsPower Sponsorship.. free fittings and water blocks and fan shrouds









Err but they want me to draw them a picture of my planned build and future updates XD I suck at Paint


----------



## VonDutch

we need coollaboratory to sponsor our delid club,
free pro/ultra for everyone ..lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote...we need coollaboratory to sponsor our delid club,
> free pro/ultra for everyone ..lol


...too late now; they just confirmed my order for six tubes was shipped last Friday !







...and I already paid ! It's about time, this run was made with the lid still on and on ThermalTake 2 Extr. closed loop (ooops, did not mean to slip past 1.5v, some settings were still on 'auto') http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2673163


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay so I got a lot of stuff.
> 
> - My ram from canada came in. Still waiting on my noctua mounts from austria, should be here any day though.
> 
> - Also got my nzxt guardian for my video editing build for someone else (see sig rig). I'm still missing hsf, samsung 830 128gb, more ram for that (some crappy gskil 1600 cl9 ares, just were the cheapest 2x4gb). So I'll be putting it together since I'm not putting the ssd behind the motherboard panel like I did for my build, this is for someone else who is computer illiterate. I got a $19 MSI Z77A G41 for this build. I know, not a great motherboard, but it's for a stock volt/low volt overclock, that i'll just tune up and go with, its not my system, just a small overclock for a large value in performance is all.
> 
> I also got an nzxt sleeved blue 1m led for my case, and put in a window. took a bit of work, but it looks awesome, ill provide pics in a sec.
> 
> I'm not sure if I should delid tonight (dont crush my chip with the noctua cooler, just delid it, stick it back in socket and swap coolers as necessary since I wont be using anything other than pk-3 on die for a while) or wait until the nh-d14 comes.
> 
> Maybe I should do some sort of stress test to make sure the system is okay first, too. like prime95 on stock settings or something.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm getting my ram from the US lately
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd at least fire it up & see how the cpu is before delidding, if it does turn out to be a low clocking voltage pig at least then you can do something with it, once delidded you're kinda stuck with it.
Click to expand...

well ive been running a stock cooler system (mount not in yet for nh-d14), seems okay. I'm getting quite a bit of blue screens though due to ram. bluescreenview and such says its most likely driver error, but it's a bit worrying. im crashing right away at 2000mhz xmp profile enabled on these ram.


----------



## I_shot

wow i see some nice stuff since my last post. Thank you everybody. club is gonna be legend no doubt it







I was messing around and i tested zalman zm stg2 and gelid gc extreme. here is the comparison

ambient temp 25 C both tests

zalman



gelid



cpu die not touched ( phobya applied )

Gelid has been my favorite Al oxide tim for a reason


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ok that's enough.
Ordered the razor blade & CLUtra (CLU isn't in stock, via OCUK, but should be in soon)

Placed orders for:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/310305002399?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-013-CL

Let's do this.

I'll let you know when both come in and then I'll video it - we can stream if you want lads.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Got a BitsPower Sponsorship.. free fittings and water blocks and fan shrouds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Err but they want me to draw them a picture of my planned build and future updates XD I suck at Paint


Wow! Very nice!
Congrats!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we need coollaboratory to sponsor our delid club,
> free pro/ultra for everyone ..lol


Haha, yes. I'd sign up for that








Just de-lidding and applying paste to CPU's everyday.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> well ive been running a stock cooler system (mount not in yet for nh-d14), seems okay. I'm getting quite a bit of blue screens though due to ram. bluescreenview and such says its most likely driver error, but it's a bit worrying. im crashing right away at 2000mhz xmp profile enabled on these ram.


Up the DRAM voltage a little bit Bromeo.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

For the cleaning of the under of the IHS and the die, can I use this?
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-000-AC

Or is it recommended not to use anything but a cloth/finger for the die?
I also don't have anti-static gloves, but have the normal rubber ones - will that be OK?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_glove


----------



## stickg1

I dip a cotton swab in isoprophyl alcohol to clean the die


----------



## mandrix

I was able to get quite a bit of the stock adhesive off with a razor blade, then used cotton swabs and 90% Isopropyl.

You guys with water blocks, how tight are you going after delidding? Normal? I'm using a Raystorm with the aluminum mount and I normally just crank down until all 4 screws seat, I don't touch the knurled adjustments.

Waiting on my repaired UD5H to come back from Gigabyte today via UPS, I'll mount the delidded cpu on it since I need to test out the repaired PCIe slot anyway.


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mandrix*
> 
> I was able to get quite a bit of the stock adhesive off with a razor blade


This is what I used as well.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Mayhems is just a dye, nothing fancy to it and a lot of bs was going on about how he was just re-selling dye so I just went with ice dragon since its an awesome white and outperforms water!


Dyes also separate over time and leave gunk in your parts I just use distilled and dazmode protector (glycol with biocide)


----------



## I_shot

My new chip arrived i think it's a decent chip. it's not delidded right now but it is gonna be soon of course







anyway here it is


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> My new chip arrived i think it's a decent chip. it's not delidded right now but it is gonna be soon of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyway here it is


Seems ok, try to boot at 5ghz and run superpi 32m...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> well ive been running a stock cooler system (mount not in yet for nh-d14), seems okay. I'm getting quite a bit of blue screens though due to ram. bluescreenview and such says its most likely driver error, but it's a bit worrying. im crashing right away at 2000mhz xmp profile enabled on these ram.


What are your vtt and imc volts set at in the bios? Set them manually at 1.2v and 1.15v respectively...and dram voltage at 1.65v, that should work.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we need coollaboratory to sponsor our delid club,
> free pro/ultra for everyone ..lol


Maybe you can get Micro Center to sponsor us and give us some free 3770K's.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Seems ok, try to boot at 5ghz and run superpi 32m...
> What are your vtt and imc volts set at in the bios? Set them manually at 1.2v and 1.15v respectively...and dram voltage at 1.65v, that should work.


well no luck with 5 ghz boot. that sucks but this chip is better than my previous chip. stock load voltage was 1.232V . with this one 1.16V


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mandrix*
> 
> I was able to get quite a bit of the stock adhesive off with a razor blade, then used cotton swabs and 90% Isopropyl.
> 
> You guys with water blocks, how tight are you going after delidding? Normal? I'm using a Raystorm with the aluminum mount and I normally just crank down until all 4 screws seat, I don't touch the knurled adjustments.
> 
> Waiting on my repaired UD5H to come back from Gigabyte today via UPS, I'll mount the delidded cpu on it since I need to test out the repaired PCIe slot anyway.


I have a raystorm also and I just tightened as normal. Finger tight and then 2 quarter turns on the other screws just to make it snug


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Maybe you can get Micro Center to sponsor us and give us some free 3770K's.


yea, i wrote them with that question, can always try right, got a mail back yesterday,

Dear Mr. VonDutch,

in answer to your question if Microcenter likes to be a sponsor of the Delidded Ivy Bridge Club,
and provide members with free 3770K's



please do not respond to this email, we surely won't contact you again ..ever!

Sincerely yours,

Microcenter Support


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i wrote them with that question, can always try right, got a mail back yesterday,
> 
> Dear Mr. VonDutch,
> 
> in answer to your question if Microcenter likes to be a sponsor of the Delidded Ivy Bridge Club,
> and provide members with free 3770K's
> 
> 
> 
> please do not respond to this email, we surely wont contact you again ..ever!
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Microcenter Support


Haha your funny. Although im sure microcenter will probably have a similar response in a less aggressive way


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Although im sure microcenter will probably have a similar response in a less aggressive way


haha yep


----------



## nagle3092

Anyone else still have large temp differences after delidding? I must have re-applied LP about 5 times now and I still come out with about a 10c difference between my hottest and coolest cores. Note this is at 4.8ghz 1.375v



I know its the clp I just cant figure out a way to get it better, just applying it to both IHS and die. I didnt have this much of a difference when using pk-1 granted temps arnt as high.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Anyone else still have large temp differences after delidding? I must have re-applied LP about 5 times now and I still come out with about a 10c difference between my hottest and coolest cores. Note this is at 4.8ghz 1.375v
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know its the clp I just cant figure out a way to get it better, just applying it to both IHS and die. I didnt have this much of a difference when using pk-1 granted temps arnt as high.


at high oc's the temp difference inceases again, np there








10C at 4.8ghz oc is acceptable

you could do a check if the ihs or block is concave tho,


yea, i applied to the die, then put back the ihs on it, to get a print, and applied another (thin) layer on the inside ihs..

ibt 4.9ghz, 11C difference between hottest/coolest core..


----------



## nagle3092

I'm betting the underside is a tad concave, the difference is the same though at 4.5 or 4.8. Hopefully the swiftech h220 comes soon I'm looking to go direct die.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> I'm betting the underside is a tad concave, the difference is the same though at 4.5 or 4.8. Hopefully the swiftech h220 comes soon I'm looking to go direct die.


yea, you could always check that it..it should be less with lower speeds, at 4.5ghz my difference is about 5C under load


----------



## I_shot

VonDutch

i got a new chip it's waiting to be delidded =)

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/221/gelidnoctuanewchip24.png/

Hell yeah babe time for delid


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> VonDutch
> 
> i got a new chip it's waiting to be delidded =)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/221/gelidnoctuanewchip24.png/
> 
> 
> 
> Hell yeah babe time for delid


haha, i would have thought by now, you already would be done with it









thats about the vcore i needed for 4.5ghz..but stable of course..


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> haha, i would have thought by now, you already would be done with it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thats about the vcore i needed for 4.5ghz..but stable of course..


first i tried 1.2V no luck.raised to 1.22V gave error after 10 minutes. last 1.23V no error . i'll run 1 hout IBT to see stable or not. maybe 18 hours prime


----------



## justanoldman

VonDutch,
Thanks for the reply on Swag's guide.

I know I have to spend a lot of time reading, but does this sum it up correctly or am I missing something?

Get a good razor blade, order C.L. Liquid Ultra, wear static wrist band, carefully cut off the ihs, clean everything with 90% alcohol, apply tiny drop of Liquid Ultra, put the chip back in the socket, then somehow place the ihs back on so it stays centered while you lower the bracket arm down.

I have an h100i, and I have some Arctic Silver 5, but I heard that was outdated, what do you think the best paste is now?


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch,
> Thanks for the reply on Swag's guide.
> 
> I know I have to spend a lot of time reading, but does this sum it up correctly or am I missing something?
> 
> Get a good razor blade, order C.L. Liquid Ultra, wear static wrist band, carefully cut off the ihs, clean everything with 90% alcohol, apply tiny drop of Liquid Ultra, put the chip back in the socket, then somehow place the ihs back on so it stays centered while you lower the bracket arm down.
> 
> I have an h100i, and I have some Arctic Silver 5, but I heard that was outdated, what do you think the best paste is now?


You would want to spread the tiny drop of Ultra on the die

As for better pastes than AS5:

Gelid GC Extreme
MX-4
PK-1

there are many others as well...pretty much any of these or newer pastes will be better than AS5


----------



## I_shot

Guys what a coincidence. look at the batches . both cpus are made in same week and almost the same batch number but big difference between two chips.old one 4.7 ghz no stable even at 1.5V but the new one is 4.7 ghz stable at 1.336V i think the batch myth for ivy bridge is busted =)


----------



## chann3l

I'm curious I have as5 on the Die till I get ultra but I also put it between the water block I have k2 stuff that came with the water block do you think it is better than as5 or should I just use as5 when I have to reset my waterblock again later ? Or should I just use ultra on top of the ihs as well? Gonna be lapping too on the outside and my water block is copper so no worries with aluminum issues


----------



## [CyGnus]

CL U/P on die and IHS


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch,
> Thanks for the reply on Swag's guide.
> 
> I know I have to spend a lot of time reading, but does this sum it up correctly or am I missing something?
> 
> Get a good razor blade, order C.L. Liquid Ultra, wear static wrist band, carefully cut off the ihs, clean everything with 90% alcohol, apply tiny drop of Liquid Ultra, put the chip back in the socket, then somehow place the ihs back on so it stays centered while you lower the bracket arm down.
> 
> I have an h100i, and I have some Arctic Silver 5, but I heard that was outdated, what do you think the best paste is now?


Yw









yea, that about sums it up justanoldman,
but practice on a old pentium if you can, before the real delid, is a good one too,
and what Airrick10 said in his post..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Guys what a coincidence. look at the batches . both cpus are made in same week and almost the same batch number but big difference between two chips.old one 4.7 ghz no stable even at 1.5V but the new one is 4.7 ghz stable at 1.336V i think the batch myth for ivy bridge is busted =)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


yea, we busted that one already long ago ..lol
all i can say the costa rica chips in general are better then the malaysian ones,
but i see a new change lately, looks like chips are getting worse with ocing,
mine was avarage when i joined here, now its almost a good chip ...lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I'm curious I have as5 on the Die till I get ultra but I also put it between the water block I have k2 stuff that came with the water block do you think it is better than as5 or should I just use as5 when I have to reset my waterblock again later ? Or should I just use ultra on top of the ihs as well? Gonna be lapping too on the outside and my water block is copper so no worries with aluminum issues


i would wait, if i do a quick search on the w/mk, AS5 is better then that one, 4w/mk against 8.6w/mk i think as5 has

XSPC K2 Thermal Compound, Thermal Conductivity = >4.0 W/mK

Arctic Silver 5, 8.7 W/(m·K)


----------



## justanoldman

I guess I have the same question as Chann3l, the cold plate material of the h100i is listed as copper, so could I use C.L. Liquid Ultra in between my ihs and cooler in addition to using it on the die?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I guess I have the same question as Chann3l, the cold plate material of the h100i is listed as copper, so could I use C.L. Liquid Ultra in between my ihs and cooler in addition to using it on the die?


i used liquid pro on everything,
but if you take your cooler of again often, they say its a pita to clean,
thats why i said, use ultra/pro on the die, and any good tim on the ihs,
theres not much difference in using liquid on the ihs in temps, compared to other tims see,
because the heat transfer area is bigger..


----------



## chann3l

Ya I was more wondering what I should do when I swap my as5 on the die with the ultra im gonna wait till the ultra gets here I just wanted to know if I could also swap the as5 between my waterblock and his with liquid ultra seems like I can so that's what I'll do







. Thanks guys


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i used liquid pro on everything,
> but if you take your cooler of again often, they say its a pita to clean,
> thats why i said, use ultra/pro on the die, and any good tim on the ihs,
> theres not much difference in using liquid on the ihs, compared to other tims see,
> because the heat transfer area is bigger..


Once I have ultra on the die and I add my second rad for good measure o won't need to take the block off for any reason so I should be good with ultra on top too


----------



## justanoldman

Thanks VonDutch,
+rep for all the help, and I will apologize now for my many questions to come...

I am thinking I should have my wife stop by Home Depot while she is out shopping to ask for the thinnest razor blade they have. That way if I accidently destroy the chip, I can say it wasn't me, it must have been the razor's fault.


----------



## VonDutch

yea, i dont mind cleaning it from the ihs, and i dont care if it stains like some say,
its not that i can see it if i put it back together again ..lol
and im using liquid ultra instead of pro if i do ..no problem..
i just clean it as good as i can, im getting curious tho, about the cleaning etc,
i think i have enough money next month to order ultra, so thats when im gonna take it apart again,
will make pic's etc when i do ..its under there for about 5 months now


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks VonDutch,
> +rep for all the help, and I will apologize now for my many questions to come...
> 
> I am thinking I should have my wife stop by Home Depot while she is out shopping to ask for the thinnest razor blade they have. That way if I accidently destroy the chip, I can say it wasn't me, it must have been the razor's fault.


no worries, i rather have you asking alot of questions, then one not asked and answered that messes up your delid








there almost always someone here to help


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks VonDutch,
> +rep for all the help, and I will apologize now for my many questions to come...
> 
> I am thinking I should have my wife stop by Home Depot while she is out shopping to ask for the thinnest razor blade they have. That way if I accidently destroy the chip, I can say it wasn't me, it must have been the razor's fault.


Just take it slow, grab an anti static wristband for 5 bucks and I dont know how tight the h100 is but my water block pushed the ihs onto the PCB pretty good so just be patient with getting into that first corner especially. I also used probably the thickest razor around but still be patient lol. Good luck


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ok that's enough.
> Ordered the razor blade & CLUtra (CLU isn't in stock, via OCUK, but should be in soon)
> 
> Placed orders for:
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/310305002399?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
> https://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-013-CL
> 
> Let's do this.
> 
> I'll let you know when both come in and then I'll video it - we can stream if you want lads.


Let's do a 4 way stream!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> For the cleaning of the under of the IHS and the die, can I use this?
> https://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=TH-000-AC
> 
> Or is it recommended not to use anything but a cloth/finger for the die?
> I also don't have anti-static gloves, but have the normal rubber ones - will that be OK?
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_glove


The rubber gloves will negate any electricity.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Maybe you can get Micro Center to sponsor us and give us some free 3770K's.


Pfffffffft.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Guys what a coincidence. look at the batches . both cpus are made in same week and almost the same batch number but big difference between two chips.old one 4.7 ghz no stable even at 1.5V but the new one is 4.7 ghz stable at 1.336V i think the batch myth for ivy bridge is busted =)


Yeah we beat that thing to death. That's why I coined the silicon lottery. As every silicon batches change per chip due to the properties of silicon. Its all based off of the silicons electrical impedence. If yo7 have a great clocker at low volts then you have a chip with a low impedence (the ability to allow electricity through. Without holding any of it back)

Your awesome info for the day. VonDutch what's the email to coolaboratory im going to contact them today.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> VonDutch what's the email to coolaboratory im going to contact them today.


i always contact them through their site, and till now i get answers in about a week,
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/support/


----------



## mandrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I have a raystorm also and I just tightened as normal. Finger tight and then 2 quarter turns on the other screws just to make it snug


Ok, thanks! I'm just now putting the block on.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mandrix*
> 
> Ok, thanks! I'm just now putting the block on.


Hope all went well for you.


----------



## [CyGnus]

When i thought i knew my CPU he decided to surprise me once again







been doing quick tests (1h Linx to see stability) and he is holding on fine, each time I reduce the voltage 2 notches and he just keeps on going.
Could not be happier my PC is very silent i can barely ear it and the temps are great


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> When i thought i knew my CPU he decided to surprise me once again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> been doing quick tests (1h Linx to see stability) and he is holding on fine, each time I reduce the voltage 2 notches and he just keeps on going.
> Could not be happier my PC is very silent i can barely ear it and the temps are great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


i wish my chip would surprise me, and run 5.0ghz at 1.4V vcore instead of the 1.520V it needs now to be stable ...LOL








noice was one of the reasons ive put mine in the hallway, besides the very cool temps there ..

not that its loud tho


----------



## SmokeyMcBong

Evening guy's









Thanks for all your help and input regarding the de-lid process.. ! It is Greatly Appreciated !

I have just successfully Completed the process without any hick ups









[ Please excuse the dusty internals, i dont usually leave it more than 2 weeks without stripping down and cleaning







]






But.....

i think this time round i have a dodgy mount or skewed paste application as my idle temps are around the same but load temps are a few degrees higher !








i will re-seat it in a min, just thought i would thank you guys for all the help and assistance









.... I will be back soon [hopefully with some better temp data]


----------



## Swag

@Valgaur

We will end up having like 10 people streaming with us.







Although, I had already considered having TD join the stream for some commentating.









How's the chip doing? You reach 6GHz yet?


----------



## glina

Please update my max OC 

5065.5 MHz
http://valid.canardpc.com/2674017


----------



## ivanlabrie

@VonDutch, nice cm 692









Guys: just use CLU or CLP on die, and whatever on the ihs. Mustard would be a fine choice lol
My replacemente should be here in a month or so.
Gonna delid my cpu right away, after testing vcore for boot and spi 32m at 5ghz .


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> Please update my max OC
> 
> 5065.5 MHz
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2674017


gratz glina,
thats a very nice vcore, eventho its only for a validation, i needed much more then that








and 103 blck??







..wauw ..lol


----------



## glina

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> gratz glina,
> thats a very nice vcore, eventho its only for a validation, i needed much more then that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and 103 blck??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..wauw ..lol


Nah, cpu-z got it wrong. It was more like 1.4V 

I use 103 to squeeze that extra bit out of my memory. 104 is also stable. 105 is not.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> Nah, cpu-z got it wrong. It was more like 1.4V


ow








still good tho ..i needed about 1.5V to get a 5.0ghz validation i think

tired, to bed early ..G'night guys









have fun ...lol









we rock


----------



## justanoldman

Ordered my C.L. Liquid Ultra, should be here sometime next week.
What have you guys gotten me into?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ordered my C.L. Liquid Ultra, should be here sometime next week.
> What have you guys gotten me into?


you gonna feel like , justanyoungman after you delidded ...LOL


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch,
> Thanks for the reply on Swag's guide.
> 
> I know I have to spend a lot of time reading, but does this sum it up correctly or am I missing something?
> 
> Get a good razor blade, order C.L. Liquid Ultra, wear static wrist band, carefully cut off the ihs, clean everything with 90% alcohol, apply tiny drop of Liquid Ultra, put the chip back in the socket, then somehow place the ihs back on so it stays centered while you lower the bracket arm down.
> 
> I have an h100i, and I have some Arctic Silver 5, but I heard that was outdated, what do you think the best paste is now?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> You would want to spread the tiny drop of Ultra on the die
> 
> As for better pastes than AS5:
> 
> Gelid GC Extreme
> MX-4
> PK-1
> 
> there are many others as well...pretty much any of these or newer pastes will be better than AS5


Or you could just use CLU on the IHS itself







!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Guys what a coincidence. look at the batches . both cpus are made in same week and almost the same batch number but big difference between two chips.old one 4.7 ghz no stable even at 1.5V but the new one is 4.7 ghz stable at 1.336V i think the batch myth for ivy bridge is busted =)


EPIC! haha
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The rubber gloves will negate any electricity.


So it that a good or bad thing - sorry for the noob question lol
Stream sounds fun








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @Valgaur
> 
> We will end up having like 10 people streaming with us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although, I had already considered having TD join the stream for some commentating.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How's the chip doing? You reach 6GHz yet?


You don't want me commentating - I would just be trollin', then quickly panicking as it comes to my turn








You just want maaaa sexy voice huh? I see how it is.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ordered my C.L. Liquid Ultra, should be here sometime next week.
> What have you guys gotten me into?


We are in the same boat amigo! lool


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you gonna feel like , justanyoungman after you delidded ...LOL


Like I was born after 1970? Cool, maybe I can read fine print again.


----------



## lilchronic

u guys should put on the first page in big huge writing coolabs pro/ultra on die only any thing else and there is no point to delid


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Or you could just use CLU on the IHS itself
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


Yep, I will use the Ultra on top of the ihs too and see how it goes. I am looking forward to not having to worry about temps so much, and just worry about voltage.

"What's that now? A bandwagon full of overclockers with delidded chips?
All right, I'm hopping on."


----------



## Gomi

]Love Cinebench - Truly do. It catches 99.9% of all my "bad" overclocks.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Yep, I will use the Ultra on top of the ihs too and see how it goes. I am looking forward to not having to worry about temps so much, and just worry about voltage.
> 
> "What's that now? A bandwagon full of overclockers with delidded chips?
> All right, I'm hopping on."


hahaha! Swag and Dutch persuaded me, and I'm one to be super curious - I just hope I don't screw up (gulp)
However with patience and precision (and a little luck with static) - I don't see any problems with it.
I've got loads of patience when it comes to these things and really take my time.

As for voltage + temps - I'm actually doing it more for the fact that I don't want my chip to be constantly stressed out at around 90c whilst folding- I would like to see a 20c drop (on load) so that I can leave my PC 24/7 folding basically.
I'm out quite a bit and LOVE the fact that I'm helping for a good cause.
I'm one that - if I won the lottery would donate a heck of a lot to scouting associations and charities (mainly ones that operate in places like Ethiopia) - So the fact that I bought my I7 is great, but the fact that I can HELP for a greater cause, no money is involved, no time is lost, just my CPU is used (some could argue the lifespan is reduced, but I couldn't give a ... as I'll probably change in 3-4 years anyway!)

Anyway, that's my only reason I'm de-lidding - my 90c temps for prime are above what they would realistically hit - my BF3 temps are around 45-65c and nothing to worry about. However folding, with 90c almost 24/7 makes me feel un-easy.

EDIT:
Long story short:
I'm de-lidding for a greater cause


----------



## SmokeyMcBong

well., even after a second re paste. and re mount, i still seem to have very different temp ranges going from core to core.,

Temps before de-lid .....



Temps after de-lid and first paste and mount attempt...



Temps after 2nd paste attempt and re-mount ....



are these the results i should be seeing? i was thinking that maybe this would help with the big temp difference between cores etc, or maybe i need a 3rd paste and mount attempt?

any help is greatly appreciated guys


----------



## SonDa5

Building a micro ITX water cooled build with a i5-3570k. Link to the build log in in my sig. MiT X 5.


----------



## mandrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hope all went well for you.


Everything went great!
Did a little testing with IBT @ max with a x45 overclock, temps were down 20+ degrees from before.
Haven't done much testing above x45, CCC keeps flaking out on me and crashing. Hope to get some more testing in tomorrow. I was late getting started today, had to wait on UPS to bring my repaired board for my backup rig.

I'm pretty happy right now, definitely one of the easiest mods I ever did.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @Valgaur
> 
> We will end up having like 10 people streaming with us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although, I had already considered having TD join the stream for some commentating.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How's the chip doing? You reach 6GHz yet?


Can't yet for the 6 giggles but for the stream who the heck is TD?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> Please update my max OC
> 
> 5065.5 MHz
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2674017


PM me as im on my phone.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Or you could just use CLU on the IHS itself
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> EPIC! haha
> So it that a good or bad thing - sorry for the noob question lol
> Stream sounds fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't want me commentating - I would just be trollin', then quickly panicking as it comes to my turn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You just want maaaa sexy voice huh? I see how it is.
> We are in the same boat amigo! lool


A month is a long wait man....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hahaha! Swag and Dutch persuaded me, and I'm one to be super curious - I just hope I don't screw up (gulp)
> However with patience and precision (and a little luck with static) - I don't see any problems with it.
> I've got loads of patience when it comes to these things and really take my time.
> 
> As for voltage + temps - I'm actually doing it more for the fact that I don't want my chip to be constantly stressed out at around 90c whilst folding- I would like to see a 20c drop (on load) so that I can leave my PC 24/7 folding basically.
> I'm out quite a bit and LOVE the fact that I'm helping for a good cause.
> I'm one that - if I won the lottery would donate a heck of a lot to scouting associations and charities (mainly ones that operate in places like Ethiopia) - So the fact that I bought my I7 is great, but the fact that I can HELP for a greater cause, no money is involved, no time is lost, just my CPU is used (some could argue the lifespan is reduced, but I couldn't give a ... as I'll probably change in 3-4 years anyway!)
> 
> Anyway, that's my only reason I'm de-lidding - my 90c temps for prime are above what they would realistically hit - my BF3 temps are around 45-65c and nothing to worry about. However folding, with 90c almost 24/7 makes me feel un-easy.
> 
> EDIT:
> Long story short:
> I'm de-lidding for a greater cause


I persuaded you as well silly! But seriously great reason to delid! I also did it for that reason!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mandrix*
> 
> Everything went great!
> Did a little testing with IBT @ max with a x45 overclock, temps were down 20+ degrees from before.
> Haven't done much testing above x45, CCC keeps flaking out on me and crashing. Hope to get some more testing in tomorrow. I was late getting started today, had to wait on UPS to bring my repaired board for my backup rig.
> 
> I'm pretty happy right now, definitely one of the easiest mods I ever did.


That's why we tell them it isn't all that hard! Its very easy if you take your time and prepare approprietly!







Glad it went well!


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Whats this for? Testing has proven it is better than water....


----------



## Totally Dubbed

TD = Totally Dubbed

LOL


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @Valgaur
> 
> We will end up having like 10 people streaming with us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although, I had already considered having TD join the stream for some commentating.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How's the chip doing? You reach 6GHz yet?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't yet for the 6 giggles but for the stream who the heck is TD?
Click to expand...

Totally Dubbed.









I reached 5.5 but it doesn't hold for more than 2 mins...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Whats this for? Testing has proven it is better than water....


results ???


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokeyMcBong*
> 
> well., even after a second re paste. and re mount, i still seem to have very different temp ranges going from core to core.,
> 
> Temps before de-lid .....
> 
> snip
> Temps after de-lid and first paste and mount attempt...
> 
> snip
> Temps after 2nd paste attempt and re-mount ....
> 
> snip
> are these the results i should be seeing? i was thinking that maybe this would help with the big temp difference between cores etc, or maybe i need a 3rd paste and mount attempt?
> 
> any help is greatly appreciated guys


Results are better than before, but I would expect a bigger temp drop. Maybe check the IHS & see if it's flat, concave IHS can mess things up...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Can't yet for the 6 giggles but for the stream who the heck is TD?
> PM me as im on my phone.
> A month is a long wait man....
> I persuaded you as well silly! But seriously great reason to delid! I also did it for that reason!
> That's why we tell them it isn't all that hard! Its very easy if you take your time and prepare approprietly!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glad it went well!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> TD = Totally Dubbed
> 
> LOL


I saw the TD before & wondered why guys keep bringing up topdog, he doesn't delid. (topdog is TD among the benchers/extreme coolers).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Totally Dubbed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I reached 5.5 but it doesn't hold for more than 2 mins...


----------



## stickg1

Valguar, when is the first annual Delidded Crew Kegger?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Totally Dubbed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I reached 5.5 but it doesn't hold for more than 2 mins...


With what chip? You don't have one do you?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Results are better than before, but I would expect a bigger temp drop. Maybe check the IHS & see if it's flat, concave IHS can mess things up...
> 
> I saw the TD before & wondered why guys keep bringing up topdog, he doesn't delid. (topdog is TD among the benchers/extreme coolers).


Yeah that's TD for you lawls. But quit cheating on that LN2 crap!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Results are better than before, but I would expect a bigger temp drop. Maybe check the IHS & see if it's flat, concave IHS can mess things up...
> 
> I saw the TD before & wondered why guys keep bringing up topdog, he doesn't delid. (topdog is TD among the benchers/extreme coolers).


wow i want to come to your house bring my 3570k and see what it can do with some ln2








i got the herbs


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> u guys playin crysis 3 multiplayer beta


Should be on there later. Took me most of my night last night to figure out it was crashing on startup because I had evga precision open. Anyone else not able to use precision with it?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Valguar, when is the first annual Delidded Crew Kegger?


I nominate Hokie's house for the location. He mentioned having a lot of space and said we can smoke inside.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Totally Dubbed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I reached 5.5 but it doesn't hold for more than 2 mins...
> 
> 
> 
> With what chip? You don't have one do you?
Click to expand...

I meant with my old chip, the one that broke. I'm waiting for Intel's confirmation for the refund before I open the box and assemble the PC...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> With what chip? You don't have one do you?
> Yeah that's TD for you lawls. But quit cheating on that LN2 crap!


No ln2 or DICE there. Just a powered cooler that plugs into the wall, I've used it for a daily.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> wow i want to come to your house bring my 3570k and see what it can do with some ln2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i got the herbs


Ln2 is more fun than what I posted there. Herb is always here too, no need to carry. He's a fun guy, I keep him around.


----------



## SmokeyMcBong

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Results are better than before, but I would expect a bigger temp drop. Maybe check the IHS & see if it's flat, concave IHS can mess things up...


Hiya mate ,

that is what i was thinking, especially with the amount of data collated suggesting bigger drops, so i had a 3rd attempt at pasting and remounting ....

It looks like i was moving the IHS [very minutely] but enough to shift alot of the CLLU to one side and more towards the bottom of the die during the mount. leaving quite a big portion of the die untouched.
So now made completely sure that all of the die is 'brushed' completely with a thin layer of CLLU, and DID NOT MOVE IT THIS TIME while mounting









So now after what i think is a proper application i have now gone from these IBT full load temps .....



To these wonderfully lower full load IBT temps .,...



Now i am very happy with these results so far,









Thanks again for all the help and info guys, its great to be a part of this awesome community!!


----------



## FtW 420

That was the kinda temp drop I would expect, much better!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Should be on there later. Took me most of my night last night to figure out it was crashing on startup because I had evga precision open. Anyone else not able to use precision with it?


i run it fine with percision its just when i mess with nvidia controll pannell or inspector it crashes on startup


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I nominate Hokie's house for the location. He mentioned having a lot of space and said we can smoke inside.


I don't want to see him scooting around on his new rig though yelling you can't catch me! Im running at 5.2 giggleherts LAWLS!!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I meant with my old chip, the one that broke. I'm waiting for Intel's confirmation for the refund before I open the box and assemble the PC...


That's right now I remember.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> No ln2 or DICE there. Just a powered cooler that plugs into the wall, I've used it for a daily.
> Ln2 is more fun than what I posted there. Herb is always here too, no need to carry. He's a fun guy, I keep him around.


Herb??


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Whats this for? Testing has proven it is better than water....


For being Dumb









I dare u to post that in a WC thread...
http://www.overclock.net/t/584302/ocn-water-cooling-club-and-picture-gallery/0_20
Now say that stuff performs better then water in there so i can watch the replys LOL.

We are smarter then that









Many have tested and we all know the more pure the water = better cooling the more crap u put in it = less cooling...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> No ln2 or DICE there. Just a powered cooler that plugs into the wall, I've used it for a daily.
> Ln2 is more fun than what I posted there. Herb is always here too, no need to carry. He's a fun guy, I keep him around.


a powerd cooler ??? what is that and what are temps like?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Phase change...single stage unit probably. It's an AC unit, or something like that, modded to cool a small plate that goes over your cpu, instead of a big radiator.

And, Hokies, spot on. No serious wc guy would use dyes...Those are only for showing off.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Phase change...single stage unit probably. It's an AC unit, or something like that, modded to cool a small plate that goes over your cpu, instead of a big radiator.
> 
> And, Hokies, spot on. No serious wc guy would use dyes...Those are only for showing off.


We get colored tubing


----------



## ivanlabrie

Pretty much...









Have you guys entered the 'win a beast 2500usd rig' contest yet?
I posted an entry there, a matx folding rig with a 7970 for btc







(x79 Gene, 3930k, 2400c9 4x4gb,7970 matrix platinum,sugo sg09 case and Silver Arrow SB-e extreme with an x750 psu and a 128gb m4)


----------



## I_shot

Bad news guys









my first delidded chip is half dead. hd 4000 internal gpu wont work anymore. windows welcome screen is black or sometimes just lines and colorful dots... i disabled hd 4000 in device manager so cpu works but no games or videos.i made a mistake. i lapped inner ihs for better contact with die but it seems liquid metal strached cpu die. there's no visual damage but something went wrong that's for sure. maybe massive pressure occured on die i don't know. the only thing i know is i have a half dead cpu. i was gonna sell it tomorrow.. darn....


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I don't want to see him scooting around on his new rig though yelling you can't catch me! Im running at 5.2 giggleherts LAWLS!!!!
> That's right now I remember.
> Herb??


I was thinking he would have a 20 minute slideshow of various graphs showing how all of our systems are **** and his is the nuts.


----------



## FtW 420

That was a cascade, a 3770k can bog down the single stage under heavy load. As ivan said, the concept is basically an air conditioner where the cold goes to cool a heatsink instead of a radiator that cools the air.
Cascade is like an AC that goes to another AC to get colder yet. Mine gets to about -100° although phase cooling doesn't hold temps as well as a pot, great for daily testing since it involves no pouring or prep. Just mount it like a heatsink , turn it on & let it do it's thing.
They are expensive to have custom built, but can be found cheaper (used, test build, etc.). Stumbled into a good deal & got mine cheaper than some guys spend on water cooling.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That was a cascade, a 3770k can bog down the single stage under heavy load. As ivan said, the concept is basically an air conditioner where the cold goes to cool a heatsink instead of a radiator that cools the air.
> Cascade is like an AC that goes to another AC to get colder yet. Mine gets to about -100° although phase cooling doesn't hold temps as well as a pot, great for daily testing since it involves no pouring or prep. Just mount it like a heatsink , turn it on & let it do it's thing.
> They are expensive to have custom built, but can be found cheaper (used, test build, etc.). Stumbled into a good deal & got mine cheaper than some guys spend on water cooling.


Is that something that my buddy that does HVAC for a living could do? Maybe I'll have him come over and work a phase change unit for me. What would you get for a block?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Is that something that my buddy that does HVAC for a living could do? Maybe I'll have him come over and work a phase change unit for me. What would you get for a block?


He probably can, there are places like this sell the various hardware like evaporators (the heatsink) http://under-the-ice.com/index.php?cPath=25

I haven't really looked into building myself, there are helpful guys in the phase change section for advice & building questions though http://www.overclock.net/f/133/phase-change


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Should be on there later. Took me most of my night last night to figure out it was crashing on startup because I had evga precision open. Anyone else not able to use precision with it?


Have you tried this?


----------



## lilchronic

i want one that can do 2 graphic cards also







but this guys is nice
http://www.overclock.net/t/822433/littledevils-pc-case-with-integrated-phase-change-and-watercooling-place


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Phase change...single stage unit probably. It's an AC unit, or something like that, modded to cool a small plate that goes over your cpu, instead of a big radiator.
> 
> And, Hokies, spot on. No serious wc guy would use dyes...Those are only for showing off.


Exactly more crap = poopy results..... seriously. Just get distilled water its cheap and the best
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Bad news guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my first delidded chip is half dead. hd 4000 internal gpu wont work anymore. windows welcome screen is black or sometimes just lines and colorful dots... i disabled hd 4000 in device manager so cpu works but no games or videos.i made a mistake. i lapped inner ihs for better contact with die but it seems liquid metal strached cpu die. there's no visual damage but something went wrong that's for sure. maybe massive pressure occured on die i don't know. the only thing i know is i have a half dead cpu. i was gonna sell it tomorrow.. darn....


You might have shorted it a small bit... which I find hard to do... but about die if you know the die it has a glass cover protecting the silicon under it from getting damaged from the IHS. What you might have is a fatal error in the CPU itself or maybe a smaller mobo short (which can occur if you don't ground yourself every few minutes) don't you have a gpu? If not... get one then you'll be fine.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was thinking he would have a 20 minute slideshow of various graphs showing how all of our systems are **** and his is the nuts.


Lol he wont unless we say something stupid... which will happen so yeah...


----------



## ivanlabrie

+1, an HVAC tech can easily mod an AC unit into a single stage cooler, good for some 5ghz+ benching on a 3770k and higher on older hardware.
If you can build a cascade that would be uber awesome though


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> He probably can, there are places like this sell the various hardware like evaporators (the heatsink) http://under-the-ice.com/index.php?cPath=25
> 
> I haven't really looked into building myself, there are helpful guys in the phase change section for advice & building questions though http://www.overclock.net/f/133/phase-change


Okay because he owes me a favor. Maybe I can just hook up a 36x36x32 air condenser and a massive air handler in the attic and hook it straight up to my CPU. LOL, that should beat ole' hokie bird for sure.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I'd copy the old school insulated case/fridge Vapochill and mod an AC unit to fit inside it, like that Little Devil case.
Perhaps you could do a cascade to cool gpus also, that would be insane


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, I'd copy the old school insulated case/fridge Vapochill and mod an AC unit to fit inside it, like that Little Devil case.
> Perhaps you could do a cascade to cool gpus also, that would be insane


You can you'd just have to custom do the heat exchangers and the tubing to match both....but you'd never move them again basically.... oooor you could make a custom sli sort of setup with the bridge set in and then make the heat exchangers already on them in the exact distance to put them right into the lanes and use some quick disconnector technology. Like push/twist locking


----------



## ivanlabrie

I was thinking more along the lines of a regular evap, easily detachable...but the thing would be calibrated for a certain load, so it might be tricky to run it with different gpus.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was thinking more along the lines of a regular evap, easily detachable...but the thing would be calibrated for a certain load, so it might be tricky to run it with different gpus.


I like complicated thinks though....


----------



## MikeG

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i wrote them with that question, can always try right, got a mail back yesterday,
> 
> Dear Mr. VonDutch,
> 
> in answer to your question if Microcenter likes to be a sponsor of the Delidded Ivy Bridge Club,
> and provide members with free 3770K's
> 
> 
> 
> please do not respond to this email, we surely won't contact you again ..ever!
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Microcenter Support






Nice one!


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> For being Dumb
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I dare u to post that in a WC thread...
> http://www.overclock.net/t/584302/ocn-water-cooling-club-and-picture-gallery/0_20
> Now say that stuff performs better then water in there so i can watch the replys LOL.
> 
> We are smarter then that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Many have tested and we all know the more pure the water = better cooling the more crap u put in it = less cooling...


Okay I missread the results but it performs almost as well as water... The nice attribute to Ice Dragon is that it allows for you to run lower pump speeds while performing better than other liquids at higher speeds.


----------



## justanoldman

So I read my email that says:
"Your order for Coollabratory Liquid Ultra has shipped"

Then I try to figure out what is wrong with me when I think:
"Ha, now you are in for it, you little WHEA generating, voltage hungry, heat generating, little time suck - Off With Your Head."


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol









Off with it already! xD


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> The nice attribute to Ice Dragon is that it allows for you to run lower pump speeds while performing better than other liquids at higher speeds.


I'm not familiar with Ice Dragon, but there could be some merit to that claim. I was running anti-freeze in my rad over the weekend to take advantage of the -8C outside temperatures (which is how I got to 5.6GHz.







). Besides not turning to slush, the anti-freeze let me run my D5 pump on high with less cavitation, but when tested indoors at 21C, distilled water outperformed the antifreeze by about 3C.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You got them siamese cats in your avatar?
I used to have 3 of em...I still miss them :/

Put that rad inside a bucket o dry ice (?)


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> well ive been running a stock cooler system (mount not in yet for nh-d14), seems okay. I'm getting quite a bit of blue screens though due to ram. bluescreenview and such says its most likely driver error, but it's a bit worrying. im crashing right away at 2000mhz xmp profile enabled on these ram.
> 
> 
> 
> What are your vtt and imc volts set at in the bios? Set them manually at 1.2v and 1.15v respectively...and dram voltage at 1.65v, that should work.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll try that.

I got my nh-d14 mount. going to run a 30 hour prime95 blend test with high ram to make sure everything is good with the system and ram (gotta leave ebay feedback), with stock cooler, stock settings, XMP profile on the ram. then i'll bin the 3570ks tommorow (see which one can pass 5ghz hyperpi 1m with the least voltage) and get to delidding.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool, go for hyperpi 32m stability if possible...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So I read my email that says:
> "Your order for Coollabratory Liquid Ultra has shipped"
> 
> Then I try to figure out what is wrong with me when I think:
> "Ha, now you are in for it, you little WHEA generating, voltage hungry, heat generating, little time suck - Off With Your Head."


When I do my video - I will say: "OFF WITH HIS HEAD!" I have no idea people, where that came from, but there was just an old man, that once told me this prophesy


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i want one that can do 2 graphic cards also
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but this guys is nice
> http://www.overclock.net/t/822433/littledevils-pc-case-with-integrated-phase-change-and-watercooling-place


Littledevil makes some of the more expensive units, but they are among the best. He does nice work!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was thinking more along the lines of a regular evap, easily detachable...but the thing would be calibrated for a certain load, so it might be tricky to run it with different gpus.


That, & gpus run hot. I gave the cascade a brief try with a 7970 but I really do need ln2 to get respectable scores, I don't know how 8 pack does it...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I'm not familiar with Ice Dragon, but there could be some merit to that claim. I was running anti-freeze in my rad over the weekend to take advantage of the -8C outside temperatures (which is how I got to 5.6GHz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). Besides not turning to slush, the anti-freeze let me run my D5 pump on high with less cavitation, but when tested indoors at 21C, distilled water outperformed the antifreeze by about 3C.


I didn't see too much difference between the premixed coolant (think mine was feser?) & distilled but wasn't really looking for a difference.
Either way, distilled is much cheaper, can pretty much be gotten anywhere, & doesn't make a mess when you're clumsy with filling & draining.
I still use the feser since I have it, comes in handy when it does get to -10 around here & I can leave it all outdoors to chill, doesn't freeze up as easily.


----------



## Valgaur

Okay! So RAM right now is sitting at 2400 megs at 8 12 12 27 at 1.75 volts. Finally pushing this new cpu!


----------



## Valgaur

Darn.... just bsoded at 5.1 with a wprime time of 4.776... ugh and 1024m of 145 seconds... darn it


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Okay! So RAM right now is sitting at 2400 megs at 8 12 12 27 at 1.75 volts. Finally pushing this new cpu!


What ram kit is that? Is it the one I reccomended you?
If that's the case, those timings suck for psc.









cl8-11-8-28-1t might work ok.


----------



## Valgaur

Ugh double.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> What ram kit is that? Is it the one I reccomended you?
> If that's the case, those timings suck for psc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cl8-11-8-28-1t might work ok.


The ones I bought from witchdoctor. Holy crap im cold. -12C temps in my room.

Ill try that later.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Totally Dubbed* wrote...When I do my video - I will say: "OFF WITH HIS HEAD!" I have no idea people, where that came from


...actually, I think I am the one who put it in play on this thread ('off with their heads') if you check the back-posts, but I can't collect royalties as this actually came from the Bastille / French Revolution. Noting that you sit in London, do you really want to give credit to the French ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The ones I bought from witchdoctor. Holy crap im cold. -12C temps in my room.
> 
> Ill try that later.


-12c?

Go for 1.85v and try 2600mhz cl8-12-8-28-1t then!
And try to run a 5ghz or more superpi 32m run








You know the tweaks? If not ask FtW...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...actually, I think I am the one who put it in play on this thread ('off with their heads') if you check the back-posts, but I can't collect royalties as this actually came from the Bastille / French Revolution. Noting that you sit in London, do you really want to give credit to the French ?


hahahaha
Get yo blades out lads! We got a competition here







!

As for the french - I'm fluent so, I'm not like one of those "english idiots" as I like to call them lol.
I don't want to be associated as an english man. Sorry if this offends anyone lol.

The "english man" has turned from someone like in my picture - a gentleman you see in james Bond, to people who throw insults, get drunks and think they know more than everyone in the world...ie. a punter.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...actually, I think I am the one who put it in play on this thread ('off with their heads') if you check the back-posts, but I can't collect royalties as this actually came from the Bastille / French Revolution. Noting that you sit in London, do you really want to give credit to the French ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hahahaha
> Get yo blades out lads! We got a competition here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> As for the french - I'm fluent so, I'm not like one of those "english idiots" as I like to call them lol.
> I don't want to be associated as an english man. Sorry if this offends anyone lol.
Click to expand...

A British not proud to be an Englishman? Move the America, you will fit right in.







Seriously though, with our upbringing, I think we all hate the Brits here. Me, my friends, my relatives, they all can't stand the Brits even though we don't have anything against them other than the War! Also, I'm Asian so I wasn't even in the middle of that fight before!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A British not proud to be an Englishman? Move the America, you will fit right in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously though, with our upbringing, I think we all hate the Brits here. Me, my friends, my relatives, they all can't stand the Brits even though we don't have anything against them other than the War! Also, I'm Asian so I wasn't even in the middle of that fight before!


That's not what Cali girls were like...couldn't give a ....about the rest








TEE HEE


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A British not proud to be an Englishman? Move the America, you will fit right in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously though, with our upbringing, I think we all hate the Brits here. Me, my friends, my relatives, they all can't stand the Brits even though we don't have anything against them other than the War! Also, I'm Asian so I wasn't even in the middle of that fight before!
> 
> 
> 
> That's not what Cali girls were like...couldn't give a ....about the rest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TEE HEE
Click to expand...

I honestly love how Asian girls grow up in Cali.







I'm not even exaggerating or joking around! Like I have some friends overseas in Asian and whenever I talk to them, it gets a bit annoying because they have no sense of humor and they always take everything seriously. On top of that (the most important note), they don't wear short enough shorts...







Even in the summer! Here though, we have amazing Asian girls prancing around taking jokes and can be fun to just talk to AND they wear those damn fine shorts.







Them legs!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> -12c?
> 
> Go for 1.85v and try 2600mhz cl8-12-8-28-1t then!
> And try to run a 5ghz or more superpi 32m run
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know the tweaks? If not ask FtW...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> -12c?
> 
> Go for 1.85v and try 2600mhz cl8-12-8-28-1t then!
> And try to run a 5ghz or more superpi 32m run
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know the tweaks? If not ask FtW...




those are my 32M and 1024M but I wasn't able to get a screenie of the new 1024 (this one) with the notepad for the OCN event right now...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hahahaha
> Get yo blades out lads! We got a competition here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> As for the french - I'm fluent so, I'm not like one of those "english idiots" as I like to call them lol.
> I don't want to be associated as an english man. Sorry if this offends anyone lol.
> 
> The "english man" has turned from someone like in my picture - a gentleman you see in james Bond, *to people who throw insults, get drunk*s and think they know more than everyone in the world...ie. a punter.


Not to offend, but isn't that Irish?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I honestly love how Asian girls grow up in Cali.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not even exaggerating or joking around! Like I have some friends overseas in Asian and whenever I talk to them, it gets a bit annoying because they have no sense of humor and they always take everything seriously. On top of that (the most important note), they don't wear short enough shorts...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even in the summer! Here though, we have amazing Asian girls prancing around taking jokes and can be fun to just talk to AND they wear those damn fine shorts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Them legs!


Short shorts







I like the way you think...


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> We get colored tubing


Agreed unless you like cleaning out gunk


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool, go for hyperpi 32m stability if possible...


hyperpi has failed me for stability testing before. Only 30+ hours of prime95, most mem (i mean max is preferable but gotta use computer for an hour or two so to be realistic) custom blend priority 10 is what i trust for stability testing. i've had many overclocks fail in 26th hour.

i just need to make sure this mobo, cpu, ram, and psu are all reliable. that's all. gotta leave feedback on the ram on ebay, i want to sleeve the psu so before i void the warranty i want to make sure the psu is okay (it makes a very faint chopping noise, the fan... kind of annoying, it's quiet but its an obnoxious, distinct sound).


----------



## FtW 420

Hyperpi is good for quick testing. If it passes hyperpi then continue with tougher testing if you want real stability, but if it doesn't even pass hyperpi there is no point in starting prime95 or IBT.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not to offend, but isn't that Irish?
> Short shorts
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the way you think...


hahahahaha - it is ALSO indeed









I like short shorts too!


----------



## Swag

The girl isn't bad but ain't my type.







Although, that's the length of short shorts they wear at my school and in my area...In general, these are the type of short shorts girls wear in SoCal (to me), girls the interest me.


Spoiler: Do NOT look if you are under 18


----------



## Joa3d43

...yeah, but can they cook ? (rhetorical question)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yeah, but can they cook ? (rhetorical question)


Wearing those shorts, who would notice?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yeah, but can they cook ? (rhetorical question)
> 
> 
> 
> Wearing those shorts, who would notice?
Click to expand...

YES! Someone who understands!


----------



## Belial

I'm failing p95 immediately (worker error, blue screen) with this XMP setting. I'm having a rather difficult time. setting 1.2vtt/1.15imc made it bsod 0024. i like hyperpi for quick stress test but in my experience if an overclock/setting/hardware is seriously faulty it'll fail p95 just as quickly as long as you set p95 priority to 10.


----------



## lilchronic

i got 5.1 ghz with out whea errors so far. dont think ima run prime 95 though


----------



## ivanlabrie

How odd belial...try more vdimm.
Have you tried booting and running memtest86+ with xmp?
If they can't run that without errors they are defective and you can rma or get a refund.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by FtW 420
> 
> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Joa3d43
> 
> ...yeah, but can they cook ? (rhetorical question)
> 
> Wearing those shorts, who would notice?
> YES! Someone who understands!


...having dated s.o. like her, I lost 20 pounds (not sure whether it was because of extra physical activity, or her lousy cooking)


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> How odd belial...try more vdimm.
> Have you tried booting and running memtest86+ with xmp?
> If they can't run that without errors they are defective and you can rma or get a refund.


I don't need to run memtest to know something isn't right. Passed a few hours of p95 with no issue with 1333 ie no xmp, but very clear bsod and issues and worker fails immediately in p95 and hyper pi rounding errors when turning on xmp, including changing vtt/imc (and i tested with multimeter to make sure its definitely getting 1.2/1.15/1.65 and it is like .02 or higher for most, imc is at 1.148 and not 1.15 but thats insignificant).

I'll try it though. Suppose it can't hurt, maybe that'll rule out imc and core voltages or something.

edit: look what I found:
Quote:


> Hello,
> 
> Unfortunately our PX538G2000ELK is only intended for the Intel P55.
> 
> The reason why it's not working at 2000 is because the Z77 does not have a native DDR3-2000 strap. Thus with XMP, it's setting the memory strap to 1866 and overclocking the CPU Baseclock to compensate. Unfortunately you might have to settle for manually setting it to 1866 and slowly increasing the Baseclock from 100-107 at it's max point.


Was getting nothing on multiple searches on this subject until I added "2000". This guy is talking about someone using a totally different system but the answer seems relevant.

edit2: actually i dont know. i mean in bios it says ram multi x20, and my fsb is 100.

edit3: turning up the multi (i see its not really a multi, its just ram divider simplified, ie 21 just goes to 2000mhz, x22 is 2133, etc) to 2133mhz seems to have fixed the issue. I mean hyperpi isn't getting rounding errors instantly, p95 is running. seems you cant run 2000mhz on z77 or something. thanks for the help, seems like ram is totally fine. just some weird z77 issue.


----------



## Hokies83

Just ordered me one of these LOL....


----------



## [CyGnus]

nice toy


----------



## King4x4

This baby never failed me!


----------



## mandrix

I got one of these, and fill it up with the compressor in my shop. I took the tire air chuck off and put a quick release valve for my blower, and I plug in a water/crud filter when I fill 'er up so I get nice clean air. 110 psi! lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A British not proud to be an Englishman? Move the America, you will fit right in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously though, with our upbringing, I think we all hate the Brits here. Me, my friends, my relatives, they all can't stand the Brits even though we don't have anything against them other than the War! Also, I'm Asian so I wasn't even in the middle of that fight before!


I've had quite a few British friends. I live in a resort area and I've met many British guys and girls on internship or on a work visa for months or years at a time. The highlight was when this one guy who actually worked in the area twice, once while he was in school and he liked it so much he got a work visa and came back. Anyway he wanted to know what College Football was all about and why 150,000 people sit in parking lots drinking beer, grilling food, and playing games then 85,000 of them cram themselves into a stadium just for a game. I mean they have soccer over there but there's no tailgating, almost unheard of. I took him to South Carolina vs Georgia, of course we went out on the town the night before and got sloshed, he was too hungover to drink before the game (I thought Englishman could drink?) but we had a good time, then went out after the game and the English accent is very popular with the South Carolina girls, so that was a useful tool in getting us a little action that night. Good times.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I don't need to run memtest to know something isn't right. Passed a few hours of p95 with no issue with 1333 ie no xmp, but very clear bsod and issues and worker fails immediately in p95 and hyper pi rounding errors when turning on xmp, including changing vtt/imc (and i tested with multimeter to make sure its definitely getting 1.2/1.15/1.65 and it is like .02 or higher for most, imc is at 1.148 and not 1.15 but thats insignificant).
> 
> I'll try it though. Suppose it can't hurt, maybe that'll rule out imc and core voltages or something.
> 
> edit: look what I found:
> Was getting nothing on multiple searches on this subject until I added "2000". This guy is talking about someone using a totally different system but the answer seems relevant.
> 
> edit2: actually i dont know. i mean in bios it says ram multi x20, and my fsb is 100.
> 
> edit3: turning up the multi (i see its not really a multi, its just ram divider simplified, ie 21 just goes to 2000mhz, x22 is 2133, etc) to 2133mhz seems to have fixed the issue. I mean hyperpi isn't getting rounding errors instantly, p95 is running. seems you cant run 2000mhz on z77 or something. thanks for the help, seems like ram is totally fine. just some weird z77 issue.


Actually on my current motherboard, I can't get 2133MHz stable like I did on my ASUS but 2200MHz works just fine with the same timings and yields better scores. So who's got two thumbs and tight timings?







<--- This Guy!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> This baby never failed me!


lol, I just use an air compressor with an inline filter. Since I do woodwork for a living I have three of them and keep one in the garage.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> Bad news guys helpinghand.gif
> 
> my first delidded chip is half dead. hd 4000 internal gpu wont work anymore. windows welcome screen is black or sometimes just lines and colorful dots... i disabled hd 4000 in device manager so cpu works but no games or videos.i made a mistake. i lapped inner ihs for better contact with die but it seems liquid metal strached cpu die. there's no visual damage but something went wrong that's for sure. maybe massive pressure occured on die i don't know. the only thing i know is i have a half dead cpu. i was gonna sell it tomorrow.. darn....
> 
> 
> 
> You might have shorted it a small bit... which I find hard to do... but about die if you know the die it has a glass cover protecting the silicon under it from getting damaged from the IHS. What you might have is a fatal error in the CPU itself or maybe a smaller mobo short (which can occur if you don't ground yourself every few minutes) don't you have a gpu? If not... get one then you'll be fine.
Click to expand...

Any more info on that I_shot?
I am about to lap my IHS, underside included, so I am a bit worried with what happened to you...
Do you think the lapping has something to do or is it only static electricity that damaged your CPU?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> The rubber gloves will negate any electricity.


Will I avoid any risk with usual rubber gloves or will it be safer to use such a tool?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You might have shorted it a small bit... which I find hard to do... but about die if you know the die it has a glass cover protecting the silicon under it from getting damaged from the IHS. What you might have is a fatal error in the CPU itself or maybe a smaller mobo short (which can occur if you don't ground yourself every few minutes) don't you have a gpu? If not... get one then you'll be fine.


I'm done with delidding. This is the second time i'm having problems after delid. There's always been a problem no matter what i do. I have a decent chip now but i won't delid it. My ideas changed because of endless delidding problems.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Any more info on that I_shot?
> I am about to lap my IHS, underside included, so I am a bit worried with what happened to you...
> Do you think the lapping has something to do or is it only static electricity that damaged your CPU?
> Will I avoid any risk with usual rubber gloves or will it be safer to use such a tool?


You know i am a big fan of the club but i'm really pissed of right now. I quit delidding . I hate to see something goes wrong.I always work with bare foot preventing static electricity but man if it's gonna happen, it happens







Turkish expression







I told my customers that delidding is dangerous and i don't want to take responsibility for it. 2 chips died after delid but i have to say i always poke with my system .These two are my mistakes i never stop ,always trying for better so it ended up bad. Anyway i don't recommend lapping inner ihs too much cause the pressure on die rises up it might hurt cpu . BTW after lapping inner ihs temps were absolutely amazing but always consider the risk.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Let's call it bad luck... sorry for you man
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Anyway *i don't recommend lapping inner ihs too much cause the pressure on die rises up it might hurt cpu* . BTW after lapping inner ihs temps were absolutely amazing but always consider the risk.


Thanx for that info!


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Let's call it bad luck... sorry for you man
> Thanx for that info!


No problem







but again in my situation lapping may not be the problem don't know %100 sure. but it happened after lapping. first try and boom







dots and lines welcomed me


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> My new chip arrived i think it's a decent chip. it's not delidded right now but it is gonna be soon of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyway here it is


You might want to install SP1/Updating LinX before calling it stable. AVX needs more voltage to be stable.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> No problem
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but again in my situation lapping may not be the problem don't know %100 sure. but it happened after lapping. first try and boom
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dots and lines welcomed me


Hmm, I bet you don't want that much to talk about it.... but could you tell me how / what did you use to lap the underside?
Something flat and small enough, on which you lay sandpaper and then move or rotate it?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> You might want to install SP1/Updating LinX before calling it stable. AVX needs more voltage to be stable.


It's already AVX . look at gflops.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Hmm, I bet you don't want that much to talk about it.... but could you tell me how / what did you use to lap the underside?
> Something flat and small enough, on which you lay sandpaper and then move or rotate it?


600 grid paper.30 moves per corner. that was too much i think.lay the paper on a flat surface then move ihs on paper forward and backward


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> It's already AVX . look at gflops.


Oh right! I was looking at time! :doh

I usually use IBT which is the same program really except the time/GFLOPS are around the other way


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> It's already AVX . look at gflops.


I_shot, can you use the embed a image, and upload your pics from your computer,
instead of using it linked to imageshack? takes ages to load, and i like to open pics in a new tab,
so i can adjust with zoom..its easier









i still dont get why peeps try to lap the inside of the ihs, alot of hassle, and no real gains when doing so,
when you dont get it right, and its a bit uneven because of trying to lap it,
the pressure on the die when you re-assamble it will be different too, which can lead to damage,
what do they say, "when its not broken, dont try fix it" ? ..something like that i think it was ..lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> I_shot, can you use the embed a image, and upload your pics from your computer,
> instead of using it linked to imageshack? takes ages to load, and i like to open pics in a new tab,
> so i can adjust with zoom..its easier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i still dont get why peeps try to lap the inside of the ihs, alot of hassle, and no real gains when doing so,
> when you dont get it right, and its a bit uneven because of trying to lap it,
> the pressure on the die when you re-assamble it will be different too, which can lead to damage,
> what do they say, "when its not broken, dont try fix it" ? ..something like that i think it was ..lol


haha that could apply to de-lidding too though









I got a package that has arrived for me at reception....can't be the CLU already surely 0.0!?
Just placed an order for the anti-static wrist band too - should come in next week


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> haha that could apply to de-lidding too though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got a package that has arrived for me at reception....can't be the CLU already surely 0.0!?
> Just placed an order for the anti-static wrist band too - should come in next week


but delidding improves performance when done right,
20-30C tempdrop gives you alot more ocing headroom..








lapping ihs, or even the inside ihs, doesnt, 1-3C max, if any..
i would only lap the ihs if after everything temps where still high,
or difference between cores are still over 13-15C (concave ihs)


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> 600 grid paper.30 moves per corner. that was too much i think.lay the paper on a flat surface then move ihs on paper forward and backward


600 for a start, but 3000 for mirror like!








What do you mean by '30 moves *per corner*'?

For the inner side of the IHS, I am still looking for something like a squared metal bar to be used as the flat surface (green one)

A and B would have to be of course smaller than the IHS. Forward and backward movement will be very limited, thus hard to stay flat...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VD*
> i still dont get why peeps try to lap the inside of the ihs


Because of poor contact (will check when delidded how it really is there under):

and because if I delid why not do the job till the end
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TD*
> haha that could apply to de-lidding too though tongue.gif


Bam!









Well, I will first see how the lapping of the easy side goes, and then decide if I do the other too...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> but delidding improves performance when done right,
> 20-30C tempdrop gives you alot more ocing headroom..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lapping ihs, or even the inside ihs, doesnt, 1-3C max, if any..
> i would only lap the ihs if after everything temps where still high,
> or difference between cores are still over 13-15C (concave ihs)


You sir are very correct!

As for the pictures of the other guy - I was going to say the same thing lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Because of poor contact (will check when delidded how it really is there under):
> 
> and because if I delid why not do the job till the end


yes, like i said, if after all temps are still bad, maybe then,
but a Q. , how did your make that pressure point, by re-assemble everything, or just put some pressure on it by hand?
are your temps very bad now ? like way more compared to others?

job till the end??
theres no job after delid, normally you put it back together , and enjoy your new temps ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> As for the pictures of the other guy - I was going to say the same thing lol.


yea, so its not only me who noticed it..does it load slow for you also?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, so its not only me who noticed it..does it load slow for you also?


Super slow!


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yes, like i said, if after all temps are still bad, maybe then,
> but a Q. , how did your make that pressure point, by re-assemble everything, or just put some pressure on it by hand?
> are your temps very bad now ? like way more compared to others?


Not delidded yet, I just removed TIM, put contact film instead and re-assembled NH-C14 back in place.
Edit: at load max core T° is 86/98°C, with 1.275V @4.5GHz
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> job till the end??
> theres no job after delid, normally you put it back together , and enjoy your new temps ..lol


Delidding goal is to get a proper CPU right, not one with a concave IHS.








But I agree, maybe I am going too far for nothing or very small improvement in the end.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> I_shot, can you use the embed a image, and upload your pics from your computer,
> instead of using it linked to imageshack? takes ages to load, and i like to open pics in a new tab,
> so i can adjust with zoom..its easier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i still dont get why peeps try to lap the inside of the ihs, alot of hassle, and no real gains when doing so,
> when you dont get it right, and its a bit uneven because of trying to lap it,
> the pressure on the die when you re-assamble it will be different too, which can lead to damage,
> what do they say, "when its not broken, dont try fix it" ? ..something like that i think it was ..lol


Got it. Yeah i give it a try but it failed me









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Oh right! I was looking at time! :doh
> 
> I usually use IBT which is the same program really except the time/GFLOPS are around the other way


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> 600 for a start, but 3000 for mirror like!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you mean by '30 moves *per corner*'?
> 
> For the inner side of the IHS, I am still looking for something like a squared metal bar to be used as the flat surface (green one)
> 
> A and B would have to be of course smaller than the IHS. Forward and backward movement will be very limited, thus hard to stay flat...
> Because of poor contact (will check when delidded how it really is there under):
> 
> and because if I delid why not do the job till the end
> Bam!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I will first see how the lapping of the easy side goes, and then decide if I do the other too...


Same method as this


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Not delidded yet, I just removed TIM, put contact film instead and re-assembled NH-C14 back in place.
> Edit: at load max core T° is 86/98°C, with 1.275V @4.5GHz
> Delidding goal is to get a proper CPU right, not one with a concave IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I agree, maybe I am going too far for nothing or very small improvement in the end.


now i understand ..sorry









yes, delidding is a process that makes ivy run like it supposed to run in the first place,
tempwise that is..lol









but then BaK2BaK, first delid, see how it goes, when something is still off,
then start thinking about lapping,
before delid for example, my core difference was about 15C, after it was 4-6C,
i bet if i would look, and i will next time i take it apart, mine is a bit concave too ..


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Same method as this


Cool, thx for the link!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just ordered me one of these LOL....


Yeah we have a few of those dusters at work. They have pretty good force behind them!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Has anyone tried trolling Intel btw?
Calling them and recording their answers as to why they put crap thermal paste on the die?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I don't need to run memtest to know something isn't right. Passed a few hours of p95 with no issue with 1333 ie no xmp, but very clear bsod and issues and worker fails immediately in p95 and hyper pi rounding errors when turning on xmp, including changing vtt/imc (and i tested with multimeter to make sure its definitely getting 1.2/1.15/1.65 and it is like .02 or higher for most, imc is at 1.148 and not 1.15 but thats insignificant).
> 
> I'll try it though. Suppose it can't hurt, maybe that'll rule out imc and core voltages or something.
> 
> edit: look what I found:
> Was getting nothing on multiple searches on this subject until I added "2000". This guy is talking about someone using a totally different system but the answer seems relevant.
> 
> edit2: actually i dont know. i mean in bios it says ram multi x20, and my fsb is 100.
> 
> edit3: turning up the multi (i see its not really a multi, its just ram divider simplified, ie 21 just goes to 2000mhz, x22 is 2133, etc) to 2133mhz seems to have fixed the issue. I mean hyperpi isn't getting rounding errors instantly, p95 is running. seems you cant run 2000mhz on z77 or something. thanks for the help, seems like ram is totally fine. just some weird z77 issue.


Good, you now got a 2133mhz kit with *****in' timings








Give maxxmem preview a go, and post your score with 5ghz cpu.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Has anyone tried trolling Intel btw?
> Calling them and recording their answers as to why they put crap thermal paste on the die?


Valgaur has methinks...


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You got them siamese cats in your avatar?
> I used to have 3 of em...I still miss them :/


Yeah, I love these guys--smart as heck--I even have them trained to use the toilet.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Put that rad inside a bucket o dry ice (?)


Just on the balcony, was doing some benching for the multithreaded mayhem:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Just on the balcony, was doing some benching for the multithreaded mayhem:


epic!


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Not delidded yet, I just removed TIM, put contact film instead and re-assembled NH-C14 back in place.
> Edit: at load max core T° is 86/98°C, with 1.275V @4.5GHz
> Delidding goal is to get a proper CPU right, not one with a concave IHS.
> But I agree, maybe I am going too far for nothing or very small improvement in the end.
> 
> 
> 
> now i understand ..sorry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yes, delidding is a process that makes ivy run like it supposed to run in the first place,
> tempwise that is..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but then BaK2BaK, first delid, see how it goes, when something is still off,
> then start thinking about lapping,
> before delid for example, my core difference was about 15C, after it was 4-6C,
> i bet if i would look, and i will next time i take it apart, mine is a bit concave too ..
Click to expand...

I agree with VonDutch to wait before lapping. I just read a review on the NH-C14 that states that the surface is slightly convex. I imagine they did this on purpose to match the concaveness of the CPU. My temps actually got worse by one or two degrees after lapping, but I was only testing with the stock Intel cooler.

Does anyone know why Intel makes the IHS concave? I would guess that they specifically mill it to make it concave and not by accident. Perhaps so that gravity would pull any excess TIM towards the center and not run out over the edges? Just guessing, but I can tell you that my Koolance 380I was convex, and my CPU concave before lapping.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Just received my CLU - but I'm going to file a claim against the seller unless someone corrects me:
As soon as I got the package, I noticed the "syringe" wasn't at the top - as soon as I opened it, I saw the inside of the cap, and it looks like it has been used - someone correct me If I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm going to accept this one:






EDIT:
Looked up an unboxing video:





And that guy didn't seem to have what I did - already contacted the eBay seller.


----------



## King4x4

Most likely customs took a sample of it.


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just ordered me one of these LOL....


I have one of those.... It really is amazing


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Most likely customs took a sample of it.


What if it wasn't imported







?


----------



## MikeG

Looks like you are also missing the hypodermic needle on the end.


----------



## VonDutch

Ultra comes without needle,
pro with needle









it prolly got squished somewhere during transport..


----------



## Gomi

Ultra does not come with a needle at the end ... Or did I remember wrong, thought only Pro came with the needle.

Edit: Nevermind, too slow


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Ultra does not come with a needle at the end ... Or did I remember wrong, thought only Pro came with the needle.
> 
> Edit: Nevermind, too slow










hehe..


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Just received my CLU - but I'm going to file a claim against the seller unless someone corrects me:
> As soon as I got the package, I noticed the "syringe" wasn't at the top - as soon as I opened it, I saw the inside of the cap, and it looks like it has been used - someone correct me If I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm going to accept this one:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT:
> Looked up an unboxing video:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And that guy didn't seem to have what I did - already contacted the eBay seller.


I can at least confirm that ultra does not have a syringe tip. Only the pro uses the syringe tip. But as for the leakage that is a completely different story. Probably temperature fluctuation in the trip? We had some major cold days last week.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Oh I know it doesn't come with the syringe TIP, but you know when you compress the "top" and push it against a cap? Or have some of it out, and then put a cap on it?
That's what it seems like has been done.

Regardless, some CLU has been "used" be it by a person or by the box (lol) - seller should pay for return postage and send one out ASAP, unless he wants a nice claim on eBay for "not advertised as NEW condition" - his choice









I really should have trained to become a lawyer....so many things that have happened in my life, and I wish sometimes I knew the exact law behind a few things. Many lawyer friends have already told me: "you would have made an excellent lawyer"








"It is not the matter of money, but a matter of principle" -> a saying a friend and I always had. Him being a top class lawyer


----------



## VonDutch

i think the law is very simple with things like this,
when a new bought product doesnt get delivered complete or kaputt,
you can return it, ask for refund, or ask for a replacement product that works or is complete..

my law is the most simple one,
i just start hitting people till they say,
"stop stop!, i give you your money back, and here take the whole box ultra!" ....LOL


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Oh I know it doesn't come with the syringe TIP, but you know when you compress the "top" and push it against a cap? Or have some of it out, and then put a cap on it?
> That's what it seems like has been done.
> 
> Regardless, some CLU has been "used" be it by a person or by the box (lol) - seller should pay for return postage and send one out ASAP, unless he wants a nice claim on eBay for "not advertised as NEW condition" - his choice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I really should have trained to become a lawyer....so many things that have happened in my life, and I wish sometimes I knew the exact law behind a few things. Many lawyer friends have already told me: "you would have made an excellent lawyer"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "It is not the matter of money, but a matter of principle" -> a saying a friend and I always had. Him being a top class lawyer


Gallium liquifies at 30c so check if there are hot stop overs during your shipping. For instance if your starting in the Netherlands where it's cold and the next stop your cl ultra is sitting in Jamaica overnight before going somewhere cold again. This is like a freeze thaw and would be a nice explanation for the leak. Get your money back anyways but I would bet the guy didn't purposely try to rip you off.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i think the law is very simple with things like this,
> when a new bought product doesnt get delivered complete or kaputt,
> you can return it, ask for refund, or ask for a replacement product that works or is complete..


Oh of course, this is a very simple matter of it was opened somehow or shipping wasn't dealt properly - if anything it could be CL's fault, rather than the eBay seller.
No with the law I was talking generally, and with other - more serious matters. This is literally nothing to be worried about.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Gallium liquifies at 30c so check if there are hot stop overs during your shipping. For instance if your starting in the Netherlands where it's cold and the next stop your cl ultra is sitting in Jamaica overnight before going somewhere cold again. This is like a freeze thaw and would be a nice explanation for the leak. Get your money back anyways but I would bet the guy didn't purposely try to rip you off.


Oh yeah of course- great explanation too btw!


----------



## Gomi

For whatever it is worth, with the PRO (Or at least the one I bought) I could actully still press the liquid out, even though the "lid" was on ( Resulting in the inside of the "lid" looking shiny ) - So I now have it stored safely away from the children - Any other TIM I used, it was impossible to squeeze it out with the lid on.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Ultra comes without needle,
> pro with needle
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *it prolly got squished somewhere during transport..*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> For whatever it is worth, with the PRO (Or at least the one I bought) I could actully still press the liquid out, even though the "lid" was on ( Resulting in the inside of the "lid" looking shiny ) - So I now have it stored safely away from the children - Any other TIM I used, it was impossible to squeeze it out with the lid on.


thats why i was thinking that earlier.....but noone ever listens to me


----------



## VonDutch

k, back to my new fav tv-show ...fringe! ..laters peeps


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> thats why i was thinking that earlier.....but noone ever listens to me


I always listen man! I did see your post


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Has anyone tried trolling Intel btw?
> Calling them and recording their answers as to why they put crap thermal paste on the die?


I have. I almost got to the point of screaming at them asking why they put a horrible TIM on it (was taking to the general manager to lol) he was like... but it works fine though... I snap back going then why the heck can't I get past 1.35 vcore on chips without hitting thermal limits of 105C I mean really!

I was a little mad.....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good, you now got a 2133mhz kit with *****in' timings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Give maxxmem preview a go, and post your score with 5ghz cpu.
> Valgaur has methinks...


Yeah... they don't like me anymore either....

I reeeeeeeally wanna delid today guys.... I want awesome temps so I don't freeze my ass off anymore for this Multi threaded comp with mr kitty cat from ealier (I'm horrible with names) uuuuuuum I_Shot PM me and lets examine your chip.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I always listen man! I did see your post


lol..i know ..just kidding,
but when i saw Gomi's post, i thought my remark got more plausible









whats with you all saying the intel tim is bad?

it isnt that bad you know









i had some conversatrions with idontcare over at anandforum about stuff,
then we came to talk about the so called "bad" intel tim....
wait...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Idontcare*
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> haha, yea, kinda "stole" the avatar :whiste:
> hope you dont mind, its a great way to start a conversation with peeps about delidding, many ask about it when they see my avatar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yes, it makes more sense now, thanks for the quick response too, great..
> 
> several members used another tim at first after delid,
> i used AS5 because i had to wait for liquid pro to arrive, but already noticed my temps where going up again after about 12-14days.. others reported the same, thats the pump out effect..i get it..
> 
> so, the reason the intel tim is so "bad", is
> 1. the low w/mk
> 2. the thickness of the tim to bridge the gap?
> 3. it doesnt pump out because of it composition,(plastic like as you say, or solid pad)
> 
> the thicker (layer) the tim, the worse the heat transfer will be, right..
> 
> yea, we get the people that want to delid, and visit the [Official] Delidded Ivy Bridge Club, to use liquid pro or ultra, it works the best when used on the die,
> i think because of the high w/mk it has, even ic diamond(4.5 W/m-K) cant compete with them,
> i wrote coollabs to ask for the w/mk of both,
> seems the 82 w/mk for liquid pro used all around is wrong,
> liquid pro 32.6 w/mk
> liquid ultra 38.4 w/mk
> confirmed by coollabs so, maybe you can use it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> man, really thank you for your help, will read your reply several times, and will think about how to answer the next time it will come up over there,
> 
> VonDutch, Fred
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hehe, I'm all for re-purposing the pics and whatever else is out there, its all public domain :thumbsup: As as you please, Fred, by all means
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And, at the risk of belaboring the point, I would like to go back and touch on this one part of your post above:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> ...so, the reason the intel tim is so "bad", is
> 1. the low w/mk
> 2. the thickness of the tim to bridge the gap?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I agree, but you got to use a big disclaimer with your bullet #1 which is that the stock Intel TIM is only "low w/mk" in comparison to the solder used with Sandy Bridge processors, it is not "low w/mk? in comparison to a tier-1 TIM like NT-H1.
> 
> *In fact, as my tests demonstrated, the thermal conductivity of NT-H1 (as good as it is) is worse than the thermal conductivity of the Intel stock CPU TIM.* The Intel stock TIM only looks bad because it has to be so thick by virtue of the gap Intel puts between the IHS and the CPU.
> 
> *I only belabor this point because it is so easy for people to get confused and start saying things like "the TIM is cheap, why did Intel use a cheap TIM?", when the reality is that the TIM is not cheap*, it is better than NT-H1, but it is not as good as solder (and it is cheaper than solder)...so you have to clarify these sorts of comparisons by making sure it is understood what you are comparing the Intel TIM to when you say things like "low" and "cheap" just to avoid misunderstandings.
> 
> Also, while I don't regularly lurk in OCN, I have great respect for it on the basis of the few times I have lurked over there. That said, I don't know if this is common knowledge, so my apologies in advance if I am insulting you by stating something everyone knows, but I have it on good authority from Intel employees that Haswell desktop chips will also be TIM and not solder.
Click to expand...

theres more, but i think this one is to the point








and has a little bit of news in it for the observant reader ...LOL
not gonna delete it tho..
we know by now the "bad" temps ivy's have, is caused by the distance between ihs and die,
not because intel used a "bad' or cheap tim









hope this helps ..so stop calling intel pls ..haha..


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Haha very good post! Cheers for the info!


----------



## I_shot

main reason is not enough proper contact between die and ihs yeah i agree that but i still don't think stock paste is better than NH-1. Every thermal paste has a weak,average and great contact ability so we can't say that intel's tim is better than NH-1 or other performance TIMs. It's very hard to test though i believe every cpu mount pressure on cpu die changes a bit


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol..i know ..just kidding,
> but when i saw Gomi's post, i thought my remark got more plausible
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> whats with you all saying the intel tim is bad?
> 
> it isnt that bad you know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i had some conversatrions with idontcare over at anandforum about stuff,
> then we came to talk about the so called "bad" intel tim....
> wait...
> theres more, but i think this one is to the point
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and has a little bit of news in it for the observant reader ...LOL
> not gonna delete it tho..
> we know by now the "bad" temps ivy's have, is caused by the distance between ihs and die,
> not because intel used a "bad' or cheap tim
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hope this helps ..so stop calling intel pls ..haha..


Von this was a long time ago right after I delidded... should have stated that I guess lol.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Von this was a long time ago right after I delidded... should have stated that I guess lol.


we came a long way since then bro,

we know so much less now ..lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> main reason is not enough proper contact between die and ihs yeah i agree that but i still don't think stock paste is better than NH-1. Every thermal paste has a weak,average and great contact ability so we can't say that intel's tim is better than NH-1 or other performance TIMs. It's very hard to test though i believe every cpu mount pressure on cpu die changes a bit


trust me, the guy i talked to, knows his stuff, and hes a great tester,
when he says things like that, he prolly tested it somehow ..lol,
he once did a test with fingerprints and hair on the ihs,
didnt make that much of a difference(2-3 it was i think) ...lol..i still clean everything very well tho


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> we came a long way since then bro,
> 
> we know so much less now ..lol


Lol yeah we are stupid deeeeerp. Lol we have come a long way though, all the info on here and everything lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Totally Dubbed* wrote...Just received my CLU - but I'm going to file a claim against the seller unless someone corrects me:
> As soon as I got the package, I noticed the "syringe" wasn't at the top - as soon as I opened it, I saw the inside of the cap, and it looks like it has been used - someone correct me If I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm going to accept this one:


My package of six syringes should be here any day now according to CoolLaboratory / DHL...and I expect at least one of them to have been opened.

When this stuff crosses international shipping boundaries, it apparently gets the attention of customs officers (due to the liquid metal). I know of people here in Vancouver who received theirs with half the content gone and that being traced back to customs 'for testing'. Now, if all of my 6 syringes have been opened and half-emptied, I am going to write a very naughty letter to the federal Minister in charge of customs, cc the media


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Haha! It is when you threaten them that they take action.
True story. Sad story.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Haha! It is when you threaten them that they take action.
> True story. Sad story.


Customs hate computer guys like us due to our "unregular" products that come from other countries... dang them.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Customs hate computer guys like us due to our "unregular" products that come from other countries... dang them.


The only danger our products do is the damage to our wallets lol.


----------



## MikeG

So Liquid Ultra has a higher thermal conductivity than Liquid Pro? Rats! I'm using Liquid Pro.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> *Totally Dubbed* wrote...Just received my CLU - but I'm going to file a claim against the seller unless someone corrects me:
> As soon as I got the package, I noticed the "syringe" wasn't at the top - as soon as I opened it, I saw the inside of the cap, and it looks like it has been used - someone correct me If I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm going to accept this one:
> 
> 
> 
> My package of six syringes should be here any day now according to CoolLaboratory / DHL...and I expect at least one of them to have been opened.
> 
> When this stuff crosses international shipping boundaries, it apparently gets the attention of customs officers (due to the liquid metal). I know of people here in Vancouver who received theirs with half the content gone and that being traced back to customs 'for testing'. Now, if all of my 6 syringes have been opened and half-emptied, I am going to write a very naughty letter to the federal Minister in charge of customs, cc the media
Click to expand...

PM me and I'll tell you how to *not* make that happen


----------



## alancsalt

Tell me about it. An EK GTX 580 waterblock of mine was held up by Aussie customs, until I found out, phoned and told them what it was. They charged me $47.30 for the privilege of being inspected. "User pays".
Quote:


> The $47.30 fee is a DHL charge for Quarantine processing carried out by Australian Quarantine and Inspection Service (AQIS). Not every shipment requires AQIS inspection, which is the reason these fees cannot be quoted prior to the shipments arrival and why they do not form part of the shipping charges


Interesting that TNT shipments were never stopped but DHL were. Maybe they have a "history" with customs.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Tell me about it. An EK GTX 580 waterblock of mine was held up by Aussie customs, until I found out, phoned and told them what it was. They charged me $47.30 for the privilege of being inspected. "User pays".
> Interesting that TNT shipments were never stopped but DHL were. Maybe they have a "history" with customs.


Yeah I don't know what it is really... they hate us I swear.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> So Liquid Ultra has a higher thermal conductivity than Liquid Pro? Rats! I'm using Liquid Pro.


thats true, but somehow most of the time pro performs a bit better, not sure why tho,
and i didnt really test it myself yet,
overall theres not much difference between the two..so no worries


----------



## ivanlabrie

Easy: NEVER use private couriers for international shipping, use USPS or China post or whatever.

@VonDutch: if anything I prefer the needle the pro comes with, and I think it's easier to spread on the die than Ultra. Also, I have a bit of faith that the purest metal alloy in it will help with tim pump out, whereas Ultra might pump a bit to the sides with tim, being a more complex mixture. That's just speculation though...


----------



## justanoldman

From VonDutch's post:
"I don't know if this is common knowledge, so my apologies in advance if I am insulting you by stating something everyone knows, but I have it on good authority from Intel employees that Haswell desktop chips will also be TIM and not solder."

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but does that mean we can infer Haswell will need to be delidded too, or is it possible Intel learned something from their Ivy mistake?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> From VonDutch's post:
> "I don't know if this is common knowledge, so my apologies in advance if I am insulting you by stating something everyone knows, but I have it on good authority from Intel employees that Haswell desktop chips will also be TIM and not solder."
> 
> Sorry if this is a dumb question, but does that mean we can infer Haswell will need to be delidded too, or is it possible Intel learned something from their Ivy mistake?


I'll go ask lol. Also if they use TIM maybe they will fix the IHS issue and then we wont need to delid buuuut if we need to I'll go ahead and delid on as well.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> @VonDutch: if anything I prefer the needle the pro comes with, and I think it's easier to spread on the die than Ultra. Also, I have a bit of faith that the purest metal alloy in it will help with tim pump out, whereas Ultra might pump a bit to the sides with tim, being a more complex mixture. That's just speculation though...


you have a point there, ultra does contain more components then pro,
i looked for it once,
but thanks to it being a liquid, both have less problems with pump-out,
it doesnt harden (as quick) like other tims, it just flows back,
while normal tim gets warm, then pumped out, and gets "solid" again much faster,

yea, i like the pro better, the needle is better i think,
if i look at others and how fast they use it all, compared to
howmany applications i did with it, but im curious now about
Ultra, and how its gonna work for me..next month i have money to buy some

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> From VonDutch's post:
> "I don't know if this is common knowledge, so my apologies in advance if I am insulting you by stating something everyone knows, but I have it on good authority from Intel employees that Haswell desktop chips will also be TIM and not solder."
> 
> Sorry if this is a dumb question, but does that mean we can infer Haswell will need to be delidded too, or is it possible Intel learned something from their Ivy mistake?


we can only hope intel learned from their mistake,
if not ..yea, it prolly gonna be delid time again with haswell ...yippie!! ..lol








i think im gonna skip a generation anyways ..

bedtime, G'night guys


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ugh, guys I can't believe these guys at a local forum...they keep arguing non-sense justifying their advice by saying 'I own an H60 it's great and better than most air coolers' bla bla.
Then they can't deal with the hard facts presented by me, in the form of tons of review links showing a lot of air coolers beating that crappy aio out of the glycol* (water lol), and still they keep arguing back.
'I have a Cm V6 and it's quiet, I'd reccomend Deepcool coolers over that HR-02 Macho you reccomend, or an h60'
That thing is NOT quiet, you can see it in tons of reviews.
They say the reviewers are paid by the companies and bla bla...man I'm pissed, I hate it when people proclaim personal experience and biased claims as fact.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ugh, guys I can't believe these guys at a local forum...they keep arguing non-sense justifying their advice by saying 'I own an H60 it's great and better than most air coolers' bla bla.
> Then they can't deal with the hard facts presented by me, in the form of tons of review links showing a lot of air coolers beating that crappy aio out of the glycol* (water lol), and still they keep arguing back.
> 'I have a Cm V6 and it's quiet, I'd reccomend Deepcool coolers over that HR-02 Macho you reccomend, or an h60'
> That thing is NOT quiet, you can see it in tons of reviews.
> They say the reviewers are paid by the companies and bla bla...man I'm pissed, I hate it when people proclaim personal experience and biased claims as fact.


yeah I agree fully. there was a while back a guy who didn't understand why I delidded and I showed him my initial post of Mhz temps drops and everything... and he was like.,.... it didnt drop at all though! you risked your chip for nothing!..... I'm thinking what are you smoking!?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Is an air cooler as good as a liquid cooler though? I would have thought a liquid cooler is not only cooler but also more silent?


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Is an air cooler as good as a liquid cooler though? I would have thought a liquid cooler is not only cooler but also more silent?


The closed circuit "all in one" loops are roughly equal to good air. A custom loop is better.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Is an air cooler as good as a liquid cooler though? I would have thought a liquid cooler is not only cooler but also more silent?


Thats usually the general thought process but sometimes it isn't true at all. Some aircooler like the NH-D14 have very good and quiet fans and can perform as good or even better than an H100. for great aircoolers/watercoolers like H100 etc etc you need great fans like the Noctua brand of Cougars, both are amazingly quiet and are very good for static pressure and airflow. albeit more expensive but well worth it most of the time.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, even the mods are pricks...now I remember why I didn't bother to post so much there.

'ivanlabire, esto es un foro de opinion donde se comparte informacion y experiencias. Por ende hay muchos usuarios que tubieron muchas experiencias variadas y por mas que leas todos los reviews del mundo, su experiencia fue real porque la vivieron, entonces o aprendes a respetar las opiniones de los demas o vas a tener problemas. Podes dar opiniones, pero estas muy equivocado si podes criticar lo que otro piensa.

Estas avisado, otro comentario de los que vi por aca y te sanciono.'

In english:

'ivanlabrie, this is an discussion forum, where we share information and ideas. Hence, many users who had varied experiences, even if they do read all the reviews in the world, their experiences are real, cause they experienced them first hand, so you either learn to respect other people's opinions or you'll have trouble.
You can give your own opinion, but you're severely wrong if you think you can discredit other's opinions and ideas"

Come on! WTH?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, even the mods are pricks...now I remember why I didn't bother to post so much there.
> 
> 'ivanlabire, esto es un foro de opinion donde se comparte informacion y experiencias. Por ende hay muchos usuarios que tubieron muchas experiencias variadas y por mas que leas todos los reviews del mundo, su experiencia fue real porque la vivieron, entonces o aprendes a respetar las opiniones de los demas o vas a tener problemas. Podes dar opiniones, pero estas muy equivocado si podes criticar lo que otro piensa.
> 
> Estas avisado, otro comentario de los que vi por aca y te sanciono.'
> 
> In english:
> 
> 'ivanlabrie, this is an discussion forum, where we share information and ideas. Hence, many users who had varied experiences, even if they do read all the reviews in the world, their experiences are real, cause they experienced them first hand, so you either learn to respect other people's opinions or you'll have trouble.
> You can give your own opinion, but you're severely wrong if you think you can discredit other's opinions and ideas"
> 
> Come on! WTH?


sorry. I hate that feeling.

in other news lol here's my wprime for today!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sorry. I hate that feeling.
> 
> in other news lol here's my wprime for today!


Good! Much better









And yeah, they go on and on...I'm done with that discussion.
http://foros.toxico-pc.com/showthread.php?t=61324&page=4
Go read for yourselves if you know spanish, otherwise use google translate.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good! Much better
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And yeah, they go on and on...I'm done with that discussion.
> http://foros.toxico-pc.com/showthread.php?t=61324&page=4
> Go read for yourselves if you know spanish, otherwise use google translate.


always use google lol. chrome = automatic translator. like that RAM setting? I can even get them at 7 12 8 27 but 1024M didnt like it very much


----------



## dmanstasiu

True dat.

High-end air coolers can perform just as well as the H100 / Kuhler 920. However, the new "AIO" Swiftech units will change that.

But yeah, NH-D14 > H60 all day err day


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lol wow...reminds me of head-fi forums.
Thanks for the info on the air coolers though!
The biggest thing for me was noise. My stock Antec 920 isn't that quiet on load. But with sp120s is.
That's the reason I didn't even consider an air cooler.
I find liquid quite quiet, if you want them to be.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol, go tell them yourselves...cause they put personal opinion over hard facts, except for mine. xD

7-12-7 is too relaxed for trp, try 2600mhz with 1.85v or 1.9v.
If you can muster 8-11-7-28-1t at 2600mhz you're set...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Lol wow...reminds me of head-fi forums.
> Thanks for the info on the air coolers though!
> The biggest thing for me was noise. My stock Antec 920 isn't that quiet on load. But with sp120s is.
> That's the reason I didn't even consider an air cooler.
> I find liquid quite quiet, if you want them to be.


The 920 is actually quite good with decent fans, your sp-120's are quiet if undervolted but still perform good in push/pull.
They rank among the best value/performance rad fans actually.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, even the mods are pricks...now I remember why I didn't bother to post so much there.
> 
> 'ivanlabire, esto es un foro de opinion donde se comparte informacion y experiencias. Por ende hay muchos usuarios que tubieron muchas experiencias variadas y por mas que leas todos los reviews del mundo, su experiencia fue real porque la vivieron, entonces o aprendes a respetar las opiniones de los demas o vas a tener problemas. Podes dar opiniones, pero estas muy equivocado si podes criticar lo que otro piensa.
> 
> Estas avisado, otro comentario de los que vi por aca y te sanciono.'
> 
> In english:
> 
> 'ivanlabrie, this is an discussion forum, where we share information and ideas. Hence, many users who had varied experiences, even if they do read all the reviews in the world, their experiences are real, cause they experienced them first hand, so you either learn to respect other people's opinions or you'll have trouble.
> You can give your own opinion, but you're severely wrong if you think you can discredit other's opinions and ideas"
> 
> Come on! WTH?


Kind of a strange post from the other guy. Talks like experiences & opinions are the same thing. I guess when they talk about putting the 3770k in the fridge to get 6Ghz at 1.8V don't give your opinion & let them experience what happens for real.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> always use google lol. chrome = automatic translator. like that RAM setting? I can even get them at 7 12 8 27 but 1024M didnt like it very much


Not bad! Wprime is one of the few things that doesn't really care about ram speed & timings, doesn't hurt though. Most stuff will still like it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Indeed that's why I chose the fans.
I could have gone the performance root really, but I don't need that.
In hindsight I would have bought the h100i, over the 920 - I underestimated my use of my PC.
I'm now glad I didn't cheap out on the processor nor the graphics card.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Kind of a strange post from the other guy. Talks like experiences & opinions are the same thing. I guess when they talk about putting the 3770k in the fridge to get 6Ghz at 1.8V don't give your opinion & let them experience what happens for real.
> Not bad! Wprime is one of the few things that doesn't really care about ram speed & timings, doesn't hurt though. Most stuff will still like it.


thanks! I'm gonna run all the benchs I can on my lappy now (have time finally) what ones can I all run on W7 again?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Kind of a strange post from the other guy. Talks like experiences & opinions are the same thing. I guess when they talk about putting the 3770k in the fridge to get 6Ghz at 1.8V don't give your opinion & let them experience what happens for real.
> Not bad! Wprime is one of the few things that doesn't really care about ram speed & timings, doesn't hurt though. Most stuff will still like it.


True dat







lol
I can't believe those guys...Makes me want to avoid posting there at all, I used the forum to sell my gpu, so I kinda felt obliged to help some folks out.

@Totally Dubbed:

Your cooler is more than up to the task vs the H100i. It fares quite well really, you can always put the rad inside a bucket of ice and go for high oc's cause glycol won't freeze and remain liquid anyway.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Indeed that's why I chose the fans.
> I could have gone the performance root really, but I don't need that.
> In hindsight I would have bought the h100i, over the 920 - I underestimated my use of my PC.
> I'm now glad I didn't cheap out on the processor nor the graphics card.












I regret both the H100 and the kuhler 920


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> thanks! I'm gonna run all the benchs I can on my lappy now (have time finally) what ones can I all run on W7 again?


Overclock the cpu and igpu if possible, and run all benchies. You'll get decent points, hardware ones.

As for the wprime thing, it's kind of an untweakable bench, except for very few tweaks that I know of, that DO make a difference.
First thing is still cpu freq, over ram, single or dual channel...then Os.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> thanks! I'm gonna run all the benchs I can on my lappy now (have time finally) what ones can I all run on W7 again?


They will all run in win7, scores just may not be as good. But it's a lappy, win xp for 2d benchmarks would be way more trouble than it's worth.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I regret both the H100 and the kuhler 920


I like the Silver Arrow SB-E Extreme...I put it in my dream matx x79 portable folding rig, in that contest thread.
Otherwise, I'm starting to like the idea of 200mm rads, with a shroud and dual 120x38mm fans on it lol (have to use those beasts o mine on something)
Or a mora3 kind of thing, next to my case, or outside the window, with holes in the wall for tubing to pass through.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lol dman







!

As for an update from eBay, the guy said it is due to transit, and wasn't used. But also mentioned a needle. I know the ultra doesn't have the needle...anyway he is sending a replacement with freepost return.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Overclock the cpu and igpu if possible, and run all benchies. You'll get decent points, hardware ones.
> 
> As for the wprime thing, it's kind of an untweakable bench, except for very few tweaks that I know of, that DO make a difference.
> First thing is still cpu freq, over ram, single or dual channel...then Os.


I can't tweak it at all... sad day but I has a 6770M in it though....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I can't tweak it at all... sad day but I has a 6770M in it though....


You definitely CAN tweak it...FtW should teach you how. I personally can't


----------



## Arm3nian

Need new fans my sickleflow are not really meant for rads and the 2000rpm is EXTREMELY annoying. I tried a fan controller but it just makes the LED's flicker, so will be getting new ones.

I was thinking about gelid fans, since they have UV reactive blades, which would go with my UV tubing and the cathodes/leds I will buy, but every review I saw said that they were "decent", I'm going to be buying 8, which would be around $150 and that is too much for "decent".

Another option I'm thinking about are gentle typhoons. I want the really quiet ones, 1350rpm maybe or lower with a fan controller. 2x 480 60mm rads should be enough for a single cpu and gpu right? CPU is at 55c max and gpu is at 30c max so no problem with cooling, room isn't even cold.

And no I do not want noctua fans. Thanks


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Need new fans my sickleflow are not really meant for rads and the 2000rpm is EXTREMELY annoying. I tried a fan controller but it just makes the LED's flicker, so will be getting new ones.
> 
> I was thinking about gelid fans, since they have UV reactive blades, which would go with my UV tubing and the cathodes/leds I will buy, but every review I saw said that they were "decent", I'm going to be buying 8, which would be around $150 and that is too much for "decent".
> 
> Another option I'm thinking about are gentle typhoons. I want the really quiet ones, 1350rpm maybe or lower with a fan controller. 2x 480 60mm rads should be enough for a single cpu and gpu right? CPU is at 55c max and gpu is at 30c max so no problem with cooling, room isn't even cold.
> 
> And no I do not want noctua fans. Thanks


Gentle typhoons are your best bet. They have a static pressure of 2.9mm/h2o. BGears 120mm fans have a rating of 3.0mm/h20, although I haven't seen many reviews on them. I'm personally buying a 140mm fan from them to see if the specs hold up.

That being said ... 2x 480 push/pull ... 16 AP15s will not be "cheap"


----------



## ivanlabrie

Swiftech helix, similar to GT's but cheaper.
SP-120 fans with low noise adapter, Sanyo Denki san ace 1011







, Gelid fans are good, but not THAT good.
Your rx rad will appreciate the extra pressure, so any of those would do. I favor 38mm fans, but they can be hard to mount.
Push pull is not really needed, with good pressure fans. It is with stuff like the Scythe Slipstreams, which are cheap and have high cfm at the cost of noise and pressure.
Push tends to work best on most fans whilst being quieter than pull scenarios.

EDIT: guys, read this:

'You have been banned for the following reason:
Por discutir constantemente las opiniones de los demas.

Date the ban will be lifted: 03-02-2013, 06:00 PM'

(Banned for arguing over other peoples opinions constantly)


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Swiftech helix, similar to GT's but cheaper.
> SP-120 fans with low noise adapter, Sanyo Denki san ace 1011
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , Gelid fans are good, but not THAT good.
> Your rx rad will appreciate the extra pressure, so any of those would do. I favor 38mm fans, but they can be hard to mount.
> Push pull is not really needed, with good pressure fans. It is with stuff like the Scythe Slipstreams, which are cheap and have high cfm at the cost of noise and pressure.
> Push tends to work best on most fans whilst being quieter than pull scenarios.
> 
> EDIT: guys, read this:
> 
> 'You have been banned for the following reason:
> Por discutir constantemente las opiniones de los demas.
> 
> Date the ban will be lifted: 03-02-2013, 06:00 PM'
> 
> (Banned for arguing over other peoples opinions constantly)


The San Ace fans are also $40 a piece. 16 of those ... ouch.

Also, lol tyrannic forum


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, ebay is your friend for cheap fans...I scored mine for 9usd (Nidec 38mm thick 5300rpm beasts)
San aces are regarded to be real quiet when undervolted and still have massive pressure. But most of the h1011 users switched over to GT AP-15's these days.
The GT fans have an excellent blade design that minimizes the noise of air moving, and have really quiet motors. Yet some people complain about an audible motor whine when doing lower rpm's cause of the non-existent airflow noise (which is prevalent amongst most fans)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sanyo-Denki-San-Ace-109R1212H1131-120mm-3pin-TAC-Sensor-102cfm-DC-12V-fan-/170911969313?pt=US_Computer_Case_Fans&hash=item27cb25b021
2600rpm, undervolt it and run it at 5v, profit.
GT AP-15's are 17usd or so, when in stock. :/
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arctic-Cooling-ARCTIC-F12-PWM-CO-120mm-Case-Fan-w-PWM-/390444962717?pt=US_Computer_Case_Fans&hash=item5ae855539d
Those are VERY good, specially with lower speed (pwm and good bearing)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arctic-Cooling-Arctic-F12-120mm-Case-Fan-1350-RPM-/290777513408?pt=UK_Computing_Case_Fans&hash=item43b3b0bdc0
These are CHEAP, but the bearing is not as good as the one over it. I'd reccomend the Helix fans from sidewindercomputers (free shipping, 7usd each)


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Well now that I've caught up on reading the thread again. I have managed to line up a buyer for my current CPU and motherboard who is open on timeframe. So I ask you guys, should I sell it soon and get an Ivy or do I wait for Haswell?







Bear in mind I'm going to be going back to South Africa to see family for the whole of March anyway so if I only really want to buy in April at the earliest. At the moment I'm leaning towards waiting for Haswell because I don't "need" a new CPU right now and my buyer doesn't need it right away either.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

There's two things to consider:
Performance increase of the next gen.
Price to pay for the next gen.

I don't think de-lidding should be on your mind here.
Money and wallet should be.
If haswell offers something considerably better, then by all means if you got the money buy into it.


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> There's two things to consider:
> Performance increase of the next gen.
> Price to pay for the next gen.
> 
> I don't think de-lidding should be on your mind here.
> Money and wallet should be.
> If haswell offers something considerably better, then by all means if you got the money buy into it.


It's not so much a question of whether I need an upgrade at this point. It's more of a "is there any reason I shouldn't wait for Haswell and buy now instead" because I've already decided I'm going to buy a new CPU and motherboard. I try to never let the cost of something get in the way (within my financial means ofcourse) and instead look more to the journey of getting there. For example, I would rather buy a $5000 car and spend $15k to rebuild the car and tune it along the way than a $20k car straight up and do nothing to it. I think it's the same reason I and people on here build their own rigs or do case mods. It makes it special knowing you had a hand in making it into what it is at the end.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> Well now that I've caught up on reading the thread again. I have managed to line up a buyer for my current CPU and motherboard who is open on timeframe. So I ask you guys, should I sell it soon and get an Ivy or do I wait for Haswell?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bear in mind I'm going to be going back to South Africa to see family for the whole of March anyway so if I only really want to buy in April at the earliest. At the moment I'm leaning towards waiting for Haswell because I don't "need" a new CPU right now and my buyer doesn't need it right away either.


I would get Haswell, performance increase and "hopefully" better clocking and "better" cooling from Ivy (I hope). I do the same thing when buying I get the absolute best I can within my means and never go back down.


----------



## Swag

@*TD*

I don't have a problem with customs anymore because I import all the products via my dad's company and since they are in oil/engineering, they don't look at the metals in general anymore...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Well with a cpu, you need the right motherboard.
Anyway you look at it you'll have to spend money for new technology.
No one here or in the world can tell you RIGHT NOW how it performs or how it compares. Time will tell.
My guess is that it will perform better, but think realistically, do you need that new performance?

I overkilled it with my i7 purchase, knowing an i5 would do more than enough for me.
Cpu technology has reached a point that it is pointless unless something challenges it. What I mean is: if nothing realistically is going to use more than 4 cores, what's the point of having 12 cores?
Now don't get me wrong, I'm speaking for the general public (that's where I place myself), for servers etc, sure it's useful.


----------



## chann3l

Not good im pretty sure pump out effect is getting worse everyday. This is after one week exactly and my temps are now higher than they were before delid. This is with as5 on the die. Before delid max temp ibt 84 day one delid 76 day 3 84 1 week hit 90. Had to down lock to 4.5 GHz to get back to mid 80s in ibt. Not sure what to do my clu isn't here yet and next weekend im buying an additional rad which wont make a difference im just doing it in case water temps go up after using clu. Not sure if I should lap ihs this weekend and redo my as5 on the die or just wait it out and hope temps dont keep rising till my clu gets here....help guys


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well with a cpu, you need the right motherboard.
> Anyway you look at it you'll have to spend money for new technology.
> No one here or in the world can tell you RIGHT NOW how it performs or how it compares. Time will tell.
> My guess is that it will perform better, but think realistically, do you need that new performance?
> 
> I overkilled it with my i7 purchase, knowing an i5 would do more than enough for me.
> Cpu technology has reached a point that it is pointless unless something challenges it. What I mean is: if nothing realistically is going to use more than 4 cores, what's the point of having 12 cores?
> Now don't get me wrong, I'm speaking for the general public (that's where I place myself), for servers etc, sure it's useful.


I recently bought a 3930k for my dad.







(Birthday present). He doesn't do anything intensive other than watching anime so it was clearly overkill. Although he says he loves it versus his old Sandy (2700k). I think I might end up selling my MVG if Intel doesn't honor the 3570k and but a RIVE and 3930k. It'll help with my folding and everything right?







And, I'm starting to get into the habit of video editting and everything like that!

I do agree if all you are doing is browsing and gaming, a new CPU above the Bloomfield line is overkill. You are much better off buying a better GPU or going SLI or buying new monitors.







Although, I dropped maybe 6k on my PC last year (2012), and bought a ***** ton of stuff so I don't think I'll be needing anything more. I hope I'm still welcome here if I switch over to X79.









I'll still be delidding and will still make a delidding video/stream, I'll just be having to borrow my friend's CPU or my brother's!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Not good im pretty sure pump out effect is getting worse everyday. This is after one week exactly and my temps are now higher than they were before delid. This is with as5 on the die. Before delid max temp ibt 84 day one delid 76 day 3 84 1 week hit 90. Had to down lock to 4.5 GHz to get back to mid 80s in ibt. Not sure what to do my clu isn't here yet and next weekend im buying an additional rad which wont make a difference im just doing it in case water temps go up after using clu. Not sure if I should lap ihs this weekend and redo my as5 on the die or just wait it out and hope temps dont keep rising till my clu gets here....help guys


wait it out. trust me.. it'll happen again it did for me three times and all i did was waste thermal paste...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Just wait for the clu to come in.
If needs be go to stock. You can live on stock for a while.


----------



## chann3l

Ya I dropped it down to 4.3 just to be safe. Ridiculous I run custom water and with this pumped out as5 garbage at 1.2 volts im hitting 80 degrees in ibt. Coming from 1.27 at 4.6 with a day one max of 76. That is terrible I can't wait to get clu. If it performs proper as I imagine it will than that is all I will be recommending to anyone lol. No point wasting time and money on garbage.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *teh_HyDr0iD* wrote...should I sell it soon and get an Ivy or do I wait for Haswell?


First, it's good to have both the choice and also some time to make it (...anticipation is half the fun







) . If you have even more budget and time, I would actually wait for the *IB-E* (September 1), because from what I have read, that will be a much bigger step-up - and one I'm waiting for









That said, owning 3 Ivy Bridge 3770 (K and non K), my understanding is that Haswell (4770K) will outperform it mostly on video - iGPU which accounts for most of the increase of Tjmax from 77 to 86 watts.

Now, if you plan to run with either just iGPU or 1 lower-end discreet GPU (combined with iGPU through Lucid VirtueMVP), then Haswell may be worth waiting for...however, otherwise (including SLI/CF) I would buy IvyBridge and invest the difference in a nice set of video cards - or perhaps even the GTX 780 or Titan if the budget allows (expected to hit the market in late February)









EDIT: Here is a link to a Russian site (use Google translator) with the first *Haswell test results* / comparison with IvyBridge (or my translator is broken and this is a recipe for eggplant pizza







) http://oclab.ru/news/pervyie-rezultatyi-testirovaniya-protsessora-haswell-v-populyarnyih-prilozheniyah


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Swag* wrote...I don't have a problem with customs anymore because I import all the products via my dad's company and since they are in oil/engineering, they don't look at the metals in general anymore...


...now THERE is an idea







- get *whole barrel* from your dad's company filled with Coollab's stuff and then sell portions at overclock.net


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> *Swag* wrote...I don't have a problem with customs anymore because I import all the products via my dad's company and since they are in oil/engineering, they don't look at the metals in general anymore...
> 
> 
> 
> ...now THERE is an idea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - get *whole barrel* from your dad's company filled with Coollab's stuff and then sell portions at overclock.net
Click to expand...

Lol, especially in NA, it might be worth it because customs is a dick when it comes to inspecting. Oh, this thing only have this much, let's spray out 80% of it...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Haha epic


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ha, you smuggler you!








Feeling all Han Solo today TD, huh?

Well, mates, I'm bored as heck...gonna try my luck with wprime using this crappy cpu lol I has XP here. (work)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lmao. The force is strong in this one


----------



## Swag

I'm getting my insurance tomorrow but I'm already driving and I drove alone on my permit.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice ride









I forgot that I already had scores for wprime submitted at the bot...But I did omit ucbench and pcmark04, so I just got 4 extra pts!









EDIT: Seeing that pcm04 refuses to run I'm left with only 2 boints.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm getting my insurance tomorrow but I'm already driving and I drove alone on my permit.


What's a "Permit" mean? Like you're meant to have a supervisor with you?
Nice car for a begginer either way, I've still got the 92' Audi here. I actually broke both locks on it for a bit and it couldn't be locked at all!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm getting my insurance tomorrow but I'm already driving and I drove alone on my permit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's a "Permit" mean? Like you're meant to have a supervisor with you?
> Nice car for a begginer either way, I've still got the 92' Audi here. I actually broke both locks on it for a bit and it couldn't be locked at all!
Click to expand...

In Australia? I heard it's really bad there in terms of auto crime... Yea, like a learners' permit, where you need an adult with you. It's a 2012 GMC Terrain SLT.


----------



## alex-tpc

Loving this delidded chip. Was able to run 3DM Vantage @ 5.338Ghz, [email protected], [email protected] on water







.

http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4555419


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm getting my insurance tomorrow but I'm already driving and I drove alone on my permit.


meh rookie..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm getting my insurance tomorrow but I'm already driving and I drove alone on my permit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> meh rookie..
Click to expand...

That looks sexy! I can't afford that yet.


----------



## CroSsFiRe2009

Out of context, we all look like drug addicts


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CroSsFiRe2009*
> 
> Out of context, we all look like drug addicts


Just need a tube to wrap on the arm and you're good to go! I bet if you actually inject that into you, you will be going to dreamland in 5 minutes... Pure liquid metal in your body...


----------



## Hokies83

meh


----------



## ivanlabrie

Lol @ clp suicide...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> meh
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Acually looks pretty damn sexy, is it finished?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Acually looks pretty damn sexy, is it finished?


No Seems Gigabyte is gonna Spend a month with my board.....

My 400ML frozen Q res will be here sat.. then just waiting on Gigabyte...

I Polished and waxxed my Case


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Acually looks pretty damn sexy, is it finished?
> 
> 
> 
> No Seems Gigabyte is gonna Spend a month with my board.....
> 
> My 400ML frozen Q res will be here sat.. then just waiting on Gigabyte...
> 
> I Polished and waxxed my Case
Click to expand...

You should've requested an express shipping or cross-shipping.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You should've requested an express shipping or cross-shipping.


I can not chew them out.. there doing it all for free lol....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You should've requested an express shipping or cross-shipping.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can not chew them out.. there doing it all for free lol....
Click to expand...

I meant like you pay like $25 for the cross-ship/express shipping, like what you do with Intel.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I meant like you pay like $25 for the cross-ship/express shipping, like what you do with Intel.


My damages were not under warranty







And there fixing it free of charge.

Check my build log son..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I meant like you pay like $25 for the cross-ship/express shipping, like what you do with Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My damages were not under warranty
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And there fixing it free of charge.
> 
> Check my build log son..
Click to expand...

Haha! I wouldn't have expected you to have the damages not under warranty. Asus replaces broken pins even though they aren't technically covered...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alex-tpc*
> 
> Loving this delidded chip. Was able to run 3DM Vantage @ 5.338Ghz, [email protected], [email protected] on water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4555419


I wanted to delid this afternoon just for this competition. my temps were holding me back from going to 5.2 or 5.3 Ghz... I was sooo angry at it.... uuuuuuuugh








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CroSsFiRe2009*
> 
> Out of context, we all look like drug addicts


wait.,...... we aren't drug addicts? I mean....


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> First, it's good to have both the choice and also some time to make it (...anticipation is half the fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) . If you have even more budget and time, I would actually wait for the *IB-E* (September 1), because from what I have read, that will be a much bigger step-up - and one I'm waiting for
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That said, owning 3 Ivy Bridge 3770 (K and non K), my understanding is that Haswell (4770K) will outperform it mostly on video - iGPU which accounts for most of the increase of Tjmax from 77 to 86 watts.
> 
> Now, if you plan to run with either just iGPU or 1 lower-end discreet GPU (combined with iGPU through Lucid VirtueMVP), then Haswell may be worth waiting for...however, otherwise (including SLI/CF) I would buy IvyBridge and invest the difference in a nice set of video cards - or perhaps even the GTX 780 or Titan if the budget allows (expected to hit the market in late February)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Here is a link to a Russian site (use Google translator) with the first *Haswell test results* / comparison with IvyBridge (or my translator is broken and this is a recipe for eggplant pizza
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) http://oclab.ru/news/pervyie-rezultatyi-testirovaniya-protsessora-haswell-v-populyarnyih-prilozheniyah


Thanks! That's a really helpful perspective. I personally do a fair amount of gaming and I do a bit of video editing stuff on the side as well as running Virtual Machines from time to time. I was thinking of getting a GTX 780 too. The way you spun it I think I might wait for IB-E







If it comes out in September I should have just had my first month's pay on a raise (I'm expecting a big one this year) so I'll be feeling a bit more wealthy.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> First, it's good to have both the choice and also some time to make it (...anticipation is half the fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) . If you have even more budget and time, I would actually wait for the *IB-E* (September 1), because from what I have read, that will be a much bigger step-up - and one I'm waiting for
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That said, owning 3 Ivy Bridge 3770 (K and non K), my understanding is that Haswell (4770K) will outperform it mostly on video - iGPU which accounts for most of the increase of Tjmax from 77 to 86 watts.
> 
> Now, if you plan to run with either just iGPU or 1 lower-end discreet GPU (combined with iGPU through Lucid VirtueMVP), then Haswell may be worth waiting for...however, otherwise (including SLI/CF) I would buy IvyBridge and invest the difference in a nice set of video cards - or perhaps even the GTX 780 or Titan if the budget allows (expected to hit the market in late February)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Here is a link to a Russian site (use Google translator) with the first *Haswell test results* / comparison with IvyBridge (or my translator is broken and this is a recipe for eggplant pizza
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) http://oclab.ru/news/pervyie-rezultatyi-testirovaniya-protsessora-haswell-v-populyarnyih-prilozheniyah
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! That's a really helpful perspective. I personally do a fair amount of gaming and I do a bit of video editing stuff on the side as well as running Virtual Machines from time to time. I was thinking of getting a GTX 780 too. The way you spun it I think I might wait for IB-E
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If it comes out in September I should have just had my first month's pay on a raise (I'm expecting a big one this year) so I'll be feeling a bit more wealthy.
Click to expand...

*STOP POSTING!* Everytime I see your avatar, I fall in love again.


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *STOP POSTING!* Everytime I see your avatar, I fall in love again.


LOL!

By the way, congrats on your drivers license from quite a few pages ago. I just got mine on Jan 4th.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *STOP POSTING!* Everytime I see your avatar, I fall in love again.


I got one of those cingy congs at home.. Make up does wonders.. my wife is not wearing any in this pic however..



hmmm demon eyes..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *STOP POSTING!* Everytime I see your avatar, I fall in love again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL!
> 
> By the way, congrats on your drivers license from quite a few pages ago. I just got mine on Jan 4th.
Click to expand...

Thanks, congrats too on yours.







Have you gotten your car yet or what? I hate how you have to pay for insurance...







It costs me $350/month! For just liability, not even covering the car...


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks, congrats too on yours.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have you gotten your car yet or what? I hate how you have to pay for insurance...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It costs me $350/month! For just liability, not even covering the car...


For now I'm borrowing a car that belongs to my parents. Fortunately because it's in my father's name with a long and safe driving history the insurance is only $160p/m comprehensive. And I am still covered by that lol, before I started driving it the insurance was only $80p/m for him. I'm shopping around for the right car at the moment but I have something specific in mind so I need to find just the right one.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks, congrats too on yours.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have you gotten your car yet or what? I hate how you have to pay for insurance...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It costs me $350/month! For just liability, not even covering the car...
> 
> 
> 
> For now I'm borrowing a car that belongs to my parents. Fortunately because it's in my father's name with a long and safe driving history the insurance is only $160p/m comprehensive. And I am still covered by that lol, before I started driving it the insurance was only $80p/m for him. I'm shopping around for the right car at the moment but I have something specific in mind so I need to find just the right one.
Click to expand...

What car are you thinking about? Also, you mean secondary driver right? We have 4 cars in my household and only 3 of us drives so I can't get secondary driver.







It's a bit annoying but what can you do?


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What car are you thinking about? Also, you mean secondary driver right? We have 4 cars in my household and only 3 of us drives so I can't get secondary driver.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a bit annoying but what can you do?




A Nissan Pulsar SSS N15 in Moody Blue haha. I may have to cave and go for a different colour if a clean enough one comes up at the right time. Here in Australia you have restrictions on your license when you just get it. For the first 3 years you are on a "provisional" license and you can't drive a car with a V8, a turbo or a supercharger and some high powered six-cylinders are banned too. That Pulsar however has an SR20DE engine which is the NA variant of the engine in the Nissan Silvia S15/14/13 and is Provisional legal. I plan to do a head swap from an SR16VE to add variable valve timing as well as running through a standard set of performance mods with the goal of preparing it for a turbo when I get my full license.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> What car are you thinking about? Also, you mean secondary driver right? We have 4 cars in my household and only 3 of us drives so I can't get secondary driver.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a bit annoying but what can you do?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A Nissan Pulsar SSS N15 in Moody Blue haha. I may have to cave and go for a different colour if a clean enough one comes up at the right time. Here in Australia you have restrictions on your license when you just get it. For the first 3 years you are on a "provisional" license and you can't drive a car with a V8, a turbo or a supercharger and some high powered six-cylinders are banned too. That Pulsar however has an SR20DE engine which is the NA variant of the engine in the Nissan Silvia S15/14/13 and is Provisional legal. I plan to do a head swap from an SR16VE to add variable valve timing as well as running through a standard set of performance mods with the goal of preparing it for a turbo when I get my full license.
Click to expand...

That law sucks! I want a 1200hp Camaro ZL1.







Rape the straight runs! The pull on those ZL1's are intense, I mean you can brake all you want and it'll just keep pulling you forward.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, ebay is your friend for cheap fans...I scored mine for 9usd (Nidec 38mm thick 5300rpm beasts)
> San aces are regarded to be real quiet when undervolted and still have massive pressure. But most of the h1011 users switched over to GT AP-15's these days.
> The GT fans have an excellent blade design that minimizes the noise of air moving, and have really quiet motors. Yet some people complain about an audible motor whine when doing lower rpm's cause of the non-existent airflow noise (which is prevalent amongst most fans)
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sanyo-Denki-San-Ace-109R1212H1131-120mm-3pin-TAC-Sensor-102cfm-DC-12V-fan-/170911969313?pt=US_Computer_Case_Fans&hash=item27cb25b021
> 2600rpm, undervolt it and run it at 5v, profit.
> GT AP-15's are 17usd or so, when in stock. :/
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arctic-Cooling-ARCTIC-F12-PWM-CO-120mm-Case-Fan-w-PWM-/390444962717?pt=US_Computer_Case_Fans&hash=item5ae855539d
> Those are VERY good, specially with lower speed (pwm and good bearing)
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arctic-Cooling-Arctic-F12-120mm-Case-Fan-1350-RPM-/290777513408?pt=UK_Computing_Case_Fans&hash=item43b3b0bdc0
> These are CHEAP, but the bearing is not as good as the one over it. I'd reccomend the Helix fans from sidewindercomputers (free shipping, 7usd each)


Hmm... 38mm push pull would easily fit in my gigantic case, even with the 60mm rad, so I guess the san ace is an option, would need a fan controller however, and worried about ticking and other stuff that comes with undervolting.

I don't really want push pull in general, $20 x 16 fans is way toooooo much imo to spend. I also don't think i'll need it would so much rad space and only a 3700k & 690.

What about these http://www.frozencpu.com/products/6176/fan-346/Yate_Loon_120mm_x_25mm_UV_Reactive_LED_Fan_-_UV_Blue_D12SM-124UB.html?tl=g36c331s521

Basically its either
1.san ace with fan controller
2.gt typhoons
3.gelid cause they look really cool
4. the yates, which are really cheap so thats a plus, or something else worth mentioning.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Gelid's suck. Generally speaking. Even moreso for radiators


----------



## Valgaur

all the bclk lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> all the bclk lol.


NICE! Was this just normal air? If it is, that's great! Most can't even reach 103...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> NICE! Was this just normal air? If it is, that's great! Most can't even reach 103...


vcore 1.35 in bios vcc's set to 1.25 each and then pll at 1.9 adnd LLC at only 100% (so normal) then had ram at 1.75volts. yeah crazy right? almost got 5 giggles with it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *teh_HyDr0iD*wrote...can't drive a car with a V8, a turbo or a supercharger and some high powered six-cylinders are banned too


...don't see Nitrous Oxide on that list


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> NICE! Was this just normal air? If it is, that's great! Most can't even reach 103...
> 
> 
> 
> vcore 1.35 in bios vcc's set to 1.25 each and then pll at 1.9 adnd LLC at only 100% (so normal) then had ram at 1.75volts. yeah crazy right? almost got 5 giggles with it.
Click to expand...

I know! So close! Try again sir.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> [QUOTE*]teh_HyDr0iD* wrote...can't drive a car with a V8, a turbo or a supercharger and some high powered six-cylinders are banned too


...don't see Nitrous Oxide on that list







[/quote]

Lol! Elude the police with NOS and then get into a fight with some other driver because you are driving too fast and he punches in your windshield.


----------



## teh_HyDr0iD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...don't see Nitrous Oxide on that list


Haha, even if it was legal to have in your car here. While you are on your provisional license you need to display P-plates on your car which is like a big red target for the cops here.







It's unfortunate, but there's a lot of drivers who drive like maniacs on provisionals and so we get targeted pretty heavily for pull overs and inspections. Someone I know got pulled over and the officer was giving him a hard time because he was wearing puma driving/racing shoes. If they saw a can of NOS in your car they'd go ballistic. I plan for my car to look as stock as possible and reserve the real extent of what it can do for trackdays.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teh_HyDr0iD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...don't see Nitrous Oxide on that list
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, even if it was legal to have in your car here. While you are on your provisional license you need to display P-plates on your car which is like a big red target for the cops here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's unfortunate, but there's a lot of drivers who drive like maniacs on provisionals and so we get targeted pretty heavily for pull overs and inspections. Someone I know got pulled over and the officer was giving him a hard time because he was wearing puma driving/racing shoes. If they saw a can of NOS in your car they'd go ballistic. I plan for my car to look as stock as possible and reserve the real extent of what it can do for trackdays.
Click to expand...

Hide the NOS under that passenger seat.







They won't suspect a thing? The first thing I'd do to that car would probably upgrade its audio system.







I got mine stock fitted with the Bose Audio System upgrade. Sounds amazing and it can handle all my songs.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CroSsFiRe2009*
> 
> Out of context, we all look like drug addicts


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just need a tube to wrap on the arm and you're good to go! I bet if you actually inject that into you, you will be going to dreamland in 5 minutes... Pure liquid metal in your body...


lol..this is a funny delid club story, dont remember his name atm..
but one day a member came into our thread, saying,

"guys guys, i accidentally injected liquid pro into my thumb, am i gonna die!!'

i was like wth, how did he manage to do that,
but like always i tried to find a answer, to help out,
did some searching on gallium etc, seems we have a little bit of gallium in
our body's anyways,
'Gallium is an element found in the body, but it occurs in a very small amount.'
and its used in the medical world also,
'A gallium scan is a test that uses a radioactive material called gallium to look for swelling (inflammation), infection'
so i could ease his worries with the info i got,
thought it was very funny tho ...lol


----------



## Joa3d43

.
Quote:


> *teh_HyDr0iD* wrote...I plan for my car to look as stock as possible and reserve the real extent of what it can do for trackday


...re looking stock, eons ago I had a Corvette C5 with a cheater NOS system...the 'fire extinguisher' was actually the NOS bottle, and the arming switch was in one of the holes for the gearshift cover







...no police stop ever queried it

...for now, your best bet is 'Need for Speed - Most Wanted (2012)'







...it is superb and I am afraid that since I won that Bugatti Veyron Super Sport, I have become the opposite of a law-abiding citizen










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just need a tube to wrap on the arm and you're good to go! I bet if you actually inject that into you, you will be going to dreamland in 5 minutes... Pure liquid metal in your body...
> 
> 
> 
> lol..this is a funny delid club story, dont remember his name atm..
> but one day a member came into our thread, saying,
> 
> "guys guys, i accidentally injected liquid pro into my thumb, am i gonna die!!'
> 
> i was like wth, how did he manage to do that,
> but like always i tried to find a answer, to help out,
> did some searching on gallium etc, seems we have a little bit of gallium in
> our body's anyways,
> 'Gallium is an element found in the body, but it occurs in a very small amount.'
> and its used in the medical world also,
> 'A gallium scan is a test that uses a radioactive material called gallium to look for swelling (inflammation), infection'
> so i could ease his worries with the info i got,
> thought it was very funny tho ...lol
Click to expand...

Yea, radioactive isotope scanning. As it traverses through your blood, they can detect for clots, tumors, abnormal growths, abnormal tissue behaviors.







All that good stuff, pretty common in cancer treatments where they want to find where the cancer decided to hop to next.







Although, injected gallium (heavy metal) will result in an abnormal reaction between the other metals in your body such as the iron in your blood or the hydrogen in your system, causing you to go into shock. The most likely outcome of intaking a large amount of heavy metals would be brain/neuro failure though.


----------



## dkim1359

Finally got around to de-lidding my 3770K, and all I can say is







!! This isn't a very good chip, but since it was my first time de-lidding, I figured if I messed it up, I could get another chip and try the silicon lottery again. The IHS TIM was replaced with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro. Highest core temp dropped by 25°C and average core temps dropped by over 26°C.

Core i7 3770K
4.6 GHz, 1.35V
Corsair H80 with GT AP-15s in push/pull
Prolimatech PK-3 between the IHS and the H80

Before - ambient temp 20°C


After - ambient temp 21°C


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dkim1359*
> 
> Finally got around to de-lidding my 3770K, and all I can say is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !! This isn't a very good chip, but since it was my first time de-lidding, I figured if I messed it up, I could get another chip and try the silicon lottery again. The IHS TIM was replaced with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro. Highest core temp dropped by 25°C and average core temps dropped by over 26°C.
> 
> Core i7 3770K
> 4.6 GHz, 1.35V
> Corsair H80 with GT AP-15s in push/pull
> Prolimatech PK-3 between the IHS and the H80
> 
> Before - ambient temp 20°C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After - ambient temp 21°C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


gratz on the successful delid dkim1359









pls try follow the "official" format as good as possible to join da club








amazing those tempdrops after delid, and using the right tim right ...lol

Now for the requirements to join the club are as follows. Post a picture of you delidded chip and write your OCN name on a piece or something of the like. For those already running delidded chips and don't feel like taking them out and re-installing I understand so take a picture that you most likely took when you delidded it and use what every program you'd like to put your name somewhere on the picture.

For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> In Australia? I heard it's really bad there in terms of auto crime... Yea, like a learners' permit, where you need an adult with you. It's a 2012 GMC Terrain SLT.


Yeah in Australia.. You mean like people breaking into cars? Yeah it only happened once when I left it at a mates, they tried to get in but the Audi was no match for their screwdriver, it must have shattered inside the lock because half of it is in the lock and there's a small scratch in the paint next to the lock. I'm getting it fixed after 3-4 months, I got quoted $120 to fix it!









And the other side.. Well I locked my keys in my car an hour and a half drive away from home (Doing 80kp/h sucks), so anyway it was outside a mates place and we tried a piece of wire and it disengaged the handle from the lock apparently, so when I eventually got a spare key sent up the lock opened but the handle didn't open the door.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> meh


Nice fan controller, I have one of those too.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *STOP POSTING!* Everytime I see your avatar, I fall in love again.


Maybe I'm too old, but that girl looks like shes 12 and not attractive to me.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I got one of those cingy congs at home.. Make up does wonders.. my wife is not wearing any in this pic however..
> 
> 
> 
> hmmm demon eyes..


Cute family


----------



## mandrix

I did some quick testing with my delidded 3770K. When I bumped the multi to x48 I was already at 1.380 vcore so I dropped the hyperthreading. I'll play some more when I get time and figure out how much vcore I want to push.
This is in my backup rig, Switch 810, D5/Raystorm/RX360/EX240, Ambient about 23c.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mandrix*
> 
> I did some quick testing with my delidded 3770K. When I bumped the multi to x48 I was already at 1.380 vcore so I dropped the hyperthreading. I'll play some more when I get time and figure out how much vcore I want to push.
> This is in my backup rig, Switch 810, D5/Raystorm/RX360/EX240, Ambient about 23c.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


looks good mandrix, why would you disable HT ?
1.3-1.45V vcore is considered safe on air/water,
i needed 1.420V vcore to make 4.8ghz run stable, no problem running it 24/7 really..


----------



## justanoldman

I know there is no definite answer, but since delidding gives us much more room to increase voltage, what do you guys think is the highest vCore that is safe for a 24/7 set it and forget it? Assuming you use offset, and want the chip not to degrade noticeably within three years.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I would think it would be 1.45v


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I know there is no definite answer, but since delidding gives us much more room to increase voltage, what do you guys think is the highest vCore that is safe for a 24/7 set it and forget it? Assuming you use offset, and want the chip not to degrade noticeably within three years.


Noone knows mate, answers range from 1.45 to 1.55 and Intel have not given a clear answer themselves.

Personally I run at 1.3 24/7 (4.8Ghz) and 1.55-1.60 when benching.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I know there is no definite answer, but since delidding gives us much more room to increase voltage, what do you guys think is the highest vCore that is safe for a 24/7 set it and forget it? Assuming you use offset, and want the chip not to degrade noticeably within three years.


The 1.3-1.45V vcore range is _considered_ safe on air/water to run 24/7









the "max" vcore is upto 1.52V, but thats, again, _considered_ the max you should run ivy on air/water, i wouldnt advice it tho,
have to wait and see first how ivy runs on that high vcore in, lets say , 1 year from now,
then we can look back and compare, or hear the story's about degradation,
till now we havent seen any degration..


----------



## justanoldman

Thanks for all the answers. I guess it will all depend on my temps after delidding on how high I can go.

I think my ultra may get here today, pretty fast for an order placed two days ago. Suddenly I am getting nervous.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the answers. I guess it will all depend on my temps after delidding on how high I can go.
> 
> I think my ultra may get here today, pretty fast for an order placed two days ago. Suddenly I am getting nervous.


you have a H100i ?
your temps wont limit you if all goes well








i can run 5.0ghz IBT(1.510V vcore) , and hit 83C on the hottest core with my simple aircooler..lol


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you have a H100i ?
> your temps wont limit you if all goes well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i can run 5.0ghz IBT(1.510V vcore) , and hit 83C on the hottest core with my simple aircooler..lol


If that is the case, I may be the test subject for 24/7 high vCore.
If I am risking my chip and any form of warrantee whatsoever by delidding, how much more risk is there for 1.5v 24/7?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If that is the case, I may be the test subject for 24/7 high vCore.
> If I am risking my chip and any form of warrantee whatsoever by delidding, how much more risk is there for 1.5v 24/7?


no degradation within 3 years..not noticeable, but low temps are important,
but then, thats why you delid it for









And running all those stability test programs
to get a stable oc, the temps you see there,
you prolly never see again in the coming 3 years, with normal daily usage,
if you want to do some benching, upto 1.6V vcore can do if temps are low,
above 1.6V vcore on air/water is entering the dangerzone,
thats what i do only if my temps are like this,

thats still on air, but very cold, i think cold enough to do some short benches, upto 1.7-1.8V vcore ..lol









hope this helps


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Wow - those new razor blades came in that I ordered....they are SUPER thin.
In fact they aren't that STRONG either - if I put enough force, I bet I could bend them. That isn't a problem for de-lidding though is it?
This blade is so much thinner than the one I used for the pent 4 - that it reassures me that nothing will actually damage the chip.

I'm waiting fro my anti-static wrist band + replacement CLU to come in, and then we can skype/video call for my de-lidding - live stream esk - something I'll upload on youtube too









*Old blade used for pent 4:*


*New blade bought for I7:*


----------



## justanoldman

In a few of the guides/videos, there is no mention of 90%+ alcohol. It is a good or bad idea to use it to help remove both the tim on the die and the black glue from the pcb and ihs?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> In a few of the guides/videos, there is no mention of 90%+ alcohol. It is a good or bad idea to use it to help remove both the tim on the die and the black glue from the pcb and ihs?


for cleaning the tim, the high % alcohol works best, for cleaning the die also,
i use spiritus, more then 90%

the high amount of alcohol evaporates fast, so thats a good thing too









the black glue you have to first clean with your fingernails and/or a creditcard , but always be careful,
if you have most of the ashesive of that way, you can use a q-tip with the alcohol on it, and dab
the left over glue with it a few times, let it soak a while, should be easy to clean then..
a dremel with a softtip seems to work good too..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> In a few of the guides/videos, there is no mention of 90%+ alcohol. It is a good or bad idea to use it to help remove both the tim on the die and the black glue from the pcb and ihs?


I used metholated spirits on the die and used my finger nails on the glue, I also tried a credit card and used a model knife-type thing for the glue on the IHS.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I used metholated spirits on the die and used my finger nails on the glue, I also tried a credit card and used a model knife-type thing for the glue on the IHS.


i used the backside of the box cutter...lol

wouldnt recommend that tho


----------



## Airrick10

Well the postman just delivered my CL Ultra! I want to delid but still nervous about it! My temps were very high yesterday while OC to 4.8Ghz with 1.367v...I was reaching 97C!!!!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> In a few of the guides/videos, there is no mention of 90%+ alcohol. It is a good or bad idea to use it to help remove both the tim on the die and the black glue from the pcb and ihs?


I used 99% isopropyl had to get it from behind the counter at the pharmacy.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> Well the postman just delivered my CL Ultra! I want to delid but still nervous about it! My temps were very high yesterday while OC to 4.8Ghz with 1.367v...I was reaching 97C!!!!


Take your time read the guides and wear an anti static wrist band and you'll do just fine


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I know there is no definite answer, but since delidding gives us much more room to increase voltage, what do you guys think is the highest vCore that is safe for a 24/7 set it and forget it? Assuming you use offset, and want the chip not to degrade noticeably within three years.


1.55v IS the max safe for 24/7 use for Ivy if your temps are great i would not run 1.55v and be loading at 100c now.

1.4v - 1.45v if your a soft core over clocker with a crappy cooler...

If you have a good water loop you can run 1.4 - 1.45v with out issue.. so there would be no reason to De lid your chip... Unles you were going for the Maximum V core of 1.55v like the hardcore overclockers do.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.55v IS the max safe for 24/7 use for Ivy.


How do you know that ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> How do you know that ?


Sin0822 and that is what i have run 24/7 for months.

I find it very hypocritical that a person has the enthusiast desire enough to force a Razor blade between a piece of copper and a circuit board... But then is scared to run any type of Vcore?


----------



## mandrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks good mandrix, why would you disable HT ?
> 1.3-1.45V vcore is considered safe on air/water,
> i needed 1.420V vcore to make 4.8ghz run stable, no problem running it 24/7 really..


I needed to do some checking around to see what was safe before I got carried away, and I happened to stop at 1.380v, that's all. Now that I see so many running much higher volts I won't be afraid to crank it up some more.


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Take your time read the guides and wear an anti static wrist band and you'll do just fine


Thanks! Yeah...I've been doing a lot of reading and well I don't have an anti static wrist band but I did get some latex gloves









I'll see if I decide to delid tonight or this weekend


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sin0822 and that is what i have run 24/7 for months.
> 
> I find it very hypocritical that a person has the enthusiast desire enough to force a Razor blade between a piece of copper and a circuit board... But then is scared to run any type of Vcore?


Of course more volts will be applied after delid but 1.55 V seems kinda high for 24/7


----------



## Valgaur

1.55 is not the max vcore.... neither is 1.52.

I'm getting very sick of this topic as well. The max vcore changes per chip due to the silicon used in the 22nm processing for Ivy Bridge. I've asked Intel many times and have been told the exact same thing which makes sense as each chip has certain properties due in part to just the silicon. That's why I'm trying to get a good group of people to actually make a good vcore to be in of good speeds and still seem safe.

Hokies.... I don't care that you have run 1.55 for months it's one chip. same for my Franky he took 1.98vcore and all the vcores in between for days of benching. I still prefer a range of 1.45vcore myself for full time loads of 24/7 like folding at home where the chip is stressed all day every day, plus playing games on it at the same time.

You can't say with certain knowledge yeah it's what I ran so it's fine yadda yadda yadda. You have to have proven results or a heck of a lot of experienced people behind your information. Yes sin knows his stuff and I agree. but 1.55 is still a lot of vcore.....

you have to be considerate to the normal users where they don't really know OC'ing as much as us and they think. Ohh 1.55 is totally fine! i'll throw that in and try for 5 giggles then they aren't delidded and they damage the thing.

That Intel chart with VID of 1.52 is at stock. it changes as soon as you OC the darn thing!

I would agree to 1.5 area IF and ONLY IF they are delidded, since the temps will be down by a large margin. but for the normal non crazy people like us, you need a safe area, so people aren't hitting thermals all day long trying to learn how to Overclock for the first time.

We need to decide on ONE and stick with it no more 8 different vcores all over the place.


----------



## justanoldman

Well my results thus far don't warrant the risk, time, and money, but as an educational experience it was very interesting. Only a 10c drop, and interestingly enough the differential from high to low went from only 6c before to 7c after, which is not good right?

Testing with 1.290v manual, H100i with two 1300rpm Noctua fans:
Cores 0 through 3, before, after, net=
78 65 = -13
82 70 = -12
82 72 = -10
76 65 = -11

Seems like a lot of people are getting 20c or better, so my 10c seems very inadequate. Based on that spread of temps, can anyone tell me if maybe I did something wrong? I painted the CL Ultra on the die, and on the top surface of the ihs, then installed as usual. Never used anything like Ultra before, but painting isn't exactly complicated so I can't think of what would have gone wrong.

Any help or suggestions much appreciated.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Well my results thus far don't warrant the risk, time, and money, but as an educational experience it was very interesting. Only a 10c drop, and interestingly enough the differential from high to low went from only 6c before to 7c after, which is not good right?
> 
> Testing with 1.290v manual, H100i with two 1300rpm Noctua fans:
> Cores 0 through 3, before, after, net=
> 78 65 = -13
> 82 70 = -12
> 82 72 = -10
> 76 65 = -11
> 
> Seems like a lot of people are getting 20c or better, so my 10c seems very inadequate. Based on that spread of temps, can anyone tell me if maybe I did something wrong? I painted the CL Ultra on the die, and on the top surface of the ihs, then installed as usual. Never used anything like Ultra before, but painting isn't exactly complicated so I can't think of what would have gone wrong.
> 
> Any help or suggestions much appreciated.


Sounds like you used too much Ultra. Try again with just a speck and paint it on so there are no mini pools. Also be sure to remove as much glue as possible, your IHS should spin freely on top of the die if done correctly.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

^people reported that sometimes the application didn't go to well - so it took them 3 tries to finally see the 20c drops they were expecting.
I don't think I'll personally see 20c first time round.

As for de-lidding - good on you for doing it RIGHT and having the courage!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Well my results thus far don't warrant the risk, time, and money, but as an educational experience it was very interesting. Only a 10c drop, and interestingly enough the differential from high to low went from only 6c before to 7c after, which is not good right?
> 
> Testing with 1.290v manual, H100i with two 1300rpm Noctua fans:
> Cores 0 through 3, before, after, net=
> 78 65 = -13
> 82 70 = -12
> 82 72 = -10
> 76 65 = -11
> 
> Seems like a lot of people are getting 20c or better, so my 10c seems very inadequate. Based on that spread of temps, can anyone tell me if maybe I did something wrong? I painted the CL Ultra on the die, and on the top surface of the ihs, then installed as usual. Never used anything like Ultra before, but painting isn't exactly complicated so I can't think of what would have gone wrong.
> 
> Any help or suggestions much appreciated.


to much TIM on the die







it happens though don't feel bad.


----------



## justanoldman

TD, and Stickg1, thanks as always.
Too much is possible I guess.
Being a newb, can you guys tell me if I can uninstall everything, and just smooth out the ultra in both places or is there no choice but to completely clean it off and reapply fresh? The one tube is not enough to do both applications again and at $18 a pop, I am just trying to figure out if I have to order a couple more.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> to much TIM on the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it happens though don't feel bad.


Thanks Valguar, and thank you very much for the great thread. My apologies for not +rep before.
Any other old delidders out there, as in born before 1970?

Any chance I can smooth out the application or should I clean all the ultra off and do it again from the start?


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> TD, and Stickg1, thanks as always.
> Too much is possible I guess.
> Being a newb, can you guys tell me if I can uninstall everything, and just smooth out the ultra in both places or is there no choice but to completely clean it off and reapply fresh? The one tube is not enough to do both applications again and at $18 a pop, I am just trying to figure out if I have to order a couple more.


If there isn't enough Ultra to do both applications again, then you really are using a lot


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1.55 is not the max vcore.... neither is 1.52.
> 
> I'm getting very sick of this topic as well. The max vcore changes per chip due to the silicon used in the 22nm processing for Ivy Bridge. I've asked Intel many times and have been told the exact same thing which makes sense as each chip has certain properties due in part to just the silicon. That's why I'm trying to get a good group of people to actually make a good vcore to be in of good speeds and still seem safe.
> 
> Hokies.... I don't care that you have run 1.55 for months it's one chip. same for my Franky he took 1.98vcore and all the vcores in between for days of benching. I still prefer a range of 1.45vcore myself for full time loads of 24/7 like folding at home where the chip is stressed all day every day, plus playing games on it at the same time.
> 
> You can't say with certain knowledge yeah it's what I ran so it's fine yadda yadda yadda. You have to have proven results or a heck of a lot of experienced people behind your information. Yes sin knows his stuff and I agree. but 1.55 is still a lot of vcore.....
> 
> you have to be considerate to the normal users where they don't really know OC'ing as much as us and they think. Ohh 1.55 is totally fine! i'll throw that in and try for 5 giggles then they aren't delidded and they damage the thing.
> 
> That Intel chart with VID of 1.52 is at stock. it changes as soon as you OC the darn thing!
> 
> I would agree to 1.5 area IF and ONLY IF they are delidded, since the temps will be down by a large margin. but for the normal non crazy people like us, you need a safe area, so people aren't hitting thermals all day long trying to learn how to Overclock for the first time.
> 
> We need to decide on ONE and stick with it no more 8 different vcores all over the place.


I vote for 1.98 and not a millivolt more!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks Valguar, and thank you very much for the great thread. My apologies for not +rep before.
> Any other old delidders out there, as in born before 1970?
> 
> Any chance I can smooth out the application or should I clean all the ultra off and do it again from the start?


Use the same brush to wipe the excess TIM onto the PCB and then carefully take a cotton swab dipped in alcohol and clean off the excess TIM. Works for me..


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I vote for 1.98 and not a millivolt more!


Max voltage is whatever your comfortable with. I say just keep the temps in check. If you're okay with cutting the IHS off your CPU and overclocking it over 4.5GHz then you're already risking the life of your chip so I say just go with it, if it dies, so be it.


----------



## c2thew

can you guys place cs source at 4.5ghz? for me the game crashes sporadically so I have to drop down to 4.4 and it's stable.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks Valguar, and thank you very much for the great thread. My apologies for not +rep before.
> Any other old delidders out there, as in born before 1970?
> 
> Any chance I can smooth out the application or should I clean all the ultra off and do it again from the start?


No problem and glad you enjoy it!







I'm only 20 if I was older than /I would have a stock screen like yours sir. Take some picture for us if you can... but basically 1/4 grain of rice so a little bigger than a tip of a pencil. Then spread it out a bit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I vote for 1.98 and not a millivolt more!


pffft.....


----------



## justanoldman

Thanks everyone.
You guys see anything wrong with these pics?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks everyone.
> You guys see anything wrong with these pics?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


NICE! very clean and well done!









what did you use to get the glue off?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> NICE! very clean and well done!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what did you use to get the glue off?


Delidding = easier than I thought
removing tim, used q-tip+ alcohol = really easy

The glue, oh that pain in butt glue, yep I hated it. Tried a few things on the ihs to practice, I think I may have scratched it a little on the edges but I figured that wouldn't matter. Finally settled on credit card for the pcb, and it worked great. Credit card all the way for the glue.


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks everyone.
> You guys see anything wrong with these pics?


Very Nice!!! Did you install it and fired it up...is it alive? lol







What are your temps?


----------



## Airrick10

When I apply CL Ultra inside the IHS....do I have to apply it to the whole area or just the area where the die makes contact?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> Very Nice!!! Did you install it and fired it up...is it alive? lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What are your temps?


Temps not very good -10c, but as you guys have said, I used too much Ultra. Will see after I try to wipe some off.

Running IBT right now on Maximum with 4.8, I just estimated 1.41v manual, and I hit 86c, max. Was never able to even try for 4.8 before so that is cool.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sin0822 and that is what i have run 24/7 for months.
> 
> I find it very hypocritical that a person has the enthusiast desire enough to force a Razor blade between a piece of copper and a circuit board... But then is scared to run any type of Vcore?


Probably delidding is a one time process that makes a large difference in temps. In my opinion worth the risk. Pushing the vcore to a level where degredstion could occur for no performance gain other than synthetic benchmarks may not be as worth it for some people


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> can you guys place cs source at 4.5ghz? for me the game crashes sporadically so I have to drop down to 4.4 and it's stable.


IDK bud, last time I played CS:S was on a single core Athlon 3700+ with a GeForce 7600 and I got 60 FPS easy so IDK what you would need 4.5GHz on an i5 or i7 for to play that...Might be software related.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Temps not very good -10c, but as you guys have said, I used too much Ultra. Will see after I try to wipe some off.
> 
> Running IBT right now on Maximum with 4.8, I just estimated 1.41v manual, and I hit 86c, max. Was never able to even try for 4.8 before so that is cool.


Yeah try to clean some of the TIM off and see if it helps.


----------



## I_shot

I am back









I wasn't gonna delid my new chip after all. one dead chip and a half dead chip as you remember. The thing is i can't change







I know that if this is gonna die i'll buy one and delid again... Nonsense i know but this mod is bloody entertaining. Anyway i used phobya LM on cpu die, gelid gc extreme on cooler and tested at 1.176V at 4.3 ghz( I couldn't go higher with intel stock cooler cause it wasn't stable due to heat and i can't compare higher clocks,voltages and temps at 4.5 or 4.6 ghz)



Before Delid Room Temp 22 C



After Delid Room Temp 21 C



19 C max and 18 C average before-after.

I won't touch the cpu from now on







I can't kill this too


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Just an old man:
Lovely pictures!
Yeah you really need little on it. If you used the whole syringe, then that's way too much!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> can you guys place cs source at 4.5ghz? for me the game crashes sporadically so I have to drop down to 4.4 and it's stable.


That means your chip is unstable at 4.5


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> That means your chip is unstable at 4.5


yeah.. can't believe I missed that post sorry.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Just an old man:
> Lovely pictures!
> Yeah you really need little on it. If you used the whole syringe, then that's way too much!


10 points clear tomorrow?


----------



## c2thew

I think all the cleaning and static electricity from using a napkin killed my higher overclocks. looks like i'm a 4.4 owner.. =(

edit* I meant CS: GO


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I used 99% isopropyl had to get it from behind the counter at the pharmacy.


It's behind the counter now? I got a good deal on a couple 5 gallon buckets of 99% a few years ago so haven't bought any in a long time.
I did notice last time I had to get acetone you need to have a driver's license to get that now. We going all nanny state up here...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1.55v IS the max safe for 24/7 use for Ivy if your temps are great i would not run 1.55v and be loading at 100c now.
> 
> 1.4v - 1.45v if your a soft core over clocker with a crappy cooler...
> 
> If you have a good water loop you can run 1.4 - 1.45v with out issue.. so there would be no reason to De lid your chip... Unles you were going for the Maximum V core of 1.55v like the hardcore overclockers do.


I hate giving 'safe' voltage advice. Safe is what the user feels comfortable with & how long he wants a chip to last, in this thread delidding & safe voltage really don't go together. Willing to risk the life of the chip to get better temps, then not want to push it?
Hardcore overclockers, max 1.55V vcore?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks Valguar, and thank you very much for the great thread. My apologies for not +rep before.
> Any other old delidders out there, as in born before 1970?
> 
> Any chance I can smooth out the application or should I clean all the ultra off and do it again from the start?


Not too far before 1970, but I was still produced in the 60s.


----------



## Swag

Well I got good news and bad news...

Bad news...Intel can't read the IHS markings so they can't honor the warranty, even though I was able to read the IHS markings myself...

Good news...I'm getting 2 new Xeon servers from my dad's company.







I already got one before, they are both dual-CPU servers and they have 6C/12T each CPU so 24T each server.








This is the one that they gave me last year, so 2 more of these:


Oh yea, and 72GB of RAM.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks everyone.
> You guys see anything wrong with these pics?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


i see something wrong intel put that crappy ass TIM on the die. other than that it looks good


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well I got good news and bad news...
> 
> Bad news...Intel can't read the IHS markings so they can't honor the warranty, even though I was able to read the IHS markings myself...
> 
> Good news...I'm getting 2 new Xeon servers from my dad's company.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I already got one before, they are both dual-CPU servers and they have 6C/12T each CPU so 24T each server.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the one that they gave me last year, so 2 more of these:
> 
> 
> Oh yea, and 72GB of RAM.


can i have your old one for benching purposes? and any others?


----------



## FtW 420

From what I've read the TIM itself is fine (application looks a bit heavy, same as overTIMmed gpus), seems more like an issue with the crappy glue holding the IHS off the PCB more. TIM is supposed to be at least as good as most regular pastes available retail (not liquid metal league).
Every once in a while you can also get an IHS that is uneven like a mountain range, those don't help...


----------



## justanoldman

I spent a long time making sure there was just a very thin even layer of Ultra on the die, and on top of the ihs. Tested it and had to shut it down because temps jumped into the 90s. No bubbles, no imperfections, just a nice, very thin layer on both. Cleaned off the inside of the ihs and h100i block as well.

Then I thought maybe not enough was in between the cooler and ihs, so took it apart again, and put a nice thin layer on both. That helped so I could actually run a test now, but the temps are up 4 degrees from when I assumed I had too much.

From how you guys describe it, I definitely think I had too much on the first time, but reducing it to a nice thin layer has caused temps to go up.

Any suggestions?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well I got good news and bad news...
> 
> Bad news...Intel can't read the IHS markings so they can't honor the warranty, even though I was able to read the IHS markings myself...
> 
> Good news...I'm getting 2 new Xeon servers from my dad's company.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I already got one before, they are both dual-CPU servers and they have 6C/12T each CPU so 24T each server.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the one that they gave me last year, so 2 more of these:
> 
> 
> Oh yea, and 72GB of RAM.


Bench multithreaded stuff on it, you'll win lol
cinebench, wprime, if you can somehow mount a gpu and oc those some 3dm11 yada yada...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> can i have your old one for benching purposes? and any others?


Me wants








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I spent a long time making sure there was just a very thin even layer of Ultra on the die, and on top of the ihs. Tested it and had to shut it down because temps jumped into the 90s. No bubbles, no imperfections, just a nice, very thin layer on both. Cleaned off the inside of the ihs and h100i block as well.
> 
> Then I thought maybe not enough was in between the cooler and ihs, so took it apart again, and put a nice thin layer on both. That helped so I could actually run a test now, but the temps are up 4 degrees from when I assumed I had too much.
> 
> From how you guys describe it, I definitely think I had too much on the first time, but reducing it to a nice thin layer has caused temps to go up.
> 
> Any suggestions?


Seems like your ihs is really concave. I guess lapping it to make it even would help with the thin layer tim application.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> *Bench multithreaded stuff on it, you'll win lol*
> cinebench, wprime, if you can somehow mount a gpu and oc those some 3dm11 yada yada...
> Me wants
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seems like your ihs is really concave. I guess lapping it to make it even would help with the thin layer tim application.


This! It's been funny to watch people rage at hwbot when dhenzjhen is smashing wprime scores.

While running at stock clocks


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, 48 core setups will beat the crap out of most wprime scores easily...It's a shame Intel killed off the SR-X potential.


----------



## Valgaur

wonder if the bank my mom works at will let me do some awesome server runs lol.


----------



## Swag

@Valgaur

I'm going to use all three of them for 24/7 folding.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well I got good news and bad news...
> 
> Bad news...Intel can't read the IHS markings so they can't honor the warranty, even though I was able to read the IHS markings myself...
> 
> Good news...I'm getting 2 new Xeon servers from my dad's company.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I already got one before, they are both dual-CPU servers and they have 6C/12T each CPU so 24T each server.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the one that they gave me last year, so 2 more of these:
> 
> 
> Oh yea, and 72GB of RAM.
> 
> 
> 
> Bench multithreaded stuff on it, you'll win lol
> cinebench, wprime, if you can somehow mount a gpu and oc those some 3dm11 yada yada....
Click to expand...

I think I can mount a gpu somehow, my dad was telling me about it before. Also, I will bench with them and then use them for folding.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @Valgaur
> 
> I'm going to use all three of them for 24/7 folding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I can mount a gpu somehow, my dad was telling me about it before. Also, I will bench with them and then use them for folding.


put the benches in my name ill PM you lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You bastard lol








I can't those kind of boints like that








I believe that is actually illegal, and has got Andre Yang banned for a while before...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wonder if the bank my mom works at will let me do some awesome server runs lol.


Just need to get the coding right. This card # with this pin # in an ATM = unlimited withdrawals...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You bastard lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't those kind of boints like that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe that is actually illegal, and has got Andre Yang banned for a while before...


You can bench with 2 people, or use another guys rig, but only 1 person can get boints for the effort. Although, you are supposed to do it yourself. That was how andre got in trouble, you can't just email record breaking screenshots & validations to friends (or in his case, customers...)

That was screwed up.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wonder if the bank my mom works at will let me do some awesome server runs lol.


Just need to get the coding right. This card # with this pin # in an ATM = unlimited withdrawals...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just need to get the coding right. This card # with this pin # in an ATM = unlimited withdrawals...
> You can bench with 2 people, or use another guys rig, but only 1 person can get boints for the effort. Although, you are supposed to do it yourself. That was how andre got in trouble, you can't just email record breaking screenshots & validations to friends (or in his case, customers...)
> 
> That was screwed up.


lol, yeah good ideal...
As for the shady stuff, I didn't recall exactly what the fuzz was about, but yeah








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just need to get the coding right. This card # with this pin # in an ATM = unlimited withdrawals...


Then again, you may be on to something









I'm gonna borrow an fx8120 myself to do some ram clock validations, easy quick boints with psc and samsung ram and cold air.








Also good for wprime lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Ordered 8 gt ap-14's from frozen cpu, $17 each so not that bad I think. I was going to get ap-13's for less noise but I figured the 14's gave the best overall noise for performance. I can already feel the comfort of the noise reduction


----------



## Totally Dubbed

BS swag, even I could read the god damn marking. Contest the decision. You got literally nothing to lose.


----------



## tzvia

Finally got it nice and stable so will try and 'join the club' here LOL. Took a bit to get the offset right on my Maximus. Here goes...

Some OC info and delid photo


CPU-Z under Prime after 12 hrs at 4.8ghz. Had to go +.15 offset and the vid went has high as 1.438v. Not one WHEA in 12 hours. This chip hit 97c on an H100 at 4.6ghz, and and only dropped 11c going to a Raystorm, delidding got it down to 60c at 4.6. Now at 4.8ghz, it briefly hit 70c once in 12 hrs and hovered around 67c the rest of the time. I lost more heat for free by delidding as compared to the hundreds I put into the Raystorm. Not that I am complaining, I was just too scared to delid until after I got the Raystorm setup. Don't regret it, as I plan to get my GPUs under water once I figure out what I need and get the funds together anyway.

Well, am I in?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> Finally got it nice and stable so will try and 'join the club' here LOL. Took a bit to get the offset right on my Maximus. Here goes...
> 
> Some OC info and delid photo
> 
> 
> CPU-Z under Prime after 12 hrs at 4.8ghz. Had to go +.15 offset and the vid went has high as 1.438v. Not one WHEA in 12 hours. This chip hit 97c on an H100 at 4.6ghz, and and only dropped 11c going to a Raystorm, delidding got it down to 60c at 4.6. Now at 4.8ghz, it briefly hit 70c once in 12 hrs and hovered around 67c the rest of the time. I lost more heat for free by delidding as compared to the hundreds I put into the Raystorm. Not that I am complaining, I was just too scared to delid until after I got the Raystorm setup. Don't regret it, as I plan to get my GPUs under water once I figure out what I need and get the funds together anyway.
> 
> Well, am I in?


first page submission format then you'll be in!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> first page submission format then you'll be in!


I think the matter of research is great - but the matter of someone having to do all of those things (ie the 4.5ghz for temp drop) is a little bit too much to join a club.
I don't have a problem, as I will do it anyway - but I hope you get my point


----------



## justanoldman

Thanks for all the assistance guys
Unfortunately you can put me down as a failure, I think the chip is headed for the trash.


----------



## FtW 420

We can still participate, I just looked at the OP & noticed I'm not actually a member either. Having the name in the list isn't that important though, there's always good chat in here.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the assistance guys
> Unfortunately you can put me down as a failure, I think the chip is headed for the trash.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the assistance guys
> Unfortunately you can put me down as a failure, I think the chip is headed for the trash.


*Justanoldman*, have you tried lapping the IHS yet first? My temp drops were only around 14C when I first delidded, so I lapped my IHS top and inside and found another 12C. Then my total temp improvement became 26C. Some IHS's need to be lapped.

Also, I'm pre-1970 myself.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Justanoldman*, have you tried lapping the IHS yet first? My temp drops were only around 14C when I first delidded, so I lapped my IHS top and inside and found another 12C. Then my total temp improvement became 26C. Some IHS's need to be lapped.
> 
> Also, I'm pre-1970 myself.


Goooo 1988...sorry im bored...cs go isn't quite cutting it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Justanoldman*, have you tried lapping the IHS yet first? My temp drops were only around 14C when I first delidded, so I lapped my IHS top and inside and found another 12C. Then my total temp improvement became 26C. Some IHS's need to be lapped.
> 
> Also, I'm pre-1970 myself.
> 
> 
> 
> Goooo 1988...sorry im bored...cs go isn't quite cutting it
Click to expand...

CS:GO sucks! Oh by the way, since there are a lot of Americans here, my dad's friend just came and taught me how to take apart/clean an AR and it looks really interesting. Does anyone shoot or anything like that? Looks like a stress reliever.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *Justanoldman*, have you tried lapping the IHS yet first? My temp drops were only around 14C when I first delidded, so I lapped my IHS top and inside and found another 12C. Then my total temp improvement became 26C. Some IHS's need to be lapped.
> 
> Also, I'm pre-1970 myself.


I think I understand lapping the top, just rub it on several levels of sandpaper, but how to you lap the inside?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I think the matter of research is great - but the matter of someone having to do all of those things (ie the 4.5ghz for temp drop) is a little bit too much to join a club.
> I don't have a problem, as I will do it anyway - but I hope you get my point


I understand the point, but the reason all of it is there is for research. also this helps show our results with certain TIM's and other things. show's the gains withdraws of delidding which most people don't really know about. Thats the reason why. I know it's a lot of information but it's necessary.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> We can still participate, I just looked at the OP & noticed I'm not actually a member either. Having the name in the list isn't that important though, there's always good chat in here.


woops link me and I'll add ya, I remember you subbmitting when we got like 8 subs in a day and I had no compuper.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> CS:GO sucks! Oh by the way, since there are a lot of Americans here, my dad's friend just came and taught me how to take apart/clean an AR and it looks really interesting. Does anyone shoot or anything like that? Looks like a stress reliever.


I hunt a lot. but I play LoL more than anything. but fishing is my stress reliever. I will fish in an instants notice if I'm able.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I think I understand lapping the top, just rub it on several levels of sandpaper, but how to you lap the inside?


you just flip it over and sand the lips of the bottom. the parts where the latch holds the lid down on.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> Finally got it nice and stable so will try and 'join the club' here LOL. Took a bit to get the offset right on my Maximus. Here goes...
> 
> Some OC info and delid photo
> 
> 
> CPU-Z under Prime after 12 hrs at 4.8ghz. Had to go +.15 offset and the vid went has high as 1.438v. Not one WHEA in 12 hours. This chip hit 97c on an H100 at 4.6ghz, and and only dropped 11c going to a Raystorm, delidding got it down to 60c at 4.6. Now at 4.8ghz, it briefly hit 70c once in 12 hrs and hovered around 67c the rest of the time. I lost more heat for free by delidding as compared to the hundreds I put into the Raystorm. Not that I am complaining, I was just too scared to delid until after I got the Raystorm setup. Don't regret it, as I plan to get my GPUs under water once I figure out what I need and get the funds together anyway.
> 
> Well, am I in?


I'll add you right now! Sorry I miss read the info on your picture submission thats my fault, been playing games all day and am blind as a bat right now!

So slap that hot Sig on your sig list! you are in!









Ohh do you have a CPU-Z link to your max OC? Your still in btw.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> CS:GO sucks! Oh by the way, since there are a lot of Americans here, my dad's friend just came and taught me how to take apart/clean an AR and it looks really interesting. Does anyone shoot or anything like that? Looks like a stress reliever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hunt a lot. but I play LoL more than anything. but fishing is my stress reliever. I will fish in an instants notice if I'm able.
Click to expand...

You sound like an old man...







Haha!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I understand the point, but the reason all of it is there is for research. also this helps show our results with certain TIM's and other things. show's the gains withdraws of delidding which most people don't really know about. Thats the reason why. I know it's a lot of information but it's necessary.
> woops link me and I'll add ya, I remember you subbmitting when we got like 8 subs in a day and I had no compuper.
> I hunt a lot. but I play LoL more than anything. but fishing is my stress reliever. I will fish in an instants notice if I'm able.
> you just flip it over and sand the lips of the bottom. the parts where the latch holds the lid down on.


Fishing as in put a line in the water, crack a beer, & reel in the line when the case is empty, or actual fishing?
Both are good for stress release.

I used to hunt as well, but it was way too stressful. Moved out to the boonies where there aren't any crackheads creeping around, much more relaxing.


----------



## justanoldman

Which lapping guide/video would you guys recommend? I have never done anything like it before.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Which lapping guide/video would you guys recommend? I have never done anything like it before.


There's a link to a guide on page one of this thread as for videos I didn't watch any when I did mine but someone here will know.









Oops nvmd ibresd that as delidding for some reason...tired


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Fishing as in put a line in the water, crack a beer, & reel in the line when the case is empty, or actual fishing?
> Both are good for stress release.
> 
> I used to hunt as well, but it was way too stressful. Moved out to the boonies where there aren't any crackheads creeping around, much more relaxing.


The first one. the one where you can sit back and just think and relax and be near nature I prefer that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Which lapping guide/video would you guys recommend? I have never done anything like it before.


look at page one for the link in the spoilers. Also you just put sand paper flat and move it in circles is all you ned to do really usually the top is the best area try that first and see what results you get.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Any other old delidders out there, as in born before 1970?


i was born in the sixties








1963..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Use the same brush to wipe the excess TIM onto the PCB and then carefully take a cotton swab dipped in alcohol and clean off the excess TIM. Works for me..


Similar to what I did, i used a cotton but to spread it then the other end to remove the excess paste. Worked a charm! 25c drop first time!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Same method as this


This lapping video looks easy to follow, thanks i_shot.


----------



## justanoldman

VonDutch, I think you win, now don't forget to take your pills and eat dinner by 4 pm.









Matt-Matt, sure rub it in, I'm jealous.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> This lapping video looks easy to follow, thanks i_shot.


glad the delid wetn well for you justanoldman








when using ultra on the die etc, you should see more then a 10C drop tho,
hope youll figure it out, but first do a concave check , before you start lapping..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch, I think you win, now don't forget to take your pills and eat dinner by 4 pm.


i never forget my daily purple pills,
sometimes a man comes , and lets me choose from a red or blue pill too











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> Finally got it nice and stable so will try and 'join the club' here LOL. Took a bit to get the offset right on my Maximus. Here goes...
> 
> Some OC info and delid photo
> 
> 
> CPU-Z under Prime after 12 hrs at 4.8ghz. Had to go +.15 offset and the vid went has high as 1.438v. Not one WHEA in 12 hours. This chip hit 97c on an H100 at 4.6ghz, and and only dropped 11c going to a Raystorm, delidding got it down to 60c at 4.6. Now at 4.8ghz, it briefly hit 70c once in 12 hrs and hovered around 67c the rest of the time. I lost more heat for free by delidding as compared to the hundreds I put into the Raystorm. Not that I am complaining, I was just too scared to delid until after I got the Raystorm setup. Don't regret it, as I plan to get my GPUs under water once I figure out what I need and get the funds together anyway.
> 
> Well, am I in?


Gratz tzvia


----------



## iwalkwithedead

Just learned exactly what lapping was and watched a really good how-to video, I don't know if I need it but I saved it anyways, just in case.

I watched a good video on delidding as well.

I do plan on delidding soon, so I am set! I just need to buy some materials for these things and pray that I don't some how botch it up because I don't have the money for another CPU lolz. I really shouldn't do it, why haven't you talked me out of this yet? lolz, I will risk it, it want to be officially part of this club dang it.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch, I think you win, now don't forget to take your pills and eat dinner by 4 pm.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Matt-Matt, sure rub it in, I'm jealous.


I was just really lucky.. Well honestly I tried a Pentium 4 IHS first and that failed miserably. I was just really lucky, hey put it this way dude. At least your processor still works and you still got a 10c drop and I've seen a few with drops like 2c which is within margin of error. I also applied some liquid ultra to my 7950 and the temps went up 2c or so. You've got to think about the chance of survival here and be happy that you were within the 80% of people that de-lidded to have a working processor. May I ask how much of the glue you removed? That is the main reason to de-lid I think








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iwalkwithedead*
> 
> Just learned exactly what lapping was and watched a really good how-to video, I don't know if I need it but I saved it anyways, just in case.
> 
> I watched a good video on delidding as well.
> 
> I do plan on delidding soon, so I am set! I just need to buy some materials for these things and pray that I don't some how botch it up because I don't have the money for another CPU lolz. I really shouldn't do it, why haven't you talked me out of this yet? lolz, I will risk it, it want to be officially part of this club dang it.


I didn't have the cash and I did it, i'm happy. That being said get hold of a few older processors and see how happy/confident you feel, Pentium 4's, Core 2's, Celerons etc. I was really lucky because I just happened to have two glued pentium 4's sitting in my drawer from 2-3 years ago (Got them for free), I also happened to get two entire socket 775 systems as test benches for free that came with glued celerons for nothing.


----------



## VonDutch

Hokies quotes Sin0822..i hope i can do the same then, last time we had this conversation about max vcore,
he said i had to stop quoting others (Sin0822) i think ..lol


On Air/Water: *Intel Rec. Max is Intel's absolute maximum rating for the Ivy Bridge lineup*,
many of the numbers provided are identical to those of Sandy Bridge,
however while vcore should be lower because of a better processing technology (22nm vs 32nm)*
it is max 1.52v here* because of the SVID max.


here Sin0822 is using the 1.3-1.45V vcore range as to be the *Recommended Range 1.3-1.45V* to run ivy

moving on










*5.3GHz is my maximum validation on air:*

theres a difference between 24/7 vcores, or using a high vcore for validation, like Sin does for his 5.3ghz validation,
hes almost at the 1.55V vcore when he does this validation run, he doesnt say its safe to use for 24/7 tho, nowhere actually..

For 5GHz for instance, *it is possible to OC to 5GHz with 1.4v on air:*


yes, its possible, IF temps permit, and thats what we archieve by delidding our ivy's,
it doesnt mean you can just go ahead and put any vcore on it, if you ask whats "safe" for 24/7 usage,
stick to the 1.3-1.45V vcore range, and youll be fine..

if you really want to push your chip to the limit, and you dont mind the risk involved running very high vcore,
then use upto the 1.52V vcore


----------



## Matt-Matt

VonDutch knows what he's talking about! I agree 100%


----------



## Valgaur

Exactly what I said earlier Von!


----------



## Hokies83

So much fail heh..



Being nice with 1.55v..

But who am i to go vs the smart guys who run 1.8v = 1.95v on Air/h100s to get screen shots XD Cough im not even that " Stupid "


----------



## King4x4

Von for Pres!

Sorry Hokies... you are too hardcore for the rest of us!


----------



## mandrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks Valguar, and thank you very much for the great thread. My apologies for not +rep before.
> Any other old delidders out there, as in born before 1970?
> 
> Any chance I can smooth out the application or should I clean all the ultra off and do it again from the start?


Yep. I was born waaaaaay before 1970, in fact I got drafted the next year, traveled the world, met new people, then...well you know.









You can probably smooth it out and remove any excess. I just spread the Pro using the syringe it came in.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the assistance guys
> Unfortunately you can put me down as a failure, I think the chip is headed for the trash.


Throwing it away because the temps only got a few degrees better? Even if you only shaved off 5C it's still a success. Order a tube of the Liquid Pro and try that out next week. See if you have better luck.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the assistance guys
> Unfortunately you can put me down as a failure, I think the chip is headed for the trash.


See that's why I keep being indecisive about my de-lid....not sure to do or not to do...
I've bought the parts - I'll see how it goes for me - I decided to just YOLO it.


----------



## stickg1

This game is exceptional: http://twinbeard.com/frog-fractions

Try to play it, the upgrades are awesome.

"Rub balloons against your tongue before extending it and nearby bugs will stick to it. Science."


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Exactly what I said earlier Von!


Yes, but Von used lots of charts!!!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Von for Pres!
> 
> Sorry Hokies... you are too hardcore for the rest of us!


Yes he is hardcore *King4x4*, but lots of the fun of this thread is that we have many different people here coming from different places with different opinions. I like that as long as there is some respect shown even when we don't always agree.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the assistance guys
> Unfortunately you can put me down as a failure, I think the chip is headed for the trash.
> 
> 
> 
> See that's why I keep being indecisive about my de-lid....not sure to do or not to do...
> I've bought the parts - I'll see how it goes for me - I decided to just YOLO it.
Click to expand...

Don't worry *Totally Dubbed*. justanoldman is still not done seeing what he can do, and we all know that throwing away a chip becasue it only improved by 10C is not really going to happen. More like the expression of some dissapointment, but really, that is still a huge improvement over an unlidded IB! And it is still possible that lapping or better application of TIM or another remount might get him the typical gains of 20-30C yet. We are still working to help him too! And we will be there for you too if you need any help.

*justanoldman*, wondering if you maybe have the IHS on top of the raised retangular lip on one side of the PCB when you latch the IHS down. Have you looked to see if the IHS is moving when you latch it? It is very easy for it to do so.

And on the lapping of the inside of the IHS. Valgaur was noting the lapping of the edges, but I actually lapped the inside of the lip. Not easy to do, but my IHS was very concave on top, which ment it was very convex inside so that only a small part of the IHS was making contact with my die. So, I had to sand that down enough to make it flat inside the lip. I got something flat and round that I could put the sandpaper on that was smaller than the area and allowed for enough movement to allow for some sanding, and I then sanded using a turning movement. It took awhile, but it worked and I ended up with an extra 12C of temp improvment after that. Total temp gain ended up as ~26C.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

^thanks for the comment!

Speaking of concave and whatnot....wouldn't be surprised if my Antec 920 is like that...which would then explain why my 920 temps aren't as good as others


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> ^thanks for the comment!
> 
> Speaking of concave and whatnot....wouldn't be surprised if my Antec 920 is like that...which would then explain why my 920 temps aren't as good as others


I lapped my last 620 but only got me a degree or two, if any. I didn't bother doing it again this time around.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I lapped my last 620 but only got me a degree or two, if any. I didn't bother doing it again this time around.


well you see, that's the thing - I'll check with the razor next time round.
Out of interest, with what did you lap it with? Which sandpaper?

For me - I have a "scratch" on my Antec 920 - which might be causing the temps to be inaccurate.
Might just go head and RMA it, if it is concave/convex.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I lapped my last 620 but only got me a degree or two, if any. I didn't bother doing it again this time around.
> 
> 
> 
> well you see, that's the thing - I'll check with the razor next time round.
> Out of interest, with what did you lap it with? Which sandpaper?
> 
> For me - I have a "scratch" on my Antec 920 - which might be causing the temps to be inaccurate.
> Might just go head and RMA it, if it is concave/convex.
Click to expand...

Yep, lapping effects do vary. If the IHS is flat, then lapping it may only gain 1-3C for all the effort and not be worth it for some. But if it is concave, then it can mean much larger gains.

As for sandpaper, if it is very concave inside the IHS and lots of sanding needs to happen, then start with some 400, then move to 600, and then finish it with some 800. If it is the top, then you can continue with 1000 and 1200. Mainly little temp diff going from 800 to 1200, but it makes it look better! Some like to go up to 2000 or even 3000 to make it like a mirror finish. I just wanted the temp improvments so I stoped at 800 inside and 1000 on the top.

Good place to find sandpaper is at auto parts stores, although ebay has it to.


----------



## justanoldman

Basically to recap - the delid went well, as my pictures show it doesn't look bad. I removed all the glue that was at all possible with a credit card, I checked and I don't think it would be possible to remove anymore without some other method. I don't feel any glue left so I think that it is as good as it can get.

For reference, here is my post with pics:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/10650#post_19193615

I put too much ultra on the die and on the top of the IHS, so in a 22.2c room with 1.29v I was 82c before and 72c after.

Then the trouble began, I took it all apart and made triple sure that I put just a very fine layer of Ultra on everything, in no way could it be too much, but it had a nice even, thin coat. Temps went up measurably, so I started all over again. The only possibility -> too little Ultra.

I had just enough Ultra left to start fresh, clean everything, and reapply Ultra on the die and on top of the ihs, just like the Coollabs video shows. I looked at a lot of pictures and I am as sure as I can be that I did it right. Temps ended up higher than when I had too much, but better than too little. Now I am out of Ultra so I try the only thing I have, AS5, and that is useless, so I can't be overclocked for now.

My trash comment was out of frustration when I realized that all the time and money put into a $229 chip after I try lapping everything, I could have just bought a 3930k. Then I remembered than I am doing this to learn, and reminded myself to not be such a whiney douche.

I found a nice razor blade that looked as level as possible. Put it on top of the ihs with a flashlight behind it, then had my wife look also to make sure she saw the same thing. Unquestionable, unmistakable light in the middle = concave. A lapping we will go, a lapping we will go, hi ho the dariy-o a lapping we will go.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Basically to recap - the delid went well, as my pictures show it doesn't look bad. I removed all the glue that was at all possible with a credit card, I checked and I don't think it would be possible to remove anymore without some other method. I don't feel any glue left so I think that it is as good as it can get.
> 
> For reference, here is my post with pics:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/10650#post_19193615
> 
> I put too much ultra on the die and on the top of the IHS, so in a 22.2c room with 1.29v I was 82c before and 72c after.
> 
> Then the trouble began, I took it all apart and made triple sure that I put just a very fine layer of Ultra on everything, in no way could it be too much, but it had a nice even, thin coat. Temps went up measurably, so I started all over again. The only possibility -> too little Ultra.
> 
> I had just enough Ultra left to start fresh, clean everything, and reapply Ultra on the die and on top of the ihs, just like the Coollabs video shows. I looked at a lot of pictures and I am as sure as I can be that I did it right. Temps ended up higher than when I had too much, but better than too little. Now I am out of Ultra so I try the only thing I have, AS5, and that is useless, so I can't be overclocked for now.
> 
> My trash comment was out of frustration when I realized that all the time and money put into a $229 chip after I try lapping everything, I could have just bought a 3930k. Then I remembered than I am doing this to learn, and reminded myself to not be such a whiney douche.
> 
> I found a nice razor blade that looked as level as possible. Put it on top of the ihs with a flashlight behind it, then had my wife look also to make sure she saw the same thing. Unquestionable, unmistakable light in the middle = concave. A lapping we will go, a lapping we will go, hi ho the dariy-o a lapping we will go.


Well, cool *justanoldman*! Thanks for your recap above. And it is great you found the reason for the dissappointing improvements. We can have some good hopes that you will get this completed with the results we are used to seeing and that you wanted and expected. And it is the fun of doing this mod anyway - that is a large part of why we do it. Keep us informed of your progress and if you have any more questions.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> I got something flat and round that I could put the sandpaper on that was smaller than the area and allowed for enough movement to allow for some sanding, and I then sanded using a turning movement. It took awhile, but it worked and I ended up with an extra 12C of temp improvment after that. Total temp gain ended up as ~26C.


Thanks a lot for all the help.
What did you use that was flat and round for the underside of the IHS?


----------



## stickg1

I would just keep the Ultra on the die until you can get some more. Also I wouldn't waste the CL Ultra/Pro on the IHS, just use some quality diamond based TIM for that. Run down to Best Buy or Staples, they sell Antec Formula 7, great stuff for IHS and coolers.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Basically to recap - the delid went well, as my pictures show it doesn't look bad. I removed all the glue that was at all possible with a credit card, I checked and I don't think it would be possible to remove anymore without some other method. I don't feel any glue left so I think that it is as good as it can get.
> I found a nice razor blade that looked as level as possible. Put it on top of the ihs with a flashlight behind it, then had my wife look also to make sure she saw the same thing. Unquestionable, unmistakable light in the middle = concave. A lapping we will go, a lapping we will go, hi ho the dariy-o a lapping we will go.


Quite the persistent legend you are!
I would give you a rep - but feel that you're counter would be going un-unique too much









Thanks PCwargamer for the info on the sandpaper +rep!


----------



## MikeG

So I decided to go "au naturel" , "buck naked", "direct-to -the-die" today. Why do I do this to myself? I got a great chip already, but I just can't leave well enough alone. Computer wouldn't boot, getting post code 55 and that major sinking feeling in my heart.







My first thought was that I over tightened the water block. Took everything apart, and no bent pins. Turns out I didn't tighten it enough. Everything is working now, hopefully better and not worse. I documented everything this time and will post my results once my body stops shaking.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> So I decided to go "au naturel" , "buck naked", "direct-to -the-die" today. Why do I do this to myself? I got a great chip already, but I just can't leave well enough alone. Computer wouldn't boot, getting post code 55 and that major sinking feeling in my heart.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My first thought was that I over tightened the water block. Took everything apart, and no bent pins. Turns out I didn't tighten it enough. Everything is working now, hopefully better and not worse. I documented everything this time and will post my results once my body stops shaking.


My half dead chip gave the exact error on post at his last 10 minutes...i remounted it with ihs on but internal gpu was gone already. I advise you to check iternal gpu. remove external vga and boot from internal gpu install drivers and see everything okay ? my half dead chip was working with drivers unistalled or disabled from device manager


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> I am back
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wasn't gonna delid my new chip after all. one dead chip and a half dead chip as you remember. The thing is i can't change
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know that if this is gonna die i'll buy one and delid again... Nonsense i know but this mod is bloody entertaining. Anyway i used phobya LM on cpu die, gelid gc extreme on cooler and tested at 1.176V at 4.3 ghz( I couldn't go higher with intel stock cooler cause it wasn't stable due to heat and i can't compare higher clocks,voltages and temps at 4.5 or 4.6 ghz)
> 
> 
> 
> Before Delid Room Temp 22 C
> 
> 
> 
> After Delid Room Temp 21 C
> 
> 
> 
> 19 C max and 18 C average before-after.
> 
> I won't touch the cpu from now on
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't kill this too


No comments ? What a shame


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> No comments ? What a shame


I already saw it and was like
 






!









Good job man, sorry for the lack of comment!


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> So I decided to go "au naturel" , "buck naked", "direct-to -the-die" today. Why do I do this to myself? I got a great chip already, but I just can't leave well enough alone. Computer wouldn't boot, getting post code 55 and that major sinking feeling in my heart.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My first thought was that I over tightened the water block. Took everything apart, and no bent pins. Turns out I didn't tighten it enough. Everything is working now, hopefully better and not worse. I documented everything this time and will post my results once my body stops shaking.


I was going to try that with my EK Supremacy but the " leave well alone " came to mind . Keep us posted.

Has anyone gone direct die with a EK Supremacy block ? Any hints for me to nudge me along to do it ?


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by MikeG
> 
> So I decided to go "au naturel" , "buck naked", "direct-to -the-die" today. Why do I do this to myself? I got a great chip already, but I just can't leave well enough alone. Computer wouldn't boot, getting post code 55 and that major sinking feeling in my heart. My first thought was that I over tightened the water block. Took everything apart, and no bent pins. Turns out I didn't tighten it enough. Everything is working now, hopefully better and not worse. I documented everything this time and will post my results once my body stops shaking.
> 
> 
> 
> My half dead chip gave the exact error on post at his last 10 minutes...i remounted it with ihs on but internal gpu was gone already. I advise you to check iternal gpu. remove external vga and boot from internal gpu install drivers and see everything okay ? my half dead chip was working with drivers unistalled or disabled from device manager
Click to expand...

I left my computer running while I went to get some lunch. No big overclock, just idling at 4.5GHz on 1.2VCore. When I came back everything was shut down and a red light on my power supply.







. I unplugged everything, ran self test on the PS, and it checked out fine. Plugged it back in and everything booted just fine. I tightened the water block just a tad more for good measure. It is hard to tell how much pressure I'm applying, but am using the springs that came with my Koolance 380. I will check the gpu once I get back from the liquor store--my nerves are shot!


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I left my computer running while I went to get some lunch. No big overclock, just idling at 4.5GHz on 1.2VCore. When I came back everything was shut down and a red light on my power supply.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I unplugged everything, ran self test on the PS, and it checked out fine. Plugged it back in and everything booted just fine. I tightened the water block just a tad more for good measure. It is hard to tell how much pressure I'm applying, but am using the springs that came with my Koolance 380. I will check the gpu once I get back from the liquor store--my nerves are shot!


Now that is something that mixes well liquor and electricity







throw in some water for good measure







JC

Keep us updated.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I already saw it and was like
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good job man, sorry for the lack of comment!


RED HOT ROONEY FTW


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> This game is exceptional: http://twinbeard.com/frog-fractions
> 
> Try to play it, the upgrades are awesome.
> 
> "Rub balloons against your tongue before extending it and nearby bugs will stick to it. Science."


very fun game lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> So I decided to go "au naturel" , "buck naked", "direct-to -the-die" today. Why do I do this to myself? I got a great chip already, but I just can't leave well enough alone. Computer wouldn't boot, getting post code 55 and that major sinking feeling in my heart.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My first thought was that I over tightened the water block. Took everything apart, and no bent pins. Turns out I didn't tighten it enough. Everything is working now, hopefully better and not worse. I documented everything this time and will post my results once my body stops shaking.


atleast it's that lol! and not you know it went poof! Also nice job on the MTM event! I tried to beat you but since I'm not delidded I couldn't really let this new girl tear things up yet.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> No comments ? What a shame


Lol sorry, very good results though. Nice clean delid at that as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> RED HOT ROONEY FTW


^ lol


----------



## lilchronic

the thread starter is not even delided ??? lol what r u waiting for


----------



## stickg1

My 3570K @ 4.8GHz is rocking at some [email protected]


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That's pretty cool, but like, wheres the motherboard and stuff.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's pretty cool, but like, wheres the motherboard and stuff.


Gigabyte has the MB

cpu gpus water block are on table in my room.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Gigabyte has the MB
> 
> cpu gpus water block are on table in my room.


I'm ready to see it all put together. When do you get your motherboard back? I have a P8Z77-V PRO just sitting here fresh from RMA.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm ready to see it all put together. When do you get your motherboard back? I have a P8Z77-V PRO just sitting here fresh from RMA.


There being quite slow even tho there order for my MB came from the Top of Gigabyte America...

Also as u can see in this picture with both on the same inverter one is alot more dim then the other...

So i ordered another inverter.. hope it clears that up.



See how much brighter the 400ML is when it is on the inverter alone?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the thread starter is not even delided ??? lol what r u waiting for


waiting to do a live stream with Swag or someone.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My 3570K @ 4.8GHz is rocking at some [email protected]


Nice, waiting to get back into the good WU's for once.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


looks good! get another inverter man. way to dim.

here's my 2620Mhz RAM at 7 12 8 27..... yeah crazy speed but I cant get them to boot at 2600 stock... UUUGH!












































http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2678162


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'll be doing it probably next weekend- when I have all the parts.


----------



## justanoldman

I spent all day on this IHS, and it desperately need lapping. It took quite a while to finally start scratching the center, that is how low it was. Then I lapped the bottom for good measure, and I spent a good amount of time trying to get the underside flat also.

I was able to scrape together a drop of Ultra so I carefully covered the die as instructed. I am using AC5 on the top of the IHS, but even with a better tim, only a couple degrees can be gained from what I understand.

Right now I have done everything humanly possible I can think of, and I have gained at least 5c from when I first delidded - as in 5c worse. Overall am I very close to the temps before all this began.

Delid the chip, use Ultra on the die, and lap a measurably concave IHS = an almost unnoticeable decrease in temps. At this point I believe the relatively thick paste that Intel used plus the black glue holding the IHS up were able to compensate for a non flat IHS. Now that there is air between the edges of the IHS and pcb, so the IHS rests directly on the die, even the slightest imperfection in the IHS is magnified. But that is just my guess.

Is there anybody who might have another suggestion I can try?


----------



## MikeG

The results are looking very good for the direct die mount. I got a 7 to 8 degree decrease in my hottest core temperature. This is in addition to the 10 degree decrease that I already gained from delidding. In addition to lower temperatures, I was also able to reduce my VCore by 0.020V and still run at the same speed. For my test configuration, I set my VCore to the lowest value required to pass 10 passes of Intel Burn test at the standard setting.

*Disclaimer:* Don't try this at home unless you are prepared to tell your son you bricked his computer.










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I spent all day on this IHS, and it desperately need lapping. It took quite a while to finally start scratching the center, that is how low it was. Then I lapped the bottom for good measure, and I spent a good amount of time trying to get the underside flat also.
> 
> I was able to scrape together a drop of Ultra so I carefully covered the die as instructed. I am using AC5 on the top of the IHS, but even with a better tim, only a couple degrees can be gained from what I understand.
> 
> Right now I have done everything humanly possible I can think of, and I have gained at least 5c from when I first delidded - as in 5c worse. Overall am I very close to the temps before all this began.
> 
> Delid the chip, use Ultra on the die, and lap a measurably concave IHS = an almost unnoticeable decrease in temps. At this point I believe the relatively thick paste that Intel used plus the black glue holding the IHS up were able to compensate for a non flat IHS. Now that there is air between the edges of the IHS and pcb, so the IHS rests directly on the die, even the slightest imperfection in the IHS is magnified. But that is just my guess.
> 
> Is there anybody who might have another suggestion I can try?


That's sad to hear *justanoldman*. Maybe further lapping to get the IHS more flat, or a pasty TIM that can fill in the spaces like ICDiamond, or back to too much CLPro or Ultra if that gets you better temps? As you may guess this is not the typical results. I guess this makes you special? Consider the ideas above and let see if others have some ideas too.

Have you considered going direct to the die? Some on here have done so and it does work.


----------



## MikeG

*@justanoldman* Some things to check:

Check the flatness of your waterblock or CPU cooler. Many manufacturers are making them convex these days to fit the concave Intel IHS.
Be sure to apply liquid pro/ultra to both the die and underside of the IHS.
Do not apply too much liquid pro/ultra. If it starts to run when the chip is held vertically, it is too much.


----------



## justanoldman

Thanks guys. I applied the Ultra right, so that is not the issue. I have not spent any real time checking the block of my h100i though.

I saw the thread about direct to die with an h100, anyone know if there is a thread anywhere out there for an h100i direct?

Also is there any quick way to do one simple test to see if direct to die would work, or do you have to do extensive modification before you and even test anything?

Are the negative side affects to getting rid of the ihs? Less chip life, more system instability, etc.?


----------



## justanoldman

Each pic was taken after quite a bit of lapping, and shows how long it took to finally reach to the center.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm really sad that the temps haven't dropped - especially knowing that you apply attention to detail and willing to do tests - especially to the point that you do them extremely cleanly and well.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm really sad that the temps haven't dropped - especially knowing that you apply attention to detail and willing to do tests - especially to the point that you do them extremely cleanly and well.


Thanks. I keep reminding myself that this rig would have cost $2500 from a builder and I spent less than $1500, so even if I buy a couple more processors, and delid them to find one good one I am still ahead. Don't worry about yours, just go slow and you will be fine. Besides the fact that my temps were not as bad as some to begin with, so it is not surprising none of my results have been stellar. I was 1.29v and 82c max before delidding, some guys have pretty bad temps to begin and see bigger drops.

I just checked the block of my H100i and I think MikeG is right. A slightly convex cooler does not sit well on my now perfectly flat IHS.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Well I'm worried that my de-lid might go pear shaped, but that's a risk I have set myself.
As for temp drops - it is really dependant (almost like knowing what OC is stable for each chip) - no one can say safely that you'll definitely see a 20c drop, but most have - thus no one can say you'll definitely reach 4.5ghz with under 1.3v but most have. So, as much as I am hopeful to get a 20c difference, I can't really guess what my temps will be.
Your temps however just demonstrate to me, that it isn't always as one would think with de-lidding.

My comment was really based upon the effort and the willingness to try, that hasn't indeed granted you with a significant difference. What I mean is - your chip owes you an apology and a pat on the back.


----------



## stickg1

old man, try lapping the lips on the bottom of the IHS so it sits tighter on the die, this might help.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Each pic was taken after quite a bit of lapping, and shows how long it took to finally reach to the center.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> old man, try lapping the lips on the bottom of the IHS so it sits tighter on the die, this might help.


Yup! thats what I did. Also very well done Oldy! very clean and nicely done..... better than mine even....


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> old man, try lapping the lips on the bottom of the IHS so it sits tighter on the die, this might help.


Already lapped the bottom of the IHS, and tried my best to flatten out the underside where the die touches.

Only thing left is lap the h100i but I can't find any info on it. Can I remove the cold plate?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Already lapped the bottom of the IHS, and tried my best to flatten out the underside where the die touches.
> 
> Only thing left is lap the h100i but I can't find any info on it. Can I remove the cold plate?


Naw like the lips around the perimeter of the IHS, the ones that had the glue on them when you delidded. Maybe if you shave those down it will make tighter contact with the die.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Naw like the lips around the perimeter of the IHS, the ones that had the glue on them when you delidded. Maybe if you shave those down it will make tighter contact with the die.


Aren't we talking about the same thing? The pic below shows I lapped the bottom of the IHS. Although it sits high enough when I place it on the die I am not even sure how much the edges touch the pcb, but I have no idea how much pressure is applied from the cooler.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Aren't we talking about the same thing? The pic below shows I lapped the bottom of the IHS. Although it sits high enough when I place it on the die I am not even sure how much the edges touch the pcb, but I have no idea how much pressure is applied from the cooler.


Oh okay, dang man IDK. Weird situation. Well not all chips are as bad temp wise when stock and undelidded. Sometimes they come making good contact from the factory and the temp drops from delidding aren't as extreme.


----------



## MikeG

*justanoldman*, no need to lap the bottom perimeter of the IHS. It should sit freely above the PCB without lapping. My biggest problem after putting a mirror finish on my IHS, was using too much TIM between the top of the IHS and bottom of the waterblock. With such a smooth finish it only takes 1/2 of a rice grain or less of TIM. I was just using AS5 this past week with good results. You just need a very tiny amount though.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Already lapped the bottom of the IHS, and tried my best to flatten out the underside where the die touches.
> 
> Only thing left is lap the h100i but I can't find any info on it. Can I remove the cold plate?


A thought I just had, are the h100i pump & fans running full out or on some kind of PWM control? If the variable speed parts are running based off cpu temps it could be things are just ramping up slower so you aren't seeing the temp drops, just running quieter.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A thought I just had, are the h100i pump & fans running full out or on some kind of PWM control? If the variable speed parts are running based off cpu temps it could be things are just ramping up slower so you aren't seeing the temp drops, just running quieter.


I switched out my stock h100i fans for two quiet Noctua ones that are plugged into the mobo so they run full speed.

Since lapping the cooler would obviously void the warranty, and my led lights are not all working, plus the firmware mixup that Corsair did, I just put in for a replacement one. Maybe my h100i was not working as it should since it had other problems. Amazon said I would have the replacement in a few days.

I also ordered some more Ultra, so I will try this again next week. It still seems like my IHS is the source of the problem though. I wish I knew an easy way to bypass it, but that mod seems complicated.


----------



## justanoldman

So one month ago, I had never built a computer or overclocked anything, and I have never had a computer related job. So I figure what the heck. Build it, overclock the cpu and gpu, do a delidding and lapping. Anything I missed?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So one month ago, I had never built a computer or overclocked anything, and I have never had a computer related job. So I figure what the heck. Build it, overclock the cpu and gpu, do a delidding and lapping. Anything I missed?


LN2, drop 10k on it, LN2, DICE, and case modding.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I switched out my stock h100i fans for two quiet Noctua ones that are plugged into the mobo so they run full speed.
> 
> Since lapping the cooler would obviously void the warranty, and my led lights are not all working, plus the firmware mixup that Corsair did, I just put in for a replacement one. Maybe my h100i was not working as it should since it had other problems. Amazon said I would have the replacement in a few days.
> 
> I also ordered some more Ultra, so I will try this again next week. It still seems like my IHS is the source of the problem though. I wish I knew an easy way to bypass it, but that mod seems complicated.


Well you need to make sure your pump for the H100i is running at full RPM. I usually just plug it into the PWR fan header because those don't have speed adjustments, just full speed all the time. If you have it on the CPU header than you need to go into BIOS or use your AI Suite to set it to run 100% all the time.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So one month ago, I had never built a computer or overclocked anything, and I have never had a computer related job. So I figure what the heck. Build it, overclock the cpu and gpu, do a delidding and lapping. Anything I missed?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> LN2, drop 10k on it, LN2, DICE, and case modding.


lol, yeah it can get out of hand. I've gone through 7 boards, 9 CPUs, and 10 GPU's all since this time in 2012...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So one month ago, I had never built a computer or overclocked anything, and I have never had a computer related job. So I figure what the heck. Build it, overclock the cpu and gpu, do a delidding and lapping. Anything I missed?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> LN2, drop 10k on it, LN2, DICE, and case modding.


...well, let's not forget liquid Helium, shall we ?









But seriously, FtW 420's comment above is important; I ran into s.th. like that with my Thermaltake Water 2 Extreme...don't use the 'normal' mobo cpu fan curve (or even custom fan curve), but let your water-cooling software override that.

In addition, I saw all those earlier lapping comments...one thing to keep in mind is that the concave shape is met by some convex shapes of certain coolers /water blocks...if that is the case, rotating the water block or CPU cooler by 90 degrees and reapplying the correct amount of TIM might help.

As an example, I was planning to lap my IHS when my delidding stuff arrives, but I already have a Koolance CPU 370 water block waiting - it actually is slightly curved at the bottom, fitting into the shape of the curved IHS - as long as I mount it correctly....this may have nothing to do with your problems, but worth checking. Good luck !


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, let's not forget liquid Helium, shall we ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But seriously, FtW 420's comment above is important; I ran into s.th. like that with my Thermaltake Water 2 Extreme...don't use the 'normal' mobo cpu fan curve (or even custom fan curve), but let your water-cooling software override that.
> 
> In addition, I saw all those earlier lapping comments...one thing to keep in mind is that the concave shape is met by some convex shapes of certain coolers /water blocks...if that is the case, rotating the water block or CPU cooler by 90 degrees and reapplying the correct amount of TIM might help.
> 
> As an example, I was planning to lap my IHS when my delidding stuff arrives, but I already have a Koolance CPU 370 water block waiting - it actually is slightly curved at the bottom, fitting into the shape of the curved IHS - as long as I mount it correctly....this may have nothing to do with your problems, but worth checking. Good luck !


I ran into that before, switching from a mobo with 100% default cpu fan speed to a board that was auto at default with an aircooler. Didn't really get why it was running hotter at the same clocks & voltage until I noticed the fan getting louder.

Liquid helium would be fun. I asked about the pricing once & 10x the cost of ln2, would make for some expensive fun.
Bit of ln2 action last night, testing a couple 3770ks for one that did decent in 3d11 physics & gave cinebench a run as well with the better one (cpu kinda sucked on air, but does alright cold).


















Just need to get the gpu tested tonight & freeze it all together for the score.


----------



## justanoldman

Ok I have some pictures that show part of my problem I think, hopefully these will give you guys an idea of how I might fix it.

These pictures are before the delid. The H100i had been installed with its included tim that is pre applied on the block. These are pics of the first time it was removed. Keep in mind there is some right to left play when you uninstall it, so some of the tim movement in these pictures happens from the uninstall process.

As you can see the paste seems pretty even on the block and on the IHS.




These pics are post delid and using AS5 with the finger in plastic spreading out a thin layer technique. It seems to me that post delid the cooler block is leaning to the right, or my IHS is higher on the right than left. What do you guys think? I must be doing something wrong, maybe this has something to do with it?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I ran into that before, switching from a mobo with 100% default cpu fan speed to a board that was auto at default with an aircooler. Didn't really get why it was running hotter at the same clocks & voltage until I noticed the fan getting louder.
> 
> Liquid helium would be fun. I asked about the pricing once & 10x the cost of ln2, would make for some expensive fun.
> Bit of ln2 action last night, testing a couple 3770ks for one that did decent in 3d11 physics & gave cinebench a run as well with the better one (cpu kinda sucked on air, but does alright cold).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just need to get the gpu tested tonight & freeze it all together for the score.


...well, very impressive









...but still not beating my







2,147,483,647 MHz














run from 3 weeks+ ago (see processor speed at 3dMark11 here http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5552345 )

...repeated it yesterday - which way to HWBot ?!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ok I have some pictures that show part of my problem I think, hopefully these will give you guys an idea of how I might fix it.
> 
> These pictures are before the delid. The H100i had been installed with its included tim that is pre applied on the block. These are pics of the first time it was removed. Keep in mind there is some right to left play when you uninstall it, so some of the tim movement in these pictures happens from the uninstall process.
> 
> As you can see the paste seems pretty even on the block and on the IHS.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These pics are post delid and using AS5 with the finger in plastic spreading out a thin layer technique. It seems to me that post delid the cooler block is leaning to the right, or my IHS is higher on the right than left. What do you guys think? I must be doing something wrong, maybe this has something to do with it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]


Just put a small dot of TIM on the IHS. You really just need the TIM where the die is and the pressure of the coldplate will spread it into a nice little circle, you get the best results this way. Doing the spread method is very easy to apply too much TIM.


----------



## Hokies83

LoL old lines are there just for leak testing XD


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Just put a small dot of TIM on the IHS. You really just need the TIM where the die is and the pressure of the coldplate will spread it into a nice little circle, you get the best results this way. Doing the spread method is very easy to apply too much TIM.


Ok thanks.
But don't those pic show that for some reason, after delidding, my IHS or cooler block is not level. They seem pushed together on the right and not contacting properly in the middle and left.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, very impressive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...but still not beating my
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2,147,483,647 MHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> run from 3 weeks+ ago (see processor speed at 3dMark11 here http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5552345 )
> 
> ...repeated it yesterday - which way to HWBot ?!


I may not be able to beat that clockspeed, but I can match it!
http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4536198

Futuremark is trying to tell us we're too slow or something...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ok thanks.
> But don't those pic show that for some reason, after delidding, my IHS or cooler block is not level. They seem pushed together on the right and not contacting properly in the middle and left.


Do the tiny dot method and then take a pic. Too much can go wrong with the spread method, it's hard to tell.

So I asked my HVAC guy about setting up a phase change system. I was explaining why you need to cool computer components because a PC enthusiast he is not. So not knowing anything about extreme cooling for PCs this is what he said...

"Couldn't you just somehow make a block that is connected with hoses to a radiator and a pump and just fill it with water, if you get enough air to go through the radiator it should cool the parts really well"

So I told him that's pretty much what is being done already, and is very common. I just want to do with a condenser. But then he had the idea of replacing the water with Glycol because it has much smaller molecules than water so might cool more effectively. Anyone ever use Glycol?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I may not be able to beat that clockspeed, but I can match it!
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4536198
> 
> Futuremark is trying to tell us we're too slow or something...


...and here I thought it was cold and lonely at the top


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Do the tiny dot method and then take a pic. Too much can go wrong with the spread method, it's hard to tell.
> 
> So I asked my HVAC guy about setting up a phase change system. I was explaining why you need to cool computer components because a PC enthusiast he is not. So not knowing anything about extreme cooling for PCs this is what he said...
> 
> "Couldn't you just somehow make a block that is connected with hoses to a radiator and a pump and just fill it with water, if you get enough air to go through the radiator it should cool the parts really well"
> 
> So I told him that's pretty much what is being done already, and is very common. I just want to do with a condenser. But then he had the idea of replacing the water with Glycol because it has much smaller molecules than water so might cool more effectively. Anyone ever use Glycol?


A lot of the pre-mix coolants have glycol in them, I've used propylene glycol in a water chiller but never had a rad with it, so have never compared.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ok I have some pictures that show part of my problem I think, hopefully these will give you guys an idea of how I might fix it.
> 
> These pictures are before the delid. The H100i had been installed with its included tim that is pre applied on the block. These are pics of the first time it was removed. Keep in mind there is some right to left play when you uninstall it, so some of the tim movement in these pictures happens from the uninstall process.
> 
> As you can see the paste seems pretty even on the block and on the IHS.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These pics are post delid and using AS5 with the finger in plastic spreading out a thin layer technique. It seems to me that post delid the cooler block is leaning to the right, or my IHS is higher on the right than left. What do you guys think? I must be doing something wrong, maybe this has something to do with it?


*justanoldman*, do you see the black rectangular thing at the bottom of the PCB that the IHS is on top of? That is rasied up higher than the rest of the PCB, and if your IHS rides up onto it when you clamp it down (like it shows to be in these pics), then that will lift you IHS off of your die enough to mess up your temps.

Try to remount your IHS - hold it steady as you clamp it down - so that it is not on top of the black area at the bottom of the pic.

That's probably your problem.....I hope!


----------



## Swag

INDIE GAMES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!









A note to people willing to, you can sand the lips of the IHS on the bottom side a bit to lower the IHS a bit more onto the die.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *justanoldman*, do you see the black rectangular thing at the bottom of the PCB that the IHS is on top of? That is rasied up higher than the rest of the PCB, and if your IHS rides up onto it when you clamp it down (like it shows to be in these pics), then that will lift you IHS off of your die enough to mess up your temps.
> 
> Try to remount your IHS - hold it steady as you clamp it down - so that it is not on top of the black area at the bottom of the pic.
> 
> That's probably your problem.....I hope!


Sorry, I'm confused. The picture you have showing in your post is pre delid. If that is pic you mean then Intel made it wrong?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I ran into that before, switching from a mobo with 100% default cpu fan speed to a board that was auto at default with an aircooler. Didn't really get why it was running hotter at the same clocks & voltage until I noticed the fan getting louder.
> 
> Liquid helium would be fun. I asked about the pricing once & 10x the cost of ln2, would make for some expensive fun.
> Bit of ln2 action last night, testing a couple 3770ks for one that did decent in 3d11 physics & gave cinebench a run as well with the better one (cpu kinda sucked on air, but does alright cold).
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just need to get the gpu tested tonight & freeze it all together for the score.


Nice runs *FtW 420*. I look forward to seeing some other bench run scores once you get the GPU ready. 3DMark11 and Vantage would be cool. Thanks for showing them.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *justanoldman*, do you see the black rectangular thing at the bottom of the PCB that the IHS is on top of? That is rasied up higher than the rest of the PCB, and if your IHS rides up onto it when you clamp it down (like it shows to be in these pics), then that will lift you IHS off of your die enough to mess up your temps.
> 
> Try to remount your IHS - hold it steady as you clamp it down - so that it is not on top of the black area at the bottom of the pic.
> 
> That's probably your problem.....I hope!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry, I'm confused. The picture you have showing in your post is pre delid. If that is pic you mean then Intel made it wrong?
Click to expand...

Well, the pic showed the IHS up close to the black rectangle, and if it is on top of it, then it will lift the IHS up. But if those were per-delidded, then I'd guess Intell was very close to on top of it, but not all the way as your before temps were not bad for a lidded chip (and that may be a reason for so little post-delid gain too).

But, I'd check to see how you are doing it when you clamp down your IHS to make sure your IHS is not on top of it. Also check your fourth pic as it shows it on top of it worse.

EDIT: I looked at them all again, and even if Intel did have it on top of the black area before you delidded it, the black glue they use raises the IHS up anyway and it may not have mattered.

But once you do delid and remove the black glue and their pasty TIM that fills in the die to IHS gap, then the black rectangle does matter.

Main thing for you to check is that you mount your IHS so that when you clamp it down that it does not move and ride up onto that part of the PCB as it will lift your IHS off of the die and mess with your temps. And since we don't use the Intel pasty TIM that fills in that gap, then there will be some space and a gap that the CL PRO and/or Ultra will not fill.

Worth checking into anyway. Just make sure the IHS is not on top of the black area of the PCB when you clamp it down.

Hope that helps.


----------



## alancsalt

Just thinking about the issue being ihs to die clearance - would it help to use something like plastigauge to measure that clearance? If there is an optimum clearance, then you could sand and measure until you'd reached it.

You crush a strip of it between ihs and die, then disassemble, peel off the strip, and compare its width to a chart that tells from that how thick it is. Would that help?

http://www.plastigaugeusa.com/how.html


----------



## justanoldman

PCWargamer,

Understood.
When I get some more Ultra and replacement cooler, I will make sure the IHS does not slide down and touch the lower black rectangle. I will probably lap the bottom of the IHS again a little to make sure it is sitting flat on the PCB.

My sincere thanks, you (along with the others here) are being extremely helpful.
Where is the +super rep button.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Just thinking about the issue being ihs to die clearance - would it help to use something like plastigauge to measure that clearance? If there is an optimum clearance, then you could sand and measure until you'd reached it.
> 
> You crush a strip of it between ihs and die, then disassemble, peel off the strip, and compare its width to a chart that tells from that how thick it is. Would that help?
> 
> http://www.plastigaugeusa.com/how.html


IDK, but that is some cool stuff *alancsalt*!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> PCWargamer,
> 
> Understood.
> When I get some more Ultra and replacement cooler, I will make sure the IHS does not slide down and touch the lower black rectangle. I will probably lap the bottom of the IHS again a little to make sure it is sitting flat on the PCB.
> 
> My sincere thanks, you (along with the others here) are being extremely helpful.
> Where is the +super rep button.


Thanks *justanoldman*. And you may not need to wait for your new Ultra to arrive to see if this can help. Just take off your HSF and unclamp your IHS - then reclamp it making sure it is not on the black area. You probably will not need to redo your die to IHS TIM if it is Ultra, although you may want to respread it with that nice brush they give you - which may also already still have some Ultra in it (mine always seems to). But you will probably need to redo the IHS to HSF TIM, but you can use whatever you got laying around for that to check this out.

Then redo it all the right way once you have the new TIM!









I'm just kinda anxious to know if this fixes it for ya!!!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks *justanoldman*. And you may not need to wait for your new Ultra to arrive to see if this can help. Just take off your HSF and unclamp your IHS - then reclamp it making sure it is not on the black area. You probably will not need to redo your die to IHS TIM if it is Ultra, although you may want to respread it with that nice brush they give you - which may also already still have some Ultra in it (mine always seems to). But you will probably need to redo the IHS to HSF TIM, but you can use whatever you got laying around for that to check this out.
> 
> Then redo it all the right way once you have the new TIM!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just kinda anxious to know if this fixes it for ya!!!


How is this one?
I didn't know if the IHS could be so high as to be on top of the gold dots at the top.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Thanks *justanoldman*. And you may not need to wait for your new Ultra to arrive to see if this can help. Just take off your HSF and unclamp your IHS - then reclamp it making sure it is not on the black area. You probably will not need to redo your die to IHS TIM if it is Ultra, although you may want to respread it with that nice brush they give you - which may also already still have some Ultra in it (mine always seems to). But you will probably need to redo the IHS to HSF TIM, but you can use whatever you got laying around for that to check this out.
> 
> Then redo it all the right way once you have the new TIM!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just kinda anxious to know if this fixes it for ya!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How is this one?
> I didn't know if the IHS could be so high as to be on top of the gold dots at the top.
Click to expand...

Might be OK. I do mine so that it is even, but not on top of, the gold dots - but real real close to them to make sure I am not on the black rectangle.

Try a bit closer to them....

I sure hope this works better for you bud....


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Might be OK. I do mine so that it is even, but not on top of, the gold dots - but real real close to them to make sure I am not on the black rectangle.
> 
> Try a bit closer to them....
> 
> I sure hope this works better for you bud....


I have this one running and temps look to be about what I had in the beginning (-10c) or so, which is very good because that is best I have done since. Will try again tomorrow.

Also, is there a way to keep the IHS from moving down when you lower the arm to lock it, or will it always move down some so you just start it a little high?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Bitdefender for 0.13c

EDIT: Don't know if i'm breaking TOS with posting this..


----------



## King4x4

Just bought fifty licenses.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Might be OK. I do mine so that it is even, but not on top of, the gold dots - but real real close to them to make sure I am not on the black rectangle.
> 
> Try a bit closer to them....
> 
> I sure hope this works better for you bud....
> 
> 
> 
> I have this one running and temps look to be about what I had in the beginning (-10c) or so, which is very good because that is best I have done since. Will try again tomorrow.
> 
> Also, is there a way to keep the IHS from moving down when you lower the arm to lock it, or will it always move down some so you just start it a little high?
Click to expand...

Yep. Start it a bit high and guide it into place as you close down the clamp. Try it a few times and you'll figure out where to start it. Then do it until it is right where you want it to be. Not too hard once you know what you're trying to do and try it a few times. It's mainly a problem if you are not aware that it can happen, but now that you know about it you'll figure out how to get the IHS to sit right. I just hope that it will solve your temp problem.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I have this one running and temps look to be about what I had in the beginning (-10c) or so, which is very good because that is best I have done since. Will try again tomorrow.
> 
> Also, is there a way to keep the IHS from moving down when you lower the arm to lock it, or will it always move down some so you just start it a little high?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> How does the IHS stay sat on the pcb after the glue is removed? Does it stay ontop of the die loose only held together by the thermal compound? I'm guessing this would affect resale values as well whether good or bad..
> Thread sure got's me thinking about it,


i wrote something about it , its in the "[Official] Delidded Ivy Bridge Club" page 1









i quote

"one tip after you done delidding and putting your processor back,
we noticed, that if you put down the bracket again, the IHS will slide a bit forward,

it will do so whatever tim you use,
except if you use a new/other adhesive/glue also

The trick is to start a bit more to the back when placing the IHS back, i think about 0.5- 1mm will do..
lower the load plate until it sits loosely on the top of the CPU package, check if its all good
Now lower it careful until you can snap it under
the stub holder on the side of the socket.
Lowering the lever takes a bit of force because you are compressing the load plate,
which in turn forces the CPU down tightly on the landing pins.

i held it with my finger in the middle if the IHS, but dont forget to clean it again
after youre done(fingerprints)

really, i tried to move it with a screwdriver afterwards, but could not move it,
so you have to get it right, before the lever is under the stub.."

end quote

if youre thinking about it, maybe you should read up some more over at the delidded club ..lol








and ask if you want to know more, or if you cant find a answer on page 1









if youre just done cutting through the adhesive,
in most cases, you need to twist and pull(a bit) to get the ihs off,
im guessing other tim's will do the same, having a bit of a glue effect..

to lazy to write today..lol copy/past it is









is it me, or is the ihs a bit skew already on this pic?


----------



## Belial

Man I'm tired.

Successfully delidded my 3570k. It was a little more difficult than I expected, a few scruff marks on the pcb (nothing that couldn't be wiped off really. I took video, pictures, took me like an hour to get through. The first side was really the hardest, it was just really hard to slip it in. I ran p95 for 30 minutes beforehand too, on [email protected] so it'd be running 90-95*C, but by the time I took off the cooler (i made a small scuff on the ihs and hsf mount ;/ ) and cleaned off the paste and all i dont think it made a difference.

Used pk3/pk3, think I'm looking at around around 15*c temp drop. I was planning to just delid right away but i had to bin 2 3570ks I had, they were about 100mhz apart and it wasn't like one chip was way better (its like 100mhz difference in where one just failed in p95 after 5 minutes, could boot but instant fail in p95, and then not boot so it was complicated) so I have a lot of info on temps at various voltages and stuff.

I think i may get a higher overclock out of this too, as both chips were failing a lot around 4.9, 5ghz, which requires 1.55+ voltage to do and would push temps at 95*C+ (at 1.5v i'd stay under 95*C load).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Man I'm tired.
> 
> *Successfully delidded my 3570k*. It was a little more difficult than I expected, a few scruff marks on the pcb (nothing that couldn't be wiped off really. I took video, pictures, took me like an hour to get through. The first side was really the hardest, it was just really hard to slip it in. I ran p95 for 30 minutes beforehand too, on [email protected] so it'd be running 90-95*C, but by the time I took off the cooler (i made a small scuff on the ihs and hsf mount ;/ ) and cleaned off the paste and all i dont think it made a difference.
> 
> Used pk3/pk3, think I'm looking at around around 15-25*C temp drop. I was planning to just delid right away but i had to bin 2 3570ks I had, they were about 100mhz apart and it wasn't like one chip was way better (its like 100mhz difference in where one just failed in p95 after 5 minutes, could boot but instant fail in p95, and then not boot so it was complicated) so I have a lot of info on temps at various voltages and stuff.
> 
> I think i may get a higher overclock out of this too, as both chips were failing a lot around 4.9, 5ghz, which requires 1.55+ voltage to do and would push temps at 95*C+ (at 1.5v i'd stay under 95*C load).




"a few scruff marks on the pcb "

nothing to bad i hope?
time to upload pic's etc


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> The results are looking very good for the direct die mount. I got a 7 to 8 degree decrease in my hottest core temperature. This is in addition to the 10 degree decrease that I already gained from delidding. In addition to lower temperatures, I was also able to reduce my VCore by 0.020V and still run at the same speed. For my test configuration, I set my VCore to the lowest value required to pass 10 passes of Intel Burn test at the standard setting.
> 
> *Disclaimer:* Don't try this at home unless you are prepared to tell your son you bricked his computer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Very nice, you're looking at an additional 7.75c drop on average.
Pretty cool for water coolers...I wouldn't try it with Swiftech blocks, or AIO's cause they have mounting mechanisms that stop automatically once you reach the optimum contact pressure (which is at IHS level)...hence bad or no contact withuot ihs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I ran into that before, switching from a mobo with 100% default cpu fan speed to a board that was auto at default with an aircooler. Didn't really get why it was running hotter at the same clocks & voltage until I noticed the fan getting louder.
> 
> Liquid helium would be fun. I asked about the pricing once & 10x the cost of ln2, would make for some expensive fun.
> Bit of ln2 action last night, testing a couple 3770ks for one that did decent in 3d11 physics & gave cinebench a run as well with the better one (cpu kinda sucked on air, but does alright cold).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just need to get the gpu tested tonight & freeze it all together for the score.


Cool! Any 580 to freeze? Or 7970's? You said 11...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Do the tiny dot method and then take a pic. Too much can go wrong with the spread method, it's hard to tell.
> 
> So I asked my HVAC guy about setting up a phase change system. I was explaining why you need to cool computer components because a PC enthusiast he is not. So not knowing anything about extreme cooling for PCs this is what he said...
> 
> "Couldn't you just somehow make a block that is connected with hoses to a radiator and a pump and just fill it with water, if you get enough air to go through the radiator it should cool the parts really well"
> 
> So I told him that's pretty much what is being done already, and is very common. I just want to do with a condenser. But then he had the idea of replacing the water with Glycol because it has much smaller molecules than water so might cool more effectively. Anyone ever use Glycol?


That guy has some smarts lol, but the glycol part doesn't work like that. It's better for water chillers or aio's but distilled performs better for regular water.
Slap him and make him mod an AC unit into a phase one, all he's gotta do is replace the evaporator with a cold plate and calibrate the unit properly. He knows how already...
Oh, and you gotta figure out a way to go below the temp control limit, which will be warmer than 0c lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> *justanoldman*, do you see the black rectangular thing at the bottom of the PCB that the IHS is on top of? That is rasied up higher than the rest of the PCB, and if your IHS rides up onto it when you clamp it down (like it shows to be in these pics), then that will lift you IHS off of your die enough to mess up your temps.
> 
> Try to remount your IHS - hold it steady as you clamp it down - so that it is not on top of the black area at the bottom of the pic.
> 
> That's probably your problem.....I hope!


+1, Hold the ihs in place with your finger whilst clamping the latch down, and avoid touching those gold pins when placing the ihs higher up on the pcb.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Man I'm tired.
> 
> Successfully delidded my 3570k. It was a little more difficult than I expected, a few scruff marks on the pcb (nothing that couldn't be wiped off really. I took video, pictures, took me like an hour to get through. The first side was really the hardest, it was just really hard to slip it in. I ran p95 for 30 minutes beforehand too, on [email protected] so it'd be running 90-95*C, but by the time I took off the cooler (i made a small scuff on the ihs and hsf mount ;/ ) and cleaned off the paste and all i dont think it made a difference.
> 
> Used pk3/pk3, think I'm looking at around around 15*c temp drop. I was planning to just delid right away but i had to bin 2 3570ks I had, they were about 100mhz apart and it wasn't like one chip was way better (its like 100mhz difference in where one just failed in p95 after 5 minutes, could boot but instant fail in p95, and then not boot so it was complicated) so I have a lot of info on temps at various voltages and stuff.
> 
> I think i may get a higher overclock out of this too, as both chips were failing a lot around 4.9, 5ghz, which requires 1.55+ voltage to do and would push temps at 95*C+ (at 1.5v i'd stay under 95*C load).


Awesome man! Hope your imc is intact...Good luck!


----------



## mandrix

Not clear to me about the problems with getting the IHS to stay in place when mounting on the board.....I just put my finger in the middle and put the clamp into position so that the edge clamps are right in the middle of the IHS.

Anyway here is some more testing, I finally swapped my UD5H with the delidded 3770K into my SM8 since it's easier to pull out the motherboard tray if I have to access the cpu to change TIM or anything compared to the Switch 810.
This is with the Liquid Pro TIM under the IHS, and I used MX4 on the water block. I like MX4 because it's real forgiving if you screw up and apply too much.


I know IBT on Standard isn't much of a test, but I don't plan to run 4.9 24/7 anyway, I'm happy tooling along at 4.5/4.6 on a daily basis.
I used straight 1.500 vcore and Turbo LLC for this run, although it drooped to 1.48x during IBT.

I think hitting 5.0 is doable, but it would take a lot more vcore or dropping to 4 threads. Temps are certainly no problem so far. I'm not comfortable pushing any more vcore, but that's me.









Ever since I read Idontcare's write up on Anandtech I knew I was going to delid sooner or later. After seeing our gang here at OCN having great success I knew I had to get on with it, and I'm glad I did. I've always been PO'd that this cpu ran so hot, but since I lapped it I knew it wasn't going to get RMA'd by Intel.
No worries now!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Man I'm tired.
> 
> Successfully delidded my 3570k. It was a little more difficult than I expected, a few scruff marks on the pcb (nothing that couldn't be wiped off really. I took video, pictures, took me like an hour to get through. The first side was really the hardest, it was just really hard to slip it in. I ran p95 for 30 minutes beforehand too, on [email protected] so it'd be running 90-95*C, but by the time I took off the cooler (i made a small scuff on the ihs and hsf mount ;/ ) and cleaned off the paste and all i dont think it made a difference.
> 
> Used pk3/pk3, think I'm looking at around around 15*c temp drop. I was planning to just delid right away but i had to bin 2 3570ks I had, they were about 100mhz apart and it wasn't like one chip was way better (its like 100mhz difference in where one just failed in p95 after 5 minutes, could boot but instant fail in p95, and then not boot so it was complicated) so I have a lot of info on temps at various voltages and stuff.
> 
> I think i may get a higher overclock out of this too, as both chips were failing a lot around 4.9, 5ghz, which requires 1.55+ voltage to do and would push temps at 95*C+ (at 1.5v i'd stay under 95*C load).


Good work, lets see those pictures! And some before and after temps.


----------



## MikeG

The joys of overclocking....my corsair AX860i power supply shut down on me again. I was running some stability testing using 3DMark Vantage and when It reached the last test, it just shut down with a red light on the power supply. I don't know if it is related to the direct die mod that I did yesterday or not. The power supply comes with a USB dongle and some monitoring software, so I want to try that first before tearing down my rig. Just one problem though, the Corsair USB dongle plugs into the USB header on the motherboard, so if the power supply shuts down, how am I supposed to monitor it? It is not like they gave me a USB plug that I can connect to my laptop and monitor it that way. Anyway, I will download the software and have a go.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I want to de-lid it now...lol
But I haven't got my replacement CLU yet


----------



## ivanlabrie

Can't you use some of the tube someone stepped on?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I want to de-lid it now...lol
> But I haven't got my replacement CLU yet


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Can't you use some of the tube someone stepped on?


was about to say the same, and ask if he had to sent the old tube back ?
if you fee like you should do it now, you prolly should ..lol


----------



## justanoldman

VonDutch,
You are correct that my ihs is slightly askew in that picture, I need to redo it.

I read everything on page one of this thread, and on Swag delidding guide, but I didn't see anywhere where it said the ihs cannot touch the black rectangle at the bottom of the pcb - maybe I missed it. I followed your advice to start it a little high, but I was always worried about the gold dots at the top, and I didn't know about being above the black part.

If you look at my before delidding picture, and all of the pictures on page one of Swag's guide, they all show the ihs on top of the black rectangle for non delidded chips. I know now that is because the glue holds the ihs above it in pre delid chips.

I followed PCWargamer's advice and used the gold dots as a guide, and this is what I ended up with:


Unfortunately that did not change my temps.


----------



## ivanlabrie

How odd...I don't get it really.


----------



## justanoldman

Sorry for taking up so much space in this thread, but I am hoping to figure this out so my incompetence doesn't dissuade anyone else from delidding since so many end up with great results.

I rotated the block of my H100i 90 degrees to the left and that took me down 3 degrees, and that is why I posted the pics before about what the tim looked like after uninstalling it. The tim does not look evenly distributed so it appears the cooler block and ihs are not making good contact.

I just put one drop of AS5 on the IHS (as apposed to the first pics I posted where I spread it out) and the results were the same. If you look at the pictures below, they look the same as my first pics. The tim is clearly being push from the right side of the block and ihs to the left.

Am I correct in thinking that the right side of the ihs is too high?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I want to de-lid it now...lol
> But I haven't got my replacement CLU yet


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch,
> You are correct that my ihs is slightly askew in that picture, I need to redo it.
> 
> I read everything on page one of this thread, and on Swag delidding guide, but I didn't see anywhere where it said the ihs cannot touch the black rectangle at the bottom of the pcb - maybe I missed it. I followed your advice to start it a little high, but I was always worried about the gold dots at the top, and I didn't know about being above the black part.
> 
> If you look at my before delidding picture all of the pictures on page one of Swag's guide, they all show the ihs on top of the black rectangle for non delidded chips. I know now that is because the glue holds the ihs above it in pre delid chips.
> 
> I followed PCWargamer's advice and used the gold dots as a guide, and this is what I ended up with:
> 
> 
> Unfortunately that did not change my temps.


its not that its said anywhere, only that you shouldnt let the ihs slide to much in that direction,
the black retangle on the pcb could cause temps being of, thats all..and its best to have it in about
the same place as before, but like PCW said, with the adhesive gone,
the black retangle is a new 'hight" so to speak..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry for taking up so much space in this thread, but I am hoping to figure this out so my incompetence doesn't dissuade anyone else from delidding since so many end up with great results.
> 
> I rotated the block of my H100i 90 degrees to the left and that took me down 3 degrees, and that is why I posted the pics before about what the tim looked like after uninstalling it. The tim does not look evenly distributed so it appears the cooler block and ihs are not making good contact.
> 
> I just put one drop of AS5 on the IHS (as apposed to the first pics I posted where I spread it out) and the results were the same. If you look at the pictures below, they look the same as my first pics. The tim is clearly being push from the right side of the block and ihs to the left.
> 
> Am I correct in thinking that the right side of the ihs is too high?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


no worries, we are eager to get it fixed too, even if it takes up 10 pages ..lol

you can see changing things around, sometimes gives you some better temps, so theres something still not right,
thats what it tells me..

the pics still dont mean it has to do with concave ihs or block,
could it be the pressure when you reassamble everything isnt good,
somehow it goes wrong with mounting it again?
looks like something is off, but im not sure what..

did you try the spinning ihs on the die when you took it apart?
you know, like in my avatar..


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch,
> You are correct that my ihs is slightly askew in that picture, I need to redo it.
> 
> I read everything on page one of this thread, and on Swag delidding guide, but I didn't see anywhere where it said the ihs cannot touch the black rectangle at the bottom of the pcb - maybe I missed it. I followed your advice to start it a little high, but I was always worried about the gold dots at the top, and I didn't know about being above the black part.
> 
> If you look at my before delidding picture, and all of the pictures on page one of Swag's guide, they all show the ihs on top of the black rectangle for non delidded chips. I know now that is because the glue holds the ihs above it in pre delid chips.
> 
> I followed PCWargamer's advice and used the gold dots as a guide, and this is what I ended up with:
> 
> 
> Unfortunately that did not change my temps.


you don't need to mount ihs that high. what temperatures do you get before and after ? what's the point you worry about ?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ok - YOLO - I'm de-lidding it now.
Might apply some MX2 underneath - or might not








Wish me luck - I'll record everything.

Pics before de-lidding:
(MX2 line method on IHS)

Before IBT:


After IBT:


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ok - YOLO - I'm de-lidding it now.
> Might apply some AS5 underneath - or might not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wish me luck - I'll record everything.
> 
> Pics before de-lidding:
> (AS5 line method on IHS)
> 
> Before IBT:
> 
> 
> After IBT:


AS5 don't cut it anymore you know if you have other paste apply it


----------



## ORAC

I have sucessfully delidded my 3770K and I am currently stress testing a 4.5 OC using Prime95.

Once I have determined that the OC is successfull, I will post pictures and particulars.

Currently under 100% load running max tempatures of 61, 68, 64, 67 at 1.248 volts.


----------



## justanoldman

Good luck TD! Go slow, and take your time. I had good luck just slowly rocking the blade back and forth. I also tried to slightly aim the blade up so as to stay as far away from the pcb as possible.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Sorry I mean mx2.
Worth a try. I know it won't make much difference. But would be cool to know the difference


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> you don't need to mount ihs that high. what temperatures do you get before and after ? what's the point you worry about ?


From what I have learned, the black rectangle on the PCB is now the highest part since there is no glue left. If you let the IHS rest on top of the black rectangle then it may not be laying as flat as it should. You have to mount the IHS that high to avoid being on top of the rectangle.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ORAC*
> 
> I have sucessfully delidded my 3770K and I am currently stress testing a 4.5 OC using Prime95.
> 
> Once I have determined that the OC is successfull, I will post pictures and particulars.
> 
> Currently under 100% load running max tempatures of 61, 68, 64, 67 at 1.248 volts.


gratz ORAC








yea, we like pics and the "warstories" ...lol


----------



## justanoldman

When I get some more Ultra next week, can I try rotating the IHS 90 degrees so the notched out part is at the top?

That would be a good test to see if one side of the IHS is ending up higher, but I don't want to ruin anything if that is ill advised.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Sorry I mean mx2.
> Worth a try. I know it won't make much difference. But would be cool to know the difference


Good luck TD, take your time


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> From what I have learned, the black rectangle on the PCB is now the highest part since there is no glue left. If you let the IHS rest on top of the black rectangle then it may not be laying as flat as it should. You have to mount the IHS that high to avoid being on top of the rectangle.


I am overlapping that black rectangle a bit because I tried to mimicking a picture of a stock not delidded 3570k when putting it back into the socket. Maybe this explains my one core being 8 to 10 degrees higher than the rest. I am not gonna bother fixing it as this one core only hits aBout 80 in ibt at 5ghz. I think my cooling is plenty good for air.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> From what I have learned, the black rectangle on the PCB is now the highest part since there is no glue left. If you let the IHS rest on top of the black rectangle then it may not be laying as flat as it should. You have to mount the IHS that high to avoid being on top of the rectangle.


Well, i'm glad that worked for you but according to my experiences there's no temp difference no matter where you put ihs.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> When I get some more Ultra next week, can I try rotating the IHS 90 degrees so the notched out part is at the top?
> 
> That would be a good test to see if one side of the IHS is ending up higher, but I don't want to ruin anything if that is ill advised.


...I am wondering whether you have too many variables that changed, what with de-lid, lapping and so forth, though a 10 C drop is nothing to scoff at. Still, as you are waiting for materials anyways, I would recommend that you pick up some 'pressure paper' and put it between the IHS and the bottom of your CPU cooler (obviously no TIM and the test being done with the system powered off - apply about 80% of the final torque you would normally use).

As per previous post, I have some CPU coolers (water and air) that are slightly curved and some that are perfectly flat...pressure paper will tell you exactly what is going on re the 'fit' between the IHS and the cooler bottom - and thus help you to eliminate some variables.

Good luck


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Well, i'm glad that worked for you but according to my experiences there's no temp difference no matter where you put ihs.


Sorry, maybe I was not clear. Moving the IHS did not change my temps. Rotating my cooler block helped a little though.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Well, i'm glad that worked for you but according to my experiences there's no temp difference no matter where you put ihs.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, maybe I was not clear. Moving the IHS did not change my temps. Rotating my cooler block helped a little though.


I would think it shouldn't affect temps, cause the IHS spins freely over the die, and doesn't really touch the pcb it seems, nor that square.
Otherwise that wouldn't be possible.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am overlapping that black rectangle a bit because I tried to mimicking a picture of a stock not delidded 3570k when putting it back into the socket. Maybe this explains my one core being 8 to 10 degrees higher than the rest. I am not gonna bother fixing it as this one core only hits aBout 80 in ibt at 5ghz. I think my cooling is plenty good for air.


Sorry for my English but i have to say that temp difference between cores is not an important issue. Temp sensors may be uncalibrated.one of my core temp was below room temp according to real temp or any other programs. That means first core temp sensor is not calibrated. core temp can not be below room temp. Just let it go do not poke around too much. you don't want to end up with a dead chip. From my experience;

1- Do not touch cpu ( caps.resistors) with bare hand. Wear static gloves or antistatic wristband.
2- Do not lap inner IHS. Too much pressure on gpu die causes fatal damage like losing internal gpu or dual channel memory ability.
3- Do not overtighten cooler screws. might damage socket pins
4- Do not apply too much liquid metal type thermal compounds on cpu die.If you gonna use liquid metal apply on both surfaces a little.
5- Delid it and don't touch it again







Let the temps be higher 2-3 C it's not worth killing it.Be happy if you have better ( >15 C ) temps.

It's a general post BTW i am not only tellin you







I'm glad that you chose not to fix it cause there's nothing to fix. you already have great temps at 5 ghz.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sounds reasonable...


----------



## Gomi

Lapping paper ordered

* 400
* 600
* 800
* 1000
* 40 micron
* 25 micron
* 20 micron
* 15 micron
* 10 micron

along with CL Ultra, a Koolance 380I and the Motherboard block for the UP7.

Will post pictures of the whole process next week, from removing the PRO to lapping and "new" temps (Though they are not really usable, as the block will have changed Raystorm-->Koolance 380I).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice block upgrade!









Looking forward to some mirror finish pics...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

AH








It is open!

This glue is a pain lol


----------



## martinhal

I have seen lots od posts about the black rectangle on the pcb. Any ideas what it is ? Why not just sand it off ?

@ *justanoldman* I see you are not seeing the same results as others. I may have missed it but what are your actual temps ? What is your vcore and multi ?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> AH
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is open!
> 
> This glue is a pain lol


Credit card is a life saver on every condition


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I have seen lots od posts about the black rectangle on the pcb. Any ideas what it is ? Why not just sand it off ?
> 
> @ *justanoldman* I see you are not seeing the same results as others. I may have missed it but what are your actual temps ? What is your vcore and multi ?


At 1.29v manual 46x100, I had a max of 82c in a 22.2c room. After delidding and using Ultra I dropped 10c. Since then a lot of different things have been tried. Only rotating the block of my h100i has helped, another 3c or so.

I can't seem to get my cooler and IHS to line up correctly, but I will test more next week when I get more Ultra.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> AH
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is open!
> 
> This glue is a pain lol


The glue was the only hard part imo, I_shot is right, a credit card worked best for me.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Seriously this glue ain't coming off! I want to check if the cpu will boot. Going to do it on air now.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> At 1.29v manual 46x100, I had a max of 82c in a 22.2c room. After delidding and using Ultra I dropped 10c. Since then a lot of different things have been tried. Only rotating the block of my h100i has helped, another 3c or so.
> 
> I can't seem to get my cooler and IHS to line up correctly, but I will test more next week when I get more Ultra.


I assume 82 was before so now you are around 69 then . I guess it could be a tad better .

Below are my IBT runs and vcore for reference



Not sure if ambient scales. . My guess you should be getting around 62 or so .


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Gguys panic...pc doesn't turn on. Nothing to do with cpu. Why is it powering onand off!!???


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Gguys panic...pc doesn't turn on. Nothing to do with cpu. Why is it powering onand off!!???


That means something's wrong with your chip or your mount.

Did you put your finger on the ihs to prevent it from moving when pressing the latch?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Gguys panic...pc doesn't turn on. Nothing to do with cpu. Why is it powering onand off!!???


?
What do you mean that it has nothing to do with your cpu?
Where are you in the process? It will not boot without the cpu, ihs, and cooler all installed properly.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

K did that, but it only goes on for several seconds now

Ok need to clean this quick and putthe cooler


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> K did that, but it only goes on for several seconds now
> 
> Ok need to clean this quick and putthe cooler


Don't boot without the cooler attached to it...and check your socket for bent pins. I fried my cpu cause of bent pins, and killed the mobo.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Seriously this glue ain't coming off! I want to check if the cpu will boot. Going to do it on air now.


The Asus sabertooth does not have the error codes on the board? i would think it would for a 200$ + bpard read those and google it.

And that will solve all your issues.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

My heart is sinking...isee a scratch on the green part of tge cpu


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I assume 82 was before so now you are around 69 then . I guess it could be a tad better .
> 
> Not sure if ambient scales. . My guess you should be getting around 62 or so .


Thanks for all the info.
I would guess around 62c also, but right now I am using AC5 between the ihs and cooler. I will use Ultra there when I get some more, that could be a couple more degrees I hope. I don't understand why lapping a really concave IHS did not help, but that might be part of the problem I am having. I can't find anyone, anywhere that has lapped an H100i, so I don't know if that is what I need to do to get it to fit better with the IHS.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> My heart is sinking...isee a scratch on the green part of tge cpu




Standard on 140$ gigabyte mid range boards and above... See number google number = solution


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Doesn't have it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Doesn't have it


Omg 200$ + board wow does Asus suck these days...

Sell that thing and get a Gigabyte UD5H.. there like 150$ better vrams more options and a better board... and u could have solved your issue by now.. with the a clean and clear debug error code.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Right side of the die is that serious?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> My heart is sinking...isee a scratch on the green part of tge cpu


Slow down.
It took me a couple hours to do mine all the way.
Clean off the glue carefully with a credit card, and see if the PCB is actually scratched.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right side of the die is that serious?


to hard to see use a pin head to point at the spot.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Right side of the die is that serious?[/QUOTE]
> It is hard to see in those pics. Your camera is getting confused and not focusing, you might want to back up a bit.


----------



## stickg1

TD, a boot loop like you described often occurs with a grounding problem. Like two LGA pins touching each other. Pull out the CPU and check very carefully for any mis-aligned LGA pins. And try to calm down, this will likely be fixed easy. Don't freak out!!

Also take a more focused picture, in the two pics you posted it almost looks like the die was peeling off, or is that just a reflection? It's hard to tell what we're supposed to be looking at.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> TD, a boot loop like you described often occurs with a grounding problem. Like two LGA pins touching each other. Pull out the CPU and check very carefully for any mis-aligned LGA pins. And try to calm down, this will likely be fixed easy. Don't freak out!!


I told u id make u famous!

Your 2 fans are seen on 5 forums and have 3 Sponsors!



Be proud of them!

But on another note on removing that xspc dbl bay with the 750 pump.. it is so much weaker then the 35X it is not funny.. u can not even tell it is on when the 35X is running lol...

A FrozenQ Helix Bay res is going there as he is one of my Sponsors


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I told u id make u famous!
> 
> Your 2 fans are seen on 5 forums and have 3 Sponsors!
> 
> 
> 
> Be proud of them!
> 
> But on another note on removing that xspc dbl bay with the 750 pump.. it is so much weaker then the 35X it is not funny.. u can not even tell it is on when the 35X is running lol...
> 
> A FrozenQ Helix Bay res is going there as he is one of my Sponsors


I require my name listed in your build credits. Oh and also 20% of all your sponsored gear, if you have to cut 1/5th off your Helix res, I am okay with that.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ok. Cooler is on.
Dram mem ok led is on. I hold it down and it is still like that...anyone willing to come on Skype?

Cpu led is fine...at least I think


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I require my name listed in your build credits. Oh and also 20% of all your sponsored gear, if you have to cut 1/5th off your Helix res, I am okay with that.


How about i make u a killer deal on a res pump / rad combo







?

Then u could get some cheap durelene lines and afew fittings / block and have a custom loop ..


----------



## Totally Dubbed




----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ok. Cooler is on.
> Dram mem ok led is on. I hold it down and it is still like that...anyone willing to come on Skype?
> 
> Cpu led is fine...at least I think


I dont have a cam or anything. You have the CPU in the socket with the IHS on and the socket latch locked right?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Indeed I do. And the cooler in on it too.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*


Try your RAM in A1 and A2 or B1 and B2, I don't think you have it in dual channel, also try one stick of RAM if that doesn't work. Clear your CMOS first and foremost and then try one stick of RAM. You could have scratched the IMC. Are you sure there are no bent pins?


----------



## justanoldman

TD, how many dimms do you have? With two they should be in A2, B2, in the pic you have them in A1 and A2. Try taking out all the dimms and then just put back one in A2.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I've tried switching ram. And I made sure there was no bent pins...I'm really sad right now









Can you pm your skype stick?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Try your RAM in A1 and A2 or B1 and B2, I don't think you have it in dual channel, also try one stick of RAM if that doesn't work. Clear your CMOS first and foremost and then try one stick of RAM. You could have scratched the IMC. Are you sure there are no bent pins?


...in the second pic, shouldn't you have one of the memory sticks on the other channel ?


----------



## justanoldman

TD,
Page 2-12 of your manual says to hold down the MemOK! switch until the DRAM_LED starts blinking to begin automatic memory compatibility tuning for successful boot.

What happens when you try that?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I've tried switching ram. And I made sure there was no bent pins...I'm really sad right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can you pm your skype stick?


I dont have a skype, I can make one real quick

Errr I don't even have a working microphone right now dude, sorry.


----------



## justanoldman

Should he try to unplug the machine are remove the mobo battery to clear cmos? I know I have to clear cmos or reflash bios when I am testing stuff because of the ongoing Asus bios bug.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Did the pin switch for the cmos...and now it doesn't switch on at all


----------



## Valgaur

PM sent. Valgaur to the rescue


----------



## Valgaur

Update.

we have the chip running, it's currently in single DRAM slots but we are finding what slots are currently running for the chip. OC's and everything else are working just fine.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Update.
> 
> we have the chip running, it's currently in single DRAM slots but we are finding what slots are currently running for the chip. OC's and everything else are working just fine.


Phew, well he wasn't running dual channel before so he might not notice the loss. Sucks but you have to look at the bright side of things! So have we confirmed its a damaged IMC?


----------



## I_shot

just like my half dead cpu. error code 55 and only run in single mod even 2 dimms installed like a2 and b1. might be a mounting issue. try with a very very paper between ihs and pcb


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Phew, well he wasn't running dual channel before so he might not notice the loss. Sucks but you have to look at the bright side of things! So have we confirmed its a damaged IMC?


This is kind of a weird one we haven't had this yet where he has 3 dimm slots still but slot 2 or the second closest to the CPU isn't working. so 1, 3, and 4 work but not 2... tryign dual channel 1, and 3 now.

Update again lol. channels 1 and 4 are working but we can't get the 2 other slots working so we are gonna try that paper idea.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Pictures - on PC right now skyping with Swag and Valguar -> 2 legendary people.

I'm running on DIMM 1 and DIMM 4 - middle two are screwed.


----------



## stickg1

Interesting, I don't see much damage to the PCB. Have we thoroughly check the LGA pins? I fixed about a dozen Z68 boards with bent pins and bent pins can kill specific RAM slots, cause boot loops, cause temp readings to go haywire, all sorts of stuff. So lets really make sure all the pins are straight and aligned.


----------



## MikeG

*Good job! Now get over here!







*

I'm trying to find out why my power supply keeps shutting down, and what that red fault light means. I go on Corsair's web site hoping to get in touch with a tech support person. I click on the link that says tech support, it lists a few FAQ's with answers, then asks "did this solve your problem? I type "no". It then says:

"Your case number is 5582865, please keep this number for future reference.
Based on the information you have provided, the best thing to do is send us your parts for replacement."

*Arrrghhh! I don't want to RMA my friggin power supply!!!! I just want to ask what does this red light mean!*


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Going to check pins now and recheck CPU.

Here is IBT after de-lidding - please bear in mind that I have MX2 on the die AND on the IHS -> also this is super cold vs before which was folding - so temps are a little better.




New temps: 73-83

Old temps: 81-91
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/10800#post_19205323


----------



## Belial

I had a few scuff marks, they were easily wiped off. Nothing serious.

I made a custom window for my NZXT Source 210, and removed the HDD bays. I had to remove the heatspreader ridgebacks on my mushkin enhanced ridebacks - while the nh-d14 can lift up the fan to accomodate them, the nzxt source 210 case wont fit the nh-d14 if you lift up the fan, especially if you got a custom window slightly reducing the width of the case. NZXT sleeved led blue 1m. No HDD, only a single SSD behind the motherboard panel.

The pictures don't do it justice, it's a much deeper blue irl and I had to make the pics grainy in order to capture detail in the dark.













I don't have as many pics of my delid process because I mostly took video (will edit, it's like 40minutes).







I don't have great records of temps before/after - I focused on binning the 2 chips I had, not temp testing. I kinda wish I did an 8k min/max fft custom p95 test for temps but it didn't cross my mind. Unfortunate, as there appears to be a 20*C temp difference from the first test of p95 and the 2nd fft length of 8. I really think my temp drop is about 15*C though, I have a lot of tests showing hitting about 92*C and when I tested last night I hit 78*C on the first 5 min of p95 (but hit up to 85+ during the 2nd fft length, I dont think i ever got that far before because it'd be hitting 100*C and instantly failing lol). PK3/PK3

I've been running p95 for about 13 hours now at [email protected] Max temp is 78*c.


----------



## stickg1

@TD - Good work, let us know what those pins look like, hopefully one got pushed out of alignment

@Belial - nice modding, looks good and clean.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> @TD - Good work, let us know what those pins look like, hopefully one got pushed out of alignment
> 
> @Belial - nice modding, looks good and clean.


we now have it in triple channel lol dimm 2 still wont work. 1 3 and 4 are all good though.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Paper worked without the antec on past POST - but then put the antec on, and it doesn't work again. Only 1 DIMM works...I think it needs to be "rmaed" - here are pics for the pins and everything:


----------



## mandrix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the info.
> I would guess around 62c also, but right now I am using AC5 between the ihs and cooler. I will use Ultra there when I get some more, that could be a couple more degrees I hope. I don't understand why lapping a really concave IHS did not help, but that might be part of the problem I am having. I can't find anyone, anywhere that has lapped an H100i, so I don't know if that is what I need to do to get it to fit better with the IHS.


Lots of heat spreaders are concave, they are made that way for a reason. IMO you will likely gain nothing sanding it flat. It is possible it's not seating squarely for some reason, though.
Looks like you already had a somewhat decent cpu, neither one of my 3770K would do 4.6 stable on 1.29v before lapping. By all means continue to experiment, but it may be you will not get better temps.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> we now have it in triple channel lol dimm 2 still wont work. 1 3 and 4 are all good though.


Good work! So he can use 1 and 3 and operate in dual channel? Since he had a Kuhler 920 theres no height or slot restraints so I would almost consider that as 100% operational. Although he can't use all 4 RAM slots, if he still has dual channel he can have up to 16GB and that's good enough!


----------



## stickg1

damn TD, this might be the one time I'm sad to say that there are no bent pins. Must be that scuff on the PCB..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Good work! So he can use 1 and 3 and operate in dual channel? Since he had a Kuhler 920 theres no height or slot restraints so I would almost consider that as 100% operational. Although he can't use all 4 RAM slots, if he still has dual channel he can have up to 16GB and that's good enough!


right now we cant get more than one working with the antec 920 on right now... look at the pins up top.


----------



## stickg1

Double check these pins, some of them look to be down too low and not making contact


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ok - first of all I would like to thank all of you that helped me. Repped all of you








Valguar and Swag were on Skype for an incredible 2-3hrs with me - props to those guys for sticking through with me.

So here it is - I need everyone's honest opinion, Swag and Valguar both say that it would be best if I keep it running the way I have it. However, seeing as I have a paper in there trying to make it run - god knows what will happen down the line - and I'm tempted to RMA it.
My chip is temperamental - it worked without any cooler and post'ed with DIMM's 1, 3, 4 - Before without any paper in, only 1, 4 would go.
Then I put my cooler on (and tried loosening it up a little), and then only 3, 4 would work.
Note how 2 never has worked.

Anyway - so now I'm folding, trying to see my temps, and more so trying to see if I'm at all stable.

This is my trail of thought:
As it is broken, and temperamental - I can't trust it.
1.
Get CLU, and see the temp difference between it and MX2
2.
Which ever "paste" is better - stick with it, and then apply glue on the PCB and send it into intel and hope for the best.
3.
If it gets rejected, I lost a little money and time - however I will have a CPU that still works, and has the "best" temps.
4.
If it gets accepted -> happy days for me.

I was extremely careful with my de-lidding...and can't believe that this has happened. Exactly the most important point (apart from the die) has been scratched - and thus is no longer working properly.
On the plus side - so far I can see around 5-10c difference in temps, and that's with MX2 - If I get this with MX2 - then I might potentially see over 20c with CLU.

I would like to know what you guys would do in my situation.
Out of 16GB that I got - supposedly 8GB is working.

-> Stick I will re-look at the pins again - I think it is the angle, rather than anything else.


----------



## Lobsterman

Check the spots I've circled, looks to be exposed copper from the PCB visoble



*edit, I see you taped over the 2 along the side, check that other spot near the corner too


----------



## tzvia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll add you right now! Sorry I miss read the info on your picture submission thats my fault, been playing games all day and am blind as a bat right now!
> 
> So slap that hot Sig on your sig list! you are in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ohh do you have a CPU-Z link to your max OC? Your still in btw.


Thanks. Never bothered to validate it so just did so... http://valid.canardpc.com/2679687


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ok - first of all I would like to thank all of you that helped me. Repped all of you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Valguar and Swag were on Skype for an incredible 2-3hrs with me - props to those guys for sticking through with me.
> 
> So here it is - I need everyone's honest opinion, Swag and Valguar both say that it would be best if I keep it running the way I have it. However, seeing as I have a paper in there trying to make it run - god knows what will happen down the line - and I'm tempted to RMA it.
> My chip is temperamental - it worked without any cooler and post'ed with DIMM's 1, 3, 4 - Before without any paper in, only 1, 4 would go.
> Then I put my cooler on (and tried loosening it up a little), and then only 3, 4 would work.
> Note how 2 never has worked.
> 
> Anyway - so now I'm folding, trying to see my temps, and more so trying to see if I'm at all stable.
> 
> This is my trail of thought:
> As it is broken, and temperamental - I can't trust it.
> 1.
> Get CLU, and see the temp difference between it and MX2
> 2.
> Which ever "paste" is better - stick with it, and then apply glue on the PCB and send it into intel and hope for the best.
> 3.
> If it gets rejected, I lost a little money and time - however I will have a CPU that still works, and has the "best" temps.
> 4.
> If it gets accepted -> happy days for me.
> 
> I was extremely careful with my de-lidding...and can't believe that this has happened. Exactly the most important point (apart from the die) has been scratched - and thus is no longer working properly.
> On the plus side - so far I can see around 5-10c difference in temps, and that's with MX2 - If I get this with MX2 - then I might potentially see over 20c with CLU.
> 
> I would like to know what you guys would do in my situation.
> Out of 16GB that I got - supposedly 8GB is working.
> 
> -> Stick I will re-look at the pins again - I think it is the angle, rather than anything else.


That's a touchy subject. You can send it in and see what they say though. Get yourself something to use in the meantime. Find a cheap Sandy or another Ivy.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Check the spots I've circled, looks to be exposed copper from the PCB visoble
> 
> 
> 
> *edit, I see you taped over the 2 along the side, check that other spot near the corner too


Ok sure - I'll do that when the CLU comes in.
Thanks for the suggestion!
I should state I used normal printing paper.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's a touchy subject. You can send it in and see what they say though. Get yourself something to use in the meantime. Find a cheap Sandy or another Ivy.


I got my old PC right outside my door - I'll use that in the mean time, if needs be.
I can survive not folding, or gaming on the new PC.
My old PC still is very good for what it is, would just have to spend a day re-installing some programs (as I wiped it clean)


----------



## stickg1

anyone ever try putting a touch of solder on those PCB blemishes?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> anyone ever try putting a touch of solder on those PCB blemishes?


My friend was saying that to me - "maybe we can solder it?"
Now that's wild.


----------



## Stu-Crossfire

Mines been a great sucess... info below pasted from my seperate topic, for your guys information.

Hi Guys,
Took the plunge and de-lidded my 3770K as even with my huge loop, 90c at 1.28v and 4.7ghz was stopping me testing any further and I really want some more clocks. Also, my core temps were very uneven which has always niggled me.

*Plus - I just wanted to do it for the hell of it, so off we go...







*

Quick test beforehand using ten runs of IBT on normal yield the following results.


Idle Core 1 = 31c
Idle Core 2 = 26c
Idle Core 3 = 29c
Idle Core 4 = 23c

Max Core 1 = 76c
Max Core 2 = 88c
Max Core 3 = 83c
Max Core 4 = 79c



*After the work was completed, I performed the same test, and yielded the following results.*

Idle Core 1 = 27c _(-4c)_
Idle Core 2 = 24c _(-2c)_
Idle Core 3 = 26c _(-3c)_
Idle Core 4 = 22c _(-1c)_

Max Core 1 = 53c _(-23c)_
Max Core 2 = 56c _(-32c)_
Max Core 3 = 58c _(-25c)_
Max Core 4 = 54c _(-25c)_
An incredible max improvement of *32 Degrees C!*
And importantly, the cores are now all within 5c of each other, instead of 12c as they were previous, which I expect is a result of the lapping.



*Just to be sure it wasnt a fluke, I put ona quick double run on Max settings. results are almost identical.







*



Pleased?
Oh yes! Now for some more volts and clocks!























Pictures to follow. just uploading.

The bits n bobs...
http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e3d38

She's under the knife...
http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e1460

No turning back now...
http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e0e28

http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e170a

IHS was definately concave... that pleased me.








http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e11d2

http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e1c86

http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e3854

Pop her back in with some Liquid pro...
http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e2834

http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e1970

And that is pretty much that. All I can say is TAKE YOUR TIME.
Rush this and you will slip and wreck her... but take your time and its very simple to do.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> My friend was saying that to me - "maybe we can solder it?"
> Now that's wild.


If he has a soldering iron handy it might be worth a shot. Just a tiny dab of solder.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> If he has a soldering iron handy it might be worth a shot. Just a tiny dab of solder.


what exactly would i be soldering?

@Stu-Crossfire : very nice mate


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> what exactly would i be soldering?
> 
> @Stu-Crossfire : very nice mate


You would just be putting a drop of solder on those bare copper parts that got scratched and hope that it mends whatever is causing your issues. The whole idea is hopeful at best as I have no proof of it ever working or being attempted.

So it'd basically be pulling a Chicharito and trying to go for big goals, hoping you get your starting spot next game.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> Thanks. Never bothered to validate it so just did so... http://valid.canardpc.com/2679687


updated!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stu-Crossfire*
> 
> Mines been a great sucess... info below pasted from my seperate topic, for your guys information.
> 
> Hi Guys,
> Took the plunge and de-lidded my 3770K as even with my huge loop, 90c at 1.28v and 4.7ghz was stopping me testing any further and I really want some more clocks. Also, my core temps were very uneven which has always niggled me.
> 
> *Plus - I just wanted to do it for the hell of it, so off we go...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> Quick test beforehand using ten runs of IBT on normal yield the following results.
> 
> 
> Idle Core 1 = 31c
> Idle Core 2 = 26c
> Idle Core 3 = 29c
> Idle Core 4 = 23c
> 
> Max Core 1 = 76c
> Max Core 2 = 88c
> Max Core 3 = 83c
> Max Core 4 = 79c
> 
> 
> 
> *After the work was completed, I performed the same test, and yielded the following results.*
> 
> Idle Core 1 = 27c _(-4c)_
> Idle Core 2 = 24c _(-2c)_
> Idle Core 3 = 26c _(-3c)_
> Idle Core 4 = 22c _(-1c)_
> 
> Max Core 1 = 53c _(-23c)_
> Max Core 2 = 56c _(-32c)_
> Max Core 3 = 58c _(-25c)_
> Max Core 4 = 54c _(-25c)_
> An incredible max improvement of *32 Degrees C!*
> And importantly, the cores are now all within 5c of each other, instead of 12c as they were previous, which I expect is a result of the lapping.
> 
> 
> 
> *Just to be sure it wasnt a fluke, I put ona quick double run on Max settings. results are almost identical.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> Pleased?
> Oh yes! Now for some more volts and clocks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pictures to follow. just uploading.
> 
> The bits n bobs...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e3d38
> 
> She's under the knife...
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e1460
> 
> No turning back now...
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e0e28
> 
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e170a
> 
> IHS was definately concave... that pleased me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e11d2
> 
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e1c86
> 
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e3854
> 
> Pop her back in with some Liquid pro...
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e2834
> 
> http://www.stewartsanderson.com/p511390059/e540e1970
> 
> 
> And that is pretty much that. All I can say is TAKE YOUR TIME.
> Rush this and you will slip and wreck her... but take your time and its very simple to do.


Nice job! give me your info and I'll let you in!


----------



## Swag

21 - 6!







NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 21 - 6!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!


Wooooooooooo go Baltimore!


----------



## Stay Puft

Im not even watching the game as it compares nothing to the "walking dead" marathon on right now


----------



## teamrushpntball

Oh my god! 109 yards!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the info.
> I would guess around 62c also, but right now I am using AC5 between the ihs and cooler. I will use Ultra there when I get some more, that could be a couple more degrees I hope. I don't understand why lapping a really concave IHS did not help, but that might be part of the problem I am having. I can't find anyone, anywhere that has lapped an H100i, so I don't know if that is what I need to do to get it to fit better with the IHS.


Going from AS5 to CLU/CLP will be a dramatic temp drop, just on the ihs even. As in as big a temp drop as going from a hyper 212 to an h80, maybe even high end cooling like an nh-d14. AS5 is just so terrible, it's been terrible for a long time (dont you have some stock paste you can use instead, like what came with some good heatsink you bought or something?). 13 years ago it was good, but 13 years ago the pentium 3 or whatever was great too.

On top of that, going to not just a high end ceramique, but a premium thermal solution like CLU/CLP, you'll literally get temp drops of 10-20*C when used just on the IHS instead of as5. Why would you buy a 13 year old thermal paste, I can assure you many other companies, and even arctic silver, have been able to figure out a better paste. The idea that pastes don't make a difference is partially wrong - yes, the difference between modern, high end pastes is very little, but as5 is not modern, and it wasn't even high end 10 years ago. Then, CLU/CLP is more in line with phobya hegrease, ic diamond, indigo extreme, than pk-3, mx-4, nh-t1 - it's an extreme paste.

You don't have to hope. It's guaranteed your temps will be dramatically different if you use a decent paste on the IHS over as5. It's not just a couple degrees lost using as5... it's huge. I literally saw bigger temp drops using PK-3 over PK-1 than from going from a hyper 212 to H50 - and pk-1 is significantly better than as5, and pk-3, while one of the better modern pastes, is not in the same league as CLU/CLP. Then again you can buy a 1.5g of pk-3 for under $4, while 1.5g of CLU/CLP is about $15-23 shipped.

I'm considering lapping my chip. With taking my nh-d14 on and off so many times, I must have scratched the IHS at one point. Kinda nasty scratch, I wouldn't normally mind but it's right in the middle. I'm pretty delicate with these heatsinks, i've mounted heatsinks at least 50+ times by now, especially the nh-d14... must be the mounting system. I don't exactly want to go about lapping the nh-d14 though.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Very nice, you're looking at an additional 7.75c drop on average.
> Pretty cool for water coolers...I wouldn't try it with Swiftech blocks, or AIO's cause they have mounting mechanisms that stop automatically once you reach the optimum contact pressure (which is at IHS level)...hence bad or no contact withuot ihs.
> Cool! Any 580 to freeze? Or 7970's? You said 11...
> That guy has some smarts lol, but the glycol part doesn't work like that. It's better for water chillers or aio's but distilled performs better for regular water.
> Slap him and make him mod an AC unit into a phase one, all he's gotta do is replace the evaporator with a cold plate and calibrate the unit properly. He knows how already...
> Oh, and you gotta figure out a way to go below the temp control limit, which will be warmer than 0c lol
> +1, Hold the ihs in place with your finger whilst clamping the latch down, and avoid touching those gold pins when placing the ihs higher up on the pcb.
> Awesome man! Hope your imc is intact...Good luck!


I do have some 580s, will have to run one for 3dmark01 but tonight going for 3d11 & whatever other 3d I have time for. See what the card can do cold before the new 3dmark drops tomorrow.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> what exactly would i be soldering?
> 
> @Stu-Crossfire : very nice mate


Don't solder it, you want to insulate the exposed spots, not increase the surface area of spots that can potentially short out.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I do have some 580s, will have to run one for 3dmark01 but tonight going for 3d11 & whatever other 3d I have time for. See what the card can do cold before the new 3dmark drops tomorrow.
> Don't solder it, you want to insulate the exposed spots, not increase the surface area of spots that can potentially short out.


3d mark 13?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Going from AS5 to CLU/CLP will be a dramatic temp drop, just on the ihs even. As in as big a temp drop as going from a hyper 212 to an h80, maybe even high end cooling like an nh-d14. AS5 is just so terrible, it's been terrible for a long time (dont you have some stock paste you can use instead, like what came with some good heatsink you bought or something?). 13 years ago it was good, but 13 years ago the pentium 3 or whatever was great too.
> 
> On top of that, going to not just a high end ceramique, but a premium thermal solution like CLU/CLP, you'll literally get temp drops of 10-20*C when used just on the IHS instead of as5. Why would you buy a 13 year old thermal paste, I can assure you many other companies, and even arctic silver, have been able to figure out a better paste. The idea that pastes don't make a difference is partially wrong - yes, the difference between modern, high end pastes is very little, but as5 is not modern, and it wasn't even high end 10 years ago. Then, CLU/CLP is more in line with phobya hegrease, ic diamond, indigo extreme, than pk-3, mx-4, nh-t1 - it's an extreme paste.
> 
> You don't have to hope. It's guaranteed your temps will be dramatically different if you use a decent paste on the IHS over as5. It's not just a couple degrees lost using as5... it's huge. I literally saw bigger temp drops using PK-3 over PK-1 than from going from a hyper 212 to H50 - and pk-1 is significantly better than as5, and pk-3, while one of the better modern pastes, is not in the same league as CLU/CLP. Then again you can buy a 1.5g of pk-3 for under $4, while 1.5g of CLU/CLP is about $15-23 shipped.
> 
> I'm considering lapping my chip. With taking my nh-d14 on and off so many times, I must have scratched the IHS at one point. Kinda nasty scratch, I wouldn't normally mind but it's right in the middle. I'm pretty delicate with these heatsinks, i've mounted heatsinks at least 50+ times by now, especially the nh-d14... must be the mounting system. I don't exactly want to go about lapping the nh-d14 though.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Going from AS5 to CLU/CLP will be a dramatic temp drop, just on the ihs even. As in as big a temp drop as going from a hyper 212 to an h80, maybe even high end cooling like an nh-d14. AS5 is just so terrible, it's been terrible for a long time (dont you have some stock paste you can use instead, like what came with some good heatsink you bought or something?). 13 years ago it was good, but 13 years ago the pentium 3 or whatever was great too.
> 
> On top of that, going to not just a high end ceramique, but a premium thermal solution like CLU/CLP, you'll literally get temp drops of 10-20*C when used just on the IHS instead of as5. Why would you buy a 13 year old thermal paste, I can assure you many other companies, and even arctic silver, have been able to figure out a better paste. The idea that pastes don't make a difference is partially wrong - yes, the difference between modern, high end pastes is very little, but as5 is not modern, and it wasn't even high end 10 years ago. Then, CLU/CLP is more in line with phobya hegrease, ic diamond, indigo extreme, than pk-3, mx-4, nh-t1 - it's an extreme paste.
> 
> You don't have to hope. It's guaranteed your temps will be dramatically different if you use a decent paste on the IHS over as5. It's not just a couple degrees lost using as5... it's huge. I literally saw bigger temp drops using PK-3 over PK-1 than from going from a hyper 212 to H50 - and pk-1 is significantly better than as5, and pk-3, while one of the better modern pastes, is not in the same league as CLU/CLP. Then again you can buy a 1.5g of pk-3 for under $4, while 1.5g of CLU/CLP is about $15-23 shipped.
> 
> I'm considering lapping my chip. With taking my nh-d14 on and off so many times, I must have scratched the IHS at one point. Kinda nasty scratch, I wouldn't normally mind but it's right in the middle. I'm pretty delicate with these heatsinks, i've mounted heatsinks at least 50+ times by now, especially the nh-d14... must be the mounting system. I don't exactly want to go about lapping the nh-d14 though.


LM Pro = 32.6 w/mk (Right from the CEO of Coollaboratory)
LM Ultra = 38.2w/mK (Right from the CEO of Coollaboratory)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-3 = (11.2W/mk)
PK-2 = (10.2W/mk)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
artic silver 5 = 8.7 w/m.k
Gelid extreme = (8.5W/mk)
everything else is less

page one.... and again he's out of paste... he's ordering it as we speak just waiting for it...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 3d mark 13?


Good question, all I see so far is it's called '3dmark'.
Looks like it will have several benchmarks in it, like 3dmark Fire Strike, 3dmark Ice Storm, & 3dmark Cloud Gate.
Fire Strike hwbot/MSI competition kicks off tomorrow with the benchmark launch.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good question, all I see so far is it's called '3dmark'.
> Looks like it will have several benchmarks in it, like 3dmark Fire Strike, 3dmark Ice Storm, & 3dmark Cloud Gate.
> Fire Strike hwbot/MSI competition kicks off tomorrow with the benchmark launch.


you gonna compete?


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> LM Pro = 32.6 w/mk (Right from the CEO of Coollaboratory)
> LM Ultra = 38.2w/mK (Right from the CEO of Coollaboratory)
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-3 = (11.2W/mk)
> PK-2 = (10.2W/mk)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
> artic silver 5 = 8.7 w/m.k
> Gelid extreme = (8.5W/mk)
> everything else is less
> 
> page one.... and again he's out of paste... he's ordering it as we speak just waiting for it...


On die w/mk is far more important than it is on ihs. On ihs skinnee's testing showed ix then phobya hegrease to be the two best despite phobya having a bit lower w/mk.


----------



## justanoldman

The difference between Ultra and AC5 is about 5c: post #67
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595&page=3

Many other tests have shown the difference to be less than 5c.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> you gonna compete?


Still have a couple hundred liters of Ln2 left & have the hardware, might as well put it to use!


----------



## justanoldman

As for the black rectangle at the bottom of the IHS, I guess you can remove it.
Look at the third pic:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2260582


----------



## Belial

Looking at the ivy bridge stable club... man there's not many people running more than 1.4vcore, and those that do are hitting like 4.9ghz+.

I'm struggling to get 4.7ghz work for p95 stable. I've got this p95 3200ram priority 10 at like the 16th hour right now on [email protected] It was bsod'ing at [email protected] instantly in p95 and after 20 minutes p95 at 1.5vcore. Probably going to have to run 1.55vcore to get an overclock around 4.7ghz.

Turbo LLC setting, disabled power settings, ram is just set to 1333mhz (although at 'performance', which is the stock setting, instead of 'normal' - i think that's fine i mean the xmp ram is 2000 cl7 1.65 and i tested it p95 13 hours at 2133 cl7 1.65v).

Maybe I have to play with lowering PLL or the vrm or something or some irrelevant setting, maybe the chip just isn't cut out to do much ;/


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Looking at the ivy bridge stable club... man there's not many people running more than 1.4vcore, and those that do are hitting like 4.9ghz+.
> 
> I'm struggling to get 4.7ghz work for p95 stable. I've got this p95 3200ram priority 10 at like the 16th hour right now on [email protected] It was bsod'ing at [email protected] instantly in p95 and after 20 minutes p95 at 1.5vcore. Probably going to have to run 1.55vcore to get an overclock around 4.7ghz.
> 
> Turbo LLC setting, disabled power settings, ram is just set to 1333mhz (although at 'performance', which is the stock setting, instead of 'normal' - i think that's fine i mean the xmp ram is 2000 cl7 1.65 and i tested it p95 13 hours at 2133 cl7 1.65v).
> 
> Maybe I have to play with lowering PLL or the vrm or something or some irrelevant setting, maybe the chip just isn't cut out to do much ;/


That is a very voltage hungry chip. Ud5h should be similar to the ud3h I'm using, I didn't think changing the PLL or power limits made any difference to temps or stability for me up to 5ghz, hopefully makes some difference for you...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Still have a couple hundred liters of Ln2 left & have the hardware, might as well put it to use!


I'll throw the lappy and the 680 at it lol.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll throw the lappy and the 680 at it lol.


whats your 680 get in 3dmark 11


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> The difference between Ultra and AC5 is about 5c: post #67
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595&page=3
> 
> Many other tests have shown the difference to be less than 5c.


Ah, information based on actually test results. I like that, as for the guy just throwing comments out of his, you know what, that is frowned upon.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll throw the lappy and the 680 at it lol.


It is an MSI sponsored comp, so you would have to have an MSI mainboard & gpu to compete...


----------



## Swag

Honestly, money well lost! I have to give it to Ravens and still happy that Lewis is going to get his win.







But damn! I can't believe that 49ers were able to catch up!


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> anyone ever try putting a touch of solder on those PCB blemishes?


Do you guys think my delidded 3570k is doing fine?

4.3 ghz Vcore 1.235 79°C hottest core
4.4 ghz Vcore 1.270 86°C
4.5 ghz Vcore 1.320 still can't stable due high temps

I scratched the pcb in one spot but is really tiny, I'm gonna post a picture later among with the arrival of my CLU. Do you think that little blemish is causing such a poor performance?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Looking at the ivy bridge stable club... man there's not many people running more than 1.4vcore, and those that do are hitting like 4.9ghz+.
> 
> I'm struggling to get 4.7ghz work for p95 stable. I've got this p95 3200ram priority 10 at like the 16th hour right now on [email protected] It was bsod'ing at [email protected] instantly in p95 and after 20 minutes p95 at 1.5vcore. Probably going to have to run 1.55vcore to get an overclock around 4.7ghz.
> 
> Turbo LLC setting, disabled power settings, ram is just set to 1333mhz (although at 'performance', which is the stock setting, instead of 'normal' - i think that's fine i mean the xmp ram is 2000 cl7 1.65 and i tested it p95 13 hours at 2133 cl7 1.65v).
> 
> Maybe I have to play with lowering PLL or the vrm or something or some irrelevant setting, maybe the chip just isn't cut out to do much ;/
> 
> 
> 
> That is a very voltage hungry chip. Ud5h should be similar to the ud3h I'm using, I didn't think changing the PLL or power limits made any difference to temps or stability for me up to 5ghz, hopefully makes some difference for you...
Click to expand...

thanks for the reply.

Yea looking around more, talking to someone, it seems like something is wrong. 1.4, 1.5vcore, that's like reserved for 5ghz and stuff.

Maybe this chip is like the results out there that are like [email protected] and that being the max overclock and those people aren't posting/doing [email protected], they just submit/stick to their [email protected]

But im okay with 1.5, 1.55v, as long as temps are fine, you know. I dont mind a little degradation and all. Anyways I dont even know where to begin with those other settings, I played with irrelevant settings on my phenom x4 build (with no success or difference i suppose but i understand what they did at least, once or twice they made a difference, ie ht link speed being lowered to unlock an athlon x4, having to use mobo socket over voltage instead of vid for voltage to chip during overclocking) a lot...

someone is telling me to change my vdroop setting, based on the following quote:
Quote:


> With it disabled, the steady-state voltages look better, but transient spikes will be worse (and AFAIK there is no way for software to detect the transients). If the CPU suddenly transitions from idle to load, there will be a brief moment when it is significantly undervolted


maybe i change vdroop from turbo, as recommended on ud3h/ud5h for ambient overclocks, to like high or medium.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Ah, information based on actually test results. I like that, as for the guy just throwing comments out of his, you know what, that is frowned upon.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good question, all I see so far is it's called '3dmark'.
> Looks like it will have several benchmarks in it, like 3dmark Fire Strike, 3dmark Ice Storm, & 3dmark Cloud Gate.
> Fire Strike hwbot/MSI competition kicks off tomorrow with the benchmark launch.


Just in time I got my Hydra quadfired lulz!

@TD My best regards to your wee chip... had the same happen to me and I actually went and bought another one.

My "Quasimodo" chip I just spanked in an Asrock Pro3 mobo and had it folding.


----------



## Swag

Corsair Sleeved Cables Kit coming in tomorrow morning!









Also, @*Valgaur & TD*, how old y'all think I was?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Corsair Sleeved Cables Kit coming in tomorrow morning!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, @*Valgaur & TD*, how old y'all think I was?


14


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Corsair Sleeved Cables Kit coming in tomorrow morning!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, @*Valgaur & TD*, how old y'all think I was?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 14
Click to expand...









17 actually. I know already, so many people tell me I sound like I'm 12, which means 14 is actually a compliment.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> whats your 680 get in 3dmark 11


http://hwbot.org/submission/2327417_valgaur_3dmark11___performance_geforce_gtx_680_10973_marks

thats a while back with older drivers. just got this one clocked at 4.5 giggles and with my normal RAM

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5807910


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 17 actually. I know already, so many people tell me I sound like I'm 12, which means 14 is actually a compliment.


You youngins








Are you 17 or 18 this year? I believe i'm not the youngest here anymore!









EDIT: Seeing as I'll be away for up to a week if I have Internet problems I'm going to spoil it and say that I'm 18, turning 19 this year!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 17 actually. I know already, so many people tell me I sound like I'm 12, which means 14 is actually a compliment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You youngins
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you 17 or 18 this year? I believe i'm not the youngest here anymore!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Seeing as I'll be away for up to a week if I have Internet problems I'm going to spoil it and say that I'm 18, turning 19 this year!
Click to expand...

I'm turning 18 in 2013.







Yes, I am young but my voice is that of a 12 year old.







I hate how whenever I call a CS or anything over the phone other than my friends/family, they automatically begin with "Hello Miss."


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> Do you guys think my delidded 3570k is doing fine?
> 
> 4.3 ghz Vcore 1.235 79°C hottest core
> 4.4 ghz Vcore 1.270 86°C
> 4.5 ghz Vcore 1.320 still can't stable due high temps
> 
> I scratched the pcb in one spot but is really tiny, I'm gonna post a picture later among with the arrival of my CLU. Do you think that little blemish is causing such a poor performance?


i dont think so, scratching the pcb somehow gives other problems most of the time,
no post, or losing a memory channel etc,
your temps seem to high to me tho..looks more like temps are un-delidded ivy has..


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quick question everyone, what's everyone using to overclock? Offset or fixed?

Just switched to an Asus Maximus V Formula and no longer have turbo as an option. Offset is kinda perplexing to me, can't seem to get a 4.8-5.0 stable at anywhere near the fixed voltage's I'd normally need.

Suppose I'll probably be leaving it at fixed [email protected], max temp is 54 after 3 hours of prime95 custom/90% unless someone gives me a reason that offset is really the way to go.


----------



## teamrushpntball

Oh, and one more thing. GO RAVENS!!!!!


----------



## King4x4

Just got a call from the shipping company... My CLU IS IN!!!!

This day can't be anymore fun... Red tubing arrived... 7950 Blocked and plated... and now CLU arrived.... Time to unpack the system lads!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2327417_valgaur_3dmark11___performance_geforce_gtx_680_10973_marks
> 
> thats a while back with older drivers. just got this one clocked at 4.5 giggles and with my normal RAM
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5807910


310.70 drivers
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5666463
u goin to let me do that to you


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 310.70 drivers
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5666463


same drivers lol but I'm at 4.5 giggles remember that lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Quick question everyone, what's everyone using to overclock? Offset or fixed?
> 
> Just switched to an Asus Maximus V Formula and no longer have turbo as an option. Offset is kinda perplexing to me, can't seem to get a 4.8-5.0 stable at anywhere near the fixed voltage's I'd normally need.
> 
> Suppose I'll probably be leaving it at fixed [email protected], max temp is 54 after 3 hours of prime95 custom/90% unless someone gives me a reason that offset is really the way to go.


i always use offset with my oc's,
i only use fixed vcore if i need to find a stable vcore for any oc,
if i have that, i switch to offset..
i like to have it downclock vcore. i think its better for my chip,
and cheaper with electric ..lol
i need 0.160V offset for my 4.8ghz
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Just got a call from the shipping company... My CLU IS IN!!!!
> 
> This day can't be anymore fun... Red tubing arrived... 7950 Blocked and plated... and now CLU arrived.... Time to unpack the system lads!


looks like you gonna have a fun day








GL


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> same drivers lol but I'm at 4.5 giggles remember that lol


3570k and a 670


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 3570k and a 670


what RAM?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what RAM?


gskill trident x 2400mhz 2x4gb


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> gskill trident x 2400mhz 2x4gb


you win lol im running 1600's right now


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> you win lol im running 1600's right now


does ram really improve graphics score that much? i thought it was mostly the phisics srore for cpu test


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> does ram really improve graphics score that much? i thought it was mostly the phisics srore for cpu test


sometimes yes. in aquamark3 I've seen boosts from my 2400 cas 7 kit. but it all depends. it also changes on each chip and gpu as each one takes the bench differently. it's weird. Imma sleep now im very tired.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sometimes yes. in aquamark3 I've seen boosts from my 2400 cas 7 kit. but it all depends. it also changes on each chip and gpu as each one takes the bench differently. it's weird. Imma sleep now im very tired.


G'night boss, sleep well


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> Do you guys think my delidded 3570k is doing fine?
> 
> 4.3 ghz Vcore 1.235 79°C hottest core
> 4.4 ghz Vcore 1.270 86°C
> 4.5 ghz Vcore 1.320 still can't stable due high temps
> 
> I scratched the pcb in one spot but is really tiny, I'm gonna post a picture later among with the arrival of my CLU. Do you think that little blemish is causing such a poor performance?


No. What type of TIM did you use on the die? Those look like undelidded temps. What do you use for cooling and what TIM did you use?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 14


lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm turning 18 in 2013.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I am young but my voice is that of a 12 year old.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate how whenever I call a CS or anything over the phone other than my friends/family, they automatically begin with "Hello Miss."


LOL
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i dont think so, scratching the pcb somehow gives other problems most of the time,
> no post, or losing a memory channel etc,
> your temps seem to high to me tho..looks more like temps are un-delidded ivy has..


Agreed
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> G'night boss, sleep well


Where in the Netherlands are you?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where in the Netherlands are you?


in the East, province Drenthe, city Emmen


----------



## Totally Dubbed

@swag: I sounded like you (with a better Mic) when I was your age.
I'm 21 myself, but don't sound it, nor look it, nor act it lol.

As for my chip...it's going to bother me always that the ram slots are not working. I would be inclined to rma it. On the other hand though, my mx2 is giving me over 10c better temps.
Also can I ask what are the disadvantages to running single channel over dual channel?
I don't mind the 8gb over the 16gb to be honest. 8gb is more than enough.


----------



## mandrix

You guys might think this is nuts, but when I delidded I did pretty much the same thing as Idontcare on Anandtech. I used a very small hammer and tapped the razor blade into each corner, then pried up the IHS. I felt I had more control that way, as I could tap gently with the hammer instead of pushing with my fingers really hard and possibly slipping and hitting the chip.
I did notice that when I tried to run the razor down the sides the same way I quickly saw I had less control and went back to prying the corners and working the razor by hand a little.

I had the cpu sitting on a rubber mat while doing the delidding, the little plumber's pack stuff from Lowes I had left over from making some fan/radiator gaskets.
Thanks to posted pics showing the open space under the IHS I had a really good idea how far I could tap the razor blade.

But everyone has to do what they think works best for them. I know this was best for me and it worked flawlessly.

The razor, some 91% alcohol, and some cotton swabs made short work of the leftover adhesive. I was going to use my dremel with a buffing pad but was too lazy to walk to the shed to get it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Over 2 years ago...I had RAM problems with ASUS....
Now I look back at it....it is the SAME problem I'm having with my current Z77:





Now I know all the signs point towards that IMC being chipped - but don't you find it ironic, that 2 years on, I'm in the same situation?
Only single channel working, and not being able to utilise two slots?

Now for my old motherboard...it was supposedly ram compatibility.
Asus supposedly tested it and it came up with 3.5GB (winxp max) - however they never tried it with MY CPU. So it lead me to believe it was BIOS related.
Now looking at what issue I have, could it have been my CPU? I never touched my CPU....but looking at some of the comments now - could be pin related.
I got packages waiting for me at uni (most probably my CLU) - and so I will check the pins again.
If this is actually pin related - not only will I be happy, but then I can check my OLD PC and check its pins too.
If for any reason I find the fault on my old pc, and it is pin related.....then I will be having some fun with asus.

Anyway - for my new pc -> probably IMC related, but could be pin related seeing as it is almost an IDENTICAL error as what I had before - except this time I know the ram works 100% fine before de-lidding and that I was the one that screwed up my system - no one else.


----------



## Belial

Woke up to this, this morning when testing a 'conservative' 4.6ghz @ 1.4vcore.

p95 custom 3200ram, worker #3 stopped with 1 error at 19 hours 51 minutes.

Max temp 70*C.

;/


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2327417_valgaur_3dmark11___performance_geforce_gtx_680_10973_marks
> 
> thats a while back with older drivers. just got this one clocked at 4.5 giggles and with my normal RAM
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5807910


You need at least 5ghz, and 1400mhz core / 7800mhz ram to do something with a 680. Get EVGA Precision X and use the locked boost speed all the time too.
Also what version of 3dm11 is that? There's a 'better' scoring version out there, you do know that, right?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm turning 18 in 2013.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I am young but my voice is that of a 12 year old.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate how whenever I call a CS or anything over the phone other than my friends/family, they automatically begin with "Hello Miss."


Hahaha! At least you can start singing for a hair metal band, or become a latin balad singer Luis Miguel style lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> Quick question everyone, what's everyone using to overclock? Offset or fixed?
> 
> Just switched to an Asus Maximus V Formula and no longer have turbo as an option. Offset is kinda perplexing to me, can't seem to get a 4.8-5.0 stable at anywhere near the fixed voltage's I'd normally need.
> 
> Suppose I'll probably be leaving it at fixed [email protected], max temp is 54 after 3 hours of prime95 custom/90% unless someone gives me a reason that offset is really the way to go.


I don't care for offsets really, but offset uses turbo, so it's basically the same.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> same drivers lol but I'm at 4.5 giggles remember that lol


Cpu doesn't affect scores all that much, not in 3dm11...more in Vantage, 06 or older 3d benchies.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> you win lol im running 1600's right now


Same as above...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> @swag: I sounded like you (with a better Mic) when I was your age.
> I'm 21 myself, but don't sound it, nor look it, nor act it lol.
> 
> As for my chip...it's going to bother me always that the ram slots are not working. I would be inclined to rma it. On the other hand though, my mx2 is giving me over 10c better temps.
> Also can I ask what are the disadvantages to running single channel over dual channel?
> I don't mind the 8gb over the 16gb to be honest. 8gb is more than enough.


Dual channel will be a bit faster, but you won't notice it in general unless you bench.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Woke up to this, this morning when testing a 'conservative' 4.6ghz @ 1.4vcore.
> 
> p95 custom 3200ram, worker #3 stopped with 1 error at 19 hours 51 minutes.
> 
> Max temp 70*C.
> 
> ;/


Can you take screenshots of your bios settings? There are a few cpu related pages...post em here. I seriously doubt you can't run 4.6 with 1.4v really.


----------



## Stu-Crossfire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> @Stu-Crossfire : very nice mate


Thanks.









After some weekend tests and benching, my best overall settings with 100% stability are 45x103 for 4640mhz @ 1.27v with ram at 2200 with 1.55v.
I have also brought PLL voltage down to 1.7 for less heat.

So I have done some IBT tests set to max, with extreme ticked for ten runs using all the ram.
*
Results are very impressive. A max of 54C.*


*
But perhaps even more impressive are the results of my same tests PASSIVE with no radiator cooling at all.
(All cooling fans switched off except the 2x silent case fans to keep the Vregs cool.)*



Still a max of 67C. Well happy.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Over 2 years ago...I had RAM problems with ASUS....
> Now I look back at it....it is the SAME problem I'm having with my current Z77:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I know all the signs point towards that IMC being chipped - but don't you find it ironic, that 2 years on, I'm in the same situation?
> Only single channel working, and not being able to utilise two slots?
> 
> Now for my old motherboard...it was supposedly ram compatibility.
> Asus supposedly tested it and it came up with 3.5GB (winxp max) - however they never tried it with MY CPU. So it lead me to believe it was BIOS related.
> Now looking at what issue I have, could it have been my CPU? I never touched my CPU....but looking at some of the comments now - could be pin related.
> I got packages waiting for me at uni (most probably my CLU) - and so I will check the pins again.
> If this is actually pin related - not only will I be happy, but then I can check my OLD PC and check its pins too.
> If for any reason I find the fault on my old pc, and it is pin related.....then I will be having some fun with asus.
> 
> Anyway - for my new pc -> probably IMC related, but could be pin related seeing as it is almost an IDENTICAL error as what I had before - except this time I know the ram works 100% fine before de-lidding and that I was the one that screwed up my system - no one else.


I went through the same situation with yours . Your dimm slots are okay. Your cpu causing this. I don't think it's a bent or unaligned pin.I searched for every pin on mine but they were flat. It might be not enough or more than enough pressure on cpu die and your cpu partially got damaged. That's for sure. At first time it gave error code 55. second dimm wasn't working. i changed slots and it worked but in single mode. I remounted it 3-4 times and still error code 55. After that ı put a thin paper between pcb and ihs . remounted it and it booted with no error code. dual channel was working.but internal gpu wasn't working probably( driver can't be installed ). I understood that it already got damaged and there's no turning back. i mounted it several times with several possibilities but no luck. i can use it without internal gpu. i just lost HD 4000 graphics.

I had a similar problem with lga 1366 i7 920 on foxconn bloodrage. but it was pin related because some pins were bent. there was no delidding club that time







it's soldered flux already haha







I just advise you to boot from internal gpu of cpu and see everything ok.. don't forget to remove external vga and install hd 4000 graphics.cause problems starts after installing drivers


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> No. What type of TIM did you use on the die? Those look like undelidded temps. What do you use for cooling and what TIM did you use?


I know man, I used the crappy AS5 on both die and ihs, also tried with the cooler master stock, with the same results. I'm using 212 EVO.

Do you think I should lap the heatsink?

btw the first core is always 10°C cooler than the rest, if all the cores were like the first one I wouldn't worry by the temps


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ok I'll try different mounts. Out of interest though, what's the point of testing the internal graphics? As I've disabled it, never installed the drivers etc after my second fresh install.
I was even thinking of doubling the layer of the paper.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ok I'll try different mounts. Out of interest though, what's the point of testing the internal graphics? As I've disabled it, never installed the drivers etc after my second fresh install.
> I was even thinking of doubling the layer of the paper.


I'm upgrading to custom watercooling so my gtx 670 is laying around with waterblock. i had to use internal gpu. you know gpu has a big area on cpu die. you have to check it also and doubling paper or a two sided tape ( which is ticker than paper) might work


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> I'm upgrading to custom watercooling so my gtx 670 is laying around with waterblock. i had to use internal gpu. you know gpu has a big area on cpu die. you have to check it also and doubling paper or a two sided tape ( which is ticker than paper) might work


BTW if internal gpu don't work properly i think you won't be able to use virtu MVP . I' ve never tried virtu MVP with my half dead cpu but i don't think it is gonna work


----------



## justanoldman

Totally Dubbed,
I am really sorry for all the trouble you have had, but I am glad that the guys here could help, especially Valgaur and Swag. I hope everything works out.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need at least 5ghz, and 1400mhz core / 7800mhz ram to do something with a 680. Get EVGA Precision X and use the locked boost speed all the time too.
> Also what version of 3dm11 is that? There's a 'better' scoring version out there, you do know that, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hahaha! At least you can start singing for a hair metal band, or become a latin balad singer Luis Miguel style lol
> I don't care for offsets really, but offset uses turbo, so it's basically the same.
> Cpu doesn't affect scores all that much, not in 3dm11...more in Vantage, 06 or older 3d benchies.
> Same as above...
> Dual channel will be a bit faster, but you won't notice it in general unless you bench.
> Can you take screenshots of your bios settings? There are a few cpu related pages...post em here. I seriously doubt you can't run 4.6 with 1.4v really.


Yeah I know there's a better one but was pretty busy last night and didn't tweak anything and just did a stock run. and I was up super late doing homework and now I'm sick from my lack of sleep the last 4 weeks. I'm taking a nap... ugh
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Totally Dubbed,
> I am really sorry for all the trouble you have had, but I am glad that the guys here could help, especially Valgaur and Swag. I hope everything works out.


Thats true. We have to remember we got the chip working and we even got RAM slots working which is better than nothing right now.


----------



## justanoldman

Newb qestions:
Are the cores lined up in order on the die, as is core 0 at the top and core 3 at the bottom? Why are the middle ones (#1, #2) always the hottest?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Newb qestions:
> Are the cores lined up in order on the die, as is core 0 at the top and core 3 at the bottom? Why are the middle ones (#1, #2) always the hottest?


cause they are surrounded by other cores that means extra heat. like our earth the core is the hottest part =)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yeah I wasn't even booting - so now I actually got a working PC.
Been folding for around 4hrs now without any problems....but I realised something:
RAM USE is minimal with folding.

So when I get home I'll run P95 with maxed out settings.
If it fails, then I know the IMC is playing a big role in the failings.

If P95 fails, I'll go on stock and try again - if it ALSO fails on P95 -> then I'll RMA without a shadow of a doubt.

I'm going to check pins, play around with mounts, and get rid of the Antec 920 cooler - to save myself some time with mounting and testing.
Mounting that cooler takes over 30mins - for testing purposes thatr's too much.
I'm not too concerned about temps right now - but they have improved drastically.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I may not be able to beat that clockspeed, but I can match it!
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4536198
> 
> Futuremark is trying to tell us we're too slow or something...


That's hilarious 2 billion MHz


----------



## justanoldman

After a lot of testing, I think there is no question my cooler block is convex. Installing it as directed always had the right side touching more than the rest of the cold plate, but going out of your way to tighten the left side first, then the right side helps to get better contact.

I also tried turning the cooler block 90 degrees to the left, and that of course caused the top to make more contact than the rest but it helped. So turning the block and tightening one side first (which directly goes against the instructions and conventional wisdom) actual got me several degrees.

So hottest core to hottest core I have dropped in the 15c range now. When I look at the tim fingerprint on the cooler and ihs, I think I have no choice but to go ahead a throw out my cooler warranty and lap it. So 3770k warranty, and H100i warranty out the window.


----------



## King4x4

Oh yaaaah!


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Oh yaaaah!


Hell yeah babe


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> A
> So hottest core to hottest core I have dropped in the 15c range now. When I look at the tim fingerprint on the cooler and ihs, I think I have no choice but to go ahead a throw out my cooler warranty and lap it. So 3770k warranty, and H100i warranty out the window.


So unlucky.
You did everything correct, and seen not much of an improvement
I did one thing wrong, seen a huge improvement, but damaged my CPU...

We were both unlucky in that respect.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Oh yaaaah!


Very nice bro!

Thought to show you my temp difference:
OK this is 60hrs vs 7hrs folding - but the temps never really changed that much within the 60hrs:
Before delidding with MX2 temps: 85-92
http://www.overclock.net/t/1355634/folding-away-a-new-addiction#post_19190478

Current MX2 temps after de-liodding: 76-82


----------



## justanoldman

TD,
Your core 0 is 4c hotter than your core 1 now, that does not look right. Are you sure the cooler is making good contact? Changing mine around is what got me from a 10c improvement to a 15c, and that was just repositioning the cooler, I didn't do anything to the ihs.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> TD,
> Your core 0 is 4c hotter than your core 1 now, that does not look right. Are you sure the cooler is making good contact? Changing mine around is what got me from a 10c improvement to a 15c, and that was just repositioning the cooler, I didn't do anything to the ihs.


sometimes the core 0 is hotter thanks to the igpu right above it since it dissipates heat from both. but it's up in the air with every chip.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> TD,
> Your core 0 is 4c hotter than your core 1 now, that does not look right. Are you sure the cooler is making good contact? Changing mine around is what got me from a 10c improvement to a 15c, and that was just repositioning the cooler, I didn't do anything to the ihs.


I thinks its quite normal . I get 75 ,80,80 ,77 at 5.1 Ghz


----------



## Totally Dubbed

No just an oldman is correct - that's due to my reduced pressure mounting of the Antec 920 - and also due to my not so even paste application. I was more in a rush when doing the paste, as I know I'm going to open it up again.

My friend just came in and made a very valid point:
Lacquer the PCB.

Would that be advised and/or how could I protect the die from not being lacquered as it is a spray.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> No just an oldman is correct - that's due to my reduced pressure mounting of the Antec 920 - and also due to my not so even paste application. I was more in a rush when doing the paste, as I know I'm going to open it up again.
> 
> My friend just came in and made a very valid point:
> Lacquer the PCB.
> 
> Would that be advised and/or how could I protect the die from not being lacquered as it is a spray.


its normal to have a temp difference between cores, even after delid,
when its still 12-16C after delid , you should be worried,
anything between 4-8C temp difference is normal..gets bigger under load, and higher oc's

tape of the die and the underside pcb if possible, and anything copper on the pcb..
i wouldnt do it, but thats upto you of course








you could spray some of the laque onto something, dap it and dap the copper you nicked on the pcb..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So *hottest core to hottest core I have dropped in the 15c range now.* When I look at the tim fingerprint on the cooler and ihs, I think I have no choice but to go ahead a throw out my cooler warranty and lap it. So 3770k warranty, and H100i warranty out the window.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> So unlucky.
> *You did everything correct, and seen not much of an improvement*
> I did one thing wrong, seen a huge improvement, but damaged my CPU...
> 
> We were both unlucky in that respect.


i wouldnt call 15C not much of a improvement TD









at least you have got a good temp difference now justanoldman, 15C isnt that bad really..gratz


----------



## ORAC

OCN name: ORAC
CPU: i7-3770k
Costa Rica Batch No: 3228B978
On Die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
MHz gained: 800 GHz
OC after De-Lid: 4.5 GHz
Temp Drops: 15C
CPU-Z validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2680702

Overclock Max CPU Voltage CPU Condition Cooling Solution Max Core Comments
3.7 GHz ** Stock Intel Stock Heatsink 83C Not Over-Clocked
4.2 GHz ** Stock Intel Stock Heatsink 105C Throttled
4.2 GHz ** Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 94C Poor Mounting
4.4 GHz 1.246 Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 94C Poor Mounting
4.5 GHz 1.256 Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 84C Prime95 (16 Hours)
4.6 GHz 1.320 Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 82C Prime95 (24 Hours)
4.5 GHz 1.256 Lapped & De-lidded Corsair H80i WC 90C RMA (Crap Prod)
4.5 GHz 1.248 Lapped & De-lidded Phanteks PH-TC12DX 68C Prime95 (20 Hours)
4.5 GHz 1.232 Lapped & De-lidded Phanteks PH-TC12DX 68C Intel Burn Test v2.54

Lapping:

600 Grit Dry
1000 Grit Dry
1500 Grit Dry
2000 Grit Dry
2500 Grit Dry
2500 Grit Wet

It should be noted that when running Prime95, depending upon the CPU speed, around the 17 to 19 minute mark, one core would spike to it maximum temperatures of 68C but did not stay there. The remaining three cores also spiked to their highest temperature during the stress test, but did not stay there. The average temperatures for each core using the Excel log from Real Temp after running Prime95 for 20 hours were, as follows: 53.66, 61.66, 58.68, 61.42.

In my opinion, the average core temperatures over an extended period of time is more indicative of the CPU's operating temperature, rather than an anomalous spike in the maximum core temperatures.

The Intel Burn Test was run at both standard and maximum. There was no difference in the m

aximum temperature for each test.

Cooling Solution.JPG 23k .JPG file


Cutting Glue.jpg 80k .jpg file


Intel Burn Test.JPG 111k .JPG file


Leveling IHS.jpg 79k .jpg file


Opened CPU.JPG 48k .JPG file


Polished IHS.jpg 78k .jpg file


Removed Glue.jpg 83k .jpg file


Stock CPU.jpg 72k .jpg file


----------



## justanoldman

My point is that I don't see anyone else with a core0 of 4c hotter than core1. Before delid he had relatively normal distribution.

I am not talking about general differences between cores, I am saying he can't go from core0 being 6c less than core1 to after delid of 4c over without something being amiss. That is a 10c swing, and core0 should be less than core1.

Hopefully when he redoes it things will look better.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> My point is that I don't see anyone else with a core0 of 4c hotter than core1. Before delid he had relatively normal distribution.
> 
> I am not talking about general differences between cores, I am saying he can't go from core0 being 6c less than core1 to after delid of 4c over without something being amiss. That is a 10c swing, and core0 should be less than core1.
> 
> Hopefully when he redoes it things will look better.


? As long as cores are with in 5-6c of each other under load that is 100% normal i do not see the issue here?


----------



## lilchronic

my temps between cores are 4c- 6c max spread between cores coolabs pro on die. the only tim that should be put on die when deliding any other tim is pointless. (coolabs pro / ultra)


----------



## King4x4

Ooooh hooookies.... I went hardcore just for you!

Daily stable [email protected]


----------



## justanoldman

Sorry I don't know any other way to say it.
Please post a pic of your temps under load where core0 is at least 4c higher than core1, not just between any two cores, just the first one 4c higher than the second. Every pic shows core0 lower than core1 except his after the delid.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Ooooh hooookies.... I went hardcore just for you!
> 
> Daily stable [email protected]


Welcome to the hardcore club.







Where we go big or buy 2600k's and switch 810s...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ORAC*
> 
> OCN name: ORAC
> CPU: i7-3770k
> Costa Rica Batch No: 3228B978
> On Die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> MHz gained: 800 GHz
> OC after De-Lid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp Drops: 15C
> CPU-Z validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2680702
> 
> Overclock Max CPU Voltage CPU Condition Cooling Solution Max Core Comments
> 3.7 GHz ** Stock Intel Stock Heatsink 83C Not Over-Clocked
> 4.2 GHz ** Stock Intel Stock Heatsink 105C Throttled
> 4.2 GHz ** Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 94C Poor Mounting
> 4.4 GHz 1.246 Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 94C Poor Mounting
> 4.5 GHz 1.256 Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 84C Prime95 (16 Hours)
> 4.6 GHz 1.320 Lapped & De-lidded CM Hyper 212 Plus 82C Prime95 (24 Hours)
> 4.5 GHz 1.256 Lapped & De-lidded Corsair H80i WC 90C RMA (Crap Prod)
> 4.5 GHz 1.248 Lapped & De-lidded Phanteks PH-TC12DX 68C Prime95 (20 Hours)
> 4.5 GHz 1.232 Lapped & De-lidded Phanteks PH-TC12DX 68C Intel Burn Test v2.54
> 
> Lapping:
> 
> 600 Grit Dry
> 1000 Grit Dry
> 1500 Grit Dry
> 2000 Grit Dry
> 2500 Grit Dry
> 2500 Grit Wet
> 
> It should be noted that when running Prime95, depending upon the CPU speed, around the 17 to 19 minute mark, one core would spike to it maximum temperatures of 68C but did not stay there. The remaining three cores also spiked to their highest temperature during the stress test, but did not stay there. The average temperatures for each core using the Excel log from Real Temp after running Prime95 for 20 hours were, as follows: 53.66, 61.66, 58.68, 61.42.
> 
> In my opinion, the average core temperatures over an extended period of time is more indicative of the CPU's operating temperature, rather than an anomalous spike in the maximum core temperatures.
> 
> The Intel Burn Test was run at both standard and maximum. There was no difference in the m
> 
> aximum temperature for each test.
> 
> Cooling Solution.JPG 23k .JPG file
> 
> 
> Cutting Glue.jpg 80k .jpg file
> 
> 
> Intel Burn Test.JPG 111k .JPG file
> 
> 
> Leveling IHS.jpg 79k .jpg file
> 
> 
> Opened CPU.JPG 48k .JPG file
> 
> 
> Polished IHS.jpg 78k .jpg file
> 
> 
> Removed Glue.jpg 83k .jpg file
> 
> 
> Stock CPU.jpg 72k .jpg file


Your in! Now Slap that wicked signature on your Sig!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Welcome to the hardcore club.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Where we go big or buy 2600k's and switch 810s...


i can run 5.2 ghz @ that voltage but im not that hardcore lol i went with the 3570k and the nzxt410


----------



## ORAC

Youbetcha!


----------



## justanoldman

Well things make more sense now. I had better temps to begin with than some others, so my drop couldn't' be as much. To test this I went out I got another 3770k and popped it in. No changes, same cooler, same everything. Temps are way higher than my other chip before I delidded it. Before I could do 1.29v at 82c, this new chip is a full 10c hotter.

So if I delid this new one, and end up at the exact same post delid temps of my current chip, I would say "wow I got 25c better." Yet I would be in the exact same place, both chips would have the same post delid temps.

Only way to check that is delid this one too....


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Ooooh hooookies.... I went hardcore just for you!
> 
> Daily stable [email protected]


I told you not to hardcore - you dirty man!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry I don't know any other way to say it.
> Please post a pic of your temps under load where core0 is at least 4c higher than core1, not just between any two cores, just the first one 4c higher than the second. Every pic shows core0 lower than core1 except his after the delid.


I completely understand what you mean man.
To be honest - I would be a little surprised when there is a huge difference is core temps.
I found my temps BEFORE delidding more "even" as to what I have now.
I also found my temps more "even" when I put MX2 over the stock antec.

I personally feel it is down to the SPREAD of the thermal paste - which makes perfect sense.

There isn't something to be worried about that said, as other have pointed out.
I also questioned Swag 2 weeks ago - as to why one of my cores would suddenly jump to 43c and then right back down to 27c within a second.
This is down to software glitches and more so load being applied to one out of my 4 cores.

As for WHICH core is higher than the other - it really doesn't matter. It just depends which one is getting used more often and getting hotter.

As for my cores:
Before de-lidding:
From colder to hotter:
Core 4, 1, 3, 2

After de-lidding:
Core 4, 3, 2, 1

If anything the de-lidding meant a more predictable temperature range.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Well things make more sense now. I had better temps to begin with than some others, so my drop couldn't' be as much. To test this I went out I got another 3770k and popped it in. No changes, same cooler, same everything. Temps are way higher than my other chip before I delidded it. Before I could do 1.29v at 82c, this new chip is a full 10c hotter.
> 
> So if I delid this new one, and end up at the exact same post delid temps of my current chip, I would say "wow I got 25c better." Yet I would be in the exact same place, both chips would have the same post delid temps.
> 
> Only way to check that is delid this one too....


Indeed - but DO NOT do it in order to prove a point to yourself or because you want to prove anything here.
Do it because you WANT TO de-lid.
Remember that warranty.

As for temp difference - as others said 10c doesn't seem like much - to give you an idea - I HAVE A 10C DIFFERENCE - and that's with "normal" paste - aka: MX2. Tonight, if I'm not tired - I will open up my PC again - and this time put some CLU (it arrived) - PS. No problems, and cap is perfect as expected.

Then I will realistically be able to give you an answer of MX2 vs CLU.
Now I know others might disagree with me when I say - if MX2 does the same temps then why put CLU - however I would agree with the others when it comes to applying CLU over MX2 on the die, simply because OVER TIME - the MX2 will just become like the stock intel one (possibly a little better, but the temps will gradually go up.


----------



## King4x4

Put some CLU and you will see a major drop. Went from noctua on the die to CLU and I got a 25'c drop!


----------



## justanoldman

If I delid this second chip, is there a market for my first one? What is a perfectly functioning 3770k that has been delidded, lapped, can do [email protected], [email protected], 4.8 at something around 1.41v, worth? Anything, or just keep it on the shelf just in case?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If I delid this second chip, is there a market for my first one? What is a perfectly functioning 3770k that has been delidded, lapped, can do [email protected], [email protected], 4.8 at something around 1.41v, worth? Anything, or just keep it on the shelf just in case?


Well it's definitely worth something. That's not a bad chip. I'd be interested, depending on the price


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Woke up to this, this morning when testing a 'conservative' 4.6ghz @ 1.4vcore.
> 
> p95 custom 3200ram, worker #3 stopped with 1 error at 19 hours 51 minutes.
> 
> Max temp 70*C.
> 
> ;/
> 
> 
> 
> Can you take screenshots of your bios settings? There are a few cpu related pages...post em here. I seriously doubt you can't run 4.6 with 1.4v really.
Click to expand...

Okay, I did the following to try things:

PWM phase Control: eXtreme Performance
Vcore Voltage Response: Fast (auto/standard/fast)
Vcore LLC: Extreme (turbo is recommended for ambient oc, extreme for ln2)

I also turned up my ram to 1866mhz with it's XMP timings (cl7-10-etc...turns out 2133 CL7 doesnt work, i think when i got it to work before it automatically turned down the timings... or maybe not, im not sure, it just wouldnt boot when i manually set them, ill check later if it'll boot 2133 xmp with auto for timings instead of having manually put them in, w/e).

Anyways, it's really helped out with stability, I think, despite Sin0822 and others saying these features don't mean anything. It's not much, but for example, [email protected], which is instant blue screen, can boot and do a bit of p95 before failing. [email protected], I've been running 20 minutes now ([email protected] is crash in like 5 min).

I'll keep laying with it but it seems messing with those settings helped (i think the ram is just whatever). I mean the VRM on this ud5h is so cool anyways (i got 3 temp sensors in it, its hard to put temp sensors on this vrm heatsink because it's so wide you can't slip one under the heatsink like you can on the ud3h, but i did stick a few inbetween some of the middle/top chokes which tend to be the hottest, which usually run at temps higher than mosfets as i understand it, and they are running 42*C max.

I guess [email protected] isn't really impressive either (then again I haven't tried 5ghz at 1.4vcore yet with these new pwm settings) but already lasting 20+ minutes on a setting that should be instant bsod is great.

Will post pics though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Newb qestions:
> Are the cores lined up in order on the die, as is core 0 at the top and core 3 at the bottom? Why are the middle ones (#1, #2) always the hottest?


Yes. It's like this. The right side of this image is at the 'top' of the chip, the gpu at the bottom. That's why people are always screwing up their IMC, have ram issues, etc, when they screw up a delid and scratch the pcb - the edge of the IHS that's closest to the die is the top part. I wish people who scratched their die would say where exactly they ended up scratching, but I imagine that's what they are hitting. It'd be no problem if you scratched up the gpu ^^.



Cores 1-2 can be hottest for many reasons. They are in the middle so maybe they get heated by the stuff around them. Some cores actually get more of a workload, or a higher/lower workload (you might think p95 or ibt is p95/ibt balanced load on all cores, buts even if your increase priority on p95, it's not - background applications is running on some of the cores, which may make them run cooler, or hotter, than the cores taking a full load). I used to think on an old quadcore that 2 of the cores were faster (they would complete more fft passes in 15 minutes in p95, after 24 hours they would be a good couple fft lengths ahead), but then I realized that those two cores were where background apps were focused on.


----------



## ivanlabrie

its a decent chip, but nothing too special.test the imc and see if it boots with three gigglehurtz ram with real loose timings. if it does at least you can get some boints with it. id keep it as a backup...or sell it to dmanstasiu cause hes a good fella


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Put some CLU and you will see a major drop. Went from noctua on the die to CLU and I got a 25'c drop!


Yeah I'm starting to think marvels here.
I might be, if not mistaken, one of the few with a reported 35c drop.
If what you and others say is true FOR MY CHIP - then I'm already at -10c....another 20-25c - will be ridiculous. Might just freeze itself whilst it is at it (no don;t get any LN2 ideas now! haha)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If I delid this second chip, is there a market for my first one? What is a perfectly functioning 3770k that has been delidded, lapped, can do [email protected], [email protected], 4.8 at something around 1.41v, worth? Anything, or just keep it on the shelf just in case?


That's quite good in fact!
Question is what would be the price of it.
Also your market might be "limited" as it is "tampered with"

Definitely not worth leaving on the shelf!
I'll take it off you for free hehe








No but seriously - you coulds ell it - but the price of it, might not be worth selling (as realistically people might be cautious buying a lapped, tampered, de-lidded chip) - with that said, some others might see it as a huge gain, as all the "ground work" (lol pun intended with grounding) is already done!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Cores 1-2 can be hottest for many reasons. They are in the middle so maybe they get heated by the stuff around them. Some cores actually get more of a workload, or a higher/lower workload (you might think p95 or ibt is p95/ibt balanced load on all cores, buts even if your increase priority on p95, it's not - background applications is running on some of the cores, which may make them run cooler, or hotter, than the cores taking a full load). I used to think on an old quadcore that 2 of the cores were faster (they would complete more fft passes in 15 minutes in p95, after 24 hours they would be a good couple fft lengths ahead), but then I realized that those two cores were where background apps were focused on.


Great info right there +rep to you! (not enough people rep these days) - Yeah I didn't damage the IMC on the die - but possibly the IMC "connection" on the PCB.
What is interesting to note is that clamping force plays a huge role here. Not for temps, but for when you screw up like I did - My friend thinks that it is a grounding issue - which explains why the paper worked better than nothing - and more so why the PC didn't boot AT ALL, before Valguar instructed me to ground my PSU.
It all makes sense.
Also the paper, as said by my friend can hold static - which, in that position is extremely dangerous - thus why he said coating it with lacquer might be a better idea than paper. Again I agree with him - just the fan that I don't want to put masking tape over the die.
So what was suggested here, was my trail of thought - spray it somewhere, then dab it on.

Who knows...I might be able to get a perfect chip if I do all of this.


----------



## Swag

Does anyone know if an epoxy adhesive gets bad in the cold and basically stops being an adhesive?

Also, I just received the CPU I sent Intel and 2 capacitors on the bottom were chipped off, the IHS looks like they use a screwdriver to scrape it...


----------



## megawatz

I can't convince myself to get the CLP or the CLU, I don't see much in a point if my max temps reach 82c using IBT on air.

It never touches about 65c on gaming/prime95/folding.

I just don't see a point in it seeing that I already have a decently crappy chip.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> My point is that I don't see anyone else with a core0 of 4c hotter than core1. Before delid he had relatively normal distribution.


My core 0 and 3 are always the hottest which would kind of make sense to me given that the IMC is above core 0 and the GPU below core 3. I haven't really paid attention to what others' are like.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone know if an epoxy adhesive gets bad in the cold and basically stops being an adhesive?
> 
> Also, I just received the CPU I sent Intel and 2 capacitors on the bottom were chipped off, the IHS looks like they use a screwdriver to scrape it...


Complain - and get it replaced ASAP. You have ALL THE RIGHTS here. More so take a picture of the IHS again - and if they say "we couldn't read the IHS" tell them to give you an email and that you send them your picture. Also possibly ask them fi they were god damn glasses whilst looking at it, as if they weren't they might need some eye tests.
If I OVER THE INTERNET can read your IHS - Intel bloody well can too. Lame ass excuse from intel here.

Btw - small dot of CLU on the die and that's it right - no spreading or anything required? I plan on doing that tomorrow.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I can't convince myself to get the CLP or the CLU, I don't see much in a point if my max temps reach 82c using IBT on air.
> 
> It never touches about 65c on gaming/prime95/folding.
> 
> I just don't see a point in it seeing that I already have a decently crappy chip.


I'll report CLU temps for you tomorrow.
So far the temps I'm getting folding/P95 are quite better than stock lol (I got MX2 on the die and on IHS)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If I delid this second chip, is there a market for my first one? What is a perfectly functioning 3770k that has been delidded, lapped, can do [email protected], [email protected], 4.8 at something around 1.41v, worth? Anything, or just keep it on the shelf just in case?


Lol you got the fever dude!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone know if an epoxy adhesive gets bad in the cold and basically stops being an adhesive?
> 
> Also, I just received the CPU I sent Intel and 2 capacitors on the bottom were chipped off, the IHS looks like they use a screwdriver to scrape it...


Construction epoxy has a pretty impressive temp range. Not sure about the stuff you're planning on using but I bet its fine up to -20C


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I can't convince myself to get the CLP or the CLU, I don't see much in a point if my max temps reach 82c using IBT on air.
> 
> It never touches about 65c on gaming/prime95/folding.
> 
> I just don't see a point in it seeing that I already have a decently crappy chip.


why did u delid your chip and not put coolabs pro/ultra? i think that is the whole point of deliding its proven to be the best TIM for what we are doing.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> My core 0 and 3 are always the hottest which would kind of make sense to me given that the IMC is above core 0 and the GPU below core 3. I haven't really paid attention to what others' are like.


Us lowly cretins can only dream of doing 5.0 with a max temp of 53c. That is so far beyond all of my testing with three 3770k chips that I can't really relate. People with off the shelf cooling almost always have higher middle core temps.


----------



## justanoldman

TD,
A very tiny dot of Ultra is all you need on the die, but you have to use the included brush to "paint" it on. Some here have also said you should put a thin layer on the underside of the ihs as well. Watch the video:
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/

I would not use it between your ihs and cooler until you are sure you will leave it there for awhile. It is not easy to clean and basically permanently stains everything.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone know if an epoxy adhesive gets bad in the cold and basically stops being an adhesive?
> 
> Also, I just received the CPU I sent Intel and 2 capacitors on the bottom were chipped off, the IHS looks like they use a screwdriver to scrape it...
> 
> 
> 
> Complain - and get it replaced ASAP. You have ALL THE RIGHTS here. More so take a picture of the IHS again - and if they say "we couldn't read the IHS" tell them to give you an email and that you send them your picture. Also possibly ask them fi they were god damn glasses whilst looking at it, as if they weren't they might need some eye tests.
> If I OVER THE INTERNET can read your IHS - Intel bloody well can too. Lame ass excuse from intel here.
> 
> Btw - small dot of CLU on the die and that's it right - no spreading or anything required? I plan on doing that tomorrow.
Click to expand...

Yea, and here is a picture of what they did to little Swag.










Spoiler: DAMN INTEL!







Also @stickg1, what do you think of this construction epoxy?
http://lepageproducts.com/ProductDetail.aspx?pid=71

@TD
You really need to spread that CLU because it won't spread by itself!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Well it's definitely worth something. That's not a bad chip. I'd be interested, depending on the price


Ok then, you have just talked me into delidding my second chip.










Just kidding, I feel I have to try with this second chip anyway. I will let you know if it survives the procedure.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Also @stickg1, what do you think of this construction epoxy?
> http://lepageproducts.com/ProductDetail.aspx?pid=71
> 
> @TD
> You really need to spread that CLU because it won't spread by itself!


Never used that before. I use this on my chips and it works fine.

http://www.loctiteproducts.com/p/epxy_5min/technical-data/Loctite-Epoxy-Instant-Mix-5-Minute.htm

It says it has a flash point of 66C and service temp of -23C to 50C, I don't think the PCB gets nearly as hot as the cores so that should be fine. My IHS's that I use it on are still stuck after heavy use.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ah ok...then in that case I'm not going to apply any CLU to the die or underneath the IHS - simply as I don't want it staining or leaving any marks, whilst I do my tests.
I will ONLY use CLU as the final straw for my testing - and potential RMA

EDIT:
Posted my RAM for sale...let's see if I can just forget about this 16GB issue


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Us lowly cretins can only dream of doing 5.0 with a max temp of 53c. That is so far beyond all of my testing with three 3770k chips that I can't really relate. People with off the shelf cooling almost always have higher middle core temps.


Naah, I'm just a noob. I guess I got lucky with my chip. What I'm discovering though is that Ivybridge likes two things, cooling, and VCore. The rest of the settings I leave on default, but I'm not sure about 5GHz and beyond, I could use some help. I have good temps, but I just can't seem to get it stable where I can run prime95 for say 12hrs.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Also @stickg1, what do you think of this construction epoxy?
> http://lepageproducts.com/ProductDetail.aspx?pid=71


@swag, If you are looking for something to seal the IHS to the PCB, I have used Permatex Black Silicone Adhesive and it works pretty good. I've even used it with temps as low as 0C. As far as I can tell it seems to be very similar to what Intel uses. It can be a bit messy if you use too much, but wipes up pretty easily before it cures. I found it in the automotive section at WalMart. Less than $4. The photos show a chip that I've used it on and re-opened. EDIT: I would caution against using the clear or white silicon that you would use for your bathroom because that can react with certain metals, but the black Permatex seems to be OK.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



 



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> TD,
> I would not use it between your ihs and cooler until you are sure you will leave it there for awhile. It is not easy to clean and basically permanently stains everything.


If you go on Coolaboratories web site, they say to use metal polish to remove CLP. I had some Weiman metal polish in the house, so I tried it and it works. I've used it on the die itself, the IHS, and my waterblock. I remove any polish residue with IPA. I also have some Indigo Xtreme Clean that I use for the final preparation before applying TIM.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Mike +rep for those pics!
I might want to get some of that glue....does it hold really strongly? I must consider glues to buy.
I'm in the UK though...


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I can't convince myself to get the CLP or the CLU, I don't see much in a point if my max temps reach 82c using IBT on air.
> 
> It never touches about 65c on gaming/prime95/folding.
> 
> I just don't see a point in it seeing that I already have a decently crappy chip.
> 
> 
> 
> why did u delid your chip and not put coolabs pro/ultra? i think that is the whole point of deliding its proven to be the best TIM for what we are doing.
Click to expand...

I kinda agree with the guy. CLU/CLP is great but at $15+ it's a little too expensive. Would rather put that money towards something else honestly. I mean considering you can get a high end ceramique like masscool for under $4 for 1.5g.

Makes a nice birthday gift to ask for though. bday is coming up and people asking me what i want. i dont really want anything. i guess i could ask for clu but eh.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I kinda agree with the guy. CLU/CLP is great but at $15+ it's a little too expensive. Would rather put that money towards something else honestly. I mean considering you can get a high end ceramique like masscool for under $4 for 1.5g.
> 
> Makes a nice birthday gift to ask for though. bday is coming up and people asking me what i want. i dont really want anything. i guess i could ask for clu but eh.


Please take Notice to Upper right 5.25 bay cover? 14$ for 30c temp drops vs 4$ for 10c temp drops id think you would have to be rather stupid to not pay an extra 10$ for 20C?
If you want to save a buck for less performance these guys feel the same way... http://www.overclock.net/t/1318995/official-fx-8320-fx-8350-vishera-owners-club/0_20


----------



## Belial

ah i took a ton of screenshots in the uefi but didnt realize i had to have a usb drive stuck in for them to save ;/


----------



## Belial

Well because im running p95 for now, been running a good 6+ hours now (4.6ghz/1.375vcore, but with pwm phase at extreme performance, vcore voltage response at fast, and llc at extreme, seems to help slightly with stability, hopefully this will be stable where 4.6/1.4v at just turbo llc wasn't at the 19th hour), i got these paint pics of my build.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






memory multi is 13.33 woops


forgot few things - set auto for dram timing selectable (default), and pretty sure profile vtt is 1.05, not 1.30. i know my vtt is always at ~1.06







As for other bios settings, I disabled atheros lan (lan #1 or whatever, not the pch lan), disabled every single sata, marvel sata controller, except sata port 0 (for my single ssd). Disabled via 1394. Enabled rapid start. 90*C warning temp (wow im really surprised these boards dont have a shutdown temp... even my $30 biostar did). Disabled igpu, initialize to peg (graphics card). i think thats it. ram timings read as 9/9/9/24 on the left side and are clearly 9/9/9/24 and all (don't think they'd be the problem given the ram i have, btw when i ran 2133mhz apparently they didnt use the xmp timings, just 9/9/9etc, the board is fine with 1866/cl7/1.65v but not 2133/cl7/1.65v but w/e, i'll worry about that later im pretty sure ram isnt the problem here).


----------



## King4x4

I paid $35 for my CLU since I shipped it urgent.... BEST $35 I PAID PERFORMANCE WISE.


----------



## Belial

ah okay where's the cheapest place to get clu i'll get it for my bday -_-
suppose i can ask my gf for paracord, but gotta see if it voids rma or not (just sleeving the last 6 inches of it, i want it to be the stock full cable sleeve where it goes from psu to behind the mobo panel, and only single wire paracord sleeve where it connects).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I can't convince myself to get the CLP or the CLU, I don't see much in a point if my max temps reach 82c using IBT on air.
> 
> It never touches about 65c on gaming/prime95/folding.
> 
> I just don't see a point in it seeing that I already have a decently crappy chip.


if your happy with the results you have now, then dont change it








but like the others say, thats the best money theyve spent in pursuit of performance, temp wise..

AS5 on the die, 80C hottest core


Liquid Pro on the die, 55C hottest core


i like low temps, even if i would have a "crappy" chip, lower temps is always better


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I can't convince myself to get the CLP or the CLU, I don't see much in a point if my max temps reach 82c using IBT on air.
> 
> It never touches about 65c on gaming/prime95/folding.
> 
> I just don't see a point in it seeing that I already have a decently crappy chip.
> 
> 
> 
> if your happy with the results you have now, then dont change it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but like the others say, thats the best money theyve spent in pursuit of performance, temp wise..
> 
> AS5 on the die, 80C hottest core
> 
> 
> Liquid Pro on the die, 55C hottest core
> 
> 
> i like low temps, even if i would have a "crappy" chip, lower temps is always better
Click to expand...

That's not really fair to compare CLP to AS5. I'd question how awesome CLP really is if you compare it to a modern, relevant paste. Comparing to AS5 is like saying "ivy bridge is the best chip I bought, you should definitely buy it over your sandy bridge, check out these before and after benchmarks I have of my ivy bridge against a pentium 2"

I wonder if something better than CLU/Indigo and PK3/masscool is out. The nature of TIMs, you dont hear about them until they become irrelevant (as5, clp). I think I'm gonna have to get some CLU - not because I want to, but because if I don't ask for something, my aunt will buy me another hideous sweater. I'll be sure to do a small fft test if/when i get it to really see how great it is (honestly I do expect a significant difference and yea i actually do think its a good value, a drop of 10*C over a high end modern paste like pk-3 maybe, i mean you'd pay premium $60+ for that kind of drop on just a heatsink upgrade).


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> That's not really fair to compare CLP to AS5. I'd question how awesome CLP really is if you compare it to a modern, relevant paste. Comparing to AS5 is like saying "ivy bridge is the best chip I bought, you should definitely buy it over your sandy bridge, check out these before and after benchmarks I have of my ivy bridge against a pentium 2"
> 
> I wonder if something better than CLU/Indigo and PK3/masscool is out. The nature of TIMs, you dont hear about them until they become irrelevant (as5, clp). I think I'm gonna have to get some CLU - not because I want to, but because if I don't ask for something, my aunt will buy me another hideous sweater. I'll be sure to do a small fft test if/when i get it to really see how great it is (honestly I do expect a significant difference and yea i actually do think its a good value, a drop of 10*C over a high end modern paste like pk-3 maybe, i mean you'd pay premium $60+ for that kind of drop on just a heatsink upgrade).


i think in this case it does, if i remember well, megawatz used AS5 also,
nothing wrong with my comparison that way









i think its more "wrong' to do a comparison like yours ...lol

"ivy bridge is the best chip I bought, you should definitely buy it over your sandy bridge,
check out these before and after benchmarks I have of my ivy bridge against a pentium 2"

ivy against a pentium 2 ...haha


----------



## BaK2BaK

Did it!









(Second razor helped for the final part getting apart the IHS)
Quote:


> OCN name:BaK2BaK
> CPU: i5 3570K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: 38°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2680790


Voltage is 1.275 in BIOS (Asrock Z77E-UTX), no offset, but CPU-Z shows 1.296V.
So I guess I am far from a golden chip.

Before:




Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Die contact: good enough, no need for lapping the inner side of the IHS:


Lapping (wet): from 600, 800, 1200, 2000, to 3000 sand paper grain size:


Mirror effect is here, little blurred area on the low right (see my avatar) but it will do!









IHS/NH-C14 contact after lapping:

Not as perfect as would have liked, was expecting a nice red square but I will live with it. Don't want to lap the base of the Nh-C14...

I then used the little brush that comes with CLU for both applying CLP and CLU.
It leaves some traces as you can see, so I guess it works but is not the perfect tool.

CLP on the die (and inner IHS):


CLU ont he IHS (and NH-C14):




After delidding and lapping:


Before and after ambient T° were almost identical, maybe a little warmer for the 2nd test (~19°C).
Min temps are colder on the 2nd test because I run the it at the first boot, while last time I did several tests/reboots before making the screenshot.
Core #2 is still the hottest, but max temp droped down from 98°C to 60°C: minus 38°C!!! IMPRESSIVE!!!








Core #1 is still the coolest, max temp droped down from 86°C to 52°C. So the max diff between core #1 and #2 is reduced from 12°C to 8°C. Was expecting a better result here, like a 3-4°C diff. I am using the iGPU, dunno... What do you guys think?

I did all the job on a wood table without being grounded, touching a metallic heater from time to time though.
Those antistatic bracelets looks so short I didn't want to be bothered wearing one (plus I had to wait 1 week to get one)
For those using one, where do you attached it?

Unlike many other hunting for speed, I am happy with 4.5GHz and did delid to reduce temps and be able to run the cooler at 9v or even 7V for extra silence.
Will see if I still have room for some extra GHz and staying silent though


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Did it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Second razor helped for the final part getting apart the IHS)
> Voltage is 1.275 in BIOS (Asrock Z77E-UTX), no offset, but CPU-Z shows 1.296V.
> So I guess I am far from a golden chip.
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Die contact: good enough, no need for lapping the inner side of the IHS:
> 
> 
> Lapping (wet): from 600, 800, 1200, 2000, to 3000 sand paper grain size:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mirror effect is here, little blurred area on the low right (see my avatar) but it will do!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IHS/NH-C14 contact after lapping:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not as perfect as would have liked, was expecting a nice red square but I will live with it. Don't want to lap the base of the Nh-C14...
> 
> I then used the little brush that comes with CLU for both applying CLP and CLU.
> It leaves some traces as you can see, so I guess it works but is not the perfect tool.
> 
> CLP on the die (and inner IHS):
> 
> 
> CLU ont he IHS (and NH-C14):
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After delidding and lapping:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before and after ambient T° were almost identical, maybe a little warmer for the 2nd test (~19°C).
> Min temps are colder on the 2nd test because I run the it at the first boot, while last time I did several tests/reboots before making the screenshot.
> Core #2 is still the hottest, but max temp droped down from 98°C to 60°C: minus 38°C!!! IMPRESSIVE!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Core #1 is still the coolest, max temp droped down from 86°C to 52°C. So the max diff between core #1 and #2 is reduced from 12°C to 8°C. Was expecting a better result here, like a 3-4°C diff. I am using the iGPU, dunno... What do you guys think?
> 
> I did all the job on a wood table without being grounded, touching a metallic heater from time to time though.
> Those antistatic bracelets looks so short I didn't want to be bothered wearing one (plus I had to wait 1 week to get one)
> For those using one, where do you attached it?
> 
> Unlike many other hunting for speed, I am happy with 4.5GHz and did delid to reduce temps and be able to run the cooler at 9v or even 7V for extra silence.
> Will see if I still have room for some extra GHz and staying silent though


Gratz BaK2BaK, glad it all went well for ya









"minus 38°C!!! IMPRESSIVE!!!







"

that is impressive..very nice, love that smily you used ...lol


----------



## nagle3092

So after about a week of regular use, and some folding I have settled on 4.8ghz at 1.38v (measured with multimeter) for my 24/7 oc. Here is a temp shot.


----------



## King4x4

For those who say CLU is excessive...



In my country the custom duties are crazy.... They confiscated one order of CLU and I ordered another... this one got through!


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> For those who say CLU is excessive...


Wow, how many rigs are you going to build with all those?! Thousends?
I needed so little for mine, syringe looks like it is unused!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> For those who say CLU is excessive...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In my country the custom duties are crazy.... They confiscated one order of CLU and I ordered another... this one got through!


they really confiscated it? ..like you never got any of the order?
that would be crazy..


----------



## justanoldman

After you guys paint the die with CLU, do you put any on the inside of the ihs also? Do you use it on top of your ihs, and do you coat the cooler with it too?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> After you guys paint the die with CLU, do you put any on the inside of the ihs also? Do you use it on top of your ihs, and do you coat the cooler with it too?


I put on DIE, inside IHS, top of IHS and on the Cooler - Very very very small amount though.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> I did all the job on a wood table without being grounded, touching a metallic heater from time to time though.
> Those antistatic bracelets looks so short I didn't want to be bothered wearing one (plus I had to wait 1 week to get one)
> For those using one, where do you attached it?


This is the one I use. I got it from Radio Shack here in the US, but you can find them at most electronics stores or online. I plug mine into the ground receptacle of my power strip or wall outlet. Building codes may vary, from region to region, so be sure your ground point is tied to earth. It also comes with an alligator clip so you can also clip it onto any earth ground point. You can attach the cord to the mat that comes with it, so you have a nice grounded work area to set your chips or circuit boards on. The ground cord is about 10 ft long and wrist strap about 8ft. I can walk all the way across the room with it detached from the mat while still being grounded. I always wear a wrist strap. Even small imperceptible static discharges can cause microscopic pitting within the substrates causing damage over time.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> This is the one I use. I got it from Radio Shack here in the US, but you can find them at most electronics stores or online. I plug mine into the ground receptacle of my power strip or wall outlet. Building codes may vary, from region to region, so be sure your ground point is tied to earth. It also comes with an alligator clip so you can also clip it onto any earth ground point. You can attach the cord to the mat that comes with it, so you have a nice grounded work area to set your chips or circuit boards on. The ground cord is about 10 ft long and wrist strap about 8ft. I can walk all the way across the room with it detached from the mat while still being grounded. I always wear a wrist strap. Even small imperceptible static discharges can cause microscopic pitting within the substrates causing damage over time.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Cool, thx a lot +rep
I hope I can find a similar kit here, looks very pro!
Till now I've only seen the simple ones having an alligator clip only.
Pics are very talkative, hope I didn't damage anything...


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mike +rep for those pics!
> I might want to get some of that glue....does it hold really strongly? I must consider glues to buy.
> I'm in the UK though...


Yes it is very strong. When I first delidded my chip, I used CLP on the top on the die and underside of the IHS. I then sealed the IHS to the PCB with a very thin bead of Permatex, makeing sure to leave a gap at one end so the chip can "breath". I used my chip this way for about three weeks, with several remounts, testing various TIMS, before deciding to cut it open and go "direct die" mount. I used a razor to cut it open again. The stuff looks and feels almost identical to the stuff Intel uses. Your auto supply store might sell something similar. Check with them to make sure it is safe to use on metal.


----------



## justanoldman

MikeG,
How did you get your pcb so clean? Your pic doesn't show any glue residue.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> After you guys paint the die with CLU, do you put any on the inside of the ihs also? Do you use it on top of your ihs, and do you coat the cooler with it too?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> I put on DIE, inside IHS, top of IHS and on the Cooler - Very very very small amount though.


same here, did all sides with thin layers,
but most just do 1 side, on the die, and on the ihs.,
both work well if you apply is good..

omg, maybe i should buy me a wrist strap too after looking at these pics..dang..

i had to use them back then for work, but never used one at home ..lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> same here, did all sides with thin layers,
> but most just do 1 side, on the die, and on the ihs.,
> both work well if you apply is good..


How hard is it to clean CLU off the die and back of the IHS?
As I don't want to "damage" it in case I need to get it off completely.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> How hard is it to clean CLU off the die and back of the IHS?
> As I don't want to "damage" it in case I need to get it off completely.


i cant say really, im using liquid pro, and i havent cleaned mine yet,
im trying to have it under there for 5-6 months, then take it apart,
and see how i do with cleaning it all, if its that hard to clean like others say,
but some here said it wasnt that hard to clean, idk TD sorry








next month i have the money to buy some ultra, then i know more about the cleaning part,
and pro is even harder to clean the ultra as i understand

lol, was just thinking, gallium melts when you hold it in your hand,
maybe you can do the same with the ihs, and get it of that way easy


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> How hard is it to clean CLU off the die and back of the IHS?
> As I don't want to "damage" it in case I need to get it off completely.


Cleaning the die is really easy, it is the metal parts that get stained. MikeG said that metal polish will take care of the stains. I am going to try that in the next couple days and post before and after pics to see what happens.

I am not sure I understand why it matters if the inside of the IHS is a little stained, it is not like we have a warrantee anymore after delidding.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Cleaning the die is really easy, it is the metal parts that get stained. MikeG said that metal polish will take care of the stains. I am going to try that in the next couple days and post before and after pics to see what happens.
> 
> I am not sure I understand why it matters if the inside of the IHS is a little stained, it is not like we have a warrantee anymore after delidding.


That's very true!
Ok thanks a lot again for the response bro!


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> The joys of overclocking....my corsair AX860i power supply shut down on me again. I was running some stability testing using 3DMark Vantage and when It reached the last test, it just shut down with a red light on the power supply. I don't know if it is related to the direct die mod that I did yesterday or not. The power supply comes with a USB dongle and some monitoring software, so I want to try that first before tearing down my rig. Just one problem though, the Corsair USB dongle plugs into the USB header on the motherboard, so if the power supply shuts down, how am I supposed to monitor it? It is not like they gave me a USB plug that I can connect to my laptop and monitor it that way. Anyway, I will download the software and have a go.


GOOD NEWS!!! My power supply shutdown had nothing to do with overclocking, delidding, or direct die. I was flushing my water loop this morning with my power supply in a stand alone configuration, when my power supply shut down with a red fault light. My power supply is not currently connected to my motherboard at all. I have my power supply jumperd and the only connection to my power supply is the 12V to my D5 pump. Now the problem is to determine whether it is the pump or the power supply. Well, I am extremely happy this has nothing to do with my overclock settings, but am disappointed however, because the Corsair AX860I 80Plus Platinum is a very expensive power supply, and so is the XSPC D5 kit, both of which are only 1 month old.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> For those who say CLU is excessive...
> 
> 
> 
> In my country the custom duties are crazy.... They confiscated one order of CLU and I ordered another... this one got through!


Thank you for that . We have the same problem here in SA with customs and the post office. With all my re-orders and replacements sent. I have 3 CLP and 3 CLU unused on hand........ your collection made me feel ok about my lot.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> MikeG,
> How did you get your pcb so clean? Your pic doesn't show any glue residue.












I used metal cleaner to clean the CLP off the die. I used the side of a credit card to scrape the black adhesive, and then a cotton swab and IPA on the die and PCB.


----------



## jacksonn24

i have 3770k that can boot into windows 5ghz at 1.4 and llc extreme cpz-u says 1.38v. not stable but any benefit to deliding? im running ek loop?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jacksonn24*
> 
> i have 3770k that can boot into windows 5ghz at 1.4 and llc extreme cpz-u says 1.38v. not stable but any benefit to deliding? im running ek loop?


delidding can give you the temperature headroom you need to be able to run very high oc's, like 5.0ghz,
if vcore permits that is









this is IBT 5.0ghz, after delid

84C hottest core, running a simple aircooler, yours should do much better


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Who here has scratched the PCB, and got everything running fine?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Who here has scratched the PCB, and got everything running fine?


I have seen posts where cpu pcb's have been scratched and worked just fine, I believe it depends where you scratch it and how badly, you can get lucky and not damage it. I had no scratches though.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have seen posts where cpu pcb's have been scratched and worked just fine, I believe it depends where you scratch it and how badly, you can get lucky and not damage it. I had no scratches though.


Hm ok - Im just curious if people had grounding issues.
I just want to run 8GB dual channel, rather than single channel.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> That's not really fair to compare CLP to AS5. I'd question how awesome CLP really is if you compare it to a modern, relevant paste. Comparing to AS5 is like saying "ivy bridge is the best chip I bought, you should definitely buy it over your sandy bridge, check out these before and after benchmarks I have of my ivy bridge against a pentium 2"
> 
> I wonder if something better than CLU/Indigo and PK3/masscool is out. The nature of TIMs, you dont hear about them until they become irrelevant (as5, clp). I think I'm gonna have to get some CLU - not because I want to, but because if I don't ask for something, my aunt will buy me another hideous sweater. I'll be sure to do a small fft test if/when i get it to really see how great it is (honestly I do expect a significant difference and yea i actually do think its a good value, a drop of 10*C over a high end modern paste like pk-3 maybe, i mean you'd pay premium $60+ for that kind of drop on just a heatsink upgrade).
> 
> 
> 
> i think in this case it does, if i remember well, megawatz used AS5 also,
> nothing wrong with my comparison that way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i think its more "wrong' to do a comparison like yours ...lol
> 
> "ivy bridge is the best chip I bought, you should definitely buy it over your sandy bridge,
> check out these before and after benchmarks I have of my ivy bridge against a pentium 2"
> 
> ivy against a pentium 2 ...haha
Click to expand...

didnt realize he used as5.


----------



## Airrick10

So I was so close to delidding this weekend but, I read what happened to TD so I decided to maybe wait a bit







Still nervous about something bad happening to my chip and not working right after delidding. I have all the stuff ready...I had even cleaned my table and had turned off my pc but I had forgotten to run the IBT at 4.5Ghz so I did that and that's when I read TD was finally delidding and decided to see how it went for him. So anyways...yesterday I decided to apply some Ultra to my cpu and heatsink and the application process was pretty simple with the brush.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> So I was so close to delidding this weekend but, I read what happened to TD so I decided to maybe wait a bit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still nervous about something bad happening to my chip and not working right after delidding. I have all the stuff ready...I had even cleaned my table and had turned off my pc but I had forgotten to run the IBT at 4.5Ghz so I did that and that's when I read TD was finally delidding and decided to see how it went for him. So anyways...yesterday I decided to apply some Ultra to my cpu and heatsink and the application process was pretty simple with the brush.


yea, sometimes a delid can go wrong..true that..
but theres more delids go right, then go wrong..thats another fact.








we learn from mistakes, thats one reason we gathered all the info
in this thread, to help people who want to delid,
and guide them through the process if needed..
do you have a old pentium to practice on first maybe?


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, sometimes a delid can go wrong..true that..
> but theres more delids go right, then go wrong..thats another fact.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> we learn from mistakes, thats one reason we gathered all the info
> in this thread, to help people who want to delid,
> and guide them through the process if needed..
> do you have a old pentium to practice on first maybe?


True true VonDutch....I'll see if I decide to delid later on in a week or two...there have been very impressive results and that encourages me to go for it! Unfortunately I had always been AMD so no previous intel chips on hand to practice on lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> True true VonDutch....I'll see if I decide to go for it later on in a week or two...there have been very impressive results and that encourages me to go for it! Unfortunately I had always been AMD so no previous intel chips on hand to practice on lol


lol..i came from amd too, this is my first intel chip ever








and i love it hehe...
but, hey i was just looking in my closet, i still have 3 old pentiums laying around from my delid project with my kids,
i dont think im gonna use them anymore..
i could send you one if you like, not sure what it will cost to send it _all_ the way over there tho ..lol


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> lol..i came from amd too, this is my first intel chip ever
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i love it hehe...
> but, hey i was just looking in my closet, i still have 3 old pentiums laying around from my delid project with my kids,
> i dont think im gonna use them anymore..
> i could send you one if you like, not sure what it will cost to send it _all_ the way over there tho ..lol


Thanks I appreciate it VonDutch! lol Yeah it's very far away.... it's ok I'm sure I'll do ok like many other 1st time delidders here!


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> didnt realize he used as5.


I did, and it's not as bad as it seems. Coming down to it and having AS5 on both the IHS and on the die, I saw about a 5-6c temp drop. I was so skeptical about it at first, but like I stated earlier, I RARELY hit 65c on air with a 100% load. Only time I go above that is IBT, which reaches 82c, but not for long.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Did it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Second razor helped for the final part getting apart the IHS)
> Voltage is 1.275 in BIOS (Asrock Z77E-UTX), no offset, but CPU-Z shows 1.296V.
> So I guess I am far from a golden chip.
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Die contact: good enough, no need for lapping the inner side of the IHS:
> 
> 
> Lapping (wet): from 600, 800, 1200, 2000, to 3000 sand paper grain size:
> 
> 
> Mirror effect is here, little blurred area on the low right (see my avatar) but it will do!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IHS/NH-C14 contact after lapping:
> 
> Not as perfect as would have liked, was expecting a nice red square but I will live with it. Don't want to lap the base of the Nh-C14...
> 
> I then used the little brush that comes with CLU for both applying CLP and CLU.
> It leaves some traces as you can see, so I guess it works but is not the perfect tool.
> 
> CLP on the die (and inner IHS):
> 
> 
> CLU ont he IHS (and NH-C14):
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After delidding and lapping:
> 
> 
> Before and after ambient T° were almost identical, maybe a little warmer for the 2nd test (~19°C).
> Min temps are colder on the 2nd test because I run the it at the first boot, while last time I did several tests/reboots before making the screenshot.
> Core #2 is still the hottest, but max temp droped down from 98°C to 60°C: minus 38°C!!! IMPRESSIVE!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Core #1 is still the coolest, max temp droped down from 86°C to 52°C. So the max diff between core #1 and #2 is reduced from 12°C to 8°C. Was expecting a better result here, like a 3-4°C diff. I am using the iGPU, dunno... What do you guys think?
> 
> I did all the job on a wood table without being grounded, touching a metallic heater from time to time though.
> Those antistatic bracelets looks so short I didn't want to be bothered wearing one (plus I had to wait 1 week to get one)
> For those using one, where do you attached it?
> 
> Unlike many other hunting for speed, I am happy with 4.5GHz and did delid to reduce temps and be able to run the cooler at 9v or even 7V for extra silence.
> Will see if I still have room for some extra GHz and staying silent though


Your in!







Now slap that Awesome Sig of ours on!

Ugh.. im still sick lol... all i wanna do is sleep and puke...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ok guys, an update.
My friend who is an engineer can and had a look...man that scratch is extremely small....but with microscopic things...anything can go wrong.
Now the thing is the scratch does pass on a circuit...but god it is on the outer edge that one wouldn't think anything could happen. We tried a lot of things: ihs flipped the other way, double paper, paper on the other little bit, thermal paste on circuit breaks. Nothing really helped.I got rid of the paper all together, and it works with only channel 3 and 4. I can't get hold of another cpu, so I'm going to try clu now and then probably rma it. I need glue help though...


----------



## chronicfx

Holy cow valguar. I didn't realize your thread hit 10,000 posts. You should get a couple overclock flames for that


----------



## Totally Dubbed

hahahahahahha CLU temps....hahahahahahahaha
Sorry I'll post IBT results in a bit.
I'm currently on the 3rd flop max temp 58c.
Remember Before de-lid was 92c
With MX2 it was around 82c

That's 34c....let me not get high hopes but LOL
I also got very nice pictures of the CLU application - what I did...as it was being a pain to come out - I put CLU on the BRUSH, then brushed it on.
Brushing on CLU took as long as de-lidding the i7


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Holy cow valguar. I didn't realize your thread hit 10,000 posts. You should get a couple overclock flames for that


Thanks, and now we already hit 11,000 posts.









Thanks for all the participation guys!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hahahahahahha CLU temps....hahahahahahahaha
> Sorry I'll post IBT results in a bit.
> I'm currently on the 3rd flop max temp 58c.
> Remember Before de-lid was 92c
> With MX2 it was around 82c
> 
> That's 34c....let me not get high hopes but LOL
> I also got very nice pictures of the CLU application - what I did...as it was being a pain to come out - I put CLU on the BRUSH, then brushed it on.
> Brushing on CLU took as long as de-lidding the i7


holy cow.... keep us informed dude those are wonderful results.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thanks, and now we already hit 11,000 posts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for all the participation guys!
> holy cow.... keep us informed dude those are wonderful results.


Man it isn't fair on my case fans nor my SP120's on my antec...they aren't even RAMPING UP hahaha! (ramp starts at 70c).
Which is another thing de-lidding does - reduce noise:
RPM before de-lidding: 1200RPM on SP120's and around 1100RPM on AF140's
RPM after de-lidding with CLU: 800-900RPM on SP120's and around 800 RPM on AF140's

It is a beast and is super quiet...
Going to play around with RAM again....who knows this just might be my luck. (I just want dual channel 8GB and I'm happy







)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Man it isn't fair on my case fans nor my SP120's on my antec...they aren't even RAMPING UP hahaha! (ramp starts at 70c).
> Which is another thing de-lidding does - reduce noise:
> RPM before de-lidding: 1200RPM on SP120's and around 1100RPM on AF140's
> RPM after de-lidding with CLU: 800-900RPM on SP120's and around 800 RPM on AF140's
> 
> It is a beast and is super quiet...
> Going to play around with RAM again....who knows this just might be my luck. (I just want dual channel 8GB and I'm happy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Yeah I would play with it a bit and see what you can get. and if you get a dual channel working... dont touch it lol.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I would play with it a bit and see what you can get. and if you get a dual channel working... dont touch it lol.


hmmm If it is too good to be true it probably is...
Interesting here:
now slot 3, 4 together don't work....All I did is sit it up right.

I went into CPUZ and my OC wasn't there - it was at 3.9ghz not 4.5ghz - but my voltage of 1.27v is there...
I've had an idea...I'm going to re-flash the BIOS...who knows!


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hmmm If it is too good to be true it probably is...
> Interesting here:
> now slot 3, 4 together don't work....All I did is sit it up right.
> 
> I went into CPUZ and my OC wasn't there - it was at 3.9ghz not 4.5ghz - but my voltage of 1.27v is there...
> I've had an idea...I'm going to re-flash the BIOS...who knows!


Good Luck! Keep us posted









Those temps are Amazing! I'm so tempted to delid!!!!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Airrick10*
> 
> Good Luck! Keep us posted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those temps are Amazing! I'm so tempted to delid!!!!


I'm tempted to RMA....but then re-de-lid









Whatever you do - be extremely careful on that right hand side.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hmmm If it is too good to be true it probably is...
> Interesting here:
> now slot 3, 4 together don't work....All I did is sit it up right.
> 
> I went into CPUZ and my OC wasn't there - it was at 3.9ghz not 4.5ghz - but my voltage of 1.27v is there...
> I've had an idea...I'm going to re-flash the BIOS...who knows!


sometimes when you cycles boots it resets cmos so just give it another go.


----------



## Airrick10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm tempted to RMA....but then re-de-lid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever you do - be extremely careful on that right hand side.


Ok Thanks for the heads up TD!


----------



## Belial

[email protected] (extreme llc, fast vcore response and extreme perf pwm phase).

On the 25th hour I got 1 error on worker 2 (rounding error). Better than failing at hour 19 i guess, though a failure is a failure. maybe just turning up llc to extreme is an increase in vcore thats why similar results of 1.375 pwm phase at extreme performance, fast vcore voltage response, and extreme llc, vs 1.4v all at auto but turbo on llc.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm going to post my own thread (for my own collection) - about my de-lidding.
Here are my pictures I took today:

*IBT pictures:*


Spoiler: CLU (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra) de-lid max temp: 72c










Spoiler: ARCTIC MX-2 de-lid max temp: 82c









Spoiler: No de-lid max temp: 91c







Rounded temp drop of around 20c: De-lid + CLU over stock, worth it? Yes, but be cautious of that IMC

*CLU application*


Spoiler: Damaged











Extremely small damage as you can see - but made all the difference with the RAM...I can only run slots 3 and 4. Pins on the board are perfectly fine. No paper is used in-between the IHS and PCB. Tried different combinations of RAM and also different mounts (no cooler full pressure vs no cooler with half pressue vs cooler vs cooler at half tightness)

*Cleaning the IHS & PCB & Die:*

I used Arctic Clean - absolutely excellent. I highly suggest it, as it is not only cheap, but also gets rid of CLU that even managed to find itself on my desk. Without the Arctic Clean, I wouldn't have been able to get rid of some CLU residue on my desk and PCB (by the die)!


Spoiler: Clean, mean and unseen!













*CLU on and looking sexy!*

CLU application is extremely easy, but you have to have A LOT OF PATIENCE. It took me a good 20 minutes to do both the under of the IHS and the die. What happened for me: I couldn't get the CLU to come out at a slow and controlled pace - more so when i tried dabbing the syringe on the die, it wouldn't "drop" - so I took my brush, dabbed it into the CLU syrings, and had CLU on the brush instead.
Barely anything was on the brush. I dabbed it once for the die, and dabbed it twice for the under of the IHS. It took a good while applying it on the IHS - but once it gets a "little warm" then it spreads with greater ease!


Spoiler: Pics or it didn't happen!



















*Final application of the CPU on the socket with MX-2 on the IHS itself (small dot method used)*


Spoiler: Y SO SEXY!?













I hope this post will help someone is a few respects:
1. You CAN screw up your CPU with the SLIGHTEST scratch. My friend after seeing it, couldn't believe how small and HOW FAR it was from the die - caused the issue. We both asked ourselves (could it be the board that has shorted out on two slots? I'll have to try, but highly doubt that)
2. Temperatures were 20c better - you can judge how good or bad that is. Personally 20c is enough for the fans not to RAMP up to max 100% load. Meaning I can fold and go to bed in even MORE silence. CLU is a 10c improvement over MX-2, however I'm lead to believe over time MX-2 will = Stock paste. The stock paste IS NOT BAD, just the distance between IHS and die is what makes it bad. In fact if we got rid of the glue, and just had die on IHS with any paste, you would see an improvement. Maybe only by a few Celsius, but still something.
3. Using the dot or line method is recommended for the IHS - I also HIGHLY suggest using something like MX-2 over CLU ON THE IHS - if you ever want those markings to stay in tact.
4. Use CLU on the die and under the IHS - VERY SMALL AMOUNT - you shouldn't even go through more than 1/10th of what's given. If you have used any more - then that's way too much.
5. Take your time, have patience, realise the costs and benefit of de-lidding. I did it out of curiosity and got EXTREMELY unlucky, as the MOST important part of the PCB (right side is the IMC) got scratched. If it was the bottom (iGPU) or a little more on the outer edge, then it wouldn't have mattered.
6. Make sure you are wearing Latex gloves and/or an anti-static wrist band. It is quite safe to deal with the CPU, but better be safe than sorry.
7. De-lid on a SOFT surface - I used my mouse mat - but when placing down the CPU on somewhere, make sure it is a non-static place -> my desk made out of wood and/or on a latex glove.

I have found this experience very interesting and intriguing. Now I know the benefits and costs of de-lidding, first hand.

EDIT:
Here's my thread:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1357638/my-i7-3770k-de-lidding-adventure


----------



## Belial

I really dislike IBT for temp testing, in my experiences it isn't consistent and causes plateaus. I mean it's linpack or whatever, it's like 7 different tests. I mean I always get a fluctuation of up to 10*C in different tests, even different ibt runs. It does make your core hot, or at least hotter then blend, but not hot enough or consistent enough.

I think the best way to test for temps is priority 10/above normal p95 with custom small fft test, min 8 max 8 length. You'll get 100% accurate temps, what you get in 15 minutes is going to be the same as 1 hour as 10 hours, as today or yesterday. I tend to get hotter on fft8 than ibt, and ibt has that plateauing, ie temp graph looks like a stair master.

The important thing when temp testing though, is being consistent. Running a single test. And ibt is not consistent, i mean it's just as consistent as p95 blend, which will give you 70*C on 400+ fft length and then 95*c on 8fft and 60 on like 2000.

Why don't you use CLU on your IHS?

You should try and find your max stable overclock before RMAing by the way. Avoiding the moral quandry of ripping intel off and committing fraud (not to be judgemental, i mean its whatever, look at the os im using lol), if you happen to have a golden chip I'd much rather have that than the dud I currently have which requires over 1.4vcore for just 4.6ghz (wow... 4.5ghz @1.4vcore is basically my max overclock, and i havent even stress tested 4.5, maybe i can only do 4.4!).

Rep, thanks for the pics. I love when people take the time to post so much stuff like you did, definitely repworthy.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I really dislike IBT for temp testing, in my experiences it isn't consistent and causes plateaus. I mean it's linpack or whatever, it's like 7 different tests. I mean I always get a fluctuation of up to 10*C in different tests, even different ibt runs. It does make your core hot, or at least hotter then blend, but not hot enough or consistent enough.
> 
> I think the best way to test for temps is priority 10/above normal p95 with custom small fft test, min 8 max 8 length. You'll get 100% accurate temps, what you get in 15 minutes is going to be the same as 1 hour as 10 hours, as today or yesterday. I tend to get hotter on fft8 than ibt, and ibt has that plateauing, ie temp graph looks like a stair master.
> 
> The important thing when temp testing though, is being consistent. Running a single test. And ibt is not consistent, i mean it's just as consistent as p95 blend, which will give you 70*C on 400+ fft length and then 95*c on 8fft and 60 on like 2000.
> 
> Why don't you use CLU on your IHS?
> 
> You should try and find your max stable overclock before RMAing by the way. Avoiding the moral quandry of ripping intel off and committing fraud (not to be judgemental, i mean its whatever, look at the os im using lol), if you happen to have a golden chip I'd much rather have that than the dud I currently have which requires over 1.4vcore for just 4.6ghz (wow... 4.5ghz @1.4vcore is basically my max overclock, and i havent even stress tested 4.5, maybe i can only do 4.4!).
> 
> Rep, thanks for the pics. I love when people take the time to post so much stuff like you did, definitely repworthy.


First of all - ABSOLUTELY agree about IBT.
That's why I let it fold for a little and then re-ran IBT - thus the HIGHER CLU de-lid temps.
If you really want to know your max temp: prime 95 is child's play. Try [email protected] hehe! I know my temps are better, around 20c better, but that's why I said rounded to 20c.

As for OC'ing: I don't see the need or want to go over 4.5ghz - that was never my intention. My intention was to get LOWER temps whilst folding.
Finally for the voltage, I'm at 1.27v stable 24/7 folding @ 4.5ghz








If you're interested to buy my chip...then that's something else







!

And thanks very much for the rep - check out my thread, you might like it even more, as that's ALL the info and pictures I've ever had for de-lidding all in one place!

PS. I'm in two minds about RMA'ing it. I love my chip and hate fraud (been a recent victim of fraud myself, it isn't pleasant). If ONLY I could run it on dual channel I would be happy. Even in the future if 8GB's don't "cut it" I could easily do 2x 16GB or 2x 8GB

EDIT:
Here's temps after around 20mins folding with BOINC -just goes to show about how I agree of IBT with you. Thing is IBT is the best way to quickly understand your temps. If you realistically want to know - try either what you said: Prime95 for a given amount of hours, or try folding for around 2hrs using [email protected] as that pushed my temps the most.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd keep it and save for a new one, then delid that one if it's a good sample (otherwise return and exchange) with the plastic card after cutting the 4 corners with REALLY good accuracy and a sharp thin razor (if it bends it's better cause you can do an U shape with it and it will only cut through the glue absolutely avoiding the pcb).


----------



## martinhal

TD are you sure your temp and vcore readings a correct ? I get 72 after 6 hours prime and IBT runs at 5 ghz and 1.464 v.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> TD are you sure your temp and vcore readings a correct ? I get 72 after 6 hours prime and IBT runs at 5 ghz and 1.464 v.


Mine are absolutely correct.
I've always questioned my Antec 920 though...


----------



## chann3l

Big update. I got my liquid ultra in the mail and tonight I lapped my ihs and replace the as5 with liquid ultra. Val When you get a chance can you update the cahrt to reflect my new data








On IHS: Liquid ultra
On Die: Liquid ultra
temps all based on IBT max stress after 10 runs at 4.6 ghz 3770k
Temp difference between hottest cores predelid to liquid ultra delid is 22 degrees! huge difference. Heres a ton of picsd of lapping and temps


Super concave

After 600 grit

After 1200 grit

Ultra on the die

Ultra on the IHS

Pre delid hottest core 84

AS5 on the die before almost immediate pump out and stock temps

And the best one, liquid ultra on the die and IHS hottest core 62 degrees !!!!








Thanks everyone for keeping my hopes up on the liquid ultra !!!


----------



## martinhal

^^^^^

Nice job









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mine are absolutely correct.
> I've always questioned my Antec 920 though...


I think you are right . Just done a test at your settings.



But don't go on my temps a member have commented that they are 10 degrees to high for a custom loop


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Custom loop beats any liquid cooler really.
But I've always expected better from my Antec.


----------



## justanoldman

Brief synopsis:
2nd delid done, appears successful, only have AS5 right now so on die and on top of IHS. Minus 11c by the club test method, and with my temp tests minus 14c hottest to hottest core testing using a more realistic actual use scenario with higher multiple and voltage. Basically what Belial said, I always use Prime95 8k, 90% ram for about 10min for my temp tests. Will get Ultra in a couple days and retest.

2nd chip easier to delid because of more glue used by Intel, and that is what caused this chip to have such bad temps pre-delid compared to my first which was harder to delid.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Brief synopsis:
> 2nd delid done, appears successful, only have AS5 right now so on die and on top of IHS. Minus 11c by the club test method, and with my temp tests minus 14c hottest to hottest core testing using a more realistic actual use scenario with higher multiple and voltage. Basically what Belial said, I always use Prime95 8k, 90% ram for about 10min for my temp tests. Will get Ultra in a couple days and retest.
> 
> 2nd chip easier to delid because of more glue used by Intel, and that is what caused this chip to have such bad temps pre-delid compared to my first which was harder to delid.


Kind of ties in with my experience. My delid was easy. My pre delid temps where really bad. 4.7 was 85 -90 and anything above was 105 .


----------



## Swag

Thanks to Corsair for sending me out the cables really quickly!







At first, I paid for them and I called them up pertaining to my RMA order and the worker waived the cable fees... Not sure what happened but he was so nice.







Maybe because he thought I was a girl.







Right Val?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Brief synopsis:
> 2nd delid done, appears successful, only have AS5 right now so on die and on top of IHS. Minus 11c by the club test method, and with my temp tests minus 14c hottest to hottest core testing using a more realistic actual use scenario with higher multiple and voltage. Basically what Belial said, I always use Prime95 8k, 90% ram for about 10min for my temp tests. Will get Ultra in a couple days and retest.
> 
> 2nd chip easier to delid because of more glue used by Intel, and that is what caused this chip to have such bad temps pre-delid compared to my first which was harder to delid.


gratz on your second successful delid justanoldman


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> PS. I'm in two minds about RMA'ing it. I love my chip and hate fraud (been a recent victim of fraud myself, it isn't pleasant). If ONLY I could run it on dual channel I would be happy. Even in the future if 8GB's don't "cut it" I could easily do 2x 16GB or 2x 8GB


You can't do dual channel? I thought the problem was that one of 4 ram slots, you can't use (and isn't that likely a motherboard issue rather than cpu issue? I had a mobo just fine, overclocked athlon ii x4 1333mhz cl7 1.5v oc ram, i put in a different cpu, tons of stability issues, was tearing hear out trying to get any overclock stable and i thought it may have been due to the fact that 6 of the pins were broken and i had used cable to replace them, and it just turned out that the mobo had bad slots - dont know if its when my gf shocked the board with static 2 years ago when i built the system, maybe its all the voltage i gave everything, maybe it had something to do with the chip, i just know i moved the ram over and everything worked just fine, it was actually a golden overclocker of a chip too).

You only need to run custom small fft 8 min/max for a few minutes before it reaches your max. A couple extras hours after 5-15 minutes of custom 8 fft length will maybe raise temps 1-2*C at the very most. It really gives you a great picture of your temperature profile, and ime, it's higher than ibt or anything else.

I do not know anything about folding though, I have no experience with it. I mean I know a lot about folding, actually, Pande doesn't know what he's talking about and [email protected] is meaningless for cancer research. Friend of mine is involved with protein folding research and apparently people in his field hate pande.

Ivan, others who saw me post about my RAM not being able to do xmp (the 2000mhz cl7 1.65v mushkins). They aren't stable at their xmp profile, I just hci memtested them on another system (different 3570k, msi g41, different everything, psu, ssd, etc) and they fail pretty quick.

$25 for mushkins that aren't stable at their xmp profile of 2000 CL7 1.65v, but are at 1.7v or 1866 CL7 1.65v.... I still dont want to leave bad ebay feedback because that's still a great price for great ram (i mean i dont think they are broken or anything, and as for them possibly causing my bad overclocks, I tested g skill ares ram 2x4gb 1600 cl9 1.5v and the overclocks fail, dont boot, etc, at same settings).


----------



## Swag

Sexy right?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sexy right?


yeah ..very sexy








do you have a GF Swag?? ...lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sexy right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yeah ..very sexy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> do you have a GF Swag?? ...lol
Click to expand...

You gotta admit sir, these cables are damn sexy. Look at that curvy 24-pin.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You gotta admit sir, these cables are damn sexy. Look at that curvy 24-pin.


LOL..







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> You can't do dual channel? I thought the problem was that one of 4 ram slots, you can't use (and isn't that likely a motherboard issue rather than cpu issue? I had a mobo just fine, overclocked athlon ii x4 1333mhz cl7 1.5v oc ram, i put in a different cpu, tons of stability issues, was tearing hear out trying to get any overclock stable and i thought it may have been due to the fact that 6 of the pins were broken and i had used cable to replace them, and it just turned out that the mobo had bad slots - dont know if its when my gf shocked the board with static 2 years ago when i built the system, maybe its all the voltage i gave everything, maybe it had something to do with the chip, i just know i moved the ram over and everything worked just fine, it was actually a golden overclocker of a chip too).
> 
> You only need to run custom small fft 8 min/max for a few minutes before it reaches your max. A couple extras hours after 5-15 minutes of custom 8 fft length will maybe raise temps 1-2*C at the very most. It really gives you a great picture of your temperature profile, and ime, it's higher than ibt or anything else.
> 
> I do not know anything about folding though, I have no experience with it. I mean I know a lot about folding, actually, Pande doesn't know what he's talking about and [email protected] is meaningless for cancer research. Friend of mine is involved with protein folding research and apparently people in his field hate pande.
> 
> 
> 
> Ivan, others who saw me post about my RAM not being able to do xmp (the 2000mhz cl7 1.65v mushkins). They aren't stable at their xmp profile, I just hci memtested them on another system (different 3570k, msi g41, different everything, psu, ssd, etc) and they fail pretty quick.
> 
> $25 for mushkins that aren't stable at their xmp profile of 2000 CL7 1.65v, but are at 1.7v or 1866 CL7 1.65v.... I still dont want to leave bad ebay feedback because that's still a great price for great ram (i mean i dont think they are broken or anything, and as for them possibly causing my bad overclocks, I tested g skill ares ram 2x4gb 1600 cl9 1.5v and the overclocks fail, dont boot, etc, at same settings).


I'd give them more volts and go for higher mhz...Try 1.75v dram and go for 2133mhz with the xmp timings. If that works you got awesome speed








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sexy right?


Awesome!








I can't and won't sit down and sleeve my psu cables one by one. I'll leave them be till I can replace my psu with a modular one with higher wattage for quad gpu benching lol
Hope I could afford two of those 7870 LE cards, they are 219usd AR at Ncix and perform like 7950's pretty much.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sexy right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't and won't sit down and sleeve my psu cables one by one. I'll leave them be till I can replace my psu with a modular one with higher wattage for quad gpu benching lol
> Hope I could afford two of those 7870 LE cards, they are 219usd AR at Ncix and perform like 7950's pretty much.
Click to expand...

Or you could just get 2x 7950s and OC them so much that they perform over stock 7970s!







Yea, I refused to waste basically a whole weekend on just sleeving...


----------



## Belial

I'm gonna try to have a heart to heart with that ebay seller (hey i sell **** stuff all the time too bro, i sold that broken phenom as a working system ^^), maybe he'll tell me "i knew it was bad! okay! I was only able to get 1.75v at 2133 CL8-7-9-10 with trfc of 92!

Hopefully. Maybe I'll RMA them to mushkin.

I asked Corsair Tech if I could sleeve just the last few inches on the PSU 24/2x6/8pins, as I wanted to keep the cables fully covered (instead of individual sleeves on each wire) and black just like it is stock, where the cables come out the psu and then dissapear behind the motherboard panel, and then have them sleeved just so when they come out from behind the mobo and attach to it, they are a cool paracord electric blue/white pattern.

But they told me it'd immediately void the warranty and they'd kill my dog if I did that. I have half a mind to just do it anyways and worst case scenario buy some heatshrink if I had to rma it, since it wouldn't be anything irrecoverable or even noticeable. But I've already had an issue with the fan that I fixed by moving the fan in the psu, I don't want to void the warranty. I wish I looked into warranty/sleeving policies of PSUs before I got this cx 500... and cx 430.

Really how are you going to fit those extensions in your case. My side panel is always bulging on my builds with 7-9 case fans, non-modular psu, fan controller... im sure you guys all have similar amount of cables. It's those god damn molex cables, those seriously need to become outdated and go the way of the optical drive. Then again not everyone is so particular about cable management i guess.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna try to have a heart to heart with that ebay seller (hey i sell **** stuff all the time too bro, i sold that broken phenom as a working system ^^), maybe he'll tell me "i knew it was bad! okay! I was only able to get 1.75v at 2133 CL8-7-9-10 with trfc of 92!
> 
> Hopefully. Maybe I'll RMA them to mushkin.
> 
> I asked Corsair Tech if I could sleeve just the last few inches on the PSU 24/2x6/8pins, as I wanted to keep the cables fully covered (instead of individual sleeves on each wire) and black just like it is stock, where the cables come out the psu and then dissapear behind the motherboard panel, and then have them sleeved just so when they come out from behind the mobo and attach to it, they are a cool paracord electric blue/white pattern.
> 
> But they told me it'd immediately void the warranty and they'd kill my dog if I did that. I have half a mind to just do it anyways and worst case scenario buy some heatshrink if I had to rma it, since it wouldn't be anything irrecoverable or even noticeable. But I've already had an issue with the fan that I fixed by moving the fan in the psu, I don't want to void the warranty. I wish I looked into warranty/sleeving policies of PSUs before I got this cx 500... and cx 430.
> 
> Really how are you going to fit those extensions in your case. My side panel is always bulging on my builds with 7-9 case fans, non-modular psu, fan controller... im sure you guys all have similar amount of cables. It's those god damn molex cables, those seriously need to become outdated and go the way of the optical drive. Then again not everyone is so particular about cable management i guess


Really, I would just invest in Bitfenix extensions which are great for the price if you do not have a Corsair AX-PSU or you don't want to buy the kit.


----------



## Belial

Extensions are expensive, it's like $20+ for the 24/2x6/8pin. I dont think I can fit that much cable anyways. Sleeving is cool because it costs virtually nothing (just like a window, got window for free from local plasticier as a sample and got the trim for like a dollar.

Maybe I'll just do it in a year or something when I'm more confident in the psu.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Or you could just get 2x 7950s and OC them so much that they perform over stock 7970s!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea, I refused to waste basically a whole weekend on just sleeving...


Thing is those are way way cheaper, and I don't wanna spend top dollar on high end gpus anymore...I'm gonna bench older stuff and game with my CRT for a while, till I can afford a good 120hz ips 3d monitor or something like that. Maybe another 2560x1440 ips panel, this time bought in the US.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I'm gonna try to have a heart to heart with that ebay seller (hey i sell **** stuff all the time too bro, i sold that broken phenom as a working system ^^), maybe he'll tell me "i knew it was bad! okay! I was only able to get 1.75v at 2133 CL8-7-9-10 with trfc of 92!
> 
> Hopefully. Maybe I'll RMA them to mushkin.
> 
> I asked Corsair Tech if I could sleeve just the last few inches on the PSU 24/2x6/8pins, as I wanted to keep the cables fully covered (instead of individual sleeves on each wire) and black just like it is stock, where the cables come out the psu and then dissapear behind the motherboard panel, and then have them sleeved just so when they come out from behind the mobo and attach to it, they are a cool paracord electric blue/white pattern.
> 
> But they told me it'd immediately void the warranty and they'd kill my dog if I did that. I have half a mind to just do it anyways and worst case scenario buy some heatshrink if I had to rma it, since it wouldn't be anything irrecoverable or even noticeable. But I've already had an issue with the fan that I fixed by moving the fan in the psu, I don't want to void the warranty. I wish I looked into warranty/sleeving policies of PSUs before I got this cx 500... and cx 430.
> 
> Really how are you going to fit those extensions in your case. My side panel is always bulging on my builds with 7-9 case fans, non-modular psu, fan controller... im sure you guys all have similar amount of cables. It's those god damn molex cables, those seriously need to become outdated and go the way of the optical drive. Then again not everyone is so particular about cable management i guess.


I wouldn't know how to fit those really long cables neither, I gave it a thought cause I found them locally for 11uds each, but not sure I can fit them behind my mobo plate in my CM 692,


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You gotta admit sir, these cables are damn sexy. Look at that curvy 24-pin.


Extremely sexy man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> You can't do dual channel? I thought the problem was that one of 4 ram slots, you can't use (and isn't that likely a motherboard issue rather than cpu issue? I had a mobo just fine, overclocked athlon ii x4 n i dont think they are broken or anything, and as for them possibly causing my bad overclocks, I tested g skill ares ram 2x4gb 1600 cl9 1.5v and the overclocks fail, dont boot, etc, at same settings).


See that's what I thought after knowing my previous experience with my old board.
To CONFIRM that it is CPU I really ought to get another CPU to test...but I can't do that....as no one I know is willing to give up their CPU for me to test.
It is PROBABLE that it COULD BE motherboard related - however it is highly likely that it is the CPU, simply as that's the only thing that changed since.
But with my situation, one cannot safely assume. Wish I had someone here that was easy going and with a LGA1155 slot. I know a guy...but he has a new PC and thus wasn't willing to.


----------



## King4x4

Trust me when I say that 7950s are just beasty little things.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> To CONFIRM that it is CPU I really ought to get another CPU to test...but I can't do that....as no one I know is willing to give up their CPU for me to test.
> It is PROBABLE that it COULD BE motherboard related - however it is highly likely that it is the CPU, simply as that's the only thing that changed since.
> But with my situation, one cannot safely assume. Wish I had someone here that was easy going and with a LGA1155 slot. I know a guy...but he has a new PC and thus wasn't willing to.


buy a Intel Celeron G440 or something like that, they are cheap, and its always handy to have a backup chip..
maybe if you look around you can even find a used one


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> buy a Intel Celeron G440 or something like that, they are cheap, and its always handy to have a backup chip..
> maybe if you look around you can even find a used one


It is £26-30 brand new - found one on ebay that has 2days remaining at around £5.
Great suggestion bro - I'll look into that.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> It is £26-30 brand new - found one on ebay that has 2days remaining at around £5.
> Great suggestion bro - I'll look into that.


£5 would be a nice prize for it, even when it gets a bit more


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Brief synopsis:
> 2nd delid done, appears successful, only have AS5 right now so on die and on top of IHS. Minus 11c by the club test method, and with my temp tests minus 14c hottest to hottest core testing using a more realistic actual use scenario with higher multiple and voltage. Basically what Belial said, I always use Prime95 8k, 90% ram for about 10min for my temp tests. Will get Ultra in a couple days and retest.
> 
> 2nd chip easier to delid because of more glue used by Intel, and that is what caused this chip to have such bad temps pre-delid compared to my first which was harder to delid.


Good work, don't go buying anymore chips now. I'll go tell your wife!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Custom loop beats any liquid cooler really.
> But I've always expected better from my Antec.


I think something is wrong with your 920. My 620 does better temps that that with more voltage.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks to Corsair for sending me out the cables really quickly!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At first, I paid for them and I called them up pertaining to my RMA order and the worker waived the cable fees... Not sure what happened but he was so nice.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe because he thought I was a girl.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right Val?


LOL...."Dude, it's a chick, she sounds hot! Send her some cables and some hawt newds!"
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Ivan, others who saw me post about my RAM not being able to do xmp (the 2000mhz cl7 1.65v mushkins). They aren't stable at their xmp profile, I just hci memtested them on another system (different 3570k, msi g41, different everything, psu, ssd, etc) and they fail pretty quick.
> 
> $25 for mushkins that aren't stable at their xmp profile of 2000 CL7 1.65v, but are at 1.7v or 1866 CL7 1.65v.... I still dont want to leave bad ebay feedback because that's still a great price for great ram (i mean i dont think they are broken or anything, and as for them possibly causing my bad overclocks, I tested g skill ares ram 2x4gb 1600 cl9 1.5v and the overclocks fail, dont boot, etc, at same settings).


Hmm, is it 4GB or 8GB? 1866 CL7 is pretty good. Just loosen the timings some, 2133 CL8 would still be great.

Also I deleted the first part of the post because it was lengthy (yours usually are, lol, not complaining, you just have a lot to say), but I wanted to comment: NEVER let your GF touch your gear!! (PC gear that is)








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sexy right?











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> £5 would be a nice prize for it, even when it gets a bit more


Good morning! errr afternoon or whatever!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Good morning! errr afternoon or whatever!


LOL..Good afternoon stickg1







, just past 1pm over here


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> LOL..Good afternoon stickg1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , just past 1pm over here


ooo, whats for lunch today?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Indeed I've placed a bid for over £10 for it. If not I'll buy it, and then return it.
As for the 920...yeah I thought of RMAing too.
I will do if I rma the i7...I've emailed Intel already.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Indeed I've placed a bid for over £10 for it. If not I'll buy it, and then return it.
> As for the 920...yeah I thought of RMAing too.
> I will do if I rma the i7...I've emailed Intel already.


Lets go see Man UTD vs Everton this weekend. I'll fly over there.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I would be up for that







!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> ooo, whats for lunch today?


chocolate!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I had fillings in for the first time of my life for my teeth, just bore. Don't eat too much chocolate!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I had fillings in for the first time of my life for my teeth, just bore. Don't eat too much chocolate!


ouch..thats no fun,
if you do eat chocolate, then eat it fast, in a short time, better for your teeth









anyways, was checking my mail...
seems i have fans everywhere, fanmail!!









yea, im a bit bored, not much to do today on the forum..lol

...back to the movie, Silent Hill: Revelation....


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Nice!
Although I would have preferred that picture without your name on....nor their top on


----------



## justanoldman

Coollaboratory liquid ultra, aka Ultra, CLU, that messy silver stuff.

All due credit to MikeG for the following information.

"But I don't want to use CLU because it will stain everything. How can I clean it? Will I have to lap the surface to get it off?"

No worries if you want to spend the time and elbow grease to get everything clean.

Coollabs Liquid Ultra applied to the block of an H100i and cleaned as well as could possibly be with isopropyl alcohol:





Then after using this product which only costs a few dollars:



We end up with this:


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Great result!
Out of interest, if I open the ihs again, should I get clu off and then reapply it?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Coollaboratory liquid ultra, aka Ultra, CLU, that messy silver stuff.
> 
> All due credit to MikeG for the following information.
> 
> "But I don't want to use CLU because it will stain everything. How can I clean it? Will I have to lap the surface to get it off?"
> 
> No worries if you want to spend the time and elbow grease to get everything clean.
> 
> Coollabs Liquid Ultra applied to the block of an H100i and cleaned as well as could possibly be with isopropyl alcohol:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then after using this product which only costs a few dollars:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We end up with this:


nice work justanoldman..so..what are you gonna use now on the block?
or you just want it to look shiny, and then apply ultra again,
i dont think its a problem if theres some ultra left on the ihs or block,
it fills the microscopic holes for you, what you did now, is scrub it all off,
and fill it with something else that hasnt got the w/mk ultra has,
even if you clean it with alcohol there will be some leftovers..

i know you all dont want stains on anything, but think about it, the only time you see this,
is when you take everything apart again, and i dont think its a daily thing..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Great result!
> Out of interest, if I open the ihs again, should I get clu off and then reapply it?


few times i just used the same liquid pro again, i just spread it out again, put some more on it if it was needed..simple








but yea, you could take it off as good as you can, and re apply..if it still looks good, i wouldnt tho..


----------



## justanoldman

TD, If you open the IHS again you need to look at the die and underside of the IHS. Does it all still look well spread out, any blank spots, etc. You might be able to get away with just using the brush to touch it up.

VonDutch, I cleaned that H100i block so I could return it due to a few problems that it had. I would agree you don't need to clean off all the Ultra for normal purposes, but if you are testing, using a different tim, or something to that effect, at least now we know we can clean it if necessary.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> VonDutch, I cleaned that H100i block so I could return it due to a few problems that it had. I would agree you don't need to clean off all the Ultra for normal purposes, but if you are testing, using a different tim, or something to that effect, at least now we know we can clean it if necessary.


i see, srry didnt know that..nah, normally just clean as good as possible, except of course if you like it shiny..lol
then it needs a bit more work, i read that ultra or pro can even up other tims if theres still some leftovers..
but yea, if youre testing/reviewing different tims, it wouldnt work..


----------



## justanoldman

Totally Dubbed,
I don't get good results at all from my H100i and it seems to do with not being able to get the block to match well with the IHS. Since you mentioned having less than stellar results from your 920, I was thinking you should post pictures of your 920 block and IHS immediately after taking it apart next time. That way we can look at the "fingerprint" that the tim leaves on both surfaces to see how well they made contact.


----------



## megawatz

Do you guys like having a closed loop system versus making your own? I've got a rad and pump, but can't decide whether I should finish it up or not.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yeah only been there for a day!
As for the glue. I placed an order. I'll take pictures when I get it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Do you guys like having a closed loop system versus making your own? I've got a rad and pump, but can't decide whether I should finish it up or not.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Good work, don't go buying anymore chips now. I'll go tell your wife!


That is funny because it is true. I explained up front to her that I would probably screw up a few parts for my first build and would have to pay to replace them, but it still end up a lot cheaper than buying it from a custom builder.

Although I shouldn't worry about it since every month she "saves" me money by buying things we don't need on sale. How about those clothes she buys, never wears, then end up in the pile of clothes going to charity at the end of the year?


----------



## King4x4

So for giggles I put my 3770k on stock numbers to check on hows the cooling... I was shocked...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Do you guys like having a closed loop system versus making your own? I've got a rad and pump, but can't decide whether I should finish it up or not.


Closed loop, like H100i or Antec 920 give ok results, not all that great. They are simple and easy though. As I understand it, custom loops are the only way to get good results. Although I am looking forward to Swiftech's new H220 closed loop system - it is more expensive but expandable and supposedly better than others.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Do you guys like having a closed loop system versus making your own? I've got a rad and pump, but can't decide whether I should finish it up or not.


Finish the loop trust me ots worth it about 5 pages back you'll see my liquid ultra delid temps on custom water. Ibt max stress 4.6 GHz 62 degrees hottest core


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> So for giggles I put my 3770k on stock numbers to check on hows the cooling... I was shocked...


i had to laugh, almost forgot what stock settings where ..lol

1.1V vcore set in bios, llc turbo..think cooling is good enough









just noticed, i need - 0.127V negative offset, it would prolly crash at idle ..lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Closed loop, like H100i or Antec 920 give ok results, not all that great. They are simple and easy though. As I understand it, custom loops are the only way to get good results. Although I am looking forward to Swiftech's new H220 closed loop system - it is more expensive but expandable and supposedly better than others.


Absolutely correct.
As for the H220 - it i mainly the fact that it has a great pump and more so the choice of changing your closed system into a custom loop later on if you so wish.


----------



## ORAC

I want to confirm that CLU is better than AS5.

Yesterday I overclocked by CPU to 4.7GHz and ran IBT ten times set for maximum which took about 79 minutes to complete. I have CLU between the die and the IHS.

Using AS5 between the Heat Sink and the CPU yielded the following max core tempatures using RealTemp: 75, 82, 83, 81.



I then replaced the AS5 with CLU and ran the same test. The max core tempatures recorded under RealTemp using CLU are, as follows: 70, 77, 75, 76.



This is a drop of at least 5C is every core.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ORAC*
> 
> I want to confirm that CLU is better than AS5.
> 
> This is a drop of at least 5C is every core.


5c sound about right when used between the IHS and your cooler. The bigger increase comes from using it on the die.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> 5c sound about right when used between the IHS and your cooler. The bigger increase comes from using it on the die.


Yup and I can confirm 10c difference between MX-2 and CLU ON THE DIE.
One thing I am not taking into account here though is over-time the MX-2 gets hard, and thus might perform like the intel one. So in fact that 10c difference might well end up as 20c difference. As noted by Valguar previously.


----------



## justanoldman

Still waiting for Ultra, but here are some pics of delid number 2.
Also I found using these razors to be helpful. They are used for shaving so they are sharp and thin, but are one sided which makes them easy to use:

http://www.amazon.com/Gem-Personna-Single-Stainless-Blades/dp/B0011Z9MVQ/ref=sr_1_3?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1360165576&sr=1-3&keywords=Single+Edge+Blades


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Looks like the razor I used! Btw, looking super clean and sexy!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Yup and I can confirm 10c difference between MX-2 and CLU ON THE DIE.
> One thing I am not taking into account here though is over-time the MX-2 gets hard, and thus might perform like the intel one. So in fact that 10c difference might well end up as 20c difference. As noted by Valguar previously.


i think Val was talking about the pump out effect..
you cant compare intels tim to other tims,
the Intel stock tim is more like a solid pad, a spacer, that isn't likely to suffer from pump-out effect. In fact I expect Intel would have intentionally chosen the specific tim they currently use on the basis that it does not suffer from pump-out. They would be fools not to factor this into their selection criteria.

time to do other things..dinner..









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Still waiting for Ultra, but here are some pics of delid number 2.
> Also I found using these razors to be helpful. They are used for shaving so they are sharp and thin, but are one sided which makes them easy to use:
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Gem-Personna-Single-Stainless-Blades/dp/B0011Z9MVQ/ref=sr_1_3?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1360165576&sr=1-3&keywords=Single+Edge+Blades


nice work oldman








yea, those razors are 1 of the 3 that are recommended for delidding on page 1 of this thread


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lol completely forgot about my mum's pc I'm thinking about buying. I'm going to be buying her an i3 - what better time to buy...than now lol


----------



## MikeG

I7-3770K - Delidded, Direct Die Mount @3.5GHz (stock) speed, 2400MHz memory


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I7-3770K - Delidded, Direct Die Mount @3.9GHz (turbo) speed, 2400MHz memory


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I could have gone much higher but I did not want to exceed the design specs of my power supply.










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I think my 360mm radiator and Koolance water block is overkill. If I had to do it again, I would have just used an H100 or similar. I wish I had more time and money, I'd like to get rid of this huge tower and see how compact I could go, like a delidded i7 and a Maximus V Gene.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I7-3770K - Delidded, Direct Die Mount @3.5GHz (stock) speed, 2400MHz memory
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I7-3770K - Delidded, Direct Die Mount @3.9GHz (turbo) speed, 2400MHz memory
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think my 360mm radiator and Koolance water block is overkill. If I had to do it again, I would have just used an H100 or similar. I wish I had more time and money, I'd like to get rid of this huge tower and see how compact I could go, like a delidded i7 and a Maximus V Gene.


great results but it looks like core 0 has a poor contact with the water block. usually core 0 is the cold one







oh and there's no overkill in OCN brotherhood


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> great results but it looks like core 0 has a poor contact with the water block. usually core 0 is the cold one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh and there's no overkill in OCN brotherhood


Yeah I was going to say - why is core 0 well off the others?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


----------



## megawatz

I have a Rad and Pump (Combo) but now I just need the res, block, tubing, and fittings.

XSPC Raystorm
Bitspower 3.5" Bay Reservoir POM Version - Black
some comp fittings
1/2" tubing?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I have a Rad and Pump (Combo) but now I just need the res, block, tubing, and fittings.
> 
> XSPC Raystorm
> Bitspower 3.5" Bay Reservoir POM Version - Black
> some comp fittings
> 1/2" tubing?


Market place my friend... If your not going highend water no need for 1/2 ID 3/4 OD "expensive " Ive got like 300$ in fittings XD


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> great results but it looks like core 0 has a poor contact with the water block. usually core 0 is the cold one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh and there's no overkill in OCN brotherhood


I guess it's because most of the Windows processes are running in core 0. When I give it a bigger load, the cores even out. As you can see here, the cores are more even now and core 1 has the higher temp:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> Market place my friend... If your not going highend water no need for 1/2 ID 3/4 OD "expensive " Ive got like 300$ in fittings XD


Yeah, not looking high end, just a custom cooling setup. I think the most thing Im confused about is how big of a res i need, what siztubing, and what fittings. I've seen the guides but they're not noobish enough. Lol


----------



## chann3l

Hurrah for liquid ultra!!! Another update here are my IBT 3770k 4.9 ghz temps

And the link to my new 3d mark 11 score http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5837682
Got a 12374 for physics. My temp drop is even bigger at 4.9 than at 4.6 27 degree difference


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hurrah for liquid ultra!!! Another update here are my IBT 3770k 4.9 ghz temps
> 
> And the link to my new 3d mark 11 score http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5837682
> Got a 12374 for physics. My temp drop is even bigger at 4.9 than at 4.6 27 degree difference


Updated!!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hurrah for liquid ultra!!! Another update here are my IBT 3770k 4.9 ghz temps
> 
> And the link to my new 3d mark 11 score http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5837682
> Got a 12374 for physics. My temp drop is even bigger at 4.9 than at 4.6 27 degree difference


cool chann3l








o, did you up blck yourself to 100.53, or is it just the Auto setting making it so ?


----------



## chann3l

Awesome thank you !! I'm so stoked on the temps im getting. I wonder if my extra rad im adding on friday will make it even better...Probably not cause im water temps are only 27 under load lol Owell i've already paid for it and it'll look cooler


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> cool chann3l
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o, did you up blck yourself to 100.53, or is it just the Auto setting making it so ?


No the Mpower board stock sets it at 100.53 lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> No the Mpower board stock sets it at 100.53 lol


nice ..well, if it doesnt keep you from ocing, no problem right








just thought it was a bit high, i always set it by hand to 100,
that way on my mobo it will show 100.034, on auto its a bit higher


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice ..well, if it doesnt keep you from ocing, no problem right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just thought it was a bit high, i always set it by hand to 100,
> that way on my mobo it will show 100.034, on auto its a bit higher


Hmmm I wonder if its stopping me from hitting 5 GHz. See temps are no longer a problem but for 4.9 I need 1.45 in the bios to be totally stable. But I went all the way to 1.47 at 5 GHz and I was getting into windows and then immediate bsod.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hmmm I wonder if its stopping me from hitting 5 GHz. See temps are no longer a problem but for 4.9 I need 1.45 in the bios to be totally stable. But I went all the way to 1.47 at 5 GHz and I was getting into windows and then immediate bsod.


the jumps in vcore get bigger with (very) high oc's,

1.405V at 4.9ghz


1.5V at 5.0ghz


if your 4.9ghz takes 1.45V vcore, you prolly need over or about 1.5V vcore to make 5.0ghz run, 1.45 or 1.47 is only 0.02V more
i would set blck by hand to 100 for now, see if it helps..


----------



## VonDutch

i remember one of us had a great explanation about whea errors long time ago,
i think it was Feniks, but im not sure..
something about it reduces speed, because it hass to double check things all the time,
and about it can lead to data corruption over time..anyone knows? feniks still around and lurking maybe ? ..lol


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hurrah for liquid ultra!!! Another update here are my IBT 3770k 4.9 ghz temps
> 
> And the link to my new 3d mark 11 score http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5837682
> Got a 12374 for physics. My temp drop is even bigger at 4.9 than at 4.6 27 degree difference


looks great but i think you can get 5ghz @ 1.52v and u need to overclock that 7950 more


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> looks great but i think you can get 5ghz @ 1.52v and u need to overclock that 7950 more


Ya im gonna try higher volts as von and you suggest and put my blck to 100. Gonna oc the 7950 later too ots at 1000 core and 1300 men right now it uses the 7970 PCB so I should be able to get better stability. 86% asic rating or whatever it is lol


----------



## King4x4

I just don't know whats going on.... My CPU is giving out lower numbers then equivalent 3770Ks at the same OC... need to do some investigating in the bios.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I just don't know whats going on.... My CPU is giving out lower numbers then equivalent 3770Ks at the same OC... need to do some investigating in the bios.


Ram.


----------



## chann3l

Well I did it broke the 5 ghz barrier. Strange tho because 1.45 v in the bios give a super stable 4.9 ghz with max temp in ibt of 73 degrees. To get 5 ghz almost totally stable i needed 1.57 in the bios. Made it through 9 runs on ibt before linpack stopped working. No bsod tho which is nice i think im done for now tho

Temps at 5ghz 1.57 v ibt


Cpuz valid http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2683326

Also @ Vondutch in the bios my blck was already set too 100 it just reads as 100.52 apparently


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Well I did it broke the 5 ghz barrier. Strange tho because 1.45 v in the bios give a super stable 4.9 ghz with max temp in ibt of 73 degrees. To get 5 ghz almost totally stable i needed 1.57 in the bios. Made it through 9 runs on ibt before linpack stopped working. No bsod tho which is nice i think im done for now tho
> 
> Temps at 5ghz 1.57 v ibt
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cpuz valid http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2683326
> 
> Also @ Vondutch in the bios my blck was already set too 100 it just reads as 100.52 apparently


This makes me want to push my 3570K to 1.5v just to see what it can do.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ram.


Checked not that :<

Oh yah bloody mobo won't clock these samsungs babies over 2133


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Checked not that :<
> 
> Oh yah bloody mobo won't clock these samsungs babies over 2133


I've moved away from GB for that reason...There a few workarounds now, they involve changing the read/write slew values in the bios, but you need a special bios too. Guess the latest one would do.
Good luck!


----------



## King4x4

New betas disables my Logitech keyboard... Need to find a decent replacement for the keyboard


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> New betas disables my Logitech keyboard... Need to find a decent replacement for the keyboard :<


You broke it. Don't use those sideways triangles, bad code


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I shouldn't be saying this but - i3 can be de-lidded too right?









Haven't seen a single person de-lid an i3, nor report it.


----------



## King4x4

Thanks... but those sideway bracket are my trademark sad face


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I shouldn't be saying this but - i3 can be de-lidded too right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't seen a single person de-lid an i3, nor report it.


There's an i3-3220 in the back, for a build I made for a customer ... The temptation to delid it is great


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> There's an i3-3220 in the back, for a build I made for a customer ... The temptation to delid it is great


I'm getting an i3...in under a week...oh lol @ me.
I got the 3225 coming in for my mum's PC build


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> There's an i3-3220 in the back, for a build I made for a customer ... The temptation to delid it is great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm getting an i3...in under a week...oh lol @ me.
> I got the 3225 coming in for my mum's PC build
Click to expand...

I got my mom an A8-5800K. Cheaper, better alternative


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Also @ Vondutch in the bios my blck was already set too 100 it just reads as 100.52 apparently


@chann3l, I have the same motherboard as you. I have discovered (at least on mine) that the MPower BIOS sometimes has a mind of its own. If I set BCLK to 100.0 (the auto setting) and then boot and look at Control Center or CPUZ, sometimes it says 100.0 and other times when I boot, it says 100.5. I really believe it is setting it to 100.5 in the latter case. I usually set mine to 100.1 in the BIOS, that way it takes it off the auto setting, and I always get 100.1.

Another thing you might notice is that if you set your memory speed to 2400 or above and VCCIO and VCCSA to auto, the BIOS will set VCCIO to 1.25V and VCCSA to 1.0V. If you set the memory speed to 2200 or below, and VCCIO and VCCSA to auto, the BIOS will always set VCCIO to 1.05V and VCCSA to 0.92V. I contacted MSI about this and they sent me a beta bios, but it does the same thing. I contacted them again and they said that is the way it is supposed to work. I'm not necessarily convinced that it is the way it is supposed to work.

You might also want to try lowering your PLL. I found that I could set my PLL to 1.60V and still be stable. It really helps lower my temps. I'm not sure above 5GHz though, it may need higher PLL. I still can't seem to get mine completely stable above 5GHz (i.e. 12Hrs Prime 95 blend 90% memory).


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I got my mom an A8-5800K. Cheaper, better alternative


Good processor - especially seeing as it is a quad core







!
But I want that HD4000's GFX & an intel motherboard









I quite like intel.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I got my mom an A8-5800K. Cheaper, better alternative
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good processor - especially seeing as it is a quad core
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> But I want that HD4000's GFX & an intel motherboard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I quite like intel.
Click to expand...

Intel is nice when you need power









She looks up recipes and checks her emails. Not too much power required. HD4000 or AMD 6670 ... I wonder which is better ... (I'm not stating anything, I actually want to know. brb researching)


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> @chann3l, I have the same motherboard as you. I have discovered (at least on mine) that the MPower BIOS sometimes has a mind of its own. If I set BCLK to 100.0 (the auto setting) and then boot and look at Control Center or CPUZ, sometimes it says 100.0 and other times when I boot, it says 100.5. I really believe it is setting it to 100.5 in the latter case. I usually set mine to 100.1 in the BIOS, that way it takes it off the auto setting, and I always get 100.1.
> 
> Another thing you might notice is that if you set your memory speed to 2400 or above and VCCIO and VCCSA to auto, the BIOS will set VCCIO to 1.25V and VCCSA to 1.0V. If you set the memory speed to 2200 or below, and VCCIO and VCCSA to auto, the BIOS will always set VCCIO to 1.05V and VCCSA to 0.92V. I contacted MSI about this and they sent me a beta bios, but it does the same thing. I contacted them again and they said that is the way it is supposed to work. I'm not necessarily convinced that it is the way it is supposed to work.
> 
> You might also want to try lowering your PLL. I found that I could set my PLL to 1.60V and still be stable. It really helps lower my temps. I'm not sure above 5GHz though, it may need higher PLL. I still can't seem to get mine completely stable above 5GHz (i.e. 12Hrs Prime 95 blend 90% memory).


thanks for all the pointers. I have my ram nice and stable at 2133 no real desire to go higher than that but i'll keep that in mind if I do. Now its ay 10000 khz so i guess 10010 right? I have pll overvoltage enabled and my temps are great. I do 4.6 ghz for a 24 hour oc at 1.27 volts and my hottest core is 62 in ibt max stress. Even at 4.9 ghz at 1.45 my max is 73 degrees. I got mostly stable at 5 ghz enough to do 9 runs of ibt no bsod just linpack stopped responding. The problem is that if I want to get it more stable i'd have to push past 1.57 volts which would probably take temps from mid 80s to 90 or so lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I shouldn't be saying this but - i3 can be de-lidded too right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't seen a single person de-lid an i3, nor report it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Intel is nice when you need power
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She looks up recipes and checks her emails. Not too much power required. HD4000 or AMD 6670 ... I wonder which is better ... (I'm not stating anything, I actually want to know. brb researching)


HD4000 is equivalent to an 8600gt, and slower than the igp in the A10-5800k by a fair margin (Llano igpu was already faster)
The processor is way better though, and you can upgrade to a faster real quad core later on with Intel.

And yeah, you can delid those...I've seen a report of a IB Celeron delid a few days ago, some chinese dude did it for kinks.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> HD4000 is equivalent to an 8600gt, and slower than the igp in the A10-5800k by a fair margin (Llano igpu was already faster)
> The processor is way better though, and you can upgrade to a faster real quad core later on with Intel.
> 
> And yeah, you can delid those...I've seen a report of a IB Celeron delid a few days ago, some chinese dude did it for kinks.


For kinks eh?....lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Intel is nice when you need power
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She looks up recipes and checks her emails. Not too much power required. HD4000 or AMD 6670 ... I wonder which is better ... (I'm not stating anything, I actually want to know. brb researching)


What if I got my mum into BF3? haha
PS. ordered!


----------



## ivanlabrie

BF3 will run like crap on both, with slow frame times, even with all low details and 720p res...
You need a discrete gpu for that.








And getting your mom to play it xD


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> BF3 will run like crap on both, with slow frame times, even with all low details and 720p res...
> You need a discrete gpu for that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And getting your mom to play it xD


haha








Yeah well the intel i3 i chose I specifically went £15 more for the HD4000's integrated graphics over the HD2500's found in the other i3's!
£460 with a monitor I'm well chuffed at the price I'm able to build this at! (that's realistically £350 without monitor) - this is my little gift to her


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> BF3 will run like crap on both, with slow frame times, even with all low details and 720p res...
> You need a discrete gpu for that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And getting your mom to play it xD
> 
> 
> 
> haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah well the intel i3 i chose I specifically went £15 more for the HD4000's integrated graphics over the HD2500's found in the other i3's!
> £460 with a monitor I'm well chuffed at the price I'm able to build this at! (that's realistically £350 without monitor) - this is my little gift to her
Click to expand...

I spent $300 for my mom's FM2 build







Come at me (No monitor as well)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I spent $300 for my mom's FM2 build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Come at me (No monitor as well)


But that's unfair in the USA and comparisons with the UK.
My 2012 build would have been around £200 cheaper (possibly more) if I had bought everything from the USA.

Regardless, good job dude







!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I spent $300 for my mom's FM2 build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Come at me (No monitor as well)
> 
> 
> 
> But that's unfair in the USA and comparisons with the UK.
> My 2012 build would have been around £200 cheaper (possibly more) if I had bought everything from the USA.
> 
> Regardless, good job dude
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
Click to expand...

Canada*









but yeah I know that feel. Canada has actually beat US prices in a surprising quantity of times recently. GO CANADA.

But... oh yeah. Delidding club









I swear, we need to just conglomerate all of our responses. I feel like we've been having a constant discussion spread over 4 threads for the past hour or so.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> This makes me want to push my 3570K to 1.5v just to see what it can do.


get coolabs ultra/pro first


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Dman, I've doing some cool bodyweight stuff at work...oops, wrong thread!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Dman, I've doing some cool bodyweight stuff at work...oops, wrong thread!


I stop paying attention to what threads I post in







Cool though. I would ... if I wasn't in dress pants. I've actually considered bringing my vibrams and shorts + tshirt and going for a run during my lunch break


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Canada*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but yeah I know that feel. Canada has actually beat US prices in a surprising quantity of times recently. GO CANADA.
> 
> But... oh yeah. Delidding club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I swear, we need to just conglomerate all of our responses. I feel like we've been having a constant discussion spread over 4 threads for the past hour or so.


agreed on the go canada stuff is cheaper at ncix than it is on ebay lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I stop paying attention to what threads I post in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cool though. I would ... if I wasn't in dress pants. I've actually considered bringing my vibrams and shorts + tshirt and going for a run during my lunch break


I have a killer AC at the break room...and the room all for myself. I set it at 18c and avoid sweating that way lol
I only do strentgh stuff though, so it's good.

EDIT: Actually there's a shower we get to use if we need to...







Go HP lol


----------



## dmanstasiu

I can just run outside, it's like 4-5C







BUT THEN MY HAIR GETS RUINED

/Diva problems


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I can just run outside, it's like 4-5C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BUT THEN MY HAIR GETS RUINED
> 
> /Diva problems


lol, I know the feeling...I avoid getting my hair wet with the rain normally. It wrecks my style








I pictured you with a more military style hairdo, more bear-esque like your avatar, but well...lmao

When are you getting a 3770k man? I'd be happy with a g440 these days...gonna mod my case and sleeve my psu to kill some time till my rma replacement gets here from the US.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> thanks for all the pointers. I have my ram nice and stable at 2133 no real desire to go higher than that but i'll keep that in mind if I do. Now its ay 10000 khz so i guess 10010 right? I have pll overvoltage enabled and my temps are great. I do 4.6 ghz for a 24 hour oc at 1.27 volts and my hottest core is 62 in ibt max stress. Even at 4.9 ghz at 1.45 my max is 73 degrees. I got mostly stable at 5 ghz enough to do 9 runs of ibt no bsod just linpack stopped responding. The problem is that if I want to get it more stable i'd have to push past 1.57 volts which would probably take temps from mid 80s to 90 or so lol.


Yep, 10010 in the BIOS is 100.1MHz. Are you delidded? What kind of cooling do you have and what is your TIM. I think you should be able to get lower temps than that.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I can just run outside, it's like 4-5C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BUT THEN MY HAIR GETS RUINED
> 
> /Diva problems
> 
> 
> 
> lol, I know the feeling...I avoid getting my hair wet with the rain normally. It wrecks my style
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I pictured you with a more military style hairdo, more bear-esque like your avatar, but well...lmao
> 
> When are you getting a 3770k man? I'd be happy with a g440 these days...gonna mod my case and sleeve my psu to kill some time till my rma replacement gets here from the US.
Click to expand...

haha it still complies fully with Canadian military standards. But the top is my discretion









I'm just about to MDPC sleeve ... as for the 3770k, I'm waiting until a find a high-clocking one for a good price


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> @chann3l, I have the same motherboard as you. I have discovered (at least on mine) that the MPower BIOS sometimes has a mind of its own. If I set BCLK to 100.0 (the auto setting) and then boot and look at Control Center or CPUZ, sometimes it says 100.0 and other times when I boot, it says 100.5. I really believe it is setting it to 100.5 in the latter case. I usually set mine to 100.1 in the BIOS, that way it takes it off the auto setting, and I always get 100.1.
> 
> Another thing you might notice is that if you set your memory speed to 2400 or above and VCCIO and VCCSA to auto, the BIOS will set VCCIO to 1.25V and VCCSA to 1.0V. If you set the memory speed to 2200 or below, and VCCIO and VCCSA to auto, the BIOS will always set VCCIO to 1.05V and VCCSA to 0.92V. I contacted MSI about this and they sent me a beta bios, but it does the same thing. I contacted them again and they said that is the way it is supposed to work. I'm not necessarily convinced that it is the way it is supposed to work.
> 
> You might also want to try lowering your PLL. I found that I could set my PLL to 1.60V and still be stable. It really helps lower my temps. I'm not sure above 5GHz though, it may need higher PLL. I still can't seem to get mine completely stable above 5GHz (i.e. 12Hrs Prime 95 blend 90% memory).


Seems like after clearing cmos or first time starting a new mpower, the bclk in bios is at 10000, but in windows it is a bit higher or lower, if you reboot & change to 10010 or something, then reboot & back to 10000 it will stay at an even 10000 in windows (always some fluctuation but mostly on the nose).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I have a killer AC at the break room...and the room all for myself. I set it at 18c and avoid sweating that way lol
> I only do strentgh stuff though, so it's good.
> 
> EDIT: Actually there's a shower we get to use if we need to...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go HP lol


Killer AC, benching in the break room?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> haha it still complies fully with Canadian military standards. But the top is my discretion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just about to MDPC sleeve ... as for the 3770k, I'm waiting until a find a high-clocking one for a good price


I just keep the hair long in the winter, mild this year but it's like a toque you never forget to bring.

If you find any great chips let me know too. 7Ghz or bust!


----------



## DiamondCut

Damn you rascals... posting up a storm in here. I've been busy jailbreaking my iphone 5, so much awesomness to come. Anyways, im buying a car in two weeks so I taking a small break on my system so I won't get to see the results of my deilid till then :/


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> haha it still complies fully with Canadian military standards. But the top is my discretion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just about to MDPC sleeve ... as for the 3770k, I'm waiting until a find a high-clocking one for a good price


Awesome! I can't afford sleeving yet, but this month is case mod time. Tinted acrilyc side panel (or glass) with magnets to attach it to the case, carbon fiber vinyl and red spray paint for the mesh.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Seems like after clearing cmos or first time starting a new mpower, the bclk in bios is at 10000, but in windows it is a bit higher or lower, if you reboot & change to 10010 or something, then reboot & back to 10000 it will stay at an even 10000 in windows (always some fluctuation but mostly on the nose).
> Killer AC, benching in the break room?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just keep the hair long in the winter, mild this year but it's like a toque you never forget to bring.
> 
> If you find any great chips let me know too. 7Ghz or bust!


lol

I could mod the AC into a beast direct die, but I would get fired...I would need to pay the maintenance guys to mod it for me too lmao


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Seems like after clearing cmos or first time starting a new mpower, the bclk in bios is at 10000, but in windows it is a bit higher or lower, if you reboot & change to 10010 or something, then reboot & back to 10000 it will stay at an even 10000 in windows (always some fluctuation but mostly on the nose).


Agreed, it is kind of weird but yes, in my experience if I change it to 10010, reboot, then change it back, it usually stays at 10000.


----------



## justanoldman

How is this for even? After putting Ultra on the die (still AS5 on top) and turning my cooler block all different ways, at 4.8x100 and a 77f (25c) room I get these temps 67, 70, 67, 67. Those are the most even temps I have ever had over three chips (two delidded).

I know those are not good temps compared to you guys, but I think I need a better cooler or go direct die to get the temps you guys get. The bottom line is I had a chip that has good voltages, but literally unusable temps. Now I have a chip with reasonable temps that I may be able to take a little higher.


----------



## prest0

Good news, guys! I finally decided to take seriously this thing with my delidded chip which looked like an undelidded chip lol.

I went to the hardware store this morning looking for some sand paper but they only had 400, 600 and 1200 so I bought the three ones. I cleaned the pcb a little more deeper and did some tests to my ihs looking for concave spots and in fact it needed some lapping.

I did like 60 times each side of the ihs using the three different numbers of the sand paper, but I couldn't get that finish you guys have posted in your lapping photos. Anyway my temps are much better now, 84°c max @4.5ghz 1.330V



Using my Bach sonatas and partitas music book for background and my nickname hidden out there


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> Good news, guys!
> I did like 60 times each side of the ihs using the three different numbers of the sand paper, but I couldn't get that finish you guys have posted in your lapping photos. Anyway my temps are much better now, 84°c max @4.5ghz 1.330V


Voltage seems way to high for that clock speed and the temps are not very good at all for a delidded IB.

Something seems wrong here.


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Voltage seems way to high for that clock speed and the temps are not very good at all for a delidded IB.
> 
> Something seems wrong here.


I posted some pages back my delid results, it was like 79°c for 4.3ghz, 84° for 4.4ghz and 95° for 4.5ghz. I'm using AS5 on the die, maybe that's the reason for the high temps. The Vcore I think it's just pure bad luck lol, my chip is very voltage hungry.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> I posted some pages back my delid results, it was like 79°c for 4.3ghz, 84° for 4.4ghz and 95° for 4.5ghz. I'm using AS5 on the die, maybe that's the reason for the high temps. The Vcore I think it's just pure bad luck lol, my chip is very voltage hungry.


That is exactly what my first chip needed, 1.33 for 4.5. There was no way around it, just not a great overclocker.

If you lapped your processor, you should probably lap your heat sink. I have run into trouble just doing one. I am finding it is the least important part of this. Using the right amount of Ultra or Pro on the die, having a good cooler, and mounting the cooler correctly are the most important for your temps.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Yep, 10010 in the BIOS is 100.1MHz. Are you delidded? What kind of cooling do you have and what is your TIM. I think you should be able to get lower temps than that.


Custom water loop, Im delidded and I have liquid ultra on the die and ihs. Keep in mind I stress with ibt max settings. With p95 i only hit 50 on hottest core with the rest being high 40s thats small ffts. IBT makes way more heat. so 4.6 ghz at 1.27v 62 hottest core is pretty good. I'm adding a 120 rad to go with my ex 240 well I alkready bought it putting it in this weekend. I thought with the ultra my water temps would go up but they are the same lol. 27 under load with ambient temps of 26 under load so now that extra rad will probably do nothing but look nice


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> I posted some pages back my delid results, it was like 79°c for 4.3ghz, 84° for 4.4ghz and 95° for 4.5ghz. I'm using AS5 on the die, maybe that's the reason for the high temps. The Vcore I think it's just pure bad luck lol, my chip is very voltage hungry.


CLP on the die is the only way to go.


----------



## chann3l

so strange I did what you said FTW 420 changed bclk and then put back to 10000 and it worked perfect cpuz now reads at the right clock. Thanks


----------



## Arm3nian

gt-ap 14s are amazing... with 1 you can't even hear it, with 8 my pump is STILL louder (max speed), and d5 is pretty quiet... dropped temperatures also.


----------



## chann3l

there setting my bclk to exactly 100 dropped me an extra 2 degrees







and for some reason steam opens faster lol


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> That is exactly what my first chip needed, 1.33 for 4.5. There was no way around it, just not a great overclocker.
> 
> If you lapped your processor, you should probably lap your heat sink. I have run into trouble just doing one. I am finding it is the least important part of this. Using the right amount of Ultra or Pro on the die, having a good cooler, and mounting the cooler correctly are the most important for your temps.


Yeah, that is so sad especially because I bought that chip in Prague expecting it to be better than they sell here in south America.

I already bought my ultra the last week in amazon for 18 dollars, I guess it's going to get here by april, lol.


----------



## Belial

Ivan Labrie, thanks for responding to my ram questions (and all of them, lol). Since your the only one really got something to say on my ram issue, i'm going to move that topic to the gigabyte thread. Basically, i figured out its just one of the sticks that's a problem.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> Yeah, that is so sad especially because I bought that chip in Prague expecting it to be better than they sell here in south America.
> 
> I already bought my ultra the last week in amazon for 18 dollars, I guess it's going to get here by april, lol.


Where are you located?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Ivan Labrie, thanks for responding to my ram questions (and all of them, lol). Since your the only one really got something to say on my ram issue, i'm going to move that topic to the gigabyte thread. Basically, i figured out its just one of the sticks that's a problem.


Cool, no prob man...I'm a ram man, from head to toe lol
I'm going for a 3ghz validation this weekend. Wish me luck!
(the plan involves a cold fx8120 and lotsa ram, some psc, bbse and samsung)

The board might have a hard time with the sticks too, gigabyte isn't as good as the top tier asrock or asus boards for ram ocing really. (specially with specific ram ic's)


----------



## DiamondCut

Hmm this is odd, I tried to enter my bios and my setup key is not working... i really dont wana clear cmos since i have to remove my GPU to do that and its a pain in general to tear my case apart... Any ideas why I cannot access my bios?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Hmm this is odd, I tried to enter my bios and my setup key is not working... i really dont wana clear cmos since i have to remove my GPU to do that and its a pain in general to tear my case apart... Any ideas why I cannot access my bios?


you use a wireless keyboard?
connect to a usb 2 port can help also..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> thanks for all the pointers. I have my ram nice and stable at 2133 no real desire to go higher than that but i'll keep that in mind if I do. Now its ay 10000 khz so i guess 10010 right? I have pll overvoltage enabled and my temps are great. I do 4.6 ghz for a 24 hour oc at 1.27 volts and my hottest core is 62 in ibt max stress. Even at 4.9 ghz at 1.45 my max is 73 degrees. I got mostly stable at 5 ghz enough to do 9 runs of ibt no bsod just linpack stopped responding. The problem is that if I want to get it more stable i'd have to push past 1.57 volts which would probably take temps from mid 80s to 90 or so lol.


if you get that blck set to 100, and set ram to 1600 for now,
you prolly need less vcore to make the 5.0ghz run,
also did you try run 5.0ghz without pll overvoltage enabled, or set to auto?
with those very high oc's every setting gets important, that i know,
even that blck 100.52 can mess things up..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Well I did it broke the 5 ghz barrier. Strange tho because 1.45 v in the bios give a super stable 4.9 ghz with max temp in ibt of 73 degrees. To get 5 ghz almost totally stable i needed 1.57 in the bios. Made it through 9 runs on ibt before linpack stopped working. No bsod tho which is nice i think im done for now tho
> 
> Temps at 5ghz 1.57 v ibt
> 
> 
> Cpuz valid http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2683326
> 
> Also @ Vondutch in the bios my blck was already set too 100 it just reads as 100.52 apparently


...4.9 / 1.45v to 5 /1.57v is quite a jump - over a wall, really. PLL adjustments could help - may be. Ran some new 3DMark benches in 4.9 and 5 (in SLI with one of the cards in the wrong slot, depending on your point of view, but that's a different thread), and the net difference in required voltage was .78


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you use a wireless keyboard?
> connect to a usb 2 port can help also..
> if you get that blck set to 100, and set ram to 1600 for now,
> you prolly need less vcore to make the 5.0ghz run,
> also did you try run 5.0ghz without pll overvoltage enabled, or set to auto?
> with those very high oc's every setting gets important, that i know,
> even that blck 100.52 can mess things up..


Haven't tried since I put the bclk to 100 and I haven't tried with ppl on auto either only enabled I'll try that and put ram to stock and see what I get thanks


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Where are you located?


Chavezland lol

So I ran a 10h prime test last night, I think this is all I can push it until my liquid ultra arrives


----------



## RMK221

Going be delidding my 3770k in a few weeks, have a Sabertooth z77. Was wondering if anyone has used the h110 by Corsair (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181035) ? And if it's worth it to do that or just go with the h100?

Thanks in advance


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RMK221*
> 
> Going be delidding my 3770k in a few weeks, have a Sabertooth z77. Was wondering if anyone has used the h110 by Corsair (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181035) ? And if it's worth it to do that or just go with the h100?
> 
> Thanks in advance


Both should do fine for a delidded ivy,
even a good aircooler would be enough








Noctua NH-D14 or something like that..


----------



## chann3l

Alright so I am going to mess with settings later see if I can get 5 at lower than 1.57 temps arnt an issue but that seems like too much voltage for 5. For now tho is 4.9 at 1.45 fine for a 24 hour oc normally I leave it at 4.6 but my temps hot 73 max on ibt at 4.9 so temps are no longer an issue. Also I have pll overvaltage enabled at 4.6 GHz with max temps of 62 ibt max stress. Would the temp difference be much with it disabled? not that im complaining lol


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RMK221*
> 
> Going be delidding my 3770k in a few weeks, have a Sabertooth z77. Was wondering if anyone has used the h110 by Corsair (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181035) ? And if it's worth it to do that or just go with the h100?
> 
> Thanks in advance


I have the H100i and would recommend waiting a couple weeks and get the Swiftech H220. Unless you want to go air, then like VonDutch said, the Noctua is good.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Alright so I am going to mess with settings later see if I can get 5 at lower than 1.57 temps arnt an issue but that seems like too much voltage for 5. For now tho is 4.9 at 1.45 fine for a 24 hour oc normally I leave it at 4.6 but my temps hot 73 max on ibt at 4.9 so temps are no longer an issue. Also I have pll overvaltage enabled at 4.6 GHz with max temps of 62 ibt max stress. Would the temp difference be much with it disabled? not that im complaining lol


any C or degree you can lower is better for your oc i think,
what do you vcore wise to run 4.6 and 4.7ghz stable?
i dont think its noticeable difference, but you can keep a eye on it,
if you disable..i never needed it with my oc's, so im curious ..lol
i leave it on auto always on my mobo..


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> you use a wireless keyboard?
> connect to a usb 2 port can help also..
> if you get that blck set to 100, and set ram to 1600 for now,
> you prolly need less vcore to make the 5.0ghz run,
> also did you try run 5.0ghz without pll overvoltage enabled, or set to auto?
> with those very high oc's every setting gets important, that i know,
> even that blck 100.52 can mess things up..


No, I use a wired one. cmstorm trigger. I thought that would be it but it just simply doesnt want to boot.
I want to just get in there so I can change the intel stepping so my i7 doesnt run 3.8 24/7 because my temps are getting too high for my comfort with these newer games coming out.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I have the H100i and would recommend waiting a couple weeks and get the Swiftech H220. Unless you want to go air, then like VonDutch said, the Noctua is good.


yea, even my Scythe Mugen 2 Rev. B was enough to shave off more then 30C








only cost me 35 euro..i pay about 100 euro for the 100i, but prizes are different in the usa


----------



## justanoldman

For any of you that have tried getting rid of the IHS and put your cooler block directly on the die: Was it worth it? Do you think it is safe long term? Are you worried about putting either too little or too much pressure on the die? Do you have to worry about scratching or damaging the die in anyway since most coolers have some play in them while installing?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> No, I use a wired one. cmstorm trigger. I thought that would be it but it just simply doesnt want to boot.
> I want to just get in there so I can change the intel stepping so my i7 doesnt run 3.8 24/7 because my temps are getting too high for my comfort with these newer games coming out.


yea ok, i was thinking about i couldnt use usb3 with my keyboard,
not sure why, but couldnt use it in the bios..lol so changed it to usb2 and it works,
maybe the bios doenst have native usb3 support?
do you have another keyboard you can try with?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Temps after 5hrs of [email protected] - remember I'm de-lidded - I think I'm going to RMA my antec lol.


----------



## justanoldman

Per this club:
3770k, posted pics already, hottest to hottest core went from 77c to 58c =-19c at 4.5 using IBT standard, with CLU on the die, AS5 on top of the IHS. MHz gained=300 for actual day to day use. Normal OC I am trying to get stable for 24/7 is 5.0. Did I forget anything?

Crazy max OC, one time shot:
http://valid.canardpc.com/2683687


----------



## Lobsterman

Thats a crazy low voltage for 5.5!, I know i needed 1.768v for same speed

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2572213

Haven't been any higher than 5.2 since then lol


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> any C or degree you can lower is better for your oc i think,
> what do you vcore wise to run 4.6 and 4.7ghz stable?
> i dont think its noticeable difference, but you can keep a eye on it,
> if you disable..i never needed it with my oc's, so im curious ..lol
> i leave it on auto always on my mobo..


I dont actually need it I had it on for 4.9 for extra stability just in case. I need 1.27 for 4.6 stable 1.24 for 4.5 and 1.3 for 4.7 then the bigger jumps come 1.4 4.8 1.45 4.9 and 1.57 for 5


----------



## chann3l

If I could find a way to belting voltage down for 5 it would be great because at 4.9 my temps only hit 73 hottest core on ibt max after 10 runs. But at 1.57 volts for 5 I hit 84 max temps in ibt. Which is acceptable but I dont like running that hot.

Prior to delliding I was hitting 84 at 1.27 volts I dropped 24 degrees so id like to be able to utilize that to really push this chip. I just dont understand how the difference between 4.9 and 5 is .12 volts


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I dont actually need it I had it on for 4.9 for extra stability just in case. I need 1.27 for 4.6 stable 1.24 for 4.5 and 1.3 for 4.7 then the bigger jumps come 1.4 4.8 1.45 4.9 and 1.57 for 5


same here,
4.6ghz 1.285V vcore
4.7ghz 1.3V
4.8ghz 1.420V
4.9ghz 1.510
5.0ghz 1.610-1.615V

like i said, big vcore jumps at the higher oc's,
so my max daily oc is only 4.8ghz at 1.420V,
not that i complain about having a ivy that runs 4.8ghz








my temps are great of course, no problem there..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> If I could find a way to belting voltage down for 5 it would be great because at 4.9 my temps only hit 73 hottest core on ibt max after 10 runs. But at 1.57 volts for 5 I hit 84 max temps in ibt. Which is acceptable but I dont like running that hot.
> 
> Prior to delliding I was hitting 84 at 1.27 volts I dropped 24 degrees so id like to be able to utilize that to really push this chip. I just dont understand how the difference between 4.9 and 5 is .12 volts


you prolly wont get enough of the vcore to run it 24/7,
temps should still be ok, if 84C is what you have in ibt at 5.0ghz, you never see those
with normal daly usage..thats more around 60C or lower


----------



## Lobsterman

Heres the differences I noted down when comparing voltages to clockspeeds a while back

3.9ghz = 1.152 @ load
4.2ghz = 0.005 above stock
4.4ghz = 0.015 ^
4.5ghz = 0.015 ^
4.6ghz = 0.025 ^
4.8ghz = 0.085 ^
5.0ghz = 0.255 ^
5.2ghz = 0.435 ^
5.4ghz = 0.685 ^

once you get to the 4.5-4.6 range the voltage:clockspeed required start to take a rocket-ride towards diminishing returns/crazy volts


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> same here,
> 4.6ghz 1.285V vcore
> 4.7ghz 1.3V
> 4.8ghz 1.420V
> 4.9ghz 1.510
> 5.0ghz 1.610-1.615V


...in the end, all chips hit 'that wall' whereby much bigger voltage jumps are needed to get to the next Ghz step...usually just past 4.7 Ghz...really good chips will simply have their curve shifted (i.e. their wall won't kick in until 4.9 or 5), but it will eventually happen of course.

EXTRA EXTRA, read all about it - Canada Post and Canada Customs actually worked really efficiently - what's the world coming to ?







:


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea ok, i was thinking about i couldnt use usb3 with my keyboard,
> not sure why, but couldnt use it in the bios..lol so changed it to usb2 and it works,
> maybe the bios doenst have native usb3 support?
> do you have another keyboard you can try with?


Its plugged into a USB2.0







And sadly I do not lol, I could just bring one of the cheap dells we have here at work....


----------



## katsuo

Hello hello I need advice, im not sure if I should delid my 3570k or not. If its a good cpu i wont so are this good temps and volts to not need delid:

4.5ghz Vcore 1.2v full load temps around 60 and stable, idle around 25-30
4.8ghz Vcore 1.4 full load temps around 80 and stable, maybe still need some minor tweaks, idle temps around 28-32

Im running it on air, Noctua NH-D14 with 3 fans on.

I was about to delid acctually today, took everything apart but it was allmost 0 gap between IHS and die so couldnt even start with razor, so i stoped to check what you guys think.

Btw im trying to get it stable at 5.0ghz, it boots normal with 1.475 and PLL 1.85 but as soon as I load it up applications start crash and didnt try go much more V yet


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katsuo*
> 
> Hello hello I need advice, im not sure if I should delid my 3570k or not. If its a good cpu i wont so are this good temps and volts to not need delid:
> 
> 4.5ghz Vcore 1.2v full load temps around 60 and stable, idle around 25-30
> 4.8ghz Vcore 1.4 full load temps around 80 and stable, maybe still need some minor tweaks, idle temps around 28-32
> 
> Im running it on air, Noctua NH-D14 with 3 fans on.
> 
> I was about to delid acctually today, took everything apart but it was allmost 0 gap between IHS and die so couldnt even start with razor, so i stoped to check what you guys think.
> 
> Btw im trying to get it stable at 5.0ghz, it boots normal with 1.475 and PLL 1.85 but as soon as I load it up applications start crash and didnt try go much more V yet


I had a tough time working my razor in when I de-lidded. It's un-nerving but you have to actually push a bit to get it in and keep wiggling the blade as if to widen the gap between the pcb and ihs. I felt the gap was too small to but after going slowly and pushing you can see it going in 1mm at a time, each wiggle a bit further. You will get it, mine had no scratches when I finished. hopefully you will not either. I have a noctua D14 and my temps top out in the mid 70's at 5ghz during prime 95 with 1.51v and since priming to get my stability right my max temp I have seen is 56 degrees from a heavy gaming session. De-lidding is worth it in my opinion.

Edit: I actually use a PLL of 1.603 and I find it more stable than higher PLL. Try lowering it and see if it works out well. Also are you enabling PLL overvoltage? That helps too when you have a higher multi.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> EXTRA EXTRA, read all about it - Canada Post and Canada Customs actually worked really efficiently - what's the world coming to ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :


...and for a delid newbie like me, this video is 'helpful' though I am sure some steps can be improved upon by the experts


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Heres the differences I noted down when comparing voltages to clockspeeds a while back
> 
> 3.9ghz = 1.152 @ load
> 4.2ghz = 0.005 above stock
> 4.4ghz = 0.015 ^
> 4.5ghz = 0.015 ^
> 4.6ghz = 0.025 ^
> 4.8ghz = 0.085 ^
> 5.0ghz = 0.255 ^
> 5.2ghz = 0.435 ^
> 5.4ghz = 0.685 ^
> 
> once you get to the 4.5-4.6 range the voltage:clockspeed required start to take a rocket-ride towards diminishing returns/crazy volts


Are those stable volts or just bootable?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am de-lidded as well and recently switched to the extreme6 after fretting over the reported cheap mosfets for several weeks and houdning sin on pm to clarify just how bad he thought they were and he replied he didn't think they were TERRIBLE he just didn't think they were up to current standards thermally and not as efficient as the new digital ones, he didn't think my motherboard was going to die or anything, he just recommended possibly pointing a fan at it. I upgraded anyway and I am happy so far and my mosfet worries have gone away. Ud3h is nice too I had both in my hand when I walked to the counter in microcenter but in the end I looked at both boxes and handed him the Ud3h to put back on the shelf. Have not thought about it since. In fact I like the extreme6 alot now.


I think im gonna go with the ud3h, considering its got decent VRM, mosfets onboard.

Back to delidded club ive not been added I see; I bought a cpu lapping kit few days ago right up to 2500 grit sandpaper so Ill have a new picture and proper submission in couple days.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katsuo*
> 
> Hello hello I need advice, im not sure if I should delid my 3570k or not. If its a good cpu i wont so are this good temps and volts to not need delid:
> 
> 4.5ghz Vcore 1.2v full load temps around 60 and stable, idle around 25-30
> 4.8ghz Vcore 1.4 full load temps around 80 and stable, maybe still need some minor tweaks, idle temps around 28-32
> 
> Im running it on air, Noctua NH-D14 with 3 fans on.
> 
> I was about to delid acctually today, took everything apart but it was allmost 0 gap between IHS and die so couldnt even start with razor, so i stoped to check what you guys think.
> 
> Btw im trying to get it stable at 5.0ghz, it boots normal with 1.475 and PLL 1.85 but as soon as I load it up applications start crash and didnt try go much more V yet


Why do you want to delid? If you need a minimum of 1.4v for 4.8 then your voltage requirements for going over 5 are going to be rather high. I think people should have a reasonably good reason to delid, and be able to afford to buy a new chip if they make a mistake.

Filling out your rig in your profile will allow people to help you better.

My first chip was tight to the PCB as well. You basically have to find the best corner and be extremely careful. With your numbers I am not sure it will be worth it or not, it all depends on you. My chip was hitting 94c at 4.8 with less voltage than you, so it was a good candidate for delidding, but your temps are not that bad.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Its plugged into a USB2.0
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And sadly I do not lol, I could just bring one of the cheap dells we have here at work....


That happened to me when I was trying to install windows 7 after swapping motherboards. Once I was able to figure out that only the USB2.0 ports were working and put my keyboard and mouse on those, I installed windows and after that everything works fine in the bios. It just needs USB3.0 drivers.


----------



## chann3l

Ok so if im @ 1.45v for 4.9 with max temps of 73 degrees in ibt max stress that should be just fine for a 24/7 oc right? Temps are ok and that voltage shouldn't cause degradation unless im missing something lol


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Ok so if im @ 1.45v for 4.9 with max temps of 73 degrees in ibt max stress that should be just fine for a 24/7 oc right? Temps are ok and that voltage shouldn't cause degradation unless im missing something lol


No one knows yet what will cause degradation, but if your max stress temps are only 73c then that is really low. So if 1.45v with really low temps causes degradation, that would be news and everyone would want to know about it.

I couldn't even come close to those temps, I think I would be 85c or so at 1.45v.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Ok so if im @ 1.45v for 4.9 with max temps of 73 degrees in ibt max stress that should be just fine for a 24/7 oc right? Temps are ok and that voltage shouldn't cause degradation unless im missing something lol


It is exactly what I run as my 24/7 except I am at 1.43v. Everyone is really guessing about degradation, I am sure you have picked up on that by now. But when it happens you will only need to bump the vcore a notch to keep the same clockspeed sometime between now and whenever or maybe never.. Get what I 'm sayin?


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Are those stable volts or just bootable?


Those were the stable voltages I got to at the time of testing with 3dMark 11 + BF3 with zero WHEA errors.


----------



## chann3l

Thanks chronic and justanoldman. I should be good at than then I imagine with such low temps it shouldn't affect it at least not for a couple years


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Are those stable volts or just bootable?
> I think im gonna go with the ud3h, considering its got decent VRM, mosfets onboard.
> 
> Back to delidded club ive not been added I see; I bought a cpu lapping kit few days ago right up to 2500 grit sandpaper so Ill have a new picture and proper submission in couple days.


Not a bad choice by any means. Let me know how it works out! I went with the extreme6 myself.


----------



## ORAC

Regarding Ivy Bridge CPU degradation due to high voltage, I found the following quote from the following review:

"For all practical purposes 1.25V-1.30V is going to be the highest useable voltage on Ivy Bridge chips, even on the highest-end air-cooling. Any more than that and you supposedly risk degradation if you run abnormal loading programs like IBT, LinX and Prime 95. Either way, we can fairly assertively state that if degradation doesn't scare you, the full load temperatures will. It's not all doom and gloom though. Your average user should easily be able hit 4.5GHz with a tiny bit more voltage than stock, so the temperatures will be imminently manageable."

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/53054-intel-i7-3770k-ivy-bridge-cpu-review-23.html


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and for a delid newbie like me, this video is 'helpful' though I am sure some steps can be improved upon by the experts


that vid is my favorite, a "must watch" for peeps that want to delid their ivy,
watch several times is even better, should be on page 1


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Those were the stable voltages I got to at the time of testing with 3dMark 11 + BF3 with zero WHEA errors.


Not bad at all, my booting experiences were similar to:

up to 4.6ghz - stock
5ghz - 1.25v
5ghz p95 stable - 1.35v
5.1ghz - 1.41v

Ive not gone higher, I think 5.1 is another vcore wall but we'll see once my new mobo arrives.


----------



## katsuo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I had a tough time working my razor in when I de-lidded. It's un-nerving but you have to actually push a bit to get it in and keep wiggling the blade as if to widen the gap between the pcb and ihs. I felt the gap was too small to but after going slowly and pushing you can see it going in 1mm at a time, each wiggle a bit further. You will get it, mine had no scratches when I finished. hopefully you will not either. I have a noctua D14 and my temps top out in the mid 70's at 5ghz during prime 95 with 1.51v and since priming to get my stability right my max temp I have seen is 56 degrees from a heavy gaming session. De-lidding is worth it in my opinion.
> 
> Edit: I actually use a PLL of 1.603 and I find it more stable than higher PLL. Try lowering it and see if it works out well. Also are you enabling PLL overvoltage? That helps too when you have a higher multi.


I will try with lower PLL but it was ok 1.65 for me until 4.5ghz after only 1.8+ helped me. PLL overvoltage is ON , i found it better also.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ORAC*
> 
> Regarding Ivy Bridge CPU degradation due to high voltage, I found the following quote from the following review:
> 
> "For all practical purposes 1.25V-1.30V is going to be the highest useable voltage on Ivy Bridge chips, even on the highest-end air-cooling. Any more than that and you supposedly risk degradation if you run abnormal loading programs like IBT, LinX and Prime 95. Either way, we can fairly assertively state that if degradation doesn't scare you, the full load temperatures will. It's not all doom and gloom though. Your average user should easily be able hit 4.5GHz with a tiny bit more voltage than stock, so the temperatures will be imminently manageable."
> 
> http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/53054-intel-i7-3770k-ivy-bridge-cpu-review-23.html


all of that changes when you delid,
the vcores he mentioned are in relation with the high temps,
hence the, "even on the highest-end air-cooling",
i rather run a higher vcore with low temps,
then a lower vcore with high temps, both can degrade a cpu, no doubt,
personally i dont think mine will degrade noticeably if i run it 1.420V vcore 24/7
with low temps, within 3 years that is, with daily usage my temps wont go over 60C..


----------



## katsuo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Why do you want to delid? If you need a minimum of 1.4v for 4.8 then your voltage requirements for going over 5 are going to be rather high. I think people should have a reasonably good reason to delid, and be able to afford to buy a new chip if they make a mistake.
> 
> Filling out your rig in your profile will allow people to help you better.
> 
> My first chip was tight to the PCB as well. You basically have to find the best corner and be extremely careful. With your numbers I am not sure it will be worth it or not, it all depends on you. My chip was hitting 94c at 4.8 with less voltage than you, so it was a good candidate for delidding, but your temps are not that bad.


But I can boot with reasonable voltage at 5ghz and it crashes after full load and heat, and as far as i know more heat mean that its getting less efficient and needs more V, or I got it wrong?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ORAC*
> 
> Regarding Ivy Bridge CPU degradation due to high voltage, I found the following quote from the following review:
> 
> "For all practical purposes 1.25V-1.30V is going to be the highest useable voltage on Ivy Bridge chips, even on the highest-end air-cooling. Any more than that and you supposedly risk degradation if you run abnormal loading programs like IBT, LinX and Prime 95. Either way, we can fairly assertively state that if degradation doesn't scare you, the full load temperatures will. It's not all doom and gloom though. Your average user should easily be able hit 4.5GHz with a tiny bit more voltage than stock, so the temperatures will be imminently manageable."
> 
> http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/53054-intel-i7-3770k-ivy-bridge-cpu-review-23.html


That quote can't be more wrong...everything said in it is wrong.

-"Little more voltage for 4.5ghz?!" - My chip does 1v for stock or idle, and 1.27v for 4.5ghz - some people need 1.35v for 4.5ghz - what BS are they talking about there?
-Degradation comes over time, something that's NOT mentioned there - it isn't an overnight degradation of your chip
-1.25-1.30v HIGHEST usable voltage!? Do they realise STOCK left on AUTO goes up to 1.35v?

Man sometimes you read the biggest crap on the internet...
FYI: This isn't a dig at you, just the facts taken from that quote.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> that vid is my favorite, a "must watch" for peeps that want to delid their ivy,
> watch several times is even better, should be on page 1


It is indeed a good video - I hoped to have made a video like that...but I screwed my chip...I'll update you guys as my mum's mobo and cpu are coming in very soon!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katsuo*
> 
> But I can boot with reasonable voltage at 5ghz and it crashes after full load and heat, and as far as i know more heat mean that its getting less efficient and needs more V, or I got it wrong?


Being able to boot at a certain voltage doesn't really tell you anything. If you have done all the proper BIOS setup, and correct testing to find that your minimum voltage for 4.8 is 1.4v, then you could need over 1.5v for 5.0 to actually be stable, it all depends on where your chip hits the wall.

It is up to you if the risk of delidding is worth it to go from 4.8 to possibly 5.0. With Ivy Bridge chips there are very few people who do 5.0 or above on a 24/7 basis.


----------



## Belial

Yea I need extra voltage to do 4.3, 4.4, and I'm looking at over 1.3vcore for 4.5. Right now I'm failing at the 20+ hour on [email protected], need just a tiny bit more. I might try to do 4.7ghz but that'll definitely require something like 1.5...

My temps are good though.

Be aware that voltages are a bigger factor than temps when it comes to degradation. If you got the features on that do stuff like less volt/frequency on idle, etc, you should be pretty good unless your doing something like compute workloads. This chip definitely appreciates more voltage though, as power hungry as it is.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm not kidding about folding being extremely intensive - temp difference between stock and CLU at this stage is around 14c -> not much


----------



## ivanlabrie

I found folding to be cooler than p95 27.7 by 15c...ymmv though.
I was using a Linux vm on Win 7.

TD, I suspect your pump may not be working properly btw, if you can rma that give it a shot.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Per this club:
> 3770k, posted pics already, hottest to hottest core went from 77c to 58c =-19c at 4.5 using IBT standard, with CLU on the die, AS5 on top of the IHS. MHz gained=300 for actual day to day use. Normal OC I am trying to get stable for 24/7 is 5.0. Did I forget anything?
> 
> Crazy max OC, one time shot:
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2683687


You're in!







Now throw that Sig on!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm not kidding about folding being extremely intensive - temp difference between stock and CLU at this stage is around 14c -> not much


hey.... take a look at this PPD.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ORAC*
> 
> Regarding Ivy Bridge CPU degradation due to high voltage, I found the following quote from the following review:
> 
> "For all practical purposes 1.25V-1.30V is going to be the highest useable voltage on Ivy Bridge chips, even on the highest-end air-cooling. Any more than that and you supposedly risk degradation if you run abnormal loading programs like IBT, LinX and Prime 95. Either way, we can fairly assertively state that if degradation doesn't scare you, the full load temperatures will. It's not all doom and gloom though. Your average user should easily be able hit 4.5GHz with a tiny bit more voltage than stock, so the temperatures will be imminently manageable."
> 
> http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/53054-intel-i7-3770k-ivy-bridge-cpu-review-23.html


Thats a pretty dated article for ivy and no doubt influenced by the temps people were seeing at the time. If the chips were running as cool as ours they would have stated different vcore tolerances I am sure. It was a hate ivy bridge keep sandy fest in April.


----------



## justanoldman

TD,
Good job on your delidding thread, I hope you figure some things out when you get chance to test another chip in your mobo. Since you are good at doing informative threads, you could do one about your folding experience. I know there are newbs who know next to nothing about it.

Valgaur,
Thanks for adding me, and thank you again for a great thread.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> For any of you that have tried getting rid of the IHS and put your cooler block directly on the die: Was it worth it? Do you think it is safe long term? Are you worried about putting either too little or too much pressure on the die? Do you have to worry about scratching or damaging the die in anyway since most coolers have some play in them while installing?


Was it worth it? That's a very subjective question and I'm sure everyone will have a different opinion. The risks are high, but also the rewards. For someone doing it for the first time, be prepared that you may damage your chip and/or your motherboard. Keep in mind, that I had a very good chip to begin with.

direct die vs. delidded:

Did I see a performance difference at 0°C? No
Did I see a gain in MHz with ambient room temperatures of 20°C? Not really--not with VCore values that I feel comfortable with. Understand that I was already somewhat stable (I could run 10 passes of IBT) at 5.0GHz and 1.415V delidded.
Did I see a reduction in temperatures? Yes, My temperatures were reduced by about 7 to 8°C from my hottest core.
Was I able to reduce my VCore? Yes I was able to lower my VCore by 0.02V (5.0GHz with 1.395V)
So what is the benefit for me? SILENT COMPUTING! I'm sitting here typing this and all the while my processor is running at 5.0GHz. My fans are set to 6.7V and will only lift a sheet of paper by about 1/2 inch when laid over the radiator. AIDA 64 stability test has been running the last 10.5 hours and my average core temps are 56°C.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








Was I worried about too much or too little pressure on the die? Absolutely, with no way to measure how much pressure I was putting on the die, I just had to guess and hope I didn't break something. My first boot attempt resulted in post code 55. I loosened my water block a little and this time the motherboard would not stay powered on. It turned out that I was being too conservative with the pressure I was putting on the die. I increased the amount of pressure until finally I could boot. Now that I know exactly how far to tighten my block, I am extremely comfortable removing and remounting the block. I have done this half a dozen times already.
Does it take nerves of steel? Yes


----------



## Belial

Does anyone know anything about overclocking the integrated graphics? (see sig rig:video editing build, worse 3570k than i even talked about, it binned worse, looking at 1.26v for 4.4, fail in 20 minutes on 4.5/1.32, msi g41, ares ram 2x2gb 1600 cl9 1.5v which seems okay at 2000 CL11 1t 1.65v, no gpu).

Does it affect cpu or ram stability? im assuming its just like assuming a graphics card - increase gpu voltage/frequency as necessary, make sure it passes 5 minutes of occt error testing and your good - but i dont know what voltages and frequencies to begin with or look at, and how it affects stability. this motherboard actually doesnt have igpu voltage, so... yea im curious what would be the frequency id be looking at, make sure that 5 min occt testing is the way to go, if it affects cpu stability at all.

thanks.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now throw that Sig on!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hey.... take a look at this PPD.


How's that possible!?
And should I run ONLY CPU and not GPU in that respect?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> TD,
> Good job on your delidding thread, I hope you figure some things out when you get chance to test another chip in your mobo. Since you are good at doing informative threads, you could do one about your folding experience. I know there are newbs who know next to nothing about it.
> 
> Valgaur,
> Thanks for adding me, and thank you again for a great thread.


Indeed I was thinking of doing that, and thanks for the support







!


----------



## justanoldman

MikeG,
Thanks a lot, very good and detailed answer.
So for max temps while stress testing 5.0 at a CPU-Z voltage of 1.408 you have 70c? Is that correct, and what are your ambient temps?


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does anyone know anything about overclocking the integrated graphics? (see sig rig:video editing build, worse 3570k than i even talked about, it binned worse, looking at 1.26v for 4.4, fail in 20 minutes on 4.5/1.32, msi g41, ares ram 2x2gb 1600 cl9 1.5v which seems okay at 2000 CL11 1t 1.65v, no gpu).
> 
> Does it affect cpu or ram stability? im assuming its just like assuming a graphics card - increase gpu voltage/frequency as necessary, make sure it passes 5 minutes of occt error testing and your good - but i dont know what voltages and frequencies to begin with or look at, and how it affects stability. this motherboard actually doesnt have igpu voltage, so... yea im curious what would be the frequency id be looking at, make sure that 5 min occt testing is the way to go, if it affects cpu stability at all.
> 
> thanks.


It's funny you should ask.







Yes, I have experimented with overclocking my integrated graphics. I was able to get it working at 1500MHz (X30 multiplier), but not any higher. I was having so much fun overclocking that I set my CPU to 5.0GHz, my 16GB ram to 2400MHz, and my GPU to 1500MHz. I then started Prime 95 blend and Furmark. Not the smartest thing I've probably done.







My computer suddenly powered off, and I could not power it on anymore despite unplugging it and plugging it back in. It finally powered up again after several minutes.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> How's that possible!?
> And should I run ONLY CPU and not GPU in that respect?
> Indeed I was thinking of doing that, and thanks for the support
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


certain wu's man. I get lucky with them a lot and they great me with respect back as well lol. but with the CPU and GPU thing. doesn't matter what one you get since they use different algorithms anyways. so I need to set my gpu as well.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> certain wu's man. I get lucky with them a lot and they great me with respect back as well lol. but with the CPU and GPU thing. doesn't matter what one you get since they use different algorithms anyways. so I need to set my gpu as well.


haha ok


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> MikeG,
> Thanks a lot, very good and detailed answer.
> So for max temps while stress testing 5.0 at a CPU-Z voltage of 1.408 you have 70c? Is that correct, and what are your ambient temps?


Yes the temperature on core 1 spiked up to 70c at one point, but I'm not sure when that was. I could have been testing my GPU or loading an application. My average temps for the past 11.5hrs is 56c and AIDA 64 is still running.

When referring to "ambient" temps, are most people talking about the idle temperature of the CPU, the temperature within the case, or the ambient temperature of the room? The temperature of my room at desk level, and on the floor near the intake of my computer is 20.6c (69F) .


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does anyone know anything about overclocking the integrated graphics? (see sig rig:video editing build, worse 3570k than i even talked about, it binned worse, looking at 1.26v for 4.4, fail in 20 minutes on 4.5/1.32, msi g41, ares ram 2x2gb 1600 cl9 1.5v which seems okay at 2000 CL11 1t 1.65v, no gpu).
> 
> Does it affect cpu or ram stability? im assuming its just like assuming a graphics card - increase gpu voltage/frequency as necessary, make sure it passes 5 minutes of occt error testing and your good - but i dont know what voltages and frequencies to begin with or look at, and how it affects stability. this motherboard actually doesnt have igpu voltage, so... yea im curious what would be the frequency id be looking at, make sure that 5 min occt testing is the way to go, if it affects cpu stability at all.
> 
> thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> It's funny you should ask.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I have experimented with overclocking my integrated graphics. I was able to get it working at 1500MHz (X30 multiplier), but not any higher. I was having so much fun overclocking that I set my CPU to 5.0GHz, my 16GB ram to 2400MHz, and my GPU to 1500MHz. I then started Prime 95 blend and Furmark. Not the smartest thing I've probably done.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My computer suddenly powered off, and I could not power it on anymore despite unplugging it and plugging it back in. It finally powered up again after several minutes.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll start with x26 and work around there. Why would your computer suddenly turn off? IGPU is not sucking a lot of power, I seriously doubt that somehow you had a psu failure (it'd maybe be different if you were furmarking a discrete gpu but even then I'm sure your psu is more than capable).

I'm assuming the shutdown occured because of instability... is that because the igpu overclock affected cpu stability? I'm guessing you couldnt turn it on again because of bad cmos? What exactly happened? I mean your story isn't exactly confidence inspiring lol. I'm just tuning a little igpu overclock because this is a stock system (its for a friend who knows nothing about computers, I got an nzxt havik on it and doing a minor overclock and off it'll go) but I want to avoid the igpu causing cpu/system instability.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Per this club:
> 3770k, posted pics already, hottest to hottest core went from 77c to 58c =-19c at 4.5 using IBT standard, with CLU on the die, AS5 on top of the IHS. MHz gained=300 for actual day to day use. Normal OC I am trying to get stable for 24/7 is 5.0. Did I forget anything?
> 
> Crazy max OC, one time shot:
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2683687


Looks like you have found yourself a very nice chip indeed!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Looks like you have found yourself a very nice chip indeed!


Almost as good as yours.








Thanks for all the help - I sent you a PM.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Thanks, I'll start with x26 and work around there. Why would your computer suddenly turn off? IGPU is not sucking a lot of power, I seriously doubt that somehow you had a psu failure (it'd maybe be different if you were furmarking a discrete gpu but even then I'm sure your psu is more than capable).
> 
> I'm assuming the shutdown occured because of instability... is that because the igpu overclock affected cpu stability? I'm guessing you couldnt turn it on again because of bad cmos? What exactly happened? I mean your story isn't exactly confidence inspiring lol. I'm just tuning a little igpu overclock because this is a stock system (its for a friend who knows nothing about computers, I got an nzxt havik on it and doing a minor overclock and off it'll go) but I want to avoid the igpu causing cpu/system instability.


HWMON showed my internal GPU was sucking 36Watts!! That's in addition to the 96Watts that I was already pulling through the cores. I wasn't using any descrete graphics card at that time. I'm not sure why my computer shut off. A bunch of little gremlins I guess. It happened two times the following morning on that same profile and I wasn't running furmark that time, just Prime 95. I set my GPU overclock back to 23 and took out two of the DIMMS and never had that problem again. It had to have been some sort of over-voltage, over-current, or thermal protection on the motherboard or power supply for it to shut down and not reset for a specific period of time. I have two CMOS copies on my motherboard, and it still would not power on even after switching to my secondary CMOS, and even though the power light was on.

Hmmm, as I sit here writing this, it dawned on me that the symptoms were very much like not having a CPU in the socket. Makes me wonder if I could have exceeded some current limit on the chip.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> MikeG,
> Thanks a lot, very good and detailed answer.
> So for max temps while stress testing 5.0 at a CPU-Z voltage of 1.408 you have 70c? Is that correct, and what are your ambient temps?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes the temperature on core 1 spiked up to 70c at one point, but I'm not sure when that was. I could have been testing my GPU or loading an application. My average temps for the past 11.5hrs is 56c and AIDA 64 is still running.
> 
> When referring to "ambient" temps, are most people talking about the idle temperature of the CPU, the temperature within the case, or the ambient temperature of the room? The temperature of my room at desk level, and on the floor near the intake of my computer is 20.6c (69F) .
Click to expand...

Ambient temp = Room temp


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does anyone know anything about overclocking the integrated graphics? (see sig rig:video editing build, worse 3570k than i even talked about, it binned worse, looking at 1.26v for 4.4, fail in 20 minutes on 4.5/1.32, msi g41, ares ram 2x2gb 1600 cl9 1.5v which seems okay at 2000 CL11 1t 1.65v, no gpu).
> 
> Does it affect cpu or ram stability? im assuming its just like assuming a graphics card - increase gpu voltage/frequency as necessary, make sure it passes 5 minutes of occt error testing and your good - but i dont know what voltages and frequencies to begin with or look at, and how it affects stability. this motherboard actually doesnt have igpu voltage, so... yea im curious what would be the frequency id be looking at, make sure that 5 min occt testing is the way to go, if it affects cpu stability at all.
> 
> thanks.


I have, using the intel extreme tuning software within windows works well. The iGPU memory is the system memory, so overclocking ram does make a difference for 3d with it.
Got the core up to 1873 in a 3dmark 06 competition. http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2304228_ftw_420_3dmark06_gma_hd_4000_11182_marks
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> HWMON showed my internal GPU was sucking 36Watts!! That's in addition to the 96Watts that I was already pulling through the cores. I wasn't using any descrete graphics card at that time. I'm not sure why my computer shut off. A bunch of little gremlins I guess. It happened two times the following morning on that same profile and I wasn't running furmark that time, just Prime 95. I set my GPU overclock back to 23 and took out two of the DIMMS and never had that problem again. It had to have been some sort of over-voltage, over-current, or thermal protection on the motherboard or power supply for it to shut down and not reset for a specific period of time. I have two CMOS copies on my motherboard, and it still would not power on even after switching to my secondary CMOS, and even though the power light was on.
> 
> Hmmm, as I sit here writing this, it dawned on me that the symptoms were very much like not having a CPU in the socket. Makes me wonder if I could have exceeded some current limit on the chip.


I had the rig on the kill-a-watt for the bench run above, 3770k using IGP, just the mobo, ssd & 1 ram fan was pulling ~ 230w for 3dmark 06 in the run above.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I'm just tuning a little igpu overclock because this is a stock system (its for a friend who knows nothing about computers, I got an nzxt havik on it and doing a minor overclock and off it'll go) but I want to avoid the igpu causing cpu/system instability.


You should have no trouble with a moderate igpu overclock. I would say 1300 (X26) would be safe if you are doing it for someone who knows nothing about computers. I set my igpu voltage to auto on my motherboard. Oh and the neat thing is that if you set it to auto (at least on my motherboard), the igpu acts as if it is in speedstep turbo mode. When not under heavy load, the voltage and speed is automatically reduced, and it ramps up when you need it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I got my hd3000 up to 2000mhz on air...and hd4000 to 1250mhz. Granted I had crappy Samsung sticks and my former ud5h which didn't play nice together. Haven't tried clocking it in Windows though, that should help with clocks.
Bet I can do MUCH better with psc and an MVG (and my Dragon f1 once it gets here)


----------



## Belial

Well, thanks for all the feedback, repped. I went into bios, this msi g41 board, i had to overclock gpu using the overclock genie menu (oc genie -> oc genie gpu control or something like that, set gpu to x26). 27 failed occt error test 1080p after like 1 minute, but 26 seemed just fine. There's no voltage control on this board. I just failed in 30 minutes of cpucct at 4.4ghz @ +.12=1.296vcore, 2000mhz CL11 1T 1.65v, x26 gpu. Could be the ram but im pretty sure its the cpu voltage because failures are quicker/later based on the cpu voltage (ie 5 minutes p95 with +08, 20 minutes with +.1, etc). Bumped up voltage to +.14, so far 40 min of occt cpu, hopefully it'll pass 24 hours p95 and I'll be done.

Quite sad though. 4.4ghz needs 1.312vcore on this chip (this is the worse of the 2 binned, this is the Video Editing build, ie msi g41, 3570k, 830ssd, 2x4gb gskill ares 1600 cl9 1.5v). I looked into exchanging my 3570k, one of them, for a i7-3770k at MC but they said they'd have to refund the motherboard combo price too.... so it'd be $40+50.

At least my other board is going 16 hours so far of p95, [email protected]+.195v = 1.416vcore. I just got that single good stick in, at it's xmp profile 2000 cl7 1.65v. if this passes then ill mess with 4.7 at 1.5v, maybe extreme llc or something on it (as i understand it, llc effectively adds voltage but serves to make it so you ultimately use less voltage than you'd need to set if you had less llc).


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> MikeG,
> Thanks a lot, very good and detailed answer.
> So for max temps while stress testing 5.0 at a CPU-Z voltage of 1.408 you have 70c? Is that correct, and what are your ambient temps?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes the temperature on core 1 spiked up to 70c at one point, but I'm not sure when that was. I could have been testing my GPU or loading an application. My average temps for the past 11.5hrs is 56c and AIDA 64 is still running.
> 
> When referring to "ambient" temps, are most people talking about the idle temperature of the CPU, the temperature within the case, or the ambient temperature of the room? The temperature of my room at desk level, and on the floor near the intake of my computer is 20.6c (69F) .
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Ambient temp = Room temp

Ambient temp is technically the air temp inside the case, but since the temp of the room and the temp inside the case tend to be within 1C of each other, you can count the room temp as ambient.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Was it worth it? That's a very subjective question and I'm sure everyone will have a different opinion. The risks are high, but also the rewards. For someone doing it for the first time, be prepared that you may damage your chip and/or your motherboard. Keep in mind, that I had a very good chip to begin with.
> 
> direct die vs. delidded:
> 
> Did I see a performance difference at 0°C? No
> Did I see a gain in MHz with ambient room temperatures of 20°C? Not really--not with VCore values that I feel comfortable with. Understand that I was already somewhat stable (I could run 10 passes of IBT) at 5.0GHz and 1.415V delidded.
> Did I see a reduction in temperatures? Yes, My temperatures were reduced by about 7 to 8°C from my hottest core.
> Was I able to reduce my VCore? Yes I was able to lower my VCore by 0.02V (5.0GHz with 1.395V)
> So what is the benefit for me? SILENT COMPUTING! I'm sitting here typing this and all the while my processor is running at 5.0GHz. My fans are set to 6.7V and will only lift a sheet of paper by about 1/2 inch when laid over the radiator. AIDA 64 stability test has been running the last 10.5 hours and my average core temps are 56°C.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Was I worried about too much or too little pressure on the die? Absolutely, with no way to measure how much pressure I was putting on the die, I just had to guess and hope I didn't break something. My first boot attempt resulted in post code 55. I loosened my water block a little and this time the motherboard would not stay powered on. It turned out that I was being too conservative with the pressure I was putting on the die. I increased the amount of pressure until finally I could boot. Now that I know exactly how far to tighten my block, I am extremely comfortable removing and remounting the block. I have done this half a dozen times already.
> Does it take nerves of steel? Yes


If you want my take on it as a well trained scientist, I don't think there is any difference between leaving the heatspreader and not. People are getting a placebo effect and thinking that going direct die is really making a difference. Technically the entire bottleneck to your heat dissapation would be from the die through that first layer of TIM as the area of contact is the smallest making the heat transfered per unit area the highest of any interface. So whether that heat is going directly to a cpu heatsink/waterblock or into the CPU heat spreader and then through the same TIM interface spread over a larger area thereby reducing the heat transfer requirements (heat per unit area) dramatically and then into the cpu heatsink/waterblock doesn't matter at that point. The only time it could matter is if your heatspreader does not make good contact with the die surface from being concave/convex, but you can have a concave/convex water block too and get bad results. So if you want my final feeling on direct die, it just doesn't make any scientific sense. Sorry guys you're just risking a cracked die. IMHO


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Was it worth it? That's a very subjective question and I'm sure everyone will have a different opinion. The risks are high, but also the rewards. For someone doing it for the first time, be prepared that you may damage your chip and/or your motherboard. Keep in mind, that I had a very good chip to begin with.
> 
> direct die vs. delidded:
> 
> Did I see a performance difference at 0°C? No
> Did I see a gain in MHz with ambient room temperatures of 20°C? Not really--not with VCore values that I feel comfortable with. Understand that I was already somewhat stable (I could run 10 passes of IBT) at 5.0GHz and 1.415V delidded.
> Did I see a reduction in temperatures? Yes, My temperatures were reduced by about 7 to 8°C from my hottest core.
> Was I able to reduce my VCore? Yes I was able to lower my VCore by 0.02V (5.0GHz with 1.395V)
> So what is the benefit for me? SILENT COMPUTING! I'm sitting here typing this and all the while my processor is running at 5.0GHz. My fans are set to 6.7V and will only lift a sheet of paper by about 1/2 inch when laid over the radiator. AIDA 64 stability test has been running the last 10.5 hours and my average core temps are 56°C.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Was I worried about too much or too little pressure on the die? Absolutely, with no way to measure how much pressure I was putting on the die, I just had to guess and hope I didn't break something. My first boot attempt resulted in post code 55. I loosened my water block a little and this time the motherboard would not stay powered on. It turned out that I was being too conservative with the pressure I was putting on the die. I increased the amount of pressure until finally I could boot. Now that I know exactly how far to tighten my block, I am extremely comfortable removing and remounting the block. I have done this half a dozen times already.
> Does it take nerves of steel? Yes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you want my take on it as a well trained scientist, I don't think there is any difference between leaving the heatspreader and not. People are getting a placebo effect and thinking that going direct die is really making a difference. Technically the entire bottleneck to your heat dissapation would be from the die through that first layer of TIM as the area of contact is the smallest making the heat transfered per unit area the highest of any interface. So whether that heat is going directly to a cpu heatsink/waterblock or into the CPU heat spreader and then through the same TIM interface spread over a larger area thereby reducing the heat transfer requirements (heat per unit area) dramatically and then into the cpu heatsink/waterblock doesn't matter at that point. The only time it could matter is if your heatspreader does not make good contact with the die surface from being concave/convex, but you can have a concave/convex water block too and get bad results. So if you want my final feeling on direct die, it just doesn't make any scientific sense. Sorry guys you're just risking a cracked die. IMHO
Click to expand...

Completely agree with this.







Also, to add a point, if you really want to get down and dirty with all those things, remove the glass pane on top of the die and add you own liquid metal on that and increase the die SA.


----------



## chann3l

I dont think there is any difference as long as you have good contact with the ihs to the die and block to ihs. Even if there is a few degree difference its probably not worth potentially crushing the die or possible dust build up on the PCB which would just be irritating to clean


----------



## sstephan

new member alert lol
heres my 377k de-lidded , direct die "proper" mount .
my temps @5g are a joke lol .





suicede runs


----------



## Belial

Has anyone actually crushed the die? I don't see the risk of direct die mounting (if anything, I would think higher temps if your cooling doesn't contact it well by going down that low). I don't really see a gain in it either, doesn't seem like people are getting temp drops from direct die mounting, as far as I've seen.


----------



## chann3l

there we go my new passmark score lol
http://www.passmark.com/baselines/V8/display.php?id=4689745287
cpu hit 12798 at 4.9 ghz in case your to lazy to click the link


----------



## $ilent

Sstephen what is that thing on top of the CPU block? Also 63c at 1.47v is amazing temps.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Are those stable volts or just bootable?
> I think im gonna go with the ud3h, considering its got decent VRM, mosfets onboard.
> 
> Back to delidded club ive not been added I see; I bought a cpu lapping kit few days ago right up to 2500 grit sandpaper so Ill have a new picture and proper submission in couple days.


Val gets pretty busy sometimes. He took more than a month and a reminder to get me on the list. This thread moves several pages a day and keeping up with every post while participating in other parts of the community and hopefully maintaining n active "life" is probably tough.


----------



## ivanlabrie

UK guys should go this event: http://www.overclock.net/t/1357015/50-person-ocn-uk-ln2-lan-48hr-event

I'm not even in the team and I would go grab a cold one and some ln2 for free lol


----------



## $ilent

already expressed an interest in that uk lan meet


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> If you want my take on it as a well trained scientist, I don't think there is any difference between leaving the heatspreader and not. People are getting a placebo effect and thinking that going direct die is really making a difference. Technically the entire bottleneck to your heat dissapation would be from the die through that first layer of TIM as the area of contact is the smallest making the heat transfered per unit area the highest of any interface. So whether that heat is going directly to a cpu heatsink/waterblock or into the CPU heat spreader and then through the same TIM interface spread over a larger area thereby reducing the heat transfer requirements (heat per unit area) dramatically and then into the cpu heatsink/waterblock doesn't matter at that point. The only time it could matter is if your heatspreader does not make good contact with the die surface from being concave/convex, but you can have a concave/convex water block too and get bad results. So if you want my final feeling on direct die, it just doesn't make any scientific sense. Sorry guys you're just risking a cracked die. IMHO


I really didn't want to start a debate, but as a "well trained scientist", where is your empirical evidence? Certainly a " well trained scientist" would do some kind of testing before speculating that it "doesn't make any scientific sense"

I have done some testing, not a whole lot, as I was not expecting to get published, but just enough to convince myself. I have done several mounts both with and without the IHS and each time they are consistent with the following table:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








Did I get a reduction in temperature -- Absolutely, 7 to 8 degrees off my hottest core at 5.0GHz.
Did it allow me to lower my VCore -- Absolutely, 0.020V at 5.0GHz.
I want to use LN2, will going direct die help me? -- I don't think so, my testing at 0 degrees showed no improvement, direct die vs IHS.
If I go direct die does it mean I can run 24/7 at 5.3 GHz? -- Probably not, as frequencies go up, so does the voltage required to gate those circuits at those speeds.

Here is a chart I did for my own research. It shows the minimum VCore required to pass 10 passes of IBT for my chip. The results are from a delidded chip before going direct die, but it should give you some general idea of what kind of voltages you will need to reach the next increment in speed:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I really didn't want to start a debate, but as a "well trained scientist", where is your empirical evidence? Certainly a " well trained scientist" would do some kind of testing before speculating that it "doesn't make any scientific sense"
> 
> I have done some testing, not a whole lot, as I was not expecting to get published, but just enough to convince myself. I have done several mounts both with and without the IHS and each time they are consistent with the following table:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did I get a reduction in temperature -- Absolutely, 7 to 8 degrees off my hottest core at 5.0GHz.
> Did it allow me to lower my VCore -- Absolutely, 0.20V at 5.0GHz.
> I want to use LN2, will going direct die help me? -- I don't think so, my testing at 0 degrees showed no improvement, direct die vs IHS.
> If I go direct die does it mean I can run 24/7 at 5.3 GHz? -- Probably not, as frequencies go up, so does the voltage required to gate those circuits at those speeds.
> 
> Here is a chart I did for my own research. It shows the minimum VCore required to pass 10 passes of IBT for my chip. The results are from a delidded chip before going direct die, but it should give you some general idea of what kind of voltages you will need to reach the next increment in speed:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


"As well trained scientist" I am supposed to spot the difference between what needs the time to actually be tested and what can be answered through common sense. I think the 7-8 degree diffference means your waterblock has a smoother contact area to the die than your ihs does. Try lapping your ihs and get back to me if you feel like doing "experiments".


----------



## chronicfx

Also if you are trying to tell me that an 8 degreed drop allowed you to go from 1.5v to 1.3v at 5ghz to pass IBT then youshouldn't be posting these types of results. That is utterly rediculous.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Also if you are trying to tell me that an 8 degreed drop allowed you to go from 1.5v to 1.3v at 5ghz to pass IBT then youshouldn't be posting these types of results. That is utterly rediculous.


I am not trying to be mean here. I am just telling you the truth as I see it. I will also give you background on "well trained", my father has a Ph.D in Chem and has been the chairman of chemistry at a university since I was born, my older brother has a Ph.D in chem and works at Bayer in Switzerland (Companies don't normally let american chemists work in switzerland or even the rest of europe for that matter unless you have the skills), my brother and I have been running reactions and tinkering with million dollar instrumentation since middle school. Heck I can maintain them like a mechanic swapping parts when needed. I myself am a chemist at a company that made more money than procter and gamble last year by a landslide. I don't want to come off like some kid arguing with you. I have a fairly good understanding of thermodynamics and can do all of the math involved. I am not going to go through that all on here as helpful as it may be, I don't get paid for this and I just want to participate and still learn things, my expertise is not in computer science, there are guys on here that would stomp me when it comes to computers, i bet more than 60% of the guys on this forum would. I am here to learn just like you Mike, but when people come to me and say here is my data "look" and I immediately find some important issues missing, like "did you lap the underside of the heatsink and your water block before making these claims?" I am sorry that you took all of that time to produce the data, but I am not convinced and probably wouldn't be if you found the same result 10 times in a row.

Anyway Mike lets be friends and get back to normal. Thats why I say "well trained" and thats all I ever wanted to say.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Also if you are trying to tell me that an 8 degreed drop allowed you to go from 1.5v to 1.3v at 5ghz to pass IBT then youshouldn't be posting these types of results. That is utterly rediculous.


I asked a simple question about going direct to die. MikeG has actually tested both and posted his results. Chronicfx, I don't know if you intended it but your posts come off as condescending and combative, and your claim that removing the IHS can't be anything but a placebo is illogical. That would be the same as claiming going from AS5 to CL Ultra on the die is nothing but a placebo.

You can very simply and easily test whether or not CLU give you temp drops vs. AS5, just like you can very simply and easily test whether going direct to die helps your temps if you have a setup that will allow it.

I have had three 3770k chips now and checked the "flatness" of the IHS on all of them. None were even remotely flat, and the worst part was they vary significantly. Their level of concavity was not the same, and one had measurably higher corners on one side than the others. Additionally the underside of the IHS that contacts the die is not flat either.

Taking those facts into account, you were exactly correct when you wrote "The only time it could matter is if your heatspreader does not make good contact with the die surface." It is quite literally physically impossible to make very good contact with any of the three Intel IHS I have inspected because they are not manufactured to any form of high standard to make them flat on the top or bottom.

The .2 was a typo, he listed it as a .02 drop previously, just like your misspelling of "rediculous" was a typo.


----------



## justanoldman

Chronicfx, saw your additional post now, thanks for that. This is a great thread, and healthy debate about subjects is a good thing. Hopefully we can all learn a little that way, or in my case learn a lot.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I asked a simple question about going direct to die. MikeG has actually tested both and posted his results. Chronicfx, I don't know if you intended it but your posts come off as condescending and combative, and your claim that removing the IHS can't be anything but a placebo is illogical. That would be the same as claiming going from AS5 to CL Ultra on the die is nothing but a placebo.
> 
> You can very simply and easily test whether or not CLU give you temp drops vs. AS5, just like you can very simply and easily test whether going direct to die helps your temps if you have a setup that will allow it.
> 
> I have had three 3770k chips now and checked the "flatness" of the IHS on all of them. None were even remotely flat, and the worst part was they vary significantly. Their level of concavity was not the same, and one had measurably higher corners on one side than the others. Additionally the underside of the IHS that contacts the die is not flat either.
> 
> Taking those facts into account, you were exactly correct when you wrote "The only time it could matter is if your heatspreader does not make good contact with the die surface." It is quite literally physically impossible to make very good contact with any of the three Intel IHS I have inspected because they are not manufactured to any form of high standard to make them flat on the top or bottom.
> 
> The .2 was a typo, he listed it as a .02 drop previously, just like your misspelling of "rediculous" was a typo.


Funny enough I read a forum where someone was trying to claim that ultra was no different and it was all to do with ambients. It made no sense lol


----------



## justanoldman

Reset, and start from the beginning since we are all friends here:
I figured out that my IHS is not flat, and learned from one source that even lapping it does not make it completely flat while being used due to the significant force caused by clamping it down on the mobo. Taking those two pieces of information into account, I wondered if going direct to die would be better simply because you eliminate the interference of the IHS which apparently cannot be made completely flat on the top and bottom while being used and clamped down. Unless, of course you could find a way to lap it while in your mobo.

It is only logical that removing the IHS which is never perfecly flat, and removing one of two layers of TIM would lower your temps. Lowering them how much is the question, and then the other questions are what are the risks of direct die contact and are they worth the temp drop. For his setup, MikeG has answered those questions.

Has anyone else tried direct to die so we could compare results?
If I am being dumb with these questions, that's OK, then I will learn something by figuring that out.


----------



## Stu-Crossfire

I think what he is trying to say is that all things being equal, if the mouting surfaces all contact the same area of die and waterblcok with no air gaps or varying pressures then the IHS removal would make very little if any at all difference and, as a guy who builds race engines for a living and has a pretty solid grasp of conductivity and thermal dynamics, I totally agree. (Assuming the conductivity of the IHS is sufficient and it is not acting as an insulator, which it may well be with that nickel coating it has on it)

However - my limited experience of the IHS is that they are significantly concave / convex so these things will never be equal and in theory, direct die contact from the primary cooler is likely going to produce better thermal conductivity unless you can perfectly lap the die on both sides and even then, does the mechanical strain of clampdown then warp it further? Ha anyone tested it when its installed, as opposed to on a bench?

However, even then, is the DIE itself actually perfectly FLAT? Has anyone checked? I didnt.

Maybe the IHS is supposed to be concave INSIDE to follow the surface of the die, and we are all making it worse. ROFLOL
Maybe being copper its just the thermal cyces that eventually lead to it being concave / convex?
(I left the inside of mine as standard)


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Reset, and start from the beginning since we are all friends here:
> I figured out that my IHS is not flat, and learned from one source that even lapping it does not make it completely flat while being used due to the significant force caused by clamping it down on the mobo. Taking those two pieces of information into account, I wondered if going direct to die would be better simply because you eliminate the interference of the IHS which apparently cannot be made completely flat on the top and bottom while being used and clamped down. Unless, of course you could find a way to lap it while in your mobo.
> 
> It is only logical that removing the IHS which is never perfecly flat, and removing one of two layers of TIM would lower your temps. Lowering them how much is the question, and then the other questions are what are the risks of direct die contact and are they worth the temp drop. For his setup, MikeG has answered those questions.
> 
> Has anyone else tried direct to die so we could compare results?
> If I am being dumb with these questions, that's OK, then I will learn something by figuring that out.


Questions are never dumb and anyone who says they are instead of trying to help shouldn't be on this forum. As for testing im too afraid to damage my chip my temps are great the way they are and its a good over locker


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Reset, and start from the beginning since we are all friends here:
> I figured out that my IHS is not flat, and learned from one source that even lapping it does not make it completely flat while being used due to the significant force caused by clamping it down on the mobo. Taking those two pieces of information into account, I wondered if going direct to die would be better simply because you eliminate the interference of the IHS which apparently cannot be made completely flat on the top and bottom while being used and clamped down. Unless, of course you could find a way to lap it while in your mobo.
> 
> It is only logical that removing the IHS which is never perfecly flat, and removing one of two layers of TIM would lower your temps. Lowering them how much is the question, and then the other questions are what are the risks of direct die contact and are they worth the temp drop. For his setup, MikeG has answered those questions.
> 
> Has anyone else tried direct to die so we could compare results?
> If I am being dumb with these questions, that's OK, then I will learn something by figuring that out.


That is a good theory too, if the clamping has enough force to make the ihs concave, which is possible i would think as it is supposedly made of copper and copper is maleable then the more "gentle" force of a "thumbtight" waterblock would be a better contact surface. Let me rephrase then, It is 100% about the contact of the surface between the die and whatever it contacts as long as it has a higher heat transfer, i.e. copper definitely does and would be found in waterblocks and the ihs. I will give you a +1 for that


----------



## Lobsterman

Speaking of waterblocks and such, does anyone else have a Phanteks PH TC14PE in the delidded club for comparing results?
Also I just noticed on page 1, unless Im blind, in the main table with all the results there isn't a column showing which cooling solution is being used!?!? i.e. air/water/etc
Surely that should be included for reference?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Val gets pretty busy sometimes. He took more than a month and a reminder to get me on the list. This thread moves several pages a day and keeping up with every post while participating in other parts of the community and hopefully maintaining n active "life" is probably tough.


Yeah, sorry about that guys in college and having 3 tests in 2 days isn't fun especially accounting tests... eeew. Plus I've really been trying to get into the benching area a lot more lately than normal I want to be a bencher, I just don't have hardware or money right now.

However I've missed the last few days post back in here. Also Illl comment on the submission format as well. I made the submission to join the way I did so I could tell a submissions from a normal post but sometimes this place moves so fast that I can't even keep up when reading through 130+ posts.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I really didn't want to start a debate, but as a "well trained scientist", where is your empirical evidence? Certainly a " well trained scientist" would do some kind of testing before speculating that it "doesn't make any scientific sense"
> 
> I have done some testing, not a whole lot, as I was not expecting to get published, but just enough to convince myself. I have done several mounts both with and without the IHS and each time they are consistent with the following table:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did I get a reduction in temperature -- Absolutely, 7 to 8 degrees off my hottest core at 5.0GHz.
> Did it allow me to lower my VCore -- Absolutely, 0.20V at 5.0GHz.
> I want to use LN2, will going direct die help me? -- I don't think so, my testing at 0 degrees showed no improvement, direct die vs IHS.
> If I go direct die does it mean I can run 24/7 at 5.3 GHz? -- Probably not, as frequencies go up, so does the voltage required to gate those circuits at those speeds.
> 
> Here is a chart I did for my own research. It shows the minimum VCore required to pass 10 passes of IBT for my chip. The results are from a delidded chip before going direct die, but it should give you some general idea of what kind of voltages you will need to reach the next increment in speed:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I likee the info you posted even if it isn't fuly proven insight from members is information in my eyes no matter if its from a 12 year old or a 70 old triple phd. ANYWAYS lol avoiding the heat of this, Im glad to see that you even had a vcore drop, that's pretty tough to get like most people actually know. I had a good vcore drop on my 4.7 but that was it. I couldn't get it any lower though.

But that's just me, humans are all different and are a communitative group, we always view things differently as we each have our own validation and credentials and experience.

Basically what Im saying is that no matter what people say is that we should treat each other with respect as we don't always know who is who on here, Unless you actually know each other.

Not to point anyone out just information and clarification on how I do things, we are all different and should be treated that way.


----------



## prest0

As I said 4 pages back my chip needed arround 1.330V for a stable prime test @4,5Ghz

Last night I did some IBT with different vcore and different stress level, and for my surprise it passed every test, even with the same vcore that I need for 4,4ghz stable (1,275). It passed the test with standard, high and very high stress level. Then I raised the Vcore back to 1.320 and did a prime test overnight. It crashed after 3 hours.

So do you guys think this is normal when comparing stability between p95 and IBT?


----------



## chronicfx

You are missing your calling. You should be a pilot valguar. My friends dad was a pilot then worked for the FAA. He even gave John travolta private lessons when he was learning to fly. He married a stewardess and lives a pretty nice life in a huge house. I still hang with his son from time to time he always promised to take us up in a Cessna but it never happened. Well the son went all the time but I never went with them. He had a stroke a few years back so no more flying anymore. I bet he would have let me grab the yoke when we got up in the air!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *prest0*
> 
> As I said 4 pages back my chip needed arround 1.330V for a stable prime test @4,5Ghz
> 
> Last night I did some IBT with different vcore and different stress level, and for my surprise it passed every test, even with the same vcore that I need for 4,4ghz stable (1,275). It passed the test with standard, high and very high stress level. Then I raised the Vcore back to 1.320 and did a prime test overnight. It crashed after 3 hours.
> 
> So do you guys think this is normal when comparing stability between p95 and IBT?


Not saying this is the same for everyone, but IBT is not of much use to me. Prime95 with 90%+ memory usage for 24 hours with no WHEA logger warnings is my first level of stability. I have found that IBT is too easy to pass vs. that.

Some people use IBT for a quick check to see temps and find a level to do longer testing. I actually like Prime95 using 8 for min and max FFT for 15 minutes tells me what I need to know about temps and to find a level appropriate for a longer test.


----------



## justanoldman

Speaking of Prime95, I have searched and found nothing but conflicting information about setting the priority of your Prime95 tests. For those who don't know, you can click on Test then Worker Windows, then choose a priority from 1 to 10. Default is 1 so that your screen saver and other background tasks can function normally.

If you choose 10 then most of your other programs including CPU-Z and other temp monitoring programs will go blank while Prime95 is running.

The internet "lore" is that you have to set it to 10 for a real stability test, but others disagree and say the workers will stop the same when encountering errors whether priority is 1 or 10.

In my brief testing I have not seen setting it to 10 make Prime95 a better stability tester. Anyone have any opinions on this?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Dare I say I shouldn't have de-lidded...


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Yes the temperature on core 1 spiked up to 70c at one point, but I'm not sure when that was. I could have been testing my GPU or loading an application. My average temps for the past 11.5hrs is 56c and AIDA 64 is still running.
> 
> *When referring to "ambient" temps, are most people talking about the idle temperature of the CPU, the temperature within the case, or the ambient temperature of the room? The temperature of my room at desk level, and on the floor near the intake of my computer is 20.6c (69F)* .


When I post temp results, the ambient temp is the temp inside the case. I have a temp sensor that measures room temp which also has a probe that I placed next to the motherboard. My fan controller also has 4 temp sensors at various places around the inside of the case


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> When I post temp results, the ambient temp is the temp inside the case. I have a temp sensor that measures room temp which also has a probe that I placed next to the motherboard. My fan controller also has 4 temp sensors at various places around the inside of the case


Agreed. You can't take room temperature as ambients. The temps inside of your case can differ largely because of the hear all your components produce. Example being my ambient temps are usually between 23 and 25 where as my room temps are usually between 15 and 20 degrees.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Dare I say I shouldn't have de-lidded...


I would assume it's my browser's problem but I can't open it in full .. :|

can you reupload elsewhere? Even dropbox it?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I would assume it's my browser's problem but I can't open it in full .. :|
> 
> can you reupload elsewhere? Even dropbox it?


Not your problem, nor mine - it is OCNET's problem it seems - I can't open it either:
http://cdn.overclock.net/9/92/92b13adf_Untitled.png

Direct link - right click tab.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Those temps seem high for 4.5GHz ... but maybe it's just me?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Those temps seem high for 4.5GHz ... but maybe it's just me?


They are pretty high for delidded with ultra at 4.5. I only hit 60 at 4.6 1.27v. I mean all chips are different...dubbed did you lap your ihs? Mine was really concave and if your running ultra on the ihs it'll have really poor contact with your water block just because it's such a thin layer it won't fill a co cave ohs like regular Tim will. I'd also double check your pressure on your block might not be quite tight enough. What were your temps before delidding? If they were about the same I would defiently look at your ihs and double check your ultra application on the die. Hopefully you get it figured out.


----------



## c2thew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Dare I say I shouldn't have de-lidded...


your temperatures aren't unreasonable for having used coolaboratory liquid pro.

Below is my temperature at 4.5ghz @ 1.288 using arctic MX-4 on the die and heatsink using a hyper 212 evo in push/pull. You are using an antec water cooler + coolaboratory liquid pro which justifies the 20 degree C temperature difference.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> your temperatures aren't unreasonable for having used coolaboratory liquid pro.
> 
> Below is my temperature at 4.5ghz @ 1.288 using arctic MX-4 on the die and heatsink using a hyper 212 evo in push/pull. You are using an antec water cooler + coolaboratory liquid pro which justifies the 20 degree C temperature difference.


Then how would you justify these temperatures?


----------



## Lobsterman

I think he may have a particularly intensive WU as I barely hit 60 C on my aircooler, but they do seem high even for FAH @ 4.5


----------



## Hokies83

And she is back from RMA..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> You are missing your calling. You should be a pilot valguar. My friends dad was a pilot then worked for the FAA. He even gave John travolta private lessons when he was learning to fly. He married a stewardess and lives a pretty nice life in a huge house. I still hang with his son from time to time he always promised to take us up in a Cessna but it never happened. Well the son went all the time but I never went with them. He had a stroke a few years back so no more flying anymore. I bet he would have let me grab the yoke when we got up in the air!


This... is kinda touchy for me. But I'll explain it anyways.

There is 2 main reasons why I'm not a commercial aviation major anymore.

1. I was never a fan of the lifestyle for the Commercial pilot, what I wanted to be when I later fell in love with flying (just the flying part as being in the air with oneself and seeing everything around you just in the plane) so just flying. That I wanted to be a Crop duster (they spray chemicals on crop to help farmers with their yields) I wanted to do so because I've come from a farming community and feel at home there, and I'd rather live in the country than in a huge city any day. The regulations that go into learning how to fly the FedEx and such planes are such a pain in the but to learn and the shear amount of time you invest into flying at my college (best in the world UND look it up if you'd like) it's so crazy expensive here. I assume everyone here who's gone through college has loans..... I wish I just had normal loans like most students say of like 10 grand after 4 years. Pffffft I burned 30K in one year 16K on school and another 16K getting my license (and that is only for my private license so I can flying myself and friends and not make a dime off it) I have my tail wheel license as well (add 6 K). I had another 80K in flight costs alone. Yes I love flying but the cost for the reward after you get that very very spendy diploma is so underpayed that it's not even funny... An aviation students walks out with roughly 120K to 200K debt on his shoulders. Wanna know what starting pay is? 20 K yeah no joke almost any corporation you start with will pay you darn close to that. This isn't even sometimes enough to pay your bills let alone have food and a place to sleep when you're flying across the US and don't get a paid hotel by your company (none of them do this anymore unless you've been there a very long time). Yes the pay is amazing 20 years down the road... but that starting pay is so stressfull that the suicide rates of pilots is getting higher and the divorce rates are even scarier. I already have the love of my life. I hate being away from her like I am this semester. 3 years of dating this March, first girl I've ever dated, and love her unconditionally, I will do everything in my power to keep her and be happy. I would rather sacrifice a dream job to be with the love of my life, I have a license and she almost does as well (God bless her for trying and she ran out of money in one semester). Simply put.... in my mind and view of the world the downsides of the aviation life do not satisfy the pay and the experience.... nothing will every give you back missing your child being born because your forced to work to pay your bills or miss them walk or miss a game of theirs. I will never sacrifice my child's dreams of showing his/her abilities to their parent by me having to work to barely get food on the table. I am currently pursuing Entrepreneurship due to that I'd love to have a company some day (I already do right now but we can't personally fund it since we (the CEO's me and a friend) are in college and were aviation majors. I love technology and always will I love learning every new trick to things like benching and OC'ing and just technology, thats why I made the club and think so thoroughly on topics with diagnosing issues with computers. (that was a lot longer than I thought it was going to be lol) (woopsies but feels good getting it off my chest once and a while)

2. I also have 2 younger sisters, college is hard enough to pay for myself to go..... but I can't jeopardize my sisters dreams because I'm greedy and need all of my parents income to pay for my school. I'm one of those guys who if I meet someone and only know them for a day and hear they need a organ transplant and I'm a match I try my hardest to donate it to them without a moments regret.

I'm just a nice country kid who knows technology and learned how to be nice and honorable through being an Eagle Scout and seeing what the world needs.









But hey, that's just me I suppose








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Not your problem, nor mine - it is OCNET's problem it seems - I can't open it either:
> http://cdn.overclock.net/9/92/92b13adf_Untitled.png
> 
> Direct link - right click tab.


same issues here.... what are your room temps? I bet you've answered this but I'm sorry been typing the above wall for a while. I'm at 1.25 vcore and 45 multi and have a max of 75C and I'm NOT delidded.... but I do have an H100 which has double the surface area of the 920. I really wanna say it's the 920 man. The limited airflow you can get through a 120mm rad can limit them. doesn't matter on the TIM or anything if the RAD can't get rid of it... it'll just level off.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> This... is kinda touchy for me. But I'll explain it anyways.
> 
> There is 2 main reasons why I'm not a commercial aviation major anymore.
> 
> 1. I was never a fan of the lifestyle for the Commercial pilot, what I wanted to be when I later fell in love with flying (just the flying part as being in the air with oneself and seeing everything around you just in the plane) so just flying. That I wanted to be a Crop duster (they spray chemicals on crop to help farmers with their yields) I wanted to do so because I've come from a farming community and feel at home there, and I'd rather live in the country than in a huge city any day. The regulations that go into learning how to fly the FedEx and such planes are such a pain in the but to learn and the shear amount of time you invest into flying at my college (best in the world UND look it up if you'd like) it's so crazy expensive here. I assume everyone here who's gone through college has loans..... I wish I just had normal loans like most students say of like 10 grand after 4 years. Pffffft I burned 30K in one year 16K on school and another 16K getting my license (and that is only for my private license so I can flying myself and friends and not make a dime off it) I have my tail wheel license as well (add 6 K). I had another 80K in flight costs alone. Yes I love flying but the cost for the reward after you get that very very spendy diploma is so underpayed that it's not even funny... An aviation students walks out with roughly 120K to 200K debt on his shoulders. Wanna know what starting pay is? 20 K yeah no joke almost any corporation you start with will pay you darn close to that. This isn't even sometimes enough to pay your bills let alone have food and a place to sleep when you're flying across the US and don't get a paid hotel by your company (none of them do this anymore unless you've been there a very long time). Yes the pay is amazing 20 years down the road... but that starting pay is so stressfull that the suicide rates of pilots is getting higher and the divorce rates are even scarier. I already have the love of my life. I hate being away from her like I am this semester. 3 years of dating this March, first girl I've ever dated, and love her unconditionally, I will do everything in my power to keep her and be happy. I would rather sacrifice a dream job to be with the love of my life, I have a license and she almost does as well (God bless her for trying and she ran out of money in one semester). Simply put.... in my mind and view of the world the downsides of the aviation life do not satisfy the pay and the experience.... nothing will every give you back missing your child being born because your forced to work to pay your bills or miss them walk or miss a game of theirs. I will never sacrifice my child's dreams of showing his/her abilities to their parent by me having to work to barely get food on the table. I am currently pursuing Entrepreneurship due to that I'd love to have a company some day (I already do right now but we can't personally fund it since we (the CEO's me and a friend) are in college and were aviation majors. I love technology and always will I love learning every new trick to things like benching and OC'ing and just technology, thats why I made the club and think so thoroughly on topics with diagnosing issues with computers. (that was a lot longer than I thought it was going to be lol) (woopsies but feels good getting it off my chest once and a while)
> 
> 2. I also have 2 younger sisters, college is hard enough to pay for myself to go..... but I can't jeopardize my sisters dreams because I'm greedy and need all of my parents income to pay for my school. I'm one of those guys who if I meet someone and only know them for a day and hear they need a organ transplant and I'm a match I try my hardest to donate it to them without a moments regret.
> 
> I'm just a nice country kid who knows technology and learned how to be nice and honorable through being an Eagle Scout and seeing what the world needs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But hey, that's just me I suppose
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> same issues here.... what are your room temps? I bet you've answered this but I'm sorry been typing the above wall for a while. I'm at 1.25 vcore and 45 multi and have a max of 75C and I'm NOT delidded.... but I do have an H100 which has double the surface area of the 920. I really wanna say it's the 920 man. The limited airflow you can get through a 120mm rad can limit them. doesn't matter on the TIM or anything if the RAD can't get rid of it... it'll just level off.


The rad in the 920 is REALLY thick and with high fpi, it matches the H100 actually barely.
I think his pump may be defective, guess it's RMA time.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The rad in the 920 is REALLY thick and with high fpi, it matches the H100 actually barely.
> I think his pump may be defective, guess it's RMA time.


or.. what pump speed are you running TD? is it even change able? if so crank that thing and see if that helps... also set fans up higher. it'll tune out eventually lol.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

It's at 3k constant. Don't know why my temps are always worse than everyone I know...if something gets rma'ed then you can guess what else will be rmaed too.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And she is back from RMA..


----------



## ORAC

Val,

When you have the chance, would you please revise my club OC information.

I have now overclocked to 4.8 GHz with the max core temperature of 72C as measured by RealTemp after 10 runs of IBT Standard. See below.

In addition to reconfiguring my cooling fans, I am now running CLU between the heatsink and the HIS. Before I had been using AS5.

The overall drop in temperature from the stock chip is now just 11C (83C - 72C) but the overall MHz has increased to 1100 MHz (3.7 GHz to 4.8GHz).

I am running a +0.20 Vcore offset with a Level 2 CPU LLC resulting in my Vcore maxing out at 1.328 volts. I am still running SpeedStep, Turbo Boost, C1E and CPU Throttling.

I have also overclocked the GT to 1500 Mhz using a +0.110 volt offset and a Level 2 IGPU LLC.

Thanks.

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2685831


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ORAC*
> 
> Val,
> 
> When you have the chance, would you please revise my club OC information.
> 
> I have now overclocked to 4.8 GHz with the max core temperature of 72C as measured by RealTemp after 10 runs of IBT Standard. See below.
> 
> In addition to reconfiguring my cooling fans, I am now running CLU between the heatsink and the HIS. Before I had been using AS5.
> 
> The overall drop in temperature from the stock chip is now just 11C (83C - 72C) but the overall MHz has increased to 1100 MHz (3.7 GHz to 4.8GHz).
> 
> I am running a +0.20 Vcore offset with a Level 2 CPU LLC resulting in my Vcore maxing out at 1.328 volts. I am still running SpeedStep, Turbo Boost, C1E and CPU Throttling.
> 
> I have also overclocked the GT to 1500 Mhz using a +0.110 volt offset and a Level 2 IGPU LLC.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2685831


Updated!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Speaking of Prime95, I have searched and found nothing but conflicting information about setting the priority of your Prime95 tests. For those who don't know, you can click on Test then Worker Windows, then choose a priority from 1 to 10. Default is 1 so that your screen saver and other background tasks can function normally.
> 
> If you choose 10 then most of your other programs including CPU-Z and other temp monitoring programs will go blank while Prime95 is running.
> 
> The internet "lore" is that you have to set it to 10 for a real stability test, but others disagree and say the workers will stop the same when encountering errors whether priority is 1 or 10.
> 
> In my brief testing I have not seen setting it to 10 make Prime95 a better stability tester. Anyone have any opinions on this?


Just an FYI, I am testing this now.
I had a stopped worker at 10 hours 48 min in my current test, then I didn't make any changes to anything except moved the priority of Prime95 from 1 to 10. Currently running the same test again to see if there is any difference between the two.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> The .2 was a typo, he listed it as a .02 drop previously, just like your misspelling of "rediculous" was a typo.


Thanks oldman, I went back and corrected it.


----------



## chann3l

Just installed my second rad will be posting 4.9 comparison temps when im done and pics







filling now wish me luck


----------



## megawatz

Anybody know why I'm getting 100c temps in IBT now after 2-3 weeks of it being de-lidded?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Anybody know why I'm getting 100c temps in IBT now after 2-3 weeks of it being de-lidded?


Page one says you used AS5 on the die and on the IHS, and that you got no temp drop from delidding. Is that correct?


----------



## megawatz

Well, it was about 5c, give or take. But even after I was still getting max 82c on IBT not last week. No real strenuous tests, I have been working on a couple of WUs overnight, but my ambient temps haven't changed.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Well, it was about 5c, give or take. But even after I was still getting max 82c on IBT not last week. No real strenuous tests, I have been working on a couple of WUs overnight, but my ambient temps haven't changed.


Get some cool labs.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Well, it was about 5c, give or take. But even after I was still getting max 82c on IBT not last week. No real strenuous tests, I have been working on a couple of WUs overnight, but my ambient temps haven't changed.


I lost 10 degrees day one with as5 by day 3 pump out had done its thing and i was back to stock temps. With liquid ultra i have dropped 24 degrees and its staying that way no pump out


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Well, it was about 5c, give or take. But even after I was still getting max 82c on IBT not last week. No real strenuous tests, I have been working on a couple of WUs overnight, but my ambient temps haven't changed.


That small of a drop from delidding doesn't really make sense to me, since I used AS5 on both while waiting for Ultra and I got 10c from it. Are you sure you didn't use too much, and that your cooler is mounted well?

From what I understand AS5 is not a good idea for the die, it is the wrong consistency. That could be why it is not working as well as it was. Replacing it with Ultra, then remounting the cooler and make sure nothing is wrong there would be my advice.


----------



## megawatz

I guess I am going to have to drop the money on CLU.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> or.. what pump speed are you running TD? is it even change able? if so crank that thing and see if that helps... also set fans up higher. it'll tune out eventually lol.


Is it weird that when I see your name I pronounce it in my head "Val-Grrrrrrrrrr"?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I guess I am going to have to drop the money on CLU.


17.99 including tax and shipping at big river, not sure if it is cheaper anywhere else. It is definitely worth it on the die.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Is it weird that when I see your name I pronounce it in my head "Val-Grrrrrrrrrr"?


Since I am old and out of it, I don't know how to say it, or what it means. I actually associate everyone by their avatar, so I get lost when people change them.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Anybody know why I'm getting 100c temps in IBT now after 2-3 weeks of it being de-lidded?


Pump out? What Tim are you using?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Anybody know why I'm getting 100c temps in IBT now after 2-3 weeks of it being de-lidded?


because u didnt use coolabs liquid pro/ultra


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I guess I am going to have to drop the money on CLU.


i quess so


----------



## chann3l

Added a swiftech extreme series 120 rad to my loop to work alongside my Ex240.




4.9 ghz @ 1.445v IBT max temp comparison

Before 120 rad max temp 73

After 120 rad max temp 70

Only dropped another 3 degrees but it looks awesome so its worth it


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Added a swiftech extreme
> 
> Only dropped another 3 degrees but it looks awesome so its worth it


Are you not cooling your GPU with your loop? I thought that was the point of a second rad, when people add a GPU into it.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Are you not cooling your GPU with your loop? I thought that was the point of a second rad, when people add a GPU into it.


ya that would be the point lol. But my gpu is core 1000 and mem 1300 right now and if I play bf3 for say 5 hours the temp doesn't exceed 54 degrees sooo I don't see the point in adding it into my loop. Maybe eventually but I just bought the extra rad prior to geting my liquid ultra thinking that my water temps would go up because of the extra dissipated heat but it did not and ncix has a no return policy on watercooling gear and you know what 3 degrees is worth 23 for fittings + 50 for rad + 23 for fan....hmmm..It looks pretty so thats good enough for me


----------



## ivanlabrie

Used fittings, or barb+clamp and cheap swiftech helix fans in p/p









Not as pretty but well...


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Used fittings, or barb+clamp and cheap swiftech helix fans in p/p
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not as pretty but well...


Whatever gets the job done







it hurts spending 6 dollars for one stupid fitting lol came to 23 bucks for two compression's and a 90 adapter


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ouch...I couldn't justify spending all that on fittings alone. But well, my pockets ain't that deep.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Whatever gets the job done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it hurts spending 6 dollars for one stupid fitting lol came to 23 bucks for two compression's and a 90 adapter


LoL my comp fittings are 8$ each and 90s are like 19$ each.. You pay for bitspower @ 1/2 id 3/4 od 45s are 17$

And i have 5 45s 5 90s and 10 comp fittings @[email protected]


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL my comp fittings are 8$ each and 90s are like 19$ each.. You pay for bitspower @ 1/2 id 3/4 od 45s are 17$
> 
> And i have 5 45s 5 90s and 10 comp fittings @[email protected]


I'm working a deal for some 3/8 1/2OD bits. I need help finding a block though. Not sure what to look for in a block.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm working a deal for some 3/8 1/2OD bits. I need help finding a block though. Not sure what to look for in a block.


I linked u that one that was like 35$ lol it will work fine.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL my comp fittings are 8$ each and 90s are like 19$ each.. You pay for bitspower @ 1/2 id 3/4 od 45s are 17$
> 
> And i have 5 45s 5 90s and 10 comp fittings @[email protected]


I have swiftech and tfc fittings 8 total and a bitspower y block and temp sensor stop fitting and koolance filter and two 45s and a 90 So about 90 dollars in fittings lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I linked u that one that was like 35$ lol it will work fine.


He said he didnt have it anymore.









Whats up with the Koolance 370si and Heatkiller 3.0? Those are decent right? Someone offered them but didnt get a definitive price. Maybe a trade with either my 7950 Vapor-X or Reference 7970.

He also had 10 bits 1/2 3/4OD's


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> He said he didnt have it anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whats up with the Koolance 370si and Heatkiller 3.0? Those are decent right? Someone offered them but didnt get a definitive price. Maybe a trade with either my 7950 Vapor-X or Reference 7970.
> 
> He also had 10 bits 1/2 3/4OD's


Heat killer 3.0 is good. just check value at frozen cpu etc and subtract 25% for it being used.

Used bitspower comp fittings go for 5$ each heatkiller 3.0 can be had for 55$ new.. so he has about 105$ worth of stuff.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heat killer 3.0 is good. just check value at frozen cpu etc and subtract 25% for it being used.
> 
> Used bitspower comp fittings go for 5$ each heatkiller 3.0 can be had for 55$ new.. so he has about 105$ worth of stuff.


Okay, thanks dude. I want to switch out one of my 7950/7970s for a 660ti/670/680 (want it for folding) with cash either way if needed. I have an ad up in the marketplace.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Okay, thanks dude. I want to switch out one of my 7950/7970s for a 660ti/670/680 (want it for folding) with cash either way if needed. I have an ad up in the marketplace.


LoL i was gonna say that 7970 + 165$ for 1 of my 680s heh.

But the back side of it is to ugly XD


----------



## chann3l

Officially hit 5.1 ghz took 1.6 volts and setting my ram to stock clocks to do it tho...Temps hit 85 max in prime 95 didnt want to do ibt just to see some 90s









http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2686394


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Officially hit 5.1 ghz took 1.6 volts and setting my ram to stock clocks to do it tho...Temps hit 85 max in prime 95 didnt want to do ibt just to see some 90s
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2686394


Updated!









Gonna try to keep up on this more now!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Updated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna try to keep up on this more now!


Haha thanks that was fast. I think 5.1 is my limit the voltage is just too much. Its like 4.9 1.445 70 max temps then 1.57 for 5 and 1.62 in bios for 5.1 cpuz just read as 1.6


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Updated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna try to keep up on this more now!


Haha thanks that was fast. I think 5.1 is my limit the voltage is just too much. Its like 4.9 1.445 70 max temps then 1.57 for 5 and 1.62 in bios for 5.1 cpuz just read as 1.6


----------



## chann3l

For the record I only hit submit once it just posted 4 times


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool! I wouldn't validate higher than that without cold.
Try to validate high ram clocks, closer to 3ghz...that's good fun and it's safe. Works good with cold air.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool! I wouldn't validate higher than that without cold.
> Try to validate high ram clocks, closer to 3ghz...that's good fun and it's safe. Works good with cold air.


Ya im good with being able to hot 5.1 on water







I have my ram over to 2133 10 11 10 28 right now might try and push it a bit higher







maybe pick up a ram block for 50 bucks and get it under water too


----------



## sstephan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Sstephen what is that thing on top of the CPU block? Also 63c at 1.47v is amazing temps.


its an indicator gauge , shows distance .
i used it to properly mount the cpu , so the pins on the cpu socket will compress the same ammount , as with original socket clamp (clamp was removed for direct die mounting)
the compression pressure of the original socket clamp is around 40kg (for those that think the die might break under pressure...)


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sstephan*
> 
> its an indicator gauge , shows distance .
> i used it to properly mount the cpu , so the pins on the cpu socket will compress the same ammount , as with original socket clamp (clamp was removed for direct die mounting)
> the compression pressure of the original socket clamp is around 40kg (for those that think the die might break under pressure...)


Crazy temps as silent said...got me beat I hit 70 in ibt at 1.445


----------



## MikeG

My Firestrike score for the MSI 3DMark Challenge http://www.3dmark.com/fs/115676

@chann3l, my pathetic GTX 560 Ti is no match for your HD 7950


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> My Firestrike score for the MSI 3DMark Challenge http://www.3dmark.com/fs/115676
> 
> @chann3l, my pathetic GTX 560 Ti is no match for your HD 7950


you found my score i see lol. It kind of sucks because as fast as my computer is someone with x79 and 2011 socket cpu will destroy me and win parts that they probably already have Unless im wrong and the winner is randomly picked but I doubt it lol That firestrike is pretty damn demanding.

heres mine http://www.3dmark.com/fs/115508

I thought it was great untill I saw all the 8XXXs and the 10000

You'd beat me hands down with a better gpu tho lol 5.2 ghz


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> My Firestrike score for the MSI 3DMark Challenge http://www.3dmark.com/fs/115676
> 
> @chann3l, my pathetic GTX 560 Ti is no match for your HD 7950


What voltage did you need to get 5.2 stable?


----------



## chann3l

Hey why does it say that my hwbot username that I put in profile is moderator deleted? who do I message about this it is my hwbot lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hey why does it say that my hwbot username that I put in profile is moderator deleted? who do I message about this it is my hwbot lol


explain this bit more lol. not sure what you mean.

here's my 3dmark at the stock gpu and at 4.5 giggles.

http://www.3dmark.com/fs/54531


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> explain this bit more lol. not sure what you mean.
> 
> here's my 3dmark at the stock gpu and at 4.5 giggles.
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/54531


I mean that it says on ocn in my profile that my hwbot name submission was moderator deleted apparently someone said its because my hwbot points haven't shown up yet and they won't add you without points


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What voltage did you need to get 5.2 stable?


1.54V. I wouldn't exactly call it stable, but enough to run the benchmark.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I mean that it says on ocn in my profile that my hwbot name submission was moderator deleted apparently someone said its because my hwbot points haven't shown up yet and they won't add you without points


you don;t have enough points... you need around 7 I believe.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> you don;t have enough points... you need around 7 I believe.


Got 11 points for entering msi direstrike comp they just have not shown up yet


----------



## Swag

I'm receiving my Asus RMA board on Monday, I've been getting interested in trying out different TIM applications and I think I'm going to use the spread smoothly method this time and see how the temps go. Any thoughts on the matter of TIM application?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm receiving my Asus RMA board on Monday, I've been getting interested in trying out different TIM applications and I think I'm going to use the spread smoothly method this time and see how the temps go. Any thoughts on the matter of TIM application?


ON the IHS or ON the die?

I personally feel that the LINE METHOD is 10x better for spread than the pea sized method for ON THE IHS, when I install my i3 to my mum's PC and re-install my i7 -> they will be line methods used.
People raved about the use of pea sized and critique me "using too much TIM" when I found that the Antec stock cooler paste was crap...they were wrong - simply put.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm receiving my Asus RMA board on Monday, I've been getting interested in trying out different TIM applications and I think I'm going to use the spread smoothly method this time and see how the temps go. Any thoughts on the matter of TIM application?
> 
> 
> 
> ON the IHS or ON the die?
> 
> I personally feel that the LINE METHOD is 10x better for spread than the pea sized method for ON THE IHS, when I install my i3 to my mum's PC and re-install my i7 -> they will be line methods used.
> People raved about the use of pea sized and critique me "using too much TIM" when I found that the Antec stock cooler paste was crap...they were wrong - simply put.
Click to expand...

On the IHS, not on the die, the die has to be spread if you want to use the CLP/CLU.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> On the IHS, not on the die, the die has to be spread if you want to use the CLP/CLU.


Exactly, but my favorite method is line method. not randomly line btw . it must be aligned with the cpu or gpu die


----------



## ivanlabrie

I use pea dot in the middle...same as Martin from martins liquid lab.


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm receiving my Asus RMA board on Monday, I've been getting interested in trying out different TIM applications and I think I'm going to use the spread smoothly method this time and see how the temps go. Any thoughts on the matter of TIM application?


I used it for the first time on my most recent mount after reassembling my rig a few days ago actually. Using Phobya HEGrease and I'm not really seeing any temperature difference, albeit I may have a 1-2*C tighter grouping on my cores. Have always used the pea method before but had so recently done the die of my i7 with pro and a spread that I just kinda started spreading it out before I knew what I was doing.

Albeit for an IHS-Block TIM the Phobya is exceptional, spreads amazingly easy and gives far better temps than anything else I have used. Tried an application of Pro for IHS and Block and my coolest core was a degree lower but the spread was almost 10*C between the 4.

Just what I've experienced so far, and certainly not a very scientific test.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> On the IHS, not on the die, the die has to be spread if you want to use the CLP/CLU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly, but my favorite method is line method. not randomly line btw . it must be aligned with the cpu or gpu die
Click to expand...

So you just put a line on the middle for the Ivys?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I use pea dot in the middle...same as Martin from martins liquid lab.


Martins liquid lab?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm receiving my Asus RMA board on Monday, I've been getting interested in trying out different TIM applications and I think I'm going to use the spread smoothly method this time and see how the temps go. Any thoughts on the matter of TIM application?
> 
> 
> 
> I used it for the first time on my most recent mount after reassembling my rig a few days ago actually. Using Phobya HEGrease and I'm not really seeing any temperature difference, albeit I may have a 1-2*C tighter grouping on my cores. Have always used the pea method before but had so recently done the die of my i7 with pro and a spread that I just kinda started spreading it out before I knew what I was doing.
> 
> Albeit for an IHS-Block TIM the Phobya is exceptional, spreads amazingly easy and gives far better temps than anything else I have used. Tried an application of Pro for IHS and Block and my coolest core was a degree lower but the spread was almost 10*C between the 4.
> 
> Just what I've experienced so far, and certainly not a very scientific test.
Click to expand...

So you're using the smooth spread application?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So you just put a line on the middle for the Ivys?
> Martins liquid lab?
> So you're using the smooth spread application?


I used liquid ultra on the die and ihs but when I used as5 I did a line on the ihs going vertically over where the die is


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> you found my score i see lol. It kind of sucks because as fast as my computer is someone with x79 and 2011 socket cpu will destroy me and win parts that they probably already have Unless im wrong and the winner is randomly picked but I doubt it lol That firestrike is pretty damn demanding.
> 
> heres mine http://www.3dmark.com/fs/115508
> 
> I thought it was great untill I saw all the 8XXXs and the 10000
> 
> You'd beat me hands down with a better gpu tho lol 5.2 ghz


There is a lucky draw part of the competition, the main part does go with the highest scores though. Not sure if the current leader will be staying in there, usually the MSI comps that need a validation require it to be a valid validation.
I was kinda waiting to see how it plays out before subbing a score, have an 11k with invalid driver & tess setting, 10148 with invalid driver & 10052 completely valid so far.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Hey why does it say that my hwbot username that I put in profile is moderator deleted? who do I message about this it is my hwbot lol


You have to have a 5 point minimum hwbot points for the OCN hwbot postbit.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm receiving my Asus RMA board on Monday, I've been getting interested in trying out different TIM applications and I think I'm going to use the spread smoothly method this time and see how the temps go. Any thoughts on the matter of TIM application?


I was testing with AS5 because it is cheap, easy to use, and easy to clean. That was helpful in my 30 or so tests of mounting a cooler to an IHS. No two coolers are the same, and no two IHS are the same, therefore there is no "best" way, only what is best for your setup.

I have tested three 3770k, one Antec cooler, and two Corsair coolers. The best way to know is try different combinations and different amounts of TIM. Then there is orientation of the cooling block, and how you tighten it down (not only how tight but which screw in which order). For example, in my current setup the best solution, by far, is the cooler block upside down and screwed down at the top first.

So you try single drop, line, spread, and each one of those can be varied as too how much. Additionally there are usually four positions for the cold plate orientation of your cooler. Each test you check temps and then look at the "fingerprint" that the TIM leaves on both surfaces. You will quickly discover that fingerprint tells you a lot about how effective the cooling will be.

I also found that you can absolutely use too little Ultra on the die. There was so much talk about everyone using too much, I tried multiple times using less and less. Too little is very possible to do, so you just have to test it. This again is chip dependent because the shape of your specific IHS will determine the optimal amount of TIM to be used on both the die and on top of the IHS.

The proper amount on the die is more important than the proper amount on top of the IHS though. But most people don't care about a few degrees either way, so as long as you get the TIM application on the die as close to perfect (for your particular chip) as possible, then you will get the best results. An OK application on top of the IHS vs. a perfect makes a difference, but not as much as getting right with the TIM application on the die. Is that a long enough answer for you?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> An OK application on top of the IHS vs. a perfect makes a difference, but not as much as getting right with the TIM application on the die. Is that a long enough answer for you?


As probably no one will rep - I will - that's a brilliant response, even though it wasn't for me.
I'm sorry for screwing up your unique rep count justanoldman too much...but:


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There is a lucky draw part of the competition, the main part does go with the highest scores though. Not sure if the current leader will be staying in there, usually the MSI comps that need a validation require it to be a valid validation.
> I was kinda waiting to see how it plays out before subbing a score, have an 11k with invalid driver & tess setting, 10148 with invalid driver & 10052 completely valid so far.
> You have to have a 5 point minimum hwbot points for the OCN hwbot postbit.


Damn im in 9th place with my 6972 ram at 2133 CPU @4.9 and you at 1050 and 1400. If I get my gpu too 1100 and 1575 by bumping the voltage it should help if I can get to 9000 I could have second place







any other suggestions ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Damn im in 9th place with my 6972 ram at 2133 CPU @4.9 and you at 1050 and 1400. If I get my gpu too 1100 and 1575 by bumping the voltage it should help if I can get to 9000 I could have second place
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any other suggestions ?


I'm just looking at some 3dmark scores done in win8 & finally considering win8. Looks like it might do considerably better than 7, first thing I've seen that actually makes it look worthwhile for.
Hoping some guys compare 7 to 8 scores & see just how much difference.
Haven't found any actual tweaks for 3dmark yet, I've just been going with horsepower.
Your card should be able to do more than 1100/1575, I don't really know 7950s well but the core should be able to go higher & I would be shocked if the memory couldn't. Supposed to get around the 0° area tonight, get the rig outdoors for an ambient temp mod, I will be for some air cooled 680 overclocking.

There are a few guys currently in the rankings who will be subbing monster scores, dRweEz is currently third but at the end he will probably be the guy to beat...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> you found my score i see lol. It kind of sucks because as fast as my computer is someone with x79 and 2011 socket cpu will destroy me and win parts that they probably already have Unless im wrong and the winner is randomly picked but I doubt it lol That firestrike is pretty damn demanding.
> 
> heres mine http://www.3dmark.com/fs/115508
> 
> I thought it was great untill I saw all the 8XXXs and the 10000
> 
> You'd beat me hands down with a better gpu tho lol 5.2 ghz


thats weak lol








http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/149428


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thats weak lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/149428


Barely beating you


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'm just looking at some 3dmark scores done in win8 & finally considering win8. Looks like it might do considerably better than 7, first thing I've seen that actually makes it look worthwhile for.
> Hoping some guys compare 7 to 8 scores & see just how much difference.
> Haven't found any actual tweaks for 3dmark yet, I've just been going with horsepower.
> Your card should be able to do more than 1100/1575, I don't really know 7950s well but the core should be able to go higher & I would be shocked if the memory couldn't. Supposed to get around the 0° area tonight, get the rig outdoors for an ambient temp mod, I will be for some air cooled 680 overclocking.
> 
> There are a few guys currently in the rankings who will be subbing monster scores, dRweEz is currently third but at the end he will probably be the guy to beat...


The highest after burner goes is 1100 and 1575 unless I mod the config file to unlock the unofficial oc. I guess I could but I don't think im gonna be able to get 10000 and your already first with that other guy in second lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> The highest after burner goes is 1100 and 1575 unless I mod the config file to unlock the unofficial oc. I guess I could but I don't think im gonna be able to get 10000 and your already first with that other guy in second lol


Doesn't hurt to unlock UO OCing & try, some guys have gotten 7950s to 1300/1800 +. Probably water cooled, but your card should have more in it.
It can be hard to do well in the competitions without extreme cooling, but always fun to try!


----------



## lilchronic

my 670 is stuck with stock bios it dosent like the unlocked bois @1.2v it throttles and dosent even go over 60c throttles @ 58c







i was able to hit 1411mhz boost with unlock bios but dam throttling pisses me off. hopefully when i get it waterd cooled it will stay below 50c and not throttle


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Doesn't hurt to unlock UO OCing & try, some guys have gotten 7950s to 1300/1800 +. Probably water cooled, but your card should have more in it.
> It can be hard to do well in the competitions without extreme cooling, but always fun to try!


That's true may as well give it a go. Could by a gpu block soon and add to my loop I ha e 360mm of rad space now lol


----------



## stickg1

I decided to give it a go: http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/168728?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I decided to give it a go: http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/168728?


Get that Apongee HD WB !!!


----------



## one80

How easy is it to remove Liquid Ultra? Does it ever "set" between the die and IHS - could I damage it when removing it?

I'm just thinking of reapplying as my temps haven't dropped as much as I would've hoped


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *one80*
> 
> How easy is it to remove Liquid Ultra? Does it ever "set" between the die and IHS - could I damage it when removing it?
> 
> I'm just thinking of reapplying as my temps haven't dropped as much as I would've hoped


You can safely remove it form the IHS and be super vigorous.
But when it comes to the DIE - you would have to take your time and patiently get it off - for example getting it off with a qtip + alcohol would be the best way to remove it I think.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *one80*
> 
> How easy is it to remove Liquid Ultra? Does it ever "set" between the die and IHS - could I damage it when removing it?
> 
> I'm just thinking of reapplying as my temps haven't dropped as much as I would've hoped


It shouldn't hurt anything. It is not difficult to remove with metal polish, just takes awhile. I posted pics of before and after in this thread.

Edit: Meant metal polish to remove from the IHS and that takes a little time, removing it from the die is not hard with alcohol and q-tip like TD said.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *one80*
> 
> How easy is it to remove Liquid Ultra? Does it ever "set" between the die and IHS - could I damage it when removing it?
> 
> I'm just thinking of reapplying as my temps haven't dropped as much as I would've hoped


I reseated with ultra and it came off very easily with an alcohol swab. It should not give you any trouble.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thats weak lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/149428


What's with the LSD as your avatar?


----------



## stickg1

Okay I decided to give it a go with my 7950 crossfired with my 7970, both overclocked to 1150/1500

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/176750?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Pwahh look at my temps 0.0


----------



## justanoldman

Too high TD. Have you tried a few times to reseat the cooler, or different amounts of TIM, to see if anything helps? If that doesn't do the trick I would say the Antec needs an RMA.

Is it normal now that I have to right click on pictures in posts, and open in a new window to see them?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Too high TD. Have you tried a few times to reseat the cooler, or different amounts of TIM, to see if anything helps? If that doesn't do the trick I would say the Antec needs an RMA.
> 
> Is it normal now that I have to right click on pictures in posts, and open in a new window to see them?


I haven't tried different amounts of TIM - however I'll be opening up my system soon enough.
When I send the i7 in, I'll send in the Antec too.

As for the posts - yup you're not the only one...no idea what's happening with OCNET right now
EDIT:
Added a bug report:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1359293/opening-enlarging-ocn-embedded-pictures


----------



## Joa3d43

...Delidded...in the middle of the night...could hardly see ( = stupid







) ... IHS was slightly crooked from the foundry (one side had a lot room, the other hardly any)...

... great results







, other than some serious blood from several of my fingers ... as soon as I can type more with the bandages, some pics and tables









...btw, before I started, I recalled reading about folks who inadvertently scratched their CPU-PCB with partial dysfunction (ie mem channels, iGPU) as the result...while mine survived (divine intervention







) , I was going to suggest to those with scratches just to try to fill them / cover them with Arctic MX4 which is no-conductive...could work, depending on the depth of the original damage


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Delidded...in the middle of the night...could hardly see ( = stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) ... IHS was slightly crooked from the foundry (one side had a lot room, the other hardly any)...
> 
> ... great results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , other than some serious blood from several of my fingers ... as soon as I can type more with the bandages, some pics and tables
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...btw, before I started, I recalled reading about folks who inadvertently scratched their CPU-PCB with partial dysfunction (ie mem channels, iGPU) as the result...while mine survived (divine intervention
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) , I was going to suggest to those with scratches just to try to fill them / cover them with Arctic MX4 which is no-conductive...could work, depending on the depth of the original damage


Congratulations.








Looking forward to pics and numbers.


----------



## Xinoxide

/Im looking at running IHS once I delid here in the next couple of weeks.

Anyone recommend any specific paste to go direcly between my die and copper water block?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Congratulations.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looking forward to pics and numbers.


I'm more interested in the injuries.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> /Im looking at running IHS once I delid here in the next couple of weeks.
> 
> Anyone recommend any specific paste to go direcly between my die and copper water block?


C.L. Ultra


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> What's with the LSD as your avatar?


lol . every 1 should experience it








http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Hofmann


----------



## chann3l

there new firestrike msi comp entry im still in 11th place lol
http://www.3dmark.com/fs/129102

New 3d mark 11 score

http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5880703


----------



## justanoldman

I don't know much about 3dmark11, but should two 3770k chips get the same Physics score if they are at the same multiplier even if the GPUs are different? Basically I am wondering if I can compare my Physics score with others who have the same chip even though we may have different video cards.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I don't know much about 3dmark11, but should two 3770k chips get the same Physics score if they are at the same multiplier even if the GPUs are different? Basically I am wondering if I can compare my Physics score with others who have the same chip even though we may have different video cards.


Your CPU handles physics in most the tests but in ge combined test part of the physics are handled by the gpu I believe could be wrong tho


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm more interested in the injuries.


...well, here is just one of them











...fortunately, there was a lot of 99% isopropanol around


----------



## glina

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> there new firestrike msi comp entry im still in 11th place lol
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/129102
> 
> New 3d mark 11 score
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5880703











now push that GPU









http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/9039
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5813770


----------



## Gomi

Just wish they would release new drivers for us TRI / QUAD people - Or maybe they are just letting the SINGLE / DUAL users have their fun before we kick in the doors wielding double-bladed axes.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *glina*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now push that GPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/9039
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5813770


...why push one when you could push two (soon results for three)


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol . every 1 should experience it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Hofmann


A little triple dipped red eye never hurts


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, here is just one of them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...fortunately, there was a lot of 99% isopropanol around


LOL yeah all the infection fighters!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Just wish they would release new drivers for us TRI / QUAD people - Or maybe they are just letting the SINGLE / DUAL users have their fun before we kick in the doors wielding double-bladed axes.


Yeah... quad sli is kinda silly


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> A little triple dipped red eye never hurts


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, here is just one of them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...fortunately, there was a lot of 99% isopropanol around


hopefully u didnt hit the pcb like u did your finger


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Delidded...in the middle of the night...could hardly see ( = stupid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) ... IHS was slightly crooked from the foundry (one side had a lot room, the other hardly any)...
> 
> ... great results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , other than some serious blood from several of my fingers ... as soon as I can type more with the bandages, some pics and tables
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...btw, before I started, I recalled reading about folks who inadvertently scratched their CPU-PCB with partial dysfunction (ie mem channels, iGPU) as the result...while mine survived (divine intervention
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) , I was going to suggest to those with scratches just to try to fill them / cover them with Arctic MX4 which is no-conductive...could work, depending on the depth of the original damage


Congrats! It'll be nice to see the new numbers, you have a pretty good chip too!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> there new firestrike msi comp entry im still in 11th place lol
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/129102
> 
> New 3d mark 11 score
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5880703


#1 score for 7950 on the bot, Nice! http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2355329_
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I don't know much about 3dmark11, but should two 3770k chips get the same Physics score if they are at the same multiplier even if the GPUs are different? Basically I am wondering if I can compare my Physics score with others who have the same chip even though we may have different video cards.


The physics score is almost completely cpu dependent, so the same processor at the same clocks should score almost the same, although system memory also makes a difference. The physics in the new 3dmark & 3dmark 11 uses bullet physics, not physx, so gpu makes no difference.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Congrats! It'll be nice to see the new numbers, you have a pretty good chip too!
> #1 score for 7950 on the bot, Nice! http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2355329_
> The physics score is almost completely cpu dependent, so the same processor at the same clocks should score almost the same, although system memory also makes a difference. The physics in the new 3dmark & 3dmark 11 uses bullet physics, not physx, so gpu makes no difference.


Thanks man im pretty stoked on it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Thanks man im pretty stoked on it


I get the prize right?


----------



## FtW 420

The lucky draw entrance was up today (entries before Feb. 10), don't know when they're doing the actual draw.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The lucky draw entrance was up today (entries before Feb. 10), don't know when they're doing the actual draw.


I hope I win it even tho my mpower is better than the prze


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I get the prize right?


if I win I'd probably trade it for something


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> hopefully u didnt hit the pcb like u did your finger


...well, the worst damage went to the IHS, but it can take it - I was so worried about hitting the PCB I literally cut and notched the IHS ::. just think of it as extra vent hole cooling which I was planning anyways









...next victim were my fingers (more than one...which is why typing is still a bit tricky and a full report comes later)

...the pcb gave me a scare when I saw what appeared as *ten-*plus copper-colored *scratches*







- especially in light of pushing very hard away from the pcb - those were not actually scratches but little pieces of copper that had fallen onto the pcb when I forced the blade into the IHS and cut into it by trying to avoid the pcb


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> @swag: I sounded like you (with a better Mic) when I was your age.
> I'm 21 myself, but don't sound it, nor look it, nor act it lol.
> 
> As for my chip...it's going to bother me always that the ram slots are not working. I would be inclined to rma it. On the other hand though, my mx2 is giving me over 10c better temps.
> Also can I ask what are the disadvantages to running single channel over dual channel?
> I don't mind the 8gb over the 16gb to be honest. 8gb is more than enough.


TD you have a Sabertooth right. This was on the sabertooth thread. I was going to rma my board becasue the dimm slots werent working and bios didnt have the option to manually overclock. This fixed everything.

Wipe BIOS chip and write data blocks to a fresh chip
HOW TO:
For ASUS Sabertooth Z77 Motherboard only. Do not attempt to use these instructions with another board. I have no experience in doing so and can not guarantee these instructions to be accurate for that. In other words, this is a Sabertooth Z77 thread and the solution is only listed here for the AMI BIOS on that board.

WARNING: This can render your ASUS Sabertooth Z77 motherboard inoperable and unserviceable by you if the BIOS chip fails to rewrite all of the data or anything else goes wrong. Do this at your own risk. BIOS flashback will not be able to recover this if something goes wrong. You have been warned.

Use American Megatrends' AMIflash Utility
http://goo.gl/6dbsB
Unpack zip files, pick the appropriatexx folder, where xx is 32 or 64 bit
CLOSE ALL PROGRAMS!!!!!!
Run amiflash\Aptio\AFUWin\xx\afuwinxx\afuwingui.exe
Click Setup TAB
Optional but Recommended: Click Save BUTTON to backup your current BIOS. Save that file to an external source
Click Open BUTTON
Select previously downloaded 1504 BIOS CAP file from Asus support website
Check "Program All Blocks" checkbox
Click Flash BUTTON
Click Windows Start Menu and "Shutdown" NOT REBOOT
Make sure computer shuts down.
Press power button to turn on computer
Wait... computer will shutdown after 1 second of turning on and then reboot again... just let it do it's thing.
Don't touch anything, don't try to enter BIOS, don't do anything til you are at the windows login screen or desktop
Profit


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> TD you have a Sabertooth right. This was on the sabertooth thread. I was going to rma my board becasue the dimm slots werent working and bios didnt have the option to manually overclock. This fixed everything.
> 
> Wipe BIOS chip and write data blocks to a fresh chip
> HOW TO:
> For ASUS Sabertooth Z77 Motherboard only. Do not attempt to use these instructions with another board. I have no experience in doing so and can not guarantee these instructions to be accurate for that. In other words, this is a Sabertooth Z77 thread and the solution is only listed here for the AMI BIOS on that board.
> t


I have no idea why this would related to me?
If the board is gone - I'll RMA it
If the I7 is gone - then I'll try to RMA it

Why would I do that to the BIOS?

And yes I have the sabertooth.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I have no idea why this would related to me?
> If the board is gone - I'll RMA it
> If the I7 is gone - then I'll try to RMA it
> 
> Why would I do that to the BIOS?


When I first built my pc ram was working fine. all dimms clocked at 1866.

I disasembled to do some painting and such. put it back together and I got cpu light. 2 dimms wouldnt work. couldnt overclock cpu or ram. I tried everything. The board was gone. I went to rma it but the the shipping place closed earlier than I thought.

I thought what the hell. Tried this and everything was working fine again.

Just a thought man.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> When I first built my pc ram was working fine. all dimms clocked at 1866.
> 
> I disasembled to do some painting and such. put it back together and I got cpu light. 2 dimms wouldnt work. couldnt overclock cpu or ram. I tried everything. The board was gone. I went to rma it but the the shipping place closed earlier than I thought.
> 
> I thought what the hell. Tried this and everything was working fine again.
> 
> Just a thought man.


Cool man - but mine is DRAM related.
I'll wait for my i3 to come in on Thursday, and I'll know for sure what the cause is


----------



## Snuckie7

So what's the consensus here on Coollaboratory Liquid pro vs Ultra? Is one definitely better than the other?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> So what's the consensus here on Coollaboratory Liquid pro vs Ultra? Is one definitely better than the other?


Ultra vs Pro vs MX4 ...some folks question this chap's method of applying CL products (a bit too much), but he is a well-known HWbot contributor: 




In my own testing, about 3 C advantage for Ultra over Pro on IHS, but was a limited test


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> So what's the consensus here on Coollaboratory Liquid pro vs Ultra? Is one definitely better than the other?


Mx-4 is Meh..

Ultra vs pro on the norm pro wins 1-3c


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> So what's the consensus here on Coollaboratory Liquid pro vs Ultra? Is one definitely better than the other?


Here is a comparison tw33k did:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro

Basically too close to call which is better. As I tried to point out in an earlier post, there are so many variables when applying TIM that it hard to distinguish between those variables and a statistically significant result. Pro and Ultra apply differently, and that is why I like Ultra, but that is just a personal preference.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The physics score is almost completely cpu dependent, so the same processor at the same clocks should score almost the same, although system memory also makes a difference. The physics in the new 3dmark & 3dmark 11 uses bullet physics, not physx, so gpu makes no difference.


Thanks.
I looked at a number of 3770k Physics scores, and it would appear (as you pointed out) that your particular RAM definitely affects the score. There was a rather wide variation with some scoring hundreds of points higher with a lower overclock. Either the test is flawed or it is measurably dependent on something other than the chip and overclock.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Here is a comparison tw33k did:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro
> 
> Basically too close to call which is better. As I tried to point out in an earlier post, there are so many variables when applying TIM that it hard to distinguish between those variables and a statistically significant result. Pro and Ultra apply differently, and that is why I like Ultra, but that is just a personal preference.


Hmm which do you think would apply better on a GPU?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Hmm which do you think would apply better on a GPU?


Good question, I have never tried it on a GPU. I am sure either would work, I just like the consistency of Ultra and the included brushes make it easy to apply as little or as much as you want.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Hmm which do you think would apply better on a GPU?


Ultra because it cleans up a bit easier. Otherwise performance is almost the same.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, the worst damage went to the IHS, but it can take it - I was so worried about hitting the PCB I literally cut and notched the IHS ::. just think of it as extra vent hole cooling which I was planning anyways
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...next victim were my fingers (more than one...which is why typing is still a bit tricky and a full report comes later)
> 
> ...the pcb gave me a scare when I saw what appeared as *ten-*plus copper-colored *scratches*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - especially in light of pushing very hard away from the pcb - those were not actually scratches but little pieces of copper that had fallen onto the pcb when I forced the blade into the IHS and cut into it by trying to avoid the pcb


well atleast you got hurt and not it... wait... lol SAVE TECHNOLOGY AND RUIN ONESELF!! yeeeeeees.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Hmm which do you think would apply better on a GPU?


either really, they aren't hard to apply.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> well atleast you got hurt and not it... wait... lol SAVE TECHNOLOGY AND RUIN ONESELF!! yeeeeeees.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


...well, like a true scientist, at least I experiment on myself first - nothing is too dangerous for the folks at the 'delid' forum







Besides, I can regrow skin (and a bit of flesh...), but the PCB can't









...here is just a quick pic (sorry for the horrible quality, was 5 am , just cleaned up the blood everywhere and my main webcam sits on the system I was operating on at the time - as in the one WITHOUT a CPU in the socket







)

...story and temps to follow over the next days


----------



## feniks

hmmm ... tried CL Pro on the die hoping for improvement over CLU ... but damn, I only worsened it LOL ... not so funny really ... will have to do it again and not fond of pulling the cpu from under the cooling block again (PITA) and cleaning CLU from there too ...

wondering if maybe I used too little of CLP on the die (and under IHS) and perhaps it doesn't make proper contact like CLU did... oh well, will put some more and see.

anyways, I noticed something weird on my 3770K (terminal side), namely one of contact terminals changed color from copper to silvery gray ... TBH, looks like TIM color now and I thought this was it at first glance, but no, the whole circular terminal changed color, it's not TIM (tried cleaning it off with alcohol LOL) ... chip runs normally so far, but wondering what up with it...

here's pics, anybody ever seen something like it before? sorry for blurry pics, but my camera had trouble making proper focus on the reflective spots.


----------



## I_shot

Guys this is my fourth 3570k chip and this has the best vid and it's Malaysia chip.Stock voltage under load 1.096V







This chip is begging to be delidded


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Guys this is my fourth 3570k chip and this has the best vid and it's Malaysia chip.Stock voltage under load 1.096V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This chip is begging to be delidded


can't read it.. upload in large please


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Guys this is my fourth 3570k chip and this has the best vid and it's Malaysia chip.Stock voltage under load 1.096V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This chip is begging to be delidded


is that on a stock cooler???


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> is that on a stock cooler???


Yes. gelid extreme applied
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> can't read it.. upload in large please


I think there's a problem with photos. they don't open in fullscreen. anyway i have tested the new cpu with 1.104V at 4.3 ghz looks stable. stock cooler with gelid extreme applied.

Stock settings

http://bit.ly/c25MCx

4.3 ghz

http://bit.ly/c25MCx


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Congrats! It'll be nice to see the new numbers, you have a pretty good chip too!.


Tx - given the chip's good performance already with the lid on (per spoilers), this made the decision to delid a bit trickier...on the one hand, here was a chip that really only needed better temps to run past 5 GHz all day long...on the other, here was a strong performer I was not going to be able to replace easily if delidding went awry






































Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## VonDutch

4.5ghz, no HT, 119 Gflops..is that good? compared to a 3570K at the same speed?



does anyone have 140 gflops if you run 5.0ghz with HT on?
is RAM important to get higher gflops?
can it be if a oc isnt stable, and the computer has to do errors checking,
can that make your gflops lower ?

i know a while ago someone said gflops arent that important,
several things can influence that, just need to know some things about it..

4.5ghz, with HT, 101 Gflops


what a big difference with or no HT?
is mine just low, or is it something else, or all good?


----------



## martinhal

I have never understood the IBT Gflops thing. Mine does the same more with HT off.

Here are my results with HT on. 5 Ghz HT with off 136.

I doubt it is a stability thing. The table below is min vcore to pass IBT . I just run IBT at 5 ghz at my 12 hour stable vcore and it is the same. My 5.1 Ghz number below is 12 hour stable vcore.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I have never understood the IBT Gflops thing. Mine does the same more with HT off.
> 
> Here are my results with HT on


yea, we have about the same gflops,
talking to someone over at anandforum, hes talking about my chip maybe a "victim of phantom instability"

"I think your overclock may be a victim of phantom instability. The error checking on the CPU is correcting the instability, but your performance is being hit in the process of it.

My reasoning behind this is that my i5-2500K at 4.4 GHz pushes 120 GFlops. Your CPU appears to be slower, despite the fact that at 5.0 GHz, it should be 15-20% faster due to Ivy Bridge's minor architecture improvements."

other post

"Phantom" instability is exactly as I described. Modern CPUs are equipped with quite robust error correction capability. If your CPUs error correction catches something and corrects it, you won't see errors when running stability tests. It will, however, drop your performance.

There's more to verifying stability than "oh, my PC didn't crash when I ran IBT."

i thought he was talking about WHEA errors ..lol, but he said he didnt mean that,
but i cant remember any of our 5.0ghz 3770K running 140 gflops in ibt..
except the ones with very good ram have a bit higher gflops?


----------



## martinhal

Sorry I added to my post after your reply . My conclusion it is not a vcore / stability issue for the reasons stated.
This chip gets great Cinebench numbers, 10.45 on one run so performance is no lacking and I don't get WHEA errors on my "stable " IBT runs


----------



## justanoldman

I just recently ran IBT on maximum at 5.0 and got about 116, don't know how 140 is possible. It went 20 passes and over 24 hours with Prime95 so I doubt it is unstable


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, we have about the same gflops,
> talking to someone over at anandforum, hes talking about my chip maybe a "victim of phantom instability"
> 
> "I think your overclock may be a victim of phantom instability. The error checking on the CPU is correcting the instability, but your performance is being hit in the process of it.
> 
> My reasoning behind this is that my i5-2500K at 4.4 GHz pushes 120 GFlops. Your CPU appears to be slower, despite the fact that at 5.0 GHz, it should be 15-20% faster due to Ivy Bridge's minor architecture improvements."
> 
> other post
> 
> "Phantom" instability is exactly as I described. Modern CPUs are equipped with quite robust error correction capability. If your CPUs error correction catches something and corrects it, you won't see errors when running stability tests. It will, however, drop your performance.
> 
> There's more to verifying stability than "oh, my PC didn't crash when I ran IBT."
> 
> i thought he was talking about WHEA errors ..lol, but he said he didnt mean that,
> but i cant remember any of our 5.0ghz 3770K running 140 gflops in ibt..
> except the ones with very good ram have a bit higher gflops?


Not sure if this helps, noting that at 5 ghz in Cinebench, I have pretty much the same results as quoted above..but here is a screenshot of 3D Vantage run with some detail info on the results, with FtW 420 noting that usually, you need a 6c/12t to cross the 50k mark...that implies that in the Vantage test (more so than in Cinebench per my experience), HT / # of cores matters...the Cinebench graphics test (OpenGL, as opposed to CPU test) is definitely 1 core once it runs after loading


----------



## feniks

GFlops always go higher if you turn off the Hyper Threading because physical cores are always faster then logical threads in hyperthreading mode (2 logical ones per 1 physical core with HT on). without HT you basically have 1 logical thread per 1 physical core, hence the boost.


----------



## feniks

how much CLP do you apply on the die? I think I made it too thin ... my temps are spread out more unevenly across cores when compared to CLU...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> how much CLP do you apply on the die? I think I made it too thin ... my temps are spread out more unevenly across cores when compared to CLU...


Try it again with a bit more, I got better temps the second time when I did a little more Ultra on the die and underside of the IHS.


----------



## Joa3d43

...and here is the corresponding Cinebench (all cores / threads) run


----------



## h2on0

I'm just gonna put this here. i put CLU on die bottom/top of IHS and on my video card gpu. This is delidded. I didn't take any other screen shot of earlier configs.(sorry). AS5 was at about 75 degrees under load. Lidded I would hit high 90's .


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feniks*
> 
> how much CLP do you apply on the die? I think I made it too thin ... my temps are spread out more unevenly across cores when compared to CLU...


i did thin layer on the die, then made a print from the die on the inside ihs, and did another thin layer on the inside ihs








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2on0*
> 
> I'm just gonna put this here. i put CLU on die bottom/top of IHS and on my video card gpu. This is delidded. I didn't take any other screen shot of earlier configs.(sorry). AS5 was at about 75 degrees under load. Lidded I would hit high 90's .


so you went from not delidded 90C to delidded 53C ?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and here is the corresponding Cinebench (all cores / threads) run


nice, looks good to me








maybe mine was juuuust a little higher ...LOL


----------



## h2on0

I went from not dellidded in the 90's to delidded with AS5 in the 70's(which I was totally happy about) to delidded with all CLU @ 53. I am actually freaking out with how good my temps are now.

This has to be the most informative/best idea/motivating club on OCN.

THANKYOU!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2on0*
> 
> I went from not dellidded in the 90's to delidded with AS5 in the 70's(which I was totally happy about) to delidded with all CLU @ 53. I am actually freaking out with how good my temps are now.
> 
> This has to be the most informative/best idea/motivating club on OCN.
> 
> THANKYOU!


First off, those are nice temps, congratulations.

Secondly, I herby second your proposal that is one of the best ideas/clubs around. It makes having an Ivy chip so much better.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2on0*
> 
> I went from not dellidded in the 90's to delidded with AS5 in the 70's(which I was totally happy about) to delidded with all CLU @ 53. I am actually freaking out with how good my temps are now.
> 
> This has to be the most informative/best idea/motivating club on OCN.
> 
> THANKYOU!


yeah, i went like







when i saw my temps first time ...lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> nice, looks good to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> maybe mine was juuuust a little higher ...LOL


...you kid now







, I'm still playing with my bandages following the delid














- but I'm coming for you (an early pic from the upcoming delid summary), haven't run all tests (like Cinebench @ 51, 52 +) yet









>> after dellid <<


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...you kid now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , I'm still playing with my bandages following the delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - but I'm coming for you (an early pic from the upcoming delid summary), haven't run all tests (like Cinebench @ 51, 52 +) yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >> after dellid <<
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


this is my highest cinebench, at 5.1ghz, 1.610V vcore, 10.28 points









come n get me


----------



## lilchronic

i5 3570k gflops 5.0and 5.1 ghz i got higher gflops 5.ghz cause i had cinebench open and probably something else running


----------



## Belial

Okay, so this is the most I got the better of those 2 i5 3570ks I had:

OCN name: Belial
CPU: i5-3570k
on die-TIM: PK-3
ihs-TIM: PK-3
Mhz gained: -
OC after delid: [email protected]
Temp drops: ~15*C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: 

[email protected] was the most I could get that chip. I believe 4.7ghz would require around 1.51, 1.52vcore (was failing after 12 hours in p95 at 1.5).

However, I was able to exchange my i5-3570K (the bad one, the one I didn't delid) for an i7-3770k for $40 at MC, and then put the better, delidded i5-3570k in a build I made for someone else (they don't even know what overclocking is, I just did a 1ghz+ overclock for them for value).

This i7-3770K is just like my i5-3570K - boot up 4.5ghz, use GTL, got to 5ghz, freeze screen at 5.1ghz. Except it does that at 1.3vcore, instead of 1.5vcore ^^
So I think I have a really, really good i7 here.

I have gone ahead and delidded it, as well as recorded a custom small fft temperature test on 4.5ghz/1.3vcore before, and after delidding.

OCN name: Belial
CPU: i5-3770K
on die-TIM: PK-3
ihs-TIM: PK-3
Mhz gained: -
OC after delid: -
Temp drops: 15+
CPU-Z validation of max OC: -

Before Delid: 89*C max (wow 3770k is a lot hotter than 3570k, I was getting this kind of temp before delid at like 1.5vcore I think).
After Delid: 76*C max (done the next day, in a room that's at least 5*F hotter...).

I believe the net result is somewhere between a 15-20*C temp drop. Those results are similar to what I believe I got last time, with the 3570k.

Pics:






Will be playing around, I'll add a cpu validation for 24 hours and all that later.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay, so this is the most I got the better of those 2 i5 3570ks I had:
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: [email protected]
> Temp drops: ~15*C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [email protected] was the most I could get that chip. I believe 4.7ghz would require around 1.51, 1.52vcore (was failing after 12 hours in p95 at 1.5).
> 
> However, I was able to exchange my i5-3570K (the bad one, the one I didn't delid) for an i7-3770k for $40 at MC, and then put the better, delidded i5-3570k in a build I made for someone else (they don't even know what overclocking is, I just did a 1ghz+ overclock for them for value).
> 
> This i7-3770K is just like my i5-3570K - boot up 4.5ghz, use GTL, got to 5ghz, freeze screen at 5.1ghz. Except it does that at 1.3vcore, instead of 1.5vcore ^^
> So I think I have a really, really good i7 here.
> 
> I have gone ahead and delidded it, as well as recorded a custom small fft temperature test on 4.5ghz/1.3vcore before, and after delidding.
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3770K
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: -
> Temp drops: 15+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: -
> 
> Before Delid: 89*C max (wow 3770k is a lot hotter than 3570k, I was getting this kind of temp before delid at like 1.5vcore I think).
> After Delid: 76*C max (done the next day, in a room that's at least 5*F hotter...).
> 
> I believe the net result is somewhere between a 15-20*C temp drop. Those results are similar to what I believe I got last time, with the 3570k.
> 
> Pics:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will be playing around, I'll add a cpu validation for 24 hours and all that later.


nice work Belial, looks good to me


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> this is my highest cinebench, at 5.1ghz, 1.610V vcore, 10.28 points
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> come n get me


...first of all. this is all in good fun as I am very grateful to you and the rest of the delid crew for helping with great prep info before my delid !

...so all in good fun







- did you notice that at 100% load, I used 1.416v at 5.1 Ghz ? You seem to be running 1.61v at 5.1 Ghz...fortunately for you, I won't go over 1.534v for now

...that said, even with 'just' CLU on the die and still MX4 (per upcoming story) on the IHS for a few more days, my temp drop was very dramatic...already between 12 to 14 c, even with an uneven water block fit on top of the 5 fat rice kernels + big blob in the middle MX4 method


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> ...that said, even with 'just' CLU on the die and still MX4 (per upcoming story) on the IHS for a few more days, my temp drop was very dramatic...already between 12 to 14 c, even with an uneven water block fit on top of the 5 fat rice kernels + big blob in the middle MX4 method


Ahhh that sounds terrible, no wonder your temp drop is so low. 1 fat rice kernel alone is way too much thermal paste, as in, I consistently saw a temp rise of about 5*C+ when using double rice grain method/fat rice grain method of spread, as opposed to half of a rice grain method (a rice grain itself borders on too much paste, frankly). You generally don't want your spread method to cover the entire IHS, as that means you used too much paste.

You can easily use too much paste, but it's impossible to use too little. When in doubt, use less.

Also, a lot of companies 'official' or 'recommended' spread methods will often be the worst way to apply paste. Prolimatech recommending a spread method (even including a spreader with their 1.5g packets), for example. HardwareSecrets did a TIM paste comparison where they showed the TIM footprint of a bunch of different spread patterns, the problem being that they never saw the temp results of their tests, they just judged them based on coverage (and covering entire ihs = too much paste).


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Ahhh that sounds terrible, no wonder your temp drop is so low. 1 fat rice kernel alone is way too much thermal paste, as in, I consistently saw a temp rise of about 5*C+ when using double rice grain method/fat rice grain method of spread, as opposed to half of a rice grain method (a rice grain itself borders on too much paste, frankly). You generally don't want your spread method to cover the entire IHS, as that means you used too much paste.
> 
> You can easily use too much paste, but it's impossible to use too little. When in doubt, use less.
> 
> Also, a lot of companies 'official' or 'recommended' spread methods will often be the worst way to apply paste. Prolimatech recommending a spread method (even including a spreader with their 1.5g packets), for example. HardwareSecrets did a TIM paste comparison where they showed the TIM footprint of a bunch of different spread patterns, the problem being that they never saw the temp results of their tests, they just judged them based on coverage (and covering entire ihs = too much paste).


...I know - normally I would have done it very differently and also used CL U or P (have lots, per pic) but I had to do a temporary fix as one of the four water block retainers is worn past 'tight' - more per upcoming summary as I am in the middle of a big conversion-build re custom loop replacing the water block...usually, I use a thin line + small dot in the middle when applying non-CL products ...the point with VonDutch was that in spite of these handicaps, I'm already experiencing some big improvements with CL on the die and 'delid'


----------



## chann3l

Yes got 6.2 points now they'll accept my hwbot lol

http://hwbot.org/user/chann3l/


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Yes got 6.2 points now they'll accept my hwbot lol
> 
> http://hwbot.org/user/chann3l/


Good work!









Watch out though, its addictive







I just managed to sell my last amount of spare / scrap gear, ordered a Little Devil Phase Change - Though it wont be used properly until Ivy-E, maybe a test run or two on an old system / bench


----------



## feniks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Try it again with a bit more, I got better temps the second time when I did a little more Ultra on the die and underside of the IHS.


yeah, I'm thinking I smeared it very thin into a mirror like thingy ... need to finish bleeding the water loop first to compare temps more directly tho, but as far as core temps spread goes, yeah it's worse ... unless it healed itself somehow LOL (not at my comp at the moment).

might need to go ebay hunting for a spare lid and lap it too.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Good work!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Watch out though, its addictive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just managed to sell my last amount of spare / scrap gear, ordered a Little Devil Phase Change - Though it wont be used properly until Ivy-E, maybe a test run or two on an old system / bench


Thanks and I agree it is pretty addicting..I just want to play some games today but in my head im thinking ok just one more benchmark lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...first of all. this is all in good fun as I am very grateful to you and the rest of the delid crew for helping with great prep info before my delid !
> 
> ...so all in good fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - did you notice that at 100% load, I used 1.416v at 5.1 Ghz ? You seem to be running 1.61v at 5.1 Ghz...fortunately for you, I won't go over 1.534v for now
> 
> ...that said, even with 'just' CLU on the die and still MX4 (per upcoming story) on the IHS for a few more days, my temp drop was very dramatic...already between 12 to 14 c, even with an uneven water block fit on top of the 5 fat rice kernels + big blob in the middle MX4 method


all good








yea, i did notice your vcore at 5.1ghz, thats great, mine isnt a very good ocer, i know..but im happy with
it anyways ..lol, 4.8ghz at 1.420V daily oc is very nice i think








i think with any kind of application of tim's something can go wrong,
i always used AS5, and did the spread method all the time, no problems with it ever,
with liquid pro/ultra the same, no problems yet..
but if i apply it 5 times, i bet theres 1 or 2 that have less temps
then the others..but those i just reapply ..lol, i know what to expect from the coollab liquids so


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Thanks and I agree it is pretty addicting..I just want to play some games today but in my head im thinking ok just one more benchmark lol


Know the feeling - I managed to "tweak" my GPUs (Love the EVBOT and Classys) and everytime I do that (Gain +10 on memory or whatever) I just *HAVE* to run it through all the tests again.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Know the feeling - I managed to "tweak" my GPUs (Love the EVBOT and Classys) and everytime I do that (Gain +10 on memory or whatever) I just *HAVE* to run it through all the tests again.


I have 7.3 points now and im ranked 86 out of 427 in canada enthusiast league. Now I want to keep going lol I do the same thing even for minimal gains just ran the 1m challenge in the comp and did 7.520 seconds bumped my blck to 100.50 from 100 and did 7.451 lol


----------



## Belial

Just got error 0xC5 BSOD (not xC00005, but like x000000c5). Anyone ever come across this? Searches seem to say it's a driver issue, integrity issue, as opposed to an overclock issue (i was running p95 but then when I re-booted, i got it immediately with something that lasted 30+ minutes on p95 just fine multiple times before). Seems odd.


----------



## stickg1

Lol, this Celeron D 356 I'm playing with gets 4.5 GFlops on stock 3.33GHz, time to crank this thing up and make it sweat.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 4.5ghz, no HT, 119 Gflops..is that good? compared to a 3570K at the same speed?
> 
> 
> 
> does anyone have 140 gflops if you run 5.0ghz with HT on?
> is RAM important to get higher gflops?
> can it be if a oc isnt stable, and the computer has to do errors checking,
> can that make your gflops lower ?
> 
> i know a while ago someone said gflops arent that important,
> several things can influence that, just need to know some things about it..
> 
> 4.5ghz, with HT, 101 Gflops
> 
> 
> what a big difference with or no HT?
> is mine just low, or is it something else, or all good?


Even at 5.5Ghz with HT I was hitting around 128Gflops. Memory does have a small effect on the gflops.








I would agree that gigaflops aren't of much importance, disabling HT decreases overall performance yet increases gigaflops. Also AVX, sp1 can double the gigaflops, yet unless running something that uses AVX a computer that gets 60 gflops can have the exact same performance as a machine getting 100 gflops +.
But for a particular single rig, when testing & looking at the gigaflops, increasing the gflpos does basically increase performance (not by disabling HT, but getting higher at however the rig is set up).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Yes got 6.2 points now they'll accept my hwbot lol
> 
> http://hwbot.org/user/chann3l/


Looking at your profile on the bot, you moved up +5675 places in the enthusiast league today, not bad!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Good work!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Watch out though, its addictive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just managed to sell my last amount of spare / scrap gear, ordered a Little Devil Phase Change - Though it wont be used properly until Ivy-E, maybe a test run or two on an old system / bench


It is addictive, you're gonna love the little devil, he does great work & builds some of the best!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h2on0*
> 
> I went from not dellidded in the 90's to delidded with AS5 in the 70's(which I was totally happy about) to delidded with all CLU @ 53. I am actually freaking out with how good my temps are now.
> 
> This has to be the most informative/best idea/motivating club on OCN.
> 
> THANKYOU!


No Problem!!!!! Hope to see and add you soon!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> First off, those are nice temps, congratulations.
> 
> Secondly, I herby second your proposal that is one of the best ideas/clubs around. It makes having an Ivy chip so much better.


I third this. Let's make it official!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay, so this is the most I got the better of those 2 i5 3570ks I had:
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: [email protected]
> Temp drops: ~15*C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> [email protected] was the most I could get that chip. I believe 4.7ghz would require around 1.51, 1.52vcore (was failing after 12 hours in p95 at 1.5).
> 
> However, I was able to exchange my i5-3570K (the bad one, the one I didn't delid) for an i7-3770k for $40 at MC, and then put the better, delidded i5-3570k in a build I made for someone else (they don't even know what overclocking is, I just did a 1ghz+ overclock for them for value).
> 
> This i7-3770K is just like my i5-3570K - boot up 4.5ghz, use GTL, got to 5ghz, freeze screen at 5.1ghz. Except it does that at 1.3vcore, instead of 1.5vcore ^^
> So I think I have a really, really good i7 here.
> 
> I have gone ahead and delidded it, as well as recorded a custom small fft temperature test on 4.5ghz/1.3vcore before, and after delidding.
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3770K
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: -
> Temp drops: 15+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: -
> 
> Before Delid: 89*C max (wow 3770k is a lot hotter than 3570k, I was getting this kind of temp before delid at like 1.5vcore I think).
> After Delid: 76*C max (done the next day, in a room that's at least 5*F hotter...).
> 
> I believe the net result is somewhere between a 15-20*C temp drop. Those results are similar to what I believe I got last time, with the 3570k.
> 
> Pics:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will be playing around, I'll add a cpu validation for 24 hours and all that later.


I can't add you yet Im on my phone right now sorry about that can you pm me the link of it please!?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...first of all. this is all in good fun as I am very grateful to you and the rest of the delid crew for helping with great prep info before my delid !
> 
> ...so all in good fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - did you notice that at 100% load, I used 1.416v at 5.1 Ghz ? You seem to be running 1.61v at 5.1 Ghz...fortunately for you, I won't go over 1.534v for now
> 
> ...that said, even with 'just' CLU on the die and still MX4 (per upcoming story) on the IHS for a few more days, my temp drop was very dramatic...already between 12 to 14 c, even with an uneven water block fit on top of the 5 fat rice kernels + big blob in the middle MX4 method


Agreed can't wait to see you get even better results!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Good work!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Watch out though, its addictive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just managed to sell my last amount of spare / scrap gear, ordered a Little Devil Phase Change - Though it wont be used properly until Ivy-E, maybe a test run or two on an old system / bench


Yeah it gets addictive waaaaay to easily....


----------



## $ilent

My submission









edit: Had to do another screenie, my notepad didnt say 'overclock'...lol


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Just got error 0xC5 BSOD (not xC00005, but like x000000c5). Anyone ever come across this? Searches seem to say it's a driver issue, integrity issue, as opposed to an overclock issue (i was running p95 but then when I re-booted, i got it immediately with something that lasted 30+ minutes on p95 just fine multiple times before). Seems odd.


yeah i had the same problem because of low vcore


----------



## I_shot

it's nice to know that my new chip passes 5 ghz wall

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2690408


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> it's nice to know that my new chip passes 5 ghz wall
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2690408


Very nice. Is that stable or boot volts?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Very nice. Is that stable or boot volts?


just enough to validate







i'm using stock cooler right now. i'm still waiting for my fittings and hoses to jump water cooling.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> 
> 
> My submission
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit: Had to do another screenie, my notepad didnt say 'overclock'...lol


wow! great chip. like it


----------



## stickg1

Where's Ivan? I need help torturing an Intel Celeron D 356 and some 533MHz Samsung DDR2 modules...


----------



## BradleyW

I sit at 70c full load at 1.2v
I am so tempted to remove the lid, or just buy a H100i


----------



## $ilent

thanks I shot, im not sure the asrock mobo reports correct vcore so it could be higher, but i have a z77x-ud3h on route and gonna order a digi multimeter off amazon too.

BradleyW get it delidded mate, so much better afterwards. Im only using a prolimatech megahalems and I just did a reseat with the on die TIM and lapped the IHS too up to 2500 grit. Max temps I saw on p95 after 25 min or so was 73c I believe, so it gives you loads of headroom temps wise.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Lol, this Celeron D 356 I'm playing with gets 4.5 GFlops on stock 3.33GHz, time to crank this thing up and make it sweat.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where's Ivan? I need help torturing an Intel Celeron D 356 and some 533MHz Samsung DDR2 modules...


Here I am...delid that sucker and clock it to the moon, OR get a pot and freeze it for some 8ghz action.








Samsung ddr2 ain't too good normally but just drop the ram ratio to keep the ram clocks slow whilst bumping the fsb like mad. Give that thing 1.45v and see how far it'll go without cold first.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Even at 5.5Ghz with HT I was hitting around 128Gflops. Memory does have a small effect on the gflops.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would agree that gigaflops aren't of much importance, disabling HT decreases overall performance yet increases gigaflops. Also AVX, sp1 can double the gigaflops, yet unless running something that uses AVX a computer that gets 60 gflops can have the exact same performance as a machine getting 100 gflops +.
> But for a particular single rig, when testing & looking at the gigaflops, increasing the gflpos does basically increase performance (not by disabling HT, but getting higher at however the rig is set up).
> Looking at your profile on the bot, you moved up +5675 places in the enthusiast league today, not bad!
> It is addictive, you're gonna love the little devil, he does great work & builds some of the best!


Thanks I've earned almost 20 points overall today. Might try putting my gpu in my loop in the next month or so unlock the unofficial ocing on afterburner and see if i can push past 1100 core and 1575 mem


----------



## Belial

especilally if you got the much hotter i7 3770k. no better value than high end cpu cooler temp drop with just a razor blade, and high end thermal paste for under $20, if not $5.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Here I am...delid that sucker and clock it to the moon, OR get a pot and freeze it for some 8ghz action.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Samsung ddr2 ain't too good normally but just drop the ram ratio to keep the ram clocks slow whilst bumping the fsb like mad. Give that thing 1.45v and see how far it'll go without cold first.


Unfortunately I cant seem to adjust the RAM multiplier on this motherboard. Biostar TP35D2-A7

Oh well, I can't seem to get past 4.55GHz, pisses me off because temps are still in the low 50's with this CM TX3.

The RAM says it will run 800MHz at 6-6-6-18 even though the stock specs are 533 4-4-4-12.

I'm going to keep trying, what's a safe voltage for DDR2? Actually it doesn't matter, I ordered 4GB of Hynix 800MHz and a Q6600 to replace this but figured I would have fun while I wait. I don't mind ruining $10 worth of RAM while I wait for a better set, as long as I have fun doing it..


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I sit at 70c full load at 1.2v
> I am so tempted to remove the lid, or just buy a H100i


Delid? Definitely (as long as you can afford another chip if you make a mistake)
H100i? No, try the delid first and see how it goes, then if need be you can look into better cooling. The H220 looks to be a better choice when it comes out in a couple weeks.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay, so this is the most I got the better of those 2 i5 3570ks I had:
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: [email protected]
> Temp drops: ~15*C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> [email protected] was the most I could get that chip. I believe 4.7ghz would require around 1.51, 1.52vcore (was failing after 12 hours in p95 at 1.5).
> 
> However, I was able to exchange my i5-3570K (the bad one, the one I didn't delid) for an i7-3770k for $40 at MC, and then put the better, delidded i5-3570k in a build I made for someone else (they don't even know what overclocking is, I just did a 1ghz+ overclock for them for value).
> 
> This i7-3770K is just like my i5-3570K - boot up 4.5ghz, use GTL, got to 5ghz, freeze screen at 5.1ghz. Except it does that at 1.3vcore, instead of 1.5vcore ^^
> So I think I have a really, really good i7 here.
> 
> I have gone ahead and delidded it, as well as recorded a custom small fft temperature test on 4.5ghz/1.3vcore before, and after delidding.
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3770K
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: -
> Temp drops: 15+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: -
> 
> Before Delid: 89*C max (wow 3770k is a lot hotter than 3570k, I was getting this kind of temp before delid at like 1.5vcore I think).
> After Delid: 76*C max (done the next day, in a room that's at least 5*F hotter...).
> 
> I believe the net result is somewhere between a 15-20*C temp drop. Those results are similar to what I believe I got last time, with the 3570k.
> 
> Pics:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will be playing around, I'll add a cpu validation for 24 hours and all that later.


You are in! Throw or awesome sig on and show your skills!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> 
> 
> My submission
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit: Had to do another screenie, my notepad didnt say 'overclock'...lol


Your in as well! Woohoo! All the new sigs!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I sit at 70c full load at 1.2v
> I am so tempted to remove the lid, or just buy a H100i


Delid it. temp changes with Heatsink changes based on the Intel gap of the die and IHS wont yield much. Take off their heads!!!


----------



## $ilent

Thanks

Just for the front page I used liquid pro not ultra









Also it could be fact I lapped the IHS or because I used liquid pro on the underside of the ihs aswell as on the die, but I'm currently folding at max temps of 67c at 5ghz with vcore of 1.35-1.40v with an air cooler!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> 
> 
> My submission
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit: Had to do another screenie, my notepad didnt say 'overclock'...lol


Nice! Is that with the ud3h? Grats on your delid! Only suggestion is if you want to join any if the stable clubs you will need to use a more current version of prime95 such as version 27.9. It uses the coding made for the newer chips called avx.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> thanks I shot, im not sure the asrock mobo reports correct vcore so it could be higher, but i have a z77x-ud3h on route and gonna order a digi multimeter off amazon too.
> 
> BradleyW get it delidded mate, so much better afterwards. Im only using a prolimatech megahalems and I just did a reseat with the on die TIM and lapped the IHS too up to 2500 grit. Max temps I saw on p95 after 25 min or so was 73c I believe, so it gives you loads of headroom temps wise.


I see


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I see


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> thanks I shot, im not sure the asrock mobo reports correct vcore so it could be higher, but i have a z77x-ud3h on route and gonna order a digi multimeter off amazon too.
> 
> BradleyW get it delidded mate, so much better afterwards. Im only using a prolimatech megahalems and I just did a reseat with the on die TIM and lapped the IHS too up to 2500 grit. Max temps I saw on p95 after 25 min or so was 73c I believe, so it gives you loads of headroom temps wise.


When you change mobo and very carefully lift your CPU out by those two side notches I was able to move mine without disturbing the Tim on the die.


----------



## $ilent

Yeah I think with max temps of 67c I got a really good CPU seat this time, so I wanna keep it intact.

In think the underside Tim application is good advice.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Just for the front page I used liquid pro not ultra
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also it could be fact I lapped the IHS or because I used liquid pro on the underside of the ihs aswell as on the die, but I'm currently folding at max temps of 67c at 5ghz with vcore of 1.35-1.40v with an air cooler!


Your Updated!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Unfortunately I cant seem to adjust the RAM multiplier on this motherboard. Biostar TP35D2-A7
> 
> Oh well, I can't seem to get past 4.55GHz, pisses me off because temps are still in the low 50's with this CM TX3.
> 
> The RAM says it will run 800MHz at 6-6-6-18 even though the stock specs are 533 4-4-4-12.
> 
> I'm going to keep trying, what's a safe voltage for DDR2? Actually it doesn't matter, I ordered 4GB of Hynix 800MHz and a Q6600 to replace this but figured I would have fun while I wait. I don't mind ruining $10 worth of RAM while I wait for a better set, as long as I have fun doing it..


I'd give it a shot...Grab a p45 board or a p965 for that chip and proper D9 ram, or a ddr3 x48 board if budget permits. That would be AWESOME.
I got awesome D9 sticks, two 775 chips and a 7750 BE but no am2+ nor 775 boards








I also got a Dragon F1 pot incoming...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your Updated!


Hey Val, got 4pts with a heaven xtreme run using a 7970 at 1100/1700mhz with an FX 8120 at 4.5ghz with my psc sticks.








#11 in Argentina's enthusiast league so far...Ordering a 7900 gt as we speak, might be good for some vmodd and dry ice action.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd give it a shot...Grab a p45 board or a p965 for that chip and proper D9 ram, or a ddr3 x48 board if budget permits. That would be AWESOME.
> I got awesome D9 sticks, two 775 chips and a 7750 BE but no am2+ nor 775 boards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Eh I don't really want to spend much more. I bought the board, CPU, and RAM for $45. I sold one of my laptops and got a Q6600 and 6GB of Hynix 800MHz for $80 more. I'm just going to use the desktop for folding a 550ti and for the kids to mess around on.


----------



## Snuckie7

So how did you guys apply your CLU? With the included brush or the rice method?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> So how did you guys apply your CLU? With the included brush or the rice method?


Gotta use the brush... it will not spread on its own because its not a conventional paste.


----------



## Swag

Of a non-delidded CPU, what temps should I expect from a 3570k with an NH-D14?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd give it a shot...Grab a p45 board or a p965 for that chip and proper D9 ram, or a ddr3 x48 board if budget permits. That would be AWESOME.
> I got awesome D9 sticks, two 775 chips and a 7750 BE but no am2+ nor 775 boards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also got a Dragon F1 pot incoming...
> Hey Val, got 4pts with a heaven xtreme run using a 7970 at 1100/1700mhz with an FX 8120 at 4.5ghz with my psc sticks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> #11 in Argentina's enthusiast league so far...Ordering a 7900 gt as we speak, might be good for some vmodd and dry ice action.


oooooh sounds nice man! might go donate plasma soon to get money for some 9800 gtx's
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Of a non-delidded CPU, what temps should I expect from a 3570k with an NH-D14?


around 60 for stock adn for 4.3-4.5 giggles around 80C tops.


----------



## feniks

adding a second layer of CLP on the die helped a lot, must have been too thin to make proper contact, temps under Intel Burn Test got lowered by around 8C when compared to before. I still have core temps spread by around 13C between core0 (coldest) and core2 (hottest), but it was same with the best application of CLU. most likely I have a concave in IHS, but I'm not gonna lap it since I am unsure what the gray color of terminal under CPU means...

however if anybody has a dead 3770(K), I can gladly take it for the spare IHS (so I can lap it and keep mine intact)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Eh I don't really want to spend much more. I bought the board, CPU, and RAM for $45. I sold one of my laptops and got a Q6600 and 6GB of Hynix 800MHz for $80 more. I'm just going to use the desktop for folding a 550ti and for the kids to mess around on.


Use 1.45v for the cpu and go as high as it'll go...ram can take up to 2.4v I think. It's normally rated for 2.1-2.2v.
1.45v is also good for the q6600, but for really high validations you'd need cold and closer to 2v.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> oooooh sounds nice man! might go donate plasma soon to get money for some 9800 gtx's
> around 60 for stock adn for 4.3-4.5 giggles around 80C tops.


I got 4.7ghz with 1.37v and 95c max temps on a similar cooler.
Well, changed my mind, I'll get an X1950 Pro, it'll arrive here with my new 3770k and pot.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd give it a shot...Grab a p45 board or a p965 for that chip and proper D9 ram, or a ddr3 x48 board if budget permits. That would be AWESOME.
> I got awesome D9 sticks, two 775 chips and a 7750 BE but no am2+ nor 775 boards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also got a Dragon F1 pot incoming...
> Hey Val, got 4pts with a heaven xtreme run using a 7970 at 1100/1700mhz with an FX 8120 at 4.5ghz with my psc sticks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> #11 in Argentina's enthusiast league so far...Ordering a 7900 gt as we speak, might be good for some vmodd and dry ice action.
> 
> 
> 
> oooooh sounds nice man! might go donate plasma soon to get money for some 9800 gtx's
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Of a non-delidded CPU, what temps should I expect from a 3570k with an NH-D14?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> around 60 for stock adn for 4.3-4.5 giggles around 80C tops.
Click to expand...

Ugh, I reached a 64 on stock... Damn! I think it might be a bad seat...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> oooooh sounds nice man! might go donate plasma soon to get money for some 9800 gtx's
> around 60 for stock adn for 4.3-4.5 giggles around 80C tops.


Selling blood for gpus to bench, hardcore!
Here in CA we just get a cookie & a glass of OJ, no gpu monies or I'd be drained...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Of a non-delidded CPU, what temps should I expect from a 3570k with an NH-D14?


What you get really is what you get. It's not even something u can estimate. Some people are hitting 100 at 4.5 whereas I was able to get to 4.8 with prime95 temps about 95 degrees. After you delid an estimate is easier to make. I can bet after delid that you should be able to prime whatever clock you can get out of 1.5 volts and stay under 80 with the d14.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Selling blood for gpus to bench, hardcore!
> Here in CA we just get a cookie & a glass of OJ, no gpu monies or I'd be drained...


I am on my phone but did I see you had a sick 3dmark11 score about p17000ish single gpu? What clock and cooling did u use?


----------



## justanoldman

I can't post in the market place here, so if you guys know anyone who wants a delidded, lapped, and perfectly functioning 3770k that can do [email protected], [email protected], and 4.8 at around 1.41v let me know.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

64c on stock voltage using stock intel cooler on my de-lidded I7.
Idle at around 30-35c

I think Antec are calling for an RMA


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Selling blood for gpus to bench, hardcore!
> Here in CA we just get a cookie & a glass of OJ, no gpu monies or I'd be drained...


Yeah yay for North Daokta right! How much are 9800 gtx's anyways lately? I wanna try to get 3 for sli runs. dem boints.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am on my phone but did I see you had a sick 3dmark11 score about p17000ish single gpu? What clock and cooling did u use?


Liquid nitrogen cooled gpu & cpu, the 7970 was at 1617/1813, 3770k at 6182Mhz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah yay for North Daokta right! How much are 9800 gtx's anyways lately? I wanna try to get 3 for sli runs. dem boints.


I got some off CL a year or 2 ago for about $50 CAD each. Easy to hardmod for extra voltage.


----------



## Swag

So, here is the rig, it is up and running and I was going to take new photos of it fully assembled with wires and everything but I just said to hold it off until tomorrow or something.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So, here is the rig, it is up and running and I was going to take new photos of it fully assembled with wires and everything but I just said to hold it off until tomorrow or something.


Hi Swag! Feel like I haven't seen you in a while. Good looking rig so far!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

OK....I'm just going to say holy molly...

I'm on my Mum's PC build...I have to re-install windows (the pain), however....I have the following in her PC:
-De-lidded I7 with supposedly ripped IMC
-Stock Intel cooler with stock paste
-i7 with stock clocks and voltages
-16GB ram

Yes you read the last bit quite right - 16GB. All channels work - regardless of what speed they are running at right now (even though I think it is on XMP -> 1600MHZ) -> I'm currently typing this from her PC...
Which might mean three things:
1. I'm extremely lucky/unlucky
2. ASUS might get an RMA request for my Z77 for 2 fried RAM slots
3. My de-lidded i7 is 100% fine....

See it to believe it?
I know it is early days - but my PC would NOT boot with more than 8GB, and more so dual channel - yet on my mum's rig it has no problems (no errors no nothing)
If you cant see this - right click, open in new tab, and be shocked (if you have followed my case that is)



I will wait for my i3, before making any sort of decision.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So, here is the rig, it is up and running and I was going to take new photos of it fully assembled with wires and everything but I just said to hold it off until tomorrow or something.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Swag! Feel like I haven't seen you in a while. Good looking rig so far!
Click to expand...

Thanks!







Yea, I haven't been here too much because I don't like my laptop so I barely get on the PC nowadays until today! I'll be taking the pictures so you guys can see the finished product. For now, I won't be using an independent GPU, I'm using the iGPU. The CPU is clocked to 4.5GHz and it is stable at 1.1800 vcore! 1.18vcore with iGPU? This is a keeper! Also, I ordered a 680. Lol! Kind of overkill but with my old GPU fried and really pissed off, this is probably the only way for me to not be as pissed.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> OK....I'm just going to say holy molly...
> 
> I'm on my Mum's PC build...I have to re-install windows (the pain), however....I have the following in her PC:
> -De-lidded I7 with supposedly ripped IMC
> -Stock Intel cooler with stock paste
> -i7 with stock clocks and voltages
> -16GB ram
> 
> Yes you read the last bit quite right - 16GB. All channels work - regardless of what speed they are running at right now (even though I think it is on XMP -> 1600MHZ) -> I'm currently typing this from her PC...
> Which might mean three things:
> 1. I'm extremely lucky/unlucky
> 2. ASUS might get an RMA request for my Z77 for 2 fried RAM slots
> 3. My de-lidded i7 is 100% fine....
> 
> See it to believe it?
> I know it is early days - but my PC would NOT boot with more than 8GB, and more so dual channel - yet on my mum's rig it has no problems (no errors no nothing)
> If you cant see this - right click, open in new tab, and be shocked (if you have followed my case that is)
> 
> 
> 
> I will wait for my i3, before making any sort of decision.


Gotta be something with the pins or socket in your mobo. I haven't been a fan of the z77 sockets, had 3 boards now where memory channels disappear, either all the time or if a heatsink has any mounting pressure on it. My asus mvg only runs fine with a heatsink placed on the cpu, if I try to actually attach the heatsink it only runs single channel.

I got a new toy today, some great memory for the collection! (think it's kit # 24 for me).


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Well I checked the pins extensively and my friend also looked at them for a good 20mins. Neither of us could see problems with it. Meaning....this all leads back to shorting...this problem is identical to the one I had on my old mobo...I'll soon also know what was the problem with the old one as my friend has it in his possession


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> OK....I'm just going to say holy molly...
> 
> I'm on my Mum's PC build...I have to re-install windows (the pain), however....I have the following in her PC:
> -De-lidded I7 with supposedly ripped IMC
> -Stock Intel cooler with stock paste
> -i7 with stock clocks and voltages
> -16GB ram
> 
> Yes you read the last bit quite right - 16GB. All channels work - regardless of what speed they are running at right now (even though I think it is on XMP -> 1600MHZ) -> I'm currently typing this from her PC...
> Which might mean three things:
> 1. I'm extremely lucky/unlucky
> 2. ASUS might get an RMA request for my Z77 for 2 fried RAM slots
> 3. My de-lidded i7 is 100% fine....
> 
> See it to believe it?
> I know it is early days - but my PC would NOT boot with more than 8GB, and more so dual channel - yet on my mum's rig it has no problems (no errors no nothing)
> If you cant see this - right click, open in new tab, and be shocked (if you have followed my case that is)
> 
> 
> 
> I will wait for my i3, before making any sort of decision.


I think I know what the problem is, I think it is probably the Antec cooler. The pressure of the cooler onto the CPU and then onto the pins were so strong that the motherboard was not able to read certain pins of the CPU and the DIMMs became inoperable. If you want to risk it, try putting your Antec cooler onto that CPU and see if the problem persists, I feel like the problem will come back. With the glue gone, the pressure on the die and overall pressure on the pins of the motherboard becoming significantly higher. The glue acts as a cushion that absorbs a lot of pressure from the coolers we put on it. Especially enthusiast coolers where they put enough pressure to break a bone.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea, I haven't been here too much because I don't like my laptop so I barely get on the PC nowadays until today! I'll be taking the pictures so you guys can see the finished product. For now, I won't be using an independent GPU, I'm using the iGPU. The CPU is clocked to 4.5GHz and it is stable at 1.1800 vcore! 1.18vcore with iGPU? This is a keeper! Also, I ordered a 680. Lol! Kind of overkill but with my old GPU fried and really pissed off, this is probably the only way for me to not be as pissed.


What GPU did you have before? Can't you RMA?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Swag you would be right, if only you had read what I did to diagnose it.
I did on air, semi pressure (by hand clamp) and so on. This isn't to do with pressure.
There are only a few things it can be:
Pins - thoroughly checked
Imc - could be, but doesn't explain it working on my mum's rig
Fried board - looks very likely
Pressure - tested everything imaginable
Incompatibility - not this


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So, here is the rig, it is up and running and I was going to take new photos of it fully assembled with wires and everything but I just said to hold it off until tomorrow or something.


I have no idea how you do that with wires... I'm just lucky the back side door closes on mine..


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So, here is the rig, it is up and running and I was going to take new photos of it fully assembled with wires and everything but I just said to hold it off until tomorrow or something.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have no idea how you do that with wires... I'm just lucky the back side door closes on mine..
Click to expand...

Looks like he did a paracord sleeving job of the wires. Takes 2 people to close both side panels on my case lol.

Front:





And back:


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So, here is the rig, it is up and running and I was going to take new photos of it fully assembled with wires and everything but I just said to hold it off until tomorrow or something.


Your system's looking real good *Swag*. Thanks for sharing those pics of it and I expect we will all want to see how you finish those last wires!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Swag you would be right, if only you had read what I did to diagnose it.
> I did on air, semi pressure (by hand clamp) and so on. This isn't to do with pressure.
> There are only a few things it can be:
> Pins - thoroughly checked
> Imc - could be, but doesn't explain it working on my mum's rig
> Fried board - looks very likely
> Pressure - tested everything imaginable
> Incompatibility - not this


*Dubbed*, I recall someone noting how their sabertooth started to act up after messing with their system, and before they RMA'ed the board they tried to do a complete erase and reload of the BIOS. I think it was a few days ago (probably hundreds of pages back on this thread...). It would be a much quicker fix than going through the whole RMA fun with Asus.....


----------



## Snuckie7

@ some of the cable management here. Is it really that hard organizing everything in the back?


----------



## Belial

NZXT source 210 has less than 2cm of space behind the motherboard (most modern cases have more, i believe the corsair carbide 300r has at least 3mm behind it, nzxt phantom has like 4-5 i think). So whatever your case has in space, half that (unless it's over 2 years old, or a terrible case).

Then, I got 5 case fans. 5 case fans isn't too bad, until you get a fan controller. Molex is a real pain in the ass - not only can these 5 case fans basically not be wired through any 'wiring hole' or utility hole or convenient slit (like those all over the hdd and cd bays), but the 5 molex connectors on the fan controller. There's also 5 temperature sensors. A Molex LED.

Not to mention in my case, I removed the HDD bays. So the matter of where to put those molex connectors, which, even in the best and most spacious of cases, cannot be put behind the motherboard panel, and are always stuck behind the HDD bays, becomes a minor problem, to a huge problem. Did I mention I also have 3 fans on my heatsink, and one of them is molex?

Oh, and you can't put them behind or inside your CD drive bays, because your case doesn't have enough space, and, because you can see cables through the cd bays if you got internal lights.

Imagine your computer case wiring, and if that same wiring set-up, was put in my case. I'm pretty sure if you used my case, you would have a ton of cables out in the open where my HDD bays are, OR, you'd have cables showing everywhere. Because I took a lot of painstaking effort, to make sure you don't see the 24 pin, 6 pins, or 8 pin cables. You dont see any sata cables, and you dont see any molex cables.

Believe me, everything in the back was organized. It was all very tidy like that other guys (who, by the way, didn't have a fan controller, any additional case fans, and didn't even plug in his cables to his motherboard or put a heatsink or GPU in). Then once you introduce molex, and remove the HDD bays, it all goes to hell.

I can't believe you are critical of the _back_ of the case. The point is making the visible part of the case (an oxymoron, but I put a window in my case so it isn't one) very clean. And there are no cables visible in my case. The only ugly part is my cables aren't sleeved... yet.


----------



## FtW 420

The back of your case doesn't even look _that_ bad, cleaner than the front of mine







.

Pursuit of performance is the motto, pursuit of fashion is for the case mod threads!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Pursuit of fashion lol
so true









Ugh, what to do? FTW HELP!








old gpu or 775 boards (abit 965 s dark, dfi ip35 pro, asus p5q)? Waiting for my new 3770k is. killing me!


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I can't believe you are critical of the _back_ of the case. The point is making the visible part of the case (an oxymoron, but I put a window in my case so it isn't one) very clean. And there are no cables visible in my case. The only ugly part is my cables aren't sleeved... yet.


I honestly thought it would be actually easier to just tie everything together neatly, even if it is in the back.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Pursuit of fashion lol
> so true
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ugh, what to do? FTW HELP!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> old gpu or 775 boards (abit 965 s dark, dfi ip35 pro, asus p5q)? Waiting for my new 3770k is. killing me!


Hard call, they're all fun...
An old gpu can be benched, modded, & re-benched with new cpus, the 775 board you do kinda need cold to get very far, it is neat to see an old celly d at 7Ghz+ though.
Also might be hard to find old cpus to bench with these guys snapping them all up for delid practice!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Even at 5.5Ghz with HT I was hitting around 128Gflops. Memory does have a small effect on the gflops.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would agree that gigaflops aren't of much importance, disabling HT decreases overall performance yet increases gigaflops. Also AVX, sp1 can double the gigaflops, yet unless running something that uses AVX a computer that gets 60 gflops can have the exact same performance as a machine getting 100 gflops +.
> But for a particular single rig, when testing & looking at the gigaflops, increasing the gflpos does basically increase performance (not by disabling HT, but getting higher at however the rig is set up).


does that mean its not liniair?
like this math suggests:
28.42 * GHz (4.5) = 127.89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Idontcare;34613621*
> Gflops are also very sensitive to the specific problem size that gets ran, dependent on the ram used for the test.
> 
> You should get a dead-linear curve between clockspeed and Gflops.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Running problem size 43122 with DDR3-1866 ram, Sandy Bridge will give you 28.28 GFlops/GHz and
> *Ivy Bridge will give you 28.42 GFlops/GHz*.


----------



## Snuckie7

^Is that graph for IBT?

I can only hit 98 GFlops with my i7-3820 at 4.3 GHz. . ..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> ^Is that graph for IBT?
> 
> I can only hit 98 GFlops with my i7-3820 at 4.3 GHz. . ..


i dont think so,
the poster is talking about problem size, cant adjust that in ibt if im correct


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i dont think so,
> the poster is talking about problem size, cant adjust that in ibt if im correct


Oh wait, I just saw the graph title: "Peak GFlops out of 5 cycles of IBT/LinX"

In IBT it must be the different stress levels you can set the program to run at.


----------



## FtW 420

Yeah not really sure how it works with the problem size, I definitely wasn't getting 156 GFlops like his math would suggest. He must be looking at LinX (linpack, same as IBT) for the problem size, there is no option to change it in IBT, it just changes with the amount of memory used I would guess.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Oh wait, I just saw the graph title: "Peak GFlops out of 5 cycles of IBT/LinX"
> 
> In IBT it must be the different stress levels you can set the program to run at.


...yes, there are different stress levels in IBT (v2):


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I can't believe you are critical of the _back_ of the case. The point is making the visible part of the case (an oxymoron, but I put a window in my case so it isn't one) very clean. And there are no cables visible in my case. The only ugly part is my cables aren't sleeved... yet.
> 
> 
> 
> I honestly thought it would be actually easier to just tie everything together neatly, even if it is in the back.
Click to expand...

It is all tied together, but the 24 pin, 2 x pci cable, and sata cables will not fit if any other cable goes over them larger than a fan controller 2 pin wire. I also have to snake these power cables in a way that you don't see them except for when they very tightly connect to the motherboard (and still, at the same, make sure none of the power cables overlap). I also can't have anything overlap the SSD, or else it won't fit, since the only free space that could fit the SSD, was one of the thinning points behind the motherboard. This also obstructs a lot of space because of the sata cable that has to connect to it, and all 4 sata connectors on that one cable.

I also constantly am moving fans around, so the cables have to be set up in a way that allows me to move things around constantly. I'm sure moving things and then restrapping them hasn't helped. All of the cables are also very taught, to make sure minimal cable is revealed inside the case. I also have to set up some give so some of them can be pulled, like so I can pull the front panel cleanly to the side so I can access the fans, the cpu cooling fans as I am constantly remounting, moving fans, etc.

You can't just tie everything together, I actually have to make sure that nothing is tied together, or else it won't fit. 8 case fans, a fan controller, 5 thermal diodes, and you can't let any of them overlap. The molex connectors on them can't overlap (that's 6 x 2 molex for male/female 3 pin fans i got + 5 + 1 for the fan controller + 1 for the LED)

19 molex heads, 4 full-length PSU cables, and an SSD that cannot overlap at all, anywhere in the case. Add to that your general speaker cables, the wires from 8 fans, y splitter, fan controller, LED, SATA cables, case cables, usb cables, 5 thermal diodes, and a case speaker, and on top of it all, you do not have a HDD bay to hide behind and nothing but a couple molex wires can go behind the CD bay, and it gets real cramped.

im getting nvidia driver crashes during stress testing, does anyone else get that? Ive had black screens before but gpu driver crashing during p95, i think that's a first for me... might be a stability issue, need more voltage, lower clock, etc, but kinda odd.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yes, there are different stress levels in IBT (v2):


Do those actually change the problem size though? Or is it just the amount of RAM used in the test?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Do those actually change the problem size though? Or is it just the amount of RAM used in the test?


I don't know for sure, but think that it does use larger problem sizes for more memory used & higher stress.


----------



## VonDutch

Linx does have some problem size options,

not sure how they work tho, i use ibt most of the time, in the program itself the problem size is greyed out,
can change it in settings


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> I honestly thought it would be actually easier to just tie everything together neatly, even if it is in the back.


When you have a really narrow space behind the back of your motherboard like Belial to only way to even attempt to be able to put your side panel back on without bending it in half is to spread the wires out like hes done. If he had a half inch or more back there like most newer cases, then sure, zip tie it all together, hell put an ice cream maker back there, whatever you want to do. But not in that case.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> im getting nvidia driver crashes during stress testing, does anyone else get that? Ive had black screens before but gpu driver crashing during p95, i think that's a first for me... might be a stability issue, need more voltage, lower clock, etc, but kinda odd.


You don't have the BLCK over 100 do you?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Can someone explain blck vs fsb to me?
In the old days you would raise fsb as high as you can. Now you leave blck at 100 - why?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Can someone explain blck vs fsb to me?
> In the old days you would raise fsb as high as you can. Now you leave blck at 100 - why?


The base clock controls much more components than the Front Side Bus. Overclocking the Front Side Bus usually directly effects the CPU and RAM, and you can sometimes lower the multiplier to get where you want to be.

Base clock can mess with your PCIe slots and Intel chipset and there is no multiplier to adjust so running these things out of spec can be dangerous but mostly causes instability.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Right so in effect we have less control nowadays?
Plus rep to Rooney


----------



## stickg1

In a way it's made overclocking easier because you have control and can isolate the CPU or RAM. It's less time consuming and almost anyone can do it, to an extent.


----------



## I_shot

New delidded chip









But first, the blood brothers













4.4 ghz stock cooler room temp 21 C gelid extreme



4.4 ghz stock cooler room temp 22 C gelid extreme



Average difference 13 C. Note that there is not huge amount of heat output cause vcore is low.so temp difference is not above 20 C. I wish i had noctua now to test higher clocks and show bigger temp gap but it's okay. That's my fourth delidded chip


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think I'm going for one of those boards...I found a lot of celly d 356 chips for 10usda and the dfi s dark comes with an e4400 and ocz reaper ram.
the abit ip35 does come with the miccro gguru panel though...and there's also a p5q but I'm not sure if it's any good for benching.

I may get a radeon though, 2600 xt, or a 4870x2, maybe a gtx 295, 285 or 9800a gtx+...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Hard call, they're all fun...
> An old gpu can be benched, modded, & re-benched with new cpus, the 775 board you do kinda need cold to get very far, it is neat to see an old celly d at 7Ghz+ though.
> Also might be hard to find old cpus to bench with these guys snapping them all up for delid practice!


----------



## justanoldman

Since I spent much of my time finding overclock levels in the 4.5 to 4.7 range, I was looking for any suggestions you guys might have. Now that delidding gives me the option of 5.0, do you guys make any changes, tweaks, or adjustments in BIOS for 5.0 or above? Or is it pretty much the same as the 4.6 range?

I got my latest chip 24 hours Prime95 stable at 5.0, but I just used the same settings I have been using (which I learned from Swag's excellent guide) and I don't konw if I should try any slight adjustments to anything.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Since I spent much of my time finding overclock levels in the 4.5 to 4.7 range, I was looking for any suggestions you guys might have. Now that delidding gives me the option of 5.0, do you guys make any changes, tweaks, or adjustments in BIOS for 5.0 or above? Or is it pretty much the same as the 4.6 range?
> 
> I got my latest chip 24 hours Prime95 stable at 5.0, but I just used the same settings I have been using (which I learned from Swag's excellent guide) and I don't konw if I should try any slight adjustments to anything.


Enable ppl overvoltage if it's not already


----------



## DiamondCut

Finally got my system up and running with a full res and rad and got into bios but I have no OS atm so I will test for clocks later. MSI was reading 35c CPU and 25c northbridge.


Oh and thats at 4.2ghz set by the MSI OC Genie II.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Finally got my system up and running with a full res and rad and got into bios but I have no OS atm so I will test for clocks later. MSI was reading 35c CPU and 25c northbridge.
> 
> 
> Oh and thats at 4.2ghz set by the MSI OC Genie II.


Mansoon fittings ?


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Mansoon fittings ?


yessir


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Finally got my system up and running with a full res and rad and got into bios but I have no OS atm so I will test for clocks later. MSI was reading 35c CPU and 25c northbridge.
> 
> 
> Oh and thats at 4.2ghz set by the MSI OC Genie II.


How many nights of RedTube did it take to fill that loop?











Or maybe?.....


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Pea sized dot MX-2 on IHS - result:
I would listen to Arctic here, and stick with the line method. The amount of paste (i know you're not supposed to have much) but the amount on there was so minimal that, I wouldn't be surprised why at HIGH LOAD and HIGH TEMPS my temp levels were going higher than expected, even after de-lidding.

Hope this helps someone.



EDIT:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How many nights of RedTube did it take to fill that loop?


hahaha


----------



## dmanstasiu

yup, old-style


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Since I spent much of my time finding overclock levels in the 4.5 to 4.7 range, I was looking for any suggestions you guys might have. Now that delidding gives me the option of 5.0, do you guys make any changes, tweaks, or adjustments in BIOS for 5.0 or above? Or is it pretty much the same as the 4.6 range?
> 
> I got my latest chip 24 hours Prime95 stable at 5.0, but I just used the same settings I have been using (which I learned from Swag's excellent guide) and I don't konw if I should try any slight adjustments to anything.


heres my settings for 5ghz


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How many nights of RedTube did it take to fill that loop?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or maybe?.....


Lol, i love this coolant. Stop your hatin ;D


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Add me to the club baby!
My cpu is 100% fine! Confirmed that it's my rubbish Asus noobtooth z77
Dram led with brand new i3 3255 - and i7 cpu runs 16gb no problems on my mum's rig!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Add me to the club baby!
> My cpu is 100% fine! Confirmed that it's my rubbish Asus noobtooth z77
> Dram led with brand new i3 3255 - and i7 cpu runs 16gb no problems on my mum's rig!


submit that stuff and I'll FINALLY add you!









bought damn time...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Add me to the club baby!
> My cpu is 100% fine! Confirmed that it's my rubbish Asus noobtooth z77
> Dram led with brand new i3 3255 - and i7 cpu runs 16gb no problems on my mum's rig!


That is great news, you didn't hurt the chip after all.








Now you just have to put up with the wait and trouble of a mobo RMA.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Add me to the club baby!
> My cpu is 100% fine! Confirmed that it's my rubbish Asus noobtooth z77
> Dram led with brand new i3 3255 - and i7 cpu runs 16gb no problems on my mum's rig!


Noobtooth lol
Get a proper MVG or MVF








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> submit that stuff and I'll FINALLY add you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bought damn time...


Someone's having his period lol


----------



## $ilent

CL liquid pro is the shiz!

58c max temps whilst gaming at 1.35-1.4v and 5ghz is unbeliavble!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hahaha! I'm allowed to diss my own things!









As for the entry requirements. I think it's not fair, as I'm going to rma the antec. If anything I got only 12c better temps. Do I really need to put the details? I got a dedicated thread lol


----------



## DiamondCut

Lol I was freaking out yesterday while filling my loop. I was switching the PSU on and off to air out my loop and I noticed that the power was going on and off on its own and I was literally freaking out because I couldn't see the display since I didn't have an HDMI cable/monitor and I was doing all this research until i noticed I had no ram in the system.... It was one of those "The answer is right in front of you" idiotic moments. I was so worried something decided to take a dump on me after I've voided all my warranty's lol.


----------



## lngu81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Add me to the club baby!
> My cpu is 100% fine! Confirmed that it's my rubbish Asus noobtooth z77
> Dram led with brand new i3 3255 - and i7 cpu runs 16gb no problems on my mum's rig!


My Sabertooth DOA on the same day due to power issue , I exchanged it for GIgabyte, the MSY shop owner said that he had 3 returned in the same week, 8 in a month!
Waiting on my liquid pro to delid the dam thing and joining the coolcats


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lngu81*
> 
> My Sabertooth DOA on the same day due to power issue , I exchanged it for GIgabyte, the MSY shop owner said that he had 3 returned in the same week, 8 in a month!
> Waiting on my liquid pro to delid the dam thing and joining the coolcats


Yup - wish I went MSi now - my GFX has been brilliant, and it is an MSI.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Why not just jump the PSU ?


----------



## lngu81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Yup - wish I went MSi now - my GFX has been brilliant, and it is an MSI.


Oops, I forgot i'm on international forum, MSY is a computer shop in Sydney - not MSI lol


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Pea sized dot MX-2 on IHS - result:
> I would listen to Arctic here, and stick with the line method. The amount of paste (i know you're not supposed to have much) but the amount on there was so minimal that, I wouldn't be surprised why at HIGH LOAD and HIGH TEMPS my temp levels were going higher than expected, even after de-lidding.
> 
> Hope this helps someone.
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How many nights of RedTube did it take to fill that loop?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hahaha
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Pea sized dot MX-2 on IHS - result:
> I would listen to Arctic here, and stick with the line method. The amount of paste (i know you're not supposed to have much) but the amount on there was so minimal that, I wouldn't be surprised why at HIGH LOAD and HIGH TEMPS my temp levels were going higher than expected, even after de-lidding.


Dude, that footprint looks absolutely perfect.

Don't do line method. Your temps are pretty consistent with MX-4, you got a 10*C drop, I don't know what you are expecting with mid-range paste.

Feel free to test out different applications of paste, but I assure you, as someone who tested 7 different pastes, and different spread methods, and over 40 TIM mounts and remounts and spreading and line and pea and etc, the paste footprint you got there looks perfect.

You've also got a 3770k, which is much hotter than a 3570k, so that's another reason your temps would be different. I'm getting 88*C peak temp in cold room with 5 case fans and an NH-D14 with 120/140/140 noctua fans all on full blast, at [email protected]

It doesn't take long to test out pastes. Just put a dab on, run small fft for 5 minutes, there's your max temp +/- 1*C. Then try it another way, takes less than an hour. In the end there's very little difference between similar amounts of paste, and it's pretty much impossible to use too little (i've had footprints half the size what you had, and temps were exactly the same), but just a single rice grain literally borders on too thermal paste, as in it will cause about 5*C+ suddenly if you start bordering on too much paste.

And a line method is wayyyyy too much paste. A dot method is perfect, a rice grain is okay. Just make sure it's actually rice grain length, like very short. It's really easy for single rice grain to be too fat or slightly too long and cause temp rise. But seriously your footprint there should be posted all over the internets of what a perfect TIM application looks like.

And it's not like I tested TIMs a month ago, I still test TIMs all the time. Every time I remount my cooler, I adjust tim application and test things out (I remount at least once every 2 days, btw I still haven't used up more than 1.5g of paste and it's gotta have done at least 20 applications). There isn't any difference most of the time, but when I use a rice grain that's too fat I can tell right away.
Quote:


> You don't have the BLCK over 100 do you?


No, manually set to 100.00. I think there might be some driver issues with the 460 though, i tried to test it for stability at the overclock i've gotten on it a while back and was having a lot of difficulty. I'll play with it later. Repped, thanks for putting a perspective on the issue though.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Dude, that footprint looks absolutely perfect.
> 
> Don't do line method. Your temps are pretty consistent with MX-4, you got a 10*C drop, I don't know what you are expecting with mid-range paste.


thanks for your input and experience


----------



## justanoldman

TD,
Nice video on your thread. I just had to translate "zed" to "zee" and "mum" to "mom."









As to the TIM fingerprint, do you have a picture of the IHS when you first took that off? I have found looking at the fingerprint on the cooler and IHS together paint a better picture of knowing whether good contact was made.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Add me to the club baby!
> My cpu is 100% fine! Confirmed that it's my rubbish Asus noobtooth z77
> Dram led with brand new i3 3255 - and i7 cpu runs 16gb no problems on my mum's rig!


That's great news! Now if we can win away tomorrow vs Real Madrid you will be having a real good week!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> No, manually set to 100.00. I think there might be some driver issues with the 460 though, i tried to test it for stability at the overclock i've gotten on it a while back and was having a lot of difficulty. I'll play with it later. Repped, thanks for putting a perspective on the issue though.


What drivers? Sounds like a strange issue, no GPU overclocking or anything?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> TD,
> Nice video on your thread. I just had to translate "zed" to "zee" and "mum" to "mom."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As to the TIM fingerprint, do you have a picture of the IHS when you first took that off? I have found looking at the fingerprint on the cooler and IHS together paint a better picture of knowing whether good contact was made.


Darn it forgot to take the picture - but it had pretty much the same pattern on the IHS too - very thin layer too.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's great news! Now if we can win away tomorrow vs Real Madrid you will be having a real good week!
> What drivers? Sounds like a strange issue, no GPU overclocking or anything?


Man that would be amazing lol!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Darn it forgot to take the picture - but it had pretty much the same pattern on the IHS too - very thin layer too.


No problem, when you get your board back, and Antec back too if you RMA that (since it seemed to be underperforming) you should try a few different TIM application methods. Takes some quick temp readings (IBT on max for 5 minutes works fine) and take pictures of the fingerprints. In not very much time you can try several different things and narrow down what works best.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's great news! Now if we can win away tomorrow vs Real Madrid you will be having a real good week!
> What drivers? Sounds like a strange issue, no GPU overclocking or anything?


To me it sounds like ram instability...
I'd loosen things up violently and use a jedec profile with single channel ram (leave the bad stick out Belial)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No problem, when you get your board back, and Antec back too if you RMA that (since it seemed to be underperforming) you should try a few different TIM application methods. Takes some quick temp readings (IBT on max for 5 minutes works fine) and take pictures of the fingerprints. In not very much time you can try several different things and narrow down what works best.


will do so amigo!
Gotta love these PC's


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> What drivers? Sounds like a strange issue, no GPU overclocking or anything?


Well I have the newest driver, 310 or whatever, for the 460. Don't worry about it, OCCT turns out is really buggy (the beta is supposed to fix it, not sure if it has). I think it had to do with CPU stability, i mean I'm sitting pretty at 12+ hours at 4.8/1.4vcore right now just fleshing out the chip so it's all good. I was trying to run my completely verfied stable 922mhz 1.087v and even stock and having driver crashes, black screens, during kombostor/furmark...

don't worry about it, i'll figure it out later









IBT doesnt work for temp testing too well for me, it's inconsistent. It plateaus, rises, plateaus, rises. Small fft (or better yet, custom small fft with min/max set to 8/8) is best, 5 minutes for instant max temp.


----------



## sena

I did it too, at first i was getting 51 error code, no memory detected, but it worked later, i hope it will remain like that.

CLLP on die, GC Extreme on IHS.

Avarage 20C temp drop.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> In a way it's made overclocking easier because you have control and can isolate the CPU or RAM. It's less time consuming and almost anyone can do it, to an extent.


I want to see how the water loop is coming along!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> I did it too, at first i was getting 51 error code, no memory detected, but it worked later, i hope it will remain like that.
> 
> CLLP on die, GC Extreme on IHS.
> 
> Avarage 20C temp drop.


Nice job, congratulations on the temp drop. Hopefully you don't run into any issues except deciding how far you want to push your now colder chip.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> CL liquid pro is the shiz!
> 
> 58c max temps whilst gaming at 1.35-1.4v and 5ghz is unbeliavble!


Isn't it


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Nice job, congratulations on the temp drop. Hopefully you don't run into any issues except deciding how far you want to push your now colder chip.


Thx man, i powered pc couple of times, and it was ok, i will see tommorow what will happen.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Linx does have some problem size options,
> 
> not sure how they work tho, i use ibt most of the time, in the program itself the problem size is greyed out,
> can change it in settings


Hey Dutch did I see on anandtech the other day a guy tell you that u have "phantom instability"? Any idea what the proper amount of gigaflops we should be getting is at. 4.9 or 5ghz with a 3570k and 1600mhz ram? Assuming I am not getting invisible calc corrections? Was that guy accurate or full of it?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Thx man, i powered pc couple of times, and it was ok, i will see tommorow what will happen.


...just delidded myself a few days back...keep in mind that you changed the 'full package depth' re CPU cooler pressure on the CPU and in turn on the pins...some folks have had issues with that, ie regarding IMC and other memory stick items...carefully readjusting the CPU cooler pressure might help


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Can someone explain blck vs fsb to me?
> In the old days you would raise fsb as high as you can. Now you leave blck at 100 - why?


It doesn't usually hurt anything to raise up the bclk. It does overclock the sata & pci-e frequencies as well (not sure what else), but I haven't seen any devices that have issues under 109 Bclk or so, & most are fine with higher (I have one ssd that starts getting flakey over 109, nothing else affected under 115).
I don't run 24/7 with bclk over 100 so can't speak for long term effects, with ivy bridge I've run 110 for 12 hours + at a time with no issues.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Since I spent much of my time finding overclock levels in the 4.5 to 4.7 range, I was looking for any suggestions you guys might have. Now that delidding gives me the option of 5.0, do you guys make any changes, tweaks, or adjustments in BIOS for 5.0 or above? Or is it pretty much the same as the 4.6 range?
> 
> I got my latest chip 24 hours Prime95 stable at 5.0, but I just used the same settings I have been using (which I learned from Swag's excellent guide) and I don't konw if I should try any slight adjustments to anything.


I don't normally have to change anything else going a little above 5ghz, I do have to start bumping up the vccio going 5.5Ghz & over.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think I'm going for one of those boards...I found a lot of celly d 356 chips for 10usda and the dfi s dark comes with an e4400 and ocz reaper ram.
> the abit ip35 does come with the miccro gguru panel though...and there's also a p5q but I'm not sure if it's any good for benching.
> 
> I may get a radeon though, 2600 xt, or a 4870x2, maybe a gtx 295, 285 or 9800a gtx+...


Isn't it[/quote]

The board does sound more fun when you have a bunch of cheap chips lined up. Got pot?
Hard to say about the board, I don't know 775 that well, I still have a rampage x48 & some p4s here I haven't used yet. I'd like to to find a 4870 x 2, 4890s are also harder to get a decent deal on than I would expect, see them now & then locally but people want way too much...
The nvidia's are all fun. a brand new gtx 295 was my biggest mod fail ever, learned with that one to solder in V read points when a slip of the hand while probing voltages was a $650 mistake...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> heres my settings for 5ghz
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I notice your long duration maintained power limit is 1second. Mine is set to auto with everything around it at 500. What is the difference between having it set to 1s vs. a longer duration and what exactly does long duration power limit do?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It doesn't usually hurt anything to raise up the bclk. It does overclock the sata & pci-e frequencies as well (not sure what else), but I haven't seen any devices that have issues under 109 Bclk or so, & most are fine with higher (I have one ssd that starts getting flakey over 109, nothing else affected under 115).
> I don't run 24/7 with bclk over 100 so can't speak for long term effects, with ivy bridge I've run 110 for 12 hours + at a time with no issues.
> I don't normally have to change anything else going a little above 5ghz, I do have to start bumping up the vccio going 5.5Ghz & over.
> 
> The board does sound more fun when you have a bunch of cheap chips lined up. Got pot?
> Hard to say about the board, I don't know 775 that well, I still have a rampage x48 & some p4s here I haven't used yet. I'd like to to find a 4870 x 2, 4890s are also harder to get a decent deal on than I would expect, see them now & then locally but people want way too much...
> The nvidia's are all fun. a brand new gtx 295 was my biggest mod fail ever, learned with that one to solder in V read points when a slip of the hand while probing voltages was a $650 mistake...


Ouch! I settled on the 775 stuff, but only p45 or x48...I have a few boards in mind, waiting to bid at the right time. I don't smoke xD and my ln2 pot hasn't got here yet.
As for the 4870x2, there are two at fleabay atm. One is at 32usd








The gtx295's are cheap too, less than 100usd atm.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I notice your long duration maintained power limit is 1second. Mine is set to auto with everything around it at 500. What is the difference between having it set to 1s vs. a longer duration and what exactly does long duration power limit do?


well honestley i have no idea


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ouch! I settled on the 775 stuff, but only p45 or x48...I have a few boards in mind, waiting to bid at the right time. I don't smoke xD and my ln2 pot hasn't got here yet.
> As for the 4870x2, there are two at fleabay atm. One is at 32usd
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The gtx295's are cheap too, less than 100usd atm.


Lol, I did mean ln2 pot. Although for smoking, it will make hardware live longer than drinking while benching (but better chance of breaking records while alcohol fueled).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, I did mean ln2 pot. Although for smoking, it will make hardware live longer than drinking while benching (but better chance of breaking records while alcohol fueled).


xD

I got 20hs more to go before I can bid on the board. A friend offered to pay half of it if I let him help me out with the dice and serve some drinks while at it lol


----------



## Swag

@*Everyone who commented about my pictures*

Thanks!







I'll probably be taking the photos later when I decide to just turn off the rig and take the pictures, the back panel of mine closes perfectly like no wires so I have had no problem on that side. I did run into problems though when I needed to pull the cables but waaaay to hard since I only have 2 hands.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Swag you would be right, if only you had read what I did to diagnose it.
> I did on air, semi pressure (by hand clamp) and so on. This isn't to do with pressure.
> There are only a few things it can be:
> Pins - thoroughly checked
> Imc - could be, but doesn't explain it working on my mum's rig
> Fried board - looks very likely
> Pressure - tested everything imaginable
> Incompatibility - not this


A work of god then.







Haha!


----------



## Joa3d43

*An almost complete and most excellent delidding adventure with a factory-crooked IHS; safe vCore per Intel (sort of); stress testing to 5.2 GHz; 3D marks*

After recently delidding, I like to express my 'Big Thanks'







to *Valgaur, FtW 420, Swag, VonDutch* and many, MANY others that have helped with their postings

Parrt 1 - intro and background


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



As part of running a software company, I updated my 'private stock' of five machines for my home office starting late last fall re I7 3770s and various Asus Z77 boards, eventually ranging from P8Z77-V LK boards to Sabertooth Z77 and ROG Max V Extreme.

Four of the machines are filled with 3770 'non-Ks' as they are part of a Virtual Machine (non-K's have locked multiplier / to 41/43 and virtualization; K's have unlocked multipliers but no virtualization). ALL machines run the max 32 GB of RAM and are loaded to the gills with heavy biz software such as multiple instances of SQL (incl. "enterprise") and IIS web servers (set to 'LocalHost') which I mention as it does affect at least vCore in overclocking.

While I used to do a lot of overclocking 'back in the day', I had not done serious OC'ing for about seven or eight years - my, how things have changed - PLL ?  All of the 'non-K' 3770 *overclock quite nicely t*o at least 4.5 Ghz, and two to max multiplier x BCLK up to 107, so 4.6 Ghz (all with after market cooling).

That kind of whetted my appetite 'for more'...1st came a decent video card (GTX 670), then a second one for SLI (next to me on my desk is lying the 3rd one....). Then I picked up a 3770K ...which turned out to be from the Costa Rica 3229C series...I ran and posted some benches and had replies from folks who recommended the 'delidding thread'...the chip validated well over 5.3 Ghz with the lid on and with fairly moderate vCore for that speed (with more to come)



When I posted these screens for 100% load at 4.8, 4.9 and 5.0 Ghz, it meant

a.) DELID as this is a good chip that runs very fast on low vCore; just needs better temps at 5 Ghz daily
b.) DON'T DELID as this is a good chip hat runs very fast on low vCore - why take the risk to ruin it ?
c.) Some PM offers to purchase the chip from me

more 100% load / vcore /speeds prior to delid


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!










The above, PLUS



PLUS...



...resulted in...



...and...



The delidding itself will be a 3-part affair, with two of the three parts completed so far.

The first step involved applying new TIM to the 3 video cards 'as a dry run', though I skipped CL (the intended TIM) as there were some aluminum bits mixed in with copper parts on the cooler that would have come in contact with the CL (which doesn't play nice with aluminum).

Then I took the CPU out and placed the Hardware-store type blade on one corner...which was followed by a BIG realization: *It was not going to work* - using a magnifying glass, I confirmed that the factory-mounted IHS 'was crooked' - on one whole side, you could not even see the black silicon-type glue as the metal of the IHS was basically sitting on the PCB...on the other side, there was a lot of room - more than I have seen in pics by others in this thread.

As I at that time only had the hardware-store 'bigger' blade, I put it all together again...and applied some Coollaboratory Ultra to the IHS (replacing what was a correctly applied Arctic MX4 TIM). Here are some direct comparisons of these two TIMS:



We then drove up to Whistler (long weekend in Canada), but I returned early on my own to get to the bottom of this ! Fellow OCers and especially Delidders' surely know how it is like ! The problem was that I was so tired yet full of hi-po espresso when I had another go at the CPU, this time starting with the crooked side that showed a lot of space and black glue.

Next - the actual delid described with too many words:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Still, I in the meantime had picked up the thinner 'Wilkinson' blade and I used that first...on the side with a lot of space, this was fairly easy though being really tired and my eyes wanting to shut did not help... yet the blade slid in effortlessly around 65% of the circumference - until I got to the spot where the IHS was virtually sitting on the pcb...working even the thin blade in there meant riding a bit on the pcb so I pushed 'up' as hard as I could - and actually ended up cutting into and notching the IHS (think of it as extra venting now).

Finally, I pulled out the bigger blade again and placed it where there was the most black glue on the pcb on the free side - then twisted it. The IHS flew off and the blade went into not one but two fingers...

I could see that on the 'problem corner', there *was NO black glue left* on the pcb to scrape off, and there were some drag marks of the blade on the pcb, but they had not gone 'through the top green layer' just marked it. I claim divine intervention because I was half asleep when I did that, so it could not have been me







Of more concern though were various copper like spots on other parts of the pcb - did I scrape right through there with the bigger blade ? Nope, they turned out to be pieces of copper from when I forced the blade into the IHS and notched it. Close call









After cleaning up the IHS and pcb, it was time to apply some CL-U, and I think I got just the right amount on it. I placed the CPU carefully into its socket and then very gingerly put the IHS on top - set back a bit to account for the 'forward-slide' when closing the metal clamp even with my finger pushing onto the IHS center top, though I know that *I am about 1.5mm too far back still* - don't think that it will matter much as the die is not touching any sides and the IHS is otherwise seated firmly on the die with the correct amount of CL.

But there was another problem - or two. For now, I have been using a closed loop Thermaltake 2 Extreme water cooler (the one with the Asetek block / pump and the 240 mm rad). This is a really good solution, other than its mobo back 'plate (rubbery plastic') and retainer 'soft metal nuts' are very flimsy...this set-up has wandered across three different motherboard types, and on two of those it has been 'on and off' at least 5 times.

By now, some of the spacer rubber pieces are only half the depth they used to be, and on one corner, one of the retainer nuts has worked itself deep into the rubber / plastic backing plate - meaning that even on full lock it will still have a bit of play and thus not be perfectly seating the water block on the IHS. Furthermore, one of the bandages had come off and I was literally bleeding onto the IHS / mobo - time to act fast and rational...

Given the upcoming 'next step' per below which includes a new Koolance block / custom loop in just a few days, I decided NOT to use CL P on the IHS for just a few days as I had read that it can be a bit hard to get off. Further, I knew that the current water block fit would be marginal at best, so I plastered far more MX4 on it than I normally would, in part to make up for the bit of play at one corner, and knowing that it just had to last a week, because:



...paraphrased per "Jaws" *We gonna need a bigger boat*



...it was difficult enough to wedge an eATX Max V Extreme into the Antec 302 case, complete with two video cards, but there is no way a 3rd will fit plus a custom cooling loop

...so here is the *'bigger boat'* (still in dry dock, also will be the home of the IvyB-E in the fall with dual GTX Titans)



more pics


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








*"Early / Temporary Results"*

Per above qualifiers (CL U on die, but too much MX 4 on ill-fitting water block), have a look-see at these early results for 5, 5.1 and 5.2 GHz 'delidded'














:



*5.1 and 5.2 GHz:*


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








I hope the new loop with 360 double-thick rad w/5 120mm fans, IHS to Koolance 370 SI CPU block with CL Pro in between will improve these already impressive temp gains per delid and partial CL. I always could run 5 Ghz 24/7 with for that speed 'modest' vCore, but temps were a bit of an issue - not anymore, even before the 'big' cooling upgrade. Per above, even 5.2 Ghz is very stable at benching.

*Safe vCore - ?*

My experience with max vCore is : Not to post it as that topic has already seen some 'heated' discussions in this thread (isn't that right, VonDutch







)

That said, I tend to use what I consider an excellent overclocking tool in addition to the posted OC for IvyBridge Bios settings on this site - said tool is *Intel's own 'Extreme Tuning Utility*'. While it has a nice option to raise vCore all the way to kingdom-come, it won't actually apply any more than 1.525v (+ - a small variance, depending on PLL). I take Intel's wisdom to heart, as much as I have other tools that can raise vCore all the way to 2vs. I might validate beyond the 5.32 Ghz I already did way back at slightly more vCore, but in the end, unless I go to LN2 later with this chip and board once IvyBridge-E has arrived. I take Intel's wisdom seriously.

Finally (if you made it this far







), some 5 GHz 3D benchmarks...including some 'extreme' settings...even with the less than perfect temp cooling solution, no core ever went past 72 C on the most intensive CPU tests











more pics / bench results


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> *An almost complete and most excellent delidding adventure with a factory-crooked IHS; safe vCore per Intel (sort of); stress testing to 5.2 GHz; 3D marks*
> 
> After recently delidding, I like to express my 'Big Thanks'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to *Valgaur, FtW 420, Swag, VonDutch* and many, MANY others that have helped with their postings
> 
> Parrt 1 - intro and background
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> As part of running a software company, I updated my 'private stock' of five machines for my home office starting late last fall re I7 3770s and various Asus Z77 boards, eventually ranging from P8Z77-V LK boards to Sabertooth Z77 and ROG Max V Extreme.
> 
> Four of the machines are filled with 3770 'non-Ks' as they are part of a Virtual Machine (non-K's have locked multiplier / to 41/43 and virtualization; K's have unlocked multipliers but no virtualization). ALL machines run the max 32 GB of RAM and are loaded to the gills with heavy biz software such as multiple instances of SQL (incl. "enterprise") and IIS web servers (set to 'LocalHost') which I mention as it does affect at least vCore in overclocking.
> 
> While I used to do a lot of overclocking 'back in the day', I had not done serious OC'ing for about seven or eight years - my, how things have changed - PLL ?  All of the 'non-K' 3770 overclock quite nicely to at least 4.5 Ghz, and two to max multiplier x BCLK up to 107, so 4.6 Ghz (all with after market cooling).
> 
> That kind of whetted my appetite 'for more'...1st came a decent video card (GTX 670), then a second one for SLI (next to me on my desk is lying the 3rd one....)
> 
> Then I picked up a 3770K ...which turned out to be from the Costa Rica 3229C series...I ran and posted some benches and had replies from folks who recommended the 'delidding thread'...the chip validated well over 5.3 Ghz with the lid on and with fairly moderate vCore for that speed (with more to come)
> 
> 
> 
> When I posted these screens for 100% load at 4.8, 4.9 and 5.0 Ghz, it meant
> 
> a.) DELID as this is a good chip that runs very fast on low vCore; just needs better temps at 5 Ghz daily
> b.) DON'T DELID as this is a good chip hat runs very fast on low vCore - why take the risk to ruin it ?
> c.) Some PM offers to purchase the chip from me
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The above, PLUS
> 
> 
> 
> PLUS...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...resulted in...
> 
> 
> 
> ...and...
> 
> 
> 
> The delidding itself will be a 3-part affair, with two of the three parts completed so far.
> 
> The first step involved applying new TIM to the 3 video cards 'as a dry run', though I skipped CL (the intended TIM) as there were some aluminium bits mixed in with copper parts on the cooler that would have come in contact with the CL (which doesn't play nice with aluminium).
> 
> Then I took the CPU out and placed the Hardware-store type blade on one corner...which was followed by a BIG realization: It was not going to work - using a magnifying glass, I confirmed that the factory-mounted IHS 'was crooked' - on one whole side, you could not even see the black silicon-type glue as the metal of the IHS was basically sitting on the PCB...on the other side, there was a lot of room - more than I have seen in pics by others in this thread.
> 
> As I at that time only had the hardware-store 'bigger' blade, I put it all together again...and applied some Coollaboratory Ultra to the IHS (replacing what was a correctly applied Arctic MX4 TIM). Here are some direct comparisons of these two TIMS:
> 
> 
> 
> We then drove up to Whistler (long weekend in Canada), but I returned early on my own to get to the bottom of this ! Fellow OCers and especially Delidders' surely know how it is like !
> 
> The problem was that I was so tired yet full of hi-po espresso when I had another go at the CPU, this time starting with the crooked side that showed a lot of space and black glue.
> 
> Next - the actual delid described with too many words:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Still, I in the meantime had picked up the thinner 'Wilkinson' blade and I used that first...on the side with a lot of space, this was fairly easy though being really tired and my eyes wanting to shut did not help... yet the blade slid in effortlessly around 65% of the circumference - until I got to the spot where the IHS was virtually sitting on the pcb...working even the thin blade in there meant riding a bit on the pcb so I pushed 'up' as hard as I could - and actually ended up cutting into and notching the IHS (think of it as extra venting now).
> 
> Finally, I pulled out the bigger blade again and placed it where there was the most black glue on the pcb on the free side - then twisted it. The IHS flew off and the blade went into not one but two fingers...
> 
> I could see that on the 'problem corner', there was NO black glue left on the pcb to scrape off, and there were some drag marks of the blade on the pcb, but they had not gone 'through the top green layer' just marked it. I claim divine intervention because I was half asleep when I did that, so it could not have been me
> 
> Of more concern though were various copper like spots on other parts of the pcb - did I scrape right through there with the bigger blade ? Nope, they turned out to be pieces of copper from when I forced the blade into the IHS and notched it. Close call
> 
> After cleaning up the IHS and pcb, it was time to apply some CL-U, and I think I got just the right amount on it.
> 
> I placed the CPU carefully into its socket and then very gingerly put the IHS on top - set back a bit to account for the 'forward-slide' when closing the metal clamp even with my finger pushing onto the IHS center top, though I know that I am about 1.5mm too far back still - don't think that it will matter much as the die is not touching any sides and the IHS is otherwise seated firmly on the die with the correct amount of CL.
> 
> But there was another problem - or two. For now, I have been using a closed loop Thermaltake 2 Extreme water cooler (the one with the Asetek block / pump and the 240 mm rad).
> 
> This is a really good solution, other than its mobo back 'plate (rubbery plastic') and retainer 'soft metal nuts' are very flimsy...this set-up has wandered across three different motherboard types, and on two of those it has been 'on and off' at least 5 times.
> 
> By now, some of the spacer rubber pieces are only half the depth they used to be, and on one corner, one of the retainer nuts has worked itself deep into the rubber / plastic backing plate - meaning that even on full lock it will still have a bit of play and thus not be perfectly seating the water block on the IHS.
> 
> Furthermore, one of the bandages had come off and I was literally bleeding onto the IHS / mobo - time to act fast and rational...
> 
> Given the upcoming 'next step' per below which includes a new Koolance block / custom loop in just a few days, I decided NOT to use CL P on the IHS for just a few days as I had read that it can be a bit hard to get off. Further, I knew that the current water block fit would be marginal at best, so I plastered far more MX4 on it than I normally would, in part to make up for the bit of play at one corner, and knowing that it just had to last a week, because:
> 
> 
> 
> ...paraphrased per "Jaws" *We gonna need a bigger boat*
> 
> 
> 
> ...it was difficult enough to wedge an eATX Max V Extreme into the Antec 302 case, complete with two video cards, but there is no way a 3rd will fit plus a custom cooling loop
> 
> ...so here is the 'bigger boat' (still in dry dock, also will be the home of the IvyB-E in the fall with dual GTX Titans)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Early / Temporary Results"
> 
> Per above qualifiers (CL U on die, but too much MX 4 on ill-fitting water block), have a look-see at these early results for 5, 5.1 and 5.2 GHz 'delidded'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope the new loop with 360 double-thick rad w/5 120mm fans, IHS to Koolance 370 SI CPU block with CL Pro in between will improve these already impressive temp gains per delid and partial CL
> 
> I always could run 5 Ghz 24/7 with for that speed 'modest' vCore, but temps were a bit of an issue - not anymore, even before the 'big' cooling upgrade. Per above, even 5.2 Ghz is very stable at benching.
> 
> *Safe vCore - ?*
> 
> My experience with max vCore is : Not to post it as that topic has already seen some 'heated' discussions in this thread (isn't that right, VonDutch  )
> 
> That said, I tend to use what I consider an excellent overclocking tool in addition tot he posted OC for IvyBridge Bios settings on this site - said tool is Intel's own 'Extreme Tuning Utility'. While it has a nice option to rise vCore all the way to kingdom-come, it won't actually apply any more than 1.525v (+ - a small variance, depending on PLL).
> 
> When it gets right down to it, I take Intel's wisdom to heart, as much as I have other tools that can raise vCore all the way to 2vs. I might validate beyond the 5.32 Ghz I already did way back at slightly more vCore, but in the end, unless I go to LN2 later with this chip and board once IvyBridge-E has arrived. I take Intel's wisdom seriously.
> 
> I close with some 5 GHz 3D benchmarks...including some 'extreme' settings...even with the less than perfect temp cooling solution, no core ever went past 72 C on the most intensive CPU tests


You probably took a really long time posting this so good job on the delid. But I just wanted to tell you, that took me forever to scroll down.


----------



## Jacer200

I just got done with a successful delidding of my i7-3770K







I don't have all the info needed to apply for the club because I just got done a little bit ago. But this weekend I will run IBT and report back on temps. I do have some photos to share. I currently have my 3770K at 4.6GHz @1.28v PLL 1.800 and I am right in the middle of checking stability but I think this is the sweet spot I just need to run Prime and IBT this weekend.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!










I think I must have not seated the die heatsink correctly because my temps are a little high. I used PK-3 on the die and the heatsink. On Prime95 my max temps were 77c, 81c, 81c, 79c with an ambient of 24c. I ran it for 45min or so just to check temps. For a comparison I was doing a 12hr stability check last night @4.6GHZ 1.24v and got similar temps.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







That was just for a temp comparison. It was a fail. I had 3 whea warnings. So I just ordered some Coollaboratory liquid ultra. So hopefully I will report back next week with a stable OC and cool temps


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> You probably took a really long time posting this so good job on the delid. But I just wanted to tell you, that took me forever to scroll down


...yes, so now you folks KNOW how my fingers feel after cutting them per delid







JUSTICE







.but I shortened it via more 'spoilers' / edits


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Joa - I'm going to read through all of that tomorrow! 4am here - been PC ablitarating all day.
That darn arctic pro freezer cooler gave me so many cuts LOL
Was a real PAIN getting that one in.

@swag - man I feel like a baws honestly - went through quite a lot today, trial and errors, test etc
long story short:
It's the board, not the cpu or anything else (ie pressure, mount, pins).
I can't for the life of me think what's wrong with the board - physically it looks all good - grounded too.

I guess it is relating to BIOS chip and/or fried DIMM slots.
Tomorrow I'm calling Scan to RMA it and my Antec 920.

My mum's PC on the other hand - is so cute, but so powerful at the same time








Will post pics on my build log thread later, after I've finished the cable management (tomorrow) - then I'll be using her PC (ie 8gb ram) until I get my Z77 saber back - I could use my i7 + 8GB EXTRA ram, but I want to test is as if she was going to use it.

EDIT:
Fun fact for this morning (5am I'm going to bed lol)

*Both my i3 and i7 are MALAY:*






*Here's how CLU looks like, once the IHS is removed:*






*Here's a look at my de-lidded i7 (right) and my stock i3 (left):*


----------



## FtW 420

Joa3d43, a long read but a good read. Stressing at 5.2Ghz with room for more is fantastic, & not even fully set up yet!

Congrats!


----------



## Valgaur

Well.... Sadly I cant Quote everything as the servers don't like me right now.

Anyways. Great job on the Delid Joa3d43! Gimme that info and I'll add ya!







Glad your alive as well.









TD I would prefer to have everything but the CPUZ I suppose, Also don't need the Mhz gained either. Again congrats!

Mr. Fear the beard man! Congrats as well! Waiting to see those great temps and you around here more often!

uuuuuum running out of memory for tryign to remember who I all quoted.. there was a lot really.....


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well.... Sadly I cant Quote everything as the servers don't like me right now.
> 
> Anyways. Great job on the Delid Joa3d43! Gimme that info and I'll add ya!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glad your alive as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TD I would prefer to have everything but the CPUZ I suppose, Also don't need the Mhz gained either. Again congrats!
> 
> Mr. Fear the beard man! Congrats as well! Waiting to see those great temps and you around here more often!
> 
> uuuuuum running out of memory for tryign to remember who I all quoted.. there was a lot really.....


Need a memory upgrade more than the PC does...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Need a memory upgrade more than the PC does...


yeah no kidding lol.


----------



## Belial

joa, repd, awesome post.

I have a hard time believing you are 100% stable at said frequency and voltages though. Please run a 24 hour prime95 custom blend with workers set to priority 10 and 90% ram!

I stopped using cinebench likes years ago when it was would pass overclocks that were far from stable (like fail in chrome, or instantly in p95). It gave me a terribly inaccurate portrayal of what my cpu was capable of, in terms of a quick test to feel out the chip. Now the only stress testing program I use is prime95 (and hyperpi for quick ram clocks).

I don't think any other stress test can reveal faults as quickly as prime95 can. The issue is that most programs won't find any fault, even 50 passes ibt, occt, etcetera, but 24 hours of prime95 finds them always. I mean if you set priority to 10 and max ram, prime95 will find instability just as quick as any other program.


----------



## Swag

Just wondering, anyone here ever get too lazy to type on the keyboard and just use the mouse to use the on-screen keyboard? This is really unproductive but I don't want to use the keyboard right now.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Joa3d43, a long read but a good read. Stressing at 5.2Ghz with room for more is fantastic, & not even fully set up yet!
> 
> Congrats!


...yeah - and thanks for the good tips prior to 'doing the deed'.

I'll take it as far on the new cooling / Tri SLI as I can within 1.525v core limit (for now) - but even with an incomplete TIM job and mis-aligned cooling block (just for a few more days) it is already more than exceeding my expectations - love doing those deep 3D Vantage 'extreme' runs and beating up some of the 6c/12t 3930s and 3960s


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well.... Sadly I cant Quote everything as the servers don't like me right now.
> 
> Anyways. Great job on the Delid Joa3d43! Gimme that info and I'll add ya!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glad your alive as well.


...thanks and again, my appreciation for a great thread you started - without the info here, I would have probably screwed it up... front info and sig can wait until I finish the cooling fix and case modding (bought a 114mm hole saw just to cut into a new CM Storm Stryker case







as I am reversing the air flow - back to front)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...thanks and again, my appreciation for a great thread you started - without the info here, I would have probably screwed it up... front info and sig can wait until I finish the cooling fix and case modding (bought a 114mm hole saw just to cut into a new CM Storm Stryker case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as I am reversing the air flow - back to front)


No problem. Very glad you and everyone here enjoys this place







. Cant wait to see that new air flow, I've seen it done and am interested in it somewhat for a future summer build for parents. (building them one redoing mine a bit and benching gear everywhere, all the 775 and gpu's all over the place) Just like you FtW lol









I'll be waiting for your submissions







and more 3dmark stuff as well, jelly of your Sli man.... not fair


----------



## solar0987

This is what I average as far as high temps go, my chip is more voltage locked as in needs aloooot 4.7 is 4.94-5.05v for prime stable temps at 78
I run 24-7 at 4.6 1.414-1.424v temps stay in the 60 highest temp yet.

Should i delid? Will it help me oc more? I was thinking it wouldn't.I really wanted 5ghz but it is not possible.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *solar0987*
> 
> This is what I average as far as high temps go, my chip is more voltage locked as in needs aloooot 4.7 is 4.94-5.05v for prime stable temps at 78
> I run 24-7 at 4.6 1.414-1.424v temps stay in the 60 highest temp yet.
> 
> Should i delid? Will it help me oc more? I was thinking it wouldn't.I really wanted 5ghz but it is not possible.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


looks to me you cant oc much more then you have now,
if you need 1.414-1.424V vcore for 4.6ghz..
in your case the temps are still ok, but your vcore limits you to oc much further,
youre sure you cant get the vcore down more at 4.6ghz?


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...just delidded myself a few days back...keep in mind that you changed the 'full package depth' re CPU cooler pressure on the CPU and in turn on the pins...some folks have had issues with that, ie regarding IMC and other memory stick items...carefully readjusting the CPU cooler pressure might help


Looks like its ok now, thx for advice,if its happen again, i will see presaure.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Hey Dutch did I see on anandtech the other day a guy tell you that u have "phantom instability"? Any idea what the proper amount of gigaflops we should be getting is at. 4.9 or 5ghz with a 3570k and 1600mhz ram? Assuming I am not getting invisible calc corrections? Was that guy accurate or full of it?


yea, i never heard of the term "phantom instability" before, so i had to ask whats up with that ..lol
i bet not to many others here did too









i showed them martinhal's graph, where you can see the gflops should go up liniair,


or like IDC showed with his graph

"You should get a dead-linear curve between clockspeed and Gflops.
Running problem size 43122 with DDR3-1866 ram, Sandy Bridge will give you 28.28 GFlops/GHz and Ivy Bridge will give you 28.42 GFlops/GHz."

another member over there tried, and got this,

"Going by IDC's 28.42 * GHz (4.5) = 127.89... seems about right, I don't think I've ever hit ~128 at 4.5GHz though, 127 yeah, so it's close enough."

if i look at martinhal's graph, the gflops should go up by about 2 per 100mhz,
i think thats about right, im not sure the liniair math will stay the same at very high oc's tho,
if it was correct, a 3770K at 5.0ghz should have about 140 gflops, thats why i asked you guys
about the gflops you have at that speed, because were delidded, its easier to run it ..lol

i see some differences in gflops we have, but most of the time its settings, and ram used that makes the difference,
theres no real standard for gflops, except if its very low, or anything else thats off compared to others,
and most of the time very low gflops has to do with , not having SP1 installed, for the avx instructions etc..

if there is/was a phantom instability then your gflops would get lower with every 100mhz you up your oc,
it _could_ mean theres that phantom instability as far as i understand it now..
that guy claimed he had about 120 gflops at 4.4ghz with a sandy bridge,
so if he would run it at 5.0ghz his gflops should be about 130-135,
if i use my 2 gflops per 100mhz..

your 3570K should have more gflops then a 3770K of course,
if i disable my HT my gflops would be higher,

4.5ghz HT on, 101 gflops


4.5ghz HT off, 119 gflops


so for me 4.5ghz 101 gflops with HT on,
i would end up with about 110 gflops at 5.0ghz,

i dont think i have that phantom instability like the guy said,
my gflops are going up liniair like IDC tried to explain too, im not to worried about it anyways,
learned long time ago in this thread gflops arent very very important, depends on to many factors
that can make differences between them, like i said , only if its of big time compared to others,
you might want to look at it some more..


----------



## solar0987

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> looks to me you cant oc much more then you have now,
> if you need 1.414-1.424V vcore for 4.6ghz..
> in your case the temps are still ok, but your vcore limits you to oc much further,
> youre sure you cant get the vcore down more at 4.6ghz?


Nope it gets failed worker in prime


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *solar0987*
> 
> Nope it gets failed worker in prime


most of us delid because they run into temp problems,
and are limited that way to oc higher, yours seems to be the
other way around, your temps are still good, but you run into vcore limit
before to high temps..
i prolly wouldnt delid it, and run 4.5-4.6ghz daily oc


----------



## sena

Guys, how safe is to keep CPU at 1.35V everyday, hottest core in prime95 is 80C, avarage is 70-75C?

Thx.

I also noticed i can now run 4.8 GHz, before that was impossible.


----------



## King4x4

Had to read over 200 posts... This club is going fast!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Guys, how safe is to keep CPU at 1.35V everyday, hottest core in prime95 is 80C, avarage is 70-75C?
> 
> Thx.


ive ran 1.38v volts for about a month now and had no problems so far, if u can keep temps low then your good.. i see ppl here running 1.35 to 1.52v.
heres my 12 hr prime run but had to up up voltage a tad becasue i had a couple whe errors. now im @1.385v and no more whea errors


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Guys, how safe is to keep CPU at 1.35V everyday, hottest core in prime95 is 80C, avarage is 70-75C?
> 
> Thx.
> 
> I also noticed i can now run 4.8 GHz, before that was impossible.


yea, like lilchronic said, should be no problem, i run 4.8ghz at 1.420V vcore 24/7,
i think the 1.3-1.45V vcore range can be _considered_ safe..

24H prime at 4.8ghz, 1.420V vcore set in bios..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Had to read over 200 posts... This club is going fast!


lol yea, somedays i have to read like 10 pages in the morning..


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive ran 1.38v volts for about a month now and had no problems so far, if u can keep temps low then your good.. i see ppl here running 1.35 to 1.52v.
> heres my 12 hr prime run but had to up up voltage a tad becasue i had a couple whe errors. now im @1.385v and no more whea errors


Thx man, i will test in weekend and i will try to find some sweet spot.

I need every available MHz from cpu, HD 7950 CFX is tooo fast.









OCN name: Sena
CPU: Intel i5 3570K
on die-TIM: Collaboratoy Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Gelid-GC extreme
Mhz gained: 300 MHz so far
OC after delid: 4800 MHz
Temp drops: 20C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2692045


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Guys, how safe is to keep CPU at 1.35V everyday, hottest core in prime95 is 80C, avarage is 70-75C?
> 
> Thx.
> 
> I also noticed i can now run 4.8 GHz, before that was impossible.


congrats on the '4.8' - I ran that for a long time and it is nice, especially when paired with a decent vid GPU. As to 'max safe voltage', that is a bit of a conundrum in this and other threads. Personally, I have NO problem running 1.35v all day, every day. Then again, I use 'speed step' and sleep mode when required - are those still enabled ?

Finally, Intel's excellent 'Extreme Tuning Utility' (for OC) does not let you go beyond 1.525v (+ - a bit, depending on PLL) on 3770 chips. If you are looking for an outside max, ie for validation though other programs let you go higher. I just figure Intel's own utility is probably not a bad guide


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> congrats on the '4.8' - I ran that for a long time and it is nice, especially when paired with a decent vid GPU. As to 'max safe voltage', that is a bit of a conundrum in this and other threads. Personally, I have NO problem running 1.35v all day, every day. Then again, I use 'speed step' and sleep mode when required - are those still enabled ?
> 
> Finally, Intel's excellent 'Extreme Tuning Utility' (for OC) does not let you go beyond 1.525v (+ - a bit, depending on PLL) on 3770 chips. If you are looking for an outside max, ie for validation though other programs let you go higher. I just figure Intel's own utility is probably not a bad guide


Thx man, i am now at 4.8 with about 1.410V in load, i will test more to see about stability, i think i can lower temps more, because i am only using one 140mm fan on my NH-D14.

Yup 4.8 GHz is nice number, its like 5.0 GHz SB(i did comparison with my friend who owns 2500k).


----------



## $ilent

Hey guys does anyone know how we'll the gigabyte z77x ud3h reports vcore? I'm hoping it doesn't auto overvolt or under volt the CPU or what's reported in CPUz.


----------



## chronicfx

Probably dead on


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Hey guys does anyone know how we'll the gigabyte z77x ud3h reports vcore? I'm hoping it doesn't auto overvolt or under volt the CPU or what's reported in CPUz.


Perfect.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

No problems here with my mATX Gigabyte board


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, i never heard of the term "phantom instability" before, so i had to ask whats up with that ..lol
> i bet not to many others here did too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i showed them martinhal's graph, where you can see the gflops should go up liniair,
> 
> 
> or like IDC showed with his graph
> 
> "You should get a dead-linear curve between clockspeed and Gflops.
> Running problem size 43122 with DDR3-1866 ram, Sandy Bridge will give you 28.28 GFlops/GHz and Ivy Bridge will give you 28.42 GFlops/GHz."
> 
> another member over there tried, and got this,
> 
> "Going by IDC's 28.42 * GHz (4.5) = 127.89... seems about right, I don't think I've ever hit ~128 at 4.5GHz though, 127 yeah, so it's close enough."
> 
> if i look at martinhal's graph, the gflops should go up by about 2 per 100mhz,
> i think thats about right, im not sure the liniair math will stay the same at very high oc's tho,
> if it was correct, a 3770K at 5.0ghz should have about 140 gflops, thats why i asked you guys
> about the gflops you have at that speed, because were delidded, its easier to run it ..lol
> 
> i see some differences in gflops we have, but most of the time its settings, and ram used that makes the difference,
> theres no real standard for gflops, except if its very low, or anything else thats off compared to others,
> and most of the time very low gflops has to do with , not having SP1 installed, for the avx instructions etc..
> 
> if there is/was a phantom instability then your gflops would get lower with every 100mhz you up your oc,
> it _could_ mean theres that phantom instability as far as i understand it now..
> that guy claimed he had about 120 gflops at 4.4ghz with a sandy bridge,
> so if he would run it at 5.0ghz his gflops should be about 130-135,
> if i use my 2 gflops per 100mhz..
> 
> your 3570K should have more gflops then a 3770K of course,
> if i disable my HT my gflops would be higher,
> 
> 4.5ghz HT on, 101 gflops
> 
> 
> 4.5ghz HT off, 119 gflops
> 
> 
> so for me 4.5ghz 101 gflops with HT on,
> i would end up with about 110 gflops at 5.0ghz,
> 
> i dont think i have that phantom instability like the guy said,
> my gflops are going up liniair like IDC tried to explain too, im not to worried about it anyways,
> learned long time ago in this thread gflops arent very very important, depends on to many factors
> that can make differences between them, like i said , only if its of big time compared to others,
> you might want to look at it some more..


I will check my gflops and get back to you. Keep in mind I run generic 1600mhz ram though so I may be a touch low. Not sure how much affect it has but I do know all you guys are heavily overclocked in that dept. too


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Perfect.


Can you elaborate please?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Can you elaborate please?


Gigabyte boards are a notch above everybody else from reporting volts to vrms this is why there not so flashy boards out sell everybody else in the world.


----------



## $ilent

Cool so no need to buy a DMM for my new giga board?


----------



## chronicfx

Hi Von dutch

Here is Gflops at 4.9



Here is gflops at 5.0



The setting at 4.9 is 24 hour prime stable and the the setting at 5.0 is 13 hours tested stable. But I am showing lower gflops than you, maybe it is my ram?


----------



## martinhal

Been a busy day today.

@ Joa3d43 - Nice post , congrats on the delid. What where you using to load the cpu on your 5.1 and 5.2 pics ?


----------



## justanoldman

I will definitely agree with comments about getting your system Prim95 for 24 hours stable while using 90%+ ram (I realize others think that is overkill), but I don't see any point in running it with priority 10. All that does is stop most of your temp monitoring software from updating, as well as the event viewer. In my tests so far, any configuration that passed Prime95 for extended time periods on priority 1 passed it on priority 10 as well.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Not at all, overkill is 3hrs of folding lol.
By that I mean not the fact you're folding. Just the fact that that's more stressful than anything I've ever ran


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Thx man, i will test in weekend and i will try to find some sweet spot.
> 
> I need every available MHz from cpu, HD 7950 CFX is tooo fast.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Sena
> CPU: Intel i5 3570K
> on die-TIM: Collaboratoy Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Gelid-GC extreme
> Mhz gained: 300 MHz so far
> OC after delid: 4800 MHz
> Temp drops: 20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2692045


Ill add you after I get out of class, everyone applies for membership when im not at my computer








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Not at all, overkill is 3hrs of folding lol.
> By that I mean not the fact you're folding. Just the fact that that's more stressful than anything I've ever ran


Agreed. Id rather be 2 weeks 24/7 folding stable that prime stable. Nall while playing music games and such at the same time.


----------



## I_shot

stock cooler 4.5 ghz stable 1.2V 11.5 hours prime


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Cool so no need to buy a DMM for my new giga board?


I would trust it to report pretty close to actual. I still own asrock but I have a dmm for that lol.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Could someone tell me if I should apply more CLU or not and/or remove it completely and start from scratch on my i7?
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/11570#post_19278698


----------



## Valgaur

It looks like you have the right amount TD. I wouldn't add anymore or take any away.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It looks like you have the right amount TD. I wouldn't add anymore or take any away.


even though there seems a little bit missing in he middle?
Like two dots type.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> even though there seems a little bit missing in he middle?
> Like two dots type.


I would take the brush you already used and smooth out both surfaces so they seem even. I had better luck adding a little more, but it will depend on the shape of your IHS.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> even though there seems a little bit missing in he middle?
> Like two dots type.


If you feel like some is missing try to spread some to that spot. Also try to do the underside of the ihs as well in the stained part from the intel paste.


----------



## $ilent

I second spreading out a die size rectangle on the underside of the IHS too, I got miles better temps doing this as apposed to just using lp on the die.


----------



## martinhal

I third that . Go ahead and do it. If you are on OCN and delided "leave well alone " does not apply to you. Do it we know you want too. Temps should come down.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

But I've got CLU on the backside of the IHS already. Do you mean completely covering the back of the IHS?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> But I've got CLU on the backside of the IHS already. Do you mean completely covering the back of the IHS?


No just the area the die will touch . Perhaps a bit bigger just in case the IHS moves during installation.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> No just the area the die will touch . Perhaps a bit bigger just in case the IHS moves during installation.


Cool beans - cheers for the input guys +rep to all


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just wondering, anyone here ever get too lazy to type on the keyboard and just use the mouse to use the on-screen keyboard? This is really unproductive but I don't want to use the keyboard right now.


lol you lazy bum xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Hey guys does anyone know how we'll the gigabyte z77x ud3h reports vcore? I'm hoping it doesn't auto overvolt or under volt the CPU or what's reported in CPUz.


Spot on...the best vrm in the business currently. Wish their bioses were better though :/
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Cool so no need to buy a DMM for my new giga board?


I'd buy one, it's useful, in general.


----------



## sena

Guys one my core is abou 10C hotter then cooldest, should i try to re-apply CLLP?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Guys one my core is abou 10C hotter then cooldest, should i try to re-apply CLLP?


That could be down to the paste ON THE IHS rather than on the die.
First try checking that and pressure of your cooler on the IHS - usually I found that if the cooler isn't evenly put on and/or the paste isn't done evenly, you'll get some cores hotter than others.


----------



## justanoldman

Switch from AS5 to Ultra on top of the IHS, and it dropped me about 5c as expected. Even with my slow-fanned cooler that really doesn't like my IHS for some reason, I am hitting a max core temp of 73c while stress testing 5.0 with 1.41v in a 72F (22.2c) room.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Guys one my core is abou 10C hotter then cooldest, should i try to re-apply CLLP?


Like TD said, could be a problem with your cooler and IHS. Try remounting the cooler a few times since that is not hard and see if it helps. If not you can check the die also. Showing us pics of the TIM on all surfaces when you take them off might help us figure out what is wrong.

For example my temps right now for Prime95 are 69, 73, 71, 69. So 4 or 5c is not a big deal, but in my opinion 10c between cores tells me something is not right.


----------



## sena

Hmm, i think i should check then.

My first three cores are about same 3-4C differnce, only fourth core is always about 10C coolder.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Hmm, i think i should check then.
> 
> My first three cores are about same 3-4C differnce, only fourth core is always about 10C coolder.


COLDER?
Interesting...That core is chillin' literally haha


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> COLDER?
> Interesting...That core is chillin' literally haha


Yup, strange, hahahha, i had same thing with my old i7 970, one core was always way cooler.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Yup, strange, hahahha, i had same thing with my old i7 970, one core was always way cooler.


Well in that case, leave it








The colder the better - just not sub "-160c"


----------



## $ilent

Folks what would you say is a feasible vcore limit? Im stable at 5gig with under 1.4v, I wouldnt mind shooting for 5.2ghz but I reckon its gonna take upwards of 1.5v.

Im thinking of getting the swiftech h220 when its out too


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Folks what would you say is a feasible vcore limit? Im stable at 5gig with under 1.4v, I wouldnt mind shooting for 5.2ghz but I reckon its gonna take upwards of 1.5v.
> 
> Im thinking of getting the swiftech h220 when its out too


DO you really need that extra 0.2?
That's a brilliant GHZ for that voltage.


----------



## ivanlabrie

As much as you feel comfortable with...if temps are good it should be relatively safe unless you go bananas and hit 1.6v+ on ambient temps. (I wouldn't go over 1.52v for 24/7...in fact I'd run stock for 24/7 and keep the high vcore and clocks for benching only)


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Folks what would you say is a feasible vcore limit? Im stable at 5gig with under 1.4v, I wouldnt mind shooting for 5.2ghz but I reckon its gonna take upwards of 1.5v.
> 
> Im thinking of getting the swiftech h220 when its out too


H220: yes.
vCore: depends on where you hit the wall. I know I need a bigger than usually jump as soon as I go over 5.0, so you have to see if that slight bump up to 5.2 is really worth it. You won't know what vCore you need until you try to stabilize it.


----------



## nyk20z3

Any 3rd party company's who offer this service ?

I am not a crazy over clocker but i would like to be able to push my 3770K to the max when i feel fit.

I have no desire to do this myself i would would rather leave it to a pro.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyk20z3*
> 
> Any 3rd party company's who offer this service ?
> 
> I am not a crazy over clocker but i would like to be able to push my 3770K to the max when i feel fit.
> 
> I have no desire to do this myself i would would rather leave it to a pro.


What are the voltage requirements for your chip? That has a lot do with whether it is wroth delidding.


----------



## $ilent

I do folding, so technically yes the extra .2ghz would be valuable, but again like others said the vcore difference seems to be alot over 5gig


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Folks what would you say is a feasible vcore limit? Im stable at 5gig with under 1.4v, I wouldnt mind shooting for 5.2ghz but I reckon its gonna take upwards of 1.5v.
> 
> Im thinking of getting the swiftech h220 when its out too


1.5v is fine.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyk20z3*
> 
> Any 3rd party company's who offer this service ?
> 
> I am not a crazy over clocker but i would like to be able to push my 3770K to the max when i feel fit.
> 
> I have no desire to do this myself i would would rather leave it to a pro.


i will do it for $229 lol... I am near microcenter. But if I fail I am just sending you back a non delidded new chip.


----------



## nyk20z3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What are the voltage requirements for your chip? That has a lot do with whether it is wroth delidding.


I will be honest ive been building and fixing comps for years but i never got deep in to overclocking so i just use pre set values or use another persons config.

My current board a Intel DZ77GA-70K feeds my 3770K almost 1.5V(A pre set OC) at 4.5GHz which from what i have seen is not safe over time and is way to much for that kind of OC.

I am custom water cooled so temps where never an issue i just would like to have max headroom when i do decide to heavily overclock.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyk20z3*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What are the voltage requirements for your chip? That has a lot do with whether it is wroth delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> I will be honest ive been building and fixing comps for years but i never got deep in to overclocking so i just use pre set values or use another persons config.
> 
> My current board a Intel DZ77GA-70K feeds my 3770K almost 1.5V(A pre set OC) at 4.5GHz which from what i have seen is not safe over time and is way to much for that kind of OC.
> 
> I am custom water cooled so temps where never an issue i just would like to have max headroom when i do decide to heavily overclock.
Click to expand...

Wow yeah there's NO way you should require 1.5v for 4.5 unless your chip blows. Drop the voltage down one notch at a time, test 20 minutes with IBT. See how long you can go until it freezes crashes

Do you have 2x 360mm rads for your CPU? that's freaking awesome


----------



## nyk20z3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> i will do it for $229 lol... I am near microcenter. But if I fail I am just sending you back a non delidded new chip.


LOL i am near MC 2 so maybe i should buy a spare chip and try it myself.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Wow yeah there's NO way you should require 1.5v for 4.5 unless your chip blows. Drop the voltage down one notch at a time, test 20 minutes with IBT. See how long you can go until it freezes crashes
> 
> Do you have 2x 360mm rads for your CPU? that's freaking awesome


TY sir i will make some adjustments over the weekend.

No i had 2 360's cooling a 3770K and 2 GTX 670 FTW's.

I removed 1 of the 360's because i did not want it mounted externally no more so now i am running a 360/120 rad until the 900D drops then i can run dual 480 rads.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Wow yeah there's NO way you should require 1.5v for 4.5 unless your chip blows. Drop the voltage down one notch at a time, test 20 minutes with IBT. See how long you can go until it freezes crashes
> 
> Do you have 2x 360mm rads for your CPU? that's freaking awesome


Actually try 10 notches at a time. Or even just set it to 1.3v manual and see if u need less or more .if u do truly need 1.5v for 4.5ghz u should def buy a new chip. And those two 360's aren't getting good use unless u delid.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Wow yeah there's NO way you should require 1.5v for 4.5 unless your chip blows. Drop the voltage down one notch at a time, test 20 minutes with IBT. See how long you can go until it freezes crashes
> 
> Do you have 2x 360mm rads for your CPU? that's freaking awesome
> 
> 
> 
> Actually try 10 notches at a time. Or even just set it to 1.3v manual and see if u need less or more .if u do truly need 1.5v for 4.5ghz u should def buy a new chip. And those two 360's aren't getting good use unless u delid.
Click to expand...

You know where I was getting. If he's inexperienced things will randomly crash and BSOD and scare him


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> I do folding, so technically yes the extra .2ghz would be valuable, but again like others said the vcore difference seems to be alot over 5gig


i need 1.52v-1.55v for 5.2ghz and thats a lil to much vcore for me so i just stay at 5ghz. i would run 5.1 but @1.46v but i dont like odd numers lol


----------



## justanoldman

Changed my rig name in honor of our club:


----------



## nyk20z3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> You know where I was getting. If he's inexperienced things will randomly crash and BSOD and scare him


It wont scare me lol i am prepared to fail a decent amount before everything is stabilized and i appreciate the insight guys.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyk20z3*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> You know where I was getting. If he's inexperienced things will randomly crash and BSOD and scare him
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It wont scare me lol i am prepared to fail a decent amount before everything is stabilized and i appreciate the insight guys.
Click to expand...

Awesome! Yeah then run that mofo hard


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyk20z3*
> 
> I will be honest ive been building and fixing comps for years but i never got deep in to overclocking so i just use pre set values or use another persons config.
> 
> My current board a Intel DZ77GA-70K feeds my 3770K almost 1.5V(A pre set OC) at 4.5GHz which from what i have seen is not safe over time and is way to much for that kind of OC.
> 
> I am custom water cooled so temps where never an issue i just would like to have max headroom when i do decide to heavily overclock.


Intel boards are kinda finnicky with oc settings...Try a manual oc (I believe those only have offset, but I'm not sure) and set the vcore lower, around 1.25v under load should be a good start.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Changed my rig name in honor of our club:


epic!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Changed my rig name in honor of our club:


me to.


----------



## DiamondCut

Finally got windows 7 installed. Idle temps are 14 22 17 29. I think the settings aren't running as low as they should on idle. The bus seems to be tweaked as its reporting 100.52 in CPU Z. GPU temp is idle 22c.

Im still in the process of updating all the BIOS and drivers, once its all up to date I will start benching and overclocking. Ill probably have some good results by the end of the day. Wish me luck!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Hey guys does anyone know how we'll the gigabyte z77x ud3h reports vcore? I'm hoping it doesn't auto overvolt or under volt the CPU or what's reported in CPUz.


The z77 ud3h is pretty close from software to actual, where cpu-z & the GB software show 1.344V under load the DMM shows 1.337V - 1.342V.


----------



## stickg1

Someone recommend me a good, but reasonably priced socket 775 board for overclocking? This Biostar clunker I got is killing me. I can't adjust the memory multiplier at all. Furthermore my 800MHz RAM is stuck at 533MHz!!! AHHHHHGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH


----------



## Djghost454

So... Just scratched the PCB on my 3770k trying to delid it...








Don't have the money to replace it... This sucks...


----------



## nyk20z3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> So... Just scratched the PCB on my 3770k trying to delid it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't have the money to replace it... This sucks...


sry to hear that.

There has to be a more error free way of doing it.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyk20z3*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> So... Just scratched the PCB on my 3770k trying to delid it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't have the money to replace it... This sucks...
> 
> 
> 
> sry to hear that.
> 
> There has to be a more error free way of doing it.
Click to expand...

Nope. You just have to be careful.

Also, if the PCB is scratched it might be ok. Don't give up til it wont boot


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> So... Just scratched the PCB on my 3770k trying to delid it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't have the money to replace it... This sucks...


try it man.... as you dont know it's dead or have you tried it? a scratch doesn't mean a dead chip







Always be thinking that. What blade did you do as well?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nyk20z3*
> 
> sry to hear that.
> 
> There has to be a more error free way of doing it.


There sadly isn't we've tried many different variations but the most controllable is the blade method, although dangerous.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> So... Just scratched the PCB on my 3770k trying to delid it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't have the money to replace it... This sucks...


That does suck, tested it yet? Insulate any exposed copper with a dab on nail polish or something to avoid any shorts.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Someone recommend me a good, but reasonably priced socket 775 board for overclocking? This Biostar clunker I got is killing me. I can't adjust the memory multiplier at all. Furthermore my 800MHz RAM is stuck at 533MHz!!! AHHHHHGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH


Hows the water loop coming along?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Someone recommend me a good, but reasonably priced socket 775 board for overclocking? This Biostar clunker I got is killing me. I can't adjust the memory multiplier at all. Furthermore my 800MHz RAM is stuck at 533MHz!!! AHHHHHGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH


You got pm, and you gotta be more careful with what you say about Biostar...their Tpower i45 might not like hearing that


----------



## Djghost454

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Nope. You just have to be careful.
> 
> Also, if the PCB is scratched it might be ok. Don't give up til it wont boot


Don't have a motherboard for it yet, got it for $100 from the RetailEdge program, wasn't going to buy a motherboard till this was completed.

It's a pretty bad cut too, I can clearly see traces, used a standard razor blade and went slow, but no luck.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Hnnnnnnnnng $120 3770k. Kills me everytime


----------



## Djghost454

Yea, still sucks, I don't have the money to replace it and was really looking forward to the upgrade.


----------



## lilchronic

this is the best way to do it right here


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Don't have a motherboard for it yet, got it for $100 from the RetailEdge program, wasn't going to buy a motherboard till this was completed.
> 
> It's a pretty bad cut too, I can clearly see traces, used a standard razor blade and went slow, but no luck.


...as was already started above, unless you cut right through traces...exposed copper on a PCB isn't a good thing, but nail polish or even non-conductive TIM (MX2, MX4) can help as the area where you scratched it is likely close to the IHS...and see if you can ask a friend with a Z77 board to put your CPU in and try to boot it


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hows the water loop coming along?


It's on the back burner. My case is going to be miserable, so I either need a new case, or need to ditch my RAID0 storage drives for a single drive so I can remove enough HDD cages to make room for a radiator at the bottom of the case. So I either need a $100 case, $100 HDD, and then still need to spend another $100 to complete the loop. So it's been put off for a bit until I get some other stuff going.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You got pm, and you gotta be more careful with what you say about Biostar...their Tpower i45 might not like hearing that


It's the specific board I'm talking about. It's miserable. Unless for some reason you can't set memory faster than 533MHz on a Celeron D 356, I can't do it with this board. I'll try out when the Q6600 comes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Don't have a motherboard for it yet, got it for $100 from the RetailEdge program, wasn't going to buy a motherboard till this was completed.
> 
> It's a pretty bad cut too, I can clearly see traces, used a standard razor blade and went slow, but no luck.


Might still work. You need to test it out before you give up on it. Hell I chipped a chunk of glass off my die on one of my i5's and I got all pissed but sure enough it works like a champ.


----------



## I_shot

Guys i've made a TIM Shootout.I'll be waiting









http://www.overclock.net/t/1360505/thermal-paste-shootout-intel-generic-cm-htk-002-gelid-extreme-mx-2-phobya-lm


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> this is the best way to do it right here


^^^ exactly right ^^^ ...just don't use an active credit card you plan to use later that evening in a restaurant


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's on the back burner. My case is going to be miserable, so I either need a new case, or need to ditch my RAID0 storage drives for a single drive so I can remove enough HDD cages to make room for a radiator at the bottom of the case. So I either need a $100 case, $100 HDD, and then still need to spend another $100 to complete the loop. So it's been put off for a bit until I get some other stuff going.
> It's the specific board I'm talking about. It's miserable. Unless for some reason you can't set memory faster than 533MHz on a Celeron D 356, I can't do it with this board. I'll try out when the Q6600 comes.
> Might still work. You need to test it out before you give up on it. Hell I chipped a chunk of glass off my die on one of my i5's and I got all pissed but sure enough it works like a champ.


haha! I'd love to have it








Pm me a price for it, I cover USPS First Class.
I found two other boards for ya...check the marketplace here. A guy is selling a p5q-e and an abit ip35v.


----------



## DiamondCut

Alright guys, I need your help getting to 5ghz...

I already delidded my i5-3570K.
I can only get it to 4.2ghz on 1.36 volts and whenever I try to boot into 4.8 @ 1.4v I blue screen as im booting into windows...
Im not sure if its XMP messing things up or what but It just doesn't want to stablize.... I also noticed once I overclocked it the turbo stops downclocking the chip even though turbo is turned on.... I have an MSI M Power board and there are a ton of new features Im simply not familiar with. Any help or key values I might be missing? let me know what info you might need, I have both of my systems on a KVM switch so its a breeze.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Don't have a motherboard for it yet, got it for $100 from the RetailEdge program, wasn't going to buy a motherboard till this was completed.
> 
> It's a pretty bad cut too, I can clearly see traces, used a standard razor blade and went slow, but no luck.


give us pictures not just explanations, then we can diagnose this problem!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Yea, still sucks, I don't have the money to replace it and was really looking forward to the upgrade.


picture matey!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Alright guys, I need your help getting to 5ghz...
> 
> I already delidded my i5-3570K.
> I can only get it to 4.2ghz on 1.36 volts and whenever I try to boot into 4.8 @ 1.4v I blue screen as im booting into windows...
> Im not sure if its XMP messing things up or what but It just doesn't want to stablize.... I also noticed once I overclocked it the turbo stops downclocking the chip even though turbo is turned on.... I have an MSI M Power board and there are a ton of new features Im simply not familiar with. Any help or key values I might be missing? let me know what info you might need, I have both of my systems on a KVM switch so its a breeze.


type in 1.55 and try 50 multi.. then slowly tweak it back.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's on the back burner. My case is going to be miserable, so I either need a new case, or need to ditch my RAID0 storage drives for a single drive so I can remove enough HDD cages to make room for a radiator at the bottom of the case. So I either need a $100 case, $100 HDD, and then still need to spend another $100 to complete the loop. So it's been put off for a bit until I get some other stuff going.
> It's the specific board I'm talking about. It's miserable. Unless for some reason you can't set memory faster than 533MHz on a Celeron D 356, I can't do it with this board. I'll try out when the Q6600 comes.
> Might still work. You need to test it out before you give up on it. Hell I chipped a chunk of glass off my die on one of my i5's and I got all pissed but sure enough it works like a champ.


Haven't tried that board with a celly D, it's not bad for c2d at least, I'll have to try a celly in it.


Asus Commando is a good one for celery although I was just after the validation & wasn't playing with memory.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Haven't tried that board with a celly D, it's not bad for c2d at least, I'll have to try a celly in it.
> 
> 
> Asus Commando is a good one for celery although I was just after the validation & wasn't playing with memory.


I pm'd him and said the same thing...good p965 board is the best for that. But hard to find and pricey.
Do you know if the p5q-e has more ram dividers? There's one here for $55.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> give us pictures not just explanations, then we can diagnose this problem!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> picture matey!
> type in 1.55 and try 50 multi.. then slowly tweak it back.


Uhggg thats so scary but dude there is an insane amount of settings in the cpu features that i honestly have never heard of like voltage agent and a few others. Ill give that a go and see what i come up with.


----------



## Djghost454

It's only 2 corners, turns out the blade I used was too flimsy and trying to get under the IHS bent it.

My cell phone camera sucks, but I hope this is salvageable.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Haven't tried that board with a celly D, it's not bad for c2d at least, I'll have to try a celly in it.
> 
> 
> Asus Commando is a good one for celery although I was just after the validation & wasn't playing with memory.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I pm'd him and said the same thing...good p965 board is the best for that. But hard to find and pricey.
> Do you know if the p5q-e has more ram dividers? There's one here for $55.


This is the best I could do with the Celeron D 356. Well actually I got it up to 4.55GHz but didn't save the validation.
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2690425

Anything higher and it doesn't post. The board I'm referring to is a Biostar TP35D2-A7

And according to a review I just read it looks like my RAM problem is because of the 533MHz BUS of the Celly. When I get the Q6600 I should be able to choose a mem freq.


----------



## DiamondCut

Okay so I tried 1.55volts at 5ghz and it boots into windows to the loading screen then blacks out and then repeats that process but it doesnt power down... is voltage too high or too low and should I be asjusting my v droop? it only allows odd increments.

Edit: I've booted into windows fine at 4.8ghz @ 1.52volts... CPU Z is reporting 1.49votls being used.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> This is the best I could do with the Celeron D 356. Well actually I got it up to 4.55GHz but didn't save the validation.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2690425
> 
> Anything higher and it doesn't post. The board I'm referring to is a Biostar TP35D2-A7
> 
> And according to a review I just read it looks like my RAM problem is because of the 533MHz BUS of the Celly. When I get the Q6600 I should be able to choose a mem freq.


Ah, thought you had the tpower i45...not a bad board anyway.








Go buy some D9 sticks and be done with it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1290822/width/500/height/1000[/IMG]
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> It's only 2 corners, turns out the blade I used was too flimsy and trying to get under the IHS bent it.
> 
> My cell phone camera sucks, but I hope this is salvageable.


looks like the end of the razor dug in good. that happend the first time i delided. this time i kept both ends of the razor blade off the pcb so it dosent dig in.
heres a pic of what i mean. both edges not over pcb

now here is a pic of what u dont want to do. end of blade over pcb


ok i no that the razor is all messed up and stuff but its good when it was brand new worked really good. but that is a dead chip so who cares


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's only 2 corners, turns out the blade I used was too flimsy and trying to get under the IHS bent it.
> 
> My cell phone camera sucks, but I hope this is salvageable.


those traces are waaaaay out there... you might be lucky and it looks like it should be decent... you never know. Just think possitively it looks decent to me, compared to some lol.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Okay so I tried 1.55volts at 5ghz and it boots into windows to the loading screen then blacks out and then repeats that process but it doesnt power down... is voltage too high or too low and should I be asjusting my v droop? it only allows odd increments.
> 
> Edit: I've booted into windows fine at 4.8ghz @ 1.52volts... CPU Z is reporting 1.49votls being used.


not enough vcore then.... your chip = poopy try 1.57-1.58 vcore


----------



## lilchronic

heres pics of my dead chip it was crap any way needed 1.35v for 4.5ghz


----------



## DiamondCut

What does it mean when your multiplier is dropping from 100.00 to 99.99? Under volted?


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not enough vcore then.... your chip = poopy try 1.57-1.58 vcore


Say it aint so! I am now at 4.8ghz @ 1.46 volts... seems good now.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> heres pics of my dead chip it was crap any way needed 1.35v for 4.5ghz


Looks exactly like my dead chip. Even the Ultra application was the same.
I'm waiting for my new one still, got one more month to go methinks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> What does it mean when your multiplier is dropping from 100.00 to 99.99? Under volted?


That's normal, it's spread spectrum's fault.
And idle clocks are 1.6ghz if you have the power saving features enabled.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Say it aint so! I am now at 4.8ghz @ 1.46 volts... seems good now.


Good, work your way around it...leave pll overvoltage enabled and test stability.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> What does it mean when your multiplier is dropping from 100.00 to 99.99? Under volted?


you have spread spectrum disabled?


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you have spread spectrum disabled?


yea, should it be enabled? I can boot into 4.9ghz fine but 5ghz and it even locks up in bios...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> yea, should it be enabled? I can boot into 4.9ghz fine but 5ghz and it even locks up in bios...


i have it disabled


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i have it disabled


Yea i tried enabling it and it made it worse. Im still haveing difficulty making the ratio adjust with C1E and C State but still its not budging


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Yea i tried enabling it and it made it worse. Im still haveing difficulty making the ratio adjust with C1E and C State but still its not budging


disable c3 and c6. you can leave package c state on auto or diable it


----------



## prest0

Well I guess I'm a lucky guy, here is my 3570k a little scratched but working like a charm


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Someone recommend me a good, but reasonably priced socket 775 board for overclocking? This Biostar clunker I got is killing me. I can't adjust the memory multiplier at all. Furthermore my 800MHz RAM is stuck at 533MHz!!! AHHHHHGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH


As much as I hate asus - the asus p5k premium was deemed one of the best 775 motherboard for OC'ing.
I have it / had it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Hnnnnnnnnng $120 3770k. Kills me everytime


Wait where!?
I would love to buy one at that price!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> 
> It's only 2 corners, turns out the blade I used was too flimsy and trying to get under the IHS bent it.
> 
> My cell phone camera sucks, but I hope this is salvageable.


If you ask me - after my experience on my de-lidding - I think you're fine.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> heres pics of my dead chip it was crap any way needed 1.35v for 4.5ghz


Wait how is this screwed?
Possibly shorted it or?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Looks exactly like my dead chip. Even the Ultra application was the same.
> I'm waiting for my new one still, got one more month to go methinks.
> That's normal, it's spread spectrum's fault.
> And idle clocks are 1.6ghz if you have the power saving features enabled.
> Good, work your way around it...leave pll overvoltage enabled and test stability.


I'm now curious to know how you guys screwed your chips - and what made it cause it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Say it aint so! I am now at 4.8ghz @ 1.46 volts... seems good now.


I can boot 5 giggles at 1.43 vcore. So take a while on LLC and PLL and mess with them, you might be able to squeeze some speed out of it it takes some tweaking though.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Wait how is this screwed?
> Possibly shorted it or?


??? never said that it was screwed
Quote:


> I'm now curious to know how you guys screwed your chips - and what made it cause it.


the razor blade cut to deep ? i but i dont really understand you question


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ??? never said that it was screwed
> the razor blade cut to deep ? i but i dont really understand you question


You said this man:
"heres pics of my dead chip"

How did it "die"?

As for my other question - what I don't understand is how did the de-lid go wrong/badly/screw your CPU?
Those little marks seems at the extremities of the PCB


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> You said this man:
> "heres pics of my dead chip"
> 
> How did it "die"?
> 
> As for my other question - what I don't understand is how did the de-lid go wrong/badly/screw your CPU?
> Those little marks seems at the extremities of the PCB


yea i ****ed it up cut to deep on the pcb, let the edge of the razor go over the pcb and the tip of the razor dug right in


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> disable c3 and c6. you can leave package c state on auto or diable it


it doesnt give me those options like that. It says C state limit and i can choose between C0 C3 C6
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I can boot 5 giggles at 1.43 vcore. So take a while on LLC and PLL and mess with them, you might be able to squeeze some speed out of it it takes some tweaking though.


Whats a good value to start off at for LLC and PLL?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> it doesnt give me those options like that. It says C state limit and i can choose between C0 C3 C6


what motherboard do u have


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yea i ****ed it up cut to deep on the pcb, let the edge of the razor go over the pcb and the tip of the razor dug right in


Ah darn!
For me, it was as I was TAKING OUT the blade - that's how I got my scratch - thankfully, looks to be OK and performing just fine (not in my babytooth board though...LOL)


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what motherboard do u have


MSI Z77 MPower. I had to leave work so I left it on intel burn at 4.8ghz 1.45 volts for 50 runs. Should take all night.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> it doesnt give me those options like that. It says C state limit and i can choose between C0 C3 C6
> Whats a good value to start off at for LLC and PLL?


LLC or Load Line Calibration set it to 100% or 125% dependant on the person. 100% will only let the set amount of vcore that you put in bios to flow through, 125% adds 25% etc etc. For PLL you can sometimes be lucky and get a good chip where it likes PLL voltage changes like mine did a lot, with this you can get stable sometimes but can't go above 1.9volts in that range unless your on LN2 or Dice... atleast that's my way of doing it. Also what RAM you got in there as well? higher RAM speeds can cause issues with OC'ing sometimes, I know when I pull mine at 2400 7-11-8-27 they can get cranky going above 5 giggles.


----------



## FtW 420

Vdroop control can stay on auto for the mpower, it sets 100% at default for minimum vdroop. I didn't think PLL voltage made any difference for anything under 5.5Ghz, never had to raise it, got no benefits from lowering it, so generally leave it auto as well.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I can boot 5 giggles at 1.43 vcore. So take a while on LLC and PLL and mess with them, you might be able to squeeze some speed out of it it takes some tweaking though.


...excellent numbers for 5 giggles ! For next-step tuning, you might want to try Intel's 'Extreme Tuning Utility' as it seems to deal with PLL and LLC automatically but very well - and doesn't automatically throw as much vCore at things like Asus AI suite does. Intel's Utility will let you adjust vCore way up - but not actually apply more than 1.525 +- but by the sounds of it, you're well within the safe range


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> LLC or Load Line Calibration set it to 100% or 125% dependant on the person. 100% will only let the set amount of vcore that you put in bios to flow through, 125% adds 25% etc etc. For PLL you can sometimes be lucky and get a good chip where it likes PLL voltage changes like mine did a lot, with this you can get stable sometimes but can't go above 1.9volts in that range unless your on LN2 or Dice... atleast that's my way of doing it. Also what RAM you got in there as well? higher RAM speeds can cause issues with OC'ing sometimes, I know when I pull mine at 2400 7-11-8-27 they can get cranky going above 5 giggles.


It doesn't give %125 it only allows +25,+50,+75, and +100.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Vdroop control can stay on auto for the mpower, it sets 100% at default for minimum vdroop. I didn't think PLL voltage made any difference for anything under 5.5Ghz, never had to raise it, got no benefits from lowering it, so generally leave it auto as well.


Ill have to change that then. Thanks.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Vdroop control can stay on auto for the mpower, it sets 100% at default for minimum vdroop. I didn't think PLL voltage made any difference for anything under 5.5Ghz, never had to raise it, got no benefits from lowering it, so generally leave it auto as well.


Yeah I found it very weird that my last chip loved it so much I could drop vcore by .06 and raise PLL by .3 and get it stable... Franky was a weird one lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...excellent numbers for 5 giggles ! For next-step tuning, you might want to try Intel's 'Extreme Tuning Utility' as it seems to deal with PLL and LLC automatically but very well - and doesn't automatically throw as much vCore at things like Asus AI suite does. Intel's Utility will let you adjust vCore way up - but not actually apply more than 1.525 +- but by the sounds of it, you're well within the safe range


Thanks! I just need some time to delid this bad lady for once...... might do it this weekend... but I have no means on how to stream the damn thing... I have streaming accounts but no camera right now lol








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> It doesn't give %125 it only allows +25,+50,+75, and +100.
> Ill have to change that then. Thanks.


try the +25 and +50 those are the 25% and 50% over 100 percent ie. 125% and 150%


----------



## lngu81

Successfully delidded my 3770K, temp drops to 69 C from 88 C, I'm using Liquid Pro, I was on AS5, ambient @ 29C. The chip is 3 days old and more OC to come...boooyaah:thumb:
Btw I will post my result of OC later after more stress test


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lngu81*
> 
> Successfully delidded my 3770K, temp drops to 69 C from 88 C, I'm using Liquid Pro, I was on AS5, ambient @ 29C. The chip is 3 days old and more OC to come...boooyaah:thumb:
> Btw I will post my result of OC later after more stress test


I'll wait to admit you myself but your in the spreadsheet lol, I want the OC results for the rest of the admittance lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I found it very weird that my last chip loved it so much I could drop vcore by .06 and raise PLL by .3 and get it stable... Franky was a weird one lol
> Thanks! I just need some time to delid this bad lady for once...... might do it this weekend... but I have no means on how to stream the damn thing... I have streaming accounts but no camera right now lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> try the +25 and +50 those are the 25% and 50% over 100 percent ie. 125% and 150%


Some people seem to do well lowering PLL, I've tried it on a few chips & found it didn't make a difference, no lower temps, not more stable, still needed the same vcore.

The 25% & 50% actually make more vdroop, in the MSI bios it is basically at max LLC on auto, changing it to anything else just increases the vdroop (so would need more vcore to compensate). Most boards work opposite, having high vdroop at auto & less with higher LLC.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lngu81*
> 
> Successfully delidded my 3770K, temp drops to 69 C from 88 C, I'm using Liquid Pro, I was on AS5, ambient @ 29C. The chip is 3 days old and more OC to come...boooyaah:thumb:
> Btw I will post my result of OC later after more stress test


Nice job! Looking forward to some pics and how much oc you gained.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Some people seem to do well lowering PLL, I've tried it on a few chips & found it didn't make a difference, no lower temps, not more stable, still needed the same vcore.
> 
> The 25% & 50% actually make more vdroop, in the MSI bios it is basically at max LLC on auto, changing it to anything else just increases the vdroop (so would need more vcore to compensate). Most boards work opposite, having high vdroop at auto & less with higher LLC.


eeeww.... I dont like that at all.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I don't like Msi, except for gpu's and only the lightning and hawk models. xD g'night folks!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> eeeww.... I dont like that at all.....


They make it easy, smallest vdroop at default, you actually have to change settings to get vdroop.
Unless you prefer more vdroop what's not to like?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I don't like Msi, except for gpu's and only the lightning and hawk models. xD g'night folks!


The boards are great, you can use high end intel msi mobos to win mid range mobos in competitions at hwbot, & AMD msi mobos.... who doesn't like fireworks?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Been a busy day today.
> 
> @ Joa3d43 - Nice post , congrats on the delid. What where you using to load the cpu on your 5.1 and 5.2 pics ?


Thanks...and you're the lucky guy I thought I briefly answer as there were several questions like this and also others far less sensible - good thing I did not post the 5.3 GHz results









The whole point of the posting exercise was JUST to do a direct comparison of 'before and after' re delidding, and with CL Ultra on the die. I am not doing any top-speed validation runs yet with this semi-incomplete setup.

The screenshots with the windows resource manager (and other tools) indicating 100% load on all cores came in two batches:

4.8, 4.9 and 5.0 and then 5.0, 5.1, and 5.2. For all these tests ('before and after'), I used Aida64 Extreme Edition 'System Stability Test' to allow for a direct comparison of 100% load - which I stated in the original post, btw









The only real differences were ambient temps (up to 3 C variance) ...and the first 3 tests were done on a Sabertooth Z77 (which is now in a VM) and the last 3 on a Maximus V Extreme. Because of the ambient and motherboard differences, I quickly ran Cinebench (two cycles each) right before and after the delid on the same mobo /ambient temp - Cinebench is NOT, and never has been, my be-all-end-all stress test.

I also keep on mentioning (hoping that one day someone will actually 'get it') that this is a partial work-related 'test' system and as such has MULTIPLE instances of SQL Server installed, including SQL ENTERPRISE which is a big memory and thread hog - in fact just the enterprise version has multiple times the memory usage than the next largest user (other than Win 7 systems stuff) via Resource / Processes.

Then there is also a RAM Disk...the SQL has a pres-set minimum of 8 gb of RAM and can use up to 16, the RAM disk has another 8 GB. SQL Enterprise is also paired with Microsoft IIS web server, addressed in localhost by the VM systems at all times trying to mimic real-world conditions, even when stress testing.

Some folks here seem to suggest that I should take 90 % of the RAM and assign it to Prime95 ...please folks - do the math, as much as I always do Prime95 testing with whatever is available, the system decides that automatically.

The are two issues I'm trying to deal with now. The first is that the delidding / cooling upgrade is not yet finished...the IHS is not seated quite right (about .75 to 1 mm 'too far back') but I don't think that that is a big issue - certainly does not seem to affect performance, and I did get the CL-U application on the die just right, so I am in no hurry to take the IHS off the die again. Of bigger concern is the fact that the close-water-loop block is a bit loose on one of the four corners as the corresponding rear retaining nut has worked itself deeper into the plastic retainer slot - I can twist the whole screw / nut assembly even when on full lock









To compensate, I added a much thicker layer of MX4 on the die / water block area ON PURPOSE than I otherwise would, knowing that within a week or so, a brand new custom loop / Koolance block / big 360 rad will go on anyways









The second issue I am still researching...the Watt numbers are getting quite scary once past 5.1 Ghz, never mind 5.3. A 3770K is rated at max 77 watts, but at the speeds I am running and I shared with you, the chip pulls almost three times its rated max (see also Sin0822's table on that on this site). I'm getting a kill-a-watt meter on the weekend to do some more benching when benching, so to speak.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> They make it easy, smallest vdroop at default, you actually have to change settings to get vdroop.
> Unless you prefer more vdroop what's not to like?
> The boards are great, you can use high end intel msi mobos to win mid range mobos in competitions at hwbot, & AMD msi mobos.... who doesn't like fireworks?


Yeah I actually prefer vdroop believe it or not, as my mobo lets me go from 100% to 175% LLC (kinda nuts really) but I like the variances, with that I can seem to better tweak my OC's for some reason. it's kinda weird, thats actually how I got my 5 giggles at 1.43 so fast. saw my 4.5 vcore and the vdroop did some quick math with variables i made and got it within .02 vcore. (initially thought 1.45 was the stable but 1.43 was actually) 







Oh well I'm off for the night time to sleep for once... omg 2 A.M. never mind sleep.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Hi Von dutch
> 
> Here is Gflops at 4.9
> 
> 
> 
> Here is gflops at 5.0
> 
> 
> 
> The setting at 4.9 is 24 hour prime stable and the the setting at 5.0 is 13 hours tested stable. But I am showing lower gflops than you, maybe it is my ram?


im using the same ram speed, with xmp profile, 1600 mhz, 9-9-9-24,
if its near what others have, i think its all good, when you oc 100mhz higher, and dont
get higher gflops cpmpared to the 100 mhz lower ones, then its a problem,
or maybe you could call it "phantom instability" ..lol
its not a exact science tho, i mean, when you run ibt and windows is checking on something in the background,
like updates, could give you a gflop less etc..i wouldnt worry to much about it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im using the same ram speed, with xmp profile, 1600 mhz, 9-9-9-24,
> if its near what others have, i think its all good, when you oc 100mhz higher, and dont
> get higher gflops cpmpared to the 100 mhz lower ones, then its a problem,
> or maybe you could call it "phantom instability" ..lol
> its not a exact science tho, i mean, when you run ibt and windows is checking on something in the background,
> like updates, could give you a gflop less etc..i wouldnt worry to much about it


...or when windows is running the dreaded 'SuperFetch' - drives me mad sometimes


----------



## Swag

Sorry for the crappy iPhone photos, I tried my best even with my lighting... The setback from my PC build pushed my new camera budget a bit farther but whatever.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...or when windows is running the dreaded 'SuperFetch' - drives me mad sometimes


i disable some of the services in windows when i install new,
like superfetch, if you have a SSD you can disable it too, accesstimes are so low/fast with SSd's see








this is my little list, set to manual in services:

Application Experience
Computer Browser (If your PC does not connect to any network)
Desktop Window Manager Session Manager (If you don't want the aero effects)
Diagnostic Policy Service
Distributed Link Tracking Client
IP Helper
Offline Files
Portable Device Enumerator Service
Print Spooler (If you do not use Printer)
Protected Storage
Remote Registry (You can safely disable it for more Security) this one i think is important to disable!








Secondary Logon
Security Center
Server (If your computer do not connect with any network)
Tablet PC Input Service
TCP/IP NetBIOS Helper
Themes ( If you want any aero and good visual appearence (classic theme will be applied))
Windows Error Reporting Service
Windows Media Center Service Launcher
Windows Search (If you rarely use Windows Search feature )
Windows Time (If you do not want to synchronize system time with internet time automatically)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i disable some of the services in windows when i install new,
> like superfetch, if you have a SSD you can disable it too, accesstimes are so low/fast with SSd's see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this is my little list, set to manual in services:
> 
> Application Experience
> Computer Browser (If your PC does not connect to any network)
> Desktop Window Manager Session Manager (If you don't want the aero effects)
> Diagnostic Policy Service
> Distributed Link Tracking Client
> IP Helper
> Offline Files
> Portable Device Enumerator Service
> Print Spooler (If you do not use Printer)
> Protected Storage
> Remote Registry (You can safely disable it for more Security) this one i think is important to disable!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Secondary Logon
> Security Center
> Server (If your computer do not connect with any network)
> Tablet PC Input Service
> TCP/IP NetBIOS Helper
> Themes ( If you want any aero and good visual appearence (classic theme will be applied))
> Windows Error Reporting Service
> Windows Media Center Service Launcher
> Windows Search (If you rarely use Windows Search feature )
> Windows Time (If you do not want to synchronize system time with internet time automatically)


i prefer to set manual over disable, with manual if windows needs it, it can still access the service if needed,
but think twice before just go ahead and disable, i dont have a printer, so i can disable/manual that one









oops, i quoted myself ..LOL ...srry









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry for the crappy iPhone photos, I tried my best even with my lighting... The setback from my PC build pushed my new camera budget a bit farther but whatever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


that looks nice and clean Swag


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry for the crappy iPhone photos, I tried my best even with my lighting... The setback from my PC build pushed my new camera budget a bit farther but whatever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that looks nice and clean Swag
Click to expand...

Thanks.







I didn't realize it was you VonDutch because it wasn't the spinning IHS anymore.







Until I read the damn suitcase!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> VonDutch wrote...i prefer to set manual over disable, with manual if windows needs it, it can still access the service if needed,
> but think twice before just go ahead and disable, i dont have a printer, so i can disable/manual that one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oops, i quoted myself ..LOL ...srry


Thanks for the list - BOTH times







- I had already modded win7 with some of it before, but there are some other ones here worth checking, i.e. whether they're needed by SQL / IIS


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks for the list - BOTH times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I had already modded win7 with some of it before, but there are some other ones here worth checking, i.e. whether they're needed by SQL / IIS


i been using black viper's config's for years now,
used to be a list, now the guy has a whole website i just noticed..
http://www.blackviper.com/service-configurations/black-vipers-windows-7-service-pack-1-service-configurations/
hes got several, win 8 , win 7 sp1 etc etc..he did/does a great job..check the guide tab to look for your config,
the link is for win 7, sp1..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't realize it was you VonDutch because it wasn't the spinning IHS anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Until I read the damn suitcase!


hmm, maybe i should change it back? ...lol








i just like the name on that suitcase,
but the spinning ihs on the die is great too,
a heck ...w8 ...

there ...all VonDutch again ..lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks for the list - BOTH times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I had already modded win7 with some of it before, but there are some other ones here worth checking, i.e. whether they're needed by SQL / IIS
> 
> 
> 
> i been using black viper's config's for years now,
> used to be a list, now the guy has a whole website i just noticed..
> http://www.blackviper.com/service-configurations/black-vipers-windows-7-service-pack-1-service-configurations/
> hes got several, win 8 , win 7 sp1 etc etc..he did/does a great job..check the guide tab to look for your config,
> the link is for win 7, sp1..
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't realize it was you VonDutch because it wasn't the spinning IHS anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Until I read the damn suitcase!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> hmm, maybe i should change it back? ...lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i just like the name on that suitcase,
> but the spinning ihs on the die is great too,
> a heck ...w8 ...
> 
> there ...all VonDutch again ..lol
Click to expand...

The original is always best.


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well in that case, leave it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The colder the better - just not sub "-160c"


I will, dont have time to mess with its now.







Thx


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The original is always best.


Swag - beautiful pictures and rig....question though:
Is that mini ITX? If so - why did you go for a small board in that case?
And LOL where is your RAM








Eaten by that gigantic cooler on that tiny board?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> I will, dont have time to mess with its now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thx


haha no probs


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Application for the club.

More info on my de-lidding can be found here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1357638/my-i7-3770k-de-lidding-adventure

At first I thought I screwed up the IMC - but that turned out to be my Asus Sabertooth and NOT the CPU causing the RAM problems.
Thus I successfully de-lidded my chip.

OCN name: Totally Dubbed
CPU: I7 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-2
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
Temp drops: 12c with Folding comparison. 20c with IBT comparison
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2650772

Temperature pictures:
Folding 60hrs Before de-lid - 92c max temp


Folding 9hrs AFTER de-lid - 80c max temp


*IBT Pictures:* (I used to have MX-2 on the die with a max temp of 82c, then I put CLU on it and got a max temp of 72c -> thus MX-2 was 10c worse than CLU)


Spoiler: CLU (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra) de-lid max temp: 72c










Spoiler: ARCTIC MX-2 de-lid max temp: 82c









Spoiler: No de-lid max temp: 91c







*Pictures:*
De-lidded picture



Clean CPU & PCB:



CLU applied:





My picture with my OCN name:



Cheers for all the help from Swag and Valguar!


----------



## JoeTesla

Success!

I don't have 'official' temps from before, and I also changed my MB..

but before, using a sabertooth z77 and a 'lidded' 3770k I counldn't run 4.8 without reaching 90+ degrees, on water.

I de-lidded and lapped to 1500, used CLP on die and on IHS.

running a MSI MPOWER now, 4.9ghz at 1.425v, temps will not go above 63-64 running IBT/OCCT+AVX/Prime95 blend.

My chip won't do 5ghz though, not at 1.54v and I don't want to go higher.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Application for the club.
> 
> More info on my de-lidding can be found here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1357638/my-i7-3770k-de-lidding-adventure
> 
> At first I thought I screwed up the IMC - but that turned out to be my Asus Sabertooth and NOT the CPU causing the RAM problems.
> Thus I successfully de-lidded my chip.
> 
> OCN name: Totally Dubbed
> CPU: I7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-2
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
> Temp drops: 12c with Folding comparison. 20c with IBT comparison
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2650772
> 
> Temperature pictures:
> Folding 60hrs Before de-lid - 92c max temp
> 
> 
> Folding 9hrs AFTER de-lid - 80c max temp
> 
> 
> *IBT Pictures:* (I used to have MX-2 on the die with a max temp of 82c, then I put CLU on it and got a max temp of 72c -> thus MX-2 was 10c worse than CLU)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: CLU (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra) de-lid max temp: 72c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: ARCTIC MX-2 de-lid max temp: 82c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: No de-lid max temp: 91c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Pictures:*
> De-lidded picture
> 
> 
> 
> Clean CPU & PCB:
> 
> 
> 
> CLU applied:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My picture with my OCN name:
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers for all the help from Swag and Valguar!


I like your amounts of thermal compound. That is exactly picture perfect to how much and how I would recommend it done. If I may have an opinion on it.







Good job on the TIM spreading!









Valguar should use that picture on the front page for application tips and a picture for pro and ultra


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Success!
> 
> I don't have 'official' temps from before, and I also changed my MB..
> 
> but before, using a sabertooth z77 and a 'lidded' 3770k I counldn't run 4.8 without reaching 90+ degrees, on water.
> 
> I de-lidded and lapped to 1500, used CLP on die and on IHS.
> 
> running a MSI MPOWER now, 4.9ghz at 1.425v, temps will not go above 63-64 running IBT/OCCT+AVX/Prime95 blend.
> 
> My chip won't do 5ghz though, not at 1.54v and I don't want to go higher.


Really? All the way from 1.425 to 1.54 you can't get one multi? Do you have pll overvoltage enabled in your bios? I bet we can get u 5 if we work on it as a group


----------



## JoeTesla

Yeah.. talk about a wall.. lol

Yes I do have pll overvoltage enabled, I also set the pll at 1.9v.

I'm still figuring my way around the MSI bios interface.. but I think that's about it for what my chip can do.

Haven't even tried messing with the RAM beyond the 2400 XMP yet.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I like your amounts of thermal compound. That is exactly picture perfect to how much and how I would recommend it done. If I may have an opinion on it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good job on the TIM spreading!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Valguar should use that picture on the front page for application tips and a picture for pro and ultra


thanks a lot man!
Although after removing the IHS from the die again - I saw it a little different as to what it was before (as you already know).
So I might apply a tiny bit more when I get my replacement board in







!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The original is always best.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Swag - beautiful pictures and rig....question though:
> Is that mini ITX? If so - why did you go for a small board in that case?
> And LOL where is your RAM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eaten by that gigantic cooler on that tiny board?
Click to expand...

Kinda annoying you can't see the RAM because of the cooler but whatever. Also, it is an mATX board so not as tiny as you'd think. I went for this one because it was a great deal from MicroCenter and who would pass up an Asus ROG?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Yeah.. talk about a wall.. lol
> 
> Yes I do have pll overvoltage enabled, I also set the pll at 1.9v.
> 
> I'm still figuring my way around the MSI bios interface.. but I think that's about it for what my chip can do.
> 
> Haven't even tried messing with the RAM beyond the 2400 XMP yet.


I wish I knew the MSI bios well. I have an asrock board. Can you not even boot in at 1.54v or is it just not stable enough?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Really? All the way from 1.425 to 1.54 you can't get one multi? Do you have pll overvoltage enabled in your bios? I bet we can get u 5 if we work on it as a group


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Yeah.. talk about a wall.. lol
> 
> Yes I do have pll overvoltage enabled, I also set the pll at 1.9v.
> 
> I'm still figuring my way around the MSI bios interface.. but I think that's about it for what my chip can do.
> 
> Haven't even tried messing with the RAM beyond the 2400 XMP yet.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I wish I knew the MSI bios well. I have an asrock board. Can you not even boot in at 1.54v or is it just not stable enough?


some ivy's make a big jumps vcore wise with those higher oc's, 4.9-5.0 and 5.1ghz chronicfx
o, and dont go over 1.89 with pll, thats the max really(for air/water)..i would lower it again if i where you JoeTesla


----------



## JoeTesla

I probably can lower the PLL for 4.9.

Also, when I OC I usually do it within the OS at first (using the MSI App..)

I set voltage, set multiplier and run Cinebench. If that passes I run a longer stability test, and after that, apply the settings to the bios.

Usually, if the OC is bad, the Cinebench app will just crash so I don't have to reboot and start over...

When I tried 5ghz at 1.54v Cinebench didn't just crash, my machine completely froze and after a few seconds I got a blue screen..
I decided to stop there...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> im using the same ram speed, with xmp profile, 1600 mhz, 9-9-9-24,
> if its near what others have, i think its all good, when you oc 100mhz higher, and dont
> get higher gflops cpmpared to the 100 mhz lower ones, then its a problem,
> or maybe you could call it "phantom instability" ..lol
> its not a exact science tho, i mean, when you run ibt and windows is checking on something in the background,
> like updates, could give you a gflop less etc..i wouldnt worry to much about it


Maybe I gave you flawed data.. I had my wife telling me to feed my son so I sort of ran that 5.0 IBT right off the boot before evrything was settled down. sorry for the rushed numbers. Did you think they were low or normal?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Maybe I gave you flawed data.. I had my wife telling me to feed my son so I sort of ran that 5.0 IBT right off the boot before evrything was settled down. sorry for the rushed numbers. Did you think they were low or normal?


looked normal to me, but you could keep a eye on it next time, if your not in a rush,
but i think it wont make a very big difference tho..
kids first, then computer right ..lol


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> I probably can lower the PLL for 4.9.
> 
> Also, when I OC I usually do it within the OS at first (using the MSI App..)
> 
> I set voltage, set multiplier and run Cinebench. If that passes I run a longer stability test, and after that, apply the settings to the bios.
> 
> Usually, if the OC is bad, the Cinebench app will just crash so I don't have to reboot and start over...
> 
> When I tried 5ghz at 1.54v Cinebench didn't just crash, my machine completely froze and after a few seconds I got a blue screen..
> I decided to stop there...


if you really have your numbers gathered, i would use the bios to oc,
i think it works better then software most of the time..
are you running xmp proflie for your ram? i saw you mentioned somewhere you run it at 2400mhz?
did you up your voltage for ram?

and if you have time, can you fill in your sig, its easier for us to see what hardware you have,
instead of asking all the time ..lol


----------



## justanoldman

Here is the link for getting your rig in your posts:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig


----------



## JoeTesla

Yes, running XMP.
I just updated my build with the 'rigbuilder'..

The XMP profile increased the ram voltage to 1.65 when running at 2400, that's the correct specs for the tridentX.
I have:

i7-3770k
MSI mPower MB
2x4GB GSkill TridentX
gtx 670 reference
samsung 840 pro 128gb
seagate 2tb 7200RPM HD
650W 80+ 'Gold' Rosewill PSU


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Yes, running XMP.
> I just updated my build with the 'rigbuilder'..
> 
> The XMP profile increased the ram voltage to 1.65 when running at 2400, that's the correct specs for the tridentX.
> I have:
> 
> i7-3770k
> MSI mPower MB
> 2x4GB GSkill TridentX
> gtx 670 reference
> samsung 840 pro 128gb
> seagate 2tb 7200RPM HD
> 650W 80+ 'Gold' Rosewill PSU


some of my (especially the higher ones) oc's failed because i was using xmp profile,
maybe you can disable it for now, and just use the multi,
even use 1600mhz if you try to get the 5.0ghz running, see how it goes then,
nice rig btw


----------



## JoeTesla

Thanks









I'll try toning down the ram and see how it goes


----------



## DiamondCut

okay so I found out what was wrong. Aparantly if you change the ratio on the MSI board it overrides all powersaving features so It wont downclock on idle... Not a big problem but I dont want to be running 5ghz on load do im burning my chip currently at 4.5ghz @ 1.32 volts. Temps are maxing at 61c.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Kinda annoying you can't see the RAM because of the cooler but whatever. Also, it is an mATX board so not as tiny as you'd think. I went for this one because it was a great deal from MicroCenter and who would pass up an Asus ROG?


I could pass up anything Asus


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Application for the club.
> 
> More info on my de-lidding can be found here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1357638/my-i7-3770k-de-lidding-adventure
> 
> At first I thought I screwed up the IMC - but that turned out to be my Asus Sabertooth and NOT the CPU causing the RAM problems.
> Thus I successfully de-lidded my chip.
> 
> OCN name: Totally Dubbed
> CPU: I7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-2
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
> Temp drops: 12c with Folding comparison. 20c with IBT comparison
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2650772
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Temperature pictures:
> Folding 60hrs Before de-lid - 92c max temp
> 
> 
> Folding 9hrs AFTER de-lid - 80c max temp
> 
> 
> *IBT Pictures:* (I used to have MX-2 on the die with a max temp of 82c, then I put CLU on it and got a max temp of 72c -> thus MX-2 was 10c worse than CLU)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: CLU (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra) de-lid max temp: 72c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: ARCTIC MX-2 de-lid max temp: 82c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: No de-lid max temp: 91c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Pictures:*
> De-lidded picture
> 
> 
> 
> Clean CPU & PCB:
> 
> 
> 
> CLU applied:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My picture with my OCN name:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers for all the help from Swag and Valguar!


Been waiting a while to type this one! Your IN, now slap that awesome sig you've been waiting for and worrying that your chip was dead! Show your great work to everyone!














Your welcome for the help, and if anyone wants my help for any reason let me know!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Success!
> 
> I don't have 'official' temps from before, and I also changed my MB..
> 
> but before, using a sabertooth z77 and a 'lidded' 3770k I counldn't run 4.8 without reaching 90+ degrees, on water.
> 
> I de-lidded and lapped to 1500, used CLP on die and on IHS.
> 
> running a MSI MPOWER now, 4.9ghz at 1.425v, temps will not go above 63-64 running IBT/OCCT+AVX/Prime95 blend.
> 
> My chip won't do 5ghz though, not at 1.54v and I don't want to go higher.


Congratulations on the sucess! but I'm just curious what batch number is you chip though? I've seen some chips have that crazy vcore wall jump for the 50 multi, it's really strange when it happens too. Lets see if we can't figure this out for you.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Been waiting a while to type this one! Your IN, now slap that awesome sig you've been waiting for and worrying that your chip was dead! Show your great work to everyone!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your welcome for the help, and if anyone wants my help for any reason let me know!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations on the sucess! but I'm just curious what batch number is you chip though? I've seen some chips have that crazy vcore wall jump for the 50 multi, it's really strange when it happens too. Lets see if we can't figure this out for you.


Cheers man









Oh I'll get a more recent CPUZ validation when I get my new board back in....oh dear just remember all this OC'ing voltage starts all over again haha (different board means different CPU voltage, who knows might be at 1.25 instead of 1.27)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> They make it easy, smallest vdroop at default, you actually have to change settings to get vdroop.
> Unless you prefer more vdroop what's not to like?
> The boards are great, you can use high end intel msi mobos to win mid range mobos in competitions at hwbot, & AMD msi mobos.... who doesn't like fireworks?


Yeah, that sounds nice but I doubt I can win any kind of competition atm.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i been using black viper's config's for years now,
> used to be a list, now the guy has a whole website i just noticed..
> http://www.blackviper.com/service-configurations/black-vipers-windows-7-service-pack-1-service-configurations/
> hes got several, win 8 , win 7 sp1 etc etc..he did/does a great job..check the guide tab to look for your config,
> the link is for win 7, sp1..
> hmm, maybe i should change it back? ...lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i just like the name on that suitcase,
> but the spinning ihs on the die is great too,
> a heck ...w8 ...
> 
> there ...all VonDutch again ..lol


Blackviper is the man! Those configs are good for stripping your os prior to benching.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I could pass up anything Asus


You haven't tried the MVG yet have you?
The Saberpoop is by no means a fair comparison...completely different leagues. Go check hwbot for results, one of the best (if not the best) bang/buck boards for high end overclocking. Bios is SUPERB!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Cheers man


Also I used your LP/U applications pics on the front page under the TIM listings.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> son...completely different leagues. Go check hwbot for results, one of the best (if not the best) bang/buck boards for high end overclocking. Bios is SUPERB!


Never said that bro - I just dislike Asus haha
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Also I used your LP/U applications pics on the front page under the TIM listings.


Oh sweet!
You have a lot more pics on my thread btw - feel free to take any of them!


----------



## justanoldman

Faster ram or overclocking your ram will give you better benchmarks, like the 3dmark11 physics score goes up by hundreds of points, and Maxmem will show better numbers.

But does it make any difference at all when gaming, multitasking, doing extensive calculations, etc.? I have read that is does make some difference, but others say that with Ivy Bridge and DDR3 1600 you won't notice real world day to day difference by going beyond that.

Any opinions?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Kinda annoying you can't see the RAM because of the cooler but whatever. Also, it is an mATX board so not as tiny as you'd think. I went for this one because it was a great deal from MicroCenter and who would pass up an Asus ROG?
> 
> 
> 
> I could pass up anything Asus
Click to expand...

Why? Bad experience with Asus?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Faster ram or overclocking your ram will give you better benchmarks, like the 3dmark11 physics score goes up by hundreds of points, and Maxmem will show better numbers.
> 
> But does it make any difference at all when gaming, multitasking, doing extensive calculations, etc.? I have read that is does make some difference, but others say that with Ivy Bridge and DDR3 1600 you won't notice real world day to day difference by going beyond that.
> 
> Any opinions?


I can't stand stock components normally...unless it's some sort of glorious chip or stick I'd rather keep safe for benching, I oc all I can, and specially ram...it's fun to tweak it








You won't see a big difference, even a stock ivy won't show a big difference when gaming and with real life usage but still we delid chips and oc them to 5ghz for 24/7 use, so what's the deal with ram these days?


----------



## JoeTesla

is the batch number on the IHS ? if so, it's now lapped so.. no go


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> is the batch number on the IHS ? if so, it's now lapped so.. no go


It is on the Intel box.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Also I used your LP/U applications pics on the front page under the TIM listings.


Hi valguar, under the "why we use clp" section of the first page where you posted TD's picture you mention 82 w/mk for liquid pro but you have the value of 32 w/mk in the top chart. Which is the true value? I always believed the 82w/mk until the OP said 32 w/mk was straight from the CEO. I wish I could see that reply from the CEO myself I always have a tough time believing Ultra is better all around, since my experience was a much better temp from Pro.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why? Bad experience with Asus?


You haven't been paying attention







?
-2 years ago => ram problems + useless customer service
-A few months ago => Xonar DX software wouldn't work, only unified drivers would work
-De-lidded => board decided to say no

Had enough of asus.


----------



## JoeTesla

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> It is on the Intel box.


I'll take a look later when I get home and let you know.


----------



## JoeTesla

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> You haven't been paying attention
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> -2 years ago => ram problems + useless customer service
> -A few months ago => Xonar DX software wouldn't work, only unified drivers would work
> -De-lidded => board decided to say no
> 
> Had enough of asus.


Yeah my Sabertooth also died just after delidding.

I took a long hard look at it after I got the MSI Mpower in,

found out I somehow managed to get a tiny drop of CLP in the cpu socket. Couldn't get it out of there no matter what I did.. so I think it was my fault it died...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why? Bad experience with Asus?
> 
> 
> 
> You haven't been paying attention
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> -2 years ago => ram problems + useless customer service
> -A few months ago => Xonar DX software wouldn't work, only unified drivers would work
> -De-lidded => board decided to say no
> 
> Had enough of asus.
Click to expand...

Well, I have been listening but I've always been faithful to Asus. Their CS is actually pretty good to me and I like that fact that they are American rather than some Indian or Chinese across the world. I'm Asian myself by the way.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Hi valguar, under the "why we use clp" section of the first page where you posted TD's picture you mention 82 w/mk for liquid pro but you have the value of 32 w/mk in the top chart. Which is the true value? I always believed the 82w/mk until the OP said 32 w/mk was straight from the CEO. I wish I could see that reply from the CEO myself I always have a tough time believing Ultra is better all around, since my experience was a much better temp from Pro.


LM Pro = 32,6 (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
LM Ultra = 38.4w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
everything else is less

this is what the numbers are, ive contacted coollab about it twice..
one mail..have to look for the other one, i have it somewhere .....

Dear Mr. Smit,

thanks for your mail. The heat conduction value for Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is 38,4 W/mk.

For more information we are gladly at your disposal.

Sincerely yours,

Coollaboratory Support

got it,

Dear Mr. Smit,

thanks for your mail. The value for Liquid Pro is approx. 32,6 W/mk.

For more information we are gladly at your disposal.

Sincerely yours,

Coollaboratory Support

hope this is enough to convince you chronicfx..lol


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> LM Pro = 32,6 (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
> LM Ultra = 38.4w/mK (coollaboratory info/helpdesk)
> IX = 20w/mK (IX literature)
> PK-1 = 10.2w/m (frozencpu)
> everything else is less
> 
> this is what the numbers are, ive contacted coollab about it twice..
> one mail..
> 
> Dear Mr. Smit,
> 
> thanks for your mail. The heat conduction value for Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is 38,4 W/mk.
> 
> For more information we are gladly at your disposal.
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> 
> Coollaboratory Support


Did you ask why they claimed or at least the sellers did 82w/mk for so long before that?

example being:

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Success!
> 
> running a MSI MPOWER now, 4.9ghz at 1.425v, temps will not go above 63-64 running IBT/OCCT+AVX/Prime95 blend.
> 
> My chip won't do 5ghz though, not at 1.54v and I don't want to go higher.


Things you can try for z77 Mpower
Disable *CPU Phase Control* which is a power saving feature under *ECO*
Disable *OverSpeed Protection*
Set *CPU Core Vdroop Offset Control* to 100%
Set *Digital Compensation Level* to High
Lower your *PLL*. This will help lower your temperatures and lower temps mean higher overclocks. Some people have PLL as low at 1.55V, I have mine at 1.6V for a stable 5.0GHz.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Did you ask why they claimed or at least the sellers did 82w/mk for so long before that?
> 
> example being:
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html


i know that, ive been using the same numbers from the start,
i was seeing it all over the place..
they dont claim it, they are the makers of the product, so i think they should be right








but i didnt specific ask them why the resellers are using the wrong number, nope..
i think its more important that at least we use the right ones ..lol

the composition of ultra and pro is a bit different too i searched for it once,
theres more other metals in ultra..its in the -safety data sheets

Ultra,
Chemical characterization:
Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous, bismuth;
suspended in a graphite-copper matrix

Pro,
Chemical characterisation:
Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous.

i think ultra does a better job filling bigger gaps, maybe because of the copper in it ..im not sure..


----------



## JoeTesla

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Things you can try for z77 Mpower
> Disable *CPU Phase Control* which is a power saving feature under *ECO*
> Disable *OverSpeed Protection*
> Set *CPU Core Vdroop Offset Control* to 100%
> Set *Digital Compensation Level* to High
> Lower your *PLL*. This will help lower your temperatures and lower temps mean higher overclocks. Some people have PLL as low at 1.55V, I have mine at 1.6V for a stable 5.0GHz.


Ooh thanks!

Will try all of that today.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm 100% sure nothing went on the pins.
As for Asus as a company...they have 0 support for barebones in Europe.
They in fact tell you when you call them to go to the resellers. Why the heck don't they also provide support? Ridiculous for a company like that. I'll never buy as rubbish ever again.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Did you ask why they claimed or at least the sellers did 82w/mk for so long before that?
> 
> example being:
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i know that, ive been using the same numbers from the start,
> i was seeing it all over the place..
> they dont claim it, they are the makers of the product, so i think they should be right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i didnt specific ask them why the resellers are using the wrong number, nope..
> i think its more important that at least we use the right ones ..lol
> 
> the composition of ultra and pro is a bit different too i searched for it once,
> theres more other metals in ultra..its in the -safety data sheets
> 
> Ultra,
> Chemical characterization:
> Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous, bismuth;
> suspended in a graphite-copper matrix
> 
> Pro,
> Chemical characterisation:
> Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous.


Well Von beat me too it lol. But I'd rather trust the Actual company over any reviewer any day, That reason being said is because of the way reviewers do this work, they take it right from the company but with cool lab's they take a while on their email, then they email you back a long time later, I've actually never gotten a response from them through my emails but Von has and so did.... who was it again.... I shot I believe.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm 100% sure nothing went on the pins.
> As for Asus as a company...they have 0 support for barebones in Europe.
> They in fact tell you when you call them to go to the resellers. Why the heck don't they also provide support? Ridiculous for a company like that. I'll never buy as rubbish ever again.


Wow, I never knew they didn't have support out of NA. That really does suck!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well Von beat me too it lol. But I'd rather trust the Actual company over any reviewer any day, That reason being said is because of the way reviewers do this work, they take it right from the company but with cool lab's they take a while on their email, then they email you back a long time later, I've actually never gotten a response from them through my emails but Von has and so did.... who was it again.... I shot I believe.


notion i think..
but yea, they respond to my mails quick most of the time i have one back within a week, maybe 2,
maybe because i live near Germany ...LOL


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I can't stand stock components normally...unless it's some sort of glorious chip or stick I'd rather keep safe for benching, I oc all I can, and specially ram...it's fun to tweak it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You won't see a big difference, even a stock ivy won't show a big difference when gaming and with real life usage but still we delid chips and oc them to 5ghz for 24/7 use, so what's the deal with ram these days?


Thanks for the reply.
It is not like 2400 ram costs that much, so would that do for most people, or you like to find lower speed ones that overclock well?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I can't stand stock components normally...unless it's some sort of glorious chip or stick I'd rather keep safe for benching, I oc all I can, and specially ram...it's fun to tweak it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You won't see a big difference, even a stock ivy won't show a big difference when gaming and with real life usage but still we delid chips and oc them to 5ghz for 24/7 use, so what's the deal with ram these days?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply.
> It is not like 2400 ram costs that much, so would that do for most people, or you like to find lower speed ones that overclock well?
Click to expand...

I got 1866 RAM and OCed them to 2400.


----------



## martinhal

What should my folding temps be ? 5 Ghz @ 1.476. Could I fold at my 5.1 ghz 1.512 v ?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I got 1866 RAM and OCed them to 2400.


G.Skill 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31 is only $139. Would you recommend something like that then I don't have to worry about ocing it, or would you suggest something else?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I got 1866 RAM and OCed them to 2400.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> G.Skill 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31 is only $139. Would you recommend something like that then I don't have to worry about ocing it, or would you suggest something else?
Click to expand...

You looking for a 2x8GB kit only or 2x4GB kits fine? Also, if you don't want to have the hassle of OCing, then that's a fine deal though $139 is on the high side. My kit was $70 normal price and with a gift card and Christmas sale, went down to $40.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

8gb total is enough. That's coming from someone with a 16gb setup then let go of 8gb to put on my mum's rig. Nothing to do with money, as the ram I have is only £35 for 8gb


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> notion i think..
> but yea, they respond to my mails quick most of the time i have one back within a week, maybe 2,
> maybe because i live near Germany ...LOL


I bet thats what it is lol, I never get an answer back.


----------



## justanoldman

Swag,
Wow that's cheap. I thought to go with 2x8 instead of 4x4 since it gives me the opportunity to add more, fewer sticks to deal with, and as you taught me - fewer sticks are easier to oc your chip.

TD,
When I work I have a lot of programs open, and I do mean a lot, some of which are ram hogs. I have 8gb on an old machine and while it does the job it is not quite enough.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm 100% sure nothing went on the pins.
> As for Asus as a company...they have 0 support for barebones in Europe.
> They in fact tell you when you call them to go to the resellers. Why the heck don't they also provide support? Ridiculous for a company like that. I'll never buy as rubbish ever again.


They charge you first before even seeing the board, nor they guarantee it can be repaired yay for Asus support lol
I actually like their bios so much I don't care...but for daily drivers I'd go with a Gigabyte ud3h, but not for me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for the reply.
> It is not like 2400 ram costs that much, so would that do for most people, or you like to find lower speed ones that overclock well?


I got old 2gb sticks, that can do cl7-11-7-28-1t at 2400mhz, and they costed $25.
So far I could boot at 2600mhz cl8-12-8-28-1t with 1.85v lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> G.Skill 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31 is only $139. Would you recommend something like that then I don't have to worry about ocing it, or would you suggest something else?


Do you need 16gb? I doubt you do, unless you are a heavy video editor, or cad drawer dude...
If not, the cheap 2400mhz trident x kits are fine. 69usd at the Egg atm...There are cheap 4x4gb kits too, I'd get those over 2x8gb any day of the week. (most use week Hynix mfr chips which are capable of being 4gb single sided, or 8gb double but kinda suck normally)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Swag,
> Wow that's cheap. I thought to go with 2x8 instead of 4x4 since it gives me the opportunity to add more, fewer sticks to deal with, and as you taught me - fewer sticks are easier to oc your chip.
> 
> TD,
> When I work I have a lot of programs open, and I do mean a lot, some of which are ram hogs. I have 8gb on an old machine and while it does the job it is not quite enough.


Well, good to hear someone actually learns. Have too many people PM me for something that I already told them...









Also, I'd probably just invest in a 2133 kit and OC it. Not hard to OC a 2133 kit to 2400. If you can get a great deal on a 2400 kit, then go for it! Also, look at the timings. Anything above 12-12-12 sucks and will be worse than a 2133 10-10-10...


----------



## JoeTesla

I got the 2x4 2400 trident kit, it's actually pretty good.

Haven't tried OCing them, but I know they do run great at 2400 with 1.52 volts (instead of the 1.65 spec)


----------



## justanoldman

Thanks for all the responses guys.

Swag,
Any chance I can convince you to do a ram overclocking guide? The ones I have looked as so far were not very good. Even if it doesn't make a bid difference, I would still like to learn how to do it correctly.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> I got the 2x4 2400 trident kit, it's actually pretty good.
> 
> Haven't tried OCing them, but I know they do run great at 2400 with 1.52 volts (instead of the 1.65 spec)


You got some headroom there...they might be good for 2666mhz with 1.65v


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the responses guys.
> 
> Swag,
> Any chance I can convince you to do a ram overclocking guide? The ones I have looked as so far were not very good. Even if it doesn't make a bid difference, I would still like to learn how to do it correctly.


Hmm, I could but it'd be the basic. I haven't seen a new RAM OCing guide for Ivy Bridge since there is a lot of speculation of it not being able to run Vdimm higher than 1.50. Should I?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hmm, I could but it'd be the basic. I haven't seen a new RAM OCing guide for Ivy Bridge since there is a lot of speculation of it not being able to run Vdimm higher than 1.50. Should I?


Why of course! How else can your legend grow? Over a hundred of my posts have been me helping someone with information I learned from your Asus oc guide. You have to remember it would be helping people who have probably never oced ram before and aren't sure where to start.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Meh, that speculation is based in the Intel spec for the chip...they also mention you can't use ram higher than 1333mhz or 1600mhz not sure.
Screw that!







Kill those rumors with fire


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hmm, I could but it'd be the basic. I haven't seen a new RAM OCing guide for Ivy Bridge since there is a lot of speculation of it not being able to run Vdimm higher than 1.50. Should I?
> 
> 
> 
> Why of course! How else can your legend grow? Over a hundred of my posts have been me helping someone with information I learned from your Asus oc guide. You have to remember it would be helping people who have probably never oced ram before and aren't sure where to start.
Click to expand...

True true, if I decide to make one, I'll start tonight. It won't be extensively long, I will layout the basics and the OCers can learn the grit by themselves.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the responses guys.
> 
> Swag,
> Any chance I can convince you to do a ram overclocking guide? The ones I have looked as so far were not very good. Even if it doesn't make a bid difference, I would still like to learn how to do it correctly.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> True true, if I decide to make one, I'll start tonight. It won't be extensively long, I will layout the basics and the OCers can learn the grit by themselves.


If anyone I'd say Ivan make a RAM ocing guide lol. No offense Swag.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for all the responses guys.
> 
> Swag,
> Any chance I can convince you to do a ram overclocking guide? The ones I have looked as so far were not very good. Even if it doesn't make a bid difference, I would still like to learn how to do it correctly.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> True true, if I decide to make one, I'll start tonight. It won't be extensively long, I will layout the basics and the OCers can learn the grit by themselves.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If anyone I'd say Ivan make a RAM ocing guide lol. No offense Swag.
Click to expand...

Yea, I ain't too knowledgeable on RAM too much. I basically go with what I learned through trial and error and ain't too familiar with each and every setting for RAM.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> I got the 2x4 2400 trident kit, it's actually pretty good.
> 
> Haven't tried OCing them, but I know they do run great at 2400 with 1.52 volts (instead of the 1.65 spec)


yea mine need 1.665v to run 2400 ive tried to oc them to 2600 with 1.75v but no luck.


----------



## JoeTesla

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Congratulations on the sucess! but I'm just curious what batch number is you chip though? I've seen some chips have that crazy vcore wall jump for the 50 multi, it's really strange when it happens too. Lets see if we can't figure this out for you.


Batch 3227C140
Made in Costa Rica

Just tried 1600 ram, 5ghz and 1.575volts, Cinebench is crashing.
Set the PLL at 1.65.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Batch 3227C140
> Made in Costa Rica
> 
> Just tried 1600 ram, 5ghz and 1.575volts, Cinebench is crashing.
> Set the PLL at 1.65.


put PLL at 1.8 volts if not then try 1.9 volts. but I bet your vcore isn't high enough cinebench requires crazy vcore sometimes


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Oh for financial traders or analytics I highly suggest 16-32gb of ram. But for most people even gamers and people who video render like me 8gb is more than enough









As for the asus discussion: My rma was treated as a 'special' favour. Not even an actual rma. That was 2yrs ago.
When I bought my new z77 I made sure I could rma for 5yrs at scan uk. I'll never have to contact asus for the next 5yrs. That's what I want.

What annoys me is that I paid a premium for the look and name. The performance has been adequate, nothing amazing. More so, the bios is nice, but I don't go in the bios every day. As long as one can get used to the bios of any motherboard, then that's enough.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> True true, if I decide to make one, I'll start tonight. It won't be extensively long, I will layout the basics and the OCers can learn the grit by themselves.


...that would be much appreciated...and I'll contribute some AIDA64 *mem read* and also CPU_Queen bench scores from 3.5 GHz to 5.3 GHz tonight...just finished running the upper-level benches, can't remember my vCore settings for 4 to 4.5 GHz









...what's this business re 1.50vDimm max @ Ivy ? I have been running 1.65v (stock) to 1.675v on 32 GB of 2400 DDR3 in an IvyBoard since last fall - with vDimm at those levels confirmed ?!









Anyways, a vDimm grid guide would be very much welcomed - THANKS


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If anyone I'd say *Ivan make a RAM ocing guide* lol. No offense Swag.


This


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> put PLL at 1.8 volts if not then try 1.9 volts. but I bet your vcore isn't high enough cinebench requires crazy vcore sometimes


1.9V ?

just dont go crazy on the cpu pll, i mean is there any proof that says it helps at all if set that high?, i never went over 1.8V with my oc's ..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> VonDutch and Co


...quick question:

When I delidded, the tail end of the affair got hurried a bit because of an injury and also bad lighting. I used CL-U (the right amount) on just the die - then put the whole thing back together quickly with a temp MX4 on the IHS, given the unique circumstances.

I know that the IHS is seated just a bit too far back by about .75mm to 1mm (I overcompensated the 'forward slide' of the IHS when closing the lever but was also literally bleeding onto the assembly so I hurried it as I could not push down on the IHS when closing the CPU locking mechanism).

I know the die is not touching any sides of the IHS, and initial temp gains (just CL-U on die; 12 to 15 C gain) have been impressive given the less-than-perfect, temporary IHS to cooler mount.

When I go back in to finish the job and also install a new custom loop, would you take the IHS off again (while leaving the CPU seated on the socket), re-apply CL-U onto the (carefully cleaned) die AS WELL AS the underside of the IHS - or just leave well enough alone...I rather not take out the CPU ever again - and it is benching with ok temps even now upwards of 5.3.

I guess I am also asking how much gain can be had from an 'extra' CL-U layer underneath the IHS, not just the die









Thanks everyone for your input !


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If anyone I'd say Ivan make a RAM ocing guide lol. No offense Swag.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> This


I also vote for Ivan making a RAM overclocking guide. The little bit I know about DDR2 and DDR3 RAM I credit to him.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If anyone I'd say Ivan make a RAM ocing guide lol. No offense Swag.


yea ivan! make it lol.







noobs like me can use some help.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Will is Ivan?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Will is Ivan?


cmon william!







if thats your reall name?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Will is Ivan?


No but if Danny Welbeck had scored that 2nd goal FTW I would let him sleep with my GF...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lol!
No it's Chris. Totally Dubbed Chris.


----------



## dmanstasiu

William is Bob. Ivan is Ivan. Ivan is not William. Ian is Bobby.


----------



## justanoldman

This is a Long post, asking for help/advice on a second build.

I put it in a spoiler in case someone doesn't want to read through it, but I would very much appreciate any help.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Hey you clicked to look! Thanks.









I should make a thread for this at some point, but since you guys are so experienced I would appreciate any input on it. Since I can't sell my fist delidded 3770k I figured I would just build another system and give the old one I am using now to the kids. I always have two computers, just in case something goes wrong. You can see my current specs in my signature rig, and with this one I figured I would do a few upgrades. I am not really trying to stay in any specific budget, just get a nice system for a reasonable price, but at this point I have a litte more money than time. Anything that saves me time is a good thing.

Anything I should change?

What I already have:
CPU: 3770k overclocked, delidded, lapped

Thinking about:
Case:
NZXT Switch 810 (I was told this is a good choice for two radiators for the H220)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146089

Cooling:
Swiftech H220, (plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well)
http://www.swiftech.com/H220.aspx

SSD:
Crucial M4 256gb
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-148-443
or possibly
Samsung 840 pro 256gb (seems faster, but I don't know if it is more reliable or not)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147193

HDD:
Just for backups, extra storage:
Western Digital Black 7200rpm 1tb
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533

Video card: (this is something I am really not sure about)
I know most here think AMD>Nvidia, but I already have a EVGA GTX 670, so I am very inclined to go with another EVGA simply to save time when updating drivers, looking for tech support, warranty, RMA etc. It will definitely be more work for me to have Nvidia in one system and AMD in the other.
The one thing I know for sure is that I want to cool this GPU with the Swiftech H220, and I know nothing about that so I need a card that can be water-cooled without too much trouble. Will be gaming on either 2560x1600 or possibly 3 monitor surround at 1920x1200 for each of the 3.
With that in mind:
EVGA GTX 670 FTW 2gb
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130787
or more $
EVGA GTX 670 4gb FTW+
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
or even more $$
EVGA GTX 680 4gb FTW+ w/backplate
or $$$
EVGA GTX 680 4gb Classified
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801

PSU
Corsair AX850 (I think it is more than I need now, but not sure what else I will add later)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139015&Tpk=ax850

Memory:
G.Skill Trident X 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231589

Motherboard:
I have a Maximus V Formula, which I am happy with so far. I have heard good things about Gigabyte but then I would have to learn a whole new BIOS, which doesn't seem worth the time unless I am missing something.
Asus ROG MVF
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
or save some $
Asus ROG Maximus V Gene
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
This is a smaller board which I would put in my old case and move the MVF to the new case, if I go that way.

If you have made it this far, your help is very much appreciated. Thank you!!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> This is a Long post, asking for help/advice on a second build.
> 
> I put it in a spoiler in case someone doesn't want to read through it, but I would very much appreciate any help.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hey you clicked to look! Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I should make a thread for this at some point, but since you guys are so experienced I would appreciate any input on it. Since I can't sell my fist delidded 3770k I figured I would just build another system and give the old one I am using now to the kids. I always have two computers, just in case something goes wrong. You can see my current specs in my signature rig, and with this one I figured I would do a few upgrades. I am not really trying to stay in any specific budget, just get a nice system for a reasonable price, but at this point I have a litte more money than time. Anything that saves me time is a good thing.
> 
> Anything I should change?
> 
> What I already have:
> CPU: 3770k overclocked, delidded, lapped
> 
> Thinking about:
> Case:
> NZXT Switch 810 (I was told this is a good choice for two radiators for the H220)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146089
> 
> Cooling:
> Swiftech H220, (plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well)
> http://www.swiftech.com/H220.aspx
> 
> SSD:
> Crucial M4 256gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-148-443
> or possibly
> Samsung 840 pro 256gb (seems faster, but I don't know if it is more reliable or not)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147193
> 
> HDD:
> Just for backups, extra storage:
> Western Digital Black 7200rpm 1tb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533
> 
> Video card: (this is something I am really not sure about)
> I know most here think AMD>Nvidia, but I already have a EVGA GTX 670, so I am very inclined to go with another EVGA simply to save time when updating drivers, looking for tech support, warranty, RMA etc. It will definitely be more work for me to have Nvidia in one system and AMD in the other.
> The one thing I know for sure is that I want to cool this GPU with the Swiftech H220, and I know nothing about that so I need a card that can be water-cooled without too much trouble. Will be gaming on either 2560x1600 or possibly 3 monitor surround at 1920x1200 for each of the 3.
> With that in mind:
> EVGA GTX 670 FTW 2gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130787
> or more $
> EVGA GTX 670 4gb FTW+
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
> or even more $$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb FTW+ w/backplate
> or $$$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb Classified
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801
> 
> PSU
> Corsair AX850 (I think it is more than I need now, but not sure what else I will add later)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139015&Tpk=ax850
> 
> Memory:
> G.Skill Trident X 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231589
> 
> Motherboard:
> I have a Maximus V Formula, which I am happy with so far. I have heard good things about Gigabyte but then I would have to learn a whole new BIOS, which doesn't seem worth the time unless I am missing something.
> Asus ROG MVF
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
> or save some $
> Asus ROG Maximus V Gene
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
> This is a smaller board which I would put in my old case and move the MVF to the new case, if I go that way.
> 
> If you have made it this far, your help is very much appreciated. Thank you!!


So you're going to buy parts for a new build to use? OR buy parts to use the old i7 on a 2nd computer? /me confused


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I actually prefer vdroop believe it or not, as my mobo lets me go from 100% to 175% LLC (kinda nuts really) but I like the variances, with that I can seem to better tweak my OC's for some reason. it's kinda weird, thats actually how I got my 5 giggles at 1.43 so fast. saw my 4.5 vcore and the vdroop did some quick math with variables i made and got it within .02 vcore. (initially thought 1.45 was the stable but 1.43 was actually)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh well I'm off for the night time to sleep for once... omg 2 A.M. never mind sleep.


You're after the vrise! I usually try to avoid vrise & would put LLC at a setting equal to or slightly lower than the Idle. Like 1.4V idle -->1.39 - 1.4V load. Gotta watch the transient voltage spikes you can't see when on air & water & playing at high vcore.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> i been using black viper's config's for years now,
> used to be a list, now the guy has a whole website i just noticed..
> http://www.blackviper.com/service-configurations/black-vipers-windows-7-service-pack-1-service-configurations/
> hes got several, win 8 , win 7 sp1 etc etc..he did/does a great job..check the guide tab to look for your config,
> the link is for win 7, sp1..
> hmm, maybe i should change it back? ...lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i just like the name on that suitcase,
> but the spinning ihs on the die is great too,
> a heck ...w8 ...
> 
> there ...all VonDutch again ..lol


Almost forgot about blackviper's site, that was where I learned most of my OS stripping, great guides!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Faster ram or overclocking your ram will give you better benchmarks, like the 3dmark11 physics score goes up by hundreds of points, and Maxmem will show better numbers.
> 
> But does it make any difference at all when gaming, multitasking, doing extensive calculations, etc.? I have read that is does make some difference, but others say that with Ivy Bridge and DDR3 1600 you won't notice real world day to day difference by going beyond that.
> 
> Any opinions?


The memory overclocks are mainly noticeable in benchmarks, but the performance is increased, you may not notice it the same way in daily things, but it's there. It is just harder to see without some kind of score or number at the end to compare with.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hmm, I could but it'd be the basic. I haven't seen a new RAM OCing guide for Ivy Bridge since there is a lot of speculation of it not being able to run Vdimm higher than 1.50. Should I?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Meh, that speculation is based in the Intel spec for the chip...they also mention you can't use ram higher than 1333mhz or 1600mhz not sure.
> Screw that!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kill those rumors with fire


That is only speculation. 1.65V vdimm is fine with every intel ddr3 platform, & ivy is better than many with vdimm tolerance.
As Ivan points out intel says memory supported is 1600Mhz, & if asked intel tech support will say it isn't safe to overclock a cpu.

Besides, you would rip the head off your cpu for better clocks, but think twice about feeding the memory a bit of voltage?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I also vote for Ivan making a RAM overclocking guide. The little bit I know about DDR2 and DDR3 RAM I credit to him.











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> No but if Danny Welbeck had scored that 2nd goal *FTW I would let him sleep with my GF*...


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol My name is Ivan, for now...unless I need lots of money fast, then I may change it to Ivanna xD

I'm not THAT good as to write a proper guide like some other people here (Sam OCX, kow ciller, cool hand luke, FtW...) but I'll give it a shot if you wish.
Gonna take a while to finish it though, so hang on in there.

I guess ddr3 should be the focus methinks, right?
I'll try to add a reccomended module list and some benchies too, gonna need some help there cause I don't have ALL the ram in the world lol Only got psc, bbse and samsung hyk0 atm.

EDIT: Thanks for the credit guys xD


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> This is a Long post, asking for help/advice on a second build.
> 
> I put it in a spoiler in case someone doesn't want to read through it, but I would very much appreciate any help.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hey you clicked to look! Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I should make a thread for this at some point, but since you guys are so experienced I would appreciate any input on it. Since I can't sell my fist delidded 3770k I figured I would just build another system and give the old one I am using now to the kids. I always have two computers, just in case something goes wrong. You can see my current specs in my signature rig, and with this one I figured I would do a few upgrades. I am not really trying to stay in any specific budget, just get a nice system for a reasonable price, but at this point I have a litte more money than time. Anything that saves me time is a good thing.
> 
> Anything I should change?
> 
> What I already have:
> CPU: 3770k overclocked, delidded, lapped
> 
> Thinking about:
> Case:
> NZXT Switch 810 (I was told this is a good choice for two radiators for the H220)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146089
> 
> Cooling:
> Swiftech H220, (plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well)
> http://www.swiftech.com/H220.aspx
> 
> SSD:
> Crucial M4 256gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-148-443
> or possibly
> Samsung 840 pro 256gb (seems faster, but I don't know if it is more reliable or not)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147193
> 
> HDD:
> Just for backups, extra storage:
> Western Digital Black 7200rpm 1tb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533
> 
> Video card: (this is something I am really not sure about)
> I know most here think AMD>Nvidia, but I already have a EVGA GTX 670, so I am very inclined to go with another EVGA simply to save time when updating drivers, looking for tech support, warranty, RMA etc. It will definitely be more work for me to have Nvidia in one system and AMD in the other.
> The one thing I know for sure is that I want to cool this GPU with the Swiftech H220, and I know nothing about that so I need a card that can be water-cooled without too much trouble. Will be gaming on either 2560x1600 or possibly 3 monitor surround at 1920x1200 for each of the 3.
> With that in mind:
> EVGA GTX 670 FTW 2gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130787
> or more $
> EVGA GTX 670 4gb FTW+
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
> or even more $$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb FTW+ w/backplate
> or $$$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb Classified
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801
> 
> PSU
> Corsair AX850 (I think it is more than I need now, but not sure what else I will add later)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139015&Tpk=ax850
> 
> Memory:
> G.Skill Trident X 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231589
> 
> Motherboard:
> I have a Maximus V Formula, which I am happy with so far. I have heard good things about Gigabyte but then I would have to learn a whole new BIOS, which doesn't seem worth the time unless I am missing something.
> Asus ROG MVF
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
> or save some $
> Asus ROG Maximus V Gene
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
> This is a smaller board which I would put in my old case and move the MVF to the new case, if I go that way.
> 
> If you have made it this far, your help is very much appreciated. Thank you!!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So you're going to buy parts for a new build to use? OR buy parts to use the old i7 on a 2nd computer? /me confused


Sorry, I am keeping my sig rig, and I am now considering building a whole new machine around my second chip that is sitting on the shelf.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Solid build. Samsung 840 > M4
4GB 670s > 680s (Imo, not worth the price premium)
PSU ... If you're running dual cards, you should be fine with an 850.
MVF for sure
RAM ; Samsung 1.35v 8GB kit. If needed, buy 2. I can't praise this RAM enough for the pricepoint


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ooo ivan! The man with a bird in his picture! That's how I acosiate people on here haha.
I almost got mind boggled when I saw a suitcase and not a spinning ihs for Dutch









As for you dman: mind = blown


----------



## I_shot

Ivan make a RAM guide and put us out of our misery


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ooo ivan! The man with a bird in his picture! That's how I acosiate people on here haha.
> I almost got mind boggled when I saw a suitcase and not a spinning ihs for Dutch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for you dman: mind = blown


He must be Russian living in Vancouver. Russian people are dancing bears right?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> This is a Long post, asking for help/advice on a second build.
> 
> I put it in a spoiler in case someone doesn't want to read through it, but I would very much appreciate any help.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hey you clicked to look! Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I should make a thread for this at some point, but since you guys are so experienced I would appreciate any input on it. Since I can't sell my fist delidded 3770k I figured I would just build another system and give the old one I am using now to the kids. I always have two computers, just in case something goes wrong. You can see my current specs in my signature rig, and with this one I figured I would do a few upgrades. I am not really trying to stay in any specific budget, just get a nice system for a reasonable price, but at this point I have a litte more money than time. Anything that saves me time is a good thing.
> 
> Anything I should change?
> 
> What I already have:
> CPU: 3770k overclocked, delidded, lapped
> 
> Thinking about:
> Case:
> NZXT Switch 810 (I was told this is a good choice for two radiators for the H220)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146089
> 
> Cooling:
> Swiftech H220, (plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well)
> http://www.swiftech.com/H220.aspx
> 
> SSD:
> Crucial M4 256gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-148-443
> or possibly
> Samsung 840 pro 256gb (seems faster, but I don't know if it is more reliable or not)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147193
> 
> HDD:
> Just for backups, extra storage:
> Western Digital Black 7200rpm 1tb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533
> 
> Video card: (this is something I am really not sure about)
> I know most here think AMD>Nvidia, but I already have a EVGA GTX 670, so I am very inclined to go with another EVGA simply to save time when updating drivers, looking for tech support, warranty, RMA etc. It will definitely be more work for me to have Nvidia in one system and AMD in the other.
> The one thing I know for sure is that I want to cool this GPU with the Swiftech H220, and I know nothing about that so I need a card that can be water-cooled without too much trouble. Will be gaming on either 2560x1600 or possibly 3 monitor surround at 1920x1200 for each of the 3.
> With that in mind:
> EVGA GTX 670 FTW 2gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130787
> or more $
> EVGA GTX 670 4gb FTW+
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
> or even more $$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb FTW+ w/backplate
> or $$$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb Classified
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801
> 
> PSU
> Corsair AX850 (I think it is more than I need now, but not sure what else I will add later)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139015&Tpk=ax850
> 
> Memory:
> G.Skill Trident X 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231589
> 
> Motherboard:
> I have a Maximus V Formula, which I am happy with so far. I have heard good things about Gigabyte but then I would have to learn a whole new BIOS, which doesn't seem worth the time unless I am missing something.
> Asus ROG MVF
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
> or save some $
> Asus ROG Maximus V Gene
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
> This is a smaller board which I would put in my old case and move the MVF to the new case, if I go that way.
> 
> If you have made it this far, your help is very much appreciated. Thank you!!


This is what i would if i were u, then give your current rig to your kids. and i like that idea with the h220 and extra rad
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569 8gb of ram for free with up7 so u dont need new ram just switch it out
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139014
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226226
2 of these http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146096


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ooo ivan! The man with a bird in his picture! That's how I acosiate people on here haha.
> I almost got mind boggled when I saw a suitcase and not a spinning ihs for Dutch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for you dman: mind = blown


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol My name is Ivan, for now...unless I need lots of money fast, then I may change it to Ivanna xD
> 
> I'm not THAT good as to write a proper guide like some other people here (Sam OCX, kow ciller, cool hand luke, FtW...) but I'll give it a shot if you wish.
> Gonna take a while to finish it though, so hang on in there.
> 
> I guess ddr3 should be the focus methinks, right?
> I'll try to add a reccomended module list and some benchies too, gonna need some help there cause I don't have ALL the ram in the world lol Only got psc, bbse and samsung hyk0 atm.
> 
> EDIT: Thanks for the credit guys xD


Quick everyone ship Ivan a bunch of DIMMs!!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, I am keeping my sig rig, and I am now considering building a whole new machine around my second chip that is sitting on the shelf.


So you're building a new rig for yourself with the better chip? Or you're using the worse chip for a build for the kids? I'm still confused, lol, sorry its been a long day, I had a $800 double bevel compound miter saw break down on me and two almost brand new nail guns die and I've been ripping apart tools, looking at part schematics, and scratching my head as to how every bearing in a saw could pop.

The cool thing is I went to my local hardware stores where I buy all my tools and I'm friends with the repairman's Son, so we got to work on them in a shop with all the tools and spare parts needed. And some other guys helped. That's what's cool about a small town, locally owned hardware store, dudes just hang out there. It's kind of like this thread only for power tools, lol.


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> This is what i would if i were u, then give your current rig to your kids. and i like that idea with the h220 and extra rad
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569 8gb of ram for free with up7 so u dont need new ram just switch it out
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139014
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226226
> 2 of these http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146096


He'd probably be better off getting a Titan (or two) when it releases, and maybe one of Corsair's digital power supplies.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139041


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*


LOL I didn't mean you!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quick everyone ship Ivan a bunch of DIMMs!!!!
> So you're building a new rig for yourself with the better chip? Or you're using the worse chip for a build for the kids? I'm still confused, lol, sorry its been a long day, I had a $800 double bevel compound miter saw break down on me and two almost brand new nail guns die and I've been ripping apart tools, looking at part schematics, and scratching my head as to how every bearing in a saw could pop.
> 
> The cool thing is I went to my local hardware stores where I buy all my tools and I'm friends with the repairman's Son, so we got to work on them in a shop with all the tools and spare parts needed. And some other guys helped. That's what's cool about a small town, locally owned hardware store, dudes just hang out there. It's kind of like this thread only for power tools, lol.


I like that idea, but shipping is expensive. (Not sure on first class or parcel post, but small flat rate via priority is 17usd)
Hyk0, psc and bbse should cover most bases really, only thing missing is micron d9 ddr3 variants, and some form of hynix bfr for completeness, maybe some Samsung hch9.

That hardware store sounds like fun







You could some wicked cool modding projects with all those tools man








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> He'd probably be better off getting a Titan (or two) when it releases, and maybe one of Corsair's digital power supplies.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139041


One titan should be plenty apparently...but we should wait and see. I'd rather have an unlocked voltage card with non ref designs though.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> He'd probably be better off getting a Titan (or two) when it releases, and maybe one of Corsair's digital power supplies.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139041


the 1200w digital 1 is nice to if u want to go with more than 2 graphic cards in the 600 series but thats if money is not an issue


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> One titan should be plenty apparently...but we should wait and see. I'd rather have an unlocked voltage card with non ref designs though.


Unfortunately you would have to go AMD for that. Hopefully the Titan won't be voltage locked though. The ref design should be adequate, but you can always replace the cooler if you don't like it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the 1200w digital 1 is nice to if u want to go with more than 2 graphic cards in the 600 series


Naw, almost nobody will ever need that much power. You can comfortably run 2 GTX 690's on a quality 850W PSU.


----------



## justanoldman

Lilchronic,
Thanks for the suggestions, but that is a little more than I would like to spend. $1200 on video cards is a lot.

Stickg1,
Sorry, my fault for not being clear. I have my signature rig that is a month old and I will be keeping. I am also using a several year old computer as my second one, it is not listed here anywhere. When I ended up delidding two 3770k I thought I would just sell it, but then I realized you need 35 rep, and after spending a few days answering a lot of new members posts and getting zero rep, I figured I would build a second system. I will give the several year old system to my kids, then I will have my sig rig, and this new build, so two rigs very similar to each other.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Unfortunately you would have to go AMD for that. Hopefully the Titan won't be voltage locked though. The ref design should be adequate, but you can always replace the cooler if you don't like it.
> Naw, almost nobody will ever need that much power. You can comfortably run 2 GTX 690's on a quality 850W PSU.


yea now u dont really need that much power but my brothers i7 920 with 3 gtx 480s does lol . my rig uses about 350w @ load his uses that at idle


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Unfortunately you would have to go AMD for that. Hopefully the Titan won't be voltage locked though. The ref design should be adequate, but you can always replace the cooler if you don't like it.
> Naw, almost nobody will ever need that much power. You can comfortably run 2 GTX 690's on a quality 850W PSU.


Yep, that was exactly what I meant...I had a 670 and felt quite underpowered at benchmarking, didn't feel like hardmodding an expensive gpu so I sold it for some profit.
And I'd rather have non ref power designs like Asus or GB or Msi's for dice or ln2 action. But for gaming a titan should be an amazing card if it's not outrageously expensive one.


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Oh for financial traders or analytics I highly suggest 16-32gb of ram. But for most people even gamers and people who video render like me 8gb is more than enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for the asus discussion: My rma was treated as a 'special' favour. Not even an actual rma. That was 2yrs ago.
> When I bought my new z77 I made sure I could rma for 5yrs at scan uk. I'll never have to contact asus for the next 5yrs. That's what I want.
> 
> What annoys me is that I paid a premium for the look and name. The performance has been adequate, nothing amazing. More so, the bios is nice, but I don't go in the bios every day. As long as one can get used to the bios of any motherboard, then that's enough.


Your mistake is/was buying from Scan, not from buying Asus.
I live a few miles down the road from Scan and I would never buy anything from them, they are notoriously bad and have a terrible reputation when it comes to taking broken hardware back not to mention all the other dodgy dealings they get up to, take a look at their "Scansure" deal they have going, your basically paying for your statutory rights if you decide to take it out. That alone is a big enough reason why you should avoid them like the plague...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> LOL I didn't mean you!!!


Couldn't resist, it was just too easy to bold it.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Unfortunately you would have to go AMD for that. Hopefully the Titan won't be voltage locked though. The ref design should be adequate, but you can always replace the cooler if you don't like it.
> Naw, almost nobody will ever need that much power. You can comfortably run 2 GTX 690's on a quality 850W PSU.


Dunno about that, 2 x 680s with a 5Ghz cpu can pull 1000w, little bit of voltage to the gpus can pull a lot of watts. Not talking frozen with high volts, air cooled with less than 100mV added.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Lilchronic,
> Thanks for the suggestions, but that is a little more than I would like to spend. $1200 on video cards is a lot.
> 
> Stickg1,
> Sorry, my fault for not being clear. I have my signature rig that is a month old and I will be keeping. I am also using a several year old computer as my second one, it is not listed here anywhere. When I ended up delidding two 3770k I thought I would just sell it, but then I realized you need 35 rep, and after spending a few days answering a lot of new members posts and getting zero rep, I figured I would build a second system. I will give the several year old system to my kids, then I will have my sig rig, and this new build, so two rigs very similar to each other.


yea that is pretty crazy for cards but dam i want two lol. i plan on adding another 670ftw to my rig but i want one that can overclock over 1300mhz/3600mhz to match my current 1


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> This is a Long post, asking for help/advice on a second build.
> 
> I put it in a spoiler in case someone doesn't want to read through it, but I would very much appreciate any help.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hey you clicked to look! Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I should make a thread for this at some point, but since you guys are so experienced I would appreciate any input on it. Since I can't sell my fist delidded 3770k I figured I would just build another system and give the old one I am using now to the kids. I always have two computers, just in case something goes wrong. You can see my current specs in my signature rig, and with this one I figured I would do a few upgrades. I am not really trying to stay in any specific budget, just get a nice system for a reasonable price, but at this point I have a litte more money than time. Anything that saves me time is a good thing.
> 
> Anything I should change?
> 
> What I already have:
> CPU: 3770k overclocked, delidded, lapped
> 
> Thinking about:
> Case:
> NZXT Switch 810 (I was told this is a good choice for two radiators for the H220)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146089
> 
> Cooling:
> Swiftech H220, (plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well)
> http://www.swiftech.com/H220.aspx
> 
> SSD:
> Crucial M4 256gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-148-443
> or possibly
> Samsung 840 pro 256gb (seems faster, but I don't know if it is more reliable or not)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147193
> 
> HDD:
> Just for backups, extra storage:
> Western Digital Black 7200rpm 1tb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533
> 
> Video card: (this is something I am really not sure about)
> I know most here think AMD>Nvidia, but I already have a EVGA GTX 670, so I am very inclined to go with another EVGA simply to save time when updating drivers, looking for tech support, warranty, RMA etc. It will definitely be more work for me to have Nvidia in one system and AMD in the other.
> The one thing I know for sure is that I want to cool this GPU with the Swiftech H220, and I know nothing about that so I need a card that can be water-cooled without too much trouble. Will be gaming on either 2560x1600 or possibly 3 monitor surround at 1920x1200 for each of the 3.
> With that in mind:
> EVGA GTX 670 FTW 2gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130787
> or more $
> EVGA GTX 670 4gb FTW+
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
> or even more $$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb FTW+ w/backplate
> or $$$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb Classified
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801
> 
> PSU
> Corsair AX850 (I think it is more than I need now, but not sure what else I will add later)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139015&Tpk=ax850
> 
> Memory:
> G.Skill Trident X 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231589
> 
> Motherboard:
> I have a Maximus V Formula, which I am happy with so far. I have heard good things about Gigabyte but then I would have to learn a whole new BIOS, which doesn't seem worth the time unless I am missing something.
> Asus ROG MVF
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
> or save some $
> Asus ROG Maximus V Gene
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
> This is a smaller board which I would put in my old case and move the MVF to the new case, if I go that way.
> 
> If you have made it this far, your help is very much appreciated. Thank you!!


Dmanstasiu, Lilchronic, Snuckie7,
Thanks for the suggestions, +rep


----------



## Swag

I keep hearing the Titan is going to cost $1200, anyone got any proof or anything like that? Should I go for a 700-series card or buy a 600-series card when it goes down a bit after the release of the new line?


----------



## Snuckie7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Couldn't resist, it was just too easy to bold it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dunno about that, 2 x 680s with a 5Ghz cpu can pull 1000w, little bit of voltage to the gpus can pull a lot of watts. Not talking frozen with high volts, air cooled with less than 100mV added.


Unless you have a SB-E CPU pulling ridiculous power from the wall, I don't see how 2 680's with only a 100mV offset and a CPU at 5GHz could ever add up to 1kW.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Wait and see Swag...we don't know squat yet, only a bunch of rumors. Wait till the 18th


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Wait and see Swag...we don't know squat yet, only a bunch of rumors. Wait till the 18th


GRRRRR! I just learned that this iGPU has problems, waaay too many problems. The iGPU keeps on crashing during gaming and it's getting annoying!


----------



## MikeG

MSI's recommended voltages for VDIMM and other voltages on the Ivybridge platform

(right click, open link in new window)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Your mistake is/was buying from Scan, not from buying Asus.
> I live a few miles down the road from Scan and I would never buy anything from them, they are notoriously bad and have a terrible reputation when it comes to taking broken hardware back not to mention all the other dodgy dealings they get up to, take a look at their "Scansure" deal they have going, your basically paying for your statutory rights if you decide to take it out. That alone is a big enough reason why you should avoid them like the plague...


Well when it came to the RMA of my RAM - they were very efficient and very fast in the turn-around.
I'm glad I bought from Scan - great tech support, and more so great customer service.
I won't accept them refusing the RMA for my sabertooth, but I would accept them refusing the RMA of my Antec 920 for example.

It is ironic that the only parts that have gone "bad" are the ones that I bought from Scan - but that's EXACTLY the reason WHY I chose to buy it from them.
If something goes wrong - I have someone to go to, for X amount of years.

List of things I got from Scan:
-Board -> due to them honouring 5years warranty
-RAM -> due to them honouring the full warranty
-PSU
-Cooler

Things I got from Amazon (things that are known to be 100% fine no matter how you look at it):
-CPU
-Screen
-Fans

Other parts that I got from OCUK:
-Fans
-GPU
-Dust cover
-Mouse mat

I chose selectively and even at times paid a little premium to go with the sellers I went for.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Couldn't resist, it was just too easy to bold it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dunno about that, 2 x 680s with a 5Ghz cpu can pull 1000w, little bit of voltage to the gpus can pull a lot of watts. Not talking frozen with high volts, air cooled with less than 100mV added.
> 
> 
> 
> Unless you have a SB-E CPU pulling ridiculous power from the wall, I don't see how 2 680's with only a 100mV offset and a CPU at 5GHz could ever add up to 1kW.
Click to expand...

They draw more power than you might think overclocked.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Menthol*
> 
> FTW, should the power that is supplied thru the pcie slot be added to that, or am I off base
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't think of that, the mobo & everything but the gpu was powered from one PSU, Just the 2 x pci-e plugs running off the second PSU. I'll throw in the 2nd lightning & just test the single psu with 2 x 680, I'm running a 2600k right now but should be similar power draw to a 3770k for a whole system test.
> 
> Edit: *It was a bit of a shocker, went to try with 2600k at 4.5Ghz, 2 x 680L at 1400/1752, +100mV. Got a full rig shutdown in gt1, 1080W showing on the meter. Tried cards completely stock volts & clocks (ln2 bios), pulls 756w from the wall.
> OCed +100 on the core & +499 mem (1307/1752), no added volts, 820w from the wall. Added 50mV with same clock, 900w from the wall.
> Only extras attached to the mobo are 2 case fans & 1 ssd. Cooling is externally powered.*
Click to expand...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> They draw more power than you might think overclocked.


...far more !









3770K
@ stock Tjmax = 77watts, @ 5.2 Ghz over 200 watts (close to 3x Tjmax stock)...just finished some benching @ 5.3 w/SLI oc'ed 670, realized I better hurry up and install that Corsair AX1200 lying in the floor


----------



## Snuckie7

Well I stand corrected.

It's surprising how much a little voltage will do.


----------



## lilchronic

maybe this is why my 670 throttles when i hit 140% power target with the modded bios @ 1.2v it cant take that much wattage?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Well I stand corrected.
> 
> It's surprising how much a little voltage will do.


...no matter whether your name is Ivan, Bill, Will or Johnson


----------



## B3g5l

Well tonight is a huge piss off! I decided to hell with it I am tired of waiting and want to play. So I set out to rip the lid off of my 3570k. It all looked simple enough to do. I started trying to get the blade to slide under the lid and just could not get under it for the life of me. I spent about half an hour going around it trying to find a gap in the bloody thing with no luck at all. Then I saw one of my small pin removal tools that looked as it would help get under to start this along. It did not. At that point I got mad and rammy and now my cpu is a paper weight.







Lesson learned not to do stuff after work when I'm already having no patience. I'm not turned away from this idea though and will try again with my new one. lol I have read a few of the guides all over the net about this but still didnt help me. Any advice anyone can give on getting the bloody knife in to start this? Are some of the lids tighter then others? Mine had no gap at all around the thing. So mad at myself right now. I hate this other computer and well already miss mine. Bah!!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> Well tonight is a huge piss off! I decided to hell with it I am tired of waiting and want to play. So I set out to rip the lid off of my 3570k. It all looked simple enough to do. I started trying to get the blade to slide under the lid and just could not get under it for the life of me. I spent about half an hour going around it trying to find a gap in the bloody thing with no luck at all. Then I saw one of my small pin removal tools that looked as it would help get under to start this along. It did not. At that point I got mad and rammy and now my cpu is a paper weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lesson learned not to do stuff after work when I'm already having no patience. I'm not turned away from this idea though and will try again with my new one. lol I have read a few of the guides all over the net about this but still didnt help me. Any advice anyone can give on getting the bloody knife in to start this? Are some of the lids tighter then others? Mine had no gap at all around the thing. So mad at myself right now. I hate this other computer and well already miss mine. Bah!!


What type of razor blade did you use?


----------



## stickg1

Well I got my Q6600 to replace the Celeron D 356 I was using. Figured I would delid the celey for kicks. Well, apparently mine was soldered. I knew the temps were way too good for there to be TIM under the lid, I mean I was running about 60C with it overclock to 4.7GHz...

Oh well, I think its gonna be no good now, I might glue it back together, drill a hole in the corner, and use it for a fashionable keychain!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> Well tonight is a huge piss off! I decided to hell with it I am tired of waiting and want to play. So I set out to rip the lid off of my 3570k. It all looked simple enough to do. I started trying to get the blade to slide under the lid and just could not get under it for the life of me. I spent about half an hour going around it trying to find a gap in the bloody thing with no luck at all. Then I saw one of my small pin removal tools that looked as it would help get under to start this along. It did not. At that point I got mad and rammy and now my cpu is a paper weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lesson learned not to do stuff after work when I'm already having no patience. I'm not turned away from this idea though and will try again with my new one. lol I have read a few of the guides all over the net about this but still didnt help me. Any advice anyone can give on getting the bloody knife in to start this? Are some of the lids tighter then others? Mine had no gap at all around the thing. So mad at myself right now. I hate this other computer and well already miss mine. Bah!!


You have to be extremely patient - I spent a good majority of 15mins trying to find one single opening - basically you have to wiggle it.
Sorry to hear about your chip









Valguar - I will make a video of my de-lid (once i have my rig back).

Remember -> I video'ed everything I did.
I will make a commentary over it too, explaining the process and what to do.

EDIT:
Might be criminal to de-lid mum's i3...


----------



## B3g5l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What type of razor blade did you use?


I was using one like this one in the pic. I thought it was thin enough to get under anything.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeTesla*
> 
> Batch 3227C140
> Made in Costa Rica
> 
> Just tried 1600 ram, 5ghz and 1.575volts, Cinebench is crashing.
> Set the PLL at 1.65.


What are your max temps when running 5.0GHz? I can get a pretty stable 5.0 as long as I keep my temps below 62.


----------



## B3g5l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> You have to be extremely patient - I spent a good majority of 15mins trying to find one single opening - basically you have to wiggle it.
> Sorry to hear about your chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Valguar - I will make a video of my de-lid (once i have my rig back).
> 
> Remember -> I video'ed everything I did.
> I will make a commentary over it too, explaining the process and what to do.
> 
> EDIT:
> Might be criminal to de-lid mum's i3...


I was trying to wiggle away but all I seemed to do is make a mark around the lid. I couldnt get under at all. I probably should have waited till the weekend to be honest. I'm going to try to get warranty on the chip. Worst they can say is no. lol Its 2 days off of a month old so maybe the store will let me and not know. lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lol you'll need to glue it back together though!


----------



## B3g5l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Lol you'll need to glue it back together though!


Its still together. I never did get it apart. I do have to do something with the scratches though in the board from when I got mad and rammy though. Its fortunate that my work has green as its company color and has about 30 paints that we spray on equipment to id it at job sites though. I know we will have the right shade of fake board... lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> GRRRRR! I just learned that this iGPU has problems, waaay too many problems. The iGPU keeps on crashing during gaming and it's getting annoying!


Odd...no gpu atm right? Grab a cheapo one from fleabay, plenty of auctions. You could go with a dual gpu like a 4870x2 lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> Its still together. I never did get it apart. I do have to do something with the scratches though in the board from when I got mad and rammy though. Its fortunate that my work has green as its company color and has about 30 paints that we spray on equipment to id it at job sites though. I know we will have the right shade of fake board... lol


Yo don't discuss those shady matters here guys...haven't you been following the thread?








You might wanna get a flexible blade next time, gillette razor and a very thin but sturdy plastic card like a license or something.
Cut through one corner only with the razor, but curve it into a U shape, thus preventing any possibility of scratching the pcb and fitting under the tiniest gap. Then cut through the rest of the glue using a plastic object.

@Stickg1, sorry to hear about the dead Celly...they are great overclockers shame it didn't make it.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> GRRRRR! I just learned that this iGPU has problems, waaay too many problems. The iGPU keeps on crashing during gaming and it's getting annoying!
> 
> 
> 
> Odd...no gpu atm right? Grab a cheapo one from fleabay, plenty of auctions. You could go with a dual gpu like a 4870x2 lol
Click to expand...

I've learned that buying from eBay is nothing but trouble...







If only it was reliable, I think it'd be best to just wait a bit longer and only watch movies and browse the internet. I'll probably just play on my xbox.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've learned that buying from eBay is nothing but trouble...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If only it was reliable, I think it'd be best to just wait a bit longer and only watch movies and browse the internet. I'll probably just play on my xbox.


Depending on what you buy...I know a guy who's selling a bunch of old cards for dirt cheap. You could get one of those, and later bench them and volt mod them xD
Valgaur might buy them from ya too lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've learned that buying from eBay is nothing but trouble...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If only it was reliable, I think it'd be best to just wait a bit longer and only watch movies and browse the internet. I'll probably just play on my xbox.
> 
> 
> 
> Depending on what you buy...I know a guy who's selling a bunch of old cards for dirt cheap. You could get one of those, and later bench them and volt mod them xD
> Valgaur might buy them from ya too lol
Click to expand...

Lol, who?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You're after the vrise! I usually try to avoid vrise & would put LLC at a setting equal to or slightly lower than the Idle. Like 1.4V idle -->1.39 - 1.4V load. Gotta watch the transient voltage spikes you can't see when on air & water & playing at high vcore.
> Almost forgot about blackviper's site, that was where I learned most of my OS stripping, great guides!
> The memory overclocks are mainly noticeable in benchmarks, but the performance is increased, you may not notice it the same way in daily things, but it's there. It is just harder to see without some kind of score or number at the end to compare with.
> 
> That is only speculation. 1.65V vdimm is fine with every intel ddr3 platform, & ivy is better than many with vdimm tolerance.
> As Ivan points out intel says memory supported is 1600Mhz, & if asked intel tech support will say it isn't safe to overclock a cpu.
> 
> Besides, you would rip the head off your cpu for better clocks, but think twice about feeding the memory a bit of voltage?


either way I prefer to Overclock much differently than most people and I like it that way more than the normal way








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> LOL I didn't mean you!!!


To late now FtW is getting himself ready!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> GRRRRR! I just learned that this iGPU has problems, waaay too many problems. The iGPU keeps on crashing during gaming and it's getting annoying!


why use the igpu?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> Well tonight is a huge piss off! I decided to hell with it I am tired of waiting and want to play. So I set out to rip the lid off of my 3570k. It all looked simple enough to do. I started trying to get the blade to slide under the lid and just could not get under it for the life of me. I spent about half an hour going around it trying to find a gap in the bloody thing with no luck at all. Then I saw one of my small pin removal tools that looked as it would help get under to start this along. It did not. At that point I got mad and rammy and now my cpu is a paper weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lesson learned not to do stuff after work when I'm already having no patience. I'm not turned away from this idea though and will try again with my new one. lol I have read a few of the guides all over the net about this but still didnt help me. Any advice anyone can give on getting the bloody knife in to start this? Are some of the lids tighter then others? Mine had no gap at all around the thing. So mad at myself right now. I hate this other computer and well already miss mine. Bah!!


Show us some pictures..... Also that's extremely rare that you find a chip that has no space, especially how the glue is on Ivy bridge. give us some more info and we can dig into this one.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> You have to be extremely patient - I spent a good majority of 15mins trying to find one single opening - basically you have to wiggle it.
> Sorry to hear about your chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Valguar - I will make a video of my de-lid (once i have my rig back).
> 
> Remember -> I video'ed everything I did.
> I will make a commentary over it too, explaining the process and what to do.
> 
> EDIT:
> Might be criminal to de-lid mum's i3...


I am thinking about delidding it this weekend...... been tempted enough for a while now and I hate having a 70C exhaust pipe for folding. So I wont be making much of a video since my lappy is gone but I will be taking lots of pictures. I'd still really like to make a video thoguh as I am the Captain here..... I need a webcam.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> I was using one like this one in the pic. I thought it was thin enough to get under anything.


Now thats whats odd..... hmmm
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Depending on what you buy...I know a guy who's selling a bunch of old cards for dirt cheap. You could get one of those, and later bench them and volt mod them xD
> Valgaur might buy them from ya too lol


PM me and I'll see what he has and what monies I can scrape up lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Odd...no gpu atm right? Grab a cheapo one from fleabay, plenty of auctions. You could go with a dual gpu like a 4870x2 lol
> Yo don't discuss those shady matters here guys...haven't you been following the thread?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You might wanna get a flexible blade next time, gillette razor and a very thin but sturdy plastic card like a license or something.
> Cut through one corner only with the razor, but curve it into a U shape, thus preventing any possibility of scratching the pcb and fitting under the tiniest gap. Then cut through the rest of the glue using a plastic object.
> 
> @Stickg1, sorry to hear about the dead Celly...they are great overclockers shame it didn't make it.


It might still work but do I have to scrape all the solder off? I don't really feel the need to use it though, I have a Q6600 now and that computer is more for the kids to use so I don't have to share my computer. They could care less if Dad has their Q6600 OC'd to 4.0GHz or not, lol. They just want to play SpongeBob


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, who?


A guy from OCF, Earthdog...quite a nice fella too.
He had a bunch of old radeon cards, which perform ok for gaming on low and at a ridiculously low price. You won't be able to see the listing though cause of the classifieds restriction (100 posts).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It might still work but do I have to scrape all the solder off? I don't really feel the need to use it though, I have a Q6600 now and that computer is more for the kids to use so I don't have to share my computer. They could care less if Dad has their Q6600 OC'd to 4.0GHz or not, lol. They just want to play SpongeBob


lol but Sponge Bob at 4ghz feels so much smoother!








Your board could handle a 3.6ghz oc easily...4ghz would be harder.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> A guy from OCF, Earthdog...quite a nice fella too.
> He had a bunch of old radeon cards, which perform ok for gaming on low and at a ridiculously low price. You won't be able to see the listing though cause of the classifieds restriction (100 posts).
> lol but Sponge Bob at 4ghz feels so much smoother!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your board could handle a 3.6ghz oc easily...4ghz would be harder.


I think I can't get passed 3.4GHz with this board. Might even be the chip. Anytime I try to stress test it over 3.4GHz the PC shuts off after about 20 seconds. The CPU isn't overheating, I think the VRMs are overheating. Or the chip just isn't up for the job. I tried at 1.5v and still no luck.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> GRRRRR! I just learned that this iGPU has problems, waaay too many problems. The iGPU keeps on crashing during gaming and it's getting annoying!
> 
> 
> 
> why use the igpu?
Click to expand...

Sadly my old GPUs died in the PSU mishap and Corsair refused to reimburse me.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sadly my old GPUs died in the PSU mishap and Corsair refused to reimburse me.


Corsair strikes again.... Make a thread wait 6 months and they will..

I used to have a pro Corsair system since there horror storys it has went all the way down to just a corsair PSU..

And id be more then happy to trade my corsair psu for another form another company of equal build Quality..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I think I can't get passed 3.4GHz with this board. Might even be the chip. Anytime I try to stress test it over 3.4GHz the PC shuts off after about 20 seconds. The CPU isn't overheating, I think the VRMs are overheating. Or the chip just isn't up for the job. I tried at 1.5v and still no luck.


May be the chip, or your crappy ram man.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Corsair strikes again.... Make a thread wait 6 months and they will..
> 
> I used to have a pro Corsair system since there horror storys it has went all the way down to just a corsair PSU..
> 
> And id be more then happy to trade my corsair psu for another form another company of equal build Quality..


Just get Seasonic products and voila...Actually their newer units are not even Seasonic, they use some other oem now. (My tx750 is CWT and is solid though...)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sadly my old GPUs died in the PSU mishap and Corsair refused to reimburse me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corsair strikes again.... Make a thread wait 6 months and they will..
> 
> I used to have a pro Corsair system since there horror storys it has went all the way down to just a corsair PSU..
> 
> And id be more then happy to trade my corsair psu for another form another company of equal build Quality..
Click to expand...

Seasonic.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

You're kidding me right Swag? They aren't replacing it!?
What about Intel !?

You're not lucky it seems with these companies. Maybe you're too soft on them


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> You're kidding me right Swag? They aren't replacing it!?
> What about Intel !?
> 
> You're not lucky it seems with these companies. Maybe you're too soft on them


Not Intel either, they said it was "physically damaged" as concluded by the head supervisor of the warranty team. I yelled at them and when they yelled back at me, I asked my dad to talk to them. He yelled at them and then the worker started saying I said I engraved the markings on myself even though he heard my entire conversation with the Intel person and I never said anything like that. He yelled even more and he is in the process of making a lot of complaints against that one worker, he even had his friends call in about the worker.


----------



## Joa3d43

...per earlier posts, did some *'stock Turbo 3.9 Ghz*' to '*delid-or-go-zap 5.3 Ghz'* memory and CPU queen bench marks today...lots of tables to compare not only with 3770k speeds but also cross-platform courtesy of Aida64 Extreme...will post link later but thought that *Valgaur* and the delid crew deserve a quick peak first - drenched in soft neon-glow


----------



## lngu81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll wait to admit you myself but your in the spreadsheet lol, I want the OC results for the rest of the admittance lol


Thank you sir, doing my 24hrs stable test now, I will send the result your way soon:thumb:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...per earlier posts, did some *'stock Turbo 3.9 Ghz*' to '*delid-or-go-zap 5.3 Ghz'* memory and CPU queen bench marks today...lots of tables to compare not only with 3770k speeds but also cross-platform courtesy of Aida64 Extreme...will post link later but thought that *Valgaur* and the delid crew deserve a quick peak first - drenched in soft neon-glow


Very cool!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lngu81*
> 
> Thank you sir, doing my 24hrs stable test now, I will send the result your way soon:thumb:


I'll be waiting


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Snuckie7*
> 
> Unless you have a SB-E CPU pulling ridiculous power from the wall, I don't see how 2 680's with only a 100mV offset and a CPU at 5GHz could ever add up to 1kW.


That is also the pull from the wall, factoring in efficiency about 800W used. More pointing out that when looking at stock watts on review sites, the watt numbers can change a lot with overclocking.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> either way *I prefer to Overclock much differently than most people* and I like it that way more than the normal way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To late now FtW is getting himself ready!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> why use the igpu?
> Show us some pictures..... Also that's extremely rare that you find a chip that has no space, especially how the glue is on Ivy bridge. give us some more info and we can dig into this one.
> I am thinking about delidding it this weekend...... been tempted enough for a while now and I hate having a 70C exhaust pipe for folding. So I wont be making much of a video since my lappy is gone but I will be taking lots of pictures. I'd still really like to make a video thoguh as I am the Captain here..... I need a webcam.
> Now thats whats odd..... hmmm
> PM me and I'll see what he has and what monies I can scrape up lol.


I understand this well! Pretty much why I didn't spend much time in the cpu section before this club got rolling...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I think I can't get passed 3.4GHz with this board. Might even be the chip. Anytime I try to stress test it over 3.4GHz the PC shuts off after about 20 seconds. The CPU isn't overheating, I think the VRMs are overheating. Or the chip just isn't up for the job. I tried at 1.5v and still no luck.


Could just be a bum board, or the memory settings aren't playing nice. Are the VRMs getting hot to the touch?
It is possible it could be the cpu, that would just be about the worst cpu ever though...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is also the pull from the wall, factoring in efficiency about 800W used. More pointing out that when looking at stock watts on review sites, the watt numbers can change a lot with overclocking.
> *I understand this well! Pretty much why I didn't spend much time in the cpu section before this club got rolling...*
> Could just be a bum board, or the memory settings aren't playing nice. Are the VRMs getting hot to the touch?
> It is possible it could be the cpu, that would just be about the worst cpu ever though...


Then I came rolling through and was swinging around vcore like nothing and you guys were like... dude.... take it easy there







I love the way I OC, I through my own formulas at it and get my OC's stable and ready in under 10 minutes.... it stinks that it's mobo determinant though. so every mobo I need to know that, ugh.


----------



## chann3l

Nobody ever cares when I post new photos of my watercooling in the water cooling club thread and I post a lot of unrelated stuff here so here is some more













Enjoy!! unless of course you don't like it lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Very cool!


...here ya go, 5.3 giggles beating up on 8 core and 12 core thingamajigs







http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/thinking-of-overclocking-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-stock-turbo-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz#post_19295015


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Nobody ever cares when I post new photos of my watercooling in the water cooling club thread and I post a lot of unrelated stuff here so here is some more
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enjoy!! unless of course you don't like it lol


This is why I can't wait to do my WC loop this summer. much fun to be had!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...here ya go, 5.3 giggles beating up on 8 core and 12 core thingamajigs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/thinking-of-overclocking-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-stock-turbo-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz#post_19295015


Great read! Well put as well.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> This is why I can't wait to do my WC loop this summer. much fun to be had!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great read! Well put as well.


Its probably one of the most fun things I've done to a computer. It is also never ending lol always something else to add.







post lots of pics once its built.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Its probably one of the most fun things I've done to a computer. It is also never ending lol always something else to add.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> post lots of pics once its built.


...glad to hear - it's what I will be doing this weekend


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...glad to hear - it's what I will be doing this weekend


Nice which one of those cpu blocks are you gonna use? that black koolance looks nice.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Nice which one of those cpu blocks are you gonna use? that black koolance looks nice.


...the Koolance (the Coollaboratory 'Alpheos' is going onto another machine later)...also, given my 'bloody' delidding experience, the Bloodred EK Liquid and 'Bloodshed Red' hoses kind of fit, even though I bought that before - an omen ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Coolaboratory block!?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Coolaboratory block!?


...yup - the thing in the center


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the Koolance (the Coollaboratory 'Alpheos' is going onto another machine later)...also, given my 'bloody' delidding experience, the Bloodred EK Liquid and 'Bloodshed Red' hoses kind of fit, even though I bought that before - an omen ?


lol that's kind of funny. And my cool blue fits cause I didn't cut myself at all while delidding







j/k thats rad tho. I want to pick up the xspc razor 7970 full coverage bloack and add my gpu soon


----------



## ivanlabrie

They should give them out for free, for the crewmen lol


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> They should give them out for free, for the crewmen lol


that would be a lot of cpu blocks...i'll take one


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> lol that's kind of funny. And my cool blue fits cause I didn't cut myself at all while delidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> j/k thats rad tho. I want to pick up the xspc razor 7970 full coverage bloack and add my gpu soon


...also going from SLI GTX 670 to tri-SLI on the weekend (got to stay amused until there is a good supply of Titans







) - have been checking out EK full cover blocks for the cards (Asus DirectCUiiT), but instead will go for generic GPU blocks and try to come up with some WC connections for the VRMs - s.th. I can transfer later to the Titans


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> They should give them out for free, for the crewmen lol


Ugh I still need to contact those guys about this thread and the amount of PR we give them lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Their sales must have gone up by 30% or something already...lol
We deserve some goodies, right?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Their sales must have gone up by 30% or something already...lol
> We deserve some goodies, right?


agreed show me the goods lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Their sales must have gone up by 30% or something already...lol
> We deserve some goodies, right?


I'll do this tomorrow and see what they say.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...quick question:
> 
> When I delidded, the tail end of the affair got hurried a bit because of an injury and also bad lighting. I used CL-U (the right amount) on just the die - then put the whole thing back together quickly with a temp MX4 on the IHS, given the unique circumstances.
> 
> I know that the IHS is seated just a bit too far back by about .75mm to 1mm (I overcompensated the 'forward slide' of the IHS when closing the lever but was also literally bleeding onto the assembly so I hurried it as I could not push down on the IHS when closing the CPU locking mechanism).
> 
> I know the die is not touching any sides of the IHS, and initial temp gains (just CL-U on die; 12 to 15 C gain) have been impressive given the less-than-perfect, temporary IHS to cooler mount.
> 
> When I go back in to finish the job and also install a new custom loop, would you take the IHS off again (while leaving the CPU seated on the socket), re-apply CL-U onto the (carefully cleaned) die AS WELL AS the underside of the IHS - or just leave well enough alone...I rather not take out the CPU ever again - and it is benching with ok temps even now upwards of 5.3.
> 
> I guess I am also asking how much gain can be had from an 'extra' CL-U layer underneath the IHS, not just the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks everyone for your input !


if everything works like it should, i wouldnt take it apart again,
even though the ihs is not seated perfectly..

i did all sides with liquid pro, had a 30+C tempdrop
if you apply the right amount, it doesnt matter if you use 1 layer on the die only,
or 2 thin layers on the die and under/inside ihs,
i think 20-30C temp drops should be possible..

anyways, if youre happy with the temps you have now, i wouldnt change anything,
"never change a winning team" right..
i had a few situations where i thought , hmm if i do this, it might be better,
and only made things worse ...lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> MSI's recommended voltages for VDIMM and other voltages on the Ivybridge platform
> 
> (right click, open link in new window)


thats a great chart to use MikeG, thanks alot








looks like most of us have "fun" ...lol and some enjoy the "danger" zone (vcore wise) ..hehe


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...quick question:
> 
> When I delidded, the tail end of the affair got hurried a bit because of an injury and also bad lighting. I used CL-U (the right amount) on just the die - then put the whole thing back together quickly with a temp MX4 on the IHS, given the unique circumstances.
> 
> I know that the IHS is seated just a bit too far back by about .75mm to 1mm (I overcompensated the 'forward slide' of the IHS when closing the lever but was also literally bleeding onto the assembly so I hurried it as I could not push down on the IHS when closing the CPU locking mechanism).
> 
> I know the die is not touching any sides of the IHS, and initial temp gains (just CL-U on die; 12 to 15 C gain) have been impressive given the less-than-perfect, temporary IHS to cooler mount.
> 
> When I go back in to finish the job and also install a new custom loop, would you take the IHS off again (while leaving the CPU seated on the socket), re-apply CL-U onto the (carefully cleaned) die AS WELL AS the underside of the IHS - or just leave well enough alone...I rather not take out the CPU ever again - and it is benching with ok temps even now upwards of 5.3.
> 
> I guess I am also asking how much gain can be had from an 'extra' CL-U layer underneath the IHS, not just the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks everyone for your input !


Don't even think of touching it, temps are great as it is. don't play with it for chances of ruining that.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> This is a Long post, asking for help/advice on a second build.
> 
> I put it in a spoiler in case someone doesn't want to read through it, but I would very much appreciate any help.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hey you clicked to look! Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I should make a thread for this at some point, but since you guys are so experienced I would appreciate any input on it. Since I can't sell my fist delidded 3770k I figured I would just build another system and give the old one I am using now to the kids. I always have two computers, just in case something goes wrong. You can see my current specs in my signature rig, and with this one I figured I would do a few upgrades. I am not really trying to stay in any specific budget, just get a nice system for a reasonable price, but at this point I have a litte more money than time. Anything that saves me time is a good thing.
> 
> Anything I should change?
> 
> What I already have:
> CPU: 3770k overclocked, delidded, lapped
> 
> Thinking about:
> Case:
> NZXT Switch 810 (I was told this is a good choice for two radiators for the H220)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146089
> 
> Cooling:
> Swiftech H220, (plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well)
> http://www.swiftech.com/H220.aspx
> 
> SSD:
> Crucial M4 256gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-148-443
> or possibly
> Samsung 840 pro 256gb (seems faster, but I don't know if it is more reliable or not)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147193
> 
> HDD:
> Just for backups, extra storage:
> Western Digital Black 7200rpm 1tb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533
> 
> Video card: (this is something I am really not sure about)
> I know most here think AMD>Nvidia, but I already have a EVGA GTX 670, so I am very inclined to go with another EVGA simply to save time when updating drivers, looking for tech support, warranty, RMA etc. It will definitely be more work for me to have Nvidia in one system and AMD in the other.
> The one thing I know for sure is that I want to cool this GPU with the Swiftech H220, and I know nothing about that so I need a card that can be water-cooled without too much trouble. Will be gaming on either 2560x1600 or possibly 3 monitor surround at 1920x1200 for each of the 3.
> With that in mind:
> EVGA GTX 670 FTW 2gb
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130787
> or more $
> EVGA GTX 670 4gb FTW+
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130824
> or even more $$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb FTW+ w/backplate
> or $$$
> EVGA GTX 680 4gb Classified
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130801
> 
> PSU
> Corsair AX850 (I think it is more than I need now, but not sure what else I will add later)
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139015&Tpk=ax850
> 
> Memory:
> G.Skill Trident X 2x8gb, 2400, 10-12-12-31
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231589
> 
> Motherboard:
> I have a Maximus V Formula, which I am happy with so far. I have heard good things about Gigabyte but then I would have to learn a whole new BIOS, which doesn't seem worth the time unless I am missing something.
> Asus ROG MVF
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
> or save some $
> Asus ROG Maximus V Gene
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
> This is a smaller board which I would put in my old case and move the MVF to the new case, if I go that way.
> 
> If you have made it this far, your help is very much appreciated. Thank you!!


...I can comment on some of the items, noting that without knowing (or even wanting to ask) re budget, it is a bit more complex re range of options

...and one good spoiler deserves another










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



*on memory* G.Skill Trident X 2x*

I have been using 32 GB G.Skill in all our new machines and love the Trident X...no problems and quick, have oc'ed them before without any extra volts to 2560...make sure your Asus ROG board has the Ram options set to 'mode 2' on the Trident X









*on the case*

...very good choice, just make sure that you have room for even bigger / more radiators...the way you are going (and I mean that as a compliment), it won't be too long before you will be thinking about a custom loop for your CPU @ 5 Ghz plus with a 360 rad - in addition to another loop / rads for the graphics







. In ""case"" you win the lotto, the Corsair 900D (Godzilla) case will fit your decor per avatar while leaving >>> huge room for expansion

*on the video cards*

I like the GTX 670ies a lot...if you are courageous, they can be heavily modded via custom bios flash (on this site)... good idea to stick with the same model...I'm currently using two Asus 670 Direct CUii 670ies that are modded, with a third one ready to go in on the weekend just for fun (before that one moves to another system later)...using one model can save you a lot of headaches. The question of 2 vs 4 GB of ram per card comes down to the games you play and resolutions...most of the time, 2 GB will be ok unless you play at 5xxx x 25xx.

I am not sure whether your new build WILL inherit a EVGA 670 and you want to go SLI. Given your wish to water-cool the GPUs - and do so with the H220 - EVGA also makes 680s (and 690ies) that are both ready for that and easily connected to the H220 - look for *HydroCopper* 680s on their site which are also clocked *very fas*t and will make it much easier for you to set them up with the H220 (noting a caveat on that below).

In general on video cards, you are looking to do this when the NVidia 'Titans' are just about to come out...from what I have seen, one Titan = two 680s, and it apparently also comes with 6 GB of Vram which solves a lot of other problems down the road, such as the intro of 4k monitors. On the other hand, for the first few months, Titan's will be very expensive - yet their introduction will push the prices down of the video cards you are looking at. I picked my 3rd 670 up last week when it dropped by $40, following some news about Titan.

All said and done, if EVGA drops the prices on their 680 HydroCoppers, that might be your best option re integration with your planned system. Otherwise, a company called 'EK' (Slovakia I think) makes all kinds of full water blocks for 670ies and 680ies, with a price tag of between 90 to 110 EUROs, depending on the specific model.

*HDD*

WD 1TB "Blacks" are the drive of choice for what you are planning in conjunction with SSDs - I use between 3 and 5 of them per system and SSD arrangement.

*Water Cooling*

There you might have a bit of an issue...you mentioned 'Swiftech H220, ("...plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well")'. The Swiftech 220 is the best closed-loop solution now and it does allow you to add GPU cooling...I was thinking along the same lines, re a custom loop I am building that has a 360 double-thick radiator and an industrial strength Swiftech pump (MPC655). But someone with a lot of experience with this pointed out to me that running two GPUs that are oce'ed (never mind 3) AND an oc'ed 5 Ghz PLUS CPU is too much for even that arrangement that has more capacity than the H220. In my case, I will run only a CPU loop now and add a second loop later just for the GPUs....for you, it comes down to whether:

a.) you plan to run SLI 670ies (never mind 680s). Even in stock form, 670ies will use up to 144 watts each...just pushing that 'power target slider' in the video options to 122% will add, well, 2x 22% to that.
b.) how far you want to push your 3770K. In stock form, its 'TjMax is 77 watts...by 5.1 Ghz, its - hard to believe - almost three times as much, and that assumes a chip that can do that at relatively low volts.

All this adds quickly to a massive amount of heat energy you will try to get rid off - just invest $20 or so in a kill-a-watt meter and hook it in between the wall and your current system and run some heavy video benchmarks like ' 3D M Vantage - you will be surprised (I was).

I am saying this because you will spend a lot of time to get rid of heat with an IvyBridge running at about 5 Ghz (+ -), yet reintroduce extra heat in a loop that also includes the GPUs - I know you mentioned TWO 240 mm rads which is a big step in the right direction, but I would NOT be surprised that you sooner or later will consider a full-on custom loop each for CPU and GPUs. One quick item for you to check (as I genuinely don't know) is if you can add a separate pump to assist the H220 pump and may be add a 3rd 240 mm (or a smaller 120) rad. This would allow you to run the H220, but allow it to dissipate close to 1000 watts...and that brings me to the PSU...

*PSU*

I upgraded 3 mth ago from a 650w to an 850w Corsair...after having delidded and benching at 5.3+ as well as adding a 3rd 670, I am looking at that AX1200 lying on the floor waiting for my attention...per above, you want to create some extra headroom for future upgrades, and changing a PSU can be a pain (think of all that cable management...







). I would recommend that you spend the extra dollars and go up to a AX1200

*Motherboard*

I make no secret of the fact that I am an 'Asus' fan (I run 3 different models across 5 machines just in my home office, including a Sabertooth Z77 I like - psst, don't tell TD







), even though Gigabyte for example also makes some great, fast and solid boards. But as you say, you already know the Bios setup; besides, Asus has the most corporate muscle to maintain great services over long periods, i.e. things we need to download etc., including for their boards that are 8 years old or older. Just as as an example, I have to run some older boards re software compatibilities, and I can always find the 'latest' set of drivers, BIOS and utilities from Asus for boards they have not produced for close to a decade.

I run a *Maximus V Extreme* (eATX)...while a bit more expensive, it does have some unique features, including Thunderbolt and especially the 'OC Key' *which you would very much appreciate, judging by your posts.* That said, the Max. Formula and Gene are very similar to it in most other respects...I have 'work plans' for the Max V Extreme down the line when things like Thunderbolt and the extra PCI / Plex expansion slots that are on the Maximus V Extreme will come in handy from a work perspective.

In closing, your choices above are already very solid and very well 'informed' - just keep in mind that business about far more Watts and thus far more cooling and PSU requirements than even a person very good at math tends to assume - and that is before the assured desire to upgrade even more later







....I would think that by about October, you will very seriously want to build an *"IvyB-E' 15 core with Titan SLIs*


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Don't even think of touching it, temps are great as it is. don't play with it for chances of ruining that.


THANKS







- I actually want to never unlock that particular CPU lever again...do they make *chastity belts* for CPU sockets


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> THANKS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I actually want to never unlock that particular CPU lever again...do they make *chastity belts* for CPU sockets


Lol, not quite a lock but makes it a bit of work to get to the latch


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, not quite a lock but makes it a bit of work to get to the latch


^^^







...but what if the CPU has to go to the toilet ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> if everything works like it should, i wouldnt take it apart again,
> even though the ihs is not seated perfectly..
> 
> i did all sides with liquid pro, had a 30+C tempdrop
> if you apply the right amount, it doesnt matter if you use 1 layer on the die only,
> or 2 thin layers on the die and under/inside ihs,
> i think 20-30C temp drops should be possible..
> 
> anyways, if youre happy with the temps you have now, i wouldnt change anything,
> "never change a winning team" right..
> i had a few situations where i thought , hmm if i do this, it might be better,
> and only made things worse ...lol
> thats a great chart to use MikeG, thanks alot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> looks like most of us have "fun" ...lol and some enjoy the "danger" zone (vcore wise) ..hehe


...Thanks VonDutch







per above, decided on a chastity belt for that CPU socket / lever


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Could just be a bum board, or the memory settings aren't playing nice. Are the VRMs getting hot to the touch?
> It is possible it could be the cpu, that would just be about the worst cpu ever though...


If I had the hardware I could probably cook a rotisserie chicken off of the heat the VRM's generate.

But IDK, I think it is the board, I'd hate to dump more money into an old platform. I don't REALLY need to overclock this thing like mad, my kids just want computer access from time to time and they'd be fine with a Pentium 4. But I need to have all my hardware overclocked to the max about to explode, it's just my nature.


----------



## givmedew

Should I just use cool liquid ultra between the core and ihs as well as between the ihs and the waterblock or should I use cool laboratory liquid metal pad or should I use Indigo Extreme?

How many times could one tube do? Could I de-lid 2 cpus and then mount 2 waterblocks with 1 tube?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Should I just use cool liquid ultra between the core and ihs as well as between the ihs and the waterblock or should I use cool laboratory liquid metal pad or should I use Indigo Extreme?
> 
> How many times could one tube do? Could I de-lid 2 cpus and then mount 2 waterblocks with 1 tube?


1 tube can go a long way (as you only need a little bit) - but just remember if you put it ON THE IHS - then you might lose the markings on it.


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Should I just use cool liquid ultra between the core and ihs as well as between the ihs and the waterblock or should I use cool laboratory liquid metal pad or should I use Indigo Extreme?
> 
> How many times could one tube do? Could I de-lid 2 cpus and then mount 2 waterblocks with 1 tube?
> 
> 
> 
> 1 tube can go a long way (as you only need a little bit) - but just remember if you put it ON THE IHS - then you might lose the markings on it.
Click to expand...

What about with the sheet of liquid metal or even the Indigo Extreme? Is that true for them as well? If so then I am def going to lap my CPU and not worry about the warranty. I have never had a cpu fail that wasn't my fault.

I am def doing this because this thing is running over 30c hotter than my 2500k


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Should I just use cool liquid ultra between the core and ihs as well as between the ihs and the waterblock or should I use cool laboratory liquid metal pad or should I use Indigo Extreme?
> 
> How many times could one tube do? Could I de-lid 2 cpus and then mount 2 waterblocks with 1 tube?


Coollabs pro or ultra on the die is a no brainer. I just replaced AS5 between the IHS and cooler and got another 5c or so. I would recommend it in both places, but you may have to try a couple times to find just the right amount to use. You can use the included brush with Ultra and touch it to the tip of the syringe to better control how much you use. I think that is easier than trying to squeeze out one perfectly sized drop, and it will make it last for more than a couple applications.

You can definitely clean off the Coollabs Ultra, I showed before and after pics, it just takes awhile. Since my IHS are lapped though I cannot comment if long term use, then cleaning with metal polish will mess up the Intel markings on the IHS.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> 1 tube can go a long way (as you only need a little bit) - but just remember if you put it ON THE IHS - then you might lose the markings on it.


I did not lose my markings but that may not be everyone. If you use the included Brillo pad you might. I just used bd alcohol swabs and was able to get everything with a bit if scrubbing.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I did not lose my markings but that may not be everyone. If you use the included Brillo pad you might. I just used bd alcohol swabs and was able to get everything with a bit if scrubbing.


ah cool beans!


----------



## megawatz

My CLU is in the mail


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, not quite a lock but makes it a bit of work to get to the latch


Didn't you put the eraser before pressing down the latch there?
I thought that was the way people normally went about it...also that's phase insulation right?








Do you think I can run on air with eraser in the socket? Or am I gonna have to peel it off after each run? :/
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> My CLU is in the mail










awesome! Off with its head!


----------



## DiamondCut

When I got coollabratory as a sponsor I did ask if I could by chance get their waterblock but they simply just didnt reply lol...

Onto other news.... My i5-3570 sucks.... Everytime I leave it priming and I come back its always on a black screen or rebooted to stock settings. I know I can get 4.5 stable but I want 4.8


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> When I got coollabratory as a sponsor I did ask if I could by chance get their waterblock but they simply just didnt reply lol...
> 
> Onto other news.... My i5-3570 sucks.... Everytime I leave it priming and I come back its always on a black screen or rebooted to stock settings. I know I can get 4.5 stable but I want 4.8


is it set to hibernate after a while?
and do you have auto update running in windows?

happened to someone a while ago, he rebooted (while running prime) because windows had to install updates ..lol
the black screen can mean hibernate or sleep too i think..

Edit,
didnt read right, you say it rebooted, and converted back to stock ..srry,
can you retrieve any error codes about it ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, had that happen to me...same as VonDutch here.
Use black viper's config after installing updates and use manual oc without offset nor power saving for testing first.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> is it set to hibernate after a while?
> and do you have auto update running in windows?
> 
> happened to someone a while ago, he rebooted (while running prime) because windows had to install updates ..lol
> the black screen can mean hibernate or sleep too i think..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, had that happen to me...same as VonDutch here.
> Use black viper's config after installing updates and use manual oc without offset nor power saving for testing first.


yea that is most likely what happened... but heres my real problem.... My motherboard doesnt support offset voltage because the VRM's are analog. So If I adjust my core ratio it will disable all speed step and power saving features.... So when I don't leave it and adjust it to clock up to 48 ratio with speed step I have to change the voltage and so that is correlating to me having the cpu idle with 1.42volts.... The odd thing is when it clocks up to 4.8ghz the voltage reading in cpu-z lowers to ~1.40 volts. I don't know if its my vdroop or not but I have that to +100% (which is %200 if I understand that auto is 100% and then the aditional 100%) My temps are fine, I just wan't to get the lowest volts possible so I don't suck the life out of my i5.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think you're fine vcore wise...your chip seems to be a dud, that's all.
Good luck with the oc, and try to test the imc later on. It might have a decent one at least, maybe even 2600mhz or 2800mhz worthy. (seems to be the trend with latest batches)


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think you're fine vcore wise...your chip seems to be a dud, that's all.
> Good luck with the oc, and try to test the imc later on. It might have a decent one at least, maybe even 2600mhz or 2800mhz worthy. (seems to be the trend with latest batches)


I'll give it a go, so what is bothering me is why the voltage is dropping when it clocks up, I want to make sure its not a stability problem and I want to get it as low as possible. I had it stable on 4.5 at 1.32 volts


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> I'll give it a go, so what is bothering me is why the voltage is dropping when it clocks up, I want to make sure its not a stability problem and I want to get it as low as possible. I had it stable on 4.5 at 1.32 volts


what ivan said, you still good with the vcore , np there ..

what do you use to read the vcore, cpu-z?
could be vdroop, even tho you have it set to 100%,
i dont even know what mobo you have, time to fill in your sig DiamondCut ..lol








its not a stability problem when your vcore reading is lower then set in bios,
if it starts to crash maybe, but that could also just mean you need more vcore..


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> what ivan said, you still good with the vcore , np there ..
> 
> what do you use to read the vcore, cpu-z?
> could be vdroop, even tho you have it set to 100%,
> i dont even know what mobo you have, time to fill in your sig DiamondCut ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its not a stability problem when your vcore reading is lower then set in bios,
> if it starts to crash maybe, but that could also just mean you need more vcore..


i have a msi M power z77 board. Im going to keep tweaking it until Im happy and sadly it will probably take me a whole afternoon to be satisfied.

EDIT: So also when using SuperPi I assume I calculate the highest value being 32m?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I can comment on some of the items, noting that without knowing (or even wanting to ask) re budget, it is a bit more complex re range of options
> 
> ...and one good spoiler deserves another
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> *on memory* G.Skill Trident X 2x*
> 
> I have been using 32 GB G.Skill in all our new machines and love the Trident X...no problems and quick, have oc'ed them before without any extra volts to 2560...make sure your Asus ROG board has the Ram options set to 'mode 2' on the Trident X
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *on the case*
> 
> ...very good choice, just make sure that you have room for even bigger / more radiators...the way you are going (and I mean that as a compliment), it won't be too long before you will be thinking about a custom loop for your CPU @ 5 Ghz plus with a 360 rad - in addition to another loop / rads for the graphics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . In ""case"" you win the lotto, the Corsair 900D (Godzilla) case will fit your decor per avatar while leaving >>> huge room for expansion
> 
> *on the video cards*
> 
> I like the GTX 670ies a lot...if you are courageous, they can be heavily modded via custom bios flash (on this site)... good idea to stick with the same model...I'm currently using two Asus 670 Direct CUii 670ies that are modded, with a third one ready to go in on the weekend just for fun (before that one moves to another system later)...using one model can save you a lot of headaches. The question of 2 vs 4 GB of ram per card comes down to the games you play and resolutions...most of the time, 2 GB will be ok unless you play at 5xxx x 25xx.
> 
> I am not sure whether your new build WILL inherit a EVGA 670 and you want to go SLI. Given your wish to water-cool the GPUs - and do so with the H220 - EVGA also makes 680s (and 690ies) that are both ready for that and easily connected to the H220 - look for *HydroCopper* 680s on their site which are also clocked *very fas*t and will make it much easier for you to set them up with the H220 (noting a caveat on that below).
> 
> In general on video cards, you are looking to do this when the NVidia 'Titans' are just about to come out...from what I have seen, one Titan = two 680s, and it apparently also comes with 6 GB of Vram which solves a lot of other problems down the road, such as the intro of 4k monitors. On the other hand, for the first few months, Titan's will be very expensive - yet their introduction will push the prices down of the video cards you are looking at. I picked my 3rd 670 up last week when it dropped by $40, following some news about Titan.
> 
> All said and done, if EVGA drops the prices on their 680 HydroCoppers, that might be your best option re integration with your planned system. Otherwise, a company called 'EK' (Slovakia I think) makes all kinds of full water blocks for 670ies and 680ies, with a price tag of between 90 to 110 EUROs, depending on the specific model.
> 
> *HDD*
> 
> WD 1TB "Blacks" are the drive of choice for what you are planning in conjunction with SSDs - I use between 3 and 5 of them per system and SSD arrangement.
> 
> *Water Cooling*
> 
> There you might have a bit of an issue...you mentioned 'Swiftech H220, ("...plan on adding a second radiator to cool the GPU as well")'. The Swiftech 220 is the best closed-loop solution now and it does allow you to add GPU cooling...I was thinking along the same lines, re a custom loop I am building that has a 360 double-thick radiator and an industrial strength Swiftech pump (MPC655). But someone with a lot of experience with this pointed out to me that running two GPUs that are oce'ed (never mind 3) AND an oc'ed 5 Ghz PLUS CPU is too much for even that arrangement that has more capacity than the H220. In my case, I will run only a CPU loop now and add a second loop later just for the GPUs....for you, it comes down to whether:
> 
> a.) you plan to run SLI 670ies (never mind 680s). Even in stock form, 670ies will use up to 144 watts each...just pushing that 'power target slider' in the video options to 122% will add, well, 2x 22% to that.
> b.) how far you want to push your 3770K. In stock form, its 'TjMax is 77 watts...by 5.1 Ghz, its - hard to believe - almost three times as much, and that assumes a chip that can do that at relatively low volts.
> 
> All this adds quickly to a massive amount of heat energy you will try to get rid off - just invest $20 or so in a kill-a-watt meter and hook it in between the wall and your current system and run some heavy video benchmarks like ' 3D M Vantage - you will be surprised (I was).
> 
> I am saying this because you will spend a lot of time to get rid of heat with an IvyBridge running at about 5 Ghz (+ -), yet reintroduce extra heat in a loop that also includes the GPUs - I know you mentioned TWO 240 mm rads which is a big step in the right direction, but I would NOT be surprised that you sooner or later will consider a full-on custom loop each for CPU and GPUs. One quick item for you to check (as I genuinely don't know) is if you can add a separate pump to assist the H220 pump and may be add a 3rd 240 mm (or a smaller 120) rad. This would allow you to run the H220, but allow it to dissipate close to 1000 watts...and that brings me to the PSU...
> 
> *PSU*
> 
> I upgraded 3 mth ago from a 650w to an 850w Corsair...after having delidded and benching at 5.3+ as well as adding a 3rd 670, I am looking at that AX1200 lying on the floor waiting for my attention...per above, you want to create some extra headroom for future upgrades, and changing a PSU can be a pain (think of all that cable management...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). I would recommend that you spend the extra dollars and go up to a AX1200
> 
> *Motherboard*
> 
> I make no secret of the fact that I am an 'Asus' fan (I run 3 different models across 5 machines just in my home office, including a Sabertooth Z77 I like - psst, don't tell TD
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), even though Gigabyte for example also makes some great, fast and solid boards. But as you say, you already know the Bios setup; besides, Asus has the most corporate muscle to maintain great services over long periods, i.e. things we need to download etc., including for their boards that are 8 years old or older. Just as as an example, I have to run some older boards re software compatibilities, and I can always find the 'latest' set of drivers, BIOS and utilities from Asus for boards they have not produced for close to a decade.
> 
> I run a *Maximus V Extreme* (eATX)...while a bit more expensive, it does have some unique features, including Thunderbolt and especially the 'OC Key' *which you would very much appreciate, judging by your posts.* That said, the Max. Formula and Gene are very similar to it in most other respects...I have 'work plans' for the Max V Extreme down the line when things like Thunderbolt and the extra PCI / Plex expansion slots that are on the Maximus V Extreme will come in handy from a work perspective.
> 
> In closing, your choices above are already very solid and very well 'informed' - just keep in mind that business about far more Watts and thus far more cooling and PSU requirements than even a person very good at math tends to assume - and that is before the assured desire to upgrade even more later
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....I would think that by about October, you will very seriously want to build an *"IvyB-E' 15 core with Titan SLIs*


Thank you very much!
That was quite literally one of the most helpful posts I have received on any forum.
Here are few of these:






















And +2 rep.

Couple questions for you in the spoiler:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



To recap, the rig in my signature will stay, this will be an additional machine with all new components. So I think what you said was:
-memory good
-ssd and hdd good
-upgrade the psu to 1200
-mobo, MVF seems fine for this level of build, but I was thinking of saving some money and using the Gene for the lower of my two builds because it will only ever have one GPU. Is the overclocking ability less in the Gene vs. the Formla?
-Switch 810 can fit one large radiator plus another one - not sure if that is enough
-GTX 670 4gb FTW+ seems the way to go for now since Hydrocoppers are not available currently but I will wait until Titan is announced as see if prices change. From what I understand I should just get a full coverage 680 water block and that will fit the 670ftw, unless I am missing something.
-cooling, I think custom water will have to wait for my next build cycle, so I will have to find out if the H220 can really handle this. Maybe I should just stick with 1 gpu for this build. The guys on the H220 thread just told me it can handle 3 overclocked things, I guess we will have to see.
Thanks for all the help!


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> awesome! Off with its head!


Head was removed and had AS5 on it, so it's getting re-delidded and putting CLU on that BAMF.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> i have a msi M power z77 board. Im going to keep tweaking it until Im happy and sadly it will probably take me a whole afternoon to be satisfied.
> 
> EDIT: So also when using SuperPi I assume I calculate the highest value being 32m?


1M or 32 M


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> 1 tube can go a long way (as you only need a little bit) - but just remember if you put it ON THE IHS - then you might lose the markings on it.


Sand paper took away my markings.


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1M or 32 M


Gotcha, I decided to just run the system at 4.8 24/7

now im trying to adjust the PLL and system voltage to get lowest power consumption.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1M or 32 M


100M Usain Bolt.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

you shouldn't have done that to that poor Q6600


----------



## ivanlabrie

He delidded the Celly D not the Q6600...that would be plain stupid


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> what kind of stuff do you have?


PM
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> you shouldn't have done that to that poor Q6600


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> He delidded the Celly D not the Q6600...that would be plain stupid


I delidded the Celeron, not the C2Q. The Celeron was like $5 and I would probably never use it again anyway.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I found a 360 for 10usd...26x multi!
Do the math: 26*333 = 8658 lmao
(not entirely impossible)


----------



## DiamondCut

Alright so I am satisfied now.... Pay attention Von or Val.

My results:
OCN name: DiamondCut
CPU: i5-3570K
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: CLP
Mhz gained: 800mhz
OC after delid: 4.8ghz
Temp drops: 25c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2695013


----------



## B3g5l

Woo hoo!!! Luckiest prick ever today! Got warranty on my chip.







Going to play with it this weekend and see what she can do and in a while I shall try this whole delidding again. This chip has much more room to get into. The other one had no gap at all.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> Woo hoo!!! Luckiest prick ever today! Got warranty on my chip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to play with it this weekend and see what she can do and in a while I shall try this whole delidding again. This chip has much more room to get into. The other one had no gap at all.


Huh? Missed this one. Did you kill a chip de-lidding and tell them and they still sent you another?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> PM
> 
> I delidded the Celeron, not the C2Q. The Celeron was like $5 and I would probably never use it again anyway.


Thanks Welbeck for that








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> Woo hoo!!! Luckiest prick ever today! Got warranty on my chip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to play with it this weekend and see what she can do and in a while I shall try this whole delidding again. This chip has much more room to get into. The other one had no gap at all.


Good man - now slow and steady - make SURE you are fully uncharged, and using a sort of anti-static thing.
Remember - be steady and take your time.

this might be your last opportunity to warranty it.


----------



## justanoldman

Best way I have found to delid is wear some surgical gloves. You don't have to worry about static, or getting dirt, oils, sweat, etc. on the chip from your hands. Find the best corner then center the razor blade on it so the corners of the blade never touch the pcb. Put a little upward pressure/tilt to the blade so it is angled ever so slightly toward the bottom of the IHS and away from the PCB. The PCB will bend slightly but that is ok if you are being careful, and it will happen naturally just because of the blade being pushed in.

My hands would get tired or cramped so I would just put the chip down and rest for a minute if I was ever feeling aggravated or impatient, which I definitely felt several times during the process.

Then you just rock the blade back and forth keeping in mind where the die is per the pictures on Swag's guide. You don't need to come close to the die at any point to get it delidded. Do each corner, then try to rock the blade back and forth while you try to get to the center of one of the sides. Trying to get the blade under the middle of side vs. a corner is too hard and dangerous. Try to work the blade over to the middle once you have it under a corner, all the while giving it a hint of upward tilt to avoid the PCB. You should be able to reach the middle of a side from each corner.

It will still seem stuck when you think you should be done, but you can carefully rotate the IHS while holding the PCB when it is ready to be twisted off.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Best way I have found to delid is wear some surgical gloves. You don't have to worry about static, or
> It will still seem stuck when you think you should be done, but you can carefully rotate the IHS while holding the PCB when it is ready to be twisted off.


Everything said above - couldn't agree more.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Alright so I am satisfied now.... Pay attention Von or Val.
> 
> My results:
> OCN name: DiamondCut
> CPU: i5-3570K
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: CLP
> Mhz gained: 800mhz
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz
> Temp drops: 25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2695013


You in! slap that sig on!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Best way I have found to delid is wear some surgical gloves. You don't have to worry about static, or getting dirt, oils, sweat, etc. on the chip from your hands. Find the best corner then center the razor blade on it so the corners of the blade never touch the pcb. Put a little upward pressure/tilt to the blade so it is angled ever so slightly toward the bottom of the IHS and away from the PCB. The PCB will bend slightly but that is ok if you are being careful, and it will happen naturally just because of the blade being pushed in.
> 
> My hands would get tired or cramped so I would just put the chip down and rest for a minute if I was ever feeling aggravated or impatient, which I definitely felt several times during the process.
> 
> Then you just rock the blade back and forth keeping in mind where the die is per the pictures on Swag's guide. You don't need to come close to the die at any point to get it delidded. Do each corner, then try to rock the blade back and forth while you try to get to the center of one of the sides. Trying to get the blade under the middle of side vs. a corner is too hard and dangerous. Try to work the blade over to the middle once you have it under a corner, all the while giving it a hint of upward tilt to avoid the PCB. You should be able to reach the middle of a side from each corner.
> 
> It will still seem stuck when you think you should be done, but you can carefully rotate the IHS while holding the PCB when it is ready to be twisted off.


completely agree! Thats why I use gloves as well?


----------



## DiamondCut

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You in! slap that sig on!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> completely agree! Thats why I use gloves as well?


Which one? I already have the club one in my sig.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Which one? I already have the club one in my sig.


your in the spreadsheet now


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Head was removed and had AS5 on it, so it's getting re-delidded and putting CLU on that BAMF.


your guna be amazed by the temp drop


----------



## Hokies83

wheeeee!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> wheeeee!


Sweet man! M
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> wheeeee!


So sick I had to show it twice! Nice build! Would be a dream rig for me mr moneybags! Or mr hungry man!


----------



## Zeek

Still needs more reservoirs


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Didn't you put the eraser before pressing down the latch there?
> I thought that was the way people normally went about it...also that's phase insulation right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think I can run on air with eraser in the socket? Or am I gonna have to peel it off after each run? :/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> awesome! Off with its head!


Latched it & then filled with eraser. I do the same for phase or ln2, as long as no air can get at the socket, can't get condensation. I don't use vaseline in the socket.
I run insulated boards for air & water all the time, it's all good. The one in the pic was being used air cooled, I can't mount the heatsink or the mvg loses a memory channel, so just sit the HS on the cpu & go. I pulled the heatsink off for that pic.
I have a couple boards completely covered in 1/4" of dragon skin (full board, front & back), those are good for air as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> yea that is most likely what happened... but heres my real problem.... My motherboard doesnt support offset voltage because the VRM's are analog. So If I adjust my core ratio it will disable all speed step and power saving features.... So when I don't leave it and adjust it to clock up to 48 ratio with speed step I have to change the voltage and so that is correlating to me having the cpu idle with 1.42volts.... The odd thing is when it clocks up to 4.8ghz the voltage reading in cpu-z lowers to ~1.40 volts. I don't know if its my vdroop or not but I have that to +100% (which is %200 if I understand that auto is 100% and then the aditional 100%) My temps are fine, I just wan't to get the lowest volts possible so I don't suck the life out of my i5.


It isn't always using the power when idle, so will have very little effect on the life of the chip or the electric bill whether the voltage drops at idle or not. Chip might live 9 3/4 years instead of 10, or cost an extra $1 a month in power. If that much.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> I'll give it a go, so what is bothering me is why the voltage is dropping when it clocks up, I want to make sure its not a stability problem and I want to get it as low as possible. I had it stable on 4.5 at 1.32 volts


A little vdroop is normal, it's actually a protection mechanism for the cpu, switching load states can cause momentary power spikes where it can pull more, vdroop helps it keep from overshooting the set voltage by too much.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> wheeeee!
> 
> snip


Looks good, can't believe you managed to fill that huge case!


----------



## sena

Can you add me pls.









OCN name: Sena
CPU: Intel i5 3570K
on die-TIM: Collaboratoy Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Gelid-GC extreme
Mhz gained: 300 MHz so far
OC after delid: 4800 MHz
Temp drops: 20C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2692045


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Latched it & then filled with eraser. I do the same for phase or ln2, as long as no air can get at the socket, can't get condensation. I don't use vaseline in the socket.
> I run insulated boards for air & water all the time, it's all good. The one in the pic was being used air cooled, I can't mount the heatsink or the mvg loses a memory channel, so just sit the HS on the cpu & go. I pulled the heatsink off for that pic.
> I have a couple boards completely covered in 1/4" of dragon skin (full board, front & back), those are good for air as well.
> It isn't always using the power when idle, so will have very little effect on the life of the chip or the electric bill whether the voltage drops at idle or not. Chip might live 9 3/4 years instead of 10, or cost an extra $1 a month in power. If that much.
> A little vdroop is normal, it's actually a protection mechanism for the cpu, switching load states can cause momentary power spikes where it can pull more, vdroop helps it keep from overshooting the set voltage by too much.
> Looks good, can't believe you managed to fill that huge case!


I.M.O.G. had a ton of problems with vaseline in the socket area with his MVG's so I'm straying clear of it...Only eraser should do, I'll be doing dice anyway.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> wheeeee!


How much are you paying your helper?


----------



## ivanlabrie

1 donut per day...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Can you add me pls.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Sena
> CPU: Intel i5 3570K
> on die-TIM: Collaboratoy Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Gelid-GC extreme
> Mhz gained: 300 MHz so far
> OC after delid: 4800 MHz
> Temp drops: 20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2692045


Your IN! Now Slap our beautiful Signature on your bottom and show it to everyone!









Nice job Hokies! How much water is it taking so far?


----------



## justanoldman

Any of you guys who water cool your gpu:
What brand do you recommend for the gpu water block, and where do you purchase them?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Any of you guys who water cool your gpu:
> What brand do you recommend for the gpu water block, and where do you purchase them?


Look up watercooling guides









Alphacool, EK, Heatikller

FrozenCPU, performance-pcs, aquatuning


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your IN! Now Slap our beautiful Signature on your bottom and show it to everyone!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice job Hokies! How much water is it taking so far?


About a Gallon.


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your IN! Now Slap our beautiful Signature on your bottom and show it to everyone!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice job Hokies! How much water is it taking so far?


Done.









Thx.


----------



## gavbon

Just wondering

will de-lidding my i7 3770k have much bearing on benching under DICE?









has anyone tried it, will be benching it under air to see what kind of clocks i can get before i de-lid it


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Just wondering
> 
> will de-lidding my i7 3770k have much bearing on benching under DICE?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> has anyone tried it, will be benching it under air to see what kind of clocks i can get before i de-lid it


As fas i know, after de-lided chips lose their subzero overclocks by wide margin.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Look up watercooling guides
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alphacool, EK, Heatikller
> 
> FrozenCPU, performance-pcs, aquatuning


Thanks. I was just looking for personal recommendations from people who water cool their gpu and which brands/resellers they like best.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Just wondering
> 
> will de-lidding my i7 3770k have much bearing on benching under DICE?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> has anyone tried it, will be benching it under air to see what kind of clocks i can get before i de-lid it


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Just wondering
> 
> will de-lidding my i7 3770k have much bearing on benching under DICE?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> has anyone tried it, will be benching it under air to see what kind of clocks i can get before i de-lid it


ive heard that liguid pro\ultra on die killed a dellided chip that was on extreme. i think it was ftw420


----------



## Swag

@*sena*

Where have you been? You've been AWOL for the longest time.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Look up watercooling guides
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alphacool, EK, Heatikller
> 
> FrozenCPU, performance-pcs, aquatuning
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I was just looking for personal recommendations from people who water cool their gpu and which brands/resellers they like best.
Click to expand...

Well those are my recommendations


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @*sena*
> 
> Where have you been? You've been AWOL for the longest time.


Been some time offline on all forums.









Come to skype sometimes.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @*sena*
> 
> Where have you been? You've been AWOL for the longest time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Been some time offline on all forums.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Come to skype sometimes.
Click to expand...

Lol, I haven't gone on Skype in a long time. Someone was stalking me and everytime I'd block them, they'd just find a way to message me again...







I'll get on now.


----------



## ivanlabrie

There's an option to allow (or not) people to message you even though they are not in your contact list lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> There's an option to allow (or not) people to message you even though they are not in your contact list lol


Really? Where?









Also guys, can you guys rate my system?
http://www.overclock.net/t/96415/post-your-rate-my-cables-here/24900_50#post_19288162


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> There's an option to allow (or not) people to message you even though they are not in your contact list lol
> 
> 
> 
> Really? Where?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also guys, can you guys rate my system?
> http://www.overclock.net/t/96415/post-your-rate-my-cables-here/24900_50#post_19288162
Click to expand...

My profile, look around


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> There's an option to allow (or not) people to message you even though they are not in your contact list lol
> 
> 
> 
> Really? Where?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also guys, can you guys rate my system?
> http://www.overclock.net/t/96415/post-your-rate-my-cables-here/24900_50#post_19288162
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> My profile, look around
Click to expand...

Thanks! I got it.







I hope the messages stop lol. They were getting threatening like.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol
You had it coming, keeping that option enabled xD (jk)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> As fas i know, after de-lided chips lose their subzero overclocks by wide margin.


Not for the reason most think though, it was because of the properties of Liquid that messed with it. I found it very strange me and FtW discussed it for a while. I believe normal stock paste which will allow the heat to regulate normally works well but I don't think FtW has done that yet.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can experiment with that, your chip will not clock good on ln2 so no worries there...freeze it for higher ddr3 validations and use gelid extreme on die whilst doing so.


----------



## B3g5l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Huh? Missed this one. Did you kill a chip de-lidding and tell them and they still sent you another?


I unfortunately did kill mine. I was impatient and still angry from work and ended up mucking it up. I ended up painting the green back on it and was able to have it replaced from the store. It was the last day of my store warranty too.







I'm still playing with this new chip and seeing what she will do for now but I will try again. And when I have had sleep and not a bad day at work. lol Angry me isnt good with a knife and chip... Although the money I had ready for a new chip if they didnt warranty mine was handy in getting me a new vid card at least. lol


----------



## Zeek

I wish I had a steady hand so I could delid my chip. Well it would be pointless since all I have is NT-H1 and air cooling


----------



## ivanlabrie

An NH-D14 is more than enough for good 5ghz temps if you get a good enough chip...good luck with the silicon lottery man! Let's hope our new chips are good 1.2v 5ghz clockers


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I wish I had a steady hand so I could delid my chip. Well it would be pointless since all I have is NT-H1 and air cooling


Well, I have delidded my chip, have an NH-D14 with NT-H1 TIM. Really, delidding is a great experience!


----------



## Zeek

Gonna pray to the OC Gods tonight









I'll be going to MicroCenter sometime tomorrow morning to pick up a new chip. I really hope it doesn't suck


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Gonna pray to the OC Gods tonight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be going to MicroCenter sometime tomorrow morning to pick up a new chip. I really hope it doesn't suck


Most chips rolling out right now and the past few weeks have been doing great! My new 3570k runs 4.5 @ 1.19vcore.







With iGPU on.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, I have delidded my chip, have an NH-D14 with NT-H1 TIM. Really, delidding is a great experience!


I MIGHT... *MIGHT* try it, lol. Gonna see what the chip does and if I can get close to 4.7/4.8 with decent voltage, it might just push me to delid it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Most chips rolling out right now and the past few weeks have been doing great! My new 3570k runs 4.5 @ 1.19vcore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With iGPU on.


Most chips at my local MC are pretty old I think. I just don't want to get a chip that's worse than the one I had lol


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Any of you guys who water cool your gpu:
> What brand do you recommend for the gpu water block, and where do you purchase them?


dazmode if your in canada and ncix has alright selection not the best tho


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, I have delidded my chip, have an NH-D14 with NT-H1 TIM. Really, delidding is a great experience!
> 
> 
> 
> I MIGHT... *MIGHT* try it, lol. Gonna see what the chip does and if I can get close to 4.7/4.8 with decent voltage, it might just push me to delid it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Most chips rolling out right now and the past few weeks have been doing great! My new 3570k runs 4.5 @ 1.19vcore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With iGPU on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Most chips at my local MC are pretty old I think. I just don't want to get a chip that's worse than the one I had lol
Click to expand...

Anything after November 19th 2012, it will be a decent chip. I say that because my chip was batched on the 19th and everyone after that has been scoring pretty good chips!


----------



## lngu81

Unfortunately, my Costa Rican i7 3770k was born on Saint Tequila day, got it stable @ 4.5 - 1.325v for 14hrs under p95, ambient 26C, here is the details








http://valid.canardpc.com/2695293


----------



## stickg1

Oldman I just want to say that I think your new found performance PC enthusiasm is awesome. You're the coolest oldman I know!


----------



## stickg1

...pretty much any time I post from my phone I double post. Or maybe I'm typically drunk when I post from my phone? That's Irrelevant!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Just wondering
> 
> will de-lidding my i7 3770k have much bearing on benching under DICE?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> has anyone tried it, will be benching it under air to see what kind of clocks i can get before i de-lid it


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> As fas i know, after de-lided chips lose their subzero overclocks by wide margin.


Maximum clocks though, you would really only hit the max under ln2, I think DICE should still be OK for getting the max it can do at -70°.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive heard that liguid pro\ultra on die killed a dellided chip that was on extreme. i think it was ftw420


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Not for the reason most think though, it was because of the properties of Liquid that messed with it. I found it very strange me and FtW discussed it for a while. I believe normal stock paste which will allow the heat to regulate normally works well but I don't think FtW has done that yet.


This, in my case I'm pretty sure it was just that the liquid metal on the die did not go well with the subzero cooling. I haven't tried a delidded chip with a good (proven) subzero paste instead yet.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> ...pretty much any time I post from my phone I double post. Or maybe I'm typically drunk when I post from my phone? That's Irrelevant!










Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anything after November 19th 2012, it will be a decent chip. I say that because my chip was batched on the 19th and everyone after that has been scoring pretty good chips!


Do the batch numbers tell the dates or something? Like how would I be able to tell?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> ...pretty much any time I post from my phone I double post. Or maybe I'm typically drunk when I post from my phone? That's Irrelevant!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anything after November 19th 2012, it will be a decent chip. I say that because my chip was batched on the 19th and everyone after that has been scoring pretty good chips!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Do the batch numbers tell the dates or something? Like how would I be able to tell?
Click to expand...

Should tell on the box.


----------



## lngu81

liquid metal has a -38 C freeze temp. Under subzero cooling, it will sink and creates space between surfaces


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> ...pretty much any time I post from my phone I double post. Or maybe I'm typically drunk when I post from my phone? That's Irrelevant!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anything after November 19th 2012, it will be a decent chip. I say that because my chip was batched on the 19th and everyone after that has been scoring pretty good chips!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Do the batch numbers tell the dates or something? Like how would I be able to tell?
Click to expand...

Batch Codes

The lot code identifier and Intel year and workweek the finished product was manufactured can be viewed by referencing the following FPO# guide:

(x)Test Site, (x)Year, (xx)Workweek, (xx)Lot Code Identifier (xx)Serialisation Code

1st letter or digit = Test Site
0 = San Jose, Costa Rica
1 = Cavite, Philippines
3 = .............., Costa Rica
6 = Chandler, Arizona
7 = .........., Philippines
8 = Leixlip, Ireland
9 = Penang, Malaysia
L = ............, Malaysia
Q = ..........., Malaysia
R = Manila, Philippines
Y = Leixlip, Ireland

2nd digit = Year of production
8 = 2008
9 = 2009
0 = 2010

3rd & 4th digits = Workweek

5th - 6th digits= Lot Code Identifier

7th - 8th digits = Serialisation Code


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Should tell on the box.


I swear I'm blind then. I see the product code, s/n, batch#, mm# but date is either nicely hiding or i'm blind, which I am


----------



## Jacer200

I just got my Coolaboratory liquid ultra to apply to my delidded 3770k. Do I just use the half grain rice method or do I spread it on with the little brushes it came with?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Oldman I just want to say that I think your new found performance PC enthusiasm is awesome. You're the coolest oldman I know!


Yep, something is definitely wrong with me. Normally I think middle aged guys are supposed to buy corvettes and chase their secretaries. Out of the blue I go buy a bunch of components, and I tell the guy I have never done it before, and don't plan on overclocking anything. Never used BIOS before, and I didn't know the meaning of lapping, delidding, IHS, PCB, or die. Fast forward 6 weeks, and now I am plunging head first in the deep end and I don't know how to swim. As for being drunk, I am not sure but I seem to hear something calling me from the freezer, something about a goose that is grey - I better go check that out.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Should tell on the box.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I swear I'm blind then. I see the product code, s/n, batch#, mm# but date is either nicely hiding or i'm blind, which I am
Click to expand...

Hmm, I'm not sure, it tells it on mine on when it reached the reseller. Whatever, use the batch number then, just look for anything past Nov 19.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> I just got my Coolaboratory liquid ultra to apply to my delidded 3770k. Do I just use the half grain rice method or do I spread it on with the little brushes it came with?


Stick the brush in the syringe, just a little. Then paint the die and the underside of the IHS where you see the stain of the previous Intel TIM.


----------



## Jacer200

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Stick the brush in the syringe, just a little. Then paint the die and the underside of the IHS where you see the stain of the previous Intel TIM.


Right on thanks!! I'll have my IBT and temps in pretty soon to join the club


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thank you very much!
> That was quite literally one of the most helpful posts I have received on any forum.
> Here are few of these:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And +2 rep.
> 
> Couple questions for you in the spoiler:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> To recap, the rig in my signature will stay, this will be an additional machine with all new components. So I think what you said was:
> -memory good
> -ssd and hdd good
> -upgrade the psu to 1200
> -mobo, MVF seems fine for this level of build, but I was thinking of saving some money and using the Gene for the lower of my two builds because it will only ever have one GPU. Is the overclocking ability less in the Gene vs. the Formla?
> -Switch 810 can fit one large radiator plus another one - not sure if that is enough
> -GTX 670 4gb FTW+ seems the way to go for now since Hydrocoppers are not available currently but I will wait until Titan is announced as see if prices change. From what I understand I should just get a full coverage 680 water block and that will fit the 670ftw, unless I am missing something.
> -cooling, I think custom water will have to wait for my next build cycle, so I will have to find out if the H220 can really handle this. Maybe I should just stick with 1 gpu for this build. The guys on the H220 thread just told me it can handle 3 overclocked things, I guess we will have to see.
> Thanks for all the help!


...glad I could help a little bit...re rep's - until recently, I did not really know what they were and asked myself why folks had so much of their equipment 'repossessed' , or may be lost out in the computer version of 'pink slips'







...get proven wrong, loose your rig









Since we are getting 'spoiled' :


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



First, to define some parameters, my understanding is that your are really talking about two machines, with the new (second one) running "only" one 670, while the first one is getting a GPU and cooling upgrade

*On the mobo*

I would whole-hardheartedly recommend the Asus ROG Max Gene...it's OC abilities are very strong; its limitations vs Formula and Extreme have more to do with the number of expansion slots (apart from Thunderbolt; Wi-Fi and built-in eSata SSD)...and a Gene can run SLI / CF with no problems at all.

The Max V E has the MOST slots and for my own purposes that comes in handy (tri-SLI now; co-processor, 10 GIG multi-NIC cards and SAS RAID for a later work environment function). Re OC capability then, the Max V has a bit higher headroom - but we're talking past 6.7 Ghz at LN2 etc .

The other item is what I had mentioned before - the OC Key - it's the software on the screen in this video 



 (see around 3:40m mark for extra amusement).

Even for OC attempts at 5 Ghz and a bit beyond, the Max Gene is a very strong solution if you don't need the extra slots and OC Key. A friend of mine just finished a build of a Max Gene last week, with a AX1200, 2x 7970s and water-cooling (Thermaltake 2 Ex / 240 rad), ALL IN ONE OF THOSE smaller CoolerMaster HAF cube cases...he needs s.th. this powerful, reliable but also compact as it holds his company's proprietary software re 4K video compression when he travels with it to big US cities for demos with clients...the last thing he wants then is a mobo that isn't top notch. Then there is also the Hardware Editor's 'Gold' award here: http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/06/28/asus_maximus_v_gene_microatx_motherboard_review/7#.UR7e12cmr1J

...so mobo is a no-brainer - Max Gene...for your purposes, really the best option (unless you need more slots or want to OC with LN2...)

*PSU*

For the dual GPU one, AX 1200/i , or OCZ 1050 gold (I prefer the AX1200)
For the single GPU, your original choice would be fine - but make sure that you don't really want to stuff more video cards in the thing later and then realize that your PSU can't really handle it.

...I am going to get some critiques for this, but I would say that at the bare minimum, assume 220w for your CPU oc 3770K at 5 Ghz, about 400w for your SLI / CF GPUs (single stock 670 = 144 with +22% option; single 680 = 175 + extra w option)...THEN add another 200 watts on top - that should be your PSU (single rail, with as high an efficiency rating as the budget allows).

*Cooling*

The PSU summary nicely 'segways' into the cooling discussion -which I think is your biggest remaining questions set.

Please have a quick look at this graph (source: Sin0822 / Ivy Bridge Overclocking guide)



Once you get past 5.0 GHz at 1.5v with any kind of decent load, you're looking at 200 watts...at 5.4 with 1.6v its a lot more than that ! So keep that number in your mind as the first 'load factor' for the H220

Now add 'roughly' 350-400 watts for SLI GPUs, depending on their OC state...

My first point would be that I really like the H220, up to its appearance, the Thermaltake 2 Ex was my unit of choice re closed loop...the H220 has the HUGE advantage that apart from some stronger pump components *it can be 'modded'* with extra cooling arrangements for GPUs etc - in essence, it is a *hybrid* between a closed-loop and custom-loop (very smart market positioning by Swiftech, btw). You can also 'mod' a Thermaltake 220 or Corsair H100 - but only with a pair of sizzers









My second point would be that NO MATTER WHAT, a 'stock rad' H220 asked to just cool an OC'ed 5 GHz 3770K (approx 200 watts) will do better temp-wise than one which also carries AN EXTRA 350-400 watts GPU heat (never mind Max Formula VRM wc).

This is not to say, that a H220 cannot handle that; what I was suggesting is the following:

Get the H220 and initially set up your approx 5 Ghz CPU as the only item on it...run it for a few days with reasonable benching / stress testing noting ambient temps as well as system temps....that's your base line right there.

Then add the GPU coolers (more on those below), with an extra 240 rad - run some more reasonable bench / stress tests for a few days noting all the above variables and see how that performs differently.

The kicker is that you probably can add another 120 if not 240 rad, but adding more rads and also two GPUs may obviously make the pump - solid as that one is - work harder...and if you are using the Max Formula board, I believe that it has water-cooling barbs already set up for the VRM, so you would want to throw that one into the loop as well.

What I have seen done before is:
a.) a split of the system into two custom loops (when CPU lowEST temps are critical) or
b.) a 'helper' pump installed into the single loop - in your case the H220.

It should be possible, but I do not know for sure - the best folks to answer that one are the Swiftech reps...just ask them what would happen of you extend the H220 loop to not only cover VRM and two GPUs with a total either two or even three rads, but also throw in one of their free-standing pumps as a 'helper' pump, or as 'extra insurance' (pumps like that are between $60 -$90). It all goes back to whether you ask the H220 to deal with 200+ watts, or 600+ watts of generated heat.

As a somewhat separate but related item, here is a quote from some folks at YouTube who were noting how OCing had changed their cooling requirements: _" With the 3770k at stock speeds under full load the H80i will keep the cpu around 60c to 65c,if I overclock it to 4.2ghz the H80i keeps the cpu around mid 80c,I also had the? cpu at 4.6ghz but had to go back to 4.2ghz because at 4.6ghz even with the H80i running at max speed the cpu would get up to 95c.

These ivy bridges are actually hotter than the 6 core Core i7 3930K my other pc with the Core i7 3930K clocked at 4.6ghz doesn't even go over 80c under full load."_

A final point on GPU coolers

I mentioned that I'm working on a custom solution which consists of taking generic GPU blocks and add a custom-fab VRM block in a way that can also be transferred to Titans later. However, if I would keep the SLI 670 (instead of Tr-SLI which forces me to deal with the heat in a different way), I would go for full blocks.

As such, I stared asking around to see what actual owners of dual 670 water-cooled blocks were saying... the guys tell me there are only two or three choices ('EK' 



 , Heatkiller / watercool.de or YoutTube here: 



).

I know one person who has had experience with both and he prefers the 'heatkiller', but it seems to be a question of visual design and metal 'quality' for him, rather than a performance question (temp-wise, he said that there were within 2 or 3 degrees of each other).

While you can order direct from those folks, in the USA, FrozenCPU.com would be your best bet for these specialty items...just make sure you know whether your 670ies have what is called a 'reference board design' or a 'custom board' design such as the Asus DirectC-Cuii

Good luck with your new build


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Batch Codes
> 
> The lot code identifier and Intel year and workweek the finished product was manufactured can be viewed by referencing the following FPO# guide:
> 
> (x)Test Site, (x)Year, (xx)Workweek, (xx)Lot Code Identifier (xx)Serialisation Code
> 
> 1st letter or digit = Test Site
> 0 = San Jose, Costa Rica
> 1 = Cavite, Philippines
> 3 = .............., Costa Rica
> 6 = Chandler, Arizona
> 7 = .........., Philippines
> 8 = Leixlip, Ireland
> 9 = Penang, Malaysia
> L = ............, Malaysia
> Q = ..........., Malaysia
> R = Manila, Philippines
> Y = Leixlip, Ireland
> 
> 2nd digit = Year of production
> 8 = 2008
> 9 = 2009
> 0 = 2010
> 
> 3rd & 4th digits = Workweek
> 
> 5th - 6th digits= Lot Code Identifier
> 
> 7th - 8th digits = Serialisation Code


I prefer this one, much easier to read.

http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?278-HOWTO-Read-an-Intel-CPU-FPO-Batch-Code


----------



## Zeek

Oh I didn't even see his post, lol. Thank you to both of you









So from my understanding I should be looking for some 3232**** with the last 4 digits of the S/N being close to 1000. That's just my theory


----------



## JoeTesla

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> What are your max temps when running 5.0GHz? I can get a pretty stable 5.0 as long as I keep my temps below 62.


I'm not sure.. I only got it to go through a cinebench at 5ghz with my ram at 1333. With the ram at it's normal 2400 I can't get it to run even at anything below 1.6v. Haven't tried higher..
with 4.9ghz I run 100% stable with 1.45v. looong prime runs, no problems. Max temps are ~65 with the pump & fans at 35%.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> About a Gallon.


Very nice rig - a true work of art!


----------



## Hokies83

Meh afew days of this to get the air bubbles out and everything filled lol.


----------



## chronicfx

Interesting fund this morning. For those with asrock boards. Hwinfo seems to report vcore correctly. So it is a problem with CPUZ and the board. Lil chronic what is your vcore during ibt in hwinfo? Wondering if this will give you your correct value. I hate autocorrect on the iPhone.... With all my heart.


----------



## Zeek

I'm about to drive down to microcenter now so I'll try that once I have a CPU in my system again.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Maximum clocks though, you would really only hit the max under ln2, I think DICE should still be OK for getting the max it can do at -70°.
> 
> This, in my case I'm pretty sure it was just that the liquid metal on the die did not go well with the subzero cooling. I haven't tried a delidded chip with a good (proven) subzero paste instead yet.


I would think the gallium solidifies and may cause problems at subzero. Just a theory.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh a few days of this to get the air bubbles out and everything filled lol.


Wouldnt a nice lava lamp have saved some money? Love this rig! You better not put a piledriver in that!


----------



## willem739

Try to practice on a old chip.

I did and its really not that difficult.









One corner was very thigh and I scratched the pc board.

Also it was a old soldered Celeron chip - but I could still delid the CPU.

Will also try on a second old chip before ordering some thermal paste.



I hope I did everything right, its my first post.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Maximum clocks though, you would really only hit the max under ln2, I think DICE should still be OK for getting the max it can do at -70°.
> 
> This, in my case I'm pretty sure it was just that the liquid metal on the die did not go well with the subzero cooling. I haven't tried a delidded chip with a good (proven) subzero paste instead yet.
> 
> 
> 
> I would think the gallium solidifies and may cause problems at subzero. Just a theory.
Click to expand...

Someone should try it with ceramique.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *willem739*
> 
> Try to practice on a old chip.
> 
> I did and its really not that difficult.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One corner was very thigh and I scratched the pc board.
> 
> Also it was a old soldered Celeron chip - but I could still delid the CPU.
> 
> Will also try on a second old chip before ordering some thermal paste.
> 
> 
> 
> I hope I did everything right, its my first post.


Nice job. Practicing is always a good idea. Welcome to ocn and the crazy delidding adventure.

Here is how to put your rig in your posts:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig


----------



## Jacer200

I delided my 3770K last night and used some Coolabratory Liquid Ultra on the die. Everything went ok. I wasn't happy with the first set of temps I was getting so I re-applied and re-seating everything and let the TIM settle over night. I used PK-3 on the HIS instead of the Liquid ultra because I don't have much left and I plan to upgrade my H100 soon. So these are my preliminary temps using prime95 for 30 min. before I do a 10 pass run on IBT. So far I am happy and my temps are down 8c on the hottest core. I know my temps could be better with push\pull intake rather than my push/exhaust .


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good use of a hammer there









Fear the hammer should be your nickname lol


----------



## Jacer200

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good use of a hammer there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fear the hammer should be your nickname lol


I found that the hammer and a not so sharp parring knife worked really well and popped the top of really fast.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> I found that the hammer and a not so sharp parring knife worked really well and popped the top of really fast.


That takes some cahonas my friend. Rep to you for using the knife and hammer. That you tube vid gave me nightmares.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> I delided my 3770K last night and used some Coolabratory Liquid Ultra on the die. Everything went ok. I wasn't happy with the first set of temps I was getting so I re-applied and re-seating everything and let the TIM settle over night. I used PK-3 on the HIS instead of the Liquid ultra because I don't have much left and I plan to upgrade my H100 soon. So these are my preliminary temps using prime95 for 30 min. before I do a 10 pass run on IBT. So far I am happy and my temps are down 8c on the hottest core. I know my temps could be better with push\pull intake rather than my push/exhaust .
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


In pic #2 it looks like you have a decent amount of glue left on the IHS, did you clean all that off, or leave it that way? Also in pic #3 it shows the TIM on the die, did you put any on the underside of the IHS?


----------



## Jacer200

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> In pic #2 it looks like you have a decent amount of glue left on the IHS, did you clean all that off, or leave it that way? Also in pic #3 it shows the TIM on the die, did you put any on the underside of the IHS?


Before I applied the the TIM I did end up cleaning up most of the glue that you see in pic #2. I just didn't take a pic of it. I did in my first application put some TIM on the underside. But I really didn't know how much to put on because it didn't spread out well it just kind of balled up. So I think I put to much on and wasn't happy with the temps. I was getting 80c on the hottest core. So I re-applied and re-seating a second time with just spreading it out on the die only and let settle over night and now my hottest core is 73c. Now I don't have much TIM left so I couldn't use any for the HIS.

Edit: While gaming for a couple hours this morning my hottest core only gets to 61c


----------



## EPiiKK

I may have missed it in the op but how sensitive the bottom of the cpu is? Should i pay extra attention not applying pressure to the bottom?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EPiiKK*
> 
> I may have missed it in the op but how sensitive the bottom of the cpu is? Should i pay extra attention not applying pressure to the bottom?


When I de-lidded mine I placed it on a piece of construction paper with some styrofoam underneath (like from a motherboard package) so that there was some cushion) as far as finger go, as long as they are clean and you have taken the necessary precautions against static (clothing, touching the metal in the case etc.) it should be totally fine to touch the bottom


----------



## Zeek

I seem to have lost the lottery with this chip... big time. Old chip did 4.5 with 1.24 this one does 4.5 with 1.34







I don't think I'll be delidding any time soon


----------



## Jacer200

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> When I de-lidded mine I placed it on a piece of construction paper with some styrofoam underneath (like from a motherboard package) so that there was some cushion) as far as finger go, as long as they are clean and you have taken the necessary precautions against static (clothing, touching the metal in the case etc.) it should be totally fine to touch the bottom


Makes me fell like a cave man







. I just stood mine straight up with the corner of the pcb digging into my wooden table for cushion. And banged away







.


----------



## EPiiKK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I seem to have lost the lottery with this chip... big time. Old chip did 4.5 with 1.24 this one does 4.5 with 1.34
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think I'll be delidding any time soon


4.5 @ 1.2-1.25V is pretty usual for ivy


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> Before I applied the the TIM I did end up cleaning up most of the glue that you see in pic #2. I just didn't take a pic of it. I did in my first application put some TIM on the underside. But I really didn't know how much to put on because it didn't spread out well it just kind of balled up. So I think I put to much on and wasn't happy with the temps. I was getting 80c on the hottest core. So I re-applied and re-seating a second time with just spreading it out on the die only and let settle over night and now my hottest core is 73c. Now I don't have much TIM left so I couldn't use any for the HIS.
> 
> Edit: While gaming for a couple hours this morning my hottest core only gets to 61c


You used way too much then. From the one pic you have there you can see there is too much on the die. You should be able to get 3 or more applications total - which would be die, underside of IHS, all of the top of the IHS, and the bottom of your cooler - and do all that three times or more from one syringe of ultra.

Did you watch the video on the Coollaboratories web site? You may want to try one more time if you want to get your temps down further. You wont need to add more it sounds like, you would use the brush to remove some off the die and underside of the IHS if you used too much. I know all this because I messed up the first time and blew through my first syringe of Ultra by using too much and not being careful with it.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EPiiKK*
> 
> 4.5 @ 1.2-1.25V is pretty usual for ivy


Exactly. What I was trying to say is that this new chip sucks, lol.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EPiiKK*
> 
> 4.5 @ 1.2-1.25V is pretty usual for ivy


My three 3770k chips:
4.5 at 1.33v
4.6 at 1.29v
4.8 at 1.29v
There is a huge variety in chips. From my experience if your VID under load is above 1.3 then it won't overclock well, and if it is below 1.2 then it will.


----------



## Jacer200

I had no idea there was a video. And had a feeling I did not apply it right the second time either. But payday is coming soon and my cpu did not get destroyed while being delidding. But thanks oldman i'll go check out that video.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EPiiKK*
> 
> I may have missed it in the op but how sensitive the bottom of the cpu is? Should i pay extra attention not applying pressure to the bottom?


You can definitely damage the underside of your chip, so you need to be careful. Rubber gloves are best when delidding for static and cleanliness. I did almost everything while holding the chip in one hand by the edges, so there should not be a need to put much pressure on it.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Exactly. What I was trying to say is that this new chip sucks, lol.


Can't you return it?


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You used way too much then. From the one pic you have there you can see there is too much on the die. You should be able to get 3 or more applications total - which would be die, underside of IHS, all of the top of the IHS, and the bottom of your cooler - and do all that three times or more from one syringe of ultra.
> 
> Did you watch the video on the Coollaboratories web site? You may want to try one more time if you want to get your temps down further. You wont need to add more it sounds like, you would use the brush to remove some off the die and underside of the IHS if you used too much. I know all this because I messed up the first time and blew through my first syringe of Ultra by using too much and not being careful with it.


You don't ever apply thermal paste to both sides of a surface. It'll just create more air bubbles. You only need it on the die itself. I also keep hearing that the coollaboratory liquid pro is actually better for on die applications but it dries like solder.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Can't you return it?


That is why most stores have such strict return policies now.

Also don't listen to what most people say on the forums. The people that do have really good chips tend to post a ton of screenshots and some people just don't stress test all that well.

Yes, 1.34v (assuming that is under prime load) is a little high for 4.5ghz but not awful.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Exactly. What I was trying to say is that this new chip sucks, lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Can't you return it?
Click to expand...

Yea, return it and buy a new one.







Haha, I remember doing that for my 930 before.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Can't you return it?


I probably will. I wanted to delid this time but 1.34v for 4.5ghz isn't worth the trouble. Hopefully the next chip I get will be good.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> You don't ever apply thermal paste to both sides of a surface. It'll just create more air bubbles. You only need it on the die itself. I also keep hearing that the coollaboratory liquid pro is actually better for on die applications but it dries like solder.


Well it is nice to have an opinion, although I like to stick to the facts. After having delided two 3770k chips, then trying too little, too much and a medium amount of Ultra to the die, then taking actual temperature readings after each one, I have some facts at my disposal. So that is 6 times over two chips I have done this. Additionally the manufacturers of the product specifically state that both surfaces can be treated provided you use the correct amount and application technique.


----------



## BababooeyHTJ

I've never head or anyone applying thermal paste like that. AFAIK, coollab doesn't even suggest that for this paste either. Applying liquid pro to just the bare die resulted in great temps for me. This is with MX-2 on the IHS.


----------



## Jacer200

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> I had no idea there was a video. And had a feeling I did not apply it right the second time either. But payday is coming soon and my cpu did not get destroyed while being delidding. But thanks oldman i'll go check out that video.


Well after triple checking everything I did end up using way to much. I thought I still had a little Coollab Ultra left but there was nothing. So I used a whole tube on two applications and I didn't have any to put on top of the IHS so I still have to use pk-3. So I still have Ultra on the die and I'm gonna have to wait until payday to re-apply.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> I've never head or anyone applying thermal paste like that. AFAIK, coollab doesn't even suggest that for this paste either. Applying liquid pro to just the bare die resulted in great temps for me. This is with MX-2 on the IHS.


Then you haven't read this thread at all, nor have you read the instructions that are provided with Ultra. "You can apply the Liquid Ultra on one or both surfaces, but the whole amount should not be too big." That is a quote from the manufacturer.

I am not here to argue with you but you keep posting outright false hoods as facts. If your temps are good then that is great. There are multiple ways to apply different TIMs, and the best way is whatever gets your individual temps the lowest.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> I delided my 3770K last night and used some Coolabratory Liquid Ultra on the die. Everything went ok. I wasn't happy with the first set of temps I was getting so I re-applied and re-seating everything and let the TIM settle over night. I used PK-3 on the HIS instead of the Liquid ultra because I don't have much left and I plan to upgrade my H100 soon. So these are my preliminary temps using prime95 for 30 min. before I do a 10 pass run on IBT. So far I am happy and my temps are down 8c on the hottest core. I know my temps could be better with push\pull intake rather than my push/exhaust .
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I added you! I just need a few things max OC and a CPUZ of the max OC. Then your IN!


----------



## Jacer200

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> I've never head or anyone applying thermal paste like that. AFAIK, coollab doesn't even suggest that for this paste either. Applying liquid pro to just the bare die resulted in great temps for me. This is with MX-2 on the IHS.


Geez those are great temps. Now I know I did something wrong.


----------



## Jacer200

Thanks Vulgaur























Validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/2696397


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

What do you guys recommend for an i5 which has been using an aftermarket HS? I can barely get the tip of the blade in the corner and I don't want to ruin it. Any ideas? Thanks!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> I've never head or anyone applying thermal paste like that. AFAIK, coollab doesn't even suggest that for this paste either. Applying liquid pro to just the bare die resulted in great temps for me. This is with MX-2 on the IHS.


Whats your cooler?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BababooeyHTJ*
> 
> I've never head or anyone applying thermal paste like that. AFAIK, coollab doesn't even suggest that for this paste either. Applying liquid pro to just the bare die resulted in great temps for me. This is with MX-2 on the IHS.


You have a pretty high end water cooling setup from the pics. My temps are pretty close yours if I were to back down to 1.3v and 4.7ghz and do prime. I don't think your TIM application is any better or worse than ours as we do both sides. In fact I would expect more if I had spent $400+ on my cooling.


----------



## chronicfx

here is 4.7 on AIR:



Your bragging about beating an air cooler by a couple degrees when you have a $500 water cooling setup. We all have our own ways of doing things, you should not discount other in this forum. Many of us have adopted this top/bottom application as it seems to yield nice results.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> Thanks Vulgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/2696397
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You IN! and updated! Now slap that Impressive Sig on!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jacer200*
> 
> I just got my Coolaboratory liquid ultra to apply to my delidded 3770k. Do I just use the half grain rice method or do I spread it on with the little brushes it came with?


Paint on a thin layer with the brush







start in the center with a very small drop and spread outwards


----------



## chann3l

I should really read through all the missed pages before I give very late advice


----------



## Jacer200

Quote:


> Paint on a thin layer with the brush
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> start in the center with a very small drop and spread outwards


Were where you like 15hrs. ago


----------



## justanoldman

Just so you guys know, this club is all to blame. If I had never delidded a chip I would never have seen the potential of my chip, and that led me to delid a second. Then of course I have to build another system for that chip, and while I am at it, might as well make some upgrades.
Second build pieces purchased so far:
NZXT Switch 810 case
3770k delidded
Corsair 1200AX psu
G.Skill Trident X 2400 ram 2x8
WD Black 1tb HDD
Samsung 840 Pro 512mb SSD
Maximus V Formula

Swiftech H220 - can't buy it for a couple weeks when it is released. Then I guess I need an additional 320 rad with three fans, more hose, more coolant, more fittings, and a water block for whatever GPU I get.

I am waiting to see what the Titan is all about before I get a video card. I started doing the math for one GTX 670 plus water block, then thought it might not be enough for surround gaming. When I added in another 670 and another water block, I thought, well heck why not just look at a GTX 690 Hydro Copper, it will only double the cost of the whole build, why not.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Just so you guys know, this club is all to blame. If I had never delidded a chip I would never have seen the potential of my chip, and that led me to delid a second. Then of course I have to build another system for that chip, and while I am at it, might as well make some upgrades.
> Second build pieces purchased so far:
> NZXT Switch 810 case
> 3770k delidded
> Corsair 1200AX psu
> G.Skill Trident X 2400 ram 2x8
> WD Black 1tb HDD
> Samsung 840 Pro 512mb SSD
> Maximus V Formula
> 
> Swiftech H220 - can't buy it for a couple weeks when it is released. Then I guess I need an additional 320 rad with three fans, more hose, more coolant, more fittings, and a water block for whatever GPU I get.
> 
> I am waiting to see what the Titan is all about before I get a video card. I started doing the math for one GTX 670 plus water block, then thought it might not be enough for surround gaming. When I added in another 670 and another water block, I thought, well heck why not just look at a GTX 690 Hydro Copper, it will only double the cost of the whole build, why not.


Good Lord!!! That's gonna be a sweet build!! But do you really need a 512MB SSD? Just go with the 256GB and buy some other stuff.


----------



## Zeek

Batch 3227C is the worst batch ever. Gonna return it next week and try to get the newest Costa Rica chip I can lol


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Good Lord!!! That's gonna be a sweet build!! But do you really need a 512MB SSD? Just go with the 256GB and buy some other stuff.


Was planning on it. Store was out of 256, but were having a sale on the 512 and when I said I would just buy the 256 online, they gave me a little discount on everything to get me to buy it. This way I don't have to worry about moving my games and other stuff around.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Was planning on it. Store was out of 256, but were having a sale on the 512 and when I said I would just buy the 256 online, they gave me a little discount on everything to get me to buy it. This way I don't have to worry about moving my games and other stuff around.


That's badass, did you go to a local MC or something?

So you have all the parts right now and you're ready to build?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's badass, did you go to a local MC or something?
> 
> So you have all the parts right now and you're ready to build?


Yep, an MC, they have good prices on drives in addition to the chip. Then they matched prices on the other stuff, and gave a little discount. No cooler yet, I have to wait for it to be released, Swiftech says "end of February" whatever that means. The ram will be here in a couple days. No video card either, but I can use the mobo video and stock cooler I guess to test everything while I wait.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's badass, did you go to a local MC or something?
> 
> So you have all the parts right now and you're ready to build?


I wish we had microcenter here in van. They won't even ship to Canada and all the best deals are in store pick up anyways.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Yep, an MC, they have good prices on drives in addition to the chip. Then they matched prices on the other stuff, and gave a little discount. No cooler yet, I have to wait for it to be released, Swiftech says "end of February" whatever that means. The ram will be here in a couple days. No video card either, but I can use the mobo video and stock cooler I guess to test everything while I wait.


I sent you a PM


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Just so you guys know, this club is all to blame. If I had never delidded a chip I would never have seen the potential of my chip, and that led me to delid a second. Then of course I have to build another system for that chip, and while I am at it, might as well make some upgrades.
> Second build pieces purchased so far:
> NZXT Switch 810 case
> 3770k delidded
> Corsair 1200AX psu
> G.Skill Trident X 2400 ram 2x8
> WD Black 1tb HDD
> Samsung 840 Pro 512mb SSD
> Maximus V Formula
> 
> Swiftech H220 - can't buy it for a couple weeks when it is released. Then I guess I need an additional 320 rad with three fans, more hose, more coolant, more fittings, and a water block for whatever GPU I get.
> 
> I am waiting to see what the Titan is all about before I get a video card. I started doing the math for one GTX 670 plus water block, then thought it might not be enough for surround gaming. When I added in another 670 and another water block, I thought, well heck why not just look at a GTX 690 Hydro Copper, it will only double the cost of the whole build, why not.


no up7???


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Good Lord!!! That's gonna be a sweet build!! But do you really need a 512MB SSD? Just go with the 256GB and buy some other stuff.


Let me just correct something
512 MB -> hahahaha
*GB


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Good Lord!!! That's gonna be a sweet build!! But do you really need a 512MB SSD? Just go with the 256GB and buy some other stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> Let me just correct something
> 512 MB -> hahahaha
> *GB
Click to expand...

There was actually a time when 512 MB was an absurd amount of space.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> There was actually a time when 512 MB was an absurd amount of space.


I know I know


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> There was actually a time when 512 MB was an absurd amount of space.


I have a PC in the garage with 16MB of RAM installed and that was hot stuff back when I used that PC.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have a PC in the garage with 16MB of RAM installed and that was hot stuff back when I used that PC.


EDO RAM


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> There was actually a time when 512 MB was an absurd amount of space.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a PC in the garage with 16MB of RAM installed and that was hot stuff back when I used that PC.
Click to expand...

I'm guessing it's not a c64 since that thing only had 64kB. Haha! Imagine running 64kB with today's stuff.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Would take literally 10yrs folding. Lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm guessing it's not a c64 since that thing only had 64kB. Haha! Imagine running 64kB with today's stuff.


I'd have to look, I think its a AMD K6 300MHz CPU.

I did have a 3DFX VooDoo3 in that machine. Now that was some hardcore GPU action right there...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm guessing it's not a c64 since that thing only had 64kB. Haha! Imagine running 64kB with today's stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd have to look, I think its a AMD K6 300MHz CPU.
> 
> I did have a 3DFX VooDoo3 in that machine. Now that was some hardcore GPU action right there...
Click to expand...

They actually were pretty good if we are talking about the same thing that I have in mind.







To what I learned a PC was, I can't believe people used to use a command-line based OS to read email...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Wouldnt a nice lava lamp have saved some money? Love this rig! You better not put a piledriver in that!


No worries I know better then to put Amd garbage in my systems who cpu's are only now equal Intel's 2008 core 2 quads I have no idea why people buy that complete garbage....

Worst ones who cry price per performance then have 1200$ in Gpus and 500$ in a water loop and a 350$ case lol but hey he saved 100$ getting a sub par cpu.... There is one guy I know of this name is red something every time I read his sig rig I just see face palms.. Lol.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Worst ones who cry price per performance then have 1200$ in Gpus and 500$ in a water loop and a 350$ case lol but hey he saved 100$ getting a sub par cpu.... There is one guy I know of this name is red something every time I read his sig rig I just see face palms.. Lol.


I was just thinking about what we pay for components. The chip, especially from a MC, is ridiculously cheap considering how significant it is to the system. Cases can be expensive but you can get good ones for not much money at all. Ram and HDD are really inexpensive for what we get now days. SSD are still high but have come down.

That leaves cooling and GPUs. You can do pretty decent cooling for a reasonable price, there is no actual need to spend a lot unless you want to. If you don't game much or only have a 1080 monitor you can get a decent GPU for a relatively high, but still affordable price. However, if you want surround gaming and water cooling for your GPU, well, fuggetaboudit. You could end up spending almost as much on the GPU setup as the rest of the whole system combined.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> EDO RAM


...stop, stop - I'm getting all misty-eyed from all that nostalgia







...now where is that old board with the VESA 2.1 Video Bus...future-proof, the salesman called it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> EDO RAM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...stop, stop - I'm getting all misty-eyed from all that nostalgia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...now where is that old board with the VESA 2.1 Video Bus...future-proof, the salesman called it
Click to expand...

Haha! That's why I don't bother future-proofing my stuff anymore. It's just a gimmick the sales people made up, I'd just spend on what I need today and if something comes up in the future, then do it then...


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have a PC in the garage with 16MB of RAM installed and that was hot stuff back when I used that PC.
> 
> 
> 
> EDO RAM
Click to expand...

Just happen to have, from a 200MHz Proliant server one stick of 64MB and two sticks of 32MB Compaq EDO RAM in front of me now....

Here's a pic. In those days 8MB sticks were more the norm, IIRC.



Wanna soup it up?


----------



## IOSEFINI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No worries I know better then to put Amd garbage in my systems who cpu's are only now equal Intel's 2008 core 2 quads I have no idea why people buy that complete garbage....
> 
> Worst ones who cry price per performance then have 1200$ in Gpus and 500$ in a water loop and a 350$ case lol but hey he saved 100$ getting a sub par cpu.... There is one guy I know of this name is red something every time I read his sig rig I just see face palms.. Lol.


We buy that complete garbage to do you a favor and save you money, ....otherwise you would have paid $2290 (at Microcenter) for that I-7 of yours.
So, you should have said thanks amd instead of ^^^

So lucky, IB owners..including myself, that the razor blade was invented....


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IOSEFINI*
> 
> We buy that complete garbage to do you a favor and save you money, ....otherwise you would have paid $2290 (at Microcenter) for that I-7 of yours.
> So, you should have said thanks amd instead of ^^^
> 
> So lucky, IB owners..including myself, that the razor blade was invented....


I for one like it that you own both...more power to ya.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IOSEFINI*
> 
> We buy that complete garbage to do you a favor and save you money, ...*.otherwise you would have paid $2290* (at Microcenter) for that I-7 of yours.
> So, you should have said thanks amd instead of ^^^
> 
> So lucky, IB owners..including myself, that the razor blade was invented....


Not really id love for AMD'S Cpu division to fold and keep the Apu/gpu Divisions...

This would cause the American gov't to make Intel split in two like AT&T and Verizon atleast then we would have 2 companys producing great cpu's pushing the performance mark instead of Amd failing allowing intel to fall asleep.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Interesting idea Hokies...

Stick, you were seriously bottlenecking that voodoo 3 man!
I had a voodoo 23 paired with an s3 card powered by a beast pentium 200d mmx and then got a p3 600be and rd ram with a voodoo 3 3500man agp....last self built enthusiast rig of mine till my i7 2600k rig last year lol


----------



## Joa3d43

...was busy modding things but just took another look at today's posts...this thread has seen its fair share of nastiness today







...is it, like a Full Moon or something ?









To celebrate the arrival of NVidia's '*Titan*', I modded three Asus GTX 670 DUii, after binning them and then taking them apart from some quick TIM replacement (MX4 as there is both copper and Aluminum, the latter getting corroded by CL-U /P)....it took a bit of old 'DOS' fooling-around, but I finally got the 670 TOP Bios installed on all three cards - then modded that BIos with the 'KGB' editor for a nice custom fit (gained over 150 MHZ on GPU and an effective 600 on mem - with something left on the table once tri-SLI is installed).

Tri-SLI of this should easily beat even a Titan







(...until I get a pair of those and move these cards over to 4 other machines which currently just have iGPU)...just two modded 670ies per SLI benches score well within SLI 680s / Cross Fire 7970 range....

The point is that yes, we spend some money on hardware, but then we get a lot of enjoyment out of it







, including when we mod after sharing info / gleaning knowledge here...*'If you can't do the time, don't do the crime' applies to your hardware bill as well*









...sorry to interrupt --- Now back to the howling


----------



## martinhal

What are your guys folding temps like . Im at 5.1 ghz with 1.512 v and 75 max .


----------



## Matt-Matt

Hey guys! It's been ages! :O
So I've moved to my accomodation, it's alrightish :/

Anyway, so yeah I checked here... 1196 unread posts. Wow.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm turning 18 in 2013.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I am young but my voice is that of a 12 year old.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate how whenever I call a CS or anything over the phone other than my friends/family, they automatically begin with "Hello Miss."


Hahahahahhaha, wow. I used to be like that but I hit it a lot earlier on


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IOSEFINI*
> 
> We buy that complete garbage to do you a favor and save you money, ....otherwise you would have paid $2290 (at Microcenter) for that I-7 of yours.
> So, you should have said thanks amd instead of ^^^
> 
> So lucky, IB owners..including myself, that the razor blade was invented....


How's that 5800K in your sig? Are those fun to overclock? Always wanted to play with one.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Interesting idea Hokies...
> 
> Stick, you were seriously bottlenecking that voodoo 3 man!
> I had a voodoo 23 paired with an s3 card powered by a beast pentium 200d mmx and then got a p3 600be and rd ram with a voodoo 3 3500man agp....last self built enthusiast rig of mine till my i7 2600k rig last year lol


I'm sure I was, I was only 8 at the time. I didn't know what I was doing, my older brother begged my mom for a new GPU so we could play games. I think eventually we got a new computer soon after.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> What are your guys folding temps like . Im at 5.1 ghz with 1.512 v and 75 max .


I fold 4.8GHz 1.41v max temp ~60C.


----------



## Lobsterman

Well I can now say I have used both Ultra and Pro, I got a excellent deal at Amazon for a syringe of Pro for £4 with free delivery!
Already can see that Pro will last much longer, 15mg meens 15 applications, whereas Ultra I got about 4 due to its more globby consistency.
Early recordings indicate identickle temperatures between the 2 so far.

Definitely easier to work with too than Ultra was.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ultra is easier rub of though. Pro seems easier to work with due to the complexion of the material and the syringe.


----------



## willem739

Thanks oldman, your advise helped


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ultra is easier rub of though. Pro seems easier to work with due to the complexion of the material and the syringe.


TD is always for whichever is easy to rub one off with


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> TD is always for whichever is easy to rub one off with


hahahaha. I am.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *willem739*
> 
> Thanks oldman, your advise helped


No problem, just let us know if you have any questions before you do your Ivy chip.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Already can see that Pro will last much longer, 15mg meens 15 applications, whereas Ultra I got about 4 due to its more globby consistency.


Yeah, I bought some CL Pro a while back, did about six applications and still have a lot left. Fifteen applications sounds about right. If you want to have some fun, spread a little Pro on a piece of glass then turn it over and voila! You have a mirror.


----------



## justanoldman

Can people even run a Prime95 stress test on a lidded Ivy chip with the stock Intel cooler? The temps on my delidded chip are really high for stock turbo 3.9 settings.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No problem, just let us know if you have any questions before you do your Ivy chip.


..and watch the videos (YouTube) several more times...and also keep some bandages handy


----------



## Swag

Okay okay okay, guys, I have a biiiiiig problem.

I can't play games right now because I have no graphics card and I'm using the iGPU.

Should I upgrade right now to a 680 (I can get it for cheap, $400) or wait for the 700-series? I plan on getting the EVGA card so that means I can do that one upgrade thing from EVGA if it comes out within the next 2 months. What do you guys think?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Can people even run a Prime95 stress test on a lidded Ivy chip with the stock Intel cooler? The temps on my delidded chip are really high for stock turbo 3.9 settings.


...did a thread a while back which involved that kind of test...a stock Intel Cooler w/stock cooler TIM on a stock 3770...the chip itself is from one of my Virtual Machine groups and had already proven to be a great oc'er with different cooling, but by just 4.1 GHz, Prime95 would generate about 86 C average in the cores with the stock set-up, while the Termaltake 2 Ex cooled (still lidded, MX2 TIM) chip would not reach those temps in Prime95 until 4.8 / 9 Ghz


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay okay okay, guys, I have a biiiiiig problem.
> 
> I can't play games right now because I have no graphics card and I'm using the iGPU.
> 
> Should I upgrade right now to a 680 (I can get it for cheap, $400) or wait for the 700-series? I plan on getting the EVGA card so that means I can do that one upgrade thing from EVGA if it comes out within the next 2 months. What do you guys think?


Easy, wait for the Titan reviews and benchmarks to be released.
What resolution do you game at? From what I read the 7 series is definitely more than a couple months away.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay okay okay, guys, I have a biiiiiig problem.
> 
> I can't play games right now because I have no graphics card and I'm using the iGPU.
> 
> Should I upgrade right now to a 680 (I can get it for cheap, $400) or wait for the 700-series? I plan on getting the EVGA card so that means I can do that one upgrade thing from EVGA if it comes out within the next 2 months. What do you guys think?
> 
> 
> 
> Easy, wait for the Titan reviews and benchmarks to be released.
> What resolution do you game at? From what I read the 7 series is definitely more than a couple months away.
Click to expand...

The EVGA Step-Up program lasts up to 90 days after original purchase date so 3 months. And, I game at 1440p.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The EVGA Step-Up program lasts up to 90 days after original purchase date so 3 months. And, I game at 1440p.


I have not read that anyone knows for sure when 7 series will be released but some put it at 3rd quarter, which is a ways away. Single monitor 1440p is not that difficult, an overclocked 2gb FTW 670 or 680 can do the job. I am waiting to see what the Titan is and if it affects the price of anything else. I just read a review that showed the 4gb cards are a waste of money even in surround gaming.

I am trying to decide if surround is worth the extra money, a 670 or 680 can handle single monitor gaming without issue, but try for 5760x1200 and things change.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The EVGA Step-Up program lasts up to 90 days after original purchase date so 3 months. And, I game at 1440p.
> 
> 
> 
> I have not read that anyone knows for sure when 7 series will be released but some put it at 3rd quarter, which is a ways away. Single monitor 1440p is not that difficult, an overclocked 2gb FTW 670 or 680 can do the job. I am waiting to see what the Titan is and if it affects the price of anything else. I just read a review that showed the 4gb cards are a waste of money even in surround gaming.
> 
> I am trying to decide if surround is worth the extra money, a 670 or 680 can handle single monitor gaming without issue, but try for 5760x1200 and things change.
Click to expand...

Lol, on Christmas, I was gifted 2 1440p monitors, so with the one I bought myself; I have 3 in total. 2 are still new in box since I don't have a GPU to run it...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, on Christmas, I was gifted 2 1440p monitors, so with the one I bought myself; I have 3 in total. 2 are still new in box since I don't have a GPU to run it...


Triple 1440p in surround means two or three 670 or 680s. Wait a day and see if dual Titans can do the job. Who cares if you spend more on the GPUs than on the whole rest of the system, right?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I told you swag get ati


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I just read a review that showed the 4gb cards are a waste of money even in surround gaming.


Do you have a link for that review? It's something I'm interested in, but hard info is difficult to find. Plenty of bland assertions, but no testing data..............

Swag: According to http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=374923 it's a paper launch tomorrow, and Titan will be limited quantity/expensive.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Do you have a link for that review? It's something I'm interested in, but hard info is difficult to find. Plenty of bland assertions, but no testing data..............
> 
> Swag: According to http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=374923 it's a paper launch tomorrow, and Titan will be limited quantity/expensive.


Sure, here you go:
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/01/14/asus_geforce_gtx_670_directcu_ii_4gb_sli_review/
No matter what they tried, the 4gb cards were not worth the extra money.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, on Christmas, I was gifted 2 1440p monitors, so with the one I bought myself; I have 3 in total. 2 are still new in box since I don't have a GPU to run it...
> 
> 
> 
> Triple 1440p in surround means two or three 670 or 680s. Wait a day and see if dual Titans can do the job. Who cares if you spend more on the GPUs than on the whole rest of the system, right?
Click to expand...

I really can't afford $900 on a single GPU right now. I really only plan to play CS:S and CS:GO and maybe a bit of LoL. Other than that, I don't have too much gaming needs on PC so I don't see a point in dropping $900 on a GPU. I was just thinking when will the normal 700-series line be coming out to see if I should just wait for that instead of jumping on the $400 680.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I told you swag get ati


It is still on my list, I have not ruled it out yet. I can get the Gigabyte 7970 for $420.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Do you have a link for that review? It's something I'm interested in, but hard info is difficult to find. Plenty of bland assertions, but no testing data..............
> 
> Swag: According to http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=374923 it's a paper launch tomorrow, and Titan will be limited quantity/expensive.


4k video will likely change the VRAM calculation anyhow as it will double requirements (mind you, most 2 GB cards would still be ok even then depending on resolutions)...current GTX series can apparently not run 4 K, but a future BIOS update might change that...Titan can run 4K right out of the box.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I really can't afford $900 on a single GPU right now. I really only plan to play CS:S and CS:GO and maybe a bit of LoL. Other than that, I don't have too much gaming needs on PC so I don't see a point in dropping $900 on a GPU. I was just thinking when will the normal 700-series line be coming out to see if I should just wait for that instead of jumping on the $400 680.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is still on my list, I have not ruled it out yet. I can get the Gigabyte 7970 for $420.


Then the Titan and 690 are out, as well as SLI, so single monitor gaming is what you can do. Unless you want to turn down all the settings for a single 680 to try to handle three monitors at 1440p. How can you get such a good deal on a 680?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Do you have a link for that review? It's something I'm interested in, but hard info is difficult to find. Plenty of bland assertions, but no testing data..............
> 
> Swag: According to http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=374923 it's a paper launch tomorrow, and Titan will be limited quantity/expensive.
> 
> 
> 
> 4k video will likely change the VRAM calculation anyhow as it will double requirements (mind you, most 2 GB cards would still be ok even then depending on resolutions)...current GTX series can apparently not run 4 K, but a future BIOS update might change that...Titan can run 4K right out of the box.
Click to expand...

I'll probably upgrade by the time 4k becomes the common. I mean, the 4k TV going on sale is around $30,000! I can't afford that.







I'll stick to my beautiful 1440p monitors for now!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I really can't afford $900 on a single GPU right now. I really only plan to play CS:S and CS:GO and maybe a bit of LoL. Other than that, I don't have too much gaming needs on PC so I don't see a point in dropping $900 on a GPU. I was just thinking when will the normal 700-series line be coming out to see if I should just wait for that instead of jumping on the $400 680.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is still on my list, I have not ruled it out yet. I can get the Gigabyte 7970 for $420.
> 
> 
> 
> Then the Titan and 690 are out, as well as SLI, so single monitor gaming is what you can do. Unless you want to turn down all the settings for a single 680 to try to handle three monitors at 1440p. How can you get such a good deal on a 680?
Click to expand...

Well it's $460 on sale + dad's friend works at MC so an extra deal + a gift card still laying around from Christmas. I still have about $150 in gift cards alone!









So I just heard that 700-series that has the GPU that will succeed the 680 will be out Q3/Q4 of this year, so shouldn't I just jump on this great deal?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay okay okay, guys, I have a biiiiiig problem.
> 
> I can't play games right now because I have no graphics card and I'm using the iGPU.
> 
> Should I upgrade right now to a 680 (I can get it for cheap, $400) or wait for the 700-series? I plan on getting the EVGA card so that means I can do that one upgrade thing from EVGA if it comes out within the next 2 months. What do you guys think?


Don't be a sissy and play single monitor with less resolution (1080p or maybe even 720p)
Wait and see what the fuss is all about regarding titan (two more days or so)
I would get a 7970/50 or two for your rig. Similar cost to a 680 if not a few bucks more. I'd play single monitor really and use a single top of the line gpu. Nvidia is totally castrated for oc, and is beaten by amd's offerings anyways.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I really can't afford $900 on a single GPU right now. I really only plan to play CS:S and CS:GO and maybe a bit of LoL. Other than that, I don't have too much gaming needs on PC so I don't see a point in dropping $900 on a GPU. I was just thinking when will the normal 700-series line be coming out to see if I should just wait for that instead of jumping on the $400 680.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is still on my list, I have not ruled it out yet. I can get the Gigabyte 7970 for $420.


Just get a 7870, 7950, 660ti with a good game bundle and even those are more than enough for the games mentioned. You could go weaker but those 1440p monitors are a lot of pixels!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay okay okay, guys, I have a biiiiiig problem.
> 
> I can't play games right now because I have no graphics card and I'm using the iGPU.
> 
> Should I upgrade right now to a 680 (I can get it for cheap, $400) or wait for the 700-series? I plan on getting the EVGA card so that means I can do that one upgrade thing from EVGA if it comes out within the next 2 months. What do you guys think?
> 
> 
> 
> Don't be a sissy and play single monitor with less resolution (1080p or maybe even 720p)
> Wait and see what the fuss is all about regarding titan (two more days or so)
> I would get a 7970/50 or two for your rig. Similar cost to a 680 if not a few bucks more. I'd play single monitor really and use a single top of the line gpu. Nvidia is totally castrated for oc, and is beaten by amd's offerings anyways.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't mind playing with a single monitor. Most of the time, I only play on my middle monitor anyways, it gives me more of a direct feeling in the game vs surround! I was thinking of the 7970 and it is still on my list. I will weigh my options tomorrow when I go to the store. I want to see which one I can get for cheaper!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I really can't afford $900 on a single GPU right now. I really only plan to play CS:S and CS:GO and maybe a bit of LoL. Other than that, I don't have too much gaming needs on PC so I don't see a point in dropping $900 on a GPU. I was just thinking when will the normal 700-series line be coming out to see if I should just wait for that instead of jumping on the $400 680.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is still on my list, I have not ruled it out yet. I can get the Gigabyte 7970 for $420.
> 
> 
> 
> Just get a 7870, 7950, 660ti with a good game bundle and even those are more than enough for the games mentioned. You could go weaker but those 1440p monitors are a lot of pixels!
Click to expand...

A lot of pixels!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Don't be a sissy and play single monitor with less resolution (1080p or maybe even 720p)
> Wait and see what the fuss is all about regarding titan (two more days or so)
> I would get a 7970/50 or two for your rig. Similar cost to a 680 if not a few bucks more. I'd play single monitor really and use a single top of the line gpu. Nvidia is totally castrated for oc, and is beaten by amd's offerings anyways.


my my...'''sissy, castrated for oc, beaten by AMD's offering' - looks like the red team had a lot of hot peppers for dinner







but let's not have a red vs green team war (ok, may be later).

What worries me is the corporate situation for AMD - while NVidia has just announced another great quarterly financial result, AMD is in yet more trouble...and the new hedge fund owner that calls the shots now (!) recently fired the top AMD squad. Poor AMD is fighting on two fronts - ie. not only graphics with NVidia but CPUs with Intel, and it has had nothing that could even come remotely close to the latest few generation of Intel...it is not that they don't have the engineering skill, but their market position has deteriorated further, and they need to save money...thus no official 7990 (though there is some back-door stuff) and no significant 2013 developments...even the Ares 2 seemed rushed a bit to avoid a direct confrontation with Titan. Compare that with the 690 launch and now Titan. Heck, NVidia is now even getting into the ""CPU"" market.

And I don't need that graduate degree in economics to figure out what will happen when AMD becomes weaker - once its nemesis have weakened it to the point that it cannot react anymore, the overall choice and price ratio we all will face in vid cards - whether red or green team - will go down the tubes.

...as to NVidia not OCing, not only do I deal with folks who have both on LN2, but I just clocked three (!) 670ies up by over 200 in GPU and 800 (effective) on VRAM this weekend


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> my my...'''sissy, castrated for oc, beaten by AMD's offering' - looks like the red team had a lot of hot peppers for dinner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but let's not have a red vs green team war (ok, may be later).
> 
> What worries me is the corporate situation for AMD - while NVidia has just announced another great quarterly financial result, AMD is in yet more trouble...and the new hedge fund owner that calls the shots now (!) recently fired the top AMD squad. Poor AMD is fighting on two fronts - ie. not only graphics with NVidia but CPUs with Intel, and it has had nothing that could even come remotely close to the latest few generation of Intel...it is not that they don't have the engineering skill, but their market position has deteriorated further, and they need to save money...thus no official 7990 (though there is some back-door stuff) and no significant 2013 developments...even the Ares 2 seemed rushed a bit to avoid a direct confrontation with Titan. Compare that with the 690 launch and now Titan. Heck, NVidia is now even getting into the ""CPU"" market.
> 
> And I don't need that graduate degree in economics to figure out what will happen when AMD becomes weaker - once its nemesis have weakened it to the point that it cannot react anymore, the overall choice and price ratio we all will face in vid cards - whether red or green team - will go down the tubes.
> 
> ...as to NVidia not OCing, not only do I deal with folks who have both on LN2, but I just clocked three (!) 670ies up by over 200 in GPU and 800 (effective) on VRAM this weekend


670 FTW








on cold florida air


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 670 FTW
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> on cold florida air


NICE
















...picked up about 1000 pts in 3D Vantage (below) just by modding the cards (results are for SLI, tri-SLI later in the week). To any 600-series GTX owner out there, *I highly recommend the 'KGB' Bios mod* referenced on the first page here http://www.overclock.net/t/1289489/gtx-600-series-unlocked-voltage-bios-downloads-and-tools . You can base it on your own current BIOS but mod it via cfg files...basically, unlimited customization !


----------



## ivanlabrie

I had a bios flashed 670 ftw, mad ram oc and 1330mhz core...still weak and not worth good points at hwbot.
you can now get half decent points at vantage with lod but still the top spots are ln2 7970s anyway. Performance wise for benching amd is where it's at, hard to argue with the top scores...

Now for gaming, it's easier to reccomend nvidia, but not quite when things like the 7870 tahiti le cards exist.
those are cut down 7970s with 7870a price tag. Best bang buck ratio in the planet!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> my my...'''sissy, castrated for oc, beaten by AMD's offering' - looks like the red team had a lot of hot peppers for dinner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but let's not have a red vs green team war (ok, may be later).
> 
> What worries me is the corporate situation for AMD - while NVidia has just announced another great quarterly financial result, AMD is in yet more trouble...and the new hedge fund owner that calls the shots now (!) recently fired the top AMD squad. Poor AMD is fighting on two fronts - ie. not only graphics with NVidia but CPUs with Intel, and it has had nothing that could even come remotely close to the latest few generation of Intel...it is not that they don't have the engineering skill, but their market position has deteriorated further, and they need to save money...thus no official 7990 (though there is some back-door stuff) and no significant 2013 developments...even the Ares 2 seemed rushed a bit to avoid a direct confrontation with Titan. Compare that with the 690 launch and now Titan. Heck, NVidia is now even getting into the ""CPU"" market.
> 
> And I don't need that graduate degree in economics to figure out what will happen when AMD becomes weaker - once its nemesis have weakened it to the point that it cannot react anymore, the overall choice and price ratio we all will face in vid cards - whether red or green team - will go down the tubes.
> 
> ...as to NVidia not OCing, not only do I deal with folks who have both on LN2, but I just clocked three (!) 670ies up by over 200 in GPU and 800 (effective) on VRAM this weekend


----------



## Belial

Has anyone tried using fluxless solder after delidding? I mean... wouldn't that be the best solution? You know for sure it works because it was done on millions of times before.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't try...for some reason Intel didn't in the first place, and it sounds like a fancy way of killing your chip.
Plus Liquid Ultra and Pro have better thermal conductivity any way.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't try...for some reason Intel didn't in the first place, and it sounds like a fancy way of killing your chip.
> Plus Liquid Ultra and Pro have better thermal conductivity any way.


^^^ I think that's right...flux less solder applied in an industrial environment (clean room) is one thing, but trying to do that at home will bring a lot of issues of contamination, among other things


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't try...for some reason Intel didn't in the first place, and it sounds like a fancy way of killing your chip.
> Plus Liquid Ultra and Pro have better thermal conductivity any way.
> 
> 
> 
> ^^^ I think that's right...flux less solder applied in an industrial environment (clean room) is one thing, but trying to do that at home will bring a lot of issues of contamination, among other things
Click to expand...

And, it is an extremely hard process to do. That chances of killing your CPU is probably 95%.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I had a bios flashed 670 ftw, mad ram oc and 1330mhz core...still weak and not worth good points at hwbot.
> you can now get half decent points at vantage with lod but still the top spots are ln2 7970s anyway. Performance wise for benching amd is where it's at, hard to argue with the top scores...
> 
> Now for gaming, it's easier to reccomend nvidia, but not quite when things like the 7870 tahiti le cards exist.
> those are cut down 7970s with 7870a price tag. Best bang buck ratio in the planet!


...I can tell you that in many benchmarks (not just Vantage), and using bone-stock settings (re Lod) on my oc'ed 670ies, I get results now that are within 7970 CF and 680 SLI range, including oc'ed ones. Ultimately, the 7970 will have a higher head-room on crazy v's, and *I really like the 7970ies*...but up here at least, the pricing of them was just not as competitive. And all the guys I know who have and love 7970ies tell me that CF (especially 3 or 4 cards) creates far worse driver issues, micros-stutter etc than SLI does.

...but even that was not my point...it's the corporate difficulty AMD has. Here is a quote from MaximumPC on a technical issue: _"The report concludes that Its possible Intel may eventually change the design back, however with AMD lagging pretty far behind these days they really don't have much incentive to do so. Enthusiasts really only have one place to shop for CPU's these days."_

I hope this does not translate into less competition in the GPU space...I would like to see AMD come up with a direct challenger to 'Titan' but know that won't happen soon - not because they don't make good stuff but because they are in a much more difficult corporate situation. Remember 3DFX and Voodoo ?...


----------



## Hokies83

They did not use Solder because it damages the Die.

Due to it's size this is why All intel chips from now on will Use Tim and not solder....

Lets just hope they use better tim and less distance from the die to the IHS.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> They did not use Solder because it damages the Die.
> 
> Due to it's size this is why All intel chips from now on will Use Tim and not solder....
> 
> Lets just hope they use better tim and less distance from the die to the IHS.


The TIM they use is actually top-notch TIM. It's just the distance/gap between the IHS and PCB that ruins the temps!









Anyone got any say on overclocking the 680? I keep hearing that they degrade even on stock voltages!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The TIM they use is actually top-notch TIM. It's just the distance/gap between the IHS and PCB that ruins the temps!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone got any say on overclocking the 680? I keep hearing that they degrade even on stock voltages!


Best thing to do with a 680 is to sell it or get your money back and get a 7970 lol...

I would but im waiting for the new stuff...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The TIM they use is actually top-notch TIM. It's just the distance/gap between the IHS and PCB that ruins the temps!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone got any say on overclocking the 680? I keep hearing that they degrade even on stock voltages!
> 
> 
> 
> Best thing to do with a 680 is to sell it or get your money back and get a 7970 lol...
> 
> I would but im waiting for the new stuff...
Click to expand...

Haven't bought the card yet, still weighing my options between a 680 and 7970!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> They did not use Solder because it damages the Die.
> 
> Due to it's size this is why All intel chips from now on will Use Tim and not solder....
> 
> Lets just hope they use better tim and less distance from the die to the IHS.


...yup, and there is also the fact that Intel had just switched to the 22nm process. Whatever we think of Intel, when it gets to this stuff, they are pretty much the smartest people on the planet - I speculate that the extra space between die and IHS (we remove) and also the TIM was 'insurance' for them after introducing a new 22nm process to see what their yield would be - it would not have taken very much for them to adjust the TIM or height of the IHS-to-die without scrapping a whole bunch of wafers to create different temperature and v patterns if the yield was worse - after all, that what we do here at delid, and quite successfully so


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> They did not use Solder because it damages the Die.
> 
> Due to it's size this is why All intel chips from now on will Use Tim and not solder....
> 
> Lets just hope they use better tim and less distance from the die to the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> ...yup, and there is also the fact that Intel had just switched to the 22nm process. Whatever we think of Intel, when it gets to this stuff, they are pretty much the smartest people on the planet - I speculate that the extra space between die and IHS (we remove) and also the TIM was 'insurance' for them after introducing a new 22nm process to see what their yield would be - it would not have taken very much for them to adjust the TIM or height of the IHS-to-die without scrapping a whole bunch of wafers to create different temperature and v patterns if the yield was worse - after all, that what we do here at delid, and quite successfully so
Click to expand...

Actually, I assume they have the glue there for insurance to not crush the more sensitive die (because it is smaller) and the fact that they want to keep all the chips uniform. It would be hard to glue the IHS onto the die so closely to the PCB and have it the same as every other chip. And you don't get that visual verification that the IHS is attached properly.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haven't bought the card yet, still weighing my options between a 680 and 7970!


7970 easy choice.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haven't bought the card yet, still weighing my options between a 680 and 7970!
> 
> 
> 
> 7970 easy choice.
Click to expand...

It's so hard because one side tells me the 680s are better and the other side tells me the 7970 is better.







I hate these mixed thoughts!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It's so hard because one side tells me the 680s are better and the other side tells me the 7970 is better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate these mixed thoughts!


Choose your poison...

Sli scales well and is pretty straightforward to set up. AMD drivers and crossfire profiles tend to be less user friendly, but I think they got it down with the latest 13.2 beta from what I gather.

7970's are cheaper and beat 680's, and can be overclocked much more, whilst giving lots more performance gain for each extra mhz.
A simple 100mhz oc on the core on my buddy's Gigabyte Windforce oc 7970 got us a big performance jump, and 100 more mhz (1200mhz) was even better, beating much higher clocked lightning and classified volt modded 680's (hard mods/evbot or nda afterburner 2.2.3) which cost more!

I got a big chunk of boints from a single heaven xtreme benchmark, and I expect a lot more after running all the other tests with the new 1200mhz 1700mhz mem oc on that 7970.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It's so hard because one side tells me the 680s are better and the other side tells me the 7970 is better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate these mixed thoughts!
> 
> 
> 
> Choose your poison...
> 
> Sli scales well and is pretty straightforward to set up. AMD drivers and crossfire profiles tend to be less user friendly, but I think they got it down with the latest 13.2 beta from what I gather.
> 
> 7970's are cheaper and beat 680's, and can be overclocked much more, whilst giving lots more performance gain for each extra mhz.
> A simple 100mhz oc on the core on my buddy's Gigabyte Windforce oc 7970 got us a big performance jump, and 100 more mhz (1200mhz) was even better, beating much higher clocked lightning and classified volt modded 680's (hard mods/evbot or nda afterburner 2.2.3) which cost more!
> 
> I got a big chunk of boints from a single heaven xtreme benchmark, and I expect a lot more after running all the other tests with the new 1200mhz 1700mhz mem oc on that 7970.
Click to expand...

My brother is dead-set on the Gigabyte 7970 WF. I, on the other hand is still having one of those moments on whichever I choose, I'll feel bad afterwards.







I've had ATI GPUs up till now and when I first got my 5870s back in 2009, the drivers really messed up. Are they fixed now? I keep reading that they are but there are some of those random posts where they say they that experienced crashes/faults in the drivers

I do plan to SLI/Crossfire down the road (maybe when 700-series comes out if prices drop) no matter what, just matters on how soon. Which is better for a 2x GPU setup? A lot of also's so another one, what do you think of the overclocking problems of the 680? Like some people swear that Keplers degrade even on stock voltage, by just raising the clocks, it degrades.


----------



## King4x4

Take it from me.

Single Card Go AMD

Crossfire Cards Go AMD

Tri-fire.... Don't touch AMD

Quadfire.... Don't touch AMD.

AMD is the best currently (until titan arrives) with benchmarks... they make

Single screen go right ahead with AMD.

Mutli-Screens Go Nvidia.

The headaches I had with Eyefinity with quadfire is just crazy even with 13.2 drivers (Which were awesome by the way) is just good.

My only gripe is that with 7680x1440 the Displayport goes into a deep sleep that shutdowns the game and the screen and you need to do a complete restart to fix it.

Not good to go when you are playing in a very competitive BF3 session and that happens...

So... I switched two of my 7950s with a 690 and bought two 680 4GB... but titan arrives.... Same performance on Multi-screen with two GPUs that have the same performance as 4x680s? Yes please!


----------



## Swag

Joa3d43 ;lilchronic; ivanlabrie; Hokies83; Hokies83; King4x4

+rep, I just wanted you guys to know thanks for putting up with my indecisiveness!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Take it from me.
> 
> Single Card Go AMD
> 
> Crossfire Cards Go AMD
> 
> Tri-fire.... Don't touch AMD
> 
> Quadfire.... Don't touch AMD.
> 
> AMD is the best currently (until titan arrives) with benchmarks... they make
> 
> Single screen go right ahead with AMD.
> 
> Mutli-Screens Go Nvidia.
> 
> The headaches I had with Eyefinity with quadfire is just crazy even with 13.2 drivers (Which were awesome by the way) is just good.
> 
> My only gripe is that with 7680x1440 the Displayport goes into a deep sleep that shutdowns the game and the screen and you need to do a complete restart to fix it.
> 
> Not good to go when you are playing in a very competitive BF3 session and that happens...
> 
> So... I switched two of my 7950s with a 690 and bought two 680 4GB... but titan arrives.... Same performance on Multi-screen with two GPUs that have the same performance as 4x680s? Yes please!


I will be doing multi-screens. I plan on getting a 2nd card also. I will be gaming on a 1440p monitor (center one only!), the other 2 monitors will be used for when I watch movies/edit/school.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I really can't afford $900 on a single GPU right now. I really only plan to play CS:S and CS:GO and maybe a bit of LoL. Other than that, I don't have too much gaming needs on PC so I don't see a point in dropping $900 on a GPU. I was just thinking when will the normal 700-series line be coming out to see if I should just wait for that instead of jumping on the $400 680.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is still on my list, I have not ruled it out yet. I can get the Gigabyte 7970 for $420.


900 is far to much. I'm very skeptical about the titan. I think they are just trying to help out their branch of video editor cards like the tesla, but that from a guy who has a bunch of video maker buddies. I might buy one this summer and make it scream and see how far it will go, but only one... no more no less.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 4k video will likely change the VRAM calculation anyhow as it will double requirements (mind you, most 2 GB cards would still be ok even then depending on resolutions)...current GTX series can apparently not run 4 K, but a future BIOS update might change that...Titan can run 4K right out of the box.


Agree completely. Also there is even 5K video as well let me know and I'll show you some.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> NICE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...picked up about 1000 pts in 3D Vantage (below) just by modding the cards (results are for SLI, tri-SLI later in the week). To any 600-series GTX owner out there, *I highly recommend the 'KGB' Bios mod* referenced on the first page here http://www.overclock.net/t/1289489/gtx-600-series-unlocked-voltage-bios-downloads-and-tools . You can base it on your own current BIOS but mod it via cfg files...basically, unlimited customization !


here's my 680 about 4 months ago with my i7 at 5.5 giggles and trashing about in anger at only 0C This is what a older reference card with cold air and an antec 620 does when OC'ed right with beta drivers, the new ones are even better, it took a lot of time getting it tweaked just right though, lot of mental math involved along with error redoing every crash.

http://www.3dmark.com/3dmv/4553724
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Has anyone tried using fluxless solder after delidding? I mean... wouldn't that be the best solution? You know for sure it works because it was done on millions of times before.


nope. because you can't. It has to be done in a completely controlled environment and it must be done by robots and with nano meter precision, along with speed and stability to align everything properly and not mess everything up.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> They did not use Solder because it damages the Die.
> 
> Due to it's size this is why All intel chips from now on will Use Tim and not solder....
> 
> Lets just hope they use better tim and less distance from the die to the IHS.


again hokies... not the TIM, the distance issue
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Choose your poison...
> 
> Sli scales well and is pretty straightforward to set up. AMD drivers and crossfire profiles tend to be less user friendly, but I think they got it down with the latest 13.2 beta from what I gather.
> 
> 7970's are cheaper and beat 680's, and can be overclocked much more, whilst giving lots more performance gain for each extra mhz.
> A simple 100mhz oc on the core on my buddy's Gigabyte Windforce oc 7970 got us a big performance jump, and 100 more mhz (1200mhz) was even better, beating much higher clocked lightning and classified volt modded 680's (hard mods/evbot or nda afterburner 2.2.3) which cost more!
> 
> I got a big chunk of boints from a single heaven xtreme benchmark, and I expect a lot more after running all the other tests with the new 1200mhz 1700mhz mem oc on that 7970.


Here..... lets make this a very simple comparison.

Swag what do you want for you computer and what do you plan to do with it? Not what everybody else thinks, but what YOU want. I've said this very few times, it's your rig, choose your parts that you want.

Just remember one thing AMD and Nvidia are good at their own things, but not both. Nvidia = better for gamers. AMD = better for benchers right now, plain and simple as that.

Thats all I have to say on this topic, it's your choice now, no one elses, only yours.


----------



## Swag

This *was* one long post!







Only 1 would still leave me broke!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Choose your poison...
> 
> Sli scales well and is pretty straightforward to set up. AMD drivers and crossfire profiles tend to be less user friendly, but I think they got it down with the latest 13.2 beta from what I gather.
> 
> 7970's are cheaper and beat 680's, and can be overclocked much more, whilst giving lots more performance gain for each extra mhz.
> A simple 100mhz oc on the core on my buddy's Gigabyte Windforce oc 7970 got us a big performance jump, and 100 more mhz (1200mhz) was even better, beating much higher clocked lightning and classified volt modded 680's (hard mods/evbot or nda afterburner 2.2.3) which cost more!
> 
> I got a big chunk of boints from a single heaven xtreme benchmark, and I expect a lot more after running all the other tests with the new 1200mhz 1700mhz mem oc on that 7970.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here..... lets make this a very simple comparison.
> 
> Swag what do you want for you computer and what do you plan to do with it? Not what everybody else thinks, but what YOU want. I've said this very few times, it's your rig, choose your parts that you want.
> 
> Just remember one thing AMD and Nvidia are good at their own things, but not both. Nvidia = better for gamers. AMD = better for benchers right now, plain and simple as that.
> 
> Thats all I have to say on this topic, it's your choice now, no one elses, only yours.
Click to expand...

Yea, I know but I like inputs.







I have a bad case of buyers remorse every time I buy something, like when I went 3570k. Even though I knew that I wouldn't need the extra threads and all they would do is basically hinder my gaming in some cases, I still had that remorse! For gaming, Nvidia is better? I don't GPU bench at all, it really hasn't interested me too much. I prefer CPU benching! It's more straightfoward to me.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually, I assume they have the glue there for insurance to not crush the more sensitive die (because it is smaller) and the fact that they want to keep all the chips uniform. It would be hard to glue the IHS onto the die so closely to the PCB and have it the same as every other chip. And you don't get that visual verification that the IHS is attached properly.


...actually, per earlier posts, my 3770K's IHS was a bit *crooked* (runs great and benches at 5.3 GHz per separate thread)- which is why I call it the 'ugly duckling'


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This *was* one long post!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only 1 would still leave me broke!
> Yea, I know but I like inputs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a bad case of buyers remorse every time I buy something, like when I went 3570k. Even though I knew that I wouldn't need the extra threads and all they would do is basically hinder my gaming in some cases, I still had that remorse! For gaming, Nvidia is better? I don't GPU bench at all, it really hasn't interested me too much. I prefer CPU benching! It's more straightfoward to me.


here take a look at my HWbot link in a sec and look at the ranking of where my referance card 680 on a cpu cooler stands on water against full custom loops with better cards than mine.

http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_vantage_-_performance/rankings#start=0#interval=20#cores=1#coolingType=3

go a few more along I'm ranked about 70 ish. but the main point is look at all the 7970 there, they are made to bench and they do bench well. I bought my 680 for gaming, and I couldn't be happier. also when you look at how Nvidia and evga release their new drivers... they show the results on how they improved form their last drivers by playing games, I really enjoy this part they go yeah our last driver sucked kinda hard huh... well this one will get you another 10 fps. Enjoy. I don't know if AMD does that, but I like it that evga does. makes me feel like they enjoy making my games better.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Take it from me.
> 
> Single Card Go AMD
> 
> Crossfire Cards Go AMD
> 
> Tri-fire.... Don't touch AMD
> 
> Quadfire.... Don't touch AMD.
> 
> AMD is the best currently (until titan arrives) with benchmarks... they make
> 
> Single screen go right ahead with AMD.
> 
> Mutli-Screens Go Nvidia.
> 
> The headaches I had with Eyefinity with quadfire is just crazy even with 13.2 drivers (Which were awesome by the way) is just good.
> 
> My only gripe is that with 7680x1440 the Displayport goes into a deep sleep that shutdowns the game and the screen and you need to do a complete restart to fix it.
> 
> Not good to go when you are playing in a very competitive BF3 session and that happens...
> 
> So... I switched two of my 7950s with a 690 and bought two 680 4GB... but titan arrives.... Same performance on Multi-screen with two GPUs that have the same performance as 4x680s? Yes please!


One thing Nvidia holds over Amd is that it's drivers are less buggy and user friendly then Amd's

And that is about it.. other then power and heat. Amd wins everywhere else price per performance over all performance...


----------



## Hokies83

And Valguar read the whole post before you try and call me stupid.... heh noobs XD


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This *was* one long post!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only 1 would still leave me broke!
> Yea, I know but I like inputs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a bad case of buyers remorse every time I buy something, like when I went 3570k. Even though I knew that I wouldn't need the extra threads and all they would do is basically hinder my gaming in some cases, I still had that remorse! For gaming, Nvidia is better? I don't GPU bench at all, it really hasn't interested me too much. I prefer CPU benching! It's more straightfoward to me.
> 
> 
> 
> here take a look at my HWbot link in a sec and look at the ranking of where my referance card 680 on a cpu cooler stands on water against full custom loops with better cards than mine.
> 
> http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_vantage_-_performance/rankings#start=0#interval=20#cores=1#coolingType=3
> 
> go a few more along I'm ranked about 70 ish. but the main point is look at all the 7970 there, they are made to bench and they do bench well. I bought my 680 for gaming, and I couldn't be happier. also when you look at how Nvidia and evga release their new drivers... they show the results on how they improved form their last drivers by playing games, I really enjoy this part they go yeah our last driver sucked kinda hard huh... well this one will get you another 10 fps. Enjoy. I don't know if AMD does that, but I like it that evga does. makes me feel like they enjoy making my games better.
Click to expand...

So Val, on a scale from 1 - 10, how satisfied are you with your purchase? Do you have any buyer's regret? I do agree though on the part of EVGA, they look like they actually like taking care of their customers!







I really like the 680 for aesthetics, and it is $20 cheaper than the 7970 in my case so it is a bonus.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> here take a look at my HWbot link in a sec and look at the ranking of where my referance card 680 on a cpu cooler stands on water against full custom loops with better cards than mine.
> 
> http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_vantage_-_performance/rankings#start=0#interval=20#cores=1#coolingType=3
> 
> go a few more along I'm ranked about 70 ish. but the main point is look at all the 7970 there, they are made to bench and they do bench well. I bought my 680 for gaming, and I couldn't be happier. also when you look at how Nvidia and evga release their new drivers... they show the results on how they improved form their last drivers by playing games, I really enjoy this part they go yeah our last driver sucked kinda hard huh... well this one will get you another 10 fps. Enjoy. I don't know if AMD does that, but I like it that evga does. makes me feel like they enjoy making my games better.


...good point re driver support by NVidia...but for *SWAG,* I don't really see the problem...it is nice to have a choice...whether you end up getting a single 7970 or 680 (670?), you will have a lot of fun either way...if you plan to add a 2nd or especially 3rd card later, then your choice probably should be biased more towards NVidia

...or just 'sell your brother' and get a Titan...or if you like your brother a lot, hold out a bit until you get two Titans


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> here take a look at my HWbot link in a sec and look at the ranking of where my referance card 680 on a cpu cooler stands on water against full custom loops with better cards than mine.
> 
> http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_vantage_-_performance/rankings#start=0#interval=20#cores=1#coolingType=3
> 
> go a few more along I'm ranked about 70 ish. but the main point is look at all the 7970 there, they are made to bench and they do bench well. I bought my 680 for gaming, and I couldn't be happier. also when you look at how Nvidia and evga release their new drivers... they show the results on how they improved form their last drivers by playing games, I really enjoy this part they go yeah our last driver sucked kinda hard huh... well this one will get you another 10 fps. Enjoy. I don't know if AMD does that, but I like it that evga does. makes me feel like they enjoy making my games better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...good point re driver support by NVidia...but for *SWAG,* I don't really see the problem...it is nice to have a choice...whether you end up getting a single 7970 or 680 (670?), you will have a lot of fun either way...if you plan to add a 2nd or especially 3rd card later, then your choice probably should be biased more towards NVidia
> 
> ...or just 'sell your brother' and get a Titan...or if you like your brother a lot, hold out a bit until you get two Titans
Click to expand...

Haha, funny on the last part.







I actually thought about the 670 but for only $50 more, I can get a 680! What's the point in getting the 670 then?







I plan on getting a 2nd card because AFAIK, you need a 2 gpu setup for Nvidia to run 3 monitors. I'm just looking for the best gaming card, I don't plan to bench really.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And Valguar read the whole post before you try and call me stupid.... heh noobs XD


my bad sorry been watching anime all day and reading subtitles get to you after 5 hours








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So Val, on a scale from 1 - 10, how satisfied are you with your purchase? Do you have any buyer's regret? I do agree though on the part of EVGA, they look like they actually like taking care of their customers!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I really like the 680 for aesthetics, and it is $20 cheaper than the 7970 in my case so it is a bonus.


I say an easy 7-8 out of 10.... mainly on the benching side only though, I really wish I had unlocked voltage for my benhcing fun. but for gaming 10/10 couldn't be happier with it.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, funny on the last part.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I actually thought about the 670 but for only $50 more, I can get a 680! What's the point in getting the 670 then?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I plan on getting a 2nd card because AFAIK, you need a 2 gpu setup for Nvidia to run 3 monitors. I'm just looking for the best gaming card, I don't plan to bench really.


for the price your getting it for and the multi monitor setup in the future with the dual gpu needs. get the nvidia cards now while you can, I bet those 700 cards wont come out until late June or mid july, everything comes out for a company around that time, mid year time is the bread and butter to get investors and crank up the stock prices and make people love you. quit waiting.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And Valguar read the whole post before you try and call me stupid.... heh noobs XD
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my bad sorry been watching anime all day and reading subtitles get to you after 5 hours
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> So Val, on a scale from 1 - 10, how satisfied are you with your purchase? Do you have any buyer's regret? I do agree though on the part of EVGA, they look like they actually like taking care of their customers!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I really like the 680 for aesthetics, and it is $20 cheaper than the 7970 in my case so it is a bonus.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I say an easy 7-8 out of 10.... mainly on the benching side only though, I really wish I had unlocked voltage for my benhcing fun. but for gaming 10/10 couldn't be happier with it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha, funny on the last part.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I actually thought about the 670 but for only $50 more, I can get a 680! What's the point in getting the 670 then?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I plan on getting a 2nd card because AFAIK, you need a 2 gpu setup for Nvidia to run 3 monitors. I'm just looking for the best gaming card, I don't plan to bench really.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> for the price your getting it for and the multi monitor setup in the future with the dual gpu needs. get the nvidia cards now while you can, I bet those 700 cards wont come out until late June or mid july, everything comes out for a company around that time, mid year time is the bread and butter to get investors and crank up the stock prices and make people love you. quit waiting.
Click to expand...

I actually heard it's going to be coming out in Q3/Q4 this year. Also, how's the overclockability of the 680? Does it degrade like many people make it seem like?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I actually heard it's going to be coming out in Q3/Q4 this year. Also, how's the overclockability of the 680? Does it degrade like many people make it seem like?


no that's a lie. I have been getting better at OC'ing my card lately actually I think the drivers are making this thing really start to shine, I just need another franky to come back to life and let me try them out to the fullest really.







I can get 1,270 / 3,402 MHz on my 680. different values I know but it's how they work.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I actually heard it's going to be coming out in Q3/Q4 this year. Also, how's the overclockability of the 680? Does it degrade like many people make it seem like?
> 
> 
> 
> no that's a lie. I have been getting better at OC'ing my card lately actually I think the drivers are making this thing really start to shine, I just need another franky to come back to life and let me try them out to the fullest really.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can get 1,270 / 3,402 MHz on my 680. different values I know but it's how they work.
Click to expand...

Okay, thanks a lot!







+rep. I really don't want to get another card that will degrade almost instantly. I just looked at the 670 as an option but I can't stand giving up more of the CUDA cores.







Not that they do too much either.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> no that's a lie. I have been getting better at OC'ing my card lately actually I think the drivers are making this thing really start to shine, I just need another franky to come back to life and let me try them out to the fullest really.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can get 1,270 / 3,402 MHz on my 680. different values I know but it's how they work.


...you might be right about the drivers (I'm using 313.96)...and I also got all three 670ies clocked to 3402 on VRAM (6804 effective), and 3 GPUs between 1240 and 1320

...another thing to consider is stock power usage. 670 = 144w, 680= 175w and 7970 is around 250w to 280w according to Anandtech...then again, I'm running 150% power target ...when you have two or three cards going, this can make a noticeable difference every month.


----------



## lilchronic

here are alot of good results of 670/680 and 7950/7970 and lots of good graphs
http://www.overclock.net/t/1360884/top-30-unigine-valley-benchmark-1-0
just thought id point this out #1 670 ftw score for single card







come get some.


----------



## King4x4

I am holding the third position on that chart woot woot!

Was the first to find out a profile for that benchmark for quadfire users... 15 mins after posting the fix all of them shot up above me


----------



## ivanlabrie

Those new 3dmark suits seem to favor nvidia in some ways...
I still insist on the 7970, Swag's running three 1440p screens. That's AMD's realm really, there's no contest performance wise.
The memory bandwidth is limited and the rop's limit the kepler's even more for that kind of screen real estate.
Costs less, performs better, no prob with 2x gpu's in crossfire either, you can overclock further and it WILL make a difference.









I had my gpu as far as 1400mhz core and 7800mhz ram effective yet still it got beaten badly at 3dm11 and heaven. For the same kind of money I could have gotten a reference 7970 (got my 670 ftw for 325 + 35 shipping) and it would have been much better.
Plenty of Nvidia fanbois here xD jk jk

EDIT: Valgaur, you might wanna check the top vantage scores at the bot...all 7970's and a few 580's! yep, real high end designs, built for overclockers.


----------



## jay2nice000

hey everyone been out of the game for alil, but did intel every fix the tim problem with ivy chips?


----------



## King4x4

I won't touch an AMD card again for eyefinity.... I am daily having at least two Displayport disconnects since I updated to 13.2.

Meaning that the eyefinity connection drops and I go down to 1024x800 resolution and I must shutdown (not only restart) the PC to get that screen back.

Going Nvidia soon for the oh glorious stable DVI ports.


----------



## Stu-Crossfire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I won't touch an AMD card again for eyefinity.... I am daily having at least two Displayport disconnects since I updated to 13.2.
> 
> Meaning that the eyefinity connection drops and I go down to 1024x800 resolution and I must shutdown (not only restart) the PC to get that screen back.
> 
> Going Nvidia soon for the oh glorious stable DVI ports.


Interestingly I was reading about a few guys with EXACTLY the same problem over on rog forums, which they fixed.
Was it you? if not, I shall elaborate.


----------



## King4x4

Not me.

But I read their "fix" and it's only viable for those who own a DP equipped screen... us Adapter users (DP to DVI Active Adapters) are not even looked at.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Those new 3dmark suits seem to favor nvidia in some ways...
> EDIT: Valgaur, you might wanna check the top vantage scores at the bot...all 7970's and a few 580's! yep, real high end designs, built for overclockers.


thats what im saying. 7970 = benching 680 = gaming.


----------



## stickg1

Shouldn't Dutch be here with breakfast by now?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Shouldn't Dutch be here with breakfast by now?


let the old man sleep


----------



## stickg1

FtW 420 has the World Record for AMD K10 chips...

http://valid.canardpc.com/records.php


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I have a 660ti - but that's great for my rig.
You try running my 660ti or a 680 on 3x 1440p monitors and the 7950 let alone 7970 will absolutely DESTROY it.
Each rig is different - I know nvidia are better for gaming generally speaking, but ATI have caught up a lot.
For a rig with more than 2 monitors or wanting to play solid 1080p on 3 - ATI without a SHADOW of a doubt.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Shouldn't Dutch be here with breakfast by now?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> let the old man sleep


i know , im a bit later then normal, ... lunchtime now ..lol
and yes, i did sleep long today.. 9am outta bed..


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> hey everyone been out of the game for alil, but did intel every fix the tim problem with ivy chips?


not yet,
and Haswell will have tim also, im curious if they will change anything on that ..


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> hey everyone been out of the game for alil, but did intel every fix the tim problem with ivy chips?


Did they fix it? No, but we seem to be doing a pretty good job of fixing it.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well this thing about Nvidia vs AMD all depends on the user for me AMD looks better than Nvidia the colors are better (image detail) if you know what i mean.


----------



## VonDutch

i love my gigabyte 7970 windforce 3 ,
pity i could only oc it to 1100/1500, cant change voltages on it ..but does great anyways


----------



## [CyGnus]

I had luck with my Asus 7870V2 it does 1200 core (24/7) default voltage with 1.3v (with vdrop is 1.24v) 1270 core for benching. The mem goes up to 1550 but i cant see any improvement over 1350/1400 though the best thing is that I have ZERO capacitor whinning


----------



## Joa3d43

I own both AMD/ATI and NVIDIA products. 7970ies are nice cards, but they use almost *100 Watts MORE* than comparable NVidia products (in this day and age?)...or put differently, *EVEN* the new TITAN uses slightly less power than the 7970.

The driver problems on multi-GPUs are far worse with the AMD/ATI, incl. micro-stutter- I ran AMD /ATI in my main machine until last October.

AMD/ATI is loosing in the marketplace, unlike NVidia which is gaining - what are the reasons ? I don't want to see AMD/ATI disappear because it is bad for choice and pricing


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Update on my RA:
Rejected due to physical damage - Severe track damage around one of the cpu cooler mounting holes. The serial number label has been tampered with, looks like its been removed and taped back on. Photos on the OLQ.

I called thme to contest it, and they will llook into it.
Last time I'm buying from SCAN UK, and buying an asus motherboard.

That's absolutely ridiculous to reject it due to the sticker (due to the antec being mounted) and due tot he CPU MOUNTING holes supposedly showing traces.

Their take on severely damaged is quite funny.
If it comes back not replaced- I'll go to tradings standards and finally flash the bios chip.

So very dissapointed.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> I own both AMD/ATI and NVIDIA products. 7970ies are nice cards, but they use almost *100 Watts MORE* than comparable NVidia products (in this day and age?)...or put differently, *EVEN* the new TITAN uses slightly less power than the 7970.
> 
> The driver problems on multi-GPUs are far worse with the AMD/ATI, incl. micro-stutter- I ran AMD /ATI in my main machine until last October.
> 
> AMD/ATI is loosing in the marketplace, unlike NVidia which is gaining - what are the reasons ? I don't want to see AMD/ATI disappear because it is bad for choice and pricing


if your into overclocking and such, you shouldnt look at what it uses,
top end products arent made that way..
you cant run 5.0ghz on ivy, and expect it runs economical








at least im not looking at all at those things..lol

besides that, my 7970 isnt running 100% load 24/7,
the few hours a day it has to work while gaming,
wont make that much difference at the end of the year when the electric bill comes in,
i expect the drivers will get better for CF , at least they work on better drivers all of the time..


----------



## justanoldman

For those of you with experience in three monitor gaming, how good is it? Currently I use my 30inch 2560x1600 which is great, but I am wondering if the cost in GPUs to game at 5760x1200 is worth it. Do many games work well with three monitors? Just looking for any opinions.


----------



## King4x4

[email protected] is veeeery nice!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Those new 3dmark suits seem to favor nvidia in some ways...
> I still insist on the 7970, Swag's running three 1440p screens. That's AMD's realm really, there's no contest performance wise.
> The memory bandwidth is limited and the rop's limit the kepler's even more for that kind of screen real estate.
> Costs less, performs better, no prob with 2x gpu's in crossfire either, you can overclock further and it WILL make a difference.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had my gpu as far as 1400mhz core and 7800mhz ram effective yet still it got beaten badly at 3dm11 and heaven. For the same kind of money I could have gotten a reference 7970 (got my 670 ftw for 325 + 35 shipping) and it would have been much better.
> Plenty of Nvidia fanbois here xD jk jk
> 
> EDIT: Valgaur, you might wanna check the top vantage scores at the bot...all 7970's and a few 580's! yep, real high end designs, built for overclockers.


I was actually a fanboy for ATI because I've never really owned a Nvidia card myself.







If I go for the 680, this will be my first Nvidia card.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Not me.
> 
> But I read their "fix" and it's only viable for those who own a DP equipped screen... us Adapter users (DP to DVI Active Adapters) are not even looked at.


Haha! I remember when Eyefinity first became slightly big, I jumped on the wagon and bought everything. Then I learned you needed DP to DVI Active Adapters and at that time, they were around $140 a piece!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Shouldn't Dutch be here with breakfast by now?


I love how you know when he gets up in the morning... Suspicious...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> For those of you with experience in three monitor gaming, how good is it? Currently I use my 30inch 2560x1600 which is great, but I am wondering if the cost in GPUs to game at 5760x1200 is worth it. Do many games work well with three monitors? Just looking for any opinions.


They work pretty well with three monitors, they also look beautiful. The question is, can your system sustain all that power needs!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It's so hard because one side tells me the 680s are better and the other side tells me the 7970 is better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate these mixed thoughts!


Over lock potential of 7000 series is huge I can get my msi 7950 to 1300 and 1750 on air and I easily beat 680s and am in line with a lot of oced 7970s. Imo get the 7970.








I also got a golden 7950 tho cause I only need 1.25 volts for that and temps dont exceed 76 degrees at those clocks in mark11 that is


----------



## justanoldman

I am starting to understand how people can spend almost as much on fans as the case itself. Nothing wrong with my new case, especially since it wasn't expensive, but man these included case fans are horrible.

Why you would include four 140mm fans that are just going to be thrown away, or taken out to a nearby field and taken care of like in the Office Space movie, is beyond me.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am starting to understand how people can spend almost as much on fans as the case itself. Nothing wrong with my new case, especially since it wasn't expensive, but man these included case fans are horrible.
> 
> Why you would include four 140mm fans that are just going to be thrown away, or taken out to a nearby field and taken care of like in the Office Space movie, is beyond me.


The love of your PC.







I mean $20/fan, Hokies probably has around 30+ fans in total, I'd say he spent a good 80% of the case price. This is OCN! We ain't subject to common sense!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was actually a fanboy for ATI because I've never really owned a Nvidia card myself.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I go for the 680, this will be my first Nvidia card.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha! I remember when Eyefinity first became slightly big, I jumped on the wagon and bought everything. Then I learned you needed DP to DVI Active Adapters and at that time, they were around $140 a piece!
> I love how you know when he gets up in the morning... Suspicious...
> They work pretty well with three monitors, they also look beautiful. The question is, can your system sustain all that power needs!


Get a 680 Lightning then, other models require hard mods...You would only need to get the special AB 2.2.3 (nda) and voila, voltage control.
If you get to 1400mhz core and 7800mhz ram that should be enough to max anything at 1440p.








With sli you have good chances of having enough horsepower for 3x1440p too, with a hefty cpu oc and some luck.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Over lock potential of 7000 series is huge I can get my msi 7950 to 1300 and 1750 on air and I easily beat 680s and am in line with a lot of oced 7970s. Imo get the 7970.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also got a golden 7950 tho cause I only need 1.25 volts for that and temps dont exceed 76 degrees at those clocks in mark11 that is


Nice card








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am starting to understand how people can spend almost as much on fans as the case itself. Nothing wrong with my new case, especially since it wasn't expensive, but man these included case fans are horrible.
> 
> Why you would include four 140mm fans that are just going to be thrown away, or taken out to a nearby field and taken care of like in the Office Space movie, is beyond me.


It adds cost and most included fans suck anyway...but you need some kind of fan there. Regular casual gamers won't be bothered with replacing case fans or doing cable management or fancy stuff like that. No fans would mean lots of burnt down gamer rigs lol
I'd get a no fan case, with a discounted price...could be an option/sku








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The love of your PC.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean $20/fan, Hokies probably has around 30+ fans in total, I'd say he spent a good 80% of the case price. This is OCN! We ain't subject to common sense!


He actually cheaped out a lot on fans...I would have gotten Gentle Typhoon ap 15's really







Or Silent Wings...


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am starting to understand how people can spend almost as much on fans as the case itself. Nothing wrong with my new case, especially since it wasn't expensive, but man these included case fans are horrible.
> 
> Why you would include four 140mm fans that are just going to be thrown away, or taken out to a nearby field and taken care of like in the Office Space movie, is beyond me.


It is funny you said that, I just bought some Noctua 140mm fans to replace the ones in my Switch 810.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Over lock potential of 7000 series is huge I can get my msi 7950 to 1300 and 1750 on air and I easily beat 680s and am in line with a lot of oced 7970s. Imo get the 7970.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also got a golden 7950 tho cause I only need 1.25 volts for that and temps dont exceed 76 degrees at those clocks in mark11 that is


Your card did extremely well on the MSI 3DMark Firestrike Challenge, even beating a bunch of 7970s. What make/model do you have?


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am starting to understand how people can spend almost as much on fans as the case itself. Nothing wrong with my new case, especially since it wasn't expensive, but man these included case fans are horrible.
> 
> Why you would include four 140mm fans that are just going to be thrown away, or taken out to a nearby field and taken care of like in the Office Space movie, is beyond me.


I just wish their was an option to buy the case without fans cause I replace mine anyways. I imagine they do it tho to keep costs down and not everyone goes extreme lol


----------



## sena

I had GTX 670 and HD 7950, and i really like hd 7950 more, GTX 670 was good, but 256 bus is .........

Now i have HD 7950 CFX overclockd to 1100/1600, one mine card is doing 1320 MHz in 3dmark11 with 1.218V in MSI AB(1.12V in real load) and on 1320 HD 7950 is brutally fast.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, they are adequate for 1080p but not as fun to oc...unless you're handy with the soldering iron and not afraid of frying your card (most ref designs can't withstand vmods...you'd need a classified or lightning, or DcuII)


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> It is funny you said that, I just bought some Noctua 140mm fans to replace the ones in my Switch 810.


Which ones? I saw two listings on Amazon for different prices but it looks like the same procduct. There is this one:
http://www.amazon.com/Noctua-Ultra-Silent-140mm-NF-P14/dp/B002XISTXM/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1361218480&sr=1-1&keywords=NF-P14+FLX
And this one:
http://www.amazon.com/Noctua-Variable-Impeller-Vortex-Control/dp/B002W7T59Q/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1361218480&sr=1-2&keywords=NF-P14+FLX
What is the difference?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> FtW 420 has the World Record for AMD K10 chips...
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/records.php


damn thats sick! i want a world record


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well this thing about Nvidia vs AMD all depends on the user for me AMD looks better than Nvidia the colors are better (image detail) if you know what i mean.


what! thats not what skyrim looks like on my 670 that looks like its been tweaked to look crappy. but then ive never owned a amd card so i cant really say. but my 670 is definetly bright and colorfull

EDIT:
ok i put that video on 1080p and amd makes nvidia look like crap. ***


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Your card did extremely well on the MSI 3DMark Firestrike Challenge, even beating a bunch of 7970s. What make/model do you have?


Msi twin frozr 3 but it is 8 and 6 pin built on the 7970 PCB so I got lucky lol. And ya I pushed it as far as I feel comfortable on air cause I wanted to place 3rd in that contest lol. I cam probably push it higher once I get it in my loop.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Which ones? I saw two listings on Amazon for different prices but it looks like the same procduct. There is this one:
> http://www.amazon.com/Noctua-Ultra-Silent-140mm-NF-P14/dp/B002XISTXM/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1361218480&sr=1-1&keywords=NF-P14+FLX
> And this one:
> http://www.amazon.com/Noctua-Variable-Impeller-Vortex-Control/dp/B002W7T59Q/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1361218480&sr=1-2&keywords=NF-P14+FLX
> What is the difference?


I believe those you mentioned are different listings for the same fan.

I ordered the NF-A14 FLX _Square Frame_ which I think is the newer version of the NF-P14 FLX. I was a little confused at first because the NF-P14 FLX is not listed on Noctua's site: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AEGRGNO/ref=pe_175190_21431760_3p_M3T1_ST1_dp_2


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I believe those you mentioned are different listings for the same fan.
> 
> I ordered the NF-A14 FLX _Square Frame_ which I think is the newer version of the NF-P14 FLX. I was a little confused at first because the NF-P14 FLX is not listed on Noctua's site: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AEGRGNO/ref=pe_175190_21431760_3p_M3T1_ST1_dp_2


Thanks. Those two listings don't make sense because it is the same seller, apparently the same product, but two completely different prices for the P14.

Those A14 look nice, I think the one thing about the P14 is that you can mount it in a 120mm space if you want. But with our 810 cases it doesn't matter since all the brackets let you do either size.

I am planning to put the radiator that comes with the Swiftech H220 in the bottom, and then buy a MCR320-XP to go in the top of the case.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> damn thats sick! i want a world record


I got the humble g620 ucbench 2011 WR lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I believe those you mentioned are different listings for the same fan.
> 
> I ordered the NF-A14 FLX _Square Frame_ which I think is the newer version of the NF-P14 FLX. I was a little confused at first because the NF-P14 FLX is not listed on Noctua's site: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AEGRGNO/ref=pe_175190_21431760_3p_M3T1_ST1_dp_2


Nice man








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks. Those two listings don't make sense because it is the same seller, apparently the same product, but two completely different prices for the P14.
> 
> Those A14 look nice, I think the one thing about the P14 is that you can mount it in a 120mm space if you want. But with our 810 cases it doesn't matter since all the brackets let you do either size.
> 
> I am planning to put the radiator that comes with the Swiftech H220 in the bottom, and then buy a MCR320-XP to go in the top of the case.


Get 120mm fans for rads...The A14 fans are AWESOME for 140mm rads or case fans. (mega uber silent ones, top notch build and package)
Noctua NF-F12 pwm would be awesome for mcr220/320-qp rads like those.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Msi twin frozr 3 but it is 8 and 6 pin built on the 7970 PCB so I got lucky lol. And ya I pushed it as far as I feel comfortable on air cause I wanted to place 3rd in that contest lol. I cam probably push it higher once I get it in my loop.


Thanks, I read the same thing about the newer twin frozor III being built on the 7970 PCB with better VRMs and and 1100mhz overclock on stock voltage (1.174V). I just placed an order for one on Amazon for $298.99 after $15.00 mail in rebate. The bad news is they are temporarily out of stock, the good news, maybe I will get a new one built on the 7970 PCB.

Added +1 to your rep.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sounds good...Good luck!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Thanks, I read the same thing about the newer twin frozor III being built on the 7970 PCB with better VRMs and and 1100mhz overclock on stock voltage (1.174V). I just placed an order for one on Amazon for $298.99 after $15.00 mail in rebate. The bad news is they are temporarily out of stock, the good news, maybe I will get a new one built on the 7970 PCB.
> 
> Added +1 to your rep.


thanks for the rep and good luck. my stock voltage was 1.031 and that got me a stable 1050 and 1400 thats bf3 for hours on end stable too. Like i said tho when you oc don't bump the voltage too high cause it doesn't need it i only needed 1.2 for 1250 and 1750 needed the extra .05 to get that 1300 tho.


----------



## chann3l

Yay!!! best 7950 firestrike submission and 21st of 186 globally single gpu
http://hwbot.org/submission/2356476_


----------



## Swag

The 7970 and 680.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I believe those you mentioned are different listings for the same fan.
> 
> I ordered the NF-A14 FLX _Square Frame_ which I think is the newer version of the NF-P14 FLX. I was a little confused at first because the NF-P14 FLX is not listed on Noctua's site: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AEGRGNO/ref=pe_175190_21431760_3p_M3T1_ST1_dp_2


...I'm using six of those and they really are quite and yet cool very efficiently...just their colour-combo is not everyone's cup of tea


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Very sexy Swag - but why both lol?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Very sexy Swag - but why both lol?


I'm going to test out which one I like better in my system.







Performance and aesthetics.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm going to test out which one I like better in my system.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Performance and aesthetics.


Good call!

I set you up with someone...you got pm.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> For those of you with experience in three monitor gaming, how good is it? Currently I use my 30inch 2560x1600 which is great, but I am wondering if the cost in GPUs to game at 5760x1200 is worth it. Do many games work well with three monitors? Just looking for any opinions.


I'd probably just game on the single 30" 1600p monitor, that sounds awesome...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I love how you know when he gets up in the morning... Suspicious...


When he gets up in the morning?! At the time I posted that it was past noon in the Netherlands. I was worried about him, lol he usually starts posting at 3AM EST.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The 7970 and 680.


Is one for your brother or something? Why did you buy both?
Go with the one that doesn't sound like a hair dryer (the one with multiple fans)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm going to test out which one I like better in my system.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Performance and aesthetics.


..*.after all those discussions* that's *exactly the right way* to do it ! Go Swag







.and may be throw in $15 to $20 for a kill-a-watt meter to measure differences, then do a new thread about the whole thing...









...and you still have your brother (for now







, Titans for $1500 / pop on eBay)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> I own both AMD/ATI and NVIDIA products. 7970ies are nice cards, but they use almost *100 Watts MORE* than comparable NVidia products (in this day and age?)...or put differently, *EVEN* the new TITAN uses slightly less power than the 7970.
> 
> The driver problems on multi-GPUs are far worse with the AMD/ATI, incl. micro-stutter- I ran AMD /ATI in my main machine until last October.
> 
> AMD/ATI is loosing in the marketplace, unlike NVidia which is gaining - what are the reasons ? I don't want to see AMD/ATI disappear because it is bad for choice and pricing


I will have to compare power use of the 680 & 7970. I think the 7970 does use a bit more, but bet the 680 isn't far behind overclocked.
A lot of people automatically go nvidia for performance, this is the first time in quite a while that AMD cards came out ahead in performance & many still don't believe it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was actually a fanboy for ATI because I've never really owned a Nvidia card myself.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I go for the 680, this will be my first Nvidia card.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha! I remember when Eyefinity first became slightly big, I jumped on the wagon and bought everything. Then I learned you needed DP to DVI Active Adapters and at that time, they were around $140 a piece!
> I love how you know when he gets up in the morning... Suspicious...
> They work pretty well with three monitors, they also look beautiful. The question is, can your system sustain all that power needs!


Lol, I was always an nvidia fanboy, the 7970 was my first AMD card!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get a 680 Lightning then, other models require hard mods...You would only need to get the special AB 2.2.3 (nda) and voila, voltage control.
> If you get to 1400mhz core and 7800mhz ram that should be enough to max anything at 1440p.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With sli you have good chances of having enough horsepower for 3x1440p too, with a hefty cpu oc and some luck.
> Nice card
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It adds cost and most included fans suck anyway...but you need some kind of fan there. Regular casual gamers won't be bothered with replacing case fans or doing cable management or fancy stuff like that. No fans would mean lots of burnt down gamer rigs lol
> I'd get a no fan case, with a discounted price...could be an option/sku
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He actually cheaped out a lot on fans...I would have gotten Gentle Typhoon ap 15's really
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or Silent Wings...


Agreed, the lightning & unlocked bios is really the only 680 available new that can almost keep up without hardmodding. If benchies make a difference for you at least, they're all good for gaming.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> damn thats sick! i want a world record


Semi world record, I have the highest accepted validation, there are 2 chips above mine at hwbot, but they got the big red X in the validation so they don't count for the cpu-z hall of fame.
That was my very first AMD chip.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Yay!!! best 7950 firestrike submission and 21st of 186 globally single gpu
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2356476_


Very good! #1 for hardware isn't easy!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..*.after all those discussions* that's *exactly the right way* to do it ! Go Swag
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .and may be throw in $15 to $20 for a kill-a-watt meter to measure differences, then do a new thread about the whole thing...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and you still have your brother (for now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , Titans for $1500 / pop on eBay)


That is the right way to do it, as long as it isn't a reference cooler on that 7970. I don't mind fan noise, but even I don't like to turn that thing up to 100%...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Direct CU II is a favorite of mine, specially if you get an unlocked 7970, or the Windforce oc ones...those are cheap and really good ocers on air (and can do some damage on cold too)


----------



## Zeek

Can't wait until I actually get a good chip so I can delid it. Also where's the cheapest place to buy ultra at? I know frozen has it but it's like $15.49 each lol


----------



## dmanstasiu

I've had 2 AMD cards and 35 NVidia cards. Still an AMD fanboy even though I've never used CrossFire or SLI









(I always go for the underdog. *looks at intel CPU* ok almost always)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I've had 2 AMD cards and 35 NVidia cards. Still an AMD fanboy even though I've never used CrossFire or SLI
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I always go for the underdog. *looks at intel CPU* ok almost always)


Gpu's are close it is not much of a big deal..

Amd cpus are 5 years behind.... so not a good choice.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I've had 2 AMD cards and 35 NVidia cards. Still an AMD fanboy even though I've never used CrossFire or SLI
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I always go for the underdog. *looks at intel CPU* ok almost always)
> 
> 
> 
> Gpu's are close it is not much of a big deal..
> 
> Amd cpus are 5 years behind.... so not a good choice.
Click to expand...

To be fair I did buy my mom a FM2 A8-5800k build







I still go AMD when I can haha


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> To be fair I did buy my mom a FM2 A8-5800k build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still go AMD when I can haha


Yeah Amd's Apus are decent for what you get if your building that type of build.


----------



## stickg1

Yeah thats all well and good but the real question is, Dukes vs Helmann's. Who makes the best Mayonnaise?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Gpu's are close it is not much of a big deal..
> 
> Amd cpus are 5 years behind.... so not a good choice.


AMD cpus are fun for extreme cooling & validations, usually better than intel.
If not extreme cooled & going for validations, not so much.

They can be relaxing at least. Start superpi 32m with intel, you have a few minutes for a beer. Run pi 32m with AMD, get a case, sit back, relax, watch a movie...


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> AMD cpus are fun for extreme cooling & validations, usually better than intel.
> If not extreme cooled & going for validations, not so much.
> 
> They can be relaxing at least. Start superpi 32m with intel, you have a few minutes for a beer. Run pi 32m with AMD, get a case, sit back, relax, watch a movie...


haha that's awesome and thanks for the comment about my firestrike


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Guys could you answer this for me:

Someone in a YouTube comment said you could use dental floss to delid after warming the glue. Is this true?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> Guys could you answer this for me:
> 
> Someone in a YouTube comment said you could use dental floss to delid after warming the glue. Is this true?


Yup. Keeps the processors minty cool


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> Guys could you answer this for me:
> 
> Someone in a YouTube comment said you could use dental floss to delid after warming the glue. Is this true?


I think the amount of heat needed to allow the glue to loosen enough that dental floss would go through it would damage the cpu and you're probably beter off following the guides on page one and taking your time. that glue is designed to withstand high heat after all it surrounds the die and i would imagine you would need more heat than the cpu can handle for dental floss to be effective imo


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I think the amount of heat needed to allow the glue to loosen enough that dental floss would go through it would damage the cpu and you're probably beter off following the guides on page one and taking your time. that glue is designed to withstand high heat after all it surrounds the die and i would imagine you would need more heat than the cpu can handle for dental floss to be effective imo


They said it was strong and thin and you could do it without warming anything. I've just heard warming it as a suggestion.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> They said it was strong and thin and you could do it without warming anything. I've just heard warming it as a suggestion.


hmm haven't tried I just know the amount of presure I needed to get my razer blade through was a lot more than dental floss would handle. Give it a try its not going to hurt anything but don't apply heat


----------



## FtW 420

At least floss shouldn't be able to damage anything, so can't hurt to try. Watch the heat though, maybe some prime 95 on air at 80° for a bit without the heatsink bolted. Pull the heatsink, pull the cpu, try the floss quick while warm or something.

Or a lightbulb to warm the cpu itself, easy-bake oven style...


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> At least floss shouldn't be able to damage anything, so can't hurt to try. Watch the heat though, maybe some prime 95 on air at 80° for a bit without the heatsink bolted. Pull the heatsink, pull the cpu, try the floss quick while warm or something.
> 
> Or a lightbulb to warm the cpu itself, easy-bake oven style...


I still would put money on it that at the end of the day he'll be back to the razer and would have had it done already if he had never heard of all this dental floss nonesense


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> I still would put money on it that at the end of the day he'll be back to the razer and would have had it done already if he had never heard of all this dental floss nonesense


He said he had done it successfully.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> He said he had done it successfully.


I don't mean to discourage you and i was half joking as FTW said its not going to damage anything to try


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm going to test out which one I like better in my system.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Performance and aesthetics.
> 
> 
> 
> Good call!
> 
> I set you up with someone...you got pm.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the thought, I really do mean it.







He was asking for $450 and if I had that cash to drop on a GPU, I would've. Then there's shipping too so that's kinda hard. I only spent $400 on one card, I'll be returning the other once I'm done.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> For those of you with experience in three monitor gaming, how good is it? Currently I use my 30inch 2560x1600 which is great, but I am wondering if the cost in GPUs to game at 5760x1200 is worth it. Do many games work well with three monitors? Just looking for any opinions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd probably just game on the single 30" 1600p monitor, that sounds awesome...
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I love how you know when he gets up in the morning... Suspicious...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> When he gets up in the morning?! At the time I posted that it was past noon in the Netherlands. I was worried about him, lol he usually starts posting at 3AM EST.
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The 7970 and 680.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Is one for your brother or something? Why did you buy both?
> Go with the one that doesn't sound like a hair dryer (the one with multiple fans)
Click to expand...

Yea I am going to. So far, the EVGA is performing fairly well and no noise whatsoever.







I'll be testing out the other card soon. My brother bought his own, these 2 are mine until I decide on which one will go back to its original home.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm going to test out which one I like better in my system.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Performance and aesthetics.
> 
> 
> 
> ..*.after all those discussions* that's *exactly the right way* to do it ! Go Swag
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .and may be throw in $15 to $20 for a kill-a-watt meter to measure differences, then do a new thread about the whole thing...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and you still have your brother (for now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , Titans for $1500 / pop on eBay)
Click to expand...

Yea, I decided to just try out both of them to see which one I really liked.







Also, I don't think I can afford a meter right now.


----------



## lilchronic

i would try it with dental floss, sounds a lot less scary then using a razor blade


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would try it with dental floss, sounds a lot less scary then using a razor blade


I will definitely report back when I try it. It could probably get the success rate up to near perfect if it works unless you pull a real kludge.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> I will definitely report back when I try it. It could probably get the success rate up to near perfect if it works unless your a real kludge.


whats a kludge?
edit nevermind
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kludge


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> whats a kludge?


Maybe he means klutz ? Lol


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Maybe he means klutz ? Lol


You need to spend more time on thereifixedit









Going to pull the trigger on attempting floss delidding tomorrow, expect pics soon after if it works.


----------



## lilchronic

i still think this is the best way to do it




but the floss thing wont hurt to try


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

I'm keen to see how this works.
What about jewelry wire? Much stronger and just as thin.


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i still think this is the best way to do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but the floss thing wont hurt to try


I am going to either cut one corner open, then try floss all the way around, or I will cut all four corners open then thread floss through adjacent corners and pull through the glue or if that doesn't work I will use the credit card method.


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I'm keen to see how this works.
> What about jewelry wire? Much stronger and just as thin.


Can't find it. The floss will literally damage NOTHING if it does anything at all though, whereas wire may scratch something. You'd also be surprised how strong floss is. It has micro-woven nylon fibers in it.


----------



## Swag

Rate it?

Before GPU:


After GPU:


So far, I am leaning towards the 680, the 7970 is quite a bit louder and it has this whine to it that just annoys me. I'm going to see the overclockability of each and then make a final decision!


----------



## Zeek

If you're gaming on 1 monitor stick with the 680. If you're using multiple stick with the loud 7970


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Rate it?
> 
> Before GPU:
> 
> 
> After GPU:
> 
> 
> So far, I am leaning towards the 680, the 7970 is quite a bit louder and it has this whine to it that just annoys me. I'm going to see the overclockability of each and then make a final decision!


Replace big ugly air cooler with h100 or the new swifttech offering..

Get psu cover for the psu and id say it would be a good 9/10


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> If you're gaming on 1 monitor stick with the 680. If you're using multiple stick with the loud 7970


I'm gaming on only 1 monitor but I use 3 monitors. I only game on the center monitor because I always get a headache when I play with the ones on the side.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm gaming on only 1 monitor but I use 3 monitors. I only game on the center monitor because I always get a headache when I play with the ones on the side.


Build looks really good if your gonna stay onm air tho I would find some black fans instead of ther noctuas they stand out like a sore thumb


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Rate it?
> 
> Before GPU:
> 
> 
> After GPU:
> 
> 
> So far, I am leaning towards the 680, the 7970 is quite a bit louder and it has this whine to it that just annoys me. I'm going to see the overclockability of each and then make a final decision!


8/10:
2 marks lost for 2 things:
1. Cooler is huge
2. matx board is too small for that case -> waste of space


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah thats all well and good but the real question is, Dukes vs Helmann's. Who makes the best Mayonnaise?


Man, come on! Hellmans








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> AMD cpus are fun for extreme cooling & validations, usually better than intel.
> If not extreme cooled & going for validations, not so much.
> 
> They can be relaxing at least. Start superpi 32m with intel, you have a few minutes for a beer. Run pi 32m with AMD, get a case, sit back, relax, watch a movie...


True dat...AMD is more like previous gen Intel stuff (p55 and x58). Much more challenging and fun to oc, and with even higher oc headroom.
Check the highest valids for ddr3 and cpu clocks...AMD fx/fm1/fm2 and older intel stuff.
I love Celly d's lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> They said it was strong and thin and you could do it without warming anything. I've just heard warming it as a suggestion.


I will try that with my new chip, I'd do one corner first with the razor in case the dental floss won't cut in. I'm positive it would do the trick after opening one corner up.
No need to heat anything probably too...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Rate it?
> 
> Before GPU:
> 
> 
> After GPU:
> 
> 
> So far, I am leaning towards the 680, the 7970 is quite a bit louder and it has this whine to it that just annoys me. I'm going to see the overclockability of each and then make a final decision!


Coil whine? get a replacement, it's pretty commonplace...or try to put some silicon in there to avoid the caps to buzz.
Oc wise the amd card will trump the kepler unless it's volt locked. What model is it? You should have gotten a Gigabyte windforce oc, dcuII or one of the HIS high end models (they are cheap and on par with the best Asus cards for oc)

EDIT: @ the MVG and D14 haters...














xD


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Rate it?
> 
> Before GPU:
> 
> 
> After GPU:
> 
> 
> So far, I am leaning towards the 680, the 7970 is quite a bit louder and it has this whine to it that just annoys me. I'm going to see the overclockability of each and then make a final decision!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coil whine? get a replacement, it's pretty commonplace...or try to put some silicon in there to avoid the caps to buzz.
> Oc wise the amd card will trump the kepler unless it's volt locked. What model is it? You should have gotten a Gigabyte windforce oc, dcuII or one of the HIS high end models (they are cheap and on par with the best Asus cards for oc)
> 
> EDIT: @ the MVG and D14 haters...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> xD
Click to expand...

Lol its probably the size of the case vs the board and D14.

I did get the Gigabyte 7970 Windforce.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol its probably the size of the case vs the board and D14.
> 
> I did get the Gigabyte 7970 Windforce.


I think you could try replacing it...see if it's voltage locked or not first. Remember Afterburner has some quirks to unlock voltages anyway, a friend of mine had some trouble with it. Check the Msi 680 Lightning thread here for a quick guide.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> They said it was strong and thin and you could do it without warming anything. I've just heard warming it as a suggestion.


I am willing to try but I see your going to. I highly doubt it will work as floss has no way of tearing the glue. it will simply slide back and forth. piano wire is to think. possibly guitar strings for banjos of super thin strings but then it will harm you to be able to hold them and the string might be to abrasiveness then....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> He said he had done it successfully.


proof or he's lying, I take ideas pretty well but for a person on Youtube who doesn't have any way of proving. then I shun it. I am going to delid soon *glares at Swag* hurry up slow man.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm gaming on only 1 monitor but I use 3 monitors. I only game on the center monitor because I always get a headache when I play with the ones on the side.


...I got the same problem - and in racing / flying games, those 'black rim' monitor sides really annoy me in my field of vision...one day, they'll make monitors with ultra-thin edges, or some sort of holographic apparatus


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I got the same problem - and in racing / flying games, those 'black rim' monitor sides really annoy me in my field of vision...one day, they'll make monitors with ultra-thin edges, or some sort of holographic apparatus


http://www.costcaptain.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=C&Product_Code=DX_VN247HP&gclid=CM2fscK9wbUCFaI-MgodshYAFg


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.costcaptain.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=C&Product_Code=DX_VN247HP&gclid=CM2fscK9wbUCFaI-MgodshYAFg


tx !...much better but edges are still there...call me the sensitive type (when it gets to that kind of thing)







- I want truly curved, no-edge O-LED's - like in sci-fi movies (...whaddayamean 'that's not real '!)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> tx !...much better but edges are still there...call me the sensitive type (when it gets to that kind of thing)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I want truly curved, no-edge O-LED's - like in sci-fi movies (...whaddayamean 'that's not real '!)


they do exist

http://www.techhive.com/article/183208/43_Inch_Curved_Monitor_Can_Now_Be_Yours_For_Just_6500.html


----------



## King4x4

I won't be touching AMD again for multi-screen gaming... would take a performance hit with Nvidia just for more stability.... Even though AMD strokes my Epeen like nothing else









Think today I will be receving my 690 (two 680s incoming in as soon as Aramex gets their act togather and delivers them)

Faster Aramex Ship Faster... I NEED MY CARDS YESTERDAY ARRRRGH!

Two problems I am seeing... the 690 is 2gbX2 and each 680 is a 4GB version so I might try going for titan if the performance/[email protected] is justified.

Nvidia pulling something like 3xTitan ($2700) is better then 2x690 ($2000) and not stating any numbers is just.... stupid.

If I see that the Titan is a flop I would sell the 690 and find a used 680 4GB from the influx of kepler owners who would jump ship and use the funds from the 690 to water block all 680s and just have fun with tri-sli until the new generation of cards come along.

./praying that twin forzr 680 4GB is a semireference card for waterblock integration.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Rate it?
> 
> Before GPU:
> 
> 
> After GPU:
> 
> 
> So far, I am leaning towards the 680, the 7970 is quite a bit louder and it has this whine to it that just annoys me. I'm going to see the overclockability of each and then make a final decision!


...I think it looks really great - VERY CLEAN !









That sleeving must have taken a bit of time but matches the board very well...nice other cable management (i.e. Sata)...I like how the cooler and PSU draw the eye...PLUS lot's of real estate for future upgrades: extra points for planning... -take it from someone who did not plan that well and who is moving a Max V Ex (eATX) and 3 Asus Direc CUii cards and three hard drives and 2 SSDs plus watercooling which I all STUFFED into a nice but small Antec 302 towards a CoolerMaster Stryker case (that 360 / 60 rad just did not want to fit).

...quick mod tip: if your case does not have an air cooler opening at the back side (across the mobo CPU back cover and VRM), get a hole saw and cut a circle for a (narrow, ie Scythe) 120mm fan - especially when oc'ing and then playing games for a long time...it really does make a measurable difference


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I won't be touching AMD again for multi-screen gaming... would take a performance hit with Nvidia just for more stability.... Even though AMD strokes my Epeen like nothing else
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Faster Aramex Ship Faster... I NEED MY CARDS YESTERDAY ARRRRGH!


You mean ATI bro right?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> they do exist
> 
> http://www.techhive.com/article/183208/43_Inch_Curved_Monitor_Can_Now_Be_Yours_For_Just_6500.html


That's what I'm talking about !







I wonder what else is true that I see in movies ? For one thing, there really are a lot of zombies out there, not just on the screen...


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> That sleeving must have taken a bit of time but matches the board very well...


I think Swag uses the pre sleeved Corsair cables
















Not sure tho, lol.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> You mean ATI bro right?


I see an AMD sticker on my graphic card... so whose ATI









No more ATI mon! They have been assimilated by the AMD warmonger!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think it looks really great - VERY CLEAN !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That sleeving must have taken a bit of time but matches the board very well...nice other cable management (i.e. Sata)...I like how the cooler and PSU draw the eye...PLUS lot's of real estate for future upgrades: extra points for planning... -take it from someone who did not plan that well and who is moving a Max V Ex (eATX) and 3 Asus Direc CUii cards and three hard drives and 2 SSDs plus watercooling which I all STUFFED into a nice but small Antec 302 towards a CooerMaster Stryker case (that 360 / 60 rad just did not want to fit).
> 
> ...quick mod tip: if your case does not have an air cooler opening at the back (above the mobo CPU back cover and VRM), get a hole saw and cut a circle for a (narrow, ie Scythe) 120mm fan - especially when oc'ing and then playing games for a long time...it really does make a measurable difference


Is it or do I see space for a three Radiators... 360, 140 and another 240 at the bottom?

Come join us swaggy... come join us in our watery cause!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I think Swag uses the pre sleeved Corsair cables
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure tho, lol.


I'm starting work on my AX1200 in the new case - A LOT of power-cables to route to various components...black 'factory' sleeves are ok but I really like the red SWAG uses


----------



## Zeek

Props to ya. I'd be too damn lazy and just buy _these_


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Props to ya. I'd be too damn lazy and just buy _these_


...NIIIIICE - of course now I have to order that and you -SIR-delayed my build


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...NIIIIICE - of course now I have to order that and you -SIR-delayed my build


I didn't mean to







The pre-sleeved cables are very nice tho. Friend has em in a build and if you didn't know any better, you'd think he sleeved them himself. They also have multiple colors. I thought you would have already known about em


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> tx !...much better but edges are still there...call me the sensitive type (when it gets to that kind of thing)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I want truly curved, no-edge O-LED's - like in sci-fi movies (...whaddayamean 'that's not real '!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> they do exist
> 
> http://www.techhive.com/article/183208/43_Inch_Curved_Monitor_Can_Now_Be_Yours_For_Just_6500.html
Click to expand...

God, I really want those. I mean, Imagine gaming on one of those, just beautiful. Although, it doesn't seem to practical to me when you want to just browse...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I won't be touching AMD again for multi-screen gaming... would take a performance hit with Nvidia just for more stability.... Even though AMD strokes my Epeen like nothing else
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Think today I will be receving my 690 (two 680s incoming in as soon as Aramex gets their act togather and delivers them)
> 
> Faster Aramex Ship Faster... I NEED MY CARDS YESTERDAY ARRRRGH!
> 
> Two problems I am seeing... the 690 is 2gbX2 and each 680 is a 4GB version so I might try going for titan if the performance/[email protected] is justified.
> 
> Nvidia pulling something like 3xTitan ($2700) is better then 2x690 ($2000) and not stating any numbers is just.... stupid.
> 
> If I see that the Titan is a flop I would sell the 690 and find a used 680 4GB from the influx of kepler owners who would jump ship and use the funds from the 690 to water block all 680s and just have fun with tri-sli until the new generation of cards come along.
> 
> ./praying that twin forzr 680 4GB is a semireference card for waterblock integration.


YOU SPEND TOO MUCH ON THOSE GPUS! 690 + 2x 680? That's like $2000 on just GPUs!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Rate it?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Before GPU:
> 
> 
> After GPU:
> 
> 
> 
> So far, I am leaning towards the 680, the 7970 is quite a bit louder and it has this whine to it that just annoys me. I'm going to see the overclockability of each and then make a final decision!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I think it looks really great - VERY CLEAN !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That sleeving must have taken a bit of time but matches the board very well...nice other cable management (i.e. Sata)...I like how the cooler and PSU draw the eye...PLUS lot's of real estate for future upgrades: extra points for planning... -take it from someone who did not plan that well and who is moving a Max V Ex (eATX) and 3 Asus Direc CUii cards and three hard drives and 2 SSDs plus watercooling which I all STUFFED into a nice but small Antec 302 towards a CoolerMaster Stryker case (that 360 / 60 rad just did not want to fit).
> 
> ...quick mod tip: if your case does not have an air cooler opening at the back side (across the mobo CPU back cover and VRM), get a hole saw and cut a circle for a (narrow, ie Scythe) 120mm fan - especially when oc'ing and then playing games for a long time...it really does make a measurable difference
Click to expand...

Thanks!







I didn't actually completely plan this thing out, I bought the parts I really wanted which were the CPU and motherboard. And then the case went on sale for $60 and the D14 was only $50 so I bought those. After that, I started bringing all the parts from my old PC like the PSU and put it in the new one. I just bought the 680 since the last time I got a new GPU was back in 2009. This will last me another good 4 years.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think it looks really great - VERY CLEAN !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That sleeving must have taken a bit of time but matches the board very well...nice other cable management (i.e. Sata)...I like how the cooler and PSU draw the eye...PLUS lot's of real estate for future upgrades: extra points for planning... -take it from someone who did not plan that well and who is moving a Max V Ex (eATX) and 3 Asus Direc CUii cards and three hard drives and 2 SSDs plus watercooling which I all STUFFED into a nice but small Antec 302 towards a CooerMaster Stryker case (that 360 / 60 rad just did not want to fit).
> 
> ...quick mod tip: if your case does not have an air cooler opening at the back (above the mobo CPU back cover and VRM), get a hole saw and cut a circle for a (narrow, ie Scythe) 120mm fan - especially when oc'ing and then playing games for a long time...it really does make a measurable difference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it or do I see space for a three Radiators... 360, 140 and another 240 at the bottom?
> 
> Come join us swaggy... come join us in our watery cause!
Click to expand...

I will show you what I plan to buy in the Summer for my water cooling adventure.







Give me a second to open up my wishlist.


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> YOU SPEND TOO MUCH ON THOSE GPUS! 690 + 2x 680? That's like $2000 on just GPUs!


Hmm.... Lets see how much I spent on GPUs...

4x7950s = 320x4 = $1280+($200 Shipping to my country) = $1480
Waterblocks+Backplates+Single Slot boards = 4x(100+25+10) = $540+Shipping = $680

Getting royally rustled by AMD poor driver support and contstant AMD issues (I went for a 3770k instead of a 3930k because of their crappy issue of X79/X58 crashing eyefinity/crossfire users) and now facing daily issues with just keeping THREE SCREENS ON.

Made me go green.... literally!

Now 2x680 4GBs = (2x$400)+$50 Shipping = $850
Switching out two of the 7950s for a 690 = -1000+(2x455) = -$90 I actually something out of this transaction lulz!

Now I am debating if the 690 with 2GB on each core is worth it over selling it and getting a third 680... Two 7950s to get rid of too.

Thats high end hardware enthuasim.... too much of a money sink.

Oh well until I can sort out the GPUs my beautilfull delidded 3770k will be cooled by 3x360 Rads!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> YOU SPEND TOO MUCH ON THOSE GPUS! 690 + 2x 680? That's like $2000 on just GPUs!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm.... Lets see how much I spent on GPUs...
> 
> 4x7950s = 320x4 = $1280+($200 Shipping to my country) = $1480
> Waterblocks+Backplates+Single Slot boards = 4x(100+25+10) = $540+Shipping = $680
> 
> Getting royally rustled by AMD poor driver support and contstant AMD issues (I went for a 3770k instead of a 3930k because of their crappy issue of X79/X58 crashing eyefinity/crossfire users) and now facing daily issues with just keeping THREE SCREENS ON.
> 
> Made me go green.... literally!
> 
> Now 2x680 4GBs = (2x$400)+$50 Shipping = $850
> Switching out two of the 7950s for a 690 = -1000+(2x455) = -$90 I actually something out of this transaction lulz!
> 
> Now I am debating if the 690 with 2GB on each core is worth it over selling it and getting a third 680... Two 7950s to get rid of too.
> 
> Thats high end hardware enthuasim.... too much of a money sink.
> 
> Oh well until I can sort out the GPUs my beautilfull delidded 3770k will be cooled by 3x360 Rads!
Click to expand...

Waaaay too much money. If I were you, I'd stick with the single 690. It performs faster than the 680s (I believe so) and it will save you money on the electricity bill.







Also, your CPU won't bottleneck you because running 2 high-end gpus will stress the CPU a lot!

Also here is what I have planned so far:

I'm thinking of changing those RX240s to 2x MONSTA radiators.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> ... I just bought the 680 since the last time I got a new GPU was back in 2009. This will last me another good 4 years.


I might be repeating myself re posts, but if you decide to keep the 680 you REALLY want to try out the GTX 600 series Bios mod thread at OCN and look for 'KGB' mods...you in fact can base those mods on your existing Bios, or another one.

...I ended up with three Asus Direct CUii 670ies (ultimately for other productivity machines here which currently just have iGPU) in my 'play' rig. I tried several different BIOS configs (from mild to wild) but then went to Asus' site and got the 'TOP' Bios which I then loaded on all three (via a bootable USB). That was a big step up, but I followed that up by modding that new TOP Bios with the KGB. Cards are stable and don't overheat but GPUs now peak between 1250 and 1370 + -, while all of their VRAM is up to an effective 6800 from 6000 (1502 to 1702)

Bottom Line: EACH 670 on its own now scores over 10000 @ 3D11, and in SLI, my Vantage score is mid 51K (need to finish my case move before tri-SLI scores). That alone was a gain of about 1000 points just for an afternoon of 'free modding' and a $12 USB stick

*The described mod does work for all 600 cards and the 680 is no exception, regardless of make / model.*.









.I realize it is a brand new card you want to keep for a long time and you don't want to wreck the thing, but when the urge hits later...with 'KGB' you have the option of basing it on your own factory BIOS...all that without external Volt modding, which of course remains an option (which I might try later, already have been asking the specialist re voltage mod points)


----------



## lilchronic

ur lucky my 670 hates the modded bios







i get alot of throttling issues. and ive tried everthing to stop it but no luck.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ur lucky my 670 hates the modded bios
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i get alot of throttling issues. and ive tried everthing to stop it but no luck.


what modded BIOS did you try ? There are so many of them listed and I had to go through several - what is your card's make and model ?


----------



## King4x4

Those modded bios are all ready downloaded and put into sequence for testing purposes


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Those modded bios are all ready downloaded and put into sequence for testing purposes


...which is why I went for the factory Direct CUii Top BIOS (which had been updated by Asus) so I'm not a tester and then modded that one instead







The cards have a hard v limit of 1.215 and if you choose a BIOS that goes over that it gets all cranky and throttles, unless you hard-mod the v's as well (which my Asus Max V Ex is set up for







- later)

Furthermore, the Asus has a custom PCB and VRM (as opposed to the reference design) and I by mistake tried a BIOS for a Zotac - my card was zig-zagging between 400 and 800 MHz - that is why I asked the previous gent what his make and model was


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Hmm.... Lets see how much I spent on GPUs...
> 
> 4x7950s = 320x4 = $1280+($200 Shipping to my country) = $1480
> Waterblocks+Backplates+Single Slot boards = 4x(100+25+10) = $540+Shipping = $680
> 
> Getting royally rustled by AMD poor driver support and contstant AMD issues (I went for a 3770k instead of a 3930k because of their crappy issue of X79/X58 crashing eyefinity/crossfire users) and now facing daily issues with just keeping THREE SCREENS ON.
> 
> Made me go green.... literally!
> 
> Now 2x680 4GBs = (2x$400)+$50 Shipping = $850
> Switching out two of the 7950s for a 690 = -1000+(2x455) = -$90 I actually something out of this transaction lulz!
> 
> Now I am debating if the 690 with 2GB on each core is worth it over selling it and getting a third 680... Two 7950s to get rid of too.
> 
> Thats high end hardware enthuasim.... too much of a money sink.
> 
> Oh well until I can sort out the GPUs my beautilfull delidded 3770k will be cooled by 3x360 Rads!


Get another 4gb 680 man...classifieds with evbot would suit you well








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Waaaay too much money. If I were you, I'd stick with the single 690. It performs faster than the 680s (I believe so) and it will save you money on the electricity bill.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, your CPU won't bottleneck you because running 2 high-end gpus will stress the CPU a lot!
> 
> Also here is what I have planned so far:
> 
> I'm thinking of changing those RX240s to 2x MONSTA radiators.


Single 690 is two 680's in sli with lower clocks and tdp and less oc headroom.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...which is why I went for the factory Direct CUii Top BIOS (which had been updated by Asus) so I'm not a tester and then modded that one instead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The cards have a hard v limit of 1.215 and if you choose a BIOS that goes over that it gets all cranky and throttles, unless you hard-mod the v's as well (which my Asus Max V Ex is set up for
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - later)
> 
> Furthermore, the Asus has a custom PCB and VRM (as opposed to the reference design) and I by mistake tried a BIOS for a Zotac - my card was zig-zagging between 400 and 800 MHz - that is why I asked the previous gent what his make and model was


Your dcu II gpu has gpu tweak solder points clearly labeled on it for voltage control via gpu hot wire. Check it out, google it or search it at anandtech forums...You can solder two or three wires and get hardware voltage control to exceed the stupid nvidia limits too


----------



## King4x4

Time to sell the 690 then... Quad-Sli scaling is meh anywhy









Head hunting a 680 4GB now I give out meger sweets to those who help







... Forgeting the titan since it's not within my budget









Praying that the Twin Forzrs I am getting are reference PCBs









Thinking EK blocks+Parallel Flow Bridge!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Some twin frozers use the same lightning pcb so you might not be lucky with that...

Where are you located man?
EDIT: ah, Dubai...noticed you used private couriers (200 shipping), that ain't a good idea man. Use USPS Priority and voila. You save on custom tax too if the packages aren't big.


----------



## King4x4

Middle East - Saudi Arabia... I spend more on AC to cool my hardware then my hardware









Lightning PCB? No problem!

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=35787


----------



## Swag

Should I still disable "Hardware Acceleration" in the Adobe Flash Settings when you right-click a flash video?


----------



## King4x4

Always... degraded my performance once by up to 5% in a benchmark


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Always... degraded my performance once by up to 5% in a benchmark


Okay, thanks!







I was wondering if it actually was worth it nowadays, guess not. I think I'm going to play a game of LoL then I'm off to bed. First game since August 2012. I couldn't stand LoL back then, I wonder how it is now...


----------



## ivanlabrie

What bench are you running? It would be better to run a stripped os (vista 32/64 or XP sp3, maybe win 7 32bit depending on the bench)
The os alone makes worlds of difference...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was wondering if it actually was worth it nowadays, guess not. I think I'm going to play a game of LoL then I'm off to bed. First game since August 2012. I couldn't stand LoL back then, I wonder how it is now...


game? add me. my name is obvious. just look to your upper left


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was wondering if it actually was worth it nowadays, guess not. I think I'm going to play a game of LoL then I'm off to bed. First game since August 2012. I couldn't stand LoL back then, I wonder how it is now...
> 
> 
> 
> game? add me. my name is obvious. just look to your upper left
Click to expand...

Let's play a game.







I might suck since it is my first time back... I tried playing the other day but I ended up having my brother play for me, I was so lazy...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Let's play a game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I might suck since it is my first time back... I tried playing the other day but I ended up having my brother play for me, I was so lazy...


send the request already Valgaur silly.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Let's play a game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I might suck since it is my first time back... I tried playing the other day but I ended up having my brother play for me, I was so lazy...
> 
> 
> 
> send the request already Valgaur silly.
Click to expand...

I just pushed all the clocks back to default once you said that! HAHA!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Middle East - Saudi Arabia... I spend more on AC to cool my hardware then my hardware
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lightning PCB? No problem!
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=35787


Saudi aye? ive alwayts wanted to talk to a Saudi... you guys are like the rich folks in the desert lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Saudi aye? ive alwayts wanted to talk to a Saudi... you guys are like the rich folks in the desert lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*


Eh do not tell me he is American? lol..

Anywho ive seen stuff about Saudi Arabia Has nice malls buildings citys rich rich oasis of the middle east...

But never had the chance to ask one first hand


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Saudi aye? ive alwayts wanted to talk to a Saudi... you guys are like the rich folks in the desert lol.


Thats actually what most people think... but sadly the truth is far from it.

I am poor barely making $55k per year (I am an engineer also!) but I do a side bussiness on enthusists parts so what I don't want I can sell pretty fast with minimum loss.

Can you believe that %80 of the saudi population don't own their own homes?

a 400m land costs about 1.2m saudi riyals = $300k.... In the middle of the desert?!

To own my own apartement it costs about $150k... my own home

Unemployment at %30 for males and over %50 for females... ~$700k.... yah good luck with my income!

So yah... we are a rich country but a poor people


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Thats actually what most people think... but sadly the truth is far from it.
> 
> I am poor barely making $55k per year (I am an engineer also!) but I do a side bussiness on enthusists parts so what I don't want I can sell pretty fast with minimum loss.
> 
> Can you believe that %80 of the saudi population don't own their own homes?
> 
> Unemployment at %30 for males and over %50 for females...
> 
> So yah... we are a rich country but a poor people


Ah so there is no middle class?

Kind of like what America has become... Super rich really rich rich then it goes all the way down to Poor lol.

I put myself at Rich but not really rich XD but i do not make much more then you do.. economy is different in my area...

House thats worth 280k "like my house " in my area in an area like Cali is worth 2.5 million lol.

hmm



I live in the Woods!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get another 4gb 680 man...classifieds with evbot would suit you well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Single 690 is two 680's in sli with lower clocks and tdp and less oc headroom.
> Your dcu II gpu has gpu tweak solder points clearly labeled on it for voltage control via gpu hot wire. Check it out, google it or search it at anandtech forums...You can solder two or three wires and get hardware voltage control to exceed the stupid nvidia limits too


Thanks for the info !


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Time to sell the 690 then... Quad-Sli scaling is meh anywhy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Head hunting a 680 4GB now I give out meger sweets to those who help
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... Forgeting the titan since it's not within my budget
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Praying that the Twin Forzrs I am getting are reference PCBs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thinking EK blocks+Parallel Flow Bridge!


...well folks, this kind of 'fits' nicely


----------



## King4x4

Hokies... You got electricity? Running water? Decent Internet? Mailbox for geek stuff to arrive? WHAT MORE DO YOU NEED?!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well folks, this kind of 'fits' nicely


I want benches not games stats lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want benches not games stats lol


...it's like the 'tease' in 'striptease' - benches come by the 3rd song


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> what modded BIOS did you try ? There are so many of them listed and I had to go through several - what is your card's make and model ?


i got the evga gtx670 FTW 02g-p4-2679-kr
ive tried modding these my self
http://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/index.php?did=10de-1189-3842-2678
and used the the 670 ftw 200%
my power target hits 140% and starts to throttle it pisses me of thats why i dont use it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i got the evga gtx670 FTW 02g-p4-2679-kr
> ive tried modding these my self
> http://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/index.php?did=10de-1189-3842-2678
> and used the the 670 ftw 200%
> my power target hits 140% and starts to throttle it pisses me of thats why i dont use it


200% is probably too much for the hard-wired limits...when it starts to throttle, is it hitting 70 C temp-wise ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i got the evga gtx670 FTW 02g-p4-2679-kr
> ive tried modding these my self
> http://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/index.php?did=10de-1189-3842-2678
> and used the the 670 ftw 200%
> my power target hits 140% and starts to throttle it pisses me of thats why i dont use it


...go back to your ORIGINAL Bios, then try this: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?284014-KGB-Kepler-BIOS-Editor-Unlocker


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 200% is probably too much for the hard-wired limits...when it starts to throttle, is it hitting 70 C temp-wise ?


my card never goes over 60c
last night it was cold and my card never went over 50c and it still throttled


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want benches not games stats lol


....3rd song soon


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ....3rd song soon


numbers...... I NEED DAS NUMBERS!!!!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ....3rd song soon


what does that prove lol 100% yeah!!!


----------



## VonDutch

2 days talk about GPU's, am i still in the right thread?








Gm









"The price that the Asus GeForce GTX Titan was listed for on Proshop was €900, equal to about $1300 by current exchange rates."

thats one expensive card ...lol


----------



## King4x4

1300... Same price as 3 used 680 4GBs LuLz


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> 2 days talk about GPU's, am i still in the right thread?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "The price that the Asus GeForce GTX Titan was listed for on Proshop was €900, equal to about $1300 by current exchange rates."
> 
> thats one expensive card ...lol


The Asus version is supposed to be clocked a bit higher than 'reference' and ** may ** have 2 x8 power connectors instead of 1x6 and 1x 8...but enough about GPUs









...two delidded chips walk down the street - says the one to the other "ohhh, the good old days - with TIM it was much more warm and cuddly, now I feel my head spinning and CLU plays with syringes and razor blades'


----------



## King4x4

I LOLED!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...go back to your ORIGINAL Bios, then try this: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?284014-KGB-Kepler-BIOS-Editor-Unlocker


well ive tried 3 different bios they all throttled on me


----------



## Joa3d43

...what about your 'stock' original one - does that throttle also ? With 'KGB', you should just see a v-increase within card limits and 1359 or so as the boost clock max (all that before your own editing if you choose to mod the .cfg file)


----------



## lilchronic

i can get 1346mhz on my stock original bios with out any throttling but once i unlock the bios it throttles.
this is what some one said in the 600 series unlocked bios thread







Quote:


> There is no more power for your card to draw. There is (as far as i know) no way you can avoid this.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yep, your oc is already maxed out lilchronic...you would need hardmods and water cooling or dice/ln2 for more. Or a Lightning or better yet a 7970








There's a dude selling a 680 lightning for 450 or so if you feel like selling your card. (1400mhz core is easy for that thing)


----------



## willem739

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Can people even run a Prime95 stress test on a lidded Ivy chip with the stock Intel cooler? The temps on my delidded chip are really high for stock turbo 3.9 settings.


I did while waiting for my H100.

OC to 4.06 GHz, 85 deg C with Prime 95, room temp 22 deg C.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeyboardXpert*
> 
> You need to spend more time on thereifixedit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to pull the trigger on attempting floss delidding tomorrow, expect pics soon after if it works.


Go for it, it's worth a try. Ages ago, we used to use a hot knife to cut through conformal coatings on printed circuit boards. It was a tool designed for that purpose with a hot wire on the end. I bet something like this could work: http://www.amazon.com/FloraCraft-Styrofoam-Accessories-Styro-Cutter/dp/B000XALM54/ref=pd_sim_sbs_t_2


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i can get 1346mhz on my stock original bios with out any throttling but once i unlock the bios it throttles.
> this is what some one said in the 600 series unlocked bios thread


..well, this makes me laugh







- per above re 1346 in stock BIOS, you seem to have one of the fastest 670ies out there in stock format. The throttling you described before w/modded BIOS makes perfect sense - in fact is alos described at 'KGB'. Essentially, you're running into the hard-wired 'true' max v of 1.1215 with power targets above 140 / 150 %. Having such a great performer out of the box obviously leaves less headroom to explore with modded BIOS before you bump into hard limits....but I wouldn't complain









Your next step would have to be hard-wiring more v's ...but that is tricky business and can also damage your card, though the temps you reported earlier suggest that you have a 'great runner' there.









On the 680 front, the Lightning some folks here refer to have a built-in step-up beyond the hard-wired v limit.

---

In other news...

...first in-depth write-up of titan here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/6760/nvidias-geforce-gtx-titan-part-1/2









On the delid front, I'm going to flip a coin whether to use CL-U or CL-P on the IHS-to-cooler arrangement, following the successful7 delid with CL-U on the die


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Go for it, it's worth a try. Ages ago, we used to use a hot knife to cut through conformal coatings on printed circuit boards. It was a tool designed for that purpose with a hot wire on the end. I bet something like this could work: http://www.amazon.com/FloraCraft-Styrofoam-Accessories-Styro-Cutter/dp/B000XALM54/ref=pd_sim_sbs_t_2


...this looks like a potentially great tool for delid







- do you know off-hand how:

a.) hot the wire would get, and
b.) how thick it is ?


----------



## willem739

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No problem, just let us know if you have any questions before you do your Ivy chip.


Thanks. I do have a question.
I used Gigabytes quick OC software (ET6) to OC to 4.57 @ 70 C with Prime 95.
Must I do a 'real' OC before I delid?
I will eventually do a proper OC but don't have time at the moment. (It will take some time as I have only OC once before with Ivy)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..and watch the videos (YouTube) several more times...and also keep some bandages handy


I will, hope bandages won't be needed


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...this looks like a potentially great tool for delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - do you know off-hand how:
> 
> a.) hot the wire would get, and
> b.) how thick it is ?


Absolutely no idea. You might be able to find something at a local craft store, that way you can see what guage the wire is. It would be worth a try on some "practice chips" first.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Wow, can't believe it's been over a month since I posted in here. Goes to show how busy I've been of late. This thread is too damn hard to keep u with







.

Anyways in other news, I'm thinking about picking up a new 3770K with my tax refund money and putting into my media server to replace my Q6600. Probably seems like overkill to most but I host Plex Media Server and want to be able to support 4-5 client file transcodings at once. Still debating though







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Make a 3930k matx beast inside a tiny case like the tj08-e


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..well, this makes me laugh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - per above re 1346 in stock BIOS, you seem to have one of the fastest 670ies out there in stock format. The throttling you described before w/modded BIOS makes perfect sense - in fact is alos described at 'KGB'. Essentially, you're running into the hard-wired 'true' max v of 1.1215 with power targets above 140 / 150 %. Having such a great performer out of the box obviously leaves less headroom to explore with modded BIOS before you bump into hard limits....but I wouldn't complain
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your next step would have to be hard-wiring more v's ...but that is tricky business and can also damage your card, though the temps you reported earlier suggest that you have a 'great runner' there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On the 680 front, the Lightning some folks here refer to have a built-in step-up beyond the hard-wired v limit.
> 
> ---
> 
> In other news...
> 
> ...first in-depth write-up of titan here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/6760/nvidias-geforce-gtx-titan-part-1/2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On the delid front, I'm going to flip a coin whether to use CL-U or CL-P on the IHS-to-cooler arrangement, following the successful7 delid with CL-U on the die


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yep, your oc is already maxed out lilchronic...you would need hardmods and water cooling or dice/ln2 for more. Or a Lightning or better yet a 7970
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's a dude selling a 680 lightning for 450 or so if you feel like selling your card. (1400mhz core is easy for that thing)


nahh i dont plan on selling this baby, i do plan on getting another 670FTW though







1 just aint enough for me. hardwiring not that either, this was my first build wish i knew what i know now about computers, definetly would of got a better mobo ,psu, bigger case, and probably the 680 lightining or the classifieds there pretty nice too


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Make a 3930k matx beast inside a tiny case like the tj08-e


$230 vs. $500...hmmm not so tough a choice haha.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *willem739*
> 
> Thanks. I do have a question.
> I used Gigabytes quick OC software (ET6) to OC to 4.57 @ 70 C with Prime 95.
> Must I do a 'real' OC before I delid?
> I will eventually do a proper OC but don't have time at the moment. (It will take some time as I have only OC once before with Ivy)


Well you don't have to do anything, but I can tell you any software overclock I have ever seen or read about it is a really bad idea, so I would strongly advise against doing that. Follow a guide here and it doesn't take that long to set up a reasonable overclock. I would not delid a chip without first knowing its exact overlocking potential and what my max temps were with the max overclock I could get. If a chip is not a good overclocker I don't think it is worth deliding.

In a nutshell my simple advice is to follow an oc guide and get a 12+ hour stable oc at the highest multiplier your temps will permit. Then look at delidding, but again that is just me.
Here is a link:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end


----------



## justanoldman

Well I waited to see what the Titan was about, and the prices of 670 and 680 went up. They are significantly higher than they were a few weeks ago. Right now the best I can see for a 4gb 680 is about $550 and I am guessing if you add a water block and backplate you are looking at $700. Is a 680 worth $700?


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Well I waited to see what the Titan was about, and the prices of 670 and 680 went up. They are significantly higher than they were a few weeks ago. Right now the best I can see for a 4gb 680 is about $550 and I am guessing if you add a water block and backplate you are looking at $700. Is a 680 worth $700?


Where are you looking? I can find reference board 680's for $439.99 and if I actually search I could probably find em cheaper, lol.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Where are you looking? I can find reference board 680's for $439.99 and if I actually search I could probably find em cheaper, lol.


The least expensive EVGA 680 with 4gb is the 04G-P4-2686-KR, please give me a link where you can get it for less than $530.


----------



## King4x4

Those are 2GB versions... we needz 4gbz!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Those are 2GB versions... we needz 4gbz!


I has 2 4gbs u can has for 900$ + shipping


----------



## King4x4

No waterz me no takez!


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> The least expensive EVGA 680 with 4gb is the 04G-P4-2686-KR, please give me a link where you can get it for less than $530.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Those are 2GB versions... we needz 4gbz!


Drugs, man. Drugs. I completely skipped over the 4gb, LOL.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> No waterz me no takez!


EK Uni Block fits on them.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Well I waited to see what the Titan was about, and the prices of 670 and 680 went up. They are significantly higher than they were a few weeks ago. Right now the best I can see for a 4gb 680 is about $550 and I am guessing if you add a water block and backplate you are looking at $700. Is a 680 worth $700?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Where are you looking? I can find reference board 680's for $439.99 and if I actually search I could probably find em cheaper, lol.


First, it is still too early - Titan has a dual NDA, and the part that deals with performance numbers has not even expired yet (will tomorrow). We were talking weeks if not months re price adjustments

Second, I just checked at my retailer, and the 670 prices are still at the same level following the drop when Titan was announced - alas, I already got three well-performing 670ies now







so for me it is all theoretical - I'll take a look at Titan purchasing in the fall

Third, there are other factors that can affect price, ranging from 'Chinese New Year' that can (and usually does) affect supply to a retailer sitting on a large position of a particular card / manufacturer (following a 'martini lunch') to currency swings - the CDN $ was trading above the US $, now it dropped by about 3 cents

In the end, if your build is waiting, you may want to find the best-price card now...there is an implicit cost of delay vs. potential $ savings only you can calculate.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Just delided two semprons painlessly, but they were already dead so I can't see if I killed them. Somebody convince me to man up and go onto my i5


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Wow, can't believe it's been over a month since I posted in here. Goes to show how busy I've been of late. This thread is too damn hard to keep u with
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Anyways in other news, I'm thinking about picking up a new 3770K with my tax refund money and putting into my media server to replace my Q6600. Probably seems like overkill to most but I host Plex Media Server and want to be able to support 4-5 client file transcodings at once. Still debating though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I got $45 for your Q6600 if you're selling.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Just delided two semprons painlessly, but they were already dead so I can't see if I killed them. Somebody convince me to man up and go onto my i5


If some old man who didn't know anything about this stuff can do it twice, then you are a girly-man if you can't do it.
Is that convincing enough?


----------



## dmanstasiu




----------



## Zeek

Probably gonna buy some ultra this weekend. Get a new chip next weekend, and hopefully get some balls and delid my chip, lol.

Lol'd at above post


----------



## justanoldman

I think what I want is a card that would be fun and interesting to learn more about ocing and water cooling. I am not sure what video card fits that bill. As in a 3770 is not that interesting, a 3770k is more so, then going from 4.4 to 4.7 was nice, add in delidding to get to 5.0 and it was great. Looking for something along that same idea for a GPU. Any suggestions?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> EK Uni Block fits on them.


...I can get my hands on the Swiftech GPU water blocks (MCW82) a bit easier than EK blocks...anyone got any experience with those ? Also thinking of 'fabbing' VRM copper water coolers because I can't find any separate VRM w-c units


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I think what I want is a card that would be fun and interesting to learn more about ocing and water cooling. I am not sure what video card fits that bill. As in a 3770 is not that interesting, a 3770k is more so, then going from 4.4 to 4.7 was nice, add in delidding to get to 5.0 and it was great. Looking for something along that same idea for a GPU. Any suggestions?


Get a Lightning 680 or a classified with evbot port, or get a proper 7970 Lightning card. (much better option)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I can get my hands on the Swiftech GPU water blocks (MCW82) a bit easier than EK blocks...anyone got any experience with those ? Also thinking of 'fabbing' VRM copper water coolers because I can't find any separate VRM w-c units


Slap a 92mm fan over them and voila...You could get some cheap heatsinks and cut em to use as vrm sinks. That's what I did when I needed small vrm sinks for my p4p800-e dlx


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I think what I want is a card that would be fun and interesting to learn more about ocing and water cooling. I am not sure what video card fits that bill. As in a 3770 is not that interesting, a 3770k is more so, then going from 4.4 to 4.7 was nice, add in delidding to get to 5.0 and it was great. Looking for something along that same idea for a GPU. Any suggestions?


...have a look at this article @ Anandtech...while about Titan, it provides a nice GPU architecture summary and relates it to 680 and 7970...as you may know, Anandtech is one of the most established review sites out there. In addition, on the top bar on the site, you'll find a whole 'GPU' section

...one question you have to ask yourself is how many cards you want now (ie two 4GB 670 or 680 should keep you happy for a long time), vs a few months from now.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6760/nvidias-geforce-gtx-titan-part-1


----------



## justanoldman

Thanks Ivanlabrie and Joa3d43.
I am thinking to just go with one card now, hook it up to the H220 to water cool it, then depending on how that goes add a second card later. I have read that there is no point in 4gb with a 670 so I guess I could go the cheap route of a 2gb 670 now, put in under water, then add another later. I think that is good enough for 2560x1600 as long as I turn down the settings. Even my poor overclocking single 670 did 60fps in AC3 with settings not all turned up with 6040x1200 surround just now, but I don't think I will do surround for now, just need to handle the 2560x1600.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah...single card and water screams 7970. Or 680 Lightning.
I insist


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah...single card and water screams 7970. Or 680 Lightning.
> I insist


Well the only lightning I see to buy is $500 for the 2gb, and there are no 4gb for sale. That is 30% more money compared to a 2gb 670, and at stock the 680 is only about 5% faster in all the reviews I have seen. I know nothing about special bios or voltage when it comes to GPUs though so I am guessing there is something special about the 680 lightning and overclocking?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks Ivanlabrie and Joa3d43.
> I am thinking to just go with one card now, hook it up to the H220 to water cool it, then depending on how that goes add a second card later. I have read that there is no point in 4gb with a 670 so I guess I could go the cheap route of a 2gb 670 now, put in under water, then add another later. I think that is good enough for 2560x1600 as long as I turn down the settings. Even my poor overclocking single 670 did 60fps in AC3 with settings not all turned up with 6040x1200 surround just now, but I don't think I will do surround for now, just need to handle the 2560x1600.


I think that's a good idea...and the difference between a well-running 670 and average 680 is quite hard to detect for most people anyways 'in the real world'. Further, by going step-by-step, you can see the impact extra GPUs have on overall temps in the H220, per earlier posts.

The industry is geared to always hype' the next big thing' just around the corner, and that can make upgrade decisions of 'now vs later' a bit tricky...I have never regretted the two 670ies (3rd not hooked in yet), never run into microstutter or any such thing...a single 670/680 is a great start and easy to add a second one later.

BTW, new NVidia 314.xx certified driver just released...


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I got $45 for your Q6600 if you're selling.


Thanks but I think I'm just going to keep it and re-purpose it. I used to have a Q6600 and sold it to upgrade to an i5 and then later needed it for a different build. I then had to go out and buy another one. So for the $50 I can get for it, it makes more sense for me to just hold onto it at this point. I've learned my lesson







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Well the only lightning I see to buy is $500 for the 2gb, and there are no 4gb for sale. That is 30% more money compared to a 2gb 670, and at stock the 680 is only about 5% faster in all the reviews I have seen. I know nothing about special bios or voltage when it comes to GPUs though so I am guessing there is something special about the 680 lightning and overclocking?


Lightning allows overvoltage well beyond the voltage cap (1.212v) if you use the correct bios and know how to tweak Afterburner. There's a guide in the Msi 680 Lightning club thread here, check the OP.
I'd rather go for a 7970, 3gb vram that gets used properly, massive overclocking headroom, voltage control, really good performance and even better than a 680 clocked much higher.
If you're going single card any of those two would be ideal, the 680 Lightning only if you for some reason prefer Nvidia.

EDIT: Puffin, I trade my Micron D9 ddr2 for 30kg of kale chips...waddaya say?


----------



## justanoldman

Things that make you Hmm&#8230;
GTX 670 plus water block is $500, if I end up with two, that is $1k. The same as a Titan&#8230;


----------



## ivanlabrie

hahaha...wait till reviews are out. If you got no voltage control over 1.2v it's kinda MEH for less performance than 670 sli.


----------



## neoroy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Whooaaa what a monster cooller you have there *Hokies83*








The rig will be cool as the winter


----------



## KeyboardXpert

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> I see an AMD sticker on my graphic card... so whose ATI
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No more ATI mon! They have been assimilated by the AMD warmonger!
> Is it or do I see space for a three Radiators... 360, 140 and another 240 at the bottom?
> 
> Come join us swaggy... come join us in our watery cause!


Haha assimilated. AMD cards do better in Starcraft II actually.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Things that make you Hmm&#8230;
> GTX 670 plus water block is $500, if I end up with two, that is $1k. The same as a Titan&#8230;


...and that's before the 780 which will come out later -- just less than Titan performance for a lot less money







- confused yet ?









But seriously folks, the NVidia Kepler family encompasses a whole bunch of chips from the 6 series to the Titans...sort of like a car manufacturer with various engines on offer which share much of the same architecture such as bore, stroke, valve timing etc....what's different is the number of cylinders and turbos...you want a 4, or straight six, a V8 or a V12 (or for Titan Bugatti fans, a W-16 with quad turbos







)

...paying $500 for a 670 sounds a bit high, even with w-c...in any case, in a well-cooled case SLI 670ies such as Asus Direct CUii don't really need w-cooling in my my experience, only when moving to tri-SLI might it become an issue due to impeded air flow (I will soon find out). In my SLI 670 Asus Direct CUii setup, temps in the GPUs, oc'ed that they are, *never exceed* high 50ies / low 60ies -- even during major benchmarking such as 3D11, Vantage or Firestrike...intense gaming for an hour is in the low 50ies. Max temp threshold for this card is about 85 C, and throttling starts at 70 C.

If $s are a concern, you might want to find the best deal on a well-cooled 670 solution such as Asus Direct CUii which should run you about $360-$380...if I recall this correctly, you already have a machine with an (EVGA?) 670...you can even for just an afternoon SLI those to find out what you gain...SLI 670, even before they are 'breathed on' represent a very fast combo. (SLI will work across different manufacturers, just not different classes, so 2GB 670 by different manufacturers can be SLI-ed)...*see how that works with your favourite games and settings, then make a decision.
*
Water -cooling GPUs is s.th. I will look at soon, but only because a.) I will be running tri-SLI and b.) I am really looking to get ready for a Titan SLI or tri-SLI later in the year (and distribute the current 670ies across other machines here). Therefore, I am NOT buying 670 custom blocks, but Uni-blocks and some sort of VRM solution I can switch over to Titan later.


----------



## Swag

Okay guys, I have decided on the 680, after all the testing and taking out the GPUs and putting the other one in, the 680 is the one I have chosen to stick with. I'm sorry to all the people who are rooting for ATI but for me, I really fell in love with the 680.

Here's the outline of why I chose the 680 over the 7970:
The 7970 was obnoxiously loud, like it would probably be louder that 3x my D14...
The 680 looks a whole lot better in my build vs the 7970.
Their performance against each other in games were so close to each other, although the 7970 won in most cases (had 5FPS higher on average)
The 7970 scored a 1074 on Heavens benchmark while the 680 scored a measly 1020 (I just realized I'm listing out why I shouldn't have gone the 680...







)

Thank you so much for helping me with my dilemma and I'm sure if I had gone with the 7970 (if it wasn't so loud and ugly); I would've been extremely happy!

To all the people who helped me, I'll be going back into the posts and +rep you all!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay guys, I have decided on the 680, after all the testing and taking out the GPUs and putting the other one in, the 680 is the one I have chosen to stick with. I'm sorry to all the people who are rooting for ATI but for me, I really fell in love with the 680.
> 
> Here's the outline of why I chose the 680 over the 7970:
> The 7970 was obnoxiously loud, like it would probably be louder that 3x my D14...
> The 680 looks a whole lot better in my build vs the 7970.
> Their performance against each other in games were so close to each other, although the 7970 won in most cases (had 5FPS higher on average)
> The 7970 scored a 1074 on Heavens benchmark while the 680 scored a measly 1020 (I just realized I'm listing out why I shouldn't have gone the 680...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Thank you so much for helping me with my dilemma and I'm sure if I had gone with the 7970 (if it wasn't so loud and ugly); I would've been extremely happy!
> 
> To all the people who helped me, I'll be going back into the posts and +rep you all!


bought damn time you decided


----------



## King4x4

Puny human....

I had a 690 installed in my pc for less then 3 hours... got rid of it due to the fact that its memory was not sufficient for my resolution I am playing in my games.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay guys, I have decided on the 680, after all the testing and taking out the GPUs and putting the other one in, the 680 is the one I have chosen to stick with. I'm sorry to all the people who are rooting for ATI but for me, I really fell in love with the 680.
> 
> Here's the outline of why I chose the 680 over the 7970:
> The 7970 was obnoxiously loud, like it would probably be louder that 3x my D14...
> The 680 looks a whole lot better in my build vs the 7970.
> Their performance against each other in games were so close to each other, although the 7970 won in most cases (had 5FPS higher on average)
> The 7970 scored a 1074 on Heavens benchmark while the 680 scored a measly 1020 (I just realized I'm listing out why I shouldn't have gone the 680...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Thank you so much for helping me with my dilemma and I'm sure if I had gone with the 7970 (if it wasn't so loud and ugly); I would've been extremely happy!
> 
> To all the people who helped me, I'll be going back into the posts and +rep you all!
> 
> 
> 
> bought damn time you decided
Click to expand...

Yea I know... I always have this, like when I was buying my motherboard + CPU, I spent a good 3 hours in MC talking to the worker about which one he recommended. He tried selling me a 3930k... so you know I didn't listen to him...


----------



## Valgaur

I really hope the 680's are 6gb cards as well. I would love 6gb of vram man..... 4 would be much better than my 2 but I never utilize more than 1.3 ever


----------



## Hokies83

I've used up to 2.3gb at 1080i and 2.8gb 2560x1440.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I really hope the 680's are 6gb cards as well. I would love 6gb of vram man..... 4 would be much better than my 2 but I never utilize more than 1.3 ever


Val, what does yours score on Heavens?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea I know... I always have this, like when I was buying my motherboard + CPU, I spent a good 3 hours in MC talking to the worker about which one he recommended. He tried selling me a 3930k... so you know I didn't listen to him...


Go Swag !







Congrats, great choice - and kudos (that's kudos, not cudas of which you have plenty now) how you arrived at it...ask for some feedback, then get the top two competitor cards and try them out yourself in your rig until you find what you like best...plus great expansion capabilities if that's really needed


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea I know... I always have this, like when I was buying my motherboard + CPU, I spent a good 3 hours in MC talking to the worker about which one he recommended. He tried selling me a 3930k... so you know I didn't listen to him...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go Swag !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats, great choice - and kudos (that's kudos, not cudas of which you have plenty now) how you arrived at it...ask for some feedback, then get the top two competitor cards and try them out yourself in your rig until you find what you like best...plus great expansion capabilities if that's really needed
Click to expand...

Yea, I've done decisions before by just going with it but this time I decided to see which one I truly liked better. If that 7970 wasn't so damn loud, I would've probably went for that. And the fact that the 680 looks 100X sexier.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I've done decisions before by just going with it but this time I decided to see which one I truly liked better. If that 7970 wasn't so damn loud, I would've probably went for that. And the fact that the 680 looks 100X sexier.


...of course, now you have to deal with IvanL when he finds out







- if you can't chase 220 volts through it, he probably won't like it - but I have to say I love the guy's 'unique' approach to things


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I've done decisions before by just going with it but this time I decided to see which one I truly liked better. If that 7970 wasn't so damn loud, I would've probably went for that. And the fact that the 680 looks 100X sexier.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...of course, now you have to deal with IvanL when he finds out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - if you can't chase 220 volts through it, he probably won't like it - but I have to say I love the guy's 'unique' approach to things
Click to expand...

Honestly, I don't want to increase the voltage going through this card... I need it to last 3 years at least...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Honestly, I don't want to increase the voltage going through this card... I need it to last 3 years at least...


...besides, even at max 'factory v' you got some nice oc tools available without frying the card...I go through s.th. like that with my delidded CPU...I can push it even more at room temps than I already have, but this system also has some big work stuff (software design) on it. The latter takes about two weeks to set up right...so if it is a choice between a 'Banzai' run that however endangers the whole setup, or a few validation runs that are still within my safety envelope...

BTW, as a new 680 owner, NVidia released a new WL driver earlier today (314.07)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Honestly, I don't want to increase the voltage going through this card... I need it to last 3 years at least...
> 
> 
> 
> ...besides, even at max 'factory v' you got some nice oc tools available without frying the card...I go through s.th. like that with my delidded CPU...I can push it even more at room temps than I already have, but this system also has some big work stuff (software design) on it. The latter takes about two weeks to set up right...so if it is a choice between a 'Banzai' run that however endangers the whole setup, or a few validation runs that are still within my safety envelope...
> 
> BTW, as a new 680 owner, NVidia released a new WL driver earlier today (314.07)
Click to expand...

I think that's the one I'm using. Lol, I reinstalled my entire Windows too. I'm loving this Precision X tool, very easy and straightfoward for OCing this card.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and that's before the 780 which will come out later -- just less than Titan performance for a lot less money
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - confused yet ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But seriously folks, the NVidia Kepler family encompasses a whole bunch of chips from the 6 series to the Titans...sort of like a car manufacturer with various engines on offer which share much of the same architecture such as bore, stroke, valve timing etc....what's different is the number of cylinders and turbos...you want a 4, or straight six, a V8 or a V12 (or for Titan Bugatti fans, a W-16 with quad turbos
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> ...paying $500 for a 670 sounds a bit high, even with w-c...in any case, in a well-cooled case SLI 670ies such as Asus Direct CUii don't really need w-cooling in my my experience, only when moving to tri-SLI might it become an issue due to impeded air flow (I will soon find out). In my SLI 670 Asus Direct CUii setup, temps in the GPUs, oc'ed that they are, *never exceed* high 50ies / low 60ies -- even during major benchmarking such as 3D11, Vantage or Firestrike...intense gaming for an hour is in the low 50ies. Max temp threshold for this card is about 85 C, and throttling starts at 70 C.
> 
> If $s are a concern, you might want to find the best deal on a well-cooled 670 solution such as Asus Direct CUii which should run you about $360-$380...if I recall this correctly, you already have a machine with an (EVGA?) 670...you can even for just an afternoon SLI those to find out what you gain...SLI 670, even before they are 'breathed on' represent a very fast combo. (SLI will work across different manufacturers, just not different classes, so 2GB 670 by different manufacturers can be SLI-ed)...*see how that works with your favourite games and settings, then make a decision.
> *
> Water -cooling GPUs is s.th. I will look at soon, but only because a.) I will be running tri-SLI and b.) I am really looking to get ready for a Titan SLI or tri-SLI later in the year (and distribute the current 670ies across other machines here). Therefore, I am NOT buying 670 custom blocks, but Uni-blocks and some sort of VRM solution I can switch over to Titan later.


Thanks a lot for the post, and information.
It is entirely possible I am doing something wrong, since I am new to GPU overclocking. Maybe we have different views of fan noise, personally I am allergic to it. If mine 670 (at 1163 and 3734 oc) hits 55% fan speed I think it is annoying, and the card will throttle as soon as it hits 70c. If you can tell me a way to have a single 670, by itself, run Heaven with max settings at 1920x1080, never have it hit 70c, and never have the fan go much over 50% I would love to know it.

As far as the case goes, I can't seem to get much difference out of that when I am testing. I am sure it would be different after hours of game play, but whether I close my case up with a couple slow fans or take both side panels off and point a large floor fan at the mobo, temps on my 670 still go over 60c while stress testing with Heaven.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think that's the one I'm using. Lol, I reinstalled my entire Windows too. I'm loving this Precision X tool, very easy and straightfoward for OCing this card.


With a single card, Precision X works best - even for those with non-EVGA cards. I had it running for a month, but for some reason it did not like voltage adjustments (within factory envelope) on card #2...Asus' GPU Twek is ok, though Precision-X is better otherwise

...working on 'White Elephant' - my new system in a white Stryker case...so many upgrades that I probably will have to reinstall windows, like you...bought an Intel Series 520 SSD yesterday and staring at the 'transfer OS' button...instead of a fresh install...

the aforementioned work stuff is what holds me back re a fresh start right now...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...of course, now you have to deal with IvanL when he finds out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - if you can't chase 220 volts through it, he probably won't like it - but I have to say I love the guy's 'unique' approach to things


Yeah, I'm disappoint... xD
Enjoy your card Swag. It's more of a straightforward thing with the kepler boost. Remember to replace the stock tim with Liquid Pro/Ultra. That will keep it from throttling when reaching 70c.
Thus you won't even need a bios flash and pseudo-overvolting. Just oc the ram as much as possible and the core a bit without getting throttling (and max the power target)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks a lot for the post, and information.
> It is entirely possible I am doing something wrong, since I am new to GPU overclocking. Maybe we have different views of fan noise, personally I am allergic to it. If mine 670 (at 1163 and 3734 oc) hits 55% fan speed I think it is annoying, and the card will throttle as soon as it hits 70c. If you can tell me a way to have a single 670, by itself, run Heaven with max settings at 1920x1080, never have it hit 70c, and never have the fan go much over 50% I would love to know it.
> 
> As far as the case goes, I can't seem to get much difference out of that when I am testing. I am sure it would be different after hours of game play, but whether I close my case up with a couple slow fans or take both side panels off and point a large floor fan at the mobo, temps on my 670 still go over 60c while stress testing with Heaven.


lol anything over 50c on my 670 and my fan is maxed out 80%. the fans dont bother me when i have my headset on.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...of course, now you have to deal with IvanL when he finds out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - if you can't chase 220 volts through it, he probably won't like it - but I have to say I love the guy's 'unique' approach to things
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, I'm disappoint... xD
> Enjoy your card Swag. It's more of a straightforward thing with the kepler boost. Remember to replace the stock tim with Liquid Pro/Ultra. That will keep it from throttling when reaching 70c.
> Thus you won't even need a bios flash and pseudo-overvolting. Just oc the ram as much as possible and the core a bit without getting throttling (and max the power target)
Click to expand...

Wait, will I still be able to RMA the card for any reason if I change the TIM to CLP?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> With a single card, Precision X works best - even for those with non-EVGA cards. I had it running for a month, but for some reason it did not like voltage adjustments (within factory envelope) on card #2...Asus' GPU Twek is ok, though Precision-X is better otherwise
> 
> ...working on 'White Elephant' - my new system in a white Stryker case...so many upgrades that I probably will have to reinstall windows, like you...bought an Intel Series 520 SSD yesterday and staring at the 'transfer OS' button...instead of a fresh install...
> 
> the aforementioned work stuff is what holds me back re a fresh start right now...


i did that when i got my intel 520 ssd and a week later i just reinstalled windows anyway. lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i did that when i got my intel 520 ssd and a week later i just reinstalled windows anyway. lol


...I really wish you wouldn't have said that...I was almost successfully kidding myself that I did not have to reinstall


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wait, will I still be able to RMA the card for any reason if I change the TIM to CLP?


...don't know the make of your 680, but last weekend when I was prepping my three 370ies for life in the fast lane (read BIOS mod and tr-SLI)...I had all three cards apart and my six packs (3 + 3) of CL paste ready to go...but then I noticed that the GPU coolers - including the parts that would touch CL - had BOTH Copper and Aluminum...CL does corrode aluminum, per package advisory...I ended up putting MX4 on them (still with great temp gains)

...still, even with a brand new card, it might be worth checking out...of the three GTX Asus Direct CU ii cards, two had 'loose screws' on the heat sink, and all three gained (individually) 3-4 C temp wise in subsequent (individual) binning / benching


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wait, will I still be able to RMA the card for any reason if I change the TIM to CLP?
> 
> 
> 
> ...don't know the make of your 680, but last weekend when I was prepping my three 370ies for life in the fast lane (read BIOS mod and tr-SLI)...I had all three cards apart and my six packs (3 + 3) of CL paste ready to go...but then I noticed that the GPU coolers - including the parts that would touch CL - had BOTH Copper and Aluminum...CL does corrode aluminum, per package advisory...I ended up putting MX4 on them (still with great temp gains)
> 
> ...still, even with a brand new card, it might be worth checking out...of the three GTX Asus Direct CU ii cards, two had 'loose screws' on the heat sink, and all three gained (individually) 3-4 C temp wise in subsequent (individual) binning / benching
Click to expand...

My 680 is made by EVGA. How do I find out if the stock HSF contains aluminum?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My 680 is made by EVGA. How do I find out if the stock HSF contains aluminum?


...don't know about EVGA, but on Asus it was obvious...the heat pipe arrangement (per pic below) is either nickel-plated copper, or at the GPU 'touch point', untreated but flattened copper...but in-between those three 'lanes' of copper facing the GPU die was the rest of the heat sink which is aluminum, both by pdf spec and by visual / touch


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I really wish you wouldn't have said that...I was almost successfully kidding myself that I did not have to reinstall


mybad! but i was overclocking also.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My 680 is made by EVGA. How do I find out if the stock HSF contains aluminum?


If it is Evga do not expect much from there heatsinks XD

They win in customer service " most of the time " but fail when it comes to stock cooling gpu's.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> mybad! but i was overclocking also.


...same diff..operation a success.....patient dead


----------



## King4x4

Well guys my 690 just went up on the sale garage on my local forum.... Thing can't handle the resolution of 7680x1440 even when dumping down the settings on BF3.... lets hope the 680 4GB are better!


----------



## Swag

Okay, I switched the TIM on the GPU! Temps are so much better now, temps went from 70C to 50C.







Really good!

I'll edit this to add the photos!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Things that make you Hmm&#8230;
> GTX 670 plus water block is $500, if I end up with two, that is $1k. The same as a Titan&#8230;


Just get a 670 with decent cooling.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Honestly, I don't want to increase the voltage going through this card... I need it to last 3 years at least...


That's what warranties are for!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, I switched the TIM on the GPU! Temps are so much better now, temps went from 70C to 50C.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Really good!
> 
> I'll edit this to add the photos!


There ya go!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, I switched the TIM on the GPU! Temps are so much better now, temps went from 70C to 50C.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Really good!
> 
> I'll edit this to add the photos!


What TIM did you go with, your temps went from what to what, any tips/instructions you could give? I have an EVGA 670 right now in one machine, but I am not sure how to do what you guys are talking about.


----------



## VonDutch

Day 3 GPU talk ...i'll bbl .......next week orso ...lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Okay, I switched the TIM on the GPU! Temps are so much better now, temps went from 70C to 50C.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Really good!
> 
> I'll edit this to add the photos!
> 
> 
> 
> What TIM did you go with, your temps went from what to what, any tips/instructions you could give? I have an EVGA 670 right now in one machine, but I am not sure how to do what you guys are talking about.
Click to expand...

I used Coollaboratory Liquid Pro. My temps went from 70C to 50C.

There are 6 screws to take off the plastic cover. There are 4 screws on the back, the 4 main screws with little springs. That takes off the heatsink. You must take off the plastic cover first before removing the 4 main screws in the back!


----------



## justanoldman

I called EVGA and they confirmed that replacing the TIM does not void the warranty provided you do it right and don't hurt anything.
They also said that you have to use a TIM that is both non-conductive and non-capacitive, otherwise you will be in trouble.
Are the Coollabs products both of those things?


----------



## King4x4

Yes!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks a lot for the post, and information.
> It is entirely possible I am doing something wrong, since I am new to GPU overclocking. Maybe we have different views of fan noise, personally I am allergic to it. If mine 670 (at 1163 and 3734 oc) hits 55% fan speed I think it is annoying, and the card will throttle as soon as it hits 70c. If you can tell me a way to have a single 670, by itself, run Heaven with max settings at 1920x1080, never have it hit 70c, and never have the fan go much over 50% I would love to know it.
> 
> As far as the case goes, I can't seem to get much difference out of that when I am testing. I am sure it would be different after hours of game play, but whether I close my case up with a couple slow fans or take both side panels off and point a large floor fan at the mobo, temps on my 670 still go over 60c while stress testing with Heaven.


Here you go - comparative temps and noise


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_geforce_gtx_670_directcu_ii_top_review,9.html

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/asus_geforce_gtx_670_directcu_ii_top_review,10.html


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I called EVGA and they confirmed that replacing the TIM does not void the warranty provided you do it right and don't hurt anything.
> They also said that you have to use a TIM that is both non-conductive and non-capacitive, otherwise you will be in trouble.
> Are the Coollabs products both of those things?


I remember talking to EVGA -> they sounded like great people.
I don't regret buying an MSI GFX, but I regret not buying something EVGA related.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Yes!


Are you answering me?
This is from the manufacturer: Like all metals, our Liquid Metal may act as an electric conductor. This forms no problem if applied according to our instructions, as your cooler is made of conducting metal as well. Make sure "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" does not touch any electric components.

So it is in fact conductive, and per EVGA should not be used on a GPU.

Are they just being careful to say that or should you really never use pro/ultra on a GPU?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I called EVGA and they confirmed that replacing the TIM does not void the warranty provided you do it right and don't hurt anything.
> They also said that you have to use a TIM that is both non-conductive and non-capacitive, otherwise you will be in trouble.
> Are the Coollabs products both of those things?


...to stick with the 'delidded' theme, these GPUs are already delidded, with EXPOSED transistors and such surrounding the die. When I opened my three 670ies up, all three had a huge globs of factory-applied TIM that had squeezed off the die onto said area with transistors...if it would have been conductive and capacitive, it would have been trouble.

...Swag however would know how to carefully apply CL so that there is no excess that could squeeze out from the top of the die and hit the sensitive electronic bits. I have not seen an exposed heat sink of an EVGA to determine whether it is nickel-plated copper or aluminum where CL would have contact - that would be my only concern per above post


----------



## justanoldman

EVGA gave me the example of AS5 not being safe because it is capacitive, while Ceramique is safe because it is not.

It sounds like you could use pro/ultra on the GPU if you are extremely careful, don't get it anywhere it shouldn't go, and don't put too much so it will be pushed out. Then of course if you ever have to RMA it you would have to open it back up, perfectly remove any trace of ultra/pro and replace it with a "safe" TIM since I am assuming they could refuse the RMA if they see you used a conductive TIM like pro/ultra.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> EVGA gave me the example of AS5 not being safe because it is capacitive, while Ceramique is safe because it is not.
> 
> It sounds like you could use pro/ultra on the GPU if you are extremely careful, don't get it anywhere it shouldn't go, and don't put too much so it will be pushed out. Then of course if you ever have to RMA it you would have to open it back up, perfectly remove any trace of ultra/pro and replace it with a "safe" TIM since I am assuming they could refuse the RMA if they see you used a conductive TIM like pro/ultra.


...sounds about right, but it's the same story with 3770 delids... As a 'middle option', there is MX4 which is the best non-CL product out there in my experience (yours may differ). MX4 is non-conductive / non-capacitive.

I ended up using MX4 on my vid cards due to the partial aluminum exposure


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds about right, but it's the same story with 3770 delids... As a 'middle option', there is MX4 which is the best non-CL product out there in my experience (yours may differ). MX4 is non-conductive / non-capacitive.
> 
> I ended up using MX4 on my vid cards due to the partial aluminum exposure


That is exactly what I was thinking. Since you just did this, any tips you can add to what Swag said, is it pretty easy to open up a 670, remove the old TIM and put the new on?


----------



## megawatz

Got my CLU in today! Guess who is ripping their PC apart .....again?


----------



## Joa3d43

...it was very straightforward..mind you, the Asus Direct CUii T is a non-reference card with a different PCB - on those, only 4 screws hold the cooler assembly...

...with the EVGA, it will be more...when we posted via 'spoilers' on heat in the whole system a few days back, I had included a YouTube link of a fellow prepping an EVGA 670 for a water block...the first part of that (taking the old cooler off re screw locations) could be helpful to you re the process...you may even find that on your card (like on so many others), the screws weren't all tightened the same etc - so a worthwhile ops in any case.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Got my CLU in today! Guess who is ripping their PC apart .....again?


...I got three apart right now...I wonder what the clinical term is for our affliction(s)


----------



## justanoldman

No kidding, one old computer in pieces because the power supply went out, another old computer being used for work, and two computer half built, switching parts back and forth, trying to share monitors to test different configurations. This is getting ridiculous.

On the plus side I just got my Trident X 2400 ram. My current sticks are old school as plain as can be, but these new ones, wow, what a difference in appearance.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wait, will I still be able to RMA the card for any reason if I change the TIM to CLP?


Yeah...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My 680 is made by EVGA. How do I find out if the stock HSF contains aluminum?


Nickel plated copper base...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Are you answering me?
> This is from the manufacturer: Like all metals, our Liquid Metal may act as an electric conductor. This forms no problem if applied according to our instructions, as your cooler is made of conducting metal as well. Make sure "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" does not touch any electric components.
> 
> So it is in fact conductive, and per EVGA should not be used on a GPU.
> 
> Are they just being careful to say that or should you really never use pro/ultra on a GPU?


They are being pussies...LP on die or go bust.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No kidding, one old computer in pieces because the power supply went out, another old computer being used for work, and two computer half built, switching parts back and forth, trying to share monitors to test different configurations. This is getting ridiculous.
> 
> On the plus side I just got my Trident X 2400 ram. My current sticks are old school as plain as can be, but these new ones, wow, what a difference in appearance.


Nice grab!


----------



## lilchronic

i have coolabs ultra on my 670 with its stock air cooler and now im a lil worried that it might cause a problem.
temps drop is not that great as to putting it on the die of you cpu cause i only droppen 6c with ultra when applied to my 670ftw


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No kidding, one old computer in pieces because the power supply went out, another old computer being used for work, and two computer half built, switching parts back and forth, trying to share monitors to test different configurations. This is getting ridiculous.
> 
> On the plus side I just got my Trident X 2400 ram. My current sticks are old school as plain as can be, but these new ones, wow, what a difference in appearance.


...and those are heavy, too...the first time I took them out of the pack, I could not believe how much more 'substantial' they were than even G.Skill Ripsaws


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i have coolabs ultra on my 670 with its stock air cooler and now im a lil worried that it might cause a problem.
> temps drop is not that great as to putting it on the die of you cpu cause i only droppen 6c with ultra when applied to my 670ftw


...just two things to worry about: 1.) used too much so that it can run off the die ? 2.) was there any aluminum that actually would touch the CL-treated area above the die ?

...otherwise, ''don't worry, be happy"


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...just two things to worry about: 1.) used too much so that it can run off the die ? 2.) was there any aluminum that actually would touch the CL-treated area above the die ?
> 
> ...otherwise, ''don't worry, be happy"


im not worried about the apllication. i just hope my heatsink is not aluminum i forget if there was any. but its been a good month so far and still up and running.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Can someone clarify something about CLU - when does too much paste become too much for temperatures to be affected?
And more so - why what is the reasoning behind it?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Can someone clarify something about CLU - when does too much paste become too much for temperatures to be affected?
> And more so - why what is the reasoning behind it?


It's only supposed to fill the gaps. The Die and IHS are both better at transferring heat. Any more, and you're decreasing the thermal transfer ability of the trio.
CLU transfers heat better than air, but not better than metal. So you use _just_ enough to fill the gaps/imperfections, which would otherwise act as air pockets

Ergo, use the least amount possible to fill in just the imperfections


----------



## I_shot

4.6 ghz 1.208V



Finally i've got a decent chip


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quite good...but that's not good for reference. Try 5ghz, boot and run superpi 32m. That's how most folks bin chips.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Are you answering me?
> This is from the manufacturer: Like all metals, our Liquid Metal may act as an electric conductor. This forms no problem if applied according to our instructions, as your cooler is made of conducting metal as well. Make sure "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" does not touch any electric components.
> 
> So it is in fact conductive, and per EVGA should not be used on a GPU.
> 
> Are they just being careful to say that or should you really never use pro/ultra on a GPU?


It is conductive, so it it actually ran off the die a bit & gets into the SMD components around the die that could make real problems.
Although the area around the die could get insulated, some LET over the SMD stuff around the die & short circuits aren't a concern anymore.I've had cards covered in 1/2" of snow & dripping water while running.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I remember talking to EVGA -> they sounded like great people.
> I don't regret buying an MSI GFX, but I regret not buying something EVGA related.


MSI is very similar, no problem taking a card apart to re-paste or use a waterblock. Most manu's are pretty good that way, if they can't tell it was taken apart, they are OK with it. It just has to go back in original factory condition if it has a problem.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and those are heavy, too...the first time I took them out of the pack, I could not believe how much more 'substantial' they were than even G.Skill Ripsaws


Dominator platinum are about the same, the heaviest heatsinks I've seen are the mushkin copperheads, They're smaller than trident X & platinum but it's a solid chunk of copper on those.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quite good...but that's not good for reference. Try 5ghz, boot and run superpi 32m. That's how most folks bin chips.


I'm having a little bit problem with my water cooling right now. as soon as i fix it i'll try 5 ghz


----------



## DiamondCut

Errrrrrrrrrr, I used CLP on my GTX 670 :S I did a good job as I always do but I didn't take the certain percautions i might of needed to take? It this something I should have to pullout the block or would I be fine If i applied my normal limited amount on the die?


----------



## dmanstasiu

meh. I used CLU on my 7970 and 2600k, no harm done (yet







)


----------



## justanoldman

What kind of temp drops did you guys get by replacing the TIM on your GPUs?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What kind of temp drops did you guys get by replacing the TIM on your GPUs?


between 8 and 10 C (per card)


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What kind of temp drops did you guys get by replacing the TIM on your GPUs?


GPU* and I didn't measure. I went from stock heatsink to kuhler 920 right away.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiamondCut*
> 
> Errrrrrrrrrr, I used CLP on my GTX 670 :S I did a good job as I always do but I didn't take the certain percautions i might of needed to take? It this something I should have to pullout the block or would I be fine If i applied my normal limited amount on the die?


...you mentioned 'pull out the block' - is your GPU water-cooled ? Apart from avoiding any spillage / dripping of CL off the die, the issue is only whether CL is touching any aluminum - I would think a w-c block would be copper / nickel-plated copper


----------



## Hokies83

Never Fear Mr Gpu is here.....

There is no harm no foul in using a conductive tim as long as....

1. Do not over do it..

2. Make sure none is touching the Pcb in any way.

3. The die is very small and very easy to apply CL LP/Lu to if you make a mistake in these regards you should not be replacing the tim on your Gpus in the first place.



You have a Huge safe area to work with.. this should not be an Issue.
If by chance tim is outside of the " Safe " Area simplely remove it before powering it on.

Galaxy will honor warranty's for replacing tim if it is not the cause of the fail of the gpu..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Never Fear Mr Gpu is here.....
> 
> There is no harm no foul in using a conductive tim as long as....
> 
> 1. Do not over do it..
> 
> 2. Make sure none is touching the Pcb in any way.
> 
> 3. The die is very small and very easy to apply CL LP/Lu to if you make a mistake in these regards you should not be replacing the tim on your Gpus in the first place.
> 
> 
> 
> You have a Huge safe area to work with.. this should not be an Issue.
> If by chance tim is outside of the " Safe " Area simplely remove it before powering it on.
> 
> Galaxy will honor warranty's for replacing tim if it is not the cause of the fail of the gpu..


Thanks for the pic and pointers Hokies...couldn't have put it any better than that. You have that big square thing around the die, and you'd have to be a fool to put so much tim as to touch the pcb anyway. xD


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thanks for the pic and pointers Hokies...couldn't have put it any better than that. *You have that big square thing around the die, and you'd have to be a fool to put so much tim as to touch the pcb anyway. xD*


Indeed.


----------



## FtW 420

Just have to watch all the little SMD components in the big square area around the die about 1/8" away. Carefully applied should be fine though, just have to make sure it isn't enough to get run off.


----------



## ivanlabrie

woot! got a free Asrock 462 mobo with an unknown cpu...a bunch of free ddr and pc133 sticks and two pcchips mobo+cpu+hsf combos. Those are also 462...I gotta figure out how to remove the hsf's now xD

EDIT: Soldered cpus (pcchips boards), and I still don't know how to remove the hsf from the Asrock one


----------



## megawatz

I'll see you guys on the CLU side. After I post this and my before pic, I'm re-de-lidding the CPU and putting CLU on both the HSM and the die.

My current setup with IBT 1024MB test with AS5 on the die and HSM: 4.5Ghz @ 1.33v


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What kind of temp drops did you guys get by replacing the TIM on your GPUs?


i got around 8c - 6c decrease in temps with ultra


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I'll see you guys on the CLU side. After I post this and my before pic, I'm re-de-lidding the CPU and putting CLU on both the HSM and the die.
> 
> My current setup with IBT 1024MB test with AS5 on the die and HSM: 4.5Ghz @ 1.33v


...good luck


----------



## DiamondCut

I wasn't smart enough to grab the temps when I first ran the system stock but my 670 idles at 21c


----------



## megawatz

Help! My CLU wont let any more out of the syringe and i cant get my IHS CLU to spread any more than this!

What do?









Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> I'll see you guys on the CLU side. After I post this and my before pic, I'm re-de-lidding the CPU and putting CLU on both the HSM and the die.
> 
> My current setup with IBT 1024MB test with AS5 on the die and HSM: 4.5Ghz @ 1.33v


im looking forward to seeing your results.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> Help! My CLU wont let any more out of the syringe and i cant get my IHS CLU to spread any more than this!
> 
> What do?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk 2


keep working it and trying to spread it


----------



## lilchronic

you have to pull the tim with the brush to the edge and even taking the brush off the end of the ihs. i hope u understand what i mean


----------



## megawatz

No matter what i do it wont spread any more than this:









Sent from my Transformer Prime TF201 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## enigma7820

the reason it wont spread anymore is one of two reason

A you changed the side of the brush you were originally using you have to use the same side you started with for every stroke meaning you turn the chip when not change your hand and brush position.

B you are using to much pressure you should not even be able to see or feel that you are actually touching the chip.

hope this helps you


----------



## ivanlabrie

Happened to me, let's say CLU/LP is very VERY picky with the surface flatness and cleanless. Any kind of debris will prevent you from spreading it.


----------



## enigma7820

also not to be rude but why the hell are you doing that when its in the socket already I would never even think of trying that. Apply it out of the case away from other components you asking for trouble with a slip or spill


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> also not to be rude but why the hell are you doing that when its in the socket already I would never even think of trying that. Apply it out of the case away from other components you asking for trouble with a slip or spill


I did it with the chip in the socket. Not hard at all. Why would you do it out of the socket and mess up your die application?


----------



## enigma7820

If have done 5 chips never once did it in the socket always outside of socket, but I also always glue the ihs back on so it doesn't move when mounting very simple and much smarter imho


----------



## megawatz

She's stable. and cooler. 73c max on IBT.







and FTR, that $#!t sucked. AS5 was cake, but this crap just turned straight into metal form in the syringe. :/


----------



## Hokies83

Use a Q tip will spread better and more.


----------



## buildtoexcess

DO NOT use Q-Tip Or Other Cotton Swabs as individual fibers will separate and remain on die surface mixed in tim (clp / et al)

fine sabel hair brush wetted with 99% alcohol and squeezed dry is best - remember no loose fibers / paper edge or cotton or other to become embedded / trapped in tim between die face & ihs...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *buildtoexcess*
> 
> DO NOT use Q-Tip Or Other Cotton Swabs as individual fibers will separate and remain on die surface mixed in tim (clp / et al)
> 
> fine sabel hair brush wetted with 99% alcohol and squeezed dry is best - remember no loose fibers / paper edge or cotton or other to become embedded / trapped in tim between die face & ihs...


Maybe for you ive used Qtip countless times just like " Cool Labs themselves do " in there app video...

I suggest u use a better Qtip if u have that problem green horn.
And stick to one side of the Qtip as the tim makes a layer between it's self and the QTip best way to get even perfect spread.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> If have done 5 chips never once did it in the socket always outside of socket, but I also always glue the ihs back on so it doesn't move when mounting very simple and much smarter imho


Absolute genius...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yeah my Qtips would leave residue - I can see the point the gent was trying to make though.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Yeah my Qtips would leave residue - I can see the point the gent was trying to make though.


Use 1 part of the Q tip never any other parts of it like seen in the video and witten in the instructions with the tim and that will never happen.

QTips give a superb controlled spread.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> It's only supposed to fill the gaps. The Die and IHS are both better at transferring heat. Any more, and you're decreasing the thermal transfer ability of the trio.
> CLU transfers heat better than air, but not better than metal. So you use _just_ enough to fill the gaps/imperfections, which would otherwise act as air pockets
> 
> Ergo, use the least amount possible to fill in just the imperfections


Cheers for the info buddy!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> MSI is very similar, no problem taking a card apart to re-paste or use a waterblock. Most manu's are pretty good that way, if they can't tell it was taken apart, they are OK with it. It just has to go back in original factory condition if it has a problem..


Asus would fail to agree


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Absolute genius...


it can create a gap though


----------



## dragon1320

just signed up today after reading all of the way and watching the videos on how to delid and did on my chip, I used super glue two tiny dots one on each side of the IHS to glue it on to the pcb, my buddy says it shouldn't be a problem cause It doesn't corrode and it doesn't conduct electricity should I have taken his advice it seems to be working great and didn't move when installing like I saw on the videos I watched


----------



## justanoldman

If you guys feel more comfortable gluing the IHS back down, then that is great. Personally I wouldn't do that because it is hard to get the exact amount of TIM on the die the first time, and there may come a time that the TIM needs to be adjusted or redone. Having a glued chip means you would have to cut through whatever glue you used, thus again risking damage. Then, of course, you have to clean that glue so as to no interfere with the IHS making proper contact with die.

After taking mine apart so many times, I am not sure how you would know how to do the glue so it wouldn't interfere with the IHS at all. Since we now know the problem with these chips was not the TIM, but the fact that the IHS was prevented from making proper contact, adding more glue seems unnecessarily problematic. Not saying it won't work, just giving my two cents.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dragon1320*
> 
> just signed up today after reading all of the way and watching the videos on how to delid and did on my chip, I used super glue two tiny dots one on each side of the IHS to glue it on to the pcb, my buddy says it shouldn't be a problem cause It doesn't corrode and it doesn't conduct electricity should I have taken his advice it seems to be working great and didn't move when installing like I saw on the videos I watched


Welcome to OCN!
You first post ever and you have delidded your chip - that is impressive.
Any pics and temp data to share?

By the way, here is how to fill out your rig so it shows up in you posts:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Use 1 part of the Q tip never any other parts of it like seen in the video and witten in the instructions with the tim and that will never happen.
> 
> QTips give a superb controlled spread.


Exactamundo ! I used a Q-tip, but only one side and watchful re fibres after watching the instructional video by CL. Fibres are actually quite easily identified, given CL's appearance once spread thin on the die


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If you guys feel more comfortable gluing the IHS back down, then that is great. Personally I wouldn't do that because it is hard to get the exact amount of TIM on the die the first time, and there may come a time that the TIM needs to be adjusted or redone. Having a glued chip means you would have to cut through whatever glue you used, thus again risking damage. Then, of course, you have to clean that glue so as to no interfere with the IHS making proper contact with die.
> 
> After taking mine apart so many times, I am not sure how you would know how to do the glue so it wouldn't interfere with the IHS at all. Since we now know the problem with these chips was not the TIM, but the fact that the IHS was prevented from making proper contact, adding more glue seems unnecessarily problematic. Not saying it won't work, just giving my two cents.


...there is also another advantage with NOT gluing it down: It may allow hot air underneath the IHS and surrounding the die to escape - at least on mine as I notched the side of the IHS









That said, there are other advantages with doing at least a partial glue-down (ie stopping the IHS from moving when locking the CPU lever down)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Use your finger to hold it in place while pressing the latch: the VonDutch method.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it can create a gap though


It was sarcasm. The idea of glueing it down does not appeal to me because if you get everything in and find your temps are not what you anticipated you have to delid all over again. Also as some have mentioned heat trapping is possible underneath the ihs if it is not ventilated through the gap left by not glueing and in turn the loop or heatsink has a bit more heat to dissapate.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it can create a gap though
> 
> 
> 
> It was sarcasm. The idea of glueing it down does not appeal to me because if you get everything in and find your temps are not what you anticipated you have to delid all over again. Also as some have mentioned heat trapping is possible underneath the ihs if it is not ventilated through the gap left by not glueing and in turn the loop or heatsink has a bit more heat to dissapate.
Click to expand...

Exactly, I don't recommend gluing it down unless you are selling the chip and the buyer wants it glued down. There is absolutely no point, not like that piece of glue is going to prevent it from getting killed...


----------



## King4x4

So I settled on 4.9ghz OC (Want 5ghz but that requires a 1.5v jump... no thank you) on my chip... under extreme stress max temp is 65'C... that CLU was worth every penny indeed!

In other news, Just tried a 690 on my 7680x1440... it failed a very miserable failure with Vram hitting the ceiling very fast in BF3..... Took that one out and smacked in two 680 4GB.... smooth sailing!

Now to check if any waterblocks will fit these beauties and to find a third one for tri-sli.

Saw benchies for Titan... not impressed what so ever....


----------



## buildtoexcess

moving on

regarding gluing/bonding the ihs to the pcb - consider the type of adhesive original used by intel - it's semi-rigid with low modulus to permit thermal movement/growth of the ihs - it's not hard setting

i am in agreement w/ idc/at re: excessive gap between face of die & "underside" of ihs being the fundamental cause of ivy bridge "thermal issues" and i have considered re-gluing the ihs using thixotropic semi rigid 2-part pu adhesive --- intel has bonded the ihs to pcb substrate to provide parallel plane surfaces of the thermal solution and the signal/power interface contact array and i believe it important to continue this design practice

i have reservations about the die face directly supporting the retention clamping force (however moderate this actually measures) as directly applied to the ihs and the likelyhood the typical die face surface is not a genuine parallel plane with the pcb substrate contact array

the "goal" being to minimize the internal gap while fully supporting the edge loading imposed by the retention mechanism AND the clamping force of the (4) threaded hold-downs of the water block while preventing any damage to the wafer die


----------



## stickg1

This is how you glue your IHS back down without interfering with anything...

Get some rubber adhesive, or epoxy (I prefer epoxy) and get just a touch of it on the end of a tooth pick. Rub inside the IHS lips on the four corners. Try to put it so it just BARELY comes up over the lips of the IHS. Place it back on the PCB nice and square/ Then let it dry for 20 minutes if epoxy, a couple hours if rubber.



This will keep your IHS in place, be easy to remove later, and not interfere with IHS to Die distance.


----------



## buildtoexcess

there is a precise "bond line" created by the robotic placement fixture to ensure parallel ihs placement AND uniform height of ihs relative to pcb contact array surface --- this is not random or variable

the relatively large gap inside is what "we" want to reduce to a minimum, this is why the ihs is removed and remounted --- using higher coefficient tim simply makes this struggle win/win

look at idc/at again & note the fact that the ihs DOES NOT touch the pcb when intel adhesive is removed, even though the ihs is resting on the wafer die --- only when the edge of the ihs is supported by adhesive will the clamping forces be tranfered to the pcb and not applied directly to the wafer die --- yes the clp/clu couples together the ihs & die face, BUT THE EDGE OF THE IHS PROVIDES MECHANICAL SUPPORT OF THE CLAMPING LOAD then transfered through the motherboard cpu pin array into the mb cpu retention mechanism backplate

so accurate "leveling" of the ihs is important


----------



## buildtoexcess

so, if i want to preserve the original intel ihs "height" while at the same time move the ihs closer toward the die face, it seems that a precision shim in copper alloy "inside the ihs" represents one possible approach - unfortunately the ihs is formed having a measurably convex contact surface

i will increase thickness of top toward inside & cut rectangular "pocket" for die, hopefully increasing delta t

as several of you know the lunar new years / chinese new years annual holiday is still in effect in asia

on the 23rd or 24th (when production workers return in hk) i will show a spare core i7 ihs (separate from cpu assembly) to (2) cnc technicians & discuss cutting several modified billet cu ihs'sthese will have "flat" tops & lower inside surface (if this must go to shenzhen production shop, the workers will only return at month's end)

this is only for my own use


----------



## chronicfx

Guess I will keep my gtx680 sli. Looks like Titan is nice but on tech powerup it didn't win a single multi monitor battle against the 690.


----------



## buildtoexcess

funny you mention this - were you in shamshuipo today? (2) titans in specialist shop this afternoon - the courier talked w/ me - buyer in beijing offering 10,000rmb each to have bragging rights w/ his friends
v. difficult to buy in prc, so special orders hand carried from hk to cn buyers - but no boxes or customs cn side seizes as parallel import - than resells for profit...

must have missed you today


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Guess I will keep my gtx680 sli. Looks like Titan is nice but on tech powerup it didn't win a single multi monitor battle against the 690.


Yep, I was looking at all the Titan numbers. For any normal gaming use two 680 4g is best, next is the 690. The Titan doesn't do anything for gamers unless you use two or three and have a serious surround setup.


----------



## Hokies83

To use 6gb of vram you would need 6 2560x1440 monitors with all the eye candy on...

Then again u would also need 4 titans to push those monitors lol.

Titan is $999 uh? ummm yeah..... more then 2 gtx 680s which slap it around...


----------



## justanoldman

Looks like I will order a 670 FTW, $380 w/rebate, and three NF-A14 FLX for the case. Now I just have to wait for Swiftech to release the H220, then order a back plate and water block for the 670, another radiator, more fans, tubing, fittings, coolant, etc. Then figure out how to make it all work, then be talked into doing this modified gpu bios you guys talk about. Man, by the time I finish this it will be time to upgrade.


----------



## chronicfx

There is a buy it now 680 on ebay for $355 free shipping.. so tempting even though I don't own a 3 way sli board to snag one with these low selling titan hopefuls putting cards up this week. I would have to put it on a shelf and save for a G1 sniper to use it though...


----------



## Zeek

Have 25 bucks to spend on TIM, lol. Plan on getting some CLU so I can delid my next chip. Not sure what TIM to get for the heatsink tho. Maybe some nt-h1 or is there something better?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *buildtoexcess*
> 
> moving on
> 
> regarding gluing/bonding the ihs to the pcb - consider the type of adhesive original used by intel - it's semi-rigid with low modulus to permit thermal movement/growth of the ihs - it's not hard setting
> 
> i am in agreement w/ idc/at re: excessive gap between face of die & "underside" of ihs being the fundamental cause of ivy bridge "thermal issues" and i have considered re-gluing the ihs using thixotropic semi rigid 2-part pu adhesive --- intel has bonded the ihs to pcb substrate to provide parallel plane surfaces of the thermal solution and the signal/power interface contact array and i believe it important to continue this design practice
> 
> i have reservations about the die face directly supporting the retention clamping force (however moderate this actually measures) as directly applied to the ihs and the likelyhood the typical die face surface is not a genuine parallel plane with the pcb substrate contact array
> 
> the "goal" being to minimize the internal gap while fully supporting the edge loading imposed by the retention mechanism AND the clamping force of the (4) threaded hold-downs of the water block while preventing any damage to the wafer die


...not to disturb this harmonious discussion, but when I finally delidded my 3770K less than two weeks ago, I had a big surprise...in fact I initially postponed delidding for a day because of this: The IHS on my CPU was ja bit 'crooked'...on one side, it showed almost no black glue and even a thin razor blade had trouble finding any kind of gap, on the other, I could have used a steak knife without touching the pcb, there was so much space.

When I was finally done, I also notched the IHS just a bit to allow air circulation...and no glue...though that was more a precaution re mounting a full water-block this weekend which may or may not require the removal of the CPU and perhaps IHS if I want to make final adjustments.


----------



## enigma7820

ok here is an update after taking off CLU and applying CLP this time I didn't use the glue to put IHS back on. Now I don't know if by chance I just did a better application but just by removing and not reusing glue and going from CLU to CLP my temps have dropped 5c by doing the way you guys thought was better, I guess I was wrong though it made it easier to install and I didn't have to put CL on while in the socket I figured I would do it everyone elses way. Thank you for the suggestions I like my new temps.

here is before with CLU and glue


here is after with CLP and no glue


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Looks like I will order a 670 FTW, $380 w/rebate, and three NF-A14 FLX for the case. Now I just have to wait for Swiftech to release the H220, then order a back plate and water block for the 670, another radiator, more fans, tubing, fittings, coolant, etc. Then figure out how to make it all work, then be talked into doing this modified gpu bios you guys talk about. Man, by the time I finish this it will be time to upgrade.


...well - you seem to like it though, otherwise you would have never opened the case







That said, it must be annoying not having the Swiftech 220 yet (don't you hate paper launches ?)

...as to Titan, there is no doubt that it is best single-GPU solution out there, at quite reasonable wattage...what's not reasonable though is the price / performance gain ratio.

Regarding 670ies, I was genuinely shocked to see at Tom's Hardware's comparison of Titan w/690, 680 and 7970 GE that my pair of 'optimized 670ies' beats them all, and even pulls ahead re some 680 SLI and 7970- CF results (which of course can also be 'optimized')...









...please, this is NOT one of those 'gee, look at my rig' chest beating items, but instead underscores what 'reasonable optimization' (like deliddding a 3770K) can do...I moved my cards to the max factory voltage after installing and modifying different vid BIOS and applying better TIM, but did not go beyond it...yet in 3D11, I'm scoring over 17,770; 215+ in AvP, over 10800 in 'FireStrike', and over 51500 in 3D Vantage...all with no micro-stutter issues, but with low temps and low noise...kind of makes me wonder why I'm installing a 3rd 'optimized' 670 on the weekend (though that one will eventually go to another machine)

...in the end, I much prefer to make a 'silk purse out of a sow's ear' than go into a store and buy a silk purse - I think in a way we all do


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Have 25 bucks to spend on TIM, lol. Plan on getting some CLU so I can delid my next chip. Not sure what TIM to get for the heatsink tho. Maybe some nt-h1 or is there something better?


Which TIM you use on the die matters more than on top of the IHS. Most tests I have seen have all the top TIMs pretty close when used between the IHS and heatsink. I can say that I got 4 or 5c when I switched from AS5 to Ultra on top of the IHS though.

I really like Ultra, but the two downsides are you don't want to get it on anything so you have to be careful, and it is a pain to clean if need be. I haven't seen anyone try to completely clean their IHS of Ultra with metal cleaner to see if the Intel markings are messed up though. It came off my H100i with a little work and time with the metal cleaner.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Have 25 bucks to spend on TIM, lol. Plan on getting some CLU so I can delid my next chip. Not sure what TIM to get for the heatsink tho. Maybe some nt-h1 or is there something better?


U can use it on both. I have a d14 myself I don't think that paste is anywhere near what the ultra will give u for temps


----------



## martinhal

Just flamed you chronicfx


----------



## Zeek

I'm just too damn lazy and I don't like spreading the TIM on the IHS, lol. I'd obviously spread CLU on the die, but on the IHS I'll just do the rice grain and let the D14 spread it. I'll just probably get another tube of the noctua paste


----------



## Valgaur

As the Captain of this group and as your friend I would like to personally thank all of you who have taken upon yourselves to become a delidded crewman. I truly appreciate all the work and time we have all put into this thread









So upon myself and all of you I Congratulate you all on 200,000 views of this thread and well past the 1200 page mark!

Truly,
Valgaur









Lets keep this bad boy rolling!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> So I settled on 4.9ghz OC (Want 5ghz but that requires a 1.5v jump... no thank you) on my chip... under extreme stress max temp is 65'C... that CLU was worth every penny indeed!
> 
> In other news, Just tried a 690 on my 7680x1440... it failed a very miserable failure with Vram hitting the ceiling very fast in BF3..... Took that one out and smacked in two 680 4GB.... smooth sailing!
> 
> Now to check if any waterblocks will fit these beauties and to find a third one for tri-sli.
> 
> Saw benchies for Titan... not impressed what so ever....


You better check Kingpincooling.com then...1700mhz core on ln2 beats the crap out of everything, including 680 sli.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> As the Captain of this group and as your friend I would like to personally thank all of you who have taken upon yourselves to become a delidded crewman. I truly appreciate all the work and time we have all put into this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So upon myself and all of you I Congratulate you all on 200,000 views of this thread and well past the 1200 page mark!
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lets keep this bad boy rolling!


Man, we need Titans...free of course.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> ok here is an update after taking off CLU and applying CLP this time I didn't use the glue to put IHS back on. Now I don't know if by chance I just did a better application but just by removing and not reusing glue and going from CLU to CLP my temps have dropped 5c by doing the way you guys thought was better, I guess I was wrong though it made it easier to install and I didn't have to put CL on while in the socket I figured I would do it everyone elses way. Thank you for the suggestions I like my new temps.
> 
> here is before with CLU and glue
> 
> 
> here is after with CLP and no glue


Any improvement is a good improvement! I would say if you are overclocking 5C is worth a remount!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Just flamed you chronicfx


Thanks!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> As the Captain of this group and as your friend I would like to personally thank all of you who have taken upon yourselves to become a delidded crewman. I truly appreciate all the work and time we have all put into this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So upon myself and all of you I Congratulate you all on 200,000 views of this thread and well past the 1200 page mark!
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lets keep this bad boy rolling!


+Rep! You deserve it


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> So I settled on 4.9ghz OC (Want 5ghz but that requires a 1.5v jump... no thank you) on my chip... under extreme stress max temp is 65'C... that CLU was worth every penny indeed!
> 
> In other news, Just tried a 690 on my 7680x1440... it failed a very miserable failure with Vram hitting the ceiling very fast in BF3..... Took that one out and smacked in two 680 4GB.... smooth sailing!
> 
> Now to check if any waterblocks will fit these beauties and to find a third one for tri-sli.
> 
> Saw benchies for Titan... not impressed what so ever....


Wish I had a pair of 4gb 680's laying around to just "slap in" lol... I guess video cards grow on trees in your kingdom.


----------



## chronicfx

Can I have your lame vram limited 690?


----------



## I_shot

5ghz 1.375V Super Pi 32M


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> ok here is an update after taking off CLU and applying CLP this time I didn't use the glue to put IHS back on. Now I don't know if by chance I just did a better application but just by removing and not reusing glue and going from CLU to CLP my temps have dropped 5c by doing the way you guys thought was better, I guess I was wrong though it made it easier to install and I didn't have to put CL on while in the socket I figured I would do it everyone elses way. Thank you for the suggestions I like my new temps.
> 
> here is before with CLU and glue
> 
> 
> here is after with CLP and no glue


How come your realtemp clockspeed is so far off in the top picture? It says 4992 Mhz


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm just too damn lazy and I don't like spreading the TIM on the IHS, lol. I'd obviously spread CLU on the die, but on the IHS I'll just do the rice grain and let the D14 spread it. I'll just probably get another tube of the noctua paste


that wont work u need to spread clu/clp


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> How come your realtemp clockspeed is so far off in the top picture? It says 4992 Mhz


good question I have noticed that it does that once in a while for some reason


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> that wont work u need to spread clu/clp


I said I'd spread the CLU on the die, but on the IHS I'd just do the rice method and let the D14 do the work.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I said I'd spread the CLU on the die, but on the IHS I'd just do the rice method and let the D14 do the work.


Ultra/Pro are not designed to be spread by a cooler on the IHS, they are designed to be spread by "painting" them on. But like I said, if you are not crazy about them as cooler TIMs, any high end paste will do almost as well.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> 5ghz 1.375V Super Pi 32M


Yay! You made it








I say it's a keeper for 24/7 use delidded...how are temps so far?
Have you tested the imc? If you can get 2800mhz or more to boot it's definitively a keeper for my standards.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ultra/Pro are not designed to be spread by a cooler on the IHS, they are designed to be spread by "painting" them on. But like I said, if you are not crazy about them as cooler TIMs, any high end paste will do almost as well.


I should clear things up. CLU on die. NT-H1 on IHS


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yay! You made it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I say it's a keeper for 24/7 use delidded...how are temps so far?
> Have you tested the imc? If you can get 2800mhz or more to boot it's definitively a keeper for my standards.


Finally









1.375V not stable but it can run 32M Superpi. Temps don't exceed 80 C under IntelAVX. I have 2x4 gb Corsair xms3 cl9 1.5V so i can't reach 2800mhz =) however they run at 2133 mhz cl10 at 1.53V that's enough for me


----------



## Valgaur

with CLU/P you need to paint the TIM on as when you put another piece of metal that is colder for some reason it will solidify the TIM making a not perfectly flat contact but if you paint it on with an even thickness then you'll have the best contact possible.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I should clear things up. CLU on die. NT-H1 on IHS


I got bad temps like that Zeek. If you look at my initital temp drop of 15 degrees from non-delid that how I did it exactly CLU/NT-H1. Now I am pro/pro and about 30 degrees less than non-delid.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Finally
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.375V not stable but it can run 32M Superpi. Temps don't exceed 80 C under IntelAVX. I have 2x4 gb Corsair xms3 cl9 1.5V so i can't reach 2800mhz =) however they run at 2133 mhz cl10 at 1.53V that's enough for me


Very nice, I'm gonna bin me some 3770k's me thinks...


----------



## Zeek

I'm just waiting till next week so I can go return my current chip and get a better one. Once I get it and make sure it's a decent one I'll delid it








Current chip sucks.


----------



## chronicfx

Just me my two homeboys and OC.net tonight..





These toys are fun, but not as fun as my computer at home!


----------



## dmanstasiu




----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*


Top is a triple quad time of flight mass spectrometer

Bottom is a Oxford INOVA 500Mhz Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Spectrometer

Doing some characterization (figuring out what I actually made) after a reaction I ran overnight last night and purified today..


----------



## dmanstasiu




----------



## Totally Dubbed

Wow now that's something I wish I got into!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Top is a triple quad time of flight mass spectrometer
> 
> Bottom is a Oxford INOVA 500Mhz Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Spectrometer
> 
> ...after a reaction I ran overnight last night and purified today..


...sounds like s still for moonshine







and your're not really delidding and over-clocking that 'Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Spectrometer', I hope...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Top is a triple quad time of flight mass spectrometer
> 
> Bottom is a Oxford INOVA 500Mhz Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Spectrometer
> 
> Doing some characterization (figuring out what I actually made) after a reaction I ran overnight last night and purified today..


i have no idea what all that is even after i looked it up on wiki, lol but it looks crazy.
did u take organic chemistry?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds like s still for moonshine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and your're not really delidding and over-clocking that 'Nuclear Magnetic Resonance Spectrometer', I hope...


It used to be a 300mhz until I filled it with Liquid Helium


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> It used to be a 300mhz until I filled it with Liquid Helium


oh no. lol


----------



## dmanstasiu

Care to explain in technical terms what you're doing ? I have a general knowledge of spectrometers


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i have no idea what all that is even after i looked it up on wiki, lol but it looks crazy.
> did u take organic chemistry?


yes I did. It's fun specially with a lil'chronic... like that one... huh


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> yes I did. It's fun specially with a lil'chronic... like that one... huh


lol. you know what i want


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Care to explain in technical terms what you're doing ? I have a general knowledge of spectrometers


I wish I could but I am at work on a work computer and these IT guys scare me







They are watching...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I wish I could but I am at work on a work computer and these IT guys scare me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are watching...


...and they are not the only ones watching in this networked world...you know the saying "Just because I am paranoid doesn't mean there isn't someone out to get me"







PS I used to work for the federal government up here, re big brothers


----------



## lilchronic

yall trippen!


----------



## Shogon

Maybe getting a 3770k today from Fry's, I'd love to de-lid it but honestly the idea scares me. I'd hate to kill it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> As the Captain of this group and as your friend I would like to personally thank all of you who have taken upon yourselves to become a delidded crewman. I truly appreciate all the work and time we have all put into this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So upon myself and all of you I Congratulate you all on 200,000 views of this thread and well past the 1200 page mark!
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lets keep this bad boy rolling!


...and a 'rep+' and big Thank You for running this kind of 'digital *Roadhouse*' for delidded CPUs like ours; they gotta have a place to mingle


----------



## Totally Dubbed

@Swag:

The baby is sooo cute







!!
(Good that you got the 680)


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> Maybe getting a 3770k today from Fry's, I'd love to de-lid it but honestly the idea scares me. I'd hate to kill it


Easy peasy chicken Parcheesi. Anyone can do it if you take the time to read the guides, watch the videos, and take your time. I would test any chip first though. If it is not a good overclocker it may not be worth delidding, try to find one that is.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> As the Captain of this group and as your friend I would like to personally thank all of you who have taken upon yourselves to become a delidded crewman. I truly appreciate all the work and time we have all put into this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So upon myself and all of you I Congratulate you all on 200,000 views of this thread and well past the 1200 page mark!
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lets keep this bad boy rolling!


...and some new tips for club members as to how to explain delidding, CL-U and such to the GF, I re-post this:

...two delidded chips walk down the street - says the one to the other "ohhh, the good old days - with TIM it was much more warm and cuddly, now I feel my head spinning and CLU plays with syringes and razor blades'


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol









Hey guys...have you seen the AMD Malta 7990 leak? Looks good







(dual Tahiti XT cores) It might be cheaper than buying two of those gpu's and be a dual slot card.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey guys...have you seen the AMD Malta 7990 leak? Looks good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (dual Tahiti XT cores) It might be cheaper than buying two of those gpu's and be a dual slot card.


linky?


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://videocardz.com/39864/amd-working-on-radeon-hd-7790-and-new-hd-7990?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+VideoCardzcom+(VideoCardz.com)

http://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-hd-7990-dual-chip-gpu-codenamed-malta-core-clocked-1-ghz/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Wccftechcom+%28WCCFtech.com%29

And there goes VonDutch again...("gpu talk yet again? schijt I'm outta here...") lol


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Use a Q tip will spread better and more.


hokie get banned over his build log?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://videocardz.com/39864/amd-working-on-radeon-hd-7790-and-new-hd-7990?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+VideoCardzcom+(VideoCardz.com)
> 
> http://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-hd-7990-dual-chip-gpu-codenamed-malta-core-clocked-1-ghz/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Wccftechcom+%28WCCFtech.com%29
> 
> And there goes VonDutch again...("gpu talk yet again? schijt I'm outta here...") lol


LOL









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> hokie get banned over his build log?


if he is banned, not sure if its true, it prolly wont be about a build log...

edit,
just thinking, didnt he try to sell his old case in his sig?
that would be against tos me thinks..but who knows right ..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://videocardz.com/39864/amd-working-on-radeon-hd-7790-and-new-hd-7990?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+VideoCardzcom+(VideoCardz.com)
> 
> http://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-hd-7990-dual-chip-gpu-codenamed-malta-core-clocked-1-ghz/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Wccftechcom+%28WCCFtech.com%29
> 
> And there goes VonDutch again...("gpu talk yet again? schijt I'm outta here...") lol


What you got against gpus? not like they just doubled in price or something...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> hokie get banned over his build log?


He doesn't look banned, he can't be happy about getting hassled for the build log though.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> What you got against gpus? not like they just doubled in price or something...


nothing against it, but 3 days on a row talk about GPU's was a bit to much for me ...lol,
nothing to do with delidding..and thats what this thread is about,
i know we go OT alot tho


----------



## Swag

Swag's "*Venus*" Build

*Cleaned GPU die:*

*Application of CLP:*


*Actual Build:*





*Window Mod:*


----------



## Joa3d43

...some PARTIAL temp results (full summary w/pics next week or so)

JUST CL-U replacing MX-4 (pretty good in its own right) on IHS- CPU cooler block, before de-lidding, 4-core average drop = 3.5 C

JUST CL-U on die WITH de-lidded CPU and vented IHS, MX-4 on IHS- CPU cooler block, 4-core average drop = 17 C


----------



## enigma7820

here is my submission

OCN name:enigma7820
CPU:i7 3770k
on die-TIM:Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM:Liquid Pro
Mhz gained:600mhz
OC after delid:5ghz run at 4.8ghz
Temp drops:32c

validation link for cpuz http://valid.canardpc.com/2703281

temp pic


delid pic


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> here is my submission
> 
> OCN name:enigma7820
> CPU:i7 3770k
> on die-TIM:Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM:Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained:600mhz
> OC after delid:5ghz run at 4.8ghz
> Temp drops:32c
> 
> validation link for cpuz http://valid.canardpc.com/2703281
> 
> temp pic
> 
> 
> delid pic


Your in!







Now slap that sig on and be proud of it! Congrats on the great temp drop!


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Easy peasy chicken Parcheesi. Anyone can do it if you take the time to read the guides, watch the videos, and take your time. I would test any chip first though. If it is not a good overclocker it may not be worth delidding, try to find one that is.


I'll read up on it more, but I'm sure I'll de-lid the chip if it is bad on temps/clocks. I'm hoping it can do 4.6 or 4.7 with good voltages.

*Prime testing 4.6 offset llc 2 with 2200 on the samsung memory, if this prime doesn't fail after 4-6 hours highest voltage in cpu-z is 1.280. Definitely need to de-lid, some cores hitting close to 70C lol. At stock it was around 50C.


----------



## CurrentlyPissed

I have a 3770k. Delided it and lapped to 3000 grit. Ill get pics up later from it. Does 5.1 at 1.415v. 5.2 is a brick wall though. Have to move all the way up to 1.48v. Wasnt worth it for the heat and degradation. Currently run it at 5.0 at 1.405. I have speedstep on too. Idles around 24c-30c. Ive idled as low as 19c on one core.

Load in gsme is around 50-55c. Prime gets to around 68c.

Rx360 + Apogee Drive 2 with mcp35x.

Getting ready to add 2 680s to that loop though. Hoping delta stays around 10 full load. May add a rx240. Will update temp changes.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note II


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good luck, maybe you reach 5ghz with 1.2v and won't need to delid.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CurrentlyPissed*
> 
> I have a 3770k. Delided it and lapped to 3000 grit. Ill get pics up later from it. Does 5.1 at 1.415v. 5.2 is a brick wall though. Have to move all the way up to 1.48v. Wasnt worth it for the heat and degradation. Currently run it at 5.0 at 1.405. I have speedstep on too. Idles around 24c-30c. Ive idled as low as 19c on one core.
> 
> Load in gsme is around 50-55c. Prime gets to around 68c.
> 
> Rx360 + Apogee Drive 2 with mcp35x.
> 
> Getting ready to add 2 680s to that loop though. Hoping delta stays around 10 full load. May add a rx240. Will update temp changes.
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note II


Great results and chip!







The perfect example of a great chip to delid...If it did 5ghz lower than that it would be a crime not to freeze it though.
I think you may need to get an extra 240 or 360 rad after adding two gpus.


----------



## CurrentlyPissed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *CurrentlyPissed*
> 
> I have a 3770k. Delided it and lapped to 3000 grit. Ill get pics up later from it. Does 5.1 at 1.415v. 5.2 is a brick wall though. Have to move all the way up to 1.48v. Wasnt worth it for the heat and degradation. Currently run it at 5.0 at 1.405. I have speedstep on too. Idles around 24c-30c. Ive idled as low as 19c on one core.
> 
> Load in gsme is around 50-55c. Prime gets to around 68c.
> 
> Rx360 + Apogee Drive 2 with mcp35x.
> 
> Getting ready to add 2 680s to that loop though. Hoping delta stays around 10 full load. May add a rx240. Will update temp changes.
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note II
> 
> 
> 
> Great results and chip!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The perfect example of a great chip to delid...If it did 5ghz lower than that it would be a crime not to freeze it though.
> I think you may need to get an extra 240 or 360 rad after adding two gpus.
Click to expand...

Thanks i had it on an h100 and did 4.8 at 1.375. But before delid and on an h100 the temps were insane. Thats what pushed me to purchase my first custom loop. Figured chip deserved better lol.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note II


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now slap that sig on and be proud of it! Congrats on the great temp drop!


thank you sir


----------



## megawatz

AFAIK, My before pictures showed the temps at 104c when running IBT. When I put CLU on it, I'm getting max of 72 (no screenshot yet). So thats a 32c drop in temp. I'll get a screenie up later.


----------



## sena

Cleaned cooler from dust and returned 120mm fan on it, and another 8-10C temp drop.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sena*
> 
> Cleaned cooler from dust and returned 120mm fan on it, and another 8-10C temp drop.


LOL.. Sounds like it was more than dusty.. It was a NH-Dirty14


----------



## sena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> LOL.. Sounds like it was more than dusty.. It was a NH-Dirty14


Yup, last time i cleaned was sometime in october(2012), i am too lazy.


----------



## valkeriefire

I am seriously about to pull the trigger on delidding my 3770k today. I have a few questions first.

1) Do you put the IHS back on after delidding with new TIM underneath? OR do you leave the IHS off and put your TIM straight on the die? It seems people are doing both. Is one better than the other.

2) I don't have any CLU. Will Noctua NT or Innovative Cooling Diamond work just as well?

3) What is the failure/kill rate on this? I've read a few, but seems to be very low <5%.

I should note my CPU is stable 4.6ghz @1.3v with temps the mid 80s using a NH-D14.
4.4ghz works @1.21v. I haven't played with 4.5 much.


----------



## enigma7820

ok so the recommended TIM is cool lab liquid pro or ultra. Ultra is easier to clean and apply it spreads much better and has been said to perform better as well. When you apply it you put it on the die and on the underside of the IHS where the die would be, when you delid and clean the underside of the IHS you will see that markings for the old intel TIM after cleaning apply your new TIM there as well, but that's if your using LP. I would wait and get Liquid Ultra. Make sure you use a static guard, take your time, start at the corners, take small breaks so you don't rush.


----------



## enigma7820

I have a dog and cat I have to clean my case like once a week. But I bought the data vac electronice duster from compusa for 39.99 plugs in and never runs out lol well worth it since a can of compressed air costs $8 a piece.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> I am seriously about to pull the trigger on delidding my 3770k today. I have a few questions first.
> 
> 1) Do you put the IHS back on after delidding with new TIM underneath? OR do you leave the IHS off and put your TIM straight on the die? It seems people are doing both. Is one better than the other.
> 
> 2) I don't have any CLU. Will Noctua NT or Innovative Cooling Diamond work just as well?
> 
> 3) What is the failure/kill rate on this? I've read a few, but seems to be very low <5%.
> 
> I should note my CPU is stable 4.6ghz @1.3v with temps the mid 80s using a NH-D14.
> 4.4ghz works @1.21v. I haven't played with 4.5 much.


1) You can do both. Not putting back on the IHS (called "bare die") yields arguably zero difference, and you run the risk of crushing your die. Not suggested. make sure you use CLP (Coollaboratory pro) on the die.

2) It will work, but not as well. Between TIMs like those, and CLP, many people find a 5-10C difference (on the die).

3) The failure rate depends purely on the skill level. There is no "gamble", no "accidents". Broken chips were caused by users. I'm not saying they're purposefully at fault, but most commonly their blade slipped and nicked the die.

If you're happy with your overclocks, it's not worth delidding unless you just do it for fun (which isn't a bad thing). Delidding just enables a better heat transfer between die to block, which gives you more headroom for overclocking.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I have a dog and cat I have to clean my case like once a week. But I bought the data vac electronice duster from compusa for 39.99 plugs in and never runs out lol well worth it since a can of compressed air costs $8 a piece.


Does it have as much pressure as compressed air ?


----------



## enigma7820

yes it does its meant for all electronice and it comes with like 10 attachments to use long, wide short whatever

looks like I bought it on sale cause its $59.99 now here's the link
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4475086&CatId=7094


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> yes it does its meant for all electronice and it comes with like 10 attachments to use long, wide short whatever
> 
> looks like I bought it on sale cause its $59.99 now here's the link
> http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4475086&CatId=7094


...nice, just what I need (or a new cleaning lady - and this is cheaper







)


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> yes it does its meant for all electronice and it comes with like 10 attachments to use long, wide short whatever
> 
> looks like I bought it on sale cause its $59.99 now here's the link
> http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4475086&CatId=7094


Yeah those data vacs are pretty awesome. We use them at work to dust the equipment. I definitely recommend if you want to keep a clean case and not buy air all the time.


----------



## Valgaur

Dont use diamond stuff on the die, as you can scratch the die and possible damage may occur for the IHS yes use diamond but use the other TIM you have for the die. NOT the diamond stuff.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> AFAIK, My before pictures showed the temps at 104c when running IBT. When I put CLU on it, I'm getting max of 72 (no screenshot yet). So thats a 32c drop in temp. I'll get a screenie up later.


----------



## lilchronic

The only TIM you should put on the die is coolabs pro/ultra thats it! nothing else

ask megawatz


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yeah those data vacs are pretty awesome. We use them at work to dust the equipment. I definitely recommend if you want to keep a clean case and not buy air all the time.


I use my 220cfm 5300rpm fans as dusters...crank them to 11 and point the exhaust towards an open window. You dust the whole room lol (not joking)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I use my 220cfm 5300rpm fans as dusters...crank them to 11 and point the exhaust towards an open window. You dust the whole room lol (not joking)


i got a air purifier next to my computer and it helps with the dust a lot


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i got a air purifier next to my computer and it helps with the dust a lot


and thats why i didnt go to classes today lol


----------



## dmanstasiu

And that's why for lunch I bought 4 meals (Burgers + Fries + coleslaw)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> And that's why for lunch I bought 4 meals (Burgers + Fries + coleslaw)


send me some lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

I drank a lot of hot chocolate...and added heavy cream to it








I'm gonna oc a pc now, a coworker brought it here, bad idea with me around...


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Dont use diamond stuff on the die, as you can scratch the die and possible damage may occur for the IHS yes use diamond but use the other TIM you have for the die. NOT the diamond stuff.


Copy that. Good advice. I just watched a YouTube video that said the same thing. I am starting now. I ran some tests at stock, [email protected] and [email protected] so I have a baseline to see what happens. Hopefully I will be posting success in a few hours. I'll use my NOctua paste on the die and Diamond between the IHS and Heatsink.

Wish me luck. See you in a few hours.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Dont use diamond stuff on the die, as you can scratch the die and possible damage may occur for the IHS yes use diamond but use the other TIM you have for the die. NOT the diamond stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Copy that. Good advice. I just watched a YouTube video that said the same thing. I am starting now. I ran some tests at stock, [email protected] and [email protected] so I have a baseline to see what happens. Hopefully I will be posting success in a few hours. I'll use my NOctua paste on the die and Diamond between the IHS and Heatsink.
> 
> Wish me luck. See you in a few hours.
Click to expand...

You won't get the full de-lidding benefits unless using CLP


----------



## valkeriefire

I know but I don't have any. If I don't kill my chip I'll order some and repaste later. Today the goal is to get the IHS off without doing damage. Correct me if I am wrong, but reapplying paste is easy after that right?

(Thank God I have an iPad to use while my pc is down







)

[email protected] pacific. That was quick. IHS is off. No obvious damage so far. I drew pens marks in the IHS so I'd know exactly how far I could go with the razer.

1431: dang cleaning the IHS took forever. Now onto the die. Coffee.

1523: after doing a bit of real work, I finally got the die cleaned. Alcohol wipes, finger nails, and persistence.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> I know but I don't have any. If I don't kill my chip I'll order some and repaste later. Today the goal is to get the IHS off without doing damage. Correct me if I am wrong, but reapplying paste is easy after that right?
> 
> (Thank God I have an iPad to use while my pc is down
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> [email protected] pacific. That was quick. IHS is off. No obvious damage so far. I drew pens marks in the IHS so I'd know exactly how far I could go with the razer.


...finger's crossed, though the worst may be over - now take your time to apply the TIM correctly, and remount carefully -


----------



## Zeek

Just ordered some CLU. Now I have to drive down to MC when I have time and get a new chip


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Copy that. Good advice. I just watched a YouTube video that said the same thing. I am starting now. I ran some tests at stock, [email protected] and [email protected] so I have a baseline to see what happens. Hopefully I will be posting success in a few hours. I'll use my NOctua paste on the die and Diamond between the IHS and Heatsink.
> 
> Wish me luck. See you in a few hours.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> I know but I don't have any. If I don't kill my chip I'll order some and repaste later. Today the goal is to get the IHS off without doing damage. Correct me if I am wrong, but reapplying paste is easy after that right?
> 
> (Thank God I have an iPad to use while my pc is down
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


yes reapplying paste is very easy.

Also! Good luck!


----------



## CurrentlyPissed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Just ordered some CLU. Now I have to drive down to MC when I have time and get a new chip


Should order pro. Ultra isnt as good when deliding.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note II


----------



## valkeriefire

Delidding and repaste completed with Success!
























Testing at stock clocks now. Will update and post pics soon.

UPDATE: Awesome, even at stock clocks I have a 6-8C drop!

My original stock IBT was 6 passes maxing at 68C. Now 6 passes yields me 60/61C. I'll start uploading photos and try 4.6ghz.


----------



## I_shot

Hey Valgaur, Would you please update my max OC on database =)

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2703467


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Successful delid.
How do I get the glue of f?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Delidding and repaste completed with Success!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Testing at stock clocks now. Will update and post pics soon.
> 
> UPDATE: Awesome, even at stock clocks I have a 6-8C drop!
> 
> My original stock IBT was 6 passes maxing at 68C. Now 6 passes yields me 60/61C. I'll start uploading photos and try 4.6ghz.


Nice can't wait!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, Would you please update my max OC on database =)
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2703467


Your Updated!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Successful delid.
> How do I get the glue of f?


finger nails or leave a little on it, I left the remaining amount after my nails to help the IHS pressure.


----------



## valkeriefire

Photos of CPU delidding.

The pen marks on the IHS really helped me make sure I didn't cut in too far. Also I found there was no need to use a hammer like some on other forums have posted. Also I didn't need to bend or pry, just constant steady pressure eventually got me in (we are talking about delidding here people!).

Now starting 4.6ghz!


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Photos of CPU delidding. Now starting 4.6ghz!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


very well done!







waiting for the temps now!


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Sorry for the crappy cell phone pic. I'm ordering some CLPro now. Used some crappy generic stuff for the time being and temps went up lol.
Used the credit card method, got one corner with a blade and then cut around with a credit card.


Edit: Never-mind, Cooler was not properly attached, temps did go down slightly even with crappy TIM.


----------



## chann3l

Before

After a few tasteful modifications










The front combined with my side window mod and top rad mesh cutout you can't even tell this is a 500r lol


----------



## valkeriefire

Ok, 4.6ghz testing complete! 14C Drop! I am very pleased with these results. My idle temp even gets down to 20C on one core.

My original IBT run @4.6ghz, 1.3v, NH-D14 maxed out at 97C. I stopped the test after 6 passes because I didn't like the temps.
Here is a sceen shot of the 97C.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







After Delidding, applying Noctua NT-H1 to the die, and Innovating Cooling Diamond to the IHS, I got a max temp of 83C and that temp held for all 10 passes.
Screen shot of 83C.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







OCN name: ValkerieFire
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
ihs-TIM: Innovative Cooling Diamond
Mhz gained: +200 (to 4.8ghz)
OC after delid: *4.6ghz*
Temp drops: *14C*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: 4.8ghz http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2704431

I've never tested this CPU past 4.6ghz, but I'll give it a shot now since the temps are reasonable. I bet I could maybe hit 5.0 and stay under 95C.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, 4.6ghz testing complete! 14C Drop! I am very pleased with these results. My idle temp even gets down to 20C on one core.
> 
> My original IBT run @4.6ghz, 1.3v, NH-D14 maxed out at 97C. I stopped the test after 6 passes because I didn't like the temps.
> Here is a sceen shot of the 97C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After Delidding, applying Noctua NT-H1 to the die, and Innovating Cooling Diamond to the IHS, I got a max temp of 83C and that temp held for all 10 passes.
> Screen shot of 83C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: ValkerieFire
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> ihs-TIM: Innovative Cooling Diamond
> Mhz gained: Not Tested Yet
> OC after delid: *4.6ghz*
> Temp drops: *14C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Max not tested yet.
> 
> I've never tested this CPU past 4.6ghz, but I'll give it a shot now since the temps are reasonable. I bet I could maybe hit 5.0 and stay under 95C.


Your IN!







Now slap that sig on and be proud of it!







Give me the CPUZ when you can man!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Photos of CPU delidding.
> 
> The pen marks on the IHS really helped me make sure I didn't cut in too far. Also I found there was no need to use a hammer like some on other forums have posted. Also I didn't need to bend or pry, just constant steady pressure eventually got me in (we are talking about delidding here people!).
> 
> Now starting 4.6ghz!


Mind I use that photo right there for my guide? Some people might find some use in it.


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Mind I use that photo right there for my guide? Some people might find some use in it.


Go for it Swag, it is the least I can do, your guide made this is all possible for me. Thanks a bunch and +Rep to you and Valgaur.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your IN!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now slap that sig on and be proud of it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Give me the CPUZ when you can man!


Thanks Valgaur, Here is the CPU-Z for 4.8ghz, http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2704431

I had to up the volts to 1.37 and set LLC to Extreme. But it passed 10 easily on Standard (I've been using High for previous tests, maybe that just makes it take longer). Any volts less than 1.37 and IBT crashed or I got a BSOD. Max temp was 87C, so I got +200mhz and -10C there. I was hoping for 1.33v but this is still decent.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Going for 5.0ghz now.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Mind I use that photo right there for my guide? Some people might find some use in it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go for it Swag, it is the least I can do, your guide made this is all possible for me. Thanks a bunch and +Rep to you and Valgaur.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot! I'll be adding it to the guide later.







+rep for a successful delid and the picture.


----------



## valkeriefire

It doesn't look like 5.0 is in the cards for me tonight. I've progressively worked up to 1.48v (which is way past the 1.4v ideal for 5ghz), and if I don't bsod then IBT crashes.

Still I am very happy with the results. I'll update my post above and call it a day.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Go for it Swag, it is the least I can do, your guide made this is all possible for me. Thanks a bunch and +Rep to you and Valgaur.
> Thanks Valgaur, Here is the CPU-Z for 4.8ghz, http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2704431
> 
> I had to up the volts to 1.37 and set LLC to Extreme. But it passed 10 easily on Standard (I've been using High for previous tests, maybe that just makes it take longer). Any volts less than 1.37 and IBT crashed or I got a BSOD. Max temp was 87C, so I got +200mhz and -10C there. I was hoping for 1.33v but this is still decent.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going for 5.0ghz now.


Updated!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Ok, 4.6ghz testing complete! 14C Drop! I am very pleased with these results. My idle temp even gets down to 20C on one core.
> 
> My original IBT run @4.6ghz, 1.3v, NH-D14 maxed out at 97C. I stopped the test after 6 passes because I didn't like the temps.
> Here is a sceen shot of the 97C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After Delidding, applying Noctua NT-H1 to the die, and Innovating Cooling Diamond to the IHS, I got a max temp of 83C and that temp held for all 10 passes.
> Screen shot of 83C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: ValkerieFire
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> ihs-TIM: Innovative Cooling Diamond
> Mhz gained: Not Tested Yet
> OC after delid: *4.6ghz*
> Temp drops: *14C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Max not tested yet.
> 
> I've never tested this CPU past 4.6ghz, but I'll give it a shot now since the temps are reasonable. I bet I could maybe hit 5.0 and stay under 95C.


1.3v is pretty high for 4.6 GHz and 83 on air isn't bad for that voltage but to bump it to 5 GHz it seems to me your going to need a lot of voltage of you need 1.3 for 4.6 and I wouldn't let your temps get anywhere near 95. 85 is pushing it at least for my comfort level.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Valkeriw, that's a genius idea with the markings!
Did you reglue the ihs to the pcb after?


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> 1.3v is pretty high for 4.6 GHz and 83 on air isn't bad for that voltage but to bump it to 5 GHz it seems to me your going to need a lot of voltage of you need 1.3 for 4.6 and I wouldn't let your temps get anywhere near 95. 85 is pushing it at least for my comfort level.


You are right, it is actually stable at lower voltages, but I haven't figured out exactly where that stability ends, and since I wanted consistent results, I went with a voltage I knew was 100% stable for my CPU. I just reran the test @ 4.6ghz, 1.275v and passed with max temp of 77C, a 6C drop under 1.3v. I think my chip is decent, but it isn't a superstar by any means.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Valkeriw, that's a genius idea with the markings!
> Did you reglue the ihs to the pcb after?


Thank you. I didn't reglue the IHS, it is just free floating and then locked down by the CPU clamp. For the markings I used a fine tip permanent marker. The ink wipes off the metal when you rub it vigorously with an alcohol wipe. A dry erase marker would probably work just as well and have no risk of permanence, but I didn't think of that until just now.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> You are right, it is actually stable at lower voltages, but I haven't figured out exactly where that stability ends, and since I wanted consistent results, I went with a voltage I knew was 100% stable for my CPU. I just reran the test @ 4.6ghz, 1.275v and passed with max temp of 77C, a 6C drop under 1.3v. I think my chip is decent, but it isn't a superstar by any means.
> Thank you. I didn't reglue the IHS, it is just free floating and then locked down by the CPU clamp. For the markings I used a fine tip permanent marker. The ink wipes off the metal when you rub it vigorously with an alcohol wipe. A dry erase marker would probably work just as well and have no risk of permanence, but I didn't think of that until just now.


nice one








!
Yeah when i read your post I had the impression that you re-glues it for some reason lol


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> You are right, it is actually stable at lower voltages, but I haven't figured out exactly where that stability ends, and since I wanted consistent results, I went with a voltage I knew was 100% stable for my CPU. I just reran the test @ 4.6ghz, 1.275v and passed with max temp of 77C, a 6C drop under 1.3v. I think my chip is decent, but it isn't a superstar by any means.
> Thank you. I didn't reglue the IHS, it is just free floating and then locked down by the CPU clamp. For the markings I used a fine tip permanent marker. The ink wipes off the metal when you rub it vigorously with an alcohol wipe. A dry erase marker would probably work just as well and have no risk of permanence, but I didn't think of that until just now.


I would try and get the voltage as low as you can for stability at 4.6 and then work your way up from there so that you don't overshoot when going for a higher oc. I know all chips are different but im completely stable at 1.26 for 4.6 1.28 4.7 1.35 4.8 1.445 4.9 1.52 5 just to give you an idea of where to start.


----------



## valkeriefire

Thanks Chann3l. I am actually testing 1.26v @4.6ghz now. I am about 5 passes through 10 on IBT. Max temp is 75C. My case is small (with minimal airflow), a Lian Li Pc-A05FN, so really I want low temps more than raw power. Still it is good to know where my limits are. Thanks for posting your voltages. If I pass this I think our chips may be similar. I needed 1.37 for 4.8, and you needed a slightly better 1.35.

Update: It passed @ 1.26v. Max temp was 1C lower @ 75C vs 76C for 1.275v.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Thanks Chann3l. I am actually testing 1.26v @4.6ghz now. I am about 5 passes through 10 on IBT. Max temp is 75C. My case is small (with minimal airflow), a Lian Li Pc-A05FN, so really I want low temps more than raw power. Still it is good to know where my limits are. Thanks for posting your voltages. If I pass this I think our chips may be similar. I needed 1.37 for 4.8, and you needed a slightly better 1.35.
> 
> Update: It passed @ 1.26v. Max temp was 1C lower @ 75C vs 76C for 1.275v.


Sounds like they are for sure and that's awesome. Low temps are better than pushing the oc I only run at 4.9 cause I do a lot of benchmarks no noticeable difference between that and 4.6 in real world applications. those are good temps for air too cause on custom water I hit in the 50s on ibt and before delidding and lapping i hit 80 so your quite a bit below my predelid temps on water.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Thanks Chann3l. I am actually testing 1.26v @4.6ghz now. I am about 5 passes through 10 on IBT. Max temp is 75C. My case is small (with minimal airflow), a Lian Li Pc-A05FN, so really I want low temps more than raw power. Still it is good to know where my limits are. Thanks for posting your voltages. If I pass this I think our chips may be similar. I needed 1.37 for 4.8, and you needed a slightly better 1.35.
> 
> Update: It passed @ 1.26v. Max temp was 1C lower @ 75C vs 76C for 1.275v.


You already have some pretty solid results - I ran 4.8 for a long time before delidding because of temperature limitations. Per earlier post w/pics of stress test (Aida64 Extreme Edition / System Stability Test 100% load), I had 4.8 = 1.312v, 4.9 = 1.328v, 5.0 = 1.376v, 5.1 = 1.416v, 5.2 = 1.496. That 3770K is known to be fairly low v, but you seem to be pretty close to a 'sweet-spot' with a very good chip.

Here is a comparison of 3770K from 3.9 GHz to 5.3 GHz (as well as other CPU types) re CPU Queen and also memory read benchmarks...if you compare your current '4.8' you'll see that you are already way up there and if you hit a 'v' wall, ask yourself whether the extra performance is worth the extra 'v's / heat / durability:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/thinking-of-overclocking-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-stock-turbo-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz

...not sure what kind of board you are running, but on mine (Asus ROG Max V Ex), I leave LLC on 'ultra' but bumped CPU and DRAM Voltage Frequency from 350 to 450 (out of 500) and CPU Power Phase control to manual / ultra fast and that allows for a slight (may be two to four step) lowering of vCore with the same degree of stability under stress test. I had the same results on another board (Sabertooth z77) after making the same changes....may be it can work for you


----------



## tt-Prodigy15

Just wondering is it really worth it removing the IHS and replacing the thermal paste under it, on a 3770k?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tt-Prodigy15*
> 
> Just wondering is it really worth it removing the IHS and replacing the thermal paste under it, on a 3770k?


YES YES YES . You will get a 20- 30 deg temp drop if you use CLP/CLU as the TIM.


----------



## stickg1

Oh Von Dutch?? Where are you???


----------



## Derko1

Hello!

I just recently bought a 3770k to replace my 2600k and was wondering if you guys would advice to delid before even using the chip? I'm guessing it might be a bad idea in case the chip is no good... but I have a WC set up it will be under and was wondering if even WC people were seeing benefits of this.

Reading through the thread slowly... so I thought I might get a quicker response by asking.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Hello!
> 
> I just recently bought a 3770k to replace my 2600k and was wondering if you guys would advice to delid before even using the chip? I'm guessing it might be a bad idea in case the chip is no good... but I have a WC set up it will be under and was wondering if even WC people were seeing benefits of this.
> 
> Reading through the thread slowly... so I thought I might get a quicker response by asking.


It would be good to at least these what your max OC without delidding is first. Some chips are even worth delidding. I had a chip that needed 1.4v for 4.5GHz, that's just a waste of time.

So my advice would be to test it first and if you can get 4.5GHz with 1.15-1.25v then that thing will be a monster when delidded.


----------



## tt-Prodigy15

Hmm its really tempting considering the temps on my Malay 3770k.. i might wait to see if it fails in the next few weeks, if it dose not fail il go ahead with the cpu sugery...


----------



## Derko1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It would be good to at least these what your max OC without delidding is first. Some chips are even worth delidding. I had a chip that needed 1.4v for 4.5GHz, that's just a waste of time.
> 
> So my advice would be to test it first and if you can get 4.5GHz with 1.15-1.25v then that thing will be a monster when delidded.


Ok. I guess it wouldn't take more than leaving some slag on the tubing, on the CPU block to be able to take it off. That way I won't have to drain the whole thing.

Man!... you IB people use super low voltages... I'm running at 1.43v for 4.8 right now







.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Hello!
> 
> I just recently bought a 3770k to replace my 2600k and was wondering if you guys would advice to delid before even using the chip? I'm guessing it might be a bad idea in case the chip is no good... but I have a WC set up it will be under and was wondering if even WC people were seeing benefits of this.
> 
> Reading through the thread slowly... so I thought I might get a quicker response by asking.


I too went from 2600K to 3770 with WC. First see how the chip does vcore wise and then delid if it is ok vcore wise. Be warded temps are bad without delid. I got a huge temp drop from delid.

What are your 2600k temps ?

Here are some reference temps of my IBT runs.


----------



## Shogon

Well I have my 6 hours of prime to reference before I de-lid, Ivy is hotter then Sandy thats for sure, my 2700k at 4.6 with 1.36V was ~8C cooler then this 3570k at 4.6 with 1.28V. I am very happy though, I can boot just fine with 2200 MHz on the samsung memory


----------



## Joa3d43

...feel like I'm walking through molasses as I'm using my laptop instead of the delidded monster...the latter is getting a new home, now doing the wiring and cable management (if you can call it that







), the transfer all the HDs and SSDs, then finish the custom water loop and let it run for 12 hrs on a separate power source re any potential leaks...will use Coollaboratory Ultra for the IHS to Koolance block


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...feel like I'm walking through molasses as I'm using my laptop instead of the delidded monster...the latter is getting a new home, now doing the wiring and cable management (if you can call it that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), the transfer all the HDs and SSDs, then finish the custom water loop and let it run for 12 hrs on a separate power source re any potential leaks...will use Coollaboratory Ultra for the IHS to Koolance block


Just unplug everything but the pump from your psu and use a paper clip to bridge it ots much faster that way stick one end in the green wires pin and the other in the black wire pin on whichever side of it on 24 pin


----------



## Youmu

I tried to join the club, but ruined my 3570K instead. I'll post pictures later, just a tiny scratch on the bottom right side, but thats all it took (and I'm sure the CPU is dead, I reseated multiple times, checked pins on mobo etc... I booted the mobo no problem with a 2500K in it). I was being so careful with the thing, but my goddamned cat jumped from the window onto me while I was holding the razor. The worst part is the scratch isnt under the IHS, so Im doubtful I can fool RMA with it on the basis of physical damage, even after reseating the IHS with silicone.

Anyone have tips for hiding a scratched PCB? Or am I completely boned? I feel like crying right now... and my cat is going to get tired of sleeping outside pretty quickly, I think.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> I tried to join the club, but ruined my 3570K instead. I'll post pictures later, just a tiny scratch on the bottom right side, but thats all it took (and I'm sure the CPU is dead, I reseated multiple times, checked pins on mobo etc... I booted the mobo no problem with a 2500K in it). I was being so careful with the thing, but my goddamned cat jumped from the window onto me while I was holding the razor. The worst part is the scratch isnt under the IHS, so Im doubtful I can fool RMA with it on the basis of physical damage, even after reseating the IHS with silicone.
> 
> Anyone have tips for hiding a scratched PCB? Or am I completely boned? I feel like crying right now... and my cat is going to get tired of sleeping outside pretty quickly, I think.


Is the cat cute? Could you sell it for a new chip?


----------



## valkeriefire

@ Youmu,

Sorry about your misfortune.









If you bought the CPU recently, your credit card may offer accident replacement. I know my Amex does for 90 days. That was one reason I delidded yesterday, my 90 days was almost up, and knew it provided some protection. Check with your credit company for details.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Just unplug everything but the pump from your psu and use a paper clip to bridge it ots much faster that way stick one end in the green wires pin and the other in the black wire pin on whichever side of it on 24 pin


Tx







- I know that one and normally would use it....but I have a separate system with a powered molex available near it...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> I tried to join the club, but ruined my 3570K instead. I'll post pictures later, just a tiny scratch on the bottom right side, but thats all it took (and I'm sure the CPU is dead, I reseated multiple times, checked pins on mobo etc... I booted the mobo no problem with a 2500K in it). I was being so careful with the thing, but my goddamned cat jumped from the window onto me while I was holding the razor. The worst part is the scratch isnt under the IHS, so Im doubtful I can fool RMA with it on the basis of physical damage, even after reseating the IHS with silicone.
> 
> Anyone have tips for hiding a scratched PCB? Or am I completely boned? I feel like crying right now... and my cat is going to get tired of sleeping outside pretty quickly, I think.


...if you have non-conductive TIM (like MX-4) or even nail polish, try to cover the scratch with that material...has been done before and chips brought back to life...the scratch is likely under the IHS boundary or near it which can create electr. interference....depends if the scratch actually severed connections...so again, just squeeze some MX-4 on all the areas that have scratches...nothing left to loose

Good luck !


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> I tried to join the club, but ruined my 3570K instead. I'll post pictures later, just a tiny scratch on the bottom right side, but thats all it took (and I'm sure the CPU is dead, I reseated multiple times, checked pins on mobo etc... I booted the mobo no problem with a 2500K in it). I was being so careful with the thing, but my goddamned cat jumped from the window onto me while I was holding the razor. The worst part is the scratch isnt under the IHS, so Im doubtful I can fool RMA with it on the basis of physical damage, even after reseating the IHS with silicone.
> 
> Anyone have tips for hiding a scratched PCB? Or am I completely boned? I feel like crying right now... and my cat is going to get tired of sleeping outside pretty quickly, I think.


There's hope yet. PM Valguar or Swag they can walk you through some steps to revive your CPU.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...feel like I'm walking through molasses as I'm using my laptop instead of the delidded monster...the latter is getting a new home, now doing the wiring and cable management (if you can call it that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), the transfer all the HDs and SSDs, then finish the custom water loop and let it run for 12 hrs on a separate power source re any potential leaks...will use Coollaboratory Ultra for the IHS to Koolance block


3x670


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Tx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I know that one and normally would use it....but I have a separate system with a powered molex available near it...


Oh ok ya if you already have a supply the that's better when I did my loop I just didn't want to have to buy one lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 3x670


...noting your 670 owner's club sig,









I spent last week modding each one - first got he second-version-Factory 670 CUii TOP BIOS, then modded that one with 'KGB' per OCN thread on modding 600 series BIOS...power target for each is now 150%, and each will go right to 1.215v under load...may hard-mod voltage later (as the ROG Max V Ex has some goodies for that) along with a second loop for GPUs, but now, I'm just trying to get the first loop (CPU) finished


----------



## Youmu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> There's hope yet. PM Valguar or Swag they can walk you through some steps to revive your CPU.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...if you have non-conductive TIM (like MX-4) or even nail polish, try to cover the scratch with that material...has been done before and chips brought back to life...the scratch is likely under the IHS boundary or near it which can create electr. interference....depends if the scratch actually severed connections...so again, just squeeze some MX-4 on all the areas that have scratches...nothing left to loose
> 
> Good luck !


I'll try, but I have doubts that it will work.


----------



## chann3l

Wow I just had an interesting issue I updated from win7 pro to win 8 pro cause my buddy who's in compsci gave it to me for free and its actually not bad if you set it to boot right to desktop. I just ran ibt in it just for kicks and my temps were the same as expected but after the stability test was done my CPU stayed at 100% usage and ibt was closed wasn't even running as a process had to restart my PC haven't tested it again. Anyone else have ibt troubles with win 8 ?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Wow I just had an interesting issue I updated from win7 pro to win 8 pro cause my buddy who's in compsci gave it to me for free and its actually not bad if you set it to boot right to desktop. I just ran ibt in it just for kicks and my temps were the same as expected but after the stability test was done my CPU stayed at 100% usage and ibt was closed wasn't even running as a process had to restart my PC haven't tested it again. Anyone else have ibt troubles with win 8 ?


Yea, it overall sucks. I can't stand it especially on multi-monitors... I have to use a shell to bring back the start button too!


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, it overall sucks. I can't stand it especially on multi-monitors... I have to use a shell to bring back the start button too!


I dont mind it and the start button doesn't bug me I can access everything through settings just as easily I just wanted it to boost my 3dnark 11 score even further when I get my gpu under water gotta keep my hwbot rank going Strong







now the damn thing is sitting "installing updates" after restart of course it'll sit there forever lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> There's hope yet. PM Valguar or Swag they can walk you through some steps to revive your CPU.


That street cred!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> I'll try, but I have doubts that it will work.


ask totally dubbed and he'll tell you how we got his chip back and up running


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> There's hope yet. PM Valguar or Swag they can walk you through some steps to revive your CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> That street cred!
Click to expand...

Lol! You must be happy Val! You shouldn't be proud of that, you should be proud that this club has received the most posts in such short time.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! You must be happy Val! You shouldn't be proud of that, you should be proud that this club has received the most posts in such short time.


And AM I! I love this thread and am still amazed at the speed at which it moves. It brightens every day of mine


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol! You must be happy Val! You shouldn't be proud of that, you should be proud that this club has received the most posts in such short time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And AM I! I love this thread and am still amazed at the speed at which it moves. It brightens every day of mine
Click to expand...

This thing already has 1/2 of the posts in the "Rate my Cables" thread... That one has significantly more views but the posts... so much. You know there are a lot of people here just chilling.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This thing already has 1/2 of the posts in the "Rate my Cables" thread... That one has significantly more views but the posts... so much. You know there are a lot of people here just chilling.


Hmmm.. Razor blades and beheadings vs. cables.. I wonder who will win this war in the end!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> I tried to join the club, but ruined my 3570K instead. I'll post pictures later, just a tiny scratch on the bottom right side, but thats all it took (and I'm sure the CPU is dead, I reseated multiple times, checked pins on mobo etc... I booted the mobo no problem with a 2500K in it). I was being so careful with the thing, but my goddamned cat jumped from the window onto me while I was holding the razor. The worst part is the scratch isnt under the IHS, so Im doubtful I can fool RMA with it on the basis of physical damage, even after reseating the IHS with silicone.
> 
> Anyone have tips for hiding a scratched PCB? Or am I completely boned? I feel like crying right now... and my cat is going to get tired of sleeping outside pretty quickly, I think.


I locked my cat out of my room while doing it.. I also did it after drinking lots of coke and made sure all my windows and doors were shut when my parents weren't home. (The cat went pshyco because I locked him in the laundry.. but oh well)

Try some nail polish


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is the cat cute? Could you sell it for a new chip?


I am still laughing lol


----------



## enigma7820

Youmo any results?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is the cat cute? Could you sell it for a new chip?
> 
> 
> 
> I am still laughing lol
Click to expand...

I'd say keep the cat but don't buy him food until the chip is paid off.


----------



## Youmu

Heres pics of the scratch. The image quality is terrible, you can barely see the mark, but its there. Wish I had something better than my camera phone to do this with. On top of the PCB, its just a hairline scratch, but still visible without magnification. On the side, theres a noticeable mark on it that you can't really see with the camera. Out of the 3 images, the third is the most clear.

http://imgur.com/wA9YtgN,xoUKYTw,vEs7iES

I'm just leaving this here in hopes of suggestions overnight, Valgaur agreed to help me out with it via PMs as well, though I'm still skeptical I can get it working, but it would be a very welcome miracle. Heading to sleep.

Also, I know I should've used Liquid Pro, but MX-2 is all that I could use for right now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Heres pics of the scratch. The image quality is terrible, you can barely see the mark, but its there. Wish I had something better than my camera phone to do this with. On top of the PCB, its just a hairline scratch, but still visible without magnification. On the side, theres a noticeable mark on it that you can't really see with the camera. Out of the 3 images, the third is the most clear.
> 
> http://imgur.com/wA9YtgN,xoUKYTw,vEs7iES
> 
> I'm just leaving this here in hopes of suggestions overnight, Valgaur agreed to help me out with it via PMs as well, though I'm still skeptical I can get it working, but it would be a very welcome miracle. Heading to sleep.
> 
> Also, I know I should've used Liquid Pro, but MX-2 is all that I could use for right now.


Mx 2 will do for now, let's just get this mean lady purring again.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Heres pics of the scratch. The image quality is terrible, you can barely see the mark, but its there. Wish I had something better than my camera phone to do this with. On top of the PCB, its just a hairline scratch, but still visible without magnification. On the side, theres a noticeable mark on it that you can't really see with the camera. Out of the 3 images, the third is the most clear.
> 
> http://imgur.com/wA9YtgN,xoUKYTw,vEs7iES
> 
> I'm just leaving this here in hopes of suggestions overnight, Valgaur agreed to help me out with it via PMs as well, though I'm still skeptical I can get it working, but it would be a very welcome miracle. Heading to sleep.
> 
> Also, I know I should've used Liquid Pro, but MX-2 is all that I could use for right now.


It's really blurry :s
Can you get a better photo possibly?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Mx 2 will do for now, let's just get this mean lady purring again.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Heres pics of the scratch. The image quality is terrible, you can barely see the mark, but its there. Wish I had something better than my camera phone to do this with. On top of the PCB, its just a hairline scratch, but still visible without magnification. On the side, theres a noticeable mark on it that you can't really see with the camera. Out of the 3 images, the third is the most clear.
> 
> http://imgur.com/wA9YtgN,xoUKYTw,vEs7iES
> 
> I'm just leaving this here in hopes of suggestions overnight, Valgaur agreed to help me out with it via PMs as well, though I'm still skeptical I can get it working, but it would be a very welcome miracle. Heading to sleep.
> 
> Also, I know I should've used Liquid Pro, but MX-2 is all that I could use for right now.


...if anyone knows all the tricks with this, it is Valgaur...the second scratch 'on the side' you mentioned sounds interesting...and also make sure there is nothing stuck underneath the CPU (what with cat dandruff and all)....hope things work out for you !


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...if anyone knows all the tricks with this, it is Valgaur...the second scratch 'on the side' you mentioned sounds interesting...and also make sure there is nothing stuck underneath the CPU (what with cat dandruff and all)....hope things work out for you !


Yes same!
I used metho to clean the fingerprints left on the bottom of my 3570k and it turned out good!


----------



## martinhal

Will folding at full speed show up instability ? Eg WHEA errors and the like ? Do WHEA errors mean instability ?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Will folding at full speed show up instability ? Eg WHEA errors and the like ? Do WHEA errors mean instability ?


Yes they do, you can actually set it for whenever you get a WHEA for a message to pop up or a sound to be played though!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Heres pics of the scratch. The image quality is terrible, you can barely see the mark, but its there. Wish I had something better than my camera phone to do this with. On top of the PCB, its just a hairline scratch, but still visible without magnification. On the side, theres a noticeable mark on it that you can't really see with the camera. Out of the 3 images, the third is the most clear.
> 
> http://imgur.com/wA9YtgN,xoUKYTw,vEs7iES
> 
> I'm just leaving this here in hopes of suggestions overnight, Valgaur agreed to help me out with it via PMs as well, though I'm still skeptical I can get it working, but it would be a very welcome miracle. Heading to sleep.
> 
> Also, I know I should've used Liquid Pro, but MX-2 is all that I could use for right now.


The only thing I noticed in the pictures was the obscene amount of MX-2 you put on the IHS. That's about 3x more than you need.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> It's really blurry :s
> Can you get a better photo possibly?


I can see the area but it's pretty tough to see, I gave him some ideas to try for today until a better picture can be provided.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Will folding at full speed show up instability ? Eg WHEA errors and the like ? Do WHEA errors mean instability ?


Heck yes it will, Folding is tougher than prime 95, thats why us folders like to say it may be stable, but can it fold. Whea don't always mean instability they can mean issues with programs failing I get them sometimes just from adobe air not working right, (hate that program so much)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The only thing I noticed in the pictures was the obscene amount of MX-2 you put on the IHS. That's about 3x more than you need.


That is true as well that's a lot of paste there.

On the side note morning all


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Will folding at full speed show up instability ? Eg WHEA errors and the like ? Do WHEA errors mean instability ?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes they do, you can actually set it for whenever you get a WHEA for a message to pop up or a sound to be played though!
Click to expand...

Link / guide/explanation?


----------



## Lobsterman

Goto Event Viewer
Find a logged WHEA
Attach it to an event


----------



## tzvia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Heres pics of the scratch. The image quality is terrible, you can barely see the mark, but its there. Wish I had something better than my camera phone to do this with. On top of the PCB, its just a hairline scratch, but still visible without magnification. On the side, theres a noticeable mark on it that you can't really see with the camera. Out of the 3 images, the third is the most clear.
> 
> http://imgur.com/wA9YtgN,xoUKYTw,vEs7iES
> 
> I'm just leaving this here in hopes of suggestions overnight, Valgaur agreed to help me out with it via PMs as well, though I'm still skeptical I can get it working, but it would be a very welcome miracle. Heading to sleep.
> 
> Also, I know I should've used Liquid Pro, but MX-2 is all that I could use for right now.


Some of the blurriness looks like it's from low light- the graininess. You could try going where the light is better, or outside in the sun if possible. If the camera or cellphone has a macro setting, that will improve it also.

Hope it can be brought back to life...


----------



## Youmu

Believe me, I tried everything with the camera settings, lighting etc... thats as good of an image as I can get. I'll clean off all the thermal paste and reapply today, in addition to the other tips Valgaur gave me. I'll report back later, have to take care of business online before I can turn things off.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Oh Von Dutch?? Where are you???


still around, a bit at least,
but dont have much to contribute, theres enough others that can help as good as i can around now








no need for peeps to hear the same answers from 10 crewmembers ...haha..


----------



## Feyris

Who ere' can I trust to delid my baby and keep it in one piece so ^ doesn't happen? I'll send the Liquid Ultra too, I dont mind whoever does using some on their own build either granted theres enough to use for one application on my side for HSF.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Goto Event Viewer
> Find a logged WHEA
> Attach it to an event


Thanks! There's no WHEAs at all in my log but w/e, it'll come in handy when I start to overclock (and get my damn llc fixed)


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Feyris*
> 
> Who ere' can I trust to delid my baby and keep it in one piece so ^ doesn't happen? I'll send the Liquid Ultra too, I dont mind whoever does using some on their own build either granted theres enough to use for one application on my side for HSF.


As long as you don't pry with the razor, and you don't go too far under the IHS, you shouldn't have any problems.

I drew the template onto my CPU so I'd know how far to cut. Removing the IHS literally only took a few minutes. Removing all the glue took about half an hour or longer.


----------



## brandon02852

I just delidded my 3770K without much effort. I used a single edge blade and slowly wiggled the blade back and forth until it cut through the glue.

I started with the corners and worked my way to the sides.

The trick is to wiggle the blade back and forth. Do not slide it like you are slicing bread.

Don't use much force cause once you cut through the glue, there will be nothing stopping the blade from crashing into the die.

Make sure to keep the blade level. You don't want to scratch/slice the PCB.

Once all the glue is severed, twist the IHS off the PCB. Do NOT lift it off. Keep twisting until it comes free.

Just be careful, take your time, and everything will go fine.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Thanks! There's no WHEAs at all in my log but w/e, it'll come in handy when I start to overclock (and get my damn llc fixed)


whea errors usually pop up when i play games since i dont fold, ive gone a while with out whea errors untill crysis 3 came out. i had to up my voltage a tad to get rid of them








i started out with 1.375v ran prime 95 for stability check but had a few whe errors


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






now a month later when i started playin crysis 3 i started to get whea errors. now my voltage is @ 1.410v @ load whea error free for now.
if i start to get more could that be signs of degridation???


----------



## MikeG

Well folks, I'm dead in the water. After two months of intermittent power supply shutdowns, it finally failed. The frustrating thing is that I had no idea if the shutdowns were caused by the power supply, motherboard, or a cable. The first time it happened was right after delidding my CPU which led me to believe I had bent some pins or something on the motherboard. Then everything was fine and it ran for two weeks straight without a failure. Now it has gotten so bad, that my computer will only stay running for 5-minutes without the supply shutting down with a red fault light. It even fails self test with nothing connected, so there is no doubt in my mind that it is the power supply.

The thing that really upsets me though, is that I paid a premium for my power supply. It is a Corsair AX860i Platinum power supply with a 7-year warranty. I do not expect it to fail within the first month. Grrrrr!







I wish I had a Seasonic.


----------



## valkeriefire

At least it is covered under warranty. I had a PSU die on me a few weeks ago and it sucked. Antec cross shipped a better model for free. If you unhappy maybe you can return it since it is so new.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Well folks, I'm dead in the water. After two months of intermittent power supply shutdowns, it finally failed. The frustrating thing is that I had no idea if the shutdowns were caused by the power supply, motherboard, or a cable. The first time it happened was right after delidding my CPU which led me to believe I had bent some pins or something on the motherboard. Then everything was fine and it ran for two weeks straight without a failure. Now it has gotten so bad, that my computer will only stay running for 5-minutes without the supply shutting down with a red fault light. It even fails self test with nothing connected, so there is no doubt in my mind that it is the power supply.
> 
> The thing that really upsets me though, is that I paid a premium for my power supply. It is a Corsair AX860i Platinum power supply with a 7-year warranty. I do not expect it to fail within the first month. Grrrrr!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish I had a Seasonic.


To me that sounds CPU power related - but I'm sure you are passed that stage of checking.
Thus I would assume, like you, that it is indeed PSU related.

You aren't the only one that had troubles with their PSU.
Swag himself, also had his Corsair PSU short his whole rig out.
He had the AX850

I myself have the AX750. I'm somewhat not surprised if my PSU did something to my motherboard, and thus the DRAM led is now showing up.
As I remember Valguar helping me "ground" the PSU, in order to get it to boot up at all.
I thought I screwed my system by de-lidding, little did I know that had nothing to do with it.

I even treated my i7 like "junk" after I had the DRAM led errors. To some extent I'm slapping myself for treating my i7 like that, as it wasn't ever at fault -> by that I mean AFTER de-lidding, thinking I screwed up my CPU - as I scratched the PCB.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> To me that sounds CPU power related - but I'm sure you are passed that stage of checking.
> Thus I would assume, like you, that it is indeed PSU related.
> 
> You aren't the only one that had troubles with their PSU.
> Swag himself, also had his Corsair PSU short his whole rig out.
> He had the AX850
> 
> I myself have the AX750. I'm somewhat not surprised if my PSU did something to my motherboard, and thus the DRAM led is now showing up.
> As I remember Valguar helping me "ground" the PSU, in order to get it to boot up at all.
> I thought I screwed my system by de-lidding, little did I know that had nothing to do with it.
> 
> I even treated my i7 like "junk" after I had the DRAM led errors. To some extent I'm slapping myself for treating my i7 like that, as it wasn't ever at fault -> by that I mean AFTER de-lidding, thinking I screwed up my CPU - as I scratched the PCB.


Yikes. Corsairs showing problems now? At what age? I have an hx850 hoping it is true that the hx are actually made a bit better than the ax even though the ax are gold. Am I crazy or has someone else seen that the hx is a bit better somewhere?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yikes. Corsairs showing problems now? At what age? I have an hx850 hoping it is true that the hx are actually made a bit better than the ax even though the ax are gold. Am I crazy or has someone else seen that the hx is a bit better somewhere?


The HX is similar, if not identical to the AX, apart from being silver and not gold rated (fully) - quick google search:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1359672/corsair-duel-new-hx750-gold-vs-older-ax750


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> The HX is similar, if not identical to the AX, apart from being silver and not gold rated (fully) - quick google search:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1359672/corsair-duel-new-hx750-gold-vs-older-ax750


Look at narmour 3 posts down:

I thought I remember reading in here a few times that the HX series had better components. That's why I went from a HX750 to another HX series - I could be very wrong but I'm sure there was a reason as to why I chose the HX over the AX series.

Yay! I'm not crazy!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yikes. Corsairs showing problems now? At what age? I have an hx850 hoping it is true that the hx are actually made a bit better than the ax even though the ax are gold. Am I crazy or has someone else seen that the hx is a bit better somewhere?


The older AX and the HX are very similar and both are manufactured by Seasonic. The new AXi are manufactured by Flextronics.

Your HX will probably last forever, or at least 10 years and then PC's will be 5x more powerful and use 1/5th of the power and you will go for like a 350w Gold PSU to run 4 GPU's and a 16 core CPU OC'd to 5GHz, lol.


----------



## FtW 420

My hx1000 went about a year before the 24pin atx failed, cut that out & soldered in another & it still runs, although not as strong as it used to.
Last time I was testing power draw with a 2600k & 2 x 680s I got a full system shutdown when it pulled a little over 1000w from the wall.

I still want one of those single rail ax1200 or 1200i, awesome for gpu benching!


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The older AX and the HX are very similar and both are manufactured by Seasonic. The new AXi are manufactured by Flextronics.


I didn't know that. I guess that explains it then.

Something else I noticed with my AXi... it comes with monitoring software and you can see power in vs. power out and it will even calculate efficiency. Most of the time it is above 90%, but during IBT, it swings down to 68%. I wouldn't think that is normal.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I didn't know that. I guess that explains it then.
> 
> Something else I noticed with my AXi... it comes with monitoring software and you can see power in vs. power out and it will even calculate efficiency. Most of the time it is above 90%, but during IBT, it swings down to 68%. I wouldn't think that is normal.


No that would be considered a defective unit and Corsair would not have a problem sending you a new one free of charge.


----------



## jay2nice000

what do you guys think of my temps and voltage? i ran just a quick test but i know its not 100 percent stable ( running prime test now). i cant do 5ghz on intel burn its starts glitching like crazy but will get there soon on prime


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> what do you guys think of my temps and voltage? i ran just a quick test but i know its not 100 percent stable ( running prime test now). i cant do 5ghz on intel burn its starts glitching like crazy but will get there soon on prime
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


those temps are far to high, delid it!


----------



## alancsalt

Cleaned.
Please do not discuss RMA fraud in the forums.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> My hx1000 went about a year before the 24pin atx failed, cut that out & soldered in another & it still runs, although not as strong as it used to.
> Last time I was testing power draw with a 2600k & 2 x 680s I got a full system shutdown when it pulled a little over 1000w from the wall.
> 
> I still want one of those single rail ax1200 or 1200i, awesome for gpu benching!


Get the an Enermax Maxrevo 1500w unit








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Cleaned.
> Please do not discuss RMA fraud in the forums.


Guys come on...be smart


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Cleaned.
> Please do not discuss RMA fraud in the forums.


sorry about that forgot for once... hmm usually i dont forget that one....









thanks Mr. Salt


----------



## jay2nice000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> those temps are far to high, delid it!


i want to and i will.....but im waiting on a better safer method. do you really think its high? i just did a prime test at 5ghz and 2 hours in and its stable at 1.43v but my temps are under 72c. i thinking im gonna stay at 4.9ghz at 1.35v ( looks like the sweet spot).


----------



## Youmu

Alright, sorry about that, didn't realize it was an issue because there were some un-moderated posts discussing it in other threads. I'll have to figure this out on my own.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

You're not alone when you have people like myself who will help you via PM


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get the an Enermax Maxrevo 1500w unit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Guys come on...be smart


I have a Silverstone 1500w still, & an Enermax Galaxy 1200.
Those are multi rail though (like the maxrevo), I could still use a nice single rail for gtx 580 benching, ax1200(or i) is the preferred model.


----------



## =JLumbs=

Hey guys do you think its even worth it for me to delid mine since i need such a high voltage to get to 4.5ghz............?...........................i do want to get to 5ghz as baaad as poss.


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> i want to and i will.....but im waiting on a better safer method. do you really think its high? i just did a prime test at 5ghz and 2 hours in and its stable at 1.43v but my temps are under 72c. i thinking im gonna stay at 4.9ghz at 1.35v ( looks like the sweet spot).


I don't think your temps are high. Obviously they will go down if you delid, but your custom loop is clearly working very well. Also you chip is really good to. I need 1.37v to get 4.8ghz and that results in temps in the 80s with my nh-d14 and I am delidded.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *=JLumbs=*
> 
> Hey guys do you think its even worth it for me to delid mine since i need such a high voltage to get to 4.5ghz............?...........................i do want to get to 5ghz as baaad as poss.


You may not hit 5GHZ but your cpu will appreciate it.

I'd sell the cpu and get another till you find one that will do 5GHZ if you must have a 5ghz cpu. Good luck.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> I don't think your temps are high. Obviously they will go down if you delid, but your custom loop is clearly working very well. Also you chip is really good to. I need 1.37v to get 4.8ghz and that results in temps in the 80s with my nh-d14 and I am delidded.


He has great temps/voltage for that speed. Looks golden for 5GHZ.


----------



## =JLumbs=

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> You may not hit 5GHZ but your cpu will appreciate it.
> 
> I'd sell the cpu and get another till you find one that will do 5GHZ if you must have a 5ghz cpu. Good luck.


Well i want as close to poss. to 5ghz but from what im reading if im using fairly high voltage already for just 4.5ghz then really no chance...


----------



## Swag

You guys must be tired of me posting pictures of my rig.







Haha! But here are some slightly better photos than the previous ones, still not good since I'm still saving up money for a new DSLR! Clumsiness has never cost me more money.


----------



## dragon1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You guys must be tired of me posting pictures of my rig.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha! But here are some slightly better photos than the previous ones, still not good since I'm still saving up money for a new DSLR! Clumsiness has never cost me more money.


very clean case good job.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You guys must be tired of me posting pictures of my rig.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha! But here are some slightly better photos than the previous ones, still not good since I'm still saving up money for a new DSLR! Clumsiness has never cost me more money.


...as per my previous comments a few days ago - VERY clean + love the three color-combo...lot's of room for a water-loop or two







and other expansion


----------



## [CyGnus]

Swag for me the only thing i dont like is that stock cooler on the VGA...ugly and noisy as hell... with so many vga's to get why did you not get a aftermarket one (Asus, Gigabyte, MSI?)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *=JLumbs=*
> 
> Well i want as close to poss. to 5ghz but from what im reading if im using fairly high voltage already for just 4.5ghz then really no chance...


Can you tell us what voltage for 4.5GHz? If it's over 1.3v you really have no chance of running 5GHz for a 24/7 Overclock. You might be able to hit it for benching but you will be well past 1.6v, at least any chip I have used that needs more than 1.3v seems to top out around 4.7-4.8 if you follow the 1.52v guideline.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Swag for me the only thing i dont like is that stock cooler on the VGA...ugly and noisy as hell... with so many vga's to get why did you not get a aftermarket one (Asus, Gigabyte, MSI?)


Yeah I agree. Those EVGA Signature2's with the dual fans even. They look nice and have better cooling.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Swag for me the only thing i dont like is that stock cooler on the VGA...ugly and noisy as hell... with so many vga's to get why did you not get a aftermarket one (Asus, Gigabyte, MSI?)


I actually want to buy an aftermarket cooler for it but I think I'd rather save the money and put it towards my watercooling this summer.







$110/GPU block... I don't even have that kind of money right now...


----------



## justanoldman

Just my opinion, but if you like your currently multiplier but not your temps, then you should consider delidding. If you want to increase your multiplier as much as possible then a chip that can do 4.5 at 1.2v is perfect, at 1.25v should be fine depending on what you want, and over 1.3v then it is not a great candidate.

And Swag, the only way that rig is going to looks its absolute best and perform quietly is water cooling, start saving your money. Don't know how it will perform yet, but an H220, plus another rad, fittings, tubing, coolant, gpu block+backplate, and a few fans should be in the $400 neighborhood.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Just my opinion, but if you like your currently multiplier but not your temps, then you should consider delidding. If you want to increase your multiplier as much as possible then a chip that can do 4.5 at 1.2v is perfect, at 1.25v should be fine depending on what you want, and over 1.3v then it is not a great candidate.
> 
> And Swag, the only way that rig is going to looks its absolute best and perform quietly is water cooling, start saving your money. Don't know how it will perform yet, but an H220, plus another rad, fittings, tubing, coolant, gpu block+backplate, and a few fans should be in the $400 neighborhood.


Agreed im not sure the price tag of that new swiftech but my custom loop has ran me about 450 so far and I haven't even added my gpu yet lol. Its well worth it tho both performance and aesthetic wise.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Agreed im not sure the price tag of that new swiftech but my custom loop has ran me about 450 so far and I haven't even added my gpu yet lol. Its well worth it tho both performance and aesthetic wise.


Is h220 better than the equivalent rad size for the xspc ray storm kit with a d5 pump?


----------



## Zeek

My CLU just arrived. Didn't expect it to get here so fast since I ordered it on Friday evening. Should be driving down to MC this weekend if we don't get snow and swap out my #3227C383 for a new chip


----------



## chefproject

Hey guys,
found today at work some stuff to practice on for the delidding of my 3570K.
Got an old pentium 4 @ 2,4 GhZ to delid and 2 Xeons from 2005, started already with the pentium and it worked out fine so i think i gonna order some liquid ultra then in the next few days


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Agreed im not sure the price tag of that new swiftech but my custom loop has ran me about 450 so far and I haven't even added my gpu yet lol. Its well worth it tho both performance and aesthetic wise.


That's too much monies...probably cause of new compression fittings. If you cheap out and go for barbs/clamps and duralene tubing you will spend around 250usd for a single gpu and cpu loop.
300 max xD (dual 240 swiftech mcr-220xp or qp, single 35x pump, raystorm block, swiftech micro res, duralene tubing 10ft)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is h220 better than the equivalent rad size for the xspc ray storm kit with a d5 pump?


H220 is better and cheaper...has pwm control too.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Just my opinion, but if you like your currently multiplier but not your temps, then you should consider delidding. If you want to increase your multiplier as much as possible then a chip that can do 4.5 at 1.2v is perfect, at 1.25v should be fine depending on what you want, and over 1.3v then it is not a great candidate.
> 
> And Swag, the only way that rig is going to looks its absolute best and perform quietly is water cooling, start saving your money. Don't know how it will perform yet, but an H220, plus another rad, fittings, tubing, coolant, gpu block+backplate, and a few fans should be in the $400 neighborhood.


thats where im stuck i dont no if i want to spend 400$ on water cooling or on another 670. i will eventually do both just not in the same month. im really thinking of going with another 670 first.
performance or coolness ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thats where im stuck i dont no if i want to spend 400$ on water cooling or on another 670. i will eventually do both just not in the same month. im really thinking of going with another 670 first.
> performance or coolness ?


...well, the 3 670ies for tri-SLI were easy compared to wrestling with 1/2 inch tubing, stuffing a 360 radiator where it was not designed to go with 6 120mm fans and a mpc 655 PUMP which is a lot bigger than in catalogued pictures...but the tubing is the worst....sort of like wrestling a python...in another day or so, I should be finished - unless the 'snake' decides to stop biting and start leaking


----------



## ivanlabrie

I lol'd...hopefully it won't spit poison on your components


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, the 3 670ies for tri-SLI were easy compared to wrestling with 1/2 inch tubing, stuffing a 360 radiator where it was not designed to go with 6 120mm fans and a mpc 655 PUMP which is a lot bigger than in catalogued pictures...but the tubing is the worst....sort of like wrestling a python...in another day or so, I should be finished - unless the 'snake' decides to stop biting and start leaking


Good analogy, those tubes never want to go exactly the way you picture them, & then have to check barbs when giving it a twist, etc.

Fun stuff!


----------



## Swag

*GUYS! Sorry if this doesn't work for you but if you want it:

Battlefield 3 is only $12 on Amazon! Only $10 on Origin!*


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *GUYS! Sorry if this doesn't work for you but if you want it:
> 
> Battlefield 3 is only $12 on Amazon! Only $10 on Origin!*


Muchas gracias


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is h220 better than the equivalent rad size for the xspc ray storm kit with a d5 pump?


I don't know about the h220, but Raystorm kit is great if you don't mind a little noise from the pump and the fans. I have the EX360 kit with the d5 pump. The pump is super powerful which I like, and it has a variable speed control, but it is attached to the dual bay reservoir and if mounted in the 5 1/2 inch drive bay, your case can pick up the vibrations from the pump and amplify them. The good news is that you won't notice the pump noise over the whine of the Xinruilian fans that come with the kit. The fans are powerful and have good static pressure, but a little loud for my taste.

I replaced the three XSPC fans with six Noctuas, and have my pump and reservoir sitting on a piece of shock absorbing Sorbothane in the bottom of my case. Now I love my kit. There is absolutely no noise from my pump, the radiator performs very well, and I can only hear the fans when I have them on 100%. I am using a Koolance 380i instead of the Raystorm waterblock that came with the kit , but that is another story.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, the 3 670ies for tri-SLI were easy compared to wrestling with 1/2 inch tubing, stuffing a 360 radiator where it was not designed to go with 6 120mm fans and a mpc 655 PUMP which is a lot bigger than in catalogued pictures...but the tubing is the worst....sort of like wrestling a python...in another day or so, I should be finished - unless the 'snake' decides to stop biting and start leaking


LOL, sounds like me! I spent this last weekend wrestling with 1/2 inch tubing--1/2 inch, 3/4 inch. I am amazed it still runs the way I had to manhandle the tubing to get it on my waterblock.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *GUYS! Sorry if this doesn't work for you but if you want it:
> 
> Battlefield 3 is only $12 on Amazon! Only $10 on Origin!*


Ordered! Thanks. I don't do multiplayer but $10 for the campaign is good for me since crysis 3 is only 5 hours I am passing out of protest


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is h220 better than the equivalent rad size for the xspc ray storm kit with a d5 pump?


I don't know much about the h220 but I have a custom raystorm kit with the ddc 3.25 pump and it works great and the reason mine was so much money is only because of the extra rad and all comp fittings.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, the 3 670ies for tri-SLI were easy compared to wrestling with 1/2 inch tubing, stuffing a 360 radiator where it was not designed to go with 6 120mm fans and a mpc 655 PUMP which is a lot bigger than in catalogued pictures...but the tubing is the worst....sort of like wrestling a python...in another day or so, I should be finished - unless the 'snake' decides to stop biting and start leaking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, sounds like me! I spent this last weekend wrestling with 1/2 inch tubing--1/2 inch, 3/4 inch. I am amazed it still runs the way I had to manhandle the tubing to get it on my waterblock.
Click to expand...

Odd, I'm running 1/2 ID 3/4" OD in my prodigy and I have no problems ... only straight compression fittings (for now)


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

How much better is liquid pro than AS5? 2-3C or like 9-10C?
Thanks!


----------



## dmanstasiu

On the die? 5-10ºC


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Alright thanks, suppose CLP is worth it then.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Alright thanks, suppose CLP is worth it then.


It can be even more than that and also doesn't experience pump out. with as5 I had a 9 degree drop from stock. after 3 days my temps were back at stock temps. With liquid ultra and lapping my ihs I dropped a total of 27 degrees and it has stayed that way


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Ordered some from frozen CPU


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think the difference is a bit bigger...10c would be average me thinks, from what I've seen here.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good analogy, those tubes never want to go exactly the way you picture them, & then have to check barbs when giving it a twist, etc.
> 
> Fun stuff!


...I thought it was a good idea to go with 1/2 inner diameter / 3/4 inch outer diameter - nothing but the best for my favorite machine...and this is how that little piglet pays me back !









...but at least now it is not a big python anymore, but a pile of smaller ones (finished cutting and it seems to actually fit now







, unlike in the first attempt


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> How much better is liquid pro than AS5? 2-3C or like 9-10C?
> Thanks!


compared to mx2 it was around 8c for me


----------



## chronicfx

Here is RS240 and Swiftech H220 head to head. Thats what I wanted to see









http://martinsliquidlab.org/2013/01/27/swiftech-h220-prefilled-2x120mm-water-cooling-kit/6/


----------



## Djghost454

Finally got to test my 3770k.

Sadly, I got 3 beeps, and nothing else. One dead CPU.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Here is RS240 and Swiftech H220 head to head. Thats what I wanted to see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://martinsliquidlab.org/2013/01/27/swiftech-h220-prefilled-2x120mm-water-cooling-kit/6/


If you go xspc get ex240 not rs its almost as slim but with performance closer to the rx series.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Finally got to test my 3770k.
> 
> Sadly, I got 3 beeps, and nothing else. One dead CPU.


I'm sorry to hear that - what happened?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Finally got to test my 3770k.
> 
> Sadly, I got 3 beeps, and nothing else. One dead CPU.


is there anything else that happens with the comp when you start it up?


----------



## =JLumbs=

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Can you tell us what voltage for 4.5GHz? If it's over 1.3v you really have no chance of running 5GHz for a 24/7 Overclock. You might be able to hit it for benching but you will be well past 1.6v, at least any chip I have used that needs more than 1.3v seems to top out around 4.7-4.8 if you follow the 1.52v guideline.
> Yeah I agree. Those EVGA Signature2's with the dual fans even. They look nice and have better cooling.


1.344 volts is what i need to get to 4.5ghz DAMMIT!!!!!

What is the 1.52v guideline????


----------



## cowsgomoo

I'm waiting for my Coolaboratory Pro to come by mail and I have a few questions.
Is it possible to remove the IHS altogether? The IHS have a certain thickness, will the heatsink still be touching the CPU without the IHS?
If the IHS is used, does the Coolaboratory Pro bond the heatsink to the IHS so that it's difficult to remove? If that's the case it's better for me to use something like the PK-1 between the heatsink and the IHS.


----------



## ivanlabrie

No point in removing the ihs altogether...indeed, do use pk1 between the heatsink and ihs and ultra for the die. Much cleaner and works just as good, if not a bit worse (2-5c)


----------



## Swag

BF3 on Ultra settings 8xAA/16xAF Filter looks BEAUTIFUL.







So damn sexy...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I thought it was a good idea to go with 1/2 inner diameter / 3/4 inch outer diameter - nothing but the best for my favorite machine...and this is how that little piglet pays me back !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...but at least now it is not a big python anymore, but a pile of smaller ones (finished cutting and it seems to actually fit now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , unlike in the first attempt


...custom loop purring away now to match delidded potential performance envelope...no leaks and just a bunch of happy little pythons (bloodshed red PrimoFlex adv.LRT ) pumping EK blood-red liquids- no sound to the pump on 4:5 and all the air bubbles seem to have escaped (for now at least)


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...custom loop purring away now to match delidded potential performance envelope...no leaks and just a bunch of happy little pythons (bloodshed red PrimoFlex adv.LRT ) pumping EK blood-red liquids- no sound to the pump on 4:5 and all the air bubbles seem to have escaped (for now at least)


Glad it's all working out for you.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> Glad it's all working out for you.


...thanks chann31 ! I'm sure you remember your first leak-test







This is my first-ever custom loop after playing with closed-loops for a while...went the harder way with the 360 rad positioning now so that it will be much easier to set up a second 360 (or 2x 240) 'in the roof' for the three GPUs though they seem to be running fairly cool even after modding the bios and upping the power target to 150%. Final assembly and case modding tomorrow...


----------



## Djghost454

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> is there anything else that happens with the comp when you start it up?


Nothing else, 3 beeps, then waits a few seconds and 3 beeps again. Put my friends 3770k in and it boots right up.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm sorry to hear that - what happened?


Posted pics a few pages back, scratched PCB in delidding attempt. This sucks


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Nothing else, 3 beeps, then waits a few seconds and 3 beeps again. Put my friends 3770k in and it boots right up.
> Posted pics a few pages back, scratched PCB in delidding attempt. This sucks


...have you tried covering all the scratches with (non conductive) MX4 (or even nail polish) ? This works if you did not actually sever lanes...also, delidding changes the geometry slightly and there are times when adjusting the cooler clamps / screws can yield results...may be this will not work here, but it may - and you have nothing left to loose with that 3770K.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cowsgomoo*
> 
> I'm waiting for my Coolaboratory Pro to come by mail and I have a few questions.
> Is it possible to remove the IHS altogether? The IHS have a certain thickness, will the heatsink still be touching the CPU without the IHS?
> If the IHS is used, does the Coolaboratory Pro bond the heatsink to the IHS so that it's difficult to remove? If that's the case it's better for me to use something like the PK-1 between the heatsink and the IHS.


*Is it possible to remove the IHS altogether?* Yes, my waterblock is directly mounted to my CPU die. I think there are a few others here with similar setups.

*The IHS have a certain thickness, will the heatsink still be touching the CPU without the IHS?* Some heatsinks such as the stock Intel heatsink that have a fixed height will not make contact with the die. You need to have a waterblock or heat sink where you can adjust the height.

*If the IHS is used, does the Coolaboratory Pro bond the heatsink to the IHS so that it's difficult to remove?* I've only been using CLP for a couple months, but have experimented with different mounts, and never had a problem. The CLP remained liquid and the IHS easily removed. I have read that it "hardens" over time, but I don't think so much so that it is difficult to separate the two surfaces. The only problem with CLP is that it is hard to completely wipe it off of metal surfaces. If you wish to remove all remaining residue, the manufacturer recommends using metal polish. People are going to throw stones at me for saying this, but I have successfully used "Weiman" metal polish several times without any ill effects. Here is a link to the manufacturer's instuctions: http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/manual_liquid_pro_englisch.pdf

I tried PK-1, but had better results with CLP.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Djghost454*
> 
> Nothing else, 3 beeps, then waits a few seconds and 3 beeps again. Put my friends 3770k in and it boots right up.
> Posted pics a few pages back, scratched PCB in delidding attempt. This sucks


god damn - try the prepare method. put paper in-between the pcb and ihs - and try to see if it boots
You can assume it isn't pins, ram etc related as your friends one boots


----------



## Zeek

Stuff like that is what scared me and makes me not want to delid. I'll probably still do it anyway since I do want to try, but that sucks man


----------



## BradleyW

Once you remove the Lid, can it be glued back on?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *=JLumbs=*
> 
> 1.344 volts is what i need to get to 4.5ghz DAMMIT!!!!!
> 
> What is the 1.52v guideline????


1.52v is the maximum VID on the Intel spec sheet. That doesn't mean for sure that is the maximum voltage but it is a good guideline to stay under for 24/7 use. I don't know anyone that has degraded their Ivy yet with high volts, I do know a few people that have killed theirs, cough, Valguar, cough. But as a recommendation I wouldn't put the voltage much past the 1.5-1.55 area. And if you need 1.344v for 4.5GHz I'd be willing to bet you need more than 1.55v to get 5.0GHz stable.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Once you remove the Lid, can it be glued back on?


Yes, rubber adhesive or epoxy. You want to go very very light in your application though. The purpose of delidding your chip was to get rid of the absurd amount of adhesive Intel used.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...thanks chann31 ! I'm sure you remember your first leak-test
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my first-ever custom loop after playing with closed-loops for a while...went the harder way with the 360 rad positioning now so that it will be much easier to set up a second 360 (or 2x 240) 'in the roof' for the three GPUs though they seem to be running fairly cool even after modding the bios and upping the power target to 150%. Final assembly and case modding tomorrow...


That sounds pretty awesome. I'm gonna add my gpu to my loop in April. And ya I remember my first fill very well as it was in January lol. Prior to that I had only ever used air. I just spent the month of December reading forums and watching a few of dazmodes videos until it felt like I had already built custom loops before haha.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Once you remove the Lid, can it be glued back on?


black silicone RTV - yes it can, but would be pointless to do so IMO


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> *Is it possible to remove the IHS altogether?* Yes, my waterblock is directly mounted to my CPU die. I think there are a few others here with similar setups.
> 
> *The IHS have a certain thickness, will the heatsink still be touching the CPU without the IHS?* Some heatsinks such as the stock Intel heatsink that have a fixed height will not make contact with the die. You need to have a waterblock or heat sink where you can adjust the height.
> 
> *If the IHS is used, does the Coolaboratory Pro bond the heatsink to the IHS so that it's difficult to remove?* I've only been using CLP for a couple months, but have experimented with different mounts, and never had a problem. The CLP remained liquid and the IHS easily removed. I have read that it "hardens" over time, but I don't think so much so that it is difficult to separate the two surfaces. The only problem with CLP is that it is hard to completely wipe it off of metal surfaces. If you wish to remove all remaining residue, the manufacturer recommends using metal polish. People are going to throw stones at me for saying this, but I have successfully used "Weiman" metal polish several times without any ill effects. Here is a link to the manufacturer's instuctions: http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/manual_liquid_pro_englisch.pdf
> 
> I tried PK-1, but had better results with CLP.


^^^ Great info, and well presented ! On running the CPU die 'naked' (that is without IHS altogether), I'm seriously thinking about it as I'm about to reassemble my system following the addition of a custom-WC loop..The IHS was originally already a bit crooked BEFORE delidding







, now it is quite crooked the other way AFTER the delidding







(circumstances included blood via slipped razor blade, bad light, way too much espresso at 4 am...). It works great now re temps, but as long as i don't use too much force with the water block tightening procedure, I think it is worth a try to run the die naked. While the temp gain will probably be very marginal, there is no way the IHS can be crooked on the die if I am not running an IHS









...on CLP / CLU, I find that CLU beats CLP by just a fraction temp wise (I know others had the reverse the results; depends I guess on application and other custom factors). The one big advantage I like about CLU is that it is easier to clean off


----------



## BradleyW

Thanks, and what is the best thermal paste to use between the IHS and CPU and Heatsink.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Thanks, and what is the best thermal paste to use between the IHS and CPU and Heatsink.


I used CL-U - here is a video which some of this thread like (me included as I originally linked it), while others complain about the CL-P application method...in my own tests of IHS to CPU heatsink thermal pastes, I found that CL-U beat MX4 (a very good product in its own right that is also non-conductive and non-capacitive) by 3.5 C.


----------



## Zeek

Most people use Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra on die and whatever they normally use on the IHS. I've seen some people use Pro on both surfaces tho. I'm thinking of trying Ultra on die and IHS too.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Most people use Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra on die and whatever they normally use on the IHS. I've seen some people use Pro on both surfaces tho. I'm thinking of trying Ultra on die and IHS too.


I've heard to you almost have to lap it off once it is on, meaning it will destroy the die upon removal. Or is this a load of rubbish?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> 1.52v is the maximum VID on the Intel spec sheet. That doesn't mean for sure that is the maximum voltage but it is a good guideline to stay under for 24/7 use. I don't know anyone that has degraded their Ivy yet with high volts, I do know a few people that have killed theirs, cough, Valguar, cough. But as a recommendation I wouldn't put the voltage much past the 1.5-1.55 area. And if you need 1.344v for 4.5GHz I'd be willing to bet you need more than 1.55v to get 5.0GHz stable.


...CPUs can degrade, depending on the amount of 'excess' voltage pumped through, though 3770Ks are supposed to be more resilient than other chips such as 3930Ks...folks who I know degraded their chips however were doing CPU speed things on a competitive basis with exotic cooling so we're probably talking more than 1.65v

...Just remember that line from Bladeruuner that I also used in the opening on my thread of CPU Queen benchmarks (3.9 GHz to 5.3 GHz / 3770K, now also with LN2 990x etc)..."THE CANDLE THAT BURNS TWICE AS BRIGHT BURNS HALF AS LONG"

...I think it is fairly safe to assume that Intel regards 1.52 v as the outside 'max' in all but 'exotic cooling' environments...I say this because I use Intel's excellent 'Extreme Tuning Utility' which lets you change multipliers (up to 63 I think), various others things and also vCore...but once it reaches 1.52 v, it will just not apply any more no matter how much more you specified via the respective slider...there is also another concern re wattage...by the time you run 5 GHz (I bench up to 5.3 currently), you're pulling close to 200 watts through the CPU assembly at room temps that technically has a tjmax rating of 77 watts...

...btw, speaking of Intel's Extreme Tuning Utility, the usual suspects better get their flamethrower ready...that utility is where the REAL Intel Burn Test (IBT) is, not that privately modified thing you folks seem to call IBT and which is based an older Intel burn-in test...more to come next week on that







(first got to finish my fire-proof underwear







)


----------



## enigma7820

its doesn't destroy the die its wipes off easy because of the material of the die, but it is hard to get off IHS, I had to use the pad that came with to get it off and of course articlean. Anyway it takes the wording off your cpu when you clean it off it will no longer have any lettering left.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> its doesn't destroy the die its wipes off easy because of the material of the die, but it is hard to get off IHS, I had to use the pad that came with to get it off and of course articlean. Anyway it takes the wording off your cpu when you clean it off it will no longer have any lettering left.


I might just stick with the paste I have now then and use liq ultra for the die.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Thanks, and what is the best thermal paste to use between the IHS and CPU and Heatsink.


I have CLU on the die, and MX-2 on the IHS
From others: You gain almost no temperature difference when you put CLU on the IHS itself + cleaning it might be hard.


----------



## BradleyW

Should I use line or spread when using CLU on the actual Die?
Thank you!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Should I use line or spread when using CLU on the actual Die?
> Thank you!


You should check the OP for that - very thin layer...spread.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Should I use line or spread when using CLU on the actual Die?
> Thank you!


You definitely spread CLU, using the included brushes works well. Some like just a thin layer on the die, others put another layer on the underside of the IHS. You can easily use too much or too little, so you may end up redoing it. You only need a tiny bit and it spreads pretty well.

There is a video on the Coollabs website, but that is an IHS application. It gives you a good idea how it works.
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/


----------



## Zeek

I'm ready to attack my chip







I'm not really gonna use the hammer or giant knife


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm ready to attack my chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not really gonna use the hammer or giant knife


Lol , keep all your options open till you fire up a successfully delided chip. I read somewhere you may need to take care of a cat....


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm ready to attack my chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not really gonna use the hammer or giant knife


I will be joining you. I'm waiting for my cool lab ultra! I might delid tommorow and then install it the day after (When the TIM arrieves)


----------



## Zeek

You'll probably get to do it before I do since I have to go pick up another chip this weekend. Current chip's a dud so I'm going to return it. Hopefully the next chip I get will be delidding worth


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> You'll probably get to do it before I do since I have to go pick up another chip this weekend. Current chip's a dud so I'm going to return it. Hopefully the next chip I get will be delidding worth


A dud how?


----------



## dmanstasiu

poor overclcker


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> poor overclcker


I see. I can do 4.5GHz HT at 1.2v @ 70c full load.
I can run 4.7Ghz HT at 1.3v but the temps are in the high 80's.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> A dud how?


Like dmanstasiu said, I have a crappy overclocker. IMC on it can't handle anything above 2000mhz ram either. Old chip did 4.8ghz with 1.34v which was average and could handle up to 2400. Sadly I killed it doing suicide runs


----------



## Joa3d43

...killed it how - with that pictured hammer or excess voltage







(...if so, how much juice ?) In any case, best of luck with the delidding


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I see. I can do 4.5GHz HT at 1.2v @ 70c full load.
> I can run 4.7Ghz HT at 1.3v but the temps are in the high 80's.


...sounds like a perfect candidate for (careful) delidding...mine was similar, the only thing that kept me from running 5 GHz and + were the temps...92 C for prime95


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...killed it how - with that pictured hammer or excess voltage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (...if so, how much juice ?) In any case, best of luck with the delidding


Excess voltage doing suicide runs







Don't remember how much juice I was running thru it, but it was a lot. Had a friends MVG and it went poof


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds like a perfect candidate for (careful) delidding...mine was similar, the only thing that kept me from running 5 GHz and + were the temps...92 C for prime95


Yep! Can't wait to remove the lid. If i destroy it I will just get another one and stick with 4.5Ghz or I will build a x79 system for my birthday. That will be my limit. Can't afford anything higher for a long time lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Insane xD On air?

I killed a G620 with stock volts, maybe +0.1v...but pumped bclk a bit. I still don't get how it died so fast :/


----------



## Zeek

I was on air. With like -5c breeze coming in the window. RealTemp was saying most cores were at 0c







Wish it didn't die tho since it was a pretty decent chip. Probably coulda hit 4.9 with it once I delid it









Now I have to wait till Saturday and see what my local MC has in stock.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You need temps below -50c for going over 1.6v safely really...(looking at you Valgaur







)


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need temps below -50c for going over 1.6v safely really...(looking at you Valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


I know you say - 50c lol, but here is an interesting thought. A chip at 1.6v @ 50c will only last as long as the same chip at 1.6v @ 70c. Temps don't mean much when you start playing with high voltage. The higher vcore will kill the chip faster than temps will ever kill it. This gives watercooling people a false sence of security to overclock too high assuming they are safe because their temps look good.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Yep! Can't wait to remove the lid. If i destroy it I will just get another one and stick with 4.5Ghz or I will build a x79 system for my birthday. That will be my limit. Can't afford anything higher for a long time lol.


...I'm lucky that way in that I can use a lot of the stuff I retire (ie mobos, ram) towards a set of VM machines re work...but the build I'm really looking forward to will be in the fall...and IvyBridge-E on whatever updated X79 board they offer (X79b, x89?), with a couple of Titans...

That said, this machine with 3 GPUs and running over 5 (benching at 5.3) is a ton of fun and enough not to let me fall for 'Haswell' in June - which apparently is not much different from Ivy other than modified IMC and especially a much stronger, better iGPU (which I don't use anyways)


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'm lucky that way in that I can use a lot of the stuff I retire (ie mobos, ram) towards a set of VM machines re work...but the build I'm really looking forward to will be in the fall...and IvyBridge-E on whatever updated X79 board they offer (X79b, x89?), with a couple of Titans...
> 
> That said, this machine with 3 GPUs and running over 5 (benching at 5.3) is a ton of fun and enough not to let me fall for 'Haswell' in June - which apparently is not much different from Ivy other than modified IMC and especially a much stronger, better iGPU (which I don't use anyways)


Lucky you. That sounds like a very good build! I think haswell might not clock "aswell" as people might think due to the integrated VRM's. It could cause temp issues and/or less VRM's might be on the Mobo's.


----------



## dmanstasiu

I went 1.65v last night ... oops


----------



## Zeek

I wasn't doing anything too crazy. Was just trying to get 5.3 validated, which I couldn't do. And tried to do a couple 5ghz cine runs at 1.5ish vcore, which didn't work either


----------



## BradleyW

How are you getting your RAM to run so high everyone? I can't go past stock without issues.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need temps below -50c for going over 1.6v safely really...(looking at you Valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I was on air. With like -5c breeze coming in the window. RealTemp was saying most cores were at 0c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wish it didn't die tho since it was a pretty decent chip. Probably coulda hit 4.9 with it once I delid it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I have to wait till Saturday and see what my local MC has in stock.


Zeek, I'm wondering re the circumstances you described, ie using a friend's Asus ROG MVG...I run a MVE and noticed s.th. very 'shocking' (pun intended). On the rare occasions when I load Asus Suite AI-2 it ALWAYS loads up way more vCore than is actually required. But worse than that...

... the other day, I briefly hit 1.614v







- not on purpose and I immediate hit reset (I'm the guy who normally stays below 1.47 max !). What happened though was that normally I run Intel Extreme Tuning Utility which also controls vCore...while running that I wanted to check s.th. in DigiPLus and was too lazy to reboot - so I loaded up AI Suite...while it was open, I switched to 'TurboV' in AISuite to bump vCore just a bit as I was testing out temps / TIMs...

...AI Suite TurboV said my chip was set to 1.165v (normally it is when booting - long story), but when I clicked the bar for a 1-step increase - it said it was now running 1.170 but CPU-Z and other software like that always running all jumped to 1.614v.







...Bottom line, only run one or the other tuning software that can effect vCore, not both at the same time - they don't play nice together...don't know if that happened to you when you were using your friend's MVG but I thought I mention it.


----------



## BradleyW

Does anyone have any additional tips for delidding from personal experiences, such as methods you found to be effective?
(Yes, I have read the OP and all links tied)
Cheers.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Does anyone have any additional tips for delidding from personal experiences, such as methods you found to be effective?
> (Yes, I have read the OP and all links tied)
> Cheers.


I cut one corner and then used a thin credit card to cut around the rest. No chance of damage after the first corner.
I used one of those cheap thin papery ones that you get from arcade places and the like.


----------



## Zeek

That's pretty weird. I don't mess with anything inside of the OS tho. I monitor voltage and temps, but I edit everything inside of the UEFI. I'm sure I didn't go above 1.6v. I did 1.57 max iirc, and that was just trying to get 5.3 validated. Maybe the board did overvolt it or something, or I messed up some where and didn't notce. But stuff happens. Hopefully I don't get another crap chip when I go back








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I cut one corner and then used a thin credit card to cut around the rest. No chance of damage after the first corner.
> I used one of those cheap thin papery ones that you get from arcade places and the like.


This is exactly what I plan on doing. Gonna try to get a blade in one corner, then once I get a CC or something in it, I'll just use that the rest of the way


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I cut one corner and then used a thin credit card to cut around the rest. No chance of damage after the first corner.
> I used one of those cheap thin papery ones that you get from arcade places and the like.


Nice tip. Cheers.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I know you say - 50c lol, but here is an interesting thought. A chip at 1.6v @ 50c will only last as long as the same chip at 1.6v @ 70c. Temps don't mean much when you start playing with high voltage. The higher vcore will kill the chip faster than temps will ever kill it. This gives watercooling people a false sence of security to overclock too high assuming they are safe because their temps look good.


That's absolutely not true...If you run your chip at too high voltages you need really low temps for it to live and respond better to the voltage. (cold makes it easier for the electrons to travel freely through your chip, whereas adding moar volts like mad won't do that as effectively, eventually causing electromigration, and thus failed oc's or premature death/degrading)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> How are you getting your RAM to run so high everyone? I can't go past stock without issues.


You have 4 sticks, and they are rated for 1600mhz. That implies they are nothing special, probably a type of crappy ram ic (like Nanya or something).
People use specific types of ram chips for overclocking, like Samsung Hyk0 (generic 1600mhz cl11 1.35v stuff, found in higher clocked G.skill trident x and corsair dominator platinum sticks for example), or specific older ic's like Powerchip or Elpida BBSE...You just need one of those for any kind of decent overclocking.
Also, using 4 sticks is much harder on your cpu's memory controller, so you might get better results with 2 x 4gb sticks vs 4. Though it depends on your ram chips in the end.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Does anyone have any additional tips for delidding from personal experiences, such as methods you found to be effective?
> (Yes, I have read the OP and all links tied)
> Cheers.


...in my case it was good to have bandages ready (no really







)

When you have watched everything re delidding vids etc, just make sure you have plenty of time and nobody is bugging you - it is a delicate operation and requires full concentration (no cats jumping on you, per other posts)

BUT THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT ITEM: Don't let the *TIP of the blade* EVER enter the area above the PCB - the outside boundary of the PCB + 1/4 inch when looking down should be the closest the tip of the blade even comes to the PCB...not doing that seems to be the number 1 reason for PCB scratches...do less cutting and more severing and angle the center of the blade just a bit upwards towards the underside of the IHS.

Also keep some MX4 handy...if against expectations there is a scratch on the PCB, use (non-conductive, non-capacitive) MX4 to cover it richly (some say nail polish also works)

GOOD LUCK


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's absolutely not true...If you run your chip at too high voltages you need really low temps for it to live and respond better to the voltage. (cold makes it easier for the electrons to travel freely through your chip, whereas adding moar volts like mad won't do that as effectively, eventually causing electromigration, and thus failed oc's or premature death/degrading)
> You have 4 sticks, and they are rated for 1600mhz. That implies they are nothing special, probably a type of crappy ram ic (like Nanya or something).
> People use specific types of ram chips for overclocking, like Samsung Hyk0 (generic 1600mhz cl11 1.35v stuff, found in higher clocked G.skill trident x and corsair dominator platinum sticks for example), or specific older ic's like Powerchip or Elpida BBSE...You just need one of those for any kind of decent overclocking.
> Also, using 4 sticks is much harder on your cpu's memory controller, so you might get better results with 2 x 4gb sticks vs 4. Though it depends on your ram chips in the end.


What I mean overall is that watercoolers could be more inclined to add too high of a voltage seen as their temps are very good. This can be dangerous in some cases. Higher voltage over time will cause issues compared to running a componant at a slight too high of a temperature. You might disagree, but I do stand by that based on what I've seen from peoples experiences. Also, my sig rig states that the RAM is made by GS (RipjawsX Series), but it rated at 1600Mhz. I just thought I might be able to increase the speed possibly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...in my case it was good to have bandages ready (no really
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> When you have watched everything re delidding vids etc, just make sure you have plenty of time and nobody is bugging you - it is a delicate operation and requires full concentration (no cats jumping on you, per other posts)
> 
> BUT THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT ITEM: Don't let the *TIP of the blade* EVER enter the area above the PCB - the outside boundary of the PCB + 1/4 inch when looking down should be the closest the tip of the blade even comes to the PCB...not doing that seems to be the number 1 reason for PCB scratches...do less cutting and more severing and angle the center of the blade just a bit upwards towards the underside of the IHS.
> 
> Also keep some MX4 handy...if against expectations there is a scratch on the PCB, use (non-conductive, non-capacitive) MX4 to cover it richly (some say nail polish also works)
> 
> GOOD LUCK


So, I use the side of the blade and never the tip of it. I also must the blade angled slightly upper towards the IHS and I am to be mindful of the CPU die? It that correct?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Bradley you are right.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Bradley you are right.


Cheers. I can't wait to remove the IHS. I will be doing it on thursday as my CLU and antistatic band come.


----------



## Youmu

Yes, cats are awful to have around while delidding. That I can testify to.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Yes, cats are awful to have around while delidding. That I can testify to.


I've got no chance then! I have a massive American Akita that likes to jump on me full force!


----------



## Youmu

Send it outside. Or lock it in the bathroom.

Anything but let it sit on the window ledge in your room...


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Send it outside. Or lock it in the bathroom.
> 
> Anything but let it sit on the window ledge in your room...


This does not work, trust me


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I know you say - 50c lol, but here is an interesting thought. A chip at 1.6v @ 50c will only last as long as the same chip at 1.6v @ 70c. Temps don't mean much when you start playing with high voltage. The higher vcore will kill the chip faster than temps will ever kill it. This gives watercooling people a false sence of security to overclock too high assuming they are safe because their temps look good.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> What I mean overall is that watercoolers could be more inclined to add too high of a voltage seen as their temps are very good. This can be dangerous in some cases. Higher voltage over time will cause issues compared to running a componant at a slight too high of a temperature. You might disagree, but I do stand by that based on what I've seen from peoples experiences. Also, my sig rig states that the RAM is made by GS (RipjawsX Series), but it rated at 1600Mhz. I just thought I might be able to increase the speed possibly.
> So, I use the side of the blade and never the tip of it. I also must the blade angled slightly upper towards the IHS and I am to be mindful of the CPU die? It that correct?


Chips will degrade no matter what you do, just have to make it happen as slow as possible.
I can be comfortable with 2V at -196°, but good chips on air or water never see 60° or get stress tested. It really depends on the user, at OCN a lot of people upgrade with each new generation, so they really don't care if they use 1.6V & make a chip last 1/4 of it's intended lifespan since they plan to replace it within a year.

I'm actually surprised at my 990x, thing has seen literally hundreds of hours at 1.8 - 1.9V & is degrading slower than my 3930k which has barely seen 1.6V, & has never seen 80°. Sandy is kinda wimpy.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Chips will degrade no matter what you do, just have to make it happen as slow as possible.
> I can be comfortable with 2V at -196°, but good chips on air or water never see 60° or get stress tested. It really depends on the user, at OCN a lot of people upgrade with each new generation, so they really don't care if they use 1.6V & make a chip last 1/4 of it's intended lifespan since they plan to replace it within a year.
> 
> I'm actually surprised at my 990x, thing has seen literally hundreds of hours at 1.8 - 1.9V & is degrading slower than my 3930k which has barely seen 1.6V, & has never seen 80°. Sandy is kinda wimpy.


How resilliant is an i7 3770k in general compared to sandy?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> What I mean overall is that watercoolers could be more inclined to add too high of a voltage seen as their temps are very good. This can be dangerous in some cases. Higher voltage over time will cause issues compared to running a componant at a slight too high of a temperature. You might disagree, but I do stand by that based on what I've seen from peoples experiences. Also, my sig rig states that the RAM is made by GS (RipjawsX Series), but it rated at 1600Mhz. I just thought I might be able to increase the speed possibly.
> So, I use the side of the blade and never the tip of it. I also must the blade angled slightly upper towards the IHS and I am to be mindful of the CPU die? It that correct?


...yes - use the center of the blade, never the tip


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yes - use the center of the blade, never the tip


Will do, cheers.


----------



## justanoldman

Sorry, completely off topic, just a quick question. I am a little too old to know what is cool, so what do you guys do with all the little stickers that come with the various products? Do you actually use them somewhere on your case or something else?


----------



## Zeek

Stickers on cars give you more HP. So I'm guessing stickers on PC cases give you higher OC's?

Seriously tho I'd never stick em on my case, but I have seen some properly placed and they look nice. It's all up to the person.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> How resilliant is an i7 3770k in general compared to sandy?


Ivy is definitely stronger. I've killed a 2500k trying ~1.75V memory with ~1.24V VTT. Ivy laughs at those voltages when air cooled, much less more exotic cooling.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, completely off topic, just a quick question. I am a little too old to know what is cool, so what do you guys do with all the little stickers that come with the various products? Do you actually use them somewhere on your case or something else?


I'm not sure, but for some reason someone on OCN bought two i5 stickers from me for $5. So apparently some people like them, so much that they would spend money to attain them.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, completely off topic, just a quick question. I am a little too old to know what is cool, so what do you guys do with all the little stickers that come with the various products? Do you actually use them somewhere on your case or something else?


...Normally, I only use stickers from my own company, if at all...but keep the ones that came with the case, memory etc for later - they come in handy to cover up scratches etc.









...coolness factor ? Not sure about stickers in that department...tastefully placed small rectangular ones can be ok but those big things from Asus (TUF inside) and even Intel (SSD 520 series) are too gaudy for my taste


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivy is definitely stronger. I've killed a 2500k trying ~1.75V memory with ~1.24V VTT. Ivy laughs at those voltages when air cooled, much less more exotic cooling.


Ah, that explains the death of my G620. 1.8v memory lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Normally, I only use stickers from my own company, if at all...but keep the ones that came with the case, memory etc for later - they come in handy to cover up scratches etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...coolness factor ? Not sure about stickers in that department...tastefully placed small rectangular ones can be ok but those big things from Asus (TUF inside) and even Intel (SSD 520 series) are too gaudy for my taste


Same here...


----------



## dmanstasiu

Yeah stickers are tacky. /endofstory


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivy is definitely stronger. I've killed a 2500k trying ~1.75V memory with ~1.24V VTT. Ivy laughs at those voltages when air cooled, much less more exotic cooling.


...take it from FtW 420 - that man has tortured more CPUs and GPUs than most (along with getting world records). Wherever dead chips go, they have a big poster of the top 10 most wanted public enemies in their great dining hall, and he's very much on it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need temps below -50c for going over 1.6v safely really...(looking at you Valgaur
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> I went 1.65v last night ... oops



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> How are you getting your RAM to run so high everyone? I can't go past stock without issues.


good stixs with 1.75 volts usually.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Chips will degrade no matter what you do, just have to make it happen as slow as possible.
> I can be comfortable with 2V at -196°, but good chips on air or water never see 60° or get stress tested. It really depends on the user, at OCN a lot of people upgrade with each new generation, so they really don't care if they use 1.6V & make a chip last 1/4 of it's intended lifespan since they plan to replace it within a year.
> 
> I'm actually surprised at my 990x, thing has seen literally hundreds of hours at 1.8 - 1.9V & is degrading slower than my 3930k which has barely seen 1.6V, & has never seen 80°. Sandy is kinda wimpy.


Thats kinda what my i7 was doing. I put about 2 hours at 1.9+ area then 1.8 area around 30 hours, but the 1.7 area was around 70 hours I had in there.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> How resilliant is an i7 3770k in general compared to sandy?


Pretty darn tough.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, completely off topic, just a quick question. I am a little too old to know what is cool, so what do you guys do with all the little stickers that come with the various products? Do you actually use them somewhere on your case or something else?


They make it look pretty and people can look and go, oh I see you got some awesome stuff in there.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Stickers on cars give you more HP. So I'm guessing stickers on PC cases give you higher OC's?
> 
> Seriously tho I'd never stick em on my case, but I have seen some properly placed and they look nice. It's all up to the person.


They make it faster!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...take it from FtW 420 - that man has tortured more CPUs and GPUs than most (along with getting world records). Wherever dead chips go, they have a big poster of the top 10 most wanted public enemies in their great dining hall, and he's very much on it


bu.....but...... darn you FtW and all your boints.... making be feel like a noob.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I laughed at the above memes


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I laughed at the above memes


That is a good combination!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I laughed at the above memes


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is a good combination!


lol thanks thought you guy would enjoy them


----------



## Swag

Well, I just finished the entire campaign of BF3 again, but on PC (Hard difficulty).







I feel like a complete no-life with it, but it was visually stunning.

Any other games out there right now that are visually stunning? I just bought Crysis 3 so that's next on my to-play list, anything else? I heard Tomb Raider got some amazing reviews but unsure if I should buy it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, I just finished the entire campaign of BF3 again, but on PC (Hard difficulty).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I feel like a complete no-life with it, but it was visually stunning.
> 
> Any other games out there right now that are visually stunning? I just bought Crysis 3 so that's next on my to-play list, anything else? I heard Tomb Raider got some amazing reviews but unsure if I should buy it.


Need for Speed - Most Wanted (2012, Origin)) is pretty neat and a TON of FUN once you win that Bugatti...I once wrecked over 55 police cars and SUVs and Rhinos in one setting (I was innocent, they started it and nobody died







). Visuals are also *far better* than in previous editions.

I also love Aerofly FS (Steam) - stunning graphics (mind you OpenGL)...unbelievable visuals with great and accurate detail of the Swiss Alps...looks like somebody used GoogleMaps and laid textures over it...fun to take that F18 from the Swiss Air force and fly 30 m above ground through glacier valleys at 1,400 km/h


----------



## ivanlabrie

@Swag: Grab a 7870 XT and you get Tomb Raider and Bioshock for free...sell that 680 and grab a 7950 to xfire with the 7870 xt and you get moar games. xD


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, I just finished the entire campaign of BF3 again, but on PC (Hard difficulty).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I feel like a complete no-life with it, but it was visually stunning.
> 
> Any other games out there right now that are visually stunning? I just bought Crysis 3 so that's next on my to-play list, anything else? I heard Tomb Raider got some amazing reviews but unsure if I should buy it.
> 
> 
> 
> Need for Speed - Most Wanted (2012, Origin)) is pretty neat and a TON of FUN once you win that Bugatti...I once wrecked over 55 police cars and SUVs and Rhinos in one setting (I was innocent, they started it and nobody died
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). Visuals are also *far better* than in previous editions.
> 
> I also love Aerofly FS (Steam) - stunning graphics (mind you OpenGL)...unbelievable visuals with great and accurate detail of the Swiss Alps...looks like somebody used GoogleMaps and laid textures over it...fun to take that F18 from the Swiss Air force and fly 30 m above ground through glacier valleys at 1,400 km/h
Click to expand...

I'll wait for that Aerofly FS on my 3 monitor set up.







Sounds interesting and when Eyefinity was released or became more popular, they always used the Flight Sim to exhibit Eyefinity.







I don't like racing games so that's out, sorry for not making it specific for what I want.

Kind of looking for an FPS or a RPG.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> @Swag: Grab a 7870 XT and you get Tomb Raider and Bioshock for free...sell that 680 and grab a 7950 to xfire with the 7870 xt and you get moar games. xD


The store gave me the Crysis 3 and Bioshock combo even though I didn't buy a 7970. My brother did so they said it was fine to give us 2.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Great!







Nice move lol

I'm still waiting for my new 3770k...Intel has it.


----------



## Youmu

Far Cry 3 looks amazing with maxed out graphics.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Great!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice move lol
> 
> I'm still waiting for my new 3770k...Intel has it.


Yea, I am waaaay too cheap to pay for a game at $60.







Why did you RMA the chip?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Far Cry 3 looks amazing with maxed out graphics.


Hmm, I've played it on console but haven't tried it on PC, I'll look it up and see if I can get a deal on it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I am waaaay too cheap to pay for a game at $60.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why did you RMA the chip?
> Hmm, I've played it on console but haven't tried it on PC, I'll look it up and see if I can get a deal on it.


Long story...thing is I needed a new one.


----------



## Zeek

We're in the same position. I just need to stop being lazy and actually make the drive down to MC


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, I just finished the entire campaign of BF3 again, but on PC (Hard difficulty).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I feel like a complete no-life with it, but it was visually stunning.
> 
> Any other games out there right now that are visually stunning? I just bought Crysis 3 so that's next on my to-play list, anything else? I heard Tomb Raider got some amazing reviews but unsure if I should buy it.


Far Cry 3 is a beautiful game, especially on nvidia cards. I get random texture flickering occasionally with my 7970.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Long story...thing is I needed a new one.


lol, don't you hate when they die at stock settings?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Borderlands 2 - PhysX on high -> have fun


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Borderlands 2 - PhysX on high -> have fun


Skipping crysis 3, playing bf3 (just got it for $12 on amazon thx td), definitely checking out tomb raider


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Far Cry 3 is a beautiful game, especially on nvidia cards. I get random texture flickering occasionally with my 7970.
> lol, don't you hate when they die at stock settings?


Yeah, life can be a biatch...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Skipping crysis 3, playing bf3 (just got it for $12 on amazon thx td), definitely checking out tomb raider


I feel like getting a few gpus for the free games and resell the cards lol
Wait for next gen and get free games, or the other way around. Sell keys keep cards, quadfire and then resell before my gf leaves me.


----------



## justanoldman

Since we are OT, I have steam and uplay, but not origin. I have heard people complain about it, is it worth it for BF3? Any difference between buying BF3 for 12 on Amazon or $10 on Origin?

Tried 670 sli by the way, was a little loud, so now trying a 690.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, life can be a biatch...
> I feel like getting a few gpus for the free games and resell the cards lol
> Wait for next gen and get free games, or the other way around. Sell keys keep cards, quadfire and then resell before my gf leaves me.


I'm selling my 7970 and getting a nice 7950 for free Crisis 3 and Bioshock.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Since we are OT, I have steam and uplay, but not origin. I have heard people complain about it, is it worth it for BF3? Any difference between buying BF3 for 12 on Amazon or $10 on Origin?
> 
> Tried 670 sli by the way, was a little loud, so now trying a 690.


If you buy it on Amazon you still have to play through Origin.


----------



## Hokies83

hey gents been lazy finishing my build...

all i really have left is wire mangt and few odds and ends.. but cannot pull myself away from Halo long enough to finish lol...

where im at atm..

Keep getting micro bubbles in my top res.. i stick a zip tie in there and keep removing them but they come back... kinda has me scratching my head atm.

Onlything i can think of is my mcp 35x is turned all the way up causing turbulence somewhere as i have no leaks.

That there is what i call clean if u got 3 things in the case and call it clean then meh yeah that is easy bro..

Try the Ubber large amount of stuff i have.. it takes 10 hrs to get it looking clean lol.
Ignore the black wires hanging down those are leds and attach to the top of the case which i have off atm lol.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Since we are OT, I have steam and uplay, but not origin. I have heard people complain about it, is it worth it for BF3? Any difference between buying BF3 for 12 on Amazon or $10 on Origin?
> 
> Tried 670 sli by the way, was a little loud, so now trying a 690.


Im pretty sure u have to play through origin either way.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> hey gents been lazy finishing my build...
> 
> all i really have left is wire mangt and few odds and ends.. but cannot pull myself away from Halo long enough to finish lol...
> 
> where im at atm..
> 
> Keep getting micro bubbles in my top res.. i stick a zip tie in there and keep removing them but they come back... kinda has me scratching my head atm.
> 
> Onlything i can think of is my mcp 35x is turned all the way up causing turbulence somewhere as i have no leaks.
> 
> That there is what i call clean if u got 3 things in the case and call it clean then meh yeah that is easy bro..
> 
> Try the Ubber large amount of stuff i have.. it takes 10 hrs to get it looking clean lol.
> Ignore the black wires hanging down those are leds and attach to the top of the case which i have off atm lol.


Looks good to me!

I noticed your 3 foot tall helper is missing from this photo. Naptime or are cartoons still on?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Looks good to me!
> 
> I noticed your 3 foot tall helper is missing from this photo. Naptime or are cartoons still on?


2AM


----------



## dmanstasiu




----------



## BradleyW

Hey folks, I was wondering, now that the PS4 is on the way and games seem to be getting too CPU heavy as it is, does this mean it is the end of PC gaming for a little while until 12 core becomes the standard?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Doubt that very much, cause consoles use 8 core cpus...
What I think will happen is things will get better multi core support and efficiency, and thus the Piledriver chips will perform a bit better xD
Plus AMD has all those never settle bundles (kinda like "the way it's meant to be played" titles) which will probably stem things in their favor.

I still can't justify getting slower single thread performance for much better multi-threaded, games are no where as threaded as specific pro software X79 was meant to be used with.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm selling my 7970 and getting a nice 7950 for free Crisis 3 and Bioshock.


I just got an email from Amazon regarding my 7950 that was on backorder, they just got more in stock:

Shipping Soon MSI AMD Radeon HD 7950 TWIN FROZR 3GD5/OC. ETA March 4-8.

I'm kinda debating whether to order a second one. I don't need it now, but thinking about the future. Two 7950's at roughly $300 each, not a bad deal right?


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Doubt that very much, cause consoles use 8 core cpus...
> What I think will happen is things will get better multi core support and efficiency, and thus the Piledriver chips will perform a bit better xD
> Plus AMD has all those never settle bundles (kinda like "the way it's meant to be played" titles) which will probably stem things in their favor.
> 
> I still can't justify getting slower single thread performance for much better multi-threaded, games are no where as threaded as specific pro software X79 was meant to be used with.


But if games become very hungry for a 8 core CPU, surely a quad will become a massive bottleneck? Just look at Crysis 3 and how heavy it is on the CPU. What I mean is, the games might become a bit too optimized for the multi-cores.


----------



## Hokies83

The 3570k will continue to crush games forawhile..

And the games will get patched to use HT and the 4 core / 8 threaded cpus will be king.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Hey folks, I was wondering, now that the PS4 is on the way and games seem to be getting too CPU heavy as it is, does this mean it is the end of PC gaming for a little while until 12 core becomes the standard?


Too CPU heavy? In Titan SLI benchmarks, an Intel 965 (Released in 2008, 5 years ago) is still on par with a modern 6-core, top of the line CPU. I wouldn't qualify games as 'CPU heavy".



Source: http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_titan_review,20.html


----------



## Face2Face

Hey Guys,

If I decide to delid my 3570K. Do you know of any adhesive I could use to keep the IHS on the PCB? I would like to resell the chip one day.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Face2Face*
> 
> Hey Guys,
> 
> If I decide to delid my 3570K. Do you know of any adhesive I could use to keep the IHS on the PCB? I would like to resell the chip one day.


Epoxy would be my preferred option


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think 3770k is the best there is atm...or Haswell (4770k).
Let's hope MC keeps their 3770k deal and turn it into a 4770k one xD


----------



## Zeek

I wish I knew someone who lived in Boston so they could go to MC and find the good batches for me.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Face2Face*
> 
> Hey Guys,
> 
> If I decide to delid my 3570K. Do you know of any adhesive I could use to keep the IHS on the PCB? I would like to resell the chip one day.


I've had excellent success with this:

Permatex Black Silicon Adhesive Sealant


Here is what a chip looks like after delidding for the second time. The black stuff you see is the Permatex, not the Intel Adhesive:



Easily scrapes off with a credit card:


Temperature Resistance Typical Values
Continuous, °C (°F) -59 to 232 (-75 to 450)
Intermittent, °C (°F) -59 to 260 (-75 to 500)


----------



## ivanlabrie

I used to use something similar...but not over do it or it will hurt temps


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think 3770k is the best there is atm...or Haswell (4770k).
> Let's hope MC keeps their 3770k deal and turn it into a 4770k one xD


Yes but Haswell will be using the LGA 1150 socket so you will need to buy a new motherboard to take advantage of the rumored 10% increase in CPU performance. It is supposed to have excellent integrated graphics though; on par with the GT 650M.


----------



## Hokies83

A little preview...

System is not powered on i however powered on the led fan the pump and both res.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Yes but Haswell will be using the LGA 1150 socket so you will need to buy a new motherboard to take advantage of the rumored 10% increase in CPU performance. It is supposed to have excellent integrated graphics though; on par with the GT 650M.


Yep, I know. I still will resell my MVG and 3770k after benching thoroughly with them.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> A little preview...
> 
> System is not powered on i however powered on the led fan the pump and both res.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Very nice man!
Whatever happened to your build log...?


----------



## Hokies83

Miss understanding with management should be back any time now.


----------



## phillyd

Hey guys, only thing I didn't see any comments about is removing the old TIM, how is this best done?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Hey guys, only thing I didn't see any comments about is removing the old TIM, how is this best done?


same as IHS alcohol and a Q tip.

I use the artic cleaning hit myself.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Hey guys, only thing I didn't see any comments about is removing the old TIM, how is this best done?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> same as IHS alcohol and a Q tip.
> 
> I use the artic cleaning hit myself.


^^ This


----------



## justanoldman

Cleaning the TIM off the die is easy and quick, as described above. The hard part is getting all the glue off everything. Old credit card works best for that.


----------



## phillyd

Thanks for the tips guys!
I'll be deliding and watercooling soon. Hopefully I'll e running 5GHz+


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Hey guys, only thing I didn't see any comments about is removing the old TIM, how is this best done?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Thanks for the tips guys!
> I'll be deliding and watercooling soon. Hopefully I'll e running 5GHz+


nice! I used paper towels to get the old crappy TIM off.


----------



## Zeek

I'm so excited but anxious to do mine







Can't wait till Saturday so I can get a new chip


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm so excited but anxious to do mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't wait till Saturday so I can get a new chip


I think I might do mine this weekend finally.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think I might do mine this weekend finally.


I'm waiting till Saturday so I can drive down to MC so I can get a new chip. Then do some testing Sunday, hopefully it's not a crap chip. Then if it's good, Monday shall be deliding day


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ah, kids these days...don't get too excited and scratch the die








I suggest doing one corner with a flexible and thin razor and then using a plastic object to cut the rest of the glue...call me paranoid, but I already killed one 3770k. :/


----------



## Zeek

Annnnnnd apparently it's going to snow on Saturday... Guess I might have to delay this to some other day.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Got my Noobtooth (unfixed) back - put my i7 back in








I added a little bit more CLU to the die and the under of the IHS - I just put a little bit - and by that I mean I put the brush into the CAP of the CLU syringe and got a little off it haha


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ah, the noobtooth xD
Z77 Failtooth...how is she behaving?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ah, the noobtooth xD
> Z77 Failtooth...how is she behaving?


DRAM led still active, asus refused the rma due to MINOR scratches by the CPU mounting holes, I shall maybe destroy the noobtooth - quite literally.

Working though with 8GB ram 2x4 on two furthest slots from the CPU and on single channel.

Edit - check the new name I've given my board in my silent beauty drop-down rigbuilder in my sig.


----------



## enigma7820

I have a sabertooth and love.it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think I might do mine this weekend finally.


...well, finally, MISTER Valgaur !







...and good luck when you delid on the weekend

And friends, may I present the first pics of the 'White Elephant'...no blood this time







only a heavy spill of isopropanol as I knocked over the bottle without the top on - a nice and shiny floor now









...took the IHS off again (was slightly crooked) and reapplied some CL-Ultra...CL-Ultra also for the Koolance block to IHS...ended up rotating block 90 degrees for an additional 5 C savings (convex/concave)...tri-SLI is a blast, though I would like to find bridges which allow for better spacing

...a LOT of WORK left to do re cable management, extra fans and so forth, but at 5 / 5.1 / 5.2 / 5.3, another drop of about 5 C, and that is with fans only on idle as I have not yet installed fan control software...could lower 'v's another notch because of even better temps


----------



## ivanlabrie

Looking superb so far


----------



## FtW 420

Agreed, goes fast while looking good, all coming together!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Agreed, goes fast while looking good, all coming together!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Looking superb so far


Thanks guys - there is a certain irony here in that I normally work with black cases and just a few blue LEDs (see rig_cub3d below...) for that Italian upscale lounge look...this thing looks more like a 'Madame's Parlor in a red light district'







, but with the Asus ROG MaxVEx being black and red and the case white (CM Storm Stryker), I though I loosen up a bit...when it's done, it should be quite clean though as most of the custom stuff is hidden.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, finally, MISTER Valgaur !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and good luck when you delid on the weekend
> 
> And friends, may I present the first pics of the 'White Elephant'...no blood this time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only a heavy spill of isopropanol as I knocked over the bottle without the top on - a nice and shiny floor now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...took the IHS off again (was slightly crooked) and reapplied some CL-Ultra...CL-Ultra also for the Koolance block to IHS...ended up rotating block 90 degrees for an additional 5 C savings (convex/concave)...tri-SLI is a blast, though I would like to find bridges which allow for better spacing
> 
> ...a LOT of WORK left to do re cable management, extra fans and so forth, but at 5 / 5.1 / 5.2 / 5.3, another drop of about 5 C, and that is with fans only on idle as I have not yet installed fan control software...could lower 'v's another notch because of even better temps


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*


Thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> A little preview...
> 
> System is not powered on i however powered on the led fan the pump and both res.


eh ?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> A little preview...
> 
> System is not powered on i however powered on the led fan the pump and both res.


----------



## FtW 420

Yes, I'd agree with that also!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think I might do mine this weekend finally.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...well, finally, MISTER Valgaur !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and good luck when you delid on the weekend
> 
> And friends, may I present the first pics of the 'White Elephant'...no blood this time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only a heavy spill of isopropanol as I knocked over the bottle without the top on - a nice and shiny floor now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...took the IHS off again (was slightly crooked) and reapplied some CL-Ultra...CL-Ultra also for the Koolance block to IHS...ended up rotating block 90 degrees for an additional 5 C savings (convex/concave)...tri-SLI is a blast, though I would like to find bridges which allow for better spacing
> 
> ...a LOT of WORK left to do re cable management, extra fans and so forth, but at 5 / 5.1 / 5.2 / 5.3, another drop of about 5 C, and that is with fans only on idle as I have not yet installed fan control software...could lower 'v's another notch because of even better temps
Click to expand...

That looks sharp! Great job *Joa3d43*!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> A little preview...
> 
> System is not powered on i however powered on the led fan the pump and both res.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> eh ?
Click to expand...

Another piece of Art *Hokies83*! I love what you guys do to your systems
!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Back to de-lidding:
De-lidded i7 - with STOCK intel cooler - has MX2 paste on the IHS and a nice coat of CLU on the die
Running STOCK clocks.

My chip is hot lol


----------



## Hokies83

LoL i ran out of 4 pin molex cables for my AX 1200 ! ima have to order more LOL " or i may have finished tonight " lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i ran out of 4 pin molex cables for my AX 1200 ! ima have to order more LOL " or i may have finished tonight " lol


...the VERY SAME thing happened today with my AX 1200







I HATE molex connectors !


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That looks sharp! Great job *Joa3d43*!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


Thanks PCWargamer...I think it was you who originally sent me to the delid thread...now look what you have done


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the VERY SAME thing happened today with my AX 1200
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I HATE molex connectors !


32 fans 2 fan controllers and 3 res they need power will do that to you..

Even tho i have 6 molex splitters i ran out heh..


----------



## Belial

Molex definitely needs to go and be replaced by something else. It makes a case go from 'everything fits in nicely and so easily' to 'a bit bulging side panel'.

SATA is kind of a pain too but not nearly as bad...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, finally, MISTER Valgaur !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and good luck when you delid on the weekend
> 
> And friends, may I present the first pics of the 'White Elephant'...no blood this time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only a heavy spill of isopropanol as I knocked over the bottle without the top on - a nice and shiny floor now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...took the IHS off again (was slightly crooked) and reapplied some CL-Ultra...CL-Ultra also for the Koolance block to IHS...ended up rotating block 90 degrees for an additional 5 C savings (convex/concave)...tri-SLI is a blast, though I would like to find bridges which allow for better spacing
> 
> ...a LOT of WORK left to do re cable management, extra fans and so forth, but at 5 / 5.1 / 5.2 / 5.3, another drop of about 5 C, and that is with fans only on idle as I have not yet installed fan control software...could lower 'v's another notch because of even better temps
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Dude that looks sweet! nice Tridents btw, I can;t wait to try 8800's in sli soon for some more air benching and see what i can get from those stock for now and Ln2 those babies this summer.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks PCWargamer...I think it was you who originally sent me to the delid thread...now look what you have done


Yes Yes bring more light overclockers to learn what OC'ing really means!


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> That looks sharp! Great job *Joa3d43*!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks PCWargamer...I think it was you who originally sent me to the delid thread...now look what you have done
Click to expand...

Yeah. Gotta love this thread. It gives you the opportunity to go further than you thought you would OC'ing stuff and having lots of fun with your system. Your build is great dude. Thanks for sharing the pics.


----------



## lilchronic

ok dont make fun of me lolz. it may not look pretty on the inside but its a lilbeast


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok dont make fun of me lolz. it may not look pretty on the inside but its a lilbeast
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


...I like it a lot







...nice white case also...think of all the expansion opportunities you still have


----------



## Hokies83

I'm pretty anal bout plugging anything into the mb ...i avoid it at all costs...


----------



## lilchronic

lol my psu had thin layer of pollen on it from having my window open lol need to bring it out to the garage and put my air compressor to it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Dude that looks sweet! nice Tridents btw, I can;t wait to try 8800's in sli soon for some more air benching and see what i can get from those stock for now and Ln2 those babies this summer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes Yes bring more light overclockers to learn what OC'ing really means!


...means it's a blast...without delidding, the other investments would not have been made...it's a package deal, really. And without this thread, I would have blown stuff up via ignorance - tx for sharing










...need longer tri SLI bridges...right now the cards are sandwiched w/horrible air flow (working on it)...but even now, with GPUs 100 MHz below binned, stable top speed and mem lower by about 200 I can still break 21000 in 3DM11 without trying hard









*EDIT:* ...for a *tongue-in-cheek* comparison








http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_titan_review,21.html


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...means it's a blast...without delidding, the other investments would not have been made...it's a package deal, really. And without this thread, I would have blown stuff up via ignorance - tx for sharing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...need longer tri SLI bridges...right now the cards are sandwiched w/horrible air flow (working on it)...but even now, with GPUs 100 MHz below binned, stable top speed and mem lower by about 200 I can still break 21000 in 3DM11 without trying hard


you're more than welcome! Just tryign to find if one of my new cards is able to do that SLI lol


----------



## jay2nice000

yup you where right golden for 5.0 stable after an 2 hours on prime, i have got it to boot at 5.1 at 1.49v but havent ran any stress test.... still not delid


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> 
> 
> yup you where right golden for 5.0 stable after an 2 hours on prime, i have got it to boot at 5.1 at 1.49v but havent ran any stress test.... still not delid


ohh cool were showing off temps and oc's








i love it


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> yup you where right golden for 5.0 stable after an 2 hours on prime, i have got it to boot at 5.1 at 1.49v but havent ran any stress test.... still not delid


What ASRock board are you using? You might be using a little big more voltage than you think.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> 
> 
> yup you where right golden for 5.0 stable after an 2 hours on prime, i have got it to boot at 5.1 at 1.49v but havent ran any stress test.... still not delid


I don't think you need to delid that. You are the voltage wall already. 5.1 will put you into unsafe territory being you have an asrock board take your cpu-z vcore and add .05-.07 to it to get your real vcore. You are over 1.5 right now I would wager.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I don't think you need to delid that. You are the voltage wall already. 5.1 will put you into unsafe territory being you have an asrock board take your cpu-z vcore and add .05-.07 to it to get your real vcore. You are over 1.5 right now I would wager.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jay2nice000*
> 
> 
> 
> yup you where right golden for 5.0 stable after an 2 hours on prime, i have got it to boot at 5.1 at 1.49v but havent ran any stress test.... still not delid


jay2nice - results look good either way







, even with that ASRock voltage issue...re. ASRock true voltage issues, this is what they're talking about: http://www.overclock.net/t/1349216/is-asrock-really-cheating-us-on-software-voltage-readings ...


----------



## z0so

OCN name: z0so
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CL-Pro
ihs-TIM: Tunique TX-2
Mhz gained: 200mhz
OC after delid: 5ghz
Temp drops: 20c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

None chip was sold immediately-After doing this on two chips i've got two bits of advice i didnt see elsewhere.

1. The method of pea sized TIM on the IHS is equally important under IHS with CL-pro. If too much is used it can spread off the die and create hot cores (90c+)

2. Two little strips of double sided tape on each of the tabbed sides of the IHS does wonders. Dont rely on it to keep it on but it is helpful during installation.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Looks clean man...Jimmie had some killer riffs back then huh?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *z0so*
> 
> OCN name: z0so
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CL-Pro
> ihs-TIM: Tunique TX-2
> Mhz gained: 200mhz
> OC after delid: 5ghz
> Temp drops: 20c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> None chip was sold immediately-After doing this on two chips i've got two bits of advice i didnt see elsewhere.
> 
> 1. The method of pea sized TIM on the IHS is equally important under IHS with CL-pro. If too much is used it can spread off the die and create hot cores (90c+)
> 
> 2. Two little strips of double sided tape on each of the tabbed sides of the IHS does wonders. Dont rely on it to keep it on but it is helpful during installation.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Your In!







Now slap that sig on man! show your pride!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Valguar - I'm going to render a video today.
I'll privately upload the video + commentary and then publically release it at a later point.


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Hokies,

there is cool, there is badass, there is beautiful.
But you my friend have created all of that in a nutshell and a mammoth at it too.

Absolutely fantastic job, very nice build - hope you are enjoying it!
May I ask how much the total build cost?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Hokies,
> 
> there is cool, there is badass, there is beautiful.
> But you my friend have created all of that in a nutshell and a mammoth at it too.
> 
> Absolutely fantastic job, very nice build - hope you are enjoying it!
> May I ask how much the total build cost?


Shopping used on most of the stuff but around 4500$


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Shopping used on most of the stuff but around 4500$


pwah! Nice one


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

OCN name: Evil Genius Jr
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: CL-Pro
ihs-TIM: CL-Pro
Mhz gained: N/A (needs more testing)
OC after delid: N/A (needs more testing)
Temp drops: *23c*
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Thats pretty epic. But is all that rad space for just the CPU? Are you going to put the GPU's in that loop at some point?


----------



## BradleyW

OMG!
I just delidded my i7 3770k. As soon as I put the blade to the CPU, I was thinking that maybe this is not a good idea!
Anyway, here it is: (Image coming soon)

OCN name: BradleyW
CPU: 3770k
On die-TIM: CL-ULTRA
IHS-TIM: Thermalright CF III
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: N/A
Temp drops: 21c


----------



## dmanstasiu

The little light that goes on in your head saying "Why am I sticking a razor blade into a $300 CPU ... oh right"


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> The little light that goes on in your head saying "Why am I sticking a razor blade into a $300 CPU ... oh right"


Just close your eyes....


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> The little light that goes on in your head saying "Why am I sticking a razor blade into a $300 CPU ... oh right"


Yeah! I'm lucky though. There was not a single mark on the PCB after I was done. I also have a 21-22c decrease at full load so I will be overclocking it higher soon.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Congrats Bradley!







You lucky son of a gun








I delidded it ok but wrecked my board...I should have waited one more week to further concentrate and do it more relaxed. I was shaking pretty badly atm. :/
Lesson learned, plus I stumbled upon great and safe delidding methods here.

What method did you use?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Just close your eyes....


lol. noooo dont do that!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Yeah! I'm lucky though. There was not a single mark on the PCB after I was done. I also have a 21-22c decrease at full load so I will be overclocking it higher soon.


20c drop aint it beautifull


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Thats pretty epic. But is all that rad space for just the CPU? Are you going to put the GPU's in that loop at some point?


Yes i will add gpus at some point


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Valguar - I'm going to render a video today.
> I'll privately upload the video + commentary and then publically release it at a later point.


Okay let me know and I'll look at it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


nice dude!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> OCN name: Evil Genius Jr
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: CL-Pro
> ihs-TIM: CL-Pro
> Mhz gained: N/A (needs more testing)
> OC after delid: N/A (needs more testing)
> Temp drops: *23c*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Your In!







Now Throw that sig on and show what you've done!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol. noooo dont do that!


...keep bandages handy as I actually delidded in the dark


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Congrats Bradley!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You lucky son of a gun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I delidded it ok but wrecked my board...I should have waited one more week to further concentrate and do it more relaxed. I was shaking pretty badly atm. :/
> Lesson learned, plus I stumbled upon great and safe delidding methods here.
> 
> What method did you use?


I used a flimsy razor blade and wiggled into a random corner. Once in, I rotated it so it would cut slightly into the side. I then used a small knife to push the razor into the side of the CPU. I repeated this process to help cut through the adheasive. From this, i used the knife to prize the IHS off carefully. It just lifted gently off. Only 1 cut from the process to my finger when I pushed the razor into the CPU/IHS corner.


----------



## Hokies83

Im only like 5 c over delta at idle lol..

And prime 95 maxing out at 55cish avg among cores with 1.53v pumping to it....

Moar rads,


----------



## BradleyW

What is the average Vcore needed for 4.8Ghz?
Thank you.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> OMG!
> I just delidded my i7 3770k. As soon as I put the blade to the CPU, I was thinking that maybe this is not a good idea!
> Anyway, here it is: (Image coming soon)
> 
> OCN name: BradleyW
> CPU: 3770k
> On die-TIM: CL-ULTRA
> IHS-TIM: Thermalright CF III
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: N/A
> Temp drops: 21c


You're In!







sorry about the wait lol page had to update







Slappa dat sig man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> What is the average Vcore needed for 4.8Ghz?
> Thank you.


around 1.4 - 1.44 area some see 1.47


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im only like 5 c over delta at idle lol..
> 
> And prime 95 maxing out at 55cish avg among cores with 1.53v pumping to it....
> 
> Moar rads,


Good Lord! LOL, MOAR VOLTS MOAR SPEEDZ!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> What is the average Vcore needed for 4.8Ghz?
> Thank you.


Eh, that's tough to answer. I've seen that range from 1.26v to Impossible. But I guess on average like 1.4v..


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry about the wait lol page had to update
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa dat sig man!
> around 1.4 - 1.44 area some see 1.47


#I am able to hit 4.7Ghz at around 1.32v (I think....or it could have been more) so hopefully I can get a decent speed.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I got 4.7 at 1.37v 24hs stable...pre-delid.
I needed 1.48v for 5ghz and 1.55v for 5.1ghz but couldn't stress test, I only tried running 3d benchies.


----------



## Joa3d43

*Next Year's Delidding ?*

...from the department of are you going to believe the rumour I'm about to start...









On two occasions today, I heard from people 'in the industry' that:

1.) Haswell may have been delayed a bit further in order to get a bigger performance lead over IvyB
2.) There may be no IvyB-E but Haswell-E instead
3.) The next performance chipset will be called X99 (replacing X79); while upper middle segment will be Z87 (replacing Z77)

Re 1, the problem is that Haswell and IvyB are too close together in performance (except iGPU graphics). This graph from a month ago is reportedly re an engineering sample (2.8GHZ, just like the IvyB counter part in this test)




...if you look at the number of folks just in this thread that are running their IvyB's at 4.8 or faster, it does become clearer that there may be a marketing problem to release a 'new chip' that tops out at 3.9 / T.

...that said, Intel can easily adjust Haswell speed via some of the steps we have been discussing (diff. TIM / gap), because nobody in their right mind believes that they are going back to tape-out. Either way, Haswell will be much more powerful on the iGPU side, giving lower to mid-range AMD / NVidia s.th. to worry about though the performance crowd like us would use single or multiple discreet GPUs anyways.

On 2.) and 3.), Intel already has filed trade papers that confirm that the next '-E' will be LG2011 (in addition to Xeon versions of course)...and X99 boards are apparently being prepped already re memory compatibility etc - that does not explain though whether the next '-E' is IvyB-E or an updated Haswell-E.

...bottom line: Keep your razor blades and Coollaboratory 'sauces' ready...in well less than a year, you might be at it again...and remember the intro folks, rumours only for now


----------



## Zeek

Sig rig chip is dead. Kinda over did it, again


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Sig rig chip is dead. Kinda over did it, again


...ahem, my condolences







- what happened re. 'kinda over did it' - too many voltskies or too deep a razor cut ?


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...ahem, my condolences
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - what happened re. 'kinda over did it' - too many voltskies or too deep a razor cut ?


Voltages again. Chip just hits a wall at 4.8. Anyway I was going to return it this weekend and get a new chip. Guess I'll just return it as dead and get a free one







MicroCenter <3


----------



## fa5terba11

Almost asked a dumb question about whether you put the heat spreader back on after delidding and applying better themal compound?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Voltages again. Chip just hits a wall at 4.8. Anyway I was going to return it this weekend and get a new chip. Guess I'll just return it as dead and get a free one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MicroCenter <3


well in that case







. ...you sound like a happy widower getting ready for a new date


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> well in that case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . ...you sound like a happy widower getting ready for a new date


And hopefully this will be a good date and she'll let me take her clothes off









Seriously tho, I hope I get a good chip so I can finally take a stab at deliding


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Next Year's Delidding ?*
> 
> ...from the department of are you going to believe the rumour I'm about to start...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On two occasions today, I heard from people 'in the industry' that:
> 
> 1.) Haswell may have been delayed a bit further in order to get a bigger performance lead over IvyB
> 2.) There may be no IvyB-E but Haswell-E instead
> 3.) The next performance chipset will be called X99 (replacing X79); while upper middle segment will be Z87 (replacing Z77)
> 
> Re 1, the problem is that Haswell and IvyB are too close together in performance (except iGPU graphics). This graph from a month ago is reportedly re an engineering sample (2.8GHZ, just like the IvyB counter part in this test)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...if you look at the number of folks just in this thread that are running their IvyB's at 4.8 or faster, it does become clearer that there may be a marketing problem to release a 'new chip' that tops out at 3.9 / T.
> 
> ...that said, Intel can easily adjust Haswell speed via some of the steps we have been discussing (diff. TIM / gap), because nobody in their right mind believes that they are going back to tape-out. Either way, Haswell will be much more powerful on the iGPU side, giving lower to mid-range AMD / NVidia s.th. to worry about though the performance crowd like us would use single or multiple discreet GPUs anyways.
> 
> On 2.) and 3.), Intel already has filed trade papers that confirm that the next '-E' will be LG2011 (in addition to Xeon versions of course)...and X99 boards are apparently being prepped already re memory compatibility etc - that does not explain though whether the next '-E' is IvyB-E or an updated Haswell-E.
> 
> ...bottom line: Keep your razor blades and Coollaboratory 'sauces' ready...in well less than a year, you might be at it again...and remember the intro folks, rumours only for now


haha cheers for the info







!
To be honest that performance increase isn't enough for even hardcore gamers to buy it.
Maybe HC overclockers might be interested...but that's it.

As for pricing, it will probably be more expensive, like anything new in this world.
If people are really concerned about the GPU - they could be a lowkey GPU and they'll beat the performance given.

For me technology, especially in mobiles and computers is FAR AHEAD for what consumers need or want - of course there are the extremes and enthusiasts etc, but generally speaking, the huge portion of the market, won't be interested in a 8core phone, nor a 12core CPU for a PC.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Awesome build *Hokies83*.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im only like 5 c over delta at idle lol..
> 
> And prime 95 maxing out at 55cish avg among cores with 1.53v pumping to it....
> 
> Moar rads,


I was thinking maybe needs some more fans???
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Next Year's Delidding ?*
> 
> ...from the department of are you going to believe the rumour I'm about to start...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On two occasions today, I heard from people 'in the industry' that:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 1.) Haswell may have been delayed a bit further in order to get a bigger performance lead over IvyB
> 2.) There may be no IvyB-E but Haswell-E instead
> 3.) The next performance chipset will be called X99 (replacing X79); while upper middle segment will be Z87 (replacing Z77)
> 
> Re 1, the problem is that Haswell and IvyB are too close together in performance (except iGPU graphics). This graph from a month ago is reportedly re an engineering sample (2.8GHZ, just like the IvyB counter part in this test)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...if you look at the number of folks just in this thread that are running their IvyB's at 4.8 or faster, it does become clearer that there may be a marketing problem to release a 'new chip' that tops out at 3.9 / T.
> 
> ...that said, Intel can easily adjust Haswell speed via some of the steps we have been discussing (diff. TIM / gap), because nobody in their right mind believes that they are going back to tape-out. Either way, Haswell will be much more powerful on the iGPU side, giving lower to mid-range AMD / NVidia s.th. to worry about though the performance crowd like us would use single or multiple discreet GPUs anyways.
> 
> On 2.) and 3.), Intel already has filed trade papers that confirm that the next '-E' will be LG2011 (in addition to Xeon versions of course)...and X99 boards are apparently being prepped already re memory compatibility etc - that does not explain though whether the next '-E' is IvyB-E or an updated Haswell-E.
> 
> ...bottom line: Keep your razor blades and Coollaboratory 'sauces' ready...in well less than a year, you might be at it again...and remember the intro folks, rumours only for now


Thanks for the update *Joa3d43*. +Rep
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Sig rig chip is dead. Kinda over did it, again


*Zeek*, what was the vcore that killed it? Don't worry, a bunch of us here have been at 1.65v or more (some much more....), so we have risked the same thing ourselves, but the data point of what did in your chip would be nice to know. Thanks.


----------



## Hokies83

32 fans is enough for me lol..

It is built for silence and all those fans make about as much noise as i can take lol.

Plus the results are great but p/p would be better.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

I feel like doing it to my 3770K. Nothing to do and need some kind of project. To get MAX temp drop what thermal paste do i need? Also what kind of razer should i use?


----------



## phillyd

Had to go back to stock cooling for a bit


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Had to go back to stock cooling for a bit


Why ?


----------



## phillyd

The CLC was a friend's and it sold, the CM V6 went back into his build which is being sold, he needs money for senior trip.


----------



## Joa3d43

*Questions on post-delid - running CPU die 'naked'*









After checking and reapplying CL-U to my delidded CPU yesterday, I noticed that the IHS is quite curved, both below (die-to-IHS) and above (IHS-to-w-c block)...clearly supported by the stain patterns of TIM...even lapping might not get it, especially on the IHS underside, even though my temps are very good already and cores fairly well balanced

There are a few folks here that have run their delidded CPU 'naked' / IHS-free. First, I am wondering whether I have to remove the CPU lock-down mechanism (including the front screw) from the mobo, or does the naked die still protrude enough to get good contact with the CPU pins in the socket ?

That segways into the second question: Running naked will apparently take several tries of 'no boot', or any partial boot before freeze - usually a sign that the contact with the pins is not right.

Those folks who have actually done this (either successfully or not) can you share what to watch out for, what to remove and how to apply the 'right' pressure ? Thanks in advance


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *PCWargamer* wrote...*Zeek*, what was the vcore that killed it? Don't worry, a bunch of us here have been at 1.65v or more (some much more....), so we have risked the same thing ourselves, but the data point of what did in your chip would be nice to know. Thanks:


^^^ indeed, at what point did the guillotine 'come down' ? My board (ROG MVE) comes with the OC key, and once my build is finished, I'm thinking I might pump it up some more







with that OC key which makes it very easy to go overboard


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I feel like doing it to my 3770K. Nothing to do and need some kind of project. To get MAX temp drop what thermal paste do i need? Also what kind of razer should i use?


I like Ultra, others like Pro, close to the same temp wise depending on who is testing. One edged razor, one that is used for shaving so it is sharp and thin. Just don't let the edges of the razor touch the pcb, you only need the middle part of the blade.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Questions on post-delid - running CPU die 'naked'*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After checking and reapplying CL-U to my delidded CPU yesterday, I noticed that the IHS is quite curved, both below (die-to-IHS) and above (IHS-to-w-c block)...clearly supported by the stain patterns of TIM...even lapping might not get it, especially on the IHS underside, even though my temps are very good already and cores fairly well balanced
> 
> There are a few folks here that have run their delidded CPU 'naked' / IHS-free. First, I am wondering whether I have to remove the CPU lock-down mechanism (including the front screw) from the mobo, or does the naked die still protrude enough to get good contact with the CPU pins in the socket ?
> 
> That segways into the second question: Running naked will apparently take several tries of 'no boot', or any partial boot before freeze - usually a sign that the contact with the pins is not right.
> 
> Those folks who have actually done this (either successfully or not) can you share what to watch out for, what to remove and how to apply the 'right' pressure ? Thanks in advance


It's funny, you said basically the exact same thing I did awhile back, and then asked the same question. Basically I agree, with the warped shape of an IHS both on top and bottom, removing it should help.

MikeG is the expert. He should be along to answer your question better, but he got something like 8c better by direct die, and yes you remove the clamp but that is easy to do. The pressure is the hard part, just a little at a time until it boots. He said once you get used to your cooler and the proper pressure it isn't that hard. I would think measuring out some spacers and working that into the mounting bracket to keep you from putting too much pressure might be a good idea. The majority here disagree with the risk/reward, but it worked for him.

Here is a thread to look at:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> It's funny, you said basically the exact same thing I did awhile back, and then asked the same question. Basically I agree, with the warped shape of an IHS both on top and bottom, removing it should help.
> 
> MikeG is the expert. He should be along to answer your question better, but he got something like 8c better by direct die, and yes you remove the clamp but that is easy to do. The pressure is the hard part, just a little at a time until it boots. He said once you get used to your cooler and the proper pressure it isn't that hard. I would think measuring out some spacers and working that into the mounting bracket to keep you from putting too much pressure might be a good idea. The majority here disagree with the risk/reward, but it worked for him.
> 
> Here is a thread to look at:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595


...Thanks, I'm looking forward to what MikeG will say...and the link is helpful though I had re-read it last night....Anandtech is a great source. My question is a little bit different though from the previous time you refer to:

I have seen info from Europe(Germany) whereby some get the IHS-free arrangement to work WITH the socket retainer mechanism in place (?) but it really seems to be just a few folks who manage to get good pin contact that way...the advantage is that the mechanism acts as a natural spacer - but again, only for a few folks - seems to be hit and miss.

There was also another chap who had actually machined the bottom of his water-block just a bit so that the inner part extended a little deeper and the outer (original) part sat on the CPU retainer / socket mechanism - but for that you need some good CNS tools and skills.


----------



## justanoldman

OT again, but since there are some benchers here, does windows 7 without SP1 help raise scores, and if so why?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> OT again, but since there are some benchers here, does windows 7 without SP1 help raise scores, and if so why?


For benching, I'd just get a stripped Win Installation. Makes a huge difference. You can talk to Val or someone more into benching about which one to specifically get.


----------



## Hokies83

Welp i think my IC diamond tim was bad lol...

I had the cap off it and used the very last in the tube on my block "thought it was a bit stiff"

So i snagged some PK-1 since a hear great things about it...

I do not want to stain my Fancy Water block with LU / LP heh.


----------



## Xinoxide

Currently Direct Die with liquid Ultra.

Temps before at 5GHz @ 1.43 were reaching 104C quite quickly.

Right now the loop isn't quite bled out, and I'm stressing max 68C. ( I kind of need a little extra heat to set the CLU right? )

Edit: Oh yeah...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> OT again, but since there are some benchers here, does windows 7 without SP1 help raise scores, and if so why?


yes the less files that are running the better the scores thats why stripped OS's are nice to have but corrupt easily, I still need a nice XP one still, kept having issue one after the other and said screw it.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Currently Direct Die with liquid Ultra.
> 
> Temps before at 5GHz @ 1.43 were reaching 104C quite quickly.
> 
> Right now the loop isn't quite bled out, and I'm stressing max 68C. ( I kind of need a little extra heat to set the CLU right? )
> 
> Edit: Oh yeah...


Nice temps. What are you using to cool CPU?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> The CLC was a friend's and it sold, the CM V6 went back into his build which is being sold, he needs money for senior trip.


Ah, too bad to hear...Grab an el cheapo True Spirit 120 or something







The Mux-120 Black managed to get my 2600k to 5300mhz btw...Nice little beast.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> OT again, but since there are some benchers here, does windows 7 without SP1 help raise scores, and if so why?


You need:
-regular 64 bit win 7 with service pack 1 for 3d (easier to setup and works good, or Win 8 for newer 3dmark)
-Win 2003 server for 2d stuff (needs minor service stripping to work, already comes with some of the important tweaks premade by default. Use black viper's guide)
That should be plenty good for you, rely on blackviper's guide to further strip your benching oses and compare to your daily driver.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Currently Direct Die with liquid Ultra.
> 
> Temps before at 5GHz @ 1.43 were reaching 104C quite quickly.
> 
> Right now the loop isn't quite bled out, and I'm stressing max 68C. ( I kind of need a little extra heat to set the CLU right? )
> 
> Edit: Oh yeah...


Awesome man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yes the less files that are running the better the scores thats why stripped OS's are nice to have but corrupt easily, I still need a nice XP one still, kept having issue one after the other and said screw it.


You lazy bum xD
I got to get an ide cable to install win xp to my current p4 experiment...There's a Silver Arrow with a 120x38 fan on top of a Pentium 4 631, which looks funny. Horrid green board and all lol
Best part is when spun down the Nidec fan is dead silent







Take that you thin fan lovers


----------



## [CyGnus]

Hokies83 great job on your build it looks great







and the temps are simply brutal... 55c at 1.53v full load is insane lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Hokies83 great job on your build it looks great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and the temps are simply brutal... 55c at 1.53v full load is insane lol


Yeah dude seriously. I think we're all a bit jelly...

So I have defected to the Green Team. I can't afford to be a top bencher when it comes to GPUs so a single GPU solution on a single 1080p monitor is probably where I'll be for a while. I sold my reference 7970 and bought an open box Gigabyte GTX670 WF3. Didn't come out of pocket any, just a straight swap. I grew tired of waiting for AMD to release a decent driver. I'm tired of the texture flickering, screen tearing, and frame latency stutters.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, those things can be a pain at times...but well, if you got a good deal on the card it'll be plenty for 1080p gaming without going overboard with msaa (or using fxaa/txaa instead)


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Currently Direct Die with liquid Ultra.
> 
> Temps before at 5GHz @ 1.43 were reaching 104C quite quickly.
> 
> Right now the loop isn't quite bled out, and I'm stressing max 68C. ( I kind of need a little extra heat to set the CLU right? )
> 
> Edit: Oh yeah...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice temps. What are you using to cool CPU?
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Currently Direct Die with liquid Ultra.
> 
> Temps before at 5GHz @ 1.43 were reaching 104C quite quickly.
> 
> Right now the loop isn't quite bled out, and I'm stressing max 68C. ( I kind of need a little extra heat to set the CLU right? )
> 
> Edit: Oh yeah...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome man!
Click to expand...

Thanks guys. I just have a EK Coolstream XTX 360 feeding distilled to an EK supremacy full copper.

My case is a HACK-JOB, to fir the rad as well. If it weren't awesome it would be be embarrassing.

Hoping to get a black top for it, I got a good deal on the block and rad, and the block was new from RMA.


----------



## Lobsterman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Was hard to see on the video, but did you leave the drive bay cover in the toilet then?


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Zeek, what was the vcore that killed it? Don't worry, a bunch of us here have been at 1.65v or more (some much more....), so we have risked the same thing ourselves, but the data point of what did in your chip would be nice to know. Thanks.


It was probably more of the VTT or VCCSA voltage killing the chip. VTT was probably at 1.25 and VCCSA was at 1.2. Vcore somewhere around 1.7







It just posted, went past loading windows screen, then poof, dead


----------



## I_shot

4.9 ghz 1.352V 24/7



Look at GFLops Yuppi yey


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> 4.9 ghz 1.352V 24/7
> 
> 
> 
> Look at GFLops Yuppi yey


I can't reach 4.7ghz with 1.35v let alone hit those temps 0.0!


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Questions on post-delid - running CPU die 'naked'*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After checking and reapplying CL-U to my delidded CPU yesterday, I noticed that the IHS is quite curved, both below (die-to-IHS) and above (IHS-to-w-c block)...clearly supported by the stain patterns of TIM...even lapping might not get it, especially on the IHS underside, even though my temps are very good already and cores fairly well balanced
> 
> There are a few folks here that have run their delidded CPU 'naked' / IHS-free. First, I am wondering whether I have to remove the CPU lock-down mechanism (including the front screw) from the mobo, or does the naked die still protrude enough to get good contact with the CPU pins in the socket ?
> 
> That segways into the second question: Running naked will apparently take several tries of 'no boot', or any partial boot before freeze - usually a sign that the contact with the pins is not right.
> 
> Those folks who have actually done this (either successfully or not) can you share what to watch out for, what to remove and how to apply the 'right' pressure ? Thanks in advance


I'm hardly the expert on "direct die" Sonda5 is the real pioneer, I'm just following in his footsteps.

Yes, you must remove the ILM (Independant Loading Mechanism), or "CPU lock-down mechanism" as you call it, or the die will not make contact with the waterblock. Additionally, your cold plate, water block or other thermal solution will need to be capable of applying enough static compressive force as to electrically seat the processor onto the socket contacts. Intel defines this as a minimum of 311 Newtons [70 lbf], and a maximum 822 Newtons [185 lbf] total static compressive load (ILM plus Heatsink) for the 1155 socket. See http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/design-guides/3rd-gen-core-lga1155-socket-guide.pdf

I am using the EK-LGA115x TRUE Backplate on my motherboard and highly reccomend it, especially if you are going to go direct die. It just makes life a lot easier, and if you later decide to re-install the ILM, it is very easy to do. It is only $5.99 from Performance PCS:
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410&products_id=30745

This guide will show you how to remove the ILM:
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IM/EK-IM-3831109855553.pdf

It might help to get familiar with your motherboard's POST codes before you begin. Remove the memory and try to boot, see what happens; remove the CPU and try to boot. Also, make sure your system is stable, and do not try to boot directly into a highly overclocked setting right away. Pick a known good "default" BIOS setting, and set that as your default to boot into before you power down to begin delidding.

I am using the springs that came with my Koolance 380i to apply the loading. I gently set the waterblock on top of the die, tighten the thumbscrews until they just make contact with the springs, and then tighten the screws two or three turns in a cross pattern (two corners at a time), enough so that the springs are applying the force to the block, but not so much that they are fully compressed, maybe 1/4 to 1/2 compressed--just guessing.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I'm hardly the expert on "direct die" Valguar and/or Von Dutch here are the real pioneers, I'm just following in their footsteps.
> 
> Yes, you must remove the ILM (Independant Loading Mechanism), or "CPU lock-down mechanism" as you call it, or the die will not make contact with the waterblock. Additionally, your cold plate, water block or other thermal solution will need to be capable of applying enough static compressive force as to electrically seat the processor onto the socket contacts. Intel defines this as a minimum of 311 Newtons [70 lbf], and a maximum 822 Newtons [185 lbf] total static compressive load (ILM plus Heatsink) for the 1155 socket. See http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/design-guides/3rd-gen-core-lga1155-socket-guide.pdf
> 
> I am using the EK-LGA115x TRUE Backplate on my motherboard and highly reccomend it, especially if you are going to go direct die. It just makes life a lot easier, and if you later decide to re-install the ILM, it is very easy to do. It is only $5.99 from Performance PCS:
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410&products_id=30745
> 
> This guide will show you how to remove the ILM:
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IM/EK-IM-3831109855553.pdf
> 
> It might help to get familiar with your motherboard's POST codes before you begin. Remove the memory and try to boot, see what happens; remove the CPU and try to boot. Also, make sure your system is stable, and do not try to boot directly into a highly overclocked setting right away. Pick a known good "default" BIOS setting, and set that as your default to boot into before you power down to begin delidding.
> 
> I am using the springs that came with my Koolance 380i to apply the loading. I gently set the waterblock on top of the die, tighten the thumbscrews until they just make contact with the springs, and then tighten the screws two or three turns in a cross pattern (two corners at a time), enough so that the springs are applying the force to the block, but not so much that they are fully compressed, maybe 1/4 to 1/2 compressed--just guessing.


I would give sonda5 the credit on direct die


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> It was probably more of the VTT or VCCSA voltage killing the chip. VTT was probably at 1.25 and VCCSA was at 1.2. Vcore somewhere around 1.7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It just posted, went past loading windows screen, then poof, dead


...well at least you had some fun by the sounds of it ...I'm no expert on VTT, but from what I've read, anything over 1.21 is getting dicey @ 3770K / IMC, though the 1.7 vCore on non-extreme cooling was probably 'not helpful'







...I admire your guts, though


----------



## BradleyW

Good news, I seem to be looking stable so far at 1.27v (4.7Ghz HT) with 65c max temp. 62c average.


----------



## Zeek

Seems like we have a winner there, nice job


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would give sonda5 the credit on direct die


Ahh yes, I couldn't recall where I learned it from. I read it in one of the posts, but I believe you are right, and he also deserves credit for pointing out the EK True Backplate.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I'm hardly the expert on "direct die" Valguar and/or Von Dutch here are the real pioneers, I'm just following in their footsteps.
> 
> Yes, you must remove the ILM (Independant Loading Mechanism), or "CPU lock-down mechanism" as you call it, or the die will not make contact with the waterblock....This guide will show you how to remove the ILM:
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IM/EK-IM-3831109855553.pdf.


.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would give sonda5 the credit on direct die


First of all, thanks for the response(s) and the highly useful links









I'm considering it not so much because of temperatures which are quite good even in extended Intel stress tests on CPU and memory (temps don't even get to 70 C on any core at 5.0 GHZ) but because I have been doing some light benching at 5.3 and want to extend that to run some extended video benches as I am close to HWbot records for the card combo (670ies) I use....

...and I noticed the less than perfect contact patterns of TIM on both the top of the CPU die and the underside of the IHS...obviously, it is an old hat that there are some concave and convex forms which are more exaggerated with some chips, IHS and blocks than others, and eliminating the IHS altogether is one way of eliminating one such variable, even though it is not my preferred choice.

The pressure on the 'naked' CPU die is key also per your posts...as mentioned in another response I wrote earlier, I have read in some Euro sites that some folks have been able to run 'naked die / IHS-free' *without* removing the ILM...but they too were using a custom back plate and - this might be the difference - had a thin piece of copper the shape of the die in between (it was actually a temp sensor as far as I recall)...another interesting solution involved a slight machining of the water-block's outside rim, so to speak, taking off a few mm so that the water block could rest on the LM but had its 'inner parts' protrude just a bit - but that takes CNC equipment and skills (the same chap in Germany also had a small water jet setup he used to carve himself a water jacket for his GPUs







doesn't everybody ?







)

I think I will first try some lapping and see what the outcome of that is...then I have an extra Coollaboratory 'Alpheos' cooling block I'm not using right now block and as step 2 see if I cannot get it machined per above...I did find a small company here with the right kind of equipment...then try the 'naked die'. BTW, as to the suggestion of learning post codes upfront - great tip ! The board I use does give you a digital display of 'post codes', with a reference sheet in the manual (...as long as I see 'A0' at the end, I'm happy







)

But again, the links MikeG provided (ie pdf) are really helpful, ditto for sonda5's earlier posts on the topic...rep+









Bon weekend


----------



## jbmayes2000

What are delidded k series processors going for? Does it depend on what oc you get with it?


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jbmayes2000*
> 
> What are delidded k series processors going for? Does it depend on what oc you get with it?


Delidded status isn't worth much, really. It's all dependant on the overclock, otherwise you get marketprice without an OC. 3770k's are about $220-250 if you're lucky, and a 3570k is around $190-200


----------



## phillyd

I kind of like the thrill of the silicone lottery.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> I kind of like the thrill of the silicone lottery.


I've always lost it, lol. I've had one decent AMD chip and one decent Intel chip. Other than that all my chips have sucked


----------



## jbmayes2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Delidded status isn't worth much, really. It's all dependant on the overclock, otherwise you get marketprice without an OC. 3770k's are about $220-250 if you're lucky, and a 3570k is around $190-200


Price difference between 3570k @ 4.5 and @ 5.0?

I ask because I'm wondering if I delid and get a good OC could I sell or trade it for a 3770k (and in turn delid that for myself)

EDIT:
Thanks for answering by the way!


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> The pressure on the 'naked' CPU die is key also per your posts...as mentioned in another response I wrote earlier, I have read in some Euro sites that some folks have been able to run 'naked die / IHS-free' *without* removing the ILM...but they too were using a custom back plate and - this might be the difference - had a thin piece of copper the shape of the die in between (it was actually a temp sensor as far as I recall)...another interesting solution involved a slight machining of the water-block's outside rim, so to speak, taking off a few mm so that the water block could rest on the LM but had its 'inner parts' protrude just a bit - but that takes CNC equipment and skills (the same chap in Germany also had a small water jet setup he used to carve himself a water jacket for his GPUs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> doesn't everybody ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


That all sounds way more complicated than it need be. It's really not too difficult removing the ILM, just be sure to keep the cover on the socket so you don't accidentally drop one of the screws in there. Like I said, the EK backplate is perfect for this and doesn't cost much. The only problem I had the first time was in being overly cautious, I did not screw the waterblock down far enough. The CPU wasn't making good electrical contact with the socket, and I got a post code of 55 if memory serves me right. Now that I have done it several times, I can not think of any reason to go back to using a lid. I am probably applying just as much pressure to the die with my waterblock as the pressure applied by the IHS sitting directly on the die. It is so easy now to take it apart and put it back together. Maybe sonda5 can also weigh in.

Just as a footnote, I upgraded the tubing and compression fittings to 1/2 ID, 3/4 OD last weekend. I don't have much patience when it comes to mechanical things, and the tubing was a little tight to slide over the fittings not to mention trying to get my big hands in there to tighten down the compression nuts. I really had to manhandle it to get it on, and have bloody knuckles as proof. My waterblock was mounted to the die at the time, which in hindsight, was probably not a good idea. I was really surprised that it booted right up without any problem.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jbmayes2000*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Delidded status isn't worth much, really. It's all dependant on the overclock, otherwise you get marketprice without an OC. 3770k's are about $220-250 if you're lucky, and a 3570k is around $190-200
> 
> 
> 
> Price difference between 3570k @ 4.5 and @ 5.0?
> 
> I ask because I'm wondering if I delid and get a good OC could I sell or trade it for a 3770k (and in turn delid that for myself)
> 
> EDIT:
> Thanks for answering by the way!
Click to expand...

3570k ... not much. People who want performance go for 3770k's right off the bat. I'd give you $180 for it though


----------



## lilchronic

id sell my 3570k @5ghz with 1.37v for no less than







400$


----------



## c2thew

http://www.ebay.com/itm/330617213128?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Is this what you could possibly use for padding using the direct die mounting method? I don't plan to do so anytime soon, but i wanted to poke at the possibility.


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> id sell my 3570k @5ghz with 1.37v for no less than
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 400$


GLWS


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> GLWS


lol well if i didnt destroy my fisrt chip deliding, i wouldent of never had to spend ANOTHER 200$ on a 2nd 3570k. but im very happy with my chip its a lilbeast







its not for sale unless i get 400$ lolz


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> That all sounds way more complicated than it need be. It's really not too difficult removing the ILM, just be sure to keep the cover on the socket so you don't accidentally drop one of the screws in there. Like I said, the EK backplate is perfect for this and doesn't cost much. The only problem I had the first time was in being overly cautious, I did not screw the waterblock down far enough. The CPU wasn't making good electrical contact with the socket, and I got a post code of 55 if memory serves me right. Now that I have done it several times, I can not think of any reason to go back to using a lid. I am probably applying just as much pressure to the die with my waterblock as the pressure applied by the IHS sitting directly on the die. It is so easy now to take it apart and put it back together. Maybe sonda5 can also weigh in.
> 
> Just as a footnote, I upgraded the tubing and compression fittings to 1/2 ID, 3/4 OD last weekend. I don't have much patience when it comes to mechanical things, and the tubing was a little tight to slide over the fittings not to mention trying to get my big hands in there to tighten down the compression nuts. I really had to manhandle it to get it on, and have bloody knuckles as proof. My waterblock was mounted to the die at the time, which in hindsight, was probably not a good idea. I was really surprised that it booted right up without any problem.


Thanks for the extra info, MikeG ...re your footnote, after having 'wrestled a python' in place per 1/2 inch inner 3/4 inch outer diameter hoses myself this week, I don't want to think about taking it off again soon


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I don't know what to say about my Antec really - but I'm on stock voltages at stock clocks with the antec + normal fans:
http://www.overclock.net/t/990111/official-antec-k-hler-h2o-620-920-owners-club/3840#post_19415591

58c de-lidded of course.
I'm a little speechless for the time being, as my temps before I sent it to be RMA'ed (nothing was exchanged) - the temps were much higher - Could be WU related.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Seems like we have a winner there, nice job


Still going strong here at 4.7Ghz HT full load. 65c average and 1.27v-1.28v.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Still going strong here at 4.7Ghz HT full load. 65c average and 1.27v-1.28v.


Your temps seem pretty damn good. You could push it a little more if you wanted to, but I'm sure you knew that.

Both of my chips need more than 1.32 for 4.7, so I hate you


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Your temps seem pretty damn good. You could push it a little more if you wanted to, but I'm sure you knew that.
> 
> Both of my chips need more than 1.32 for 4.7, so I hate you


lol, \i know for a fact my chips only need 1.24v but I added a bit extra as I plan to try for a higher speed. My min target is 4.8Ghz and the speed I would love is 5Ghz+. Looks like i have a very good chip that was just limited by the cheap paste before deliding.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> lol, \i know for a fact my chips only need 1.24v but I added a bit extra as I plan to try for a higher speed. My min target is 4.8Ghz and the speed I would love is 5Ghz+. Looks like i have a very good chip that was just limited by the cheap paste before deliding.


I'm sure you'll be able to hit 4.8, probably even 4.9 since the temps seem good. For 5 you might need to change the TIM on the CPU. What did you use on the die?


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm sure you'll be able to hit 4.8, probably even 4.9 since the temps seem good. For 5 you might need to change the TIM on the CPU. What did you use on the die?


CL Ultra on die
CF III on IHS


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm sure you'll be able to hit 4.8, probably even 4.9 since the temps seem good. For 5 you might need to change the TIM on the CPU. What did you use on the die?
> 
> 
> 
> CL Ultra on die
> CF III on IHS
Click to expand...

Most recommend CLP on die.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> CL Ultra on die
> CF III on IHS


Most people use CLP on die, but I'll also be using CLU on my die when I delid. Will probably use some MX-4 on IHS, not sure yet tho. Have to see what MC has in stock.


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Most people use CLP on die, but I'll also be using CLU on my die when I delid. Will probably use some MX-4 on IHS, not sure yet tho. Have to see what MC has in stock.


the best microcenter has is mx-4


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Most recommend CLP on die.


Why, because it is cheaper?


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> the best microcenter has is mx-4


Yea, I thought so. Wasn't sure tho









Edit: errmergard


----------



## dmanstasiu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Most recommend CLP on die.
> 
> 
> 
> Why, because it is cheaper?
Click to expand...

Because it has a higher thermal conductivity transfer rating. 37 vs 82 mk/h something


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Yea, I thought so. Wasn't sure tho
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: errmergard


...is that your new 'date taking her cloth off', per earlier post ?









re MX4 and CL, MX4 is the 'next best thing'...I have used it before on die and IHS - probably will cost you 3 to 8 C for both...in some HWbot member YouTube tests I posted earlier, MX4 actually beats CL-P though not CL-U, but there are other tests that show the opposite...bottom line, MX4 is way better than MX2 (had both) and the closest thing to CL while also not being conductive and non-capacitive....and it is easy to clean off later when your CL products arrive


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...is that your new 'date taking her cloth off', per earlier post ?


Nope. I plan on getting a new one tomorrow, well unless it snows. I was just wondering if it was hard to get the blade in. Went in quite quick tho.









And I'm probably gonna use CLU on the die and MX-4 on the IHS. I'm always swapping CPU coolers and I think it would just be easier like that.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks for the extra info, MikeG ...re your footnote, after having 'wrestled a python' in place per 1/2 inch inner 3/4 inch outer diameter hoses myself this week, I don't want to think about taking it off again soon


Yeah but definitely worth the trouble. That orange tubing sure looks sexy.


----------



## stickg1

Val if you don't delid this weekend I'm gonna flip out


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> It was probably more of the VTT or VCCSA voltage killing the chip. VTT was probably at 1.25 and VCCSA was at 1.2. Vcore somewhere around 1.7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It just posted, went past loading windows screen, then poof, dead


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Nope. I plan on getting a new one tomorrow, well unless it snows. I was just wondering if it was hard to get the blade in. Went in quite quick tho.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I'm probably gonna use CLU on the die and MX-4 on the IHS. I'm always swapping CPU coolers and I think it would just be easier like that.


Take it easy on the voltage with the new one, 1.2V vccio & 1.1V vccsa should be enough for 6ghz + with 2800Mhz memory. Vcore will still need what it needs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Good news, I seem to be looking stable so far at 1.27v (4.7Ghz HT) with 65c max temp. 62c average.


Nice, sounding like a pretty good chip!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Val if you don't delid this weekend I'm gonna flip out


KEEP CALM and Wayne Rooney


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> KEEP CALM and Wayne Rooney


Wayne Rooney and I are gonna freekick Val in the nards if that damn CPU isn't cut in half by this time Sunday!!! You've been warned!


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Take it easy on the voltage with the new one, 1.2V vccio & 1.1V vccsa should be enough for 6ghz + with 2800Mhz memory. Vcore will still need what it needs.


No worries, everything will be fine this time


----------



## ivanlabrie

Awesome find here...

I registered at SPCR (long time lurker), found some neat stuff over there.


----------



## FtW 420

Those do look pretty cool, I'd try an assortment pack of the different sizes.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome find here...
> 
> I registered at SPCR (long time lurker), found some neat stuff over there.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Those do look pretty cool, I'd try an assortment pack of the different sizes.


I don't understand, are they just bendable heat-pipes? I got confused when they said Phase Change. What's going on with those?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Awesome find here...
> 
> I registered at SPCR (long time lurker), found some neat stuff over there.


...TX...great info







...bookmarked it for further look-see


----------



## ivanlabrie

@Stick: bendable heatpipes...heatpipes use phase change to cool basically. Low pressure state water boils at lower temps and thus changes phases inside the sealed pipe. The vapor goes to the area where it makes contact with something like a fin stack and it goes back to liquid form to begin the process again.
So we're all basically running some form of water cooling in fact xD


----------



## FtW 420

Looks like it can just stick on where extra cooling might be needed, for me I'd like to try it for gpu vrm cooling at least. Any surface that feels hot should be able to get better cooling as long as the strips can be bent to fit.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Val if you don't delid this weekend I'm gonna flip out


Take it easy there champ








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> KEEP CALM and Wayne Rooney


he better keep calm!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Wayne Rooney and I are gonna freekick Val in the nards if that damn CPU isn't cut in half by this time Sunday!!! You've been warned!


hey buddy, my nards will be touched by no one, except the lady.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks like it can just stick on where extra cooling might be needed, for me I'd like to try it for gpu vrm cooling at least. Any surface that feels hot should be able to get better cooling as long as the strips can be bent to fit.


VRMS for gpus and other end touches Ln2 pot. your welcome


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Take it easy there champ
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> he better keep calm!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hey buddy, my nards will be touched by no one, except the lady.
> VRMS for gpus and other end touches Ln2 pot. your welcome


It's a heat pipe cooler, you don't want it getting too cold, they don't work as well frozen. But they should work better than the ramsinks I currently use.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's a heat pipe cooler, you don't want it getting too cold, they don't work as well frozen. But they should work better than the ramsinks I currently use.


even if they are frosen the heat will be distriputed from the gpu put as well to the vrms (said it backwards)


----------



## Belial

I get Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for $8 (amazon points on card dropped it from $16ish).

I test my pk-3 delid i7, at [email protected]

Max temp 105*C?, I had throttling on the 3rd core, the rest of the cores were like 98-99.

Then I put CLU on both die and ihs. I put a tiny drop on die, spread it, then what's the brush, i spread under ihs. You really don't need much of this stuff at all. Then I put a similarly, but slightly larger tiny drop on ihs, spread it all over.

Before


After


I have max temp of 77*C. a ~30*C temp drop doesn't really sound right, especially since I tested [email protected] before and ran a 24 hour p95 test even on that setting with a max temp of 89*C. So I don't know what happened, I didn't reset the cooler or anything....

But I'd say I got a temp drop of ~12*C going to coollaboratory liquid ultra.

I'll post my 24/7 prime95 overclock on this cpu later. Just got a new PSU because I had a faulty one before, I'm sure this chip can do 4.9ghz if not 5+, on reasonable voltages.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Yeah but definitely worth the trouble. That orange tubing sure looks sexy.


...thanks...works for me







plus, I have a *whole other roll of tubing left for when I do the second loop for the GPUs* (if need be re longer bridges)...the top two cards are getting really hot (no surprise there as they can't breath - 40 C MORE than the bottom card







). Still, even with throttling on the GPUs via heat and nowhere near top speed settings for vid/CPU, getting there:


----------



## valkeriefire

^^^ Impressive results Belial. I need to order some CLU ASAP.

What is the consensus on temps increasing after delidding? By that I mean, do temps regularly go up after the initial drop after some delidds? If so, is this due to not using CLU? Is the IHS shifting under the heatsink, or is all the Tim squeezing out or something. I've read a few post by people who say their temps slowly crept back up. Is this a normal phenomenon?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> ^^^ Impressive results Belial. I need to order some CLU ASAP.
> 
> What is the consensus on temps increasing after delidding? By that I mean, do temps regularly go up after the initial drop after some delidds? If so, is this due to not using CLU? Is the IHS shifting under the heatsink, or is all the Tim squeezing out or something. I've read a few post by people who say their temps slowly crept back up. Is this a normal phenomenon?


...very much depends on the TIM - with MX4, CLU and CLP (I have used all of them), temp stayed low (if not dropped 1 c or so) over the review period (6 mth +)

...however, several posts re Artic Silver 5 and a few other TIMs seem to suggest that temps creep back up a bit


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay, so this is the most I got the better of those 2 i5 3570ks I had:
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: [email protected]
> Temp drops: ~15*C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> [email protected] was the most I could get that chip. I believe 4.7ghz would require around 1.51, 1.52vcore (was failing after 12 hours in p95 at 1.5).
> 
> However, I was able to exchange my i5-3570K (the bad one, the one I didn't delid) for an i7-3770k for $40 at MC, and then put the better, delidded i5-3570k in a build I made for someone else (they don't even know what overclocking is, I just did a 1ghz+ overclock for them for value).
> 
> This i7-3770K is just like my i5-3570K - boot up 4.5ghz, use GTL, got to 5ghz, freeze screen at 5.1ghz. Except it does that at 1.3vcore, instead of 1.5vcore ^^
> So I think I have a really, really good i7 here.
> 
> I have gone ahead and delidded it, as well as recorded a custom small fft temperature test on 4.5ghz/1.3vcore before, and after delidding.
> 
> OCN name: Belial
> CPU: i5-3770K
> on die-TIM: PK-3
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: -
> Temp drops: 15+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: -
> 
> Before Delid: 89*C max (wow 3770k is a lot hotter than 3570k, I was getting this kind of temp before delid at like 1.5vcore I think).
> After Delid: 76*C max (done the next day, in a room that's at least 5*F hotter...).
> 
> I believe the net result is somewhere between a 15-20*C temp drop. Those results are similar to what I believe I got last time, with the 3570k.
> 
> Pics:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will be playing around, I'll add a cpu validation for 24 hours and all that later.


Okay so I just tested [email protected] I'm not sure why I hit 105*C earlier on pk-3, but anyways, I ran [email protected] on this new CLU on die/CLU on IHS and my temp was 68*C.

So I think I got a 8*C temp drop going to CLU.

So I just want to say I was wrong about how awesome Coollaboratory liquid ultra is. It's by far a good investment over PK-3 or another high end thermal ceramique that you can get for under $3, despite the ~$20 cost of CLU. 8*C temp drop is similar to what you'd get going from a hyper 212 to a mid-high end cooler like an hr-02 macho, h80, frio extreme.... And that's over pk-3, so that's pretty insane.

So that'd put my total temp drop ~23*C from pk3 IHS lidded to non-delid CLU IHS/CLU on-die.

I told you guys I'd compare pk3 vs clu.

Anyways, I was wrong.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay so I just tested [email protected] I'm not sure why I hit 105*C earlier on pk-3, but anyways, I ran [email protected] on this new CLU on die/CLU on IHS and my temp was 68*C.
> 
> So I think I got a 8*C temp drop going to CLU.
> 
> So I just want to say I was wrong about how awesome Coollaboratory liquid ultra is. It's by far a good investment over PK-3 or another high end thermal ceramique that you can get for under $3, despite the ~$20 cost of CLU. 8*C temp drop is similar to what you'd get going from a hyper 212 to a mid-high end cooler like an hr-02 macho, h80, frio extreme.... And that's over pk-3, so that's pretty insane.
> 
> So that'd put my total temp drop ~23*C from pk3 IHS lidded to non-delid CLU IHS/CLU on-die.
> 
> I told you guys I'd compare pk3 vs clu.
> 
> Anyways, I was wrong.


...once I thought I was wrong, but I was mistaken









...a 23 degree C drop is almost identical what I got after delidding and adding it together with a prior CLU-on-IHS-to block test...by the time I added a custom water loop, it's lot more but delidding is by far the biggest contributor to temp drops...and CLU over MX4 yielded a netted-out 3.5 C.

Congrats on your great progress


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Seems like the i7 runs ridiculously hotter than an i5 - seriously 1.4v for the i5 and you see 70c temps - and for the i7 you see 90c+


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay so I just tested [email protected] I'm not sure why I hit 105*C earlier on pk-3, but anyways, I ran [email protected] on this new CLU on die/CLU on IHS and my temp was 68*C.
> 
> So I think I got a 8*C temp drop going to CLU.
> 
> So I just want to say I was wrong about how awesome Coollaboratory liquid ultra is. It's by far a good investment over PK-3 or another high end thermal ceramique that you can get for under $3, despite the ~$20 cost of CLU. 8*C temp drop is similar to what you'd get going from a hyper 212 to a mid-high end cooler like an hr-02 macho, h80, frio extreme.... And that's over pk-3, so that's pretty insane.
> 
> So that'd put my total temp drop ~23*C from pk3 IHS lidded to non-delid CLU IHS/CLU on-die.
> 
> I told you guys I'd compare pk3 vs clu.
> 
> Anyways, I was wrong.


updated! Thats why we all use CL stuff man. crazy things happen when we all love and cherish the CL man!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Seems like the i7 runs ridiculously hotter than an i5 - seriously 1.4v for the i5 and you see 70c temps - and for the i7 you see 90c+


Yea the cache and hyperthreading definitely make the i7 hotter than the i5. Not sure about a 20*C temp rise but it is hotter.
Quote:


> updated! Thats why we all use CL stuff man. crazy things happen when we all love and cherish the CL man!


No need to update, yet. I'll post when I get my final overclock and temps. I've 24 houred [email protected] just for a very conservative, baseline. I dont think 4.9 was stable at 1.4v but at 1.45 ive been trucking 2 hours already (on 2400 cl8-12-8-28 very tight secondary and tertiary timings too, 1.75v, either going to be very stupid waste of time or very lucky if i pass this run on both my first test on 4.9 and such tight secondary/tertiary timings but loosening to 28 from 27 helped me pass more than 2 hours right away). I think I can definitely get 4.9 to work on this chip under 1.5v, hopefully i'll be able to do 5ghz on less than 1.55v. I think 5.1 would be asking quite a lot, but maybe we'll see.


----------



## BradleyW

ok I am now testing at 4.8Ghz at 1.3v and my top temp is around 62c. This chip is the best I've ever had! I know for a fact that it does not need 1.3v but I am just uisng a bit more vcore for an easier OC.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I get Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for $8 (amazon points on card dropped it from $16ish).
> 
> I test my pk-3 delid i7, at [email protected]
> 
> Max temp 105*C?, I had throttling on the 3rd core, the rest of the cores were like 98-99.
> 
> Then I put CLU on both die and ihs. I put a tiny drop on die, spread it, then what's the brush, i spread under ihs. You really don't need much of this stuff at all. Then I put a similarly, but slightly larger tiny drop on ihs, spread it all over.
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> After
> 
> 
> I have max temp of 77*C. a ~30*C temp drop doesn't really sound right, especially since I tested [email protected] before and ran a 24 hour p95 test even on that setting with a max temp of 89*C. So I don't know what happened, I didn't reset the cooler or anything....
> 
> But I'd say I got a temp drop of ~12*C going to coollaboratory liquid ultra.
> 
> I'll post my 24/7 prime95 overclock on this cpu later. Just got a new PSU because I had a faulty one before, I'm sure this chip can do 4.9ghz if not 5+, on reasonable voltages.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay so I just tested [email protected] I'm not sure why I hit 105*C earlier on pk-3, but anyways, I ran [email protected] on this new CLU on die/CLU on IHS and my temp was 68*C.
> 
> So I think I got a 8*C temp drop going to CLU.
> 
> So I just want to say I was wrong about how awesome Coollaboratory liquid ultra is. It's by far a good investment over PK-3 or another high end thermal ceramique that you can get for under $3, despite the ~$20 cost of CLU. 8*C temp drop is similar to what you'd get going from a hyper 212 to a mid-high end cooler like an hr-02 macho, h80, frio extreme.... And that's over pk-3, so that's pretty insane.
> 
> So that'd put my total temp drop ~23*C from pk3 IHS lidded to non-delid CLU IHS/CLU on-die.
> 
> I told you guys I'd compare pk3 vs clu.
> 
> Anyways, I was wrong.


Glad to see you've come around! There's a reason we all use the stuff, it's pretty good in this particular application (on the die). Nice results, good work.


----------



## Belial

^ Thanks. Hopefully within the week I'll report my max overclock. If I'm lucky and I pass this 24 hours p95 with my ram as tight as it is, it means I'm all done with my ram overclocking because I've literally got every single secondary and tertiary timing down to 1 point from what it would boot from (well, ***c is at 100 instead of 133 and 74 wouldn't boot, and then for the t ref intervals i got 5200/45 and i could maybe go lower on those), like a handful of them are loosened 1 for stability (ie rrsr is 5 instead of 4, rwdrdd is 4 instead of 3). This [email protected] overclock is really more to test my ram but i threw in 4.9ghz on a rather high voltage because i wanted to test both at the same time.

if i fail this test i'll be pulling my hair out wondering if it's the ram or the cpu overclock and would run the cpu at stock on the same ram timings and likely fight it for a few days, haha.


Quote:


> ok I am now testing at 4.8Ghz at 1.3v and my top temp is around 62c. This chip is the best I've ever had! I know for a fact that it does not need 1.3v but I am just uisng a bit more vcore for an easier OC.


Screenie of 24 hour custom blend plz. I don't believe this is truly stable. I've had a couple ivies and the one I got here that can do [email protected] is a goldfind (I'm pretty sure it can do 5ghz around 1.5, 1.525v, which is what golden chips do).


----------



## Xinoxide

Hmmm... Mine is 5ghz on 1.45~ but is giving me a hard time over 5.2ghz.

Edit; I am on an oc formula. I need to stick my multimeter in it to really confirm its voltage.


----------



## Xinoxide

Dooop.


----------



## BradleyW

Hey everyone, I cannot seem to hit 4.8 ghz. The more vcore I add, the less stable it is. My temps are only 62c at that speed, even when I push up to 1.37vcore. Any tips to get this chip stable. It does not seem to like too much voltage here.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Hey everyone, I cannot seem to hit 4.8 ghz. The more vcore I add, the less stable it is. My temps are only 62c at that speed, even when I push up to 1.37vcore. Any tips to get this chip stable. It does not seem to like too much voltage here.


I need 1.41v for 4.8GHz, my previous chip wouldn't even post at 4.8GHz if I gave it 1.6v. Keep adding voltage until you get there. Then check temps and decide if that 100MHz is even worth it.


----------



## chronicfx

Anyone own a multimeter and know how to test vcore? PM me if you have a board other than Asrock and can check a vcore for me under load.


----------



## BradleyW

Here are my results atm. This is very strange!
4.8Ghz, LLC Extreme, PPL Overvolt Enabled, 62c max temp.

vcore 1.28 = 2 hours stable
vcore 1.35 = 5 seconds stable
vcore 1.37 = 2 seconds stable
vcore 1.4 or higher = 1 second stable.
The chip does not like voltage. This is why I only need 1.19v for 4.5Ghz!
Any other suggestions to help get to 4.8Ghz?
Thank you everyone


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks like it can just stick on where extra cooling might be needed, for me I'd like to try it for gpu vrm cooling at least. Any surface that feels hot should be able to get better cooling as long as the strips can be bent to fit.


Yeah, the guy has a ton of them to sell...they are really flexible and cool for 10usd a pop.
You want some?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Hmmm... Mine is 5ghz on 1.45~ but is giving me a hard time over 5.2ghz.
> 
> Edit; I am on an oc formula. I need to stick my multimeter in it to really confirm its voltage.


No worries, OC Formula is top of the crop like Maximus V Extreme and Gigabyte UP7.


----------



## Xinoxide

It makes me feel warm and fuzzy having my board compared to a up7.

I am determined to hit at least 5.4ghz.


----------



## Valgaur

welp....... I did it.... it's dead. I sneezed while delidding and i cut through 18 traces, shes dead, totally and completely.

I'm just kidding she's running amazingly well right now just trying to get my multi to freaking behave in bios for me.


----------



## lilchronic

its about time


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> welp....... I did it.... it's dead. I sneezed while delidding and i cut through 18 traces, shes dead, totally and completely.
> 
> I'm just kidding she's running amazingly well right now just trying to get my multi to freaking behave in bios for me.


LOL, I was gonna say, that must have been one hell of a sneeze and you should get that checked out. Anytime a sneeze makes you have an epileptic seizure you might have a problem.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> LOL, I was gonna say, that must have been one hell of a sneeze and you should get that checked out. Anytime a sneeze makes you have an epileptic seizure you might have a problem.


yeah no kidding! So far things are good and I have 20C drops but my ambients are higher than they were before so not perfect conditions I'd say probably around 25C drops area


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yeah no kidding! So far things are good and I have 20C drops but my ambients are higher than they were before so not perfect conditions I'd say probably around 25C drops area


Well I'm glad you got it done! Did you make a video?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> welp....... I did it.... it's dead. I sneezed while delidding and i cut through 18 traces, shes dead, totally and completely.
> I'm just kidding she's running amazingly well right now just trying to get my multi to freaking behave in bios for me.


hehe nice one bro!
Pics or it didn't happen - I need your application to put you in the OP (hahaha)

Re-flash the bios.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hehe nice one bro!
> Pics or it didn't happen - I need your application to put you in the OP (hahaha)
> 
> Re-flash the bios.


Yeah.. And use the right format.


----------



## lilchronic

just to refresh your memory lolz








For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Here are my results atm. This is very strange!
> 4.8Ghz, LLC Extreme, PPL Overvolt Enabled, 62c max temp.
> 
> vcore 1.28 = 2 hours stable
> vcore 1.35 = 5 seconds stable
> vcore 1.37 = 2 seconds stable
> vcore 1.4 or higher = 1 second stable.
> The chip does not like voltage. This is why I only need 1.19v for 4.5Ghz!
> Any other suggestions to help get to 4.8Ghz?
> Thank you everyone


Strange indeed, but maybe there is something else going on. I too have a golden chip and my voltages are very similar to yours yet I can get a pretty stable 5.0GHz and can even run some benchmarks at 5.2GHz. My voltages for comparison are:

Freq. ---- BIOS ---- CPUZ
4.5GHz -- 1.150V -- 1.144V
4.8GHz -- 1.290V -- 1.280V
5.0GHz -- 1.420V -- 1.408V

Where are you measuring your voltage--CPUZ? What test are you running and what kind of failure are you getting? If BSOD, what is the code? Check your frequency with CPUZ under load to make sure you are not throttling. I don't know your motherboard, but you want to make sure disable any over-voltage, or current limiting features. Also disable turbo and speedstep for now until you find out what's going on. Just use two DIMMs for now also at the default settings. PLL, VCCIO, and VCCSA can all be set at the default. Hope this helps.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Here are my results atm. This is very strange!
> 4.8Ghz, LLC Extreme, PPL Overvolt Enabled, 62c max temp.
> 
> vcore 1.28 = 2 hours stable
> vcore 1.35 = 5 seconds stable
> vcore 1.37 = 2 seconds stable
> vcore 1.4 or higher = 1 second stable.
> The chip does not like voltage. This is why I only need 1.19v for 4.5Ghz!
> Any other suggestions to help get to 4.8Ghz?
> Thank you everyone


Could your motherboard be overheating? Not so good power supply?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Could your motherboard be overheating? Not so good power supply?


A sniper and a corsair... unlikely I guess


----------



## BradleyW

It would seem anything higher than 1.31vcore gives the system a BSOD in 1 second. It can't handle vcore increases beyond this limit. Looks like I have the worst i7 on OCN......I have the worst luck......
BTW, I am using the onboard graphics. Could this be something to do with it? Or are there other settings I could try and turn on/increase to fix the issue? Clutching at straws here.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> It would seem anything higher than 1.31vcore gives the system a BSOD in 1 second. It can't handle vcore increases beyond this limit. Looks like I have the worst i7 on OCN......I have the worst luck......
> BTW, I am using the onboard graphics. Could this be something to do with it? Or are there other settings I could try and turn on/increase to fix the issue? Clutching at straws here.


Luckily for you 4.5ghz is more than enough for almost anything u do


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Luckily for you 4.5ghz is more than enough for almost anything u do


I'm not happy with 4.5GHz. My cards get choked in CPU demanding games such as crysis 3 and sleeping dogs. I drop to the 50's now and again unless I reduce CPU heavy settings. But I use vsync so i need to keep 60 at all times. Is there anything I can do at all to see if I can sort something out?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> welp....... I did it.... it's dead. I sneezed while delidding and i cut through 18 traces, shes dead, totally and completely.
> 
> [I'm just kidding she's running amazingly well right now just trying to get my multi to freaking behave in bios for me.


...I knew you were going to pull a 'small font' stunt like this - because you must have a sense of humour to run a thread like this







Congrats Mr. Valgaur - and welcome to the club (ha, I always wanted to say that)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I'm not happy with 4.5GHz. My cards get choked in CPU demanding games such as crysis 3 and sleeping dogs. I drop to the 50's now and again unless I reduce CPU heavy settings. But I use vsync so i need to keep 60 at all times. Is there anything I can do at all to see if I can sort something out?


Buy a new chip and hope you have better luck...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I'm not happy with 4.5GHz. My cards get choked in CPU demanding games such as crysis 3 and sleeping dogs. I drop to the 50's now and again unless I reduce CPU heavy settings. But I use vsync so i need to keep 60 at all times. Is there anything I can do at all to see if I can sort something out?


BradleyW...don't mean to sound patronizing in case you already checked, but the way you describe the 'hard wall' is a bit unusual...some BIOS have over current protection, CPU over-temp protection, over-voltage protection etc. etc. etc. ...just saying that that hard 1-sec shutdown is unusual and 'smells a bit' like a safety kicking in - either in BIOS or perhaps some win-based software such as Intel Extreme Tuning Utility (though the latter is limited at 1.525 and won't cause a hard shut down).

...just have a look again in all niches and cracks of your Bios / win settings to see if there is a hard limit setting.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well I'm glad you got it done! Did you make a video?


no i didnt as my phone didnt want to cooperate but with my other chip i can do a demonstration video as of how to do it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hehe nice one bro!
> Pics or it didn't happen - I need your application to put you in the OP (hahaha)
> 
> Re-flash the bios.


take it easy many pics for you!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Yeah.. And use the right format.


pfffft format?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just to refresh your memory lolz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> 
> Fixed
> 
> OCN name: Valgaur
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: 500 Mhz
> OC after delid: 5000 Mhz
> Temp drops: 25C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2714803
> 
> just threw volts on working at the moment on it.
> 
> You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I knew you were going to pull a 'small font' stunt like this - because you must have a sense of humour to run a thread like this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats Mr. Valgaur - and welcome to the club (ha, I always wanted to say that)


yeah I'm a humorous guy.









ALL THE PICTURES:













Frankys head is now on Athena....... wait... what?






see the differences of the IHS corners?



one thing though is that the TIM is much less these newer chips along with the amount of glue man.


----------



## MiiX

Delidded my Intel pentium D 915:

For training for the real challenge.
Well, I do not know if it works, heh


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> no i didnt as my phone didnt want to cooperate but with my other chip i can do a demonstration video as of how to do it.
> take it easy many pics for you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pfffft format?
> 
> yeah I'm a humorous guy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ALL THE PICTURES:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Frankys head is now on Athena....... wait... what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> see the differences of the IHS corners?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> one thing though is that the TIM is much less these newer chips along with the amount of glue man.


Those pics are clearly fakes, membership DENIED!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Those pics are clearly fakes, membership DENIED!


to bad i'm in the sheet


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Is 1.3V okay for 24/7 operation if temps are fine? used to AMD voltages lol.


----------



## phillyd

1.3v is very ok.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Great Thanks!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> to bad i'm in the sheet


We can fix that!! If we could just find the OP...hrmmmm


----------



## MiiX

Guys, im just wondering here, When delidded, do you guys apply `TIM to the core, then place the IHS on, then TIM again? Or do you TIM onto the core then forget about the IHS? If IHS is not used, wont there be a gap between the CPU PCB and the CPU-mount mechanism on the motherboard?


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Guys, im just wondering here, When delidded, do you guys apply `TIM to the core, then place the IHS on, then TIM again? Or do you TIM onto the core then forget about the IHS? If IHS is not used, wont there be a gap between the CPU PCB and the CPU-mount mechanism on the motherboard?


Yes, yes, and yes.

A select few are running without the IHS ( myself included ), in which case the CPU needs either a shim, or the clamping mechanism removed.


----------



## MiiX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Yes, yes, and yes.
> 
> A select few are running without the IHS ( myself included ), in which case the CPU needs either a shim, or the clamping mechanism removed.


Okay. What kind of shim do you use?

EDIT: If you use it.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Okay. What kind of shim do you use?
> 
> EDIT: If you use it.


I would just remove the locking mechanism because it's not going to be doing anything anyway. It only locks the chip in if the IHS is on the chip.


----------



## MiiX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I would just remove the locking mechanism because it's not going to be doing anything anyway. It only locks the chip in if the IHS is on the chip.


Great. I think I will do that. Any special TIM needed to when applied to the chip itself?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Great. I think I will do that. Any special TIM needed to when applied to the chip itself?


coolaboratory liquid pro for best results!


----------



## Agoniizing

What do you guys think? Is this good for a 3770k at 4.7ghz?


----------



## phillyd

looks pretty good to me, depends on cooling though. go fill out your sig rig.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> looks pretty good to me, depends on cooling though. go fill out your sig rig.


agreed need to know what you got but pretty good with that vcore and temps wise anyways.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> ^ Thanks. Hopefully within the week I'll report my max overclock. If I'm lucky and I pass this 24 hours p95 with my ram as tight as it is, it means I'm all done with my ram overclocking because I've literally got every single secondary and tertiary timing down to 1 point from what it would boot from (well, ***c is at 100 instead of 133 and 74 wouldn't boot, and then for the t ref intervals i got 5200/45 and i could maybe go lower on those), like a handful of them are loosened 1 for stability (ie rrsr is 5 instead of 4, rwdrdd is 4 instead of 3). This [email protected] overclock is really more to test my ram but i threw in 4.9ghz on a rather high voltage because i wanted to test both at the same time.
> 
> if i fail this test i'll be pulling my hair out wondering if it's the ram or the cpu overclock and would run the cpu at stock on the same ram timings and likely fight it for a few days, haha.
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ok I am now testing at 4.8Ghz at 1.3v and my top temp is around 62c. This chip is the best I've ever had! I know for a fact that it does not need 1.3v but I am just uisng a bit more vcore for an easier OC.
> 
> 
> 
> Screenie of 24 hour custom blend plz. I don't believe this is truly stable. I've had a couple ivies and the one I got here that can do [email protected] is a goldfind (I'm pretty sure it can do 5ghz around 1.5, 1.525v, which is what golden chips do).
Click to expand...

Failed at the 19th hour. Testing again at stock frequency because the ram timings are so close to done, pretty sure a fatal error, rounding .5, less than expected .4, is a ram issue, but i have no idea where to start and it could have been the cpu so gotta test it again, this time doing it the right way ;/


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> looks pretty good to me, depends on cooling though. go fill out your sig rig.


can you check my sig to see if i did it right? lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> coolaboratory liquid pro for best results!


...didn't you mean to say CoolLaboratory liquid ? Ultra







(Here we go again...)


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> can you check my sig to see if i did it right? lol


Not yet, try this:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Not yet, try this:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig


----------



## Totally Dubbed

So val, this is your second or first chip?


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> So val, this is your second or first chip?


Second.....I guess you never heard about Franky....and what happened to Franky...........


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PCWargamer*
> 
> Second.....I guess you never heard about Franky....and what happened to Franky...........


No what happened







?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> No what happened
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


Franky was a good chip but one day benching at the gym he tried too much vcore and died.

Edit : Franky is a legend here on OCN


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Haha








But I'm sorry to hear that


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> No what happened
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> 
> Franky was a good chip but one day benching at the gym he tried too much vcore and died.
> 
> Edit : Franky is a legend here on OCN
Click to expand...

What exactly happened? I've never heard about an ivy degrading or dying before. Although i do recall franky, i didnt ever know details or how he was ivy.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> What exactly happened? I've never heard about an ivy degrading or dying before. Although i do recall franky, i didnt ever know details or how he was ivy.


It was something in the order of 1.8 V


----------



## ivanlabrie

More like 1.9v or something... xD

Guess who's got a 3770k on it's way here? yeah, me, I know...not funny. meh









Now that I had gotten fond of my p4 631 and was about to recap a 7600gt I got lying here...
Guess I can still use that gpu with some dice on it (sandwich bag pot style)


----------



## problemgaming

I will be delidding my 3770k next weekend when my H220 comes in. However, I have a few questions.

1) How much thermal paste is needed on the TIM and IHS. I will be using CooLaboratory liquid ultra.
2) How should I apply the thermal paste? Line method? Rice ball? Smooth it out with the brush included in the liquid ultra kit?

Thanks ahead of time for all assistance.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *problemgaming*
> 
> I will be delidding my 3770k next weekend when my H220 comes in. However, I have a few questions.
> 
> 1) How much thermal paste is needed on the TIM and IHS. I will be using CooLaboratory liquid ultra.
> 2) How should I apply the thermal paste? Line method? Rice ball? Smooth it out with the brush included in the liquid ultra kit?


1 - Just a tiny little drop
2- Use the tip provided in the CLP/U Kit

CLP Video:


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> What exactly happened? I've never heard about an ivy degrading or dying before. Although i do recall franky, i didnt ever know details or how he was ivy.
> 
> 
> 
> It was something in the order of 1.8 V
Click to expand...

What happened? Was it an accident? Was it an air bench or ln2 bench? Was it immediate? Was it dramatic, like sparks and stuff, or just your cpu wouldn't boot? How did you know it was dead?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> No what happened
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


I MURDERED HIM








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Franky was a good chip but one day benching at the gym he tried too much vcore and died.
> 
> Edit : Franky is a legend here on OCN


aaaaaw








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> What exactly happened? I've never heard about an ivy degrading or dying before. Although i do recall franky, i didnt ever know details or how he was ivy.


I think I'm the only one to kill a ivy by OC'ing it so far and it got very wierd with later into the life after certain vcore I noticed degradation quite a bit but I wanted to observe it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> More like 1.9v or something... xD
> 
> Guess who's got a 3770k on it's way here? yeah, me, I know...not funny. meh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now that I had gotten fond of my p4 631 and was about to recap a 7600gt I got lying here...
> Guess I can still use that gpu with some dice on it (sandwich bag pot style)


yeah lots o volts









nice bench it and then wait and throw the p4








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *problemgaming*
> 
> I will be delidding my 3770k next weekend when my H220 comes in. However, I have a few questions.
> 
> 1) How much thermal paste is needed on the TIM and IHS. I will be using CooLaboratory liquid ultra.
> 2) How should I apply the thermal paste? Line method? Rice ball? Smooth it out with the brush included in the liquid ultra kit?
> 
> Thanks ahead of time for all assistance.


take a look at the picture list 2 pages back on a post of mine i tried to get a picture of the dot i used and then i spread it out and it's working amazingly right now


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I MURDERED HIM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> aaaaaw
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I'm the only one to kill a ivy by OC'ing it so far and it got very wierd with later into the life after certain vcore I noticed degradation quite a bit but I wanted to observe it.
> yeah lots o volts


Franky Goes to Hollywood the Electric Chair


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I laughed so loud when I read that hahaha


----------



## MikeG




----------



## Belial

i wish i could get a straight answer and the story of what happened









Actually I'm fairly certain I've asked at least twice before about what happened and never got anything more than a franky joke. Hence, I've heard of franky but besides being a dead chip I didn't know anything else about it.

My ivy seems like it's almost 1.5v for 4.9ghz 24/7 stable, but it'll definitely need over 1.5v for 24/7 5ghz. Sin0822 said he 'wouldn't boot over 1.5v on air' but i dont see anyone having trouble with 1.5-1.6v so I think' I'll press on and have 1.55v as my max voltage that I'll venture too.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I MURDERED HIM


We had contacted DSS and tried to get lil Franky into protective custody but it was too late!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> i wish i could get a straight answer and the story of what happened
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually I'm fairly certain I've asked at least twice before about what happened and never got anything more than a franky joke. Hence, I've heard of franky but besides being a dead chip I didn't know anything else about it.
> 
> My ivy seems like it's almost 1.5v for 4.9ghz 24/7 stable, but it'll definitely need over 1.5v for 24/7 5ghz. Sin0822 said he 'wouldn't boot over 1.5v on air' but i dont see anyone having trouble with 1.5-1.6v so I think' I'll press on and have 1.55v as my max voltage that I'll venture too.


Hey the worst that happens is you have to buy a new chip. I say go for it..


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> My ivy seems like it's almost 1.5v for 4.9ghz 24/7 stable, but it'll definitely need over 1.5v for 24/7 5ghz. Sin0822 said he 'wouldn't boot over 1.5v on air' but i dont see anyone having trouble with 1.5-1.6v so I think' I'll press on and have 1.55v as my max voltage that I'll venture too.


You may want to consider water cooling. It's not just a a matter of increasing VCore. Getting a to stable 24/7 5.0GHz is kind of tough and requires a good chip and a good cooling solution. Here is an example:

5.0GHz @ 1.4V - Fans and pump on low - Hottest core 70C - Prime 95 failed


5.0GHz @ 1.4V - Fans and pump on high - Hottest core 62C - Prime 95 passed


Getting to 4.8GHz was a piece of cake for me, but It took me a long while before I could get to a stable 5.0GHz. I finally figured out that once I hit 5.0GHz, my chip just did not like temps above ~63 degrees.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> i wish i could get a straight answer and the story of what happened
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually I'm fairly certain I've asked at least twice before about what happened and never got anything more than a franky joke. Hence, I've heard of franky but besides being a dead chip I didn't know anything else about it.
> 
> My ivy seems like it's almost 1.5v for 4.9ghz 24/7 stable, but it'll definitely need over 1.5v for 24/7 5ghz. Sin0822 said he 'wouldn't boot over 1.5v on air' but i dont see anyone having trouble with 1.5-1.6v so I think' I'll press on and have 1.55v as my max voltage that I'll venture too.


Valgaur lives in North Dakota where people leave their motors going in the carparks. It is cold. Val had a good chip which he named Franky and fed lots of volts in pursuit of the ultimate Ivy Bridge overclock. He kept increasing these volts until one day, after a meal of something like 1.98v, Franky got all wobbly and soon died. Franky had been the chip that could, but now he was dead. Val was sad.

And then he went out and bought a new one, but the legend of Franky lived on.

( The last validation the 5GHz Club had for Franky was http://valid.canardpc.com/2558184
No LN2, no DICE, just North Dakota Air...... )


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *problemgaming*
> 
> I will be delidding my 3770k next weekend when my H220 comes in. However, I have a few questions.
> 
> 1) How much thermal paste is needed on the TIM and IHS. I will be using CooLaboratory liquid ultra.
> 2) How should I apply the thermal paste? Line method? Rice ball? Smooth it out with the brush included in the liquid ultra kit?
> 
> Thanks ahead of time for all assistance.


Once you have completely cleaned off the die, pcb, and ihs you only need a very small amount of Ultra on the die. I think it is easier to just touch the included brush to the syringe to get a little ultra on it. Then you can paint the die, but it is possible to use too much and too little. The video CyGnus linked is helpful, but be aware that is a big drop of Ultra they start with because he is doing a whole IHS, the die is a lot smaller than that. When finished, the die surface area should look something like that video though.

Many of us also put a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS, there is usually a stain from the old Intel TIM to show you where the die will make contact. My advice is to go slow, and be very patient getting that first corner going. I did both mine when everyone else was asleep so no distractions, and brought a floor lamp over to give me good lighting. Rubber gloves make it easier too because you don't have to worrying about static and getting dirt/oils on anything.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> You may want to consider water cooling. It's not just a a matter of increasing VCore. Getting a to stable 24/7 5.0GHz is kind of tough and requires a good chip and a good cooling solution. Here is an example:
> 
> 5.0GHz @ 1.4V - Fans and pump on low - Hottest core 70C - Prime 95 failed


Besides 1 golden chip, everyone needs at least 1.45v for prime95. I don't know if I have a 'golden' chip but it's at least a very good chip, so just a little more voltage than most. My max temps stay in the 70s with what I have so I don't think cooling is too bad.

Anyways at stock clocks I failed prime95 after 15 hours. Or didn't really fail, it's still running, but the USB doesnt appear to be working. I can't use my mouse or keyboard. I've never seen instability manifest like that before. Makes me sad because prime95 is clearly still chugging along... I guess I have to loosen on of the tertiary timings on my ram or something.


----------



## valkeriefire

@Belial. Your mouse freeze could be from software. I just had the same issue while OCing my CPU and ram. Ironically, it was not hardware at all, it was Microsoft Security Essentials. Once I disabled it, my OC Prime95 tests went much better and the freezes went away. Now it BSODs when it has a problem which is clearly OC related.


----------



## Belial

How did that cross you mind? The computer isn't freezing, like if I plug/plug the router I can see the interet icon has a red x on it, i can see it load up internet when i pull the cable and then put it back in. The mouse optical LED comes on. But it doesn't seem to be taking input, like if I press caps lock on my keyboard, it doesn't stay on, and I can't move the mouse at all or use the keyboard. I see the mouse icon, it sometimes gets a loading animation next to it when im pullling and plugging usb devices.

I mean even my skype is still on. someone keeps messaging me on skype and the skype icon is flashing with messages.

I'll disable MSE and run the same ram timings again. I mean it's rather tight timings, they are all literaly within 1 unit of what is unstable. It seems with ram though, it's not a collective imprint of stability, but rather each timing is it's own thing. So like a tighter trfc + tighter trefix9 isn't going to be more unstable just as an overclocked cpu and gpu that are stable on their own crash when put together.

yesterday i had run a test of these timings with [email protected] (was being lazy) and it had a worker error at hour 19. That very likely could have been the cpu though, as it was the first time i tried 4.9 (been doing ram overclocks due to faulty psu, but new psu came in).

i've passed 24 hours of prime95 on this system before, and earlier this week when first figuring out ram timings, i was loosening them and it went from 5 minutes failure to 2 hours, and now its at 15 hours+ so i dont think mse is the problem actually. its just a weird way for instability to show, ive nver had the mouse and keyboard stop responding but prime95 just keep running on all workers just fine.


----------



## wazza300

hi guys,well done on the delidding









@4.8ghz myself with 1.38v

loving the col liquid pro,dont know how I managed without it for so long


----------



## Crooksy

Eugh, I think I need to delid but I don't think I want to risk it at this time.

Temps max out at 63ish on 4.2 at 1.21v. Not too good considering a custom loop


----------



## wazza300

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Crooksy*
> 
> Eugh, I think I need to delid but I don't think I want to risk it at this time.
> 
> Temps max out at 63ish on 4.2 at 1.21v. Not too good considering a custom loop


your temps arnt high,anything below 80c is ok imo

delidding is risky but the benefits are huge,just cut one corner and use very thin plastic to cut the rest as it wont cut the pcb like a metal blade would


----------



## MikeG

"Give me a razor and I will delid the world."
- Archimedes


----------



## Zeek

LOOOOOOOL'd at above post


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Crooksy*
> 
> Eugh, I think I need to delid but I don't think I want to risk it at this time.
> 
> Temps max out at 63ish on 4.2 at 1.21v. Not too good considering a custom loop


Max out at 63 with Prime95/IBT? What voltage do you need for 4.5? How big is the spread between the four max core temps?


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Still going higher








Temps still lower than non oc'ed stock








http://valid.canardpc.com/2715917


----------



## Zeek

New chip seems pretty decent. Old chip did 4.6ghz with 1.35v and this one is currently P95'ing at 4.7ghz 1.27v Lets see if it holds


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Valgaur lives in North Dakota where people leave their motors going in the carparks. It is cold. Val had a good chip which he named Franky and fed lots of volts in pursuit of the ultimate Ivy Bridge overclock. He kept increasing these volts until one day, after a meal of something like 1.98v, Franky got all wobbly and soon died. Franky had been the chip that could, but now he was dead. Val was sad.
> 
> And then he went out and bought a new one, but the legend of Franky lived on.
> 
> ( The last validation the 5GHz Club had for Franky was http://valid.canardpc.com/2558184
> No LN2, no DICE, just North Dakota Air...... )


Thats basically the jist of it lol, I had ambients temps of around -30C and was like, screw it I want the 2Giggles club! so cranked the vcore up and did 5.5 decently and then got greedy and thought, I could bench at 5.5! then i had to start throwing crazy vcore to get it stable and just ended up throwing 1.98vcore at it a couple times and then i did it in bios once and tried for 5.6 giggles and then he died basically. I did notice memory issues were a big thing before Franky died though it's very weird on the stability with him, vcore's never really changed for my OC's but the memory had issues sometimes then it just stopped. Very weird and hard to tell about it's actual degredation.

Gonna try for another one striclty for benching now lol








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wazza300*
> 
> hi guys,well done on the delidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @4.8ghz myself with 1.38v
> 
> loving the col liquid pro,dont know how I managed without it for so long


Isn't this stuff amazing!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Crooksy*
> 
> Eugh, I think I need to delid but I don't think I want to risk it at this time.
> 
> Temps max out at 63ish on 4.2 at 1.21v. Not too good considering a custom loop


Yeah you should fix that!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wazza300*
> 
> your temps arnt high,anything below 80c is ok imo
> 
> delidding is risky but the benefits are huge,just cut one corner and use very thin plastic to cut the rest as it wont cut the pcb like a metal blade would


Thats why we are here aren't we? or is it because we are all so B E A UTIFUL!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> 
> 
> "Give me a razor and I will delid the world."
> - Archimedes


I like that sir, very nice.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> New chip seems pretty decent. Old chip did 4.6ghz with 1.35v and this one is currently P95'ing at 4.7ghz 1.27v Lets see if it holds


typo on the vcores?


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> typo on the vcores?


Nope, those are the correct values


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Nope, those are the correct values


..... but howd you get lower vcore with higher clock sir? tell me your secret!


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ..... but howd you get lower vcore with higher clock sir? tell me your secret!



















Guess I just finally got a nice piece of silicon. Old chip was ridiculously bad, but this new chip is still better than my 1st. Quite happy with it so far! Oh and I should be delliding it tomorrow if all goes to plan


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> BradleyW...don't mean to sound patronizing in case you already checked, but the way you describe the 'hard wall' is a bit unusual...some BIOS have over current protection, CPU over-temp protection, over-voltage protection etc. etc. etc. ...just saying that that hard 1-sec shutdown is unusual and 'smells a bit' like a safety kicking in - either in BIOS or perhaps some win-based software such as Intel Extreme Tuning Utility (though the latter is limited at 1.525 and won't cause a hard shut down).
> 
> ...just have a look again in all niches and cracks of your Bios / win settings to see if there is a hard limit setting.


I don't know if there is any setting in windows. I would not know what to look for.
Also, I will check the bios but I think I've set everything correctly


----------



## ivanlabrie

This p4 rig is quite fast for regular use, can't notice the difference with an amd quad (955 be and 2gb of ram with win 8 lol), and it boots and shutdowns in 25 and 7 sec respectively.


----------



## BradleyW

It seems the CPU is fine at using 1.4vcore during small FFT. However, blend test fails in about half a second.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> It seems the CPU is fine at using 1.4vcore during small FFT. However, blend test fails in about half a second.


what bsod code are you getting


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what bsod code are you getting


I can't see. It is too fast. So I used 3rd party software but it says the PC has no logs.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I can't see. It is too fast. So I used 3rd party software but it says the PC has no logs.


http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows-vista/help-troubleshoot-the-blue-screen-of-death-by-preventing-automatic-reboot/

http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/blue_screen_view.html


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows-vista/help-troubleshoot-the-blue-screen-of-death-by-preventing-automatic-reboot/
> 
> http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/blue_screen_view.html


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*


i get that bsod if i go over 1.45v and i have not figued it out how to stop it. wish i new id be @ 5.2ghz


----------



## BradleyW

Is it some sort of voltage intolorence on the CPU?


----------



## lilchronic

for my asrock board
(0x124 = increase/decrease vcore or QPI/VTT... have to test to see which one it is)
you can try this
but im pretty new to computers and cant answer thats question. all i can say is ... i dont know and i hope not


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> How did that cross you mind? The computer isn't freezing, like if I plug/plug the router I can see the interet icon has a red x on it, i can see it load up internet when i pull the cable and then put it back in. .


I thought my problem was similar because my rig still ran also, but the mouse cursor froze and they windows key wouldn't activate the start button. prime95 was still running and coretemp and realtemp still tracked my temps, and CPU-z showed the voltage slightly oscillate. So my rig wasn't frozen, but it wasn't working either. Since disabling mse I haven't had the issue. I've learned mse seems to take my OC as a problem and causes it to freeze up. When I run stock clocks, I can run a mse sweep without problems.

Maybe our situations are different, but they sounded similar enough to warrant sharing.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i get that bsod if i go over 1.45v and i have not figued it out how to stop it. wish i new id be @ 5.2ghz


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Is it some sort of voltage intolorence on the CPU?


...this is what you need to memorize (bookmark will do







) http://www.overclock.net/a/common-bsod-error-code-list-for-overclocking


----------



## BradleyW

And what setting in my board will be under QPI/VTT voltage?
Thank you.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I had BSOD 124 at some point -> more vcore.

Evidence:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1350818/bsod-after-doing-a-tidy-up-of-the-pc/10#post_19157876


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> And what setting in my board will be under QPI/VTT voltage?
> Thank you.


advanced voltage settings/ cpu core voltage controll
http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I had BSOD 124 at some point -> more vcore.
> 
> Evidence:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1350818/bsod-after-doing-a-tidy-up-of-the-pc/10#post_19157876


Anything over 1.3v causes a blue screen....
I increased VTT up to a massive 1.35v and it did not help. (I upped the voltage in stages)


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> i wish i could get a straight answer and the story of what happened
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually I'm fairly certain I've asked at least twice before about what happened and never got anything more than a franky joke. Hence, I've heard of franky but besides being a dead chip I didn't know anything else about it.
> 
> My ivy seems like it's almost 1.5v for 4.9ghz 24/7 stable, but it'll definitely need over 1.5v for 24/7 5ghz. Sin0822 said he 'wouldn't boot over 1.5v on air' but i dont see anyone having trouble with 1.5-1.6v so I think' I'll press on and have 1.55v as my max voltage that I'll venture too.
> 
> 
> 
> Valgaur lives in North Dakota where people leave their motors going in the carparks. It is cold. Val had a good chip which he named Franky and fed lots of volts in pursuit of the ultimate Ivy Bridge overclock. He kept increasing these volts until one day, after a meal of something like 1.98v, Franky got all wobbly and soon died. Franky had been the chip that could, but now he was dead. Val was sad.
> 
> And then he went out and bought a new one, but the legend of Franky lived on.
> 
> ( The last validation the 5GHz Club had for Franky was http://valid.canardpc.com/2558184
> No LN2, no DICE, just North Dakota Air...... )
Click to expand...

wow that's awesome. so.... basically for air overclock, short term, we know up to ~1.9v is fine then









I'm totally going to push up to at least 1.6v for my 24/7 overclock (if necessary).


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> wow that's awesome. so.... basically for air overclock, short term, we know up to ~1.9v is fine then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm totally going to push up to at least 1.6v for my 24/7 overclock (if necessary).


Heh, MicroCenter is going to like you...


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> I thought my problem was similar because my rig still ran also, but the mouse cursor froze and they windows key wouldn't activate the start button. prime95 was still running and coretemp and realtemp still tracked my temps, and CPU-z showed the voltage slightly oscillate. So my rig wasn't frozen, but it wasn't working either. Since disabling mse I haven't had the issue. I've learned mse seems to take my OC as a problem and causes it to freeze up. When I run stock clocks, I can run a mse sweep without problems.
> 
> Maybe our situations are different, but they sounded similar enough to warrant sharing.


Well... I mean WSE/the inputs not working as they should, I think, is a sign of instability. That's very interesting what you say, but what made you go "hey maybe I should disable MSE"? I mean I've never had a problem with MSE on overclocks on this build, like i said I did [email protected] 30 hours, i think i even did a windows sweep on that and had mse on and everything.

I think maybe just something is unstable, i mean the day before I failed [email protected] with these crazy tight ram timings, now maybe that cpu was stable and the ram was the problem. So I up TRFC from 100 to 110, since I think I'm right on the cusp of stable with these ram timings.
Quote:


> Heh, MicroCenter is going to like you...


Has anyone had a problem running 1.5-1.6v? I don't understand. "Franky" seems to be the only report of an ivy bridge dying/degrading, and plenty of people run 1.5-1.6v with no problem so far, so why not?

BradleyW, the fact you got x124 really shouldn't be read into that much. It's more that you got a BSOD (=unstable), then what code you've got. I've had faulty ram, faulty motherboards, faulty psu, unstable ram, unstable gpu, etc, give me x124s. If you try to use those bsod codes and such too much you'll go crazy. Sometimes, maybe, it can give you a hint but I really would not take them seriously.

Clearly your overclock is unstable, need more voltage/lower frequency. Which I guess is what they say about x124 but I think it's obvious that's the problem when you can't pass blend at your setting. ime 24 hours of prime95 is the fastest and easiest way to get a quick idea of how a chip overclocks, no use in running small fft or anything else. You just get a warped idea of the chip.


----------



## Belial

oh and some guy said it's easier to overclock through bclk, like set multi to 48 and then 103 = 5ghz, like it's an easier way to overclock. like you cant do 5ghz, maybe just 4.9, so use bclk a tiny bit and you can reach it. Anyone know about that?


----------



## wazza300

you can use the bclk a little,it varies from board to board on how far you can go,cooling also plays a part

124 error is cpu voltage on z77/68 used to be qpi/vtt on x58

I found on z77 you can be bench stable ibt/prime95 with little voltage but when it comes to gaming games crash to desktop,only cure is a bigish bump in cpu voltage (due to linked pci-e bus?) idk

setting 1.65v cpu pll will help you be stable with less cpu voltage too


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> wow that's awesome. so.... basically for air overclock, short term, we know up to ~1.9v is fine then


Only if your ambient temp is frequently sub-zero....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, don't go overboard unless you're below 0c ambients...Even then I wouldn't do it unless I had an ln2 or dry ice cooled pot or phase change. And that has its limits too.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ok ladies and gents - I'm now back to my 4.5ghz OC with +0.07 offset.
Before attempting to RMA my antec - I was hitting around 80c
After I got back the same antec unit but this time switched the direction of the fans to pull air in from outside - I'm so far at 65c max temp - I'll soon see if any temps go higher!


----------



## Zeek

Nice change of temps







I'll be delliding tomorrow morning, lol. Kinda nervous about it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> wow that's awesome. so.... basically for air overclock, short term, we know up to ~1.9v is fine then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm totally going to push up to at least 1.6v for my 24/7 overclock (if necessary).


my room was -25C btw..... and so was I


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ok ladies and gents - I'm now back to my 4.5ghz OC with +0.07 offset.
> Before attempting to RMA my antec - I was hitting around 80c
> After I got back the same antec unit but this time switched the direction of the fans to pull air in from outside - I'm so far at 65c max temp - I'll soon see if any temps go higher!


...wow, great change...next thing you know and your Sabertooth forgives you and fires on all DRAM slots again


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> wow that's awesome. so.... basically for air overclock, short term, we know up to ~1.9v is fine then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm totally going to push up to at least 1.6v for my 24/7 overclock (if necessary).
> 
> 
> 
> my room was -25C btw..... and so was I
Click to expand...

but you had shorts on


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> my room was -25C btw..... and so was I


...we in the 'Great White North' (otherwise known as Canada) don't get your problem with that...but may be 'Frankie' was born in Costa Rica and he just could not acclimatize, no matter how much you tried to warm him up with vCore


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> oh and some guy said it's easier to overclock through bclk, like set multi to 48 and then 103 = 5ghz, like it's an easier way to overclock. like you cant do 5ghz, maybe just 4.9, so use bclk a tiny bit and you can reach it. Anyone know about that?


I will be doing this as well. Not sure what voltage we may need to change on the motherboard though.


----------



## invincible20xx

i keep on hearing here that small ftt is not a valid stability test, really ?!

i just passed 30 hours of prime small ftt 4.4GHz @ 1.25 v , please don't tell me i need to test again.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

You need to test different things, if anything blend with 90% ram is more thorough, though not be all end all by any means.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need to test different things, if anything blend with 90% ram is more thorough, though not be all end all by any means.


and how to do this test....

i'm starting to fed up with overclocking and what not all together lol


----------



## BradleyW

I tried a BCLK of 102 and died in in blend test after 20 mins


----------



## invincible20xx

how to set prime to test blend with 90% ram like you guys suggest ? i have 8 gigs of ram


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> and how to do this test....
> 
> i'm starting to fed up with overclocking and what not all together lol


You need to run 24+ hours of prime95, sorry.

For example, I set an overclock a few days ago and it failed at the 19th hour, with a worker error on one thread/worker. Then today I tested the same overclock, to be sure, and it failed at the 16th hour by my mopuse and keyboard not responding, even though p95 kept running and even my skpe and hwinfo programs were still going.

Small fft is just a single test, out of over 80+ tests that prime95 runs, to test every part of your chip. Small fft is great for temp testing, but not for stability. It tests specifically the on-die memory on the chip I think, but it does not test your cpu's memory controller, interaction with ram, etc, and that's just as important.

If you are getting stressed, just take a break. You can always just overclock 2 years from now, it's not a hurry.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> and how to do this test....
> 
> i'm starting to fed up with overclocking and what not all together lol


thats why i don't prime my OC's I set them and let them fold until it breaks, foldings a tougher OC tester anyways and you can test it for as long as you want.







38 days running, Last chip had a stable OC of over 200 days







take that prime95.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> You need to run 24+ hours of prime95, sorry.
> 
> For example, I set an overclock a few days ago and it failed at the 19th hour, with a worker error on one thread/worker. Then today I tested the same overclock, to be sure, and it failed at the 16th hour by my mopuse and keyboard not responding, even though p95 kept running and even my skpe and hwinfo programs were still going.
> 
> Small fft is just a single test, out of over 80+ tests that prime95 runs, to test every part of your chip. Small fft is great for temp testing, but not for stability. It tests specifically the on-die memory on the chip I think, but it does not test your cpu's memory controller, interaction with ram, etc, and that's just as important.
> 
> If you are getting stressed, just take a break. You can always just overclock 2 years from now, it's not a hurry.


thanks for your input belial but i know i need to test for 24 hour + , i did small ftt for 30 hours and it passed i called it a day but now you guys telling me i need to run other tests , that's what pisses me off i thought i were safe....








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> thats why i don't prime my OC's I set them and let them fold until it breaks, foldings a tougher OC tester anyways and you can test it for as long as you want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 38 days running, Last chip had a stable OC of over 200 days
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> take that prime95.


and did it break, degrade or show instability after those 200 days ?

by the way i mine with my gpu and sometimes it crashes when the cpu is not stable


----------



## wazza300

ibt maximum stress for me,then ill play lots games to find any instability,prime95 is a bit weak imo

but each to there own n all that


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> how to set prime to test blend with 90% ram like you guys suggest ? i have 8 gigs of ram


Do a Prime95 Torture test, click Custom, leave all defaults except for the memory used. Look at the performance tab of Task Manger and use 90% of the Available number. Let it run for 24 hours. Check to make sure you have nothing popping up in your Event Viewer - Custom Views - Administrative events.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wazza300*
> 
> ibt maximum stress for me,then ill play lots games to find any instability,prime95 is a bit weak imo
> 
> but each to there own n all that


I have tried many oc settings that passed IBT with zero issues, and failed in Prime95. I have little use for IBT except to test temps, but like you said, to each his own.

I think we all agree that 24 hours of Prime95 is just step one, you have to do everything you normally do for a little while to see if it is stable for you.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> thanks for your input belial but i know i need to test for 24 hour + , i did small ftt for 30 hours and it passed i called it a day but now you guys telling me i need to run other tests , that's what pisses me off i thought i were safe....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and did it break, degrade or show instability after those 200 days ?
> 
> by the way i mine with my gpu and sometimes it crashes when the cpu is not stable


it did once i killed it... read back a few pages lol


----------



## wazza300

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I have tried many oc settings that passed IBT with zero issues, and failed in Prime95. I have little use for IBT except to test temps, but like you said, to each his own.
> 
> I think we all agree that 24 hours of Prime95 is just step one, you have to do everything you normally do for a little while to see if it is stable for you.


that's true,but ibt is very fast at finding instability compared to prime95

your pretty close if your ibt stable,gaming/day to day usage will find the rest


----------



## ivanlabrie

Actually each of those stability tests focus on one or more parts of the cpu and how it works. I'm not exactly sure how or on what, but I remember reading about it in some anandtech forum thread VonDutch posted here.
I favor a more functional approach to stability testing. Test according to your needs, but test smart. Find out what is it that your chip works on when doing your task of choice and then test with programs that use that, or just do the darn thing


----------



## Zeek

All I do is game. I'm fine with 15 passes of IBT max mem, then 2-3 hours of P95 and I'm good.

I'm just really lazy


----------



## lilchronic

12hrs minimum p95 blend test 90% ram. thats how i roll. all this overclocking talk makes me want to try for 5.2 ghz prime95 run









EDIT: ok i lied about 5.2ghz i cant do it 1.55v is to high


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> thanks for your input belial but i know i need to test for 24 hour + , i did small ftt for 30 hours and it passed i called it a day but now you guys telling me i need to run other tests , that's what pisses me off i thought i were safe....


I dont know where you got the idea that small fft would be all you need o_o

small fft is one single test of 80+ that blend does. 30 minutes of small fft is probably the same as 24 hours.
Quote:


> ibt maximum stress for me,then ill play lots games to find any instability,prime95 is a bit weak imo
> 
> but each to there own n all that


I've been able to do 50 passes of ibt on faulty hardware more than once, i dont trust ibt at all. it doesnt get temps nearly as high as small fft, which is the 2nd test blend does.

People think prime95 is weak but that's because they aren't running the settings correctly. On default settings, prime95 is weaker than any other stress test program. You have:

- Raise priority to 10 (or above normal in task manager). On default prime95 is 1, which is very very low, because it was originally created for compute workload instead of stress testing. OCCT, IBT, etc, they all run a default priority of 7-10, which makes them much more stressful at default settings.

- Check off sum input and round error checking, otherwise unstable and incorrect results aren't reported and what could have just been failing every pass seems like it's stable.

- Use 80%+ ram, to stress the imc and ram. IBT on default does this to a high level while on default blend, prime95 tests as if you only have 2GB of ram on a 32bit OS.

If all you do is a game that isn't very intensive, and you don't mind having to reinstall windows in 1-3 years, or random crashes, that's fine. Personally, I don't want to be pulling my hair out in 2 years when, say, i get new ram that's failing 24 hours of prime95, when it turns out that the overclock i had been running wasnt stable and i spend weeks trying to figure out why the new ram doesn't work, or whatever, or why a certain game doesnt work at all.

I also stream, which is extremely CPU intensive. Games won't stress your system, but streaming will, and if you got a good system, imo, there's no reason not to stream every game you play (so you have it on video, get a following if you are good enough, whatever). If you have an unstable system, and i've had systems that could pass 12 hours of prime95 just fine crash quickly in streaming, you are going to crash during streaming, you are going to have stuttering and dropped frames, and you will crash during streaming (and viewers aren't keen on a stream that crashes...).

Just running 24 hours prime95 custom blend testing is the fastest and easiest way to stress test. The majority of my broken hardware could pass 12 hours but would not pass up to 24. Just the last 2 days, I set ram overclocks that could pass IBT and would only fail P95 after 16 hours.

It doesn't matter if your system fails in 16 hours or 50 passes of IBT or fails in 5 minutes, unstable is unstable. Failing only after 20 hours of prime95 doesn't necessarily mean your system is more stable, it just means a particulary segment of your system that is tested on that particular FFT length is what reveals the instability. It's not that a game won't stress your system like 20 hours of prime95. If it fails, it fails, as you are really supposed to pass infinite prime95 testing, 24 hours is just the minimum to run every test. I've had overclocks that could pass up to 21 hours of prime95 that would crash every time I opened starcraft.

Also had an issue where I had to reinstall windows because a system crashed during a windows update installation. It had ran fine for about a month, and it passed 50 runs of IBT and over 6 hours of prime95. I thought that would be enough for a gaming system, but it wasn't.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it did once i killed it... read back a few pages lol


On *Systems Stability Testing*






















...this is one of those topics which gets a lot of heated discussions going...enough to make me puke (though that may also be the penicillin I'm on). So I will try to enlighten you (







)...I start with a quote from Tom's Hardware re Intel's Extreme Tuning Utility, with Anandtech also having some great quotes on it:

_*"...XTU is likely intended for "in the know" overclocking exhibitionists and members of the press who usually get their hardware long before our round-ups are published. Most end-users are forced to search for it, and the lack of references to the name makes that search even more difficult.

Intel has its own stress-testing program, which many professional-level overclockers use to prove that their systems are stable...."*_

...not that I know everything, but I head the firm that has been for over a decade now supplying a very large global organization with tens of millions of members with custom software (think cloud computing and such) running exclusively on hardware we also put together. Obviously, the commercial systems are not overclocked, but we apply the same rigor to those as I do to my own systems which run and bench up to 5.3 GHz...sorry for this piece of chest-beating but I think it is necessary in this context.

- IBT ...what you folks call the Intel Burn Test (IBT) is actually not the current IBT at all - the one I see here is an older one modified by 'agentGOD' - that should have been your first clue









- Prime95 isn't getting any younger - I know modern systems that can pass 24 hrs or longer on Prime95 but bomb as soon as they are supposed to run Cinebench 11.5 etc.

- I rather run 10 min of vCore at 1.75, and would purchase such a chip, but would not do so from someone who constantly runs Prime95, IBT or folds all day and all night - that will cause more degradation than short bursts of higher voltage - as much as you really should stay below 1.52v unless you have below-ambient cooling solutions

- we use specialty proprietary commercial software that is designed to bring any commercial system down in less than 2 min to test out...the stuff I see mentioned here as 'tough' and the 'final judge' of your system's stability does not compare.

- asking a CPU IMC to run 12 hrs of Prime95 on 4 or 8 GB is NOT the same as doing so on 16 or 32 GB, think of the extra work the IMC has to do...thus the CPU vCore voltages will be different - so no sense saying, 'my Golden chip' does this or that without any extra info on what is running.

- While I am at it, please stop talking about *'Golden Chips'* - it usually embarrasses you, in public. There are professional OC networks where you can buy such chips...one recent one offered booted up at over 5.5 GHZ w/1.55 vCore (un-deliided) - but the asking price was $1500...that probably qualifies as a Golden Chip

Now then, back to 'XTU'...that includes Intel's current System Stability Test...it comes with a CPU stress test AND a memory stress test which you can run from 1 min to







30 days ! That's what professional overclockers use as much as commercial system builders, not to mention Anandtech , Tom's Hardware etc...when I take an *Intel product* such as an I7 3770K, I feel more comfortable with *Intel's latest 'official' stress test* embedded in XTU than whatever some folks here seem to insist on with a certain degree of zealousness...usually when someone just posted a faster CPU time than they did.

My recommendation should be clear: Run Intel's XTU stress tests for CPU and memory for 12 to 24 hrs - and have a nice day


----------



## Agoniizing

My temps at 4.5GHz before delid


My temps at 4.7GHz after delid


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> My temps at 4.5GHz before delid
> 
> 
> My temps at 4.7GHz after delid


lol 200 mhz extra while 25c lower on the hottest core, maaaaaan this is so tempting !!

i'm really on the fence of de-lidding here i need a confidence boost , should i do it
















what voltages are you using ?


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> lol 200 mhz extra while 25c lower on the hottest core, maaaaaan this is so tempting !!
> 
> i'm really on the fence of de-lidding here i need a confidence boost , should i do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what voltages are you using ?


I was scared when I did it too. And im using 1.33v for 4.7GHz.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> I was scared when I did it too. And im using 1.33v for 4.7GHz.


but was it that hard after all ?

what tim did you use on the die ?

coolab liquid pro is not available here, all i have is mx-4 and ocz freeze...

can i expect 20c drops ?

here are my current results after 30h of prime @ 4.4Ghz @ 1.25v


----------



## lilchronic

i had to try it just a 5 min run. i can run this for weeks lolz


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> On *Systems Stability Testing*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...this is one of those topics which gets a lot of heated discussions going...enough to make me puke (though that may also be the penicillin I'm on). So I will try to enlighten you (
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )...I start with a quote from Tom's Hardware re Intel's Extreme Tuning Utility, with Anandtech also having some great quotes on it:
> 
> _*"...XTU is likely intended for "in the know" overclocking exhibitionists and members of the press who usually get their hardware long before our round-ups are published. Most end-users are forced to search for it, and the lack of references to the name makes that search even more difficult.
> 
> Intel has its own stress-testing program, which many professional-level overclockers use to prove that their systems are stable...."*_
> 
> ...not that I know everything, but I head the firm that has been for over a decade now supplying a very large global organization with tens of millions of members with custom software (think cloud computing and such) running exclusively on hardware we also put together. Obviously, the commercial systems are not overclocked, but we apply the same rigor to those as I do to my own systems which run and bench up to 5.3 GHz...sorry for this piece of chest-beating but I think it is necessary in this context.
> 
> - IBT ...what you folks call the Intel Burn Test (IBT) is actually not the current IBT at all - the one I see here is an older one modified by 'agentGOD' - that should have been your first clue
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - Prime95 isn't getting any younger - I know modern systems that can pass 24 hrs or longer on Prime95 but bomb as soon as they are supposed to run Cinebench 11.5 etc.
> 
> - I rather run 10 min of vCore at 1.75, and would purchase such a chip, but would not do so from someone who constantly runs Prime95, IBT or folds all day and all night - that will cause more degradation than short bursts of higher voltage - as much as you really should stay below 1.52v unless you have below-ambient cooling solutions
> 
> - we use specialty proprietary commercial software that is designed to bring any commercial system down in less than 2 min to test out...the stuff I see mentioned here as 'tough' and the 'final judge' of your system's stability does not compare.
> 
> - asking a CPU IMC to run 12 hrs of Prime95 on 4 or 8 GB is NOT the same as doing so for 16 or 32 GB, think of the extra work the IMC has to do...thus the CPU vCore voltages will be different - so no sense saying, 'my Golden chip' does this or that without any extra info on what is running.
> 
> - While I am at it, please stop talking about *'Golden Chips'* - it usually embarrasses you, in public. There are professional OC networks where you can buy such chips...one recent one offered booted up at over 5.5 GHZ w/1.55 vCore (un-deliided) - but the asking price was $1500...that probably qualifies for a Golden Chip
> 
> Now then, back to 'XTU'...that includes Intel's current System Stability Test...it comes with a CPU stress test AND a memory stress test which you can run from 1 min to
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 30 days ! That's what professional overclockers use as much as commercial system builders, not to mention Anandtech , Tom's Hardware etc...when I take an *Intel product* such as an I7 3770K, I feel more comfortable with I*ntel's latest 'official' stress test* embedded in XTU than whatever some folks here seem to insist on with a certain degree of zealousness...usually when someone just posted a faster CPU time than they did.
> 
> My recommendation should be clear: Run Intel's XTU stress tests for CPU and memory for 12 to 24 hrs - and have a nice day


im not familiar with xtu but what the guy says seems legit


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> but was it that hard after all ?
> 
> what tim did you use on the die ?
> 
> coolab liquid pro is not available here, all i have is mx-4 and ocz freeze...
> 
> can i expect 20c drops ?
> 
> here are my current results after 30h of prime @ 4.4Ghz @ 1.25v


I took my precious time delidding because i didnt want to cut the PCB. And I used coollab on the die. If your not going to use coollab i dont think you can expect 20c drops, maybe 10c or a little more. What cooler do you have?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> I took my precious time delidding because i didnt want to cut the PCB. And I used coollab on the die. If your not going to use coollab i dont think you can expect 20c drops, maybe 10c or a little more. What cooler do you have?


damn









only 10c


----------



## justanoldman

Joa3d43,
Are there settings for XTU? It just seems to test cpu or memory, not both at the same time like others. How long do you have to run this for it to find anything that 24 hours of Prime95 wouldn't, and how do you know it failed? You can see stopped workers in Prime95 while everything else is running perfectly.


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> damn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only 10c


What cooler are you using? And if you do end up delidding, use PK-1. And where are you from?


----------



## justanoldman

I am not sure I would delid if I couldn't put Ultra or Pro on it. Where can't you get that stuff shipped?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Joa3d43,
> Are there settings for XTU? It just seems to test cpu or memory, not both at the same time like others. How long do you have to run this for it to find anything that 24 hours of Prime95 wouldn't, and how do you know it failed? You can see stopped workers in Prime95 while everything else is running perfectly.


also when i tested my gpu my cpu was only using 10-20% and only @ 2.0 ghz??


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> What cooler are you using? And if you do end up delidding, use PK-1. And where are you from?


i'm using a nzxt havik 140 and it's performance is equivalent to a noctua nh-d14.....

and i'm from egypt and the only thermal compounds available to me are some ocz freeze that i have around from a couple of years back and i can get mx-4 or noctua nt-h1 from the market


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Joa3d43,
> Are there settings for XTU? It just seems to test cpu or memory, not both at the same time like others. How long do you have to run this for it to find anything that 24 hours of Prime95 wouldn't, and how do you know it failed? You can see stopped workers in Prime95 while everything else is running perfectly.


...just ask Intel...they know more than I do... from Intel's XTU help file:

"*Stress Tests in Intel Extreme Tuning Utility*

Intel XTU provides three stress tests: CPU, memory and graphics. The CPU test verifies the stability of your system with its new system settings by running a computation-intensive program. The memory test verifies the stability of your memory by carrying out a series of memory-intensive operations targeted at taxing the memory subsystem. The graphics test verifies the stability of your system by running a series of graphics-intensive operations targeted at taxing the internal graphics core of the CPU. This test is only available on platforms with internal graphics cores.

You can run all of these tests at any time for a specified amount of time each. Alternatively, you can choose to stop a test midway if necessary by simply clicking the Stop Testing button.

As the stress tests run, you will see progress indicators. You will see the total time remaining for test completion and the portion of the test that has been completed. The log area below provides further information about the current test session, with indicators on whether the current test passed or failed."


----------



## gdesmo

Spent the afternoon at the machinists today modifing my waterblock and IHS. Cut out the center of IHS so that waterblock would sit directly on the processor die, IHS is only used to hold down PCB that the die is attached to. Will be using 6 TEC`s for cooling processors and will see temps down to about -25 to -35 C. Here`s a bunch of pictures showing some of the process >>>


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!













Do not try this unless you are totally confident in what you are doing and have a good machinist. IHS is made of copper and must be clamped down carefully, also Processor die is extremely fragile and pressure must be applied evenly and gently. Will be using a Graphene and sub-zero type carrier for the Graphene as a thermal interface. Yes I`m nuts !


----------



## Hokies83

Well i had my system up for 1 day but in that time i tested my OC..

Now Gigabyte did change the Bios on my board... but with 1.55v i would bsod in like 10 secs where i was rock stable before i tore my system down

Also this may be due to the bad Tim i was using because when i first got the loop up and going temps were ubber...

2 hrs later i woas hitting 98c before my BSOD.. now that is higher temps then my H-100...

So i guess i will update the status of this when the system is back up and running again.. 2 weeks maybe as im selling off my 680s and going tri fire 7950s with water blocks.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Yes I`m nuts !


Nuts yes, but dang that is ridiculously cool!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Spent the afternoon at the machinists today modifing my waterblock and IHS. Cut out the center of IHS so that waterblock would sit directly on the processor die, IHS is only used to hold down PCB that the die is attached to. Will be using 6 TEC`s for cooling processors and will see temps down to about -25 to -35 C. Here`s a bunch of pictures showing some of the process >>>
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do not try this unless you are totally confident in what you are doing and have a good machinist. IHS is made of copper and must be clamped down carefully, also Processor die is extremely fragile and pressure must be applied evenly and gently. Will be using a Graphene and sub-zero type carrier for the Graphene as a thermal interface. Yes I`m nuts !


Congrats !







I'm glad someone actually tried that. I had seen it before and posted about it here:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/12860#post_19413915



...however, the original (in Germany) I referred to did not mention the exact amount to machine off...but since you have done it for real (and I'm thinking about it), the big magical question is







how much did the machinist take off (in mm with decimal pts, please) ...pleeeaaase







...inquiring minds want to know, and so does our machinist


----------



## gdesmo

I`ve been running without the IHS since April when the 3770K came out, went straight from the box to the knife. Can give you the basic numbers tomorrow night, for the block you have to make sure there is enough material on the bottom plate because it has to go in fairly deep. Block design has to be an extremely high flow version rate because of the reduced surface area of the block.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> I`ve been running without the IHS since April when the 3770K came out, went straight from the box to the knife. Can give you the basic numbers tomorrow night, for the block you have to make sure there is enough material on the bottom plate because it has to go in fairly deep. Block design has to be an extremely high flow version rate because of the reduced surface area of the block.


...that would be great...







...thanks in advance as you more than others will know, this relates to 'pin pressure' a.k.a. boot or beeping error code









...I'm running a Koolance 370si which is quite high flow, but I was going to try this on a spare Coollaboratory 'Alpheos' water block which has softer materials surrounding the cooper contact plate


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## invincible20xx

so you guys think it's not worth de-lidding if i don't have coolab liquid pro ? mx-4 , noctoua nh-t1 or ocz freeze won't cut it ?









all i hope for is 4.6 GHz at 75c max


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> so you guys think it's not worth de-lidding if i don't have coolab liquid pro ? mx-4 , noctoua nh-t1 or ocz freeze won't cut it ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all i hope for is 4.6 GHz at 75c max


...CL-U / P for the die would be better - BUT MX4 will tide you over nicely until you get some CL...in my own experience (others may vary) MX4 losses about 3.5 C to 4 C to CL-U but is better than most other non CL products...plus it is non-conductive and non-capacitive (unlike CL ), so safer if you by mistake drop some (like an earlier poster did with a DRAM slot)

...good luck with the delidding


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...CL-U / P for the die would be better - BUT MX4 will tide you over nicely until you get some CL...in my own experience (others may vary) MX4 losses about 3.5 C to 4 C to CL-U but is better than most other non CL products...plus it is non-conductive and non-capacitive (unlike CL ), so safer if you by mistake drop some (like an earlier poster did with a DRAM slot)
> 
> ...good luck with the delidding


thanks, 3~4 c is no big deal anyways , right ? but this is ocn i know hah


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> What cooler are you using? And if you do end up delidding, use PK-1. And where are you from?
> 
> 
> 
> i'm using a nzxt havik 140 and it's performance is equivalent to a noctua nh-d14.....
> 
> and i'm from egypt and the only thermal compounds available to me are some ocz freeze that i have around from a couple of years back and i can get mx-4 or noctua nt-h1 from the market
Click to expand...

I actually own both the havik 140 and nh-d14 and they are not similar at all. nh-d14 is way better, there's no way a single tower is going to compete with a dual tower. NZXT is a mid-range cooler, with similar fans it performed a little better (like a few degrees) than my h50. My nh-d14 was a good 10*c better. You also can't put 3 fans on the havik, which is a crucial reason why dual towers are amazing.

Not saying havik is a bad cooler, at $30 it's an amazing cooler. But it's not top end cooling, it's mid-range.

A 10*C drop from delidding is a very respectable drop in temps. That's about the difference in an nh-d14 and havik ^^. Plus with using only mx-4, that would make sense. I got about 15*c using pk-3, which is a much better paste. I got around a 23*C drop using CLU.

Results vary, I can't imagine only 3-4*C using clu from mx-4. Going from mx-4 ondie and IHS to CLU ondie/IHS has got to result in at least 10*C drop.

It's definitely worth delidding no matter what paste you have. The paste isn't the problem after all, the problem is the gap between the IHS and die that you reduce when you rub off the glue. It isn't worth delidding if your CPU can only do 4.6ghz and temperatures aren't your problem but the stability/quality of the chip is the problem. though, but if your chip can do 4.7+ on less than 1.5v I think it's worth delidding. Really depends on how good your chip is, how much you are pushing it, and if you really need lower temps.

For example I had a terrible ivy that could only do [email protected]+v. It wasn't worth delidding, and temps never were an issue on the overclock I ran on it (settled for something like [email protected] because the motherboard I ended up putting the chip on couldn't do more than 1.33v). On my current ivy, temps become a problem when lidded as I'm pushing way past 1.3v to really unlock the full potential of a great chip that's clearly capable of over 4.8ghz on less than 1.5v.

If you are only going to do 4.6ghz on your chip, eh, it's not really worth delidding but it's up to you. It's fun to do, some of us enjoy the process of delidding, and running cooler means lower power consumption, and longer chip life. Like I have no problem delidding just a terrible chip on a low overclock because the board can only do 1.33v, because that rig is going to be used for at least 7+ years, why not.

Rationally, I don't think it's worth risking the chip, but then I was confident in delidding and that nothing wrong would happen, I've got a steady hand and love these kinds of things, and the temp drop is just lower power consumption and lower chip life so why not. It's a free 10*C+ temp drop, you have to pay $50+ for those kind of temp drops.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I actually own both the havik 140 and nh-d14 and they are not similar at all. nh-d14 is way better, there's no way a single tower is going to compete with a dual tower. NZXT is a mid-range cooler, with similar fans it performed a little better (like a few degrees) than my h50. My nh-d14 was a good 10*c better. You also can't put 3 fans on the havik, which is a crucial reason why dual towers are amazing.
> 
> Not saying havik is a bad cooler, at $30 it's an amazing cooler. But it's not top end cooling, it's mid-range.
> 
> A 10*C drop from delidding is a very respectable drop in temps. That's about the difference in an nh-d14 and havik ^^. Plus with using only mx-4, that would make sense. I got about 15*c using pk-3, which is a much better paste. I got around a 23*C drop using CLU.
> 
> Results vary, I can't imagine only 3-4*C using clu from mx-4. Going from mx-4 ondie and IHS to CLU ondie/IHS has got to result in at least 10*C drop.
> 
> It's definitely worth delidding no matter what paste you have. The paste isn't the problem after all, the problem is the gap between the IHS and die that you reduce when you rub off the glue. It isn't worth delidding if your CPU can only do 4.6ghz and temperatures aren't your problem but the stability/quality of the chip is the problem. though, but if your chip can do 4.7+ on less than 1.5v I think it's worth delidding. Really depends on how good your chip is, how much you are pushing it, and if you really need lower temps.
> 
> For example I had a terrible ivy that could only do [email protected]+v. It wasn't worth delidding, and temps never were an issue on the overclock I ran on it (settled for something like [email protected] because the motherboard I ended up putting the chip on couldn't do more than 1.33v). On my current ivy, temps become a problem when lidded as I'm pushing way past 1.3v to really unlock the full potential of a great chip that's clearly capable of over 4.8ghz on less than 1.5v


from the reviews i've seen they are the same the nh-d14 is like a 2c ~ 0.5c better depending on how hot the processor is

here is a review from overclock3d to support what i'm saying






are you talking about the havik 120 ? because the havik 140 is not 30$









it's 61$ now

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835146011&Tpk=havik%20140

and i bought it for like 80$ when it was new

my chip currently does 4.4GHz @ 1.25 30 hours prime small ftt stable didn't try other tests, so i guess it could get 4.7~ 4.8 @ 1.40v maybe is that a de-lidding worthy chip ?

also i don't get it what could go when you remove the glue ? and reduce the space between the ihs and the die ?


----------



## Belial

You need to look at testing methodology for reviews (frozencpu, hardwaresecrets, and TH are the worst offenders in order but it's rare to find good reviews, vortez, hardocp, xbit, they do good ones from random bits ive seen there's always issues). Most of the time they don't use a modern chip, nor will they overclock it to any significant level.

The profiles of coolers, and pastes, changes dramatically on different levels of cooling. An extreme example is that budget HDT coolers (exposed heatpipe like hyper 212) like the Hyper 212 EVO will out perform custom water cooling, as HDT does extremely well on idle/lower loads and is extremely cheap to make (so good for lower level overclocks, dualcores, and some of the lower end quads) but will never stand up to a regular heatpipe design, and then water cooling specifically is 'bad' at idle and low load. So the Hyper 212 Evo will vary a good 40*C+ on low overclock to a high overclock, while water will never vary +/- 20*c from 50*C no matter what's going on.

I say this, but this is not an exaggeration of what some sites do. For example, Frozencpu tests a THERMAL PLATE at 150w! First off, Ivy Bridge will go above 150w when overclocked (maybe it is only the highest of overclocks, granted, but then nothing else is near as cool running or efficient as ivy bridge, god forbid you run an AMD or sandy or first gen core). But what's really bad about a 150w thermal plate, is that it spreads heat over a large 5cmx5cm square evenly, whereas a CPU emits heat only from a very, very small ~5mm x 30mm die (which is why putting enough paste to cover an entire IHS is actually worse than putting just enough to cover the die and covering only 1/4th the CPU).

This is why the Hyper 212 EVO is considered better than the Silver Arrow and Logisys Assassin on Frozencpu, and why many sites you don't see more than 5*C temp drop from a piece of crap cooler to the highest end cooler.

Another problem with all review sites, is that they will never push the chip far because they try to compare all heatsinks. That sounds nice, but you cannot run an overclock on a stock cooler. So in order to keep the stock cooler and similar cheap radial coolers on the same graph and table as the NH-D14, they run a very small overclock. So you got the stock cooler at 90*C on the table, but then the NH-D14 and Hyper 212 running maybe in the 50s' or 60's. Crank up an overclock where the Hyper 212 Evo is in the 80s, and you'll see a much larger difference between it and other, higher end coolers.

So 1-2*C might sound like a small difference on whatever review site you saw, but I'm willing to bet that the absolute temps were more like 55 vs 57, or 65 vs 67, in which case yea, 1-2*C is actually huge and will magnify to about a 10*C+ difference on a real world overclock.

This is why we care about 1-3*C temp differences in certain things, because it magnifies on a true overclock, especially when you got people in here that are really pushing the boundary and have no problem running over 1.5v for 24/7 overclocks, or are benching and pushing insane voltages.

And i was talking about the NZXT Havik 140. I got 2x 140mm havik fans, yes? I paid $30 for it. I bought it used here on the OCN marketplace. You can check my buyer feedback in my profile to see the listing (i think he listed it at like $50 or something but he had it up for sale for a few weeks with no bites so I offered $25 and we negotiated to $30).

Also you gotta consider sales. Anyone who buys heatsinks at their full price is dumb. Why would you buy the NZXT havik 140 for $61 when, say, the Zalman LQ310, a comparable cooler (midrange is midrange) for $29 on sale right now. In a week the Zalman LQ320 will be back up to $60+, in which case some other mid-range cooler will be $20-30 and that will be what to buy that week.
Quote:


> also i don't get it what could go when you remove the glue ? and reduce the space between the ihs and the die ?


When you remove the glue holding the IHS to the PCB of the CPU, it lowers the IHS so it creates a tighter contact to the die. Your heatsink would perform less optimally if it wasn't mounted tight. Same thing.
Quote:


> my chip currently does 4.4GHz @ 1.25 30 hours prime small ftt stable didn't try other tests, so i guess it could get 4.7~ 4.8 @ 1.40v maybe is that a de-lidding worthy chip ?


Why even bother testing 4.4ghz? Any sandy/ivy will do 4.5-5ghz on reasonable voltage. You can compare yoru results to others in the ivy bridge stable club:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet/0_100

1.25v for 4.4 seems about middle of the road compared to the other results. But then again maybe a lot of these guys are running 4.4 because their chips are so bad that they couldn't do 4.6+ on good voltages, I don't know. Maybe they dont have good coolers, they didnt delid, or have a bad motherboard.

i still lol that you ran 30 hours small fft. its okay just run prime95 blend









But your test of 30 hours of small fft is useless and it doesnt give any insight to how great your chip is. Assuming it could pass 24 hours of blend that seems average compared to other results so maybe you could push more, I don't know.

Here's a few things you can do:
Set your overclock to like [email protected] Boot up into windows. Use a software program like gigabyte tweaklauncher, and see how far you can go frequency wise. My bad chips would freeze when i put in around 4.6, 4.7, 4.8ghz. My good chip froze at 5.1ghz. That will give you an idea of how good your chip is. You could talk to others who've done that or ask them to do it if you PM people.

You could also just try to see how far you can overclock on 1.3v. If you are struggling with like 4.5ghz at 1.3, bad chip. If you can do maybe 4.6, 4.7, that's a better chip.

I mean you should really try to push a higher overclock first. I dont know why you are bothering with 1.25v, your cooler should be able to handle a lot more even before a delid.


----------



## Belial

and dear god the nzxt 140mm fans are such crap. The build quality is crap, they are flimsy plastic (like all nzxt fans i suppose). The weird bacon design just makes the fan extremely loud, and they have like this wobble. They shake my case when they are on high speed, I used the noctua low noise adaptor on them (AND put them on a fan controller so I could run them at 40%) because they were so bad.

And they have this terrible quality where when you run them at lower speeds, they wobble and create this terrible sound that isn't as bad when they are on high speed. They are just such insanely loud fans that push relatively little air for 140mm fans. I'm only using them because they should be better than 120mm fans (at least yate loon mediums) but I usually turn them off because they are so loud, even when on low power adaptors.

And the fan mounts nzxt uses on the havik are THE worst fan mounts I've ever dealt with, and I've used a lot of heatsinks. I dont know how you make a mount so terrible, in a few months they get crusty and break apart. Not a big deal, you can always use cable ties which is as good as any mount.

I tried to use my noctua fan clips on them originally, and I had to shave off large chunks on the fan to fit the nh-d14 clips on them. I ended up getting a 3rd noctua fan instead of using the 140mm bacon fan as my 3rd nh-d14 fan though.

As for that video.... that guy ran on stock settings, and he was running on large fft, which doesnt test for temperature at all. Like I said, you really put coolers on a high load chip, and who is in 1st place and who is in 2nd and 3rd will often change. On stock overclocks, the Hyper 212 Evo is technically THE BEST HEATSINK EVER as well as other HDT coolers. Put it on a decent overclock and you get something different, like custom water being #1 and high end coolers being #2.

Also another problem with review sites is they usually compare heatsinks by delta temps done on varying days of the year. It's nice for a quick comparison of a ton of heatsinks but it isn't accurate, as ambient temps have an exponential impact on load temps.

That guy's review went way too long holy crap he talks a lot. I applaud anyone doing that kind of thing, of course, but he's just not really pushing the heatsinks.

edit: and no offense that you paid so much for the havik, I'm talking US prices. Egypt Im sure isn't the same prices lol.
You should pay:
$20 or less for low end coolers (hyper 212, gaia, etc)
$20-40 for midrange
$40-70 for high end

Now the H100 might be on sale once a year for $60-70, or might be only that price on ebay used, but there's 100 other heatsinks that perform within 1-2*C and are basically identical to it in performance. Just as it goes, the Logisys Assassin for the last few months was $39 (it's not as good as the h100, but it's still within 3*c and is the best air cooler). Then last week the Zalman lq320 was $39, which outperforms the H100 and likely outperforms the H100i on apples to apples.

A specific cooler might not be on sale, but one exactly like it always is.

It's not really fair to compare only the nh-d14 with 120/140 vs a nzxt 140/140 either. Slap a 3rd fan on the nh-d14, which you can't do with the havik, or, use just 2x120mm fans on both (or 2x140mm i suppose, since both can use 140s) and see what the results are.

nzxt nh-d14 is definitely on the lower end of high end heatsinks, but it's definitely way better than the nzxt 140. Maybe I should have done a heatsink review, I didn't really bother to because it was apparent as I ran multiple CPUs and overclocks that the havik wasn't in the same league. It's a very capable cooler, like I said, at $20-40 which is all you should pay for a mid-range cooler (in the US, i know prices always vary) it's great.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> You need to look at testing methodology for reviews (frozencpu, hardwaresecrets, and TH are the worst offenders in order but it's rare to find good reviews, vortez, hardocp, xbit, they do good ones from random bits ive seen there's always issues). Most of the time they don't use a modern chip, nor will they overclock it to any significant level.
> 
> The profiles of coolers, and pastes, changes dramatically on different levels of cooling. An extreme example is that budget HDT coolers (exposed heatpipe like hyper 212) like the Hyper 212 EVO will out perform custom water cooling, as HDT does extremely well on idle/lower loads and is extremely cheap to make (so good for lower level overclocks, dualcores, and some of the lower end quads) but will never stand up to a regular heatpipe design, and then water cooling specifically is 'bad' at idle and low load. So the Hyper 212 Evo will vary a good 40*C+ on low overclock to a high overclock, while water will never vary +/- 20*c from 50*C no matter what's going on.
> 
> I say this, but this is not an exaggeration of what some sites do. For example, Frozencpu tests a THERMAL PLATE at 150w! First off, Ivy Bridge will go above 150w when overclocked (maybe it is only the highest of overclocks, granted, but then nothing else is near as cool running or efficient as ivy bridge, god forbid you run an AMD or sandy or first gen core). But what's really bad about a 150w thermal plate, is that it spreads heat over a large 5cmx5cm square evenly, whereas a CPU emits heat only from a very, very small ~5mm x 30mm die (which is why putting enough paste to cover an entire IHS is actually worse than putting just enough to cover the die and covering only 1/4th the CPU).
> 
> This is why the Hyper 212 EVO is considered better than the Silver Arrow and Logisys Assassin on Frozencpu, and why many sites you don't see more than 5*C temp drop from a piece of crap cooler to the highest end cooler.
> 
> Another problem with all review sites, is that they will never push the chip far because they try to compare all heatsinks. That sounds nice, but you cannot run an overclock on a stock cooler. So in order to keep the stock cooler and similar cheap radial coolers on the same graph and table as the NH-D14, they run a very small overclock. So you got the stock cooler at 90*C on the table, but then the NH-D14 and Hyper 212 running maybe in the 50s' or 60's. Crank up an overclock where the Hyper 212 Evo is in the 80s, and you'll see a much larger difference between it and other, higher end coolers.
> 
> So 1-2*C might sound like a small difference on whatever review site you saw, but I'm willing to bet that the absolute temps were more like 55 vs 57, or 65 vs 67, in which case yea, 1-2*C is actually huge and will magnify to about a 10*C+ difference on a real world overclock.
> 
> This is why we care about 1-3*C temp differences in certain things, because it magnifies on a true overclock, especially when you got people in here that are really pushing the boundary and have no problem running over 1.5v for 24/7 overclocks, or are benching and pushing insane voltages.
> 
> And i was talking about the NZXT Havik 140. I got 2x 140mm havik fans, yes? I paid $30 for it. I bought it used here on the OCN marketplace. You can check my buyer feedback in my profile to see the listing (i think he listed it at like $50 or something but he had it up for sale for a few weeks with no bites so I offered $25 and we negotiated to $30).
> 
> Also you gotta consider sales. Anyone who buys heatsinks at their full price is dumb. Why would you buy the NZXT havik 140 for $61 when, say, the Zalman LQ310, a comparable cooler (midrange is midrange) for $29 on sale right now. In a week the Zalman LQ320 will be back up to $60+, in which case some other mid-range cooler will be $20-30 and that will be what to buy that week.
> When you remove the glue holding the IHS to the PCB of the CPU, it lowers the IHS so it creates a tighter contact to the die. Your heatsink would perform less optimally if it wasn't mounted tight. Same thing.
> Why even bother testing 4.4ghz? Any sandy/ivy will do 4.5-5ghz on reasonable voltage. You can compare yoru results to others in the ivy bridge stable club:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet/0_100
> 
> 1.25v for 4.4 seems about middle of the road compared to the other results. But then again maybe a lot of these guys are running 4.4 because their chips are so bad that they couldn't do 4.6+ on good voltages, I don't know. Maybe they dont have good coolers, they didnt delid, or have a bad motherboard.
> 
> i still lol that you ran 30 hours small fft. its okay just run prime95 blend
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But your test of 30 hours of small fft is useless and it doesnt give any insight to how great your chip is. Assuming it could pass 24 hours of blend that seems average compared to other results so maybe you could push more, I don't know.
> 
> Here's a few things you can do:
> Set your overclock to like [email protected] Boot up into windows. Use a software program like gigabyte tweaklauncher, and see how far you can go frequency wise. My bad chips would freeze when i put in around 4.6, 4.7, 4.8ghz. My good chip froze at 5.1ghz. That will give you an idea of how good your chip is. You could talk to others who've done that or ask them to do it if you PM people.
> 
> You could also just try to see how far you can overclock on 1.3v. If you are struggling with like 4.5ghz at 1.3, bad chip. If you can do maybe 4.6, 4.7, that's a better chip.
> 
> I mean you should really try to push a higher overclock first. I dont know why you are bothering with 1.25v, your cooler should be able to handle a lot more even before a delid.


dude aside from your posts being really long and i don't understand most of your points but just don't call me dumb for paying retail price for a heatsink.....

also arn't you the guy who were saying it's ok to run 1.9v on an ivy cpu









get your facts right, the guy from overclock 3d pushed the 2 coolers to their maximum with an i7 950 @ 4.4 ghz or 4.2 don't really remember and the the gap was 2c at low overclocks and at high overclocks the gap decreased to 0.5 c

also if you got it used for 30$ this doesn't make it a mid-range 30$ cooler, because anybody looking to buy it new will pay retail price which is 60$ now

and i bother testing @ 4.4 GHz because of the temp don't want it to go over 80c max while testing


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> dude aside from your posts being really long and i don't understand most of your points but just don't call me dumb for paying retail price for a heatsink.....


I apologize, and apologized, as I had written that before seeing the part where you overpaid for a havik.
Quote:


> also arn't you the guy who were saying it's ok to run 1.9v on an ivy cpu


arnt you the guy who ;aid $61 for a mid-range cooler








Quote:


> get your facts right, the guy from overclock 3d pushed the 2 coolers to their maximum with an i7 950 @ 4.4 ghz or 4.2 don't really remember and the the gap was 2c at low overclocks and at high overclocks the gap decreased to 0.5 c


So he tests them on totally different days and different ambient temps, he compares a cooler with a 120/140mm fans instead of 2x140mm fans that are blazingly loud, and he tests them on large fft instead of a small fft which results in a 10-20*C lower temperature result.

It's a terrible review. I own both the nh-d14 and havik, I'm using both right now, I can tell you, easily 5-10*c difference on them. His review goes against every other review out there as well. It's not physically possible for a single tower cooler, to perform on the same level as a dual tower with almost twice the surface area (except the very ridiculous hr-02 macho, which still doesnt beat any of the dual towers). No amount of innovation and copper/nickel/silver is going to make one design better than another. It may reduce the gap, but it won't make it better.

The archon is a better heatsink even, and that is still quite a bit behind the nh-d14.
Quote:


> also if you got it used for 30$ this doesn't make it a mid-range 30$ cooler, because anybody looking to buy it new will pay retail price which is 60$ now


Right, I'm well aware of what prices might be regularly. It's a mid-range cooler. You should never pay more than $20-40 for a mid-range cooler. The NZXT havik might be only $20-40 once a year on some special newegg shell shocker or used, but there are hundreds of other mid-range coolers with 6 heatpipes, single tower, that are out there, that perform identically, and one of them is on sale, all the time.
Quote:


> and i bother testing @ 4.4 GHz because of the temp don't want it to go over 80c max while testing


Maybe you should have gotten a better cooler









80*C is quite cool, for a max temp really 90-105*C is fine depending on how conservative you are. I had no problem with my havik going over [email protected], pretty sure it stayed around 80 as I know I wasn't pushing temps at all.

You can learn something, or you can just get angry and nasty about things, i dont even know why. I'm telling you why that review is terrible and why most reviews in general are terrible. Sorry if that hurts your sensibilities.


----------



## c2thew

turns out whenever i play cs:go i get random crashes at 4.4 and 4.5ghz. At first i thought it was my video card, but after looking at WHEA, it turns out that my computer isn't quite stable. I think it's because that I used a napkin during the delidding process as I've cleaned my chip several times. Static electricity is probably what neutered my chip from being able to overclock beyond a stable 4.5ghz.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> turns out whenever i play cs:go i get random crashes at 4.4 and 4.5ghz. At first i thought it was my video card, but after looking at WHEA, it turns out that my computer isn't quite stable. I think it's because that I used a napkin during the delidding process as I've cleaned my chip several times. Static electricity is probably what neutered my chip from being able to overclock beyond a stable 4.5ghz.


lol that would not cause a problem, all that would do (using a napkin to clean) is at worst leave flakes of napkin on the CPU that likely get on anyone's cpu just because of stuff traveling in the air. Stuff like getting your finger on the ihs, touching it and such, really has no impact on the temps (maybe like .00001 degree more if anything). Static electricity will kill your chip, as in it won't work. It won't make it a bad overclocker.

The majority of ivies are just 'bad' overclockers. It's only a very few chips that can get beyond 4.5-4.6ghz, and a very select few that can do 4.7+. Much less any that can do 4.7+ on a low voltage.

So I failed prime95, again, at the 16th hour. Hardware failure on one worker. These ram timings, so hard. I'm pretty sure I'm just right there with stability but I have no idea what to loosen, what secondary tertiary to really loosen. I went from TRFC from 100 to 110, like this (2400mhz CL8-12-8-28 1T 1.75v)



I have no idea which of these many, many timings is responsible for me to keep failing like this so I'm just going to bump voltage up from 1.75 to 1.76. Maybe I'll use DDR LLC too, haha.

Anyways my point is that I tried that intel xtreme tuning benchmark on these settings. I did the memory test, 5 minutes. Now 5 minutes is far from 16 hours, but it didn't reveal any instability.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I apologize, and apologized, as I had written that before seeing the part where you overpaid for a havik.
> arnt you the guy who ;aid $61 for a mid-range cooler
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So he tests them on totally different days and different ambient temps, he compares a cooler with a 120/140mm fans instead of 2x140mm fans that are blazingly loud, and he tests them on large fft instead of a small fft which results in a 10-20*C lower temperature result.
> 
> It's a terrible review. I own both the nh-d14 and havik, I'm using both right now, I can tell you, easily 5-10*c difference on them. His review goes against every other review out there as well. It's not physically possible for a single tower cooler, to perform on the same level as a dual tower with almost twice the surface area (except the very ridiculous hr-02 macho, which still doesnt beat any of the dual towers). No amount of innovation and copper/nickel/silver is going to make one design better than another. It may reduce the gap, but it won't make it better.
> 
> The archon is a better heatsink even, and that is still quite a bit behind the nh-d14.
> Right, I'm well aware of what prices might be regularly. It's a mid-range cooler. You should never pay more than $20-40 for a mid-range cooler. The NZXT havik might be only $20-40 once a year on some special newegg shell shocker or used, but there are hundreds of other mid-range coolers with 6 heatpipes, single tower, that are out there, that perform identically, and one of them is on sale, all the time.
> Maybe you should have gotten a better cooler
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 80*C is quite cool, for a max temp really 90-105*C is fine depending on how conservative you are. I had no problem with my havik going over [email protected], pretty sure it stayed around 80 as I know I wasn't pushing temps at all.
> 
> You can learn something, or you can just get angry and nasty about things, i dont even know why. I'm telling you why that review is terrible and why most reviews in general are terrible. Sorry if that hurts your sensibilities.


the only thing that actually hurts me is way you trash my words like i'm a pos, it's like you are talking to a complete ******, look back at the way you talk in that post, it makes you come off like a mr.know it all while everybody else including me is a pos.

i will respect you but i expect the same in return....


----------



## Belial

Okay let's leave it at that. I meant no offense, I saw the price you paid afterwards, and I don't think it's really applicable if you aren't in the US anyways.

It's more like I think certain reviewers are dumb. And even then I don't think that's true, I think they are fully aware what they are doing and skewing their tests intentionally, so that they get more products to test out(notice they never say "this item sucks!", every single item reviewed is always high quality A+! at least) and ultimately sell and make money on, and to attract a larger audience (the more dumbed down the material and less technical and in-depth, the wider audience you'll have, ie OCN's forum size vs Tomshardware forum, vs even the more specialist hardware sites like rebelshaven which is basically dead).

They all have an agenda, I think, and it rages me. Hardware Secrets puts out absolutely amazing articles, like their article on what a VRM is, how to judge a power supply, explanation of RAM timings, but their benchmarks on heatsinks and thermal paste is absolute crap (although the stuff about testing chocolate and vaseline and various household products is cool). Tomshardware puts out a ton of stuff and it's great they get a lot of people into this stuff, but their forums are a cesspool of bad advice and their benchmarks are definitely, intentionally, geared toward uninformed people (ie 'this motherboard is the best overclocker because it has a great overclocking software", "this motherboard is the fastest even though that's only because it's stock bios settings slightly overclock the ram and bclk").

I used to worship TH and loved it. Over time I started going from 'noticing' they weren't talking about certain things to intentionally leaving certain details out. It's the Reviewer industrial complex man, say nice things and companies will send you more stuff to review.

Prolimatech offered to let me review more of their stuff after I tested their thermal paste, but I told them it would be unfair if I ended up writing a negative review of their new fan when I don't have the specialist equipment necessary to test fans out (dba meter, cfm meter, static fluid meter, whatever those are). I don't think the reason they didn't send me the fan to test out was because I didn't have the complex equipment to do an honest fan test.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Okay let's leave it at that. I meant no offense, I saw the price you paid afterwards, and I don't think it's really applicable if you aren't in the US anyways.
> 
> It's more like I think certain reviewers are dumb. And even then I don't think that's true, I think they are fully aware what they are doing and skewing their tests intentionally, so that they get more products to test out(notice they never say "this item sucks!", every single item reviewed is always high quality A+! at least) and ultimately sell and make money on, and to attract a larger audience (the more dumbed down the material and less technical and in-depth, the wider audience you'll have, ie OCN's forum size vs Tomshardware forum, vs even the more specialist hardware sites like rebelshaven which is basically dead).
> 
> They all have an agenda, I think, and it rages me. Hardware Secrets puts out absolutely amazing articles, like their article on what a VRM is, how to judge a power supply, explanation of RAM timings, but their benchmarks on heatsinks and thermal paste is absolute crap (although the stuff about testing chocolate and vaseline and various household products is cool). Tomshardware puts out a ton of stuff and it's great they get a lot of people into this stuff, but their forums are a cesspool of bad advice and their benchmarks are definitely, intentionally, geared toward uninformed people (ie 'this motherboard is the best overclocker because it has a great overclocking software", "this motherboard is the fastest even though that's only because it's stock bios settings slightly overclock the ram and bclk").
> 
> I used to worship TH and loved it. Over time I started going from 'noticing' they weren't talking about certain things to intentionally leaving certain details out. It's the Reviewer industrial complex man, say nice things and companies will send you more stuff to review.
> 
> Prolimatech offered to let me review more of their stuff after I tested their thermal paste, but I told them it would be unfair if I ended up writing a negative review of their new fan when I don't have the specialist equipment necessary to test fans out (dba meter, cfm meter, static fluid meter, whatever those are). I don't think the reason they didn't send me the fan to test out was because I didn't have the complex equipment to do an honest fan test.


ok let's forget it and put it behind our backs









also since you apologized i apologize too if i offended you mr.demon lord belial


----------



## Totally Dubbed

You first run ibt. Then run prime, then fold if needs be. Then you know you're 100% stable


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> ok let's forget it and put it behind our backs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also since you apologized i apologize too if i offended you mr.demon lord belial


Glad you guys sorted it out. You wouldn't like Valgaur when he's angry, he'll make you read every word posted on this thread.......


----------



## BradleyW

Do you void Intel warrenty by running the chip over the default voltage? Or do they cover moderate overclocking? I can't seem to find the exact UK warranty Document for the i7 3770k 2 year warranty plan as standard with all i7 3770k's.


----------



## alancsalt

I think I put "100% stable" in the same box with "future proof"...


----------



## Zeek

Temps before the chip gets nekid. I have a pretty high ambient. 24c'ish










Spoiler: Pics


----------



## wazza300

whea errors/warnings,esp cpu parity errors are 100% not enough cpu voltage


----------



## B3g5l

So round 2 of delidding was way more fun than the first attempt. It came off in maybe a minute. The last one was so tight I couldn't get under it at all. My only regret is the first chip was a great one and this one is complete crap. The first one I was able to do 5.0ghz on air and this one hasn't gone past 4.7.







Oh well lesson learned. If its tight don't try to mess it up. Just enjoy it.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> So round 2 of delidding was way more fun than the first attempt. It came off in maybe a minute. The last one was so tight I couldn't get under it at all. My only regret is the first chip was a great one and this one is complete crap. The first one I was able to do 5.0ghz on air and this one hasn't gone past 4.7.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh well lesson learned. If its tight don't try to mess it up. Just enjoy it.


Did you replace the 1st CPU with this new one?
What errors are you getting at 4.7Ghz?


----------



## B3g5l

The first one was a delid fail. It was so tight the blade wouldn't fit under it anywhere. I ended up scraping the green off the board while trying.







I was fortunate enough that the store gave me warranty on the old one. Possibly after painting the board again to match... Lol So far anything over 4.7 runs at 100 degrees real fast in Prime and I end up aborting test. Any less voltage and it just doesn't load. Its been annoying me. The temps dropped from 40 idle on my 4.6 day to day clock to 15. Minus one core that is always high to the rest. My core one seems to jump about 10 degrees higher then the rest all the time. When I've got some time I'm going to see if I can get higher now. I hope so.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B3g5l*
> 
> The first one was a delid fail. It was so tight the blade wouldn't fit under it anywhere. I ended up scraping the green off the board while trying.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was fortunate enough that the store gave me warranty on the old one. Possibly after painting the board again to match... Lol So far anything over 4.7 runs at 100 degrees real fast in Prime and I end up aborting test. Any less voltage and it just doesn't load. Its been annoying me. The temps dropped from 40 idle on my 4.6 day to day clock to 15. Minus one core that is always high to the rest. My core one seems to jump about 10 degrees higher then the rest all the time. When I've got some time I'm going to see if I can get higher now. I hope so.


You might have to reseat the IHS and use a bit more TIM by the sounds of it. What TIM do you use for the die?


----------



## Zeek

Do you guys apply TIM to the die and the bottom side of the IHS too? I'm about to delid and I'm unsure, lol.


----------



## wazza300

I just applied liquid pro to the top of the die and top of the ihs,between it and your cpu cooler

using a silver arrow aircooler max temp I get in ibt max memory stress is 78c @4.8ghz 1.38v


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Do you guys apply TIM to the die and the bottom side of the IHS too? I'm about to delid and I'm unsure, lol.


If you are using pro or ultra, then I would recommend a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS in addition to painting the die. You don't have to do that, people have done it both ways. I think it has to do with exactly how much you put on the die since I am sure we all did it at least slightly differently. Take a pic after you apply, so we can see.


----------



## quark004

hey guys just wondering if temp drops can give me any hope of lowering the vcore for a particular clock speed. I have my 3570k at 4.5 ghz and vcore at 1.338.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *quark004*
> 
> hey guys just wondering if temp drops can give me any hope of lowering the vcore for a particular clock speed. I have my 3570k at 4.5 ghz and vcore at 1.338.


Personally, I have not experienced my chip needed lower voltage to be stable by delidding. After the delid my temps were so good that I could afford to go for a higher multiple, but the 15 to 20c drop didn't lower my voltage requirements. I have heard people mention that lower temps keep them more stable though.

Welcome to OCN, buy the way, here is how to get your rig in your posts:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig


----------



## quark004

thnx for the reply. I have been following so many threads on overclocking and it has given me a lot of confidence to overclock my cpu. Gr8 knowledge base here.


----------



## Zeek

Time to start delidding











Edit: That wasn't too bad


----------



## BradleyW

How hot would a chip run if you delid and remove all TIM without replacing it?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Time to start delidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: That wasn't too bad


VERY nice man - well done!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> How hot would a chip run if you delid and remove all TIM without replacing it?


Probably burn on the copper...


----------



## MKHunt

So a 3770k is in the mail. I need convincing to delid it. Cooling it and my 590 is an EX360, RX240, and RX120 with an MCP-35x so I'm not really hurting for cooling ability, I just like lower temps. I've also read that the best time to delid is before the chip gets sandwiched by a heatsink/waterblock.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> VERY nice man - well done!!
> Probably burn on the copper...


What about of not all the die is covered properly? Overheating issues?


----------



## Youmu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Do you void Intel warrenty by running the chip over the default voltage? Or do they cover moderate overclocking? I can't seem to find the exact UK warranty Document for the i7 3770k 2 year warranty plan as standard with all i7 3770k's.


Noticed this post got skipped.

I don't think there is any way to void a warranty without physically damaging the CPU. They have no real way to tell what damaged it, and I do believe that Intel's warranty (or at least one of their extra warranty plans, that you have to pay 30$~ for) covers moderate OCing.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I think I put "100% stable" in the same box with "future proof"...


I wish I could +rep you man...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Noticed this post got skipped.
> 
> I don't think there is any way to void a warranty without physically damaging the CPU. They have no real way to tell what damaged it, and I do believe that Intel's warranty (or at least one of their extra warranty plans, that you have to pay 30$~ for) covers moderate OCing.


The one you pay for covers ln2 overclocking if you like...no questions asked replacement.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> So a 3770k is in the mail. I need convincing to delid it. Cooling it and my 590 is an EX360, RX240, and RX120 with an MCP-35x so I'm not really hurting for cooling ability, I just like lower temps. I've also read that the best time to delid is before the chip gets sandwiched by a heatsink/waterblock.


You should only attempt to delid if you can afford a new chip. I would only recommend delidding if your chip will benefit from lowered temps and thus give you the opportunity to go for a higher multiplier. If you have a chip that is already limited by high voltage requirements, then I don't really think it is worth it. Unless you just feel like doing it for fun of course.

The big thing we all want to know is how much of a temp drop you get after delidding. You can't know that, or what your voltage requirements are for the chip unless you install it, overclock it , and test it before delidding. I can't image the pressure applied by installing a cooler would make any difference to delidding afterwards.


----------



## Zeek

Ahh it's so perty. I can't get all of the gunk off of the PCB tho :c


Spoiler: Pics


----------



## BradleyW

Do intel or other resellers check to see if you've removed the IHS? btw, good job on the delid Zeek. You deserve a good chip!


----------



## Youmu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Do intel or other resellers check to see if you've removed the IHS? btw, good job on the delid Zeek. You deserve a good chip!


Discussing RMA fraud is against the rules, I'll answer that in PM.


----------



## Zeek

I went from maxing out at 82c to maxing out at 58c under 4.5ghz OC. I'm as happy as can be


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I went from maxing out at 82c to maxing out at 58c under 4.5ghz OC. I'm as happy as can be


How much volts do you need for 4.5Ghz?
Any other changes sucvh as PLL, ICH, VTT and so on?


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> How much volts do you need for 4.5Ghz?
> Any other changes sucvh as PLL, ICH, VTT and so on?


1.2v for 4.5ghz. And I haven't touched any settings so PPL is 1.58v VTT 1.07v VCSAA .925v


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> 1.2v for 4.5ghz. And I haven't touched any settings so PPL is 1.58v VTT 1.07v VCSAA .925v


My chip also did 4.5Ghz at 1.2v but it is vcore sensitive and blue screens at 1.3v or higher. I suggest you put around 1.35vcore into the chip and test using blend for 15-20 mins.


----------



## B3g5l

Ill try reseating it this weekend coming when I've got a min. Hopefully it'll help it out some. For tim I've got liquid pro on the inside and mx4 on the outside as my cooler is aluminum.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Do intel or other resellers check to see if you've removed the IHS? btw, good job on the delid Zeek. You deserve a good chip!


...yup, and some of their folks are avid members of OCN...so...

a.) ...always make sure that when you post pics of your deed, folks can read all the numbers on the IHS









b.) ...when you delidded and also lapped your CPU, just keep the CPU but sent back the loose lapped IHS with all the numbers gone and say "...it came that way"

c.) ...get a lawyer who writes you a note that says "...*Valgaur made me do it*"


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> My chip also did 4.5Ghz at 1.2v but it is vcore sensitive and blue screens at 1.3v or higher. I suggest you put around 1.35vcore into the chip and test using blend for 15-20 mins.


I plan to see how high I can go later. I have an extra 24c I can use now


----------



## ACHILEE5

Anyone in this thread talking about RMA is really


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I think I put "100% stable" in the same box with "future proof"...


...and Roy says that your *true* words of wisdom 'will all be lost, like tears in the rain'


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *quark004*
> 
> hey guys just wondering if temp drops can give me any hope of lowering the vcore for a particular clock speed. I have my 3570k at 4.5 ghz and vcore at 1.338.


...it depends on several other factors. It certainly *is possible,* but not the norm. I have several 3770s (K and non-K), and on two of them, including the 'K', I could lower vCore by a few steps after working on 20-30 C temp drops...that however includes not only de-lidding, CL-P / U / MX4, but also adding custom cooling loops with 360/60 rads cooled by six push/pull 120mm fans, instead of a 'closed loop' 240/280 mm with two 120mm fans.

Still working on the final setup but on the 3770K, but so far I saved 0.05 v...after dropping temps for a combined total of 27 C in stress testing / 100 % load. Ivy Bridge processors in particular have this strong temp / v trade-off


----------



## Zeek

I'm surprised









Before Delidding



And after



I didn't think it was going to be so much


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yup, and some of their folks are avid members of OCN...so...
> 
> a.) ...always make sure that when you post pics of your deed, folks can read all the numbers on the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> b.) ...when you delidded and but also lapped your CPU, just keep the CPU but sent back the loose lapped IHS with all the numbers gone and say "...it came that way"
> 
> c.) ...get a lawyer who writes you a note that says "...*Valgaur made me do it*"


Lol Valgaur made me do it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ACHILEE5*
> 
> Anyone in this thread talking about RMA is really


I agree guys come on here you know how I don't like talking about this in here, let's try harder to keep it out.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Do you void Intel warrenty by running the chip over the default voltage? Or do they cover moderate overclocking? I can't seem to find the exact UK warranty Document for the i7 3770k 2 year warranty plan as standard with all i7 3770k's.


Technically, yes. Intel and AMD says you void the warranty if you overclock at all. Practically, Intel doesn't even ask for a proof of purchase during an RMA. And I believe someone said they allow up to 3 incidences per chip, or that's sort of their limit.

They also have a 'Performance Tuning Plan' where the original purchaser of a chip, for $20-35, can have an extended warranty of sorts that covers any type of overclocking, no questions. I don't think it covers delidding so I didn't care for it.
Quote:


> So a 3770k is in the mail. I need convincing to delid it. Cooling it and my 590 is an EX360, RX240, and RX120 with an MCP-35x so I'm not really hurting for cooling ability, I just like lower temps. I've also read that the best time to delid is before the chip gets sandwiched by a heatsink/waterblock.


I would recommend you test it out first and bin it (set to 1.3v, see if it's good enough that you can crank it to 5ghz in software). A bad chip isn't worth delidding unless you want to do it for fun. The majority of ivies are bad chips and can't do more than 4.5-4.6, so they aren't worth delidding.
Quote:


> Ahh it's so perty. I can't get all of the gunk off of the PCB tho :c


Use a generous amount of Isopropyl alcohol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm surprised
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before Delidding
> 
> 
> 
> And after
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think it was going to be so much


^^^ *NICE*... congrats


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> and i'm from egypt and the only thermal compounds available to me are some ocz freeze that i have around from a couple of years back and i can get mx-4 or noctua nt-h1 from the market


If you are the adventurous type, and don't mind doing some experimentation you could break open a Mercury free thermometer that contains Galinstan; an alloy quite similar to Liquid Pro, but with a lower thermal conductivity (16.5 W·m−1·K−1).

http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=362174&catid=182982&aid=338666&aparam=goobase_filler


----------



## gdesmo

The moment you touch the pcb with the knife you have technically voided your warranty ! Don`t blame the manufacturers for all the times they have been ripped off by people RMAing things that should not be sent back !


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> The moment you touch the pcb with the knife you have technically voided your warranty ! Don`t blame the manufacturers for all the times they have been ripped off by people RMAing things that should not be sent back !


I don't think anyone is angry about this. However, I've seemed to upset some people when I asked about the 3 year warranty and the OC warranty. Why people have gotten upset about this I don't know. Also, a certain member thinks my question is related to RMA fraud or something like that, which again, I don't get how that conclusion has been made? If someone could explain to me then go ahead?


----------



## Belial

It's upsetting because this site is like anti-piracy and stuff (even though everyone here does it?). No hax'd windows, no loaders, and no abusing warranties and such.

Delidding pretty clearly voids the warranty, and returning the chip because of your own mess-ups just puts the cost of your mistake on everyone else as you hurt Intel, who has to eat that cost, and companies, like all economic animals, are going to shift that load, so us, the customer base, will likely eat part of your mistake too.

If you delid, you can always sell your chip used, delidded, you can even sell it on ebay as 'parts/not working' and still get most of your money back. Just understand it'll be unpopular here when you ask, basically 'hey guys want to pay for my mistake?". We'll help you if you ruin your chip, there are many legitimate things you can do, but lying and abusing warranty is not one of them.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> ^ I think they got upset at someone else.


I was the one who asked about Warranty though. So I assume.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I don't think anyone is angry about this. However, I've seemed to upset some people when I asked about the 3 year warranty and the OC warranty. Why people have gotten upset about this I don't know. Also, a certain member thinks my question is related to RMA fraud or something like that, which again, I don't get how that conclusion has been made? If someone could explain to me then go ahead?


Not really mad at anyone in particular, it`s just that people damage items and expect the manufacturers to foot the bill. Talk like that is against the rules, should not really be discussed because it just gives people the idea that it is ok. Don`t worry, be happy ! lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Actually I'm curious to know how it works with the law: Buying a product and expecting it to hit better temps. But after modifications and thus voiding the warranty, grants you better temps. You could actually win a case against Intel. Think about it.
You could tell them and argue, having the average temperatures one should expect with it on stock should be in the product description, as that plays a vital role in your buying decisions of not only the chip but the cooling solutions you will need.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Congrats !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm glad someone actually tried that. I had seen it before and posted about it here:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/12860#post_19413915
> 
> 
> 
> ...however, the original (in Germany) I referred to did not mention the exact amount to machine off...but since you have done it for real (and I'm thinking about it), the big magical question is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how much did the machinist take off (in mm with decimal pts, please) ...pleeeaaase
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...inquiring minds want to know, and so does our machinist


IHS opening is> 17.5 mm X 23.5 mm , block surface area is 16 X 23.5 mm and is 4.3 mm deep from die surface to the main body of the block. Note that the actual die is only 10 X 19 mm, I purposely did it that way so the block would retain more thermal mass. Block being used should ideally have a micropin structure that sticks upwards from main block. Water blocks with groove machined into the bottom will most likely not have enough material to cut the rectangular die interface. Block I have will be triple plated with pure silver to aid conduction. Which brings me to the next project, no I`ll leave that to another time. Any way I hope that info helps a bit, Oops I forgot to add one big item. hole is offset upwards in the IHS so that it leaves a little more strength on the side that has a notch in it. Cheers !


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> How much volts do you need for 4.5Ghz?
> Any other changes sucvh as PLL, ICH, VTT and so on?


enable pll overvoltage for high oc


----------



## stickg1

I put some CLP on a peanut butter sandwich. Now I idle at 93F instead of 98.6F, that's a 5.5F DROP!!!


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> It's upsetting because this site is like anti-piracy and stuff (even though everyone here does it?). No hax'd windows, no loaders, and no abusing warranties and such.
> 
> Delidding pretty clearly voids the warranty, and returning the chip because of your own mess-ups just puts the cost of your mistake on everyone else as you hurt Intel, who has to eat that cost, and companies, like all economic animals, are going to shift that load, so us, the customer base, will likely eat part of your mistake too.
> 
> If you delid, you can always sell your chip used, delidded, you can even sell it on ebay as 'parts/not working' and still get most of your money back. Just understand it'll be unpopular here when you ask, basically 'hey guys want to pay for my mistake?". We'll help you if you ruin your chip, there are many legitimate things you can do, but *lying and abusing warranty* is not one of them.


Why is everyone going on about this? And why was I accused of this earlier?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I put some CLP on a peanut butter sandwich. Now I idle at 93F instead of 98.6F, that's a 5.5F DROP!!!


In that case get your therapist to apply more volts in your next session.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> IHS opening is> 17.5 mm X 23.5 mm , block surface area is 16 X 23.5 mm and is 4.3 mm deep from die surface to the main body of the block. Note that the actual die is only 10 X 19 mm, I purposely did it that way so the block would retain more thermal mass. Block being used should ideally have a micropin structure that sticks upwards from main block. Water blocks with groove machined into the bottom will most likely not have enough material to cut the rectangular die interface. Block I have will be triple plated with pure silver to aid conduction. Which brings me to the next project, no I`ll leave that to another time. Any way I hope that info helps a bit, Oops I forgot to add one big item. hole is offset upwards in the IHS so that it leaves a little more strength on the side that has a notch in it. Cheers !


... Rep+ added
















THANK YOU so much for this highly specialized information, it will save us some trial, error and frustration (and probably the life of one test block)...when I got my CPU, it was a great performer out of the box but I called it 'ugly duckling' as the IHS was mounted slightly crooked (one side touched the PCB, the other lifted off the PCB by a fair margin)...also turns out that the IHS is quite curved on top, and lapping only does so much, never mind trying to lap the underside of the IHS 'evenly'...so running IHS-free seems like a good option

...kind of curious to learn more about your next project per teaser above...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, let it be...just don't discuss those sort of topics here.


----------



## valkeriefire

It is important to remember this is a public forum and that there is a lot of manufacturer support here. Based on previous posts it is reasonable that Intel intentionally made the TIM poorly transfer heat, if they hadn't, the chip would perform too well, which would reduce sales of SB-E and Haswell when it comes out. Having been involved in court myself, I know no one is going to go to court with intel over a $300 dollar CPU. It will cost you more just to consult a lawyer on the matter, going to court would be thousands more.

The moderators in charge of the forum need to make sure RMA fraud isn't discussed in order to maintain the credibility of the forum. We have to play by rules if we want to hang out here. I dual boot my rig and run an OS named after a fruit, but I can't discuss it here. It's just the way it is. Live with it and enjoy the benefits of OCN.


----------



## BradleyW

Any tips on resealing the IHS with Silicone, such as how to seal it?
Might sell the chip to my mate and grab another from ebay.
Cheers.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ... Rep+ added
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> THANK YOU so much for this highly specialized information, it will save us some trial, error and frustration (and probably the life of one test block)...when I got my CPU, it was a great performer out of the box but I called it 'ugly duckling' as the IHS was mounted slightly crooked (one side touched the PCB, the other lifted off the PCB by a fair margin)...also turns out that the IHS is quite curved on top, and lapping only does so much, never mind trying to lap the underside of the IHS 'evenly'...so running IHS-free seems like a good option
> 
> ...kind of curious to learn more about your next project per teaser above...


Thanx, whereabouts in our great land are you located ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Thanx, whereabouts in our great land are you located ?


"...it's not rain, it's liquid sunshine" - and those '"winter Olympics" were fun


----------



## ZealotKi11er

After a lot of thinking for 200Mhz that i might get out of my 3770K is not worth killing the 3 years warranty. My Chip get hot yes but also is covered so if it burns out i can get a new one.


----------



## TSXmike

CL ultra and some of my wc gear arrived today. Its almost time.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> "...it's not rain, it's liquid sunshine" - and those '"winter Olympics" were fun


Got it ! 6 inches of that white crap today I hear.







Oops wrong city, are you on the island or in Victoria area ?


----------



## BradleyW

Would this do the trick for sealing the IHS before selling my chip?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/140914917056?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
Cheers.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That would work, it's a high temperature adhesive apparently...which is vital for cpu loads. As well as it being non conductive.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That would work, it's a high temperature adhesive apparently...which is vital for cpu loads. As well as it being non conductive.


Thank you.
Do I apply a thin line along the sides and rest the IHS on top without pressure for a while?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Thank you.
> Do I apply a thin line along the sides and rest the IHS on top without pressure for a while?


id put small drop in each corner.but there is really no need to reseal it.
unless its being sent somewhere and you dont want it to come off


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> id put small drop in each corner.but there is really no need to reseal it.
> unless its being sent somewhere and you dont want it to come off


Thanks mate. Yeah I want to stick it on fairly well as my mate is thinking of buying it off me. I'd hate for the IHS to fall off on him.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Got it ! 6 inches of that white crap today I hear.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oops wrong city, are you on the island or in Victoria area ?


Mainland - Van / Whistler...still lot's of snow: http://www.whistlerblackcomb.com/the-mountain/web-cams/blackcomb.aspx

...judging by your Avatar, you would love the 'sea-to-sky' highway (I used to ride)


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> If you are the adventurous type, and don't mind doing some experimentation you could break open a Mercury free thermometer that contains Galinstan; an alloy quite similar to Liquid Pro, but with a lower thermal conductivity (16.5 W·m−1·K−1).
> 
> http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=362174&catid=182982&aid=338666&aparam=goobase_filler


hey thanks for the input , can anybody else vouch for this ?

i might actually try to find this somewhere


----------



## gdesmo

Yes, mountains would be nice to ride around. I have to get my excitement at the race tracks these days, not too many good roads to ride on. Must be nice to be in God`s country ! Just finishing an (shhhh) AMD rig to match my main ride, have 7 Ducati`s. >>


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> hey thanks for the input , can anybody else vouch for this ?
> 
> i might actually try to find this somewhere


Kind of dangerous, even inhaling a minute bit of it will stay in your body for decades. Stick to the Ultra unless you really want to play with fire.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Yes, mountains would be nice to ride around. I have to get my excitement at the race tracks these days, not too many good roads to ride on. Must be nice to be in God`s country ! Just finishing an (shhhh) AMD rig to match my main ride, have 7 Ducati`s. >>


beautiful bike - beautiful build - nice one!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> hey thanks for the input , can anybody else vouch for this ?
> 
> i might actually try to find this somewhere


don't touch it with a hundred foot long pole.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Yes, mountains would be nice to ride around. I have to get my excitement at the race tracks these days, not too many good roads to ride on. Must be nice to be in God`s country ! Just finishing an (shhhh) AMD rig to match my main ride, have 7 Ducati`s. >>


nice looks, horrible specs!







just messing but looks very well done! take internal pics man!


----------



## ivanlabrie

If it's non mercury alloy it wouldn't be as dangerous...still sounds scary.
Buy from sidewinder computers, they will ship to your door.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Kind of dangerous, even inhaling a minute bit of it will stay in your body for decades. Stick to the Ultra unless you really want to play with fire.


well lol i sure don't want to develop squirrel aids from inhaling this for a couple hundred mhz on the processor









will just stick to the mx-4 then....

Edit : wow at the amounts of warnings, mercury is that dangerous ?

i think i heard that before about mercury being dangerous to us.....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> well lol i sure don't want to develop squirrel aids from inhaling this for a couple hundred mhz on the processor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will just stick to the mx-4 then....


what about CooLlaboratory stuff man?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what about CooLlaboratory stuff man?


they are not available to me here, i'm from egypt shipping the coolab to here will be kinda hard and it will cost like 50$ after shipping









also is this a proper way to de-lid ?






thanks !


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> they are not available to me here, i'm from egypt shipping the coolab to here will be kinda hard and it will cost like 50$ after shipping
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also is this a proper way to de-lid ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks !


if i didnt have homework due in 2 hours i'd watch it lol.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if i didnt have homework due in 2 hours i'd watch it lol.


i hate homework









that guy did it in 2 mins like a boss !


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Yes, mountains would be nice to ride around. I have to get my excitement at the race tracks these days, not too many good roads to ride on. Must be nice to be in God`s country ! Just finishing an (shhhh) AMD rig to match my main ride, have 7 Ducati`s. >>


...gorgeous (both machines) ! ...grew up in Europe and we used to wind our bikes out on the Autobahn (traffic permitting)...'sea-to-sky' here is heavily patrolled by police helichopchops and other unsavory techniques to spoil the fun, but not all the time...and the weather often spoils their flying fun







Ducati's are my favorite - a relative had a used Paso 906 back then, he's still in Europe and trying to find a decent one to restore now ($$$







)...

...AMD ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i hate homework
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that guy did it in 2 mins like a boss !


I took my lid off in about 3 minutes but I took care of the PCB with my card to protect my traces.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I took my lid off in about 3 minutes but I took care of the PCB with my card to protect my traces.


card ? wat card ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> card ? wat card ?


credit card for the glue


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Kind of dangerous, even inhaling a minute bit of it will stay in your body for decades. Stick to the Ultra unless you really want to play with fire.


Do you even know what Ultra is made of? Look it up.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> don't touch it with a hundred foot long pole.
> nice looks, horrible specs!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just messing but looks very well done! take internal pics man!


Et tu Valguar?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If it's non mercury alloy it wouldn't be as dangerous...still sounds scary.
> Buy from sidewinder computers, they will ship to your door.


Not as scary as this...




Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> Edit : wow at the amounts of warnings, mercury is that dangerous ?


YES MERCURY IS VERY DANGEROUS, THAT IS WHY WE ARE NOW USING GALINSTAN IN THERMOMETERS THAT YOU PUT IN YOUR MOUTH.

Do not use Mercury. They sell Gallinstan thermometers at Wallmart. I will try it out tomorrow and let you know. I don't expect it to be as good as CLP, but hey, if you can't buy CLP, it could be the next best thing. By the way, delidding your chip sounds dangerous, you might get cut and void the warranty.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Do you even know what Ultra is made of? Look it up.
> Et tu *Valguar*?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not as scary as this...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> YES MERCURY IS VERY DANGEROUS, THAT IS WHY WE ARE NOW USING GALINSTAN IN THERMOMETERS THAT YOU PUT IN YOUR MOUTH.
> 
> Do not use Mercury. They sell Gallinstan thermometers at Wallmart. I will try it out tomorrow and let you know. I don't expect it to be as good as CLP, but hey, if you can't buy CLP, it could be the next best thing. By the way, delidding your chip sounds dangerous, you might get cut and void the warranty.


quick question for you guys.......

do you know how to spell my name? Valgaur not Valguar, or as DJ (OCN Overclocker) calls me Vagur


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> quick question for you guys.......
> 
> do you know how to spell my name? Valgaur not Valguar, or as DJ (OCN Overclocker) calls me Vagur


your name fits someone from the frozen tundra


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...gorgeous (both machines) ! ...grew up in Europe and we used to wind our bikes out on the Autobahn (traffic permitting)...'sea-to-sky' here is heavily patrolled by police helichopchops and other unsavory techniques to spoil the fun, but not all the time...and the weather often spoils their flying fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ducati's are my favorite - a relative had a used Paso 906 back then, he's still in Europe and trying to find a decent one to restore now ($$$
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )...
> 
> ...AMD ?


AMD only because I got a smoking deal on it, don`t worry it is my ghetto build. Have a few Z77`s and Z68`s >>


----------



## Totally Dubbed

as it is pronounce val-gu-ar - that's why

Saying it as:
val-ga-our
Is harder. I'll call you.....cookie monster kay?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> as it is pronounce val-gu-ar - that's why
> 
> Saying it as:
> val-ga-our
> Is harder. I'll call you.....cookie monster kay?


lol !










original


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> they are not available to me here, i'm from egypt shipping the coolab to here will be kinda hard and it will cost like 50$ after shipping
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also is this a proper way to de-lid ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks !


Mate, trust me, shipping is cheap, you gotta do some work looking for it, that's all. Ebay, www.sidewindercomputers.com, performance-pcs.com...those will ship to your door, and cost little money if you use economy shipping (not private couriers)
Did the work for you, CLP at performance-pcs is 13.99 and shipping is a mere 11.10 via first class. Takes a week to get there.
Don't be a wuss and delid like a real crewman









" United States Postal Service (First-Class Package International Service (Varies by destination) (No Tracking)) $11.10"
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> lol !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> original


Or how about Valerie?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> as it is pronounce val-gu-ar - that's why
> 
> Saying it as:
> val-ga-our
> Is harder. I'll call you.....cookie monster kay?


Mr. Nom Nom


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mate, trust me, shipping is cheap, you gotta do some work looking for it, that's all. Ebay, www.sidewindercomputers.com, performance-pcs.com...those will ship to your door, and cost little money if you use economy shipping (not private couriers)
> Did the work for you, CLP at performance-pcs is 13.99 and shipping is a mere 11.10 via first class. Takes a week to get there.
> Don't be a wuss and delid like a real crewman
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> " United States Postal Service (First-Class Package International Service (Varies by destination) (No Tracking)) $11.10"
> Or how about Valerie?


thanks, i will see if i can get it without getting ripped off in shipping

+rep for you man

Edit : also if i go ahead and try to get it from there , liquid pro or liquid ultra ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> AMD only because I got a smoking deal on it, don`t worry it is my ghetto build. Have a few Z77`s and Z68`s >>


...lot's to do on both fronts in those long, cold winters in TO ( I spend some years 'back East' ).

...what kind of rad(s) is your main system / 3770k running which was pictured a few pages back ? Fans ? Dual loop I take it ?


----------



## Zeek

Am I doing it right?










*OCN name:* Zeek
*CPU:* Intel i7 3770K
*on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
*ihs-TIM:* Noctua NT-H1
*Mhz gained:* 400
*OC after delid:* 4.9ghz
*Temp drops:* 24C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Haven't tried yet


















*Before:*










*After:*


----------



## justanoldman

Excellent job Zeek, nice to hear success stories.
+rep for a job well done


----------



## Zeek

Thanks mate







I've been tweaking all day and have posted a couple pictures, but completely forgot to make the actual post, lol. Have P95 running currently at 4.9ghz 1.39v and temps are still better than the 4.5ghz non delidded OC. So happy with the results









Oh I'm about to get my 1st flame too, I can almost taste it! Oh wait, tasting fire is bad nvm


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Am I doing it right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* Zeek
> *CPU:* Intel i7 3770K
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Noctua NT-H1
> *Mhz gained:* 400
> *OC after delid:* 4.9ghz
> *Temp drops:* 24C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Haven't tried yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Before:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After:*


nice job man !


----------



## c2thew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Any tips on resealing the IHS with Silicone, such as how to seal it?
> Might sell the chip to my mate and grab another from ebay.
> Cheers.


I believe Permatex 81158 3 Ounce Black RTV Silicone Adhesive Sealant was mentioned before as the adhesive to reseal the ihs but no one has ever done it. One would assume that replacing the previous tim with arctic mx-4 and permatex should do it providing that after you seal it you make sure you test it out so that the sealant sticks to the PCB board.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Am I doing it right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* Zeek
> *CPU:* Intel i7 3770K
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Noctua NT-H1
> *Mhz gained:* 400
> *OC after delid:* 4.9ghz
> *Temp drops:* 24C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Haven't tried yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Before:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After:*


...congrats - now it's 'ZeekMeister'


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> ...congrats - now it's 'ZeekMeister'


i was thinking patapon might be good


----------



## MKHunt

Well, I've decided to delid the 3770k when it arrives thursday or friday. The more reading and pic seeing I did, the more I realized that the black goop usually makes a pretty decently sized gap. I always have my 2600k to fall back on if it goes poorly. Ordered Coollab Pro from sidewinder since Performance PCs wanted $13.73 for shipping. I hope the chip they send me is a Costa Rica fab chip. My Costa Rica 2600k was amazing while this Malay 2600k is merely average. Call it superstition, but I believe in Intel's CR plant.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...lot's to do on both fronts in those long, cold winters in TO ( I spend some years 'back East' ).
> 
> ...what kind of rad(s) is your main system / 3770k running which was pictured a few pages back ? Fans ? Dual loop I take it ?


Triple loop - Not done yet but it is a TEC cooled cpu with 4 x 160 watt tec`s and 2 x 190 watt tec`s in three chiller units. 5 controller units, 1 main one has dew point control as well which I will overide. to cool the hot side of the chiller units I have a monsta 420 x 110 mm thick rad, 360 TFC X changer, and will have a RX 360 as well. To cool the 2 x 670 GPU`s will most likely be a monsta 240 x 80 mm thick rad. those two loops will each use a Laing D5 Vario pump in a Koolance RP 452 res combo. Cold side of tec`s gets no rad or res and will be pumped by two DDC 3.25 pumps in series. Two pumps because I will be running cold side with a 60% propylene glycol and 40% distilled water coolant and will be in the -20 to -30 C range of cooling. TIM will be a hybrid Graphene and other sub-zero type tim combination. The Tec`s and other equipment require a lot of power when really pushed so I am using a Seasonic X-1250 and a Mean Well SP 480 power supply. More another day. Cheers


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Am I doing it right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* Zeek
> *CPU:* Intel i7 3770K
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Noctua NT-H1
> *Mhz gained:* 400
> *OC after delid:* 4.9ghz
> *Temp drops:* 24C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* Haven't tried yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Before:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After:*


You're In!







Now Slap that Sig on and show your epicness!


----------



## c2thew

Question. when you set your voltages to fixed, doesn't your computer use more power even when in idle? I've been using offset for a long time and have tried fixed to get a successful stable voltage, however I switched back to offset/enable C1 and c3 states to conserve power when the chip isn't in full use.

Any thoughts on fixed vs offset in terms of energy savings over say a year?

thanks!


----------



## c2thew

\


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Triple loop - Not done yet but it is a TEC cooled cpu with 4 x 160 watt tec`s and 2 x 190 watt tec`s in three chiller units. 5 controller units, 1 main one has dew point control as well which I will overide. to cool the hot side of the chiller units I have a monsta 420 x 110 mm thick rad, 360 TFC X changer, and will have a RX 360 as well. To cool the 2 x 670 GPU`s will most likely be a monsta 240 x 80 mm thick rad. those two loops will each use a Laing D5 Vario pump in a Koolance RP 452 res combo. Cold side of tec`s gets no rad or res and will be pumped by two DDC 3.25 pumps in series. Two pumps because I will be running cold side with a 60% propylene glycol and 40% distilled water coolant and will be in the -20 to -30 C range of cooling. TIM will be a hybrid Graphene and other sub-zero type tim combination. The Tec`s and other equipment require a lot of power when really pushed so I am using a Seasonic X-1250 and a Mean Well SP 480 power supply. More another day. Cheers


...great system !!














This could teach me a thing or three...got a 3770k on an ROG MaxVEx board and I'm still finalizing my first custom single (CPU only) loop...just added a 3rd GTX 670 for tri_SLI and am debating cooling solutions...ie. 2nd loop as I don't want 3 GPUs that have been breathed on (incl PowerTraget=150) pushing an extra 600 Watts of heat energy into the CPU loop..but as I may upgrade later to Titans, I am reluctant to buy custom GPU jackets,. so I am thinking Uni-blocks with separate VRM solution.

...more on another day when it's not past midnight in TO


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> Question. when you set your voltages to fixed, doesn't your computer use more power even when in idle? I've been using offset for a long time and have tried fixed to get a successful stable voltage, however I switched back to offset/enable C1 and c3 states to conserve power when the chip isn't in full use.
> 
> Any thoughts on fixed vs offset in terms of energy savings over say a year?
> 
> thanks!


I don't understand why someone would stick with fixed voltage once they have found their stable oc. Using offset with the high voltages that come with higher overclocks (that we can get with delidding) not only saves electricity, it should put significantly less wear on your chip. Sending over 1.4v to your chip all the time even though it doesn't need it doesn't make sense to me, plus there is obviously the added heat which that generates.

I know some mobos aren't crazy about offset voltage, but if you can use it I don't know why you wouldn't.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I don't understand why someone would stick with fixed voltage once they have found their stable oc. Using offset with the high voltages that come with higher overclocks (that we can get with delidding) not only saves electricity, it should put significantly less wear on your chip. Sending over 1.4v to your chip all the time even though it doesn't need it doesn't make sense to me, plus there is obviously the added heat which that generates.
> 
> I know some mobos aren't crazy about offset voltage, but if you can use it I don't know why you wouldn't.


...exactly ! There is a small price to pay re extra v's to push it out of C states and lower multis into full-on mode, but over the course of a day, even as a heavy user with active database and web server software, most of the time my system is doing lighter work, with voltages swinging from 0.972 to 1.144 plus/minus at well over 5 GHz settings...all bets are off when I'm benching, though...all the more reason to conserve power and the chip when I am not


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I don't understand why someone would stick with fixed voltage once they have found their stable oc. Using offset with the high voltages that come with higher overclocks (that we can get with delidding) not only saves electricity, it should put significantly less wear on your chip. Sending over 1.4v to your chip all the time even though it doesn't need it doesn't make sense to me, plus there is obviously the added heat which that generates.
> 
> I know some mobos aren't crazy about offset voltage, but if you can use it I don't know why you wouldn't.


Using a fixed voltage doesn't really generate more heat, at idle it isn't using the power like it does under load, so temps aren't really higher. It may save a few pennies in electricity & I can see where it's a benefit to businesses with multiple machines, but for a single PC the difference would be negligible. It is even possible that the constant switching voltage between load & idle could be more wear & tear on a chip using offset than fixed voltage, although I don't know if it does or not.
For me, I just prefer having the fixed voltage & multi for screenshots so I can see what voltage I needed for the clocks when I've done something before, 1600Mhz at under 1V in cpu-z doesn't tell me anything. I can't see fixed voltage making any difference to the lifespan of the chip or the hydro bill over offset though (unless someone plans on keeping a chip for many years, still not sure if it would make a difference then).


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Using a fixed voltage doesn't really generate more heat, at idle it isn't using the power like it does under load, so temps aren't really higher. It may save a few pennies in electricity & I can see where it's a benefit to businesses with multiple machines, but for a single PC the difference would be negligible. It is even possible that the constant switching voltage between load & idle could be more wear & tear on a chip using offset than fixed voltage, although I don't know if it does or not.
> For me, I just prefer having the fixed voltage & multi for screenshots so I can see what voltage I needed for the clocks when I've done something before, 1600Mhz at under 1V in cpu-z doesn't tell me anything. I can't see fixed voltage making any difference to the lifespan of the chip or the hydro bill over offset though (unless someone plans on keeping a chip for many years, still not sure if it would make a difference then).


...there is a bit of 'apples and oranges' going on, never mind the difficulty of measuring things accurately - but I just changed my Bios around (no speed step and c states)...using CPUID Hardware Monitor for 'before and after', the average consumption of the CPU 'package' is more than double the watts for non-heavy load (36 watts instead of 15) - and the core temps are about 2 C hotter on average - so yes, these Intel power saving technologies are there to, well, save power.

But what I don't know if this is negated by the extra energy (and potential wear and tear) when coming out of a low state - I guess it depends on what kind of work your computer is doing for MOST OF THE DAY. Ironically, our commercial systems are usually under more load anyways, so with them we are interested in a lower power consumption at full load.

Another factor may be operating systems...I got several near-identical systems next to each other...the one's with Windows 7 64 are constantly fidgeting, while those running Windows Server 2008 are calm...the constant fidgeting of Windows 7 64 may be rather energy inefficient with speed step and C states enabled, given the constant switching required.

Your point about a constant MHz is well taken though when benching and setting a system up (different from day-to-day of the typical user)...when I first joint the 5 GHz club re validation, I had speed-step and C states on...I was basically trying to hunt for / time the 'validate button' for the right moment...very frustrating...since then, when I validate or bench and need to have accurate info to get a vCore and other settings, I leave speed step and c states off.

So in the end, the energy saving technologies do save measurable energy and also heat...but whether it is significant or not or whether other factors such as a nervous OS negate much of it I cannot say..I would like to find out more though whether speed step and c states and the associated higher 'speed-up' juice are in the end better or worse for a chip over, say, 2 years compared to running them constantly but more stably at a higher voltage.


----------



## FtW 420

I'll have to do some testing, never actually tried the power saving features on an OCed ivy, have the wattmeter on now & testing as is, will have to read up on offset.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'll have to do some testing, never actually tried the power saving features on an OCed ivy, have the wattmeter on now & testing as is, will have to read up on offset.


...should be interesting - what will also make a difference is whether you have just iGPU, or are running a discreet GPU (per our earlier conversation about this)...iGPU adds significantly more on my Ivy's core's when idling (though obviously total system consumption may be less with iGPU). There is also a feature in Asus AI Suite that tells you how much CO2 you saved when kicking in some of their e-saving features, but who knows how they came up with those numbers...and turning on AI Suite usually messes with BIOS settings.

In the meantime, I will do some more tri-SLI benching - pulling something like 800 watts + out of the socket while I am thinking about saving 15 w on c state


----------



## kesawi

I didn't notice a difference between fixed and offset overclock at idle for 1.2V based on the power consumption readout on my UPS, however it is not as accurate as what I imagine a wattmeter would be.


----------



## c2thew

Thanks for the pointers, but from what my understanding of offset is that the computer feeds an additional say .025 volts under load when it needs it. So say my computer runs at 4.5ghz @ 1.26 with a +.025 offset. Under load and according to cpu ID i see voltage swings from 1.26 to 1.288 (yes my chip sucks, i'm aware of that). However after i'm done running the tests, my chip drops back down to 1.0v or sometimes to .992 since C states are enabled. My cpu downclocks to 1.6ghz due to C states? or Intel speedstep so that my power usage is lower.

My understanding is that when you use a fixed voltage the chip operates at 4.5ghz 1.25v all the time. So even if you drop down to just browsing the internet, your chip is continuously being fed 1.25v and running at 4.5ghz which translates into higher operating costs. Yes it's probably $5-10 annually, but it's still piece of mind knowing that you aren't always juicing the chip.

Now i suppose my question is this: Is it C states (1 and 3 in the bios) that allow the chip to throttle back down to 1.6ghz or is it intel speedstep which does the down throttling? I guess what i'm trying to do is use a fixed voltage of 1.25 yet have the computer drop back down to 1.6ghz when it's not using any power. But I think that feeding the chip 1.25v is still drawing more power regardless if the chip isn't using it at 4.5 or 1.6ghz.

Hope that makes sense of what i'm trying to do.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> Thanks for the pointers, but from what my understanding of offset is that the computer feeds an additional say .025 volts under load when it needs it. So say my computer runs at 4.5ghz @ 1.26 with a +.025 offset. Under load and according to cpu ID i see voltage swings from 1.26 to 1.288 (yes my chip sucks, i'm aware of that). However after i'm done running the tests, my chip drops back down to 1.0v or sometimes to .992 since C states are enabled. My cpu downclocks to 1.6ghz due to C states? or Intel speedstep so that my power usage is lower.
> 
> My understanding is that when you use a fixed voltage the chip operates at 4.5ghz 1.25v all the time. So even if you drop down to just browsing the internet, your chip is continuously being fed 1.25v and running at 4.5ghz which translates into higher operating costs. Yes it's probably $5-10 annually, but it's still piece of mind knowing that you aren't always juicing the chip.
> 
> Now i suppose my question is this: Is it C states (1 and 3 in the bios) that allow the chip to throttle back down to 1.6ghz or is it intel speedstep which does the down throttling? I guess what i'm trying to do is use a fixed voltage of 1.25 yet have the computer drop back down to 1.6ghz when it's not using any power. But I think that feeding the chip 1.25v is still drawing more power regardless if the chip isn't using it at 4.5 or 1.6ghz.
> 
> Hope that makes sense of what i'm trying to do.


...my brain is hurting and I just did two 3dM11 tri-SLI benches, so I'm not really saving very much energy at all







...but my tentative understanding is that the 1600MHz you see is Intel speed-step - it cuts the multiplier...sort of the opposite of turbo...c-states on the other hand relate to various levels of sleep mode...from full sleep (though not 'off') to 'parking' cores and threads...you can see that sometimes in Windows resource manager re. "parked cores"...and there are various partial sleep modes in-between


----------



## invincible20xx

should i heat up my cpu using prime before delidding ?! do you guys recommend this ? will this loosen up the adhesive intel used


----------



## FtW 420

With fixed vcore & multi 4800mhz @ 1.344V using an air cooled 3770k & gtx 580 in a gigabyte z77 ud3h I was idling at 30 - 34° in realtemp & pulling 116 - 121W from the wall. Running IBT with lots of memory it was pulling 222 - 232W from the wall.
With all the power saving features enabled & using 0.1V offset to match the 1.344V load voltage I used for fixed I was idling at 26 - 28° & pulling 82 - 86W from the wall (1600Mhz @ 0.852 - 1.032V showing in cpu-z). Load temps & power pulled from the wall was all the same as fixed.


----------



## MKHunt

30W savings? that's like changing from sandy to ivy.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> I believe Permatex 81158 3 Ounce Black RTV Silicone Adhesive Sealant was mentioned before as the adhesive to reseal the ihs but no one has ever done it. One would assume that replacing the previous tim with arctic mx-4 and permatex should do it providing that after you seal it you make sure you test it out so that the sealant sticks to the PCB board.


I actually tried it for a while, but my temps went through the roof, and I was only ever able to get 5.6GHz overclock:









http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2669381



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## MikeG

Look what the cat dragged in:
Nice!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







It just came back from RMA. Corsair actually sent a new one advance RMA. No problems so far and the efficiency is looking good:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Thanks mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been tweaking all day and have posted a couple pictures, but completely forgot to make the actual post, lol. Have P95 running currently at 4.9ghz 1.39v and temps are still better than the 4.5ghz non delidded OC. So happy with the results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I'm about to get my 1st flame too, I can almost taste it! Oh wait, tasting fire is bad nvm


Awesome on the Delid Zeek. Your chip is perfect if it will do 4.5 on 1.2v. I don't think mine will. I can't remember, and I can't test it for a few days. Are you still using the NH-D14 listed in your signature? Our rigs are similar. I have the same cooler and I am about to test 4.8 at 1.37v. Your temps are Better than mine. Sid you use CL Ultra on the die? I still need to order some, but funds are tight (my wife is spending all our money on the backyard







) I can't wait to see if I get a significant drop using CLU, right now I have Noctua NH-T1 on the die.
Quote:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Look what the cat dragged in:
> Nice!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It just came back from RMA. Corsair actually sent a new one advance RMA. No problems so far and the efficiency is looking good:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Advanced RMAs are the bomb. I've done them with Antec and Asus and it is the only way to go. I'd much rather give them my credit card number and get my part immediately rather then send in my broken part first and wait weeks for a replacement. Congrats.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Awesome on the Delid Zeek. Your chip is perfect if it will do 4.5 on 1.2v. I don't think mine will. I can't remember, and I can't test it for a few days. Are you still using the NH-D14 listed in your signature? Our rigs are similar. I have the same cooler and I am about to test 4.8 at 1.37v. Your temps are Better than mine. Sid you use CL Ultra on the die? I still need to order some, but funds are tight (my wife is spending all our money on the backyard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) I can't wait to see if I get a significant drop using CLU, right now I have Noctua NH-T1 on the die.


Yep, still using the D14, and I stuck with 4.8ghz at 1.35v. Kind of hit a wall for 4.9 .Tried even up to 1.42 but really didn't want to go any higher even tho temps were still safe. And I did use CLU on the die with NT-H1 on the IHS


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> should i heat up my cpu using prime before delidding ?! do you guys recommend this ? will this loosen up the adhesive intel used


It was recommended to me.

I would not recommend it to anyone else. By the time you set everything up, the chip will be cool again. All it does is rush you in something that should take a long time.

The only thing that'd make delidding easier is if you don't put a big heatsink on it. However if you want to know what temp drop you got from delidding and if your chip is even worth delidding in the first place you'll need to put a heatsink on it and run it and overclock it a bit and see what it can do.
Quote:


> It just came back from RMA. Corsair actually sent a new one advance RMA. No problems so far and the efficiency is looking good:


I just did an advanced RMA with corsair. I'm on the fence on if I'll ever buy corsair again. A faulty unit is a faulty unit but I think maybe it blew out because a small led in my case had went out, and took the psu with it (or degraded it so much that it basically became a ~150w psu).
Quote:


> .Tried even up to 1.42 but really didn't want to go any higher even tho temps were still safe. And I did use CLU on the die with NT-H1 on the IHS


I still haven't gotten any responses on this, except being ridiculed, but since there have been zero reports of degradation, I don't see why we cannot run up to 1.6v for 24/7 ambient overclock. Or even higher, as long as temps are okay, since the only ivy to die was at what, 1.9, 1.98v?


----------



## Zeek

Basement is pretty cold today


----------



## Stige

One delid done, one dead CPU =D

I think I need a thinner blade...


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> I believe Permatex 81158 3 Ounce Black RTV Silicone Adhesive Sealant was mentioned before as the adhesive to reseal the ihs but no one has ever done it. One would assume that replacing the previous tim with arctic mx-4 and permatex should do it providing that after you seal it you make sure you test it out so that the sealant sticks to the PCB board.


I resealed the CPU I broke with black RTV silicone and it looked just like it did out of the box, as if it was brand new!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I resealed the CPU I broke with black RTV silicone and it looked just like it did out of the box, as if it was brand new!


Hush...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> should i heat up my cpu using prime before delidding ?! do you guys recommend this ? will this loosen up the adhesive intel used


No, it doesn't do anything because by the time you get your chip out it's already cooled right back down to normal. just sharpen your blade with a wet stone. That's what I did.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> One delid done, one dead CPU =D
> 
> I think I need a thinner blade...



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I resealed the CPU I broke with black RTV silicone and it looked just like it did out of the box, as if it was brand new!


Come on guys you know the rules about talking about this.


----------



## martinhal

Valgaur , I have just commented on your folding team rank in another thread , 666 .... is this planed ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Valgaur , I have just commented on your folding team rank in another thread , 666 .... is this planed ?


Yup! Mr. Nom Nom Or Cookie Monster


----------



## stickg1

All the sudden my iGPU doesn't work and I cant pick a RAM freq higher than 1600MHz. Tried the CPU and RAM in a different board and it works fine. iGPU isn't even an option in BIOS it's like it completely disappeared. If I try to boot with no discrete GPU I get error code D6 on the Dr. Debug LED, means no output detected.

1. Messed up my LGA pins? (I looked and they seemed to be in pristine shape)
2. Dead or dying board? (Extreme6)
3. Corrupted BIOS chip? (I flashed and reflashed the BIOS and cleared CMOS several times now)


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> All the sudden my iGPU doesn't work and I cant pick a RAM freq higher than 1600MHz. Tried the CPU and RAM in a different board and it works fine. iGPU isn't even an option in BIOS it's like it completely disappeared. If I try to boot with no discrete GPU I get error code D6 on the Dr. Debug LED, means no output detected.
> 
> 1. Messed up my LGA pins? (I looked and they seemed to be in pristine shape)
> 2. Dead or dying board? (Extreme6)
> 3. Corrupted BIOS chip? (I flashed and reflashed the BIOS and cleared CMOS several times now)


This is odd. Tried different inputs on the motherboard? It does sound like the board is on it's way out. Just not sure which bit and why.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> This is odd. Tried different inputs on the motherboard? It does sound like the board is on it's way out. Just not sure which bit and why.


Yeah I've tried HDMI and DVI


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> All the sudden my iGPU doesn't work and I cant pick a RAM freq higher than 1600MHz. Tried the CPU and RAM in a different board and it works fine. iGPU isn't even an option in BIOS it's like it completely disappeared. If I try to boot with no discrete GPU I get error code D6 on the Dr. Debug LED, means no output detected.
> 
> 1. Messed up my LGA pins? (I looked and they seemed to be in pristine shape)
> 2. Dead or dying board? (Extreme6)
> 3. Corrupted BIOS chip? (I flashed and reflashed the BIOS and cleared CMOS several times now)


Sounds like a delid related problem...did you have any marks or scratches on your pcb? Or could be pin related.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sounds like a delid related problem...did you have any marks or scratches on your pcb? Or could be pin related.


Well the same chip works fine in my other board (backup H67 board I have). The iGPU is fine (because theres no discrete GPU in that PC anyway), and the same sticks of RAM will overclock just fine. I looked real close at the pins and they were all fine, I will have to pull the board out this weekend and give it another look.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ah, ok...then it's 97% board related. Maybe a software issue, did you update the bios or something?


----------



## ep45-ds3l

Well, finally got around to delid my 3770k.. Temps are around 10C cooler or so with TX-4 applied to the die and IHS (The best paste Microcenter had). May order some CLU but, not sure if it will help my temps. Before the delid anything over 1.2 volts or so was hitting temps in the low 80's. I even used a different HSF the NH-D14. But.. I'll take a 10C cooler temp on my CPU thanks to the tips on this thread.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice! But whatever happened to that 775 board of yours?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ep45-ds3l*
> 
> Well, finally got around to delid my 3770k.. Temps are around 10C cooler or so with TX-4 applied to the die and IHS (The best paste Microcenter had). May order some CLU but, not sure if it will help my temps. Before the delid anything over 1.2 volts or so was hitting temps in the low 80's. I even used a different HSF the NH-D14. But.. I'll take a 10C cooler temp on my CPU thanks to the tips on this thread.


Nice job, congratulations.
I think most everyone got better temps when they went to ultra/pro on the die than anything else they tried. I definitely think it is worth it to use them on the die, on top of the IHS they do a great job too, but any high end paste does pretty well there.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ah, ok...then it's 97% board related. Maybe a software issue, did you update the bios or something?


I tried updating to a newer and older bios to fix the problem. I've had the same problem on all three bioses.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Dang Stick...you be screwed son.
Can you rma the board?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Dang Stick...you be screwed son.
> Can you rma the board?


Definitely, its only 2 months old and I bought it NIB at MC. I've contacted ASRock already.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool, I heard their warranty is one year only though :/
Good luck mate!


----------



## c2thew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No, it doesn't do anything because by the time you get your chip out it's already cooled right back down to normal. just sharpen your blade with a wet stone. That's what I did.
> 
> Come on guys you know the rules about talking about this.


Resealing is not fraudulent.... some people might not want their chip to be delidded if they sell the chip to a friend and want piece of mind knowing that their IHS won't fall off when trying to build their computer. disclosure would be wise, but IMO this isn't really fraud if it was there to begin with.

just my 2 cents.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ep45-ds3l*
> 
> Well, finally got around to delid my 3770k.. Temps are around 10C cooler or so with TX-4 applied to the die and IHS (The best paste Microcenter had). May order some CLU but, not sure if it will help my temps. Before the delid anything over 1.2 volts or so was hitting temps in the low 80's. I even used a different HSF the NH-D14. But.. I'll take a 10C cooler temp on my CPU thanks to the tips on this thread.


Gratz! give me le info and I'll add you!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *c2thew*
> 
> Resealing is not fraudulent.... some people might not want their chip to be delidded if they sell the chip to a friend and want piece of mind knowing that their IHS won't fall off when trying to build their computer. disclosure would be wise, but IMO this isn't really fraud if it was there to begin with.
> 
> just my 2 cents.


Yeah I agree just most people talk about it for RMA's so just trying to keep the law is all lol







I agree completely for resealing though.







Sorry about my way of typing that's me after like 6 hours of accounting homework.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> With fixed vcore & multi 4800mhz @ 1.344V using an air cooled 3770k & gtx 580 in a gigabyte z77 ud3h I was idling at 30 - 34° in realtemp & pulling 116 - 121W from the wall. Running IBT with lots of memory it was pulling 222 - 232W from the wall.
> With all the power saving features enabled & using 0.1V offset to match the 1.344V load voltage I used for fixed I was idling at 26 - 28° & pulling 82 - 86W from the wall (1600Mhz @ 0.852 - 1.032V showing in cpu-z). Load temps & power pulled from the wall was all the same as fixed.


Thanks for the info *FtW 420*. It's what I figured. Not much of a savings in watts worth the concern. We probably blow away any savings with just our benching anyway!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ep45-ds3l*
> 
> Well, finally got around to delid my 3770k.. Temps are around 10C cooler or so with TX-4 applied to the die and IHS (The best paste Microcenter had). May order some CLU but, not sure if it will help my temps. Before the delid anything over 1.2 volts or so was hitting temps in the low 80's. I even used a different HSF the NH-D14. But.. I'll take a 10C cooler temp on my CPU thanks to the tips on this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Good job delidding *ep45-ds3l*!









CLU or CLP does make a significant difference over other TIMs and is highly recommended.

But, the difference is really seen with a decent OC going. 4.5GHz or higher IBT/Prime95 comparisons is a good place to start if you want to see a delidding temp difference between before and after.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Hi guys,

I am running my delidded 3570k @ 4.7GHz with 1.37V (CPUZ reports 1.39V though).

Obviously not a golden chip, I think I can not expect it to reach 5GHz staying under 1.45V (safe voltage limit I arbitrarily fixed).

Before I try to find a stable voltage for 4.8GHz, do you think I could improve some of my Asrock Z77E-ITX BIOS settings?


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## Zeek

I think the shirt's bigger than he is


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*


Cute.. My 2.5 year old goes into my T-shirt drawer and puts my shirts on (usually comes to me for a little help) all the time. Hokies, I noticed you have 4gb cards at 1440p. Is that dual monitor 1440p or single monitor for gaming. I am at 1440p right now and am trying to look for a reason to ebay my 2gb cards and pick up a couple 4gb cards. But it seems the $$ loss doing so wouldn't be worth it as I haven't seen the vram usage as an issue yet. Have you found that the 4gb cards are useful in some games or are you sort of just future proofing?


----------



## Hokies83

Ive used over 2gb of Vram with a 1080p panel..

Texture mods and extreme settings can do it..

Id suggest getting AMD cards 3gb seems to be a sweet spot and there performance is bar none for the $$$$


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive used over 2gb of Vram with a 1080p panel..
> 
> Texture mods and extreme settings can do it..
> 
> Id suggest getting AMD cards 3gb seems to be a sweet spot and there performance is bar none for the $$$$


You don't buy into the Hard Forum view about the uneven rendering of frames in the AMD cards giving the higher framerate a "less smooth" experience?

I have been thinking about modding skyrim and playing it again since the mods look so cool. The problem is I ALWAYS install mods wrong. At least I tried on GTA IV and could never get those ICE enhancers to work. I am just bad at following those types of directions to put this file here and extract this there and delete this and that. It never works for me


----------



## Hokies83

It is a driver thing will get fixed.. if it was really that bad there would be an Huge up roar everywhere about the amd cards.


----------



## Zeek

Overclocking ram is a pain in the butt, at least the OC is stable, so far







Delidded of course


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> You don't buy into the Hard Forum view about the uneven rendering of frames in the AMD cards giving the higher framerate a "less smooth" experience?
> 
> I have been thinking about modding skyrim and playing it again since the mods look so cool. The problem is I ALWAYS install mods wrong. At least I tried on GTA IV and could never get those ICE enhancers to work. I am just bad at following those types of directions to put this file here and extract this there and delete this and that. It never works for me


Nexus mods has a tool and a guide lol. Just download the mods using the manager and then make sure you enable them. Also run the mod manager with admin rights.

Also, 4gb isn't really worth upgrading to. It would be better to spend the money on 4gb if you were buying new and wanted to future proof ,but no need now. Games get REALLY close to going over 2048mb, like skyrim with mods, crysis 3, but there hasn't been a game that I can't play yet due to insufficient vram, although it will probably come later, but that time I shall a 4k monitor and gtx 790


----------



## justanoldman

CL Ultra: I posted something like this before, but this time the Ultra was left on much longer.

After applying CL Ultra in between the IHS and cooler, it will stay somewhat liquid for a little while. Over time it gets rather hard, and it is not easy to clean like some other TIMs. Temp wise this stuff is great, I just want people to know what to expect if they need to clean it off.

This picture is after pulling it off the IHS, and you do have to pull because when the TIM hardens it gets a little stuck.



This picture is after spending a decent amount of time with alcohol. I knew it wouldn't do much but I was curious to see how clean I could get it. The answer is, alcohol will do little to clean it.



The final picture is after using metal polish, then cleaning up any residue with alcohol.



The moral here is, Ultra is great and works well, you just have know how to clean it and spend a little time.


----------



## Zeek

That's the main reason I didn't do that and stuck with NT-H1 between the IHS and cooler. Didn't expect it to be so bad tho.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> CL Ultra: I posted something like this before, but this time the Ultra was left on much longer.
> 
> After applying CL Ultra in between the IHS and cooler, it will stay somewhat liquid for a little while. Over time it gets rather hard, and it is not easy to clean like some other TIMs. Temp wise this stuff is great, I just want people to know what to expect if they need to clean it off.
> 
> This picture is after pulling it off the IHS, and you do have to pull because when the TIM hardens it gets a little stuck.
> 
> 
> 
> This picture is after spending a decent amount of time with alcohol. I knew it wouldn't do much but I was curious to see how clean I could get it. The answer is, alcohol will do little to clean it.
> 
> 
> 
> The final picture is after using metal polish, then cleaning up any residue with alcohol.
> 
> 
> 
> The moral here is, Ultra is great and works well, you just have know how to clean it and spend a little time.


Very clean ! good job


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is a driver thing will get fixed.. if it was really that bad there would be an Huge up roar everywhere about the amd cards.


Is there any advantage to picking up a pair if ghz ed. 7970 vs regular 7970's? Do they end up overclocking the same? I am eyeing the sapphire vapor x right now.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Nexus mods has a tool and a guide lol. Just download the mods using the manager and then make sure you enable them. Also run the mod manager with admin rights.
> 
> Also, 4gb isn't really worth upgrading to. It would be better to spend the money on 4gb if you were buying new and wanted to future proof ,but no need now. Games get REALLY close to going over 2048mb, like skyrim with mods, crysis 3, but there hasn't been a game that I can't play yet due to insufficient vram, although it will probably come later, but that time I shall a 4k monitor and gtx 790


Thanks maybe i will mod first and if it runs crappy then look to upgrade. Probably smart since i havent even given my hardware a chance.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

A few things to comment on:
1. Since when did re-sealing a unit become illegal?
2. Stick1: sounds driver related if you ask me. Could be board, but that's odd for it to suddenly go if you haven't changed anything. Oh and little respect to that ref...
3. As someone already noted before my delid is quite funny. I have one core almost 8c LOWER than all the others. I'm not complaining just thinking that core is nice and cool lol.
I'm at max temp of 68c now, huge drop from my 92c beforehand. Folding for more hours increases temps, but reversed cooler is doing a good job.


----------



## Zeek

Yea, one of my cores is almost 10c below all the others too


----------



## Totally Dubbed

It's like saying: you know what guys, you may be hot and all, but I'm gonna chill. Screw you guys I'm staying cool


----------



## BradleyW

I have a 7c difference between the cores.


----------



## lilchronic

re sealing a delided chip is not wrong but trying to rma it is. you shouldnt rma something that you broke its for defective products.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is there any advantage to picking up a pair if ghz ed. 7970 vs regular 7970's? Do they end up overclocking the same? I am eyeing the sapphire vapor x right now.


Get the Cheapest Ref PCB and grab some water blocks and roll









These cards are heat limited unlike Nvidia which is voltage locked.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> re sealing a delided chip is not wrong but trying to rma it is. you shouldnt rma something that you broke its for defective products.


I agree - although when you feel you paid premium and it broke by you, unintentionally - then I get pissed off.
ie. the Noobtooth z77

Here's my temps - folding for over 5hrs + OC to 4.5ghz @ offset +0.07 and antec 920 push/pull inwards with my SP120's


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?285301-New-batch-3570k-like-GOD
cough


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?285301-New-batch-3570k-like-GOD
> cough


oh my god 0.0!


----------



## lilchronic

yea i understand . lol i still have my first chip that i F#%ked up just chillen in my drawer. i stil dont no what to do with it.
you guys have any ideas. lolz


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?285301-New-batch-3570k-like-GOD
> cough


h o l y c r a p


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is there any advantage to picking up a pair if ghz ed. 7970 vs regular 7970's? Do they end up overclocking the same? I am eyeing the sapphire vapor x right now.


Same cards, the Ghz edition just has the gimmicky boost like kepler cards.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?285301-New-batch-3570k-like-GOD
> cough


God-like batch, but doesn't say what batch...

I want one though, looks like a monster for ln2!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?285301-New-batch-3570k-like-GOD
> cough


man my chips better lolz i wish. i could probably get 5.6 on ln2







i need 1.15v for 4.6ghz never really tried 4.5


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> man my chips better lolz i wish. i could probably get 5.6 on ln2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i need 1.15v for 4.6ghz never really tried 4.5


The worst 3770k made can get 5.6ghz on ln2, yours would do better.
Ivy is all about the cooling, I have a 3770k that can't even boot 5Ghz on air with any voltage, but cold it still runs 5Ghz under 1.4V.


----------



## MKHunt

Hookay, 3770k is in. At 1.3V fixed, it hits 4.7 gigglehurts and maxes at about 80C. I think I'm going to delid this sucker and see what we can actually do.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Hookay, 3770k is in. At 1.3V fixed, it hits 4.7 gigglehurts and maxes at about 80C. I think I'm going to delid this sucker and see what we can actually do.


...looks like a very good chip you're about to make better (or...never mind) ...best of luck, and remember, keep bandages handy


----------



## Zeek

Joa, I think you got some ketchup on your finger.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Joa, I think you got some ketchup on your finger.


..nope, the real thing courtesy of the delidding blades...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> h o l y c r a p


The vcores shown in the extreme systems thread for the new batch were done on the new Asrock Z87! J/K


----------



## chronicfx

Just waiting for my 2K textures mod to download and I will be 22 mods deep for skyrim. I will let you guys know how it runs at 1440p Ultra with 2gb vram.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Should be fun to watch...post a vram usage screenie


----------



## Zeek

Z87 is coming, and they have ghetto mobos! I'm gonna go stick my 3770K into that mobo at full force and make it work


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?285301-New-batch-3570k-like-GOD
> cough


I think its a watercooling curse... people with crap cooling somehow end up with the best cpu's LOL


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Just waiting for my 2K textures mod to download and I will be 22 mods deep for skyrim. I will let you guys know how it runs at 1440p Ultra with 2gb vram.


Missed the vram screenie opportunity sorry Ivan. but to sum up I ran around for about an hour, checked out a dungeon or two and went to a few towns.. Mountains, wilderness, snow.. you name it. I did just fine for the most part pinned at 60.1 FPS, I did hitch all of three times for about a second due to vram usage, but all the rest I was fine. Wasn't bad at all. VRAM usage according to EVGA precision was mostly between 1750-1950 with a couple times I noticed it at 2034 and when I was in that section I got all three of my "hitches" within a couple minute span (a fraction of a second a piece but still obvious). Not a bad experience overall though. I think I can stick with these cards unless I start to notice it alot or it makes me die when I am fighting a dragon.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, it's close to enough, but 3gb would be the middle ground between overkill and enough.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, it's close to enough, but 3gb would be the middle ground between overkill and enough.


...Titan it up (







) with 6 GB for 4k monitors


----------



## ivanlabrie

Titan lacks punch for 4k res...


----------



## Hokies83

Titan lacks everything for 1.000 usd + imo.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> One delid done, one dead CPU =D
> 
> I think I need a thinner blade...


I'm pretty sure most people who killed during a delid used the wrong type of razor blade. It's purely an assumption but I can't believe people killed their CPU delidding using the single sided, correct, razor blade (not a utility blade, not an exacto knife...).
Quote:


> . At 1.3V fixed, it hits 4.7 gigglehurts and maxes at about 80C. I think I'm going to delid this sucker and see what we can actually do.


See if you can use software like GTL or XTU and see how far you can take it at 1.3v. If you can get 5ghz or above on 1.3v with software tuning, it's a good chip worth delidding. If you can only do [email protected] I don't think it's worth delidding as you'll maybe do 4.5-4.6 and only after a very high voltage.

What is Z87, and holy crap those god chips... i'd love to see what they can do 24 hour stable. Over 5ghz under 1.5v...


----------



## c2thew

i think that most people who kill their chips during the delid process tend to rush the delid process based on others who have done the delidding in 5 minutes which sets the standard of how long the process should take. When I did my delid, i took my time and actually stopped twice to go take a breather to prevent the risk of putting too much pressure and possibly scratching the PCB board on the chip. It's pretty much in agreement that if the blade damages the green PCB, there is a VERY high chance of only being able to use single channel memory instead of dual channel memory and let's face it: that would be a very guilt ridden delid. Only being able to use 16gb max on two memory slots instead of 32gb max on all 4 memory slots would be troubling if you only have 4 sticks of 4gb memory.

Deliding is fun but risky if you don't take your time and be mindful of the angle of the blade.

I am still shocked that the new 3570k chip batch was able to crank out 5ghz at such low voltage. Wouldn't that beat out a 3770k chip in terms of cpu rendering?


----------



## ivanlabrie

In multi threaded stuff nope...not by a long shot.
It's a great chip for 2d benching and gaming, but a similar 3770k would be ideal for gaming, cause of multi gpu intensive cpu usage at high resolutions.
I already mailed my buddy in Tx to see if he bumps into one of that batch no.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Titan lacks punch for 4k res...


I have a question:

Our GPU's may not have the raw power for quadrupling mainstream resolution overnight, but why is there no focus, not even mentioned, for 2/2.5d games at 3840x2160?

Think Starcraft: Brood War.

http://i.imgur.com/ZS7Uy.jpg

This, but abooooout 7-8x higher resolution

People seem to associate 3d with being "better" than 2d and i really dont think that is strictly the case, they are two different entities. Starcraft ran at 640x480 on systems that were considered pretty ancient at its time of release, something like 15 years ago - does this not make sense as a stepping stone or type of game to be played on 4k displays at least?


----------



## ivanlabrie

You mean upscaling games to 4k artificially? It would definitely look good, but not AS good as proper 4k res.
Ps3 upscales to 1080p, right? Not my cup of tea personally...
I think there are far more serious concerns, visually apart from resolution itself.
For instance, ghosting, color accuracy, black levels, stuttering. Quite a few little things that still make a difference in the long run, in your visual experience.
I like the idea of an ips 3d/120hz lightboost enabled monitor, if it were compatible with AMD cards that is.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


>


omg wow


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I'm pretty sure most people who killed during a delid used the wrong type of razor blade. It's purely an assumption but I can't believe people killed their CPU delidding using the single sided, correct, razor blade (not a utility blade, not an exacto knife...).
> See if you can use software like GTL or XTU and see how far you can take it at 1.3v. If you can get 5ghz or above on 1.3v with software tuning, it's a good chip worth delidding. If you can only do [email protected] I don't think it's worth delidding as you'll maybe do 4.5-4.6 and only after a very high voltage.
> 
> What is Z87, and holy crap those god chips... i'd love to see what they can do 24 hour stable. Over 5ghz under 1.5v...




Pretty much what I used, not sure what it is called in english though.

Propably way too thick, even though there was no visual damage to the chip I think it propably bent the PCB too much and broke something inside.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I find the GTX titan OTT.
I have no idea why one would get it, when you could go SLI with 2 GTX660ti's and/or for the same price still get GTX680's x2


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> You mean upscaling games to 4k artificially?


No, i dont, actually i hate that stuff.

Starcraft: Brood War took almost nothing to render at 640x480 at 60+fps - slowdowns were pretty much unheard of.
Quote:


> Processor 90 MHz Pentium or equivalent
> 
> Video SVGA video card that supports DirectDraw at 640 x 480 resolution, 256 colors
> 
> Memory 16 MB RAM


Starcraft's minimum requirements.

Rendering a 2d or 2.5d game - using sprites, not models and shaders - should surely take very little power? I dont mean upscaling at all, i just mean natively rendering 3840x2160.

If a marine in Starcraft is 5 pixels by 10 pixels and display density is up 5x - you could make sprites that are 25x50 pixels and have it cover the same area for example.

If Starcraft could run 640x480 on a 90MHz pentium system with whatever qualified as a video card back when 90mhz pentiums were around, surely an OC'd 3570k + titan could render something using 27x as many pixels if you could get around the bandwidth issues for transmitting 3840x2160 at high framerates


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I have no idea why one would get it, when you could go SLI with 2 GTX660ti's and/or for the same price still get GTX680's x2


SLI has to deal with microstuttering, profiles, etc and also brings a lot of problems to screen capture for streaming programs etc - If you are trying to run a high resolution and FPS livestream and keep game framerates up, titan is a better option - and also if you want to avoid SLI/Xfire, it holds the title of strongest single GPU by quite some margins - it also has 6gb VRAM which is arguably useful at times when other cards are limited to something like 2gb per GPU which does not increase when you sli/xfire them


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> No, i dont, actually i hate that stuff.
> 
> Starcraft: Brood War took almost nothing to render at 640x480 at 60+fps - slowdowns were pretty much unheard of.
> Starcraft's minimum requirements.
> 
> Rendering a 2d or 2.5d game - using sprites, not models and shaders - should surely take very little power? I dont mean upscaling at all, i just mean natively rendering 3840x2160.
> 
> If a marine in Starcraft is 5 pixels by 10 pixels and display density is up 5x - you could make sprites that are 25x50 pixels and have it cover the same area for example.
> 
> If Starcraft could run 640x480 on a 90MHz pentium system with whatever qualified as a video card back when 90mhz pentiums were around, surely an OC'd 3570k + titan could render something using 27x as many pixels if you could get around the bandwidth issues for transmitting 3840x2160 at high framerates


Ah, gotcha, after the second attempt at reading comprehension...lack of sleep ftw!
I love 2.5d games







I'm playing Ragnarok Online in my P4 rig while I wait for my 3770k and will probably continue to play it, and Baldur's Gate 2 from time to time.
It's perfectly doable, me thinks.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I'm pretty sure most people who killed during a delid used the wrong type of razor blade. It's purely an assumption but I can't believe people killed their CPU delidding using the single sided, correct, razor blade (not a utility blade, not an exacto knife...).
> See if you can use software like GTL or XTU and see how far you can take it at 1.3v. If you can get 5ghz or above on 1.3v with software tuning, it's a good chip worth delidding. If you can only do [email protected] I don't think it's worth delidding as you'll maybe do 4.5-4.6 and only after a very high voltage.
> 
> What is Z87, and holy crap those god chips... i'd love to see what they can do 24 hour stable. Over 5ghz under 1.5v...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pretty much what I used, not sure what it is called in english though.
> 
> Propably way too thick, even though there was no visual damage to the chip I think it propably bent the PCB too much and broke something inside.
Click to expand...

ooooh my god lol.

See. This shouldn't even count as a failed delid. Yes, that is too thick, clearly in the OP it states you should use a razor blade. I really don't think it's possible to screw up a delid if you use the right razor blade.

it's okay, my first delid I used a utility razor blade instead of the correct, thinner blade. I didn't mess up my delid though still (the thicker blade just is way harder to stick in and you gotta work hard to make sure the blade stays flat, as it'll have a tendency to aim toward towards the PCB). I was sweating after delidding with the utility blade, but when I used the right razor blade it cut through like butter and took maybe 15 minutes.
Quote:


> SLI has to deal with microstuttering, profiles, etc and also brings a lot of problems to screen capture for streaming programs etc - If you are trying to run a high resolution and FPS livestream and keep game framerates up, titan is a better option - and also if you want to avoid SLI/Xfire, it holds the title of strongest single GPU by quite some margins - it also has 6gb VRAM which is arguably useful at times when other cards are limited to something like 2gb per GPU which does not increase when you sli/xfire them


ysosmart


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> ooooh my god lol.
> 
> See. This shouldn't even count as a failed delid. Yes, that is too thick, clearly in the OP it states you should use a razor blade. I really don't think it's possible to screw up a delid if you use the right razor blade.
> 
> it's okay, my first delid I used a utility razor blade instead of the correct, thinner blade. I didn't mess up my delid though still (the thicker blade just is way harder to stick in and you gotta work hard to make sure the blade stays flat, as it'll have a tendency to aim toward towards the PCB). I was sweating after delidding with the utility blade, but when I used the right razor blade it cut through like butter and took maybe 15 minutes.
> ysosmart


I'm not sure if you can even get that kind of blades in Finland, I guess I will have to check around when I go to town next time, never seen razor blades like that, like ever in person









The blade on this thing is 0.6mm thick :l

Owell, no harm done (lol), lesson learned


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Hi guys,
> 
> I am running my delidded 3570k @ 4.7GHz with 1.37V (CPUZ reports 1.39V though).
> 
> Obviously not a golden chip, I think I can not expect it to reach 5GHz staying under 1.45V (safe voltage limit I arbitrarily fixed).
> 
> Before I try to find a stable voltage for 4.8GHz, do you think I could improve some of my Asrock Z77E-ITX BIOS settings?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


2nd attempt








Any Asrock owners could tell me what they think about my settings? lilchronic, chronicfx?

If they are ok, what are the steps to switch from this fixed mode to the offset mode?


----------



## Zeek

If you go to offset you'll save a couple cents on your electric bill, lol. From what I know most people do use offset. You could also update your bios to the newest version. I think I saw someone with a ITX on 1.80 and that could help with overclocking or give you better stability. You could also disable C3, C6 and C State Support since SpeedStep and C1E are enabled the others don't need to be.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> You could also disable C3, C6 and C State Support since SpeedStep and C1E are enabled the others don't need to be.


Great I will try that! Thx a lot +rep
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> You could also update your bios to the newest version. I think I saw someone with a ITX on 1.80 and that could help with overclocking or give you better stability.


Yep, BIOS 1.80 is out but here I am kind of 'don't fix it if it works'. Especially since they removed 1.70 (without explanation) which was available couple of weeks ago. I might give 1.80 a try though to see If it lets me reduce the voltage without loosing stability.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> If you go to offset you'll save a couple cents on your electric bill, lol.


Yep, that's why I would like to use offset now.
Do I just have to find the offset voltage needed to match my current fixed voltage at load?


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Yep, BIOS 1.80 is out but here I am kind of 'don't fix it if it works'. Especially since they removed 1.70 (without explanation) which was available couple of weeks ago. I might give 1.80 a try though to see If it lets me reduce the voltage without loosing stability.


I'm the same way. I'm still on 2.70 for my board even tho 2.80 is out. It's not quite the leap like yours is tho. So for you it _might_ help, and it could also do thing, lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Yep, that's why I would like to use offset now.
> Do I just have to find the offset voltage needed to match my current fixed voltage at load?


The offset voltage lets you adjust what your idle vcore is. For example I have mine at -0.055 and I idle at 0.978. It's different for every chip and I've seen some guys go all the way down to -0.095 and they idle'd at 0.920. If you need more voltage under load then you adjust the Additional Turbo Voltage as necessary. For that I have it as +0.193 with LLC2 and that gets me at 1.37-1.38 under load for 4.8ghz. Every chip is different tho so you might need less or more


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> The offset voltage lets you adjust what your idle vcore is.
> If you need more voltage under load then you adjust the Additional Turbo Voltage as necessary.


Ok, so offset voltage is for idle vcore and turbo voltage is for load vcore.

Is there a way to know what is the basis voltage in the BIOS or do I just need to set some offset/turbo and check in Windows what are the related idle/load vcores?

Also, how could I check if the resulting idle vcore is the right one?


----------



## gdesmo

RELIDDED Club, not delidded club !


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Ok, so offset voltage is for idle vcore and turbo voltage is for load vcore.
> 
> Is there a way to know what is the basis voltage in the BIOS or do I just need to set some offset/turbo and check in Windows what are the related idle/load vcores?
> 
> Also, how could I check if the resulting idle vcore is the right one?


I'm not too sure about that since I'm no expert but I think the VID voltage you can see in realtemp is the actual voltage the chip is putting out. Then you can use additional turbo to adjust it as necessary. Most people just use +0.005 offset and +0.004 turbo at 4.5ghz to see what their chip does. And to test idle you just need to check CPUZ and surf the web for a while to make sure it doesn't crash. As far as I know, there isn't really away to test idle vcore.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I'm not sure if you can even get that kind of blades in Finland, I guess I will have to check around when I go to town next time, never seen razor blades like that, like ever in person
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The blade on this thing is 0.6mm thick :l
> 
> Owell, no harm done (lol), lesson learned


I don't know about Finland, but try a hardware store. That is where I got mine:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/100140001?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=razor+blade&storeId=10051&N=5yc1v&R=100140001#.UTiiRhykqtY

http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/100154917?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=razor+blade&storeId=10051&N=5yc1v&R=100154917#.UTii5BykqtY

Just use the blade by itself. Don't try to use it with the scraper because you won't get the proper angle. Start with the corners, and use a side to side rocking motion with the pivot point at the corner. Rely on your sense of touch, you should be able to feel that it is in rubber as opposed to scraping against a hard surface.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm not too sure about that since I'm no expert but I think the VID voltage you can see in realtemp is the actual voltage the chip is putting out. Then you can use additional turbo to adjust it as necessary. Most people just use +0.005 offset and +0.004 turbo at 4.5ghz to see what their chip does. And to test idle you just need to check CPUZ and surf the web for a while to make sure it doesn't crash. As far as I know, there isn't really away to test idle vcore.


Thx a lot Zeek!


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> A few things to comment on:
> 1. Since when did re-sealing a unit become illegal?
> 2. Stick1: sounds driver related if you ask me. Could be board, but that's odd for it to suddenly go if you haven't changed anything. Oh and little respect to that ref...
> 3. As someone already noted before my delid is quite funny. I have one core almost 8c LOWER than all the others. I'm not complaining just thinking that core is nice and cool lol.
> I'm at max temp of 68c now, huge drop from my 92c beforehand. Folding for more hours increases temps, but reversed cooler is doing a good job.


What speed you folding at and what vcore ?

Im at 5.1 and 1.512 vcore hitting max 73 degrees


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'm not too sure about that since I'm no expert but I think the *VID voltage you can see in realtemp is the actual voltage the chip is putting out.* Then you can use additional turbo to adjust it as necessary. Most people just use +0.005 offset and +0.004 turbo at 4.5ghz to see what their chip does. And to test idle you just need to check CPUZ and surf the web for a while to make sure it doesn't crash. As far as I know, there isn't really away to test idle vcore.


You got it a bit wrong there.
VID is just a reference number for Offset Voltage for each multiplier, it is NOT your actual voltage in any way.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> You got it a bit wrong there.
> VID is just a reference number for Offset Voltage for each multiplier, it is NOT your actual voltage in any way.


That's exactly what I was trying to explain, just didn't know how to explain it. Like I said, I'm no expert in any of this. Thanks for clearing it up


----------



## justanoldman

Offset = manual vCore - most common VID under load
The VID is just a number assigned by Intel, not a specfic reflection of what is needed or anything. I have seen a correlation of lower VID with better overclocking ability. Intel should just shoot out the chips with the lowest VIDs and sell them for a premium to overclockers.


----------



## Belial

^ In my experience I've seen a correlation in lower VID and worse overclocking ability.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> ^ In my experience I've seen a correlation in lower VID and worse overclocking ability.


Three 3770k: 1.31 bad overclocker, 1.22 ok overclocker, 1.18 good overclocker. I have also seen a lot of people post in threads and seen the same general correlation. But as you have pointed out, it is simply a correlation, not a definitive fact. I have yet to see an Ivy chip with a VID over 1.3 that was a great overclocker.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Three 3770k: 1.31 bad overclocker, 1.22 ok overclocker, 1.18 good overclocker. I have also seen a lot of people post in threads and seen the same general correlation. But as you have pointed out, it is simply a correlation, not a definitive fact. I have yet to see an Ivy chip with a VID over 1.3 that was a great overclocker.


Do you even realize the VID changes with every multiplier? What you just posted makes no sense at all.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Do you even realize the VID changes with every multiplier? What you just posted makes no sense at all.


Or...do you realize he is talking about 3 separate CPU chips that he has...all at the same clock speed - but all at different VID's and different Vcores


----------



## I_shot

5 ghz 1.41V and vid 1.206V


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Do you even realize the VID changes with every multiplier? What you just posted makes no sense at all.


Any change in VID from 3.9 to 5.0 is slight and not all that significant. Example: VID at 3.9 1.21, VID at 4.6 1.22. I was giving VIDs in the range where I first test 4.5 multiplier. Sorry if that doesn't make sense to you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Or...do you realize he is talking about 3 separate CPU chips that he has...all at the same clock speed - but all at different VID's and different Vcores











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> 5 ghz 1.41V and vid 1.206V


That is the same as my best chip almost, 5.0 at 1.41v with a 1.18 VID.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> ^ In my experience I've seen a correlation in lower VID and worse overclocking ability.
> 
> 
> 
> Three 3770k: 1.31 bad overclocker, 1.22 ok overclocker, 1.18 good overclocker. I have also seen a lot of people post in threads and seen the same general correlation. But as you have pointed out, it is simply a correlation, not a definitive fact. I have yet to see an Ivy chip with a VID over 1.3 that was a great overclocker.
Click to expand...

My point was that stock voltage/VID is meaningless.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Three 3770k: 1.31 bad overclocker, 1.22 ok overclocker, 1.18 good overclocker. I have also seen a lot of people post in threads and seen the same general correlation. But as you have pointed out, it is simply a correlation, not a definitive fact. I have yet to see an Ivy chip with a VID over 1.3 that was a great overclocker.


That was true for 775 chips, but not for Ivy or SB chips. It's not as relevant.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> My point was that stock voltage/VID is meaningless.


Not really...not exactly meaningless, we know Intel is kinda generous with vid and auto vcore but better chips have lower vid these days. (at least, that most of the time correlates to a higher oc capability with low volts, but not everytime as FtW has stated previously here)


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Any change in VID from 3.9 to 5.0 is slight and not all that significant. Example: VID at 3.9 1.21, VID at 4.6 1.22. I was giving VIDs in the range where I first test 4.5 multiplier. Sorry if that doesn't make sense to you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is the same as my best chip almost, 5.0 at 1.41v with a 1.18 VID.


That's the max vid under heavy load. it's usually 1.19V during load


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> 2nd attempt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any Asrock owners could tell me what they think about my settings? lilchronic, chronicfx?
> 
> If they are ok, what are the steps to switch from this fixed mode to the offset mode?


yea i would say try offset thats what i run @ 5ghz with 1.37v- 1.40v with these settiings here for a reference









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## lilchronic

CPU vid idle stock 3570k

CPU VID @ stock settings @ load cpu vid 1.186v


VID @5ghz idle

VID 5ghz load vid 1.416


----------



## Puck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> RELIDDED Club, not delidded club !


x2


----------



## Hokies83

bling bling...


----------



## gdesmo

Hmmmm, AMD cards in an Intel forum. Try clicking on forum above !


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Hmmmm, AMD cards in an Intel forum. Try clicking on forum above !


??? ummm.... yeah bro... I have both and Amd cards have nothing to do with Intel...

If Nvidia cards did not suck so bad i would not have sold my Gtx 680s which were Bar none among the very best of 680s...

You see that Shirt you do know that is Galaxy Tech US a Nvidia Gpu Partner... Wheres your shirt?



And Alas...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Hmmmm, AMD cards in an Intel forum. Try clicking on forum above !


What you talkin bout man?








I guess you prefer your hd4000 lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> bling bling...


Did you get a thermal pad on the mosfets near the top front? (in the marked square)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Did you get a thermal pad on the mosfets near the top front? (in the marked square)


Errr No Aplhacools instructions did not show any going there =/


----------



## gdesmo

I actually have a XFX 7970 black edition, Diamond 7870, and 2 x Diamond 6870`s. Just don`t think I would brag about them in an Intel forum ! I also have a Gigabyte 680 and 2 Gigabyte 670`s but I wouldn`t think about thrusting them in the AMD guy`s faces. I did not say anything nasty or derogatory, was thinking it was strange and you are getting upset over nothing. LOL


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Errr No Aplhacools instructions did not show any going there =/


Don't know if they are actually needed, but on my 7970s the stock heatsink (& heatplate on the lightning) both had a pad there for contact.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> I actually have a XFX 7970 black edition, Diamond 7870, and 2 x Diamond 6870`s. Just don`t think I would brag about them in an Intel forum ! I also have a Gigabyte 680 and 2 Gigabyte 670`s but I wouldn`t think about thrusting them in the AMD guy`s faces. I did not say anything nasty or derogatory, was thinking it was strange and you are getting upset over nothing. LOL


Gpus can freely be talked about in either section, if it's part of the system, why not? The intel & AMD sections are about the cpus & any gpu can go with those.

Just have to watch slamming whichever card in the wrong nvidia or AMD gpu section. They can still be discussed in the competitor section, but you would want to avoid saying AMD sucks in the AMD section, & vice versa.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well said...that was the point though. We normally talk OT stuff in here...get a drink and enjoy


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well said...that was the point though. We normally talk OT stuff in here...get a drink and enjoy


Ivan looksy what I picked up in a heap of AM2+ parts I got last week...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227289


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Ivan looksy what I picked up in a heap of AM2+ parts I got last week...
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227289


hehe! Sexy ddr2 mate








Have you tried it yet?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> hehe! Sexy ddr2 mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have you tried it yet?


I have it in a AM2+ board right now. It's all breadboarded right now just to make sure it all works. I haven't had time to mess with it. Installed windows now and this weekend the kids are gonna be out of the house and the wifey is working doubles so I will have some time to make things happen. Or just sit on the couch with a case of beer, haven't decided yet.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> it's okay, my first delid I used a utility razor blade instead of the correct, thinner blade. I didn't mess up my delid though still (the thicker blade just is way harder to stick in and you gotta work hard to make sure the blade stays flat, as it'll have a tendency to aim toward towards the PCB). I was sweating after delidding with the utility blade, but when I used the right razor blade it cut through like butter and took maybe 15 minutes.


I used a utility blade for my practice runs on some old E6300 processors and found they went ok and was intending to get stuck into my 3770K tomorrow. Are there significant differences between an E6300 and an i7 that makes using a thicker blade riskier?


----------



## gdesmo

He didn`t talk about anything, was just showing off ! Dialog or explanation of system or something would have been fine.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have it in a AM2+ board right now. It's all breadboarded right now just to make sure it all works. I haven't had time to mess with it. Installed windows now and this weekend the kids are gonna be out of the house and the wifey is working doubles so I will have some time to make things happen. Or just sit on the couch with a case of beer, haven't decided yet.


Get the case of beer and mess around with the PC


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Get the case of beer and mess around with the PC


QFT. Beer + solid decision-making regarding overvolting to dangerous levels = a good time


----------



## chronicfx

I did it.. I am making a switch to the red team.. Hope I don't regret it.

2 xSapphire 7970 Vapor-X's inbound!

2xEVGA GTX680 on sale for $400 a piece on ebay!

Ummm.. I have a PCI sound card in my extreme6 in the slot between the video cards, will this be alright with the dual fan vapor-x's in crossfire?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Don't know if they are actually needed, but on my 7970s the stock heatsink (& heatplate on the lightning) both had a pad there for contact.
> Gpus can freely be talked about in either section, if it's part of the system, why not? The intel & AMD sections are about the cpus & any gpu can go with those.
> 
> Just have to watch slamming whichever card in the wrong nvidia or AMD gpu section. They can still be discussed in the competitor section, but you would want to avoid saying AMD sucks in the AMD section, & vice versa.


I took the blocks off and put some there lol.

Block covers them so why not have pads there..


----------



## MikeG

Since we are on the subject of AMD: I just received my MSI R7950 Twin Frozr 3GD5/OC. Mine is the newer Boost Edition which doesn't have the 7970 PCB (MSI went back to using the 7950 PCB), but it seems to do alright:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







*Hokies83* - Those waterblocks are sweet!







I like the chrome finish, It will nicely match my Koolance 380i. I'm going to order one tomorrow. I think that will complete my rig.


----------



## Swag

Can anyone help me with the Nvidia OpenGL problem?

Code:



Code:


The NVIDIA OpenGL driver has encountered
an out of memory error. This application might
behave inconsistently and fail.

How can I fix this?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Since we are on the subject of AMD: I just received my MSI R7950 Twin Frozr 3GD5/OC. Mine is the newer Boost Edition which doesn't have the 7970 PCB (MSI went back to using the 7950 PCB), but it seems to do alright:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Hokies83* - Those waterblocks are sweet!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the chrome finish, It will nicely match my Koolance 380i. I'm going to order one tomorrow. I think that will complete my rig.


http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_240_580&products_id=36088


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I took the blocks off and put some there lol.
> 
> Block covers them so why not have pads there..


Makes sense








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> Since we are on the subject of AMD: I just received my MSI R7950 Twin Frozr 3GD5/OC. Mine is the newer Boost Edition which doesn't have the 7970 PCB (MSI went back to using the 7950 PCB), but it seems to do alright:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Hokies83* - Those waterblocks are sweet!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the chrome finish, It will nicely match my Koolance 380i. I'm going to order one tomorrow. I think that will complete my rig.


That 3dm11 score is nice, but lowish (probably tesselation enabled in catalyst)...I couldn't scrape the 11k mark with my 670 clocked to 1400mhz core lol and 5ghz cpu


----------



## FtW 420

The titan is more than I was expecting. This is what it did in 3dmark 11, no mods done, just water cooled, with daily OC on the 3770k & slow memory.



Barely 400 points behind my 7970k graphics score, with the 7970k at 1617/1800 with an well overlocked cpu & memory.


----------



## Hokies83

LoL Titan is 1049$ 7970 is 350$ lol

I just do not see the titan hype yeah it is a fast Gpu.. but 1000$ fast No Way... 650$ fast.. Yes.


----------



## ivanlabrie

My thoughts exactly...still, free card for benching easy boints yeah why not?
I still hate the sheer amount of mods you have to do to Nvidia cards these days to get good scores. Modding a 1000usd card, not for the faint of heart.
I'll just stick to older vmodded older gen gpus for benching and call it a day.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL Titan is 1049$ 7970 is 350$ lol
> 
> I just do not see the titan hype yeah it is a fast Gpu.. but 1000$ fast No Way... 650$ fast.. Yes.


he got it strictly for benching


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The titan is more than I was expecting. This is what it did in 3dmark 11, no mods done, just water cooled, with daily OC on the 3770k & slow memory.
> 
> 
> 
> Barely 400 points behind my 7970k graphics score, with the 7970k at 1617/1800 with an well overlocked cpu & memory.


...gorgeous for a single GPU card, no matter what it's price tag...I say this on a day *when I got the HWbot world record for my 670 tri SLI*...each one was binned by itself...

...15788 for a single GPU *is just sick*..and all this is before you bring out the LN2 kit, isn't it ?


----------



## Zeek

Yep, that's just on water. Pretty damn impressive


----------



## lilchronic

titan should have been 650$


----------



## MKHunt

Titan seems inflated for its compromises. And I know a thing or two about an Nvidia flagship having compromises.

Gathering my toolz to kill my chip tomorrow.


----------



## Zeek

Good luck


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hopefully I'll be part of this club sometime next week!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hopefully I'll be part of this club sometime next week!


OT...

But seeing your Avatar reminded me..... My Brother thinks his Cobalt SS can take my Boosted 2004 Zo6 Corvette XD

Weight same...

RWD vs FWD i have 3x more HP / TQ Power band picks up quicker and last longer to...

I was thinken id beat him by 15 = 25 lenghs in the 1/4 lol


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Makes sense
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That 3dm11 score is nice, but lowish (probably tesselation enabled in catalyst)...I couldn't scrape the 11k mark with my 670 clocked to 1400mhz core lol and 5ghz cpu


I got a much better score with tesselation turned off, but then 3DMark says my result is invalid. Is that something I should normally keep off? I think this is about the max my card will do. Maybe I should buy a second one, that way I wouldn't have to work so hard.










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yea i would say try offset thats what i run @ 5ghz with 1.37v- 1.40v with these settiings here for a reference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Going to try these values, thx a lot!


----------



## sakerfalcon

After delidding, I'm getting about 15C idle difference from hottest to coldest core. I've applied CLU on die and on IHS; any explanations besides bad application of CLU?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sakerfalcon*
> 
> After delidding, I'm getting about 15C idle difference from hottest to coldest core. I've applied CLU on die and on IHS; any explanations besides bad application of CLU?


bad mount with your cooler? lolz but idle temps dont mean any thing its all about temps @ load


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sakerfalcon*
> 
> After delidding, I'm getting about 15C idle difference from hottest to coldest core. I've applied CLU on die and on IHS; any explanations besides bad application of CLU?


sleeper cores. It's normal. it's if they are that far apart at full load is where you need to worry.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MikeG*
> 
> I got a much better score with tesselation turned off, but then 3DMark says my result is invalid. Is that something I should normally keep off? I think this is about the max my card will do. Maybe I should buy a second one, that way I wouldn't have to work so hard.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Hwbot thinks tess disabled via catalyst is valid, cause it's part of the driver settings (like Nvidia's LOD trick)
EDIT: Only disable it if you don't care for tesselation or don't like it, or you're benching for boints.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sakerfalcon*
> 
> After delidding, I'm getting about 15C idle difference from hottest to coldest core. I've applied CLU on die and on IHS; any explanations besides bad application of CLU?


15C seems alot to me, even at idle,



5 to 10C max is more like it at idle,
but what the others say, more important is your temp difference under load


----------



## [CyGnus]

That is a bad mount or too much CLP/U in die i had to remount my cpu 3 times and finally have a 4/5c max temp difference between cores


----------



## stickg1

It's funny everyone is selling their nvidia's for AMD's. Where were you guys two weeks ago when I was trying to trade my 7970 for a 670?

Having had both, I will say that the 7970 gets higher benchmark scores, but the gameplay on the GTX 670 is much smoother. I don't have the texture flickering, screen tearing, and frame latency anymore now that I went Green.

But hey maybe one day AMD will make a decent driver, I'm just not one to sit around and wait after I paid $300-$400 for a piece of hardware. IMO, it should work 100% right out of the box.

Just my


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's funny everyone is selling their nvidia's for AMD's. Where were you guys two weeks ago when I was trying to trade my 7970 for a 670?
> 
> Having had both, I will say that the 7970 gets higher benchmark scores, but the gameplay on the GTX 670 is much smoother. I don't have the texture flickering, screen tearing, and frame latency anymore now that I went Green.
> 
> But hey maybe one day AMD will make a decent driver, I'm just not one to sit around and wait after I paid $300-$400 for a piece of hardware. IMO, it should work 100% right out of the box.
> 
> Just my


...I see far more people buying NVidia than AMD...also supported by compiled sales statistics...AMD is in $ difficulty and had to agree to a hedge fund stepping in which fired a lot of their senior staff, while NVidia just reported great financial results on very strong sales.

In my community here, new vid card purchases re 2:1 for NVidia..BUT the whole vid market may change as Intel is bringing out CPUs with built-in iGPU that can actually be used for decent gaming...low end and lower middle-class from AMD and Nvidia are facing a lot more competition


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> it's okay, my first delid I used a utility razor blade instead of the correct, thinner blade. I didn't mess up my delid though still (the thicker blade just is way harder to stick in and you gotta work hard to make sure the blade stays flat, as it'll have a tendency to aim toward towards the PCB). I was sweating after delidding with the utility blade, but when I used the right razor blade it cut through like butter and took maybe 15 minutes.
> 
> 
> 
> I used a utility blade for my practice runs on some old E6300 processors and found they went ok and was intending to get stuck into my 3770K tomorrow. Are there significant differences between an E6300 and an i7 that makes using a thicker blade riskier?
Click to expand...

It's a million times more difficult using a utility blade than a regular razors blade. It's hard to get in there so you are pushing really hard (and once you break through the glue, that might be enough to just go all the way to slam the die or pcb), it constantly is forcing itself to angle downwards to scratch the pcb so half the effort is just keeping the blade flat...

I would not use a utility blade on an i7. I mean I did, but it was hard, I actually scuffed my PCB in the process... You can be one of the few people who screw up the delid because they most likely used a utility blade or exacto knife, or like 100% of the people who succeeded because they used the right tools.

I'm just speaking out of my bum here, but I really think all the people who screwed up delidding, used the wrong blade or something disastrous. The OP isn't clear on what type of razor blade to use so I went with the sharpest blade I had (i had about 30 blades of every type when I was delidding) rather than the thinnest.
Quote:


> It's funny everyone is selling their nvidia's for AMD's. Where were you guys two weeks ago when I was trying to trade my 7970 for a 670?
> 
> Having had both, I will say that the 7970 gets higher benchmark scores, but the gameplay on the GTX 670 is much smoother. I don't have the texture flickering, screen tearing, and frame latency anymore now that I went Green.


yea given how expensive gpus are I'm pretty much done with experimenting with amd on that one. and with cpus too (although i still maintain the phenom ii x4 is the best budget chip to this day).


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's funny everyone is selling their nvidia's for AMD's. Where were you guys two weeks ago when I was trying to trade my 7970 for a 670?
> 
> Having had both, I will say that the 7970 gets higher benchmark scores, but the gameplay on the GTX 670 is much smoother. I don't have the texture flickering, screen tearing, and frame latency anymore now that I went Green.
> 
> But hey maybe one day AMD will make a decent driver, I'm just not one to sit around and wait after I paid $300-$400 for a piece of hardware. IMO, it should work 100% right out of the box.
> 
> Just my


From what i read it can be fixed if u work at it and find the right driver.


----------



## couchasault9001

completed my de-lid last night... holy crap that was stressful.

i ended up turning my oven to 175f and put it in there about 6 different times through the process. made it a bit easier. i just put it lid down on a clean cookie sheet.

I put it in last night with some as5 just to make sure everything was okay. liquid ultra will be here today. Going to put my 212+ on for reference before/after then put my zalman lq320 on in push pull.


----------



## MikeG

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> completed my de-lid last night... holy crap that was stressful.
> 
> i ended up turning my oven to 175f and put it in there about 6 different times through the process. made it a bit easier. i just put it lid down on a clean cookie sheet.


















Gave you a rep for guts.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You should have baked cookies while at it...or muffins lol


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> completed my de-lid last night... holy crap that was stressful.
> 
> i ended up turning my oven to 175f and put it in there about 6 different times through the process. made it a bit easier. i just put it lid down on a clean cookie sheet.
> 
> I put it in last night with some as5 just to make sure everything was okay. liquid ultra will be here today. Going to put my 212+ on for reference before/after then put my zalman lq320 on in push pull.


Bing !! and the results ?


----------



## MKHunt

Plans to kill my 3770k went horribly awry.



Reassembling my loop, so I'll have results later today.


----------



## BradleyW

Looks like a good chip. Take care with the delid and good look.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Plans to kill my 3770k went horribly awry.
> 
> 
> 
> Reassembling my loop, so I'll have results later today.


Nice one man!


----------



## stickg1

chronic I saw your thread on [H], I gave you a shout-out but got no love :\

I think I need a new BIOS chip for my Extreme6 after searching for people with my same problems on google, that seems to be the fix.

1. My CPU multi is capped at 38
2. RAM is capped at 1600MHz
3. iGPU and anything related to it has been removed from BIOS.

Very crippling ailment to say the least. I don't want to send it to ASrock if I don't have to so I'm going to order a new BIOS chip to see if that's the fix.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Plans to kill my 3770k went horribly awry.
> 
> 
> 
> Reassembling my loop, so I'll have results later today.


Glad it`s alive !


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Nice one man!


Danke. I cut the IHS a bit which resulted in elevated blood pressure when I saw a fleck of copper on the PCB.

Oh and forget about having results tonight. Swiftech intervened.


----------



## kesawi

How to you spread Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra? No brush was supplied with the kit. I've tried using another small brush and all it seems to do is stick to the end of it rather than spread.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> How to you spread Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra? No brush was supplied with the kit. I've tried using another small brush and all it seems to do is stick to the end of it rather than spread.


I got two sticks with my CLU package. It was in the back with the scrubbing pad.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I got two sticks with my CLU package. It was in the back with the scrubbing pad.


All I had with mine was the syringe, instructions, scrubbing brush and warning card. Nothing else.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> All I had with mine was the syringe, instructions, scrubbing brush and warning card. Nothing else.


I'd probably contact where ever got it from and see if they could sort out the issue. As for using something else, I've seen a couple of people use a cotton swab. Just stick to one side of it and you should be ok.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'd probably contact where ever got it from and see if they could sort out the issue. As for using something else, I've seen a couple of people use a cotton swab. Just stick to one side of it and you should be ok.


Will have to give that a go as I ordered it direct from Coollaboratory in Germany. Thanks


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Will have to give that a go as I ordered it direct from Coollaboratory in Germany. Thanks


Just use a Q-tip and be done.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Just use a Q-tip and be done.


This. They send a qtip with a plastic stick instead of wrapped paper. It's easiest to spread it if you wipe the same direction with each stroke.


----------



## TonicX

Gunna do it! Delid my 3770k , that is. The research phase is wrapping-up now and I have decided for sure that this is a good idea albeit slightly risky. probably not as risky as going all-in with a pair of Jacks like at the poker table tonight, ... thumpa, thumpa, thumpa. whew, I win! I have the right, rectangular, thin, razor -blade, 220,400, 600, 1600, grit sand-paper. and the CoolLab Ultra will be here Monday. I got some really good OCs with Asus AI2 real-time controls and [MOW] (c) * ambient techniques; but It hits a wall at 4750 Mhz- Temps go Bat-S#it Crazy! Even with IC Diamond 7- Got to be the intel TIM and IHS height; not to mention huge room for improving the flatness (it is concave) and smoothness of the top of the cover. I believe the unlidded approach has merits but not enough of you run this way for me to go straight there. So im a gunna delid and relid my baby, thanks for all the helpful posts. Im new to this forum - holla at your boy, TonicX

* [Minnesota Open Window}


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Gunna do it! Delid my 3770k , that is. The research phase is wrapping-up now and I have decided for sure that this is a good idea albeit slightly risky. probably not as risky as going all-in with a pair of Jacks like at the poker table tonight, ... thumpa, thumpa, thumpa. whew, I win! I have the right, rectangular, thin, razor -blade, 220,400, 600, 1600, grit sand-paper. and the CoolLab Ultra will be here Monday. I got some really good OCs with Asus AI2 real-time controls and [MOW] (c) * ambient techniques; but It hits a wall at 4750 Mhz- Temps go Bat-S#it Crazy! Even with IC Diamond 7- Got to be the intel TIM and IHS height; not to mention huge room for improving the flatness (it is concave) and smoothness of the top of the cover. I believe the unlidded approach has merits but not enough of you run this way for me to go straight there. So im a gunna delid and relid my baby, thanks for all the helpful posts. Im new to this forum - holla at your boy, TonicX
> 
> * [Minnesota Open Window}


Examine your TIM when you remove the chip before deciding the IHS shape. Mine was either completely flat or the same shape as my raystorm because K2 paste from my temporary test runs was spread incredibly evenly. That K2 is actually very very decent stuff! But for my final mount I used IC Diamond.


----------



## kesawi

Delidded my i7-3770K and did it make a huge difference to the temps. It was definitely easier with a thinner blade. Thanks to everyone for suggestions with spreading the Liquid Ultra:thumb: Details below for submission to club.

*OCN name:* kesawi
*CPU:* i7-3779K
*on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
*ihs-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
*Mhz gained:* 200MHz
*OC after delid:* 4700MHz
*Temp drops:* 25C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* valid.canardpc.com/2652558



Delidded CPU:


Pre-delid [email protected]: Max Core Temp 91C


Post-delid [email protected]: Max Core Temp 66C


Post-delid temps @4.7GHz (Target 24/7 stable overclock): Max Core Temp 89C (Note running quiet fan profiles rather than max fan speed)


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> How to you spread Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra? No brush was supplied with the kit. I've tried using another small brush and all it seems to do is stick to the end of it rather than spread.


cotton swap, brush and a surgical glove( i cut of 1 finger..lol) you can use,
i tried all of them, it works..
it will stick to the end of a brush, or q-tip when you start to apply it,
just keep at it, and use the same spot of brush or q-tip all the time








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Delidded my i7-3770K and did it make a huge difference to the temps. It was definitely easier with a thinner blade. Thanks to everyone for suggestions with spreading the Liquid Ultra:thumb: Details below for submission to club.
> 
> *OCN name:* kesawi
> *CPU:* i7-3779K
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHz
> *OC after delid:* 4700MHz
> *Temp drops:* 25C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2652558
> 
> Delidded CPU:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pre-delid [email protected]: Max Core Temp 91C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Post-delid [email protected]: Max Core Temp 66C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Post-delid temps @4.7GHz (Target 24/7 stable overclock): Max Core Temp 89C (Note running quiet fan profiles rather than max fan speed)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


o, i see you got it "covered" already ..lol
nvm my post above









gratz on the delid kesawi








have to say, at 4.7ghz and 89C looks a bit hot to me still, whats your ambient temp, very high also?
i hit 84C when i run IBT at 5.0ghz see..


----------



## martinhal

@ kesawi

Welcome to the club good job. The temps are a tad high but I guess ambient temps are high Down Under. Below are the temps I get.


----------



## kesawi

My ambient is 27.2C outside the case and 28.8C inside my case at the intake to my CPU cooler. Unfortunately my chip loves voltage so I have to run vCore at 1.42V for it to be stable. Still it's a less than the 1.512V I see you're running at for 5GHz. My chip has always been hot and delidding has helped a lot.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> My ambient is 27.2C outside the case and 28.8C inside my case at the intake to my CPU cooler. Unfortunately my chip loves voltage so I have to run vCore at 1.42V for it to be stable. Still it's a less than the 1.512V I see you're running at for 5GHz. My chip has always been hot and delidding has helped a lot.


That's 5.1 ....







handy for folding , max temp 76 .

Edit : If you look at my table Im at 84 for 1.512 . I still think that your temps are still a tad high for 1.392. My guess you should be at around 80.

Perhaps reseat and all that good stuff.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> My ambient is 27.2C outside the case and 28.8C inside my case at the intake to my CPU cooler. Unfortunately my chip loves voltage so I have to run vCore at 1.42V for it to be stable. Still it's a less than the 1.512V I see you're running at for 5GHz. My chip has always been hot and delidding has helped a lot.


...First: CONGRATS to kesawi









delidding can really help increase the GHz headroom via lower temps...my chip always had the speed, but delidding and a strong custom w-c loop (have you considered that?) opened a whole new range...here are some quick temps for 5.0, 5.1, 5.2 and 5.3 GHz for the CPU Queen bench (related thread is here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/thinking-of-overclocking-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-stock-turbo-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz )


----------



## Derko1

So... I can do 4.6ghz at 1.32v on my 3770k... and I was trying to get to 4.8ghz with 1.40v and was not able to do it at all. It totally escaped my mind to check temperatures. I'm using a water set up, and I knew that temperatures would be bad... but not as bad as I am seeing right now.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> That's 5.1 ....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> handy for folding , max temp 76 .
> 
> Edit : If you look at my table Im at 84 for 1.512 . I still think that your temps are still a tad high for 1.392. My guess you should be at around 80.
> 
> Perhaps reseat and all that good stuff.


Nice







My temps are a lot lower than they were before so I'm really happy with where they're at now, and would like to improve them but I'm not sure how much more I'll gain. I'm out of the Liquid Ultra so unfortunately I can't reseat my IHS for now. I'm pretty sure I had the right amount of coverage for the liquid ultra on both the die and IHS based on how it looked compared to the 



.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...First: CONGRATS to kesawi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> delidding can really help increase the GHz headroom via lower temps...my chip always had the speed, but delidding and a strong custom w-c loop (have you considered that?) opened a whole new range...here are some quick temps for 5.0, 5.1, 5.2 and 5.3 GHz for the CPU Queen bench (related thread is here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/thinking-of-overclocking-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-stock-turbo-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz )
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice temps and overclock you have there







I've considered going down the route of a custom water loop and if I was folding or regularly doing a lot of processor intensive stuff where an extra 200-300MHz would be beneficial then it would be worth the expense. I've been overclocking my PC really just to see how far I can push it rather than for any real practical purpose. Having said that I'll probably end up water cooling it at some point because I'll run out of things to play around with on air







I'm trying to shoot for a 4.5GHz 24/7 overclock keeping the temperatures in the low 70s. Ambient can be another 10C higher here at the peak of summer so it will leave me a buffer. Currently running a Prime 95 stability test at the moment and I've had to push VCore up to 1.275 already, although I'm getting a droop down to 1.26V according to CPU-Z.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *Kewasi* wrote... Nice temps and overclock you have there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've considered going down the route of a custom water loop and if I was folding or regularly doing a lot of processor intensive stuff where an extra 200-300MHz would be beneficial then it would be worth the expense. I've been overclocking my PC really just to see how far I can push it rather than for any real practical purpose. Having said that I'll probably end up water cooling it at some point because I'll run out of things to play around with on air
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm trying to shoot for a 4.5GHz 24/7 overclock keeping the temperatures in the low 70s. Ambient can be another 10C higher here at the peak of summer so it will leave me a buffer. Currently running a Prime 95 stability test at the moment and I've had to push VCore up to 1.275 already, although I'm getting a droop down to 1.26V according to CPU-Z.


-...4.5 should easily be possible at that voltage for your chip...with the right cooling, even with ambient temps in the mid-30ies, 4.8 is also not totally unrealistic..

...each chip will have it's own 'wall' it hits at a given speed...with some 3770K's it can set in around 4.4, others don't hit it until 5 or 5.1 and a few select chips don't see it far beyond that...but that wall is there, requiring a much steeper vCore increase for the next 100 MHz step.

...up until recently, I ran a '*closed-loop*' Thermaltake Water 2 Extreme 240mm unit which I highly recommend for those folks interested in water-cooling but not yet looking at a custom loop. Other good closed loop ones would be the related KrakenX60 and the new Swiftech.

In my case, the closed loop was good enough for a nice, cool 4.9 daily (ambient usually is 22 C), with 5 a possibility though temps would slip into the high 80ies (pre-delid). Once delidded, I saw a combined 20.5 c drop from the delid and CL-U on the IHS- and going to a powerful CPU custom loop saved another 5-10 C (not done final testing yet as I should lap my IHS given its curvature)...with that overall temp drop, all my speed settings tr vCore had to be redone







...because on average, I could lower vCore by 0.05v due to the massive combined temp savings...that's IvyBridge for you...VERY temp sensitive











- re stability testing, I would recommend *Intel's actual stability and stress testing software* Embedded in Intel's XTU (Extreme Tuning Utility)...more here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13050#post_19431442 .

I find it to be tougher, ie on memory test (which of course is also a CPU test in its own right), than Prime95 - XTU will heat up my system (post delid, custom loop) by 5 to 7 C MORE than Prime95...I'm running 32GB of TridentX and the CPU's IMC (memory controller) has its hands full with that during stress testing...and if you really want to / need to, you can set it to run up to 30 days... Intel's XTU is what the pro's are using in commercial builds and serious /pro-overclocking, per referenced post.

- ...look forward to follow your progress...by the sounds of it, you have more than reasonable speed targets in mind while also thinking about ambient temps during the hot season...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ladies and gents, a FULL guide and explanation of delidding a IB CPU, by me:
Swag and Cookie Monster approved (Val)




For more information on my de-lidding, please visit my OCN thread:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1357638/my-i7-3770k-de-lidding-adventure


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> chronic I saw your thread on [H], I gave you a shout-out but got no love :\
> 
> I think I need a new BIOS chip for my Extreme6 after searching for people with my same problems on google, that seems to be the fix.
> 
> 1. My CPU multi is capped at 38
> 2. RAM is capped at 1600MHz
> 3. iGPU and anything related to it has been removed from BIOS.
> 
> Very crippling ailment to say the least. I don't want to send it to ASrock if I don't have to so I'm going to order a new BIOS chip to see if that's the fix.


You got dell'd


----------



## chronicfx

you mean the original delidded thread on Hard Forum.. Yeah that one went down like a lead balloon. But then I found this one on OCN. Not sure which was started first, may have to look at the original post and claim copyright and damages on val







I kid..


----------



## chronicfx

I started that one then realized you can't just upload pictures from your C drive... You have to go through the internet?? I had no idea how nor did I want to learn.. Thats when I decided OCN rocks.


----------



## BradleyW

Which thermal compound have Intel used in the 3770k for the thermal performance to be so poor?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Which thermal compound have Intel used in the 3770k for the thermal performance to be so poor?


I believe it is not all that bad. The problem seems to be that the thermal conductivity of most pastes cant keep up with the heat generated by the small die. That's why CLP/CLU does so well as it has 5-10 times the thermal conductivity of other pastes. People have used mx4 and as5 on die and still fall short of CLP.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I believe it is not all that bad. The problem seems to be that the thermal conductivity of most pastes cant keep up with the heat generated by the small die. That's why CLP/CLU does so well as it has 5-10 times the thermal conductivity of other pastes. People have used mx4 and as5 on die and still fall short of CLP.


Also the amount of rubber sealant they use creates a gap between the die and the IHS. This is the primary problem.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Also the amount of rubber sealant they use creates a gap between the die and the IHS. This is the primary problem.


Agreed on this.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Agreed on this.


That's half the problem .


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> That's half the problem .


^^^ that plus it traps heat around the die below the IHS


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Also the amount of rubber sealant they use creates a gap between the die and the IHS. This is the primary problem.


+1


----------



## Littlejoe

I did it, was easy too. Won't be able to join the club because I didn't do the before temp test, but that's okay. I know I did it. Now if my CLP would just get here. This is a spare cpu (I5 3750) as I didn't like it's oc. Would only get to 4.3 stable so I rolled the dice again.

One question, can I clean the glue with ArctiClean?

Thanks for the guide!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> I did it, was easy too. Won't be able to join the club because I didn't do the before temp test, but that's okay. I know I did it. Now if my CLP would just get here. This is a spare cpu (I5 3750) as I didn't like it's oc. Would only get to 4.3 stable so I rolled the dice again.
> 
> One question, can I clean the glue with ArctiClean?
> 
> Thanks for the guide!


You can try to clean it with arcticlean, however I suggest first using a credit card, and then once youve done as much as you can do with it, use arcticlean
See arcticlean as a polisher of the residue of the remaining glue.


----------



## Swag

103 degree F fever... I feel bad...


----------



## Littlejoe

Looks like I might have a couple small nicks on the PCB. They didn't go all the way through but I can see copper. My concern is that they'll short to lid. Is there something I can put on the nicks?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 103 degree F fever... I feel bad...


Get better soon bro
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> Looks like I might have a couple small nicks on the PCB. They didn't go all the way through but I can see copper. My concern is that they'll short to lid. Is there something I can put on the nicks?


I had some on my PCB as well :/
I saw from your pictures, on the corners it looked like you had several scratches, but couldn't be sure.
It should be OK though - but provide us with some high-res pics.


----------



## gdesmo

Acrylic nail polish or LET.


----------



## Swag

Sorry this is a bit OT but can anyone help me on this?

My friend recently got hacked and my brother is telling me it is this certain website, can anyone verify if this is a malicious website?

Website: pvp.pitforge.com

It is for a Minecraft server we play.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> Looks like I might have a couple small nicks on the PCB. They didn't go all the way through but I can see copper. My concern is that they'll short to lid. Is there something I can put on the nicks?


I had a little nick in mine and I was scared out of my mind when I noticed. Chip still works fine tho


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 103 degree F fever... I feel bad...


...I know your pain...am still on Penicillin...my fever was not as high as yours though - Good Health to you !


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> Acrylic nail polish or LET.


^^^ +1 and MX4 also does the trick


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys! I'm finally here. After nicking the PCB on my 3570k a couple days ago and losing dual-channel memory, I'm finally here. Got a pretty golden 3770k at microcenter today and I just finished delidding it with much success. Currently benching 4.6Ghz @ 1.24v. Haven't gone any lower on the voltage. I am slowing just raising the clock up with this same voltage and haven't gotten any errors yet. VERY HAPPY So please add me to this club:thumb:

Don't hate me, but I'm using mx4 until my CLU gets here. Temps still dropped about 7c as far as I can see.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Sp P95 just crashed at 4.6Ghz @ 1.24. I've never had it crash on me I've just gotten blue screens of errors. Well I'll go back down to 4.5Ghz and see how low of a voltage I can get.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Delidded my i7-3770K and did it make a huge difference to the temps. It was definitely easier with a thinner blade. Thanks to everyone for suggestions with spreading the Liquid Ultra:thumb: Details below for submission to club.
> 
> *OCN name:* kesawi
> *CPU:* i7-3779K
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHz
> *OC after delid:* 4700MHz
> *Temp drops:* 25C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* valid.canardpc.com/2652558
> 
> 
> 
> Delidded CPU:
> 
> 
> Pre-delid [email protected]: Max Core Temp 91C
> 
> 
> Post-delid [email protected]: Max Core Temp 66C
> 
> 
> Post-delid temps @4.7GHz (Target 24/7 stable overclock): Max Core Temp 89C (Note running quiet fan profiles rather than max fan speed)


You're In!







Slap that new Sig on baby!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> I did it, was easy too. Won't be able to join the club because I didn't do the before temp test, but that's okay. I know I did it. Now if my CLP would just get here. This is a spare cpu (I5 3750) as I didn't like it's oc. Would only get to 4.3 stable so I rolled the dice again.
> 
> One question, can I clean the glue with ArctiClean?
> 
> Thanks for the guide!


That's alright just give me the info you can and I'll add you!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 103 degree F fever... I feel bad...


I have it as well.......


----------



## RavageTheEarth

OCN name: RavageTheEarth
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: MX4
ihs-TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: Not totally sure just got the CPU today, is that ok? I would say around 300Mhz though
OC after delid: 4500
Temp drops: 7c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2724250





Is that all the right info? I got the CPU today and just popped it in and made sure it wasn't horrible and then took it out and delidded it. Can't wait to be part of the club finally!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> OCN name:
> 
> Is that all the right info? I got the CPU today and just popped it in and made sure it wasn't horrible and then took it out and delidded it. Can't wait to be part of the club finally!


Can't say if that is everything needed, but I would wait until you put some coollabs on the die, and see what your temp drops really are. Congrats on the new chip and delid!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Can't say if that is everything needed, but I would wait until you put some coollabs on the die, and see what your temp drops really are. Congrats on the new chip and delid!


True, I'm just impatient and wanted to get the delidded club signature haha. Yea I guess I'll wait it would add more valuable info on the chart. I could only imagine what CLU is going to do because I'm at 4.7Ghz @ 1.32v right now and I've been running it for over an hour and a half and temps havent passed 80c. I'm amazed!


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> -...4.5 should easily be possible at that voltage for your chip...with the right cooling, even with ambient temps in the mid-30ies, 4.8 is also not totally unrealistic.


Have been testing 4.5gHz and have had to push the voltage up to 1.285 and it still keeps failing Prime95 running a custom blend with +90% memory utilisation after 1-2 hours









I'm beginning to wonder whether my RAM might have a problem. I've run Memtest on it overnight at stock settings and had no errors. I've run the same test with my current 24/7 overclock of 4.3GHz @ 1.2V and it comes up with errors. I also switch from fixed voltage to an offset overclock with DVID-0.070 @ 4.3GHZ to get my target VCore of 1.2V. It passed a 12 hour run of Prime95 but crashed the moment I started playing some games. I'm not sure what's going on.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Watercooling
> 
> 
> 
> ..each chip will have it's own 'wall' it hits at a given speed...with some 3770K's it can set in around 4.4, others don't hit it until 5 or 5.1 and a few select chips don't see it far beyond that...but that wall is there, requiring a much steeper vCore increase for the next 100 MHz step.
> 
> ...up until recently, I ran a '*closed-loop*' Thermaltake Water 2 Extreme 240mm unit which I highly recommend for those folks interested in water-cooling but not yet looking at a custom loop. Other good closed loop ones would be the related KrakenX60 and the new Swiftech.
> 
> In my case, the closed loop was good enough for a nice, cool 4.9 daily (ambient usually is 22 C), with 5 a possibility though temps would slip into the high 80ies (pre-delid). Once delidded, I saw a combined 20.5 c drop from the delid and CL-U on the IHS- and going to a powerful CPU custom loop saved another 5-10 C (not done final testing yet as I should lap my IHS given its curvature)...with that overall temp drop, all my speed settings tr vCore had to be redone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...because on average, I could lower vCore by 0.05v due to the massive combined temp savings...that's IvyBridge for you...VERY temp sensitive


I've considered a closed loop water cooling solution however I have a Fractal R3 case and would need to do to much modification to it to fit a 240mm radiator in. Also my video card gets a tad warm under load so I would want to cool that as well. By the time I buy something like the Thermaltake for the CPU and Accelero Hybrid for the GPU I'm only maybe $50-$100 off a custom loop any way. As I said I'm happy running on air and am only really pushing the overclock just to see what I can get it do do








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Stability Testing
> 
> 
> 
> - re stability testing, I would recommend *Intel's actual stability and stress testing software* Embedded in Intel's XTU (Extreme Tuning Utility)...more here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13050#post_19431442 .
> 
> I find it to be tougher, ie on memory test (which of course is also a CPU test in its own right), than Prime95 - XTU will heat up my system (post delid, custom loop) by 5 to 7 C MORE than Prime95...I'm running 32GB of TridentX and the CPU's IMC (memory controller) has its hands full with that during stress testing...and if you really want to / need to, you can set it to run up to 30 days... Intel's XTU is what the pro's are using in commercial builds and serious /pro-overclocking, per referenced post.


I'll give that a go. I know Intel Burn Test heats up my CPU more than Prime95 does.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> - ...look forward to follow your progress...by the sounds of it, you have more than reasonable speed targets in mind while also thinking about ambient temps during the hot season...


Thanks I appreciate the help you've given me


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Have been testing 4.5gHz and have had to push the voltage up to 1.285 and it still keeps failing Prime95 running a custom blend with +90% memory utilisation after 1-2 hours
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm beginning to wonder whether my RAM might have a problem. I've run Memtest on it overnight at stock settings and had no errors. I've run the same test with my current 24/7 overclock of 4.3GHz @ 1.2V and it comes up with errors. I also switch from fixed voltage to an offset overclock with DVID-0.070 @ 4.3GHZ to get my target VCore of 1.2V. It passed a 12 hour run of Prime95 but crashed the moment I started playing some games. I'm not sure what's going on.
> I've considered a closed loop water cooling solution however I have a Fractal R3 case and would need to do to much modification to it to fit a 240mm radiator in. Also my video card gets a tad warm under load so I would want to cool that as well. By the time I buy something like the Thermaltake for the CPU and Accelero Hybrid for the GPU I'm only maybe $50-$100 off a custom loop any way. As I said I'm happy running on air and am only really pushing the overclock just to see what I can get it do do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll give that a go. I know Intel Burn Test heats up my CPU more than Prime95 does.
> Thanks I appreciate the help you've given me


...sounds like your chip has a very responsible owner...ultimately, you have to decide what the highest level of vCore under load you are comfortable with >>>which of course is the age-old question...with good cooling, you can run lower Vcore or higher GHz....but in the end - and take it from a speed-freak who is sick at home so he established 12 records at HWBot over two days - what it really comes down to is only '3D gaming / video'...whether your email runs at 4, 4.5 or 5 GHz is totally immaterial, other than wanting to know how far you can push a given chip >>>just because you want to know









...I guess I am saying that whatever your computer budget is, go for video first because it makes the most daily difference.

...here is the link to Intel's XTU...not only does it have the 'real stress test', but I find that it is among the best overclocking tools...when I use that, I can usually lower my vCore by a step, presumably because it has fixed formulas for PLL and various other things people easily bring out of balance...best of luck







http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/motherboards/desktop-motherboards/desktop-boards-software-extreme-tuning-utility.html


----------



## Hokies83

Have not seen the de lidded club Mascot around much?

Oh where Oh where has our Von Dutch gone? Visted the Red light Dist again?


----------



## Belial

What do you guys set your PLL voltage to? What happens if you set it 'too' low? I heard on one guide that lowering it affect overclock performance and you shouldn't go below 1.709?

trying to hit [email protected]~1.45-1.55v 24 hour p95 stable. Hopefully less rather than more. Running 1.5v PLL, having Kernel-WHEA errors after a few hours of testing but i think that's vcore related (ive got it so system shuts down when WHEA errors occur).

http://www.thinkcomputers.org/intel-ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide/


----------



## martinhal

Ive always left it at my MB auto of 1.8 , have just dropped it to 1.715. Will fold with that and see how it turns out. Not going to waste folding time to run Prime 95 seeing my GPU's have picked up some 40+ ppd units







. Besides that I think if I can fold 24 hours plus with no WHEA errors I can call it stable.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> OCN name: RavageTheEarth
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: MX4
> ihs-TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: Not totally sure just got the CPU today, is that ok? I would say around 300Mhz though
> OC after delid: 4500
> Temp drops: 7c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2724250
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that all the right info? I got the CPU today and just popped it in and made sure it wasn't horrible and then took it out and delidded it. Can't wait to be part of the club finally!


You're In!







Now Slap that brand new and amazing Sig on! About time you got in here right!









With PLL it can matter on the OC as with my last chip I ran 1.5 for all the way to 4.8 Giggles and didn't have any issues during my folding fun. I usually set it for 1.9 during major OC'ing/benching runs just to help for stability.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> What do you guys set your PLL voltage to? What happens if you set it 'too' low? I heard on one guide that lowering it affect overclock performance and you shouldn't go below 1.709?
> 
> trying to hit [email protected]~1.45-1.55v 24 hour p95 stable. Hopefully less rather than more. Running 1.5v PLL, having Kernel-WHEA errors after a few hours of testing but i think that's vcore related (ive got it so system shuts down when WHEA errors occur).
> 
> http://www.thinkcomputers.org/intel-ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide/


i run 1.38v -1.416v for 5 ghz and cpu pll @ 1.605v no whea errors


----------



## RavageTheEarth

How do you guys make your computer shutdown if you get an errors in p95 or at a certain temperature that is too high for your personal liking?

Thanks valgaur! I'll still post my before and afters, but it will be from mx4 to CLU:thumb:


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds like your chip has a very responsible owner...ultimately, you have to decide what the highest level of vCore under load you are comfortable with >>>which of course is the age-old question...with good cooling, you can run lower Vcore or higher GHz....but in the end - and take it from a speed-freak who is sick at home so he established 12 records at HWBot over two days - what it really comes down to is only '3D gaming / video'...whether your email runs at 4, 4.5 or 5 GHz is totally immaterial, other than wanting to know how far you can push a given chip >>>just because you want to know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I guess I am saying that whatever your computer budget is, go for video first because it makes the most daily difference.


Seeing as I delidded I'm not sure whether that makes me a responsible owner







I agree, my GTX670 sustains +60fps at 1920x1200 with full eye candy on everything I play so the difference between 4.3GHz and 4.5 or 4.7 for that matter is pretty immaterial. I occasionally may do some video encoding, but for me it's critical to have 24/7 stability as my kids use the PC and I don't want it crashing on them. Have really just being trying to push it and see how far I can get my chip for curiosity's sake. I've had some good benchmarks with 3DMark (In the top 4) and 3DMark11 (just outside top 20) for a single GTX670 so was hoping to try and get a bit more out of the chip as there's only a small margin between my scores and #1 hardware spot that an extra 200MHz would give me, but I'm not real fussed if I don't get it. I've tried briefly putting it to 5GHZ @ 1.5V but 3DMark crashes as soon as the run starts. Best I've been able to sustain for a complete run is 4.8GHz and that took 1.5V. I think 4.3GHz seems to be my wall.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...here is the link to Intel's XTU...not only does it have the 'real stress test', but I find that it is among the best overclocking tools...when I use that, I can usually lower my vCore by a step, presumably because it has fixed formulas for PLL and various other things people easily bring out of balance...best of luck
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/motherboards/desktop-motherboards/desktop-boards-software-extreme-tuning-utility.html


I had a play around with it but can't find where to set VCore.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> How do you guys make your computer shutdown if you get an errors in p95 or at a certain temperature that is too high for your personal liking?


Not sure how to get it to shut down on Prime95 errors, but if you use Core Temp (http://www.alcpu.com/CoreTemp/) you canconfigure it to automatically shut down above a certain temperature threshold.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Not sure how to get it to shut down on Prime95 errors, but if you use Core Temp (http://www.alcpu.com/CoreTemp/) you canconfigure it to automatically shut down above a certain temperature threshold.


Is it where it says alarm temperature in the settings? There is something right near there called alarm .exe I'm not sure what that is either.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

My PLL is 1.7 - I fold daily.
Stock PLL is around 1.8


----------



## RavageTheEarth

hey Valgaur thanks for jumping in betweeen them two last night and stopping that fight in my thread. Bummer I really wanted to update on that thread but now its locked. I totally am all for heated debate, but that just went too far. So my liquid ultra will be here in 3-5 days


----------



## RavageTheEarth

One quick question. When I apply the CLU do I apply it to both the die and the backside of the IHS?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> My PLL is 1.7 - I fold daily.
> Stock PLL is around 1.8


We do what we want,
We do what we waa-ant,
We're Man United,
We do what we want!


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> One quick question. When I apply the CLU do I apply it to both the die and the backside of the IHS?


When I did it for the 1st time I applied a drop to the die and spread it with the brush, then put a tiny bit on the underside of the IHS. I thought I put too much but my temps were pretty good







I did leave a little of the silicon on the chip, and it helped when closing the clamp on the mobo, because when you take all the silicon off the IHS slides when you close the socket latch. With the little amount of silicon I left it didn't slide one bit


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> When I did it for the 1st time I applied a drop to the die and spread it with the brush, then put a tiny bit on the underside of the IHS. I thought I put too much but my temps were pretty good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did leave a little of the silicon on the chip, and it helped when closing the clamp on the mobo, because when you take all the silicon off the IHS slides when you close the socket latch. With the little amount of silicon I left it didn't slide one bit


Yea that's my problem I took all the glueoff so my ihs lides. I just place it alittle higher up so when it slides. Right into the position its supposed to be in. I guess its good and bad because now the ihs is closer to the die.
Ok so ill puut a thin layer of it on the die and the ihs.


----------



## Lobsterman

Excellent tutorial vid TD, it should be on the... oh wait it is









Lol Belial, this wins quote of the decade for me:-
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> I know it's novel, but the power of a processor has zero impact on the power of a graphics card.


mega


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Excellent tutorial vid TD, it should be on the... oh wait it is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol Belial, this wins quote of the decade for me:-
> mega


thanks buddy!
Thought NO ONE noticed it!
Yes Val and Swag approved the video and liked it - I had the video on private for over a week, before making it public.
Anyway, I'm really happy with the video - covers everything you need to know, and glad to see it in the OP already


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Lobsterman*
> 
> Excellent tutorial vid TD, it should be on the... oh wait it is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol Belial, this wins quote of the decade for me:-
> mega
> 
> 
> 
> thanks buddy!
> Thought NO ONE noticed it!
> Yes Val and Swag approved the video and liked it - I had the video on private for over a week, before making it public.
> Anyway, I'm really happy with the video - covers everything you need to know, and glad to see it in the OP already
Click to expand...

I'll add it to my guide when I feel 100%.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'll add it to my guide when I feel 100%.


thanks buddy









Both this thread and yours are linked to my video


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea that's my problem I took all the glueoff so my ihs lides. I just place it alittle higher up so when it slides. Right into the position its supposed to be in. I guess its good and bad because now the ihs is closer to the die.
> Ok so ill puut a thin layer of it on the die and the ihs.


Watch the Coollabs video to get an idea of how to apply Ultra.
I like painting it on the die, and then just a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS just to fill in the cracks so to speak. You can do the underside of the IHS with what is just left on the brush from doing the die, it doesn't take much when you spend the time to spread it.
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/

Nice thing about delidding is you can go back and try it again. I have repainted the die on both chips a few times.

Edit: You can keep the IHS in place when being clamped down by firmly press down on the middle of it with one finger while you clamp it down with the other hand.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Also, how mych LCU should I apply to spread it perfectly into a thin layer? Should I use the half a grain of rice method?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Watch the Coollabs video to get an idea of how to apply Ultra.
> I like painting it on the die, and then just a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS just to fill in the cracks so to speak. You can do the underside of the IHS with what is just left on the brush from doing the die, it doesn't take much when you spend the time to spread it.
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/
> 
> Nice thing about delidding is you can go back and try it again. I have repainted the die on both chips a few times.
> 
> Edit: You can keep the IHS in place when being clamped down by firmly press down on the middle of it with one finger while you clamp it down with the other hand.


Oh ok cool thanks I didn't even see that you posted.


----------



## Derko1

So I killed my chip!!!!

Seriously I did. Turns out that my chip had a solid piece of the HIS basically soldered to the PCB. I was able to cut around it without issues except for that one piece. I actually broke a razor on it trying to cut it. It was tiny, but as I wiggled it, I was able to get it off... but then came out the chunk of the PCB.










Never doing it again... and I went and bought a new one arleady. Good thing this one OC's bette than the other one. It's doing 4.6ghz at 1.23v


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Watch the Coollabs video to get an idea of how to apply Ultra.
> I like painting it on the die, and then just a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS just to fill in the cracks so to speak. You can do the underside of the IHS with what is just left on the brush from doing the die, it doesn't take much when you spend the time to spread it.
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/
> 
> Nice thing about delidding is you can go back and try it again. I have repainted the die on both chips a few times.
> 
> Edit: You can keep the IHS in place when being clamped down by firmly press down on the middle of it with one finger while you clamp it down with the other hand.


I should say I initially had just a bit of CLU on the die, but then after giving it a week without using it, I added a little bit more to the layer - and ever since I seem to have been getting better temps.
So as justanoldman did and recommended - sometimes it depends on your application with the temps you'll get.
To tell you know of the temp difference - I'm talking about 10c improvement initially, and then that increased to a 24c improvement.

CLU application is the KEY to the temps. you need JUST the right amount, not too much, not too little.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> So I killed my chip!!!!
> 
> Seriously I did. Turns out that my chip had a solid piece of the HIS basically soldered to the PCB. I was able to cut around it without issues except for that one piece. I actually broke a razor on it trying to cut it. It was tiny, but as I wiggled it, I was able to get it off... but then came out the chunk of the PCB.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Never doing it again... and I went and bought a new one arleady. Good thing this one OC's bette than the other one. It's doing 4.6ghz at 1.23v


sorry to hear that - I don't get how it was soldered 0.0?


----------



## Derko1

I don't know. It was solid with the PCB... it was only on one corner at the edge.


----------



## MKHunt

Sorry to hear your loss Derko.

I just booted my system for the first time since the delid. Works perfectly.

I'd call it a 20C drop since it was between 80-84 before. It's almost like I'm back on Sandy....



And my loop isn't even completely bled yet. I can hear air bubbles shooting through the pump.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> So I killed my chip!!!!
> 
> Seriously I did. Turns out that my chip had a solid piece of the HIS basically soldered to the PCB. I was able to cut around it without issues except for that one piece. I actually broke a razor on it trying to cut it. It was tiny, but as I wiggled it, I was able to get it off... but then came out the chunk of the PCB.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Never doing it again... and I went and bought a new one arleady. Good thing this one OC's bette than the other one. It's doing 4.6ghz at 1.23v


What? It was soldered? What kind of chip was it?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> So I killed my chip!!!!
> 
> Seriously I did. Turns out that my chip had a solid piece of the HIS basically soldered to the PCB. I was able to cut around it without issues except for that one piece. I actually broke a razor on it trying to cut it. It was tiny, but as I wiggled it, I was able to get it off... but then came out the chunk of the PCB.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Never doing it again... and I went and bought a new one arleady. Good thing this one OC's bette than the other one. It's doing 4.6ghz at 1.23v


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> sorry to hear that - I don't get how it was soldered 0.0?


Ummm did you delid the chip in your sig rig? IE the i7-2600K? Because, um, that's a Sandy Bridge, not an Ivy Bridge. Notice that this is the "Official Delidded *Ivy Bridge* Club", nowhere is it mentioned of anyone delidding a Sandy Bridge. It is common knowledge that Intel went back to glue and TIM on the 22nm process. They soldered the Sandy family chips. I'm sorry for your loss...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> *Ummm did you delid the chip in your sig rig? IE the i7-2600K?* Because, um, that's a Sandy Bridge, not an Ivy Bridge. Notice that this is the "Official Delidded Ivy Bridge Club", nowhere is it mentioned of anyone delidding a Sandy Bridge. I'm sorry for your loss...


DOH!


----------



## Lobsterman

Belial will fix it, he knows about puters.


----------



## Derko1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Ummm did you delid the chip in your sig rig? IE the i7-2600K? Because, um, that's a Sandy Bridge, not an Ivy Bridge. Notice that this is the "Official Delidded *Ivy Bridge* Club", nowhere is it mentioned of anyone delidding a Sandy Bridge. It is common knowledge that Intel went back to glue and TIM on the 22nm process. They soldered the Sandy family chips. I'm sorry for your loss...


I just switched to a 3770k two days ago.









http://www.overclock.net/t/1366517/build-log-derko1s-800d-upgrade


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> I just switched to a 3770k two days ago.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1366517/build-log-derko1s-800d-upgrade


Phew, I was worried about ya! Well it sucks that it died but I've never heard of anything being soldered on an Ivy. Could you take some pictures for us?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> I just switched to a 3770k two days ago.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1366517/build-log-derko1s-800d-upgrade


We would like pics if you can. No one has every heard of an IVY chip with anything but black glue holding down the IHS to the PCB.

Edit: Not quick enough, Stickg1 beat me to it. Perils of getting older.


----------



## Derko1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Phew, I was worried about ya! Well it sucks that it died but I've never heard of anything being soldered on an Ivy. Could you take some pictures for us?


Yea sure. It wasn't exactly soldered. It was just REALLY stuck on the PCB.


----------



## lilchronic

youmu^^^ keep things like that to yourself.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Yea sure. It wasn't exactly soldered. It was just REALLY stuck on the PCB.


I think you didn't have enough patience man...all you needed was more time to go around the edged - what I think has happened:
You did all the corners, and some sides, but forgot one side - and thus that one side made it feel as if it was soldered on. No matter how hard you try it won't come off, unless you slice that glue.
Then via force, you lodged it on one side, and then damaged your PCB.

As others said, would like to see some nice pics of it - because I don't think you did the de-lidding right -> you seem to have unfortunately rushed it









PS. Sexy build bro
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Youmu*
> 
> Somehow, my RMA was approved on that 3570K I fudged up a few weeks ago. I'll consider myself lucky, I may try to delid again, but not until I have disposable income for a replacement this time.


you beast


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Yea sure. It wasn't exactly soldered. It was just REALLY stuck on the PCB.


sorry to here that







can we see pictures??
heres my pics of my first chip that i destroyed. my second chip was done perfectly









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## BradleyW

Sorry to hear that derko. Are you sure it was solder or strong adheasive?


----------



## justanoldman

My delidded 5.0. Not done yet, but coming along.
I guess with the Noctua colors, the red and black of the mobo, green on the gpu, and gold/white on the psu I am not going to win any beauty contests.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> My delidded 5.0. Not done yet, but coming along.
> I guess with the Noctua colors, the red and black of the mobo, green on the gpu, and gold/white on the psu I am not going to win any beauty contests.


you got the h220 bro!?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> you got the h220 bro!?


Two actually. They work fine. All my tests so far put it on par with the H100i as far as just cooling the CPU. The big test will be when I eventually add a rad and cool the gpu.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Two actually. They work fine. All my tests so far put it on par with the H100i as far as just cooling the CPU. The big test will be when I eventually add a rad and cool the gpu.


Interesting - no better temps than the H100i?
As for the fans, tried switching them, see what happens?


----------



## I_shot

Guys check these out,

http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f136/grosser-wlp-test-inkl-fluessigmetall-761920.html

http://www.radeon3d.org/forum/thread-2067.html

you know i used phobya all the time but don't have clp or clu for comparison.i'll post the results as soon as i get clu and clp. and if you can get phobya lm ,please post the comparison results.


----------



## Derko1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I think you didn't have enough patience man...all you needed was more time to go around the edged - what I think has happened:
> You did all the corners, and some sides, but forgot one side - and thus that one side made it feel as if it was soldered on. No matter how hard you try it won't come off, unless you slice that glue.
> Then via force, you lodged it on one side, and then damaged your PCB.


Nope. Took around 2 hours to do it. I sliced through the metal it self with the razor. I even broke one of the blades while doing it. Started with a second.

Another thing that happened, is that there was almost no glue actually there. It was extremely little. I am looking at my new chip and it's got way more than the one I messed up. It's thick looking, as opposed to mine not even being visible through the edge.

I sliced through a good bit of the HIS before cutting through.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Sorry to hear that derko. Are you sure it was solder or strong adheasive?


I am not sure. I'll post pics in a bit.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Interesting - no better temps than the H100i?
> As for the fans, tried switching them, see what happens?


The pump is much stronger so it can handle extra rads and gpus added to the loop. But in just stock configuration it only comes with one 240 rad, and the fin spacing is designed more for quiet than extreme performance. I also am doing tests with the fans set at 1350 rpm or so, and the cooling performance is very similar between the two whether I use stock fans or some NF-P12s I had lying around. I need to order some NF-F12s at some point and test again.

The stock fans of the H100i were too loud in my opinion, the stock H220 ones are not that bad. If you are never going to expand the loop I don't think the H220 is worth the price, and the H100i would do the job. If you want to cool your gpu, then the H220 could be the perfect product, but I won't know for a few weeks when I try to expand it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Nope. Took around 2 hours to do it. I sliced through the metal it self with the razor. I even broke one of the blades while doing it. Started with a second.
> 
> Another thing that happened, is that there was almost no glue actually there. It was extremely little. I am looking at my new chip and it's got way more than the one I messed up. It's thick looking, as opposed to mine not even being visible through the edge.
> 
> I sliced through a good bit of the HIS before cutting through.
> I am not sure. I'll post pics in a bit.


Very very odd - again sorry to hear about it brother!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> The pump is much stronger so it can handle extra rads and gpus added to the loop. But in just stock configuration it only comes with one 240 rad, and the fin spacing is designed more for quiet than extreme performance. I also am doing tests with the fans set at 1350 rpm or so, and the cooling performance is very similar between the two whether I use stock fans or some NF-P12s I had lying around. I need to order some NF-F12s at some point and test again.
> 
> The stock fans of the H100i were too loud in my opinion, the stock H220 ones are not that bad. If you are never going to expand the loop I don't think the H220 is worth the price, and the H100i would do the job. If you want to cool your gpu, then the H220 could be the perfect product, but I won't know for a few weeks when I try to expand it.


Great input +rep (you deserve to get more rep to be honest for all the help you've been providing through the forums)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Guys check these out,
> 
> http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f136/grosser-wlp-test-inkl-fluessigmetall-761920.html
> 
> http://www.radeon3d.org/forum/thread-2067.html
> 
> you know i used phobya all the time but don't have clp or clu for comparison.i'll post the results as soon as i get clu and clp. and if you can get phobya lm ,please post the comparison results.


Very interesting - although what is the composition of the paste?
As others have noted - CLU/P on the IHS has very little difference to other standard pastes out there (ie MX4/2) - but on the die...that's a whole different story.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Is it where it says alarm temperature in the settings? There is something right near there called alarm .exe I'm not sure what that is either.


Open CoreTemp and then select _Overheat Protection_ from the _Options_ menu.



Check the _Enable overheat protection_ checkbox, select _Activate at the specified temperature_ and enter the temperature you want the shutdown to occur at. Under _Shut down options_ make sure the _Enable_ checkbox is checked, and _Power down_ is selected. You can specify a delay after the temp is exceeded for the PC to shutdown.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Open CoreTemp and then select _Overheat Protection_ from the _Options_ menu.
> 
> 
> 
> Check the _Enable overheat protection_ checkbox, select _Activate at the specified temperature_ and enter the temperature you want the shutdown to occur at. Under _Shut down options_ make sure the _Enable_ checkbox is checked, and _Power down_ is selected. You can specify a delay after the temp is exceeded for the PC to shutdown.


I never knew it could do that - does core temp have to be running in order for it to shut down?
+rep to you sir!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Open CoreTemp and then select _Overheat Protection_ from the _Options_ menu.
> 
> 
> 
> Check the _Enable overheat protection_ checkbox, select _Activate at the specified temperature_ and enter the temperature you want the shutdown to occur at. Under _Shut down options_ make sure the _Enable_ checkbox is checked, and _Power down_ is selected. You can specify a delay after the temp is exceeded for the PC to shutdown.


Thanks for taking the time to do that! Ill set it when I go home. I'm always so scared to leave p95 running overnight just in case something goes wrong. Now I will be much more at ease.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Nope. Took around 2 hours to do it. I sliced through the metal it self with the razor. I even broke one of the blades while doing it. Started with a second.
> 
> Another thing that happened, is that there was almost no glue actually there. It was extremely little. I am looking at my new chip and it's got way more than the one I messed up. It's thick looking, as opposed to mine not even being visible through the edge.
> 
> I sliced through a good bit of the HIS before cutting through.
> I am not sure. I'll post pics in a bit.


No problem. Thank you again mate.


----------



## MegaHertz

I might soon own a IB and I might soon grow a pair!

Should I delidd straight out of the box?
How important is it to get the PCB completely clean of that glue? Will it decrease performance? Also did you guys find double edge razer or single edged razers better? I know double edge is thinner, bends, and is very very sharp


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MegaHertz*
> 
> I might soon own a IB and I might soon grow a pair!
> 
> Should I delidd straight out of the box?
> How important is it to get the PCB completely clean of that glue? Will it decrease performance? Also did you guys find double edge razer or single edged razers better? I know double edge is thinner, bends, and is very very sharp


I'd test out the CPU before delidding, You could get a crap chip and it would be pointless to delid. The cleaner the PCB and IHS are, they closer they will be, which would mean better temps overall. And I used a double edge razor


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MegaHertz*
> 
> I might soon own a IB and I might soon grow a pair!
> 
> Should I delidd straight out of the box? Is the possibility of RMA ruined?
> 
> How important is it to get the PCB completely clean of that glue? Will it decrease performance? Also did you guys find double edge razer or single edged razers better? I know double edge is thinner, bends, and is very very sharp


either razor is good. and once you delid you void warrenty.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Thanks for taking the time to do that! Ill set it when I go home. I'm always so scared to leave p95 running overnight just in case something goes wrong. Now I will be much more at ease.


No worries, happy to help. Even without coretemp your CPU will automatically start to throttle down if the temps hit 105C, and then shut off if the thermal overload protection limit is reached to prevent hardware damage. Coretemp allows windows to shutdown gracefully and at a predefined lower temperature rather than just having the BIOS immediately signal the PSU to power down.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I never knew it could do that - does core temp have to be running in order for it to shut down?
> +rep to you sir!


Thanks for the rep. Yes coretemp has to be running if you wish to use the software overheat protection feature, however the CPU already has in-built hardware thermal overload protection as I outlined above.


----------



## MegaHertz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> I'd test out the CPU before delidding, You could get a crap chip and it would be pointless to delid. The cleaner the PCB and IHS are, they closer they will be, which would mean better temps overall. And I used a double edge razor


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> either razor is good. and once you delid you void warrenty.


Understood







Even with a "crappy" CPU I still will have high temperatures and can't really return it right?(Depending on where I buy it from?)

Would it be easier to delidd from the box or after the glue/tim get heated up and "used" ?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MegaHertz*
> 
> I might soon own a IB and I might soon grow a pair!
> 
> Should I delidd straight out of the box? Is the possibility of RMA ruined?
> 
> How important is it to get the PCB completely clean of that glue? Will it decrease performance? Also did you guys find double edge razer or single edged razers better? I know double edge is thinner, bends, and is very very sharp


Absolutely you need to test the chip before delidding, many chips are not worth the trouble. Plus you need the data to join our super cool club.

Getting all the black glue off is a pain, but just take your time using an old credit card to get it off. It will come clean. In my opinion, a single edged razor blade made for shaving - not the kind made for utility or box cutting - works the best. Also a pair of rubber gloves makes it easier to handle without worry.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MegaHertz*
> 
> Understood
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even with a "crappy" CPU I still will have high temperatures and can't really return it right?(Depending on where I buy it from?)


My local store lets me return CPU's if I don't like them, but that's for other reasons. Most stores/online retailers won't let you. Once you delidded the chip, you can't return it either as It voids all warranty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MegaHertz*
> 
> Would it be easier to delidd from the box or after the glue/tim get heated up and "used" ?


Like I said, try the chip out first anyway to make sure everything is good. The heating up won't really do anything because by the time you take the heatsink off and take it out of the socket it will already have cooled down.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I can't wait to get my CLU in! With the mx4 my OC of 4.7ghz at 1.308v hits a max temp of 83c during a 14 hour run of p95" but is usually in the 70s. The CLU should open the door to a possible 5ghz OC. I think I get my wall at 4.8ghz because it requires a decent jump in voltage so I don't really want to go that high yet because I'm sure temps would max at the mid 90s and that is out of my comfort zone. Will definetly post some screenies with the differences in temps between using mx4 on the die and using CLU on the die if anyone is interested.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Getting all the black glue off is a pain, but just take your time using an old credit card to get it off. It will come clean. In my opinion, a single edged razor blade made for shaving - not the kind made for utility or box cutting - works the best. Also a pair of rubber gloves makes it easier to handle without worry.


I found doing the above plus applying some isopropyl alcohol to the PCB also helped to get the glue off.


----------



## Zeek

Tomorrow I might take my rig apart again and clean the PCB. I left some silicon on it because it was hard to take off and I didn't want to scratch anything


----------



## MegaHertz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> My local store lets me return CPU's if I don't like them, but that's for other reasons. Most stores/online retailers won't let you. Once you delidded the chip, you can't return it either as It voids all warranty
> Like I said, try the chip out first anyway to make sure everything is good. The heating up won't really do anything because by the time you take the heatsink off and take it out of the socket it will already have cooled down.


I understand







Knowing I will get some form of temperature decrease is already a fact. My basic curiosity is if a brand new chip with the silicone and tim unheated would be easier to remove.
Reason I ask is because I'm obviously clueless and I don't know if the silicone glue is already activated or when you use the CPU it goes from paste to melted cheese


----------



## TonicX

Yes I am interested! my Cool Lab Ultra should be here tomorrow(Monday March11) let us compare notes.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Yes I am interested! my Cool Lab Ultra should be here tomorrow(Monday March11) let us compare notes.


Alright! Nice World Industries avatar btw


----------



## Joa3d43

*...the joys of deliddedness.*..









...as tricky as delidding can be, it certainly has its upsides...when I was first sent to this thread by PCWargamer, I thought these folks are 'nuts'...better get a *chastity belt* for my CPU socket before I do something stupid - like take a razor blade to a perfectly good CPU that ran fast at low 'v' @ 5GHz plus...

...well, I did something stupid, and there was also blood, a few scratches and divine intervention







What it did was to unleash a whole new performance envelope because now I could deal with temps when doing extensive, longer bench runs...a few more investments (ROG Maximums V Extreme, custom water loop etc) enabled more performance - but by far the biggest 'enabler for the results below' was the delidding...so *thanks Valgaur* for running a nice thread with great info which really helped get me there...









...joined HWBot just two days ago, and yet got well over 20 world records in the enthusiast class for my video setup, though some extended beyond that...most of the time, my scores are smack in the middle of overclocked 680ies and 7970ies - and thanks to delidding, I can now compete against 3930ies 6 core / 12 thread machines running @ 5 GHz.









The best part is that in those two days, I got *over a 100 points* for the *Overclock.net team* at HWbot ...a few more runs left for tomorrow - and this system is not yet fully maxed as I have to lap and straighten out a slightly crooked IHS, not to mention one of the 4 GPUs which really should be RMA'ed because of power leakage and does not perform well at all...










...so if you are considering delidding, carefully study the process, cost and benefits - and ENJOY the outcome (hopefully)...either way, best of luck


----------



## Belial

My [email protected]+.285v offset (1.488v, 1.5 on DMM), Turbo LLC, with RAM oc (2400 8-12-8-28 with very tigh secondary/tertiary) lasted for 15 hours in p95 (i think i acidentally cut the power, not that it failed)

Have any of you guys played changed your PLL, VTT, or IMC voltages?

I set PLL to 1.5 and i think it caused WHEA errors (wow, i did not realize that kernel-WHEA and whea-logger errors in events log were signs of instability, that probably means a bunch of 24 hour prime95 stable overclocks ive done and others have done werent really stable we just didnt realize there were errors lol) so I changed it to 1.6 and seems okay.

Right now I'm trying to add reduced VTT/IMC voltages to the mix, it seems by reducing both from stock by .05v, from 1.05/.925 to 1.00/.875 has helped with temps a few degrees, and .985/.860 wasn't stable.

Just curious what others have done with their other voltages, what they normally get and such.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Pll should be at 1.8 normally the lower you go could cause instability


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Tomorrow I might take my rig apart again and clean the PCB. I left some silicon on it because it was hard to take off and I didn't want to scratch anything


I'm also going to clean up my silicon a little more before applying the CLU. I was also scared because I didn't want to scratch anything haha


----------



## justanoldman

Using an old credit card to "scrape" the glue off works well. You just go slow and get the edge of the card to catch a little of the glue as you slide it and it will come off. You don't have to worry about hurting anything if you are being careful. There will usually still be a stain from the glue there, but the credit card will be able to remove any residue you can feel on the pcb.

It is one of those things that takes longer than it should, but the glue will pretty much all come off the pcb and IHS. I put the edge of the pcb on a clean piece of paper on my table, and kept the chip somewhat vertical. That way I could scrape the glue off without having to push down on the pcb and have to worry about the back side of it.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Pll should be at 1.8 normally the lower you go could cause instability


That has got to be the worst post I've ever seen on OCN. I know I'm an idiot but I have a faint clue of what I'm doing here, yes, I'm aware lower voltages may cause stability. You did read my post right, where I said I was running 24+ hours of prime95, and that 1.6v lasted over 15 hours just fine?

Most guides recommend lowering PLL for temps, btw. They just don't say what to lower it to, what most people set it to, etc. There's a million posts and tables and data on what vcore you should expect for X frequency, but nothing on PLL, VTT, or IMC voltages.
Quote:


> You don't have to worry about hurting anything if you are being careful.


The die is metal, it's not fragile by any means. You need to use sandpaper to get through it, and there are people who even lap their dies. The die you see is just another integrated heatspreader, actually. There's no scratching you can do unless you use something very metal or hard, but towels, fingernails, plastic, isn't going to scratch anything and you dont even have to be careful!

Lots of alcohol and paper towel, napkins, coffee filter, ez to come off.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> My [email protected]+.285v offset (1.488v, 1.5 on DMM), Turbo LLC, with RAM oc (2400 8-12-8-28 with very tigh secondary/tertiary) lasted for 15 hours in p95 (i think i acidentally cut the power, not that it failed)
> 
> Have any of you guys played changed your PLL, VTT, or IMC voltages?
> 
> I set PLL to 1.5 and i think it caused WHEA errors (wow, i did not realize that kernel-WHEA and whea-logger errors in events log were signs of instability, that probably means a bunch of 24 hour prime95 stable overclocks ive done and others have done werent really stable we just didnt realize there were errors lol) so I changed it to 1.6 and seems okay.
> 
> Right now I'm trying to add reduced VTT/IMC voltages to the mix, it seems by reducing both from stock by .05v, from 1.05/.925 to 1.00/.875 has helped with temps a few degrees, and .985/.860 wasn't stable.
> 
> Just curious what others have done with their other voltages, what they normally get and such.


I'd stick with default pll voltage, in my experience it did nothing but cause instability and WHEA errors.
If anything you need to up some voltages like imc a few notches and maybe vtt too.
Don't go overboard, just give them a healthy boost, cause you're pushing a heavy ram oc there. No need to get "better" temps with a delidded chip. It won't make a difference temp wise...If you were to freeze the chip, then THAT would definitely make a difference allowing you to run much lower vcore and imc/vtt.
EDIT: Refer to Sin's chart showing safe vtt and imc voltages on air. That's more dangerous stuff than vcore is, you'll instantly degrade your memory controller or whack your chip if you push too hard on them.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> That has got to be the worst post I've ever seen on OCN. I know I'm an idiot but I have a faint clue of what I'm doing here, yes, I'm aware lower voltages may cause stability. You did read my post right, where I said I was running 24+ hours of prime95, and that 1.6v lasted over 15 hours just fine?
> 
> Most guides recommend lowering PLL for temps, btw. They just don't say what to lower it to, what most people set it to, etc. There's a million posts and tables and data on what vcore you should expect for X frequency, but nothing on PLL, VTT, or IMC voltages.
> The die is metal, it's not fragile by any means. You need to use sandpaper to get through it, and there are people who even lap their dies. The die you see is just another integrated heatspreader, actually. There's no scratching you can do unless you use something very metal or hard, but towels, fingernails, plastic, isn't going to scratch anything and you dont even have to be careful!
> 
> Lots of alcohol and paper towel, napkins, coffee filter, ez to come off.


Belial, you're kinda moody today, aren't ya? Don't jump on the guy like that, he was kinda brief that's all but I agree with his suggestion.
And the die is not metal, it's silicon, like some kind of glass type thing with a clear smooth mirrorlike finish at the top, definitely not metal.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> I'd stick with default pll voltage, in my experience it did nothing but cause instability and WHEA errors.
> If anything you need to up some voltages like imc a few notches and maybe vtt too.
> Don't go overboard, just give them a healthy boost, cause you're pushing a heavy ram oc there. No need to get "better" temps with a delidded chip. It won't make a difference temp wise...If you were to freeze the chip, then THAT would definitely make a difference allowing you to run much lower vcore and imc/vtt.
> EDIT: Refer to Sin's chart showing safe vtt and imc voltages on air. That's more dangerous stuff than vcore is, you'll instantly degrade your memory controller or whack your chip if you push too hard on them.


My RAM oc (2400, cl8-12-8-28 tight second and thirds) was 24 hours stable at the stock vtt/imc. From what I've seen it's more like 2600+ that really needs a bump in those voltages, although I've definitely heard 2400 needing it but I think 2400 is right on the limit. Maybe my imc is as good as you say it is, right ^^

Now it's a matter of getting my CPU stable, and I've been running all cpu tests with that ram oc (which i let run for 30 hours prime95, no problem once i set the dram references to auto and didn't try to push my thirds further than what they default to at 1333, which already is much tighter than their defaults at 2400).

I'm pretty sure +.285v offset = 1.488v is 24 hour prime95 stable but at ~15th hour my pc shutdown. I think it was because my hwinfo 96*C max temp shutdown kicked in, around that time my oven had filled the apartment with smoke when it was opened and the grill i had out front the door blew everything into the house when i moved some charcoal around and suddenly created a blaze of heat. I think that hot air might have gotten sucked in by the 10 fans on my system and got it a little hot lol. I mean I'm not sure why it shutdown, almost all resets and such when overclocking and unstable has always resulted in a reset, not a hard shutdown, so thats why i think it was the temps.

Which is why I'm trying to get my temps a bit lower. Now I'm pretty sure even in summer it wont get that hot and once im done with this stress testing I wont be within 20*C of my max temp on small fft so I'm not worried about the temps being bad, but I mean if I'm going for a _perfect perfect_ overclock, then all my voltages should be as low as possible (as in .28 causes whea errors) while clocks should be as high as possible, and that's what I'm going for.

I've seen Sin's chart and guide, he clearly gives maxes and such, but he does not give minimums and he does say to reduce PLL voltage and 'if necessary' reduce vtt/imc (it's not necessary but why not, right?).

But really, what IS your experience with PLL? What happened? Becuase I'm not getting WHEA errors even after 12+ hours of prime95 on 1.6v PLL. Then again I've heard a few people mention that PLL is more tied with sleep, idle stability, not load stability.
Quote:


> Belial, you're kinda moody today, aren't ya? Don't jump on the guy like that, he was kinda brief that's all but I agree with his suggestion.
> And the die is not metal, it's silicon, like some kind of glass type thing with a clear smooth mirrorlike finish at the top, definitely not metal.


I've read a few reports of people who've messed with PLL that they've gone as low as 1.5v, but i think that's for around the 4.5ghz range and that higher up you need a bit more pll, and i think i read one guy was running like 1.2pll or something 'insane' like that (insane but i have no frame of reference here what people usually set PLL) it still isn't clear to me, like.... are 'good' chips able to run like 1.5, 1.4v pll? What if my chip is a 'bad' chip, should I run pll more like 1.7, 1.8/stock? Some guy even mentioned that he wasnt able to overclock past like 4.5 until he reduced his PLL drastically, at which point he was able to hit like a way higher overclock (sorry for vagueries, but i believe the guy heads one of the clubs around here.... forgot which club i saw it in, the asrock club maybe?).

I dont think i've ever heard anyone raise their PLL voltage from stock though except in extreme LN2 stuff, and it's more in regards to bclk tuning.

which brings me to the question, does anyone here mess with bclk for 24/7 overclock? I heard one guy here recently said he got 5ghz much easier by using bclk + multi instead of multi alone, which goes in contrast with sin saying dont ever touch bclk, it degrades gpu ssd everything, omg it's so dangerous (but does he mean like for ln2, 105+, or is he also talking about just 101 bclk, etc?).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> My RAM oc (2400, cl8-12-8-28 tight second and thirds) was 24 hours stable at the stock vtt/imc. From what I've seen it's more like 2600+ that really needs a bump in those voltages, although I've definitely heard 2400 needing it but I think 2400 is right on the limit. Maybe my imc is as good as you say it is, right ^^
> 
> Now it's a matter of getting my CPU stable, and I've been running all cpu tests with that ram oc (which i let run for 30 hours prime95, no problem once i set the dram references to auto and didn't try to push my thirds further than what they default to at 1333, which already is much tighter than their defaults at 2400).
> 
> I'm pretty sure +.285v offset = 1.488v is 24 hour prime95 stable but at ~15th hour my pc shutdown. I think it was because my hwinfo 96*C max temp shutdown kicked in, around that time my oven had filled the apartment with smoke when it was opened and the grill i had out front the door blew everything into the house when i moved some charcoal around and suddenly created a blaze of heat. I think that hot air might have gotten sucked in by the 10 fans on my system and got it a little hot lol. I mean I'm not sure why it shutdown, almost all resets and such when overclocking and unstable has always resulted in a reset, not a hard shutdown, so thats why i think it was the temps.
> 
> Which is why I'm trying to get my temps a bit lower. Now I'm pretty sure even in summer it wont get that hot and once im done with this stress testing I wont be within 20*C of my max temp on small fft so I'm not worried about the temps being bad, but I mean if I'm going for a _perfect perfect_ overclock, then all my voltages should be as low as possible (as in .28 causes whea errors) while clocks should be as high as possible, and that's what I'm going for.
> 
> I've seen Sin's chart and guide, he clearly gives maxes and such, but he does not give minimums and he does say to reduce PLL voltage and 'if necessary' reduce vtt/imc (it's not necessary but why not, right?).
> 
> But really, what IS your experience with PLL? What happened? Becuase I'm not getting WHEA errors even after 12+ hours of prime95 on 1.6v PLL. Then again I've heard a few people mention that PLL is more tied with sleep, idle stability, not load stability.
> I've read a few reports of people who've messed with PLL that they've gone as low as 1.5v, but i think that's for around the 4.5ghz range and that higher up you need a bit more pll, and i think i read one guy was running like 1.2pll or something 'insane' like that (insane but i have no frame of reference here what people usually set PLL) it still isn't clear to me, like.... are 'good' chips able to run like 1.5, 1.4v pll? What if my chip is a 'bad' chip, should I run pll more like 1.7, 1.8/stock? Some guy even mentioned that he wasnt able to overclock past like 4.5 until he reduced his PLL drastically, at which point he was able to hit like a way higher overclock (sorry for vagueries, but i believe the guy heads one of the clubs around here.... forgot which club i saw it in, the asrock club maybe?).
> 
> I dont think i've ever heard anyone raise their PLL voltage from stock though except in extreme LN2 stuff, and it's more in regards to bclk tuning.
> 
> which brings me to the question, does anyone here mess with bclk for 24/7 overclock? I heard one guy here recently said he got 5ghz much easier by using bclk + multi instead of multi alone, which goes in contrast with sin saying dont ever touch bclk, it degrades gpu ssd everything, omg it's so dangerous (but does he mean like for ln2, 105+, or is he also talking about just 101 bclk, etc?).


Forget bclk, no point in messing with it for 24/7 oc's really.
Second, pll overvoltage is not pll voltage. Internal pll overvoltage enabled messes with sleep but gives greater stability at higher than 4.6ghz oc's, so you NEED to have that enabled instead of auto in the bios.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...the joys of deliddedness.*..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ...as tricky as delidding can be, it certainly has its upsides...when I was first sent to this thread by PCWargamer, I thought these folks are 'nuts'...better get a *chastity belt* for my CPU socket before I do something stupid - like take a razor blade to a perfectly good CPU that ran fast at low 'v' @ 5GHz plus...
> 
> ...well, I did something stupid, and there was also blood, a few scratches and divine intervention
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What it did was to unleash a whole new performance envelope because now I could deal with temps when doing extensive, longer bench runs...a few more investments (ROG Maximums V Extreme, custom water loop etc) enabled more performance - but by far the biggest 'enabler for the results below' was the delidding...so *thanks Valgaur* for running a nice thread with great info which really helped get me there...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...joined HWBot just two days ago, and yet got well over 20 world records in the enthusiast class for my video setup, though some extended beyond that...most of the time, my scores are smack in the middle of overclocked 680ies and 7970ies - and thanks to delidding, I can now compete against 3930ies 6 core / 12 thread machines running @ 5 GHz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The best part is that in those two days, I got *over a 100 points* for the *Overclock.net team* at HWbot ...a few more runs left for tomorrow - and this system is not yet fully maxed as I have to lap and straighten out a slightly crooked IHS, not to mention one of the 4 GPUs which really should be RMA'ed because of power leakage and does not perform well at all...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...so if you are considering delidding, carefully study the process, cost and benefits - and ENJOY the outcome (hopefully)...either way, best of luck


Thanks, you've knocked my down a rung on some of the GTX670 benchmark tables


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Forget bclk, no point in messing with it for 24/7 oc's really.
> Second, pll overvoltage is not pll voltage. Internal pll overvoltage enabled messes with sleep but gives greater stability at higher than 4.6ghz oc's, so you NEED to have that enabled instead of auto in the bios.


Why would there not be a point in messing with bclk? The point is always for a higher and higher overclock, no? I mean I just dont understand what or if there are dangers with a low bclk of like 101, 102, and, why can't you run like 110+ if your board is good enough to do so. I'd much rather have 5010mhz speed than 5000.

Yes, I know about pll overvoltage, I'm definitely not confusing the two, and I do have pll overvoltage enabled. i know they are two totally separate things. or there is some connection but yea practically they are entirely different.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Why would there not be a point in messing with bclk? The point is always for a higher and higher overclock, no? I mean I just dont understand what or if there are dangers with a low bclk of like 101, 102, and, why can't you run like 110+ if your board is good enough to do so. I'd much rather have 5010mhz speed than 5000.
> 
> Yes, I know about pll overvoltage, I'm definitely not confusing the two, and I do have pll overvoltage enabled. i know they are two totally separate things. or there is some connection but yea practically they are entirely different.


No connection other than the name...

" [email protected] ASUS Community Support, 1.9 Years

Status: [email protected] is online now
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mambobuzzz View Post
Sorry, didn't understand that much. With 1.5v for CPU PLL everything runs smooth, burning programms run without any errors. I just thought lower is better like for vcore...
Should I raise it to it's default ?

May I ask a little off topic question ? On P8Z68-V Pro what's the difference between the red and black USB 2.0 ports ? They are all connected to Intel controller right ? Is there any technical difference ?
You should use PLL at default on this architecture - the clocking limitations of this architecture are very bound to the right PLL voltage level (hence the internal PLL OV option working the way it does). I think the reason you are having to offset the DQ and CMD refs is to compensate for any timing mismatch caused in the clock distribution network within the CPU due to a low PLL voltage.

So yes, try default of 1.8V for PLL and see if you still need DQ and CMD ref offset for S3 resume.

-Raja " Source

Straight from Asus, fix pll at 1.8v and forget it









And, fsb 110mhz is only possible with cpu running below -50c so no go. Trust me, you don't wanna run into stupid risks with little to no benefit for your goals.
Now if you are benching, running 3dm11 or 3dm05 or Aquamark, then by all means go for the absolute max oc in every aspect.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Thanks, you've knocked my down a rung on some of the GTX670 benchmark tables


...OOOps - didn't even know you were in there...nothing personal







....in most of these I was going up against a few guys with clocked-up 3930Ks / 3960Xs from the US and Europe. What I found particularly amusing is that I seem to be the only guy at HWbot who ran and submitted a quad-SLI Firestrike Extreme overall (independent of the card make)...everybody else knew better







...that bench needs some serious re-writing for tri-SLI and Quad-SLI

...thinking of switching either to Titan's or s.th. like it...also looking at memory benches (which I have never run before).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good to see you enjoying the sport Joa...have fun with ram!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> My RAM oc (2400, cl8-12-8-28 tight second and thirds) was 24 hours stable at the stock vtt/imc. From what I've seen it's more like 2600+ that really needs a bump in those voltages, although I've definitely heard 2400 needing it but I think 2400 is right on the limit. Maybe my imc is as good as you say it is, right ^^
> 
> Now it's a matter of getting my CPU stable, and I've been running all cpu tests with that ram oc (which i let run for 30 hours prime95, no problem once i set the dram references to auto and didn't try to push my thirds further than what they default to at 1333, which already is much tighter than their defaults at 2400).
> 
> I'm pretty sure +.285v offset = 1.488v is 24 hour prime95 stable but at ~15th hour my pc shutdown. I think it was because my hwinfo 96*C max temp shutdown kicked in, around that time my oven had filled the apartment with smoke when it was opened and the grill i had out front the door blew everything into the house when i moved some charcoal around and suddenly created a blaze of heat. I think that hot air might have gotten sucked in by the 10 fans on my system and got it a little hot lol. I mean I'm not sure why it shutdown, almost all resets and such when overclocking and unstable has always resulted in a reset, not a hard shutdown, so thats why i think it was the temps.
> 
> Which is why I'm trying to get my temps a bit lower. Now I'm pretty sure even in summer it wont get that hot and once im done with this stress testing I wont be within 20*C of my max temp on small fft so I'm not worried about the temps being bad, but I mean if I'm going for a _perfect perfect_ overclock, then all my voltages should be as low as possible (as in .28 causes whea errors) while clocks should be as high as possible, and that's what I'm going for.
> 
> I've seen Sin's chart and guide, he clearly gives maxes and such, but he does not give minimums and he does say to reduce PLL voltage and 'if necessary' reduce vtt/imc (it's not necessary but why not, right?).
> 
> But really, what IS your experience with PLL? What happened? Becuase I'm not getting WHEA errors even after 12+ hours of prime95 on 1.6v PLL. Then again I've heard a few people mention that PLL is more tied with sleep, idle stability, not load stability.
> I've read a few reports of people who've messed with PLL that they've gone as low as 1.5v, but i think that's for around the 4.5ghz range and that higher up you need a bit more pll, and i think i read one guy was running like 1.2pll or something 'insane' like that (insane but i have no frame of reference here what people usually set PLL) it still isn't clear to me, like.... are 'good' chips able to run like 1.5, 1.4v pll? What if my chip is a 'bad' chip, should I run pll more like 1.7, 1.8/stock? Some guy even mentioned that he wasnt able to overclock past like 4.5 until he reduced his PLL drastically, at which point he was able to hit like a way higher overclock (sorry for vagueries, but i believe the guy heads one of the clubs around here.... forgot which club i saw it in, the asrock club maybe?).
> 
> I dont think i've ever heard anyone raise their PLL voltage from stock though except in extreme LN2 stuff, and it's more in regards to bclk tuning.
> 
> which brings me to the question, does anyone here mess with bclk for 24/7 overclock? I heard one guy here recently said he got 5ghz much easier by using bclk + multi instead of multi alone, which goes in contrast with sin saying dont ever touch bclk, it degrades gpu ssd everything, omg it's so dangerous (but does he mean like for ln2, 105+, or is he also talking about just 101 bclk, etc?).


I've played with lowering cpu pll but saw no no point in it, didn't make anything more stable, didn't make a difference for temps, didn't seem top make a difference to anything. I pretty much just leave it alone except for ln2, where I do play with raised pll voltage a bit.

For bclk I do play with it a fair amount, although mostly for sub-zero temps where raising the bclk raises the temperature the cpu cold boot bugs. I have stability tested up to 110 bclk but at the time it was running 24/7 at -100° so needed at least 105 bclk to even POST, & it wasn't a setup I planned to run for more than a week or so.
Other than that bclk is mostly for fine tuning memory & benchmarking when air & water cooled, I have used bclk higher than stock on pretty much every cpu I've had in the last few years & have yet to damage any hardware with the increased pci-e frequency. At the worst I've just corrupted my OS when trying too high.
For 24/7 it don't think it would hurt to up the bclk a bit, I completely understand wanting those extra mhz, but I change my OC when I want more & change it back for just web browsing. Bios profiles are handy that way.
It can be easier to get a higher clock with bclk + multi, when at the point where the next multi needs too big a voltage bump to get to desktop, but that is generally around a point that is too much for 24/7 stable.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good to see you enjoying the sport Joa...have fun with ram!


...thanks IvanL...it is a lot of fun...trying to understand tertiary timing because a very experienced OCer' told me that with Asus boards, there is some extra speed to be had in tertiaries...I just hate crashing this baby as it has 32GB of RAM that also includes a Ramdisk and several instances of SQL Enterprise....booting back up can take a while







, and I haven't mounted the Intel SSD as boot drive yet...figure it is better to do that after the benches


----------



## snowfree52

Hello,

at 1,45V for 4,8Ghz my temps are around 80°C after 8h OCCT

Do you guys think I would benefit from delidding my 3770K ?

I'm only using the EK thermal paste that was provided with my EK waterblock

Thanks


----------



## solar0987

I was bored the other day and I delidded my 3570k i used the mx-4 i had got 5c lower temps but they were already low.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *solar0987*
> 
> I was bored the other day and I delidded my 3570k i used the mx-4 i had got 5c lower temps but they were already low.


Use CLP/U and get another 10-15ºc Drop on top of that


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> My [email protected]+.285v offset (1.488v, 1.5 on DMM), Turbo LLC, with RAM oc (2400 8-12-8-28 with very tigh secondary/tertiary) lasted for 15 hours in p95 (i think i acidentally cut the power, not that it failed)
> 
> Have any of you guys played changed your PLL, VTT, or IMC voltages?
> 
> I set PLL to 1.5 and i think it caused WHEA errors (wow, i did not realize that kernel-WHEA and whea-logger errors in events log were signs of instability, that probably means a bunch of 24 hour prime95 stable overclocks ive done and others have done werent really stable we just didnt realize there were errors lol) so I changed it to 1.6 and seems okay.
> 
> Right now I'm trying to add reduced VTT/IMC voltages to the mix, it seems by reducing both from stock by .05v, from 1.05/.925 to 1.00/.875 has helped with temps a few degrees, and .985/.860 wasn't stable.
> 
> Just curious what others have done with their other voltages, what they normally get and such.


I leave my PLL at 1.8v, after testing it at different values I saw that it did nothing for me. Going below 1.6v seemed to cause instability.

VTT and VCCSA I have played with a bit too trying to get my RAM stable. My crucial kit is good for 2200MHz CL10, nothing crazy but for a $50 8GB kit of RAM I'll take it. Anyway I run those voltages in the 1.1-1.2v range and it allowed me to lower some of my sub-timings a hair.

Oh and don't snap at people like that. You're new here too, as am I, as is TD. We all talk out of our backside sometimes but it doesn't mean you need to be a pain about it.

And TD did have a valid point, in the majority of cases adjusting the PLL voltage doesn't do anything. Just because his post wasn't the length of a novel doesn't mean it was a bad post.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm not wrong in saying I've seen people unstable at a lower than 1.8 pll and having overvoltage disabled.
Simple as that: keep it at 1.8 unless you like fiddling with things. You ought to watch your manner Belial.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm not wrong in saying I've seen people unstable at a lower than 1.8 pll and having overvoltage disabled.
> Simple as that: keep it at 1.8 unless you like fiddling with things. You ought to watch your manner Belial.


Dude how do you like the Fractal R4? Is it awesome or is it really fkin awesome??

I'm trying to get one off a guy in the classifieds section. It looks business sexy. Like its a mature grown-mans case with a little bit of badass.

I'm really over my Rosewill Blackhawk, it looked awesome on Newegg, but I'm sick of it. Going to slide it on down to Danny's computer (my 7 year old), because he thinks this Rosewill with the NZXT fan controller is bad as hell.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Beautiful case indeed bro. It is quite big and very heavy though.
I would recommend the case, but I had qc problems with my first r4 and then the hdd tray making noise throughout the case.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Hello,
> 
> at 1,45V for 4,8Ghz my temps are around 80°C after 8h OCCT
> 
> Do you guys think I would benefit from delidding my 3770K ?
> 
> I'm only using the EK thermal paste that was provided with my EK waterblock
> 
> Thanks


Sure, if you want to run 4.8ghz 1.45v at 60-65c ^^

You are limited by voltage you are willing to go to, so there's not much if anything to gain by running lower load temps, in terms of performance.

Longevity, maybe, but i dont think that's even really a factor


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Benefits of delidding in my eyes:
-Lower temperatures
-High achievable OC with lower temps
-If the OC is kept the same, lower noise (as your fans have to work less hard to cool your CPU/case)

Cons:
-Possibility of damaging your PCB
-Shorting your CPU
-Bending socket pins on your motherboard
-Voiding your warranty
-Costs of buying CLU (additional thermal paste)


----------



## kesawi

I think I'm going to stop messing around trying to find a higher stable overclock for a while and just enjoy myself by playing some games in silence with my cooler CPU.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> I think I'm going to stop messing around trying to find a higher stable overclock for a while and just enjoy myself by playing some games in silence with my cooler CPU.


Yeah I was thinking with my 68c max .... I could potentially hit 5ghz? but what's the point? Might do it during the holidays for fun - to see how hard I can push the chip.
I'm at 4.5ghz 1.27v manual / +0.07 offset - max temp 68c under full load after 8hrs+ folding Realistically gaming I wouldn't hit over 50c lol.


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Yeah I was thinking with my 68c max .... I could potentially hit 5ghz? but what's the point? Might do it during the holidays for fun - to see how hard I can push the chip.
> I'm at 4.5ghz 1.27v manual / +0.07 offset - max temp 68c under full load after 8hrs+ folding Realistically gaming I wouldn't hit over 50c lol.


My chip for instance does 4.5GHz with 1.18v (24h prime stable max temp 53º c) but i cant get it stable at 5GHz even with 1.45v, not all chips can hit those frequencies and be stable though i can benchmark at 5.1GHz


----------



## Totally Dubbed

That's very true. Last time I tried 4.8 I had to get to over 1.4v


----------



## [CyGnus]

Lets be realistic what is the difference in gaming at 4.5 or 5GHz maybe 2/3fps?
For some ppl more is always better (and in this case it is) for others (like me) i rather run the chip at 4.5GHz with 1.18v keep the power bill down temps down fans down have almost a silent PC and enjoy the system


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Lets be realistic what is the difference in gaming at 4.5 or 5GHz maybe 2/3fps?
> For some ppl more is always better (and in this case it is) for others (like me) i rather run the chip at 4.5GHz with 1.18v keep the power bill down temps down fans down have almost a silent PC and enjoy the system


Absolutely just wanted to see hwo it could do - my 4.5ghz is more than enough for EVERYTHING I do







even stock 3.5ghz is fine to be honest -> although I do notice the difference in rendering videos.


----------



## Belial

^ Generally it's about 1-2fps for 100mhz, but with intel and these ivy bridges I think you'll likely see about 2-5fps per 100mhz. On cpu intensive games though. And what's more important is your minimum fps, not your average or max fps (which are more GPU related). CPU basically determines how bad your fps gets during some insane 64 man or 200vs200army situation, and how smooth the game is on that critical moment in the biggest part of the game. Obviously, this is a bigger deal in cpu intensive games like 64 mans or starcraft, but minimum fps being cpu related exists for all games.

The real difference comes if you stream though. If you stream your gameplay - and there's no reason not to if you got the power, just stream every game you have, make it private if you dont want people to watch and just have cool videos on storage online - overclocking makes a huge difference.

Depends on what you do (streaming, cpu intensive game) but 500mhz is a huge deal and definitely very noticeable in some spots. I mean that can very simply be the difference in 20 minimumfps like every other i7 overclocked gets on 4vs4 team RTS and 25-30fps which means you can play smoothly.

I mean my athlon was enough for my needs (it definitely needed to be unlocked and overclocked though, and while it was smooth enough it was definitely at 90%+ utilization the entire time, i could only do 45 fps not 60fps which is still a great stream and it looked better than most pro streams with i7s because I used the correct settings) but my i7 is definitely way smoother. I'll likely be posting tests later on comparing results (ht on, off, the difference in 5ghz vs 4.9ghz, 2400mhz ram vs 1600mhz, etc).


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Lets be realistic what is the difference in gaming at 4.5 or 5GHz maybe 2/3fps?
> For some ppl more is always better (and in this case it is) for others (like me) i rather run the chip at 4.5GHz with 1.18v keep the power bill down temps down fans down have almost a silent PC and enjoy the system


The difference in your power bill between 1.2V and 1.5V is less than 5$ per year.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yea I've been playing a ton of Crysis 3 and with my failed delidded 3570k I was having a little trouble with the frames (nothing horrible or stuttery since I run two overclocked 7950's in x-fire), but it was hitting the low 40's sometimes when in outside environments and that bothers me. Now with the delidded 3770k I started the game over and everything is a lot smoother. Right when I got to that first outside environment I was nervous, but the game didn't even stutter with the transition and it stayed steady at 60fps. Its awesome to be able to run a game like that with maxed out graphic settings and 4x MSAA. Its really a work of art. Very happy with it! Very happy with everyone in this club! Very happy I killed my last chip!


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Sure, if you want to run 4.8ghz 1.45v at 60-65c ^^
> 
> You are limited by voltage you are willing to go to, so there's not much if anything to gain by running lower load temps, in terms of performance.
> 
> Longevity, maybe, but i dont think that's even really a factor


I mean, Are my temps high or low for this OC with this voltage ? if they are high I may benefit from delidding the CPU

If they are low and the gain is about 2-3° I won't bother


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Hello,
> 
> at 1,45V for 4,8Ghz my temps are around 80°C after 8h OCCT
> 
> Do you guys think I would benefit from delidding my 3770K ?
> 
> I'm only using the EK thermal paste that was provided with my EK waterblock
> 
> Thanks


1.45v is not a low voltage. I don't use OCCT much, but if you are saying that is your max core temp hit while doing any stress testing, including prime or ibt, then those are definitely good temps. You have a custom water setup so I would expect better temps than others.

There are two good reasons to delid. If you want to keep your current multiplier but lower your temps, or if you want to increase your multiplier but temps (not voltage) are getting in the way.

If you delid to get your temps down 10 to 20c and stay at 4.8 is that what you want? If you delid and want 5.0 but that takes more than 1.55v are you really comfortable with that much voltage 24/7?

Your setup is not a clear cut case, your temps are good, but your chip is a little voltage hungry. It depends on what you want, but I would say it is probably not worth the risk.


----------



## snowfree52

I see what you mean, I'm on the low side of the temps but I'm almost at the max on the voltage side,
Therefore I can't go much further on the OC even if I lose some degrees.

At the end it's just about my satisfaction having lower temps, am I correct ?

I am stable at 4,6Ghz @ 1,3V with temps around 60-65 °C maybe I should keep it like that ?

I still have the EK indigo extreme to test, I hope I can lower my temps with it


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I see what you mean, I'm on the low side of the temps but I'm almost at the max on the voltage side,
> Therefore I can't go much further on the OC even if I lose some degrees.
> 
> At the end it's just about my satisfaction having lower temps, am I correct ?
> 
> I am stable at 4,6Ghz @ 1,3V with temps around 60-65 °C maybe I should keep it like that ?
> 
> I still have the EK indigo extreme to test, I hope I can lower my temps with it


You are correct.
Those temps, 60-65c, are max stress testing core temps, or everyday use/gaming temps?
Testing different TIMs, how much you use, and your exact cooler installation method can lead to at least a several degree drop when optimized. It takes time to test, but when you find the optimal TIM, amount, and cooler installation the results are usually worth it.


----------



## snowfree52

yes these are during OCCT temps, not everyday use.

can't go wrong with indigo extreme, you have to put all of it !


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> yes these are during OCCT temps, not everyday use.
> 
> can't go wrong with indigo extreme, you have to put all of it !


I wish we new for sure what combination of temps and voltage made Ivy safe from any measurable degradation, but we don't. From what I have read, I think we are ok if you keep the voltage below 1.45v and everyday temps below the 60-65c range. There are some people who think nothing of 1.5v+ 24/7 and others who are paranoid of going over 1.35v.

It is up to each person how much risk they will take. Compared to the cost of a couple Titans that many on this site are buying, I guess having to replace an Ivy chip from degradation seems cheap.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Hello,
> 
> at 1,45V for 4,8Ghz my temps are around 80°C after 8h OCCT
> 
> Do you guys think I would benefit from delidding my 3770K ?
> 
> I'm only using the EK thermal paste that was provided with my EK waterblock
> 
> Thanks


1,45v for 4.8 sounds a bit high, mid-to-high 1.3ies would be better as guarantor to reach e.g. 5 GHz. Delidding carries its own risks and costs, but certainly, any time you can lower temps is a good thing for an electronic component that goes through heat-cycling.

Depending on particulars, delidding plus a LM (liquid metal) TIM replacement will gain something like 12-23 C temp advantage. In turn, that large a gain may allow you to run lower v-core at any given speed, like I experienced...mind you, I started of low (pre-delid 4.8:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







There are really two main schools of thought re your question above:
















The first covers average-to-not-so-good chips (higher 'v' at lower GHz)...some will argue that these are not worth delidding, but you can turn that around and say that those are the chips *that need it most*...

The second covers low-v chips...many here will suggest that those are 'worth' delidding...obviously, if the chip already has a naturally higher limit, delidding will help increase that limit even further and get you beyond even 5 GHz.

I happen to think that both are potentially correct, as long as the dangers and costs of delidding are taken into account...but to make delidding really count you also have to have other upgraded components such as a strong water cooling system (over 4.8) and a board with VRMs that can handle much higher demands on a sustained basis because at 5 GHz plus, your 3770K max TDP = 77 watts will be exceeded by a multiple...typically, you're looking at 200 watts plus.

In the end, you may want to (very carefully) delid and use LM to see how far that takes you - then may be use two settings in your BIOS or something like Intel's XTU in Win7...the first is the daily 'regular' for browsing the web, email, and MS Office etc at a lower GHz, say 4.3 or 4.5, the second is for 'gaming' (and/or benching) at 4.9 or 5.1 etc...sleep states and Intel SpeedStep are also important in this...I run well over 5GHz yet even then, SpeedStep and C states remain enabled and functional.

Finally, is all that really worth it re the tradeoff's for extra performance ? Here is a table that may help quantify the potential gains:










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/thinking-of-overclocking-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-stock-turbo-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz


----------



## snowfree52

thanks,

I actually didn't tested anything less than 1,45V for 4,8 maybe I can get less, but I wanted to be sure I was at least 8 hours stable with 1,45

What I am sure of is I need 1,3V for 4,6. with even 1,29 I crash within 5 min on OCCT, with 1,3 I did 8 hours without problem.

I am not sure why you say if I delidded I could run lower V core at the same GHZ ?

5Ghz : I tried and it won't boot at 1,5V. not sure it's worth it going further


----------



## ivanlabrie

If it won't boot at 1.5v and 5ghz return it, rma it...give it to a friend or sell it. BAD chip.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If it won't boot at 1.5v and 5ghz return it, rma it...give it to a friend or sell it. BAD chip.


hahaha that would be me


----------



## TonicX

Attention: Valgaur
I officially submit my information data for [Official] Delidded Ivy Bridge Club Membership:

OCN name: ................ TonicX
CPU: .......................... i3770K
on die-TIM: ................. CoolLaboratory Ultra
ihs-TIM: ..................... CoolLaboratory Ultra
Mhz gained: ............... 400.1 MgHz
OC after delid: ............ 5200.1 MgHz
Temp drops: ............... 15* [ Hottest Core #3 before = 81* after = 66* @4500 intel burn test]
CPU-Z validation of max OC: .... http://valid.canardpc.com/2726703

Additionally, I Lapped the IHS completely flat top and bottom starting with 360 and 400 then 800 finally 1600 sandpaper.

I am looking forward to active participation in this Forum. I will freely share any other delidded data with you and those in persuit of performance!

Attachment 1

> OCN name on a piece.JPG
Attachment 2

> 4500 pre delid.JPG
Attachment 3

> 4500 post delid.JPG
Attachment 4

> 5200.1_OCmax_TonicX.JPG


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ^ Generally it's about 1-2fps for 100mhz, but with intel and these ivy bridges I think you'll likely see about 2-5fps per 100mhz. On cpu intensive games though. And what's more important is your minimum fps, not your average or max fps (which are more GPU related). CPU basically determines how bad your fps gets during some insane 64 man or 200vs200army situation, and how smooth the game is on that critical moment in the biggest part of the game. Obviously, this is a bigger deal in cpu intensive games like 64 mans or starcraft, but minimum fps being cpu related exists for all games.
> 
> The real difference comes if you stream though. If you stream your gameplay - and there's no reason not to if you got the power, just stream every game you have, make it private if you dont want people to watch and just have cool videos on storage online - overclocking makes a huge difference.
> 
> Depends on what you do (streaming, cpu intensive game) but 500mhz is a huge deal and definitely very noticeable in some spots. I mean that can very simply be the difference in 20 minimumfps like every other i7 overclocked gets on 4vs4 team RTS and 25-30fps which means you can play smoothly.
> 
> I mean my athlon was enough for my needs (it definitely needed to be unlocked and overclocked though, and while it was smooth enough it was definitely at 90%+ utilization the entire time, i could only do 45 fps not 60fps which is still a great stream and it looked better than most pro streams with i7s because I used the correct settings) but my i7 is definitely way smoother. I'll likely be posting tests later on comparing results (ht on, off, the difference in 5ghz vs 4.9ghz, 2400mhz ram vs 1600mhz, etc).


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Yea I've been playing a ton of Crysis 3 and with my failed delidded 3570k I was having a little trouble with the frames (nothing horrible or stuttery since I run two overclocked 7950's in x-fire), but it was hitting the low 40's sometimes when in outside environments and that bothers me. Now with the delidded 3770k I started the game over and everything is a lot smoother. Right when I got to that first outside environment I was nervous, but the game didn't even stutter with the transition and it stayed steady at 60fps. Its awesome to be able to run a game like that with maxed out graphic settings and 4x MSAA. Its really a work of art. Very happy with it! Very happy with everyone in this club! Very happy I killed my last chip!


I've spent the last month tweaking my system to push it further than what I had with my original overclock in the month after I purchased it, for a 1-2fps maximum gain. For the games I play I already sustained over 60fps on a single monitor at 1920x1200 so it isn't a huge deal. For others that extra little bit can make the games they play a lot more enjoyable. For me it's time to stop and enjoy the fruits of my labour.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, definitely not a good chip to delid...not worth it imho.


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, definitely not a good chip to delid...not worth it imho.


is this for me ?


----------



## stickg1

To me there's more to delidding than just hitting 5.0GHz+. I've seen guys spend several hundred dollars on custom loops just to shave 10C-20C off their load temps. This mod will cost about $20 and net you a 15C temp drop on average. That's why I delid, I've had two crappy chips, but they run really cool.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> To me there's more to delidding than just hitting 5.0GHz+. I've seen guys spend several hundred dollars on custom loops just to shave 10C-20C off their load temps. This mod will cost about $20 and net you a 15C temp drop on average. That's why I delid, I've had two crappy chips, but they run really cool.


this mod could cost you $350 though...lol


----------



## snowfree52

I've spent several hundred dollars indeed !


----------



## snowfree52

I still don't understand how I could gain some mhz after delidd ? Can someone explain ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> To me there's more to delidding than just hitting 5.0GHz+. I've seen guys spend several hundred dollars on custom loops just to shave 10C-20C off their load temps. This mod will cost about $20 and net you a 15C temp drop on average. That's why I delid, I've had two crappy chips, but they run really cool.


My water system is somewhere north of 2000$ lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My water system is somewhere north of 2000$ lol


You're a wildman!
My cascade, 2 x single stages, & water loop were less than that combined. Gotta admit my rigs look nowhere near as nice as yours though.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> this mod could cost you $350 though...lol


LOL
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I still don't understand how I could gain some mhz after delidd ? Can someone explain ?


Well because you are going to drastically reduce the temp of your chip. Therefore you can add more voltage and go for higher overclocks. Since your temps are no longer a limiting factor you can get higher speeds. Now the problem is, people are saying your chip isn't worth delidding. And what they mean is to get a gain on speed, you will likely have to put your voltage well over 1.5v, since nobody knows the maximum safe voltage for Ivy, and these voltages have been known to degrade previous 1155 chips and 775 chips, voltages in excess of 1.55v are avoided with Ivy. Some people don't really care, others do.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My water system is somewhere north of 2000$ lol


Yeah dude but yours is ballin', you basically run ambient temp, LOL


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I still don't understand how I could gain some mhz after delidd ? Can someone explain ?


It is very simple:

Let's just say FOR EXAMPLE:
I am at 4.5ghz with 1.35v and my max temp is 95c

Meaning I can't increase my OC (without increasing vcore) - as temps are at a max

I de-lid and then:
I am at 4.5ghz with 1.35v and my max temp is now 75c

This has now given me an EXTRA 20c headroom to play with.

So I go to 1.5v and now have a max temp of 95c BUT at 5ghz
0.5ghz gained

Does that make sense







?


----------



## Hokies83

Well my thoughts of why i got the best rads and such were this...

Re use value i will be able to do this with every system for many years to come.

The Monsta rads are inner chambers all copper and outter steel they should last near forever.

Last pic i took still waiting on 1 7950.


----------



## snowfree52

yes this I know, but that doesn't apply to me, does it ?

I'm just around 70-75°C at 4,8ghz and 1,45V.
Therefore I'm not limited by temps, but by V core

I don't want to jeopardize my CPU for 200Mhz , I really would like to run 5Ghz though


----------



## FtW 420

I do want to get at least one of those monster rads. My cheapo paper thin swiftech rads are functional but one of those monsters is like 4 of them combined...


----------



## Hokies83

There was a 480 UT 60 at PPS that had some loose solder flux in it they were asking 99$ for. The performance of the ut60 and monsta are almost the same monsta just has more epeen./options

And remember check out my build log and post a comment it bumps my build log!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I still don't understand how I could gain some mhz after delidd ? Can someone explain ?


When you have a good chip, you need to push over 1.45v to really get the higher overclocks it's possible capable of. You actually need a GREAT chip to do [email protected] If you have a golden chip you can do 5ghz without delidding possibly on a good water loop or high end air but that's talking like the best out of thousands.

Why have a water loop if you aren't going to push high voltages? Generally, people say 1.45-1.5v is the max for a delidded IB provided your temps are okay, but you can push from 1.5-1.6v if your temps are good. Be aware that 1.5-1.6v is quite dangerous, and if your cooling isn't up to snuff you'll do damage, and pushing around 1.55, 1.6v, is really getting into extreme voltages. So far there have been no reports of damage or degradation at even as high at 1.6v for 24/7 overclocks, but there are less than a dozen people who are really doing that.

Your current chip sounds terrible though, it doesn't sound like it's worth delidding. Sell it, use the money to get a new one, or exchange it, whatever. More than 50% of ivies can only do 4.5-4.6ghz on less than 1.45v, so don't feel bad.

Delidding can allow people to push higher overclocks if they have a good chip. Without delidding, it's impossible to really push far past 1.3v unless you have a custom water loop (i dont need to tell you how expensive those are). And no one has ever done anything above 4.7ghz on 1.3v or less, so to reach the higher ranges on ivy you have to delid. Even with a custom water loop, you are not going to be able to push far past 1.45v+, which is really a necessity for 5ghz (unless you got a golden chip).

Delidding has allowed me to push [email protected], and this is a great chip so it was worth delidding, otherwise on my nh-d14 cooling I'd only be able to do maybe 4.7ghz, and my temps would be even higher than what my 5ghz is when delidded. It may even be possible for me to push 5.1ghz on ~1.54v. On my last ivy, which is 24 hour prime95 stable at 4.6ghz @ 1.42v, the chip was terrible and delidding it wouldnt matter because temps werent the problem, stability was (or voltage, if you want to get down to it, and no I will not run a 4.7ghz on 1.55v at 90*C+, that's just not worth it).

your temps sound fine so you sound okay to run maybe up to 1.5v, but the problem is that running 1.5v on your $200+ custom water loop is going to have higher temps than me at [email protected] But your chip is definitely not worth pushing that much voltage through, nor is it worth delidding. You are having trouble _just booting_. For me there is about a .3-.4v difference in what I can boot, and what is 24 hour prime95 stable. So if you can't even boot [email protected], I'm pretty sure you'd need like 1.8v to be stable at 5ghz and that is just not going to happen lol...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> yes this I know, but that doesn't apply to me, does it ?
> 
> I'm just around 70-75°C at 4,8ghz and 1,45V.
> Therefore I'm not limited by temps, but by V core
> 
> I don't want to jeopardize my CPU for 200Mhz , I really would like to run 5Ghz though


Not really no.
You could increase vcore more, and as long as you're oin IB and under 105c / 95c for safety, you'll be fine.

Question you'll have to ask yourself is about degradation at such high voltages - why do you need more mhz? and more so, why are you t such a high vcore/clock?
de-lidding won't help you as such, nor will be useful in your respect.
Although, I've never really seen 1.45v run at 75c under load (by load I mean folding and/or prime)


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I still don't understand how I could gain some mhz after delidd ? Can someone explain ?


Adding to what the others have said above, reduced heat will also allow ivy bridge to run at a slightly lower voltage for a corresponding frequency. There is a good explanation of the relationship between voltage, temperature and frequency at http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end.


----------



## Joa3d43

^^^ +1 - with extra cooling like LN2 or Liquid Helium, your chip would run 6 GHz +....not practical for 'normal' operations, but it does underscore that with extra cooling comes more potential speed. Delidding + LM is a step in the right direction


----------



## stickg1

Where's Val and Swag?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You're a wildman!
> My cascade, 2 x single stages, & water loop were less than that combined. Gotta admit my rigs look nowhere near as nice as yours though.


lol xD
I need to get my hands on a cascade...one of those that run at -190c or something.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Adding to what the others have said above, reduced heat will also allow ivy bridge to run at a slightly lower voltage for a corresponding frequency. There is a good explanation of the relationship between voltage, temperature and frequency at http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end.


Not exactly true unless you are at -50c or lower.


----------



## chronicfx

So the guy I sold my GTX680 to on ebay just emailed me and says it freezing while playing all his games (batman arkham city, crysis 2 & 3, aliens ... I think he's full of it He gave me his phone number to call him and says "he would hate to ask for a refund".. I don't want a broken card back and no money lol.. It was working the day I sent. What should I do? How can I have him test it to make sure it is alright?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So the guy I sold my GTX680 to on ebay just emailed me and says it freezing while playing all his games (batman arkham city, crysis 2 & 3, aliens ... I think he's full of it He gave me his phone number to call him and says "he would hate to ask for a refund".. I don't want a broken card back and no money lol.. It was working the day I sent. What should I do? How can I have him test it to make sure it is alright?


Should have earned 1 more rep and sold it here lol.

Bunch of crooks on Ebay i would never sell anything more then 50$ in value there.

But ---> Clean driver install ---> run Heaven 4.0

Make sure his PSU is enough for the gpu and both power plugs are in.

Get his system specs etc..


----------



## Rucka315

So i decided to jump the gun and try deliding my 3770k and i am really happy i did. I forgot to take a pic of my before temps but i have my after temps and i can say its a huge decrease per core in temperature.
I was kinda scared when i turned the machine back on to see the same temps as before idle but as soon as i cranked up some Prime95 the new TIM kicked in amazingly. Here are my pics from my work and my new temps.

Temps before deliding were 89c 95c 96c 92c some times it would spike to almost 100c.

OCN name: Rucka315
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: none
OC after delid: 4.8ghz
Temp drops: 25c or more

If you have any questions go ahead and ask i am willing to answer what ever i can.


----------



## Zeek

Ughh, that dust


----------



## Rucka315

Yea yea i cleaned before i put the cooler back in.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Ughh, that dust


Haha I was thinking the same thing. I've already took my case and everything apart and blew it off in the two months that I have had it my rig. Bothers the hell outta me.


----------



## Rucka315

No congrats just going to make fun of the dust wow troll city here.


----------



## sakerfalcon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> So i decided to jump the gun and try deliding my 3770k and i am really happy i did. I forgot to take a pic of my before temps but i have my after temps and i can say its a huge decrease per core in temperature.
> I was kinda scared when i turned the machine back on to see the same temps as before idle but as soon as i cranked up some Prime95 the new TIM kicked in amazingly. Here are my pics from my work and my new temps.


You might want to clean up that paste around the socket...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So the guy I sold my GTX680 to on ebay just emailed me and says it freezing while playing all his games (batman arkham city, crysis 2 & 3, aliens ... I think he's full of it He gave me his phone number to call him and says "he would hate to ask for a refund".. I don't want a broken card back and no money lol.. It was working the day I sent. What should I do? How can I have him test it to make sure it is alright?


Probably out to scam you. Ask him to provide proof and video, but it's likely going to be an uphill battle for you since buyer holds all the cards. If he insists, have him pay for return shipping of the item before issuing a refund. Also, take all the money out of your Paypal.


----------



## Rucka315

Yet again i cleaned the socket and whipped/blew out the dust before putting back in the cooler any non trolls on this site damn.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok so when I ran my 14 hour test on p95 turns out I somehow was running it at 4.5ghz and I meant to do 4.7Ghz at 1.328v. So I have been doing some p95 tests and have been trying to get it stable, but I'm having a hard time. I was just at 1.348v and I got an error on worker #3 and it stopped so I bumped up my voltage to 1.36v and now my workers seem to be off on the timing of the tests. Noticably worker #3 which is still on test four. What is going on? Usually they stay in time within a second or two.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Woah why did worker #3 pass the 448k test in 7 runs and worker #7 pass it in 13 runs and worker #5 pass in #12 tests, etc etc. Does this always happen?? I'm kind of freaked out.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not exactly true unless you are at -50c or lower.










I meant to clarify that in my post and left it out.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Yet again i cleaned the socket and whipped/blew out the dust before putting back in the cooler any non trolls on this site damn.


Just because dust bothers me doesn't mean I'm a troll I am happy that you did a good job delidding. Sorry if I offended you I was really just joking cause I'm OCD about this stuff. Was it your first try doing it to a chip?

EDIT: BTW I really did mean to say good job when I posted that first comment I'm just so busy with my own testing I totally forgot. Its one of those days. Looks like you did a nice clean job. No nicks or scratches. I can't really see your screen shot because I am on a 23.6" monitor what were your temp drops?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol xD
> I need to get my hands on a cascade...one of those that run at -190c or something.
> Not exactly true unless you are at -50c or lower.


I've never seen one, but a cascade that can run ln2 temps would be great!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Just because dust bothers me doesn't mean I'm a troll I am happy that you did a good job delidding. Sorry if I offended you I was really just joking cause I'm OCD about this stuff. Was it your first try doing it to a chip?


Some of my stuff would make your head explode, you'd probably want to drag a vacuum over here to stop the nightmares...
When I can't read the writing on the mobo anymore, time to blow the dust off.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Some of my stuff would make your head explode, you'd probably want to drag a vacuum over here to stop the nightmares...
> When I can't read the writing on the mobo anymore, time to blow the dust off.


aGHHHHHH don't tell me that! I'm going to find you...........

and clean your computer


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Yet again i cleaned the socket and whipped/blew out the dust before putting back in the cooler any non trolls on this site damn.


Nope, we're mostly all trolls here. Seriously tho, calm down and take a joke. Gratz on the delid and go OC the chip to hell








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> When I can't read the writing on the mobo anymore, time to blow the dust off.


LOL! I usually clean my rig every month since I have my PC on carpet :l It gets pretty dusty quick but as soon as I see build up I clean it


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Adding to what the others have said above, reduced heat will also allow ivy bridge to run at a slightly lower voltage for a corresponding frequency. There is a good explanation of the relationship between voltage, temperature and frequency at http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end.
> 
> 
> 
> Not exactly true unless you are at -50c or lower.
Click to expand...

There'd be a graph curve for this, gains dropping off towards 150c. Old rule of thumb was that less than 22°C would get you another 200MHz, and each degree drop from that would net you roughly 15MHz (??) heading for -50°C, or was it 200MHz for every 5°C, less after that..

I read that somewhere during the socket 775 and 1366 era, but fully realize sandy and ivy have their own behaviors... just would have thought that would carry over into less voltage at lower temp for a given OC


----------



## Rucka315

Ok thanks all for the congrats i got scared that it was going to be nothing but trolls clowing my dust lol. I'm currently working on a 5ghz oc wish me luck im really close to getting a stable vcore.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Should have earned 1 more rep and sold it here lol.
> 
> Bunch of crooks on Ebay i would never sell anything more then 50$ in value there.
> 
> But ---> Clean driver install ---> run Heaven 4.0
> 
> Make sure his PSU is enough for the gpu and both power plugs are in.
> 
> Get his system specs etc..


He has a 3770k (not overclocked) I told him to delid that puppy. Well we ran furmark 1080 benchmark cause it was quick and he got the same score as my matched card which is still unsold. We also found out that physx > cpu was checked instead of letting the GTX680 do it. I bet his 3770k was overclocked poorly and this was exposing it and he wasn't letting on.. But after we switched it over to the GPU everything was working again. I hope it stays that way.


----------



## chronicfx

My two sapphire vapor-x 7970's arrive on Thursday. I am really nervous after reading all the crossfire issues. Should I use Radeon Pro or afterburner and do the frame limiting and dynamic vsync thing? Any suggestions or am I doomed?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Nope, we're mostly all trolls here. Seriously tho, calm down and take a joke. Gratz on the delid and go OC the chip to hell
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL! I usually clean my rig every month since I have my PC on carpet :l It gets pretty dusty quick but as soon as I see build up I clean it


Heatsinks, rads & coolers I clean off pretty regularly, I do get lazy with parts where dust buildup doesn't affect performance. I went to see the revision number on a motherboard before & did have to clean it to be able to read what was there though, hadn't noticed it was getting that dirty until really looking.


----------



## Zeek

You're doomed and they're gonna go boom on you.

I'd just use afterburner and be set with it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Heatsinks, rads & coolers I clean off pretty regularly, I do get lazy with parts where dust buildup doesn't affect performance. I went to see the revision number on a motherboard before & did have to clean it to be able to read what was there though, hadn't noticed it was getting that dirty until really looking.


Oh, well in that aspect we're pretty similar. I clean my D14 and fans/case monthly. Mobo doesn't get touched too often. Old 990FXA-UD3 has a decent layer when I took it out and I never noticed, lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Ok thanks all for the congrats i got scared that it was going to be nothing but trolls clowing my dust lol. I'm currently working on a 5ghz oc wish me luck im really close to getting a stable vcore.


Awesome definetly keep us updated bro! Congrats! Are you using CLU?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Ok thanks all for the congrats i got scared that it was going to be nothing but trolls clowing my dust lol. I'm currently working on a 5ghz oc wish me luck im really close to getting a stable vcore.


...good luck...and re. dust, just get a 200 mm side-fan for the GPUs / VRMs...19 DB only, but huge air movement with no chance for dust


----------



## Rucka315

Just got 30 min of Prime95 5ghz 1.464v on load. so far so good.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> My two sapphire vapor-x 7970's arrive on Thursday. I am really nervous after reading all the crossfire issues. Should I use Radeon Pro or afterburner and do the frame limiting and dynamic vsync thing? Any suggestions or am I doomed?


What games are you going to be playing? I had a TON of issues when I put my second 7950 in a couple weeks ago, but it turns out it was actually windows corruption (what are the chances of that???) and since then everything has been amazing. I've been so involved with my delidding and trying to find a stable overclock that I have only played about an hour of gaming in the last week. I have had like no problems though. I'm currently #40 on the duel cards chart of the valley benchmark and once Karlitos gets back and enters all of the pending benches I should be #32 so I am really happy with the performance of my two 7950's. Currently running at 1170/1600.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My water system is somewhere north of 2000$ lol


That`s a good start !


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> You're doomed and they're gonna go boom on you.
> 
> I'd just use afterburner and be set with it.
> Oh, well in that aspect we're pretty similar. I clean my D14 and fans/case monthly. Mobo doesn't get touched too often. Old 990FXA-UD3 has a decent layer when I took it out and I never noticed, lol.


I've put dust filters on all my intake fans and I've not had dust build up on any fans or internal components in the 8 months since I built the PC. I clean the filters once every couple of weeks as the dust builds up on them. It does restrict airflow slightly and may contribute to an extra 1-2C difference between external and internal case ambient temperatures. I haven't tested filter on vs off temps and the likely small temperature gains are not worth it to me over the benefit of having a clean system. Having dust on the heatsinks, rads and fans will impede airflow and cooling anyway which could offset the gains to having no filters.


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://www.overclock.net/t/13663/automatic-refilling-ln2-cooler

lol

@FtW: There was a guy who had a 5 stage project but doesn't seem to be finished...Also, I keep seeing -170c and similar head temps, but that's with no load.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> That`s a good start !


Meh @ good start i have one of the most extreme Water loops out there..

There is only a Handful of people with more rads then me.


----------



## Rucka315

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Awesome definetly keep us updated bro! Congrats! Are you using CLU?


Im not trying to look like a dummy but what is CLU mean?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Im not trying to look like a dummy but what is CLU mean?


Cool Labs liquid ultra


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh @ good start i have one of the most extreme Water loops out there..
> 
> There is only a Handful of people with more rads then me.


It`s a great system no doubt about it, when you brag about how much you spent well that just stroking your own ego ! I`ve spent more on just my TEC part of my Glycol cooling with controllers, machining, silver plating never mind quad pumps, quad rads including Monsta 420 and 360. No matter what we do someone has something better than us, please don`t try and be such an Elitist ! LOL


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> It`s a great system no doubt about it, when you brag about how much you spent well that just stroking your own ego ! I`ve spent more on just my TEC part of my Glycol cooling with controllers, machining, silver plating never mind quad pumps, quad rads including Monsta 420 and 360. No matter what we do someone has something better than us, please don`t try and be such an Elitist ! LOL


I looked at Tec cooling and chose not to. i could do it if i liked

My question is why combine 2 cheapo Cooler Master cases but yet spend all the money on a thing such as a tec chiller??

Why not get a Case labs of Mountain mods case?

They would make ur build look so much better.

I only see 2 Monsta rads what are the other brands? in the top of the case?


----------



## TonicX

Attention Moderators:
in reference to my submission-
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508

I have a cpu-z validation with my correct username @:

http://valid.canardpc.com/2726957

Thanks-alot! I could not have done it with-out you!


----------



## teamrushpntball

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> It`s a great system no doubt about it, when you brag about how much you spent well that just stroking your own ego ! I`ve spent more on just my TEC part of my Glycol cooling with controllers, machining, silver plating never mind quad pumps, quad rads including Monsta 420 and 360. No matter what we do someone has something better than us, please don`t try and be such an Elitist ! LOL


This, and the fact that you spent a fourth of your budget on extra reservoirs. Certainly an aesthetic choice that I can hardly argue with considering the amount I've spent customizing my TJ07. Yet you constantly interject just how much you've spent to cram a needless amount of radiator space into your build.

Why must you insult other people's hardwork just to brag about your build?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *teamrushpntball*
> 
> This, and the fact that you spent a fourth of your budget on extra reservoirs. Certainly an aesthetic choice that I can hardly argue with considering the amount I've spent customizing my TJ07. Yet you constantly interject just how much you've spent to cram a needless amount of radiator space into your build.
> 
> Why must you insult other people's hardwork just to brag about your build?


Damn these de lidded club newbies do not know me very well and spew hate lol i find that funny.

Im one of the first members of this club and was one of the people who had the idea for Valgaur to start it









And for the love of god dude where did i insult somebodys build?? really get over it..

Also me saying i spent 2k is not a Brag that is just me so try again.


----------



## MKHunt

WHen I replace my car's radiator, I know exactly where it's going.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> WHen I replace my car's radiator, I know exactly where it's going.


I had that idea.

Somebody on a Euro forum did it used water hoses etc.

Anywho i post picture updates in this thread because...

Alot of the people i talk to via pm and who follow my build are in this thread..

And i used to be one of the most active people in this thread so alot of ppl in here know me..

So i post pics to update them time to time not to brag.

My build log is on 7 or so forums which i update and when i update on one i may throw a picture or 2 in a thread i know of with ppl i know / friends to update them as well.

If this is "Bragging then you have the wrong idea"


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I had that idea.
> 
> Somebody on a Euro forum did it used water hoses etc.


Most definitely needs an aquarium pump as well. The pressure drop across that thing would be ridiculous.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Most definitely needs an aquarium pump as well. The pressure drop across that thing would be ridiculous.


Pond pump


----------



## Rucka315

So how much lower would my temps be with CLU?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> So how much lower would my temps be with CLU?


Temp drops from CLU range from 20c to 35c.


----------



## gdesmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn these de lidded club newbies do not know me very well and spew hate lol i find that funny.
> 
> Im one of the first members of this club and was one of the people who had the idea for Valgaur to start it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And for the love of god dude where did i insult somebodys build?? really get over it..
> 
> Also me saying i spent 2k is not a Brag that is just me so try again.


I`m not a newb to what you call delidding because honestly it is temporary delidding. My 3770 K was truly delidded last April the first week they came out and has not ever been run with the IHS on. That is an older incarnation of my TEC rig with the dual 922`s. When you call someones cases a cheap build I would say that is a bit of an insult . I have several and can afford any case I want but that is not the point . I do things because I enjoy it and don`t care for some peoples egos so I will do you a big favour and not bother to post in Your forum.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gdesmo*
> 
> I`m not a newb to what you call delidding because honestly it is temporary delidding. My 3770 K was truly delidded last April the first week they came out and has not ever been run with the IHS on. That is an older incarnation of my TEC rig with the dual 922`s. When you call someones cases a cheap build I would say that is a bit of an insult . I have several and can afford any case I want but that is not the point . I do things because I enjoy it and don`t care for some peoples egos so I will do you a big favour and not bother to post in Your forum.


The calling of your cases cheap was not to insult you dude.. i have afew old dell cases there cheap 2 if somebody told me that it would not insult me i would laugh about it. So no insult intended.

It was to suggest getting a ubber case to show case your build.

" you know hey man u seem to have alot of money having tec cooler and all why not get a real sweet case and really show case that thing"

I to have had Ivy Since April i got mine First release batch that came into stock...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> So how much lower would my temps be with CLU?


The die TIM you used is pretty good, but most have found that cool labs ultra or pro work best. Depending on the optimization of your application you should get a handful of degrees by switching to ultra or pro, and we assume less pump out over time.

By the way, congrats on the delid, you seemed to have achieved very good results. I did notice in your pictures that you have your IHS quite low, but you got a nice temp drop so that might not be causing any issues.

Also, to you and others new to this thread, I have read a lot of different threads here and this is the best one by far, we are all friends here, just don't take anything too seriously.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> WHen I replace my car's radiator, I know exactly where it's going.


That's how wc started out...just make sure it's copper and not aluminum with brass tubes.
You'd need to make some custom barbs, braze them to the thing and add a fan shroud to mount fans over them.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The calling of your cases cheap was not to insult you dude.. i have afew old dell cases there cheap 2 if somebody told me that it would not insult me i would laugh about it. So no insult intended.
> 
> It was to suggest getting a ubber case to show case your build.
> 
> " you know hey man u seem to have alot of money having tec cooler and all why not get a real sweet case and really show case that thing"
> 
> I to have had Ivy Since April i got mine First release batch that came into stock...


It's just your "tone" or way of phrasing things that make you look like that at times man...If people don't know you too well you might come off as a prick to their eyes.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's how wc started out...just make sure it's copper and not aluminum with brass tubes.
> You'd need to make some custom barbs, braze them to the thing and add a fan shroud to mount fans over them.
> It's just your "tone" or way of phrasing things that make you look like that at times man...If people don't know you too well you might come off as a prick to their eyes.


LoL Yeah i guess so but people who know me know i do not mean it like that..

I am a Country music listening ******* And almost nothing i say is to insult anyone... Unless u have a 4k Amd build that is i can be a bit harsh but that is about it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol 4k as in resolution? Cause I could use a quad 7970 4k gaming rig. xD

Found this...seems like an interesting project!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol 4k as in resolution? Cause I could use a quad 7970 4k gaming rig. xD
> 
> Found this...seems like an interesting project!


LoL no as in 4000 USD into an 8350 rig lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I would only spend 4000 on gpus and cooling if I could...and a good 120hz 3d ips monitor by Samsung (they have a lightboost hack of their own compatible with AMD gpus)
That would include a cascade for gpu and cpu cooling, and a Titan or a few 7970s lol

I'd happily bench with an 8350 though, paired with a CHV-Z and my psc ram, and maybe some Samsung D-rev and Hynix CFR sticks.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Im not trying to look like a dummy but what is CLU mean?


Clear Liquid Ultra , a great non-conductive dust remover .







...

Congrats on the delid


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> When you have a good chip, you need to push over 1.45v to really get the higher overclocks it's possible capable of. You actually need a GREAT chip to do [email protected] If you have a golden chip you can do 5ghz without delidding possibly on a good water loop or high end air but that's talking like the best out of thousands.
> 
> Why have a water loop if you aren't going to push high voltages? Generally, people say 1.45-1.5v is the max for a delidded IB provided your temps are okay, but you can push from 1.5-1.6v if your temps are good. Be aware that 1.5-1.6v is quite dangerous, and if your cooling isn't up to snuff you'll do damage, and pushing around 1.55, 1.6v, is really getting into extreme voltages. So far there have been no reports of damage or degradation at even as high at 1.6v for 24/7 overclocks, but there are less than a dozen people who are really doing that.
> 
> Your current chip sounds terrible though, it doesn't sound like it's worth delidding. Sell it, use the money to get a new one, or exchange it, whatever. More than 50% of ivies can only do 4.5-4.6ghz on less than 1.45v, so don't feel bad.
> 
> Delidding can allow people to push higher overclocks if they have a good chip. Without delidding, it's impossible to really push far past 1.3v unless you have a custom water loop (i dont need to tell you how expensive those are). And no one has ever done anything above 4.7ghz on 1.3v or less, so to reach the higher ranges on ivy you have to delid. Even with a custom water loop, you are not going to be able to push far past 1.45v+, which is really a necessity for 5ghz (unless you got a golden chip).
> 
> Delidding has allowed me to push [email protected], and this is a great chip so it was worth delidding, otherwise on my nh-d14 cooling I'd only be able to do maybe 4.7ghz, and my temps would be even higher than what my 5ghz is when delidded. It may even be possible for me to push 5.1ghz on ~1.54v. On my last ivy, which is 24 hour prime95 stable at 4.6ghz @ 1.42v, the chip was terrible and delidding it wouldnt matter because temps werent the problem, stability was (or voltage, if you want to get down to it, and no I will not run a 4.7ghz on 1.55v at 90*C+, that's just not worth it).
> 
> your temps sound fine so you sound okay to run maybe up to 1.5v, but the problem is that running 1.5v on your $200+ custom water loop is going to have higher temps than me at [email protected] But your chip is definitely not worth pushing that much voltage through, nor is it worth delidding. You are having trouble _just booting_. For me there is about a .3-.4v difference in what I can boot, and what is 24 hour prime95 stable. So if you can't even boot [email protected], I'm pretty sure you'd need like 1.8v to be stable at 5ghz and that is just not going to happen lol...


Thanks for the explaination but I am not sure I understand,
You say my chip is terrible and you're not alone

but you also say 50% of the chips out there won't go past 4,5 -4,6 Ghz at 1,45V
Mine is stable at 4,8Ghz @ 1,45V

therefore I'd say it's better thant at least 50% of the chips out there, let's say 70% ??

That means, even if I sell/return it, and buy another one I just have 30% chances of getting a better one, and 70% of getting a worse one ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

77% of all statistics are made on the fly...I say the most usual vcore for 4.5ghz from what I've seen is between 1.25v and 1.3v. More than that and that chip sucks BAD.


----------



## snowfree52

mine runs stable at 4,6 @ 1,3V and 4,5 @ 1,25

And I can actually boot at 1,5V and 5Ghz, I runned a super PI 2M in 16 sec and them BSOD









I just took this chart : https://docs.google.com/a/sitex-isolation.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AldAG0FCQxM-dHZuNTBOaUVKZlNlWDZQWFh4Y3dudmc&gid=39

and did some calculation with only the 3770K

average overclock is 4615,7Mhz with 1,291V
median is 4559,5Mhz with 1,280V

Seeing this I think I am in the middle, around 50% chances getting a worse chip, 50% getting a better chip.

Not sure my chip is THAT terrible, just average


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, told you so...xD

I'd get a new chip, and then delid it anyway.
I'd reccomend a 323xCxxxx batch one...3570k's are decent nowadays it seems.


----------



## snowfree52

I have until the end of the week then 30 days return policy is over.









difficult


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I have until the end of the week then 30 days return policy is over.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> difficult


...not the be-all and end-all, just a quick test...at what vCore @ 5 GHz can you load and run Cinebench 11.5...? You can tell s.th. by a 'bug text' error message by Cinebench but not BSOD


----------



## snowfree52

will try this when I get home

what V core should I definitely not go past ? 1,6V ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> will try this when I get home
> 
> what V core should I definitely not go past ? 1,6V ?


...that's a personal thing, but I would not go past 1.55 for short benching and 1.52 for longer benching


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> will try this when I get home
> 
> what V core should I definitely not go past ? 1,6V ?


As said above.
Personally I wouldn't go above 1.55v for short term benching and 1.35v for long term.

There's no real concrete answer to this.


----------



## Belial

OCN name: Belial88
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: ~200mhz
OC after delid: [email protected] (1.499DMM)
Temp drops: ~23*C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2727595

34 Hours Prime95 Custom Blend 80%+ Ram Tested, Above Normal Priority, no Kerneal/Logger WHEA errors.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> OCN name: Belial88
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: ~200mhz
> OC after delid: [email protected] (1.499DMM)
> Temp drops: ~23*C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2727595
> 
> 34 Hours Prime95 Custom Blend 80%+ Ram Tested, Above Normal Priority, no Kerneal/Logger WHEA errors.


Nice! Looking good!


----------



## justanoldman

Nice job Belial, temp drop looks good.
34 hours of Prime95 with almost 1.5v. If you run that voltage 24/7 and do Prime95 24+ hours test every now and again to check stability over time, you should be able to figure out if that degrades an Ivy chip or not.

I hope it doesn't, but there are those people that believe 24 hours of Prime is terrible for your chip at any time, and others that think 1.5v 24/7 will degrade it also. If you are doing both and don't get noticeable degradation then you will be able to prove Ivy is a lot stronger than they think.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Nice job Belial, temp drop looks good.
> 34 hours of Prime95 with almost 1.5v. If you run that voltage 24/7 and do Prime95 24+ hours test every now and again to check stability over time, you should be able to figure out if that degrades an Ivy chip or not.
> 
> I hope it doesn't, but there are those people that believe 24 hours of Prime is terrible for your chip at any time, and others that think 1.5v 24/7 will degrade it also. If you are doing both and don't get noticeable degradation then you will be able to prove Ivy is a lot stronger than they think.


Yeah, we should be able to learn something from his and Martinhal's chip.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...not the be-all and end-all, just a quick test...at what vCore @ 5 GHz can you load and run Cinebench 11.5...? You can tell s.th. by a 'bug text' error message by Cinebench but not BSOD


That's kinda harsh on the chip, quite similar to prime95 max stress but in shorter timespan.
I think the proper procedure to give us a remote idea of what it's capable is vcore to boot at 5ghz and run superpi 32m, that's the standard these days. Then if you delid you go stress test and whatnot or just freeze the thing.


----------



## snowfree52

Well with 1,5V I can boot and run super PI 2M, didn't try 32m

Will try when I get home


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What games are you going to be playing? I had a TON of issues when I put my second 7950 in a couple weeks ago, but it turns out it was actually windows corruption (what are the chances of that???) and since then everything has been amazing. I've been so involved with my delidding and trying to find a stable overclock that I have only played about an hour of gaming in the last week. I have had like no problems though. I'm currently #40 on the duel cards chart of the valley benchmark and once Karlitos gets back and enters all of the pending benches I should be #32 so I am really happy with the performance of my two 7950's. Currently running at 1170/1600.


I am getting crysis 3 and bioshock with it free, I have tomb raider but am saving it to play on these cards, saints row the third i am about half way through but keep finding other things to play. Thats probably my "next 4" oh yeah, just got darksiders 2 for %65 percent off on steam.. so next 5


----------



## justanoldman

The benefits of delidding and using good TIM:
Before delidding I could only do 4.8 at 1.295v and my temps were over 90c. I just switched around a bunch of things in my rigs, so I had to test again. Now I can do 5.0 at 1.41v and max core temps of 72, 76, 74, 72 with Prime95 and an off the shelf cooler.


----------



## Icydead

Hi,

today I successfully delidded my 3570k and I used MX-2 on DIE, until Liquid Pro/Ultra arrives. I have a lapped IHS and I am using Noctua NH-D14 and my question is, can I use Liquid Pro/Ultra on lapped IHS and if yes, would there be some problems when I would want to take the cooler off after some time ? Same question applies if I use it on DIE.

Im looking forward to testing with this paste, as my chip is capable of [email protected] and [email protected] prime stable 24h (prior to delid).

Thanks guys


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> today I successfully delidded my 3570k and I used MX-2 on DIE, until Liquid Pro/Ultra arrives. I have a lapped IHS and I am using Noctua NH-D14 and my question is, can I use Liquid Pro/Ultra on lapped IHS and if yes, would there be some problems when I would want to take the cooler off after some time ? Same question applies if I use it on DIE.
> 
> Im looking forward to testing with this paste, as my chip is capable of [email protected] and [email protected] prime stable 24h (prior to delid).
> 
> Thanks guys


Congratulations. Post some pics and temp numbers when you can.

So far we have not found anything better to use on the die than ultra or pro, so no question you should use it there. Because the PCB and die are not metal, it comes off relatively easily.

On top of the IHS is a matter of personal choice. I have lapped IHSs as well and use ultra on them. There is no problem when you want to take it apart later, I posted pics previously here that with some metal polish and elbow grease the TIM can be removed if need be. It does harden a bit over time so you have to pull a little to get your cooler off, but it is no big deal.

I use ultra on the die and on top of the IHS on both machines, and happy so far.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Congratulations. Post some pics and temp numbers when you can.
> 
> So far we have not found anything better to use on the die than ultra or pro, so no question you should use it there. Because the PCB and die are not metal, it comes off relatively easily.
> 
> On top of the IHS is a matter of personal choice. I have lapped IHSs as well and use ultra on them. There is no problem when you want to take it apart later, I posted pics previously here that with some metal polish and elbow grease the TIM can be removed if need be. It does harden a bit over time so you have to pull a little to get your cooler off, but it is no big deal.
> 
> I use ultra on the die and on top of the IHS on both machines, and happy so far.


Thanks for answer. So, do you think it will still be possible to take off the cooler and perhaps the IHS as well relatively easy after for example a year? It worries me a little if it hardens over time. I will post pics after I take out the cpu again to apply liquid ultra. Im currently testing if everything is ok.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Thanks for answer. So, do you think it will still be possible to take off the cooler and perhaps the DIE as well relatively easy after for example a year? It worries me a little if it hardens over time. I will post pics after I take out the cpu again to apply liquid ultra. Im currently testing if everything is ok.


I haven't had my rig for a year so I can't guarantee anything, but I recently switch everything around after several weeks. I took apart both chips and both coolers completely. Cleaned off all the ultra on both dies, and reasonably cleaned off the ultra on the IHSs (there is a stain left which doesn't matter if you are reapplying the same TIM). Then put ultra back on the dies and IHSs, I had no trouble with it. Hope that helps.

Edit: Here is link to my post with pics:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13240#post_19452973


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's kinda harsh on the chip, quite similar to prime95 max stress but in shorter timespan.
> I think the proper procedure to give us a remote idea of what it's capable is vcore to boot at 5ghz and run superpi 32m, that's the standard these days. Then if you delid you go stress test and whatnot or just freeze the thing.


Well just arrived from work and at 1,55V @ 5Ghz I can run superPI 32M in 6min 45s
but google chrome refuses to open and when I lanched OCCT, BSOD instantly.

I guess for cinebench I would need 1,6 or more and I won't go there.

So, what do you guys think ? return it ?


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I haven't had my rig for a year so I can't guarantee anything, but I recently switch everything around after several weeks. I took apart both chips and both coolers completely. Cleaned off all the ultra on both dies, and reasonably cleaned off the ultra on the IHSs (there is a stain left which doesn't matter if you are reapplying the same TIM). Then put ultra back on the dies and IHSs, I had no trouble with it. Hope that helps.
> 
> Edit: Here is link to my post with pics:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13240#post_19452973


Thanks for pics, that bastard is really sticky. Yea I have in mind something like you know "apply the liquid ultra, assemble it together, close the case and be done with it for like a year", because recently Ive had enough of this hardware tweaking and other hardware "manoeuvres" and I need a break







My first experience with Intel after I switched from AMD, and I had to RMA my new MB like 3 or 4 times, Im not even sure now. Once they sold me used one, lol, then another one had squealing caps, another one too, etc. and every time I had to drive like 150km to the shop because I didnt want to wait, and Ive spent over a month with this. So I wanted to ensure myself that I will not destroy MB or anything when I will try to take the cooler off after that much time.


----------



## clayer

hi. can you add me please.

delidded and lapped liquid pro on all surfaces currently at 4.7oc max temp late 50s

custom loop 1x360 2x240 1x120/twin d5 res combo.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Well with 1,5V I can boot and run super PI 2M, didn't try 32m
> 
> Will try when I get home


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Well just arrived from work and at 1,55V @ 5Ghz I can run superPI 32M in 6min 45s
> but google chrome refuses to open and when I lanched OCCT, BSOD instantly.
> 
> I guess for cinebench I would need 1,6 or more and I won't go there.
> 
> So, what do you guys think ? return it ?


Yeah, return it...it's pretty lousy really, my former chip which was not good would do 32m at 1.48v and 5.1ghz with 1.52v. Could boot 5.2 without delidding at 1.55v or so.
I'm getting a new one next Thursday, hope it's a good one, maybe you can get yours by then as well








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *clayer*
> 
> hi. can you add me please.
> 
> delidded and lapped liquid pro on all surfaces currently at 4.7oc max temp late 50s
> 
> custom loop 1x360 2x240 1x120/twin d5 res combo.


Nice results, now go for 5ghz







(magic number xD)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

My CLU will be here tomorrow!!!! Can't wait. Sucks I'm having a horrible time getting 4.7ghz stable it takes 1.392v in which I pretty much hit my thermal cieling so I'm at 4.6Ghz at 1.29v for now.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> My CLU will be here tomorrow!!!! Can't wait. Sucks I'm having a horrible time getting 4.7ghz stable it takes 1.392v in which I pretty much hit my thermal cieling so I'm at 4.6Ghz at 1.29v for now.


i thought you had a good chip this time, probably it's still better than mine lol

did you de-lid the new chip ? what tim are you using on die now ?


----------



## Solonowarion

Would it be okay to put some painters tpe on the bottom of thechip for esie handling.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yea me too... it does take around 1.2v for 4.5ghz, but its seems like every every .1ghz takes an extra .1v. Freaking sucksss. I'm using mx4 right now.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Would it be okay to put some painters tpe on the bottom of thechip for esie handling.


I wouldn't do that personally. Rubber gloves makes it easy to handle and you don't have to worry about static.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Would it be okay to put some painters tpe on the bottom of thechip for esie handling.


You should just wear some disposable gloves. I wouldn't try something like that. If even one little piece of glue gets stuck the connection for the whole chip will be thrown off.

Yea I was going to do some more stress testing tonight but I have an interview for a really good job tomorrow so I'm just going to sleep. Then I can start watercooling and buying a couple more chips and hope for that golden one to come along.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea me too... it does take around 1.2v for 4.5ghz, but its seems like every every .1ghz takes an extra .1v. Freaking sucksss. I'm using mx4 right now.


what cooler are you using and what temps @ 1.2v and @ 1.3v

because after i de-lid i will be using mx-4 too and i don't know if i will be able to get my hands on liquid pro


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> You should just wear some disposable gloves. I wouldn't try something like that. If even one little piece of glue gets stuck the connection for the whole chip will be thrown off.
> 
> Yea I was going to do some more stress testing tonight but I have an interview for a really good job tomorrow so I'm just going to sleep. Then I can start watercooling and buying a couple more chips and hope for that golden one to come along.


i'd just keep what you have and clock @ 4.5GHz with 1.2v and enjoy the cool delidded running chip, 4.5 is still good maybe 4.6 @ 1.30 and call it a day !


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, return it...it's pretty lousy really, my former chip which was not good would do 32m at 1.48v and 5.1ghz with 1.52v. Could boot 5.2 without delidding at 1.55v or so.
> I'm getting a new one next Thursday, hope it's a good one, maybe you can get yours by then as well


I just lanched the return and already ordered another 3770K, I hope it's gonna be better !!!

Should receive it friday

How many 3770K have you gone through ?


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I wouldn't do that personally. Rubber gloves makes it easy to handle and you don't have to worry about static.


So its okay to handle the bottom though?

I like handling bottoms.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> what cooler are you using and what temps @ 1.2v and @ 1.3v
> 
> because after i de-lid i will be using mx-4 too and i don't know if i will be able to get my hands on liquid pro


At 1.2v temps aren't passing 72c after 14 hours of p95 and 1.3v temps aren't passing 85c after 14 hours of p95. At 1.391v temps get close to 100c so I just can't really run that right now. Why can't yoju get your hands on CLU? I would do everything you can to get it even if you have to pay a hefty price on shipping.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> At 1.2v temps aren't passing 72c after 14 hours of p95 and 1.3v temps aren't passing 85c after 14 hours of p95. At 1.391v temps get close to 100c so I just can't really run that right now. Why can't yoju get your hands on CLU? I would do everything you can to get it even if you have to pay a hefty price on shipping.


idk if i import it maybe it will get lost in the way i live faaaaaaarrrr away from those nice cute little liquid pro filled syringes


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> So its okay to handle the bottom though?
> 
> I like handling bottoms.


Haha this made me lol. Yes it is ok you BETTER buy an anti stattic bracelet though. I refuse to touch anything in my computer without one. Even if you are wearing gloves there could be a rip in one and you can still send some static to your $330 chip. Id pay $5 for one if I were you.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> So its okay to handle the bottom though?
> 
> I like handling bottoms.


I avoid touching the underside of the chip at all times. If you are not wearing gloves your hands always have dirt, oil, and dead skin cells on them. Even if you are, I always feel more comfortable handling the chip by the edges.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> what cooler are you using and what temps @ 1.2v and @ 1.3v
> 
> because after i de-lid i will be using mx-4 too and i don't know if i will be able to get my hands on liquid pro


And I'm using a noctua d14 for cooling


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha this made me lol. Yes it is ok you BETTER buy an anti stattic bracelet though. I refuse to touch anything in my computer without one. Even if you are wearing gloves there could be a rip in one and you can still send some static to your $330 chip. Id pay $5 for one if I were you.


Ok thanks. Yeh I got gloves and anti stat strap. Just building up the courage to do it.


----------



## invincible20xx

i seriously want to delid guys but i'm so freakin afraid, is there any fail proof method ? or at least the most mooooooost safe method of them all please reply !


----------



## MegaHertz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i seriously want to delid guys but i'm so freakin afraid, is there any fail proof method ? or at least the most mooooooost safe method of them all please reply !


take your time, take breaks, watch videos, ask questions, last but not least, dont be scared

its not easy its not hard, just treat it as a $320 chip you bought and just imagine how easy it is to damage it IF you dont care.

you should be fine if you do it proper


----------



## Solonowarion

Any use a heat gun to warm up the glue to slizice it easier?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i seriously want to delid guys but i'm so freakin afraid, is there any fail proof method ? or at least the most mooooooost safe method of them all please reply !


No, nothing is fail proof. If you do everything you should prior to delidding I would say you have a 90%+ chance. If you hurry at all, don't prepare all the way, or use any of the wrong tools, then that percentage goes down measurably.

one sided razor, made for shaving not utility
rubber surgical gloves
a clean not static place to do it where you won't be disturbed at all
good lighting - it can be hard to see which is the best corner to start
pick the corner with the most gap between the IHS and pcb
very slowly get the middle of the razor in the gap, angle it up toward the IHS, away from the pcb
don't ever use the edges of the razor, just rock it back and forth
draw lines on the IHS if it helps - look at pics in Swag's guide- don't go too far
don't try to get the razor in the side of the chip, just the corners
you can reach the sides from the corners if you are careful
take your time, go slow, take a break if need be

Good luck.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> So its okay to handle the bottom though?
> 
> I like handling bottoms.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> idk if i import it maybe it will get lost in the way i live faaaaaaarrrr away from those nice cute little liquid pro filled syringes


Yeah, I can see where you're coming from.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i seriously want to delid guys but i'm so freakin afraid, is there any fail proof method ? or at least the most mooooooost safe method of them all please reply !


Cut one corner open using a flexible gillette type razor, form a U shape with it and make the curved part in the middle fit under the ihs with good care, to avoid nicking the pcb. After that's done continue with a plastic card, a thin one would do.

And get CLU from ebay or performance-pcs.com, it'll get to you fine, and shipping via first class is cheap. I payed 5 bucks in shipping plus the CLP cost.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i seriously want to delid guys but i'm so freakin afraid, is there any fail proof method ? or at least the most mooooooost safe method of them all please reply !


Ill send you a pm when I go home in an hour and a half with my very detailed method and a couple pictures I made. I'm on my phone right now so when I get on my computer ill send it. Stay tuned!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52* View Post
> 
> Well just arrived from work and at 1,55V @ 5Ghz I can run superPI 32M in 6min 45s
> but google chrome refuses to open and when I lanched OCCT, BSOD instantly.
> 
> I guess for cinebench I would need 1,6 or more and I won't go there.
> 
> So, what do you guys think ? return it ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, return it...it's pretty lousy really, my former chip which was not good would do 32m at 1.48v and 5.1ghz with 1.52v. Could boot 5.2 without delidding at 1.55v or so.
> I'm getting a new one next Thursday, hope it's a good one, maybe you can get yours by then as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice results, now go for 5ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (magic number xD)










...that's why I suggested to snowfree52 to run Cinebench earlier - with a vcore cap on - it tells you very quickly whether your chip can sustain demanding operations at a given speed....a good range finder in my book to start dialing in a system before fine tuning and longer-runs of stress-testing via XTU.

...for *snowfree52*, this won't be an easy decision because his chip is certainly not a bad one - just not as good as he wants to be to run 5 GHz sustained. The question is whether the next chip he gets will be better or worse...if you have a chance to ask the retailer to line up 3770K boxes, try to go for *'Costa Rica' series 3229C or later*...good luck


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> idk if i import it maybe it will get lost in the way i live faaaaaaarrrr away from those nice cute little liquid pro filled syringes


I was surprised how cheap shipping was directly from the Coollabs online store. Just ordered two more syringes of CLU and shipping was less than EUR6 to Australia, and arrived within 2 weeks.


----------



## Icydead

As I slowly read through the increasing number of the new posts, more and more cant I believe Ive successfully delidded my cpu. I bought it only month ago. And when I was cutting through the top of the IHS, I applied too much pressure and went through like if it was a butter. In that moment I thought I killed my chip. Who knows what stopped my hand, but it wasnt me and as I discovered when I took off the IHS, it wasnt the Die either. But it definitely sounded like I chipped half of the Die. It was kinda hard as all of the corners were too tight. When I was doing it I was listening to the video guide posted on the first side. I dont want to do anything like this ever again


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> I was surprised how cheap shipping was directly from the Coollabs online store. Just ordered two more syringes of CLU and shipping was less than EUR6 to Australia, and arrived within 2 weeks.


...same here to Canada...6 tubes of CL (-U and -P) took a bit longer than two weeks but the actual process with PayPal credit card etc was very smooth...placing an order and paying for it took about 5 min


----------



## stickg1

A lot of fresh fish in the Delidded Thread lately, I like it. Happy Delidding!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Congrats to everyone who has successfully delidded recently! Its not an aesy thing to achieve. Especially the first time!


----------



## BradleyW

Which is the best way to quickly find an error on an unstable OC?
Also, what is the *average* voltage needed for 4.5GHz?
Thank you.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Which is the best way to quickly find an error on an unstable OC?
> Also, what is the *average* voltage needed for 4.5GHz?
> Thank you.


We don't have enough accurate data to state a mean or mode, but I think most would agree that around 1.25v is a reasonable estimate of the median.

I run Prime95 torture test, custom, change it to 8k by 8k, and memory to 90% of available. Have event viewer up to look for any WHEA warnings. If it can go 15 minutes then go down voltage until it can't pass, then notch it back up and do a regular longer test.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Nice job Belial, temp drop looks good.
> 34 hours of Prime95 with almost 1.5v. If you run that voltage 24/7 and do Prime95 24+ hours test every now and again to check stability over time, you should be able to figure out if that degrades an Ivy chip or not.
> 
> I hope it doesn't, but there are those people that believe 24 hours of Prime is terrible for your chip at any time, and others that think 1.5v 24/7 will degrade it also. If you are doing both and don't get noticeable degradation then you will be able to prove Ivy is a lot stronger than they think.


Thanks.

I do a lot of streaming which is basically running your cpu at 100% for hours on end (which is why stability is important to me, but i dont have important data so if i had to wipe my drive i wouldnt think twice).

People might say 1.5v is much but that is because they are worried about temps. There have been *zero* reports of degradation on ivy bridge with people doing up to 1.5-1.6v. if one of those guys comes here and says they got degradation at 1.499v, maybe I'll consider stepping it back but I seriously doubt it.

I don't really see 1.499v as very extreme either. I'd say it's definitely the max on what most people consider a limit, 1.5v, ha, but really i'm pretty sure 1.5-1.6v is fine. Obviously no one knows for sure but so far people are doing so good on 1.5-1.6v, so i dont think there's any logical reason to believe 1.5-1.6v is dangerous. Now temps can be a problem, but I'm keeping quite toasy so the main concern is not there for me (i'm definitely not running cold on p95, but it's not too hot).
Quote:


> today I successfully delidded my 3570k and I used MX-2 on DIE, until Liquid Pro/Ultra arrives. I have a lapped IHS and I am using Noctua NH-D14 and my question is, can I use Liquid Pro/Ultra on lapped IHS and if yes, would there be some problems when I would want to take the cooler off after some time ? Same question applies if I use it on DIE.


There is no problem. CLU comes off just fine, you might need to use the supplied soft-scrubber, or metal polish, if it's been there for a while but it's really not difficult or permanent.
Quote:


> Now I can do 5.0 at 1.41v and max core temps of 72, 76, 74, 72 with Prime95 and an off the shelf cooler.


Have you run a custom blend prime95 and made sure you have no Kernel-WHEA or WHEALOGGER errors? Because if you can really do 5ghz at 24hours+ p95 with no errors of any kind, that would mean you have an absolutely golden chip. I have a hard time belieiving you are really stable at that voltage...

I mean I can do [email protected], and I can even pass multiple hours of prime95. However I'll get tons of whea errors and I'll fail before 24 hours.

Also it's a lot easier to do that on Extreme LLC... because Extreme LLC feeds a ton of extra voltage (and heat) to your chip, but on software it looks like you are using a lower vcore, but in reality (which you can measure with a DMM), it's way more.

Like my 5ghz overclock, was stable on:
+.34 Offset High LLC (DMM = 1.51v)
+.285 Offset Turbo LLC (DMM = 1.499v)
+.265 Offset Extreme LLC (DMM = 1.53v)

High didn't increase voltage much but I needed a really high voltage to be stable on high. Extreme added a ton of extra heat, and even though my CPU-Z said I was stable at like 1.48v, in reality I was at 1.53v.
Quote:


> Would it be okay to put some painters tpe on the bottom of thechip for esie handling.


There would be nothing wrong with that, and I'd say it's a great idea if it wasn't for the fact that there's no reason for you to do that in the first place. Well maybe, dont want static to go through the contacts on the bottom... but just discharge yourself before touching cpu, don't work on a carpet, don't wear socks... i mean even all that should really be fine, just dont be stupid.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

How do I use event viewer? Is that going to show errors that p95 isn't going to show me?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Have you run a custom blend prime95 and made sure you have no Kernel-WHEA or WHEALOGGER errors? Because if you can really do 5ghz at 24hours+ p95 with no errors of any kind, that would mean you have an absolutely golden chip. I have a hard time belieiving you are really stable at that voltage...
> .


Actually I don't think it is all that good, there are others who can do 5.0 at under 1.4v. It is stable at 4.8 with under 1.3v. I am at the wall though, I haven't tried too hard but it looks like 5.1 would be at least 1.5v. Like you I am very picky about stability. I switched some stuff around so I am test testing my good chip for the second time. Prime95, torture test, custom, change only the memory used to 90%. I always have the event view up to check for anything that pops up while testing.

My voltage in manual is 1.41, I am testing offset now, so with rounding and such it results in a vCore of 1.41 to 1.424 in Hardware Monitor. My digital multimeter reads 1.414. I don't think it is Prim95 24 hour stable, I know it is. As for more than that, I have not had any instability in using the computer, but I haven't tried folding.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> How do I use event viewer? Is that going to show errors that p95 isn't going to show me?


Click on the start button, type "event" click on Event Viewer. Then click Custom Views -> Administrative Events. If your computer is running properly there should be nothing occurring in there. There are many things that will pop up, especially when you are testing, but you should know why each Error or Warning comes up. It takes a lot of googling to find the reason for some of them.

With specific regard to overclocking, if you see any WHEA warnings event id 19 internal parity error, that means your overclock is unstable even if Prime95 is running fine. Usually just means you need more vCore.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Click on the start button, type "event" click on Event Viewer. Then click Custom Views -> Administrative Events. If your computer is running properly there should be nothing occurring in there. There are many things that will pop up, especially when you are testing, but you should know why each Error or Warning comes up. It takes a lot of googling to find the reason for some of them.
> 
> With specific regard to overclocking, if you see any WHEA warnings event id 19 internal parity error, that means your overclock is unstable even if Prime95 is running fine. Usually just means you need more vCore.


Ok thanks! I'll start looking at that. I'm very picky about stability so I'm sure you just made my life a living hell hahaha


----------



## lilchronic

im prime95 stable @ 5 ghz with 1.36v-1.38v, but i need 1.39v - 1.41v. to be completley whea error free. last time i hade a whea error was when crysis 3 came out. since i mostly got them from gaming


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## MegaHertz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im prime95 stable @ 5 ghz with 1.36v-1.38v, but i need 1.39v - 1.41v. to be completley whea error free. last time i hade a whea error was when crysis 3 came out. since i mostly get them from gaming
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


thats sick, i cant even hit 4.9 at 1.5v on my SB, cant wait till i get my 3770k


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So just for the hell of it I tried booting at 5Ghz at 1.5v and I blue screened as it was going into windows

Now I just want to buy another chip I'm bummed. On the brighter side of things I've gotten my overclock of 4.6Ghz down to 1.28v and it is supposedly stable. I'll know for sure in the morning. Then I have my interview and hopefully my CLU will be at home when I get back.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Nvm not stable at 1.28 I'm back up to 1.3v and testing that.


----------



## ryboto

So, I'm thermally limited, I believe, and am considering delidding.... right now I can do 4.5ghz with 1.18vcore, but going up my temps climb pretty fast. I need some encouragement to go for it and rip the top off....

If I do, is the consensus to use Liquid Pro between the IHS and die?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> So, I'm thermally limited, I believe, and am considering delidding.... right now I can do 4.5ghz with 1.18vcore, but going up my temps climb pretty fast. I need some encouragement to go for it and rip the top off....
> 
> If I do, is the consensus to use Liquid Pro between the IHS and die?


You should use liquid ultra because it is easier to spread and to take off.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Actually I don't think it is all that good, there are others who can do 5.0 at under 1.4v. It is stable at 4.8 with under 1.3v. I am at the wall though, I haven't tried too hard but it looks like 5.1 would be at least 1.5v. Like you I am very picky about stability. I switched some stuff around so I am test testing my good chip for the second time. Prime95, torture test, custom, change only the memory used to 90%. I always have the event view up to check for anything that pops up while testing.


Yea but [email protected] or less is really, really rare, like you can count on one hand kinda thing... Nice chip then.
Quote:


> Ok thanks! I'll start looking at that. I'm very picky about stability so I'm sure you just made my life a living hell hahaha


dont forget about kernel-whea errors too (event viewer->windows->kernelwhea
Quote:


> So, I'm thermally limited, I believe, and am considering delidding.... right now I can do 4.5ghz with 1.18vcore, but going up my temps climb pretty fast. I need some encouragement to go for it and rip the top off....
> 
> If I do, is the consensus to use Liquid Pro between the IHS and die?


First off, Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra > Pro. Why would you get pro, someone did a test showing that Ultra and Pro are the same, slightly favored towards Ultra (within margin of error) but ultra is way easier to use and is way newer than Pro. Ultra is literally Pro version 2.0. Why would you use version 1.0 when 2.0 is out (dont say window 7 vs 8, 8 wasn't a big upgrade and frankly we should be using 8, just right now nothing utilizes it enough to really warrant changing to if you already got 7).

And to see how good your chip is and if it's worth delidding - boot at 1.3v. Then, use a software program to overclock your cpu - if you can hit 5ghz without crashing in 10 seconds, you got a decent chip. If you can do 5.1, it's an amazing chip (for reference, I have [email protected] 34+ hours of prime95 stable, but I cannot get to 5.1ghz). If you can only do 4.6, 4.7, then it's a bad chip. 4.8 isn't really worth delidding unless you really want to, 4.9, sure.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> So, I'm thermally limited, I believe, and am considering delidding.... right now I can do 4.5ghz with 1.18vcore, but going up my temps climb pretty fast. I need some encouragement to go for it and rip the top off....
> 
> If I do, is the consensus to use Liquid Pro between the IHS and die?


I like ultra since it comes with brushes, and it is a little easier to handle. I am not sure anyone has shown conclusively which is better thermally between pro and ultra.

If 4.5 is really stable at 1.18 that is a good chip and probably worth delidding. If you have done your research, prepared yourself properly, and can afford a new chip should the worst happen, you should definitely do it. My second chip isn't even that good, but I delidded so I could go from 4.6 to 4.8 and measurably reduce my temps.


----------



## Belial

^ Some guy did conclusively test it. Forgot his name, he posts in this thread often and has some southpark avatar. Just google clu vs clp basically, he threw it up on anandtech forums too.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> So, I'm thermally limited, I believe, and am considering delidding.... right now I can do 4.5ghz with 1.18vcore, but going up my temps climb pretty fast. I need some encouragement to go for it and rip the top off....
> 
> If I do, is the consensus to use Liquid Pro between the IHS and die?


Think of it like this man..."I need to look like Arnold but not sure if I should use steroids, humpf".








We got the whole workout club crew in here it seems.









You got a pretty good chip it seems, try to see how much juice it needs to boot at 5ghz and run superpi 32m without errors. If it's below 1.4v you should definitely delid it.
And yeah, try either Liquid Pro or Ultra on the die. I prefer Pro after trying out both, cause Pro is easier to spread and the syringe comes with a useful needle that can help in case you go overboard and need to suck some paste back in the tube.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> And yeah, try either Liquid Pro or Ultra on the die. I prefer Pro after trying out both, cause Pro is easier to spread and the syringe comes with a useful needle that can help in case you go overboard and need to suck some paste back in the tube.


Thanks for reminding me about that.
The syringe on Ultra is big, it is very easy to squeeze out too much - way too much for the die in fact. The easiest way to deal with this in my opinion is to carefully push the ultra to the end of the syringe without any actually coming out. Then dip in the included brush, just to get a little bit on it, and then paint the die.


----------



## kesawi

I think if you're stuck with a chip that doesn't overclock well and gets high temps under load like mine did, it's still worth delliding just to have it run cooler so I can run a quieter system.


----------



## Valgaur

MASSIVE WALL OF TEXT BEWARE! AND I WARNED YOU!









First off sorry for my absence I have been sick and am on spring break and decided to take a few days away from people and go snow camping by sleeping in my own man made igloo and go cross country snowkiting (google it)









didn't quite expect 270 posts though!









Secondly, Congratz to all the approved new additions to the club here!







Job well done all of you!









NOW READ MAH WALL OF TEXT!!!










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> I found doing the above plus applying some isopropyl alcohol to the PCB also helped to get the glue off.


A credit card that is around a year old and nice and warm from your buttox really does wonders as:

1. It's already maliable from being warm and somewhat used.
2. Has a nice good edge that can't harm the traces nor the PCB in any way, I used a credit card myself as well, worked beautifully.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...the joys of deliddedness.*..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...as tricky as delidding can be, it certainly has its upsides...when I was first sent to this thread by PCWargamer, I thought these folks are 'nuts'...better get a *chastity belt* for my CPU socket before I do something stupid - like take a razor blade to a perfectly good CPU that ran fast at low 'v' @ 5GHz plus...
> 
> ...well, I did something stupid, and there was also blood, a few scratches and divine intervention
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What it did was to unleash a whole new performance envelope because now I could deal with temps when doing extensive, longer bench runs...a few more investments (ROG Maximums V Extreme, custom water loop etc) enabled more performance - but by far the biggest 'enabler for the results below' was the delidding...so *thanks Valgaur* for running a nice thread with great info which really helped get me there...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...joined HWBot just two days ago, and yet got well over 20 world records in the enthusiast class for my video setup, though some extended beyond that...most of the time, my scores are smack in the middle of overclocked 680ies and 7970ies - and thanks to delidding, I can now compete against 3930ies 6 core / 12 thread machines running @ 5 GHz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The best part is that in those two days, I got *over a 100 points* for the *Overclock.net team* at HWbot ...a few more runs left for tomorrow - and this system is not yet fully maxed as I have to lap and straighten out a slightly crooked IHS, not to mention one of the 4 GPUs which really should be RMA'ed because of power leakage and does not perform well at all...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...so if you are considering delidding, carefully study the process, cost and benefits - and ENJOY the outcome (hopefully)...either way, best of luck


About time I see someone posts some great results from their delidding and what they really did with it besides getting a good OC and amazing temps! Very nicely done sir!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Attention: Valgaur
> I officially submit my information data for [Official] Delidded Ivy Bridge Club Membership:
> 
> OCN name: ................ TonicX
> CPU: .......................... i3770K
> on die-TIM: ................. CoolLaboratory Ultra
> ihs-TIM: ..................... CoolLaboratory Ultra
> Mhz gained: ............... 400.1 MgHz
> OC after delid: ............ 5200.1 MgHz
> Temp drops: ............... 15* [ Hottest Core #3 before = 81* after = 66* @4500 intel burn test]
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: .... http://valid.canardpc.com/2726703
> 
> Additionally, I Lapped the IHS completely flat top and bottom starting with 360 and 400 then 800 finally 1600 sandpaper.
> 
> I am looking forward to active participation in this Forum. I will freely share any other delidded data with you and those in persuit of performance!
> 
> Attachment 1
> 
> > OCN name on a piece.JPG
> Attachment 2
> 
> > 4500 pre delid.JPG
> Attachment 3
> 
> > 4500 post delid.JPG
> Attachment 4
> 
> > 5200.1_OCmax_TonicX.JPG


You're In!







Add This new Sig to your Sig list already!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where's Val and Swag?


Was wondering when someone would miss me!







I believe he is still sick, Swag that is.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> So i decided to jump the gun and try deliding my 3770k and i am really happy i did. I forgot to take a pic of my before temps but i have my after temps and i can say its a huge decrease per core in temperature.
> I was kinda scared when i turned the machine back on to see the same temps as before idle but as soon as i cranked up some Prime95 the new TIM kicked in amazingly. Here are my pics from my work and my new temps.
> 
> Temps before deliding were 89c 95c 96c 92c some times it would spike to almost 100c.
> 
> OCN name: Rucka315
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: none
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz
> Temp drops: 25c or more
> 
> If you have any questions go ahead and ask i am willing to answer what ever i can.


You're In!







Slap that new sig onto your list!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Yet again i cleaned the socket and whipped/blew out the dust before putting back in the cooler any non trolls on this site damn.


Sorry about that lol sometimes we get heated up and snap at some people here, just take it as advice if you ever see posts like that on here, usually thats how it's meant to be.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Ok thanks all for the congrats i got scared that it was going to be nothing but trolls clowing my dust lol. I'm currently working on a 5ghz oc wish me luck im really close to getting a stable vcore.


Hurry up on that CPUZ for the 5 giggles already!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Attention Moderators:
> in reference to my submission-
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508
> 
> I have a cpu-z validation with my correct username @:
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2726957
> 
> Thanks-alot! I could not have done it with-out you!


Gots it!







ATLEAST SOMEONE TELLS ME THEY WANT AN UPDATE FOR MAX OC IN HERE!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Thanks for the explaination but I am not sure I understand,
> You say my chip is terrible and you're not alone
> 
> but you also say 50% of the chips out there won't go past 4,5 -4,6 Ghz at 1,45V
> Mine is stable at 4,8Ghz @ 1,45V
> 
> therefore I'd say it's better thant at least 50% of the chips out there, let's say 70% ??
> 
> That means, even if I sell/return it, and buy another one I just have 30% chances of getting a better one, and 70% of getting a worse one ?


Completely agree with you here. no way 50% are that high of voltages, The average for 4.5-4.7 is around 1.25-1.3 for 4.5 and around 1.4-1.43 vcore for 4.7 on here. It's all a huge lottery for chips lately with the vcore so it's all up to you really, honestl for a normal gaming rig and nothing crazy I'd run your current OC and be happy with it and get some nice good temp drops, but thas just my thoughts as the Captain







Just remember it's your rig, it's ment to please you (shut up, I know what you thought there!) not others.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> OCN name: Belial88
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: ~200mhz
> OC after delid: [email protected] (1.499DMM)
> Temp drops: ~23*C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2727595
> 
> 34 Hours Prime95 Custom Blend 80%+ Ram Tested, Above Normal Priority, no Kerneal/Logger WHEA errors.


Now fold for a month straight and then i'll be impressed with that stress test, not being mean but prime does mean crap to me.

Anyways







You're In!







Slap that Sig on now! Nice temp drops by the way.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *clayer*
> 
> hi. can you add me please.
> 
> delidded and lapped liquid pro on all surfaces currently at 4.7oc max temp late 50s
> 
> custom loop 1x360 2x240 1x120/twin d5 res combo.


Add you how? You're missing half the stuff I need sill! first page of the thread has what you need to fill out, or atlas give me your temp drops and your CPUZ for max OC, all in one post please, almost 14K posts here, not hunting through them all








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha this made me lol. Yes it is ok you BETTER buy an anti stattic bracelet though. I refuse to touch anything in my computer without one. Even if you are wearing gloves there could be a rip in one and you can still send some static to your $330 chip. Id pay $5 for one if I were you.


Any type of rubber touching a human body immediately gets rid of any type of static in the body so a tear isn't a problem at all, also you get better control with being able to actually touch every side of the CPU when you have those gloves on.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I avoid touching the underside of the chip at all times. If you are not wearing gloves your hands always have dirt, oil, and dead skin cells on them. Even if you are, I always feel more comfortable handling the chip by the edges.


Same with myself except while wearing those gloves I don't have any issues with touching the bottom but I still try to keep it at a minimum








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Ok thanks. Yeh I got gloves and anti stat strap. Just building up the courage to do it.


Wel hurry up and Make your CPU seemed loved and make it run nice and cool! Then it will love you right back!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Any use a heat gun to warm up the glue to slizice it easier?


By the time you could be able to hold it and try not to over heat the silicon and not ruin the CPU it's way beyond worth it, besides the glue is meant to handle crazy heat as it is.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> A lot of fresh fish in the Delidded Thread lately, I like it. Happy Delidding!


I like it as well! Lots of fresh blood! wait.... I mean new members!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Congrats to everyone who has successfully delidded recently! Its not an aesy thing to achieve. Especially the first time!


Glad you're finally in here sir!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im prime95 stable @ 5 ghz with 1.36v-1.38v, but i need 1.39v - 1.41v. to be completley whea error free. last time i hade a whea error was when crysis 3 came out. since i mostly got them from gaming
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


My reason why I hate prime as a stability test, people tote 24+ hour runs and then play a game for 30 minutes and then say I need more vcore I guess and then re prime. How about people learn what real stability is and what you really need it for. Sorry that's my grumble for the day








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> ^ Some guy did conclusively test it. Forgot his name, he posts in this thread often and has some southpark avatar. Just google clu vs clp basically, he threw it up on anandtech forums too.


it's in the OP for a reason in the list of TIM's and their heat movement.


TO ALL THE PEOPLE I DIDNT GET WITH THEIR SUBMISSIONS TO THIS CLUB LET ME KNOW!









Also if their was anything I missed int he last 260-300 posts that needs my attention let me know lol


----------



## Belial

^ bleh. dunno about that. You'd be lucky to get 100-200mhz out of your chip if you delid a bad overclocker, and that's only after pushing extreme voltages. I could either do 4.4ghz @ 1.33v, which is still an insane voltage for just 4.4, or give it up to about 1.5v for 4.6ghz.

I mean to do that, you'd need to spend WAY more money on a motherboard, WAY more on cooling, it's just not worth it.

I got 2 computers

on my bad chip, I spent $30 on an nzxt havik heatsink (and even that I'd say is too much money spent), $20 on a crap motherboard that was on sale (it's a really, really bad board, holy crap are msi boards terrible quality, you can just tell by feeling it compared to another one, but hard to beat $20)... no extra fans, nothing else. It isn't worth spending a ton of money for a board to push more voltage, a better cooler, accessory fans and pastes and stuff for cooling, on a chip that *might* get 100,200mhz only after you push an insane voltage through it.

on my good chip, I spent $80 on a z77x-ud5h, a high quality motherboard, $43 on an nh-d14, $30 on another 140mm fan, $10 on CLU, $20 on extra case fans... and it's definitely worth spending ~$150 for a cpu that can push a good 400mhz further on a delid and good cooling and good motherboard.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Now fold for a month straight and then i'll be impressed with that stress test, not being mean but prime does mean crap to me.
> 
> Anyways You're In! Slap that Sig on now! Nice temp drops by the way.


Folding for a month vs Prime95 for a month? Surely prime95 is a better stress test right?

If folding is a good stress test, I'd love to try it out. I think I've mentioned it before, but Folding is a bunch of crap and meaningless (according to a few friends of mine who actually work in protein folding and structural biology and the reputation pande has in the field as a sort of... not sure, it's like the guy from angry birds taking credit and being on the front cover of a cpu architecture journal). They said if their boss caught them running [email protected] they'd get in a lot of trouble lol. Like pande isn't respected by more established guys in the field.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> MASSIVE WALL OF TEXT BEWARE! AND I WARNED YOU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First off sorry for my absence I have been sick and am on spring break and decided to take a few days away from people and go snow camping by sleeping in my own man made igloo and go cross country snowkiting (google it)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> didn't quite expect 270 posts though!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Secondly, Congratz to all the approved new additions to the club here!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Job well done all of you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> NOW READ MAH WALL OF TEXT!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> A credit card that is around a year old and nice and warm from your buttox really does wonders as:
> 
> 1. It's already maliable from being warm and somewhat used.
> 2. Has a nice good edge that can't harm the traces nor the PCB in any way, I used a credit card myself as well, worked beautifully.
> About time I see someone posts some great results from their delidding and what they really did with it besides getting a good OC and amazing temps! Very nicely done sir!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Add This new Sig to your Sig list already!
> Was wondering when someone would miss me!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe he is still sick, Swag that is.
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap that new sig onto your list!
> Sorry about that lol sometimes we get heated up and snap at some people here, just take it as advice if you ever see posts like that on here, usually thats how it's meant to be.
> Hurry up on that CPUZ for the 5 giggles already!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gots it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ATLEAST SOMEONE TELLS ME THEY WANT AN UPDATE FOR MAX OC IN HERE!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Completely agree with you here. no way 50% are that high of voltages, The average for 4.5-4.7 is around 1.25-1.3 for 4.5 and around 1.4-1.43 vcore for 4.7 on here. It's all a huge lottery for chips lately with the vcore so it's all up to you really, honestl for a normal gaming rig and nothing crazy I'd run your current OC and be happy with it and get some nice good temp drops, but thas just my thoughts as the Captain
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just remember it's your rig, it's ment to please you (shut up, I know what you thought there!) not others.
> Now fold for a month straight and then i'll be impressed with that stress test, not being mean but prime does mean crap to me.
> 
> Anyways
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap that Sig on now! Nice temp drops by the way.
> Add you how? You're missing half the stuff I need sill! first page of the thread has what you need to fill out, or atlas give me your temp drops and your CPUZ for max OC, all in one post please, almost 14K posts here, not hunting through them all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any type of rubber touching a human body immediately gets rid of any type of static in the body so a tear isn't a problem at all, also you get better control with being able to actually touch every side of the CPU when you have those gloves on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same with myself except while wearing those gloves I don't have any issues with touching the bottom but I still try to keep it at a minimum
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wel hurry up and Make your CPU seemed loved and make it run nice and cool! Then it will love you right back!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By the time you could be able to hold it and try not to over heat the silicon and not ruin the CPU it's way beyond worth it, besides the glue is meant to handle crazy heat as it is.
> I like it as well! Lots of fresh blood! wait.... I mean new members!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glad you're finally in here sir!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My reason why I hate prime as a stability test, people tote 24+ hour runs and then play a game for 30 minutes and then say I need more vcore I guess and then re prime. How about people learn what real stability is and what you really need it for. Sorry that's my grumble for the day
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it's in the OP for a reason in the list of TIM's and their heat movement.
> 
> 
> TO ALL THE PEOPLE I DIDNT GET WITH THEIR SUBMISSIONS TO THIS CLUB LET ME KNOW!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also if their was anything I missed int he last 260-300 posts that needs my attention let me know lol


Valgaur is back...yeah ! Glad you enjoyed your snow camping and snow-kiting ! We wanted to go camping a couple weekends back in the mountains near Whistler, but off the main runs it's all severe avalanche warnings, as it is in much of British Columbia right now....thanks for your comments on my hwbot runs above...I only delidded in the first place to go fast, and I mean more than reading emails @ 5+ giggles...

btw, snow-kiting must be fun in North Dakota - lots of icy winds


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...that's why I suggested to snowfree52 to run Cinebench earlier - with a vcore cap on - it tells you very quickly whether your chip can sustain demanding operations at a given speed....a good range finder in my book to start dialing in a system before fine tuning and longer-runs of stress-testing via XTU.
> 
> ...for *snowfree52*, this won't be an easy decision because his chip is certainly not a bad one - just not as good as he wants to be to run 5 GHz sustained. The question is whether the next chip he gets will be better or worse...if you have a chance to ask the retailer to line up 3770K boxes, try to go for *'Costa Rica' series 3229C or later*...good luck


I guess I would need something around 1,6-1,65V to run cinebench at 5Ghz.

with my actual chip, max I can do is 4,6 @ 1,30V
4,8 needs 1,45V and I don't want that 24/24 even if stable.

I already ordered a new chip and I hope it's better than mine.

Still, the new one should arrive on Thursday or Friday and I have to send my actual chip before end of saturday, that means hopefully I have friday enening to test the new chip and decide wich one I send back on saturday









My batch number on the actual chip is : 3240C294 from costa rica
and my friend's batch (his chip was hot as hell, so he returned it too) : 3228B967


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> ^ bleh. dunno about that. You'd be lucky to get 100-200mhz out of your chip if you delid a bad overclocker, and that's only after pushing extreme voltages. I could either do 4.4ghz @ 1.33v, which is still an insane voltage for just 4.4, or give it up to about 1.5v for 4.6ghz.
> 
> I mean to do that, you'd need to spend WAY more money on a motherboard, WAY more on cooling, it's just not worth it.


My point is that delidding is stil beneficial if you have a bad chip under certain circumstances. If you already have high temperatures to begin with (like I did) and you can't swap the chip over for a better one and are stuck with it (like I was) then there is still an advantage in delidding just to get the lower temperatures even if you don't get any actual overclock gain. For some 4.2 or 4.3GHz is enough of an existing performance gain for what they do with their PC. Delidding (provided you don't screw it up) is a cheap cooling upgrade. I went from 91C to 60C and probably would needed to invest $300 in a custom water cooling loop to get a similar reduction. In doing so I've probably gained a 10dB reduction in cooling noise by being able to run my fans slower, which is totally worth it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Folding for a month vs Prime95 for a month? Surely prime95 is a better stress test right?
> 
> If folding is a good stress test, I'd love to try it out. I think I've mentioned it before, but Folding is a bunch of crap and meaningless (according to a few friends of mine who actually work in protein folding and structural biology and the reputation pande has in the field as a sort of... not sure, it's like the guy from angry birds taking credit and being on the front cover of a cpu architecture journal). They said if their boss caught them running [email protected] they'd get in a lot of trouble lol. Like pande isn't respected by more established guys in the field.


As a family member who has had a few deaths in the family due to Cancer and other diseases and not having the financial means to donate money to the cure of those diseases, yet having a high end compuper, It makes me feel good to try and contribute to helping other members of my family to hope fully be better treated from those diseases.

On the stability side, [email protected] is much more intensive as each wu you get or test I guess you can call them are each different even though the numbers are the name the stress is different due to the differences in the proteins and the 3d modeling and how your CPU handles each one. That's why through all of the possible tests you can get through on folding it's a much better testing platform than prime.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Valgaur is back...yeah ! Glad you enjoyed your snow camping and snow-kiting ! We wanted to go camping a couple weekends back in the mountains near Whistler, but off the main runs it's all severe avalanche warnings, as it is in much of British Columbia right now....thanks for your comments on my hwbot runs above...I only delidded in the first place to go fast, and I mean more than reading emails @ 5+ giggles...
> 
> btw, snow-kiting must be fun in North Dakota - lots of icy winds


Yeah I just want to snag those GPU's of your's for a while, can I??







Yeah Nodak is amazing for going snow-kiting, you guys should try it, great way to get outside and feel really active.


----------



## snowfree52

Anyway, does a CPU need a break in or does it deliver full power out of the box ?


----------



## Belial

5.1ghz takes too much voltage. I can pass prime95 probably for 24 hours on like around 1.48v but i get whea errors and i was still getting whea errors within 10 minutes at 1.54v so i'm going to stick with [email protected]

If I had a better cooler, like a high end closed loop (lq320, kraken 240), i would do it but it's not worth getting such an expensive cooler for just 100mhz to push an extreme voltage.

Sorry guys.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Anyway, does a CPU need a break in or does it deliver full power out of the box ?


no break in.
Quote:


> As a family member who has had a few deaths in the family due to Cancer and other diseases and not having the financial means to donate money to the cure of those diseases, yet having a high end compuper, It makes me feel good to try and contribute to helping other members of my family to hope fully be better treated from those diseases.


Im not going to get into this publicly. If you want me to tell you why folding is the wrong way to do this, PM me.

Although, folding might be relevant for parkinsons.
Quote:


> On the stability side, [email protected] is much more intensive as each wu you get or test I guess you can call them are each different even though the numbers are the name the stress is different due to the differences in the proteins and the 3d modeling and how your CPU handles each one. That's why through all of the possible tests you can get through on folding it's a much better testing platform than prime.


How long does that take, to run through all the possible tests?
Quote:


> My point is that delidding is stil beneficial if you have a bad chip under certain circumstances. If you already have high temperatures to begin with (like I did) and you can't swap the chip over for a better one and are stuck with it (like I was) then there is still an advantage in delidding just to get the lower temperatures even if you don't get any actual overclock gain. For some 4.2 or 4.3GHz is enough of an existing performance gain for what they do with their PC. Delidding (provided you don't screw it up) is a cheap cooling upgrade. I went from 91C to 60C and probably would needed to invest $300 in a custom water cooling loop to get a similar reduction. In doing so I've probably gained a 10dB reduction in cooling noise by being able to run my fans slower, which is totally worth it.


I delidded my bad chip, but that's because I enjoy delidding and I see very little risk. The temps were very low, the overclock is low. Rationally, it was not a good decision, but i did it for fun. You should be able to do 4.4-4.6ghz no matter how bad your chip is or your aftermarket cooler is though. What overclock were you running?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok finally got 4.6Ghz pretty stable. No WHEA errors or p95 errors in the six and a half hours I ran it. So I'm just going to call this my before picture with mx4 on the die. I'm 90% sure my CLU will be here today so I'll have an after picture posted tomorrow so you can see the difference between temps. I still need to do an extended 23 hour run, but I'll wait on doing that because I actually feel like doing a little gaming.


----------



## ryboto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> And to see how good your chip is and if it's worth delidding - boot at 1.3v. Then, use a software program to overclock your cpu - if you can hit 5ghz without crashing in 10 seconds, you got a decent chip. If you can do 5.1, it's an amazing chip (for reference, I have [email protected] 34+ hours of prime95 stable, but I cannot get to 5.1ghz). If you can only do 4.6, 4.7, then it's a bad chip. 4.8 isn't really worth delidding unless you really want to, 4.9, sure.


I'll give it a try when I get home. I can do 4.6ghz, testing at the moment. Was promising last night for the 3 hours I had it going, but I'll know for sure tonight. I imagine I'll thermally throttle with that voltage and frequency, you don't think so?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I like ultra since it comes with brushes, and it is a little easier to handle. I am not sure anyone has shown conclusively which is better thermally between pro and ultra.
> 
> If 4.5 is really stable at 1.18 that is a good chip and probably worth delidding. If you have done your research, prepared yourself properly, and can afford a new chip should the worst happen, you should definitely do it. My second chip isn't even that good, but I delidded so I could go from 4.6 to 4.8 and measurably reduce my temps.


I've delidded CPUs in the past, so I'm not too too worried. I am truly stable at that frequency and voltage, but with my cooler and case, I don't have the best temperatures, and I don't plan on investing in anything more extravagant.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Think of it like this man..."I need to look like Arnold but not sure if I should use steroids, humpf".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We got the whole workout club crew in here it seems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You got a pretty good chip it seems, try to see how much juice it needs to boot at 5ghz and run superpi 32m without errors. If it's below 1.4v you should definitely delid it.
> And yeah, try either Liquid Pro or Ultra on the die. I prefer Pro after trying out both, cause Pro is easier to spread and the syringe comes with a useful needle that can help in case you go overboard and need to suck some paste back in the tube.


I'll give it a try. If it does indeed boot and completes pi, I'll probably be too tempted not to do it!


----------



## invincible20xx

will surgical gloves protect the chip from static ? i don't know where to get an anti static bracelet where i live and can't get it online


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> will surgical gloves protect the chip from static ? i don't know where to get an anti static bracelet where i live and can't get it online


Yes, and they protect the chip from whatever is on your hands. Make sure to delid on a nonconductive surface, even with gloves I wouldn't want to do it on a metal desk or table.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Yes, and they protect the chip from whatever is on your hands. Make sure to delid on a nonconductive surface, even with gloves I wouldn't want to do it on a metal desk or table.


i'm planing to do it on an A4 printing paper, good ?


----------



## TonicX

I broke 10.20 on cinebench lastnight all-time personal best, ever, ... on any machine, ... in reality! really.








but that was way out too high and too hot for long animation renders(Why I need this chip- besides C.O.D.) learned alot with the asus ai2 OC gui but I dialed in 4900 @ 1.4 hard into the BIOS for a solid start and render client render beast. clockin, in the upper 60's lower 70's this is where i would like to be operating on long rendering. also i am happy with the intel turbo that tunes it all down when idle.

Thank guys for the good info on delidding, i took your advice: (1) research before you leap (2) test your chip before diving in, (3) use a THIN razor or wait till you get one (4) order some Cool Laboratory Ultra to make your chip happy(cool) as possable., not ready?... refer to advice (1).

the numbers tell me it was a success! I love to Modify stuff for less weight, aesthetics, easy access, whatever. THIS MOD .. is for performance and It literally will cut seconds, minutes and hours off of my render times.

Now I just need one more Ivy Bridge and my system will be complete... "Whoosh-whoosh of air respirator... Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,"


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i'm planing to do it on an A4 printing paper, good ?


Sure, I did that too since it is clean, but I did it on a wood table also to avoid any conductivity.


----------



## Icydead

Guys what is a better way to apply Liquid Pro on the die ? To spread it and make a very thin layer with Q-Tip supplied with paste, or just drop a little dot ? Ill put the IHS on top of it ofc.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys what is a better way to apply Liquid Pro on the die ? To spread it and make a very thin layer with Q-Tip supplied with paste, or just drop a little dot ? Ill put the IHS on top of it ofc.


spread method and have a thin layer works well,
its the best way to apply the liquid pro,
has to look a bit like this one,


i did the die, then put on the ihs to make a print to the inside ihs,
then did the inside ihs also, thin layers of course








works well with liquid pro..


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> spread method and have a thin layer works well,
> its the best way to apply the liquid pro,
> 
> i did the die, then put on the ihs to make a print to the inside ihs,
> then did the inside ihs also, thin layers of course
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> works well with liquid pro..


So a thin layer on the die is not enough ? I will make it on the inside ihs as well then







You just spreaded the left overs from the print or you added more paste when you were doing inside ihs ?


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> So a thin layer on the die is not enough ? I will make it on the inside ihs as well then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You just spreaded the left overs from the print or you added more paste when you were doing inside ihs ?


yea, or just put on a bit more on the die again if needed after you got the print on the inside ihs,
on the inside ihs ive used the print to know where to put the other layer,
its prolly not enough to use the print liquid only to cover the rectangle, have to try and see for yourselfs,
keep a eye on that the liquid pro doesnt "float" on the die, and youll be fine,
this is way to much as you can see ..lol










im not saying a thin layer isnt enough on the die only,
its the method ive used to apply mine ..lol,
i just let my 30+C tempdrop do the talking here ..haha








some others used this method also, with great results,
but one layer on die only, when done right, will give the same results..


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I broke 10.20 on cinebench lastnight all-time personal best, ever, ... on any machine, ... in reality! really.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but that was way out too high and too hot for long animation renders(Why I need this chip- besides C.O.D.) learned alot with the asus ai2 OC gui but I dialed in 4900 @ 1.4 hard into the BIOS for a solid start and render client render beast. clockin, in the upper 60's lower 70's this is where i would like to be operating on long rendering. also i am happy with the intel turbo that tunes it all down when idle.


Not sure where you at in your ocing, but please don't use AI Suite to do it. I would suggest you read Swag's guide to overclocking Ivy with an Asus mobo. It will show you every setting you need:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards

Welcome to OCN by the way, here is how to get your rig in your posts:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig


----------



## RavageTheEarth

My chip doesn't boot with 5ghz at 1.5v so I guess I'm never going to get that 5ghz OC :-( :-( :-(


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> My chip doesn't boot with 5ghz at 1.5v so I guess I'm never going to get that 5ghz OC :-( :-( :-(


don't stress yourself man, a cool stable 4.6GHz and call it a day lol









and don't forget to game the crap out of it cause you have paid twice for this !


----------



## PapaSmurf6768

My CLU just got here, hoping to join this club the next time I have to break down my loop. Can't wait for those higher OCs!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> My chip doesn't boot with 5ghz at 1.5v so I guess I'm never going to get that 5ghz OC :-( :-( :-(


i managed to let it run IBT at 5.0ghz, 1.510V vcore, but its not stable,


i need about 1.6V vcore to make it run really stable ...LOL ..thats a big no no








for benching i went alot higher then that tho,
youre trying to make 5.0ghz run 24/7 ? or just for benching?


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yea, or just put on a bit more on the die again if needed after you got the print on the inside ihs,
> on the inside ihs ive used the print to know where to put the other layer,
> its prolly not enough to use the print liquid only to cover the rectangle, have to try and see for yourselfs,
> keep a eye on that the liquid pro doesnt "float" on the die, and youll be fine


Ok good, so I will make a thin layer on the die, then I will put on the ihs to have liquid printed on it and then I will apply a new layer there - on the inside ihs - either by using the print liquid if that would be enough, or by adding a new paste. Right ? I also assume that Q-tip supplied with paste is good to do the job.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf6768*
> 
> My CLU just got here, hoping to join this club the next time I have to break down my loop. Can't wait for those higher OCs!


Why wait??


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Ok good, so I will make a thin layer on the die, then I will put on the ihs to have liquid printed on it and then I will apply a new layer there either by using the print liquid if that would be enough, or by adding a new paste. Right ? I also assume that Q-tip supplied with paste is good to do the job.


yep, you got it








and when you use the q-tip when you apply, use the same side/spot all the time, its easier to apply that way


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> yep, you got it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and when you use the q-tip when you apply, use the same side/spot all the time, its easier to apply that way


Yea, Ive read that somewhere







Well now I should be ready thanks to your liquid 101







Now to wait until it arrives.


----------



## PapaSmurf6768

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Why wait??


Don't tempt me!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> don't stress yourself man, a cool stable 4.6GHz and call it a day lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and don't forget to game the crap out of it cause you have paid twice for this !


Haha thanks man there is so much talk on here about the infamous 5ghz OC that I sometimes forget that I still have a decent chip even though I can't hit that


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha thanks man there is so much talk on here about the infamous 5ghz OC that I sometimes forget that I still have a decent chip even though I can't hit that


yup !

man i just successfully de-lidded the pentium 4 i told you about it just needed a little more work that i done using a thin but firm card board like thingy, guess i will do my 3770k now

break the corners using a blade then continue using my ultra thin firm cardboard guess this is it !!

the most fail proof way to go about this !


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> yup !
> 
> man i just successfully de-lidded the pentium 4 i told you about it just needed a little more work that i done using a thin but firm card board like thingy, guess i will do my 3770k now
> 
> break the corners using a blade then continue using my ultra thin firm cardboard guess this is it !!
> 
> the most fail proof way to go about this !


Good job! Let us know how it goes! Good luck!!!!!!!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf6768*
> 
> Don't tempt me!


Well its too late!! Your tempted!

Btw my CLU should be here when I get home. I aready have my chip all taken apart and cleaned all it needs is the CLU on it!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> My chip doesn't boot with 5ghz at 1.5v so I guess I'm never going to get that 5ghz OC :-( :-( :-(


did u enable pll overvoltage?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf6768*
> 
> Don't tempt me!


20c temp drop!


----------



## invincible20xx

so i successfully de-lidded this pentium 4 1.7 GHz 256kb Cash without a single scratch !



now onto the i7 ?


----------



## invincible20xx

but as of now this is all i have for TIM

http://www.imagebam.com/image/01bf09243015931

Sigh


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> but as of now this is all i have for TIM
> 
> http://www.imagebam.com/image/01bf09243015931
> 
> Sigh


it's a good tim


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> it's a good tim


but not as good as clu that most likely i will not be able to get it shipped here


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> but not as good as clu that most likely i will not be able to get it shipped here


All that matters is that it is not the stock TIM. You will see temp improvements. Did you do it yet?????


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Just got home and my CLU isn't here. So impatient.

Curse you FedExxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> All that matters is that it is not the stock TIM. You will see temp improvements. Did you do it yet?????


not yet but will be doing it today in a few hours will go now get a couple of surgical gloves and a nice thin blade

i will break just one corner and swipe the ultra thin, ultra sturdy card board to pop it open like the p4, pretty sure the chance of scratching the die or the pcb this way is 0%~5%


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> not yet but will be doing it today in a few hours will go now get a couple of surgical gloves and a nice thin blade
> 
> i will break just one corner and swipe the ultra thin, ultra sturdy card board to pop it open like the p4, pretty sure the chance of scratching the die or the pcb this way is 0%~5%


huh? How are you going to delid by breaking one corner and using cardboard? I don't understand your words hahaha


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok so just to make sure when I apply the CLU I should squeeze a little out and spread a very thin layer with the brush on the die and then put the IHS on and make an imprint and then apply another very small layer onto the part of the IHS that is touching the die? Also, when applying it to the top of the IHS I should just spread a thin layer around with the brush and then put my heat sink on? Or should I apply some on the heat sink too and then put it on the IHS and screw it in?

I just want to be sure before it gets here because once it is here there is going to be nothing stopping me from putting it on.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> huh? How are you going to delid by breaking one corner and using cardboard? I don't understand your words hahaha


idk if it will work i will try it and report, i want to break one corner using the blade so as to make a an entrance point for the hard card thin card board-ish thing that i will show in the pictures and then try to swipe it between the ihs and the pcb till it comes loose i did something close to this to the pentium 4, also the card board i have is very sturdy for how thin it is and it's edge is kinda sharp idk if card board is the right word for it....

here is the blade that i will use and the piece of "card board"

http://www.imagebam.com/image/785ee1243031655 http://www.imagebam.com/image/67fd8a243031815 http://www.imagebam.com/image/211063243031974 http://www.imagebam.com/image/b5c67f243032139 http://www.imagebam.com/image/f46207243032283

is this type of blade safe to use ?


----------



## Rucka315

I suggest you get a razor like this. The one you have i tried using and i found it way to difficult to apply the right amount of pressure to penetrate the rubber glue.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> I suggest you get a razor like this. The one you have i tried using and i found it way to difficult to apply the right amount of pressure to penetrate the rubber glue.


'

but won't this wiggle and twist about so could possibly scratch the pcb due to it's flexibility !


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> I suggest you get a razor like this. The one you have i tried using and i found it way to difficult to apply the right amount of pressure to penetrate the rubber glue.


Thats the same blade i used to delid my 3770k.


----------



## Rucka315

No its going to have a protector on one side of the blade this picture is just showing it as a double sided blade.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I would use a small rectangular blade that has a grip on one side of it. You can get them at any hardware store for like 2 bucks. I tried that kind of blade the first time I did it and it was so long it was hard to have complete control over it. Some people use that kind of blade though so if you feel comfortable with it do it.


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> No its going to have a protector on one side of the blade this picture is just showing it as a double sided blade.


Mine didnt have a protector on one side. It was just like that picture.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I would use a small rectangular blade that has a grip on one side of it. You can get them at any hardware store for like 2 bucks. I tried that kind of blade the first time I did it and it was so long it was hard to have complete control over it. Some people use that kind of blade though so if you feel comfortable with it do it.


i know what you mean but i don't think it's available here

there is the double sided one available but i want a blade that is NOT flexible !


----------



## BradleyW

What part of event viewer do I need to looking at to check for errors whilst overclocking.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok so just to make sure when I apply the CLU I should squeeze a little out and spread a very thin layer with the brush on the die and then put the IHS on and make an imprint and then apply another very small layer onto the part of the IHS that is touching the die? Also, when applying it to the top of the IHS I should just spread a thin layer around with the brush and then put my heat sink on? Or should I apply some on the heat sink too and then put it on the IHS and screw it in?
> 
> I just want to be sure before it gets here because once it is here there is going to be nothing stopping me from putting it on.


There are some people who just put Ultra on one surface, and others who put it on both. If you put it on both, like I do, just do a very thin layer on the other surface. So paint the one primary side (the die and top of IHS) like the guy in the Coollabs video on their website. The you can usually just use what is left on the brush to do the secondary side (the underside of the IHS and your cooler).


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i know what you mean but i don't think it's available here
> 
> there is the double sided one available but i want a blade that is NOT flexible !


The one i used was flexible, it was good because it was super thin. I was also very careful and I took my time.


----------



## Rucka315

Well that sucks that yours didn't have a protector on one side that must have been a nightmare.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> What part of event viewer do I need to looking at to check for errors whilst overclocking.


Just posted it a few pages back:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13650#post_19501730


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Well that sucks that yours didn't have a protector on one side that must have been a nightmare.


I used tissue paper on one side so it wasnt that bad.


----------



## Rucka315

Ahh ok i guess that could work i still would be scared to cut my finger off lol.


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Ahh ok i guess that could work i still would be scared to cut my finger off lol.


I made sure to put enough so I wouldnt cut myself. The blade is super sharp.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> There are some people who just put Ultra on one surface, and others who put it on both. If you put it on both, like I do, just do a very thin layer on the other surface. So paint the one primary side (the die and top of IHS) like the guy in the Coollabs video on their website. The you can usually just use what is left on the brush to do the secondary side (the underside of the IHS and your cooler).


Ok thanks. I took every last bit of silicon glue off of the pcb on my chip so the die should be touching the IHS so I'll just apply a very thin layer to the die and then use the remaining TIM on the brush for the underside of the IHS and then put a thin layer on the top of the IHS. The fedex guy is pulling up right now!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ladies and gents,
May I remind you there's an OP where you'll find blade recommendations and more so a long video showing you the process.
As for folding: I enjoy contributing to something, I fold daily.


----------



## TonicX

Patience. i had to wait two extra days cause i used regular US Postal! but it was worth it. I use CLU with the brush on in one direction method.
see: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508

Now I am running stable and cool at 4900 MgHz not even playing around with voltages anymore, im happy with it.

I did Sub-zero my chip with an open window and paper tube to my H60 water cooler and cranked up the Vcore
Got a 5523.02 http://valid.canardpc.com/2728836

never got above 4800 predelid with IC diamond on IHS

CLU rules- i simply wont cut corners except on my chip

This screen Shot is moments before I went ballistic and hit 5523.02 -7.0 Centigrade! It did not crash but i did not like the high vcore and brang it back to earth.

Could it go further? Prolly but point is this mod really works.

by the way... notice the razor blade i used, it may be slightly thicker than the double-sided kind. but it cut straight in with moderate force and i felt totally in control of the blade.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Patience. i had to wait two extra days cause i used regular US Postal! but it was worth it. I use CLU with the brush on in one direction method.
> see: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508
> 
> Now I am running stable and cool at 4900 MgHz not even playing around with voltages anymore, im happy with it.
> 
> I did Sub-zero my chip with an open window and paper tube to my H60 water cooler and cranked up the Vcore
> Got a 5523.02 http://valid.canardpc.com/2728836


I am not sure why you are not heeding multiple people's advice, so I will just wish you luck with that oc. You couldn't pay me to oc with AI Suite or using BCLK on Ivy.


----------



## Belial

Benchmarks of my system:

i7-3770K Delidded
Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H F15r (beta)
Mushkin Enhanced Ridgeback 996902 PSC XDZ Ram IC 2x2GB custom made
Intel X25-M G2 80GB
GTX 460 768mb MSi Twin Frozr II 922mhz Core/2000mhz Mem 1.087v



http://www.passmark.com/baselines/V8/display.php?id=6110645547
Passmark Rating 3,951
*CPU Mark 13,475*
2D Graphics Mark 1,100
3D Graphics Mark 3,365
Memory Mark 2,567
Disk Mark 1,323


----------



## martinhal

My Cinebench


And almost 1 million folding points


----------



## RavageTheEarth

WOW I need a cigarette. Just had many horrible things happen. So I open the CLU and it looks like they wrapped aluminum foil around the tip and inside the cap. I wonder why they do that??? So I start to push down on the plunger and I'm seeing nothing come out. I'm confused...







So I look at the "foil" wrapped around the tip and notice that its bigger now. Wait a second! Thats the actual stuff!!! So I take the brush and catch some and way too much attached to the brush I guess and I'm spending so much time trying to grab the excess off of the die and put it on the inside of the IHS. FINALLY that was over. Got a nice thin layer on the die and the IHS. So I pop it in and continue to put some on the top of the IHS. Using my newly aquired, "brush it off the side of the syringe and onto the IHS" method. After a little while I get a nice layer and I am DONE. Spend a couple minutes getting that huge cooler in my case and screwed in. Plugged everything in, put on the door, turn it on..... no image, computer shuts off and turns back on multiple times, dr. debug tells me error 55. I panic. Flashbacks of my previous failed delidding attempt fly through my mind.... error 55, computer won't boot, restarts multiple times, I think of a my credit card bill and my limit which I'm $5 dollars away from. "I'm screwed", I tell myself. I scurry and while keeping my cool (as much as I could) I took everything apart. Got down to the IHS and I seen a little smudge on the pcb going over all of those gold dots from when the brush tapped the pcb and I wiped it off with my finger. The TINIEST and most transparent little smudge you would ever see in your life. I use one of the iso alcohol wipes cool labs gave me and wiped it off. Put everything back together. Pressed the power button.........and........... it booted! The weight of the world was lifted off my shoulders. I am never taking my computer apart again (I lie). Anyways.....

Temp difference from mx4 on the die and heatsink to CLU on the die and heatsink.......

25c









Yea baby!


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> WOW I need a cigarette. Just had many horrible things happen. So I open the CLU and it looks like they wrapped aluminum foil around the tip and inside the cap. I wonder why they do that??? So I start to push down on the plunger and I'm seeing nothing come out. I'm confused...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I look at the "foil" wrapped around the tip and notice that its bigger now. Wait a second! Thats the actual stuff!!! So I take the brush and catch some and way too much attached to the brush I guess and I'm spending so much time trying to grab the excess off of the die and put it on the inside of the IHS. FINALLY that was over. Got a nice thin layer on the die and the IHS. So I pop it in and continue to put some on the top of the IHS. Using my newly aquired, "brush it off the side of the syringe and onto the IHS" method. After a little while I get a nice layer and I am DONE. Spend a couple minutes getting that huge cooler in my case and screwed in. Plugged everything in, put on the door, turn it on..... no image, computer shuts off and turns back on multiple times, dr. debug tells me error 55. I panic. Flashbacks of my previous failed delidding attempt fly through my mind.... error 55, computer won't boot, restarts multiple times, I think of a my credit card bill and my limit which I'm $5 dollars away from. "I'm screwed", I tell myself. I scurry and while keeping my cool (as much as I could) I took everything apart. Got down to the IHS and I seen a little smudge on the pcb going over all of those gold dots from when the brush tapped the pcb and I wiped it off with my finger. The TINIEST and most transparent little smudge you would ever see in your life. I use one of the iso alcohol wipes cool labs gave me and wiped it off. Put everything back together. Pressed the power button.........and........... it booted! The weight of the world was lifted off my shoulders. I am never taking my computer apart again (I lie). Anyways.....
> 
> Temp difference from mx4 on the die and heatsink to CLU on the die and heatsink.......
> 
> 25c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea baby!


Thanks for sharing , glad it worked out. Now leave well alone !!


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> My Cinebench
> 
> 
> And almost 1 million folding points


Wow really nice. that what im talkin bout!
ps noob question: What is folding?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Thanks for sharing , glad it worked out. Now leave well alone !!


Haha I will! I'll post some pics tonight or tomorrow


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> My Cinebench
> 
> 
> And almost 1 million folding points


do you run that 24/7? As long as your temps okay and that's actually stable why not right? Would you know about how much you'd need to be 24 hour prime95 stable on 5ghz?


----------



## lilchronic

i delided my wisdom teeth today lol just got back from getting all 4 of my wisdom teeth pulled


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i delided my wisdom teeth today lol just got back from getting all 4 of my wisdom teeth pulled


Haha you must be feeling gooooood


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> do you run that 24/7? As long as your temps okay and that's actually stable why not right? Would you know about how much you'd need to be 24 hour prime95 stable on 5ghz?


I have only tried 1.464 V for 5 ghz but I think I can get lower but too lazy to do a 24 hour prime run a lower voltage.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Wow really nice. that what im talkin bout!
> ps noob question: What is folding?


See the link http://folding.stanford.edu/English/Learn

Some may argue but I found that folding breaks my OC's faster than Prime95 , so I would rather fold for 24 hours than run prime for 24 hours , at least I'm getting points. Folding also broke my GPU OC . I have run Heaven , 3d Mark and others for stability and passed , then played BF3 6 hours passed . One hour into GPU folding and got bad work units , had to up voltage to get it to work.

Edit: I think stable means different things to different people . To me if I can do what I want to at 5.1 ghz and not crash then I'm " stable " at 5.1.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok guys I have something really wierd (and scary) that I have just discovered. On my AsRock Z77 Extreme4 I am at 4.8Ghz stress testing right now using Level 2 LLC with +.010 offset and .102 additional turbo boost. CPU-z is reporting 1.36v, but I just used my DMM on the voltage points on the back of the board and it reads 1.46v! Temps have maxed out at 73c and I'm on test 12 of the 8k test I think. I'm going to try Level 5 LLC and see if that helps. I am using 20 DCV on my DMM is that the right setting? This cant be right.

EDIT: I just stopped the test and checked my voltage during idle and it was about 1.05 so that means this is correct (about .03 off), right? My BIOS reads 1.08 vcore. CPU-z reads .960 vcore at the desktop.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha you must be feeling gooooood


lol yea they put me to sleep under anaesthesia i think thats how you spell it. got some lortabs, pain medicine


----------



## martinhal

I have read on OCN that some AsRock boards under report vcore on CPU-Z . Yip 20 DCV is right on your DMM . If you are unsure of a setting use it on a 1.5 v battery and see if you get a 1.5 +/- reading.

I think your temps are OK for that vcore based on my temps from IBT tests below ( yes my pic again ). You can up the multi im sure if you are at 1.4 odd vcore.


----------



## lilchronic

i have asrock board but the multi meter i found out in my garage is so old im worried to try.and i havent read much up on it to use it correctly either,also what points would i check on the asrock extreme 4


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> I have read on OCN that some AsRock boards under report vcore on CPU-Z . Yip 20 DCV is right on your DMM . If you are unsure of a setting use it on a 1.5 v battery and see if you get a 1.5 +/- reading.
> 
> I think your temps are OK for that vcore based on my temps from IBT tests below ( yes my pic again ). You can up the multi im sure if you are at 1.4 odd vcore.


That just scary. If I didn't know that I'm sure I would've blown my rig.


----------



## martinhal

I know the feeling , you only need one scary PC event in one day. I did follow your other thread too.

Leave the pc alone now !!! Play a game then turn off the pc..... Turn it back on in the morning , but light a smoke first just in case it does not post.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am not sure why you are not heeding multiple people's advice, so I will just wish you luck with that oc. You couldn't pay me to oc with AI Suite or using BCLK on Ivy.


..."heeding advice" ? Interesting choice of words that says quite a lot...

SOME parts of AI Suite are very good for oc'ing, never mind that Asus knows more than most about Asus boards' bios, and AI Suite does directly hook into the Bios (which is not always a good thing). That said, I have oc'ed via Bios, via Asus Suite and via XTU, with the latter being my 1st choice. Still, I find AI Suite can be a great tool as long as you know what you are doing, and I have used it before during several verified world record runs at HWBot.

XTU is more encompassing re a variety of unseen parameters and also less aggressive than AI Suite re vCore etc - but if a OCN member wants to use AI Suite instead of "...heeding your and others' advice" here, that's his or her business...there is a lot of stuff being spouted around here by a few 'individuals who really do not have decades of experience - advice that is actually nonsensical, not 'the last word in wisdom'


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am not sure why you are not heeding multiple people's advice, so I will just wish you luck with that oc. You couldn't pay me to oc with AI Suite or using BCLK on Ivy.


OK good ... why not BCLK i3770K ? a technical response would be most usefully. I have only had this system for a few weeks now.
as for the AI suite: I know. i have done my OCing in the Bios. I dont want to get into this right now, later yeah.
but what about ...why not BCLK i3770K ? this is interesting.


----------



## snowfree52

I've read horror stories about guys putting CL pro beetween the CPU and the waterblock, many reported a weld beetween them when they tried to unmount the waterblock.

did someone here actually already tried to unmount his waterblock after having CL for several months ?

Did someone experienced that ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> My Cinebench
> 
> 
> And almost 1 million folding points


...I admire your courage, honestly....just under 1.6v scares me too much ! I'm thinking of getting a 3970X for a work-related application, and hear those can really fly with up to 1.6v

Then again, I have been lucky that I don't have to go there with my 3770K, though it is just a question of time when I feel tempted to go and bench at 5.4 (have benched up to 5.3 per earlier thread)

...my voltages at 100% load per AIDA 64 extreme stability test in Windows Resource Manager:


----------



## martinhal

Hey each to there own I guess. The important thing is to learn what works for you . I wish I had learned more before I got in to OC. I had not built a system in about 7 years till I got my SB i5 . I used AI Suite because I did not understand the bios to OC it and it did 5ghz . I then got an i7 and messed around with bios OC and all I could get was 4.7. I then got into water cooling and pushed it to 5 and was happy.

I only realised a few months ago that my first i5 was doing 5 ghz an a stock cooler with a software OC - I had no idea of the gem I had .


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I've read horror stories about guys putting CL pro beetween the CPU and the waterblock, many reported a weld beetween them when they tried to unmount the waterblock.
> 
> did someone here actually already tried to unmount his waterblock after having CL for several months ?
> 
> Did someone experienced that ?


I did it to the copper plate of a corsair H60 - i will tell you later this year about any welding. Frankly, this sounds just like the type of contact i would hope for. besides welds can be broken.


----------



## BradleyW

Well, I just delidded my second 3770k and I've scratched the PCB in 3 places. You can see the copper. I've installed the CPU and everything seems to be working fine? Is there anything I can do to check if the CPU is really working as it should? I ran benchmarks and that seemed fine as well. Anything I could use to cover the small copper scratches?
Thank you.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Well, I just delidded my second 3770k and I've scratched the PCB in 3 places. You can see the copper. I've installed the CPU and everything seems to be working fine? Is there anything I can do to check if the CPU is really working as it should? I ran benchmarks and that seemed fine as well. Anything I could use to cover the small copper scratches?
> Thank you.


Well it seems to be good then. And I have heard of people using a 2 part epoxy to fill scratches


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I did it to the copper plate of a corsair H60 - i will tell you later this year about any welding. Frankly, this sounds just like the type of contact i would hope for. besides welds can be broken.


yes, but motherboars and sockets can ben broken too









and people telling they had to use force and sharp plastic blades to separate them while beeing mouted on the motherboard doesn't seems nice.


----------



## Icydead

Here is my delided chip











Liquid Pro arrives tomorrow morning so right after my classes, Im going to have 3 days off and squeeze this chip


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i know what you mean but i don't think it's available here
> 
> there is the double sided one available but i want a blade that is NOT flexible !


It's better if it's flexible...You can make it into an U shape and fit the bent part onto one of the edges of the ihs. Much safer, you will avoid hitting the pcb 100% and open up one corner.
Then you can do the rest with a plastic card. *That should be the number one method in the first page*.
Fool proof...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I admire your courage, honestly....just under 1.6v scares me too much ! I'm thinking of getting a 3970X for a work-related application, and hear those can really fly with up to 1.6v
> 
> Then again, I have been lucky that I don't have to go there with my 3770K, though it is just a question of time when I feel tempted to go and bench at 5.4 (have benched up to 5.3 per earlier thread)
> 
> ...my voltages at 100% load per AIDA 64 extreme stability test in Windows Resource Manager:
> 
> ]


One thing, 3930/3960/3970x are SB architecture...SB degrades really easily over 1.45v, so no go.
You could only pull 1.6v on cold, and they won't go far, haven't seen any over 5.6ghz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Here is my delided chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Liquid Pro arrives tomorrow morning so right after my classes, Im going to have 3 days off and squeeze this chip


Nice! Good luck with the LP. have fun


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Anyway, does a CPU need a break in or does it deliver full power out of the box ?


Cpus usually do their best right out of the box, checking max clocks with a new cpu after a couple hours it usually needs a bit more voltage or lower clocks. not much difference, but i usually think of that as the break in period (from new to where it needs the voltage bump, then it will stay the same for quite a while unless abused).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..."heeding advice" ? Interesting choice of words that says quite a lot...
> 
> SOME parts of AI Suite are very good for oc'ing, never mind that Asus knows more than most about Asus boards' bios, and AI Suite does directly hook into the Bios (which is not always a good thing). That said, I have oc'ed via Bios, via Asus Suite and via XTU, with the latter being my 1st choice. Still, I find AI Suite can be a great tool as long as you know what you are doing, and I have used it before during several verified world record runs at HWBot.
> 
> XTU is more encompassing re a variety of unseen parameters and also less aggressive than AI Suite re vCore etc - but if a OCN member wants to use AI Suite instead of "...heeding your and others' advice" here, that's his or her business...there is a lot of stuff being spouted around here by a few 'individuals who really do not have decades of experience - advice that is actually nonsensical, not 'the last word in wisdom'


I don't like having AI suite installed on a rig, but it does come in handy for testing & can be handy for benching as well.
When testing it is faster to just up the clock or voltage in AI suite & see if it helps, rather than the reboot every time. Once you know the chip, it can be done in bios.
When benching you hit limits of where it wants to be able to load windows, when it crashes loading windows, it can be easier to drop a multi, boot up & then clock it back up on the desktop.

But something about AI suite just bugs me, msi & gigabyte software seems less invasive, you can just shut it off & it isn't there. AI suite likes to hang out in the background even when you don't want it to...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Well, I just delidded my second 3770k and I've scratched the PCB in 3 places. You can see the copper. I've installed the CPU and everything seems to be working fine? Is there anything I can do to check if the CPU is really working as it should? I ran benchmarks and that seemed fine as well. Anything I could use to cover the small copper scratches?
> Thank you.


I usually use clear nail polish or liquid electric tape to insulate. With a nicked PCB it should be done before ever trying to boot it though, you can short circuit a PCB all you want when it isn't powered, as long as there are no shorts when it gets powered up, all is good.
If the cpu PCB is nicked & something live can arc creating a short circuit, it's already to late. Insulate first so there can be no short.
It's like washing a motherboard or gpu in the sink, as long as it dries completely before powering it up it's fine. Not dry, & it won't live long once powered.

Oh yeah, finally found a decent cpu for 3d, validated this & benches fine at 6.4Ghz.
http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2729279


----------



## Belial

ivan labrie what are you talking about?

invincible20xx, didn't you already mess up a delid using the wrong blade?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..."heeding advice" ? Interesting choice of words that says quite a lot...
> 
> SOME parts of AI Suite are very good for oc'ing, never mind that Asus knows more than most about Asus boards' bios, and AI Suite does directly hook into the Bios (which is not always a good thing). That said, I have oc'ed via Bios, via Asus Suite and via XTU, with the latter being my 1st choice. Still, I find AI Suite can be a great tool as long as you know what you are doing, and I have used it before during several verified world record runs at HWBot.
> 
> XTU is more encompassing re a variety of unseen parameters and also less aggressive than AI Suite re vCore etc - but if a OCN member wants to use AI Suite instead of "...heeding your and others' advice" here, that's his or her business...there is a lot of stuff being spouted around here by a few 'individuals who really do not have decades of experience - advice that is actually nonsensical, not 'the last word in wisdom'


I was not referring to using AI Suite to test an overclock or to tweak things for benching, I was pointing out that his BCLK is 104.2 which is what usually happens when you use TurboEVO to auto set an overclock. You apparently think that Asus knows so much about their boards that bios is stupid, and us spending time to manually set it up, and test all the settings is pointless. Sure let's just delete all the guides here and everyone just use TurboEVO to magically and automatically find our perfect overclocks for 24/7 stability. Thanks, what I great idea, I sure am stupid. Thanks for pointing out how stupid and inexperienced I am.

I have only been here a few months, but that was by far the most condescending post I have read. Wow, you worked in your HWBot again, what is that 25 posts now?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok guys I have something really wierd (and scary) that I have just discovered. On my AsRock Z77 Extreme4 I am at 4.8Ghz stress testing right now using Level 2 LLC with +.010 offset and .102 additional turbo boost. CPU-z is reporting 1.36v, but I just used my DMM on the voltage points on the back of the board and it reads 1.46v! Temps have maxed out at 73c and I'm on test 12 of the 8k test I think. I'm going to try Level 5 LLC and see if that helps. I am using 20 DCV on my DMM is that the right setting? This cant be right.
> 
> EDIT: I just stopped the test and checked my voltage during idle and it was about 1.05 so that means this is correct (about .03 off), right? My BIOS reads 1.08 vcore. CPU-z reads .960 vcore at the desktop.


Most ASRock Z77 boards report the voltage through software inaccurate. Multi-meter is the way to go. But yeah, not weird or scary, almost common knowledge with the Extreme4.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I was not referring to using AI Suite to test an overclock or to tweak things for benching, I was pointing out that his BCLK is 104.2 which is what usually happens when you use TurboEVO to auto set an overclock. You apparently think that Asus knows so much about their boards that bios is stupid, and us spending time to manually set it up, and test all the settings is pointless. Sure let's just delete all the guides here and everyone just use TurboEVO to magically and automatically find our perfect overclocks for 24/7 stability. Thanks, what I great idea, I sure am stupid. Thanks for pointing out how stupid and inexperienced I am.
> 
> I have only been here a few months, but that was by far the most condescending post I have read. Wow, you worked in your HWBot again, what is that 25 posts now?


...are you sure you want to go there ? It is you who is condescending to the poster who showed a screenshot of Ai Suite.....and others...

First, Asus knows a lot about their boards and the bios they issue - more than anyone here...

Second, I have only been here a few months longer than you, though I have background on hardware and software that started in the 90ies, and do this professionally.

Third, BCLK clocking can be very effective as long as the range has been checked in prior tests - especially when you are near 'the wall' when an extra step in the multiplier calls for too much extra vCore...one of the OCN Editors (and absolute world record holder on a particular CPU top speed) actually wrote a good post about it a few days ago on this thread...so best argue with him

Fourth, as to your "wow, you worked in your HWBot again, what is that 25 posts now?"...Aha, the *dead give-away* ...

I only did the records on the weekend...in grand total (excluding this post) I only have done 13 posts altogether on anything in this thread since then. I reported on the HWbot results once, then reacted to Valgaur's congrats (though did not myself mention HWbot), so that just leaves my earlier posts to you - a grand-total of 3, not 25..and 2 of the 3 were responses...... it just seems to loom larger in _your_ head


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I was not referring to using AI Suite to test an overclock or to tweak things for benching,
> 
> I was pointing out that his BCLK is 104.2 which is what usually happens when you use TurboEVO to auto set an overclock.
> 
> You apparently think that Asus knows so much about their boards that bios is stupid, and us spending time to manually set it up, and test all the settings is pointless. Sure let's just delete all the guides here and everyone just use TurboEVO to magically and automatically find our perfect overclocks for 24/7 stability. Thanks, what I great idea, I sure am stupid. Thanks for pointing out how stupid and inexperienced I am.
> 
> I have only been here a few months, but that was by far the most condescending post I have read. Wow, you worked in your HWBot again, what is that 25 posts now?


You are in error: the BCLK of 104.2 is set in my bios. At 47x It gives me my 4900MgHz or 4897 to be exact that i like for rendering CINEMA 4D. AND the Freq : 5523.02 MHz (104.21 * 53) for the tag
*5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*
If you assumed i used the auto clock feature your wrong, but thats ok you are right about that feature being junk, for serious OCers anyway.

But my question remains WHY wont you use BCLK on ivy?







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...are you sure you want to go there ?


"Go there?" Seriously? Wow you are a legend in your own mind, why in the world would I care?

None of what you posted has much to do with a stable, safe, 24/7 overclock. If you want to tell people to use software to set auto overclocks that raise BCLK then be my guest.

Is there a moderator here that can delete all my posts please? They are all condescending and not at helpful according to my all knowing friend here. Thanks. Don't worry won't be posting about it again.
Time=money, and this is not worth my money.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> ivanlabrie wrote ...One thing, 3930/3960/3970x are SB architecture...SB degrades really easily over 1.45v, so no go.
> You could only pull 1.6v on cold, and they won't go far, haven't seen any over 5.6ghz.
> Nice! Good luck with the LP. have fun


...you are right, and I also know this is a bit late in the game for Sandy-E (though the new one has been apparently delayed until Q4). But we need either an 8c/16t Xeon for the application in question (that also involves a lot of encryption) or a really fast 6c/12T 3970X...I obviously have not tried it yet, but from what I have seen, with them it is also about great cooling (150w watt rating out of the box)...apparently it will hit 5.2 at under 1.5v with a strong custom water loop, and with some more enhanced cooling, I have seen some numbers that suggest 5.4 giggles at 1.55...just wondering whether the 15 mb cache will allow for that kind of thing...besides, I do not want to break it as it really will be put to work.


----------



## stickg1

I'd use BCLK for benching or HWBot but not for doing something where long term stability is paramount. It effects too many different clock rates in your system. It is also notorious for corrupting your OS if you push it too far. I don't particularly like using it because I use my PC primarily for gaming and don't want to go through the hassle of reinstalling everything for a few tens of MHz. If I was a bencher with a stripped OS I would mess with it more. 100-105 BCLK is fine, anything more and you're asking for trouble.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> "Go there?" Seriously? Wow you are a legend in your own mind, why in the world would I care?
> 
> None of what you posted has much to do with a stable, safe, 24/7 overclock. If you want to tell people to use software to set auto overclocks that raise BCLK then be my guest.
> 
> Is there a moderator here that can delete all my posts please? They are all condescending and not at helpful according to my all knowing friend here. Thanks. Don't worry won't be posting about it again.
> Time=money, and this is not worth my money.


....problems with the facts, I guess. I have never, ever advised anyone on setting 'auto overclocks', and I feel I have done a lot to show folks the benefits on Intel's own XTU, including stability tests - the very same the professionals use. Good luck...


----------



## Solonowarion

I love lamp


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'd use BCLK for benching or HWBot but not for doing something where long term stability is paramount. It effects too many different clock rates in your system. It is also notorious for corrupting your OS if you push it too far. I don't particularly like using it because I use my PC primarily for gaming and don't want to go through the hassle of reinstalling everything for a few tens of MHz. If I was a bencher with a stripped OS I would mess with it more. 100-105 BCLK is fine, anything more and you're asking for trouble.


Good to know - thanks for some science. That's really useful. +rep


----------



## kesawi

I go away for 12 hours and come back to 80 new posts, this thread is pretty popular








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ....problems with the facts, I guess. I have never, ever advised anyone on setting 'auto overclocks', and I feel I have done a lot to show folks the benefits on Intel's own XTU, including stability tests - the very same the professionals use. Good luck...


Tried using Intel XTU but could find where to adjust the VCore. Would appreciate if someone could point me in the right direction.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I delidded my bad chip, but that's because I enjoy delidding and I see very little risk. The temps were very low, the overclock is low. Rationally, it was not a good decision, but i did it for fun. You should be able to do 4.4-4.6ghz no matter how bad your chip is or your aftermarket cooler is though. What overclock were you running?


I was running 4.3GHz @ 1.2V and still getting in the mid 80s under Prime95 and IBT. I now get temps in the high 50s / low 60s doing the same runs, so delidding has definitely being worth it for me despite having a bad chip that needs a lot of voltage. Was doing some 3DMark benchmarks last night for submission to HWBot and had to run 1.55V to achieve 4.9GHz stable in 3DMark







Haven't found my 24/7 stable voltage for 4.5GHz or 4.6GHz yet but I know it is going to be somewhere between 1.3-1.45V as it was still crashing at 1.29V for 4.5GHz (I did say I was going to stop overclocking and just enjoy playing games for a while but I've found it too adictive







)


----------



## ryboto

Ok, I asked if I should delid, and was told to attempt booting at 5ghz. I set the a 50 multiplier, turned off turbo offest, kept PLL overvoltage disabled, and set vcore to fixed at 1.35v.

It booted, to my surprise. Had a few WHEA erros upon booting, one program refused to start, but I confirmed with CPU-Z, saw 1.36v, and passed superpi 1M. Is this a candidate for delidding?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, true...I play more with my overclocks than games normally...except for my mmo nights xD (from 1am till 6am daily lol...go to bed at 6 get up at 12, such a rockstar eh?) lol


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> Ok, I asked if I should delid, and was told to attempt booting at 5ghz. I set the a 50 multiplier, turned off turbo offest, kept PLL overvoltage disabled, and set vcore to fixed at 1.35v.
> 
> It booted, to my surprise. Had a few WHEA erros upon booting, one program refused to start, but I confirmed with CPU-Z, saw 1.36v, and passed superpi 1M. Is this a candidate for delidding?


what are your temps like?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> Ok, I asked if I should delid, and was told to attempt booting at 5ghz. I set the a 50 multiplier, turned off turbo offest, kept PLL overvoltage disabled, and set vcore to fixed at 1.35v.
> 
> It booted, to my surprise. Had a few WHEA erros upon booting, one program refused to start, but I confirmed with CPU-Z, saw 1.36v, and passed superpi 1M. Is this a candidate for delidding?


DAM...nice chip, you even have pll overvoltage disabled, that's nuts!







You normally need that enabled for higher clocks, wonder how far it'll go with 1.5v and pll on.
Delid that sucker right away mate


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> I go away for 12 hours and come back to 80 new posts, this thread is pretty popular
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tried using Intel XTU but could find where to adjust the VCore. Would appreciate if someone could point me in the right direction.
> I was running 4.3GHz @ 1.2V and still getting in the mid 80s under Prime95 and IBT. I now get temps in the high 50s / low 60s doing the same runs, so delidding has definitely being worth it for me despite having a bad chip that needs a lot of voltage. Was doing some 3DMark benchmarks last night for submission to HWBot and had to run 1.55V to achieve 4.9GHz stable in 3DMark
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't found my 24/7 stable voltage for 4.5GHz or 4.6GHz yet but I know it is going to be somewhere between 1.3-1.45V as it was still crashing at 1.29V for 4.5GHz (I did say I was going to stop overclocking and just enjoy playing games for a while but I've found it too adictive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


XTU works on 'delta' - that is the change on voltage set in your bios...in XTU, go to 'manual tuning' and then you see two sliding bars up top...one for BCLK and one for adding or subtracting additional Turbo vCore...further below you will see the multiplier settings


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> Ok, I asked if I should delid, and was told to attempt booting at 5ghz. I set the a 50 multiplier, turned off turbo offest, kept PLL overvoltage disabled, and set vcore to fixed at 1.35v.
> 
> It booted, to my surprise. Had a few WHEA erros upon booting, one program refused to start, but I confirmed with CPU-Z, saw 1.36v, and passed superpi 1M. Is this a candidate for delidding?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> DAM...nice chip, you even have pll overvoltage disabled, that's nuts!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You normally need that enabled for higher clocks, wonder how far it'll go with 1.5v and pll on.
> Delid that sucker right away mate


Ivan, SHHHH.

Dude, that chip isn't a keeper, should be sold to some poor sucker like me as soon as possible...









Sounds like a great chip man! But if you do want to sell it before delidding can I get dibs?


----------



## invincible20xx

hey guys, i just delidded my cpu, i nicked the pcb but i tried the processor and it is still working fine, but i can see the copper in the nicked tiny area, what can i use as an insulator on that area to prevent any IHS induced short circuit (before i fired up the pc i used clear tape as a quick insulator on that area just to see if the pc was gonna turn on) but now i want a practical solution what can i use on the nicked area to insulate it from contact with IHS i want something that will endure high tempreture as well, will nail polish work ? will it endure heat up to say 90c ? thanks


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I'm so blown away that my board is reporting .1v off. So that means I have the worst luck with chips EVER. My last chip, a 3570k, needed 1.391v for 4.5Ghz so in reality it really needed 1.491v. My new 3770k which I thought was decent needs 1.371v for 4.7Ghz so in reality it needs 1.471v. What the hell....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> hey guys, i just delidded my cpu, i nicked the pcb but i tried the processor and it is still working fine, but i can see the copper in the nicked tiny area, what can i use as an insulator on that area to prevent any IHS induced short circuit (before i fired up the pc i used clear tape as a quick insulator on that area just to see if the pc was gonna turn on) but now i want a practical solution what can i use on the nicked area to insulate it from contact with IHS i want something that will endure high tempreture as well, will nail polish work ? will it endure heat up to say 90c ? thanks


MX4 usually works - and is made for that kind of environment while being non-conductive...then again nail polish may also do the trick..never heated up nail polish before







...have to ask the GF


----------



## Master__Shake

clear nail polish


----------



## Belial

I have to wonder about some of the sentiment being thrown around here.

Hardware has really come a long, long way, as well as software. I really wonder if software overclocking is as bad as it is made out to be anymore. Nowadays boards are basically sold on how good the included overclocking suite is, every single person at tomshardware buys their boards based on the software, and TH's reviews of motherboards ranks a board's ability to overclock not on it's VRM, but based on how far of a software overclock you can get (even if voltages are reported inaccurately 100% of the time on all motherboards no matter the brand and quality, and you can often use some motherboard oc programs on other boards).

I think it's a valid question to ask these days, if software overclocking _really_ is that bad. I mean people still say you should disable all powersaving options or that you should never go above 1.575 ram voltage on sandy bridge and ivy bridge, liquid pro being better than ultra, there's TONS of myths that are perpetuated because what _used_ to be true or based off some mythical intel spreadsheet that never existed. Remember the 'max voltage for ivy is 1.52v", haha.

However software doesnt have offset voltage, and not nearly as much control like I still can't change LLC in software or pwm switch rate, and I dont want to have to set my overclock every single time i log back into windows... maybe software does suck if it doesnt even have those basics covered but I don't think it's right to just say all software sucks without question still. Motherboard manufacturers spend a ton of money and time into their overclocking software. It could definitely just be markinet bullcrap but I'm sure that is less and less true as time goes on.
Quote:


> ....problems with the facts, I guess. I have never, ever advised anyone on setting 'auto overclocks', and I feel I have done a lot to show folks the benefits on Intel's own XTU, including stability tests - the very same the professionals use. Good luck...


I think you showed people like me that XTU might be better but nothing concrete. I haven't heard any reports, like someone saying "well i passed 24 hours of prime95 but failed in 5 hours of xtu' or any sort of comparison of the two, like 'well i know for sure i fail prime95 at .05v less than my current voltage but xtu passes just fine'.
Quote:


> Ok, I asked if I should delid, and was told to attempt booting at 5ghz. I set the a 50 multiplier, turned off turbo offest, kept PLL overvoltage disabled, and set vcore to fixed at 1.35v.
> 
> It booted, to my surprise. Had a few WHEA erros upon booting, one program refused to start, but I confirmed with CPU-Z, saw 1.36v, and passed superpi 1M. Is this a candidate for delidding?


I told you what to do to see how good your chip is already. Boot at 1.3v, see how far you can overclock in windows with a software program. 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, until it freezes on you (just not freezing for 10 seconds so you can select the next overclock is all you need to do). If you can do 5ghz without freezing within 10 seconds then you got a good chip worth delidding.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm so blown away that my board is reporting .1v off. So that means I have the worst luck with chips EVER. My last chip, a 3570k, needed 1.391v for 4.5Ghz so in reality it really needed 1.491v. My new 3770k which I thought was decent needs 1.371v for 4.7Ghz so in reality it needs 1.471v. What the hell....


oh man the freakin sillicon lottery....









don't sweat it try 4.6GHz @ 1.35 if it goes then just keep it there

i delidded my cpu but i nicked it at one place it's still working but i'm looking for something to apply on the nicked area just to insulate it from the IHS


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Master__Shake*
> 
> clear nail polish


will it endure the heat produced in that area by the processor ?

also i can't seem to get the intel adhesive off of it i'm afraid to nick the pcb again while trying to get it off, is it really necessary to remove the old adhesive ? what will happen if i don't remove it and just slap the IHS on the processor ?

also if i have to remove it, what is the best way to go about it ?


----------



## ryboto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Master__Shake*
> 
> what are your temps like?


Was kinda worried about stability, so I rushed, plus a friend is waiting to game, so I didn't have much time to fiddle. Since I wasn't doing anything more than SuperPI, I don't think I was seeing crazy temps, since my fans didn't even ramp up.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> DAM...nice chip, you even have pll overvoltage disabled, that's nuts!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You normally need that enabled for higher clocks, wonder how far it'll go with 1.5v and pll on.
> Delid that sucker right away mate


Might need PLL for stability, who knows, but it was pretty crazy to see 5000mhz in CPU-Z! I'll order some Coollaboratory tim and give it a shot. Now I have to decide on Pro or Ultra.........
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivan, SHHHH.
> 
> Dude, that chip isn't a keeper, should be sold to some poor sucker like me as soon as possible...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds like a great chip man! But if you do want to sell it before delidding can I get dibs?


Ha! I'll keep you in mind









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I told you what to do to see how good your chip is already. Boot at 1.3v, see how far you can overclock in windows with a software program. 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, until it freezes on you (just not freezing for 10 seconds so you can select the next overclock is all you need to do). If you can do 5ghz without freezing within 10 seconds then you got a good chip worth delidding.


Well, since I know it's stable at 4.6ghz, I figured just go for the gold. It booted with 1.36v at 5.0ghz, ran SuperPI 1M, no BSOD. Including the boot process, it was at 5.0ghz for probably 3-4 min.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> oh man the freakin sillicon lottery....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> don't sweat it try 4.6GHz @ 1.35 if it goes then just keep it there
> 
> i delidded my cpu but i nicked it at one place it's still working but i'm looking for something to apply on the nicked area just to insulate it from the IHS


Wow man you are so lucky bro. Thank god you didn't kill it and remember that if you ever get liquid ultra that it is conductive so just be really careful with it.
The thing that sucks is that even when my MOBO is pumping 1.48v (real volts) into my cpu temps never go over 70c with the new CLU. They mostly stay in the 50's though. If only I could get it at a decent clock for voltage. I wish there was a way to do a fonzie style jukebox hit to the chip and make it take less volts. I think I'm going to go to microcenter in a month or two and buy another chip.


----------



## Master__Shake

i used clear nail polish on a gtx 260 to get rid of coil whine i think they get hot and that card is still alive and kicking.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Master__Shake*
> 
> i used clear nail polish on a gtx 260 to get rid of coil whine i think they get hot and that card is still alive and kicking.


do you recomment putting the nail polish on the pcb or the IHS in the area that will likely fall on the nicked place ?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivan, SHHHH.
> 
> Dude, that chip isn't a keeper, should be sold to some poor sucker like me as soon as possible...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds like a great chip man! But if you do want to sell it before delidding can I get dibs?


LOL!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm so blown away that my board is reporting .1v off. So that means I have the worst luck with chips EVER. My last chip, a 3570k, needed 1.391v for 4.5Ghz so in reality it really needed 1.491v. My new 3770k which I thought was decent needs 1.371v for 4.7Ghz so in reality it needs 1.471v. What the hell....


Ah, it ain't so bad man. It's still a good CPU, it's a 3770K. Go run some benches against the guys in the Vishera thread, it will cheer you up.


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> do you recomment putting the nail polish on the pcb or the IHS in the area that will likely fall on the nicked place ?


pcb where the nick is, that way you dont have to worry about shorting the cpu.


----------



## justanoldman

Valgaur,
Thank for the thread, sorry for the trouble, but when you get a chance could you remove me from the club and delete my info from the first post?
Thanks.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Valgaur,
> Thank for the thread, sorry for the trouble, but when you get a chance could you remove me from the club and delete my info from the first post?
> Thanks.


Over a little argument? Guys butt heads in here all the time. It's no big deal!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Valgaur,
> Thank for the thread, sorry for the trouble, but when you get a chance could you remove me from the club and delete my info from the first post?
> Thanks.


There are always going to be conflicting opinions on the internet, don't take it personally. Arguments like that can be frustrating to those involved, but they end & tomorrow is a new day.

No need to leave the club over it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So if I run a high voltage, like 1.6v would it just break my chip and not my other components? Is heat the reason why you can't run high voltages or is it because the chip just dies from it even if it isn't hitting the tj maxx?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Valgaur,
> Thank for the thread, sorry for the trouble, but when you get a chance could you remove me from the club and delete my info from the first post?
> Thanks.


Don't leave the club man.. You've been a lot of help to me and a ton of other people. We wouldn't want to lose someone like yourself. Come onn I just got here. The party just started! You can't leave yet!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have to wonder about some of the sentiment being thrown around here.
> 
> Hardware has really come a long, long way, as well as software. I really wonder if software overclocking is as bad as it is made out to be anymore. Nowadays boards are basically sold on how good the included overclocking suite is, every single person at tomshardware buys their boards based on the software, and TH's reviews of motherboards ranks a board's ability to overclock not on it's VRM, but based on how far of a software overclock you can get (even if voltages are reported inaccurately 100% of the time on all motherboards no matter the brand and quality, and you can often use some motherboard oc programs on other boards).
> 
> I think it's a valid question to ask these days, if software overclocking _really_ is that bad. I mean people still say you should disable all powersaving options or that you should never go above 1.575 ram voltage on sandy bridge and ivy bridge, liquid pro being better than ultra, there's TONS of myths that are perpetuated because what _used_ to be true or based off some mythical intel spreadsheet that never existed. Remember the 'max voltage for ivy is 1.52v", haha.
> 
> I think you showed people like me that XTU might be better but nothing concrete. I haven't heard any reports, like someone saying "well i passed 24 hours of prime95 but failed in 5 hours of xtu' or any sort of comparison of the two, like 'well i know for sure i fail prime95 at .05v less than my current voltage but xtu passes just fine'.
> .


...your point if what used to be true but isn't anymore is well taken...there was a time when all the memory you need 'is 640K







' ... that's why for commercial applications, we only use XTU (ditto for oc'ing and testing private systems)...in my experience, the XTU memory test results in a higher power draw and temps than prime95...typically 2 to 5 C higher, when I last ran a comparison (which is some time ago) though it depends on the system (ie speed and amount of RAM)

...I rarely use prime95 or the old, modified IBT these days anymore because I find XTU more challenging - and also what commercial clients *can agree on* as a 'valid' test which we log on commercial builds before they leave...Then again, the XTU test result really doesn't say very much more than 'passed' or 'failed'...obviously, you want the 'green' passed







I ran some XTU tests last Friday before a weekend of record runs and there should be a log.

...a word of advice though...while I don't mind Asus AI Suite either if I'm in a hurry to test different scenarios, better don't run XTU and AI Suite *at the same time.*..vCore can shoot up as those two can become additive on vCore...and I would know that because...


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have to wonder about some of the sentiment being thrown around here.
> 
> Hardware has really come a long, long way, as well as software. I really wonder if software overclocking is as bad as it is made out to be anymore. Nowadays boards are basically sold on how good the included overclocking suite is, every single person at tomshardware buys their boards based on the software, and TH's reviews of motherboards ranks a board's ability to overclock not on it's VRM, but based on how far of a software overclock you can get (even if voltages are reported inaccurately 100% of the time on all motherboards no matter the brand and quality, and you can often use some motherboard oc programs on other boards).
> 
> I think it's a valid question to ask these days, if software overclocking _really_ is that bad. I mean people still say you should disable all powersaving options or that you should never go above 1.575 ram voltage on sandy bridge and ivy bridge, liquid pro being better than ultra, there's TONS of myths that are perpetuated because what _used_ to be true or based off some mythical intel spreadsheet that never existed. Remember the 'max voltage for ivy is 1.52v", haha.
> 
> However software doesnt have offset voltage, and not nearly as much control like I still can't change LLC in software or pwm switch rate, and I dont want to have to set my overclock every single time i log back into windows... maybe software does suck if it doesnt even have those basics covered but I don't think it's right to just say all software sucks without question still. Motherboard manufacturers spend a ton of money and time into their overclocking software. It could definitely just be markinet bullcrap but I'm sure that is less and less true as time goes on.
> I think you showed people like me that XTU might be better but nothing concrete. I haven't heard any reports, like someone saying "well i passed 24 hours of prime95 but failed in 5 hours of xtu' or any sort of comparison of the two, like 'well i know for sure i fail prime95 at .05v less than my current voltage but xtu passes just fine'.
> I told you what to do to see how good your chip is already. Boot at 1.3v, see how far you can overclock in windows with a software program. 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, until it freezes on you (just not freezing for 10 seconds so you can select the next overclock is all you need to do). If you can do 5ghz without freezing within 10 seconds then you got a good chip worth delidding.


In an effort to get the most out of my equipment I watched a presentation/review of the asus z77 series mobos CATAGORY: OVERCLOCKING





You are right. "Hardware has really come a long, long way, as well as software. I really wonder if software overclocking is as bad as it is made out to be anymore."

This is JJ Guerrero from Asus directly and could be considered Overclocking 101 for the newest MOBOs
it is Asus but alot of the info is general overclocking practices and terminology.

Notable that 25% of OCers or now using Software to overclock compared to 1-4% few years back. these boards have a chip built -in to digitally control damn near everthing in your OS gui

They do go over (1) BIO (2) XTU (3) AI Suite(realtime Controls) OVERCLOCKING in this video. I would make this maditory viewing for anyone has had enough random dial twisting. (What does this one do? CRASH BSOD. However, it may be a bit on the conservative side.

I learned stuff here maybe you could to.







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*









EDIT: JJ Guerrero from Asus same presentation for New Egg - this one is better IMHO





"Asus rep states Vcore Max 1.325 -1.350 = poppycock x bugdugery x balderdash" TonicX


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> XTU works on 'delta' - that is the change on voltage set in your bios...in XTU, go to 'manual tuning' and then you see two sliding bars up top...one for BCLK and one for adding or subtracting additional Turbo vCore...further below you will see the multiplier settings


I'll need to have another look at it when I get home from work as I'm not seeing nearly half the settings that appear on a lot of the screenshots I've found for the program through google. I have the manual tuning option, but I don't have any of the sub-meneu levels for processor, memory or voltages.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm gonna give that xtu thing a try once I get my 3770k...gotta wait a week.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Valgaur,
> Thank for the thread, sorry for the trouble, but when you get a chance could you remove me from the club and delete my info from the first post?
> Thanks.


no!


----------



## justanoldman

I really don't want to post anymore on this because I know no one want to read it. However, just to be clear, I will address the issue. Joa3d43 posts have become more and more condescending, reread his posts by hearing the meaning not just reading the words.

He is reasonably eloquent in choosing his words, but since I have had jobs where corporate communications get scrutinized carefully, you do not read the words, you read between the lines.

Obviously I made a mistake in my choice of words in the one post, didn't mean to, just a mistake. The following rant by Joa3d43 was very personal and very specific in its condescension and attack on me. Disagreements and even very heated debate is fine, I used to have a job where we screamed at each other most of the day wearing silly colored coats - I am no stranger to that.

Direct, carefully crafted, and very personal attacks on another club member, however are unacceptable. Since his post was not commented on by anyone, my assumption was that it was considered acceptable here. No big deal, just don't want to be part of that. Thanks and good luck in the future.


----------



## TonicX

Post Delidded Ivy @ 4800
Here is a Benchmark illustrating the extreme demands of Intels Burn Test Compared to Cinebench11.5
On the CPU Temp Graph the first test was Cinebench with long consistentish levels compared to IBT spiky cycling.
Some of the Old Stand-By Tests Can damage newer Processors are not validated- beware!







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I really don't want to post anymore on this because I know no one want to read it. However, just to be clear, I will address the issue. Joa3d43 posts have become more and more condescending, reread his posts by hearing the meaning not just reading the words.
> 
> He is reasonably eloquent in choosing his words, but since I have had jobs where corporate communications get scrutinized carefully, you do not read the words, you read between the lines.
> 
> Obviously I made a mistake in my choice of words in the one post, didn't mean to, just a mistake. The following rant by Joa3d43 was very personal and very specific in its condescension and attack on me. Disagreements and even very heated debate is fine, I used to have a job where we screamed at each other most of the day wearing silly colored coats - I am no stranger to that.
> 
> Direct, carefully crafted, and very personal attacks on another club member, however are unacceptable. Since his post was not commented on by anyone, my assumption was that it was considered acceptable here. No big deal, just don't want to be part of that. Thanks and good luck in the future.


I didn't comment cause I felt it wasn't exactly my business, and was at work relatively busy...but I don't think it's that big of a deal.
I've had some arguments and debates with many forum members and almost always we end up coming to an agreement of sorts, like for instance our buddy Belial...He or Hokies can have a "bad" attitude, or make it sound like they are condescending when in reality it's just their way of expressing themselves via text...for example, I've pm'd with Belial for a while and he's nothing like that really.
But you don't have to get along with someone if it just happens to don't "feel" right, nor should you be forced to leave this club for that.
Your choice man, hope you can get along eventually...


----------



## TonicX

This video is the best explaination of why heat is such an obstacle for the ivy bridge and why i decided to delid.







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm gonna give that xtu thing a try once I get my 3770k...gotta wait a week.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> I'll need to have another look at it when I get home from work as I'm not seeing nearly half the settings that appear on a lot of the screenshots I've found for the program through google. I have the manual tuning option, but I don't have any of the sub-meneu levels for processor, memory or voltages.


...I think you have to turn those sub menus on separately, usually by clicking 'o.k.' to the legal stuff which comes on screen...then there is also 'profiles' - my fauvorite - that's where you save your favourite, stress-tested settings and where XTU shines as it controls various unseen parameters to work together in a profile


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I didn't comment cause I felt it wasn't exactly my business, and was at work relatively busy...but I don't think it's that big of a deal.
> I've had some arguments and debates with many forum members and almost always we end up coming to an agreement of sorts, like for instance our buddy Belial...He or Hokies can have a "bad" attitude, or make it sound like they are condescending when in reality it's just their way of expressing themselves via text...for example, I've pm'd with Belial for a while and he's nothing like that really.
> But you don't have to get along with someone if it just happens to don't "feel" right, nor should you be forced to leave this club for that.
> Your choice man, hope you can get along eventually...


agreed


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I really don't want to post anymore on this because I know no one want to read it. However, just to be clear, I will address the issue. Joa3d43 posts have become more and more condescending, reread his posts by hearing the meaning not just reading the words.
> 
> He is reasonably eloquent in choosing his words, but since I have had jobs where corporate communications get scrutinized carefully, you do not read the words, you read between the lines.
> 
> Obviously I made a mistake in my choice of words in the one post, didn't mean to, just a mistake. The following rant by Joa3d43 was very personal and very specific in its condescension and attack on me. Disagreements and even very heated debate is fine, I used to have a job where we screamed at each other most of the day wearing silly colored coats - I am no stranger to that.
> 
> Direct, carefully crafted, and very personal attacks on another club member, however are unacceptable. Since his post was not commented on by anyone, my assumption was that it was considered acceptable here. No big deal, just don't want to be part of that. Thanks and good luck in the future.


I choose bad wording sometimes, I've posted something before that seemed reasonable at the time but realized later I came across as quite a jerk. I doubt he meant to be condescending to you, may have just come across wrong. Like Ivan, it wasn't really my business & I prefer to stay out of arguments unless I figure I can help clear up an issue, don't want to make anyone feel like they are being ganged up on.
There is also the option to block or ignore a member, so you can still go through the club thread, his posts just won't show up for you. I haven't done it to anyone, just seems kind of extreme when things like that usually blow over as quick as they start.
It is your decision, but input form everyone is good & you have been a regular poster here, it would be sad to see you go over this.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think you have to turn those sub menus on separately, usually by clicking 'o.k.' to the legal stuff which comes on screen...then there is also 'profiles' - my fauvorite - that's where you save your favourite, stress-tested settings and where XTU shines as it controls various unseen parameters to work together in a profile


Do I still need to enter a fixed voltage into the BIOS to start with or do I leave it at auto? Also do the settings reset with each reboot? How long should I stress test for? Is there a decent overclocking guide to using XTU anywhere?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> Do I still need to enter a fixed voltage into the BIOS to start with or do I leave it at auto? Also do the settings reset with each reboot? How long should I stress test for? Is there a decent overclocking guide to using XTU anywhere?


...there are different approaches you can use, it all works. I tend to set the multiplier manually but lower (say 45) in the bios and the voltage on 'auto', then boot up - with XTU automatically loading the last good profile (say 52).

By setting a lower multiplier on auto-v in the bios, I believe and have seen some evidence to that effect (though nothing iron-clad yet) that with C and sleep states on, your chip will idle or be on partial load at lower voltages...even at 5.2, I see 0.98v...then again, coming out of sleep and low-load states probably requires more of a quick boost...anyways, back to your question: Both manual and auto settings for v-core in Bios work subsequently with XTU


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So if I run a high voltage, like 1.6v would it just break my chip and not my other components? Is heat the reason why you can't run high voltages or is it because the chip just dies from it even if it isn't hitting the tj maxx?


Using High Volts Burned up video cards, several mother boards, PCI wireless adapter, even a monitor, but never a processor. But that just my experience.

Most idiotic Computer Modification:
One time i had screwed a metal shelf on an old box stlye monitor and aparently used too long of screws. Ya no kidding! I had an 2 inch long blue tesla arc from the corner of the shelf to my Metal rig case and my first reaction was to seperate them, so i moved the case away and the arc just streched. WHA? Ya! After i pulled the plug and did a post-mortem i discovered all the PCI components where ghost. i slap the vga cord over to the On-Board VGA then back to School homework (PHOTOSHOP) but could not continue, only, because my roomate and I where laughing too hard.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lmao xD

Very nice "mod"


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Using High Volts Burned up video cards, several mother boards, PCI wireless adapter, even a monitor, but never a processor. But that just my experience.
> 
> Most idiotic Computer Modification:
> One time i had screwed a metal shelf on an old box stlye monitor and aparently used too long of screws. Ya no kidding! I had an 2 inch long blue tesla arc from the corner of the shelf to my Metal rig case and my first reaction was to seperate them, so i moved the case away and the arc just streched. WHA? Ya! After i pulled the plug and did a post-mortem i discovered all the PCI components where ghost. i slap the vga cord over to the On-Board VGA then back to School homework (PHOTOSHOP) but could not continue, only, because my roomate and I where laughing too hard.


So using a high voltage like 1.6v on an ivy bridge would burn up every other component except the video card? So the only disadvantage of using high volts on a ivy bridge is heat? and yea that is hilarious


----------



## ryboto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lmao xD
> 
> Very nice "mod"


You said you liked liquid pro over liquid ultra, yea? Need to decide on which to buy for my delidding.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> You said you liked liquid pro over liquid ultra, yea? Need to decide on which to buy for my delidding.


get both







ive got pro on die and ultra on ihs because i heard ultra is easier to get off. but either one will work just as good, i personally like pro the best because it has a need too apply the perfect amount, and it seems like you would get more applications with the pro


----------



## Hokies83

Man these new batches do seem to be Alot better then the release batches.. atleast Freq wise.


----------



## lilchronic

you got a new cpu ? or you talkin bout new members


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you got a new cpu ? or you talkin bout new members


LoL nah i still have the same chip









Talking about new members numbers.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Well, since I know it's stable at 4.6ghz, I figured just go for the gold. It booted with 1.36v at 5.0ghz, ran SuperPI 1M, no BSOD. Including the boot process, it was at 5.0ghz for probably 3-4 min.












That's not the point. The point to see how good your chip is, to 'bin' it. Boot at 1.3v, if you can get software overclock (not booting) to 5ghz or above, it's worth delidding. Below that is a judgement call or simply not worth it. like less than 4.8 would be not worth delidding and a bad chip. [email protected] and having issues doesn't really sound like a great chip, but maybe you have a decent chip.

Quote:


> So if I run a high voltage, like 1.6v would it just break my chip and not my other components? Is heat the reason why you can't run high voltages or is it because the chip just dies from it even if it isn't hitting the tj maxx?


It depends on the chip, but in the case of Ivy, the max of 1.45-1.6v being cited so frequently is because of how new the chip is, how frail sandy was, how unexplored those voltages are for 24/7 overclocks, and that heat becomes a huge limiting factor. If you got an extremely high end air cooler or one of the better closed loops or custom water, you can push above 1.5v easily and stay cool (if you delidded, that is)and run over 5ghz for 24/7. No one has degraded or killed an ivy bridge yet except benching insane 1.9v+, and more than a few people run 1.6v for 24/7 so until they say they have problems, I wouldn't worry about running up to 1.6v until you see people who've already been running such a voltage for a long time now, say they have issues.

I mean degradation is immediately apparent generally, it's not like you are creeping signfiicant damage to your chip (I mean im sure a year is more like 2 years of aging, but it's not like 5+ years of aging per year.... then again this is all guessing).

Be aware voltages hurts a chip more than temps do, so if you are going to push extreme voltages, it's best your temps are not riding the limit of 90-100*C on load.
Quote:


> ...I rarely use prime95 or the old, modified IBT these days anymore because I find XTU more challenging - and also what commercial clients can agree on as a 'valid' test which we log on commercial builds before they leave...Then again, the XTU test result really doesn't say very much more than 'passed' or 'failed'...obviously, you want the 'green' passed I ran some XTU tests last Friday before a weekend of record runs and there should be a log.


im kinda done stress testing. In the future I'll see how xtu fares, if it catches overclocks that are unstable on prime95, or as quickly, that kind of thing.

I just dont like how it has a separate test for cpu and ram. That seems a bit like a waste. I got to run 24 hours of xtu both cpu and ram tests to see every single overclock I change is stable or not?
Quote:


> You are right. "Hardware has really come a long, long way, as well as software. I really wonder if software overclocking is as bad as it is made out to be anymore."
> .............


You know even is software overclocking is okay nowadays, it just doesn't offer enough control, and you have to set it upon logging in every single time you restart your computer as most of them lack 'apply on start-up' options. You can't change LLC, you can't change pwm switch rates, you can't change pll, vtt, imc. I'm the kind of person that literally has every single voltage on the absolute lowest (i tested my pll, vtt/imc, vcore, all to be so that one .05v interval lower would crash), every single ram timing, even the tertiary ones are on the absolute tightest they can be on. You just don't have that control in software. This depends on the motherboard though, of course - gigabyte's software is terrible, while MSI has great software (and vice versa is true on hardware).

Im sure software overclocking is fine for 99% of overclockers who just change enable pll overvoltage, maybe set llc once to a setting, and then change vcore/frequency, but it still has a ways to go before it's good enough for me. I will have no problems using it once it has all the same options .

Then again that might be a motherboard issue. For example MSI's software overclock program, is literally just the BIOS screens popping up in a window when your logged in. It can't get any more straightforward than that.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> I really don't want to post anymore on this because I know no one want to read it. However, just to be clear, I will address the issue. Joa3d43 posts have become more and more condescending, reread his posts by hearing the meaning not just reading the words.


I don't really see the problem. Joa3d43 seems to have experience using software and bclk overclocking and gave his input, YMMV. He clearly says he doesn't think asus suite is the be all end all, just in particular instances it's very good. I'm sure anyone could agree with just a non-committal statement, right? Then, you mistook the fact that his bclk was set manually, not automatically.

If anything you are the one that seemed a bit hostile, with the first shot fired:
Quote:


> "Go there?" Seriously? Wow you are a legend in your own mind, why in the world would I care?
> 
> None of what you posted has much to do with a stable, safe, 24/7 overclock. If you want to tell people to use software to set auto overclocks that raise BCLK then be my guest.
> 
> Is there a moderator here that can delete all my posts please? They are all condescending and not at helpful according to my all knowing friend here. Thanks. Don't worry won't be posting about it again.
> Time=money, and this is not worth my money.


I have a lot of respect for you but it just seems like your overreacting a bit. There's nothing wrong with being a bit condescending to someone if they are wrong and being a stuck up jerk but you clearly made a few incorrect assumptions (automatic bclk, using software to overclock everything).

Quote:


> ....problems with the facts, I guess. I have never, ever advised anyone on setting 'auto overclocks', and I feel I have done a lot to show folks the benefits on Intel's own XTU, including stability tests - the very same the professionals use. Good luck...


I mean he doesn't disagree with anything you say man. Even a mod chipped in and said they agreed that software can be useful and bclk overclocking has it's place.

I'm all for being rude and laying down the law on some ignorant motherflicker but i think the issue here is more miscommunication and less about ignorance.
Quote:


> Obviously I made a mistake in my choice of words in the one post, didn't mean to, just a mistake. The following rant by Joa3d43 was very personal and very specific in its condescension and attack on me. Disagreements and even very heated debate is fine, I used to have a job where we screamed at each other most of the day wearing silly colored coats - I am no stranger to that.


Make a witty comeback!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> I've had some arguments and debates with many forum members and almost always we end up coming to an agreement of sorts, like for instance our buddy Belial...He or Hokies can have a "bad" attitude, or make it sound like they are condescending when in reality it's just their way of expressing themselves via text...for example, I've pm'd with Belial for a while and he's nothing like that really.
> But you don't have to get along with someone if it just happens to don't "feel" right, nor should you be forced to leave this club for that.
> Your choice man, hope you can get along eventually...


You know I still insist that _considering_ a P67/Z68 used/sale/refurb/overstock is the way to go for a brand new ivy bridge build, you just go through the hoops of replacing the bios, buying the board used with the newest flashed, have a local computer shop or friend lend you an SB to use to flash, etc and pocket yourself money in the process.

It's just dat microcenter bundle special. The $40+ bundle savings is basically identical to the savings to be had in buying p67/z68, it means no hoops to jump through, and it's basically a 2013 car vs a 2011 car.

It's all about the quality of the motherboard you buy, not the chipset. If you don't live by microcenter, you should definitely consider a p67/z68 board for a new ivy bridge build. Not saying you should buy it, even without the microcenter specials, you can find a z77 that might be a better performance to value ratio than some p67/z68 on sale. But I'm just saying, they are amongst the choices out there. I mean an Asrock Extreme Z68 is better than an Asrock Extreme Z77 - so maybe for your new IB build, you consider the Asrock Extreme4 Z68, the Gigabyte Z77X-D3H, an Msi z68 g45. A lot of the z77 boards are actually worse than their p67/z68 counterparts (msi and asrock in particular).

But like I said, microcenter made me just drop the issue and look at me, I have a Z77X-UD5H. I paid $79 for it (about the price of a decent p67/z68, whereas z77s are usually $100+).

Time is a factor that the whole issue did not consider though, the time it'd take to research all the p67/z68 boards and how they work with ivy bridge (and nearly no one with p67/z68 upgraded to IB) is rather difficult. I attempted to compile a list here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1354973/list-of-motherboards-by-overclocking-options

And the p67/z68 section is rather small.


----------



## Swag

Damn! 1 day I was out to just relax and get better, you guys post 200+ posts in 1 day... Too much, guessing a bit of OT in there but still...









I just went to my local PC store and a worker had ordered 3 Titans... Showed me the pictures of his current rig (3 680s), I'm wondering right now how the hell does a person working at slightly above minimum wage afford something like that... Debt?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Damn! 1 day I was out to just relax and get better, you guys post 200+ posts in 1 day... Too much, guessing a bit of OT in there but still...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just went to my local PC store and a worker had ordered 3 Titans... Showed me the pictures of his current rig (3 680s), I'm wondering right now how the hell does a person working at slightly above minimum wage afford something like that... Debt?


He gets Slapped around by 4 7950s that cost less then 1 Titan? lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Damn! 1 day I was out to just relax and get better, you guys post 200+ posts in 1 day... Too much, guessing a bit of OT in there but still...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just went to my local PC store and a worker had ordered 3 Titans... Showed me the pictures of his current rig (3 680s), I'm wondering right now how the hell does a person working at slightly above minimum wage afford something like that... Debt?
> 
> 
> 
> He gets Slapped around by 4 7950s that cost less then 1 Titan? lol
Click to expand...

Lol, I understand but really, my dad is an engineer and is earning fairly good money right now. He loves computers but can't justify putting himself down $3000 for just GPUs. How can someone earning minimum wage afford to drop $3000? Even working everyday from 9-5 for 6 days a week with Sundays off, you are only earning about $2000 a month.... without taxes...


----------



## Radmanhs

man, I'm so tempted to delid. my cpu







is there anyway to hold the cpu still with something other than your hand because I cant tomorrow I will post the model of an old dell my dad is using to see if its possible to delid the cpu in that


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> no break in.
> Im not going to get into this publicly. If you want me to tell you why folding is the wrong way to do this, PM me.
> 
> Although, folding might be relevant for parkinsons.
> *How long does that take, to run through all the possible tests?*
> I delidded my bad chip, but that's because I enjoy delidding and I see very little risk. The temps were very low, the overclock is low. Rationally, it was not a good decision, but i did it for fun. You should be able to do 4.4-4.6ghz no matter how bad your chip is or your aftermarket cooler is though. What overclock were you running?


Well over a month based on the "tests" I've been getting lately, You can even get repeats sometimes that will basically re check your stability, I see the new beta wu's are much tougher than the normal ones though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> will surgical gloves protect the chip from static ? i don't know where to get an anti static bracelet where i live and can't get it online


Any type of Plastic gloving will do perfectly.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Yes, and they protect the chip from whatever is on your hands. Make sure to delid on a nonconductive surface, even with gloves I wouldn't want to do it on a metal desk or table.


Normal printer paper does it wonderfully!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i'm planing to do it on an A4 printing paper, good ?


Any printer paper
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I broke 10.20 on cinebench lastnight all-time personal best, ever, ... on any machine, ... in reality! really.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but that was way out too high and too hot for long animation renders(Why I need this chip- besides C.O.D.) learned alot with the asus ai2 OC gui but I dialed in 4900 @ 1.4 hard into the BIOS for a solid start and render client render beast. clockin, in the upper 60's lower 70's this is where i would like to be operating on long rendering. also i am happy with the intel turbo that tunes it all down when idle.
> 
> Thank guys for the good info on delidding, i took your advice: (1) research before you leap (2) test your chip before diving in, (3) use a THIN razor or wait till you get one (4) order some Cool Laboratory Ultra to make your chip happy(cool) as possable., not ready?... refer to advice (1).
> 
> the numbers tell me it was a success! I love to Modify stuff for less weight, aesthetics, easy access, whatever. THIS MOD .. is for performance and It literally will cut seconds, minutes and hours off of my render times.
> 
> Now I just need one more Ivy Bridge and my system will be complete... "Whoosh-whoosh of air respirator... Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,Don,"


Hurry up and delid already!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha thanks man there is so much talk on here about the infamous 5ghz OC that I sometimes forget that I still have a decent chip even though I can't hit that


Pffffft don't worry about the 5 Giggles club. Go for 5.5 Giggles and get the coveted 2 Ghz Club








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Ladies and gents,
> May I remind you there's an OP where you'll find blade recommendations and more so a long video showing you the process.
> As for folding: I enjoy contributing to something, I fold daily.


^^^^^^^^^^^

I don't know why but so many people completely forget about the OP








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> My Cinebench
> 
> 
> And almost 1 million folding points


I'm at 3 mill points and apparently my dorm turned my computer off...... darn them was looking forward to those points!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> WOW I need a cigarette. Just had many horrible things happen. So I open the CLU and it looks like they wrapped aluminum foil around the tip and inside the cap. I wonder why they do that??? So I start to push down on the plunger and I'm seeing nothing come out. I'm confused...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I look at the "foil" wrapped around the tip and notice that its bigger now. Wait a second! Thats the actual stuff!!! So I take the brush and catch some and way too much attached to the brush I guess and I'm spending so much time trying to grab the excess off of the die and put it on the inside of the IHS. FINALLY that was over. Got a nice thin layer on the die and the IHS. So I pop it in and continue to put some on the top of the IHS. Using my newly aquired, "brush it off the side of the syringe and onto the IHS" method. After a little while I get a nice layer and I am DONE. Spend a couple minutes getting that huge cooler in my case and screwed in. Plugged everything in, put on the door, turn it on..... no image, computer shuts off and turns back on multiple times, dr. debug tells me error 55. I panic. Flashbacks of my previous failed delidding attempt fly through my mind.... error 55, computer won't boot, restarts multiple times, I think of a my credit card bill and my limit which I'm $5 dollars away from. "I'm screwed", I tell myself. I scurry and while keeping my cool (as much as I could) I took everything apart. Got down to the IHS and I seen a little smudge on the pcb going over all of those gold dots from when the brush tapped the pcb and I wiped it off with my finger. The TINIEST and most transparent little smudge you would ever see in your life. I use one of the iso alcohol wipes cool labs gave me and wiped it off. Put everything back together. Pressed the power button.........and........... it booted! The weight of the world was lifted off my shoulders. I am never taking my computer apart again (I lie). Anyways.....
> 
> Temp difference from mx4 on the die and heatsink to CLU on the die and heatsink.......
> 
> 25c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea baby!


You're Updated! Also! QUIT WITH THE DRAMA DARN YOU!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Well, I just delidded my second 3770k and I've scratched the PCB in 3 places. You can see the copper. I've installed the CPU and everything seems to be working fine? Is there anything I can do to check if the CPU is really working as it should? I ran benchmarks and that seemed fine as well. Anything I could use to cover the small copper scratches?
> Thank you.


Seems the chip is running more than happily with it's new haircut!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I love lamp


Lamp indeed sir!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivan, SHHHH.
> 
> Dude, that chip isn't a keeper, should be sold to some poor sucker like me as soon as possible...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds like a great chip man! But if you do want to sell it before delidding can I get dibs?


Owner of the thread gets first dibs!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Valgaur,
> Thank for the thread, sorry for the trouble, but when you get a chance could you remove me from the club and delete my info from the first post?
> Thanks.


I don't really see a reason as well to take you off from this minor argument. I see and have experience this many times!







Have you not seen me and Hokies yammer at each other a bunch? sometimes I want to smack the guy, but 20 minutes later I treat him like an old friend









I respect any of your decisions and if you truly wish to be taken off the list (and mess up my entire list







) PM me and I can either help you two sort things out or I can take you out of the club. I would really hate to see you go as you do post a lot of good information and help many people on here. The choice is ultimately your's
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm gonna give that xtu thing a try once I get my 3770k...gotta wait a week.


HURRY UP ALREADY!!!









I will throw some of my knowledge out there on AI Suite as well, Not being mean or anything just giving my views on it.

1st I use it for every bench and time I bench or test a OC.
2nd I like the format much more as I use fixed voltage so it gives me great CPU control.
3rd I love it when I have annoying as heck bios issues (like I'm currently having were I can't change my multi) but in W7 I can change it right away and have great things from it.

4th and most importantly you can have much easier OC ability in your OS while benching and when you have certain parameters OC's memorized it makes a great thing for a quick OC change for a bench while your Bios set RAM OC is very picky.

I like AI Suite and It's just me, I do lots of mental math to get each OC right on the first time as well, and I like my way, each person is different and should have their respect on how they do it.









Now lets get alone like a nice crazy family on OCN! or better yet Crewmen!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> man, I'm so tempted to delid. my cpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is there anyway to hold the cpu still with something other than your hand because I cant tomorrow I will post the model of an old dell my dad is using to see if its possible to delid the cpu in that


RUBBER GLOVES


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Damn! 1 day I was out to just relax and get better, you guys post 200+ posts in 1 day... Too much, guessing a bit of OT in there but still...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just went to my local PC store and a worker had ordered 3 Titans... Showed me the pictures of his current rig (3 680s), I'm wondering right now how the hell does a person working at slightly above minimum wage afford something like that... Debt?
> 
> 
> 
> He gets Slapped around by 4 7950s that cost less then 1 Titan? lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Lol, I understand but really, my dad is an engineer and is earning fairly good money right now. He loves computers but can't justify putting himself down $3000 for just GPUs. How can someone earning minimum wage afford to drop $3000? Even working everyday from 9-5 for 6 days a week with Sundays off, you are only earning about $2000 a month.... without taxes...
Click to expand...

Take a personal loan from the bank, sell the 3x680s and slowly pay it off interest free in a few months on a good plan?

If you don't have a family, you don't need to make a lot of money to be filfthy rich and buy whatever you want. You can live very well on minimum wage if you are only supporting yourself and living with roommates (or better yet, still living at home!).
Quote:


> As for folding: I enjoy contributing to something, I fold daily.


Yes but are you actually contributing to anything is a question people in the field commonly ask. There are other distributed computing projects that are indisputably contributable (say that 2 times fast).


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> man, I'm so tempted to delid. my cpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is there anyway to hold the cpu still with something other than your hand because I cant tomorrow I will post the model of an old dell my dad is using to see if its possible to delid the cpu in that


maybe u can use a vice
https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSjvAbBNSXZ7YU7YlGxKaJc1_8HOnULWvqsntJoHgwr27VS47vurw


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys..... I have an idea of what I want to do further with my build this summer and it involves....... Wood lots and lots of Wood

My dad is an amazing carpenter and I've learned a lot from him in my life. I really think I could make a great wheeled case for my rig, Fully watercooled in the summer by the way, I totally plan on 3-4 way SLI as well. Would you guys be interested in a log of a custom made wooden case build? I have some pretty cool ideas for rad placement and even reservoir ideas as well.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys..... I have an idea of what I want to do further with my build this summer and it involves....... Wood lots and lots of Wood
> 
> My dad is an amazing carpenter and I've learned a lot from him in my life. I really think I could make a great wheeled case for my rig, Fully watercooled in the summer by the way, I totally plan on 3-4 way SLI as well. Would you guys be interested in a log of a custom made wooden case build? I have some pretty cool ideas for rad placement and even reservoir ideas as well.


Wooden Shelf build?

Yes i like those.. but u have to make it massive no Girly ITX stuff..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lol, I understand but really, my dad is an engineer and is earning fairly good money right now. He loves computers but can't justify putting himself down $3000 for just GPUs. How can someone earning minimum wage afford to drop $3000? Even working everyday from 9-5 for 6 days a week with Sundays off, you are only earning about $2000 a month.... without taxes...


I could buy 100 Titans if i wanted to does not mean im going to.

Titans performance numbers are horrid for 1049$ " and this is coming from someone who thought gtx 690 numbers were low"

LoL so unless the Titan is between 600$ = 700$ "where it's performance number declare it should be" im 100% not interested.

Far as Raw power with over clocking the 7950 is the sweet spot boys.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Wooden Shelf build?
> 
> Yes i like those.. but u have to make it massive no Girly ITX stuff..
> I could buy 100 Titans if i wanted to does not mean im going to.
> 
> Titans performance numbers are horrid for 1049$ " and this is coming from someone who thought gtx 690 numbers were low"
> 
> LoL so unless the Titan is between 600$ = 700$ "where it's performance number declare it should be" im 100% not interested.
> 
> Far as Raw power with over clocking the 7950 is the sweet spot boys.


it'll be huge don't worry little buddy lol









thinking 4 monsta's and a dual acrylic side panel system for the mobo side long with the WC side as well. might do a exterior tubing thing and light it up with UV on the inside. Early stages of thinking really.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Make a witty comeback!


Really? So me saying something annoying like he is a complete douche who's condescension is only matched by his desperate need for his epeen to help compensate for personal shortcomings, would help the issue?

I was very surprised that anyone would use a bclk of 104 for a 24/7 overclock. It would be impossible for me to be condescending to anyone here because computers never have nor will ever be my area of expertise. If I made a mistake in the way I wrote it, ok, it is not like I text on my blueberry or send out twits on the tweeter like you young folk, so posting my thoughts in an unclear manor is more than possible. How about this, change my initial post to : golly gee mister I can't believe you used a bclk of 104, and didn't respond to two posts about it, I sure would be awful scared to try that since everything I have ever read says don't do that for ivy for 24/7 ocs.

Next cue the the well thought out carefully crafted personal attack. It is completely without question that he meant it as a personal attack, this was no disagreement about bclk. He was apparently harboring ill feelings because he thinks I am condescending (ring, hello?, kettle this is pot, you are black). I realize many did not read between the lines, but he and I are both smart enough to know exactly how demeaning and degrading his post was meant to be. I made a mistake in my choice of words, he didn't, a personal attack is just that. If you guys want to go there that is ok by me, but I don't think you do.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it'll be huge don't worry little buddy lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thinking 4 monsta's and a dual acrylic side panel system for the mobo side long with the WC side as well. might do a exterior tubing thing and light it up with UV on the inside. Early stages of thinking really.


This with wood would be more Epic.



4 Monsta's? Valguar ready to play with the big boys now lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This with wood would be more Epic.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4 Monsta's? Valguar ready to play with the big boys now lol.


...Hokies83 beat me to it - I have seen a few 'desk' computers I am rather interested in, given that I have way too many cases in my private residence , and it combines the art of carpentry with hardware modding...sure would like to see a build log on something unusual like that because I am going to attempt it later in the year

...here is another one I like, w/link for source and to more

http://redharbinger.com/forums/useralbums/l3p-d3sk.28/view


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Make a witty comeback!
> 
> 
> 
> Really? So me saying something annoying like he is a complete douche who's condescension is only matched by his desperate need for his epeen to help compensate for personal shortcomings, would help the issue?
> 
> I was very surprised that anyone would use a bclk of 104 for a 24/7 overclock. It would be impossible for me to be condescending to anyone here because computers never have nor will ever be my area of expertise. If I made a mistake in the way I wrote it, ok, it is not like I text on my blueberry or send out twits on the tweeter like you young folk, so posting my thoughts in an unclear manor is more than possible. How about this, change my initial post to : golly gee mister I can't believe you used a bclk of 104, and didn't respond to two posts about it, I sure would be awful scared to try that since everything I have ever read says don't do that for ivy for 24/7 ocs.
> 
> Next cue the the well thought out carefully crafted personal attack. It is completely without question that he meant it as a personal attack, this was no disagreement about bclk. He was apparently harboring ill feelings because he thinks I am condescending (ring, hello?, kettle this is pot, you are black). I realize many did not read between the lines, but he and I are both smart enough to know exactly how demeaning and degrading his post was meant to be. I made a mistake in my choice of words, he didn't, a personal attack is just that. If you guys want to go there that is ok by me, but I don't think you do.
Click to expand...

It is odd but I've heard one other guy say he had an easier overclock with bclk x multi than multi alone. Who knows why or what's really going on, maybe just 'incorrect' stress testing. it's okay man, dont worry, i dont really see the blow-up or problems or 'mistake in the way [you] wrote it'. i dont really see condescending comments or insults from either of you guys, really. Quite tame compared to some of the stuff i've wrought in here lol.

i have read only one thing that say don't mess with bclk, that was sin's guide, everything else either doesn't address bclk tuning or says don't bother (and come on, i'm sure i'm not the only person here who would bother with 24 hour testing of just a single tertiary timing timed one step tighter or a voltage .05v lower. I mean really, what's the point of a high end motherboard, right? The whole point a high end board is so you can crank up bclk, boards like what I have can do bclks of over 110, I'm sure there's something to be said of bclk tuning. Just not sure what it is.
Quote:


> Next cue the the well thought out carefully crafted personal attack. It is completely without question that he meant it as a personal attack, this was no disagreement about bclk.


I've read the last 2 100-post pages a couple times and I really am not sure what you are talking about. Just degrade him back or ignore it (heh, high road, yea right, always get the last word!). Really just whenever stuff gets nasty I always take it to PM. Very few times was it that PM didn't result in us just getting along and having a laugh. And those few times, the other guy got banned because they really were just nuts lol (not from the pm exchange, they just got themselves banned in a blaze of glory and self nudie pics).

We all have epeen here, we are just friendly about it that's all. How you use your computer and your computer knowledge (or lack thereof) is no statement on how you are as a person, don't worry about it.


----------



## Valgaur

I like the looks of deskputers but I prefer the case mobility lol. I plan on a case just not sure on what size shape and such I think I have an idea for my 2 res's hokies did you use just one pump or did you have a secondary in the loop?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I like the looks of deskputers but I prefer the case mobility lol. I plan on a case just not sure on what size shape and such I think I have an idea for my 2 res's hokies did you use just one pump or did you have a secondary in the loop?


2 mcp 35X


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I like the looks of deskputers but I prefer the case mobility lol. I plan on a case just not sure on what size shape and such I think I have an idea for my 2 res's hokies did you use just one pump or did you have a secondary in the loop?


...I realize you may want something on wheels / mobility...the advantage of the 'desks' are that they hold two, sometimes three systems 'in one' - and they are extremely space efficient

...but here is another idea for your and your dad - why not get a bench test setup out of metal like these http://www.ocaholic.ch/xoops/html/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=968&sel_lang=english and build a wooden structure around it ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 2 mcp 35X


I kind of figured as such. Not sure what gpus to run but thinking 680s since I haz one already lol but with the res im thinking a dual 400mm set up on the roof that come up right beside each other and then having myself route and make some good curved pieces come and connect flush with the res's and coming back down a bit in the middle. I plan to hide all of the rads and the pumps and fans in a back side like the mountain mods cases were it has two sides sort of thing.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I kind of figured as such. Not sure what gpus to run but thinking 680s since I haz one already lol but with the res im thinking a dual 400mm set up on the roof that come up right beside each other and then having myself route and make some good curved pieces come and connect flush with the res's and coming back down a bit in the middle. I plan to hide all of the rads and the pumps and fans in a back side like the mountain mods cases were it has two sides sort of thing.


Get 7950s water cooling makes them overclock even higher... there faster then 680s.

680 with water just makes then run quiet and cool will not allow u to OC any higher.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Get 7950s water cooling makes them overclock even higher... there faster then 680s.
> 
> 680 with water just makes then run quiet and cool will not allow u to OC any higher.


Yeah 7950 or 7970s?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah 7950 or 7970s?


7950s there so cheap and each come with a Copy of Crysis 3 and Bioshoch which u can sell for 50$ per card...

I got my 3 for 180$ each lol


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah 7950 or 7970s?
> 
> 
> 
> 7950s there so cheap and each come with a Copy of Crysis 3 and Bioshoch which u can sell for 50$ per card...
> 
> I got my 3 for 180$ each lol
Click to expand...

They decided to give me one of those scratch-code things with my 680. I'm not sure why but can't complain being I got a free game.


----------



## Hokies83

7970 PCB " for water blocks"

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161420

Or 7950 PCB " for water blocks"

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131478


----------



## TonicX

quote name= Belial
It is odd but I've heard one other guy say he had an easier overclock with bclk x multi than multi alone. Who knows why or what's really going on, maybe just 'incorrect' stress testing.

EXPERIMENT #19511256 Official: TonicX
The BCLK question is a real onion and since there are literally infinate variables(Different stress test, different hardware, different color nail polish on your cpu, i will do some good old empirical science.

1. Test trials begin on my render rig using the Ivy Bridge validated AIDA64 System Stability Test
2. Fans will be set 30-60 [40%power ate 30* scaling to reach full 100% fan power at 60*
3. MOW techniques will not be implimented (MOW = Minnesota Open Window)
4. The Case will remain stationary with both side panels off
5. the OC settings will remain where they have been for the last 24+ hours call it Core Speed BcLK vs No BcLK
senerio A. Core speed 4897.8 Mz x47.0 , Bus Speed 104.21 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
vs
senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled

6. Data will be shared Live with OCN official Delided Ivy Crew via my Gaming rig Quad Core 775 Gigabyte

7. As a scientist I no longer 'Care" and let go of all bias. I SIMPLY WANT TO KNOW.

8. This test is not 24/7 as I do not undertake Render session with that timeframe but 36-48-or 72 hours cranked is not uncommon.

9. Purpose: Stress-Testing Computers

10. Risks: Stress-Testing Members

Any member feedback is welcome!
especially anyone familiar with AIDA64 v2.80.2300 extreme software









*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 7970 PCB " for water blocks"
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161420
> 
> Or 7950 PCB " for water blocks"
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131478


Id rather get the galaxy cards as they seem to be having higher clocks for benching.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Id rather get the galaxy cards as they seem to be having higher clocks for benching.


Galaxy is a Nvidia only partner

Ref cards are luck of the draw.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> quote name= Belial
> It is odd but I've heard one other guy say he had an easier overclock with bclk x multi than multi alone. Who knows why or what's really going on, maybe just 'incorrect' stress testing.
> 
> EXPERIMENT #19511256 Official: TonicX
> The BCLK question is a real onion and since there are literally infinate variables(Different stress test, different hardware, different color nail polish on your cpu, i will do some good old empirical science.
> 
> 1. Test trials begin on my render rig using the Ivy Bridge validated AIDA64 System Stability Test
> 2. Fans will be set 30-60 [40%power ate 30* scaling to reach full 100% fan power at 60*
> 3. MOW techniques will not be implimented (MOW = Minnesota Open Window)
> 4. The Case will remain stationary with both side panels off
> 5. the OC settings will remain where they have been for the last 24+ hours call it Core Speed BcLK vs No BcLK
> senerio A. Core speed 4897.8 Mz x47.0 , Bus Speed 104.21 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
> vs
> senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
> 
> 6. Data will be shared Live with OCN official Delided Ivy Crew via my Gaming rig Quad Core 775 Gigabyte
> 
> 7. As a scientist I no longer 'Care" and let go of all bias. I SIMPLY WANT TO KNOW.
> 
> 8. This test is not 24/7 as I do not undertake Render session with that timeframe but 36-48-or 72 hours cranked is not uncommon.
> 
> 9. Purpose: Stress-Testing Computers
> 
> 10. Risks: Stress-Testing Members
> 
> Any member feedback is welcome!
> especially anyone familiar with AIDA64 v2.80.2300 extreme software
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


I am quite familiar with Aida64 extreme software


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/thinking-of-overclocking-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-stock-turbo-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz


, including the recently updated version...but I have seen too many "stress-tested members", as you put it







, already today

I will add though that some time ago, I for over 7 years ran a server on Windows NT4 serving big and busy SQL databases that was both overclocked and underclocked (bus, CPU) - the only time it was shut down was either to immediately reboot (NT4 had memory leak issues), or to give it new HDs every two years - never a problem with it over 7 years...

...good luck with the tests, I will make it a point to follow the progress and results


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Galaxy is a Nvidia only partner
> 
> Ref cards are luck of the draw.


or if it has to be NVidia - (why not ? (rhetorical question







) then consider those crazy 680 lightnings...and ask someone like Ftw 420 how to get your hands on that special over-volt software


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> or if it has to be NVidia - (why not ? (rhetorical question
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) then consider those crazy 680 lightnings...and ask someone like Ftw 420 how to get your hands on that special over-volt software


Gimme that software meow!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Gimme that software meow!


After seeing what happened with the last 3770k Evga would be sending me threatening letters if I gave you moar vollts for the 680s











you get stuck with


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys..... I have an idea of what I want to do further with my build this summer and it involves....... Wood lots and lots of Wood
> 
> My dad is an amazing carpenter and I've learned a lot from him in my life. I really think I could make a great wheeled case for my rig, Fully watercooled in the summer by the way, I totally plan on 3-4 way SLI as well. Would you guys be interested in a log of a custom made wooden case build? I have some pretty cool ideas for rad placement and even reservoir ideas as well.


...here is another wooden hybrid, just for ideas http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/case-mod/2009/12/14/cygnus-x1-by-attila-lukacs-oldnewby/7


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...here is another wooden hybrid, just for ideas http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/case-mod/2009/12/14/cygnus-x1-by-attila-lukacs-oldnewby/7


I have a woodshop where i make one of a kind in-laid wood table tops and chess sets
Now this Guy has truly inspired me to fuse my two passions
http://www.overclock.net/t/584302/ocn-water-cooling-club-and-picture-gallery/790#post_8078992


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I kind of figured as such. Not sure what gpus to run but thinking 680s since I haz one already lol but with the res im thinking a dual 400mm set up on the roof that come up right beside each other and then having myself route and make some good curved pieces come and connect flush with the res's and coming back down a bit in the middle. I plan to hide all of the rads and the pumps and fans in a back side like the mountain mods cases were it has two sides sort of thing.


Nope...Sell that 680, don't be silly. It's crazy weak compared to a Titan or a 7970, and overclocks a lot less unless you do a lot of complicated hard mods, and still won't yield a big improvement. Each 50mhz you add to a 7970 are much more noticeable for benching.
Plus you can now even FOLD on AMD cards man, they give great ppd using open cl







(weak compute on the 680s vs a 7970 too)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah 7950 or 7970s?


7970s
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Id rather get the galaxy cards as they seem to be having higher clocks for benching.


Nope, reference 7970's have voltage control, non ref don't except for a few. Non ref like the Matrix platinum have all the bells and whistles, and are awesome for ln2, or a lightning.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I have a woodshop where i make one of a kind in-laid wood table tops and chess sets
> Now this Guy has truly inspired me to fuse my two passions
> http://www.overclock.net/t/584302/ocn-water-cooling-club-and-picture-gallery/790#post_8078992


Go for it!!!


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok guys I have something really wierd (and scary) that I have just discovered. On my AsRock Z77 Extreme4 I am at 4.8Ghz stress testing right now using Level 2 LLC with +.010 offset and .102 additional turbo boost. CPU-z is reporting 1.36v, but I just used my DMM on the voltage points on the back of the board and it reads 1.46v! Temps have maxed out at 73c and I'm on test 12 of the 8k test I think. I'm going to try Level 5 LLC and see if that helps. I am using 20 DCV on my DMM is that the right setting? This cant be right.
> 
> EDIT: I just stopped the test and checked my voltage during idle and it was about 1.05 so that means this is correct (about .03 off), right? My BIOS reads 1.08 vcore. CPU-z reads .960 vcore at the desktop.


Common issue on the AsRock Z77 boards it looks like, even my OC Formula has this issue although it is nowhere near as bad as it is on the Extreme 4.
You can find thread on the subject in here http://www.overclock.net/t/1360404/asrock-z77-extreme-4-vcore-reading


----------



## ryboto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's not the point. The point to see how good your chip is, to 'bin' it. Boot at 1.3v, if you can get software overclock (not booting) to 5ghz or above, it's worth delidding. Below that is a judgement call or simply not worth it. like less than 4.8 would be not worth delidding and a bad chip. [email protected] and having issues doesn't really sound like a great chip, but maybe you have a decent chip.


I will need more than 1.36v(or maybe other tweaks like enabling PLL overvoltage), BUT looking here - http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet/0_100 at the 3570K 5ghz OC's, the lowest vcore is 1.368v.

If delidding really knocks ~20C off of load temps, I'm pretty sure I've got a good shot at 5ghz.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> This with wood would be more Epic.
> 
> 
> 
> 4 Monsta's? Valguar ready to play with the big boys now lol.


I could make you one out of wood. Cost a pretty penny though.


----------



## Icydead

Ok, I applied liquid pro on the die and on the inside ihs according to VonDutch method







Thanks man, you were really helpful but man, that liquid is like T1000 from terminator







So far everything works, Im curently testing it, and I have a [email protected] and temps are hoovering around 46*C on all cores. Id say I have like 15-20 temp drop, I applied MX-2 on IHS. Ill post pics later


----------



## invincible20xx

hey guys so this best i can get the intel glue off the pcb, is it ok to leave at that and just use it ?



also can you notice the scratched area ? it is still working i tried it and it booted no problem, i will put clear nail polish on it the scratched area, will this be ok ? keep in mind this area will be heating up maybe till 85c....


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> hey guys so this best i can get the intel glue off the pcb, is it ok to leave at that and just use it ?
> 
> 
> 
> also can you notice the scratched area ? it is still working i tried it and it booted no problem, i will put clear nail polish on it the scratched area, will this be ok ? keep in mind this area will be heating up maybe till 85c....


Yea thats fine you should just take a credit card and scrape along it with some force and it will leave a stain, but it will come off. You would be suprised how much that pcb can handle. Its just no match against a blade. I got every piece of glue off of mine! Do it! You want that IHS to be basically sitting on the die.


----------



## ChaosAD

Get as much glue off the pcb as you can, so as the ihs to sit properly on it. A shade of glue will not harm though.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I ran a 4.7Ghz bench all night and I have finally figured how much "real" voltage it needs. Ready? 1.46v. Bleh. Here is after a ten hour run of P95 blend.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Get as much glue off the pcb as you can, so as the ihs to sit properly on it. A shade of glue will not harm though.


i'm trying to do it with my finger nail i'm really afraid to scratch the pcb again !


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I ran a 4.7Ghz bench all night and I have finally figured how much "real" voltage it needs. Ready? 1.46v. Bleh. Here is after a ten hour run of P95 blend.


i think our chips are simillar i will just aim for 4.6GHz and really call it a day, those extra 400MHz are down to extreeeeeeme luck, just don't bother man and game the crap out of it !


----------



## Radmanhs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> maybe u can use a vice
> https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSjvAbBNSXZ7YU7YlGxKaJc1_8HOnULWvqsntJoHgwr27VS47vurw


hmmm, maybe if im very careful, it sucks i cant hold on to anything with my right hand due to cerebral palsy without giving it a death grip









can i delid the cpu in an old dell, it has a pentium d inside


----------



## invincible20xx

scrapped off more intel glue this is it now


----------



## ChaosAD

You made it! Thats what i meant. Apply CL Pro, place the ihs carefully on top and you are ready to feel the difference!


----------



## invincible20xx

i've tried to put clear nail paint, it's kinda rubber like idk will this sustain high temps produced by the cpu in 80c ball park ?


----------



## valkeriefire

I finally ordered my CLU







, I look forward to comparing my delidded NH-H1 results with delidded CLU temps. I probably won't get to test it for a week or two though.


----------



## snowfree52

well, I just received my new CPU and it's worse than the first one ! it's not even stable at 4,6 - 1,3V, it needs 1,35V to be stable !























5Ghz @ 1,55V crashes immediately


----------



## Stige

I got a second chip too, can't even stay on desktop without crashing in 2 seconds at 4.8GHz / 1.45V.

Time to delid the first one I think... (5GHz, 1.44V stable)...


----------



## Zeek

Everyone seems to be having back luck with their chips







My 1st chip was decent, 2nd sucked, and current one is alright. I feel the feels tho. I almost cried when I got my second chip :c


----------



## snowfree52

that's how I feel


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I could make you one out of wood. Cost a pretty penny though.


I will carve you that desk out of a single block of wood or tree using the same razor blade i delidded my chip with if i can charge $40/hr while i work on it for the next decade. Do we have a deal?


----------



## chronicfx

My 2 sapphire vapor x 7970's are out for delivery!! Should I be excited or is crossfire gonna suck compared to my old 680's? Hoping for the best though! 2 Be honest i am nervous like a first time delidder


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> My 2 sapphire vapor x 7970's are out for delivery!! Should I be excited or is crossfire gonna suck compared to my old 680's? Hoping for the best though! 2 Be honest i am nervous like a first time delidder


Why you nervous what you planning on doing to them ? The GPU core is pre-delided just waiting for CLP







I went from 570's SLI to 7970' s crossfire and have no issues . No micro stutter or anything. They OC well and go like hell , enjoy them. They also fold well now 50K ppd per card .


----------



## stickg1

Whaaaa? They finally released a decent AMD core for folding at home? Used to aggravate me that my 7970 would only get 9K PPD and more often than not have errors on the WU...


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Whaaaa? They finally released a decent AMD core for folding at home? Used to aggravate me that my 7970 would only get 9K PPD and more often than not have errors on the WU...


Yip have netted 700 K in the last week from the wu's


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Why you nervous what you planning on doing to them ? The GPU core is pre-delided just waiting for CLP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went from 570's SLI to 7970' s crossfire and have no issues . No micro stutter or anything. They OC well and go like hell , enjoy them. They also fold well now 50K ppd per card .


Thanks for the confidence builder. All I want from them is not to stutter. I don't even really need them to be faster than the 680's because they handled everything alright. I will be happy with smooth, same speed, and a bonus gigabyte of vram. If they can achieve that I will be a happy camper. The reason I switched was to get the extra vram hoping all else would just be equal.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> hmmm, maybe if im very careful, it sucks i cant hold on to anything with my right hand due to cerebral palsy without giving it a death grip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can i delid the cpu in an old dell, it has a pentium d inside


i would be really carefull use a cloth if you need to use the vice.
this video here is my favorite way to delid because the chance of ruining your chip is a lot less than using a razor the whole time and risk scratching the pcb.




and i not sure if you can practice on a pentium d it may be solderded to the die


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I got a second chip too, can't even stay on desktop without crashing in 2 seconds at 4.8GHz / 1.45V.
> 
> Time to delid the first one I think... (5GHz, 1.44V stable)...


What MOBO are you using? Did you check the voltage points to see what voltage you are actually using? I am never going to trust a motherboard vcore read ouut ever again.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> that's how I feel


Me too :-(


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryboto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's not the point. The point to see how good your chip is, to 'bin' it. Boot at 1.3v, if you can get software overclock (not booting) to 5ghz or above, it's worth delidding. Below that is a judgement call or simply not worth it. like less than 4.8 would be not worth delidding and a bad chip. [email protected] and having issues doesn't really sound like a great chip, but maybe you have a decent chip.
> 
> 
> 
> I will need more than 1.36v(or maybe other tweaks like enabling PLL overvoltage), BUT looking here - http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet/0_100 at the 3570K 5ghz OC's, the lowest vcore is 1.368v.
> 
> If delidding really knocks ~20C off of load temps, I'm pretty sure I've got a good shot at 5ghz.
Click to expand...

You do realize that the guy who hit [email protected], he has a one in a million chip and that he can probably boot 5ghz on stock voltage, right? My chip is like most chips that are within the ~5% that can do 5ghz on less than 1.55v - I can boot at [email protected] but I'm not stable at all. It took an extra ~.2v for me to actually be stable at that voltage. On average it takes around 1.45v for 5ghz.

Why dont you just see how far you can go with 1.3v?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

So many posts....wow:
Val: Get some wood -> lol









Belial: True, although I might as well hope for the best (about folding)

Swag: In Cyprus is was a huge problem, people were buying things they couldn't afford with loans to "show off" - people always wanted to show their wealth, wealth they never had. Thus the problem with the Greek economy, where there was too much lending and no way to pay it back. That might be the same mentality for the person who dropped so much on GPU's.

Justanoldman: Bro, I love your contributions here, please don't leave. As for people being spiteful, it happens everywhere. I almost get it daily on YouTube by haters being idiots. I just troll them now. I don't expect you to do that here, but just ignore it. I must say, sometimes it is hard to ignore - especially when it comes from forum MODERATORS on OCN: http://www.overclock.net/t/1362043/my-experience-with-scan-uk-asus-motherboard-antec-920-rma/40#post_19506831

Long story short, some people have nothing better to do than sit behind a computer and make other people feel like they are stupid, and/or insult them. Those people I consider no lifes. I'm not saying ANYONE in this thread is like that, I'm just saying as a general comment.
I hope you understand and keep posting over here.

As for the BCLK thing - no one I know uses over 100 for IB. Using 350 FSB is a thing of the past. People can use over 100 to around 110 if they want to for short term benchmarking and/or can use it in the long run, but for simplicity of numbers and a more stable OC, people just use 100. As you must remember the BCLK adjusts RAM, CPU and most probably PCI-e speeds. Back in the day, you had options for all three, now you only have 1 option.

On another note, been reading up over here about all the nail polish.
Do I have to use it at all? Remember my scratch I had on my PCB - would it be essential for me to cover that scratch from the IHS? As for the time being, I've had no problems (like shorting of CPU etc)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Gimme that software meow!


Getting closer...

Now to hook them up and wait 3 days to get the air out of my loop lol


----------



## Stige

Second delid attempt... semi succesful.

Dual Channel seems to b0rked, pretty common problem it seems lol

BUT DEM TEMPS!

53/54/56/54C @ 7min of Prime95 atm.

Temps were 85C+ before delid at these settings O_O
1.44V, 5GHz.

Using the IHS atm, couldn't get enough pressure or something on the CPU to get it to boot without the IHS on.

EDIT: Was too lazy to run Prime more, ran IBT and temps maxed out at 60/65/66/64C with Standard.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> You do realize that the guy who hit [email protected], he has a one in a million chip and that he can probably boot 5ghz on stock voltage, right? My chip is like most chips that are within the ~5% that can do 5ghz on less than 1.55v - I can boot at [email protected] but I'm not stable at all. It took an extra ~.2v for me to actually be stable at that voltage. On average it takes around 1.45v for 5ghz.
> 
> Why dont you just see how far you can go with 1.3v?


id say 2 in one million


----------



## inedenimadam

just practiced on a old Pentium 4, I cant know for 100% sure that it worked because my socket 478 mobo is shot out. Surprisingly easy...less than 2 minutes to pop the top, not a scratch on the thing. I am putting an order in today for some LCP.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> quote name= Belial
> It is odd but I've heard one other guy say he had an easier overclock with bclk x multi than multi alone. Who knows why or what's really going on, maybe just 'incorrect' stress testing.
> 
> EXPERIMENT #19511256 Official: TonicX
> The BCLK question is a real onion and since there are literally infinate variables(Different stress test, different hardware, different color nail polish on your cpu, i will do some good old empirical science.
> 
> 1. Test trials begin on my render rig using the Ivy Bridge validated AIDA64 System Stability Test
> 2. Fans will be set 30-60 [40%power ate 30* scaling to reach full 100% fan power at 60*
> 3. MOW techniques will not be implimented (MOW = Minnesota Open Window)
> 4. The Case will remain stationary with both side panels off
> 5. the OC settings will remain where they have been for the last 24+ hours call it Core Speed BcLK vs No BcLK
> senerio A. Core speed 4897.8 Mz x47.0 , Bus Speed 104.21 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
> vs
> senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
> 
> 6. Data will be shared Live with OCN official Delided Ivy Crew via my Gaming rig Quad Core 775 Gigabyte
> 
> 7. As a scientist I no longer 'Care" and let go of all bias. I SIMPLY WANT TO KNOW.
> 
> 8. This test is not 24/7 as I do not undertake Render session with that timeframe but 36-48-or 72 hours cranked is not uncommon.
> 
> 9. Purpose: Stress-Testing Computers
> 
> 10. Risks: Stress-Testing Members
> 
> Any member feedback is welcome!
> especially anyone familiar with AIDA64 v2.80.2300 extreme software
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


Thursday march 16 1:02 PM @ 10 hours 52 minute into EXPERIMENT #19511256

I woke-up to find that Senerio A has Failed the AIDA64 System Stability Test -

Observations:
1. Test trials Paused(no-stress)
2. Fans are still working
3. The MOW is not in affect- however Direct sunlight is bathing the black ATX case
4. Case open with with side panel off
5. The OC settings remain at:
senerio A. Core speed 4897.8 Mz x47.0 , Bus Speed 104.21 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
6. Temps normal for idle conditions
7. Windows 8 seams fully functional, reports no BSOD, has not rebooted, has UP TIME of 1:04:54:16
8. Stress-Testing of TonicX = minimal

Investigations:
1. What made the AIDA64 System Stability Test report: 3/14/2013/ 6:35:37 AM - WARNING: HARDWARE FAILURE DETECTED! TEST STOPPED
2. How do I harvest data from AIDA64
3. Did heat from the sun introduce a significate new variable to EXPERIMENT #19511256
4. Is Hardware damaged
5. Did Hardware damage occure during StressTest_01

Plan:
1. Table Question in OVERCLOCK.NET forum: What data can be found in AIDA64 to persue answer to investigative questions?
2. Reboot
3. Dianostic test
4. Change OC setting in BIOS to senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
5. Begin StressTest_002
6. Pause/Hold StressTest_002 for discussion.

Ok someone talk to me. How do i use AIDA64 (i see a report wizard)?
Any Questions, Comments, Advise would be useful now?
What do YOU think.

shout outs:
Thanks JOA3D43 for the support and the link. +rep
Thanks Valgaur for this lively thread. +rep
Thanks Justanoldman for being passionate about Overclocking. +rep
Thanks Belial for the challenge. +rep



EDIT: here is a link to the AIDA64 report on my site http://www.iversondigital.com/Report_StressTest_001.htm








*"Yeah my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What MOBO are you using? Did you check the voltage points to see what voltage you are actually using? I am never going to trust a motherboard vcore read ouut ever again.


Z77 OC Formula, should be in my sig rig.

The 1.44V is measured with a DMM, CPU-Z shows just ~1.41V for me.
Not as bad as my E4 was but still off by too much.

On another note: I was the one that had more stable clock with upping BCLK and lowering multi to achieve same overclock with my old 2500K.
Currently running 5.1GHz with 104.1x49.

More speed = better! Everything counts, this is OCN right? Then why wouldn't you use the BCLK to overclock!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Second delid attempt... semi succesful.
> 
> Dual Channel seems to b0rked, pretty common problem it seems lol
> 
> BUT DEM TEMPS!
> 
> 53/54/56/54C @ 7min of Prime95 atm.
> 
> Temps were 85C+ before delid at these settings O_O
> 1.44V, 5GHz.
> 
> Using the IHS atm, couldn't get enough pressure or something on the CPU to get it to boot without the IHS on.
> 
> EDIT: Was too lazy to run Prime more, ran IBT and temps maxed out at 60/65/66/64C with Standard.


how do you know it is borked ?


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> how do you know it is borked ?


Wouldn't get past 55 code with them in dual channel but work in single channel?









Someone on a Finnish forum said though that he got his dual channel to work after reapplying paste and everything again, maybe I just got some waste on some wrong place.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Wouldn't get past 55 code with them in dual channel but work in single channel?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone on a Finnish forum said though that he got his dual channel to work after reapplying paste and everything again, maybe I just got some waste on some wrong place.


good luck, did you scratch the pcb ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> After seeing what happened with the last 3770k Evga would be sending me threatening letters if I gave you moar vollts for the 680s
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you get stuck with


Gimme! Gimme now!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nope...Sell that 680, don't be silly. It's crazy weak compared to a Titan or a 7970, and overclocks a lot less unless you do a lot of complicated hard mods, and still won't yield a big improvement. Each 50mhz you add to a 7970 are much more noticeable for benching.
> Plus you can now even FOLD on AMD cards man, they give great ppd using open cl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (weak compute on the 680s vs a 7970 too)
> 7970s
> Nope, reference 7970's have voltage control, non ref don't except for a few. Non ref like the Matrix platinum have all the bells and whistles, and are awesome for ln2, or a lightning.
> Go for it!!!


What 7970s though? Id be getting either 3 or 4 of them for my loop. Plus to bench them.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> good luck, did you scratch the pcb ?


No signs of physical damage to the PCB so not sure what's up with it, maybe it is like the guy said on Finnish forum, just random things adding up.

Will try to clean it up properly and reinstall to see if it helps.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> No signs of physical damage to the PCB so not sure what's up with it, maybe it is like the guy said on Finnish forum, just random things adding up.
> 
> Will try to clean it up properly and reinstall to see if it helps.


good luck !


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Gimme! Gimme now!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What 7970s though? Id be getting either 3 or 4 of them for my loop. Plus to bench them.


Even the lighting gets out performed by 7950s....


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> No signs of physical damage to the PCB so not sure what's up with it, maybe it is like the guy said on Finnish forum, just random things adding up.
> 
> Will try to clean it up properly and reinstall to see if it helps.


Check MOBO pins, check CPU socket holes


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Second delid attempt... semi succesful.
> 
> Dual Channel seems to b0rked, pretty common problem it seems lol
> 
> BUT DEM TEMPS!
> 
> 53/54/56/54C @ 7min of Prime95 atm.
> 
> Temps were 85C+ before delid at these settings O_O
> 1.44V, 5GHz.
> 
> Using the IHS atm, couldn't get enough pressure or something on the CPU to get it to boot without the IHS on.
> 
> EDIT: Was too lazy to run Prime more, ran IBT and temps maxed out at 60/65/66/64C with Standard.


How borked is your dual channel? You couldn't boot until you moved the ram around?

What razor blade did you use? And it's very possible that a piece of that rubbery glue you rub off, may have gotten stuck on the contacts or in your motherboard pins, make sure that didn't happen. almost happened to me but i was so ocd about everything that the 10th time i remounted the chip I noticed.


----------



## Radmanhs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would be really carefull use a cloth if you need to use the vice.
> this video here is my favorite way to delid because the chance of ruining your chip is a lot less than using a razor the whole time and risk scratching the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i not sure if you can practice on a pentium d it may be solderded to the die


ok, where i work during one of my classes i have a supply of old pentiums, may just practice on those


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Even the lighting gets out performed by 7950s....


----------



## lilchronic

im bout to get another 670 FTW next week PAY DAY


----------



## TonicX

Stress-test_002 no BCLK overclock has begun

1. Test trials continue on my render rig using the Ivy Bridge validated AIDA64 System Stability Test
2. Fans will be set 30-60 [40%power ate 30* scaling to reach full 100% fan power at 60*
3. MOW techniques will not be implimented (MOW = Minnesota Open Window)
4. The Case will remain stationary with both side panels off
5. the OC settings have been changed in BIOS to:
senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled

pre-test
1. cinebench .................pass 9.78 (down from senerio A 9.90)
2. intel burn test................ success

Here's what I've learned from member posting concerning raising the BCLK
1. 100.1- 104.9 is a moderately raised BCLK and over 105 is more extreme dangerous [DEPENDING ON THE TEMP CONDITIONS AND COMPONENTS as with all OCs]
2. It is a viable option for benchmarking and short tests but should be avoided for Long tests because it is less stable.
Quote:


> Totally Dubbed
> As for the BCLK thing - no one I know uses over 100 for IB. Using 350 FSB is a thing of the past. People can use over 100 to around 110 if they want to for short term benchmarking and/or can use it in the long run, but for simplicity of numbers and a more stable OC, people just use 100. As you must remember the BCLK adjusts RAM, CPU and most probably PCI-e speeds. Back in the day, you had options for all three, now you only have 1 option


Quote:


> Justanoldman
> You couldn't pay me to oc with AI Suite or using BCLK on Ivy.


Quote:


> stickg1
> I'd use BCLK for benching or HWBot but not for doing something where long term stability is paramount. It effects too many different clock rates in your system. It is also notorious for corrupting your OS if you push it too far. I don't particularly like using it because I use my PC primarily for gaming and don't want to go through the hassle of reinstalling everything for a few tens of MHz. If I was a bencher with a stripped OS I would mess with it more. 100-105 BCLK is fine, anything more and you're asking for trouble.


The test is currently a the 1 hour mark for the BCLK @ 100 x 49 right now.



stay tuned for more updates! stay tuned! get it? Ha! I kill me.

 Official Corsair Hydro Series Club 
*5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Stress-test_002 no BCLK overclock has begun
> 
> 1. Test trials continue on my render rig using the Ivy Bridge validated AIDA64 System Stability Test
> 2. Fans will be set 30-60 [40%power ate 30* scaling to reach full 100% fan power at 60*
> 3. MOW techniques will not be implimented (MOW = Minnesota Open Window)
> 4. The Case will remain stationary with both side panels off
> 5. the OC settings have been changed in BIOS to:
> senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.464 Offset Enabled
> 
> pre-test
> 1. cinebench .................pass 9.78 (down from senerio A 9.90)
> 2. intel burn test................ success
> 
> Here's what I've learned from member posting concerning raising the BCLK
> 1. 100.1- 104.9 is a moderately raised BCLK and over 105 is more extreme dangerous [DEPENDING ON THE TEMP CONDITIONS AND COMPONENTS as with all OCs]
> 2. It is a viable option for benchmarking and short tests but should be avoided for Long tests because it is less stable.
> 
> The test is currently a the 1 hour mark for the BCLK @ 100 x 49 right now.
> 
> 
> 
> stay tuned for more updates! stay tuned! get it? Ha! I kill me.
> 
> Official Corsair Hydro Series Club
> *5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


Thanks for benching +rep to you dude!

Indeed yeah, BCLK gives more "bandwidth" as such - and thus gets better performance. Just be warned in going too high, as you might blow your PCI-e slot equipment (like GPU)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Thanks for benching +rep to you dude!
> 
> Indeed yeah, BCLK gives more "bandwidth" as such - and thus gets better performance. Just be warned in going too high, as you might blow your PCI-e slot equipment (like GPU)


Even running 110 or more on ivy, & much more than that with 1366 rigs, I've never seen hardware damaged with overclocking the pci-e. The worst I've done is corrupted an OS, it was with one SSD that didn't like over 110 bclk, Another identical ssd was fine with more, & all my HDDs have been fine with more. Never saw any issues with other hardware besides the one ssd.

If there is sensitive data on the drive, it isn't a bad idea to be careful with bclk in case of corruption. Other than that I don't see any harm.


----------



## Stige

Friend ran his i3 (Sandy) with 107.2MHz BCLK without any issues for nearly 2 years before he upgraded last christmas. The CPU is still in use on another PC without any issues.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Gimme! Gimme now!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What 7970s though? Id be getting either 3 or 4 of them for my loop. Plus to bench them.


Reference cards are easier to control using soft, most of them will allow you to. BUT vrm might be weaker so I'd suggest either Asus DcuII TOP or Gigabyte Windforce 3x OC (but not all of those are voltage unlocked, only older version...otherwise you'll have to hardmod them apart from the OVP/OCP mods you'll have to do anyway to go over 20% power target)
Lightning is best for ln2 really.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Even the lighting gets out performed by 7950s....


Nice








But not true man...Look at the scoreboard, no 7950 in that ranking for a while scrolling down...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Even running 110 or more on ivy, & much more than that with 1366 rigs, I've never seen hardware damaged with overclocking the pci-e. The worst I've done is corrupted an OS, it was with one SSD that didn't like over 110 bclk, Another identical ssd was fine with more, & all my HDDs have been fine with more. Never saw any issues with other hardware besides the one ssd.
> 
> If there is sensitive data on the drive, it isn't a bad idea to be careful with bclk in case of corruption. Other than that I don't see any harm.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Friend ran his i3 (Sandy) with 107.2MHz BCLK without any issues for nearly 2 years before he upgraded last christmas. The CPU is still in use on another PC without any issues.


True dat...ssd data corruption is the only concern I'd have and instability for 24/7 use. For benching, bclk all the way


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Even running 110 or more on ivy, & much more than that with 1366 rigs, I've never seen hardware damaged with overclocking the pci-e. The worst I've done is corrupted an OS, it was with one SSD that didn't like over 110 bclk, Another identical ssd was fine with more, & all my HDDs have been fine with more. Never saw any issues with other hardware besides the one ssd.
> 
> If there is sensitive data on the drive, it isn't a bad idea to be careful with bclk in case of corruption. Other than that I don't see any harm.


But isn't BCLK OC'ing the PCI-e slot speeds too? Thus meaning you get better GPU benches, but with too much BCLK - you could blow it? That's my understanding of it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im bout to get another 670 FTW next week PAY DAY


...until then, anticipation is half the fun







:


----------



## Littlejoe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> I did it, was easy too. Won't be able to join the club because I didn't do the before temp test, but that's okay. I know I did it. Now if my CLP would just get here. This is a spare cpu (I5 3750) as I didn't like it's oc. Would only get to 4.3 stable so I rolled the dice again.
> 
> One question, can I clean the glue with ArctiClean?
> 
> Thanks for the guide!


OCN name: Littlejoe
CPU: I5-3750
on die-TIM: CLPro
ihs-TIM: AS-5
Mhz gained:100
OC after delid:4.42
Temp drops:Not sure. Didn't test it before I took it out. Compared to my good chip. It looks like 14c with more voltage then the other chip
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2730679

Can't wait to get my other chip done and back in. It can do 4.5 @1.232v


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...there are different approaches you can use, it all works. I tend to set the multiplier manually but lower (say 45) in the bios and the voltage on 'auto', then boot up - with XTU automatically loading the last good profile (say 52).
> 
> By setting a lower multiplier on auto-v in the bios, I believe and have seen some evidence to that effect (though nothing iron-clad yet) that with C and sleep states on, your chip will idle or be on partial load at lower voltages...even at 5.2, I see 0.98v...then again, coming out of sleep and low-load states probably requires more of a quick boost...anyways, back to your question: Both manual and auto settings for v-core in Bios work subsequently with XTU


I opened up XTU and seem to be missing quite a lot of the tweaking options, and can't get the memory options despite ticking the checkbox in the settings. I increased the multiplier to 45 but still had to manually adjust VCore through Gigabyte Easy Tune 6 to get it stable. Changing the _Additional Turbo Voltage_ setting in XTU didn't impact VCore or stability at all.



I'm now running 4.5GHz @ 1.290V which droops to 1.272V according to CPU-Z under load. It survived 5 minutes of stress testing under XTU and so far 30 minutes of Prime95 custom blend with 90% memory utilisation. I've left it running while I'm at work so will have 12 hours by this evening. I did notice a couple of WHEA errors in the event log during the stress testing so far. Do I need to be worried about these?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Reference cards are easier to control using soft, most of them will allow you to. BUT vrm might be weaker so I'd suggest either Asus DcuII TOP or Gigabyte Windforce 3x OC (but not all of those are voltage unlocked, only older version...otherwise you'll have to hardmod them apart from the OVP/OCP mods you'll have to do anyway to go over 20% power target)
> Lightning is best for ln2 really.
> Nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But not true man...Look at the scoreboard, no 7950 in that ranking for a while scrolling down...
> 
> True dat...ssd data corruption is the only concern I'd have and instability for 24/7 use. For benching, bclk all the way


...in fact, contrary to what some folks think and publish, some mobos come from the factory with a slightly higher clock than 100.00 already







- note the word 'slightly' (more on that later). My own work / productivity systems are tested up to 106 (the personal cut-off I use with the usual equipment I run)...benching a bit higher...but again, it all depends on your a.) starting position per mobo and b.) very specifically the type of mobo / bios, memory and PCIe GPUs you are running - no one-size-fits-all answer.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Spread spectrum messes with that as well...I'd just set it at 100 manually and disable spread spectrum and focus on multiplier ocing for 24/7 anyway. That's just me though.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Reference cards are easier to control using soft, most of them will allow you to. BUT vrm might be weaker so I'd suggest either Asus DcuII TOP or Gigabyte Windforce 3x OC (but not all of those are voltage unlocked, only older version...otherwise you'll have to hardmod them apart from the OVP/OCP mods you'll have to do anyway to go over 20% power target)
> Lightning is best for ln2 really.
> Nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But not true man...Look at the scoreboard, no 7950 in that ranking for a while scrolling down...
> 
> True dat...ssd data corruption is the only concern I'd have and instability for 24/7 use. For benching, bclk all the way


It is very true id say a good 10% faster.

Reason u see no 7950s is because ppl who compete on HWBot are not gonna buy 7950s to do it there gonna use 7970s lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Reference cards are easier to control using soft, most of them will allow you to. BUT vrm might be weaker so I'd suggest either Asus DcuII TOP or Gigabyte Windforce 3x OC (but not all of those are voltage unlocked, only older version...otherwise you'll have to hardmod them apart from the OVP/OCP mods you'll have to do anyway to go over 20% power target)
> Lightning is best for ln2 really.
> Nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But not true man...Look at the scoreboard, no 7950 in that ranking for a while scrolling down...
> 
> True dat...ssd data corruption is the only concern I'd have and instability for 24/7 use. For benching, bclk all the way


I was thinking the windforce from gigabyte, the ghz edition or no?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I was thinking the windforce from gigabyte, the ghz edition or no?


Nope, ghz ed might be locked...older non ghz are the ones to get.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Reference cards are easier to control using soft, most of them will allow you to. BUT vrm might be weaker so I'd suggest either Asus DcuII TOP or Gigabyte Windforce 3x OC (but not all of those are voltage unlocked, only older version...otherwise you'll have to hardmod them apart from the OVP/OCP mods you'll have to do anyway to go over 20% power target)
> Lightning is best for ln2 really.
> Nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But not true man...Look at the scoreboard, no 7950 in that ranking for a while scrolling down...
> 
> True dat...ssd data corruption is the only concern I'd have and instability for 24/7 use. For benching, bclk all the way


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is very true id say a good 10% faster.
> 
> Reason u see no 7950s is because ppl who compete on HWBot are not gonna buy 7950s to do it there gonna use 7970s lol.


Hokies is partly right, although at least one guy has pushed the 7970 & 3770k on Ln2 not many are. If andre was using one, it would probably be higher up the ranks.
But that one ln2 cooled 7950 result, in the rankings counting all gpus in 3dmark 11 it is way down that list, #160 in the ranking. http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark11_-_performance/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> But isn't BCLK OC'ing the PCI-e slot speeds too? Thus meaning you get better GPU benches, but with too much BCLK - you could blow it? That's my understanding of it.


Upping the bclk does overclock the pci-e, it isn't going to blow anything, but data corruption does become a possibility. There are a lot of overclocking do's & don't's that get ignored, bclk is like vdimm, a lot of people think going over 1.5V on the memory will kill their cpu, far from it. Kinda like a bit of bclk.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I was thinking the windforce from gigabyte, the ghz edition or no?


I've been totally happy with my lightning, good overclocker with all types of cooling, & can take what you throw at it.
If you're going to run on air, no reference cooler unless you're comfortable with earplugs. & as ivan pointed out, Ghz editions aren't really better binned chips, & many are voltage locked.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've been totally happy with my lightning, good overclocker with all types of cooling, & can take what you throw at it.
> If you're going to run on air, no reference cooler unless you're comfortable with earplugs. & as ivan pointed out, Ghz editions aren't really better binned chips, & many are voltage locked.


Alright so the normal ones huh. FtW ill be ln2/ h20ing them. Will ln2 them first mostlikely then through them into my rig for normal usage









I mean I wouldn't mind keeping the 680 and get 2 more of them but I want some serious boints this summer. New 3770K soon (hopefully) got my new 8800 ultras waiting for me got my 8800 gtx hungry for ln2 and just need a new psu mobo and then ill be good for a while, just need pots and ln2 and moar gpus really.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Alright so the normal ones huh. FtW ill be ln2/ h20ing them. Will ln2 them first mostlikely then through them into my rig for normal usage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mean I wouldn't mind keeping the 680 and get 2 more of them but I want some serious boints this summer. New 3770K soon (hopefully) got my new 8800 ultras waiting for me got my 8800 gtx hungry for ln2 and just need a new psu mobo and then ill be good for a while, just need pots and ln2 and moar gpus really.


For ln2 I would go for the lightning or matrix, not sure if the giga models come with overvoltage software or ready made hardware mod points like the lightning/matrix do.
Otherwise, you will be soldering to those little 0.5mm resistors for more vgpu. I've done it many times & still found just the other day that soldering on a new expensive card can be really nerve-wracking.


----------



## sakerfalcon

Two for two successful thus far. Mystery nick on the PCB, I have no idea how I got there, because by the time I was using the sides I was almost pushing it flat with my thumb. The damage seems to be a corner of the blade rubbing up against the PCB - you can sort of see it squished up. I recommend using Feather blades first to split the glue and IHS apart, and then using a thin break-off box-cutter blade to do the rest. In my case, the razor blade's width was perfect so I could push it all the way in without going near the die on the sides.



1. Feather blades are thin so easy to break/loosen the glue. It goes through em like butter.
2. Razor blades are thicker to fully separate the IHS and PCB. The blade goes in easy and the thickness forces the two apart. I just used my thumb to gently push the blade further and further in, and when the base of my thumb hits the CPU PCB I know that side is completely done.
Then I used nails on the side to twist off the top.



This time it took 15 minutes tops. The second time around I knew what I was doing.


----------



## Hokies83

Yah if u want to really compete you need a 7970 lighting or Matrix.

I just wany my 7950s each running 1250mhz + and 1600mhz mem +

Which should beat a 680 in most games.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Even the lighting gets out performed by 7950s....


I got a half chub looking at those pics.


----------



## stickg1

Ivan and FTW, you guys see this stuff yet?? Could an Ivy run this? I've only seen speeds this high on AMD chips...

http://www.corsair.com/us/memory-by-product-family/vengeance/vengeance-extreme-memory-8gb-3000mhz-cl12-1-65v-ddr3-memory-kit-cml8gx3m2a3000c12r.html?utm_source=Corsair&utm_medium=FacebookTwitter&utm_content=ProductLink&utm_campaign=VengeanceEXTLaunch13


----------



## BradleyW

Thank you Ftw for the info about CPU short outs and so on.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Ivan and FTW, you guys see this stuff yet?? Could an Ivy run this? I've only seen speeds this high on AMD chips...
> 
> http://www.corsair.com/us/memory-by-product-family/vengeance/vengeance-extreme-memory-8gb-3000mhz-cl12-1-65v-ddr3-memory-kit-cml8gx3m2a3000c12r.html?utm_source=Corsair&utm_medium=FacebookTwitter&utm_content=ProductLink&utm_campaign=VengeanceEXTLaunch13


It is possible, not really sure about air or water even with a great IMC, but a great IMC + subzero temps should handle it.
I can't believe they gave that the Vengeance name. So many Vengeance kits barely qualify as low end memory, yet put the name that memory enthusiasts would avoid like the plague on a high end kit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Thank you Ftw for the info about CPU short outs and so on.


No problem, I should have posted that earlier, hadn't really been paying attention the 'nicked PCB, tried it & it works' or 'doesn't work' posts, insulating before powering up may increase chances of survival if it can short.


----------



## TonicX

I can't find a post here i read yesterday. so i need a little help.

fill in the blank.

"other than the multiplier, there are really only two voltages that you adjust for a simple overclock. The Vcore to raise cpu voltage to provide stability on higher multipliers and [BLANK] that can be lowered to help with high temperatures."

Answer in the form of a question!

Good-Luck

Que music








*"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I can't find a post here i read yesterday. so i need a little help.
> 
> fill in the blank.
> 
> "other than the multiplier, there are really only two voltages that you adjust for a simple overclock. The Vcore to raise cpu voltage to provide stability on higher multipliers and [BLANK] that can be lowered to help with high temperatures."
> 
> Answer in the form of a question!
> 
> Good-Luck
> 
> Que music
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


PLL Voltage? Not sure if it helps with temperatures though but generally 3 voltages you might need to adjust: VCore, PLL Voltage, VCCIO/VTT Voltage.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It is possible, not really sure about air or water even with a great IMC, but a great IMC + subzero temps should handle it.
> I can't believe they gave that the Vengeance name. So many Vengeance kits barely qualify as low end memory, yet put the name that memory enthusiasts would avoid like the plague on a high end kit.
> No problem, I should have posted that earlier, hadn't really been paying attention the 'nicked PCB, tried it & it works' or 'doesn't work' posts, insulating before powering up may increase chances of survival if it can short.


...from the press release (grains of salt) "..The extreme-speed 3000MHz rating of the Vengeance Extreme memory kits is the result of a rigorous internal four-stage hand-screening process performed by Corsair engineers. This process is passed by fewer than one in 50 memory ICs. Performance qualification is performed on select *Intel Z77* based motherboards, including the ASUS P8Z77-I DELUXE and ASRock Z77 OC Formula. To hit their rated speeds, the modules require a 3rd Generation Intel Core unlocked processor with an Integrated Memory Controller capable of running 3000MHz."

...I have seen Asus J.J. talk on NewEgg.tv / YouTube about some of their top boards (z77 / x79) getting certified for 3000 MHz ram


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I can't find a post here i read yesterday. so i need a little help.
> 
> fill in the blank.
> 
> "other than the multiplier, there are really only two voltages that you adjust for a simple overclock. The Vcore to raise cpu voltage to provide stability on higher multipliers and [BLANK] that can be lowered to help with high temperatures."
> 
> Answer in the form of a question!
> 
> Good-Luck
> 
> Que music
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


Not sure what fills in the blank, never found anything besides vcore that can be lowered to help with high temperatures. Lowering PLL made no difference in temps when I tested it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I can't find a post here i read yesterday. so i need a little help.
> 
> fill in the blank.
> 
> "other than the multiplier, there are really only two voltages that you adjust for a simple overclock. The Vcore to raise cpu voltage to provide stability on higher multipliers and [BLANK] that can be lowered to help with high temperatures."
> 
> Answer in the form of a question!
> Good-Luck
> 
> Que music
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


llc is your answer


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So something weird that's going on. I know if my OC isn't stable if afterburner doesn't start and my screen flickers. Once I get to a stable OC afterburner starts fine. I have it set to start when windows starts. Has anyone experienced this?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> I opened up XTU and seem to be missing quite a lot of the tweaking options, and can't get the memory options despite ticking the checkbox in the settings. I increased the multiplier to 45 but still had to manually adjust VCore through Gigabyte Easy Tune 6 to get it stable. Changing the _Additional Turbo Voltage_ setting in XTU didn't impact VCore or stability at all.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm now running 4.5GHz @ 1.290V which droops to 1.272V according to CPU-Z under load. It survived 5 minutes of stress testing under XTU and so far 30 minutes of Prime95 custom blend with 90% memory utilisation. I've left it running while I'm at work so will have 12 hours by this evening. I did notice a couple of WHEA errors in the event log during the stress testing so far. Do I need to be worried about these?


...sorry for being short...in meetings typing on a small mobile...why only 5 min on XTU ? Memory or CPU test - whereby the memory test is a major build-in CPU test anyhow per win resource manager ? What kind of WHEA errors ?


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I can't find a post here i read yesterday. so i need a little help.
> 
> fill in the blank.
> 
> "other than the multiplier, there are really only two voltages that you adjust for a simple overclock. The Vcore to raise cpu voltage to provide stability on higher multipliers and [BLANK] that can be lowered to help with high temperatures."
> 
> Answer in the form of a question!
> 
> Good-Luck
> 
> Que music
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


A. PLL Voltage
B. VCCIO/VTT Voltage.
C. LLC
D. None of Above

I think it is "A" but maybe "C"


----------



## Radmanhs

anyone know where i can get old dead cpu's that i can delid for practice?


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> anyone know where i can get old dead cpu's that i can delid for practice?


See post #1, there is a list of cheap CPUs you can buy on ebay to practice with.

Here is a list of CPU's that should be able to be delidded and some are very cheap so great for saving your chips.

IHS Not Soldered To Die

Hyperthreading/Single Cores

-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
-(S-478) Celeron
-(S-775) Celeron
-Celeron 420
-Celeron 430
-Celeron 440
-AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)

Dual Cores

-AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
-Celeron Dual Core E1200
-Celeron Dual Core E1400
-Pentium Dual Core E2140
-Pentium Dual Core E2160
-Pentium Dual Core E2180
-Pentium Dual Core E2200
-Pentium Dual Core E2210
-Pentium Dual Core E2220
-Pentium Dual Core E6300
-Core 2 Duo E4300
-Core 2 Duo E4400
-Core 2 Duo E4500
-Core 2 Duo E4600
-Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E7200
-Core 2 Duo E7300
-Core 2 Duo E7400
-Core 2 Duo E7500
-Core 2 Duo E7600


----------



## Radmanhs

i have a couple old pentium 4's, how will i know if they are the type i can delid


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For ln2 I would go for the lightning or matrix, not sure if the giga models come with overvoltage software or ready made hardware mod points like the lightning/matrix do.
> Otherwise, you will be soldering to those little 0.5mm resistors for more vgpu. I've done it many times & still found just the other day that soldering on a new expensive card can be really nerve-wracking.


Yikes, I'm gonna give it a go on a 7600gt first. Last thing I tried was a fan controller I made and a 478 Asus mobo which scared me pretty bad. (damn small pins)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah if u want to really compete you need a 7970 lighting or Matrix.
> 
> I just wany my 7950s each running 1250mhz + and 1600mhz mem +
> 
> Which should beat a 680 in most games.


Go for the kill







Titan, who? (except on single card scenarios and ln2...no thanks)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> i have a couple old pentium 4's, how will i know if they are the type i can delid


Pentium 4 478 should be ok...those pretty much suck anyway unless they are extreme version (unlocked multiplier) which sell for a few bucks at fleabay.


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sorry for being short...in meetings typing on a small mobile...why only 5 min on XTU ? Memory or CPU test - whereby the memory test is a major build-in CPU test anyhow per win resource manager ? What kind of WHEA errors ?


That's ok








Just ran CPU test for 5 minutes as a quick check for problems since I only had limited time before going to work. Have left Prime95 running longer as I need a 12hr test for the Ivy Stable Club. I'm not sure what the exact WHEA errors were and will need to have a look at the event log entries when I get home tonight.


----------



## Littlejoe

So, I delidded my good chip tonight. This is my second delidding. The first one had a few hits on the pcb but lived. It wasn't a good chip to begin with, and still isn't. But, nothing ventured nothing gained right? After cleaning the good chip, there seems do be a small nick on the bottom corner. Don't know how I did it, and I'm not really worried about it. Anyways, I have high hopes for this chip. I plan on holding on to this set- up for at least the next year, maybe more. I plan on using CLPro on the dye and the IHS. My question is, should I take the time to Lap the IHC, or will the CLPro take care of it?

Thanks for looking


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> So, I delidded my good chip tonight. This is my second delidding. The first one had a few hits on the pcb but lived. It wasn't a good chip to begin with, and still isn't. But, nothing ventured nothing gained right? After cleaning the good chip, there seems do be a small nick on the bottom corner. Don't know how I did it, and I'm not really worried about it. Anyways, I have high hopes for this chip. I plan on holding on to this set- up for at least the next year, maybe more. I plan on using CLPro on the dye and the IHC. My question is, should I take the time to Lap the IHC, or will the CLPro take care of it?
> 
> Thanks for looking


...I didn't lap and have to go back in to do that...it depends on the IHS curvature and its 'fit' with the specific water-block you are using, re concave / convex issues...if it is all perfectly straight, I would say (others may differ) that lapping is optional though it wouldn't hurt, other than take off serial number info etc. Either way, congrats


----------



## ryboto

ordered my CLP...now contemplating lapping the thing., I have fine grit and rough grit sanding materials from my headlight cleaning kit....crafty?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Lap it if it works...otherwise make a shiny keychain with the ihs that reads 3770k. No point in having one for bragging rights if you can't read the model from it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> So, I delidded my good chip tonight. This is my second delidding. The first one had a few hits on the pcb but lived. It wasn't a good chip to begin with, and still isn't. But, nothing ventured nothing gained right? After cleaning the good chip, there seems do be a small nick on the bottom corner. Don't know how I did it, and I'm not really worried about it. Anyways, I have high hopes for this chip. I plan on holding on to this set- up for at least the next year, maybe more. I plan on using CLPro on the dye and the IHC. My question is, should I take the time to Lap the IHC, or will the CLPro take care of it?
> 
> Thanks for looking


Good job!


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Stress-test_002 no BCLK overclock has begun
> 
> 1. Test trials continue on my render rig using the Ivy Bridge validated AIDA64 System Stability Test
> 2. Fans will be set 30-60 [40%power ate 30* scaling to reach full 100% fan power at 60*
> 3. MOW techniques will not be implimented (MOW = Minnesota Open Window)
> 4. The Case will remain stationary with both side panels off
> 5. the OC settings have been changed in BIOS to:
> senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.410 Offset Enabled
> 
> pre-test
> 1. cinebench .................pass 9.78 (down from senerio A 9.90)
> 2. intel burn test................ success
> 
> Here's what I've learned from member posting concerning raising the BCLK
> 1. 100.1- 104.9 is a moderately raised BCLK and over 105 is more extreme dangerous [DEPENDING ON THE TEMP CONDITIONS AND COMPONENTS as with all OCs]
> 2. It is a viable option for benchmarking and short tests but should be avoided for Long tests because it is less stable.
> 
> The test is currently a the 1 hour mark for the BCLK @ 100 x 49 right now.
> 
> 
> 
> stay tuned for more updates! stay tuned! get it? Ha! I kill me.
> 
> Official Corsair Hydro Series Club
> *5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


Stress-Test_002 Has exceeded senerio A by one hour at 5:04:30 hours AIDA64 Stability Test: PASSED.
Im going to terminate the phase 1 of the EXPERIMENT

1. Since i was testing stability and the benchmark with Core speed 4897.8 Mz x47.0 , Bus Speed 104.21 MHz Core Voltage 1.410 Offset Enabled reported: 3/14/2013/ 6:35:37 AM - WARNING: HARDWARE FAILURE DETECTED! TEST STOPPED

2. and senerio B. Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage 1.410 Offset Enabled exceeded this time by 1 hour and was manually terminated.

the hypothesis of: "Raising the BCLK instead of the multiplier is less stable for extended time-frame benchmarking" is supported.

I do not know what "HARDWARE FAILURE DETECTED" means exactly.

i do know exactly what "TEST STOPPED"

Practical:
1. I see why use of BCLK Frequency increases are undesirable and will limit the use of this adjustment.
2. If this adjustment is dialed into the mix i should be minimized and use for purpose of achieving frequencies between the hundereds numerical place of MHz i.e. 3900, 4400, 5100, also expressed as the Tenths place of GHz i.e. 3.5, 4.2, 5.5
3. Doing some quick math *I see no reason to raise the BCLK on ivy bridge above 102.1* because at this point it achieves the equivilant of the next multiplier and then goes back to 100.0
3b. example: 49x multiplier with a BClk of 102 is 4998 and so it is pointless to go higher with the BCLK when It simple starts over at 50x 100.0
4. if i liked the speed, voltages, and temps at a clock between the pillar Multipliers say 4948 you obviously cannot achieve this with a bclk of 100.0 so in that case I would test it with some worst case senerio artaficial workload software like aida64, cinebench, Intel Burn Test, what have you to get a quick Idea if its good-to-go. but what really maters is the app I am using, Photoshop, After Effects, Cinema 4d, GRID, Battlefield3, Folding ect. is it stable. If It is I see no reason why not. OC that last ounce of performance.

5. I repeat my main discovery: NO NEED TO GO ABOVE 102 WITH THE IVY BRIDGE.
6. I will probably be Operating my Render Rig at Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage. If I render with all 8 threads.

Thanks to all the OCN Crewmen!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Thanks for sharing man!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *TonicX* wrote...
> ...
> 3. Doing some quick math *I see no reason to raise the BCLK on ivy bridge above 102.1* because at this point it achieves the equivilant of the next multiplier and then goes back to 100.0
> 3b. example: 49x multiplier with a BClk of 102 is 4998 and so it is pointless to go higher with the BCLK when It simple starts over at 50x 100.0
> 4. if i liked the speed, voltages, and temps at a clock between the pillar Multipliers say 4948 you obviously cannot achieve this with a bclk of 100.0 so in that case I would test it with some worst case senerio artaficial workload software like aida64, cinebench, Intel Burn Test, what have you to get a quick Idea if its good-to-go. but what really maters is the app I am using, Photoshop, After Effects, Cinema 4d, GRID, Battlefield3, Folding ect. is it stable. If It is I see no reason why not. OC that last ounce of performance.
> 5. I repeat my main discovery: NO NEED TO GO ABOVE 102 WITH THE IVY BRIDGE.
> 6. I will probably be Operating my Render Rig at Core speed 4900 Mz x49.0 , Bus speed 100 MHz Core Voltage. If I render with all 8 threads.
> 
> Thanks to all the OCN Crewmen!


...Kudos for the test...BCLK can be useful under CERTAIN circumstances (more later), and I trust you saw FtW 420's multiple posts on the subject...but really, its primary use comes when you are 'out of multipliers' and the only other way to increase speed by definition is BCLK...out of multipliers either means the extreme cooling folks (maxed with Ivy at 63 multi), or 'us' when you are at your max 'sustainable' multi...say for the sake of argument 5 giggles...yet your CPU 'wall' (huge jump re required delta in vCore) won't occur until 5040 or so...that is when you would use a small BCLK step-up.

I have run many machines at a non-100 BCLK for years on end...and also the latest is a 3770 non-K which is multiplier limited and part of a VM at close 4.6 GHz since last October as a localhost server w/various databases and such using BCLK + 6.xx...no problems in stability and such...even when compared to two more that are part of the same VM that run at 4.3 GHz

*BUT:* When setting it up, all the stability testing had to be redone because what works re memory timing etc @ 100 BCLK may actually not be stable at 104 or so...everything has to be redone with a 'non-100' setting, usually by picking a fairly low multi / CPU GHz speed well below the known max of the CPU, then increasing BCLK in 0.5 steps or so...testing, testing, testing...but again, great work


----------



## Stige

This is OCN, there is no such thing as "no need to go above 102.1".

104x50 is always faster than 102x51, even if it is only by little


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> So, I delidded my good chip tonight. This is my second delidding. The first one had a few hits on the pcb but lived. It wasn't a good chip to begin with, and still isn't. But, nothing ventured nothing gained right? After cleaning the good chip, there seems do be a small nick on the bottom corner. Don't know how I did it, and I'm not really worried about it. Anyways, I have high hopes for this chip. I plan on holding on to this set- up for at least the next year, maybe more. I plan on using CLPro on the dye and the IHC. My question is, should I take the time to Lap the IHC, or will the CLPro take care of it?
> 
> Thanks for looking


The reason we use Thermal paste is because the top of the cpu cover and the bottom of the heatsink are not perfectly flat and smooth. How to correct that and use minimal Thermal Paste is the objective.
Joa3D43 address the shape of your heatsink, If it is flat like my corsair H60 the you can greatly increase surface to surface contact by lapping the IHS. I wrapped sand paper around a super-flat piece of beveled glass see: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508 This took me almost an hour but i went all the way to flat cooper removing the nickle plating from the entire top surface.

I Lapped the IHS completely flat top and bottom starting with 360 and 400 then 800 finally 1600 sandpaper. I think i could have gone to 2500 or 3000 grit.
btw dont lap the die it is silicon(Glass) or underside of the cover.(i dont see how to make the flat and it would only degrade(scratch) the smooth metal.

personally i think a good lap job is essential to making the COOL LABORATORY ULTRA fill in the gap between the cpu and the heatsink.

You can find fine grit sandpaper at home improvement stores, hardware store, woodworking store like ROCKLER woodworking.

whip the thing of with an achohol swab after, and i sure your alreadly know about contaminates and static shock dangers.

take your time and i sure you'll do GREAT!







*"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Great job TonicX - 2 reps from me for the tests.
The reason one would go beyond that for BCLK is simple: You would want more for the PCI-E slots - although CPU might not increase, GPU might do indeed.
Regardless, as I would have thought, pointless going over unless you are going to bench.


----------



## justanoldman

In order for new people to not make mistakes in this area I feel compelled to post despite my disappointment with a couple members. Regulars please feel free to ignore the following.

Do not lap your IHS, I will say this again, do not lap your IHS. Having obtained information directly from the designer of a current cold plate for a cooler, it is illogical to lap your IHS without significant testing before doing so.

Most cold plate manufactures assume, and rightly so, that your IHS is slightly concave. They therefore make their cold plates slightly convex in order to match better. After careful testing I have confirmed that the information I previously posted here is correct. The clamping mechanism of your mobo slightly changes the shape of your IHS when installed.

Unless you plan on lapping your IHS while it is installed in your mobo, you have a reasonably high probability of make it fit worse, not better with your cold plate. This is easy to confirm if you want to take the time. Take you mobo out of the case, get a perfectly flat edged piece of metal or razor and a flashlight. Measure the shape of your IHS both in and out of the mobo. Normally these will be slightly different.

Furthermore, if you did manage to somehow make your IHS perfectly flat while installed in the mobo, you would then have to lap your cold plate as well because it is most likely not flat. You immediately void your warranty on most coolers by doing so.

Now before some of you throw your normal hissy fits, remember that I wrote that you should not lap before testing, I did not write no one should lap ever. If you measure your IHS while clamped down in the mobo and it turns out to be convex or noticeably twisted in some way, then lapping may help. This would be an unusual circumstance though.

I spent an entire day installing and reinstalling my H100i with a lapped IHS. It took longer than it should have but I finally found the optimal way to install it, and it was in direct contradiction to the standard instructions. From all my testing I determined that I would have been better off not lapping the IHS, but I did not know this information when I did. I posted it all in here awhile back. You can look and see that I commented at the time how surprised I was that lapping did not help my temps. That led me to do some research into why.

Furthermore, my testing showed that despite my best efforts it is impossible to place the delidded IHS in exactly the same position on the die/pcb every time. These slight variations in the positioning of an IHS can further affect the fit with your cooler because of the force exerted by the clamping mechanism.

Please note that I have a lapped IHS and I have made it work, so this is not a huge deal. However I would have been slightly better off never doing so, and I would hate to see anyone new make the same mistake without directly testing if lapping will help. Hope that helps any new people here.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Great job TonicX - 2 reps from me for the tests.
> The reason one would go beyond that for BCLK is simple: You would want more for the PCI-E slots - although CPU might not increase, GPU might do indeed.
> Regardless, as I would have thought, pointless going over unless you are going to bench.


There are a few cases where bclk is helpful, mostly benching though. For cpu if it can't get to the next multi but you still want more, bclk does it. Same idea for fine tuning memory.
Sometimes when at high clocks reaching the next multi takes a huge voltage bump, upping the bclk can help it reach the same clock without as much voltage (it would still need the big voltage bump for stability, but at least it got to the desktop).
The main use for me is cold boot bugs using ivy, with cold enough temperatures, the machine will not post with bclk at 100, get the bclk at least 105 or higher, then it will post normally.

Higher bclk isn't always helpful, but it doesn't necessarily hurt anything either.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There are a few cases where bclk is helpful, mostly benching though. For cpu if it can't get to the next multi but you still want more, bclk does it. Same idea for fine tuning memory.
> Sometimes when at high clocks reaching the next multi takes a huge voltage bump, upping the bclk can help it reach the same clock without as much voltage (it would still need the big voltage bump for stability, but at least it got to the desktop).
> The main use for me is cold boot bugs using ivy, with cold enough temperatures, the machine will not post with bclk at 100, get the bclk at least 105 or higher, then it will post normally.
> 
> Higher bclk isn't always helpful, but it doesn't necessarily hurt anything either.


what's the reasoning behind that out of interest?
Why does it not boot with BCLK at 100, and boots with 105?
I'm curious!
Love learning new things







!


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Great job TonicX - 2 reps from me for the tests.
> The reason one would go beyond that for BCLK is simple: You would want more for the PCI-E slots - although CPU might not increase, GPU might do indeed.
> Regardless, as I would have thought, pointless going over unless you are going to bench.


Yes, that's what I thought. When it gets down to it, we should up it when we CAN up it. Even extreme overclocking should be done with understanding of the principals and not reckless dial twisting, after-all the context of this particular study is stability during extreme stress. I am involved in this group forum because I don't want to senselessly or ignorantly destroy my expensive computer components. Knowledge is Power- quite literally in this arena. I see the draw of Overclocking for the sake of overclocking, as a hobby, and an end in itself. However, I am a Graphic Design Consultant and bought this chip to speed up my render-times. Found the chip has heat issues and jump on board the Delidding Ship like so many others before me.








*"Overclocking is like cup stacking, everyone should do it from time to time, and some are extremely talented and very competitive about it."*


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hehe nice one man!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> what's the reasoning behind that out of interest?
> Why does it not boot with BCLK at 100, and boots with 105?
> I'm curious!
> Love learning new things
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


Not really sure, it probably is the pci-e or clock gen frequencies (something affected by bclk) that helps. With 1366 they would hit a wall at about 220 bclk, only way to go higher was increasing the pci-e frequency, but I don't know just how things depend on each other. Extreme cooling can make things behave differently, mostly in a good way though.
Don't know what happened with sandy, they were just weird. Hard multi limit different for each chip & terrible cold boot bugs that nothing would fix. Ivy plays much nicer.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Interesting - thanks for the info


----------



## quark004

delided my i5 3570k. Not a gr8 overclocker but i wanted to reduce the temps. Getting around 15 degree reduction in temps running prime.


----------



## quark004

Using generic thermal compound that came with the air cooler. Plannig to buy cl pro but not available in my country so i have to order from uk or usa.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *quark004*
> 
> 
> delided my i5 3570k. Not a gr8 overclocker but i wanted to reduce the temps. Getting around 15 degree reduction in temps running prime.


15 degrees is exactly what mine drop. I had no problems with the Cool Laboratory Ultra which is basically Cool Laboratory Pro improved. you can order is here http://www.Performance-PCs.com
Good Luck! I hope You have an excellent chip!
http://valid.canardpc.com/2728836







*T o n i c X*














*Ivy Bridge Owners' Club*







*[Official] Delidded Crewman 
*







*_.=5 GHz Overclock Club=._*








*5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*
*ASUS P8Z77 SERIES OWNERS*







1GHz *Overclock* Club







*_.=4 GHz Overclock Club=._* 
OCN Water Cooling Club







*Rig: I7 3770K, Asus P8Z77MPro, 16Gb HyperX, Patriot SSD, Windows 8, Water H60, CX750M PS*








 Official Corsair Hydro Series Club 
*5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## kesawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kesawi*
> 
> That's ok
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just ran CPU test for 5 minutes as a quick check for problems since I only had limited time before going to work. Have left Prime95 running longer as I need a 12hr test for the Ivy Stable Club. I'm not sure what the exact WHEA errors were and will need to have a look at the event log entries when I get home tonight.


Have checked and I've had two sorts of WHEA errors:





The last few errors occurred just before Prime95 crashed.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quark, if you can't get it shipped to you for a reasonable price, I could order it for you and then post it to you if needs be.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> In order for new people to not make mistakes in this area I feel compelled to post despite my disappointment with a couple members. Regulars please feel free to ignore the following.
> 
> Do not lap your IHS, I will say this again, do not lap your IHS. Having obtained information directly from the designer of a current cold plate for a cooler, it is illogical to lap your IHS without significant testing before doing so.
> 
> Most cold plate manufactures assume, and rightly so, that your IHS is slightly concave. They therefore make their cold plates slightly convex in order to match better. After careful testing I have confirmed that the information I previously posted here is correct. The clamping mechanism of your mobo slightly changes the shape of your IHS when installed.
> 
> Unless you plan on lapping your IHS while it is installed in your mobo, you have a reasonably high probability of make it fit worse, not better with your cold plate. This is easy to confirm if you want to take the time. Take you mobo out of the case, get a perfectly flat edged piece of metal or razor and a flashlight. Measure the shape of your IHS both in and out of the mobo. Normally these will be slightly different.
> 
> Furthermore, if you did manage to somehow make your IHS perfectly flat while installed in the mobo, you would then have to lap your cold plate as well because it is most likely not flat. You immediately void your warranty on most coolers by doing so.
> 
> Now before some of you throw your normal hissy fits, remember that I wrote that you should not lap before testing, I did not write no one should lap ever. If you measure your IHS while clamped down in the mobo and it turns out to be convex or noticeably twisted in some way, then lapping may help. This would be an unusual circumstance though.
> 
> I spent an entire day installing and reinstalling my H100i with a lapped IHS. It took longer than it should have but I finally found the optimal way to install it, and it was in direct contradiction to the standard instructions. From all my testing I determined that I would have been better off not lapping the IHS, but I did not know this information when I did. I posted it all in here awhile back. You can look and see that I commented at the time how surprised I was that lapping did not help my temps. That led me to do some research into why.
> 
> Furthermore, my testing showed that despite my best efforts it is impossible to place the delidded IHS in exactly the same position on the die/pcb every time. These slight variations in the positioning of an IHS can further affect the fit with your cooler because of the force exerted by the clamping mechanism.
> 
> Please note that I have a lapped IHS and I have made it work, so this is not a huge deal. However I would have been slightly better off never doing so, and I would hate to see anyone new make the same mistake without directly testing if lapping will help. Hope that helps any new people here.


Hmm that is interesting. So basicaly it can lead to decrease of temperatures not improvment right ? (I think I managed to get some decrease, but only like 1-2*C. ) Or is there some risk of damage or something like that ? I have a lapped ihs as well, I did it because I had a small nick on the ihs which was scrathing my cooler plate so I lapped it.


----------



## BaK2BaK

VonDutch>
Dunno if I missed it, did you finally try 'redelidding' your CPU to check how is Liquid Pro after months of usage?


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> In order for new people to not make mistakes in this area I feel compelled to post despite my disappointment with a couple members. Regulars please feel free to ignore the following.
> 
> Do not lap your IHS, I will say this again, do not lap your IHS. Having obtained information directly from the designer of a current cold plate for a cooler, it is illogical to lap your IHS without significant testing before doing so.
> 
> Most cold plate manufactures assume, and rightly so, that your IHS is slightly concave. They therefore make their cold plates slightly convex in order to match better. After careful testing I have confirmed that the information I previously posted here is correct. The clamping mechanism of your mobo slightly changes the shape of your IHS when installed.
> 
> Unless you plan on lapping your IHS while it is installed in your mobo, you have a reasonably high probability of make it fit worse, not better with your cold plate. This is easy to confirm if you want to take the time. Take you mobo out of the case, get a perfectly flat edged piece of metal or razor and a flashlight. Measure the shape of your IHS both in and out of the mobo. Normally these will be slightly different.
> 
> Furthermore, if you did manage to somehow make your IHS perfectly flat while installed in the mobo, you would then have to lap your cold plate as well because it is most likely not flat. You immediately void your warranty on most coolers by doing so.
> 
> Now before some of you throw your normal hissy fits, remember that I wrote that you should not lap before testing, I did not write no one should lap ever. If you measure your IHS while clamped down in the mobo and it turns out to be convex or noticeably twisted in some way, then lapping may help. This would be an unusual circumstance though.
> 
> I spent an entire day installing and reinstalling my H100i with a lapped IHS. It took longer than it should have but I finally found the optimal way to install it, and it was in direct contradiction to the standard instructions. From all my testing I determined that I would have been better off not lapping the IHS, but I did not know this information when I did. I posted it all in here awhile back. You can look and see that I commented at the time how surprised I was that lapping did not help my temps. That led me to do some research into why.
> 
> Furthermore, my testing showed that despite my best efforts it is impossible to place the delidded IHS in exactly the same position on the die/pcb every time. These slight variations in the positioning of an IHS can further affect the fit with your cooler because of the force exerted by the clamping mechanism.
> 
> Please note that I have a lapped IHS and I have made it work, so this is not a huge deal. However I would have been slightly better off never doing so, and I would hate to see anyone new make the same mistake without directly testing if lapping will help. Hope that helps any new people here.


That's were some pressure test paper could help!
On my setup:
Before lapping


After


Not perfect, but at least there is more contact in the center area where the die is.


----------



## snowfree52

do you guys think I need to order the coollaboratories cleaning set with the ultra ?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Thank you Ftw for the info about CPU short outs and so on.


did you put the nail polish on the nicked pcb or not yet ?

i have a bad feeling about the nail polish it doesn't look like it will sustain the heat in this area !


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> do you guys think I need to order the coollaboratories cleaning set with the ultra ?


Ultra is not supposed to be so hard to remove, is it? I guess you dont have to order it then







But I dont know how ultra looks after months of usage and how helpful is their cleaning kit actually.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> do you guys think I need to order the coollaboratories cleaning set with the ultra ?


Some metal polish will do.


----------



## TonicX

No, The CLU KIT comes with a large isopophol (Alchohol) pad. im not sure about metal polish the video said "NO RESIDUE" cleaner i.e. rubbing Alchohol


----------



## kesawi

Well I've flashed the BIOS on my UD5H back to F14, removed my GTX670 and set the RAM back to the default speed and timings for 1333MHZ. So far I'm stable at much lower voltages so something's up with either my RAM, GPU or BIOS. Am able to get 4.5GHZ @ 1.225V without WHEA errors or crashing in XTU. Previously I was up near 1.3V to achieve the same


----------



## ripsaw

still reading the backlog of posts since i last posted, haven't got around to delidding yet, but now cllp is on the way. Is it even going to be worth it for me if this is the best i can get out of my chip?

thanks gents


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> 
> No, The CLU KIT comes with a large isopophol (Alchohol) pad. im not sure about metal polish the video said "NO RESIDUE" cleaner i.e. rubbing Alchohol


The isopropyl pad coming along with the Ultra is to clean the surfaces before application.
There is also an abbrasiv sponge in the Ultra package, but using it will sort of lap your surfaces.

There are users here that had success with metal polish to clean Ultra from their IHS and coolers, Justanoldman did it I guess...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I'm thinking of getting another motherboard? What is a MOBO that is awesome for overclocking? A Sabertooth? I definetly need it to be crossfire ready.Yesterday I was having a really hard time getting my OC stable and today just for the hell of it I typed in 4.8Ghz and its been completely stable in P95 for over an hour. DMM volts are 1.465v. This MOBO is bi-polar. I also want one that has an accurate vcore of .001v off


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I'm thinking of getting another motherboard? What is a MOBO that is awesome for overclocking? A Sabertooth? I definetly need it to be crossfire ready.Yesterday I was having a really hard time getting my OC stable and today just for the hell of it I typed in 4.8Ghz and its been completely stable in P95 for over an hour. DMM volts are 1.465v. This MOBO is bi-polar. I also want one that has an accurate vcore of .001v off


Stay away from Sabertooth at all costs lol.

Gigabyte ud3h

Gigabyte ud5h

Gigabyte up4 up5

Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3

Any of the Asus ROG boards.


----------



## Stige

And stay away from AsRock if you don't have a DMM handy, you will never know what voltages you are actually pushing to your CPU! =D


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> And stay away from AsRock if you don't have a DMM handy, you will never know what voltages you are actually pushing to your CPU! =D


Yea thats why I'm using and thats why I want to run away from it. lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea thats why I'm using and thats why I want to run away from it. lol


Sabertooth is the most over priced board in the z77 line up.

It is a cheap board with 100$ MB features. " Gimmik plastic armour" does not warrant selling a 100$ mb for 200$ +

It does not even have a De bug Led which the 130$ UD3H has lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sabertooth is the most over priced board in the z77 line up.
> 
> It is a cheap board with 100$ MB features. " Gimmik plastic armour" does not warrant selling a 100$ mb for 200$ +
> 
> It does not even have a De bug Led which the 130$ UD3H has lol.


Yea I just wasn't sure about it. So no Sabertooth. Ok, so Gigabyte? Any other recommendations?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I just wasn't sure about it. So no Sabertooth. Ok, so Gigabyte? Any other recommendations?


*Gigabyte*

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128544
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128551
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128558
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128559

*Asus*
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131934

*MSI*
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130660

The Board i have the E-ATX Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3 "which in my opinion at it's price point is an all around best for Z77 features wise" Out of stock on the egg.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> *Gigabyte*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128544
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128551
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128558
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128545
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128559
> 
> *Asus*
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131830
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131934
> 
> *MSI*
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130660
> 
> The Board i have the E-ATX Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3 "which in my opinion at it's price point is an all around best for Z77 features wise" Out of stock on the egg.


Wow thats a really nice board I might just wait until that is back in stock and get that one. That way I can extend my 7950 crossfire at some point. I'm probably not going to get a haswell for a couple years so I really don't care about switching everything over to the new socket right now. Thanks! Have you used a DMM with it to see how much it is off?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Wow thats a really nice board I might just wait until that is back in stock and get that one. That way I can extend my 7950 crossfire at some point. I'm probably not going to get a haswell for a couple years so I really don't care about switching everything over to the new socket right now. Thanks! Have you used a DMM with it to see how much it is off?


Gigabyte boards are spot on with voltages.

Yea the G1 Sniper 3 with run 16x16x or 8x8x8x8x


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Gigabyte boards are spot on with voltages.


Damn! Alright thanks I appreciate the help that sounds like heaven right now.


----------



## stickg1

Hokie I'll build you a desk case, only cost a couple G's. It will be epic though. I'm going to start on one for myself but it will be modest. I don't have nearly as much hardware to put in it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Damn! Alright thanks I appreciate the help that sounds like heaven right now.






Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hokie I'll build you a desk case, only cost a couple G's. It will be epic though. I'm going to start on one for myself but it will be modest. I don't have nearly as much hardware to put in it.


LoL im good bro i have so many hours into my build now i need a break XD


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hokie I'll build you a desk case out of tooth picks with the Mona Lisa painted on every single one. I'll even use glass stolen straight from the sistine chapel. Best of all I'll only charge you $1000 for it. Just wire me the money now through western union and I'll get started right away! Promise!


----------



## Swag

Someone build this:


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I'm thinking of getting another motherboard? What is a MOBO that is awesome for overclocking? A Sabertooth? I definetly need it to be crossfire ready.Yesterday I was having a really hard time getting my OC stable and today just for the hell of it I typed in 4.8Ghz and its been completely stable in P95 for over an hour. DMM volts are 1.465v. This MOBO is bi-polar. I also want one that has an accurate vcore of .001v off
> 
> 
> 
> Stay away from Sabertooth at all costs lol.
> 
> Gigabyte ud3h
> 
> Gigabyte ud5h
> 
> Gigabyte up4 up5
> 
> Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3
> 
> Any of the Asus ROG boards.
Click to expand...

Why no up7?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Why no up7?


He did not say his budget so i was sticking for what you get for your $

Id suggest the UP7 if he was going for LN2 overclocking... But for air/water The G1 Sniper 3 is the better buy.


----------



## I_shot




----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*


Nice voltage dude! Whats up with the 13c diff between cores?


----------



## gavbon

Got to ask

anyone in the UK do this as i'm worried ill destroy my chip


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Nice voltage dude! Whats up with the 13c diff between cores?


first core sensor has calibration problem as you see in this photo first core temp is lower 7 C than ambient temp 14 C which is impossible







that means first core temp sensor sucks


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Someone build this:


If its wood and glass I can build it. That's what i do for a living.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Got to ask
> 
> anyone in the UK do this as i'm worried ill destroy my chip


And having a fellow countryman go before you makes it easier?


----------



## gavbon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> And having a fellow countryman go before you makes it easier?


i meant to pay for the work to be done

i would love to give it a try tho, but would need a 2nd i7 3770k first as a spare just incase


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I wouldn't ask for pay, but no responsibility for things going wrong. I'm in Guildford, in the UK, and will gladly do it for you, for free.
I do think of you do it, it would be better for you, as the responsibility is on you, but your call let me know via a pm if you want me to do it









As for the Noobtooth Z77 - I agree,stay away from it


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> And having a fellow countryman go before you makes it easier?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i meant to pay for the work to be done
> 
> i would love to give it a try tho, but would need a 2nd i7 3770k first as a spare just incase
Click to expand...

look around for some old p4 or celeron chips. http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=pentium+4&_sacat=0&_from=R40
Theres a list on first page of this thread with the de-liddable ones
Or get TD to do it for you








Quote:


> As for the Noobtooth Z77 - I agree,stay away from it


lol


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Gigabyte boards are spot on with voltages.
> 
> Yea the G1 Sniper 3 with run 16x16x or 8x8x8x8x


The way you have your cards setup are they running 8x8x16x or 8x8x8 ?


----------



## Xinoxide

I put my lid back on because my hottest core was hitting 100C under linx at 5GHz 1.5v.

Now my hottest core is 97C but my other cores are up from 93C~ to 96C.

I more appreciate them being even like this, I am just surprised with CLU the IHS has such little impact.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I put my lid back on because my hottest core was hitting 100C under linx at 5GHz 1.5v.
> 
> Now my hottest core is 97C but my other cores are up from 93C~ to 96C.
> 
> I more appreciate them being even like this, I am just surprised with CLU the IHS has such little impact.


What's your cooling? Expanding the sigs is bugged for me for some reason so can't see, but those temps seem very high for 1.5V delidded.


----------



## Belial

Maybe Xinoxide's LLC is maxed out? That can really increase temps and there's no reason to use over the 2nd highest setting on ambient cooling. High ambient? It's a bit surprising of a max temp but not improbable.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> *Maybe Xinoxide's LLC is maxed out? That can really increase temps* and there's no reason to use over the 2nd highest setting on ambient cooling. High ambient? It's a bit surprising of a max temp but not improbable.


Do you even know what LLC does?

And I do have it at Level 1/Maximum aswell.


----------



## martinhal




----------



## ripsaw

Anyone want to chime in on whether my chip is even worth a delid? If not just going to sell chip + board and buy a Gigabyte mobo and new chip. im so fed up with this asus bios debacle. Just flashed back to 0704 because of sticky multiplier, now i can't even get 4.5 stable.
Screenie:


----------



## Xinoxide

My LLC is on the second highest setting, the highest setting on my board sends mty vcore as far as 400mv over what I am trying to achieve. Must be the highest setting is for over 1.7v.

I keep my PLL at 1.7.

Vtt at 1.14. I have gone both lidless and with the lid with minor differences.

I have a Koolance pmp-450S pushing water through an EK supremacy full copper, and an EK coolstream XTX 360 rad.

Ambient is around 23C, sometimes if its cool enough here in FL ill open my doors and windows, but thats still around 22-25C.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> My LLC is on the second highest setting, the highest setting on my board sends mty vcore as far as 400mv over what I am trying to achieve. Must be the highest setting is for over 1.7v.
> 
> I keep my PLL at 1.7.
> 
> Vtt at 1.14. I have gone both lidless and with the lid with minor differences.
> 
> I have a Koolance pmp-450S pushing water through an EK supremacy full copper, and an EK coolstream XTX 360 rad.
> 
> Ambient is around 23C, sometimes if its cool enough here in FL ill open my doors and windows, but thats still around 22-25C.


you have high temps bro considering your loop. i have ex120 rad + mcp655+apogee gtz+gtx670 block my temps at 5 ghz 1.41V 75 C max linx avx( room temp 23 C ) 1.5V loads extra temperature but 97 C is very high


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> My LLC is on the second highest setting, the highest setting on my board sends mty vcore as far as 400mv over what I am trying to achieve. Must be the highest setting is for over 1.7v.
> 
> I keep my PLL at 1.7.
> 
> Vtt at 1.14. I have gone both lidless and with the lid with minor differences.
> 
> I have a Koolance pmp-450S pushing water through an EK supremacy full copper, and an EK coolstream XTX 360 rad.
> 
> Ambient is around 23C, sometimes if its cool enough here in FL ill open my doors and windows, but thats still around 22-25C.


If you got LLC at highest than your full load VCore should be pretty much the same as your half load VCore, LLC only affects your full load VCore.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> My LLC is on the second highest setting, the highest setting on my board sends mty vcore as far as 400mv over what I am trying to achieve. Must be the highest setting is for over 1.7v.
> 
> I keep my PLL at 1.7.
> 
> Vtt at 1.14. I have gone both lidless and with the lid with minor differences.
> 
> I have a Koolance pmp-450S pushing water through an EK supremacy full copper, and an EK coolstream XTX 360 rad.
> 
> Ambient is around 23C, sometimes if its cool enough here in FL ill open my doors and windows, but thats still around 22-25C.
> 
> 
> 
> If you got LLC at highest than your full load VCore should be pretty much the same as your half load VCore, LLC only affects your full load VCore.
Click to expand...

This doesn't fall in line with the behavior I have witnessed from the OC formula, with it set to 1 and the same settings, vcore on P95 is 1.53, vcore on IBT goes up towards 1.56v... Ill have to give it another try with Linx.

Ill probably stick my multimeter in it again just to be sure.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*


I_shot- How did you get the AID64 sidebar display. i have aida64 extreme but can find this in preferences


----------



## invincible20xx

i'm now on my de-lidded chip, temps went down and please also note that the ambient temps today is hotter by 3c~5c than before, but look they went down in a strange way !

Before :



After :



core 1 : 74 - 58 = 16c down

core 2 : 80 - 69 = 11c down (was the hottest core before)

core 3 : 77 - 74 = 3c down only (now the hottest core and the temp reduction after de-lidding is sooo minimal compared to the other cores specially core 1)

core 4 : 73 - 68 = 5c down only (also minimal reduction)

so my question is why a core went down by 16 c while another core went 3c only....

should i try to re-apply thermal paste again ? also i have put a very thin layer of rtv silicon on one of the IHS sides in the area that falls on the nicked pcb to protect it from short outs, do you recommend removing that thin layer ?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I_shot- How did you get the AID64 sidebar display. i have aida64 extreme but can find this in preferences


Preferences>Hardware Monitoring>Desktop Gadgets>Enable Desktop bla bla =)


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> should i try to re-apply thermal paste again ?


and what paste did you use on the die ?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> and what paste did you use on the die ?


OCZ Freeze

but one of the cores dropped 3c only !!!


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> OCZ Freeze
> 
> but one of the cores dropped 3c only !!!


CLU is where it's at, forget any other paste


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> OCZ Freeze
> 
> but one of the cores dropped 3c only !!!


yea thats interesting, but I cant imagine anything you could do about it aside from reaplying the paste. Thin layer on the die, and thin layer on the inside IHS







Try CL PRO, it will reduce temps off another 10*C


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Usually that's because of uneven application. CLU is what you need


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> CLU is where it's at, forget any other paste


it still doesn't make sense 3c only even if i used ketchup on the die it should drop more than 3c lol

don't you think ?!


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> it still doesn't make sense 3c only even if i used ketchup on the die it should drop more than 3c lol
> 
> don't you think ?!


Maybe just uneven application, cant be anything else


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Usually that's because of uneven application. CLU is what you need


totally dubbed i know you nicked your pcb while de-lidding , i nicked mine too but the cpu survived but the fact that i nicked the cpu is still in the back of my head and it is annoying you told me on youtube that you didn't cover the nicked area with any sort of protection layer, what if the IHS touched that nicked area it's right there under the edges of the IHS it could easily make contact won't this screw the cpu ? i've put some rtv silicon on one side of the ihs where it falls on the nicked pcb which makes the IHS slightly elevated from that side but it's a very thin layer could it be the reason ?

also u sure nothing will happen if i put the IHS directly on the nicked area? i've been advised to put clear nail polish on the scratch but i don't think that nail polish can take the heat produced by the cpu....

last but not least how can i 100% determine if the scratch on the pcb didn't "really" affect my cpu ? any benchmarks or stress test recommended for that ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I'm thinking of getting another motherboard? What is a MOBO that is awesome for overclocking? A Sabertooth? I definetly need it to be crossfire ready.Yesterday I was having a really hard time getting my OC stable and today just for the hell of it I typed in 4.8Ghz and its been completely stable in P95 for over an hour. DMM volts are 1.465v. This MOBO is bi-polar. I also want one that has an accurate vcore of .001v off


Get an Asus MVG from Microcenter...104usd currently, best board for the money and one of the best ocing mobos.
If you don't like it get an UD4H by GB, which is really good for ram too. (newer and better than ud3h-ud5h)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> And stay away from AsRock if you don't have a DMM handy, you will never know what voltages you are actually pushing to your CPU! =D


you have an OC Formula, that board is GREAT, and it reports vcore fine, maybe a tad higher than what it feeds to the chip if anything.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> If its wood and glass I can build it. That's what i do for a living.


Good to know...I may need some help for my upcoming modding project. It involves wood and glass.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Do you even know what LLC does?
> 
> And I do have it at Level 1/Maximum aswell.


LLC actually may make the vcore overshoot under load if you set it at max level, so Belial is right.
No need to be rude either...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> it still doesn't make sense 3c only even if i used ketchup on the die it should drop more than 3c lol
> 
> don't you think ?!


Mustard might drop 10c...not joking xD


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I'm at 4.8Ghz and have been running p95 for 7 hours now. Here is a screenshot. DMM reports 1.472v


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Do you even know what LLC does?
> 
> And I do have it at Level 1/Maximum aswell.


Flashback to the pcilliterate battle... not again...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get an Asus MVG from Microcenter...104usd currently, best board for the money and one of the best ocing mobos.
> If you don't like it get an UD4H by GB, which is really good for ram too. (newer and better than ud3h-ud5h)
> you have an OC Formula, that board is GREAT, and it reports vcore fine, maybe a tad higher than what it feeds to the chip if anything.
> Good to know...I may need some help for my upcoming modding project. It involves wood and glass.
> LLC actually may make the vcore overshoot under load if you set it at max level, so Belial is right.
> No need to be rude either...
> Mustard might drop 10c...not joking xD


Good choices for boards as well! OC Formula is the one Asrock board I would like to try, & the mvg is the board I was using benching at 6.4Ghz the other night.

The LLC is subjective, the voltage a cpu needs at load is the voltage it needs, however LLC is configured. The main concept of it as you say is too avoid heavy overshoot when close the maximum safe voltages (for those worried about safety).
But it shouldn't really affect temps. cpu needs 1.25V to run stable, configure llc1 to have 1.25V under load, look at load temps. then configure llc10 to load at 1.25V, how different can the temps be?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I'm at 4.8Ghz and have been running p95 for 7 hours now. Here is a screenshot. DMM reports 1.472v


CLU ?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> CLU ?


Yep. CLU







Temps mostly stay in the 60's, but they venture up into the 80's for a couple minutes every once in a while. Hence the high max temps. The only reason I get those temps is because I'm at a whopping 1.472v. Not bad though because when actually playing games temps never go over 60c. if I had a better chip I wouldn't have to go that high, but I'm happy with 4.8Ghz.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by Stige
> 
> CLU is where it's at, forget any other paste
> 
> it still doesn't make sense 3c only even if i used ketchup on the die it should drop more than 3c lol
> 
> don't you think ?!


yeah but dont use chocholate - it scored the lowest with the highest temps. i'm for real i saw a chart somewhere.
1 rep point for anyone finding that data.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> yeah but dont use chocholate - it scored the lowest with the highest temps. i'm for real i saw a chart somewhere.
> 1 rep point for anyone finding that data.


you mean this?







http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermal-Compound-Roundup-February-2012/1490/5


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> you mean this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermal-Compound-Roundup-February-2012/1490/5


?????????????


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> you mean this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermal-Compound-Roundup-February-2012/1490/5


I remember that one, was surprised that mayo did so well, not just for sammiches anymore.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol, that's the one...mustard was good


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> you mean this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermal-Compound-Roundup-February-2012/1490/5


yep +rep for ripsaw - good job rip!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> yep +rep for ripsaw - good job rip!


^^^










































Mayonnaise only 1 c worse than CL- U ?


----------



## TonicX

I Like IC Diamond 7 and you get a big syring for 7usd but its a little thick for my tastes. oh- and it does not squeeze-out or burn-out as fast as other popular thermal paste. you know what i mean









im useing clu on the die and ihs and am set to boot at 50x 100 @ 5000.1 and cinebench a 10.12 with temps in the 80's, that almost as good as a 8core 16 thread 2.92GHz Intel Xeon X5570 (it get 10.33)

waiting for the CLU delivery was well worth it.

i also did a good job with the lapping of the cover. it slaps so flatly on the cooler face that it sounds and feels like a friggin magnet.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I prefer ic diamond over any other regular tim too...but clu/clp is best for the die. (or any exposed die like gpus)


----------



## I_shot

i don't rely on hardwaresecrets tests.That thermal compound chart is complete garbage


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I prefer ic diamond over any other regular tim too...but clu/clp is best for the die. (or any exposed die like gpus)


Yea I just applied CLU on my MSI TFIII and Sapphire Dual-x 7950's that are in crossfire and they dropped 10c! They were already running pretty cool, but I just like everything being as cool as it can be.


----------



## TonicX

that list is incomplete they forgot earwax and the thermal conductivity of a luggy.


----------



## invincible20xx

ok so re-applying tim, can you guys show me the best way to put tim on die and IHS, i will be using ocz freeze because this is all i have for now and probably will be all i have till haswel comes out and i ditch ivy bridge all together lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Invisible: I would suggest protecting it. My knick goes straight on the ihs, thus the possibility of shorting is high. I didn't think of that at first, but now it's in, I have no problems, so I rather not touch it.
Put a layer of nail polish, get rid of that rtv and enjoy


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Invisible: I would suggest protecting it. My knick goes straight on the ihs, thus the possibility of shorting is high. I didn't think of that at first, but now it's in, I have no problems, so I rather not touch it.
> Put a layer of nail polish, get rid of that rtv and enjoy


nail polish will take the heat ? i need confirmation on that i'm afraid of it









got an idea of what benchmarks or stress tests to make sure the chip is not suffering from something ?

also i'm invincible, wish i was invisible great stuff i could have done


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> yep +rep for ripsaw - good job rip!


forget to click the button? Lol


----------



## kesawi

Seem to be stable now with 4.6GHz @ 1.315V and RAM at 1333MHZ. Had to drop bios version back to non-beta which means I lose TRIM on my SSDs in RAID







. Maximum temp 74 with ambient of 28. When I push my RAM to 1600MHZ using the XMP profile I start getting WHEA errors in Prime95. Should I be looking at replacing my RAM? I'm not running it any faster than what it's rated for (ie 1600MHz at 8-8-8-24)?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm not sure about the nail polish myself you'll have to ask someone with experience, but it basically acts as a lacquer


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm not sure about the nail polish myself you'll have to ask someone with experience, but it basically acts as a lacquer


ok thanks, can some one confirm ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm not sure about the nail polish myself you'll have to ask someone with experience, but it basically acts as a lacquer


Pretty much, bare metal close enough to bare metal to allow a charge to arc across it is bad, something in between that can stop it from arcing is good.
I'm not sure how nail polish or LET work for high temperatures around the cpu, I use those to insulate for cold temps, so I can keep running a board while its covered in snow & ice.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Pretty much, bare metal close enough to bare metal to allow a charge to arc across it is bad, something in between that can stop it from arcing is good.
> I'm not sure how nail polish or LET work for high temperatures around the cpu, I use those to insulate for cold temps, so I can keep running a board while its covered in snow & ice.


that is why i'm worried to use nail polish maybe it will not be suitable for high temps, is there anything else that will sure work well for coating a nicked cpu pcb ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> that is why i'm worried to use nail polish maybe it will not be suitable for high temps, is there anything else that will sure work well for coating a nicked cpu pcb ?


MX4 will do very well - non-conductive and designed for that environment


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> MX4 will do very well - non-conductive and designed for that environment


how can i get it to cover the nicked area ? it will flow out how can i keep it in there?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> how can i get it to cover the nicked area ? it will flow out how can i keep it in there?


...brush it on (ie with an UNUSED CL brush or s.th. like it) in 2 or 3 layers...I have done so in the past and it is not running out...I find that while MX4 cures just a bit in terms of consistency, though not necessarily temps...btw, MX2 will also work - and I cannot quite recall re its viscosity but if it is thicker, use that


----------



## TonicX

invincible20xx- you could use a small piece of electrical tape or duct tape whilst you find a more perm solution, just to get on with your clocking.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> invincible20xx- you could use a small piece of electrical tape or duct tape whilst you find a more perm solution, just to get on with your clocking.


this will melt i guess, i've coated the side of the IHS with a very thin layer of High Temp gasket maker, i coated the side of the IHS that falls on the nicked area on the pcb and left it to dry so that it formed a rubber like thin coat on that side of the IHS but idk could this very fine layer on that side of the pcb be the reason of high cpu temps on 2 of the cores after de-lidding, because the IHS is very slightly elevated like 0.01mm elevated than the other side (the sickness of the rubber coat on the IHS)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I just got an error on worker #3 after 11 hours and 17 minutes so should I just increase my turbo boost by .01v? Think that would fix it? It sucks going through 11 hours of stress testing just to have to start again.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I use those to insulate for cold temps, so I can keep running a board while its covered in snow & ice.










Thats........................... AWESOME


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I just got an error on worker #3 after 11 hours and 17 minutes so should I just increase my turbo boost by .01v? Think that would fix it? It sucks going through 11 hours of stress testing just to have to start again.


personally, IMHO, i think you some of you guys stability test way to hard. Why not run the software, application, program, or game that you will be using, crank it up fully and if it is stable, works right, like it should, and does not crash, is not that a good Overclock? What i mean is.. why dial the OC back down so you can run some artifical workload generator like prime95 when you could be playing your favorite game at a higher clock because it never taxes your cpu more than 50%.
unless your rig is for benchmarking and that is the primary purpose for the build. then i totally understand a 100% error free OC.

I have 4800, 4900, 5000, profile set in my bios they are all stable but this way i can control how hot i am running depending on the software app or game i am running.

I am so happy to be able to boot-up @50x 100.0 and a 1.5 Vcore and render a still or a few frames like a Xeon rig, but this is unavoidably in the upper 80's (Welcome to the ivy bridge) but i'm not going to run my rig that hot all day long.

remember this is just TonicX's off-the-cuff opinion so dont trip, but i want to discuss this because i will be better informed afterwards-- holla back!

dont look at it like it fail at 11 hours. look at it like it was stable max out for 10 plus hours!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> personally, IMHO, i think you some of you guys stability test way to hard. Why not run the software, application, program, or game that you will be using, crank it up fully and if it is stable, works right, like it should, and does not crash, is not that a good Overclock? What i mean is.. why dial the OC back down so you can run some artifical workload generator like prime95 when you could be playing your favorite game at a higher clock because it never taxes your cpu more than 50%.
> unless your rig is for benchmarking and that is the primary purpose for the build. then i totally understand a 100% error free OC.
> 
> I have 4800, 4900, 5000, profile set in my bios they are all stable but this way i can control how hot i am running depending on the software app or game i am running.
> 
> I am so happy to be able to boot-up @50x 100.0 and a 1.5 Vcore and render a still or a few frames like a Xeon rig, but this is unavoidably in the upper 80's (Welcome to the ivy bridge) but i'm not going to run my rig that hot all day long.
> 
> remember this is just TonicX's off-the-cuff opinion so dont trip, but i want to discuss this because i will be better informed afterwards-- holla back!


Because when you are playing that game a couple months or even a year from now and you are on that certain place in a certain level and an AI points their gun at you and shoots and the bullets calculate in your cpu that certain way to hit that explosive barrel next to you and your cpu calculates it that certain way to explode in a certain direction and it can't handle that code and your game crashes and then you have no idea why it crashed and you have to test everything. That is why. I want to be certain that my overclock is 100% error free so if I ever have to trouble shoot if something like that happens, I will DEFINETLY know that it is not my CPU's fault. I'm not saying you are stupid for wanting to just play the game to stress the OC and you have every right to do that, but personally I want to know that there is no way it is going to fail. I also do a lot of music production and recording and if I ever lost something because my CPU OC failed I would be extremely ticked off.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats........................... AWESOME


I've always loved seeing the hardware go faster while looking like it should die any minute. Just looking & I don't really have any good frozen mobo pics, mostly gpus & memory. Have to get mobo pics next time....




can help for cold water too.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've always loved seeing the hardware go faster while looking like it should die any minute. Just looking & I don't really have any good frozen mobo pics, mostly gpus & memory. Have to get mobo pics next time....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can help for cold water too.


Dude that is BAD ASS. How do they not short out?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Should I be worried of having not protected the knick on my PCB on the CPU?


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Because when you are playing that game a couple months or even a year from now and you are on that certain place in a certain level and an AI points their gun at you and shoots and the bullets calculate in your cpu that certain way to hit that explosive barrel next to you and your cpu calculates it that certain way to explode in a certain direction and it can't handle that code and your game crashes and then you have no idea why it crashed and you have to test everything. That is why. I want to be certain that my overclock is 100% error free so if I ever have to trouble shoot if something like that happens, I will DEFINETLY know that it is not my CPU's fault. I'm not saying you are stupid for wanting to just play the game to stress the OC and you have every right to do that, but personally I want to know that there is no way it is going to fail. I also do a lot of music production and recording and if I ever lost something because my CPU OC failed I would be extremely ticked off.


Fair enough then in response to your original question... Yes i think more Vcore will make your OC less likely to error and more stable. Good Luck! btw what are you stress testing with?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Fair enough then in response to your original question... Yes i think more Vcore will make your OC less likely to error and more stable. Good Luck! btw what are you stress testing with?


I'm just using P95 and have event viewer open to look for WHEA errors. I'll probably run IBT sometime tomorrow, but only after I treat myself to the beauty of Crysis 3. I can never just stress test constantly. I need to remind myself why I have the computer in the first place haha.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Should I be worried of having not protected the knick on my PCB on the CPU?


Don't worry - Just fix it. A touch of enamel paint will do the trick.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Should I be worried of having not protected the knick on my PCB on the CPU?


See now your freaking yourself out. Has it been working fine? If the answer is yes then just don't touch it! If you do have to take it out for some reason that would be the time to fix it. We all know what happens when you try to fix something that ain't broke. It becomes broke!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I was just thinking about it and I feel like we are all spoiling ourselves with delidding and once haswell comes out we are going to be so dissapointed with our "non CLU" temps. The IHS's are going to be soldered, right? I think I'm just going to stock up on ivy's and have fun with those for the next ten years until they come out with a CPU that has liquid nitrogen cooling built into the die


----------



## TonicX

RavageTheEarth do you want to share info with me about IVY SUPER STABLE CLUB i think i want to look into this thread/tag. what about you?


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I was just thinking about it and I feel like we are all spoiling ourselves with delidding and once haswell comes out we are going to be so dissapointed with our "non CLU" temps. The IHS's are going to be soldered, right? I think I'm just going to stock up on ivy's and have fun with those for the next ten years until they come out with a CPU that has liquid nitrogen cooling built into the die


I'd say the trend is cooler and more power efficient, less likely to need big heat exchangers, or ln2. But there will always be people trying to push the hardware faster


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> See now your freaking yourself out. Has it been working fine? If the answer is yes then just don't touch it! If you do have to take it out for some reason that would be the time to fix it. We all know what happens when you try to fix something that ain't broke. It becomes broke!


Indeed- I shall leave it!
LEAVE IT YEAH!







lol


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I was just thinking about it and I feel like we are all spoiling ourselves with delidding and once haswell comes out we are going to be so dissapointed with our "non CLU" temps. The IHS's are going to be soldered, right? I think I'm just going to stock up on ivy's and have fun with those for the next ten years until they come out with a CPU that has liquid nitrogen cooling built into the die


I still have an sandy bridge and an old Quad Core Duo Q9400 from 2007 that still clocks like a champ. in fact All my OCN chat has been from my Quad Core - its on a gigabyte motherboard__ga-ep45-ud3lr_f11 775 i upgraded to a ssd and it can still hold its own for gaming but the IVY is over
*Three Times As Fast*
rendering in cinema 4 d . So HASWELL better be ultra cool and amazingly overclockable!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted *by RavageTheEarth V*iew Post
> 
> So I was just thinking about it and I feel like we are all spoiling ourselves with delidding and once haswell comes out we are going to be so dissapointed with our "non CLU" temps. The IHS's are going to be soldered, right? I think I'm just going to stock up on ivy's and have fun with those for the next ten years until they come out with a CPU that has liquid nitrogen cooling built into the die biggrin.gif


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I still have an sandy bridge and an old Quad Core Duo Q9400 from 2007 that still clocks like a champ. in fact All my OCN chat has been from my Quad Core - its on a gigabyte motherboard__ga-ep45-ud3lr_f11 775 i upgraded to a ssd and it can still hold its own for gaming but the IVY is over
> *Three Times As Fast*
> rendering in cinema 4 d . So HASWELL better be ultra cool and amazingly overclockable!!!


...I see you two are on the same slippery slope I found myself on a while back









...meanwhile I run Cinebench at over 5.1 GHz, ditto for 3D11, and all with cores never hotter than 72 C (strong custom w-c loop, low-v and delidded chip)...but as soon as that is done, I cannot help thinking about MORE...eventually, I'll be right back at 85 C














...

...and what's worse, I can hardly wait for Ivy-E / Haswelll-E TO DO IT ALL OVER AGAIN

btw, loaded up the Intel 520 series SSD as the dedicated bench drive for the first time this afternoon, and with a clean, lean Win 7 / 64 installation - almost as much 'gain' as I felt with delidding


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've always loved seeing the hardware go faster while looking like it should die any minute. Just looking & I don't really have any good frozen mobo pics, mostly gpus & memory. Have to get mobo pics next time....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can help for cold water too.


...is that how your brand-new NVidia Titan looks like now














cool - in more ways than one


----------



## TonicX

OVERCLOCKING:
"Benchmark enthusiasts, overclockers, and people with money to burn who boost their ego by posting computer pictures on forums are the target market for these."-bit-tech.net
RENDERING:
"And professionals of course. Main usage is probably 3d render and bid or photo editting"-bit-tech.net
and
Actually, don't forget about pros running rendering or other intensive multi-threaded programs who basically need a more consumer-friendly Xeon on a budget. Same holds for the GeForce Titan - it'll be very useful for those who need the Tesla K20 on a budget.-bit-tech.net
*INTEL-HASWELL-E*
I don't see any price quotes yet but the is very exciting news for me!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> OVERCLOCKING:
> "Benchmark enthusiasts, overclockers, and people with money to burn who boost their ego by posting computer pictures on forums are the target market for these."-bit-tech.net
> RENDERING:
> "And professionals of course. Main usage is probably 3d render and bid or photo editting"-bit-tech.net
> and
> Actually, don't forget about pros running rendering or other intensive multi-threaded programs who basically need a more consumer-friendly Xeon on a budget. Same holds for the GeForce Titan - it'll be very useful for those who need the Tesla K20 on a budget.-bit-tech.net
> *INTEL-HASWELL-E*
> I don't see any price quotes yet but the is very exciting news for me!


...not really new 'news' (per earlier posts in this thread) but *welcome* nonetheless...I would start now with an X79 board and a Sandy-E, *but* while Haswell-E will run in an x79, the new top chipset platform will be X99







...so: more waiting







...and pushing the Ivy some more


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Anyone want to chime in on whether my chip is even worth a delid? If not just going to sell chip + board and buy a Gigabyte mobo and new chip. im so fed up with this asus bios debacle. Just flashed back to 0704 because of sticky multiplier, now i can't even get 4.5 stable.
> Screenie:


What ROG is that ? Want to trade for a Sniper 3 ?


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> ok so re-applying tim, can you guys show me the best way to put tim on die and IHS, i will be using ocz freeze because this is all i have for now and probably will be all i have till haswel comes out and i ditch ivy bridge all together lol


Make a very thin layer on the die, then put the IHS on to have the paste printed on the inside, and then apply new thin layer there - on the inside IHS - by adding new paste or by the left overs from the print if that would be enough







By letting it print on the inside IHS, you will basicly mark the area for the layer. That is how I applied the CLP and it works great. I was using the MX-2 on the die before and I just put a line on the die and let the IHS to spread it. Why dont you just buy CLP ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> What ROG is that ? Want to trade for a Sniper 3 ?


...the man (ripsaw) obviously has taste in motherboards..














.. .it's a ROG Maximus V Extreme, per his pic, top left - same I run and HIGHLY recommend...and if your triple Radeon cards have voltage wire inputs, the board and bios is set up for that...

...with Plex chip, it runs my 670ies at PCIe 3 at x8, x16, x8


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the man (ripsaw) obviously has taste in motherboards..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .. .it's a ROG Maximus V Extreme, per his pic, top left - same I run and HIGHLY recommend...and if your triple Radeon cards have voltage wire inputs, the board and bios is set up for that...
> 
> ...with Plex chip, it runs my 670ies at PCIe 3 at x8, x16, x8


...and it just got the OCN HWbot team some more points


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the man (ripsaw) obviously has taste in motherboards..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .. .it's a ROG Maximus V Extreme, per his pic, top left - same I run and HIGHLY recommend...and if your triple Radeon cards have voltage wire inputs, the board and bios is set up for that...
> 
> ...with Plex chip, it runs my 670ies at PCIe 3 at x8, x16, x8


Do you notice any stutter if one lane runs at x 16


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Do you notice any stutter if one lane runs at x 16


...usually no, though I also run Quad-SLI at times, and there it can happen, though rarely (apart from 3D Firestrike Ex whereby apparently, I'm the only one - no matter what GPU card combo - stupid enough to ever run it completely per HWBot...one test was MOSTLY stutter and yielded 0.68 FPS








).

Not sure about Radeon cards, though but in general, the x8 x16 x8 is fine with the GTX 670ies...besides, you can actually switch the x16 to x8 in the bios


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I just got an error on worker #3 after 11 hours and 17 minutes so should I just increase my turbo boost by .01v? Think that would fix it? It sucks going through 11 hours of stress testing just to have to start again.


i've went through 23 and a half hours before and failed, it sucked like hell


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i've went through 23 and a half hours before and failed, it sucked like hell


How did the repaste go ?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Make a very thin layer on the die, then put the IHS on to have the paste printed on the inside, and then apply new thin layer there - on the inside IHS - by adding new paste or by the left overs from the print if that would be enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By letting it print on the inside IHS, you will basicly mark the area for the layer. That is how I applied the CLP and it works great. I was using the MX-2 on the die before and I just put a line on the die and let the IHS to spread it. Why dont you just buy CLP ?


can't get it as i live far away

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> How did the repaste go ?


didn't do it yet

will enamel paint take the high temp ?


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> can't get it as i live far away
> didn't do it yet
> 
> will enamel paint take the high temp ?


You can always order it online? Shouldn't cost that much..


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> You can always order it online? Shouldn't cost that much..


don't think it will make it here, will get lost in the way....

did you further test your chip ? hope it worked as it should....


----------



## Icydead

jesus crist, one worker failed after 29 hours 55 minutes in blend test. /sigh

[email protected]


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> jesus crist, one worker failed after 29 hours 55 minutes in blend test. /sigh
> 
> [email protected]


put 1.25 through it and don't even bother testing again i guess


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> put 1.25 through it and don't even bother testing again i guess


yea, I guess 1.235V-1.24 would be fine too


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> yea, I guess 1.235V-1.24 would be fine too


just give it 1.25 for peace of mind and to be 100% sure without having to test for 30 hours again just to save 10mv


----------



## snowfree52

guys , third CPU received today, same as first one ! still needs 1,45V for 4,8Ghz.





































I don't think I'll bother taking a fourth one, this is insane !


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys , third CPU received today, same as first one ! still needs 1,45V for 4,8Ghz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think I'll bother taking a fourth one, this is insane !


don't bother i guess


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> just give it 1.25 for peace of mind and to be 100% sure without having to test for 30 hours again just to save 10mv


I wouldnt mind testing actually, because Im waiting for my HDD to come from RMA anyways, so Im thinking of going 4.8GHZ, but from initial tests it will require 1.3+.

I just realized I have Internal PPL voltage disabled.


----------



## MiiX

Do you guys think Intel will go for a new socket or continiue with 2011 or 1155 for the 14nm CPU's?


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> I wouldnt mind testing actually, because Im waiting for my HDD to come from RMA anyways, so Im thinking of going 4.8GHZ, but from initial tests it will require 1.3+.
> 
> I just realized I have Internal PPL voltage disabled.


I had a huge jump in voltage when going from 4.6GHz to 5GHz, 4.6GHz was stable with only 1.176V but 5GHz required 1.44V already.

Currently at 5.1GHz with 1.504V.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Do you guys think Intel will go for a new socket or continiue with 2011 or 1155 for the 14nm CPU's?


Haswell is to be released on the 1150 socket.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> jesus crist, one worker failed after 29 hours 55 minutes in blend test. /sigh
> 
> [email protected]


That sounds so nice! I'm running about .23v higher than that for the same speeds.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> I just realized I have Internal PPL voltage disabled.


I have it disbaled also. Is that something I should have enabled?


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I had a huge jump in voltage when going from 4.6GHz to 5GHz, 4.6GHz was stable with only 1.176V but 5GHz required 1.44V already.
> 
> Currently at 5.1GHz with 1.504V.


Hmm Im trying 4.8GHZ now, and it seems the more voltage i put into it, the sooner it throws bsod - whea uncorectable error.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I have it disbaled also. Is that something I should have enabled?


I dont know, but It always enable itself when I change cpu multiplier in bios.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I want to go buy another chip so bad, but I'm afraid that the employee is going to be having a bad day and he is just going to go back there when I tell him a batch number and just tell me he can't find it. Is it legal to bride him with money??? The employees there don't see that motivated at all.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I want to go buy another chip so bad, but I'm afraid that the employee is going to be having a bad day and he is just going to go back there when I tell him a batch number and just tell me he can't find it. Is it legal to bride him with money??? The employees there don't see that motivated at all.


I can understand why. I can't imagine the pay is all that great . Being surrounded by all that hardware and not being able to afford it .


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I want to go buy another chip so bad, but I'm afraid that the employee is going to be having a bad day and he is just going to go back there when I tell him a batch number and just tell me he can't find it. Is it legal to bride him with money??? The employees there don't see that motivated at all.


I think at some point they should allow you to choose the one that you particulary want, like when you are buying baked goods







but Ive never tried that, they just bring it to you from storage, wish you good day and thats it. I wonder what would the storeman do if I told him if he could go back to bring me another one with this and this number. I got mine by luck. The first one couldnt even reach 4.5, so I returned it in 14 day period and bought another one.


----------



## Icydead

Guys whats up with this ? Im trying 4.8GHZ, and when I put for example 1.27V, it lasts 20 minutes in prime95 blend test until prime itself crash. So I increase voltage to for example 1.35V, and it throws bsod after few seconds in prime. So i put 1.4V and it fails immediately in prime. The more voltage, the sooner it fails?


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That sounds so nice! I'm running about .23v higher than that for the same speeds.


it seems whe have the same CPU


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys whats up with this ? Im trying 4.8GHZ, and when I put for example 1.27V, it lasts 20 minutes in prime95 blend test until prime itself crash. So I increase voltage to for example 1.35V, and it throws bsod after few seconds in prime. So i put 1.4V and it fails immediately in prime. The more voltage, the sooner it fails?


Enable PLL Overvoltage? Just a wild guess.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Do you guys think Intel will go for a new socket or continiue with 2011 or 1155 for the 14nm CPU's?


neither so new mobo = expense to us. so 1150 socket for Haswell.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys whats up with this ? Im trying 4.8GHZ, and when I put for example 1.27V, it lasts 20 minutes in prime95 blend test until prime itself crash. So I increase voltage to for example 1.35V, and it throws bsod after few seconds in prime. So i put 1.4V and it fails immediately in prime. The more voltage, the sooner it fails?


Memory timings and bclk and other things. moar info man


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> neither so new mobo = expense to us. so 1150 socket for Haswell.
> Memory timings and bclk and other things. moar info man


Look at this guy i helped him out when he was a noob and he does not even comment on my build log!

Im going to go find a corner to Cry in!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys whats up with this ? Im trying 4.8GHZ, and when I put for example 1.27V, it lasts 20 minutes in prime95 blend test until prime itself crash. So I increase voltage to for example 1.35V, and it throws bsod after few seconds in prime. So i put 1.4V and it fails immediately in prime. The more voltage, the sooner it fails?


this happend to me a couple months ago when i was trying to get 5 ghz stable. once i reinstalled windows i was able to run that oc. you might have corrupted your os maybe


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> this happend to me a couple months ago when i was trying to get 5 ghz stable. once i reinstalled windows i was able to run that oc. you might have corrupted your os maybe


Could be, I run a temporary os installed on a backup drive and used only for overlock testing, so a lot of hard resets, bsods, etc. I did set 1.27V and its running fine 2 hours 16 minutes now in prime, but once I set anything higher then 1.3V, bsod. Whea_uncorectable error. If the test fails Ill try to reinstall that os.

Now I just remember that this os was even installed on my previous mobo, which was msi z77 gd65.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Should I enable PLL overvoltage in my BIOS? I have had it disabled the whole time I have been OC'ing and I sometimes get a crash of P95 itself where the program has to close.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> it seems whe have the same CPU


Lets go with Hokies and we can all cry in the corner.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Should I enable PLL overvoltage in my BIOS? I have had it disabled the whole time I have been OC'ing and I sometimes get a crash of P95 itself where the program has to close.


I have it enabled myself


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Should I enable PLL overvoltage in my BIOS? I have had it disabled the whole time I have been OC'ing and I sometimes get a crash of P95 itself where the program has to close.


enable pll overvoltage for high overclocks. i need it enabled to boot 5 ghz others may need it for 4.5


----------



## Swag

Anyone play Crysis 3 yet?

I'm playing right now and I'm confused... Are you playing original Prophet or the new Prophet? I'm guessing new Prophet... (The original Prophet referring to the guy who shot his brain out in C2).


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone play Crysis 3 yet?
> 
> I'm playing right now and I'm confused... Are you playing original Prophet or the new Prophet? I'm guessing new Prophet... (The original Prophet referring to the guy who shot his brain out in C2).


not sure but the graphics are sick! lol i think its a new prophet


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone play Crysis 3 yet?
> 
> I'm playing right now and I'm confused... Are you playing original Prophet or the new Prophet? I'm guessing new Prophet... (The original Prophet referring to the guy who shot his brain out in C2).


I think you are playing as the original prophet. I haven't played any of the other crysis games, but at the movie at the intro he talks about how he sacrificed himself to wear the nanosuit and it shows him blowing his brains out. Absolutely amazing game. Its so nice to be able to play with all settings on very high and 4x MSAA and never drop below 60fps. Beautiful visuals.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Should I enable PLL overvoltage in my BIOS? I have had it disabled the whole time I have been OC'ing and I sometimes get a crash of P95 itself where the program has to close.


Yes, you should enable it for higher overclocks, there is no harm in enabling it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> neither so new mobo = expense to us. so 1150 socket for Haswell.
> Memory timings and bclk and other things. moar info man


...probably right...besides, there is so much more new memory tech coming down the pipe (16 GB sticks, DDR4 etc) re 14nm and even before that they pretty much have to go for a redesign

...*BUT* beyond technical requirements, it's also how Intel help$ out the motherboard makers by generating new sales (especially as Intel itself just announced that they are leaving the arena on mobos)...not that most motherboards aren't produced by Foxconn anyhow







.

A lot of the mobo makers were mad at Intel for moving the 'pins' from the CPU to the mobo socket = moving the RMA / 'honesty problems' from Intel to the mobo maker...in turn, Intel will throw out some new chipset / standards and give perfectly good tech the boot...look at the 1155 Ivy vs 1150 Haswell...five fewer pins and Intel could not accommodate that with the existing recent, upscale 1155 / Z77 - which Asus tech has confirmed carries Haswell DRAM lane design already ?









I am looking forward to the new Ivy-E / Haswell-E (with up to 15 cores) on X99 boards in about 8 months


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone play Crysis 3 yet?
> 
> I'm playing right now and I'm confused... Are you playing original Prophet or the new Prophet? I'm guessing new Prophet... (The original Prophet referring to the guy who shot his brain out in C2).
> 
> 
> 
> not sure but the graphics are sick! lol i think its a new prophet
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone play Crysis 3 yet?
> 
> I'm playing right now and I'm confused... Are you playing original Prophet or the new Prophet? I'm guessing new Prophet... (The original Prophet referring to the guy who shot his brain out in C2).
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are playing as the original prophet. I haven't played any of the other crysis games, but at the movie at the intro he talks about how he sacrificed himself to wear the nanosuit and it shows him blowing his brains out. Absolutely amazing game. Its so nice to be able to play with all settings on very high and 4x MSAA and never drop below 60fps. Beautiful visuals.
Click to expand...

2 different thoughts...









But yes, the graphics are beautiful! They are so damn sexy.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I had a huge jump in voltage when going from 4.6GHz to 5GHz, 4.6GHz was stable with only 1.176V but 5GHz required 1.44V already.
> 
> Currently at 5.1GHz with 1.504V.


...sounds almost like mine - even the really, really good chips have '*the wall*', it just occurs 200 to 300 MHz or so later...on a diagram with GHz and vCore (and/or temps) on the axis, ""good and great"" chips merely have their curve shifted to the right a bit...and per earlier post, when you get to 5.1 @ 1.504 like above which is really excellent, you start to wonder about 5.2 and 5.3 giggles


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I think I'm going to order a new case next week because my cooler master mid-atx HAF 912 seems really tight and I want to get better airflow so I would like some help on a great case to get. I made sure the cables were as neat as possible so it would help me get better airflow. I'm definetly getting a full-atx case. I just have to decide on which on. I don't really want to spend more than $200, but I would like to stay in the $150 range. Here is my case right now:



I was looking at this one. Is this good? Any suggestions are totally welcome.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119160

and this one:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129100&SortField=0&SummaryType=0&PageSize=10&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&IsFeedbackTab=true#scrollFullInfo

and this one. I like this the best so far. I want one with those rubber things where you can slip the cables through.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811133191


----------



## lilchronic

man i cant wait any longer to get my other 670 FTW .... but i have too







another week


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> Anyone want to chime in on whether my chip is even worth a delid? If not just going to sell chip + board and buy a Gigabyte mobo and new chip. im so fed up with this asus bios debacle. Just flashed back to 0704 because of sticky multiplier, now i can't even get 4.5 stable.
> Screenie:


...quite a few posts ago, but a couple of quick points:

1.) the Maximus V Ex board gets returned about 50% of the time at the store location in Vancouver I go to - because it has so many additional settings even very experienced oc'ers have not seen before and fool around with (me included)...it is also rare...when I bought mine, the only had one...and that was in the regional warehouse

2.) the 'Bios' problems with Asus (ROG and other series) have been written about a lot, also over at the ROG site / forum...I ran into it myself, but because the ROG Max V has two Bios chips on board, I switched and get it all back...I will *have a tip* in a later post on BCLK which helps stop that from occurring again...it is not just a Bios problem but s.th. that interacts with it when you crash and eventually affects the win registry


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds almost like mine - even the really, really good chips have '*the wall*', it just occurs 200 to 300 MHz or so later...on a diagram with GHz and vCore (and/or temps) on the axis, ""good and great"" chips merely have their curve shifted to the right a bit...and per earlier post, when you get to 5.1 @ 1.504 like above which is really excellent, you start to wonder about 5.2 and 5.3 giggles


i wonder if i had a phase changer. id be at 6ghz chillen







like FTW420


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I think I'm going to order a new case next week because my cooler master mid-atx HAF 912 seems really tight and I want to get better airflow so I would like some help on a great case to get. I made sure the cables were as neat as possible so it would help me get better airflow. I'm definetly getting a full-atx case. I just have to decide on which on. I don't really want to spend more than $200, but I would like to stay in the $150 range. Here is my case right now:
> 
> 
> 
> I was looking at this one. Is this good? Any suggestions are totally welcome.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119160
> 
> and this one:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129100&SortField=0&SummaryType=0&PageSize=10&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&IsFeedbackTab=true#scrollFullInfo
> 
> and this one. I like this the best so far. I want one with those rubber things where you can slip the cables through.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811133191


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811815011


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811815011


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146100
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146099


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...probably right...besides, there is so much more new memory tech coming down the pipe (16 GB sticks, DDR4 etc) re 14nm and even before that they pretty much have to go for a redesign
> 
> ...*BUT* beyond technical requirements, it's also how Intel help$ out the motherboard makers by generating new sales (especially as Intel itself just announced that they are leaving the arena on mobos)...not that most motherboards aren't produced by Foxconn anyhow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> A lot of the mobo makers were mad at Intel for moving the 'pins' from the CPU to the mobo socket = moving the RMA / 'honesty problems' from Intel to the mobo maker...in turn, Intel will throw out some new chipset / standards and give perfectly good tech the boot...look at the 1155 Ivy vs 1150 Haswell...five fewer pins and Intel could not accommodate that with the existing recent, upscale 1155 / Z77 - which Asus tech has confirmed carries Haswell DRAM lane design already ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am looking forward to the new Ivy-E / Haswell-E (with up to 15 cores) on X99 boards in about 8 months


The more I read posts like this and should I get Ivy or wait for Haswell posts the less I want to spend any mony on components now . I doubt I will even buy Haswell unless its the Hawsell_E 15 core monster ( not sure if







or







applies to that) . As much as like new hardware it may be the time to wait it out for a year and see what comes to market ... bearing in mind that at that point something better may be about to launch.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i wonder if i had a phase changer. id be at 6ghz chillen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like FTW420


...and you would be wondering how to get to 6.2 GHz





















...just like FtW 420, when he decides that the phase changer has to vacate in favour of LN2









...that's why it is a billion dollar industry we feed


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i wonder if i had a phase changer. id be at 6ghz chillen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like FTW420
> 
> 
> 
> ...and you would be wondering how to get to 6.2 GHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...just like FtW 420, when he decides that the phase changer has to vacate in favour of LN2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...that's why it is a billion dollar industry we feed
Click to expand...

I see people spend 1 - 2 grand on a huge WC system but I'd rather spend that 1G to buy a LD phase change cooler... Consistent sub-zero temps...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> The more I read posts like this and should I get Ivy or wait for Haswell posts the less I want to spend any mony on components now . I doubt I will even buy Haswell unless its the Hawsell_E 15 core monster ( not sure if
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> applies to that) . As much as like new hardware it may be the time to wait it out for a year and see what comes to market ... bearing in mind that at that point something better may be about to launch.


...on the one hand, there is always 'something new' around the corner and if your upgrade would involve a jump over several generations now, I'd say go for it now...but that is clearly not the case.

...the Ivy-E/Sandy-E 15 core














will likely require X99, but it is a LG2011...this came out when Intel had to file certain trade papers a few weeks back

...in your case, with a super-fast low-v chip and triple Radeons, why don't you join the Overclock.net HWBot team ? Globally, we are in 4th place (#1 being KingPin's team - you know the fellow with all the records and 4 Titan's cooled by LN2...) - but within striking distance of 3rd...I think FtW 420 had a great haul of pts yesterday and I added a few myself in a different class, but your setup is super-hot ! So come and join !







...it helps fill the time with great fun until your 15-core xx-E arrives !


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, what do you guys think is the best version for Nvidia Drivers right now? I can't stand the current one.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, what do you guys think is the best version for Nvidia Drivers right now? I can't stand the current one.


im on 314.21 no problems so far


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...on the one hand, there is always 'something new' around the corner and if your upgrade would involve a jump over several generations now, I'd say go for it now...but that is clearly not the case.
> 
> ...the Ivy-E/Sandy-E 15 core
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will likely require X99, but it is a LG2011...this came out when Intel had to file certain trade papers a few weeks back
> 
> ...in your case, with a super-fast low-v chip and triple Radeons, why don't you join the Overclock.net HWBot team ? Globally, we are in 4th place (#1 being KingPin's team - you know the fellow with all the records and 4 Titan's cooled by LN2...) - but within striking distance of 3rd...I think FtW 420 had a great haul of pts yesterday and I added a few myself in a different class, but your setup is super-hot ! So come and join !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...it helps fill the time with great fun until your 15-core xx-E arrives !


Great point me in the right direction .


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, what do you guys think is the best version for Nvidia Drivers right now? I can't stand the current one.
> 
> 
> 
> im on 314.21 no problems so far
Click to expand...

If I'm not using 3D, do I need to install that 3D component when you install the driver?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If I'm not using 3D, do I need to install that 3D component when you install the driver?


i always perform a clean install and install the 3d stuff also even thou i dont have 3D


----------



## stickg1

Anyone have a problem with their HDMI input on nvidia cards? Everytime I turn the monitor off and on while the computer is still on I have to unplug the HDMI cable and plug it back in otherwise the resolution is wrong or there is no display period. I think it's the current drivers and not the card because I have the same problem with a GeForce 210


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Great point me in the right direction .


GREAT !

...just go to http://www.hwbot.org and sign up (enthusiast league unless your computer room is full of phase change and LN2 gear)...I signed up with my OCN tag but obviously a different pw etc, and IMPORTANTLY, don't forget to choose overclock.net as your team as the points (boints) are both for yourself and the team you belong to.

...on the weekends, their web site can be VERY slow as a lot of folks are then on it and everything has to be updated

...under the 'benchmark' tag, choose where you want to compete (most competitions are for the video card class, i.e. 7970) and then also read the 'rules' as to what they want to see for verification when you submit a result for that benchmark

...here is the 7970 class...you'll see that it is by single card, SLI/CF, triples, and quads...see you at the other side























http://www.hwbot.org/hardware/videocard/radeon_hd_7970/


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If I'm not using 3D, do I need to install that 3D component when you install the driver?


...I tried it and for a beta, it is pretty good, though no performance gains or losses in the stuff I do...I understand that it is mostly an update for the new 'Tomb raider'


----------



## PapaSmurf6768

Wasn't planning on delidding for a while but I was bored this morning so why not









My tools:


Delidding wasn't that hard, what had me most nervous was how close together the PCB and IHS were, I though I'd have a little more wiggle room for the blade. I powered through it and once everything was separated, it didn't look like there were any nicks.




Forgot to take any more pictures, but after that I cleaned up the thermal paste and used my fingernail to scratch off the adhesive. Then I used CLU on the die and the IHS. Everything booted up no problem, was sweating bullets when I pressed the power button. Early results are showing about 10 - 15C drops in temperature, time to get overclocking!


----------



## Icydead

So I have discovered, that the more voltage I put into cpu, the sooner it fails prime95 test. 4.7GHZ is stable at 1.25V and if I just for the sake of this test put 1.4V into it, it fails the test as soon as I click "begin the test". Ive also discovered that with [email protected], it boots with memory set to xmp, but not when memory is at default. - Default memory is [email protected], xmp is [email protected] If memory is set to default but 1.65V it boots again. This is tricky


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> So I have discovered, that the more voltage I put into cpu, the sooner it will fail prime95 test. 4.7GHZ is stable at 1.25V and if I just for the sake of this test put 1.4V into it, it will fail the test as soon as I click "begin the test". Ive also discovered that with [email protected], it will boot with memory set to xmp, but not when memory is at default. - Default memory is [email protected], xmp is [email protected] If memory is set to default but 1.65V it will boot again. This is tricky


If I went higher than 1.3vcore, I would also fail prime95. The higher the voltage, the quicker I would fail. This is the 3rd case I've seen now in the space of 2 weeks. There has been one thing in common. The CPU's have been delidded.
IB is more trouble than what it is worth so I decided to get shut.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> If I went higher than 1.3vcore, I would also fail prime95. The higher the voltage, the quicker I would fail. This is the 3rd case I've seen now in the space of 2 weeks. There has been one thing in common. The CPU's have been delidded.
> IB is more trouble than what it is worth so I decided to get shut.


You think it has something to do with delidding ? Thats weird


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys whats up with this ? Im trying 4.8GHZ, and when I put for example 1.27V, it lasts 20 minutes in prime95 blend test until prime itself crash. So I increase voltage to for example 1.35V, and it throws bsod after few seconds in prime. So i put 1.4V and it fails immediately in prime. The more voltage, the sooner it fails?


Ivy can be tricky, I've seen this with high overclocks when benching. I have to get the voltage just right, bit too little = unstable, bit too much = unstable, have to find the right spot in the middle & then it works. Older chips weren't as picky, too much voltage may not be as good for the chip, but it worked.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Should I enable PLL overvoltage in my BIOS? I have had it disabled the whole time I have been OC'ing and I sometimes get a crash of P95 itself where the program has to close.


I've always left it on auto, I haven't had any issues letting it enable or disable itself as needed whether at any clockspeed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i wonder if i had a phase changer. id be at 6ghz chillen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> like FTW420


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and you would be wondering how to get to 6.2 GHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...just like FtW 420, when he decides that the phase changer has to vacate in favour of LN2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...that's why it is a billion dollar industry we feed


It's a vicious cycle. Air is fun until you try water, then you try phase & every ivy bridge chip can suddenly boot 5Ghz at 1.3V, but there are still limits to what it can do under load. Colder phase, then DICE, then ln2....
Liquid helium is like 10x the cost of ln2 & much harder to work with, but I want to try it...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Great point me in the right direction .


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> GREAT !
> 
> ...just go to http://www.hwbot.org and sign up (enthusiast league unless your computer room is full of phase change and LN2 gear)...I signed up with my OCN tag but obviously a different pw etc, and IMPORTANTLY, don't forget to choose overclock.net as your team as the points (boints) are both for yourself and the team you belong to.
> 
> ...on the weekends, their web site can be VERY slow as a lot of folks are then on it and everything has to be updated
> 
> ...under the 'benchmark' tag, choose where you want to compete (most competitions are for the video card class, i.e. 7970) and then also read the 'rules' as to what they want to see for verification when you submit a result for that benchmark
> 
> ...here is the 7970 class...you'll see that it is by single card, SLI/CF, triples, and quads...see you at the other side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.hwbot.org/hardware/videocard/radeon_hd_7970/


People do automatically start off in enthusiast & need photos with submissions to show the cooling. Just have to make sure not to accidentally select the wrong cooling when submitting, selecting a sub-zero form of cooling (easy to make a mistake in the drop down menus) automatically bumps the user to the extreme OC league.
In the benchmarks section at OCN there is an hwbot team section with some guides & tweaking threads, feel free to post for any help with the benchmarks or tweaks.

Good luck!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf6768*
> 
> Wasn't planning on delidding for a while but I was bored this morning so why not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My tools:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delidding wasn't that hard, what had me most nervous was how close together the PCB and IHS were, I though I'd have a little more wiggle room for the blade. I powered through it and once everything was separated, it didn't look like there were any nicks.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Forgot to take any more pictures, but after that I cleaned up the thermal paste and used my fingernail to scratch off the adhesive. Then I used CLU on the die and the IHS. Everything booted up no problem, was sweating bullets when I pressed the power button. Early results are showing about 10 - 15C drops in temperature, time to get overclocking!


Very nice job! hurry up and give me your submission!

I finally got word about my summer job and I got it! nice 10-12k im going to be investing in many things! about 1/3 or 1/2 in computer parts and my wooden build! gonna need it for all those 480 80mm rads lol







oooh.... and loans... lots and lots of loans to pay off.







MOAR CPU's!!!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Haha! Good Val







Congrats man...
I'm doing extra work on Sundays to help pay off my debts, and save a bit till I can afford a monitor and gpu.
Still tempted by ram but can't get any new kits now.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Very nice job! hurry up and give me your submission!
> 
> I finally got word about my summer job and I got it! nice 10-12k im going to be investing in many things! about 1/3 or 1/2 in computer parts and my wooden build! gonna need it for all those 480 80mm rads lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oooh.... and loans... lots and lots of loans to pay off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MOAR CPU's!!!!


..congrats on the summer job







...and your further contributions to feeding that billion dollar industry














BTW, I have discovered the joys of 200mm sickle fans...quiet but VERY effective when running 3 or 4 GPUs which invariably block each others' cooling..s.th. to keep in mind when planning for your semi-wooden build


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Very nice job! hurry up and give me your submission!
> 
> I finally got word about my summer job and I got it! nice 10-12k im going to be investing in many things! about 1/3 or 1/2 in computer parts and my wooden build! gonna need it for all those 480 80mm rads lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oooh.... and loans... lots and lots of loans to pay off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MOAR CPU's!!!!


Sounds like a good summer job, congrats! 6Ghz with a living chip afterwards for you in the near future!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Haha! Good Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats man...
> I'm doing extra work on Sundays to help pay off my debts, and save a bit till I can afford a monitor and gpu.
> Still tempted by ram but can't get any new kits now.


Never enough money for all the nice memory kits out there. I got a dual channel set of the 2666 c10s, & still want quad channel..
Not to mention a pi 2133 8-9-8 kit, never have the cash when I see them, get paid & they're gone (if they were a reasonable price).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice score!

Lately I've been wanting to try a micron kit...check these results out:



Ballistix Elite 1866mhz cl9 1.5v single sided or double sided 4gb sticks...D9PFJ chips inside (no mixed chips).


----------



## PapaSmurf6768

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Very nice job! hurry up and give me your submission!
> 
> I finally got word about my summer job and I got it! nice 10-12k im going to be investing in many things! about 1/3 or 1/2 in computer parts and my wooden build! gonna need it for all those 480 80mm rads lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oooh.... and loans... lots and lots of loans to pay off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MOAR CPU's!!!!


Grats on the job man! I've been testing all day and here's my submission:

*OCN name:* PapaSmurf6768
*CPU:* 3570K
*on die-TIM:* CLU
*ihs-TIM:* CLU
*Mhz gained:* 200
*OC after delid:* 4.8GHz
*Temp drops:* 10-15C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* 

I delidded in the first place not to get a higher max OC (I actually got the CPU-Z validation before I delidded) but rather to get my temps down for a higher 24/7 OC. Before I had a 4.6GHz overclock with a load temp of 80C, now I have a 4.8GHz overclock with a load temp of 65C! Definitely worth it!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf6768*
> 
> Grats on the job man! I've been testing all day and here's my submission:
> 
> *OCN name:* PapaSmurf6768
> *CPU:* 3570K
> *on die-TIM:* CLU
> *ihs-TIM:* CLU
> *Mhz gained:* 200
> *OC after delid:* 4.8GHz
> *Temp drops:* 10-15C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:*
> 
> I delidded in the first place not to get a higher max OC (I actually got the CPU-Z validation before I delidded) but rather to get my temps down for a higher 24/7 OC. Before I had a 4.6GHz overclock with a load temp of 80C, now I have a 4.8GHz overclock with a load temp of 65C! Definitely worth it!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nice score!
> 
> Lately I've been wanting to try a micron kit...check these results out:
> 
> 
> 
> Ballistix Elite 1866mhz cl9 1.5v single sided or double sided 4gb sticks...D9PFJ chips inside (no mixed chips).


2400 8-8-8, I like! Must have been a healthy dose of vdimm for that...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sounds like a good summer job, congrats! 6Ghz with a living chip afterwards for you in the near future!
> Never enough money for all the nice memory kits out there. I got a dual channel set of the 2666 c10s, & still want quad channel..
> Not to mention a pi 2133 8-9-8 kit, never have the cash when I see them, get paid & they're gone (if they were a reasonable price).










-







-









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Haha! Good Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats man...
> I'm doing extra work on Sundays to help pay off my debts, and save a bit till I can afford a monitor and gpu.
> Still tempted by ram but can't get any new kits now.


yes many RAM kits.... I keep forgetting RAM lol... must
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..congrats on the summer job
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and your further contributions to feeding that billion dollar industry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, I have discovered the joys of 200mm sickle fans...quiet but VERY effective when running 3 or 4 GPUs which invariably block each others' cooling..s.th. to keep in mind when planning for your semi-wooden build


I'm thinking of passive looking cooling but having fans freaking everywhere. 8 fans on a 480 then take 4-5 more of those rads..... then some air movement fans for mobo and such......... so. many. fans.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sounds like a good summer job, congrats! 6Ghz with a living chip afterwards for you in the near future!
> Never enough money for all the nice memory kits out there. I got a dual channel set of the 2666 c10s, & still want quad channel..
> Not to mention a pi 2133 8-9-8 kit, never have the cash when I see them, get paid & they're gone (if they were a reasonable price).


pffft 6 giggles on air!! I'll need some good 775 stuff though.


----------



## AaronMa

Quick question...

Does delidding help with voltages at all?

I know there are some cases where people can use 0.010v less, but anything realistic?
Because I have seriously the worst chip in all of history. Trust me. Its bad.
4.4 at 1.365v and 4.6 is unreachable.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf6768*
> 
> Grats on the job man! I've been testing all day and here's my submission:
> 
> *OCN name:* PapaSmurf6768
> *CPU:* 3570K
> *on die-TIM:* CLU
> *ihs-TIM:* CLU
> *Mhz gained:* 200
> *OC after delid:* 4.8GHz
> *Temp drops:* 10-15C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:*
> 
> I delidded in the first place not to get a higher max OC (I actually got the CPU-Z validation before I delidded) but rather to get my temps down for a higher 24/7 OC. Before I had a 4.6GHz overclock with a load temp of 80C, now I have a 4.8GHz overclock with a load temp of 65C! Definitely worth it!


You're In! (sorry forgot to quote lol)







Slap that sig on!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AaronMa*
> 
> Quick question...
> 
> Does delidding help with voltages at all?
> 
> I know there are some cases where people can use 0.010v less, but anything realistic?
> Because I have seriously the worst chip in all of history. Trust me. Its bad.
> 4.4 at 1.365v and 4.6 is unreachable.


Nothing noticable really. Trust me though I feel your pain. My last chip, a 3570k took 1.492v for 4.5Ghz. My current 3770k takes 1.492v for 4.8Ghz. Where are all the good chips people???

I have had this wierd feeling that it is partly my motherboards fault though. Is that a possibility?? One day it will be stable and the next it won't like my overclock. It's so strange. I think I'm going to be buying the ASUS Maximus V formula in 2 weeks or so. Am I going to be happy with that??


----------



## AaronMa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I have had this wierd feeling that it is partly my motherboards fault though. Is that a possibility??


I have that feeling as well though... That will be the next thing I try. I am getting to the bottom of it soon!
I hope I didnt just spend 20 bucks (CL pro) to cool a furnace that I cant overclock..


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Where are all the good chips people???


Not in Massachusetts.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zeek*
> 
> Not in Massachusetts.


Haha tell me about it. I say we meet at microcenter and lock employees in the closet and take the uniforms and then we can team up and search for the best batch #'s. Then we can give them their uniforms back and buy them. Those people who work there seem rude sometimes. I feel like they wouldn't take the time to look for a certain batch number for me.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AaronMa*
> 
> I have that feeling as well though... That will be the next thing I try. I am getting to the bottom of it soon!
> I hope I didnt just spend 20 bucks (CL pro) to cool a furnace that I cant overclock..


What MOBO do you have?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AaronMa*
> 
> Quick question...
> 
> Does delidding help with voltages at all?
> 
> I know there are some cases where people can use 0.010v less, but anything realistic?
> Because I have seriously the worst chip in all of history. Trust me. Its bad.
> 4.4 at 1.365v and 4.6 is unreachable.


...there is a strong relationship between 'v', heat and GHz that is more emphasized with Ivy (for now) than other chips - and the good news is of course that it also works in reverse.

...all told, I managed to lower my stable 'v' requirements by about 0.05v @ 5.1 GHz - but that is after various cooling changes for a chip that could hit 5 giggles at 1.376v stable before delidding....

- delidding got me about a 17 C drop
- CL-U about 4 C compared to MX4
- another 11 C from switching from a very good (to 4.8 GHz) Thermaltake water 2 extreme closed loop to a full and 'generous' custom loop with 360/60 all-copper rad, 6x 120mm push/pull fans, Koolance block and 1/2 inch inner / 3/4 inch outer diameter tubes, all fed by a Swiftech MPC655 pump

...so yes, extra cooling will help with your v's - especially if you help your system with additional cooling aids, though delidding brought the most gain on its own...it can be a tricky process but there are many good guides out there and also YouTube...just take your time, and good luck if you decide to proceed










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## AaronMa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What MOBO do you have?


I have the Gigabyte Z77X UD3H.
Love the board. Overclocking is.... *shakes head 'no'* easy on it. When the OC doesnt go through, you have to reset the bios.

But the board is nice.. Just a little problem I have had.


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha tell me about it. I say we meet at microcenter and lock employees in the closet and take the uniforms and then we can team up and search for the best batch #'s. Then we can give them their uniforms back and buy them. Those people who work there seem rude sometimes. I feel like they wouldn't take the time to look for a certain batch number for me.


Everytime I go I talk to the SAME guy, lol. He's on of the Spanish employee's and he's pretty nice. He let me go thru the case to find the newest batch I could. Didn't ask him to look in the back, but I know they have more. That's where my crappy chip came from tho.


----------



## AaronMa

But I did see that the new batch OCs VERY well... 3570ks hitting 5.6 on air supposedly..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, seems like 3570k's are all the rage lately...maybe cause of the lower temps cause of no HT. I'll get a newer 3770k batch this week probably, so I'll have something to compare with.


----------



## TonicX

working on my rep today and i have the gold data for you!

Today I'm looking at fixing Vcore droop with an offset Vcore value and a load line calibration employed. here are the results:
On the Asus z77 all values set in bios (in fact I removed the AI Suite completely for this test but love to play with real time voltage changes, I like the fan controls, Control Freak Panel is more like it!
here is the bios run down:

OC tuner .........manual
BCLK .........100
Asus multicore enhance .........Enabled
Turbo Ratio .........manual
Ratio Synchronization control .........disabled
Core .........see chart
Internal PLL Overvolt ......... enabled
CPU bus speed : DRAM speed ratio mode .........Auto
Memory Frequency .........1600 (hardware specific)
EPU Power Saving Mode .........Disabled
OC tuner .........OK
DRAM ......... defaults
CPU Power Management_ .........autos
DIGI VRM
CPU Load Line Calibration .........see chart
Voltage Freq .........Auto
VRM Spread Spectrum .........Enables
CPU Power Phase Control .........Optimized
CPU Duty Control .........Thermal Probe
CPU Current Capability .........140%
CPU Voltage.........OFFSET MODE
Offest sign......+
CPU Offset Voltage .........see chart
PCH..........Auto 1.050
VCCSA voltage ....auto
CPU PLL Voltage =+0.10
CPU Spread Spectrum..... Disabled

Question and critiques are welcome.
Thanks!

General Observation: The delidded IVY bridge is extremely Overclockable but has serious heat and voltage issues after 4800 no matter what you do.

I still love my chip. And have no ill issues with the P8Z77-mPro board (I bought it yellow tagged, off the rack at Microcenter for 115usd)


----------



## TonicX

Highest Core, Cinebench #s , Actual Vcore are results the rest of the data is settings. hope this clearifies some.







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*















*"Yeah my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## PapaSmurf6768

Do you guys think 1.37V is fine for a 24/7 overclock? I'm trying to push this chip as far as I can but I don't want it to die a year down the road.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf6768*
> 
> Do you guys think 1.37V is fine for a 24/7 overclock? I'm trying to push this chip as far as I can but I don't want it to die a year down the road.


The asus rep jj said the max Vcore for this chip [i7 3770k] is 1.35 so your are right in the conservative max. 



Persosonally i think 1.45 @ a 4900 OC is where I'm set 24/7 but mine idles down to 1600 with a Vcore of 1.124 when no cpu demands are present.







*Rig: I7 3770K, Asus P8Z77MPro, 16Gb HyperX, Patriot SSD, Windows 8, Water H60, CX750M PS*








 Official Corsair Hydro Series Club 
*5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## Valgaur

hey Hokies... what fans would you recommend for 4-5 480 montsa's in push pull.... yes push pull


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hey Hokies... what fans would you recommend for 4-5 480 montsa's in push pull.... yes push pull


Fan Budget?

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/8410/fan-518/Noiseblocker_NB-Multiframe_M12-S3HS_120mmx25mm_Ultra_Silent_Fan_-_1800_RPM_-_27_dBA.html?tl=g36c15s60

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/10323/fan-674/Scythe_Gentle_Typhoon_120mm_x_25mm_Fan_-_1850_RPM_D1225C12B5AP-15_Hot_Item_.html?tl=g36c15s60

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17229/fan-1059/Sanyo_Denki_120mm_x_38mm_High-Speed_Fan_-_1025_CFM_109R1212H1011.html?tl=g36c15s562


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Fan Budget?


...half a summer job's pay


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Fan Budget?
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/8410/fan-518/Noiseblocker_NB-Multiframe_M12-S3HS_120mmx25mm_Ultra_Silent_Fan_-_1800_RPM_-_27_dBA.html?tl=g36c15s60
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/10323/fan-674/Scythe_Gentle_Typhoon_120mm_x_25mm_Fan_-_1850_RPM_D1225C12B5AP-15_Hot_Item_.html?tl=g36c15s60
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17229/fan-1059/Sanyo_Denki_120mm_x_38mm_High-Speed_Fan_-_1025_CFM_109R1212H1011.html?tl=g36c15s562


not a grand just for fans lol! maybe.....3-400 totally pot shotting this by the way. how much did you spend on fans? I might stick with push pull but if I don't need it (propably not) then I'll go push or pull.

plus I want quiet fans lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not a grand just for fans lol! maybe.....3-400 totally pot shotting this by the way. how much did you spend on fans? I might stick with push pull but if I don't need it (propably not) then I'll go push or pull.
> 
> plus I want quiet fans lol


...per Hookies above listing, Gentle Typhoons, according to a friend who runs a render farm with over 40 machines, each with 2x 7970ies....I like the Bitfenix 200mm sickle fans for non-radiator duty (ie general board / GPU cooling), 19 db only and huge air flow - may be you should also buy a lotto ticket in addition to the summer job


----------



## alancsalt

AFAIK
Push better than Pull
Not much gain in Push/Pull.

Also, radiators can be designed to benefit from particular types of fans... Different XSPC rads have differing optimum fan requirements, varied by depth and fin density...

AFAIK.


----------



## Stige

For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.

*OCN name:* Stige
*CPU:* 3570K
*on die-TIM:* CLP
*ihs-TIM:* CLP
*Mhz gained:* 100
*OC after delid:* 5100MHz
*Temp drops:* 25-30C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2733873

I don't have exact temp differences but in Prime95 before delid at 5GHz @ 1.44V I hit 85C temps in just few minutes and it takes about 22-24 minutes to reach max temps on my cooling setup.

Currently at 5.1GHz / 1.504V I don't even break 60C in temps before the 15 min mark in Prime, and after that it climbs to ~64-66C and stops there.

Couldn't get enough pressure on the CPU with just the block to go for direct-to-die install


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not a grand just for fans lol! maybe.....3-400 totally pot shotting this by the way. how much did you spend on fans? I might stick with push pull but if I don't need it (propably not) then I'll go push or pull.
> 
> plus I want quiet fans lol


Push is your friend if you want quiet...also you'll be looking at a 1000 to 1500rpm fan for that job.
I think Gelid Silent 120 pwm will be best in a price/performance ratio for your needs. They perform on par with Gentle Typhoons but are quieter at certain rpm. The best would be Noctua NF-F12 PWM but they cost a bit more, or BeQuiet! Silent Wings 120mm pwm fans, but cost more than Noctuas sometimes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> AFAIK
> Push better than Pull
> Not much gain in Push/Pull.
> 
> Also, radiators can be designed to benefit from particular types of fans... Different XSPC rads have differing optimum fan requirements, varied by depth and fin density...
> 
> AFAIK.


Yup!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> 
> *OCN name:* Stige
> *CPU:* 3570K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* CLP
> *Mhz gained:* 100
> *OC after delid:* 5100MHz
> *Temp drops:* 25-30C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2733873
> 
> I don't have exact temp differences but in Prime95 before delid at 5GHz @ 1.44V I hit 85C temps in just few minutes and it takes about 22-24 minutes to reach max temps on my cooling setup.
> 
> Currently at 5.1GHz / 1.504V I don't even break 60C in temps before the 15 min mark in Prime, and after that it climbs to ~64-66C and stops there.
> 
> Couldn't get enough pressure on the CPU with just the block to go for direct-to-die install


Nice temps for 5.1ghz


----------



## RavageTheEarth

This really is an absolute nightmare trying to OC my chip. I ended up starting to use a level 2 LLC even though the voltage fed to the chip seemed to be a lot more than the other Levels of LLC that I have tried, but all I care about is stability because I had a multimeter anyways. Something does not seem right about this. I'm working on a 4.8Ghz OC A couple days ago I was at +.129 additional turbo boost with +.005 offset and a level 2 LLC. I left P95 all night and after 11 hours one worker had an error and the others were still working. So I ended up bumping it up to +.138 additional turbo voltage and it P95 crashed after like 2 hours. So last night I was at +.152 additional turbo voltage so I left P95 run all night and I got a BSOD after for hours. Keep in mind that .129 additional turbo boost is actually 1.484v and .152 is 1.506v. Sorry guys, I just needed to vent.


----------



## MoGTy

Waiting for my new stuff to come in, I'll post a delidded application.

I'll be happy if it drops the temps and keep it at that. I have a really bad chip for overclocking. Hits a wall at 4.5Ghz, no amount of voltage will change that.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> Waiting for my new stuff to come in, I'll post a delidded application.
> 
> I'll be happy if it drops the temps and keep it at that. I have a really bad chip for overclocking. Hits a wall at 4.5Ghz, no amount of voltage will change that.


Let us know how it goes!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys so as some of you know I am going to be replacing my MOBO soon with an ASUS MVF, but I just have one question. So when I take my CPU out do I have to take the IHS off and clean all of the CLU off of it? Or could I just kind of see if any stuck to the heatsink and then kind of brush a little more on the spots missing on the IHS and go over the old CLU to make a nice layer again and just clean the heatsink? I'm just wondering because it's going to be a little scary cleaning the CLU off with the IHS on the PCB because the IHS is going to move around and it will be scary taking the IHS off and leaving the bare die open to the dangers of the world haha.


----------



## PapaSmurf6768

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> The asus rep jj said the max Vcore for this chip [i7 3770k] is 1.35 so your are right in the conservative max.
> 
> 
> 
> Persosonally i think 1.45 @ a 4900 OC is where I'm set 24/7 but mine idles down to 1600 with a Vcore of 1.124 when no cpu demands are present.


OK I'll just leave it then I think, I'm sure it'll be fine (knock on wood). My MSI board doesn't have any offset capabilities unfortunately, so the OC I set it at is the speed it stays at.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey guys so as some of you know I am going to be replacing my MOBO soon with an ASUS MVF, but I just have one question. So when I take my CPU out do I have to take the IHS off and clean all of the CLU off of it? Or could I just kind of see if any stuck to the heatsink and then kind of brush a little more on the spots missing on the IHS and go over the old CLU to make a nice layer again and just clean the heatsink? I'm just wondering because it's going to be a little scary cleaning the CLU off with the IHS on the PCB because the IHS is going to move around and it will be scary taking the IHS off and leaving the bare die open to the dangers of the world haha.


CLU is fully reusable, you shouldn't have any issues without replacing the paste, atleast I haven't had any yet.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> CLU is fully reusable, you shouldn't have any issues without replacing the paste, atleast I haven't had any yet.


Ok cool thanks! I always go to call it pastee but I can't get myself to do it because it is so much more than that. I'm going to just call it T-1000 like from terminator haha


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Do you guys think I'm having such a hard time overclocking because my memory (Corsair Vengeance Low-Profile DDR3 1600) isn't on the supported memory list for my AsRock Z77 Extreme4? My MOBO automatically sets it to DDR3 1333 so I have set it manually to DDR3 1600. Should I overclock it higher than 1600? Or should I let the MOBO underclock it to 1333? Or is that not a factor in overclocking a cpu?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Do you guys think I'm having such a hard time overclocking because my memory (Corsair Vengeance Low-Profile DDR3 1600) isn't on the supported memory list for my AsRock Z77 Extreme4? My MOBO automatically sets it to DDR3 1333 so I have set it manually to DDR3 1600. Should I overclock it higher than 1600? Or should I let the MOBO underclock it to 1333? Or is that not a factor in overclocking a cpu?


Did you select the XMP profile?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Did you select the XMP profile?


I don't know what an XMP profile is? How do I select it?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey guys so as some of you know I am going to be replacing my MOBO soon with an ASUS MVF, but I just have one question. So when I take my CPU out do I have to take the IHS off and clean all of the CLU off of it? Or could I just kind of see if any stuck to the heatsink and then kind of brush a little more on the spots missing on the IHS and go over the old CLU to make a nice layer again and just clean the heatsink? I'm just wondering because it's going to be a little scary cleaning the CLU off with the IHS on the PCB because the IHS is going to move around and it will be scary taking the IHS off and leaving the bare die open to the dangers of the world haha.


I would be interested to know how it turn out. I have two MVF boards and don't have any of the issues you have reported, so it will be nice to know if the board has something do with it. The only problem is the Asus bios bug, but a new version should be out soon. When you encounter the bug it only takes a few minutes to fix, so it is not a big deal, just annoying.

Just follow Swag's guide to overclock your chip with the MVF, it has everything you need. You shouldn't have any problems at all, but if you have any questions just post them in the guide and someone will help you with whatever you need.

CLU can be reused the same day, maybe the next, but not weeks later. It starts to harden, and you can see and feel the roughness of it when you pull off the heatsink after it has been there awhile. You can see in the pics I posted here what it looks like when it sets, but it can be cleaned off.

Taking off the IHS is no big deal, and you will need to do so for optimal results. Just be careful, and prepare like you would if you were going to delid. Cleaning CLU off the die is easy since it is not metal, but you may need some metal polish and a decent amount of time to clean it off the top and bottom of the IHS. Since you are going to use CLU again, you don't have too make it look perfect, you just have to make it perfectly smooth. You don't want bits of hardened CLU to prevent a match between the surfaces. Hope that helps.


----------



## Littlejoe

Well I guess I've hit the top of my chip at 4.7 @ 1.375v. I've been all the way to 1.5 and can't get 4.8 stable. I am using the "turbo" method. Leaving the multiplier on auto and manually changing the voltage. I was hoping to get to 5.0. Just so I could get in the 5.0 club but, oh well. For my 24/7 I leave the cpu and voltage on auto and get to 4.4 stable @ 1.216v stable. Willing to listen to any suggestions on getting to 5.0.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I don't know what an XMP profile is? How do I select it?


It's in the overclocking menu. About half-way down. Right above where you select the RAM frequency. Select the XMP profile that is stored on your RAM and you can leave the rest of the RAM settings auto.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I would be interested to know how it turn out. I have two MVF boards and don't have any of the issues you have reported, so it will be nice to know if the board has something do with it. The only problem is the Asus bios bug, but a new version should be out soon. When you encounter the bug it only takes a few minutes to fix, so it is not a big deal, just annoying.
> 
> Just follow Swag's guide to overclock your chip with the MVF, it has everything you need. You shouldn't have any problems at all, but if you have any questions just post them in the guide and someone will help you with whatever you need.
> 
> CLU can be reused the same day, maybe the next, but not weeks later. It starts to harden, and you can see and feel the roughness of it when you pull off the heatsink after it has been there awhile. You can see in the pics I posted here what it looks like when it sets, but it can be cleaned off.
> 
> Taking off the IHS is no big deal, and you will need to do so for optimal results. Just be careful, and prepare like you would if you were going to delid. Cleaning CLU off the die is easy since it is not metal, but you may need some metal polish and a decent amount of time to clean it off the top and bottom of the IHS. Since you are going to use CLU again, you don't have too make it look perfect, you just have to make it perfectly smooth. You don't want bits of hardened CLU to prevent a match between the surfaces. Hope that helps.


Thanks a lot! Very nice to see you post you have been a lot of help to me when I need it and I thank you for that. I feel like it has to be the MOBO that is making it so hard to OC my chip. I got all the way up to 1.503v (DMM) for 4.8Ghz and it is still not stable. 4.5Ghz only needs 1.25v (DMM) to be stable. I know that I don't have the best chip and I'm not going to hit 5Ghz just by replacing the MOBO, but I think it definetly will help.

What do you mean by the "BIOS bug"?

And yes I will replace the CLU. Sucks that they gave me a leaking syringe with mine I barely have any left now because half of it leaked out of it.

I emailed Cool labs and they said they would send me a new one and asked for my shipping information so I gave it to them, but they haven't emailed me back after that. Hopefully they are actually sending one out to me.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What do you mean by the "BIOS bug"?


No problem. I honestly try to help when I can, so many here have helped me along the way. The Asus bios bug which I first encountered at the beginning of January, happens when you make a few too many changes in bios and cause instability while testing. I have had to deal with it over three chip overclocks, and while it is annoying it is easy to address.

One of the most common symptoms is making a change in bios to the multiplier or something else, and those changes not actually following through when getting to your desktop. When that happens, or any other unexplained strangeness going on with bios, you just reflash the same bios and you are good to go. You just make sure to export your saved profiles to a usb stick, so you can load them after the flash. Once you reach your stable oc and stop making changes, you don't see the bug anymore.

Asus has been working on a new bios to fix the bug for weeks, we are expecting it in the near future. That sucks about your CLU, hopefully they send it out soon.


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> The asus rep jj said the max Vcore for this chip [i7 3770k] is 1.35 so your are right in the conservative max.
> 
> 
> 
> Persosonally i think 1.45 @ a 4900 OC is where I'm set 24/7 but mine idles down to 1600 with a Vcore of 1.124 when no cpu demands are present.


My CPU goes back to 1600 when not used but V-core stays the same (1,38 for 4,7Ghz)

How do you do to make it idle dows ?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No problem. I honestly try to help when I can, so many here have helped me along the way. The Asus bios bug which I first encountered at the beginning of January, happens when you make a few too many changes in bios and cause instability while testing. I have had to deal with it over three chip overclocks, and while it is annoying it is easy to address.
> 
> One of the most common symptoms is making a change in bios to the multiplier or something else, and those changes not actually following through when getting to your desktop. When that happens, or any other unexplained strangeness going on with bios, you just reflash the same bios and you are good to go. You just make sure to export your saved profiles to a usb stick, so you can load them after the flash. Once you reach your stable oc and stop making changes, you don't see the bug anymore.
> 
> Asus has been working on a new bios to fix the bug for weeks, we are expecting it in the near future. That sucks about your CLU, hopefully they send it out soon.


Damn so everytime you change the multiplier you have to re-flash the BIOS? That sucks! Be sure to let me know if they come out for a fix. Or is there somewhere that I can check to see if they came out with it?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> Well I guess I've hit the top of my chip at 4.7 @ 1.375v. I've been all the way to 1.5 and can't get 4.8 stable. I am using the "turbo" method. Leaving the multiplier on auto and manually changing the voltage. I was hoping to get to 5.0. Just so I could get in the 5.0 club but, oh well. For my 24/7 I leave the cpu and voltage on auto and get to 4.4 stable @ 1.216v stable. Willing to listen to any suggestions on getting to 5.0.


I feel your pain man. What do you mean you are leaving the multiplier on auto? Do you mean turbo boost is on auto? Are you using an offset or fixed voltage? Are all of your other settings on auto? How about your c-states? Post some pics of your BIOS settings so we can help you out.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> My CPU goes back to 1600 when not used but V-core stays the same (1,38 for 4,7Ghz)
> 
> How do you do to make it idle dows ?


You would need to use offset mode instead of fixed mode for your voltage.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> My CPU goes back to 1600 when not used but V-core stays the same (1,38 for 4,7Ghz)
> 
> How do you do to make it idle dows ?


That is offset vs manual voltage, since you have an Asus mobo it is all covered here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Damn so everytime you change the multiplier you have to re-flash the BIOS? That sucks! Be sure to let me know if they come out for a fix. Or is there somewhere that I can check to see if they came out with it?


Sorry, to be clear, no one knows exactly how many changes and/or instability triggers the bug, but it not just one or two. Sometimes I can make 10+ changes with zero issues, other times only a handful if I created too much instability. You can check the download site of Asus support for the MVF, it will be something after the current 1604 bios. I would hope we see it before the end of the month.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Damn so everytime you change the multiplier you have to re-flash the BIOS? That sucks! Be sure to let me know if they come out for a fix. Or is there somewhere that I can check to see if they came out with it?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> That is offset vs manual voltage, since you have an Asus mobo it is all covered here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards
> Sorry, to be clear, no one knows exactly how many changes and/or instability triggers the bug, but it not just one or two. Sometimes I can make 10+ changes with zero issues, other times only a handful if I created too much instability. You can check the download site of Asus support for the MVF, it will be something after the current 1604 bios. I would hope we see it before the end of the month.


I only run the old beta driver (the last released by Shamino at kingpincooling.com forums...)
Most stable and troublefree driver, and the best for benching.


----------



## jdm317

Delidded my new i7 3770k last night. I found that even though it is tedious, its pretty easy if you're patient. Went ahead and removed my socket holder and running lidless under my Koolance 380i. Using Shin Etsu G751 till my Coollaboratory Liquid Pro arrives. Temps dropped 15c, cant wait to see what it does with the Liquid Pro. Thanks for the advice. One little tip I have is that if you run the blade across a piece of paper at a strong angle, if it "catches" a lot (friction), turn it over, it should be much smoother on the other side of the blade, mark the razor side that is facing up as "TOP". By Doing this, Im pretty sure the razor blade never even touched the silicon.


Thank you for the great guide, it was very helpful.


----------



## snowfree52

thank you guys ! will have a look at this offset !


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Delidded my new i7 3770k last night. I found that even though it is tedious, its pretty easy if you're patient. Went ahead and removed my socket holder and running lidless under my Koolance 380i. Using Shin Etsu G751 till my Coollaboratory Liquid Pro arrives. Temps dropped 15c, cant wait to see what it does with the Liquid Pro. Thanks for the advice. One little tip I have is that if you run the blade across a piece of paper at a strong angle, if it "catches" a lot (friction), turn it over, it should be much smoother on the other side of the blade, mark the razor side that is facing up as "TOP". By Doing this, Im pretty sure the razor blade never even touched the silicon.
> 
> 
> Thank you for the great guide, it was very helpful.


Great job!!! Congrats on the success!!!!!


----------



## Littlejoe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I feel your pain man. What do you mean you are leaving the multiplier on auto? Do you mean turbo boost is on auto? Are you using an offset or fixed voltage? Are all of your other settings on auto? How about your c-states? Post some pics of your BIOS settings so we can help you out.


I overclock using turbo, that's the multiplier I change. My board does not have off-set voltage, but V-droop is at 100%. I'll try and edit with some picks.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not a grand just for fans lol! maybe.....3-400 totally pot shotting this by the way. how much did you spend on fans? I might stick with push pull but if I don't need it (propably not) then I'll go push or pull.
> 
> plus I want quiet fans lol


Then ur gonna have to go cheap...

u would have so many rads u would not need p/p like me i just run pull because i have so many rads... and pull is more quiet.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No problem. I honestly try to help when I can, so many here have helped me along the way. The Asus bios bug which I first encountered at the beginning of January, happens when you make a few too many changes in bios and cause instability while testing. I have had to deal with it over three chip overclocks, and while it is annoying it is easy to address.
> 
> One of the most common symptoms is making a change in bios to the multiplier or something else, and those changes not actually following through when getting to your desktop. When that happens, or any other unexplained strangeness going on with bios, you just reflash the same bios and you are good to go. You just make sure to export your saved profiles to a usb stick, so you can load them after the flash. Once you reach your stable oc and stop making changes, you don't see the bug anymore.
> 
> Asus has been working on a new bios to fix the bug for weeks, we are expecting it in the near future. That sucks about your CLU, hopefully they send it out soon.


Yep, this is absolutly true. but not a game changer. sometimes I change a multiplier but the multi is 39 when i set 48 for example, I just reflash the bios from usb (usb must be formated to fat32) and load a profile, also on my usb. good-to-go. besides flashing bios and saving profiles is good practice when overclocking anywho.







*"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Great job!!! Congrats on the success!!!!!


Hey, thanks man!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Do you guys think I'm having such a hard time overclocking because my memory (Corsair Vengeance Low-Profile DDR3 1600) isn't on the supported memory list for my AsRock Z77 Extreme4? My MOBO automatically sets it to DDR3 1333 so I have set it manually to DDR3 1600. Should I overclock it higher than 1600? Or should I let the MOBO underclock it to 1333? Or is that not a factor in overclocking a cpu?


there is a bios update on the extreme 4 that fixes that


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Then ur gonna have to go cheap...
> 
> u would have so many rads u would not need p/p like me i just run pull because i have so many rads... and pull is more quiet.


And pull gives higher temps than Push.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> And pull gives higher temps than Push.


i always thought pull was better!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> And pull gives higher temps than Push.


Depends on the rad and the fan...

When you have a MASSIVE Amount of Massive rads it is not so important...

Example...




And the extra 20DBA of noise p/p adds is not worth the 1c temp drop i might get LoL.


----------



## lilchronic

^^^ MASSIVE LOL
do you guy think these wil be suficiente enough to cool 2 670 sli and my cpu im bout to get enothr 670 next week then plan to go water cooling right after that








http://www.frozencpu.com/products/18290/ex-wat-242/Swiftech_H220_Compact_Drive_II_Plug-and-Play_Liquid_Cooling_System.html?tl=g30c321s818
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16236/ex-rad-410/Alphacool_NexXxoS_Monsta_Dual_120mm_Radiator_-_80mm_Thick.html?tl=g30c95s160
the alpha cool nexus is a beast i plan on a push pull config with that and just a pull set up with the h220


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I only run the old beta driver (the last released by Shamino at kingpincooling.com forums...)
> Most stable and troublefree driver, and the best for benching.


...Shamino had a major hand in designing the board I use (Max V Extreme)...do you have a direct link, please ? Tx









...I'm happy with my Valley (quad 670) score, but I'm trying to get into the 6k range - may be Shamino has s.th. new


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Depends on the rad and the fan...
> 
> When you have a MASSIVE Amount of Massive rads it is not so important...
> 
> Example...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And the extra 20DBA of noise p/p adds is not worth the 1c temp drop i might get LoL.


I want performance







So I could care less for noise!

I got 1850 RPM Gentle Typhoons on my Rad.


----------



## Hokies83

I run not much over delta


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> AFAIK
> Push better than Pull
> Not much gain in Push/Pull.
> 
> Also, radiators can be designed to benefit from particular types of fans... Different XSPC rads have differing optimum fan requirements, varied by depth and fin density...
> 
> AFAIK.


...tell me more, please







...in a previous configuration, I had a 240mm closed loop (Thermaltake 2 Ex) that by very (space) necessity had the rad and its two 120mm fans as 'pull', but on the outside in the back of the case in free air...so tests re push / pull were somewhat inconclusive









Now I have a custom loop in a much bigger case with a XSPC 360/60 all-copper rad mounted vertically at the front of the case - currently with 6x 120mm fans in push-pull...I know that push is my preference, especially as I reversed the airflow in the case...if I understand you correctly, I can get rid off' the 3 120mm pull fans and just leave the 3 120mm 'push' fans without too much / any? hit on performance ?

I can answer that question myself by doing some tests, but it is all very tight in there, and you can save me a few hours in a system with Quad-SLI and a lot of wires and tubes and pumps and res and etc very near the rad......thanks in advance


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...tell me more, please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...in a previous configuration, I had a 240mm closed loop (Thermaltake 2 Ex) that by very (space) necessity had the rad and its two 120mm fans as 'pull', but on the outside in the back of the case in free air...so tests re push / pull were somewhat inconclusive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I have a custom loop in a much bigger case with a XSPC 360/60 all-copper rad mounted vertically at the front of the case - currently with 6x 120mm fans in push-pull...I know that push is my preference, especially as I reversed the airflow in the case...if I understand you correctly, I can get rid off' the 3 120mm pull fans and just leave the 3 120mm 'push' fans without too much / any? hit on performance ?
> 
> I can answer that question myself by doing some tests, but it is all very tight in there, and you can save me a few hours in a system with Quad-SLI and a lot of wires and tubes and pumps and res and etc very near the rad......thanks in advance


It is all between 1-3c of eachother it all depends on how much noise u want. Pull most quit then push then p/p.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is all between 1-3c of eachother it all depends on how much noise u want. Pull most quit then push then p/p.


Thanks Hokies83


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://kingpincooling.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=23

Check that forum...You can find a bios thread for each ROG board. Get the latest beta bios and voila.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://kingpincooling.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=23
> 
> Check that forum...You can find a bios thread for each ROG board. Get the latest beta bios and voila.


Thanks Ivanlabrie







...great to have the link back as I had lost it...

I also have some non-Bios questions for those folks, i.e. on Max V Extr., any more info on the differences between PCI Gen3 preset auto - 1 - 2 -3














...not much info anywhere on that....yet I would like to know as I am really getting that system dialed in now: http://www.overclock.net/t/1360884/official-top-30-unigine-valley-benchmark-1-0-fill-the-form/2640#post_19539264

...re the actual Bios issue and lost / blocked multipliers, there is a way around that and I'll share in a post coming up later this week.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Then ur gonna have to go cheap...
> 
> u would have so many rads u would not need p/p like me i just run pull because i have so many rads... and pull is more quiet.


I can do 25 of the gray ones. (Total mind blank right now) but I can maybe do 500 for fans so I can throw some others in. Im thinking of sandwiching all these rads together for my side panel ideas of 2 acrylic windows. But if not ill just do one acrylic window with a nice curve in it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

9G1212M4011 Val...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> 
> *OCN name:* Stige
> *CPU:* 3570K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* CLP
> *Mhz gained:* 100
> *OC after delid:* 5100MHz
> *Temp drops:* 25-30C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2733873
> 
> I don't have exact temp differences but in Prime95 before delid at 5GHz @ 1.44V I hit 85C temps in just few minutes and it takes about 22-24 minutes to reach max temps on my cooling setup.
> 
> Currently at 5.1GHz / 1.504V I don't even break 60C in temps before the 15 min mark in Prime, and after that it climbs to ~64-66C and stops there.
> 
> Couldn't get enough pressure on the CPU with just the block to go for direct-to-die install


You're In! :thumb sorry about that time of not getting you was on my phone for a large chunk of the day


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is all between 1-3c of eachother it all depends on how much noise u want. Pull most quit then push then p/p.


Not necessarily at all.

If you got crappy fans, Push/Pull will make a world of a difference (I got 10C drop on my TrueSpirit when I added a second fan to it).
But if you got good fans then it won't make that much of a difference, not on my radiator atleast.

Pull setup was good 4-5C worse on my Rad than Push was, pretty big difference IMO when it might matter.


----------



## snowfree52

Well my 3770K is stable @ 1,32V for 4,7Ghz , I guess it's not so bad ...


----------



## alancsalt

I think Hokies was talking about noise levels? As for push/pull, made no difference for me on a 120 rad with a 25mm shroud on the push side , but maybe there are situations where it does...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I think Hokies was talking about noise levels? As for push/pull, made no difference for me on a 120 rad with a 25mm shroud on the push side , but maybe there are situations where it does...


Thanks - I'm going to check out how 3 good push fans only (instead of 6 push / pull) will perform temp wise on the 360/60 rad...sure could use that extra space I would gain. Currently, at 5.1 GHz 3 consecutive runs of Cinebench will heat the cores up to only 70 C max, so I have a bit of headroom.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Well my 3770K is stable @ 1,32V for 4,7Ghz , I guess it's not so bad ...


that's pretty good IMO
I feel that our i7's require more power than the i5's do.


----------



## snowfree52

yeah but I need just a bit less than 1,45V for 4,8Ghz


----------



## [CyGnus]

Every system is different with me push/pull is not worth it i see less 1ºc and maybe the difference is the ambient i do know, but i have better results in push about -3ºc better temps compared to pull.
Since fans are so cheap we might as well test to see the difference


----------



## ivanlabrie

There's a thread with results comparing push, pull and push/pull configs for a ton of fans on a Megahalems heatsink and a x58 I7 oced to 3.6ghz or something.
Check it out, push/pull is normally not too much better, but introduces more noise than push and a bit more than pull. Depending on the rad pull may be noisier with certain fans than push.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1274407/fans-the-most-complete-and-comprehensive-array-of-tests-and-benchmarks


----------



## snowfree52

I think with push/pull you can go quieter for the same result


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> yeah but I need just a bit less than 1,45V for 4,8Ghz


I think I need more for 4.7ghz - but can't be asked to stress my chip so much - 4.5ghz at 1.27 is more than enough for me + I get a max temp of 68c which in my opinion is beastly, as I was hitting 92c before de-lidding


----------



## snowfree52

at 1,32V I'm just under 80°C and I'm not delidded


----------



## snowfree52

here is some charts about push/pull : http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com/Radiator-Fan-Orientation-And-Shroud-Testing-Review.html


----------



## [CyGnus]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I think I need more for 4.7ghz - but can't be asked to stress my chip so much - 4.5ghz at 1.27 is more than enough for me + I get a max temp of 68c which in my opinion is beastly, as I was hitting 92c before de-lidding


Something is wrong there i have a antec 620 (akasa viper fan @ 1300 rpm) and my 3570k @ 4.7GHz 1.26v IBT does not go above 54ºc so i would say 4.5 and 68ºc is not good at all


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Something is wrong there i have a antec 620 (akasa viper fan @ 1300 rpm) and my 3570k @ 4.7GHz 1.26v IBT does not go above 54ºc so i would say 4.5 and 68ºc is not good at all


Sorry, but I can't really do anything more.
I had 92c before de-lidding.
Heard the same story over and over again - I then sent it into for RMA, Scan UK came back saying the temps were fine.
Then I contacted Antec, and told them my temps, on stock 3.5ghz were 70c - and they came back telling me that was normal for a liquid cooler.
I can't really do or say much more.

My fitting is also correct - you may see a video I created in the antec 920 club (in my sig).

Long story short:
I can't do anything about those temps - more so other people have also reported similar high-temperatures from their antec 920 units. Another user was hitting 70c+ on stock, and another 85c+ on 4.5ghz.

I wish I had even better temps - but that's why I de-lidded.
68c on full load, is the lowest/highest I've ever seen my CPU on load be.
In other words, I'm happy with 68c MAX temperatures on 100% load whilst folding.

PS. IBT is a RUBBISH test for temps.
Sure for 50 gflops you might get a better indication, but IBT for me is only for short-term stress testing.
Temps CANNOT be determined by IBT alone.
I do understand Val's logic in putting IBT in order to test people's temps post and pre de-lidding, as that's the easiest, and fastest way - but as some people on here might know - including justanoldman - IBT temperatures should be taken with a pinch of salt.
Prime 95 for 24 hrs and/or fold for over 8hrs - THEN you'll know your actual MAX temperatures.
I got print screens as proof showing the huge difference and inconsistency of IBT temperatures.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Sorry, but I can't really do anything more.
> I had 92c before de-lidding.
> Heard the same story over and over again - I then sent it into for RMA, Scan UK came back saying the temps were fine.
> Then I contacted Antec, and told them my temps, on stock 3.5ghz were 70c - and they came back telling me that was normal for a liquid cooler.
> I can't really do or say much more.
> 
> My fitting is also correct - you may see a video I created in the antec 920 club (in my sig).
> 
> Long story short:
> I can't do anything about those temps - more so other people have also reported similar high-temperatures from their antec 920 units. Another user was hitting 70c+ on stock, and another 85c+ on 4.5ghz.
> 
> I wish I had even better temps - but that's why I de-lidded.
> 68c on full load, is the lowest/highest I've ever seen my CPU on load be.
> In other words, I'm happy with 68c MAX temperatures on 100% load whilst folding.
> 
> PS. IBT is a RUBBISH test for temps.
> Sure for 50 gflops you might get a better indication, but IBT for me is only for short-term stress testing.
> Temps CANNOT be determined by IBT alone.
> I do understand Val's logic in putting IBT in order to test people's temps post and pre de-lidding, as that's the easiest, and fastest way - but as some people on here might know - including justanoldman - IBT temperatures should be taken with a pinch of salt.
> Prime 95 for 24 hrs and/or fold for over 8hrs - THEN you'll know your actual MAX temperatures.
> I got print screens as proof showing the huge difference and inconsistency of IBT temperatures.


Wayne Rooney runs a Kuhler 920. He has a 3770K @ 9GHz with max temp of 37C. The chip wants to get hotter but it just respects him too much. Maybe if you score a couple more goals per year your chip would comply.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Wayne Rooney runs a Kuhler 920. He has a 3770K @ 9GHz with max temp of 37C. The chip wants to get hotter but it just respects him too much. Maybe if you score a couple more goals per year your chip would comply.


that's on idle right?
9HGZ? hahaha BEAST









As for football - here's my victories in Fifa 13 - I've gone for a French sided team:



Check the goal out at 5:20


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well i mentioned IBT as reference cause it runs hotter then Prime 95 i only ran mine about 12h and max temp was 51ºc folding its 48ºc. I dont believe my cpu is special and runs -15ºc cooler but if you say everything is ok idont know what is going on. Is it well mounted / seated the amount of CLP/U
correct?
I had to re-seat the IHS 3 times because i had too much CLP on it and the temps were just awful but when i applied a tiny bit almost none on the die the temps decreased -10ºc easy.
Make sure everything is spot on i find those 68ºc a little high. Try to LAP the block and the IHS. Explore all options


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well i mentioned IBT as reference cause it runs hotter then Prime 95 i only ran mine about 12h and max temp was 51ºc folding its 48ºc. I dont believe my cpu is special and runs -15ºc cooler but if you say everything is ok idont know what is going on. Is it well mounted / seated the amount of CLP/U
> correct?
> I had to re-seat the IHS 3 times because i had too much CLP on it and the temps were just awful but when i applied a tiny bit almost none on the die the temps decreased -10ºc easy.
> Make sure everything is spot on i find those 68ºc a little high. Try to LAP the block and the IHS. Explore all options


What hes saying is he thinks he has a faulty Kuhler, but the retailer and the manufacturer are telling him it's fine so there's nothing he can do about it, unless he wants to throw it away and get something else.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well i mentioned IBT as reference cause it runs hotter then Prime 95 i only ran mine about 12h and max temp was 51ºc folding its 48ºc. I dont believe my cpu is special and runs -15ºc cooler but if you say everything is ok idont know what is going on. Is it well mounted / seated the amount of CLP/U
> correct?
> I had to re-seat the IHS 3 times because i had too much CLP on it and the temps were just awful but when i applied a tiny bit almost none on the die the temps decreased -10ºc easy.
> Make sure everything is spot on i find those 68ºc a little high. Try to LAP the block and the IHS. Explore all options


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What hes saying is he thinks he has a faulty Kuhler, but the retailer and the manufacturer are telling him it's fine so there's nothing he can do about it, unless he wants to throw it away and get something else.


this









And yes - I have done everything - incl experimenting with CLU amount, paste form (X method etc), mounting pressure, and fan direction.
I won't lap the IHS.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And yes - I have done everything - incl experimenting with CLU amount, *paste form (X method etc)*, mounting pressure, and fan direction.
> I won't lap the IHS.


Have you looked at the video on how the CLU/CLP is supposed to be applied?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> that's on idle right?
> 9HGZ? hahaha BEAST
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for football - here's my victories in Fifa 13 - I've gone for a French sided team:
> 
> 
> 
> Check the goal out at 5:20


Nope 37C full load.

You play on XBOX? I play too, I got FIFA13 on PC. I played the last couple of FIFAs on PS3 but thought it would be cool on PC. It's nice, plus it was only $30 instead of $60 so that's good too. Can people on PC play people on XBOX? If so we should have a game!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Have you looked at the video on how the CLU/CLP is supposed to be applied?


I'm guessing he did because he explains how to apply it in his video on the first page of this thread







I wonder if there is something up with quality control on those antecs. Have you ever tried another cooler on the CPU? I do think that something is wrong, but I totally believe you that you have tried everything.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Couldn't get enough pressure on the CPU with just the block to go for direct-to-die install


What I did with my Supremacy was order a replacement mounting kit, Then *I bent the arms up* on the original one and put the replacement in the box for when I decide to swap blocks.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I kind of gave up on my 4.8Ghz OC and just went back down to 4.5Ghz, which I never actually thoroughly tested, until I get rid of this damn board. I'm just going save for a month just so I can save some money too and spend somewhere around $600 for a case and motherboard. So do we all agree that the ASUS Maximus V Formula is a good choice? Anyways, so I'm using 1.279v DMM (I know I started a little high, but since 4.7Ghz took 1.461v DMM I figured I would start a little higher). CPU-z is reading between 1.224 - 1.24, but that isn't right. Here is a screeny of P95 a little over 11 hours in. As you can see my chip hasn't gone above 62c.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> What I did with my Supremacy was order a replacement mounting kit, Then *I bent the arms up* on the original one and put the replacement in the box for when I decide to swap blocks.


Got any pics? Not sure what you mean


----------



## Xinoxide

It seems to be the z77 e4 took a turn for the worst.

I had a z68 e3 gen3, and I had NUMEROUS 2500K's running 5ghz+. with ease. it wasn't until I hit 5.2+ territory the board showed it limits.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yea I look forward to getting rid of it. I need more rep so I can sell it on here. I also have like two crossfire bridges, a 212 EVO, and a couple fans that I no longer need. Just waiting for the rep to flood in and I'm going to post everything I have been saving up online haha.

I wish I knew of these problems when I bent my pins on my other one. Then I wouldn't have spent $130 on another one. It's my fault though. I've invested over 2k on this rig and I shouldn't have cheaped out on the motherboard. I totally thought microcenter would sell the MVF for less, but it is actually ten dollars more than on newegg.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Nope 37C full load.
> 
> You play on XBOX? I play too, I got FIFA13 on PC. I played the last couple of FIFAs on PS3 but thought it would be cool on PC. It's nice, plus it was only $30 instead of $60 so that's good too. Can people on PC play people on XBOX? If so we should have a game!


No you can't - but yeah I was thinking of getting it for PC - but I love the Xbox community more









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm guessing he did because he explains how to apply it in his video on the first page of this thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if there is something up with quality control on those antecs. Have you ever tried another cooler on the CPU? I do think that something is wrong, but I totally believe you that you have tried everything.


I tried the STOCK intel cooler - and there was considerable difference between the two (after it came back from RMA) - RMA nothing changed - I have no idea why temps were so high beforehand (pre-delidding) -> but after it came back from RMA - nothing had changed, suddely temps were better (mount was exactly the same, and as video'ed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Have you looked at the video on how the CLU/CLP is supposed to be applied?


The pictures in the OP are mine - and the Video too - so yes I have indeed


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I just got an WHEA code 19 after 12 hours of P95









So that means I'm going to have to bump the voltage up to 1.3v for 4.5Ghz

Why do I get a feeling I'm going to take a ride to microcenter and gamble for a better one once again????


----------



## justanoldman

Tips for shopping at Micro Center:
They will match pretty much any price you find online, just bring a current printout. Look everywhere you can online and just find the best price for each component. This assumes you are willing to haggle if they act like they can't do it.

The more you buy the better. This is especially true when buying a chip. They lose money on it and the sales reps get bad marks if there are chips being sold without anything else on the ticket. If you are buying a chip they are usually much more willing to work with the other prices.

If you bought just a chip recently, but not much else on the ticket, you can do an in place exchange for the chip and add more items to the ticket. That way they go from a bad ticket with just a chip, to a good ticket with a chip plus other components. You can either actually exchange the chip (within 15 days) or keep your current chip, and they can still do the in place exchange.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Tips for shopping at Micro Center:
> They will match pretty much any price you find online, just bring a current printout. Look everywhere you can online and just find the best price for each component. This assumes you are willing to haggle if they act like they can't do it.
> 
> The more you buy the better. This is especially true when buying a chip. They lose money on it and the sales reps get bad marks if there are chips being sold without anything else on the ticket. If you are buying a chip they are usually much more willing to work with the other prices.
> 
> If you bought just a chip recently, but not much else on the ticket, you can do an in place exchange for the chip and add more items to the ticket. That way they go from a bad ticket with just a chip, to a good ticket with a chip plus other components. You can either actually exchange the chip (within 15 days) or keep your current chip, and they can still do the in place exchange.


Yea I'm a decent haggler so that should work out. You know, its wierd because I know they lose money on the chips, but everytime I have gone there and just bought a chip they say nothing. They just ring me up and send me on my way. I don't really like the people who work there they arent that friendly. At least at my cambridge, MA store.

I need to get a new motherboard and case before I blow money on a chip that I don't even need though. So its going to be a little while before I buy another one. I want to see how my chip handles in a better high quality motherboard. I shouldn't have cheaped out on one in the first place.


----------



## stickg1

They have a reserved parking spot up front for "justanoldman" in courtesy of his recent expenditures!


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I just got an WHEA code 19 after 12 hours of P95
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So that means I'm going to have to bump the voltage up to 1.3v for 4.5Ghz
> 
> Why do I get a feeling I'm going to take a ride to microcenter and gamble for a better one once again????


Got one too after 8 hours but discovered it after 16 hours. /sigh
This is a loooong way









Once I get it stable, Im gonna game the **** out of it


----------



## KuuFA

Just delidded my 3770k after grabbing it launch day. I Used the C Clamp method as shown on here and I think should be updated on the first page its a really easy way to do it (if you have the right tools)

I unfortunately did not take any pics but I just ordered my CLU TIM and will post pics when I have to take it apart again. Hopefully ill get a drop in temps like most people!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I'm a decent haggler so that should work out. You know, its wierd because I know they lose money on the chips, but everytime I have gone there and just bought a chip they say nothing. They just ring me up and send me on my way. I don't really like the people who work there they arent that friendly. At least at my cambridge, MA store.
> 
> I need to get a new motherboard and case before I blow money on a chip that I don't even need though. So its going to be a little while before I buy another one. I want to see how my chip handles in a better high quality motherboard. I shouldn't have cheaped out on one in the first place.


don't think it's worth it because haswell is 3 months away....

so wait 3 months and ditch ivy bridge all together i guess....


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I'm a decent haggler so that should work out. You know, its wierd because I know they lose money on the chips, but everytime I have gone there and just bought a chip they say nothing. They just ring me up and send me on my way. I don't really like the people who work there they arent that friendly. At least at my cambridge, MA store.
> 
> I need to get a new motherboard and case before I blow money on a chip that I don't even need though. So its going to be a little while before I buy another one. I want to see how my chip handles in a better high quality motherboard. I shouldn't have cheaped out on one in the first place.


I can do 5 on my workstation motherboard, lol worst decision of my life. Didn't even know it was a workstation, probably should've researched the "WS" before hand









But ya, it really isn't meant for overclocking, can't get any ram kit at their rated specs, crashes over 1600+, cpu does better but I really want to get a maximus 5 extreme to see what my chip can do, but I also want Haswell, maybe haswell E since intel might be skipping ivy e.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> don't think it's worth it because haswell is 3 months away....
> 
> so wait 3 months and ditch ivy bridge all together i guess....


Haswell is meh


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Haswell is meh


well the ipc gain is not much but if it is flux-less soldered and it's average over-clock is higher then by all means !!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> don't think it's worth it because haswell is 3 months away....
> 
> so wait 3 months and ditch ivy bridge all together i guess....


I know I'm just not sure what I want to do. I'm so torn. I wish we had more info on them or had some prototypes to gawk at, but until they are released and the threads start flooding in, we aren't going to know how much better they are. If I wait for Haswell I'm going to have to buy the chip, a new expensive motherboard, and some new expensive DDR4 RAM. I'm pretty sure I'm going to stick with Ivy for a while until I can really read up on how these chips are going to be and just be able to study them a little bit before spending all of that money.

What are you guys going to do? Am I going to be the only one in this thread when they come out??? I know it is going to make me jealous seeing all of these Haswell threads coming out. Its so nice coming home and just finding this thread always on the first page of the intel CPU's. Soon, I'm going to search for it...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Haswell is meh


We haven't really seen anything from haswell yet, bit too early to say if it is meh.

Unless you plan on running stock...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I know I'm just not sure what I want to do. I'm so torn. I wish we had more info on them or had some prototypes to gawk at, but until they are released and the threads start flooding in, we aren't going to know how much better they are. If I wait for Haswell I'm going to have to buy the chip, a new expensive motherboard, and some new expensive DDR4 RAM. I'm pretty sure I'm going to stick with Ivy for a while until I can really read up on how these chips are going to be and just be able to study them a little bit before spending all of that money.
> 
> What are you guys going to do? Am I going to be the only one in this thread when they come out??? I know it is going to make me jealous seeing all of these Haswell threads coming out. Its so nice coming home and just finding this thread always on the first page of the intel CPU's. Soon, I'm going to search for it...


Haswell won't be using ddr4, current memory can be used.


----------



## MoGTy

*OCN name:* mogty
*CPU:* i5 3570k
*on die-TIM:* AS5
*ihs-TIM:* AS5
*Mhz gained:* 400
*OC after delid:* 4.6Ghz
*Temp drops*: 14°C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2736040

Other info : I didn't use Liquid Pro or Ultra, because it's really hard to get over here. Ordering it takes weeks.

Some temp info, not meant to be used for an official temp evolution :

Temp is noted on the hottest core with IBT.

1.168v - 4.2Ghz
Stock TIM - no lapping - IBT temps : 76°C Ambient : 20°C

1.168v - 4.2Ghz
AS5 - no lapping - IBT temps : 67°C Ambient : 20°C

1.168v - 4.2Ghz
AS5 - lapped - IBT temps : 63°C Ambient : 21°C


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> We haven't really seen anything from haswell yet, bit too early to say if it is meh.


Oh but we did, its performance was previewed just today in 8 page thread on tomshardware, thats why Im saying its meh


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> We haven't really seen anything from haswell yet, bit too early to say if it is meh.
> 
> Unless you plan on running stock...
> Haswell won't be using ddr4, current memory can be used.


LoL see how Intel people say the next gen chip will be meh...

And the Amd people think magic will happen with Steamroller lmao.... they think there gonna get 30% = 50% IPC performance from the Faildriver to Steamroller..

LoL IMO SteamRoller will still be 15 = 25% slower then a similar clocked Sandy Bridge.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I know I'm just not sure what I want to do. I'm so torn. I wish we had more info on them or had some prototypes to gawk at, but until they are released and the threads start flooding in, we aren't going to know how much better they are. If I wait for Haswell I'm going to have to buy the chip, a new expensive motherboard, and some new expensive DDR4 RAM. I'm pretty sure I'm going to stick with Ivy for a while until I can really read up on how these chips are going to be and just be able to study them a little bit before spending all of that money.
> 
> What are you guys going to do? Am I going to be the only one in this thread when they come out??? I know it is going to make me jealous seeing all of these Haswell threads coming out. Its so nice coming home and just finding this thread always on the first page of the intel CPU's. Soon, I'm going to search for it...


no man you will be able to use the cheap ddr3, what i'm saying is if you are really gonna be buying another ivy bridge cpu then how about wait 3 months and get a haswell cpu + a mobo, you will be buying an extra mobo and you are not pleased with your extreme 4 anyways

so u want to buy another cpu + mobo right because your 3770k + extreme 4 is not satisfying you, so it's the same if you wait 3 months you will pay the same but for better newer tech, you get what i mean ?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> We haven't really seen anything from haswell yet, bit too early to say if it is meh.
> 
> Unless you plan on running stock...
> Haswell won't be using ddr4, current memory can be used.


Oh I thought it was going to support the new DDR4. I knew it would support current memory, but with the way I think I would just give them my credit card and tell them to give me all the latest stuff. Thats why I think it's safer for me to stick with Ivy


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL IMO SteamRoller will still be 15 = 25% slower then a similar clocked Sandy Bridge.


That is true, but the question is of course, if similar clocked Sandy Bridge´s performance is really needed. It is nice, but needed ? For a lot of people no, not really.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL see how Intel people say the next gen chip will be meh...
> 
> And the Amd people think magic will happen with Steamroller lmao.... they think there gonna get 30% = 50% IPC performance from the Faildriver to Steamroller..
> 
> LoL IMO SteamRoller will still be 15 = 25% slower then a similar clocked Sandy Bridge.


i really really wish that AMD comes back to competition because if not, Intel will skin us and milk us in the upcoming cpu generations because of NO competition !


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> no man you will be able to use the cheap ddr3, what i'm saying is if you are really gonna be buying another ivy bridge cpu then how about wait 3 months and get a haswell cpu + a mobo, you will be buying an extra mobo and you are not pleased with your extreme 4 anyways
> 
> so u want to buy another cpu + mobo right because your 3770k + extreme 4 is not satisfying you, so it's the same if you wait 3 months you will pay the same but for better newer tech, you get what i mean ?


Yea I hear ya. Is it really not going to cost more? I would think that the new chips and motherboards would cost more than the current 1155 and ivy tech.

and I'm not going to by another chip anytime soon. Money isn't flowing in like it used to. I was just kind of dreaming....


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I hear ya. Is it really not going to cost more? I would think that the new chips and motherboards would cost more than the current 1155 and ivy tech.


nope not really ivy will drop slightly while the latest and greatest then will claim the price points of ivy and z77 now, it's how it works









final verdict, don't invest in another ivy processor and main board now because you already have them and the newer gen is 3 months away

you ALREADY got the ivy even if it was clocked 4.4 or even 4.2 it's not worth it to try your luck again for a better chip + mobo to get a couple of hundred mhz more with a newer gen all together 3 months away just doesn't make sense man !


----------



## ivanlabrie

Unless the HSA foundation does its magicks...I wanna get a Steamroller chip eventually, seems like fun stuff.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Oh but we did, its performance was previewed just today in 8 page thread on tomshardware, thats why Im saying its meh


Tomshardware though, they can make any chip look meh.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL see how Intel people say the next gen chip will be meh...
> 
> And the Amd people think magic will happen with Steamroller lmao.... they think there gonna get 30% = 50% IPC performance from the Faildriver to Steamroller..
> 
> LoL IMO SteamRoller will still be 15 = 25% slower then a similar clocked Sandy Bridge.


The intel fans hope the next chip can have even more improvement the last one.
The AMD fans hope that the next chip is at least as good as the last one & pray for better.

AMD chips are still fun to play with, & do OK in some things.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> *OCN name:* mogty
> *CPU:* i5 3570k
> *on die-TIM:* AS5
> *ihs-TIM:* AS5
> *Mhz gained:* 400
> *OC after delid:* 4.6Ghz
> *Temp drops*: 14°C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2736040
> 
> Other info : I didn't use Liquid Pro or Ultra, because it's really hard to get over here. Ordering it takes weeks.
> 
> Some temp info, not meant to be used for an official temp evolution :
> 
> Temp is noted on the hottest core with IBT.
> 
> 1.168v - 4.2Ghz
> Stock TIM - no lapping - IBT temps : 76°C Ambient : 20°C
> 
> 1.168v - 4.2Ghz
> AS5 - no lapping - IBT temps : 67°C Ambient : 20°C
> 
> 1.168v - 4.2Ghz
> AS5 - lapped - IBT temps : 63°C Ambient : 21°C


You're In!







now slap that new sig you earned!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Argh, I want to fast forward till it's Thursday...new chip comin'
My birthday is the 26th, so I hope I can get some good scores to celebrate.
Got a 9800gt 512mb to repair now. I think I can do a pencil mod on it once I get my chip. Might be good for some ok scores. (don't wanna kill it, gotta give it back)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Argh, I want to fast forward till it's Thursday...new chip comin'
> My birthday is the 26th, so I hope I can get some good scores to celebrate.
> Got a 9800gt 512mb to repair now. I think I can do a pencil mod on it once I get my chip. Might be good for some ok scores. (don't wanna kill it, gotta give it back)


Meh ill be 30 April 26th XD


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now slap that new sig you earned!


Thank you !


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh ill be 30 April 26th XD


Same as my sister's birthday. She gets to hit 50 this year.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Argh, I want to fast forward till it's Thursday...new chip comin'
> My birthday is the 26th, so I hope I can get some good scores to celebrate.
> Got a 9800gt 512mb to repair now. I think I can do a pencil mod on it once I get my chip. Might be good for some ok scores. (don't wanna kill it, gotta give it back)


i get paid on the 26th


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I just want to say thanks to everyone here. This is really a great community of people. I wasn't sure what forums I should go to when I started building this rig since this is my first build in 5 years and even back then I didn't really get into forums or anything. I just built it without much info, got sick of it pretty quickly, and sold it. So this time around I joined toms hardware. People were soooo rude to me and you guys know that I'm not rude to anyone (or I try not to be). I was like, "what am I doing wrong???". Kind of discouraged me. So I seen this forum and seen a lot of good answers and participation here (not like at toms where someone would ask what components they should use for a computer build and all of the replies would be computer generated builds assembled by price). I joined and it was like the lights of heaven were shining in my face. Haven't been on toms hardware since the day I joined overclock.net. So yea, just wanted to say thanks for keeping me motivated in the pursuit of performance


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So does anyone know of a set date on when Haswell is coming out? Or is it one of those things like, "it should be June, but it might be December"?


----------



## stickg1

I know what you mean about Tom's Hardware. I was a member for a while and it was my favorite forum. But the quality of the members started going down hill. You get a bunch of cookie-cutter answers, for example, "Only buy Corsair or Seasonic PSUs", or people just making parts lists on pcpartpicker.com. Which can be useful but then the thread turns into 50 people taking that same build and changing one part and calling their's better. Then people start arguing about it. Then there was the time I got a temporary vacation for getting into it with a guy over his suggestions which were so a$$ backwards it was absurd. I still hang out there on occasion but it's only for a "Casual Talk" thread that me and couple of decent guys chit chat in. Similar to this thread only this thread has an actual purpose, lol. Most of them have made moderator by now, I probably could have too if I stayed more involved in the community. It was like herding cats though, can't get anything accomplished. OCN has a better format, and the average user on OCN is more knowledgeable than the average Tom's user.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So does anyone know of a set date on when Haswell is coming out? Or is it one of those things like, "it should be June, but it might be December"?


me thinking june is june









btw i don't know how to feel with my cpu right now, i delidded it, scratched it but it's working fine like it should with dual channel memory, 4 cores 8 threads , igpu aka all the bells and whistles and what not, should i be happy that i de-lidded it and it's still working or be pissed of that i actually scratched the pcb









the scratch is tinyyyyyyyyy, could i have been so extremely lucky that the scratch didn't cut any trace or any thing ?


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So does anyone know of a set date on when Haswell is coming out? Or is it one of those things like, "it should be June, but it might be December"?


It can definitely be one of those things. Knowing Intel, they can delay the release date however they please. But from my personal hunch, I think it would hit the market within a month after computex 2013.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> me thinking june is june
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> btw i don't know how to feel with my cpu right now, i delidded it, scratched it but it's working fine like it should with dual channel memory, 4 cores 8 threads , igpu aka all the bells and whistles and what not, should i be happy that i de-lidded it and it's still working or be pissed of that i actually scratched the pcb
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the scratch is tinyyyyyyyyy, could i have been so extremely lucky that the scratch didn't cut any trace or any thing ?


Trust me, I scratched my pcb on my 3570k and killed dual-channel memory so you should definetly be happy.... and grateful! haha You didn't have to go through the feeling where you boot your computer after putting the chip back in and it won't post and your heart sinks to the bottom of your stomach


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> me thinking june is june
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> btw i don't know how to feel with my cpu right now, i delidded it, scratched it but it's working fine like it should with dual channel memory, 4 cores 8 threads , igpu aka all the bells and whistles and what not, should i be happy that i de-lidded it and it's still working or be pissed of that i actually scratched the pcb


Long as it all works like it should, a scratch on the PCB should not be upsetting.
Perfection is nice, but sometimes you have to settle for adequate. As long as it runs cooler now, you are success!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> It can definitely be one of those things. Knowing Intel, they can delay the release date however they please. But from my personal hunch, I think it would hit the market within a month after computex 2013.


when is computex 2013 ? which month ?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Trust me, I scratched my pcb on my 3570k and killed dual-channel memory so you should definetly be happy.... and grateful! haha You didn't have to go through the feeling where you boot your computer after putting the chip back in and it won't post and your heart sinks to the bottom of your stomach


lol i got that feeling when the IHS fell off and my eye spotted the scratch i was like "curse it" - you know what i mean hah, even my mom noticed that i'm boiling inside !


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> when is computex 2013 ? which month ?


June 4th-8th, 2013.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Long as it all works like it should, a scratch on the PCB should not be upsetting.
> Perfection is nice, but sometimes you have to settle for adequate. As long as it runs cooler now, you are success!


but come to think of it perfect is something it wasn't even before the de-lid because 85c for just a 4.4 GHz oc was hardly a perfection don't you agree ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh ill be 30 April 26th XD


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Same as my sister's birthday. She gets to hit 50 this year.


Wow, plenty of coincidences...xD
I will probably delid my next chip if it ain't too good.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yep my face turned beat red it was a horrible feeling.

So do you guys think that microcenter is going to sell the 4770k's for 230 like they do for the 3770k's? Did they have that deal for the 3770k's when they came out? I really don't want to spend $330 on a chip. I'm too pampered now haha DAMN YOU MICROCENTER for polluting my mind with unbelievable deals!! If I'm going to have to pay over $300 for it I'm just going to stick with the 3770k until I can get a Haswell 4770k for $230. 15% performance increase isn't worth an extra hundred bucks IMO


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> but come to think of it perfect is something it wasn't even before the de-lid because 85c for just a 4.4 GHz oc was hardly a perfection don't you agree ?


Most definetly man!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yep my face turned beat red it was a horrible feeling.
> 
> So do you guys think that microcenter is going to sell the 4770k's for 230 like they do for the 3770k's? Did they have that deal for the 3770k's when they came out? I really don't want to spend $330 on a chip. I'm too pampered now haha DAMN YOU MICROCENTER for polluting my mind with unbelievable deals!! If I'm going to have to pay over $300 for it I'm just going to stick with the 3770k until I can get a Haswell 4770k for $230. 15% performance increase isn't worth an extra hundred bucks IMO


if it is 15% ipc + soldered IHS, then it will be worth it i guess !


----------



## inedenimadam

I AM IN! Not a scratch on it. Two minutes to get in, twenty to clean off all the black silicone. I could not wait for the CLP, so I am using arctic silver for the moment. 4.9Ghz, 1.328V, max temp 81



Also, if anyone has an extra IHS, I bent the corners of mine with the vice grips I used to hold it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> if it is 15% ipc + soldered IHS, then it will be worth it i guess !


Is a soldered IHS cooler than CLU on the die?


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> but come to think of it perfect is something it wasn't even before the de-lid because 85c for just a 4.4 GHz oc was hardly a perfection don't you agree ?


I think that it kinda depends upon how many volts was it taking for 4.4Ghz, because it may even be a poor overclocking chip before the delid process.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I AM IN! Not a scratch on it. Two minutes to get in, twenty to clean off all the black silicone. I could not wait for the CLP, so I am using arctic silver for the moment. 4.9Ghz, 1.328V, max temp 81
> 
> 
> 
> Also, if anyone has an extra IHS, I bent the corners of mine with the vice grips I used to hold it.


I have a 3570k IHS from my delidding attempt that resulted in a 3570k death. I was thinking of making it into a keychain so I'm not totally sure I want to give it away, but I will definetly think about it. Is it affecting your performance?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Most definetly man!


i was always feeling like, damn people with the same oc are in the 55c ballpark lol yet i have to deal with 85c

but the temp went down alot 18c on the hottest cores but one core didn't drop that much only 3c i re-applied tim it's still the same, maybe i'm doing something wrong with applying tim ? the IHS slides slightly when i put it in the socket but just a little sway to one side could be the reason the difference between the hottest and the coolest core now is so big ? 15c ?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Same as my sister's birthday. She gets to hit 50 this year.


Stop counting at 40, trust me, no good comes from thinking or realizing you are over 40.

OT, but I told my wife I was done with these two builds since she is sick of Micro Center by now. Guess I will skip telling her the part where I just ordered everything to expand my H220 to cool my 690. Didn't realize how much I had spent on water cooling until I added it up - and this is just for a really basic setup.

Just realized I have over 1k posts, in two and half months, gotta slow down.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I have a 3570k IHS from my delidding attempt that resulted in a 3570k death. I was thinking of making it into a keychain so I'm not totally sure I want to give it away, but I will definetly think about it. Is it affecting your performance?


I think it might be, I double checked the internal TIM for contact before closing it all up and I am getting a 11C variation between Core0 and Core1, I think the dimpled(raised) metal on the edges are creating a pocket in between the IHS and my cooler.

Also, I don't know if you guys knew this, but the IHS has a copper core!

Come to think of it, I could lap the top of the IHS and reapply the TIM, but I have had enough fun for the night, it will have to wait till tomorrow.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> me thinking june is june
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> btw i don't know how to feel with my cpu right now, i delidded it, scratched it but it's working fine like it should with dual channel memory, 4 cores 8 threads , igpu aka all the bells and whistles and what not, should i be happy that i de-lidded it and it's still working or be pissed of that i actually scratched the pcb
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the scratch is tinyyyyyyyyy, could i have been so extremely lucky that the scratch didn't cut any trace or any thing ?


1) Congrats







2.) Count your blessings














3.) We count our blessings as we did not have to read 10k posts about all the bad corporations that didn't make it scratch-proof























...avoiding scratches and gouges are a good thing, but if they happen, it is not necessarily the end (though again, better to avoid them). I have seen one Ivy that had two scratches and a deep gouge (!)...if you would have dropped your tear on it, the gouge would have collected all the liquids in a little lake - yet when the owner's dad brought it to me to check out, IT STILL WORKED right away in one of my regular boards







...all of it, dual channel IMC, iGPU...I told him what I have been posting here since early February, that is just put some MX4 (or 2) on the bad spots, especially as they tend to be where the IHS would be very close to it...just insulate it.

Obviously, it all depends whether lanes where cut or not...and on a related matter, there are folks like the person above who have written off their delidded chip even though they should not have...delidding can change the mounting pressure of blocks just a bit...and when several circumstances conspire, this will also change the alignment / depth of the the pins a bit.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 1) Congrats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2.) Count your blessings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 3.) We count our blessings as we did not have to read 10k posts about all the bad corporations that didn't make it scratch-proof
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...avoiding scratches and gouges are a good thing, but if they happen, it is not necessarily the end (though again, better to avoid them). I have seen one Ivy that had two scratches and a deep gouge (!)...if you would have dropped your tear on it, the gouge would have collected all the liquids in a little lake - yet when the owner's dad brought it to me to check out, IT STILL WORKED right away in one of my regular boards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...all of it, dual channel IMC, iGPU...I told him what I have been posting here since early February, that is just put some MX4 (or 2) on the bad spots, especially as they tend to be where the IHS would be very close to it...just insulate it.
> 
> Obviously, it all depends whether lanes where cut or not...and on a related matter, there are folks like the person above who have written off their delidded chip even though they should not have...delidding can change the mounting pressure of blocks just a bit...and when several circumstances conspire, this will also change the alignment / depth of the the pins a bit.


that guy's dad brought that chip to you after de-lidding it to check it out ?

u known to be a computer guy in your area ?

also you sure that if i put mx-4 on the scratched area the paste will get trapped in the nick and act as an insulator ? won't the mx-4 just flow away of the nick when i put the IHS back on ?


----------



## jdm317

OCN name: jdm317
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: Shin Etsu G751 for now. (Coollaboratory Liquid Metal Pro on its way)
ihs-TIM: NO IHS
Mhz gained: 400mhz
OC after delid: 5.0ghz max.
Temp drops: 10-12°C average

Running 4.8ghz 24/7 at 68°C. Hopefully it will get better with the LMP.


The tiny copper shavings came off the IHS.







No scratches whatsoever on PCB.

I haven't had a lot of time to overclock since I delidded. Will update if anything changes.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Stop counting at 40, trust me, no good comes from thinking or realizing you are over 40.
> 
> OT, but I told my wife I was done with these two builds since she is sick of Micro Center by now. Guess I will skip telling her the part where I just ordered everything to expand my H220 to cool my 690. Didn't realize how much I had spent on water cooling until I added it up - and this is just for a really basic setup.
> 
> Just realized I have over 1k posts, in two and half months, gotta slow down.


hehe!
But check the amount of posts I've gotten too


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> OCN name: jdm317
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Shin Etsu G751 for now. (Coollaboratory Liquid Metal Pro on its way)
> ihs-TIM: NO IHS
> Mhz gained: 400mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0ghz max.
> Temp drops: 10-12°C average
> 
> Running 4.8ghz 24/7 at 68°C. Hopefully it will get better with the LMP.
> 
> 
> The tiny copper shavings came off the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No scratches whatsoever on PCB.


Nice! good job! what voltage are you using for 4.8Ghz?

BTW I got an email from cool labs today and they said they sent my CLU replacement out on Friday. No questions asked. Awesome company!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> that guy's dad brought that chip to you after de-lidding it to check it out ?
> 
> u known to be a computer guy in your area ?


...I run a software company for the past 15 years...and it was the son of our in-house legal counsel who had done 'the deed' after seeing some YouTube on it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> OCN name: jdm317
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Shin Etsu G751 for now. (Coollaboratory Liquid Metal Pro on its way)
> ihs-TIM: NO IHS
> Mhz gained: 400mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0ghz max.
> Temp drops: 10-12°C average
> 
> Running 4.8ghz 24/7 at 68°C. Hopefully it will get better with the LMP.
> 
> 
> The tiny copper shavings came off the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No scratches whatsoever on PCB.
> 
> I haven't had a lot of time to overclock since I delidded. Will update if anything changes.


Notwithstanding your order of Coollaboratory Pro, I hear very good things about 'Shin Etsu' pastes (unless I am confusing the name). I believe NVidia uses it on its top-end components...would be great to see your temp drop results w/ Coollaboratory Pro vs Shin Etsu G751


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> but come to think of it perfect is something it wasn't even before the de-lid because 85c for just a 4.4 GHz oc was hardly a perfection don't you agree ?


This is true. I have good coolers so I didn't actually need to delid, but I had extra chips so just did it for fun.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> if it is 15% ipc + soldered IHS, then it will be worth it i guess !


If it's new I always have to try it anyway.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Stop counting at 40, trust me, no good comes from thinking or realizing you are over 40.
> 
> OT, but I told my wife I was done with these two builds since she is sick of Micro Center by now. Guess I will skip telling her the part where I just ordered everything to expand my H220 to cool my 690. Didn't realize how much I had spent on water cooling until I added it up - and this is just for a really basic setup.
> 
> Just realized I have over 1k posts, in two and half months, gotta slow down.


I did pretty much stop counting at 40, b-days aren't as fun as they used to be. Waiting for 16 to drive, & 18 to drink seemed to take forever, now the bdays come faster every year.

Watercooling does add up, it's nice & handy but doesn't come cheap. I spent less on my single stage phase than I did on a cheap loop....


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I run a software company for the past 15 years...and it was the son of our in-house legal counsel who had done 'the deed' after seeing some YouTube on it


also you sure that if i put mx-4 on the scratched area the paste will get trapped in the nick and act as an insulator ? won't the mx-4 just flow away of the nick when i put the IHS back on ?

what i did to prevent the ihs from shorting the cpu is i've painted one side of the IHS (that will fall on the scratch) with a thin layer of clear nail polish, this is how i did it.....

http://www.imagebam.com/image/4c2231244068145

this makes the IHS just slightly elevated from this side, could this be the reason why the hottest core now is over 10c hotter than the coldest core ?

do you recommend taking it off cleaning that nail paint and use your method of putting mx-4 on the scratched area as a better solution ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> also you sure that if i put mx-4 on the scratched area the paste will get trapped in the nick and act as an insulator ? won't the mx-4 just flow away of the nick when i put the IHS back on ?
> 
> what i did to prevent the ihs from shorting the cpu is i've painted one side of the IHS (that will fall on the scratch) with a thin layer of clear nail polish, this is how i did it.....
> 
> http://www.imagebam.com/image/aa3be3244067835
> 
> this makes the IHS just slightly elevated from this side, could this be the reason why the hottest core now is over 10c hotter than the coldest core ?


...hard to say from just a small pic, but it is possible...MX4 does not seem to run out but harden just a tiny bit (don't use too much!) when exposed to air, and heat cycles...on my own Ivy 3770K, it CAME from the factory with a slightly crooked IHS, and the temp differences between cores improved to about 7-8C hottest to coolest under load once I straightened it out following delid. You can put a dab of MX4 over the nail polish - but also on the 4 opposing ends of the IHS (not all the way around) to get some symmetry back, re cores...but again, very hard to say from just a pic


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I'm thinking of buying this case in two weeks. I definetly need to upgrade on the parts of rig that I cheaped out on when building it (case / mobo). I think this would be a great upgrade since I currently am using a CM HAF 912 and I'm considering water cooling. The thing that sucks is that I own two 7950's in crossfire and they are non-reference pcb's so there is no chance of watercooling them. Don't get me wrong, I love them, but when I water cool, I want to water cool EVERYTHING.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146096


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...hard to say from just a small pic, but it is possible...MX4 does not seem to run out but harden just a tiny bit when exposed to air, and heat cycles...on my own Ivy 3770K, it CAME from the factory with a slightly crooked IHS, and the temp differences between cores improved to about 7-8C hottest to coolest under load once I straightened it out following delid. You can put a dab of MX4 over the nail polish - but also on the 4 opposing ends of the IHS (not all the way around) to get some symmetry back, re cores...but again, very hard to say from just a pic


can you see the side with the nail paint on it ? i've put another pic circling the side


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> OCN name: jdm317
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Shin Etsu G751 for now. (Coollaboratory Liquid Metal Pro on its way)
> ihs-TIM: NO IHS
> Mhz gained: 400mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0ghz max.
> Temp drops: 10-12°C average
> 
> Running 4.8ghz 24/7 at 68°C. Hopefully it will get better with the LMP.
> 
> 
> The tiny copper shavings came off the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No scratches whatsoever on PCB.
> 
> I haven't had a lot of time to overclock since I delidded. Will update if anything changes.


You're In! 







nicely done sir! Slap the sig on, you've earned it!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nicely done sir! Slap the sig on, you've earned it!


is my scratched but 100% working chip worthy of the sig captain ? lol


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> this makes the IHS just slightly elevated from this side, could this be the reason why the hottest core now is over 10c hotter than the coldest core ?


I have experimented with my two delidded chips and found it is very easy to misalign the IHS or have failed to put the exact amount of ultra/pro on the die. First thing I look for its variation in max core temps. Just did a 24 hour Prime95 run at 5.0, 1.41v posted in the stable club.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






Temps were 73, 77, 74, 73. If you are getting 10c difference after delidding then I believe you have some room to experiment to try to get an optimal setup.
(Also did a 24 hour XTU run since some crazy nut who misinterprets posts made by newbs suggested it.







Temps were noticeably lower during that run though.)


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I have experimented with my two delidded chips and found it is very easy to misalign the IHS or have failed to put the exact amount of ultra/pro on the die. First thing I look for its variation in max core temps. Just did a 24 hour Prime95 run at 5.0, 1.41v posted in the stable club.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps were 73, 77, 74, 73. If you are getting 10c difference after delidding then I believe you have some room to experiment to try to get an optimal setup.
> (Also did a 24 hour XTU run since some crazy nut who misinterprets posts made by newbs suggested it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps were noticeably lower during that run though.)


hmmm so what if i ditch the IHS all together and go for direct die, what are the odds ?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> hmmm so what if i ditch the IHS all together and go for direct die, what are the odds ?


A few here have tried with some success, they can answer better than I. Many others have commented that it is not worth the risk. My simple advice is do what I did, take a few hours and try a bunch of times to see if you can get things better. Just enough TIM in the right place, the IHS sitting just right when clamped down, and the cooler installation in the best configuration you can find.

When I had my H100i the best by far was the block upside down and one side tightened before the other - it shouldn't be best like that, but it was the best fit for my particular IHS. If you think something you did to the IHS is making it lopsided, you need to test it to know. Look at the TIM fingerprint and interpret it, get some pressure paper, or lay the rig down so you can test if the IHS is level and flat while clamped down - it may take removing the mobo to see that though.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> is my scratched but 100% working chip worthy of the sig captain ? lol


did you submit it? if you did and I missed it linky it and I'll get ya.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> hmmm so what if i ditch the IHS all together and go for direct die, what are the odds ?


You may have to remove your CPU socket latch. On my AsRock board it sits just above the height of the DIE. If your heatsink or H20 block are to wide it wont make contact, and you will need to remove it or mod it.

edit: Just know that the only thing that will hold down the CPU at this point is the cooling block itself. You could find a way, I have not tried anything yet, other than trying not to forget its not latched.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Nice! good job! what voltage are you using for 4.8Ghz?


Pretty high, 1.39v, so far 3 hrs prime stable. It only takes 1.21v for 4.6ghz, its quite the jump. Might be missing something, still learning the chip.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Pretty high, 1.39v, so far 3 hrs prime stable. It only takes 1.21v for 4.6ghz, its quite the jump. Might be missing something, still learning the chip.


That sounds good to me. For 4.8Ghz my chip takes somewhere around 1.51v to be semi-stable. That is DMM voltage. CPU-z says it is 1.39v, but it sucks and it lies to me.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That sounds good to me. For 4.8Ghz my chip takes somewhere around 1.51v to be semi-stable. That is DMM voltage. CPU-z says it is 1.39v, but it sucks and it lies to me.


I have the same board, I thought I had a golden chip before I bought a DMM...Now I realize I have a slightly better than average chip and a crap board!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have the same board, I thought I had a golden chip before I bought a DMM...Now I realize I have a slightly better than average chip and a crap board!


Yea man it is a total bummer.

So for my next question..... why is it that all of the knowledged people here just "happen" to have 5Ghz chips????? Me thinks you guys have some secret dead poets society where you hand out the good batch numbers. Yea! Thats right! I know about your little secret!!!!!

..............sorry. I have to be at work in 4 hours and I can't sleep for the life of me. Driving me nuts. I closed and got out 3 hours ago and now I have to open in a foot of snow in 4 hours. Brilliant!!


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That sounds good to me. For 4.8Ghz my chip takes somewhere around 1.51v to be semi-stable. That is DMM voltage. CPU-z says it is 1.39v, but it sucks and it lies to me.


I guess the temps are making me timid. I never had heat issues with my 2500k under water even at its max of 5.3ghz and 1.55v, no matter what It wouldnt boot at 5.4 even with over 1.6v and single digit temps(window mod). I think it would have eventually done it, I just wasnt willing to push the voltage any higher. My Coollab pro just shipped, hopefully it will be here before the weekend and I can get the temps down where they should be.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> Notwithstanding your order of Coollaboratory Pro, I hear very good things about 'Shin Etsu' pastes (unless I am confusing the name). I believe NVidia uses it on its top-end components...would be great to see your temp drop results w/ Coollaboratory Pro vs Shin Etsu G751


Its all I use anymore for pretty much everything, I have no complaints. Anxious to see what the Coollaboratory Pro gives me, hopefully something closer to Sandy temps.

edit: Ok CPU never hit single digits, thats idle temps. Stayed around 30-35°C.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx* View Post
> 
> hmmm so what if i ditch the IHS all together and go for direct die, what are the odds ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> You may have to remove your CPU socket latch. On my AsRock board it sits just above the height of the DIE. If your heatsink or H20 block are to wide it wont make contact, and you will need to remove it or mod it.
> 
> edit: Just know that the only thing that will hold down the CPU at this point is the cooling block itself. You could find a way, I have not tried anything yet, other than trying not to forget its not latched.


...one of the first things I would do in a situation where I was not sure about the IHS mount to the water-block is to use pressure paper...there have been several good posts about that here, including one just a few days ago...pressure paper mounted between the IHS and water block will show you where the 'weak contact spots' are.

...normally, to run 'direct die' (no IHS) is a lot trickier. First, per above, you likely have to remove the socket latch mechanism (with an alternative described below), and then you have to be REAL careful as to a.) get a perfect alignment to your cooling block with just the right amount of thermal compound, and b.) experiment with the lock-down pressure of the block in order to get perfect pin contact - since eliminating the IHS has now changed the lock down parameters (depth etc)

There is another way others and I also have posted about: That is getting your (water-) block machined around the outside edges so that it just fits and protrudes inside the socket latch mechanism by the amount you lost when you left the IHS off...starting with pressure paper sounds far more reasonable to me...good luck


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> I guess the temps are making me timid. I never had heat issues with my 2500k under water even at its max of 5.3ghz and 1.55v, no matter what It wouldnt boot at 5.4 even with over 1.6v and single digit temps(window mod). I think it would have eventually done it, I just wasnt willing to push the voltage any higher. My Coollab pro just shipped, hopefully it will be here before the weekend and I can get the temps down where they should be.
> Its all I use anymore for pretty much everything, I have no complaints. Anxious to see what the Coollaboratory Pro gives me, hopefully something closer to Sandy temps.
> 
> edit: Ok CPU never hit single digits, thats idle temps. Stayed around 30-35°C.


Just wondering, why did you choose pro over ultra?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea man it is a total bummer.
> 
> So for my next question..... why is it that all of the knowledged people here just "happen" to have 5Ghz chips????? Me thinks you guys have some secret dead poets society where you hand out the good batch numbers. Yea! Thats right! I know about your little secret!!!!!
> 
> ..............sorry. I have to be at work in 4 hours and I can't sleep for the life of me. Driving me nuts. I closed and got out 3 hours ago and now I have to open in a foot of snow in 4 hours. Brilliant!!


I will have to show you the secret microcenter handshake.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Just wondering, why did you choose pro over ultra?


Honestly I don't have a "good" reason. I find myself wondering the same thing. I opted to go with frozenCPU this time around instead of sidewinder. Dont get me wrong, i love sidewinder, but ive had 2 shipping oopsies on my last couple of orders with them. Both pertaining to low stock and me ending up getting the short straw and having to wait. FrozenCPU only had a couple of the Ultra left in stock on friday so I just bought the Pro to avoid any problems. Chalk it up to impatience I guess, because now they have 87 in stock.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Just wondering, why did you choose pro over ultra?
> 
> 
> 
> Honestly I don't have a "good" reason. I find myself wondering the same thing. I opted to go with frozenCPU this time around instead of sidewinder. Dont get me wrong, i love sidewinder, but ive had 2 shipping oopsies on my last couple of orders with them. Both pertaining to low stock and me ending up getting the short straw and having to wait. FrozenCPU only had a couple of the Ultra left in stock on friday so I just bought the Pro to avoid any problems. Chalk it up to impatience I guess, because now they have 87 in stock.
Click to expand...

I have heard the Pro is easier to apply?

The ultra has a tenancy to not want to stick to anything. >:[

I will trying pro next time, I just ran out of ULTRA using it on my freshly delidded GTX 470 ( the Die is HUUUGHE ).


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I have heard the Pro is easier to apply?
> 
> The ultra has a tenancy to not want to stick to anything. >:[
> 
> I will trying pro next time, I just ran out of ULTRA using it on my freshly delidded GTX 470 ( the Die is HUUUGHE ).


That's kind of what I assumed. The pro seems to have a more traditional AS5 or Shin Etsu application process, and I agree the Ultra even looks like its runny, kind of like graphene lubricant. Im not dissing it in any way, im sure I will give it a try eventually. It clearly does the job.

edit: That die IS huge!


----------



## Hokies83

Ive used both and found Pro More easy to spread and both Leaveing residue when u want to clean it off.

Fine for the Die but i would not use it on any Fancy water blocks.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive used both and found Pro More easy to spread and both Leaveing residue when u want to clean it off.
> 
> Fine for the Die but i would not use it on any Fancy water blocks.


Yeah, I have had to basically lap my Supremacy every time I reseat... Pretty annoying.

Ive been pushing some volts, so the CLU has been as hard to get off as solder with a fingernail.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive used both and found Pro More easy to spread and both Leaveing residue when u want to clean it off.
> 
> Fine for the Die but i would not use it on any Fancy water blocks.


Keeping this in mind for sure. Is it impossible to remove or just difficult?


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Keeping this in mind for sure. Is it impossible to remove or just difficult?


That thin line between difficult and impossible, is CLU.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Yeah, I have had to basically lap my Supremacy every time I reseat... Pretty annoying.
> 
> Ive been pushing some volts, so the CLU has been as hard to get off as solder with a fingernail.


Wow that is pretty harsh.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> That thin line between difficult and impossible, is CLU.


Nicely put.


----------



## Joa3d43

..*.Something new to play with* - once you have revved up your delidded CPU









...have been running in a lot of HWBot international GPU competitions, and frankly, after the 20th run of a 'usual suspect' benchmarks, it can get a trifle boring (at least until the results page







)...but there is a new GPU and CPU test in beta now which I find quite, ahem, "Different" and a touch bizarre in the positive sort of way





















- here is a HD video of how the actual test looks like...do yourself a favour and check it out !


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..*.Something new to play with* - once you have revved up your delidded CPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...have been running in a lot of HWBot international GPU competitions, and frankly, after the 20th run of a 'usual suspect' benchmarks, it can get a trifle boring (at least until the results page
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )...but there is a new GPU and CPU test in beta now which I find quite, ahem, "Different" and a touch bizarre in the positive sort of way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - here is a HD video of how the actual test looks like...do yourself a favour and check it out !


Was about to finally lay down and close my eyes, and you share this. Hahaha. This is great, I loved it. Sooo much going on.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Was about to finally lay down and close my eyes, and you share this. Hahaha. This is great, I loved it. Sooo much going on.


...it is, well, 'out there'...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..*.Something new to play with* - once you have revved up your delidded CPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...have been running in a lot of HWBot international GPU competitions, and frankly, after the 20th run of a 'usual suspect' benchmarks, it can get a trifle boring (at least until the results page
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )...but there is a new GPU and CPU test in beta now which I find quite, ahem, "Different" and a touch bizarre in the positive sort of way
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - here is a HD video of how the actual test looks like...do yourself a favour and check it out !


I saw this thing around 4 months ago


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I saw this thing around 4 months ago


...yes, but it is now in 'final beta' - so the 1/2 gig download may be worth it now, not to mention the $-upgrade which I do have re. way more detail, difficulty and other stuff...anyways, after watching 3d01 to 3d13 way too many times over the last few weeks, Catzilla is refreshing


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Keeping this in mind for sure. Is it impossible to remove or just difficult?


Neither, you just gotta know what you're doing and how to do it. I've delidded two chips, both with success.


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Neither, you just gotta know what you're doing and how to do it. I've delidded two chips, both with success.


He wasn't talking about the IHS









From what I've read CLU and CLP tend to etch into the Aluminium / Copper due to a chemical reaction. Although this isn't necessarily bad for the temps, it does kinda ruin the IHS / cooler you put on top of it, if you reseat. Which makes me wonder if I'll actually ever use CLU or CLP over AS5, which doesn't etch.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> He wasn't talking about the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From what I've read CLU and CLP tend to etch into the Aluminium / Copper due to a chemical reaction. Although this isn't necessarily bad for the temps, it does kinda ruin the IHS / cooler you put on top of it, if you reseat. Which makes me wonder if I'll actually ever use CLU or CLP over AS5, which doesn't etch.


Aluminium yes,
Copper nope..

wouldnt be a good thing if liquid pro/ultra would eat copper ...lol,
no use to bring a product on the market when almost all surfaces you use it on are made of copper..


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> He wasn't talking about the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From what I've read CLU and CLP tend to etch into the Aluminium / Copper due to a chemical reaction. Although this isn't necessarily bad for the temps, it does kinda ruin the IHS / cooler you put on top of it, if you reseat. Which makes me wonder if I'll actually ever use CLU or CLP over AS5, which doesn't etch.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Aluminium yes,
> Copper nope..
> 
> wouldnt be a good thing if liquid pro/ultra would eat copper ...lol,
> no use to bring a product on the market when almost all surfaces you use it on are made of copper..
Click to expand...

It sure does stick, almost seems like is solders itself to the surfaces after a bit of heat gets pumped through it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> It sure does stick, almost seems like is solders itself to the surfaces after a bit of heat gets pumped through it.


it does stick after a while, but upto a month or maybe a few it will stay liquid,
like any other tim it hardens a bit over time..
but theres a difference between that and eating copper,
"It doesnt bond, more like the fact the gallium in CLP creates an alloy with Aluminum and breaks down the aluminum by destroying the lattice structures in the Al, gallium will also do this with other metals, but copper and nickel are not one of them."
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?162440-Coollabs-Liquid-Pro-Investigated!-Easiest-possible-way-to-remove-included.-56k-warnin

this is what gallium does to Alu,


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it does stick after a while, but upto a month or maybe a few it will stay liquid,
> like any other tim it hardens a bit over time..
> but theres a difference between that and eating copper,
> "It doesnt bond, more like the fact the gallium in CLP creates an alloy with Aluminum and breaks down the aluminum by destroying the lattice structures in the Al, gallium will also do this with other metals, but copper and nickel are not one of them."
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?162440-Coollabs-Liquid-Pro-Investigated!-Easiest-possible-way-to-remove-included.-56k-warnin
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


...hey, VonDutch is back







- and very right he is, never mind that CL products give a warning right on the package about aluminum...I was going to do my Direct CU ii cards with CL U, but in the end did not because there was a tiny bit if aluminum visible on the die contact area:


----------



## Icydead

Guys is it possible that chip just wont last higher voltages ? I can currently go [email protected] and it goes fine for 29 hours in prime but then one worker fails. So I logically set 1.25V and one would think it will be completely stable, but to my surprise, prime itself crash after 8 hours or so. So I might end up with [email protected] again.. But it doesnt make any sense, as I see ppl here having their chips on 1.4V etc., and 1.25V isnt really high


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys is it possible that chip just wont last higher voltages ? I can currently go [email protected] and it goes fine for 29 hours in prime but then one worker fails. So I logically set 1.25V and one would think it will be completely stable, but to my surprise, prime itself crash after 8 hours or so. So I might end up with [email protected] again.. But it doesnt make any sense, as I see ppl here having their chips on 1.4V etc., and 1.25V isnt really high


Did you catch my post on this matter. I posted several days ago.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> Did you catch my post on this matter. I posted several days ago.


Yes I did, but we were talking about 1.4V. It seems impossible to me that chip could not stand 1.25V, that would be just ridiculous.

PS: SmallFFT test on 1.4V is quite fine, but just blend BSOD immediately. Seems to me as something with RAM, not the chip


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys is it possible that chip just wont last higher voltages ? I can currently go [email protected] and it goes fine for 29 hours in prime but then one worker fails. So I logically set 1.25V and one would think it will be completely stable, but to my surprise, prime itself crash after 8 hours or so. So I might end up with [email protected] again.. But it doesnt make any sense, as I see ppl here having their chips on 1.4V etc., and 1.25V isnt really high


ivy is also about working the vcore very carefully,
made me think about something sin0822 said in his guide, how ivy behaves under ln2 etc..
i wouldnt go from 1.235 to 1.25 in one step tho, just stick to the 0.005V increments , and first try 1.240, then1.245...and then 1.25V,
not sure what else there could be wrong with your vcore up, and getting worse results..

Under LN2/DICE: Temperature is more important for high clocks than voltage is when it comes to Ivy Bridge. Also under LN2 higher vcore might not yield a higher clock, as it will add more heat which can have an opposite effect. *So while at 1.84v I might do 6.6 GHz if I increase to 1.86 I can only do 6.55, but if I lower the vcore to 1.83v I can still only do 6.55,* it is all about working the volts very carefully. I should take a second and note that Ivy Bridge is an extremely tough CPU, it is very hard to kill, however you can kill it if you go above 1.6v on air and ~2.0v on LN2. Ivy Bridge also seems to be more resilient to degradation than Sandy Bridge was, however the heat produced by the CPU can cause degradations when above what Intel recommends.

the way i do my oc's, is find my stable vcore for any oc, then change to offset, see if it is stable,
then i just at 0.005 or 0.010V, and let it run like that, never had problems with it doing it that way,
so i think its strange you cant/couldnt at more vcore


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ivy is also about working the vcore very carefully,
> made me think about something sin0822 said in his guide, how ivy behaves under ln2 etc..
> i wouldnt go from 1.235 to 1.25 in one step tho, just stick to the 0.005V increments , and first try 1.240, then1.245...and then 1.25V,
> not sure what else there could be wrong with your vcore up, and getting worse results..
> 
> Under LN2/DICE: Temperature is more important for high clocks than voltage is when it comes to Ivy Bridge. Also under LN2 higher vcore might not yield a higher clock, as it will add more heat which can have an opposite effect. *So while at 1.84v I might do 6.6 GHz if I increase to 1.86 I can only do 6.55, but if I lower the vcore to 1.83v I can still only do 6.55,* it is all about working the volts very carefully. I should take a second and note that Ivy Bridge is an extremely tough CPU, it is very hard to kill, however you can kill it if you go above 1.6v on air and ~2.0v on LN2. Ivy Bridge also seems to be more resilient to degradation than Sandy Bridge was, however the heat produced by the CPU can cause degradations when above what Intel recommends.


Well, 1.235V failed after 29 hours. 1.245V gave whea code 19 after 8-9 hours, and with 1.250V prime just crashed after 8 hours. I dont remember if I tried 1.2400V though, but I think I did.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> ivy is also about working the vcore very carefully,
> made me think about something sin0822 said in his guide, how ivy behaves under ln2 etc..
> i wouldnt go from 1.235 to 1.25 in one step tho, just stick to the 0.005V increments , and first try 1.240, then1.245...and then 1.25V,
> not sure what else there could be wrong with your vcore up, and getting worse results..
> 
> Under LN2/DICE: Temperature is more important for high clocks than voltage is when it comes to Ivy Bridge. Also under LN2 higher vcore might not yield a higher clock, as it will add more heat which can have an opposite effect. *So while at 1.84v I might do 6.6 GHz if I increase to 1.86 I can only do 6.55, but if I lower the vcore to 1.83v I can still only do 6.55,* it is all about working the volts very carefully. I should take a second and note that Ivy Bridge is an extremely tough CPU, it is very hard to kill, however you can kill it if you go above 1.6v on air and ~2.0v on LN2. Ivy Bridge also seems to be more resilient to degradation than Sandy Bridge was, however the heat produced by the CPU can cause degradations when above what Intel recommends.
> 
> the way i do my oc's, is find me stable vcore for any oc, then change to offset, see if it is stable,
> then i just at 0.005 or 0.010V, and let it run like that, never had problems with it doing it that way,
> so i think its strange you cant/couldnt at more vcore


Hi Von Dutch!


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Well, 1.235V failed after 29 hours. 1.245V gave whea code 19 after 8-9 hours, and with 1.250V prime just crashed after 8 hours. I dont remember if I tried 1.2400V though, but I think I did.


it is very strange, thats for sure,
if i look at the vcores you used, i would almost say 1.230V vcore is the one you need ..lol

i would fiddle some more with the 1.235V vcore you had, it ran prime very long after all,
29H is very stable already see, you prolly wont see a crash with normal daily usage (1-2 a year?),

if data is very very important to you, i would surely go on looking for stability,
if your a normal daily user, like me playing games, browse a bit online etc, it isnt a big deal if it would crash sometimes,
windows on its own can do that too...lol..

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> ...*hey, VonDutch is back
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * - and very right he is, never mind that CL products give a warning right on the package about aluminum...I was going to do my Direct CU ii cards with CL U, but in the end did not because there was a tiny bit if aluminum visible on the die contact area:


answering PM's, couldnt resist to answer on some posts tho ...haha..








you sure thats Alu and not the heatpipes (nickel plated) that are flattened between the copper plate?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hi Von Dutch!


Hiya stickg1


----------



## alancsalt

Ah, Von Dutch, remember Windows 98 days....

Q: How do you crash a Windows computer?
A: Turn it on...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Ah, Von Dutch, remember Windows 98 days....
> 
> Q: How do you crash a Windows computer?
> A: Turn it on...


LOL


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *VonDutch* wrote...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...hey, VonDutch is back
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - and very right he is, never mind that CL products give a warning right on the package about aluminum...I was going to do my Direct CU ii cards with CL U, but in the end did not because there was a tiny bit if aluminum visible on the die contact area:


Quote:


> answering PM's, couldnt resist to answer on some posts tho ...haha..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you sure thats Alu and not the heatpipes (nickel plated) that are flattened between the copper plate?


...I wish it would be so, but no







, it is part of the aluminum fin assembly (for weight) merged with the flattened nickel-plated copper pipes....

... the video setup in this run, while beating even some tri-sli Titans and currently in 5th overall here







would have been even better without the cards throttling a bit, per top right corner info in the pic below.

I'm actually considering whether to paint a small thin MX4 'stripe' on the alu bits as 'protection', and then adding CL-U to the die...I'll try a bit of CL-U on a small separate piece of aluminum, both with and without MX4 and see what happens after a week or so









Any ideas you can come up with on this are welcome







as you can tell, air-cooled Quad-SLI is a major 'space-limited' affair, though I mostly run tri-SLI for daily fun


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Ah, Von Dutch, remember Windows 98 days....
> 
> Q: How do you crash a Windows computer?
> A: Turn it on...










...not so funny back then though, as far as I recall - when the thing would crash in the most inopportune moments and take all your open files / work with it ...I still have several Win98 / SE and even Win 95 disks...just as a reminder how bad things could get...loaded 'bits' of them up the other day on a 12GB USB stick - boots right up to DOS and even SafeMode (kind of...)


----------



## justanoldman

Since the subject of CLU and GPUs was brought up I have a question.
The EK water block I ordered for my 690 says that you should use Gelid GC-Extreme on the two dies and PLX bridge on the card. I have never used GC-Extreme before, should I just use that like they recommend or just use some of my CLU when I put on the water block?


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Since the subject of CLU and GPUs was brought up I have a question.
> The EK water block I ordered for my 690 says that you should use Gelid GC-Extreme on the two dies and PLX bridge on the card. I have never used GC-Extreme before, should I just use that like they recommend or just use some of my CLU when I put on the water block?


GC-Extreme is good but I find it VERY HARD to get in there properly, in like 10 attempts I managed to seat it properly once...

You need one full tube to get one attempt right >.<

That is why I just prefer CLU on everything these days.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> He wasn't talking about the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From what I've read CLU and CLP tend to etch into the Aluminium / Copper due to a chemical reaction. Although this isn't necessarily bad for the temps, it does kinda ruin the IHS / cooler you put on top of it, if you reseat. Which makes me wonder if I'll actually ever use CLU or CLP over AS5, which doesn't etch.


I'm not sure if someone would wanna see the IHS from the inside.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> it is very strange, thats for sure,
> if i look at the vcores you used, i would almost say 1.230V vcore is the one you need ..lol
> 
> i would fiddle some more with the 1.235V vcore you had


Well I turned off the xmp profile, set the ram speed and voltage manually and lelt all the timings on auto except the main ones and now Im going up from 1.2V with 0.005V increments. Currently at 1.22V


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> I'm not sure if someone would wanna see the IHS from the inside.


Looks aren't the point really, the point is that the etching could potentially increase thermal resistance.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I have a 3570k IHS from my delidding attempt that resulted in a 3570k death. I was thinking of making it into a keychain so I'm not totally sure I want to give it away, but I will definetly think about it. Is it affecting your performance?


Thanks for considering it, but I wont need it. I went ahead and lapped the IHS to an almost mirror finish. Also lapped my heatsink at the same time, making sure that my lap marks travel the same direction when seated. I got the drop I was looking for. I have only done preliminary testing but all cores are showing max temp within 5C. 4.7ghz, 1.21VCore(read by DMM), 65C max. This was just a quick test with P95, letting it run all the way through the 8kk fft. I am pretty sure I will be able to stabilize 5.0 now and I still haven't received my CLP.

I wonder if lapping the underside of the IHS will give any decrease in temps....anybody ever tried?


----------



## Littlejoe

Hey,guys. Thinking of doing a fresh windows 7 install as it may be corrupted. After the install, can I apply a back up or would that bring the corruption back?


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Thanks for considering it, but I wont need it. I went ahead and lapped the IHS to an almost mirror finish. Also lapped my heatsink at the same time, making sure that my lap marks travel the same direction when seated. I got the drop I was looking for. I have only done preliminary testing but all cores are showing max temp within 5C. 4.7ghz, 1.21VCore(read by DMM), 65C max. This was just a quick test with P95, letting it run all the way through the 8kk fft. I am pretty sure I will be able to stabilize 5.0 now and I still haven't received my CLP.
> 
> I wonder if lapping the underside of the IHS will give any decrease in temps....anybody ever tried?


Yep, I did. 2°C drop. However, since I had to lap the underside while keeping it as flat as possible, I had to get rid of the outer edge that elevates the IHS from the die. So when you reseat it, be warned, you can crush the die. What I did to fix this was simple. I lapped my IHS until it felt like a snug fit but not bone crushing.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> Hey,guys. Thinking of doing a fresh windows 7 install as it may be corrupted. After the install, can I apply a back up or would that bring the corruption back?


If you are confident that it is corrupt, and something easier won't help, then a fresh install with no loading of previous backups or settings is the safe way to go. Reinstalling windows is easy, but I am no fan of having to install every program again. I think that is the only way to go if you want to be sure you are not reintroducing the problem.

Not sure what the problem is, but you could try some easy stuff like a system restore, or test it and see if loading a backup works or not. You can always to do a full, fresh install if nothing else works.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So remember I was saying that I wanted to get into water cooling, but I couldn't because of my 7950's? Well my Sapphire just started shooting aritfacts while in crossfire with my MSI TFIII and I troubleshooted and came to the conclusion that it was defective. Called newegg and I'm getting a refund. Now I just have to get enough rep to be able to sell my 2 month old MSI TFIII 7950 on here for like $200 bucks and I can get a pair of 7970's. Anyone want to buy a TFIII? It overclocks to 1200/1600 on air and never gets over 65c. Its a great card, I just want to upgrade and have optional room for watercooling.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So remember I was saying that I wanted to get into water cooling, but I couldn't because of my 7950's? Well my Sapphire just started shooting aritfacts while in crossfire with my MSI TFIII and I troubleshooted and came to the conclusion that it was defective. Called newegg and I'm getting a refund. Now I just have to get enough rep to be able to sell my 2 month old MSI TFIII 7950 on here for like $200 bucks and I can get a pair of 7970's. Anyone want to buy a TFIII? It overclocks to 1200/1600 on air and never gets over 65c. Its a great card, I just want to upgrade and have optional room for watercooling.


7950 PCB?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 7950 PCB?


Yea


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So remember I was saying that I wanted to get into water cooling, but I couldn't because of my 7950's? Well my Sapphire just started shooting aritfacts while in crossfire with my MSI TFIII and I troubleshooted and came to the conclusion that it was defective. Called newegg and I'm getting a refund. Now I just have to get enough rep to be able to sell my 2 month old MSI TFIII 7950 on here for like $200 bucks and I can get a pair of 7970's. Anyone want to buy a TFIII? It overclocks to 1200/1600 on air and never gets over 65c. Its a great card, I just want to upgrade and have optional room for watercooling.


good luck selling it man









get reference 7970 if you can because that's the way if you are gonna go water cooling


----------



## couchasault9001

4.4ghz 86c hottest core before

4.6ghz 62c hottest core after

some before and after goodness. I'm on my third prime95 run. don't want to leave it running when i'm not here. but so far looks like this is stable. Can't seem to get 4.7 and above stable on any voltage however. i ran it all the way up to 1.5v and it actually gets less stable when i get above 1.4v. Its not a temp thing. my fans never even accellerate off idle( they idle up to 65c then ramp quickly.

I didn't take any pics in the process or even read any of the required research stuff. sorry about that. But i did it


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> good luck selling it man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> get reference 7970 if you can because that's the way if you are gonna go water cooling


Yep that is exactly what I'm going to do









I'm looking at the SAPPHIRE 100351SR 7970 right now.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yep that is exactly what I'm going to do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm looking at the SAPPHIRE 100351SR 7970 right now.


good luck !


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea


LoL take the cooler off i need to see the PCB XD those TF cards went back and forth on there PCBs


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL take the cooler off i need to see the PCB XD those TF cards went back and forth on there PCBs


Well it is 6 + 6 pins so doesn't that mean that it isn't reference? Is there anyway to tell if it is reference by the back of the PCB? Or the color? Its in my case and I don't want to take it apart.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well it is 6 + 6 pins so doesn't that mean that it isn't reference? Is there anyway to tell if it is reference by the back of the PCB? Or the color? Its in my case and I don't want to take it apart.


Only way i can tell is the PCB lol. under the cooler.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Really? There are 7970 pcb's that use 6 + 6 pins? So I couldve have a 7970 pcb this whole time? Thats news to me. Well I'm running on 2 hours sleep right now so I'm not going to risk taking it apart, but I'll do it tomorrow for you.


----------



## Hokies83

Ref 7950 PCB looks like this



Ref 7970 PCB looks like this


----------



## jdm317

Came home from work to find 2 packages. My backup Shin Etsu and my CLP.







Kiddos are nuts right now, so ill get around to testing it later tonight.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Came home from work to find 2 packages. My backup Shin Etsu and my CLP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Kiddos are nuts right now, so ill get around to testing it later tonight.*


OMG tell me about it. Came home and there was nothing to cook for them unless I got creative. I did breakfast for dinner and now I got three pancake and syrup loaded children bouncing off the walls. WORST IDEA EVER!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Came home from work to find 2 packages. My backup Shin Etsu and my CLP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kiddos are nuts right now, so ill get around to testing it later tonight.


...sounds like your kids are overclocked, also







- delidded as well ?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds like your kids are overclocked, also
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - delidded as well ?


They run on some quantum light processor... I just cant keep up. They definitely need to be underclocked. *breaks out the voltmeter and solder*

edit: Almost forgot my scalpel.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> OMG tell me about it. Came home and there was nothing to cook for them unless I got creative. I did breakfast for dinner and now I got three pancake and syrup loaded children bouncing off the walls. WORST IDEA EVER!


Lmao!! I feel your pain. I cant even count how many times we have done eggo's for supper. My daughter is banned from syrup!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Lmao!! I feel your pain. I cant even count how many times we have done eggo's for supper. My daughter is banned from syrup!


I was going to get some shut-eye, but now you guys made me hungry...for waffles, with lots of yummy syrup


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> I was going to get some shut-eye, but now you guys made me hungry...for waffles, with lots of yummy syrup


Butter too.... mmmmmmmm. So bad but soooooo gooood


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Butter too.... mmmmmmmm. So bad but soooooo gooood


Grass-fed butter is GOOD for you, don't fall for the "fats are bad for ya" myth.








I eat a LOT of good fats daily and I lost 7kg in a month. Eating 1600kcal a day (I normally ate 2000kcal, but lots of sugar, and crap)
Avocados, butter, milk...all good, all good.


----------



## alancsalt

Delidded food now......


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Delidded food now......


...well, it did need a pinch of (alanc)salt









...where is that post with all the '''different''' things to try on the IHS-to-block TIM, ie mayonnaise, vegetable oil, ketchup etc ?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, it did need a pinch of (alanc)salt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...where is that post with all the '''different''' things to try on the IHS-to-block TIM, ie mayonnaise, vegetable oil, ketchup etc ?


Hmm I have some blue icing, feels just like shin etsu


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I always like to think out of the box...food is a big deal for me xD


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Grass-fed butter is GOOD for you, don't fall for the "fats are bad for ya" myth.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I eat a LOT of good fats daily and I lost 7kg in a month. Eating 1600kcal a day (I normally ate 2000kcal, but lots of sugar, and crap)
> Avocados, butter, milk...all good, all good.


I love avocados.... and butter..


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like to mash the content of the avocado with butter and slap that mix over a nice bread slice with seeds and sea salt. Or use that mixture of avocados+sea salt+butter for salad dressings or whatever









Ok, good news...my chip is at customs, should be here tomorrow or Thursday!!!


----------



## TonicX

over clocked children and delidded food you guys need to sleep. IMHO!


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, it did need a pinch of (alanc)salt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...where is that post with all the '''different''' things to try on the IHS-to-block TIM, ie mayonnaise, vegetable oil, ketchup etc ?


here it is:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermal-Compound-Roundup-February-2012/1490/5


----------



## ivanlabrie

That always brings a smile to my face...xD


----------



## alancsalt

Just don't mistake your TIM for mayonnaise..and put it on the salad..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Just don't mistake your TIM for mayonnaise..and put it on the salad..


'Dad what did you do? This salad tastes like AS5...'


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 'Dad what did you do? This salad tastes like AS5...'


Back up a bit ... how would one know what AS5 tastes like ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 'Dad what did you do? This salad tastes like AS5...'


...that red liquid in my custom loop (almost a liter) looks like strawberry juice...oh wait, it says 'Bloodshed Red'


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Just don't mistake your TIM for mayonnaise..and put it on the salad..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'Dad what did you do? This salad tastes like AS5...'
Click to expand...

i saw what you did there....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I know how tim smells..therefore I can guess the taste more or less accurately xD
We have a guy here who injected Liquid Pro on his finger lol
Now, FtW is eating AS5.
I'll stick to the avocados, thank you.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> i saw what you did there....


...segwaying to / from foods, I suppose I can use one of the 120mm fans from the move of 6 'push / pull' on my 360 / 60 to just 3 'push' to chop carrots...so far on day 1, only a 1 C difference, but the weather has changed and ambient temp delta may be confusing things...will report back when I have better observations....now, let's eat


----------



## ivanlabrie

I can easily chop carrots with my 5300rpm fans...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I can easily chop carrots with my 5300rpm fans...


I await to see the video!


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol, I can't do it now...wait till Thursday. I got carrots in the fridge.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol, I can't do it now...wait till Thursday. I got carrots in the fridge.


Are you using the Deltas? I have 2 Delta fans, I love them but they are way too loud and mine aren't even the 5k RPM ones...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> i saw what you did there....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I know how tim smells..therefore I can guess the taste more or less accurately xD
> We have a guy here who injected Liquid Pro on his finger lol
> Now, FtW is eating AS5.
> I'll stick to the avocados, thank you.


not sure if ivan saw what I did there...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> not sure if ivan saw what I did there...


NOM NOM NOM

I've been eating Salads like crazy lately, so freaking gooooood. FtW ou goin to Mopar place in April?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I can easily chop carrots with my 5300rpm fans...


...these puppies weigh a ton, sound like a Catalina flying boat taking off and are really thick, not to mention hoover up any dust within a five mile radius (from one of our server rooms, with genuine dirt from a construction / reno next door)...I think I can use these for slicing meats


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...these puppies weigh a ton, sound like a Catalina flying boat taking off and are really thick, not to mention hoover up any dust within a five mile radius (from one of our server rooms, with genuine dirt from a construction / reno next door)...I think I can use these for slicing meats


You want these for slicing & dicing. Hold on tight, they can fly


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You want these for slicing & dicing. Hold on tight, they can fly


...I take five







- I think I have seen them on YouTube...put them flat on the table, turn them on and they hover, only held back by the power cables


----------



## ivanlabrie

hahaha...gotta love 120x38mm fans.

Mine are Nidec Beta-V TA450DC. 5300rpm, 220cfm, infinite dba.


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, should I replace my NH-D14 SE2011 fans or just keep them?


----------



## Hokies83

600 cfm...

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12690/fan-ac-33/Fantec_254_x_89mm_Dual_Ball_Bearing_AC_Fan_Kit_w_Grill_-_CAB_706_-_High_Speed_600_CFM.html?tl=g36c435s1109


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol xD

That's just too much Hokies...if it fits a rad it's good. 120mm fans are best for pressure and cfm. Sanyo makes the biggest and baddest ones, 48v beasts. They push close to 300cfm.

These are nice and more efficient, noise to db wise. But insane nonetheless









EDIT: @Swag: If you feel like replacing them and want uber quietness, get BeQuiet! Silent Wings 2 140mm fans. They are quieter than the stock Noctuas and move a tad more air. If you want silence and the best cooling possible then Noctua NF-F12 pwm, or for someting cheaper Gelid Silent 12 pwm or 14 pwm.
If you want to have more power at your disposal Thermalright TY-143 fans are sweet, and orange xD
140mm, efficient, quiet at low rpm and can put out 130cfm at 2500rpm, which is a LOT for a 140mm fan.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 600 cfm...
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/12690/fan-ac-33/Fantec_254_x_89mm_Dual_Ball_Bearing_AC_Fan_Kit_w_Grill_-_CAB_706_-_High_Speed_600_CFM.html?tl=g36c435s1109


Now that is like an accident waiting to happen for me...
I've broken down a rig before & left the psu with the delta plugged in, next time I set up there were other fans on the table, the delta got propped up on the gpu without paying attention.
I reached for it when it tipped back, but not fast enough to prevent full launch. They can really go!


----------



## alancsalt

Scythe Kaze
3000RPM
133 CFM

Delta AFC1212DE-SP02 120x38mm
3900 RPM
148.34 CFM
51 dBA

Nidec C34262-71 Beta V TA450DC
Speed 4050 RPM (Temperature Detecting Variable Speed)
Air Flow: 130 CFM ( Variable)
Noise: 53.5 dBA ( Variable)

The three blade Nidecs would be best for the carrots...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I know how tim smells..therefore I can guess the taste more or less accurately xD
> We have a guy here who injected Liquid Pro on his finger lol
> Now, FtW is eating AS5.
> I'll stick to the avocados, thank you.


Ya it isn't noticable anymore... although http://www.petrastechshop.com/peptpcobi1.html still is when I spilled it on my matress lol.


----------



## King4x4

Pfft Amatures.

I fire up my rig so I can boil some water for my morning coffee









Of course the water comes from INSIDE the rigs loop









"Honey what are you doing?
"Me: Turning off the fans darling for some morning coffee!"


----------



## ivanlabrie

lmao xD


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I know how tim smells..therefore I can guess the taste more or less accurately xD
> We have a guy here who injected Liquid Pro on his finger lol
> Now, FtW is eating AS5.
> I'll stick to the avocados, thank you.


Well not only is AS5 full of protein and fiber, nothing will keep you as cool on a hot summer day.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I honestly LOVE this thread - not only do we get the "job done" with de-lidding and guiding people, but the conversations we have here are golden.
From chopping carrots with fans, to GPU's etc!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I honestly LOVE this thread - not only do we get the "job done" with de-lidding and guiding people, but the conversations we have here are golden.
> From chopping carrots with fans, to GPU's etc!


Definetly! This is my favorite thread on the site. Too bad I missed the edible TIM conversation haha


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Definetly! This is my favorite thread on the site. Too bad I missed the edible TIM conversation haha


haha









In all honesty though, putting mayo on, as a TIM might work, but would that work for a period of time? Or via common sense it will "cook"?

Maybe we need a new youtube series: "It might Overclock, but will it cook?"
When I one day get to 250 rep, and get a OC account, where I can put a personal "motto/title"
It shall be that.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I finally have 4.5Ghz stable haha. I ran it for almost 15 hours and temps didn't go over 65c. Voltage is 1.296v according to the DMM. I'm still glad I delidded even though it is a sucky chip because I would have hit 90c in a run like that before.


So in about two weeks time I'm going to order this case:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146096

and this motherboard:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854

It is definetly going to be nice to have a case that gives my components more room to breath and a motherboard that will make everything run smoother and be able to run all three of my SSD's at 6gb/s. Can't wait!


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I finally have 4.5Ghz stable haha. I ran it for almost 15 hours and temps didn't go over 65c. Voltage is 1.296v according to the DMM. I'm still glad I delidded even though it is a sucky chip because I would have hit 90c in a run like that before.
> 
> 
> So in about two weeks time I'm going to order this case:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146096
> 
> and this motherboard:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131854
> 
> It is definetly going to be nice to have a case that gives my components more room to breath and a motherboard that will make everything run smoother and be able to run all three of my SSD's at 6gb/s. Can't wait!


Thats not so long







I experienced worker fails after 16 and even 29 hours


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Thats not so long
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I experienced worker fails after 16 and even 29 hours


Yea I wanted to play Crysis so I stopped it. I know I'm supposed to run it longer than that and I am going to. I'm just updating and saying that it is my longest stable run so far. I just don't really see a point in running it that long right now. I'm going to wait until I get my new motherboard that can actually overclock.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I wanted to play Crysis so I stopped it. I know I'm supposed to run it longer than that and I am going to. I'm just updating and saying that it is my longest stable run so far. I just don't really see a point in running it that long right now. I'm going to wait until I get my new motherboard that can actually overclock.


I see







Actually I cant decide if I should do regular 24 hour run or let it run longer. Im scared it will fail after 29 hours again







But Im still in the process of finding the right voltage. 4.9GHZ is a no go, because Ive covered 1.27 to 1.4 in 0.005 increments, it always failed and I didnt want to go higher. Now Im doing 4.8GHZ, began with 1.2V and now Im at 1.295V, because 1.29V had a whea code 19 after 4 hours 11 minutes.

have you ever played with VCCSA and VCCIO voltages while you were pursuing that 4.5GHZ ?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> I see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually I cant decide if I should do regular 24 hour run or let it run longer. Im scared it will fail after 29 hours again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But Im still in the process of finding the right voltage. 4.9GHZ is a no go, because Ive covered 1.27 to 1.4 in 0.005 increments, it always failed and I didnt want to go higher. Now Im doing 4.8GHZ, began with 1.2V and now Im at 1.295V, because 1.29V had a whea code 19 after 4 hours 11 minutes.
> 
> have you ever played with VCCSA and VCCIO voltages while you were pursuing that 4.5GHZ ?


I'm not sure what those voltages are. What are they??


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm not sure what those voltages are. What are they??


One is IMC voltage and the other one System Agent voltage. There is also Cpu PPL voltage. A cant find anything solid about it that would tell me exactly how helpful or not are they when doing just cpu overclock.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yeah you can run 24hrs of prime and be stable, but then come and fold...and then realise you need to bump the voltage up even more lol


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Yeah you can run 24hrs of prime and be stable, but then come and fold...and then realise you need to bump the voltage up even more lol


yea, too bad more vcore doesnt mean more stability with my chip







I can be stable 29 hours, but when I bump it +0.005V, I crash after 9 hours


----------



## Hokies83

Meh folding...

im a Miner me likes 400$ a month from pc running why i be alseep


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh folding...
> 
> im a Miner me likes 400$ a month from pc running why i be alseep


Ok Hokies I'm going to take the cooler off of the twin frozr iii and show you the pcb. Be back soon.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok Hokies I'm going to take the cooler off of the twin frozr iii and show you the pcb. Be back soon.


I cannot buy it my Psu can not take another 7950..

However confirming it does those overclocks and the PCB will make it an Easy sell for 200$

Cough Valgaur cough Valgaur


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I cannot buy it my Psu can not take another 7950..
> 
> However confirming it does those overclocks and the PCB will make it an Easy sell for 200$
> 
> Cough Valgaur cough Valgaur


haha I actually got my Sapphire working again which is good because since I mailed in my UPC for a 20 dollar rebate I guess I can't get a refund (I wish they actually alerted people of this and not just in the super fine print), but its whatever. So I'm going to keep the TFIII since I'll probably get less performance with two 7970's with my luck they will be bad overclockers. Anyways, this is a 7950 pcb, right?


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I wanted to play Crysis so I stopped it. I know I'm supposed to run it longer than that and I am going to. I'm just updating and saying that it is my longest stable run so far. I just don't really see a point in running it that long right now. I'm going to wait until I get my new motherboard that can actually overclock.


Just installed crysis3 last night did the training and started the corridor sweeps. Since i'm a COD man the keyboard layout is identical just need to learn to use this suit and swap-out weapons and attachments quicker. can some one loan me 500 usd for a new Graphics Card
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/390572-33-7950-7970
Well ... the 7950 can be overclocked to a stock 7970 easily which gives you the same performance (basically). -tomshardware

*7950 or 7970* *

Im not fussy
















*







*"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## Ali Man

Gonna delid another 3770K, hoping this one would cross 5Ghz or at least get a better VCore from it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Just installed crysis3 last night did the training and started the corridor sweeps. Since i'm a COD man the keyboard layout is identical just need to learn to use this suit and swap-out weapons and attachments quicker. can some one loan me 500 usd for a new Graphics Card
> http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/390572-33-7950-7970
> Well ... the 7950 can be overclocked to a stock 7970 easily which gives you the same performance (basically). -tomshardware
> 
> *7950 or 7970* *
> 
> Im not fussy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


Haha my two 7950's totally eat up Crysis. The games looks absolutely breath taking with all graphics settings maxed out and 4x MSAA.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha my two 7950's totally eat up Crysis. The games looks absolutely breath taking with all graphics settings maxed out and 4x MSAA.


Deep shades of blellow(blue+yellow) ENVY. My ASUS P8Z77 can run it im shocked, (but not Full-Res) Just another Success story for the 3770K and its new Graphics capabilities. first, I Tried running the game with my old nvida card and the game said nah-uh - need DX11 So try again!
Send me a screenie of some reflections preferably crome, plz thx







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Gonna delid another 3770K, hoping this one would cross 5Ghz or at least get a better VCore from it.


Good luck on the 250usd silicon pull tab.
let us know how low it go!?!


----------



## TonicX

Anyone know of a program like fraps that overlays during full screen games - core temps or cpu usage? does aida? does CoreTemp.exe? I wanna see my temps!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Deep shades of blellow(blue+yellow) ENVY. My ASUS P8Z77 can run it im shocked, (but not Full-Res) Just another Success story for the 3770K and its new Graphics capabilities. first, I Tried running the game with my old nvida card and the game said nah-uh - need DX11 So try again!
> Send me a screenie of some reflections preferably crome, plz thx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


What do you mean "reflections"? I don't understand what you mean by that. Like chrome reflections in Crysis?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> haha I actually got my Sapphire working again which is good because since I mailed in my UPC for a 20 dollar rebate I guess I can't get a refund (I wish they actually alerted people of this and not just in the super fine print), but its whatever. So I'm going to keep the TFIII since I'll probably get less performance with two 7970's with my luck they will be bad overclockers. Anyways, this is a 7950 pcb, right?


Yes that is a 7950 PCB now to get u some water blocks on there !


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yes that is a 7950 PCB now to get u some water blocks on there !


I thought they didn't sell waterblocks for 7950 pcb's? Thats what I was told. Thats the whole reason I wanted to get 7970's! What about my Sapphire 2L? Could I get waterblocks for that too?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I thought they didn't sell waterblocks for 7950 pcb's? Thats what I was told. Thats the whole reason I wanted to get 7970's! What about my Sapphire 2L? Could I get waterblocks for that too?


I have Tri Fire 7950s with water blocks.







http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_240_580&products_id=36088

or

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_240_579&products_id=33689

Both made for the Ref 7950 PCB.

For the Sapphire card samething need to look at the pcb.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Good luck on the 250usd silicon pull tab.
> let us know how low it go!?!


Surely, one side strap almost done!


----------



## Ali Man

Actually I'm done, my 3rd delid attempt, first time in 2013, all success. 15min record time!

http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb457/AliMan89/IMG_0811.jpgriginal


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Nice one man!


----------



## Ali Man

Thank you!

Warranty gone, hello overclocking!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have Tri Fire 7950s with water blocks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_240_580&products_id=36088
> 
> or
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_240_579&products_id=33689
> 
> Both made for the Ref 7950 PCB.
> 
> For the Sapphire card samething need to look at the pcb.


Oh. My. God. Thanks! I hope my Sapphire is a reference 7950 pcb! How much did that cooling set-up cost? The PCB is blue so doesn't that mean that there is a good chance that it isn't reference?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Thank you!
> 
> Warranty gone, hello overclocking!


hahahaha!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Actually I'm done, my 3rd delid attempt, first time in 2013, all success. 15min record time!
> 
> http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb457/AliMan89/IMG_0811.jpgriginal


Good job! I did my last one in ten minutes. Beat ya







haha


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, good news and bad news...

New 3770k is at my mother-in-law's, buuuuuuuuuuuuuuut I'm stuck here at work so I won't be able to install it till tomorrow morning


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh. My. God. Thanks! I hope my Sapphire is a reference 7950 pcb! How much did that cooling set-up cost? The PCB is blue so doesn't that mean that there is a good chance that it isn't reference?


NP!

The loop cost alot lol.

Link me the sapphire card and i can check.

But it better to be safe then sorry and remove the cooler and look at the pcb.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> NP!
> 
> The loop cost alot lol.
> 
> Link me the sapphire card and i can check.
> 
> But it better to be safe then sorry and remove the cooler and look at the pcb.


ROFL! Hokie I bet RavageTheEarth can break his rig down and put it back in, in less time than Jeff Gordon's Pit Crew. lol. omg


















































but Ravage better pull the motherboard out to be sure!


----------



## Icydead

This overclocking starts to give me a headache







Ive set [email protected] - blend test bsod 124 after 20 minutes. So I tried again and its stable for 2 hours 30 minutes and still running. WTH







I experienced something similar few weeks ago - 24 hours stable in prime, and after that I restarted, run prime again and it crashed after 2 minutes.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> This overclocking starts to give me a headache
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ive set [email protected] - blend test bsod 124 after 20 minutes. So I tried again and its stable for 2 hours 30 minutes and still running. WTH
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I experienced something similar few weeks ago - 24 hours stable in prime, and after that I restarted, run prime again and it crashed after 2 minutes.


Stability is a relative term. if the software is on Windows it will crash sooner or later - it a mater of time. ambient temps change, case temps change, I've experienced a cool case crashing quicker that a warm one, go fiqure... Overclocking is like voodoo "I don't know how it works!" " I just know it does". you hear me? You heard me!


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Good job! I did my last one in ten minutes. Beat ya
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> haha


I was resting my hands for short intervals









Anyways, this BNIB chip was a disappointment. My current chip OC's better. Off to ebay or the market place.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Stability is a relative term. if the software is on Windows it will crash sooner or later - it a mater of time. ambient temps change, case temps change, I've experienced a cool case crashing quicker that a warm one, go fiqure... Overclocking is like voodoo "I don't know how it works!" " I just know it does". you hear me? You heard me!


If this will keep happening, Ill be stuck in this forever







Im going to pat my case and tell it to behave.


----------



## Gomi

Looks like I finally found a winner











Got it from a handpicked selection that passed superpi 32m stable (Sub 1.3Vcore).

Little Devil Phase Change will be here next week - So not de-lidding this one but putting it under Phase instead


----------



## Ali Man

^^ Lucky you.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Looks like I finally found a winner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got it from a handpicked selection that passed superpi 32m stable (Sub 1.3Vcore).
> 
> Little Devil Phase Change will be here next week - So not de-lidding this one but putting it under Phase instead


Congrats !







...wait till FtW 420 sees this, he'll probably wants to put it on LN2


----------



## ivanlabrie

If it does 6ghz on phase/dice...DAMN


----------



## Hokies83

Time to put that UP7 to work it still has afew more world records to break


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Time to put that UP7 to work it still has afew more world records to break


..speaking of which, Ananadtech has a relatively new (March 1) review of the UP7 here ...I had a real tough time choosing between the UP7 and ROG Maximus V Extreme


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..speaking of which, Ananadtech has a relatively new (March 1) review of the UP7 here ...I had a real tough time choosing between the UP7 and ROG Maximus V Extreme


Pretty easy choice up7 is the better board.

Other then how u want ur system colors if u want blk/red then Asus if not Up7 and never look back.


----------



## ivanlabrie

UP7 is serious business, specially if you got 6.5ghz+ ln2 chips and guts. xD


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Prrety easy choice up7 is the better board.


But costs a lot more, and if you're not gonna go for ln2 with super uber chips, I'd take the MVG over it lol
Even the OC Formula would do perfectly fine for ln2 and specially ram clocking. Gigabyte bioses are kinda meh...

For a gamer type dude, yeah, up5, ud4h, those are fine.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Prrety easy choice up7 is the better board.


...may be, may be not - but it turned out that they didn't have a single one at the depot, and only one Max V Extreme left...for the next chip gen, I may try out the UP7 successor as I have run Gigabyte boards before and like them...

...still, I love the Max V Ex (Shamino's had a lot to do with it) and it has done well for me:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## ivanlabrie

The beauty of the board is ram and cpu oc capabilities, as well as the easy gpu hot wire thing.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> But costs a lot more, and if you're not gonna go for ln2 with super uber chips, I'd take the MVG over it lol
> Even the OC Formula would do perfectly fine for ln2 and specially ram clocking. Gigabyte bioses are kinda meh...
> 
> For a gamer type dude, yeah, up5, ud4h, those are fine.


If u want a gaming MB get a G1 Sniper 3.......


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The beauty of the board is ram and cpu oc capabilities, as well as the easy gpu hot wire thing.


...yup...ram settings go up to 3200 MHz in my Bios, and I will soon find out (under NDA)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Looks like I finally found a winner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got it from a handpicked selection that passed superpi 32m stable (Sub 1.3Vcore).
> 
> Little Devil Phase Change will be here next week - So not de-lidding this one but putting it under Phase instead


Looks like a great one! The best one I have is a (can't remember for sure but think) 5Ghz boot at 1.28V, but it doesn't like high clocks with 8 threads. 6.4Ghz + for 4 core 3d benching at least.
Did not want to budge over this for full load 8 thread, it was disappointing with so much voltage headroom left.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Congrats !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...wait till FtW 420 sees this, he'll probably wants to put it on LN2


Ln2 all the cpus!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yup...ram settings go up to 3200 MHz in my Bios, and I will soon find out (under NDA)


Still not a UP7







King of Socket 1155.

Anywho if i did not get my G1 Sniper 3 sooooooo CHEAP i prolly would of had a ROG board cause it matches my colors...

Would have to be a MVE tho the MVF is not as good as the Sniper.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Still not a UP7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King of Socket 1155.
> 
> Anywho if i did not get my G1 Sniper 3 sooooooo CHEAP i prolly would of had a ROG board cause it matches my colors...
> 
> Would have to be a MVE tho the MVF is not as good as the Sniper.


...I think Martinhal was posting a few days ago that he may want to trade a Sniper for ROG MVE, if you are serious - and want to be color-coordinated to boot


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks like a great one! The best one I have is a (can't remember for sure but think) 5Ghz boot at 1.28V, but it doesn't like high clocks with 8 threads. 6.4Ghz + for 4 core 3d benching at least.
> Did not want to budge over this for full load 8 thread, it was disappointing with so much voltage headroom left.
> 
> 
> Ln2 all the cpus!


...right ! But then, you use AS5 for salad dressing...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think Martinhal was posting a few days ago that he may want to trade a Sniper for ROG MVE, if you are serious - and want to be color-coordinated to boot


Ugh i do not want to tear this down again till i get another chip lol.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Looks like I finally found a winner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got it from a handpicked selection that passed superpi 32m stable (Sub 1.3Vcore).
> 
> Little Devil Phase Change will be here next week - So not de-lidding this one but putting it under Phase instead


Nice chip man!

Man this sucks. I'm having this weird problem which apparently is ONLY an issue with Panasonic TVs and nVidia GPUs. When I turn the TV off, for example if I'm leaving the house for a bit, when I turn the TV back on I have to unplug the HDMI cable and plug it back in to get a display. I tried a couple different nVidia GPUs and a handful of drivers. Never had an issue with my 7950 or 7970. So frickin' mad, I either have to get a new monitor or a new GPU because I'm not going to plug and unplug the HDMI cable 4 times a day for the next year or so.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ugh i do not want to tear this down again till i get another chip lol.


...don't blame you...my custom loop (CPU-only) is complex enough, but yours...
















...which reminds me: Are you using those quick disconnect fittings ? Can they really be used without having to drain and refill the system (though presumably air bleeding should be done to be on the safe side) ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Still not a UP7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> King of Socket 1155.
> 
> Anywho if i did not get my G1 Sniper 3 sooooooo CHEAP i prolly would of had a ROG board cause it matches my colors...
> 
> Would have to be a MVE tho the MVF is not as good as the Sniper.


No denying the up7 is a great board, but can't really call it the king yet. Looking at 20 benchmark records, the up7 has beaten the m5e in 3 of them.
The m5e has more submissions, so the up7 may well catch up, but hasn't yet.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> No denying the up7 is a great board, but can't really call it the king yet. Looking at 20 benchmark records, the up7 has beaten the m5e in 3 of them.
> The m5e has more submissions, so the up7 may well catch up, but hasn't yet.


My thoughts exactly...it's not king for US yet Hokies. I'd rather use my cheap MVG instead of such an expensive board for benching.
Unless you intend to run more than 2 gpus, it's more than enough. And, I don't like GB bioses that much. Newer ones are getting better from what I gather, but still...not my cup of tea.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok guys so I'm about to tear apart my rig because my power supply has been making this wierd chirping noise so I am going to send it in for an exchange. Figure I'll just take apart the whole thing because I'm going to order the Maximus V Formula and Phantom Full tower ATX on friday. See ya guys on my crappy laptop!!


----------



## ivanlabrie

haha...Try to get the 820 and mod it


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok guys so I'm about to tear apart my rig because my power supply has been making this wierd chirping noise so I am going to send it in for an exchange. Figure I'll just take apart the whole thing because I'm going to order the Maximus V Formula and Phantom Full tower ATX on friday. See ya guys on my crappy laptop!!


dude your luck with hardware is kinda bad every piece you got had to be exchanged for some reason , cpu , mobo , gpu , psu , case lol

might as well build a new rig


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> dude your luck with hardware is kinda bad every piece you got had to be exchanged for some reason , cpu , mobo , gpu , psu , case lol
> 
> might as well build a new rig


Haha tell me about it and all of the things I have are quality except the motherboard and the case. I'm just going to get this new motherboard and case and re-install windows and hopefully everything will work out.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> haha...Try to get the 820 and mod it


...got a 820 Phantom sitting a few feet from me - modding only half finished...nice case though







(got for $100 because it had been a demo in the store with a few minor scratches)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Anyone know of a program like fraps that overlays during full screen games - core temps or cpu usage? does aida? does CoreTemp.exe? I wanna see my temps!


aida 64 and hw.monitor do it. aida64


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> haha...Try to get the 820 and mod it


I was actually going to get the 820, but I don't really need all of that extra jazz. All I care about are dust filters, ample cable management space, and lots of places for fans. I am going to get the 620 phantom. The ASUS Maximus V Forumla and Phantom 620 come to $460 after shipping costs. I really wanted to spend under $500 for the two so that is perfect.

What do you mean by "mod" it? Like extra lights and stuff?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I was actually going to get the 820, but I don't really need all of that extra jazz. All I care about are dust filters, ample cable management space, and lots of places for fans. I am going to get the 620 phantom. The ASUS Maximus V Forumla and Phantom 620 come to $460 after shipping costs. I really wanted to spend under $500 for the two so that is perfect.
> 
> What do you mean by "mod" it? Like extra lights and stuff?


That, MOD it...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That, MOD it...


DAMN! I think I need some more years of experience under my belt before I attempt something like that. For goodness sakes I don't even have any clue how a water loop works or how I would even attempt setting one up.

This is an amazing Phantom 820 mod. http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=248493

So what is the difference between the 820 and 630? Just lighting right?

Also, does anyone want to stop me from getting the ASUS Maximus V Formula? Or is all my research correct and that is a good board that I will be happy with. I don't plan on upgrading to Haswell for maybe a year and a half to two years so I don't mind spending a chunk of change.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> DAMN! I think I need some more years of experience under my belt before I attempt something like that. For goodness sakes I don't even have any clue how a water loop works or how I would even attempt setting one up.
> 
> This is an amazing Phantom 820 mod. http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=248493
> 
> So what is the difference between the 820 and 630? Just lighting right?
> 
> Also, does anyone want to stop me from getting the ASUS Maximus V Formula? Or is all my research correct and that is a good board that I will be happy with. I don't plan on upgrading to Haswell for maybe a year and a half to two years so I don't mind spending a chunk of change.


All I can say is that wait for it to come down in price, memory sticks and motherboard have gone way up this past month in prices. You could easily get it for $260 shipped on egg, now it's like $300.

Apart from that, go for it. We're both in the same boat, even though haswell is on my mind, but I may just keep Ivy just because this mobo MVF is just awesome in all ways.


----------



## MKHunt

- The secret joy of water cooling is that everyone thinks it's incredibly complicated when in reality, it's very very simple.

-In a year and a half to two years, just get Haswell-E









-Maximus V is a super spiffy board and the only complaints I've heard with it are really complaints about ASUS' CS department.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> All I can say is that wait for it to come down in price, memory sticks and motherboard have gone way up this past month in prices. You could easily get it for $260 shipped on egg, now it's like $300.
> 
> Apart from that, go for it. We're both in the same boat, even though haswell is on my mind, but I may just keep Ivy just because this mobo MVF is just awesome in all ways.


Yea check this out. Its $290 and there is a 25$ promo code. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131934 That is why I want to jump on it now.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> - The secret joy of water cooling is that everyone thinks it's incredibly complicated when in reality, it's very very simple.
> 
> -In a year and a half to two years, just get Haswell-E
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Maximus V is a super spiffy board and the only complaints I've heard with it are really complaints about ASUS' CS department.


Yea I can't wait to put my two 7950's and 3770k under water! Silence.......


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> DAMN! I think I need some more years of experience under my belt before I attempt something like that. For goodness sakes I don't even have any clue how a water loop works or how I would even attempt setting one up.
> 
> This is an amazing Phantom 820 mod. http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=248493
> 
> So what is the difference between the 820 and 630? Just lighting right?
> 
> Also, does anyone want to stop me from getting the ASUS Maximus V Formula? Or is all my research correct and that is a good board that I will be happy with. I don't plan on upgrading to Haswell for maybe a year and a half to two years so I don't mind spending a chunk of change.


I have the related Maximus V Extreme (I use tri-SLI and quad-SLI so I need the extra lanes), and I am very happy with it...best board I ever had


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> All I can say is that wait for it to come down in price, memory sticks and motherboard have gone way up this past month in prices. You could easily get it for $260 shipped on egg, now it's like $300.
> 
> Apart from that, go for it. We're both in the same boat, even though haswell is on my mind, but I may just keep Ivy just because this mobo MVF is just awesome in all ways.


Holy smokes I hadn't even noticed that! Though if you can find an OpenBox deal on Newegg, I found out that Newegg Open Box for Asus means factory refurbished and sealed with warranty. Got my Sabertooth Z77 for $150 that way.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Holy smokes I hadn't even noticed that! Though if you can find an OpenBox deal on Newegg, I found out that Newegg Open Box for Asus means factory refurbished and sealed with warranty. Got my Sabertooth Z77 for $150 that way.


Wow thats cool! Can I still get the one year accidental damage service plan? I am going to get that plan just in case I bend the socket pins or something like that. I swear, they still use pins so we have to buy another board if we bend them haha


----------



## Hokies83

LoL i got some crazy gpu temps...

Top card 34C full load

Middle card 55C full load

Bottom card 36C full Load....

Seems ima have to break the loop down " AGAIN" and see whats up with the middle card....

Oh and cpu is about 55C full load....


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i got some crazy gpu temps...
> 
> Top card 34C full load
> 
> Middle card 55C full load
> 
> Bottom card 36C full Load....
> 
> Seems ima have to break the loop down " AGAIN" and see whats up with the middle card....
> 
> Oh and cpu is about 55C full load....


Judging purely from your temps, I would bet money they're in parallel? 20C is a huge delta though. My 590 hits 41C at stock volts (.925V), 50C overvolted to 1V. I figure that's pretty decent for two fermi dies on a single board.

ETA: Regarding accidental damage, I have no idea. I just know that when I used the Asus product registration tool, it signed me up for the full 5-year TUF warranty. All the accessories were also in sealed packaging and the mobo had stickers over ports and slots.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i got some crazy gpu temps...
> 
> Top card 34C full load
> 
> Middle card 55C full load
> 
> Bottom card 36C full Load....
> 
> Seems ima have to break the loop down " AGAIN" and see whats up with the middle card....
> 
> Oh and cpu is about 55C full load....


those are great temps!
do you think they would be cooler if u had 1 rad cooling the cpu, then from cpu to your two other rads and from there cooling the gpu's. and not straight from the cpu to gpu but to a rad before the loop goes to the gpu's

when i plan on going water cooling i thought it would be better if the loop didnt go from the cpu straight to the gpus but to the other rad first then the gpu's ?

or does all that even matter???


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> those are great temps!
> do you think they would be cooler if u had 1 rad cooling the cpu, then from cpu to your two other rads and from there cooling the gpu's. and not straight from the cpu to gpu but to a rad before the loop goes to the gpu's
> 
> when i plan on going water cooling i thought it would be better if the loop didnt go from the cpu straight to the gpus but to the other rad first then the gpu's ?
> 
> or does all that even matter???


Few C but it would look messy.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i got some crazy gpu temps...
> 
> Top card 34C full load
> 
> Middle card 55C full load
> 
> Bottom card 36C full Load....
> 
> Seems ima have to break the loop down " AGAIN" and see whats up with the middle card....
> 
> Oh and cpu is about 55C full load....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> those are great temps!
> do you think they would be cooler if u had 1 rad cooling the cpu, then from cpu to your two other rads and from there cooling the gpu's. and not straight from the cpu to gpu but to a rad before the loop goes to the gpu's
> 
> when i plan on going water cooling i thought it would be better if the loop didnt go from the cpu straight to the gpus but to the other rad first then the gpu's ?
> 
> or does all that even matter???


Great temps, but that middle card is being a weirdo.
I have never seen that before, but I have always run series, mike might be onto something with the parallel thing (if you are in parallel).


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Few C but it would look messy.


I would also say that the few C you see under light/moderate load would completely disappear under heavy load (assuming that in-between rad is placed elsewhere in the loop).


----------



## jdm317

I was wrong in stating my vcore of 1.39v at 4.8ghz earlier in the thread. It is actually at 1.29v. Bad math, good chip.



About to tear it down and try the CLP out. Really hope it helps.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> those are great temps!
> do you think they would be cooler if u had 1 rad cooling the cpu, then from cpu to your two other rads and from there cooling the gpu's. and not straight from the cpu to gpu but to a rad before the loop goes to the gpu's
> 
> when i plan on going water cooling i thought it would be better if the loop didnt go from the cpu straight to the gpus but to the other rad first then the gpu's ?
> 
> or does all that even matter???


I think you got your answer already, but I just asked that same question elsewhere. I was planning to go from top rad, to cpu, to gpu, then bottom rad, and wondered if it made difference that you are sending the cpu heated water straight to the gpu. I was told that it makes little difference because the water heats up over several revolutions through the loop and not from one component to the next. As long as the pump is good enough to create good flow, it doesn't matter what the order of components is too any measureable extent.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Wow all of this water cooling talk makes me really want to water cool









Can someone link me to a good water cooling guide so I can start learning stuff and figuring out how these things work?


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=674257

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=628092


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i got some crazy gpu temps...
> 
> Top card 34C full load
> 
> Middle card 55C full load
> 
> Bottom card 36C full Load....
> 
> Seems ima have to break the loop down " AGAIN" and see whats up with the middle card....
> 
> Oh and cpu is about 55C full load....


..let us know what you find...the top contenders must be 'mounting', 'debris', or bad temp sensor - very odd, though...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *RavageTheEarth* wrote ...Can someone link me to a good water cooling guide so I can start learning stuff and figuring out how these things work?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=674257
> 
> http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=628092


Folks can always start with a closed-loop 'store bought' system - but I just finished a custom loop and it actually is a ton of fun...biggest challenge was to visualize everything right re. future upgrades and space in the case - this multi-part YouTube series by Linus / NCIX is pretty good:


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Great temps, but that middle card is being a weirdo.
> I have never seen that before, but I have always run series, mike might be onto something with the parallel thing (if you are in parallel).


Yeah im parallel it is the new craze if you have very good head pressure it puts the PWN on series.


----------



## Arm3nian

What cpu would you guys recommend for a photoshop user. My uncle has a photo business and wants to upgrade from his core 2 duo. I'm going to recommend 3570k because it seems like the best for the $. Going 3770k would benefit because the threads but I dont think it is necessary. I was also thinking amd because of the cores but ya... amd lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> What cpu would you guys recommend for a photoshop user. My uncle has a photo business and wants to upgrade from his core 2 duo. I'm going to recommend 3570k because it seems like the best for the $. Going 3770k would benefit because the threads but I dont think it is necessary. I was also thinking amd because of the cores but ya... amd lol.


3770k Snag a used one for 250$ call it a day.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 3770k Snag a used one for 250$ call it a day.


Ya that might work. What about a mobo/ram. Doubt he will overclock like we do but maybe a little. Needs to be quite cheap, Like less than 150board and 50ram. Was thinking a cheap msi boards looks decent, and some corsair ram.


----------



## Hokies83

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

*CPU:* Intel Core i7-3770K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($304.99 @ Newegg)
*Motherboard:* MSI Z77MA-G45 Micro ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($107.99 @ Amazon)
*Memory:* G.Skill Sniper 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($53.30 @ NCIX US)
*Total:* $466.28
_(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)_
_(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-03-21 01:26 EDT-0400)_


----------



## dr/owned

Has anyone dremel-ed their IHS so only the edges of it are left? If I were going to delid, I wouldn't chicken out, I'd want to direct cool the die while still having enough of the IHS to use the stock bracket. Or just use a 2.5mm thick shim...that would work too per package specs from Intel.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> dude your luck with hardware is kinda bad every piece you got had to be exchanged for some reason , cpu , mobo , gpu , psu , case lol
> 
> might as well build a new rig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha tell me about it and all of the things I have are quality except the motherboard and the case. I'm just going to get this new motherboard and case and re-install windows and hopefully everything will work out.
Click to expand...

How uch voltage did your cpu need for 4.5ghz?


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Has anyone dremel-ed their IHS so only the edges of it are left? If I were going to delid, I wouldn't chicken out, I'd want to direct cool the die while still having enough of the IHS to use the stock bracket. Or just use a 2.5mm thick shim...that would work too per package specs from Intel.


I started with Direct Die.

I put the IHS back on and only have between a 2-3C raise in temps with it on.

The temps are also a little more even. Maybe a better block will keep temps more even.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Has anyone dremel-ed their IHS so only the edges of it are left? If I were going to delid, I wouldn't chicken out, I'd want to direct cool the die while still having enough of the IHS to use the stock bracket. Or just use a 2.5mm thick shim...that would work too per package specs from Intel.


I thought that same exact thing, but there were not enough direct die champions out there, so I just used cool lab like most of the guys on the list. why don't you dremel yours first then I will.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Has anyone dremel-ed their IHS so only the edges of it are left? If I were going to delid, I wouldn't chicken out, I'd want to direct cool the die while still having enough of the IHS to use the stock bracket. Or just use a 2.5mm thick shim...that would work too per package specs from Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> I thought that same exact thing, but there were not enough direct die champions out there, so I just used cool lab like most of the guys on the list. why don't you dremel yours first then I will.
Click to expand...

I'm still on the fence. On the one hand a 3770k only costs me $186 so a mistake wouldn't be a huge deal, but on the other it's a fair amount of work to potentially crack the die. Going to ye-olde-toolbox now to see if I have a dremel bit that could just can-opener the IHS, leaving the glue that holds the IHS alone and attacking the edge instead.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I'm still on the fence. On the one hand a 3770k only costs me $186 so a mistake wouldn't be a huge deal, but on the other it's a fair amount of work to potentially crack the die. Going to ye-olde-toolbox now to see if I have a dremel bit that could just can-opener the IHS, leaving the glue that holds the IHS alone and attacking the edge instead.


study the shape and size of the die, notice it runs parallel to the wings. don't get close to the nugget center. Good Luck!








*"This Is Rocket Surgery!"*


----------



## dr/owned

Checking the specs again, it wouldn't work. The die is lower than the height of the wings (nice term), so heatsink would be making contact with them instead of the die.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Checking the specs again, it wouldn't work. The die is lower than the height of the wings (nice term), so heatsink would be making contact with them instead of the die.


the direct die thing works at all because the green plastic part of the socket support the bottom of the chip evenly, although too much heatsink pressure cause the die part of the chip to bend in; and not enough pressure will fail contact on all the pins. good to see your thinking it through but still experimental. if you do delid cutting the glue is easest with a thinner razor blade, push it in a corner and rock it into a side x 4. Cool Lab Ultra thermal paste is what I recommend from my experience. Godspeed.







*"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can modify your waterblock to fit the die 'inside' it...I think Joa3d43 did that already.


----------



## chefproject

Finally i did it two days ago.The lid is of.....i will post the pics later when i get home......only thing i can say is that my temps are worse than before with the Zalman TIM i used for the moment cause CLU is ordered but not arrived until now. Tried already 3 times a reseat but it doesen 't help :-(


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yeah im parallel it is the new craze if you have very good head pressure it puts the PWN on series.


I don't understand how parallel works. Seems like the flow would be clashing on the middle card. It would make more sense that the water goes in one side and comes out the other.

How does parallel work?


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> Finally i did it two days ago.The lid is of.....i will post the pics later when i get home......only thing i can say is that my temps are worse than before with the Zalman TIM i used for the moment cause CLU is ordered but not arrived until now. Tried already 3 times a reseat but it doesen 't help :-(


i tried as5 before my clu got here and my temps were worse also. I didn't really expect that.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> i tried as5 before my clu got here and my temps were worse also. I didn't really expect that.


It is all about the application. Remember thin layer. I like brushing it in the same direction. Remember to get all of the glue off on the pcb so the IHS can sit as close as possible to the die. Do a thin layer on the die and on the IHS.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> Finally i did it two days ago.The lid is of.....i will post the pics later when i get home......only thing i can say is that my temps are worse than before with the Zalman TIM i used for the moment cause CLU is ordered but not arrived until now. Tried already 3 times a reseat but it doesen 't help :-(


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> i tried as5 before my clu got here and my temps were worse also. I didn't really expect that.


strange tho, even when i used AS5 at first,i had to wait for liquid pro also, i still got about 10C tempdrop..
another 25C came of when i used liquid pro later on..









i looked for the w/mk zalman tim has,
zalman thermal grease (1.2W/mK),
which is very low really, maybe thats why,
even intels tim(4-5w/mk) or AS5(8-9w/mk) has a higher w/mk then that


----------



## chefproject

Will try it again in the weekend but application was done with the brush very thin layer on the die and inside the ihs and same between ihs and cooler no idea what case the problem


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I don't understand how parallel works. Seems like the flow would be clashing on the middle card. It would make more sense that the water goes in one side and comes out the other.
> 
> How does parallel work?


Cuts flow in Half.

Makes the liquid passing thru the cards not heat up as much more has less flow.

This is why u need " MASSIVE" head pressure for it to work.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I found adding two layers gave me better temps


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> i tried as5 before my clu got here and my temps were worse also. I didn't really expect that.
> 
> 
> 
> It is all about the application. Remember thin layer. I like brushing it in the same direction. Remember to get all of the glue off on the pcb so the IHS can sit as close as possible to the die. Do a thin layer on the die and on the IHS.
Click to expand...

your suggesting brushing on as5?


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> Finally i did it two days ago.The lid is of.....i will post the pics later when i get home......only thing i can say is that my temps are worse than before with the Zalman TIM i used for the moment cause CLU is ordered but not arrived until now. Tried already 3 times a reseat but it doesen 't help :-(
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> i tried as5 before my clu got here and my temps were worse also. I didn't really expect that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> strange tho, even when i used AS5 at first,i had to wait for liquid pro also, i still got about 10C tempdrop..
> another 25C came of when i used liquid pro later on..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i looked for the w/mk zalman tim has,
> zalman thermal grease (1.2W/mK),
> which is very low really, maybe thats why,
> even intels tim(4-5w/mk) or AS5(8-9w/mk) has a higher w/mk then that
Click to expand...

i tried reseating 2 more times and for some reason with as5 my hottest core was around 2c hotter than it was before delidding. My clu did drop temps 25c as well on the first try so thats the solution


----------



## King4x4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cuts flow in Half.
> 
> Makes the liquid passing thru the cards not heat up as much more has less flow.
> 
> This is why u need " MASSIVE" head pressure for it to work.


Actually the correct thing is that you massive flow.

Parallel flow = Minor Headloss + Flow split in nearly equal proportions between the parts dependent on the ressistance through each part.

This equates that the flow will flow the most in the first card that needs it.

Series = Major Headloss + Same flow in all of the parts at the same time so equal flow that will gradually heat up.

So the correct terminology is that you need MASSIVE FLOW for parallel.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> your suggesting brushing on as5?


No I don't think that would work that well. I was talking about CLU


----------



## ivanlabrie

Got a new chip guys...Batch 3227CXXX.
Couldn't test much cause I need to reinstall microxp and I need a proper gpu (I used a semi-dead 7600gt which only shows blue and some shades of gray on screen, with 4 bit depth and 640x480 res lmao)
The thing booted at 4.5ghz with 1.2v and 4x2gb 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24-2t psc sticks (mixed set lol), but it was a completely random vcore I used. Seems to run cool, cause I had 29c in the bios, with a passive silver arrow.


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> your suggesting brushing on as5?
> 
> 
> 
> No I don't think that would work that well. I was talking about CLU
Click to expand...

just making sure, haha.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Got a new chip guys...Batch 3227CXXX.
> Couldn't test much cause I need to reinstall microxp and I need a proper gpu (I used a semi-dead 7600gt which only shows blue and some shades of gray on screen, with 4 bit depth and 640x480 res lmao)
> The thing booted at 4.5ghz with 1.2v and 4x2gb 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24-2t psc sticks (mixed set lol), but it was a completely random vcore I used. Seems to run cool, cause I had 29c in the bios, with a passive silver arrow.


Very nice. Yeah, that 7600gt is definitely on life support lmao. Looks like the CPU could be a good one. Have you delidded it yet?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Very nice. Yeah, that 7600gt is definitely on life support lmao. Looks like the CPU could be a good one. Have you delidded it yet?


No delidding on this one...I have good reasons for that (I won't discuss those here, for the sake of alancsalt's peace of mind)








Plus, I'd lose resale value in Argentina, people would never buy a delidded chip here.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Got a new chip guys...Batch 3227CXXX.
> Couldn't test much cause I need to reinstall microxp and I need a proper gpu (I used a semi-dead 7600gt which only shows blue and some shades of gray on screen, with 4 bit depth and 640x480 res lmao)
> The thing booted at 4.5ghz with 1.2v and 4x2gb 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24-2t psc sticks (mixed set lol), but it was a completely random vcore I used. Seems to run cool, cause I had 29c in the bios, with a passive silver arrow.


Well I hope the IMC God's put in extra care when they conceived that chip!


----------



## snowfree52

guys, anyone knows how I can have my temps and vcore etc ... from aida 64 at the top left while playing crysis ?

Thanks


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys, anyone knows how I can have my temps and vcore etc ... from aida 64 at the top left while playing crysis ?
> 
> Thanks


Use HWinfo64 instead, it has an OSD.


----------



## sbruno624

Did anybody ever try putting a piece of painters tape on the side of razor that touches the PCB to prevent scratches? Just an idea, because I have Feather shaving razors, they're thin as anything and extremely sharp, just thinking that if the razor could still cut on the top side it would be safer


----------



## Zeek

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sbruno624*
> 
> Did anybody ever try putting a piece of painters tape on the side of razor that touches the PCB to prevent scratches? Just an idea, because I have Feather shaving razors, they're thin as anything and extremely sharp, just thinking that if the razor could still cut on the top side it would be safer


I had the same idea, but I used electrical tape. Didn't work out to well for me, so I just went in straight with the razor, lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well I hope the IMC God's put in extra care when they conceived that chip!


Yeah, definitely...It's looking pseudo decent imc wise. There are some REALLY sucky ones out there. I'll be testing 4x2gb mixed psc sets just for fun.


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Use HWinfo64 instead, it has an OSD.


could you explain how to do it ?

I was actually trying to make it work but don't have a clue ?

Thanks


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sbruno624*
> 
> Did anybody ever try putting a piece of painters tape on the side of razor that touches the PCB to prevent scratches? Just an idea, because I have Feather shaving razors, they're thin as anything and extremely sharp, just thinking that if the razor could still cut on the top side it would be safer


I am not sure how that would work, you have so little room to work with between the IHS and PCB a piece of tape seems like it would just get in the way. If you look at the pictures of my two delidded chips, and most of those here, you can delid without ever really coming close to the pcb.

You can see in the pics that a lot of the glue is still on the pcb, so it is possible to delid without having the cutting edge of the razor touch the pcb. The pcb can be bent ever so slightly which enables you to carefully angle the razor blade up toward the IHS and away from the pcb. This assumes you use a one sided razor blade, not the very flexible two sided kind - but those have worked for some here too.

The hardest part, in my opinion, is getting the edge of the razor into that first corner. It took me several minutes on my first chip, that had a small gap between the IHS and pcb, to get the razor under the IHS while being angled away from the pcb. The second chip had terrible temps to start with and a lot of glue, so it was definitely easier to delid.

Most of the people that had trouble delidding will say that they could have used better tools, taken more time to do it carefully and slowly, or did some more research first. Ivy is a nice chip, and delidding makes is a very good chip - assuming the silicon lottery didn't treat you like a red headed step child.


----------



## badtaylorx

I think i may have screwed the pooch here.....i delidid my 3570k, no scratches and i used the coolabs. pro... but i did this before installing windows....

is there a reflow process that has to happen at first??? or will i be good to just post up and go???

any advice would be good....

thanx

mBTX


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Fire it up and see what happens. Destruction isn't dependent on windows.

I guarantee you that your chip was functional before delidding. Nearly certain every single die is tested in an OS environment prior to shipment. (Among other tests).


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *badtaylorx*
> 
> I think i may have screwed the pooch here.....i delidid my 3570k, no scratches and i used the coolabs. pro... but i did this before installing windows....
> 
> is there a reflow process that has to happen at first??? or will i be good to just post up and go???
> 
> any advice would be good....
> 
> thanx
> 
> mBTX


There should not be any difference with installing windows with a lidded or delidded chip if there was no damage done when delidding. It would, however, be very hard to know anything about temps and stability if the chip was not tested prior to delidding. I would definitely advise anyone to test your chip thoroughly before delidding. Without doing that you don't know if the chip is worth delidding, what the temps were lidded to compare, and to know if there was anything wrong with the chip so it could be exchanged.

All that said, you should be fine if there is nothing wrong with the chip. Just make sure to go to bios stock defaults when installing windows.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, definitely...It's looking pseudo decent imc wise. There are some REALLY sucky ones out there. I'll be testing 4x2gb mixed psc sets just for fun.


...I have my favorite set of 8x4 / 32GB TridentX-2400 which I try out on all 3770ies at given settings, 1.67v for the ram and 4.56 GHz w/BCLK @ 106.0 and multi @ 43..(there's a reason for the latter settings, given that we use also 3770 non-K's that have full VM support unlike the 'K' but are multiplier-limited)...then run Cinebench to find lowest vCore where that works at, then do XTU stability testing.

...we use the max of 32GB work-wise anyways but it also stresses the IMC more than 4 or 8 etc..usually, this approach allows for relatively quick 'binning' of CPUs, though there are other totally valid methods as well....this one just 'works' for us.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I don't understand how parallel works. Seems like the flow would be clashing on the middle card. It would make more sense that the water goes in one side and comes out the other.
> 
> How does parallel work?


Like a fork in the road. It splits up and runs beside each other. Then its like yo man lets go back into one lane!
Then they meet up real quick.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I have my favorite set of 8x4 / 32GB TridentX-2400 which I try out on all 3770ies at given settings, 1.67v for the ram and 4.56 GHz w/BCLK @ 106.0 and multi @ 43..(there's a reason for the latter settings, given that we use also 3770 non-K's that have full VM support unlike the 'K' but are multiplier-limited)...then run Cinebench to find lowest vCore where that works at, then do XTU stability testing.
> 
> ...we use the max of 32GB work-wise anyways but it also stresses the IMC more than 4 or 8 etc..usually, this approach allows for relatively quick 'binning' of CPUs, though there are other totally valid methods as well....this one just 'works' for us.


Yeah, that is a hell of a lot of stress for the imc...I run superpi 32m, if it passes with any give settings I choose I'm happy. xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Like a fork in the road. It splits up and runs beside each other. Then its like yo man lets go back into one lane!
> Then they meet up real quick.


Makes sense...


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Makes sense...


Sure does...


----------



## sbruno624

Yeah I think I need better razors, there is a very very tiny hairline scratch on the very edge so I put it away so I didnt mess it up for later. Ill see how the temps are before I do anything, I get my board tomorrow.


----------



## badtaylorx

thanx guys, yeah i guess i got a little too randy and put the cart before the horse.....i wasnt so worried about the win install so much as the lack of a cpu stressor and temp monitoring if a re-flow process was needed for the liq. metal TIM.....

but you've rested my fears ....thanx

mBTX


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm gonna borrow an 8400gs 512mb for a while...till I can get some benching cards. I need 2d picture for benching at least. lol


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> could you explain how to do it ?
> 
> I was actually trying to make it work but don't have a clue ?
> 
> Thanks


I've tried AiDa64, OpenHardwareMonitor.exe, HWiNFO64 Program, Still no osd for crysis3 is this a windows 8 problem, or user problem, Heh?
I can get it on the tashbar with HWiNFO64 Program but no logitec lcd. stumped


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna borrow an 8400gs 512mb for a while...till I can get some benching cards. I need 2d picture for benching at least. lol


I still have one of those, 2d picture for benching it can handle. Anything 3d will be a slideshow.

It's fun to run valley through, it can't read under 1fps so it takes longer on the time, the benchmark timer runs in slow motion.


----------



## Xinoxide

LOL. Under 1FPS. I like it.

Does it skew the score?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys, anyone knows how I can have my temps and vcore etc ... from aida 64 at the top left while playing crysis ?
> 
> Thanks


you need afterburner or percision x, riva tuner
preferences-external applications


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I still have one of those, 2d picture for benching it can handle. Anything 3d will be a slideshow.
> 
> It's fun to run valley through, it can't read under 1fps so it takes longer on the time, the benchmark timer runs in slow motion.


...been there, done that







...when I ran quad SLI at HWBot for Firestrike Extreme (at least at the time the only submission, regardless of card), one test 'crawled' to an astonishing *0.68 FPS* average ...no wonder there were no other submissions... I think it is fair to say that Firestrike is, ahem, _not very well optimized_ for more than 2 cards (tri-SLI results for that test are usually lower than SLI)

...Valley is another story, though...it likes Quad cards.


----------



## Swag

What'd y'all think?

I was wondering if I should skip a res and make my own with a blood bag. I was thinking of ways to make the build my own so since I have a C70, the most popular way to use it is as an ammo can, adding a blood bag really accommodates the build.


----------



## johnny13oi

Don't know if this has been tried before and I don't know the composition of the glue used to attach the lid but has anyone tried using fishing line like a saw and a hairdryer or a heat gun to soften the glue and try cutting through like that? No chance of damage that way unless you use a heat gun and heat it up too much.

Now if they used an epoxy, then this might not work.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna borrow an 8400gs 512mb for a while...till I can get some benching cards. I need 2d picture for benching at least. lol


...well, that bright light in Argentina below must be you benching then







Go Ivanlabrie









...btw, this 'traffic snapshot' was 'gleaned' (source Spiegel / in pic) from a bot that had been placed on root servers that are supposed to be untouchable for bots ! That's kind of scary...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok so I'm going to be placing my order tomorrow. I have a 500 dollar credit limit and I am torn between the ASUS Maximus V Formula ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131934 ) or the GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP7 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569 ). If I buy the ASUS I will also buy the Phantom 630 with it, but if I buy the GIGABYTE I will have to wait to buy a case, but that won't really matter since I am sending my PSU out for an RMA so I'm not going to be able to use the computer for a couple weeks anyways. If I buy the GIGABYTE I will probably just end up buying the Phantom 820 case.

What to do? Can you guys give me some input on this?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok so I'm going to be placing my order tomorrow. I have a 500 dollar credit limit and I am torn between the ASUS Maximus V Formula ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131934 ) or the GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP7 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569 ). If I buy the ASUS I will also buy the Phantom 630 with it, but if I buy the GIGABYTE I will have to wait to buy a case, but that won't really matter since I am sending my PSU out for an RMA so I'm not going to be able to use the computer for a couple weeks. If I buy the GIGABYTE I will probably just end up buying the Phantom 820 case.
> 
> What to do? Can you guys give me some input on this?


...there is a fair amount of posts yesterday on ROG Maximus, Gigabyte UP7 etc, might be worth it to read through them, incl FtW 420's table he posted


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've had one before...and a 9400gt. Check my submissions at the bot, fun stuff lol
Aquamark was choppy, gimme a break xD


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, that bright light in Argentina below must be you benching then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Go Ivanlabrie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...btw, this 'traffic snapshot' was 'gleaned' (source Spiegel / in pic) from a bot that had been placed on root servers that are supposed to be untouchable for bots ! That's kind of scary...


Interesting stuff...and yeah, scary too :/

I'll use that 2d crappy card for a while till I can find a btc capable one.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok so I'm going to be placing my order tomorrow. I have a 500 dollar credit limit and I am torn between the ASUS Maximus V Formula ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131934 ) or the GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP7 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569 ). If I buy the ASUS I will also buy the Phantom 630 with it, but if I buy the GIGABYTE I will have to wait to buy a case, but that won't really matter since I am sending my PSU out for an RMA so I'm not going to be able to use the computer for a couple weeks anyways. If I buy the GIGABYTE I will probably just end up buying the Phantom 820 case.
> 
> What to do? Can you guys give me some input on this?


Givent the UP7's price, I personally wouldnt get it unless I knew I was going to drop $1200 on a golden IB chip, and put it under an LN2 pot. ( or go Quad SLI )

Maybe one of these:

ASRock OC Formula ( This is my board, the only way I could be happier is if you bought me a UP7 )

Gigabyte z77x-UP5 ( Was the board I planned on but got a better deal on the OC Formula )

MSI z77 mPower ( supposedly hand tested to 4.6ghz )

The MVF is still a great board. From my reading through other peoples experience, it seems to excel extremely well in memory overclocking capabilities.

Beyond that, 95% of what you are going to get out of your chip, is going to be because of your chip specifically.

But I must say, the OC Formula has held the Ivy bridge clock speed record, and has a great bios.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Givent the UP7's price, I personally wouldnt get it unless I knew I was going to drop $1200 on a golden IB chip, and put it under an LN2 pot.
> 
> Maybe one of these:
> 
> ASRock OC Formula ( This is my board, the only way I could be happier is if you bought me a UP7 )
> 
> Gigabyte z77x-UP5 ( Was the board I planned on but got a better deal on the OC Formula )
> 
> MSI z77 mPower ( supposedly hand tested to 4.6ghz )
> 
> The MVF is still a great board. From my reading through other peoples experience, it seems to excel extremely well in memory overclocking capabilities.
> 
> Beyond that, 95% of what you are going to get out of your chip, is going to be because of your chip specifically.
> 
> But I must say, the OC Formula has held the Ivy bridge clock speed record, and has a great bios.


Have you tested the OC Formula with a DMM to see how much the voltage is off? With the Extreme4 that I'm selling the voltage was off up to .1v depending on what LLC I was using. The lowest it was off was .03v


----------



## ivanlabrie

The OC Formula is on another whole new level...can't compare it to cheaper Asrock boards. Think of it as a cheaper MVE.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The OC Formula is on another whole new level...can't compare it to cheaper Asrock boards. Think of it as a cheaper MVE.


Hmmm maybe I'll get that then. It's only $205 at newegg right now. As long as the voltage won't be off more than .02 I'll be happy. Then I can buy the Phantom 820 with it! Nice! Now to decide if I want the case in white or black







Any opinions on that?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get a black case...black and gold is cool.
And it reports a bit more than the actual dmm voltage.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hmmm maybe I'll get that then. It's only $205 at newegg right now. As long as the voltage won't be off more than .02 I'll be happy. Then I can buy the Phantom 820 with it! Nice! Now to decide if I want the case in white or black
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any opinions on that?


A decent mobo should be less than .01 off on vCore. I can't comment on the other brands because I haven't tested them, but both my MVF have worked perfectly. I am not aware of anyone on Swag's guide that has had any real trouble with ocing their chips, so while the current bios bug is a little annoying the bios is very easy to use and oc. Just my 2, wait, I mean 47 cents (hint: the intentional deflation of the dollar is far worse than you think it is).


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok so I'm going to be placing my order tomorrow. I have a 500 dollar credit limit and I am torn between the ASUS Maximus V Formula ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131934 ) or the GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UP7 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128569 ). If I buy the ASUS I will also buy the Phantom 630 with it, but if I buy the GIGABYTE I will have to wait to buy a case, but that won't really matter since I am sending my PSU out for an RMA so I'm not going to be able to use the computer for a couple weeks anyways. If I buy the GIGABYTE I will probably just end up buying the Phantom 820 case.
> 
> What to do? Can you guys give me some input on this?


I've heard good things myself of the MSI Mpower - regarding customer service.
Asus (especially) and Gigabyte on the other hand...


----------



## Joa3d43

More *Cinebench* fun - F*ast, Faster and REAL Fast*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, that is a hell of a lot of stress for the imc...I run superpi 32m, if it passes with any give settings I choose I'm happy. xD
> Makes sense...


...I remember the first time I ran Cinebench at 5 giggles and got 'oh so close' (10.17) to that Xeon with 8 cores / 16 threads (10.33). Then I delidded and started to beat that Xeon...emphasis on that, not all, Xeons









Here is a YouTube vid of that crazy EVGA SR-X Classified board (a monster that could have gone a lot further if Intel had played ball with LG2011 / 3960x) with two Xeons for a total of 16 cores and 32 threads running Cinebench.
















BTW, you'll notice Intel's Extreme Tuning and OC'ing utility (XTU) on the desktop, because that's what you need to set up serious stuff like that.





and if that isn't fast enough, here is a Google Server node doing Cinebench...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get a black case...black and gold is cool.
> And it reports a bit more than the actual dmm voltage.


What is a bit?

Should I go with the AsRock or the MSI? I don't know if the Maximus V Formula is going to be worth the extra $100 bucks. What would make it worth that extra money?


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Stuff!
> 
> 
> 
> Givent the UP7's price, I personally wouldnt get it unless I knew I was going to drop $1200 on a golden IB chip, and put it under an LN2 pot.
> 
> Maybe one of these:
> 
> ASRock OC Formula ( This is my board, the only way I could be happier is if you bought me a UP7 )
> 
> Gigabyte z77x-UP5 ( Was the board I planned on but got a better deal on the OC Formula )
> 
> MSI z77 mPower ( supposedly hand tested to 4.6ghz )
> 
> The MVF is still a great board. From my reading through other peoples experience, it seems to excel extremely well in memory overclocking capabilities.
> 
> Beyond that, 95% of what you are going to get out of your chip, is going to be because of your chip specifically.
> 
> But I must say, the OC Formula has held the Ivy bridge clock speed record, and has a great bios.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have you tested the OC Formula with a DMM to see how much the voltage is off? With the Extreme4 that I'm selling the voltage was off up to .1v depending on what LLC I was using. The lowest it was off was .03v
Click to expand...

The last I checked I was about 0.02~ off running rather high voltages ( 1.55+ ).

I haven't really checked since as I am pretty confident in its accuracy.

Having gotten a 5.3GHz validation on close to 1.7v was awesome. I think that run was close to 0.03 higher as my readings were a little closer to 1.7v.

I could also only small FFT's on that for like 8 minutes, Chip just wouldn't dstabilize.

I also want to mention I was attempting 5.3 with offset voltage. :|


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hmmm maybe I'll get that then. It's only $205 at newegg right now. As long as the voltage won't be off more than .02 I'll be happy. Then I can buy the Phantom 820 with it! Nice! Now to decide if I want the case in white or black
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any opinions on that?


white


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What is a bit?
> 
> Should I go with the AsRock or the MSI? I don't know if the Maximus V Formula is going to be worth the extra $100 bucks. What would make it worth that extra money?


get the MVF if you ever go 3way sli it will be woth it







i dont think the oc formula can do 3 way sli? if it can i think its only 4x pci-e and that wont be as good as the MVF. please correct me if im wrong.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> The last I checked I was about 0.02~ off running rather high voltages ( 1.55+ ).
> 
> I haven't really checked since as I am pretty confident in its accuracy.
> 
> Having gotten a 5.3GHz validation on close to 1.7v was awesome. I think that run was close to 0.03 higher as my readings were a little closer to 1.7v.
> 
> I could also only small FFT's on that for like 8 minutes, Chip just wouldn't dstabilize.
> 
> I also want to mention I was attempting 5.3 with offset voltage. :|


Well thats not bad at all. As long as I can get an idea of where the voltage is going to be and not have to take my DMM out every single time I change the voltage I will be happy. So should I go with the OC Formula? Also, I'm trying to see if my huge Noctua NH-D14 will fit. I have low profile RAM so that isn't a problem. I'm not seeing it on the Noctua website.

http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=compatibility_gen&products_id=34&lng=en#LGA1155_ASRock

EDIT: NVM I found a picture

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1039512059&postcount=5


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> get the MVF if you ever go 3way sli it will be woth it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i dont think the oc formula can do 3 way sli? if it can i think its only 4x pci-e and that wont be as good as the MVF. please correct me if im wrong.


ASUS MVF - PCI Express 3.0 x163 (x16 or dual x8 or x8/x4/x4)
AsRock Z77 OC Formula - PCI Express 3.0 x162 (x16/x8 or x8/x8)PCI Express 2.0 x161 (x4)

BTW I am crossfire









That is a decent point, but I'm not sure if I will do that. Hmmm more decisions......


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> LOL. Under 1FPS. I like it.
> 
> Does it skew the score?


It must, the score would be much lower if it could have read under 1fps. Here's a run on the gt210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The OC Formula is on another whole new level...can't compare it to cheaper Asrock boards. Think of it as a cheaper MVE.


This ^. Every bencher I know of who has tried it liked it, I had no desire to ever try any asrock board before this one.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> white


I was actually thinking about going white, but I'm a total sucker for gun metal grey. When I got my Subaru STi the first thing I did was paint my rims Gun Metal Grey







Then I added a full turbo back exhaust with a tune, headers, GT35R turbo with all supporting mods, brakes, and suspension ( coilovers, don't worry I would never slam a car like that ). Hoping we will get one more snow fall so I can drift one more time before putting my summer tires back on.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> ASUS MVF - PCI Express 3.0 x163 (x16 or dual x8 or x8/x4/x4)
> AsRock Z77 OC Formula - PCI Express 3.0 x162 (x16/x8 or x8/x8)PCI Express 2.0 x161 (x4)
> 
> BTW I am crossfire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is a decent point, but I'm not sure if I will do that. Hmmm more decisions......


i also want to upgrade my mobo and i like the oc formula a lot but i think i want the extra pci-e slot that the MVF offers. just in case i ever get a 3rd card, bout to get my 2nd 670FTW next week







cant wait


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i also want to upgrade my mobo and i like the oc formula a lot but i think i want the extra pci-e slot that the MVF offers. just in case i ever get a 3rd card, bout to get my 2nd 670FTW next week
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cant wait


The MSI z77 MPower supports 3 way SLI/Crossfire.

What do you guys think of that board?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I was actually thinking about going white, but I'm a total sucker for gun metal grey. When I got my Subaru STi the first thing I did was paint my rims Gun Metal Grey
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then I added a full turbo back exhaust with a tune, headers, GT35R turbo with all supporting mods, brakes, and suspension ( coilovers, don't worry I would never slam a car like that ). Hoping we will get one more snow fall so I can drift one more time before putting my summer tires back on.


i had the best of both on my CBR600rr black and white. CLEAN!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> ASUS MVF - PCI Express 3.0 x163 (x16 or dual x8 or x8/x4/x4)
> AsRock Z77 OC Formula - PCI Express 3.0 x162 (x16/x8 or x8/x8)PCI Express 2.0 x161 (x4)
> 
> BTW I am crossfire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is a decent point, but I'm not sure if I will do that. Hmmm more decisions......


...not sure what the budget is, but if you can go with a MVE (about $360-380), you get x8 x16 x8 x8 for quads, and x8 x16 x8 for tri-SLI


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i also want to upgrade my mobo and i like the oc formula a lot but i think i want the extra pci-e slot that the MVF offers. just in case i ever get a 3rd card, bout to get my 2nd 670FTW next week
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cant wait
> 
> 
> 
> The MSI z77 MPower supports 3 way SLI/Crossfire.
> 
> What do you guys think of that board?
Click to expand...

I adore the board, its one of those I would like to get my own hands on and experience.

I would not purchase it for tri-silly or crossfire really because of the layout and bandwidth limits.

I personally think tri and quad setups are 2011 territory because of the extra PCIe bandwidth.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...not sure what the budget is, but if you can go with a MVE (about $360-380), you get x8 x16 x8 x8 for quads, and x8 x16 x8 for tri-SLI


might as well get the UP7 if i go big like that


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...not sure what the budget is, but if you can go with a MVE (about $360-380), you get x8 x16 x8 x8 for quads, and x8 x16 x8 for tri-SLI


Yea I'm starting to lean more towards the Maximus V Extreme. Hopefully they come out with a fix for that BIOS bug soon. I think I am going to eventually go with three 7950's. What do you guys think of the extreme? I can always just pay off some of my credit card and then buy the case in a week.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> might as well get the UP7 if i go big like that


but I did go big














... http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/14470#post_19563243


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd still get the MVE...cheaper, and proven bioses for oc. UP7 is still in its infancy.

And FtW, sometimes I feel like you're some kind of canuck brother of mine lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I'm starting to lean more towards the Maximus V Extreme. Hopefully they come out with a fix for that BIOS bug soon. I think I am going to eventually go with three 7950's. What do you guys think of the extreme? I can always just pay off some of my credit card and then buy the case in a week.


...that Bios bug is a bit of a myth... I actually did have that happen, but learned how to get around it (am posting that over at ROG Asus first as I already posted there before on it)...It is a Win 7 issue as much as a Bios issue, given that there are Asus programs (even hidden ones) that run in Windows but have direct Bios access. Since I used one simple precaution, it never happened again no matter how crazy my settings were before a crash









EDIT - ...and the MVE comes with *two* full onboard bios' anyways, via a small switch


----------



## ivanlabrie

It seems that Google server cinebench score is shopped man...That chip is 1155 socket, limited to 32gb max ram size. Desktop 1155 xeon.
Look at my team mate's cinebench score here


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It seems that Google server cinebench score is shopped man...That chip is 1155 socket, limited to 32gb max ram size. Desktop 1155 xeon.
> Look at my team mate's cinebench score here


...even if it isn't shopped, per PM with someone else just now, it couldn't be used anyhow for any record stuff because the machines ;'have to be legally in your possession'

..congrats on the HWBot Cinebench !!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd still get the MVE...cheaper, and proven bioses for oc. UP7 is still in its infancy.
> 
> And FtW, sometimes I feel like you're some kind of canuck brother of mine lol


Great minds think alike!
Or just a benching guy thing. What bencher doesn't like good boards, nice memory, & when away from the rig, short shorts...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It seems that Google server cinebench score is shopped man...That chip is 1155 socket, limited to 32gb max ram size. Desktop 1155 xeon.
> Look at my team mate's cinebench score here


The google server system would have some serious power, I don't doubt there are machines out there that can do that. But do that for a legit hwbot score isn't too likely.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I'm thinking of going with the Maximus V Extreme just to really future proof myself because I definetly am going to eventually run three 7950's and water cool and all of that. Also, going to buy another 3770k at some point. Plus the thing is just bad to the bone. I was thinking about the up7, but it really is just in its infancy right now I think that is what I will buy.

So................

What do you guys think?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I'm thinking of going with the Maximus V Extreme just to really future proof myself because I definetly am going to eventually run three 7950's and water cool and all of that. Also, going to buy another 3770k at some point. Plus the thing is just bad to the bone. I was thinking about the up7, but it really is just in its infancy right now I think that is what I will buy.
> 
> So................
> 
> What do you guys think?


....per previous post ^^^ above ... great minds think alike


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Great minds think alike!
> Or just a benching guy thing. What bencher doesn't like good boards, nice memory, & when away from the rig, short shorts...
> The google server system would have some serious power, I don't doubt there are machines out there that can do that. But do that for a legit hwbot score isn't too likely.


Yeah, you could submit and agree to not receive points for that submission.









I think it's a bencher thing, not many of us around...although we got a few more guys interested lately. I like those open comps for that, got me hooked up a while ago and you learn about efficiency and stuff.
I also hate when a record gets published as front page news, and people start saying "what's the point? is that thing 24/7 stable?" and what not.








"Benching is boring, pressing a key and watching a bench play doesn't involve skill"


----------



## KuuFA

If you are going to go 3 way CFX/SLI you should seriously consider going 2011 for the PCIE lanes. Adding a PLX chip just gives you more latency. IMO. and I would go for the MVE as well. I have 2 Gene's a IV and a V I love them both. But if it were me and I knew I was going to go 3 way CFX/SLI I would go 2011.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, you could submit and agree to not receive points for that submission.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it's a bencher thing, not many of us around...although we got a few more guys interested lately. I like those open comps for that, got me hooked up a while ago and you learn about efficiency and stuff.
> I also hate when a record gets published as front page news, and people start saying "what's the point? is that thing 24/7 stable?" and what not.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Benching is boring, pressing a key and watching a bench play doesn't involve skill"


^^^







...I get goosebumps when I try a bench with settings right on the edge which has a 70% chance of failing, but then works anyways...just better be stable long enough to get the HWBot required screenshots, CPU-Z et al. Besides, every single work related machine I touch has gone through some crazy benching first...if it behaved perfectly at 53% above stock settings, I know it will do just fine for many years at stock, or even slightly beyond...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, you could submit and agree to not receive points for that submission.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it's a bencher thing, not many of us around...although we got a few more guys interested lately. I like those open comps for that, got me hooked up a while ago and you learn about efficiency and stuff.
> I also hate when a record gets published as front page news, and people start saying "what's the point? is that thing 24/7 stable?" and what not.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Benching is boring, pressing a key and watching a bench play doesn't involve skill"


Those posts used to bug me too. I would comment now & then to the effect of 'why post to say this doesn't interest you? If it's boring, click back & read something interesting.'
One of the mods pointed out that if it wasn't for the people who don't get it & comment anyway, there would be a news post followed by a couple of posts saying 'nice' or 'cool' that would get lost down the page in no time so no one would see it anymore.

So now I try to look at it like that, at least the people complaining keep it bumped so I can see it there when I log in.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, didn't think of it that way...









Need a benching gpu, cheep, decent boints. Someone send me free cards lol I can bake or repair them.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok well it is final! I'm getting the MVE!!! It's going to be so nice owning such a nice board! Do you think I should upgrade my RAM? I'm only running Corsair Vengeance DDR3 1600 Low Profile. Should I get some high quality "platinum" RAM? Any suggestions? I want to upgrade everything in my rig to the very high quality for the most optimal performace.

I'm not looking for anything super expensive. I'm not too knowledged in RAM but I think 2400 or 2133 would be a little of an improvement right? Would this affect my CPU overclocks in a positive or negative way?

Also, a lower latency is better, right? My current RAM is at 9-9-9-24 2N so should I look for something similar to that except at a 2133 speed?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok well it is final! I'm getting the MVE!!! It's going to be so nice owning such a nice board! Do you think I should upgrade my RAM? I'm only running Corsair Vengeance DDR3 1600 Low Profile. Should I get some high quality "platinum" RAM? Any suggestions? I want to upgrade everything in my rig to the very high quality for the most optimal performace.


...again, a question of budget etc, but the MVE (I run it) will pay you back royally on RAM...it has several different pre-set 'modes' for any type of RAM...1600 is a good start, but if you can go for at least 8 if not 16GB 2400 (or even higher), that board will put you at a whole different level...and in its Bios, Ram settings go up to 3200 MHz









...also leave a few bucks over for a SSD as a boot / game drive if you can...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok well it is final! I'm getting the MVE!!! It's going to be so nice owning such a nice board! Do you think I should upgrade my RAM? I'm only running Corsair Vengeance DDR3 1600 Low Profile. Should I get some high quality "platinum" RAM? Any suggestions? I want to upgrade everything in my rig to the very high quality for the most optimal performace.
> 
> I'm not looking for anything super expensive. I'm not too knowledged in RAM but I think 2400 or 2133 would be a little of an improvement right? Would this affect my CPU overclocks in a positive or negative way?
> 
> Also, a lower latency is better, right? My current RAM is at 9-9-9-24 2N so should I look for something similar to that except at a 2133 speed?


i would get these!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...that Bios bug is a bit of a myth... I actually did have that happen, but learned how to get around it (am posting that over at ROG Asus first as I already posted there before on it)...It is a Win 7 issue as much as a Bios issue, given that there are Asus programs (even hidden ones) that run in Windows but have direct Bios access. Since I used one simple precaution, it never happened again no matter how crazy my settings were before a crash
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT - ...and the MVE comes with *two* full onboard bios' anyways, via a small switch


Would you care to share this secret? haha

So could I just switch BIOS's and then switch back to solve the BIOS bug with the MVE?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would get these!
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285


Well I need low-profile RAM because of my Noctua NH-D14 lol. Maybe I should just wait until I upgrade to water cooling to get new RAM?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Would you care to share this secret? haha
> 
> So could I just switch BIOS's and then switch back to solve the BIOS bug with the MVE?


...I'll PM it to you tomorrow as I promised to post it elsewhere first









...as to Bios switching, if it would be a straightforward Bios bug, you could do that...but it isn't that...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well I need low-profile RAM because of my Noctua NH-D14 lol. Maybe I should just wait until I upgrade to water cooling to get new RAM?


yea thats true but those are pretty







. i would take those any day over my 2400mhz gskill tridents10-12 12-31-n2. my timming suck and i cant tighten them. but then again i dont no how to oc them that great either. neede 1.7 for 9-11-11-30 @ 2400 still not stable


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would get these!
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285
> 
> 
> 
> Well I need low-profile RAM because of my Noctua NH-D14 lol. Maybe I should just wait until I upgrade to water cooling to get new RAM?
Click to expand...

Plan on going with water? I just feel like the board is getting wasted on a D14.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well I need low-profile RAM because of my Noctua NH-D14 lol. Maybe I should just wait until I upgrade to water cooling to get new RAM?


Much of the time the top part of the heatspreader can be removed, I haven't taken my platinum sticks apart but I did take the top of the trident X off so they could get in & out of the slots while a d14 is mounted. They barely fit, but they fit.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'll PM it to you tomorrow as I promised to post it elsewhere first
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...as to Bios switching, if it would be a straightforward Bios bug, you could do that...but it isn't that...


Oh my god I'm so curious now haha. Please PM me when you get a chance. Thanks! Much appreciated!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Plan on going with water? I just feel like the board is getting wasted on a D14.


Oh yes most definetly putting my two (probably three by the time I save up enough) 7950's and 3770k under water. Just want to save up a decent amount of money for a custom loop first. All I need now is a new case and I will be all set. I already have three SSD's so I'm all set with that. I'm happy with my graphics cards and PSU. So after I pay off my credit card and purchase the 820 case all my savings will be towards a custom loop. I will probably end up buying a new chip at some point though. I'm a little unhappy with the one I have now. My second Ivy. A little better than my first, but not by all means considered "good". Its pointless to put it under water because to get it stable at 4.9Ghz I would have to probably use 1.6v possibly higher. 4.8Ghz takes 1.531v and temps get to 87c after 14 hours of p95. So I just settled for 4.5Ghz for now at 1.3v until I get my new motherboard and see how it performs on it. I'm sure it won't be much better, but I'm definetly going to mess around and try 4.8Ghz again.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Plan on going with water? I just feel like the board is getting wasted on a D14.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh yes most definetly putting my two (probably three by the time I save up enough) 7950's and 3770k under water. Just want to save up a decent amount of money for a custom loop first. All I need now is a new case and I will be all set. I already have three SSD's so I'm all set with that. I'm happy with my graphics cards and PSU. So after I pay off my credit card and purchase the 820 case all my savings will be towards a custom loop. I will probably end up buying a new chip at some point though. I'm a little unhappy with the one I have now. My second Ivy. A little better than my first, but not by all means considered "good". Its pointless to put it under water because to get it stable at 4.9Ghz I would have to probably use 1.6v possibly higher. 4.8Ghz takes 1.531v and temps get to 87c after 14 hours of p95. So I just settled for 4.5Ghz for now at 1.3v until I get my new motherboard and see how it performs on it. I'm sure it won't be much better, but I'm definetly going to mess around and try 4.8Ghz again.
Click to expand...

Good deal!

I am glad to hear you have big plans for that board.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Much of the time the top part of the heatspreader can be removed, I haven't taken my platinum sticks apart but I did take the top of the trident X off so they could get in & out of the slots while a d14 is mounted. They barely fit, but they fit.


Yea I actually did see a mod for that. I know how to use a dremel so it shouldn't be too complicated hah


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh yes most definetly putting my two (probably three by the time I save up enough) 7950's and 3770k under water. Just want to save up a decent amount of money for a custom loop first. All I need now is a new case and I will be all set. I already have three SSD's so I'm all set with that. I'm happy with my graphics cards and PSU. So after I pay off my credit card and purchase the 820 case all my savings will be towards a custom loop. I will probably end up buying a new chip at some point though. I'm a little unhappy with the one I have now. My second Ivy. A little better than my first, but not by all means considered "good". Its pointless to put it under water because to get it stable at 4.9Ghz I would have to probably use 1.6v possibly higher. 4.8Ghz takes 1.531v and temps get to 87c after 14 hours of p95. So I just settled for 4.5Ghz for now at 1.3v until I get my new motherboard and see how it performs on it. I'm sure it won't be much better, but I'm definetly going to mess around and try 4.8Ghz again.


it took me like 3 weeks to get 5ghz stable on my asrock extreme 4. It was a pain, i was so sure i needed 1.38v to be stable and the higher i went the faster it crashed. (0x000124) i was so pissed i wanted to buy a new board , i thought my board was not good enough for 5ghz.. anyway's i reinstalled windows and ran this my first try! i promise you


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






and after all that i decided to buy another 670ftw instead of a new mobo. but i still want to upgrade to the MVF with water cooling! becuse my current board is just not good enough for my chip. period! lolz


----------



## quark004

for overclocks >4.5 is offset method ok ?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *quark004*
> 
> for overclocks >4.5 is offset method ok ?


i use offset for 5ghz just fine.








but i dont like you lolz you got a 100 in bf3 i hate those guys they always kill me i get so pissed! lolz


----------



## quark004

how much volts you are using for 5 ghz


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i use offset for 5ghz just fine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i dont like you lolz you got a 100 in bf3 i hate those guys they always kill me i get so pissed! lolz


haha me too


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *quark004*
> 
> how much volts you are using for 5 ghz


i ran prime 95 @ 1.368v-1.386v but had a few whea errors in prime95 and a few games so i upped it to 1.386v-1.406v @ full load to get rid of whea errors


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'll PM it to you tomorrow as I promised to post it elsewhere first
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...as to Bios switching, if it would be a straightforward Bios bug, you could do that...but it isn't that...


plz pm me too. I cant figure it out, I was playing with lower Vcore for 48x 49x 50x and must have rebooted 50 times, only needed to reflash my bios once. but not prob cause I got a flash drive with that and my profiles pluged-in all the time.

HEY RAVAGE- Im glad to see you went with ASUS you wont be sending that one back








Joa3d43 - thank +rep in advance!















*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


----------



## quark004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i ran prime 95 @ 1.368v-1.386v but had a few whea errors in prime95 and a few games so i upped it to 1.386v-1.406v @ full load to get rid of whea errors


guess i have a bad chip mine need 1.35 for 4.5ghz. I hate guyz like you .


----------



## Ali Man

The higher the OC goes, the harder it gets to OC with offset voltage. Personally, it's too much of a hassle, I only use offsets till max 4.6Ghz.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *quark004*
> 
> guess i have a bad chip mine need 1.35 for 4.5ghz. I hate guyz like you .


OMG I though I was the one getting the worst chips off the shelf!
I only tried 1 3570k & it was bad enough that I never bothered to try another one.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> plz pm me too. I cant figure it out, I was playing with lower Vcore for 48x 49x 50x and must have rebooted 50 times, only needed to reflash my bios once. but not prob cause I got a flash drive with that and my profiles pluged-in all the time.
> 
> HEY RAVAGE- Im glad to see you went with ASUS you wont be sending that one back
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Joa3d43 - thank +rep in advance!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


...will do, but your post actually (kind of) has the answer in it...when I do this tomorrow, I'm afraid I am going to sound like your mother about 'wearing that extra scarf in those Minnesota winters', then again, what I know is how to keep it from happening...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *quark004*
> 
> guess i have a bad chip mine need 1.35 for 4.5ghz. I hate guyz like you .


lol its all good







i just played bf3 the past 45 min and i cant take sometimes


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would get these!
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yea thats true but those are pretty
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . i would take those any day over my 2400mhz gskill tridents10-12 12-31-n2. my timming suck and i cant tighten them. but then again i dont no how to oc them that great either. neede 1.7 for 9-11-11-30 @ 2400 still not stable


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231638









The top fin is removable, fits with the color scheme and has decent bin samsung ic's.









EDIT: btw, my new chips kinda sucks...haven't tested thoroughly yet, but won't boot with anything lower than 1.19v at 4.5ghz. wprime crashes instantly, so I need moar vcore it seems. Haven't tested imc yet, running xmp atm.

I give up, forget 2d benching...I'm installing win 7 and gpu drivers now, gonna see if I can get better clocks using XTU after booting at 4.5ghz and 1.19v.
If I can get 5ghz from within Windows I'll call it a day.


----------



## ryboto

Got my CLP...between skiing, and trying to lift an engine into the hatch of my car, I'm not sure when I'll have time to pop the top!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> OMG I though I was the one getting the worst chips off the shelf!
> I only tried 1 3570k & it was bad enough that I never bothered to try another one.


Ok, I know this is going to sound crazy, but my first 3570k took 1.39v with my AsRock Z77 Extreme4 to do stable for longer than two hours. Knowing my Extreme4, a Level 2 LLC makes the board report vcore .1v off so the voltage was really 1.49v...........


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...will do, but your post actually (kind of) has the answer in it...when I do this tomorrow, I'm afraid I am going to sound like your mother about 'wearing that extra scarf in those Minnesota winters', then again, what I know is how to keep it from happening...


Do you have to change the multiplier down and then back up before you exit the BIOS? Also, REP for you in advance.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Guys what do you think about the CORSAIR Hydro Series H90 Water Cooler? I'm thinking of getting a decent WC with my MOBO, but I would only have like $120 to spend on it at the most. Would I be dissapointmed coming from a Noctua NH-D14? I was also looking at the Thermaltake CLW0217 Water 2.0 Extreme/All-In-One Liquid Cooling System and the CORSAIR Hydro Series H100i Water Cooler too. I guess I could just buy the H100i and see how it performs and if I don't like it I could just get a refund. I just want to free up space around my CPU. I love my Noctua, it's just that it gets in the way of my RAM and it just covers a lot of the motherboard and on the MVE it is going to sit extremely close to my 7950.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It must, the score would be much lower if it could have read under 1fps. Here's a run on the gt210
> 
> This ^. Every bencher I know of who has tried it liked it, I had no desire to ever try any asrock board before this one.


The Z77 OC Formula board is great on itself but suffers from the same issue as the cheaper AsRock Z77 boards: Vcore reporting is off by miles.

On my OC Formula the vcore reporting is off by 0.03-0.04.

Not as bad as my E4 was (nearly 0.1 off) but it is still off way too much for 240€ board.

Other than that it is a decent board and the water cooling for mosfets is the only reason I bought it.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> The higher the OC goes, the harder it gets to OC with offset voltage. Personally, it's too much of a hassle, I only use offsets till max 4.6Ghz.


This is incorrect for my mobo, but I understand that some mobos are not crazy about offset. There is zero difference for me to stabilize 5.0 for 24/7 with manual or offset voltage. Nothing is 100%, but when I say stable I mean 24+ hours of Prime95 and XTU, as well as using it everyday for normal use with zero instabilities or WHEA.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Guys what do you think about the CORSAIR Hydro Series H90 Water Cooler? I'm thinking of getting a decent WC with my MOBO, but I would only have like $120 to spend on it at the most. Would I be dissapointmed coming from a Noctua NH-D14?


Get the H220, it is $140 but you can save up and expand it to cool your gpus later. Just get a case that can fit at least a 240 and a 360 rad.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> This is incorrect for my mobo, but I understand that some mobos are not crazy about offset. There is zero difference for me to stabilize 5.0 for 24/7 with manual or offset voltage. Nothing is 100%, but when I say stable I mean 24+ hours of Prime95 and XTU, as well as using it everyday for normal use with zero instabilities or WHEA.
> Get the H220, it is $140 but you can save up and expand it to cool your gpus later. Just get a case that can fit at least a 240 and a 360 rad.


I think I might actually go with the H100i. It looks like a good start for me to jump into the game without blowing too much money.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I think I might actually go with the H100i. It looks like a good start for me to jump into the game without blowing too much money.


H100 is pretty awful though, you should look at spending your money better.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I think I might actually go with the H100i. It looks like a good start for me to jump into the game without blowing too much money.


I have directly compared the H100i to the H220. It is pretty simple, if you want to expand the loop for a gpu or two, then you have to get the H220. If you will just cool the cpu and never expand then the H100i can work for you. Their cpu cooling capabilities are very similar.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I have directly compared the H100i to the H220. It is pretty simple, if you want to expand the loop for a gpu or two, then you have to get the H220. If you will just cool the cpu and never expand then the H100i can work for you. Their cpu cooling capabilities are very similar.


Yea I ordered the H100i. As long as it is as good as my Noctua I will be happy. I just want more space which in turn will provide more airflow and allow me to use RAM with fins that I don't have to cut off and void the warranty. Wow, I have so much stuff to sell when I get my 35 rep haha. I have my 212 EVO, Noctua NH-D14, AsRock Z77 Extreme 4, and my Seasonic M12II 620 Bronze. This pile keeps getting bigger and bigger I can't wait to get some money back.


----------



## BradleyW

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I ordered the H100i. As long as it is as good as my Noctua I will be happy. I just want more space which in turn will provide more airflow and allow me to use RAM with fins that I don't have to cut off and void the warranty. Wow, I have so much stuff to sell when I get my 35 rep haha. I have my 212 EVO, Noctua NH-D14, AsRock Z77 Extreme 4, and my Seasonic M12II 620 Bronze. This pile keeps getting bigger and bigger I can't wait to get some money back.


I've just ordered an H100i as well.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BradleyW*
> 
> I've just ordered an H100i as well.


Nice!! I'm definetly going to let everyone know what I think of it and you should do the same. I'd like to compare temps. So I ordered the ASUS MVE and the H100i and next week I'm going to order my Phantom 820 in Gun Metal Grey and I should be all set!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Guys what do you think about the CORSAIR Hydro Series H90 Water Cooler? I'm thinking of getting a decent WC with my MOBO, but I would only have like $120 to spend on it at the most. Would I be dissapointmed coming from a Noctua NH-D14? I was also looking at the Thermaltake CLW0217 Water 2.0 Extreme/All-In-One Liquid Cooling System and the CORSAIR Hydro Series H100i Water Cooler too. I guess I could just buy the H100i and see how it performs and if I don't like it I could just get a refund. I just want to free up space around my CPU. I love my Noctua, it's just that it gets in the way of my RAM and it just covers a lot of the motherboard and on the MVE it is going to sit extremely close to my 7950.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I think I might actually go with the H100i. It looks like a good start for me to jump into the game without blowing too much money.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Nice!! I'm definetly going to let everyone know what I think of it and you should do the same. I'd like to compare temps. So I ordered the ASUS MVE and the H100i and next week I'm going to order my Phantom 820 in Gun Metal Grey and I should be all set!


What's with you peeps and the H100i???







H220 would have been much better in the long run (if you intented to do a full loop)

Ok, imc is not too bad. 4x2gb 2400mhz cl9-11-9-28-1t relatively decent subs...I'm gonna go for max mhz with single stick now.
Cpu cores are kinda ***gish, they need a lot of juice for 4.5ghz, but still stay relatively cool without delidding (which is odd, and kinda sucks)


----------



## Jsunn

Hello All,

I DE-Lidded my 3770K last night and it was pretty easy, I just took my time and followed the guides posted here. No scratches or bends to the PCB or CPU die.

I used CL Pro, that stuff is kinda hard to work with but I got a pretty good temp drop at full load.







~10 deg.

I'll post some screen shots a little later.

Thanks again for the info!











-Jason


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> I DE-Lidded my 3770K last night and it was pretty easy, I just took my time and followed the guides posted here. No scratches or bends to the PCB or CPU die.
> 
> I used CL Pro, that stuff is kinda hard to work with but I got a pretty good temp drop at full load.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~10 deg.
> 
> I'll post some screen shots a little later.
> 
> Thanks again for the info!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Jason


Good job! Did you go back with the IHS or keep it lidless?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> I DE-Lidded my 3770K last night and it was pretty easy, I just took my time and followed the guides posted here. No scratches or bends to the PCB or CPU die.
> 
> I used CL Pro, that stuff is kinda hard to work with but I got a pretty good temp drop at full load.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~10 deg.
> 
> I'll post some screen shots a little later.
> 
> Thanks again for the info!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Jason


Very nice! Congrats man









Well, imc keeps going up...just got 5.2 points for my 2600mhz submission lol
Shooting for 3ghz nao!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> I DE-Lidded my 3770K last night and it was pretty easy, I just took my time and followed the guides posted here. No scratches or bends to the PCB or CPU die.
> 
> I used CL Pro, that stuff is kinda hard to work with but I got a pretty good temp drop at full load.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~10 deg.
> 
> I'll post some screen shots a little later.
> 
> Thanks again for the info!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Jason


Congrats man! Looks like you did a nice clean job. I used liquid ultra liquid ultra because it is a lot easier to spread and make a nice clean finish. Also beware if you put it on top of the IHS where the heatsink is because it tends to bond with some metals


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> What's with you peeps and the H100i???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> H220 would have been much better in the long run (if you intented to do a full loop)
> 
> Ok, imc is not too bad. 4x2gb 2400mhz cl9-11-9-28-1t relatively decent subs...I'm gonna go for max mhz with single stick now.
> Cpu cores are kinda ***gish, they need a lot of juice for 4.5ghz, but still stay relatively cool without delidding (which is odd, and kinda sucks)


Don't hate man. And did you really just use the word "***gish"? Id refrain from using that type of language as to not offend everyone. Also, when I go to a full water loop in a year or so I'm going to replace it with something better and just sell it. I just wanted something that was cheap, good, and simple until then. So I think this will do the job just fine.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Don't hate man. And did you really just use the word "***gish"? Id refrain from using that type of language as to not offend everyone. Also, when I go to a full water loop in a year or so I'm going to replace it with something better and just sell it. I just wanted something that was cheap, good, and simple until then. So I think this will do the job just fine.


Just fooling around with y'all, no offense intended...It's just that I fail to see the value of an h100i when you have a D14 already. If I were you I would have gone straight to the h220 or kept the d14, which performs on par with an h100i anyway.


----------



## jdm317

I was just wondering, could you guys on water and CLP/CLU let me know what your temps are at with 1.4-1.45v. Thanks in advance.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Just fooling around with y'all, no offense intended...It's just that I fail to see the value of an h100i when you have a D14 already. If I were you I would have gone straight to the h220 or kept the d14, which performs on par with an h100i anyway.


Yea I wasn't trying start anything with you I just know your a good guy and I didn't want anyone to get mad at you. The main reason I wanted to get the h100I was for SPACE so I could see the beautiful mobo through the case window and have the option to upgrade RAM without modding anything. I want something that performs the same or better than my Noctua so I think I made the right choice for the time being.


----------



## lilchronic

yea i will be selling my h100 soon and gettting the H220


----------



## sbruno624

Just got finished doing mine waiting for my motherboard to arrive... Scariest 10 minutes of my life, chip looks clean thank god. I had an ifixit kit laying around, the scratch free pry bars work wonders for scraping off the rubber off the pcb and heatsink.


----------



## Swag

Someone backed up into my car yesterday and now there's a small dent on the passenger side doors.







I'm going to try the plunger method right now, any other ideas while I'm gone doing this?


----------



## Belial

omg so I'm getting WHEA errors in streaming, fairly quickly, on slow preset.

Hopefully it's because of my faulty PSU, and not an unstable overclock ;/


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> omg so I'm getting WHEA errors in streaming, fairly quickly, on slow preset.
> 
> Hopefully it's because of my faulty PSU, and not an unstable overclock ;/


How could that be because of cpu is beyond me


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> omg so I'm getting WHEA errors in streaming, fairly quickly, on slow preset.
> 
> Hopefully it's because of my faulty PSU, and not an unstable overclock ;/


Neither one of those situations sound good. Why not get a new PSU?


----------



## chefproject

Like i promised some pics of the delidding action









OCN name: chefproject
CPU: 3570k
On-die TIM:Zalman Thermal grease (CLU is ordered)
IHS TIM: Zalman
Mhz gained:
OC after delid: http://valid.canardpc.com/2705753 4,8 ghz same as before
Temp drops: none until now will test again when CLU arrives






Greetings and regards Chef


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> *What's with you peeps and the H100i???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> H220 would have been much better in the long run (if you intented to do a full loop)
> *
> Ok, imc is not too bad. 4x2gb 2400mhz cl9-11-9-28-1t relatively decent subs...I'm gonna go for max mhz with single stick now.
> Cpu cores are kinda ***gish, they need a lot of juice for 4.5ghz, but still stay relatively cool without delidding (which is odd, and kinda sucks)


Or you just build a full custom loop to begin with if you want to water cool and stay away from the closed loop stuff alltogether.

Thought if the H220 is fully upgradeable then I guess it might be a decent starting point if the CPU block is decent atleast.


----------



## ivanlabrie

The block is quite good...not sure if you've seen Martin's review.It's a quality product, built by a company that actually makes wc stuff, and not a rebranded gemeric unit...comes at a slight premium though.


----------



## tzvia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> I was just wondering, could you guys on water and CLP/CLU let me know what your temps are at with 1.4-1.45v. Thanks in advance.


I'm on water with offset voltage +.15, 1.423vcore. Temp hovers around 68~70c in a 21~23c room on my clu covered delidded 3770k at 4.8 Priming small ffts.


----------



## Ali Man

^^ Yea I can confirm that, it basically depends all on your cooling solution.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> I was just wondering, could you guys on water and CLP/CLU let me know what your temps are at with 1.4-1.45v. Thanks in advance.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> I'm on water with offset voltage +.15, 1.423vcore. Temp hovers around 68~70c in a 21~23c room on my clu covered delidded 3770k at 4.8 Priming small ffts
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Ok thanks. Yeah the room im in is about 26-28°C, its an added room that doesnt cool off as well as the rest of the house. 1.47v at 5ghz after wPrime1024 i was getting about 95°C on a koolance 380i with 480mm of rad using CLP, so I knew something wasnt right. Turns out I had the thing tightened down way too much. Im running without the lid and without the socket clamp so I guess I over compensated. Loosened it way off, temps dropped down to 85°C load, down from 95°. For my ambient temps and being at 1.47v id say I have it down closer to where it should be. Still too high for my liking, but ivy is just one hot bee-otch. Ill see how she does tonight when the temps drop.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> I'm on water with offset voltage +.15, 1.423vcore. Temp hovers around 68~70c in a 21~23c room on my clu covered delidded 3770k at 4.8 Priming small ffts.


I'm on water with offset voltage +.260, 1.352 vcore. Temps Cores#1-4...59c,64c,67c,69c on my clu covered delidded 3770k at 4.8 Cinabench 9.73







*"Yeah, my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> I'm on water with offset voltage +.15, 1.423vcore. Temp hovers around 68~70c in a 21~23c room on my clu covered delidded 3770k at 4.8 Priming small ffts.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm on water with offset voltage +.260, 1.352 vcore. Temps Cores#1-4...59c,64c,67c,69c on my clu covered delidded 3770k at 4.8 Cinabench 9.73
Click to expand...

Im on water with offset +0.050, 1.442 vcore. Temps 77c,87c,88c,87c on my CLU covered delidded 3770K at 4.9 in a room that is currently 25c+ with IBT MAX.

L:[


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> plz pm me too. I cant figure it out, I was playing with lower Vcore for 48x 49x 50x and must have rebooted 50 times, only needed to reflash my bios once. but not prob cause I got a flash drive with that and my profiles pluged-in all the time.
> 
> HEY RAVAGE- Im glad to see you went with ASUS you wont be sending that one back
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Joa3d43 - thank +rep in advance!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


Ravage and TonicX...haven't forgotten about you...just got in from several hours at the dentist - what a lovely time (not really)...been trying to post at the other site first, and keep on getting this: _Internal Server Error - Read The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was unable to complete your request. Reference #3.aa01e78e.1363999557.d07b2a0_ I guess I'm not the only one with a crazy day...will definitely follow up later


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> Like i promised some pics of the delidding action
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: chefproject
> CPU: 3570k
> On-die TIM:Zalman Thermal grease (CLU is ordered)
> IHS TIM: Zalman
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid: http://valid.canardpc.com/2705753 4,8 ghz same as before
> Temp drops: none until now will test again when CLU arrives
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greetings and regards Chef


Added but your CPUz is having issues for me. just give me a link when you redo it


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Added but your CPUz is having issues for me. just give me a link when you redo it


This?

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2705753


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Or you just build a full custom loop to begin with if you want to water cool and stay away from the closed loop stuff alltogether.
> 
> Thought if the H220 is fully upgradeable then I guess it might be a decent starting point if the CPU block is decent atleast.


...as far as that goes, I think the H220 is a very decent unit, though the H100i is also a big improvement over the original H100..but after heaving run another decent closed-loop (ThermalTake 2 Extreme w/240mm rad) on my 'play system' since last fall, I finally switched to a full custom loop and they're not even comparable temp wise - so dramatic is the difference. Mind you, the custom loop was designed to be a bit overkill for cooling just a single CPU.

...while the H220 can be expanded (for extra $) to cool GPUs, the question is how many...per an earlier post I did on this, a well running 3770k will consume around 200 watt+ on full load = 200 watts of heat energy @5GHz. By the time you add in a good GPU, you just added another 175-200 watts of heat energy...with a dual GPU / single card (690, 7990) it is somewhere between an extra 330 to over 400 watt on max load... after playing Crysis or BF3 for an hour, things might get toasty....and now your H220 has to handle triple or more the original heat load.

...so while the H220 can accommodate a GPU, how many can you add, and should you. If it is two separate GPU cards, you might also start to see some serious pump losses, according to posts by H 220 owners elsewhere...which can be alleviated by installing an additional pump...but then you are looking at a system that cost way more than a custom loop but gives you less.

...I now run the original Thermaltake 2 extreme custom loop on one of the 3770 (non-K) in my VM...performing flawlessly as always.....BUT like all such units (incl H220, H100i, Thermaltake etc), the pump is integrated directly into the CPU water block - and I don't actually like that. First, it adds a bit more weight in a vertical position, but far, far more importantly, all these pumps vibrate just a bit - just put your finger on it when they run - and *I don't like my CPU die and the pins having a vibrator (







) wiggle them all day long*. I prefer the idea of the pump being mounted (and rubber insulated) away from the CPU which leaves a much lighter, non-vibrating water block attached to the CPU.

...does Swiftech make great WC components ? Yup, and more than half my custom loop involves Swiftech parts. But Asetek which makes most of the pump / block components for many of the other closed-loop brands out there also has a good track record - and that's what Intel chose for the Intel closed-loop cooler.

I would think that for CPU-only cooling, a closed-loop is the right way for many folks...adding in GPUs however raises a few more red flags, at least if it is more than one. And whether closed-loop or custom-loop, I would think it is better to keep GPU and CPU loops apart, unless you have something like Hokies83 who has so much cooling power in a big system, what with 4x 360 montsa rads and, ahem, VERY MANY fans


----------



## ivanlabrie

Don't cry...4.5ghz 1.4v, 86c air. Not delidded.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Don't cry...4.5ghz 1.4v, 86c air. Not delidded.


...your new chip you kept at your mother-in-law's place


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Don't cry...4.5ghz 1.4v, 86c air. Not delidded.


My first 3570 was like that. How's the IMC?


----------



## Belial

I have a question about power draw-

So in hw-info, my VRM (z77x-ud5h) shows power draw:


Like what do these numbers mean? Can I figure out how much my CPU wattage is based on those numbers? If not, are they close (like software vcore and 12v/3.3v/5v rail readings aren't 100% accurate but they are close)? How do you get your actual cpu wattage then?

Thanks.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have a question about power draw-
> 
> So in hw-info, my VRM (z77x-ud5h) shows power draw:
> 
> 
> Like what do these numbers mean? Can I figure out how much my CPU wattage is based on those numbers? If not, are they close (like software vcore and 12v/3.3v/5v rail readings aren't 100% accurate but they are close)? How do you get your actual cpu wattage then?
> 
> Thanks.


...software watt readings tends to be somewhat inaccurate (unfortunately)...try a Multi-meter on the board itself...and hard OCers also use a kill-a-watt meter (around $20) that goes between your system and the wall power outlet..

...here are two pics from Sin0822's Ivy OC guide which you can use as guide posts


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...
> I would think that for CPU-only cooling, a closed-loop is the right way for many folks...adding in GPUs however raises a few more red flags, at least if it is more than one. And whether closed-loop or custom-loop, I would think it is better to keep GPU and CPU loops apart, unless you have something like Hokies83 who has so much cooling power in a big system, what with 4x 360 montsa rads and, ahem, VERY MANY fans


We are still waiting for more people to expand the H220, there have been so few that I am not sure we can draw any conclusions yet. I completely agree though that if you want the best temps or have three video cards then custom is the way to go. For one or two cards, and reasonably good temps, then the H220 is perfect for people who are not ready for the leap to full custom.

I have half my stuff to expand one of my H220 units sitting here (a little frustrating that I can't do anything with it) but the rest will not be here until next week. I have a lot of temp data on my chip and gpu so I will be able to tell pretty quickly how the H220 does with a 690. At the show, Swiftech showed the H220 doing well with two video cards but they had three rads in the loop. I was told by water coolers here that you should expect to need one rad per component cooled with the H220.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Ravage and TonicX...haven't forgotten about you...just got in from several hours at the dentist - what a lovely time (not really)...been trying to post at the other site first, and keep on getting this: _Internal Server Error - Read The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was unable to complete your request. Reference #3.aa01e78e.1363999557.d07b2a0_ I guess I'm not the only one with a crazy day...will definitely follow up later


Ok thanks for not forgetting about us! Just tell us whenever you do what you have to do







Thanks!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sbruno624*
> 
> Just got finished doing mine waiting for my motherboard to arrive... Scariest 10 minutes of my life, chip looks clean thank god. I had an ifixit kit laying around, the scratch free pry bars work wonders for scraping off the rubber off the pcb and heatsink.


This is a cool little trick

http://diy-auto-repair.wonderhowto.com/how-to/fix-your-car-dent-with-hair-dryer-127450/4

Doesnt damage paint.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> Like i promised some pics of the delidding action
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: chefproject
> CPU: 3570k
> On-die TIM:Zalman Thermal grease (CLU is ordered)
> IHS TIM: Zalman
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid: http://valid.canardpc.com/2705753 4,8 ghz same as before
> Temp drops: none until now will test again when CLU arrives
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greetings and regards Chef


Great job! Especially with the glue on the pcb. Very clean!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I've been doing some reading on the H100i and I hear that the backplate tends to be a little loose after installation. Can anyone confirm this?? It really isn't a problem because I could just go buy some rubber washers to stack on the backplate so it is seated better.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I've been doing some reading on the H100i and I hear that the backplate tends to be a little loose after installation. Can anyone confirm this?? It really isn't a problem because I could just go buy some rubber washers to stack on the backplate so it is seated better.


I used q-tips.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...your new chip you kept at your mother-in-law's place


Yeah...can't replace it again so I'm stuck with it. Gonna serve well as my main chip for my gaming rig.
I decided to build a test bench and get a different cpu for that. Gonna take me a while to save, but I might be able to muster some cash for a benching only rig. I already got great ddr3 and an MVG. A pot incoming (KPC Dragon F1) and plenty of time to start a project like that during the weekends. It would imply taking the MVG out of my cm 690 for benching outside or somewhere else (can't pour ln2 or dice inside my room, too little ventilation)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My first 3570 was like that. How's the IMC?


Decent, 4x2gb 2600mhz cl8...Couldn't boot over 2600mhz though, post code 23. Might go a few mhz higher with bclk and cold on it.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I've been doing some reading on the H100i and I hear that the backplate tends to be a little loose after installation. Can anyone confirm this?? It really isn't a problem because I could just go buy some rubber washers to stack on the backplate so it is seated better.


Loose for sure, thought I did it wrong at first. It is just designed that way, once you install the pump and screw it down all the way it pulls the backplate tight. It is actually really easy to install and uninstall.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My first 3570 was like that. How's the IMC?


my first chip was like that also i thought i had the worst chip ever so this is what i did to it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I used q-tips.


Wait? I'm confused. Where did you use the q-tips?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Loose for sure, thought I did it wrong at first. It is just designed that way, once you install the pump and screw it down all the way it pulls the backplate tight. It is actually really easy to install and uninstall.


Oh ok so once I screw in the pump all the way it will pull it up tight and it won't be loose at all? I guess it is just a problem with some motherboards then. You have the formula right? So I probably will be all set with my extreme.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> We are still waiting for more people to expand the H220, there have been so few that I am not sure we can draw any conclusions yet. I completely agree though that if you want the best temps or have three video cards then custom is the way to go. For one or two cards, and reasonably good temps, then the H220 is perfect for people who are not ready for the leap to full custom.
> 
> I have half my stuff to expand one of my H220 units sitting here (a little frustrating that I can't do anything with it) but the rest will not be here until next week. I have a lot of temp data on my chip and gpu so I will be able to tell pretty quickly how the H220 does with a 690. At the show, Swiftech showed the H220 doing well with two video cards but they had three rads in the loop. I was told by water coolers here that you should expect to need one rad per component cooled with the H220.


i cant wait to see your results cause thats what i plan on doing


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh ok so once I screw in the pump all the way it will pull it up tight and it won't be loose at all? I guess it is just a problem with some motherboards then. You have the formula right? So I probably will be all set with my extreme.


Correct, I had zero problems installing the H100i with the MVF, I don't think you will have any problems with the MVE.


----------



## Xinoxide

I got a new 3770K in trade today. Im trying to get her clocked up to 5ghz for a comparison.

I've been 1 step at a time since delidding it this morning.

So far im back up to 4.9GHz with 1.36v, as opposed to my other chips 1.46v~.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Correct, I had zero problems installing the H100i with the MVF, I don't think you will have any problems with the MVE.


Ok awesome! I'll probably go get some washers just in case! Now to watch some installation videos as this is all new to me.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i cant wait to see your results cause thats what i plan on doing


I am hoping it works. There is only one card but two gpus on it so we will see what happens. I am adding a 360 rad to the 240 that comes with it, so I think that should be enough.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am hoping it works. There is only one card but two gpus on it so we will see what happens. I am adding a 360 rad to the 240 that comes with it, so I think that should be enough.


yea i want to add the dual 120mm thats 80mm thick! lol hopefully it will work and stay pretty cool with 2x 670's and a 5ghz cpu


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I am hoping it works. There is only one card but two gpus on it so we will see what happens. I am adding a 360 rad to the 240 that comes with it, so I think that should be enough.
> 
> 
> 
> yea i want to add the dual 120mm thats 80mm thick! lol hopefully it will work and stay pretty cool with 2x 670's and a 5ghz cpu
Click to expand...

86mm thick.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok thanks for not forgetting about us! Just tell us whenever you do what you have to do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks!


...rog.asus.com where I will post first has been 'inaccessible ' for many hours now...weird


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...rog.asus.com where I will post first has been 'inaccessible ' for many hours now...weird


So that means we are priority #1 now


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So that means we are priority #1 now


...yes your in the 1st position right after I manage to post over there







I still wonder how a site like that can be down for so long


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah...can't replace it again so I'm stuck with it. Gonna serve well as my main chip for my gaming rig.
> I decided to build a test bench and get a different cpu for that. Gonna take me a while to save, but I might be able to muster some cash for a benching only rig. I already got great ddr3 and an MVG. A pot incoming (KPC Dragon F1) and plenty of time to start a project like that during the weekends. It would imply taking the MVG out of my cm 690 for benching outside or somewhere else (can't pour ln2 or dice inside my room, too little ventilation)
> Decent, 4x2gb 2600mhz cl8...Couldn't boot over 2600mhz though, post code 23. Might go a few mhz higher with bclk and cold on it.


...Ivanlabrie...I think it was you who posted about a new bendable, phase-like 'metal strip' product for VRM cooling and such a while back...did you ever get some, and if so, do you recommend them ? I ask because I'm working on Uni-water blocks for up to 4 GTX 670ies, but like to find some way to cool the VRMs (in addition to small fans for them). Tx


----------



## Valgaur

sorry I haven't been very frequent in here guys my Grandpa recently passed away and I'm feeling a bit off, anyways... Anyone know how to get a PS3 controller to work for PS3?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have a question about power draw-
> 
> So in hw-info, my VRM (z77x-ud5h) shows power draw:
> 
> 
> Like what do these numbers mean? Can I figure out how much my CPU wattage is based on those numbers? If not, are they close (like software vcore and 12v/3.3v/5v rail readings aren't 100% accurate but they are close)? How do you get your actual cpu wattage then?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> ...software watt readings tends to be somewhat inaccurate (unfortunately)...try a Multi-meter on the board itself...and hard OCers also use a kill-a-watt meter (around $20) that goes between your system and the wall power outlet..
> 
> ...here are two pics from Sin0822's Ivy OC guide which you can use as guide posts
Click to expand...

I understand they may be inaccurate, but surely they are in the ballpark? 12v reading in software is very inaccurate, vcore is very inaccurate, but it's still within the ballpark, it's still semi-accurate, and enough to be reliable enough for a general picture.

And how is a multi-meter going to tell me my power output? I have a DMM, but i just use it to read vcore/vtt/vram/imc/igpu/pll on my z77x-ud5h voltage points (or i could touch back of mobo on the phases). How do you use it to read wattage? I dont have a killawatt, and im not going to buy one.

Also those figures from sin's guide, that's based on LN2. [email protected] is 30*C?

But I'm sure from that graph I can take it that [email protected] is WAY ABOVE 200w?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sorry I haven't been very frequent in here guys my Grandpa recently passed away and I'm feeling a bit off, anyways... Anyone know how to get a PS3 controller to work for PS3?


Really sorry to hear that!









Just plug it in with the USB cable and press the ps button


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Ivanlabrie...I think it was you who posted about a new bendable, phase-like 'metal strip' product for VRM cooling and such a while back...did you ever get some, and if so, do you recommend them ? I ask because I'm working on Uni-water blocks for up to 4 GTX 670ies, but like to find some way to cool the VRMs (in addition to small fans for them). Tx


Flexible heatpipes, yeah they look reliable. I didn't order them yet, but I wanna try them out.
Check out silent pc review forums, search for them there. I p'md the guy selling them and he replied right away.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Really sorry to hear that!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just plug it in with the USB cable and press the ps button


Same here...*sends a virtual ln2 cooled hug*

Guys, apparently I'm stable at 4.2ghz with "only" 1.2v. I think I need to do some more testing before calling this little guy a 'dud'.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Flexible heatpipes, yeah they look reliable. I didn't order them yet, but I wanna try them out.
> Check out silent pc review forums, search for them there. I p'md the guy selling them and he replied right away.
> Same here...*sends a virtual ln2 cooled hug*
> 
> Guys, apparently I'm stable at 4.2ghz with "only" 1.2v. I think I need to do some more testing before calling this little guy a 'dud'.


Thanks for the info...btw, FtW has suggested in the past that some of the chips that are poor performers under normal circumstances end up doing quite well under LN2 (emphasis on "some") - may be 'give the cold shoulder' to that little guy


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sorry I haven't been very frequent in here guys my Grandpa recently passed away and I'm feeling a bit off, anyways... Anyone know how to get a PS3 controller to work for PS3?


...condolences for your loss


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks for the info...btw, FtW has suggested in the past that some of the chips that are poor performers under normal circumstances end up doing quite well under LN2 (emphasis on "some") - may be 'give the cold shoulder' to that little guy


Yep, we've discussed that already...My team mates said the same thing, imc will probably do a bit better (nothing too wow) and cpu clocks will scale better with voltage. 4.2ghz seems solid at 1.2v, I've been folding for a while now, ran IBT and passed...


----------



## alancsalt

Which means not delid, but put a dice or nitrogen pot on it.....I guess.


----------



## cowsgomoo

The texture of the coollaboratory pro has caught me off guard. I applied a drop of it on top of my IHS, it rolled of just like a ball and got onto my motherboard. My system isn't posting now, and I'm not sure whether it's the chip or a motherboard screwed by the liquid metal.


----------



## Ali Man

^^ Lol, funny how you put it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cowsgomoo*
> 
> The texture of the coollaboratory pro has caught me off guard. I applied a drop of it on top of my IHS, it rolled of just like a ball and got onto my motherboard. My system isn't posting now, and I'm not sure whether it's the chip or a motherboard screwed by the liquid metal.


dam that was a bad idea you should put it on before you put the cpu in the mobo. thats a tuff situation


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have a question about power draw-
> 
> So in hw-info, my VRM (z77x-ud5h) shows power draw:
> 
> 
> Like what do these numbers mean? Can I figure out how much my CPU wattage is based on those numbers? If not, are they close (like software vcore and 12v/3.3v/5v rail readings aren't 100% accurate but they are close)? How do you get your actual cpu wattage then?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> ...software watt readings tends to be somewhat inaccurate (unfortunately)...try a Multi-meter on the board itself...and hard OCers also use a kill-a-watt meter (around $20) that goes between your system and the wall power outlet..
> 
> ...here are two pics from Sin0822's Ivy OC guide which you can use as guide posts
Click to expand...

So no one knows what those VRM readings on my HW info means? I'm not asking if they are reliable (although i want to know that too), I'm asking what they mean at all, or supposed to mean. Would Power (POUT) and Power(Input) be added together for total cpu draw?
Quote:


> If you take a look here we see the power draw (12v current monitor on the 8 pin connector) when running wprime 1024 on a 3570K on a G1 Sniper M3, what is amazing about this shot is that 234W is being provided to the CPU VRM through a 4-pin power connector powering a 6 phase VRM (identical CPU phase quality as UD3H and UD5H and Sniper 3). The CPU is at 6.1 GHz. T


Sins guide - so how exactly is this done? I have a DMM, how would I go about measuring my power draw of system components?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cowsgomoo*
> 
> The texture of the coollaboratory pro has caught me off guard. I applied a drop of it on top of my IHS, it rolled of just like a ball and got onto my motherboard. My system isn't posting now, and I'm not sure whether it's the chip or a motherboard screwed by the liquid metal.


Use the syringe to suck it back up. That's what I do. Stick the needle in the little ball of CLP and pull back on the plunger and it will suck it right back into the syringe.


----------



## chefproject

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Added but your CPUz is having issues for me. just give me a link when you redo it


http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2705753

Greetings and regards and thx for adding









Chef


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yes your in the 1st position right after I manage to post over there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still wonder how a site like that can be down for so long


So the site is up I tried to see if you had posted over there, but I can't find anything but yea, its up


----------



## Totally Dubbed

My condolences to your recent loss Val, hope you're ok buddy


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2705753
> 
> Greetings and regards and thx for adding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Chef


Updated! thank you sir


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I think I'm going to go with the white Phantom 820. I think my red ASUS MVE will look awesome in it alongside my H100I and black and grey 7950's. I am going to be ordering it on Tuesday. Can't wait to put everything together. I just sent my Seasonic x850 in for an RMA today so I'm bummed about that. Its going to be a while before I get it back. I read that if they find the product isn't defective they are going to charge me 25 to send it back. That worries me because it wasn't dead it just was making a quiet squeaking and chirping noise so I figured that a capacitor was defective or something and I didn't trust it to power my expensive rig. What do you guys think will happen?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Haven't dealt with Seasonic nor heard bad things about them either...so can't really comment on that.
Good luck though!


----------



## jdm317

Just realized I never gave my cpu-z validation. Here go. 1.51v is the actual voltage.

http://valid.canardpc.com/2741686


----------



## Jsunn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Good job! Did you go back with the IHS or keep it lidless?


I lapped the IHS and then put it all back together. purring right a long, now just need to stabilize my OC.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Just realized I never gave my cpu-z validation. Here go. 1.51v is the actual voltage.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2741686


Updated! and anyoen have any idea for PS3 controller to PC? i wanna use it for NFS


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Updated! and anyoen have any idea for PS3 controller to PC? i wanna use it for NFS


I think I remember a friend wanting to do so - but it seems like it is impossible.
There are hacked drivers to do this if I'm not mistaken.
The PS3 works differently than the Xbox one does.
Drivers are not available etc - thus is all from what I overheard, not facts.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Updated! and anyoen have any idea for PS3 controller to PC? i wanna use it for NFS


yea i do here is where i got it. you can even do it through bluetooth if you have it
http://www.motioninjoy.com/download





USE XBOX PROFILE FOR NFS


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Updated! and anyoen have any idea for PS3 controller to PC? i wanna use it for NFS


I've done it but it was glitchy. It also helps if you can read Japanese because that's what all the sites and driver installs were in when I tried. Granted this was 2 years ago so maybe it has changed some.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I've done it but it was glitchy. It also helps if you can read Japanese because that's what all the sites and driver installs were in when I tried. Granted this was 2 years ago so maybe it has changed some.


it works good now! i only use it for a couple games like NFS







its poorly optimized thou.
by the way did u sell that 670 yet i would like to no if you ever tried modding the bios? and if u did whats the max oc with modded bios


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So that means we are priority #1 now


...thanks guys for being patient









...apart from dentists visits and such, I wanted to post over at rog.asus first because THEY WILL wipe out (and openly criticize you) if you put in links to overclock.net (though not anandtech forums etc)...seems that there have been too many RMA 'games' being played here, and/or folks badmouthing stuff they actually broke / caused themselves.

...here is the updated post at overclock.net in one of my threads as the *Asus Bios 1604 multiplier issue* is certainly not limited to 'delidded' chips...look for post #23:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1360912/updated-asus-bios-1604-tips-cross-platform-results-for-a-3770k-3-9-ghz-to-5-3-ghz


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it works good now! i only use it for a couple games like NFS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its poorly optimized thou.
> by the way did u sell that 670 yet i would like to no if you ever tried modding the bios? and if u did whats the max oc with modded bios


Naw I kept it, I ditched the TV and got a 23" LG LED IPS panel. It's sweet, no more problems. The max clock I have is 1286/1900, I can do that on 1050mV. I try going up to 1150mV and can't get any more core clock. IDK if the modded BIOS would help, I think I'm at this cards max. I might look into a modded BIOS next weekend though because I wanted to try it just for the experience. I got too much on my plate this weekend.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Naw I kept it, I ditched the TV and got a 23" LG LED IPS panel. It's sweet, no more problems. The max clock I have is 1286/1900, I can do that on 1050mV. I try going up to 1150mV and can't get any more core clock. IDK if the modded BIOS would help, I think I'm at this cards max. I might look into a modded BIOS next weekend though because I wanted to try it just for the experience. I got too much on my plate this weekend.


DO I hear IPS234V and copying me?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> DO I hear IPS234V and copying me?


I got this: LG 23" LED IPS HD Monitor 23EA63V-P

It was cheap and the display was the most impressive of all the monitors they had. Although they had the same brand and make only it was a 27" but it was $330 and out of my price range by $130.


----------



## chronicfx

So tried overclocking my 7970's last couple days. Best I can get totally artifact free is 1160/1600 at 1.25 and 1.5v respectively core/mem. Is that ok or complete crap? I am being very strict on artifact... If i see a couple i fail it. Using heaven and crysis 3 to check.


----------



## chronicfx

Scoring 15,200 on 3dmark11.. Sound right? Slow ram and a 3570k?


----------



## maestrobg

after delidding and applying coolaboratory liquid ultra on the die and coolaboratory liquid pro between IHS and H100, i succesfully finished 10 laps of LINX on 4.9ghz... cpu isnt some awesome chip, because it requires 1.52v for 4.9ghz, but i think that temps with this voltage (1.52 is very high ) are awesome ( max 88c ) !!!

nearly 141 gflops


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maestrobg*
> 
> after delidding and applying coolaboratory liquid ultra on the die and coolaboratory liquid pro between IHS and H100, i succesfully finished 10 laps of LINX on 4.9ghz... cpu isnt some awesome chip, because it requires 1.52v for 4.9ghz, but i think that temps with this voltage (1.52 is very high ) are awesome ( max 88c ) !!!
> 
> nearly 141 gflops


What speed is your ram?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> What speed is your ram?


2400mhz







top right of pic


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 2400mhz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> top right of pic


Iphone doesnt blow pics up


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Scoring 15,200 on 3dmark11.. Sound right? Slow ram and a 3570k?


sounds unbeliveable
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5990461

EDITh wait i thought u only had 1 card


----------



## [CyGnus]

Well faster ram will get you better physics score and up the overall one, i have mine set to 2400MHz cas 10-11-11-28 and my score on a 7870:

P 9340 http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5573768

And a pic of the mem power


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> Well faster ram will get you better physics score and up the overall one, i have mine set to 2400MHz cas 10-11-11-28 and my score on a 7870:
> 
> P 9340 http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/5573768
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> And a pic of the mem power


Good advice







...it took some BCLK clocking AND faster ram timings to break into the 11k range with P 11018 and my fastest single 670 after being stuck at 109xx...physics score picked up










http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6152087


----------



## stickg1

I moved into a new case. I had a Rosewill Blackhawk, I got a Fractal Design Arc Midi. It's still a work in progress, I'm short 1 140mm fan and I think I'll do some accent lighting, but overall this case is much easier to work in and better to look at IMO.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I got this: LG 23" LED IPS HD Monitor 23EA63V-P
> 
> It was cheap and the display was the most impressive of all the monitors they had. Although they had the same brand and make only it was a 27" but it was $330 and out of my price range by $130.


Looks identical to mine







!


----------



## [CyGnus]

stickg1 pretty cool case


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> stickg1 pretty cool case


Thank you, I'm working on a windowed side panel right now.


----------



## stickg1

UGH! Better put in an order for some CLU/P. I was moving cases and for some reason took my chip out of the board and I tried to be careful but I bumped the IHS and now my temps are up a few degrees!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I moved into a new case. I had a Rosewill Blackhawk, I got a Fractal Design Arc Midi. It's still a work in progress, I'm short 1 140mm fan and I think I'll do some accent lighting, but overall this case is much easier to work in and better to look at IMO.


Very nice!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok so when I first seen that newegg was using lasership as a shipping partner I was totally ticked off. Well as you guys know yesterday around noon I ordered my ASUS MAximus V Extreme and H100i cooler. I used the free 4-7 day shipping because I sent in my power supply today and am not going to be able to add these new parts until I get it back and until I order my Phantom 820 on tuesday. Well I just got home (10pm) and guess what was on my porch?? My package! I looked online and I guess it arrived at noon today. I am amazed by how fast that came! It took exactly 24 hours to arrive at my doorstep. I have to admit, I am VERY impressed!!

This motherboard is truly a sight to be seen. Just by looking at it I can tell why it is almost $400. Beautiful design. I can tell that they put a lot of thought into where to place everything. The thing is just dead sexy. Pictures can't do it justice, but here are some anyways!!!





As for accessories they definetly don't scimp you on that!


As for the H100i it looks absolutely awesome, but my cell phone camera sucks so I couldn't get any good pictures of it at all. Definetly going to look amazing in the case. Lets just hope nothing is DOA. Knock on wood (I really did)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

One question. Should I replace the TIM that comes on the water block on the H100i?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> One question. Should I replace the TIM that comes on the water block on the H100i?


you could leave it and if you dont like the temps then put some CLU on. they should still be pretty good as long as u have CLpro on the die.







its up to you though h100 usaually comes with good TIM


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you could leave it and if you dont like the temps then put some CLU on. they should still be pretty good as long as u have CLpro on the die.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its up to you though h100 usaually comes with good TIM


Ok cool if I replace it I am going to be using regular TIM. The CLU left a little mark on my Noctua. Its nothing that would affect temps or makes the surface of the heatsink, I just don't like marks on my stuff haha. I'll try out the stock TIM. Now I just have to wait WEEKS for my PSU to come back.


----------



## [CyGnus]

The Asus is a beast of a board, the H100i not so much why did you not go with a Swifftech220 or even a Kraken X60? i Never had a Asus CLC but i hear very bad things about them all, that was one of the reasons why i got the Antec 620 over the Asus H60.
Dont take this the wrong way maybe that one will not have problems at all and its a good cooler maybe ppl do all this hype for nothing, lets hope so


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I would suggest against putting clu/p on the ihs, simply because it doesn't do much for temps vs normal paste, and more so is harder to clean (you'll need metal remover)

As for the board. Just by looking at the name puts me off


----------



## Littlejoe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> One question. Should I replace the TIM that comes on the water block on the H100i?


I read somewhere that Corsair uses a TIM made by Corning. It sure is applied nicely.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[CyGnus]*
> 
> The Asus is a beast of a board, the H100i not so much why did you not go with a Swifftech220 or even a Kraken X60? i Never had a Asus CLC but i hear very bad things about them all, that was one of the reasons why i got the Antec 620 over the Asus H60.
> Dont take this the wrong way maybe that one will not have problems at all and its a good cooler maybe ppl do all this hype for nothing, lets hope so


Haha I'm never going to live this one down!! The main reason is for space and looks. As long as it performs about the same as the Noctua I will be happy. The reason is that all the way up to 1.53v (not going to try any higher) I haven't hit my thermal ceiling. My vcore ceiling comes way before that. So truly there is no point in spending some quality money on a better water cooler because it will simply have nothing to cool! Once I do some more hunting for a chip and find one that is definetly decent, I'm going to jump on a full custom loop then. Until then I can just learn about my board slowly and buy another 7950 for tri-fire now that I have a 3rd, and 4th!, pci-e slot.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I'm trying to install the backplate to the H100i and I definetly need some washers. It should be flush with the motherboard when it pokes through, but it rises above so when I tighten the standoff screws the backplate will have a chance to move back and forth. Going to the harware store to get some in a little bit. My fiances grandmother just died so I'm going to go over there and keep her company for the day. See you guys tonight!


----------



## [CyGnus]

Sorry to ear that man.


----------



## jdm317

Thats sad. Sorry to hear ravage. Sorry about your loss as well Valgaur.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Oh dear another loss from our community








Condolences


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I'm trying to install the backplate to the H100i and I definetly need some washers. It should be flush with the motherboard when it pokes through, but it rises above so when I tighten the standoff screws the backplate will have a chance to move back and forth. Going to the harware store to get some in a little bit. My fiances grandmother just died so I'm going to go over there and keep her company for the day. See you guys tonight!


Good Luck and Hope you feel better soon Rav, Hope you're alright.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Thats sad. Sorry to hear ravage. Sorry about your loss as well Valgaur.


Very weird, usually stuff like this doesn't happen like this, but glad we have a great community!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Oh dear another loss from our community
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Condolences


I'm doing better but I'll be pretty off on Tuesday probably wont even be on at all.


----------



## SilentAD

Ok, so I finally got my new mobo, ud5h (replacing my extreme4) as well as my CLP. Clean all surfaces, get blade(s), static wrist strap and proceed to attempt this.

Come to find out, the gap between the IHS and PCB is almost NON EXISTENT. Even for the thinnest blade I have, which I chipped two just trying to wiggle my way in to start. But no worries on the two nicked blades, the PCB was completely intact.

Conclusion, I'm going to have to settle for my higher than desired temperatures and oc of only 45


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Good Luck and Hope you feel better soon Rav, Hope you're alright.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very weird, usually stuff like this doesn't happen like this, but glad we have a great community!
> I'm doing better but I'll be pretty off on Tuesday probably wont even be on at all.


My wife lost her grandmother 2 weeks ago.







Our world was shattered last October when my wifes sister died of Cancer. She was our best friend. I started overclocking again just so I wouldn't go crazy... Don't mean to bring anyone down, just nice to have a community of like minded individuals to relate with, and I know it helps knowing that people at least will take a moment to put the people that are hurting in there thoughts. Its very strange, but it does help a little. For a lot of people losing Grandparents is as devastating as losing a parent, some pretty much are losing a parent.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> Ok, so I finally got my new mobo, ud5h (replacing my extreme4) as well as my CLP. Clean all surfaces, get blade(s), static wrist strap and proceed to attempt this.
> 
> Come to find out, the gap between the IHS and PCB is almost NON EXISTENT. Even for the thinnest blade I have, which I chipped two just trying to wiggle my way in to start. But no worries on the two nicked blades, the PCB was completely intact.
> 
> Conclusion, I'm going to have to settle for my higher than desired temperatures and oc of only 45


you could try the wood block and hammer with a vice grib.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Littlejoe*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> One question. Should I replace the TIM that comes on the water block on the H100i?
> 
> 
> 
> I read somewhere that Corsair uses a TIM made by Corning. It sure is applied nicely.
Click to expand...

F***et about Corning..

My entire family had deep roots in the building of the city and working the plants in Corning NY.

Now where are they?


----------



## valkeriefire

Wow, I finally got my CLU installed. My original de-lid was done with NH-H1 on the die, and Innovative Cooling Diamond (ICD) on the IHS. My original delid temps 78C, but overtime they have slowly crept up to 89C. This is still well below my non-delidded temps of 97C, but was not what I had hoped for.

After installing with CLU on the die and ICD on the IHS, my temps are down to 74C load. This is at 4.6ghz 1.296v load with 0.045v offset and a NH-D14 cooler. My case is a small Lian Li PC-A05, so it isn't exactly made for airflow (although I've done some mods to help with that).

Overall I am impressed with the CLU performance. The amount that comes in the tube is disappointing for the price.

Can you put CLU on the IHS? I read you shouldn't use CLU on an aluminum Heatsink. I don't know if my NH-D14 is aluminum or not. It looks like it, but it could be nickle plated copper.

Screen shots from today, same room same ambient temps...

Pre-CLU temps of 89C


CLU temps of 74C


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I moved into a new case. I had a Rosewill Blackhawk, I got a Fractal Design Arc Midi. It's still a work in progress, I'm short 1 140mm fan and I think I'll do some accent lighting, but overall this case is much easier to work in and better to look at IMO.


LoL wha.....

I sold u a res / pump / rad get that loop up and running!!!


----------



## lilchronic

wow i was just looking at some old screen shots of mine and i cant belive i let my temps go thats high before i delided


now after delid
i wish i would of taken better screen shots and ran more tests to compare temps.


----------



## Solonowarion

Praying to the delid gods. Wish me luck.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> Wow, I finally got my CLU installed. My original de-lid was done with NH-H1 on the die, and Innovative Cooling Diamond (ICD) on the IHS. My original delid temps 78C, but overtime they have slowly crept up to 89C. This is still well below my non-delidded temps of 97C, but was not what I had hoped for.
> 
> After installing with CLU on the die and ICD on the IHS, my temps are down to 74C load. This is at 4.6ghz 1.296v load with 0.045v offset and a NH-D14 cooler. My case is a small Lian Li PC-A05, so it isn't exactly made for airflow (although I've done some mods to help with that).
> 
> Overall I am impressed with the CLU performance. The amount that comes in the tube is disappointing for the price.
> 
> Can you put CLU on the IHS? I read you shouldn't use CLU on an aluminum Heatsink. I don't know if my NH-D14 is aluminum or not. It looks like it, but it could be nickle plated copper.
> 
> Screen shots from today, same room same ambient temps...
> 
> Pre-CLU temps of 89C
> 
> 
> CLU temps of 74C


...good to check re composition of the heatsink re aluminum as that is a definite 'no-no' with CL products (no problem with copper / nickel plated copper).

...I did run a test with MX4 vs CL-U on the IHS-to-water-block spot. In my case, CL-U beat MX4 by between 3C and 4C, noting that MX4 is pretty good anyhow, and probably easier to remove afterwards. Still, if you want to max your temp drop after delidding and have CL-U on the die, you might as well 'go for the whole enchilada' and apply CL-U on top of the IHS as well, once you confirmed its composition.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Praying to the delid gods. Wish me luck.


good luck dude!


----------



## MKHunt

Well, when I get my Titan, it will be blockless until I can get an EK XXL true full cover block....

which means my 3770k will have to itself: EX360, RX240, RX120. Should I try for the elusive 5 gigglehurts? All rads are gasketed and fanned up with corsair SP-120 high performance fans.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I really do appreciate you guys taking the time to give your condolences. It truly does mean a lot. So I'm going to have to go to a wake and all that good stuff sometime this week. Still think I'm going to order my 820 case sometime this week. This community is really amazing and I'm glad to have found it. Not going to get too into detail, but I'm recovering from drug and alcohol addiction and have been clean for almost a year now and building this computer and talking to you guys about overclocking and all of this interesting stuff has been a huge part of my sobriety. It sucks tthat I have to deal with a death, but at least I can actually mourn and deal with those feelings now so I am really grateful for that.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I really do appreciate you guys taking the time to give your condolences. It truly does mean a lot. So I'm going to have to go to a wake and all that good stuff sometime this week. Still think I'm going to order my 820 case sometime this week. This community is really amazing and I'm glad to have found it. Not going to get too into detail, but I'm recovering from drug and alcohol addiction and have been clean for almost a year now and building this computer and talking to you guys about overclocking and all of this interesting stuff has been a huge part of my sobriety. It sucks tthat I have to deal with a death, but at least I can actually mourn and deal with those feelings now so I am really grateful for that.


Be very careful. Hardware can become your new addiction. While it might not kill you, it can certainly kill your wallet.

I also had similar problems in the past with drugs an alcohol. Now my main hobby is computers, and I took it a little too far. My GF and some of my online friends had to show me the errors of my ways. I still slip up from time to time, like upgrading for no reason or foolish spending. Only buy something if you really need it and never let a sale or a good deal get the best of you. Before you buy a bunch of items ask yourself if you really need to upgrade or if it's just your addictive personality.

Shopping is also a common addiction, whether it be in a mall, or online with computer parts. Just be careful.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Be very careful. Hardware can become your new addiction. While it might not kill you, it can certainly kill your wallet.
> 
> I also had similar problems in the past with drugs an alcohol. Now my main hobby is computers, and I took it a little too far. My GF and some of my online friends had to show me the errors of my ways. I still slip up from time to time, like upgrading for no reason or foolish spending. Only buy something if you really need it and never let a sale or a good deal get the best of you. Before you buy a bunch of items ask yourself if you really need to upgrade or if it's just your addictive personality.
> 
> Shopping is also a common addiction, whether it be in a mall, or online with computer parts. Just be careful.


Yea I definetly agree that it could easily become my new addiction.... and it sort of is, but I made a deal with myself that I have to put a certain amount of money in the bank each week and once I have enough money saved up from the leftover money in my checks that is when I can buy that part that I want. And I have been doing that pretty successfully. Once I order my case I am going to have pretty much everything I need until I save u_ enough for a decent water loop, but that will probably be a year or so. I'm learning this strange thing.... its called moderation.


----------



## valkeriefire

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...good to check re composition of the heatsink re aluminum as that is a definite 'no-no' with CL products (no problem with copper / nickel plated copper).
> 
> ...I did run a test with MX4 vs CL-U on the IHS-to-water-block spot. In my case, CL-U beat MX4 by between 3C and 4C, noting that MX4 is pretty good anyhow, and probably easier to remove afterwards. Still, if you want to max your temp drop after delidding and have CL-U on the die, you might as well 'go for the whole enchilada' and apply CL-U on top of the IHS as well, once you confirmed its composition.


I did as you suggested, I checked the composition and the base plate of the NH-D14 is nickle clad copper (source) Based on that I applied CLU to the IHS aswell and I got the 3-4C drop you mentioned vs my ICD. I reran the same IBT and got 71C when I had gotten 74-75C previously.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Praying to the delid gods. Wish me luck.


Good luck man, remember to face the slick frictionless side of the blade down and you should be smooth sailing.

edit: Meh, by frictionless I simply mean the side that doesnt try and grab hold, or cut, when sliding it across paper, plastic, etc. I felt it was key know this, and probably one of the greatest measures to prevent nicking a trace.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> I did as you suggested, I checked the composition and the base plate of the NH-D14 is nickle clad copper (source) Based on that I applied CLU to the IHS aswell and I got the 3-4C drop you mentioned vs my ICD. I reran the same IBT and got 71C when I had gotten 74-75C previously.


That looks good. Pretty much what I get at that voltage with CLP.


----------



## Solonowarion

Why did I wait so long to do this! Time for 5 ghz!









Took about 5 minutes to get the head off. The heat gun helped a lot with getting the glue off.

Once I had the corner in I just kept a lot of pressure on the blade. Pushing down so it would force the blade on the IHS. I ground the corners off of the blade but it was really unnecessary. It cut through the glue like butter. Only had to rock back and forth a few times for each corner.















So far its looking like aprox 20 degrees difference. Will get back when I have more concrete results.


----------



## MKHunt

That is a metric buttload of CLP. When I had coated mine completely in CLP both the die and IHS looked like they had perfectly smooth mirrored surfaces. It took forever to spread, and it doesn't seem like its going to stick at all, but it will. You would probably see more of a drop by using less, or finding the 'perfect' amount for your specific chip.

ETA: Holy guacamole your chip had a TON of factory TIM! I saw ~19-20C drop and from what I've seen, my factory TIM was actually fairly decent.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Why did I wait so long to do this! Time for 5 ghz!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Took about 5 minutes to get the head off. The heat gun helped a lot with getting the glue off.
> 
> Once I had the corner in I just kept a lot of pressure on the blade. Pushing down so it would force the blade on the IHS. I ground the corners off of the blade but it was really unnecessary. It cut through the glue like butter. Only had to rock back and forth a few times for each corner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So far its looking like aprox 20 degrees difference. Will get back when I have more concrete results.


Woooh! Cleaned her up NICE! Best of luck reaching 5ghz








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> That is a metric buttload of CLP. When I had coated mine completely in CLP both the die and IHS looked like they had perfectly smooth mirrored surfaces. It took forever to spread, and it doesn't seem like its going to stick at all, but it will. You would probably see more of a drop by using less, or finding the 'perfect' amount for your specific chip.


I agree, I used to much my first time around. Thought it was perfect till I started playing with a drop on a piece of plastic and managed to cover the entire thing. Takes less than half a BB worth, it goes a very long way.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> That is a metric buttload of CLP. When I had coated mine completely in CLP both the die and IHS looked like they had perfectly smooth mirrored surfaces. It took forever to spread, and it doesn't seem like its going to stick at all, but it will. You would probably see more of a drop by using less, or finding the 'perfect' amount for your specific chip.


Alright when I change my coolant soon I will try less CLU. Thanks.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I definetly agree that it could easily become my new addiction.... and it sort of is, but I made a deal with myself that I have to put a certain amount of money in the bank each week and once I have enough money saved up from the leftover money in my checks that is when I can buy that part that I want. And I have been doing that pretty successfully. Once I order my case I am going to have pretty much everything I need until I save u_ enough for a decent water loop, but that will probably be a year or so. I'm learning this strange thing.... its called moderation.


Lol, yeah. It's amazing how much money you save by not drinking and getting high everyday. I was amazed. I could like, actually pay my bills on time and not do shady stuff to make rent.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Why did I wait so long to do this! Time for 5 ghz!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Took about 5 minutes to get the head off. The heat gun helped a lot with getting the glue off.
> 
> Once I had the corner in I just kept a lot of pressure on the blade. Pushing down so it would force the blade on the IHS. I ground the corners off of the blade but it was really unnecessary. It cut through the glue like butter. Only had to rock back and forth a few times for each corner.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So far its looking like aprox 20 degrees difference. Will get back when I have more concrete results.


Good work but that's too much CLU/P. It shouldn't bubble like that, it should be smooth almost mirror like. Get the quantity right and I bet you get another 5C.


----------



## PontiacGTX

could be good, that in the main OP, they put Batch number and compare similar ones


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PontiacGTX*
> 
> could be good, that in the main OP, they put Batch number and compare similar ones


Batch numbers over clock ability isn't very consistent with IB cpus.

Really seems to be luck of the draw on particular cpu with IB.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Batch numbers over clock ability isn't very consistent with IB cpus.
> 
> Really seems to be luck of the draw on particular cpu with IB.


I researched and Found 3 batches on i7 3770k which keep Ocing with low voltage and not too bad temps compared to all i7 3770ks


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Lol, yeah. It's amazing how much money you save by not drinking and getting high everyday. I was amazed. I could like, actually pay my bills on time and not do shady stuff to make rent.
> Good work but that's too much CLU/P. It shouldn't bubble like that, it should be smooth almost mirror like. Get the quantity right and I bet you get another 5C.


Yea this has been the best year of my life in many years. Love having a wallet full of money.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Batches are these:
Intel Core i7 3770k

*3218B960* Great Ocing with Asus Maximus Gene V z77 or MSI Mpower

*3218C176* great with ASUS Maximus 5 Formula bios 701 or Maximus Gene V z77 or MSI Mpower

*3216B695* Asus V Gene z77

1st and 2nd for sure are great beast , third could be 70% effective in most of cases


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Why did I wait so long to do this! Time for 5 ghz!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Took about 5 minutes to get the head off. The heat gun helped a lot with getting the glue off.
> 
> Once I had the corner in I just kept a lot of pressure on the blade. Pushing down so it would force the blade on the IHS. I ground the corners off of the blade but it was really unnecessary. It cut through the glue like butter. Only had to rock back and forth a few times for each corner.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So far its looking like aprox 20 degrees difference. Will get back when I have more concrete results.


...Congrats







- a very professional looking delidding approach by a fellow- BCer







I have seen before that a heat-gun is a really nice way to make the job go smooth


----------



## Totally Dubbed

That pcb is so clean and lean! Great job there!


----------



## Solonowarion

Anyone have any issues with cpu z not reporting right multiplier? I have it at x50 in bios but cpu z still only reporting x48. I have been using the asus/ivybridge overclocking guide on here and cant seem to find any way to fix it.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Anyone have any issues with cpu z not reporting right multiplier? I have it at x50 in bios but cpu z still only reporting x48. I have been using the asus/ivybridge overclocking guide on here and cant seem to find any way to fix it.


Save your profile, export it to a usb, reflash bios, load your profile from the usb.


----------



## alancsalt

Only works for same number bios though. If you upgrade, better take the f12 screenshots of settings.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Save your profile, export it to a usb, reflash bios, load your profile from the usb.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Only works for same number bios though. If you upgrade, better take the f12 screenshots of settings.


Thanks. Reflashing worked. 5 ghz! http://valid.canardpc.com/2744071

Now just have to start priming.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I had to put 3 tiny o-rings over each of the female standoffs on the backplate of my H100i to make them flush on the top of the motherboard so it wasn't loose when I screwed in the standoffs. The only problem is that the backplate is a not flush against the back of the motherboard. It is raised maybe an 8th of an inch off the back of the motherboard, but that was the only way I could ensure a snug fit. I'm sure it won't be a problem fitting it in my Phantom 820 case that I just ordered a couple minutes ago. I ended up going with white!!

\

and here are some more pics of my MOBO with the CPU, RAM, and standoffs in.


----------



## Xinoxide

That board is beautiful.

Itll be nice with a nice big MIPS/EK VRM block on it too. Same for the RAM.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Thanks. Reflashing worked. 5 ghz! http://valid.canardpc.com/2744071
> 
> Now just have to start priming.


No problem. Just be prepared to reflash again when settings don't carry through or you see anything strange. Hopefully a new bios will be released soon to fix this issue.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I had to put 3 tiny o-rings over each of the female standoffs on the backplate of my H100i to make them flush on the top of the motherboard so it wasn't loose when I screwed in the standoffs. The only problem is that the backplate is a not flush against the back of the motherboard. It is raised maybe an 8th of an inch off the back of the motherboard, but that was the only way I could ensure a snug fit. I'm sure it won't be a problem fitting it in my Phantom 820 case that I just ordered a couple minutes ago. I ended up going with white!!


What exactly happens when you install the H100i all the way without the washers? Are you saying if you install it just like the instructions show and tighten the bolts all the way down the pump is actually loose? I am curious because even though the backplate was loose when I installed it (since it is designed that way) the square clamp that sits over the pump effectively pulls the backplate tight when everything is screwed down. I could grab the pump and couldn't move it at all after installation. I watched several videos of it being installed and no one used washers and it worked fine.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> That board is beautiful.
> 
> Itll be nice with a nice big MIPS/EK VRM block on it too. Same for the RAM.


Oh yea man I didn't even know something like that existed and that is why I am waiting at least a year before blowing a chunk of change on a custom loop. I couldn't find anything by EK for the V Extreme, but I did find this from MIPS.
http://www.aquatuning.us/product_info.php/info/p15145_MIPS-ASUS-Maximus-5-Extreme-Fullcover-POM.html


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No problem. Just be prepared to reflash again when settings don't carry through or you see anything strange. Hopefully a new bios will be released soon to fix this issue.
> What exactly happens when you install the H100i all the way without the washers? Are you saying if you install it just like the instructions show and tighten the bolts all the way down the pump is actually loose? I am curious because even though the backplate was loose when I installed it (since it is designed that way) the square clamp that sits over the pump effectively pulls the backplate tight when everything is screwed down. I could grab the pump and couldn't move it at all after installation. I watched several videos of it being installed and no one used washers and it worked fine.


Well I haven't installed it all of the way, but I have just put everything together really quick and when installed as described in the manual the "female standoffs" come up from below and sit maybe 1/16 of an inch above the motherboard so when the standoffs are screwed in they easily move down and up so since the block is installed onto the standoffs the block itself easily moves down and up so I can see how if the motherboard was stood up in a case the top of the block could move forward off the CPU providing uneven cooling. The way I installed it the "female standoffs" were perfectly flush with the top of the motherboard and when the standoffs are screwed in there is absolutely no play at all.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well I haven't installed it all of the way, but I have just put everything together really quick and when installed as described in the manual the "female standoffs" come up from below and sit maybe 1/16 of an inch above the motherboard so when the standoffs are screwed in they easily move down and up so since the block is installed onto the standoffs the block itself easily moves down and up so I can see how if the motherboard was stood up in a case the top of the block could move forward off the CPU providing uneven cooling. The way I installed it the "female standoffs" were perfectly flush with the top of the motherboard and when the standoffs are screwed in there is absolutely no play at all.


Just a suggestion, but I don't think you need any washers. I didn't, no review I read needed them, or any videos I watched. I am not saying that is conclusive or anything, but I would call Corsair and confirm. The unit is specifically designed to be loose when you install the backplate, then the clamp around the pump will make it completely tight when you install it.

It is designed (like the H220 also) so that you can screw the pump down as far as you can. You just turn the screwdriver until it stops, no guessing how hard to tighten it. If you add washers you are altering that design, and I am guessing that you will have to adjust how hard you screw the pump down to avoid damage to the mobo.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Just a suggestion, but I don't think you need any washers. I didn't, no review I read needed them, or any videos I watched. I am not saying that is conclusive or anything, but I would call Corsair and confirm. The unit is specifically designed to be loose when you install the backplate, then the clamp around the pump will make it completely tight when you install it.
> 
> It is designed (like the H220 also) so that you can screw the pump down as far as you can. You just turn the screwdriver until it stops, no guessing how hard to tighten it. If you add washers you are altering that design, and I am guessing that you will have to adjust how hard you screw the pump down to avoid damage to the mobo.


Oh yea that actually just made a lot of sense to me because when you tighten the screws it will pull the standoff up and pull the backplate tight against the back of the motherboard, right? Hmm, I guess the threads I was reading kind of polluting my thinking of how this was supposed to work.

This is where I got the idea:

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=113973'

Some of these people are saying that after assembling it, it is still loose, but if you have the MVF and you can 100% confirm that your block isn't the slightest bit loose I will trust you and take that washers off. I just don't know why they would assemble the product like that.

EDIT: Well I guess it makes sense. As long as it is completely snug against the CPU I will be happy.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh yea that actually just made a lot of sense to me because when you tighten the screws it will pull the standoff up and pull the backplate tight against the back of the motherboard, right? Hmm, I guess the threads I was reading kind of polluting my thinking of how this was supposed to work.
> 
> This is where I got the idea:
> 
> http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=113973'
> 
> Some of these people are saying that after assembling it, it is still loose, but if you have the MVF and you can 100% confirm that your block isn't the slightest bit loose I will trust you and take that washers off. I just don't know why they would assemble the product like that.
> 
> EDIT: Well I guess it makes sense. As long as it is completely snug against the CPU I will be happy.


The people in that thread were worried about loose backplates, and were told it was normal. Loose backplate is irrelevant, loose pump is a huge problem. I have the MVF not the MVE thus I am simply suggesting you call Corsair and confirm before using those washers. As long as you have extra TIM to test, it is pretty simple. Just install it without the washers first. If the pump is loose I am sure you will be able to tell. Corsair is little too big to just forget to put in washers. If you use the washers and tighten down all the way and the washers accidently put too much pressure where it should not go you could damage your mobo.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Another quick question about the H100i and the fan connector cable that plugs into the 2 fans and into the block. Why is there 2 inputs for that cable on the block? Is that just so you can connect it neatly if it is coming from the left of the case or the right of the case? I know my H100i came with two of those cables. Am I supposed to use the other one for something?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh yea man I didn't even know something like that existed and that is why I am waiting at least a year before blowing a chunk of change on a custom loop. I couldn't find anything by EK for the V Extreme, but I did find this from MIPS.
> http://www.aquatuning.us/product_info.php/info/p15145_MIPS-ASUS-Maximus-5-Extreme-Fullcover-POM.html


...re your earlier question per PM, using 8x 16x 8x - or - 8x 8x 8x both work on my Max V Ex, though with little difference in performance. It comes down to getting enough space in-between to cool the cards (and your hands are tied with Quad SLI at 8x 16x 8x 8x anyhow which I sometimes run). Remember though that PCIe3 '8' is pretty much the same a PCIe2 '16', and unless you're going to run 4 overclocked Titan's, you are unlikely to get anywhere near close saturating the buses

...here is a pic of the EK waterblock's configurator for the Max V Ex, including board water-cooling



...here is a pic of my Max V Ex...I don't think that the VRM and PCH need water-cooling...I have measured no more than 45 C max even when hard-benching at 5.2 GHz+, confirmed by AI Suite sensors which also list that...it may come down to what kind of case you are using...you'll note the big 200 mm fan on top (there's another 200mm on the side window)


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Another quick question about the H100i and the fan connector cable that plugs into the 2 fans and into the block. Why is there 2 inputs for that cable on the block? Is that just so you can connect it neatly if it is coming from the left of the case or the right of the case? I know my H100i came with two of those cables. Am I supposed to use the other one for something?


If I understand you question correctly, the other fan header can be used with other splitter to control another two fans. So you can do push/pull if you get another two fans. Everything I have read says it will probably not be worth the trouble on this particular unit though.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...re your earlier question per PM, using 8x 16x 8x - or - 8x 8x 8x both work on my Max V Ex, though with little difference in performance. It comes down to getting enough space in-between to cool the cards (and your hands are tied with Quad SLI at 8x 16x 8x 8x anyhow which I sometimes run). Remember though that PCIe3 '8' is pretty much the same a PCIe2 '16', and unless you're going to run 4 overclocked Titan's, you are unlikely to get anywhere near close saturating the buses
> 
> ...here is a pic of the EK waterblock's configurator for the Max V Ex, including board water-cooling
> 
> 
> 
> ...here is a pic of my Max V Ex...I don't think that the VRM and PCH need water-cooling...I have measured no more than 45 C max even when hard-benching at 5.2 GHz+, confirmed by AI Suite sensors which also list that...it may come down to what kind of case you are using...you'll note the big 200 mm fan on top (there's another 200mm on the side window)


What case is that? Just ordered my white Phantom 820 a couple hours ago.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If I understand you question correctly, the other fan header can be used with other splitter to control another two fans. So you can do push/pull if you get another two fans. Everything I have read says it will probably not be worth the trouble on this particular unit though.


Oh ok good I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something and didn't have to use the other fan cable for something since there is two inputs on the block itself for two of those fan cables. Thanks! I'll try to install without any washers (except the ones that came with it).


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What case is that? Just ordered my white Phantom 820 a couple hours ago.


...irony of ironies







- that case is a CM Storm Stryker, though the above assembly will be moved to a NZXT Phantom Full Tower case already standing here as I am building up a Rampage IV Ex / 3970x machine that in turn will be moved to the Stryker case - both boards are nearly identical in look and layout and the new system will inherit the w-c, hd, ssd and PSU setup already installed in the Stryker - sort of like 'hand-me-downs' among siblings


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...irony of ironies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - that case is a CM Storm Stryker, though the above assembly will be moved to a NZXT Phantom Full Tower case already standing here as I am building up a Rampage IV Ex / 3970x machine that in turn will be moved to the Stryker case - both boards are nearly identical in look and layout and the new system will inherit the w-c, hd, ssd and PSU setup already installed in the Stryker - sort of like 'hand-me-downs' among siblings


Haha that is funny. What model Phantom is it?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha that is funny. What model Phantom is it?


...a white 820 (6 mth old display demo from the store with a minor scratch and a price tag of $100)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...a white 820 (6 mth old display demo from the store with a minor scratch and a price tag of $100)


WOW what a good price!!! Definetly post some pics when you get everything together and I will do the same. I would love to see how yours looks. I paid 270 after shipping so you got one hell of a deal!!!!

I'm seriously worried about how I am going to figure out the whole fan cables and controller stuff and how to make it nice and neat because I'm OCD about that stuff and that huge hunk of cables worries me because I have never set up anything like that. My HAF 912 had 3 cables. Would you be able to also post pics of your cable management too?


----------



## ivanlabrie

You guys with your shiny 820's...







hate y'all xD
jk jk, I'm happy with my cm 690 II.

I'm considering delidding this chip but I know I shouldn't now. Gotta wait till I can order a second 3770k and resell this one.
Though I'm not 100% positive it's as bad as I think. I had some bsods running stock clocks, I think it must be gpu related cause I'm running a baked (previously dead) 9800 gt gpu.
The thing started artifacting and I got a few bsods which I thought were vcore related, but not sure.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I really do appreciate you guys taking the time to give your condolences. It truly does mean a lot. So I'm going to have to go to a wake and all that good stuff sometime this week. Still think I'm going to order my 820 case sometime this week. This community is really amazing and I'm glad to have found it. Not going to get too into detail, but I'm recovering from drug and alcohol addiction and have been clean for almost a year now and building this computer and talking to you guys about overclocking and all of this interesting stuff has been a huge part of my sobriety. It sucks tthat I have to deal with a death, but at least I can actually mourn and deal with those feelings now so I am really grateful for that.


Hopefully yours goes well like mine should I hope. Best of wishes to you sir.


----------



## SilentAD

Any tips on trying to get the glue "warmed" up a bit? Considering I know about black rtv sealant from automotive work, I doubt it but just thought I'd ask.

I'm asking this because when I took a good look at my CPU, there are almost NO gap to squeeze a thin razor blade in between as seen in the videos and pictures . . .


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> WOW what a good price!!! Definetly post some pics when you get everything together and I will do the same. I would love to see how yours looks. I paid 270 after shipping so you got one hell of a deal!!!!
> 
> I'm seriously worried about how I am going to figure out the whole fan cables and controller stuff and how to make it nice and neat because I'm OCD about that stuff and that huge hunk of cables worries me because I have never set up anything like that. My HAF 912 had 3 cables. Would you be able to also post pics of your cable management too?


...as I wrote, it was a demo on the shelf at NCIX...since I go 'there a lot' , it had been staring at me for a long time, whispering '...get me outta here'







...the side door was off and scratched a bit, but nothing that couldn't be fixed.

...between the last post and this, I re-installed the 4th 670 card for another Quad-SLI run for Valley (currently at 6036 per below)...on the Stryker, cable management is a bit of a mess because I swap cards quite often and while I'm using a Corsair AX1200, the 4th card is fed by molex







, but when I'm done with the Phantom / 3970x, I'll post some more pics, it will take a bit longer though...


----------



## Swag

*OT again*:

CS:GO, although does not have the nicest graphics is simply amazing and a lot of fun! I love BF3 for its graphics but the competitive in CS:GO is just too damn addicting.







I kinda want to look for some OCNers who play CS:GO (namely people in this club), anyone?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You guys with your shiny 820's...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hate y'all xD
> jk jk, I'm happy with my cm 690 II.
> 
> I'm considering delidding this chip but I know I shouldn't now. Gotta wait till I can order a second 3770k and resell this one.
> Though I'm not 100% positive it's as bad as I think. I had some bsods running stock clocks, I think it must be gpu related cause I'm running a baked (previously dead) 9800 gt gpu.
> The thing started artifacting and I got a few bsods which I thought were vcore related, but not sure.


...are you getting BSOD 116s or 117s ? Those re often GPU related


----------



## ivanlabrie

A bunch of friends play, I've only played the original game so far...
And, yeah CS for a competitive shooter is very nice, I like that sort of fast paced action in multiplayer fps games.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> justanoldman to RAVAGE THE EARTH
> Just a suggestion, but I don't think you need any washers. I didn't, no review I read needed them, or any videos I watched. I am not saying that is conclusive or anything, but I would call Corsair and confirm. The unit is specifically designed to be loose when you install the backplate, then the clamp around the pump will make it completely tight when you install it.
> 
> It is designed (like the H220 also) so that you can screw the pump down as far as you can. You just turn the screwdriver until it stops, no guessing how hard to tighten it. If you add washers you are altering that design, and I am guessing that you will have to adjust how hard you screw the pump down to avoid damage to the mobo.
> 
> Oh yea that actually just made a lot of sense to me because when you tighten the screws it will pull the standoff up and pull the backplate tight against the back of the motherboard, right? Hmm, I guess the threads I was reading kind of polluting my thinking of how this was supposed to work.
> 
> This is where I got the idea:
> 
> http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=113973'
> 
> Some of these people are saying that after assembling it, it is still loose, but if you have the MVF and you can 100% confirm that your block isn't the slightest bit loose I will trust you and take that washers off. I just don't know why they would assemble the product like that.
> 
> EDIT: Well I guess it makes sense. As long as it is completely snug against the CPU I will be happy.


As the O-rings age and heat-up they will yield to the pressures and forces. Which will relax the pressure off the cooling head on the cpu; in addition to this the backplate is designed to keep the motherboard flat! I have noticed with non-backplate installations (like the stock intel air cooler) a BULDGING of the motherboard cpu area! The metal backplate must make contact to prevent this,

I have a similar closed water-cooling system (H60) I did mod the backplate because I wanted more pressure between the cooler and the cpu. What I did was wrap wire around the four metal braces (keeps mb flat) and add 4- 2mm (1 per) metal washers on the backplate stand-offs. it was a little loose but it tighten-up nicely upon thumb-screw tightening. You do have a rectangular metal plate on the underside of your mb,right? the wire is maybe 1mm and is between the rectangular metal plate and the cooler Xplate.

I am asking you to rethink this rubber washer system, just a thought, I do however, think the H100 is a good choice and is a good product. I can run at 4.8Ghz topping at 70* loaded, 4.9 and 50Ghz are under 85* cranked but too high Vcore to run 24-7. _but I digress!

If you want a better idea of what I did, or have any other questions feel free.
You have plenty of time to find what will work for you until ypur psu arrives- have fun.

Ps; I finished crisis 3 on normal! the last battle was crazy sick to figure out! I die so many times and had to take a break and come back two days later. well, have fun with the new gear -later dude!

_
*5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*















*"Yeah my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *OT again*:
> 
> CS:GO, although does not have the nicest graphics is simply amazing and a lot of fun! I love BF3 for its graphics but the competitive in CS:GO is just too damn addicting.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I kinda want to look for some OCNers who play CS:GO (namely people in this club), anyone?


I played CS a bunch when I was in high school. We even traveled the region to play in LAN tournies for money. Not sure why I haven't tried CS:GO yet. Maybe I'll give it a try soon.


----------



## Icydead

Request for club membership









*OCN name:* Icydead
*CPU*: i5 3570k
*on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
*ihs-TIM*: Arctic Cooling MX-2
*Mhz gained:* 200MHZ (Was able to achieve same OC without delid, but I didnt like the temps so I dropped it to 4.5GHZ)
*OC after delid:* 4700MHZ
*Temp drops*: 15-20*C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2744549
Lapped IHS with 600, 800 and 1200 grit.

Temps etc.

 

24 hours 20 minutes prime custom blend test stable, no whea errors.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Request for club membership
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* Icydead
> *CPU*: i5 3570k
> *on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM*: Arctic Cooling MX-2
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHZ (Was able to achieve same OC without delid, but I didnt like the temps so I dropped it to 4.5GHZ)
> *OC after delid:* 4700MHZ
> *Temp drops*: 15-20*C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2744549
> Lapped IHS with 600, 800 and 1200 grit.
> 
> Temps etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 24 hours 20 minutes prime custom blend test stable, no whea errors.


Nice man!!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hopefully yours goes well like mine should I hope. Best of wishes to you sir.


and also to you sir. Hang in there.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> As the O-rings age and heat-up they will yield to the pressures and forces. Which will relax the pressure off the cooling head on the cpu; in addition to this the backplate is designed to keep the motherboard flat! I have noticed with non-backplate installations (like the stock intel air cooler) a BULDGING of the motherboard cpu area! The metal backplate must make contact to prevent this,
> 
> I have a similar closed water-cooling system (H60) I did mod the backplate because I wanted more pressure between the cooler and the cpu. What I did was wrap wire around the four metal braces (keeps mb flat) and add 4- 2mm (1 per) metal washers on the backplate stand-offs. it was a little loose but it tighten-up nicely upon thumb-screw tightening. You do have a rectangular metal plate on the underside of your mb,right? the wire is maybe 1mm and is between the rectangular metal plate and the cooler Xplate.
> 
> I am asking you to rethink this rubber washer system, just a thought, I do however, think the H100 is a good choice and is a good product. I can run at 4.8Ghz topping at 70* loaded, 4.9 and 50Ghz are under 85* cranked but too high Vcore to run 24-7. _but I digress!
> 
> If you want a better idea of what I did, or have any other questions feel free.
> You have plenty of time to find what will work for you until ypur psu arrives- have fun.
> 
> Ps; I finished crisis 3 on normal! the last battle was crazy sick to figure out! I die so many times and had to take a break and come back two days later. well, have fun with the new gear -later dude!
> 
> _
> *5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"Yeah my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


Yes I actually did re-think putting rubber washers on the backplate. I guess I can just assemble the whole block and just see if it fits. Didn't really want to waste the TIM that came with it, but I have a couple tubes of IC Diamond and Arctic Silver plus the syringe of CLU so I'm all set.

Dude, I totally miss Crysis so bad. Its going to be so nice when I get to play it again!


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Nice man!!!


Thanks








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Dude, I totally miss Crysis so bad. Its going to be so nice when I get to play it again!


I see you cant wait just like me







Now when I am looking at it, I will probably play crysis again too .)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok so I just attached the block and took it off and it didn't make contact with the sides of my CPU. I ended up pressing it down again, but the red lines I added to this picture shows where the block didn't make contact. Should I attemp to lap my CPU or do you guys think it is fine that it only makes contact with the middle since that is where the most heat is. I think when I wipe the TIM off and apply some with the pea method it will spread across the whole thing. I think it's just because I am using the pre-spread TIM on the block.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok so I just attached the block and took it off and it didn't make contact with the sides of my CPU. I ended up pressing it down again, but the red lines I added to this picture shows where the block didn't make contact. Should I attemp to lap my CPU or do you guys think it is fine that it only makes contact with the middle since that is where the most heat is. I think when I wipe the TIM off and apply some with the pea method it will spread across the whole thing. I think it's just because I am using the pre-spread TIM on the block.


...this is also a regular topic as that happens a lot:

First, I would get some pressure paper to put between the block and IHS...it will more clearly show the contact patterns

Second, some IHS are curved just a bit (or a bit more than others), ditto for some CPU blocks...try to 'rotate' your block 90 degrees to deal with this concave/convex issue and remount on the IHS (perhaps with pressure paper as a test).

Third, undoubtedly, some folks are going to suggest 'lapping' the IHS and possibly the block...using increasingly finer grid sand paper (eventually up to 3000 if you can get it, i.e. automotive supply stores, though 2000 will do)...this can help as well, but you will remove all the markings of your CPU

Fourth, once you tried the 'rotation method' described above, using MX4 - and a bit more of it - than CL-U/P can also help as it is a bit better in shaping itself into 'cavities'

Finally, the pattern on your pics also suggest that there is a bit of an uneven 'mounting issue' (the 4 bolts that fasten it to the back plate) that may be joining up with the convex/concave items above.


----------



## homestyle

Ive got my 3570k up to 4.7 with 1.3 vcore.

Max temps during normal operations (gaming, etc) is 75c on the hottest core.

Are these safe temps?

I dont plan on going higher. The only reason to delid would be to get lower temps. Is it worth it?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...this is also a regular topic as that happens a lot:
> 
> First, I would get some pressure paper to put between the block and IHS...it will more clearly show the contact patterns
> 
> Second, some IHS are curved just a bit (or a bit more than others), ditto for some CPU blocks...try to 'rotate' your block 90 degrees to deal with this concave/convex issue and remount on the IHS (perhaps with pressure paper as a test).
> 
> Third, undoubtedly, some folks are going to suggest 'lapping' the IHS and possibly the block...using increasingly finer grid sand paper (eventually up to 3000 if you can get it, i.e. automotive supply stores, though 2000 will do)...this can help as well, but you will remove all the markings of your CPU
> 
> Fourth, once you tried the 'rotation method' described above, using MX4 - and a bit more of it - than CL-U/P can also help as it is a bit better in shaping itself into 'cavities'
> 
> Finally, the pattern on your pics also suggest that there is a bit of an uneven 'mounting issue' (the 4 bolts that fasten it to the back plate) that may be joining up with the convex/concave items above.


^Agree with all this.
I would just add that I would only lap an IHS as a last resort. Also, I tried every position with two different H100i units. One worked best with one quarter turn to the left, the other worked much better turned a full half turn so it was upside down. You can also tighten the four bolts in different orders to get better contact where you want it. You just have to try and see what works best.

Since we are all delidded we know exactly where the die is, and I have found I get the best temps when concentrating on getting the best contact in that area of the IHS. It would be nice to have perfect contact everywhere, but if you can't then try to get the best contact over the die.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...this is also a regular topic as that happens a lot:
> 
> First, I would get some pressure paper to put between the block and IHS...it will more clearly show the contact patterns
> 
> Second, some IHS are curved just a bit (or a bit more than others), ditto for some CPU blocks...try to 'rotate' your block 90 degrees to deal with this concave/convex issue and remount on the IHS (perhaps with pressure paper as a test).
> 
> Third, undoubtedly, some folks are going to suggest 'lapping' the IHS and possibly the block...using increasingly finer grid sand paper (eventually up to 3000 if you can get it, i.e. automotive supply stores, though 2000 will do)...this can help as well, but you will remove all the markings of your CPU
> 
> Fourth, once you tried the 'rotation method' described above, using MX4 - and a bit more of it - than CL-U/P can also help as it is a bit better in shaping itself into 'cavities'
> 
> Finally, the pattern on your pics also suggest that there is a bit of an uneven 'mounting issue' (the 4 bolts that fasten it to the back plate) that may be joining up with the convex/concave items above.


Yea in that picture I just hand tightened the screw until I couldn't tighten them anymore. The block wasn't moving at all but maybe that was a problem? I definetly put the backplate on right. Where can I buy pressure paper? At a hardware store?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea in that picture I just hand tightened the screw until I couldn't tighten them anymore. The block wasn't moving at all but maybe that was a problem? I definetly put the backplate on right. Where can I buy pressure paper? At a hardware store?


One place for paper:
http://www.xoxide.com/contact-and-pressure-paper-for-cpu-contact-testing.html

If the pump was not moving at all when installed, that is what you want. Rotating the pump and trying to install it that way, as well as tightening certain screws first can you get better contact though.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> ^Agree with all this.
> I would just add that I would only lap an IHS as a last resort. Also, I tried every position with two different H100i units. One worked best with one quarter turn to the left, the other worked much better turned a full half turn so it was upside down. You can also tighten the four bolts in different orders to get better contact where you want it. You just have to try and see what works best.
> 
> Since we are all delidded we know exactly where the die is, and I have found I get the best temps when concentrating on getting the best contact in that area of the IHS. It would be nice to have perfect contact everywhere, but if you can't then try to get the best contact over the die.


Damn I was really hoping to be able to put the block on so the corsair logo was able to be read without turning your head haha. I feel like that if I put a pea sizdrop of TIM it will spead evenly. Since I used the pre-applied TIM it did't spread evely, but if I use a pea sized drop the pressure will spread it across the IHS. I'm at work right now so I don't have time to check this message so I hope it made sense.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Ive got my 3570k up to 4.7 with 1.3 vcore.
> 
> Max temps during normal operations (gaming, etc) is 75c on the hottest core.
> 
> Are these safe temps?
> 
> I dont plan on going higher. The only reason to delid would be to get lower temps. Is it worth it?


Up to you man. I would. They are safe temps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Request for club membership
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* Icydead
> *CPU*: i5 3570k
> *on die-TIM*: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM*: Arctic Cooling MX-2
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHZ (Was able to achieve same OC without delid, but I didnt like the temps so I dropped it to 4.5GHZ)
> *OC after delid:* 4700MHZ
> *Temp drops*: 15-20*C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC*: http://valid.canardpc.com/2744549
> Lapped IHS with 600, 800 and 1200 grit.
> 
> Temps etc.
> 
> 
> 
> 24 hours 20 minutes prime custom blend test stable, no whea errors.


You're In! Slap the Sig on baby!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> and also to you sir. Hang in there.


Thank you sir.


----------



## TonicX

RAVAGE THE EARTH
The reason we use Thermal paste is because the top of the cpu cover and the bottom of the heatsink are not perfectly flat and smooth. How to correct that and use minimal Thermal Paste is the objective.
Joa3D43 and justanoldman gave up some solution that hopefully will work, If not: and If the cooler block is flat like my corsair H60 *you can greatly increase surface to surface contact by lapping the IHS*.

That said after you have tried everything else, other than filling in the a large void with thermal paste. I VOTE FOR LAPPING THE IHS!
I delidded, lapped it, CLU, tightened it down first time done - haven't seen it since; haven't "fixed" it since(see TonicX Motto). The temps tell me I did it right, after all looking to see if it spread right defeats the whole process by introducing air-so that's out on final install, I did use some cheap silicon paste as a test after lapping it. check this




justanoldman says clamping the chip assembly down in the socket can bend it, so beware: he know his stuff, but I did not experience that.

I wrapped sand paper around a super-flat piece of beveled glass see: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508 This took me almost an hour but i went all the way to flat cooper removing the nickle plating from the entire top surface.
I Lapped the IHS completely flat top and bottom starting with 360 and 400 then 800 finally 1600 sandpaper. I think i could have gone to 2500 or 3000 grit.
btw dont lap the die it is silicon(Glass) or underside of the cover.(i dont see how to make the flat and it would only degrade(scratch) the smooth metal.

while lapping:
1. short back-and-forth action alternating small circular action, finishing with back-and-forth with two finger inside the cover.
2. fine grain lastly- duh
3. mount the paper on a highly,super,ultra flat surface like tempered glass or machined-metal
4. do not let the IHS rock side-to-side
5. take it all the way down to just copper- mine was concave and I needed to get down to the lowest point, i.e. the center
6. optional: lap the bottom of cover ,but not excessively(this increases pressures on die(maybe test with some cheap silicon first)
7. I recommend a stationary sanding surface, but, if you use a sand-block method (not a rubber block it will round the corners and flex to the shape of your cover) place the cover on something that stabize it in place like a paper or cloth.
8. don't get lazy and use motorizered sanders - they are not flat enough - hard to control - too aggressive.
9. control the metal dust- use gloves or wash hand before,during breaks, and after. If you do this process in your computer room, do it on paper so you can just chuck the whole mess.
10. remember your SNIPER training "SLOW IS SMOOTH AND SMOOTH IS FAST"







*"SLOW IS SMOOTH AND SMOOTH IS FAST"*









Personally i think a good lap job is essential to making the COOL LABORATORY ULTRA fill in the gap between the cpu and the heatsink.
When I was done, I slapped my IHS onto my cooling block and it sounded like a freaken magnet making contact. (do not slide it around laterally in this position - it will scratch)

You can find fine grit sandpaper at home improvement stores, hardware store, woodworking store like ROCKLER woodworking.
wipe the thing of with an achohol swab after, and Im sure your alreadly know about contaminates and static shock dangers.

Nothing to fear- just MOD IT! Take your time and im sure you'll do GREAT!

why not lap it?

1. you may want to resell/return it
2. its flat enough as-is
3. you don't have a super flat surface or the right sand papers
4. voids warrentee- oh ya that shreaded already
5. you have not tried other methods yet - this is the last resort







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*









http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/16510


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> RAVAGE THE EARTH
> The reason we use Thermal paste is because the top of the cpu cover and the bottom of the heatsink are not perfectly flat and smooth. How to correct that and use minimal Thermal Paste is the objective.
> Joa3D43 and justanoldman gave up some solution that hopefully will work, If not: and If the cooler block is flat like my corsair H60 *you can greatly increase surface to surface contact by lapping the IHS*.
> 
> That said after you have tried everything else, other than filling in the a large void with thermal paste. I VOTE FOR LAPPING THE IHS!
> I delidded, lapped it, CLU, tightened it down first time done - haven't seen it since; haven't "fixed" it since(see TonicX Motto). The temps tell me I did it right, after all looking to see if it spread right defeats the whole process by introducing air-so that's out on final install, I did use some cheap silicon paste as a test after lapping it. check this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> justanoldman says clamping the chip assembly down in the socket can bend it, so beware: he know his stuff, but I did not experience that.
> 
> I wrapped sand paper around a super-flat piece of beveled glass see: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508 This took me almost an hour but i went all the way to flat cooper removing the nickle plating from the entire top surface.
> I Lapped the IHS completely flat top and bottom starting with 360 and 400 then 800 finally 1600 sandpaper. I think i could have gone to 2500 or 3000 grit.
> btw dont lap the die it is silicon(Glass) or underside of the cover.(i dont see how to make the flat and it would only degrade(scratch) the smooth metal.
> 
> while lapping:
> 1. short back-and-forth action alternating small circular action, finishing with back-and-forth with two finger inside the cover.
> 2. fine grain lastly- duh
> 3. mount the paper on a highly,super,ultra flat surface like tempered glass or machined-metal
> 4. do not let the IHS rock side-to-side
> 5. take it all the way down to just copper- mine was concave and I needed to get down to the lowest point, i.e. the center
> 6. optional: lap the bottom of cover ,but not excessively(this increases pressures on die(maybe test with some cheap silicon first)
> 7. I recommend a stationary sanding surface, but, if you use a sand-block method (not a rubber block it will round the corners and flex to the shape of your cover) place the cover on something that stabize it in place like a paper or cloth.
> 8. don't get lazy and use motorizered sanders - they are not flat enough - hard to control - too aggressive.
> 9. control the metal dust- use gloves or wash hand before,during breaks, and after. If you do this process in your computer room, do it on paper so you can just chuck the whole mess.
> 10. remember your SNIPER training "SLOW IS SMOOTH AND SMOOTH IS FAST"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"SLOW IS SMOOTH AND SMOOTH IS FAST"*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Personally i think a good lap job is essential to making the COOL LABORATORY ULTRA fill in the gap between the cpu and the heatsink.
> When I was done, I slapped my IHS onto my cooling block and it sounded like a freaken magnet making contact. (do not slide it around laterally in this position - it will scratch)
> 
> You can find fine grit sandpaper at home improvement stores, hardware store, woodworking store like ROCKLER woodworking.
> wipe the thing of with an achohol swab after, and Im sure your alreadly know about contaminates and static shock dangers.
> 
> Nothing to fear- just MOD IT! Take your time and im sure you'll do GREAT!
> 
> why not lap it?
> 
> 1. you may want to resell/return it
> 2. its flat enough as-is
> 3. you don't have a super flat surface or the right sand papers
> 4. voids warrentee- oh ya that shreaded already
> 5. you have not tried other methods yet - this is the last resort
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*


Thanks for the detailed guide! I have an IHS from my 3570k delidding failure that I can try it on. I think I'll buy some fine grain sanding paper tonight. So the only place to buy pressure paper is online? They don't sell it at harware stores or any other stores?

REP for you!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Thanks for the detailed guide! I have an IHS from my 3570k delidding failure that I can try it on. I think I'll buy some fine grain sanding paper tonight. So the only place to buy pressure paper is online? They don't sell it at harware stores or any other stores?
> 
> REP for you!


Practice is fine, but I wouldn't do your real chip yet.
Once you lap it, it is not like you can undo it. If you really want to do it, here is the video I copied to do mine:




and part 2:




Do exactly what he does and use the grits he uses and you will be fine.

If you do lap your IHS then you are supposed to lap your cooler block too, but that voids your warranty. It is also not at all easy to try to lap the cold plate of the H100i unless you take it apart - then you have to worry about spilling any of the coolant. Point being, wait for your actual temps and multiple tries at mounting before lapping. You can always do it later.


----------



## KuuFA

Ok... So second delid (razorless method) is done now how do i apply CLU? and is it necessary to clean off the glue off the chip?


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> 
> 
> Ok... So second delid (razorless method) is done now how do i apply CLU? and is it necessary to clean off the glue off the chip?


Whats the razorless method. Do tell.


----------



## KuuFA

Updated my post It sounds pretty bad in theory but it is incredibly easy. I did both of my chips within seconds.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Practice is fine, but I wouldn't do your real chip yet.
Once you lap it, it is not like you can undo it. If you really want to do it, here is the video I copied to do mine:




and part 2:




Do exactly what he does and use the grits he uses and you will be fine.

If you do lap your IHS then you are supposed to lap your cooler block too, but that voids your warranty. It is also not at all easy to try to lap the cold plate of the H100i unless you take it apart - then you have to worry about spilling any of the coolant. Point being, wait for your actual temps and multiple tries at mounting before lapping. You can always do it later.

Yea I have some experience with sanding by hand so I think I could dp it fine and if I messed up it would be fine since its just a IHS that I am never going to use again anyways.


----------



## neopunx

Hey guys, been gone for a few months, whats new?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> 
> 
> Ok... So second delid (razorless method) is done now how do i apply CLU? and is it necessary to clean off the glue off the chip?


Cleaning the glue off is the most important part. The glue is what makes the temps so bad. They use too much glue and there is a gap between the die and the IHS filled with TIM. The glue gets removed, the die and IHS make contact with a very thin layer of CLU in between and you get the big temp drop.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So the H100i isn't perfectly flat?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So the H100i isn't perfectly flat?


No, because CPUs aren't perfectly flat. And 99/100 of their customers aren't going to lap them flat. So they try their best to make it fit to most CPUs.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So the H100i isn't perfectly flat?


A lot of heatsinks aren't perfectly flat. I'm not sure about the h100 specifically, but quite a few are made to have a slightly convex bottom, the idea being that the lowest part of the curve will press into the center of the IHS harder to make better contact right over the die.
The ones like that do have to be oriented the right way when mounting for optimal performance, with the die & not across it.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Ok... So second delid (razorless method) is done now how do i apply CLU? and is it necessary to clean off the glue off the chip?


Apply CLU with the included brush, you only need a very little bit, it will spread a long way if you keep brushing it. Some also put a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS where the die will touch it. You can watch the video on CLU being applied on their website here:
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/
Keep in mind that an IHS is a lot bigger than the die, so you don't need as much as they show.

And as Stickg1 already posted, you defintley want to remove the glue. An old credit card worked well for me.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neopunx*
> 
> Hey guys, been gone for a few months, whats new?


Ivy Bridge has gotten old, waiting for Haswell now. It's said to be releasing on Computex in June.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So the H100i isn't perfectly flat?


Yea it never touches the entire surface unlike GPUs.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Cleaning the glue off is the most important part. The glue is what makes the temps so bad. They use too much glue and there is a gap between the die and the IHS filled with TIM. The glue gets removed, the die and IHS make contact with a very thin layer of CLU in between and you get the big temp drop.


Oh Thanks for the explanation +rep!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Apply CLU with the included brush, you only need a very little bit, it will spread a long way if you keep brushing it. Some also put a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS where the die will touch it. You can watch the video on CLU being applied on their website here:
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/
> Keep in mind that an IHS is a lot bigger than the die, so you don't need as much as they show.
> 
> And as Stickg1 already posted, you defintley want to remove the glue. An old credit card worked well for me.


Yup cleaned it and now its up and running!

Here is how much i applied:


Too much? Too little? I noticed I didn't cover the very edge of the die so I covered it before I put the IHS back on.


----------



## ivanlabrie

New gpu in da house lol...8400gs xD

Stupid MVG with no vga or dvi video output, hdmi only. ARGH!
I'll be getting a couple of 5770s soon, might be decent enough till I can amass a good enough btc fortune and afford next gen stuff.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Oh Thanks for the explanation +rep!
> Yup cleaned it and now its up and running!
> 
> Here is how much i applied:
> 
> 
> Too much? Too little? I noticed I didn't cover the very edge of the die so I covered it before I put the IHS back on.


Looks good!


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> RAVAGE THE EARTH
> The reason we use Thermal paste is because the top of the cpu cover and the bottom of the heatsink are not perfectly flat and smooth. How to correct that and use minimal Thermal Paste is the objective.
> Joa3D43 and justanoldman gave up some solution that hopefully will work, If not: and If the cooler block is flat like my corsair H60 *you can greatly increase surface to surface contact by lapping the IHS*.
> 
> That said after you have tried everything else, other than filling in the a large void with thermal paste. I VOTE FOR LAPPING THE IHS!
> I delidded, lapped it, CLU, tightened it down first time done - haven't seen it since; haven't "fixed" it since(see TonicX Motto). The temps tell me I did it right, after all looking to see if it spread right defeats the whole process by introducing air-so that's out on final install, I did use some cheap silicon paste as a test after lapping it. check this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> justanoldman says clamping the chip assembly down in the socket can bend it, so beware: he know his stuff, but I did not experience that.
> 
> I wrapped sand paper around a super-flat piece of beveled glass see: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13520#post_19492508 This took me almost an hour but i went all the way to flat cooper removing the nickle plating from the entire top surface.
> I Lapped the IHS completely flat top and bottom starting with 360 and 400 then 800 finally 1600 sandpaper. I think i could have gone to 2500 or 3000 grit.
> btw dont lap the die it is silicon(Glass) or underside of the cover.(i dont see how to make the flat and it would only degrade(scratch) the smooth metal.
> 
> while lapping:
> 1. short back-and-forth action alternating small circular action, finishing with back-and-forth with two finger inside the cover.
> 2. fine grain lastly- duh
> 3. mount the paper on a highly,super,ultra flat surface like tempered glass or machined-metal
> 4. do not let the IHS rock side-to-side
> 5. take it all the way down to just copper- mine was concave and I needed to get down to the lowest point, i.e. the center
> 6. optional: lap the bottom of cover ,but not excessively(this increases pressures on die(maybe test with some cheap silicon first)
> 7. I recommend a stationary sanding surface, but, if you use a sand-block method (not a rubber block it will round the corners and flex to the shape of your cover) place the cover on something that stabize it in place like a paper or cloth.
> 8. don't get lazy and use motorizered sanders - they are not flat enough - hard to control - too aggressive.
> 9. control the metal dust- use gloves or wash hand before,during breaks, and after. If you do this process in your computer room, do it on paper so you can just chuck the whole mess.
> 10. remember your SNIPER training "SLOW IS SMOOTH AND SMOOTH IS FAST"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *"SLOW IS SMOOTH AND SMOOTH IS FAST"*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Personally i think a good lap job is essential to making the COOL LABORATORY ULTRA fill in the gap between the cpu and the heatsink.
> When I was done, I slapped my IHS onto my cooling block and it sounded like a freaken magnet making contact. (do not slide it around laterally in this position - it will scratch)
> 
> You can find fine grit sandpaper at home improvement stores, hardware store, woodworking store like ROCKLER woodworking.
> wipe the thing of with an achohol swab after, and Im sure your alreadly know about contaminates and static shock dangers.
> 
> Nothing to fear- just MOD IT! Take your time and im sure you'll do GREAT!
> 
> why not lap it?
> 
> 1. you may want to resell/return it
> 2. its flat enough as-is
> 3. you don't have a super flat surface or the right sand papers
> 4. voids warrentee- oh ya that shreaded already
> 5. you have not tried other methods yet - this is the last resort
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just kidding
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*
Click to expand...

Thanks for the detailed guide! I have an IHS from my 3570k delidding failure that I can try it on. I think I'll buy some fine grain sanding paper tonight. So the only place to buy pressure paper is online? They don't sell it at harware stores or any other stores?

REP for you!

I got some from my dentist. Cool guy.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I got some from my dentist. Cool guy.


Haha thats so funny why do they use pressure paper? I have a dentist appointment in a week.

So what fans do you think I should use for my H100i?

The stock ones:


Or these cooler master fans:


Give me your vote


----------



## KuuFA

OCN name: KuuFA
CPU: 3570K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS TIM: Z4
Mhz gained: +400MHz (for now)
OC after delid: I'm at 4.6GHz (higher overclock coming when I have time)
Temp drops: On average dropped ~25C with the hottest core dropping 30C

Was at 4.2 @ 80c hottest core on a hyper 212+ now testing 4.6 @ 1.28v 72c prime 95 1972's will validate when perfectly stable.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha thats so funny why do they use pressure paper? I have a dentist appointment in a week.
> 
> So what fans do you think I should use for my H100i?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: SNIP!
> 
> 
> 
> The stock ones:
> 
> 
> Or these cooler master fans:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Give me your vote


The stock corsairs, as the sickle flows don't have good static pressure. I have 2 lol got them free after rebate I use them on a spare computer they look cool but yea they just move a bit of air no static pressure.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> OCN name: KuuFA
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: Z4
> Mhz gained: +400MHz (for now)
> OC after delid: I'm at 4.6GHz (higher overclock coming when I have time)
> Temp drops: On average dropped ~25C with the hottest core dropping 30C
> 
> Was at 4.2 @ 80c hottest core on a hyper 212+ now testing 4.6 @ 1.28v 72c prime 95 1972's will validate when perfectly stable.


Nice







Welcome to the club


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I got some from my dentist. Cool guy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha thats so funny *why do they use pressure paper?* I have a dentist appointment in a week.
> 
> So what fans do you think I should use for my H100i?
> 
> The stock ones:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or these cooler master fans:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Give me your vote
Click to expand...

Bite adjustments for my dentures. I lost a large portion of my teeth to meth.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Bite adjustments for my dentures. I lost a large portion of my teeth to meth.


It's nice to hear that I'm not the only addict here. Are you in recovery?


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Bite adjustments for my dentures. I lost a large portion of my teeth to meth.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's nice to hear that I'm not the only addict here. Are you in recovery?
Click to expand...

Clean since shortly after my join date.

Saddest part is I'm only 25 and have a face full of acrylic.

Anyways, Here's to spending money on breaking stuff.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> It's nice to hear that I'm not the only addict here. Are you in recovery?


lol im 3 1/2 years clean.







from Opiates. i could of built a lot of computers the way i went through money


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Clean since shortly after my join date.
> 
> Saddest part is I'm only 25 and have a face full of acrylic.
> 
> Anyways, Here's to spending money on breaking stuff.


Cheers to that









22 with tracks so scarred that they will never fade away.

Let that acrylic be a reminder of where you were and where you are now.

One day at a time my friend


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol im 3 1/2 years clean.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> from Opiates. i could of built a lot of computers the way i went through money


Same here. Opiates sucked me in so slowly over a period of a year that I didn't even know it. Life is amazing now. I wake up everyday feeling like a million dollars. I have my bad days, but I am never un-grateful. I'm having so much fun building computers and writing music.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good to hear you folks recovered from that...I have family members that spent a long time doing cocaine so I can relate to that somewhat.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> The stock corsairs, as the sickle flows don't have good static pressure. I have 2 lol got them free after rebate I use them on a spare computer they look cool but yea they just move a bit of air no static pressure.


Ok thanks! Can anyone reccomend some fans that would be better than the stock corsairs? Noise doesn't really bother me because I use headphones.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good to hear you folks recovered from that...I have family members that spent a long time doing cocaine so I can relate to that somewhat.


Yea addiction is truly an epidemic. Most people imagine addicts as people bumming for money on the streets, but you really never know. It could be someone who works in a hospital or a CEO of a huge company.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> The stock corsairs, as the sickle flows don't have good static pressure. I have 2 lol got them free after rebate I use them on a spare computer they look cool but yea they just move a bit of air no static pressure.
> 
> 
> 
> Ok thanks! Can anyone reccomend some fans that would be better than the stock corsairs? Noise doesn't really bother me because I use headphones.
Click to expand...

In this case, some High RPM Deltas, Sanyo Denki, or NMB fans.

120x35mm.

If you need 140mm just get adaptors.

The fans will last forever.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> In this case, some High RPM Deltas, Sanyo Denki, or NMB fans.
> 
> 120x35mm.
> 
> If you need 140mm just get adaptors.
> 
> The fans will last forever.


Yea I heard delta's push A LOT of air. In the Phantom 820 that is on it's way I'm thinking of putting two 200mm fans on the top and then hanging the rad for my H100i from the L-Hook that is supplied with the case so I can have a push/pull setup. Do you think I should just stick three deltas on the top and then two on the rad for a crazy push/pull set-up?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> New gpu in da house lol...8400gs xD
> 
> Stupid MVG with no vga or dvi video output, hdmi only. ARGH!
> I'll be getting a couple of 5770s soon, might be decent enough till I can amass a good enough btc fortune and afford next gen stuff.


I still have mine too, in-club 8400gs bench off!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> It's nice to hear that I'm not the only addict here. Are you in recovery?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good to hear you folks recovered from that...I have family members that spent a long time doing cocaine so I can relate to that somewhat.


I was a heavy drinker through my teen years, & spent some time having a fondness for freebasing. There were a few incidents that made me realize I had to change things & I did. I kept the 420 & quit the rest of it over 20 years ago.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> New gpu in da house lol...8400gs xD
> 
> Stupid MVG with no vga or dvi video output, hdmi only. ARGH!
> I'll be getting a couple of 5770s soon, might be decent enough till I can amass a good enough btc fortune and afford next gen stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> I still have mine too, in-club 8400gs bench off!
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> It's nice to hear that I'm not the only addict here. Are you in recovery?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good to hear you folks recovered from that...I have family members that spent a long time doing cocaine so I can relate to that somewhat.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was a heavy drinker through my teen years, & spent some time having a fondness for freebasing. There were a few incidents that made me realize I had to change things & I did. I kept the 420 & quit the rest of it over 20 years ago.
Click to expand...

I had quit everything and kept the 420, Now I have a son! Fatherhood is a very good... thing.

I cannot words. But I don't do anything but overclock now.

Itried to play some games, ended up bumping my multi and trying to stabilize instead.

( While the little guy was napping )


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok thanks! Can anyone reccomend some fans that would be better than the stock corsairs? Noise doesn't really bother me because I use headphones.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I heard delta's push A LOT of air. In the Phantom 820 that is on it's way I'm thinking of putting two 200mm fans on the top and then hanging the rad for my H100i from the L-Hook that is supplied with the case so I can have a push/pull setup. Do you think I should just stick three deltas on the top and then two on the rad for a crazy push/pull set-up?


Get 120x38 Nidec Beta V ta450dc 5300rpm fans for ebay, 9usd each. 220cfm and massive pressure, you can control them with a proper pwm controller, if you need less noise for some reason.
Do a push only setup with those set as exhaust and you'll be golden.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I still have mine too, in-club 8400gs bench off!
> 
> I was a heavy drinker through my teen years, & spent some time having a fondness for freebasing. There were a few incidents that made me realize I had to change things & I did. I kept the 420 & quit the rest of it over 20 years ago.


It's ON!!!!
Now, to find a way to boot at 5ghz...or do you wanna go for 4ghz cpu efficiency with maxed gpu?
Ram I can go up to 2600mhz, so no concerns there.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I had quit everything and kept the 420, Now I have a son! Fatherhood is a very good... thing.
> 
> I cannot words. But I don't do anything but overclock now.
> 
> Itried to play some games, ended up bumping my multi and trying to stabilize instead.
> 
> ( While the little guy was napping )


Yeah, I love benching and overclocking stuff








I do like gaming, but only mmo's these days, cause I get to play with my gf or friends.


----------



## S3phro

I took the leap a week or so ago and delidded, only got around to putting some liquid pro on it this weekend..

My temps atm are 20-25c idle and 60-70c on load @ 1.450 vcore/5Ghz (3570k)

Wondering though, are those temps a little high for a xspc raystorm/ two 240mm rads and a d5 pump??

I'm thinking about re-applying the liquid pro but I want to be sure before I go through the effort of removing all the gear.

Cheers!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get 120x38 Nidec Beta V ta450dc 5300rpm fans for ebay, 9usd each. 220cfm and massive pressure, you can control them with a proper pwm controller, if you need less noise for some reason.
> Do a push only setup with those set as exhaust and you'll be golden.


Why can I only get them on ebay? jw


----------



## ivanlabrie

Temps look rather high to me...I'd re apply.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Why can I only get them on ebay? jw


Cause that's the cheapest place, they come from Israel. 9usd each, plus 6usd shipping.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fans-12VDC-120x120x38MM-5300-RPM-Nidec-VA450DC-V34809-35-New-/360472319351?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53edd31577

I wouldn't reccomend getting ball bearing fans really, cause the bearing can get damaged on its way to you. One of my 5300rpm fans is silent at 1600rpm, but the other one makes a distinct bearing noise. Nothing too terrible, but not silent.
I'd go with Gelid Silent 12 fans in push/pull for better efficiency and good price.
Ebay also has them cheaper than anywhere else, those fans rival Gentle Typhoons spec wise, and noise wise they can be quieter at certain rpm.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get 120x38 Nidec Beta V ta450dc 5300rpm fans for ebay, 9usd each. 220cfm and massive pressure, you can control them with a proper pwm controller, if you need less noise for some reason.
> Do a push only setup with those set as exhaust and you'll be golden.
> It's ON!!!!
> Now, to find a way to boot at 5ghz...or do you wanna go for 4ghz cpu efficiency with maxed gpu?
> Ram I can go up to 2600mhz, so no concerns there.
> Yeah, I love benching and overclocking stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do like gaming, but only mmo's these days, cause I get to play with my gf or friends.


With the little cards cpu speed becomes much less of a factor, there probably wouldn't be much difference between 4Ghz & 5Ghz cpu anyway, low clock will be fine.
Playing on a 3930k right now but have to get the 1155 rig back up soon, need to work on memory clock for the pro cup, gotta make sure OCN stays out of last place at least!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> With the little cards cpu speed becomes much less of a factor, there probably wouldn't be much difference between 4Ghz & 5Ghz cpu anyway, low clock will be fine.
> Playing on a 3930k right now but have to get the 1155 rig back up soon, need to work on memory clock for the pro cup, gotta make sure OCN stays out of last place at least!


But, older card...dx9 only. Those benchies eat cpu clocks like there's no tomorrow.
I'm gonna be beat with my current max oc of 4.2ghz cpu. WORST cpu ever!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I think I'm just going to fire up my new MVE with my old 620w seasonic PSU just to make sure it isn't DOA because there is so many small little trinkets on that board that I'm really worried that something might be wrong with it. Also, I'm going crazy not having a rig to play with!!!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> But, older card...dx9 only. Those benchies eat cpu clocks like there's no tomorrow.
> I'm gonna be beat with my current max oc of 4.2ghz cpu. WORST cpu ever!


Some difference but very little, the gpu is a bottleneck. I would have to find screens,but in the gt210 competition overclocking the cpu another Ghz made almost no difference in aquamark or 03.

With the little cards it almost turns into a vram overclocking competition,memory speed on the card makes the most difference in benches.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> *FtW 420* wrote...With the little cards cpu speed becomes much less of a factor, there probably wouldn't be much difference between 4Ghz & 5Ghz cpu anyway, low clock will be fine.
> Playing on a 3930k right now but have to get the 1155 rig back up soon, need to work on memory clock for the pro cup, gotta make sure OCN stays out of last place at least!


...on the HWBot Team side, Overclock.net is currently in 4th but what name are you guys using on the HWBot Pro OC ? ...don't seem to be able to find it









...got the ROG Rampage IV E and LG2011 3970x on order, I can hardly wait to run the delidded Ivy on the LG1155 ROG Max V E against it...more cores against faster IMC...any bets @ 'clock-for-clock', other than Cinebench etc ? I figure 3D11 should be faster on the 3970X (Physics score), but I am not so sure about Unigine stuff such as Valley, Heaven etc

...then on to some more extreme (non-LN2) cooling for the Ivy / Max V E


----------



## FtW 420

For the pro team we are using the name OCN Pro http://hwbot.org/team/ocn_pro/

The sb-e cpus do get slightly lower graphics scores on average, although anything that likes more cores will do better. For graphics it is pretty much like comparing a 2600k to a 3770k at the same speed. There would probably be a small drop in the graphics scores that are mainly gpu based, where there will be a good gain in others like firestrike, 3d11 & vantage. But you still have the 3770k, so will be set for all benches!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For the pro team we are using the name OCN Pro http://hwbot.org/team/ocn_pro/
> 
> The sb-e cpus do get slightly lower graphics scores on average, although anything that likes more cores will do better. For graphics it is pretty much like comparing a 2600k to a 3770k at the same speed. There would probably be a small drop in the graphics scores that are mainly gpu based, where there will be a good gain in others like firestrike, 3d11 & vantage. But you still have the 3770k, so will be set for all benches!


...exactamundo ! Per earlier discussions, I plan to build up my desk with sidewalls which will incorporate various bits such as fans, openings for cables and also pipes for a major external cooling system, then have the Max V E / 3770k, the Rampage IV / 3970x and one or two more later models all 'in there' under a sliding tempered glass plate...will look much better, save a lot of space and be more efficient with switchable-between-systems extreme cooling...might even set it up that I have an extra PSU as a 'surrogate' during heavy benching with 4 GPU cards in a single system


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok I'm about to boot her up. Just a quick cig and I'm pressing that power button. Wish me luck!!


----------



## Joa3d43

*PRICING ALERT*

...not sure why (too much 'QE' ?), but component prices seem to tighten up re for example some GPUs and CPUs...just spoke to a friend of mine who runs a lot of systems for a software company, and they suggest that G.Skill memory prices for items such as TridentX will go up by as much as 20%, that memory being highly rated by OCers (Samsung ICs) but cheaper than many of the alternatives...so G.Skill TridentX is a more extreme example (for its own reasons), but have you guys also noticed a more general firming of prices for other 'major' components ?


----------



## Hokies83

I donno i paid 69$ for my 8gb of Trident X 2400mhz lol.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok I'm about to boot her up. Just a quick cig and I'm pressing that power button. Wish me luck!!


Don't forget the gpu, & good luck!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *PRICING ALERT*
> 
> ...not sure why (too much 'QE' ?), but component prices seem to tighten up re for example some GPUs and CPUs...just spoke to a friend of mine who runs a lot of systems for a software company, and they suggest that G.Skill memory prices for items such as TridentX will go up by as much as 20%, that memory being highly rated by OCers (Samsung ICs) but cheaper than many of the alternatives...so G.Skill TridentX is a more extreme example (for its own reasons), but have you guys also noticed a more general firming of prices for other 'major' components ?


Memory prices are going up, I was just reading this earlier http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/memory/display/20130324103810_Micron_DRAM_Production_to_Remain_Limited_in_2013_and_2014.html


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Don't forget the gpu, & good luck!
> Memory prices are going up, I was just reading this earlier http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/memory/display/20130324103810_Micron_DRAM_Production_to_Remain_Limited_in_2013_and_2014.html


Yea I'm not doing the GPU's because I'm re-installing windows and my old power supply that I'm using right now doesn't support crossfire so I'm just going to install the cards and drivers for the first time when I get everything in my case and I get my x-850 back from RMA (It is going to arrive at Seasonic on friday and then who knows how long it will take to get back).

But on a brighter note... It works!!!! Installing windows right now. I just plugged in one SSD so I can know which one has windows installed on it. I'll plug in the other two and format them once I have my PSU back and everything is in the case.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Hey board
> I got somethin' real important to do 'wit you
> So set her down and question
> 
> Guys, you know I've been waiting such a long long time (such a long time)
> And now I'm ready to lay it on the box
> (Wooow) You know it's Overclock! and my heart is open wide < cant think of a fitting line
> Gonna set you somewhere, so I know you'll work when time
> 
> A board so tempting, so click that button, plop
> Take a look onscreen -- it's my board on a box
> 
> _Its on its box!_
> 
> Not gonna wait for that seasonic thing
> That sort of thing don't mean anything
> Not gonna set atop a fancy box
> Board, ya gotta know you're my gangnam star
> 
> Not gonna let you a rest in the stale
> A board like you needs tested now
> Wanna get you booting from the start
> Eager 'valuation board
> 
> It's my board on its box
> My board on a box boys
> It's my board on its box
> Ooh, my board on its box guys


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So my BIOS version is 1408 so I'm thinking of just sticking with this BIOS until a fix for the bug is released. If I end up having problems with it I'll update the BIOS to the latest one. Would that be bad to do? Or should I just update it anyways?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So my BIOS version is 1408 so I'm thinking of just sticking with this BIOS until a fix for the bug is released. If I end up having problems with it I'll update the BIOS to the latest one. Would that be bad to do? Or should I just update it anyways?


...the base BIOS should be fine...besides, you have two BIOS' onboard the Max V E







- I still have the original on one and 1604 on the other on my MVE, though per my post on the weekend, I have had no more troubles with 1604 since I used that process I shared


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*


AHAHAHA LOVE the lonely island. That has to be the funniest thing I have read on this site ever. I'm just sitting in my room alone. The ole lady is off at work. No one home. and I read that and spit my chips across the room and almost die choking on them. You're going to kill me!!

PRICELESS

Andy Samberg - Xinoxide

You guys should collaborate.

PS I'm leaving a flashlight lit on this whole system thats on the box tonight because when my GF comes in to go to bed she BETTER NOT trip over my little set-up. I already know she is going to be PO'd about the stuff on the floor. It was clean when she left and now it looks like a tornado hit it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So my CPU is idling at 30c in the BIOS right now. and the CPU is at stock settings. I haven't touched anything.The fans are just on super low speed so could that be why the temps are at 30c? How do I know if the pump is working on the H100i.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol im 3 1/2 years clean.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> from Opiates. i could of built a lot of computers the way i went through money


quit 2 years 3 month ago - booze and pills, do we have to start a need thread?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So my CPU is idling at 30c in the BIOS right now. and the CPU is at stock settings. I haven't touched anything.The fans are just on super low speed so could that be why the temps are at 30c? How do I know if the pump is working on the H100i.


dont worry about idle temps there always going to jump around. full load temps is what u want to be concerned about


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> It's nice to hear that I'm not the only addict here. Are you in recovery?


Addict here as well. 4 months of rehab. That was 2 years ago now.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So my CPU is idling at 30c in the BIOS right now. and the CPU is at stock settings. I haven't touched anything.The fans are just on super low speed so could that be why the temps are at 30c? How do I know if the pump is working on the H100i.


if it plug in its working - probably max at 4500 rpm if you want it to idle down for lower temps - AI suite fan expert 2 to set in throttle. you can install the fan expert adjust fan settings and uninstall it, it will the be in bios, and save a bios profiles or set fan speed in bios , I guess, but I haven't done that.

EDIT: wait a second doesn't the H100 have monitoring software?

EDIT2: Real answer- on your mother board each 3 or 4 pin fan power connector has a lable CPU, chassie 1, chassie 2, fan 1, fan 2, psu ect. find the one you plug the pump part of your cooler into, check the rpm's for that fan in you bios front page.


----------



## homestyle

what kind of gaming temp drops can I expect? I would use Prolimatech PK-1 on the die and over the ihs.

I know the stress test temps should see massive drops.

I'm running 4.7ghz with 1.3 vcore and hit 73C max gaming temps. is a 10C drop average?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> what kind of gaming temp drops can I expect? I would use Prolimatech PK-1 on the die and over the ihs.
> 
> I know the stress test temps should see massive drops.
> 
> I'm running 4.7ghz with 1.3 vcore and hit 73C max gaming temps. is a 10C drop average?


Yea I would say so. Can I ask why you aren't going to use something like CLU? If you are going to do something that extreme you might as well milk it for everything you can get. You should use CLU so you can get a 25c average drop. Then you can go for the big 5-0


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> what kind of gaming temp drops can I expect? I would use Prolimatech PK-1 on the die and over the ihs.
> 
> I know the stress test temps should see massive drops.
> 
> I'm running 4.7ghz with 1.3 vcore and hit 73C max gaming temps. is a 10C drop average?


I would honestly only suggest delidding if you plan on using coolabs.

For no other reason then the proof is in this thread. I would guess 10C would be generous.

Really though noone can say for sure. Go for it if you want.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> quit 2 years 3 month ago - booze and pills, do we have to start a need thread?


Good for you man. and yes, I think we do need to make a thread! I'm glad I brought the topic up because it really is nice knowing I'm not the only one in recovery.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> dont worry about idle temps there always going to jump around. full load temps is what u want to be concerned about


Ok thanks. Would I be able to feel the pump moving water? I know I won't hear it because these damn fans are so loud. I mean they are LOUD. I know I said I didn't care about noise before, but can anyone suggest a pair of fans that would be quieter than this on full load and move the same amount (or more) of air?


----------



## Solonowarion

I know there is no reason to run at 5 ghz I just want to get it stable then I will go back to my 4.7 or 4.5 OC.

At 1.504 volts not really going over 75C. Could I run it as is? How much degradation can we approximate?


----------



## TonicX

^^ what they said COOL LABORATORY ULTRA if you cant find any a ask me more a link or go to their site and they have 3 or 4 on-line distributors - btw - look at the members list on page 1 of this thread, we all had to wait for the best possible product.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Addict here as well. 4 months of rehab. That was 2 years ago now.


congrats brother







2years


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok thanks. Would I be able to feel the pump moving water? I know I won't hear it because these damn fans are so loud. I mean they are LOUD. I know I said I didn't care about noise before, but can anyone suggest a pair of fans that would be quieter than this on full load and move the same amount (or more) of air?


hook them up to a fan ccontroller. i have my h100's fans hooked up to my nzxt 420 case fan controller. lolz


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I know there is no reason to run at 5 ghz I just want to get it stable then I will go back to my 4.7 or 4.5 OC.
> 
> At 1.504 volts not really going over 75C. Could I run it as is? How much degradation can we approximate?


Yeah, that's a good question, idk, but I would like to know what these higher vcores could do to a chip or a mb, or whatever, because now I have all kinds of headroom temp wise but my vcore is 1.352 at 4800,

attention: Can one of you elders briefly or no so briefly explain degradation?


----------



## Rucka315

I can tell you i had a 2600k that died on me that i had at 1.5v for about 8 months.


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I would say so. Can I ask why you aren't going to use something like CLU? If you are going to do something that extreme you might as well milk it for everything you can get. You should use CLU so you can get a 25c average drop. Then you can go for the big 5-0


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I would honestly only suggest delidding if you plan on using coolabs.
> 
> For no other reason then the proof is in this thread. I would guess 10C would be generous.
> 
> Really though noone can say for sure. Go for it if you want.


i've gone through lots of threads about delidding. the biggest factor helping lower temps is not the intel tim. its actually removing the glue and the gap, which placies the ihs closer on the die.

the other reason for using regular tim is that i plan on going commando (bare die) in the future. and cleaning up the residue of clu will be pain.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Guys I'm having a problem with the H100i. I downloaded the Corsair Link program, but cannot find the firmware for the life of me. Isn't that what I use to control the fan speed? HELP


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> i've gone through lots of threads about delidding. the biggest factor helping lower temps is not the intel tim. its actually removing the glue and the gap, which placies the ihs closer on the die.
> 
> the other reason for using regular tim is that i plan on going commando (bare die) in the future. and cleaning up the residue of clu will be pain.


CLU is actually really easy to get off the die. It's hard to get off of metals though. I think that liquid pro is what is hard to get off of the die. Correct me if I'm wrong. I can tell you that my CLU wiped off the die really easily.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I did a quick p95 test of 4.5Ghz at 1.27v and temps didn't get over 47c and the fans didn't spin up at all. I guess that means its working!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Yeah, that's a good question, idk, but I would like to know what these higher vcores could do to a chip or a mb, or whatever, because now I have all kinds of headroom temp wise but my vcore is 1.352 at 4800,
> 
> attention: Can one of you elders briefly or no so briefly explain degradation?


I had a good link somewhere explaining it, figures it was on another OS now that i can use it...
I don't remember the works, the short version of electromigration is that with electricity running through the cpu, the electrons & ions in the electrical pathways tend to jump around. This damages the pathways, generally a slow process & things last for years.
Degradation happens even at stock cpu clocks & voltages but higher current & higher temperatures speed up the process. Turning up the voltage generally makes higher temperatures at the same time so it's a double whammy.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ok guys, so 3227Cxxx batch sucks but not as much as I first thought...
After replacing my borked gpus with a good 8400gs I started testing again and got to 4.5ghz stable with "only" 1.336v (cpu-z under cinebench load).
Not as bad as I thought!
Gonna try climbing higher from the os for benching purposes.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I did a quick p95 test of 4.5Ghz at 1.27v and temps didn't get over 47c and the fans didn't spin up at all. I guess that means its working!


CONGRATS you are a water-cooled, extreme overclocker!









can you say 'nano-vision enabled' while breathing-in. good. feels nice does it? sounds nice does it? GOOOOOD!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ha! 91c max temp on my hottest core, 21c ambient. 4.5ghz at 1.336v...big MEH!

EDIT: yeah, found my max stable oc without delidding. this chip SUCKS pretty much, but not as badly as I first thought.

Today's my bday too...


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Today's my bday too...










*Happy B'day ivan..*


----------



## ivanlabrie

Thanks man! Good to see you alive and kicking








I got a chip like yours now...can barely do 4.5ghz on air lol
2600mhz max ram validation.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ha! 91c max temp on my hottest core, 21c ambient. 4.5ghz at 1.336v...big MEH!
> 
> EDIT: yeah, found my max stable oc without delidding. this chip SUCKS pretty much, but not as badly as I first thought.
> 
> Today's my bday too...


Happy bday!

Hopefully the chip does well with cold.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Today's my bday too...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Happy B'day ivan..*
Click to expand...

*Happy Birthday Ivan..*


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thanks man! Good to see you alive and kicking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got a chip like yours now...can barely do 4.5ghz on air lol
> 2600mhz max ram validation.


youre hitting 100+C with it running 4.5ghz?

o, did you see that vid with using a vice, a hammer, and a wooden block?
might want to watch it, looks like a very easy way to delid, gonna try it myselfs soon..

http://www.fnarfbargle.com/private/130315-Delid-vid/IMG_0081.m4v


----------



## DoooX

Just a quick question. (It's a big subject cannot search for it)
Is it necessary to re-aplly that black silicon, or whatever, on the edges after cleaning the chip itself and putting a new TIM ? Or the whole process is just indented to be "remove everything, clean it as much as possible and just put the IHS back on the PCB while clamping it with the socket bracket" ?


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DoooX*
> 
> Just a quick question. (It's a big subject cannot search for it)
> Is it necessary to re-aplly that black silicon, or whatever, on the edges after cleaning the chip itself and putting a new TIM ? Or the whole process is just indented to be "remove everything, clean it as much as possible and just put the IHS back on the PCB while clamping it with the socket bracket" ?


its not necessary







I mean you can do it if you want, but why







Just clean it as much as possible.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> o, did you see that vid with using a vice, a hammer, and a wooden block?
> might want to watch it, looks like a very easy way to delid, gonna try it myselfs soon..
> 
> http://www.fnarfbargle.com/private/130315-Delid-vid/IMG_0081.m4v


dude







Are you telling me that I could have done this 3 second thing instead of sweating while cutting through with razor ? Im just going to facepalm into my pillow


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> dude
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you telling me that I could have done this 3 second thing instead of sweating while cutting through with razor ? Im just going to facepalm into my pillow


yes ..i am ....LOL

nah, i didnt know this way of delidding yet, and i tried to figure out many (safe) ways,
but we got stuck with the use of 3 different blades, like we show on page 1..
maybe useful for future delidders tho, but first has to be done a few times, to make sure it works well








but it looks good to me, cant wait to give it a try, i still have some pentiums here, but im afraid they are all soldered,
making it hard to try this ...maybe ivanlabrie and his new chip can try? *blink blink*


----------



## jdm317

A little update for me. http://valid.canardpc.com/2745715 at 1.63v







and still sitting at 5°C idle. It was 1.6v but kept rebooting, stays in windows and can surf at 1.63

Reinstalled the window mod last night. 3000cfm turbine fan (very quiet) forcing 0°C outside air through the front radiator. Forgot to mention that part.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I checked my Antec 920 and it was almost but not perfectly flat either. Just an fyi


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ha! 91c max temp on my hottest core, 21c ambient. 4.5ghz at 1.336v...big MEH!
> 
> EDIT: yeah, found my max stable oc without delidding. this chip SUCKS pretty much, but not as badly as I first thought.
> 
> Today's my bday too...
> 
> 
> 
> Bummer. Totally sound like my old 3570k! Sorry to hear that, but happy birthday!!!


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ha! 91c max temp on my hottest core, 21c ambient. 4.5ghz at 1.336v...big MEH!
> 
> EDIT: yeah, found my max stable oc without delidding. this chip SUCKS pretty much, but not as badly as I first thought.
> 
> Today's my bday too...


Happy birthday man!! Hope you have a good one!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok so does anyone know how I can control the lights and the fan speed on my H100i? I heard that there is a program to do that and I am using Corsair Link, but I don't see any option to do that and I went to update the firmware because I figured that was the problem, but it looks like there isn't any firmware available on the site. What is going on with this???


----------



## ivanlabrie

Thanks a lot guys!

And, no, I won't be delidding my only chip atm cause I can't afford to get a replacement (this one CAN'T be replaced *hint*)
Plus, I don't see the point with such high vcore for 4.5ghz, and I wanna see how good it'll do on dry ice.

Heading to the gym, ttyl guys


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> i've gone through lots of threads about delidding. the biggest factor helping lower temps is not the intel tim. its actually removing the glue and the gap, which placies the ihs closer on the die.
> 
> the other reason for using regular tim is that i plan on going commando (bare die) in the future. and cleaning up the residue of clu will be pain.


CLU is easy to clean off.
CLP isnt as easy but you can still get it off.

Someone correct me if I am wrong but a couple off times wasnt it said here that a bare die application only resulted in a couple degrees more of a temp drop?

The biggest factor is definitely the tim .


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> CLU is easy to clean off.
> CLP isnt as easy but you can still get it off.
> 
> Someone correct me if I am wrong but a couple off times wasnt it said here that a bare die application only resulted in a couple degrees more of a temp drop?
> 
> The biggest factor is definitely the tim .


I am running bare DIE and getting about the same temps as everyone else that have successfully delidded and are still using the IHS, might be a tad lower.

I built a chiller, and don't know whether to use bare die or slap the IHS back on to take care of the air gap around the DIE. Maybe *FTW 420* or some of the other sub zero benchers can enlighten me on this. I have dielectric grease, rubber eraser, Dragon Skin FX Pro, and PLENTY of armaflex (about 120ft of 2"x1/4"). Without the socket holder I feel like it solves a lot of problems and eliminates the need for the eraser. I can still run without the socket holder and still use the IHS. I just don't know if the fact that I delidded will cause possible air in the vacant area around the die itself if I use the IHS again. If it does then condensation will surely form. Without it I can just cover the area around the DIE in dielectric grease. This little headache is the primary reason I have taken a break from completing the chiller.

Sorry to change the subject. If anyone with experience has suggestions feel free to PM me with your ideas.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ha! 91c max temp on my hottest core, 21c ambient. 4.5ghz at 1.336v...big MEH!
> 
> EDIT: yeah, found my max stable oc without delidding. this chip SUCKS pretty much, but not as badly as I first thought.
> 
> Today's my bday too...
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


*...Happy Birthday IvanL*







- older and wiser, or, like good wine, older and just better


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> dude
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you telling me that I could have done this 3 second thing instead of sweating while cutting through with razor ? Im just going to facepalm into my pillow


...or save a bit of flesh and blood (healed fine, though) ?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...or save a bit of flesh and blood (healed fine, though) ?


No pain, no gain!








Glad it healed up. Could have been much worse.









I agree though. Sweating, trembling from intense focus, fear of spontaneous combustion. All things I experienced while delidding.









..and having 1 shoe and sock off with your toes wrapped around something metal...(my bedframe)


----------



## Solonowarion

Format isnt perfect, I didnt read the rules before. I just had my prime 95 tests not IBT.

OCN name: Solonowarion
CPU: i5 3570k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.7 ghz I kept the same overclock.
Temp drops: 18c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Will post Val when I get home.

I put too much CLU on die will try less soon and get back with better results.

On another note I was able to get 5.0 ghz on 1.504 volts and keep the same temps as my 4.7 - 1.328 v oc.

This pic was for the Ivy stable club.


----------



## TonicX

Hi is this the right thread? I recently delidded my ivy bridge, have had a successful rehab from drugs and alcohol, have grieved the lost of a pet missing an appendage, and hate and/or am afraid of clowns.
Wuzzup y'all!

Solonowarion - did you get your "degradation" question answered yet? If so, what's the low-down?

CONGRATs on the 18 degrees Lower temps!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I know there is no reason to run at 5 ghz I just want to get it stable then I will go back to my 4.7 or 4.5 OC.
> 
> At 1.504 volts not really going over 75C. Could I run it as is? How much degradation can we approximate?


I have seen exactly zero confirmed reports of measurable eletromigration (degradation) in an Ivy chip running at what is considered normal voltages and temps. If you are at 1.5v or so and below, and your real life day to day temps are below 60c you may or may not see excessive degradation over the coming years. Some say 1.5v is safe others say it is not, some say heat matters more others say voltage matters more.

As has already been posted, we all know that degradation happens to every chip since heat and voltage cause it to happen. But we know chips can go 10+ years without issue at stock. So if we say you increase the pace of degradation by 300%, then maybe you see negative results of ocing in three years or so. This is ocn so many won't care beyond three years - or even less.

If you are paranoid about degradation on a 200 to 300 dollar chip, then you probably would not have delidded and oced your chip. There is no one out there who knows exactly how far you can push Ivy, it is too young, and no scientific tests have been done.

It would also depend on how you use it. If you fold everyday then you should be more careful. If you use your machine sometimes to game, surf, work, etc. and shut it down at night, you probably don't need to be as careful.

I realize that doesn't actually answer your question, but there is no answer yet, we don't know. From what is worth, your temps look very good, and 1.5 is not exactly excessive, so I would be surprised if you have any really serious degradation in the next few years.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> i've gone through lots of threads about delidding. the biggest factor helping lower temps is not the intel tim. its actually removing the glue and the gap, which placies the ihs closer on the die.
> 
> the other reason for using regular tim is that i plan on going commando (bare die) in the future. and cleaning up the residue of clu will be pain.


As the 20th person to say the same thing, clu is really easy to get off the die, and many have already found that you have to use ultra or pro on the die to get the best results from delidding.

Some have had luck with bare die, but the temp drop is not all that great, and most will tell you it is not worth the trouble. Your temps look high, I would guess there is an issue with your cooler, maybe too much tim, too little tim, or not a clean installation which is preventing good contact between the IHS and cold plate. I would try to reseat the cooler and try to get a better tim spread then see what your temps are.


----------



## maestrobg

5ghz linx, on the balcony

144 gflops !!!!

what do you say ?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maestrobg*
> 
> 5ghz linx, on the balcony
> 
> 144 gflops !!!!
> 
> what do you say ?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Can someone help me with my H100I please! I am using thee corsair link software and I can't find the firmware for my block and I don't know how to see what version of the firmware I am currently using. I can't see any options to customize the LED's or change the fan speed. The only thing I see in the corsair link software that shows that it recognizes is the update firmware page, but it requires me to have the firmware file on the computer to update it. So I currently have no control over my H100I.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Can someone help me with my H100I please! I am using thee corsair link software and I can't find the firmware for my block and I don't know how to see what version of the firmware I am currently using. I can't see any options to customize the LED's or change the fan speed. The only thing I see in the corsair link software that shows that it recognizes is the update firmware page, but it requires me to have the firmware file on the computer to update it. So I currently have no control over my H100I.


maybe this will help?
http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=111405


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Hi is this the right thread? I recently delidded my ivy bridge, have had a successful rehab from drugs and alcohol, have grieved the lost of a pet missing an appendage, and hate and/or am afraid of clowns.
> Wuzzup y'all!
> 
> Solonowarion - did you get your "degradation" question answered yet? If so, what's the low-down?
> 
> CONGRATs on the 18 degrees Lower temps!


haha this IS the right thread! Yeah I got it answered as best I could.

Thanks and welcome to the thread.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I have seen exactly zero confirmed reports of measurable eletromigration (degradation) in an Ivy chip running at what is considered normal voltages and temps. If you are at 1.5v or so and below, and your real life day to day temps are below 60c you may or may not see excessive degradation over the coming years. Some say 1.5v is safe others say it is not, some say heat matters more others say voltage matters more.
> 
> As has already been posted, we all know that degradation happens to every chip since heat and voltage cause it to happen. But we know chips can go 10+ years without issue at stock. So if we say you increase the pace of degradation by 300%, then maybe you see negative results of ocing in three years or so. This is ocn so many won't care beyond three years - or even less.
> 
> If you are paranoid about degradation on a 200 to 300 dollar chip, then you probably would not have delidded and oced your chip. There is no one out there who knows exactly how far you can push Ivy, it is too young, and no scientific tests have been done.
> 
> It would also depend on how you use it. If you fold everyday then you should be more careful. If you use your machine sometimes to game, surf, work, etc. and shut it down at night, you probably don't need to be as careful.
> 
> I realize that doesn't actually answer your question, but there is no answer yet, we don't know. From what is worth, your temps look very good, and 1.5 is not exactly excessive, so I would be surprised if you have any really serious degradation in the next few years.


Thank you for that JAOM that makes sense. I cant see myself having this cpu oc'd for more than a year. Ill just bring this PC to the office and build a new one. repped.


----------



## chronicfx

Anyone know if you can run this ram without the cooling fan and having the top heatspreader removed without it overheating?

GSKILL Trident CL9 9-11-11-31 2400mhz

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233259

and how would it compare to this in speed?

Corsair 1600MHz 7-8-8-24

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233259

Tired of my lowly physics score in 3dmark11..

I currently have this

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233389


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> *...Happy Birthday IvanL*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - older and wiser, or, like good wine, older and just better


Thanks a lot man!








I think just older, and with less storage space and ram.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Anyone know if you can run this ram without the cooling fan and having the top heatspreader removed without it overheating?
> 
> GSKILL Trident CL9 9-11-11-31 2400mhz
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233259
> 
> and how would it compare to this in speed?
> 
> Corsair 1600MHz 7-8-8-24
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233259
> 
> Tired of my lowly physics score in 3dmark11..
> 
> I currently have this
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233389


The heatspreader and fan is purely cosmetic...You can overvolt to 1.9v on air and you won't have a problem if you have case airflow going on.
2400mhz will be a lot faster than your 1600mhz cl7-8-8-24 config.

Check my memtest I posted a few posts back. Secondary and tertiary timings make a big difference, mhz and decent timings too.


----------



## Joa3d43

*CPU Fan 4pin vs 3 pin*

...just picked up the Rampage IV though still waiting for the 3970X...looking forward to compete against myself re MaxVEx / delidded low 'v' 3770K vs Rampage IV Ex / 3970X...can't loose, can't win...may have been cheaper to just play tic-ta-to a lot









...when building up the Rampage / 3970X, I wonder about a pile of extra Noctua 120mm fans I have for the water-cooling...specifically, they are '3-pin', not '4-pin'...even after many years of OCing, I have never tried to run a 3-pin fan plugged into the CPU-dedicated fan header...I know if that specific CPU 4-pin fan-header is not connected at all, the board will not boot up at all...

...but what about putting a 3-pin on that specific header ? I suppose I can find out quickly anyways by just trying it when the CPU arrives, but if anyone has any experience / advice on this, it would be greatly appreciated...my work takes me across a pile of time-zones, and by the time I try this, it will be when stores are closed...nothing worse than having all these new toys and missing a minor connector to make it boot Tx


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *CPU Fan 4pin vs 3 pin*
> 
> ...just picked up the Rampage IV though still waiting for the 3970X...looking forward to compete against myself re MaxVEx / delidded low 'v' 3770K vs Rampage IV Ex / 3970X...can't loose, can't win...may have been cheaper to just play tic-ta-to a lot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...when building up the Rampage / 3970X, I wonder about a pile of extra Noctua 120mm fans I have for the water-cooling...specifically, they are '3-pin', not '4-pin'...even after many years of OCing, I have never tried to run a 3-pin fan plugged into the CPU-dedicated fan header...I know if that specific CPU 4-pin fan-header is not connected at all, the board will not boot up at all...
> 
> ...but what about putting a 3-pin on that specific header ? I suppose I can find out quickly anyways by just trying it when the CPU arrives, but if anyone has any experience / advice on this, it would be greatly appreciated...my work takes me across a pile of time-zones, and by the time I try this, it will be when stores are closed...nothing worse than having all these new toys and missing a minor connector to make it boot Tx


3 pin connectors work fine in all the 4 pin headers
To boot with nothing plugged into the cpu fan header you have to disable 'stop on f1 errors' in the boot options.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 3 pin connectors work fine in all the 4 pin headers
> To boot with nothing plugged into the cpu fan header you have to disable 'stop on f1 errors' in the boot options.


...great - THANKS - and a virtual 'rep +' (since you can't take any real ones as an editor...)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Thanks a lot man!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think just older, and with less storage space and ram.


....LOL squared







...but then, you already wrote you're fond of avocados...throw in lots of fish/fish-oils, red wine (not too much), LOTs of coffee, nut oils, olive oil and milk (Vit D for DNA), and you might 'defrag' your storage space and volt up your ram. *Then again...*



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



...in a small town, a noted local citizen turns 100 years old...local dignitaries and the press attend to help celebrate...the local beat reporter asks the 100-year-old celebrant "What is your secret to live so long" ? He answers, "I never smoked, I never drank alcohol and I never married and stayed celibate..."

...people nod in approval re what seems like a healthy life style...all of a sudden, there is a huge noise coming from the next room, along with people shouting at each other...the birthday 'boy' says, slightly embarrassed, "Don't worry - that's just my dad...he's drunk again and fighting with his girlfriend"


----------



## stickg1

I got a windowed side panel for my Arc Midi. I was going to make my own but I got lazy. Since the R4 and Midi are the same dimension they have the same side panel and it came with the noise dampening material which is cool.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I got a windowed side panel for my Arc Midi. I was going to make my own but I got lazy. Since the R4 and Midi are the same dimension they have the same side panel and it came with the noise dampening material which is cool.


That looks pretty awesome man!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *CPU Fan 4pin vs 3 pin*
> 
> ...just picked up the Rampage IV though still waiting for the 3970X...looking forward to compete against myself re MaxVEx / delidded low 'v' 3770K vs Rampage IV Ex / 3970X...can't loose, can't win...may have been cheaper to just play tic-ta-to a lot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...when building up the Rampage / 3970X, I wonder about a pile of extra Noctua 120mm fans I have for the water-cooling...specifically, they are '3-pin', not '4-pin'...even after many years of OCing, I have never tried to run a 3-pin fan plugged into the CPU-dedicated fan header...I know if that specific CPU 4-pin fan-header is not connected at all, the board will not boot up at all...
> 
> ...but what about putting a 3-pin on that specific header ? I suppose I can find out quickly anyways by just trying it when the CPU arrives, but if anyone has any experience / advice on this, it would be greatly appreciated...my work takes me across a pile of time-zones, and by the time I try this, it will be when stores are closed...nothing worse than having all these new toys and missing a minor connector to make it boot Tx


Right now I have a 3 pin connector on my CPU fan header for my H100i and that is all on my ASUS MVE and it boots up fine.

I do have an A0 on the debug that doesn't go away. It means IDE initialization is started. Anyone know what that is about?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> maybe this will help?
> http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=111405


Thanks. Turns out I didn't have the USB cable plugged into the USB header.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Right now I have a 3 pin connector on my CPU fan header for my H100i and that is all on my ASUS MVE and it boots up fine....


Tx...one thing I need to check is whether a 3 pin CPU fan shows up right and will be programmable in Asus Suite / FanExpert2 as I prefer that over external fan controls (which have their own merit but often require either a USB or even serial port)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That looks pretty awesome man!!


Thanks!

I'm pretty happy with my build right now. Happier than I've been since I start building again about a year and a half ago. I always buy stuff that looks good or the reviews/benchmarks look good and I get it and I'm not satisfied. This is the 5th PC I've built in the past year and a half and I think this one is a keeper.

3570K @ 4.8GHz
ASRock Z77 Extreme6
Crucial Ballistix Tactical Low Pro @ 2200MHz 10-10-10-28
Gigabyte WF3 OC 670
Fractal Arc Midi Windowed


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Tx...one thing I need to check is whether a 3 pin CPU fan shows up right and will be programmable in Asus Suite / FanExpert2 as I prefer that over external fan controls (which have their own merit but often require either a USB or even serial port)


They will work with fan xpert...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> I'm pretty happy with my build right now. Happier than I've been since I start building again about a year and a half ago. I always buy stuff that looks good or the reviews/benchmarks look good and I get it and I'm not satisfied. This is the 5th PC I've built in the past year and a half and I think this one is a keeper.
> 
> 3570K @ 4.8GHz
> ASRock Z77 Extreme6
> Crucial Ballistix Tactical Low Pro @ 2200MHz 10-10-10-28
> Gigabyte WF3 OC 670
> Fractal Arc Midi Windowed


Looks very nice, and it's a solid setup all around.
I want some of those ram sticks, they perform quite good for 4gb sticks.
(I've seen them do 2400mhz cl8-8-10-24-1t, and they also do 2933mhz...)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I want some of those ram sticks, they perform quite good for 4gb sticks.
> (I've seen them do 2400mhz cl8-8-10-24-1t, and they also do 2933mhz...)


I can't get mine to do anything like that. But honestly for the $50 I paid for them BNIB, to get 8GB of 2200MHz at only 1.5v I'm pretty happy with that.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Guys, I'm totally in love with this board. It comes with two wires that I can plug into the side of the board and plug my testers for my multimeter into to watch CPU (or whatever I want) voltage. Voltage is pretty much spot on (about .002 off) between my MM and CPU-z. I'm testing out 4.7Ghz at 1.362v (took 1.491v on Asrock Z77 Extreme4) and am two hours into P95 with no WHEA errors or P95 errors. At that voltage and multiplier my Asrock failed in about 20 minutes. I just can't say enough good things about this motherboard not to mention the ridiculous amount of features it has. Temps are great too.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> They will work with fan xpert...
> Looks very nice, and it's a solid setup all around.
> I want some of those ram sticks, they perform quite good for 4gb sticks.
> (I've seen them do 2400mhz cl8-8-10-24-1t, and they also do 2933mhz...)


One more post!!!! 4000!!!!! WOOT


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Guys, I'm totally in love with this board. It comes with two wires that I can plug into the side of the board and plug my testers for my multimeter into to watch CPU (or whatever I want) voltage. Voltage is pretty much spot on (about .002 off) between my MM and CPU-z. I'm testing out 4.7Ghz at 1.362v (took 1.491v on Asrock Z77 Extreme4) and am two hours into P95 with no WHEA errors or P95 errors. At that voltage and multiplier my Asrock failed in about 20 minutes. I just can't say enough good things about this motherboard not to mention the ridiculous amount of features it has. Temps are great too.


Gotta love that board...I'm happy with mine, and it's like 1/2 of yours.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> One more post!!!! 4000!!!!! WOOT


Done deal...xD


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Gotta love that board...I'm happy with mine, and it's like 1/2 of yours.
> Done deal...xD


Yeaaaaaaaaah BABY!!! haha


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://store.steampowered.com/agecheck/app/8190/

Someone else posted it here...I always wanted that game lol


----------



## Swag

I want Tomb Raider.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> They will work with fan xpert...


...even better, 'cause I have 7 'orphaned' Noctua NF-P12s from other builds / switching to push from push / pull laying around...no more unemployment for them


----------



## iwalkwithedead

EDIT: Already shown in this thread xD

Thought this was interesting. If you don't already know about it. [Delid without razor]


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








http://www.overclock.net/t/1370209/delid-3570k-without-a-razor-blade/0_40


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iwalkwithedead*
> 
> Thought this was interesting. If you don't already know about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1370209/delid-3570k-without-a-razor-blade/0_40


...yup, very interesting...but was already posted here earlier today


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iwalkwithedead*
> 
> Thought this was interesting. If you don't already know about it.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1370209/delid-3570k-without-a-razor-blade/0_40


Oh yeah a guy made a thread with this method a couple weeks ago and it blew my mind. After tedious sweating and shaking and sawing with a small razor blade I could have just hit the damn thing with a hammer on a vice. A couple of people have done this successfully since then. Haven't heard of any fails yet. (knock on wood)

Alright I'm going to sleep and let P95 run over night and if I wake up without any errors or WHEA errors (knock on wood again) I am going to be so amazed. Been running for 3 and 1/2 hours now. Have to get lots of sleep to emotionally prepare myself for tomorrow and the day after. Goodnight!!


----------



## iwalkwithedead

Alright, I'll remove this one so it's not being shown over and over again. xD Thanks


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Gotta love that board...I'm happy with mine, and it's like 1/2 of yours.
> Done deal...xD


Got the 8400 in the rig & ready for action!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Got the 8400 in the rig & ready for action!


I like Aquamark, one of my favorite benchies...I can run it at 4.9ghz it seems. hmmm
Now, to volt mod the 8400gs.


----------



## Joa3d43

..*.FtW..*.not sure if running old cards is a hobby or you do it for the ProCup at HWBot, but I got a couple of old cards here...like a ATI Radeon 9800, another slightly younger ATI Radeon (I never used it but it's an All-in-Winder w/TV) and an older Winfast Nvidia, circa 2000endish


----------



## ivanlabrie

gpu benching is cool...you can re bench every time a better cpu comes out.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..*.FtW..*.not sure if running old cards is a hobby or you do it for the ProCup at HWBot, but I got a couple of old cards here...like a ATI Radeon 9800, another slightly younger ATI Radeon (I never used it but it's an All-in-Winder w/TV) and an older Winfast Nvidia, circa 2000endish


More of a hobby, although all hardware gets hardware points. The pro cup is big money hardware, I still need better gear to compete.
I haven't benched agp cards in a while, would have to dig out the pIII rig for those. It would be cool if they made a new board with an old school agp slot in it...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> gpu benching is cool...you can re bench every time a better cpu comes out.


This is part of it as well. New more efficient cpus can get better scores with the old cards, & they do still have competitions for older hardware.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> gpu benching is cool...you can re bench every time a better cpu comes out.


...indeed







- I much prefer it over other benching at HWBot, as much as those have their own appeal...and since I find myself with a new CPU soon, I can rerun a whole bunch of things...mind you that 3970X will have to go to work in an encryption biz application in the fall, so I do not want to break it...

...the 3770K / MaxVEx on the other hand will experience 'a much colder climate' soon


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good call









I'll try to get a pot as soon as possible, this chip is begging for some -78c love.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> More of a hobby, although all hardware gets hardware points. The pro cup is big money hardware, I still need better gear to compete.
> I haven't benched agp cards in a while, would have to dig out the pIII rig for those. It would be cool if they made a new board with an old school agp slot in it...
> This is part of it as well. New more efficient cpus can get better scores with the old cards, & they do still have competitions for older hardware.


...I even throw in a working AGP board and CPU...the board is an 'Abit'...just don't try to get an updated BIOS for it as the company went bust, due to some 'financial irregularities' as I recall

...you would do me a favour as all the old stuff has to go somewhere, before it gets chucked...so if you're interested...


----------



## dr/owned

Anyone on OCN in the US offer a delidding service? I wish I could do the wood-n-hammer method of deliding, but I don't have a bench vise. Or a bench sturdy enough for one.

Seriously...I'll mail someone my 3770k along with a prepaid return label. As long as he/she has exp. doing the job I'm down for it. I'd have to order another 3770k though to use while my current one is away.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm gonna try the vise thing when I get a new 3770k...

As for the old stuff, I could give those some love, but shipping can get pricey.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm gonna try the vise thing when I get a new 3770k...
> 
> As for the old stuff, I could give those some love, but shipping can get pricey.


...yup, and FtW lives fairly close...otherwise, you too are more than welcome to it at $0, though you would have to arrange / $ shipping...British Columbia to Argentina...


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Anyone on OCN in the US offer a delidding service? I wish I could do the wood-n-hammer method of deliding, but I don't have a bench vise. Or a bench sturdy enough for one.
> 
> Seriously...I'll mail someone my 3770k along with a prepaid return label. As long as he/she has exp. doing the job I'm down for it. I'd have to order another 3770k though to use while my current one is away.


I would only do it if I got to play with the chip for a week or so.

Nothing too crazy, just to get familiar with a different chip.

I employ the "Extreme take my time method" to delidding.

I don't apply any pressure with my blade, and it takes like 20 minutes of continuous rocking back and forth.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I even throw in a working AGP board and CPU...the board is an 'Abit'...just don't try to get an updated BIOS for it as the company went bust, due to some 'financial irregularities' as I recall
> 
> ...you would do me a favour as all the old stuff has to go somewhere, before it gets chucked...so if you're interested...


That would be cool, older stuff can be a challenge, it'll be fun to see what it all can do.


----------



## homestyle

so with the decreased temps, were any of you able to lower the vcore for a given overclock compared to your pre-delidded overclocks?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That would be cool, older stuff can be a challenge, it'll be fun to see what it all can do.


...Done !









EDIT: The Abit board is an IC7-G (even have the manual for it), the CPU a '2.8' GHz HT which will go up to 3.2 on air...I also have some memory sticks that go with it..incl. gold spreader OCZs, in addition to the vid cards


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> so with the decreased temps, were any of you able to lower the vcore for a given overclock compared to your pre-delidded overclocks?


...*yes*, by approx. 0.05v @ 5.1+ Giggles - BUT that not only included delidding & CL-U TIM everywhere but also a powerful custom water loop addition...all told, these dropped temps by almost 30 C combined which was enough to lower v-core


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha thats so funny why do they use pressure paper? I have a dentist appointment in a week.
> 
> So what fans do you think I should use for my H100i?
> 
> The stock ones:
> 
> 
> Or these cooler master fans:
> 
> 
> Give me your vote


I'd try the cooler master fans out honestly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> OCN name: KuuFA
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: Z4
> Mhz gained: +400MHz (for now)
> OC after delid: I'm at 4.6GHz (higher overclock coming when I have time)
> Temp drops: On average dropped ~25C with the hottest core dropping 30C
> 
> Was at 4.2 @ 80c hottest core on a hyper 212+ now testing 4.6 @ 1.28v 72c prime 95 1972's will validate when perfectly stable.


You're in! just let me know when you get it stable.







Slap the sig on!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok thanks! Can anyone reccomend some fans that would be better than the stock corsairs? Noise doesn't really bother me because I use headphones.


get cougars! love those girl.... i mean fans....








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For the pro team we are using the name OCN Pro http://hwbot.org/team/ocn_pro/
> 
> The sb-e cpus do get slightly lower graphics scores on average, although anything that likes more cores will do better. For graphics it is pretty much like comparing a 2600k to a 3770k at the same speed. There would probably be a small drop in the graphics scores that are mainly gpu based, where there will be a good gain in others like firestrike, 3d11 & vantage. But you still have the 3770k, so will be set for all benches!


how do i get on the pro team FtW?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ha! 91c max temp on my hottest core, 21c ambient. 4.5ghz at 1.336v...big MEH!
> 
> EDIT: yeah, found my max stable oc without delidding. this chip SUCKS pretty much, but not as badly as I first thought.
> 
> Today's my bday too...


Happy Birthday buddy!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> A little update for me. http://valid.canardpc.com/2745715 at 1.63v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and still sitting at 5°C idle. It was 1.6v but kept rebooting, stays in windows and can surf at 1.63
> 
> Reinstalled the window mod last night. 3000cfm turbine fan (very quiet) forcing 0°C outside air through the front radiator. Forgot to mention that part.


Updated!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Format isnt perfect, I didnt read the rules before. I just had my prime 95 tests not IBT.
> 
> OCN name: Solonowarion
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.7 ghz I kept the same overclock.
> Temp drops: 18c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Will post Val when I get home.
> 
> I put too much CLU on die will try less soon and get back with better results.
> 
> On another note I was able to get 5.0 ghz on 1.504 volts and keep the same temps as my 4.7 - 1.328 v oc.
> 
> This pic was for the Ivy stable club.


You're in as well!







Slap the sig on baby!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..*.FtW..*.not sure if running old cards is a hobby or you do it for the ProCup at HWBot, but I got a couple of old cards here...like a ATI Radeon 9800, another slightly younger ATI Radeon (I never used it but it's an All-in-Winder w/TV) and an older Winfast Nvidia, circa 2000endish


three tongues or dual tongue gpu?

Well had the funeral today. Woohoo and so now I'm all down so I'm gonna go have some fun. cya guys in a while


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well had the funeral today. Woohoo and so now I'm all down so I'm gonna go have some fun. cya guys in a while


...tomorrow morning, the sun will rise


----------



## Swag

*@Valgaur*

My grandpa died too on Saturday. The funeral will be on Thursday but I can't attend. Bad year I guess, especially how my family believes in the Zodiac stuff.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Guys, I'm totally in love with this board. It comes with two wires that I can plug into the side of the board and plug my testers for my multimeter into to watch CPU (or whatever I want) voltage. Voltage is pretty much spot on (about .002 off) between my MM and CPU-z. I'm testing out 4.7Ghz at 1.362v (took 1.491v on Asrock Z77 Extreme4) and am two hours into P95 with no WHEA errors or P95 errors. At that voltage and multiplier my Asrock failed in about 20 minutes. I just can't say enough good things about this motherboard not to mention the ridiculous amount of features it has. Temps are great too.


I'M GLAD TO HEAR IT! You deserve a break. Have you installed the AI suite2? Just wondering. I played with it a lot when my board was new. but uninstalled the whole thing now, since im kind of done tweeking stuff. I may reinstall it if my fans stop ramping up with the cpu usage. Do you plan on running 24 hour bench? What were your temps spikes on IBT? anyway, I love my asus board too, the z77 is here to stay! Long Live King Ivy.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'd try the cooler master fans out honestly.
> You're in! just let me know when you get it stable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap the sig on!
> get cougars! love those girl.... i mean fans....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *how do i get on the pro team FtW?*
> Happy Birthday buddy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Updated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're in as well!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap the sig on baby!
> *three tongues or dual tongue gpu?*
> 
> Well had the funeral today. Woohoo and so now I'm all down so I'm gonna go have some fun. cya guys in a while


We could use a memory overclocking master. The current top validation is a little over 3700Mhz for ddr3, & the current scores are for registration, the cup doesn't actually start for a few more days.

AGP cards all the way!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...tomorrow morning, the sun will rise


Thanks man.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *@Valgaur*
> 
> My grandpa died too on Saturday. The funeral will be on Thursday but I can't attend. Bad year I guess, especially how my family believes in the Zodiac stuff.


You're the thrid one including myself with a passing of a relative. Hope you feel better buddy.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> We could use a memory overclocking master. The current top validation is a little over 3700Mhz for ddr3, & the current scores are for registration, the cup doesn't actually start for a few more days.
> 
> AGP cards all the way!


a memory man huh? I've been meaning to really learn it well here lately just haven't had time or the cold stuff for it lol, I'll get some good ram this summer and give er hell. what else do I need to do really?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> a memory man huh? I've been meaning to really learn it well here lately just haven't had time or the cold stuff for it lol, I'll get some good ram this summer and give er hell. what else do I need to do really?


Bin cpus to find one with a STRONG imc. But your best bet is building an AMD platform for max ddr3 validations.
Think, A8-3870k with a good mobo, fx 8350 with a CHV and cold...That and proper Samsung d-rev/Hynix MFR-CFR/Micron D9QMT(stupid micron and their non binned ic's...can't recall the exact chip)

> 2933mhz and more capable, scales with cold and voltage.

EDIT: Oh, and get an MVG, a dice pot for cpu and ram and install memtweakit and turbo V evo (ai suite II oc utility)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bin cpus to find one with a STRONG imc. But your best bet is building an AMD platform for max ddr3 validations.
> Think, A8-3870k with a good mobo, fx 8350 with a CHV and cold...That and proper Samsung d-rev/Hynix MFR-CFR/Micron D9QMT(stupid micron and their non binned ic's...can't recall the exact chip)
> 
> > 2933mhz and more capable, scales with cold and voltage.
> 
> EDIT: Oh, and get an MVG, a dice pot for cpu and ram and install memtweakit and turbo V evo (ai suite II oc utility)


yeah my current chip is decent on IMC but my mobo needs a bios update big time.....


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> a memory man huh? I've been meaning to really learn it well here lately just haven't had time or the cold stuff for it lol, I'll get some good ram this summer and give er hell. what else do I need to do really?


Pretty much just need to get cold & get experience with subzero & tweaking, from there it's about the hardware. There will be a new cup every 3 months the way it looks right now.
It's gonna be tough competition, it's the new pro league.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *@Valgaur*
> 
> My grandpa died too on Saturday. The funeral will be on Thursday but I can't attend. Bad year I guess, especially how my family believes in the Zodiac stuff.


...my condolences to you also.

And without wanting to get into religion, metaphysics, philosophy et al, consider your computer with your 680 that is running programming which essentially is all based on simple 'on -off' switches...now consider any form of life, all going back to the original landing of DNA (however it got to this earth)...we're talking ' A T C G ' infinitely adaptable and self-correcting programming in molecules...housing spirit and sentient beings...makes any software engineer drop their jaw in amazement.

""Whatever"" is behind this, your grandpas are in good hands.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *@Valgaur*
> 
> My grandpa died too on Saturday. The funeral will be on Thursday but I can't attend. Bad year I guess, especially how my family believes in the Zodiac stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> You're the thrid one including myself with a passing of a relative. Hope you feel better buddy.
Click to expand...

You too, don't let it get you depressed especially if you two were close to each other.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Good morning! So I have been running P95 for 13 hours now, with no errors and no WHEA errors. I'm amazed I can run the same OC as my other board with .13 less voltage!!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I'M GLAD TO HERE IT! You deserve a break. Have you installed the AI suite2? Just wondering. I played with it a lot when my board was new. but uninstalled the whole thing now, since im kind of done tweeking stuff. I may reinstall it if my fans stop ramping up with the cpu usage. Do you plan on running 24 hour bench? What were your temps spikes on IBT? anyway, I love my asus board too, the z77 is here to stay! Long Live King Ivy.


No I'm not using AI Suite I'm not TOO interested in it, but I might give it a shot once they fix the BIOS bug. Scared to install any of these utilities at the moment I don't want to mess anything up. I haven't ran IBT yet, but when I do I will let you know. It has been almost 14 hours now and temps haven't gone over 64c, but they are mostly hanging out around in the 50's. Can't believe it!


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> No I'm not using AI Suite I'm not TOO interested in it, but I might give it a shot once they fix the BIOS bug. Scared to install any of these utilities at the moment I don't want to mess anything up. I haven't ran IBT yet, but when I do I will let you know. It has been almost 14 hours now and temps haven't gone over 64c, but they are mostly hanging out around in the 50's. Can't believe it!


Sounds like you have a good plan. keep up the updates.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'd try the cooler master fans out honestly.
> You're in! just let me know when you get it stable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap the sig on!
> get cougars! love those girl.... i mean fans....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how do i get on the pro team FtW?
> Happy Birthday buddy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Updated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're in as well!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap the sig on baby!
> three tongues or dual tongue gpu?
> 
> Well had the funeral today. Woohoo and so now I'm all down so I'm gonna go have some fun. cya guys in a while


This is why i do not own CM Sickle flows like he linked / that are tested in this video... Cougars are way better...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok guys 17 hours in and no p95 errors or WHEA errors. I'm absolutely blown away by my new MVE. I was thinking that I might be able to run my OC at a lower voltage like maybe .01v between my old board and this, but .12v!!! WOW. Do you guys think it was my power supply that was making it so hard to OC? I wasn't having any problems with it that I noticed except for the fact that it was always doing this really quiet sqeaking and chirping sound. That is the reason I RMA'd it. Right now I'm using my old Seasonic M12II 620w to power my system (no crossfire support





















) until my Seasonic x-850 gets back and everything is running extremely smooth.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok guys 17 hours in and no p95 errors or WHEA errors. I'm absolutely blown away by my new MVE. I was thinking that I might be able to run my OC at a lower voltage like maybe .01v between my old board and this, but .12v!!! WOW. Do you guys think it was my power supply that was making it so hard to OC? I wasn't having any problems with it that I noticed except for the fact that it was always doing this really quiet sqeaking and chirping sound. That is the reason I RMA'd it. Right now I'm using my old Seasonic M12II 620w to power my system (no crossfire support
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) until my Seasonic x-850 gets back and everything is running extremely smooth.


I do not think a 620 watt psu is enough for 2x 7950s i have 3x 7950s and a 1200 watt AX 1200 and i would be scared to run 4.

Id look for something in the 800watt range.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not think a 620 watt psu is enough for 2x 7950s i have 3x 7950s and a 1200 watt AX 1200 and i would be scared to run 4.
> 
> Id look for something in the 800watt range.


same here especially if your ocing the cpu that will pull a lot more volts. get a bigger and better psu.

Well more bad news for valgaur, a close school friend has passed away late last night from a heart attack.... this isnt fair...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not think a 620 watt psu is enough for 2x 7950s i have 3x 7950s and a 1200 watt AX 1200 and i would be scared to run 4.
> 
> Id look for something in the 800watt range.


I know I wouldn't even try to run crossfire on a 620watt. I was saying that I have a Seasonic x-850 for my 2 x 7950, but it is out for an RMA so I can't run crossfire until I get it back.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> same here especially if your ocing the cpu that will pull a lot more volts. get a bigger and better psu.
> 
> Well more bad news for valgaur, a close school friend has passed away late last night from a heart attack.... this isnt fair...


I'm really sorry to hear that. We have been going through the same stuff man. My friend recently killed himself and I have had a lot of deaths in the family in the past year. That is why I'm so involved in this forum and building computers. It is great to keep my mind occupied while trying to stay clean in this hard time of my life. I feel for you. If you need anything, just ask. My condolences from me to you.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok guys 17 hours in and no p95 errors or WHEA errors. I'm absolutely blown away by my new MVE. I was thinking that I might be able to run my OC at a lower voltage like maybe .01v between my old board and this, but .12v!!! WOW. Do you guys think it was my power supply that was making it so hard to OC? I wasn't having any problems with it that I noticed except for the fact that it was always doing this really quiet sqeaking and chirping sound. That is the reason I RMA'd it. Right now I'm using my old Seasonic M12II 620w to power my system (no crossfire support
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) until my Seasonic x-850 gets back and everything is running extremely smooth.


wow i really need to upgrade my extreme4 to the MVF


----------



## Rucka315

Ok now do it at 4.9ghz!







lol


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> wow i really need to upgrade my extreme4 to the MVF


Definetly should! I just got the MVE because I like all the extra features including the OC key and PCI-E testers and the countless other ones, but I'm sure the MVF is just as good. This is the longest I've run P95 and I'm amazed by my success.

Ok off to the wake







Have a good day guys! I'm going to leave my computer running until I get home at 9pm and that will be 26 hours of P95. Cross your fingers for no errors for me!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Ok now do it at 4.9ghz!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol


I'm totally going to push it further I just want to get 26 hours in so I have a stable overclock I can fall back on. Definetly going to 4.9Ghz next! Hopefully I can do it with 1.45v or less!


----------



## Bajawah

What is everyones thought on this?

"EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy"

http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Anyone on OCN in the US offer a delidding service? I wish I could do the wood-n-hammer method of deliding, but I don't have a bench vise. Or a bench sturdy enough for one.
> 
> Seriously...I'll mail someone my 3770k along with a prepaid return label. As long as he/she has exp. doing the job I'm down for it. I'd have to order another 3770k though to use while my current one is away.
> 
> 
> 
> I would only do it if I got to play with the chip for a week or so.
> 
> Nothing too crazy, just to get familiar with a different chip.
> 
> I employ the "Extreme take my time method" to delidding.
> 
> I don't apply any pressure with my blade, and it takes like 20 minutes of continuous rocking back and forth.
Click to expand...

I have a new 3770k en route to me. I'll send you a PM once it arrives (have to make sure it's not a better overclocker than my current one) and then get the ball rolling on shipping details. Will probably mail it out on Saturday.

This is also now my 5th 3770k....I think I have a cherry picking addiction.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bajawah*
> 
> What is everyones thought on this?
> 
> "EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy"
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


...very, VERY interesting - especially as it's priced below EU 4...it takes care of the changed depth parameters and 'correct pin contact' we talked about in this thread so often...

...given the low price, but probably high shipping costs, it almost makes sense to bulk-order...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Guys can we not talk about losses







? It makes me sad


----------



## Bajawah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...very, VERY interesting - especially as it's priced below EU 4...it takes care of the changed depth parameters and 'correct pin contact' we talked about in this thread so often...
> 
> ...given the low price, but probably high shipping costs, it almost makes sense to bulk-order...


What is the feeling on direct to chip cooling anyway?

I took the top off my ivy, like a year ago so I have not been around to see any developments.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bajawah*
> 
> What is the feeling on direct to chip cooling anyway?
> 
> I took the top off my ivy, like a year ago so I have not been around to see any developments.


...just speaking for myself, once you decide to delid, the 'running naked' option is almost a natural conclusion, though there are 'pros' and 'cons'.

Running without the IHS seems to save folks anywhere from 1 C to over 5 C in temps, but the greatest difficulty was always in getting the alignment 'right' (i.e. perfectly flat), and then the torquing down / pressure right for the CPU pin contact...the EK stand-offs seem to take care of that, though there are other (more expensive) solutions, such as machining the outside edges of your CPU block in order to keep the CPU latch mechanism on the board.

I may yet opt for running IHS-less, but frankly don't have a temp issue anymore anyways...besides, the IHS, if mounted correctly (also in regards to concave / convex issues) can do exactly what it is supposed to do - that is spread the heat, rather like the cylinder head w/extra fins on an air-cooled motorcycle engine.


----------



## Bajawah

Is there any issue to removing the IHS with liquidcool under it?

From my understanding the liquidcool kinda glues itself to everything.


----------



## Rucka315

Yea mines at 1.45v idle and 1.47v on load.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm totally going to push it further I just want to get 26 hours in so I have a stable overclock I can fall back on. Definetly going to 4.9Ghz next! Hopefully I can do it with 1.45v or less!


----------



## azasadny

Nope... I checked...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bajawah*
> 
> Is there any issue to removing the IHS with liquidcool under it?
> 
> From my understanding the liquidcool kinda glues itself to everything.


...depends what type of Coollaboratory (CL) Liquid Metal (I think that's what you mean). CL-U (Ultra) should be easier than CL-P (Pro) to remove...in both cases, some caution is in order not to get any on sensitive electronic bits as it is obviously conductive and capacitive (some folks dropped it into DRAM slots etc and ruined a board). Other than that, start with Isopropanol...I have removed CL-U several times form the IHS and water block without any problems whatsoever...though the longest it had been in there 'undisturbed' was 1 1/2 mths, so over time (as in your case), it might take a bit more cleaning...

...there are more tips in this thread recently (last two weeks or so) as to how to clean up the trickier CL-Pro


----------



## ivanlabrie

That EK block looks cool!









Ok, I'm 48hs folding stable at 4.5ghz and 1.336v with 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24-2t 4x2gb ram. (relatively tight subs and 1.7v dram)


----------



## jdm317

So when I went to reapply my CLP last night I notice that I had made a horrible tired mistake with my last application of CLP. I had cleaned the DIE off great, and applied the CLP perfectly, but neglected to even LOOK at the waterblock or clean it off... It was about 2am on weeknight when I first applied it. Needless to say, I am happy that I found it and my temps have dropped another 10°C for a total drop of about 25°C since delidding.

Seems I need to moderate my overclocking nights better to limit these kind of mistakes.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That EK block looks cool!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, I'm 48hs folding stable at 4.5ghz and 1.336v with 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24-2t 4x2gb ram. (relatively tight subs and 1.7v dram)












update

OCN name: jdm317
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: No IHS
Mhz gained: 600mhz
OC after delid: 5.3ghz @ 1.64v
Temp drops: 25°C


----------



## ivanlabrie

Sick 5.3ghz









Try not to kill that chip...get dry ice if you want MOAR.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> So when I went to reapply my CLP last night I notice that I had made a horrible tired mistake with my last application of CLP. I had cleaned the DIE off great, and applied the CLP perfectly, but neglected to even LOOK at the waterblock or clean it off... It was about 2am on weeknight when I first applied it. Needless to say, I am happy that I found it and my temps have dropped another 10°C for a total drop of about 25°C since delidding.
> 
> Seems I need to moderate my overclocking nights better to limit these kind of mistakes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> update
> 
> OCN name: jdm317
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: No IHS
> Mhz gained: 600mhz
> OC after delid: 5.3ghz @ 1.64v
> Temp drops: 25°C


Updated!


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sick 5.3ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Try not to kill that chip...get dry ice if you want MOAR.


Ill try not to. Have a chiller built and ready for testing on it... Very reluctant because of the condensate proofing. Have everything I need, just having doubts.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sick 5.3ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Try not to kill that chip...get dry ice if you want MOAR.
> 
> 
> 
> Ill try not to. Have a chiller built and ready for testing on it... Very reluctant because of the condensate proofing. Have everything I need, just having doubts.
Click to expand...

My plan to deal with the subject is to have a dehumidifier blowing onto my desktop directly. $150 or so for one that's rated to handle a whole basement. It will need to be hacked to be always on instead of switching off at 35% RH. Even if it only drops RH a little bit, it'll still enable 20-30F sub-ambient temps.

I'm waiting for a RH sensor to be delivered where I can measure the humidity of my HVAC system with the AC on, to determine how dry the air being blown from a dehumidifier is.


----------



## tiborrr12

These will soon be available at your favourite US / AUD / Asian reseller, no worries.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bajawah*
> 
> What is everyones thought on this?
> 
> "EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy"
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


That is pretty cool! I briefly tried getting the mount right for bare die but always 55 on post, just could not get the right pressure, ended up putting the IHS back on to get it running.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That EK block looks cool!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, I'm 48hs folding stable at 4.5ghz and 1.336v with 2000mhz cl9-9-9-24-2t 4x2gb ram. (relatively tight subs and 1.7v dram)


What kinda clocks are you hitting on the 8400?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> So when I went to reapply my CLP last night I notice that I had made a horrible tired mistake with my last application of CLP. I had cleaned the DIE off great, and applied the CLP perfectly, but neglected to even LOOK at the waterblock or clean it off... It was about 2am on weeknight when I first applied it. Needless to say, I am happy that I found it and my temps have dropped another 10°C for a total drop of about 25°C since delidding.
> 
> Seems I need to moderate my overclocking nights better to limit these kind of mistakes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> update
> 
> OCN name: jdm317
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: No IHS
> Mhz gained: 600mhz
> OC after delid: 5.3ghz @ 1.64v
> Temp drops: 25°C


5.3Ghz not extreme cooled, nice!
But don't kill it!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Ill try not to. Have a chiller built and ready for testing on it... Very reluctant because of the condensate proofing. Have everything I need, just having doubts.


How will the rig be oriented (upright in a case, flat on the box), & how are you condensate proofing so far?
Remembering one of callsignvega's rigs, he found a pretty foolproof way to make sure the board won't get any water on it, although there wouldn't be any cpu swapping going on after insulating.


----------



## dr/owned

^^ I just wish EK used nickel / process that didn't corrode. I'm throwing out (not literally) my Supremacy block in favor of a Koolance one because of this. I wish the situation were different, because I do want to direct die cool my chip without having to buy a $70 sheet of oxygen free copper to use as a shim (not really direct die at that point to be fair).


----------



## tiborrr12

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is pretty cool! I briefly tried getting the mount right for bare die but always 55 on post, just could not get the right pressure, ended up putting the IHS back on to get it running.


Yes, it took quite a lot of trial and error to get it right








Theory < practice.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok guys I'm officially 23 hours in with no errors. I can truly declare that I am stable. Going to start testing 4.9Ghz tonight.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sick 5.3ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Try not to kill that chip...get dry ice if you want MOAR.


I thought that was a No-No if already delidded?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EK_tiborrr*
> 
> Yes, it took quite a lot of trial and error to get it right
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Theory < practice.


When will these be available? http://www.ekwb.com/news/302/19/EK-Water-Blocks-Proud-To-Announce-Partnership-with-SF3D-OC/

I do like the look of the mounting setup, want to try one!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I thought that was a No-No if already delidded?


It will still work, just may not clock as high as it could have pre-delidding.
It's a no-no with liquid metal TIM though.


----------



## tiborrr12

@FtW 420: Probably by May 1st.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok guys I'm officially 23 hours in with no errors. I can truly declare that I am stable. Going to start testing 4.9Ghz tonight.


good luck .)


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is pretty cool! I briefly tried getting the mount right for bare die but always 55 on post, just could not get the right pressure, ended up putting the IHS back on to get it running.
> What kinda clocks are you hitting on the 8400?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.3Ghz not extreme cooled, nice!
> But don't kill it!
> How will the rig be oriented (upright in a case, flat on the box), & how are you condensate proofing so far?
> Remembering one of callsignvega's rigs, he found a pretty foolproof way to make sure the board won't get any water on it, although there wouldn't be any cpu swapping going on after insulating.


The board will stay in its case. For the testing scenario I will just leave the case next to the chiller and plumb into the open case. One idea I had for condensate proofing for bare die setup was to use dragon skin all the way up to the socket (without latch) and then put a thin layer of dielectric grease over the silicon around the die, after that a layer of armaflex or electrical tape carefully stuck to the base of the socket going over the chip and staying parallel with the edge of the die as close as possible without overlapping, pulling it down tight and sticking it to the other side of the socket base, repeat process on other side of the die, then fill in the squares north and south of the die with tape. Any flaws in this? Keep the grease? Throw it out? I will look for Callsignvega's rig. I dont mind leaving this chip in for a while, my next adventure will be haswell or later.

Armaflex on the waterblock to where it keeps a big enough hole for the die to go through and make contact, while being thin enough not to interfere with waterblock to die contact? Is this a flawed method?

My approach:
Dragon Skin FX Pro all over motherboard flush with CPU socket to keep water off of components (front and back)
Armaflex around CPU socket to prevent condensate build up. (front and back)
One of the above mentioned methods for CPU condensate proofing.
Armaflex over every side and top surface of CPU block, applied liberally.
Make wall around video card to prevent dragon skin from running off during application.
Dragonskin on back of GPU first while using eraser to keep holes plugged.
Dragonskin on front of GPU with waterblock mounted, allowing dragon skin to self level its way around the block after plugging the bottom of the waterblock with eraser and pouring in dragon skin through the top, plugging top, level card, allow dragon skin to level and harden. *(thank you NoGuru for this suggestion)*
Apply armaflex to heatkiller waterblock surface liberally.

Armaflex around every micron of supercooled surface including the chiller reservoir and all the way back to re-entering chiller reservoir. (suction line/cap tube armaflexed as well)

Fire away, but please go easy on me


----------



## dr/owned

If you're going to go the protect rather than dehumidify route (either from a dehumidifier, silica gel, air tight case enclosure filled with nitrogen), then you might as well put everything in mineral oil. At least mineral oil is somewhat cleanable, wheras dragon skil is not.


----------



## FtW 420

I think it was callsignvega's 990x or 3960x rig when he was chilled water cooling, he got everything all installed, tested & ready to go, then with the board flat (case on the side for you in a regular case), he literally poured dragon skin over everything. The entire heatsink was covered with everything around it.
If no air can get at the area that is below the dew point no condensation can happen, so with that method you would just have to insulate the water lines going to & from the chiller & heatsink, pour the dragon skin covering the ends of the water line insulation on the heatsink, & there will be no chance of any water forming up or dripping from the lines in the case area.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> If you're going to go the protect rather than dehumidify route (either from a dehumidifier, silica gel, air tight case enclosure filled with nitrogen), then you might as well put everything in mineral oil. At least mineral oil is somewhat cleanable, wheras dragon skil is not.


Dragon skin is a lot easier to clean than vaseline or mineral oil, literally just have to grab the edge & pull it off, it comes off in a sheet. I've cleaned a dragon skin covered board in less than 10 minutes, good as new & didn't have to wash it in soap & water.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Ill try not to. Have a chiller built and ready for testing on it... Very reluctant because of the condensate proofing. Have everything I need, just having doubts.


Congrats jdm317...1.64v is A LOT on air/water, at least for longer periods of time...I felt guilty dipping into the low 1.5s at 5.3+ (pic below)...but then, it is your chip

...have you considered TEC cooling (example here: http://www.digitalstormonline.com/cryo-tec.asp )...some of those now come with pretty good water barriers


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Dragon skin is a lot easier to clean than vaseline or mineral oil, literally just have to grab the edge & pull it off, it comes off in a sheet. I've cleaned a dragon skin covered board in less than 10 minutes, good as new & didn't have to wash it in soap & water.


What I see happening is you get it flowing underneath components and then forming a U with itself (with the component between the edges of the U), where when you try to pull it off it's going to rip those components off with it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Ill try not to. Have a chiller built and ready for testing on it... Very reluctant because of the condensate proofing. Have everything I need, just having doubts.


You didn't have doubts when pushing 1.64v through it, yet you're afraid of protecting it's life span with better cooling?
Don't worry so much, you won't be disappointed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is pretty cool! I briefly tried getting the mount right for bare die but always 55 on post, just could not get the right pressure, ended up putting the IHS back on to get it running.
> What kinda clocks are you hitting on the 8400?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.3Ghz not extreme cooled, nice!
> But don't kill it!
> How will the rig be oriented (upright in a case, flat on the box), & how are you condensate proofing so far?
> Remembering one of callsignvega's rigs, he found a pretty foolproof way to make sure the board won't get any water on it, although there wouldn't be any cpu swapping going on after insulating.


I haven't overclocked it yet...I can't control voltage via software so it's gonna be modded eventually.
I'll wait till I score a 5770 or two (a co worker has a dead and a good one for me) - freebies








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I think it was callsignvega's 990x or 3960x rig when he was chilled water cooling, he got everything all installed, tested & ready to go, then with the board flat (case on the side for you in a regular case), he literally poured dragon skin over everything. The entire heatsink was covered with everything around it.
> If no air can get at the area that is below the dew point no condensation can happen, so with that method you would just have to insulate the water lines going to & from the chiller & heatsink, pour the dragon skin covering the ends of the water line insulation on the heatsink, & there will be no chance of any water forming up or dripping from the lines in the case area.
> Dragon skin is a lot easier to clean than vaseline or mineral oil, literally just have to grab the edge & pull it off, it comes off in a sheet. I've cleaned a dragon skin covered board in less than 10 minutes, good as new & didn't have to wash it in soap & water.


I was about to ask what method was that...xD


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EK_tiborrr*
> 
> @FtW 420: Probably by May 1st.


What about ordering direct from EK's online shop...do you deliver to USA / Canada ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> What I see happening is you get it flowing underneath components and then forming a U with itself (with the component between the edges of the U), where when you try to pull it off it's going to rip those components off with it.


It doesn't, the worst it will do is stick to the thermal pads under the heatsinks on the motherboard mosfets & pull the pads out when the skin it pulled off. This is from covering the bottom of a board, you can see where every component was, but nothing pulls off the board, the skin peels off easily.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I think it was callsignvega's 990x or 3960x rig when he was chilled water cooling, he got everything all installed, tested & ready to go, then with the board flat (case on the side for you in a regular case), he literally poured dragon skin over everything. The entire heatsink was covered with everything around it.
> If no air can get at the area that is below the dew point no condensation can happen, so with that method you would just have to insulate the water lines going to & from the chiller & heatsink, pour the dragon skin covering the ends of the water line insulation on the heatsink, & there will be no chance of any water forming up or dripping from the lines in the case area.
> Dragon skin is a lot easier to clean than vaseline or mineral oil, literally just have to grab the edge & pull it off, it comes off in a sheet. I've cleaned a dragon skin covered board in less than 10 minutes, good as new & didn't have to wash it in soap & water.


soap and water on your mobo!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You didn't have doubts when pushing 1.64v through it, yet you're afraid of protecting it's life span with better cooling?
> Don't worry so much, you won't be disappointed.
> I haven't overclocked it yet...I can't control voltage via software so it's gonna be modded eventually.
> I'll wait till I score a 5770 or two (a co worker has a dead and a good one for me) - freebies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was about to ask what method was that...xD


I'm already used to modding everything from before the 400 series, software voltage is pretty new, everything older needs hardmods.
People still try bios modding, but keep in mind without a voltage controller than can be adjusted with software, voltage in the bios can be changed but it doesn't change the voltage that the gpu actually gets.
Hardmodding all the way! I did my 8400, the zotac card used 50k VRs for the gpu & memory.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> soap and water on your mobo!


& gpus that were covered in vaseline. My boss though I was weird standing at the the sink last time I was washing 3 mobos & 2 gpus, sticking them in the dishrack after rinsing...
Just have to completely dry them before giving them power again.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> & gpus that were covered in vaseline. My boss though I was weird standing at the the sink last time I was washing 3 mobos & 2 gpus, sticking them in the dishrack after rinsing...
> Just have to completely dry them before giving them power again.


lmao thats crazy. never heard of that before


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ...My boss thought I was weird standing at the the sink last time I was washing 3 mobos & 2 gpus, sticking them in the dishrack after rinsing....


...gee, I wonder why he would think that







...you did this at the company cafeteria ?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*


Nice image and thanks for the explanation. Ghost motherboard omgz!









Question:

Would a pure silver shim work? At ~2 mm it's just a hair thinner than the stock IHS according to Intel spec (which is around 2.2mm). I'm thinking waterblock -> shim -> die. With no thermal paste between the shim and die since it can be polished perfectly smooth.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...gee, I wonder why he would think that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...you did this at the company cafeteria ?


Sort of, I live in the house on the property the shop is at, so my kitchen is the company cafeteria.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Nice image and thanks for the explanation. Ghost motherboard omgz!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Question:
> 
> Would a pure silver shim work? At ~2 mm it's just a hair thinner than the stock IHS according to Intel spec (which is around 2.2mm). I'm thinking waterblock -> shim -> die. With no thermal paste between the shim and die since it can be polished perfectly smooth.


That probably would work well. If it matches the thickness of the IHS the latch could be left on the board, & pure machined flat silver would conduct better than the IHS does.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Question:
> 
> Would a pure silver shim work? At ~2 mm it's just a hair thinner than the stock IHS according to Intel spec (which is around 2.2mm). I'm thinking waterblock -> shim -> die. With no thermal paste between the shim and die since it can be polished perfectly smooth
> 
> That probably would work well. If it matches the thickness of the IHS the latch could be left on the board, & pure machined flat silver would conduct better than the IHS does.


Is contact between the substrate and socket a problem? I ask because it's significantly more difficult to delid while leaving the wings of the IHS in tact, vs. completely removing the IHS and allowing pressure from the shim and waterblock do the work.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sort of, I live in the house on the property the shop is at, so my kitchen is the company cafeteria...


...at least you don't have to worry about high power bills (or weak phases leading to the wall outlets) when you want to push 1.9v at 6 giggles through a LN2-cooled Hexacore at 3 am... not to mention a pile of OC'ed GPUs...I should be able to see the 'glow' from my place when I look East into the Valley...and here I thought it was the first part of the sunrise...


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You didn't have doubts when pushing 1.64v through it, yet you're afraid of protecting it's life span with better cooling?
> Don't worry so much, you won't be disappointed.
> I haven't overclocked it yet...I can't control voltage via software so it's gonna be modded eventually.
> I'll wait till I score a 5770 or two (a co worker has a dead and a good one for me) - freebies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was about to ask what method was that...xD


Yes this does seem strange doesnt it?









My primary concern is that with all that extra cooling I would overlook an air gap and *zap*. You are right I should stop worrying about it and push forward. Thank you for the encouragement. I have a long couple of work days till the weekend but Im going to finally give it a go on Saturday.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> I think it was callsignvega's 990x or 3960x rig when he was chilled water cooling, he got everything all installed, tested & ready to go, then with the board flat (case on the side for you in a regular case), he literally poured dragon skin over everything. The entire heatsink was covered with everything around it.
> If no air can get at the area that is below the dew point no condensation can happen, so with that method you would just have to insulate the water lines going to & from the chiller & heatsink, pour the dragon skin covering the ends of the water line insulation on the heatsink, & there will be no chance of any water forming up or dripping from the lines in the case area.


Thank you , I will keep that method in mind for sure, sounds like a solid idea.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *"dr/owned'*
> What I see happening is you get it flowing underneath components and then forming a U with itself (with the component between the edges of the U), where when you try to pull it off it's going to rip those components off with it.


Thanks for pointing out concerns. A lot of this has been tested over in the "alternative to eraser" thread. I have seen the mineral oil idea and although its interesting Im gonna step away from that method for this build. I cant leave this Switch 810 all by its lonesome.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> Congrats jdm317...1.64v is A LOT on air/water, at least for longer periods of time...I felt guilty dipping into the low 1.5s at 5.3+ (pic below)...but then, it is your chip
> 
> ...have you considered TEC cooling (example here: http://www.digitalstormonline.com/cryo-tec.asp )...some of those now come with pretty good water barriers


I wont be keeping it at those clocks for the time being, just wanted to see how far I could go before getting close to tj Max. Thankfully I stayed well within safe temperature while testing with the shop fan window mod. Its getting hot around here so the window mod will be rendered pointless within the next few weeks.

I have looked at TEC cooling but I think I will keep that as my next step in extreme cooling after this chiller. I was able to build the chiller very cheap since the window unit was given to me a couple of years ago, and I no longer needed it.

I appreciate all the responses. I have been wanting to do extreme cooling for a while now, but starting a very large family very early in life put a damper on all of my hobbies for the past six years. Glad im finally getting to dip my toes in the water.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> I have looked at TEC cooling but I think I will keep that as my next step in extreme cooling after this chiller. I was able to build the chiller very cheap since the window unit was given to me a couple of years ago, and I no longer needed it.
> 
> I appreciate all the responses. I have been wanting to do extreme cooling for a while now, but starting a very large family very early in life put a damper on all of my hobbies for the past six years. Glad im finally getting to dip my toes in the water.


...don't get us wrong, we just don't want you to end the career of your chip prematurely before the real fun begins...I am glad you are having this discussion here, because I'm more or less in the same boat....per posts yesterday > building up a Rampage EX w/3970X which will 'inherit' the current Ivy-K w-c setup, freeing the MaxVE 3770K for more extreme cooling adventures...I think I might go directly to TEC, but chilled water remains an option and I like to see how you do with that...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Is contact between the substrate and socket a problem? I ask because it's significantly more difficult to delid while leaving the wings of the IHS in tact, vs. completely removing the IHS and allowing pressure from the shim and waterblock do the work.


I tried to get bare die mounting pressure right for about 15 minutes before giving up. The shim might make it easier to get the pressure right while having better thermal conductivity than the IHS, would have to try it & see.
I do like the new EK bare die mount, takes the guesswork & testing out of it, although I would need a new waterblock for it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...at least you don't have to worry about high power bills (or weak phases leading to the wall outlets) when you want to push 1.9v at 6 giggles through a LN2-cooled Hexacore at 3 am... not to mention a pile of OC'ed GPUs...I should be able to see the 'glow' from my place when I look East into the Valley...and here I thought it was the first part of the sunrise...


It's an old farmhouse, I don't have to worry about the bills but the outlets leave something to be desired, not enough of them on separate breakers.. I have extension cords running all over the place to get power where I need it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's an old farmhouse, I don't have to worry about the bills but the outlets leave something to be desired, not enough of them on separate breakers.. I have extension cords running all over the place to get power where I need it.


...I know







...but if it makes you feel any better, I live in a fairly new high-rise condo tower and I also have extension cords running here and there...specifically from the kitchen which has some extra strong phases, for when I do HWBot stuff on Quad-SLI...that pulls well over 1000 watts and dims the lights


----------



## ivanlabrie

Tec cooling is nice if you have a decent loop already...not as efficient as a phase unit or a chiller, but it does work.
I always wanted to do that, but didn't find a proper tec for my pentium 4 back then. xD Nor monies for a loop!


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Tec cooling is nice if you have a decent loop already...not as efficient as a phase unit or a chiller, but it does work.
> I always wanted to do that, but didn't find a proper tec for my pentium 4 back then. xD Nor monies for a loop!


I slapped a 90W TEC I had from another project on my 3770k along with an air cooler. It worked great at idle but under load it got overwhelmed in a hurry


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Tec cooling is nice if you have a decent loop already...not as efficient as a phase unit or a chiller, but it does work.
> I always wanted to do that, but didn't find a proper tec for my pentium 4 back then. xD Nor monies for a loop!


...for sure..I would only use TEC with a strong water loop which is already installed...chilled water still interests me because I am planning on this 'desk computer' which will have four mobos side by side under glass, all running and of course all water-cooled...I have seen a free-standing system for two computers which had interconnected cases and valves whereby you could switch to 'chilled water' just by turning the valve lever, and in the longer run, that's what I would want to incorporate into the 'desk computer'


----------



## TinDaDragon

Hey guys,

I don't know if this has been posted before, but I just saw this video






Is it a viable way to delid? It seems so easy


----------



## homestyle

Is the pump out effect based on actual facts or just theory?

Im planning on using regular tim.

Ive seen bare die gpus with tim like as5 last for years.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Is the pump out effect based on actual facts or just theory?
> 
> Im planning on using regular tim.
> 
> Ive seen bare die gpus with tim like as5 last for years.


I've seen it for a fact with CLU at sub zero temps. Worked fine air & water cooled, took less than 10 seconds under load when subzero for all the TIM to move from the top of the die to the sides of the die. No tim at 1.6V made the cpu very unhappy.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Is the pump out effect based on actual facts or just theory?
> 
> Im planning on using regular tim.
> 
> Ive seen bare die gpus with tim like as5 last for years.


...wait till FtW is back...he's relayed some good experiences with pump-out (apparently, CPU temp, when frozen, went up to 100 C in a split-second as LM Tim pumped out)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Is the pump out effect based on actual facts or just theory?
> 
> Im planning on using regular tim.
> 
> Ive seen bare die gpus with tim like as5 last for years.


its real as liek with the Ivy's when you delid them and you see the intel paste TIM it has very little on the the actual die but it's all on the sides of the die. it happens even with my PK-1 i had it. GPU's have different amounts of pressure because they only get so tight but with cpus you can really crank them down tight.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TinDaDragon*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I don't know if this has been posted before, but I just saw this video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it a viable way to delid? It seems so easy


Yeah that's one way to do it. If you have access to a Vise like that then try it out. Razor blades are cheaper than a 30lb bench mounted vise.

EDIT: You might have to have rubber on the vise, I can't tell from that picture if it's rubber on metal or metal on metal. Metal on metal might be harder to get a good grip and would more than likely leave scratches on your IHS.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TinDaDragon*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I don't know if this has been posted before, but I just saw this video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it a viable way to delid? It seems so easy


...good stuff, but was already posted here twice yesterday


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So since I can do 4.7ghz at 1.36v then 1.44v would be a good start for 4.9ghz?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TinDaDragon*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I don't know if this has been posted before, but I just saw this video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it a viable way to delid? It seems so easy


try it! looks easy to me, i would of done it if i didnt do it already with a razor


----------



## stickg1

Val - it got cold here in SC these past few days. Please keep your cold weather in the northern mid-west, please and thanks!

I thought it was nice wearing shorts last week. I was like 45C today, that's too cold for a stick!


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> its real as liek with the Ivy's when you delid them and you see the intel paste TIM it has very little on the the actual die but it's all on the sides of the die. it happens even with my PK-1 i had it. GPU's have different amounts of pressure because they only get so tight but with cpus you can really crank them down tight.


I know anecdotally and theoretically its there, but has anyone actually experienced it?

And the tim oozing on the sides is normal
You want that to happen.


----------



## TinDaDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...good stuff, but was already posted here twice yesterday


I don't follow this thread often, sorry


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol, people gave me a weird look last time I mentioned that and thought I was joking (in some other thread here...)

Kepler cards for instance can be bios modded and they are all the rage, but the gains are really small...I'm glad I sold the 670 ftw I had. Boring card is boring to oc and bench.
I have a no name passive 8400 gs (ref design 99% sure)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol, people gave me a weird look last time I mentioned that and thought I was joking (in some other thread here...)
> 
> Kepler cards for instance can be bios modded and they are all the rage, but the gains are really small...I'm glad I sold the 670 ftw I had. Boring card is boring to oc and bench.
> I have a no name passive 8400 gs (ref design 99% sure)


..well, I dunno, there are ways to make them (670ies) 'less boring' and tease Titan owners and others







...you just have to be nice to them


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice score!









I know what you mean, I like a challenge once after a while, but Kepler is not 100% there for me....

I think I'm gonna try the vise+hammer delid method soon.
What do you guys think?


----------



## Hokies83

256bit bus + locked voltage makes Kepler suck.

Kepler should have came 384bit bus an unlocked voltage.....

I went from 2 4gb 680s to 3 7950s and the 7950s net me 50% more FPS Plus pay for themselves every month


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nice score!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know what you mean, I like a challenge once after a while, but Kepler is not 100% there for me....
> 
> I think I'm gonna try the vise+hammer delid method soon.
> What do you guys think?


...on the vise+hammer, I am wondering whether you should use a heat-gun first re. the silicon...other than that, the only thing that worries me is that the IHS hits the die when it flies off

...on the vid cards, I have a unique problem...per earlier posts, I now have two ROG boards (MVE, RampIVE)...I also have a friend who lives a floor below me who has a new software company involved in building software for rendering for 4K monitors...as such, he currently has 28 boxes of Gigabyte 7970ies behind the couch, awaiting deployment in the render farm...two per machine but NOT in CF to mimic 4K

...that gives me an idea to try a few out (bin them







) on the second mobo...fortunately /unfortunately, I'm still waiting for the 3970x to arrive so I have a few more days to ponder this predicament....though I could just pull the 670ies for a bit over Eastern...oh dear


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...on the vise+hammer, I am wondering whether you should use a heat-gun first re. the silicon...other than that, the only thing that worries me is that the IHS hits the die when it flies off
> 
> ...on the vid cards, I have a unique problem...per earlier posts, I now have two ROG boards (MVE, RampIVE)...I also have a friend who lives a floor below me who has a new software company involved in building software for rendering for 4K monitors...as such, he currently has 28 boxes of Gigabyte 7970ies behind the couch, awaiting deployment in the render farm...two per machine but NOT in CF to mimic 4K
> 
> ...that gives me an idea to try a few out (bin them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) on the second mobo...fortunately /unfortunately, I'm still waiting for the 3970x to arrive so I have a few more days to ponder this predicament....though I could just pull the 670ies for a bit over Eastern...oh dear


UM... could I have his address. You know, just to.... ask him a couple tech questions??????


----------



## JasonD

Too many posts to dig through... (Though I made it through a few hundred!)

Has anyone tried direct water-cooling of the die?

This would have to be a (Negative pressure) design. {Sucking water through, as opposed to trying to push it through.} I say this because the setup would require placing the water-cover directly mounted onto the PCB, minus the contact plate. The negative pressure would also ensure that any possible "boiling bubbles", would be evacuated. As opposed to a positive pressure system, which would never push bubbles out, they would simply collect and twirl. The negative pressure is important, because it would not require massive pressure to hold the cover onto the PCB, as it would have a natural suction-cup effect to assist its grip. Thus, also allowing you to completely silicone the whole PCB/Water-cover assembly too.

I imagine this could be done with a modification to the original cover, if it were to be "hammered" into a slight dome-shape over the die, and connectors being soldered on each side for the water-inlet and water-outlet.

I am not talking about uber-chilling it down to zero... simply room-temp regulated water temps, or a standard setup with a simple radiator and a reservoir.

I know that the components on a GPU (the surface-mount resistors) are all protected by a thin layer of epoxy, as I see everyone smearing the electrically conductive thermal paste all over the components, without harming the function. So I imagine this could also be extended to the GPU as-well. All the GPU's I have seen, have no covers over the die.

Anyone brave enough to try it? (Or oil-cooled, if you prefer. The electronic mineral-oil found in microwave capacitors is perfect for this type of cooling, and is non-conductive, as water potentially is.)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> UM... could I have his address. You know, just to.... ask him a couple tech questions??????


...He won't be home...my GF and I will buy him his favorite steak dinner and his favorite restaurant, along with some nice beers, and then I shall bring up my 'R+D' needs re temporary 7970ies


----------



## justanoldman

If some is going to go the vise method, I would think that rotational torque would put far less stress on the pcb than the shear force created by a hammer blow. If the glue can be "knocked" off, one would surmise that it could be twisted off with less force.

The question is how to turn the pcb. A block wood with a pcb sized cutout would work, but that seems like too much trouble.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JasonD*
> 
> Too many posts to dig through... (Though I made it through a few hundred!)
> 
> Has anyone tried direct water-cooling of the die?
> 
> This would have to be a (Negative pressure) design. {Sucking water through, as opposed to trying to push it through.} I say this because the setup would require placing the water-cover directly mounted onto the PCB, minus the contact plate. The negative pressure would also ensure that any possible "boiling bubbles", would be evacuated. As opposed to a positive pressure system, which would never push bubbles out, they would simply collect and twirl. The negative pressure is important, because it would not require massive pressure to hold the cover onto the PCB, as it would have a natural suction-cup effect to assist its grip. Thus, also allowing you to completely silicone the whole PCB/Water-cover assembly too.
> 
> I imagine this could be done with a modification to the original cover, if it were to be "hammered" into a slight dome-shape over the die, and connectors being soldered on each side for the water-inlet and water-outlet.
> 
> I am not talking about uber-chilling it down to zero... simply room-temp regulated water temps, or a standard setup with a simple radiator and a reservoir.
> 
> I know that the components on a GPU (the surface-mount resistors) are all protected by a thin layer of epoxy, as I see everyone smearing the electrically conductive thermal paste all over the components, without harming the function. So I imagine this could also be extended to the GPU as-well. All the GPU's I have seen, have no covers over the die.
> 
> Anyone brave enough to try it? (Or oil-cooled, if you prefer. The electronic mineral-oil found in microwave capacitors is perfect for this type of cooling, and is non-conductive, as water potentially is.)


Me too stooped to understand all of those intelligent words (new to water cooling), but I would like to say welcome to the forum! Most people are smarter than I


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...on the vise+hammer, I am wondering whether you should use a heat-gun first re. the silicon...other than that, the only thing that worries me is that the IHS hits the die when it flies off
> 
> ...on the vid cards, I have a unique problem...per earlier posts, I now have two ROG boards (MVE, RampIVE)...I also have a friend who lives a floor below me who has a new software company involved in building software for rendering for 4K monitors...as such, he currently has 28 boxes of Gigabyte 7970ies behind the couch, awaiting deployment in the render farm...two per machine but NOT in CF to mimic 4K
> 
> ...that gives me an idea to try a few out (bin them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) on the second mobo...fortunately /unfortunately, I'm still waiting for the 3970x to arrive so I have a few more days to ponder this predicament....though I could just pull the 670ies for a bit over Eastern...oh dear


I feel like it wouldn't be a good idea to use a heat gun because I think that a big part of that working is having the glue nice and dry. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but that is my insight on this.


----------



## dr/owned

Anyone have the dimensions of the 3770k die? By using pixel-counts and estimation on the socket spec, I think a 1x1 shim would cover the whole die.

EDIT: Nevermind, found the dimensions are well under an inch.

Silver shim ahoy:



Will be around 20% better performance than the stock IHS. It's a little bit thinner (around .2mm) and 7.5% better thermal conductivity (even more because IHS isn't pure copper)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...He won't be home...my GF and I will buy him his favorite steak dinner and his favorite restaurant, along with some nice beers, and then I shall bring up my 'R+D' needs re temporary 7970ies


Haha I wish I had a neighbor like that. My neighbors like staring out their windows angrily at anything that moves!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I'm running 4.9Ghz at 1.46v for 8 tests. So far temps haven't gone over 60c. I tried 1.44v, but I got a WHEA code 19 so I bumped up the Vcore a little bit. Lets see how this goes!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...on the vise+hammer, I am wondering whether you should use a heat-gun first re. the silicon...other than that, the only thing that worries me is that the IHS hits the die when it flies off
> 
> ...on the vid cards, I have a unique problem...per earlier posts, I now have two ROG boards (MVE, RampIVE)...I also have a friend who lives a floor below me who has a new software company involved in building software for rendering for 4K monitors...as such, he currently has 28 boxes of Gigabyte 7970ies behind the couch, awaiting deployment in the render farm...two per machine but NOT in CF to mimic 4K
> 
> ...that gives me an idea to try a few out (bin them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) on the second mobo...fortunately /unfortunately, I'm still waiting for the 3970x to arrive so I have a few more days to ponder this predicament....though I could just pull the 670ies for a bit over Eastern...oh dear


I've always wanted to do this, but funds...
I can only watch the guys at hwbot buying pallets of 3770k to bin through & dream.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha I wish I had a neighbor like that. My neighbors like staring out their windows angrily at anything that moves!


Start working out in the front yard.

Naked.

Warming up with jumping jacks should have their curtains closed in no time.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I'm running 4.9Ghz at 1.46v for 8 tests. So far temps haven't gone over 60c. I tried 1.44v, but I got a WHEA code 19 so I bumped up the Vcore a little bit. Lets see how this goes!


60c, you sure that is your highest max core temp while stress testing?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If some is going to go the vise method, I would think that rotational torque would put far less stress on the pcb than the shear force created by a hammer blow. If the glue can be "knocked" off, one would surmise that it could be twisted off with less force.
> 
> The question is how to turn the pcb. A block wood with a pcb sized cutout would work, but that seems like too much trouble.


Interesting points...I'll give this some thought, and discuss it with my father-in-law. He has the toolset and expertise in handyman type jobs lol


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If some is going to go the vise method, I would think that rotational torque would put far less stress on the pcb than the shear force created by a hammer blow. If the glue can be "knocked" off, one would surmise that it could be twisted off with less force.
> 
> The question is how to turn the pcb. A block wood with a pcb sized cutout would work, but that seems like too much trouble.
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting points...I'll give this some thought, and discuss it with my father-in-law. He has the toolset and expertise in handyman type jobs lol
Click to expand...

Saw this at home depot yesterday:

http://www.wood-carving-tools.com/wood-clamp-424.jpg

Seems like it could be used to grab the IHS and then you twist. PCB would have to be in a vise of some sort still.


----------



## sbruno624

Okay so I had a horrible idea that just may be crazy enough to work... and/or destroy your cpu, either one. I was thinking delid the CPU, channel a little area where you can fit cables for a temp sensor on the ihs, tape temp sensor under ihs near die, close it all up. This is totally hypothetical, I would never do this with a new processor, just wondering if that actually could work


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Start working out in the front yard.
> 
> Naked.
> 
> Warming up with jumping jacks should have their curtains closed in no time.












On my lawnmower?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sbruno624*
> 
> Okay so I had a horrible idea that just may be crazy enough to work... and/or destroy your cpu, either one. I was thinking delid the CPU, channel a little area where you can fit cables for a temp sensor on the ihs, tape temp sensor under ihs near die, close it all up. This is totally hypothetical, I would never do this with a new processor, just wondering if that actually could work


Why? The die already has a thermal diode. And you would also get pretty inaccurate readings trying to get a temp sensor to "stick" anywhere.


----------



## sbruno624

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Anyone have the dimensions of the 3770k die? By using pixel-counts and estimation on the socket spec, I think a 1x1 shim would cover the whole die.
> 
> EDIT: Nevermind, found the dimensions are well under an inch.
> 
> Silver shim ahoy:
> 
> 
> 
> Will be around 20% better performance than the stock IHS. It's a little bit thinner (around .2mm) and 7.5% better thermal conductivity (even more because IHS isn't pure copper)


holy expensive, how are you gonna work that just shove it between the die and block?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Why? The die already has a thermal diode. And you would also get pretty inaccurate readings trying to get a temp sensor to "stick" anywhere.


My cpu temps are all over the place in RealTemp, I didn't know the built in ones were accurate


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> 60c, you sure that is your highest max core temp while stress testing?


Well after 10 minutes, but still pretty close. Here is after 23 hours of P95 with 1.36v with my new H100i



Even with my Noctua running 1.529v (DMM, and didn't do it for more than a day) on my old board temps didn't exceed 84c. This chip runs REALLY cool after delidding it. Temps improved with the new H100i (I turned it 90 degrees like you suggested) Also, temps in my room are pretty cool. About 15c in here. I stress test with the windows open just because I like my chip running as cool as possible when stress testing. I don't think I would hit my thermal limit anyways, but for me, the cooler the better.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sbruno624*
> 
> holy expensive, how are you gonna work that just shove it between the die and block?


Yes. Hopefully it arrives mirror-finish and I won't need to polish the side that contacts the die. If both sides are perfectly smooth (which we know the die is) there's no need for thermal paste. And keep in mind mirrors are made from silver deposition (at least sometimes).

Not too worried about flatness. Silver is malleable so when I screw the waterblock down it'll flex to conform to the die and waterblock.

I'll probably be buying some steel shims to substitute for the hold-down wings on the IHS.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll delid my dead G620 with this method...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Val - it got cold here in SC these past few days. Please keep your cold weather in the northern mid-west, please and thanks!
> 
> I thought it was nice wearing shorts last week. I was like 45C today, that's too cold for a stick!


pfffft make it colder!!!!!!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well after 10 minutes, but still pretty close. Here is after 23 hours of P95 with 1.36v with my new H100i
> 
> Even with my Noctua running 1.529v (DMM, and didn't do it for more than a day) temps didn't exceed 84c. This chip runs REALLY cool after delidding it. Temps improved with the new H100i (I turned it 90 degrees like you suggested) Also, temps in my room are pretty cool. About 15c in here. I stress test with the windows open just because I like my chip running as cool as possible when stress testing. I don't think I would hit my thermal limit anyways, but for me, the cooler the better.


15c room temp? Dang my wife would never allow that. That explains 7c of it anyway.

Your screen shots makes sense, that shows 64c at 1.36v. I thought you were saying you could do 60c at 1.46v. So if 1.36v was 64c, then 1.46v should be in 70s for a long Prime95 run, and add in for low room temps - that makes sense. Thanks for clarifying.

Glad you are liking the new board, it is a lot more fun when your chip and mobo cooperate.


----------



## sbruno624

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Yes. Hopefully it arrives mirror-finish and I won't need to polish the side that contacts the die. If both sides are perfectly smooth (which we know the die is) there's no need for thermal paste. And keep in mind mirrors are made from silver deposition (at least sometimes).
> 
> Not too worried about flatness. Silver is malleable so when I screw the waterblock down it'll flex to conform to the die and waterblock.
> 
> I'll probably be buying some steel shims to substitute for the hold-down wings on the IHS.


Thats pretty slick, wish i had the money and know how to do that. I wanted to sand down the bottom of my ihs to get closer contact but I have to wait til school lets out so I have access to my equipment, and a work area. And ill actually use Liquid Pro instead of the thermal paste. Let us know how that silver turns out tho im curious


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well after 10 minutes, but still pretty close. Here is after 23 hours of P95 with 1.36v with my new H100i
> 
> 
> 
> Even with my Noctua running 1.529v (DMM, and didn't do it for more than a day) on my old board temps didn't exceed 84c. This chip runs REALLY cool after delidding it. Temps improved with the new H100i (I turned it 90 degrees like you suggested) Also, temps in my room are pretty cool. About 15c in here. I stress test with the windows open just because I like my chip running as cool as possible when stress testing. I don't think I would hit my thermal limit anyways, but for me, the cooler the better.


looks good bro








this is what i ran a while ago on my extreme 4 been stable ever since. but i cant wait to upgrade mobo just need to sell my extreme 4 first if i want the MVF.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> 15c room temp? Dang my wife would never allow that. That explains 7c of it anyway.
> 
> Your screen shots makes sense, that shows 64c at 1.36v. I thought you were saying you could do 60c at 1.46v. So if 1.36v was 64c, then 1.46v should be in 70s for a long Prime95 run, and add in for low room temps - that makes sense. Thanks for clarifying.
> 
> Glad you are liking the new board, it is a lot more fun when your chip and mobo cooperate.


It is! So I got an error at 4.9Ghz with 1.46v and I refuse to go any higher (for a daily OC) so I'm down to 4.8Ghz at 1.42v and if all goes well I will keep that for my daily OC. Currently 30 minutes into testing. I also tried booting up with 5Ghz and 1.5v and it booted right up. I might validate that just so I can get into the 5Ghz club haha is that bad of me to do?

See, what I do is go into the computer room and lock myself inside and put a towel under the door and open up the windows and get the fans blasting to get it nice and cool. Doesn't affect the rest of the house and the GF doesn't complain. She doesn't really say much about it except giving me some, "you are very wierd" looks every once in a while when I sneak out for food. After being with her for 3 years I have done crazier things so as long as I'm being a good boy she doesn't care.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Yes. Hopefully it arrives mirror-finish and I won't need to polish the side that contacts the die. If both sides are perfectly smooth (which we know the die is) there's no need for thermal paste. And keep in mind mirrors are made from silver deposition (at least sometimes).
> 
> Not too worried about flatness. Silver is malleable so when I screw the waterblock down it'll flex to conform to the die and waterblock.
> 
> I'll probably be buying some steel shims to substitute for the hold-down wings on the IHS.


...I'm giving away a little secret here I tried and it seemed to work...as shims to substitute for the hold-down wings, I thought of using the little plastic end pieces of 'water-pics for flossing' while I was brushing my teeth...they are hard plastic (non-conductive), very thin and you can stack them / apply MX4 as temp glue to get the desired pressure on the pcb...I got as far as trying it out in terms of locking the CPU latch and it works, though still had to deal with the water block 'gap' described above.

...just an idea for a cheap dry run at least and it does not leave any marks on the pcb...because the way Intel designed this, the hold-down wings play a key role in pressing the CPU pins into the CPU...once you delid and remove the black silicon, the pressure points are elsewhere (die center).


----------



## sbruno624

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> It is! So I got an error at 4.9Ghz with 1.46v and I refuse to go any higher (for a daily OC) so I'm down to 4.8Ghz at 1.42v and if all goes well I will keep that for my daily OC. Currently 30 minutes into testing. I also tried booting up with 5Ghz and 1.5v and it booted right up. I might validate that just so I can get into the 5Ghz club haha is that bad of me to do?
> 
> See, what I do is go into the computer room and lock myself inside and put a towel under the door and open up the windows and get the fans blasting to get it nice and cool. Doesn't affect the rest of the house and the GF doesn't complain. She doesn't really say much about it except giving me some, "you are very wierd" looks every once in a while when I sneak out for food. After being with her for 3 years I have done crazier things so as long as I'm being a good boy she doesn't care.


Yeah after a while my family just gave up trying to figure out why I do half the stuff I do with my computer and just went with it.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On my lawnmower?


Naked jumping jacks on the lawnmower would probably make them move out of fear for the insane man across the street... to guarantee it, yell at the grass while mowing.
"You, right there, you think you're tall? Huh? take this! Hey dandelion, you're next!'
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sbruno624*
> 
> holy expensive, how are you gonna work that just shove it between the die and block?
> My cpu temps are all over the place in RealTemp, I didn't know the built in ones were accurate


Realtemp uses a formula to calculate the core temps, there are no actual core tempo sensors, just the package sensor.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Yes. Hopefully it arrives mirror-finish and I won't need to polish the side that contacts the die. If both sides are perfectly smooth (which we know the die is) there's no need for thermal paste. And keep in mind mirrors are made from silver deposition (at least sometimes).
> 
> Not too worried about flatness. Silver is malleable so when I screw the waterblock down it'll flex to conform to the die and waterblock.
> 
> I'll probably be buying some steel shims to substitute for the hold-down wings on the IHS.


If using no paste, as soon as the board POSTs get into bios & check the temp ASAP in the bios, then you can continue into windows or shut down fast if needed.
Even with what looks like a perfect finish, a tiny bit of TIM may help, doesn't hurt to try both ways & compare.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sbruno624*
> 
> Yeah after a while my family just gave up trying to figure out why I do half the stuff I do with my computer and just went with it.


Haha REP to that my friend!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Naked jumping jacks on the lawnmower would probably make them move out of fear for the insane man across the street... to guarantee it, yell at the grass while mowing.
> "You, right there, you think you're tall? Huh? take this! Hey dandelion, you're next!'


Haha well then it is a done deal. Just have to wait until it gets nice out and then I'm doing it. Maybe the owner of MSI will move in next door and give me a few of those 7970 Lightnings (4 to be exact).


----------



## homestyle

when I insert the blade should I angle the blade towards the ihs so I don't get the blade near the pcb?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> when I insert the blade should I angle the blade towards the ihs so I don't get the blade near the pcb?


..yes - that is VERY important

...also, DO NOT let the ends of the blade anywhere near the pcb at all (that's how 99% of the scratches occur)...use the *center of the blade* above the pcb and angled at the IHS a bit


----------



## SilentAD

Woooooow!!! Considering I'm making this post, it means my first delid experience was a SUCCESS ! I used the good ol' vice+wood+hammer method seeing as how I simply COULD NOT fit even the thinnest of razors between my CPU's IHS and PCB. And holy CRAP! are the temp results worth it alone!

Prior to delid, stable at 43 @ highest temps 94c, found out this was because of a horrible seating on the heatsink.

Post delid, retesting p95 on 43 with highest temps of about 72-74c, but this is with a better seating on the heatsink. This however I don't feel is a significant factor in that, prior to switching from my z77 extreme4 to my now ud5h, I was stable at 45 with highest temps of 93c with a good seating on the heatsink soooooo . . .

Pics to come once I find my max stable OC and get a validation so I can join the club









Delid Success: 1
Delid Failure: 0


----------



## SilentAD

Yes, I know my temps/oc ratings are a bit low, and for the voltage I needed to keep it stable at 45 and under 95c . . . I can honestly I don't have the greatest of chips







at all LoL.

But seeing as how I mainly just game, use matlab, multisim, and anime . . . I'm happy for a first time experience with OC'ing and Deliding


----------



## fnarfbargle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah that's one way to do it. If you have access to a Vise like that then try it out. Razor blades are cheaper than a 30lb bench mounted vise.


I dunno about 30lb. I can pick it up with one hand. They are hardened metal jaws, no rubber. Dunno why you'd be worried about a mark on the side of the IHS though.


----------



## fnarfbargle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If some is going to go the vise method, I would think that rotational torque would put far less stress on the pcb than the shear force created by a hammer blow. If the glue can be "knocked" off, one would surmise that it could be twisted off with less force.
> 
> The question is how to turn the pcb. A block wood with a pcb sized cutout would work, but that seems like too much trouble.


That was my original intentions, I just could not find my channel locks when I looked for them, so reached for the hammer instead.

I was going to use a pair of channel locks, with some spare neoprene rubber I have lying around to cushion the jaws. I'm sure a twist would be as good as a thump.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..yes - that is VERY important
> 
> ...also, DO NOT let the ends of the blade anywhere near the pcb at all (that's how 99% of the scratches occur)...use the *center of the blade* above the pcb and angled at the IHS a bit


Use force towards the IHS your not gonna kill the chip by bending the PCB a little bit.. i bent the crap out of mine lol...

I also started with a regular razor blade on the corners then used a thinner longer and sharper one to finish the job.



After i started with regular blade.


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..yes - that is VERY important
> 
> ...also, DO NOT let the ends of the blade anywhere near the pcb at all (that's how 99% of the scratches occur)...use the *center of the blade* above the pcb and angled at the IHS a bit


but when i get the sides, the ends of the blade does have to get near the pcb right?

or is there another technique?


----------



## sbruno624

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> but when i get the sides, the ends of the blade does have to get near the pcb right?
> 
> or is there another technique?


When I did mine i went corners first, and once you get the corners up, you should have more play, the sides with the retention bracket clip things are easiest to get up first since they arent near the die, and once you get the sides slowly go along the top and bottom, unless of course you want to stick it in a vice and smack it with a hammer. But it took me 15 minutes, I had some microscopic scratches, didnt effect a thing. Just use a stiff razor, I started with a shaving razor and it kept flexing and nicking the edge, thankfully it didnt hurt it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> but when i get the sides, the ends of the blade does have to get near the pcb right?
> 
> or is there another technique?


Think i was in the first 5= 10 to Delid...

Keep the corners away from the PCB at all costs the corners is what kills 90% of ppls cpu's

The sharp ends will cut into the pcb..

Why i used the regular razor blade then the long one.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll try the vise method tomorrow...probably. Need to grab a deliddable chip, the dead G620 is soldered so it's not gonna come off easily.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll try the vise method tomorrow...probably. Need to grab a deliddable chip, the dead G620 is soldered so it's not gonna come off easily.


I have one of those.. but mine is long de lidded heh...

Guess ill try it with Haswell / Broadwell


----------



## ivanlabrie

hehe...my new 3770k still has the lid on its die.
Don't wanna kill my only cpu so I'm not compromising it till I get a second one.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> hehe...my new 3770k still has the lid on its die.
> Don't wanna kill my only cpu so I'm not compromising it till I get a second one.


Yea, I gotta wait until I get more money until I delid my 2nd one.


----------



## SilentAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> hehe...my new 3770k still has the lid on its die.
> Don't wanna kill my only cpu so I'm not compromising it till I get a second one.


That's exactly how I felt . . . until I stumbled upon the "razorless method" and now I'm sitting here with 20-23c cooler temps !!! 1/1 delid success LoL









Gooble Goble, gooble goble, one of us, one of us . . . LoL


----------



## dr/owned

Holy crap it's harder than you would think to find shim material that is appropriately sized to replace the IHS hold downs.

With the glue + metal the wings are 1.2mm thick ~ 3/64". Width has to be within the (estimated) range of .295 to .422 in.

Finally McMaster came through with:

Multipurpose O1 Tool Steel Tight-Tolerance Flat Stock, 3/64" X 3/4", 1-1/2'L

3/4" is exactly twice the width I need (.375 in) , so I will have to dremel it in half.

Now I just have to delid my chip which Xinoxide has volunteered to do via the razor blade method. Anyone wanna volunteer to try with the hammer and vise method, which seems somewhat safer?


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Holy crap it's harder than you would think to find shim material that is appropriately sized to replace the IHS hold downs.
> 
> With the glue + metal the wings are 1.2mm thick ~ 3/64". Width has to be within the (estimated) range of .295 to .422 in.
> 
> Finally McMaster came through with:
> 
> Multipurpose O1 Tool Steel Tight-Tolerance Flat Stock, 3/64" X 3/4", 1-1/2'L
> 
> 3/4" is exactly twice the width I need (.375 in) , so I will have to dremel it in half.
> 
> Now I just have to delid my chip which Xinoxide has volunteered to do via the razor blade method. Anyone wanna volunteer to try with the hammer and vise method, which seems somewhat safer?


Whoever delids their chip with a hammer, Please, make a video! I suspect a hoax. I doubt it is as easy as the demo on youtube. Question: What is the "G" shock rating of ivy bridge?, What is the possible "G" shock out of a hammer blow? If the glue is heated will it not flex, stretch, or bounce on impact, if it was chilled would it make the glue more brittle requiring less force? Lets be responsible and test this method scientifically. again - I would love to see a video of the "hammer the IHS off your ivy" method. or the "Oreo cookie twist the IHS off your ivy" or the "cut holes in your IHS and directly water cool the die" I have an idea: put it in the oven and get it really hot so the glue melts called it the "open grill-cheese sandwich delided ivy" method. Preheat the oven at X degrees for X2 minutes, place the chip in a non-greased, non-floured pan, Bake the chip at Y degrees for Y2 minutes remove from oven, CAUTION chip may be hot! immediately open IVY BRIDGE Like a clam with hotpad themal gloves. I'm gunna need about 10 3770k to find the optimal temperature and provide a baseline for statistical success rates.







TonicX


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Whoever delids their chip with a hammer, Please, make a video! I suspect a hoax. I doubt it is as easy as the demo on youtube. Question: What is the "G" shock rating of ivy bridge?, What is the possible "G" shock out of a hammer blow? If the glue is heated will it not flex, stretch, or bounce on impact, if it was chilled would it make the glue more brittle requiring less force? Lets be responsible and test this method scientifically. again - I would love to see a video of the "hammer the IHS off your ivy" method. or the "Oreo cookie twist the IHS off your ivy" or the "cut holes in your IHS and directly water cool the die" I have an idea: put it in the oven and get it really hot so the glue melts called it the "open grill-cheese sandwich delided ivy" method. Preheat the oven at X degrees for X2 minutes, place the chip in a non-greased, non-floured pan, Bake the chip at Y degrees for Y2 minutes remove from oven, CAUTION chip may be hot! immediately open IVY BRIDGE Like a clam with hotpad themal gloves. I'm gunna need about 10 3770k to find the optimal temperature and provide a baseline for statistical success rates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TonicX


I dont think there is any G shock rating .


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> Woooooow!!! Considering I'm making this post, it means my first delid experience was a SUCCESS ! I used the good ol' vice+wood+hammer method seeing as how I simply COULD NOT fit even the thinnest of razors between my CPU's IHS and PCB. And holy CRAP! are the temp results worth it alone!
> 
> Prior to delid, stable at 43 @ highest temps 94c, found out this was because of a horrible seating on the heatsink.
> 
> Post delid, retesting p95 on 43 with highest temps of about 72-74c, but this is with a better seating on the heatsink. This however I don't feel is a significant factor in that, prior to switching from my z77 extreme4 to my now ud5h, I was stable at 45 with highest temps of 93c with a good seating on the heatsink soooooo . . .
> 
> Pics to come once I find my max stable OC and get a validation so I can join the club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delid Success: 1
> Delid Failure: 0


Good job! Now go buy some CLU so you can actually see some "real" temp drops!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've always wanted to do this, but funds...
> I can only watch the guys at hwbot buying pallets of 3770k to bin through & dream.
> Start working out in the front yard.
> 
> Naked.
> 
> Warming up with jumping jacks should have their curtains closed in no time.


Don't forget to stretch!!!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnarfbargle*
> 
> I dunno about 30lb. I can pick it up with one hand. They are hardened metal jaws, no rubber. Dunno why you'd be worried about a mark on the side of the IHS though.


I suppose you can use a lighter one, I have 3 or 4 of them. They're all 25lbs or heavier. All I'm saying is, if you don't already have one or have access to one, then going out and buying a $50-$100 bench vise is kind of silly. And there are real issues stemming from scratching or in other ways damaging your IHS but I won't discuss them on this forum.


----------



## fnarfbargle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Whoever delids their chip with a hammer, Please, make a video! I suspect a hoax. I doubt it is as easy as the demo on youtube


*ahem*








http://www.overclock.net/t/1370209/delid-3570k-without-a-razor-blade/30#post_19602052


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> when I insert the blade should I angle the blade towards the ihs so I don't get the blade near the pcb?


yes


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Think i was in the first 5= 10 to Delid...
> 
> Keep the corners away from the PCB at all costs the corners is what kills 90% of ppls cpu's
> 
> The sharp ends will cut into the pcb..
> 
> Why i used the regular razor blade then the long one.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> but when i get the sides, the ends of the blade does have to get near the pcb right?
> 
> or is there another technique?


agreed 100%


----------



## homestyle

So does clu become like an adhesive?

Clamping the cpu on the mobo moves the ihs a little. So if i were to switch mobos after my first delid would i need to do another application of clu under the ihs or would the clu be strong enough to hold the ihs in place?

Obviously i would have to reapply on the top of ihs.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> So does clu become like an adhesive?
> 
> Clamping the cpu on the mobo moves the ihs a little. So if i were to switch mobos after my first delid would i need to do another application of clu under the ihs or would the clu be strong enough to hold the ihs in place?
> 
> Obviously i would have to reapply on the top of ihs.


IHS has always moved for me.


----------



## SilentAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Holy crap it's harder than you would think to find shim material that is appropriately sized to replace the IHS hold downs.
> 
> With the glue + metal the wings are 1.2mm thick ~ 3/64". Width has to be within the (estimated) range of .295 to .422 in.
> 
> Finally McMaster came through with:
> 
> Multipurpose O1 Tool Steel Tight-Tolerance Flat Stock, 3/64" X 3/4", 1-1/2'L
> 
> 3/4" is exactly twice the width I need (.375 in) , so I will have to dremel it in half.
> 
> Now I just have to delid my chip which Xinoxide has volunteered to do via the razor blade method. Anyone wanna volunteer to *try with the hammer and vise method, which seems somewhat safer?*
> 
> 
> 
> *Whoever delids their chip with a hammer, Please, make a video! I suspect a hoax. I doubt it is as easy as the demo on youtube.* Question: What is the "G" shock rating of ivy bridge?, What is the possible "G" shock out of a hammer blow? If the glue is heated will it not flex, stretch, or bounce on impact, if it was chilled would it make the glue more brittle requiring less force? Lets be responsible and test this method scientifically. again - I would love to see a video of the "hammer the IHS off your ivy" method. or the "Oreo cookie twist the IHS off your ivy" or the "cut holes in your IHS and directly water cool the die" I have an idea: put it in the oven and get it really hot so the glue melts called it the "open grill-cheese sandwich delided ivy" method. Preheat the oven at X degrees for X2 minutes, place the chip in a non-greased, non-floured pan, Bake the chip at Y degrees for Y2 minutes remove from oven, CAUTION chip may be hot! immediately open IVY BRIDGE Like a clam with hotpad themal gloves. I'm gunna need about 10 3770k to find the optimal temperature and provide a baseline for statistical success rates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TonicX
Click to expand...

I'm freaking SORRY for not making a video !!! I had my phone charging in the living room. After class yesterday I went to Lowe's and bought a $29 4.5" table vice (so that answers someone who previously thought they were expensive)

With my success I don't have a razor delid to compare to, but I would spectate this method is WAY safer. IF you make sure when you whack the block of wood to make sure you CATCH or have something soft around the vice. Because when my CPU finally broke free from the IHS, it didn't exactly stay put like the video in the other thread, it popped off the table and landed on the ground (I didn't calibrate my hammer enough







). Yes, the part with the CPU !!! Fell to the ground (concrete, garage) but it was all fine and dandy, no scratches, cleaned her up, did the deed with CLP and now I'm loving my 20-23c temp drop


----------



## SilentAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Good job! Now go buy some CLU so you can actually see some "real" temp drops!


How is 20-23c not a "real" temp drop O_O ? I could probably see a few more degrees if I got a proper TIM for IHS-Heatsink. But I only had the stock cooler master TIM that came with my Hyper 212 Evo.


----------



## SilentAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> So does clu become like an adhesive?
> 
> Clamping the cpu on the mobo moves the ihs a little. So if i were to switch mobos after my first delid would i need to do another application of clu under the ihs or would the clu be strong enough to hold the ihs in place?
> 
> Obviously i would have to reapply on the top of ihs.
> 
> 
> 
> IHS has always moved for me.
Click to expand...

The IHS didn't move more than 1mm for me, meaning it basically didn't move at all when I used the CPU clamp on my ud5h mobo. As for another application of CLU when switching motherboards, I would say you wouldn't have to "IF" you lift the CPU out of the socket straight up and set it straight down. Same goes for putting it into the new motherboard.

I speculate this, because after putting my CPU in the socket, I forgot to move the IHS back a bit before clamping it down so when I did, the CLP between the die and IHS gave me quit a bit of resistance when moving horizontally. I'm not entirely sure how it would behave vertically because as I found out after the delid, the IHS has some weight to it (practially ALL the weight of the CPU package LoL)


----------



## Hokies83

I always take the mb out when putting the de lidded cpu in that way u can get it perfect,


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Good job! Now go buy some CLU so you can actually see some "real" temp drops!
> 
> 
> 
> How is 20-23c not a "real" temp drop O_O ? I could probably see a few more degrees if I got a proper TIM for IHS-Heatsink. But I only had the stock cooler master TIM that came with my Hyper 212 Evo.
Click to expand...

I honestly think CLU is overhyped. Anyone reading the 80-way thermal interface review would agree that how paste is applied and how much pressure is on it is far more important than what paste is applied.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I honestly think CLU is overhyped. Anyone reading the 80-way thermal interface review would agree that how paste is applied and how much pressure is on it is far more important than what paste is applied.


........

W/MK there is NO Over Hype to it when Put between a die and an IHS it is KING by a mile...


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I honestly think CLU is overhyped. Anyone reading the 80-way thermal interface review would agree that how paste is applied and how much pressure is on it is far more important than what paste is applied.
> 
> 
> 
> ........
> 
> W/MK there is NO Over Hype to it when Put between a die and an IHS it is KING by a mile...
Click to expand...

[citation needed]


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I honestly think CLU is overhyped. Anyone reading the 80-way thermal interface review would agree that how paste is applied and how much pressure is on it is far more important than what paste is applied.


I have used CLU on the die and on the IHS, I have also used other tim on both surfaces. On the IHS it is better than others but by only a few degrees, on the die is another story. I don't know if we have anyone that didn't see a measurable difference when switching to ultra or pro on the die from some other tim.


----------



## flv1333

I'm really tempted to get this: http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html

since I'm planning a custom loop anyways







any thoughts? think a direct die contact will lower the temps even more?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flv1333*
> 
> I'm really tempted to get this: http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
> 
> since I'm planning a custom loop anyways
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any thoughts? think a direct die contact will lower the temps even more?


Repost from yesterday. I don't think it'll be an improvement for most people. Most waterblocks/heatsinks are slightly convex, and I doubt EK is an exception. The IHS has a benefit of making good contact less finicky, because you can just put down a ton of pressure to flex the IHS to conform a bit better.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> How is 20-23c not a "real" temp drop O_O ? I could probably see a few more degrees if I got a proper TIM for IHS-Heatsink. But I only had the stock cooler master TIM that came with my Hyper 212 Evo.


I didn't say it wasn't a good temp drop but I'm just saying that you could get better.why not milk it for all you can get?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> [citation needed]


No need to prove it to you.. Just beleive it. Almost everyone that put "regular paste" then switched to clu or clp on the die saw at least 10 degrees extra. No need to prove it to you.


----------



## dr/owned

Not to be difficult, but CLU is supposed to be a bit lower thermal conductivity than CLP, and CLP was only rated B+ here:

http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=150&Itemid=62&limit=1&limitstart=11

I'm using GC Electronics Silcone Z9 10-8108 which was rated higher (it's also vastly cheaper)

In my mind thermal conductivity is thermal conductivity and it doesn't matter where it's being applied.


----------



## TonicX

Rav - I want to do a stability test and have prime95,v25.11,build 2. My first time prime95 crashed after 10 minutes, I up the vcore. Now my question: how do know if I have errors? why does it take 24 hours? Help a prime95 nooby out. what is a whea error?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Not to be difficult, but CLU is supposed to be a bit lower thermal conductivity than CLP, and CLP was only rated B+ here:
> 
> http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=150&Itemid=62&limit=1&limitstart=11
> 
> I'm using GC Electronics Silcone Z9 10-8108 which was rated higher (it's also vastly cheaper)
> 
> In my mind thermal conductivity is thermal conductivity and it doesn't matter where it's being applied.


Alrighty now it's time to learn people!!!










just kidding feeling much better and feeling somewhat smurt today.

Anyways dr, as with the entire 80 way thing of paste lets make one thing clear about CLU/CLP right now. it's not meant to be on the IHS as a standard TIM, it's ment purely (as i see it) for the die of Ivy bridge.

liquid metal like solder is meant for small places to move lots of heat, CLU/CLP are key for this as their heat movement is pretty darn crazy as it is. This is why it's mainly for the die as the die is very small and outputs tons of heat which the CLP/CLP can immediately hold and throw out onto the IHs and then transfer to the heat sink. I don't believe there are any actual testings of switching die TIM from lets say AS5 and MX or even prolimatech or other stuff to CLU/CLP. this is because the smaller the are the more heat density and the more w/km (shut up if i spelled it wrong) then the best performance you can get. on the front page i have the list of the most used TIM on here... go take a look at the top two which are CLU/CLP they are at least twice as high on the values of heat movement.

IHS TIM's can't compete as they need a larger area to work as thats how they are designed to be placed and used, CLU/CLP do both they don't work the best on the IHS (still darn good with stock Intel TIM though) but put it on the die........ and use lets say MX-1 you'll drop at least 10 C no problem then switch the MX-1 and you'll drop more, why? because the CLU/CLP can move all the heat no problem but the MX-1 is holding everything back. then switch to a crazy good TIM like CLU and then you'll drop even more as it will have a much higher transfer rate of heat and then it's all based on your cooling unit after that.

We don't recommend it just for sponsor or kicks. it's the best TIM for this out there. take a look through the OP and look through the spreadsheet and see what TIMs everyone is using and the temp drops, it's for exactly that.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Rav - I want to do a stability test and have prime95,v25.11,build 2. My first time prime95 crashed after 10 minutes, I up the vcore. Now my question: how do know if I have errors? why does it take 24 hours? Help a prime95 nooby out. what is a whea error?


Sorry, this is an inside joke I guess?
I would assume someone who tells people to oc with BCLK for a 24/7 stability would be an expert in testing that stability.


----------



## TonicX

I have a intel i3-2100 LGA1155 is the IHS solder or tim ? I know it is not Overclockable (except a few notches with BCLK) but is it a suitable chip to delid, if I want to try one of the neo-deliding techniques? I,m going to youtube it. If I was going to do another 3770K or similar, no way would I do anything other that the "Razor-Blade Technique" It was so controlled -(literally Rocket-Surgery) but I am experimentational sort of guy. So I'm thinking of making a jig in my woodshop to "Oreo Cookie twist the die off Ivy Bridge" The hammer just seams to reckless- imho - What do you guys want to see? I will take a quick poll, film the dirty-deed, and post it this evening. Wish me luck!







*i7 3770K-Asus P8Z77MPro-16Gb HyperX-Patriot SSD-Windows8-Water H60- CX750M*








*5.5GHz Ivy 3770K*







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*















*"Yeah my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## dr/owned

OK I checked the specs between the GC Electronics and the CLU.

7.5 vs. 38.4. Still a whole lot crappier than silver or copper which is > 400.

OK I'm in agreement then...CLU will be superior only because you don't have to worry about the liquidity of CLU being counter-productive towards filling in gaps.

I guess if I'm going through the crazy length of using silver to replace the copper IHS, I might as well use the best thermal paste possible (I'll probably use CLU for die->silver shim and GC Electronics for shim -> waterblock).


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, this is an inside joke I guess?
> I would assume someone who tells people to oc with BCLK for a 24/7 stability would be an expert in testing that stability.


No, no joke, not an expert, you missed a few post then. I did one brief stability test and it supported your assertion about not ocing the bclk, so I have been running it at 100 since. So if you have time to reply to my post how about answering the questions? Thanks-man.

EDIT: I don't need a personal tutorial but a link would suffice since this has undoubtitly been cover here somewhere? I don't really feel comfortable using these extreme artificial workload benches for long periods of time, I suspect it could damage are degrade my cpu/hardware. BUT- this is a render machine (Cinema 4d) and a few games. The render and the games dont crash it, so why find a program that pushes it harder and hotter? My SSD hard-drive RAID 0 cant take a lot of crashing.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> No, no joke, not an expert, you missed a few post then. I did one brief stability test and it supported your assertion about not ocing the bclk, so I have been running it at 100 since. So if you have time to reply to my post how about answering the questions? Thanks-man.


You have an Asus mobo correct? I can try to help you with whatever you need to know about bios settings or stability testing.
Follow Swag's guide, it gives you all the settings, and tells you how to test. You want Prime95 27.9 now. WHEA logger 19 parity error warnings in your Windows Event Viewer mean your oc is not stable.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You have an Asus mobo correct? I can try to help you with whatever you need to know about bios settings or stability testing.
> Follow Swag's guide, it gives you all the settings, and tells you how to test. You want Prime95 27.9 now. WHEA logger 19 parity error warnings in your Windows Event Viewer mean your oc is not stable.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards


Thanks- just what I need +2 your rep is for 98 to 100 now. triple digits! congrats


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Thanks- just what I need +2 your rep is for 98 to 100 now. triple digits! congrats


Thanks. Despite previous claims to the contrary, I only have two purposes here, to learn and to also try to help others with what I have learned. Read through the first post in that thread, any question you have just post in that thread and someone will help you.
Unfortunately you will probably trigger the bios bug and need to reflash at some point. There is a new bios for Asus Rog mobos but not the P8Z77 yet, it should be out soon.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I got my Phantom 820 in today and it looks beautiful. I wish I had my PSU :-( will take pics tonight


----------



## KuuFA

Alright just made a short and sweet guide on how to delid razorless version LMK if i need to make changes!

[How To] Delid your Ivy Bridge CPU with out a Razor Blade!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> OK I checked the specs between the GC Electronics and the CLU.
> 
> 7.5 vs. 38.4. Still a whole lot crappier than silver or copper which is > 400.
> 
> OK I'm in agreement then...CLU will be superior only because you don't have to worry about the liquidity of CLU being counter-productive towards filling in gaps.
> 
> I guess if I'm going through the crazy length of using silver to replace the copper IHS, I might as well use the best thermal paste possible (I'll probably use CLU for die->silver shim and GC Electronics for shim -> waterblock).


Just make sure clu wont eat the silver!


----------



## lilchronic

@ justanoldman got my 670 today and im right behind your 690

Quote:


> So I got my Phantom 820 in today and it looks beautiful. I wish I had my PSU :-( will take pics tonight


heres my nzxt 420 lol its really the 410 but 420 sounds better









kinda want to get my heat gun out and take them stickers off


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks. Despite previous claims to the contrary, I only have two purposes here, to learn and to also try to help others with what I have learned. Read through the first post in that thread, any question you have just post in that thread and someone will help you.
> Unfortunately you will probably trigger the bios bug and need to reflash at some point. There is a new bios for Asus Rog mobos but not the P8Z77 yet, it should be out soon.


Yeah I've decided to ugrade my p8z77 to the ROG (not just the bios bug) - its pretty basic and they skimped on the heatsinks and some features. so now can afford the rog so - wth. Then A kick-ass video card or 2 - then a custom loop. I've learned a lot reading in these rooms.
*







*







*I JUST NEED ONE MORE PART!*















I *ALWAYS* JUST NEED ONE MORE PART!


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just make sure clu wont eat the silver!










Already checked "Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra was designed for use with high quality coolers made of copper or silver."

Thanks for looking out for me though









I am a bit worried about the silver touching nickel waterblock. Anodic index is within .15V so I dunno...in theory it'll be ok.


----------



## SilentAD

I would have used my CLP on my IHS-Heatsink but alas, the Copper Heat pipes with the 212 Evo are attached to an Aluminum block







Otherwise I would have seen a few more *c drop


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> @ justanoldman got my 670 today and im right behind your 690


I think I am supposed to say "oh yeah, it's on like donkey kong" but that might make me seem old. Good luck with the 670 sli, it is a really good setup. I was going to go that way but I just wanted to have to deal with one water block so went with the 690. My card doesn't oc that well, but at least I am in second place for that card.

That is a great score so far, you are not running the Precision X osd while benchmarking Valley are you? I think that will hurt your score, you want to turn off every extra process you can.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Yeah I've decided to ugrade my p8z77 to the ROG (not just the bios bug) - its pretty basic and they skimped on the heatsinks and some features. so now can afford the rog so - wth. Then A kick-ass video card or 2 - then a custom loop. I've learned a lot reading in these rooms.


Did the same thing - started with a P8Z77-V Pro, took it back for a MVF and I am glad I did. Trying to expand my H220 this weekend to cool my gpu. Good mobo, delid, watercooling are the way to go I think.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> I would have used my CLP on my IHS-Heatsink but alas, the Copper Heat pipes with the 212 Evo are attached to an Aluminum block
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Otherwise I would have seen a few more *c drop


To the contrary, I thought we established this morning that CLP/U is better for Die->IHS but worse for IHS->heatsink.


----------



## Fallout323f

dont know of it is allready posted but look here.

http://www.ekwb.com/news/324/19/EK-first-to-support-cooling-of-delided-Ivy-Bridge-CPUs/


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> That is a great score so far, you are not running the Precision X osd while benchmarking Valley are you? I think that will hurt your score, you want to turn off every extra process you can.


yea i did but just to make sure that my new 670 didnt throttle with unlocked bios. which my older card does and i cant stand it so i keep the stock bios on it so i dont have to deal with the throttling


----------



## SilentAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> I would have used my CLP on my IHS-Heatsink but alas, the Copper Heat pipes with the 212 Evo are attached to an Aluminum block
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Otherwise I would have seen a few more *c drop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To the contrary, I thought we established this morning that CLP/U is better for Die->IHS but worse for IHS->heatsink.
Click to expand...

Ahh yeah, I forgot. Well, next time I come across some better TIM for IHS (currently using the stock cooler master TIM that comes with the 212 Evo) then I'll replace it. Other than that, CLP on my die and I'm LOVING IT ! I can finally overclock without the worry of overheating on moderate clocks like 45.


----------



## TonicX

is the intel i3-2100 LGA1155 is the IHS solder or tim
repost of:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/15130#post_19623069







*OFF WITH ITS HEAD!*








or







*OFF TO E-BAY?*


----------



## Warocia

I did some maintenance on the loop the other day. Here is long-term effects of Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra against copper if anybody is interested.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's better for the heatsink if contact is good...Can't possibly be worse with higher w/mk.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> is the intel i3-2100 LGA1155 is the IHS solder or tim
> repost of:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/15130#post_19623069
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OFF WITH ITS HEAD!*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OFF TO E-BAY?*


That's a Sandy Bridge i3 man, soldered ihs...don't bother.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warocia*
> 
> I did some maintenance on the loop the other day. Here is long-term effects of Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra against copper if anybody is interested.


Oh-oh! I have clu between my IHS and copper cool block.
Did it fuse or form a strong bond, sort of like a "weld" together?

How Long is "long-term"?

Do you think it will sand out or is it divited?


----------



## dr/owned

CLU looks to be mostly gallium, which will for CuGa when they come in contact.

According to the research paper I'm reading, it seems gallium dissolves copper:

Is most likely that the particles of the
initial solid phase dissolve in liquid gallium. The slower
the accumulation of copper in the solution, the larger the
CuGa2
crystallites


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Oh-oh! I have clu between my IHS and copper cool block.
> Did it fuse or form a strong bond, sort of like a "weld" together?
> 
> How Long is "long-term"?
> 
> Do you think it will sand out or is it divited?


Sands out..


----------



## SilentAD

Ok so I finally got her stable at 46 (Still waiting for CPUZ validation) so here goes nothing:

OCN: SilentAD
On-die TIM: CLP
IHS TIM: Stock Coolermaster (Came with 212 Evo)
MHz Gained: 300 MHz (for now)
OC Post-delid: 4.604
Temp Drops: @ 45 stable - 21c

Now for the Pictures









My i7 3770k Information:


After 4.5" Vice + Wood + Calibrated Hammer:



After Clean Up:



With CLP Applied:


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I think I am supposed to say "oh yeah, it's on like donkey kong" but that might make me seem old. Good luck with the 670 sli, it is a really good setup. I was going to go that way but I just wanted to have to deal with one water block so went with the 690. My card doesn't oc that well, but at least I am in second place for that card.
> 
> That is a great score so far, you are not running the Precision X osd while benchmarking Valley are you? I think that will hurt your score, you want to turn off every extra process you can.
> Did the same thing - started with a P8Z77-V Pro, took it back for a MVF and I am glad I did. Trying to expand my H220 this weekend to cool my gpu. Good mobo, delid, watercooling are the way to go I think.


But you're "Justanoldman" so it's okay for you to use dated phrases!

Ohh the woes of P8Z77-V Pro use. Man am I glad I ditched that thing. I ate $50 doing so, mostly because a buddy of mine was interested but I know he doesn't make very much money so I tossed it too him for $125 after I got it back from RMA. I got it for $175 including rebate and newegg black friday sale.


----------



## dr/owned

In case anyone wants to know the specs of the packaging (thank god for scale drawings):

Die is .5mm thick
Glue is around .3mm thick (it can vary)
IHS wings are 1mm thick
IHS top (that touches die) is 2.28mm thick
Total IHS height is 2.75mm thick (it is not the sum of wings + top)
PCB is 1mm thick
Total package height (PCB+Glue+IHS) is 4.05mm

Die Dimensions are 8.141 x 19.361 mm (this is per AnandTech, assuming 3770k)

Ordering some .5mm copper shim right now so I can wrap the die with it. I don't want my 1x1 silver shim "flopping" on the edges, because I want as much contact as possible with the waterblock. It's possible that the IHS, even though it's made with an inferior metal, will yield better results because it is 28 mm^2 vs. 1x1 which is 25.4 mm^2.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Already checked "Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra was designed for use with high quality coolers made of copper or silver."
> 
> Thanks for looking out for me though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am a bit worried about the silver touching nickel waterblock. Anodic index is within .15V so I dunno...in theory it'll be ok.


No problem if anything just get a silver kill coil
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> Ok so I finally got her stable at 46 (Still waiting for CPUZ validation) so here goes nothing:
> 
> OCN: SilentAD
> On-die TIM: CLP
> IHS TIM: Stock Coolermaster (Came with 212 Evo)
> MHz Gained: 300 MHz (for now)
> OC Post-delid: 4.604
> Temp Drops: @ 45 stable - 21c
> 
> Now for the Pictures
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> My i7 3770k Information:
> 
> 
> After 4.5" Vice + Wood + Calibrated Hammer:
> 
> 
> 
> After Clean Up:
> 
> 
> 
> With CLP Applied:


You're In! Slap that new Sig on man!


----------



## Joa3d43

*Direct Die (no IHS) Water Block mods; original Anandtech Ivy dimensions*

Regarding direct-die to water-block cooling and also Ivy Bridge dimensions, as Yogi Berra once said "...*it's deja vous all over again*"...so, something new and something old









Here is a collage of pics of a heavily modified and subsequently triple-silver plated water-block modified to retain the CPU latch mechanism but leave off the IHS...this is the work of a pro who used to (...) post here. Essentially, the water block was machined down around the edges to fit 'into' the CPU latch mechanism by the precise amount needed to make good contact with the CPU die and also re correct CPU pin-pressures


more @ http://www.overclock.net/t/1256763/lets-see-some-direct-die-water-cooling-on-ivy-bridge/

...and here are some of the *original* Anandtech articles re Ivy Bridge dimensions, and also direct-die TIM comparisons









http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=33789593

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595


----------



## Hokies83

Yah i only use copper in my loops i even removed the nickel plated plugs that were in my Res and replaced them with copper ones lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warocia*
> 
> I did some maintenance on the loop the other day. Here is long-term effects of Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra against copper if anybody is interested.


Holy crap! It looks like there is a tumor on the block! How high is it off of the copper? Wow lots of discussion today.

Anyways I found my Phantom 820 on my doorstep when I came home from the funeral today and I was so happy to see it because I just wanted to build a little bit and get my mind off of things. The case itself is amazing. The amount of cables it comes with is scary.. so is the size. I mean I knew it was a full tower case, but this thing is just massive. It makes my E-ATX MOBO look like a M-ATX haha. So I spent a couple hours making things neat (I'm going all out in cable management on this case) and I think I did a pretty good job so far. I'm so happy I bought a huge bag of zipties a while ago. They are really coming in handy now. I am just wiring all of the power cables through the case so all I have to do is plug the PSU in when it gets back from RMA. I'm (im)patiently waiting for it to come back. Here are some pics. Look good for my first real cable management attempt? I spent 4 hours doing this tiny little bit. Sorry for the bad pictures from my cell phone. Also, excuse the loose cables in the second picture those still need to be ran behind the motherboard.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Neat!









Seems like a nice case to work with...hopefully it'll help get you distracted.


----------



## dr/owned

Update from me:

Plan A has switched from silver shim to the EK method....reduced height thumbnuts on my Koolance 380i (need to update sig). I will then have the block directly touching the die and attempt to use pressure from the waterblock to make pin contact. Will order from McMaster Carr tonight and have by Monday.

Won't bore everyone with specific numbers, but I've taken and used specific measurements to have decent certainty all my heights will be correct.

Reason for the switch? After doing a heat transfer simulation (fairly easy to use and free software too), believe it or not, a thinner shim made of silver will potentially be worse than a copper IHS, because the surface are would be smaller (negating the thinness and thermal conductivity advantages)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ah, makes sense...good that it saved you like 95 bucks in the process...

Good luck!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> After doing a heat transfer simulation (fairly easy to use and free software too), believe it or not, a thinner shim made of silver will potentially be worse than a copper IHS, because the surface are would be smaller (negating the thinness and thermal conductivity advantages)


Hmm very interesting. I would have thought it would have been the other way around. Very interested to see how things go when you get it on monday. Be sure to take lots and lots of pictures









We like pictures


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> After doing a heat transfer simulation (fairly easy to use and free software too), believe it or not, a thinner shim made of silver will potentially be worse than a copper IHS, because the surface are would be smaller (negating the thinness and thermal conductivity advantages)
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm very interesting. I would have thought it would have been the other way around. Very interested to see how things go when you get it on monday. Be sure to take lots and lots of pictures
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We like pictures
Click to expand...

For a super ghetto touchpad drawing of what the heat transfer lines look like, with an oversized surface area you get lines that curve towards the edges. With one that's equally sized you only get straight lines (and fewer lines total).



And the silver is already ordered...so that's plan B








Fortunately it's a precious metal so I can resell it at near market value no problem if I don't use it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> For a super ghetto touchpad drawing of what the heat transfer lines look like, with an oversized surface area you get lines that curve towards the edges. With one that's equally sized you only get straight lines (and fewer lines total).


Yea my mind was stuck on the thin-ness and conductivity and not surface area. That makes perfect sense!

Goodnight people. Back to work tomorrow!


----------



## dr/owned

Just in case a nerd comes here off google at some point, here's the non-ghetto simulation. Notice T2 (the bottom configuration in the background) is cooling off much faster than T1.



So unfortunately for the guy above that has a crazy nice looking custom waterblock machined to precisely match the die dimensions...it's a non-optimal design


----------



## Swag

Do any of you guys know if the 3570K will bottleneck the 680? Or 2x 680s?


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Do any of you guys know if the 3570K will bottleneck the 680? Or 2x 680s?


@4.8?

no way.

@ stock
1x680 no
2x680 probably.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Do any of you guys know if the 3570K will bottleneck the 680? Or 2x 680s?
> 
> 
> 
> @4.8?
> 
> no way.
> 
> @ stock
> 1x680 no
> 2x680 probably.
Click to expand...

Just wondering, seems a lot of people are saying otherwise but I trust the people here more.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Do any of you guys know if the 3570K will bottleneck the 680? Or 2x 680s?


no i dont think so, maybe 4 titans would cause a bottleneck


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bottlenecking is such a vague term...

What is it exactly that you fear? You won't be hindered fps wise, when adding a second 680 even at stock clocks. That would happen if you were to game on a pentium 4 and go from a 5870 to a gtx 680 maybe.


----------



## dr/owned

How is this even vaguely related to delidded IB?


----------



## Warocia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Oh-oh! I have clu between my IHS and copper cool block.
> Did it fuse or form a strong bond, sort of like a "weld" together?
> 
> How Long is "long-term"?
> 
> Do you think it will sand out or is it divited?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Holy crap! It looks like there is a tumor on the block! How high is it off of the copper? Wow lots of discussion today.


One year. It is only surface stain and sands out pretty easily. I was surprised that direct die was almost clean so it resist the effects of CLU better than copper. CLU seems great way to void a warranty (cleaning IHS can be pain without damaging text). Of course, this doesn't matter when you are already delidded cpu.


----------



## homestyle

anyone use regular tim under the ihs and not notice worsening temps? (pump-out effect)

if so, what tim did you use?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> anyone use regular tim under the ihs and not notice worsening temps? (pump-out effect)
> 
> if so, what tim did you use?


...in my 6x 3770 VM systems, I use MX4...very close to CL in many ways...in fact: 



 ... 'faster' is a well known HWBOt guy..


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...in my 6x 3770 VM systems, I use MX4...very close to CL in many ways...in fact:
> 
> 
> 
> ... 'faster' is a well known HWBOt guy..


im not concered about absolute performance.

i've heard that regular tim can pump out and you get progressively higher and higher temps until you redo the tim again. i heard some people with as5 had this problem.


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> anyone use regular tim under the ihs and not notice worsening temps? (pump-out effect)
> 
> if so, what tim did you use?


My understanding was that normal TIM under the IHS will work short-term but not recommended for long term uses as it will wear out.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> im not concered about absolute performance.
> 
> i've heard that regular tim can pump out and you get progressively higher and higher temps until you redo the tim again. i heard some people with as5 had this problem.


MX4 is a long term product.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm not so sure about that...I'd stick to liquid metal for the die. Not hard to find and you can get it shipped to your door for pennies vs the amount of performance given.


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm not so sure about that...I'd stick to liquid metal for the die. Not hard to find and you can get it shipped to your door for pennies vs the amount of performance given.


i'm more concerned about the difficulty with removing the CLU after a while. .... which would happen if I switch mobos/cpus or ever want to try another tim.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> im not concered about absolute performance.
> 
> i've heard that regular tim can pump out and you get progressively higher and higher temps until you redo the tim again. i heard some people with as5 had this problem.


I think most here are using the liquid metal. I did use mx4 for a while as I was waiting for some CLU with the first chip I delidded, only a couple weeks & it was fine when I opened it up again.
I'm sure there are some here that have been using normal tim for longer, have to see if they pop up, or get some regular tim on your die & start testing.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> i'm more concerned about the difficulty with removing the CLU after a while. .... which would happen if I switch mobos/cpus or ever want to try another tim.


...for what it is worth (and others may have a different opinion)

...MX4 is the less-complicated 98% solution which I run on customer machines...great temps on die and IHS and easy removal with a few rounds of Isopropanol every time...

...on the two-out-of-eight no holds barred machines, I run CL-U...more difficult to remove during mobo swaps later than MX4, but certainly not an unsolvable conundrum...just a bit more work...while I own several tubes of CL-Pro, I stay away from it...not because it is 'bad' in any way, just more tricky to clean up than CL-U, without a performance gain


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, I'm sick and tired of this Zalman mic.

What do you guys think is the best headset for PC right now? For gaming. I need a headset because I don't want a separate mic anymore.


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...for what it is worth (and others may have a different opinion)
> 
> ...MX4 is the less-complicated 98% solution which I run on customer machines...great temps on die and IHS and easy removal with a few rounds of Isopropanol every time...
> 
> ...on the two-out-of-eight no holds barred machines, I run CL-U...more difficult to remove during mobo swaps later than MX4, but certainly not an unsolvable conundrum...just a bit more work...while I own several tubes of CL-Pro, I stay away from it...not because it is 'bad' in any way, just more tricky to clean up than CL-U, without a performance gain


what is the consistency of mx4?

scale of 1 to 10. 1 is as5 and 10 is ic diamond.


----------



## Rucka315

Kinda off subject their swag but its ok. I use this headset because its cheap its durable and they sound amazing. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B1KJK22


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Kinda off subject their swag but its ok. I use this headset because its cheap its durable and they sound amazing. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B1KJK22


I go OT every time I'm here, I just wait until someone has a question about delidding and then we answer that but I like to go OT.









Added to my list, my current list has the Corsair 1300 Analog and the Steelseries Siberia V2.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> what is the consistency of mx4?
> 
> scale of 1 to 10. 1 is as5 and 10 is ic diamond.


3 or 4


----------



## Tim Milano

Im sorry but I have to ask can someone in simple words explain what this actually involves and why people do it?

All I got was hit your CPU chip, with a hammer, and overclockers do this.......

Yes im not a pro-computer know it all person.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tim Milano*
> 
> Im sorry but I have to ask can someone in simple words explain what this actually involves and why people do it?
> 
> All I got was hit your CPU chip, with a hammer, and overclockers do this.......
> 
> Yes im not a pro-computer know it all person.


These Ivy Bridge cpus come with the metal plate over the core attached to the pcb with glue and they use thermal paste as the thermal interface material between said metal plate (ihs) and the cpu core.
This generates bad contact cause of the amount of glue and tim used, which leads to really high temps. Even water cooling can't help if the thermal interface between the cpu cooler base and core is poor.
After delidding you can replace the paste with something with higher thermal conductivity and get rid of the glue to narrow the gap, hence reducing temperatures greatly!


----------



## Tim Milano

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> These Ivy Bridge cpus come with the metal plate over the core attached to the pcb with glue and they use thermal paste as the thermal interface material between said metal plate (ihs) and the cpu core.
> This generates bad contact cause of the amount of glue and tim used, which leads to really high temps. Even water cooling can't help if the thermal interface between the cpu cooler base and core is poor.
> After delidding you can replace the paste with something with higher thermal conductivity and get rid of the glue to narrow the gap, hence reducing temperatures greatly!


Hmmmm....now it makes sense. Would it help if the CPU chips were at a big size? Like more surface to water cool.....


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> How is this even vaguely related to delidded IB?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rucka315*
> 
> Kinda off subject their swag but its ok. I use this headset because its cheap its durable and they sound amazing. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B1KJK22


You guys are new to this thread. We go off topic often, we still talk delidding when someone has a question, but our subject matter can stray from that frequently.

After all it is the Delidded Club. A Club for Delidders! Enjoy!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

LOL @ Swag - always being off-topic. I can't remember him being on-topic the last time









As for the paste:
CLU on the die.
MX2 on the IHS

= works great.
Cleaning CLU off the PCB, was hard enough, let alone it being "printed" on the IHS over a period of time.
Personally, I would NEVER use CLU on the IHS.

MX2 is 2 yrs old and still kicking.
Will get MX4 once my MX2 runs out...in like another 2yrs time? lol


----------



## Swag

Haha! Well, I have a lot of OT questions... Too much in fact. I've been MIA these past few weeks from OCN basically and I've been completely hooked into playing the new games like Bioshock and a lot of competitive CSGO.


----------



## I_shot

Speaking of thermal paste ;



I'm gonna make an extreme thermal compound shootout today


----------



## Mopar63

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warocia*
> 
> I did some maintenance on the loop the other day. Here is long-term effects of Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra against copper if anybody is interested.


I would like to hear more about this, especially from the people at Coollaboratory. The documentation for the Ultra and Pro says it works better on copper. Have you submitted this picture to them for an answer?


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Warocia*
> 
> I did some maintenance on the loop the other day. Here is long-term effects of Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra against copper if anybody is interested.


That's quite normal. we're talking about liquid metal here and that's why they put grinding pad into kit


----------



## Mopar63

Okay so explain this to me. I am looking to use this on a 3570K with a Water 2.0 Extreme cooler on my Prodigy build. Does this stuff just ball up over time or what???


----------



## I_shot

ıt'll be very solid and hard to remove but don't worry . you can remove it using metal cleaner and sand paper


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok guys I finally have my cable management all neat and tidy (this case has a million cables even before the power supply) and I think I did a pretty good job for my first time actually doing it. Everything is put in and it looks great. Except for a little sag on my top 7950







Its not too bad though. All I need now is to get my PSU back from Seasonic so I can actually use it! UPS tracking says it is going to arrive at Seasonic today. Anyone have any idea how long it will take to get back to me??


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You might have a few more rep if you bothered to answer the question asked instead of posting a completely irrelevant review of on the IHS comparison. Helping people in nice, posting info about on the IHS instead of under the IHS which is what the question was about seems pointless.
> 
> I just posted that using pro/ultra on the IHS is ok, but not necessary, on the die is another matter. Since the thread owner just posted a lengthy explanation of why people use those on the die, do you realize you are calling him and everyone here who just posted that those are the preferred TIMs idiots and know it alls?
> 
> I am flagging your post as intentionally personally offensive and therefore in violation of the TOS. I would appreciate an official ocn response from a moderator.


everyone look the moon is falling out of the sky.
lolz
u 2 should kiss and make up


----------



## I_shot

Check out my new liquid metal shootout

http://www.overclock.net/t/1376460/liquid-metal-thermal-compounds-tested


----------



## Joa3d43

*Use of silver...*

Per earlier post about the chap who had fully customized his CPU block and subsequently silver-plated it...


...there is another important item, noting that the whole thing is silver-plated, including the inside of the block that comes in contact with the cooling liquids (see small pics inside the bigger one): Silver is anti-bacterial, and as such is often used in liquid-cooled systems in some form or another to control bacterial growth - even if you started out with distilled water etc. Often, folks use a small piece of silver anchored in the reservoir. I find the approach above quite unique and 'outside the box', with additional benefits such as the anti-bacterial qualities.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> LOL @ Swag - always being off-topic. I can't remember him being on-topic the last time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for the paste:
> CLU on the die.
> MX2 on the IHS
> 
> = works great.
> Cleaning CLU off the PCB, was hard enough, let alone it being "printed" on the IHS over a period of time.
> Personally, I would NEVER use CLU on the IHS.
> 
> MX2 is 2 yrs old and still kicking.
> Will get MX4 once my MX2 runs out...in like another 2yrs time? lol


If you delid = no warranty.

So you should use CLU on both the die and IHS.


----------



## MattyMatt

http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html

In case you havent heard


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yea I was too scared to use CLU on the IHS because I didn't want it to make marks on my block, but of course I used it on the die. I used MX4 on the IHS and everything is working great. I only noticed a 2 or 3c difference between the two so I don't really see a need to use CLU on my block.


----------



## ivanlabrie

In a perfect world you should mate...cheers.


----------



## stickg1

But "justanoldman", he has some sick HWBot scores so obviously he's smarter than everyone here..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> But "justanoldman", he has some sick HWBot scores so obviously he's smarter than everyone here..


Eh?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Eh?


Sarcasm is hard to portray in a forum


----------



## dr/owned

I like how I said "I used specific measurements" to determine heights needed for direct die cooling with waterblock, and then I do this for my order:



The glue Intel applies is the wildcard. It has a min and max with a decently wide variation. I'm also not sure how it's going to work with the waterblock now forcing the package to make contact with the pins, so I just ordered all possible combinations....washers are cheap.

Also, Koolance's mounting system is superior to EK's. EK fuses the top thumb nut with the stud, so you're stuck with one height. Koolance you get a keyed screw and a thumbnut separately.


----------



## stickg1

For the good of the thread, tonight I will see how difficult it is to remove two month old CLU from the die. Then replace the CLU with Formula 7 nanodiamond and try to generate a pumpout over the next month or two. (or however how long it takes)

The CPU will fold 24/7 @ 4.5GHz and temps monitored daily to see any increases.


----------



## Warocia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> For the good of the thread, tonight I will see how difficult it is to remove two month old CLU from the die. Then replace the CLU with Formula 7 nanodiamond and try to generate a pumpout over the next month or two. (or however how long it takes)
> 
> The CPU will fold 24/7 @ 4.5GHz and temps monitored daily to see any increases.


You should try GELID solutions GC-Extreme, if you want see fast pumpout effect. It should only take a couple weeks.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok guys I finally have my cable management all neat and tidy (this case has a million cables even before the power supply) and I think I did a pretty good job for my first time actually doing it. Everything is put in and it looks great. Except for a little sag on my top 7950
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its not too bad though. All I need now is to get my PSU back from Seasonic so I can actually use it! UPS tracking says it is going to arrive at Seasonic today. Anyone have any idea how long it will take to get back to me??
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I personally would have H100 as intake.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I personally would have H100 as intake.


I wouldn't...you'd be drawing hot air into the case.
I'd revert the rear exhaust fan to be an intake and add a magnetic dust filter there, thus you cool your vrm with cold outside air and feed fresh air to the h100 fans to push it through the rads out of the case.


----------



## Xinoxide

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> I personally would have H100 as intake.
> 
> 
> 
> I wouldn't...you'd be drawing hot air into the case.
> I'd revert the rear exhaust fan to be an intake and add a magnetic dust filter there, thus you cool your vrm with cold outside air and feed fresh air to the h100 fans to push it through the rads out of the case.
Click to expand...

The H100 will still eat warm air from his GPU's in this scenario no?

I would think the priority is to get the CPU as cool as possible. The gpu's and VRM will be okay with a 1-2C increase.


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> For the good of the thread, tonight I will see how difficult it is to remove two month old CLU from the die. Then replace the CLU with Formula 7 nanodiamond and try to generate a pumpout over the next month or two. (or however how long it takes)
> 
> The CPU will fold 24/7 @ 4.5GHz and temps monitored daily to see any increases.


I would be interested in this as I've got the F7 Nano Diamond applied as my TIM right now. Temps are similar if not the same compared to the Formula 5


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xinoxide*
> 
> The H100 will still eat warm air from his GPU's in this scenario no?
> 
> I would think the priority is to get the CPU as cool as possible. The gpu's and VRM will be okay with a 1-2C increase.


Not really...You need to have a mid case fan as well as powerful front intakes and remove the pci slot covers. You can maybe add a shim or something to separate the lower portion of the case from the top one, airflow wise.

It would look something like this:


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not really...You need to have a mid case fan as well as powerful front intakes and remove the pci slot covers. You can maybe add a shim or something to separate the lower portion of the case from the top one, airflow wise.
> 
> It would look something like this:


PFFT...

You want cooling u NEEDS a real water Loop lol.

You could have 2 half working fans on a real loop and still beat the h100i by 10 c lol.


----------



## Phantom NZXT

Got mine open... Full story here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1376528/my-i5-3570k-oc-story-pic-heavy#post_19630977


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> PFFT...
> 
> You want cooling u NEEDS a real water Loop lol.
> 
> You could have 2 half working fans on a real loop and still beat the h100i by 10 c lol.


I know, just trying to help the guy with an h100i...I prefer my Silver Arrow. If not, custom wc as you say


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yea eventually I am going to go with a full custom loop. Just don't have the money for it now. I do like my H100i though.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It works good, should do ok for a while, and carry enough resale value.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> PFFT...
> 
> You want cooling u NEEDS a real water Loop lol.
> 
> You could have 2 half working fans on a real loop and still beat the h100i by 10 c lol.


Yup, any real loop will easily beat the H100i by a long shot, even with lousy fans.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can get a cheap chinese loop for $250 with gpu and all, (fullcover block). True story


----------



## lilchronic

well im ready to get rid of my h100 even though i have great temps with it, i never go over 60c @ 5ghz. but i do need to cool my gpu's also so, peace out h100 and hello custome loop


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can get a cheap chinese loop for $250 with gpu and all, (fullcover block). True story


Damn you!!! Now I'm not happy with my H100i anymore!! Haha jk, but that really does look too good to resist.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok so two of these 7950 waterblocks. How do these look?

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/ATI-HD7970-HD7950-cards-GPU-VGA-water-block-water-cooling/555419458.html


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok so two of these 7950 waterblocks. How do these look?
> 
> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/ATI-HD7970-HD7950-cards-GPU-VGA-water-block-water-cooling/555419458.html


Make sure your gpus are reference, check the video outputs and the pci-e connector.
If you see an AMD Radeon or something logo near the pci-e and one hdmi, one dvi and two mini dp below the vent it's reference. (it's also shorter than the 7970 pcb at 11.8" or something)

Edit: you can get EK fullcover for the same prize btw...the pump is cheaper, and the fittings. You can get good components and some cheaper ones for better performance/expense ratios.

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=33690
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/mcungpuwawha.html universal...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Make sure your gpus are reference, check the video outputs and the pci-e connector.
> If you see an AMD Radeon or something logo near the pci-e and one hdmi, one dvi and two mini dp below the vent it's reference. (it's also shorter than the 7970 pcb at 11.8" or something)
> 
> Edit: you can get EK fullcover for the same prize btw...the pump is cheaper, and the fittings. You can get good components and some cheaper ones for better performance/expense ratios.


\

I know that my TFIII is a reference 7950 board and I'm pretty sure my Sapphire 11196-16-20g is also reference. Just have to confirm the latter. Yea I might buy the CPU block, GPU block, and pump elsewhere and get everything else at aliexpress. Would that ruin the whole point of ordering from them?


----------



## stickg1

So I've pulled the CPU, replaced the CLU with some PB, chocolate chips, egg, and flour. The cooling performance is awful but 30 more minutes of folding and I should have a tasty treat!


----------



## ivanlabrie

You baking there? lmao!









Try heating some tacos over the heatsink or something...could replace a microwave. Or use a heatgun to cook stuff.


----------



## I_shot

New tims and comparison added guys,

http://www.overclock.net/t/1376460/liquid-metal-versus-non-metal-compounds-update


----------



## jdm317

If you are planning on a waterblock for the 79xx series you may want to do yourself a favor and take a look *HERE*. Very good information.

Especially since there are not many reviews for 7xxx waterblocks.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> If you are planning on a waterblock for the 79xx series you may want to do yourself a favor and take a look *HERE*. Very good information. This is why I bought the heatkiller.
> 
> Especially since there are not many reviews for 7xxx waterblocks.


Yes especially for 7950's. Any links to reviews for 7950's?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yes especially for 7950's. Any links to reviews for 7950's?


Not that I have come across.









I know that the Heatkiller score will reflect on the 7950 as well since it fits both cards. I cant speak for the others though. In that review the heatkiller is $94... seems the price has gone up a bit as now its 119. FrozenCPU still has the full copper without nickel plating but they are out of stock. Sidewinder has them but only the nickel plated.


----------



## homestyle

so the pump-out effect with regular tim will still keep my temps below pre-delidded temps right?

it won't make me worse off?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Not that I have come across.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know that the Heatkiller score will reflect on the 7950 as well since it fits both cards. I cant speak for the others though. In that review the heatkiller is $94... seems the price has gone up a bit as now its 119. FrozenCPU still has the full copper without nickel plating but they are out of stock. Sidewinder has them but only the nickel plated.


What is the best style? Nickel, copper, or just black? Does it matter? I want to get black, but would that affect anything?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What is the best style? Nickel, copper, or just black? Does it matter? I want to get black, but would that affect anything?


I wanted to keep nickel out of my loop but ended up getting the Koolance 380i which is nickel plated. Some have claimed that many nickel plated blocks corrode when mixed with other metals. I dont have any supporting evidence though. At first I was worried about it but then I kept running across users who claimed the majority of nickel plating problems were mostly due to chipping and not corrosion, so it seemed like the two were just getting mixed in together.

Black would look sick indeed. I dont really think you can go wrong either way. Nickel plating can crack and chip, you need to be more careful with it. Other than that I dont really think you can go wrong. Maybe clean out your loop and blocks once or twice a year to be on the safe side.

My loop contains only nickel and copper. No brass core rads, no aluminum.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> I wanted to keep nickel out of my loop but ended up getting the Koolance 380i which is nickel plated. Some have claimed that many nickel plated blocks corrode when mixed with other metals. I dont have any supporting evidence though. At first I was worried about it but then I kept running across users who claimed the majority of nickel plating problems were mostly due to chipping and not corrosion, so it seemed like the two were just getting mixed in together.
> 
> Black would look sick indeed. I dont really think you can go wrong either way. Nickel plating can crack and chip, you need to be more careful with it. Other than that I dont really think you can go wrong. Maybe clean out your loop and blocks once or twice a year to be on the safe side.
> 
> My loop contains only nickel and copper. No brass core rads, no aluminum.


Ok thanks for the help. Then I will get black EK VGA and CPU blocks. I am finally happy with my build so I can start buying watercooling stuff slowly as I get the money.


----------



## Hokies83

Alphacool makes a full cover 7950 block that is all copper.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It leaves a few caps exposed though...it looks nice anyway









EDIT: Mind blown...I can't for the life of me do that.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It leaves a few caps exposed though...it looks nice anyway
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Mind blown...I can't for the life of me do that.


Thanks Ivan. Had to try it & can do it, but not without wrenching the left shoulder a bit...
Should have waited till after work, lifting will be fun for the rest of the day.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It leaves a few caps exposed though...it looks nice anyway
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Mind blown...I can't for the life of me do that.


wth?! Im only 25 and I KNOW my back would go out doing that







. Im not in bad shape by any means but some things..... geez...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It leaves a few caps exposed though...it looks nice anyway
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Mind blown...I can't for the life of me do that.


Ivan are you the instructor? That's quite the tan you have...


----------



## ivanlabrie

lmao xD

I can't do that atm...not as high, but I'm sick (stupid flu).
I can bench press 75% of my body weight, so I shouldn't even try it lol (you need 125% for that)

Back on more off topicness, JSS rules and this is a nice cover:


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Alphacool makes a full cover 7950 block that is all copper.


They are also the cheapest and perform better than some of the more expensive pieces.

They are also sexy. Sexy is always a plus.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok thanks for the help. Then I will get black EK VGA and CPU blocks. I am finally happy with my build so I can start buying watercooling stuff slowly as I get the money.


No problem man. The new build looks great btw.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cheapest and full copper sounds great!

http://izismile.com/2010/06/07/funny_korean_comic_strips_41_pics.html

So bored...and at work man, can you guys believe it?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cheapest and full copper sounds great!
> 
> http://izismile.com/2010/06/07/funny_korean_comic_strips_41_pics.html
> 
> So bored...and at work man, can you guys believe it?


Bahahaha.... the 2 belly buttons.... omg

That sucks. Yesterday I worked from 7am to 10pm, luckily that made today pretty short.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Where is a good place to buy radiators? I'm looking for a triple 120mm for the top, dual 120mm for the bottom, and single 140mm for the rear. Would that be sufficient enough to cool three 7950's and a 3770k? If it is overkill that would be fine. The cooler the better!!

I found this article on my case and I'm very happy I decided to go with it. This is a great guide for anyone with the phantom 820 who plans on watercooling!

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/11/08/nzxt_phantom_820_fulltower_case_review/5


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Where is a good place to buy radiators? I'm looking for a triple 120mm for the top, dual 120mm for the bottom, and single 140mm for the rear. Would that be sufficient enough to cool three 7950's and a 3770k? If it is overkill that would be fine. The cooler the better!!


Sidewinder has always had the lowest prices when I was in the market to buy. Seems like everytime I go over there they have the swiftech XP rads on sell.

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/radiators.html


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Where is a good place to buy radiators? I'm looking for a triple 120mm for the top, dual 120mm for the bottom, and single 140mm for the rear. Would that be sufficient enough to cool three 7950's and a 3770k? If it is overkill that would be fine. The cooler the better!!
> 
> I found this article on my case and I'm very happy I decided to go with it. This is a great guide for anyone with the phantom 820 who plans on watercooling!
> 
> http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/11/08/nzxt_phantom_820_fulltower_case_review/5


....Frozencpu is another place with a solid selection here: http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g30/c95/list/p1/


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like those...mcr-220-xp. They scale well with fan cfm and are cheap. Can work with quieter fans too.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I like those...mcr-220-xp. They scale well with fan cfm and are cheap. Can work with quieter fans too.


Thats what I went with. Im not disappointed. The only flaw I have found with them is the mounting holes dont line up perfectly with my Switch 810 or the fans







. Took quite a bit of work to get them lined up but once I did that was the end of any trouble. I tried to flush mine but it was clean as a whistle.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ....Frozencpu is another place with a solid selection here: http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g30/c95/list/p1/


Definitely. I bought a few of the pieces in my loop from them. Only downside I had is they cost quite a bit in shipping for me. Since Ravage is in MA it probably wouldn't be near as high.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Where is a good place to buy radiators? I'm looking for a triple 120mm for the top, dual 120mm for the bottom, and single 140mm for the rear. Would that be sufficient enough to cool three 7950's and a 3770k? If it is overkill that would be fine. The cooler the better!!
> 
> I found this article on my case and I'm very happy I decided to go with it. This is a great guide for anyone with the phantom 820 who plans on watercooling!
> 
> http://www.hardocp.com/article/2012/11/08/nzxt_phantom_820_fulltower_case_review/5


How thick can they be? Frozen cpu and performancepcs have the highend rads Sidewinder sells lowerend rads.

However side winder is the best place to buy pumps.

Performancepcs has the best Water block selection to.

Frozen Cpu has the best prices on Bits power fittings i bought from all 3..

I got my Apongee drive 2 + mcp 35X pump from side winder

I got my water blocks / back plates odds and ends from Performancepcs

And i got my Tubing / fittings and lighting from Frozen CPU.

Frozen cpu and Performancepcs have coupon codes for OCN members.

Frozen cpu is OCN in check out

Performancepcs is OCN55 in check out.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Alright thanks guys. I am actually think of doing a double 360 radiator mount on the top of my case. I made a rough diagram of what I would like to look like. I asked the guys in the water cooling part of the forum and they said it would work. So now I need four rads in total. I just have to figure out what all these different types of pumps are and which one to get and how the power consumption works. Is there a guide that explains all of this stuff?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright thanks guys. I am actually think of doing a double 360 radiator mount on the top of my case. I made a rough diagram of what I would like to look like. I asked the guys in the water cooling part of the forum and they said it would work. So now I need four rads in total. I just have to figure out what all these different types of pumps are and which one to get and how the power consumption works. Is there a guide that explains all of this stuff?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Only suggestion I have is to make the top rad the first rad after the blocks. That way the "hot" rad isnt blowing hot air into the "cool" rad. Maybe its not a problem though, just a suggestion.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright thanks guys. I am actually think of doing a double 360 radiator mount on the top of my case. I made a rough diagram of what I would like to look like. I asked the guys in the water cooling part of the forum and they said it would work. So now I need four rads in total. I just have to figure out what all these different types of pumps are and which one to get and how the power consumption works. Is there a guide that explains all of this stuff?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


If u do not go for the Apongee drive 2 block/pump combo then get the mcp 655 with speed control that is modded @ sidewinder

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/sicumclad5wi.html

Also figure out how thick of a rad u can fit so ones can be suggested.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

That thing is a work of art. Yea, money isn't really a problem so I'm willing to spend a nice chunk of change on it. So how are these powered? Is there just power fed to the pump and that is all that needs juice in a loop?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That thing is a work of art. Yea, money isn't really a problem so I'm willing to spend a nice chunk of change on it. So how are these powered? Is there just power fed to the pump and that is all that needs juice in a loop?


Yah and the pump has speed control on the pump no messing with Pwn or software on the MB.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah and the pump has speed control on the pump no messing with Pwn or software on the MB.


Is the pump connected to power via molex or sata? and is that the only thing that needs to be powered in a loop?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think it's molex...I like pwm actually, but the directness of voltage control can be useful at times.






Free...


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think it's molex...I like pwm actually, but the directness of voltage control can be useful at times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Free...


It is a 4 pin molex with a 2 pin fan controller for pump speed control monitoring. Same pump I use without the custom fittings.

I passed out for him at :48 seconds


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol









You gotta get in the mindset...

Night time, maybe some rain, cold...delidded a chip and it died.

Try this one:


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> It is a 4 pin molex with a 2 pin fan controller for pump speed control monitoring. Same pump I use without the custom fittings.
> 
> I passed out for him at :48 seconds


and what does the 2 pin connect to? Is there anyway I could connect it to my Phantom fan controller? or would I have to buy another controller of some sort? Sorry if these questions are stupid, but I am completely new to all of this. I need a guide for beginners! Maybe something like water cooling for dummies??


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You gotta get in the mindset...
> 
> Night time, maybe some rain, cold...delidded a chip and it died.
> 
> Try this one:


Bahahaha.. "







The Delidded Dead Chip Blues"

edit: what was up with the name I chose before. bleh haha


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=674257

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=628092

MartinM has those linked in his site...


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> and what does the 2 pin connect to? Is there anyway I could connect it to my Phantom fan controller? or would I have to buy another controller of some sort? Sorry if these questions are stupid, but I am completely new to all of this. I need a guide for beginners! Maybe something like water cooling for dummies??


Sorry I made a mistake. The 2 pin is for monitoring the RPM's and pretty sure you cant control it.

edit: Just got home to look at the pump. Its a 3 pin fan connector with 1 pin. Hooks into a mobo fan port.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=674257
> 
> http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=628092
> 
> MartinM has those linked in his site...


Haha awesome thanks much!

Love me some miles davis.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You gotta get in the mindset...
> 
> Night time, maybe some rain, cold...delidded a chip and it died.
> 
> Try this one:


...I love jazz, but if it's 'night time, rain, cold and have a delidded chip that died', I'd go classical / sad


----------



## SilentAD

Ok, I made it into the club, but wanted to test my 46x stability and got a 100% rock stable 13hr test in and got her validated

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2750616

Now, I know it's a big vcore for such only 46, but what can I say, she aint the best chip in the bag LoL


----------



## chefproject

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Great job! Especially with the glue on the pcb. Very clean!


Thx man

How some of you guys maybee remember i had that heat issue after delidding and using the Zalman TIM on the Die. A few threads earlier somebody wrote, that it does not matter so much which TIM you are using....man you are so wrong about that one. Yesterday my CLU arrived and i applied it in the late evening and i must say: Holy Molly what a huge difference.
I couldn't do a primerun on the Zalman TIM even on 4,6 because heat was spiking up to above 100°c.
I did write down all the messurements i made while this little experiment









Before delidding using Zalman TIM between IHS and heatsink

@ 4,8 Ghz *1,352v* Temps max while primerun 8k test 83-92-92-85

after delidding using Zalman TIM on the die and the IHS

@4,8 Ghz 1,352v not possible pc shut down
@4,6 Ghz 1,308v item dito
@4,5 Ghz 1,266v 99-102-103-100

after using CLU on the die and the IHS



@4,8 Ghz *1,336v* 76-85-82-83 100% load
0,866v 20-24-24-25 idle
ambient temps 19°c

Greetings and regards Chef
PS: Wait until i get a good cooler


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Thx man
> 
> How some of you guys maybee remember i had that heat issue after delidding and using the Zalman TIM on the Die. A few threads earlier somebody wrote, that it does not matter so much which TIM you are using....man you are so wrong about that one. Yesterday my CLU arrived and i applied it in the late evening and i must say: Holy Molly what a huge difference.
> I couldn't do a primerun on the Zalman TIM even on 4,6 because heat was spiking up to above 100°c.
> I did write down all the messurements i made while this little experiment
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before delidding using Zalman TIM between IHS and heatsink
> 
> @ 4,8 Ghz *1,352v* Temps max while primerun 8k test 83-92-92-85
> 
> after delidding using Zalman TIM on the die and the IHS
> 
> @4,8 Ghz 1,352v not possible pc shut down
> @4,6 Ghz 1,308v item dito
> @4,5 Ghz 1,266v 99-102-103-100
> 
> after using CLU on the die and the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @4,8 Ghz *1,336v* 76-85-82-83
> 
> Greetings and regards Chef Wait until i get a good cooler


Nice!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> Thx man
> 
> How some of you guys maybee remember i had that heat issue after delidding and using the Zalman TIM on the Die. A few threads earlier somebody wrote, that it does not matter so much which TIM you are using....man you are so wrong about that one. Yesterday my CLU arrived and i applied it in the late evening and i must say: Holy Molly what a huge difference.
> I couldn't do a primerun on the Zalman TIM even on 4,6 because heat was spiking up to above 100°c.
> I did write down all the messurements i made while this little experiment
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before delidding using Zalman TIM between IHS and heatsink
> 
> @ 4,8 Ghz *1,352v* Temps max while primerun 8k test 83-92-92-85
> 
> after delidding using Zalman TIM on the die and the IHS
> 
> @4,8 Ghz 1,352v not possible pc shut down
> @4,6 Ghz 1,308v item dito
> @4,5 Ghz 1,266v 99-102-103-100
> 
> after using CLU on the die and the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> @4,8 Ghz *1,336v* 76-85-82-83 100% load
> 0,866v 20-24-24-25 idle
> ambient temps 19°c
> 
> Greetings and regards Chef
> PS: Wait until i get a good cooler


Nice! Those temps do seem a bit high, but it could just be the Zalman. Did you make sure to put the thinnest layer possible on the die and on the bottom of the IHS that touches the die? Its really easy to put to much because CLU spreads like wildfire. All you need is an extremely tiny bead and just work it around. If anything, just buy a cheap CLC to use for the time being like my H100i. I love it and I get great temps. The only problem is that my 7950's are crying for some water too so I'm going to go for a custom loop sometime in the near future.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SilentAD*
> 
> Ok, I made it into the club, but wanted to test my 46x stability and got a 100% rock stable 13hr test in and got her validated
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2750616
> 
> Now, I know it's a big vcore for such only 46, but what can I say, she aint the best chip in the bag LoL


Updated!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

You shave off 1-4c by having clu vs normal paste on the ihs. To me that's not worth the trouble.
As for the warranty...well I'd not like to think of it that way


----------



## dr/owned

^^

Probably the biggest root-cause temperature improvement of delidding + relidding is in putting a thin layer of TIM down instead of the massive glob there from the factory.


----------



## chefproject

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Nice! Those temps do seem a bit high, but it could just be the Zalman. Did you make sure to put the thinnest layer possible on the die and on the bottom of the IHS that touches the die? Its really easy to put to much because CLU spreads like wildfire. All you need is an extremely tiny bead and just work it around. If anything, just buy a cheap CLC to use for the time being like my H100i. I love it and I get great temps. The only problem is that my 7950's are crying for some water too so I'm going to go for a custom loop sometime in the near future.


I reapplied the TIM about 3 or 4 times and it was terrible. Also reseated the heatsink a few times even with different fan settings in the case.....no advance








Actually i was thinking about the H100i or staying on air with a Noctua or Phantek cooler and the temps i have now it's for sure my Zalman cooler i got now.The reviews of it weren't very good mistake by me......

Cheers Chef


----------



## stickg1

Where is everyone? I'm over here getting toasted. I went to a local craft beer store and am doing an American IPA show-down. So far all 8 are winning!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Its quiet in here...........

............too quiet


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Use of silver...*
> 
> Per earlier post about the chap who had fully customized his CPU block and subsequently silver-plated it...
> 
> 
> ...there is another important item, noting that the whole thing is silver-plated, including the inside of the block that comes in contact with the cooling liquids (see small pics inside the bigger one): Silver is anti-bacterial, and as such is often used in liquid-cooled systems in some form or another to control bacterial growth - even if you started out with distilled water etc. Often, folks use a small piece of silver anchored in the reservoir. I find the approach above quite unique and 'outside the box', with additional benefits such as the anti-bacterial qualities.


Wish we could use graphene.. That would be where its at. Maybe in 10 years.


----------



## homestyle

I just delidded and I'm using ic diamond on the die and prolimatech tim on the ihs.

my temps under intel burn test are

78
91
91
89

Should I try a reseat? I was sliding the ihs around as the retention bracket was moving the ihs. The range from core 0 to 1 and 2 seem large.

in b4 CLU. That is an option in the future.

btw, my temps are high because my fans are all on low. I'm comparing my temps and keeping all variables the same except for of course the delid.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> I just delidded and I'm using ic diamond on the die and prolimatech tim on the ihs.
> 
> my temps under intel burn test are
> 
> 78
> 91
> 91
> 89
> 
> Should I try a reseat? I was sliding the ihs around as the retention bracket was moving the ihs. The range from core 0 to 1 and 2 seem large.
> 
> in b4 CLU. That is an option in the future.
> 
> btw, my temps are high because my fans are all on low. I'm comparing my temps and keeping all variables the same except for of course the delid.


Dude you might want to get that IC Diamond off of your die ASAP it is going to scratch the hell out of it. Just a suggestion. I've seen it happen before.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> I just delidded and I'm using ic diamond on the die and prolimatech tim on the ihs.
> 
> my temps under intel burn test are
> 
> 78
> 91
> 91
> 89
> 
> Should I try a reseat? I was sliding the ihs around as the retention bracket was moving the ihs. The range from core 0 to 1 and 2 seem large.
> 
> in b4 CLU. That is an option in the future.
> 
> btw, my temps are high because my fans are all on low. I'm comparing my temps and keeping all variables the same except for of course the delid.


First: Congrats









...I think you're right...while there normally us a jump in temps to the two middle cores, it usually is around no more than 7-8C (though there are other things which can affect that, ie iGPU on/off)...if you have the time, you might try a re-seat...

...per other responses, you may want to consider MX4 or s.th. like it instead of IC diamond on the die

...can't remember if you posted the 'pre-delid' temps for comparison - can you post them together with the post-delid (perhaps after re-seat) with all other vars the same (ie fan speed)


----------



## lilchronic

if u dont use CLP or CLU there is no point in deliding


----------



## Joa3d43

...lowering vCore

...as I am prepping the Rampage/RIVE/3970X, I moved the quad channel 32GB TridentX/2400 kit over from the MVE/3770K which in turn is running a new pack of 16GB TridentX/2400....I have never run anything less than 32GB in any of the Z77 machines before for productivity reasons (partial work machines)...but as suspected, reducing the workload of the 3770K IMC (32 > 16) has also meant a slightly lower vCore requirements...still doing longer-run stability testing, but it looks like the change in RAM is saving about 0.005 to 0.01v vCore at given speed settings.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> I just delidded and I'm using ic diamond on the die and prolimatech tim on the ihs.
> 
> my temps under intel burn test are
> 
> 78
> 91
> 91
> 89
> 
> Should I try a reseat? I was sliding the ihs around as the retention bracket was moving the ihs. The range from core 0 to 1 and 2 seem large.
> 
> in b4 CLU. That is an option in the future.
> 
> btw, my temps are high because my fans are all on low. I'm comparing my temps and keeping all variables the same except for of course the delid.


Well depends on the volts?

H100I is not custom water so do not expect much my H100 in p/p used to get that hot.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...lowering vCore
> 
> ...as I am prepping the Rampage/RIVE/3970X, I moved the quad channel 32GB TridentX/2400 kit over from the MVE/3770K which in turn is running a new pack of 16GB TridentX/2400....I have never run anything less than 32GB in any of the Z77 machines before for productivity reasons (partial work machines)...but as suspected, reducing the workload of the 3770K IMC (32 > 16) has also meant a slightly lower vCore requirements...still doing longer-run stability testing, but it looks like the change in RAM is saving about 0.005 to 0.01v vCore at given speed settings.


Have you ever ran any DDR3 1600 with your 3770k? I currently have 1600, but was thinking of upgrading RAM to 2400 since I have a nice new MVE board, but am scared of having to up the vcore more. I'm just wondering how much I will have to up the vcore.


----------



## homestyle

icd will scratch the surface, but the scratches are superficial.

the bigger concern is pump-out of tim.

CLU is in my plans in the future, but the main gain from delidding is not from changing out the tim. It's from reducing the ihs-die gap by removing the glue.

i'm gonna do a reseat and if temps are better and remain better, I'm gonna keep it on.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where is everyone? I'm over here getting toasted. I went to a local craft beer store and am doing an American IPA show-down. So far all 8 are winning!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Its quiet in here...........
> 
> ............too quiet


If I posted, it'd probably be OT and some people didn't like it last time.









@*stickg1*
What IPA's are you trying? I recently tried this Canadian one and it's pretty good.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> I just delidded and I'm using ic diamond on the die and prolimatech tim on the ihs.
> 
> my temps under intel burn test are
> 
> 78
> 91
> 91
> 89
> 
> Should I try a reseat? I was sliding the ihs around as the retention bracket was moving the ihs. The range from core 0 to 1 and 2 seem large.
> 
> in b4 CLU. That is an option in the future.
> 
> btw, my temps are high because my fans are all on low. I'm comparing my temps and keeping all variables the same except for of course the delid.


Also, I would just like to check to make sure you have the backplate on correctly. I helped someone out recently who was getting similar jumps in temps. Turns out they didn't have the backplate on correctly for their H100i. Do you have it so the two screw cutouts in the backplate goes over the screws on the back of the motherboard?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If I posted, it'd probably be OT and some people didn't like it last time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @*stickg1*
> What IPA's are you trying? I recently tried this Canadian one and it's pretty good.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Have you ever ran any DDR3 1600 with your 3770k? I currently have 1600, but was thinking of upgrading RAM to 2400 since I have a nice new MVE board, but am scared of having to up the vcore more. I'm just wondering how much I will have to up the vcore.


...not with the 3770K, but with all the 3770 (non-K) in the VM - they run 32GB each of Ripjaws 1600. The 1600 to 2400 MHz jump may affect the CPU IMC to some extent, but the much bigger stress increase comes from running 32GB vs 16GB...btw, the MVE is known to love 2400MHz TridentX


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...not with the 3770K, but with all the 3770 (non-K) in the VM - they run 32GB each of Ripjaws 1600. The 1600 to 2400 MHz jump may affect the CPU IMC to some extent, but the much bigger stress increase comes from running 32GB vs 16GB...btw, the MVE is known to love 2400MHz TridentX


AWESOME. I'm only going to be running 16GB anyway. Should I go with two sticks of 8 or four sticks of 4? I'm thinking of attempting an overclock on them. Do you overclock them? Should I look for a certain version? Or is it just luck of the draw?

EDIT: and it is Red and Black!!! I'm in love







It totally fits my theme!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> AWESOME. I'm only going to be running 16GB anyway. Should I go with two sticks of 8 or four sticks of 4? I'm thinking of attempting an overclock on them. Do you overclock them? Should I look for a certain version? Or is it just luck of the draw?
> 
> EDIT: and it is Red and Black!!! I'm in love
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It totally fits my theme!


...others may differ, but I would actually go for a 16GB 'quad channel' (4x 4) kit as they tend to be closely matched / binned (usually meant for Sandy-E X79 etc)

...yes, the Red and Black - I'm soooooo tempted to do that 'desk computer' now - the MVE and Rampage IV have the same colour scheme and look very much alike (not identical, but close enough)...side by side ROG boards with TridentX matching AND red 3/4 inc cooling tubes on black Koolance block...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...others may differ, but I would actually go for a 16GB 'quad channel' (4x 4) kit as they tend to be closely matched / binned (usually meant for Sandy-E X79 etc)
> 
> ...yes, the Red and Black - I'm soooooo tempted to do that 'desk computer' now - the MVE and Rampage IV have the same colour scheme and look very much alike (not identical, but close enough)...side by side ROG boards with TridentX matching AND red 3/4 inc cooling tubes on black Koolance block...


That sounds tasty. So I'm definetly going to get those. I'm running 4 x 4gb 1600 Corsair Vengeance right now. I'm going to go with black CPU block and black blocks for my 7950's and then go with white UV tubing because my Phantom 820 is white







I can't wait to get all my stuff for a full custom loop. I'm still confused with what I need to get though. I read the guide, but I am still not sure what some things are and what they do. I am going to run a single loop so I would need a pump, blocks for VGA and CPU, compression fittings, resevoir, and rads. What else do I need?


----------



## homestyle

Very interesting.

I reseated and removed the ICD. I replaced it with prolimatech tim on the die and ihs.

Now they are:

68
74
75
74

This is more like it. I'm going to keep the prolimatech tim on there and see how it performs over time. I'd rather keep this tim on there than use CLU because of the flexibility of switching mobos and cpus. I've already dropped a good 20C... leaving 5C for added flexibility is worth it.

nothing was wrong with the icdiamond. it was just a bad seat


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That sounds tasty. So I'm definetly going to get those. I'm running 4 x 4gb 1600 Corsair Vengeance right now. I'm going to go with black CPU block and black blocks for my 7950's and then go with white UV tubing because my Phantom 820 is white
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't wait to get all my stuff for a full custom loop. I'm still confused with what I need to get though. I read the guide, but I am still not sure what some things are and what they do. I am going to run a single loop so I would need a pump, blocks for VGA and CPU, compression fittings, resevoir, and rads. What else do I need?


...usually at this point, a discussion breaks out whether you should have two separate loops (one for GPUs, one for CPU)...but if you make your single loop strong enough (ie Hokies83' setup), it can work...keep in mind that it is just simple math :...an overclocked 5GHz / plus Ivy 3770K at room temps can easily generate over 210 watts+ of heat energy...and a couple of GPUs (depending on the model) can add another 500 to 600 watts (especially if oc'ed), so that is all heat energy you got to get rid off...plus the more separate things you have in a loop, the harder your pump has to work re restrictions etc...

...that said, your list looks pretty complete; just add industrial-strength Velcro, ties for the bits that don't accept compression fittings (ie my MPC655 pump)...also, you didn't list tubes/hoses and fans but I am certain you know that you need those...finally, if you don't run custom water-blocks for your GPUs but Uni-Blocks (which are great), you also need to think about cooling the GPUs' VRMs and memory bits w/extra fans


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Very interesting.
> 
> I reseated and removed the ICD. I replaced it with prolimatech tim on the die and ihs.
> 
> Now they are:
> 
> 68
> 74
> 75
> 74
> 
> This is more like it. I'm going to keep the prolimatech tim on there and see how it performs over time. I'd rather keep this tim on there than use CLU because of the flexibility of switching mobos and cpus. I've already dropped a good 20C... leaving 5C for added flexibility is worth it.
> 
> nothing was wrong with the icdiamond. it was just a bad seat


NICE^^^


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Very interesting.
> 
> I reseated and removed the ICD. I replaced it with prolimatech tim on the die and ihs.
> 
> Now they are:
> 
> 68
> 74
> 75
> 74
> 
> This is more like it. I'm going to keep the prolimatech tim on there and see how it performs over time. I'd rather keep this tim on there than use CLU because of the flexibility of switching mobos and cpus. I've already dropped a good 20C... leaving 5C for added flexibility is worth it.
> 
> nothing was wrong with the icdiamond. it was just a bad seat


Ok glad you got it off quickly. Wouldn't have been nice to let it sit and then take it off to find your die all scratched to hell. Glad you got some better temps. BTW CLU is extremely easy to get off of the die with an alcohol wipe. Just a little fyi. Good job


----------



## homestyle

Here's my pics. I had more trouble removing the black glue after removoing the ihs.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...usually at this point, a discussion breaks out whether you should have two separate loops (one for GPUs, one for CPU)...but if you make your single loop strong enough (ie Hokies83' setup), it can work...keep in mind that it is just simple math :...an overclocked 5GHz / plus Ivy 3770K at room temps can easily generate over 210 watts+ of heat energy...and a couple of GPUs (depending on the model) can add another 500 to 600 watts (especially if oc'ed), so that is all heat energy you got to get rid off...plus the more separate things you have in a loop, the harder your pump has to work re restrictions etc...
> 
> ...that said, your list looks pretty complete; just add industrial-strength Velcro, ties for the bits that don't accept compression fittings (ie my MPC655 pump)...also, you didn't list tubes/hoses and fans but I am certain you know that you need those...finally, if you don't run custom water-blocks for your GPUs but Uni-Blocks (which are great), you also need to think about cooling the GPUs' VRMs and memory bits w/extra fans


Ok awesome thanks for the help. I am going to have a 120.3 rad, two 120.2 rads, and a 140 rad in my Phantom 820 case so I hope that is overkill for my setup. Also, I'm thinking of using this pump ( http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/sicumclad5wi.html ). Do you think I should get it with the speed control? I don't want to make it anymore complicated by adding another controller. I can choose to just get it tach sensor ( don't even know what that is). but if speed control is about controlling noise I don't care about it. Noise doesn't bother me. Unless it is going to be extremely loud and annoying. Also, that pump has inlets for compression fittings. So what do you think about that? Am I on the right track? Also, could I somehow plug the speed controller into my Phantom 820 fan controller?


----------



## KuuFA

Koolance CPU-380 ~$57

or

Swifttech apogee hd ~$41

Which one?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok awesome thanks for the help. I am going to have a 120.3 rad, two 120.2 rads, and a 140 rad in my Phantom 820 case so I hope that is overkill for my setup. Also, I'm thinking of using this pump ( http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/sicumclad5wi.html ). Do you think I should get it with the speed control? I don't want to make it anymore complicated by adding another controller. I can choose to just get it tach sensor ( don't even know what that is). but if speed control is about controlling noise I don't care about it. Noise doesn't bother me. Unless it is going to be extremely loud and annoying. Also, that pump has inlets for compression fittings. So what do you think about that? Am I on the right track? Also, could I somehow plug the speed controller into my Phantom 820 fan controller?


On my pump (Swiftech MPC 655) there is a little adjustment screw in the back - I set it to 4 / 5 when I put this together and have not touched it since...I make cooling adjustments through Fans / Asus Suite FanExpert2 - I know some folks don't like it, but it *works great* for me, and also doesn't require a separate USB or other port
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Koolance CPU-380 ~$57
> 
> or
> 
> Swifttech apogee hd ~$41
> 
> Which one?


...Hokies83 is the real expert on this w-c stuff, but I think both blocks are good, though I personally went with the Koolance (370SI, the prior model to 380)...good tests results, absolutely no complaints and I like its looks:


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Koolance CPU-380 ~$57
> 
> or
> 
> Swifttech apogee hd ~$41
> 
> Which one?


They perform close.. Go with which ever is cheaper or you like the looks of better.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> On my pump (Swiftech MPC 655) there is a little adjustment screw in the back - I set it to 4 / 5 when I put this together and have not touched it since...I make cooling adjustments through Fans / Asus Suite FanExpert2 - I know some folks don't like it, but it *works great* for me, and also doesn't require a separate USB or other port


Oh so speed control is just a screw on the pump?

BTW thanks for the pic I love how that RAM looks on the MVE. So is lower latency and timings better for RAM? For the Trident X I see two with different specs.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231588

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231639


----------



## Hokies83

Cannot sell game codes on OCN cough.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cough Pm.. Cough sell it on Anandtech cough


cough 2nd this cough and you should remove that post before you get an infraction? cough


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh so speed control is just a screw on the pump?
> 
> BTW thanks for the pic I love how that RAM looks on the MVE. So is lower latency and timings better for RAM? For the Trident X I see two with different specs.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231588
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231639


...yes - on the MPC655 (and variants, as long as it is not the 'B') the speed adjustment is just the little screw in the back, with settings from 1 to 5









...I'd go with the lower latency though they will perform above specs anyhow, at least the kits I have / know of with others...have run them at 2600+ (via BCLK increase) on fast settings with no probs, even on heavy memory-intensive benching


----------



## Qlix

This is my first delid. Pentium 4 lga775. Pretty sure it was soldered on. This was ridiculously easier than I thought... Minus the solder part. It took quite a lot of pressure to get the ihs off. I assume an ivy would be infinitely easier once cut through the silicone


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> 
> 
> This is my first delid. Pentium 4 lga775. Pretty sure it was soldered on. This was ridiculously easier than I thought... Minus the solder part. It took quite a lot of pressure to get the ihs off. I assume an ivy would be infinitely easier once cut through the silicone


Yes after you cut through the silicone it just pops off. Good job! You should have no problem delidding your 3770k


----------



## ZealotKi11er

So i finally did mine. I used the Vice + Hammer Method.
I am using NT-H1 in the Die right now and getting ~ 15C drop.
I used to get upwards 93C+ and now i am getting 80C in the hottest core.
I have already ordered CLP and it comming and dont know what to expect.
What are the cons for using it? Also should ~ how much more will the temps drop?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> So i finally did mine. I used the Vice + Hammer Method.
> I am using NT-H1 in the Die right now and getting ~ 15C drop.
> I used to get upwards 93C+ and now i am getting 80C in the hottest core.
> I have already ordered CLP and it comming and dont know what to expect.
> What are the cons for using it? Also should ~ how much more will the temps drop?


CLP can be a lot harder to spread and get off than CLU. Can I ask why you chose it over CLU? Anyway you would be able to switch before they ship it? Also, if you are using either on a copper heatsink, over time it will bond and almost create a weld between the top of the IHS and the heatsink. That is why I only use it on the die, but some people like that "weld" effect because that is what they want in a liquid metal. Also you should expect about an extra 10c-15c drop if applied correctly.

EDIT: BTW I forgot to say good job


----------



## Qlix

I have a 775 board to test this p4 in. Do I have to figure out how to get the solder off or can I just throw it in and power it up real quick?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> I have a 775 board to test this p4 in. Do I have to figure out how to get the solder off or can I just throw it in and power it up real quick?


I *think* that you can just pop it in because the solder will still transfer heat (not as good as before) because it will be touching.


----------



## Qlix

I just scraped off as much as I could with my fingernail. It's pretty damn smooth. Ill try it out here in a bit with some AS Ceramique (only thing I have -.-)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> I just scraped off as much as I could with my fingernail. It's pretty damn smooth. Ill try it out here in a bit with some AS Ceramique (only thing I have -.-)


Yea you will be fine man. Just put a small drop of the TIM on it. Less is always better.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> CLP can be a lot harder to spread and get off than CLU. Can I ask why you chose it over CLU? Anyway you would be able to switch before they ship it? Also, if you are using either on a copper heatsink, over time it will bond and almost create a weld between the top of the IHS and the heatsink. That is why I only use it on the die, but some people like that "weld" effect because that is what they want in a liquid metal. Also you should expect about an extra 10c-15c drop if applied correctly.
> 
> EDIT: BTW I forgot to say good job


I dont know where i read but some where saying Pro was better for die. Also will still use normal past on the CPU top.


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> CLP can be a lot harder to spread and get off than CLU. Can I ask why you chose it over CLU? Anyway you would be able to switch before they ship it? Also, if you are using either on a copper heatsink, over time it will bond and almost create a weld between the top of the IHS and the heatsink. That is why I only use it on the die, but some people like that "weld" effect because that is what they want in a liquid metal. Also you should expect about an extra 10c-15c drop if applied correctly.
> 
> EDIT: BTW I forgot to say good job


if you ever switch out cpus, do you need to redo the CLU paste on the die?

does it form a "poor mans" adhesive?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> I dont know where i read but some where saying Pro was better for die. Also will still use normal past on the CPU top.


Yea then you should be fine. Temps are the same between CLU and CLP. You will just have a tougher time getting the CLP to spread, but it eventually will and you will be very happy


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> if you ever switch out cpus, do you need to redo the CLU paste on the die?
> 
> does it form a "poor mans" adhesive?


If you are careful to not move the IHS at all when taking it out of the socket then you don't need to replace it, but if you do tap it and move it at all then you should replace it. It does form a little of a bond, but the IHS will still move if you tap it. It's not a strong bond at all.


----------



## homestyle

how many applications do you get with the 1 tube?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> how many applications do you get with the 1 tube?


Like a million haha. When you use it just imagine how much you think you should use.... and then use a quarter of that. I say it all the time, but the stuff truly spreads like wildfire. Like it really freaks me out how you can get a big layer just by spreading a tiny drop. You just need to take your time and "work it". You should watch the Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra application video on youtube to get an idea.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Jeez I'm spending so much time on this forum I just want my PSU back so I can use my beautifully rebuilt rig!!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> how many applications do you get with the 1 tube?


...if 'done right' (which I only manage every so often), a syringe of CL-U should give at least 8-10 applications...just to be on the safe side, I had ordered 3x CL-U and 3x CL-P (though traded a CL-P for an extra-long MSI SLI bridge)

...tendency is to put too much on at first


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> how many applications do you get with the 1 tube?


you'll get more applications with clp than clu


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea then you should be fine. Temps are the same between CLU and CLP. You will just have a tougher time getting the CLP to spread, but it eventually will and you will be very happy


CLP spreads more easy then CLU in my case from using both.


----------



## ivoryg37

I just successfully Delidded my i5-3570K and running some regular thermal paste to test that it is working. I do have some liquid pro with me and my understanding is that it is metal. What happens if I accidently go off the die or if the IHS spreads the liquid pro once I put it back on? Will it short out the CPU?


----------



## Qlix

Is it worthwhile to lap the ihs after delidding? Seems to me after you remove the silicone adhesive then drop the socket clamp down after reinstalling your going to get a convex ihs anyways? So lapping after a delid seems pointless. I'm probably wrong, just want clarification


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivoryg37*
> 
> I just successfully Delidded my i5-3570K and running some regular thermal paste to test that it is working. I do have some liquid pro with me and my understanding is that it is metal. What happens if I accidently go off the die or if the IHS spreads the liquid pro once I put it back on? Will it short out the CPU?


not much will happen, except if you damaged the pcb maybe when you delidded it,
everything electric is protected by the pcb,
if you manage to let it run off the IHS, you already know its wrong..

this one was way to much....


this is about right,


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> Is it worthwhile to lap the ihs after delidding? Seems to me after you remove the silicone adhesive then drop the socket clamp down after reinstalling your going to get a convex ihs anyways? So lapping after a delid seems pointless. I'm probably wrong, just want clarification


no need to lap the ihs, except if after delid the temps are still way of, or temp difference between cores are still very big, (15+C)
then i would look if the IHS is concave/convex or not, the extra temp drop after lapping isnt that big..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Update: My MVG died it seems...stupid 8400gs shorted or something and now it won't boot.
I'm praying to the ROG gods :/

Back on the p4 rig, I even removed some spare cables from my psu...snif








Gonna have to ship it back to Texas for RMA.

Now I TRULY need a 5770 at least, can't play my games with intel igpu (d945gccr and two d9 sticks)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Update: My MVG died it seems...stupid 8400gs shorted or something and now it won't boot.
> I'm praying to the ROG gods :/
> 
> Back on the p4 rig, I even removed some spare cables from my psu...snif
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna have to ship it back to Texas for RMA.
> 
> Now I TRULY need a 5770 at least, can't play my games with intel igpu (d945gccr and two d9 sticks)


...sorry to hear that







...are you sure its dead:dead ? It won't boot even without any cards (if it has iGPU) ?

...I know it's a repeat, but here is the appropriate music:


----------



## matt1886

not a member, but would like to post my results. Just delidded , and lapped my 3570k temps dropped 25c-30c depending on ambient..

heatsink: Hyper 212+ push/pull
tim on die: Collaboratory Liquid Ultra
tim on ihs: Collaboratory Liquid Ultra

Here's a screenshot of my boinc machine chrunching away at 100% load..

 f


----------



## stickg1

Happy Easter! I'm going rabbit hunting!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Happy Easter! I'm going rabbit hunting!


Be verrrrrry quiet. I hope you are going with elmer fudd


----------



## MoGTy

I have a small issue, direct contact isn't working. Is this a matter of too much pressure, too little or no contact with the pins on the mobo? I really did try a few times already but without the holding bracket I run into trouble ie it doesn't boot.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> I have a small issue, direct contact isn't working. Is this a matter of too much pressure, too little or no contact with the pins on the mobo? I really did try a few times already but without the holding bracket I run into trouble ie it doesn't boot.


The bracket that clamps the IHS down to the socket provides the perfect amount of pressure. Without it, you have to find the right amount of pressure to make it work. It's going to be take a lot of trial and error

I took my delidded chip out. This is 2 month old CLU (looks like I put too much on)



With cotton swabs and alcohol, I cleaned the CLU off in about 30 seconds



I applied Antec Formula 7 nano-diamond. So far on Prime custom (80% of my RAM and FFTs 8K - 64K) my temps on average are 7C higher than with the CLU. The ambient temp is an entire 2C cooler today though.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Update: My MVG died it seems...stupid 8400gs shorted or something and now it won't boot.
> I'm praying to the ROG gods :/
> 
> Back on the p4 rig, I even removed some spare cables from my psu...snif
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna have to ship it back to Texas for RMA.
> 
> Now I TRULY need a 5770 at least, can't play my games with intel igpu (d945gccr and two d9 sticks)


Really?? How did it die? How old was it?


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The bracket that clamps the IHS down to the socket provides the perfect amount of pressure. Without it, you have to find the right amount of pressure to make it work. It's going to be take a lot of trial and error
> 
> I took my delidded chip out. This is 2 month old CLU (looks like I put too much on)
> 
> 
> 
> With cotton swabs and alcohol, I cleaned the CLU off in about 30 seconds
> 
> 
> 
> I applied Antec Formula 7 nano-diamond. So far on Prime custom (80% of my RAM and FFTs 8K - 64K) my temps on average are 7C higher than with the CLU. The ambient temp is an entire 2C cooler today though.


Dang, I guess I'll have to keep trying. I wish CLU wasn't so rare around here. I'm using AS5 :/


----------



## EssArTee4

OCN name: EssArTee4
CPU: I5 3570K
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: Kept the same
OC after delid: Kept the same
Temp drops: 25C
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## justanoldman

I realize I am not an HWBot pro and therefore my opinion is irrelevant, but since people have mentioned CLU needing to be sanded off, and others have mentioned lapping I am posting a few bits of info.

As to lapping, please don't do it unless you are sure you need to after checking your IHS while mounted, my lengthy post on lapping is here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13940#post_19519345

As to CLU, yes it become dry, hard, and acts like a light adhesive when it sets between two metal surfaces. In between your IHS and cooler it will dry over time and you will need to use a bit of force to pull them apart - no big deal just be aware of it. It will not dry on the die because it is not metal and it is easy to get it off. You will most like need to redo the die application any time you unclamp the chip from the mobo.

My previous post on CLU removal is here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13230#post_19452973

And over the weekend I needed to completely remove CLU from a different cooler than the one pictured in my post linked above, and from the IHS. It takes only paper towels and metal polish, no sanding or using any abrasives of any kind, not even the included pad. It does takes time, but it can be completely removed with just the metal polish.

Here are the cooler and IHS after uninstalling them. The CLU is hard to the touch and rough to the feel:



Here they are after cleaning with metal polish and then alcohol to finish the cleaning:



Hope that helps somebody.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sorry to hear that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...are you sure its dead:dead ? It won't boot even without any cards (if it has iGPU) ?
> 
> ...I know it's a repeat, but here is the appropriate music:


I think it was the 8400gs I was using as video output (CRT only has analog input, and thus I can't use the igpu cause the board only has HDMI out).
Must have died and took the board with it.
Tried flashing via rog connect, rc tweakit from a laptop, a lot of things. Even tested the psu in the system I'm now using, with a dmm under p95 load.
All fine, don't wanna put that 8400gs in this system, I'll see if I can mail my MVG to Tx for RMA (bought it at MC) and meanwhile grab a 5870 or something similar for LTC/BTC duties.

I posted at ROG forums and got a few replies, I'll retry the bios flashback thing tomorrow and see if the cpu leds flash or what, or maybe try removing the cpu and ram and flashing again. It's rather strange


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EssArTee4*
> 
> OCN name: EssArTee4
> CPU: I5 3570K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: Kept the same
> OC after delid: Kept the same
> Temp drops: 25C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Very happy you decided to join buddy. You will like it here! Happy easter:thumb:


----------



## EssArTee4

Thanks, happy Easter to you as well


----------



## Qlix

So someone just mentioned antec formula 7. Is this stuff any good? I've seen mixed reviews. It's the only thing I can get locally. I have arctic silver Ceramique on hand. Which would be better on the die? And what would you recommend not named CLU/CLP that can be had from newegg if I had to change


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> So someone just mentioned antec formula 7. Is this stuff any good? I've seen mixed reviews. It's the only thing I can get locally. I have arctic silver Ceramique on hand. Which would be better on the die? And what would you recommend not named CLU/CLP that can be had from newegg if I had to change


the only TIM you should put on a delided cpu is clu/clp unless you want to go sub zero cooling and i hear gelid is a good TIM for that. anyway its pointless to delid and not use clp/clu. but .thats my opinion


----------



## Joa3d43

Happy Eastern / long weekend everybody









...my GF brought a whole bag of Cadbury chocolate Easter eggs







I'm getting overclocked on chocolate and sugar









*IvanL.*..hope that board gets fixed one way or another...pulling everything (CPU, RAM, Cards, PSU power connection) and then re-connecting it can - at times - bring stuff back as it forces the BIOS into default mode...good luck


----------



## MoGTy

I'm not christian at all but I appreciate the idea so Happy Easter


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I realize I am not an HWBot pro and therefore my opinion is irrelevant, but since people have mentioned CLU needing to be sanded off, and others have mentioned lapping I am posting a few bits of info.
> 
> As to lapping, please don't do it unless you are sure you need to after checking your IHS while mounted, my lengthy post on lapping is here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13940#post_19519345
> 
> As to CLU, yes it become dry, hard, and acts like a light adhesive when it sets between two metal surfaces. In between your IHS and cooler it will dry over time and you will need to use a bit of force to pull them apart - no big deal just be aware of it. It will not dry on the die because it is not metal and it is easy to get it off. You will most like need to redo the die application any time you unclamp the chip from the mobo.
> 
> My previous post on CLU removal is here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/13230#post_19452973
> 
> And over the weekend I needed to completely remove CLU from a different cooler than the one pictured in my post linked above, and from the IHS. It takes only paper towels and metal polish, no sanding or using any abrasives of any kind, not even the included pad. It does takes time, but it can be completely removed with just the metal polish.
> 
> Here are the cooler and IHS after uninstalling them. The CLU is hard to the touch and rough to the feel:
> 
> Here they are after cleaning with metal polish and then alcohol to finish the cleaning:
> 
> Hope that helps somebody.


the metal polish does leave behind a residue that inhibits heat transfer, no?

now if you wanted to clean that stuff off your cpu die, how would you do it?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> the metal polish does leave behind a residue that inhibits heat transfer, no?
> 
> now if you wanted to clean that stuff off your cpu die, how would you do it?


You would definitely not want any metal polish residue left over on any surfaces. After I use the polish, I spend time getting it completely clean with isopropyl alcohol. Q-tips and alcohol make cleaning the die quick and easy.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> So someone just mentioned antec formula 7. Is this stuff any good? I've seen mixed reviews. It's the only thing I can get locally. I have arctic silver Ceramique on hand. Which would be better on the die? And what would you recommend not named CLU/CLP that can be had from newegg if I had to change


Formula 7 is great. And if you need some in a pinch it is available at Staples and Best Buy in the US so no need to wait for shipping. It is on par with IC Diamond and MX-4. They had it on sale at Best Buy one day for $7 a tube when they typically sell for $14 per tube. I bought all they had (6 tubes). So it's my go to paste. I put it on all my GPUs, and inbetween IHS and cooler. Works great. So far its working better than I expected on the die. The real test is to simulate a pump-out. So what I will be doing is Folding for 48hours, turning the PC off for 4 hours (to cool down) and Fold for 48 (and repeat). Hopefully by May I will start getting a temperature rise.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> I have a small issue, direct contact isn't working. Is this a matter of too much pressure, too little or no contact with the pins on the mobo? I really did try a few times already but without the holding bracket I run into trouble ie it doesn't boot.


...that's what often happens with initial 'direct die' trials. It is about the correct 'depth' spacing to get the right CPU-to-pins contact. You can do more 'trial and error' using some of the dimensions in the original Anandtech articles about that here:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=33789593

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595

...OR: EK (from EK waterblock fame) just announced 'stand-offs' for deliddeed processors (EURO 3.99), but they may not be available until May

...OR, using the Ananadtech dimensions per above, you can keep the CPU latch mechanism on and go for a machined water/ CPU block...there is an example w/pic I had posted just a few days ago in this thread about a chap in Toronto who had done that (not on my usual boot drive right now which has the pic...just look for a collage of pics w/silver in it)

...good luck !


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> I'm not christian at all but I appreciate the idea so Happy Easter


I'm not either but easter, to me, is about getting together with my family and enjoying our time together because I won't have them forever and after all, family is the most important thing in life. At least to me it is! Still can't help browsing the forums though. Now that I can't use my rig I've been on here 24/7. I can't wait to be up and running again! Only if seasonic would hurry up! Seems like they are going to take their sweet time. I wish they would send a replacement first so I could actually have something to use while it is out ggetting fixed!!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm not either but easter, to me, is about getting together with my family and enjoying our time together because I won't have them forever and after all, family is the most important thing in life. At least to me it is! Still can't help browsing the forums though. Now that I can't use my rig I've been on here 24/7. I can't wait to be up and running again! Only if seasonic would hurry up! Seems like they are going to take their sweet time. I wish they would send a replacement first so I could actually have something to use while it is out ggetting fixed!!


i think its called a advanced rma when they send you the replacement first but that costs a lil more


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EssArTee4*
> 
> OCN name: EssArTee4
> CPU: I5 3570K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: Kept the same
> OC after delid: Kept the same
> Temp drops: 25C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


You're In!







Welcome aboard and slap that sig on!

Happy Easter to all and if not of the catholic faith Happy weekend to everyone!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Amen bro...

How's everything down there?

I'm gonna try a few things more with my MVG before sending it to Asus in the US.
I can't seem to find a cheep radeon anywhere...







(57xx/58xx,68xx/69/xx)
My budget is so ridiculously low it ain't even funny. I just want to have decent sha256/scrypt hashing power and something that can play Tera online/SWTOR at med/high.
(paired with my current p4 631 rig...which can't be oced)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Amen bro...
> 
> How's everything down there?
> 
> I'm gonna try a few things more with my MVG before sending it to Asus in the US.
> I can't seem to find a cheep radeon anywhere...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (57xx/58xx,68xx/69/xx)
> My budget is so ridiculously low it ain't even funny. I just want to have decent sha256/scrypt hashing power and something that can play Tera online/SWTOR at med/high.
> (paired with my current p4 631 rig...which can't be oced)


Pretty good -ish I am broke so i can t go to a OC and LN2 event as of this funeral. but its alright. Hopefully you get some good luck and get a nice good GPU and ask Asus to be nice


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah...could be worse.
I decided to not spend real money on upgrades till Christmas. I'll mine as much as possible, hence the need for a radeon card.
I need two new bird cages, to fix my oven, a new fridge eventually...lotsa stuff.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah...could be worse.
> I decided to not spend real money on upgrades till Christmas. I'll mine as much as possible, hence the need for a radeon card.
> I need two new bird cages, to fix my oven, a new fridge eventually...lotsa stuff.


PM


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm not either but easter, to me, is about getting together with my family and enjoying our time together because I won't have them forever and after all, family is the most important thing in life. At least to me it is! Still can't help browsing the forums though. Now that I can't use my rig I've been on here 24/7. I can't wait to be up and running again! Only if seasonic would hurry up! Seems like they are going to take their sweet time. I wish they would send a replacement first so I could actually have something to use while it is out ggetting fixed!!


Ah yes, that's the only reason I still appreciate the holidays, family and friends.
Yeah, I got a similar issue with the main rig, had to RMA my motherboard. Sitting here til I get it back, which could take... 2 to 8 weeks. Yay







With no chance on an easy replacement I guess we'll just have to sit through it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> Ah yes, that's the only reason I still appreciate the holidays, family and friends.
> Yeah, I got a similar issue with the main rig, had to RMA my motherboard. Sitting here til I get it back, which could take... 2 to 8 weeks. Yay
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With no chance on an easy replacement I guess we'll just have to sit through it.


I hear ya. I almost want to just buy another PSU for the time being. I have a Seasonic 620w but it won't be able to support my crossfire setup and I already have all my cable management setup and everyhing plugged in so I'm just going to have to wait.


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I hear ya. I almost want to just buy another PSU for the time being. I have a Seasonic 620w but it won't be able to support my crossfire setup and I already have all my cable management setup and everyhing plugged in so I'm just going to have to wait.


Sad times, sad stories.

First world problems I guess


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Update: My MVG died it seems...stupid 8400gs shorted or something and now it won't boot.
> I'm praying to the ROG gods :/
> 
> Back on the p4 rig, I even removed some spare cables from my psu...snif
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna have to ship it back to Texas for RMA.
> 
> Now I TRULY need a 5770 at least, can't play my games with intel igpu (d945gccr and two d9 sticks)


Hopefully it comes back, though I killed mine once but it's still kicking. Even managed to boot it up last night with a heatsink mounted, best it has worked in a while.
I even finally got some 3000Mhz memory going







http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2752223

GT210 isn't much better than an e8400 & not a gamer card, but if you want one I have a couple spares.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Pretty good -ish I am broke so i can t go to a OC and LN2 event as of this funeral. but its alright. Hopefully you get some good luck and get a nice good GPU and ask Asus to be nice


Sucks that you can't make the event, the bench meets are fun. But they will make you want a pot even more, mo money...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah...could be worse.
> I decided to not spend real money on upgrades till Christmas. I'll mine as much as possible, hence the need for a radeon card.
> I need two new bird cages, to fix my oven, a new fridge eventually...lotsa stuff.


Fix oven, cook birds, same $ on dinner & birdcages


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Hopefully it comes back, though I killed mine once but it's still kicking. Even managed to boot it up last night with a heatsink mounted, best it has worked in a while.
> I even finally got some 3000Mhz memory going http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2752223


is that the corsair 2666mhz kit oc'ed ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> is that the corsair 2666mhz kit ?


Yes, it's a pretty beastly kit.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Hopefully it comes back, though I killed mine once but it's still kicking. Even managed to boot it up last night with a heatsink mounted, best it has worked in a while.
> I even finally got some 3000Mhz memory going
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2752223
> 
> GT210 isn't much better than an e8400 & not a gamer card, but if you want one I have a couple spares.
> Sucks that you can't make the event, the bench meets are fun. But they will make you want a pot even more, mo money...
> Fix oven, cook birds, same $ on dinner & birdcages


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yes, it's a pretty beastly kit.


Seems like you scored a nice imc there...and decent sticks









I won't cook my pet birds man, u crazy? Plus, I'm a vegetarian...
Thanks for the offer but I need something more red and capable sha256 wise (hint mining)


----------



## justanoldman

Off topic but since water has been brought up, and you have to "delid" your video card to water cool it, I am hoping to get some opinions.

My EK water block for my 690 only has two openings for the fittings that point down. That is ok for the outlet that will go down to the rad at the bottom of the case. But going from the cpu to the 690 I will have to have the tubing go over the card and bend to go under it to connect.
I think I could order some EK extensions to allow an up and down connection, but can I do it the way I suggested or is that not a good idea?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yes, it's a pretty beastly kit.


i want it lol


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Off topic but since water has been brought up, and you have to "delid" your video card to water cool it, I am hoping to get some opinions.
> 
> My EK water block for my 690 only has two openings for the fittings that point down. That is ok for the outlet that will go down to the rad at the bottom of the case. But going from the cpu to the 690 I will have to have the tubing go over the card and bend to go under it to connect.
> I think I could order some EK extensions to allow an up and down connection, but can I do it the way I suggested or is that not a good idea?


You can definitely make a u-bend for the tubing. It won't be as pretty but it will be as functional if not slightly more functional since tubing is less restrictive than a 90* fitting (the extension would be like two 90* fittings).

Very strange that they made the block that way though.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> You can definitely make a u-bend for the tubing. It won't be as pretty but it will be as functional if not slightly more functional since tubing is less restrictive than a 90* fitting (the extension would be like two 90* fittings).
> 
> Very strange that they made the block that way though.


Thanks for the help. +rep
You are definitely right that I would have to do a couple 90 degree turns to get the fittings to look pretty. Is that a normal thing in water cooling that 90 degree turns in fittings or link systems is more restrictive and should be avoided?
Here is a pic of it.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for the help. +rep
> You are definitely right that I would have to do a couple 90 degree turns to get the fittings to look pretty. Is that a normal thing in water cooling that 90 degree turns in fittings or link systems is more restrictive and should be avoided?
> Here is a pic of it.


If you get on martinsliquidlab.org he has measures for pressure drop over 1' of tubing and pressure drop across a 90* fitting. It's rather abnormal for a block to be designed like that. Normally they have an extension with 4 holes and 2 plugs so that for water to enter it's just 1 90* bend instead of entering and exiting from the bottom. For link systems, it just depends on the system. Granted, we're talking diffrences of a tenth of a PSI, so if your pump has more than enough overhead, go for whichever you feel works best for your personal tastes and budget.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for the help. +rep
> You are definitely right that I would have to do a couple 90 degree turns to get the fittings to look pretty. Is that a normal thing in water cooling that 90 degree turns in fittings or link systems is more restrictive and should be avoided?
> Here is a pic of it.


I agree with MkHunt. But if you want it to look pretty, you could always use 2 rotary adapters from frozencpu

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/13679/ex-tub-974/Phobya_60_Angled_G14_Female_to_G14_Male_Rotary_Extender_-_Black_Nickel_64181.html?tl=g30c497s1504



Probably closer to the resistance of the U bent tubing, in case you wanted the metal look. Just a suggestion.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks for the help. +rep
> You are definitely right that I would have to do a couple 90 degree turns to get the fittings to look pretty. Is that a normal thing in water cooling that 90 degree turns in fittings or link systems is more restrictive and should be avoided?
> Here is a pic of it.


That's weird. Do they have other 690 blocks? It should have one on top and one on bottom. I mean what if you wanted to have quad SLI with 2 690s?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yes, it's a pretty beastly kit.










...now that's a great run ! How did you cool the ram for that particular run - air ? water ? - extreme ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...now that's a great run ! How did you cool the ram for that particular run - air ? water ? - extreme ?


Just regular air cooled so far. I'll try strapping a small single stage on it next & see what it does at -15°.
Also have to try single channel for higher frequency, 3000Mhz is nowhere near enough for the memory OC stage...


----------



## ivanlabrie

You're gonna need an fx bd or pd rig for that...IB is more efficient but 3ghz imc is normally the max. Have you booted higher than that yet??


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just regular air cooled so far. I'll try strapping a small single stage on it next & see what it does at -15°.
> Also have to try single channel for higher frequency, 3000Mhz is nowhere near enough for the memory OC stage...


...ahem, if 3000MHz is not it, what would be 'near enough' ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You're gonna need an fx bd or pd rig for that...IB is more efficient but 3ghz imc is normally the max. Have you booted higher than that yet??


I do have an 8150 here I haven't used, hand picked by massman I won in a comp. a while back. Never wanted to run it in the 990fx ud5 though, that board killed my golden 955be & 1090t, both at stock... The clear cmos button is a mislabelled cpu self destruct button.
I do need a new chv.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...ahem, if 3000MHz is not it, what would be 'near enough' ?


Current first place is a bit over 3700Mhz, 3000Mhz right now has us in 9th place. Mostly don't want to be last in this stage, OCN is at least hoping for a podium finish in the overall cpu, top 5 at the end would nice.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I do have an 8150 here I haven't used, hand picked by massman I won in a comp. a while back. Never wanted to run it in the 990fx ud5 though, that board killed my golden 955be & 1090t, both at stock... The clear cmos button is a mislabelled cpu self destruct button.
> I do need a new chv.
> Current first place is a bit over 3700Mhz, 3000Mhz right now has us in 9th place. Mostly don't want to be last in this stage, OCN is at least hoping for a podium finish in the overall cpu, top 5 at the end would nice.


...noticed that several of the top submission in various disciplines at the global HWBot list G.Skill TridentX, though they were not memory-specific competitions...not to mention that the top guys have their's 'binned'

...I also find that even with 'identical RAM' in daily operations / applications which performs 'as advertised' or better at the rated speed, many pieces can go beyond via BCLK by 10% or so ...but there is always a small handful which stands out which can go much further...private, binned reserve, so to speak


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...noticed that several of the top submission in various disciplines at the global HWBot list G.Skill TridentX, though they were not memory-specific competitions...not to mention that the top guys have their's 'binned'
> 
> ...I also find that even with 'identical RAM' in daily operations / applications which performs 'as advertised' or better at the rated speed, many pieces can go beyond via BCLK by 10% or so ...but there is always a small handful which stands out which can go much further...private, binned reserve, so to speak


The trident X are popular since they are basically the same chips as the comparable corsair kits at a cheaper price. Binning is a part of it for pretty much all hardware.
There have been a fair number of kits out there which get used, but have never been available to the public or were very limited (stores got some, but one shipment of a few kits, & never seen again). There are a few kits I would love to find...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The trident X are popular since they are basically the same chips as the comparable corsair kits at a cheaper price. Binning is a part of it for pretty much all hardware.
> There have been a fair number of kits out there which get used, but have never been available to the public or were very limited (stores got some, but one shipment of a few kits, & never seen again). There are a few kits I would love to find...


i would take these any day
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285
over what i have now wich are these. and they stink, well i think they do i tried 2600 couldnt get it,. but i got 2400mhz 9-11-11-31 @1.725v







is that bad ?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The trident X are popular since they are basically the same chips as the comparable corsair kits at a cheaper price. Binning is a part of it for pretty much all hardware.
> There have been a fair number of kits out there which get used, but have never been available to the public or were very limited (stores got some, but one shipment of a few kits, & never seen again). There are a few kits I would love to find...


...sometimes it could just be luck - on the 6x VM 3770 machines, we run 32GB of 1600MHz Ripjaws (matched quad kits)...of the 6, all can OC pretty good, but 1 kit can hit 2000MHz plus at tight timings, while the others don't much like to go beyond 1866MHz - all were bought at the same place, though at different times...similar story on the TridentX quad kits - all OC, but one stands out even though it has got the same label / price...law of large numbers, I guess...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would take these any day
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285
> over what i have now wich are these. and they stink, well i think they do i tried 2600 couldnt get it,. but i got 2400mhz 9-11-11-31 @1.725v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that bad ?
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587


...try 10 10 12 30 @ 1.67v / 2400MHz w/fast Ram settings in Bios (depending on your Bios of course)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would take these any day
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285
> over what i have now wich are these. and they stink, well i think they do i tried 2600 couldnt get it,. but i got 2400mhz 9-11-11-31 @1.725v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that bad ?
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587


Your kit is kind of random, ic wise...2400c9 is Samsung d-rev, 2400c11 some form of Hynix and yours too. Is it dual or single sided?
That makes a big difference. Only get double sided kits for best efficiency.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sometimes it could just be luck - on the 6x VM 3770 machines, we run 32GB of 1600MHz Ripjaws (matched quad kits)...of the 6, all can OC pretty good, but 1 kit can hit 2000MHz plus at tight timings, while the others don't much like to go beyond 1866MHz - all were bought at the same place, though at different times...similar story on the TridentX quad kits - all OC, but one stands out even though it has got the same label / price...law of large numbers, I guess...


IMC is the name of the game guys...If the chip can't boot at whatever timings and volts over certain megahurz range, you're screwed most of the time.

Good and bad news, my MVG is confirmed dead, and my 3770k and rams are fine.
I'll be mailing it to Texas for RMA, it should take a month or two.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would take these any day
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285
> over what i have now wich are these. and they stink, well i think they do i tried 2600 couldnt get it,. but i got 2400mhz 9-11-11-31 @1.725v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that bad ?
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587


The kit you have is probably better than the corsair kit, I think those are hynix ICs in both, the 2400 c10 is likely higher bin. The trident kit you have should be better for loosening timings to get higher speed, the samsung kits generally do a bit tighter timings but don't reach as high frequencies.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> I agree with MkHunt. But if you want it to look pretty, you could always use 2 rotary adapters from frozencpu
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/13679/ex-tub-974/Phobya_60_Angled_G14_Female_to_G14_Male_Rotary_Extender_-_Black_Nickel_64181.html?tl=g30c497s1504
> Probably closer to the resistance of the U bent tubing, in case you wanted the metal look. Just a suggestion.


Thanks for the suggestion. I will look into those.
I think my plan will be to set it up as simple as possible at first, then worry about looks later. I have a feeling I am going to mess something up with this being my first water cooled expansion.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's weird. Do they have other 690 blocks? It should have one on top and one on bottom. I mean what if you wanted to have quad SLI with 2 690s?


That is the only way they make it, two holes on the bottom. They include a link that is a 90 degree for both holes so then you can add another link, which you have to order, to make the fittings go up. If you have two 690s I think you use the included links on both, then order a sli bridge than connects those two links.

I am just figuring all this stuff out as I go. I asked beforehand about everything, but being told things are compatible and them being compatible in real life are not the same.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i would take these any day
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233285
> over what i have now wich are these. and they stink, well i think they do i tried 2600 couldnt get it,. but i got 2400mhz 9-11-11-31 @1.725v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is that bad ?
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231587


I have those TridentX too, haven't tried any oc yet though, just running standard XMP at 2400, 10-12-12-31 at 1.65v.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Your kit is kind of random, ic wise...2400c9 is Samsung d-rev, 2400c11 some form of Hynix and yours too. Is it dual or single sided?
> That makes a big difference. Only get double sided kits for best efficiency.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMC is the name of the game guys...If the chip can't boot at whatever timings and volts over certain megahurz range, you're screwed most of the time.
> 
> Good and bad news, my MVG is confirmed dead, and my 3770k and rams are fine.
> I'll be mailing it to Texas for RMA, it should take a month or two.


Ivan, just saw this http://www.hwbot.org/newsflash/1978_intel_extreme_overclocking_workshop_in_buenos_aires_argentina_on_april_10

Might make you feel better to see other peoples hardware take a beating if it's close & you have free time.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Your kit is kind of random, ic wise...2400c9 is Samsung d-rev, 2400c11 some form of Hynix and yours too. Is it dual or single sided?
> That makes a big difference. Only get double sided kits for best efficiency.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMC is the name of the game guys...If the chip can't boot at whatever timings and volts over certain megahurz range, you're screwed most of the time.
> 
> Good and bad news, my MVG is confirmed dead, and my 3770k and rams are fine.
> I'll be mailing it to Texas for RMA, it should take a month or two.


...at least the 3770K is ok...

...you're right on the IMC, but per earlier posts, I use the single 3770K to test out ALL kits (including those for the 3770 VMs) as I know that its IMC can handle it...unfortunately for the 3770K, it had to give up its own set of the fastest kit of 32GB Trident to the ROG RIVE/ 3970X...it's sulking


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivan, just saw this http://www.hwbot.org/newsflash/1978_intel_extreme_overclocking_workshop_in_buenos_aires_argentina_on_april_10
> 
> Might make you feel better to see other peoples hardware take a beating if it's close & you have free time.


...or save some travel bucks and watch that crazy dude on YouTube fry old hardware in his drive way - like sending 220v to an AMD CPU, or run things without any heat-sink...I think he must have had a bad childhood experience with computers


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys. Just got home and I'm so stuffed. Think I'm going to take apart the fan controller and remove some of the cables I'm not using. Just added two 200mm fans on the top to act as a "pull" for my H100i just to move a little more air. I was just thinking about it and do you guys think I should reverse the rear exhaust so I can feed the H100i some fresh air? I figure when you have a radiator on the top and an exhaust in the rear the two would be fighting for air to throw out of the case. This way it will all be concentrated to go through the top and the rear intake would cool down the hot air headed out the top. Is my logic right? I know the two additional 200mm fans aren't going to help much, but I figure that it will help a little bit.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The kit you have is probably better than the corsair kit, I think those are hynix ICs in both, the 2400 c10 is likely higher bin. The trident kit you have should be better for loosening timings to get higher speed, the samsung kits generally do a bit tighter timings but don't reach as high frequencies.


what kinda timmings should i try for 2600mhz i never tried loosening them when i went for 2600


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what kinda timmings should i try for 2600mhz i never tried loosening them when i went for 2600


I would start at 11-13-13 leaving the rest auto, then try to tighten up from there. The cas & trcd probably won't want to tighten up, but the trp & tras might, & then tertiary & secondaries.


----------



## lilchronic

ok i tried 2600mhz 11-13-13 it faild and i went to 1.7v then i tried 12 -13-13 and it worked @ 1.7 but crashed after i booted in winows so i tried 1.725 it failed instantly so now im @ 2400 with 10-10-12 1.67v


----------



## MKHunt

Corsair Dominator Platinum 2133 @ 2200MHzCL9 @1.52V.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivan, just saw this http://www.hwbot.org/newsflash/1978_intel_extreme_overclocking_workshop_in_buenos_aires_argentina_on_april_10
> 
> Might make you feel better to see other peoples hardware take a beating if it's close & you have free time.


Yeah, seen it a month ago at that local site...registered there but it's some sort of give away contest thingie. I doubt a new guy will get in.
I never posted in that forum except on the event's thread








(I don't like local forums normally...people tend to be too selfish/cocky/rude or simply ignorant and a combination of those other perks mentioned before)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...or save some travel bucks and watch that crazy dude on YouTube fry old hardware in his drive way - like sending 220v to an AMD CPU, or run things without any heat-sink...I think he must have had a bad childhood experience with computers


Which guy!?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what kinda timmings should i try for 2600mhz i never tried loosening them when i went for 2600


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok i tried 2600mhz 11-13-13 it faild and i went to 1.7v then i tried 12 -13-13 and it worked @ 1.7 but crashed after i booted in winows so i tried 1.725 it failed instantly so now im @ 2400 with 10-10-12 1.67v


Looks like you won't be able to use more "24/7 friendly" voltages for higher clocks...Try 1.85v and 11-13-12-31-2t and see if that boots with auto subs.
Then open memtweakit and try to tighten the tertiary timings (as far as they'll go...which is normally 1-1-1-1-4-4-1-4-4-0). Try a maxmem run at 5ghz or go for 3ghz







(you might wanna bump vccio and vccsa to 1.15v)

EDIT: You might wanna try 9-12-11 or 9-11-10-28-2t too...hynix friendly combinations. xD


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, seen it a month ago at that local site...registered there but it's some sort of give away contest thingie. I doubt a new guy will get in.
> I never posted in that forum except on the event's thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I don't like local forums normally...people tend to be too selfish/cocky/rude or simply ignorant and a combination of those other perks mentioned before)
> Which guy!?
> 
> Looks like you won't be able to use more "24/7 friendly" voltages for higher clocks...Try 1.85v and 11-13-12-31-2t and see if that boots with auto subs.
> Then open memtweakit and try to tighten the tertiary timings (as far as they'll go...which is normally 1-1-1-1-4-4-1-4-4-0). Try a maxmem run at 5ghz or go for 3ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (you might wanna bump vccio and vccsa to 1.15v)
> 
> EDIT: You might wanna try 9-12-11 or 9-11-10-28-2t too...hynix friendly combinations. xD


what are safe voltages to run


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what are safe voltages to run


No voltage is truly safe...I consider 1.75v the max for daily usage. Hynix scales well with voltage and specially with cold.
Try not to go over 1.85v...unless you can get some chilly AC air inside your case. Then go for 1.9v and shoot for 3ghz+


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Which guy!?


...just a small selection (check the right column at YouTube for more)...needless to add: Don't try this at home


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> No voltage is truly safe...I consider 1.75v the max for daily usage. Hynix scales well with voltage and specially with cold.
> Try not to go over 1.85v...unless you can get some chilly AC air inside your case. Then go for 1.9v and shoot for 3ghz+


yea i should of tried that a couple months ago when it was 28*F at night lol i live in florida its starting to get hot. bye bye cold front hello heat wave








but im bout to try some of those timmings you suggested 9-12-11-28 9-11-10-28-2t sounds good


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hynix works like that...try xmp profile, and change the main timings to that. Work your way around 1.65-75v first.
Memtweakit from within Windows does wonders for secondary/tertiary timings, but remember some of the timings you will achieve are not bootable most of the time. Don't change twcl from Win unless you wanna reboot your pc forcefully.


----------



## Joa3d43

Qs fo*r FtW and IvanL*

...per spoiler, did some more Unigine Heaven competition with 2x 670 cards and delidded 3770K earlier this evening (IMC seems to be working very fine







), not least as Heaven seems to be slower with tri-SLI and quad-SLI

...adding the aforementioned 3970X Sandy-E, which has inherited the 3770K's original fast (quad set) TridentX...I have never worked on Sandy-E before (though have on Xeons, but with stock EEC RAM), especially re quad channel mem in the 'semi-crazy' Rampage IV Extreme board.

My plan is to use the exact-same settings as a starting point (ie mem 'v', timings etc), then try to do some more competitive runs, but with the 3970X (same vid cards)...what are the most *fundamental differences* between the Ivy and Sandy-E re *memory setup*, apart from the quad channels etc...Tx











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## MattyMatt

So, uhm, I totally just delidded. I was kind of bored and this chip was burnt by LN2 anyway, so if anything went wrong, I have my back up. I didnt read the guidelines before, but since I dont have my actual cooler yet... right now it is just ugly stock. And I only have MX4. Need to remount since IHS went on crooks. Just booted to make sure it still worked.

http://i.imgur.com/4fI4Ljp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/tOQAunW.jpg

So far the idles have dropped below thirty, except for one core. That one is near 40 :/


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattyMatt*
> 
> So, uhm, I totally just delidded. I was kind of bored and this chip was burnt by LN2 anyway, so if anything went wrong, I have my back up. I didnt read the guidelines before, but since I dont have my actual cooler yet... right now it is just ugly stock. And I only have MX4. Need to remount since IHS went on crooks. Just booted to make sure it still worked.
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/4fI4Ljp.jpg
> http://i.imgur.com/tOQAunW.jpg
> 
> So far the idles have dropped below thirty, except for one core. That one is near 40 :/


Woah man, I don't think I have ever seen a chip that was completely spotless of the black glue on the pcb. Usually it leaves a residue. How did you get it all off? REP to you for that!


----------



## MKHunt

Credit card then rubbing with fingers. When I took this I had rubbed the left but not the right side.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattyMatt*
> 
> So, uhm, I totally just delidded. I was kind of bored and this chip was burnt by LN2 anyway, so if anything went wrong, I have my back up. I didnt read the guidelines before, but since I dont have my actual cooler yet... right now it is just ugly stock. And I only have MX4. Need to remount since IHS went on crooks. Just booted to make sure it still worked.
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/4fI4Ljp.jpg
> http://i.imgur.com/tOQAunW.jpg


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Credit card then rubbing with fingers. When I took this I had rubbed the left but not the right side.


Congrats to both of you
















...that looks a lot cleaner than when I did mine (it survived just fine, but there was blood







) ...I kind of feel relieved that there is no sense in delidding Sandy-E's....


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Credit card then rubbing with fingers. When I took this I had rubbed the left but not the right side.


Damn I tried rubbing with my fingers after using the credit card and I couldn't get it to come off. I guess my fingers are too soft and sexy....










Can you say... "Hand Model" ?????

lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Qs fo*r FtW and IvanL*
> 
> ...per spoiler, did some more Unigine Heaven competition with 2x 670 cards and delidded 3770K earlier this evening (IMC seems to be working very fine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), not least as Heaven seems to be slower with tri-SLI and quad-SLI
> 
> ...adding the aforementioned 3970X Sandy-E, which has inherited the 3770K's original fast (quad set) TridentX...I have never worked on Sandy-E before (though have on Xeons, but with stock EEC RAM), especially re quad channel mem in the 'semi-crazy' Rampage IV Extreme board.
> 
> My plan is to use the exact-same settings as a starting point (ie mem 'v', timings etc), then try to do some more competitive runs, but with the 3970X (same vid cards)...what are the most *fundamental differences* between the Ivy and Sandy-E re *memory setup*, apart from the quad channels etc...Tx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


The timings & vdimm will pretty much be the same, x79 does use a bit different tertiaries & the tRCD doesn't like to tighten up as much as with ivy.
With c2 revision sb-e avoid going over 1.2V on the VTT, people have seen rapid degrading getting up around 1.25V.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The timings & vdimm will pretty much be the same, x79 does use a bit different tertiaries & the tRCD doesn't like to tighten up as much as with ivy.
> With c2 revision sb-e avoid going over 1.2V on the VTT, people have seen rapid degrading getting up around 1.25V.


...Thanks ! Don't even know what revision it is (latest 3970X, just arrived at the warehouse, will pick it up Tuesday)...I presume the VTT is automatically set by the Rampage board, as is the case with my Max V Ex / 3770K now ? I normally don't play with VTT, and the Max V Ex has VTTDDR v = 0.75 ...do people really push that to 1.2+ v ?


----------



## FtW 420

The r4e will have a cpu vtt voltage control, that is the one to not go too high with. There is also one called 2nd cpu vtt, but that can be left on auto.

Just have to watch early memory kit xmp profiles, some of them can set the vtt too high. It was fine with the c1 revision chips that quad channel memory launched with, but the c2 revision came out with the vt-d extension & those ones couldn't take as much vtt.
The 3970x will be c2.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The r4e will have a cpu vtt voltage control, that is the one to not go too high with. There is also one called 2nd cpu vtt, but that can be left on auto.
> 
> Just have to watch early memory kit xmp profiles, some of them can set the vtt too high. It was fine with the c1 revision chips that quad channel memory launched with, but the c2 revision came out with the vt-d extension & those ones couldn't take as much vtt.
> The 3970x will be c2.


Thanks ! The good news is that I know the transferred TridentX 32GB kit inside out...I'll watch for the R4E Bios / XMP settings it adopts, also vis-a-vis VTT


----------



## lilchronic

i currently running 9-11-11-28-2n 2400mhz @ 1.73v or would it be better if i ran @ 2600 12-13-13-33-2n @ 1.75v, im kinda confused with all these setting that can be changed.







i need some sleep


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i currently running 9-11-11-28-2n 2400mhz @ 1.73v or would it be better if i ran @ 2600 12-13-13-33-2n @ 1.75v, im kinda confused with all these setting that can be changed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i need some sleep


I hear ya. I'm exhausted. I can't figure out how RAM overclocking works at all no matter how hard I try to learn it.


----------



## MattyMatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Woah man, I don't think I have ever seen a chip that was completely spotless of the black glue on the pcb. Usually it leaves a residue. How did you get it all off? REP to you for that!


I spent quite a while on it. There is a faint outline, otherwise just my nails and cotton swabs. Applied ArctiClean a few times to soften it a bit. Couldnt get it our of the corners of the IHS, tried everything there.

Does anyone know where I can get Coollaboratory Liquid PRO or ULTRA in Canada? They always charge import from the States which always means another freaking tenner for their "import handling fee of the 50 cents you owe the government in taxes mkay thanks". Otherwise I have to ask friends in the states to ship it to me as a gift


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I hear ya. I'm exhausted. I can't figure out how RAM overclocking works at all no matter how hard I try to learn it.


...it's sort of like Alchemy, only 'darker'







...especially when you hear that certain Asus boards (your MVE included) react very well to ""certain"" tertiary setting changes...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattyMatt*
> 
> I spent quite a while on it. There is a faint outline, otherwise just my nails and cotton swabs. Applied ArctiClean a few times to soften it a bit. Couldnt get it our of the corners of the IHS, tried everything there.
> 
> Does anyone know where I can get Coollaboratory Liquid PRO or ULTRA in Canada? They always charge import from the States which always means another freaking tenner for their "import handling fee of the 50 cents you owe the government in taxes mkay thanks". Otherwise I have to ask friends in the states to ship it to me as a gift


...I ordered it direct from Germany at Coollab's online shop (PayPal credit card setup - easy)...first part of the journey to Canada (BC) was via DHL, then CanadaPost...arrived with no extra fees / taxes...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I ordered it direct from Germany at Coollab's online shop (PayPal credit card setup - easy)...first part of the journey to Canada (BC) was via DHL, then CanadaPost...arrived with no extra fees / taxes...


Yea just order it straight from them. Even when the syringe was leaking a little bit they took my word for it and sent me a brand new one for free. Now I have the leaking one which is still usable and a brand new one that is still in the package. That is how you know you are dealing with a great company!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Thanks ! Don't even know what revision it is (latest 3970X, just arrived at the warehouse, will pick it up Tuesday)...I presume the VTT is automatically set by the Rampage board, as is the case with my Max V Ex / 3770K now ? I normally don't play with VTT, and the Max V Ex has VTTDDR v = 0.75 ...do people really push that to 1.2+ v ?


VTTDDR is another thing...I set it at 0.850v normally for max valids and stuff.
I don't touch vccio or vccsa (vtt and imc) on Ivy...SB even more so. Fragile POS chips.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i currently running 9-11-11-28-2n 2400mhz @ 1.73v or would it be better if i ran @ 2600 12-13-13-33-2n @ 1.75v, im kinda confused with all these setting that can be changed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i need some sleep


It would be better if you tightened the secondary and tertiary timings with memtweakit or cpu-tweaker from the Os first. And compare using maxxmem preview.
(Asrock has a ram oc from the os utility...comes with the oc formula, look for it)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> VTTDDR is another thing...I set it at 0.850v normally for max valids and stuff.
> I don't touch vccio or vccsa (vtt and imc) on Ivy...SB even more so. Fragile POS chips.
> It would be better if you tightened the secondary and tertiary timings with memtweakit or cpu-tweaker from the Os first. And compare using maxxmem preview.
> (Asrock has a ram oc from the os utility...comes with the oc formula, look for it)


i crashed a couple times 0x50, 0xD1, and the last 1 i got 0x7E







i give up for tonight


----------



## ivanlabrie

Moar vdimm...


----------



## lilchronic

i think im just guna buy that asrock oc formula and keep my extreme 4 and see if i can bring my failed delid cpu back to life. . i never tried running with 1 stick of ram in different slots i just went out and bought a new 1 lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

yeah, OC Formula is like a cheap MVE...great for ram *specially psc but modern sticks too


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> VTTDDR is another thing...I set it at 0.850v normally for max valids and stuff.
> I don't touch vccio or vccsa (vtt and imc) on Ivy...SB even more so. Fragile POS chips...


...no wonder people get confused







...twice now I have seen CPUs at over 1.9vs (vcore !) on air...one apparently lived, one did not...that one also had vccio at almost double the stock value


----------



## homestyle

how much CLU should I apply on the die?

1/4 of a grain of rice?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> how much CLU should I apply on the die?
> 
> 1/4 of a grain of rice?


I would say that, I normally put just a tiny bit and if I need more, I just add more. CLU isn't like other thermal pastes and since you are already spreading it, you won't have to worry about the extra air bubbles by adding a bit more later. Too much = bad, too little = fixable.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I would say that, I normally put just a tiny bit and if I need more, I just add more. CLU isn't like other thermal pastes and since you are already spreading it, you won't have to worry about the extra air bubbles by adding a bit more later. Too much = bad, too little = fixable.


This. Even if you do less than a 1/4 of a grain of rice, more than likely you will still be fine. Pretty sure my last application was less than 1/4 rice grain and by the time I was done push/pulling it around, I still had a tiny bit bubbled in one spot, so I pushed it to the right side of the die, away from the cores. Mind you, this is with CLP. So maybe I shouldnt be saying anything since I have no experience with CLU. I would assume they are very close though.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> how much CLU should I apply on the die?
> 
> 1/4 of a grain of rice?


...^^^ the above responses on quantity .... In addition, since it is liquid metal, best to do it in a well-lit room and also look at your 'spread work' from different angles a lot to determine the thinnest but most complete layer possible


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> how much CLU should I apply on the die?
> 
> 1/4 of a grain of rice?


With two chips, lots of mistakes, and testing I have applied CLU to the die about 20 times now. For me the easiest and most controlled way is to have the CLU pushed to the end of the syringe but not pushed actually out of it. Then dip the tip of your included brush into the syringe to get a small amount on it. Next paint the die, it will spread much more then you think it does. You don't want to see many bubbles of it when you are done.

I also like to put a very thin layer on the underside of the IHS but just enough to stain it. You can use what is left on the brush to do it. If you end up with too much anywhere a qtip can help get some off. Take pics after application and the guys here can usually say if it looks like too much or too little.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...no wonder people get confused
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...twice now I have seen CPUs at over 1.9vs (vcore !) on air...one apparently lived, one did not...that one also had vccio at almost double the stock value


Thats not me.... I promise......









I still love my OC RAM kit where it does 2600 8-10-11-10-27







at 1.8 vdimm and 1.2 for vvio and vccio


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I decided to jump start my old PSU to power the fans and lights in my Phantom 820 just to check for anything that doesn't work. Turns out the NZXT 200mm fan on the top that I was using as a "pull" for my H100i was hitting the radiator screws while the 200mm cooler master next to it was touching anything. So I grabbed my other 200mm Cooler Master and ripped the blue LED's out like I did for the first (I'm going for a beastly red lighting for this build) and popped it on top and all was well. Then I had fan fever so I threw in a 120mm fan on the bottom and a 120mm on the swivel mount that is on the HDD cage and aimed it towards the radiator. I also reversed the rear exhaust to an intake so I can feed the H100i some fresh air. So now I have a total of 8 fans in my case and it is almost completely silent when it is on. Very happy. All of the LED's on the case work absolutely great and nothing is wrong. Very happy with it. So now I'm just waiting for my PSU ....







(tapping foot inpatiently)

Also, I made this diagram while thinking of how to setup the fans. Am I right with how the airflow would be with my two 7950's?


----------



## TonicX

I have a used syringe of CoolLaboratory Ultra with 6 mileters left but it seams as though it is compacted, and "NOT SO LIQUID" I assume the liqid vehicle that the metal particles mostly squeezed out, there is some left. I am gunna try to get it out out the tube and mix it up like thinning oil paints.

411?

Advice?

Other than "order some more" - done that.

Has anyone experienced this problem?

Does anyone have a solution? Literally?

Could I mix it with something?

What is the liqid part of CLU?

Using my OCN lifeline for an answer. help!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I have a used syringe of CoolLaboratory Ultra with 6 mileters left but it seams as though it is compacted, and "NOT SO LIQUID" I assume the liqid vehicle that the metal particles mostly squeezed out, there is some left. I am gunna try to get it out out the tube and mix it up like thinning oil paints.
> 
> 411?
> 
> Advice?
> 
> Other than "order some more" - done that.
> 
> Has anyone experienced this problem?
> 
> Does anyone have a solution? Literally?
> 
> Could I mix it with something?
> 
> What is the liqid part of CLU?
> 
> Using my OCN lifeline for an answer. help!


Don't use any other materials as you may have a chemical reaction and kill thyself. First just try using a heat gun and heat it up a bit I bet its just in the syringe and hardened a bit. So give it some heat and see if that works.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I have a used syringe of CoolLaboratory Ultra with 6 mileters left but it seams as though it is compacted, and "NOT SO LIQUID" I assume the liqid vehicle that the metal particles mostly squeezed out, there is some left. I am gunna try to get it out out the tube and mix it up like thinning oil paints.
> 
> 411?
> 
> Advice?
> 
> Other than "order some more" - done that.
> 
> Has anyone experienced this problem?
> 
> Does anyone have a solution? Literally?
> 
> Could I mix it with something?
> 
> What is the liqid part of CLU?
> 
> Using my OCN lifeline for an answer. help!


Don't use any other materials as you may have a chemical reaction and kill thyself. First just try using a heat gun and heat it up a bit I bet its just in the syringe and hardened a bit. So give it some heat and see if that works.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Don't use any other materials as you may have a chemical reaction and kill thyself. First just try using a heat gun and heat it up a bit I bet its just in the syringe and hardened a bit. So give it some heat and see if that works.


What he said^ Heat gun. It's not worth killing youself trying to get the last little bit out like a junkie licking the spoon haha. JK I think the same way, but I don't think it's worth the risk.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats not me.... I promise......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still love my OC RAM kit where it does 2600 8-10-11-10-27
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> at 1.8 vdimm and 1.2 for vvio and vccio


...and a minute of silence for Fast-Frankie [Valgaur's former CPU] which he sent to the electric chair







...there ought to be a law against murdering CPUs


----------



## TonicX

RavageTheEarth: Do you mind if I as you where you purchased your current MOBO? I have money for a ROG or MVF but micro center cant seem to keep any on there shelves. Will you recommend an on-line dis plz? did you get the $303 or $380 model? Are you still happy with it? my chip need to find a permanent home!

EDIT: does yours have h2o cooling port adaptable heatsinks like the mvf?


----------



## TonicX

As I said my chip is getting a new home - a permanent home - then on to intels Haswell
vvv This is confusing the heck out of me!
Maximus V Formula Game Bundled Edition
Crosshair V Formula-Z
Maximus V Extreme
Maximus V Formula/ThunderFX
Maximus V Formula
Maximus V GENE
Rampage IV GENE
Rampage IV Extreme/BATTLEFIELD 3
Rampage IV Extreme
Rampage III GENE
Rampage III Formula
Crosshair IV Formula
Crosshair IV Extreme
Rampage III Extreme
Crosshair V Formula
Maximus IV Extreme
Maximus IV GENE-Z
Maximus IV Extreme-Z

My Minneapolis Microcenter list:

$289.99
Maximus V Formula LGA 1155 Z77 ATX Intel Motherboard with Assassin's Creed III Bundle
http://www.microcenter.com/product/405600/Maximus_V_Formula_LGA_1155_Z77_ATX_Intel_Motherboard_with_Assassin's_Creed_III_Bundle

or
$379 for
Maximus V Extreme LGA 1155 Intel Z77 Extended ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.microcenter.com/product/397079/Maximus_V_Extreme_LGA_1155_Intel_Z77_Extended_ATX_Intel_Motherboard

Formula or GENE or Extreme? extreme is better than formula? these are both better than GENE?

III or IV or V? v is newer than IV is newer than III! right?

any of these seem fine but i want a full loop including multi-graphics eventually.
i like the water cooled heatsinks on the FORMULA Why does it cost less?

Which one is the top dog?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get the Gene unless you're gonna run more than 2 gpus or you need your board to be bigger cause it makes you feel less of a man being matx...









They have different features, but price/performance and for out right overclocking you can't touch the MVG.


----------



## TonicX

rep 4 u. I'm going to look into the MVG now.

I took this post to [OFFICIAL] ROG Maximus V Owners Club and got a question for a question. thanks for the answer?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> As I said my chip is getting a new home - a permanent home - then on to intels Haswell
> vvv This is confusing the heck out of me!
> Maximus V Formula Game Bundled Edition
> Crosshair V Formula-Z
> Maximus V Extreme
> Maximus V Formula/ThunderFX
> Maximus V Formula
> Maximus V GENE
> Rampage IV GENE
> Rampage IV Extreme/BATTLEFIELD 3
> Rampage IV Extreme
> Rampage III GENE
> Rampage III Formula
> Crosshair IV Formula
> Crosshair IV Extreme
> Rampage III Extreme
> Crosshair V Formula
> Maximus IV Extreme
> Maximus IV GENE-Z
> Maximus IV Extreme-Z
> 
> My Minneapolis Microcenter list:
> 
> $289.99
> Maximus V Formula LGA 1155 Z77 ATX Intel Motherboard with Assassin's Creed III Bundle
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/405600/Maximus_V_Formula_LGA_1155_Z77_ATX_Intel_Motherboard_with_Assassin's_Creed_III_Bundle
> 
> or
> $379 for
> Maximus V Extreme LGA 1155 Intel Z77 Extended ATX Intel Motherboard
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/397079/Maximus_V_Extreme_LGA_1155_Intel_Z77_Extended_ATX_Intel_Motherboard
> 
> Formula or GENE or Extreme? extreme is better than formula? these are both better than GENE?
> 
> III or IV or V? v is newer than IV is newer than III! right?
> 
> any of these seem fine but i want a full loop including multi-graphics eventually.
> i like the water cooled heatsinks on the FORMULA Why does it cost less?
> 
> Which one is the top dog?


G1 Sniper 3 is better then all those boards besides the MVG

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128552 269$


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Ahem for the Z77 OC Formula: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asrock-z77-extreme3_7.html#sect0

Spoiler Alert: Top of the charts


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Ahem for the Z77 OC Formula: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asrock-z77-extreme3_7.html#sect0
> 
> Spoiler Alert: Top of the charts


LoL Asrock is nothing compared to top tier Gigabyte boards and Asus boards...

Do not make me Call Sin in here


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Ahem for the Z77 OC Formula: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asrock-z77-extreme3_7.html#sect0
> 
> Spoiler Alert: Top of the charts


...seems to be missing a few top boards though...here is one from the Swiss overclock site 'ocaholic'

http://www.ocaholic.ch/xoops/html/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=734&page=0

...perhaps by combining reviews, a more complete picture emerges >>> my old socket 370 is best


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> As I said my chip is getting a new home - a permanent home - then on to intels Haswell
> vvv This is confusing the heck out of me!
> Maximus V Formula Game Bundled Edition
> Crosshair V Formula-Z
> Maximus V Extreme
> Maximus V Formula/ThunderFX
> Maximus V Formula
> Maximus V GENE
> Rampage IV GENE
> Rampage IV Extreme/BATTLEFIELD 3
> Rampage IV Extreme
> Rampage III GENE
> Rampage III Formula
> Crosshair IV Formula
> Crosshair IV Extreme
> Rampage III Extreme
> Crosshair V Formula
> Maximus IV Extreme
> Maximus IV GENE-Z
> Maximus IV Extreme-Z
> 
> My Minneapolis Microcenter list:
> 
> $289.99
> Maximus V Formula LGA 1155 Z77 ATX Intel Motherboard with Assassin's Creed III Bundle
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/405600/Maximus_V_Formula_LGA_1155_Z77_ATX_Intel_Motherboard_with_Assassin's_Creed_III_Bundle
> 
> or
> $379 for
> Maximus V Extreme LGA 1155 Intel Z77 Extended ATX Intel Motherboard
> http://www.microcenter.com/product/397079/Maximus_V_Extreme_LGA_1155_Intel_Z77_Extended_ATX_Intel_Motherboard
> 
> Formula or GENE or Extreme? extreme is better than formula? these are both better than GENE?
> 
> 
> III or IV or V? v is newer than IV is newer than III! right?
> 
> any of these seem fine but i want a full loop including multi-graphics eventually.
> i like the water cooled heatsinks on the FORMULA Why does it cost less?
> 
> Which one is the top dog?


Which one is the top dog? Well in terms of just overall performance, it'd be the Extreme.

To explain what those numbers mean, they represent the type of socket.

V is the one you want because it is 1155 (Z77)
IV is the older version which is also 1155 but on P67
III is really old and it is used for the 1366 socket

Anything that says RAMPAGE is for X79 (So instead of Maximus, it says RAMPAGE)

I'd go for the Formula only because it gives you the options for more GPUs later down the road. The Extreme is really just a Formula with more technology that will only be utilized if you really need it now because if you don't use it now, chances are you won't use it down the road.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Which one is the top dog? Well in terms of just overall performance, it'd be the Extreme.
> 
> To explain what those numbers mean, they represent the type of socket.
> 
> V is the one you want because it is 1155 (Z77)
> IV is the older version which is also 1155 but on P67
> III is really old and it is used for the 1366 socket
> 
> Anything that says RAMPAGE is for X79 (So instead of Maximus, it says RAMPAGE)
> 
> I'd go for the Formula only because it gives you the options for more GPUs later down the road. The Extreme is really just a Formula with more technology that will only be utilized if you really need it now because if you don't use it now, chances are you won't use it down the road.


...also, 'Extreme', apart from some extra tech features, allows you to run *Quad SLI / CF*


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Which one is the top dog? Well in terms of just overall performance, it'd be the Extreme.
> 
> To explain what those numbers mean, they represent the type of socket.
> 
> V is the one you want because it is 1155 (Z77)
> IV is the older version which is also 1155 but on P67
> III is really old and it is used for the 1366 socket
> 
> Anything that says RAMPAGE is for X79 (So instead of Maximus, it says RAMPAGE)
> 
> I'd go for the Formula only because it gives you the options for more GPUs later down the road. The Extreme is really just a Formula with more technology that will only be utilized if you really need it now because if you don't use it now, chances are you won't use it down the road.
> 
> 
> 
> ...also, 'Extreme', apart from some extra tech features, allows you to run *Quad SLI / CF*
Click to expand...

This too. Although, I honestly doubt hes going to do quad SLI because of the fact that he's looking for a cheaper option. The most I'd do for myself for gaming would be 2 GPUs. I don't see a point in quad SLI for me because all I do is surf the web, play games like CS (nothing too extreme), and try to OC my stuff to the max.







My brother's getting into sub-zero and I'm letting him sort all the problems out himself. He made a mistake when he was putting down my pot and he didn't know why his CPU wasn't booting....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys, it's simple...Gigabyte has nice vrm, but their bioses are not as good as Asus.
Asrock has not-so-good boards except for the OC Formula which is on par with the best by Asus or Gigabyte, whilst being cheaper.
Get your facts straight Hokies, I know you like GB but the MVG is the better board for benching, the OC Formula for a higher budget, and then MVE or UP7. That defines better for me, how good they are for benching.
For normal usage even a z77x-d3h like VonDutch's would do fine.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This too. Although, I honestly doubt hes going to do quad SLI because of the fact that he's looking for a cheaper option. The most I'd do for myself for gaming would be 2 GPUs. I don't see a point in quad SLI for me because all I do is surf the web, play games like CS (nothing too extreme), and try to OC my stuff to the max.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My brother's getting into sub-zero and I'm letting him sort all the problems out himself. He made a mistake when he was putting down my pot and he didn't know why his CPU wasn't booting....


...the ROG Extreme (and its counterpart, the Gigabyte xxxxx UP7) are for a specific sub group only (incl. LN2 etc)...their extra PCI lanes via Plex chip give you more options, ie compared to running dual GPU cards in two PCIe slots, which tend to be a bit slower than quad discreet GPUs of the same genre. But your point is well taken...according to the manager at the NCIX I go to, 'Extreme' and 'UP7' have the highest return ratio...not because of RMA / faults, but because they are too tricky to set up / overkill / price-performance

...btw, you did not trade your brother in for tri-SLI Titans after all ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys, it's simple...Gigabyte has nice vrm, but their bioses are not as good as Asus.
> Asrock has ****ty boards except for the OC Formula which is on par with the best by Asus or Gigabyte, whilst being cheaper.
> Get your facts straight Hokies, I know you like GB but the MVG is the better board for benching, the OC Formula for a higher budget, and then MVE or UP7. That defines better for me, how good they are for benching.
> For normal usage even a z77x-d3h like VonDutch's would do fine.


My Facts are straight..

Get your eyes checked and read again.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Umm. I like my MVE. Me thinks its cool







Lets just take a step back guys. No need to start anything. Everyone has their own opinions and that is what makes us human right??


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Ahem for the Z77 OC Formula: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asrock-z77-extreme3_7.html#sect0
> 
> Spoiler Alert: Top of the charts
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...seems to be missing a few top boards though...here is one from the Swiss overclock site 'ocaholic'
> 
> http://www.ocaholic.ch/xoops/html/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=734&page=0
> 
> ...perhaps by combining reviews, a more complete picture emerges >>> my old socket 370 is best
Click to expand...

I think there is a flaw in their testing methods when they show an Intel board beating the OC Formula, where xbit showed that board was near the bottom of all the benches which is in line with what other reviews find.


----------



## TonicX

reply to Hockies83:
Thanks for your input. rep1 Could you give a reason or two why you personally think it is better. I did check-out your link and looked at your build again x3 now.
I would think you would perfer the red MOBO!?! what's up man? gimme one reason.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> reply to Hockies83:
> Thanks for your input. rep1 Could you give a reason or two why you personally think it is better. I did check-out your link and looked at your build again x3 now.
> I would think you would perfer the red MOBO!?! what's up man? gimme one reason.


Yes id rather have a MVG.

Got the G1 sniper Very cheap Cough cough.

The Gigabyte G1 Sniper is better then every Z77 board besides the MVG and UP7 when it comes to features and options.

The MVF does not even have a PLX chip...

And at the 269$ price range nothing can touch it... The gaming features and the 100$ onboard audio....

You run 2 way cf / sli @ pci-3.0 @ 16x 16x im running Tri fire at 16x8x8 Which the MVG will do aswell but i have the gaming features and a 100$ audio card to boot that the MVG does not...

MVG is a bencher's board.

But you still have people who do not even know how to apply tim buy them lol when they will never get into the LN2 overclocking that boards like the MVG and UP7 were designed for.

Us happy with 5ghz + on water do not need that.


----------



## SDBolts619

I keep coming back to the idea of delidding my 3770k. I'm currently stable at 4.5ghz, 1.27 fixed with P95 temps peaking at about 80-81. If I go delidded, I could expect to see those drop into the mid-60's to 70 degree range, right? Which means I can probably push 4.8ghz at somewhere in the 1.35-1.40 range at about 80-85 degrees? Does that sound reasonable and achievable?

Can anyone also let me know what the normal delivery time is for Collaboratory Ultra?


----------



## dr/owned

^^ I'm at 4.7 right now with 1.35V and mid 80s under load (non-delidded). It's not 100% stable (fails Prime95 after an hour) because I haven't bothered to use anything but ASRock's Nick Shih profiles which can be tuned a bit.

So yeah delidding would make what you want possible. It's around 4 days from FrozenCPU to your door using First Class.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I think Hokies meant MVE...the MVG only has two pci-e slots.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SDBolts619*
> 
> I keep coming back to the idea of delidding my 3770k. I'm currently stable at 4.5ghz, 1.27 fixed with P95 temps peaking at about 80-81. If I go delidded, I could expect to see those drop into the mid-60's to 70 degree range, right? Which means I can probably push 4.8ghz at somewhere in the 1.35-1.40 range at about 80-85 degrees? Does that sound reasonable and achievable?
> 
> Can anyone also let me know what the normal delivery time is for Collaboratory Ultra?


In my experience your numbers are too optimistic. If you need 1.27v to completely stabilize 4.5, then I would estimate you would need in the range of 1.45v for 4.8.

Your chip is a little voltage hungry, so that will limit you to a degree. If your delidding is successful and your TIM application works as we hope then you could probably do 4.8 at 1.45v and have testing temps in the 80s.

CLU can be had in less than a week from Amazon or Frozen if they have stock.


----------



## TonicX

Oh crap i just shuck the tree to hard now the ASRock guys come out. well i'm trying to narrow down the search! but, What the Heck. Hockies83 says gigabyte and i have an old gigabyte with double thick copper that is indestructable on my Quad Core Chip. but Quad SLI is so much overkill i havta laugh, ahem. This build is going to have a firm color scheme and the sniper would really set me down a challenging path theme-wise with the brite green (I would bet ...nevermind). OK i will look at the top two ASRock boards, i never owned one, i know nothing about them. LETS PLAY JEOPARDY. Top 1155 OC MOBO for 1000.


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think Hokies meant MVE...the MVG only has two pci-e slots.


three


----------



## TonicX

I'm gunna need verification on that.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SDBolts619*
> 
> I keep coming back to the idea of delidding my 3770k. I'm currently stable at 4.5ghz, 1.27 fixed with P95 temps peaking at about 80-81. If I go delidded, I could expect to see those drop into the mid-60's to 70 degree range, right? Which means I can probably push 4.8ghz at somewhere in the 1.35-1.40 range at about 80-85 degrees? Does that sound reasonable and achievable?
> 
> Can anyone also let me know what the normal delivery time is for Collaboratory Ultra?


..re CoolLab order, mine took about 9 days (though 5 of which it was stuck at a depot in the Netherlands via online tracking info)

...re temps / v-core, it ultimately depends on your specific chip, but yes, it is possible (pics are for 100% load via Aida64 Stability Test)...you'll see 5 GHZ twice...the changed desktop background indicates post-delid, though still prior to a subsequent custom water loop upgrade










Spoiler: 4.8 - 5.2 GHz: Spoiler!


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> three


Well, I can't imagine I will ever use more than dual SLI cards so that brings me back to MVG. does anyone really liquid cool the cpu vrm zone like the MVF supports. I see SNIPER has this too.


----------



## dr/owned

^^ The OC Formula has the ability to watercool the VRMs and comes stock with a 40mm fan on the heatsink. I have the fan turned off and no watercooling and it's only warm to the touch. Watercooling would just be pointless.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think Hokies meant MVE...the MVG only has two pci-e slots.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> three
Click to expand...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> three


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Well, I can't imagine I will ever use more than dual SLI cards so that brings me back to MVG. does anyone really liquid cool the cpu vrm zone like the MVF supports. I see SNIPER has this too.


Wc for vrm is only for AMD or x79.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*


My thoughts exactly...unless you wanna use a pci-e riser to put a card there, but it's gonna take a performance hit. (unless you're a miner like that Minecraft guy)


----------



## TonicX

Performance-PCs.com sent me Coollaboratory Ultra in 4 days regular US Postal Mail.


----------



## Hokies83

If ur gonna water cool gpus and dont mind 8x8x then id have to suggest the MVG...

You can find them used for 130$ = 150$

LoL just do not put that MATX board in a HUGE case lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

8x pci-e 3.0 is = pci-e 2.0 16x anyway...You're not gonna bottleneck that bandiwidh with two gpus unless you get two Titans and overclock them violently. If anything you take a 2% performance hit even then.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Wc for vrm is only for AMD or x79.
> My thoughts exactly...unless you wanna use a pci-e riser to put a card there, but it's gonna take a performance hit. (unless you're a miner like that Minecraft guy)


....as already stated, the MVE (with Plex and 5 PCIe) is a 'specialty board', but it (and for that matter its very similar Rampage 4 X79) come with some unique features that I find highly useful.

First, the PCIe slots

...both the MVE and the Gigabyte Z77 counterpart, the UP7, are geared towards two sub markets (and we happen to fit both here). The first is the 'speed' market, what with LN2 profiles on the MVE / Rampage IV X79, voltage read-out points, OC key for overlay and OF COURSE over-volting features for multiple VGA cards (hard-wired PLUS BIOS)...what is also great is the ability to switch off lanes on the board, without taking extra cards out...when you run tri-SLI and quad-SLI, and water-cool, you'll have a serious jungle of power cables and cooling tubes that can get in the way of moving things around...never mind the Bios profiles of those boards which can be a bit overwhelming but nonetheless, if you are into speed - that's what you want.

...the second sub market is actually a small but growing niche of 'semi-commercial'...given the price of these boards, they end up in the 'WS Work Station' market as well. When 'I am done with the fun' re both the MVE Z77 and Rampage IV X79, they'll be moved to a Virtual Machine (VM) complex that already includes 6x 3770 (non-K) machines...the extra PCIe lanes become very handy there as hub machines that will get PCIe cards with 4x Intel 10 Gigabit NICs each and Hard drive clusters (LSI cards)...still too early in the game to figure out if our type of proprietary software can also be easily ($ cost) enough re-written to benefit from 'Tesla' / Intel Phi type co-processing - but for either, we again would need extra PCIe slots.

There is no doubt that boards like the ROGs M-V-E and R-IV-E are not meant for the main stream - ditto for the Gigabyte UP7...but they do have market(s) nonetheless, and are very much appreciated


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 8x pci-e 3.0 is = pci-e 2.0 16x anyway...You're not gonna bottleneck that bandiwidh with two gpus unless you get two Titans and overclock them violently. If anything you take a 2% performance hit even then.


2% is 2%

An im speaking of pci-e 3.0 x 16 vs pci-e 3.0 x8.

I need every bit of power out of my Gpu's / cpu for my gaming needs.

However thereis a gaming feature rich MATX board that supports pci-e 3.0 x16 x16

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128551









There so much better then the other boards in the price range... Gigabyte should give more color options =/


----------



## Swag

God, thank you guys, you guys are all saying you all prefer the MVG. Makes me feel happy about my purchase.







I was going to get the Formula but I didn't see the point since I was only going to use 2 PCIE slots, but after everyone was getting the Formula/Extreme, I started getting buyers' remorse!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This too. Although, I honestly doubt hes going to do quad SLI because of the fact that he's looking for a cheaper option. The most I'd do for myself for gaming would be 2 GPUs. I don't see a point in quad SLI for me because all I do is surf the web, play games like CS (nothing too extreme), and try to OC my stuff to the max.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My brother's getting into sub-zero and I'm letting him sort all the problems out himself. He made a mistake when he was putting down my pot and he didn't know why his CPU wasn't booting....
> 
> 
> 
> ...the ROG Extreme (and its counterpart, the Gigabyte xxxxx UP7) are for a specific sub group only (incl. LN2 etc)...their extra PCI lanes via Plex chip give you more options, ie compared to running dual GPU cards in two PCIe slots, which tend to be a bit slower than quad discreet GPUs of the same genre. But your point is well taken...according to the manager at the NCIX I go to, 'Extreme' and 'UP7' have the highest return ratio...not because of RMA / faults, but because they are too tricky to set up / overkill / price-performance
> 
> ...btw, you did not trade your brother in for tri-SLI Titans after all ?
Click to expand...

I weighed the options and found out it'd be easier for my brother to keep buying me random stuff because the Titans didn't seem too good. I'd wait for the next roll of dual-GPUs.

And, personally, I like Asus boards, the next brand would probably be Gigabyte boards.

@TonicX

What are you looking for in a board and what is your max price range? Also, with the max price range, if it's worth it, how much more are you willing to drop?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, true true...Now imagine if Intel sold unlocked 8 core xeons for 2011 socket. SR-X + two of them would make many IT guys drool and drive their bosses mad









The MVG is favored by many benchers cause of the price performance, for benching that is.
For a gamer, with one or two gpus in mind, it's good, but there are cheaper options like the UD3H or UD5H.


----------



## Hokies83

169$


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, true true...Now imagine if Intel sold unlocked 8 core xeons for 2011 socket. SR-X + two of them would make many IT guys drool and drive their bosses mad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The MVG is favored by many benchers cause of the price performance, for benching that is.
> For a gamer, with one or two gpus in mind, it's good, but there are cheaper options like the UD3H or UD5H.


...funny that you mentioned that





















- we were looking at the SR-X, but Intel did not play ball (and Shamino went from EVGA to Asus and had a major hand in the MVE)


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, true true...Now imagine if Intel sold unlocked 8 core xeons for 2011 socket. SR-X + two of them would make many IT guys drool and drive their bosses mad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The MVG is favored by many benchers cause of the price performance, for benching that is.
> For a gamer, with one or two gpus in mind, it's good, but there are cheaper options like the UD3H or UD5H.


I still prefer Asus overclockabilty over the UD series.







I like my MVG, I game and I bench and the price/performance (like you said) is unbeatable!

By the way:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







And my server again:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I still prefer Asus overclockabilty over the UD series.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like my MVG, I game and I bench and the price/performance (like you said) is unbeatable!
> 
> By the way:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And my server again:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


...you need more RAM sticks







...made by Rolex ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Rolex cpu (?)


----------



## MattyMatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea just order it straight from them. Even when the syringe was leaking a little bit they took my word for it and sent me a brand new one for free. Now I have the leaking one which is still usable and a brand new one that is still in the package. That is how you know you are dealing with a great company!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I ordered it direct from Germany at Coollab's online shop (PayPal credit card setup - easy)...first part of the journey to Canada (BC) was via DHL, then CanadaPost...arrived with no extra fees / taxes...


How much did delivery cost? If its not too bad, Ill go ahead with that.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Rolex cpu (?)


...can only delid those with a gold-plated razor !!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *I still prefer Asus overclockabilty* over the UD series.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like my MVG, I game and I bench and the price/performance (like you said) is unbeatable!
> 
> By the way:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And my server again:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


So you like how u change voltage and the Multi with the colors in there screen vs the colors of other company's?

Well if were thinken like that i perfer the classic bios look.



When i seen my Bios with black and orange colors i was lost and confused @[email protected]


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattyMatt*
> 
> How much did delivery cost? If its not too bad, Ill go ahead with that.


...I had ordered a few other things as well in addition to 6 tubes of CoolLab stuff, including a water-block, some cooling liquids etc...so a bigger box...all told for these extra items as well, 'extra-cost' for fast(ish) delivery was about $25-$30, though in retrospect, for just a few tubes of CL LM without any of the other stuff, I would just go for their regular cheaper delivery option...btw, you can do a dry run re ordering at their online shop and see delivery cost options geared towards your specific purchase.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> So you like how u change voltage and the Multi with the colors in there screen vs the colors of other company's?
> 
> Well if were thinken like that i perfer the classic bios look.


Go look at the hwbot results if you don't believe me...Asus bios is superior compared to GB, most benchers use those. Some use the ud5h and up7 nowadays, but still, I prefer the MVG for tweaking stuff. my ud5h had tons of problems with Samsung ic rams, hyk0, which most high end kits these days have.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Go look at the hwbot results if you don't believe me...Asus bios is superior compared to GB, most benchers use those. Some use the ud5h and up7 nowadays, but still, I prefer the MVG for tweaking stuff. my ud5h had tons of problems with Samsung ic rams, hyk0, which most high end kits these days have.


LoL

Dude....

LoL....










There the samething with different colors LOL

You can change Voltage in one.. so does the other.. you can change the multi u can aswell with the other.

People use Asus ROG boards because the UP7 was late to the show.. and 9 out of 10 people perfer black and red vs black and neon green.

I had a RE3 so umm yah....

get real here cause im to smart to be fooled by the non sense.

Ive also been running just about the highest 3770k OC for a VERY long time in our little thread









In the Gigabyte bios u gotta rub 2 sticks together to change the Core voltage and the Multi.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ....as already stated, the MVE (with Plex and 5 PCIe) is a 'specialty board', but it (and for that matter its very similar Rampage 4 X79) come with some unique features that I find highly useful.
> 
> First, the PCIe slots
> 
> ...both the MVE and the Gigabyte Z77 counterpart, the UP7, are geared towards two sub markets (and we happen to fit both here). The first is the 'speed' market, what with LN2 profiles on the MVE / Rampage IV X79, voltage read-out points, OC key for overlay and OF COURSE over-volting features for multiple VGA cards (hard-wired PLUS BIOS)...what is also great is the ability to switch off lanes on the board, without taking extra cards out...when you run tri-SLI and quad-SLI, and water-cool, you'll have a serious jungle of power cables and cooling tubes that can get in the way of moving things around...never mind the Bios profiles of those boards which can be a bit overwhelming but nonetheless, if you are into speed - that's what you want.
> 
> ...the second sub market is actually a small but growing niche of 'semi-commercial'...given the price of these boards, they end up in the 'WS Work Station' market as well. When 'I am done with the fun' re both the MVE Z77 and Rampage IV X79, they'll be moved to a Virtual Machine (VM) complex that already includes 6x 3770 (non-K) machines...the extra PCIe lanes become very handy there as hub machines that will get PCIe cards with 4x Intel 10 Gigabit NICs each and Hard drive clusters (LSI cards)...still too early in the game to figure out if our type of proprietary software can also be easily ($ cost) enough re-written to benefit from 'Tesla' / Intel Phi type co-processing - but for either, we again would need extra PCIe slots.
> 
> There is no doubt that boards like the ROGs M-V-E and R-IV-E are not meant for the main stream - ditto for the Gigabyte UP7...but they do have market(s) nonetheless, and are very much appreciated


rep from TonicX for in -depth Answers.

Yeah, Good- Since im trying to find a good home, a permanent home for my Delidded IVY BRIDGE chip, I am certainly looking way down the road and trying to anticipate what i will want then. It's really pretty simple: I want a benching, gaming, rendering, oced, wc, ivy platform. and in a year or more, after i get haswell, this will be just a Cinema 4d render client. and that will be my benching, gaming, rendering, oced, wc, platform.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nevermind man...I'll stick to my board once I get an RMA. If I had gotten a GB board I would be up and running in less time though...food for thought (Asus support kinda sucks)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nevermind man...I'll stick to my board once I get an RMA. If I had gotten a GB board I would be up and running in less time though...food for thought (Asus support kinda sucks)


Gigabyte fixed my board for Damages i caused in 1 week. for free.

Get Asus to do that lol.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I still prefer Asus overclockabilty over the UD series.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like my MVG, I game and I bench and the price/performance (like you said) is unbeatable!
> 
> By the way:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And my server again:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I'm not trying to save money on the MOBO. down the road a $200 or $300 board is all the same. I just dont want to wish i bought something else or feel the need to replace/upgrade from here.
Ive had good micro atx boards before a two slots has been all i've needed so far. lets face it this stuff is changing and new stuff is comeing down the pipe so fast by the time i finish this build, it will be time to move on to the next tech! and thats ok the I enjoy the hardware side of developement as much as the latest 3d plug-ins for Cinema 4D or after Effects for example. Actually it is imperative that i get multi-threaded processors that get hot and need Water, and and air flow design consideration . ect. Because I need a Powerful render machine and want a fast gaming rig. I have enjoyed building PC computer since 1995 and dont recone i'll get board with it soon.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Gigabyte fixed my board for Damages i caused in 1 week. for free.
> 
> Get Asus to do that lol.


No way! lmao
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> I'm not trying to save money on the MOBO. down the road a $200 or $300 board is all the same. I just dont want to wish i bought something else or feel the need to replace/upgrade from here.
> Ive had good micro atx boards before a two slots has been all i've needed so far. lets face it this stuff is changing and new stuff is comeing down the pipe so fast by the time i finish this build, it will be time to move on to the next tech! and thats ok the I enjoy the hardware side of developement as much as the latest 3d plug-ins for Cinema 4D or after Effects for example. Actually it is imperative that i get multi-threaded processors that get hot and need Water, and and air flow design consideration . ect. Because I need a Powerful render machine and want a fast gaming rig. I have enjoyed building PC computer since 1995 and dont recone i'll get board with it soon.


Multi threaded is x79 ground, although a 3770k does fine for most stuff for less.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> *I still prefer Asus overclockabilty* over the UD series.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like my MVG, I game and I bench and the price/performance (like you said) is unbeatable!
> 
> By the way:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And my server again:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> So you like how u change voltage and the Multi with the colors in there screen vs the colors of other company's?
> 
> Well if were thinken like that i perfer the classic bios look.
> 
> 
> 
> When i seen my Bios with black and orange colors i was lost and confused @[email protected]
Click to expand...

Not that I like the look of the Asus UEFI, I prefer the original BIOS look. Although, I've had better results with Asus board vs my Gigabyte board during the 1366 era.

Also, Asus replaced my MVG when my PSU blew up in 2 weeks free of charge without the need to pay for shipping.







Well I paid at first and then they reimbursed me.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Wish me luck mate...


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL
> 
> Dude....
> 
> LoL....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There the samething with different colors LOL
> 
> You can change Voltage in one.. so does the other.. you can change the multi u can aswell with the other.
> 
> People use Asus ROG boards because the UP7 was late to the show.. and 9 out of 10 people perfer black and red vs black and neon green.
> 
> I had a RE3 so umm yah....
> 
> get real here cause im to smart to be fooled by the non sense.
> 
> Ive also been running just about the highest 3770k OC for a VERY long time in our little thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In the Gigabyte bios u gotta rub 2 sticks together to change the Core voltage and the Multi.


yeah Hokies83 your prolly right about that. I didn't know when up7 came out. but, I as much as we value function over form on this thread, looks still matter - it is a consideration. to some all red may be boring design wise but if i hade Hokies83 's rig i might try bring some more neon green into it or go primary with some blue. just spitballing here.


----------



## TonicX

dub post edit- sry


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Wish me luck mate...


...good luck with your MVG RMA


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> No way! lmao
> Multi threaded is x79 ground, although a 3770k does fine for most stuff for less.


well right - the 3770k at 4.9 Ghz is 3x faster at rendering than my quad core from 2008. and i cannot spent $1000 on a chip (in this economy- cough) now i gotta research x79 thanks for the lead - rep given for laughing your ao!


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Not that I like the look of the Asus UEFI, I prefer the original BIOS look. Although, I've had better results with Asus board vs my Gigabyte board during the 1366 era.
> 
> Also, Asus replaced my MVG when my PSU blew up in 2 weeks free of charge without the need to pay for shipping.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well I paid at first and then they reimbursed me.


Wow very nice. All this talk about the MVG just might push me to buy one, and this business between you and Asus about the PSU makes my decision so much easier. Eventually everyone thats a 'Delidded Crewman' is going to own a MVG Maximus if this trend continues


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Wow very nice. All this talk about the MVG just might push me to buy one, and this business between you and Asus about the PSU makes my decision so much easier. Eventually everyone thats a *'Delidded Crewman' is going to own an MVG*.


Not me i have a Mans case...

MVG in my case is like SHAQ driving a Miata



My E-ATX board is not even big enough XD but it is large enough not to look bad.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Not me i have a Mans case...
> 
> MVG in my case is like SHAQ driving a Miata
> 
> 
> 
> My E-ATX board is not even big enough XD but it is large enough not to look bad.


No doubt about that man. Thats why edited my post. The MVE looks like it would play the part though.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Not me i have a Mans case...
> 
> MVG in my case is like SHAQ driving a Miata
> 
> 
> 
> My E-ATX board is not even big enough XD but it is large enough not to look bad.


Where's the mini-person in the Cars shirt?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where's the mini-person in the Cars shirt?







This one?

He is playing Wii









My loop is pretty funny...

My Idle temps are Avg...

i7 3770k 1.55v 5.1ghz Max temp 3 cores 55c 1 core 58c Idle... 3 cores 27c 1 core 32c

3x 7950 1200 mhz / 1500 mem

Top card idle 34c top card max load 41c

2nd card idle 27c max load 34c

3rd card idle 27c max load 35c..

LoL Guess the way i have flow running makes the top card the hottest.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol, his expression in the last one is like "this rig is full of win, huh?" xD


----------



## stickg1

lol he's a cutie for sure


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Not me i have a Mans case...
> 
> MVG in my case is like SHAQ driving a Miata
> 
> 
> 
> My E-ATX board is not even big enough XD but it is large enough not to look bad.


I've put two MOBO IN a smaller case with PSUs but they were only Air cooled.







Maybe you could fit a tropical fish tank in there, run coils through it to cool and symbiotically warm the fish. "Were is NEMO? Hes in the blazing GPU again!"


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where's the mini-person in the Cars shirt?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This one?
> 
> He is playing Wii
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My loop is pretty funny...
> 
> My Idle temps are Avg...
> 
> i7 3770k 1.55v 5.1ghz Max temp 3 cores 55c 1 core 58c Idle... 3 cores 27c 1 core 32c
> 
> 3x 7950 1200 mhz / 1500 mem
> 
> Top card idle 34c top card max load 41c
> 
> 2nd card idle 27c max load 34c
> 
> 3rd card idle 27c max load 35c..
> 
> LoL Guess the way i have flow running makes the top card the hottest.
Click to expand...

Sorry but are you filipino? Your kid kinda looks like it, that's why.









Also, what's the best Korean monitor on the block right now? My brother is looking for a new monitor and I have Crossovers but I bought them a while back.


----------



## Hokies83

It drops to this when i enter the menu donno why.. but i hold a steady 120fps.. with 3 7950s...

My 2 Gtx 680 4Gbs with 1220mhz / + 350 Overclocks would be anywhere from 20fps to 40fps...

High res textures everything MAxxed OUT.

Yes sir a 8350 will not do that







i was bottle necking Cpu side all they way to 4.7ghz... 60fps is easy.. 120fps is a whole nother level...

@ 2560x1440


----------



## ivanlabrie

Fish tank reservoir? xD


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sorry but are you filipino? Your kid kinda looks like it, that's why.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, what's the best Korean monitor on the block right now? My brother is looking for a new monitor and I have Crossovers but I bought them a while back.


Im White.... My wife is Vietnamese.



As far as the monitor goes there all LG panels so ima go with Imput Lag +price as best....


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Fish tank reservoir? xD


That would look awesome. My chiller res is a fish tank, unfortunately its covered in armaflex.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can always have a transparent chiller res filled with glycol and fake plastic fish...xD

http://www.overclockers.com/fishtank-watercooling/
http://www.ioncross.com/dammitall/fishtank/


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can always have a transparent chiller res filled with glycol and fake plastic fish...xD











My kids would love it.

just saw your edit. That is actually an awesome idea....


----------



## Joa3d43

*FtW 420* and *IvanL*

...thanks for the memory tips yesterday (FtW: tried some of your PM-tips on the 3770K memory - result below) ...armed with them, took my MVE and 2 of the 670ies for a walk up the 'staircase to heaven'

















Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## ivanlabrie

3dm11 combined test and Vantage cpu score reflect 3d ram efficiency well from what I gather...I normally go by maxxmem scores though, but so I heard. I have yet to test it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 3dm11 combined test and Vantage cpu score reflect 3d ram efficiency well from what I gather...I normally go by maxxmem scores though, but so I heard. I have yet to test it.


...for those, I'll try the Rampage / 3970X with the same vid cards next week...Vantage should benefit from the Hexacore, ditto for 3dm11 combined...Heaven and also Valley are sensitive to a variety of factors, including mem sub...though they behave differently re extra BCLK clocks


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...for those, I'll try the Rampage / 3970X with the same vid cards next week...Vantage should benefit from the Hexacore, ditto for 3dm11 combined...Heaven and also Valley are sensitive to a variety of factors, including mem sub...though they behave differently re extra BCLK clocks


Yeah, your nvidia cards will do fine for those benchies as well...you're gonna get some good scores!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, your nvidia cards will do fine for those benchies as well...you're gonna get some good scores!


...hope so.

Have you started the RMA process yet on your MVG ? I'm no expert (I have never RMAed anything in 20 years of overclocking), but I heard there is an option whereby you use your credit card and they get you a new one right a way until the other one shows up (for a relatively small fee, of course)...I mention it in case you don't want to wait two months or whatever estimate you had given earlier. Anyways, I hope it works out







- being without my fav board would bug me.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...hope so.
> 
> Have you started the RMA process yet on your MVG ? I'm no expert (I have never RMAed anything in 20 years of overclocking), but I heard there is an option whereby you use your credit card and they get you a new one right a way until the other one shows up (for a relatively small fee, of course)...I mention it in case you don't want to wait two months or whatever estimate you had given earlier. Anyways, I hope it works out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - being without my fav board would bug me.


Nope, I would need to send it to the US for that...a friend got it for me there.
I'll see if the local Asus support can repair it for a fee, and if not then I'll ship it back to Tx.


----------



## stickg1

There's an ASUS Argentina? That's rad!

Although I'd be weary of anyone in a Boca Juniors or Lionel Messi shirt.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You can always have a transparent chiller res filled with glycol and fake plastic fish...xD
> 
> http://www.overclockers.com/fishtank-watercooling/
> http://www.ioncross.com/dammitall/fishtank/


fake fish ... phff ... what is symbiotically about that. you dont get it man! the Processor heat can be used to benefit life, thereby making the planet gooder. sheesus! Unless the fake fish fit the color scheme... wow.. then i would be subbed!
I think a thermostate to stop the fish tank from over-heating needs developemnent. warm-water = good. IVY BRIDGE = boiled blue beta fish batman.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hokies (or someone) would you be able to help me out? I'm planning everything for my water loop and I'm wondering how I would connect my two 7950's. They have one free slot between them right now. What would I have to buy to connect them? Could you send me a link? I would like it in black. I have no idea what they are called. At first I thought you were supposed to connect them with a tube, but then I seen your picture and it looks like some type of compression fitting or something in between them. I'm going to be running one loop and am soon going to add a 3rd 7950.

GoAlso, I am looking at tubing right now and I see that some say 3/8 x 1/2 and some say 3/8 x 5/8. Why is there two sizes for 3/8? Would either fit on something specified to use 3/8? Is there one that would be better to get?

Here is my list so far:

(2x) Sidewinder Custom tapped MCP655 / Laing D5 with G 1/4 Threads - $180
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/sicumclad5wi.html
EK Supremacy - Acetal CPU Water Block - $77
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/cpu-blocks/ek-supremacy-acetal.html
(2x) EK-FC7950 - Acetal VGA Water Block - $218
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/ati-radeon-full-cover-blocks/radeon-hd-7xx0-series/ek-fc7950-acetal.html
Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 360mm - $70
http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p979_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-360mm.html
Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 240mm - $50
http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p977_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-240mm.html
Alphacool NexXxoS XT45 Full Copper 140mm - $55
http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p987_Alphacool-NexXxoS-XT45-Full-Copper-140mm.html


----------



## TonicX

Hi - RavageTheEarth - i asked you about you new MOBO a few pages back but anyway looks like i'm leaning towards MVG or MVE.

btw - waterloops: have you seen this thread?
http://www.overclock.net/t/1339010/build-log-an-old-mans-first-blinged-out-water-build
he has a good sense of humor and does not hide his mistakes, for our benefit. enjoy, i read 1-15 of 30 pages tonight and will finish it later.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hokies (or someone) would you be able to help me out? I'm planning everything for my water loop and I'm wondering how I would connect my two 7950's. They have one free slot between them right now. What would I have to buy to connect them? Could you send me a link? I would like it in black. I have no idea what they are called. At first I thought you were supposed to connect them with a tube, but then I seen your picture and it looks like some type of compression fitting or something in between them. I'm going to be running one loop and am soon going to add a 3rd 7950.
> 
> GoAlso, I am looking at tubing right now and I see that some say 3/8 x 1/2 and some say 3/8 x 5/8. Why is there two sizes for 3/8? Would either fit on something specified to use 3/8? Is there one that would be better to get?
> 
> Here is my list so far:
> 
> (2x) Sidewinder Custom tapped MCP655 / Laing D5 with G 1/4 Threads - $180
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/sicumclad5wi.html
> EK Supremacy - Acetal CPU Water Block - $77
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/cpu-blocks/ek-supremacy-acetal.html
> (2x) EK-FC7950 - Acetal VGA Water Block - $218
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/ati-radeon-full-cover-blocks/radeon-hd-7xx0-series/ek-fc7950-acetal.html
> Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 360mm - $70
> http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p979_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-360mm.html
> Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 240mm - $50
> http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p977_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-240mm.html
> Alphacool NexXxoS XT45 Full Copper 140mm - $55
> http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p987_Alphacool-NexXxoS-XT45-Full-Copper-140mm.html


http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=bitspower+aqua+link

Im using 4 of these they are for normal spacing like you would need for 3x 7950s.
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=35668&zenid=c001d7963ba43665accf330b8e0ed590
for 2 u may need the longer one.

The tubing is like this 3/8 inner " how wide inside of the tube is " 1/2 outter " how wide the out side of the tube is.

I use 1/2 3/4 myself.. it is harder to work with.

Btw u kno u can get Alphaacool water blocks? would match the rads.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=bitspower+aqua+link
> 
> Im using 4 of these they are for normal spacing like you would need for 3x 7950s.
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=35668&zenid=c001d7963ba43665accf330b8e0ed590
> for 2 u may need the longer one.
> 
> The tubing is like this 3/8 inner " how wide inside of the tube is " 1/2 outter " how wide the out side of the tube is.
> 
> I use 1/2 3/4 myself.. it is harder to work with.
> 
> Btw u kno u can get Alphaacool water blocks? would match the rads.


Thanks! Much help! I'll have to look into the Alphacool blocks. Are they any good? I was also looking at Koolance too. I don't mind mixing and matching as long as all of the blocks are black. I'm going with black blocks and white UV tubing to match my white Phantom 820 case


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Thanks! Much help! I'll have to look into the Alphacool blocks. Are they any good? I was also looking at Koolance too. I don't mind mixing and matching as long as all of the blocks are black. I'm going with black blocks and white UV tubing to match my white Phantom 820 case


http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_240_580&products_id=36088

+

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_1018_1042&products_id=36087

Koolance blocks will not fit.

You have EK and Alphacool.



Vs





Being Plastic + that stupid little plate made me choose Alphacool Bling nling vs plastic XD


----------



## RavageTheEarth

The EK is plastic? I think I actually like the Alphacool better than EK. I would want the backplates too.


----------



## alancsalt

EK top is acetal.
Quote:


> Acetal (POM) - A thermoplastic produced by the addition polymerization of an aldehyde through the carbonyl function, yielding unbranched polyoxymethylene chains of great length. The acetal resins are among the strongest and stiffest of all thermoplastics, and are characterized by good fatigue life, low moisture sensitivity, high resistance to solvents and chemicals, and good electrical properties. Because of these properties, acetals often compete with nylons for many of the same applications. Acetals may be processed by conventional injection molding and extrusion techniques. The main area of application for acetal is industrial and mechanical products.
> The acetal polymer (POM) class was first introduced in 1956 and has achieved important application because of a good profile of properties. Two types of acetals available are a homopolymer and a copolymer with slightly different advantages for each. Acetals are available in fiber reinforced and lubricated molding grades as well as extruded shapes for machined parts.
> 
> Features
> Lubricated (391), Copolymer (302), Good Wear Resistance (262), Low Friction (208), Good Chemical Resistance (180), Homopolymer (171), Good Dimensional Stability (169), High Strength (140), High Stiffness (126), General Purpose (124), 128 More... Uses
> Automotive Applications (208), Gears (184), General Purpose (121), Engineering Parts (116), Bearings (106), Business Equipment (75), Fasteners (62), Thin-walled Parts (62), Electrical/Electronic Applications (62), Textile Applications (52), 85 More...
> 
> Disadvantages
> - Poor resistance to acids
> - Subject to UV degradation
> - Flammable
> - Difficult to bond
> - High specific gravity


----------



## MattyMatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I had ordered a few other things as well in addition to 6 tubes of CoolLab stuff, including a water-block, some cooling liquids etc...so a bigger box...all told for these extra items as well, 'extra-cost' for fast(ish) delivery was about $25-$30, though in retrospect, for just a few tubes of CL LM without any of the other stuff, I would just go for their regular cheaper delivery option...btw, you can do a dry run re ordering at their online shop and see delivery cost options geared towards your specific purchase.


Thank you. Just hate registering to figure all the stuff out. Ill order tomorrow.


----------



## ivanlabrie

High specific gravity...that sucks (?) XD

Never knew what acetal really is, so thanks!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Never knew what acetal really is, so thanks!


Me neither. Still not sure what it is.... lol

It does make a little more sense though.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> High specific gravity...that sucks (?) XD
> 
> Never knew what acetal really is, so thanks!


...but you always know about DRAM timings







...with that in mind, what is the lowest Dram Ref cycle time for TridentX/2400 you recommend for a.) 2x 8GB 3770K and b.) 4x 8GB 3970X ? Thank you in advance


----------



## ivanlabrie

ref cycle? I haven't tested Samsung ram that much to give you an average but from what I've seen people tend to run that at 96 when going for 2600-2800mhz cl9-12-12-26-2t. (tertiaries normally go as tight as 1-1-1-1-4-4-1-1-4-4-0)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> ref cycle? I haven't tested Samsung ram that much to give you an average but from what I've seen people tend to run that at 96 when going for 2600-2800mhz cl9-12-12-26-2t. (tertiaries normally go as tight as 1-1-1-1-4-4-1-1-4-4-0)


Thanks - good stuff (rep+ also for all the other hints)







I hear it also comes down to the number of sticks, so with 4, I might have to stay a bit looser than with 2 sticks...tertiaries I already had as above.


----------



## Joa3d43

*Hokies83*

...a couple of week(s) back, you had reported on your first temp tests, and as I recall the center GPU card ran a lot hotter than the other two...earlier today you posted new info which showed that the problem had been fixed...

...just out of interest, what was the issue / problem that caused the center card to run initially much hotter / how did you fix it if not obvious ?


----------



## Belial

Hey so I used the supplied scrubber with my CLU and it scratched up my IHS (i think). Did that happen with anyone else? Like ***. I didn't even need it, I was able to remove the CLU with rubbing alcohol, just got to rub it out a lot (it seems like CLU just melts itself to the metal or something and you rub it off, just like how you can rub the nickel off any IHS if you scrub it hard enough with IPA).


----------



## Swag

How am I getting such low points?!?!


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*


and ? can't you see three pci-e slots ? 2 red and 1 black


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How am I getting such low points?!?!


...see if you can tighten up main system memory timings

...vid card memory should go up to 3400 or so (6800 effect) without artifacts (most current gen GDDR5 NVidia cards can get there)

...check OCN for 'GTX 600 series Bios mods' thread...I'm using just a mild Bios tweak now, though will mod cards more heavily later (ie voltage above 1.215v which is the factory hard max) once I w-c them

...this should get you to 2100-2300 in Valley w/your 3570

Bon appetit


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Hokies83*
> 
> ...a couple of week(s) back, you had reported on your first temp tests, and as I recall the center GPU card ran a lot hotter than the other two...earlier today you posted new info which showed that the problem had been fixed...
> 
> ...just out of interest, what was the issue / problem that caused the center card to run initially much hotter / how did you fix it if not obvious ?


I switched the 2nd card out with the top card..

So the 2nd card is now the top.

I replaced the tim and put a back plate on it..

However it is still the hottest gpu.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I switched the 2nd card out with the top card..
> 
> So the 2nd card is now the top.
> 
> I replaced the tim and put a back plate on it..
> 
> However it is still the hottest gpu.


Did the backplate help at all? I can't decide if the backplates help or if they just trap heat.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Did the backplate help at all? I can't decide if the backplates help or if they just trap heat.


Most do nothing but the Alphacools are passive heat sinks.




Thermal pads and all same places the pads are on the other side for the Water block.

So the alphacool back plate gets a lil warm.. unlike others that are just for show.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Hey so I used the supplied scrubber with my CLU and it scratched up my IHS (i think). Did that happen with anyone else? Like ***. I didn't even need it, I was able to remove the CLU with rubbing alcohol, just got to rub it out a lot (it seems like CLU just melts itself to the metal or something and you rub it off, just like how you can rub the nickel off any IHS if you scrub it hard enough with IPA).


Yep same thing happened to me. I lapped my IHS a little bit and didn't even know! My IHS no longer has any writing on it.Good think I already voided the warranty!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Most do nothing but the Alphacools are passive heat sinks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thermal pads and all same places the pads are on the other side for the Water block.
> 
> So the alphacool back plate gets a lil warm.. unlike others that are just for show.


They also add some stability to the card itself, right?


----------



## Hokies83

Yes.


----------



## KuuFA

Hmm Does the Heat killer backplate do the same?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Hmm Does the Heat killer backplate do the same?


You cannot use Heat killer block with a 7950 unless it has a 7970 PCB.

If so i would have had 3 Heat killer blocks lol.

Do not fall for blocks that say HD 79xx etc.. they will not fit a Ref 7950 PCB.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Hi - RavageTheEarth - i asked you about you new MOBO a few pages back but anyway looks like i'm leaning towards MVG or MVE.
> 
> btw - waterloops: have you seen this thread?
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1339010/build-log-an-old-mans-first-blinged-out-water-build
> he has a good sense of humor and does not hide his mistakes, for our benefit. enjoy, i read 1-15 of 30 pages tonight and will finish it later.


Oh sorry about that man. I would say to go with the MVG if you are looking to just OC and play around with settings in the BIOS and stuff. Unless you have a huge case then you should get the MVE. I personally got the MVE because I like tinkering with everyything and possible might end up running quad-fire at some point. I'm totally happy with my purchase.
Woah! ASUS MVE Open Box check out the price!!!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858R

Should I purchase the extended warraty from newegg?
http://promotions.newegg.com/service_net/11-3420/index.html

I've wanted to buy this, but I feel like there is something shady going on with this. Why wouldn't newegg do something like that?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh sorry about that man. I would say to go with the MVG if you are looking to just OC and play around with settings in the BIOS and stuff. Unless you have a huge case then you should get the MVE. I personally got the MVE because I like tinkering with everyything and possible might end up running quad-fire at some point. I'm totally happy with my purchase.
> Woah! ASUS MVE Open Box check out the price!!!
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858R
> 
> Should I purchase the extended warraty from newegg?
> http://promotions.newegg.com/service_net/11-3420/index.html
> 
> I've wanted to buy this, but I feel like there is something shady going on with this. Why wouldn't newegg do something like that?


MVE is worth it for that price









Id only want it cause it matches my Colors.. and would only be worth it for an Even swap.

If i had a MVE id have to buy an Audio card aswell... Which would take away from my clean look.

LoL because i Luv mah Audio.. i can make my house shake with these bad boys... 

And with the MVE realtek audio " Insert puke emote here "









Blasting this so loud now i can not hear my self think @[email protected]


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yea man I love me some skynyrd. Oooh ooh that smell. Can't you smell that smell?









I absolutely love my MVE. So I've been torn between white and red tubing and I think I'm going to go with the red. It's going to look pretty damn sweet.





I'm thinking about using a white lighting once I add my loop. My camera sucks, but I was using a dark red lighting. The camera made it look pink-ish

I'm also going to take the mesh off the side and replace it with acrylic so the side panel can be a three-part window.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea man I love me some skynyrd. Oooh ooh that smell. Can't you smell that smell?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I absolutely love my MVE. So I've been torn between white and red tubing and I think I'm going to go with the red. It's going to look pretty damn sweet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm thinking about using a white lighting once I add my loop. My camera sucks, but I was using a dark red lighting. The camera made it look pink-ish


Well if u luv Audio..









http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882117424

+

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829132053

+

http://www.amazon.com/LP-2020A-Lepai-Tripath-Class-T-Amplifier/dp/B0049P6OTI

=


----------



## Valgaur

All the mobo love lately!







breaking in my new coaster that I found in a 1998 pc lovely 478 socket baby.....









I'm debating on what I should do with my summer build/redo of my custom case, i have the layout all planned but it's the parts im debating.... a would love a sr-2







and dual 3930K's lol and 4 way 7970's.... right hokies!?


----------



## Hokies83

You can Only use Xeon Cpu's in the SR-2

3-4 7950s / 7970s Yup... my 3 7950s slap my 2 680s around like a red headed step child.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can Only use Xeon Cpu's in the SR-2
> 
> 3-4 7950s / 7970s Yup... my 3 7950s slap my 2 680s around like a red headed step child.


I guess i could do a dual system in my custom case... that would be pretty sick i think.


----------



## Hokies83

It is cool but u could do the samething with 2 monitors lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is cool but u could do the samething with 2 monitors lol.


im gonna do atleast 3 monitors. maybe 3+1


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> im gonna do atleast 3 monitors. maybe 3+1


LoL i hope not 3 of those Cheapo Asus monitors u have lol.

Id at the Min do 3 Dell 24 inch Ips 1080x1200 monitors.

Dell UltraSharp U2412M.

Or 3 catleaps... Which having 3-4 gpus would benefit from


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i hope not 3 of those Cheapo Asus monitors u have lol.
> 
> Id at the Min do 3 Dell 24 inch Ips 1080x1200 monitors.
> 
> Dell UltraSharp U2412M.
> 
> Or 3 catleaps... Which having 3-4 gpus would benefit from


i really wanna do 3 cat's but man they are exspensive


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> i really wanna do 3 cat's but man they are exspensive


Not to bad.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Glossy-QNIX-QX2710-LED-Evolution-ll-27-2560x1440-Samsung-PLS-Panel-Monitor-/321099912197?pt=Computer_Monitors&hash=item4ac30bd405

http://www.ebay.com/itm/achieva-shimian-qh270-lite-2560-By-1440-Monitor-AS-IS-/321100688786?pt=Computer_Monitors&hash=item4ac317ad92

http://www.ebay.com/itm/QH270-Lite-Achieva-ShiMian-27-Quad-HD-16-9-DVI-D-Wide-2560x1440-PC-Monitor-/321080802184?pt=Computer_Monitors&hash=item4ac1e83b88

Prices keep going up these used to be sub 300$


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Can someone explain what is going on in this picture? I'm trying to figure out this whole watercooling thing. Where is the pump and resevoir in this picture? I don't see either and isn't the resevoir supposed to be above the pump?



Also, can someone let me know if I would be able to fit two pumps and a resevoir in my case? I have 3 SSD's so I'm wondering if that lack of space in the HDD cage is going to affect anything. I am also going to have a 120.2 rad on the bottom of the case where the single 120mm fan currently is, a 140 rad at the rear, and a 120.3 rad on the top. Would that be enough cooling power? I am going to be running a single loop.


----------



## Hokies83

Look like there in the drive bay.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Holy crap guys check this out: http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?263514-Extra-Guy-s-PC-Mods-(Phantom-820-mod-atm)
btw Idk why you can't click on that link, but if you copy and paste it it will work.
What program is he using to create those models? I would love to learn something like that. If someone can give me the program name for those 3d models they will recieve REP.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Look like there in the drive bay.


Oh so two of the Sidewinder Custom tapped MCP655 / Laing D5 with G 1/4 Threads would fit in the drive bays?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Holy crap guys check this out: http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?263514-Extra-Guy-s-PC-Mods-(Phantom-820-mod-atm)
> What program is he using to create those models? I would love to learn something like that. If someone can give me the program name for those 3d models they will recieve REP.
> Oh so two of the Sidewinder Custom tapped MCP655 / Laing D5 with G 1/4 Threads would fit in the drive bays?


Sure.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sure.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sure.


Ok thank you for your help Hokies, sir. REP for you for putting up with my stupid questions.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok thank you for your help Hokies, sir. REP for you for putting up with my stupid questions.


LoL nah yours are fine.

You want stupid Visit the Amd section


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL nah yours are fine.
> 
> You want stupid Visit the Amd section


ahahaha now THAT made me laugh.


----------



## KuuFA

Man that one with the blue hoses looks like it has meters of extra slack lol. Cant wait to redo my loop


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Man that one with the blue hoses looks like it has meters of extra slack lol. Cant wait to redo my loop


Can't wait to get me loop!! lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Holy crap guys check this out: http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?263514-Extra-Guy-s-PC-Mods-(Phantom-820-mod-atm)
> btw Idk why you can't click on that link, but if you copy and paste it it will work.
> What program is he using to create those models? I would love to learn something like that. If someone can give me the program name for those 3d models they will recieve REP.
> Oh so two of the Sidewinder Custom tapped MCP655 / Laing D5 with G 1/4 Threads would fit in the drive bays?


most likely the blue tubing pic has a dual 5.25" bay res and pump combo so one pump and thats its for the loop. if you get a MCP655 or somthing like that you can do your loop probably but with your case and setup its gonna be a very tight fit man..... you can maybe fit a dual bay res in as you dont have the space for an internal res unless you want it to be crazy crowded in there. then with yopur cooling you should be more than fine as a 360 is pretty good and a thicker 120mm on the exhaust will do well as a good item.... uuuuum I'm not a fan of rads on the bottom as thats where you need pumps at, give me some more pics of your case WITH your PSU







so I can do some mental measuring and see what I can find that will fit in there for you









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Can't wait to get me loop!! lol


Just wait until mine









Hey Hokies those aren't Catleaps though?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> most likely the blue tubing pic has a dual 5.25" bay res and pump combo so one pump and thats its for the loop. if you get a MCP655 or somthing like that you can do your loop probably but with your case and setup its gonna be a very tight fit man..... you can maybe fit a dual bay res in as you dont have the space for an internal res unless you want it to be crazy crowded in there. then with yopur cooling you should be more than fine as a 360 is pretty good and a thicker 120mm on the exhaust will do well as a good item.... uuuuum I'm not a fan of rads on the bottom as thats where you need pumps at, give me some more pics of your case WITH your PSU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so I can do some mental measuring and see what I can find that will fit in there for you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just wait until mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Hokies those aren't Catleaps though?


Catleap is just a name.

There all 2nd hand LG panels.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> most likely the blue tubing pic has a dual 5.25" bay res and pump combo so one pump and thats its for the loop. if you get a MCP655 or somthing like that you can do your loop probably but with your case and setup its gonna be a very tight fit man..... you can maybe fit a dual bay res in as you dont have the space for an internal res unless you want it to be crazy crowded in there. then with yopur cooling you should be more than fine as a 360 is pretty good and a thicker 120mm on the exhaust will do well as a good item.... uuuuum I'm not a fan of rads on the bottom as thats where you need pumps at, give me some more pics of your case WITH your PSU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so I can do some mental measuring and see what I can find that will fit in there for you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just wait until mine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Hokies those aren't Catleaps though?


Yea I guess I could sacrifice the bottom rad. I can fit another 140 rad on the swivel fan mount on the HDD cage so I guess that could be where I can have my 3rd.
I can't show you my PSU in the case because stupid Seasonic has it and there is no way to check the status of my RMA or even get a hold of them on the phone so idk when I'm going to be able to use my rig again.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I guess I could sacrifice the bottom rad. I can fit another 140 rad on the swivel fan mount on the HDD cage so I guess that could be where I can have my 3rd.
> I can't show you my PSU in the case because stupid Seasonic has it and there is no way to check the status of my RMA or even get a hold of them on the phone so idk when I'm going to be able to use my rig again.


Measure where u want rads and take pics and lemme see









This way i can suggest rads.

Do u have 85mm up top? if so get a Alphacool Nexxos 360 UT 60 in push config.

Pair that with a Nexxos 240 ut 60 and ur good to go.

Rememmber u need to only fit one 25mm thick fan. so that is 85mm.


----------



## SDBolts619

Hmm, after checking out the razorblade-less method of IHS removal, I've pulled the trigger on the Coollaboratory Ultra from FrozenCPU (Along with a few supplies for sleeving my cables) and will delid once that comes in.

Since I already have a nice workbench with a vice in my garage, seems like this would be the easier way to go...

On the downside, from the replies to my earlier post, sounds like my CPU won't like going up too high even with delidding since it's set at 1.270 to be stable at 4.5ghz







Oh well, I should still get better temps out of the deal...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Catleap is just a name.
> 
> There all 2nd hand LG panels.


so they are the LG panels huh?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> so they are the LG panels huh?


The s-IPS are the PLS are claiming to be Samsung panels.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> MVE is worth it for that price
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...
> 
> Blasting this so loud now i can not hear my self think @[email protected]


Thanks Hokies...







one of my fall-time faves - but music drive and bookmarks are on another set of HDs as I'm putting together a new config... and this song has so many versions...this is a good one !


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You can Only use Xeon Cpu's in the SR-2
> 
> 3-4 7950s / 7970s Yup... my 3 7950s slap my 2 680s around like a red headed step child.


...that was the problem for that mobo...can you imagine two Sandy-E 'Ks' or 'X's on that board, oc'ed to 5.2 ? Mind you, you would need two PSUs if you also ran tri or quad GPUs


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Thanks Hokies...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> one of my fall-time faves - but music drive and bookmarks are on another set of HDs as I'm putting together a new config... and this song has so many versions...this is a good one !


I use that one cause it is HD audio lol.


----------



## homestyle

We could possibly get better temps if we dont clamp down the mobo cpu clamp. With the glue gone the mobo clamp pushes the ihs to the cpu pcb. This creates a convex bow right over the die.

By not clamping down, the ihs sits flush against cpu die and we get better tim seat because the ihs doesnt slide 1mm over the die as we clamp down.

I know the clamp provides the right pressure for the pins to make contact with the pads, but that becomes irrelavent because our after market coolers already provide 50+ pounds of pressure anyway.


----------



## SonDa5

For those that are interested in direct die cooling here is a post I made at TechPowerUp that has some good info on it.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2775935&postcount=94

Powers that be are welcome to add the link as sticky at the front. Some good bare die food for thought in that thread IMO.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey Sonda5, long time no see bud








how's your mpower doin?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey Sonda5, long time no see bud
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how's your mpower doin?


Doing fine. I read this thread all the time and post in other threads all the time as well. Good to see so many people having fun and success with delidding.

The mother board is doing great.


----------



## ivanlabrie

cool, lucky you...my mvg died on me jactually my pos gpu killed it.ill be trying the vise delid method sooniish.


----------



## justanoldman

Sorry, another water question. If you have the new H220 cooling your cpu with a 220 rad, then you expand the loop with a gpu and add a 320 rad, what should your cpu temps do?

I would have assumed they would automatically go down. If you stress test the cpu with the gpu at idle you have 5x120 rad space now vs. 2x120 rad space before. But from what I have seen and looking at a review the cpu temps don't change much or even go up a couple.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> All the mobo love lately!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> breaking in my new coaster that I found in a 1998 pc lovely 478 socket baby.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm debating on what I should do with my summer build/redo of my custom case, i have the layout all planned but it's the parts im debating.... a would love a sr-2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and dual 3930K's lol and 4 way 7970's.... right hokies!?


...whatever you're planning, especially if it is HiPo, make sure your electrical setup in your room / office can take it...unless that 478 socket is going to be your new and only machine









...apart from 6x 3770 VM systems, 3 monitors, peripherals etc and the M-V-E / delidded 3770K, I just picked up the Rampage-IV Ex, with the 3970X....both the M-V-E and the Rampage have a AX1200w PSUs...combined with everything else, I had to run another HomeDepot 'industrial strength' power tool extension cord to pull power from phases in other rooms - have to get an electrician in here to do some upgrades in my Home Office, or move a bed into our commercial space







!

...won't be able to do a full boot-up / assembly of the 3970X until the weekend, but had the warehouse guys pick the latest 'batch' number and also put the CPU in the LGA2011 socket...too many horror stories about bent pins w/LG2011....The M-V-E and Rampage-IV-EX will join a Sabertooth 77 in the 'desk computer' I mentioned before for a build up in a few months time - after the electrician has done his thing









R-IV-Extr


M-V-Extr


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> cool, lucky you...my mvg died on me jactually my pos gpu killed it.ill be trying the vise delid method sooniish.


...cool...when you do, are you planning to use a heat-gun first to soften up the silicon glue that holds the IHS to the PCB ? I have been wondering about that...or even in regard to using the vise, then 'twisting off' the IHS, per earlier posts by others


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, another water question. If you have the new H220 cooling your cpu with a 220 rad, then you expand the loop with a gpu and add a 320 rad, what should your cpu temps do?
> 
> I would have assumed they would automatically go down. If you stress test the cpu with the gpu at idle you have 5x120 rad space now vs. 2x120 rad space before. But from what I have seen and looking at a review the cpu temps don't change much or even go up a couple.


Depending on the rads / fans used 1-2c


----------



## Jayjr1105

So has anyone used the razor-less hammer method yet? Going to do mine tonight this way...


----------



## KuuFA

Just updated the OP to my thread to reflect how many known users Have used that technique.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Just updated the OP to my thread to reflect how many known users Have used that technique.


...great !







Has anyone in your thread had any problems with the IHS accidentally hitting the die when it flies off ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> How am I getting such low points?!?!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...see if you can tighten up main system memory timings
> 
> ...vid card memory should go up to 3400 or so (6800 effect) without artifacts (most current gen GDDR5 NVidia cards can get there)
> 
> ...check OCN for 'GTX 600 series Bios mods' thread...I'm using just a mild Bios tweak now, though will mod cards more heavily later (ie voltage above 1.215v which is the factory hard max) once I w-c them
> 
> ...this should get you to 2100-2300 in Valley w/your 3570
> 
> Bon appetit


This should help, valley does like the memory clocks. The score wasn't terrible but could definitely be improved.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Did the backplate help at all? I can't decide if the backplates help or if they just trap heat.


They can help cool but it isn't a dramatic difference. Buy backplates for looks & card protection (hard to knock components off by accident when covered), & if they do help temps, it's a bonus.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> We could possibly get better temps if we dont clamp down the mobo cpu clamp. With the glue gone the mobo clamp pushes the ihs to the cpu pcb. This creates a convex bow right over the die.
> 
> By not clamping down, the ihs sits flush against cpu die and we get better tim seat because the ihs doesnt slide 1mm over the die as we clamp down.
> 
> I know the clamp provides the right pressure for the pins to make contact with the pads, but that becomes irrelavent because our after market coolers already provide 50+ pounds of pressure anyway.


Some pressure on the heatsink does help, I just stick a heatsink on without mounting pretty regularly, it works, but doesn't work quite as well as when properly mounted & clamped down.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> cool, lucky you...my mvg died on me jactually my pos gpu killed it.ill be trying the vise delid method sooniish.


I should have bugged you to vmod the stupid gpu, might have threatened it into behaving....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not yet from what I've seen...

You should put the cpu in the vise with the die perpendicular to the direction of the blow.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Depending on the rads / fans used 1-2c


Thanks. I have a lot to learn about water, I just assumed another 320 rad would more than compensate for a gpu at idle and help the cpu. Dang it, I just realized I am talking myself into two custom loops for my next build.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...cool...when you do, are you planning to use a heat-gun first to soften up the silicon glue that holds the IHS to the PCB ? I have been wondering about that...or even in regard to using the vise, then 'twisting off' the IHS, per earlier posts by others


If someone tries twisting it off and it works, then I will claim credit, if it fails I will say it was your idea. Just kidding














. Honestly the hammer seems to be working well for the people so far, from what they say you don't hit it that hard. Hang up a towel or something to catch the pcb if it does pop off and fly a little.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> This should help, valley does like the memory clocks. The score wasn't terrible but could definitely be improved.
> They can help cool but it isn't a dramatic difference. Buy backplates for looks & card protection (hard to knock components off by accident when covered), & if they do help temps, it's a bonus.
> Some pressure on the heatsink does help, I just stick a heatsink on without mounting pretty regularly, it works, but doesn't work quite as well as when properly mounted & clamped down.
> I should have bugged you to vmod the stupid gpu, might have threatened it into behaving....


Yeah, so much for that pos 8400gs...I'm gonna vmod my 7600gt this weekend. I still have to reflow the core and ram chips properly with the heat gun and aluminum foil on the rest of the card.
Should help with the artifacts I get with it.

I ordered a 6950 1gb, those SUCK for benching, right? Gonna fund my other upgrades though.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> For those that are interested in direct die cooling here is a post I made at TechPowerUp that has some good info on it.
> 
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2775935&postcount=94
> 
> Powers that be are welcome to add the link as sticky at the front. Some good bare die food for thought in that thread IMO.


thats a nice chip you have there just like mine


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, so much for that pos 8400gs...I'm gonna vmod my 7600gt this weekend. I still have to reflow the core and ram chips properly with the heat gun and aluminum foil on the rest of the card.
> Should help with the artifacts I get with it.
> 
> I ordered a 6950 1gb, those SUCK for benching, right? Gonna fund my other upgrades though.


The AMD 6000 series was a bit of suck.


----------



## Hokies83

L33t Gamer playing some Pocoyo racing on the Wii.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol


----------



## Zeek

Every time I check this thread there's like 250 new post every time









My delidded chip is still going strong without any issues. Has been for the last month or so since I've had it. Still everything is the same I just ran prime for about 8 hours to make sure nothing was dying


----------



## chronicfx

Anyone checked out the razorless de-lidding using the vice, hammer and wooden block. Thats pretty sweet huh? Wish I thought of that.. I had a proper vice 10 feet away from me when I delidded using my razor.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Anyone checked out the razorless de-lidding using the vice, hammer and wooden block. Thats pretty sweet huh? Wish I thought of that.. I had a proper vice 10 feet away from me when I delidded using my razor.


Yah if i do a Haswell build i will try that method.


----------



## dr/owned

FYI ArctiClean leaves a residue that's quite visible on the die. Step 1.5 should be isopropyl. Avoiding step 2 because it has an anti-corrosive that I doubt the die wants.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> FYI ArctiClean leaves a residue that's quite visible on the die. Step 1.5 should be isopropyl. Avoiding step 2 because it has an anti-corrosive that I doubt the die wants.


You have to keep using the Thermal Surface Purifier till it goes away


----------



## Valgaur

I just had a great idea on my build layout for this year..... completely different fron what most people would think in a build. What I'm stuck on though is what I should get for a mobo/cpu setup.... I kinda want a x79 board for the blocks but thats kinda silly for just the looks..... what do you think I should use for the cpu and mobo? im open to any Intel ideas, and quad 7970's baby







depending on the new 700 series of course....


----------



## ivanlabrie

You kidding me man? Hold on to that board and wait for Haswell, then grab a Gryphon z87 and a 4770k.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You kidding me man? Hold on to that board and wait for Haswell, then grab a Gryphon z87 and a 4770k.


I kinda figured lol, this will just be a new build and my current one will be for benching since my board is pretty freaking OP already.







(atleast I think it is) ((no i don't care))









but I have a sweet idea on my WC layout that will be very different sepecially the side/front panel


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I kinda figured lol, this will just be a new build and my current one will be for benching since my board is pretty freaking OP already.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (atleast I think it is) ((no i don't care))
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but I have a sweet idea on my WC layout that will be very different sepecially the side/front panel


Hmmm, then get a Gigabyte ud3h...and a 3770k at MC. Pair it with Dominator platinum 2133mhz c9 with not-so-manly wc compatible heatspreaders and use those even-less-manly coolants with dyes.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hmmm, then get a Gigabyte ud3h...and a 3770k at MC. Pair it with Dominator platinum 2133mhz c9 with not-so-manly wc compatible heatspreaders and use those even-less-manly coolants with dyes.


ill get the 4770K and the good mobo of whatever is out then


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I just had a great idea on my build layout for this year..... completely different fron what most people would think in a build. What I'm stuck on though is what I should get for a mobo/cpu setup.... I kinda want a x79 board for the blocks but thats kinda silly for just the looks..... what do you think I should use for the cpu and mobo? im open to any Intel ideas, and quad 7970's baby
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depending on the new 700 series of course....


...X79 / LG2011 is supposed to stick around for longer (longer than LG1155 anyhow)...and they'll be able to run the next gen Ivy-E / Haswell-E as well when they come out late 2013, though there will also be a new chipset, the X99 (main difference to X79: more USB3, more Sata 6GB native)

...with X79, you get a true 40 PCIe lanes- just ducky for running 4 GPUs unless you opt for the MVE (or Gigabyte xxxUP7) - OR, go for this





















... http://www.overclock.net/t/1377425/tpu-asus-launches-the-p9x79-e-ws-with-x16-link-4-way-graphics









...CPU wise, it's a question of budget...I got enough new stuff to last for a while, but Haswell is rumored to be - drum roll please - not much faster than Ivy at clock-for-clock but a HUGE overclocker (folks on NDA have been hinting, as has Intel itself)...I have heard stories by 'trusted sources' whereby Haswell can hit a further 700+ MHz on the same vCore

...personally, I would still opt for a X79 with either a 3930K or an 'X' series, depending on budget, especially as you're already running a fast Ivy (...just remember Fast Frankie when you want to increase vCore some more







)

...look forward to learn about what you mean when you post above "...completely different from what most people would think..." That sounds intriguing..







.I am having a great time planning the aforementioned 'desk computer' - not that I invented that but will do my own thing. The general idea of NOT being forced into a case and its restrictions , no matter how nice and big, is VERY appealing. I measured things out already and save a huge amount of space while having my fav 3 boards under glass and sharing some components !


----------



## ivanlabrie

The deskputer is amazing, I'd love to have one...I'll stick to case modding for now, once I get some cash flow going.
You could have a shared loop, with a chiller built in, like Callsignvega's setup.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...X79 / LG2011 is supposed to stick around for longer (longer than LG1155 anyhow)...and they'll be able to run the next gen Ivy-E / Haswell-E as well when they come out late 2013, though there will also be a new chipset, the X99 (main difference to X79: more USB3, more Sata 6GB native)
> 
> ...with X79, you get a true 40 PCIe lanes- just ducky for running 4 GPUs unless you opt for the MVE (or Gigabyte xxxUP7) - OR, go for this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... http://www.overclock.net/t/1377425/tpu-asus-launches-the-p9x79-e-ws-with-x16-link-4-way-graphics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...CPU wise, it's a question of budget...I got enough new stuff to last for a while, but Haswell is rumored to be - drum roll please - not much faster than Ivy at clock-for-clock but a HUGE overclocker (folks on NDA have been hinting, as has Intel itself)...I have heard stories by 'trusted sources' whereby Haswell can hit a further 700+ MHz on the same vCore
> 
> ...personally, I would still opt for a X79 with either a 3930K or an 'X' series, depending on budget, especially as you're already running a fast Ivy (...just remember Fast Frankie when you want to increase vCore some more
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> ...look forward to learn about what you mean when you post above "...completely different from what most people would think..." That sounds intriguing..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .I am having a great time planning the aforementioned 'desk computer' - not that I invented that but will do my own thing. The general idea of NOT being forced into a case and its restrictions , not matter how nice and big, is VERY appealing. I measured things out already and save a huge amount of space while having my fav 3 boards under glass and sharing some components !


Yeah I'm still debating but for a little teaser for the new look will be a case basically turned 90° so the side window/panel is the front and I'm going to make it and upside down build (i think not sure really) then with my front panel make it a solid window and make it colapsable. I really cant wait. but for quad fire and a x79 mobo and big cpu i might need two psus lol.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yeah I'm still debating but for a little teaser for the new look will be a case basically turned 90° so the side window/panel is the front and I'm going to make it and upside down build (i think not sure really) then with my front panel make it a solid window and make it colapsable. I really cant wait. but for quad fire and a x79 mobo and big cpu i might need two psus lol.


Are you still planning on getting a pot? Might be an idea to make some kinda tech bench case, something that you can change the cooler on & freeze without having to take the whole rig apart.
You may plan on having a benching rig & daily rig, but if you start freezing, you will freeze everything. The daily rig will be the one the pot isn't mounted on.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Are you still planning on getting a pot? Might be an idea to make some kinda tech bench case, something that you can change the cooler on & freeze without having to take the whole rig apart.
> You may plan on having a benching rig & daily rig, but if you start freezing, you will freeze everything. The daily rig will be the one the pot isn't mounted on.


I'm gonna actually







I'll slap two ax 1200's into it and a set of 128 gig ssds for OS's and benchies then have everything else change







might make it out of wood as well lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Are you still planning on getting a pot? Might be an idea to make some kinda tech bench case, something that you can change the cooler on & freeze without having to take the whole rig apart.
> You may plan on having a benching rig & daily rig, but if you start freezing, you will freeze everything. The daily rig will be the one the pot isn't mounted on.


...or mount two mobos back to back with ply-wood and Styrofoam (for insulation) in between on bearings that are anchored on the sides - then just 'flip and spin' depending if you want to freeze or not...then again, you do live in North Dakota....so you're frozen anyways


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...or mount two mobos back to back with ply-wood and Styrofoam (for insulation) in between on bearings that are anchored on the sides - then just 'flip and spin' depending if you want to freeze or not...then again, you do live in North Dakota....so you're frozen anyways


I want my Ivy mobo for benching as well..... but I could easily cool double systems but thats would be pointless as I'd only use one.... if anything I'd have them facing each other and have tubing connecting them and cooling it all in a giant loop







(yes I even thought of this lol)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...X79 / LG2011 is supposed to stick around for longer (longer than LG1155 anyhow)...and they'll be able to run the next gen Ivy-E / Haswell-E as well when they come out late 2013, though there will also be a new chipset, the X99 (main difference to X79: more USB3, more Sata 6GB native)
> 
> ...with X79, you get a true 40 PCIe lanes- just ducky for running 4 GPUs unless you opt for the MVE (or Gigabyte xxxUP7) - OR, go for this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... http://www.overclock.net/t/1377425/tpu-asus-launches-the-p9x79-e-ws-with-x16-link-4-way-graphics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...CPU wise, it's a question of budget...I got enough new stuff to last for a while, but Haswell is rumored to be - drum roll please - not much faster than Ivy at clock-for-clock but a HUGE overclocker (folks on NDA have been hinting, as has Intel itself)...I have heard stories by 'trusted sources' whereby Haswell can hit a further 700+ MHz on the same vCore
> 
> ...personally, I would still opt for a X79 with either a 3930K or an 'X' series, depending on budget, especially as you're already running a fast Ivy (...just remember Fast Frankie when you want to increase vCore some more
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> ...look forward to learn about what you mean when you post above "...completely different from what most people would think..." That sounds intriguing..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .I am having a great time planning the aforementioned 'desk computer' - not that I invented that but will do my own thing. The general idea of NOT being forced into a case and its restrictions , no matter how nice and big, is VERY appealing. I measured things out already and save a huge amount of space while having my fav 3 boards under glass and sharing some components !


G1 sniper 3 has a PLX chip aswell







and is only 269$


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I want my Ivy mobo for benching as well..... but I could easily cool double systems but thats would be pointless as I'd only use one.... if anything I'd have them facing each other and have tubing connecting them and cooling it all in a giant loop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (yes I even thought of this lol)


...yes, the giant loop







...it plays a role in my 'deskputer 3x mobo' plans as I will run SLI x2 at times, but then switch to QUAD-SLI in just one machine...besides, the way I am laying it out I can put 5x 360x60 rads on the 'sides', venting out - while forming one of the edges of the deskputer


----------



## ivanlabrie

You could use the hot air blowing out of the sides to heat aquariums or a greenhouse and keep some 1337 carnivore plants in there!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You could use the hot air blowing out of the sides to heat aquariums or a greenhouse and keep some 1337 carnivore plants in there!


...might be a nice source of heat for the winter,







but we're already on the city steam plant anyways...seriously, where this is located in my place allows me to to vent the hot air into a 'flexible dryer tube' that leads to an outside exhaust port (I'm about 30 stories up...)...there is also the option to get a cold-air intake at the other end of the 'deskputer'


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd avoid the cold air intake...and focus on ways to recycle/get rid of the heat.
Callsignvega had a cool loop with three split valve thingies, leading to a geothermal loop for summer, a chiller for benching and a regular loop for winter (heater)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd avoid the cold air intake...and focus on ways to recycle/get rid of the heat.
> Callsignvega had a cool loop with three split valve thingies, leading to a geothermal loop for summer, a chiller for benching and a regular loop for winter (heater)


...I'm really not far enough yet on the 'nitty-gritty' planning for this project (target completion date = fall 2013). That said, in spite of being 'Canada' which makes N.Dakota look positively balmy, I actually live in the (relatively speaking) warmest, most moderate-climate part, right by the Pacific, a bay of which is right outside...and as I look out and 'up' right now, there is still lots of snow on the 'Coastal Mountains', but down here, not so much...

...cold air intake would be 'relative' - obviously I do not want to run into condensation issues re too far below-ambient...I am looking at TEC, though (again, not finalized)...per earlier post, even now I have some power phase upgrading to do, then I can get more detailed as to TEC et al - as they can suck up some serious extra juice...


----------



## TonicX

I was thinking lets get past the dream computer. I really need this oced ivy for faster 3d rendering. so how a bout a DREAM RENDER FARM. Take a refer truck and turn it into a mobile server space. Only cpus need to be underwater and gpus are non-existent because the render clients can be intitalized via remote net. Twenty-Five multi-cores working feverishly. Yet THAT WOULD BE COOL! I want to do one in a dorm minifridge first to learn how to deal with cold, corrosion, moisture and the like.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Measure where u want rads and take pics and lemme see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This way i can suggest rads.
> 
> Do u have 85mm up top? if so get a Alphacool Nexxos 360 UT 60 in push config.
> 
> Pair that with a Nexxos 240 ut 60 and ur good to go.
> 
> Rememmber u need to only fit one 25mm thick fan. so that is 85mm.


So I measured on the top of my case and I have 70mm before it hits my MOBO, but I have 8-pin and 4-pin power cables connected to power the CPU on the motherboard so that is going to contrain a little more of that space. I could probably bend them back some more. Would I be able to go fanless for the top rad if I go with the Alphacool Nexxos 360 UT30 full copper? I really wish I could put one on the bottom. I could put the pump in the 5.25 area, but then the res would have to be somewhere above the case and I want it in the case. Do you guys think that I definetly need two pumps for this loop even if I'm using the Sidewinder Custom tapped MCP655 / Laing D5 with G 1/4 Threads? I could have one 140 rad on the bottom next to the pump. I'm just confused with all of this haha

On a brighter note my PSU is going to be delivered back to me on monday!!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I just had a great idea on my build layout for this year..... completely different fron what most people would think in a build. What I'm stuck on though is what I should get for a mobo/cpu setup.... I kinda want a x79 board for the blocks but thats kinda silly for just the looks..... what do you think I should use for the cpu and mobo? im open to any Intel ideas, and quad 7970's baby
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> depending on the new 700 series of course....


I want a new build to, 7970s and x79, but I'm hesitant because sb-e has already been out forever, and 7970s already been out for a year. I hope ivy-e and 8000/700 series comes out mid of this year, I really don't want to wait till end of 2013.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I want a new build to, 7970s and x79, but I'm hesitant because sb-e has already been out forever, and 7970s already been out for a year. I hope ivy-e and 8000/700 series comes out mid of this year, I really don't want to wait till end of 2013.


...have you seen these two items per your post above ?

http://www.overclock.net/t/1368527/fudzilla-ivy-bridge-e-delayed-to-q4-2013

http://www.overclock.net/t/1376710/xbitlabs-intel-s-new-extreme-processors-will-barely-improve-performance-significantly


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So I measured on the top of my case and I have 70mm before it hits my MOBO, but I have 8-pin and 4-pin power cables connected to power the CPU on the motherboard so that is going to contrain a little more of that space. I could probably bend them back some more. Would I be able to go fanless for the top rad if I go with the Alphacool Nexxos 360 UT30 full copper? I really wish I could put one on the bottom. I could put the pump in the 5.25 area, but then the res would have to be somewhere above the case and I want it in the case. Do you guys think that I definetly need two pumps for this loop even if I'm using the Sidewinder Custom tapped MCP655 / Laing D5 with G 1/4 Threads? I could have one 140 rad on the bottom next to the pump. I'm just confused with all of this haha
> 
> On a brighter note my PSU is going to be delivered back to me on monday!!


Id seeif u can get the ut 45s to fit.

You can buy one for the lower area and see if it fits in the top then order the 2nd one


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Couldn't I put the 60mm UT30 on the top and then add fans above the case? Like this: http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/2581/phantom820withfans.png

Man I really want to learn how to use blender, but I feel like it would be years before I learn how to do work like this^


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Couldn't I put the 60mm UT30 on the top and then add fans above the case? Like this: http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/2581/phantom820withfans.png
> 
> Man I really want to learn how to use blender, but I feel like it would be years before I learn how to do work like this^


Yes you could!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

My god... scratch EVERYTHING. THIS is what I want. My brain can't comprehend how a freeware program can create and render these models...

http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/4480/phantom820withcables2.png
http://img547.imageshack.us/img547/7910/phantom820withexterior2.png


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yes you could!


Awesome well I think that is what I will do then. I would definetly do two loops if it could look like this^

Where would I buy that stiff tubing like that?


----------



## Hokies83

That will work


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That will work


You mean the copper pipes?

You have to bend them..

I do not like them reminds me of my basement ceiling.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Well in the renders they look like transparent blue and white. Not copper. Does a place cell something like that? I definetly don't want to use copper haha. I'll be out in my yard with a conduit bender looking like a nut. I think its ugly too.


----------



## Hokies83

Your asking for headaches and trouble being a frist time water cooler with stiff tubing.

Id try to get the most flexable stuff u can get since this is your first time.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Your asking for headaches and trouble being a frist time water cooler with stiff tubing.
> 
> Id try to get the most flexable stuff u can get since this is your first time.


Yea thats true I can still do something like that with regular tubing. Probably for the best.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well in the renders they look like transparent blue and white. Not copper. Does a place cell something like that? I definetly don't want to use copper haha. I'll be out in my yard with a conduit bender looking like a nut. I think its ugly too.


...then again, it could be fun







>> http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/2012/12/18/december-2012-bit-tech-modding-update/2


----------



## Hokies83

Now u need to choose if you want clear tubing with dye or colored tubing with pure distilled water.


----------



## KaRLiToS

Has someone tried the Vice method with hammer and wood yet?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KaRLiToS*
> 
> Has someone tried the Vice method with hammer and wood yet?


Sandy bridge E user! how dare you cross into our sacred 1155 IB safe house!

lol j/k

Anywho i think afew guys have and has worked well for them.

You selling the x79 and going 1155?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KaRLiToS*
> 
> Has someone tried the Vice method with hammer and wood yet?


I have seen a handful of people do it with success. Haven't heard of any failures yet. (knock on wood (and then use that wood to delid your CPU







)) Seems like a pretty fail-proof method if done correctly.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Now u need to choose if you want clear tubing with dye or colored tubing with pure distilled water.


I'm not really interested in using any dyes. I think I'm going to just go for red tubing with distilled water. Does anyone sell any dark red transparent tubing that you have seen? That would be ideal.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm not really interested in using any dyes. I think I'm going to just go for red tubing with distilled water. Does anyone sell any dark red transparent tubing that you have seen? That would be ideal.


what i used.

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17887/ex-tub-1620/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_Advanced_LRT_Tubing_38ID_x_58_OD_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_Bloodshed_Red_PFLEXA10-58-R_w_Free_Sys_Prep.html?tl=g30c99s1615


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> what i used.
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17887/ex-tub-1620/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_Advanced_LRT_Tubing_38ID_x_58_OD_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_Bloodshed_Red_PFLEXA10-58-R_w_Free_Sys_Prep.html?tl=g30c99s1615


That is PERFECT. Thank you!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Would you also be able to suggest some fans that have an extremely high static pressure since they are going to be on top of the UT60 I want a lot of airflow to be sucked through them.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Would you also be able to suggest some fans that have an extremely high static pressure since they are going to be on top of the UT60 I want a lot of airflow to be sucked through them.


Budget and how much noise can u stand lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KaRLiToS*
> 
> Has someone tried the Vice method with hammer and wood yet?


I've tried it actually, on a dead Ivy Bridge I bought for like $5...







Works fairly well but some people say use the vice you have at home or whatever's convenient, I found it 10x easier and 10x not as nerve racking if you do it with a rubberized vice. I say this because well, the rubber looked it it was holding it a bit better versus the metal and I was actually scared when I used a metal one at first before asking my neighbor to borrow his because it looked like it was scratching the PCB.


----------



## Hokies83

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16059/fan-999/Scythe_Gentle_Typhoon_120mm_x_25mm_Fan_-_2150_RPM_D1225C12B6AP-45_New_Speed.html?tl=g36c15s60 15$

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/8410/fan-518/Noiseblocker_NB-Multiframe_M12-S3HS_120mmx25mm_Ultra_Silent_Fan_-_1800_RPM_-_27_dBA.html?tl=g36c15s60 22$

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/8402/fan-519/Noiseblocker_NB-Multiframe_M12-P_120mmx25mm_Ultra_Silent_PWM_Fan_-_1000-2000_RPM_-_12-29_dBA.html?tl=g36c15s60 28$

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16919/fan-1049/Noiseblocker_NB-eLoop_B12-4_120mmx25mm_Ultra_Silent_Bionic_Blade_Fan_-_2400_RPM_-_3429_dBA_Hot_Item.html?tl=g36c15s60 22$

There all from 28dba to 34dba.

If that is to much noise they all have lower rpm versions that are more quiet.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Ok thanks.budget wise I have no problem spending a good chunk of change on some high quality fans. Noise-wise I don't want to be listening to a spooled up turbine all day haha.


----------



## Hokies83

All of those are HQ fans


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...have you seen these two items per your post above ?
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1368527/fudzilla-ivy-bridge-e-delayed-to-q4-2013
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376710/xbitlabs-intel-s-new-extreme-processors-will-barely-improve-performance-significantly


First of all performance rumors are rumors, no one exactly knows the performance increase. Second, ivy-e is a step up in lithography and the performance increase will be bigger than a step up in architecture, like ivy to haswell.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok thanks.budget wise I have no problem spending a good chunk of change on some high quality fans. Noise-wise I don't want to be listening to a spooled up turbine all day haha.


I suggest getting either Gelid Silent 12's, Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-15's, Noctua nf-f12 pwm's or BeQuiet! Silent Wing's (black fans, quite similar to nf-f12 pwm without the ugly noctua color scheme, and quieter with a tad less static pressure).
And, go push and not pull on your rads, most fans are designed for push and will make a strange noise in pull mode (the nf-f12 does for instance)
Oh, and don't buy noiseblockers, their static pressure is kinda meh and they are severely over priced.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> First of all performance rumors are rumors, no one exactly knows the performance increase. Second, ivy-e is a step up in lithography and the performance increase will be bigger than a step up in architecture, like ivy to haswell.


Yeah, till we see how Ivy-e or Haswell overclock, on ln2...I don't care. Just gimme back fsb overclocking and then we're talkin'


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> First of all performance rumors are rumors, no one exactly knows the performance increase. Second, ivy-e is a step up in lithography and the performance increase will be bigger than a step up in architecture, like ivy to haswell.


...just posted the article-links re latest on release dates..







....Like others, I am also trying to figure out if the next 'Sandy-E' will be an 'IVY-E' or a 'HASWELL-E' as I have read about both versions...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...just posted the article-links re latest on release dates..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....Like others, I am also trying to figure out if the next 'Sandy-E' will be an 'IVY-E' or a 'HASWELL-E' as I have read about both versions...


I think it will most likely be ivy-e, most articles I read support that claim. I would of course rather see a leap to haswell-e but we just have to wait and see.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, till we see how Ivy-e or Haswell overclock, on ln2...I don't care. Just gimme back fsb overclocking and then we're talkin'


Both will bring new chipsets with them so maybe decent fsb overclocking will be back. Some say haswell will oc better, but maybe that is just regarding temperatures. Ivy-e will be more of a step up imo because it will be replacing a 2 year old cpu, something that performs near or exactly the same doesn't seem right. All speculation though


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I think it will most likely be ivy-e, most articles I read support that claim. I would of course rather see a leap to haswell-e but we just have to wait and see.
> Both will bring new chipsets with them so maybe decent fsb overclocking will be back. Some say haswell will oc better, but maybe that is just regarding temperatures. Ivy-e will be more of a step up imo because it will be replacing a 2 year old cpu, something that performs near or exactly the same doesn't seem right. All speculation though


...I suspect that things would move faster with Intel re roll-out schedule if AMD would be a more serious threat on the CPU side...may be NVidia and its focus on massive parallel computing / co-processing (Tesla K20 etc) will light a fire - Intel seems to be watching that and Intel's Phi is being positioned aggressively price wise, what with up to 60 or Xeons on one PCIe card


----------



## Valgaur

man... I'll need to do the math on how much this build will cost me......


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've tried it actually, on a dead Ivy Bridge I bought for like $5...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Works fairly well but some people say use the vice you have at home or whatever's convenient, I found it 10x easier and 10x not as nerve racking if you do it with a rubberized vice. I say this because well, the rubber looked it it was holding it a bit better versus the metal and I was actually scared when I used a metal one at first before asking my neighbor to borrow his because it looked like it was scratching the PCB.


Do you have to heat the CPU before to make it easier or does it work "out of the box" ?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I've tried it actually, on a dead Ivy Bridge I bought for like $5...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Works fairly well but some people say use the vice you have at home or whatever's convenient, I found it 10x easier and 10x not as nerve racking if you do it with a rubberized vice. I say this because well, the rubber looked it it was holding it a bit better versus the metal and I was actually scared when I used a metal one at first before asking my neighbor to borrow his because it looked like it was scratching the PCB.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have to heat the CPU before to make it easier or does it work "out of the box" ?
Click to expand...

I just did it out of the box, it might be easier if you run the CPU a bit and take it out and work with that so its naturally heated vs using a heat gun.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I suspect that things would move faster with Intel re roll-out schedule if AMD would be a more serious threat on the CPU side...may be NVidia and its focus on massive parallel computing / co-processing (Tesla K20 etc) will light a fire - Intel seems to be watching that and Intel's Phi is being positioned aggressively price wise, what with up to 60 or Xeons on one PCIe card


AMD has been falling behind for 6 years now, currently they are way too far behind to compete in any way. If they did come up with something new in the future, not near future obviously, then yeah maybe we would seen Intel pushing more products out.
I know what you're talking about with the parallel super computer that nvidia came up with, but that won't replace intel. The tasks that a gpu does is much different than a task a cpu does. Both companies use parallel computing with lots of teslas and xeons but the tasks they do are different and would be slower if one was to replace the other.


----------



## dr/owned

Dremeling the 2011 EK Supremacy jet plate to get it to fit the Koolance 380i. .7mm vs .94mm thick to reduce the convex shape of the base.









Very similar in shape and size.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> man... I'll need to do the math on how much this build will cost me......


I foresee you getting your kidney appraised soon


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I foresee you getting your kidney appraised soon


any idea where i can get quadfire WC bridges?? you know instead of tubing it up?


----------



## snowfree52

this you mean ? : http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/multiple-block-connectivity/fc-connection-parts/ek-fc-bridge-quad-csq.html


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> AMD has been falling behind for 6 years now, currently they are way too far behind to compete in any way. If they did come up with something new in the future, not near future obviously, then yeah maybe we would seen Intel pushing more products out.
> I know what you're talking about with the parallel super computer that nvidia came up with, but that won't replace intel. The tasks that a gpu does is much different than a task a cpu does. Both companies use parallel computing with lots of teslas and xeons but the tasks they do are different and would be slower if one was to replace the other.


...it really isn't an easy switch re software, given Intel's huge installed base...we looked at it in our firm (software) and decided to 'keep on open mind' and try out one small project that had no legacy code, but it will make up less than 5% of our output for years to come. Far more important for us is the increased use of VMs.

What gives me more hope is that both Intel and Nvidia are aware that they have to get much more involved in the mobile market...Intel has even talked about 'low-power' Haswell-and-beyond architecture for mobile at below 16 w or so...eventually, I suspect that the approach of many parallel cores might become much more prevalent...like 10 core of a design for mobile and 100 core of the same design for servers etc...but as you said, all speculation for now...I just want Intel to have some really serious competition, because that's good for us...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> this you mean ? : http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/multiple-block-connectivity/fc-connection-parts/ek-fc-bridge-quad-csq.html


yeah now how do i connect it and I want the liquid to flow from one gpu to the next not through them all at once. I want MSI lightnings.... like seriously.... besides those what ones are good? (btw so far on pricing without gpus and blocks for gpus and connects of the gpus bridge thingy deal







I'm at around 1800 I believe.)

This is without fans btw....


----------



## Arm3nian

Lightnings are good, the asus matrix is also good. Ive heard the HIS is clocked the highest. I would stay with those 3, preferably lightnings because of crazy overclocking.


----------



## snowfree52

where are you gonna put 5 monsta 480 ???


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Lightnings are good, the asus matrix is also good. Ive heard the HIS is clocked the highest. I would stay with those 3, preferably lightnings because of crazy overclocking.


I am having a tough time finding the lightnings though....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> where are you gonna put 5 monsta 480 ???


because I can? and to make it epic of course! It's a secret where imma put them


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ... I want MSI lightnings.... like seriously.... besides those what ones are good?


...FtW 420 has a few...complete with that software (v ++) you are not supposed to let out in public


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...it really isn't an easy switch re software, given Intel's huge installed base...we looked at it in our firm (software) and decided to 'keep on open mind' and try out one small project that had no legacy code, but it will make up less than 5% of our output for years to come. Far more important for us is the increased use of VMs.
> 
> What gives me more hope is that both Intel and Nvidia are aware that they have to get much more involved in the mobile market...Intel has even talked about 'low-power' Haswell-and-beyond architecture for mobile at below 16 w or so...eventually, I suspect that the approach of many parallel cores might become much more prevalent...like 10 core of a design for mobile and 100 core of the same design for servers etc...but as you said, all speculation for now...I just want Intel to have some really serious competition, because that's good for us...


I dont think intel has interest for mobile cpus like arm, if thats what you mean. But yeah they are going for low power in laptops and such, more battery life = more appealing. Processor fabrication is really a unique field, its not like car companies where everyone just makes different products using the same combustion engine. And you're right competition would benefit everyone but I really don't see it happening.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I am having a tough time finding the lightnings though...


...one option 'may' be Asus 680 Direct CU ii Top (1137 MHz) you can buy currently (mid $500 range). You can volt-mod those per PCB and if you get a mobo board with voltage wire points and Bios (ie some ROGs) you're in business...then again, per other posts, get an ROG Matrix or even the $$$ Ares 2 and it has the voltage wires already on there.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I am having a tough time finding the lightnings though....
> because I can? and to make it epic of course! It's a secret where imma put them


Ebay has some I think. Newegg had them in stock yesterday wow


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ebay has some I think. Newegg had them in stock yesterday wow


...just checked Newegg...out of stock again...I guess s they go fast (no pun intended)








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I dont think intel has interest for mobile cpus like arm, if thats what you mean. But yeah they are going for low power in laptops and such, more battery life = more appealing. Processor fabrication is really a unique field, its not like car companies where everyone just makes different products using the same combustion engine. And you're right competition would benefit everyone but I really don't see it happening.


...it's years ago, but I did get a tour of Intel's centers near Portland...even had to wear a funny white body suit for the clean-room - but first and foremost, they are a business...so with less competition (ie AMD), they can afford to slow their release schedule...

...re mobile, though, depending what numbers you believe, about half (and growing) of all web visits are now done via mobile (smart phones, tablets etc)...that's a market Intel cannot afford to miss, and won't...but I have no idea whether they get there by shrinking their current architecture, or come up with a new one...then again, they just registered 15-core LG2011 ".Sandy-E' successor with the federal government in a trade filing they have to do for importing such items later , i.e. from Costa Rica....more cores are definitely in the cards, but yes, 15 Xeon or Sandy-E cores are not the same thing as 1500+ Cuda cores in an NVidia card


----------



## Swag

Ok guys, thanks for the people who helped me with my GPU OC thing.











My highest score this day was 1998 but the screenshot apparently didn't save properly so here's another run at 1989. I got the effective ram up to 7008 but regardless of the vram OC (stock or OCed), the GPU core was maxing out at 1200. I'm not sure why but it didn't want to pass that. I couldn't play BF3 or Tera for any longer than 30 minutes with 1200+, it would artifact and just crash the driver instantly.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ok guys, thanks for the people who helped me with my GPU OC thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My highest score this day was 1998 but the screenshot apparently didn't save properly so here's another run at 1989. I got the effective ram up to 7008 but regardless of the vram OC (stock or OCed), the GPU core was maxing out at 1200. I'm not sure why but it didn't want to pass that. I couldn't play BF3 or Tera for any longer than 30 minutes with 1200+, it would artifact and just crash the driver instantly.


...looks like a nice improvement from before - glad it worked out for you...







...to go further, you probably have to mod the Bios because such GPUs normally have a limit in there set to 1202; looks s.th. like this 'unraveled'

# Fan settings
Fan_Min = 10
Fan_Max = 100

# Board power settings
Max_Power_Target = 130

Max_Boost_Freq = 1202

# Voltage = 1212500
Voltage = 1200000
# Voltage = 1187500
# Voltage = 1175000
# Voltage = 1162500
# Voltage = 1150000


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Ok guys, thanks for the people who helped me with my GPU OC thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My highest score this day was 1998 but the screenshot apparently didn't save properly so here's another run at 1989. I got the effective ram up to 7008 but regardless of the vram OC (stock or OCed), the GPU core was maxing out at 1200. I'm not sure why but it didn't want to pass that. I couldn't play BF3 or Tera for any longer than 30 minutes with 1200+, it would artifact and just crash the driver instantly.
> 
> 
> 
> ...looks like a nice improvement from before - glad it worked out for you...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...to go further, you probably have to mod the Bios because such GPUs normally have a limit in there set to 1202; looks s.th. like this 'unraveled'
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> # Fan settings
> Fan_Min = 10
> Fan_Max = 100
> 
> # Board power settings
> Max_Power_Target = 130
> 
> Max_Boost_Freq = 1202
> 
> # Voltage = 1212500
> Voltage = 1200000
> # Voltage = 1187500
> # Voltage = 1175000
> # Voltage = 1162500
> # Voltage = 1150000
Click to expand...

My GPU is already hitting 63C so I will wait until I water it.

I'm thinking my bottleneck is more on the CPU side for higher benchmark scores but that's just a thought.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My GPU is already hitting 63C so I will wait until I water it.
> 
> I'm thinking my bottleneck is more on the CPU side for higher benchmark scores but that's just a thought.


bottleneck? no way


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I suggest getting either Gelid Silent 12's, Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-15's, Noctua nf-f12 pwm's or BeQuiet! Silent Wing's (black fans, quite similar to nf-f12 pwm without the ugly noctua color scheme, and quieter with a tad less static pressure).
> And, go push and not pull on your rads, most fans are designed for push and will make a strange noise in pull mode (the nf-f12 does for instance)
> Oh, and don't buy noiseblockers, their static pressure is kinda meh and they are severely over priced.
> Yeah, till we see how Ivy-e or Haswell overclock, on ln2...I don't care. Just gimme back fsb overclocking and then we're talkin'


Yea I was actually thinking of doing a pull into the inside of the case from the top and then that can go out of the outside of the case.


----------



## Desert Rat

I just ordered CLU for my delid and should be here by next week. Have anyone tried CLU on their gpu's and had good results? I got 2 FTW 660TI's on the way and would like to try it out before I put them in the system.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desert Rat*
> 
> I just ordered CLU for my delid and should be here by next week. Have anyone tried CLU on their gpu's and had good results? I got 2 FTW 660TI's on the way and would like to try it out before I put them in the system.


Make sure there's no aluminum coming in contact with the CLU.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I was actually thinking of doing a pull into the inside of the case from the top and then that can go out of the outside of the case.


You will be fine on pull config.

Get these

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16059/fan-999/Scythe_Gentle_Typhoon_120mm_x_25mm_Fan_-_2150_RPM_D1225C12B6AP-45_New_Speed.html?tl=g36c15s60

They got the price per performance..


----------



## josephimports

OCN name: *josephimports*
Method: *razorless by fnarfbargle*
CPU: *3770K*
on die-TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra*
ihs-TIM: *MX4*
Mhz gained: *200*
OC after delid: *4800*
Temp drops: *~20c*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2756079







While originally intending to do the razor method, i chickened out a few times. The last time managing to clear two corners, but then i scraped the top of the ihs and freaked out. I thought I scratched the pcb.







So when I saw the razorless video, I said to myself, that looks way too easy and sure enough, it was. Its this thread/forum that continues to fuel this hobby for me, so thanks everyone.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You will be fine on pull config.
> 
> Get these
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/16059/fan-999/Scythe_Gentle_Typhoon_120mm_x_25mm_Fan_-_2150_RPM_D1225C12B6AP-45_New_Speed.html?tl=g36c15s60
> 
> They got the price per performance..


Hey Hokies I'm going to take a picture of my PCB on my Sapphire 7950 sometime today. Would you be able to confirm that it is reference for me?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desert Rat*
> 
> I just ordered CLU for my delid and should be here by next week. Have anyone tried CLU on their gpu's and had good results? I got 2 FTW 660TI's on the way and would like to try it out before I put them in the system.


I have done it on my two 7950's, but I ended up taking it off because I got scared it would eventually short something out so I replaced it with mx4 and still had pretty decent temp drops. CLU dropped temps about 8c and mx4 dropped temps about 5c.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

over 400 replies - mother of....time to scroll back


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey Hokies I'm going to take a picture of my PCB on my Sapphire 7950 sometime today. Would you be able to confirm that it is reference for me?


Yes


----------



## Desert Rat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Make sure there's no aluminum coming in contact with the CLU.


Thanks for the tip









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I have done it on my two 7950's, but I ended up taking it off because I got scared it would eventually short something out so I replaced it with mx4 and still had pretty decent temp drops. CLU dropped temps about 8c and mx4 dropped temps about 5c.


Glad to hear that it makes that much of a diference since Nvidia throttles at 70c. I should have both cards by tomorrow and will replace the grease with mx4 since I have buckets of that laying around


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> OCN name: *josephimports*
> Method: *razorless by fnarfbargle*
> CPU: *3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra*
> ihs-TIM: *MX4*
> Mhz gained: *200*
> OC after delid: *4800*
> Temp drops: *~20c*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2756079
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While originally intending to do the razor method, i chickened out a few times. The last time managing to clear two corners, but then i scraped the top of the ihs and freaked out. I thought I scratched the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So when I saw the razorless video, I said to myself, that looks way too easy and sure enough, it was. Its this thread/forum that continues to fuel this hobby for me, so thanks everyone.


You're In!







Now slap the Sig ona nd be proud of it!


----------



## Yosarian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> OCN name: *josephimports*
> Method: *razorless by fnarfbargle*
> CPU: *3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra*
> ihs-TIM: *MX4*
> Mhz gained: *200*
> OC after delid: *4800*
> Temp drops: *~20c*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2756079
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While originally intending to do the razor method, i chickened out a few times. The last time managing to clear two corners, but then i scraped the top of the ihs and freaked out. I thought I scratched the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So when I saw the razorless video, I said to myself, that looks way too easy and sure enough, it was. Its this thread/forum that continues to fuel this hobby for me, so thanks everyone.


Wow, congrats!
You should go and post your success story here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yes


Thanks a lot. The pcb on the Sapphire is blue so I hope that doesn't mean that it isn't reference.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

3770k arrives today!

Any advice would be appreciated
I have read alot about these 3770k's burning out in few weeks, I'm not sure if it was just peoples bad luck or something to do with a series of batches manufactured by intel
Should I wait a month running stock to delidd? I now not only am scared of delidding, but delidding so early with a new chip, it burning out and having no RMA


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> what i used.
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17887/ex-tub-1620/PrimoChill_PrimoFlex_Advanced_LRT_Tubing_38ID_x_58_OD_-_10ft_Retail_Pack_-_Bloodshed_Red_PFLEXA10-58-R_w_Free_Sys_Prep.html?tl=g30c99s1615


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That is PERFECT. Thank you!


Just wanted to add, that is the tubing I bought and found it is incompatible with Swiftech fittings because what PrimoChill calls 5/8 is not what Swiftech calls 5/8. It is also pretty stiff stuff and nowhere near as easy to bend as the stock tubing on the H220. I am looking for more flexible tubing now to replace the PrimoChill because I have some difficult turns to make in my loop.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> 3770k arrives today!
> 
> Any advice would be appreciated
> *I have read alot about these 3770k's burning out in few weeks,* I'm not sure if it was just peoples bad luck or something to do with a series of batches manufactured by intel
> Should I wait a month running stock to delidd? I now not only am scared of delidding, but delidding so early with a new chip, it burning out and having no RMA


Burning out how?

Ive ran 1.54v since Oct 2012.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desert Rat*
> 
> Thanks for the tip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glad to hear that it makes that much of a diference since Nvidia throttles at 70c. I should have both cards by tomorrow and will replace the grease with mx4 since I have buckets of that laying around


I tried ultra on my 690 and got terrible results because I applied it incorrectly. I bought pro after using all of the ultra and now my gpu never goes above 34c full load (under water). Just make sure you apply it very thinly, I used a q-tip (doesn't have to be included ones) for CLP and it should be the same with ultra. If you want you can also apply it to the gpu block as well as the core, that is what I did and got very good results. If you apply too much then the performance will be bad, but if you apply too little then there won't be contact between the gpu core and the block because both pastes are thin, and you will get terrible results. The first time around I even got ultra on my pcb but nothing happened, if you spread it correctly then it will never drip. Also make sure to NOT move the block when mounting, try to get it as steady as possible, in my experience CLU or CLP don't like to be moved after making contact.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> 3770k arrives today!
> 
> Any advice would be appreciated
> I have read alot about these 3770k's burning out in few weeks, I'm not sure if it was just peoples bad luck or something to do with a series of batches manufactured by intel
> Should I wait a month running stock to delidd? I now not only am scared of delidding, but delidding so early with a new chip, it burning out and having no RMA


ive never heard of them burning out. oh wait there is 1 way. cough... 1.9v ... cough


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive never heard of them burning out. oh wait there is 1 way. cough... 1.9v ... cough


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Burning out how?
> 
> Ive ran 1.54v since Oct 2012.


Of course







If you are implying that intel chips don't just "burn out" that would be ridiculous. People have received DOA chips on top of chips that burn out within weeks

Quickest post I could find
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ph4ntom*
> 
> hi all.
> 
> has anyone seen a batch# 3241F405 from Costa Rica i7 3770K just recived it , had a Malay L223B657 that burned on me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> last week


Also, don't want to go digging through the forums but it's there if you want to search

I just want to take precautions, if I get a chip today, delidd tomorrow, dies next week, I can't RMA, it doesn't cost you money and you don't care, that is why im relying on fellow OCN user experiences


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive never heard of them burning out. oh wait there is 1 way. cough... 1.9v ... cough


Any chip sent over to Valgaur's house is basically a death sentence.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive never heard of them burning out. oh wait there is 1 way. cough... 1.9v ... cough


Hi!


----------



## darkphantom

Just got done delidding, video in the "delid without razor" thread.

Will post the updates in temps tonight


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkphantom*
> 
> Just got done delidding, video in the "delid without razor" thread.
> 
> Will post the updates in temps tonight


awsome! with that new way of deliding with out a razor this thread is guna blow up! one big delidded family lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> awsome! with that new way of deliding with out a razor this thread is guna blow up! one big delidded family lol


Moar minions! I mean family!


----------



## lilchronic

look another trying it out. lol he will try again tommorow lol


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Just wanted to add, that is the tubing I bought and found it is incompatible with Swiftech fittings because what PrimoChill calls 5/8 is not what Swiftech calls 5/8. It is also pretty stiff stuff and nowhere near as easy to bend as the stock tubing on the H220. I am looking for more flexible tubing now to replace the PrimoChill because I have some difficult turns to make in my loop.


Would you be able to recommend some good tubing that won't kink but is easy to bend around. It would be awesome if it was red. How many different 5/8ths tubing is there??? Also, could someone recommend a pump that would be able to run a single loop really well with my two 7950's and 3770k? I really don't want to have to use two pumps because I'm going to have a lot of trouble fitting both of them. Also, I don't want one that is really loud. Is that even possible? Another question, I'm. Wondering what I could use to seperate my case right above the PSU from the rest of the case. What type of material could I use to do something like that? I want it to be white so is there a certain type of paint thatt would be best for this? Sorry for all the questions I'm just having a lot of trouble planning all of this out. If you want to see what u want it to look like I posted a link to a picture a couple pages back. I would post it again but I'm on my phone so it is hard enough to type this as it is.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Would you be able to recommend some good tubing that won't kink but is easy to bend around. It would be awesome if it was red. How many different 5/8ths tubing is there??? Also, could someone recommend a pump that would be able to run a single loop really well with my two 7950's and 3770k? I really don't want to have to use two pumps because I'm going to have a lot of trouble fitting both of them. Also, I don't want one that is really loud. Is that even possible? Another question, I'm. Wondering what I could use to seperate my case right above the PSU from the rest of the case. What type of material could I use to do something like that? I want it to be white so is there a certain type of paint thatt would be best for this? Sorry for all the questions I'm just having a lot of trouble planning all of this out. If you want to see what u want it to look like I posted a link to a picture a couple pages back. I would post it again but I'm on my phone so it is hard enough to type this as it is.


You need to stay with what i linked.. it bends i have the 1/2 x 3/4 which is by far the hardest to bend.. and i bent it..

Staying with what i linked you helps you avoid plasticizer / clouding issues other tubing brands suffer from.

Only other brand i know with UV red with out these issues is feser http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/fetuftacuvho3.html " out of stock "

But there is some here.. http://www.amazon.com/Feser-Active-UV-Hose-Feet/dp/B002GUFW3W


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> look another trying it out. lol he will try again tommorow lol


That's the guy three posts above you, darkphantom. lol and he succeeded today.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive never heard of them burning out. oh wait there is 1 way. cough... 1.9v ... cough


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hi!


FRANK THE TANK!!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

*@RavageTheEarth; Hokies83*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You need to stay with what i linked.. it bends i have the 1/2 x 3/4 which is by far the hardest to bend.. and i bent it..
> 
> Staying with what i linked you helps you avoid plasticizer / clouding issues other tubing brands suffer from.
> 
> Only other brand i know with UV red with out these issues is feser http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/fetuftacuvho3.html " out of stock "
> 
> But there is some here.. http://www.amazon.com/Feser-Active-UV-Hose-Feet/dp/B002GUFW3W


...I also use 1/2 x 3/4 PrimoChill tubing...Advanced LRT / bloodshed red (on Swiftech 1/2 compression fittings), and I agree with Hokies (not always but today







) - while the PrimoChill tubes of that diameter can behave a bit like *cranky Pythons* initially, you'll have far less trouble later. In addition, I am not sure if these w-c tricks / hints were already posted...in case they were not, here are some tips I received from a pro when I did my first custom-loop recently:








..if the tubes don't want to easily slide over a barb or work in a compression fitting, you can dip one end in a cup of fairly warm water for a couple of minutes, then use a needle-nose pliers to open them up a bit (carefully)...








...I use Teflon plumber tape on all screw-in fittings that touch the cooling liquid, but only on the first few threads - you don't want bits of Teflon floating around in your loop (pump!) later...








...make sure that your reservoir is near and slightly above your pump as you need to make certain that your pump never runs dry...








...before you start, buy a few gallons of distilled water and thoroughly flush your radiator several times...you would be surprised how many little pieces of dirt / paint shavings come out, even in a brad new all-copper or brass setup...I even flushed the tubes and the Koolance block before mounting...








...when placing the MPC655 pump, make sure that you can reach the back adjustment screw once mounted...also, consider that down the road, you need to flush / drain the system for maintenance, so plan accordingly re access to drain plugs etc...








...unless you run cooling liquids with anti-bacterial additives, you may also want to glue a small piece of silver tape in your reservoir as silver is a really good anti-bacterial agent

...and now back to our regular programming: Hokies83 - I hear you're switching away from Gigabyte boards and AMD 7k series GPUs to the real thing / ROG boards with Nvidia GPUs


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Alright Hokies, here it is:





It looks reference to me. I need a second opinion though


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright Hokies, here it is:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Wait, what?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright Hokies, here it is:


Looks ref to me
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@RavageTheEarth; Hokies83*
> ...I also use 1/2 x 3/4 PrimoChill tubing...Advanced LRT / bloodshed red (on Swiftech 1/2 compression fittings), and I agree with Hokies (not always but today
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) - while the PrimoChill tubes of that diameter can behave a bit like *cranky Pythons* initially, you'll have far less trouble later. In addition, I am not sure if these w-c tricks / hints were already posted...in case they were not, here are some tips I received from a pro when I did my first custom-loop recently:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..if the tubes don't want to easily slide over a barb or work in a compression fitting, you can dip one end in a cup of fairly warm water for a couple of minutes, then use a needle-nose pliers to open them up a bit (carefully)...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I use Teflon plumber tape on all screw-in fittings that touch the cooling liquid, but only on the first few threads - you don't want bits of Teflon floating around in your loop (pump!) later...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...make sure that your reservoir is near and slightly above your pump as you need to make certain that your pump never runs dry...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...before you start, buy a few gallons of distilled water and thoroughly flush your radiator several times...you would be surprised how many little pieces of dirt / paint shavings come out, even in a brad new all-copper or brass setup...I even flushed the tubes and the Koolance block before mounting...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...when placing the MPC655 pump, make sure that you can reach the back adjustment screw once mounted...also, consider that down the road, you need to flush / drain the system for maintenance, so plan accordingly re access to drain plugs etc...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...unless you run cooling liquids with anti-bacterial additives, you may also want to glue a small piece of silver tape in your reservoir as silver is a really good anti-bacterial agent
> 
> *...and now back to our regular programming: Hokies83 - I hear you're switching away from Gigabyte boards and AMD 7k series GPUs to the real thing / ROG boards with Nvidia GPUs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *


Gigabyte boards are better then Rog boards









I did own an X58 RE3 it was a nice board. And my HTPC is an Asus board...

Also i did own 2 of the very top tier GTX 680s for a good 8 months..

And 2 other 2GB 680s...

These Amd Gpus kick there butts pretty hard tho.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I tried ultra on my 690.. Also make sure to NOT move the block when mounting, try to get it as steady as possible, in my experience CLU or CLP don't like to be moved after making contact.


^^^ very good point...when I did my 4 cards, the final alignment always led to a bit of sliding-around which is not good with CL U/Pro...so I ended up using 4 thin straws as 'alignment pins' by putting them through the cooler-assembly and through the matching 4 screw holes in the PCB, then lowering it down evenly.


----------



## dr/owned

Gallium melts at 85F....which is largely what CLU is. Seems like you would want to "preheat" your parts before putting them together, and this would give you a lot more "wiggle room" (literally).


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@RavageTheEarth; Hokies83*
> ...I also use 1/2 x 3/4 PrimoChill tubing...Advanced LRT / bloodshed red (on Swiftech 1/2 compression fittings), and I agree with Hokies (not always but today
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) - while the PrimoChill tubes of that diameter can behave a bit like *cranky Pythons* initially, you'll have far less trouble later. In addition, I am not sure if these w-c tricks / hints were already posted...in case they were not, here are some tips I received from a pro when I did my first custom-loop recently:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..if the tubes don't want to easily slide over a barb or work in a compression fitting, you can dip one end in a cup of fairly warm water for a couple of minutes, then use a needle-nose pliers to open them up a bit (carefully)...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I use Teflon plumber tape on all screw-in fittings that touch the cooling liquid, but only on the first few threads - you don't want bits of Teflon floating around in your loop (pump!) later...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...make sure that your reservoir is near and slightly above your pump as you need to make certain that your pump never runs dry...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...before you start, buy a few gallons of distilled water and thoroughly flush your radiator several times...you would be surprised how many little pieces of dirt / paint shavings come out, even in a brad new all-copper or brass setup...I even flushed the tubes and the Koolance block before mounting...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...when placing the MPC655 pump, make sure that you can reach the back adjustment screw once mounted...also, consider that down the road, you need to flush / drain the system for maintenance, so plan accordingly re access to drain plugs etc...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...unless you run cooling liquids with anti-bacterial additives, you may also want to glue a small piece of silver tape in your reservoir as silver is a really good anti-bacterial agent
> 
> ...and now back to our regular programming: Hokies83 - I hear you're switching away from Gigabyte boards and AMD 7k series GPUs to the real thing / ROG boards with Nvidia GPUs


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You need to stay with what i linked.. it bends i have the 1/2 x 3/4 which is by far the hardest to bend.. and i bent it..
> 
> Staying with what i linked you helps you avoid plasticizer / clouding issues other tubing brands suffer from.
> 
> Only other brand i know with UV red with out these issues is feser http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/fetuftacuvho3.html " out of stock "
> 
> But there is some here.. http://www.amazon.com/Feser-Active-UV-Hose-Feet/dp/B002GUFW3W


Thanks a lot guys I'll stick with that tubing. I really appreciate those tips too I'm going to save them in a word pad to look at when I'm putting the loop together. A tighter fit is always better than a looser one! I really do like that tubing so I'm glad it will work. So with the MPC655 would I be able to run a single loop with one pump? I have some people telling me that it will be more than enough and others saying that I have to use two of them if I want to run a single loop. So what is the truth here? I'm being pulled in two different directions.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Thanks a lot guys I'll stick with that tubing. I really appreciate those tips too I'm going to save them in a word pad to look at when I'm putting the loop together. A tighter fit is always better than a looser one! I really do like that tubing so I'm glad it will work. So with the MPC655 would I be able to run a single loop with one pump? I have some people telling me that it will be more than enough and others saying that I have to use two of them if I want to run a single loop. So what is the truth here? I'm being pulled in two different directions.


For your Loop one mcp 655 is enough...

LoL when u get into loops like mine is when u need 2...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Looks ref to me
> [/B]
> 
> Gigabyte boards are better then Rog boards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did own an X58 RE3 it was a nice board. And my HTPC is an Asus board...
> 
> Also i did own 2 of the very top tier GTX 680s for a good 8 months..
> 
> And 2 other 2GB 680s...
> 
> These Amd Gpus kick there butts pretty hard tho.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


...wait til FtW and/or IvanL see all your pics of older but powerful cards







...they might want to buy them from you because *'if you can LN2 it, they will do it'*


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> For your Loop one mcp 655 is enough...
> 
> LoL when u get into loops like mine is when u need 2...


My coming build will be caseless, with tubing running to a 1080radiator I will mount on my wall. I hope two pumps will be enough.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> My coming build will be caseless, with tubing running to a 1080radiator I will mount on my wall. I hope two pumps will be enough.


1 pump is enough for a 1080 rad.. depends on gpu water blocks / lengh of tubing.

But if u wanna be safe with 1 pump look at the D5 Strong and the mcp 35x


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Gallium melts at 85F....which is largely what CLU is. Seems like you would want to "preheat" your parts before putting them together, and this would give you a lot more "wiggle room" (literally).


It's a good thing it boils at 4000+faren, because it would get really messy really soon if it was closer to 85


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 1 pump is enough for a 1080 rad.. depends on gpu water blocks / lengh of tubing.
> 
> But if u wanna be safe with 1 pump look at the D5 Strong and the mcp 35x


How much tubing did you use? Because I expect at least 5ft. running to the wall and then 5ft. running back, and this isn't counting the tubing between the components.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How much tubing did you use? Because I expect at least 5ft. running to the wall and then 5ft. running back, and this isn't counting the tubing between the components.


12 feet maybe.. i wasted alot.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 12 feet maybe.. i wasted alot.


You used 12ft and did not make the tubes as short as possible or you bought 12ft and wasted? Because for my current build I bought like 20ft and ended up using around 3ft with none to spare, yeah messed up alot lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yeah now how do i connect it and I want the liquid to flow from one gpu to the next not through them all at once. I want MSI lightnings.... like seriously.... besides those what ones are good? (btw so far on pricing without gpus and blocks for gpus and connects of the gpus bridge thingy deal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm at around 1800 I believe.)
> 
> This is without fans btw....


Man, are you a gamer or a bencher?
Come on, either buy dual Titans or quad 7970's...go big or go home.
Or grab a ton of old gpus and gpu pots, and a 3930k system for vantage and 3dm11. (the rest with 1155 at 6.5ghz)
I suppose Ivy bridge hexa cores will beat everything at 3d, once IB-E is out, IF they overclock to 6.2ghz on ln2 (comparing current x79 performance at 3d, the extra threads help, even with lower clocks cause of SB arch)
BUT if Haswell comes with bclk straps, and overclocks 10% more than IB and has 10% more ipc, IB-E is doomed.

EDIT: Oh, and btw, you want any of these gpus in no particular order:

-Asus 7970 DcuII TOP
-Asus 7970 Matrix Platinum
-HIS 7970 X Turbo something (beast as the matrix, and cheaper)
-Msi 7970 Lightning

Peace








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...wait til FtW and/or IvanL see all your pics of older but powerful cards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...they might want to buy them from you because *'if you can LN2 it, they will do it'*












You know it! Sadly, knowing Hokies, I know he has already sold most of the old stuff to fund the new gen.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hi!


Mr. Valgaur..per yesterday's and earlier posts, it would be great to get some MSI 680 Lightnings...now that I have a 2nd ROG, I need more GPUs ! I found 2 places in town that advertised the 680 Lightnings as 'in stock'...these are older, less busy shops with web sites that have not changed their look in years.. so there actually was a chance that they had some dusting away in the back...I drove up there earlier today, intending to buy 4-6 (and re-sell 2 to you at cost)...alas, 'no cigar'







- they did check with their suppliers but the word 'unavailable' was used a lot...I have one more serious lead and will let you know...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I suppose Ivy bridge hexa cores will beat everything at 3d, once IB-E is out, IF they overclock to 6.2ghz on ln2 (comparing current x79 performance at 3d, the extra threads help, even with lower clocks cause of SB arch)
> BUT if Haswell comes with bclk straps, and overclocks 10% more than IB and has 10% more ipc, IB-E is doomed.


So you're saying haswell > ivy-e? I don't think Intel would release ivy hexa cores 6 months after they release haswell if it performs better.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You used 12ft and did not make the tubes as short as possible or you bought 12ft and wasted? Because for my current build I bought like 20ft and ended up using around 3ft with none to spare, yeah messed up alot lol.


Wasted alot of it think i got about 9 foot in the case


----------



## justanoldman

So when you "delid" your gpu, CL Ultra is safe to use as long as you do it right, correct? Or would MX-4 be better for gpu dies?

Does color of water cooling tubing matter? As in all black not letting any light vs. a clear tubing?

Since you guys are experts and like the PrimoChill tubing, will I run into trouble using the XSPC High Flex tubing that several people have told me to use if want more flex?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Mr. Valgaur..per yesterday's and earlier posts, it would be great to get some MSI 680 Lightnings...now that I have a 2nd ROG, I need more GPUs ! I found 2 places in town that advertised the 680 Lightnings as 'in stock'...these are older, less busy shops with web sites that have not changed their look in years.. so there actually was a chance that they had some dusting away in the back...I drove up there earlier today, intending to buy 4-6 (and re-sell 2 to you at cost)...alas, 'no cigar'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - they did check with their suppliers but the word 'unavailable' was used a lot...I have one more serious lead and will let you know...


He already has 680s he is looking for 7970 lightnings because they destroy 600 series when overclocked, plus the new drivers. It's nice because everyone like myself who has the cooling to overclock isn't voltage locked. 7970/7950s you can overclock like mad worrying more about cooling rather than voltage wall.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So when you "delid" your gpu, CL Ultra is safe to use as long as you do it right, correct? Or would MX-4 be better for gpu dies?
> 
> Does color of water cooling tubing matter? As in all black not letting any light vs. a clear tubing?
> 
> Since you guys are experts and like the PrimoChill tubing, will I run into trouble using the XSPC High Flex tubing that several people have told me to use if want more flex?


Well it's more about performance if you do it wrong rather than safe. I got some on my pcb and nothing happened. I posted a page back on things you need to do carefully.

Color of tubing for what temperature reasons? Shouldn't matter everything is at ambient temperature. Yeah the color black absorbs heat faster but cools faster, but I doubt the difference is even measurable.

As for xspc tubing some say it is terrible, others say it decent, I think it might fog tho...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So you're saying haswell > ivy-e? I don't think Intel would release ivy hexa cores 6 months after they release haswell if it performs better.


Re-read my post, I was talking strictly about benchmarking on ln2.
Ambient cooling at stock is all Intel cares about, and that's how the people who benefit from the extra threads for daily and pro work run their chips (mostly).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So when you "delid" your gpu, CL Ultra is safe to use as long as you do it right, correct? Or would MX-4 be better for gpu dies?
> 
> Does color of water cooling tubing matter? As in all black not letting any light vs. a clear tubing?
> 
> Since you guys are experts and like the PrimoChill tubing, will I run into trouble using the XSPC High Flex tubing that several people have told me to use if want more flex?


Same behavior as cpu dies really...I didn't even check if my gtx 670 ftw's cooler was aluminum and just poured cl ultra on it.








25c drops!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> He already has 680s he is looking for 7970 lightnings because they destroy 600 series when overclocked, plus the new drivers. It's nice because everyone like myself who has the cooling to overclock isn't voltage locked. 7970/7950s you can overclock like mad worrying more about cooling rather than voltage wall.


HEAVILY modded 680s can beat 7970s at Heaven, Vantage and 3dm11 (maybe Firestrike) but now with Titan out, there's no point unless you're a gamer or a green fanboi.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> He already has 680s he is looking for 7970 lightnings because they destroy 600 series when overclocked, plus the new drivers. It's nice because everyone like myself who has the cooling to overclock isn't voltage locked. 7970/7950s you can overclock like mad worrying more about cooling rather than voltage wall.


...may be I misunderstood him when he wrote a couple of pages back that: "I am having a tough time finding the lightnings though...."

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/15670#post_19666444

...no matter - in a few months time, we'll all be reading about engineering samples of 700 / 8000 series GPUs anyways


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So when you "delid" your gpu, CL Ultra is safe to use as long as you do it right, correct? Or would MX-4 be better for gpu dies?
> 
> Does color of water cooling tubing matter? As in all black not letting any light vs. a clear tubing?
> 
> *Since you guys are experts and like the PrimoChill tubing, will I run into trouble using the XSPC High Flex tubing that several people have told me to use if want more flex?*


Lots of issues with Cloudy build up reported with the XSPC stuff.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys with android devices, get this: http://www.engadget.com/2013/04/02/3dmark-android-benchmark-now-on-google-play/

Check the play store, it's free


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> HEAVILY modded 680s can beat 7970s at Heaven, Vantage and 3dm11 (maybe Firestrike) but now with Titan out, there's no point unless you're a gamer or a green fanboi.


Heavily modded as in what? Increasing power target doesn't do that much, and the voltage still has a limit even though it's a bit higher. I already modded my 690 bios not much different than a 680 one. If you're talking about hardware modding maybe, but if you can do that on the 680 then you can also do that on 7970.

Also what does titan have to do with 7970?


----------



## Hokies83

I guess he means Magic lol cause there is no way..... unless u got a heavy modded Gtx 680 with LN2 at 2000mhz/+1000 Mem lol.

Cause even Overclcoked 7950s beat over clocked 680s in those 9 times out of 10 lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> .....I didn't even check if my gtx 670 ftw's cooler was aluminum and just poured cl ultra on it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 25c drops!
> HEAVILY modded 680s can beat 7970s at Heaven, Vantage and 3dm11 (maybe Firestrike) but now with Titan out, there's no point unless you're a gamer or a green fanboi.


right you are...it makes little difference as there are many great cards by both NVidia and AMD...here is the current Heaven World record ranking...open class so that includes engineering samples, LN2 etc...as you know I compete in that (with tips from you and FtW on mem - tx again) and there are 7970ies and 680ies/690ies above and below...as I said, many great cards by several producers, both in the 'red' and the 'green team'...









BTW, this all reminds me of wrestling with my cousin regularly as to which was better - BMW or Mercedes (what our dad's drove back in Europe)...then one day, our father's switched alliances - my dad bought a used Mercedes (Diesel) and my uncle a used BMW...there was about a week of peace....then my cousin and I started wrestling again, only on different sides than before


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Heavily modded as in what? Increasing power target doesn't do that much, and the voltage still has a limit even though it's a bit higher. I already modded my 690 bios not much different than a 680 one. If you're talking about hardware modding maybe, but if you can do that on the 680 then you can also do that on 7970.
> 
> Also what does titan have to do with 7970?


http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1682
Again, Titan has to do with performance, I'm talking strictly about benchmarking. I'm not into gaming with uber high details, in fact my main rig is a pentium 4 631 atm, with intel hd graphics (soon to be a 6950 1gb) and that would be fine for my needs lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I guess he means Magic lol cause there is no way..... unless u got a heavy modded Gtx 680 with LN2 at 2000mhz/+1000 Mem lol.
> 
> Cause even Overclcoked 7950s beat over clocked 680s in those 9 times out of 10 lol.


Exactly...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> right you are...it makes little difference as there are many great cards by both NVidia and AMD...here is the current Heaven World record ranking...open class so that includes engineering samples, LN2 etc...as you know I compete in that (with tips from you and FtW on mem - tx again) and there are 7970ies and 680ies/690ies above and below...as I said, many great cards by several producers, both in the 'red' and the 'green team'...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, this all reminds me of wrestling with my cousin regularly as to which was better - BMW or Mercedes (what our dad's drove back in Europe)...then one day, our father's switched alliances - my dad bought a used Mercedes (Diesel) and my uncle a used BMW...there was about a week of peace....then my cousin and I started wrestling again, only on different sides than before


Heaven xtreme is more of an AMD camp, basic yeah, greenish so to speak


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1682
> Again, Titan has to do with performance, I'm talking strictly about benchmarking. I'm not into gaming with uber high details, in fact my main rig is a pentium 4 631 atm, with intel hd graphics (soon to be a 6950 1gb) and that would be fine for my needs lol
> Exactly...
> Heaven xtreme is more of an AMD camp, basic yeah, greenish so to speak


.yeah, it really varies by bench mark competition...and the driver 'mods' that are allowed

BTW, on Titan - as gorgeous as they are, they still are 'rejects' (bad term, I know) from certain Tesla foundry wafers..if NVidia would want to, they could release even faster Titans (based on the K20X I think)...but why ? They can sell all the top-of-the line Tesla's at $3k +


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Looks ref to me
> [/B]
> 
> Gigabyte boards are better then Rog boards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did own an X58 RE3 it was a nice board. And my HTPC is an Asus board...
> 
> Also i did own 2 of the very top tier GTX 680s for a good 8 months..
> 
> And 2 other 2GB 680s...
> 
> These Amd Gpus kick there butts pretty hard tho.


\Wait, the card pictured there is reference? I got a powercolor 7970 when the 7000 series launched, I always thought it was reference since they were the first ones out, but my PCB is different.
Did they actually have reference & non reference out on launch day?

Also, you seem to have been listening to sin too much & have GB on the brain...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...wait til FtW and/or IvanL see all your pics of older but powerful cards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...they might want to buy them from you because *'if you can LN2 it, they will do it'*


There are some nice ones there, but I guess I've never shown a pic of my gpu collection here...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man, are you a gamer or a bencher?
> Come on, either buy dual Titans or quad 7970's...go big or go home.
> Or grab a ton of old gpus and gpu pots, and a 3930k system for vantage and 3dm11. (the rest with 1155 at 6.5ghz)
> I suppose Ivy bridge hexa cores will beat everything at 3d, once IB-E is out, IF they overclock to 6.2ghz on ln2 (comparing current x79 performance at 3d, the extra threads help, even with lower clocks cause of SB arch)
> BUT if Haswell comes with bclk straps, and overclocks 10% more than IB and has 10% more ipc, IB-E is doomed.
> 
> EDIT: Oh, and btw, you want any of these gpus in no particular order:
> 
> -Asus 7970 DcuII TOP
> -Asus 7970 Matrix Platinum
> -HIS 7970 X Turbo something (beast as the matrix, and cheaper)
> -Msi 7970 Lightning
> 
> Peace
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know it! Sadly, knowing Hokies, I know he has already sold most of the old stuff to fund the new gen.


Ivy bridge at 6.2Ghz + can start to edge out sb-e in 3dmark 11. With enough clockspeed & good memory the higher gpu scores ivy gets can overcome the physics score advantage of the hexcore.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So you're saying haswell > ivy-e? I don't think Intel would release ivy hexa cores 6 months after they release haswell if it performs better.


It better not... It's pretty much impossible for the quad core to overcome the hexcore in multithread use.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Heavily modded as in what? Increasing power target doesn't do that much, and the voltage still has a limit even though it's a bit higher. I already modded my 690 bios not much different than a 680 one. If you're talking about hardware modding maybe, but if you can do that on the 680 then you can also do that on 7970.
> 
> Also what does titan have to do with 7970?


It is a lot more hardmodding & software tricks to get the 680 performance high enough to beat the 7970, but it is doable. 8 pack from OCN put a lot of time into his cards to take some world records with the 680 before titan launched. It was him & kingpin with 680s above a sea of 7970s in the ranks.


----------



## Hokies83

That is a Ref 7950 PCB


The ref 7970 Pcb is different.



Sin knows his stuff







he the only one who goes so far in depth with these boards he is the only person i trust when im looking at a board.. i just pick up the phone give him a call and ask..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That is a Ref 7950 PCB
> 
> 
> The ref 7970 Pcb is different.
> 
> 
> 
> Sin knows his stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> he the only one who goes so far in depth with these boards he is the only person i trust when im looking at a board.. i just pick up the phone give him a call and ask..


7950, I missed that part, thanks. Made me wonder for a minute...

He does know boards, his reviews are as in-depth as they get. Almost too long of a read, but if there's anything you need to know about a board, it's in there. There was some learning curve & he has made some mistakes, learned form them & carried on.
He is honest as well, most reps will push the hardware they represent at all cost, when asked straight up if a different board is better than the GB he will say so when it is.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man, are you a gamer or a bencher?
> Come on, either buy dual Titans or quad 7970's...go big or go home.
> Or grab a ton of old gpus and gpu pots, and a 3930k system for vantage and 3dm11. (the rest with 1155 at 6.5ghz)
> I suppose Ivy bridge hexa cores will beat everything at 3d, once IB-E is out, IF they overclock to 6.2ghz on ln2 (comparing current x79 performance at 3d, the extra threads help, even with lower clocks cause of SB arch)
> BUT if Haswell comes with bclk straps, and overclocks 10% more than IB and has 10% more ipc, IB-E is doomed.
> 
> EDIT: Oh, and btw, you want any of these gpus in no particular order:
> 
> -Asus 7970 DcuII TOP
> -Asus 7970 Matrix Platinum
> -HIS 7970 X Turbo something (beast as the matrix, and cheaper)
> -Msi 7970 Lightning
> 
> Peace
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know it! Sadly, knowing Hokies, I know he has already sold most of the old stuff to fund the new gen.


I'm both lol, born gamer but I'm turning into a bencher







so I need a gaming rig and a benching rig as well. I just really want to do an epic build. I don't know... might throw the ivy in it to save money... but I do need a nice x79 anyways.... but man whole new build basically lol. I'm gonna get LN2 stuff this summer as well and bench during school








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Mr. Valgaur..per yesterday's and earlier posts, it would be great to get some MSI 680 Lightnings...now that I have a 2nd ROG, I need more GPUs ! I found 2 places in town that advertised the 680 Lightnings as 'in stock'...these are older, less busy shops with web sites that have not changed their look in years.. so there actually was a chance that they had some dusting away in the back...I drove up there earlier today, intending to buy 4-6 (and re-sell 2 to you at cost)...alas, 'no cigar'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - they did check with their suppliers but the word 'unavailable' was used a lot...I have one more serious lead and will let you know...


Don't worry I'm currently broke as heck right now so don't look to hard for me









What did you guys think of my ideas for parts though?.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm both lol, born gamer but I'm turning into a bencher
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so I need a gaming rig and a benching rig as well. I just really want to do an epic build. I don't know... might throw the ivy in it to save money... but I do need a nice x79 anyways.... but man whole new build basically lol. I'm gonna get LN2 stuff this summer as well and bench during school
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't worry I'm currently broke as heck right now so don't look to hard for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did you guys think of my ideas for parts though?.


...what ? Not selling a kidney or a lung ?









No worries, I'm not committing you to any purchases...if I find what I am looking for, there are several folks interested...As to your build-plans and ideas, they look very intriguing...once you start thinking 'outside the box', you realize that there is the 'Undiscovered Country...' Post some drawings though, if you like...{after the patent agent? )


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It is a lot more hardmodding & software tricks to get the 680 performance high enough to beat the 7970, but it is doable. 8 pack from OCN put a lot of time into his cards to take some world records with the 680 before titan launched. It was him & kingpin with 680s above a sea of 7970s in the ranks.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://kingpincooling.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1682


I must admit that is an interesting mod, I'll figure something like that out when I get my Ph.d in 8 years lol.

But anyway, my point was a non crazy watercooler unlike those two guys will still have much better results with overclocking a 7970 than a 680. Also it seems way more dangerous than delidding, incorrectly cut a trace and there goes $500.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, it's REAL tricky, even more so than modding 7970's for max clocks on ln2.
The voltage controller chip has many quirks...not worth it imho.


----------



## stickg1

I know everyone here is pro AMD when it comes to GPUs. And I was too, I had 6870, 2x 6870, 2x 6950, 7950, 7970, all in the past year. I sold my 7970 and got a 670. The gaming experience is much smoother. I don't get as high of benchmark scores but the tearing, flickering, and frame latency has vanished.

Some will say that it's inexperience on my part and I just needed to try messing with all sorts of settings to fix it. But I don't feel like I should have to mess with a $400 just to get it to work correctly. I don't mind installing a GPU, installing the drivers, and having no issues at all. That's the ideal scenario for me anyway.


----------



## lilchronic

my 670's keep up with any 7950's out there







. Now 7970 and 680 lightnings i got no chance.
and they aint even wet


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my 670's keep up with any 7950's out there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Now 7970 and 680 lightnings i got no chance.
> and they aint even wet


7950 @ 1100mhz/1500 = 7970 ghz at boost... all 3 of mine are at 1225/1600 atm









670 has no direct compute and this is why it falls behind... Also a 7950 pays for it's self in a month


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I know everyone here is pro AMD when it comes to GPUs. And I was too, I had 6870, 2x 6870, 2x 6950, 7950, 7970, all in the past year. I sold my 7970 and got a 670. The gaming experience is much smoother. I don't get as high of benchmark scores but the tearing, flickering, and frame latency has vanished.
> 
> Some will say that it's inexperience on my part and I just needed to try messing with all sorts of settings to fix it. But I don't feel like I should have to mess with a $400 just to get it to work correctly. I don't mind installing a GPU, installing the drivers, and having no issues at all. That's the ideal scenario for me anyway.


That's why I said "benching strictly" when I was discussing which gpus to get for Val...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's why I said "benching strictly" when I was discussing which gpus to get for Val...


Stick had driver issues i suspect...

As i to have had both and my 7950s are silky smooth.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've seen video comparisons and I don't think the frame time thingy is so bad as people make it out to be.

It's funny that the machine that does these measurements is sponsored by Nvidia...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Stick had driver issues i suspect...
> 
> As i to have had both and my 7950s are silky smooth.


Yeah something was off with those 7950s and 7970s I used.

The people I sold them too love them, so I know they weren't bad cards. I might have been doing something wrong.

I did have to sell my 32" HDTV and got a 24" IPS Panel because there is a problem that exists with ONLY nvidia and Panasonic HDTVs where I would have to unplug and plug the HDMI cable back in everytime I turned the monitor back on. That got old fast. This screen is small but it's a much better picture and the colors are fantastic so no real regrets at the end of the day.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 7950 @ 1100mhz/1500 = 7970 ghz at boost... all 3 of mine are at 1225/1600 atm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 670 has no direct compute and this is why it falls behind... Also a 7950 pays for it's self in a month


in tomb raider with tressfx it falls behind
i run mine 24/7 1306/7000 max oc on both cards 1346/7308


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys don't discuss that here...I've been slapped already xD
> You may wanna edit those posts.
> Also, if you want, we got pm. Jus sayin
> 
> The magic word ain't one starting with B but one starting with L.


/confused

PM


----------



## lilchronic

nevermind


----------



## alancsalt

The discussion of coin-mining is not permitted on OCN
Quote:


> ENTERPRISE - 5/10/11 at 4:57am
> 
> Due to a recent decision from the management team on Overclock.net we now will no longer support the discussion of Bitcoin or any other elements of it.
> 
> The Use of Bitcoin breaches our TOS as you can use Bitcoin to earn currency. It specifically states in the OCN TOS that you may not Directly or Indirectly profit from the use of OCN. As such we cannot support the Bitcoin project. We also feel that the Bitcoin project does not fit in with goals we strive for on OCN.
> 
> We have nothing against the Bitcoin project, it simply does not fit the purpose and goals of Overclock.Net


Not only Bit-coin, but all coin mining. This was confirmed with management. Posts regarding Coin Mining will be deleted.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Thanks for clarifying that here...I was doing your work


----------



## lilchronic

ok lets get back on topic here my 670's own lol









*Edit*
im just kidding guys, lol seems like it got real quite in here


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok lets get back on topic here my 670's own lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Edit*
> im just kidding guys, lol seems like it got real quite in here


...I love that spirit...but as some ancient philosophies point out...'be careful what you ask for'


----------



## darkphantom

Would you guys mind helping me?
http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/280

I don't want to double post so I will point to that thread.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I actually replied to your post...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I love that spirit...but as some ancient philosophies point out...'be careful what you ask for'


oh im not worried bout your 670's lol


----------



## dr/owned

I kinda wanna know now how exactly BC's transaction log thing works and why tons of computation power is needed. Wiki wasn't particularly clear on the subject, and I only want the high school explanation not the PhD one.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I know everyone here is pro AMD when it comes to GPUs. And I was too, I had 6870, 2x 6870, 2x 6950, 7950, 7970, all in the past year. I sold my 7970 and got a 670. The gaming experience is much smoother. I don't get as high of benchmark scores but the tearing, flickering, and frame latency has vanished.
> 
> Some will say that it's inexperience on my part and I just needed to try messing with all sorts of settings to fix it. But I don't feel like I should have to mess with a $400 just to get it to work correctly. I don't mind installing a GPU, installing the drivers, and having no issues at all. That's the ideal scenario for me anyway.


I think most here are pro-performance. Different cards for different uses.
Gamers from both camps seem pretty happy, folders generally prefer nvidia, before Titan AMD was scoring better in the majority of benchmarks.
There is no 1 card that really does it all, it's why I get all of them. Gets expensive tough.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I've seen video comparisons and I don't think the frame time thingy is so bad as people make it out to be.
> 
> It's funny that the machine that does these measurements is sponsored by Nvidia...


Also depends on the people, perfectionists might see a flaw that few other people can see, & they are perfectionists so after seeing it they can not stop seeing it & just have fun with the game. Some might not see it, others see it & can ignore it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> oh im not worried bout your 670's lol


...working on the 3970X with 4x MSI 680 Lightnings...

...but I am not trying to worry you at all (above on 670ies was a *real* compliment to you)...just pointing out when you responded to SWAG earlier, your Valley score had that 'Microsoft Render' bit which Karlitos hates so much...while Swag's did not..but generally, I like what you did with your 670ies, btw


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I think most here are pro-performance. Different cards for different uses.
> Gamers from both camps seem pretty happy, folders generally prefer nvidia, before Titan AMD was scoring better in the majority of benchmarks.
> There is no 1 card that really does it all, it's why I get all of them. Gets expensive tough.
> Also depends on the people, perfectionists might see a flaw that few other people can see, & they are perfectionists so after seeing it they can not stop seeing it & just have fun with the game. Some might not see it, others see it & can ignore it.


I was running Tera online at detail level 0...preset 0 or the lowest possible, and 1024x768 res.
I'm not picky, it's just a game, no need to spend a LOT on gaming really, not for me.
I play Tera and Ragnarok Online 1 (yeah, the classic one...no silly 3d dumbed down one)


----------



## Hokies83

LoL i pegged Bf3 On *MAX* *SETTINGS* at 200fps which is the fps limit in BF3 with 70% gpu across all 3.

Best my 680s could ever do was 160fps with 99% use.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I know everyone here is pro AMD when it comes to GPUs. And I was too, I had 6870, 2x 6870, 2x 6950, 7950, 7970, all in the past year. I sold my 7970 and got a 670. The gaming experience is much smoother. I don't get as high of benchmark scores but the tearing, flickering, and frame latency has vanished.
> 
> Some will say that it's inexperience on my part and I just needed to try messing with all sorts of settings to fix it. But I don't feel like I should have to mess with a $400 just to get it to work correctly. I don't mind installing a GPU, installing the drivers, and having no issues at all. That's the ideal scenario for me anyway.


When I bought my first 7970 (Sapphire Dual X OC Boost) I had to adjust the stock memory voltage in order for the stuttering to cease, the card was great, but the stock mem voltage was too high. I recently sold that card. My Diamond didnt have the issue, but when overclocking from 1900 to 1940 (1.7v - 1.737) if the voltage is even one step up to high I will get unbearable stutter and skipping. Go too low and it hangs. Find the middle and its smooth as silk. So maybe it was a memory issue. I know that if I have core voltage issues it just hangs and exits. I can always tell when its the memory that's off due to this. Also 79xx is sensitive to temp changes. My max overclock voltage needs to be adjusted up or down with as little as a 3°C change in ambient. Possibly why the sapphire card stuttered.

Blah im sleepy think I will hit the sack early tonight.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i pegged Bf3 On *MAX* *SETTINGS* at 200fps which is the fps limit in BF3 with 70% gpu across all 3.
> 
> Best my 680s could ever do was 160fps with 99% use.


...and you monitor(s) actually display...60FPS ? 120 FPS ? (I know I am asking for it







)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and you monitor(s) actually display...60FPS ? 120 FPS ? (I know I am asking for it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


One is 60hz other is 120hz...

It is just showing the performance gap for the same cost


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and you monitor(s) actually display...60FPS ? 120 FPS ? (I know I am asking for it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Duuuuuude just..... just don't. haha. I think he might have just been trying to see the most GPU usage he could get, but he will have to tell you for himself his reasons why. Calmly, politely. Oh man I totally came on OCN to get away from all of this North Korea BS. Don't start!!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey Hokies what are your clocks and volts on your triple 7950's?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey Hokies what are your clocks and volts on your triple 7950's?


I got them up to 1225/1600 there boost cards so there locked at 1.25v


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Duuuuuude just..... just don't. haha. I think he might have just been trying to see the most GPU usage he could get, but he will have to tell you for himself his *reasons why*. Calmly, politely. Oh man I totally came on OCN to get away from all of this North Korea BS. Don't start!!!


The answer is most definitely "because reasons."

At least, that's my answer when people ask me why I have two titans for one 60Hz monitor.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I got them up to 1225/1600 there boost cards so there locked at 1.25v


Yea my two cards are both boost and I'm at 1165/1600. Don't expect to milk them much more with WC, but they will look awesome and run cooler so that is all I care about. I'm a bit worried about getting a third because I'm scared that I'm going to get a horrible card and it is going to lag all of my cards down to 1100/1500 or something like that, but I do need the performance of a third card. It's just going to be nerve racking.


----------



## ivanlabrie

1225 is more than enough anyway...non boost 7970 reference card are more fun for wc.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> The answer is most definitely "because reasons."
> 
> At least, that's my answer when people ask me why I have two titans for one 60Hz monitor.


Haha all the power to ya!! I get crap for running my dual 7950's on one monitor... for some strange reason..


----------



## Hokies83

HD7000 Loves being cool if u keep them under 50c do not be shocked to get 50mhz more.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Haha all the power to ya!! I get crap for running my dual 7950's on one monitor... for some strange reason..


Just try the reasoning I use. People stop asking questions reeeeeeal quick.

"Why do you have TWO 7950s for a single screen? Do you really need them?"
"Look, I need them because reasons."
"....."

Also remember, WC lets you push the VRMs harder. (MOAR VOLTSSSSSSSS)


----------



## stickg1

Finally got Swype working again on my phone! Woot!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Just try the reasoning I use. People stop asking questions reeeeeeal quick.
> 
> "Why do you have TWO 7950s for a single screen? Do you really need them?"
> "Look, I need them because reasons."
> "....."
> 
> Also remember, WC lets you push the VRMs harder. (MOAR VOLTSSSSSSSS)


MINT.

Love it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Duuuuuude just..... just don't. haha. I think he might have just been trying to see the most GPU usage he could get, but he will have to tell you for himself his reasons why. Calmly, politely. Oh man I totally came on OCN to get away from all of this North Korea BS. Don't start!!!


...oh, I am pretty sure that Hokies knows when I am just playing (though I am not entirely sure what North Korea has to do with anything - but then, I am Canadian)...I just know that when I confer with Hokies one way or the other, out drops massive knowledge and experience on his part...even if he secretly craves an ROG board and NVidia Titans


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...working on the 3970X with 4x MSI 680 Lightnings...
> 
> ...but I am not trying to worry you at all (above on 670ies was a *real* compliment to you)...just pointing out when you responded to SWAG earlier, your Valley score had that 'Microsoft Render' bit which Karlitos hates so much...while Swag's did not..but generally, I like what you did with your 670ies, btw


push it to the limit







yea i had the igpu enabled in bios but lucid was not running. but thanks for the comliment, i like to joke around sometimes


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> HD7000 Loves being cool if u keep them under 50c do not be shocked to get 50mhz more.


I would be pretty happy if I could push that more. I'm thinking of selling my Sapphire Dual-x and getting two more TFIII's. My single TFIII runs 1225/1625, but the Sapphire made me lower my OC







It's still not a bad OC for a crossfire set-up, but I'm thinking of getting two more TFIII for looks and for a chance of getting a 1200Mhz tri-fire setup on air. What do you think my chances are.. slim?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...oh, I am pretty sure that Hokies knows when I am just playing (though I am not entirely sure what North Korea has to do with anything - but then, I am Canadian)...I just know that when I confer with Hokies one way or the other, out drops massive knowledge and experience on his part...even if he secretly craves an ROG board and NVidia Titans


All I can say about North Korea is this: Small guy, big threats. I will stop there as I'm pretty sure these type of discussions (debates) aren't allowed on the forum. You are lucky you are in Canada man. Ever watch Trailor Park Boys?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I would be pretty happy if I could push that more. I'm thinking of selling my Sapphire Dual-x and getting two more TFIII's. My single TFIII runs 1225/1625, but the Sapphire made me lower my OC
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's still not a bad OC for a crossfire set-up, but I'm thinking of getting two more TFIII for looks and for a chance of getting a 1200Mhz tri-fire setup on air. What do you think my chances are.. slim?


Sell them all and grab two 7970 ref cards (non boost/ghz ed...but older models)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL i pegged Bf3 On *MAX* *SETTINGS* at 200fps which is the fps limit in BF3 with 70% gpu across all 3.
> 
> Best my 680s could ever do was 160fps with 99% use.


thats @ 2560x1440 ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> All I can say about North Korea is this: Small guy, big threats. I will stop there as I'm pretty sure these type of discussions (debates) aren't allowed on the forum. You are lucky you are in Canada man. Ever watch Trailor Park Boys?


Has me thinking more about Team America, 'I'm so ronery... so ronery...'

TPB was a great show!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thats @ 2560x1440 ?


I can do it with both 2560x1440 Use goes up to 75% - 80% same Caapped fps.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Has me thinking more about Team America, 'I'm so ronery... so ronery...'
> 
> TPB was a great show!


AMERICA! F- YEAH!! lol


----------



## lilchronic

lol 1080p 200fps as low as 56% usage on both cards 64 player map. thats insane i always use vsync


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sell them all and grab two 7970 ref cards (non boost/ghz ed...but older models)


I was actually thinking about doing that, but I really don't need them as I'm not going multi-monitor. Plus I just like how you don't see WC 7950's as much as you see 7970's. I actually tried flashing the BIOS's on my cards to non-boost BIOS's, but everything got all screwed up and I had to flash the original BIOS's back. Are these cards BIOS locked?


----------



## ivanlabrie

I wouldn't mess with the bios...You can get confirmed unlocked Sapphire 7950 cards too.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol 1080p 200fps as low as 56% usage on both cards 64 player map. thats insane i always use vsync


Your missing some setings then cause my 680s at 1220mhz/+350 mem could only get 160 fps 99% use with the settings i used.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I wouldn't mess with the bios...You can get confirmed unlocked Sapphire 7950 cards too.


Yea it ended up scaring me away so I flashed them back and havent touched it since.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Your missing some setings then cause my 680s at 1220mhz/+350 mem could only get 160 fps 99% use with the settings i used.


yea i was lol had graphichs on medium , i dont no why








now there maxed out 1080p
bottom 2 osd's are cpu usage and temps


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## lilchronic

now im thinking what i would get if i was @ 5.2 ghz instead of 5 darn you hokies


----------



## MKHunt

Basically if Tri-SLI scaling wasn't complete trash at 1080p they'd be on even footing in terms of raw fps.

Adaptive Vsync for life.


----------



## Valgaur

Totally got the approval to spend but tons of money on my build this summer!!!!!!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> now im thinking what i would get if i was @ 5.2 ghz instead of 5 darn you hokies


LoL well not much graf settings = gpu not cpu.

Those are nice 670s!

My first set of 680s did 1350/+600 mem

My 4gbs would only do 1220mhz/+350....

However when u think of a 7950.. which stock is 800mhz... Going all the way up to 1200mhz... that is a 50% OC and is pretty huge.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> now im thinking what i would get if i was @ 5.2 ghz instead of 5 darn you hokies


Now I'm wondering what my rig would be like at 5+ darn you both.

First I need to pipe a portable A/C unit directly to my intakes though. A mid-tower can only accommodate so much rad while keeping two titans and a 3770k under 37C and 60C, respectively.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Totally got the approval to spend but tons of money on my build this summer!!!!!!!


you must explain !


----------



## lilchronic

well i have this pos extreme 4 from assrock. lol. i have now 5ghz @ 1.38v and for 5.1 i need like 1.42v -1.46v idk somewhere between there. but ive seen quite a few people upgrade from the extreme 4 and they were able to lower there voltage a lot ! i was so surprised. i would love to go from 1.38v @ 5ghz to 1.28v


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i have this pos extreme 4 from assrock. lol. i have now 5ghz @ 1.38v and for 5.1 i need like 1.42v -1.46v idk somewhere between there. but ive seen quite a few people upgrade from the extreme 4 and the were able to lower there voltage a lot ! i was so surprised. i would love to go from 1.38v @ 5ghz to 1.28v


*1.28?!!?!?!?!?* Do you have the goldenest chip ever?









ETA: Just saw it's an i5. I feel stupid now.


----------



## She loved E

Looks like hes at 1.38 & wants to try to get down to 1.28. Thats a big jump... GL


----------



## lilchronic

well ive seen it happen. guy's with my same mobo upgraded to a good board and was able to lower ther voltage. ok i no 1.28v would be insane but i wish.


----------



## lilchronic

@ ravagethearth
i think you were 1 of them that had my extrem 4 and upgraded to the MVE and was able to lower voltage.
how much were u able to drop voltage?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> Looks like hes at 1.38 & wants to try to get down to 1.28. Thats a big jump... GL


Coming from my Asrock z77 Extreme4 to my new ASUS MVE I was able to drop my voltage to be stable by .13v
Extreme4 = 4.8Ghz @ 1.491v
MVE = 4.8Ghz @ 1.36v
The extreme4 told me I was running at 1.391v, but then I took out the DMM and seen 1.491v. I bent the pins on my first Extreme4 and then ordered another one and that one told me the same thing. Ridiculous.\
My MVE is spot on reporting voltage. I already sent a message to the writer of the AsRock Overclocking Guide begging him to put a warning in his guide about this problem so people don't degrade their chips over night and he said he will. Of course LLC plays a part in lessening the wrong vcore readings, but it will still be off by .3v at the least.

DISCLAIMER: Your results may vary


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Coming from my Asrock z77 Extreme4 to my new ASUS MVE I was able to drop my voltage to be stable by .13v
> Extreme4 = 4.8Ghz @ 1.491v
> MVE = 4.8Ghz @ 1.36v
> The extreme4 told me I was running at 1.391v, but then I took out the DMM and seen 1.491v. I bent the pins on my first Extreme4 and then ordered another one and that one told me the same thing. Ridiculous.


----------



## nagle3092

Considering you have an extreme 4 I bet the voltage your CPU is actually getting is 1.45v or higher unless you got your measurement with a multimeter.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Considering you have an extreme 4 I bet the voltage your CPU is actually getting is 1.45v or higher unless you got your measurement with a multimeter.


No dont kill my high! lolz
i dont have a multimeter


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*


i edited my post and put a disclaimer. Don't just blow a bunch of money on a new MOBO if you are just hoping to get a drop like I did. It's possible that you might and I'm almost certain you will get a drop in voltage, but I can't tell you if it will be .05v or .1v. I WOULD get rid of that MOBO ASAP though. That totally destroyed my respect for their company, but I do respect people who use AsRock. Anyways, I hear that some of their other boards are a lot better with vcore readings.

I am completely satisfied with my MVE though and have no regrets spending that much $ on it since I am not going to go to Haswell for a couple years and who knows what kind of crazy things I am going to want to do until then. This motherboard allows for a lot of room for expansion. Not to mention all of the crazy features. LN2 anyone?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well ive seen it happen. guy's with my same mobo upgraded to a good board and was able to lower ther voltage. ok i no 1.28v would be insane but i wish.


...for 5 giggles, with a GREAT board AND 4c/8t chip, you should be happy with a daily below 1.480v on a board that does not fudge the numbers in 'v-core' at CPU-Z etc


----------



## lilchronic

well i kida thought about it and how could it really be around 1.45v if my temps never hit 70c i would think if its really using 1.45v temps would be higher than these

but you guy are right the only way to really tell is with a multi meter


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> you must explain !


I asked my parents what I could buy from computer parts value vise and they said go nuts basically.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

A little off subject here, but I'm so PO'd that I can't use afterburners OSD. I'm one of the unlucky bunch of people that can't use it because it crashes to desktop right when I start games like Skyrim and BF3. Turn OSD off and it is fixed. It is really hit and miss most people have no problem with it and a select few can't even use it at all. My life would be sooo much easier with it! Anyways, I'm really hoping that the artifacting I was getting before I sent my PSU in was because when I replaced the TIM on my Sapphire I forgot to put the crossfire bridge back on and I'm hoping the drivers got messed up when I booted without the crossfire bridge. Since then I have a new install of windows all ready to go (literally untouched), new case, new motherboard, and come monday a new (and hopefully working) PSU. If I get artifacting and have to send a card in I'm going to do a kart wheel out my window. I've been dying to use my rebuilt rig and if something goes wrong I am going to dub myself the unluckiest scuba diver to ever tread in water.

EDIT: So it looks like I'm starting to talk crazy so that means I should go to sleep. Goodnight people!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I asked my parents what I could buy from computer parts value vise and they said go nuts basically.


... my parents just say, "seriously Josh???? How much F---ing money are you spending on this crap" ahahaha

I can't wait to see this EPIC-ness


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i kida thought about it and how could it really be around 1.45v if my temps never hit 70c i would think if its really using 1.45v temps would be higher than these
> 
> but you guy are right the only way to really tell is with a multi meter


Thats totally possible man. I was running 1.529v (or something like that) on the Extreme4 and I wasn't going over 84c. What LLC are you using?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I asked my parents what I could buy from computer parts value vise and they said go nuts basically.


...money is one thing, but you will also need that master carpenter on your envisaged build...lucky you, there seems to be someone in your family that can help you (beyond $s)


----------



## lilchronic

ive been trying to figure out what board i want. oc formula or the MVF. and i really want to push my cpu and memory oc so thats why i kinda am leaning to the oc formula but that extra pci-e slot on the MVF i want to. im stuck in a jam. but if they still had the g1 sniper i would go with that for 269$ but its dicontinued


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Thats totally possible man. I was running 1.529v (or something like that) on the Extreme4 and I wasn't going over 84c. What LLC are you using?


LLC 2


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive been trying to figure out what board i want. oc formula or the MVF. and i really want to push my cpu and memory oc so thats why i kinda am leaning to the oc formula but that extra pci-e slot on the MVF i want to. im stuck in a jam. but if they still had the g1 sniper i would go with that for 269$ but its dicontinued


Dude have you not heard about how the MVF and MVE work REALLY REALLY well with the Trident RAM??? I'm going to be purchasing that exact RAM soon for that reason.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> LLC 2


Yes you are getting an incorrect vcore then. LLC2 is the worst I believe.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey I found you a present. ASUS MVE for $320 open box. Pull the trigger QUICK!

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858R&Tpk=maximus%20v%20extreme%20open%20box&IsVirtualParent=1


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> ... my parents just say, "seriously Josh???? How much F---ing money are you spending on this crap" ahahaha
> 
> I can't wait to see this EPIC-ness


neither can I.....much GPU decisions to be had man.... tri monitors as well baby!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...money is one thing, but you will also need that master carpenter on your envisaged build...lucky you, there seems to be someone in your family that can help you (beyond $s)


Yeah my dad is very good and I am pretty decent myself, I've been tweaking it more and more making it better and better.


----------



## Arm3nian

Seems like no one wants to wait for new cpu/gpus to come out. You guys just plan to resell later?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Seems like no one wants to wait for new cpu/gpus to come out. You guys just plan to resell later?


HD 7950s are soooo cheap already.. can get them for like 200$ after selling Crysis 3 / Bioshock lol.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey I found you a present. ASUS MVE for $320 open box. Pull the trigger QUICK!
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858R&Tpk=maximus%20v%20extreme%20open%20box&IsVirtualParent=1


well i just bought this other 670 so im pretty broke right now even if i sold my extreme 4 for 100 bucks id still need 20 more dollars for that lol, and pay day is every 2 weeks so that also sucks. but all i need is another 3 weeks. of








nah im just playin i work @ boston market







it aint that bad


----------



## homestyle

anybody use the coollaboratory cleaning kit to remove the CLU from your heatsink?

Does it make it look new?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> anybody use the coollaboratory cleaning kit to remove the CLU from your heatsink?
> 
> Does it make it look new?


A couple dollars for a bottle of metal polish. Lengthy post here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/15350#post_19644142


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> HD 7950s are soooo cheap already.. can get them for like 200$ after selling Crysis 3 / Bioshock lol.


I've lost so much money already buying wrong parts and reselling lol. Close to $3000 it is very sad. Need to start over from scratch now that I know what to buy.


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> A couple dollars for a bottle of metal polish. Lengthy post here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/15350#post_19644142


does the metal polish actually remove the clu? does the heatsink look new, or can somebody tell something was put on there and cleaned?

and how much benefit is there from using clu on top of the ihs? (i'll be putting it on my die)


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> does the metal polish actually remove the clu? does the heatsink look new, or can somebody tell something was put on there and cleaned?
> 
> and how much benefit is there from using clu on top of the ihs? (i'll be putting it on my die)


I thought I covered all that in the post, but yes it removes it all if (and only if) you are willing to take the time to get it all out. It is not a quick process.

On top of the die I think it depends on the fit between your particular cooler and your IHS, but overall you should see about 5c better than a standard TIM and maybe just a couple c better than a good TIM. As has been pointed out by others here, you might not see any gain from using on the IHS per some tests results.

That's the problem with tests where the numbers are pretty close. Unless you use my cooler and my IHS and have a robot perfectly apply the TIM and mount the cooler in the exact same way every time then you are going to have variations of at least 1 to 3c.

In summary, use it on the die, but only on the IHS if you really want to, and you should test it on your setup to see if it lowers temps. If you clean it up the same day it is not bad.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Totally got the approval to spend but tons of money on my build this summer!!!!!!!


If you need a "wood-guy" with a design degree I am reasonable relativly nearby and have lots of time. just put that out there. and ... CONGRATS!
http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey I found you a present. ASUS MVE for $320 open box. Pull the trigger QUICK!
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131858R&Tpk=maximus%20v%20extreme%20open%20box&IsVirtualParent=1


yeah you posted one like tha for me too and i woulda PULLED THE TRIGGER except 220 of my $ is on a Microcenter gift card. and so im stuck fith them on a back-order with no open box mark down


----------



## Hokies83

Still alil pricey the MVE should be like 299$ New.

UP7 329$

G1 Sniper 3 259$

MVF 229$


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> HD 7950s are soooo cheap already.. can get them for like 200$ after selling Crysis 3 / Bioshock lol.


where? for really...


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Still alil pricey the MVE should be like 299$ New.
> 
> UP7 329$
> 
> G1 Sniper 3 259$
> 
> MVF 229$


Yes your right again! the new stuff is coming. these prices should be drpping like halo. I'm waiting for something special and if i get the sniper i want to paint the green crome or camo.


----------



## Hokies83

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202006


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> If you need a "wood-guy" with a design degree I am reasonable relativly nearby and have lots of time. just put that out there. and ... CONGRATS!
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball


I am curious as to how you mount the mobo with the stand offs and such.. does the wood keep it from having issues or do youneed a metal back plate


----------



## snowfree52

guys , did you see that :

http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


----------



## lilchronic

they dont sell the G1 sniper 3 anymore? its dicontinued @ newgg


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys , did you see that :
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


Holy crapola! Do want


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I am curious as to how you mount the mobo with the stand offs and such.. does the wood keep it from having issues or do youneed a metal back plate


I recommend scraping a metal case and building the wood on that. Wood alone is kinda sketchy.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys , did you see that :
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


Jesus effing Christ YES WE'VE SEEN IT. You're now the 4th person to post it.


----------



## Arm3nian

According to ek we are experts


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys , did you see that :
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


we've seen it. The trick with this, and i don't remember the source, is to mount it before you put the MOBO in the case, so you can examine the side profile.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys , did you see that :
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
> 
> 
> 
> we've seen it. The trick with this, and i don't remember the source, is to mount it before you put the MOBO in the case, so you can examine the side profile.
Click to expand...

My strategy tomorrow is the same strategy I always use: I put the screws on the post and then tighten them just enough so they thread (can tell by pulling up on them whether they've latched). Then I do quarter turns in the cross pattern until they max out, which usually happens at the same time for all the screws meaning I was pretty consistent.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> they dont sell the G1 sniper 3 anymore? its dicontinued @ newgg


They could never keep them in stock they always sold in a day or 2 after coming back in stock.

But.....

http://www.ebay.com/ctg/Gigabyte-Technology-G1-Sniper-3-LGA-1155-Motherboard-/127358319

http://www.costcaptain.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=C&Product_Code=DX_GAG1SNIPER3&gclid=CMfJyf24sLYCFUWd4AodTRoAOg


----------



## Gomi

Asking here as this place have become my 2nd home here at OCN.

Does anyone know of a good and up to date Insulation (24/7 phase) guide. Asking as the ones I found all been outdated (nail polish etc.), missing half the pictures or been so short and lacking derails that I wonder why they even bothered writing it in the first place.

I have kneaded eraser, neoprene, electricians tape and armaflex up to my ears, just need a proper guide. Do not want to miss some crucial step only to have condensation zapping my rig.

Do you still use vaseline in the socket?

Can it really be right that you only need neoprene on the back of the MOBO?

Do I use the electricians tape as a "border", containing the kneaded eraser within - And thereby not getting it in between the caps etc. ?


----------



## snowfree52

Well I guess not all of you saw it before ...

sorry but each time I come to this thread there's like 10 pages more, sometimes I have the time to read, sometimes not.

I thought posting the link could help someone !


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Asking here as this place have become my 2nd home here at OCN.
> 
> Does anyone know of a good and up to date Insulation (24/7 phase) guide. Asking as the ones I found all been outdated (nail polish etc.), missing half the pictures or been so short and lacking derails that I wonder why they even bothered writing it in the first place.
> 
> I have kneaded eraser, neoprene, electricians tape and armaflex up to my ears, just need a proper guide. Do not want to miss some crucial step only to have condensation zapping my rig.
> 
> Do you still use vaseline in the socket?
> 
> Can it really be right that you only need neoprene on the back of the MOBO?
> 
> Do I use the electricians tape as a "border", containing the kneaded eraser within - And thereby not getting it in between the caps etc. ?


I think dragonskin is the most fashionable method nowadays. I'm just going to put my desktop in a large heavy duty clear plastic bag and pump the output of a free standing dehumidifier into one end of it, creating positive pressure of dry air in the case (poking some holes for the cables coming out. With my relative humidity at 25% right now, I think I'll have no problem getting it down to 5% in my case, lowering the frost point to -18C which is well below the freezing point of my coolant. Still deciding whether I want to run one water chiller or two (HC-500A).


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I think dragonskin is the most fashionable method nowadays. I'm just going to put my desktop in a large heavy duty clear plastic bag and pump the output of a free standing dehumidifier into one end of it, creating positive pressure of dry air in the case (poking some holes for the cables coming out. With my relative humidity at 25% right now, I think I'll have no problem getting it down to 5% in my case, lowering the frost point to -18C which is well below the freezing point of my coolant. Still deciding whether I want to run one water chiller or two (HC-500A).


Dragon Skin Fast 10 - Thanks buddy! I just did a Google search and this stuff is pretty amazing - Just apply it and never worry about air pockets or anything. And it looks so easy to "pull" off, should that be needed. +REP!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Asking here as this place have become my 2nd home here at OCN.
> 
> Does anyone know of a good and up to date Insulation (24/7 phase) guide. Asking as the ones I found all been outdated (nail polish etc.), missing half the pictures or been so short and lacking derails that I wonder why they even bothered writing it in the first place.
> 
> I have kneaded eraser, neoprene, electricians tape and armaflex up to my ears, just need a proper guide. Do not want to miss some crucial step only to have condensation zapping my rig.
> 
> Do you still use vaseline in the socket?
> 
> Can it really be right that you only need neoprene on the back of the MOBO?
> 
> Do I use the electricians tape as a "border", containing the kneaded eraser within - And thereby not getting it in between the caps etc. ?


First, some food for thought for those wanting to freeze stuff and who have wc components already HERE.
And for the insulation guide, I'll refer you to one by kingping HERE.
Avoid vaseline in the socket area, or close to the ram slots, it gives a lot of problems with electrical contact between the cpu pads and the socket pins, and problems with ram.


----------



## Coolwaters

thats genius!

heating up the heat-spreader so the glue is nice and soft...


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> First, some food for thought for those wanting to freeze stuff and who have wc components already HERE.
> And for the insulation guide, I'll refer you to one by kingping HERE.
> Avoid vaseline in the socket area, or close to the ram slots, it gives a lot of problems with electrical contact between the cpu pads and the socket pins, and problems with ram.


Thanks Ivan









Already ordered a custom built Phase Change system (SS) by Piotres (For 24/7 use on CPU) - Will keep the GPUs cooled by water and the MO-RA 9x140MM radiator (Lulz @ overkill).

And thanks for the guide


----------



## Gomi

For anyone intrested in batchnumbers and such here is mine:



3230B359

A Google search turns nothing up, so it is possible one of those "Random" chips.

Results under stock air cooler (lulz):

superpi 32m stable:


Will have it under water shortly (Not delidded - Going under Phase) to test IMC.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I am curious as to how you mount the mobo with the stand offs and such.. does the wood keep it from having issues or do youneed a metal back plate


You would be better off cutting the mobo tray and even I/O and expansion slots from an old case and building around it. Or at the very least scribe the tray and I/O/expansion part of the ATX standard case onto the wood you use because it has to be almost perfect otherwise you'll be starting over with just the slightest miscut!


----------



## marine73

I remember back in the day pulling the IHS off of AMD 64 chips and leaving them off. Aftermarket HS went right on top of the chip. Suppose that prolly isn't possible with the current retaining system on the 1155 socket. Anyway, looks good and will consider doing this on my next build.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> HD 7950s are soooo cheap already.. can get them for like 200$ after selling Crysis 3 / Bioshock lol.


How do you sell them?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> How do you sell them?


Here u have to sale the card... On other forums you can sell the codes


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Here u have to sale the card... On other forums you can sell the codes


Ohh ok damn I'm just selling Crysis 3. I already used that card. Bummer man.


----------



## lilchronic

ok i need some help lol is this enough to talk smack to an 8350 hokies i need u.








look here
http://www.overclock.net/t/884072/post-your-3dmark11-scores/4490#post_19675772


----------



## stickg1

HELP! Which color should I paint all the white trim in my case, I have a green theme.



All the white is going to be one of those two colors


----------



## Joa3d43

*@Hokies*

...I'v just picked up a Gigabyte 670 (Windforce3, OC, 3 fans) as it was on sale... also have 4x Asus Direct CUii 670ies...all for 8 machines by the way...my *question* is this: Can I flash the Gigabyte Windforce with an Asus Bios...obviously the specs are the same (memory, base and boost clock) but the VRM etc are likely not...on a prior occasion, I flashed an Asus 670 with an EVGA Bios, and while it was basically functional, I had huge swings in power / boost so I flashed it back.

I don't know that much about Gigabyte VRMs and PCBs...what do you think ? Tx in advance


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@Hokies*
> 
> ...I'v just picked up a Gigabyte 670 (Windforce3, OC, 3 fans) as it was on sale... also have 4x Asus Direct CUii 670ies...all for 8 machines by the way...my *question* is this: Can I flash the Gigabyte Windforce with an Asus Bios...obviously the specs are the same (memeory, base and boost clock) but the VRM etc are likely not...on a prior occasion, I flashed an Asus 670 with an EVGA Bios, and while it was basically functional, I had huge swings in power / boost so I flashed it back.
> 
> I don't know that much about Gigabyte VRMs and PCBs...what do you think ? Tx in advance


I know you were asking Hokie but they have the same specs except for the Giga uses 6 and 8 pin. So I'm not sure if the power delivery or power limit would be the same.

But out of curiosity what advantage do you seek flashing the Giga with the ASUS BIOS?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I know you were asking Hokie but they have the same specs except for the Giga uses 6 and 8 pin. So I'm not sure if the power delivery or power limit would be the same.
> 
> But out of curiosity what advantage do you seek flashing the Giga with the ASUS BIOS?


...I have a given set of profiles I worked up for SLI, tri-SLI and quad-SLI as these combos will run primarily in 3 machines (3970X, 3770K and 3770)...it's easier if all cards use the same bios re synchronization


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I have a given set of profiles I worked up for SLI, tri-SLI and quad-SLI as these combos will run primarily in 3 machines (3970X, 3770K and 3770)...it's easier if all cards use the same bios re synchronization


Understood, well it might be worth a shot.

I grabbed that same Giga WF3 670 a few weeks back, open box on newegg for $300. I'm thrilled with it!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok i need some help lol is this enough to talk smack to an 8350 hokies i need u.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> look here
> http://www.overclock.net/t/884072/post-your-3dmark11-scores/4490#post_19675772


5ghz 3570k is faster then every 24/7 OC 8350 on OCN.

Destruction faster in things that use 6 threads or less... But pretty even in multi threaded.

People who own Fx 8350 and try to puff there chests out are not worth arguing with.. You can already tell they do not know jack for these reasons.

1. You bought a Amd cpu.. your a Dummy...

2. They will try to validate there purchase no matter what you say or prove.

3. They will post the same 5 token benchmarks they have since the 8350 release.. and ignore the other 9999999999999

4. It only leads to infractions " i know "









Best thing to do is give them a Face palm gif laugh at them and move on.

Here are some for example.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@Hokies*
> 
> ...I'v just picked up a Gigabyte 670 (Windforce3, OC, 3 fans) as it was on sale... also have 4x Asus Direct CUii 670ies...all for 8 machines by the way...my *question* is this: Can I flash the Gigabyte Windforce with an Asus Bios...obviously the specs are the same (memory, base and boost clock) but the VRM etc are likely not...on a prior occasion, I flashed an Asus 670 with an EVGA Bios, and while it was basically functional, I had huge swings in power / boost so I flashed it back.
> 
> I don't know that much about Gigabyte VRMs and PCBs...what do you think ? Tx in advance


Im not sure on that one if the WF3 has 2 Bios then why not try? you can always switch to the other bios to recover that one.


----------



## justanoldman

Any opinions? Can I use a Noctua 140mm fan, the NF-A14, on a 140mm radiator? I know it is a case fan but would it still be ok on a rad?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Any opinions? Can I use a Noctua 140mm fan, the NF-A14, on a 140mm radiator? I know it is a case fan but would it still be ok on a rad?


Ugly fans but yes.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im not sure on that one if the WF3 has 2 Bios then why not try? you can always switch to the other bios to recover that one.


Tx-







I'll run a few 'before' baseline tests 'as is' first, than try a some BIOS stuff


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ugly fans but yes.


I know, my build doesn't look all that good so it doesn't matter much now. I have 5 NF-F12 on the other two rads, and three NF-A14 case fans. Just planning to add a 140mm rad to the back case fan.


----------



## Rangerjr1

I feel like the only white guy among many black guys!


----------



## stickg1

Someone asked me a long time ago and I never got around to it until today. But my Extreme6 voltage reading is off by about .056v as shown in the following pictures...

Not as bad as the Extreme4's but still has to be considered, and this is why the push for 5.0GHz is unrealistic with my chip.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 5ghz 3570k is faster then every 24/7 OC 8350 on OCN.
> 
> Destruction faster in things that use 6 threads or less... But pretty even in multi threaded.
> 
> People who own Fx 8350 and try to puff there chests out are not worth arguing with.. You can already tell they do not know jack for these reasons.


...or *lilchronic* could point out 'cold-matter-of-factually-sarcastically' that the AMD 8350 has been such a wild ""success"", some of their top people were fired and a Hedge Fund took over control


----------



## dr/owned

^^ That looks like a pretty cheap / generic multimeter that might be off by +5% or more, especially when you're using a 20V scale.

Fluke multimeter or nothing


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ That looks like a pretty cheap / generic multimeter that might be off by +5% or more, especially when you're using a 20V scale.
> 
> Fluke multimeter or nothing


Yeah it was only $20 and doesn't have the 2v measurement, but when I had a P8Z77-V Pro the readings were spot on with the software readings.


----------



## dr/owned

2000m means 2000mV = 2V, unless that mode is broken.

It's also possible that the measuring point you're using is higher voltage than the voltage further down the line at the actual socket pin (which is the reason for load lines).


----------



## Joa3d43

*CPU-Z bugs*

...over at the Rampage IV Extreme thread, the CPU-Z bug was being discussed and I posted s.th. on it last week which may also be of interest here. Per pics below, the current version of CPU-Z does not seem to pick up C-states / SpeedStep correctly, thus some rather interesting numbers (on some other sites where fast CPUs are offered for sale for LN2 / competition etc, this has become a potential problem, though with an actual CPU-Z validation, you can get around that).

In any case, speculation that this has to do with BIOS is not substantiated...on my 'regular' Win 7 boot drive for the 3770K, CPU-Z does display the bug per pics...but on a new bench drive with a fresh Win 7 install that only shares the 'downloads' drive which has the very same CPU-Z, it will show SpeedStep correctly (i.e. 1600MHz when it down clocks). Everything else, including BIOS, settings, hardware is identical...must be something in Win 7 (registry etc)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 2000m means 2000mV = 2V, unless that mode is broken.
> 
> It's also possible that the measuring point you're using is higher voltage than the voltage further down the line at the actual socket pin (which is the reason for load lines).


Hmmm

Just retested with 2000mV, that same 1.48v reading point is now reading 1515mV, and the one that was reading 1.6v before (which I assumed was my RAM) is reading 1445mV. So I'm officially confused and all results are being tossed as irrelevant until I find the proper reading point.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> they dont sell the G1 sniper 3 anymore? its dicontinued @ newgg


Sometimes they say discontinued when stuff us just out if stock.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ That looks like a pretty cheap / generic multimeter that might be off by +5% or more, especially when you're using a 20V scale.
> 
> Fluke multimeter or nothing


Not true. Flukes can handle more voltage such as a main to a house. There is not a big diff in accuracy at the low end between cheap n expensive


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Sometimes they say discontinued when stuff us just out if stock.


chronic, pm


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 5ghz 3570k is faster then every 24/7 OC 8350 on OCN.
> 
> Destruction faster in things that use 6 threads or less... But pretty even in multi threaded.
> 
> People who own Fx 8350 and try to puff there chests out are not worth arguing with.. You can already tell they do not know jack for these reasons.
> 
> 1. You bought a Amd cpu.. your a Dummy...
> 
> 2. They will try to validate there purchase no matter what you say or prove.
> 
> 3. They will post the same 5 token benchmarks they have since the 8350 release.. and ignore the other 9999999999999
> 
> 4. It only leads to infractions " i know "
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Best thing to do is give them a Face palm gif laugh at them and move on.
> 
> Here are some for example.


i love it. i almost fell out my chair lmao







Quote:


> I feel like the only white guy among many black guys!


ohh! look who showed lol.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ That looks like a pretty cheap / generic multimeter that might be off by +5% or more, especially when you're using a 20V scale.
> 
> Fluke multimeter or nothing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not true. Flukes can handle more voltage such as a main to a house. There is not a big diff in accuracy at the low end between cheap n expensive
Click to expand...

Flukes are guaranteed to be more accurate than a generic one. You can expect 0.05% DC voltage accuracy with a Fluke which you just won't get with a DMM that costs $20. Plus measurements are faster and less prone to hysteresis.

I agree that generics can be perfectly OK for DC measurements, but there are benefits to paying $300 for a dmm .


----------



## Totally Dubbed

LN2 @ -172c
3770k
6.4GHZ
On-the-fly OC
UK's No1 OC'er
Gadget Show live

Do you think he could have gotten a better OC de-lidded







?
PS. His chip he has at home is a 3770k @ 5ghz with 1.35v! MENTAL








!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Totally got the approval to spend but tons of money on my build this summer!!!!!!!


Nice! Cooling first so the chips can survive Mr. Leadfoot on the vcore.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i have this pos extreme 4 from assrock. lol. i have now 5ghz @ 1.38v and for 5.1 i need like 1.42v -1.46v idk somewhere between there. but ive seen quite a few people upgrade from the extreme 4 and they were able to lower there voltage a lot ! i was so surprised. i would love to go from 1.38v @ 5ghz to 1.28v


Keep in mind it's just a number on the screen, the cpu is still using the same actual voltage it would in a different board. It's nice to see the cpu-z voltage close to thew actual, but really isn't that important.
If you ever want to do more extreme cooling & overclock higher you will need a better board, but not really worth it just to see a different vcore in screenshots.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Dude have you not heard about how the MVF and MVE work REALLY REALLY well with the Trident RAM??? I'm going to be purchasing that exact RAM soon for that reason.
> Yes you are getting an incorrect vcore then. LLC2 is the worst I believe.


That isn't just the board, it's the bios by shammy. It works better for most types of memory, not just trident.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok i need some help lol is this enough to talk smack to an 8350 hokies i need u.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> look here
> http://www.overclock.net/t/884072/post-your-3dmark11-scores/4490#post_19675772


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 5ghz 3570k is faster then every 24/7 OC 8350 on OCN.
> 
> Destruction faster in things that use 6 threads or less... But pretty even in multi threaded.
> 
> People who own Fx 8350 and try to puff there chests out are not worth arguing with.. You can already tell they do not know jack for these reasons.
> 
> 1. You bought a Amd cpu.. your a Dummy...
> 
> 2. They will try to validate there purchase no matter what you say or prove.
> 
> 3. They will post the same 5 token benchmarks they have since the 8350 release.. and ignore the other 9999999999999
> 
> 4. It only leads to infractions " i know "
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Best thing to do is give them a Face palm gif laugh at them and move on.
> 
> Here are some for example.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> chronic, pm


Hey, AMD are still better for sub-zero cooled validations.








































































That is all.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> LN2 @ -172c
> 3770k
> 6.4GHZ
> On-the-fly OC
> UK's No1 OC'er
> Gadget Show live


yeah - *but we've got Valgaur* - he puts 1.89v into everything even without an audience







...just ask 'Frankie' (ah may be not, Frankie's dead)


----------



## TonicX

after much research, and comparing I purchased a maximus V GENE today at microcenter for $204, also a Geforce GTX 650ti for $140 without doing any research. The ROG board is to be my delidded ivy's permanent dwelling; but I am unsure if i should take the plastic off the 650 or return it. is there a thread for owners of this card or what? Im only running 1680x1050 single for games- dual for Cinema 4d, photoshop, and After effects.
It should be enough, right?
I will check back after i get a post. but before i open the video card. any comments, links or questions are welcome. but first a pile of baked ziti!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> yeah - *but we've got Valgaur* - he puts 1.89v into everything even without an audience
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...just ask 'Frankie' (ah may be not, Frankie's dead)


haha


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> LN2 @ -172c
> 3770k
> 6.4GHZ
> On-the-fly OC
> UK's No1 OC'er
> Gadget Show live
> 
> Do you think he could have gotten a better OC de-lidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> PS. His chip he has at home is a 3770k @ 5ghz with 1.35v! MENTAL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


Never actually seen 8 pack before, just the ab shots on his desktops.
Delidded would have probably been about 6.2Ghz, the average is about 200Mhz lost off the max clocks before delidding.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Keep in mind it's just a number on the screen, the cpu is still using the same actual voltage it would in a different board. It's nice to see the cpu-z voltage close to thew actual, but really isn't that important.
> If you ever want to do more extreme cooling & overclock higher you will need a better board, but not really worth it just to see a different vcore in screenshots.


lol
well im really determined to run 5ghz + when i get a new board, if i can







. extreme cooling souds so fun! but i think i need a lot more experience befor i do that


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Never actually seen 8 pack before, just the ab shots on his desktops.
> Delidded would have probably been about 6.2Ghz, the average is about 200Mhz lost off the max clocks before delidding.


...we could also highlight for Hokies that this is an Asus ROG board - of course !


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Hey, AMD are still better for sub-zero cooled validations.
> 
> That is all.


Ya got me partner. The ONE time AMD is > Intel is if you have this attached to your house:

http://www.uigi.com/customerstations.jpg


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Ya got me partner. The ONE time AMD is > Intel is if you have this attached to your house:
> 
> http://www.uigi.com/customerstations.jpg


That would be nice, I'd never run out! But these are more affordable & do the job


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...we could also highlight for Hokies that this is an Asus ROG board - of course !


The up7 on XtremeSystems was OC higher then that


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That would be nice, I'd never run out! But these are more affordable & do the job


My mom was watching some day time talk show the other day when I went over there for lunch. This guy was making margaritas with liquid nitrogen, I thought of you...


----------



## KuuFA

Alright got everything back together (just got my 380I) and now running 5.0 @ 1.5v max temps so far with a 1hr in prime doing 1792's is 74 degrees. If only I could make a loop for my 3570k lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That would be nice, I'd never run out! But these are more affordable & do the job


I can see a radioactive spider hanging from that wall man...watch out, you might get superpowers from it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My mom was watching some day time talk show the other day when I went over there for lunch. This guy was making margaritas with liquid nitrogen, I thought of you...


I was trying to convince my gf of getting a dewar, might try the 'I can become a part time barman' line next...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The up7 on XtremeSystems was OC higher then that


Yep, the up7 has almost been overclocked as high as the ROG boards, a few more Mhz it will catch up the mvg, then another 100Mhz after that it can beat the mve.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My mom was watching some day time talk show the other day when I went over there for lunch. This guy was making margaritas with liquid nitrogen, I thought of you...


I did get one of the workers here after his shift, wanted a weak rum & coke so mixed one weak.
Then put in ice cubes made of 75% bacardi to bug him about being an easy drunk.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Never actually seen 8 pack before, just the ab shots on his desktops.
> Delidded would have probably been about 6.2Ghz, the average is about 200Mhz lost off the max clocks before delidding.


Realised just now he is part of the OCN team and you're in contact with him (same team too)!







!
Numero unooo in Canada?
Very impressive man!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Realised just now he is part of the OCN team and you're in contact with him (same team too)!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> Numero unooo in Canada?
> Very impressive man!


We do chat in PM a fair bit, he's a good guy.

1st in Canada was more impressive in the extreme OC league. Right now I'm the #1 guy in Canada in the Pro OC, but it's not as impressive when I'm the only guy in Canada in the Pro league. 1st out of 1.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Realised just now he is part of the OCN team and you're in contact with him (same team too)!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> Numero unooo in Canada?
> Very impressive man!
> 
> 
> 
> We do chat in PM a fair bit, he's a good guy.
> 
> 1st in Canada was more impressive in the extreme OC league. Right now I'm the #1 guy in Canada in the Pro OC, but it's not as impressive when I'm the only guy in Canada in the Pro league. 1st out of 1.
Click to expand...

Doesn't matter had sex.


----------



## shamanik1320

Hello all I wanted to say I also have joined the delidded club unofficially, and learned a lot of interesting stuff on the way. I don't have the proof I did it unfortunately, since I didn't have my name in the photo I shot, but I'll post it as it helps describe the process I went through and what I encountered. I also have a video of my finale PC build (completed, except I can still get two more gpu's (I have only one right now), but besides that, I have 16 fans (minus the power supplies, so 17, but I don't count it since it doesn't connect to inside of case, and my delidded 3770k using Coollabs Liquid Ultra inside and between the heatspreader and my Corsair H100i closed loop cooler. I purchased a lapping kit from frozencpu.com or some site and it was a lot of sandpaper for polishing the cpu really well, I polished the inside and the outside of the heatspreader, as you can see the copper circle inside the heatspreader here, surrounding the Liquid Ultra metal paste. Now this part went swimmingly, it covered and adhered great on the glue covered cpu dye.

My PC

21.jpg 908k .jpg file

This picture is my property, do not reproduce or alter without permission.

My delidded i7-3770k

20.jpg 1116k .jpg file

This picture is my property, do not reproduce or alter without permission.

Now the next part, isn't a problem, I mean my system has been stable for like a month since I delidded.and shows no signs of problems and I've been running prime95 and intel burn test successfully at 4.7 Ghz (however IBT makes things so hot I think every now and then my cpu was throttling down.) but I know it was a success. Here's what I encountered though, the lapped surface of my heatspreader on top of my 3770k when I applied the liquid ultra, I found the extra well polished surface I made made the Liquid Ultra not want to adhere real well, it seemed to roll right over the surface almost like metal water and not actually bond, Now I slowly applied the stuff and rolled it over and over everything really slowly and covered it pretty much perfect and not a drop getting on the PCB, Then I attached the waterblock and that was over a month ago. Now, whenever I do my favorite test, which is run Real Temp's Load Tester for testing your cpu and I run MSI Afterburner's Kombustor at the same time, after hours, my cpu with a +.2 volt offset value @ 4.7 Ghz, I don't see any core go past 85-90 degrees.

Here are my system specs and I have youtube videos of my setup if you want to see my channel it's shamanik1320.

Corsair 400r case
Corsair H100i closed loop radiator and waterblock w/ SP 120 performance edition in pull and fans it came with in push, on a Delidded i7-3770k w/ Coollabs Liquid Ultra as only used thermal paste in both sides of heatspreader. Lapped heatspreader on both sides as well.
8 Gb 1866 mhz DDR3 G. Skill Ares Ram
MSI Geforce 680 GTX twin frozr iii w/ 4 GB vram
Asus Sabertooth Z77 Motherboard
Thermaltake 850 watt PSU

I use this system to make gaming videos on youtube. I like games like Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon: Future Soldier, Battlefield 3, Crysis 3, stuff like that. I also play fps games and most games in general only with a Razer Hydra Motion Controller. It's like a wiimote but a lot better. I gamed with mouse and keyboard for 15 years or so, I haven't had a reason to game with mouse and keyboard since two years ago I picked up the Razer Hydra. It is just so superior in every single way. However you have to kinda set it up yourself, the way it works out of the box sucks.

Anyone who reproduces this system will find one minor problem, the radiator for the Corsair H100i, and the radiator port on top of the Corsiar 400r case, will not line up with the Asus Sabertooth Z77 motherboard, the plastic armour is way too in the way, I love the armour, and luckily it's pretty minor because you can get it in almost straight but with only 3 screws able to line up (not the original centered holes where it's meant to line up, but it doesn't affect the airflow, nothing is covered, just the two fans on top are centered and not perfectly lined up but the only a couple cm's skewed, I don't even consider that to be a problem, the problem I see, is I can only get 3 screws pinning the radiator to the case, and when I add the fans on pull (top of case), I could only get 2 screws in where there are four screw holes, however the radiator feels super secure anyways. But something you will definitely need to know going into it.

I also used a lot of electrical tape to cover up any gaps that would affect the airflow of the Corsair H100i since out of the box, looking at it, there were so many gaps. I figured duct tape the **** of everything around it that would allow air to leak out and not be pushed through the radiator.

I love this thing's fans, it puts off so much air, I just think it's fun seeing how much air you can move through a case. Now soon as I have an extra $120 I don't need, I'll get 3 delta fans for the inside (since the ones on top it wouldn't be a good idea as Delta fans can slice a finger apart if you were to touch it.

Another idea I had, I duct taped three small 80 mm fans in conjunction with one another so they all blow the same direction, does this help them really put out a lot more air working together like that? There is no way for air to leak out of it.

Here is the link to the video of my finalized pc if you want to see.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I got a lot of those 1st out of 1 scores... 2 pointers with gold cups lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Hello all.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> This is I believe my first ever post on the Overclock.net forums. I wanted to say I also have joined the delidded club and learned a lot of interesting stuff on the way. I don't have the proof I did it unfortunately, since I only have one pic and it has no way of telling who it is, but I'll post it as it helps describe the process I went through and what I encountered. I also have a video of my finale PC build (completed, except I can still get two more gpu's (I have only one right now), but besides that, I have 16 fans (minus the power supplies, so 17, but I don't count it since it doesn't connect to inside of case, and my delidded 3770k using Coollabs Liquid Ultra inside and between the heatspreader and my Corsair H100i closed loop cooler. I purchased a lapping kit from frozencpu.com or some site and it was a lot of sandpaper for polishing the cpu really well, I polished the inside and the outside of the heatspreader, as you can see the copper circle inside the heatspreader here, surrounding the Liquid Ultra metal paste. Now this part went swimmingly, it covered and adhered great on the glue covered cpu dye.
> 
> 20.jpg 1116k .jpg file
> 
> This picture is my property, do not reproduce or alter without permission.
> 
> Now the next part, isn't a problem, I mean my system has been stable for like a month since I delidded.and shows no signs of problems and I've been running prime95 and intel burn test successfully at 4.7 Ghz (however IBT makes things so hot I think every now and then my cpu was throttling down.) but I know it was a success. Here's what I encountered though, the lapped surface of my heatspreader on top of my 3770k when I applied the liquid ultra, I found the extra well polished surface I made made the Liquid Ultra not want to adhere real well, it seemed to roll right over the surface almost like metal water and not actually bond, Now I slowly applied the stuff and rolled it over and over everything really slowly and covered it pretty much perfect and not a drop getting on the PCB, Then I attached the waterblock and that was over a month ago. Now, whenever I do my favorite test, which is run Real Temp's Load Tester for testing your cpu and I run MSI Afterburner's Kombustor at the same time, after hours, my cpu with a +.2 volt offset value @ 4.7 Ghz, I don't see any core go past 85-90 degrees.
> 
> Here are my system specs and I have youtube videos of my setup if you want to see my channel it's shamanik1320.
> 
> Corsair 400r case
> Corsair H100i closed loop radiator and waterblock w/ SP 120 performance edition in pull and fans it came with in push, on a Delidded i7-3770k w/ Coollabs Liquid Ultra as only used thermal paste in both sides of heatspreader. Lapped heatspreader on both sides as well.
> 8 Gb 1866 mhz DDR3 G. Skill Ares Ram
> MSI Geforce 680 GTX twin frozr iii w/ 4 GB vram
> Asus Sabertooth Z77 Motherboard
> Thermaltake 850 watt PSU
> 
> I use this system to make gaming videos on youtube. I like games like Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon: Future Soldier, Battlefield 3, Crysis 3, stuff like that. I also only play fps games and most games in general with a Razer Hydra Motion Controller. It's like a wiimote but a lot better.
> 
> Anyone who reproduces this system will find one minor problem, the radiator for the Corsair H100i, and the radiator port on top of the Corsiar 400r case, will not line up with the Asus Sabertooth Z77 motherboard, the plastic armour is way too in the way, I love the armour, and luckily it's pretty minor because you can get it in almost straight but with only 3 screws able to line up (not the original centered holes where it's meant to line up, but it doesn't affect the airflow, nothing is covered, just the two fans on top are centered and not perfectly lined up but the only a couple cm's skewed, I don't even consider that to be a problem, the problem I see, is I can only get 3 screws pinning the radiator to the case, and when I add the fans on pull (top of case), I could only get 2 screws in where there are four screw holes, however the radiator feels super secure anyways. But something you will definitely need to know going into it.
> 
> I also used a lot of electrical tape to cover up any gaps that would affect the airflow of the Corsair H100i since out of the box, looking at it, there were so many gaps. I figured duct tape the **** of everything around it that would allow air to leak out and not be pushed through the radiator.
> 
> I love this thing's fans, it puts off so much air, I just think it's fun seeing how much air you can move through a case. Now soon as I have an extra $120 I don't need, I'll get 3 delta fans for the inside (since the ones on top it wouldn't be a good idea as Delta fans can slice a finger apart if you were to touch it.
> 
> Another idea I had, I duct taped three small 80 mm fans in conjunction with one another so they all blow the same direction, does this help them really put out a lot more air working together like that? There is no way for air to leak out of it.
> 
> Here is the link to the video of my finalized pc if you want to see.


I didn't read your entire post because I have a stye on my eyelid and it hurts to look at the white background for that long (because your post was a mini-novel) but I did see the picture and that's way too much CLU. When it forms little puddles like that you know it's too much. That's going to hurt your temps by a couple degrees. It should be a smooth mirror-like finish.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> after much research, and comparing I purchased a maximus V GENE today at microcenter for $204, also a Geforce GTX 650ti for $140 without doing any research. The ROG board is to be my delidded ivy's permanent dwelling; but I am unsure if i should take the plastic off the 650 or return it. is there a thread for owners of this card or what? Im only running 1680x1050 single for games- dual for Cinema 4d, photoshop, and After effects.
> It should be enough, right?
> I will check back after i get a post. but before i open the video card. any comments, links or questions are welcome. but first a pile of baked ziti!


Between my corsair copper block and my Lapped IHS i should apply (A.) CLU (B) Artic Silver 5 (C) IC Diamond 7 (D) Liquid Nitro (E) silicon Compound ??? seriously.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Between my corsair copper block and my Lapped IHS i should apply (A.) CLU (B) Artic Silver 5 (C) IC Diamond 7 (D) Liquid Nitro (E) silicon Compound ??? seriously.


Diamond son! Easy to clean and yields good temps. Less time consuming, just a tiny little line (you know where the die is because you've delidded) so tiny line on the die and you're good. I take my cooler on and off way too much to clean and apply CLU everytime.


----------



## Jayjr1105

OCN name: Jayjr1105
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: Coolermaster HTK-002
Mhz gained: none yet
OC after delid: 4.4
Temp drops: 19c max 9c min.

*Before de-lid:*
Intel Burn Test 10 passes on high
Max Core Temps: 64,70,70,69
Prime 95 30 minutes on blend
Max Core Temps: 67,72,73,73

*After de-lid:*
Intel Burn Test 10 passes on high
Max Core Temps: 52,59,62,60
Prime 95 30 minutes on blend
Max Core Temps: 48,53,56,54


----------



## lilchronic

i think im going with this board. after read this. im sure it will be much better for what im tryn to do and for my price range
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6650/asrock-z77-oc-formula-review-living-in-the-fast-lane


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That would be nice, I'd never run out! But these are more affordable & do the job


Thats a baby one. You should see the ones that I use to fill my NMR with Nitrogen and Helium. An overclockers dream!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> We do chat in PM a fair bit, he's a good guy.
> 
> 1st in Canada was more impressive in the extreme OC league. Right now I'm the #1 guy in Canada in the Pro OC, but it's not as impressive when I'm the only guy in Canada in the Pro league. 1st out of 1.


Yeah he was a great guy to chat to!
And see below - still couuuuuuuuuuuuunts








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Doesn't matter had sex.


LOL
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Between my corsair copper block and my Lapped IHS i should apply (A.) CLU (B) Artic Silver 5 (C) IC Diamond 7 (D) Liquid Nitro (E) silicon Compound ??? seriously.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Diamond son! Easy to clean and yields good temps. Less time consuming, just a tiny little line (you know where the die is because you've delidded) so tiny line on the die and you're good. I take my cooler on and off way too much to clean and apply CLU everytime.


I agree.
I've also heard bad things about AS5's performance nowadays.
I would stay away from that completely.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i think im going with this board. after read this. im sure it will be much better for what im tryn to do and for my price range
> http://www.anandtech.com/show/6650/asrock-z77-oc-formula-review-living-in-the-fast-lane


Want me to find u a G1 Sniper 3 for the same price or less used?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Flukes are guaranteed to be more accurate than a generic one. You can expect 0.05% DC voltage accuracy with a Fluke which you just won't get with a DMM that costs $20. Plus measurements are faster and less prone to hysteresis.
> 
> I agree that generics can be perfectly OK for DC measurements, but there are benefits to paying $300 for a dmm .


The one I use is a cheap $20 radio shack DMM. While it only boasts a 2% accuracy variation at 2V I feel that is an acceptable loss of accuracy.

-Dr/owned lets say hypothetically we have the same exact chip and I run mine at 1.51v and you run yours at 1.48v do you feel that your is going to last significantly longer?

If you answered yes like I know you are inclined to because it is your nature to say black to everyones white

How are you going to afford your next chip? You already spent your $300?


----------



## Hokies83

Lol Pm sent lilchronic G1 Sniper 3 for 185$.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I got a lot of those 1st out of 1 scores... 2 pointers with gold cups lol


They all add up. Look at Genieben...
Just noticed I'm not alone in Canada pro oc, rasparthe joined the team. But same team so we both have the same points & rank.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Guys i need some help. I Delidded the CPU Sunday and used Noctua NT-H1 on the CPU and the die. I was getting upwards 90C before and after i did it i got 83C in the hottest core but it took 8 hours to reach that number. Today i had Core Temp open just to check how hot the CPU cores get under normal use and for some reason one core was 84C. I Launched Prime 95 and Core #1 and Core #2 hit 80C instantly which before they hit ~ 65C and only into 70s after 10 mins. What surprised me was that core #0 and #3 where both in 60s. Do you guys think that the paste in the die might have slipped off? I have CLP on the way but want to fix this problem first.


----------



## stickg1

Man what a crappy week


----------



## tinmann

I bought a i7 3770 recently and i plan to put it on water but I would never attempt the stuff you guys are talking about here. No


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tinmann*
> 
> I bought a i7 3770 recently and i plan to put it on water but I would never attempt the stuff you guys are talking about here. No


Y?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Guys i need some help. I Delidded the CPU Sunday and used Noctua NT-H1 on the CPU and the die. I was getting upwards 90C before and after i did it i got 83C in the hottest core but it took 8 hours to reach that number. Today i had Core Temp open just to check how hot the CPU cores get under normal use and for some reason one core was 84C. I Launched Prime 95 and Core #1 and Core #2 hit 80C instantly which before they hit ~ 65C and only into 70s after 10 mins. What surprised me was that core #0 and #3 where both in 60s. Do you guys think that the paste in the die might have slipped off? I have CLP on the way but want to fix this problem first.


Could be to much tim... Also the clamp could have made the IHS slide down.

Id just live with it till the CLU gets there.

And just remember EXTREME thin layer on die and EXTREME thin layer on back side of IHS.

Stuff goes a Mile.. Use a Q tip and work it.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Lol Pm sent lilchronic G1 Sniper 3 for 185$.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Lol Pm sent lilchronic G1 Sniper 3 for 185$.


Sniper is an awesome board.. Can't use it myself though since I have 7970 vapor-x in crossfire and I need triple slot space.

Did I mention I finally tried to overclock my ram last night. It is at 2000mhz 9-10-9-27-1T @ 1.65v right now. This is the corsair low profile ram ddr3 1600mhz 9-9-9-24-2T @ 1.5v overclocked. My 3dmark11 physics score went from 9100 to 9850







So I guess there isn't much need to buy the cas 10 2400mhz trident x's. I will just run like this for now. I played tomb raider for about 3 hours last night without WHEA errors or freezes. Should I run memtest86+ or not bother with it since I haven't seen WHEA errors yet.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tinmann*
> 
> I bought a i7 3770 recently and i plan to put it on water but I would never attempt the stuff you guys are talking about here. No


You're more like the cowardly lion than the tinmann...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Sniper is an awesome board.. Can't use it myself though since I have 7970 vapor-x in crossfire and I need triple slot space.
> 
> Did I mention I finally tried to overclock my ram last night. It is at 2000mhz 9-10-9-27-1T @ 1.65v right now. This is the corsair low profile ram ddr3 1600mhz 9-9-9-24-2T @ 1.5v overclocked. My 3dmark11 physics score went from 9100 to 9850
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I guess there isn't much need to buy the cas 10 2400mhz trident x's. I will just run like this for now. I played tomb raider for about 3 hours last night without WHEA errors or freezes. Should I run memtest86+ or not bother with it since I haven't seen WHEA errors yet.


?

Native Sli is pci-e Slot 1 and Slot 3.. so 3 spaces between top and 2nd card









As seen here.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Y?
> Could be to much tim... Also the clamp could have made the IHS slide down.
> 
> Id just live with it till the CLU gets there.
> 
> And just remember EXTREME thin layer on die and EXTREME thin layer on back side of IHS.
> 
> Stuff goes a Mile.. Use a Q tip and work it.


Should i use it in the IHS too or keep using normal thermal paste?

I did not use much at all. Temp where fine when 4 days go.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> ?
> 
> Native Sli is pci-e Slot 1 and Slot 3.. so 3 spaces between top and 2nd card
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As seen here.


My bad you are right there is room. I saw a thread where the crossfire bridge would not reach.. Thats what it was.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Should i use it in the IHS too or keep using normal thermal paste?
> 
> I did not use much at all. Temp where fine when 4 days go.


Id leave it off between Heatsink and IHS..

But use it on bottom of IHS between IHS and Die.

Could be pump out?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> My bad you are right there is room. I saw a thread where the crossfire bridge would not reach.. Thats what it was.


Board comes with 3 bridges 2 way and 3way and 4 way hard bridges.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Board comes with 3 bridges 2 way and 3way and 4 way hard bridges.


Can you use those for 7970's?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Can you use those for 7970's?


Nope ur stuck with the flex x fire connectors with the cards =[


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Board comes with 3 bridges 2 way and 3way and 4 way hard bridges.


...also, MSI makes a non-standard longer flexible bridge cable for SLI, (14 cm instead of 12 cm) - may be they also have one for CF - it's used by folks with LN2 pots and such which need the extra length


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Want me to find u a G1 Sniper 3 for the same price or less used?


Why the downgrade man? Top tier benching board to mid-high end gamer board?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Man what a crappy week


Why man!?

Did I mention I finally tried to overclock my ram last night. It is at 2000mhz 9-10-9-27-1T @ 1.65v right now. This is the corsair low profile ram ddr3 1600mhz 9-9-9-24-2T @ 1.5v overclocked. My 3dmark11 physics score went from 9100 to 9850







So I guess there isn't much need to buy the cas 10 2400mhz trident x's. I will just run like this for now. I played tomb raider for about 3 hours last night without WHEA errors or freezes. Should I run memtest86+ or not bother with it since I haven't seen WHEA errors yet.[/quote]

Memtest is only for testing faulty mem at stock clocks...Run IBT max mem for 5 passes and superpi 32m, if it passes you're mostly golden.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Want me to find u a G1 Sniper 3 for the same price or less used?


i pm'd that guy







thanks


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Why the downgrade man? Top tier benching board to mid-high end gamer board?
> Why man!?
> 
> Did I mention I finally tried to overclock my ram last night. It is at 2000mhz 9-10-9-27-1T @ 1.65v right now. This is the corsair low profile ram ddr3 1600mhz 9-9-9-24-2T @ 1.5v overclocked. My 3dmark11 physics score went from 9100 to 9850
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I guess there isn't much need to buy the cas 10 2400mhz trident x's. I will just run like this for now. I played tomb raider for about 3 hours last night without WHEA errors or freezes. Should I run memtest86+ or not bother with it since I haven't seen WHEA errors yet.


? G1 Sniper 3 is the HIGHEST end Gamer board on Z77..... Unless ur running LN2 a benching board is a waste.. and were talking Gigabytes 2-3rd best board VS an Asrock board here lmao..

The G1 Series are quite famous boards that bridge the gap between Normal desk top Benching board and gamer.

Try again MR Asus







The Hokie has been around to long


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

3770k arrived. OC'd, stressed

4.5ghz 2600k 1.375v (turbo llc) stable -> 65C max VRM 65C max core

4.5ghz 3770k 1.335v (high llc) stable -> 76C max VRM 75/83/77/84C max cores

I'll be considering delidding with a hammer and vice seeing as the clearance for a razor is smaller than i imagined....

I tried a 4.7 at 1.450 and had to shut the computer off due to temp flying to 100C+ and vrm hitting 100C+
delidding might drop the temps, but why is this 3770k beating my VRMS up?

Batch 3230B865


----------



## chronicfx

@ivan currently on pass 3 of 5 max ibt. The flame looks to wave proudly without stuttering. I am hoping for the best


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> ? G1 Sniper 3 is the HIGHEST end Gamer board on Z77..... Unless ur running LN2 a benching board is a waste.. and were talking Gigabytes 2-3rd best board VS an Asrock board here lmao..
> 
> The G1 Series are quite famous boards that bridge the gap between Normal desk top Benching board and gamer.
> 
> Try again MR Asus
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Hokie has been around to long


Highest end gamer board







I know you didn't get that from sin, he is not a 3d guy.

I don't know of any rankings for gaming boards so can't argue it, but sounds funny.
It doesn't get the highest cpu clocks, or 3d scores, or memory clocks, or reference clock, but it is the highest end gaming board.

Can't prove you wrong but can still bug you with ROG.
.
.
.
.
.
.
ROG!


----------



## chronicfx

Max temps at 94 degrees... Time to buy a rasa kit with the $300 I saved on my multimeter.


----------



## shamanik1320

Dude, it isn't that hard, my advice, use a thick beanie hat to grip the razor blade and slide it in, you don't saw, you force it in wedging through the glue, remember which sides the dye are running between and just only go in a tiny amount on this sides where the dye is near the edge. you just set it in the gap, against the glue and apply an extreme amount of pressure, but keep your touch, so u dont cut through too quickly.

I even had my 3770k hooked up to a cooler master 212 evo+ for a week or so before I delidded it, someone said that hooking it up to a bracket system for a large aftermarket air cooler makes it not worth doing, but I did it anyway and it all worked out.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Highest end gamer board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know you didn't get that from sin, he is not a 3d guy.
> 
> I don't know of any rankings for gaming boards so can't argue it, but sounds funny.
> It doesn't get the highest cpu clocks, or 3d scores, or memory clocks, or reference clock, but it is the highest end gaming board.
> 
> Can't prove you wrong but can still bug you with ROG.
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> ROG!


Not made for that.

It is made to compete with the MVF ..

Which not only does it beat the MVF on price it beats it on features and has a PLX chip which Asus cheaped out on and did not even put it on there " Gamer Board "

A gamer is not worried about Hwbot i am a gamer... I do not bench i do not care about it..
The G1 has features like shutting down all your connections and focuses all your bandwidth to the game your playing..
Has features to hear " foot steps" while gaming etc.

But will also push a 3770k 5ghz + and run sli / xfire at x8x16x8 or x8x8x8x8 or 16x16..
Only the MVE will do that.. but it lacts the gaming features







nasty Realtek Audio *Puke*

LoL But at the end of the day this fact still remains...

Gigabyte is the number 1 selling mother board company in the world Asus is number 2


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Dude, it isn't that hard, my advice, use a thick beanie hat to grip the razor blade and slide it in, you don't saw, you force it in wedging through the glue, remember which sides the dye are running between and just only go in a tiny amount on this sides where the dye is near the edge. you just set it in the gap, against the glue and apply an extreme amount of pressure, but keep your touch, so u dont cut through too quickly.
> 
> I even had my 3770k hooked up to a cooler master 212 evo+ for a week or so before I delidded it, someone said that hooking it up to a bracket system for a large aftermarket air cooler makes it not worth doing, but I did it anyway and it all worked out.


I am going to have to recommend the wooden block and vice method after seeing it. Looks a lot safer and easier if you have the tools available.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Max temps at 94 degrees... Time to buy a rasa kit with the $300 I saved on my multimeter.


ROFL, you're too much man stop...


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I didn't read your entire post because I have a stye on my eyelid and it hurts to look at the white background for that long (because your post was a mini-novel) but I did see the picture and that's way too much CLU. When it forms little puddles like that you know it's too much. That's going to hurt your temps by a couple degrees. It should be a smooth mirror-like finish.


Yeah, you're probably right, have you tried applying it to a lapped surface though? That was tough. I probably should've used a q-tip for the dye. I'm gonna let it go though for awhile and someday I'll crack it open again and see how it looks. I'm just too afraid to take it apart that it's all together lol. When I was switching my 3770 to the 3770k I accidently bent some cpu pins on my Asus Sabertooth Z77 due to my old Cooler Master 212 EVO +'s bracket system, thus having to buy a second $230 motherboard. So I am not going to feel like opening it again for some time. ^^

But I was wondering, does the consistency change at all after being used for a long period of time?


----------



## KuuFA

Hmm is my MVG stopping me from getting 5.0 stable? I can boot at 1.42 - 1.55 but still cant pass prime ~ 10 min in running 1792's


----------



## shamanik1320

Lol I forgot to mention, I used the beanie hat that Intel gave me with the 3770k. Is that irony? Or is that what the beanie is for? I was almost about to give up, but I found out when holding the razor blade with a beanie hat (although I suppose if u had a blade connected to a handle that would work too.) I could leverage and put a lot of pressure on the blade and it just sunk right into that glue.


----------



## chronicfx

OK it passed. I gained 4 gflops by overclocking the ram too. 130 to 134







I'll take it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> after much research, and comparing I purchased a maximus V GENE today at microcenter for $204, also a Geforce GTX 650ti for $140 without doing any research. The ROG board is to be my delidded ivy's permanent dwelling; but I am unsure if i should take the plastic off the 650 or return it. is there a thread for owners of this card or what? Im only running 1680x1050 single for games- dual for Cinema 4d, photoshop, and After effects.
> It should be enough, right?
> I will check back after i get a post. but before i open the video card. any comments, links or questions are welcome. but first a pile of baked ziti!


Nice! Welcome to the club! Be sure to let us know how you like you Gene!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That isn't just the board, it's the bios by shammy. It works better for most types of memory, not just trident.


Thank you for clearing that up sir!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Not made for that.
> 
> It is made to compete with the MVF ..
> 
> Which not only does it beat the MVF on price it beats it on features and has a PLX chip which Asus cheaped out on and did not even put it on there " Gamer Board "
> 
> A gamer is not worried about Hwbot i am a gamer... I do not bench i do not care about it..
> The G1 has features like shutting down all your connections and focuses all your bandwidth to the game your playing..
> Has features to hear " foot steps" while gaming etc.
> 
> But will also push a 3770k 5ghz + and run sli / xfire at x8x16x8 or x8x8x8x8 or 16x16..
> Only the MVE will do that.. but it lacts the gaming features
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nasty Realtek Audio *Puke*
> 
> LoL But at the end of the day this fact still remains...
> 
> Gigabyte is the number 1 selling mother board company in the world Asus is number 2


I know, gigabyte was my fav. boards for x58 for sure, & I still get a gigabyte board for every socket (no x79 GB though).
I do prefer Asus for memory overclocking.

I like MSI boards too, after using the z77 ud3h for a while I would take the mpower over it any day.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Yeah, you're probably right, have you tried applying it to a lapped surface though? That was tough. I probably should've used a q-tip for the dye. I'm gonna let it go though for awhile and someday I'll crack it open again and see how it looks. I'm just too afraid to take it apart that it's all together lol. When I was switching my 3770 to the 3770k I accidently bent some cpu pins on my Asus Sabertooth Z77 due to my old Cooler Master 212 EVO +'s bracket system, thus having to buy a second $230 motherboard. So I am not going to feel like opening it again for some time. ^^
> 
> But I was wondering, does the consistency change at all after being used for a long period of time?


I too used way too much CLU (only mine was CLP) my first time around. And after two months, mine was still just as wet looking as the first day I put it on.

Here's how we've come to think about it. Consider about how much CLU you would think is needed to cover the die, use about 1/4 of that amount, and you have the right amount of TIM.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I know, gigabyte was my fav. boards for x58 for sure, & I still get a gigabyte board for every socket (no x79 GB though).
> I do prefer Asus for memory overclocking.
> 
> I like MSI boards too, after using the z77 ud3h for a while I would take the mpower over it any day.


LoL well the UD3h is quite a ways down the pecking order now

1 Up7

2 G1 sniper 3 / UP5

3 Up4

4 UP3

5 UD5H

6 UD3H


----------



## nemm

Before delidding I was running [email protected] hitting 78-97-96-80 in IBT 10 pass using a custom loop, I wasn't too amused with the temperatures especially with my setup but after testing and remounting numerous times checking the imprint on ihs and cpu block, good consistent cover every time and the same consistency applied the temperatures in each test. Not being happy and knowing the IB run hot I at least thought my loop should have been doing a better job so I dismantled the loop and inspecting the cpu block for blockages. My main focus was this block because the gpu temps were fine and there was no air trapped in the loop, anyway nothing wrong with block.

Loop reassembled, trapped air removed and all temperatures were once again the same as previous so I decided to delid using mx4 on both die and ihs which gave temperatures of 72-90-90-75. Not impressed with the drops thinking something is a miss here, time to reapply paste again which gave pretty much the same results so I lapped the ihs and using a micrometer to measure the change in thickness once the surface became flat and concave center was no more. The before thickness was 2.42mm, after was 2.16mm which is a large difference in my opinion which surprised me. Thermal compound reapplied and not expecting miracles since seeing others who have lapped results but it was worth a shot I began testing, results were 72-87-87-73.

After these not so impressive results I managed to get hold of some Gelid extreme, so I applied it to both die and ihs. Again not expecting much since I have used mx4 and gc extreme before finding the performance the same, however the results shocked me, 62-71-70-61. Not only did the difference between the lowest and highest core decrease to a more anticipated value of 10 instead of 19 before delid and 15 after delid and lapping, the temperatures across all cores dropped further more.

To summarise delid findings,

*before* 78-97-96-80, temp difference 19deg, avg 87.75deg _*mx4 ihs_
*after* 72-90-90-75, temp difference 18deg, avg 81.75deg _*mx4 die and ihs_
*lapped* 72-87-87-73, temp difference 15deg, avg 79.75deg _*mx4 die and ihs_
*gc ext* 62-71-70-61, temp difference 10deg, avg 66.00deg _*gc extreme die and ihs_

26deg drop on the hottest core and 21.75deg avg across all core drop, now I am happy. I did contemplate CLU/P but never managed to source any.

As you can see, gelid came out far superior this time which has shocked me how bad mx4 was for this particular application considering all previous experience with both compounds the difference has been negligible.

With the drop in max temperatures I tried a further overclock but the voltage increase to get 8-12hr prime blend stable was too large at 1.464, however I could pass IBT with 1.408 but failed with encoding so the 100mhz gain is not worth the voltage increase.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*


Welcome to the forum man! I'm sure Valgaur will add you anyways if you want. Just try filling out the info from the first page in the thread the best that you can and post it. Also, I think you applied too much CLU. All you need to do is push the syringe so it is just below the tip and then stick the brush in the tip to coat it and that might be enough for the die and the bottom of the IHS. The stuff preads like wildfire.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nemm*
> 
> Before delidding I was running [email protected] hitting 78-97-96-80 in IBT 10 pass using a custom loop, I wasn't too amused with the temperatures especially with my setup but after testing and remounting numerous times checking the imprint on ihs and cpu block, good consistent cover every time and the same consistency applied the temperatures in each test. Not being happy and knowing the IB run hot I at least thought my loop should have been doing a better job so I dismantled the loop and inspecting the cpu block for blockages. My main focus was this block because the gpu temps were fine and there was no air trapped in the loop, anyway nothing wrong with block.
> 
> Loop reassembled, trapped air removed and all temperatures were once again the same as previous so I decided to delid using mx4 on both die and ihs which gave temperatures of 72-90-90-75. Not impressed with the drops thinking something is a miss here, time to reapply paste again which gave pretty much the same results so I lapped the ihs and using a micrometer to measure the change in thickness once the surface became flat and concave center was no more. The before thickness was 2.42mm, after was 2.16mm which is a large difference in my opinion which surprised me. Thermal compound reapplied and not expecting miracles since seeing others who have lapped results but it was worth a shot I began testing, results were 72-87-87-73.
> 
> After these not so impressive results I managed to get hold of some Gelid extreme, so I applied it to both die and ihs. Again not expecting much since I have used mx4 and gc extreme before finding the performance the same, however the results shocked me, 62-71-70-61. Not only did the difference between the lowest and highest core decrease to a more anticipated value of 10 instead of 19 before delid and 15 after delid and lapping, the temperatures across all cores dropped further more.
> 
> To summarise delid findings,
> 
> *before* 78-97-96-80, temp difference 19deg, avg 87.75deg _*mx4 ihs_
> *after* 72-90-90-75, temp difference 18deg, avg 81.75deg _*mx4 die and ihs_
> *lapped* 72-87-87-73, temp difference 15deg, avg 79.75deg _*mx4 die and ihs_
> *gc ext* 62-71-70-61, temp difference 10deg, avg 66.00deg _*gc extreme die and ihs_
> 
> 26deg drop on the hottest core and 21.75deg avg across all core drop, now I am happy. I did contemplate CLU/P but never managed to source any.
> 
> As you can see, gelid came out far superior this time which has shocked me how bad mx4 was for this particular application considering all previous experience with both compounds the difference has been negligible.
> 
> With the drop in max temperatures I tried a further overclock but the voltage increase to get 8-12hr prime blend stable was too large at 1.464, however I could pass IBT with 1.408 but failed with encoding so the 100mhz gain is not worth the voltage increase.


Good post, glad to see such positive results.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> 
> OCN name: Jayjr1105
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: Coolermaster HTK-002
> Mhz gained: none yet
> OC after delid: 4.4
> Temp drops: 19c max 9c min.
> 
> *Before de-lid:*
> Intel Burn Test 10 passes on high
> Max Core Temps: 64,70,70,69
> Prime 95 30 minutes on blend
> Max Core Temps: 67,72,73,73
> 
> *After de-lid:*
> Intel Burn Test 10 passes on high
> Max Core Temps: 52,59,62,60
> Prime 95 30 minutes on blend
> Max Core Temps: 48,53,56,54


You're In!







Trow a new sig on man! Show it off!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Hello all I wanted to say I also have joined the delidded club unofficially, and learned a lot of interesting stuff on the way. I don't have the proof I did it unfortunately, since I didn't have my name in the photo I shot, but I'll post it as it helps describe the process I went through and what I encountered. I also have a video of my finale PC build (completed, except I can still get two more gpu's (I have only one right now), but besides that, I have 16 fans (minus the power supplies, so 17, but I don't count it since it doesn't connect to inside of case, and my delidded 3770k using Coollabs Liquid Ultra inside and between the heatspreader and my Corsair H100i closed loop cooler. I purchased a lapping kit from frozencpu.com or some site and it was a lot of sandpaper for polishing the cpu really well, I polished the inside and the outside of the heatspreader, as you can see the copper circle inside the heatspreader here, surrounding the Liquid Ultra metal paste. Now this part went swimmingly, it covered and adhered great on the glue covered cpu dye.
> 
> My PC
> 
> 21.jpg 908k .jpg file
> 
> This picture is my property, do not reproduce or alter without permission.
> 
> My delidded i7-3770k
> 
> 20.jpg 1116k .jpg file
> 
> This picture is my property, do not reproduce or alter without permission.
> 
> Now the next part, isn't a problem, I mean my system has been stable for like a month since I delidded.and shows no signs of problems and I've been running prime95 and intel burn test successfully at 4.7 Ghz (however IBT makes things so hot I think every now and then my cpu was throttling down.) but I know it was a success. Here's what I encountered though, the lapped surface of my heatspreader on top of my 3770k when I applied the liquid ultra, I found the extra well polished surface I made made the Liquid Ultra not want to adhere real well, it seemed to roll right over the surface almost like metal water and not actually bond, Now I slowly applied the stuff and rolled it over and over everything really slowly and covered it pretty much perfect and not a drop getting on the PCB, Then I attached the waterblock and that was over a month ago. Now, whenever I do my favorite test, which is run Real Temp's Load Tester for testing your cpu and I run MSI Afterburner's Kombustor at the same time, after hours, my cpu with a +.2 volt offset value @ 4.7 Ghz, I don't see any core go past 85-90 degrees.
> 
> Here are my system specs and I have youtube videos of my setup if you want to see my channel it's shamanik1320.
> 
> Corsair 400r case
> Corsair H100i closed loop radiator and waterblock w/ SP 120 performance edition in pull and fans it came with in push, on a Delidded i7-3770k w/ Coollabs Liquid Ultra as only used thermal paste in both sides of heatspreader. Lapped heatspreader on both sides as well.
> 8 Gb 1866 mhz DDR3 G. Skill Ares Ram
> MSI Geforce 680 GTX twin frozr iii w/ 4 GB vram
> Asus Sabertooth Z77 Motherboard
> Thermaltake 850 watt PSU
> 
> I use this system to make gaming videos on youtube. I like games like Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon: Future Soldier, Battlefield 3, Crysis 3, stuff like that. I also play fps games and most games in general only with a Razer Hydra Motion Controller. It's like a wiimote but a lot better. I gamed with mouse and keyboard for 15 years or so, I haven't had a reason to game with mouse and keyboard since two years ago I picked up the Razer Hydra. It is just so superior in every single way. However you have to kinda set it up yourself, the way it works out of the box sucks.
> 
> Anyone who reproduces this system will find one minor problem, the radiator for the Corsair H100i, and the radiator port on top of the Corsiar 400r case, will not line up with the Asus Sabertooth Z77 motherboard, the plastic armour is way too in the way, I love the armour, and luckily it's pretty minor because you can get it in almost straight but with only 3 screws able to line up (not the original centered holes where it's meant to line up, but it doesn't affect the airflow, nothing is covered, just the two fans on top are centered and not perfectly lined up but the only a couple cm's skewed, I don't even consider that to be a problem, the problem I see, is I can only get 3 screws pinning the radiator to the case, and when I add the fans on pull (top of case), I could only get 2 screws in where there are four screw holes, however the radiator feels super secure anyways. But something you will definitely need to know going into it.
> 
> I also used a lot of electrical tape to cover up any gaps that would affect the airflow of the Corsair H100i since out of the box, looking at it, there were so many gaps. I figured duct tape the **** of everything around it that would allow air to leak out and not be pushed through the radiator.
> 
> I love this thing's fans, it puts off so much air, I just think it's fun seeing how much air you can move through a case. Now soon as I have an extra $120 I don't need, I'll get 3 delta fans for the inside (since the ones on top it wouldn't be a good idea as Delta fans can slice a finger apart if you were to touch it.
> 
> Another idea I had, I duct taped three small 80 mm fans in conjunction with one another so they all blow the same direction, does this help them really put out a lot more air working together like that? There is no way for air to leak out of it.
> 
> Here is the link to the video of my finalized pc if you want to see.


Holy long page batman.....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Welcome to the forum man! I'm sure Valgaur will add you anyways if you want. Just try filling out the info from the first page in the thread the best that you can and post it. Also, I think you applied too much CLU. All you need to do is push the syringe so it is just below the tip and then stick the brush in the tip to coat it and that might be enough for the die and the bottom of the IHS. The stuff preads like wildfire.


What Ravage said give me info and I'll add ya!


----------



## Arm3nian

I can be sure of one thing for my next build, my motherboard will not be ASUS. I have already had 3 boards from there and have had bad experiences with all of them... my current one being the worse, and they have all been high end.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I can be sure of one thing for my next build, my motherboard will not be ASUS. I have already had 3 boards from there and have had bad experiences with all of them... my current one being the worse, and they have all been high end.










sorry to hear that. I mean I have heard tons of stories about asus boards but I currently own 3 asus boards and they work great! (p5q pro turbo, MIVG/gen3, and MVG. They all seem to be very nice in quality.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Welcome to the forum man! I'm sure Valgaur will add you anyways if you want. Just try filling out the info from the first page in the thread the best that you can and post it. Also, I think you applied too much CLU. All you need to do is push the syringe so it is just below the tip and then stick the brush in the tip to coat it and that might be enough for the die and the bottom of the IHS. The stuff preads like wildfire.


Well, my problem with filling in the info is I used a 3770 like since Ivy Bridge came out last April a year ago and I only switched to a 3770k a little over a month ago, I never got to really mess with it overclocking, even though I did have the 3770k attached to an air cooler before my Corsair H100i came, I never got around to overclocking it until I finished doing everything so I can't really provide good temperature data.

However, I did start using Real Temp instead of my Asus software because I've found Real Temp gives a different result, Asus usually tells me my cpu is 10 degrees cooler, and it doesn't even tell me what temp all the cores are. So I didn't even know about Real Temp before I finished everything on this pc build and started learning how to overclock the cpu.

OCN name:shamanik1320
CPU:Intel i7-3770k w/ Corsair H100i
on die-TIM:Coollabs Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM:Coollabs Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained:Never overclocked before delidding
OC after delid:4.7
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:If you watch my youtube video I posted, or on my channel it's "Ultimate PC Update" you can see myself running CPU-Z and it applying my +.2v offset and my Intel Turbo Boost monitor hitting 4.7 when I run Intel Burn Test.

I will follow the temperature recording thing tomorrow after work.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Just ran Prime 95 for 30min and i am getting 74/101/95/83. About 20C hotter then 3 days ago. Using NT-H1 in die and IHS.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Just ran Prime 95 for 30min and i am getting 74/101/95/83. About 20C hotter then 3 days ago. Using NT-H1 in die and IHS.


prob pump out. Have you redone the paste to see if it goes away?


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> prob pump out. Have you redone the paste to see if it goes away?


It that common? I will wait for CLP to come so i can do it again.


----------



## Hokies83

Ive had lots of Asus boards..

My brother is running a M3F with an i5 760

Atm i have a p55M Asus board.. in my HTPC Never had any issues with them.. But there RMA service sux.


----------



## shamanik1320

I am such a fan of the Asus Sabertooth Z77. I just think the idea of plastic armour is great. Not because it needs to protect anything, but that way the whole board is kept colder, it has two fans attached to the plastic cover that blow air underneath and through it, so a good amount of air is always flowing right against the components, also comes with like 12 temperature sensors, the plastic cover can get in the way though, besides that and it's priced pretty high, I'm such a fan of Asus motherboards. But Gigabyte is great too and I trust anything from MSI. I'd love to try an EVGA motherboard someday though for something different.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I can be sure of one thing for my next build, my motherboard will not be ASUS. I have already had 3 boards from there and have had bad experiences with all of them... my current one being the worse, and they have all been high end.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> I am such a fan of the Asus Sabertooth Z77. I just think the idea of plastic armour is great. Not because it needs to protect anything, but that way the whole board is kept colder, it has two fans attached to the plastic cover that blow air underneath and through it, so a good amount of air is always flowing right against the components, also comes with like 12 temperature sensors, the plastic cover can get in the way though, besides that and it's priced pretty high, I'm such a fan of Asus motherboards. But Gigabyte is great too and I trust anything from MSI. I'd love to try an EVGA motherboard someday though for something different.


Err the Sabertooth is the most over priced board in the Z77 Line up =/ ... They charge an Extra 100$ for the Plastic LoL.

The money they want for that thing and it does not even have a DEBug LED XD


----------



## Joa3d43

*Mobo sales by company, satisfaction index*

...not sure I should wade into the ongoing discussion(s) on 'my fav mobo company is better than yours'







, and also how satisfied users are across a larger number







...but then this is a thread where folks take razor blades to CPUs, if not a vise and hammer....

...the one thing I would look for are sales figures and satisfaction rankings

On sales, I could only find s.th. from early 2011 (so things may have changed) but here you go, per article on BitNet / DigiTimes:

_"...The figures, which are quoted over on DigiTimes, put ASRock in third place, behind Asustek and Gigabyte. It's a significant improvement over the company's showing in 2009, with 2010's figures pushing ASRock ahead of both MSI and ECS.

The figures, which only count own-brand retail sales and not OEM provisions, show ASRock selling eight million motherboards, compared with ECS and MSI selling seven million apiece. However, the company still has a long way to go if it wants to catch up with the market leaders.

By comparison, Asustek sold an estimated 21.6 million own-brand motherboards in 2010 - more than double that of ASRock, while second-place firm Gigabyte managed a similarly impressive 18 million_."

On customer satisfaction...:the latest (April 2013) here:


----------



## ZealotKi11er

I just pciked my MB because ASUS is way too overpriced @ ~ $200 price point for what you get. Z77 PRO was ~ $220 vs UD5H ~ $190.


----------



## Hokies83

LOL those votes do not mean much everybody just votes for the brand they own


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LOL those votes do not mean much everybody just votes for the brand they own


...Doesn't that make it even more valid though? Vote for what you have and like. That's the definition of customer satisfaction.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> ...Doesn't that make it even more valid though? Vote for what you have and like. That's the definition of customer satisfaction.


No...

People buy Asus because there colors are better. Hell even i admit that...

If i had a G1 Sniper 3 and a MVE setting infront of me same price id pick the MVE all day and twice on sunday... I still know Asus Customer service is about as bad as it gets.

Fact of the matter is my G1 Sniper 3 was Free.... MVE is over 300$ Which would u pick?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LOL those votes do not mean much everybody just votes for the brand they own


...the ratio of 'up /down' votes per brand does tell you a little bit...there is however a funny bit in that table: Foxconn (8) - it actually manufactures many of the mobos of the other guys, above and below


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the ratio of 'up /down' votes per brand does tell you a little bit...there is however a funny bit in that table: Foxconn (8) - it actually manufactures many of the mobos of the other guys, above and below


Yes i know Foxconn makes them lol.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Mobo sales by company, satisfaction index*
> 
> ...not sure I should wade into the ongoing discussion(s) on 'my fav mobo company is better than yours'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , and also how satisfied users are across a larger number
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...but then this is a thread where folks take razor blades to CPUs, if not a vise and hammer....
> 
> ...the one thing I would look for are sales figures and satisfaction rankings
> 
> On sales, I could only find s.th. from early 2011 (so things may have changed) but here you go, per article on BitNet / DigiTimes:
> 
> _"...The figures, which are quoted over on DigiTimes, put ASRock in third place, behind Asustek and Gigabyte. It's a significant improvement over the company's showing in 2009, with 2010's figures pushing ASRock ahead of both MSI and ECS.
> 
> The figures, which only count own-brand retail sales and not OEM provisions, show ASRock selling eight million motherboards, compared with ECS and MSI selling seven million apiece. However, the company still has a long way to go if it wants to catch up with the market leaders.
> 
> By comparison, Asustek sold an estimated 21.6 million own-brand motherboards in 2010 - more than double that of ASRock, while second-place firm Gigabyte managed a similarly impressive 18 million_."
> 
> On customer satisfaction...:the latest (April 2013) here:


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LOL those votes do not mean much everybody just votes for the brand they own


This is true, intel boards in the #3 spot, it wasn't just overclockers voting.


----------



## Arm3nian

Why is Biostar on that list... I had a Biostar board and had to RMA because of faulty ram slots, after 2 months they sent me back the EXACT same board, and pretended they changed it.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> No...
> 
> People buy Asus because there colors are better. Hell even i admit that...
> 
> If i had a G1 Sniper 3 and a MVE setting infront of me same price id pick the MVE all day and twice on sunday... I still know Asus Customer service is about as bad as it gets.
> 
> Fact of the matter is my G1 Sniper 3 was Free.... MVE is over 300$ Which would u pick?


I've been with both GB and Asus in the past year. Asus CS is definitely worse, but their products have also been less prone to problems in my experience. I actually preferred the Gigabyte Z68 colors by a huge margin to Asus. I think Asus' mix of shades of blue for their non-ROG line is absolutely vomit inducing whereas GB boards were mostly black with consistent color schema.

My ONLY qualm with Gigabyte is that their motherboards typically have horrible BIOS. They're solid physically, but the BIOS are plain bad and the updates do nothing if/when they even get posted.

I only went Asus this round because i got a factory refurb sealed box sabertooth z77 for $150 shipped. Same warranty as NIB and errythang.

Both my Asus and GB mobos had Foxconn sockets.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Why is Biostar on that list... I had a Biostar board and had to RMA because of faulty ram slots, after 2 months they sent me back the EXACT same board, and pretended they changed it.


It's a popularity list, biostar were cheap, like asrock, so were popular.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Alright so I've been spending a little time doing a crappy blueprint of my water loop in paint. I would like your opinions on it because I'm not sure if there would be a better way to do it. I'm using two pumps in this blueprint because of the vertical climb at the beginning of the loop. There is going to be a 200mm fanless radiator on the front, a 360 rad on the top, a 140 rad on the back, and another 140 rad on the fan mount on the HDD cage. How does it look?


----------



## KuuFA

Is the a rad in the middle of the case? if so it wouldn't be a good spot for it as its just getting ambient hot air around your case. You should put it on the bottom of your case if you can mount it there..


----------



## lilchronic

so nobody likes the asrock oc formula?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Is the a rad in the middle of the case? if so it wouldn't be a good spot for it as its just getting ambient hot air around your case. You should put it on the bottom of your case if you can mount it there..


In the very middle is the CPU block. On the bottom left is the PSU. Should have made that a little more clear. Do you mean the CPU block or the rad that is hanging from the HDD cage? I could probably fix one 120mm rad on the bottom, but I need some of that space for my pumps.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so nobody likes the asrock oc formula?


A lot of people think it is the best benching board or whatever, but I'm personally dont with AsRock


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so nobody likes the asrock oc formula?


I like it enough to want to try one, but have gotten 7 x z77 boards already, no new ones unless something dies.
It is the only Asrock board I would even look at.


----------



## Inacoma79

I'm in









OCN name: Inacoma79
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
Mhz gained: .7 (up from 4.5)
OC after delid: 4.7
Temp drops: 13C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2757176

Delid


CLU application


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL well the UD3h is quite a ways down the pecking order now
> 
> 1 Up7
> 
> 2 G1 sniper 3 / UP5
> 
> 3 Up4
> 
> 4 UP3
> 
> 5 UD5H
> 
> 6 UD3H


You're missing the ud4h...one of the GB boards I'm interested in. Improved memory clocking stuffs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so nobody likes the asrock oc formula?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> A lot of people think it is the best benching board or whatever, but I'm personally dont with AsRock


It's a GREAT board, unlike the rest of the Asrock boards. Their 1 year warranty is worse than Asus or Gigabyte's 3 years, and GB has better support than Asus.
Next gen I may go with GB if they make something really good for benching and relatively cheep, with a better bios.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I like it enough to want to try one, but have gotten 7 x z77 boards already, no new ones unless something dies.
> It is the only Asrock board I would even look at.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> In the very middle is the CPU block. On the bottom left is the PSU. Should have made that a little more clear. Do you mean the CPU block or the rad that is hanging from the HDD cage? I could probably fix one 120mm rad on the bottom, but I need some of that space for my pumps.


Yea that one hanging off your hdd cage needs to go lol Your loop is strange why didn't you get like a dual pump with res?
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/xstwd5dubayr.html

I mean Its almost exactly the same as the pumps you have and what you are trying to do it only makes sense?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I like it enough to want to try one, but have gotten 7 x z77 boards already, no new ones unless something dies.
> It is the only Asrock board I would even look at.


Yea I am in the same boat with you. Its the only Asrock board i would even try. I am even thinking about trading/ selling my gene V for one but I am on the fence about giving up my Gene


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Yea that one hanging off your hdd cage needs to go lol Your loop is strange why didn't you get like a dual pump with res?
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/xstwd5dubayr.html
> 
> I mean Its almost exactly the same as the pumps you have and what you are trying to do it only makes sense?
> Yea I am in the same boat with you. Its the only Asrock board i would even try. I am even thinking about trading/ selling my gene V for one but I am on the fence about giving up my Gene


Keep it, and try both...compare and then sell or return.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I like it enough to want to try one, but have gotten 7 x z77 boards already, no new ones unless something dies.
> It is the only Asrock board I would even look at.


lol i want to try it too but im not sure about it, theres a few pros and cons, one is only being capable of 2 way sli other than that i like it. sounds like it can overclock great! OC FORMULA . LOL
i would of definetly gone with the G1 sniper for 185$ that was a steal. i missed out thou a lil slow


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Keep it, and try both...compare and then sell or return.


Maybe in a few months when it drops in price the only reason I am considering it is because of my 2nd 7950 coming in lol my Gene is going to be packed until i get water blocks for them lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Yea that one hanging off your hdd cage needs to go lol Your loop is strange why didn't you get like a dual pump with res?
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/xstwd5dubayr.html
> 
> I mean Its almost exactly the same as the pumps you have and what you are trying to do it only makes sense?
> Yea I am in the same boat with you. Its the only Asrock board i would even try. I am even thinking about trading/ selling my gene V for one but I am on the fence about giving up my Gene


Because I know nothing about watercooling and thats why I just drew a picture and asked you guys because I need to be told what I'm doing wrong and why so I can learn. I didnt even know about the dual pump thing until right now.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Because I know nothing about watercooling and thats why I just drew a picture and asked you guys because I need to be told what I'm doing wrong and why so I can learn. I didnt even know about the dual pump thing until right now.


OH well in that case sorry if my post sounded condescending didn't mean for it to be.









But yea I would just grab that if you wanted to go dual pump I have one pump right now and I cannot even imagine how much room 2 pumps would take lol.

Hmm ill do a quick sketch up on what i think you should do but I am no expert at it lol I have only done 3 loops and only one of them have been in a huge case lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> OH well in that case sorry if my post sounded condescending didn't mean for it to be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But yea I would just grab that if you wanted to go dual pump I have one pump right now and I cannot even imagine how much room 2 pumps would take lol.
> 
> Hmm ill do a quick sketch up on what i think you should do but I am no expert at it lol I have only done 3 loops and only one of them have been in a huge case lol.


Oh didn't mean to be rude man I didn't even think of that I was just explaining why I sounded so stupid or my diagram made no sense haha. Thanks a lot man I appreciate that!









Sorry if I came off that way! I try to never be rude to anyone here no matter what







Thats my #1 rule


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh didn't mean to be rude man I didn't even think of that I was just explaining why I sounded so stupid or my diagram made no sense haha. Thanks a lot man I appreciate that!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry if I came off that way! I try to never be rude to anyone here no matter what
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats my #1 rule


We both thought the wrong things lol its cool man.









Here is what i propose (I try to run the least amount of tubing possible) The blue arrows mean airflow Its going to be tough but yea it can be done with the right fittings.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> We both thought the wrong things lol its cool man.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is what i propose (I try to run the least amount of tubing possible) The blue arrows mean airflow Its going to be tough but yea it can be done with the right fittings.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> We both thought the wrong things lol its cool man.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is what i propose (I try to run the least amount of tubing possible) The blue arrows mean airflow Its going to be tough but yea it can be done with the right fittings.


Haha yea sometimes it can be hard to determine ones emotion through text only. Yea that actually looks really good man. I just need to take some measurements on the dual pump res to make sure that it will fit. Thanks a lot for that! Looks like it will work great.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Hmm is my MVG stopping me from getting 5.0 stable? I can boot at 1.42 - 1.55 but still cant pass prime ~ 10 min in running 1792's


In the other thread you said 4.8 was completely stable at 1.35v right?
That means 5.0 should be 1.47-1.48v. If you need much more than that, then you found your wall. Mine is at 5.1, I can do 5.0 with exactly what I thought it would be, but 5.1 doesn't like me.


----------



## MKHunt

This proposed loop looks familiar.....











Also, as someone with a nearly identical setup to what you're looking at, there is *AMPLE* flow with a single MCP-35X. That pic was taken three days ago and my computer is still shooting bubbles straight through the res into the pump intake.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inacoma79*
> 
> I'm in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Inacoma79
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
> Mhz gained: .7 (up from 4.5)
> OC after delid: 4.7
> Temp drops: 13C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2757176
> 
> Delid
> 
> 
> CLU application


You're In!







Slap the sig on!

BTW thank you guys for being so active in here! 1600 pages man.... and I believe around 250K views as well. Thank you all!

Truly,
Valgaur


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> This proposed loop looks familiar.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, as someone with a nearly identical setup to what you're looking at, there is *AMPLE* flow with a single MCP-35X. That pic was taken three days ago and my computer is still shooting bubbles straight through the res into the pump intake.


What are your temps? Also, what is your pump/resevoir? Is your pump in your resevoir? I feel like I need something like that in my case that would fit in the 5.25" drive area in the top so I can run a 240 rad on the bottom. Also, I'm not too sure how a 200mm rad in the front would would work out so I think I'm just going to stick with one in the top, rear, and bottom. I was really looking for overkill so that is what I'm worried about. This my situation. Here are the rads I'm going to be using.
Alphacool NexXxoS UT60 Full Copper 360mm - $105 (Top, I would have to put the fans above it pulling down into the case because it is a 60mm rad and I can't fit the fans between it and my motherboard. Is that a problem?
http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p975_Alphacool-NexXxoS-UT60-Full-Copper-360mm.html
Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 240mm - $50 (Bottom, pulling into case)
http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p977_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-240mm.html
Alphacool NexXxoS XT45 Full Copper 140mm - $55 (Rear, exhaust)
http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p987_Alphacool-NexXxoS-XT45-Full-Copper-140mm.html

Is this enough for a 3770k at 4.8 @ 1.4v and two crossfire 7950's at 1165/1600 @ 1.25v?

Is your top rad crooked? Everything looks awesome BTW


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> BTW thank you guys for being so active in here! 1600 pages man.... and I believe around 250K views as well. Thank you all!
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur


I know! A strange thing is that on page 1500 was post 15000 and on page 1600 was post 16000. Creeeeeepy









Or maybe that is how it is supposed to be? I would just think that all the pictures and stuff would throw it off.

Also, I think the thank you should go to you Mr. Valgaur. This is by far my favorite thread on the site!!


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> In the other thread you said 4.8 was completely stable at 1.35v right?
> That means 5.0 should be 1.47-1.48v. If you need much more than that, then you found your wall. Mine is at 5.1, I can do 5.0 with exactly what I thought it would be, but 5.1 doesn't like me.


Had to bump it to 1.36v but yea so far its looking good going on 3 hours of 1792's

Yea I guess i did find my wall at 5.0 It sucks because I barely hit 75c's with 5.0 at 1.5v : /


----------



## Goku SysOP

you can add me to the list







Liquid PRO for both on die and IHS, running 4.5 at 1.184v 24/7 oc no power saving feature enabled constant 4.5


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I know! A strange thing is that on page 1500 was post 15000 and on page 1600 was post 16000. Creeeeeepy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or maybe that is how it is supposed to be? I would just think that all the pictures and stuff would throw it off.
> 
> Also, I think the thank you should go to you Mr. Valgaur. This is by far my favorite thread on the site!!


the pages are setup to be only 10 posts per page no matter the lengths they are. I believe you set this up in your account, atleast thats what I remember.

Also thank you back sir








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Goku SysOP*
> 
> you can add me to the list
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Liquid PRO for both on die and IHS, running 4.5 at 1.184v 24/7 oc no power saving feature enabled constant 4.5


You're In as well, Slap that Sig on baby!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the pages are setup to be only 10 posts per page no matter the lengths they are. I believe you set this up in your account, atleast thats what I remember.


ahaha ok that makes sense. I knew it was too good to be true


----------



## Hokies83

Mine is set to 25 posts per page


----------



## Goku SysOP

http://valid.canardpc.com/2758071

Before Delidded 3770K (Default Paste) with Kuhler 620 H2O setup
4.4GHz 100% Load = 72C - 77C

4.6GHz 100% Load = 80C - 84C

4.7GHz 100% Load = 84C - 91C 1.288V

4.8GHz 100% Load = 94C - 98C 1.336V Throttled

Relidded 3770K (AS5 Poly Silver) with H100i H2O Setup
4.0GHz 100% Load = 59C - 61C 1.088 Voltage

4.4GHz 100% Load = 65C - 68C

4.5GHz 100% Load = 70C - 80C 1.231 Voltage

4.7GHz 100% Load = 76C - 83C 1.288 Voltage

4.8GHz 100% Load = 85C - 93C 1.336 Voltage

4.9GHz 100% Load = 94C - 98C 1.386 Voltage throttled

Relidded 3770K (Liquid PRO) With H100i H2O Setup
4.5GHz 100% Load = 58C - 61C 1.184 Voltage (Pkg. 35C - 38C)

4.7GHz 100% Load = 76C 1.288 Voltage (Pkg. 45C - 48C)

12C Temp Drop from AS5 Poly delid


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Mine is set to 25 posts per page


I didn't even know we could do that. I'm going to change it right now!


----------



## TonicX

Maximus V Gene is up a running! temps look good 52-57-57-57 prime95 full load. now for some OC. thanks guys and gals for the passionate instructions. this thread is approaching a "faster than i can read it" pace. CLU on die and IC Diamond on the block. my last 12 hour prime95 stable set-up with this chip was 4900. 9.64 cinebench 24-7. i expect simular performance with this board. I've been all asus, asus, asus and this motherboard package is the full customer treatment. But, to be fair i have been posting it from my old mister reliable GIGABYTE board EP45-UD3LR. Well my computer is all "ONE OF US" again! LATER

RAVAGE the browsers are set-up for 10 post per page- CREPPY!!?! you so funny !


----------



## Hokies83

Top of page in Pref i think


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> RAVAGE the browsers are set-up for 10 post per page- CREPPY!!?! you so funny !


ahahaha I know I'm just silly sometimes. This usually happens around 1am - 2am. So. Per usual. That means sleep should be initiated.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> ahahaha I know I'm just silly sometimes. This usually happens around 1am - 2am. So. Per usual. That means sleep should be initiated.


Me too. good luck with your loop research. nite.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What are your temps? Also, what is your pump/resevoir? Is your pump in your resevoir? I feel like I need something like that in my case that would fit in the 5.25" drive area in the top so I can run a 240 rad on the bottom. Also, I'm not too sure how a 200mm rad in the front would would work out so I think I'm just going to stick with one in the top, rear, and bottom. I was really looking for overkill so that is what I'm worried about. This my situation. Here are the rads I'm going to be using.
> Alphacool NexXxoS UT60 Full Copper 360mm - $105 (Top, I would have to put the fans above it pulling down into the case because it is a 60mm rad and I can't fit the fans between it and my motherboard. Is that a problem?
> http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p975_Alphacool-NexXxoS-UT60-Full-Copper-360mm.html
> Alphacool NexXxoS ST30 Full Copper 240mm - $50 (Bottom, pulling into case)
> http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p977_Alphacool-NexXxoS-ST30-Full-Copper-240mm.html
> Alphacool NexXxoS XT45 Full Copper 140mm - $55 (Rear, exhaust)
> http://www.alphacool.com/product_info.php/info/p987_Alphacool-NexXxoS-XT45-Full-Copper-140mm.html
> 
> Is this enough for a 3770k at 4.8 @ 1.4v and two crossfire 7950's at 1165/1600 @ 1.25v?
> 
> Is your top rad crooked? Everything looks awesome BTW


It should be plenty. My titans at 1.21V and 1215MHz core hit a whopping 41C after 3 hours of Valley. Crysis 3 puts the cards at 38C and the 3770k at 60C with 1.3V through it. I still have air in my loop, too.

I use these components:
Koolance RP-401x2 Reservoir
5x EK PSC 90* Rotary Fittings
8x Swiftech 45* Rotary fittings
1x Koolance 2-3 Slot Bridge
1x MCP-35x
2x EK Titan Block
1x XSPC Raystorm
1x RX120
1x RX240
1x EX360
6x Corsair SP120 HP
1x Bitfenix Hydro Fan Controller
5x XSPC male-female G1/4 thread extenders
12x XSPC Compression fittings
1x Killcoil
2 drops copper sulphate
12 square feet of acoustic damping foam
Primochill Red Pro LRT tubing

The top rad is crooked because I accidentally bought the multiport version, and nobody makes flush fitting plugs for it so it presses against the case ceiling. Plus the case was designed to support a 280mm rad MAX anyway lol.


----------



## She loved E

After failing w/a razor before, I'm finally delidded! Thanks to this thread.

BEFORE

4.8GHz @ 1.285v

Max temps after 45min P95

86 *92* 86 83

AFTER (CLP on die)

4.8GHz @ 1.285v

Max temps after 45min P95

59 *66* 59 58

*DROP*

*26C*

No pics unfortunately as I was too anxious to fire her up. I do have a shot of my failed attempt from a few months ago if needed haha.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> After failing w/a razor before, I'm finally delidded! Thanks to this thread.
> 
> BEFORE
> 4.8GHz @ 1.285v
> Max temps after 45min P95
> 
> 86 *92* 86 83
> 
> AFTER (CLP on die)
> 4.8GHz @ 1.285v
> Max temps after 45min P95
> 
> 59 *66* 59 58
> 
> *DROP*
> *26C*
> 
> No pics unfortunately as I was too anxious to fire her up. I do have a shot of my failed attempt from a few months ago if needed haha.


Congrats !!! ...no matter how the top was popped off, as long as you get there, along with a bit of CL liquid metals


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> After failing w/a razor before, I'm finally delidded! Thanks to this thread.
> 
> BEFORE
> 4.8GHz @ 1.285v
> Max temps after 45min P95
> 
> 86 *92* 86 83
> 
> AFTER (CLP on die)
> 4.8GHz @ 1.285v
> Max temps after 45min P95
> 
> 59 *66* 59 58
> 
> *DROP*
> *26C*
> 
> No pics unfortunately as I was too anxious to fire her up. I do have a shot of my failed attempt from a few months ago if needed haha.


nice! u can get 5ghz i bet looks like a good vcore for 4.8


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Please don't buy Asus products if you value customer service at the slightest level.
As for the sabertooth z77 - yes you are paying extra for that "look". but the look is pretty cool and unique, more so it fits with quite a few setups. The bios of the board is actually very good and the OC abilities are decent.
However, if you don't care about looks, and a little uglier bios (which in all honesty, who cares?) then buy something else.
I've heard great things of the U range of gigabyte, but the best one out the lot without anyone complaining about customer service, rma, quality, performance is the msi mpower - as pointed out by someone here.

You would save yourself hassle, money and get great looks from the msi board.
Also don't trust those websites were you vote up or down like facebook...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Please don't buy Asus products if you value customer service at the slightest level.
> As for the sabertooth z77 - yes you are paying extra for that "look". but the look is pretty cool and unique, more so it fits with quite a few setups. The bios of the board is actually very good and the OC abilities are decent.
> However, if you don't care about looks, and a little uglier bios (which in all honesty, who cares?) then buy something else.
> I've heard great things of the U range of gigabyte, but the best one out the lot without anyone complaining about customer service, rma, quality, performance is the msi mpower - as pointed out by someone here.
> 
> You would save yourself hassle, money and get great looks from the msi board.
> Also don't trust those websites were you vote up or down like facebook...


There are horror stories about Asus CS, but happy stories too. I haven't had to RMA anything Asus.

The maximus are generally the better boards for memory overclocking, for memory clockers makes it hard not to want one...
Sabertooth makes it easier not to want an Asus







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There are horror stories about Asus CS, but happy stories too. I haven't had to RMA anything Asus.
> 
> The maximus are generally the better boards for memory overclocking, for memory clockers makes it hard not to want one...
> Sabertooth makes it easier not to want an Asus
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


+23

off to bed...


----------



## dr/owned

The power of direct die cooling. Temperatures would be lower, but I found out tonight that my rad fans are only running at 1/3 speed because the power distribution pcb is a piece of crap.

I also have a voltage hungry chip. Once I get chilled water going I think I'll be able to get 5.2Ghz or more at 1.8V.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright so I've been spending a little time doing a crappy blueprint of my water loop in paint. I would like your opinions on it because I'm not sure if there would be a better way to do it. I'm using two pumps in this blueprint because of the vertical climb at the beginning of the loop. There is going to be a 200mm fanless radiator on the front, a 360 rad on the top, a 140 rad on the back, and another 140 rad on the fan mount on the HDD cage. How does it look?


Uhh no integrated George Foreman grill or Panini press? What about a kegerator?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *She loved E*
> 
> After failing w/a razor before, I'm finally delidded! Thanks to this thread.
> 
> BEFORE
> 4.8GHz @ 1.285v
> Max temps after 45min P95
> 
> 86 *92* 86 83
> 
> AFTER (CLP on die)
> 4.8GHz @ 1.285v
> Max temps after 45min P95
> 
> 59 *66* 59 58
> 
> *DROP*
> *26C*
> 
> No pics unfortunately as I was too anxious to fire her up. I do have a shot of my failed attempt from a few months ago if needed haha.


Glad you got it delidded successfully this time!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Uhh no integrated George Foreman grill or Panini press? What about a kegerator?
> Glad you got it delidded successfully this time!


You have a rad a res and a pump... when is ur loop gonna be done?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You have a rad a res and a pump... when is ur loop gonna be done?


When I buy an entire loop. Unfortunately I sold those parts a month in a half ago when I was short for bills.









I'm voltage limited on this chip, I'm gonna go full water when I can afford a good chip or upgrade my entire platform.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> When I buy an entire loop. Unfortunately I sold those parts a month in a half ago when I was short for bills.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm voltage limited on this chip, I'm gonna go full water when I can afford a good chip or upgrade my entire platform.


Does that include the kegerator and/or george foreman?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I've been thinnking about my loop and I think I'm going to use my old HAF 912 to attach to the Phantom to hold my PSU, SSD's, Opt Drive, Pump, and Fan Controller. That way I will have ample room for my rads. I was thinking about putting the res in there too, but I want to have it in the Phantom because I like how it looks. I will just run tubing from the res through a rubber grommet to the pump in the HAF and then back through a rubber grommet into the 820 and straight to a rad. So should I go through two rads and then to the CPU block and then through another two rads and then to the GPU's? Would that be the best way to efficiently cool? Or should I just run the water through all of the rads and then to the CPU and GPU's? Anyways here is a picture of the HAF next to the Phantom


----------



## MKHunt

If an 820 doesn't have enough room, you should reconsider your plans. Remember, my loop is in an ATX _mid tower_.

As for order, it only makes a difference at idle. At load, the loop will achieve a consistent water temperature. Also remember that adding more pumps than you need creates excess heat dump into your coolant which will necessitate more rad/raise temps. A single 655 or 35X can easily cope with even 3 koolance/ek blocks (both are high flow) as well as a cpu block and 3 rads.

If you're going to absolutely bring another case into it, just use that case to mount a 3x3 rad. You definitely don't need more than a full tower for your proposed loop. People were cooling quad-sli gtx 590s with loops that fit in full towers....

You can also fit a 240mm rad on the back of the drive cages.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> If an 820 doesn't have enough room, you should reconsider your plans. Remember, my loop is in an ATX _mid tower_.
> 
> As for order, it only makes a difference at idle. At load, the loop will achieve a consistent water temperature. Also remember that adding more pumps than you need creates excess heat dump into your coolant which will necessitate more rad/raise temps. A single 655 or 35X can easily cope with even 3 koolance/ek blocks (both are high flow) as well as a cpu block and 3 rads.
> 
> If you're going to absolutely bring another case into it, just use that case to mount a 3x3 rad. You definitely don't need more than a full tower for your proposed loop. People were cooling quad-sli gtx 590s with loops that fit in full towers....
> 
> You can also fit a 240mm rad on the back of the drive cages.


I can definetly fit all that into my Phantom 820, but I really like the look of a case with a water loop that has no optical drive, SSD's, and PSU. Thats why I was thinking of doing something like that. Also I am going to use one good pump for the loop. I don't ever move my case so that is why I was thinking about doing something like that. It's not definite yet though.
Also, I just remembered about how I seen somewhere that you should get a drain adapter or whatever it is called. Where would I put one of those to make it easy to drain my loop?


----------



## MKHunt

At the lowest point. You can be clever about it though. Instead of having my front rad with the ports at the top, since the second card was so low I put the rad ports at the bottom. With nothing else on the bottom, to drain I simply pop off the tube there and it flows right through the mesh floor. That way no ugly t-line.

SSDs can safely be double sided taped to the back of the motherboard tray.
Optical drives are a waste of space these days. Seriously, I haven't missed mine and if I do, its in an external enclosure.
PSUs can be easily and tastefully covered with a false floor. Most who make the water builds you're describing use a psu cover or false floor. It covers the grommets as well which break uniformity.

Even if you dont move your case, the extra work that goes into a more elegant solution is in the end a thousand times more satisfying.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> PSUs can be easily and tastefully covered with a false floor. Most who make the water builds you're describing use a psu cover or false floor.


Yeah I know I can move my SSD's (I have 3 of them in my rig) and get rid of the the Opt. Drive. It's just the PSU that I'm not sure about. I'm just not sure what to do or how I would go about creating a false floor to match my white Phantom and still look nice. Any idea how I would do that? All I would really need to know is what materials I should use.

This is what I would like to go for:


----------



## Hokies83

LoL ever wonder What the cables of 3 gpus 36 fans 2 fan controllers 3 cath converters 2 Pumps 6 ssds 2 led controllers 3 Cath lights cpu / mb power look like...

When there is just a huge massive amount of wire to deal with and there is really just no where for them to go?

Those other guys will never show u there mess! but the hokie will...





LoL but none can be seen from the front @[email protected]


----------



## MKHunt

For a false floor basically use sheet steel, a cheap bender, and spray paint. Might take a few cans to find a good color match, but it can be done. If you want to get real fancy and do an entire full-length false floor, you can find various steel meshes for the top and solid sheet steel for the side. It's just a matter of cutting, bending, and painting. Personally, I couldn't be bothered since I'm not staring into my case every day









Hokies, I notice that behind our rear panels bear a striking resemblance....


----------



## Jayjr1105

So what's the average voltage needed for 4.7 on a 3770K. I was excited to see that my chip could almost do 4.4 on stock voltage (1.7~1.8) but it appears to have gone downhill after that. I see that some people still follow the 1.52v max rule from Sandy Bridge but I wonder what number you should *try* and keep it under


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So what's the average voltage needed for 4.7 on a 3770K. I was excited to see that my chip could almost do 4.4 on stock voltage (1.7~1.8) but it appears to have gone downhill after that. I see that some people still follow the 1.52v max rule from Sandy Bridge but I wonder what number you should *try* and keep it under


around 1.35 to 1.4 Volts


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> around 1.35 to 1.4 Volts


Which question was 1.35 - 1.4 an answer to?


----------



## nemm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yeah I know I can move my SSD's (I have 3 of them in my rig) and get rid of the the Opt. Drive. It's just the PSU that I'm not sure about. I'm just not sure what to do or how I would go about creating a false floor to match my white Phantom and still look nice. Any idea how I would do that? All I would really need to know is what materials I should use.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> This is what I would like to go for:


Just a suggestion, I would personally use the top radiator setup as an exhaust rather than an intake.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> Which question was 1.35 - 1.4 an answer to?


for 4.7


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> for 4.7


Do you have some plans for this build on paper? I wanna see stuff. I think some of the guys and me are almost as excited as you about it!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Do you have some plans for this build on paper? I wanna see stuff. I think some of the guys and me are almost as excited as you about it!


I should start drawing it up... I'll do it later today lol


----------



## stickg1

On a side note, last week I cleaned off my CLP and put on some Antec Formula 7. No pump out yet, and temps are way better than at stock. A few degrees warmer than the CLP.

Kind of strange that the temps are within a handful of degrees, I believe I put on too much CLP and the absolute perfect amount of Formula7.

Ambient temps are currently within .5C of the Day1 Prime95 4.5GHz test on the Formula7, and the temps are actually 2C lower. I didn't know this stuff had a curing period but apparently it's in the sweet spot right now. It's been 6 days, only time will tell!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So what's the average voltage needed for 4.7 on a 3770K. I was excited to see that my chip could almost do 4.4 on stock voltage (1.7~1.8) but it appears to have gone downhill after that. I see that some people still follow the 1.52v max rule from Sandy Bridge but I wonder what number you should *try* and keep it under


Average is hard to say, but 4.7 under 1.3 is decent, over 1.4 is not. No one knows what is safe, there is no evidence of measurable Ivy degradation by just normal everyday use at a high voltage like 1.5.

We know degradation always happens and the electromigration is hastened by voltage and heat. The higher your voltage the better your temps need to be. Ivy chips are less stable at higher temps also, so I like to keep my max Prime95 testing temps at 80c or below.

You should be safe in the low 1.4 range if temps are good. In the 1.50s you are taking a risk but no one knows how much risk. If you want the chip to not have noticeable degradation for 5 years that is a different situation than upgrading in two years.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nemm*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> Just a suggestion, I would personally use the top radiator setup as an exhaust rather than an intake.


Haha that just made me realize I made that diagram totally wrong. I meant to have the rear fan as an intake and the top rad as an exhaust lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Ouch

http://www.overclock.net/t/1378998/i-killed-my-3770k#post_19685462


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Ouch
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1378998/i-killed-my-3770k#post_19685462


Yea I hate those posts. I made one myself a while ago when I killed my first chip. I hate when people just post there to be rude. If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I hate those posts. I made one myself a while ago when I killed my first chip. I hate when people just post there to be rude. If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.


...yeah, that usually adds insult to injury, so to speak...I'm wondering if Valgaur & Co can give him a PM, i.e. about nail-polish / MX4 'cover' etc he probably does not even know that there are methods to try to recover...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

You know, I find it funny that all my life I've hated winter, but now that it is gone I am really excited to get all the parts for my water loop and get it all together and put my rig right next to my open window in the middle of winter with my hat and gloves on benching. lol


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yeah, that usually adds insult to injury, so to speak...I'm wondering if Valgaur & Co can give him a PM, i.e. about nail-polish / MX4 'cover' etc he probably does not even know that there are methods to try to recover...


I bellive he did know about the nail polish as he mentioned it at the beginning of the thread. I also told him to try one stick of RAM in different slots just in case he blew his IMC like I did with my first delid attempt.


----------



## stickg1

Dude he gouged into the PCB in a few spots. That's not IMC, the chip smoked when he powered up. She's gone...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Dude he gouged into the PCB in a few spots. That's not IMC, the chip smoked when he powered up. She's gone...


Oh I was on my phone so I couldn't see the pictures so thats why I suggested that. I may be stupid, but I'm not that stupid lol


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Dude he gouged into the PCB in a few spots. That's not IMC, the chip smoked when he powered up. She's gone...


up in smoke








i feel bad though i no what it feels like to have a chip die frrom trying to delid


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> The power of direct die cooling. Temperatures would be lower, but I found out tonight that my rad fans are only running at 1/3 speed because the power distribution pcb is a piece of crap.
> 
> I also have a voltage hungry chip. Once I get chilled water going I think I'll be able to get 5.2Ghz or more at 1.8V.


How strong is that water chiller? For 1.8V you will probably want to be on the verge of freezing alcohol. & no 3770k is so bad that it only does 5.2Ghz at 1.8V cold.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yeah, that usually adds insult to injury, so to speak...I'm wondering if Valgaur & Co can give him a PM, i.e. about nail-polish / MX4 'cover' etc he probably does not even know that there are methods to try to recover...


I just posted in there, for bare copper on the PCB nail polish or anything else would have had to be on the PCB before trying to fire it up.
A short circuit has to be prevented, once power has gone through it, it's too late to fix it.


----------



## lilchronic

im need to try to bring my old chip back to life







what do you guys think does it look dead. lolz


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I was just thinking about it and I could cut the front part of my HAF 912 off and then mount my PSU, res, and pump in it and feed the tubes through the back of the HAF and through the rubber grommets on my Phantom. Man I really wish I knew how to use blender I would love to make 3d models of this.
So I would be able to install a 360 rad on the top and front, 240 rad on the bottom, and a 140rad on the rear. Then I can just install some low 600RPM fans all around and enjoy a silent rig. Sound like a good idea? Basically I would just turn my HAF into a box with my pump, res, and psu and I can have a display that will show the water temp and CPU temp on it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im need to try to bring my old chip back to life
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what do you guys think does it look dead. lolz


...see FtW's post above...nail polish and/or MX4 slathered on the scratched spots to insulate it is the first step to try


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...see FtW's post above...nail polish and/or MX4 slathered on the scratched spots to insulate it is the first step to try


Did you already try only using one stick of RAM and testing on each RAM slot?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys why does this radiator have all of these inputs? I thought a radiator just had an input for the hose to bring water in and an input for another hose to take the water out? This thing looks really complicated


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Ouch
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1378998/i-killed-my-3770k#post_19685462


"I followed the guide", next he says "I used a cutting knife instead of a razor blade". Lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey guys why does this radiator have all of these inputs? I thought a radiator just had an input for the hose to bring water in and an input for another hose to take the water out? This thing looks really complicated
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


The extra ports are for use for access. Depending on where and how you mount it, some ports may become unusable. Just make sure you close the inlets/outlets you don't use.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey guys why does this radiator have all of these inputs? I thought a radiator just had an input for the hose to bring water in and an input for another hose to take the water out? This thing looks really complicated


No it is to actually to make things easier for you not more complicated. You choose which inlet and outlet you want, and plug the rest. A res can be vertical or horizontal or on its side, so with more choices it makes it easier to fit in your rig.


----------



## dr/owned

Also can make a drain port too.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

That is awesome!!! Didn't even realize that. Is the one at the end supposed to be for a drain?? Tme to re-draw my design.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Did you already try only using one stick of RAM and testing on each RAM slot?


no but i tryed a bunch of times remounting it,. i saw the deep scratches i put in it so i thought it was dead and i just bought a new 1







i mean it's probably dead but ima try again once i get a new board


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> That is awesome!!! Didn't even realize that. Is the one at the end supposed to be for a drain?? Tme to re-draw my design.


You can put drain ports wherever you want. Ideally you want them at the lowest portion of the loop, and remember that air has to be above water for it to drain. On my loop I have several drain and air ports (I just use T fittings with a homemade plug), because I have 3 valves so I can change my cpu or gpu or move my case (external rad/pump/res) without having to drain the entire loop.

Fun fact: the reason you'll see a bunch of vents on a house roof is because they're the "air ports" for your sink/tub/washer drains. Without them or if they're not properly size you get crappy drainage.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> no but i tryed a bunch of times remounting it,. i saw the deep scratches i put in it so i thought it was dead and i just bought a new 1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i mean it's probably dead but ima try again once i get a new board


Mine looked the same and it turned out that I couldn't run dual channel memory. I had to use A2 and B2. Just test with one slot at a time. What error code did you get?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You can put drain ports wherever you want. Ideally you want them at the lowest portion of the loop, and remember that air has to be above water for it to drain. On my loop I have several drain and air ports (I just use T fittings with a homemade plug), because I have 3 valves so I can change my cpu or gpu or move my case (external rad/pump/res) without having to drain the entire loop.
> 
> Fun fact: the reason you'll see a bunch of vents on a house roof is because they're the "air ports" for your sink/tub/washer drains. Without them or if they're not properly size you get crappy drainage.


Oh that really interesting. I still have so much to learn! So I think I'm going to have my Pump/Res/Opt Drive/PSU in my HAF 912 and then just fill the Phantom up to the brim with rads. Still have much planning to do though. Hope to have it done by next winter.
At least I get my PSU back on monday so I can use my rig again after the longest three weeks of my life haha. I can't wait to get back to overclocking on the new MOBO!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> "I followed the guide", next he says "I used a cutting knife instead of a razor blade". Lol


...I saw that - may be he picks up on FtW's hints re (potential only) recovery. ...just waiting for someone to try it with an Oyster shucking knife and posting about it (no...don't, just kidding!).

I must admit though, as I am getting ready to set up a Sandy-E, I'm kind of glad deep down that those don't need to be delidded...I've done Ivys and they survived, with results that made it well worth it...but there always is a chance of disaster...one of the posters here had a cat jump on him during the process...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...one of the posters here had a cat jump on him during the process...


ahahahahaha


----------



## dr/owned

^^ I had to kick my cat out of the room. Didn't want to hurt his ears with the banging noise (from the hammer-vise method)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Mine looked the same and it turned out that I couldn't run dual channel memory. I had to use A2 and B2. Just test with one slot at a time. What error code did you get?


the code i cant really rember but i think it was a 00 im not sure though


----------



## dbranger94

Add me, please!

OCN name: dbranger94
CPU: i5-3570k (lapped and polished)
Method: Vice
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Shin-Etsu X23-7783D
Mhz gained: None, Yet! (Did it to lower temps in HTPC)
OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
Temp drops: 26C and falling...
Cooling: Xigmatek HDT-SD964 lapped and polished, w/two Scythe 92mm PWM fans (push/pull)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2758102




BTW, the vice method is awesome! Took less than a minute...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> "I followed the guide", next he says "I used a cutting knife instead of a razor blade". Lol




Delidding knife? That's not a delidding knife...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the code i cant really rember but i think it was a 00 im not sure though


00 I see quite a bit of when fighting with memory clocks, have to reset the failed OC & try something else.
With Asus at least, I don't know the assrocker boards.


----------



## Arm3nian

For any future delid I will use my 5.6ft. sword from the Lord of the Rings. I bought it sharpened.


----------



## Jayjr1105

So even with temps looking good after a successful delid, should you still see a 10c difference between cores? I thought this process closed the gap on that.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> So even with temps looking good after a successful delid, should you still see a 10c difference between cores? I thought this process closed the gap on that.


I still have a 10° + difference between the hottest & coldest core. First time I put together the delidded chip & ran it temps were very uneven, reseating made it better but I still have core 0 always coolest, 1 & 4 warmer & similar temps, core 3 just runs hotter.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bunch of posts...dang.

I'm gonna grab a z77x-ud4h Hokies. It's supposed to clock ram quite well lol








Next month maybe.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bunch of posts...dang.
> 
> I'm gonna grab a z77x-ud4h Hokies. It's supposed to clock ram quite well lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Next month maybe.


I've heard the same, Gigabyte ud4h or up boards for memory.


----------



## stickg1

But which board tastes best with eggs and bacon?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> But which board tastes best with eggs and bacon?


...once you get past that crunchy PCB bit and hit the solder, they all taste pretty much the same...a bit like blood in your mouth

...there are of course those who say that Gigabyte tastes better, while others prefer the raw-meat taste of ROG


----------



## Jayjr1105

So I just updated my BIOS (I was 3 versions OLD) and wiped the slate clean because after de-lidding I wasn't happy with my 4.5+ overclock voltage. I am wondering how 4.4 only needs 1.2v to be 24hr Prime95 stable yet for 4.5 and 1.3v I keep having one core flutter out 20 minutes into Prime. I don't get how only 100MHz change in OC can translate into needing .1v+ more?

Edit: I also just ran 10 passes of IBT on Very High settings without a hitch.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> But which board tastes best with eggs and bacon?


Intel looks good. I actually did a search for the tastiest motherboard & there it was. More of a dessert board though.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Intel looks good. I actually did a search for the tastiest motherboard & there it was. More of a dessert board though.


...I'm getting hungry looking at that


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've heard the same, Gigabyte ud4h or up boards for memory.


Yup...I got in the Argentina ln2 event thingie man








So happy!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...once you get past that crunchy PCB bit and hit the solder, they all taste pretty much the same...a bit like blood in your mouth
> 
> ...there are of course those who say that Gigabyte tastes better, while others prefer the raw-meat taste of ROG


lol you sicko xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'm getting hungry looking at that


I ate too much already...avocados <3 lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yup...I got in the Argentina ln2 event thingie man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So happy!


Congrats Ivan !







Quote:


> lol you sicko xD


...indeed - running a Gigabyte GPU and an Asus GPU TOGETHER in SLI - that's just sick


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Err the Sabertooth is the most over priced board in the Z77 Line up =/ ... They charge an Extra 100$ for the Plastic LoL.
> 
> The money they want for that thing and it does not even have a DEBug LED XD


Yeah, but the plastic makes it a better motherboard. I'll shell 100 dollars more for something that's better designed and looks totally badass. That plastic w/ fans on it makes sure that air is coursing over all the motherboard's surface. Therefore things will be cooled down and more reliable. If a board is open, air is hitting it but there's no channel of air so the air around it is gonna be a lot worse at removing heat. By making sure the air can only flow over the components on the board, and is being propelled by a fan through that channel. I think any board without such a cover is missing out on a huge advantage.

I've had motherboards with debug led's I think they're gaudy and ugly and they've never benefitted me. The Sabertooth Z77 has lights on each component port so if you do have a problem, you just see where the red light is, is it near the gpu? the cpu? the ram? I don't have to look up codes. Besides usually if something is wrong up, it takes like 5 minutes to pinpoint the problem or less. Sorry. I just think it's an amazing board.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I may have both an ud4h and an mvg...so yeah. Let's hope they don't bite each other's sockets off or something.









One will go to a perma test bench thing with a pot, and the other in my cm 690 II which I'll mod, for my daily driver gaming and air benching machine.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Yeah, but the plastic makes it a better motherboard. I'll shell 100 dollars more for something that's better designed and looks totally badass. That plastic w/ fans on it makes sure that air is coursing over all the motherboard's surface. Therefore things will be cooled down and more reliable. If a board is open, air is hitting it but there's no channel of air so the air around it is gonna be a lot worse at removing heat. By making sure the air can only flow over the components on the board, and is being propelled by a fan through that channel. I think any board without such a cover is missing out on a huge advantage.
> 
> I've had motherboards with debug led's I think they're gaudy and ugly and they've never benefitted me. The Sabertooth Z77 has lights on each component port so if you do have a problem, you just see where the red light is, is it near the gpu? the cpu? the ram? I don't have to look up codes. Besides usually if something is ****ed up, it takes like 5 minutes to pinpoint the problem or less. Sorry. I just think it's an amazing board.


Perfectly fine if you like the board man, but the q-led is an awesome thing for a bencher for example.
The Sabertooth doesn't work for me, too expensive and the MVG beats it in everything, so I didn't buy it.








No need to justify your puchase though, if you're enjoying it, what the heck? right?









EDIT: I'm gonna build an 8350 rig to piss some fanbois here lol







jk jk (maybe I'll freeze my friend's 8120 if I find him a proper 990fx board)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yup...I got in the Argentina ln2 event thingie man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So happy!
> lol you sicko xD
> I ate too much already...avocados <3 lol


Nice, that should be a blast!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Yeah, but the plastic makes it a better motherboard. I'll shell 100 dollars more for something that's better designed and looks totally badass. That plastic w/ fans on it makes sure that air is coursing over all the motherboard's surface. Therefore things will be cooled down and more reliable. If a board is open, air is hitting it but there's no channel of air so the air around it is gonna be a lot worse at removing heat. By making sure the air can only flow over the components on the board, and is being propelled by a fan through that channel. I think any board without such a cover is missing out on a huge advantage.
> 
> I've had motherboards with debug led's I think they're gaudy and ugly and they've never benefitted me. The Sabertooth Z77 has lights on each component port so if you do have a problem, you just see where the red light is, is it near the gpu? the cpu? the ram? I don't have to look up codes. Besides usually if something is ****ed up, it takes like 5 minutes to pinpoint the problem or less. Sorry. I just think it's an amazing board.


I see it just the opposite, it wouldn't be as bad if all the plastic was gone. I can't see the thermal armor helping anything, would likely make board temps worse, & I just can't like it for looks.
Nothing against your board, a personal thing for me, I'm just not feeling the thermal armor.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Perfectly fine if you like the board man, but the q-led is an awesome thing for a bencher for example.
> The Sabertooth doesn't work for me, too expensive and the MVG beats it in everything, so I didn't buy it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No need to justify your puchase though, if you're enjoying it, what the heck? right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: I'm gonna build an 8350 rig to piss some fanbois here lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jk jk (maybe I'll freeze my friend's 8120 if I find him a proper 990fx board)


I have to get another 990fx board, had what is supposed to be a good 8150 here for like a year that I haven't really tried yet.
Gonna have to play some 3d11 physics, pretty sure I can beat a 3570, not sure if 3770k is beatable....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may have both an ud4h and an mvg...so yeah. Let's hope they don't bite each other's sockets off or something.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One will go to a perma test bench thing with a pot, and the other in my cm 690 II which I'll mod, for my daily driver gaming and air benching machine.


...I think there's also a mod on OCN for 690ies to make Quadro xxxx out of them (just in case your heart desires that...)...involves some cutting here, some soldering there...right up your alley


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dbranger94*
> 
> Add me, please!
> 
> OCN name: dbranger94
> CPU: i5-3570k (lapped and polished)
> Method: Vice
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Shin-Etsu X23-7783D
> Mhz gained: None, Yet! (Did it to lower temps in HTPC)
> OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp drops: 26C and falling...
> Cooling: Xigmatek HDT-SD964 lapped and polished, w/two Scythe 92mm PWM fans (push/pull)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2758102
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, the vice method is awesome! Took less than a minute...


that is the cleanest intel application. it looks like a heatsink has never pressed down on it. if you match the pieces together, the whole die and ihs are covered in tim.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice, that should be a blast!
> I see it just the opposite, it wouldn't be as bad if all the plastic was gone. I can't see the thermal armor helping anything, would likely make board temps worse, & I just can't like it for looks.
> Nothing against your board, a personal thing for me, I'm just not feeling the thermal armor.
> I have to get another 990fx board, had what is supposed to be a good 8150 here for like a year that I haven't really tried yet.
> Gonna have to play some 3d11 physics, pretty sure I can beat a 3570, not sure if 3770k is beatable....


bring it! lol nah im just kidding im pretty sure can lol


----------



## Hokies83

My camera does not do it Justice... SHES FINISHED!! And yes there is a clear side window on there


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice, that should be a blast!
> I see it just the opposite, it wouldn't be as bad if all the plastic was gone. I can't see the thermal armor helping anything, would likely make board temps worse, & I just can't like it for looks.
> Nothing against your board, a personal thing for me, I'm just not feeling the thermal armor.
> I have to get another 990fx board, had what is supposed to be a good 8150 here for like a year that I haven't really tried yet.
> Gonna have to play some 3d11 physics, pretty sure I can beat a 3570, not sure if 3770k is beatable....


Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly. TheSabertooth Z77 armor has two miniature, i think 40 mm fans on it at key points, so it pushes air under the armour, therefore you have a channel of air, instead of just having an open volume of air where some may or most likely won't stick near your board taking heat along with it. A channelized amount of air allows it to propel wind directly over the board. It also comes with 12 temperature sensors. I can pretty much guarentee it does better. When people here the word "armour" they think it's too protect from blunt force. The armour in this case is only there to make the air flow directly over the board.

Not to mention 4 fan controller ports, plus 2 ports for the two fans that connect to the thermal armour I mentioned. Plus the CPU fan port. Including the power supply's fan, even though it doesn't enter the case's atmosphere. I'm at 17 fans strong.

Gonna get 3 delta fans and put 2 of them on my radiator on the bottom in the inside of the case. Not on top since they can cut fingers. Need to buy one though and experiment with it before I realize if I want something so loud, but people say they aren't annoying on low power.

Also, as for looks, tell me this doesn't look awesome.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My camera does not do it Justice... SHES FINISHED!! And yes there is a clear side window on there


Awesome!!!1!

Our cases are like Luke Skywalker vs. Darth Vader. Except mine is nowhere near on the order of magnitude of awesome that is.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dbranger94*
> 
> Add me, please!
> 
> OCN name: dbranger94
> CPU: i5-3570k (lapped and polished)
> Method: Vice
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Shin-Etsu X23-7783D
> Mhz gained: None, Yet! (Did it to lower temps in HTPC)
> OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp drops: 26C and falling...
> Cooling: Xigmatek HDT-SD964 lapped and polished, w/two Scythe 92mm PWM fans (push/pull)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2758102
> 
> -snip
> BTW, the vice method is awesome! Took less than a minute...


Should post that in the how to so I can add you to the spreadsheet! so far 100% success rate! with 0 deaths!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My camera does not do it Justice... SHES FINISHED!! And yes there is a clear side window on there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: snip


Looks sweet! My second 7950 just came in and it has Hynix's!!! yay!! can't wait to try it out.


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly. TheSabertooth Z77 armor has two miniature, i think 40 mm fans on it at key points, so it pushes air under the armour, therefore you have a channel of air, instead of just having an open volume of air where some may or most likely won't stick near your board taking heat along with it. A channelized amount of air allows it to propel wind directly over the board. It also comes with 12 temperature sensors. I can pretty much guarentee it does better. When people here the word "armour" they think it's too protect from blunt force. The armour in this case is only there to make the air flow directly over the board.
> 
> Not to mention 4 fan controller ports, plus 2 ports for the two fans that connect to the thermal armour I mentioned. Plus the CPU fan port. Including the power supply's fan, even though it doesn't enter the case's atmosphere. I'm at 17 fans strong.
> 
> Gonna get 3 delta fans and put 2 of them on my radiator on the bottom in the inside of the case. Not on top since they can cut fingers. Need to buy one though and experiment with it before I realize if I want something so loud, but people say they aren't annoying on low power.
> 
> Also, as for looks, tell me this doesn't look awesome.


The amount of air that the 40mm fan would actually would push is worthless. A normal board in a case with fans would have far more airflow over it than what that 40mm fan could do.

Cant say I blame you for taking that pic down.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dbranger94*
> 
> Add me, please!
> 
> OCN name: dbranger94
> CPU: i5-3570k (lapped and polished)
> Method: Vice
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Shin-Etsu X23-7783D
> Mhz gained: None, Yet! (Did it to lower temps in HTPC)
> OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp drops: 26C and falling...
> Cooling: Xigmatek HDT-SD964 lapped and polished, w/two Scythe 92mm PWM fans (push/pull)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2758102
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, the vice method is awesome! Took less than a minute...


You're In!







Sorry that took so long!







but you can now wear your Sig in proud honor~!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My camera does not do it Justice... SHES FINISHED!! And yes there is a clear side window on there


Nice!

I need to do some 3d modelling of my ideas.... anyone got any idea on what program to use?


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> The amount of air that the 40mm fan would actually would push is worthless. A normal board in a case with fans would have far more airflow over it than what that 40mm fan could do.


I disagree. In an open environment, yes, it wouldn't push much, but if you're pushing into a small volume of air between the PCB and motherboard components and the armor above which is a gap less than probably half an inch. Plus those small fans get up to going past 6000 rpms. The value of your fans size is directly relevant to the volume of space you're pushing the air into.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly. TheSabertooth Z77 armor has two miniature, i think 40 mm fans on it at key points, so it pushes air under the armour, therefore you have a channel of air, instead of just having an open volume of air where some may or most likely won't stick near your board taking heat along with it. A channelized amount of air allows it to propel wind directly over the board. It also comes with 12 temperature sensors. I can pretty much guarentee it does better. When people here the word "armour" they think it's too protect from blunt force. The armour in this case is only there to make the air flow directly over the board.
> 
> Not to mention 4 fan controller ports, plus 2 ports for the two fans that connect to the thermal armour I mentioned. Plus the CPU fan port. Including the power supply's fan, even though it doesn't enter the case's atmosphere. I'm at 17 fans strong.
> 
> Gonna get 3 delta fans and put 2 of them on my radiator on the bottom in the inside of the case. Not on top since they can cut fingers. Need to buy one though and experiment with it before I realize if I want something so loud, but people say they aren't annoying on low power.
> 
> Also, as for looks, tell me this doesn't look awesome.


Looking around on the web can't find any actual numbers, although most sabertooth owners who have other boards as well say it makes no difference, not hotter or cooler than a board without the thermal armor.
Although 1 post did mention that when you drop a screw & it goes under the armor, then it becomes a nuisance.

So if you like the look it's all good, but it doesn't really do anything for board temps (unproven, but I am 100% sure an armorless board with good airflow around it will be as good if not better).


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking around on the web can't find any actual numbers, although most sabertooth owners who have other boards as well say it makes no difference, not hotter or cooler than a board without the thermal armor.
> Although 1 post did mention that when you drop a screw & it goes under the armor, then it becomes a nuisance.
> 
> So if you like the look it's all good, but it doesn't really do anything for board temps (unproven, but I am 100% sure an armorless board with good airflow around it will be as good if not better).


The way I see it, it's not gonna help your cpu and that's the only thing besides your gpu where heat is gonna be most likely an issue, so true, it's not gonna help you push anything out of your overclock. However, I do think it helps the life of the board because I do think it keeps the more miscellanious parts of the motherboard cool. It's simple physics that a small amount of air being forced into a confined space is gonna have a lot more wind power than if i just take same fan and sit it in the middle of a room. So for extending the life of the boad I think it's great. And it's possible it could help attain a small advantage in overclclocking, but I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't. Yeah, I guess we'll never know, I would like to know the numbers too. I know the board comes with a five year warranty. Doesn't mean dick when you bend the cpu pins though I found out.









Plus I like having so many fan controller ports. 2 for the cpu,which is standard, 2 for the armour's fans and then 4 general fan controller ports? How many other board's have that many?

Also, I had a question I was wondering if you guys could help me with. My case fan that sits above my pcie ports and on the back of the tower case, it pulls air out, so does my radiator, should i turn it around to pull air in and this up and into the radiator? Even though i have 3 80 mm fans i electrical taped together to pull air in the front top of the case, which evnetually goes to the radiator. Should this back fan be a exhaust or intake? The radiator is right next to it, but the general design is pull air in from front and then out top and back. It's a ****ty fan now, its kinda slow, but eventually I want to replace it, so maybe when it's more powerful it'd be better to have it suck air in that the radiator can use?


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> I disagree. In an open environment, yes, it wouldn't push much, but if you're pushing into a small volume of air between the PCB and motherboard components and the armor above which is a gap less than probably half an inch. Plus those small fans get up to going past 6000 rpms. The value of your fans size is directly relevant to the volume of space you're pushing the air into.


That 6000rpm fan pushes almost no air, most push around 6-7cfm in that range. Even a 15000rpm delta only pushes around 26-27cfm. At best those are open air specs and when you add restrictions it will be less. I dont see the armor as nothing more than for looks. If you like it then no biggie, I just don't see any valued reason to have it.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry that took so long!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but you can now wear your Sig in proud honor~!
> Nice!
> 
> I need to do some 3d modelling of my ideas.... anyone got any idea on what program to use?


Definately Cinema 4d, free trial from distributor. MAXON.NET

It is the most user friendly Professional 3D software out there!

I've have been using it since 2007 and studied it in college, Animation, Advanced Animation, Advanced Compositing.


Plus i would be available to help you get started. val- i dont make this offer often but i imagine we could design some amazing rigs.

other artwork by TonicX at http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball#post_19556819


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice, that should be a blast!
> I see it just the opposite, it wouldn't be as bad if all the plastic was gone. I can't see the thermal armor helping anything, would likely make board temps worse, & I just can't like it for looks.
> Nothing against your board, a personal thing for me, I'm just not feeling the thermal armor.
> I have to get another 990fx board, had what is supposed to be a good 8150 here for like a year that I haven't really tried yet.
> Gonna have to play some 3d11 physics, pretty sure I can beat a 3570, not sure if 3770k is beatable....










990fx is fan, for ram megahurz and cpu-z.

Hey, do you know if I can submit any result from that Intel event thing? Or do I need to take my own board for that, cause mine's screwed. (I do have ram and a 3770k, does that count?)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think there's also a mod on OCN for 690ies to make Quadro xxxx out of them (just in case your heart desires that...)...involves some cutting here, some soldering there...right up your alley


You're mistaking my case with a gpu...I'm broke, how could I afford a gtx 690?








...and you mean, mod it into a Tesla k10? Curious....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My camera does not do it Justice... SHES FINISHED!! And yes there is a clear side window on there


Looking good, those res thingies look like candy bars








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly. TheSabertooth Z77 armor has two miniature, i think 40 mm fans on it at key points, so it pushes air under the armour, therefore you have a channel of air, instead of just having an open volume of air where some may or most likely won't stick near your board taking heat along with it. A channelized amount of air allows it to propel wind directly over the board. It also comes with 12 temperature sensors. I can pretty much guarentee it does better. When people here the word "armour" they think it's too protect from blunt force. The armour in this case is only there to make the air flow directly over the board.
> 
> Not to mention 4 fan controller ports, plus 2 ports for the two fans that connect to the thermal armour I mentioned. Plus the CPU fan port. Including the power supply's fan, even though it doesn't enter the case's atmosphere. I'm at 17 fans strong.
> 
> Gonna get 3 delta fans and put 2 of them on my radiator on the bottom in the inside of the case. Not on top since they can cut fingers. Need to buy one though and experiment with it before I realize if I want something so loud, but people say they aren't annoying on low power.
> 
> Also, as for looks, tell me this doesn't look awesome.


You need to lose the pata/ide hard drive (if it's a hard drive), that ribbon cable wrecks airflow inside your case. You also need to do some cable management to improve airflow and lose the 80mm fans and grab better 120 or 140mm units. They'll move more air whilst being silent.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry that took so long!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but you can now wear your Sig in proud honor~!
> Nice!
> 
> I need to do some 3d modelling of my ideas.... anyone got any idea on what program to use?


Sketchup, learn to use it, it's amazing


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You're mistaking my case with a gpu...I'm broke, how could I afford a gtx 690?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and you mean, mod it into a Tesla k10? Curious....


...my bad, I mixed up posts...(while juggling 5x 670 w/identity crisis)...then again, I am all for modding a sow's ear into a silk purse


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly. TheSabertooth Z77 armor has two miniature, i think 40 mm fans on it at key points, so it pushes air under the armour, therefore you have a channel of air, instead of just having an open volume of air where some may or most likely won't stick near your board taking heat along with it. A channelized amount of air allows it to propel wind directly over the board. It also comes with 12 temperature sensors. I can pretty much guarentee it does better. When people here the word "armour" they think it's too protect from blunt force. The armour in this case is only there to make the air flow directly over the board.
> 
> Not to mention 4 fan controller ports, plus 2 ports for the two fans that connect to the thermal armour I mentioned. Plus the CPU fan port. Including the power supply's fan, even though it doesn't enter the case's atmosphere. I'm at 17 fans strong.
> 
> Gonna get 3 delta fans and put 2 of them on my radiator on the bottom in the inside of the case. Not on top since they can cut fingers. Need to buy one though and experiment with it before I realize if I want something so loud, but people say they aren't annoying on low power.
> 
> Also, as for looks, tell me this doesn't look awesome.


wow thats awsome! just awsome


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My camera does not do it Justice... SHES FINISHED!! And yes there is a clear side window on there


...looks fantastic Hokies


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My camera does not do it Justice... SHES FINISHED!! And yes there is a clear side window on there


ehh looks ok. lol


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need to lose the pata/ide hard drive (if it's a hard drive), that ribbon cable wrecks airflow inside your case. You also need to do some cable management to improve airflow and lose the 80mm fans and grab better 120 or 140mm units. They'll move more air whilst being silent.


Yeah, getting rid of the IDE cable is a good idea. It goes to my dvd burner, which I kinda hate to replace with one using sata just because id rather put the money into other things first, but definitely something ill keep in mind for down the road.

You would have to see my case to get an idea what im talking about with 80 mm fans, that area will only fit 80 mm, in fact it isn't even an area of the case made for fans, I modded it in myself. But I am going to switch out some of my 120s for better 120's someday, but the 80 mms are only in the top of the front. I also have two 120's in the bottom front of the case. The 120s are next to one another, the 80's are sandwiched together because i put them in two spare 5 1/4 bays. 120's wouldn't fit there. You can't see them in the picture.


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly. TheSabertooth Z77 armor has two miniature, i think 40 mm fans on it at key points, so it pushes air under the armour, therefore you have a channel of air, instead of just having an open volume of air where some may or most likely won't stick near your board taking heat along with it. A channelized amount of air allows it to propel wind directly over the board. It also comes with 12 temperature sensors. I can pretty much guarentee it does better. When people here the word "armour" they think it's too protect from blunt force. The armour in this case is only there to make the air flow directly over the board.
> 
> Not to mention 4 fan controller ports, plus 2 ports for the two fans that connect to the thermal armour I mentioned. Plus the CPU fan port. Including the power supply's fan, even though it doesn't enter the case's atmosphere. I'm at 17 fans strong.
> 
> Gonna get 3 delta fans and put 2 of them on my radiator on the bottom in the inside of the case. Not on top since they can cut fingers. Need to buy one though and experiment with it before I realize if I want something so loud, but people say they aren't annoying on low power.
> 
> Also, as for looks, tell me this doesn't look awesome.


this is how it should look lol why post that picture is what I was thinking


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> wow thats awsome! just awsome


Thank you. I'm glad you like it. ^^ One day I want to try my hand at custom water cooling but it sounds like a lot to learn and experiment with so I just went with the Corsair H100i. I wonder how much better a custom loop would perform though. I got video of the whole case on my youtube channel:shamanik1320. Video is "Ultimate PC Update! Delidded 3770k"
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> this is how it should look lol why post that picture is what I was thinking


You mean the angle and how it's too close inside? Yeah, I could've taken a better picture but oh well.


----------



## darkphantom

Great gains on the temps! I haven't even pushed it - my first run with the delidded chip and the temp dropped a good 20C! Will be properly pushing it tomorrow and see what I get


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 990fx is fan, for ram megahurz and cpu-z.
> 
> Hey, do you know if I can submit any result from that Intel event thing? Or do I need to take my own board for that, cause mine's screwed. (I do have ram and a 3770k, does that count?)
> You're mistaking my case with a gpu...I'm broke, how could I afford a gtx 690?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and you mean, mod it into a Tesla k10? Curious....
> Looking good, those res thingies look like candy bars
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need to lose the pata/ide hard drive (if it's a hard drive), that ribbon cable wrecks airflow inside your case. You also need to do some cable management to improve airflow and lose the 80mm fans and grab better 120 or 140mm units. They'll move more air whilst being silent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sketchup, learn to use it, it's amazing


I'll probably grab another chv, might live longer than it did with the livestream event & I have a clue how to use the software.
For the hardware at the event, should be OK as long as no one else is also submitting with the same hardware. If you have to share a rig & the other guy wants to submit scores you'll have to chat about who gets to sub what.


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Thank you. I'm glad you like it. ^^ One day I want to try my hand at custom water cooling but it sounds like a lot to learn and experiment with so I just went with the Corsair H100i. I wonder how much better a custom loop would perform though. I got video of the whole case on my youtube channel:shamanik1320. Video is "Ultimate PC Update! Delidded 3770k"


you must not know sarcasm


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'll probably grab another chv, might live longer than it did with the livestream event & I have a clue how to use the software.
> For the hardware at the event, should be OK as long as no one else is also submitting with the same hardware. If you have to share a rig & the other guy wants to submit scores you'll have to chat about who gets to sub what.


I'll take my cpu and ram to see how good they do on cold I think...
Gonna have to take a picture of whatever rig I bench with, right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> you must not know sarcasm


Sadly, it seems so...What case is that btw?
Maybe we can help tidy that thing up man, it's a mess. I can fit 120mm fans under my dvd drive in the 5.25 bay but I just ditched the thing and a put a 140mm there.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Maybe we can help tidy that thing up man, it's a mess. I can fit 120mm fans under my dvd drive in the 5.25 bay but I just ditched the thing and a put a 140mm there.


The case is a corsair 400r.

Maybe you should not be so assuming you understand what is going on? I have 17 fans in my system, I have two 120's under my dvd drive. I said the 80's fit above the dvd drive. I didn't say I don't have 120's. Tidy up? It has plenty of excellent airflow, it's just a badly shot picture that doesn't show you what's going on around it. It wasn't meant to show off the case or the cooling. I was discussing how the Asus Sabertooth Z77 is my motherboard of choice. Anyways, I just finished this build. I don't give a crap about some wires. When I put my final fans in, maybe then I'll care about it but for now there is a straight shot of air along the top fans and into the radiator.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll take my cpu and ram to see how good they do on cold I think...
> Gonna have to take a picture of whatever rig I bench with, right?
> Sadly, it seems so...What case is that btw?
> Maybe we can help tidy that thing up man, it's a mess. I can fit 120mm fans under my dvd drive in the 5.25 bay but I just ditched the thing and a put a 140mm there.


Pictures never hurt. They are only mandatory for the enthusiast league & competitions, but everyone likes pics.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ok, don't take it so personal, man...was trying to help.
Your case looks pretty bad, like an early 90's AT box, with that cable mess.
That can't have good airflow, that's the thing. 80mm fans are noisy as heck and move little amount of air. No point having them around anymore, I'd personally ditch them.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Pictures never hurt. They are only mandatory for the enthusiast league & competitions, but everyone likes pics.


I haven't submitted a single extreme cooling result (I'm in the enthusiast league atm...)
I wanna make sure I don't get reported or something and get to make some boints while being there, that's all.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Definately Cinema 4d, free trial from distributor. MAXON.NET
> 
> It is the most user friendly Professional 3D software out there!
> 
> I've have been using it since 2007 and studied it in college, Animation, Advanced Animation, Advanced Compositing.
> 
> 
> Plus i would be available to help you get started. val- i dont make this offer often but i imagine we could design some amazing rigs.
> 
> other artwork by TonicX at http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball#post_19556819


I'm downloading it now lol. we should try and come up with some crazy things


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly.


Yes Mr. FTW is StOoPiD.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> wow thats awsome! just awsome


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ehh looks ok. lol


AHAHAHA dude you are killing me you need to stop this.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm downloading it now lol. we should try and come up with some crazy things


Good! I think so too. That makes my day. I bet we could really come up with some innovative concepts. and the renders will be realistic enough to fool some into thinking they are real builds. I gotta sleep - but read my http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball (just one -page) and visit my site http://www.iversondigital.com and check-out ANIMATION page. we can talk about the first build design tomorrow. maybe we should get a virtual meeting account of some kind - I know they give em away free for new starters. just a thought. I will look for you when I get rolling on Saturday.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I haven't submitted a single extreme cooling result (I'm in the enthusiast league atm...)
> I wanna make sure I don't get reported or something and get to make some boints while being there, that's all.


...well, the chap I compete most against in that league is running a LN2 pot (in his avatar / pic of system)...FtW tried to explain before how that is 'fair'...but I did not quite get it


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Make board temps worse? I don't think you know very much about it honestly. TheSabertooth Z77 armor has two miniature, i think 40 mm fans on it at key points, so it pushes air under the armour, therefore you have a channel of air, instead of just having an open volume of air where some may or most likely won't stick near your board taking heat along with it. A channelized amount of air allows it to propel wind directly over the board. It also comes with 12 temperature sensors. I can pretty much guarentee it does better. When people here the word "armour" they think it's too protect from blunt force. The armour in this case is only there to make the air flow directly over the board.
> 
> Not to mention 4 fan controller ports, plus 2 ports for the two fans that connect to the thermal armour I mentioned. Plus the CPU fan port. Including the power supply's fan, even though it doesn't enter the case's atmosphere. I'm at 17 fans strong.
> 
> Gonna get 3 delta fans and put 2 of them on my radiator on the bottom in the inside of the case. Not on top since they can cut fingers. Need to buy one though and experiment with it before I realize if I want something so loud, but people say they aren't annoying on low power.
> 
> Also, as for looks, tell me this doesn't look awesome.


It doesn't look awesome, you can't even see the motherboard because of that horrendous mess of wires. Having a giant birds nest of wires in the middle of your case HURTS AIR FLOW. Having 17 fans does not make your airflow BOSS. Having 5 or 6 well placed fans with a wide open case would be superior to what you have there.

It's great to have pride in your setup. I think the rest of the guys in here would all agree that it needs some serious work.

The 400R has ton's of cable routing holes and a huge amount of space behind the motherboard for tucking wires.

I had a P67 Sabertooth, the thermal armor didn't do much for temps, it did create a lot of noise because 40mm fans are screamers.

My Extreme6 has 6 fan ports, the same as yours, only yours has two extra for the armor fans. Which is designed to generate interest from guys like you.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

^Exactly and we are really nice guys here and are glad to help people out who are new to this and give them tips, but when you have a closed mind and tell guys like FTW 420 that they don't know what he is talking about we aren't going to be so nice about telling you that you need to fix it.
It does look like you have a nice build on your hands, but you really do need to tuck all the cables behind the motherboard because it DOES affect the airflow a lot. We aren't just saying that because we want to see you take everything apart and bust your butt re-routing all the cables. We are telling you that because you seem really focused on cooling and the way you have things right now is not a proper way to set up a build that you want to move a lot of air.
When I first built my computer a couple months back my cable management was absolutely horrible, but I listened to the people on this site and welcomed all of their suggestions and it really helped me out in the long run. I would suggest for you to do the same.
Here is what the cable management on my new rig looks like.




I have 8 fans in my build and look how neat everything is. That way I will move a lot of air with minimal restriction.


----------



## stickg1

Exactly, you have a really nice case and it was designed to hide cables.

(BTW, I painted all my white trim lime green for a lil touch of custom, how does it look?)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Exactly, you have a really nice case and it was designed to hide cables.
> 
> (BTW, I painted all my white trim lime green for a lil touch of custom, how does it look?)


That looks really cool man! I'm looking to do some custom work too. Trying to think of how to cut my HAF 912 and attach it to the Phantom so I can hold the pump, res, the sensor display screen, etc in it.


----------



## stickg1

I'll throw some ideas on that later. But first while its empty, paint it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Exactly, you have a really nice case and it was designed to hide cables.
> 
> (BTW, I painted all my white trim lime green for a lil touch of custom, how does it look?)


man that looks SWEET!


----------



## Hokies83

Heh


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Exactly, you have a really nice case and it was designed to hide cables.
> 
> (BTW, I painted all my white trim lime green for a lil touch of custom, how does it look?)


Looks good, like an nvidia fanboi's case







jk jk lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heh


I'm gonna say one thing: Paint or cover the psu logo.








Other than that, superb!


----------



## homestyle

Did I put too much CLU? The CLU I had was more watery. Most of the other CLU pictures I've seen looked dry and more textured.

I'm concerned about the extra dripping down into the socket area in my upright motherboard.


----------



## lilchronic

my cherie amour


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Did I put too much CLU? The CLU I had was more watery. Most of the other CLU pictures I've seen looked dry and more textured.
> 
> I'm concerned about the extra dripping down into the socket area in my upright motherboard.


If that picture looks like what I think it looks like, it is too much. There can be a few little bubbles of it, but that pic looks like it was poured on, not painted on with a brush. Just a little on the brush, then paint the die, a tiny bit will spread and spread.


----------



## homestyle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If that picture looks like what I think it looks like, it is too much. There can be a few little bubbles of it, but that pic looks like it was poured on, not painted on with a brush. Just a little on the brush, then paint the die, a tiny bit will spread and spread.


it was painted on. my clu came out more watery.

i only used .25-.5 grain of rice.

i've been running now for 3 hours. im just gonna roll the dice and keep on running. temps are great now. if i pull it off and inspect i might not get the same great temps.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> it was painted on. my clu came out more watery.
> 
> i only used .25-.5 grain of rice.
> 
> i've been running now for 3 hours. im just gonna roll the dice and keep on running. temps are great now. if i pull it off and inspect i might not get the same great temps.


It is hard to tell from the pic, but if it is working well, don't worry about it.

You are the first I have heard say that the clu was watery. Is that the only batch you have tried or do you have another to compare it to? I think I have gone through 3 or 4 syringes and they seemed pretty consistent, but I never use the syringe to apply it, I use it like a paint can to get it on the brush, then brush the surface.


----------



## homestyle

this is my first time using this stuff. of course i researched all the application methods and followed those.

i used the brush to move it around. i didn't "paint" it on because the bristles could flick specks of the metal. i just moved it around with the brush.

the extra that was on the brush was painted on the inside of the ihs.


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If that picture looks like what I think it looks like, it is too much. There can be a few little bubbles of it, but that pic looks like it was poured on, not painted on with a brush. *Just a little on the brush, then paint the die, a tiny bit will spread and spread.*


Exactly. I took a video, I'll see if I can upload it. You can take a a fraction of a pea and it will spread all over the die and then some. You just don't want it to look like there is any puddling.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> this is my first time using this stuff. of course i researched all the application methods and followed those.
> 
> i used the brush to move it around. i didn't "paint" it on because the bristles could flick specks of the metal. i just moved it around with the brush.
> 
> the extra that was on the brush was painted on the inside of the ihs.


You can feel free to paint it, when a little gets on the pcb it wipes up easily with a qtip and alcohol. You are correct though that if you are not careful the brush can flick the clu when you get to the edge of the die. I just do it slow and any that gets on the pcb I just wipe up immediately.

If your temps are good, then that is what matters. I have confirmed that you can definitely use too little as well. You can put a very, very thin layer on, but still completely cover it and get worse temps. It can take several attempts to get optimal temps from your chip. Based on the pics and how you describe the application, I think the majority here would say you used a little too much, but if your current temps are good, then don't worry about it unless you really want to try again.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Good! I think so too. That makes my day. I bet we could really come up with some innovative concepts. and the renders will be realistic enough to fool some into thinking they are real builds. I gotta sleep - but read my http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball (just one -page) and visit my site http://www.iversondigital.com and check-out ANIMATION page. we can talk about the first build design tomorrow. maybe we should get a virtual meeting account of some kind - I know they give em away free for new starters. just a thought. I will look for you when I get rolling on Saturday.


You got it lol









I'll take a shower first and then I'll try messing with that program... and see what I can do in it.... I've used blender before and this looks similar I just need to learn the controls









and holy crap sir...... you got some skills


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Looks good, like an nvidia fanboi's case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jk jk lol
> I'm gonna say one thing: Paint or cover the psu logo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Other than that, superb!


Agree'd the PSU logo sticks out like a sore thumb. I wonder if it will look bad if I peel it off.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yes Mr. FTW is StOoPiD.


I didn't call him stupid. Do you always put words in other people's mouths? Just thought perhaps he wasn't up and up on every feature the board has. I've bought two, so compared to someone who hasn't had one (unless he has bought one), I'd probably have a better idea of if something works well or not on the board. It also comes down to simple physics. Someone who says the thermal armour would make it worse just doesn't seem to get the idea. Do 2 40mm fans do a lot? No. But it doesn't have to if it's pushing air into a tight volume of space. If I have an open board just like any other board, it's exposed and air isn't going to run along it as well as if I were to cover it and force air underneath the cover, that same air that was before running around in open space, is now forced to only flow over the motherboard until it's expelled. Making it so air can't go anywhere else makes a channel of air that is much more efficient for getting rid of waste heat rather than something exposed. FTW was saying it would make it worse. Physics just doesn't agree with that. Now this doesn't help the cpu at all, just the surface temperature of the motherboard.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ok, don't take it so personal, man...was trying to help.
> Your case looks pretty bad, like an early 90's AT box, with that cable mess.
> That can't have good airflow, that's the thing. 80mm fans are noisy as heck and move little amount of air. No point having them around anymore, I'd personally ditch them.


Noisy as heck? That's why you put fans on controllers. Can't have good airflow? Yeah, why would something with 16 fans put off good airflow? You're judging the case's airflow based on a closeup shot of the motherboard I posted? That doesn't give you an idea of it's cooling ability at all. You're assuming a lot here from that one pic. Then you tell me that wires are all important and I should get rid of some of my fans? Yeah, that's really gonna help airflow, let's get rid of fans to help the airflow. 120's wont fit in the spot I put the 80 mm's and the 80's are electrical taped together so air can only move through the next fan. As you can see, this pulls air in, it's sucked up by the radiator or spit out the back. It's a straight shot right to the radiator The only place a lot of wires are is on the bottom and there are tons of fans there anyways. My system runs fine and puts off a lot of air. Maybe once I buy the final fans I settle with I'll do something about the wires, but until then I couldn't hardly care about anything so inconsequential. Anyways, sorry for getting heated, but it becomes kinda personal when someone insults my work, based on something so trivial like some wires, when they aren't even seeing a good photo of the whole case.


Along the top you have two tiny fan wires, two power cables that just reach and can not be routed and the coolant tubes to the H100i. The only mess of wires is on the very bottom, far away from the radiator.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It doesn't look awesome, you can't even see the motherboard because of that horrendous mess of wires. Having a giant birds nest of wires in the middle of your case HURTS AIR FLOW. Having 17 fans does not make your airflow BOSS. Having 5 or 6 well placed fans with a wide open case would be superior to what you have there.
> 
> It's great to have pride in your setup. I think the rest of the guys in here would all agree that it needs some serious work.
> 
> The 400R has ton's of cable routing holes and a huge amount of space behind the motherboard for tucking wires.


Actually, I was talking about the looks of the Sabertooth Z77 in general when I said it makes it awesome. I really wasn't even talking about my specific setup. Even though yeah, I do think my tower looks great. But as I told the others, those wires are on the bottom, along the top there is almost no wires in the way, and a lot of those wires in that picture nothing can be done about. I know there's routing ports on the tower, but some aren't long enough to be routed but honestly, I don't have any issues with temperature with benchmarking so heat-wise it has no problem.

As for what would be superior, 6 fans vs 16, that's your opinion. Recognize it when you use it. Also, I can see the motherboard just fine. Perhaps see the new pics I put up that actually show you the rest of the case? There is a straight open tunnel of air from the front to the back feeding the radiator with air. I'll mess with the wires a little bit but honestly I have like 14 temperature sensors or more in it, if there were a problem somewhere, I'd see it.

I'll see if any other wires can be routed though.


----------



## stickg1

Wires aren't trivial and inconsequential. You want to speak of the science behind it..

On a windy day does the wind feel stronger in an open field or in a dense forest? Wires obstruct airflow, similar to overgrowth in a forest.

At least zip-tie some of those wires together and tuck them away, it truly is a mess. And I don't feel like I'm insulting your work, because you couldn't have worked very hard on those wires. You just plugged them in and ran them wherever it was easiest. That's not hard work, that's doing the minimum to make the PC functional.


----------



## Qlix

I heard cable extensions are expensive


----------



## chronicfx

So I pulled the trigger and ordered a gigabyte Z77x-UD5H to replace my Asrock extreme6 along with an XSPC rs360 kit yesterday. Is there a big difference in the terminology used in the bios? I am wondering if the overclocking will be straight forward and exactly the same more or less using offset and turbo voltages? Anyone have experience with both boards or brands?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> I didn't call him stupid. Do you always put words in other people's mouths?


Ok well I'm not even going to even remotely get into this with you because you seem like someone who is always on the offense, but no where di I actually say that you called him stupid. I was just making a joke because you were talking to FTW like he got his first computer yesterday. I'm really not going to explain myself anymore because you obviously didn't take my suggestion ffrom my last post to you to heart. So you just have fun doing your own thing. As long as you are enjoying your computer then that is all that really matters. Just don't be rude to us. We have a good thing going in this thread and we don't want someone coming in here telling us we don't know what we are talking about.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So I pulled the trigger and ordered a gigabyte Z77x-UD5H to replace my Asrock extreme6 along with an XSPC rs360 kit yesterday. Is there a big difference in the terminology used in the bios? I am wondering if the overclocking will be straight forward and exactly the same more or less using offset and turbo voltages? Anyone have experience with both boards or brands?


Why no ud4h luv? You saw us discussing its ram clocking prowess and whatnot, same as the new and improved UP series...UD5H was the first iteration of z77x boards by GB, the newer ones are a bit better and cost the same or less at times. :/
I've had that board and it was a nightware to deal with if you have Samsung hyk0 chips, similar to the Mpower by Msi.
Not a bad board at all, very nice onboard sound and headphone amp included, debug led, power, reset, and clear cmos buttons on the board, voltage read points for extreme oc or debugging.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok well I'm not even going to even remotely get into this with you because you seem like someone who is always on the offense, but no where di I actually say that you called him stupid. I was just making a joke because you were talking to FTW like he got his first computer yesterday. I'm really not going to explain myself anymore because you obviously didn't take my suggestion ffrom my last post to you to heart. So you just have fun doing your own thing. As long as you are enjoying your computer then that is all that really matters. Just don't be rude to us. We have a good thing going in this thread and we don't want someone coming in here telling us we don't know what we are talking about.


He probably doesn't know 'who' FtW is or dies, or what his level of experience in the field is...but well, no need to fight over trivial things like that.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Wires aren't trivial and inconsequential. You want to speak of the science behind it..
> 
> On a windy day does the wind feel stronger in an open field or in a dense forest? Wires obstruct airflow, similar to overgrowth in a forest.
> 
> At least zip-tie some of those wires together and tuck them away, it truly is a mess. And I don't feel like I'm insulting your work, because you couldn't have worked very hard on those wires. You just plugged them in and ran them wherever it was easiest. That's not hard work, that's doing the minimum to make the PC functional.


I am the worst wire offender ever when it comes to wire management. But I promise that if my wife will give me a good chunk of time next weekend to install and leak test the rasa kit with the new motherboard installed.. I will use zip ties instead of just tucking stuff wherever I can. I will even take my electric duster home from work and clean all my fans


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Why no ud4h luv? You saw us discussing its ram clocking prowess and whatnot, same as the new and improved UP series...UD5H was the first iteration of z77x boards by GB, the newer ones are a bit better and cost the same or less at times. :/
> I've had that board and it was a nightware to deal with if you have Samsung hyk0 chips, similar to the Mpower by Msi.
> Not a bad board at all, very nice onboard sound and headphone amp included, debug led, power, reset, and clear cmos buttons on the board, voltage read points for extreme oc or debugging.
> He probably doesn't know 'who' FtW is or dies, or what his level of experience in the field is...but well, no need to fight over trivial things like that.


Yea I hear ya man that's why I said I'm not going to get into this. It can be a bit aggravating, but I refuse to fight with anyone on here. In the end it is just a computer we are talking about.


----------



## jamdox

Add me!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I am the worst wire offender ever when it comes to wire management. But I promise that if my wife will give me a good chunk of time next weekend to install and leak test the rasa kit with the new motherboard installed.. I will use zip ties instead of just tucking stuff wherever I can. I will even take my electric duster home from work and clean all my fans


I use my huge compressor to blow the dust off all my components. The thing will blow off your skin! I love it!!!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I hear ya man that's why I said I'm not going to get into this. It can be a bit aggravating, but I refuse to fight with anyone on here. In the end it is just a computer we are talking about.


Alright so what all are we trying to fit into a Phantom 820? I think you should just do the one case man. Maybe just do 2 rads instead of 3 if space is an issue. I think the two case setup is gonna be weird.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> Add me!


You should go to the first page of the thread and fill out the info and include it in a post. Congrats


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> I heard cable extensions are expensive


Now that's a really good idea. I will definitely get around to doing that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ok well I'm not even going to even remotely get into this with you because you seem like someone who is always on the offense, but no where di I actually say that you called him stupid. I was just making a joke because you were talking to FTW like he got his first computer yesterday. I'm really not going to explain myself anymore because you obviously didn't take my suggestion ffrom my last post to you to heart. So you just have fun doing your own thing. As long as you are enjoying your computer then that is all that really matters. Just don't be rude to us. We have a good thing going in this thread and we don't want someone coming in here telling us we don't know what we are talking about.


Yeah, I'm sorry. It's cool. I didn't mean to be rude.

As for the whole wire issue. Yeah there was a little more I could do, I messed with it for like 10 minutes and it looks a lot better. But the most important space around the radiator was just fine before. I just had a mess of wires at the bottom. But I did find some stuff I could place more optimally.

Just honestly, there is only so much I'm willing to mess with on this though, because this build has been such a doozy, and not just because I had to open a cpu with a razor blade, which wasn't too bad, but still nerve-wracking. But then getting my Corsair H100i and finding out the Asus Sabertooth Z77 I like so much, the plastic armour actually got in the way of it, but I eventually got the radiator attached, although it's skewed and not exactly center with the fans on top. Also, if anyone were to repeat this, Sabertooth Z77 + Corsair 400r + Corsair H100i, you'll find out you can only get two screws in it with push/pull configuration, three screws if you only use the one set of fans. Just that I was able to get things working right in the end makes me happy. Then I also bent the pins on my motherboard when I was switching from the 3770 to the 3770k, so went without a computer for awhile. *gasp* I'm just happy to have it all completed that I really wasn't even thinking about something like wires so it seemed trivial to me, but I suppose it was good advice, so thanks.


----------



## jamdox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> You should go to the first page of the thread and fill out the info and include it in a post. Congrats


I will once the video and guide are changed from a barbarous and dangerous razor delid to the civilized, enlightened, safe and efficient hammer method









Seriously, it's like when you stop a clinical trial early because NOT using the new treatment is a waste of lives. The old method should NOT be up there anymore!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> Add me!


umm








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> You should go to the first page of the thread and fill out the info and include it in a post. Congrats


what he said lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Now that's a really good idea. I will definitely get around to doing that.
> Yeah, I'm sorry. It's cool. I didn't mean to be rude.
> 
> As for the whole wire issue. Yeah there was a little more I could do, I messed with it for like 10 minutes and it looks a lot better. But the most important space around the radiator was just fine before. I just had a mess of wires at the bottom. But I did find some stuff I could place more optimally.
> 
> Just honestly, there is only so much I'm willing to mess with on this though, because this build has been such a doozy, and not just because I had to open a cpu with a razor blade, which wasn't too bad, but still nerve-wracking. But then getting my Corsair H100i and finding out the Asus Sabertooth Z77 I like so much, the plastic armour actually got in the way of it, but I eventually got the radiator attached, although it's skewed and not exactly center with the fans on top. Also, if anyone were to repeat this, Sabertooth Z77 + Corsair 400r + Corsair H100i, you'll find out you can only get two screws in it with push/pull configuration, three screws if you only use the one set of fans. Just that I was able to get things working right in the end makes me happy. Then I also bent the pins on my motherboard when I was switching from the 3770 to the 3770k, so went without a computer for awhile. *gasp* I'm just happy to have it all completed that I really wasn't even thinking about something like wires so it seemed trivial to me, but I suppose it was good advice, so thanks.


No hard feelings man, all we were trying to say even something like wires can be important in the pursuit of optimal performance, which is something I think we are all after here on OCN. Good luck!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Alright so what all are we trying to fit into a Phantom 820? I think you should just do the one case man. Maybe just do 2 rads instead of 3 if space is an issue. I think the two case setup is gonna be weird.


Yea I hear ya man. It is gonna be a pain in the butt to do that. I could probably hide my SSD'S behind the motherboard and get rid of the opt drive all together so that way I can still get rid of all the bays. Then I can fit a 240 rad on the bottom and a 360 rad on the top and a 360 rad on the front and a 140 rad on the rear and I would still be able to fit one of those pumps / res things somewhere in the case. Still have to figure out where to put everything.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I hear ya man. It is gonna be a pain in the butt to do that. I could probably hide my SSD'S behind the motherboard and get rid of the opt drive all together so that way I can still get rid of all the bays. Then I can fit a 240 rad on the bottom and a 360 rad on the top and a 360 rad on the front and a 140 rad on the rear and I would still be able to fit one of those pumps / res things somewhere in the case. Still have to figure out where to put everything.


Ditch one of those rads IMO. It will be sweet with all those rads but its borderline "hokie", the new adjective for "excessive" here on OCN.


----------



## Vi0lence

i run 3 rads. a 240 on my cpu and 2x 360's on my gpu's. works very well.


----------



## Joa3d43

*@ Valgaur, IvanL and Hokies @ w-c friends*

...making good progress re the 'deskputer', but have a question...

...to recap briefly, of the 8 or so systems I have here in my home-office for work and play / VM, 3 are going to become part of a 'deskputer' as I desperately need to recover some space...

...I have chosen 3 mobos which are currently installed already in typical 'cases'...the Rampage IV w/3970X, the MVE w/3770K and the Sabertooth Z77 w/3770 (non-K)....btw, no cheap-shots in the Sabertooth - you all gonna get it later









I now had a bit of time to lay it all out - the mobos, 2x AX1200 and 1x TX850 PSUs, the GPUs, W-C cooling and try it on a dedicated
'table top' I pirated from storage...I'm going to use cut-out mobo trays (metal) from old cases, with extra-long stand-offs. The basic dimensions (for now) are 4ft x 2ft x9 inches...in addition, there are things going to be mounted underneath (possibly the PSUs), while the rads are making up the 'back and one side' with the other 'side' being an air-intake w/filters...the whole thing will be under a glass enclosure for dust protection.

...then on the way to Starbucks, we happened to pass by an architectural / design firm...and in their show window, they had all these models of buildings, interior and exterior designs etc...all made out of wood and plastic - and get this: all mounted in custom-carpentry 3D wood and glass tables...so I went in and chatted with their model builder (master carpenter). He suggested another option: That of a wall mount !! That would save even more space and look spiffy on top. While I will use this architectural firm for some tricky wood work I can't easily do myself (various openings underneath for cables, pipes, IO shroud exits and such), the 'wall mount' approach vs the deskputer approach really is quite similar, but it does raise an important technical question:

...if mounted vertically, the w-c pumps (min 3x MPC 655) will have to push cooling liquids 'up hill' for close to two feet unless I change the design which has other consequences - before I do so, is there a data-table you know of that expresses additional pump pressures needed for each 1ft of height ? I'm using 1/2 x 3/4 PrimoChill advanced LRT tubing. Thanks in advance


----------



## jdm317

Wow a lot has gone on since my last visit..
Finally finding the time and energy to get around to getting the dragon skin applied. A lot more tedious than I had expected but I think it has gone well so far. Thanks for the advice to those of you who offered advice, I think I repped you all. FTW 420 I keep forgetting I can't rep you









About to wrap up the GPU like a pig in a blanket then I will be leak testing. I'll be sure to triple check everything.

poured the dragon skin through the holes in the backplate. Evened out nicely.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Now that's a really good idea. I will definitely get around to doing that.
> Yeah, I'm sorry. It's cool. I didn't mean to be rude.
> 
> As for the whole wire issue. Yeah there was a little more I could do, I messed with it for like 10 minutes and it looks a lot better. But the most important space around the radiator was just fine before. I just had a mess of wires at the bottom. But I did find some stuff I could place more optimally.
> 
> Just honestly, there is only so much I'm willing to mess with on this though, because this build has been such a doozy, and not just because I had to open a cpu with a razor blade, which wasn't too bad, but still nerve-wracking. But then getting my Corsair H100i and finding out the Asus Sabertooth Z77 I like so much, the plastic armour actually got in the way of it, but I eventually got the radiator attached, although it's skewed and not exactly center with the fans on top. Also, if anyone were to repeat this, Sabertooth Z77 + Corsair 400r + Corsair H100i, you'll find out you can only get two screws in it with push/pull configuration, three screws if you only use the one set of fans. Just that I was able to get things working right in the end makes me happy. Then I also bent the pins on my motherboard when I was switching from the 3770 to the 3770k, so went without a computer for awhile. *gasp* I'm just happy to have it all completed that I really wasn't even thinking about something like wires so it seemed trivial to me, but I suppose it was good advice, so thanks.


Yea I hear ya man I also bent my motherboard pins when putting the chip back in after delidding so I know what its like to have to buy a new board for something stupid like that. My psu has been in RMA for two weeks now so I haven't been able to use my build in two weeks now and I'm dying to try out my new parts.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I hear ya man I also bent my motherboard pins when putting the chip back in after delidding so I know what its like to have to buy a new board for something stupid like that. My psu has been in RMA for two weeks now so I haven't been able to use my build in two weeks now and I'm dying to try out my new parts.


Damn. What bent them? For me it was a Cooler Master 212 EVO+ mounting kit and I wasn't noticing the pin inside wasn't lined up with the bracket and I guess it bent the pins. I looked online for advice and got a magnifying glass and a flashlight and tried rearranging them all, until i saw one of the gold pins snap off while moving it back. lol.

I was trying to do the whole validation thing for the delidded temperature test. But I'm having some trouble. I usually just use a +.2v offset value and go at 4.7 Ghz, I can game all day and nothing crashes and my 4 cpu core temperatures playing Battlefield 3 with all settings maxed never goes beyond 80 degrees celsius, however, Intel Burn Test I'm having trouble setting up to where it won't go to 105 degrees (I can complete the test at 4.5 with +.125 offset but CPU-Z is saying I'm at 1.42 or so vcore), my one core, the second one from the left on the chart in Real Temp, is always a little hotter, usually by 3 or 4 degrees than the other cores. I'm kinda new to overclocking cpu's too, I've tried booting at 4.5 Ghz at 1.2v manual but it won't boot, I even pushed it to 1.28 and it got into windows and shortly after it went bluescreen restart. Does this mean I didn't get a good chip because it won't do 4.5 at 1.2v manual? Is there a setting I could try? EPU power saving mode is off, almost everything like load line calib. and any overclocking value is set to extreme or best value for overclocking potential. I didn't check the C1 and c2 and package c states though, so perhaps I'll mess with them.

Any advice would be appreciated.


----------



## chronicfx

Is ud4h better because it is newer than the ud5h? I got the ud5h for $135 with gift cards for best buy. Would the ud4h have been better?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> I will once the video and guide are changed from a barbarous and dangerous razor delid to the civilized, enlightened, safe and efficient hammer method
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously, it's like when you stop a clinical trial early because NOT using the new treatment is a waste of lives. The old method should NOT be up there anymore!


Sorry, I will go ahead and disagree with that. I watched your video and saw how the chip was handled. I would bet that it is ok, but I could not guarantee it. When I delidded both my chips with a razor I used rubber gloves whenever I handled it to avoid static and any dirt/oils that are always present on your hands, and I treated it extremely gently at all times.

The repeated blows struck to the pcb may be 100% fine, but you don't have any long term data on that. I know for a fact that both my chips were handled with extreme care and no kind of force was used on any part of it. Delidding with a razor, when done right, exposes the pcb and die to nothing whatsoever dangerous or out of the ordinary. Only the glue is cut, nothing else is affected.

I have watched all the hammer videos and I don't fault anyone for going that direction at all. The blunt force trauma inflicted on the pcb may be perfectly fine, I am not an Intel engineer, but I know for a fact no force or damage was done to my chips when I used a razor.
Both methods are valid, but I would have to wait awhile to see if the trauma caused by repeated hammer blows means anything or not. Just my two cents.


----------



## jamdox

Fair enough, but the OP should at least link to the hammer method so people know there is more than one option out there. Like I said, so far nobody has killed their chip with this method, while the razor method is very accident-prone.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> Fair enough, but the OP should at least link to the hammer method so people know there is more than one option out there. Like I said, so far nobody has killed their chip with this method, while the razor method is very accident-prone.


Agreed, pm him with what info you think should be there, and then he will decide how to proceed.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, the chap I compete most against in that league is running a LN2 pot (in his avatar / pic of system)...FtW tried to explain before how that is 'fair'...but I did not quite get it


Maybe Ivan can give a better explanation, but you are mainly running 3d benchmarks right now, which get ranked by the gpu so looking at that.
Running a bench for a single 7970 say you get the highest score for any air or water cooled single 7970, you would be in the #1 spot for that card in that benchmark in the enthusiast league & get the most points for it in the league.
Now you look at the rankings for for 1 x 7970 in that benchmark, & you can be in the #30 spot behind cards that were ln2 cooled.

So in the overall rankings for 1 x 7970 you are still competing against extreme coolers for the absolute highest score.

But being in the enthusiast league, you still get good points for having the fastest card on non-extreme cooling. The leagues are about the points.

Extreme coolers compete against extreme coolers for points in the extreme OC league
Normal coolers compete for points in the enthusiast league.

It's still an all out competition for the highest score & highest ranking, any cooling goes.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> I didn't call him stupid. Do you always put words in other people's mouths? Just thought perhaps he wasn't up and up on every feature the board has. I've bought two, so compared to someone who hasn't had one (unless he has bought one), I'd probably have a better idea of if something works well or not on the board. It also comes down to simple physics. Someone who says the thermal armour would make it worse just doesn't seem to get the idea. Do 2 40mm fans do a lot? No. But it doesn't have to if it's pushing air into a tight volume of space. If I have an open board just like any other board, it's exposed and air isn't going to run along it as well as if I were to cover it and force air underneath the cover, that same air that was before running around in open space, is now forced to only flow over the motherboard until it's expelled. Making it so air can't go anywhere else makes a channel of air that is much more efficient for getting rid of waste heat rather than something exposed. FTW was saying it would make it worse. Physics just doesn't agree with that. Now this doesn't help the cpu at all, just the surface temperature of the motherboard.
> Noisy as heck? That's why you put fans on controllers. Can't have good airflow? Yeah, why would something with 16 fans put off good airflow? You're judging the case's airflow based on a closeup shot of the motherboard I posted? That doesn't give you an idea of it's cooling ability at all. You're assuming a lot here from that one pic. Then you tell me that wires are all important and I should get rid of some of my fans? Yeah, that's really gonna help airflow, let's get rid of fans to help the airflow. 120's wont fit in the spot I put the 80 mm's and the 80's are electrical taped together so air can only move through the next fan. As you can see, this pulls air in, it's sucked up by the radiator or spit out the back. It's a straight shot right to the radiator The only place a lot of wires are is on the bottom and there are tons of fans there anyways. My system runs fine and puts off a lot of air. Maybe once I buy the final fans I settle with I'll do something about the wires, but until then I couldn't hardly care about anything so inconsequential. Anyways, sorry for getting heated, but it becomes kinda personal when someone insults my work, based on something so trivial like some wires, when they aren't even seeing a good photo of the whole case.
> 
> 
> Along the top you have two tiny fan wires, two power cables that just reach and can not be routed and the coolant tubes to the H100i. The only mess of wires is on the very bottom, far away from the radiator.


Its all good, just friendly discussion.
I do think physics agrees with me though. Say you have a computer in a case generating heat, 2 x case fans pushing air through it.
Will this cool better than a computer in the open air, no case, with 2 x case fans moving air over everything? Maybe as good, but better?

I was mainly pointing out that the thermal armor is like an advertising feature, something different than anyone else has (it is good for manufacturers to try new & different things), & while it may not hurt temps, it doesn't necessarily help them either. Like a gpu backplate, looks good, but usually more aesthetic than functional.
MSI military spec components are a good example. Heavily advertised, but do the military spec components offer anything better than the competitors who don't have military spec components? Not one bit of difference.

Not knocking your board or anything, me not liking the sabertooth is only about the look & personal taste, as far as performance goes I would take the sabertooth over some other boards. (like lilchronics extreme 4. his board just sucks







)


----------



## stickg1

Did a little painting this afternoon


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Is ud4h better because it is newer than the ud5h? I got the ud5h for $135 with gift cards for best buy. Would the ud4h have been better?


UD5H is fine board i had my 3770k running 5ghz and ram at 2500mhz on a UD5H


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Maybe Ivan can give a better explanation, but you are mainly running 3d benchmarks right now, which get ranked by the gpu so looking at that.
> Running a bench for a single 7970 say you get the highest score for any air or water cooled single 7970, you would be in the #1 spot for that card in that benchmark in the enthusiast league & get the most points for it in the league.
> Now you look at the rankings for for 1 x 7970 in that benchmark, & you can be in the #30 spot behind cards that were ln2 cooled.
> 
> So in the overall rankings for 1 x 7970 you are still competing against extreme coolers for the absolute highest score.
> 
> But being in the enthusiast league, you still get good points for having the fastest card on non-extreme cooling. The leagues are about the points.
> 
> Extreme coolers compete against extreme coolers for points in the extreme OC league
> Normal coolers compete for points in the enthusiast league.
> 
> It's still an all out competition for the highest score & highest ranking, any cooling goes


...I think I understand better now - TX







...it also seems that what I really should be doing is stay in the enthusiast league, but get myself a LN2 pot - I do have an enclosed balcony


----------



## TonicX

Have you guys heard about CoolLaboratory Ultra Thermal Paste? I always use a tiny bit of it between my delidded ivy bridge IHS and die. This week I moved my CPU to a new mobo - the Ledgendary MAXIMUS V GENE and use some IC Diamond between the IHS and corsair Copper water block but temps were- MEH! high seventies with full load.

Today I replaced the IC Diamond with the smallest amount of CoolLaboratory Ultra Thermal Paste. and Guess What? High sixties fully loaded! CLU definitely is the Coolest







I just earned another notch on my multipler - Yeah baby!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Wow a lot has gone on since my last visit..
> Finally finding the time and energy to get around to getting the dragon skin applied. A lot more tedious than I had expected but I think it has gone well so far. Thanks for the advice to those of you who offered advice, I think I repped you all. FTW 420 I keep forgetting I can't rep you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About to wrap up the GPU like a pig in a blanket then I will be leak testing. I'll be sure to triple check everything.
> 
> poured the dragon skin through the holes in the backplate. Evened out nicely.


Looks good, if no air can get at exposed cold metal, should get 0 condensation issues.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think I understand better now - TX
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...it also seems that what I really should be doing is stay in the enthusiast league, but get myself a LN2 pot - I do have an enclosed balcony


1st submission with anything extreme cooled automatically bumps you into the extreme OC league, even if it's an air cooled gpu 3d bench with an extreme cooled cpu. Most 3d benches are cpu benches as well, heaven is one of only a couple that are almost completely gpu dependent.


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys... anyone looking for a 680??







try and help me out here


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks good, if no air can get at exposed cold metal, should get 0 condensation issues.
> 1st submission with anything extreme cooled automatically bumps you into the extreme OC league, even if it's an air cooled gpu 3d bench with an extreme cooled cpu. Most 3d benches are cpu benches as well, heaven is one of only a couple that are almost completely gpu dependent.


...dang - such a good plan


----------



## chronicfx

Does gigabyte have turbo offset like asus and asrock do?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> (like lilchronics extreme 4. his board just sucks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


lmao funny guy







and my psu that sucks to, 850w pos blackwidow TR2 RX







my brother laughed @ me when i bought it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I hate Thermaltake with a passion...I'm not buying anything by them or Msi








If Biostar made psu's they would probably be better than some Thermaltake units.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I hate Thermaltake with a passion...I'm not buying anything by them or Msi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If Biostar made psu's they would probably be better than some Thermaltake units.


I still like MSI boards, most of the bench team bugs me for it but I do well with them.

Not buying anything MSI though? The boards are debatable, but the gpus are always up with the best if not _the_ best.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I still like MSI boards, most of the bench team bugs me for it but I do well with them.
> 
> Not buying anything MSI though? The boards are debatable, but the gpus are always up with the best if not _the_ best.


Gigabyte has me covered warranty wise and I'm poor...unless it's a lightning, there's no convincing me.

EDIT: Turns out I can't submit nor take my gear to the Intel event thingie


----------



## chronicfx

Turbo offset?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Turbo offset?


Gigabyte does do it, I did my offset vs. fixed testing on a GB z77 board.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Turbo offset?


nevermind


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lmao funny guy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and my psu that sucks to, 850w pos blackwidow TR2 RX
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my brother laughed @ me when i bought it.


Thermaltake does suck, but the 850w Blackwidow is their least lethal model. Or got a passing review at least. I actually had one for a while, it was on clearance at Best Buy for like $75. After a lot of verbal harassment from forum members I replaced it.

It ran fine for me but good grief was that thing ugly. What color is that anyway? It was like poop brown mixed with titanium. No other component on the planet matches that color.


----------



## lilchronic

wow i just now realized that my case wont fit a extended atx mobo


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> wow i just now realized that my case wont fit a extended atx mobo


A hacksaw can fix that.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A hacksaw can fix that.


better yet a mobo box


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A hacksaw can fix that.


my psu would be in the way


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my psu would be in the way


Then a hacksaw & a big hammer...









Ivan could look at the psu pic after & post


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my psu would be in the way


Which mobo? I thought E-ATX were just a little wider...


----------



## lilchronic

well thats a good question either the OC formula or the MVF.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well thats a good question either the OC formula or the MVF.


Don't get the MVF, you might be able to beat my Valley 1440p score then.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Don't get the MVF, you might be able to beat my Valley 1440p score then.


man i should of tried last night it was like 40* F out


----------



## stickg1

I'm am really happy with this paint job. I need to figure out something with my Corsair logo on the PSU. It's burnt orange and everything else is black or green.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Thermaltake does suck, but the 850w Blackwidow is their least lethal model. Or got a passing review at least. I actually had one for a while, it was on clearance at Best Buy for like $75. After a lot of verbal harassment from forum members I replaced it.
> 
> It ran fine for me but good grief was that thing ugly. What color is that anyway? It was like poop brown mixed with titanium. No other component on the planet matches that color.


I have one of those too and I also got mine from Best Buy. Really great power supply. I had my old PSU which was 650 I believe die on me so I needed something that night to get back up and running with so I went to Best Buy and thought of that as a good choice. What did you replace it with?


----------



## Hokies83

More my main rig i would use no less then a top tier Psu.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> I have one of those too and I also got mine from Best Buy. Really great power supply. I had my old PSU which was 650 I believe die on me so I needed something that night to get back up and running with so I went to Best Buy and thought of that as a good choice. What did you replace it with?


I do a lot of buying and selling of parts. I'm always on the marketplace and the local Craigslist. I found a guy selling a bunch of mid-range enthusiast parts and in one of the PCs he was selling was a Corsair TX750w. The rig had a dead mobo, but I was able to sell all the other working parts, keep the TX750w and still make a profit. So it worked out well for me, free PSU essentially. The TX750 isn't exactly my dream PSU, but after reading a lot of reviews on JonnyGuru and HardwareSecrets, I was really uncomfortable powering $1000 worth of parts with a Thermaltake PSU.


----------



## Arm3nian

I don't really see a point in a case for a watercooled build. Its not going to be transportable anyway, due to weight and risk of destroying the loop, and it limits your space. Also it costs $.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Don't get the MVF, you might be able to beat my Valley 1440p score then.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Don't get the MVF, you might be able to beat my Valley 1440p score then.


* Beats the old mans Valley score *

Bah i could but do not care... Id rather keep my 3 7950s making me $$$$


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*


----------



## Betsy601

I'll join the club asap...waiting on Sidewinder's package
Liquid Ultra ftw.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> better yet a mobo box


...better yet no box at all - mount it on the wall (hey, that rhymed







)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*


----------



## stickg1

You guys and your fancy pants monitors and SLI setups. Feeling real jelly beans right now.


----------



## lilchronic

so how is the asus MVG ?? is it a good board?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so how is the asus MVG ?? is it a good board?


Love both of mine. Here you go:


----------



## Hokies83

Asus Rog Circle jerk going on up in here @[email protected]

MVG is the only one priced decent fine if u have a small case and only want to SLI on water.

Other 2 are over priced.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Asus Rog Circle jerk going on up in here @[email protected]
> 
> MVG is the only one priced decent fine if u have a small case and only want to SLI on water.
> 
> Other 2 are over priced.


Yes yes we get it Mr. Hokies


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Asus Rog Circle jerk going on up in here @[email protected]
> 
> MVG is the only one priced decent fine if u have a small case and only want to SLI on water.
> 
> Other 2 are over priced.


...it might make you fell better to know that the *Gigabyte* 670 WF3 OC card I picked up on sale is a great performer...right out of the box, before any mods, it could hit 1340 GHz in stock form...now I gave it an *Asus* mod treatment and it works even better


----------



## Hokies83

I do not own a gigabyte gpu there power color... and my other is an Evga.

Onlything Asus i own is my Router and my HTPC mb.

Onlything gigabyte i own is my main system MB... Which i like much better then the Rampage Extreme 3 i had before it..... " other then colors"

IM Loyal to no brand.. i get what is best if something gives the same performance for 50$ less ill get that....


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...it might make you fell better to know that the *Gigabyte* 670 WF3 OC card I picked up on sale is a great performer...right out of the box, before any mods, it could hit 1340 GHz in stock form...now I gave it an *Asus* mod treatment and it works even better


Man that sucks, my Giga WF3 670 can't get past 1286MHz no matter what voltage. I might try a BIOS mod tomorrow.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Love both of mine. Here you go:


i give up i had you beat but it crashed right before the score came up







1346mhz/3634


----------



## darkphantom

Alright gents, been OCing for a couple hours trying to figure out what would be a good place to stop. Thus far, 4.7ghz @ 1.28v temps in the 63-67C range









De-lidding was so worth it!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not own a gigabyte gpu there power color... and my other is an Evga.
> 
> Onlything Asus i own is my Router and my HTPC mb.
> 
> Onlything gigabyte i own is my main system MB... Which i like much better then the Rampage Extreme 3 i had before it..... " other then colors"
> 
> IM Loyal to no brand.. i get what is best if something gives the same performance for 50$ less ill get that....


Yeah I hear ya I was torn between the GIGABYTE G1 Assassin Sniper 3, Up7, and MVE. I just couldn't choose so I went with the MVE becuase the color matched the theme I was going for and I like a lot of the extra features on the board that I will eventually use at some point (I swear!!)







I'm sure I would have loved either one.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkphantom*
> 
> Alright gents, been OCing for a couple hours trying to figure out what would be a good place to stop. Thus far, 4.7ghz @ 1.28v temps in the 63-67C range
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> De-lidding was so worth it!


Nice chip man!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Man that sucks, my Giga WF3 670 can't get past 1286MHz no matter what voltage. I might try a BIOS mod tomorrow.


...before you do, are you running SLI, tri-SLI or quad-SLI ? I ask because the cards will slow down, at least with tri + ....1286 is pretty good...have you increased the PowerTarget to max - ditto for the voltage adjustments you can do in 'stock' ?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...it might make you fell better to know that the *Gigabyte* 670 WF3 OC card I picked up on sale is a great performer...right out of the box, before any mods, it could hit 1340 GHz in stock form...now I gave it an *Asus* mod treatment and it works even better


yea my first card hit 1346 stock bios but it exceeds the power limit and starts to throtttle with unlocked bios. @ 1.212v


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Nice chip man!


Thanks, but keep your fingers crossed. IBT passed...time to send it to prime over night and see what happens!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkphantom*
> 
> Thanks, but keep your fingers crossed. IBT passed...time to send it to prime over night and see what happens!


Good luck! My fingers will be crossed for you.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i give up i had you beat but it crashed right before the score came up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1346mhz/3634


Dude, I had to spend 40% more than you to beat you by a fraction, you already won.







You have to save up and put them under water. Getting rid of the floor fan and not listening to the gpu fan is great.


----------



## dbranger94

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> that is the cleanest intel application. it looks like a heatsink has never pressed down on it. if you match the pieces together, the whole die and ihs are covered in tim.


Temps were pretty even before delidding. Core #2 was 2-3C hotter than the rest and #4 was a little cooler... The cores still have that same temp. spread. It must be a characteristic of my particular die...? Also, other than being really dry, they did get the paste on there pretty evenly. Only had it a week before yanking the top off.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Dude, I had to spend 40% more than you to beat you by a fraction, you already won.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have to save up and put them under water. Getting rid of the floor fan and not listening to the gpu fan is great.


yea these cards are awsome! but i need a new board first and im starting to like the MVG, but since im a noob and bought this small case i cant fit anything else in it, id need to get these girls wet cause them pci-e slots look really tight on that MVG


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yea these cards are awsome! but *i need a new board first* and im starting to like the MVG, but since im a noob and bought this small case i cant fit anything else in it, id need to get these girls wet cause them pci-e sluts look really tight on that MVG


I disagree. Your 3570k runs 5ghz on that board, why not spend the saved cash on WC?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I disagree. Your 3570k runs 5ghz on that board, why not spend the saved cash on WC?


you got a point but .... idk i want to push my chip harded and i want to try 5.2 ghz .








my current mobo is not worthy enough for my 5 ghz chip @ 1.38v


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you got a point but .... idk i want to push my chip harded and i want 5.2 ghz .


I totally understand that feeling, but you will get a ton more performance by going WC and OCing your cards higher. 5.0 to 5.2 is visible only in benches. Heck, 4.7GHz to 4.9GHz in FireStrike was a whopping 42 points and that's on an i7 with OCed memory.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I totally understand that feeling, but you will get a ton more performance by going WC and OCing your cards higher. 5.0 to 5.2 is visible only in benches. Heck, 4.7GHz to 4.9GHz in FireStrike was a whopping 42 points and that's on an i7 with OCed memory.


yea my brother told me when he went water cooling on his 480's he was able to gain 50mhz im not sure if 600 series are like that but even 25 more mhz would be awsome


----------



## MKHunt

WC also lets you bios mod and overvolt your cards more safely, as I have shown with my titans.


----------



## jdm317

I promise I will try and quit posting pics of the chiller unit! Im just too excited right now, its working. First try and sitting at -18°C on the res and 0°C on all cores including GPU. Unit has been running for 45 minutes. Its a bit slow but shes still dropping and has a ways to go.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## dr/owned

Aren't you going to freeze your coolant?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Aren't you going to freeze your coolant?


No sir. Its shown to be free flowing at -35°C. 50/50 Denatured alcohol/Distilled Water/ some antifreeze for corrosion. Running fine, no ice buildup at all.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Then a hacksaw & a big hammer...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ivan could look at the psu pic after & post


Thank God I got you to cover my back when I'm not around lol








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I totally understand that feeling, but you will get a ton more performance by going WC and OCing your cards higher. 5.0 to 5.2 is visible only in benches. Heck, 4.7GHz to 4.9GHz in FireStrike was a whopping 42 points and that's on an i7 with OCed memory.


Firestrike doesn't mind cpu clocks that much really, and prefers Nvidia.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> WC also lets you bios mod and overvolt your cards more safely, as I have shown with my titans.


670s don't go much further on water...for my it's kinda of a waste, unless you do it for fun.
An MVG on ln2 or Dry Ice would do much better than the Asrock board he has


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 670s don't go much further on water...for my it's kinda of a waste, unless you do it for fun.


It is pretty useless to put any 600 under water, with decent air flow and properly applied good tim anyone should be able to get the max voltage out of them w/o throttling. Although it is nice seeing really low temperatures. When I was on air, going from stock voltage to max voltage was a difference of 3c, which is not very big.


----------



## Hokies83

Yah Kepler does not need water.. will not allow u to clock any higher onlythings i can see is looks and noise.

Hd7000 Works very well with water however.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> It is pretty useless to put any 600 under water, with decent air flow and properly applied good tim anyone should be able to get the max voltage out of them w/o throttling. Although it is nice seeing really low temperatures. When I was on air, going from stock voltage to max voltage was a difference of 3c, which is not very big.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah Kepler does not need water.. will not allow u to clock any higher onlythings i can see is looks and noise.
> 
> Hd7000 Works very well with water however.


...the only time I really would like water for the 670ies-on full voltage and PT is in Quad-SLI- because they block each other's air flow - SLI and tri-SLI are fine...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, Titan benefits more from it. Heck instead of spending monies on water I'd get a Titan lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, Titan benefits more from it. Heck instead of spending monies on water I'd get a Titan lol


...not yet - price adj. / new Titan versions to come soon...


----------



## dr/owned

I went watercooling to begin with because I was annoyed by the fan noise on my 680s. I don't own $1000 headphones just so I can have audio quality ruined by fan drone.

I even have gone to the length of putting up 3" thick sound panels around my desktop for the mechanical HDD whine and the remaining 2 fans running in the case.

I like my silence


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the only time I really would like water for the 670ies-on full voltage and PT is in Quad-SLI- because they block each other's air flow - SLI and tri-SLI are fine...


well on the MVG you would want them water cooled for the same reason. pci slots are tight on that micro boad wish they made a regular ATX ROG board


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I went watercooling to begin with because I was annoyed by the fan noise on my 680s. I don't own $1000 headphones just so I can have audio quality ruined by fan drone.
> 
> I even have gone to the length of putting up 3" thick sound panels around my desktop for the mechanical HDD whine and the remaining 2 fans running in the case.
> 
> I like my silence


Exactly. Water helped a bit with my 690 oc, but I couldn't care less about that. The silence of a card under water vs. max fan speed to keep it under 70c is worth a lot to me.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I found it really hard, going over 50c after applying CLU on my 670 ftw's die...


----------



## Arm3nian

Best thing going from air to water ----> Not having to worry about fan spinning faster during a game







ahhh so comfy to my ears.


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Best thing going from air to water ----> Not having to worry about fan spinning faster during a game
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ahhh so comfy to my ears.


True, but you still have fans cooling the rads


----------



## ivanlabrie

I run my TY-140s at full blast and my Silver Arrow passively atm...I hate fans ramping up, fixed rpm is much better for me, noise-wise.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I went watercooling to begin with because I was annoyed by the fan noise on my 680s. I don't own $1000 headphones just so I can have audio quality ruined by fan drone.
> 
> I even have gone to the length of putting up 3" thick sound panels around my desktop for the mechanical HDD whine and the remaining 2 fans running in the case.
> 
> I like my silence


...fair enough...the 670ies I run are Direct CUii's and a GB WF3 - both non reference designs and in tests I have seen the quietest cards on the market...only in Quad-SLI does it become 'noticeable-to-annoying'...

... and of course during competitive 3D benching...but at that point the system with oc'ed CPU and GPUs is trying to get rid off up to 1100 watts on full bore - silence is not the priority then







- nor achievable


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I found it really hard, going over 50c after applying CLU on my 670 ftw's die...


wow thats darn good i only saw about a 5c drop.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I got a 15c drop on mine...I was quite pleased with it. Got to 1400mhz core but wasn't stable enough to finish 3dm11.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

how did you guys feel about CLP/CLU on the GPU die vs just regular tim, was it always more than a few C for you?
Is it false information that CLP/CLU will scratch the die over time or when removed?


----------



## ivanlabrie

False...100%

CLP/CLU won't hurt the die at all, it only melts aluminum.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> False...100%
> 
> CLP/CLU won't hurt the die at all, it only melts aluminum.


Copper is also soluble in CLU/gallium (per MSDS, CLU is gallium)

http://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1134/S0036029508060049#page-1

http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf

Nickel I can't find anything.


----------



## SonDa5

I have had no problems using CLP on die against copper or nickel plated copper in the last 6 months or so.

Also I have cleaned off CLP with alcohol off the die and it isn't hard to clean. Cleaning CLP off of copper is hard but possible.

Overall CLP has been good experience for how effective it is at cooling.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Copper is also soluble in CLU/gallium (per MSDS, CLU is gallium)
> 
> http://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1134/S0036029508060049#page-1
> 
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf
> 
> Nickel I can't find anything.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have had no problems using CLP on die against copper or nickel plated copper in the last 6 months or so.
> 
> CLP is an alloy, not pure gallium.
> And, it's okay, doesn't damage copper like it does with aluminum.
> 
> Also I have cleaned off CLP with alcohol off the die and it isn't hard to clean. Cleaning CLP off of copper is hard but possible.
> 
> Overall CLP has been good experience for how effective it is at cooling.


Same here...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have had no problems using CLP on die against copper or nickel plated copper in the last 6 months or so.
> 
> Also I have cleaned off CLP with alcohol off the die and it isn't hard to clean. Cleaning CLP off of copper is hard but possible.
> 
> Overall CLP has been good experience for how effective it is at cooling.


^^^ pretty much the same here on several machines (dies; IHS), though not with CL-P but instead with CL-U...I think folks who lapped their IHS (and in doing so removed nickel plating of the copper, or other protective coatings over copper) might have more of an issue over time


----------



## lilchronic

i think i might be able to fit a Extended-ATX in my case, what board is this in the picture i cant tell, the owner has it posted as the MVE, does that look right ?
http://cdn.overclock.net/4/4f/4f0e6f05_DSC00890.jpeg


----------



## plu2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ^^^ pretty much the same here on several machines (dies; IHS), though not with CL-P but instead with CL-U...I think folks who lapped their IHS (and in doing so removed nickel plating of the copper, or other protective coatings over copper) might have more of an issue over time


Hmm... I am having an EK Supremacy nickel plated block along with the EK PreciseMount on the way right now and am planning to use the CLU.
With this I have a few options:

Use the CLU on the naked die along with the PreciseMount
Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and then use Gelid GC Extreme between the IHS and the block to protect the block from the CLU.
Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and between the IHS and the block.
I would like to get the most out of delidding the CPU but I am also a bit concerned about damaging the block with the CLU...
Any suggestions?


----------



## ChaosAD

Atm i can do [email protected], 4,[email protected] I can sell this chip and get a new one without any extra cash. I m not really lucky with hardware though. Would you do it or shall i stay out of trouble?


----------



## TonicX

what is the name of the widows utility I use to view whea errors and such?


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Atm i can do [email protected], 4,[email protected] I can sell this chip and get a new one without any extra cash. I m not really lucky with hardware though. Would you do it or shall i stay out of trouble?


I had 3 chips ans none of them are better than the one you have. You should keep it !


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> what is the name of the widows utility I use to view whea errors and such?


event viewer


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I had 3 chips ans none of them are better than the one you have. You should keep it !


Thats my concern, if the new is no better i ll have to start the sell/buy process all over again.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Hmm... I am having an EK Supremacy nickel plated block along with the EK PreciseMount on the way right now and am planning to use the CLU.
> With this I have a few options:
> 
> Use the CLU on the naked die along with the PreciseMount
> Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and then use Gelid GC Extreme between the IHS and the block to protect the block from the CLU.
> Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and between the IHS and the block.
> I would like to get the most out of delidding the CPU but I am also a bit concerned about damaging the block with the CLU...
> Any suggestions?


...on one machine (delidded 3770K), I use '3'...on another (3970X) CLU on the IHS...the nickel plating of the EK block should work fine with CL-U...the rest of the machines use MX4 which is not at CL's performance level but close (within 3- 4 C or so...type in 'MX4 and Coollaboratory Pro and Ultra' in YouTube )


----------



## sp00n82

4.7GHz is already on the winning side of the lottery.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> I had 3 chips ans none of them are better than the one you have. You should keep it !


...right - the 4.8 v numbers are not bad and can probably be improved with solid cooling (and certainly delidding if the owner is up for it)...besides, you never know what you get the next time around...


----------



## ChaosAD

Already under custom water and dellided. I can also do 4,[email protected] but i want t stay under 1.4v cause i fold 24/7. 5Ghz is another story, i need almost 1,49v to be fully stable although my temps dont even reach 60c. But i was hopping for a 5+Ghz chip u know, Like everyone else do


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Already under custom water and dellided. I can also do 4,[email protected] but i want t stay under 1.4v cause i fold 24/7. 5Ghz is another story, i need almost 1,49v to be fully stable although my temps dont even reach 60c. But i was hopping for a 5+Ghz chip u know, Like everyone else do


My 1.575V says "hi".









I tried everything I could to finagle a lower voltage...pwm, pll, etc. If voltage were crack, then my chip is a crackhead. Still my peak temperature is in the 80's.

Once I move houses I'll give chilled water a shot (around -15C). I'm willing to go up to 1.75V. Don't really care if the chip breaks, I just want to prove a point.


----------



## snowfree52

guys, when the motherboard is in offset mode with a defined multiplier (let's say 47) and you want to apply another multiplier, you need to go back to manual Vcore, find the right one, recalculate the offset etc ... or can you just up the multiplier and the offset calculates automatically ?


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> My 1.575V says "hi".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tried everything I could to finagle a lower voltage...pwm, pll, etc. If voltage were crack, then my chip is a crackhead. Still my peak temperature is in the 80's.
> 
> Once I move houses I'll give chilled water a shot (around -15C). I'm willing to go up to 1.75V. Don't really care if the chip breaks, I just want to prove a point.


I get your point, LOL! You run 1.575 daily? Then my 5Ghz/1,5v chip is golden


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> My 1.575V says "hi".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tried everything I could to finagle a lower voltage...pwm, pll, etc. If voltage were crack, then my chip is a crackhead. Still my peak temperature is in the 80's.
> 
> Once I move houses I'll give chilled water a shot (around -15C). I'm willing to go up to 1.75V. Don't really care if the chip breaks, I just want to prove a point.
> 
> 
> 
> I get your point, LOL! You run 1.575 daily? Then my 5Ghz/1,5v chip is golden
Click to expand...

With Haswell coming up, there's 2 scenarios:

(Assuming 5.5 Ghz is even possible with my chip. I'll probably aim for 101*55 for 5555 just to be kewl







)

Chip breaks, I upgrade to Haswell. 5 Ghz there is as good as 5.5 Ghz Ivy. No performance lost.

Chip doesn't break, 5.5 Ghz Ivy is as good as 5 Ghz Haswell and I don't have to bother upgrading. No performance missed.

Either way I get to proof-of-concept my waterchilling method (chilled radiator + 23 gallon reservoir, dehumidified air, etc), have one of the highest 24/7 overclocks around here, and see how much voltage really affects degradation.


----------



## fnarfbargle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I used rubber gloves whenever I handled it to avoid static and any dirt/oils that are always present on your hands, and I treated it extremely gently at all times.


Either you have a great source of conductive rubber gloves or you misunderstand static electricity. Dirt and oils can be removed with alcohol, but putting a dielectric between you and the chip does exactly the opposite to "avoid static"


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnarfbargle*
> 
> Either you have a great source of conductive rubber gloves or you misunderstand static electricity. Dirt and oils can be removed with alcohol, but putting a dielectric between you and the chip does exactly the opposite to "avoid static"


It's really not his fault, it is a common misconception around here that rubber gloves will prevent static discharge for some reason. You are definetly correct though and that is why no matter what I'm doing (even putting on a crossfire bridge) I am always wearing my anit-static bracelet. Thanks for bringing this up because I was going to talk about it one day, but it totally escaped my mind.

*Rubber gloves will let you build up a static charge that WILL fry your motherboard, CPU, etc.*


----------



## illuz

OCN name: illuz
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: Same
OC after delid: 4.7GHz
Temp drops: 25'c

Prime95 stress testing and I'm at 72 max.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> OCN name: illuz
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: Same
> OC after delid: 4.7GHz
> Temp drops: 25'c
> 
> Prime95 stress testing and I'm at 72 max.


Wow lots of new blood lately! Congrats & welcome! Valgaur will probably add you sometime today.


----------



## illuz

Cheers bud. lurked here for a while, thought it's about time I posted. Very informative boards!



^ just to clarify, dunno whether I needed to show proof etc. I'll be changing this K2 out for a custom CPU loop in a few month, looking forward to those temperatures


----------



## Scott1541

Hi guys, my PC won't boot with 2 sticks of RAM in. Anyone come across this before or know why this is? I don't see how delidding a CPU can cause my PC not to boot with 2 sticks of RAM.


----------



## Slavkoza

Wow nice results! is it worth to delid a sandy chip? I would like to try if the improvement is significant...


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slavkoza*
> 
> Wow nice results! is it worth to delid a sandy chip? I would like to try if the improvement is significant...


Sandys are soldered on aren't they?

Also I've got an update to my problem. I can boot with 2 sticks, just not with dual channel


----------



## alancsalt

ram control (IMC) is on the processor, so I would guess you must have nicked it on a corner delidding?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Hi guys, my PC won't boot with 2 sticks of RAM in. Anyone come across this before or know why this is? I don't see how delidding a CPU can cause my PC not to boot with 2 sticks of RAM.


Yeah, check the PCB around the die for any nicks or scratches. Sometimes you accidently scratch the PCB and it can have side-effects like a damaged IMC. Or it could just be the pins in your LGA socket, maybe something got bent as you removed and replaced the CPU. Check very carefully for bent pins and scratches. Once you find one of them, or both, let us know and we'll give you the procedure to fix it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Slavkoza*
> 
> Wow nice results! is it worth to delid a sandy chip? I would like to try if the improvement is significant...


DO NOT ATTEMPT TO DELID A SANDY. They are soldered to the die. This will ruin your chip. Do not do it.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> ram control (IMC) is on the processor, so I would guess you must have nicked it on a corner delidding?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah, check the PCB around the die for any nicks or scratches. Sometimes you accidently scratch the PCB and it can have side-effects like a damaged IMC. Or it could just be the pins in your LGA socket, maybe something got bent as you removed and replaced the CPU. Check very carefully for bent pins and scratches. Once you find one of them, or both, let us know and we'll give you the procedure to fix it.


I delidded using the vice and hammer method, so I wouldn't expect and cuts into the PCB, although I tightened the vice a bit too much and there's a few marks on the IHS. I wouldn't expect that to cause any problem though. I looked over it once before installing it again but I don't remember seeing anything abnormal, everything looked alright to me. I might take it out again for another inspection.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Atm i can do [email protected], 4,[email protected] I can sell this chip and get a new one without any extra cash. I m not really lucky with hardware though. Would you do it or shall i stay out of trouble?


Buy new one, test it, return or sell if it sucks...Then decide wether to sell your current one or not.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Hmm... I am having an EK Supremacy nickel plated block along with the EK PreciseMount on the way right now and am planning to use the CLU.
> With this I have a few options:
> 
> Use the CLU on the naked die along with the PreciseMount
> Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and then use Gelid GC Extreme between the IHS and the block to protect the block from the CLU.
> Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and between the IHS and the block.
> I would like to get the most out of delidding the CPU but I am also a bit concerned about damaging the block with the CLU...
> Any suggestions?


I'd stick to the regular ihs in place mount with the retention mechanism and use CLU on die, and Gelid on the ihs. Also, don't spend money on that EK retention thing for direct die, it's money wasted.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> I delidded using the vice and hammer method, so I wouldn't expect and cuts into the PCB, although I tightened the vice a bit too much and there's a few marks on the IHS. I wouldn't expect that to cause any problem though. I looked over it once before installing it again but I don't remember seeing anything abnormal, everything looked alright to me. I might take it out again for another inspection.


Were you loading with defaults or overclock settings? Have you tried flashing your bios? Checked for bent pins in the socket?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

*My first Phantom "mod"*

So one of the features of the MVE is the ROG Probelt. It allows you to detect your system's current voltage and OC settings with a multimeter. Before I had this case I was just running everything on boxes and had the multimeter connected the whole time. Now that I have everything in the case it restricts my use of the multimeter because I would need to take off the side panel to use it. So I came up with an idea to use a grinder to grind down some of the plastic on one of the inserts on the 5.25" bay panels. Lucky for me the front door still closes completely allowing me to use the multimeter outside of the case with the door shut. I know this isn't a special mod or anything, but it is my first and I am damn proud of it














The multimeter is a Fluke 75 and I love it. Great DMM.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yah Kepler does not need water.. will not allow u to clock any higher onlythings i can see is looks and noise.
> 
> Hd7000 Works very well with water however.


So you are still just running the boost BIOS's on your 7950's? You haven't messed with them at all?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Hi guys, my PC won't boot with 2 sticks of RAM in. Anyone come across this before or know why this is? I don't see how delidding a CPU can cause my PC not to boot with 2 sticks of RAM.


Because these chips have an IMC in them (Integrated memory controller) and I'm guessing you either nicked that part of the PCB or bent the pins in your socket. So you probably killed your dual-channel memory. I did the same thing to my first chip so I ended up having to run one stick in A2 and another stick in B2 until I got a new chip. Some people can only run one stick though so you just have to test. Try one stick in the slot farthest from the CPU and then if it boots try another stick in the one directly next to it. Sorry to hear that








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> I delidded using the vice and hammer method, so I wouldn't expect and cuts into the PCB, although I tightened the vice a bit too much and there's a few marks on the IHS. I wouldn't expect that to cause any problem though. I looked over it once before installing it again but I don't remember seeing anything abnormal, everything looked alright to me. I might take it out again for another inspection.


Considering this post I'm guessing that you bent a pin (or a couple pins) in the socket of your motherboard. Take a flashlight and look into the socket looking for anything that looks out of place. Do you have a debug on your motherboard? What code is it reading?


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Were you loading with defaults or overclock settings? Have you tried flashing your bios? Checked for bent pins in the socket?


I've checked for bent pins, and they all looked in line to me. Just now I've had the CPU out again and looked over it twice with a magnifying glass, I couldn't find any damage. Right now I'm going to have a look over the pins again, and if they are still in line I'll put it back together and try resetting the BIOS again. Then if the problem still exists I'll see if there's a new BIOS update, I'm currently running F16.

If I can't fix the problem then I'll just have to live with single channel









EDIT: I've just discovered that two pins right at the bottom of the socket appear to be grey rather than gold/brass colour, so they could have some TIM on them.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So you are still just running the boost BIOS's on your 7950's? You haven't messed with them at all?


There is no Bios u can flash over a Boost bios to fully unlock voltage control ive tried over 40.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnarfbargle*
> 
> Either you have a great source of conductive rubber gloves or you misunderstand static electricity. Dirt and oils can be removed with alcohol, but putting a dielectric between you and the chip does exactly the opposite to "avoid static"


I was overly careful when delidding both my chip, so I took my time. During that time my hands would tend to sweat, therefore wearing gloves makes perfect sense to be able to handle the chip without having to worry about it or have to clean it all off later. You are correct that my post was incomplete, I used the gloves to avoid sweat/dirt/oil transfer and an anti static wristband (that came with my handy dandy computer builder tool kit) to avoid static. I also made sure to touch something metal a few times to make sure and I did it on a nonconductive surface.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> I've checked for bent pins, and they all looked in line to me. Just now I've had the CPU out again and looked over it twice with a magnifying glass, I couldn't find any damage. Right now I'm going to have a look over the pins again, and if they are still in line I'll put it back together and try resetting the BIOS again. Then if the problem still exists I'll see if there's a new BIOS update, I'm currently running F16.
> 
> If I can't fix the problem then I'll just have to live with single channel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: I've just discovered that two pins right at the bottom of the socket appear to be grey rather than gold/brass colour, so they could have some TIM on them.


That is very possible. I would wait until someone gives you an idea of how to remove it before attempting to. Maybe if you run something small, sharp, and metal over them it will slide off. It doesn't matter if there is a little TIM in your socket as long as it doesn't affect your contact with the pins.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> There is no Bios u can flash over a Boost bios to fully unlock voltage control ive tried over 40.


Haha yea I figured I tried a couple myself and I got no where quick. I hate that they made these boost cards like that, but at the same time I love these boost cards.


----------



## Scott1541

Well then, looks like everything is working now, I've just booted up with my RAM in dual channel







I'm guessing it was either a BIOS issue, because I reset the BIOS again with both sticks in position this time, or TIM on those two pins.

Now to get my BIOS settings back in order and OC again







Then post my delid pic


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Well then, looks like everything is working now, I've just booted up with my RAM in dual channel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm guessing it was either a BIOS issue, because I reset the BIOS again with both sticks in position this time, or TIM on those two pins.
> 
> Now to get my BIOS settings back in order and OC again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then post my delid pic


Sounds good! I was just about to reply to you in the other thread I am glad you got it sorted! still going on 100% (unless its a mobo problem)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Well then, looks like everything is working now, I've just booted up with my RAM in dual channel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm guessing it was either a BIOS issue, because I reset the BIOS again with both sticks in position this time, or TIM on those two pins.
> 
> Now to get my BIOS settings back in order and OC again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then post my delid pic


Glad you got everything worked out! I know how scary those situations can be. Now have some fun!!


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Well then, looks like everything is working now, I've just booted up with my RAM in dual channel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm guessing it was either a BIOS issue, because I reset the BIOS again with both sticks in position this time, or TIM on those two pins.
> 
> Now to get my BIOS settings back in order and OC again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then post my delid pic










Good news is good!


----------



## Scott1541

Now I'm more relaxed here's my delid pic. I did it quickly on my phone as I was eager to get it back together and test. I've just ran P95, and at 4.5GHz, 1.325V I'm hitting 75°C. Before I remember at 4.4GHz, 1.27V I was getting around 80°C. There's definitely an improvement, and I've only used MX-4 for now, until I get my hands on some CLU.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys, when the motherboard is in offset mode with a defined multiplier (let's say 47) and you want to apply another multiplier, you need to go back to manual Vcore, find the right one, recalculate the offset etc ... or can you just up the multiplier and the offset calculates automatically ?


That question would best be asked in this thread:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards

You can definitely just use offset when finding your stable vCore. It is, however, better to use manual at each multiplier, then pick the multiplier you will stick with and switch to offset then.

When on offset at a given multiplier you manually type in an offset number, and that will not change automatically no matter what you do. If you go up to the next multiplier you will need to manually increase your offset number in bios.

So if you are on 4.5 at 1.25v manual, or at that 4.5 with say +.050 offset (if your VID was 1.2), then you want to try 4.6. You will need to manually change the 1.25v manual vCore to something like 1.31v, or if you are on offset you will need to manually change the +.050 offset to something like +.110.

You can do it either way, but most find it easier to stick with manual until you make your final decision on your 24/7 oc then switch to offset. Some don't use offset at all and just stick with manual, it is a personal choice.


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> That question would best be asked in this thread:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards
> 
> You can definitely just use offset when finding your stable vCore. It is, however, better to use manual at each multiplier, then pick the multiplier you will stick with and switch to offset then.
> 
> When on offset at a given multiplier you manually type in an offset number, and that will not change automatically no matter what you do. If you go up to the next multiplier you will need to manually increase your offset number in bios.
> 
> So if you are on 4.5 at 1.25v manual, or at that 4.5 with say +.050 offset (if your VID was 1.2), then you want to try 4.6. You will need to manually change the 1.25v manual vCore to something like 1.31v, or if you are on offset you will need to manually change the +.050 offset to something like +.110.
> 
> You can do it either way, but most find it easier to stick with manual until you make your final decision on your 24/7 oc then switch to offset. Some don't use offset at all and just stick with manual, it is a personal choice.


thank you very much !


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Now I'm more relaxed here's my delid pic. I did it quickly on my phone as I was eager to get it back together and test. I've just ran P95, and at 4.5GHz, 1.325V I'm hitting 75°C. Before I remember at 4.4GHz, 1.27V I was getting around 80°C. There's definitely an improvement, and I've only used MX-4 for now, until I get my hands on some CLU.
> 
> Snip


Expect another 10-15'C off of that mate! Good news on the dual channel ram working again, nightmare that.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Anyone try the OC key for the higher end ASUS boards? I know it's always better to OC in the BIOS and that probably applies to this too, right?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Copper is also soluble in CLU/gallium (per MSDS, CLU is gallium)
> 
> http://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1134/S0036029508060049#page-1
> 
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf
> 
> Nickel I can't find anything.


Solubility is a different phenomenon. Did you happen to see under what conditions this
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Copper is also soluble in CLU/gallium (per MSDS, CLU is gallium)
> 
> http://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1134/S0036029508060049#page-1
> 
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf
> 
> Nickel I can't find anything.


Are you sure that you understood the paper?


----------



## Raghar

Is there an image where Intel obviously screwed up with TIM? I need real life Ivy Bridge image for motivational poster.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Anyone try the OC key for the higher end ASUS boards? I know it's always better to OC in the BIOS and that probably applies to this too, right?


That's meant for extreme overclocking...regular 24/7 air/water overclocking is easier and better using bios and regular tools, but sometimes you need to change settings on the fly for validations and whatnot and when cooling with dry ice or ln2 timing is very important (you don't want your precious coolant to boil on you before you finish the job)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> guys, when the motherboard is in offset mode with a defined multiplier (let's say 47) and you want to apply another multiplier, you need to go back to manual Vcore, find the right one, recalculate the offset etc ... or can you just up the multiplier and the offset calculates automatically ?


...just came from ROG Asus after looking up some info and while I was looking for something else ran across their 'OC' guide for IVY 4.7 (and of course other speeds). Honestly, I have read more 'guides' on Asus IVY setup than I can list on a variety of sites and even in 3 different languages...but ultimately, I find ROG Asus information the best, not least as it has been vetted by Asus staff...so if you run an Asus board, you might want to consult here on offset, vCore etc http://rog.asus.com/i/overclocking/

...also keep in mind that *setup info has to change* as you near 5 GHz and beyond, and/or run really fast RAM. Many guides, including some at OCN, are more or less 'ok' for speeds up to 4.8 or so, but just plain 'inaccurate' when it gets to i.e. phases for CPU and DRAM above those speeds.
Whatever you work with, happy hunting for the extra GHz/giggles


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's meant for extreme overclocking...regular 24/7 air/water overclocking is easier and better using bios and regular tools, but sometimes you need to change settings on the fly for validations and whatnot and when cooling with dry ice or ln2 timing is very important (you don't want your precious coolant to boil on you before you finish the job)


...I think that's not too far from the truth...I have two OC keys for two boards, and it can be a lot of fun, but it's not really meant for 'regular overclocking' (...besides, it took me some time to locate an old PS2 keyboard you need for those in addition to USB keyboards).

...with modern boards that have DIGITAL controls of board parameters, BIOS and Win OC'ing (ie via TurboV in AISuite) is not as different as it once was 'back in the day'...in fact BIOS itself is *software* (Basic Input Output System)...further, the often-discussed Asus 'Bios bug' is simply proof that BIOS and OS based programs are far more integrated now via digital controls...Ultimately, I still use Bios for 'final oc'ing' after I used Win based TurboV to 'find my range', so to speak.

...in the end, why not try the OC key 'for fun', otherwise you'll always be thinking about it when you see the OC Key laying there


----------



## justanoldman

Sounds to me like you are calling Swag’s guide inaccurate. I will let him respond if he so wishes.


----------



## Scott1541

Hmmm.. There is a difference of 8°C between the hottest and coldest cores of my 3570K, should I reapply the TIM? In order of hottest to coldest they go 3,2,4,1.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Hmmm.. There is a difference of 8°C between the hottest and coldest cores of my 3570K, should I reapply the TIM? In order of hottest to coldest they go 3,2,4,1.


Completely normal bud. Mines about 8-10 between hottest and coldest


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Hmmm.. There is a difference of 8°C between the hottest and coldest cores of my 3570K, should I reapply the TIM? In order of hottest to coldest they go 3,2,4,1.


Middle ones are usually the hottest and I think most people have at least a 4 or 5c difference between hottest and coldest. Your 8c is not unusual, if it were over 10c then reapplying TIM, reseating the IHS, and trying for an optimal cooler mount would usually help. You can try those things, but you might only go from 8c to 5 or 6c.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Completely normal bud. Mines about 8-10 between hottest and coldest


...same here, 8 C...I think It may also depend if your have iGPU on or off - certainly makes a difference in idle watt consumption and temps


----------



## Scott1541

IGPU, now that's something I've never checked before. I'm going to assume it's enabled by default, so I'll have to disable that


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> IGPU, now that's something I've never checked before. I'm going to assume it's enabled by default, so I'll have to disable that


...as long as you have a discreet video-card or two...VirtuMVP for example etc needs iGPU, but doesn't work / work right with SLI or more more GPUs


----------



## KuuFA

Since I have a MVG is it worth it to go MVF? or should I go for Asrock OC formula? only about 20 bucks apart. Looking to get a little higher OC hopefully.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I found virtu completely useless for me...It can't be used with hwbot.
I'm not sure how it would affect input lag if you have 21ms with a Samsung "lightboost" monitor though, might be interesting to try.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I found virtu completely useless for me...It can't be used with hwbot.
> I'm not sure how it would affect input lag if you have 21ms with a Samsung "lightboost" monitor though, might be interesting to try.


...same here - it improves some benches (which is why it is flagged at 3DM11, HWBot and so forth), but in many games I have, it introduced a horrible flicker, loss of some DX 11 features etc...then there is also the $ question - I understand that the base version that comes with many mobos is still free, but updates will now cost extra (I am just going by a thread I read - I haven't used Virtu in ages







)


----------



## Scott1541

iGPU must have been disabled automatically as there was no effect on temperature at all. I think I'll wait until tomorrow and see what the temps and temp difference are like then. If there is still a difference of around 8°C then I'll reapply the TIM. Although this time I'll spread it on the die rather than putting a blob in the middle.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I found virtu completely useless for me...It can't be used with hwbot.
> I'm not sure how it would affect input lag if you have 21ms with a Samsung "lightboost" monitor though, might be interesting to try.


Agh Virtu gave me so many bugs I uninstalled it so fast and never looked back.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Since I have a MVG is it worth it to go MVF? or should I go for Asrock OC formula? only about 20 bucks apart. Looking to get a little higher OC hopefully.


If you aren't happy with the OC you are getting with the MVG I doubt any of the higher models would help. I'm sure they would a little bit and I have no facts to support this, but I would say go for the OC Formula. Or a Gigabyte board (Hokies would be so proud.... (insert crying avatar here).)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think that's not too far from the truth...I have two OC keys for two boards, and it can be a lot of fun, but it's not really meant for 'regular overclocking' (...besides, it took me some time to locate an old PS2 keyboard you need for those in addition to USB keyboards).
> 
> ...with modern boards that have DIGITAL controls of board parameters, BIOS and Win OC'ing (ie via TurboV in AISuite) is not as different as it once was 'back in the day'...in fact BIOS itself is *software* (Basic Input Output System)...further, the often-discussed Asus 'Bios bug' is simply proof that BIOS and OS based programs are far more integrated now via digital controls...Ultimately, I still use Bios for 'final oc'ing' after I used Win based TurboV to 'find my range', so to speak.
> 
> ...in the end, why not try the OC key 'for fun', otherwise you'll always be thinking about it when you see the OC Key laying there


Yea I've just heard so many bad things about overclocking in windows that I haven't even tried it, but the OC Key seems a little different than that. I think I will try it out, but I only have a USB keyboard







Thats wierd that you have to use old technology in order to use this new technology lol. Oh irony....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I've just heard so many bad things about overclocking in windows that I haven't even tried it, but the OC Key seems a little different than that. I think I will try it out, but I only have a USB keyboard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats wierd that you have to use old technology in order to use this new technology lol. Oh irony....


...here is a taste, using an MVE - this is what FtW and IvanL go through when they want to check their email








..no really


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> iGPU must have been disabled automatically as there was no effect on temperature at all. I think I'll wait until tomorrow and see what the temps and temp difference are like then. If there is still a difference of around 8°C then I'll reapply the TIM. Although this time I'll spread it on the die rather than putting a blob in the middle.


...or iGPU just sits on 'auto'...I once had a discussion with FtW about iGPU and watt usage (and thus extra heat in the iGPU section of the CPU)...the differences are minor and you can see them when you run s.th. like CPUID hardware monitor - iGPU 'on' raises idle watt /temps by just a small amount...I checked that with running identical machines (other than adding a vid card to one) in my Virtual Machine which consists of 6x 3770 (non-K, but with VT-D)...same mobo and Bios, same hardware other than the vid card...Of course, it is a bit of a red herring...while your core package might use less juice, the extra vid card still raises your system's overall power consumption...

...you may have already stated this before, but what kind of TIM are you using for your CPU die ? If it is a CL liquid metal product, you should spread it on very, very lightly - like brushing it on for a thin film.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...or iGPU just sits on 'auto'...I once had a discussion with FtW about iGPU and watt usage (and thus extra heat in the iGPU section of the CPU)...the differences are minor and you can see them when you run s.th. like CPUID hardware monitor - iGPU 'on' raises idle watt /temps by just a small amount...I checked that with running identical machines (other than adding a vid card to one) in my Virtual Machine which consists of 6x 3770 (non-K, but with VT-D)...same mobo and Bios, same hardware other than the vid card...Of course, it is a bit of a red herring...while your core package might use less juice, the extra vid card still raises your system's overall power consumption...
> 
> ...you may have already stated this before, but what kind of TIM are you using for your CPU die ? If it is a CL liquid metal product, you should spread it on very, very lightly - like brushing it on for a thin film.


Right now I'm using Arctic Cooling MX-4 as I don't have anything from Coollaboratory yet







I might not end up getting any for a few weeks, that's why I'm going to reapply the MX-4 for the time being.

Also I lied, my iGPU setting was on auto actually, but now it's on disabled.


----------



## fnarfbargle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I was overly careful when delidding both my chip, so I took my time. During that time my hands would tend to sweat, therefore wearing gloves makes perfect sense to be able to handle the chip without having to worry about it or have to clean it all off later. You are correct that my post was incomplete, I used the gloves to avoid sweat/dirt/oil transfer and an anti static wristband (that came with my handy dandy computer builder tool kit) to avoid static. I also made sure to touch something metal a few times to make sure and I did it on a nonconductive surface.


No, no, no, no, no. You used insulated gloves, and a non-conductive surface. There is a reason we use conductive mats on our desks for ESD protection. If you want to wear gloves, use something natural that does not promote the generation of static electricity. The fact you put a band on means nothing if you are wearing an insulator, it just means one side of the capacitor that is your hands is earthed. You want your hands to be conductive, your desk to be conductive and your tools to be conductive. Touching some earthed metal with your insulated gloves is nothing more than superstition. You are discharging that particular spot on your gloves, but there is nothing to conduct any other static to earth.

I know these chips are pretty rugged, and you obviously took some precautions, but please try to understand that the weak links in your protection chain mean it is (a) incomplete, and (b) potentially worse than having no protection at all. Rubber gloves are never good with electronics unless they are conductive ( and for all forms of gloves found by anyone on this board they are _never_ conductive ). If you want to use gloves, use cotton.

Have a read of this : http://www.sony.net/Products/SC-HP/tec/catalog/pdf/chapter4_e_201108.pdf


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's meant for extreme overclocking...regular 24/7 air/water overclocking is easier and better using bios and regular tools, but sometimes you need to change settings on the fly for validations and whatnot and when cooling with dry ice or ln2 timing is very important (you don't want your precious coolant to boil on you before you finish the job)


I agree with you.

BIOS setings for stability to protect OS and data on 24/7 system.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnarfbargle*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> No, no, no, no, no. You used insulated gloves, and a non-conductive surface. There is a reason we use conductive mats on our desks for ESD protection. If you want to wear gloves, use something natural that does not promote the generation of static electricity. The fact you put a band on means nothing if you are wearing an insulator, it just means one side of the capacitor that is your hands is earthed. You want your hands to be conductive, your desk to be conductive and your tools to be conductive. Touching some earthed metal with your insulated gloves is nothing more than superstition. You are discharging that particular spot on your gloves, but there is nothing to conduct any other static to earth.
> 
> I know these chips are pretty rugged, and you obviously took some precautions, but please try to understand that the weak links in your protection chain mean it is (a) incomplete, and (b) potentially worse than having no protection at all. Rubber gloves are never good with electronics unless they are conductive ( and for all forms of gloves found by anyone on this board they are _never_ conductive ). If you want to use gloves, use cotton.
> 
> Have a read of this : http://www.sony.net/Products/SC-HP/tec/catalog/pdf/chapter4_e_201108.pdf


So you are saying that wearing a properly grounded anti static wrist band, and touching metal with your skin (never said I touched my glove) will be completely negated by wearing vinyl gloves?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...here is a taste, using an MVE - this is what FtW and IvanL go through when they want to check their email
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..no really


Thats pretty damn awesome. I want to build a case with a LN2 funnel on the top that feeds it to the CPU, but I'm sure people do it in open air because it will ruin the other components, right?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Thats pretty damn awesome. I want to build a case with a LN2 funnel on the top that feeds it to the CPU, but I'm sure people do it in open air because it will ruin the other components, right?


..."Dragon skin"" etc - for anything that is more than a little below ambient temps, you really need to think about insulating everything...there are LN2 experts here...and who knows, may be one day we even get one who does liquid Helium


----------



## fnarfbargle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So you are saying that wearing a properly grounded anti static wrist band, and touching metal with your skin (never said I touched my glove) will be completely negated by wearing vinyl gloves?


Not completely, but enough to be significant. You've moored you boat with really strong chain, but you've tied the chain to the jetty with dental floss.

Semiconductor handling gloves have strands of carbon woven into them to make them dissipative. Any synthetic surface *will* generate static, it's just a matter of how much and how fast. Cotton gloves don't generate static, but they can be a bear to work with and can saturate with sweat.

ESD matts are expensive. Metal cake tins make excellent anti ESD work surfaces if they are earthed. I've also got a stack of anti static foam sheets I use when I do sensitive stuff. I'm not saying dont take precautions, but you need to watch the weak links in the chain. In the wrong circumstances, you can generate lots of volts with rubber gloves, and that undoes all the good of wearing a strap. The charge develops on the outer skin of the glove and just dumps into whatever you touch with it. No snap, no crackle and no pop, just damaged gate layers.

While We are talking about it, bare feet on un-painted concrete floors are much cheaper than ESD matts and booties. Concrete is (relatively) very conductive.

Best thing you can do around home is wear natural fibers and have bare feet.


----------



## netminder1976

OCN name: netminder1976
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: XSPC K2
Mhz gained: Same
OC after delid: 4.5GHz (gonna try higher) at 1.29v
Temp drops: 24'c


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Right now I'm using Arctic Cooling MX-4 as I don't have anything from Coollaboratory yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I might not end up getting any for a few weeks, that's why I'm going to reapply the MX-4 for the time being.
> 
> Also I lied, my iGPU setting was on auto actually, but now it's on disabled.


...I bought six 'tubes' of CL Pro and CL U...ended up never using the Pro yet, but am a happy user of CL U...all that said, MX4 is my basic standby - very good in its own right. Here is a vid by a well-known Brazilan over-clocker (it's in Portuguese, but fairly obvious) who compares MX4, CL Pro and CL U. Now, others may have different results, but the point is that MX4 is very good for a non-LM product...there is other good stufff, such as Gelid and the stuff NVidia highly recommends


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> OCN name: illuz
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: Same
> OC after delid: 4.7GHz
> Temp drops: 25'c
> 
> Prime95 stress testing and I'm at 72 max.


Welcome! You Sir are the 100th member! (bout time we got to 100)







Just kidding show off your stuff by wearing your Sig now!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Wow lots of new blood lately! Congrats & welcome! Valgaur will probably add you sometime today.


Yessir I check daily








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *netminder1976*
> 
> OCN name: netminder1976
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: XSPC K2
> Mhz gained: Same
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz (gonna try higher) at 1.29v
> Temp drops: 24'c


You're In!







Throw caution to the wind and show your techiness with the Sig!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnarfbargle*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Not completely, but enough to be significant. You've moored you boat with really strong chain, but you've tied the chain to the jetty with dental floss.
> 
> Semiconductor handling gloves have strands of carbon woven into them to make them dissipative. Any synthetic surface *will* generate static, it's just a matter of how much and how fast. Cotton gloves don't generate static, but they can be a bear to work with and can saturate with sweat.
> 
> ESD matts are expensive. Metal cake tins make excellent anti ESD work surfaces if they are earthed. I've also got a stack of anti static foam sheets I use when I do sensitive stuff. I'm not saying dont take precautions, but you need to watch the weak links in the chain. In the wrong circumstances, you can generate lots of volts with rubber gloves, and that undoes all the good of wearing a strap. The charge develops on the outer skin of the glove and just dumps into whatever you touch with it. No snap, no crackle and no pop, just damaged gate layers.
> 
> While We are talking about it, bare feet on un-painted concrete floors are much cheaper than ESD matts and booties. Concrete is (relatively) very conductive.
> 
> Best thing you can do around home is wear natural fibers and have bare feet


Thanks. Helpful info.
I have never actually hurt anything with a static discharge, but I have gotten shocked touching metal right before I was about to grab on of my components. How worried, in real life, do we have to be about hurting our home built pcs with static?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks. Helpful info.
> I have never actually hurt anything with a static discharge, but I have gotten shocked touching metal right before I was about to grab on of my components. How worried, in real life, do we have to be about hurting our home built pcs with static?


It really is a rare occurance, but it is better to wrap it up rather than have a baby if you catch my drift.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I bought six 'tubes' of CL Pro and CL U...ended up never using the Pro yet, but am a happy user of CL U...all that said, MX4 is my basic standby - very good in its own right. Here is a vid by a well-known Brazilan over-clocker (it's in Portuguese, but fairly obvious) who compares MX4, CL Pro and CL U. Now, others may have different results, but the point is that MX4 is very good for a non-LM product...there is other good stufff, such as Gelid and the stuff NVidia highly recommends


No anti-static bracelet!!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Sandys are soldered on aren't they?
> 
> Also I've got an update to my problem. I can boot with 2 sticks, just not with dual channel


I was going to say keep working with the mounting pressure, but looks like you got it solved in a later post, nice!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Anyone try the OC key for the higher end ASUS boards? I know it's always better to OC in the BIOS and that probably applies to this too, right?


As Ivan said, mostly for extreme overclocking. It isn't bad for testing as well, if testing in windows fails but doesn't crash, you can just make changes in windows & keep on testing, then when done reboot & make the changes in bios.
z77 boots fast, I miss the delete key at the right moment so often when I want to get into bios....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Since I have a MVG is it worth it to go MVF? or should I go for Asrock OC formula? only about 20 bucks apart. Looking to get a little higher OC hopefully.


If you have the mvg I'd try the formula OC for something new. Mvf is pretty much the same as mvg with more room.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Thats pretty damn awesome. I want to build a case with a LN2 funnel on the top that feeds it to the CPU, but I'm sure people do it in open air because it will ruin the other components, right?


Might get everything too cold. The cpu loves the cold, sometimes the caps & other components don't like it as much, frozen caps can get flakey.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks. Helpful info.
> I have never actually hurt anything with a static discharge, but I have gotten shocked touching metal right before I was about to grab on of my components. How worried, in real life, do we have to be about hurting our home built pcs with static?


I walk around holding PC components a few times a week at least, for years. I touch grounded metal before grabbing it & regularly while holding & working with it. Never used gloves or an antistatic bracelet & have never hurt anything with ESD.
I do live in an area where the humidity never really gets that low, in the cold of winter it can get below 20% RH but it's usually higher. In times of low RH I do try to be more diligent with frequent grounding.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> No anti-static bracelet!!










...at least when applying the 'stuff', he has the CPU is on an anti-static pad... but that wasn't really the point of the video


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> No anti-static bracelet!!


Real men don't need anti-static wristbands/bracelets







I've never bothered with them either, I just try to ensure I'm working on a non-conductive surface and if possible, the thing I'm working on is earthed.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...at least when applying the 'stuff', he has the CPU is on an anti-static pad... but that wasn't really the point of the video


Hehehehe I know I just had to say it since that has been on the agenda of topics today.


----------



## lilchronic

lol all this anti static stuff and i just rememberd FTW420 washes mobo's with soap and water


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol all this anti static stuff and i just rememberd FTW420 washes mobo's with soap and water


Once a component is soldered down to a pcb then it's pretty hard to destroy with static. As told to me by a tech who's worked with this stuff for 40 years.

I wear nylon gloves dipped with foamed nitrile. More grip, less fingerprints. Love those gloves with a passion. I wear them working on my car, I wear them working on my computer. They make gloves with silver threads woven into the fabric for anti-static, but I don't want to spend $7 a pair when they're semi-disposable.


----------



## Valgaur

Well I'm finally getting to drawing my design so you guys can see my craziness


----------



## dr/owned

^^ It can't be any worse looking that what I've got going on in and around my case. Built for easy of use, not for looks.:


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well I'm finally getting to drawing my design so you guys can see my craziness


WOOT WOOT


----------



## stickg1

I just cover my hands and fingers in peanut butter. Not really for anti-static but it makes my components delicious. Also one of my kids has a dangerous curiosity but also a peanut allergy so if he touches my stuff he gets a rash and I can say "DAMN KIDS! I told you to stay away from my puter!! RABBLE [email protected]!"


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well I'm finally getting to drawing my design so you guys can see my craziness


...but can it play Crysis 8 ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hehehehe I know I just had to say it since that has been on the agenda of topics today.


...I know - and it was funny ...one man's static discharge is another man's bright idea


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol all this anti static stuff and i just rememberd FTW420 washes mobo's with soap and water


Reggie from the bench team puts them in the dishwasher, lazy...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well I'm finally getting to drawing my design so you guys can see my craziness


Nice, hope to see some insanity in there!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ It can't be any worse looking that what I've got going on in and around my case. Built for easy of use, not for looks.:


I like this. I started off planning to build a pretty rig when I first joined OCN, but I like to change & tinker with things too much, trying to make a rig look nice has become a futile effort.
Fast & ugly over average but pretty! Some guys can pull off a good amount of both simultaneously, but then a simple cpu swap becomes a bigger job.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lol had two people on YouTube now tell me I'm an idiot for risking my i7's life and de-lidding...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Lol had two people on YouTube now tell me I'm an idiot for risking my i7's life and de-lidding...


FX owners.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Lol had two people on YouTube now tell me I'm an idiot for risking my i7's life and de-lidding...


Yeah you're crazy dude. I don't know anyone that would attempt a stunt like that.

You ready for the decimation of the City Folk tomorrow at Old Trafford?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> FX owners.


LOL

"I would never delid a CPU! Especially a $300 i7. I spent $250 on my Crosshair V Formula but totally got a bargain on my FX-8350. Silly i7 owners and their benchmarks. Who needs benchmarks when you have cores?"


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Lol had two people on YouTube now tell me I'm an idiot for risking my i7's life and de-lidding...


Some people are jerks, just have to ignore them. Even here we have those obviously over compensating for some personal shortcoming by putting down others. If putting down someone makes you feel like more of a man, then you weren't much a man to begin with.


----------



## Valgaur

Gonna work on the rest of the drawings after I finish homework


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna work on the rest of the drawings after I finish homework


Do not need cd rom drive.. i do not use one.. if i need it ill plug it in.. then un plug it again lol no reason to use those ugly things.

Lambo door eh?
Do double lambo doors!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Oh don't worry I troll them, and more so, most of them have no idea what they're on about









@val - that design is looking cool bro!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna work on the rest of the drawings after I finish homework


...looks cool !







So you have the mobo tray running at a 45 degree angle, rising towards the back ? If so, you could put PSU and fans underneath the 'high end'


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Do not need cd rom drive.. i do not use one.. if i need it ill plug it in.. then un plug it again lol no reason to use those ugly things.
> 
> Lambo door eh?
> Do double lambo doors!


My first design had that implied but the Rad layout would have been messy and not very good this way I can have everything hidden and see just the tubing and everything I want to see








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...looks cool !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So you have the mobo tray running at a 45 degree angle, rising towards the back ? If so, you could put PSU and fans underneath the 'high end'


Thats the plan lol dual PSU's and hide all the cabling and make it come through nice and cleanly


----------



## stickg1

What type of wood? You gonna paint it or stain it?

You're a cool dude Val but those drawing skills are kind of busted


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What type of wood? You gonna paint it or stain it?
> 
> You're a cool dude Val but those drawing skills are kind of busted


Shut up I haven't drawn in around 8 years feels good to get back into it lol, I used to be a huge art nut (more of just making things not going super crazy art man wise)

I'm really not sure on wood yet I'd like a dark wood like redwood or maybe stained oak, really not sure though.,... tiger wood would be sooooo epic









any recommendations?


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/470#post_19702074

Hammer+Clamp








Interesting journey along the way of completing the process

After all said and done, CLU on inside die, PK3 on outside, watercooled

4.5Ghz 1.34v was at high 70's some cores 80's max stress test.
Now I can't break 60C on any core on any stress test


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/470#post_19702074
> 
> Hammer+Clamp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting journey along the way of completing the process
> 
> After all said and done, CLU on inside die, PK3 on outside, watercooled
> 
> 4.5Ghz 1.34v was at high 70's some cores 80's max stress test.
> Now I can't break 60C on any core on any stress test


Congrats !







How long did the hammer and clamp take you...how many 'hits' ? I have a razor-delidded 3770K but may get another 'K' I would delid in a few months, once more is known about Haswell (or perhaps we can even delid Haswells ?)


----------



## fnarfbargle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Thanks. Helpful info.
> I have never actually hurt anything with a static discharge, but I have gotten shocked touching metal right before I was about to grab on of my components. How worried, in real life, do we have to be about hurting our home built pcs with static?


Well, it's a really interesting question. I use all my ESD gear when working on other peoples gear, but it when it comes to my own I just go bare feet and keep brushing the (a) chassis. I don't _think_ I've ever damaged anything. Having said that, ESD damage is so insidious it can take years to surface, so I don't really know.

My gut feeling says as long as you don't do your pc work on rayon shag pile carpet while wearing a polyester leisure suit you'll probably be ok.

I wasn't trying to be a prick, I just wanted to try and correct the perception that rubber gloves protected against static. I can get a bit passionate about things sometimes and I apologies if I came across as rude.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna work on the rest of the drawings after I finish homework


It kinda reminds me of what I built (in) one night:



You're ahead of me though, you have a drawing and I was freestyling it


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnarfbargle*
> 
> Well, it's a really interesting question. I use all my ESD gear when working on other peoples gear, but it when it comes to my own I just go bare feet and keep brushing the (a) chassis. I don't _think_ I've ever damaged anything. Having said that, ESD damage is so insidious it can take years to surface, so I don't really know.
> 
> My gut feeling says as long as you don't do your pc work on rayon shag pile carpet while wearing a polyester leisure suit you'll probably be ok.
> 
> I wasn't trying to be a prick, I just wanted to try and correct the perception that rubber gloves protected against static. I can get a bit passionate about things sometimes and I apologies if I came across as rude.


Thanks, I appreciate all the info.
You came off as little rude, but you more than made up for it with helpful and directly useful information.
+rep


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Shut up I haven't drawn in around 8 years feels good to get back into it lol, I used to be a huge art nut (more of just making things not going super crazy art man wise)
> 
> I'm really not sure on wood yet I'd like a dark wood like redwood or maybe stained oak, really not sure though.,... tiger wood would be sooooo epic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any recommendations?


I guess it depends what you can get out there. I was talking with this one guy that lives in Maine and they have mahogany out the ass, kind of like down here in South Carolina cypress and poplar are really common.

Since you have such large panels you might be better off getting a 5/8-3/4 veneered piece of plywood. You can get it in all types of wood. Then you might have to get some edge banding or trim out the ends.

Otherwise if you did it out of solid cut boards you would have the task of jointing them together into a panel and planing all the joints, which might take just as long as the entire building process!

Did you say your dad or someone in your family does woodwork? Ask what they carry at the local lumber yard. You can always special order stuff but I recommend getting a list of exactly how much you need because it's expensive. At my yard it takes a few weeks sometimes and you can't take back anything you don't use that is special order.

But if you want it a dark stain, try some red oak, walnut, mahogany, you might even be able to get some cedar or redwood which should be marginally cheaper than the other woods mentioned.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I guess it depends what you can get out there. I was talking with this one guy that lives in Maine and they have mahogany out the ass, kind of like down here in South Carolina cypress and poplar are really common.
> 
> Since you have such large panels you might be better off getting a 5/8-3/4 veneered piece of plywood. You can get it in all types of wood. Then you might have to get some edge banding or trim out the ends.
> 
> Otherwise if you did it out of solid cut boards you would have the task of jointing them together into a panel and planing all the joints, which might take just as long as the entire building process!
> 
> Did you say your dad or someone in your family does woodwork? Ask what they carry at the local lumber yard. You can always special order stuff but I recommend getting a list of exactly how much you need because it's expensive. At my yard it takes a few weeks sometimes and you can't take back anything you don't use that is special order.
> 
> But if you want it a dark stain, try some red oak, walnut, mahogany, you might even be able to get some cedar or redwood which should be marginally cheaper than the other woods mentioned.


/Mahogany would be my favorite honestly, that nice rich wood color is awesome and I'l get panels not boards and do it one by one lol


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Congrats !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How long did the hammer and clamp take you...how many 'hits' ? I have a razor-delidded 3770K but may get another 'K' I would delid in a few months, once more is known about Haswell (or perhaps we can even delid Haswells ?)


first 5 hits didnt work, i didnt have something securing the clamp, it was heavy but not enough, i put a flat weight against the edge of the oven which made it not move then i got it off in 3 whacks









i must of hit the thing 10 times though, i wasnt thrilled about it not coming off on the first few whacks... i mean, ultimately im sitting there hitting a wood block against my PCB


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna work on the rest of the drawings after I finish homework


I posted my reply on the case design thread:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball/10#post_19702430


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/470#post_19702074
> 
> Hammer+Clamp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting journey along the way of completing the process
> 
> After all said and done, CLU on inside die, PK3 on outside, watercooled
> 
> 4.5Ghz 1.34v was at high 70's some cores 80's max stress test.
> Now I can't break 60C on any core on any stress test


Nice job bud! Glad to see you have finally joined the club!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> first 5 hits didnt work, i didnt have something securing the clamp, it was heavy but not enough, i put a flat weight against the edge of the oven which made it not move then i got it off in 3 whacks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i must of hit the thing 10 times though, i wasnt thrilled about it not coming off on the first few whacks... i mean, ultimately im sitting there hitting a wood block against my PCB


...tx







- and I am not certain that slicing a processor assembly open with a razor blade is that much saner than hitting it with wood block against its PCB







.but since I already did the razor thing, I might try the wood block / hammer / vise thing on the next one


----------



## jdm317

Newegg is doing 20% off the 3770k with promo code right now.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Newegg is doing 20% off the 3770k with promo code right now.


Still more expensive than Microcenter's $229 price. Though its in store pickup only. BUT if youre close to a best buy, show them MC's price theyll price match it for you and order it for free.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Shut up I haven't drawn in around 8 years feels good to get back into it lol, I used to be a huge art nut (more of just making things not going super crazy art man wise)
> 
> I'm really not sure on wood yet I'd like a dark wood like redwood or maybe stained oak, really not sure though.,... tiger wood would be sooooo epic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any recommendations?


see if there is a ROCKLER WOODWORKING in your area they have a little outlet in a stripmall nearby so I can just walk in and get whatever I want in any quantity. I find mahogany, cedar and redwood on the lighter softer end of the spectrum. I am in love with cocobolo(rich grainy darkbrowns), zebra wood(B&W), black walnut, my day job is in a woodshop and its just me and the master cabinetmaker, I don't use stains (That's my signature) but to each his own- Jacobean is the name of a dark rich color that makes any wood almost like ebony... que song ... yeah that's it stevie. I also like benke it sort of orangeish, theres purple heart(duh) and yellow heart (duh duh) ordering wood on-line is to be avoided. Don't miss out on the selecting your own boards- it will make the final stuff more meaningful. and you can find stuff with interesting grains that you will have to see to appreciate.

Also: YOUNGBLOODS maybe a good source for exoctic hardwoods.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> see if there is a ROCKLER WOODWORKING in your area they have a little outlet in a stripmall nearby so I can just walk in and get whatever I want in any quantity. I find mahogany, cedar and redwood on the lighter softer end of the spectrum. I am in love with cocobolo(rich grainy darkbrowns), zebra wood(B&W), black walnut, my day job is in a woodshop and its just me and the master cabinetmaker, I don't use stains (That's my signature) but to each his own- Jacobean is the name of a dark rich color that makes any wood almost like ebony... que song ... yeah that's it stevie. I also like benke it sort of orangeish, theres purple heart(duh) and yellow heart (duh duh) ordering wood on-line is to be avoided. Don't miss out on the selecting your own boards- it will make the final stuff more meaningful. and you can find stuff with interesting grains that you will have to see to appreciate.
> 
> Also: YOUNGBLOODS maybe a good source for exoctic hardwoods.


that is true I might make the exterior with plains and plywood the interior


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> Still more expensive than Microcenter's $229 price. Though its in store pickup only. BUT if youre close to a best buy, show them MC's price theyll price match it for you and order it for free.


Closest Microcenter for me is in Dallas. I would end up spending the money saved in gas, and then some.







Wish it wasnt so..

So this is probably the best I can do for an unopened 3770k


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Closest Microcenter for me is in Dallas. I would end up spending the money saved in gas, and then some.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wish it wasnt so..
> 
> So this is probably the best I can do for an unopened 3770k


You have Paypal?

Be active in this club and when u want a 3770k.. Paypal somebody the $$ to go to there MC and get u one.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Newegg is doing 20% off the 3770k with promo code right now.


It's $20 and amazon is already selling it at that price.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Closest Microcenter for me is in Dallas. I would end up spending the money saved in gas, and then some.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wish it wasnt so..
> 
> So this is probably the best I can do for an unopened 3770k


What's the best price you're willing to pay for a 3770K?


----------



## DeanW75234

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Copper is also soluble in CLU/gallium (per MSDS, CLU is gallium)
> 
> http://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1134/S0036029508060049#page-1
> 
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf
> 
> Nickel I can't find anything.


You know, I just read both MSDS Sheets and didn't see any mention of solubility with copper anywhere. I've been working with these type of data sheets for over 27 years.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> It's $20 and amazon is already selling it at that price.



















Wow I feel dumb... Oh well.

I would pay 250 any day for an untouched 3770k.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> It's $20 and amazon is already selling it at that price.


Also Amazon has Prime, which is a life ruiner.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Also Amazon has Prime, which is a life ruiner.


Yeah I have prime atm. I just misread the newegg sale as 20% which would have been $65 off.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow I feel dumb... Oh well.
> 
> I would pay 250 any day for an untouched 3770k.


Lol, it's alright. Got one 3770K coming in later this week.
Could give you a good price on that one.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

INCREDIBLEHULK
Intel i7 3770k
Cool Laboratory Ultra
Prolimatech PK-3
3.5ghz to 4.5ghz
15-20C on all cores
http://valid.canardpc.com/2761771


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Closest Microcenter for me is in Dallas. I would end up spending the money saved in gas, and then some.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wish it wasnt so..
> 
> So this is probably the best I can do for an unopened 3770k


seriously... go to best buy. They sell 3770k online, BUT the STORE will order items for you and price match. I took my phone, showed the microcenter price to the store manager, he ordered the 3770K from their online store, price matched it to $229 and shipped it to my house. 0 reason to drive anywhere but to Best Buy


----------



## ivanlabrie

Best buy sounds like a good idea, for people far from MC.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Best buy sounds like a good idea, for people far from MC.


Seriously: youve seen me raving about BB stuffs over @ OCF (Im Rugscrubber). Dont know why anyone wouldnt do that if youre in the US.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> Seriously: youve seen me raving about BB stuffs over @ OCF (Im Rugscrubber). Dont know why anyone wouldnt do that if youre in the US.


Same avatar too, right?









I don't get it neither, there's gotta be a best buy around, almost anywhere, right?


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Same avatar too, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't get it neither, there's gotta be a best buy around, almost anywhere, right?


yeah same avatar. Ive spoken to a lot of people lately about best buy. They actually do a really great job of taking care of people. My brother in law went to buy a Microsoft Surface when they came out what...8 months ago? They didnt have any at the time but he needed something portable so he bought a laptop instead, the store manager wrote on his receipt that when the Surface became available they would exchange his laptop no questions asked. They just got Surface in about 2 months ago here, they gave him a full refund on his 6 month old laptop and sold him a Surface.

Thats service. Makes me want to see what else i can find online to get from them for next to nothing lol


----------



## dr/owned

I avoid doing business on electronics anywhere I'd have to pay sales tax. I heavily moved over to ebay after amazon started charging tax in my state.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I avoid doing business on electronics anywhere I'd have to pay sales tax. I heavily moved over to ebay after amazon started charging tax in my state.


pay shipping or pay sales tax, its roughly the same give or take a few dollars depending on the urgency of your purchase.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> seriously... go to best buy. They sell 3770k online, BUT the STORE will order items for you and price match. I took my phone, showed the microcenter price to the store manager, he ordered the 3770K from their online store, price matched it to $229 and shipped it to my house. 0 reason to drive anywhere but to Best Buy


Except for the fact 99% of the people there don't know any more than the average person about tech.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Except for the fact 99% of the people there don't know any more than the average person about tech.


the post had nothing to do with the technical knowledge of the employees and everything to do with the fact they will match just about any price, from any store, online or local.

I can go down the road a mile to the local "*wholesale computer supply*", a store that claims to be a one stop shop for all things "computer" (a local start up with about 10 employees mind you) and ask for a Z77 board and they look at me like Im smoking crack.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> INCREDIBLEHULK
> Intel i7 3770k
> Cool Laboratory Ultra
> Prolimatech PK-3
> 3.5ghz to 4.5ghz
> 15-20C on all cores
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2761771


YOU'RE IN MR HULK! SLAP SIG ON BUTT AND SHOW IT OFF.









Also I'mma doodle my case tomorrow during class


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> YOU'RE IN MR HULK! SLAP SIG ON BUTT AND SHOW IT OFF.


In the words of mr Dave chapelle IM RICH Female DOG! /point at laugh at Gtx 680


----------



## Qlix

i should probably put a damn validation post up huh -.-

Ill do that after i get my CLP tomorrow


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> the post had nothing to do with the technical knowledge of the employees and everything to do with the fact they will match just about any price, from any store, online or local.
> 
> I can go down the road a mile to the local "*wholesale computer supply*", a store that claims to be a one stop shop for all things "computer" (a local start up with about 10 employees mind you) and ask for a Z77 board and they look at me like Im smoking crack.


lol xD

True, happens in Argentina too...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> the post had nothing to do with the technical knowledge of the employees and everything to do with the fact they will match just about any price, from any store, online or local.
> 
> I can go down the road a mile to the local "*wholesale computer supply*", a store that claims to be a one stop shop for all things "computer" (a local start up with about 10 employees mind you) and ask for a Z77 board and they look at me like Im smoking crack.


Exactly, Best Buy a giant retailer, doesn't differ from the local shop. At least the employees who work at MC or Frys Electronics know where their hardware is. BB online/store selection is also quite bad compared to others. And most of those stores, including some online retailers match prices.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Exactly, Best Buy a giant retailer, doesn't differ from the local shop. At least the employees who work at MC or Frys Electronics know where their hardware is. BB online/store selection is also quite bad compared to others. And most of those stores, including some online retailers match prices.


so youre taking my helpful suggestion (because BB is usually in every major city across the US) and turning it into a debate about which stores are better and why? GG sir.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> so youre taking my helpful suggestion (because BB is usually in every major city across the US) and turning it into a debate about which stores are better and why? GG sir.


Your suggestion of going to a BB to match a price isn't helpful at all. As mentioned, the cheap price for the 3770k is an in store only promotion. Best Buy doesn't match things like that, no one does. The reason MC has them for cheap is because they have extra stock. Also, a place like NCIX (many others exist) matches prices online and ships ANYWHERE in the U.S/Canada. Besides that, there is no sales tax, and shipping is always free on items like the 3770k.

Overall, your post is invalid. Good night.


----------



## lilchronic

i love best buy







they got everything! we got our dishwasher from there now that i think of it lol


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Your suggestion of going to a BB to match a price isn't helpful at all. As mentioned, the cheap price for the 3770k is an in store only promotion. Best Buy doesn't match things like that, no one does. The reason MC has them for cheap is because they have extra stock. Also, a place like NCIX (many others exist) matches prices online and ships ANYWHERE in the U.S/Canada. Besides that, there is no sales tax, and shipping is always free on items like the 3770k.
> 
> Overall, your post is invalid. Good night.


I see what you are saying, he still isn't wrong. If you are good with words you might be able to get a price match at best buy.

It's actually not an in-store promotion at all, they only sell the product in-store, the same way best buy only sells certain products on-line.

There's best buy products online you can't buy in store, does that mean they wouldn't match those to a price of a product you could buy at tigerdirect's store front?


----------



## dr/owned

Threads derailing tonight:


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Your suggestion of going to a BB to match a price isn't helpful at all. As mentioned, the cheap price for the 3770k is an in store only promotion. Best Buy doesn't match things like that, no one does. The reason MC has them for cheap is because they have extra stock. Also, a place like NCIX (many others exist) matches prices online and ships ANYWHERE in the U.S/Canada. Besides that, there is no sales tax, and shipping is always free on items like the 3770k.
> 
> Overall, your post is invalid. Good night.


you are very wrong. This is EXACTLY the way i got my 3770k. Best Buy price matched MC's INSTORE ONLY price. No sweet talk, no hassle. Just a simple question.. "hey, will you do this?" "Sure thing!" Unless youve done it, or tried to do it, dont talk out of your ass. And its not even a promotion, the MC price has been that price for a very long time...


----------



## dr/owned

^^ I think he means you can't go to bestbuy and ask them to pricematch MC unless you also have an MC in your city. Every pricematch I've read says "local competitors" only.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> you are very wrong. This is EXACTLY the way i got my 3770k. Best Buy price matched MC's INSTORE ONLY price. Unless youve done it, or tried to do it, dont talk out of your ass.


It is actually quite funny because MC doesn't offer a online / in store price, its only sold in stores and only sold at that price, making it not a promotion.
But the funnier part is, best buy doesn't even have the cpu in store so it has to be placed to order online








(im assuming your best buy is like mine has 3 power supplies , 8 video cards, and 10 hard drives, then 300 tv's







)
Quote:


> What is considered a local retail competitor?
> A local retail competitor for retail store purchases is a retail store authorized by a vendor to sell a new, factory-sealed product with a warranty and is located in the same market area (within a 25 mile radius) of your local Best Buy store. A local retail competitor for BestBuy.com purchases is a retail store authorized by a vendor to sell a new, factory-sealed product with a warranty and is located in the same market area (within a 25 mile radius) as either the billing address or the shipping address on record for the purchase.


nevermind


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

double post


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ I think he means you can't go to bestbuy and ask them to pricematch MC unless you also have an MC in your city. Every pricematch I've read says "local competitors" only.


I dont have a Micro Center in my state. There isnt a Micro Center within 10 hours drive. If you read BBs "low price guarantee" it states any local competitor or qualifying online retailer. "Qualifying" is pretty much at the discretion of the store. From what i gathered from my talks with the manager... most BBs will honor MC's prices, as well as neweggs and Frys


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ I think he means you can't go to bestbuy and ask them to pricematch MC unless you also have an MC in your city. Every pricematch I've read says "local competitors" only.
> 
> 
> 
> I dont have a Micro Center in my state. There isnt a Micro Center within 10 hours drive.
Click to expand...

You might have just gotten a lax store manager:
Quote:


> If you find a lower price on a qualifying product at a *local* retail competitor?s store or a *designated* major online retailer, we will match the price. At the time of purchase, we will match the current pre-tax price for new, identical, immediately available products from a local retail competitor's store and these designated major online retailers: Amazon.com, Apple.com, Bhphotovideo.com, Buy.com, Crutchfield.com, Dell.com, Frys.com, hhgregg.com, HP.com, HomeDepot.com, Lowes.com, Newegg.com, OfficeDepot.com, OfficeMax.com, Sears.com, Staples.com, Target.com, TigerDirect.com and Walmart.com. We will match prices between our stores and BestBuy.com®. We will also match prices post purchase if we lower our price within 15 days of your purchase.


Notice, no MicroCenter.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> It is actually quite funny because MC doesn't offer a online / in store price, its only sold in stores and only sold at that price, making it not a promotion.
> But the funnier part is, best buy doesn't even have the cpu in store so it has to be placed to order online
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (im assuming your best buy is like mine has 3 power supplies , 8 video cards, and 10 hard drives, then 300 tv's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> nevermind
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i just realized the person writing the Price Guarantee page failed at proof reading and copy pasted the clause twice. lol almost as funny as typos on newegg


and yes, the store has to order the CPU for you, you pay sales tax, but no shipping.


----------



## dr/owned

BTW, what was the managers name so I can rat him out to corporate and make sure _no one_ get's good prices unless I can too.

Yeah. I'll kick over sand castles. What. Come at me.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You might have just gotten a lax store manager:
> Notice, no MicroCenter.


see edited post









He basically told me they had to match those stores, because if they didnt, they couldnt compete most of the time. So yeah... it may be in writing, but theyll do it


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> you are very wrong. This is EXACTLY the way i got my 3770k. Best Buy price matched MC's INSTORE ONLY price. No sweet talk, no hassle. Just a simple question.. "hey, will you do this?" "Sure thing!" Unless youve done it, or tried to do it, dont talk out of your ass. And its not even a promotion, the MC price has been that price for a very long time...


I never said you can't do it. I said they don't support it, MC isn't even in their retailer list. I bought a headset and it broke after the 30 day return, I bought the same one and replaced the package and returned the broken one for full money back and kept the working headset. Their employees are dumb as I mentioned, which is why BB is going bankrupt.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> I dont have a Micro Center in my state. There isnt a Micro Center within 10 hours drive. If you read BBs "low price guarantee" it states any local competitor or qualifying online retailer. "Qualifying" is pretty much at the discretion of the store. From what i gathered from my talks with the manager... most BBs will honor MC's prices, as well as neweggs and Frys


well the only way to see if this will work is to try ourselves.


----------



## dr/owned

Lucky for me I pay less for my processors than MC charges, even without tax









I had to google where the nearest best buy is from me, because I haven't needed one in years...which probably isn't a good sign for them. Unsurprisingly the google reviews are unanimously bad.


----------



## Valgaur

Enough, sheesh.....









Lets talk about..... Wood


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Enough, sheesh.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lets talk about..... Wood


...you tell'em ! Otherwise, I chime in about buying that 3970X last week...definitely not at Microcenter...and definitely not $229







but, I also hear that prices for certain types of wood are going up


----------



## codenamew

Hi guys, yesterday I have delidded my 3570 k but unfortunately I scratches the pcb. Just a minor scratches and the copper seems to be exposed. Now the closest 2 memory slot to the CPU is not working whenever I tried to put a ram on it and it shows error 55. I have read in the forum that one of the possibilities is that I have damaged the imc but I saw someone with greater scratches than mine but working fine. Another thing is that could it be due to the seating of my nh-d14? I have tighten the screw till it no longer turns. Have I done sth wrong here and should I reseat my noctua? If yes could someone pls guide me on how to reseat it ? Thanks


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *codenamew*
> 
> Hi guys, yesterday I have delidded my 3570 k but unfortunately I scratches the pcb. Just a minor scratches and the copper seems to be exposed. Now the closest 2 memory slot to the CPU is not working whenever I tried to put a ram on it and it shows error 55. I have read in the forum that one of the possibilities is that I have damaged the imc but I saw someone with greater scratches than mine but working fine. Another thing is that could it be due to the seating of my nh-d14? I have tighten the screw till it no longer turns. Have I done sth wrong here and should I reseat my noctua? If yes could someone pls guide me on how to reseat it ? Thanks


Cmos reset OK. That was what Gigabyte wrote down when I RMA-ed my board for code 55, even though the socket pins and cpu were fine.

Board came back working so maybe it was just a cmos reset that fixed it (I can't remember if I tried that or not before RMA-ing it).


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *codenamew*
> 
> Hi guys, yesterday I have delidded my 3570 k but unfortunately I scratches the pcb. Just a minor scratches and the copper seems to be exposed. Now the closest 2 memory slot to the CPU is not working whenever I tried to put a ram on it and it shows error 55. I have read in the forum that one of the possibilities is that I have damaged the imc but I saw someone with greater scratches than mine but working fine. Another thing is that could it be due to the seating of my nh-d14? I have tighten the screw till it no longer turns. Have I done sth wrong here and should I reseat my noctua? If yes could someone pls guide me on how to reseat it ? Thanks


It depends where you scratched the pcb, some scratches are not as bad as others, yours is probably in the middle of how badly it is damaged. There are some guides on how to fix it but it might not work, or destroy it completely. Check if your motherboard is bending due to the cooler pressure, it could very much cause that. I would reseat it just to make sure. Good luck


----------



## Joa3d43

*@ codenamew*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> It depends where you scratched the pcb, some scratches are not as bad as others, yours is probably in the middle of how badly it is damaged. There are some guides on how to fix it but it might not work, or destroy it completely. Check if your motherboard is bending due to the cooler pressure, it could very much cause that. I would reseat it just to make sure. Good luck


...in addition to the comments above re re-seating and so forth, you can try either MX4 or even nail polish directly on the scratch - anything to insulate the exposed copper / scratch that is usually close to the IHS


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> seriously... go to best buy. They sell 3770k online, BUT the STORE will order items for you and price match. I took my phone, showed the microcenter price to the store manager, he ordered the 3770K from their online store, price matched it to $229 and shipped it to my house. 0 reason to drive anywhere but to Best Buy


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Best buy sounds like a good idea, for people far from MC.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> Seriously: youve seen me raving about BB stuffs over @ OCF (Im Rugscrubber). Dont know why anyone wouldnt do that if youre in the US.


You serious? I'm always in Best Buy, haggling, complaining, trying to buy display models for cheap. There's only one guy that will work with me, the others are all drones. But "Tom", (I think that's his name) is a decent dude. He got me this monitor for 15% off. But sometimes Best Buy has some crazy clearance sales in the PC components sections. I've bought 2 Kuhler 620's there for $40 each, 6 tubes of Antec Formula 7 for $6.50 a tube, 3 BNIB PNY GTX 560ti OCs for $125 each, and 2 EVGA GTX560 2GB's for $108 each.

But yeah, I think I'm going to go for a 3770K.


----------



## Scott1541

I've just reapplied TIM and there are improvements







The maximum temperature has dropped by 1°C, and the difference between hottest and coldest cores has dropped to 6-7°C. There could be room for further improvement even with MX-4, but I'm not complaining


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *codenamew*
> 
> Hi guys, yesterday I have delidded my 3570 k but unfortunately I scratches the pcb. Just a minor scratches and the copper seems to be exposed. Now the closest 2 memory slot to the CPU is not working whenever I tried to put a ram on it and it shows error 55. I have read in the forum that one of the possibilities is that I have damaged the imc but I saw someone with greater scratches than mine but working fine. Another thing is that could it be due to the seating of my nh-d14? I have tighten the screw till it no longer turns. Have I done sth wrong here and should I reseat my noctua? If yes could someone pls guide me on how to reseat it ? Thanks


I did that same thing man. Your IMC is toast OR you bent some pins in your CPU socket.


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I did that same thing man. Your IMC is toast OR you bent some pins in your CPU socket.


roll queen music now: ... And another one bites the dust...

Hammer 100%!


----------



## Scott1541

I bet Intel loves delidding. It voids warranties so less chips to replace and it kills some chips so consumers have to buy more


----------



## Hokies83

de lidding did not kill my warranty lapping the IHS did.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> de lidding did not kill my warranty lapping the IHS did.


So intel will actually replace a chip that has been delidded, providing the IHS is still intact?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> So intel will actually replace a chip that has been delidded, providing the IHS is still intact?


Ocn TOS does not allow us to openly Discuss that.







Has to be took to PM.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ocn TOS does not allow us to openly Discuss that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Has to be took to PM.


So you're basically saying it can't be done legitimately?


----------



## illuz

My max temps during gaming are about 60'C - If I were to move to a monsta 240 rad and a custom cpu loop, what would I be looking at for max loads?









Got the EK block & fittings on the way. Also would I be even better off going direct-die water-cooling, or just leaving the IHS and CPU bracket in place? Was thinking about getting the EK Precision Mount Ivy kit.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> So you're basically saying it can't be done legitimately?


No it can't, and you can't talk about RMA fraud on the site.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> My max temps during gaming are about 60'C - If I were to move to a monsta 240 rad and a custom cpu loop, what would I be looking at for max loads?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got the EK block & fittings on the way. Also would I be even better off going direct-die water-cooling, or just leaving the IHS and CPU bracket in place? Was thinking about getting the EK Precision Mount Ivy kit.


What multiplier and voltage are you running? I think your cooler is equivalent to a NH-D14 correct? Standard water cooling is not going to do much better for temps than a good air cooler.

Lots of opinions about direct die, but if you get that new kit I think that eliminates some of the risks and problems associated with it. I would like to know how it performs if anyone here tests it.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Lots of opinions about direct die, but if you get that new kit I think that eliminates some of the risks and problems associated with it. I would like to know how it performs if anyone here tests it.


I've been running direct die mount for almost 6 months with my own mount and the temps and performance is great.
My thread on my direct die mount:
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2775935&postcount=94

I think physics can prove that eliminating the IHS and mounting direct die properly is better for cooling. I never used the IHS so I have no before and after tests to show but I'm sure people will be posting tests like this soon now that EK made a direct die mounting kit.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I've been running direct die mount for almost 6 months with my own mount and the temps and performance is great.
> My thread on my direct die mount:
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2775935&postcount=94
> 
> I think physics can prove that eliminating the IHS and mounting direct die properly is better for cooling. I never used the IHS so I have no before and after tests to show but I'm sure people will be posting tests like this soon now that EK made a direct die mounting kit.


So you get those amazing temps with just normal watercooling? What temps did you get with IHS after delid if you tried it.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So you get those amazing temps with just normal watercooling? What temps did you get with IHS after delid if you tried it.


Amazing? Seem a little high for direct die.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Amazing? Seem a little high for direct die.


My chip ran very hot to begin with and I debated whether to sell it and get another or delid for a few months before I finally delidded.

I went straight to direct die since to me it seems like removing the IHS allows better thermal transfer from die directly to water block.

Never tested with IHS so I can't provide any comparison temps for my die but to me direct die seems like it will work better and if somebody knows the mathematical physics behind it I think the benefits could be shown with math.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Amazing? Seem a little high for direct die.


Compared to with the IHS it is amazing. It is basically a free 30-50 drop since you already delidded.


----------



## codenamew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I did that same thing man. Your IMC is toast OR you bent some pins in your CPU socket.


Yeah man. It's so sad knowing that I have damaged the imc. I have confirmed that no pins are bent. Could reseating the heat sink with a paper btw the ihs n the die will resulted in a better contact pressure?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> My chip ran very hot to begin with and I debated whether to sell it and get another or delid for a few months before I finally delidded.
> 
> I went straight to direct die since to me it seems like removing the IHS allows better thermal transfer from die directly to water block.
> 
> Never tested with IHS so I can't provide any comparison temps for my die but to me direct die seems like it will work better and if somebody knows the mathematical physics behind it I think the benefits could be shown with math.


If it is working, that is great. I have a lot of trouble with my IHS I would like to get rid of it, but not sure if I am up for the challenge.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Compared to with the IHS it is amazing. It is basically a free 30-50 drop since you already delidded.


I just tested my chip with 5.0 and 1.41v which is measurable more voltage and did 10 IBT runs as his screen shot shows. If you account for his 18.6c ambient vs my 24c then my hottest core was 68c vs his 70c. I use an IHS, and a very simple loop with very slow fans. Not sure where see a 50c drop.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If it is working, that is great. I have a lot of trouble with my IHS I would like to get rid of it, but not sure if I am up for the challenge.
> I just tested my chip with 5.0 and 1.41v which is measurable more voltage and did 10 IBT runs as his screen shot shows. If you account for his 18.6c ambient vs my 24c then my hottest core was 68c vs his 70c. I use an IHS, and a very simple loop with very slow fans. Not sure where see a 50c drop.


Lol my bad, I thought the temperatures where while IBT was running, then I looked at his max and saw 70c. I get about 50-55c on prime, 55-60c on IBT and linpack. This is with the IHS. Running 1.43v


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> My max temps during gaming are about 60'C - If I were to move to a monsta 240 rad and a custom cpu loop, what would I be looking at for max loads?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got the EK block & fittings on the way. Also would I be even better off going direct-die water-cooling, or just leaving the IHS and CPU bracket in place? Was thinking about getting the EK Precision Mount Ivy kit.


There's a potential risk of crushing the die and you won't be looking at massive temp difference unless you're using a bad quality TIM under the IHS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *codenamew*
> 
> Yeah man. It's so sad knowing that I have damaged the imc. I have confirmed that no pins are bent. Could reseating the heat sink with a paper btw the ihs n the die will resulted in a better contact pressure?


You could give it a try, but I highly doubt it to change anything. So you're basically limited to 16GB of total memory space and half the memory bandwidth from dual channel memory, which really isn't the worst thing in the world.


----------



## lilchronic

you must have a hot chip. i have my ihs on and my temps are great, id probably drop 1c if i went direct die i honestly dont think its worth it


----------



## justanoldman

What is the normal difference in temps between a delidded 3570k and delidded 3770k?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What is the normal difference in temps between a delidded 3570k and delidded 3770k?


I would have to say the average is between 15-20C as depends on the TIM and we have a lot over 20C and a few under 15C


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> roll queen music now: ... And another one bites the dust...
> 
> Hammer 100%!


Haha you mean "Another One Bites the Dust" fades into "Hammer Time" and then that fades into "We Are the Champions" lol


----------



## codenamew

Thanks for all the feedbacks. Just one thing , it seems that the temperature is same before delid and after delid. I'm using Tim from noctua while waiting for my CLU to arrive. I have tried both line method and small dot method on the die but the result is still the same.


----------



## ivoryg37

Waiting to get off work so I can put some cool pro on it


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *codenamew*
> 
> Thanks for all the feedbacks. Just one thing , it seems that the temperature is same before delid and after delid. I'm using Tim from noctua while waiting for my CLU to arrive. I have tried both line method and small dot method on the die but the result is still the same.


I believe you'll truly need the CLU on the die to see the huge temperature drop.

For your IHS, this is just my opinion, after a lot of reading, watching many people do wrong, theories and myths.
I do how I've seen works best. Example, look at your stock HSF, the tim will amount to a circle in the chip not covering edges. I do same with TIM, i apply a smaller than bb sized dot in the middle and mount so it becomes a circle on my chip. line, x's and all other methods might work, but they don't work as good as the dot in the middle.

One thing I can guarantee is, never spread your tim out with a card, or a plastic, or anything, never put too much, and dont try to cover your whole chip. With tim LESS is more, you want a very thin layer for maximum performance.
GL when you get the CLU







Remember to use VERY little...

*Does everyone here have a core that likes to stay cooler than the others? My core#3 is 6C under all others at min/max temps







why couldnt the other's be like him*


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> I believe you'll truly need the CLU on the die to see the huge temperature drop.
> 
> For your IHS, this is just my opinion, after a lot of reading, watching many people do wrong, theories and myths.
> I do how I've seen works best. Example, look at your stock HSF, the tim will amount to a circle in the chip not covering edges. I do same with TIM, i apply a smaller than bb sized dot in the middle and mount so it becomes a circle on my chip. line, x's and all other methods might work, but they don't work as good as the dot in the middle.
> 
> One thing I can guarantee is, never spread your tim out with a card, or a plastic, or anything, never put too much, and dont try to cover your whole chip. With tim LESS is more, you want a very thin layer for maximum performance.
> GL when you get the CLU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Remember to use VERY little...
> 
> *Does everyone here have a core that likes to stay cooler than the others? My core#3 is 6C under all others at min/max temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> why couldnt the other's be like him*


Chocolate is better on the die than what Intel used lol. But yeah CLP/CLU is best on die, also one of the best on ihs but it makes more of a difference from die to ihs rather than ihs to block.

I think everyone has a core that runs







er


----------



## WhiteFireDragon

Hi guys, I also made a video doing this, even before this huge thread started. There are a lot of useful info on here, so can I put a link of this thread in my video description? I was going to do it, but thought it would be a better idea to get permission from the OP or any moderators first.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What is the normal difference in temps between a delidded 3570k and delidded 3770k?


HT in the 3770K is what makes it run hotter than the 3570K and that's it. If you turn that off, temp difference would be between 5-10C.

And no, there's not a worlds temp difference between either of the delidded processors, taking into account of what I mentioned above.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WhiteFireDragon*
> 
> Hi guys, I also made a video doing this, even before this huge thread started. There are a lot of useful info on here, so can I put a link of this thread in my video description? I was going to do it, but thought it would be a better idea to get permission from the OP or any moderators first.


Good to see you here man, [H] buddy.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I just tested my chip with 5.0 and 1.41v which is measurable more voltage and did 10 IBT runs as his screen shot shows. If you account for his 18.6c ambient vs my 24c then my hottest core was 68c vs his 70c. I use an IHS, and a very simple loop with very slow fans. Not sure where see a 50c drop.


Seems like many IB chips operate at different temps. You would have to try direct die to know for certain what benefit if any there is.

What was you IBT pass time when you ran it to compare to my run?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WhiteFireDragon*
> 
> Hi guys, I also made a video doing this, even before this huge thread started. There are a lot of useful info on here, so can I put a link of this thread in my video description? I was going to do it, but thought it would be a better idea to get permission from the OP or any moderators first.


By all means go right ahead


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Seems like many IB chips operate at different temps. You would have to try direct die to know for certain what benefit if any there is.
> 
> What was you IBT pass time when you ran it to compare to my run?


Mine was slower, I didn't note it but I know it was in the 120s. What exactly does the time and gflops tell us?


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> What multiplier and voltage are you running? I think your cooler is equivalent to a NH-D14 correct? Standard water cooling is not going to do much better for temps than a good air cooler.
> 
> Lots of opinions about direct die, but if you get that new kit I think that eliminates some of the risks and problems associated with it. I would like to know how it performs if anyone here tests it.


My cooler is up there with the big boys yes, it falls slightly below the NH-D14 by a few degrees.

The loop I wish to implement is this:
8 x XSPC Chrome G1/4 to 7/16 ID, 5/8 OD Compression Fitting
1 x EK-Supremacy Nickel Plex x £56
1 x Alphacool NexXxoS Monsta 240 - £67.74
1 x XSPC D5 Vario Pump & EK-D5 X-TOP CSQ Plexi Combo £81.99
1 x EK-RES X3 250 Reservoir £45.12
1 x Mayhems Pastel - Blueberry Blue Coolant 1L £14.99
1 x XSPC 7/16" ID (16/11mm) High Flex Hose - Clear (1m Length) £2.99

I already have Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850s. I wish to go Direct die.

I run my chip at 4.7GHz, v1.36-7, speed step enabled. Temps hit 70-72'C MAX with IBT maximum stress run, 60'c in everyday use. I'm hoping that going direct die with this water cooling loop will drop my temps another 20'c maybe?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Mine was slower, I didn't note it but I know it was in the 120s. What exactly does the time and gflops tell us?


Not much, 3570k's almost always finish faster and get more glfops than 3770k's in IBT, which makes no sense. I've also seen a higher clocked cpu get a LOWER score than the same one clocked lower.


----------



## SDBolts619

Tracking shows my CLU will arrive tomorrow, so a couple of questions in preparation for delidding:


I'm disinclined to use CLU between the IHS and my H220 block. I also have on hand the TIM Mate that comes with the H220 and AS5. Which one should I choose?
Speaking of AS5, I've always kept mine in the freezer for storage. Is this actually beneficial?
Granted, I have an antistatic band and mat, but I do wonder if they're even necessary where I live. Since I'm 2 miles from the ocean and 1 mile from San Diego bay, the only time static becomes an issue is when we have Santa Ana winds, which normally occur during the fall. During most of the year, I could rub my feet on the carpet for 5 minutes and barely get a jolt out of it. I know that I'm better safe than sorry, but given a relatively high humidity environment, what are the chances for static damage?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> My cooler is up there with the big boys yes, it falls slightly below the NH-D14 by a few degrees.
> 
> The loop I wish to implement is this:
> 8 x XSPC Chrome G1/4 to 7/16 ID, 5/8 OD Compression Fitting
> 1 x EK-Supremacy Nickel Plex x £56
> 1 x Alphacool NexXxoS Monsta 240 - £67.74
> 1 x XSPC D5 Vario Pump & EK-D5 X-TOP CSQ Plexi Combo £81.99
> 1 x EK-RES X3 250 Reservoir £45.12
> 1 x Mayhems Pastel - Blueberry Blue Coolant 1L £14.99
> 1 x XSPC 7/16" ID (16/11mm) High Flex Hose - Clear (1m Length) £2.99
> 
> I already have Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850s. I wish to go Direct die.
> 
> I run my chip at 4.7GHz, v1.36-7, speed step enabled. Temps hit 70-72'C MAX with IBT maximum stress run, 60'c in everyday use. I'm hoping that going direct die with this water cooling loop will drop my temps another 20'c maybe?


Others here know more than I, but the cooling comes mostly from rad space and with a single 240 rad there is only so much you can do. I would say switching from what you have to the new setup would reduce temps a few degrees but not 10c or anything. As for direct die, I don't know how much that will take off, but I would assume a few more.

Keeping an oc Ivy chip below 60c in real life use is good, so you are not doing bad right now.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> My cooler is up there with the big boys yes, it falls slightly below the NH-D14 by a few degrees.
> 
> The loop I wish to implement is this:
> 8 x XSPC Chrome G1/4 to 7/16 ID, 5/8 OD Compression Fitting
> 1 x EK-Supremacy Nickel Plex x £56
> 1 x Alphacool NexXxoS Monsta 240 - £67.74
> 1 x XSPC D5 Vario Pump & EK-D5 X-TOP CSQ Plexi Combo £81.99
> 1 x EK-RES X3 250 Reservoir £45.12
> 1 x Mayhems Pastel - Blueberry Blue Coolant 1L £14.99
> 1 x XSPC 7/16" ID (16/11mm) High Flex Hose - Clear (1m Length) £2.99
> 
> I already have Scythe Gentle Typhoon 1850s. I wish to go Direct die.
> 
> I run my chip at 4.7GHz, v1.36-7, speed step enabled. Temps hit 70-72'C MAX with IBT maximum stress run, 60'c in everyday use. I'm hoping that going direct die with this water cooling loop will drop my temps another 20'c maybe?


Looks like a good build. That pump with a top is overkill for 1 rad and only cpu loop. It is future proof though if you want to add a gpu later, or add more rads if you get a bigger case. Then you can get 1/2 3/4 tubing as it is the biggest and allows for more flow.

For temps, water usually drops them by 10-30c, it really depends on different factors. With CLU/CLP on the die you will get even more temp drops maybe 15c. I got 45+ temp drops going from air to straight delid water, but I used the IHS, not sure why lol.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Looks like a good build. That pump with a top is overkill for 1 rad and only cpu loop. It is future proof though if you want to add a gpu later, or add more rads if you get a bigger case. Then you can get 1/2 3/4 tubing as it is the biggest and allows for more flow.
> 
> For temps, water usually drops them by 10-30c, it really depends on different factors. With CLU/CLP on the die you will get even more temp drops maybe 15c. I got 45+ temp drops going from air to straight delid water, but I used the IHS, not sure why lol.


45C drop?

Must be a really bad air cooler I must say.


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Others here know more than I, but the cooling comes mostly from rad space and with a single 240 rad there is only so much you can do. I would say switching from what you have to the new setup would reduce temps a few degrees but not 10c or anything. As for direct die, I don't know how much that will take off, but I would assume a few more.
> 
> Keeping an oc Ivy chip below 60c in real life use is good, so you are not doing bad right now.


I know I'm doing well at the moment, but I wish to go to water cooling anyway. I want every bit of cooling I can get









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Looks like a good build. That pump with a top is overkill for 1 rad and only cpu loop. It is future proof though if you want to add a gpu later, or add more rads if you get a bigger case. Then you can get 1/2 3/4 tubing as it is the biggest and allows for more flow.
> 
> For temps, water usually drops them by 10-30c, it really depends on different factors. With CLU/CLP on the die you will get even more temp drops maybe 15c. I got 45+ temp drops going from air to straight delid water, but I used the IHS, not sure why lol.


I'm going to add my SLI GTX670s later in the year with an XT45 360 radiator up the top. I'll change the fittings when I do this too.








I already have delidded with CLU under the IHS and on the IHS which is how I'm at 60'c general use.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SDBolts619*
> 
> Tracking shows my CLU will arrive tomorrow, so a couple of questions in preparation for delidding:
> 
> 
> I'm disinclined to use CLU between the IHS and my H220 block. I also have on hand the TIM Mate that comes with the H220 and AS5. Which one should I choose?
> Speaking of AS5, I've always kept mine in the freezer for storage. Is this actually beneficial?
> Granted, I have an antistatic band and mat, but I do wonder if they're even necessary where I live. Since I'm 2 miles from the ocean and 1 mile from San Diego bay, the only time static becomes an issue is when we have Santa Ana winds, which normally occur during the fall. During most of the year, I could rub my feet on the carpet for 5 minutes and barely get a jolt out of it. I know that I'm better safe than sorry, but given a relatively high humidity environment, what are the chances for static damage?


Why so? Metal polish takes it off. You'll see 10-15'c drop with it on the die, and another 10'c comes from having it on the IHS also. (In my case anyway)


----------



## Valgaur

heres the interior ideas. my current loop layout will go from the dual pump setup to the 5 rads then to the cpu block then the block chain of 7970's or 7950's and then to the left Res and under to the other res on the right back to the pumps.... that sound right?


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SDBolts619*
> 
> Tracking shows my CLU will arrive tomorrow, so a couple of questions in preparation for delidding:
> 
> 
> I'm disinclined to use CLU between the IHS and my H220 block. I also have on hand the TIM Mate that comes with the H220 and AS5. Which one should I choose?
> Speaking of AS5, I've always kept mine in the freezer for storage. Is this actually beneficial?
> Granted, I have an antistatic band and mat, but I do wonder if they're even necessary where I live. Since I'm 2 miles from the ocean and 1 mile from San Diego bay, the only time static becomes an issue is when we have Santa Ana winds, which normally occur during the fall. During most of the year, I could rub my feet on the carpet for 5 minutes and barely get a jolt out of it. I know that I'm better safe than sorry, but given a relatively high humidity environment, what are the chances for static damage?


- AS5 for sure.

- Depends upon the cooling setting of your freezer. But hell, just by saying it's a freezer, then it's a bad idea from speculation.

Extended Temperature Limits:
Peak: -50°C to >180°C
Long-Term: -50°C to 130°C

-A really low chance of that happening, but not impossible. The best thing you could do is wear thin plastic gloves and wear slippers.. I personally used paper towels in a certain way and it worked well.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SDBolts619*
> 
> Tracking shows my CLU will arrive tomorrow, so a couple of questions in preparation for delidding:
> 
> 
> I'm disinclined to use CLU between the IHS and my H220 block. I also have on hand the TIM Mate that comes with the H220 and AS5. Which one should I choose?
> Speaking of AS5, I've always kept mine in the freezer for storage. Is this actually beneficial?
> Granted, I have an antistatic band and mat, but I do wonder if they're even necessary where I live. Since I'm 2 miles from the ocean and 1 mile from San Diego bay, the only time static becomes an issue is when we have Santa Ana winds, which normally occur during the fall. During most of the year, I could rub my feet on the carpet for 5 minutes and barely get a jolt out of it. I know that I'm better safe than sorry, but given a relatively high humidity environment, what are the chances for static damage?


If you aren't sure that you want to use CLU on top of the IHS then don't. I have directly compared the stock H220 TIM to AS5 and saw no statistically significant difference. You could probably get one or two c better with a higher end TIM. I can't think of a reason to take a chance with static, if you have the stuff just use it, then you won't have to wonder later if you did some damage however slight.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> 45C drop?
> 
> Must be a really bad air cooler I must say.


Yeah hyper 212+ with bad static pressure fans plus badly applied mx-4. My cpu was cooking at 95c at 1.25v.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If you aren't sure that you want to use CLU on top of the IHS then don't. I have directly compared the stock H220 TIM to AS5 and saw no statistically significant difference. You could probably get one or two c better with a higher end TIM. I can't think of a reason to take a chance with static, if you have the stuff just use it, then you won't have to wonder later if you did some damage however slight.


Why would static be a problem from IHS to block? Also CLU comes off with alcohol from the block, and gives 10c drops or more if applied correctly compared to as5/mx4.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Why would static be a problem from IHS to block? Also CLU comes off with alcohol from the block, and gives 10c drops or more if applied correctly compared to as5/mx4.


He asked about delidding, so when handling a chip for delidding, yes you should worry about static.

CLU will not come off the block or IHS with alchohol, I have posted extensively about that, including pictures. It needs something else like metal polish and a couple hours.

CLU will give less than a 5c drop vs. other good TIMs when used on top of the IHS. I have tested it several times.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> He asked about delidding, so when handling a chip for delidding, yes you should worry about static.
> 
> CLU will not come off the block or IHS with alchohol, I have posted extensively about that, including pictures. It needs something else like metal polish and a couple hours.
> 
> CLU will give less than a 5c drop vs. other good TIMs when used on top of the IHS. I have tested it several times.


I took off CLU from my gpu block and cpu block perfectly fine without any polish. CLP I haven't tried yet. And going from mx-4 watercooled to CLP watercooled I got 15c drops not 5c. You have to make sure to apply it carefully and correctly or it doesn't give good performance.

This is with my GPU which the cores are on the block, no IHS, you should know since you have a 690 yourself. As I said CLU doesn't make as much of a difference from the IHS to the block compared to the die to the IHS/Block but it still does make a difference.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I took off CLU from my gpu block and cpu block perfectly fine without any polish. CLP I haven't tried yet. And going from mx-4 watercooled to CLP watercooled I got 15c drops not 5c. You have to make sure to apply it carefully and correctly or it doesn't give good performance.
> 
> This is with my GPU which the cores are on the block, no IHS, you should know since you have a 690 yourself. As I said CLU doesn't make as much of a difference from the IHS to the block compared to the die to the IHS/Block but it still does make a difference.


I mean no offense, but I would need to see pics to believe that you completely removed all traces of CLU from a copper cold plate after months of use with simple alcohol. I tried, spend at least 20 minutes using alcohol and it made little difference to the residue stain left by CLU over an extended period of time.

I have applied a few different TIMs to both my chips many, many times now including CLU. If you got a 15c drop from going from MX4 to CLU then your application of MX-4 was incorrect or your cooler was not installed properly. There are a lot of reviews on the web that show CLU is a few degrees better, nothing remotely close to 15c.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> heres the interior ideas. my current loop layout will go from the dual pump setup to the 5 rads then to the cpu block then the block chain of 7970's or 7950's and then to the left Res and under to the other res on the right back to the pumps.... that sound right?


..LoL







- just came back from a w-c shopping trip - that 3970X can draw close to 400w plus minus on OC, pictures in a few days... Regarding your layout above, I think you want the pump (at least one) on the 'cold' side of the rads, sitting between 'rad-cold-out' and 'CPU-in'...with the res just ahead and above the pump


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I mean no offense, but I would need to see pics to believe that you completely removed all traces of CLU from a copper cold plate after months of use with simple alcohol. I tried, spend at least 20 minutes using alcohol and it made little difference to the residue stain left by CLU over an extended period of time.
> 
> I have applied a few different TIMs to both my chips many, many times now including CLU. If you got a 15c drop from going from MX4 to CLU then your application of MX-4 was incorrect or your cooler was not installed properly. There are a lot of reviews on the web that show CLU is a few degrees better, nothing remotely close to 15c.


Well it was more like 2 weeks of use rather than a month. It does not harden like clp but I guess it would make removing easier. Can't post pics because I already sanded every surface to make them flatter for the best application of pro. Also, ihs to block I don't expect 15c but die straight to gpu block.. 15c is what I got.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well it was more like 2 weeks of use rather than a month. It does not harden like clp but I guess it would make removing easier. Can't post pics because I already sanded every surface to make them flatter for the best application of pro. Also, ihs to block I don't expect 15c but die straight to gpu block.. 15c is what I got.


Ok, I thought you meant exact same setup, going from one TIM to CLU you got 15c; direct die and CLU together make sense.

In my experience, CLU will not harden between the die and IHS, but it will between the IHS and a cooler, at least two different copper coolers I tested.

I think CLU or CLP on the die is great (most agree on that), and I like on the IHS too, but I just like to warn people they might have trouble getting all the residue stain completely removed from the IHS and their cooler over time if they use it on top of the IHS. It can be done, it is just a lot of work.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> heres the interior ideas. my current loop layout will go from the dual pump setup to the 5 rads then to the cpu block then the block chain of 7970's or 7950's and then to the left Res and under to the other res on the right back to the pumps.... that sound right?


For my build I was planning pump to rads then to another pump then to cpu gpu then back to the first pump. Would it make any difference where the pumps are in the loop?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ok, I thought you meant exact same setup, going from one TIM to CLU you got 15c; direct die and CLU together make sense.
> 
> In my experience, CLU will not harden between the die and IHS, but it will between the IHS and a cooler, at least two different copper coolers I tested.
> 
> I think CLU or CLP on the die is great (most agree on that), and I like on the IHS too, but I just like to warn people they might have trouble getting all the residue stain completely removed from the IHS and their cooler over time if they use it on top of the IHS. It can be done, it is just a lot of work.


Yeah both ultra and pro are more of an effort on copper to copper. Pro probably won't even come off completly unless extreme sanding. For copper to copper it is a matter of if you are willing to go through some extra work for a bit cooler temps, it is for me, but isn't for some others. I put pro on both die and heatsink. I would advise either pro or ultra on die and ultra or other on heatsink, but I used pro because I had it and wanted a slight more cooling, which was not needed because my motherboard doesn't allow clocking past 4.9, 5 is barely stable.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..LoL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - just came back from a w-c shopping trip - that 3970X can draw close to 400w plus minus on OC, pictures in a few days... Regarding your layout above, I think you want the pump (at least one) on the 'cold' side of the rads, sitting between 'rad-cold-out' and 'CPU-in'...with the res just ahead and above the pump


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Thats why the last place the water will be is the re's to get bubbles out and for looks abut the temps should be pretty darn good considering my idea
> 
> For my build I was planning pump to rads then to another pump then to cpu gpu then back to the first pump. Would it make any difference where the pumps are in the loop?


I don't believe so it shouldn't matter


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I don't believe so it shouldn't matter


...by the sounds of it you folks are running more than one pump anyway, so you have more flexibility...but the general rule is that you want at least one pump as close to the CPU as is reasonable on the 'fresh supply' side...

...there are a few YouTube vids on that...LinusTech has a good series on building extended WC loops w/extra items hooked in (ie GPU), and I am sure Hokies will have more info as well


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Y'all are complaining at that price for a 3770k!?
I had to buy mine for £255!!


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Y'all are complaining at that price for a 3770k!?
> I had to buy mine for £255!!


You guys over in the US get your computer parts at ridiculous cheaper prices than we do thats for sure... I had to haggle to get my 3770k at £248, £280 new... $225 for a 3770k. I would be buying them a few at a time to find a golden chip


----------



## Hokies83

@ the WC pump question it is good to have a pump before are right behind the main restriction in the loop.

And one placed to promote flow maybe behind the rads to pull water thru them.

@ Above poster i got my 3770k on the day it first came out it was 359 USD.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Not much, 3570k's almost always finish faster and get more glfops than 3770k's in IBT, which makes no sense. I've also seen a higher clocked cpu get a LOWER score than the same one clocked lower.


Although gigaflops are a measure of performance, they aren't a very good measure of performance since gigaflops can be increased by disabling hyperthreading on a cpu that has HT, so decreasing overall performance can increase flops.
It is fine for checking performance on your computer, test gflops, change settings, test again & higher gflops are an indication of higher performance. But when you are running HT enabled, it isn't a good test to compare with another system running a cpu without HT.
Can't just judge a cpu by the gigaflops.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Y'all are complaining at that price for a 3770k!?
> I had to buy mine for £255!!


Over $400 CAD here for 3770k after tax. I want a local Microcenter for xmas...


----------



## ivanlabrie

FtW, import...all you other guys complaining too. USPS First Class goes straight to your door, takes a while but you save a TON of money.


----------



## lilchronic

Gflops? lolz cant wait to get my OC FORMULA i just orderded


----------



## TX2000

Thanks For the nice topic you have here. Count another delidded CPU (Razor Way)


Before all the mess started. i had a corsair 120 Closed system

putting CLP like 1/4 of a rice . that thing really i mean really cover lots of surface

direct to the chip


and all done bfore this mess i was hitting 100c so i had to dial back on the OC
i was at 75C @4.5 at 1.30v
now i am at 65C @4.8 at 1.38v.

i also upgraded to xspc raystorm rs360 is a nice kit
thanks for all the info you had in here, it helped me expose the brain of my 3550k without issues.

Thanks Again and Happy OC.


----------



## dr/owned

Direct die is the way to go. You don't even have to do anything special with my waterblock to do it, just have to be careful tightening the thumb screws evenly and keep going until springs fully compress.

You get more surface area closer to the die, and 1 less layer of thermal paste.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Although gigaflops are a measure of performance, they aren't a very good measure of performance since gigaflops can be increased by disabling hyperthreading on a cpu that has HT, so decreasing overall performance can increase flops.
> It is fine for checking performance on your computer, test gflops, change settings, test again & higher gflops are an indication of higher performance. But when you are running HT enabled, it isn't a good test to compare with another system running a cpu without HT.
> Can't just judge a cpu by the gigaflops.
> Over $400 CAD here for 3770k after tax. I want a local Microcenter for xmas...


Two days ago I almost bought another 3770K at MC for $229.00 plus $21.00 tax for $250.00. Intel does not let them sell it for less or they would!


----------



## TX2000

quick question

i am looking at temp core difference and core 1 and 2 have a difference of 10C should i reapply the paste or this is in acceptable parameters?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> i got my 3770k on the day it first came out it was 359 USD.


Same here, came out 11:59 pacific time on newegg, and I ordered it


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> quick question
> 
> i am looking at temp core difference and core 1 and 2 have a difference of 10C should i reapply the paste or this is in acceptable parameters?


Probably about normal. My delta is 8C between cores.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> FtW, import...all you other guys complaining too. USPS First Class goes straight to your door, takes a while but you save a TON of money.


Only problem there is declaration & duty. If it is shipped as a new 3770k at a cheaper than in Canada price, customs fixes that...


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Probably about normal. My delta is 8C between cores.


thanks . i will try now to hit5GHz or die trying (more like killing it)


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> thanks . i will try now to hit5GHz or die trying (more like killing it)


It only dies when it's running 1.9 or higher 24/7... cough cough Val


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Only problem there is declaration & duty. If it is shipped as a new 3770k at a cheaper than in Canada price, customs fixes that...


...ah, sigh, our government and its bureaucracy


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Only problem there is declaration & duty. If it is shipped as a new 3770k at a cheaper than in Canada price, customs fixes that...


Used and not in the 3770k box!

It then becomes a Pent 4 valued at 10$


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> @ the WC pump question it is good to have a pump before are right behind the main restriction in the loop.
> 
> And one placed to promote flow maybe behind the rads to pull water thru them.
> 
> @ Above poster i got my 3770k on the day it first came out it was 359 USD.


Alright so res to pump through all the rads then another pump after the rads to go to the cpu and the gpu blocks to the res's


----------



## Joa3d43

*@ Hokies, FtW and Ivan*

...a quick question about a custom loop:







Working on the R-IV-E / 3970X...that thing has an out-of-the box t=max= 150w (almost 2x that of a 3770K), BEFORE OC'ing...

...mobo will be 'open-air' with heavy VRM cooling on both sides...water custom loop consists of 'the usual HD' components I have used before w/some variation, i.e. a MPC655 pump, 1/2-3/4 PrimoChill adv.LRT tubes, XSPC 360/60 rad w7 Noctua 120mm fans and an EK Supremacy LG2011 block...

BUT: One extra addition - once the liquid leaves the XSPC, it moves on to a BlackIce 180 / 60 high-flow low resistance rad w/21fpi and a 360 watt rating, then back to the res, on to the MPC 655 and then into the CPU w-c block...the BlackIce will not have any fans for now...instead, I plan to have the option of fully submerging it into ice-water...basically taking baby steps towards a more extended solution later....

...the w-c system will basically be mounted horizontally, so no big height differences to overcome...I think the MPC 655 should be enough for this 2nd rad as well, noting that folks use it normally for CPU + SLI GPU...what do you guys think ? Thanks


----------



## dr/owned

I still get good flow with my setup and same pump.

You might need more rad though. I heat soak my 480 under full load.


----------



## Qlix

OCN name: Qlix
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Liguid Pro
ihs-TIM: PK-3
Mhz gained: none yet








OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 20c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2762750


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Gflops? lolz cant wait to get my OC FORMULA i just orderded


Nice choice!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Only problem there is declaration & duty. If it is shipped as a new 3770k at a cheaper than in Canada price, customs fixes that...


Hokies beat me to it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@ Hokies, FtW and Ivan*
> 
> ...a quick question about a custom loop:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Working on the R-IV-E / 3970X...that thing has an out-of-the box t=max= 150w (almost 2x that of a 3770K), BEFORE OC'ing...
> 
> ...mobo will be 'open-air' with heavy VRM cooling on both sides...water custom loop consists of 'the usual HD' components I have used before w/some variation, i.e. a MPC655 pump, 1/2-3/4 PrimoChill adv.LRT tubes, XSPC 360/60 rad w7 Noctua 120mm fans and an EK Supremacy LG2011 block...
> 
> BUT: One extra addition - once the liquid leaves the XSPC, it moves on to a BlackIce 180 / 60 high-flow low resistance rad w/21fpi and a 360 watt rating, then back to the res, on to the MPC 655 and then into the CPU w-c block...the BlackIce will not have any fans for now...instead, I plan to have the option of fully submerging it into ice-water...basically taking baby steps towards a more extended solution later....
> 
> ...the w-c system will basically be mounted horizontally, so no big height differences to overcome...I think the MPC 655 should be enough for this 2nd rad as well, noting that folks use it normally for CPU + SLI GPU...what do you guys think ? Thanks


Should be enough, rads are not really restrictive, blocks are. (and sharp turns)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> OCN name: Qlix
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liguid Pro
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: none yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 20c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2762750


GREAT!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> OCN name: Qlix
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liguid Pro
> ihs-TIM: PK-3
> Mhz gained: none yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 20c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2762750


Keep rockin out man and You're In!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I still get good flow with my setup and same pump.
> 
> You might need more rad though. I heat soak my 480 under full load.


...might be right...if so, I can also submerge the 360 as well as the 180, the way I am laying it out (once I decided not to mount it in a case, far more flexibility







)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Should be enough, rads are not really restrictive, blocks are. (and sharp turns)


Thanks everyone


----------



## Hokies83

Yah blocks are tough...

Even with my 2 MCp 35X running 100% i do not have enough flow to get the full benefit of parallel as one card at load is 10c hotter then the other 2.. Meaning good flow is not going thru the card cause i do not have enough.

If i decide to add a 4th 7950... "which would mean another PSU " i may do so... But i may just get a Booster to do it.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Used and not in the 3770k box!
> 
> It then becomes a Pent 4 valued at 10$


This works for getting someone to buy a chip & mail it up here, it would be simple & nice to just be able to order from a US etailer though. NCIX & Newegg are the best we have here for parts, & they still don't carry everything the US shops do.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@ Hokies, FtW and Ivan*
> 
> ...a quick question about a custom loop:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Working on the R-IV-E / 3970X...that thing has an out-of-the box t=max= 150w (almost 2x that of a 3770K), BEFORE OC'ing...
> 
> ...mobo will be 'open-air' with heavy VRM cooling on both sides...water custom loop consists of 'the usual HD' components I have used before w/some variation, i.e. a MPC655 pump, 1/2-3/4 PrimoChill adv.LRT tubes, XSPC 360/60 rad w7 Noctua 120mm fans and an EK Supremacy LG2011 block...
> 
> BUT: One extra addition - once the liquid leaves the XSPC, it moves on to a BlackIce 180 / 60 high-flow low resistance rad w/21fpi and a 360 watt rating, then back to the res, on to the MPC 655 and then into the CPU w-c block...the BlackIce will not have any fans for now...instead, I plan to have the option of fully submerging it into ice-water...basically taking baby steps towards a more extended solution later....
> 
> ...the w-c system will basically be mounted horizontally, so no big height differences to overcome...I think the MPC 655 should be enough for this 2nd rad as well, noting that folks use it normally for CPU + SLI GPU...what do you guys think ? Thanks


As long as the block isn't too restrictive it should all work well. When using restrictive parts the mcp355 with higher head pressure might do better, but don't think the EK supremacy is that restrictive.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Should be enough, rads are not really restrictive, blocks are. (and sharp turns)


As to sharp turns, logically it would seem that a lot of 90 degree fittings would be restrictive and affect temps, but I see most people using quite of few of them. Then I read the Martin's lab test where he says you need 30 of the 90 degree fittings to even raise temps by 1c. Those results surprised me.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> If i decide to add a 4th 7950... "which would mean another PSU " i may do so... But i may just get a Booster to do it.


Didn't we already find out last week that Crossfire is broken? Seems the money would be better spent going for 2 more powerful cards rather than 4 weaker ones.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> As long as the block isn't too restrictive it should all work well. When using restrictive parts the mcp355 with higher head pressure might do better, but don't think the EK supremacy is that restrictive.


Thanks







I normally use the Koolance 370SI (ie on the delidded 3770K), but couldn't get one...plus I read good things about the EK Supremacy...and both the Koolance and the EK Supremacy have a good flow rating re resistance...

I also still have a 'Coollaboratory Alpheos' water block laying around which is supposed to have excellent flow / low resistance, but unfortunately it's inlet / outlet are too close together for the big tubes / fittings I'm using - and I have another use for it anyhow.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Didn't we already find out last week that Crossfire is broken? Seems the money would be better spent going for 2 more powerful cards rather than 4 weaker ones.


7950/70's are stronger than 680s...for less. And they have many uses








Gaming is only one of them.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 7950/70's are stronger than 680s...for less. And they have many uses
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gaming is only one of them.


Like what? They make a crappy sandwich and are less than satisfactory in the bedroom.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Didn't we already find out last week that Crossfire is broken? Seems the money would be better spent going for 2 more powerful cards rather than 4 weaker ones.


Tri fire works fine the 4th card would be added to make me more money so instead of 1000USD a month id make 1250 Usd a month from my 7950s.

3 7950s = 2x Titans









When i want to game id just turn the 4th card off.. Ubber for " Free Gpu's"

Makes there really no reason to buy Nvidia card until they can Compute again.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Let's just say they are better...unless you're rich and can afford a Titan.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Let's just say they are better...unless you're rich and can afford a Titan.


...I know I already contributed before to the 'eternal' GPU discussion with the info below...just get 4x 670ies and beat a lot of high-end stuff costing twice+ as much







But I really got to go to dinner now and spend some of the money I saved w/ my 670ies

...Seriously, folks - Thanks for the help earlier on the w-c loop, and enjoy your discussion


Spoiler: Unigine Valley top 20!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I know I already contributed before to the 'eternal' GPU discussion with the info below...just get 4x 670ies and beat a lot of high-end stuff costing twice+ as much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I really got to go to dinner now and spend some of the money I saved w/ my 670ies
> 
> ...Seriously, folks - Thanks for the help earlier on the w-c loop, and enjoy your discussion
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Unigine Valley top 20!


I'm mad that your Gigabyte WF3 overclocks leaps and bounds better than mine. I modded my BIOS and maxed voltage and put power target to 150% and still can't get a single MHz higher than I could with my stock BIOS.









I'm stuck at 1280MHz/1900MHz. Which I guess compared to the average WF3 it's good, just not yours...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I know I already contributed before to the 'eternal' GPU discussion with the info below...just get 4x 670ies and beat a lot of high-end stuff costing twice+ as much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I really got to go to dinner now and spend some of the money I saved w/ my 670ies
> 
> ...Seriously, folks - Thanks for the help earlier on the w-c loop, and enjoy your discussion
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Unigine Valley top 20!


sup run your two best cards


----------



## RavageTheEarth

aghhh the story of my life. So I got my PSU back and everything booted up and no squeaking or chirping sounds so I booted into windows and installed the drivers for my crossfire 7950's and it asks me to restart so I did and now I can't get past the splash screen onto the desktop. I have to restart and restore to an earlier point and then everything works fine. Problem after problem with this computer







I just want to play!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> aghhh the story of my life. So I got my PSU back and everything booted up and no squeaking or chirping sounds so I booted into windows and installed the drivers for my crossfire 7950's and it asks me to restart so I did and now I can't get past the splash screen onto the desktop. I have to restart and restore to an earlier point and then everything works fine. Problem after problem with this computer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just want to play!


welcome to the world of computers lol


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> welcome to the world of computers lol


I can't even explain to you how many problems I've had since I got it haha. Anyways, I updated the motherboard BIOS to the newest version and it booted right up. Hopefully the GPU drivers didn't get corrupted in the process!


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

You guys think a scratch on my 3770k's die will lead to problems?
I'm more worried about cleaning the CLU off to take pics than i am of the scratch
i removed chip perfect but after cleaning the die a few times there were 3 thin looking scratches thin like hair , i probably should of took pic before









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







this was before i cleaned the die/ihs... after i cleaned the die with qtip i noticed 3 hairline type scratches, but they werent deep or anything... i used the CLU's cleaning pad to clean it and i said the hell with it and applied some CLU
now im paranoid


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> You guys think a scratch on my 3770k's die will lead to problems?
> I'm more worried about cleaning the CLU off to take pics than i am of the scratch
> i removed chip perfect but after cleaning the die a few times there were 3 thin looking scratches thin like hair , i probably should of took pic before
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this was before i cleaned the die/ihs... after i cleaned the die with qtip i noticed 3 hairline type scratches, but they werent deep or anything... i used the CLU's cleaning pad to clean it and i said the hell with it and applied some CLU
> now im paranoid


Unless they are really deep scratches I wouldn't worry about them too much.

I am bummed. I can Hit 4.8 @ 1.36v with 1600mhz memory rock solid stability but to get my memory to 2133 I need 1.4v this is terrible lol.

Well the good thing is my temps don't reach 74c in a 80f room lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm mad that your Gigabyte WF3 overclocks leaps and bounds better than mine. I modded my BIOS and maxed voltage and put power target to 150% and still can't get a single MHz higher than I could with my stock BIOS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm stuck at 1280MHz/1900MHz. Which I guess compared to the average WF3 it's good, just not yours...


...I hate to tell you this, but that run was done some time back - no GB WF3 OC...just 4x Asus DirectCUii 670ies (915/980 stock before light modding) with one being a bit of a dog and holding the others back on synchro...once I finish my new build, I'll do some more runs with the GB WF3 OC on board


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Unless they are really deep scratches I wouldn't worry about them too much.
> 
> I am bummed. I can Hit 4.8 @ 1.36v with 1600mhz memory rock solid stability but to get my memory to 2133 I need 1.4v this is terrible lol.
> 
> Well the good thing is my temps don't reach 74c in a 80f room lol.


Ah... i think you solved my problem man.
on SB i was running 2133 with 1.6v on the ram and cas9 timings....
i switch to IB and i crash at 2133, so ive been running 2000

im 4.5ghz 1.345 im not sure if i want to go any higher on the vcore !!!








( im still boggled about how my die, i swear everything was perfect then i clean it and it was like wolverine left his mark on my chip as punishment for hitting it with a hammer







the pic was from before i cleaned it)


----------



## TonicX

Its OFFICIAL! TonicX is running his 3770K BARE-DIE and has the best temps ever.












I thought about this since before I gave my chip a shave. but needed time to work out the details.









Disclaimer: this is not advise or a guide, simple: This is how I did it.

With a metal coat hanger, yep, that's right a staple for any Modder. It is heavy duty though - so don't worry











first I took the underside stand-off nuts to the grinding wheel, so the stand-off would screw down tight to the MOBO.



I just eyeballed the thickness of the IHS and tried to lower the block that much.
The COAT HANGER IS UNDER THE BRACKET - trust me. Im a professional











CLU was applied so Intel should take note!


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Its OFFICIAL! TonicX is running his 3770K BARE-DIE and has the best temps ever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: snip!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought about this since before I gave my chip a shave. but needed time to work out the details.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Disclaimer: this is not advise or a guide, simple: This is how I did it.
> 
> With a metal coat hanger, yep, that's right a staple for any Modder. It is heavy duty though - so don't worry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> first I took the underside stand-off nuts to the grinding wheel, so the stand-off would screw down tight to the MOBO.
> 
> 
> 
> I just eyeballed the thickness of the IHS and tried to lower the block that much.
> The COAT HANGER IS UNDER THE BRACKET - trust me. Im a professional
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU was applied so Intel should take note!


Hahaha Congrats! I would post this in the Ghetto rigging shenanigans lol.


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Koolance 380i doesn't have any of that nanny standoff BS









The standoffs are only there to keep the post held firm and are a cm away from touching the waterblock mounting bracket.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Unless they are really deep scratches I wouldn't worry about them too much.
> 
> I am bummed. I can Hit 4.8 @ 1.36v with 1600mhz memory rock solid stability but to get my memory to 2133 I need 1.4v this is terrible lol.
> 
> Well the good thing is my temps don't reach 74c in a 80f room lol.


How much memory in the rig? Usually when memory overclocking I don't need more vcore unless really stretching it. I don't use more than 2 x 4Gb in the ivy rigs though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Its OFFICIAL! TonicX is running his 3770K BARE-DIE and has the best temps ever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought about this since before I gave my chip a shave. but needed time to work out the details.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Disclaimer: this is not advise or a guide, simple: This is how I did it.
> 
> With a metal coat hanger, yep, that's right a staple for any Modder. It is heavy duty though - so don't worry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> first I took the underside stand-off nuts to the grinding wheel, so the stand-off would screw down tight to the MOBO.
> 
> 
> 
> I just eyeballed the thickness of the IHS and tried to lower the block that much.
> The COAT HANGER IS UNDER THE BRACKET - trust me. Im a professional
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU was applied so Intel should take note!


Best temps ever?









Good job though, I played with trying to get bare die booted up & lacked the patience to get the mounting pressure right.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> How much memory in the rig? Usually when memory overclocking I don't need more vcore unless really stretching it. I don't use more than 2 x 4Gb in the ivy rigs though.
> Best temps ever?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good job though, I played with trying to get bare die booted up & lacked the patience to get the mounting pressure right.


yeah- lots of block pressure- but the bracket bends and flexes so the pressure is displaced..

memory? 4 x 4gig why again?


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> How much memory in the rig? Usually when memory overclocking I don't need more vcore unless really stretching it. I don't use more than 2 x 4Gb in the ivy rigs though.


4x4gb.

I am not sure either why it needs .05 more v's to get it stable.







If I run them stock @ 1600 I am prime95 stable 24hr's with 1.36v

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> yeah- lots of block pressure- but the bracket bends and flexes so the pressure is displaced..
> 
> memory? 4 x 4gig why again?


Well A long time ago there was a MC coupon for I think $25 off of a purchase of $25 for higher. Lets just say I walked with $10 bucks for 2x4gb of samsung green's... And well I bought a few... lol. For this rig and my baby ivy rig.


----------



## TX2000

i hit a wall trying to run @5GHz . i am fine at 4.8 @1.39V but for 5GHZ i have to go up too 1.52 and still unstable
temps below 70C tho


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> i hit a wall trying to run @5GHz . i am fine at 4.8 @1.39V but for 5GHZ i have to go up too 1.52 and still unstable
> temps below 70C tho


I could do 4.7 @ 1.35-1.40 (pre-delid, so these numbers might be lower now). 5.0 takes 1.575. I could boot 5.2 at 1.7V, but it would fail prime95 without thermal throttling.


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I could do 4.7 @ 1.35-1.40 (pre-delid, so these numbers might be lower now). 5.0 takes 1.575. I could boot 5.2 at 1.7V, but it would fail prime95 without thermal throttling.


i think i will stay there i don't feel comfortable going higher


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> i hit a wall trying to run @5GHz . i am fine at 4.8 @1.39V but for 5GHZ i have to go up too 1.52 and still unstable
> temps below 70C tho


Yeah - me too - that's pretty much the max for ultra-stable (4800) it has something to do with heat transference in the 22nm lithography. any amount of external cooling cannot touch this effect. It is intrinsic to the 3770K but i'm happy with it none the less. I'm hoping to tune-in a stable 4900 with a reasonable Vcore after i'm done messing with it. but I will run it at 4800 if I cant do 4900 because I know 4800 can be run stable. like prime95 for 12+ hours with no whea errors .


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> 4x4gb.
> 
> I am not sure either why it needs .05 more v's to get it stable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I run them stock @ 1600 I am prime95 stable 24hr's with 1.36v
> Well A long time ago there was a MC coupon for I think $25 off of a purchase of $25 for higher. Lets just say I walked with $10 bucks for 2x4gb of samsung green's... And well I bought a few... lol. For this rig and my baby ivy rig.


I'll have to experiment with 4 x 4Gb to see if I do need more vcore for that or not. I would have assumed more vccio/vccsa, but didn't think it would really affect vcore. I haven't tried it though, don't know if it is normal or not.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Yeah - me too - that's pretty much *the max for ultra-stable (4800) it has something to do with heat transference in the 22nm lithography. any amount of external cooling cannot touch this effect.* It is intrinsic to the 3770K but i'm happy with it none the less. I'm hoping to tune-in a stable 4900 with a reasonable Vcore after i'm done messing with it. but I will run it at 4800 if I cant do 4900 because I know 4800 can be run stable. like prime95 for 12+ hours with no whea errors .


Gotta disagree with this a bit, phase or chilled water can be used 24/7 & it does make it a lot easier for higher overclocks.
I started having trouble with stability testing at about 5.5Ghz on the last chip I was playing with.


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'll have to experiment with 4 x 4Gb to see if I do need more vcore for that or not. I would have assumed more vccio/vccsa, but didn't think it would really affect vcore. I haven't tried it though, don't know if it is normal or not.
> Gotta disagree with this a bit, phase or chilled water can be used 24/7 & it does make it a lot easier for higher overclocks.
> I started having trouble with stability testing at about 5.5Ghz on the last chip I was playing with.


that is a tad out of my budget


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> that is a tad out of my budget


Water chillers are cheap, but they can sure ugly up a room, as well as take a good chunk of space.
Phase does get pricey, although cheaper than some guys spend on water cooling gear. It is hard to find good used ones, they go quick.

The post was more to point out that external cooling can counter the heat effect. At least somewhat, Ivy still doesn't OC as well on phase as a great sandy could for 24/7, although colder & colder makes it keep going faster where sandy would stop.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'll have to experiment with 4 x 4Gb to see if I do need more vcore for that or not. I would have assumed more vccio/vccsa, but didn't think it would really affect vcore. I haven't tried it though, don't know if it is normal or not.


Yea I was along the lines of VCCIO/VCCSA as With my 2600k I would've needed a bump in those. But not vcore. Maybe I got lucky in my 24hr prime at 1.36? lol who Knows.

Looking to up my mobo size the question is which formula to go?

Asrock OC formula

or

Maximus V Formula
/
The only thing I dont like about the OC formula is that the piping the in the hybrid cooler is aluminum.... who was the genius that thought of that?


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Water chillers are cheap, but they can sure ugly up a room, as well as take a good chunk of space.
> Phase does get pricey, although cheaper than some guys spend on water cooling gear. It is hard to find good used ones, they go quick.
> 
> The post was more to point out that external cooling can counter the heat effect. At least somewhat, Ivy still doesn't OC as well on phase as a great sandy could for 24/7, although colder & colder makes it keep going faster where sandy would stop.


i think tomorrow ill reapply the CLP because it is fluctuating too much between cores. my highest core atm is at 64c


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Yea I was along the lines of VCCIO/VCCSA as With my 2600k I would've needed a bump in those. But not vcore. Maybe I got lucky in my 24hr prime at 1.36? lol who Knows.
> 
> Looking to up my mobo size the question is which formula to go?
> 
> Asrock OC formula
> 
> or
> 
> Maximus V Formula
> /
> The only thing I dont like about the OC formula is that the piping the in the hybrid cooler is aluminum.... who was the genius that thought of that?


yo i say get the OC formula







unless u plan on running 3way sli get the MVF








i just orderd the OC Formula myself


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yo i say get the OC formula
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> unless u plan on running 3way sli get the MVF
> i just orderd the OC Formula myself


Why would you run 3 way sli on the MVF and not the AOCF?

Also the Aluminum clashes against my loop way too hard lol. I got brass/nickle plated/copper in my loop lol.


----------



## Hokies83

I would not run 3 way on those boards they have No PLX chip....

3 way Sli u need a G1 Sniper 3 MVE or a UP7

Anywho there is a MVG over on Hard forum for 150$ shipped

And a G1 Sniper m3 for 125$ shipped <-- has triple spacing between top pci-e slot and bottom pci-e slot


----------



## juntzo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Yea I was along the lines of VCCIO/VCCSA as With my 2600k I would've needed a bump in those. But not vcore. Maybe I got lucky in my 24hr prime at 1.36? lol who Knows.
> 
> Looking to up my mobo size the question is which formula to go?
> 
> Asrock OC formula
> 
> or
> 
> Maximus V Formula
> /
> *The only thing I dont like about the OC formula is that the piping the in the hybrid cooler is aluminum.... who was the genius that thought of that?*


It's copper according to Nickshih himself at post #45. http://www.overclock.net/t/1306881/official-asrock-z77-oc-formula-overclocking-troubleshooting-discussion/30_30


----------



## lilchronic

well dam i dont no what im talking about


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I would not run 3 way on those boards they have No PLX chip....
> 
> 3 way Sli u need a G1 Sniper 3 MVE or a UP7
> 
> Anywho there is a MVG over on Hard forum for 150$ shipped
> 
> And a G1 Sniper m3 for 125$ shipped <-- has triple spacing between top pci-e slot and bottom pci-e slot


Well the OC Formula does have a PLX chip but its a PEX8605 Chip lol.

plus I already have an MVG I just got my second PCS+ 7950 w/ Hynix's and well unless i get water blocks for them the first one is going to be choking lol.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juntzo*
> 
> It's copper according to Nickshih himself at post #45. http://www.overclock.net/t/1306881/official-asrock-z77-oc-formula-overclocking-troubleshooting-discussion/30_30


well according to the Overclockers review it has Aluminum / a copper heatpipe

While the MVF has a copper heatpipe as well as copper tubing. So I am not sure....


----------



## juntzo

Quote:


> well according to the Overclockers review it has Aluminum / a copper heatpipe


Nick Shih is the board's designer!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I would not run 3 way on those boards they have No PLX chip....
> 
> 3 way Sli u need a G1 Sniper 3 MVE or a UP7
> 
> Anywho there is a MVG over on Hard forum for 150$ shipped
> 
> And a G1 Sniper m3 for 125$ shipped <-- has triple spacing between top pci-e slot and bottom pci-e slot


forgot my board


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juntzo*
> 
> Nick Shih is the board's designer!


Oh I know lol. Just conflicting reports between a reviewer and a person who works at the company that makes it kinda irks me atm

But I am leaning towards the AOCF but with just a $10 difference between the AOCF and the MVF the lean just kinda goes away lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> forgot my board


Meh that thing cost over 100usd more then a Up7 what was Asus thinking?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Yea I was along the lines of VCCIO/VCCSA as With my 2600k I would've needed a bump in those. But not vcore. Maybe I got lucky in my 24hr prime at 1.36? lol who Knows.
> 
> Looking to up my mobo size the question is which formula to go?
> 
> Asrock OC formula
> 
> or
> 
> Maximus V Formula
> /
> The only thing I dont like about the OC formula is that the piping the in the hybrid cooler is aluminum.... who was the genius that thought of that?


Who needs vrm cooling for z77 anyway?
It doesn't even get hot for ln2 and 7ghz action man...
It only adds restriction to your loop and no benefit.
Get the OC Formula, or a z77x-up5th, or an MVE or UP7 if you want something better than the MVG. That board's already top notch.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh that thing cost over 100usd more then a Up7 what was Asus thinking?


It kinda sucks...Valgaur, get a proper board next time


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh that thing cost over 100usd more then a Up7 what was Asus thinking?


...may be 'you get what you pay for' ?!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...may be 'you get what you pay for' ?!


Valgaur's board sucks








I would never get a non rog Asus board...but that's just me. Don't mind me.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Who needs vrm cooling for z77 anyway?
> It doesn't even get hot for ln2 and 7ghz action man...
> It only adds restriction to your loop and no benefit.
> Get the OC Formula, or a z77x-up5th, or an MVE or UP7 if you want something better than the MVG. That board's already top notch.


Yea while its not needed its still pretty sweet to look at once its all connected imo. But its true I don't "need" it but why not? lol. The only reason I am even looking to sidegrade/upgrade is because I need the space for 2 of my PCS+ 7950's while I could just waterblock them and be happy with my MVG i kinda want an atx board again lol.

MVE/UP7 is just dumb expensive for 1155 boards imo (unless you do benching).


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Who needs vrm cooling for z77 anyway?
> It doesn't even get hot for ln2 and 7ghz action man...
> It only adds restriction to your loop and no benefit.
> Get the OC Formula, or a z77x-up5th, or an MVE or UP7 if you want something better than the MVG. That board's already top notch.
> It kinda sucks...Valgaur, get a proper board next time


Is mofset/vrm cooling worth it for x79? I was thinking it would be for me because my build is going to be on my desk, without any airflow directly or near the motherboard. Also I was thinking it would look cool, and doesn't really cost that much.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Valgaur's board sucks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would never get a non rog Asus board...but that's just me. Don't mind me.


I had been waiting for the MVE for months and I couldn't wait to build my rig any longer so I got the best one I could get and... as soon as I got it.... Newegg got the MVE I was so unbelievably pissed you have no idea......


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I had been waiting for the MVE for months and I couldn't wait to build my rig any longer so I got the best one I could get and... as soon as I got it.... Newegg got the MVE I was so unbelievably pissed you have no idea......


Why no return and exchange man!?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Is mofset/vrm cooling worth it for x79? I was thinking it would be for me because my build is going to be on my desk, without any airflow directly or near the motherboard. Also I was thinking it would look cool, and doesn't really cost that much.


100% worth it, like on AMD am3+.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Why no return and exchange man!?
> 100% worth it, like on AMD am3+.


I was so sick of waiting I couldn't I waited 4 months to build it and then waited another month for the board alone... all I wanted to do was just build the darn thing!


----------



## ivanlabrie

hehe...what would you do if you were me?

Sitting on two dead boards, just rma'd my cpu and now my MVG dies.








I may get my gpu tomorrow or by Wednesday, can't wait!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> hehe...what would you do if you were me?
> 
> Sitting on two dead boards, just rma'd my cpu and now my MVG dies.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may get my gpu tomorrow or by Wednesday, can't wait!


You still got a desktop? I was without one for 2 months waiting for an rma, I was near death when it was over.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You still got a desktop? I was without one for 2 months waiting for an rma, I was near death when it was over.


Yeah, tell me about it...I was without a pc of my own for 6 months or so.
Then got this pentium 4 rig, from scraps. After two months of using it I got my 3770k from RMA and started using the MVG, with an 8400gs which was all I had atm. That thing died and took the board with it.
So now, I'm back on the p4 Cedar mill rig, 2x1gb ddr2, no gpu. I'll be getting a 6950 1gb I got for real cheep, which will allow me to play Tera and keep my sanity while I gather funds for the RMA, an ln2 pot and a backup board and 3770k. (and a next gen gpu and monitor later on)


----------



## markovian

i havent seen a delided cpu for a long time but lol at intell really cheap out on the tim and the solder but charge as much as u do

small tip form someone who has delided omg 20+ amds may or may not be relivent

they sell ultra thin dubble sided razors take one break it in 1/2 electic tape 1/2 and angle it towds the ihs

back then i was dice and some other odd methods i killed a cpu a week they where like what 120 bucks eatch at the time tho

n i had no bills lol


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Keep in mind thermal paste works great for stock speeds. For all we know there were technical / cost challenges associated with soldering 22nm.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Keep in mind thermal paste works great for stock speeds. For all we know there were technical / cost challenges associated with soldering 22nm.


Sandy had a bigger die so I guess the solder was safer, lets see what they do with ivy bridge e and haswell.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I hate to tell you this, but that run was done some time back - no GB WF3 OC...just 4x Asus DirectCUii 670ies (915/980 stock before light modding) with one being a bit of a dog and holding the others back on synchro...once I finish my new build, I'll do some more runs with the GB WF3 OC on board


Oh the other day I thought you said you were able to crank around 1350MHz from the core clock with the WF3.


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Unless they are really deep scratches I wouldn't worry about them too much.
> 
> I am bummed. I can Hit 4.8 @ 1.36v with 1600mhz memory rock solid stability but to get my memory to 2133 I need 1.4v this is terrible lol.
> 
> Well the good thing is my temps don't reach 74c in a 80f room lol.


I'm at 4.7GHz v1.36 && 2133MHz 9-10-10-21-96-1T v1.6... gonna knock HT off and RAM down to 1600 and see where I can get my chip then!


----------



## illuz

Couldn't get 5GHz stable below v1.575


----------



## prest0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *codenamew*
> 
> Hi guys, yesterday I have delidded my 3570 k but unfortunately I scratches the pcb. Just a minor scratches and the copper seems to be exposed. Now the closest 2 memory slot to the CPU is not working whenever I tried to put a ram on it and it shows error 55. I have read in the forum that one of the possibilities is that I have damaged the imc but I saw someone with greater scratches than mine but working fine. Another thing is that could it be due to the seating of my nh-d14? I have tighten the screw till it no longer turns. Have I done sth wrong here and should I reseat my noctua? If yes could someone pls guide me on how to reseat it ? Thanks


Morning, gentlemen. I'm here with the exact same problem. But there's something else that happened. My delidded chip was working perfect until 4 days ago my PSU failed booting (I've googled the issue and found out that many corsairs CX600 have that problem). So at the beginning I was worried about my 3570k (which has some scratches on the pcb) or my UD3H so I reapplied the CLP and the AS5 on die and ihs respectively. Later I found the problem was only the PSU. So now I'm using an old Thermaltake 450W but it only has one 4 pin ATX 12V power connector and the UD3h requires ATX 8-pin 12V connection, anyway I connected it to my UD3h with 4pin missing and is working fine right now but with that little big ram problem.

Do you guys think is a power issue? Or the IMC is just dying because of the scratches and rubbing alcohol?


----------



## illuz

I wouldn't advise running the PSU with a 4 pin when it requires an 8 pin, it could possibly be that. However as you've scratched the PCB of the chip this has always been the cause of a faulty IMC on most of the damaged IB chips I've seen.

Do some more testing when you get the replacement PSU, or could you go test it out at a friends?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Oh the other day I thought you said you were able to crank around 1350MHz from the core clock with the WF3.


...I did - just got the GB WF3 OC last week...but the Valley run score of over 6000 was done well before then, exclusively with all Asus 670ies...reconstituting the MVE / 3770K and adding RIVE / 3970X, distributing the 5x 670ies (among them the GB WF3 OC) across those two setups over the course of this and next week (too busy at work to finish it ups as quickly as I would like).


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys, just a tip. Never buy a fierce gaming mouse. This thing sucks. I have to unplug it every time I boot into windows because it doesn't turn on so I have to unplug and plug it back in every single time I start my computer. MEH!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Valgaur's board sucks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would never get a non rog Asus board...but that's just me. Don't mind me.










...I wouldn't say 'it sucks' but for the money involved, I would go ROG every single time...I think Valgaur said that ROG versions weren't out yet at that time.

...ROG boards like MVE and Gigabyte counterparts like UP7 are used a lot for benching, but also have some semi-commercial applications (per earlier posts) due to their quality components and features, such as extra PCI lanes courtesy of Plex.

...*BUT*: When we first started to look at non-Xeon alternatives by investing in VMs, we started out with a couple of basic Asus P8Z77V-LKs and equipped them with 3770s (non-K, VT-D) just to build a new 'nucleus' for internal testing purposes....these V-LK boards were about $120 on sale, yet came with Sata 6G, SLI, USB3 and so forth....rock solid boards.

Then we added a Sabertooth Z77 (yes, I know the opinion of many 'delid regulars' on that board, especially about its Thermal Armor dress







)...again, ZERO problems...after adding a 3770K to the mix, both the V-LK and Sabertooth could validate as well as run daily @ well past 5 GHz (5.2 was the highest), though V-LK's phases don't go high enough on phase frequencies for longer-term 5.2+ settings. BTW, all configurations included a 'full-house' 32GB.

...the Z77 and now X79 ROG boards are a whole different animal, destined first for benching (also to find their weaknesses and limitations) and then hub/ light-commercial services...the extra PCI lanes will come in handy for PCIe cards for multiple NICs for VMs, LSI raid cards and perhaps even co-processors (Tesla, Intel Phi).

...that said, if building up a delidded Ivy machine with plans that *do not go beyond SLI*, I think folks would be well-served with the $120 V-LK (and likely the Gigabyte counterparts though I have not run GB Z77 yet). Ultimate speed is more likely a function of the particular Ivy 3770K you end up with, especially re vCore requirements and IMC.


----------



## chronicfx

And another tip... Don't order a motherboard from best buy. I ordered it friday and it still hasn't shipped. I ordered an rs360 kit from frozencpu 10 minutes after and it is out for delivery... Bb sucks. Guess i won't be installing a loop this weekend because my motherboard won't be here.

Sevond thought : Is it hard to swap a motherboard with a loop in place? If i were to install the loop with my extreme6 then put in the ud5h the weekend after this one?


----------



## enigma7820

I have a razer deathadder and its the best mouse I have ever owned, but I have only owned 5 diffenet mouses. its a 3500dpi mouse I bought on sale at best buy for 69.99, I just saw it there the other day for either 89.99 or 99.99


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I have a razer deathadder and its the best mouse I have ever owned, but I have only owned 5 diffenet mouses. its a 3500dpi mouse I bought on sale at best buy for 69.99, I just saw it there the other day for either 89.99 or 99.99


I ordered mine from Hong Kong for 40 shipped...should be here soonish.


----------



## illuz

Got my deathadder for 40 quid over here in the UK, only ever owned the Copper Head prior to this but the DA is very nice indeed!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I have a razer deathadder and its the best mouse I have ever owned, but I have only owned 5 diffenet mouses. its a 3500dpi mouse I bought on sale at best buy for 69.99, I just saw it there the other day for either 89.99 or 99.99


I have a g9x which has been solid for me the last two years. I could recommend that too though I have never tried the deathadder.


----------



## Hokies83

I use a Logitech M70 Thumb Ball mouse XD

Been using these for the last 13 years so i find it hard to use the old laser style anymore.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I did - just got the GB WF3 OC last week...but the Valley run score of over 6000 was done well before then, exclusively with all Asus 670ies...reconstituting the MVE / 3770K and adding RIVE / 3970X, distributing the 5x 670ies (among them the GB WF3 OC) across those two setups over the course of this and next week (too busy at work to finish it ups as quickly as I would like).










you work hrad


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Couldn't get 5GHz stable below v1.575


I feel your pain


----------



## SDBolts619

Since we've gotten into a sidetrack discussion about mice.... I've been considering the Corsair M95. I have a Logitech G700, which is quite good, but I do have a hard time getting the lower row of thumb buttons without rolling over to the top row (on press and hold situations such as weapon zoom, etc.) Does anyone here have the M95 and what do you think of it?

Back on track, my CLU is out for delivery with UPS! T minus 7 hours until delidding commences!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I have a razer deathadder and its the best mouse I have ever owned, but I have only owned 5 diffenet mouses. its a 3500dpi mouse I bought on sale at best buy for 69.99, I just saw it there the other day for either 89.99 or 99.99


i got mine at walmart for like 49.99 and my keyboard the razor deathstalker lol


----------



## TX2000

and here as high as i will go

http://valid.canardpc.com/2763522

not bad for 24/7


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> and here as high as i will go
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2763522
> 
> not bad for 24/7


not bad
this is as high as i go
http://valid.canardpc.com/2663970


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> not bad
> this is as high as i go
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2663970










nice

how are you cooling that
and did you downclocked your memory?

lol nm my brain is acting up because of the lack of sleep (memory part)


----------



## snowfree52

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> not bad
> this is as high as i go
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2663970


24/7 ?


----------



## netminder1976

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> and here as high as i will go
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2763522
> 
> not bad for 24/7


What temps you get with this? Im gonna try and get mine this high.


----------



## Scott1541

I'm surprised the mod squad haven't been in here and 'cleaned' the place up yet


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> 24/7 ?


i wish


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *netminder1976*
> 
> What temps you get with this? Im gonna try and get mine this high.


67C is the highest i got. running direct to die with CLP and raystorm RS360


----------



## dr/owned

Since this thread got sidetracked by mice, my 2 cents.

Had G500, switched to G9x. G9x feels more ergo in my hand. I only buy logitech mice because I've never had one break on me, and logitech has a great replacement policy. Razer I've heard says "go take a flying leap".

even more off topic, I'm a bit weird, I have the (nearly) exact same mouse/keyboard/wrist rest/mousepad setup at my home desk as I do at my work desk. I like the continuity.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I don't think I can get warranty coverage in Argentina anyway, so I said, eff that...I'm getting a reported as flawless sensor in my mouse and as cheep as possible.
Couldn't find the Microsoft mice of old so I settled with the Deathadder.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> I'm surprised the mod squad haven't been in here and 'cleaned' the place up yet


They don't because they come in here and chat with us







Plus we help many people every day but we get many OT question's from people so we get off topic that way a lot

eh hem

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They don't because they come in here and chat with us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Plus we help many people every day but we get many OT question's from people so we get off topic that way a lot
> 
> eh hem
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


...no no no - we're just 'well-rounded' and interested to peek beyond the little cubby-holes ( I was going to work Pink Floyd's 'The Wall' in there, but for now, it's cubby-holes )


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Topic sidetracked?? What topic?









We chat about everything here, but when someone has a question about delidding we are all ready to help. That is why this is my favorite thread on OCN. Thanks Valgaur!!


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> 67C is the highest i got. running direct to die with CLP and raystor, RS360


You have the same kinda chip as me mate, I'm now running 4.8Ghz 247 at v1.424, fluctuates between v1.36-42 depending on load. I'm gonna go direct contact too when I finish buying my custom loop


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They don't because they come in here and chat with us
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Plus we help many people every day but we get many OT question's from people so we get off topic that way a lot
> 
> eh hem
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


No 1.9v?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> No 1.9v?


*@ Valgaur* and Co....

...don't feel so bad for Frankie, there is this (as far as I know, air-cooled)









http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2662292


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *TX2000*
> 
> 67C is the highest i got. running direct to die with CLP and raystor, RS360
> 
> 
> 
> You have the same kinda chip as me mate, I'm now running 4.8Ghz 247 at v1.424, fluctuates between v1.36-42 depending on load. I'm gonna go direct contact too when I finish buying my custom loop
Click to expand...

Speaking of fluctuation, even with a multimeter measurement on my mobo's test point, the voltage was bang on 1.575V for me at idle or full load. Seems like ASRock did a good job with the OC Formula.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Topic sidetracked?? What topic?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We chat about everything here, but when someone has a question about delidding we are all ready to help. That is why this is my favorite thread on OCN. Thanks Valgaur!!


No problem








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> No 1.9v?


No I only did that to try for 5.6 a few times never took a pic of it as I never got 5.6


----------



## Ali Man

So do you guys think that Haswell would most probably use fluxless solder or would Intel use their 'Secret Sauce' and ruin these new chips again?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> So do you guys think that Haswell would most probably use fluxless solder or would Intel use their 'Secret Sauce' and ruin these new chips again?


Their secret sauce isn't bad at all it's the spacing that the glue made issues with the heat resourting to delidding, and with the smaller die size solder doesn't work so they will use TIM again


----------



## dr/owned

I'm guessing it'll be TIM again. Haswell was being worked on before Ivy Bridge was even released (as Broadwell is being worked on before Haswell is released), so the assembly/packaging methods are unlikely to change.

I say "worked on", I mean wafers / packaged chips exist.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I'm guessing it'll be TIM again. Haswell was being worked on before Ivy Bridge was even released (as Broadwell is being worked on before Haswell is released), so the assembly/packaging methods are unlikely to change.
> 
> I say "worked on", I mean wafers / packaged chips exist.


Even though you have a point in what you're saying, but this TIM issue was brought into light way back in 2012, so amendments could be made during that time as shipping just started this month.

Point being, if Intel wanted to resolve the problem, then they easily could have and also would have had the opportunity to do so during all this time, but if they don't, Haswell would be useless over Ivy in my opinion.


----------



## dr/owned

Remember though that Intel probably doesn't consider this a problem. Most sales probably go to OEMs that don't overclock at all, where overclocking is really where thermal paste vs solder matters.

I kinda hope Haswell is still thermal paste so I can delid it and keep doing direct-die.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I do a lot of buying and selling of parts. I'm always on the marketplace and the local Craigslist. I found a guy selling a bunch of mid-range enthusiast parts and in one of the PCs he was selling was a Corsair TX750w. The rig had a dead mobo, but I was able to sell all the other working parts, keep the TX750w and still make a profit. So it worked out well for me, free PSU essentially. The TX750 isn't exactly my dream PSU, but after reading a lot of reviews on JonnyGuru and HardwareSecrets, I was really uncomfortable powering $1000 worth of parts with a Thermaltake PSU.


What have you heard of Thermaltake PSU's? I've always thought they were a good reputable company. Thanks for the warning though, I'll look up the reviews. I haven't had an issue yet. I've had this build for about 7-8 months and the PSU for like 1 1/4 years. I know it comes with a 5 year warranty. I wonder if that would cover damage the PSU might cause. Prob' not. I really should look closer at warranty info.

I did however (as I said I got the PSU from Best Buy but I was without PC, usually I get all my stuff off Newegg, well I looked up Johnnyguru and Hardware Secrets but they were reviewing the Toughpower 850 watt PSU I had the Black Widow one, so I went on Newegg to see customer reviews, and I just found out that they did upgrade my model to something nicer. So I have the outdated model, but damn, I don't remember this PSU being 135 dollars?! I got it from BB which is supposedly higher priced at like 90 I think? No way it was more than 100. Both the outdated model (still available on newegg @ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153106) and newer version (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=17-153-158&Tpk=17-153-158) are $135. I'd love having the nicer one though someday. Kinda make you wonder powering your **** with something they found a problem with. Probably some minor improvements plus extra sexiness though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I don't really see a point in a case for a watercooled build. Its not going to be transportable anyway, due to weight and risk of destroying the loop, and it limits your space. Also it costs $.


Well, that's why I went with the Corsair H100i, I take my computer back and forth every week I'm moving it. But I'd sure like to know how much performance I'm losing by not using a custom loop.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh Ive had my AX 1200 for 3 years with 3 different systems... Bout the onlything Corsair does right...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh Ive had my AX 1200 for 3 years with 3 different systems... Bout the onlything Corsair does right...


haha my brother told me that he bought the hx1000w and it was DOA so he RMA'd it three different times cause each time it was DOA so the 4th time they sent him the AX 1200w and he's had it for the past three years lol


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Speaking of fluctuation, even with a multimeter measurement on my mobo's test point, the voltage was bang on 1.575V for me at idle or full load. Seems like ASRock did a good job with the OC Formula.


I use speedstep mate or in sure it'd be rock solid


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Razer is too expensive and over-rated at times:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Upgraded-Software-Precision-Programmable-Cartridge/dp/B00AAQRNQ8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1365539083&sr=8-1&keywords=anker+gaming

Get that - for £30, honestly best mouse I've ever used.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> haha my brother told me that he bought the hx1000w and it was DOA so he RMA'd it three different times cause each time it was DOA so the 4th time they sent him the AX 1200w and he's had it for the past three years lol


Only psu's ill buy from Corsair are the AX and the new digital power ones HX is a PoS.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I use a Logitech M70 Thumb Ball mouse XD
> 
> Been using these for the last 13 years so i find it hard to use the old laser style anymore.


Another one! I like the marble mice, got one for free many years ago since a friend got one for xmas & hated it, passed it around till it got to me & I liked it. Been using them ever since.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I don't think I can get warranty coverage in Argentina anyway, so I said, eff that...I'm getting a reported as flawless sensor in my mouse and as cheep as possible.
> Couldn't find the Microsoft mice of old so I settled with the Deathadder.


The cheap MS keyboards & mice can be handy, but I had the weirdest issue trying to run tri sli on the x79 rig recently. Nothing stable, even all stock with the third card in & tried everything, trading out all parts until I found the issue.
Unplugged the MS usb keyboard, plugged in a razer usb keyboard. fixed.
It took me all day to solve that one....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> So do you guys think that Haswell would most probably use fluxless solder or would Intel use their 'Secret Sauce' and ruin these new chips again?


I'm guessing TIM as well. They couldn't use solder on Ivy because of the new 3d transistors, & haswell is the same architecture.
Not sure how the temps will be though, haswell will be easier on the voltage, but don't toss out the blades & liquid metal TIM yet.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh Ive had my AX 1200 for 3 years with 3 different systems... Bout the onlything Corsair does right...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Only psu's ill buy from Corsair are the AX and the new digital power ones HX is a PoS.


My HX1000 worked well new, but 3 years later can't take a full 1000W load anymore. I have to stop wishing for an ax1200 & just get one...


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Razer is too expensive and over-rated at times:
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Upgraded-Software-Precision-Programmable-Cartridge/dp/B00AAQRNQ8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1365539083&sr=8-1&keywords=anker+gaming
> 
> Get that - for £30, honestly best mouse I've ever used.


I was about to get super excited since my Naos 5000 has an intermittent double click issue.

But then the scroll wheel and side lights neither change color nor turn off. Oh well. The wait continues :/


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Another one! I like the marble mice, got one for free many years ago since a friend got one for xmas & hated it, passed it around till it got to me & I liked it. Been using them ever since.
> The cheap MS keyboards & mice can be handy, but I had the weirdest issue trying to run tri sli on the x79 rig recently. Nothing stable, even all stock with the third card in & tried everything, trading out all parts until I found the issue.
> Unplugged the MS usb keyboard, plugged in a razer usb keyboard. fixed.
> It took me all day to solve that one....
> I'm guessing TIM as well. They couldn't use solder on Ivy because of the new 3d transistors, & haswell is the same architecture.
> Not sure how the temps will be though, haswell will be easier on the voltage, but don't toss out the blades & liquid metal TIM yet.
> 
> My HX1000 worked well new, but 3 years later can't take a full 1000W load anymore. I have to stop wishing for an ax1200 & just get one...


Get a BeQuiet! dark rock pro something...1500w I think.


----------



## Derko1

After killing my first 3770k with the blade... I am here to redeem my self! Wood and hammer method!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Took about 5 well placed hits and then it popped off. Temps are around 10-15C lower. Only used MX-4... will be replacing with CLU at the end of the week.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Say hello!!*
> 
> 
> *Vice I found at HD for around $24 bucks*
> 
> 
> *Vice... say hello to wood!*
> 
> 
> *Hammer what are you doing down there?!*
> 
> 
> *POP!* Needed the help of the dumb bells to hold the vice in place.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> After killing my first 3770k with the blade... I am here to redeem my self! Wood and hammer method!










grats!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice, and nice pics too!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> After killing my first 3770k with the blade... I am here to redeem my self! Wood and hammer method!


Congrats !







...have to say delidding seems to become more adventurous and fun...vise and dumb bells today...a few days ago a big Swiss Army knife in the pick







...still looking for someone to do the vise-and pliers 'twist-off' method (w/ pics and video please)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get a BeQuiet! dark rock pro something...1500w I think.


Just looked those up, decent looking units but 1200W is the biggest they have, not quite enough for a tri sli 680s or sli titans (I do want more, trying to hold off...).


----------



## Derko1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Congrats !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...have to say delidding seems to become more adventurous and fun...vise and dumb bells today...a few days ago a big Swiss Army knife in the pick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...still looking for someone to do the vise-and pliers 'twist-off' method (w/ pics and video please)


Yea... did that guy that wanted to have a delidder made.... ever get it done?

Thanks guys! After the horror that was having my CPU totally dead... and now being able to successfully do it in 5 minutes... it's pretty awesome!


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Congrats !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...have to say delidding seems to become more adventurous and fun...vise and dumb bells today...a few days ago a big Swiss Army knife in the pick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...still looking for someone to do the vise-and pliers 'twist-off' method (w/ pics and video please)
> 
> 
> 
> Yea... did that guy that wanted to have a delidder made.... ever get it done?
> 
> Thanks guys! After the horror that was having my CPU totally dead... and now being able to successfully do it in 5 minutes... it's pretty awesome!
Click to expand...

That was me that wanted to have a delidder made. Turned out to be too cost prohibitive at $200+ to get it done, because even though I have Solidworks models they'd still have to write up the tool paths for the CNC bits.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just looked those up, decent looking units but 1200W is the biggest they have, not quite enough for a tri sli 680s or sli titans (I do want more, trying to hold off...).


We were discussing this with Valgaur yesterday...I confused that one with another unit.








That one is absolutely perfect but lower wattage.

http://www.overclockers.com/cooler-master-m2-1500-power-supply-review/


----------



## Derko1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> That was me that wanted to have a delidder made. Turned out to be too cost prohibitive at $200+ to get it done, because even though I have Solidworks models they'd still have to write up the tool paths for the CNC bits.


That sucks.









I read your posts in the other thread up to that part where you posted that. I thought maybe you had found someone else.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> That was me that wanted to have a delidder made. Turned out to be too cost prohibitive at $200+ to get it done, because even though I have Solidworks models they'd still have to write up the tool paths for the CNC bits.
> 
> 
> 
> That sucks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I read your posts in the other thread up to that part where you posted that. I thought maybe you had found someone else.
Click to expand...

I got a second quote and it was in the same ballpark. Really I could probably outsource the g code generation to someone in eastern europe for $20, but I said "meh" and just bought a clamp and hammer.

True story: I had to have a PCB made up for a project. Outsourced the design to a guy in the Ukraine for $500 and it would have cost at least $2000 to have an American do it. Quality I got back was fantastic too, even though I had to be up at 4 AM to talk to the guy.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> We were discussing this with Valgaur yesterday...I confused that one with another unit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That one is absolutely perfect but lower wattage.
> 
> http://www.overclockers.com/cooler-master-m2-1500-power-supply-review/


I haven't bought a coolermaster psu since I made the mistake of getting a 650w CM psu, that exploded when loaded up with a whopping 430W pulled from the wall (80% bronze, so actually about a 350W load).
I've blown up better psus, but really had to work at it.

Still eyeballing the ax1200s, I can always do dual psu when needed....


----------



## MKHunt

Plus AX1200s don't have the rainbow cables. I keep trying to find a 1000W+ PSU to replace my tired 850 (at titan load at stock volts the fan spins to max waaaaaay fast) but all the cables are rainbow colored :/

That Be Quiet psu sure does have some nice numbers though.

Vega's had generally not negative things to say about his NEX1500. But it costs an arm and a leg.


----------



## FtW 420

OMG, looking at the evga supernova 1500w, & the price tag....

is over $500


----------



## MKHunt

Oh right, Canadaland. It shows $409 USD for me. -15% coupon sitting in my Titan box good for any EVGA PSU and suddenly it's $348.50 for me (lmk if there is interest in the 15% coupon)

$500 CAD is rather ridiculous though.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> OMG, looking at the evga supernova 1500w, & the price tag....
> 
> is over $500


It is Evga They make 12 different Gtx 680s Change the bios on one make it 10mhz faster then another and charge 10$ more for the same cards.

Why i hate Evga.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> OMG, looking at the evga supernova 1500w, & the price tag....
> 
> is over $500


...got both my AX1200s on sale for CAD $269 +tx each at NCIX


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I haven't bought a coolermaster psu since I made the mistake of getting a 650w CM psu, that exploded when loaded up with a whopping 430W pulled from the wall (80% bronze, so actually about a 350W load).
> I've blown up better psus, but really had to work at it.
> 
> Still eyeballing the ax1200s, I can always do dual psu when needed....


I can hook you up with used great units for spare change if you wish...
Read the review, it's a superb unit, that CM one man.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is Evga They make 12 different Gtx 680s Change the bios on one make it 10mhz faster then another and charge 10$ more for the same cards.
> 
> Why i hate Evga.


Indeed, they charge more for the factory overclocked cards, yet every SC type card I've gotten since the 400 series, have overclocked worse than the cheaper vanilla models I've gotten.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...got both my AX1200s on sale for CAD $269 +tx each at NCIX


That is the price right now, might go for one. A good strong single rail is handy for benching the power hog gpus like the 580.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I can hook you up with used great units for spare change if you wish...
> Read the review, it's a superb unit, that CM one man.


It doesn't look bad, just the name. It's like the Asrock of PSUs, there is the OC Formula, then the rest....
Spare change is a good sounding price though.


----------



## dr/owned

I sold my 680 SC because it would crash at STOCK speeds (RMA-ed it and sold it). Factory overclocked cards are a waste of money unless they've done something to the hardware (like MSI did with the Lightnings having > 1.21V). Cards where it's just a +10 Mhz bump for +$20...bleh.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is the price right now, might go for one. A good strong single rail is handy for benching the power hog gpus like the 580..


...not to rush you or anything, but the $30 off ends April 10...










http://www.ncix.com/products/?sku=53721&vpn=CMPSU-1200AX&manufacture=Corsair


----------



## Valgaur

I'm gonna need a biiig PSU for my build...

RIVE+ 3930K (oced)

4 7950's

yeah....

thinkin this

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182251


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Derko1*
> 
> After killing my first 3770k with the blade... I am here to redeem my self! Wood and hammer method!


Nice one man!!
Does she run?
And temps







?


----------



## Derko1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Nice one man!!
> Does she run?
> And temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?


Yea it runs great!









Well... today we had basically a +85F day... so that did not help. BUT! Temps I was getting before were in the mid to high 80C's. That was with 45F weather outside and with the window cracked open a bit. Now I am in the high 70C's, so I think that I've easily seen a drop of around 10-15C. If we have another cold day, I'll be able to better gauge the actual change.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm gonna need a biiig PSU for my build...
> 
> RIVE+ 3930K (oced)
> 
> 4 7950's
> 
> yeah....
> 
> thinkin this
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182251


You already have 1 AX 1200 just get another one.. 2 of them is enough for anything.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You already have 1 AX 1200 just get another one.. 2 of them is enough for anything.


but then i'll need another one for benching.....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> but then i'll need another one for benching.....


?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Single rail needs massive juice for ln2 gpu benching Hokies...that's why.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Single rail needs massive juice for ln2 gpu benching Hokies...that's why.


Lmao 2 ax 1200s = over 200 amps on the 12v rail.. Plenty enough then some.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Single rail needs massive juice for ln2 gpu benching Hokies...that's why.


exactly I need a giant ass psu... or i will be buying 2 more ax1200....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Thracks
> Apr 6, 2013 at 12:32 pm
> The 7950 takes about 15 amps at absolutely max load, maybe 17A overclocked. If you can fit four of those and the rest of your system into 100A, you'll probably be just fine.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's ambient oc...I'm talking 1700mhz core with ln2. Way more wattage.


----------



## Hokies83

Umm yah No way on Gods earth 4 7950s are going to use more then 200 Amps .


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Lmao 2 ax 1200s = over 200 amps on the 12v rail.. Plenty enough then some.


if I have 2 AX1200's in my build... then what psu do i need for benching? another AX1200 thats what. I'd rather get a huge 1500 or 1600 PSU for my main rig and have my current ax1200 for benching...... simple as that.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Single rail needs massive juice for ln2 gpu benching Hokies...that's why.


TiN's gtx 580 testing is still mind boggling. I was wondering why I never got great clocks from the 580 lightning until I saw that...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Umm yah No way on Gods earth 4 7950s are going to use more then 200 Amps .


The 7950s won't use all the juice, but when he gets down to benching he will likely start getting the higher end cards for global scores, might as well be prepared.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if I have 2 AX1200's in my build... then what psu do i need for benching? another AX1200 thats what. I'd rather get a huge 1500 or 1600 PSU for my main rig and have my current ax1200 for benching...... simple as that.


UH ur not gonna use ur main rig for benching?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> TiN's gtx 580 testing is still mind boggling. I was wondering why I never got great clocks from the 580 lightning until I saw that...
> The 7950s won't use all the juice, but when he gets down to benching he will likely start getting the higher end cards for global scores, might as well be prepared.


Isen't the 1600 Watt Lepa the one ppl are suggesting?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> UH ur not gonna use ur main rig for benching?


UH no! When are you gonna build a $4,000 test bench Hokie?


----------



## ivanlabrie

That Lepa unit is very nice...Top notch stuff.

580s eat volts like mad







I like them. I'd get 580 quad sli over 680s really.
Good boints to be had too.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> UH no! When are you gonna build a $4,000 test bench Hokie?


I do not bench waste of time imo.

I rather sell the profits from my 7950s on Ebay and play games.. And make things look pretty









Im more of a Flash / E-peen / gamer / make money where i can type.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> UH ur not gonna use ur main rig for benching?


I will... but not LN2 it'll be on water so a 1500-1600 will be fine for it but 1200 wont be enough. my 1200 will be for LN2 stuff only.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Isen't the 1600 Watt Lepa the one ppl are suggesting?


I'm debating that one or the hercules


----------



## stickg1

No upgrades for me for a bit. I'm gonna get some tires for the truck and need to get my puppy fixed. Also thinking of trading wifey's car in and getting something bigger. The boys keep getting bigger and the Jeep Grand Cherokee isn't cutting it anymore.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Isen't the 1600 Watt Lepa the one ppl are suggesting?


That would cover almost everything you can bench, it would start getting tight for really high overclocked quad gpu setups with a high overclocked cpu, but should still handle things as high as water cooled cards will go.

Getting into ln2 cooled multi gpu would still need more. I pretty much stick to single card when freezing now so won't need 5 x ax1200s to run the rig like the guys freezing 4 x 580s were, 1 for the gpu & another psu for the rest of the rig will work.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Things can get kinda crazy with ln2...I'll start with dice and cpus only, mostly 775 and maybe some 3770k love for 2d action.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not bench waste of time imo.
> 
> I rather sell the profits from my 7950s on Ebay and play games.. And make things look pretty
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im more of a Flash / E-peen / gamer / make money where i can type.


There can be some money in benching, just takes a while to get there. Part of the reason I'm an editor now is the OCN bench competitions, it used to be like a regular paycheck for me, editors don't win prizes so more people can win now.
Still trying to win the ticket to the MOA finals for the cash prizes, but I do win free boards & stuff while failing.
Last year was probably around $3000 in cash & prizes for getting good bench scores.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if I have 2 AX1200's in my build... then what psu do i need for benching? another AX1200 thats what. I'd rather get a huge 1500 or 1600 PSU for my main rig and have my current ax1200 for benching...... simple as that.










...something else to consider: What are your phases like re the location you plan to do that... For 2x AX1200s (plus an 850 and 6x 625 and various peripherals) I ended up pulling power from three wall outlets - feeding one set of machines via a 50ft HD 10 gauge industrial extension cord...kitchens and garages often have the strongest phases. With a single 1500W +, you have reduced options - as nice as they otherwise are. With 2x 1200 or even 3x 1200, you can combine without too much trouble... not least as AX1200s are single rail gold std...again, all depends on the electrical wiring @ the place you plan to run that


----------



## SDBolts619

In!



Before:


Spoiler: Warning: Large!







After:


Spoiler: Warning: Large!







OCN name: SDBolts619
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Liguid Ultra
ihs-TIM: AS-5
Mhz gained: none yet
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 14-19c


----------



## Hokies83

Just snagged this for my 2nd Tri fire rig im building cough cough " will pay my morgage payment"

http://www.overclock.net/t/1380420/fs-1200w-antec-tpq-psu/0_20


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just snagged this for my 2nd Tri fire rig im building cough cough " will pay my morgage payment"
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1380420/fs-1200w-antec-tpq-psu/0_20


And cough cough it's looking like GPU's won't be very good for paying the mortgage anymore, in the same way CPUs became dinosaurs.

I'm sure someone reading this is like "what the eff are they talking about".


----------



## stickg1

FTW, when are you gonna have us over for margaritas?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Depends on what kind of dinosaurs you're talking about...Bsaurus are not profitable long ago. Lsaurus on the other hand.









I want moar coca cola, just ran out.









Tomorrow I'll attend that Intel Extreme overclocking workshop thing, at Intel's HQ in Buenos Aires!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Depends on what kind of dinosaurs you're talking about...Bsaurus are not profitable long ago. Lsaurus on the other hand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want moar coca cola, just ran out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tomorrow I'll attend that Intel Extreme overclocking workshop thing, at Intel's HQ in Buenos Aires!


See if they'll let you leave with a chip for a decent price.

Errr is your chip fixed but board broken? I can't remember.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> See if they'll let you leave with a chip for a decent price.
> 
> Errr is your chip fixed but board broken? I can't remember.


New chip...fresh from rma.
Dead mobo, gotta ship to USA for RMA.

I may buy a z77x-ud4h next month if I get some good profit.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> And cough cough it's looking like GPU's won't be very good for paying the mortgage anymore, in the same way CPUs became dinosaurs.
> 
> I'm sure someone reading this is like "what the eff are they talking about".


Cough Gpus are fine cough 3 7950 = 1000 USD a month cough Morgage is 980usd a month cough

Since those cough Asic machines came to play my profits have went up cough cough blocks get solved faster at less profits for me cough.. but at the speed there being solved in the end has = higher profits for me cough.

im in a POOL Cough


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cough Gpus are fine cough 3 7950 = 1000 USD a month cough Morgage is 980usd a month cough


Check the news, cough, GPUs are soon to be phased out any month now.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Check the news, cough, GPUs are soon to be phased out any month now.


Cough cough NOPE.


----------



## ivanlabrie

We're gonna get slapped...we need a skype chat thing.


----------



## dr/owned

It's going to be like everything else: a few people initially make some money, then people with big bankrolls show up, little people can no longer compete, people with big bankrolls make their bankrolls even bigger, little people find something else to do. It's even worse than a normal cycle, because it's a game where bankroll is everything.

We're talking about gold mining in alaska right? When's the last time you saw grandpa joe with one tooth standing in a river panning by himself? Oh wait, Caterpillar showed up and wrecked him.

And would someone throw a cough drop bomb on this page


----------



## ivanlabrie

I recently saw a chinese dude fitting 771 quad core chips on 775 boards...that's sick stuff!


----------



## Valgaur

so.... what psu?? 1500 evga or 1600 hercules??


----------



## ivanlabrie

EVGA, nope...1500w coolermaster, two big rails.
Or the LEPA unit.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> so.... what psu?? 1500 evga or 1600 hercules??


EVGA is somewhat gimmicky in my view. Like their motherboards and psu are really cheap for what you get... raises concerns about quality. They released a 680 for mac... whats the point if there are like no games that you can actually play on mac that requires a 680.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> EVGA is somewhat gimmicky in my view. Like their motherboards and psu are really cheap for what you get... raises concerns about quality. They released a 680 for mac... *whats the point if there are like no games that you can actually play on mac that requires a 680.*


That's exactly what I was thinking, about the Mac thing.
Pretty lame. A GPU for an OS that doesn't even support games, ingenius.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'm pretty sure MAC asked for the Mac edition cards, there's also a 7950 white mac edition.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There can be some money in benching, just takes a while to get there. Part of the reason I'm an editor now is the OCN bench competitions, it used to be like a regular paycheck for me, editors don't win prizes so more people can win now.
> Still trying to win the ticket to the MOA finals for the cash prizes, but I do win free boards & stuff while failing.
> Last year was probably around $3000 in cash & prizes for getting good bench scores.


I think what you mean is extreme benching with cherry chips, something that not all of us have the pleasure of doing.
Benching by itself? Yea that's a definitely GO, on air, water.......


----------



## ivanlabrie

Why cherry chips? You do the binning yourself man...there's a bunch of us into that here.
Even in Argentina...


----------



## dr/owned

Because binning yourself costs you money unless you have access to chips at prices below what the market is paying. It wouldn't make sense to buy a $250 3770k, find it sucks, and then resell it for $200 and rinse-repeat.

(unless you're doing it for fun, in which case hobbies are expensive).


----------



## ivanlabrie

You can sell the good ones for a LOT...look at kpc forums or xs for example.
And, the binning pays off once you find a good chip to freeze. If you're into benching.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> EVGA, nope...1500w coolermaster, two big rails.
> Or the LEPA unit.


does the lepa have braided cables? I want nice looking cables for the build.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Why cherry chips? You do the binning yourself man...there's a bunch of us into that here.
> Even in Argentina...


Binning just by looking through Batch No.s?
Not sure what you mean.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Because binning yourself costs you money unless you have access to chips at prices below what the market is paying. It wouldn't make sense to buy a $250 3770k, find it sucks, and then resell it for $200 and rinse-repeat.
> 
> (unless you're doing it for fun, in which case hobbies are expensive).


Lol, yea I was thinking the same.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> does the lepa have braided cables? I want nice looking cables for the build.


Buy ext.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> I think what you mean is extreme benching with cherry chips, something that not all of us have the pleasure of doing.
> Benching by itself? Yea that's a definitely GO, on air, water.......


I haven't always benched extreme, & have only ever gotten 1 truly cherry cpu. My 2600k was the only one that could be called golden.
As far as the bigger competitions now extreme cooled is the way to go, but before going extreme I only water cooled, & still finished on the podium for prize money almost every time.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Big custom case, either sleeve yourself or buy extensions as Hokies said.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I haven't always benched extreme, & have only ever gotten 1 truly cherry cpu. My 2600k was the only one that could be called golden.
> As far as the bigger competitions now extreme cooled is the way to go, but before going extreme I only water cooled, & still finished on the podium for prize money almost every time.


So it's by coincidence that you win each time even with non-golden chips?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> So it's by coincidence that you win each time even with non-golden chips?


It's not always about the clock speeds...depending on the bench, that's secondary. Main thing is tweaking and selecting the proper os.
I got the ucbench2011 wr with less clocks than the second guy for example. (with a G620)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> So it's by coincidence that you win each time even with non-golden chips?


No, I was just willing to push them harder than most people. I spent many hours outdoors bundled up like an eskimo on the cold nights spending 6 hours to get a good 8 second superpi time, etc.
It is a money game too, that top of the line memory kit for a good pi time doesn't come cheap.


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Is there really any secret sauce to winning? Every time I read about a record being set there's some mention of "he didn't give all the details". Like he wrote a custom BIOS with access to a secret CPU voltage rail


----------



## ivanlabrie

You need to know how to tweak the software, what driver version is best, specific details of each benchmark program, of each piece of hardware...a whole bunch of stuff.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need to know how to tweak the software, what driver version is best, specific details of each benchmark program, of each piece of hardware...a whole bunch of stuff.


This, it's a game of time & patience. Not too hard to OC the cpu to the max, or the gpu, memory takes more time but it gets there. Finding all the tweaks & doing the testing to get the most out of a benchmark with the hardware being used can take a long time
Then trying to tie it all together for one great bench score is the real challenge.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hence my love for Aquamark, gotta learn to love pcm05 and 3d01 though...pcm05, yikes. :/
There were some cheep irams, but no monies.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's not always about the clock speeds...depending on the bench, that's secondary. Main thing is tweaking and selecting the proper os.
> I got the ucbench2011 wr with less clocks than the second guy for example. (with a G620)


Basically hardware plays it obvious part, but software does a lot too, yea I get that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> No, I was just willing to push them harder than most people. I spent many hours outdoors bundled up like an eskimo on the cold nights spending 6 hours to get a good 8 second superpi time, etc.
> It is a money game too, that top of the line memory kit for a good pi time doesn't come cheap.


Fair enough. Although I thought it was a little warmer down in Vancouver than compared to Ontario?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Basically hardware plays it obvious part, but software does a lot too, yea I get that.
> Fair enough. Although I thought it was a little warmer down in Vancouver than compared to Ontario?


It usually is warmer here, but we do get some cold nights in the winter. Before starting with extreme cooling I looked forward to them very much, although it usually didn't get colder than -10° or so. I still bench outdoors in winter when air cooling cards
At my old place I chopped a hole in the living room wall after a while so I could put the rig outside, running the cables through the hole so I could sit inside with the monitor, mouse & keyboard. Just had to go outside when I had to clear the cmos.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It usually is warmer here, but we do get some cold nights in the winter. Before starting with extreme cooling I looked forward to them very much, although it usually didn't get colder than -10° or so. I still bench outdoors in winter when air cooling cards
> At my old place I chopped a hole in the living room wall after a while so I could put the rig outside, running the cables through the hole so I could sit inside with the monitor, mouse & keyboard. *Just had to go outside when I had to clear the cmos.*


I benched some outside winter 2011 and a little bit early last winter. When running cables, clearing the CMOS is just an extra 2 wires to run and then you never have to be cold. Just keep the PSU on its own switchable socket.

I guess it wasn't really outside, but the rig was in the garage.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It usually is warmer here, but we do get some cold nights in the winter. Before starting with extreme cooling I looked forward to them very much, although it usually didn't get colder than -10° or so. I still bench outdoors in winter when air cooling cards
> At my old place I chopped a hole in the living room wall after a while so I could put the rig outside, running the cables through the hole so I could sit inside with the monitor, mouse & keyboard. Just had to go outside when I had to clear the cmos.


Interesting man. It does sound like fun though. Over here down in Florida, barely ever get to see cool days.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You need dry ice and stuff to prevent condensation me thinks...or a water chiller.


----------



## Ali Man

That stuff causes condensation, not prevents it lol.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Razer is too expensive and over-rated at times:
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Upgraded-Software-Precision-Programmable-Cartridge/dp/B00AAQRNQ8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1365539083&sr=8-1&keywords=anker+gaming
> 
> Get that - for £30, honestly best mouse I've ever used.


Unless I'm playing a flight sim or a platformer the only peripheral I use is a Razer Hydra motion controller. No other company makes anything like it or I'd love to see what the competition could come up with, it has literally redefined gaming for me. I make gaming videos of using it on my youtube channel under the same name as my name here on Overclock.net. I used mouse and keyboard almost exclusively to game for over 15 years but haven't needed to game with one ever in the two years since getting my Hydra.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> That stuff causes condensation, not prevents it lol.


I think he meant
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You need dry ice*,* and stuff to prevent condensation me thinks...or a water chiller.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Unless I'm playing a flight sim or a platformer the only peripheral I use is a Razer Hydra motion controller. *No other company makes anything like it* or I'd love to see what the competition could come up with, it has literally redefined gaming for me. I make gaming videos of using it on my youtube channel under the same name as my name here on Overclock.net. I used mouse and keyboard almost exclusively to game for over 15 years but haven't needed to game with one ever in the two years since getting my Hydra.


Sorry, it was so easy.


----------



## Ali Man

Condensation only till a certain temperature, only gotta keep a watch at temps as it goes down.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> That stuff causes condensation, not prevents it lol.


Hmmm...colder than ambient air stuff will get condensation.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I think he meant


lol, yah xD
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Condensation only till a certain temperature, only gotta keep a watch at temps as it goes down.


I meant that you could try a water chiller for cheap sub zero action, but you'd need to prep your hardware to withstand condensation without shorting. (insulation)


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Sorry, it was so easy.


Well obviously, but good luck getting decent gaming action with it on PC, unless of course you're emulating with dolphin which is a lot of fun and makes the gf happy. Then I wanted to try the half life 2 wii mod but even though my bluetooth dongle was compatible with wiimote, the bluetooth stack the person used to compile the program didn't like my dongle so was out of luck, then turned to the whole GlovePIE thing and found out that I would never get acceptal gameplay with PC titles. And there aren't many good fps games on Wii, Then Hydra came along. So really no, a Wii isn't like a Hydra, similar concept but magnets instead of a sensor bar (something I didn't like at first but I love ratcheting now) However, the profile system for it sucks, you gotta write your own script and just make it the default so it runs on every game, you only need one configuration for any FPS, Third Person Shooters, and MMO type games, but RTS games need to be configured singularly but for non-rts games we don't need the 150+ different profiles that come with it. Just a heads up, it needs a bit of work before it works right for you, not just something you can be enjoying 100% on the first day or even the first week.

Also after 15+ years of mouse/keyboard gaming I felt I was starting to get carpal tunnel from a mouse. Luckily now I can game all day every day with no discomfort. A great thing I say. Some people in my life would say otherwise I'm sure. lol

Ivanlabrie:OMG. Thanks for the link to the MLP fan club on your signature. 6000 pages??? My night is gone now. ^^


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hmmm...colder than ambient air stuff will get condensation.
> lol, yah xD
> I meant that you could try a water chiller for cheap sub zero action, but you'd need to prep your hardware to withstand condensation without shorting. (insulation)


what is the best way to insulate a board?
i just watched this on youtube


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Well obviously, but good luck getting decent gaming action with it on PC, unless of course you're emulating with dolphin which is a lot of fun and makes the gf happy. Then I wanted to try the half life 2 wii mod but even though my bluetooth dongle was compatible with wiimote, the bluetooth stack the person used to compile the program didn't like my dongle so was out of luck, then turned to the whole GlovePIE thing and found out that I would never get acceptal gameplay with PC titles. And there aren't many good fps games on Wii, Then Hydra came along. So really no, a Wii isn't like a Hydra, similar concept but magnets instead of a sensor bar (something I didn't like at first but I love ratcheting now) However, the profile system for it sucks, you gotta write your own script and just make it the default so it runs on every game, you only need one configuration for any FPS, Third Person Shooters, and MMO type games, but RTS games need to be configured singularly but for non-rts games we don't need the 150+ different profiles that come with it. Just a heads up, it needs a bit of work before it works right for you, not just something you can be enjoying 100% on the first day or even the first week.
> 
> Also after 15+ years of mouse/keyboard gaming I felt I was starting to get carpal tunnel from a mouse. Luckily now I can game all day every day with no discomfort. A great thing I say. Some people in my life would say otherwise I'm sure. lol
> 
> Ivanlabrie:OMG. Thanks for the link to the MLP fan club on your signature. 6000 pages??? My night is gone now. ^^










have fun! I lost track of the club thread already...been to busy, this club takes a considerable part of my browsing time.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what is the best way to insulate a board?
> i just watched this on youtube


Best way? There is no such thing...just avoid using vaseline near the cpu socket.
Ask FtW


----------



## Arm3nian

How come more people don't use water chillers? Seems somewhat more convenient than dice/ln2


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How come more people don't use water chillers? Seems somewhat more convenient than dice/ln2


IIRC Not cold enough. You'll still get condensation below dew point anyway.. (18C?) Only way to go below freezing point is to mix the water with alcohol or glycol or something that lowers the freezing point. Even so, you are not going to get the processor below freezing.

SSphase can get you to between minus 30 and minus 50. Cascade can get you to around minus 110...
Dice can get you around minus 80, while LN2 can get you to minus 196....and then there's liquid helium


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> IIRC Not cold enough. You'll still get condensation below dew point anyway.. (18C?) Only way to go below freezing point is to mix the water with alcohol or glycol or something that lowers the freezing point. Even so, you are not going to get the processor below freezing.
> 
> SSphase can get you to between minus 30 and minus 50. Cascade can get you to around minus 110...
> Dice can get you around minus 80, while LN2 can get you to minus 196....and then there's liquid helium


Liquid Helium, alright ! -269 degrees Celsius


----------



## Ali Man

Well theoretically LN2/Dice can't be used 24/7. That's just for extreme benching, breaking records, etc.

Water chillers are great for 24/7 usage, but cost quite a bit.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Well theoretically LN2/Dice can't be used 24/7. That's just for extreme benching, breaking records, etc.
> 
> Water chillers are great for 24/7 usage, but cost quite a bit.


...I'm trying to find where I saw it, but there is a unique version of a TEC unit that has sensors that keeps your CPU within 2 to 3 C of its idle temp even under load - so no ice / condensation issues. It's major draw-back was power consumption...I have to look for the link


----------



## KuuFA

Hmm so just made a loop with left over parts

ax120 w/ sp120 p/p

xspc kit reservoir/pump combo

and an rasa

my idle temps are ridiculously high lol I am talking ~41c did I get a bad mount? or what is going on lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Hmm so just made a loop with left over parts
> 
> ax120 w/ sp120 p/p
> 
> xspc kit reservoir/pump combo
> 
> and an rasa
> 
> my idle temps are ridiculously high lol I am talking ~41c did I get a bad mount? or what is going on lol.


...pics possible ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have fun! I lost track of the club thread already...been to busy, this club takes a considerable part of my browsing time.
> Best way? There is no such thing...just avoid using vaseline near the cpu socket.
> Ask FtW


I think LET (liquid electric tape) is probably the most versatile. Dragon skin like in the video is good to at least -125° or so, but the first time I ran at -196° for a while the dragon skin all cracked apart. LET is still fine at -196°.
Vaseline is the quickest & easiest, I've insulated a board in 2 minutes from out of the box & got to freezing, messy to clean after & vaseline does not agree with z77 sockets as ivan pointed out.
Eraser takes a while to put on, but comes off pretty easily & works at all temps..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Liquid Helium, alright ! -269 degrees Celsius


I'd like to try it sometime, very expensive & needs custom made pots for it to be really effective....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Well theoretically LN2/Dice can't be used 24/7. That's just for extreme benching, breaking records, etc.
> 
> Water chillers are great for 24/7 usage, but cost quite a bit.


Water chiller is similar to running phase, both are basically air conditioners, a few hundred watts. But what's a bit of electricity compared to more speed? It's fun to stomp on the gas pedal sometimes, even when gas is so expensive (almost as much as premium bottled water







)!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'm trying to find where I saw it, but there is a unique version of a TEC unit that has sensors that keeps your CPU within 2 to 3 C of its idle temp even under load - so no ice / condensation issues. It's major draw-back was power consumption...I have to look for the link


This one? http://www.overclock.net/t/1092075/drop-in-waterblock-for-the-ivy-sandy-bridge-without-the-tec-headaches


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> This one? http://www.overclock.net/t/1092075/drop-in-waterblock-for-the-ivy-sandy-bridge-without-the-tec-headaches


...yeah, but there was also the chap from TO who had referenced that unit via a different link to a store...in any case, per your link above, it seems to be all about the dew point controller that makes it different from a normal TEC as it would not require any insulation


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...pics possible ?




Its a really small loop lol.

Is the ax just not good enough for just the processor?

I mean I have built a couple of loops but haven't got temps like this before.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> This one? http://www.overclock.net/t/1092075/drop-in-waterblock-for-the-ivy-sandy-bridge-without-the-tec-headaches


Found it: http://www.arqtik.com/index.php/product/1-180sdd-single-direct-die-1155-1156-black ...the only problem: The store is closed







the unit was only $149 for LG1155 and a bit more for Sandy


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> 
> 
> Its a really small loop lol.
> 
> Is the ax just not good enough for just the processor?
> 
> I mean I have built a couple of loops but haven't got temps like this before.


...since you mentioned that it was that high at idle (41 C), it either is a bad mount or there is s.th. wrong with the pump / hoses


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...since you mentioned that it was that high at idle (41 C), it either is a bad mount or there is s.th. wrong with the pump / hoses


Yea checked the pump its going strong I guess its just a bad mount lol. but man this is going to be a pain! this case is was made before back plate cut outs were popular lol.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Found it: http://www.arqtik.com/index.php/product/1-180sdd-single-direct-die-1155-1156-black ...the only problem: The store is closed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the unit was only $149 for LG1155 and a bit more for Sandy


The link to his store was in his thread.
But yeah, it's been closed for a while now, not sure if it will open again or not, can PM him & ask I guess.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The link to his store was in his thread.
> But yeah, it's been closed for a while now, not sure if it will open again or not, can PM him & ask I guess.


...yeah..but we saw it elsewhere







.I'm in regular PM contact with the chap from TO who actually has some of that equipment (and then some)...I'll ask him..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Yea checked the pump its going strong I guess its just a bad mount lol. but man this is going to be a pain! this case is was made before back plate cut outs were popular lol.


...funny that you mention that - I'm working on a dual side-by-side ROG system that is case-less







I really LOVE case-less since I started working on it


----------



## Arm3nian

Anyone know how long the 3570k and 3770k sale at microcenter will last? I'm going to go to Best Buy and try and get it priced match, my uncle is in the market for one.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's not a sale but the regular price...


----------



## D33G33

OCN name: D33G33
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: TBA
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 16degrees
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2764397

Just pulled the pin and delidded after I was less than impressed with my new (and first) watercooling set up. Hottest core is now peaking at 66degrees when only running my fans at 5v. So much better!
Will try at 4.5ghz and go for a max OC when I have more time.

Update// Just bumped up to 4.5ghz and max temp was 62degrees using the testing methods for this thread which is 4 degrees lower than when i was running OCCT @ 4.4ghz for an hour. It doesnt give you accurate data (sorry) but i'm really happy with the results.

DeLidded!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> FTW, when are you gonna have us over for margaritas?


haha that guy was so funny!
That's what I love about the USA - a bit of sense of humour, not straight down boring talk, like the English, here in England.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Water chiller is similar to running phase, both are basically air conditioners, a few hundred watts. But what's a bit of electricity compared to more speed? It's fun to stomp on the gas pedal sometimes, even when gas is so expensive (almost as much as premium bottled water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )!


Yea I agree, except that phase is more like a custom water chiller and you still recommend phase rather than a chiller and also for it being cheaper?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> haha that guy was so funny!
> That's what I love about the USA - a bit of sense of humour, not straight down boring talk, like the English, here in England.


You English folk in England...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Yea I agree, except that phase is more like a custom water chiller and you still recommend phase rather than a chiller and also for it being cheaper?


Phase is more expensive than a chiller...Chiller can be done with a waterblock, a pump, a big icebox thing, tubing and insulation for it and a cheep window ac unit. You just put the evaporator inside the water tank and fill it with glycol or something with low freezing points. A big enough AC can cool both a gpu and cpu, maybe more.
And there's also the Hailea HC500 and similar units which can be used with great success. A guy I know runs two in his triple titan and 3770k system. It goes down to 4c though, with 3 gpus.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SDBolts619*
> 
> In!
> 
> 
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Large!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Large!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: SDBolts619
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Liguid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: AS-5
> Mhz gained: none yet
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 14-19c


You're In!







very clean job! now show your stuff and wear your Sig!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> OCN name: D33G33
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: TBA
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 16degrees
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2764397
> 
> Just pulled the pin and delidded after I was less than impressed with my new (and first) watercooling set up. Hottest core is now peaking at 66degrees when only running my fans at 5v. So much better!
> Will try at 4.5ghz and go for a max OC when I have more time.
> 
> Update// Just bumped up to 4.5ghz and max temp was 62degrees using the testing methods for this thread which is 4 degrees lower than when i was running OCCT @ 4.4ghz for an hour. It doesnt give you accurate data (sorry) but i'm really happy with the results.
> 
> DeLidded!


You're In as well!







Slappa that Sig on!


----------



## KuuFA

Well I remounted still idling with the hottest core touching 40c in a ~78f room soo yea but load temps I guess are significantly improved lol.


----------



## inedenimadam

I have a question:

If the IHS is a copper shim essentially....what is it coted with that makes it silver in appearance?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have a question:
> 
> If the IHS is a copper shim essentially....what is it coted with that makes it silver in appearance?


So Intel can put the batch number and other info on the IHS


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have a question:
> 
> If the IHS is a copper shim essentially....what is it coted with that makes it silver in appearance?


Nickel.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have a question:
> 
> If the IHS is a copper shim essentially....what is it coted with that makes it silver in appearance?


...nickel

EDIT - didn't see the post above...moar coffee


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Well I remounted still idling with the hottest core touching 40c in a ~78f room soo yea but load temps I guess are significantly improved lol.


...well, at least it's s.th. but still, that's a bit unusual - are your running Intel SpeedStep and related (re idle) and also, what is your typical idle vCore reading (CPU-Z, CPUID Hardware monitor) etc


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, at least it's s.th. but still, that's a bit unusual - are your running Intel SpeedStep and related (re idle) and also, what is your typical idle vCore reading (CPU-Z, CPUID Hardware monitor) etc




Yup doing all that with a 4.6 @ 1.304 but load i get under 61c its just my idles I am worried about lol. I mean I am using CLU on the die, But I never even moved it? lol.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Phase is more expensive than a chiller...Chiller can be done with a waterblock, a pump, a big icebox thing, tubing and insulation for it and a cheep window ac unit. You just put the evaporator inside the water tank and fill it with glycol or something with low freezing points. A big enough AC can cool both a gpu and cpu, maybe more.
> And there's also the Hailea HC500 and similar units which can be used with great success. A guy I know runs two in his triple titan and 3770k system. It goes down to 4c though, with 3 gpus.


Yea I knew that it was a little more expensive, but that's what he said a few pages back. But wait, if you're already using a Chiller, then why use a cheap AC unit with it?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Nickel.


Thanks, I guess it doesn't make much difference anymore for me, I was just curios









Here is my submission:



OCN name:inedenimadam
CPU:i53750k
on die-TIM:AS5
ihs-TIM:AS5
Mhz gained:0
OC after delid:4.5 @1.128(DMM)
Temp drops:14C
CPU-Z validation of max OC:







5.2Ghz







@ 1.488 (DMM)
http://valid.canardpc.com/2764701
Lapped IHS w/Sandpaper180--->320--->600--->800--->1200--->1500

did I forget something? am I in?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How come more people don't use water chillers? Seems somewhat more convenient than dice/ln2


Will have this up and running next month. Have to move houses this month and don't want to move a 50 lb chiller.

They can get to freezing temperatures (assuming you have a big enough chiller, which I will). I'm going to take the fans off my RX480 and dunk it in 20 gallons of water, and then chill that (cheap) water and not the expensive pre-mix. I'll have to insulate the 20 gallon container and the tubing running to it from my case to keep it cold.

To deal with condensation: putting entire desktop in a big plastic bag, and pumping the output of a dehumidifier into it. Should be good down to -18C or so before I hit the frost point at 74F 5% Relative Humidity. My ambient is 74F 25-30% RH, so I figure the dehumidifier can easily strip out 20%. Won't look pretty, but I haven't cared about that in a while.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Will have this up and running next month. Have to move houses this month and don't want to move a 50 lb chiller.
> 
> They can get to freezing temperatures (assuming you have a big enough chiller, which I will). I'm going to take the fans off my RX480 and dunk it in 20 gallons of water, and then chill that (cheap) water and not the expensive pre-mix. I'll have to insulate the 20 gallon container and the tubing running to it from my case to keep it cold.
> 
> To deal with condensation: putting entire desktop in a big plastic bag, and pumping the output of a dehumidifier into it. Should be good down to -18C or so before I hit the frost point at 74F 5% Relative Humidity. My ambient is 74F 25-30% RH, so I figure the dehumidifier can easily strip out 20%. Won't look pretty, but I haven't cared about that in a while.


Something else I thought about is how people say it is best to counteract high voltages like 1.6+ with extreme cooling, like dice/ln2 to increase the life of the cpu. You might get sub ambient or sub zero but how much more do you plan to overclock than what you currently have? Because ivy really likes volts after a certain clock speed, which creates a lot of heat.


----------



## dr/owned

I'm looking at the exponential power vs temperature graph here:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/0_100

Where it seems like Ivy really likes good cooling, where it doesn't have to be insane like LN2. I'm aiming for 5,2 or if I'm lucky 5.4-5.5. Willing to go up to 1.75V.

I'll also get my GPU's super-cool in the process, and do a proof-of-concept on water chilled radiators that'll be applicable as long as waterblocks exist.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I'm looking at the exponential power vs temperature graph here:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1247413/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-with-ln2-guide-at-the-end/0_100
> 
> Where it seems like Ivy really likes good cooling, where it doesn't have to be insane like LN2. I'm aiming for 5,2 or if I'm lucky 5.4-5.5. Willing to go up to 1.75V.
> 
> I'll also get my GPU's super-cool in the process, and do a proof-of-concept on water chilled radiators that'll be applicable as long as waterblocks exist.


Yeah that was my point, you might run into degrading at 1.75 w/o dice or higher temps. And you will hit a voltage wall with your 680s if you haven't already, unless you've hard modded.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> 
> 
> Yup doing all that with a 4.6 @ 1.304 but load i get under 61c its just my idles I am worried about lol. I mean I am using CLU on the die, But I never even moved it? lol.


...actually your RealTemp readings (minimum 30, 35, 33, 27) look good ?! Ditto for max...I'm wondering if a.) you use iGPU (as that raises some core's temp a bit) and b.) have some sort of Windows process gong on in the background, even with SpeedStep on...my Win 'enemy' is Superfetch that usually rattles on...but overall, your Min/Max RealTemp readings are well within the norm


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...actually your RealTemp readings (minimum 30, 35, 33, 27) look good ?! Ditto for max...I'm wondering if a.) you use iGPU (as that raises some core's temp a bit) and b.) have some sort of Windows process gong on in the background, even with SpeedStep on...my Win 'enemy' is Superfetch that usually rattles on...but overall, your Min/Max RealTemp readings are well within the norm


Yea well sitting around 39 is a bit fishy lol. but I mean its fine My load temps are good just wondering lol.

Super fetch and all that jazz was disabled thanks to sean and his ssd optimizations for windows lol.

thanks though Just need to probably reapply CLU as 8 degree difference is kinda irking me.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Yeah that was my point, you might run into degrading at 1.75 w/o dice or higher temps. And you will hit a voltage wall with your 680s if you haven't already, unless you've hard modded.


...presumably, the 'absolute' max for Ivy per Intel on good water-cooling is about 1.55v (per link included in the previous posts). Which doesn't change the fact that some folks are 'risk-takers' http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2662292 ...I have done some light benching at 5.3 GHz (1.55v) and temps were hard to control even with low ambient temp and a strong w-c solution...

...re GPUs / 600 series (and even Titan), the hard-wired 'max' is 1.215v...with voltage mods, you can get around that, but apparently there are folks who put 1.4v into a Titan that was being 'extreme-cooled' and killed it


----------



## dr/owned

^^ That's the max that Nvidia wants. Lightnings go up to 1.38 (or it might be 1.368, can't remember exactly), because they don't use the stock pwm power controller.

If it breaks, I'll frame it, put it on the wall, and buy another









More seriously, I realize I'm crossing into danger-zone with the voltages I want to run, but I accept the risks.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ That's the max that Nvidia wants. Lightnings go up to 1.38 (or it might be 1.368, can't remember exactly), because they don't use the stock pwm power controller.
> 
> If it breaks, I'll frame it, put it on the wall, and buy another
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More seriously, I realize I'm crossing into danger-zone with the voltages I want to run, but I accept the risks.


Fair enough








How do you reach 1.38 on lightnings? Can you literally just move the voltage slider up in afterburner or precisionx lol.


----------



## dr/owned

You switch over to the LN2 BIOS (it's a switch on the PCB), then flash one of the original bios roms from the first 5000 lightnings. +100mV then corresponds to 1.36V and you're allowed to do 300% Power Limit instead of 150%. The cards idle at 1.2V and go up to 1.36 under load. You actually need a multimeter to see this, since Afterburner only shows 1.2.

I might have my story wrong, but supposedly Nvidia didn't like MSI selling cards that went higher than 1.21V, so MSI was forced to change after the first run of cards. Then Nvidia tried to limit the voltage in the drivers, so it took a couple of updates to Afterburner for them to get around that.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Yea well sitting around 39 is a bit fishy lol. but I mean its fine My load temps are good just wondering lol.
> 
> Super fetch and all that jazz was disabled thanks to sean and his ssd optimizations for windows lol.
> 
> thanks though Just need to probably reapply CLU as 8 degree difference is kinda irking me.


...while 8c differential is within the typical range for cores, I would do the same...obviously 'something' is raising idle temps more than it should....hope it works out

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ That's the max that Nvidia wants. Lightnings go up to 1.38 (or it might be 1.368, can't remember exactly), because they don't use the stock pwm power controller.
> 
> If it breaks, I'll frame it, put it on the wall, and buy another
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More seriously, I realize I'm crossing into danger-zone with the voltages I want to run, but I accept the risks.


...yes - and you're right, it is your chip and your risk to take (the stuff I have done to them is not so 'normal' either)....just a quick tip: At least according to my experience, at 5.2 +, also give as much cooling to the VRM as possible as it will be pumping a lot of juice, and I find that increasing the phase frequencies to 400MHz or 500MHz helps, at least on my chip at those speeds...ditto for the DRAM phase frequencies if you run 2400MHz or faster RAM

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Fair enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How do you reach 1.38 on lightnings? Can you literally just move the voltage slider up in afterburner or precisionx lol.


...LoL I have bee looking for 4 680 Lightnings and might even have a line on a couple...I understand that there are two versions of the controlling software...the 'normal' one which lets you go up a few steps (may be 1.38, not sure), and another software that is usually not available unless you're a verified 'extreme cooler' which goes higher for LN2 benching....but it seems to be software controlled, unlike the e-Power companion cards from EVGA, or the old stand-by of soldering your cards


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Oh yeah you're thinking of Afterburner Extreme which you have to jump through a ton of hoops to get them to send you a copy that's tied to YOU personally. I heard you only need that for LN2 or higher and the extra volatage above 1.36 makes no difference in max overclock for normal cooling.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Oh yeah you're thinking of Afterburner Extreme which you have to jump through a ton of hoops to get them to send you a copy that's tied to YOU personally. I heard you only need that for LN2 or higher and the extra volatage above 1.36 makes no difference in max overclock for normal cooling.


...that's what I was talking about...







FtW happens to have a copy of that extreme software and gave screenshots of both over the last month or so in this thread (both = 'mere mortals' vs 'verified LN2' Lightning Afterburner versions)...quite a difference...


----------



## Arm3nian

So with that lightning mod a 680 can compare with a 7970 in oc, not bad. But if that 1.38 as you claim only works on lightnings then I would either get that gpu or 7970, 1.175/1.21 is a terrible limit for 670/680/690 when watercooling, you can't push them at all.


----------



## gavbon

Anyone near Liverpool UK who fancies de-lidding an Ivy chip for me?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So with that lightning mod a 680 can compare with a 7970 in oc, not bad. But if that 1.38 as you claim only works on lightnings then I would either get that gpu or 7970, 1.175/1.21 is a terrible limit for 670/680/690 when watercooling, you can't push them at all.


Which is why everyone wants the Lightnings and they're so hard to find. They'll probably hold their value pretty well too once the 700 series comes out.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So with that lightning mod a 680 can compare with a 7970 in oc, not bad. But if that 1.38 as you claim only works on lightnings then I would either get that gpu or 7970, 1.175/1.21 is a terrible limit for 670/680/690 when watercooling, you can't push them at all.


...well, there is a lot you can do to them beyond v-mods...I find that at least at certain benches I compete in, the type of card you're running matters less >>> I'm surrounded by 680/690ies and 7970ies...this is from HWBot WorldRecords...

...I put it in a spoiler as some folks react 'differently' to it, but the point I'm trying to make is that it depends more on a given bench and drivers...Unigine tests (like Heaven) in particular seems to be quite sensitive to memory sub-systems (both main and GPU), and even then it depends if one talks about DX9, 11 etc











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Are those results current? 1241/1665 isn't that impressive for a Lightning 680. In the club on the Nvidia section, I saw people running 1400+ on the core and 2000 on the memory. One of my lightnings worked fine at 1375 core and 1400 memory. The other only works at 1225 and 1100, which kinda cripples the first one since it's SLI.


----------



## gavbon

Another quick question

If i was ti de-lid my i7 3770k....but didn't want to use the IHS, is there anything i can use that would make up the gap from my raystorm block to the cpu die?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Are those results current? 1241/1665 isn't that impressive for a Lightning 680. In the club on the Nvidia section, I saw people running 1400+ on the core and 2000 on the memory. One of my lightnings worked fine at 1375 core and 1400 memory. The other only works at 1225 and 1100, which kinda cripples the first one since it's SLI.


Those tests are useless for real world applications. 690 should not lose to a 580...


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Another quick question
> 
> If i was ti de-lid my i7 3770k....but didn't want to use the IHS, is there anything i can use that would make up the gap from my raystorm block to the cpu die?


It appears that the Raystorm uses the same mounting system as EK does, where the standoffs are fused to the posts and you screw the entire thing directly into the backplate. You could probably try buying EK's "Naked Ivy" kit with lower standoffs and the threading would be the same.

380i you install the posts through the backplate (from behind), and then thread down the standoffs which are too stubby to restrict the waterblock height anyways.


----------



## Arm3nian

1145 on a 680 ugh... I have 1150 on my 690 currently these results are madness


----------



## gavbon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> It appears that the Raystorm uses the same mounting system as EK does, where the standoffs are fused to the posts and you screw the entire thing directly into the backplate. You could probably try buying EK's "Naked Ivy" kit with lower standoffs and the threading would be the same.
> 
> 380i you install the posts through the backplate (from behind), and then thread down the standoffs which are too stubby to restrict the waterblock height anyways.


Thanks for that

hmmmmm, anyone got confirmation it would fit a raystorm etc?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Are those results current? 1241/1665 isn't that impressive for a Lightning 680. In the club on the Nvidia section, I saw people running 1400+ on the core and 2000 on the memory. One of my lightnings worked fine at 1375 core and 1400 memory. The other only works at 1225 and 1100, which kinda cripples the first one since it's SLI.


...yes, the results are as of literally '10 min ago' (and I noticed that I lost a place - I better finish up my new rig







) ...I know what you mean by one card crippling the other(s)...I run into that with quad-SLI...1 card = excellent 2 cards = pretty good 1 card = a dog...the latter drags down the other ones...that said, there is a rather strange relationship in GTX 600 series between memory and GPU MHz as I am sure you are aware of - slowing down memory from absolute top speed just a bit starts to increase scores...until you find that sweet spot unique to your card(s)


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Thanks for that
> 
> hmmmmm, anyone got confirmation it would fit a raystorm etc?


Hang on buddy, I'm working on something for you


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Thanks for that
> 
> hmmmmm, anyone got confirmation it would fit a raystorm etc?


I've sanded my 3770k IHS so much that half the material is gone lol, which means it isn't very thick. Raystorm you can screw all the way in and give lots of pressure which you don't even need for on die. Haven't directly tried it with my raystorm but it should work, if it doesn't make contact then the kit from ek will do.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 1145 on a 680 ugh... I have 1150 on my 690 currently these results are madness


...Heaven at HWBot is a special version you have to download...and even with regular versions, you can't run those with 'normal' top speed...I have to back my GPU and GPU mem MHz down a bit (like everyone else) to make it through a full run...Unigine (which makes Heaven) also does 'Valley'...how many times I made it to the final scene (#18), just to hang at the last moment before the score appears...I'm sure many of you know the frustration


----------



## dr/owned

You can also just buy four 6-32 screws, cut the heads off, and use that as the posts instead of the ones XSPC gives you. Then use some 6-32 1/8" thick x 1/4" wide nuts as standoffs that'll be lower than the socket, so then you can crank down the waterblock and it'll touch the die. Probably cheaper than EK's $10 kit for 50 cents worth of standoffs.

This assumes XSPCS uses 6-32 threading (which they probably do since this is what Koolance does and a lot of rads use), and that the existing standoffs are too high for direct die.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Heaven at HWBot is a special version you have to download...and even with regular versions, you can't run those with 'normal' top speed...I have to back my GPU and GPU mem MHz down a bit (like everyone else) to make it through a full run...Unigine (which makes Heaven) also does 'Valley'...how many times I made it to the final scene (#18), just to hang at the last moment before the score appears...I'm sure many of you know the frustration


If you have to lower your oc to run the special version that means your oc is unstable lol. Also, valley is nothing compared to version 4.0 of heaven, I can pass valley 10 times and fail in the first 10 seconds of heaven. (max settings on both)


----------



## dr/owned

^^ I don't trust Heaven because my scores SUCK in it, even though BF3 plays fine at expected frame rates (and my Furmark score is also what I would expect). Think my installation is borked, because I get like half the framerate I should get.


----------



## dr/owned

Double.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> If you have to lower your oc to run the special version that means your oc is unstable lol. Also, valley is nothing compared to version 4.0 of heaven, I can pass valley 10 times and fail in the first 10 seconds of heaven. (max settings on both)


...not sure we think that differently - other than for a an attempt at a world record in a given bench, you'll obviously try to max things for ' stable + 0' or 'crash -1 ' ...Valley is easier than Heaven, but Heaven being in the chart above, not Valley

...still, the point is that Unigine in general react to more than just sheer GPU / GPU mem speed...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ I don't trust Heaven because my scores SUCK in it, even though BF3 plays fine at expected frame rates. Think my installation is borked, because I get like half the framerate I should get.


The new version is really demanding, at the start im at 20-31fps, then it shoots up to 60-80, then back to 20, all over the place.

It really matters what you're doing when buying a gpu, if only gaming then I could care less how my card does in benches and vise-versa. Then there are results of a 580 beating a 7970,680,690 which make you go huh?


----------



## dr/owned

^^







when I go to Extreme tesselation at 2560x1440, I get 13 fps max and like 8 fps min. Crazy. It's like Crysis 1 and 8800 series all over again.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...not sure we think that differently - other than for a an attempt at a world record in a given bench, you'll obviously try to max things for ' stable + 0' or 'crash -1 ' ...Valley is easier than Heaven, but Heaven being in the chart above, not Valley
> 
> ...still, the point is that Unigine in general react to more than just sheer GPU / GPU mem speed...


Of course it is more than then the core clock/mem clock, but some results are really weird. Also green team almost always does better in heaven than red, and its the opposite for other benches.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when I go to Extreme tesselation at 2560x1440, I get 13 fps max and like 8 fps min. Crazy.


At 2560x1440 ultra quality, extreme tes, 8x AA (pretty much every thing maxed) I get way more than 13fps max, free walking around I get 30-60fps maybe more I don't remember. Something is really wrong with your heaven


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Heaven at HWBot is a special version you have to download...and even with regular versions, you can't run those with 'normal' top speed...I have to back my GPU and GPU mem MHz down a bit (like everyone else) to make it through a full run...Unigine (which makes Heaven) also does 'Valley'...how many times I made it to the final scene (#18), just to hang at the last moment before the score appears...I'm sure many of you know the frustration


I hate that run where your on the last test with like 2 seconds left and your scores have been crazy good all run long... and GPU gives out.... and then you can;t get it to do it again... so aggrivating. BTW guys a heavily modified 580 is a silly card to compete against, you can literally throw volts at iot and it'll just keep going, then zombie it after it dies to make it do it again... 580's are scary things......
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Thanks, I guess it doesn't make much difference anymore for me, I was just curios
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is my submission:
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name:inedenimadam
> CPU:i53750k
> on die-TIM:AS5
> ihs-TIM:AS5
> Mhz gained:0
> OC after delid:4.5 @1.128(DMM)
> Temp drops:14C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.2Ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @ 1.488 (DMM)
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2764701
> Lapped IHS w/Sandpaper180--->320--->600--->800--->1200--->1500
> 
> did I forget something? am I in?


No SIR! DENIED!







JK You're In now slap that Sig on!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No SIR! DENIED!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JK You're In now slap that Sig on!


Sweet! That IHS thingy looks kinda purdy all exposed copper don't it?


----------



## TX2000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Thanks for that
> 
> hmmmmm, anyone got confirmation it would fit a raystorm etc?


i am running with a raystorm without the ihs


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I hate that run where your on the last test with like 2 seconds left and your scores have been crazy good all run long... and GPU gives out.... and then you can;t get it to do it again... so aggrivating. BTW guys a heavily modified 580 is a silly card to compete against, you can literally throw volts at iot and it'll just keep going, then zombie it after it dies to make it do it again... 580's are scary things.....:


..that's what I hear - they just LOVE to suck back the juice...all you really need for a top score is a *20000 watt PSU*


----------



## jdm317

Hi again fellow daredevils. I have had a death in my electronic family lately (my 7970 and my Z68)







due to my desire to always be colder









I dont know how many of you have actual experience woking on/modding IC's/Traces, but for those of you that do have the experience, if you dont mind, take a look *HERE* and lets see if we can fix this thing. Positive mindedness please, naysayers not permitted. I am going to attempt to fix this thing even if everyone says there is no point in trying. I do not for one second think it is impossible.









If I have to wire a cut off PCI express connector and shove it down into the board dangling from the card I will









I have already ordered new parts. Im sorry to say that the motherboard isnt getting many tears from me since it was about to be replaced anyways. My sadness is centered on my 7970


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gavbon*
> 
> Anyone near Liverpool UK who fancies de-lidding an Ivy chip for me?


I'm in the UK - London.
You could send it - but I urge you to do it yourself, as you don;t want to be holding anyone accountable for any problems.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Hi again fellow daredevils. I have had a death in my electronic family lately (my 7970 and my Z68)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> due to my desire to always be colder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I dont know how many of you have actual experience woking on/modding IC's/Traces, but for those of you that do have the experience, if you dont mind, take a look *HERE* and lets see if we can fix this thing. Positive mindedness please, naysayers not permitted. I am going to attempt to fix this thing even if everyone says there is no point in trying. I do not for one second think it is impossible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I have to wire a cut off PCI express connector and shove it down into the board dangling from the card I will
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have already ordered new parts. Im sorry to say that the motherboard isnt getting many tears from me since it was about to be replaced anyways. My sadness is centered on my 7970


This sounds like s.th. FtW 420 (and/or IvanL) may be able to shed some light on...FtW 420 usually signs in around this time of day, though he may also be picking up parts....why not PM him ?


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> This sounds like s.th. FtW 420 (and/or IvanL) may be able to shed some light on...FtW 420 usually signs in around this time of day, though he may also be picking up parts....why not PM him ?


If I dont hear from anyone on the thread I started tonight, then ill pm him. Hopefully he will see it and chime in but I dont like to PM people for some reason, feels like im begging







(and yes, I AM begging lol)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ That's the max that Nvidia wants. Lightnings go up to 1.38 (or it might be 1.368, can't remember exactly), because they don't use the stock pwm power controller.
> 
> If it breaks, I'll frame it, put it on the wall, and buy another
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More seriously, I realize I'm crossing into danger-zone with the voltages I want to run, but I accept the risks.


Without AB extreme , there is also the artmoney hack https://sites.google.com/site/qwwwizx/home/gtx-680
Just be careful with the voltage, & probably won't have an issue with chilled water, but without some power state modding the 680 Lightning cold boot bugs at about -40°.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> So with that lightning mod a 680 can compare with a 7970 in oc, not bad. But if that 1.38 as you claim only works on lightnings then I would either get that gpu or 7970, 1.175/1.21 is a terrible limit for 670/680/690 when watercooling, you can't push them at all.


680 Lightning was the 680 to have, at launch I looked at what 680s were doing compared to 7970s, & waited for better 680s.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Are those results current? 1241/1665 isn't that impressive for a Lightning 680. In the club on the Nvidia section, I saw people running 1400+ on the core and 2000 on the memory. One of my lightnings worked fine at 1375 core and 1400 memory. The other only works at 1225 and 1100, which kinda cripples the first one since it's SLI.


For the lower clocks it can be in multi gpu with a weak one holding back a good one, also power limits. Benching tri sli on my 1250W psu I could not get maximum clocks out of the cards because there just wasn't enough juice.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Those tests are useless for real world applications. 690 should not lose to a 580...


Depends on what it is doing. 580 is still a stronger card in compute than a 680, using apps that work in compute or benching 3dmark2001, the 580 can win.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Heaven at HWBot is a special version you have to download...and even with regular versions, you can't run those with 'normal' top speed...I have to back my GPU and GPU mem MHz down a bit (like everyone else) to make it through a full run...Unigine (which makes Heaven) also does 'Valley'...how many times I made it to the final scene (#18), just to hang at the last moment before the score appears...I'm sure many of you know the frustration


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> If you have to lower your oc to run the special version that means your oc is unstable lol. Also, valley is nothing compared to version 4.0 of heaven, I can pass valley 10 times and fail in the first 10 seconds of heaven. (max settings on both)


Hwbot heaven bench is tougher to pass than the new version of heaven. I think the hwbot version is 2.1, but get your card all stable in heaven 4.0, then try hwbot heaven & crash.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..that's what I hear - they just LOVE to suck back the juice...all you really need for a top score is a *20000 watt PSU*


Close! I have to get out pretty quick for the ax1200, one of those with just the card on it & the 580 should fly. It is scary that a gpu can need a dedicated 1000w psu not to crash when OCed enough.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Hi again fellow daredevils. I have had a death in my electronic family lately (my 7970 and my Z68)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> due to my desire to always be colder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I dont know how many of you have actual experience woking on/modding IC's/Traces, but for those of you that do have the experience, if you dont mind, take a look *HERE* and lets see if we can fix this thing. Positive mindedness please, naysayers not permitted. I am going to attempt to fix this thing even if everyone says there is no point in trying. I do not for one second think it is impossible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I have to wire a cut off PCI express connector and shove it down into the board dangling from the card I will
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have already ordered new parts. Im sorry to say that the motherboard isnt getting many tears from me since it was about to be replaced anyways. My sadness is centered on my 7970


I've never tried to fix such a thing, once the pci-e contacts are cooked I really don't know how to repair that short of a pci-e tab transplant. I can ask some of the other modders who are better with the electronics.
That is the one place I still use vaseline when doing subzero, the pci-e slot.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> If you have to lower your oc to run the special version that means your oc is unstable lol. Also, valley is nothing compared to version 4.0 of heaven, I can pass valley 10 times and fail in the first 10 seconds of heaven. (max settings on both)


wait a minute - are you Armenian







???


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> wait a minute - are you Armenian
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ???


Last time I checked yes lol.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Last time I checked yes lol.


oh wow







!
So am I - at least my parents are.
Glad to meet a fellow Armenian de-lidder! Let alone OC'ers!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> oh wow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> So am I - at least my parents are.
> Glad to meet a fellow Armenian de-lidder! Let alone OC'ers!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys been busy baby sitting the niece this week I'm gonna have a lot of reading to do this weekend! I'm gonna have lots of reading to do this weekend. This thread sure moves fast.


----------



## Radmanhs

Pentium 4 (520J)

is this one i can practice on? i can get it for a few $

I was going to do razorless so can i also practice with the same cpu's?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Got to freeze some stuffs today...a few guys from a local forums helped with the ln2 pouring and condensation buildup damage control.
Cool folks really, it was a blast. (that intel extreme oc workshop thing)

Some frosty pics for the gang:

http://imgur.com/rkL9tla,urYeae4,pxLYG1m,7w4Qcs5#0

Got to 6ghz, ram wouldn't go over 2500mhz (stupid single sided hynix MFR crap)...-180c cold bugged on me.
Now I need to get a Duniek pot and a small dewar and thermo.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got to freeze some stuffs today...a few guys from a local forums helped with the ln2 pouring and condensation buildup damage control.
> Cool folks really, it was a blast. (that intel extreme oc workshop thing)
> 
> Some frosty pics for the gang:
> 
> http://imgur.com/rkL9tla,urYeae4,pxLYG1m,7w4Qcs5#0
> 
> Got to 6ghz, ram wouldn't go over 2500mhz (stupid single sided hynix MFR crap)...-180c cold bugged on me.
> Now I need to get a Duniek pot and a small dewar and thermo.


...you must feel great...btw, whose 3770K was that (the 'slow one' stored at your mother-in-law before ?) ...more pics please


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's all I got...cpu was supplied by Intel, board by Asus reps who were watching me fiddle with their MVE







, ram and ssd by adata dudes...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's all I got...cpu was supplied by Intel, board by Asus reps who were watching me fiddle with their MVE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , ram and ssd by adata dudes...


Was expecting 10ghz.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got to freeze some stuffs today...a few guys from a local forums helped with the ln2 pouring and condensation buildup damage control.
> Cool folks really, it was a blast. (that intel extreme oc workshop thing)
> 
> Some frosty pics for the gang:
> 
> http://imgur.com/rkL9tla,urYeae4,pxLYG1m,7w4Qcs5#0
> 
> Got to 6ghz, ram wouldn't go over 2500mhz (stupid single sided hynix MFR crap)...-180c cold bugged on me.
> Now I need to get a Duniek pot and a small dewar and thermo.


Good stuff! Was it a -180° cold bug in windows or a cold boot bug? It would be good for a CBB, all my chips do that by about -145°.
Commented on the frost thermos in the memory thread, looks cool







Mine never get all frosty on the outside.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Was expecting 10ghz.


A new world record would have been better, but 6Ghz benching is always pretty fun.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That's all I got...cpu was supplied by Intel, board by Asus reps who were watching me fiddle with their MVE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , ram and ssd by adata dudes...


...MVE, eh ? ...did you play with the OC Key ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Good stuff! Was it a -180° cold bug in windows or a cold boot bug? It would be good for a CBB, all my chips do that by about -145°.
> Commented on the frost thermos in the memory thread, looks cool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mine never get all frosty on the outside.
> A new world record would have been better, but 6Ghz benching is always pretty fun.











CBB actually, got 00 q-led code...and didn't start till it hit -170c again. After that -177c booted fine though...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...MVE, eh ? ...did you play with the OC Key ?


Nope, only held it...and tossed it on the dimastech bench. The monitor I was using didn't support dvi, so I was using an adapter for the 680. Wasn't my rig so I couldn't do all that much, otherwise I would have installed XP instead of 7.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> ... otherwise I would have installed XP instead of 7.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Couldn't bench 3d cause the 7 install got borked when testing the imc and I had no means of installing another os...too bad.
Only got to 6ghz 2c/2t though, cause I didn't have AI Suite to boot at -177c and go lower from within windows, to get higher mhz.
Any other way to change ratio/bclk from Windows? What do you guys use?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Couldn't bench 3d cause the 7 install got borked when testing the imc and I had no means of installing another os...too bad.
> Only got to 6ghz 2c/2t though, cause I didn't have AI Suite to boot at -177c and go lower from within windows, to get higher mhz.
> Any other way to change ratio/bclk from Windows? What do you guys use?


I also use Intel's XTU

btw, ....a teaser about Haswell OC'ing, courtesy from Intel slides http://www.overclock.net/t/1381038/sin-idf2013-intel-publishes-more-haswell-overclocking-details#post_19726345


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> I also use Intel's XTU
> 
> btw, ....a teaser about Haswell OC'ing, courtesy from Intel slides http://www.overclock.net/t/1381038/sin-idf2013-intel-publishes-more-haswell-overclocking-details#post_19726345


Doesn't work for me...I don't use turbo nor offsets. Couldn't get it to work with fixed clocks/voltages.


----------



## D33G33

With all this talk about OCing videocards, I came across someone that has made hacked BIOS' for the GTX650+ that lets you increase the TPD from 122% to 150% but that's not a voltage increase? Would that help much? I was only able to get an extra 40mhz on the clock and 200mhz on the memory of my EVGA 670 SuperClocked which I was disappointed with. I think peak boost clock was 1086mhz...







I'm thinking about unlocking the TDP as its watercooled and temps are very low (max i have seen is mid 50's) but don't know if this will actually help me at all... I'm not too concerned if it pops... I really want a 690/Titan or new 790 (if it comes)


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've never tried to fix such a thing, once the pci-e contacts are cooked I really don't know how to repair that short of a pci-e tab transplant. I can ask some of the other modders who are better with the electronics.
> That is the one place I still use vaseline when doing subzero, the pci-e slot.


I will definitely keep that in mind the next go with the chiller. Thanks for the PM's







Hopefully with some guidance I can have it running again, im feeling more hopeful.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Couldn't bench 3d cause the 7 install got borked when testing the imc and I had no means of installing another os...too bad.
> Only got to 6ghz 2c/2t though, cause I didn't have AI Suite to boot at -177c and go lower from within windows, to get higher mhz.
> Any other way to change ratio/bclk from Windows? What do you guys use?


A lot of the bench team swear by ROG connect, I don't have a laptop anymore so have rarely used it.
It's actually been a while since I overclocked within windows, the 6.4Ghz 05 & 6.1Ghz 3d11 runs I was doing recently were booted up from bios.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Doesn't work for me...I don't use turbo nor offsets. Couldn't get it to work with fixed clocks/voltages.


..install XTU after you boot up with no turbo, offsets - XTU tends to lock in on original configs it sees first


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> With all this talk about OCing videocards, I came across someone that has made hacked BIOS' for the GTX650+ that lets you increase the TPD from 122% to 150% but that's not a voltage increase? Would that help much? I was only able to get an extra 40mhz on the clock and 200mhz on the memory of my EVGA 670 SuperClocked which I was disappointed with. I think peak boost clock was 1086mhz...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm thinking about unlocking the TDP as its watercooled and temps are very low (max i have seen is mid 50's) but don't know if this will actually help me at all... I'm not too concerned if it pops... I really want a 690/Titan or new 790 (if it comes)


I modded my 690 bios and increased the power limit to 150%. Didn't do anything because the card never reaches 150% power limit when I monitor it under 100% load. Also I gained no oc potential out of it. If you want to oc like crazy get a 7970/7950 or lightning 680 and mod that. Titan also oc's decently but it is a ripoff unless you're getting 3 or 4. A single 690 beats a titan, and costs the same. 3x 7970/7950s beat 2 titans, cost less. Even at 3 titans with quad lightning 680 or 7970s oc'd like mad you can beat them, and save $1000. Only reason I see getting 3-4 titans is to blow off money.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I modded my 690 bios and increased the power limit to 150%. Didn't do anything because the card never reaches 150% power limit when I monitor it under 100% load. Also I gained no oc potential out of it. If you want to oc like crazy get a 7970/7950 or lightning 680 and mod that. Titan also oc's decently but it is a ripoff unless you're getting 3 or 4. A single 690 beats a titan, and costs the same. 3x 7970/7950s beat 2 titans, cost less. Even at 3 titans with quad lightning 680 or 7970s oc'd like mad you can beat them, and save $1000. Only reason I see getting 3-4 titans is to blow off money.


...the DEA never saw that one coming: Titan laundering


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the DEA never saw that one coming: Titan laundering


DEA and laundering... reminds me of Breaking Bad lol... amazing show


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> DEA and laundering... reminds me of Breaking Bad lol... amazing show


I like that one as well, hate them for making me wait this long after that last episode


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



where Hank figured it out...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I like that one as well, hate them for making me wait this long after that last episode where Hank figured it out...


Yeah their air times are weird, btw I would put that as a spoiler just incase


----------



## FtW 420

Took me a while to notice the post, but a good idea. I forget about spoiler tags...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A lot of the bench team swear by ROG connect, I don't have a laptop anymore so have rarely used it.
> It's actually been a while since I overclocked within windows, the 6.4Ghz 05 & 6.1Ghz 3d11 runs I was doing recently were booted up from bios.


Yeah, I'll do that once I get a pot and my board RMA'd. That wasn't my MVE for obvious reasons, so I couldn't install whatever I wanted nor did I have a laptop. (I don't own one either...)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..install XTU after you boot up with no turbo, offsets - XTU tends to lock in on original configs it sees first


I'll stick to ROG connect me thinks...There's a way to connect from a mobile device using bluetooth.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll stick to ROG connect me thinks...There's a way to connect from a mobile device using bluetooth.


...makes perfect sense...I actually prefer ROG Connect even over OC Key for quick changes and testing...XTU is also 'pretty big' in mem...more designed for regular daily ops, 'guarding' and also stability testing


----------



## MKHunt

2800MHz here I come. I'd love to shoot for CL10 but.... I'm not sure if that will happen. Hynix CFR binned Corsair chips. Thoughts?


----------



## Joa3d43

*Haswell GT3E*

...better order some more CL Liquid Metals - lot's of die areas to cover











story / source at Anandtech / VR Zone http://www.anandtech.com/show/6892/haswell-gt3e-pictured-coming-to-desktops-rsku-notebooks


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> 2800MHz here I come. I'd love to shoot for CL10 but.... I'm not sure if that will happen. Hynix CFR binned Corsair chips. Thoughts?


CL10 2800. *drools* can't wait for DDR4...


----------



## Valgaur

So for the benchers in here.... me and Ivan did some math..... with Haswell the absolute top OC you can get is 167Mhz x 80 multi = 13360 Mhz

Yeah.... 13.360 giggles.....









I wanta 6 Giggles stable everyday OC!!!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So for the benchers in here.... me and Ivan did some math..... with Haswell the absolute top OC you can get is 167Mhz x 80 multi = 13360 Mhz
> 
> Yeah.... 13.360 giggles.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wanta 6 Giggles stable everyday OC!!!!!


...funny that you mention that, I was looking at least for 10 giggles per back-and-forth with FtW - but why stop there








...so your goal of less than 50% of theoretical top speed makes you and IvanL sound 'almost reasonable'















...wait - what ? what's the world coming to ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...funny that you mention that, I was looking at least for 10 giggles per back-and-forth with FtW - but why stop there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...so your goal of less than 50% of theoretical top speed makes you and IvanL sound 'almost reasonable'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...wait - what ? what's the world coming to ?


gimme a haswell and my H100 will do 6 giggles


----------



## Scott1541

If only it was 13370 MHz Then you could have a leet overclock


----------



## lilchronic

what the heck i going on in here. i see 13ghz here, 6ghz with h100 there, lol .


----------



## ashio83

I'm in guys, took the jump earlier today. The process of de-lidding only took 20 minutes with zero damage. I'll update later with details here are my pics for now.









http://s260.photobucket.com/user/ashio83/library/3770K%20Delid


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ashio83*
> 
> I'm in guys, took the jump earlier today. The process of de-lidding only took 20 minutes with zero damage. I'll update later with details here are my pics for now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://s260.photobucket.com/user/ashio83/library/3770K%20Delid


looking at those pictures makes me want to punch an intel tech.

Good job, let us know the temps!


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *Haswell GT3E*
> 
> ...better order some more CL Liquid Metals - lot's of die areas to cover
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> story / source at Anandtech / VR Zone http://www.anandtech.com/show/6892/haswell-gt3e-pictured-coming-to-desktops-rsku-notebooks


The second die is probs just edram for the graphics and won't produce much heat at all.


----------



## enigma7820

on the five cpu's I delided the glue was nowhere near as thick and as much as yours interesting thing I noticed with a few delids lately is that they look heavy on the glue under the IHS.


----------



## ashio83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> looking at those pictures makes me want to punch an intel tech.
> 
> Good job, let us know the temps!


Haha, thanks, I will. At the moment I'm just using AS5 and I've dropped roughly 15 degrees under load. That is temp until I get some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro ordered next week.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> on the five cpu's I delided the glue was nowhere near as thick and as much as yours interesting thing I noticed with a few delids lately is that they look heavy on the glue under the IHS.


It was thick, bit of a nightmare to remove but she's clean now. I'll get some real tests done after dad daughter time this weekend.

Thanks guys.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> The second die is probs just edram for the graphics and won't produce much heat at all.


...but it's below the _same_ IHS (as far as I know)


----------



## KuuFA

Hmm do you guys think I am stressing my 450w Fortress

By running

3570k 4.6 @ 1.306v

PCS+ 7950 stock

and a small WC loop?

And since I have another 7950 sitting here waiting for my new mobo for my other computer can i run it as well lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Hmm do you guys think I am stressing my 450w Fortress
> 
> By running
> 
> 3570k 4.6 @ 1.306v
> 
> PCS+ 7950 stock
> 
> and a small WC loop?
> 
> And since I have another 7950 sitting here waiting for my new mobo for my other computer can i run it as well lol.


 Yes... must be well build if it has lasted this long tho! would not try to keep a load on it very long or furmark runs lol.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yes... must be well build if it has lasted this long tho! would not try to keep a load on it very long or furmark runs lol.


Well it usually runs

2 x 8800gt's at stock instead of the 7950 lol.....

soo yea lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Well it usually runs
> 
> 2 x 8800gt's at stock instead of the 7950 lol.....
> 
> soo yea lol.


I fried a 500 watt su with a Gtx 260 back in the day.... like fire works.....

U need a Psu? i may have an Antec 1200watt TQ for 130$







has 4 - 5 12v rails each with 38 amps on them.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> 2800MHz here I come. I'd love to shoot for CL10 but.... I'm not sure if that will happen. Hynix CFR binned Corsair chips. Thoughts?


try cl11 or 12...cl11-13-12-35-2t. Hynix likes looser timings and high megahurz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...but it's below the _same_ IHS (as far as I know)


That looks like a mobile part man, desktop Haswell won't have ram for the igpu.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I fried a 500 watt su with a Gtx 260 back in the day.... like fire works.....
> 
> U need a Psu? i may have an Antec 1200watt TQ for 130$
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> has 4 - 5 12v rails each with 38 amps on them.


Lol no as I have a Coolermaster real power pro 850w and an AX750 if I needed as both are unused atm Love the Real power pro though that chrome was such a beauty back in the day. lol.

Also This build is for my gf I am just using it until I get my new mobo lol.

and my words earlier about the a certain mobo i will eat it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Lol no as I have a Coolermaster real power pro 850w and an AX750 if I needed as both are unused atm Love the Real power pro though that chrome was such a beauty back in the day. lol.
> 
> Also This build is for my gf I am just using it until I get my new mobo lol.
> 
> and my words earlier about the a certain mobo i will eat it.


Id trust a 750AX corsair PSU anyday over CM mid range crap.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> 2800MHz here I come. I'd love to shoot for CL10 but.... I'm not sure if that will happen. Hynix CFR binned Corsair chips. Thoughts?


It may be possible, but shoot for 11-13-13 or 11-13-12 first, loosen up a number on each if it doesn't want to work. Hynix likes a bit looser timings & does higher frequency, samsung holds a bit tighter timings, but doesn't easily do as high a frequency.
Watch the debug LED too, 23 means the IMC doesn't want to go that high, 55 means the memory needs more volts or looser timings.
I've had one 3770k IMC of 9 tested that could not do over 2600Mhz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> what the heck i going on in here. i see 13ghz here, 6ghz with h100 there, lol .


Dreaming... I really do hope to see fantastic numbers like 10Ghz from Haswell, but going to keep my expectations a bit lower.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> looking at those pictures makes me want to punch an intel tech.
> 
> Good job, let us know the temps!


It's a machine, you'll hurt your hand. Take a big steel bar.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> try cl11 or 12...cl11-13-12-35-2t. Hynix likes looser timings and high megahurz.
> That looks like a mobile part man, desktop Haswell won't have ram for the igpu.


This, the desktop part will likely share the system DDR3 like ivy does. If anyone plans to use the igpu in desktop, this is one area where you really will see a difference between 1600mhz memory & faster stuff.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Id trust a 750AX corsair PSU anyday over CM mid range crap.


Well considering its age. ~2008

It was one of the best units CM made

http://www.coolermaster.com/product.php?product_id=35

and well I would hope in 4-5 years we would make better PSU's lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> try cl11 or 12...cl11-13-12-35-2t. Hynix likes looser timings and high megahurz.
> That looks like a mobile part man, desktop Haswell won't have ram for the igpu.


...yup - that why I added GT3 to the tag line - still, this pic tells me that Haswell might be 'deliddable' too, just looking at the surface of the main CPU die


----------



## ivanlabrie

Their high end stuff si top notch. Silent Pro 1000-1500w.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Their high end stuff si top notch. Silent Pro 1000-1500w.


LoL?

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story5&reid=193

Doh! http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story6&reid=315

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story5&reid=259

Hail to the king baby...

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story5&reid=189

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story6&reid=300

Notice Cooler Master Psu's scoring lowest in performance LOL.


----------



## netminder1976

Is there anyone here that went from clu under the ihs to using no ihs? Just wondering if it would be worth it at all. Thanks


----------



## KuuFA

Well mine wasn't this one but..

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story3&reid=52

it was just 250w shy lol. Still the best for what it was back in the day.

but yea of course seasonic is one of the top psu makers of today. the coolermasters aren't as good but they are no slouches either.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Seasonic is just an oem, like CWT, or Superflower...
My TX750 is a CWT unit, and while it's not brilliant it works pretty good.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL?
> 
> http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story5&reid=193
> 
> Doh! http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story6&reid=315
> 
> http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story5&reid=259
> 
> Hail to the king baby...
> 
> http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story5&reid=189
> 
> http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story6&reid=300
> 
> Notice Cooler Master Psu's scoring lowest in performance LOL.


I wouldn't go as far as saying they are top notch but they do work and are a viable temporary replacement if you don't have a corsair around to use.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not all corsair units are good...that's a misconception as well.

I've seen certain Silent Pro Gold units score perfectly at ocf, and Bobnova is one of the best psu reviewers out there.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It may be possible, but shoot for 11-13-13 or 11-13-12 first, loosen up a number on each if it doesn't want to work. Hynix likes a bit looser timings & does higher frequency, samsung holds a bit tighter timings, but doesn't easily do as high a frequency.
> Watch the debug LED too, 23 means the IMC doesn't want to go that high, 55 means the memory needs more volts or looser timings.
> *I've had one 3770k IMC of 9 tested that could not do over 2600Mhz*.


I guess I'm having the same problem as you've mentioned. I'm running 2133Mhz Ripjaws-Z (Hynix IC's) that does 2400Mhz @ 10-12-11-27 (1T) on stock volts and from there, I can take it all the way til 2580Mhz through the BCLK till it crashes. But it wouldn't boot at 2600MHz from the memory multiplier.


----------



## KuuFA

Sooo If I were to play lets say Witcher 2 or Bioshock infinite? My PSU will be on full load?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not all corsair units are good...that's a misconception as well.
> 
> I've seen certain Silent Pro Gold units score perfectly at ocf, and Bobnova is one of the best psu reviewers out there.


Not saying they're perfect, my ax1200 which costs $300 has coil whine when my computer is OFF, I guess drawing a whole 0.1 watt to power my motherboard is hard. Not sure if all psu do that but it's pathetic.

-In general though they get better reviews than CM psu.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Sooo If I were to play lets say Witcher 2 or Bioshock infinite? My PSU will be on full load?


you should pull 350w-400w from the wall, when i had 1 670 FTW and @ 5ghz i pulled 350watts now with 2 670 i pull 550w


----------



## ivanlabrie

power draw in normal scenarios tend to be pretty low with Intel systems these days...Even overclocked.


----------



## KuuFA

lol ok. thanks guys.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> power draw in *normal* scenarios tend to be pretty low with Intel systems these days...Even overclocked.


Lol, I was told I was abnormal earlier this week...
I have the new ax1200 now, have to see just how much environmental damage I can do with a single gpu...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, I was told I was abnormal earlier this week...
> I have the new ax1200 now, have to see just how much environmental damage I can do with a single gpu...


...I'm just upgrading (fortifying is more like it) the custom loop for the new 3970X CPU - oc'ed approaching 400w - not an environmental butterfly either


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> power draw in normal scenarios tend to be pretty low with Intel systems these days...Even overclocked.


True... I was surprised that even overclocked at 4.5 my 3570k uses less wattage than a common light bulb. Graphics cards on the other hand....


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> True... I was surprised that even overclocked at 4.5 my 3570k uses less wattage than a common light bulb. Graphics cards on the other hand....


At 4.5Ghz it is likely using more than a light bulb, but nothing out of hand. It's hard to tell the power of the cpu alone, software can't read it properly & power meters only read the power the PSU is pulling from the wall for the system. The system can be barebones (mobo, cpu, hdd) but still not an isolated cpu.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> True... I was surprised that even overclocked at 4.5 my 3570k uses less wattage than a common light bulb. Graphics cards on the other hand....
> 
> 
> 
> At 4.5Ghz it is likely using more than a light bulb, but nothing out of hand. It's hard to tell the power of the cpu alone, software can't read it properly & power meters only read the power the PSU is pulling from the wall for the system. The system can be barebones (mobo, cpu, hdd) but still not an isolated cpu.
Click to expand...

Open Hardware monitor isolates the wattage for the CPU, is that not be trusted as a ballpark?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> At 4.5Ghz it is likely using more than a light bulb, but nothing out of hand. It's hard to tell the power of the cpu alone, software can't read it properly & power meters only read the power the PSU is pulling from the wall for the system. The system can be barebones (mobo, cpu, hdd) but still not an isolated cpu.


...all that talk about Power (and with it heat) makes me thirsty...got a bottle of Argentinean Malbec here and some white extra-old cheddar and walnuts...if I don't like the Malbec wine, I just put it into the w-c loop of the Sandy-E...wonder what a drunk 3970X would think "...2+2 = 17 ...hey, L3 cache, baby, take your clothes o







...may be I call my old GF, Pentium4, and tell here that I..."


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Open Hardware monitor isolates the wattage for the CPU, is that not be trusted as a ballpark?


Not really, HWMonitor can be way off, like reading 168W for older cpus that pull 400W +.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...all that talk about Power (and with it heat) makes me thirsty...got a bottle of Argentinean Malbec here and some white extra-old cheddar and walnuts...if I don't like the Malbec wine, I just put it into the w-c loop of the Sandy-E...wonder what a drunk 3970X would think "...2+2 = 17 ...hey, L3 cache, baby, take your clothes o
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...may be I call my old GF, Pentium4, and tell here that I..."


I should try this, give the 3770k some liquid courage to shoot for 7Ghz. When you're drunk & loose you don't get hurt as easily, maybe works for the cpu too...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Out of interest.
If I have my pc on all day vs folding at 100%
What is the power consumption difference?

I'm curious to know!
Ie. Does heating a kettle require more kW than my pc does for the whole day?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I should try this, give the 3770k some liquid courage to shoot for 7Ghz. When you're drunk & loose you don't get hurt as easily, maybe works for the cpu too...


...and with the alcohol, you've got built-in evaporate cooling


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Out of interest.
> If I have my pc on all day vs folding at 100%
> What is the power consumption difference?
> 
> I'm curious to know!
> Ie. Does heating a kettle require more kW than my pc does for the whole day?


I'll have a quick look at this right now..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...all that talk about Power (and with it heat) makes me thirsty...got a bottle of Argentinean Malbec here and some white extra-old cheddar and walnuts...if I don't like the Malbec wine, I just put it into the w-c loop of the Sandy-E...wonder what a drunk 3970X would think "...2+2 = 17 ...hey, L3 cache, baby, take your clothes o
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...may be I call my old GF, Pentium4, and tell here that I..."


Malbec is fine, even the cheapest Malbec from Argentina is top notch.








...and LMAO








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not really, HWMonitor can be way off, like reading 168W for older cpus that pull 400W +.
> I should try this, give the 3770k some liquid courage to shoot for 7Ghz. When you're drunk & loose you don't get hurt as easily, maybe works for the cpu too...


True, true...I've pulled off some nasty parkour stunts while being pseudo-drunk


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> At 4.5Ghz it is likely using more than a light bulb, but nothing out of hand. It's hard to tell the power of the cpu alone, software can't read it properly & power meters only read the power the PSU is pulling from the wall for the system. The system can be barebones (mobo, cpu, hdd) but still not an isolated cpu.
> 
> 
> 
> ...all that talk about Power (and with it heat) makes me thirsty...got a bottle of Argentinean Malbec here and some white extra-old cheddar and walnuts...if I don't like the Malbec wine, I just put it into the w-c loop of the Sandy-E...wonder what a drunk 3970X would think "...2+2 = 17 ...hey, L3 cache, baby, take your clothes o
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...may be I call my old GF, Pentium4, and tell here that I..."
Click to expand...

Well, it _would_ lower the freezing point....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Booze has lower freezing point than water...yeah. Water chiller!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Booze has lower freezing point than water...yeah. Water chiller!


...experiment with drunk 3970X has to wait - after letting it breath a bit, the Malbec is 'just fine' (viva Argentina) - let the Sandy-E buy its own wine, or it can share some with the delidded 3770K


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Out of interest.
> If I have my pc on all day vs folding at 100%
> What is the power consumption difference?
> 
> I'm curious to know!
> Ie. Does heating a kettle require more kW than my pc does for the whole day?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'll have a quick look at this right now..


A few quick tests, rig at 4.8Ghz 1.36V in bios, 2 x 7970 at 1150 core 1.175V. Watts are read from the wall, psu efficency not calculated.

Idle in offset mode - 114W , 1600mhz 0.882V
idle in fixed more - 148W , 4800mhz 1.356V

Cpu at 100% load in IBT, gpus idle - 262W
Gpus both loaded, cpu about 15% load for gpus - 689W
gpus & cpu at 100% load - 792W


----------



## chris-br

Hey, sup guys, long time. ;P


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A few quick tests, rig at 4.8Ghz 1.36V in bios, 2 x 7970 at 1150 core 1.175V. Watts are read from the wall, psu efficency not calculated.
> 
> Idle in offset mode - 114W , 1600mhz 0.882V
> idle in fixed more - 148W , 4800mhz 1.356V
> 
> Cpu at 100% load in IBT, gpus idle - 262W
> Gpus both loaded, cpu about 15% load for gpus - 689W
> gpus & cpu at 100% load - 792W


...memory test ( <=> 3 GHz)...didn't you and I this already exchange posts on this about a month ago - or am I imagining things (via Malbec ?) ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...memory test ( <=> 3 GHz)...didn't you and I this already exchange posts on this about a month ago - or am I imagining things (via Malbec ?) ?


I think so when I was running the x79 rig with some 680s. Using a z77 with 7970s today so did some quick testing for TDs question.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I regret forgetting to put tRRSR at 5 for the Hynix sticks...I failed miserably with those


----------



## Swag

I bought an H100i and the temps are 9C cooler vs my NH-D14. Added to that note, the ambient temp during the NH-D14 was cooler.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good that means the faster fans the h100i has are working...









Hokies! quick...list your 7950 model number.


----------



## KuuFA

I am going to assume they are reference powercolors.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I bought an H100i and the temps are 9C cooler vs my NH-D14. Added to that note, the ambient temp during the NH-D14 was cooler.


With extended load the water may heat up a bit & let the d14 catch up., the AIO coolers do tend to be pretty close to high end air.

AIO coolers look a whole lot better on the board though, that d14 just covers all...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good that means the faster fans the h100i has are working...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hokies! quick...list your 7950 model number.


I think hokies is tearing up the loop again, his VRM temps are a bit out of hand.


----------



## chris-br

As expected.. being ignored.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> As expected.. being ignored.


who r u ?

lol just kidding


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good that means the faster fans the h100i has are working...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hokies! quick...list your 7950 model number.


What the box looks like

Yea he got these.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> As expected.. being ignored.


Timing, you were the last post on a page with the new page starting a minute or less later. Had to look back to see what I missed.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good that means the faster fans the h100i has are working...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hokies! quick...list your 7950 model number.


7950 & not 7970? 7970s can be found for not too much more.


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> who r u ?
> 
> lol just kidding


lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Timing, you were the last post on a page with the new page starting a minute or less later. Had to look back to see what I missed.


Heh, didnt notice cuz i see 100 posts per page. ;P


----------



## chris-br

Well. i got a brand new 7950 today.


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> Well. i got a brand new 7950 today.


Nice! I am guessing the WF3? lol.

I got 2 powercolor PCS+ 7950's not too long ago either! both will do 1200+ at 1.2v but the vrms get a tad bit hot lol.


----------



## chris-br

It's running 1ghz out of the box.. happy.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> lol
> Heh, didnt notice cuz i see 100 posts per page. ;P


I was set up that way for a while, I got messed up in the huddler switch & have just left it default since then. Now that I can get into my own profile & options again I should fix that...


----------



## chris-br

wonderng if i should put liquid pro on the new card.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> As expected.. being ignored.


Hi there








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 7950 & not 7970? 7970s can be found for not too much more.


I don't want no stinkin 7950s








I got a shiny new 6950 1gb WF3 with 1 year left of warranty coverage...today.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris-br*
> 
> wonderng if i should put liquid pro on the new card.


Do so! I will as soon as I test temps at stock and oced with the stock tim tonight.


----------



## chris-br

i got out of a 6970.


----------



## FtW 420

I do plan on getting a 5870 this weekend, finally found a 5870 Lightning on the local craigslist!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I do plan on getting a 5870 this weekend, finally found a 5870 Lightning on the local craigslist!


I'm so jelly!


----------



## KuuFA

Well I am quite pleased with the recent refresh I did on my "spare" rig.

Before:


The stuff I put in:


And how she sits now:




Excuse the Cables as I am not done with the management yet lol.

The case is an Lian Li PC-7 Plus From like 2005 lol good ole case has been through a lot lol.

I must say I do like how the newer Corsair fans look! Their performance may not be top notch but if you are able to get them at around ~$10 a fan I think they are great!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I think so when I was running the x79 rig with some 680s. Using a z77 with 7970s today so did some quick testing for TDs question.


...good ! some memory circuits are still ok







- as far as I recall, it was about Intel's SpeedStep on/off re power savings ?

...on another note, that new custom loop for Sandy-E is being leak-tested - so far, not a drop of EK's blood-red's finest where it doesn't belong







big, long loop though...took 1.5 liters, 550 ml more than what I had built for the delidded 3770K !


----------



## ivanlabrie

WF3x 6950 lives!!!!








Got a hefty UPS just in case...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good that means the faster fans the h100i has are working...


Well, I got it as payment for helping my dad's coworker.







Pretty good and it'll be covering my CPU until I get enough money for custom water.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I bought an H100i and the temps are 9C cooler vs my NH-D14. Added to that note, the ambient temp during the NH-D14 was cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> With extended load the water may heat up a bit & let the d14 catch up., the AIO coolers do tend to be pretty close to high end air.
> 
> AIO coolers look a whole lot better on the board though, that d14 just covers all...
Click to expand...

I let prime95 run for 15 minutes on 8FFT so it'll get as close to as hot it'll be with the current ambient temp. The D14 reached 88C while the H100i barely hit 76C.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...good ! some memory circuits are still ok
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - as far as I recall, it was about Intel's SpeedStep on/off re power savings ?
> 
> ...on another note, that new custom loop for Sandy-E is being leak-tested - so far, not a drop of EK's blood-red's finest where it doesn't belong
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> big, long loop though...took 1.5 liters, 550 ml more than what I had built for the delidded 3770K !


I wonder how much liquid hokies needed? 1.5L might have been a drop in the bucket...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, I got it as payment for helping my dad's coworker.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pretty good and it'll be covering my CPU until I get enough money for custom water.
> I let prime95 run for 15 minutes on 8FFT so it'll get as close to as hot it'll be with the current ambient temp. The D14 reached 88C while the H100i barely hit 76C.


Not bad at all!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I wonder how much liquid hokies needed? 1.5L might have been a drop in the bucket...
> Not bad at all!


90% of a gallon of water


----------



## FtW 420

Not bad, I wasn't sure if those rads would hold more than that or not.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not bad, I wasn't sure if those rads would hold more than that or not.


..speaking of rads...







when I put this together earlier, the first order of the day was to take the two BRAND NEW rads and flush them thoroughly with distilled water...like on earlier builds, it is quite mind-boggling how many little pieces of shavings, paint and other '''stuff'' comes out of the factory-fresh rads at first...stuff you certainly don't want lodged in your pump, res, or CPU block later...quality control at the rad factory must have been sick that day


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I wonder how much liquid hokies needed? 1.5L might have been a drop in the bucket...
> Not bad at all!


...yeah - but this one is just a single CPU loop (no GPUs in the loop) - Hokies got 3 GPUs on his as well, not to mention 'a lot of' big reservoirs


----------



## FtW 420

I just have cheapo swiftech rads, but they were the same. Put in distilled, give it a shake, dump out water + gunk.
Repeated a few times till the water came out gunkless.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Gunkless is the name of the game...









Stupid Cat 13.2 bsod on startup. Had to load safe mode and remove crap.
Downloading the 12.11 beta, which happens to be the driver used by the no.1 3dmark 11 guy with this card.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A few quick tests, rig at 4.8Ghz 1.36V in bios, 2 x 7970 at 1150 core 1.175V. Watts are read from the wall, psu efficency not calculated.
> 
> Idle in offset mode - 114W , 1600mhz 0.882V
> idle in fixed more - 148W , 4800mhz 1.356V
> 
> Cpu at 100% load in IBT, gpus idle - 262W
> Gpus both loaded, cpu about 15% load for gpus - 689W
> gpus & cpu at 100% load - 792W


Wow those GPU's!
Thanks a lot for the info!
How many minutes/hours etc was this taken over?
And if it draws 262w at idle, is that a constant over a period of time?

Would rep you if I could


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Wow those GPU's!
> Thanks a lot for the info!
> How many minutes/hours etc was this taken over?
> And if it draws 262w at idle, is that a constant over a period of time?
> 
> Would rep you if I could


It was just quick testing, watched the idles for a minute, load the gpus for a minute, etc.
All done in about 10 minutes.
The gpus are pretty tame as is, just a mild overclock, they can pull a lot more yet.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *netminder1976*
> 
> Is there anyone here that went from clu under the ihs to using no ihs? Just wondering if it would be worth it at all. Thanks




I did notice an improvement, cant say exactly how much, maybe 5c for me. since before I delidded I though bare-die was the logical solution. remove the barrier of ihs and thermal paste but a lot of people said they had trouble getting the chip to post since the water block pressure alone is responcible for making all pins to contact.
see my recient post;
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/16510#post_19710658

so much of this temp decrease effect is in the application of the clu and the alignment of the mount. not just what is uses but how.

I did not want to alter my water block hardware in a way that would prevent me from using the ihs again If I so choose.







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN YOU DIDN'T OVERCLOCK IT ENOUGHT*








just kidding







*IF IT AINT BROKE THEN DON'T FIX IT!*















*"Yeah my name is Ivy and I get hot."*


----------



## Valafar

Just delidded my 3770k a couple days ago using the calibrated hammer method. That has to be among the craziest ways to remove a ihs I have ever done, but it worked and took all of about a minute to do. I would not hesitate to do it again. I use that CL Ultra under the ihs and temps dropped way down. Went from 85C + after 10 minutes of Prime95 blend to 65C after 12+ hour blend. Sadly it seems my cpu doesn't want to go above 4.7Ghz without a massive increase in volts. Currently running +0.2 offset to hit 4.7Ghz.


----------



## VonDutch

Maybe time to get the "calibrated hammer method" on page 1?

looks like a good way to delid if you ask me, cant wait till i can do it myselfs,
maybe when/if i buy a Haswell for my new build


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Maybe time to get the "calibrated hammer method" on page 1?
> 
> looks like a good way to delid if you ask me, cant wait till i can do it myselfs,
> maybe when/if i buy a Haswell for my new build


Wow what happend to you lol, been gone forever.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Wow what happend to you lol, been gone forever.


Lol, yea i know,
just doing some other things atm, and i thought a while ago,
no need to answer questions with 10 peeps saying about the same..lol
the delid team is doing a great job








but i still read when i have time tho..but not every day, and 10 pages ..haha

and i wanted to give Valgaur some time to get some more +Rep's ...LOL








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Maybe time to get the "calibrated hammer method" on page 1?
> 
> looks like a good way to delid if you ask me, cant wait till i can do it myselfs,
> maybe when/if i buy a Haswell for my new build


but this new method, i think is important to the club see


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Lol, yea i know,
> just doing some other things atm, and i thought a while ago,
> no need to answer questions with 10 peeps saying about the same..lol
> the delid team is doing a great job
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i still read when i have time tho..but not every day, and 10 pages ..haha
> but this new method, i think is important to the club see


Hello VonDutch







I actually checked the other day if your account was still active ! ...thought you might have fallen off the ends of the earth


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Hello VonDutch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I actually checked the other day if your account was still active ! ...thought you might have fallen off the ends of the earth


Hey Joa3d43








yea, i dont always login when im reading up..
no worries, still active, be it in the background,

but that hammer method is interesting i think, so had to logon for that,
i think its a good one to have on our page 1..
i didnt check the whole thread, but theres several movie clips in there i think that we can use also?,
besides the info about how to do it, and what you need..

like this vid,





heres the other one,
http://www.fnarfbargle.com/private/130315-Delid-vid/IMG_0081.m4v

maybe theres better ones out there ..idk..


----------



## ivanlabrie

VonDutch!

Long time no see...may Thijs Van Leer and Arjen Lucassen be with you. (?)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Hey Joa3d43
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea, i dont always login when im reading up..
> no worries, still active, be it in the background,
> 
> but that hammer method is interesting i think, so had to logon for that,
> i think its a good one to have on our page 1....


...I also find it quite interesting...even have been wondering whether one can use a pair of pliers with the vise to twist the IHS off, perhaps after warming up the silicon bead ... looks like Haswell may also be 'delidable'


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> VonDutch!
> 
> Long time no see...may Thijs Van Leer and Arjen Lucassen be with you. (?)


Haha, hey ivan ..long time indeed, weeks go very fast..hows you?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I also find it quite interesting...even have been wondering whether one can use a pair of pliers with the vise to twist the IHS off, perhaps after warming up the silicon bead ... looks like Haswell may also be 'delidable'


Haswell will not be soldered, so yes, we can delid them also ..lol
was thinking, if you warm it, the glue will get more flexible?, it wont "break" as easy then when you dont heat it up before delidding it..
twisting it could be a good way also..i still have 2 old pentiums laying around from my old delid project with my kids,
im afraid they are soldered, but i guess it wont matter if i use them to try the new methods of delidding, im not planning on using them afterwards so ..
now i need to find someone who has a vice i can use ...haha, and have my kids here to make a vid ...


----------



## illuz

Would it be worth using CLU on my 2 GTX 670 Windforces when I water cool them?


----------



## D33G33

woo just getting better and better! I was so upset when i custom watercooled PC was getting to 80degrees on a 4.4ghz 1.2vcore OC.
I don't have the best chip but have now have a stable OC of 4.7ghz @ 1.375vcore and peak temp on IBT was 73degrees!!!! Now i run an 8 hour on OCCT just to be sure, I dont expect to see temps over 76-78 degrees, then... I might have a crack @ 4.8ghz.... Though i'm not really too comfortable going over 1.4v this isn't an every day PC just to play games and stuff so... why not?

Thanks for the delidding encouragement! I would have never enjoyed my PC after i threw what I considered to be a lot of money at the cooling and stuff remained to get high temps on a very mild OC.

Validation







http://valid.canardpc.com/2766941


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Would it be worth using CLU on my 2 GTX 670 Windforces when I water cool them?


yea i would, i have clu on both of my 670's and there on air


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Would it be worth using CLU on my 2 GTX 670 Windforces when I water cool them?


Im running an EVGA 670 Superclocked with an extra 40mhz OC (peak 1086mhz) and at an absolute maximum of Heaven and Furmark then didnt get over 62 Degrees with an XSPC waterblock using MX-4... Considering the mess CLU/CLP can make and its current temps I don't see a benefit. IMO


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> Im running an EVGA 670 Superclocked with an extra 40mhz OC (peak 1086mhz) and at an absolute maximum of Heaven and Furmark then didnt get over 62 Degrees with an XSPC waterblock using MX-4... Considering the mess CLU/CLP can make and its current temps I don't see a benefit. IMO


I'd say that 62C is a bit too much for being under water and your overclock is also quite low compared to most 670's.


----------



## Triggagnomic

Room for one more? I dunno if y'all are still adding people though...

OCN name: Triggagnomic
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid: 4818
Temp drops: 14C

http://i314.photobucket.com/albums/ll415/Triggagnomic_2008/48_zps2d5daad9.jpg

http://valid.canardpc.com/2767075

That was mad-scary! My wife would have murdered me if I'd got that wrong...

Thanks for the great tutorials & posts guys, they made the whole thing much easier to get my head around!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> I'd say that 62C is a bit too much for being under water and your overclock is also quite low compared to most 670's.


yea my cards barley go over 65c on air


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yea my cards barley go over 65c on air


Poopy 3770k and Poopy 670's


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> Poopy 3770k Poopy 670's


Fixed!


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yea my cards barley go over 65c on air


My previous Giga 670 barely went over 55C on air and at 1280Mhz at the core.


----------



## Hokies83

Yah kepler runs cool and draws less power because it has no on die compute.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> Poopy 3770k and Poopy 670's


oh boy look what u made me do











http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6321924


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> oh boy look what u made me do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6321924


Great OC for the volts.


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> oh boy look what u made me do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6321924


Lolz just disheartening... I might have another go at OCing the 670 then... I must just be super unlucky with hardware.

Though i will say my WC is very tame, just 2x 240's... that's an excuse... right?


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> My previous Giga 670 barely went over 55C on air and at 1280Mhz at the core.


How much on the memory?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys! I've been playing the role of soccer dad this week and haven't even gotten a chance to turn on my rig. Suck!! Can't wait until sunday so I can start increasing that multiplier again.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> Lolz just disheartening... I might have another go at OCing the 670 then... I must just be super unlucky with hardware.
> 
> Though i will say my WC is very tame, just 2x 240's... that's an excuse... right?


lol no excuse
but your card shouldnt hit 60c water cooled maybe it would be a good idea to put clu on it and try to remount


----------



## Ali Man

^^yea definitely.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> How much on the memory?


Around 6800Mhz.

Got 10.4k P-marks in 3DMark 11.


----------



## ivanlabrie

@D33G33: 2 x 240 rads is fine for a 670 and a 3770k...btw.
And yeah, CLU is 100% worth it. My 6950 is doing 850mhz and 1300mhz ram with 46c max load while gaming. Haven't tested benchies yet but I guess it will not go above 50c. Used to idle at 38c with stock tim, load at 46c at stock (800mhz 1250mhz)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol no excuse
> but your card shouldnt hit 60c water cooled maybe it would be a good idea to put clu on it and try to remount


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> @D33G33: 2 x 240 rads is fine for a 670 and a 3770k...btw.
> And yeah, CLU is 100% worth it. My 6950 is doing 850mhz and 1300mhz ram with 46c max load while gaming. Haven't tested benchies yet but I guess it will not go above 50c. Used to idle at 38c with stock tim, load at 46c at stock (800mhz 1250mhz)










...*a word of caution re CLU* on Gigabyte WF3 OC 670 (and also Asus Direct CUii 670)

I have both types and ended up putting MX4 on instead of the planned CL-U...on both types of cards, you see that the area of the air cooling segment that touches the GPU die is ""mostly"" flattened copper pipes - but not exclusively...there are thin bits of aluminum in-between (worse on the Asus)...and aluminum and CL-U are a big no-no (also per CL-U instruction package), you'll damage your cards over the longer term. I'm working on covering the thin alu bits with MX4 first, then add CL-U, but haven't quite perfected it yet.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> Maybe time to get the "calibrated hammer method" on page 1?
> 
> looks like a good way to delid if you ask me, cant wait till i can do it myselfs,
> maybe when/if i buy a Haswell for my new build


It has a linkyto the other thread about it. I talked with the guy about it, Ill throw the other info from them on the front page later, currently in classes right now though. Glad to have ya back bro! Hope the break was nice!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Wow what happend to you lol, been gone forever.


I kinda took a break, was really nice lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Triggagnomic*
> 
> Room for one more? I dunno if y'all are still adding people though...
> 
> OCN name: Triggagnomic
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4818
> Temp drops: 14C
> 
> http://i314.photobucket.com/albums/ll415/Triggagnomic_2008/48_zps2d5daad9.jpg
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2767075
> 
> That was mad-scary! My wife would have murdered me if I'd got that wrong...
> 
> Thanks for the great tutorials & posts guys, they made the whole thing much easier to get my head around!


So ill add ya later as earlier sentence im in class right now so just PM me the link so I don't forget lol, lots of stuff for me today


----------



## Triggagnomic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So ill add ya later as earlier sentence im in class right now so just PM me the link so I don't forget lol, lots of stuff for me today


Cheers!









PM sending now...


----------



## lilchronic

it has arrived


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it has arrived


Oh nice you went with the OC Formula? Congrats on getting a new board! I have heard that the vcore is still off a little bit, but not nearly as bad as the Extreme4. I would still get a DMM just to see, but you will definetly have a lot easier of a time getting a stable OC with this new board. Be sure to post pics when you have everything set up. Good luck with that 5 giggles OC!!

I can validate with 5Ghz at 1.5v now (couldn't boot at 5Ghz even with 1.6v on my Extreme4), but it takes a lot more volts than that to be stable. My wall is at 4.9Ghz. I really *want to run a little over 1.5v* for my 24/7, but I'm confused on exactly how long my chip will live with really good temps at that voltage. Can anyone give me an answer to that??


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it has arrived


Nice!








Better not give you better scores though.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it has arrived
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh nice you went with the OC Formula? Congrats on getting a new board! I have heard that the vcore is still off a little bit, but not nearly as bad as the Extreme4.?
Click to expand...

Vcore is dead on perfect with this board when using a multimeter to take the measurement from the voltage monitor pins on the board. It bounces around a bit in CPUz, but don't think any board won't have that problem.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Vcore is dead on perfect with this board when using a multimeter to take the measurement from the voltage monitor pins on the board. It bounces around a bit in CPUz, but don't think any board won't have that problem.


Oh nice ok thats good I guess I heard that from someone who has no idea how to use a DMM. I just heard it was off around .005v - .01v

So does anyone think my chip will last a year if I feed it 1.55v with temps that don't go over 75c? My computer isn't on 24/7 I'd say I use it maybe 28 hours a week.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So does anyone think my chip will last a year if I feed it 1.55v with temps that don't go over 75c? My computer isn't on 24/7 I'd say I use it maybe 28 hours a week.


I would bet it is at least a 10 to 1 likelihood that you will be fine for a year under those conditions. You mean max stress testing temps are 75c right, so day to day temps are in the 50s?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I would bet it is at least a 10 to 1 likelihood that you will be fine for a year under those conditions. You mean max stress testing temps are 75c right, so day to day temps are in the 50s?


Yes max stress test temps are 75c under that voltage.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...*a word of caution re CLU* on Gigabyte WF3 OC 670 (and also Asus Direct CUii 670)
> 
> I have both types and ended up putting MX4 on instead of the planned CL-U...on both types of cards, you see that the area of the air cooling segment that touches the GPU die is ""mostly"" flattened copper pipes - but not exclusively...there are thin bits of aluminum in-between (worse on the Asus)...and aluminum and CL-U are a big no-no (also per CL-U instruction package), you'll damage your cards over the longer term. I'm working on covering the thin alu bits with MX4 first, then add CL-U, but haven't quite perfected it yet.


Not MY WF3 card...solid copper slab as the cooler base plate, full copper slab that makes contact with the thermal pads and core.
I used CLP and it works wonders as usual.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it has arrived


Nice!!! Congrats


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not MY WF3 card...solid copper slab as the cooler base plate, full copper slab that makes contact with the thermal pads and core.
> I used CLP and it works wonders as usual.


...yes- varies from model to model...just suggesting to check first...mine will get CL U with a thin painted on MX4 stripe where there's aluminum per earlier pics posted


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Triggagnomic*
> 
> Room for one more? I dunno if y'all are still adding people though...
> 
> OCN name: Triggagnomic
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4818
> Temp drops: 14C
> 
> http://i314.photobucket.com/albums/ll415/Triggagnomic_2008/48_zps2d5daad9.jpg
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2767075
> 
> That was mad-scary! My wife would have murdered me if I'd got that wrong...
> 
> Thanks for the great tutorials & posts guys, they made the whole thing much easier to get my head around!


You're In!







Slap the Sig on baby!!!!


----------



## Inacoma79

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not MY WF3 card...solid copper slab as the cooler base plate, full copper slab that makes contact with the thermal pads and core.
> I used CLP and it works wonders as usual.
> Nice!!! Congrats


Ooh, Ooh, I was thinking about doing this with my 660TIs WF editions, what was your method of application, both die and HS? How many layers?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Single layer on both, die and cooler base. 46c max load oced to 850mhz and 1300mhz ram. Gonna try higher and some overvolting later.


----------



## MKHunt

-Use Asus recommended memory slots (2 furthest), boot loops at XMP settings (VCCSA at 1.2V)
-Disregard Asus, employ knowledge that the copper traces for the two closer slots are physically shorter, and here's where I sit.



The tweaking will begin tonight!

I did have to increase my vcore though :/

I think my vcore was straddling the edges of stability before.


----------



## Inacoma79

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Single layer on both, die and cooler base. 46c max load oced to 850mhz and 1300mhz ram. Gonna try higher and some overvolting later.


Sah-weet!


----------



## lilchronic

well i got some pics









i didnt even try to get all the clu off the top ihs and water block. i just used alcohol to get all the chunks out, then just spread the orginal clu with a cotten ball till it looked nice and flat, then i applied some more on top of the old












now its time to try and bring my old chip back to life. ill call him frankinstien lol


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> -Use Asus recommended memory slots (2 furthest), boot loops at XMP settings (VCCSA at 1.2V)
> -Disregard Asus, employ knowledge that the copper traces for the two closer slots are physically shorter, and here's where I sit.
> 
> 
> 
> The tweaking will begin tonight!
> 
> I did have to increase my vcore though :/
> 
> I think my vcore was straddling the edges of stability before.


You're just doing this for fun right? I recall a couple of articles that found there's no advantage to > 2133 CL 9, and CL is more important than Mhz. http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/memory-performance-16gb-ddr31333-to-ddr32400-on-ivy-bridge-igp-with-gskill/14

I might be wrong, but I thought they put zig zags in the traces to make distance to CPU about the same.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You're just doing this for fun right? I recall a couple of articles that found there's no advantage to > 2133 CL 9, and CL is more important than Mhz. http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/memory-performance-16gb-ddr31333-to-ddr32400-on-ivy-bridge-igp-with-gskill/14
> 
> I might be wrong, but I thought they put zig zags in the traces to make distance to CPU about the same.


That article is testing memory speeds with IGP of Ivy Bridge. Higher frequency is great for synthetic benchmarks, so yeah I guess it is just for fun. I find that the 2200MHz CL10 I get out of my 1600MHz CL8 1.35v kit is definitely worthwhile. Especially because the 8GB kit was only $45 (at the time, now its like $75). That's a decent overclock IMO, not anything for the bench-geeks to drool over but for a gamer like me, it aint too shabby!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it has arrived


Congrats! Can't bug you about your board anymore, I want one of those...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Oh nice ok thats good I guess I heard that from someone who has no idea how to use a DMM. I just heard it was off around .005v - .01v
> 
> So does anyone think my chip will last a year if I feed it 1.55v with temps that don't go over 75c? My computer isn't on 24/7 I'd say I use it maybe 28 hours a week.


Most boards are at least a touch off with vcore reading, I've never see any board that was dead on yet.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> -Use Asus recommended memory slots (2 furthest), boot loops at XMP settings (VCCSA at 1.2V)
> -Disregard Asus, employ knowledge that the copper traces for the two closer slots are physically shorter, and here's where I sit.
> 
> 
> 
> The tweaking will begin tonight!
> 
> I did have to increase my vcore though :/
> 
> I think my vcore was straddling the edges of stability before.


Nice! I generally use maxxmem & aida64 for quick checks to make sure latency & bandwidth are improving as I make changes
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You're just doing this for fun right? I recall a couple of articles that found there's no advantage to > 2133 CL 9, and CL is more important than Mhz. http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/memory-performance-16gb-ddr31333-to-ddr32400-on-ivy-bridge-igp-with-gskill/14
> 
> I might be wrong, but I thought they put zig zags in the traces to make distance to CPU about the same.


Most articles talk more about price/performance. Performance goes up with faster memory, but the kits can go up in price pretty fast for smaller gains, price/performance goes down.
Gaming is one area where faster memory doesn't do much except increase minimum frame rates, not much for extra FPS, since most OCNers are gamers, most don't believe in spending an extra buck if it doesn't help gaming.
Anything cpu intensive can benefit, but the gains aren't huge & the price of a great memory kit can be huge.
The article was written by one of the OCN bench team...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Benching team member? slap that guy


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Benching team member? slap that guy


...benching is fun







...sort of like building a little bridge over a creek...you instantly know if your latest changes worked - or not, like when you end up in the water


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...benching is fun
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...sort of like building a little bridge over a creek...you instantly know if your latest changes worked - or not, like when you end up in the water


Think he was talking about borandi, the bench team member writing articles about price/performance... For benchers it is usually performance/who cares what it costs if performance is better.

But he does write articles for mainstream as well, that one is more for the price savvy gamers.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You're just doing this for fun right? I recall a couple of articles that found there's no advantage to > 2133 CL 9, and CL is more important than Mhz. http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/memory-performance-16gb-ddr31333-to-ddr32400-on-ivy-bridge-igp-with-gskill/14
> 
> I might be wrong, but I thought they put zig zags in the traces to make distance to CPU about the same.


My reading of that review did not give me CL being more important than MHz. CL timings did reduce with speed, but despite that the conclusion was:
Quote:


> In the end, we have to recommend what kits our users should be looking for. Taking the DDR3-1333 C9 kit as a base, it seems a no-brainer to go for the DDR3-1600 C9 kit for $5 more. The boost across the board for a negligible difference in price is worth it. The jump up to the G.Skill 1866 C9 kit also provides enough of a measurable boost, although the leap in price from 1600 C9 is another $15, which could be harder to swallow.
> 
> As we move into the 2133 C9 kit we tested today, we again across our test bed see a tangible jump in performance. This jump is not as much as moving from 1333 to 1600, but it is there and users wanting peak performance will be happy with this kit, though the size of the user pockets will also have to match.
> 
> When it comes to our 2400 C10 kit results, compared to the 2133 C9, it is highly dependant which kit comes out on top. Even if one kit beats the other, it is only by a small margin - not one that can be justified by a $15 jump in the price.


In my benching experience, MHz has always yielded more than CL.


----------



## stickg1

I kind of want a 2nd kit of my RAM just so I don't have any empty slots, is that weird? 8GB is plenty but when I look in the window and see empty slots it's not aesthetically pleasing to me.

I have these:

Crucial Ballistix Tactical 8GB 1600MHz CL8 1.35v
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148656

When I bought them they were $25 cheaper than they are now!


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Do I need 32 gb of ram? Hells no, but I didn't want empty slots either









Not really for aesthetics, but I was like "eh ram doesn't have an expiration date and I'm sure it'll get used eventually, even if it's 2 years from now".

Plus the 2nd kit happened to be on sale at the time.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You're just doing this for fun right? I recall a couple of articles that found there's no advantage to > 2133 CL 9, and CL is more important than Mhz. http://www.anandtech.com/show/6372/memory-performance-16gb-ddr31333-to-ddr32400-on-ivy-bridge-igp-with-gskill/14
> 
> I might be wrong, but I thought they put zig zags in the traces to make distance to CPU about the same.
> 
> 
> 
> My reading of that review did not give me CL being more important than MHz. CL timings did reduce with speed, but despite that the conclusion was:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, we have to recommend what kits our users should be looking for. Taking the DDR3-1333 C9 kit as a base, it seems a no-brainer to go for the DDR3-1600 C9 kit for $5 more. The boost across the board for a negligible difference in price is worth it. The jump up to the G.Skill 1866 C9 kit also provides enough of a measurable boost, although the leap in price from 1600 C9 is another $15, which could be harder to swallow.
> 
> As we move into the 2133 C9 kit we tested today, we again across our test bed see a tangible jump in performance. This jump is not as much as moving from 1333 to 1600, but it is there and users wanting peak performance will be happy with this kit, though the size of the user pockets will also have to match.
> 
> When it comes to our 2400 C10 kit results, compared to the 2133 C9, it is highly dependant which kit comes out on top. Even if one kit beats the other, it is only by a small margin - not one that can be justified by a $15 jump in the price.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> In my benching experience, MHz has always yielded more than CL.
Click to expand...

My understanding has been that Mhz goes up and CL goes up at the same time, with them largely cancelling each other out to where it's no difference in non-synthetic loads. The difference being you pay a lot more for the bigger Mhz number. I can't remember the article title, but it showed 2133 CL9 being just as fast as something like 2400 CL11.

I'm thinking of a Tom's Hardware article from a couple of years ago that found CL was more important than Mhz. Not sure if it relevant nowadays, but DDR3 1600 was pretty fast when it was written.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> My understanding has been that Mhz goes up and CL goes up at the same time, with them largely cancelling each other out to where it's no difference in non-synthetic loads. The difference being you pay a lot more for the bigger Mhz number. I can't remember the article title, but it showed 2133 CL9 being just as fast as something like 2400 CL11.
> 
> I'm thinking of a Tom's Hardware article from a couple of years ago that found CL was more important than Mhz. Not sure if it relevant nowadays, but DDR3 1600 was pretty fast when it was written.


If the CL goes up too much it does tend to lower the increase that higher frequency gives, 2133mhz c11 may be pretty close to 2133 c9, but good memory kits can run 2400 c7 - c9 too, I tend to do best at 2500 - 2700Mhz c9 or c10 on ivy bridge.

A couple years ago memory overclocking was different, the uncore & cpu frequency were untied & the memory clock depended on the chips ability to overclock the uncore.
The uncore had to be double the memory speed at a minimum, & without a $1000 cpu most chips would max the uncore at about 4Ghz unless really pushing things, so 2000 - 2200Mhz memory with tighter timings was a good goal to shoot for benching clocks, 1600 - 1866 was more common for 24/7.


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys... finally found a home for the 680 Thanks again Ivan!

What 7970 or 7950 I wanna bench it so 7970 obviously but what one will have unlocked volts and that I can WC later for the build??


----------



## FtW 420

Other guys probably know what is best for unlocked voltage, for full cover water reference is supposed to be the way to go.
The soldering iron can still unlock voltage on any card, if you plan on ever benching cold, one of the gpus with a beefed up PCB can be handy, reference card VRMs can only take so much. But then available water blocks become more limited... Cards like the Lightning are getting hard to find too.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys... finally found a home for the 680 Thanks again Ivan!
> 
> What 7970 or 7950 I wanna bench it so 7970 obviously but what one will have unlocked volts and that I can WC later for the build??


If ur not benching 7950 is a much better buy..

If your benching then the 7970 lighting or matrix.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys... finally found a home for the 680 Thanks again Ivan!
> 
> What 7970 or 7950 I wanna bench it so 7970 obviously but what one will have unlocked volts and that I can WC later for the build??


..*.sell NVidia and buy Radeon* ? I'm *just having some fun,* but I just beat the 4x CF Radeons for the absolute World Record in Firestrike Extreme for 4x GPUs (independent of make or model)...I used to be the only entrant, but then this fellow showed up with his Radeons and beat my submission.....so today, I used the delidded Ivy goodness combined with some NVidia Keplers to almost triple his score...may be you should ask Ivan for help to get your 680 back







(now, now, now - just having some fun - I like Radeons







)


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yup, I said either of those, use universal blocks, good for ANY gpu you buy in the future.









The HIS X2 Turbo is a beast of a card, up to par with those.

@Joa3d43: That's one of the few benchies (along with Vantage with the lod tweak and Heaven dx9) where a 680 does best...BUT for most benchmarks and older ones too, 7970 is better. Compute shows its advantage, higher oc capability without a gazillion mods that WILL probably kill your card on ln2 too.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yup, I said either of those, use universal blocks, good for ANY gpu you buy in the future.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The HIS X2 Turbo is a beast of a card, up to par with those.
> 
> @Joa3d43: That's one of the few benchies (along with Vantage with the lod tweak and Heaven dx9) where a 680 does best...BUT for most benchmarks and older ones too, 7970 is better. Compute shows its advantage, higher oc capability without a gazillion mods that WILL probably kill your card on ln2 too.


7970s do better in firestrike than 680s, although Titans are up top.
With the allowed tweaks, it is hard for 670s & 680s to keep up to radeon in anything dx11.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..*.sell NVidia and buy Radeon* ? I'm *just having some fun,* but I just beat the 4x CF Radeons for the absolute World Record in Firestrike Extreme for 4x GPUs (independent of make or model)...I used to be the only entrant, but then this fellow showed up with his Radeons and beat my submission.....so today, I used the delidded Ivy goodness combined with some NVidia Keplers to almost triple his score...may be you should ask Ivan for help to get your 680 back
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (now, now, now - just having some fun - I like Radeons
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


680 = poop


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yup, I said either of those, use universal blocks, good for ANY gpu you buy in the future.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The HIS X2 Turbo is a beast of a card, up to par with those.
> 
> @Joa3d43: That's one of the few benchies (along with Vantage with the lod tweak and Heaven dx9) where a 680 does best...BUT for most benchmarks and older ones too, 7970 is better. Compute shows its advantage, higher oc capability without a gazillion mods that WILL probably kill your card on ln2 too.


...I'm using 670ies, and no LOD tweak...I think it was some changes to main system mem I made (..psst)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'm using 670ies, and no LOD tweak...I think it was some changes to main system mem I made (..psst)


I do not know how u get these miracle bench numbers you sure ur not using titans.. and hacking that stuff to say 670s?

How u can beat fully voltage unlocked lighting Gtx 680s is past my thinking .


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not know how u get these miracle bench numbers you sure ur not using titans.. and hacking that stuff to say 670s?


...well, thanks everyone for your support







no, there not Titans (those will come later) and no hacking...HWBot ! The new GB WF3 OC replaced the weak link card from before...and in 20 years of building systems, I might have learned s.th. (...I hope).









Ironically, I wasn't really planning on a record run today... just trying to set final benches with the Ivy before running the same benches with the same cards on the 3970X starting next week....


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I do not know how u get these miracle bench numbers you sure ur not using titans.. and hacking that stuff to say 670s?
> 
> How u can beat fully voltage unlocked lighting Gtx 680s is past my thinking .


Depends on the machine & driver too. Maybe the multi gpu lightning owner believed the posts about a 1000W PSU being plenty, so can't OC them...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, thanks everyone for your support
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no, there not Titans (those will come later) and no hacking...HWBot ! The new GB WF3 OC replaced the weak link card from before...and in 20 years of building systems, I might have learned s.th. (...I hope).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ironically, I wasn't really planning on a record run today... just trying to set final benches with the Ivy before running the same benches with the same cards on the 3970X starting next week....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 7970s do better in firestrike than 680s, although Titans are up top.
> With the allowed tweaks, it is hard for 670s & 680s to keep up to radeon in anything dx11.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'm using 670ies, and no LOD tweak...I think it was some changes to main system mem I made (..psst)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Depends on the machine & driver too. Maybe the multi gpu lightning owner believed the posts about a 1000W PSU being plenty, so can't OC them...


lol









I think Joa's 670's do good cause not too many people have as many submissions in that category.
Try single gpu and show me scores man


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, thanks everyone for your support
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no, there not Titans (those will come later) and no hacking...HWBot ! The new GB WF3 OC replaced the weak link card from before...and in 20 years of building systems, I might have learned s.th. (...I hope).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ironically, I wasn't really planning on a record run today... just trying to set final benches with the Ivy before running the same benches with the same cards on the 3970X starting next week....


It is not that... it is the fact that 670s are weak cards... and ur beating much faster cards with weaker cards and i donno how it is happening it is like impossible but yet it is happening?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think Joa's 670's do good cause not too many people have as many submissions in that category.
> Try single gpu and show me scores man


...all in good fun, folks ! FireStrikeEX is certainly not the only bench the system does well at...Heaven, Valley, Aquamark, Catzilla, 03, 05 etc...SLI, tri-SLI, quads...I don't think I should list the 20 global cups w/2,3 and 4 cards here...and I have never run any of the modern systems with only one card, not even after finishing a build - but I know what you're saying.


----------



## lilchronic

ITS ALIVE!!!!! LOL well it turns out my first 3570k that i thoght i killed, well its alive and installing windows now


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is not that... it is the fact that 670s are weak cards... and ur beating much faster cards with weaker cards and i donno how it is happening it is like impossible but yet it is happening?


...I don't think that there is a singular secret there...it's like motorcycle or car racing up a curvy mountain pass, the most powerful (but heavier) machines don't always win...the one thing I pay a lot of attention to is GPU usage...all 4 are usually 90-99% most of the time (depending on the bench)...and there is part of your answer...the other cards would blow my doors off in a straight drag race, but I think that I run higher GPU usage for more of the time...plus on the CPU and buses , I run unusual BCLK (not 100, not even daily)...the trickiest bit was to find the BCLK that works with IMC, a lot of (16-32) TridentX at fast settings AND 4 GPUs w/Plex at x8, x16, x8, x8


----------



## lilchronic

my 670's own 7950's


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...all in good fun, folks ! FireStrikeEX is certainly not the only bench the system does well at...Heaven, Valley, Aquamark, Catzilla, 03, 05 etc...SLI, tri-SLI, quads...I don't think I should list the 20 global cups w/2,3 and 4 cards here...and I have never run any of the modern systems with only one card, not even after finishing a build - but I know what you're saying.


You listing enthusiast league results, right?
On air 7970's are gonna be temp limited, and 680s will already reach their max...
On cold is were things get interesting, and we get 580s beating the rest at 1200mhz core








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ITS ALIVE!!!!! LOL well it turns out my first 3570k that i thoght i killed, well its alive and installing windows now


Congrats man! Now put some radeon cards in it...







be smart.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my 670's own 7950's


Umm no.... oc 7950 should = 10% = 15% faster then ur 670s

Remember i had 4 680s my 7950s are faster lol. and alot cheaper...

You could call the fan boy card and say RUNT FRAMES!... but yeah that would just be sad..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You listing enthusiast league results, right?
> On air 7970's are gonna be temp limited, and 680s will already reach their max...
> On cold is were things get interesting, and we get 580s beating the rest at 1200mhz core


...obviously mixed, Ivan...on several it is *against everybody*, including the extreme folks...my main adversary in 670ies has a LN2 pot and is listed in the pro/extreme league...but this has run its course...just ask FtW; he tried to explain the competition aspect before between enthusiast and other...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Umm no.... oc 7950 should = 10% = 15% faster then ur 670s
> 
> Remember i had 4 680s my 7950s are faster lol. and alot cheaper...
> 
> You could call the fan boy card and say RUNT FRAMES!... but yeah that would just be sad..


That's not even true. I've had both. My Vapor-X 7950 was getting the same bench scores as my WF3 670 and it's not even a good clocker. My 7970 was a good clocker (1300/1800) and was no more than 10% faster than my 670 or 7950.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol I know I know...
We should get them Duniek pots, they seem to be cheaper than the rest.
The one I used was like an F1EE clone and worked really good.

Check these out man: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820313322&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3754110&SID=skim1132X509988X9f99a39acc855d5e7751ab1463df5c54
Hynix goodness for max mhz stuff!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's not even true. I've had both. My Vapor-X 7950 was getting the same bench scores as my WF3 670 and it's not even a good clocker. My 7970 was a good clocker (1300/1800) and was no more than 10% faster than my 670 or 7950.


Mate, did you disable tesselation in the catalyst driver 3d settings? That is one of the secret sauces of 7970/50's for benching at hwbot.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mate, did you disable tesselation in the catalyst driver 3d settings? That is one of the secret sauces of 7970/50's for benching at hwbot.


So they disable settings to get their cards to put up numbers? That doesn't sound like something the fastest non-Titan single GPU card should have to compromise on to compete, dialed down settings.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's not even true. I've had both. My Vapor-X 7950 was getting the same bench scores as my WF3 670 and it's not even a good clocker. My 7970 was a good clocker (1300/1800) and was no more than 10% faster than my 670 or 7950.


Your stuff was not running right 7970 should be a good 20% faster
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So they disable settings to get their cards to put up numbers? That doesn't sound like something the fastest single GPU card on the planet should have to compromise on to compete, dialed down settings.


Nvidia not running it why should the amd be bogged down by it?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Your stuff was not running right 7970 should be a good 20% faster


Maybe something was wrong with your 680s, or maybe it's the fact that you keep comparing 2x 680s to 3x 7950s. It's like being surprised your Corvette beat a Corolla in a drag race.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Maybe something was wrong with your 680s, or maybe it's the fact that you keep comparing 2x 680s to 3x 7950s. It's like being surprised your Corvette beat a Corolla in a drag race.


No i have ran 2 way 3 way and 4 way SLI my stuff runs great LOL... I was in the top 10 in Heaven for a long time.. check the thread i been pushed out the top 30 but it still shows me 31-32.....

I just tell it how it is no fan boy to it.. it is not my fault u sold faster cards to get slower ones because u had stuttering issues.. you should have problem solved it...

Like today i had to do because Bioshock Inf kept crashing every 5 mins stuttering etc... i had to turn off my Killer Lan controller.. now flawless..


----------



## stickg1

Meh I had a rough day and I'm a little wound up. Sorry, I'll stop the bickering. All I'm trying to say is I don't think the 670 and 680 are complete garbage, just because they trail by less than a handful of frames in a benchmark.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Meh I had a rough day and I'm a little wound up. Sorry, I'll stop the bickering. All I'm trying to say is I don't think the 670 and 680 are complete garbage, just because they trail by less than a handful of frames in a benchmark.


good 70fps in 2 of my games... and to see these cards i pad 190$ a piece for beat cards that were well over 500$.... and even then the 7950s have already paid for themselfs but have gone on to make me $$$$.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Maybe something was wrong with your 680s, or maybe it's the fact that you keep comparing 2x 680s to 3x 7950s. It's like being surprised your Corvette beat a Corolla in a drag race.


Depends how long the drag race. If I was in my corolla which weighs much less than a corvette and the race was 20ft, I would win simply from acceleration.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol I know I know...
> We should get them Duniek pots, they seem to be cheaper than the rest.
> The one I used was like an F1EE clone and worked really good.
> 
> Check these out man: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820313322&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3754110&SID=skim1132X509988X9f99a39acc855d5e7751ab1463df5c54
> Hynix goodness for max mhz stuff!


Have to watch duniek though, my duniek pot came in good shape, but people have had some pretty scary things come in. Mikecdm bought some stuff, & it wasn't just destroyed in the shipping, it left in rough shape.

Good price for those Teams!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So they disable settings to get their cards to put up numbers? That doesn't sound like something the fastest non-Titan single GPU card should have to compromise on to compete, dialed down settings.


Happens with every benchmark, they all have thier own allowed tweaks. At least the 3d stuff is easy & basic. Pcmark 05 on the other hand, makes me wish hwbot would just abolish all tweaks.
Put in hardware, overclock it, start bench up, run bench.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Car analogy is funny...but not accurate.









For benching at hwbot comps and such, all it matters is the score. I care about that, and the fact that AMD cards have nice and USEFUL compute power







, whilst being cheaper. I can then buy a titan if I wish, later on...









Pcm05 shouldn't give boints at this point in time...it's so effed up.








3d01 is nice albeit being extremely tweakable, it's challenging and fun.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Car analogy is funny...but not accurate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For benching at hwbot comps and such, all it matters is the score. I care about that, and the fact that AMD cards have nice and USEFUL compute power
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , whilst being cheaper. I can then buy a titan if I wish, later on...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pcm05 shouldn't give boints at this point in time...it's so effed up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 3d01 is nice albeit being extremely tweakable, it's challenging and fun.


Cough the 6950 cough will pay for a titan in about 13 months cough cough after power bill cough.


----------



## Arm3nian

7000 series wasn't always the best... when 600 series came out those were the cards to get, which is why almost everyone has those. A year ago the 7970/7950 were overpriced, clocked low, and had bad drivers. A little later they came out with much higher factory clocked cards, never settle drivers which gave them like 40% increase in fps, and many price drops. A 7950 now costs as much as a 660ti, and can clock to a 7970/680, the choice is obvious.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cough the 6950 cough will pay for a titan in about 13 months cough cough after power bill cough.










Sounds like 4:20 over there, pass it around!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cough the 6950 cough will pay for a titan in about 13 months cough cough after power bill cough.


Maybe earlier than that...cough. We need to see an ENT or whatever man, this dry cough sucks!
Remember, 141% more useful to go the LITE way first...








How does 0.0084usd kWh sound to you btw?







Gotta love Argentina sometimes...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 7000 series wasn't always the best... when 600 series came out those were the cards to get, which is why almost everyone has those. A year ago the 7970/7950 were overpriced, clocked low, and had bad drivers. A little later they came out with much higher factory clocked cards, never settle drivers which gave them like 40% increase in fps, and many price drops. A 7950 now costs as much as a 660ti, and can clock to a 7970/680, the choice is obvious.


Yeah, that's true man...I even had a 670 FTW back then. xD


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 7000 series wasn't always the best... when 600 series came out those were the cards to get, which is why almost everyone has those. A year ago the 7970/7950 were overpriced, clocked low, and had bad drivers. A little later they came out with much higher factory clocked cards, never settle drivers which gave them like 40% increase in fps, and many price drops. A 7950 now costs as much as a 660ti, and can clock to a 7970/680, the choice is obvious.


They did? I got a 7970 at launch, then when the 680s launched I watched the results & they never did catch up to 7000 series so I waited on the non-reference PCB models before getting some 680s.
680s were ahead in reviews at stock clocks, but when overclocked they didn't keep up.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Maybe earlier than that...cough. We need to see an ENT or whatever man, this dry cough sucks!
> Remember, 141% more useful to go the LITE way first...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How does 0.0084usd kWh sound to you btw?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gotta love Argentina sometimes...
> Yeah, that's true man...I even had a 670 FTW back then. xD


Cough if unlocked to a cough 6970 at that power rate cough 6-8 months depending on market cough.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> They did? I got a 7970 at launch, then when the 680s launched I watched the results & they never did catch up to 7000 series so I waited on the non-reference PCB models before getting some 680s.
> 680s were ahead in reviews at stock clocks, but when overclocked they didn't keep up.


In benchmarks? I remember in games the 600 series destroying amd, and they cost about the same if not less.

Also almost every popular game at the time liked nvidia better. Bf3, crysis 2, avp, just cause 2, shogun 2


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> If ur not benching 7950 is a much better buy..
> 
> If your benching then the 7970 lighting or matrix.


it's gonna be a 7970... just tryin to find one lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ITS ALIVE!!!!! LOL well it turns out my first 3570k that i thoght i killed, well its alive and installing windows now


*looks at Franky*


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> In benchmarks? I remember in games the 600 series destroying amd, and they cost about the same if not less.
> 
> Also almost every popular game at the time liked nvidia better. Bf3, crysis 2, avp, just cause 2, shogun 2


I do look at the benchmarks, not a gamer so I don't pay attention to the gaming reviews & comparisons. With the earlier AMD drivers I could see where people may prefer nvidia, they did handle tessellation better than the AMD cards.


----------



## Swag

Anyone know how I can fix change the fan speeds on the H100i without using the Corsair Link thing?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone know how I can fix change the fan speeds on the H100i without using the Corsair Link thing?


...what board are you running - Asus ?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone know how I can fix change the fan speeds on the H100i without using the Corsair Link thing?
> 
> 
> 
> ...what board are you running - Asus ?
Click to expand...

Yup, Asus MVG.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yup, Asus MVG.


...I use Asus FanExpert2 exclusively for 3 machines that are w-c, no other software...not sure if you use AI Suite II or not...just in case, FanExpert2 is a module in Asus Suite II, and you don't have to install all the other ones if you don't want to (ie TurboV, DigiII+ etc). FanExpert2 allows you either 'manual fixed' or 'custom curves' you can program...just make sure that you unplug the USB of the H100 from the board and disable the H100 software from loading automatically.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it's gonna be a 7970... just tryin to find one lol.
> *looks at Franky*


i put some MX-4 over the scratches on the pcb
and only the last two memory slots work B1 and B2


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yup, Asus MVG.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I use Asus FanExpert2 exclusively for 3 machines that are w-c, no other software...not sure if you use AI Suite II or not...just in case, FanExpert2 is a module in Asus Suite II, and you don't have to install all the other ones if you don't want to (ie TurboV, DigiII+ etc). FanExpert2 allows you either 'manual fixed' or 'custom curves' you can program...just make sure that you unplug the USB of the H100 from the board and disable the H100 software from loading automatically.


There is fan control in the 'monitor' section of the bios as well.
I might have to start using the mvg for some daily again soon, if this Gigabyte board flakes out again today, I'm going to pick up the hammer & see how ultra durable it really is.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There is fan control in the 'monitor' section of the bios as well.
> I might have to start using the mvg for some daily again soon, if this Gigabyte board flakes out again today, I'm going to pick up the hammer & see how ultra durable it really is.


...trouble in Gigabyte paradise ?


----------



## chris-br

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Not MY WF3 card...solid copper slab as the cooler base plate, full copper slab that makes contact with the thermal pads and core.
> I used CLP and it works wonders as usual.
> Nice!!! Congrats


Not on mine.. funny its that got hotter with CLP, put mx-4 for now.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ITS ALIVE!!!!! LOL well it turns out my first 3570k that i thoght i killed, well its alive and installing windows now


yay! Love hearing good news like this.
How did you think u killed it?
And/or what did u do to make it work?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There is fan control in the 'monitor' section of the bios as well.
> I might have to start using the mvg for some daily again soon, if this Gigabyte board flakes out again today, I'm going to pick up the hammer & see how ultra durable it really is.


FTW - completely random - but why no capitals in your title?
"performance fanboy"
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone know how I can fix change the fan speeds on the H100i without using the Corsair Link thing?


the off-topic master is back ahha


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yup, Asus MVG.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I use Asus FanExpert2 exclusively for 3 machines that are w-c, no other software...not sure if you use AI Suite II or not...just in case, FanExpert2 is a module in Asus Suite II, and you don't have to install all the other ones if you don't want to (ie TurboV, DigiII+ etc). FanExpert2 allows you either 'manual fixed' or 'custom curves' you can program...just make sure that you unplug the USB of the H100 from the board and disable the H100 software from loading automatically.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> There is fan control in the 'monitor' section of the bios as well.
> I might have to start using the mvg for some daily again soon, if this Gigabyte board flakes out again today, I'm going to pick up the hammer & see how ultra durable it really is.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I stopped using any other board manufacturer other than Asus... They just provide the best products to me, I've never had a problem with an Asus. My brother's Gigabyte board for the 1090T died after a year of use.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There is fan control in the 'monitor' section of the bios as well.
> I might have to start using the mvg for some daily again soon, if this Gigabyte board flakes out again today, I'm going to pick up the hammer & see how ultra durable it really is.
> 
> 
> 
> ...trouble in Gigabyte paradise ?
Click to expand...

Only Asus for me.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone know how I can fix change the fan speeds on the H100i without using the Corsair Link thing?
> 
> 
> 
> the off-topic master is back ahha
Click to expand...

I've been so busy these past few months, I only get on OCN a little now. My work and school is taking up all my time!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...trouble in Gigabyte paradise ?


Board was flakey with memory out of the box, it'll run 2666Mhz stable, but after shutting down it makes me downclock to 2133 or so, then it can clock back up again.
Now it won't start with 2133mhz memory, needs to be 1600 or it won't boot. but after booting, it can run 2666Mhz again, it just can't cold boot with overclocked memory...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> yay! Love hearing good news like this.
> How did you think u killed it?
> And/or what did u do to make it work?
> FTW - completely random - but why no capitals in your title?
> "performance fanboy"
> the off-topic master is back ahha


I had to hurry to change it that day, I had spec's name in the title & had one of the mods screaming at me to change it, not take 5 seconds to do it, but NOW.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> yay! Love hearing good news like this.
> How did you think u killed it?
> And/or what did u do to make it work?


i used mx-4 over the scratches on pcb and only the last two memory slots worked
but im glad i was a noob and thought it was dead cause now i have a chip that can do 5 ghz and not like this 1
stock cooler but delidid with clp on die









this is the worst chip ever made


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Board was flakey with memory out of the box, it'll run 2666Mhz stable, but after shutting down it makes me downclock to 2133 or so, then it can clock back up again.
> Now it won't start with 2133mhz memory, needs to be 1600 or it won't boot. but after booting, it can run 2666Mhz again, it just can't cold boot with overclocked memory....


...and hitting it with a hammer will fix that ?














...I know, it at the very least will fix the frustration level









- - -























I like to come back to what you said earlier re PSUs (to *Hokies* , I think, in response to some of the records I hold with the 670ies)... I really do think that PSUs play a far bigger role than folks think...here's my math:

...take an AX1200 PSU (we both have them)...and may be assume an 85% efficiency...that leaves 1020w to play with...Now take the Ivy at 5.1 GHz or higher...even a low 'v' chip like mine will suck back about 200w (depending on ambient etc, but close enough)...that leaves 820w

...a 670 is rated at 144w (or 576w for 4)...overclock them and you should assume around 210w (or 840w)...out of 820w...see what I mean ?

...a 7970 is between 250w and 275 stock (observed)...even without oc'ing...but you only have 820w left to play with...and that is *before all kinds of peripherals and their current draw, spikes* etc...and oc'ed 7970ies can easily get deep into the 300s...310, 320 ?

...that's the part people don't get - at least with 4 cards...and *even with 3x 7970*ies, you still might be in trouble on that front (ie 3x 300w vs 820w available)...the same math would apply to 680ies (which are a bit better than 7970ies on the watt consumption, but still high, never mind maxed-out 680 Lightnings)...the 670ies are very efficient and can run longer at 'their' top speed, even if their absolute top speed is lower.

...even my frugal 670ies will run into trouble with the 3970x...because that one can slurp down close to 400w on full oc-boil...so I am setting up a secondary PSU link that can supply two of the four cards.

...what about 7950ies ? ...don't know enough about them, but I would think if you clock them up to 7970 levels, you might get the similar power consumption.

...finally, there is Titan...a 670 is exactly half of a Titan re cuda cores (1344)...Titan is clocked fairly low to achieve a 235w rating (below 7970 even)...but clock them up, and there goes the efficiency...

...just my


----------



## Hokies83

My Heavy overclocked 7950s are showing to be pulling about 20Amps each so x3 = 60 Amps still 40 amps to spare so the AX1200 is plenty for 3.

They have run upwards to 10 days 24/7 like that with out issue.


----------



## FtW 420

Another thing to think of the power spikes where a card can pull more that doesn't show on a multimeter or in software. Thinking of the gtx580 again, people were having enough trouble that TiN used an oscilliscope to see what was going on there & the scope could see what other meters were missing, huge power spikes where the card was pulling 800W + for a fraction of a second.
Our cards here won't do anything like that, but if they also have thier smaller power spikes that aren't enough to crash the card or anything, it may have some affect on the scores.


----------



## MKHunt

My AX850 is not coping so well with the load I'm throwing at it. I'm seeing visible fluctuation in the 12V rail at full load









The big question. Seasonic platinum 1000 for $229 or AX 1200 for $265?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Another thing to think of the power spikes where a card can pull more that doesn't show on a multimeter or in software. Thinking of the gtx580 again, people were having enough trouble that TiN used an oscilliscope to see what was going on there & the scope could see what other meters were missing, huge power spikes where the card was pulling 800W + for a fraction of a second.
> Our cards here won't do anything like that, but if they also have thier smaller power spikes that aren't enough to crash the card or anything, it may have some affect on the scores.


...after a HWBot run earlier today, I checked PrecisionX for parameters...GPU1 had spiked to 264% of power...not as crazy as 580ies, but still...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> My AX850 is not coping so well with the load I'm throwing at it. I'm seeing visible fluctuation in the 12V rail at full load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The big question. Seasonic platinum 1000 for $229 or AX 1200 for $265?


Easy AX1200

One used in the market place for 199$ i think 7 year warrantys by serial.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> My AX850 is not coping so well with the load I'm throwing at it. I'm seeing visible fluctuation in the 12V rail at full load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The big question. Seasonic platinum 1000 for $229 or AX 1200 for $265?


...I have two AX1200s side-by-side, so I might be partial...but if you want to add another GPU card later, or just get peace of mind, I'd say spend the extra $36

...I even looked at 'industrial' 1500w units used by a render farm in their individual machines, but apart from cost ($$$) they don't even have an on/off switch...and there is the question how good your wall socket / phases are where your (home?) computer sits...AX1200 get my vote


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Board was flakey with memory out of the box, it'll run 2666Mhz stable, but after shutting down it makes me downclock to 2133 or so, then it can clock back up again.
> Now it won't start with 2133mhz memory, needs to be 1600 or it won't boot. but after booting, it can run 2666Mhz again, it just can't cold boot with overclocked memory...
> I had to hurry to change it that day, I had spec's name in the title & had one of the mods screaming at me to change it, not take 5 seconds to do it, but NOW.


oh mods...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i used mx-4 over the scratches on pcb and only the last two memory slots worked
> but im glad i was a noob and thought it was dead cause now i have a chip that can do 5 ghz and not like this 1
> stock cooler but delidid with clp on die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this is the worst chip ever made


haha - well I had that exact same problem with mine - thought it was the chip - ended being the noobtooth z77.


----------



## MKHunt

AX1200 all ordered up. The draw of the Seasonic was the ability to reuse my AX850 cables. But since I plan to grab IB-E, 1200 indeed seemed the better choice.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> AX1200 all ordered up. The draw of the Seasonic was the ability to reuse my AX850 cables. But since I plan to grab IB-E, 1200 indeed seemed the better choice.










...don't remember where I saw it, but the 'top' IB-E's are expected to be around tmax=120w + - (Ivy 3770K= 77w) *stock*...before oc'ing


----------



## MKHunt

I just assumed a 125W TDP. I'm hoping that in exchange for the long wait, IB's higher Perf:Watt ratio will be more on the perf side for IB-E. Power savings are _nice_, but electricity is cheap here.

I also got some food poisons, so 2800MHz rams will wait til tomorrow. So far it's 2666MHz at 1.65V command 1. Tertiary timings could be tightened though. Secondaries, too.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I just assumed a 125W TDP. I'm hoping that in exchange for the long wait, IB's higher Perf:Watt ratio will be more on the perf side for IB-E. Power savings are _nice_, but electricity is cheap here.
> 
> I also got some food poisons, so 2800MHz rams will wait til tomorrow. So far it's 2666MHz at 1.65V command 1. Tertiary timings could be tightened though. Secondaries, too.










...hope you get better


----------



## MKHunt

It is Taco Bell, I'm sure it will pass in time. I still haven't prime blended or crysis 3'd with these timings. I guess what I'm saying is that I'd like to hide from myself the likelihood of a blue screen until I am ready to suffer boot loops for hours. The only downside to memory clocking on the sabertooth is the way they jammed VCCIO/VCCSA into one single voltage setting and I can't even control the phase modulation on it.


----------



## VonDutch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It has a link to the other thread about it. I talked with the guy about it, Ill throw the other info from them on the front page later, currently in classes right now though. Glad to have ya back bro! Hope the break was nice!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I kinda took a break, was really nice lol.


cool








so we both took a break ..lol
yea, thought the hammer method should be at least mentioned on page 1, thanks bro


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, that sucks badly...a shame really.
Do you have internal pll overvoltage and additional write swizzle settings?


----------



## cowsgomoo

Hi guys, I succeeded with the delidding, except that one of the RAM slot on my P877-i deluxe has some problem. With a stick of RAM in the inner slot, the board's DRAM error led lights up and it doesn't post. It's not the RAM because I tested the same stick of RAM on both slots, and with two different sticks. Taking the board back to RMA, the guy who tested the board tested that RAM slot to be fine with some other CPU and RAM. Has anyone here had the same problem? Narrowing this down, it's either the CPU or some incompatability I don't know of.

I have tested it again after the failed RMA and that RAM slot is still not working.
P.S. It boot to Windows fine with only one stick of RAM in the outer slot.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...hope you get better


I want to sneak in your house and switch my WF3 for yours, rofl, it's not fair!!!


----------



## Desert Rat

I delidded mine yesterday and it works fine. Before if I had 1.4v it would hit 105c but now it stays at 90c on the hottest core(1 core is 15c lower). I used CLU on the die and MX4 on the H100 side. Im just hapy I didnt killed it


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cowsgomoo*
> 
> Hi guys, I succeeded with the delidding, except that one of the RAM slot on my P877-i deluxe has some problem. With a stick of RAM in the inner slot, the board's DRAM error led lights up and it doesn't post. It's not the RAM because I tested the same stick of RAM on both slots, and with two different sticks. Taking the board back to RMA, the guy who tested the board tested that RAM slot to be fine with some other CPU and RAM. Has anyone here had the same problem? Narrowing this down, it's either the CPU or some incompatability I don't know of.
> 
> I have tested it again after the failed RMA and that RAM slot is still not working.
> P.S. It boot to Windows fine with only one stick of RAM in the outer slot.


You either bent a pin in the socket and/or nicked the pcb on your CPU and killed the internal memory controller. I have done both. Sorry to hear that man.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cowsgomoo*
> 
> Hi guys, I succeeded with the delidding, except that one of the RAM slot on my P877-i deluxe has some problem. With a stick of RAM in the inner slot, the board's DRAM error led lights up and it doesn't post. It's not the RAM because I tested the same stick of RAM on both slots, and with two different sticks. Taking the board back to RMA, the guy who tested the board tested that RAM slot to be fine with some other CPU and RAM. Has anyone here had the same problem? Narrowing this down, it's either the CPU or some incompatability I don't know of.
> 
> I have tested it again after the failed RMA and that RAM slot is still not working.
> P.S. It boot to Windows fine with only one stick of RAM in the outer slot.


I had the same problem - ended up being my noobtooth Z77. However, if it has been tested with ANOTHER CPU to be running fine - then it has to be only one other thing: You scratched the PCB on your CPU, on the right hand side, where the IMC would be, and thus the RAM slots are not working.

Can you, yourself confirm that you saw another CPU in there, with RAM working on all slots?
Sometimes people mighrt lie to you to say that it is working, when in reality it isn't.

Another option you could do is to try and reflash the bios, maybe it is having some difficulties in picking up your ram.

And did you notice this ram problem after and/or before delidding?
ie. was it working beforehand?

EDIT:
And it could be the motherboard pins - but then again, if another CPU worked in there, then it can't be pin related.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desert Rat*
> 
> I delidded mine yesterday and it works fine. Before if I had 1.4v it would hit 105c but now it stays at 90c on the hottest core(1 core is 15c lower). I used CLU on the die and MX4 on the H100 side. Im just hapy I didnt killed it


Those temps are way too high...
What Ghz clock are you at, that you are at 1.4v?


----------



## Desert Rat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Those temps are way too high...
> What Ghz clock are you at, that you are at 1.4v?


Its a horrible chip. It takes 1.4v just to be folding stable @ 4.6Ghz. Im sure temps could be better but not too bad for a H100 in a room that is @ 27c.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desert Rat*
> 
> Its a horrible chip. It takes 1.4v just to be folding stable @ 4.6Ghz. Im sure temps could be better but not too bad for a H100 in a room that is @ 27c.


Those temps sound a bit off to me also. Did you make sure to put the thinnest layer of CLU possible on the die and the bottom of the IHS? I would attempt to re-apply it if I were you. I think you could see a better drop than that. I'm using 1.42v for 4.8Ghz with an H100i and temps don't go over 75c after 23 hours of P95 blend. Did you make sure to put the backplate for the H100 on correctly? The two cutouts go over the screws on the back of the motherboard.


----------



## Lil-Diabo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cowsgomoo*
> 
> Hi guys, I succeeded with the delidding, except that one of the RAM slot on my P877-i deluxe has some problem. With a stick of RAM in the inner slot, the board's DRAM error led lights up and it doesn't post. It's not the RAM because I tested the same stick of RAM on both slots, and with two different sticks. Taking the board back to RMA, the guy who tested the board tested that RAM slot to be fine with some other CPU and RAM. Has anyone here had the same problem? Narrowing this down, it's either the CPU or some incompatability I don't know of.
> 
> I have tested it again after the failed RMA and that RAM slot is still not working.
> P.S. It boot to Windows fine with only one stick of RAM in the outer slot.


My bet is on the delidding as well.
My first 3570k wouldn't boot with ram in the second slot. Managed to sell it (albeit cheaply)


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, that sucks badly...a shame really.
> Do you have internal pll overvoltage and additional write swizzle settings?


I do have swizzles. The settings available to me appear to the the same as the MVG with the exceptions of:
-Xtreme Tweaking
-SPI Booster
-VRM Protection Threshold
-the VCCIO tab
-2nd VCCIO voltage
-Skew voltage
-VTTDDR

Settings in the memory tabs appear to be the same. The frustration comes when I want to bump my VCCIO to say, 1.3V, my VCCSA is then quite high. It's aggravating because having held both boards with VRM heatsinks removed, the MVG and Sabertooth appear to use identical circuitry for power delivery.

ETA: Anybody have experience with EK's direct die kit?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desert Rat*
> 
> Its a horrible chip. It takes 1.4v just to be folding stable @ 4.6Ghz. Im sure temps could be better but not too bad for a H100 in a room that is @ 27c.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Those temps sound a bit off to me also. Did you make sure to put the thinnest layer of CLU possible on the die and the bottom of the IHS? I would attempt to re-apply it if I were you. I think you could see a better drop than that. I'm using 1.42v for 4.8Ghz with an H100i and temps don't go over 75c after 23 hours of P95 blend. Did you make sure to put the backplate for the H100 on correctly? The two cutouts go over the screws on the back of the motherboard.


@1.4v I'm not surprised.
I'm at 1.27v @ 68c max temp.
So 1.4v could well hit 95c on my rig too.

I'm still chocked to see 1.4v for 4.6ghz!
Can you not go to 4.5ghz and go for a lower voltage?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i put some MX-4 over the scratches on the pcb
> and only the last two memory slots work B1 and B2


Hey man how is your new board treating you?


----------



## Wenty

Just did mine and stressing it now with Prime95 as I type this.

Running at 5GHz









Temps at 75- 82

1.52 volts


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I'm taking advantage of what could be the last chilly day before it starts getting warm out. I have all my windows open and fans blasting and I'm going to drink some coffee and start some benching. If I could only get my damn 7950's over 1165Mhz


----------



## Desert Rat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> @1.4v I'm not surprised.
> I'm at 1.27v @ 68c max temp.
> So 1.4v could well hit 95c on my rig too.
> 
> I'm still chocked to see 1.4v for 4.6ghz!
> Can you not go to 4.5ghz and go for a lower voltage?


To be honest the vcore does not bother me. Us folders are not afraid of a little voltage here and there, lol. If it dies it just gives me an excuse to get a better one


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desert Rat*
> 
> To be honest the vcore does not bother me. Us folders are not afraid of a little voltage here and there, lol. If it dies it just gives me an excuse to get a better one


well no it isn't about voltages I'm concerned about (although I wouldn't run 24/7 at anything above 1.45v) but those temps are what I'm worried about.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey man how is your new board treating you?


so far i love it. booted 2666mhz on my trident x with some preset the board came with


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so far i love it. booted 2666mhz on my trident x with some preset the board came with


2666Mhz high five! I think our sticks are pretty much identical. Hynix CFRs?

I'm preparing to VCCIO/VCCSA 1.35V and see if we can't boot 2800.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> 2666Mhz high five! I think our sticks are pretty much identical. Hynix CFRs?
> 
> I'm preparing to VCCIO/VCCSA 1.35V and see if we can't boot 2800.


ive got the trident x gskill 2400mhx @10-12-12-31-2n 1.65v.
the preset on my board said 2666mhz hynix so i tried it lol
im still a noob with ram overclocking this new board has so many settings


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> 2666Mhz high five! I think our sticks are pretty much identical. Hynix CFRs?
> 
> I'm preparing to VCCIO/VCCSA 1.35V and see if we can't boot 2800.


Isn't that dangerous voltage?


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Isn't that dangerous voltage?


Did you see a drop in temperatures going from delidded to direct die mate?


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Isn't that dangerous voltage?


Yus. Looks like I'll be keeping it to 1.2-1.25.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone know how I can fix change the fan speeds on the H100i without using the Corsair Link thing?


You can install the software and the usb link, then setup your led color scheme that you want.

After that you can uninstall the software and the usb cable, and just plug your rad fans into the two mobo cpu fan headers. You can use bios to set a simple fan profile or just keep them at a set % like I did because I am not a fan of fan speed changes. With more complex fan curves you have a few software programs to choose from as has been mentioned. I am a little fanatical about fan noise and fancy fan profiles are not fantastic nor worthy of fanfare in my opinion.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone know how I can fix change the fan speeds on the H100i without using the Corsair Link thing?
> 
> 
> 
> You can install the software and the usb link, then setup your led color scheme that you want.
> 
> After that you can uninstall the software and the usb cable, and just plug your rad fans into the two mobo cpu fan headers. You can use bios to set a simple fan profile or just keep them at a set % like I did because I am not a fan of fan speed changes. With more complex fan curves you have a few software programs to choose from as has been mentioned. I am a little fanatical about fan noise and fancy fan profiles are not fantastic nor worthy of fanfare in my opinion.
Click to expand...

I hate how they had to use a USB power... I wish they used a molex or PCIE power cable.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm taking advantage of what could be the last chilly day before it starts getting warm out. I have all my windows open and fans blasting and I'm going to drink some coffee and start some benching. If I could only get my damn 7950's over 1165Mhz


...go Ravage !







Looks like you are having fun (and benching success) with the MVE and the 7950ies...when you bench (i.e. Valley, 3D11), what speed is your Ivy running ?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Did you see a drop in temperatures going from delidded to direct die mate?


I went straight to bare die when I delidded. Thats how I roll.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I went straight to bare die when I delidded. Thats how I roll.


lol i like that







i didnt have the guts to do it. on my second chip







and i can only see a max of 5c cooler than with ihs, and when i already dropped 30c another 5c aint that big of deal for me.
But u did it (like a boss)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...go Ravage !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like you are having fun (and benching success) with the MVE and the 7950ies...when you bench (i.e. Valley, 3D11), what speed is your Ivy running ?


I'm currently running 4.8Ghz and I got my 7950's up to 1175/1600 with a score of 3852 in Valley Extreme HD preset. My best score yet. Damn dual-x can't get past that core clock though. My TFIII can run 1225/1625 as a single card. Going to start inscreasing the clock speed on the ivy tonight. Didn't have much time to do that this morning. Luckily for me it is going to be nice and chilly out tonight so I'm going to find a stable voltage for 4.9Ghz. Tried overclocking my crappy corsair vengeance DDR3 1600 to 1866 with 9, 10, 9, 27, 1N, but had no luck. I had a feeling I wouldn't be able to OC the RAM. Lost my job recently so it's going to be a little bit before I can upgrade anything







Damn random company downsizes.


----------



## TenzoMonk

I'd be honored to join!









Used the hammer/wood/vice method... SUPER EASY... 25c drop in temps (using CLU)! (Never used IBT before the delid... and temps w/HWM and OHWM were same in previous tests). Pics/Video below!

Let me know if there is anything else needed!

OCN name: TenzoMonk
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-3
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 25C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2768515

Tools










Video













Results:
Before



After



Didn't feel comfortable going past 90c before. So we'll see how far we can go


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TenzoMonk*
> 
> I'd be honored to join!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Used the hammer/wood/vice method... SUPER EASY... 25c drop in temps (using CLU)! (Never used IBT before the delid... and temps w/HWM and OHWM were same in previous tests). Pics/Video below!
> 
> Let me know if there is anything else needed!
> 
> OCN name: TenzoMonk
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-3
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 25C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2768515
> 
> Tools
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Results:
> Before
> 
> 
> 
> After
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't feel comfortable going past 90c before. So we'll see how far we can go


Congrats on the sucess!! Thanks for the video! I'm sure that will help people out. Welcome!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Yus. Looks like I'll be keeping it to 1.2-1.25.


I found that 3770k's imc even with stock vccio and vccsa can max most sticks on air, or get to the max of the imc without much tinkering with those voltages. Also, I degraded my first 3770k's imc with vccio and vccsa over 1.3v on air. Could boot at 2400mhz first, then couldn't pass 2200mhz. Stick to 1.2v or lower unless you get a pot and dice/ln2. (-50c or lower)
Shame you don't have a q-led display to see the code 23 or 55 to determine your imc's and ram sticks' capabilities.
I found vttddr at 0.8-0.850 to be useful for higher validations, it helped me get to 2600mhz, when I was maxing out at 2450mhz previously. Also, timing combinations make a BIG BIG difference.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TenzoMonk*
> 
> I'd be honored to join!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Used the hammer/wood/vice method... SUPER EASY... 25c drop in temps (using CLU)! (Never used IBT before the delid... and temps w/HWM and OHWM were same in previous tests). Pics/Video below!
> 
> Let me know if there is anything else needed!
> 
> OCN name: TenzoMonk
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-3
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 25C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2768515
> 
> Tools
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Results:
> Before
> 
> 
> 
> After
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't feel comfortable going past 90c before. So we'll see how far we can go


...well done - and very nice info presentation / useful for others - Thanks


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I want to sneak in your house and switch my WF3 for yours, rofl, it's not fair!!!


...help ! burglars ! someone call the police









...I do live in a high-security tower w/24 hr concierge/security and more video surveillance cameras you can shake a stick(g1) at







- it might be easier for you just to go to a store / online and buy a GB WF3 OC ?!

While mine is speedy, the bios replacement I chose (and had help getting written) actually slows it a bit - but matches it with the fastest Asus cards I run, for synchro, smooth 4x SLI


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...help ! burglars ! someone call the police
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I do live in a high-security tower w/24 hr concierge/security and more video surveillance cameras you can shake a stick(g1) at
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - it might be easier for you just to go to a store / online and buy a GB WF3 OC ?!
> 
> While mine is speedy, the bios replacement I chose (and had help getting written) actually slows it a bit - but matches it with the fastest Asus cards I run, for synchro, smooth 4x SLI


A WF3 that does the numbers you reported are rare. I could buy 10 of them and not get one like that, unfortunately. I do love this card though, I plan on using the air cooler until next generation and I have yet to see it break 60C on full load.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like my 6950...








I tried a few games and it maxes most out (Tera, SWTOR, Far Cry 1...)Sadly my cpu bottleneck is obnoxious (p4 631 at stock)
I met an Asus rep locally, I'll see if he can get my board repaired in Buenos Aires, instead of going through the ordeal of shipping it to Texas and back here for an rma.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> A WF3 that does the numbers you reported are rare. I could buy 10 of them and not get one like that, unfortunately. I do love this card though, I plan on using the air cooler until next generation and I have yet to see it break 60C on full load.


...I might be used more to HWBot numbers, but single 670ies running an actual mid-1300s is not that unusual...though high-1200s is more likely with two or more cards --- I might pick up a second GB WF3 OC as I am currently re-configuring 4 of the 8 machines in my Home Office (many of them work related)...I better don't post any numbers on the 2nd one if it is as fast as the first


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm currently running 4.8Ghz and I got my 7950's up to 1175/1600 with a score of 3852 in Valley Extreme HD preset. My best score yet. Damn dual-x can't get past that core clock though. My TFIII can run 1225/1625 as a single card. Going to start inscreasing the clock speed on the ivy tonight. Didn't have much time to do that this morning. Luckily for me it is going to be nice and chilly out tonight so I'm going to find a stable voltage for 4.9Ghz. Tried overclocking my crappy corsair vengeance DDR3 1600 to 1866 with 9, 10, 9, 27, 1N, but had no luck. I had a feeling I wouldn't be able to OC the RAM. Lost my job recently so it's going to be a little bit before I can upgrade anything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Damn random company downsizes.


...hope things work out on the job front ! I asked about the CPU speed as Valley etc react nicely to an increase in CPU speed (and also faster memory for later)...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I might be used more to HWBot numbers, but single 670ies running an actual mid-1300s is not that unusual...though high-1200s is more likely with two or more cards --- I might pick up a second GB WF3 OC as I am currently re-configuring 4 of the 8 machines in my Home Office (many of them work related)...I better don't post any numbers on the 2nd one if it is as fast as the first


Eh it's okay. That's probably why I got mine Open Box on Newegg for $300. Someone bought it and it didn't get the 1300+ clocks they wanted so they sent it back and made up an excuse. I don't really bench or anything, for gaming on my single 1080p monitor, the 1275MHz I run is more than enough. I actually just made a custom BIOS to have it set to 1175/1750 stock with 1.16v and 120% Power Target. Runs cool and quiet and plenty of performance.


----------



## dr/owned

^^ I've found too that you really don't want to buy used parts from the current generation. I've sold 4 3770k's on ebay because they were poor overclockers, and my first set of 680's were bought used and couldn't overclock at all from reference.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm currently running 4.8Ghz and I got my 7950's up to 1175/1600 with a score of 3852 in Valley Extreme HD preset. My best score yet. Damn dual-x can't get past that core clock though. My TFIII can run 1225/1625 as a single card. Going to start inscreasing the clock speed on the ivy tonight. Didn't have much time to do that this morning. Luckily for me it is going to be nice and chilly out tonight so I'm going to find a stable voltage for 4.9Ghz. Tried overclocking my crappy corsair vengeance DDR3 1600 to 1866 with 9, 10, 9, 27, 1N, but had no luck. I had a feeling I wouldn't be able to OC the RAM. Lost my job recently so it's going to be a little bit before I can upgrade anything
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Damn random company downsizes.


Yeah with mine i can clock the core up pretty high but my memory sucks " Elpida crap" one does 1275mhz/1550 mem other 2 do 1225mhz/1500 mem

But hell 1275mhz is almost a 60% Overclock on a 7950 lol and 1225mhz is over a 50% overclock XD


----------



## lilchronic

ot question here
well i reinstalled windows to day for my new board and now my ram says 2448mhz instead of 2400mhz? why is this ? its not that i dont like it but, is this what it was always at and my old board just read 2448mhz?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ I've found too that you really don't want to buy used parts from the current generation. I've sold 4 3770k's on ebay because they were poor overclockers, and my first set of 680's were bought used and couldn't overclock at all from reference.


Yeah this is true. At the time I was having trouble with my Radeons and I sold my last 7970. I only had $300 to spend and saw that Open Box for $300 and jumped on it. I thought there might be a reason someone returned it but I figured I would take the chance for $100 off retail. If Radeon gets some even better drivers I might go back, but for now, this card is doing fine for the load I put on it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ot question here
> well i reinstalled windows to day for my new board and now my ram says 2448mhz instead of 2400mhz? why is this ? its not that i dont like it but, is this what it was always at and my old board just read 2448mhz?


Bus speed?


----------



## ivanlabrie

@Stick: wait for July, then grab a 7950.







(And Haswell







)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> @Stick: wait for July, then grab a 7950.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (And Haswell
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


What's happening in July? Aside from me finishing a few jobs and might actually have some money to blow (which I doubt you would have known without me telling you)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bus speed?


ohh ok thats what i did lol


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What's happening in July? Aside from me finishing a few jobs and might actually have some money to blow (which I doubt you would have known without me telling you)


That exactly...lol
AMD is fixing that runt frame dilemma, andHaswell will be out by then. You can sell that pos gpu of yours and grab a 7950 which will repay nicely.


----------



## dr/owned

A 7950 only makes $4 a day for itself at the current rates after fees and electricity, which is pretty yawn-worthy.

I'll pay $4 a day for proper frame metering and better drivers with Nvidia.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That exactly...lol
> AMD is fixing that runt frame dilemma, andHaswell will be out by then. You can sell that pos gpu of yours and grab a 7950 which will repay nicely.


runt frame dilemma?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> A 7950 only makes $4 a day for itself at the current rates after fees and electricity, which is pretty yawn-worthy.
> 
> I'll pay $4 a day for proper frame metering and better drivers with Nvidia.


?

Coins per 24h at these conditions 0.0393
Power cost per 24h 0.48 USD
Revenue per day 6.26 USD
Less power costs 5.78 USD
System efficiency 3.00 MH/s/W
Mining Factor 100 at the end of the time frame 1.00 USD/[email protected]/s
Average Mining Factor 100 1.02 USD/[email protected]/s
Power cost per time frame 14.61 USD
Revenue per time frame 186.61 USD
Less power costs *172.00 USD* <-- monthly

Then the prices go up? Nvidia is fail with out compute.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> That exactly...lol
> AMD is fixing that runt frame dilemma, andHaswell will be out by then. You can sell that pos gpu of yours and grab a 7950 which will repay nicely.
> 
> 
> 
> runt frame dilemma?
Click to expand...

In a sentence, my understanding: crossfire is broken and AMD has a substantial number of broken or delayed frames that they still count towards overall framerate.

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/Frame-Rating-Dissected-Full-Details-Capture-based-Graphics-Performance-Tes-12


----------



## Hokies83

Runt frames are Nvidia Fan bois weapons.. when a good 75% of Amd users to not notice or suffer from it.

I have Tri Fire. and my stuff runs better now then it did on Nvidia. and makes me money LoL..

I do not see any reason to buy an Nvidia Gpu.. if 2 of mine were not free.. i prolly would not have made the mistake...


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> A 7950 only makes $4 a day for itself at the current rates after fees and electricity, which is pretty yawn-worthy.
> 
> I'll pay $4 a day for proper frame metering and better drivers with Nvidia.
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> 
> Coins per 24h at these conditions 0.0393
> Power cost per 24h 0.48 USD
> Revenue per day 6.26 USD
> Less power costs 5.78 USD
> System efficiency 3.00 MH/s/W
> Mining Factor 100 at the end of the time frame 1.00 USD/[email protected]/s
> Average Mining Factor 100 1.02 USD/[email protected]/s
> Power cost per time frame 14.61 USD
> Revenue per time frame 186.61 USD
> Less power costs *172.00 USD* <-- monthly
> 
> Then the prices go up? Nvidia is fail with out compute.
Click to expand...

.0393 coins is only worth $3.54 at current rates (around $90:1), not $6.26. The market has crashed so badly that I assume your calculator is using a 3 day average or something that makes the price look a lot better than it is.


----------



## lilchronic

my 670's own 7950


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my 670's own 7950


No they dont dude why do u keep saying that LOL i hope u do not believe that cause 7950s Crush 680s LOL so i donno where that leaves your 670s.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> .0393 coins is only worth $3.54 at current rates (around $90:1), not $6.26. The market has crashed so badly that I assume your calculator is using a 3 day average or something that makes the price look a lot better than it is.


You must not watch the market enough nor understand it..

It keeps jumpinng from 100 Usd to 150 USD.....

And will go up again.. after the panic is over...

You can hold on to coins till then??? I have 3 coins im holding onto right now..


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my 670's own 7950
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No they dont dude why do u keep saying that LOL i hope u do not believe that cause 7950s Crush 680s LOL so i donno where that leaves your 670s.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> .0393 coins is only worth $3.54 at current rates (around $90:1), not $6.26. The market has crashed so badly that I assume your calculator is using a 3 day average or something that makes the price look a lot better than it is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You must not watch the market enough nor understand it..
> 
> It keeps jumpinng from 100 Usd to 150 USD.....
> 
> And will go up again.. after the panic is over...
> 
> You can hold on to coins till then??? I have 3 coins im holding onto right now..
Click to expand...

I've been watching the livefeed of current trades from the major markets. None of the top 3 exchanges have reported a high in the last 24 hours greater than 130:1. Prices also don't "jump" on exchanges when it's a bid-ask process with fluid volume. Stop making crap up.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yup, Hokies is spot on...Crush is a kinda violent term, but 7950's have more raw power than 680s, specially after oc. Each mhz increases performance more than Nvidia cards do too, and the memory bandwidth and ROP's are stronger.
To each their own, I prefer AMD, you prefer Nvidia, it's ok. Monopolies aren't good, so better yet.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I've been watching the livefeed of current trades from the major markets. None of the top 3 exchanges have reported a high in the last 24 hours greater than 130:1. Prices also don't "jump" on exchanges when it's a bid-ask process with fluid volume. Stop making crap up.


Damn we got a tard...

I watch the markets ALL DAY EVERY DAY AND HAVE BEEN Doing so for months dont fan boi noob the thread up with crap.

I watched it shoot up from 50$ to 150 $ in 8 hrs.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yup, Hokies is spot on...Crush is a kinda violent term, but 7950's have more raw power than 680s, specially after oc. Each mhz increases performance more than Nvidia cards do too, and the memory bandwidth and ROP's are stronger.
> To each their own, I prefer AMD, you prefer Nvidia, it's ok. Monopolies aren't good, so better yet.


I perfer Nvidia... Just they screwed us over with Kepler.

Even a Nvidia fan boi has to take a look at it.. why buy this gpu.. if this much cheaper gpu can not only out perform it but pay for it's self .. and pay me at the same time.

Said fan boi would have to be stupid yes?


----------



## dr/owned

Someone's just sad they're sitting on worthless coins, which is what they are until you sell them. $3.50 - electricity - exchange fees - taxes and you've made probably all of $3 a day. Don't go spending it all it one place.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 
> 
> Someone's just sad they're sitting on worthless coins, which is what they are until you sell them. $3.50 - electricity - exchange fees - taxes and you've made probably all of $3 a day. Don't go spending it all it one place.


My gpus make 22$ a day. and ive sold 1/10th for almost 40$

LoL you do not know jack bro... MARKET GOES UP... IT GOES DOWN IT GOES UP AGAIN

HOLD ONTO THEM WHILE IT IS DOWN *SELL WHEN IT IS UP.*

Unless u are a fan Boi and want to try and make it look like it sucks Cough cough.

Not my fault your Nvidia card can only fold lol ill thank you if i get cancer one day!


----------



## lilchronic

just thought id share with everyone my 17 year old dog. got her for christmas when i was 8 years old. brought great times and will leave with great memory's







. monday she will be put to sleep.


----------



## lilchronic

my 670's







7950's lol
i know hokies i just like to think that


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just thought id share with everyone my 17 year old dog. got her for christmas when i was 8 years old. brought great times and will leave with great memory's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . monday she will be put to sleep.


Sad moment

I had a dog when i was like 4.. he lived 19 years... i still think about him.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sad moment
> 
> I had a dog when i was like 4.. he lived 19 years... i still think about him.


sad moment for sure,
i like to think about the good old days bringing her to the beach and all the girls want to come talk to me. or should i say they want to come see my dog


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my 670's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 7950's lol
> i know hokies i just like to think that


Hokie just gets PB and jelly because he has such a weak rig


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Sad moment
> 
> I had a dog when i was like 4.. he lived 19 years... i still think about him.
> 
> 
> 
> sad moment for sure,
> i like to think about the good old days bringing her to the beach and all the girls want to come talk to me. or should i say come see my dog
Click to expand...

Doesn't matter had sex









(



 in case you don't know the reference)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Doesn't matter had sex
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (
> 
> 
> 
> in case you don't know the reference)


oh i know lol
best 30 seconds of my life


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my 670's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 7950's lol
> i know hokies i just like to think that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hokie just gets PB and jelly because he has such a weak rig
Click to expand...

Or that before the 8000 series comes out, ASIC miners are going to go Roman-empire on the ecosystem: control and conquer. I bet he cried when AMD said a refresh was getting pushed back into 2014


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TenzoMonk*
> 
> I'd be honored to join!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Used the hammer/wood/vice method... SUPER EASY... 25c drop in temps (using CLU)! (Never used IBT before the delid... and temps w/HWM and OHWM were same in previous tests). Pics/Video below!
> 
> Let me know if there is anything else needed!
> 
> OCN name: TenzoMonk
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-3
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 25C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2768515
> 
> Tools
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Results:
> Before
> 
> 
> 
> After
> 
> 
> 
> Didn't feel comfortable going past 90c before. So we'll see how far we can go


You're In!







I shall be using your video for the front page as well!







So slap your sig on baby!


----------



## lilchronic

quick question
since i can only run single channel on my old 3570k what kinda of ram should i get . would i still be able to run two sticks of ram in the B1 and B2 slots?
just not dual channel?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> quick question
> since i can only run single channel on my old 3570k what kinda of ram should i get . would i still be able to run two sticks of ram in the B1 and B2 slots?
> just not dual channel?


I'd try to run two sticks before you buy a kit. Might be better off just getting a single stick of 8GB if you can't use more than one DIMM, dual channel or single channel you might still be limited to one stick so check it out first.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Or that before the 8000 series comes out, ASIC miners are going to go Roman-empire on the ecosystem: control and conquer. I bet he cried when AMD said a refresh was getting pushed back into 2014


You have no clue to whom u r talking to?

























Item Sku Qty 2 Subtotal
5 GH/s Bitcoin Miner BF0005G 2 $548.00
Subtotal $548.00
Shipping & Handling $14.00
Grand Total $562.00


----------



## lilchronic

my 670's own !


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my 670's own !


You can thank my 590s for locked voltage those thinks fried with any kind of overclocking...

However u can thank Nvidia for removing compute and giving u a weak Memory Bus.


----------



## TX2000

Yesterday my powersupply decided to start whistling and today if i use my videocard it auto shutdown.. Time to get a new one. My x3 ultra 1000w served me well. RIP


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You have no clue to whom u r talking to?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Item Sku Qty 2 Subtotal
> 5 GH/s Bitcoin Miner BF0005G 2 $548.00
> Subtotal $548.00
> Shipping & Handling $14.00
> Grand Total $562.00


I've never seen such a collaboration of weak systems in my life!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I've never seen such a collaboration of weak systems in my life!


LoL there was 6 diffrent processors in those machines 2 being Amd 4 being Intel. and 8 years of Nvidia Gpus









Tnt 2
8400 gs
Had Msi 8600 GTS to but no pics.
9600 gt
260
275
470s
590s
680s
@[email protected]

Athlon x2 6400
1055T

Pent 4 with HT
i5 750
i7 930
i7 3770k

I do not have any pics of my Amd duron / Thunderbird pent 2-3 systems XD

The 400Mhz Duron was the first system i build myself...
it was 1996 or 1997 do not remember.


----------



## TenzoMonk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I shall be using your video for the front page as well!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So slap your sig on baby!


I feel honored! DONE!

And thanks!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL there was 6 diffrent processors in those machines 2 being Amd 4 being Intel. and 8 years of Nvidia Gpus
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tnt 2
> 8400 gs
> Had Msi 8600 GTS to but no pics.
> 9600 gt
> 260
> 275
> 470s
> 590s
> 680s
> @[email protected]
> 
> Athlon x2 6400
> 1055T
> 
> Pent 4 with HT
> i5 750
> i7 930
> i7 3770k
> 
> I do not have any pics of my Amd duron / Thunderbird pent 2-3 systems XD
> 
> The 400Mhz Duron was the first system i build myself...
> it was 1996 or 1997 do not remember.


lol, I was just fuxin with you anyway man


----------



## TX2000

Thanks but i am on my way to get a new one


----------



## Hokies83

Lol my cpu is bottlenecking bio shock inf lol.

I get same fps on max settings as I do lowest settings lol

115 = 117


----------



## TX2000

What you think?


----------



## TX2000

Woops http://www.coolermaster.com/product.php?product_id=6663


----------



## ScottAllyn

w00t! I delidded my i7-3770K today with a razor, despite jabbing a box cutter blade into my thumb last night while cutting gaskets for my radiators.











The system's not together yet, so I don't have any numbers.


----------



## Arm3nian

I see a lot of people in here with the asrock extreme 4 motherboard, how is it? Maybe ud3h for an alternative? Need advice for a build for a friend.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I see a lot of people in here with the asrock extreme 4 motherboard, how is it? Maybe ud3h for an alternative? Need advice for a build for a friend.


ASRock ext4 is great if you can get one on the combo deal at microcenter. Just be aware that it does not report voltage correctly, as much as .100 off. If you are only going for a mild overclock its not an issue, but if you ware going for broke, get a DMM for voltage monitoring. Also the "ASMedia" SATA3 slots are tied to the eSATA, and cant be used at the same time as the eSATA. Not a big deal because it still gives you a ton of options for extra SATA slots. If I were to rebuild my current system from scratch I would have gone with the Giga because of the Hackintosh compatibility, and I don't use enough of the SATA ports to take advantage of the "ASMedia" ports.

But if you can get to a microcenter and cant get the giga....the ASR board is a solid board with some great features, but is not without flaw.

That's my story and im sticking to it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

The Extreme 4 is a kinda low budget board. The D3h, UD3h or Extreme 6 would be better. I'd stick to GB for low price z77 though.
Longer warranty, better build quality and better power delivery, and features.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I see a lot of people in here with the asrock extreme 4 motherboard, how is it? Maybe ud3h for an alternative? Need advice for a build for a friend.


The UD3H is the Best cheap board.


----------



## stickg1

The UD3H is a great board. I would probably trade my Extreme6 for one if given the opportunity.

Although since I've gone with the black and lime green theme on my build that Sniper would be pretty tits...


----------



## Arm3nian

4-0 favoring GB... I guess the choice is obvious.


----------



## lilchronic

the extreme 4 is fine i ran 5 ghz on one. its just a cheap board with crappy VRM runs hot!


----------



## jprovido

any new delidding methods since the last time I was here? I'm thinking of trading my i5 3570k+cash for a 3770k from a friend. I'm not really fond of using the razor blade again ( I damaged the cpu a bit but fortunately it's working just fine)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The UD3H is a great board. I would probably trade my Extreme6 for one if given the opportunity.
> 
> Although since I've gone with the black and lime green theme on my build that Sniper would be pretty tits...


Heh if i upgrade ill PM u on the G1 Sniper 3.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> any new delidding methods since the last time I was here? I'm thinking of trading my i5 3570k+cash for a 3770k from a friend. I'm not really fond of using the razor blade again ( I damaged the cpu a bit but fortunately it's working just fine)


Vise hammer and block of wood method.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> In a sentence, my understanding: crossfire is broken and AMD has a substantial number of broken or delayed frames that they still count towards overall framerate.
> 
> http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/Frame-Rating-Dissected-Full-Details-Capture-based-Graphics-Performance-Tes-12


I have had *ZERO* problems with crossfire. I see no reason to pay that ridiculous price for Nvidia products. I am not a fanboi of anything, but I think the price is way out of wack. I like Nvidia, but that just turns me away. I see no reason to get the almighty TItan when I can just keep stacking 7950's!!!


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Vise hammer and block of wood method.


lmao that's crazy. ima look up a thread about this

edit

The Ud3h is a great board. it gets my i5 3570k to 5ghz without a sweat.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> lmao that's crazy. ima look up a thread about this
> 
> edit
> 
> The Ud3h is a great board. it gets my i5 3570k to 5ghz without a sweat.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Heh if i upgrade ill PM u on the G1 Sniper 3.


Get something red and black to match your gear and send me the lime green hotness!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I have had *ZERO* problems with crossfire. I see no reason to pay that ridiculous price for Nvidia products. I am not a fanboi of anything, but I think the price is way out of wack. I like Nvidia, but that just turns me away. I see no reason to get the almighty TItan when I can just keep stacking 7950's!!!


Then you need to get your eyes checked player! I got 20/15 and that frame latency is a biatch!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Then you need to get your eyes checked player! I got 20/15 and that frame latency is a biatch!


Both sli and crossfire have microstutter. That is why people opt for 1 or 3 gpus for the best gaming experience. Although in some games crossfire stuters more and in others sli.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Then you need to get your eyes checked player! I got 20/15 and that frame latency is a biatch!


You did not take the time to fix it.

I notice it in some games then i problem solve and fix the issue.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Then you need to get your eyes checked player! I got 20/15 and that frame latency is a biatch!


Well I'm perfectly happy with it so that is all I care about. The only game that has problems is Far Cry 3, but I played that on the ps3 before I got my PC so I didn't really feel the need to play it through again. I must only be able to see 30 FPS because my buttery smooth Crysis 3 doesn't bother me at all.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Both sli and crossfire have microstutter. That is why people opt for 1 or 3 gpus for the best gaming experience. Although in some games crossfire stuters more and in others sli.


I was having trouble with single card 7950 and 7970. I prefer my 670 now. I got higher benchmark scores with my Radeons but the gameplay of the GTX is superior. But we've beat this topic to death. This is just my opinion, and until I see a fix for the Radeons, I'm on the green team.


----------



## tambok2012

ANY rich guys here i just want to have an answer to the Hammer,Wood and Vice technique

DOES IT REALLY WORK?

can you try it on your chip







and can you make a video from the moment you delid it and put it in your mobo and put it on


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tambok2012*
> 
> ANY rich guys here i just want to have an answer to the Hammer,Wood and Vice
> 
> DOES IT REALLY WORK?
> 
> can you try it on your chip


Many people have tried it already. I haven't heard of anyone failing yet. Knock on wood.... with a hammer...... and delid your chip


----------



## SDBolts619

I'm not rich, but I tried it and it works great. Am I disqualified because I'm not rich?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was having trouble with single card 7950 and 7970. I prefer my 670 now. I got higher benchmark scores with my Radeons but the gameplay of the GTX is superior. But we've beat this topic to death. This is just my opinion, and until I see a fix for the Radeons, I'm on the green team.


Maybe I'm just lucky because I truly do not have any problems with the games I play. Bioshock infinite, Crysis 3, Battlefield 3, metro 2033


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Maybe I'm just lucky because I truly do not have any problems with the games I play. Bioshock infinite, Crysis 3, Battlefield 3, metro 2033


I had major issues with Bishock Inf...

But from reading up seems Nvidia has more issues with Bioshock then the Hd7000 does...

I had to turn off my killer lan controller and go into the game Config and change the pool to 1024..


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I had major issues with Bishock Inf...
> 
> But from reading up seems Nvidia has more issues with Bioshock then the Hd7000 does...
> 
> I had to turn off my killer lan controller and go into the game Config and change the pool to 1024..


I'm wondering if something is wrong with my Bioshock or if it's just not that demanding. I play on the Ultra preset and I'm maxed at 60FPS with 25-70% GPU usage at all times. Granted I'm only on one 1080p monitor but I thought the game would need some more ass than a single 670 for Ultra.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm wondering if something is wrong with my Bioshock or if it's just not that demanding. I play on the Ultra preset and I'm maxed at 60FPS with 25-70% GPU usage at all times. Granted I'm only on one 1080p monitor but I thought the game would need some more ass than a single 670 for Ultra.


I play it on ultra at 120FPS with that alternate setting with 20% gpu use.

it does not like to stay pegged at 120-fps tho.. stays 115= 117 fps.. i turned off Fps lock and it shot up to over 250fps lol.

It is a Cpu demanding game. FX will suffer.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was having trouble with single card 7950 and 7970. I prefer my 670 now. I got higher benchmark scores with my Radeons but the gameplay of the GTX is superior. But we've beat this topic to death. This is just my opinion, and until I see a fix for the Radeons, I'm on the green team.


Well then it was probably something other than microstutter, because by definition you can't get microstuter with a single gpu, the frames are rendered on 1 gpu so there is no sync issue.

And yeah I know what you're talking about with bioshock inf, every time I go into a new area or turn around I get stutter, I thought it was my gpu memory clock so I raised it a bit, no difference. Mind you I run the game at 60fps so I'm fairly sure it is the game's fault, not hardware.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well then it was probably something other than microstutter, because by definition you can't get microstuter with a single gpu, the frames are rendered on 1 gpu so there is no sync issue.
> 
> And yeah I know what you're talking about with bioshock inf, every time I go into a new area or turn around I get stutter, I thought it was my gpu memory clock so I raised it a bit, no difference. Mind you I run the game at 60fps so I'm fairly sure it is the game's fault, not hardware.


Go into th e game engine config and change the pool from 114 to 512.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Well then it was probably something other than microstutter, because by definition you can't get microstuter with a single gpu, the frames are rendered on 1 gpu so there is no sync issue.
> 
> And yeah I know what you're talking about with bioshock inf, every time I go into a new area or turn around I get stutter, I thought it was my gpu memory clock so I raised it a bit, no difference. Mind you I run the game at 60fps so I'm fairly sure it is the game's fault, not hardware.


My issue with the radeons was mostly texture flickering, screen tearing even with v-sync enabled, and frame latency.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My issue with the radeons was mostly texture flickering, screen tearing even with v-sync enabled, and frame latency.


That's one thing better on these amds.. my Nvidia always had flickering / screen tearing / texture flickering.. with these amds they do not...

First time with out any of that in years lol.

My first 2 7970s i had big issues with tho.. but these 7950s none.


----------



## stickg1

Where's Ivan? I just ordered 4x2GB PSC chips, mostly because I wanted all slots full and all to match. They aren't anything too crazy. G.Skill ECO's come stock at 1600MHz 7-8-7-24 1.35v

If I can get them to run the same speed as my Crucial Ballistic Tactical LP's I will be more than happy. Plus I'm about to switch out this AM2+ DDR2 board that I use with my 1055t for a decent AM3 board so I need to have a spare kit of DDR3.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well I'm perfectly happy with it so that is all I care about. The only game that has problems is Far Cry 3, but I played that on the ps3 before I got my PC so I didn't really feel the need to play it through again. I must only be able to see 30 FPS because my buttery smooth Crysis 3 doesn't bother me at all.


lol i only play the two games on ps3, socom and mortal kombat







thats all i need


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol i only play the two games on ps3, socom and mortal kombat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thats all i need


my ps3 is gathering dust lol. Haven't used it since I built my PC.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where's Ivan? I just ordered 4x2GB PSC chips, mostly because I wanted all slots full and all to match. They aren't anything too crazy. G.Skill ECO's come stock at 1600MHz 7-8-7-24 1.35v
> 
> If I can get them to run the same speed as my Crucial Ballistic Tactical LP's I will be more than happy. Plus I'm about to switch out this AM2+ DDR2 board that I use with my 1055t for a decent AM3 board so I need to have a spare kit of DDR3.


Here I am bud...I was busy, feasting on lotsa soy burgers, doritos, cheddar, fries, hot sauce and coca cola.








Those are ok psc sticks, nothing too brilliant. They may do 2200mhz cl8-11-8-27-1t in a 4x2gb config with 1.7v
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> my ps3 is gathering dust lol. Haven't used it since I built my PC.


I may buy one for 50 bucks or so...lol
My gf always wanted one.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I see a lot of people in here with the asrock extreme 4 motherboard, how is it? Maybe ud3h for an alternative? Need advice for a build for a friend.


Build quality wise, the UD3h is far more superior than the Extreme4. It even holds a few world records under its name. E4 is great for the features it provides and of course, for its price. But it wouldn't be the best motherboard for extreme overclocking.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> my ps3 is gathering dust lol. Haven't used it since I built my PC.


If I may ask, how does it feel for jumping onto the PC platform from a console?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was busy, feasting on lotsa soy burgers, doritos, cheddar, fries, hot sauce and coca cola.


Damn youuuuuu!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now I have to eat. You awoken my appetite with a vengeance.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> If I may ask, how does it feel for jumping onto the PC platform from a console?












^That










I watched a video of Skyrim with mods on youtube and it RUINED the console for me. I couldn't even play the damn thing anymore. So I built a PC and haven't looked back. If you told me that you were having fun benching last night a couple months ago I would have looked at you like you were a nut and asked you what "benching" was. Now I'm into everything. Modding, water cooling, overclocking, benching, mining, etc. You name it. I'm looking into some type of computer class actually. I love this stuff that much that I would like to make a career out of it.


----------



## lilchronic

if they had socom 1 and 2 for the ps3 i would not need any other game lol









anyway
my new oc with my new board







needs further testing but looks good so far


5.2 is a pain in the ass i need like 1.5v and i keep getting a bsod 0x124


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> if they had socom 1 and 2 for the ps3 i would not need any other game lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyway
> my new oc with my new board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> needs further testing but looks good so far
> 
> 
> 5.2 is a pain in the ass i need like 1.5v and i keep getting a bsod 0x124


Damn dude you have a nice chip. I joined the 5ghz club today, but I still have a little work to do before I can get it stable. Actually, I don't think I will get it stable unless I feed my chip 1.6v







I guess I will have to stick with 4.9Ghz. So close!!


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^That
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I watched a video of Skyrim with mods on youtube and it RUINED the console for me. I couldn't even play the damn thing anymore. So I built a PC and haven't looked back. If you told me that you were having fun benching last night a couple months ago I would have looked at you like you were a nut and asked you what "benching" was. Now I'm into everything. Modding, water cooling, overclocking, benching, mining, etc. You name it. I'm looking into some type of computer class actually. I love this stuff that much that I would like to make a career out of it.


Unique and it sounds good man.
We need more X-console guys to see what you have!


----------



## VonDutch

just had to share this one with you guys... funny


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Damn youuuuuu!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Now I have to eat. You awoken my appetite with a vengeance.


How high is your vengeance clocked







, mine is at 2133


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How high is your vengeance clocked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , mine is at 2133


Vengeance at 2133?! You must have some seriously slack timings


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> if they had socom 1 and 2 for the ps3 i would not need any other game lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyway
> my new oc with my new board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> needs further testing but looks good so far
> 
> 
> 5.2 is a pain in the ass i need like 1.5v and i keep getting a bsod 0x124


I tried that....I can boot it and run super pi at 1.488(DMM), but I cant for the life of me keep the temps down with this crappy zalman...what type of temperatures are you seeing with the H100i? For me I get two to three minutes into prime before I cross the 95C mark and I shut it down.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> How high is your vengeance clocked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , mine is at 2133


I haven't been able to find a stable clock. Do you have the vengeance 1600? What are your overclock settings? Timings, command rate, latency, voltage, etc. I tried 9, 10, 9, 27 1N at 1.65v for 1866 and it did not go well.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I tried that....I can boot it and run super pi at 1.488(DMM), but I cant for the life of me keep the temps down with this crappy zalman...what type of temperatures are you seeing with the H100i? For me I get two to three minutes into prime before I cross the 95C mark and I shut it down.


low 70's c


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I game more on my Xbox, despite having a pc that runs bf3 on ultra


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I haven't been able to find a stable clock. Do you have the vengeance 1600? What are your overclock settings? Timings, command rate, latency, voltage, etc. I tried 9, 10, 9, 27 1N at 1.65v for 1866 and it did not go well.


When I had the Vengeance 1600, the best OC I could do was tweak a couple secondaries and drop the command rate to 1t from 2t. It typically does not OC well.

Ugh, and these sticks aren't budging from 2666. I can't even get 1T at 2666 without infinite boot loops. I think it's the mobo though. Because if I overvolt the sticks to 1.7V and drop them to 2400 10-12-12-31 (to emulate the gskill set of Hynix) and go for 1T it still goes into infinite boot loop. Actually, they will blue screen with CL10 at 2400 but are rock solid with CL11 at 2666, which is just weird as heck.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I game more on my Xbox, despite having a pc that runs bf3 on ultra


How can u stand the Horrid grafs the fake 1080i and the choppy game play at sub 30fps?

You know the Xbox 360 controller will work on pc right?


----------



## KuuFA

Soooo I am going to be moving out of my Fractal arc midi.....

But I am not sure what to move into?

I have a Cosmos S sitting in my closet.

I was looking at getting either a

SM8

or a 900d not really sure what to get/do?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> When I had the Vengeance 1600, the best OC I could do was tweak a couple secondaries and drop the command rate to 1t from 2t. It typically does not OC well.
> 
> Ugh, and these sticks aren't budging from 2666. I can't even get 1T at 2666 without infinite boot loops. I think it's the mobo though. Because if I overvolt the sticks to 1.7V and drop them to 2400 10-12-12-31 (to emulate the gskill set of Hynix) and go for 1T it still goes into infinite boot loop. Actually, they will blue screen with CL10 at 2400 but are rock solid with CL11 at 2666, which is just weird as heck.


2666 sound reaaaaal nice right about now. Going to be buying some G.Skill Trident X 2400 for my next upgrade.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How can u stand the Horrid grafs the fake 1080i and the choppy game play at sub 30fps?
> 
> You know the Xbox 360 controller will work on pc right?


oh man it looks sooo bad on the ps3. i tried to play it and it was like foggy lol it was terrible
you can also use the ps3 controller for games if u want and it can be wireless if you have bluetooth


----------



## kzim9

Well I figure I should tell everyone that I had to redo my (die) lastnight. I went to start to fold and temps shot thru the roof!!! 105'C!!!!

I first thought it may be that my H80 bit the bullet, but after remembering I had some Liqiud Pro waiting to be installed I would try that first.

I used MX4 on both TIM surfaces when I did the intail Delid, and it seem to work well. @ 4.6 I was hovering around 70'C.

The spreads looked very good on both surfaces when I took them apart, so I cleaned them up and use Pro on the die and MX4 on the sink.

What a difference!!! I tested at 4.6 for 12hrs prime and max temp was 63'C. Major imporvement!

I suggest not to use MX4 on the die for anyone new to this. CoolLabs all the way!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 2666 sound reaaaaal nice right about now. Going to be buying some G.Skill Trident X 2400 for my next upgrade.


ive got the trident x 2400mhz 10-12-12-31 2n @1.65v and i got 2666mhz 11-13-13-35 @ 1.75v but i keep getting bsod's and it will just freez sometimes
bsod 0xD1
im not sure if its safe to go higher then 1.75v?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kzim9*
> 
> Well I figure I should tell everyone that I had to redo my (die) lastnight. I went to start to fold and temps shot thru the roof!!! 105'C!!!!
> 
> I first thought it may be that my H80 bit the bullet, but after remembering I had some Liqiud Pro waiting to be installed I would try that first.
> 
> I used MX4 on both TIM surfaces when I did the intail Delid, and it seem to work well. @ 4.6 I was hovering around 70'C.
> 
> The spreads looked very good on both surfaces when I took them apart, so I cleaned them up and use Pro on the die and MX4 on the sink.
> 
> What a difference!!! I tested at 4.6 for 12hrs prime and max temp was 63'C. Major imporvement!
> 
> I suggest not to use MX4 on the die for anyone new to this. CoolLabs all the way!


i try to tell people this







its pointless to delid and not use clp/clu


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Actually it isn't even 1080I, more like x700 - but it's about the gameplay and community rather than graphics.
Don't get me wrong I love bf3 on the pc...but it just isn't the same thing.
As for the controller, yeah I have it on my PC, a wired one, however EA suck in implementation of controllers for their game


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just had to share this one with you guys... funny

















- ...how times change...back in the day, we just 'played doctor'


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive got the trident x 2400mhz 10-12-12-31 2n @1.65v and i got 2666mhz 11-13-13-35 @ 1.75v but i keep getting bsod's and it will just freez sometimes
> bsod 0xD1
> im not sure if its safe to go higher then 1.75v?


I thought 2666 wasn't stable on my rig at 1.7V. Dropped to 1.65V and it's rock solid. On H2O you can maybe get away with 1.8V, but not sure if I would run that 24/7.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Soooo I am going to be moving out of my Fractal arc midi.....
> 
> But I am not sure what to move into?
> 
> I have a Cosmos S sitting in my closet.
> 
> I was looking at getting either a
> 
> SM8
> 
> or a 900d not really sure what to get/do?


...before going completely 'case-less' on two ROG set-ups, I worked with the NZXT Phantom and the CM Stryker - both very solid cases, though needed some minor mods to accept a 360/60 + 240 rad...if you're going for an extensive w-c loop, multiple GPUs and the price doesn't bother you, the 900D ("Casezilla") looks like a really nice solution....BIG with lot's of room for multiple rads...beyond that: custom solutions by firms such as Mountain Mods etc


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I thought 2666 wasn't stable on my rig at 1.7V. Dropped to 1.65V and it's rock solid. On H2O you can maybe get away with 1.8V, but not sure if I would run that 24/7.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive got the trident x 2400mhz 10-12-12-31 2n @1.65v and i got 2666mhz 11-13-13-35 @ 1.75v but i keep getting bsod's and it will just freez sometimes
> bsod 0xD1
> im not sure if its safe to go higher then 1.75v?


...TridentX 2400 should easily get to 10-10 -12-30 at stock 1. 65v - I have 48 GB of that stuff via 6x 8GB sticks, an they all meet that target though I have not tried tightening up some more yet


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Actually it isn't even 1080I, more like x700 - but it's about the gameplay and community rather than graphics.
> Don't get me wrong I love bf3 on the pc...but it just isn't the same thing.
> As for the controller, yeah I have it on my PC, a wired one, however EA suck in implementation of controllers for their game


its the BF3 hackers i hate em


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...TridentX 2400 should easily get to 10-10 -12-30 at stock 1. 65v - I have 48 GB of that stuff via 6x 8GB sticks, an they all meet that target though I have not tried tightening up some more yet


ive tried that and it works but....... need more speed captian. lol


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...before going completely 'case-less' on two ROG set-ups, I worked with the NZXT Phantom and the CM Stryker - both very solid cases, though needed some minor mods to accept a 360/60 + 240 rad...if you're going for an extensive w-c loop, multiple GPUs and the price doesn't bother you, the 900D ("Casezilla") looks like a really nice solution....BIG with lot's of room for multiple rads...beyond that: custom solutions by firms such as Mountain Mods etc


No doubt they are nice cases! the phantom doesn't really appeal to me as it has a door









The CM Stryker is kinda like my Cosmos S (which is still a super nice case btw love the aluminum)

The problem with the Cosmos S is the lack of Rad space I mean (360 + 240 is still a ton)

But I just want to have more? Like 2x480's or 2x240's and a 360?

Planning on a

CPU + 2x GPU loop (maybe even a third gpu)

I like the way the 900d looks (modern, Its price is quite appealing)

I know Case Labs is the penultimate case in which the SM8 would be right next to the 900d (Full aluminum, Totally customizable the only negative is its looks.... IMO.)


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> its the BF3 hackers i hate em


this - and how I find PC gaming is "unfair" gaming vs console gaming.
I get bashed each time I say it - but heck most people don't have both, are fanboys and/or jealous.


----------



## stickg1

My PS3 pretty much plays cartoons from Netflix for my kids. I might sell it because I have a few other media streaming options.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> just had to share this one with you guys... funny










Glad your back buddy
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive tried that and it works but....... need more speed captian. lol


I'm giveneer All she's Got!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My PS3 pretty much plays cartoons from Netflix for my kids. I might sell it because I have a few other media streaming options.


^


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Actually it isn't even 1080I, more like x700 - but it's about the gameplay and community rather than graphics.
> Don't get me wrong I love bf3 on the pc...but it just isn't the same thing.
> As for the controller, yeah I have it on my PC, a wired one, however EA suck in implementation of controllers for their game


What do you mean by unfair? I'm not bashing, I just don't know what you mean. Damn now I really want to play BF3. Agh I have to download it again. Damn fresh windows install!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive tried that and it works but....... need more speed captian. lol


...now try some BCLK bus-clocking which also ramps up your memory - you should get to 2560 MHz or so on stock timings with TridentX 2400 (.....just be careful if you go beyond 7% plus). This will also be good training for Haswell which will have a lot BCLK OC 'zones' , never mind 80x multi)


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What do you mean by unfair? I'm not bashing, I just don't know what you mean. Damn now I really want to play BF3. Agh I have to download it again. Damn fresh windows install!!!


i was just palyin and i had to quit dam hackers
ps3 and xbox dont have hackers like the pc. the hackers ruin online gaming for pc its sad


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...now try some BCLK bus-clocking which also ramps up your memory - you should get to 2560 MHz or so on stock timings with TridentX 2400 (.....just be careful if you go beyond 7% plus). This will also be good training for Haswell which will have a lot BCLK OC 'zones' , never mind 80x multi)


i tried the bclk yesterday @ 105.0 and 4.8 and it booted @ 5ghz but im not sure about bclk i never tried messing with it till yesterday


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What do you mean by unfair? I'm not bashing, I just don't know what you mean. Damn now I really want to play BF3. Agh I have to download it again. Damn fresh windows install!!!


If I have a gaming mouse I'm at an advantage over a guy with a £5 dell mouse. Simply put.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i was just palyin and i had to quit dam hackers
> ps3 and xbox dont have hackers like the pc. the hackers ruin online gaming for pc its sad


I've played over 300hrs of BF3 on the xbox - haven't seen 1 hacker.
I played under 1hr on the PC and experienced 10...

I haven't played BF3 in over 2 months - I'm just bored of it.


----------



## Coolwaters

Looks like it would be better if you freeze it with a air buster first before hitting with the wood block.
so that the adhesive is hard and brittle.

and cutting should be heated up.


----------



## chris68

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I haven't been able to find a stable clock. Do you have the vengeance 1600? What are your overclock settings? Timings, command rate, latency, voltage, etc. I tried 9, 10, 9, 27 1N at 1.65v for 1866 and it did not go well.


I have vengeance 1600 and I use 9-11-11-28 with 1.6 Volts for 1800 and it works absolutely fine super stable.
By the way I delidded my CPU before a couple of hours (used the new hammer method lol!, operation was a breeze only a couple of minutes) and test it with Intel Burn Test at maximum settings and it run perfecly cool compared with before








Now it's 68-70 C at full load and before delidding 98 C!!! A gain of almost 30 degrees.
My i7 3770K runs at 4.5 Ghz


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> In a sentence, my understanding: crossfire is broken and AMD has a substantial number of broken or delayed frames that they still count towards overall framerate.
> 
> http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/Frame-Rating-Dissected-Full-Details-Capture-based-Graphics-Performance-Tes-12


Really depends on the user, some people have the eye for this & seeing it just gets annoying, others may not notice it & not have a problem.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just thought id share with everyone my 17 year old dog. got her for christmas when i was 8 years old. brought great times and will leave with great memory's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . monday she will be put to sleep.


17 years is a ripe old age for her, it does get hard to let go.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The UD3H is the Best cheap board.


For memory overclocking fans, ud4h.
As a guy who likes playing with memory, it is hard to like this board...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I was having trouble with single card 7950 and 7970. I prefer my 670 now. I got higher benchmark scores with my Radeons but the gameplay of the GTX is superior. But we've beat this topic to death. This is just my opinion, and until I see a fix for the Radeons, I'm on the green team.


I've always liked green team, but man did they ever go downhill with drivers. I'm convinced the guy who used to write crappy drivers for AMD went over to nvidia...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Where's Ivan? I just ordered 4x2GB PSC chips, mostly because I wanted all slots full and all to match. They aren't anything too crazy. G.Skill ECO's come stock at 1600MHz 7-8-7-24 1.35v
> 
> If I can get them to run the same speed as my Crucial Ballistic Tactical LP's I will be more than happy. Plus I'm about to switch out this AM2+ DDR2 board that I use with my 1055t for a decent AM3 board so I need to have a spare kit of DDR3.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Here I am bud...I was busy, feasting on lotsa soy burgers, doritos, cheddar, fries, hot sauce and coca cola.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those are ok psc sticks, nothing too brilliant. They may do 2200mhz cl8-11-8-27-1t in a 4x2gb config with 1.7v
> I may buy one for 50 bucks or so...lol
> My gf always wanted one.


ECO can be PSC or BBSE, have to see the serial code, as well as test them. Most aren't stellar, but never know if you get lucky sticks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> My PS3 pretty much plays cartoons from Netflix for my kids. I might sell it because I have a few other media streaming options.


My ps3 has become a simple blu ray player over the last couple years.


----------



## stickg1

Yeah, I'm not expected 2400MHz+ but I will be happy with 2133MHz with reasonable timings. I paid $50 for 4x2GB sticks. Really I just wanted 4 matching DIMMs that could run similar settings to my Crucial Ballistix without breaking the bank. I think I will have that with these sticks. I should get them Wednesday or Thursday, I will report back with results!


----------



## MKHunt

Sigh. Got my Z68XP-UD4 board back from RMA today. Same board, still has the random power off issue. The heck Gigabyte?









I wish it never had problems.... but by the same token, SLi titans in PCIE2.0 x8 would probably be kinda rough. The problem now is that this board and my old 590 are going to my younger brother (he got a 2600k, this board, and 590 for <$600 what a lucky guy) but I can't feel good about it if the board is still broken.


----------



## stickg1

While we're on the topic, if any of the regulars want to hit me on steam I have the same steam name as my OCN username.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Sigh. Got my Z68XP-UD4 board back from RMA today. Same board, still has the random power off issue. The heck Gigabyte?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish it never had problems.... but by the same token, SLi titans in PCIE2.0 x8 would probably be kinda rough. The problem now is that this board and my old 590 are going to my younger brother (he got a 2600k, this board, and 590 for <$600 what a lucky guy) but I can't feel good about it if the board is still broken.


...it just randomly powers off (whether idle or load) with no apparent rhyme or reason... ?


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> While we're on the topic, if any of the regulars want to hit me on steam I have the same steam name as my OCN username.


why would I want to add you on Steam.?


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...it just randomly powers off (whether idle or load) with no apparent rhyme or reason... ?


Yup, exactly that. No consistencies, and its not even a regular thing. It can happen multiple times in an hour or not happen for up to a week.

ETA: I tried it in a different case, same problem. New video card, same problem. New RAM, same problem. 3770k instead of 2600k, same problem. New AX850, same problem. Switched mobos, no more problems.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> why would I want to add you on Steam.?


LOL, get out the way son!! I had you on steam for too long, might have to drop you.


----------



## malmental

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> why would I want to add you on Steam.?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, get out the way son!! I had you on steam for too long, might have to drop you.
Click to expand...

I'm the only one that listens to you..


----------



## Arm3nian

More amd fanbois say Intel sucks than intel users say amd sucks... btw amd sucks


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> ... I tried it in a different case, same problem. New video card, same problem. New RAM, same problem. 3770k instead of 2600k, same problem. New AX850, same problem. Switched mobos, no more problems.


...yup - that pretty much settles it for good...









almost sounds like a 'cold solder' somewhere on that Gigabyte


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> More amd fanbois say Intel sucks than intel users say amd sucks... btw amd sucks


do you want to go sit in the corner also


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yup - that pretty much settles it for good...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> almost sounds like a 'cold solder' somewhere on that Gigabyte


I'd welcome a cold joint since it's an easy fix, but it didn't exhibit the problem over its entire lifetime. Only since about August 2012.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yup - that pretty much settles it for good...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> almost sounds like a 'cold solder' somewhere on that Gigabyte


i heard before someone put the dead mobo in the oven and it worked again after they baked it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I'd welcome a cold joint since it's an easy fix, but it didn't exhibit the problem over its entire lifetime. Only since about August 2012.


...well - give it to your brother cheap (as you suggested), obviously let him know to back up his stuff regularly and : ...you enjoy the Asus...besides, as you say, with two Titans PCIe3 full speed is nice


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i heard before someone put the dead mobo in the oven and it worked again after they baked it


...ahem. what temp settings ?


----------



## KuuFA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...ahem. what temp settings ?


Well first you have to remove all the plastic on the board. I.E. the pci-e slots and everything plastic.

and i think the temp is like 250f?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malmental*
> 
> I'm the only one that listens to you..


lol true


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> More amd fanbois say Intel sucks than intel users say amd sucks... btw amd sucks


Thats because Intel users are secure in knowing we have the superior product, so we don't need to go around trying to argue it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Well first you have to remove all the plastic on the board. I.E. the pci-e slots and everything plastic.
> 
> and i think the temp is like 250f?


...learn s.th new every day - Gigabyte souffle


----------



## lilchronic

well i just watched this but i didnt work for him





edit: i love the top comment


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i just watched this but i didnt work for him
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit: i love the top comment


Oh it's Linus, I thought I recognized that voice. I tried to bake a 9600GT the other day and it didn't work. I don't think it was the way to solve the problem though. I got it on CL for $10 and it worked for like 2 days, lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KuuFA*
> 
> Well first you have to remove all the plastic on the board. I.E. the pci-e slots and everything plastic.
> 
> and i think the temp is like 250f?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i just watched this but i didnt work for him
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit: i love the top comment


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Oh it's Linus, I thought I recognized that voice. I tried to bake a 9600GT the other day and it didn't work. I don't think it was the way to solve the problem though. I got it on CL for $10 and it worked for like 2 days, lol.


Quick words of wisdom: Don't bake. Cover the entire card with tin foil film thingie and only expose the ram chips and gpu core.
Then proceed to point a heat gun from 10cm away to the core for 1 minute, then each pair of adjacent ram chips for 30 sec and finally go back to the core for 30 sec more. That should reflow the bga solder joints to make proper electrical contact with the chips. Let it cool down for 30 min and then re attach the plastic stuff and fire it!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chris68*
> 
> I have vengeance 1600 and I use 9-11-11-28 with 1.6 Volts for 1800 and it works absolutely fine super stable.
> By the way I delidded my CPU before a couple of hours (used the new hammer method lol!, operation was a breeze only a couple of minutes) and test it with Intel Burn Test at maximum settings and it run perfecly cool compared with before
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now it's 68-70 C at full load and before delidding 98 C!!! A gain of almost 30 degrees.
> My i7 3770K runs at 4.5 Ghz


I'll try that, thanks. What is the command rate that you used? Congrats on the delid BTW


----------



## Totally Dubbed

What's your steam id bro?
I'll add you tomorrow
Mine is Totally Dubbed


----------



## malmental

what's Steam..?


----------



## Hokies83

Think my Steam ID is Hokies1983


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'll add you tomorrow. I'm currently in bed, listening to music and not being able to sleep.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Mine is ivanlabrie, but I'm not using any steam game atm...Just SWTOR, Tera online and Ragnarok Online 1


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mine is Totally Dubbed


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Think my Steam ID is Hokies1983


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mine is ivanlabrie


I would have NEVER guessed those steamed id's.


----------



## dr/owned

Is it bad that I don't even remember what my Steam ID is? Autologon spoils me.


----------



## plu2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Hmm... I am having an EK Supremacy nickel plated block along with the EK PreciseMount on the way right now and am planning to use the CLU.
> With this I have a few options:
> 
> Use the CLU on the naked die along with the PreciseMount
> Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and then use Gelid GC Extreme between the IHS and the block to protect the block from the CLU.
> Use the CLU between the die and the IHS and between the IHS and the block.
> I would like to get the most out of delidding the CPU but I am also a bit concerned about damaging the block with the CLU...
> Any suggestions?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd stick to the regular ihs in place mount with the retention mechanism and use CLU on die, and Gelid on the ihs. Also, don't spend money on that EK retention thing for direct die, it's money wasted.


Would you care to elaborate on why EK PreciseMount is a waste of money?

Does anybody else in here have experience with this PreciseMount on a naked Ivy?


----------



## VonDutch

i think he means it not worth the money, time and effort,
besides the extra risk of damaging the die, compared to the gains..

if all goes wel , and you have a 30+C tempdrop, using the IHS as before,
what extra will it give you if you shave off another ..lets say 2- to 5C max..(if any)

you prolly run into max vcore, before you run into TJmax..


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Would you care to elaborate on why EK PreciseMount is a waste of money?
> 
> Does anybody else in here have experience with this PreciseMount on a naked Ivy?


Don't have any experience with it but if you have the block to go with it and it will provide a quick and proper fast mount with it I would get it. Seems like a great idea for anybody who want to go bare die mount with the matching EK block.

Looking forward to your results with it.


----------



## plu2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Don't have any experience with it but if you have the block to go with it and it will provide a quick and proper fast mount with it I would get it. Seems like a great idea for anybody who want to go bare die mount with the matching EK block.


I find it to be a rather good idea too - no gluing of the IHS back on the PCB or alignment-troubles with the loose IHS and the retention bracket...
Since it is already on it's way along with Supremacy CPU-block I think I am going to try it out.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Looking forward to your results with it.


Will report back. The goodies should get here by thursday, so with a little luck I will have assembled my first custom WC rig by sunday


----------



## illuz

I'll be going direct-die. Sure it may only be 2-5'c difference, but I want that difference. I want every bit of cooling & performance I can get


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I would have NEVER guessed those steamed id's.


hahahah


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I would have NEVER guessed those steamed id's.


Well mine is totally unique. Get ready for this..... ready?

RavageTheEarth

BOOM


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Guys got a question on YouTube:
"Very nice Video







, Not to sound stupid , But say with the Pentium G2020 Ivy Bridge CPU is it possible to delid that aswell , as im guessing all Ivybridge﻿ CPU's use the same type of TIM setup ?"

I'm not sure myself, so I told him I'll get back to him.
Can that be delidded and/or is it using the same TIM as i5's and i7's? As it is indeed an IB:
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/3intel-pentium-g2020-s-1155-ivy-bridge-dual-core-29ghz-5-gt-s-dmi-3mb-smart-cache-29x-core-ratio-55w


----------



## malmental

and of course mine is: malmental...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Alright guys I have just confirmed the stabilization of my very first RAM overclock. It's not much, but I'm pretty happy because I have four sticks of crappy DDR3 1600 Vengeance and I was sure I wasn't going to be able to overclock it. I'm running 1600 Mhz with timings of 9, 11, 11, 28 at 1.6v. I left my command rate at 2N. Should I change that? I'm still a beginner at this stuff.


----------



## MKHunt

Stock for those is 10-10-10-27 right? Run a bandwidth test in sandra and aida at your oc, run one at stock, see which has better latency/bandwidth.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright guys I have just confirmed the stabilization of my very first RAM overclock. It's not much, but I'm pretty happy because I have four sticks of crappy DDR3 1600 Vengeance and I was sure I wasn't going to be able to overclock it. I'm running 1600 Mhz with timings of 9, 11, 11, 28 at 1.6v. I left my command rate at 2N. Should I change that? I'm still a beginner at this stuff.


Try 1n...Also, try to install memtweakit and from within Windows change the secondary and tertiary timings while watching the maxxmem previewq results each time, and the memtweakit score too.
That will teach you HOW to tune your timings for best efficiency. Twcl will make your rig crash if you change it from the Os








Have fun!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Stock for those is 10-10-10-27 right? Run a bandwidth test in sandra and aida at your oc, run one at stock, see which has better latency/bandwidth.


Stock is 9-9-9-24 2N


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Try 1n...Also, try to install memtweakit and from within Windows change the secondary and tertiary timings while watching the maxxmem previewq results each time, and the memtweakit score too.
> That will teach you HOW to tune your timings for best efficiency. Twcl will make your rig crash if you change it from the Os
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have fun!


Alright I'll try that. So the point is to loosen up the timings to allow for a faster speed, right?


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Stock is 9-9-9-24 2N


Oh so you have 2 8gb kits?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Oh so you have 2 8gb kits?


No I have two (4gb x 2) kits. They are different version sticks too so that is why I didn't think I could get a successful overclock.

So I just noticed I am only getting about 30% usage in Bioshock Infinite on each GPU. I have the framerate locked at 60fps and am getting a constant framerate of 60fps. I'm surprised how little power this game uses.


----------



## netminder1976

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Oh so you have 2 8gb kits?


He may have the same ram as me... I have a Corsair Vengeance 16gb kit that came stock with them timings.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Oh so you have 2 8gb kits?
> 
> 
> 
> No I have two (4gb x 2) kits. They are different version sticks too so that is why I didn't think I could get a successful overclock.
> 
> So I just noticed I am only getting about 30% usage in Bioshock Infinite on each GPU. I have the framerate locked at 60fps and am getting a constant framerate of 60fps. I'm surprised how little power this game uses.
Click to expand...

I thought it was going to be a heavier title too, but just my single 7850 1GB with a moderate overclock eats it right up...mind you I only game at 720p because that's the max resolution on my projector. I get stutter in the transition scenes(background loading?), but that's it!


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> No I have two (4gb x 2) kits. They are different version sticks too so that is why I didn't think I could get a successful overclock.
> 
> So I just noticed I am only getting about 30% usage in Bioshock Infinite on each GPU. I have the framerate locked at 60fps and am getting a constant framerate of 60fps. I'm surprised how little power this game uses.


Sorry, should have been more specific. I meant 2x (2x4gb) kits. Which two versions do you have? Corsair uses the leading version number to designate chip manufacturer. So if you have say, a 1.12 and a 2.13 they would be a different manufacturer.

On a single titan at 1440 I get ~153fps.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *netminder1976*
> 
> He may have the same ram as me... I have a Corsair Vengeance 16gb kit that came stock with them timings.


Aye, I had one of those kits and couldn't OC any besides dropping it from 2CR to 1CR.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *netminder1976*
> 
> He may have the same ram as me... I have a Corsair Vengeance 16gb kit that came stock with them timings.


Yea I have the Vengeance Low-Profile sticks DDR3 1600 9-9-9-24 1.5v...... and I can't wait to get rid of them








Trident X 2400Mhz is my next upgrade.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Sorry, should have been more specific. I meant 2x (2x4gb) kits. Which two versions do you have? Corsair uses the leading version number to designate chip manufacturer. So if you have say, a 1.12 and a 2.13 they would be a different manufacturer.
> 
> On a single titan at 1440 I get ~153fps.
> Aye, I had one of those kits and couldn't OC any besides dropping it from 2CR to 1CR.


I forget the exact versions, but they are two of the later versions. I just know that they aren't that good lol


----------



## netminder1976

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I have the Vengeance Low-Profile sticks DDR3 1600 9-9-9-24 1.5v...... and I can't wait to get rid of them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trident X 2400Mhz is my next upgrade.


Quick question... would 8gb of thay Trident X 2400 be better than my 16gb Vengeance?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *netminder1976*
> 
> Quick question... would 8gb of thay Trident X 2400 be better than my 16gb Vengeance?


Depends what you're doing. Benchmarking yeah it will help, gaming not by much.


----------



## netminder1976

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Depends what you're doing. Benchmarking yeah it will help, gaming not by much.


Yeah mostly gaming.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *netminder1976*
> 
> Yeah mostly gaming.


Yea well then you would be better sticking with the vengeance. I do a lot of benching and I love overclocking everything I can so that is why I want to upgrade. Plus the Trident X will look amazing with my ASUS MVE


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea well then you would be better sticking with the vengeance. I do a lot of benching and I love overclocking everything I can so that is why I want to upgrade. Plus the Trident X will look amazing with my ASUS MVE


Have fun putting that ram in, the heatsink is basically a knife. (personal experience)


----------



## Inacoma79

I'll buy a cheese burger for the first person who guesses my steam ID.







LOL.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inacoma79*
> 
> I'll buy a cheese burger for the first person who guesses my steam ID.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL.


Inacoma79?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Have fun putting that ram in, the heatsink is basically a knife. (personal experience)


Totally worth the blood. Plus the blood will match my MOBO too


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright I'll try that. So the point is to loosen up the timings to allow for a faster speed, right?


im pretty sure u want to tighten your timming for faster speed


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Inacoma79?


Inacoma1979, GG i'll message you my address.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im pretty sure u want to tighten your timming for faster speed


I think he means loosen his timings to allow for a higher clock speed. Intel likes higher clocks while amd likes tighter timings I think.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I think he means loosen his timings to allow for a higher clock speed. Intel likes higher clocks while amd likes tighter timings I think.


Yea I mean loosen them just enough to allow for a higher Mhz speed. I was just wondering if that is how RAM overclocking works.







Not to knowledged with it.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I mean loosen them just enough to allow for a higher Mhz speed. I was just wondering if that is how RAM overclocking works.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not to knowledged with it.


Generally that is what you do but you can try other things. For one you can try raising the clock speed by raising the voltage. I went up to 1.85v on the trident sticks and they didn't die. From there you can try to loosen the timings and go for an even higher clock speed. Don't loosen them too much though







Your ram overclock will depend mostly on how much tweaking and time you want to spend on it. If you like to experiment/benchmark then go for it.


----------



## Inacoma79

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Inacoma79?


LOL,








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Inacoma1979, GG i'll message you my address.


sorry bro Scott1541 beat you, but it's just 79 no 19. LOL


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Would you care to elaborate on why EK PreciseMount is a waste of money?
> 
> Does anybody else in here have experience with this PreciseMount on a naked Ivy?


You could have bought a 380i and not needed an overpriced kit to do bare die while getting better performance than the EK Supremacy. I say "overpriced kit" because they charge $10 + shipping for around $2 worth of hardware.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inacoma79*
> 
> LOL,


----------



## yknot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> [Would you care to elaborate on why EK PreciseMount is a waste of money?
> 
> Does anybody else in here have experience with this PreciseMount on a naked Ivy?


Why three plastic washers for four standoffs?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *yknot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> [Would you care to elaborate on why EK PreciseMount is a waste of money?
> 
> Does anybody else in here have experience with this PreciseMount on a naked Ivy?
> 
> 
> 
> Why three plastic washers for four standoffs?
Click to expand...

The retention bracket uses 3 screws, so you need 3 nylon washers once you throw the bracket away.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I mean loosen them just enough to allow for a higher Mhz speed. I was just wondering if that is how RAM overclocking works.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not to knowledged with it.


The timings are wait times for certain things. The numbers count the clock ticks to wait. You can divide them by the MHz to compare. If you want to know what would be the same actual time for "10" when going from 1600 Mhz to 1866 Mhz, you'd do this:

10 / 1600 * 1866 = 11.6625

So a timing of 11 @ 1866 would be faster, and 12 @ 1866 would be slower in actual nanoseconds. You can use that for a starting guess for your overclocking. Your BIOS probably uses this formula for all timings you have on "Auto" (my Gigabyte board's BIOS works like that). If this is the case, you have to manually set all timings for them to actually get faster from the overclocking, or you'll only get increased bandwidth out of it.

The "tREFI" timing works differently. For that, a higher number means stuff is set more aggressive, so "loosening" that would mean using a smaller number.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Alright guys I have just confirmed the stabilization of my very first RAM overclock. It's not much, but I'm pretty happy because I have four sticks of crappy DDR3 1600 Vengeance and I was sure I wasn't going to be able to overclock it. I'm running 1600 Mhz with timings of 9, 11, 11, 28 at 1.6v. I left my command rate at 2N. Should I change that? I'm still a beginner at this stuff.


So stock is 1600MHz 9-9-9-24 right? So now you're running 1600MHz 9-11-11-28?? You just made your RAM slower.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im pretty sure u want to tighten your timming for faster speed


Both...tighter, faster mhz, faster ram.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So stock is 1600MHz 9-9-9-24 right? So now you're running 1600MHz 9-11-11-28?? You just made your RAM slower.


Yup...That's why I suggested playing with memtweakit to get to know how each timing affects scores.


----------



## stickg1

Man hell yeah, I bought a GT 430 a few weeks ago locally and I thought the guy screwed me because I got home and it didn't work. Then dude wouldnt return my calls and I didn't know where he lived because I met him halfway. Well I was bored and I baked it, now it's working!

I only have the SFF bracket for it though, so I'm running it with no slot plate because I don't have one for a regular size case. I wonder if they sell those somewhere?


----------



## lilchronic

any suggetions i get 0x0A 0xD1 0x118 bsod's i dont have a qpi setting??


----------



## chris68

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'll try that, thanks. What is the command rate that you used? Congrats on the delid BTW


Thanks. The command rate is 2


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So stock is 1600MHz 9-9-9-24 right? So now you're running 1600MHz 9-11-11-28?? You just made your RAM slower.


What do you mean? I said I'm running 1800Mhz with those timings.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea I mean loosen them just enough to allow for a higher Mhz speed. I was just wondering if that is how RAM overclocking works.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not to knowledged with it.


'







...apart from primary timings, also keep an eye on 'DRAM ref cycle times' in secondary...usually XMP et al set it quite high, depending on your RAM kit - and certainly the amount of RAM you have installed (the more RAM, the higher the DRAM ref cycle time)...I find that lowering helps performance across the board, not just for benching...for 32 GB of TridentX 2400, it will set this parameter to '243', though I can lower it to 198 (any lower and it is BSOD time)...it also depends to some extent on you CPU's IMC capabilities...just run your bench / tests / games until you find the lowest, 'stable' DRAM ref cycle time.







.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> any suggetions i get 0x0A 0xD1 0x118 bsod's i dont have a qpi setting??


Your tertiaries are like puke worthy man...
You want: 1-1-1-1-5-4-1-4-4 there.

Up vtt ddr to 0.850v, raise vccio and vccsa to 1.15v both.

EDIT: What Joa said is important too...not as big as those tertiaries, but it helps. I use 96 for my PSC sticks at 2400mhz.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Your tertiaries are like puke worthy man...
> You want: 1-1-1-1-5-4-1-4-4 there.
> 
> Up vtt ddr to 0.850v, raise vccio and vccsa to 1.15v both.
> 
> EDIT: What Joa said is important too...not as big as those tertiaries, but it helps. I use 96 for my PSC sticks at 2400mhz.


...right, and especially on Asus boards /Intel, tertiaries make a big difference also...here are my MVE timings (TridentX 2400) for IVY / K arrived at with the help of FtW and Ivan before...


----------



## lilchronic

ok well i gave up un 2600mhz now im at this


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> any suggetions i get 0x0A 0xD1 0x118 bsod's i dont have a qpi setting??


I think 0x118 is add Peanut Butter and 0xD1 is add Grape Jelly, not sure what 0x0A is, crescent roll maybe?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok well i gave up un 2600mhz now im at this


...and the timings in my sheet above can be used (at least on this specific setup) to do some 'mild' BCLK clocking as well...i.e. 102 to 104...so the timings are not that tight that there is no more headroom for slightly faster MHz on the ram


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and the timings in my sheet above can be used (at least on this specific setup) to do some 'mild' BCLK clocking as well...i.e. 102 to 104...so the timings are not that tight that there is no more headroom for slightly faster MHz on the ram


so how tight of timmings do you think i can go. i dont really no what to try


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so how tight of timmings do you think i can go. i dont really no what to try


...I haven't gone further than the ones I shared as I want the headroom for BCLK...that said, they're pretty tight already...Ivan and FtW might be able to give you advice 'beyond the frontier'









EDIT: Also keep in mind that I run between 16GB (min) and 32GB, fewer GB might help tighten things up


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> so how tight of timmings do you think i can go. i dont really no what to try


Easy: cl9-11-11-21-1t, if no go: cl9-10-10-26-1t...experiment!


----------



## lilchronic

look good to you guys?







i like it, thanks ivan


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> look good to you guys?


...one way to check (I know you like Valley):

- run Valley at 'old' mem settings (ie at 5.1 GHz - I think your reported before your 3570K can do that)
- reboot- run Valley again at 'new' mem settings, with everything else the same (ie vid card timing, fresh run after reboot)


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I haven't gone further than the ones I shared as I want the headroom for BCLK...that said, they're pretty tight already...Ivan and FtW might be able to give you advice 'beyond the frontier'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Also keep in mind that I run between 16GB (min) and 32GB, fewer GB might help tighten things up


Why would running more (capacity) ram decrease oc potential? All I know is that running fewer sticks will because of a lesser strain on the IMC. I guess the cpu writes more data since you have more ram if you test using all ram but would that increase load on the IMC?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> look good to you guys?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i like it, thanks ivan


Looking pretty good, have to run some pi 32m to see if it wants to be stable enough.
Could probably drop the tRFC a bit as well if it's stable as is.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Man, I'm bored...I wish I could fast forward 30 days


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking pretty good, have to run some pi 32m to see if it wants to be stable enough.
> Could probably drop the tRFC a bit as well if it's stable as is.


well i guess its not stable? this is what i get


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Why would running more (capacity) ram decrease oc potential? All I know is that running fewer sticks will because of a lesser strain on the IMC. I guess the cpu writes more data since you have more ram if you test using all ram but would that increase load on the IMC?


...that's the point ! 32GB is twice as many sticks than 16 (per earlier config descriptions re 6x 8GB TridentX 2400 sticks for the two ROGs)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i guess its not stable? this is what i get


Yep, unstable. Try loosening off the tRAS a bit (start at 28 & see if good there). If not, tRCD to 12 may do it.
For benching I usually use the more vdimm method, but it's nice to find your best 1.65V profile at the best frequency & timings possible at that.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, second that...26 is nice on Samsung chips. 28 is kinda slow for hyk0


----------



## stickg1

I want some sick memory chips, guys feed me some links, I think my main sig rig is sold for $1250, there's room in that price to rebuild faster and stronger..


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I want some sick memory chips, guys feed me some links, I think my main sig rig is sold for $1250, there's room in that price to rebuild faster and stronger..


quit worrying bout some ram buy a Raystorm kit atleast XD


----------



## ivanlabrie

Get the trident X 2666 cl10 kit, 2x4gb and call it a day. Overclock to 2800mhz cl9-12-12-28-1t and you're good to go.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get the trident X 2666 cl10 kit, 2x4gb and call it a day. Overclock to 2800mhz cl9-12-12-28-1t and you're good to go.


I guess I should mention that I would like to keep the price somewhat reasonable (less than $120 for a kit)


----------



## WiSH2oo0

I figured I better post my results here with the 3570K. That way people know that is is not always all sunshine and rainbows on the other side







My experience did not go over to well. Once I dropped the CPU into the motherboard and fired here up. I did not get a picture on my monitor. So then I took out my graphics card and tried with the on board video with no luck. My 3570K is junk


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSH2oo0*
> 
> I figured I better post my results here with the 3570K. That way people know that is is not always all sunshine and rainbows on the other side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My experience did not go over to well. Once I dropped the CPU into the motherboard and fired here up. I did not get a picture on my monitor. So then I took out my graphics card and tried with the on board video with no luck. My 3570K is junk


Have you checked everything thoroughly, looked for bent pins, damage to the CPU, etc..?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSH2oo0*
> 
> I figured I better post my results here with the 3570K. That way people know that is is not always all sunshine and rainbows on the other side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My experience did not go over to well. Once I dropped the CPU into the motherboard and fired here up. I did not get a picture on my monitor. So then I took out my graphics card and tried with the on board video with no luck. My 3570K is junk


Did you check the board for any bent pins? From what I can see the cpu itself doesn't look damaged, & z77 sockets are wimpy.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I guess I should mention that I would like to keep the price somewhat reasonable (less than $120 for a kit)


Get Crucial Ballistix 1600mhz cl8 kits...2x4gb and overclock them to the moon. Best ones have a particular serial number, read THIS thread.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Did you check the board for any bent pins? From what I can see the cpu itself doesn't look damaged, & z77 sockets are wimpy.


LGA sockets SUCK!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get Crucial Ballistix 1600mhz cl8 kits...2x4gb and overclock them to the moon. Best ones have a particular serial number, read THIS thread.


That's what I already have, only mine are FKR


----------



## ivanlabrie

Try overclocking them past 2400mhz? Read the thread...









If not, Trident X 2400mhz cl10 are cheep...

Buy either of these ASAP:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820313323

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820313322


----------



## WiSH2oo0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Have you checked everything thoroughly, looked for bent pins, damage to the CPU, etc..?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Did you check the board for any bent pins? From what I can see the cpu itself doesn't look damaged, & z77 sockets are wimpy.


Yes I did check for bent pins and everything looked fine. I will look again now after I tear it apart again right now. If my 3570K is indeed bad will it hurt any of my other gear when I fired up my comp(motherboard, GPU, memory or PSU)?


----------



## Valgaur

No you should be good. make sure to thoroughly ground everything turn it all off put cpu in latch down and let it sit fully unpowered for a bit then flip the switch and see if you can get anything from it at all.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSH2oo0*
> 
> I figured I better post my results here with the 3570K. That way people know that is is not always all sunshine and rainbows on the other side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My experience did not go over to well. Once I dropped the CPU into the motherboard and fired here up. I did not get a picture on my monitor. So then I took out my graphics card and tried with the on board video with no luck. My 3570K is junk


Dang...thanks for posting...can we get a close up of the chip? I am curious to see what is damaged? Also have you tried running a single stick? Does your MOBO have a dr debug or something similar ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get Crucial Ballistix 1600mhz cl8 kits...2x4gb and overclock them to the moon. Best ones have a particular serial number, read THIS thread.
> LGA sockets SUCK!


Most LGA have been pretty good to me, never had similar issues with 775 or 1366. Even p67 1155 sockets didn't give me a hard time.
Just the z77 1155 boards so far, way more picky with mount pressure & pins bending from a slight breeze in the air it seems like.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSH2oo0*
> 
> Yes I did check for bent pins and everything looked fine. I will look again now after I tear it apart again right now. If my 3570K is indeed bad will it hurt any of my other gear when I fired up my comp(motherboard, GPU, memory or PSU)?


I wouldn't think anything else should have been damaged, can't say for sure since PCs do strange things sometimes but most of the other people who got no POST after a failed delid suffered no other damage to the rig.
Looking closer I see what might be a scuff on the PCB at the top right of the pic, very small & hard to tell if it is or not (for me at least).


----------



## WiSH2oo0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking closer I see what might be a scuff on the PCB at the top right of the pic, very small & hard to tell if it is or not (for me at least).


Yes FTW, there is a little knick on the pcb.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Most LGA have been pretty good to me, never had similar issues with 775 or 1366. Even p67 1155 sockets didn't give me a hard time.
> Just the z77 1155 boards so far, way more picky with mount pressure & pins bending from a slight breeze in the air it seems like.


I know...775 pins seem to be tougher, can't remember how my z68 board felt like though.
But the guy I sold it to bent a pin when installing his cpu, and I fixed it for him.

AMD's socket is way nicer for me.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I know...775 pins seem to be tougher, can't remember how my z68 board felt like though.
> But the guy I sold it to bent a pin when installing his cpu, and I fixed it for him.
> 
> AMD's socket is way nicer for me.


Pins on the motherboard rather than a socket is way better. Imagine delidding an amd... by the time you're done you will either have 942 holes in your fingers or 2 months of bending pins.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSH2oo0*
> 
> Yes FTW, there is a little knick on the pcb.


...try covering the nick with MX4 (or even nail polish) to insulate it...nicks usually occur near where the IHS will be seated...


----------



## stickg1

Should I rebuild with a MVG in a cute mATX case or with a UD4H in a Fractal R4?


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Should I rebuild with a MVG in a cute mATX case or with a UD4H in a Fractal R4?


Oh dude, mATX all the way. Small power = big satisfaction.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Pins on the motherboard rather than a socket is way better. Imagine delidding an amd... by the time you're done you will either have 942 holes in your fingers or 2 months of bending pins.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Should I rebuild with a MVG in a cute mATX case or with a UD4H in a Fractal R4?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Oh dude, mATX all the way. Small power = big satisfaction.


Both?









I'd go with the MVG if you're gonna bench...even the UD4H will do good for that anyway. Up to you, which color do you prefer?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Both?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd go with the MVG if you're gonna bench...even the UD4H will do good for that anyway. Up to you, which color do you prefer?


Well the shields on the heatsinks of the UD4H are kind of meh, do you think I could peel them off easy enough? I have some RAM on the way that would match that board really well. If I got the MVG I would want some red dimms.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well the shields on the heatsinks of the UD4H are kind of meh, do you think I could peel them off easy enough? I have some RAM on the way that would match that board really well. If I got the MVG I would want some red dimms.


Good excuse to get those $70 gskill 2400 DIMMs


----------



## ivanlabrie

OT: I always wanted GBPI's...

Stick, get the UD4H and mod the heatsinks









EDIT: brb, gonna go dream of 2300c8 BGPI's...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> OT: I always wanted GBPI's...
> 
> Stick, get the UD4H and mod the heatsinks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: brb, gonna go dream of 2300c8 BGPI's...


I still prefer my 2400 c7







got 2600 c8 once... then franky died







so gonna wait a bit on that again


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Good excuse to get those $70 gskill 2400 DIMMs


...I love that G.Skill Trident 2400 stuff.even w/tight timings and oc...it's happy with 1.68v in both the Sandy-E X @ RIVE and IVY K @ MVE


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I still prefer my 2400 c7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> got 2600 c8 once... then franky died
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so gonna wait a bit on that again


I don't think Frankie would have wanted you to move on to playing with another chip so soon. It's kind of insensitive..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I still prefer my 2400 c7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> got 2600 c8 once... then franky died
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so gonna wait a bit on that again


...I love how innocently you wrote it: "...then Frankie died'


----------



## lilchronic

well i cant get 2600mhz stable for the life of me







ugh
but i got this stable










ram overcloking is really frustrating


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I still prefer my 2400 c7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> got 2600 c8 once... then franky died
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so gonna wait a bit on that again


2300c8 G.skill Pi's...: http://www.expc.ca/i-16446-G_SKILL_F3_18400CL8D_4GBPIS_Pi_Series_4GB_2X2GB_DDR3_2300_CL8_11_8_28.html
Love those sticks...dream set for me. I want a Pi themed rig with them. 4x2gb at 2600mhz cl8-12-7-27-1t








Yours are 2133mhz cl7 at stock.

... edited


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Oh really? Damn. I would have thought a faster Mhz meant faster RAM. I haven't gotten a chance to do MemTweakIt, but I did install it. Just going to let the computer mine overnight.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 2300c8 G.skill Pi's...: http://www.expc.ca/i-16446-G_SKILL_F3_18400CL8D_4GBPIS_Pi_Series_4GB_2X2GB_DDR3_2300_CL8_11_8_28.html
> Love those sticks...dream set for me. I want a Pi themed rig with them. 4x2gb at 2600mhz cl8-12-7-27-1t
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yours are 2133mhz cl7 at stock.
> So it seems...xD
> They even fold now man, and better than Kepler.
> Get over it


I'll check in there tomorrow, highly doubtful they actually have them, but I can hope! Not too far from me.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'll check in there tomorrow, highly doubtful they actually have them, but I can hope! Not too far from me.


I could cry if I ever got a set...lol specially bnib.


----------



## jdm317

So the new Diamond 7970 came in today... So far she has gone as far on air and her predecessor. I am happy.... So far.









Good to be back to benching, and with a new card to boot









Ill get the water block back on in a few days, still need some new thermal pads.

On another note my new MVF is doing nicely as well.

edit: Haven't read through the posts lately. Hope everyone is doing well.


----------



## hammadj

Hey guys, anyone have any experience with this stuff: http://www.aquatuning.us/product_info.php/info/p1156_liquid-metal-thermal-compoand-Paste-LM--1g-.html

Is it a good alternative for CLU? Its way cheaper, that's why I'm considering it.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> So the new Diamond 7970 came in today... So far she has gone as far on air and her predecessor. I am happy.... So far.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good to be back to benching, and with a new card to boot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ill get the water block back on in a few days, still need some new thermal pads.
> 
> On another note my new MVF is doing nicely as well.


are you going to try againg with the phase changer?









if it was me i probably would but i would wait a week or two before i tried again


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> I'll be going direct-die. Sure it may only be 2-5'c difference, but I want that difference. I want every bit of cooling & performance I can get


That is the spirit of winning.


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> are you going to try againg with the phase changer?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it was me i probably would but i would wait a week or two before i tried again


Heh, I will take a break from extremes until I get a new pump for the chiller. I did come across 2 8000 btu window units recently for cheap... that got my blood going









My wife would kill me...


----------



## ivoryg37

Does this look correct? This is my first time installing CLP


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivoryg37*
> 
> Does this look correct? This is my first time installing CLP


...I think very much so !


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivoryg37*
> 
> Does this look correct? This is my first time installing CLP


Looks good from what I see in the photos.

With 1 little drop on the die I can cover the entire die of a gpu and put a lite coat on the surface of the contact area of the block and still have a little excess on the cotton swab.


The stuff goes a long ways.


----------



## MKHunt

I'm convinced that given enough swabbing, CLP will cover the entire world.

ETA: AX1200 is in! And no electrical fires!

yet


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> are you going to try againg with the phase changer?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if it was me i probably would but i would wait a week or two before i tried again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heh, I will take a break from extremes until I get a new pump for the chiller. I did come across 2 8000 btu window units recently for cheap... that got my blood going
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *My wife would kill me...*
Click to expand...

Joys of single-ness: can blow $2k on a watercooling setup and no one cares.

Suggestion: ditch the wife









I'm just hoping PPC doesn't increase the price of the HC-500A before 2 weeks when I move and pull the trigger. Then I have another few hundred worth of pumps and fittings and insulation and dehumidifier. I'll be peeved if I don't get 5.4 Ghz.


----------



## lilchronic

the best dog ever. RIP TINY



why did you do this to me? and you have to take a pic of me like this


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I'm convinced that given enough swabbing, CLP will cover the entire world.
> 
> ETA: AX1200 is in! And no electrical fires!...yet


...covered the die (big) of a 3970X - dented my CL U reserves....congrats on the AX1200 ! As you say that, I am shuffling two of those babies around on my '2x ROG' semi-desk w-c custom loop build - seemed a lot simpler in my mind ...space...I need space


----------



## ivoryg37

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I think very much so !


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Looks good from what I see in the photos.
> 
> With 1 little drop on the die I can cover the entire die of a gpu and put a lite coat on the surface of the contact area of the block and still have a little excess on the cotton swab.
> 
> The stuff goes a long ways.


Ok Thanks, I hope its right so I don't have to redo since I have a waterloop its a hassle to take stuff out and put back in. I put much less than what you have pictured. Maybe a ball smaller than a BB pellet


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdm317*
> 
> Heh, I will take a break from extremes until I get a new pump for the chiller. I did come across 2 8000 btu window units recently for cheap... that got my blood going
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My wife would kill me...


Get a nice OCN Marksman pot, a not too big dewar and ln2 (and a small thermo for pouring).
And also get artist's eraser, armaflex and paper towels...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I'm convinced that given enough swabbing, CLP will cover the entire world.
> 
> ETA: AX1200 is in! And no electrical fires!
> 
> yet


So much truth...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Joys of single-ness: can blow $2k on a watercooling setup and no one cares.
> 
> Suggestion: ditch the wife
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just hoping PPC doesn't increase the price of the HC-500A before 2 weeks when I move and pull the trigger. Then I have another few hundred worth of pumps and fittings and insulation and dehumidifier. I'll be peeved if I don't get 5.4 Ghz.


Two of those can cool 3 titans and a 3770k at 5.4ghz...I've seen it done. (lowest temp at full tilt and load 4c-8c)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get a nice OCN Marksman pot, a not too big dewar and ln2 (and a small thermo for pouring).
> And also get artist's eraser, armaflex and paper towels...
> So much truth...
> Two of those can cool 3 titans and a 3770k at 5.4ghz...I've seen it done. (lowest temp at full tilt and load 4c-8c)


I've never really looked at the pre-made chillers like that, if it actually holds the temps that low it would be impressive.
I'll have to watch for results!


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Get a nice OCN Marksman pot, a not too big dewar and ln2 (and a small thermo for pouring).
> And also get artist's eraser, armaflex and paper towels...
> So much truth...
> Two of those can cool 3 titans and a 3770k at 5.4ghz...I've seen it done. (lowest temp at full tilt and load 4c-8c)
> 
> 
> 
> I've never really looked at the pre-made chillers like that, if it actually holds the temps that low it would be impressive.
> I'll have to watch for results!
Click to expand...

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cooling/2010/07/20/hailea-hc-500a-water-chiller-review/7

Lowest it was able to go was 4C (28C cpu under full load with 2 gpu's), but I'm going to hack the guts so it runs regardless of the control board to go colder. Basically just direct connect up the compressor to AC power and let a homebrew microcontroller do the management via relay switching.









In theory my coolant is good down to -6C, which I'm going to call "good enough".


----------



## FtW 420

Not bad, definitely nicer looking than most home built chillers. It'll still be interesting to see results!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've never really looked at the pre-made chillers like that, if it actually holds the temps that low it would be impressive.
> I'll have to watch for results!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not bad, definitely nicer looking than most home built chillers. It'll still be interesting to see results!


Guy I know from OCF has two with his triple Titan and 3770k rig...His is stock, no temp sensor removal done on it I think.
Two of those can probably go a bit colder with no sensor, and the compressor just working full bore.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've never really looked at the pre-made chillers like that, if it actually holds the temps that low it would be impressive.
> I'll have to watch for results!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not bad, definitely nicer looking than most home built chillers. It'll still be interesting to see results!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Guy I know from OCF has two with his triple Titan and 3770k rig...His is stock, no temp sensor removal done on it I think.
> Two of those can probably go a bit colder with no sensor, and the compressor just working full bore.
Click to expand...

I really want to know how loud they are, since it's going to be running along with a dehumidifier which is also a compressor. (God the power company is going to love me). I'm going to run 15-20' of tubing to put it in my storage room / spare bedroom so I hopefully won't have to hear it much.

2 seems like overkill for my setup. if I were running a 3970X and 3 Titans, then yeah would probably go with the dual chiller.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the best dog ever. RIP TINY
> 
> 
> 
> why did you do this to me? and you have to take a pic of me like this


Sorry for your loss Chronic!


----------



## illuz

RIP - She looks like a lovely dog. Losing pets really sucks


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> well i cant get 2600mhz stable for the life of me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ugh
> but i got this stable
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ram overcloking is really frustrating


Dont you have a 3570k? I find it awesome you
are able to run 2400. I dont think alot of them can do it.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Sorry for your loss Chronic!


Aww sorry dude. That sucks.


----------



## ivanlabrie

@lilchronic: Sorry for your loss aswell...Reminds me of my doggie, she was a bit bigger, yellow and really friendly







. It's been a long time since we had to put her to sleep, cause she had a few tumors but I still remember her to this day.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Really sorry to hear that man. How are you holding up? I have a cat named Tiny that we are going to have to put down soon. It's really hard. Just keep your head up man. We are all here for you.


----------



## stickg1

Does anyone live close enough to a Micro Center to make a run for me without it being too much of a bother? Obviously I'll pay shipping and for your time and gas as well.


----------



## lilchronic

thanks everyone for the support . its tuff losing a member of the family. RIP Tiny


----------



## stickg1

Do I have to have an ASUS mobo to use Mem Tweakit? I can see all my timings but if I adjust them they go back to normal when I click "Apply"


----------



## stickg1

This is what I have so far...

I wonder if ASRock has a mem tweak tool that would work with my mobo? I'll google it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> This is what I have so far...
> 
> I wonder if ASRock has a mem tweak tool that would work with my mobo? I'll google it.


The OC Formula dudes use one...don't know the name or if it'll work with other Asrock boards. Try cpu tweaker?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> The OC Formula dudes use one...don't know the name or if it'll work with other Asrock boards. Try cpu tweaker?


The OC Formula doesnt work for mine either. I gotta do it the old fashioned way in BIOS, very time consuming, but this is where I'm at now. I set all my main timings to 13 and still can't boot 2400MHz so it looks like I won't get much more than 2200MHz..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The OC Formula doesnt work for mine either. I gotta do it the old fashioned way in BIOS, very time consuming, but this is where I'm at now. I set all my main timings to 13 and still can't boot 2400MHz so it looks like I won't get much more than 2200MHz..


Your imc might suck pretty bad then...try 1.2v vccio and vccsa, and vttddr at 0.850v.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Your imc might suck pretty bad then...try 1.2v vccio and vccsa, and vttddr at 0.850v.


all I have is VCCSA and VTT in my BIOS. I tried adjusting them, its either my mobo, chip, or RAM. No way to tell unless I get other parts to try.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The OC Formula doesnt work for mine either. I gotta do it the old fashioned way in BIOS, very time consuming, but this is where I'm at now. I set all my main timings to 13 and still can't boot 2400MHz so it looks like I won't get much more than 2200MHz..










sorry to hear that mate
my SB used to boot 1.6v and 9-11-11-27 1T at 2133 and my IB can only do that at 2000, it's weird


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> all I have is VCCSA and VTT in my BIOS. I tried adjusting them, its either my mobo, chip, or RAM. No way to tell unless I get other parts to try.


I think your sticks might need more vdimm for 2400mhz. Also you got AMAZING timings already at 2200mhz. Try 1.8v and go for 2400mhz cl9-11-13-28-2t. Should probably work...VTT is vccio and VCCSA is well...vccsa








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry to hear that mate
> my SB used to boot 1.6v and 9-11-11-27 1T at 2133 and my IB can only do that at 2000, it's weird


In your case I'm pretty sure your sticks are the culprit...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think your sticks might need more vdimm for 2400mhz. Also you got AMAZING timings already at 2200mhz. Try 1.8v and go for 2400mhz cl9-11-13-28-2t. Should probably work...VTT is vccio and VCCSA is well...vccsa
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Yeah I figured VTT was VCCIO, I don't think I have a VTTDDR adjustment though. I'll try 2400MHz once more but I think CL9 2200MHz is pretty sweet for a 8GB kit a bought NIB for $45


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I really want to know how loud they are, since it's going to be running along with a dehumidifier which is also a compressor. (God the power company is going to love me). I'm going to run 15-20' of tubing to put it in my storage room / spare bedroom so I hopefully won't have to hear it much.
> 
> 2 seems like overkill for my setup. if I were running a 3970X and 3 Titans, then yeah would probably go with the dual chiller.


I would expect it to be about as loud as a window shaker AC of similar size, startup is usually a little louder than when it is cold & running.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thanks everyone for the support . its tuff losing a member of the family. RIP Tiny


My condolences, I have a 17 year old cat that is slowing down & they are like part of the family after so long.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Do I have to have an ASUS mobo to use Mem Tweakit? I can see all my timings but if I adjust them they go back to normal when I click "Apply"


I don't know about asrock, memtweakit does work with my MSI & gigabyte boards. Asrock does have a similar utility though, I've seen it in screenshots.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Your imc might suck pretty bad then...try 1.2v vccio and vccsa, and vttddr at 0.850v.


Vttddr.... forgot about that when going for 3000Mhz + memory, gonna have to set up for another go at that....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Your kit seems to be quite good but it needs volts to shine...it can probably do 2600mhz, but you need more than 1.8v for that probably.
It has a dead zone in between 1.72v-1.78v if it has D9QMT chips (probably the case), so just go for 1.8v to quickly determine if your imc is up to par.
If you had a board with a LED display you'd know if it was the imc or the ram that won't go higher.


----------



## plu2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You could have bought a 380i and not needed an overpriced kit to do bare die while getting better performance than the EK Supremacy. I say "overpriced kit" because they charge $10 + shipping for around $2 worth of hardware.


Hmmm - I paid €3,95 ~$5,20 and since they shipped it along with the Supremacy block and other goodies, I didn't pay extra for the shipping.


----------



## stickg1

If I try anything over 2200MHz I get LED code 55 which means "Memory not installed"

Not sure if that's what you were talking about or not. But I think this memory just doesn't do it. In an article I read (I think you linked it last night) the guy said he bought several kits and 2 or 3 were awesome and the rest couldn't boot past 2133MHz, I think I have one of those kits. Only in my case they seem to like 2200MHz much more than 2133MHz.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> If I try anything over 2200MHz I get LED code 55 which means "Memory not installed"
> 
> Not sure if that's what you were talking about or not. But I think this memory just doesn't do it. In an article I read (I think you linked it last night) the guy said he bought several kits and 2 or 3 were awesome and the rest couldn't boot past 2133MHz, I think I have one of those kits. Only in my case they seem to like 2200MHz much more than 2133MHz.


Your timings at 2200mhz seem quite nice...Give them more voltage man, what's the voltage when you get code 55?
Code 23 means your cpu can't handle it, 55 ram needs more voltage...These are good up to 1.9v, maybe more on cold.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Your timings at 2200mhz seem quite nice...Give them more voltage man, what's the voltage when you get code 55?
> Code 23 means your cpu can't handle it, 55 ram needs more voltage...These are good up to 1.9v, maybe more on cold.


I did 1.8v for 2400MHz CL10-13-13-30-2T, if 1.8v can't do that speed at those timings then I'm fine with 2200MHz. I had VCCSA and VCCIO both at 1.2v. I'm not comfortable going any higher on the vDIMM or vtt. I'm running 2200MHz 9-9-9-27-1T on 1.65v, 1.15v VTT, 1.10v VCCSA


----------



## stickg1

Oh I'm not sure if I already mentioned this but I went to my local best buy and they said they would price match Micro Center on the 3770K. When I rebuild I might just get my 3770K from them and the MVG from them if they will price match Newegg on it.


----------



## ivanlabrie

For 24/7 that 2200mhz config would be unbeatable really...Try a 5ghz maxxmem run and post results. I'm guessing close to 30k copy/read.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think your sticks might need more vdimm for 2400mhz. Also you got AMAZING timings already at 2200mhz. Try 1.8v and go for 2400mhz cl9-11-13-28-2t. Should probably work...VTT is vccio and VCCSA is well...vccsa
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In your case I'm pretty sure your sticks are the culprit...


how do you figure if they ran fine on the same motherboard with a sandy bridge ? 24/7
this would make me think the CPU's imc is the culprit? no?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Or the settings...What are your settings voltage and timing wise? You're using xmp?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the best dog ever. RIP TINY
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> why did you do this to me? and you have to take a pic of me like this


...sorry to hear this - but TINY will chasing sheep through the clouds and sleeping on a bed of milk-bones and bacon right about now


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Or the settings...What are your settings voltage and timing wise? You're using xmp?


Same settings, same voltage, no XMP

I even tried boosting voltage of dram and vccio :/ I gave up when it didn't work and couldn't get any more help in my thread about it


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> Same settings, same voltage, no XMP
> 
> I even tried boosting voltage of dram and vccio :/ I gave up when it didn't work and couldn't get any more help in my thread about it


Well, might be your imc but certain chips react different with different architectures. Could be your board as well, the way it sets auto timings might prevent the system from booting. Try xmp and then modify it to get to 2133 or higher. Try really loose timings and 1.75v for dram voltage...
What are your current timings set at? 1600mhz kits suck normally, they just aren't binned and sometimes have mixed chips, which makes them suck even more. I only buy 2000mhz or more rated kits.


----------



## HiLuckyB

OCN name: HiLuckyB
CPU: i7 3770K
on die-TIM: MX-2
ihs-TIM: MX-2
Mhz gained: 100MHz for now
OC after delid: 4.8GHz
Temp drops: 12c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2772377 http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2772377

http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00603.jpg.html

http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00605.jpg.html

http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00615.jpg.html


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, might be your imc but certain chips react different with different architectures. Could be your board as well, the way it sets auto timings might prevent the system from booting. Try xmp and then modify it to get to 2133 or higher. Try really loose timings and 1.75v for dram voltage...
> What are your current timings set at? 1600mhz kits suck normally, they just aren't binned and sometimes have mixed chips, which makes them suck even more. I only buy 2000mhz or more rated kits.


9-11-11-29 1T 1.6v just like it was on SB









Would suck If I lose cas timing or have to increase voltage for a 67mhz increase








It's the gskill trident X ram so I wouldn't expect it to be some random pair








I will try XMP like you mentioned , before XMP made all my timings more than what stock was, was weird but who knows, I know nothing of the IB system just learning, had to settle for 2000 because i did not want to go past 1.65v voltage or cas9


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HiLuckyB*
> 
> OCN name: HiLuckyB
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: MX-2
> ihs-TIM: MX-2
> Mhz gained: 100MHz for now
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: 12c
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2772377 http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2772377
> 
> http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00603.jpg.html
> 
> http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00605.jpg.html
> 
> http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00615.jpg.html


mx-2 is outdated and there are alot of tims that perform better. Get some CLU/CLP on that die to get the most out of the delid


----------



## chronicfx

Whats up fellas... Sooo.. I swapped my extreme6 for a UD5h this weekend and installed a Raystorm instead of my D14!!



I have these two clocks prime, IBT stable, and most importantly tomb raider stable although I think I am about to finish it.. Bioshock up next!

5 ghz at 1.488v



4.7ghz at 1.296v



My only problem with the UD5h so far (beside the bios being a PITA to use compared to Asrocks although I am getting the hang of it) is that I was able to overclock my lowly 1600MHz ram kit a little bit better on the extreme6. Perhaps someone here can help my out?

I was able to use all of these timings on the Asrock Extreme6 just setting the main timings and leaving everything else alone (auto) because honestly I don't understand what all of the different timings mean in the bios.

Mem Copy---Mem Read---Mem Write---Mem Latency---physics 3dmark11
2000---9---11---9---27---2T---1.65v---26550

24073

24365

54.9

1866---9---10---9---24---2T---1.5v

25539

23319

24196

54.3

1866---9---10---9---24---1T---1.5v

25401

23501

24126

53.6

2000---9---11---9---27---1T---1.65v

26401

24477

24532

51.9

9837

But on the Z77x-UD5h the only one that will boot (and actually is stable) is 1866 9-11-11-27-2T @ 1.5v and I am having no luck with getting to 2000mhz. Is it the board or do you think something is on auto that shouldn't be?

I have this ram http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233379

Edit: The formatting looks ok then when I submit it... It sucks. Hopefully you can follow along


----------



## HiLuckyB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> mx-2 is outdated and there are alot of tims that perform better. Get some CLU/CLP on that die to get the most out of the delid


I am going to be ordering some CLU for the die very soon. I have MX-2, MX-4, and Arctic silver ceramique, And so far MX-2 has giving me the best temps on my cpu and gpu WB's.

What other tim's are better then MX-2, And are easy to use?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Whats up fellas... Sooo.. I swapped my extreme6 for a UD5h this weekend and installed a Raystorm instead of my D14!!
> 
> 
> 
> I have these two clocks prime, IBT stable, and most importantly tomb raider stable although I think I am about to finish it.. Bioshock up next!
> 
> 5 ghz at 1.488v
> 
> 
> 
> 4.7ghz at 1.296v
> 
> 
> 
> My only problem with the UD5h so far (beside the bios being a PITA to use compared to Asrocks although I am getting the hang of it) is that I was able to overclock my lowly 1600MHz ram kit a little bit better on the extreme6. Perhaps someone here can help my out?
> 
> I was able to use all of these timings on the Asrock Extreme6 just setting the main timings and leaving everything else alone (auto) because honestly I don't understand what all of the different timings mean in the bios.
> 
> Mem Copy Mem Read Mem Write Mem Latency physics
> 2000 9 11 9 27 2T 1.65v 26550 24073 24365 54.9
> 26700 24112 24306 55.3
> 
> 1866 9 10 9 24 2T 1.5v 25539 23319 24196 54.3
> 25539 23024 24196 54.2
> 
> 1866 9 10 9 24 1T 1.5v 25401 23501 24126 53.6
> 25265 23405 23835 53.6
> 
> 2000 9 11 9 27 1T 1.65v 26401 24477 24532 51.9 9837
> 26252 24477 24230 53.1
> 
> But on the Z77x-UD5h the only one that will boot (and actually is stable) is 1866 9-11-11-27-2T @ 1.5v and I am having no luck with getting to 2000mhz. Is it the board or do you think something is on auto that shouldn't be?
> 
> I have this ram http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233379


Your ram uses HYK0 chips by Samsung...told ya, UD5H doesn't play nice with those IC's. I could only boot 2400mhz once, and the was stuck at 2200mhz and got some really strange behavior on that board. Should have gotten the UD4H or UP5. You might have to change some tertiary timings, I can't recall which one atm, but those boards defaults some of the obscure timings too tight for HYK0 chips so they don't boot at all. May help to play with Slew settings and maybe try a different bios. Ask Sin0822 for more info.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HiLuckyB*
> 
> OCN name: HiLuckyB
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: MX-2
> ihs-TIM: MX-2
> Mhz gained: 100MHz for now
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: 12c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2772377 http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2772377
> 
> http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00603.jpg.html
> 
> http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00605.jpg.html
> 
> http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/DSC00615.jpg.html


You're In!







Slap that sig on proudly! Nice job on the cleaning btw.









gonna get me some free Pentium 4's and the RAM mobo's PSU and HDDs and everything for free on thursday lol, much benching









Ohh and I am getting my hands on a MSI 7970 Lightning brand new


----------



## ivanlabrie

Very nice haul...









Keep us updated!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ohh and I am getting my hands on a MSI 7970 Lightning brand new


...please forward to me asap







- please


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Your ram uses HYK0 chips by Samsung...told ya, UD5H doesn't play nice with those IC's. I could only boot 2400mhz once, and the was stuck at 2200mhz and got some really strange behavior on that board. Should have gotten the UD4H or UP5. You might have to change some tertiary timings, I can't recall which one atm, but those boards defaults some of the obscure timings too tight for HYK0 chips so they don't boot at all. May help to play with Slew settings and maybe try a different bios. Ask Sin0822 for more info.


I had a feeling some of the defaults could be too tight. Thanks I will ask over in the gigabyte thread and see what I get.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

My wife left me yesterday because I apparently overclock too much.
Now I'll have to find a compatible motherboard to stick my RAM into.

(This is a joke. Thought to have some humor







)


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thanks everyone for the support . its tuff losing a member of the family. RIP Tiny


Sorry to hear that, man. RIP Tiny.


----------



## HiLuckyB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap that sig on proudly! Nice job on the cleaning btw.


That was a quick clean to put it back in my rig to make sure it was still working after knocking it's top off







Funny part is that was just with using the edge of a credit card to clean it









It's a little cleaner now and when I get some CLU, Ill make sure it's perfect


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> My wife left me yesterday because I apparently overclock too much.
> Now I'll have to find a compatible motherboard to stick my RAM into.
> 
> (This is a joke. Thought to have some humor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


When I first started reading it, I said: "Good lord whats going on in this thread!" out loud to my wife... and then said "Nevermind, its nothing." when she asked what it was about. lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HiLuckyB*
> 
> I am going to be ordering some CLU for the die very soon. I have MX-2, MX-4, and Arctic silver ceramique, And so far MX-2 has giving me the best temps on my cpu and gpu WB's.
> 
> What other tim's are better then MX-2, And are easy to use?


Well personally since I've figured out about CLU/CLP I don't use anything but those, but there are some alternatives for the ihs.

I find mx-4 quite good. Other options are pk-3 and ic diamond. Shin etsu gets some good reviews also.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Very nice haul...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Keep us updated!


only need to wait until Thursday!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...please forward to me asap
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - please


noooooope, been waiting for a while trying to hunt down the perfect card and finally got a hold of a brand new one that will be amazing later (I hope)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HiLuckyB*
> 
> That was a quick clean to put it back in my rig to make sure it was still working after knocking it's top off
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Funny part is that was just with using the edge of a credit card to clean it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a little cleaner now and when I get some CLU, Ill make sure it's perfect


Glad you like CLU







welcome aboard


----------



## shamanik1320

Hey Valgaur, it's been awhile but I got the temps on my system. I am running offest mode and doing manual at 4.5 Ghz @ 1.2 vcore seemed to not want to boot unless I was missing something. Anyways, I ran a test program and set (I can actually set a manual and a offset at the same time. My manual setting was 1.140v and my offset is +.2, this was reading at 1.304v while running Intel Burn Test.

OCN name:shamanik1320
CPU:i7-3770k
on die-TIM:CLU
ihs-TIM:CLU
Mhz gained:N/A
OC after delid:I run at 4.7 Ghz(4.5 for test)
Temp drops:N/A
CPU-Z validation of max OC:1.304v for the 4.5 Ghz test

My highest temperature readings were thus:

Core 0 = 76 degrees celsius
Core 1 = 85 degrees celsius
Core 2 = 83 degrees celsius
Core 3 = 78 degrees celsius

I have lapped my heatspreader on both sides using a lapping kit from FrozenCPU, which consisted of varying grits of paper up to 2500. I however did not lap the surface of my Corsair H100i waterblock surface. I just removed the paste and connected it using CLU inside and out.

Here is the picture of my delidded cpu again, now I know the criticism is spot on that it isn't the best application of clu, well, I actually broke my motherboard switching the chip, the cpu pins got bent, so after i took this picture, it sat on my shelf for a good two weeks before I got to install it. So I don't know if that's exactly how it looked before putting it together.

You can notice if you look around the CLU on the heatspreader you can see the copper coming through where it was lapped inside.

Only thing left is as someone on here suggested I'm going to someday get a power cable extension to get that cable so it can loop around behind. But I'm not gonna take it apart and do that until I get new fans for the inside. I'm trying to figure out what is the best route to take. I want to buy one 120 mm Delta fan so I can hook it up at low power and see how loud it is and it it's worth putting in and then I'll buy more if I like it, but I don't know what 120 mm's to replace. The exhaust fan on the back of the case is extremely weak, so that's a candidate, but then with that much power I should probably turn it around so it brings air in for the radiator above it. Then I'm thinking two delta fans to replace the native fans to the Corsair H100i, which brings me the fans on the Corsair H100i. I bought Corsair SP 120 performance edition fans for on top, I was told the H100i's come with fans were Corsair SP 120's, but the ones that came with the H100i can go extremely low, and much higher than the sp 120's I bought, the native fans go 1000-2500, and the SP 120's go about 2000, and they're on top, if they were the same the 120's on top should be going faster. What fans come with the H100i? I can't find this out.

And OMG, I should stick a Delta fan 120 mm above the 80 mm fan on my side panel. So 4 delta 120's at 40 bucks a piece. Only 160 for fans. Damn, this is not gonna happen for quite some time lol.

But I will buy one pretty soon so I can see if I like it. Any comments? What a Delta 120 sounds like on low power? I like when fans are loud, just not when I don't want them to be.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Depends on the Delta...you don't want those man. They get damaged when being shipped cause of the dual ball bearings.
Plus not all undervolt well without making ticking noises.
Get an fdb or hdb fan, either Panaflos 120x38, modern pwm fans like Gelid Silent 12's or Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-15's...


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, it's been awhile but I got the temps on my system. I am running offest mode and doing manual at 4.5 Ghz @ 1.2 vcore seemed to not want to boot unless I was missing something. Anyways, I ran a test program and set (I can actually set a manual and a offset at the same time. My manual setting was 1.140v and my offset is +.2, this was reading at 1.304v while running Intel Burn Test.
> 
> OCN name:shamanik1320
> CPU:i7-3770k
> on die-TIM:CLU
> ihs-TIM:CLU
> Mhz gained:N/A
> OC after delid:I run at 4.7 Ghz(4.5 for test)
> Temp drops:N/A
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:1.304v for the 4.5 Ghz test
> 
> My highest temperature readings were thus:
> 
> Core 0 = 76 degrees celsius
> Core 1 = 85 degrees celsius
> Core 2 = 83 degrees celsius
> Core 3 = 78 degrees celsius
> 
> I have lapped my heatspreader on both sides using a lapping kit from FrozenCPU, which consisted of varying grits of paper up to 2500. I however did not lap the surface of my Corsair H100i waterblock surface. I just removed the paste and connected it using CLU inside and out.
> 
> Here is the picture of my delidded cpu again, now I know the criticism is spot on that it isn't the best application of clu, well, I actually broke my motherboard switching the chip, the cpu pins got bent, so after i took this picture, it sat on my shelf for a good two weeks before I got to install it. So I don't know if that's exactly how it looked before putting it together.
> 
> You can notice if you look around the CLU on the heatspreader you can see the copper coming through where it was lapped inside.
> 
> Only thing left is as someone on here suggested I'm going to someday get a power cable extension to get that cable so it can loop around behind. But I'm not gonna take it apart and do that until I get new fans for the inside. I'm trying to figure out what is the best route to take. I want to buy one 120 mm Delta fan so I can hook it up at low power and see how loud it is and it it's worth putting in and then I'll buy more if I like it, but I don't know what 120 mm's to replace. The exhaust fan on the back of the case is extremely weak, so that's a candidate, but then with that much power I should probably turn it around so it brings air in for the radiator above it. Then I'm thinking two delta fans to replace the native fans to the Corsair H100i, which brings me the fans on the Corsair H100i. I bought Corsair SP 120 performance edition fans for on top, I was told the H100i's come with fans were Corsair SP 120's, but the ones that came with the H100i can go extremely low, and much higher than the sp 120's I bought, the native fans go 1000-2500, and the SP 120's go about 2000, and they're on top, if they were the same the 120's on top should be going faster. What fans come with the H100i? I can't find this out.
> 
> And OMG, I should stick a Delta fan 120 mm above the 80 mm fan on my side panel. So 4 delta 120's at 40 bucks a piece. Only 160 for fans. Damn, this is not gonna happen for quite some time lol.
> 
> But I will buy one pretty soon so I can see if I like it. Any comments? What a Delta 120 sounds like on low power? I like when fans are loud, just not when I don't want them to be.


I'm curious how and why you lapped the inside of the ihs. Lapping must be done on a flat surface... This is impossible to do on the inside due to the raised lip. Do you mean you simply removed the nickel plating?


----------



## shamanik1320

Yeah, I just wound it around my finger and rubbed for a bit going up in grit after so long.

It didn't pose a problem, however lapping the top of the heatspreader, made it very hard for the CLU to stick to the surface, it was so polished it just run over the surface and didn't want to adhere but I slowly worked it back and forth until it was coated well and it worked good. I would like to go a year or two without removing the heatspreader and waterblock and see what it's like after that much time.


----------



## FtW 420

????????????

Not enough posts in the delidded thread, usually pages, today just a few posts.

Omega man?









Good luck with the new card Val, what kinda pot are you getting?
Tek 9 Fat worked pretty well for me, but want to try the slim to see if it bugs the memory less.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I want a raptor 3 pot...but oh so expensive! Even with a discount









Duniek replied to my pm, he has some stock left and offered some decent prices.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ????????????
> 
> Not enough posts in the delidded thread, usually pages, today just a few posts.
> 
> Omega man?


...nah - they all moved to the AMD threads now


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...nah - they all moved to the AMD threads now


AMD chips are sick. I'm going 8320 on my next build. Moar cores = moar scores! It's science!


----------



## FtW 420

But AMD overclocks higher too
http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2226595_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_fx_8150_146sec_546ms

although less core AMD at lower clocks is almost there...
http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2257175_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_phenom_ii_x6_1090t_be_146sec_891ms

But more cores is better
http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2211088_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_phenom_ii_x4_955_be_177sec_468ms

Extra threads beats more cores WAT?
http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2224361_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_core_i7_2600k_129sec_906ms


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://hwbot.org/submission/2340675_the_game_superpi___1m_core_2_e8400_(3.0ghz)_7sec_219ms

http://hwbot.org/submission/2223322__mat__superpi___1m_fx_8150_10sec_687ms


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2340675_the_game_superpi___1m_core_2_e8400_(3.0ghz)_7sec_219ms
> 
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2223322__mat__superpi___1m_fx_8150_10sec_687ms


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> But AMD overclocks higher too
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2226595_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_fx_8150_146sec_546ms
> 
> although less core AMD at lower clocks is almost there...
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2257175_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_phenom_ii_x6_1090t_be_146sec_891ms
> 
> But more cores is better
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2211088_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_phenom_ii_x4_955_be_177sec_468ms
> 
> Extra threads beats more cores WAT?
> http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2224361_ftw_420_wprime___1024m_core_i7_2600k_129sec_906ms


I'm not really even sure what I'm looking at, but my post was an attempt at a joke.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm not really even sure what I'm looking at, but my post was an attempt at a joke.


Yep, the scores we posted were just for the the extra lulz. Moar cores for higher scores!

Higher clocks don't even help...


----------



## Solonowarion

can you put a chip in the freezer to harden the glue? when i delid again I want to try it.

I cant think of one reason it wouldnt work. Has anyone tried it?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm not really even sure what I'm looking at, but my post was an attempt at a joke.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yep, the scores we posted were just for the the extra lulz. Moar cores for higher scores!
> 
> Higher clocks don't even help...


Ours too...notice the superpi 1m run with both an 8ghz 8150 and a 6480mhz E8400...the 8400 wins! lol (I know it's x86 bla bla...it wins though)


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ours too...notice the superpi 1m run with both an 8ghz 8150 and a 6480mhz E8400...the 8400 wins! lol (I know it's x86 bla bla...it wins though)


Ah gotcha, I do plan on rebuilding though. This time with a MVG and 3770K.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> can you put a chip in the freezer to harden the glue? when i delid again I want to try it.
> 
> I cant think of one reason it wouldnt work. Has anyone tried it?


Is this a genuine question?


----------



## HiLuckyB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> can you put a chip in the freezer to harden the glue? when i delid again I want to try it.
> 
> I cant think of one reason it wouldnt work. Has anyone tried it?


I don't see the point, I would think after taking it out of the freezer you would get condensation.

I used this method and it only took 4 small hits and the top came off. http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Ours too...notice the superpi 1m run with both an 8ghz 8150 and a 6480mhz E8400...the 8400 wins! lol (I know it's x86 bla bla...it wins though)


Gotcha, too many numbers for me to look at. The sun fried me today, building a house with no shade at all on the lot, 9 hours of straight roasting, and it's only April!!! I'm drinking some beer to get hydrated, errr buzzed, whatever!


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Is this a genuine question?


Yes lol I only troll on facebook. It would be easier to tap the pcb off.
like I said I personally cant think off a reason it would be harmful.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Yes lol I only troll on facebook. It would be easier to tap the pcb off.
> like I said I personally cant think off a reason it would be harmful.


What putting a cpu in a freezer? Wouldnt be harmful? Behave


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> can you put a chip in the freezer to harden the glue? when i delid again I want to try it.
> 
> I cant think of one reason it wouldnt work. Has anyone tried it?


Not sure if the freezer is cold enough. Cold does work though, for the corsair memory sticks that have the heatspreaders glued on, people trying to remove the spreaders were ripping the ICs right off the PCB, but 2 minutes at -196° & the heatspreaders will fall off on their own.

As for condensation concern, just make sure the temp is equalized & the cpu is dry before powering it. You can drop a cpu in a glass of water & as long as it is completely dried before powering it, nothing will get hurt.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> What putting a cpu in a freezer? Wouldnt be harmful? Behave


Im sorry are we on a forum or are you trying to hint at the size of your male endowment?

thanks for the help bro


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Im sorry are we on a forum or are you trying to hint at the size of your male endowment?
> 
> thanks for the help bro


Well getting the glue cold might help with the vise and hammer method. For the cutting method, I reckon hot glue would be easier to cut than cold glue.

Either way, it seems like both methods are pretty easy to do without heating or cooling the chip. So I'm not sure if cooking or cooling is even necessary.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Im sorry are we on a forum or are you trying to hint at the size of your male endowment?
> 
> thanks for the help bro


No idea what your talking about but it seems like a daft idea to put a cpu in a freezer, I cant see it working afterwards...


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well getting the glue cold might help with the vise and hammer method. For the cutting method, I reckon hot glue would be easier to cut than cold glue.
> 
> Either way, it seems like both methods are pretty easy to do without heating or cooling the chip. So I'm not sure if cooking or cooling is even necessary.


Yeah fair enough. The razor realy does cut through the glue like butter. just curious.

thanks peeps


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> No idea what your talking about but it seems like a daft idea to put a cpu in a freezer, I cant see it working afterwards...


Cpu in the freezer won't hurt anything. HDDs are really the only part that can't be completely immersed in water, dried off, & work fine afterwards. I've left ram in the freezer & pulled it out, dropped it in the board & overclocked it while it was still cold trying to get better clocks. I've had wet cpus as well, all good when dry. I use them frozen all the time







.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> No idea what your talking about but it seems like a daft idea to put a cpu in a freezer, I cant see it working afterwards...


It will work afterwards. Just has to be dry.

I just don't see how it would help with delidding the chip because it's already easy without going to any extreme temperatures, whether high or low.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It will work afterwards. Just has to be dry.
> 
> I just don't see how it would help with delidding the chip because it's already easy without going to any extreme temperatures, whether high or low.


I'll have to try it with one of the crappy 3770k when I load up on ln2 again, most can't really use the same method but never know, might make it easy enough to do by hand.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It will work afterwards. Just has to be dry.
> 
> I just don't see how it would help with delidding the chip because it's already easy without going to any extreme temperatures, whether high or low.


yeah I have only done razor method myself and understand vice is very simple I was just thinking it would be that much easier with hardened and cold glue.

anyways.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Cpu in the freezer won't hurt anything. HDDs are really the only part that can't be completely immersed in water, dried off, & work fine afterwards. I've left ram in the freezer & pulled it out, dropped it in the board & overclocked it while it was still cold trying to get better clocks. I've had wet cpus as well, all good when dry. I use them frozen all the time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


LMAO







did you get higher clocks? lol


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> yeah I have only done razor method myself and understand vice is very simple I was just thinking it would be that much easier with hardened and cold glue.
> 
> anyways.


Well hey, you don't know until you try!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> yeah I have only done razor method myself and understand vice is very simple I was just thinking it would be that much easier with hardened and cold glue.
> 
> anyways.


I think it'll help, if it behaves anything like ram heatsinks....yeah people, heatsinks!







I don't get why we have to call them heatspreaders to be understood. Must be Tom's hardware fault.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I think it'll help, if it behaves anything like ram heatsinks....yeah people, heatsinks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't get why we have to call them heatspreaders to be understood. Must be Tom's hardware fault.


I didnt have any trouble getting them off my crucial ballistix tactical low pro's, but now I do have trouble getting them to stay on.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> LMAO
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> did you get higher clocks? lol


I did do a bit better but it didn't last long, would pretty much have to have the bios all ready to go for a very quick bench.
Wasn't helpful enough to keep doing it anyway, the upside down duster blast for a quick memory chill is more effective when necessary.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I didnt have any trouble getting them off my crucial ballistix tactical low pro's, but now I do have trouble getting them to stay on.


Some come with thermal pad or tape like most g-skill kits do, others like supertalent & corsair use permanent thermal glue (not sure about all their kits but at least some did).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, it's been awhile but I got the temps on my system. I am running offest mode and doing manual at 4.5 Ghz @ 1.2 vcore seemed to not want to boot unless I was missing something. Anyways, I ran a test program and set (I can actually set a manual and a offset at the same time. My manual setting was 1.140v and my offset is +.2, this was reading at 1.304v while running Intel Burn Test.
> 
> OCN name:shamanik1320
> CPU:i7-3770k
> on die-TIM:CLU
> ihs-TIM:CLU
> Mhz gained:N/A
> OC after delid:I run at 4.7 Ghz(4.5 for test)
> Temp drops:N/A
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:1.304v for the 4.5 Ghz test
> 
> My highest temperature readings were thus:
> 
> Core 0 = 76 degrees celsius
> Core 1 = 85 degrees celsius
> Core 2 = 83 degrees celsius
> Core 3 = 78 degrees celsius
> 
> I have lapped my heatspreader on both sides using a lapping kit from FrozenCPU, which consisted of varying grits of paper up to 2500. I however did not lap the surface of my Corsair H100i waterblock surface. I just removed the paste and connected it using CLU inside and out.
> 
> Here is the picture of my delidded cpu again, now I know the criticism is spot on that it isn't the best application of clu, well, I actually broke my motherboard switching the chip, the cpu pins got bent, so after i took this picture, it sat on my shelf for a good two weeks before I got to install it. So I don't know if that's exactly how it looked before putting it together.
> 
> You can notice if you look around the CLU on the heatspreader you can see the copper coming through where it was lapped inside.
> 
> Only thing left is as someone on here suggested I'm going to someday get a power cable extension to get that cable so it can loop around behind. But I'm not gonna take it apart and do that until I get new fans for the inside. I'm trying to figure out what is the best route to take. I want to buy one 120 mm Delta fan so I can hook it up at low power and see how loud it is and it it's worth putting in and then I'll buy more if I like it, but I don't know what 120 mm's to replace. The exhaust fan on the back of the case is extremely weak, so that's a candidate, but then with that much power I should probably turn it around so it brings air in for the radiator above it. Then I'm thinking two delta fans to replace the native fans to the Corsair H100i, which brings me the fans on the Corsair H100i. I bought Corsair SP 120 performance edition fans for on top, I was told the H100i's come with fans were Corsair SP 120's, but the ones that came with the H100i can go extremely low, and much higher than the sp 120's I bought, the native fans go 1000-2500, and the SP 120's go about 2000, and they're on top, if they were the same the 120's on top should be going faster. What fans come with the H100i? I can't find this out.
> 
> And OMG, I should stick a Delta fan 120 mm above the 80 mm fan on my side panel. So 4 delta 120's at 40 bucks a piece. Only 160 for fans. Damn, this is not gonna happen for quite some time lol.
> 
> But I will buy one pretty soon so I can see if I like it. Any comments? What a Delta 120 sounds like on low power? I like when fans are loud, just not when I don't want them to be.


You're In as well!







slap your new Sig on!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ????????????
> 
> Not enough posts in the delidded thread, usually pages, today just a few posts.
> 
> Omega man?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good luck with the new card Val, what kinda pot are you getting?
> Tek 9 Fat worked pretty well for me, but want to try the slim to see if it bugs the memory less.


I want a good one but not sure really what one to get....


----------



## stickg1

it's a thermal tape, it lost all of its tackiness when I peeled them off to check the IC's. And I had actually planned on painting them but decided it would be a waste of time because from a top view it's such a thin piece of metal that you would never actually see it. I might be in the market for some of this thermal tape if I ever sell this kit.

But to be honest this 2200MHz 9-9-9-27-1t 1.65v is pretty boss for the $45 I spent on them. Was brand new from Newegg before the DDR3 prices shot up.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> it's a thermal tape, it lost all of its tackiness when I peeled them off to check the IC's. And I had actually planned on painting them but decided it would be a waste of time because from a top view it's such a thin piece of metal that you would never actually see it. I might be in the market for some of this thermal tape if I ever sell this kit.
> 
> But to be honest this 2200MHz 9-9-9-27-1t 1.65v is pretty boss for the $45 I spent on them. Was brand new from Newegg before the DDR3 prices shot up.


That is good speed & timings for the price. A few years back had to spend a small fortune to get memory that could do that, I've spent $400 + on a kit more than once to be able to run similar specs.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> No idea what your talking about but it seems like a daft idea to put a cpu in a freezer, I cant see it working afterwards...


...I think it is not a good idea to put 'either...' in a freezer


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not sure if the freezer is cold enough. Cold does work though, for the corsair memory sticks that have the heatspreaders glued on, people trying to remove the spreaders were ripping the ICs right off the PCB, but 2 minutes at -196° & the heatspreaders will fall off on their own.
> 
> As for condensation concern, just make sure the temp is equalized & the cpu is dry before powering it. You can drop a cpu in a glass of water & as long as it is completely dried before powering it, nothing will get hurt.


...not a freezer question, but related: When do I have to start worrying about condensation ? I'm working on something whereby one tube leading to the CPU will be colder than ambient by about 5 - 10 C...theoretically, I guess that 'anything' colder than ambient can produce moisture, but in reality, is there some sort of magic delta ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

When you go below dew point...gotta watch that.


----------



## Matt607

I'll join the club asap...waiting on Sidewinder's package
Liquid Ultra ftw.


----------



## FtW 420

There is a bit of a delta but not sure just how much, a couple degrees below ambient may not get any condensation, but by about 10° difference condensation can be a concern.


----------



## MKHunt

Depends on relative humidity too. With an arid 10-20% humidity here the delta is much larger than say, Florida. Look up the dew point for your area (changes hourly) but that's when condensation will form. Here the dew point is 13F at the moment.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There is a bit of a delta but not sure just how much, a couple degrees below ambient may not get any condensation, but by about 10° difference condensation can be a concern.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> When you go below dew point...gotta watch that.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Depends on relative humidity too. With an arid 10-20% humidity here the delta is much larger than say, Florida. Look up the dew point for your area (changes hourly) but that's when condensation will form. Here the dew point is 13F at the moment.


...thanks guys







- I'll watch the dew point for sure...temp in my place is usually 19-21 C with windows always open and 'not arid' (...am right by an inlet of the Pacific)...theweathernetwork / here i come


----------



## Hokies83

How the crap am i getting 18 = 25 FPS in Crysis 3 XD getting 50 = 60% gpu use.. lol guess Amd needs some new drivers for that game? Ill wait

Off to the new tomb raider then


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...thanks guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I'll watch the dew point for sure...temp in my place is usually 19-21 C with windows always open and 'not arid' (...am right by an inlet of the Pacific)...theweathernetwork / here i come


An RH meter is handy too, I have a cheapo thermometer that reads RH as well near the benching area. I check the RH before starting to get an idea if I can get away with light insulation, or if I have to pack in the shop towel.
Right now only 15% RH here, I would get some ice on the pot if I was frozen, but it wouldn't end up looking like the board got caught in a blizzard by the time I'm done.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How the crap am i getting 18 = 25 FPS in Crysis 3 XD getting 50 = 60% gpu use.. lol guess Amd needs some new drivers for that game? Ill wait
> 
> Off to the new tomb raider then


Can't resist...

Cough, gaming? Cough wasting those gpu clock cycles cough


----------



## Hokies83

Cough Mass DDOS attacks last 2 days Cough


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> An RH meter is handy too, I have a cheapo thermometer that reads RH as well near the benching area. I check the RH before starting to get an idea if I can get away with light insulation, or if I have to pack in the shop towel.
> Right now only 15% RH here, I would get some ice on the pot if I was frozen, but it wouldn't end up looking like the board got caught in a blizzard by the time I'm done.
> Can't resist...
> 
> Cough, gaming? Cough wasting those gpu clock cycles cough


...I got an idea: Hokies can buy NVidia, no ? (jjjuuuuust kidding !)

...if condensation does get to be an issue, I guess I have to put on that Neoprene sleeve after all I bought...it is just so, so , so... ugly


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I got an idea: Hokies can buy NVidia, no ? (jjjuuuuust kidding !)
> 
> ...if condensation does get to be an issue, I guess I have to put on that Neoprene sleeve after all I bought...it is just so, so , so... ugly


buy moar tubing to put around the sleeve. Nothing says srsbsns like 2" tubing.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I got an idea: Hokies can buy NVidia, no ? (jjjuuuuust kidding !)
> 
> ...if condensation does get to be an issue, I guess I have to put on that Neoprene sleeve after all I bought...it is just so, so , so... ugly


Ive had plenty of Nvidia.. Kepler is not worth it they suck. Only titan is good and it is 500$ over priced.
Even it only gets 240 MH/S roughly = in power to a 7850...

And id think u would get no better results with my Settings as it seems to be " CPU bottleneck "


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> buy moar tubing to put around the sleeve. Nothing says srsbsns like 2" tubing.


I don't think they make 2'' bloodred Advanced LRT tubing, sadly...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> And id think u would get no better results with my Settings as it seems to be " CPU bottleneck "


...you need to check out Virtual Machines with solid underlying hardware - 16 cores /32 threads dedicated to Crysis 3 ought to do it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...you need to check out Virtual Machines with solid underlying hardware - 16 cores /32 threads dedicated to Crysis 3 ought to do it


Game patch and driver opts do it to.

I got other games to play no biggie.


----------



## Joa3d43

...and now for something compltely different...

...got some 3970X BIOS settings downloaded I like to take a look at, but it is in " .CMO' format...after some hunting around, found a program (FileviewPro) that claims to do it but I keep on getting error messages about Bolian this and that...what do you guys use to open CMO files ? Inquiring minds want to know ...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Game patch and driver opts do it to.
> 
> I got other games to play no biggie.


That game is kinda broken it seems...I played at a friend's place last Saturday. He got constant 55-60fps with a single 680 at stock and a 4.6ghz 2600k. 2x msaa 1920x1080 all the rest maxed. Then applied 4x msaa, got 45fps, 8x msaa 35fps. It always looked the same though, no picture change. 0 difference! lol
I've heard single player mode is bugged and uses a LOT more cpu than multi player. Try that to compare man.
And again, don't waste time with mhash, you want scrypt man. 30% better!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Cough Mass DDOS attacks last 2 days Cough


Ah, I was wondering what was up with the long poll thing...


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How the crap am i getting 18 = 25 FPS in Crysis 3 XD getting 50 = 60% gpu use.. lol guess Amd needs some new drivers for that game? Ill wait
> 
> Off to the new tomb raider then


Either that or a CPU bottleneck.


----------



## tw33k

Just de-lidded my new chip. Tried using a hammer but I think the bench had too much give in it and wasn't solid enough. I gave it a few good whacks but the noticed that the PCB on one corner had separated a tiny bit. My heart stopped. I figured if it was dead there was no harm in finishing the job so I used a razor (which only takes few seconds) Clened it up, added Liquid Pro to the die and top of the IHS. Thank goodness it booted and temps dropped 18c.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Just de-lidded my new chip. Tried using a hammer but I think the bench had too much give in it and wasn't solid enough. I gave it a few good whacks but the noticed that the PCB on one corner had separated a tiny bit. My heart stopped. I figured if it was dead there was no harm in finishing the job so I used a razor (which only takes few seconds) Clened it up, added Liquid Pro to the die and top of the IHS. Thank goodness it booted and temps dropped 18c.


LOng time no see!


----------



## tw33k

lol..I forgot about that. Yeah, haven't been online a lot lately but now my new test bench is up and running I'll be around a lot more


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I chose Nvidia for the drivers over the 7950....however playing world of tanks and it crashes so much - I had to downgrade to a lower driver version so that it stops crashing.


----------



## Desert Rat

I have been lowering my vcore for 4.6ghz and manage to go down to 1.36v from 1.4v. Before delidding it needed the extra vcore. It doesnt make sense to me but that is what I noticed.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> How the crap am i getting 18 = 25 FPS in Crysis 3 XD getting 50 = 60% gpu use.. lol guess Amd needs some new drivers for that game? Ill wait
> 
> Off to the new tomb raider then


Really?? I get a constant 60fps with a couple drops down to 55fps with everything maxed and 4x MSAA with my two 7950's. Something is wrong there. What drivers are you using? Do you have ULPS disabled? Are you using unofficial overclocking mode?

and what do you mean Mass DDOS? With bitmining? I've been mining with minimal problems. I actually got .006BTC - .007BTC for each round all night. Maybe it's because they weren't letting Mr. Hokies suck up all the BTC


----------



## Hokies83

Prolly the 8x MSAA @ 2560x1440 doing it. Still Cpu bottleneck .


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Think I'm going to drive over to Boston to add to the support. This is really so sad. I can't believe Obama is coming to visit us! I think it's too late to get into the cathedral, but I need to visit my aunt in the hospital.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Prolly the 8x MSAA @ 2560x1440 doing it. Still Cpu bottleneck .


Ohh yea that would do it ha. I personally see absolutely no difference between 4x and 8x MSAA so I just stick with 4x. You play on two monitors?


----------



## Hokies83

FPS games i play on the 120hz 1080i monitor Eye candy games i play on the 2560x1440 monitor.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I need to get myself a 1440p


----------



## ivanlabrie

I want an ips 120hz 1440p and two 7970s


----------



## bmw477

I just received a strange package in the mail. A set of 6 Gillette Super Thin Double Edged razor blades and a syringe labled Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra. What should I do with these?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I want an ips 120hz 1440p and two 7970s


this is exactly what I want.
But....the price....oh hell no.
probably £300 per screen?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bmw477*
> 
> I just received a strange package in the mail. A set of 6 Gillette Super Thin Double Edged razor blades and a syringe labled Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra. What should I do with these?


Shave......your temps


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bmw477*
> 
> I just received a strange package in the mail. A set of 6 Gillette Super Thin Double Edged razor blades and a syringe labled Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra. What should I do with these?


Ummmm.... dude it's pretty obvious. Shave those prickly hairs off your face and use the Liquid Ultra as after-shave. That way they will NEVER grow back


----------



## bmw477

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Ummmm.... dude it's pretty obvious. Shave those prickly hairs off your face and use the Liquid Ultra as after-shave. That way they will NEVER grow back


Yeah, my buddy told me you guys would know what to do with those items. I plan on putting my 3770k, er, I mean my face under the knife this weekend. Just hope it wakes up afterwards.


----------



## Hokies83

Just do the Vise wood hammer method safer it is on page 1 op.

Holy Jesus....

Tomb Raider maxxed out at 2560x1440 with 4x smaa Is using almost 6GB of Vram LoL i feel sorry for Nvidia ppl with this game XD

It is loaded all 3 7950s at 100% but i am pulling off 50fps = 60 fps With 4x SMAA. it looks even better then Crysis 3 does.

Im running my gaming overclocks.. which are not the cards Max i think i can using my mining overclocks and maybe pull off a steady 60FPS.


----------



## lilchronic

2560x 1440 8xmsaa in crysis lol 27.FPS


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just do the Vise wood hammer method safer it is on page 1 op.
> 
> Holy Jesus....
> 
> Tomb Raider maxxed out at 2560x1440 with 4x smaa Is using almost 6GB of Vram LoL i feel sorry for Nvidia ppl with this game XD
> 
> It is loaded all 3 7950s at 100% but i am pulling off 50fps = 60 fps With 4x SMAA. it looks even better then Crysis 3 does.
> 
> Im running my gaming overclocks.. which are not the cards Max i think i can using my mining overclocks and maybe pull off a steady 60FPS.


Really? Hmm I may have to get it.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Just do the Vise wood hammer method safer it is on page 1 op.
> 
> Holy Jesus....
> 
> Tomb Raider maxxed out at 2560x1440 with 4x smaa Is using almost 6GB of Vram LoL i feel sorry for Nvidia ppl with this game XD
> 
> It is loaded all 3 7950s at 100% but i am pulling off 50fps = 60 fps With 4x SMAA. it looks even better then Crysis 3 does.
> 
> Im running my gaming overclocks.. which are not the cards Max i think i can using my mining overclocks and maybe pull off a steady 60FPS.


6gb of Vram? Are you using 7970's? I thought you had 7950's?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 6gb of Vram? Are you using 7970's? I thought you had 7950's?


it will load on your physical memory


----------



## chronicfx

I have to agree. I think Tomb Raider looks better than crysis 3. Although both are stunners at 2560x1440 maxed out.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have to agree. I think Tomb Raider looks better than crysis 3. Although both are stunners at 2560x1440 maxed out.


crysis 3 all the way, The reflections of the water on the walls looks sick thats my favorite part


----------



## lilchronic

i dont like tomb raider that much i miss the old one where you can jump backwars doing backflips and shooting you dual Desert Eages


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 2560x 1440 8xmsaa in crysis lol 27.FPS


I get bout the same Fps with 3 7950s Crysis 3 runs like poo on amd cards atm even tho it is an amd game.

http://s792.photobucket.com/user/hokies83/media/TombRaider2013-04-1812-47-22-26_zpsfff159ae.png.html

http://s792.photobucket.com/user/hokies83/media/TombRaider2013-04-1812-47-47-34_zps458f53d0.png.html


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I don't think that Crysis 3 runs bad on AMD cards. I'm pretty impressed that I can get 60fps with everything maxed and 4x MSAA. Then again, I am playing on a 1080i monitor. Tomb Raider does look really good, but I think I agree with lilchronic. Those water reflections are beastly and the terrain is great too. My favorite is how smooth all of the interiors on the buildings look. I've never seen anything like it. Definetly the most amazing looking game I've every played. So happy I can play it without a single hiccup


----------



## Hokies83

Crysis 3 does look great but after playing both my vote goes to tomb raider.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I get bout the same Fps with 3 7950s Crysis 3 runs like poo on amd cards atm even tho it is an amd game.
> 
> http://s792.photobucket.com/user/hokies83/media/TombRaider2013-04-1812-47-22-26_zpsfff159ae.png.html
> 
> http://s792.photobucket.com/user/hokies83/media/TombRaider2013-04-1812-47-47-34_zps458f53d0.png.html


I was getting a solid pegged 45 fps using the frame limiter and radeon pro with crysis 3.. Something not right lilchronic. I dont remember having any dips at all really.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I was getting a solid pegged 45 fps using the frame limiter and radeon pro with crysis 3.. Something not right lilchronic. I dont remember having any dips at all really.


maxed out @ 2560x1440 8x MSAA? i dont know i did change it to 8x MSAA while i was in the game maybe that messed it up?
also you have two 7970's should be 5-10 fps better then what i have.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I want an ips 120hz 1440p and two 7970s


Not quite&#8230;
I need a 2560x1600 30" IPS that you can calibrate to true color, 120hz, thin, light, never gets hot, no light bleed, deep blacks, and costs less than my hot, overpriced NEC 30 inchers. I think I might have to wait awhile for that.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Not quite&#8230;
> I need a 2560x1600 30" IPS that you can calibrate to true color, 120hz, thin, light, never gets hot, no light bleed, deep blacks, and costs less than my hot, overpriced NEC 30 inchers. I think I might have to wait awhile for that.


ahhh the dream!


----------



## inedenimadam

You guys are crazy...even with my glasses on, the difference between 720p and anything higher is virtually undetectable to me. But then again, I am sitting 14ft. From a projection on a wall as opposed to 18" away from a screen. Lag, or low frame rates are my pet peeves, they hurt a game more than resolution.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You guys are crazy...even with my glasses on, the difference between 720p and anything higher is virtually undetectable to me. But then again, *I am sitting 14ft. From a projection on a wall* as opposed to 18" away from a screen. Lag, or low frame rates are my pet peeves, they hurt a game more than resolution.


That could very well be your problem









I sit about 3' from my monitors and at that distance 720p looks horrible. I'm generally happy with anything above 900p though


----------



## dr/owned

I sit arms length from my monitor, and 27" fills my vision nicely. I like to sit really close so when I lean in it's like 1.5 feet away from my face.


----------



## lilchronic

well since we are on the subject, i sit about 4' away from my 42'' sony bravia 1080p tv. i put my feet up relax, keyboard on my lap, little table for my mouse


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I want an ips 120hz 1440p and two 7970s


...might as well wait for the 4K UHD monitors (essentially twice 1080p's resolution @ 3840 pixels × 2160 pixels, 8.3 megapixels)...the first ones are out for under $5k, but their refresh rate is lousy...once they are available in volume @ 120 Hz, it will be a whole new ballgame, including vid-card requirements...until 8K UHD beckons


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You guys are crazy...even with my glasses on, the difference between 720p and anything higher is virtually undetectable to me. But then again, I am sitting 14ft. From a projection on a wall as opposed to 18" away from a screen. Lag, or low frame rates are my pet peeves, they hurt a game more than resolution.


I can easily tell the difference between 1080p and 720p - all I have to do is switch on my Xbox to see the difference between the resolutions.
I can also tell the difference between plasma, lcd and LED.
I can finally tell the difference between 15FPS and 80FPS too.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I can easily tell the difference between 1080p and 720p - all I have to do is switch on my Xbox to see the difference between the resolutions.
> I can also tell the difference between plasma, lcd and LED.
> I can finally tell the difference between 15FPS and 80FPS too.


even going from 60 hz to 75hz is great so smooth cant imagine what 120hz would be like

i want to get a catleap monitor and oc to like 90hz i would be fine with that since most games cant really hold 120FPS


----------



## Joa3d43

FYI *CL- U* liquid metal... 2 months later

...as part of a the pre-cursor build of the deskputer which involves somewhat 'siamesed' 2x ROG boards (pics soon), I opened up the delidded 3770K @ the ROG Max V Extr. -

- the CL Ultra liquid metal which I had applied on both the CPU die and on top of the IHS over two months earlier was still fairly compliant and had not pumped out, even after plenty of heat cycles and some heavy HWBot record benching...all surfaces cleaned up nicely with Isopropanol, with the Nickel on the water block showing just a bit of 'cloudiness' where the CL U contact was...


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You guys are crazy...even with my glasses on, the difference between 720p and anything higher is virtually undetectable to me. But then again, *I am sitting 14ft. From a projection on a wall* as opposed to 18" away from a screen. Lag, or low frame rates are my pet peeves, they hurt a game more than resolution.
> 
> 
> 
> That could very well be your problem
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I sit about 3' from my monitors and at that distance 720p looks horrible. I'm generally happy with anything above 900p though
Click to expand...

I am fully willing to admit that I might think different if I had the hardware you guys do. I wonder if there has been any study about how much further the science behind resolution will go before the human eye cannot tell the difference? Like a max resolution for human consumption under a traditional aspect ratios.

Edit: Google is my friend....your eye has a resolution of 10600x7000 (74megapixels) at 20"
http://www.clarkvision.com/imagedetail/eye-resolution.html


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> even going from 60 hz to 75hz is great so smooth cant imagine what 120hz would be like
> 
> i want to get a catleap monitor and oc to like 90hz i would be fine with that since most games cant really hold 120FPS


I honestly wouldn't be able to tell you the difference of anything 80hz+ to be honest.
That said I haven't been able to game solidly at 120FPS - so maybe a lack of exposure and experience is what could be lacking.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> even going from 60 hz to 75hz is great so smooth cant imagine what 120hz would be like
> 
> i want to get a catleap monitor and oc to like 90hz i would be fine with that since most games cant really hold 120FPS


...the 120Hz can actually be perceived by some folks, but more importantly,it becomes very useful in 3D


----------



## ivanlabrie

Less input lag, no motion blur, good colors...I want an FW900 lol

I actually game on a 1280x960 CRT, colors are godly, 85hz refresh rate is nice but res is too low.
I'll probably get a proper monitor later on. No cash for that, I'd rather get more radeons and benching gear.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

A smile to people's faces - a new shirt I bought


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol xD

That goes against TOS man...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Less input lag, no motion blur, good colors...I want an FW900 lol
> 
> I actually game on a 1280x960 CRT, colors are godly, 85hz refresh rate is nice but res is too low.
> I'll probably get a proper monitor later on. No cash for that, I'd rather get more radeons and benching gear.


^^^ + ...modern LEDs are 'getting there', but the old CRTs were unbeatable for colours and response time - unfortunately, they weighed a ton (could be over 110 pounds), took up a lot of valuable desk space and may have had some 'interesting emissions' towards your brain if you sat 'close'...I kept a Samsung HD 41 inch hybrid which is 16x9 CRT w/HDMI etc, but 'not practical' on a desk...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol xD
> 
> That goes against TOS man...


How so?
It is a picture....of me being happy of my de-lid - there.
Does that now fit the TOS? LOL


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> How so?
> It is a picture....of me being happy of my de-lid - there.
> Does that now fit the TOS? LOL


lol just kidding...








Nice shirt brah


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Im sorry are we on a forum or are you trying to hint at the size of your male endowment?
> 
> thanks for the help bro


Only if they said the size of your overclock would decrease significantly by putting your cpu in the freezer


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> A smile to people's faces - a new shirt I bought


Looks like you need this shirt lol.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Less input lag, no motion blur, good colors...I want an FW900 lol
> 
> I actually game on a 1280x960 CRT, colors are godly, 85hz refresh rate is nice but res is too low.
> I'll probably get a proper monitor later on. No cash for that, I'd rather get more radeons and benching gear.


I have one of the very best Crt monitors sitting in my Closet 1600x1200 XD still sells for 700$.. tried to do a free give away 2x nobody wants it lol.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> maxed out @ 2560x1440 8x MSAA? i dont know i did change it to 8x MSAA while i was in the game maybe that messed it up?
> also you have two 7970's should be 5-10 fps better then what i have.


I never run 8x i run 2x and you wont see a single jaggy at 1440


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol just kidding...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice shirt brah


hehehe - who knows, you're probably right some sort of ridiculous TOS has been broken with that pic....








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Looks like you need this shirt lol.
> 
> I have one of the very best Crt monitors sitting in my Closet 1600x1200 XD still sells for 700$.. tried to do a free give away 2x nobody wants it lol.[/QUOTE]
> 
> seriously - I don't put on weight [IMG alt="frown.gif"]https://www.overclock.net/images/smilies/frown.gif
> I'm like 0% fat.
> 
> ohhhhhhh I should go to a girl and say: "hey ladies, forget activia yoghurt, I'm fat free"


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Looks like you need this shirt lol.
> 
> 
> I have one of the very best Crt monitors sitting in my Closet 1600x1200 XD still sells for 700$.. tried to do a free give away 2x nobody wants it lol.


xD

Hokies, here's your next board.
The FW900 was 1920x1440 or so...









 (dream setup for me)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> even going from 60 hz to 75hz is great so smooth cant imagine what 120hz would be like
> 
> i want to get a catleap monitor and oc to like 90hz i would be fine with that since most games cant really hold 120FPS


My catleap doesn't OC. At all....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...the 120Hz can actually be perceived by some folks, but more importantly,it becomes very useful in 3D


It's even part of a pcmark 05 tweak now, when used in conjunction with an older tweak.
Why I hate pcmark now, you have to tweak the 10,000 tweaks to be competitive....
If anyone saw MikeCDM break the pcmark WR live this weekend on the OCN stream, I wouldn't doubt pcmark tweaking set off the swearing streak that made them shut the sound off.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol xD
> 
> That goes against TOS man...


Some pics skirt it, never even got warned for my bong cooler pic.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Looks like you need this shirt lol.


Saw a PETA shirt I wanted once, People for the Eating of Tasty Animals.

But agreed, TD needz burgers! Extra cheese with greasy fries. Couple years of that & he'll catch up to me...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> But agreed, TD needz burgers! Extra cheese with greasy fries. Couple years of that & he'll catch up to me...


hey hey you guys are just jealous of that 6 pack!
In all honesty, my height + weight, help me with Taekwondo competitions


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hey hey you guys are just jealous of that 6 pack!
> In all honesty, my height + weight, help me with Taekwondo competitions


Damn 6 pack of Kool Aid.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn 6 pack of Kool Aid.


I HAD to google that LOL


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hey hey you guys are just jealous of that 6 pack!
> In all honesty, my height + weight, help me with Taekwondo competitions


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn 6 pack of Kool Aid.


lol








I'm skinny too, getting bigger slowly...eat healthy fats and proteins and lift bro. It'll help you kick even more arse!


----------



## Hokies83

Ive posted my Picture in here 3-4x nobody ever commented on it tho


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm skinny too, getting bigger slowly...eat healthy fats and proteins and lift bro. It'll help you kick even more arse!


But I already won a silver medal in the student nationals...with a sprained ankle...that 1 month later still hasn't healed...








But yeah - I do eat healthy.
When I did go to the gym (nowadays I do only TKD and thus I'm knackered after it) - I put on over 8KG - pure muscle in under 6 months. I was very happy








Might need to start what I was doing before in the gym.

Might seem petty, but I used to be able to lift (via two dumbbells, in each arm, in the bench position) only 8.5KG per arm.
In under 6 months, I went to 23KG per arm.

Dumbbells are infinitely harder to do than a bench-press.
I'm no gym guy though!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive posted my Picture in here 3-4x nobody ever commented on it tho


It's cuz you nor your rig is sexy. Innit like.
(But your son is utterly adorable)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ...Saw a PETA shirt I wanted once, People for the Eating of Tasty Animals.


LoL







...I have seen the shorter version as well (PETA = People Eat Tasty Animals), but my GF is a paid-up member of PETA so that won't be part of my wardrobe...I go deer hunting with friends every year (hey, this is BC), and she tries to make me feel guilty because "...YOU KILLED BAMBI"...I still have some in the freezer, come to think of it....!


----------



## Obi Wan

Well, I finally got up the nerve to hack up my i7-3770K! 1st, I wan to say thank you for all of the helpful info and the time that people put into well laid out instructions and videos.
I had no trouble and everything went smoothly. Once I started on it, I just kept calm and everything went well after that. I guess the only real bugger was when I got to the point where I was attempting to re-install the IHS back onto the PCB once installed into the mobo. Trying to get everything lined up and the mounting bracket closed was a little tricky. I used Coolabratories Liquid Ultra between the Die and the IHS. I used Prolimatech PK1 between the IHS and my waterblock.





As far as results go, (ambient temps @21c)
- My idle temps (@4.6ghz / 1.24v) haven't changed but only 3c-4c down to @30c-32c but before the delidding there was such a huge difference between my coolest core and the hottest core and now it's nearly even across all cores. I stll do not like these idle temps but I suppose I can live with it. I am going to try mounting my fans on the rad differently to see if there would make any difference. Maybe also adding fans for a push/pull setup vs just push using as exhaust.
- Max temps under full Prime95 burn is where this procedure seems to shine. I was sitting max [email protected] 90c after an hr during blend torture test and the hottest after delidding during same test never got above 70c. Now THAT made it worth the trouble (and stress) of the whole delidding process. Overall I am happy with the results. It leaves me additional overclocking headroom if I so desire and didn't cost a dime well, unless I would have screwed something up... but, I didn't. So, I'm a pretty happy guy.


----------



## Ali Man

Looking good man, so 4.6GHz @ 1.24V is completely stable?


----------



## Obi Wan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Looking good man, so 4.6GHz @ 1.24V is completely stable?


Well, after 10 passes of IBT set to very high and Prime95 blend test for 3 1/2 hrs (I had to stop, something came up) everything seems ok.
I will attempt to run Prime95 for longer this weekend becasue I will be off so I will get a better feel for it then. I used to go max about 6-8 hrs and never had any troubles once I passed that but What do you suggest onPrime95, 6, 8, 10, 12, 24 hrs? What are people doing these days?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obi Wan*
> 
> Well, after 10 passes of IBT set to very high and Prime95 blend test for 3 1/2 hrs (I had to stop, something came up) everything seems ok.
> I will attempt to run Prime95 for longer this weekend becasue I will be off so I will get a better feel for it then. I used to go max about 6-8 hrs and never had any troubles once I passed that but What do you suggest onPrime95, 6, 8, 10, 12, 24 hrs? What are people doing these days?


...Congrats on your delid







I use Intel's XTU which has a built-in stress test program, including for IMC / memory...in the same ball park as Prime95 but more modern and also uses a bit more watts / higher temps....you can set XTU for up to 30 days (!)...but 12 hrs should tell you plenty.


----------



## Obi Wan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Congrats on your delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I use Intel's XTU which has a built-in stress test program, including for IMC / memory...in the same ball park as Prime95 but more modern and also uses a bit more watts / higher temps....you can set XTU for up to 30 days (!)...but 12 hrs should tell you plenty.


Thank you Sir! I'll give it a try.


----------



## shamanik1320

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Depends on the Delta...you don't want those man. They get damaged when being shipped cause of the dual ball bearings.
> Plus not all undervolt well without making ticking noises.
> Get an fdb or hdb fan, either Panaflos 120x38, modern pwm fans like Gelid Silent 12's or Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP-15's...


Thanks for the advice. I will definitely check those out! That's unfortunate to hear about the fans, they do sound like they aren't your typical fans and thus probably do need extra special care in packaging. I'll definitely do my research before deciding.

Also, I want to add, what is with these fan names??? They sound so artistic and pussified. I don't care if that thing is that loud, why not a name like "The Horrifier" or "The Mangler", or "Dynamite Eardrum Implosifier", I don't understand, do companies think we'll shy away from a powerful image of a fan?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obi Wan*
> 
> Well, I finally got up the nerve to hack up my i7-3770K! 1st, I wan to say thank you for all of the helpful info and the time that people put into well laid out instructions and videos.
> y.


I sense a disturbance in the force.
BACK TO delidding talk!?
MADNESS!









Congratz bro and welcome to the most off topic thread you'll ever encounter.

EDIT:
And back on topic - I should note that I may be no Jedi in the real world. But I'm certainly a master of the troll.
*swishes away with his imaginary lightsabers* (Yeah I'm too cool for only one)


----------



## Obi Wan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I sense a disturbance in the force.
> BACK TO delidding talk!?
> MADNESS!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratz bro and welcome to the most off topic thread you'll ever encounter.
> 
> EDIT:
> And back on topic - I should note that I may be no Jedi in the real world. But I'm certainly a master of the troll.
> *swishes away with his imaginary lightsabers* (Yeah I'm too cool for only one)


Yeah, I got on here earlier to post my results and there was talk about t-shirts and fast food... I was like "hmmmm, maybe I clicked the wrong thread". lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obi Wan*
> 
> Yeah, I got on here earlier to post my results and there was talk about t-shirts and fast food... I was like "hmmmm, maybe I clicked the wrong thread". lol


hehe - when I read my emails and notifications - I'm now accustom to saying: "Yup this is the thread"


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Thanks for the advice. I will definitely check those out! That's unfortunate to hear about the fans, they do sound like they aren't your typical fans and thus probably do need extra special care in packaging. I'll definitely do my research before deciding.
> 
> Also, I want to add, what is with these fan names??? They sound so artistic and pussified. I don't care if that thing is that loud, why not a name like "The Horrifier" or "The Mangler", or "Dynamite Eardrum Implosifier", I don't understand, do companies think we'll shy away from a powerful image of a fan?


Most companies make strong fans for servers, hence the robotic part names.








I have two 5300rpm 220cfm Nidec 120x38 fans, which ROCK! Buuuuut, one of them got a damaged bearing when flying from Israel to Argentina. So I can't reccomend buying 2bb fans anymore, not from abroad or shipped via postage.


----------



## Hokies83

Meh fans that ppl down the street can hear.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shamanik1320*
> 
> Thanks for the advice. I will definitely check those out! That's unfortunate to hear about the fans, they do sound like they aren't your typical fans and thus probably do need extra special care in packaging. I'll definitely do my research before deciding.
> 
> Also, I want to add, what is with these fan names??? They sound so artistic and pussified. I don't care if that thing is that loud, why not a name like "The Horrifier" or "The Mangler", or "Dynamite Eardrum Implosifier", I don't understand, do companies think we'll shy away from a powerful image of a fan?


I agree! I like lots of airflow & don't want a 'gentle typhoon', I want a 'raging hurricane'!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh fans that ppl down the street can hear.


I still think you should use deltas. Put a little seat on top of the rig & let your boy drive it around the house.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I agree! I like lots of airflow & don't want a 'gentle typhoon', I want a 'raging hurricane'!
> I still think you should use deltas. Put a little seat on top of the rig & let your boy drive it around the house.


...or mount them on a swivel so he can take off like a helicopter - that would be a cool toy

...FTW - better get benching done quick with this weather...miserable now (6 C, rain w a few flakes in it) but it is supposed to get warm and sunny all next week...17 C+


----------



## lilchronic

ok so i need some advice i got this voltage meter but i dont no how to use it or where to connect to mobo. any help











ok so the black cord is the Gnd right and the red goes on the cpu spot?
but what setting do i set the volt meter to to read voltage ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obi Wan*
> 
> Thank you Sir! I'll give it a try.


...and who is this 'Sir' guy anyways ?







...btw. your chip looks pretty good with the speed / vCore...a very quick test that will tell you 'roughly' where your chip's 'speed wall' is to run Cinebench 11.5 / processor test ...as you increase speed and watch for the required vcore to pass it...this assumes a decent cooling system and is not the be-all / end-all but I use that method to bin chips when I have a choice of more than one and want to quickly find out into which one to invest more time...


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obi Wan*
> 
> Well, after 10 passes of IBT set to very high and Prime95 blend test for 3 1/2 hrs (I had to stop, something came up) everything seems ok.
> I will attempt to run Prime95 for longer this weekend becasue I will be off so I will get a better feel for it then. I used to go max about 6-8 hrs and never had any troubles once I passed that but What do you suggest onPrime95, 6, 8, 10, 12, 24 hrs? What are people doing these days?


Prime95 barely tells you anything about stability. I personally use Arauna Ray Tracing benchmark for checking stability by running it for a few hours.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...or mount them on a swivel so he can take off like a helicopter - that would be a cool toy
> 
> ...FTW - better get benching done quick with this weather...miserable now (6 C, rain w a few flakes in it) but it is supposed to get warm and sunny all next week...17 C+


But time...
I will need to get the water chiller project running again for multi gpu benching in the warm.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ok so i need some advice i got this voltage meter but i dont no how to use it or where to connect to mobo. any help


You have the probes in the right spots on the meter, set it to V on the left side of off, 2000M (2v), & will have to check the manual or look closer on the board to see which pins in the header are for what voltage. There should be little plugs & wires in the box so you can stick the ends of the probes in them & not have to hold the probes.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> But time...
> I will need to get the water chiller project running again for multi gpu benching in the warm.
> You have the probes in the right spots on the meter, set it to V on the left side of off, 2000M (2v), & will have to check the manual or look closer on the board to see which pins in the header are for what voltage. There should be little plugs & wires in the box so you can stick the ends of the probes in them & not have to hold the probes.


dont think i got that, dude i bought it from i think he kept it along with the mobo stand off's








yea i didnt get that thing but i did check my voltages and there all spot on with what cpu z and what my bios reads


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> dont think i got that, dude i bought it from i think he kept it along with the mobo stand off's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea i didnt get that thing but i did check my voltages and there all spot on with what cpu z and what my bios reads


Ah, you got it, I was looking around & found this


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hey guys, read this: http://www.overclockers.com/nvidias-fcat-gpu-testing-pursuing/

Summarizes some of my thoughts about the whole runt frame thing...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hey guys, read this: http://www.overclockers.com/nvidias-fcat-gpu-testing-pursuing/
> 
> Summarizes some of my thoughts about the whole runt frame thing...


Fcat is Nvidia Program XD lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Fcat is Nvidia Program XD lol.


Exactly...read the article. Settles the thing.
I'm seeing a lot of reviewers showing mining temps and results, I like that.









How do you guys think the Sapphire ref 7950s would work on air with liquid pro on die? Might get one, and then two or three more lol


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> FYI *CL- U* liquid metal... 2 months later
> 
> ...as part of a the pre-cursor build of the deskputer which involves somewhat 'siamesed' 2x ROG boards (pics soon), I opened up the delidded 3770K @ the ROG Max V Extr. -
> 
> - the CL Ultra liquid metal which I had applied on both the CPU die and on top of the IHS over two months earlier was still fairly compliant and had not pumped out, even after plenty of heat cycles and some heavy HWBot record benching...all surfaces cleaned up nicely with Isopropanol, with the Nickel on the water block showing just a bit of 'cloudiness' where the CL U contact was...


Did the CLU remove the letters from the CPU IHS ? I want to put some on my 3930 chip.


----------



## chronicfx

Did I read somewhere June or July they think they will have the whole runt frame thing solved in a driver?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Exactly should be when the 7990 launches...so they said. That affects only xfire noticeably.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Did the CLU remove the letters from the CPU IHS ? I want to put some on my 3930 chip.


...letters were already gone prior from light lapping...but before, when CL U had been on for just a couple of weeks and I made some adjustments (before lapping), letters were still there after a gentle cleaning with Isopropanol


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> But time...
> I will need to get the water chiller project running again for multi gpu benching in the warm.
> You have the probes in the right spots on the meter, set it to V on the left side of off, 2000M (2v), & will have to check the manual or look closer on the board to see which pins in the header are for what voltage. There should be little plugs & wires in the box so you can stick the ends of the probes in them & not have to hold the probes.
> 
> 
> 
> dont think i got that, dude i bought it from i think he kept it along with the mobo stand off's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yea i didnt get that thing but i did check my voltages and there all spot on with what cpu z and what my bios reads
Click to expand...

I said it before...(our) mobo is bang on with the voltage regulation, idle and full load. ASRock put out a good product. Let me check my box to see if I got the "official" voltage probes, I never bothered really looking through all the bags since I was just doing a swap with my Gigabyte board so already had everything I needed.

EDIT: Yeah no cables. Just 3 sata cables, 2 molex to something adapters, cd, manual, motherboard plastic bench standoffs, and the backplate/usb3 thing.

I just used these: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/9140 (ebay has them cheaper if you search "female jumper wire"). Plug in nicely into the mobo, and then I push in a male jumper cable that I clip my multimeter onto.


----------



## tw33k

This OC Formula is tricky when it comes to offset voltage (well mine is at least) I'm getting a DMM as soon as I can. Fixed voltage is solid but offset fluctuates way too much. I managed to get 4.7GHz stable @ 1.272v but it jumps from as low as 1.256v up to 1.280v! I've never seen anything like it. Trying to get 4.8GHz stable now. I was hoping to get it stable >1.3v but it's looking unlikely.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> This OC Formula is tricky when it comes to offset voltage (well mine is at least) I'm getting a DMM as soon as I can. Fixed voltage is solid but offset fluctuates way too much. I managed to get 4.7GHz stable @ 1.272v but it jumps from as low as 1.256v up to 1.280v! I've never seen anything like it. Trying to get 4.8GHz stable now. I was hoping to get it stable >1.3v but it's looking unlikely.


You mean on offset and LLC at max you get those variations?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> This OC Formula is tricky when it comes to offset voltage (well mine is at least) I'm getting a DMM as soon as I can. Fixed voltage is solid but offset fluctuates way too much. I managed to get 4.7GHz stable @ 1.272v but it jumps from as low as 1.256v up to 1.280v! I've never seen anything like it. Trying to get 4.8GHz stable now. I was hoping to get it stable >1.3v but it's looking unlikely.


you seemed to have a pretty good chip booting 5ghz @1.3v
ive got 4.8 stable with offset mode easy 1.248v- 1.256v LLC1 with latest bios 2.0( voltage meter reads 1.249v-1.253v)









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> You mean on offset and LLC at max you get those variations?


Yes...that's what's happenning. Fixed voltage is steady but offset was all over the place. Got 4.8GHz stable and the voltage didn't jump around as much


CPU-Z

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you seemed to have a pretty good chip booting 5ghz @1.3v
> ive got 4.8 stable with offset mode easy 1.248v- 1.256v LLC1 with latest bios 2.0( voltage meter reads 1.249v-1.253v)


I sold that chip. This is new one


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Yes...that's what's happenning. Fixed voltage is steady but offset was all over the place. Got 4.8GHz stable and the voltage didn't jump around as much
> 
> 
> CPU-Z
> I sold that chip. This is new one


why


----------



## tw33k

4.8GHz @ 1.3v isn't bad


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> 4.8GHz @ 1.3v isn't bad


oh no thats good, i was just







cause u sold that awsome chip









and seems like you got another awsome chip a 3770k too


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> oh no thats good, i was just
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cause u sold that awsome chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and seems like you got another awsome chip a 3770k too


lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> If you needed monies you were better off doing what Hokies does and keeping such a glorious chip. I now hate you


It's not that I needed the money. The guy who bought it does LN2 benching. He'll get better use out of than I would


----------



## ivanlabrie

xD

I'm gonna try trixx 4.6 now to see if I can get higher clocks out of my card...910mhz core is getting boring.
May score a nice 775 board eventually, so I can bench my p4 631 and go for a 7ghz run.


----------



## plu2

Another hammer/vice success story:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







OCN name: plu2
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
ihs-TIM: Bare die
Mhz gained: None yet
OC after delid: 4,5Ghz
Temp drops: ~17C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2774978

Please note that I de-lidded the CPU and build a new custom liquid cooled loop around it immediately after, so the temp drops are somewhat not valid for the research ...
This test was done running the fans fixed at 600-750 RPM. I am sure I would get even better temps running the fans much faster...


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Another hammer/vice success story:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: plu2
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> ihs-TIM: Bare die
> Mhz gained: None yet
> OC after delid: 4,5Ghz
> Temp drops: ~17C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2774978
> 
> Please note that I de-lidded the CPU and build a new custom liquid cooled loop around it immediately after, so the temp drops are somewhat not valid for the research ...
> This test was done running the fans fixed at 600-750 RPM. I am sure I would get even better temps running the fans much faster...


Good stuff, so you're stable at 4.5Ghz @ 1.128V ?


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Yes...that's what's happenning. Fixed voltage is steady but offset was all over the place. Got 4.8GHz stable and the voltage didn't jump around as much


Yea that's a little odd, but not too odd as it's still an AsRock. Only a good few handful motherboards actually have decent LLC without too much variation from the set value.


----------



## plu2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Good stuff, so you're stable at 4.5Ghz @ 1.128V ?


Absolutely - no issues whatsoever in Prime95 or Intel Burn Test .
I guess I was lucky with my chip, which might also explain the rather low temp drops.

The only little thing that really doesn't bother me is that at idle Core 1 is ~10C hotter than Core 3 (and ~5C hotter than Core 2 and 4).
At load delta T between the cores are ~4-5C and Core 1 tends to be the coldest at load.


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Good stuff, so you're stable at 4.5Ghz @ 1.128V ?


Crackin chip there


----------



## Hokies83

And look at whats back in Stock...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128552&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-Motherboards%20-%20Intel-_-GIGABYTE-_-13128552&cm_sp=&AID=10440897&PID=4549763&SID=overclockdotnet-thr-rc-li-t-d-20


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I'm kind of regretting buying this Phantom 820. I'm having such a hard time planning a loop for this thing. I wish they designed it with some serious watercooling in mind. Do you guys think that a single ST30 360mm rad could efficiently cool my CPU and a monsta 480mm rad could efficiently cool three overclocked 7950's?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm kind of regretting buying this Phantom 820. I'm having such a hard time planning a loop for this thing. I wish they designed it with some serious watercooling in mind. Do you guys think that a single ST30 360mm rad could efficiently cool my CPU and a monsta 480mm rad could efficiently cool three overclocked 7950's?


LoL get a Mountain mods... there built for one reason and one reason only water cooling..


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL get a Mountain mods... there built for one reason and one reason only water cooling..


I really like the look of the Phantom and I'm far from rich so I really have to stick with this case as much as I don't want to. I'm sure I'll figure something out and I know I'm definetly doing an external 480 monsta rad so it will work out eventually. I just have to keep planning.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I really like the look of the Phantom and I'm far from rich so I really have to stick with this case as much as I don't want to. I'm sure I'll figure something out and I know I'm definetly doing an external 480 monsta rad so it will work out eventually. I just have to keep planning.


Yah u can put stuff on the outside.

But then again i only paid 230$ for my Mountain mods case lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey Hokies so I un-synced my two 7950's in afterburner and enabled voltage control and I was able to change the voltage of the TFIII to 1.3v, but I couldn't raise the voltage of the Sapphire, but I was able to undervolt the memory on both cards to 1.5v. I thought "voltage locked" means you can't change the voltage at all?


----------



## dr/owned

@Ravage,

You could do what I did and go for an external rad/pump. Get a 1x12 piece of wood and screw down as many rads as you want. Or buy the Mountain Mods water barrel thing.

Side rant: went looking for a replacement case because the 932 Haf Advanced is meh (side side rant: Newegg reviews are definitely inflated/filtered towards 5 eggs for everything, because it isn't a 5 egg case). I couldn't find a single case that met all my requirements.


----------



## lilchronic

im bout to get the h220 with the rad on the top then fit two of these rads next to each other on the front of my case with some delta fans.
then after that ill get some water blocks for my 670's









http://www.frozencpu.com/products/7142/ex-rad-128/Black_Ice_GTX_Xtreme_M184_Radiator_-_Black.html?tl=g30c95s759#blank
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/de92ffhisp.html


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I'm going to use this to mount the external 480 monsta









Koolance Radiator Mounting Bracket with Quick-Release - $45
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_457_335_982&products_id=25631


----------



## couchasault9001

quick question.

i'm at 4.6ghz on 1.31v. i can't get any multi above 46 stable. i've ran my voltage up to 1.38. anything above that becomes unstable again, but i still can't get any multi's to run above 46. llc didn't get me anywhere either. tried clearing cmos, i have the latest bios.

hottest core on 1.38v @ 4.6ghz id 64c after 10 hours of p95.

chip or mobo?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> quick question.
> 
> i'm at 4.6ghz on 1.31v. i can't get any multi above 46 stable. i've ran my voltage up to 1.38. anything above that becomes unstable again, but i still can't get any multi's to run above 46. llc didn't get me anywhere either. tried clearing cmos, i have the latest bios.
> 
> hottest core on 1.38v @ 4.6ghz id 64c after 10 hours of p95.
> 
> chip or mobo?


did u enable pll overvoltage?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> quick question.
> 
> i'm at 4.6ghz on 1.31v. i can't get any multi above 46 stable. i've ran my voltage up to 1.38. anything above that becomes unstable again, but i still can't get any multi's to run above 46. llc didn't get me anywhere either. tried clearing cmos, i have the latest bios.
> 
> hottest core on 1.38v @ 4.6ghz id 64c after 10 hours of p95.
> 
> chip or mobo?


Had a chip that was similar to this. Had to throw a ton of voltage to get past 4.5 Ghz. That chip now belongs to AVADirect, who apparently buy used processors for their builds.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im bout to get the h220 with the rad on the top then fit two of these rads next to each other on the front of my case with some delta fans.
> then after that ill get some water blocks for my 670's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/7142/ex-rad-128/Black_Ice_GTX_Xtreme_M184_Radiator_-_Black.html?tl=g30c95s759#blank
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/de92ffhisp.html


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm going to use this to mount the external 480 monsta
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Koolance Radiator Mounting Bracket with Quick-Release - $45
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_457_335_982&products_id=25631


...had an externally mounted rad on a previous build - worked great, also re lower temps... BUT now going completely case-less - gives a whole new meaning to 'thinking outside the box' - what freedom !









...little choice anyways...what with two mobos in one combined build and 900mm x 60 mm rads in total. Still, I find going case-less is a ton of fun, improves cooling, access to components etc...just requires some decent layout and dust cover planning...try it, you might like it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im bout to get the h220 with the rad on the top then fit two of these rads next to each other on the front of my case with some delta fans.
> then after that ill get some water blocks for my 670's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/7142/ex-rad-128/Black_Ice_GTX_Xtreme_M184_Radiator_-_Black.html?tl=g30c95s759#blank
> http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/de92ffhisp.html


...just installed the BlackIce rad above as part of a bigger loop - great performer in smaller package


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> did u enable pll overvoltage?


yea.I tried it on auto and i ran it all the way up to 1.8v i believe it was. whatever intels max recommended spec is, i don't recall it at the moment.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Had a chip that was similar to this. Had to throw a ton of voltage to get past 4.5 Ghz. That chip now belongs to AVADirect, who apparently buy used processors for their builds.


so it was the chip in your case then.

The reason i'm asking is i'm going to move to sli soon and my board doesn't support it... if i've got a dud chip i'm not really going to replace the chip, If it's a dud there's no sense buying a higher end mobo.

Unless there's a market for 4.6ghz capped de-lidded chips i don't know about haha.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Another hammer/vice success story:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: plu2
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> ihs-TIM: Bare die
> Mhz gained: None yet
> OC after delid: 4,5Ghz
> Temp drops: ~17C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2774978
> 
> Please note that I de-lidded the CPU and build a new custom liquid cooled loop around it immediately after, so the temp drops are somewhat not valid for the research ...
> This test was done running the fans fixed at 600-750 RPM. I am sure I would get even better temps running the fans much faster...


You're In!







Use the Sig wisely!


----------



## j0sh

Just finished. So far I am very happy. Before it would jump over 84c on IBT and now its barely at 70 with h100i

OCN name: j0sh
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
Mhz gained: 400Mhz
OC after delid: 4.7Ghz
Temp drops: ~14C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2775745

http://s27.photobucket.com/user/element_dc5/media/photo1-1_zpsd108f583.jpg.html

http://s27.photobucket.com/user/ele...e-422f-9068-d5138002cb57_zpsb2761865.jpg.html


----------



## Qlix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> yea.I tried it on auto and i ran it all the way up to 1.8v i believe it was. whatever intels max recommended spec is, i don't recall it at the moment.
> so it was the chip in your case then.
> 
> The reason i'm asking is i'm going to move to sli soon and my board doesn't support it... if i've got a dud chip i'm not really going to replace the chip, If it's a dud there's no sense buying a higher end mobo.
> 
> Unless there's a market for 4.6ghz capped de-lidded chips i don't know about haha.


There's actually quite a few people around these forums that seem to have issues going over 4.6. We should start our own club... The **** out of luck ivy oc club


----------



## Joa3d43

*6 GHz, Prime95*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> There's actually quite a few people around these forums that seem to have issues going over 4.6. We should start our own club... The **** out of luck ivy oc club


...funny that you mention another club - just came from some light reading at the 6GHz club and saw a reference to this post on Prime95/12hrs:









http://www.overclock.net/t/1243800/2500k-max-multi-56#post_16996531


----------



## tzvia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...had an externally mounted rad on a previous build - worked great, also re lower temps... BUT now going completely case-less - gives a whole new meaning to 'thinking outside the box' - what freedom !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...little choice anyways...what with two mobos in one combined build and 900mm x 60 mm rads in total. Still, I find going case-less is a ton of fun, improves cooling, access to components etc...just requires some decent layout and dust cover planning...try it, you might like it


LOL caseless. Been doing that for about a decade. Use Lowes metal shelving units, mojo trays, Thermalkake icages and zipties. Not classy looking, and have to blow it out every few weeks but I can do whatever I want. Just built a rig for the bro using a 20 dollar 3 shelf unit that has enough room for whatever he wants to do. We closed three of the sides with some stamped metal sheets that have X hole patterns cut in them so there is plenty of airflow, and 230mm fans. Then made a flip up door out of the two sheets covering the front for easy access. He says it looks like something Godzilla would crush on a cheap movie set and I think it looks like an oil refinery. Whatever, it was less than 100 bucks with the stamped sheets and drive cage and will work with any hardware and has room for a plastic Godzilla.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...had an externally mounted rad on a previous build - worked great, also re lower temps... BUT now going completely case-less - gives a whole new meaning to 'thinking outside the box' - what freedom !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...little choice anyways...what with two mobos in one combined build and 900mm x 60 mm rads in total. Still, I find going case-less is a ton of fun, improves cooling, access to components etc...just requires some decent layout and dust cover planning...try it, you might like it


my brothers rig

Quote:


> yea.I tried it on auto and i ran it all the way up to 1.8v i believe it was. whatever intels max recommended spec is, i don't recall it at the moment.


No i mean Internal PLL Overvoltage enable it, insted of auto


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my brothers rig
> 
> No i mean Internal PLL Overvoltage enable it, insted of auto


Damn i did not know Tallahassee was the ghetto lol.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn i did not know Tallahassee was the ghetto lol.


15 bucks for that fan thats stronger, or 4x 180mm fans for 120$. also im orignally from miami maybe thats where it got it from


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 15 bucks for that fan thats stronger, or 4x 180mm fans for 120$.


Yah but no Static pressure.. lots of air flow tho...

If it works it works just poking and it for being Ghetto as heck lol.\

I trust in you with my Guidance to do much better!


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> yea.I tried it on auto and i ran it all the way up to 1.8v i believe it was. whatever intels max recommended spec is, i don't recall it at the moment.
> so it was the chip in your case then.
> 
> The reason i'm asking is i'm going to move to sli soon and my board doesn't support it... if i've got a dud chip i'm not really going to replace the chip, If it's a dud there's no sense buying a higher end mobo.
> 
> Unless there's a market for 4.6ghz capped de-lidded chips i don't know about haha.
> 
> 
> 
> There's actually quite a few people around these forums that seem to have issues going over 4.6. We should start our own club... The **** out of luck ivy oc club
Click to expand...

lol

lets do it. we can all cry deeply together.


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> my brothers rig
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> yea.I tried it on auto and i ran it all the way up to 1.8v i believe it was. whatever intels max recommended spec is, i don't recall it at the moment.
> 
> 
> 
> No i mean Internal PLL Overvoltage enable it, insted of auto
Click to expand...

lol @ that box fan.

i'll have to look at the bios on that again when i get home but i know i tried pll over-voltage on off, auto, and on and i believe there was a voltage selection field for it where i tried auto as well as some other voltages leading up to 1.8v. i may be wrong on that last part.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> lol
> 
> lets do it. we can all cry deeply together.


i have trouble getting 5.1 ghz stable can we make a thread for that ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> lol
> It's not that I needed the money. The guy who bought it does LN2 benching. He'll get better use out of than I would










The one guy I didn't bug in PM to sell a great chip before delidding it, is the one who would....
Double








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> quick question.
> 
> i'm at 4.6ghz on 1.31v. i can't get any multi above 46 stable. i've ran my voltage up to 1.38. anything above that becomes unstable again, but i still can't get any multi's to run above 46. llc didn't get me anywhere either. tried clearing cmos, i have the latest bios.
> 
> hottest core on 1.38v @ 4.6ghz id 64c after 10 hours of p95.
> 
> chip or mobo?


Chip. It isn't a great mobo, but isn't so bad it holds back a chip at 4.6Ghz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *6 GHz, Prime95*
> ...funny that you mention another club - just came from some light reading at the 6GHz club and saw a reference to this post on Prime95/12hrs:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1243800/2500k-max-multi-56#post_16996531


Reggie is awesome, I loved that one!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *j0sh*
> 
> Just finished. So far I am very happy. Before it would jump over 84c on IBT and now its barely at 70 with h100i
> 
> OCN name: j0sh
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> Mhz gained: 400Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.7Ghz
> Temp drops: ~14C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2775745
> 
> http://s27.photobucket.com/user/element_dc5/media/photo1-1_zpsd108f583.jpg.html
> 
> http://s27.photobucket.com/user/ele...e-422f-9068-d5138002cb57_zpsb2761865.jpg.html


You're In!







Now get crakin and put your new Sig on!


----------



## I_shot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> A smile to people's faces - a new shirt I bought


haha you made my day


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> haha you made my day


thanks bro


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> LOL caseless. Been doing that for about a decade. Use Lowes metal shelving units, mojo trays, Thermalkake icages and zipties. Not classy looking, and have to blow it out every few weeks but I can do whatever I want. Just built a rig for the bro using a 20 dollar 3 shelf unit that has enough room for whatever he wants to do. We closed three of the sides with some stamped metal sheets that have X hole patterns cut in them so there is plenty of airflow, and 230mm fans. Then made a flip up door out of the two sheets covering the front for easy access. He says it looks like something Godzilla would crush on a cheap movie set and I think it looks like an oil refinery. Whatever, it was less than 100 bucks with the stamped sheets and drive cage and will work with any hardware and has room for a plastic Godzilla.


....have seen some pretty good case-less over the years - some great early pioneers out there ...ultimately, this will become a 'deskputer' under glass in the fall...for now, it is part of my regular 'desk' (formerly an IKEA dining room table seating up top 10)...one of the two ROGs is a Rampage IV Extreme w/3970X which can really heat up the VRMs, especially the one by the I-O ports...case-less makes it a cinch to cool...also using 3 extra 200 mm fans (







) which I noticed also make great dust removers....









...*just have to remember to leave my coffee cup at the right, not left*







(though the boards are a few inches off the table via rubber mounts for the inevitable spills)....my hands were always a trifle too big to fiddle with these tiny openings in regular cases for proper cable management anyways (I'm 6' 4''+), and many a times, I ended up swearing at the contortions to get anything done inside the case, and looking for bandages afterwards...

...best of all, both ROGs (the other is a MVE) have 'power' and 'reset' right on the board...what with a total of as much as 8 machines in my home office, the space savings alone are incredible...prior, the two boards in question were in a CM Stryker and a Phantom 820 respectively, taking up valuable real estate.

...Now making it 'pretty' with 1/4'' and 1/2'' flex tubing for the wiring (2x AX1200s have a lot of cables)...My GF says that with the red w-c tubes, the whole contraption looks sort of like an industrial refinery aerial photo from the top view...I hope to have pics and may be a short build-log by Sunday or Monday...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hey hey you guys are just jealous of that 6 pack!
> In all honesty, my height + weight, help me with Taekwondo competitions


I use to do TKD to, quit after 9 years at two black belts, got boring lol.

Best part of it was seing "***" on everyone's uniform, (World Taekwondo Federation)









Edit: Lol stars on W-T-F


----------



## Hokies83

Yes i love the power and Reset on My G1 Sniper 3.. i do not even use the power button on the case i use the one on the MB XD

Power / reset clear cosmos it is all there


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I use to do TKD to, quit after 9 years at two black belts, got boring lol.
> 
> Best part of it was seing "***" on everyone's uniform, (World Taekwondo Federation)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Lol stars on W-T-F


yeah!
It made me laugh the first time I saw it









I've been doing TKD for around 3 years now







!
Soon to be black belt (according to my master)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yes i love the power and Reset on My G1 Sniper 3.. i do not even use the power button on the case i use the one on the MB XD
> 
> Power / reset clear cosmos it is all there










...even when in the case (w/side off), I got used to just using the mobo buttons for power

...here are a few shots from earlier in the week when I started to lay out things after bringing the 3970X up to speed a few times (just to see...)...incidentally, this is NOT the final assembly look


----------



## tzvia

Ok, could not resist taking a few pictures of the rig I 'consulted' on and then built for my brother. After all, it is a delidded 3770k using the hammer method. I call it the 'Oil Refinery'. Yea the back isn't on it yet.



Asus Maximus V Formula, 16g Trident-x 2400, Corsair 1200i, 2x Segate 3tb drives, 1 Muskin 240g MSATA, PNY GTX 680 4gb, LG Blue-ray burner, LG 24" LED monitor, Corsair H100 (he already had it), lots of zip-ties and split tubing, Liquid Ultra. At 4.8ghz, +.16v offset 1.394v. He's happy. Primes at around 73c. Love those Bitfenix fans. As for all the stuffed sheep, he's the manager of a furniture/bedding store and I think those are Beautyrest sheep.







If he ever wants to do real water, available space is not an issue. We shall see how the temps hold up this summer.


----------



## Hokies83

LoL i like the case! it is a Ghetto Mountain mods ascension lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...even when in the case (w/side off), I got used to just using the mobo buttons for power
> 
> ...here are a few shots from earlier in the week when I started to lay out things after bringing the 3970X up to speed a few times (just to see...)...incidentally, this is NOT the final assembly look


flower in the background, uneven desk, remote control on the edge of falling, sticker still on the TV: 2/10








(hopefully you get that's a joke)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> Ok, could not resist taking a few pictures of the rig I 'consulted' on and then built for my brother. After all, it is a delidded 3770k using the hammer method. I call it the 'Oil Refinery'. Yea the back isn't on it yet.
> 
> 
> 
> Asus Maximus V Formula, 16g Trident-x 2400, Corsair 1200i, 2x Segate 3tb drives, 1 Muskin 240g MSATA, PNY GTX 680 4gb, LG Blue-ray burner, LG 24" LED monitor, Corsair H100 (he already had it), lots of zip-ties and split tubing, Liquid Ultra. At 4.8ghz, +.16v offset 1.394v. He's happy. Primes at around 73c. Love those Bitfenix fans. As for all the stuffed sheep, he's the manager of a furniture/bedding store and I think those are Beautyrest sheep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If he ever wants to do real water, available space is not an issue. We shall see how the temps hold up this summer.


...love it







I'll have to consider the sheep / doll options







...in my earlier pics, there is a little fridge / freezer you just see the side of...how convenient


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> flower in the background, uneven desk, remote control on the edge of falling, sticker still on the TV: 2/10
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (hopefully you get that's a joke)


...it could even be funny









...but it's not a flower but a plant on the 'stag' I got as a prize for a hunting success (longest shot)
...desk is level, camera is not
...remote not falling off; held down by Velcro (I







industrial Velcro); no TV- but top-down view of one of the monitors w/regular emblems (no stickers)

...but generally, an invasion from outer space of PCs attacking my place...taking it over; wonder what they're planning from their new base here...world domination ?

*EDIT* ...speaking of world domination , looks like Titan is getting some competition (per OCN fp post) :


----------



## dr/owned

Lil teaser:


----------



## jdm317

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Lil teaser:


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice toy, now show us some frosty pics


----------



## RavageTheEarth

A prayer to the money gods..... Gods, please give me a nice chunk of change, for I no longer like air. I no longer want to hear my shop fan. My boiling VRM's..... MY BOILING VRM'S!!!! Give me some sub-40c temps. Give me water. Distilled goodness. Give me..... $1149. Thank you. I will patiently wait by the mail box for the money.


----------



## bmw477

Ok guys, new here. So I successfully de-lidded my 3770k processor last night. I am seeing results of up to 27 degrees lower temperature on hottest core. Good stuff!!! So what is the process for joining the de-lidding club?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bmw477*
> 
> Ok guys, new here. So I successfully de-lidded my 3770k processor last night. I am seeing results of up to 27 degrees lower temperature on hottest core. Good stuff!!! So what is the process for joining the de-lidding club?


Now for the requirements to join the club are as follows. Post a picture of you delidded chip and write your OCN name on a piece or something of the like. For those already running delidded chips and don't feel like taking them out and re-installing I understand so take a picture that you most likely took when you delidded it and use what every program you'd like to put your name somewhere on the picture.

For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!
happy 420!


----------



## couchasault9001

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *couchasault9001*
> 
> quick question.
> 
> i'm at 4.6ghz on 1.31v. i can't get any multi above 46 stable. i've ran my voltage up to 1.38. anything above that becomes unstable again, but i still can't get any multi's to run above 46. llc didn't get me anywhere either. tried clearing cmos, i have the latest bios.
> 
> hottest core on 1.38v @ 4.6ghz id 64c after 10 hours of p95.
> 
> chip or mobo?
> 
> 
> 
> Chip. It isn't a great mobo, but isn't so bad it holds back a chip at 4.6Ghz.
Click to expand...

thanks a bunch!


----------



## Arm3nian

I check yesterday and 200 new posts. I check today (4/20) and 10 new posts lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I check yesterday and 200 new posts. I check today (4/20) and 10 new posts lol.


What do you mean by that?? Are we busy doing something??


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yes we are quite the chatty bunch in here


----------



## Mms60r

Hi guys, new here. I finally finished my first loop and I am moving on the the fine tuning stage. After a disaster with Indigo Xtreme reflow I switched to CoolLabratory Ultra as per coming across this thread. My 3770k OC is at 4.5, I only adjusted the multiplier, and my temps are +/- 60 except 1 core is about +/- 72.5 at full load. Are the temps ok? Should I be concerned about that 1 core? Would delidding help? Do I have more headroom to OC for a 24/7 machine? Thanks.


----------



## Qlix

Yes to all o the above except being concerned with temps. Seem fine. I'd be more concerned about the CLU stain you're about to get on your block.

But you seem to have a ton of headroom. Delidding can only help.


----------



## Mms60r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Qlix*
> 
> Yes to all o the above except being concerned with temps. Seem fine. I'd be more concerned about the CLU stain you're about to get on your block.
> 
> But you seem to have a ton of headroom. Delidding can only help.


I've read about the staining. Not sure I understand what it means though? The cpu waterblock or the IHS? I also read about lapping to remove stains. Not sure what that is either??


----------



## dr/owned

So it looks like 40F is as low as the chiller will go even running continuously. Not sure why, but I have some theories.

a) It was previously running a saltwater aquarium, so who knows how much buildup is in the evaporator box. Might try flushing with some CLR or vinegar.
b) The pump I'm using is only 1/3 of the minimum flowrate specified. Not sure why there is a minimum flowrate...maybe cavitation is needed? I'll have a 1000 gph pump arriving on tuesday (3x the flow of an MCP655)
c) The bucket I'm testing with is uninsulated. I might just be reaching the limit of heat input = heat removed

All of these options are fixable. Option d) is that it's just low on refrigerant or something and I'm not paying to fix that.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *plu2*
> 
> Absolutely - no issues whatsoever in Prime95 or Intel Burn Test .
> I guess I was lucky with my chip, which might also explain the rather low temp drops.
> 
> The only little thing that really doesn't bother me is that at idle Core 1 is ~10C hotter than Core 3 (and ~5C hotter than Core 2 and 4).
> At load delta T between the cores are ~4-5C and Core 1 tends to be the coldest at load.


Well then you have one hell of a nice chip man. Luck for sure, people don't get this good even after binning like crazy. 10C is a bit too much of a variation. You may need to recheck the TIM you applied inside and above the IHS.


----------



## skupples

Soo, its probably in here among the 1700+ pages,so please dont hate...do you guys recommend coolabs paste over indigo xtreme when it comes time to put the water block back on? would i even be able to get the cpu hot enough for reflow?

edit: didnt know they make their own type of "eti" not sure what they call it...


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> Soo, its probably in here among the 1700+ pages,so please dont hate...do you guys recommend coolabs paste over indigo xtreme when it comes time to put the water block back on? would i even be able to get the cpu hot enough for reflow?


CLU is the way to go. Indigo is just too much hassle for not much gain. For IHS -> Waterblock just use normal paste. Only need the liquid metal stuff for die -> IHS.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I check yesterday and 200 new posts. I check today (4/20) and 10 new posts lol.
> 
> 
> 
> What do you mean by that?? Are we busy doing something??
Click to expand...

We're all busy doing the smoking bush.







Except me, I've had work this entire day.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> Soo, its probably in here among the 1700+ pages,so please dont hate...do you guys recommend coolabs paste over indigo xtreme when it comes time to put the water block back on? would i even be able to get the cpu hot enough for reflow?
> 
> edit: didnt know they make their own type of "eti" not sure what they call it...


...depends how much extra temp reductions you want to gain... "somewhere"







in these 1700 pages, I posted some results of Coollaboratory Ultra (CL-U) on both the die AND the IHS *vs* CL-U on the die and MX4 (my 'normal' non-liquid-metal TIM favourite) on the IHS to water-block area...*CL-U on both* lowered temps by an additional 4 C or so in stress testing...

...the disadvantage of CL-U on your IHS is that it can be tougher to clean up, it can get rid of the 'writing stamp' on your IHS (though that doesn't have to be the case) and if your water block is untreated copper (i.e. NOT Nickel plated), CL-U by its very function will leave some cloudiness / marks on the water block after longer-term use....said marks do polish out, but if you plan to use the bottom of your water block as a mirror down the line...you have been warned...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> We're all busy doing the smoking bush.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except me, I've had work this entire day.


Haha I was waiting for someone to say it!!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> We're all busy doing the smoking bush.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Except me, I've had work this entire day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha I was waiting for someone to say it!!!
Click to expand...

I think everyone knows but it's just that I think it's against the rules to straightly talk about it.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think everyone knows but it's just that I think it's against the rules to straightly talk about it.


Yep, at least one of the mods is very much against it.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



I used to have 'Free the W**d' in my user title when I was new to explain the FtW but was not allowed to do that..


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think everyone knows but it's just that I think it's against the rules to straightly talk about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yep, at least one of the mods is very much against it.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I used to have 'Free the W**d' in my user title when I was new to explain the FtW but was not allowed to do that..
Click to expand...

Haha, well I guess we can't blame him, I mean this is an overclocking forum. Not oversmoking.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think everyone knows but it's just that I think it's against the rules to straightly talk about it.


Talk about what?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yep, at least one of the mods is very much against it.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I used to have 'Free the W**d' in my user title when I was new to explain the FtW but was not allowed to do that..










...you mean 'FtW' does not mean 'For the Win'







?!







...and EVGA FtW cards are really for







?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...you mean 'FtW' does not mean 'For the Win'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?!


Not when I signed up here, I was using FtW on other forums long before getting back into PC & hadn't heard the 'for the win' before.
A couple years ago I won a gigabyte competition & they had the news on their main page with 'FtW lives up to his username...', figured I better not correct it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not when I signed up here, I was using FtW on other forums long before getting back into PC & hadn't heard the 'for the win' before.
> A couple years ago I won a gigabyte competition & they had the news on their main page with 'FtW lives up to his username...', figured I better not correct it.


...all this talk has given me...the Munchies ! Must find food....


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not when I signed up here, I was using FtW on other forums long before getting back into PC & hadn't heard the 'for the win' before.
> A couple years ago I won a gigabyte competition & they had the news on their main page with 'FtW lives up to his username...', figured I better not correct it.


Ahahaha priceless man. That is hilarious!


----------



## chronicfx

Happy Holidays for those that still celebrate this one! I used to celebrate this one hard in washington square. But now I have two kids and wife that doesn't so those days are like once or twice a year now... But from 14 to about 30 I never missed a day. Happy today guys!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

haha brilliant lads


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've heard you can make a special oil that cures cancer with 'it' O.O

Man, I want my MVG back. Can't fold, can't bench, can't mine and play at the same time like this...even a proper 775 board would be nice so I can take this 631 to 5ghz


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

What's a good place to learn about the stepping of intel chips and what not ?


----------



## chronicfx

I just ordered 2400mhz ripjaw Z's to go with my new UD5h. I didn't get trident X because it was red and the motherboard is blue, is there any difference between the chips they use? I know the ripjaw is considered lower end but the specs are identical so I wasn't sure if they were using the same stuff just for this model.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> What's a good place to learn about the stepping of intel chips and what not ?


...this should get you part way down the road... (the first one I use from time to time, the last link leads to Intel stepping ID software)...the first gives you detail and code names you can plug into Google









http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_%28microarchitecture%29#Steppings (incl. scroll down 'see also')

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_microprocessors

http://pc.ayumilove.net/list-of-intel-cpu-batch-number/

--

http://www.intel.com/p/en_US/support/highlights/processors/toolspiu


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...you mean 'FtW' does not mean 'For the Win'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not when I signed up here, I was using FtW on other forums long before getting back into PC & hadn't heard the 'for the win' before.
> A couple years ago I won a gigabyte competition & they had the news on their main page with 'FtW lives up to his username...', figured I better not correct it.
Click to expand...

"What's FTW mean? 'Forever Two Wheels' " said the biker to the policeman.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I just ordered 2400mhz ripjaw Z's to go with my new UD5h. I didn't get trident X because it was red and the motherboard is blue, is there any difference between the chips they use? I know the ripjaw is considered lower end but the specs are identical so I wasn't sure if they were using the same stuff just for this model.


Depends on the timings and serial number...if it's xxxx2500xxxx then it's probably Samsung. Check the link in my sig (ram addict thread) to get a list of serial/chip codes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> "What's FTW mean? 'Forever Two Wheels' " said the biker to the policeman.


Film the whale (?)


----------



## stickg1

I snagged a cheap laptop to use while I rebuild. It's got an i5-3230m in it. Time to delid it! Errr wait, Intel already did, hmmm. CLP??


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I snagged a cheap laptop to use while I rebuild. It's got an i5-3230m in it. Time to delid it! Errr wait, Intel already did, hmmm. CLP??


Well technically you can't delid something that never had one on in the first place


----------



## ivanlabrie

680 guys: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/18308/ex-blc-1405/EK_VGA_Supremacy_Bridge_Edition_Universal_High_Performance_VGA_Cooling_Block_-_Acetal_Nickel_EK-VGA_Supremacy_Bridge_Edition_-_AcetalNickel.html


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Free {the} Willie ?


^^ This too!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 680 guys: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/18308/ex-blc-1405/EK_VGA_Supremacy_Bridge_Edition_Universal_High_Performance_VGA_Cooling_Block_-_Acetal_Nickel_EK-VGA_Supremacy_Bridge_Edition_-_AcetalNickel.html


Looks good for a uni block, but not sure about the extra bit on the side for the in/outlets, might mess with compatibility on some cards.


----------



## lilchronic

i just jacked my brothers extra watercooling stuff, bout to by a pump and res and have a loop just for my cards







and keep the h100 cooling the cpu


what size VRM heatsinks do i need for the 670 FTW ?? anyone no?


----------



## stickg1

I just sold my main rig for $1250 cash. I haven't decided how I'm going to replace it but I went ahead and bought my dream PSU.

CORSAIR AX760i 760W Digital
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139043

I can't decide on a case, I want something with plenty of space, and plenty of style. The rest of the components I can wait on. I sold one of the other PCs in my sig and bought a i5-3230m laptop to use while I shop over the next few weeks.


----------



## Hokies83

Ack you coulda got a used AX 1200 or another 1200 watt psu for that price XD


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ack you coulda got a used AX 1200 or another 1200 watt psu for that price XD


$150 after coupon code and rebate, I don't plan on ever using more than SLI or Crossfire, most likely I will always just have the strongest single GPU I can afford.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i just jacked my brothers extra watercooling stuff, bout to by a pump and res and have a loop just for my cards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and keep the h100 cooling the cpu
> 
> 
> what size VRM heatsinks do i need for the 670 FTW ?? anyone no?


For the memory:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835708009

VRM's:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835708011

Or you could check out these too:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835708012

One last option is that you can modify or widen the fan-plate that passively cools the VRM's and memory chips. But it is a lot of work. I installed my Raystorm the same way:


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I just ordered 2400mhz ripjaw Z's to go with my new UD5h. I didn't get trident X because it was red and the motherboard is blue, is there any difference between the chips they use? I know the ripjaw is considered lower end but the specs are identical so I wasn't sure if they were using the same stuff just for this model.


Ripjaws Z usually use Hynix CFR's, but can't be sure about the current ones. Trident-X for the model you mentioned had Samsung IC's.

Do let us know if it boots at 2400Mhz (XMP). From personal experience, I dumped my UD5H due to this reason. Now my MVF has no problem booting at 2400Mhz, even though they're rated at 2133Mhz.


----------



## Capwn

So how can you tell if your ivy chip is TIM or soldered??? Arent the new ones soldered? If you try to delid a soldered chip.. Is it all bad?


----------



## FtW 420

All have TIM, 99.99% sure none are soldered & none will be. There was an issue with not being able to use solder with the tri gate transistors with ivy bridge.
Trying to delid a soldered chip could be bad, the solder would have to be heated enough to let the IHS loose or the die can be torn from the PCB.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> $150 after coupon code and rebate, I don't plan on ever using more than SLI or Crossfire, most likely I will always just have the strongest single GPU I can afford.


Still just in case you change your mind....

I paid 125$ for an Antec True Power 1200 watt Psu like 10 days ago lol..... Used Magic Inter net monies.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Still just in case you change your mind....
> 
> I paid 125$ for an Antec True Power 1200 watt Psu like 10 days ago lol..... Used Magic Inter net monies.


Naw I like this one, comes fully modular with nicely sleeved cables. Platinum rated, digital control and monitoring. I'm happy with it. Will likely last me a decade.

Now if I could just find a damn case to put it in. All the cases are looking pretty meh right now.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i just jacked my brothers extra watercooling stuff, bout to by a pump and res and have a loop just for my cards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and keep the h100 cooling the cpu
> 
> 
> what size VRM heatsinks do i need for the 670 FTW ?? anyone no?


None, slap a fan there!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Ripjaws Z usually use Hynix CFR's, but can't be sure about the current ones. Trident-X for the model you mentioned had Samsung IC's.
> 
> Do let us know if it boots at 2400Mhz (XMP). From personal experience, I dumped my UD5H due to this reason. Now my MVF has no problem booting at 2400Mhz, even though they're rated at 2133Mhz.


Same issue with mine...hated that board's lack of ram ocing ability (particularly Samsung chips)
New ud4h with T topology is much better, or the UP series ones.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Naw I like this one, comes fully modular with nicely sleeved cables. Platinum rated, digital control and monitoring. I'm happy with it. Will likely last me a decade.
> 
> Now if I could just find a damn case to put it in. All the cases are looking pretty meh right now.


I've seen tons of the new i units failing...I would've gone with whatever 850w xfx unit for cheep full modular Seasonic inside stuff.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Naw I like this one, comes fully modular with nicely sleeved cables. Platinum rated, digital control and monitoring. I'm happy with it. Will likely last me a decade.
> 
> Now if I could just find a damn case to put it in. All the cases are looking pretty meh right now.


...go case-less ? I love it, not to mention superior cooling, access etc.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...go case-less ? I love it, not to mention *superior cooling*, access etc.


Can't feed my portable A/C unit's output directly into the intake of nothing


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Naw I like this one, comes fully modular with nicely sleeved cables. Platinum rated, digital control and monitoring. I'm happy with it. Will likely last me a decade.
> 
> Now if I could just find a damn case to put it in. All the cases are looking pretty meh right now.


What type of case u want? ill look in all the market places?

i am in them all lol..

Anywho do something different then a plain o case...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Can't feed my portable A/C unit's output directly into the intake of nothing


Caseless the AC just has to blow cold in the rig's general direction. You can't properly duct an AC into a case opening, having the entire rig in a duct from the AC would be the best way to go.


----------



## MKHunt

How not?

This

http://www.amazon.com/Honeywell-MN12CES-Portable-Conditioner-Control/dp/B008UHXLGA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1366591064&sr=8-3&keywords=portable+a%2Fc

-> Case bottom (all fans exhaust, all reasonably sized holes covered with acoustic foam) with styrofoam block fitted to bottom to direct air in.

Conventional in-home A/C is def. impossible to properly duct because there's no real pressure coming from the vents.


----------



## FtW 420

The portable AC just sits in front of the case or is the air directed into the case?
I was mostly thinking that with any AC, you can't really reduce the area where the cold air vents out, or the evaporator can start to freeze up & cooling efficiency goes down.


----------



## stickg1

Just turn your room into a giant freezer.


----------



## dr/owned

Just buy an aquarium chiller. Much better efficiency to have end to end liquid instead of blowing cold air, because air sucks. I think I'm going to have to throw a second 1/2 HP chiller in line with my 1/3 HP one if I want to go sub freezing (lowest I was able to go was 0.9C with 3 gallons of water in a bucket). I would buy the 1HP one, but I can't move 70 pounds around.

In related news, have to buy an AX1200i, because I'm exceeding the 30A rail on my X-1250 and I get hard shutdowns during BF3 fragfests.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> How not?
> 
> This
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Honeywell-MN12CES-Portable-Conditioner-Control/dp/B008UHXLGA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1366591064&sr=8-3&keywords=portable+a%2Fc
> 
> -> Case bottom (all fans exhaust, all reasonably sized holes covered with acoustic foam) with styrofoam block fitted to bottom to direct air in.
> 
> Conventional in-home A/C is def. impossible to properly duct because there's no real pressure coming from the vents.


...that unit in your link is 12,000 BTUs...looks good - but in all honesty, wouldn't cascading phase (or even LN2) be easier in the end ?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Ripjaws Z usually use Hynix CFR's, but can't be sure about the current ones. Trident-X for the model you mentioned had Samsung IC's.
> 
> Do let us know if it boots at 2400Mhz (XMP). From personal experience, I dumped my UD5H due to this reason. Now my MVF has no problem booting at 2400Mhz, even though they're rated at 2133Mhz.


I will let you know. The ripjaw-z 2400mhz are actually listed on the ud5h's memory compatibility list so I am hoping it will be more up to my imc than anything else. Wish me luck. At least I can get some tech support on both sides if it doesn't work for that reason.


----------



## HiLuckyB

Seems odd that Z77 MB's having problems with 2400MHz ram, When my Z68 MB with my 3770K has no problems running 2400MHz ram.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...that unit in your link is 12,000 BTUs...looks good - but in all honesty, wouldn't cascading phase (or even LN2) be easier in the end ?


Electricity here is significantly cheaper than LN2, + dewpoint scares me which is why I've always leaned towards chilled air (esp. with an inline dehumidifier). This way it prevents buying a new pump (I can't see a 35X pumping through a Haiea), preserves some mobility (I really only push OCs for benches), and lets me control the unit via remote. Freezing is a non-issue this way (though I always include medical grade glycerin in my loops) as well.

and @FtW it'd not be just in front, it'd be ducted.


----------



## Hokies83

hmmm...
Quote:


> stickg1: I'll do that, trying to fix the toilet, there's poo everywhere
> stickg1 is now Away.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> hmmm...


Well I was wondering where the kids' tooth brushes were. Apparently my 3 year old flushed them all down the toilet.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HiLuckyB*
> 
> Seems odd that Z77 MB's having problems with 2400MHz ram, When my Z68 MB with my 3770K has no problems running 2400MHz ram.


The Gigabytes are weird, this ud3h will overclock memory easily, 2666Mhz +. The problem is keeping it that way, I can stability test with overclocked memory no problem, restarts with no issue.
But shutting down is another story. Go to start again, & it will fail until memory is downclocked, then it can be started, overclocked again & run stable till the cows come home, or the rig is shut down.
It gets annoying, so I just use a cheap kit & run it at 1600 in the ud3h most of the time so I can shut down & start up normally..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Electricity here is significantly cheaper than LN2, + dewpoint scares me which is why I've always leaned towards chilled air (esp. with an inline dehumidifier). This way it prevents buying a new pump (I can't see a 35X pumping through a Haiea), preserves some mobility (I really only push OCs for benches), and lets me control the unit via remote. Freezing is a non-issue this way (though I always include medical grade glycerin in my loops) as well.
> 
> and @FtW it'd not be just in front, it'd be ducted.


Can probably pull the front of the case right off for air in, as long as there is enough opening at the bottom, sides & back for free flowing air out.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well I was wondering where the kids' tooth brushes were. Apparently my 3 year old flushed them all down the toilet.


DOH!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well I was wondering where the kids' tooth brushes were. Apparently my 3 year old flushed them all down the toilet.


Ha, that is too funny, well funny for us, not so much for you having to deal with it. One of my favorite days was never having to buy diapers again.


----------



## MKHunt

best advice I can give:


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Ha, that is too funny, well funny for us, not so much for you having to deal with it. One of my favorite days was never having to buy diapers again.


Yeah diapers sucked. They're really expensive too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> best advice I can give:


I tried something like that a wire clothes hanger. Didn't help so I drained the toilet the best I could and pulled it up. Sat it in the tub upside down and kept pumping water through it until I got the clog loose enough to come out. Which reminds me, I should stop on the way home from work tomorrow and get a new wax ring. I just put the toilet back on the old wax but that could lead to some more poopy problems.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I will let you know. The ripjaw-z 2400mhz are actually listed on the ud5h's memory compatibility list so I am hoping it will be more up to my imc than anything else. Wish me luck. At least I can get some tech support on both sides if it doesn't work for that reason.


Good luck man and I really do hope that it works. Till date Gigabyte makes the most sturdiest motherboards with highly rated components, but unfortunately they lack in different areas. Could you believe over 16 revisions of the bios of this mobo and it hasn't even been a year as yet, lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

...there was a story on OCN about a new 50 inch 4k 120 hz monitor - for $1299







...followed up and eventually found this:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7674736&CatId=4717

...just what we need for our delidded, machines ...mind you, to run 3 at 4k, you probably also need to buy a couple of 6GB Titans (or equivalent)


----------



## dr/owned

For that price I'm going to call it as complete garbage.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> For that price I'm going to call it as complete garbage.


...the monitors or the Titans ?









- I'm going to reserve judgement until I see at least some reviews...sometimes you get new (unknown brand) companies trying to break into a market and pricing accordingly...that said, I doubt it can be top-of-the-line quality stuff


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> For that price I'm going to call it as complete garbage.


lol never even heard of seiki but i wouldnt mind replacing my 42 inch sony with that


----------



## MKHunt

it's 30Hz at 4k, not 120hz.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> it's 30Hz at 4k, not 120hz.


...figures







though it does say 120Hz... ...so I don't have to order my Titan ULTRA's yet ? http://videocardz.com/40974/nvidia-also-to-launch-geforce-gtx-titan-ultra


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...figures
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...so I don't have to order my Titan ULTRA's yet ? http://videocardz.com/40974/nvidia-also-to-launch-geforce-gtx-titan-ultra


Nope. If they'll even exist.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1363440/nvidia-geforce-gtx-titan-owners-club/7320#post_19805626

BTW, this is their "original source" http://www.3dcenter.org/artikel/wie-eine-geforce-gtx-titan-ii-aussehen-koennte


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Nope. If they'll even exist.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1363440/nvidia-geforce-gtx-titan-owners-club/7320#post_19805626
> 
> BTW, this is their "original source" http://www.3dcenter.org/artikel/wie-eine-geforce-gtx-titan-ii-aussehen-koennte


...I actually visit that site regularly ... in the interest of AMD fans, here is their table re AMD (though not much info yet on 8000 series)

http://www.3dcenter.org/news/amd-begruendet-die-verschiebung-der-radeon-hd-8000-serie


----------



## dr/owned

I can haz GTX 780?

Anyhoo...I really wish they would get the 700 series out the door and stop wasting effort on the Titan series (assuming there's a LE coming). Titan is an epeen product, so why would anyone want a Light Edition epeen?


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I can haz GTX 780?
> 
> Anyhoo...I really wish they would get the 700 series out the door and stop wasting effort on the Titan series (assuming there's a LE coming). Titan is an epeen product, so why would anyone want a Light Edition epeen?


because they get epeen light and make it just as fast as a _*stock*_ epeen and suddenly epeen original is "worse value" and "a stupid buy" (lol not that it's good value or a sound financial choice, but that's what having an investment banker is for!)

Just like all the "buy a 670 instead of a 680" or "buy a 570 instead of a 580." The X80 cards are still at the top of the charts once everything's overclocked.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> because they get epeen light and make it just as fast as a _*stock*_ epeen and suddenly epeen original is "worse value" and "a stupid buy" (lol not that it's good value or a sound financial choice, but that's what having an investment banker is for!)
> 
> Just like all the "buy a 670 instead of a 680" or "buy a 570 instead of a 580." The X80 cards are still at the top of the charts once everything's overclocked.


That one always got me, 'an overclocked 570 is as fast as a 580, FOR LESS!' but then, 580s can overclock too..

They all have a market & people get what is in the budget & plans, but I have always thought that was a strange argument on an overclock oriented forum.


----------



## Hokies83

Give me 4k in 27inch / 30 inch then ill be interested.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That one always got me, 'an overclocked 570 is as fast as a 580, FOR LESS!' but then, 580s can overclock too..
> 
> They all have a market & people get what is in the budget & plans, but I have always thought that was a strange argument on an overclock oriented forum.


All so true, though there is one exception - when you run multiple GPUs and the top-line cards use too much power in OC for the PSUs that are available. That said, it might be cheaper to get a dual 24pin connector and 2nd PSU


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That one always got me, 'an overclocked 570 is as fast as a 580, FOR LESS!' but then, 580s can overclock too..
> 
> They all have a market & people get what is in the budget & plans, but I have always thought that was a strange argument on an overclock oriented forum.
> 
> 
> 
> All so true, though there is one exception - when you run multiple GPUs and the top-line cards use too much power in OC for the PSUs that are available. That said, it might be cheaper to get a dual 24pin connector and 2nd PSU
Click to expand...

Tried it. XFX 1000W won't turn on for more than a second with the 24pin short thing. Tried putting both the CPU and a SATA load on it and no joy. Said screw it and now have the AX1200i inbound









And it hepls that newegg has 15% off + $30 MIR on it right now.


----------



## h2on0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah diapers sucked. They're really expensive too.
> I tried something like that a wire clothes hanger. Didn't help so I drained the toilet the best I could and pulled it up. Sat it in the tub upside down and kept pumping water through it until I got the clog loose enough to come out. Which reminds me, I should stop on the way home from work tomorrow and get a new wax ring. I just put the toilet back on the old wax but that could lead to some more poopy problems.


Yeah I know were getting off topic... but I ended up replacing my wax ring and forgot to take the towel out of the hole(keep the smell away). It took me a while to figure it out and I made another mess.

On topic I'm at 1.46 with a 4.7 oc. Do you guys think that is to high? My temps are fin.


----------



## dr/owned

Unusually high voltage for just 4.7. 1.4V would be on the average-high end.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I just want AFFORDABLE 120hz IPS


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I just want AFFORDABLE 120hz IPS


Korean 1440p PLS panels not affordable? IMO they're a steal.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

How much they going for?
Quoting UK prices too lol


----------



## MKHunt

190.26 pounds sterling.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Glossy-QNIX-QX2710-LED-Evolution-ll-27-2560x1440-Samsung-PLS-Panel-Monitor-/321099912197?pt=Computer_Monitors&hash=item4ac30bd405


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Very nice indeed!


----------



## MKHunt

Reports of gamma overshoot at 120Hz, but there seem to be more and more ICC profiles being created to deal with this.


----------



## eternal7trance

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That one always got me, 'an overclocked 570 is as fast as a 580, FOR LESS!' but then, 580s can overclock too..
> 
> They all have a market & people get what is in the budget & plans, but I have always thought that was a strange argument on an overclock oriented forum.


What about various people on OCN who tested overclocked 670s and overclocked 680s and they benchmarked the same?

Even Karlitos Unigen thread has 680s and 670s with the same overclocks performing equal.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eternal7trance*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That one always got me, 'an overclocked 570 is as fast as a 580, FOR LESS!' but then, 580s can overclock too..
> 
> They all have a market & people get what is in the budget & plans, but I have always thought that was a strange argument on an overclock oriented forum.
> 
> 
> 
> What about various people on OCN who tested overclocked 670s and overclocked 680s and they benchmarked the same?
> 
> Even Karlitos Unigen thread has 680s and 670s with the same overclocks performing equal.
Click to expand...

680 has more stream processors and texture units, so at the end of the day it will be faster if at same clocks.


----------



## chefproject

Hey guys, i know it's not really ontopic,and how i know this is not really a problem here








but i was playing around with my ram timings and got my 1600 sticks( Black dragon GeIL) to 1866 with 10-10-9- 28- 1T on 1,580 v and now i can't boot into my bios anymore ,pc is just going to boot on OS immediately any ideas?
will say got black screen until os boots up.....
greetings and regards Chef


----------



## eternal7trance

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 680 has more stream processors and texture units, so at the end of the day it will be faster if at same clocks.


Ignoring the 680s that have extreme overclocks if you look at the chart the 670 and 680 with near the same OC, they perform equally. This shouldn't be happening. I tried this with a 680 and a 670 myself because I didn't believe it. Sure enough I put both at a 1250 OC and they both came out identical in benchmarks and gaming.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1360884/official-top-30-unigine-valley-benchmark-1-0-fill-the-form-single-and-multi-monitors

Look at the top 30 single GPUs minus the three 680s with extreme overclocks.

56 joblanx i7 3770k GTX 670 51,5 2155 1158

.
57 pwnzilla61 FX 8350 GTX 680 51,5 2153 432

.
58 Cakewalk_S i5 2500k GTX 670 51,4 2151 628

.
59 ahonenh i7 3770k GTX 680 51,3 2148 1031


----------



## dr/owned

Gainward GeForce GTX 680 Phantom 2 GB
vs
Zotac GeForce GTX 670 Amp!

670 has faster clocks, but across all the benchmarks the 680 edges it:

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/2012-vga-gpgpu/19-Tom-s-Hardware-Index-B-Performance,2976.html


----------



## eternal7trance

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Gainward GeForce GTX 680 Phantom 2 GB
> vs
> Zotac GeForce GTX 670 Amp!
> 
> 670 has faster clocks, but across all the benchmarks the 680 edges it:
> 
> http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/2012-vga-gpgpu/19-Tom-s-Hardware-Index-B-Performance,2976.html


Keep in mind that chart you linked only shows the "reported boost" but each card on that chart will boost differently than what the box says. So that chart isn't really correct unless they show the actual boost clocks.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eternal7trance*
> 
> Ignoring the 680s that have extreme overclocks if you look at the chart the 670 and 680 with near the same OC, they perform equally. This shouldn't be happening. I tried this with a 680 and a 670 myself because I didn't believe it. Sure enough I put both at a 1250 OC and they both came out identical in benchmarks and gaming.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1360884/official-top-30-unigine-valley-benchmark-1-0-fill-the-form-single-and-multi-monitors
> 
> Look at the top 30 single GPUs minus the three 680s with extreme overclocks.
> 
> 56 joblanx i7 3770k GTX 670 51,5 2155 1158
> 
> .
> 57 pwnzilla61 FX 8350 GTX 680 51,5 2153 432
> 
> .
> 58 Cakewalk_S i5 2500k GTX 670 51,4 2151 628
> 
> .
> 59 ahonenh i7 3770k GTX 680 51,3 2148 1031


you forgot 1





















1398mhz OC
http://cdn.overclock.net/c/c2/c2ea884f_valley_2013_02_17_21_06_28_247.jpeg


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> Korean 1440p PLS panels not affordable? IMO they're a steal.


links links links!

i tried to look for 1440p panels looked like i'd be spending $600 minimum,


----------



## eternal7trance

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> links links links!
> 
> i tried to look for 1440p panels looked like i'd be spending $600 minimum,


On ebay, search for qnix qx2700 or qx2710


----------



## Hokies83

My Lepi Hi Fi Amp Died NOOOOOOO i have to listen to my head phones till another one gets here NOOOOOO.....









Meanwhile... Chillen..


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cough cough, got my first profit in FIAT man!








0.1 locally.
Keep working boys!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My Lepi Hi Fi Amp Died NOOOOOOO i have to listen to my head phones till another one gets here NOOOOOO.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Meanwhile... Chillen..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


muchos nice and cute







!


----------



## Valgaur

Ugh.......... can't stand this waiting anymore! my 7970 Lightning is like an hour from me..... come on USPS GIMME!!!!


----------



## stickg1

Is it the UP4 or UD4H that's supposedly good for RAM OC'ing?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eternal7trance*
> 
> What about various people on OCN who tested overclocked 670s and overclocked 680s and they benchmarked the same?
> 
> Even Karlitos Unigen thread has 680s and 670s with the same overclocks performing equal.


It does depend on the quality of the card too, a golden 670 may beat average 680s, but all things equal the 680>670.
Then the system, cpu speed & type, system memory, overclocks, etc. Even in a graphics test a better/faster overall rig does make some difference.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you forgot 1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1398mhz OC
> http://cdn.overclock.net/c/c2/c2ea884f_valley_2013_02_17_21_06_28_247.jpeg


Good example, a great 670 that keeps up with many 680s, although 680s with similar clocks still come out ahead


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Ugh.......... can't stand this waiting anymore! my 7970 Lightning is like an hour from me..... come on USPS GIMME!!!!


Waiting kills me, this is why I drive hours to go to the store & leave with new toys. Waiting a day or 2 to get it shipped is the impatient time...
I was planning to get a 480 Lightning today, have to wait for the boss to let me know he loaded up my CC for me on the way.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Is it the UP4 or UD4H that's supposedly good for RAM OC'ing?


Both, the ud4h is the one to get from the ud series, the up series are all supposed to be better with memory as well.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Both, the ud4h is the one to get from the ud series, the up series are all supposed to be better with memory as well.


Okay cool, Newegg is offering $60 off on a UD4H and 3570K combo. Almost as cheap as MC when you consider tax and gas for MC. I might jump on it, unless this guy sells me his 2600K and Z68-UD4 for $250, then I will just use that until I can get my hands on something better.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Waiting kills me, this is why I drive hours to go to the store & leave with new toys. Waiting a day or 2 to get it shipped is the impatient time...
> I was planning to get a 480 Lightning today, have to wait for the boss to let me know he loaded up my CC for me on the way.
> Both, the ud4h is the one to get from the ud series, the up series are all supposed to be better with memory as well.


so sick of waiting........ I'm running my main rig on my poor 8800 gts.... things a monster but can only do so much lol my dual ultras dont cut it... they are kinda shot good thing they were cheap


----------



## ivanlabrie

Bake em!









I may score a 7950 it seems...now, which one to get for an air cooled workhorse?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Bake em!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may score a 7950 it seems...now, which one to get for an air cooled workhorse?


Air cooled /puke....

You want performance out of HD 79xx u needs water.. Atleast be a cheap skate and antec 620 mod it and put some ram sinks on the Vrms lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Opened my windows before I left this morning and just came home to a freezing room. YES! Pushing 1275Mhz out of the TFIII on cold air with core at 55c and VRM's at 67c and 60c







I used to love summer, but now idk.... I need to hurry up and save to water cool. So I want to go straight from the CPU block through both GPU's with no rads in between. I am determined to set it up like that (ie. Hokies setup). What do you guys think of this loop?

So could I go from pump to 30mm thick 360 rad and then to cpu and then through two GPUs and then to external 480 monsta rad and then to front 30mm thick 240 rad and then to resevoir and back to pump? That would make my life a whole lot easier if I could do something like that. I'm going to be using a Alphacool VPP655 Variable Speed Pump so I don't think flow will be a problem, right?


----------



## Solonowarion

Flow wouldnt be a problem. Component order doesnt matter but personaly I feel better having rads before components and after pump.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Waiting kills me, this is why I drive hours to go to the store & leave with new toys...


Waiting is a virtue, don't you know







...I'm not very good at it either...and I live only 7 min from a major NCIX store (and 30 from their biggest warehouse in Canada







)

*THERE WILL BE BLOOD...
*
...blood-red EK cooling liquids that is...had a bit of a learning experience: When having two reservoirs in one unified loop - keep one or the other closed tightly, otherwise EK's finest blood-red liquids will shoot up in the air...a roll of Kleenex later, and all is well...

...this is a monster *single* loop - just under 13 feet of PrimoChill Adv. LRT 1/2 - 3/4 tubing, 2.5 liters of liquids (not counting spilled







), 2 reservoirs, 2 MPC 655 pumps, 2 water blocks, 3 rads with a total of over 900mm / 60 mm cooling (incl. chill options), 12x 120mm fans, 2x 140mm fans, 2x 200mm fans - and finally, NO LEAKS, and after 1 1/2 hrs, no bubbles


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Flow wouldnt be a problem. Component order doesnt matter but personaly I feel better having rads before components and after pump.


Yea I hear ya. I was thinking about that, but I'm not sure how I would do that and have everything looking neat. I could probably go through the 240 and 480 and then hit my gpu's and the cpu and the go to the 360 and backto the res.


----------



## Hokies83

<-- wants that msi card


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Air cooled /puke....
> 
> You want performance out of HD 79xx u needs water.. Atleast be a cheap skate and antec 620 mod it and put some ram sinks on the Vrms lol.


Air is CHEEP!
I'll get water once I have moar profits.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm a huge fan of the TFIII. I'm currently mining with it with a 1300mhz core. My sapphire can only get up to 1165. I so regret getting it to crossfire with the MSI.....


When did you buy it? Voltage unlocked? And, what is the exact part name?
Thanks!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Waiting is a virtue, don't you know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I'm not very good at it either...and I live only 7 min from a major NCIX store (and 30 from their biggest warehouse in Canada
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> *THERE WILL BE BLOOD...
> *
> ...blood-red EK cooling liquids that is...had a bit of a learning experience: When having two reservoirs in one unified loop - keep one or the other closed tightly, otherwise EK's finest blood-red liquids will shoot up in the air...a roll of Kleenex later, and all is well...
> 
> ...this is a monster *single* loop - just under 13 feet of PrimoChill Adv. LRT 1/2 - 3/4 tubing, 2.5 liters of liquids (not counting spilled
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), 2 reservoirs, 2 MPC 655 pumps, 2 water blocks, 3 rads with a total of over 900mm / 60 mm cooling (incl. chill options), 12x 120mm fans, 2x 140mm fans, 2x 200mm fans - and finally, NO LEAKS, and after 1 1/2 hrs, no bubbles


Thinking back you should have saved the delidding with the razor until filling the loop, when asked about coolant you could say it has real human blood.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm a huge fan of the TFIII. I'm currently mining with it with a 1300mhz core. My sapphire can only get up to 1165. I so regret getting it to crossfire with the MSI.....


I though sapphire were supposed to be the better average cards, or was with 7970s?
1300 core on air is nice for any 79xx!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Me too...I'm about to get a Sapphire 4L 7950. It's the cheepest one atm.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Thinking back you should have saved the delidding with the razor until filling the loop, when asked about coolant you could say it has real human blood.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


...ohh, that







...it healed well ! Those were the days







before the hammer, wood and vise method

...the effect of the 'blood' is enhanced as the tubes are 'bloodshed-red' PrimoChills -- in addition to the blood-red EK liquids









...when I took the garbage out which had a whole ball of the used Kleenex visible that had soaked up the (blood-red) spill, my neighbor gave me that frightened look in the elevator


----------



## lilchronic

delided chip, only B1 and B2 single channel memory work


----------



## Ali Man

And that still makes you happy, lol.

4.2Ghz @ 1.256V ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

That chip was dead, technically...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> And that still makes you happy, lol.
> 
> 4.2Ghz @ 1.256V ?


Can't every chip do 4.2 on stock voltage lol.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> And that still makes you happy, lol.
> 
> 4.2Ghz @ 1.256V ?


heck yea! that chip is a beast. its immortal








Quote:


> Can't every chip do 4.2 on stock voltage lol.


nope only this one


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I though sapphire were supposed to be the better average cards, or was with 7970s?
> 1300 core on air is nice for any 79xx!


I hate my Sapphire haha. I find that the MSI TFIII is the exception. I feel like you have a better chance at getting a good overclocker if you buy that card. Just out of the consensus of people that I have heard talking about them, it seems that only a few found it to be a horrible overclocker. I'm going to sell my Sapphire ASAP and buy three more TFIII's haha. I am not really a "fanboy" of anything, but the TFIII is something that I love.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Air is CHEEP!
> I'll get water once I have moar profits.
> When did you buy it? Voltage unlocked? And, what is the exact part name?
> Thanks!


Of what? The Sapphire or the MSI?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Of what? The Sapphire or the MSI?


Which model Sapphire? Those are crappy clocks but I might buy it at the right price. Pm me if you really are selling.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I know we are quite off-topic -= but I HAD to share this with you guys in the UK:
This mouse (black or blue) is going for £5.99 with coupon: P7XAGSA7 - only going for 24hrs!
ABSOLUTELY GREAT MOUSE - buy it!
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00B0TMWTW/ref=noref?ie=UTF8&psc=1&s=computers

Not advertising or anything - just an absolutely lovely mouse...you can't even find a darn dell crap one for that price







!

I even got a black one sent for review - but I just purchased a blue one for my cousin


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eternal7trance*
> 
> On ebay, search for qnix qx2700 or qx2710


i would never buy a monitor like this on ebay lol
with no in store return policy i'm already at a loss. manufacturer warranty isn't enough









i appreciate you trying to help but ebay is a place that should never be mentioned







it is home of the DOA computer components, unless it's a known store selling which is in the few percentiles

Anyone else know a place besides newegg?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> i would never buy a monitor like this on ebay lol
> with no in store return policy i'm already at a loss. manufacturer warranty isn't enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i appreciate you trying to help but ebay is a place that should never be mentioned
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it is home of the DOA computer components, unless it's a known store selling which is in the few percentiles
> 
> Anyone else know a place besides newegg?


Mono Price.


----------



## Valgaur

Lets keep it cleaner in here lol


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> then lets keep it cleaner in here lol


AMEN TO THAT


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> AMEN TO THAT


got my new 7970 lightning here.... and man oh man are these things beefy and heavy tough buggers though.

and heres the list of parts from my free compuper parts run!

5 pentium 4 d 920's
2 160gig hdd's with xp on them
2 N6600 nvidia cards (yeah super old ones)
2 disk drives because I can?
2 heatsinks
8 stixs of RAM (not sure on speed but pretty sure ddr2 stuff)
and 2 300W (as far as I know) psu's

2 super crappy mobos desktop ones so crappers basically


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> got my new 7970 lightning here.... and man oh man are these things beefy and heavy tough buggers though.
> 
> and heres the list of parts from my free compuper parts run!
> 
> 5 pentium 4 d 920's
> 2 160gig hdd's with xp on them
> 2 N6600 nvidia cards (yeah super old ones)
> 2 disk drives because I can?
> 2 heatsinks
> 8 stixs of RAM (not sure on speed but pretty sure ddr2 stuff)
> and 2 300W (as far as I know) psu's
> 
> 2 super crappy mobos desktop ones so crappers basically


Nice! Have you put them through their paces yet? Are they the new version or the barely existent old version?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Nice! Have you put them through their paces yet? Are they the new version or the barely existent old version?


which things lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Nice! Have you put them through their paces yet? Are they the new version or the barely existent old version?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> which things lol


Ah, bet he's thinking the original lightning or the boost edition. I would expect the original one, boost & Ghz cards kinda suck.
I want to hear some results too, decent for benchies on air at least?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ah, bet he's thinking the original lightning or the boost edition. I would expect the original one, boost & Ghz cards kinda suck.
> I want to hear some results too, decent for benchies on air at least?


wont be playing with it today as I'm studying for a test tomorrow then i will







gonna pump lotsa cold air in and see what she can do, look like a good one so far, sitting at 1070 and 1400 mem right off the bat (n00b to AMD btw)


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wont be playing with it today as I'm studying for a test tomorrow then i will
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gonna pump lotsa cold air in and see what she can do, look like a good one so far, sitting at 1070 and 1400 mem right off the bat (n00b to AMD btw)


Cold air! I have plenty of cold air! I'm literally shivering with a winter coat on in my room right now, but it's worth it. Tomorrow is going to be 70F (guess I'm going to have to go out and do normal people stuff) and you can't beat 54c (on air) with 1300Mhz core on my TFIII 7950. Been going for hours at that temp


----------



## Hokies83

LoL if i let cold air in my gpus run at like 25c....

But im more then happy with 39c and letting my 4 rads with there 12 fans sucking heat out warm my house


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL if i let cold air in my gpus run at like 25c....
> 
> But im more then happy with 39c and letting my 4 rads with there 12 fans sucking heat out warm my house


Why I used to fold, it was an easy way to keep the cpu & gpus loaded to pump out enough heat to help warm the place.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL if i let cold air in my gpus run at like 25c....
> 
> But im more then happy with 39c and letting my 4 rads with there 12 fans sucking heat out warm my house


lol your case....eh, I mean walls of fans


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Guys, check this water cooled rig out. Probably the coolest design I have ever seen!

http://www.mod-planet.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=42360


----------



## dr/owned

^^ Does it say what hardware is in it. It always seems dudes with over the top cases end up running something lame like 560Ti's.

Unrelated, AX1200i arrived. Must be $20 in packaging alone.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ Does it say what hardware is in it. It always seems dudes with over the top cases end up running something lame like 560Ti's.
> 
> Unrelated, AX1200i arrived. Must be $20 in packaging alone.


I don't know, don't speak whatever-ese, but it is from 2007 hahaha. I just love the case design and its really original. Valgaur should copy it







What is the 1200i for?


----------



## FtW 420

Still a very cool looking rig, he made the old steam engine look work well.


----------



## dr/owned

Didn't look at the date. I was thinking "Steam Punk" is a bit overdone nowadays, but in 2007 it was original.

680 Lightning overclocked and overvolted consumes more than the 12V rail of my X-1250 could handle, resulting in the PSU switching off during load spikes of BF3 (scrapmetal 64 player server). Stupid design. V12_2 is PCI-e and is 30A, V12_3 is PCI-e as well and is 45A. make both 45A and I wouldn't have this problem. XFX/Seasonic advertise it (1250W and 1000W gold/platinum variants) as "single rail" assuming you'll never exceed 30A to find out it isn't. AX1200i is 104A of true single rail.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Didn't look at the date. I was thinking "Steam Punk" is a bit overdone nowadays, but in 2007 it was original.
> 
> 680 Lightning overclocked and overvolted consumes more than the 12V rail of my X-1250 could handle, resulting in the PSU switching off during load spikes of BF3 (scrapmetal 64 player server). Stupid design. V12_2 is PCI-e and is 30A, V12_3 is PCI-e as well and is 45A. make both 45A and I wouldn't have this problem. XFX/Seasonic advertise it (1250W and 1000W gold/platinum variants) as "single rail" assuming you'll never exceed 30A to find out it isn't. AX1200i is 104A of true single rail.


I hear that, I loved the silverstone 1500w psu until the 680 lightnings, but with multi 25A rails a 1500W PSU becomes only good enough for sli, can't even bench tri sli properly without adding a second PSU because the stupid thing has 4 x 8pin + 6pin pci-e cables.


----------



## ivanlabrie

https://mega.co.nz/#!1ZsV2SJb!KXdgUWSoRGGtGdv5fGNsfX6lV_5a0_uszuJY1yQuEzo

I'll leave this here...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> lol your case....eh, I mean walls of fans


...just fired up the siamed loop...deliided Ivy was lapped today and in this loop dropped another 10 C...idling and light loads AT ambinet w'all 4 cores identical (!) at 21 C...but the 3970X ran hotter than I thought, after mounting it with CL-U on the IHS... turned out to be a major concave / convex IHS Water-block issue...the worst I have ever seen...remounting with MX4 dropped temps of the Sandy-E 25 C ! Now everything i ready to take advantage of the monster loop w/13 feet and more fans than I'll admit to in public


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice! Make sure to watch that vid man...









I think I'm gonna get wc for my gpu, at least antec mod.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nice! Make sure to watch that vid man...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I'm gonna get wc for my gpu, at least antec mod.


...planning on GPU W-C as well with a separate loop later (once I know more about 780s / 8970s)...right now, I've got 5 cards I'm moving between two primary machines in various configs...a ""normal"" w-c loop would get in the way of freely moving them, but there are some custom options I'm think about...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...planning on GPU W-C as well with a separate loop later (once I know more about 780s / 8970s)...right now, I've got 5 cards I'm moving between two primary machines in various configs...a ""normal"" w-c loop would get in the way of freely moving them, but there are some custom options I'm think about...


I do the standard LP treatment to mine...got a 6950 atm and a HIS 7950 incoming.
I'll resell the 6950 in two months and grab a second 7950 or maybe resell both and grab dual 7970s for wc.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lets keep it cleaner in here lol


...speaking of which, I saw Alatar (forum moderator) post the item below at a GPU thread...good advice, I think: _"Okay guys keep it civil and on topic. Attack the argument instead of the user and don't type in the word fanboy and everything is fine..."_

...then again, this could be almost too civil for us


----------



## Arm3nian

All this talk about cold air... it's about 90 outside over here lol. I left a thermometer outside the other day and it got up to 131 degrees.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> All this talk about cold air... it's about 90 outside over here lol. I left a thermometer outside the other day and it got up to 131 degrees.


eeeeeeeeew its still around 40°F here


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> eeeeeeeeew its still around 40°F here


Frozen tundra > desert


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Frozen tundra > desert


Bikini > parka


----------



## lilchronic

80* F in sunny florida today








@ val how do u get the degree symbol?


----------



## FtW 420

alt + 2 + 4 + 8 all at once. °


----------



## ivanlabrie

You and your strange farenheit degrees...use C guys. You can directly relate to your case and component temps that way.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Bikini > parka


...UBC nude beach > Bikini


----------



## lilchronic

° ° awsome!







i learn somthing new every day. lolz


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...UBC nude beach > Bikini


i kinda feel bad for ppl that dont live near the beach.







lol i have to live near the ocean


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i kinda feel bad for ppl that dont live near the beach.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol i have to live near the ocean


I live in the woods in the mountains ....

Id rather live in Vegas tho... After a friend who just went and came back sent me a link to a web site of the girls u can pick from....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I live in the woods in the mountains ....


...sorry to rub it in...I live by the beach, woods, snow-capped mountains - in a big metro area - 15 min from here is a mountain with tram, wolves, grizzly bears and skiing...says so in the tourist brochure


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I live in the woods in the mountains ....
> 
> Id rather live in Vegas tho... After a friend who just went and came back sent me a link to a web site of the girls u can pick from....


cali is where its at, last time i went out there to visit, holy crap every angle you turn your head there is a fine ass chick








you wont no what to do confusion sets in lolz


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Bikini > parka


Bikini? There is 1 lake and you can't even swim in it because there is a drought lol.


----------



## SonDa5

You delid guys sure do get off topic easy.


----------



## tw33k

The voltage on my OC Formula appears to be jumping all over the place according to CPU-Z and Aida64, dropping as low as 1.232v all the way up to 1.256v (averaging 1.248v). It was bothering me so I bought a DMM and tested it. It reported the voltage as 1.237v so the board is reporting an average of 0.01v too much (and as much as 0.019v)



Also, I'm spending a week in Vegas in October....can't wait


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> The voltage on my OC Formula appears to be jumping all over the place according to CPU-Z and Aida64, dropping as low as 1.232v all the way up to 1.256v (averaging 1.248v). It was bothering me so I bought a DMM and tested it. It reported the voltage as 1.237v so the board is reporting an average of 0.01v too much (and as much as 0.019v)
> 
> 
> 
> Also, I'm spending a week in Vegas in October....can't wait


what bios are you using ?
for me at 5ghz LLC1 cpu-z reads 1.376v - 1.384v. my DMM reads 1.379v -1.383v. im using the latest bios 2.0


----------



## tw33k

I went to a website for Vegas call girls and the pics of the girls they claimed were available were actually of porn stars.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, maybe they double as actresses and call girls...wouldn't surprise me one bit. They may even shoot there in Vegas too.

Argh, I can't wait to get my pentium d 820 and 7950.







The p4 631 is kinda too slow for me. That will serve me well while I cough *save* cough enough for a new board and some wc and ln2/dice gear.


----------



## tw33k

I have it on good authority that the pictures of the girls on those websites and on the cards that are handed out in the streets are not the girls that arrive when you call.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...UBC nude beach > Bikini


Mankini > anything.


----------



## ivanlabrie




----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mankini > anything.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*


Yes...
I hope he meant mankini <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< anything


----------



## ivanlabrie

Kids these days...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

No I look fabulous in it.
Hahaha.


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol xD

Pics or it didn't happen (?)

...

No please, don't!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> No I look fabulous in it.
> Hahaha.


?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I know a guy here who likes his escorts, his biggest complaint is when you call them up for the girl in the pic, they always try to send her mom instead...


lol...yeah. If you can't trust an escort agency who can you trust?


----------



## stickg1

I don't have a main rig anymore. I need to get to MC so I can delid something...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I don't have a main rig anymore. I need to get to MC so I can delid something...


burn the money!!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

ahaha Hokies is making it very hard to "keep this thread clean". I love it


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> burn the money!!!


...while talking about burning money...the 3970X seems well-behaved with its 6c/12t on v-core:


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> ahaha Hokies is making it very hard to "keep this thread clean". I love it


Eh well it is a " Club " and de lidding has never been the onlything we talk about...

If it was this thread would be very boring...

Also all my Hot chic pic posts were removed.. a Mr u know who musta reported them....

I do not see how hot chic pics break any rules... They had all there clothes on and everything was covered.. Ive seen ALOT Worse avatars then those pics here lol.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Eh well it is a " Club " and de lidding has never been the onlything we talk about...
> 
> If it was this thread would be very boring...
> 
> Also all my Hot chic pic posts were removed.. a Mr u know who musta reported them....
> 
> I do not see how hot chic pics break any rules... They had all there clothes on and everything was covered.. Ive seen ALOT Worse avatars then those pics here lol.


AGREED


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...while talking about burning money...the 3970X seems well-behaved with its 6c/12t on v-core:











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Eh well it is a " Club " and de lidding has never been the onlything we talk about...
> 
> If it was this thread would be very boring...
> 
> Also all my Hot chic pic posts were removed.. a Mr u know who musta reported them....
> 
> I do not see how hot chic pics break any rules... They had all there clothes on and everything was covered.. Ive seen ALOT Worse avatars then those pics here lol.


Hot bikini chicks not allowed on OCN? Discrimination against fabric-challenged females is wrong!

Someone should be teased mercilessly for disliking hot chicks....


----------



## Swag

Here an updated version of my system (H100i installed):

Pictures are bad because I don't have a lighting setup anymore and it was with an iPhone 5


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## snowfree52

so clean !


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Here an updated version of my system (H100i installed):
> 
> Pictures are bad because I don't have a lighting setup anymore and it was with an iPhone 5
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


...that is --- beautiful !


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Very nice Swag


----------



## Solonowarion

Man this thread has halted! Looks great SWAG


----------



## homestyle

Yeah this thread is now about unicorns.

Cant believe a mod hasn't come in to regulate the thread. Its a shame to. So much good information is lost among the gibberish.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Yeah this thread is now about unicorns.
> 
> Cant believe a mod hasn't come in to regulate the thread. Its a shame to. So much good information is lost among the gibberish.


Your information is in the OP.


----------



## Scott1541

I'll have to step in and help









So yeah, delidding, how's it going? Good?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Yeah this thread is now about unicorns.
> 
> Cant believe a mod hasn't come in to regulate the thread. Its a shame to. So much good information is lost among the gibberish.


seriously.....seriously?
What "good information" is being lost?

Man people forget that we're human beings and interaction is a key element to our living.
Yet people still insist to be over the top serious and on the point the whole time (I'm talking about typing on a forum)
Good news though - you'll probably go down well to be a mod - so get applying.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Yeah this thread is now about unicorns.
> 
> Cant believe a mod hasn't come in to regulate the thread. Its a shame to. So much good information is lost among the gibberish.


Im not talking about the type of content, just that it has slowed down quite a bit.

Unicorns FTW


----------



## Inacoma79

Once I delid my shirt and go under water, ill be dropping some crazy temps! I'm thinking spreading a thin layer of SPF 30, what do you all think? XD


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Yeah this thread is now about unicorns.
> 
> Cant believe a mod hasn't come in to regulate the thread. Its a shame to. So much good information is lost among the gibberish.


ahaha it is Valgaurs thread and he approves of the open discussion. Important info is on the first page. It's not like anyone comes here anymore since now people delid with a vice and hammer. Sometimes we need a break about talking about delidding everyday and just want to talk about other stuff. That's a big part of life ya know, discussion


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Im not talking about the type of content, just that it has slowed down quite a bit.
> 
> Unicorns FTW


Why drag me into this? I have no unicorns...


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like earth ponies more...or a pegasus maybe.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I like earth ponies more...or a pegasus maybe.


Pegasus is cooler, death from above!

pegAsus too...


----------



## ivanlabrie

I was talking ponies brah...








As in see my sig









Had to post this: http://cheezburger.com/67333


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was talking ponies brah...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As in see my sig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Had to post this: http://cheezburger.com/67333


I've been trying to find the right meme to post in response but it doesn't seem to be out there....


----------



## ivanlabrie

...and no meme's were posted that day.
I don't like meme's really...post something witty.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> ahaha it is Valgaurs thread and he approves of the open discussion. Important info is on the first page. It's not like anyone comes here anymore since now people delid with a vice and hammer. Sometimes we need a break about talking about delidding everyday and just want to talk about other stuff. That's a big part of life ya know, discussion


agreed, it';s a club where we can disguss things not just delidding as with delidding we have 1700+ posts in here almost 1800, get a little bland after a while lol. We are here mainly as a form of information and how to exactly do it and for diagnosis








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I was talking ponies brah...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As in see my sig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Had to post this: http://cheezburger.com/67333


New book mark








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> ...and no meme's were posted that day.
> I don't like meme's really...post something witty.


I agree memes get a little old after a while but most are still pretty good.


----------



## Swag

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *snowfree52*
> 
> so clean !


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Here an updated version of my system (H100i installed):
> 
> Pictures are bad because I don't have a lighting setup anymore and it was with an iPhone 5
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...that is --- beautiful !
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Very nice Swag


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Man this thread has halted! Looks great SWAG






Thanks guys!







I appreciate the comments! What are some additions you guys think would look great in this? I was thinking of making a custom red sticker for my 680 but unsure.









Also, UNICORNS ARE THE BOMB! I see them every week (once a week). I'm joking! I see pegasus...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 
> Thanks guys!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I appreciate the comments! What are some additions you guys think would look great in this? I was thinking of making a custom red sticker for my 680 but unsure.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, UNICORNS ARE THE BOMB! I see them every week (once a week). I'm joking! I see pegasus...


The white on the gpu is really the only thing that distracts from the look. I wouldn't go full red for a sticker, mostly black with a red 'racing stripe' about as thick as the red on the memory would look nice.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Swag, why do more for an already beautiful rig. I can't see anything more apart from led lights if you want


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Swag, why do more for an already beautiful rig. I can't see anything more apart from led lights if you want


Not a fan of LED lights, I search for perfection and in my eyes, it ain't perfect... What I hate is the fact that the cables for my front fans are just hanging in the back...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Stop being so complacent woman! You won't be seeing those cables anyway! Haha


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Stop being so complacent woman! You won't be seeing those cables anyway! Haha


Yea I know, but I still like knowing that the build is perfect inside and out.









I really want a 1200W PSU even though I don't need it!


----------



## Arm3nian

Can someone with an h100 do me a favor.









The molex shield fell off and now the 2 connectors are mixed up. I need to know which connector is the 12v and which is the ground. They are attached next to the the fan header wire, then the 2 molex connectors. I think the 12v connector (that fits into a yellow female connector) is the one in the middle of the fan wire and the other molex connector wire, and the one on the end is the ground. So Fan wire - 12v - ground.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Here an updated version of my system (H100i installed):
> 
> Pictures are bad because I don't have a lighting setup anymore and it was with an iPhone 5
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Cable Management like a boss. HA! Management.....Boss, it's funny cause.. well nvm


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Can any of you inform me?

http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/850#post_19830850


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> Can any of you inform me?
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/850#post_19830850


Your Raystorm is touching the die directly currently?

I'd personally recommend using CLU only under the IHS and not bare as it can cause some issues and it's not even limited to the block or cpu cooler, it's actually hazardous because it conducts electricity, so a little off the mobo and you can easily shot-circuit some stuff.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Can someone with an h100 do me a favor.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The molex shield fell off and now the 2 connectors are mixed up. I need to know which connector is the 12v and which is the ground. They are attached next to the the fan header wire, then the 2 molex connectors. I think the 12v connector (that fits into a yellow female connector) is the one in the middle of the fan wire and the other molex connector wire, and the one on the end is the ground. So Fan wire - 12v - ground.


I can't be certain, but the last time I checked, the black is the ground (-), yellow is usually your (+12) and the red is mostly (+5).
For confirmation, use a volt meter just to be sure.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> You delid guys sure do get off topic easy.


You think?
I'm glad someone else noticed.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Your Raystorm is touching the die directly currently?
> 
> I'd personally recommend using CLU only under the IHS and not bare as it can cause some issues and it's not even limited to the block or cpu cooler, it's actually hazardous because it conducts electricity, so a little off the mobo and you can easily shot-circuit some stuff.


nope i have CLU on die and PK-3 on the raystorm

my heatkiller 79x0 has CLU on it with the GPU dye, just worried that in X amount of time ill have a hole and leak if the clu eats the copper block alive. i'm going to redo my waterblock tomorrow but i hope i dont gain more than 10C, with CLU i have ridiculous low temps on a high oc 7970 , would hate to lose all the temps


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> nope i have CLU on die and PK-3 on the raystorm
> 
> my heatkiller 79x0 has CLU on it with the GPU dye, just worried that in X amount of time ill have a hole and leak if the clu eats the copper block alive. i'm going to redo my waterblock tomorrow but i hope i dont gain more than 10C, with CLU i have ridiculous low temps on a high oc 7970 , would hate to lose all the temps


Lol, bad move man. CLU is the best there is but it isn't good for all applications. Most of these contact surfaces are made of Copper, if not then nickel, but I'm sure it eats copper up pretty bad.


----------



## ivanlabrie

It doesn't eat copper, it just blends with it. It'll leave a nasty stain that's all. No performance loss or anything, if anything it'll improve heat transfer.
It does eat through aluminum but not copper nor nickel.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Lol, bad move man. CLU is the best there is but it isn't good for all applications. Most of these contact surfaces are made of Copper, if not then nickel, but I'm sure it eats copper up pretty bad.


Please don't post opinions. it's frustrating enough when you spread false information and a new member reads it and spreads it to more people. I'm not trying to be rude, but honest.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It doesn't eat copper, it just blends with it. It'll leave a nasty stain that's all. No performance loss or anything, if anything it'll improve heat transfer.
> It does eat through aluminum but not copper nor nickel.


i appreciate the help ivanlabrie, i did some research but could not draw a conclusion, i knew with aluminum it was a no-go but i was worried with over time on copper if it would actually eat through it. i know it can get thick and "weld" to the block but for long term use i dont know if i should just replace it with PK-3 or enjoy the great temps


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well I did use it on my Silver Arrow's base which is nickel plated copper, for like 4 months. No problem whatsoever...


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> Please don't post opinions. it's frustrating enough when you spread false information and a new member reads it and spreads it to more people. I'm not trying to be rude, but honest.


Man I'm amazed you used CLU regardless of even researching a bit of how it's NOT GOOD for most cpu coolers or blocks for that matter. More importantly, removing it off the IHS is a real big pain and it surely does void warranty.

And there's nothing false with what I said. It may not eat it theoretically, but it screws it up, leaving you to the same situation.


----------



## MKHunt

To be fair, voiding warranty by aggressively cleaning the IHS is really not even relevant in a delidding club is it? It's like saying that running an aftermarket air filter on your turbocharged BMW E39 would void the warranty on the intake system.

I believe all it does is stain, and Intel was fine with warrantying my 1st 2600k after I used IC Diamond on it which (surprise!) stains. All hard metals have pores and grooves (most liquid metals too) so if one soft metal is easily pressed into those grooves, hello stain central. Since the lettering is a laser etch, it's going to suffer.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Man I'm amazed you used CLU regardless of even researching a bit of how it's NOT GOOD for most cpu coolers or blocks for that matter. More importantly, removing it off the IHS is a real big pain and it surely does void warranty.
> 
> And there's nothing false with what I said. It may not eat it theoretically, but it screws it up, leaving you to the same situation.


I'm using CLP for direct DIE to nickel plated block and high quality copper block and apart from difficulties in cleaning the stuff works great for cooling and no bonding or metal corrosion going on. I have been using it for about 8 months.


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I'm using CLP for direct DIE to nickel plated block and high quality copper block and apart from difficulties in cleaning the stuff works great for cooling and no bonding or metal corrosion going on. I have been using it for about 8 months.


It of course is the best form of heat transfer. But using it for GPU's wouldn't make much sense as they already run really cool under water. For CPU's, it's different.

Have you done a comparison with the before and after temps with using a different really good TIm like MX-4?


----------



## Valgaur

CLU on my H100 block for..... well since October to tired to count right now







your fine with copper trust me just leaves a stain is all.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> CLU on my H100 block for..... well since October to tired to count right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> your fine with copper trust me just leaves a stain is all.


mx-4 stained mine because I didn't clean it for like 3 months.

Anyway, this pump is terrible besides its cooling potential. I switched the connectors and from my luck followed a picture that showed the wrong way to do it... so now I fried my 2nd one. Still probably works but no lights. I know molex sucks in general but the one they used on the h100 is unacceptable.

Either air or custom loop i'm so fed up with this closed loop crap. Hope my uncle doesn't mind a semi destroyed cooler.


----------



## stickg1

CLU/CLP is good for anything whether it is CPU or GPU. The reason being it has a really high thermal conductivity. It transfers as well, if not better, than if it were soldered to the other item. You might only get a few degrees on your GPU or between your IHS and heatsink/waterblock, but it's still better. It does not work with aluminum. It will corrode. It will work with copper and nickel, it will leave a stain, it can be cleaned with metal polish and IPA.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Ali Man, stop posting nonsense








I'm glad so many members showed up to provide more information
*Thanks for the help guys!!!*


----------



## Hokies83

Hulk smash build log... Needs a G1 Sniper 3 for the Green.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Yay I put my 3770K in a vise and it took 2 whacks till I think I felt something then when I hit it the third time I saw it move. So I stopped and wiggled the chip till it came off. I then used my fingernails and a toothpick to clean off most of the gunk that was on there. Later I used some Goo Gone and let it sit for a minute or so. Then I cleaned it all off with some isopropyl alcohol. I then took some pics and then I lapped the heat spreader, starting with 120 grit and went all the way to 2500 grit. I have some Liquid Ultra on the way to the house so by tomorrow I should be putting it all back together. Here are the few pics that came out clear.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> Yay I put my 3770K in a vise and it took 2 whacks till I think I felt something then when I hit it the third time I saw it move. So I stopped and wiggled the chip till it came off. I then used my fingernails and a toothpick to clean off most of the gunk that was on there. Later I used some Goo Gone and let it sit for a minute or so. Then I cleaned it all off with some isopropyl alcohol. I then took some pics and then I lapped the heat spreader, starting with 120 grit and went all the way to 2500 grit. I have some Liquid Ultra on the way to the house so by tomorrow I should be putting it all back together. Here are the few pics that came out clear.


nicely done sir









Give me your info for the front pages member listing!


----------



## Joa3d43

*CL-P / U, MX4...*

...I have been putting the finishing touches on the 'siamesed' RIVE and MVE build...got 'a little bit sidetracked' putting the 3970X through some early competitive HWBot stuff (success)...but now back to the 'cosmetic improvements' re cable and cooling tube management...in the process of building this up, I removed the 3770K in the MVE which was running CL-U on both the die and the IHS...after 3 months or so, *CL-U did not leave any visible marks* (serial # etching had already been cleaned off in prior mods), and a liberal application of Isopropanol on Kleenex cleaned up *ALL traces* of CL-U from the previous application.









...both the 3770K and 3970X are great low-v performers (both validate at 1.36+ - v @ 5 GHz) but both had VERY *concave* IHS' (a relationship to low v ? ?







) - way beyond what my other chips have... It is there where CL products can pose a problem...for the 3770K, I got around that as I did dome serious lapping of the IHS, starting with 600 grid and finalizing with 2000 grid sand paper...once done, a new thin layer of CL-U on both die and (lapped) IHS dropped temps even more...combined with the siamesed triple-rad loop, 5 GHz at Cinebench has a.) fairly uniform core temps and b.) stays in the high 50ies C range for max core temp now.

...but the *3970X initially had some temp issues* with even a 'solid' application of *CL-U..*..in spite off correct water-block to IHS mounting, there clearly remained a 'cavity' between the IHS and the block. I knew from previous experience that MX4 is much better (and safer!) to fill such cavities, and once I applied MX4, temps went down dramatically...by over 20 C in Cinebench at 5 GHz for the Sandy-E. I suppose I could have applied 'more CL-U' into the cavity, but the problem is dosage...too much and it will start to run out and hit electronically sensitive components...not enough and the cavity remains in some shape or form...and lapping a brand-new $1000+ CPU was not in the cards (...yet, may do so later)...also keep in mind that the 3970X has a much bigger die / IHS than the 3770K (and thus potentially bigger cavity with a concave IHS). So MX4 solved the problem nicely.

...per multiple earlier post I have done on CL and MX products, both my own experience and repeatable YouTube experiments between CL-P, CL-U and MX4 suggest that CL-U has the best temp performance, followed closely by CL-P and MX4 (in some tests, MX4 actually beats CL-P)...bottom line: If your IHS i/ water-block is not too concave / convex and involves no aluminum, CL-U is the best choice, followed by CL-P...but if there are such shape issues and you don't want to lap (and in the process remove CPU serial info etc), then go for MX4...

...finally, whether CPU or GPU get TIM applications, in all cases, copper or Nickel/copper are 'ok' for CL and other liquid metal products, aluminum is definitely NOT...some caution is in order as many GPU 'blocks' actually have flattened copper (or nickel/copper) bottoms that are embedded in an aluminum assembly, with some minor amount of aluminum also touching the die area...in that case, either stick to MX4 entirely, or apply it on the aluminum bits (usually very thin stripes) before applying CL products on the die.


----------



## Scott1541

If you use CLU on the die and then a less conductive TIM on the IHS like for example MX-4, then doesn't the TIM on the IHS 'bottleneck' the heat transfer from the die to the heatsink? Or does the greater surface area of the IHS reduce the problem enough so that it isn't really an issue?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *CL-P / U, MX4...*
> 
> ...I have been putting the finishing touches on the 'siamesed' RIVE and MVE build...


Pictures...


----------



## Hokies83

BTW Today is my 30th Birth day ,,,,, Now waiting for the Love From Bite Marks ... like he gave me 2 hrs after i got out of Surgery..


----------



## FtW 420

Happy Bday!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Pictures...


...soon - making it a separate 'build-log'...here is a tiny quick peek from Wednesday before re-routing and dressing of cables...I'm still offending the beauty police







...note the (temporary) labels on the tubes...9 separate pieces


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> BTW Today is my 30th Birth day ,,,,, Now waiting for the Love From Bite Marks ... like he gave me 2 hrs after i got out of Surgery..










Happy Birthday to YOOUU


----------



## ivanlabrie

Happy Bday Hokies!








Hope you got something special planned, maybe a short weekend trip to Vegas?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> BTW Today is my 30th Birth day ,,,,, Now waiting for the Love From Bite Marks ... like he gave me 2 hrs after i got out of Surgery..


Happy birthday!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...soon - making it a separate 'build-log'...here is a tiny quick peek from Wednesday before re-routing and dressing of cables...I'm still offending the beauty police
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...note the (temporary) labels on the tubes...9 separate pieces


Nice! A true "desktop" build! It literally takes up the entire top of the desk!


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Happy Bday Hokies!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope you got something special planned, maybe a short weekend trip to Vegas?


lol...careful or your posts will be removed


----------



## lilchronic

Happy bday!
now check out my ghetto water loop for my gpu's








only a 90$ loop


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Happy bday!
> now check out my ghetto water loop for my gpu's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only a 90$ loop


Not bad for $90, it has got a lot of potential.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Not bad for $90, it has got a lot of potential.


yea it will get there, but its not as nice as you rig though







thay baby is clean


----------



## ivanlabrie

$90? What are the parts?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Happy Bday Hokies!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope you got something special planned, maybe a short weekend trip to Vegas?


I'll let him stay in my room instead of the garage for his bday.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I'll let him stay in my room instead of the garage for his bday.


I wouldnt, no cleaning crew on the planet could clean the stains..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Nice! A true "desktop" build! It literally takes up the entire top of the desk!


...actually, it's only 1/4 of the 'desk' (=formerly a dining room table) that also has 2x 27 inch and 1x 22 inch monitors...and after moving some other machines out, my 'desk' is down to 6 keyboards and 6 mice

...seriously though - the main advantages I was hoping for (overall great mobo component cooling and access in addition to a monster loop that can handle anything the CPUs dish out) have already materialized...just trying to find the time & discipline now to finish the 'non-essential beauty components, *instead of* benching the two ROGs Oc'ed to beyond5 giiggles to see where the new limits are...luckily, it's a Friday


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> $90? What are the parts?


pump and res for 90$
i took a 240 and two EK - VGA supreme HF water blocks from my brother 







and a bunch of fittings

the only thing im missing are some heatsinks on my vrm and power moduals ? i think they'er called.

ive checked with a laser heat gun and they where about 80c max in crysis3 is that ok ?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> pump and res for 90$
> i took a 240 and two EK - VGA supreme HF water blocks from my brother
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and a bunch of fittings


Nice! What else can we take from your brother? I'm pretty big and wouldnt mind strong arming someone for some decent parts. Just give me the address and I'll share the loots??


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Nice! What else can we take from your brother? I'm pretty big and wouldnt mind strong arming someone for some decent parts. Just give me the address and I'll share the loots??


a bunch of stuff








but robbing him would be a death wish if u tried.







it sucks cause im a felon i cant get my license to carry a concealed weapon


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> pump and res for 90$
> i took a 240 and two EK - VGA supreme HF water blocks from my brother
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and a bunch of fittings
> 
> the only thing im missing are some heatsinks on my vrm and power moduals ? i think they'er called.
> 
> ive checked with a laser heat gun and they where about 80c max in crysis3 is that ok ?


Cool! I thought you scored wc stuff from aliexpress at first glance...magicool stuffs.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> a bunch of stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but robbing him would be a death wish if u tried.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it sucks cause im a felon i cant get my license to carry a concealed weapon


Stupid laws!!

I'm not much for robbery or larceny unfortunately, lol. Guess I'll just have to make it count at Micro Center this weekend.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Stupid laws!!
> 
> I'm not much for robbery or larceny unfortunately, lol. Guess I'll just have to make it count at Micro Center this weekend.


lol me either. just drugslol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Stupid laws!!
> 
> I'm not much for robbery or larceny unfortunately, lol. Guess I'll just have to make it count at Micro Center this weekend.


Unfortunately?









Some reading for more info...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Stupid laws!!
> 
> *I'm not much for robbery or larceny* unfortunately, lol. Guess I'll just have to make it count at Micro Center this weekend.


I hear ya. I'm not a huge fan of doing the same thing twice either.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Nice! What else can we take from your brother? I'm pretty big and wouldnt mind strong arming someone for some decent parts. Just give me the address and I'll share the loots??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> a bunch of stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but robbing him would be a death wish if u tried.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it sucks cause im a felon i cant get my license to carry a concealed weapon
Click to expand...

Move to Florida, you can buy a gun off the street legally...


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Happy bday!
> now check out my ghetto water loop for my gpu's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> only a 90$ loop


You mean after stealing your brothers parts, it costed you $90, lol?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I hear ya. I'm not a huge fan of doing the same thing twice either.


----------



## chronicfx

Can't remember who was inquiring. The Ripjaw-Z 2400's booted right up at XMP on my UD5h and 3570k. All is right in my world!


----------



## tw33k

Got 5GHz stable...


Booted and validated 5.2GHz I didn't spend much time on it so might be able to lower the voltage and go even higher


----------



## illuz

Very nice chip you have there!


----------



## tw33k

Temps are great which gives me room for higher clock speeds if I can keep the voltage down


----------



## HiLuckyB

*Update*

After getting some CLU, I dropped another 14c from using MX-2 on everything. Now im running at 4.9GHz -1.456v at 70c









OCN name: HiLuckyB
CPU: i7 3770K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 200MHz
OC after delid: 4.9GHz
Temp drops: 26c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2785614

http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/49GHzCLUMX-4.jpg.html


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Can't remember who was inquiring. The Ripjaw-Z 2400's booted right up at XMP on my UD5h and 3570k. All is right in my world!


That's great to know, looks like they finally did something right with all those bios upgrades, good stuff!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Pretty god chip man...congrats.


----------



## Joa3d43

...this certainly isn't a competition - but these two 'Siamese Twins' are currently competing at HWBot - thus my efforts to build a SHARED monster w-c loop for both:

VID



CPU-Z vCore per 5 GHZ OCN tables

3970X = 1.36v @ 5 GHz; 3770K = 1.528v @ 5.31+ GHz (1.35v @ 5 GHz ?)


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...this certainly isn't a competition - but these two 'Siamese Twins' are currently competing at HWBot - thus my efforts to build a SHARED monster w-c loop for both:
> 
> VID
> 
> 
> 
> CPU-Z vCore per 5 GHZ OCN tables
> 
> 3970X = 1.36v @ 5 GHz; 3770K = 1.528v @ 5.31+ GHz (1.35v @ 5 GHz ?)


Teach me how to run a computer with only 8 cpu's and some motherboards! Lol, your signature is too funny.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Teach me how to run a computer with only 8 cpu's and some motherboards! Lol, your signature is too funny.


...in a strange sort of way...it all makes sense !

- two primary'play' systems (ROGs) with 3970X and delidded 3770K (1x ROG R-IV-EX; 1x ROG M-V-EX)

- 6 secondary 'work' systems in VM/Virtual Machine (1x Asus Sabertooth Z77, 5x Asus P8Z77V-LK) all with 3770 (non-Ks) w /v t-D

...really not that mysterious


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...in a strange sort of way...it all makes sense !
> 
> - two primary'play' systems (ROGs) with 3970X and delidded 3770K (1x ROG R-IV-EX; 1x ROG M-V-EX)
> 
> - 6 secondary 'work' systems in VM/Virtual Machine (1x Asus Sabertooth Z77, 5x Asus P8Z77V-LK) all with 3770 (non-Ks) w /v t-D
> 
> ...really not that mysterious


Any xeons in the future?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Any xeons in the future?


...intelligent question ! But we're coming from XEON's over the last decade...Ivys in Virtual Machine are being tested out as XEON replacements - so far, so good, so much cheaper re surrounding infrastructure


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HiLuckyB*
> 
> *Update*
> 
> After getting some CLU, I dropped another 14c from using MX-2 on everything. Now im running at 4.9GHz -1.456v at 70c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: HiLuckyB
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 200MHz
> OC after delid: 4.9GHz
> Temp drops: 26c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2785614
> 
> http://s193.photobucket.com/user/HiLuckyB/media/My PC/49GHzCLUMX-4.jpg.html


Updated!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...this certainly isn't a competition - but these two 'Siamese Twins' are currently competing at HWBot - thus my efforts to build a SHARED monster w-c loop for both:
> 
> VID
> 
> 
> 
> CPU-Z vCore per 5 GHZ OCN tables
> 
> 3970X = 1.36v @ 5 GHz; 3770K = 1.528v @ 5.31+ GHz (1.35v @ 5 GHz ?)


gimme that chip!!!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> gimme that chip!!!!!


...ahem, which one ?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...ahem, which one ?


both








naw! val can have the 3770k ill take the 3970x


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> both
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> naw! val can have the 3770k ill take the 3970x


...I am afraid there is FtW ahead of you with his LN2 pot and 800L of LN2...he lives in my extended neighborhood


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> both
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> naw! val can have the 3770k ill take the 3970x


exactly both!!!!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I am afraid there is FtW ahead of you with his LN2 pot and 800L of LN2...he lives in my extended neighborhood


FTW might be first in line, but im second for a free 3970x


----------



## Hokies83

? free stuff Where? ill take anything with a board with more then 3 PCI-E 16x slots lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> exactly both!!!!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> FTW might be first in line, but im second for a free 3970x


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> ? free stuff Where? ill take anything with a board with more then 3 PCI-E 16x slots lol.


...NUTS ! ...keep on dreaming









...I need these goodies myself - as of the time of writing, I managed to get 3d11 and 3d Vantage records for 670 (and some beyond re other GPUs) for 'Trifecta' *SLI*. *tri-SLI* and *quad-SLI*...also got some more Firestrike stuff ...quad-Vantage score was *65560*









http://www.overclock.net/t/325228/post-your-3dmark-vantage-scores-here/2110#post_19854625


----------



## chronicfx

Liking the new ripjaws! I5 3570k over 10000 physics









http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6488387

Not liking the buzz that has started in my rs360 pump







Drained it and refilled and its stil there.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Liking the new ripjaws! I5 3570k over 10000 physics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6488387
> 
> Not liking the buzz that has started in my rs360 pump
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drained it and refilled and its stil there.


cpu @ 0mhz? what was you oc
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6413819


----------



## ivanlabrie

I played with a friend's 680 sli setup today...managed to get 20k in 3dm11 with a simple slight oc. I still prefer 7970s


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I played with a friend's 680 sli setup today...managed to get 20k in 3dm11 with a simple slight oc. I still prefer 7970s


Slight overclock? With sli 680s & an sb-e at 5ghz it still takes a pretty decent OC to do 20k. Think I was close to 1400 core for 21k.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, derp, that was only graphics score, combined was much less lol. 2600k at 4.4ghz will never do that.


----------



## FtW 420

I see, was thinking they sound pretty great for 680s...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I played with a friend's 680 sli setup today...managed to get 20k in 3dm11 with a simple slight oc. I still prefer 7970s


...I still prefer 670ies over 680ies and 7970ies...more bang for the 'watt'


----------



## ivanlabrie

xD

20k should be doable with a 5ghz cpu and a big oc, right? But still, 7970s would eat them for lunch.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Disable tesselation in Catalyst and oc slightly and trifire will score higher in 90% of the benchmarks. If the gpu is the bottleneck of course.
Plus Kepler has a very crappy oc potential man...it comes pre overclocked by design, mid range chip pushed to hell and back. Not digging that.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> xD
> 
> 20k should be doable with a 5ghz cpu and a big oc, right? But still, 7970s would eat them for lunch.


Doable for some good 680s, this was my sli score here



7970s would slay them in the bot ranks though.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> xD
> 
> 20k should be doable with a 5ghz cpu and a big oc, right? But still, 7970s would eat them for lunch.


...I think 20k should be doable...close to it w/dual 670ies already, without running top speed on either CPU or GPU...just need a chilly day and wool socks


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yup, notice the lack of scores for those new 0pts benchies: http://hwbot.org/hardware/videocard/radeon_hd_7950/
http://hwbot.org/submission/2352548_stu_a_msd_3dmark___fire_strike_3x_radeon_hd_7970_6608_marks
(that's the only 7970 trifire score man, that's why Kepler and the other cards are on top) 1050 core gpu and 4.5ghz cpu.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yup, notice the lack of scores for those new 0pts benchies: http://hwbot.org/hardware/videocard/radeon_hd_7950/
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2352548_stu_a_msd_3dmark___fire_strike_3x_radeon_hd_7970_6608_marks
> (that's the only 7970 trifire score man, that's why Kepler and the other cards are on top) 1050 core gpu and 4.5ghz cpu.


They do get way lower subs when they aren't worth boints yet, once they get some value they will be worth pushing the HW harder for the top spots & the subs will roll in.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> cpu @ 0mhz? what was you oc
> http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/6413819


5ghz


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> 5ghz


i needed 5.1ghz to get 10,000
nice


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> They do get way lower subs when they aren't worth boints yet, once they get some value they will be worth pushing the HW harder for the top spots & the subs will roll in.


...doesn't matter what you say- some folks are not going to believe you...really, it's across the board...my HWBot tri-SLI score for 3D11 (points) is in the top 50 and flanked on either side by tri-fire 7970ies...similar story in other benches...btw, the tri-SLI 3D11 was done at 4.9 instead of 5.1+ GHz...but next week I'll look at SLI benches again.

...the real problem in Quads - for most of us - is PSUs ...the 3970X and 4x 670ies start to hit the AX1200 PSU limit when using heavy OC settings...working on connecting the 2nd PSU...folks with 680ies and 7970ies will hit the limits sooner


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Disable tesselation in Catalyst and oc slightly and trifire will score higher in 90% of the benchmarks. If the gpu is the bottleneck of course.
> Plus Kepler has a very crappy oc potential man...it comes pre overclocked by design, mid range chip pushed to hell and back. Not digging that.


How come some 600 series beat the 7970s then? Hard voltage mod, or just the specific bench? I know for a fact you can't clock 600 series past 1.175v/1.21v if your life depended on it without a hard mod.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, depends on the settings...clocks for everything and components. It's not just a model/brand thing. Drivers, os and lots of other settings make a difference. But at top level, there are very few Kepler cards, and only on select benchmarks.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, depends on the settings...clocks for everything and components. It's not just a model/brand thing. Drivers, os and lots of other settings make a difference. But at top level, there are very few Kepler cards, and only on select benchmarks.


...*really* ? ...must be talking different planets...At HWBot's 'video bench' page that lists s.th. like 18 benches, NVidia is in 1st place in 10, while AMD is in 1st in 8


----------



## ivanlabrie

I know you favor Nvidia, it's apparent, but the odds of getting a remotely good score at hwbot with a kepler card vs a tahiti are far worse...I only see very few results at the top. Even the almighty kingpin's 2ghz 680 was dethroned a while ago. They are NOT benching friendly cards, they die on you if you overvolt via hardmods, and I wouldn't reccomend them to people interested in benchmarking 3d stuff cause they are not really good at all.
Trying to get a good oc out of one can be a very frustrating process.

EDIT; also, I insist on the "it's not a brand thing"...Nvidia made the 580 which was a beast of a card and a great ocer, with powerful compute and a big arse die.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark2001_se/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20

> 580
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark03/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20

> titan/7970
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark05/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20

> only mixed bench (really cpu bound)
http://hwbot.org/submission/2367878_mtech_aquamark_geforce_gtx_580_547184_marks

> same here...note you don't see x79 there, 4 cores max, best single thread perf rules.
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark06/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20

> mixed results, again, top kepler results are HARD to reproduce, and this bench is really cpu bound as well.
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark_vantage_-_performance/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20

> Titans, one 1800mhz kepler and 7970s. Again, refer to the LOD tweak for this one (recently added with nvidia drivers)
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/unigine_heaven_-_xtreme_preset/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20

> strictly gpu bound bench: Titans and 7970s, again no surprise.
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/unigine_heaven_-_basic_preset/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20 ----> this one favors nvidia more in general
http://hwbot.org/benchmark/3dmark11_-_performance/rankings?cores=1#start=0#interval=20

> not a single kepler in sight...Titan/7970



Face it, Kepler sucks man...for benching that is. It's a gamers card.


----------



## Hokies83

Nvidia sucks this gen. And i do perfer Nvidia...

He just has some very lucky Benchmarks. / 670s..he gets higher scores then 680s clocked higher then his 670s.... Almost think hes some kinda Haxor.

But any who.... in realworld a 1200mhz 7970 should beat a 680 at similar clocks by a 10 = 20% margin...

Dont blame the mail mail blame Nvidia.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I know you favor Nvidia, it's apparent, but the odds of getting a remotely good score at hwbot with a kepler card vs a tahiti are far worse...I only see very few results at the top. Even the almighty kingpin's 2ghz 680 was dethroned a while ago. They are NOT benching friendly cards, they die on you if you overvolt via hardmods, and I wouldn't reccomend them to people interested in benchmarking 3d stuff cause they are not really good at all.
> Trying to get a good oc out of one can be a very frustrating process.


...I own both Nvidia and AMD cards, and frankly: pointing out that Nvidia leads AM in top spots in all available benches is not favoring anything...other than the hard facts ! 10 > 8


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I own both Nvidia and AMD cards, and frankly: pointing out that Nvidia leads AM in top spots in all available benches is not favoring anything...other than the hard facts ! 10 > 8


Refer to my big edit and spoiler man...Nvidia is too broad of a statement.


----------



## Hokies83

99.99% of people with these cards do not go to HW Bot..i fore one donot care.. i had some very golden 680s that would do 1375mhz.... and did not care to post on HW bot..

I only care about FPS in the game im playing...

You also have to take into account the amount of sub missions.... " Since most people like Nvidia cause there cards and drivers have been more constant more people vastly use Nvidia.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I just wanna avoid guys go grab 680/670s cause Joa is getting good scores at select benchmarks with them. His X79 chips make a big difference vs 3770k's at more modern benchies, and also does the fact that many benchmarks have few submissions to compete with. Specially in the 3x gpu category.
Single gpu is where it's at.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, once I get my MVG back I can try some of the not so x79 or nvidia friendly benchies...I definitely will try them all


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, once I get my MVG back I can try some of the not so x79 or nvidia friendly benchies...I definitely will try them all


Getting ready to order a 7790 myself.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll stick to my 6950/7950 for the time being...may get a 780 or 8970 once they are out. Probably both








(and some old school stuff for dice fun)
My next purchase will be a PLS Samsung monitor by June.


----------



## Hokies83

I may sell my cat leap and look at one i need something with a DP...

My Active DP to DL dvi adapter keeps crashing... And im not willing to pay almost 100$ for the star tech one.


----------



## Mms60r

Well I did it. Delidding went smooth but remounting was a little rough. I had CLU on the IHS already and it was a pain to get it off (the EK Block also). My plan was to put CLU on the die and an Indigo X I had left over on the IHS. Well like the first time I tried the Indigo I screwed up the reflow. Dont know what I'm doing wrong. Pulled the EK block off again and figured I'd just put the CLU on again. Oops its empty. So I had to use some Tuniq TX-2. I dont know much about that stuff or if its any good but its all I had. I'll probably get some more CLU here soon and do the IHS again (unless you guys think its fine as is). Now onto some preliminary results. I was running at 4.6 @ 1.275, ran a 2.5 hour Prime95 test and reached a max temp of 78c. Heres a screen shot of that..


After the delid I loaded up the same OC profile and ran Prime95 again. I only ran it for about 15min but the difference was obvious immediately.



Let me know what you guys think and if I need more info to join


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I just wanna avoid guys go grab 680/670s cause Joa is getting good scores at select benchmarks with them. His X79 chips make a big difference vs 3770k's at more modern benchies, and also does the fact that many benchmarks have few submissions to compete with. Specially in the 3x gpu category.
> Single gpu is where it's at.


...just doesn't seem to be your day for math... of the 35 or so hardware cups I earned, 8 were done with the X79 / 3970 - the other 27 with the Z77 / 3770K


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, list your 3770k cups then...can't search for them myself lol So much work!








I'm pretty sure they are low popularity benchies.

EDIT: just checked...1st out of 1-4, and stuff like that doesn't really count. It's just because you got relatively lucky 670s which are not popular benching cards.
And those are hardware cups, only counting 670s. Check global points/ranks and you'll see my point is spot on.
As for hardware points, there are far better benching cards like 8800/9800 series, and 580s, 4870s. BUT competition is FIERCE.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mms60r*
> 
> Well I did it. Delidding went smooth but remounting was a little rough. I had CLU on the IHS already and it was a pain to get it off (the EK Block also). My plan was to put CLU on the die and an Indigo X I had left over on the IHS. Well like the first time I tried the Indigo I screwed up the reflow. Dont know what I'm doing wrong. Pulled the EK block off again and figured I'd just put the CLU on again. Oops its empty. So I had to use some Tuniq TX-2. I dont know much about that stuff or if its any good but its all I had. I'll probably get some more CLU here soon and do the IHS again (unless you guys think its fine as is). Now onto some preliminary results. I was running at 4.6 @ 1.275, ran a 2.5 hour Prime95 test and reached a max temp of 78c. Heres a screen shot of that..
> 
> 
> After the delid I loaded up the same OC profile and ran Prime95 again. I only ran it for about 15min but the difference was obvious immediately.
> 
> 
> 
> Let me know what you guys think and if I need more info to join


can you fill out the info organized like the first page states?







nice job btw!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, list your 3770k cups then...can't search for them myself lol So much work!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm pretty sure they are low popularity benchies.
> 
> EDIT: just checked...1st out of 1-4, and stuff like that doesn't really count. It's just because you got relatively lucky 670s which are not popular benching cards.
> And those are hardware cups, only counting 670s. Check global points/ranks and you'll see my point is spot on.
> As for hardware points, there are far better benching cards like 8800/9800 series, and 580s, 4870s. BUT competition is FIERCE.


you got that right for my 8800 i'll need to zombie it then volt mod the poop out of it and pray it can take it under LN2 like nuts


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys! Long time no post! Been so busy of late. Took apart the 7950s yesterday and used the compressor to blow all the dust out and spent a good hour applying a perfect coating of CLU. Got a nice temp drop from it. It really had to be done since I have been running my GPUs at 99% load 24/7. Been using a shop fan to keep them as cool as possible. Going to get into the water cooling game sooner than I though someone is selling me a 200mm phoyba xtreme rad, dp600_p pump, bitspower 250 z resevoir, and a 6 pack of black chromo monsoon fittings for $125 just to help me get started. All I need to buy are the blocks and a 240 rad after that. Going to leave my H100I in there for the time being because I just want to get my GPUs under water first and then I can focus on the rest of the loop. Can't wait!!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, list your 3770k cups then...can't search for them myself lol So much work!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm pretty sure they are low popularity benchies.
> 
> EDIT: just checked...1st out of 1-4, and stuff like that doesn't really count. It's just because you got relatively lucky 670s which are not popular benching cards.
> And those are hardware cups, only counting 670s. Check global points/ranks and you'll see my point is spot on.
> As for hardware points, there are far better benching cards like 8800/9800 series, and 580s, 4870s. BUT competition is FIERCE.


It's just that so many people on here have 600 series and talk about overclocking when comparing it to 7950/7970s... I think it's more of how much of an OC you can get before running into a voltage wall rather than how high you can get the OC in general. Kepler is only good for those staying stock or looking for a mild overclock, because even with decent air cooling or low end water cooling you run into a voltage wall. If 700 series is locked then it will be the same story as it is now.


----------



## Mms60r

OCN name: MMS60R
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: Coollabs Ultra
ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-2 <= Would something better work here? More CLU perhaps?
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.6Ghz
Temp drops: -14c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2779766

I ran Intel Burn on very high 10 times and got a max core temp of 64c. Not sure if this needs to be submitted too or how? My pre-delid max core temp was 78c during a 2.5 hour Prime95 test. I used the same OC profile for both tests.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mms60r*
> 
> OCN name: MMS60R
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollabs Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-2 <= Would something better work here? More CLU perhaps?
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.6Ghz
> Temp drops: -14c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/2779766
> 
> I ran Intel Burn on very high 10 times and got a max core temp of 64c. Not sure if this needs to be submitted too or how? My pre-delid max core temp was 78c during a 2.5 hour Prime95 test. I used the same OC profile for both tests.


You're In!







you could give the CLU on the IHS a try might yeild you a few more °C but sometimes it doesnt, what cooler you got thats the real question now that your heat can move much better.


----------



## Mms60r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you could give the CLU on the IHS a try might yeild you a few more °C but sometimes it doesnt, what cooler you got thats the real question now that your heat can move much better.


I'm glad you asked. I am fully water-cooled. I'm using a EK-Supremacy HF CPU block. When I was trying to clean off the CLU from the EK I had to use a pad to kind of brush it out. It pretty much ruined the mirror finish of the copper block. Obviously from my temps it must not be a big deal but you think it will hurt anything?

Also a basic OC question. I'm very happy with 4.6 right now but, where can I go with this now? I could try to go for a higher over clock, but I'd rather get the temps down even further. Does the increased headroom delidding gave allow me to drop the vcore further and maintain stability for 4.6?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mms60r*
> 
> I'm glad you asked. I am fully water-cooled. I'm using a EK-Supremacy HF CPU block. When I was trying to clean off the CLU from the EK I had to use a pad to kind of brush it out. It pretty much ruined the mirror finish of the copper block. Obviously from my temps it must not be a big deal but you think it will hurt anything?
> 
> Also a basic OC question. I'm very happy with 4.6 right now but, where can I go with this now? I could try to go for a higher over clock, but I'd rather get the temps down even further. Does the increased headroom delidding gave allow me to drop the vcore further and maintain stability for 4.6?


the stains are fine it just makes the copper smoother as the residue you are seeing is filling the impurities of the metal bottom. The OC issue link me your CPUZ again so I can look at your voltages, but very rarely we see a drop in vcore required for OC's, but you never know


----------



## Joa3d43

*GPU Competition and legal stuff*















...it's always an interesting experience when posting some idependtly verified global competition results (most with the delidded 3770K)...the attempts to discredit, or worse, accuse one of cheating, are not unexpected by now, but they should stop (please see the legal summary in the 'spoiler' below). It is also sad to watch...

...HWBot (the site where global bench competitions are hosted) lists in their video card section the five currently most popular cards...they are 7970, 680, Titan, 670 and 580...of course you can then look for more detailed listings by brand as well for other cards...fact is, 670ies have become popular, with over 2,700 submissions...whereby the number of submissions is also a function of how long a card has been on the market...in the above 5 listing, 670ies are the second 'newest'

...any time you submit a specific result, say for a 670, the HWBot site returns info where you stack up against all other video cards (incl. Titans, 7970ies etc), no matter whether they are 'Enthusiast' (non-extreme cooling) or Pro (extreme cooling)...you also have to submit pics of your hardware, as well as verification URLs...I didn't even compete at HWBot until less than two months ago (and took a sabbatical for a month as I was building up my 'Siamese twins')...I really did not set out to collect cups and records, including against much bigger guns who use extreme cooling, but it happened anyways...










...Being part of the OCN HWBot team, I started out in 922nd place in that team, and within a few weeks hit the top 10 (currently #3)...that is INDEPENDENT of hardware (ie what GPUs I run)...in country rankings, I am somewhat surprised to find myself in 3rd spot as well...even in worldwide rankings, I started out at 'way behind' and worked my way up to 122nd rank out of 17426 at the time of writing - against ANY hardware (CPU, mobo, GPU) - all in what is an effective 30+ days of actually being 'active'....but what that also means is that I could contribute over 140 point for the OCN team at HWBot, with the OCN team being itself in 'ranking' competition against other teams.

...I really am not looking for anybody's approval / disapproval at the 'delid' thread - obviously, I have chosen to compete at a globally verified site instead, because frankly, you don't get so much hatred there...I still post some select results at 'delid' because that is where I picked up a lot of info to prep my machines...so much for trying to say 'thank you'.









...At the end of the day, I like 670ies for a couple of reasons...first and foremost, they have a lower watt rating (and thus heat) per clock than 680ies with the same die size, though obviously 680ies have more CUDA cores...670ies will clock nice and high and when they were released, it was quite embarrassing to NVidia for 670ies being very close / even beating 680ies in some reviews...

...Also, I have never run less than SLI, and while going up to quads, and power consumption becomes a real issue...a *single 670 at stock uses over 100 watts LESS per card than a 7970*...ultimately, I build systems that 'maximize the area under the curve', rather than establish high peaks (ie outright GHz numbers) - and that turned out to be a good recipe for success, along with memory subsystems that are optimized and low 'v' CPUs...this also allows me to run all my GPUs with 'stock' air cooling. I could go out this afternoon and buy 4 Titans if I would want to given my hardware budget...but I don't - I MUCH rather make a silk purse of a sow's ear...way more fun than just pulling out a wallet.

...can't remember whether it was in 'Valley or 'Heaven'(Valley I think), but when I posted my quad 670ies score that was over 6000, there were some folks not happy about that as it beat even some tri-Titans...but that was nothing compared to one or two guys who had great success with 7950ies, beating much more expensive hardware...they got some posts that all but accused them of cheating...in the end, even that is 'normal', unfortunately...the more your system performs above average, the worse it will get...

---









...'delid' has suffered a fairly large number of posts that were modded / removed lately...just because the internet allows for a large degree of anonymity does not mean that basic rules of courtesy should be ignored...and more than that, there are actually legal issues as well...on the commercial side, we run some global business hubs that also have the ability to post...though we review each submission BEFORE it gets released (I am one of the 'mods'), given the nature of what we do (also relates to intellectual property etc). But no matter what site or specialty, there are some legal basics folks who post on any site should be aware...here is a nice summary from 'wisegeek.org' which reflect the general rules succinctly:










Spoiler: Warning: internet harassment laws Spoiler!



wisegeek.org

Internet harassment laws make it a criminal act to use the Internet to threaten, torment, stalk, intimidate or otherwise distress a person. Legislation and enforcement varies from one jurisdiction to another, but Internet harassment laws are put in place to protect potential victims from the trauma of cyberstalking, cyberbullying and other forms of internet harassment. In some regions, provisions have been made within broader harassment laws specifically relating to the Internet and other forms of communication.

Legal definitions of Internet harassment vary slightly from one region to another, but most jurisdictions agree on the basic principles. Internet harassment is an attempt to use email or another form of electronic communication to torment, threaten, stalk or perform some similar act that would cause distress to a reasonable person. When determining the difference between simple rudeness and criminal harassment, authorities are likely to consider issues such as the attacker's apparent intent, the frequency of the remarks or postings, evidence of premeditation or information gathering, whether others were encouraged to participate in these acts and whether remarks or attacks were directed specifically at the victim.

For those found guilty, the penalties for violating Internet harassment laws depend on the severity of the attacks and the jurisdiction. Harassment convictions can result in fines, community service or a prison sentence. If the victim made previous attempts to make the attacker stop, or if the attacker engaged in other illegal activities such as hacking to harass the victim, sentencing is likely to be harsher.


----------



## Hokies83

Do not worry it will be ok.



For internet harassment... You should Try the Corvette forums.... Those guys are some of the worst people u will find on the internet...

95% of a bunch of rich Snobby old guys...

Ive had a Guy that goes by RC00e Stalk me across 3-4 forums all the way to my You tube pages where i have had to disable msges on them... and this has went on for 5-6 years...

If he evver trys that here.. then i will have to contact his local police... but he is yet to come to any of the computer forums im on...

His harassment has been constant crude remarks to me about me my wife and kid... he has made pictures of me and my wife / kid with little boxes of text saying crude things.....

That is internet harassment....


----------



## Mms60r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the stains are fine it just makes the copper smoother as the residue you are seeing is filling the impurities of the metal bottom. The OC issue link me your CPUZ again so I can look at your voltages, but very rarely we see a drop in vcore required for OC's, but you never know


I have vcore set to 1.275 but under load in CPU-z it drops to 1.248


----------



## Scott1541

You know what they say about arguing over the internet being like the special olympics...

[Just in case this post is needed







]


----------



## justanoldman

Posted this in the water cooling club, but my first basic water cooling is about done. Since it is a dilidded chip the temp numbers might be helpful to someone new here. CLU on the die and IHS.

Any of you water cooling guys, let me know if you see anything wrong.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!




Delidded 3770k, 5.0 @ 1.41v, MVF, 16 gb TridentX 2400, Switch 810
Swiftech: H220, 220 rad bottom, 320 rad top, 140 rad back

5 NF-F12 fans on top/bottom rads, one NF-A14 on 140 rad, two more NF-A14 case fans

Heatkiller hole edition full cover copper block with backplate for the GTX 690

2 Bitspower 45 degree compression fittings, the rest are Swiftech Lok-seal compression, using Swiftech black Truflex 3/8-5/8 tubing

With the rad fans at 60% (the lowest bios settings I have), case fans on the low noise adapter, and the H220 pump at 30% this setup is very quiet. With those quiet settings my Prime95 max core temps with an 8k-8k torture test with 90% ram usage for 15 minutes with the chip at 5.0, 1.41v are:
68, 71, 70, 66 in a 22.7c room

Running a benchmark Valley 1.0 run with a max gpu overclock +155, +740 my two cores are about 40c max.


----------



## ivanlabrie

justanoldman, that looks very nice! Well done








I see you got fine taste in fans too...


----------



## InCoGnIt0

The other day I delidded my 3770K and everything went so smooth (I used the vise method). Today I got my Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and put it all back together. I boot my computer up and it says "New CPU detected please hit F1 to enter setup". THIS IS WHERE I ABOUT SHAT MYSELF. I go into the bios and everything looks A OK so I just hit save and restart and BOOM windows pops up and i'm off and running. I don't know what that little hiccup was, but could anyone share what they think it was please, and thank you in advance.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> The other day I delidded my 3770K and everything went so smooth (I used the vise method). Today I got my Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and put it all back together. I boot my computer up and it says "New CPU detected please hit F1 to enter setup". THIS IS WHERE I ABOUT SHAT MYSELF. I go into the bios and everything looks A OK so I just hit save and restart and BOOM windows pops up and i'm off and running. I don't know what that little hiccup was, but could anyone share what they think it was please, and thank you in advance.


I don't know why but it happened to me as well and I've de-lidded a few chips


----------



## Hokies83

I only Play PC games online to Avoid the 12 yearolds. lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I tried LoL but it's beyond me liking that game...I just can't stomach it and the community doesn't help.
I'm mailing my MVG tomorrow, should be RMA'd pretty fast and back here within this month.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I only Play PC games online to Avoid the 12 yearolds. lol.


Yeah most pc games are exempt from this, but not LoL. Probably because the graphics are so bad I can run it on my router, and the 12 year olds on their htpc


----------



## dr/owned

121 unread replies....yeahhhhh not going to read that much.

@justanoldman, why the 1200W psu with a single card? Planning on going bonzai-crazy in the future with upgrades?

In the off-topic club, putting together a NAS/home server. Deciding between a $60 3220T or a $115 3570k. And having to decide between m-ATX intel mobo or an m-ITX one. Like the ITX for size and the fact it doesn't need an ATX power supply, but it has no full size PCI slots that I'll probably need for a sata card.


----------



## Arm3nian

Anyway, perfect day to overclock in Vegas. This is while driving with my windows open for 20 minutes.


----------



## FtW 420

Had a big multi quote post going about the gpu war & it disappeared on me...

Long & short of it was you need both 600 series & 7000 series to do as well as possible in all benchies, 7000 series did do better in the majority of benchmarks before Titan launched.

joa3d43 isn't doing hax, but much tweaking & tweaked well enough, it is possible for 670s to beat superior hardware when the bencher of superior hardware is just running a bench without as much effort. With all the same tweaks, the superior hardware should win, but it does come down to the overclocker.

I agree with ivan that although joa3d43 is doing great with the 670s, multi gpu 670s is not as well represented as multi gpu 680s & 7970s. He would have to work much harder there to get to the top of the ranks. He has gotten good at tweaking the HW for good scores though, I don't doubt he would do pretty well against others with similar cooling.
Single gpu has always been the biggest challenge, it's my favorite place to play.

Hokies, saying you could beat his scores but don't want to try because the gpus are busy & you would rather game when they aren't in use, is a bit of a cop out.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> justanoldman, that looks very nice! Well done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see you got fine taste in fans too...


Thanks.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> The other day I delidded my 3770K and everything went so smooth (I used the vise method). Today I got my Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and put it all back together. I boot my computer up and it says "New CPU detected please hit F1 to enter setup". THIS IS WHERE I ABOUT SHAT MYSELF. I go into the bios and everything looks A OK so I just hit save and restart and BOOM windows pops up and i'm off and running. I don't know what that little hiccup was, but could anyone share what they think it was please, and thank you in advance.


Happens every time you take the chip out, doesn't mean anything bad.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> @justanoldman, why the 1200W psu with a single card? Planning on going bonzai-crazy in the future with upgrades?
> .


When I first bought this stuff I was planning on have a few gpus and it was on sale for a good price so I figured what the heck. Afterwards I realized I don't need it but for the price it is fine, and I can use it later for upgrades if need be.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Anyway, perfect day to overclock in Vegas. This is while driving with my windows open for 20 minutes.


...just watched the weather forecast for my area - sunny and nice but cold, relatively speaking- until _saw Calgary_ - snowfall warning for tomorrow...great weather for benching there, in case you can get a cheap flight from Vegas !


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Yeah most pc games are exempt from this, but not LoL. Probably because the graphics are so bad I can run it on my router, and the 12 year olds on their htpc


lol @ running it on your router







made my day...You could run it on a TI-83 too.

@FtW: Not arguing with his tweaking skills, just justifying my point of view.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Had a big multi quote post going about the gpu war & it disappeared on me...
> 
> Long & short of it was you need both 600 series & 7000 series to do as well as possible in all benchies, 7000 series did do better in the majority of benchmarks before Titan launched.
> 
> joa3d43 isn't doing hax, but much tweaking & tweaked well enough, it is possible for 670s to beat superior hardware when the bencher of superior hardware is just running a bench without as much effort. With all the same tweaks, the superior hardware should win, but it does come down to the overclocker.
> 
> I agree with ivan that although joa3d43 is doing great with the 670s, multi gpu 670s is not as well represented as multi gpu 680s & 7970s. He would have to work much harder there to get to the top of the ranks. He has gotten good at tweaking the HW for good scores though, I don't doubt he would do pretty well against others with similar cooling.
> Single gpu has always been the biggest challenge, it's my favorite place to play.
> 
> Hokies, saying you could beat his scores but don't want to try because the gpus are busy & you would rather game when they aren't in use, is a bit of a cop out.


...well, now that my Siamese system is back together, I might even try for some single GPU benches later this and next week....I have never actually done singles ! BTW, thanks for the tips on VCCSA and VTT yesterday...I tried it and it runs fine @ 5G + with them down to 1.15v


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool man! You need to do 2D...try ucbench2011, it's a fun thing to tweak. Same as pifast and 32m.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, now that my Siamese system is back together, I might even try for some single GPU benches later this and next week....I have never actually done singles ! BTW, thanks for the tips on VCCSA and VTT yesterday...I tried it and it runs fine @ 5G + with them down to 1.15v


run two cards sli







i eat 7950's and 680's maybe not a classified or lightning


----------



## stickg1

I got an MVG, 3770K, and 840 Pro 128GB at Micro Center. I also bought a cheap AMD combo to upgrade the kids' Athlon X2 5800 system. I won't get too into it as to not upset Hokie, but it is a Vishera, and it was $140 for the chip and motherboard.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Had a big multi quote post going about the gpu war & it disappeared on me...


...one more thing: It's the tables where my results fit in which interests me...could have posted the tri-SLI Vantage, but here is the quad-SLI Vantage from yesterday...note the type of cards I'm surrounded by, which has been my point all along...

...and *thanks for being a gentleman* re your quad 580 score there...instead of going 'derogatory', I'm pretty sure that you'll fire up the Sandy-E and 580ies and beat the crap out of my score soon - that's the way to do it...and as you know, when I submitted it I also added it for OCN for the special Vantage Team competition still going on for a day or two


----------



## Arm3nian

0
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol @ running it on your router
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> made my day...You could run it on a TI-83 too.
> 
> @FtW: Not arguing with his tweaking skills, just justifying my point of view.


TI-83 is quite powerful, I played games on it during math class









TI-83 has a 6mhz cpu I think, my router has a whopping 680mhz, both more than enough to get 60fps on LoL


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> run two cards sli
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i eat 7950's and 680's maybe not a classified or lightning


Dang that is good, I got up to 98.7 recently and over 60 in 1440p but I don't know if I can get up to 100 ever since there are no bios that work for a 690. Good thing I don't do anything at 1080p.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I got an MVG, 3770K, and 840 Pro 128GB at Micro Center. I also bought a cheap AMD combo to upgrade the kids' Athlon X2 5800 system. I won't get too into it as to not upset Hokie, but it is a Vishera, and it was $140 for the chip and motherboard.


Tried ocing the 3770k yet? I really like my 840 pro, it is a nice drive.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Dang that is good, I got up to 98.7 recently and over 60 in 1440p but I don't know if I can get up to 100 ever since there are no bios that work for a 690. Good thing I don't do anything at 1080p.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tried ocing the 3770k yet? I really like my 840 pro, it is a nice drive.


Well I went a wedding this weekend. My girl was supposed to come, but our babysit fell through. I went without her, then took the long way home to stop at MC and blew about $1000 on various electronics. I'm in the doghouse unfortunately, lol. I'll get to it in a few days when things blow over.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...one more thing: It's the tables where my results fit in which interests me...could have posted the tri-SLI Vantage, but here is the quad-SLI Vantage from yesterday...note the type of cards I'm surrounded by, which has been my point all along...
> 
> ...and *thanks for being a gentleman* re your quad 580 score there...instead of going 'derogatory', I'm pretty sure that you'll fire up the Sandy-E and 580ies and beat the crap out of my score soon - that's the way to do it...and as you know, when I submitted it I also added it for OCN for the special Vantage Team competition still going on for a day or two


Mate you still haven't replied to my spoiler heavy post, took me some time to write it...or you failed to see it.
Vantage is a test which favors Nvidia cause of the LOD tweak among other things. You can like your 670s but they are not ideal benching cards...I'm not gonna argue more about this though, so whatever floats your boat. It's your business after all








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 0
> TI-83 is quite powerful, I played games on it during math class
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TI-83 has a 6mhz cpu I think, my router has a whopping 680mhz, both more than enough to get 60fps on LoL


lol







I'm pretty sure that's accurate, at least if you bother to emulate x86 hardware and run DirectX with those lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Had a big multi quote post going about the gpu war & it disappeared on me...
> 
> Long & short of it was you need both 600 series & 7000 series to do as well as possible in all benchies, 7000 series did do better in the majority of benchmarks before Titan launched.
> 
> joa3d43 isn't doing hax, but much tweaking & tweaked well enough, it is possible for 670s to beat superior hardware when the bencher of superior hardware is just running a bench without as much effort. With all the same tweaks, the superior hardware should win, but it does come down to the overclocker.
> 
> I agree with ivan that although joa3d43 is doing great with the 670s, multi gpu 670s is not as well represented as multi gpu 680s & 7970s. He would have to work much harder there to get to the top of the ranks. He has gotten good at tweaking the HW for good scores though, I don't doubt he would do pretty well against others with similar cooling.
> Single gpu has always been the biggest challenge, it's my favorite place to play.
> 
> Hokies, saying you could beat his scores but don't want to try because the gpus are busy & you would rather game when they aren't in use, is a bit of a cop out.


My Vram does not Overclock at all. He should talk to TSM106.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I got an MVG, 3770K, and 840 Pro 128GB at Micro Center. I also bought a cheap AMD combo to upgrade the kids' Athlon X2 5800 system. I won't get too into it as to not upset Hokie, but it is a Vishera, and it was $140 for the chip and motherboard.


Nice, hope it's a good 3770k, & the mvg won't let you down, bring on the memory clocks!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...one more thing: It's the tables where my results fit in which interests me...could have posted the tri-SLI Vantage, but here is the quad-SLI Vantage from yesterday...note the type of cards I'm surrounded by, which has been my point all along...
> 
> ...and *thanks for being a gentleman* re your quad 580 score there...instead of going 'derogatory', I'm pretty sure that you'll fire up the Sandy-E and 580ies and beat the crap out of my score soon - that's the way to do it...and as you know, when I submitted it I also added it for OCN for the special Vantage Team competition still going on for a day or two


I don't have 4 x 580s anymore, although I might have to see about getting another to chop apart for my Titan mod project anyway. Would be neat to see what I could do with 4 of them on an x79 rig, the 1366 I used for my old score was good but x79 gets better graphics scores.
The only cards I have 4 of right now are 5870s.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Mate you still haven't replied to my spoiler heavy post, took me some time to write it...or you failed to see it.
> Vantage is a test which favors Nvidia cause of the LOD tweak among other things. You can like your 670s but they are not ideal benching cards...I'm not gonna argue more about this though, so whatever floats your boat. It's your business after all l


...as I already mentioned to you many weeks back when you had an issue my 'Heaven' scores, I just don't use LOD tweaks...may be I finally should...nor do I think that 670ies are good benching cards...but that's precisely why I like them: silk purse out of a sow's ear and all that...I do think though that they offer the best 'power to weight' ratio, re watt consumption vs. output.

...but we can agree that we really do not need to gone about this...bottom line for me is that the deliided secrets I learned here were very helpful, and I put them to good use by joining the OCN HWBot team...so thanks to the many folks who helped me out


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> The other day I delidded my 3770K and everything went so smooth (I used the vise method). Today I got my Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and put it all back together. I boot my computer up and it says "New CPU detected please hit F1 to enter setup". THIS IS WHERE I ABOUT SHAT MYSELF. I go into the bios and everything looks A OK so I just hit save and restart and BOOM windows pops up and i'm off and running. I don't know what that little hiccup was, but could anyone share what they think it was please, and thank you in advance.


Yes that's happened to me before - but that's nothing to be worried about


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Nice, hope it's a good 3770k, & the mvg won't let you down, bring on the memory clocks!
> I don't have 4 x 580s anymore, although I might have to see about getting another to chop apart for my Titan mod project anyway. Would be neat to see what I could do with 4 of them on an x79 rig, the 1366 I used for my old score was good but x79 gets better graphics scores.
> The only cards I have 4 of right now are 5870s.


...I could lend you my X79 RIVE (for your 3930K) and some reasonably fast quad 670ies


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...as I already mentioned to you many weeks back when you had an issue my 'Heaven' scores, I just don't use LOD tweaks...may be I finally should...nor do I think that 670ies are good benching cards...but that's precisely why I like them: silk purse out of a sow's ear and all that...I do think though that they offer the best 'power to weight' ratio, re watt consumption vs. output.
> 
> ...but we can agree that we really do not need to gone about this...bottom line for me is that the deliided secrets I learned here were very helpful, and I put them to good use by joining the OCN HWBot team...so thanks to the many folks who helped me out


Yeah, if you like them and are happy with them that's all that matters...no need to justify one's purchase.
Wait till I get my MVG and thou shalt be challenged by my 7950 to a single gpu war.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm pretty sure that's accurate, at least if you bother to emulate x86 hardware and run DirectX with those lol


I think by the time someone finishes emulating a pc on something other than a pc, they will have a pc lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, I did go to some maniac extents to get that done...on android. Just to run Ragnarok Online anywhere







(talk about mmo junkies...huh?)
Frustrated the heck outta me!
Now there's an app that does that, but you need android 4.0 and my phone can't run it no matter what.









EDIT: I want a Samsung Q1 Ultra!!!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, if you like them and are happy with them that's all that matters...no need to justify one's purchase.
> Wait till I get my MVG and thou shalt be challenged by my 7950 to a single gpu war.


...may be, but I also look forward to 2 or 3 780ies (stopped by NCIX today...release date w/them 3-4 weeks) as I still have a few free GPU slots - that's in addition to my 670ies...I think you mentioned that you were also getting some 780ies...not sure if you run in the 'extreme cooling' class or not, but may be when your 780ies arrive, you can finally fill me in on that LOD tweak business...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...may be, but I also look forward to 2 or 3 780ies (stopped by NCIX today...release date w/them 3-4 weeks) as I still have a few free GPU slots - that's in addition to my 670ies...I think you mentioned that you were also getting some 780ies...not sure if you run in the 'extreme cooling' class or not, but may be when your 780ies arrive, you can finally fill me in on that LOD tweak business...


Not yet...no plans for the time being.
I WILL get next gen gpus after prices get more reasonable and I cash out my savings. Give the LOD thing a go, it's worth a shot.








Got some debts to get rid off first, and a PLS monitor to buy to enjoy my z77/7950 rig.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, I did go to some maniac extents to get that done...on android. Just to run Ragnarok Online anywhere
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (talk about mmo junkies...huh?)
> Frustrated the heck outta me!
> Now there's an app that does that, but you need android 4.0 and my phone can't run it no matter what.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: I want a Samsung Q1 Ultra!!!!


Emulator code is way too tedious for me, I don't like it lol, some people love it however. I tried something similar and ran a game and recorded using teamviewer, then played it using my phone. The controls were terrible but it worked with just a little lag, nvidia's project shield was obviously stolen from me =


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Emulator code is way too tedious for me, I don't like it lol, some people love it however. I tried something similar and ran a game and recorded using teamviewer, then played it using my phone. The controls were terrible but it worked with just a little lag, nvidia's project shield was obviously stolen from me =


I had a program to do that...but using my psp. The controls were epic, and I could play lots of games with barely no lag from the same lan.


----------



## dr/owned

Cox Ultimate FTMFW.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 
> 
> Cox Ultimate FTMFW.


... I only have premier








You think it is worth an extra $40 a month.


----------



## Obi Wan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 
> 
> Cox Ultimate FTMFW.


That's ridiculous!!! I'm jealous...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Well....this is my uni connection:
http://www.speedtest.net/result/2677997548.png

I love their upload speeds








(I sometimes hit over 100)


----------



## Arm3nian

I'm jealous of google fiber... 1000mb up and down for $70 a month lol.


----------



## dr/owned

Right now I'm only paying $79.99 a month ($20 off for 6 months) because of my house move it's considered a "new account". Previously I was on Premier that gave me 50 mbps for $67.XX a month. I figured for $10 more was worth 3x the speed. Did add some complications though because my router is only 100 mbps and not 1gbps. So I just have modem -> desktop ethernet #1 and desktop ethernet #2 -> router WAN, using ICS.

I'll probably keep going with it when the price bumps to $99 a month. It's not *that* expensive, and it's *so* nice being able to download HD tv shows in seconds.

Lowest ping I ever get is 25 ms though, but 50 ms is good enough for gaming.


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's completely bananas...My home connection is only good for 300-400kb's download, and 60kb/s up.
That's the best I can get currently in my area. Costs $40 monthly too...


----------



## Obi Wan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well....this is my uni connection:
> http://www.speedtest.net/result/2677997548.png
> 
> I love their upload speeds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I sometimes hit over 100)


Wow, is it not strange to have your upload speeds best your download speeds? I've never seen that before.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've seen it using 3g internet...


----------



## stickg1

It's common for large networks like universities. At Clemson in the dorms my bandwidth was off the chain.


----------



## Obi Wan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's common for large networks like universities. At Clemson in the dorms my bandwidth was off the chain.


HaHa! I live in G'ville and bleed orange. Grew up Tiger fan, used to have season tickets but they downgraded my parking pass after many years so I told 'em to ****.


----------



## dr/owned

Same...university internet was crazy fast. Ethernet I'd pull down 100 up and 100 down all day long. Reason for this was my university was tied into 3 or 4 ISP's (Cox, Time Warner, L3, Qwest, etc). Saw the main server-room where all traffic was routed through....bundle of ethernet cables 2 feet across....nearly crapped my pants.

They actually have a live feed of their network stats:



So I gotta wonder what I could do with gigabit internet if an entire university only manages to use 4 gbps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's common for large networks like universities. At Clemson in the dorms my bandwidth was off the chain.


the building im in.... 10 down.... .2 up.... woohoo cat 3 cables but my new building next summer...... gig up and down!!!!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

So I'm heading over to a certain someones house tomorrow to trade my delidded 3570k with no dual-channel memory (killed it with the blade) and a 120GB Kingston HyperX SSD for a Phoyba Xtreme Full Copper 200mm Rad, a 6-pack of monsoon black chrome fittings, Bitspower Water Tank z-Multi 250mm res, Jingway DP600 pump, and some tubing. Now I'm more than halfway towards my goal of water cooling my GPU's! Now my money can go towards a nice 240 radiator and those sweet alphacool blocks with backplates.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> ...might have to see about getting another to chop apart for my Titan mod project anyway.....


...noticed your 'Titan project' is going very well already







....single-card record at 'Valley'...86.9fps and 3637 score...congrats


----------



## ivanlabrie

That price tag is so prohibitive currently for me...I'd love to zombie-mod one of those though. But I'd need to get a cpu and gpu pot and a dewar/thermo to make it worth the investment.
I think I'll start with 2d benching on cold using dice and a good cpu pot first...diced 3770k for basic 3d with whatever card I find sounds like an OK platform.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Same...university internet was crazy fast. Ethernet I'd pull down 100 up and 100 down all day long. Reason for this was my university was tied into 3 or 4 ISP's (Cox, Time Warner, L3, Qwest, etc). Saw the main server-room where all traffic was routed through....bundle of ethernet cables 2 feet across....nearly crapped my pants.
> 
> They actually have a live feed of their network stats:
> 
> 
> 
> So I gotta wonder what I could do with gigabit internet if an entire university only manages to use 4 gbps.


Cox doesn't have very good pings.. probably would be better if they had a direct fiber optic cable running to everyone's house. I did a speedtest once on a wired computer at my university and got around 700mb down lol, probably connected directly to cox.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obi Wan*
> 
> Wow, is it not strange to have your upload speeds best your download speeds? I've never seen that before.


It is indeed normal for uni connections - as they cap the downloads, but rarely cap the uploads









PS.
8Pack broke 3 world records!!!

http://www.vortez.net/news_story/overclocks_own_8_pack_returns_with_3_world_overclocking_records.html


----------



## illuz

That's some insane clocks right there. :O

My new monsta 240mm rad should be here tomorrow, just need to buy the pump, res, tubing and coolant and naked mount kit.
I don't know whether to go UV tubing and plain water with UV LED lights or blue colourant and blue lights...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yup 7.2ghz is mental!


----------



## Valgaur

so guys for my wooden build Im thinking TEC cooling for a 3930K and quadfire as well the rads will be worth it then


----------



## stickg1

I like my new 3770K so far. I started at 4.5GHz 1.2v and it keeps going lower and lower!! I might have finally got a winner!!!

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2789244


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> so guys for my wooden build Im thinking TEC cooling for a 3930K and quadfire as well the rads will be worth it then


Your building a work of Art.. having a Tec just ruins the build and will make it ugly =/

So do a Normal loop and make it pretty... And use LN2 when u wanna bench.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> so guys for my wooden build Im thinking TEC cooling for a 3930K and quadfire as well the rads will be worth it then


IDK about that, the condesation will be a headache with the wood. Split, swell, crack, it's gonna be tough.


----------



## ivanlabrie

No condensation with properly insulated stuff, armaflex will help...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> IDK about that, the condesation will be a headache with the wood. Split, swell, crack, it's gonna be tough.


the wood wont be touching any of it at all, the rads will be warm the components wont touch the wood and will be heavily insulated, im thinking either this with hot swappable gpu's for benching runs at nice cold temps. or doing custom piping with copper to make it all look amazing full copper blocks and make a nice deep oak cedar color with stains. still deciding though....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> No condensation with properly insulated stuff, armaflex will help...


...what's the difference between armaflex and neoprene - just brand names ?


----------



## dr/owned

So bought a 3220T for my combo NAS/Guest Gaming box/HTPC/automation server. Mini-ITX, 4GB ram, 840 SSD, 6TB Raid 0, around $400 not counting the mech hdd's...it'll be berry naice!

Eyeballing a used 8800 GT for graphics. Very inexpensive and would be a lot better than the HD2500 the 3220T comes with. Yay or nay? I know I'd be missing DX11, but I don't think that's too much of a tradeoff. Biggest concern is heat/power consumption vs a newer 650 or 7750, but those cards are a lot more expensive.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the wood wont be touching any of it at all, the rads will be warm the components wont touch the wood and will be heavily insulated, im thinking either this with hot swappable gpu's for benching runs at nice cold temps. or doing custom piping with copper to make it all look amazing full copper blocks and make a nice deep oak cedar color with stains. still deciding though....


...are you going to do competitive benching - if so, LN2 will move you to a different class if you aren't already there ?







I think I may use the IVY in LN2 soon, but don't know if one can run in two classes at the same time (as the 3970x will stay water cooled)...have to ask FtW

...btw, your build sounds amazing...so much fun going outside the 'normal case' limitations, isn't ?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I'm really looking forward to seeing it Val!
Any ideas on ETA of it being fully built?

It's not the parts inside that will take to "assemble" but the case itself.


----------



## illuz

Keep pushing stickg1!!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Keep pushing stickg1!!


"keep pushing that 1 stick g" is what I read.
See what I did there?


----------



## stickg1

Unfortunately I don't have any cooling yet. So I can't go much further. I'm using a 92mm downblowing CM Vortex I got to use in my HTPC. Even with 1.17v at 4.5GHz I'm hitting 80C.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...are you going to do competitive benching - if so, LN2 will move you to a different class if you aren't already there ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I may use the IVY in LN2 soon, but don't know if one can run in two classes at the same time (as the 3970x will stay water cooled)...have to ask FtW
> 
> ...btw, your build sounds amazing...so much fun going outside the 'normal case' limitations, isn't ?


im going to do dice and LN2 this summer as well workin my butt off to pay for all the parts and get everything all ready honestly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I'm really looking forward to seeing it Val!
> Any ideas on ETA of it being fully built?
> 
> It's not the parts inside that will take to "assemble" but the case itself.


I do have a somewhat far away ETA it WILL be done by the end of the summer. I'm more worried about the actually cooling build more that the case really me and my dad working together on something like this will take maybe 3 weeks tops, me and him will be working on it almost every day


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> So bought a 3220T for my combo NAS/Guest Gaming box/HTPC/automation server. Mini-ITX, 4GB ram, 840 SSD, 6TB Raid 0, around $400 not counting the mech hdd's...it'll be berry naice!
> 
> Eyeballing a used 8800 GT for graphics. Very inexpensive and would be a lot better than the HD2500 the 3220T comes with. Yay or nay? I know I'd be missing DX11, but I don't think that's too much of a tradeoff. Biggest concern is heat/power consumption vs a newer 650 or 7750, but those cards are a lot more expensive.


Well, if it's $20 I'd get it...you can bench with it too.
If not get a 4850.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...are you going to do competitive benching - if so, LN2 will move you to a different class if you aren't already there ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I may use the IVY in LN2 soon, but don't know if one can run in two classes at the same time (as the 3970x will stay water cooled)...have to ask FtW
> 
> ...btw, your build sounds amazing...so much fun going outside the 'normal case' limitations, isn't ?


You submit a subzero run and you automatically enter the OC league...there's no going back to Enthusiast.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Unfortunately I don't have any cooling yet. So I can't go much further. I'm using a 92mm downblowing CM Vortex I got to use in my HTPC. Even with 1.17v at 4.5GHz I'm hitting 80C.










Nice chip so far...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> im going to do dice and LN2 this summer as well workin my butt off to pay for all the parts and get everything all ready honestly.
> I do have a somewhat far away ETA it WILL be done by the end of the summer. I'm more worried about the actually cooling build more that the case really me and my dad working together on something like this will take maybe 3 weeks tops, me and him will be working on it almost every day


...well worth planning ahead for - even for months...that's half the fun right there...I'm far from finished with my 'thing' that will eventually become a deskputer, but this is rewarding...you'll love the pre-built time


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You submit a subzero run and you automatically enter the OC league...there's no going back to Enthusiast....


Tx for the info - decision time, I guess


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Tx for the info - decision time, I guess


I'd start by grabbing a bunch of old nvidia cards (8800, 9800, 8600) or Radeons like the 4870, 5870...and a gpu pot. That and an air cooled cpu like both of yours would do great at 3d benching with cold on volt modded gpus, it's doable on dice.


----------



## Hokies83

* Wonders when Val is going to fix is sig rig *


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd start by grabbing a bunch of old nvidia cards (8800, 9800, 8600) or Radeons like the 4870, 5870...and a gpu pot. That and an air cooled cpu like both of yours would do great at 3d benching with cold on volt modded gpus, it's doable on dice.


...I feel almost 'obligated' to do s.th. with the two CPUs, both having strong IMCs and running low 'v'...and I'm quite willing to do some volt-modding even on the 670ies...and hoping that some 780ies will have non-ref PCBs (like MSI Lightning; Asus Top)

...the 3970X will eventually go to 'work' so I am unlikely to push it past 5.2 GHz for now in benching...and I also just read ""confirmation"" about the 4960X Ivy-E coming out in September which looks a lot closer to the current 3970X than I thought (I had hoped for a Haswell-E, but that will come out later w/new chipset) ...more here: http://wccftech.com/intel-ivy-bridge-e-lga2011-hedt-processors-launching-september-2013/

...but given the results I have seen, my CPUs are fast enough as it is without doing s.th. drastic...it's the GPUs that need a bit more speed / extreme cooling...two of them can touch 1340+ - / 1800s at 1.215v hard limit on air, but there are guys that run them at 1476+ w/LN2 and volt-mods


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> * Wonders when Val is going to fix is sig rig *


thanks for the reminder!







fixin now


----------



## Hokies83

Man i missed the 7790 for 109$ by mere hours.. i was gonna buy 2 to put in my brand new 3570k + extreme 4 rig...

Now one with a good cooler is like 149$ =/ i gotta wait for a sale heh...

Having a 3570k + extreme 4 rig makes it easy for me to make the transfer to Haswell when i find the right price.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I feel almost 'obligated' to do s.th. with the two CPUs, both having strong IMCs and running low 'v'...and I'm quite willing to do some volt-modding even on the 670ies...and hoping that some 780ies will have non-ref PCBs (like MSI Lightning; Asus Top)
> 
> ...the 3970X will eventually go to 'work' so I am unlikely to push it past 5.2 GHz for now in benching...and I also just read ""confirmation"" about the 4960X Ivy-E coming out in September which looks a lot closer to the current 3970X than I thought (I had hoped for a Haswell-E, but that will come out later w/new chipset) ...more here: http://wccftech.com/intel-ivy-bridge-e-lga2011-hedt-processors-launching-september-2013/
> 
> ...but given the results I have seen, my CPUs are fast enough as it is without doing s.th. drastic...it's the GPUs that need a bit more speed / extreme cooling...two of them can touch 1340+ - / 1800s at 1.215v hard limit on air, but there are guys that run them at 1476+ w/LN2 and volt-mods


Well, seems like you're on the right track...focus on older cards. Not worth murdering the 670s when you can get way more points on older volt modded and cold stuff...Talking 30-50pts vs 15pts.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Man i missed the 7790 for 109$ by mere hours.. i was gonna buy 2 to put in my brand new 3570k + extreme 4 rig...
> 
> Now one with a good cooler is like 149$ =/ i gotta wait for a sale heh...
> 
> Having a 3570k + extreme 4 rig makes it easy for me to make the transfer to Haswell when i find the right price.


I'm gonna have to get Haswell but not at launch, maybe by Christmas.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Man i missed the 7790 for 109$ by mere hours.. i was gonna buy 2 to put in my brand new 3570k + extreme 4 rig...
> 
> Now one with a good cooler is like 149$ =/ i gotta wait for a sale heh...
> 
> Having a 3570k + extreme 4 rig makes it easy for me to make the transfer to Haswell when i find the right price.


you got a pretty good deal on that 3570k + extreme 4


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you got a pretty good deal on that 3570k + extreme 4


lol I remember on Steam you said you were gonna let them go cheap, I didn't know you meant THAT cheap! Good deal for Hokies.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, seems like you're on the right track...focus on older cards. Not worth murdering the 670s when you can get way more points on older volt modded and cold stuff...Talking 30-50pts vs 15pts....


...only half-kidding: what about S3 Virge cards - they used to be the mainstay in our commercial stuff and I still have some laying around ('basic' PCI).


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...only half-kidding: what about S3 Virge cards - they used to be the mainstay in our commercial stuff and I still have some laying around ('basic' PCI).


Check the bot. If they can run any of the benchies they are worth a shot. Those probably can't...I'd run my Voodoo's if I still had them







But they would not run many benchmark these days (I think)

http://hwbot.org/hardware/videocard/s3g_unichrome_pro/


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> lol I remember on Steam you said you were gonna let them go cheap, I didn't know you meant THAT cheap! Good deal for Hokies.


Pays to be on more then one forum...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, seems like you're on the right track...focus on older cards. Not worth murdering the 670s when you can get way more points on older volt modded and cold stuff...Talking 30-50pts vs 15pts.
> I'm gonna have to get Haswell but not at launch, maybe by Christmas.


Ivy-E by Christmas


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ivy-E by Christmas


I have some amazing plans for that CPU as well.







Dont we Ivan









You guys are gonna love this build, I'm so hyped you have no idea.


----------



## Hokies83

lost the hype when u said tec heh...

Insulation is not purdy =/

Id rather have Broadwell then Ivy-E anywho.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I have some amazing plans for that CPU as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dont we Ivan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... I'm so hyped you have no idea.


...oh yes we do !


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ivy-E by Christmas


I'd rather get Haswell really...8ghz on ln2 is tempting, and so is the increased ram oc capabilities, and super beastly 2d powa.
Plus I may get unlocked i3 chips with some luck.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...oh yes we do !


mwahaha







3d benching monsta!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> mwahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 3d benching monsta!


...was posting the SLI top score in FireStrike Extreme I hit last night w/3970X when I fired up the Ivy for the 1st time in its 'new home' and ran my 1st single-GPU bench...got my 1st points in singles







a lot tougher because it is not just more people, but more w/LN2, Phase Cascades etc...still, my 1st single GPU points mean that I now got some in singles, sli, tri-sli and quads ! I'm going to have to look how to optimize...









...more 3d benching monstas, please !










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## dmanstasiu

Did anyone here go from AS5 to CLU/CLP? There is no "previous TIM" section on the OP graph so that's no use ... I'm trying to prove to someone that going from AS5 to CLU is worth it by citing delid procedures with the respectable temp drops. I'm thinking they're about in line with 10-15ºC right?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good man! Now, getting good global scores with a 670 is gonna be rough...you'd need ln2, tons of mods that may kill the card and a 5.4ghz 3930k/6.2ghz 3770k.
Even with 7970's getting high scores is tricky, specially after Titan came out.


----------



## PCWargamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Did anyone here go from AS5 to CLU/CLP? There is no "previous TIM" section on the OP graph so that's no use ... I'm trying to prove to someone that going from AS5 to CLU is worth it by citing delid procedures with the respectable temp drops. I'm thinking they're about in line with 10-15ºC right?


Yes. I went from AS5 to CLU and then CLP. I recall *VonDutch* did too. We both gained somewhere near 10-15C IIRC. CLU/P is best on the die. Let the person do his own testing and he will see himself.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good man! Now, getting good global scores with a 670 is gonna be rough...you'd need ln2, tons of mods that may kill the card and a 5.4ghz 3930k/6.2ghz 3770k.
> Even with 7970's getting high scores is tricky, specially after Titan came out.


...oh I know...FtW and I were chatting just now, and he mentioned that I had gone past his score with "1380 core 7970 on ln2"...but Unigine always has been the favorite of my particular setup for some weird reason(s)...

Yet I'm under no illusion having looked at some of other scores in singles...most of these guys are a 5.9GHz to 6.8GHz on the Ivy / LN2...there are some more benches I can get points at I think - but for now, I just wanted to see if I could score @ single cards at all...









...I need to finish tweaking the 3970X...I have been very careful with it as Sandy-E C2 can degrade quicker than Ivy...I'm now happy that 51x100 is perfectly stable and safe voltage...the goal is to do the same w/5.2, then go back to the Ivy and see about optimum tweaking re its new home







...this new monster w-c loop is still ""ugly""







, but very effective


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'll be repairing my MVG this week! I found out who's the guy that does the Asus rma repairs locally...I'll pay a few bucks and get it repaired in no time, vs shipping it back to the US for rma.

Can't wait to bench my 6950! It's still relatively virgin so to speak


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll be repairing my MVG this week!...
> 
> Can't wait to bench my 6950! It's still relatively virgin so to speak


...not for long...sounds like you're going to make its new home the 'red light district' (noting the colour combo of MVGs







)


----------



## HiLuckyB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> Did anyone here go from AS5 to CLU/CLP? There is no "previous TIM" section on the OP graph so that's no use ... I'm trying to prove to someone that going from AS5 to CLU is worth it by citing delid procedures with the respectable temp drops. I'm thinking they're about in line with 10-15ºC right?


I went from MX-2 to CLU and got a 14c drop, I think it would be around the same with AS5.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, I have to give this mobo back to its owner...my current work horse (D945GCCR) isn't mine, a coworker gave it to me till I could repair the MVG.
I won't need to get risers to install my 7950 too, which is nice. MOAR bandwidth!I wonder if you can run xfire with a 7xxx and 6xxx card.








I'm gonna have to resell the 6950 and get a second 7950 soonish.

EDIT: well, no...you can't. But I can xfire with a 7970 so maybe I'll get that instead and kill two birds with one stone








MVG is good for up to 3 gpus too, though the third one will suffer if you install it with a riser.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, I have to give this mobo back to its owner...my current work horse (D945GCCR) isn't mine, a coworker gave it to me till I could repair the MVG.
> I won't need to get risers to install my 7950 too, which is nice. MOAR bandwidth!I wonder if you can run xfire with a 7xxx and 6xxx card.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna have to resell the 6950 and get a second 7950 soonish.
> 
> EDIT: well, no...you can't. But I can xfire with a 7970 so maybe I'll get that instead and kill two birds with one stone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MVG is good for up to 3 gpus too, though the third one will suffer if you install it with a riser.


...what do you mean by riser ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> It is indeed normal for uni connections - as they cap the downloads, but rarely cap the uploads
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS.
> 8Pack broke 3 world records!!!
> 
> http://www.vortez.net/news_story/overclocks_own_8_pack_returns_with_3_world_overclocking_records.html


He's a monster bencher! Should have some insane Titan scores coming soon too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> so guys for my wooden build Im thinking TEC cooling for a 3930K and quadfire as well the rads will be worth it then


A 3930k might be a bit hard on a TEC, doable but straight water might actually work better at high clocks & voltage. Benching 3930k on my single stage isn't bad, but more than a few minutes with all 12 threads loaded at 100% gets pretty rough. Sb-e makes a lot of heat by 5ghz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...what's the difference between armaflex and neoprene - just brand names ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...are you going to do competitive benching - if so, LN2 will move you to a different class if you aren't already there ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I may use the IVY in LN2 soon, but don't know if one can run in two classes at the same time (as the 3970x will stay water cooled)...have to ask FtW
> 
> ...btw, your build sounds amazing...so much fun going outside the 'normal case' limitations, isn't ?


Both closed cell foam, the neoprene is a bit softer but they do the same job.

Submit one extreme cooled score, & you're in the extreme OC league, for good.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I feel almost 'obligated' to do s.th. with the two CPUs, both having strong IMCs and running low 'v'...and I'm quite willing to do some volt-modding even on the 670ies...and hoping that some 780ies will have non-ref PCBs (like MSI Lightning; Asus Top)
> 
> ...the 3970X will eventually go to 'work' so I am unlikely to push it past 5.2 GHz for now in benching...and I also just read ""confirmation"" about the 4960X Ivy-E coming out in September which looks a lot closer to the current 3970X than I thought (I had hoped for a Haswell-E, but that will come out later w/new chipset) ...more here: http://wccftech.com/intel-ivy-bridge-e-lga2011-hedt-processors-launching-september-2013/
> 
> ...but given the results I have seen, my CPUs are fast enough as it is without doing s.th. drastic...it's the GPUs that need a bit more speed / extreme cooling...two of them can touch 1340+ - / 1800s at 1.215v hard limit on air, but there are guys that run them at 1476+ w/LN2 and volt-mods


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, seems like you're on the right track...focus on older cards. Not worth murdering the 670s when you can get way more points on older volt modded and cold stuff...Talking 30-50pts vs 15pts.
> I'm gonna have to get Haswell but not at launch, maybe by Christmas.


I agree with this, older cards are fun to start with & less to lose when things go wrong, & something eventually does go wrong. I've killed 2 new cards with failed vmods (one a $600 >3 week old gtx295), & 3 or 4 old 8800s learning to insulate for subzero. Benching gets addicting enough, when the thrill of taking older cards to the breaking point doesn't fulfill the need for speed anymore, then risk the new expensive ones.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'd rather get Haswell really...8ghz on ln2 is tempting, and so is the increased ram oc capabilities, and super beastly 2d powa.
> Plus I may get unlocked i3 chips with some luck.
> mwahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 3d benching monsta!


Ivy-e though, 6Ghz + 12 thread full pot goodness. At least it better be or I will be so disappoint ...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> He's a monster bencher! Should have some insane Titan scores coming soon too.
> A 3930k might be a bit hard on a TEC, doable but straight water might actually work better at high clocks & voltage. Benching 3930k on my single stage isn't bad, but more than a few minutes with all 12 threads loaded at 100% gets pretty rough. Sb-e makes a lot of heat by 5ghz.
> 
> Both closed cell foam, the neoprene is a bit softer but they do the same job.
> 
> Submit one extreme cooled score, & you're in the extreme OC league, for good.
> 
> I agree with this, older cards are fun to start with & less to lose when things go wrong, & something eventually does go wrong. I've killed 2 new cards with failed vmods (one a $600 >3 week old gtx295), & 3 or 4 old 8800s learning to insulate for subzero. Benching gets addicting enough, when the thrill of taking older cards to the breaking point doesn't fulfill the need for speed anymore, then risk the new expensive ones.
> Ivy-e though, 6Ghz + 12 thread full pot goodness. At least it better be or I will be so disappoint ...


Well, if Ivy-E does 6.2ghz 6c/12t then I'm sold! Specially paired with 2600mhz quad channel PSC.
But still, Haswell might be better all around and cheaper.

EDIT: http://www.techimo.com/forum/graphics-cards-displays/271920-xfire-pcie-1x.html
I might be able to fold despite the third card being in an 1x slot...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> He's a monster bencher! Should have some insane Titan scores coming soon too.
> A 3930k might be a bit hard on a TEC, doable but straight water might actually work better at high clocks & voltage. Benching 3930k on my single stage isn't bad, but more than a few minutes with all 12 threads loaded at 100% gets pretty rough. Sb-e makes a lot of heat by 5ghz.
> 
> Both closed cell foam, the neoprene is a bit softer but they do the same job.
> 
> Submit one extreme cooled score, & you're in the extreme OC league, for good.
> 
> I agree with this, older cards are fun to start with & less to lose when things go wrong, & something eventually does go wrong. I've killed 2 new cards with failed vmods (one a $600 >3 week old gtx295), & 3 or 4 old 8800s learning to insulate for subzero. Benching gets addicting enough, when the thrill of taking older cards to the breaking point doesn't fulfill the need for speed anymore, then risk the new expensive ones.
> Ivy-e though, 6Ghz + 12 thread full pot goodness. At least it better be or I will be so disappoint ...


I'm still shooting idea but it would be pretty sweet if you joined my idea planning sir! been wondering where you have been!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ivy-e though, 6Ghz + 12 thread full pot goodness. At least it better be or I will be so disappoint ...


I reeeeeeaaaaaally hope intel doesn't mess ivy-e up, if they take it to its full potential I think we can look forward to something nice. Also ivy-e sounds like old tech since haswell is coming but it is just as advanced imo.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, it's not as advanced technically, but has an advantage with two more cores and 4 more threads.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...what do you mean by riser ?


A ribbon cable type adapter that goes between the pci-e slot & pci-e tab on the card, so you can run a card outside the mobo area.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, if Ivy-E does 6.2ghz 6c/12t then I'm sold! Specially paired with 2600mhz quad channel PSC.
> But still, Haswell might be better all around and cheaper.
> 
> EDIT: http://www.techimo.com/forum/graphics-cards-displays/271920-xfire-pcie-1x.html
> I might be able to fold despite the third card being in an 1x slot...


Haswell will be better for things limited to 4c/8t, but for multithread ivy-e should be beastly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm still shooting idea but it would be pretty sweet if you joined my idea planning sir! been wondering where you have been!


I'll do that! Been busy with planning & working for money to see plans come through.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I reeeeeeaaaaaally hope intel doesn't mess ivy-e up, if they take it to its full potential I think we can look forward to something nice. Also ivy-e sounds like old tech since haswell is coming but it is just as advanced imo.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, it's not as advanced technically, but has an advantage with two more cores and 4 more threads.


Haswell will do better in single thread performance & anything that is limited to the core & thread count. Ivy-e should be the fastest hexcore though, & a hexcore that overclocks like ivy bridge & scales with cold should be impressive.
I plan on having both.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A ribbon cable type adapter that goes between the pci-e slot & pci-e tab on the card, so you can run a card outside the mobo area.
> Haswell will be better for things limited to 4c/8t, but for multithread ivy-e should be beastly.
> I'll do that! Been busy with planning & working for money to see plans come through.
> 
> Haswell will do better in single thread performance & anything that is limited to the core & thread count. Ivy-e should be the fastest hexcore though, & a hexcore that overclocks like ivy bridge & scales with cold should be impressive.
> I plan on having both.


well I'm curious to see what ideas you can come up with in my plans (been waiting all day







) I hear you on the money making parts though... this build is gonna kill some major money....


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Haswell will be better for things limited to 4c/8t
> Haswell will do better in single thread performance & anything that is limited to the core & thread count. Ivy-e should be the fastest hexcore though, & a hexcore that overclocks like ivy bridge & scales with cold should be impressive.
> I plan on having both.


Lots of things are starting to like more cores, maybe that process will speed up in near future? If the hexacores oc nicely this time around it might be the chip to have. There might even be an octocore later on, or maybe that will be in haswell e or broadwell e, really looking forward to all of these, especially broadwell


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Lots of things are starting to like more cores, maybe that process will speed up in near future? If the hexacores oc nicely this time around it might be the chip to have. There might even be an octocore later on, or maybe that will be in haswell e or broadwell e, really looking forward to all of these, especially broadwell


More cores are definitely being utilised, especially in physics simulations etc, but benchmarks which only use single cores (such as SuperPI etc) then Haswell will be out on top GHz for GHz due to the increased IPC.

e.g. :

horrorxpun. - 3770k @ 5.2GHz - MVF - 8GB 2040MHz 9-10-9-21-1T - 6m 31.6s
dave_beast. - 2600k @ 5.28GHz - P67A-GD55 - 16GB - 1862MHz 9-9-9-24-2T - 6m 31.9s

2600k Sandy is clocked nearly 1GHz faster, yet it still can't keep up with the Ivy Bridge architecture.


----------



## I_shot

Raystorm+ Feser Monsta Lite 420+ MCP655 1.4V 5 ghz 26 C Ambient temp



Even the chip is delidded it is by far the hottest chip of my four delidded cpus.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> More cores are definitely being utilised, especially in physics simulations etc, but benchmarks which only use single cores (such as SuperPI etc) then Haswell will be out on top GHz for GHz due to the increased IPC.
> 
> e.g. :
> 
> horrorxpun. - 3770k @ 5.2GHz - MVF - 8GB 2040MHz 9-10-9-21-1T - 6m 31.6s
> dave_beast. - 2600k @ 5.28GHz - P67A-GD55 - 16GB - 1862MHz 9-9-9-24-2T - 6m 31.9s
> 
> 2600k Sandy is clocked nearly 1GHz faster, yet it still can't keep up with the Ivy Bridge architecture.


Sandy is 32nm, ivy is 22nm, quite different from ivy vs haswell. Anyway, only time can tell how each will perform compared to their predecessor.


----------



## illuz

Be around 5-10%, 10% at a push clock for clock I'd say.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...oh I know...FtW and I were chatting just now, and he mentioned that I had gone past his score with "1380 core 7970 on ln2"...but Unigine always has been the favorite of my particular setup for some weird reason(s)...
> 
> Yet I'm under no illusion having looked at some of other scores in singles...most of these guys are a 5.9GHz to 6.8GHz on the Ivy / LN2...there are some more benches I can get points at I think - but for now, I just wanted to see if I could score @ single cards at all...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I need to finish tweaking the 3970X...I have been very careful with it as Sandy-E C2 can degrade quicker than Ivy...I'm now happy that 51x100 is perfectly stable and safe voltage...the goal is to do the same w/5.2, then go back to the Ivy and see about optimum tweaking re its new home
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...this new monster w-c loop is still ""ugly""
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , but very effective


At what voltage do the 3930 chips start to degarde ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> At what voltage do the 3930 chips start to degarde ?


Like SB, I wouldn't go over 1.45v for 24/7 use...some run 1.5v but I wouldn't do it unless cold.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Like SB, I wouldn't go over 1.45v for 24/7 use...some run 1.5v but I wouldn't do it unless cold.


I must be kinda crazy then. I'm running 1.528 v on my 3570k . Been about 3 months so far. Stressing Ill go into the 70's but regular use ( gaming ) doesnt break 60 deg.


----------



## Hokies83

SB? 1.4v is scary for SB.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Like SB, I wouldn't go over 1.45v for 24/7 use...some run 1.5v but I wouldn't do it unless cold.


Im at 1.432 24/7 so I should be ok ??


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Im at 1.432 24/7 so I should be ok ??


You're fine. What are temps like?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> You're fine. What are temps like?


SB-E 4.9 Ghz 1.432 v max temp 65 under load.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> SB-E 4.9 Ghz 1.432 v max temp 65 under load.


I'd say your fine.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I must be kinda crazy then. I'm running 1.528 v on my 3570k . Been about 3 months so far. Stressing Ill go into the 70's but regular use ( gaming ) doesnt break 60 deg.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I'd say your fine.


He probably is, but remember SB and SB-E are NOTHING like Ivy bridge man.


----------



## illuz

What clocks are you hitting for that?

Had to take my CPU cooler out as I'm selling my Alpenfohn k2, so it's back to the stock cooler for me and stock clocks. At least until I can afford to buy the rest of my water-cooling parts.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> At what voltage do the 3930 chips start to degarde ?


...assuming that temps are well controlled, there are 3 voltages to watch for with SB-E C2 (different from C1)...these are v-core, VCCSA and VTT

I keep vCore at a daily 1.275 v base (mine is a 3970X but 3930K is very similar).

Much *more importantly*, 'C2' stepping are much more sensitive than C1 re VCCSA and VTT...under no circumstances should either VCCSA or VTT exceed 1.2v (I run mine at 1.15v for 32GB / 2400MHz RAM)...with C1s, 1.35 to 1.4 was considered doable, and on many boards (ie RIVE), auto XMP in Bios will bump it up to past 1.35v++ as you increase speed, even on C2s, so this is something to watch - degradation with those on the wrong setting can be very swift


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yup, my thoughts exactly...SB was pretty similar, degradation or insta death was the reward.
Ivy is so much tougher









I want a Haswell rig NAO


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> He probably is, but remember SB and SB-E are NOTHING like Ivy bridge man.


Ya they are soldered, lol. Delid ftw


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Ya they are soldered, lol. Delid ftw


Ivan meant for being wimpy with voltages. Ivy laughs at voltages that would have sandy degrading quickly.
Besides the locked max multi for each sb & sb-e cpu. If you reach the max clock on ivy & still want it to go faster, you can improve cooling & do it. If you reach the max clock on sandy & want faster, have to buy more cpus until you find a faster one.
You still have to bin ivy cpus if you want a 7Ghz chip, but unlike sandy most will validate 6Ghz when properly cooled & pushed.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Amen


----------



## Hokies83

Just snagged 2 7850s for 245$ shipped







to go into my 150$ shipped i5 3570k+extreme 4 rig lol.

That is using a 120$ Antec True Power Quattro 1200 watt Psu. lol...


----------



## Arm3nian

Guys how do you run dual channel on the ud3h? Using corsair 1600mhz 2x8gb sticks, running 1333mhz currently. I looked at the manual and it says channel A is slot 2 and 4, and channel b is slot 1 and 3, I tried both sticks in both configurations and cpu-z still reporting single channel. Do I have to set something in the bios?

CPU is 3770k, also haven't delidded this so there is no way it is a pcb problem.


----------



## Arm3nian

Disregard that post ^. Got confused with the manual, I thought the manual meant that Channel A is technically both channels together so channel 1, but nope. You have to put them slot 1 and 2.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I had a similar confusion briefly once I first got my ud5h lol...after ages of not buying new hardware.


----------



## amd655

Is it possible to delid a sandy bridge chip?

Not that i need to do it, just curious.


----------



## alancsalt

Inadvisable. Soldered.


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Inadvisable. Soldered.


Ok


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Ok


Whatup Recon!! Long time no see, its stickg1 from THG!


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Whatup Recon!! Long time no see, its stickg1 from THG!


Sheesh..... don't i know some folk, hi mate


----------



## amd655

"1.4v is scary for SB"

LOL... yeah right....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> "1.4v is scary for SB"
> 
> LOL... yeah right....


Yup SB is a degrading monster.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Indeed it is...

Alancsalt! I needed some tips on ocing to 5ghz on your Pro3 yesterday and couldn't find your screenshots.
Can you give a buddy a hand with that? He has a 2500k though.


----------



## Hokies83

LoL cannot find my camera or i would take pics of this 3570k build.. that i dub Ghetto Build lol....

IM using a 10 yearold case.. that i ripped all the 5.25 / hdd bays out of.. pretty much making it a empty box...

I used my Old cosmos 2 / front panel.. which i drilled a hole on top ran wires thru.. it has usb 3.0 sata and usb ports etc... lol... i likes it...

But can not hate on a 500$ cost i5 3570k build that is running HD 7000 series X fire lol.


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yup SB is a degrading monster.


Proof or it never happened.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Proof or it never happened.


The hundreds upon hundreds of reported degrading SB chips are more then enough proof.

You can degrade the crap out of an SB chip with just one high voltage run.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Proof or it never happened.


you shold delid your SB chip







you'll get awsome temps


----------



## amd655

Well i must be the only one with a CPU that has not degraded....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Well i must be the only one with a CPU that has not degraded....


...my 3970X that joined my delidded 3770K is too new to really add sensible data, though the reports on SB/E degradation I have seen differentiate between C1 and C2 steppings, and also whether folks were just running highish v-core (say around 1.52+) 24/7 or additionally also more than 1.2v on VCCSA and VTT (per earlier post) on the newer C2 steppings...what seems a fact though is that Ivys are more forgiving of high- v-core (*within reason*...) and far less destructible than SB-Es


----------



## FtW 420

My 2600k has degraded, still reaches the max but takes a bit more voltage than it used to. Never been used for a daily, & has never seen a load temp as high as 60°.
I killed my first 2500k setting the VTT voltage to 1.24V, just had to set that & press the start button for the kill, with ivy I have used 1.25V + fairly often with no issues so far.


----------



## illuz

Do you know why that is FtW? I'd of thought ivy was weaker in terms of leeway with voltage compared to SB.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys I've finally started my first water loop ever and I have the link to the build log in my signature and if you guys could check it out and subscribe to it I would really appreciate it. Thanks a lot guys!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Do you know why that is FtW? I'd of thought ivy was weaker in terms of leeway with voltage compared to SB.


Sandy does have a weaker IMC than Ivy, & it degrades easier. I imagine the benchers just see it more than most since that is where pushing the memory clocks & timings make more difference, so pushing the IMC harder.
Guys have killed & degraded chips with high vcore as well, usually 1.5V or more in a daily driver from what I remember though


----------



## amd655

I know my ram does not run at it's rated timings ever, it just will fail to boot, this began to happen back with my MSI P67A-GD53 board, but ram would not run in dual channel ever, and so i bought this EVGA board, now the ram will never run at CL9, only CL11.

When i first got my sandy set up, memory worked fine at XMP.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> I know my ram does not run at it's rated timings ever, it just will fail to boot, this began to happen back with my MSI P67A-GD53 board, but ram would not run in dual channel ever, and so i bought this EVGA board, now the ram will never run at CL9, only CL11.
> 
> When i first got my sandy set up, memory worked fine at XMP.


lol your RAM hates you.


----------



## Hokies83

Damn Valguar sitting on all the beer again...


----------



## FtW 420

For memory overclocking with sandy bridge, the MIVE was the board to have. It worked well with pretty much all memory, & was really the only board that could overclock well with hypers for great timings.


----------



## Splinter007

Did anyone have the same problem I had?

What the heck, Intel...



My first time de-lidding. It probably won't be the last time either.


----------



## FtW 420

What problem did you have, chip ran hot? A few guys here had that...


----------



## Splinter007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> What problem did you have, chip ran hot? A few guys here had that...


About 5% of the internal die was covered in the thermal paste. Terrible job. 80C at 4.0ghz with an aftermarket cooler.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Splinter007*
> 
> About 5% of the internal die was covered in the thermal paste. Terrible job. 80C at 4.0ghz with an aftermarket cooler.


----------



## FtW 420

Looks like most of it probably stuck to the IHS when it came off, but 4Ghz @ 80° with an aftermarket cooler does sound hotter than normal, even for a hot running cpu.

If you already have some CLU for it, should see a pretty dramatic difference. Any paste will help once the big wad of glue is gone, the liquid metal TIM on the die does do very well & is preferred though.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Damn Valguar sitting on all the beer again...


what I do? sorry been doing insane amounts of homework and I'm still not done, been working on this homework for 19 hours already


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what I do? sorry been doing insane amounts of homework and I'm still not done, been working on this homework for 19 hours already


19 hours? Hokies must be right, homework & beer make homework take longer...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Splinter007*
> 
> About 5% of the internal die was covered in the thermal paste. Terrible job. 80C at 4.0ghz with an aftermarket cooler.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks like most of it probably stuck to the IHS when it came off, but 4Ghz @ 80° with an aftermarket cooler does sound hotter than normal, even for a hot running cpu.
> 
> If you already have some CLU for it, should see a pretty dramatic difference. Any paste will help once the big wad of glue is gone, the liquid metal TIM on the die does do very well & is preferred though.


...strange things do happen...on my 3770K, the IHS was on 'crooked' from the factory with one side touching the PCB and on top of that the IHS was very concave...but the burned one above - wow...I like my steak crispy Chicago style, but not my CPUs


----------



## dr/owned

Update:

Now running with my RX480 submerged in 12 gallons of water. Water is being circulated through a 1/3 HP Chiller. 75F right now because it hasn't had a chance to get ahead, and I haven't insulated my reservoir or tubing. Impossible to heatsoak the rad now.

I give you 5.1 Ghz @ 1.725V (couldn't get 5.2 to boot at this voltage):



Do I need to start messing with Bclk and other crap now? Does this count as "Extreme Overclock" to where cranking the multiplier is the only thing needed?


----------



## FtW 420

I'd be uncomfortable with those temps at that voltage. The temps are good for what you're running, but high temps + high voltage = danger, keep an eye out for it needing higher volts to maintain that. I dunno if it'll degrade there or not, but it wouldn't surprise me.
Might be an idea to let the water all cool right down first.

Bclk is more for trying to squeeze out the last few cpu & memory Mhz, & for avoiding cold boot bugs. You shouldn't need to mess with it unless you want to.
If looking at extreme cooled overclocks, around -100° ivy bridge stops booting up, setting bclk to 105 or so allows it to keep booting up again until it gets to -145° to -196° (depends on the cpu).


----------



## ivanlabrie

That's too hot for 1.7v...insane and Franky-like.








You really hate your chip, right man?

I'd back down a little, or maybe try FtW's suggestions...if you can get the chip colder than ambient then it'll be worth seeing.
Why not dump the rad altogether?


----------



## dr/owned

Water is at 67F, Ambient is 80F.

Peak temperature is dropping linearly as the water temperature goes down. Doubt I'll get the water much colder without insulating the reservoir. I might end up adding a 2nd chiller, because this one was a craigslist special and who knows if the refrigerant is topped off.

Can't dump the rad, because I'm running premix coolant. Would rather not have to buy 11 gallons of it, and the rad is acting as a coupler between the ton of chilled tap water (cheap and replaceable) and the small amount of coolant in the loop ($14 to fill just the loop). I could just run the chiller in the loop without the 11 gallon reservoir, but then it'll probably cause the compressor to cycle on/off too much and burn it out.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, yeah...should be ok. Second chiller might do the trick, along with insulation.
Good luck!


----------



## Valgaur

Is. That 1.728vcore? For only 5.1!? Throw that chip away id consider extreme ocing once you reach the 2 giggle club. Those vvores for that clock iz just bad....sorry im on my phone


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys! you dead or what??? 8ghz 4770k spotted in the wild...


----------



## dr/owned

1.725 for 5.1...yep. I haven't bothered tuning it yet, but it seems any lower will cause bsods during P95.

So far it's 1.575 for 5.0, 1.35 for 4.7.

Ironically this was the best chip out of 5 I sorted from the same batch. I know it's definitely not golden









PS - Tried 1.775 for 5.2....crashed P95, peak temp was 95C.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys! you dead or what??? 8ghz 4770k spotted in the wild...


L2n?

I want to know what to expect on high end water lol.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 1.725 for 5.1...yep. I haven't bothered tuning it yet, but it seems any lower will cause bsods during P95.
> 
> So far it's 1.575 for 5.0, 1.35 for 4.7.
> 
> Ironically this was the best chip out of 5 I sorted from the same batch. I know it's definitely not golden
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS - Tried 1.775 for 5.2....crashed P95, peak temp was 95C.


You need the second chiller badly or convert both to a cascade, that would definitely satisfy your needs man. You can do eet!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys! you dead or what??? 8ghz 4770k spotted in the wild...




what? where?!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Guys! you dead or what??? 8ghz 4770k spotted in the wild...


that has to be on ln2
and im thinking from 5.3 - 5.5ghz on water with a 4770k


----------



## illuz

Its on LN2 and needs about 2.25 volts to hit it... Insane.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 1.725 for 5.1...yep. I haven't bothered tuning it yet, but it seems any lower will cause bsods during P95.
> 
> So far it's 1.575 for 5.0, 1.35 for 4.7.
> 
> Ironically this was the best chip out of 5 I sorted from the same batch. I know it's definitely not golden
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS - Tried 1.775 for 5.2....crashed P95, peak temp was 95C.
> 
> 
> 
> You need the second chiller badly or convert both to a cascade, that would definitely satisfy your needs man. You can do eet!
Click to expand...

Yep, think I'll add the second chiller. Lowest temperature I got overnight with the desktop idling was 61F. If I add a second chiller, it will be more than double the cooling capacity (1/3 HP + 1/2 HP) and I think It'll be able to do a temperature pulldown all the way to the dewpoint (high 30's since I have 22% humidity indoors), even without insulating the reservoir. Then I have to decide if I want to buy a dehumidifier and blow that air into the case.

This weekend I also have to move to a more permanent connection setup to the chiller. Right now I'm just using some home depot 3/4 ID 1 OD tubing, and I'd like to use PVC pipe and get the chiller 20 feet away exhausting out a window. PVC pipe is also so much cheaper than tubing.....20 cents a foot vs 90 cents a foot.







vs. $4 a foot if I were to connect my loop directly to the chiller (where running 40 feet of Tygon would be crazy expensive).

At some point I'll have to take pics and do a writeup so someone else can follow my work or make it better.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool, just don't push more than 1.6v unless you REALLY hate that chip.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> 1.725 for 5.1...yep. I haven't bothered tuning it yet, but it seems any lower will cause bsods during P95.
> 
> So far it's 1.575 for 5.0, 1.35 for 4.7.
> 
> Ironically this was the best chip out of 5 I sorted from the same batch. I know it's definitely not golden
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS - Tried 1.775 for 5.2....crashed P95, peak temp was 95C.












here how about this.... your not gonna get 5.2 under 1.8 i can garauntee you that much the vcore jumps are crazy you'd probably need like 1.86 area.....


----------



## ivanlabrie

He would definitely get 6ghz with 1.9v at -170c...most likely, but not sure on more than 2 cores.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> He would definitely get 6ghz with 1.9v at -170c...most likely, but not sure on more than 2 cores.


And I'll never get down _that_ low, because I'm too scared of dragonskinning my mobo. Plus LN2 isn't really a 24/7 option.
Quote:


> here how about this.... your not gonna get 5.2 under 1.8 i can garauntee you that much the vcore jumps are crazy you'd probably need like 1.86 area.....


Yeah it seems like that is going to be true. I'm hoping that if I get the water down to -10C or so that the leakage will go down enough where I can make 5.2-5.3 without increasing voltage. I noticed that I was able to get P95 stable at 5.1 w/ 1.725V at 65F whereas previously at 75F it would crash after the first 5 tests. This gels with the Ivy Bridge OC Guide that found power consumption dropped near-exponentially with lower temperatures, even "reasonable" lower temperatures and not just water vs LN2.

My informal goal is to get 5.3 stable 24/7 so then I'll have the highest 24/7 IB OC according to the IB Stable Club spreadsheet. Right now the highest is 5.25 I think.


----------



## amd655

I currently have 5 at 1.4v, with no sign of any instability, but temps are on the high side.


----------



## lilchronic

here what i got a while back on my old board


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> And I'll never get down _that_ low, because I'm too scared of dragonskinning my mobo. Plus LN2 isn't really a 24/7 option.
> Yeah it seems like that is going to be true. I'm hoping that if I get the water down to -10C or so that the leakage will go down enough where I can make 5.2-5.3 without increasing voltage. I noticed that I was able to get P95 stable at 5.1 w/ 1.725V at 65F whereas previously at 75F it would crash after the first 5 tests. This gels with the Ivy Bridge OC Guide that found power consumption dropped near-exponentially with lower temperatures, even "reasonable" lower temperatures and not just water vs LN2.
> 
> My informal goal is to get 5.3 stable 24/7 so then I'll have the highest 24/7 IB OC according to the IB Stable Club spreadsheet. Right now the highest is 5.25 I think.


The colder the better, lower temps also needs less voltage. Don't fear the dragon skin or LET.

This was with cascade, basically an air conditioner cascading into another air conditioner & going to a cpu heatsink instead of cooling the air or water. I should get back to getting this done with max memory....


----------



## ivanlabrie

I'd love to get a cascade or even a single stage...It's something I got pending.


----------



## dr/owned

^^ You bring up a good idea FtW. What if I bought an AC and blew it into the radiator of the chiller? I have to wonder how much the temperature would improve with that. It might still be more cost effective to just throw more chillers into the loop than to optimize a single chiller.

As is the refrigerant flowing into the rad is very hot (110+ and can only grab it for a few seconds before it hurts too much). Refrigerant flowing out is still warm.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You NEED to put the evaporator of an AC inside the fluid....it's the only proper way to do it.


----------



## justanoldman

You guys have any opinions on the L.D. cases with phase?
http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g1/c547/list/p1/Cases-LD_Cooling_Cases.html
I don't really know much about it. Is it really practical for 24/7 use as far a cost to run it, maintain it, reliability, etc.?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You guys have any opinions on the L.D. cases with phase?
> http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g1/c547/list/p1/Cases-LD_Cooling_Cases.html
> I don't really know much about it. Is it really practical for 24/7 use as far a cost to run it, maintain it, reliability, etc.?


I've only heard good things about Little Devil, but the prices are a bit steep...Would love one though.


----------



## givmedew

actual delidding question...

I just de-lidded my i5-3570K no issues it was not the first one I delidded BUT this time I did not really see the results I was expecting.

It seems like I have only taken about 5-7c off the temps. I was hitting around 75 and now I am hitting around 70.

Used CooLabs Ultra and Gelied GC Extreme. I plan on using Indigo Extreme but didn't want to use it up until after I know everything is good to go.

I was using IC Diamond prior to the delidding.

http://valid.canardpc.com/2792709

Think I did something wrong or just live with it?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Too much paste on die probably or bad seating of the heatsink...redo that.
Don't spread Gelid paste, use a pea sized drop in the middle. Clean all surfaces with IPA and cotton swabs before reapplying paste.


----------



## dr/owned

Probably too much CLU. Seems to be a common problem.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> actual delidding question...
> 
> I just de-lidded my i5-3570K no issues it was not the first one I delidded BUT this time I did not really see the results I was expecting.
> 
> It seems like I have only taken about 5-7c off the temps. I was hitting around 75 and now I am hitting around 70.
> 
> Used CooLabs Ultra and Gelied GC Extreme. I plan on using Indigo Extreme but didn't want to use it up until after I know everything is good to go.
> 
> I was using IC Diamond prior to the delidding.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2792709
> 
> Think I did something wrong or just live with it?


...in addition to the above responses, also better check concavity of the IHS...non LM products tend to deal with a concave IHS a lot better and can mask a severe case of it


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> here what i got a while back on my old board


hey now do not blow up my ghetto rig....


----------



## dr/owned

Messed with some of the power settings in BIOS- load line calibration down to Level 2 from Level 1. Not sure if I messed with the PWM switching settings, but I'll check later. High PLL voltage seems to make no difference for max OC, but lower gives slightly better temperatures.

5.1 @ 1.65V (haven't tried lower yet), and it's been P95 stable for 2 hours so far. Peak temp 84C...at 72C right now.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Man, you're asking the chip to die...last time I tell you. You don't just stress test over 1.6v


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Man, you're asking the chip to die...last time I tell you. You don't just stress test over 1.6v


All chips die eventually









[insert badass WWII movie quote here]


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> All chips die eventually
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [insert badass WWII movie quote here]


not really I beat mine apart to really see if IVY actually degrade and it did but very quickly, dont break it unless you wanna i guess


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> All chips die eventually
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [insert badass WWII movie quote here]


You need sub zero cooling for those voltages... don't even matter if you get decent temps on water, those tests are pointless because you won't be running it 24/7 at that voltage or be breaking any benchmark records.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> hey now do not blow up my ghetto rig....


It survived i ran 5 ghz on it for months @1.38v


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> actual delidding question...
> 
> I just de-lidded my i5-3570K no issues it was not the first one I delidded BUT this time I did not really see the results I was expecting.
> 
> It seems like I have only taken about 5-7c off the temps. I was hitting around 75 and now I am hitting around 70.
> 
> Used CooLabs Ultra and Gelied GC Extreme. I plan on using Indigo Extreme but didn't want to use it up until after I know everything is good to go.
> 
> I was using IC Diamond prior to the delidding.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2792709
> 
> Think I did something wrong or just live with it?
> 
> 
> 
> ...in addition to the above responses, also better check concavity of the IHS...non LM products tend to deal with a concave IHS a lot better and can mask a severe case of it
Click to expand...

NON LM???

I have a convex water block... The 5noz by Detroit Waterblocks... When I put the Gelied GC Extreme on I use a very thin bead in the center about the length of 2 small grains of rice and maybe just a bit thinner. I then set the waterblock onto it and wiggled it just a little bit once I had tightened it down a tad.

As for the CooLabs I brushed it on as if it was barely there at all. I brushed it onto both the IHS and the die.

I used just the smallest and thinnest layer of silicone RTV imaginable to ensure it would not raise the IHS up enough to separate the lid from the die given how thing the coating of CooLab Ultra was on it.

Are you saying that it is possible that the IHS is no longer concave and therefore is not seating well with my water block? I could believe this especially since the water block is already not flat.

I am hoping this is not an actual IHS to DIE issue and not because it was a pain to do (it was easier than lapping my 920) but instead because I don't think I could have done a better job unless luck played into it.

Let me know if any of what I just said changes anything.

I do not want to lap this processor and if I did I think I would lap it more like a valve (sit it on the water block and spin it back and fourth) since the water block was purposely made convex.


----------



## dr/owned

Sounds like your application method was good. Maybe you already had a good chip where the TIM wasn't that big of a deal?


----------



## dr/owned

P95 causing a double post with lag....


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> All chips die eventually
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [insert badass WWII movie quote here]
> 
> 
> 
> You need sub zero cooling for those voltages... don't even matter if you get decent temps on water, those tests are pointless because you won't be running it 24/7 at that voltage or be breaking any benchmark records.
Click to expand...

The whole point of my exercise is this is a 24/7 setup. And I disagree about temperature not mattering. I'd argue 70C @ 1.6 is probably just as "safe" as 85C and 1.45 which you see a lot of around here with people running H100's. Temperature vs Leakage is an exponential curve with Ivy, and I'm planning on shaving off at least another 15C which will in turn probably allow for even lower voltages = a double win (lower temp and voltage).


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> NON LM???
> 
> I have a convex water block... The 5noz by Detroit Waterblocks... When I put the Gelied GC Extreme on I use a very thin bead in the center about the length of 2 small grains of rice and maybe just a bit thinner. I then set the waterblock onto it and wiggled it just a little bit once I had tightened it down a tad.
> 
> As for the CooLabs I brushed it on as if it was barely there at all. I brushed it onto both the IHS and the die.
> 
> I used just the smallest and thinnest layer of silicone RTV imaginable to ensure it would not raise the IHS up enough to separate the lid from the die given how thing the coating of CooLab Ultra was on it.
> 
> Are you saying that it is possible that the IHS is no longer concave and therefore is not seating well with my water block? I could believe this especially since the water block is already not flat.
> 
> I am hoping this is not an actual IHS to DIE issue and not because it was a pain to do (it was easier than lapping my 920) but instead because I don't think I could have done a better job unless luck played into it.
> 
> Let me know if any of what I just said changes anything.
> 
> I do not want to lap this processor and if I did I think I would lap it more like a valve (sit it on the water block and spin it back and fourth) since the water block was purposely made convex.


...LM = Liquid Metal TIM products such as Coollaboratory (there are other brands)

....some IHS are more concave than others...one thing to test out if after reassembly it shows temps that are higher than expected is to turn the water-block by 90 degrees if you can

..also, LMs are great for heat transfer in non-sub-zero applications, but they are not very good in filling in spaces between concave/convex 'hollows' if there isn't a perfect fit...On both my 3770K and 3970X, the IHS was really concave (far above average)...the water blocks for each had no convexity in one case and not enough in the other application...I ended up lapping the IHS of the 3770K with 600 >>> 2000 grid sand paper, and that did the trick together with CoolLabs Ultra on both the die and IHS

...for the 3970X which has a much bigger IHS, I tried CoolLabs in a thin layer, but temps were higher than they should have been in a very strong w-c loop...when I took it apart again, I noticed the pattern of the concavity via the TIM marks...switched to MX4 and temps dropped by 20 C compared to Coollabs Ultra (normally, MX4 is a few degrees above Coollabs Ultra)...Non LM products such as MX4 are just better to fill the concave/convex space if there isn't a perfect fit, or flat surfaces on both the IHS and wager-block


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> The whole point of my exercise is this is a 24/7 setup. And I disagree about temperature not mattering. I'd argue 70C @ 1.6 is probably just as "safe" as 85C and 1.45 which you see a lot of around here with people running H100's. Temperature vs Leakage is an exponential curve with Ivy, and I'm planning on shaving off at least another 15C which will in turn probably allow for even lower voltages = a double win (lower temp and voltage).


Thing is the lower vcore cause of lower temps thing only shows up at subzero temps, around -30c or less. I say, forget the whole no condensation thing and mod your chillers into a single or cascade.


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> ......
> 
> 
> 
> ...LM = Liquid Metal TIM products such as Coollaboratory (there are other brands)
> 
> ....some IHS are more concave than others...one thing to test out if after reassembly it shows temps that are higher than expected is to turn the water-block by 90 degrees if you can
> 
> ..also, LMs are great for heat transfer in non-sub-zero applications, but they are not very good in filling in spaces between concave/convex 'hollows' if there isn't a perfect fit...On both my 3770K and 3970X, the IHS was really concave (far above average)...the water blocks for each had no convexity in one case and not enough in the other application...I ended up lapping the IHS of the 3770K with 600 >>> 2000 grid sand paper, and that did the trick together with CoolLabs Ultra on both the die and IHS
> 
> ...for the 3970X which has a much bigger IHS, I tried CoolLabs in a thin layer, but temps were higher than they should have been in a very strong w-c loop...when I took it apart again, I noticed the pattern of the concavity via the TIM marks...switched to MX4 and temps dropped by 20 C compared to Coollabs Ultra (normally, MX4 is a few degrees above Coollabs Ultra)...Non LM products such as MX4 are just better to fill the concave/convex space if there isn't a perfect fit, or flat surfaces on both the IHS and wager-block
Click to expand...

So should I do a straight edge check on the top of the IHS (I am guessing we are talking about the top)?

If I screwed up the internal application I would have seen an increase in temps or odd temps on certain cores right? They all went down and they all got closer just not a big difference at all.

Are these temps expected at this voltage? My water barely gets warm and I know what my tubes and rads feel like when they are really really hot. Also I am looking to the GPU temp as an indication of performance and the GPU temps are either the same or higher which to me if they are indeed higher then that would tell me more heat is getting from the CPU and into the water which is a good thing. The GPU temps are very low IMO GTX670 mid 50s when the CPU is running in place large FFTs and the GPU is being taxed by furmark. GPU is overvolted, overclocked, and over TDPd.

I have Indigo Xtreme... I wanted to make sure everything was good to go before using it... I am not planning on using the LM (thanks for explaining what that was) in between the IHS and the water block but should I give it a shot anyways? I am worried about it stripping the letters off the CPU.

Rotating the block is going to be hella hard work but if all else fails I will do it (require full drain and partial rebuild and different fittings).

The cooling system itself is what I would consider overkill and the temps do not change wether I am running 20% PWM on the PUMP or 100% and the the fans barely matter at all either... I could turn all but one of the 480 rad fans off and maybe 1 or 2 degrees of change with the GPU and CPU.

My goal here was to be able to run 4.5GHz without the CPU Motherboard sensor ever seeing 75c which is maybe 68-72c on the cores. At 75c the PWM signal goes from whatever it is set to (usually the lowest settings) to 100% instantly! Just for the heck of it when I had a 2500K I had all 4000RPM ~200CFM PWM fans but ran them at 20% (very quiet) I have had to remove them because of the annoyance while gaming of them going from 20 to 100 to 20 to 100 back and fourth. The Cooler Master Xcaliburs are not even that much better LOL at almost half the speed. If I can not solve this I am going to have to switch them all to blademasters as those are tolerable at 100% and only ~10-20% slower than xcaliburs. If you are wondering at my odd fan selection well I use what I can get for free or near free and also I have tons of all of those fans so not interested in purchasing any other.

The only good news from this de-lid is before I could not get the PWM to not do this in gaming even at 4.0GHz and at least now I have gotten it to stop doing it too much at 4.4GHz and 1.92v I do not know if I can go lower I am taking it down a few steps at a time.

If these temps sound "decent" or maybe "almost average" then I will be "happy" with my work. If not then I would like to see some change.

In games the GPU never goes above 45c so again my guess is the water isn't even getting that warm.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> It survived i ran 5 ghz on it for months @1.38v


Ah must be another chip. Thought the chip u sold me was a over locking turd lol.


----------



## HaunteR

Upgrading my i5 3570K to either i7 3770K or 4770K.

Hoping the 4770K has better thermal paste so I won't have to delid it; however if I do get the 3770K which paste do you recommend I delid?


----------



## Valgaur

Alright guys, so in about 5 hours I will be flying to Denver for a family emergency so please, please keep it clean in here.

Truly,
Valgaur


----------



## stickg1




----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> So should I do a straight edge check on the top of the IHS (I am guessing we are talking about the top)?
> In games the GPU never goes above 45c so again my guess is the water isn't even getting that warm.


OK bro - something must have gone wrong with the application.
Believe me, as I had similar problems.
I actually put TOO LITTLE CLU on the die, when I put a little more (2 layers) I saw my temps drop a lot.
I get no higher than 68-70c whilst folding for long period of time (ie 10 days straight of folding)
This is with an Antec 920.

With no load, I'm sitting at around 30c.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Alright guys, so in about 5 hours I will be flying to Denver for a family emergency so please, please keep it clean in here.
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur


shizzle dude - hope everything is ok


----------



## Hokies83

Got lilchronic's Extreme 4 and 3570k here.

Must admit it has a strange odor of burnt grass? i was very familiar with in my Teenage years


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> So should I do a straight edge check on the top of the IHS (I am guessing we are talking about the top)?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> If I screwed up the internal application I would have seen an increase in temps or odd temps on certain cores right? They all went down and they all got closer just not a big difference at all.
> 
> Are these temps expected at this voltage? My water barely gets warm and I know what my tubes and rads feel like when they are really really hot. Also I am looking to the GPU temp as an indication of performance and the GPU temps are either the same or higher which to me if they are indeed higher then that would tell me more heat is getting from the CPU and into the water which is a good thing. The GPU temps are very low IMO GTX670 mid 50s when the CPU is running in place large FFTs and the GPU is being taxed by furmark. GPU is overvolted, overclocked, and over TDPd.
> 
> I have Indigo Xtreme... I wanted to make sure everything was good to go before using it... I am not planning on using the LM (thanks for explaining what that was) in between the IHS and the water block but should I give it a shot anyways? I am worried about it stripping the letters off the CPU.
> 
> Rotating the block is going to be hella hard work but if all else fails I will do it (require full drain and partial rebuild and different fittings).
> 
> The cooling system itself is what I would consider overkill and the temps do not change wether I am running 20% PWM on the PUMP or 100% and the the fans barely matter at all either... I could turn all but one of the 480 rad fans off and maybe 1 or 2 degrees of change with the GPU and CPU.
> 
> My goal here was to be able to run 4.5GHz without the CPU Motherboard sensor ever seeing 75c which is maybe 68-72c on the cores. At 75c the PWM signal goes from whatever it is set to (usually the lowest settings) to 100% instantly! Just for the heck of it when I had a 2500K I had all 4000RPM ~200CFM PWM fans but ran them at 20% (very quiet) I have had to remove them because of the annoyance while gaming of them going from 20 to 100 to 20 to 100 back and fourth. The Cooler Master Xcaliburs are not even that much better LOL at almost half the speed. If I can not solve this I am going to have to switch them all to blademasters as those are tolerable at 100% and only ~10-20% slower than xcaliburs. If you are wondering at my odd fan selection well I use what I can get for free or near free and also I have tons of all of those fans so not interested in purchasing any other.
> 
> The only good news from this de-lid is before I could not get the PWM to not do this in gaming even at 4.0GHz and at least now I have gotten it to stop doing it too much at 4.4GHz and 1.92v I do not know if I can go lower I am taking it down a few steps at a time.
> 
> If these temps sound "decent" or maybe "almost average" then I will be "happy" with my work. If not then I would like to see some change.
> 
> In games the GPU never goes above 45c so again my guess is the water isn't even getting that warm
> 
> 
> .


Your temps seem high, but I don't see that your listed room temp. I am at 1.41v and 5.0 on a 3770k which are usually a little hotter than a 3570k and my 15min 8k Prime95 temps are 68, 71, 70, 66 in a 22.7c room. I just have a H220 with a couple more rads, so it is nothing extreme.

As TD already posted, you could have too little CLU on the die, I know I did that one time. A very thin staining of the underside of the IHS is fine, but on the die it should be a little more than that. If you can get some pressure paper that is best to check how your cooler and IHS meet up, but you can use an easy spreading TIM like AS5.

Put a drop of AS5 in the middle of the IHS then install your cooler, and test temps. Take the cooler off and take pictures of both the IHS and cooler. You can usually tell if there is a problem from the TIM fingerprint on both surfaces. If you redo the TIM on the die, you can take pics of that too. People here can tell if is too much of too little usually.

Checking the shape of your IHS is a very good idea. You can check it with a straight edge (like a good razor blade) and a flashlight. It is better though to check it when it is actually installed in the mobo since the locking mechanism changes the shape slightly.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HaunteR*
> 
> Upgrading my i5 3570K to either i7 3770K or 4770K.
> 
> Hoping the 4770K has better thermal paste so I won't have to delid it; however if I do get the 3770K which paste do you recommend I delid?


I don't see the point in going from a 3570k to 3770k with the 4770k around the corner. Just wait and see how it performs and whether it needs delidding or not. As far as TIM goes you need a liquid metal one on the die. Most here use CL Ultra or Pro.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Alright guys, so in about 5 hours I will be flying to Denver for a family emergency so please, please keep it clean in here.
> 
> Truly,
> Valgaur


Hope everything is ok.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Valgaur, hope you're fine man...good luck with whatever!


----------



## Valgaur

it's not actually, my other Grandfather passed away this morning, this stress is gonna kill me with finals.... first final is in 3 days. ugh


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Got lilchronic's Extreme 4 and 3570k here.
> 
> Must admit it has a strange odor of burnt grass? i was very familiar with in my Teenage years


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it's not actually, my other Grandfather passed away this morning, this stress is gonna kill me with finals.... first final is in 3 days. ugh


oh god








R.I.P.

PS.
Ask for an extension for your exams.
No one should do exams with that type of stress on their minds


----------



## Hokies83

1 of my grand parents died 4 months before i was born.

other when i was 3..

Another when i was 10

And the last one this past year.


----------



## givmedew

@justinanoldman

I do not have AS5

I could use the Gelied GC Extreme or the Antec Diamond that is what I have not including the small box full of cheaper crap TIMs.

Could the problem be that I used RTV to glue the die back on? I used the smallest amount I just kind of put a thin film on the corners with a glove. Nothing compared to what it had from the factory BUT I do understand that the IHS is now lower or closer to the chip now because the LM is so much thinner than the original TIM.

If I had a flat water block I would just direct mount the water block to the DIE LOL but I know for a fact my waterblock is convex the machinist did it on purpose.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> @justinanoldman
> 
> I do not have AS5
> 
> I could use the Gelied GC Extreme or the Antec Diamond that is what I have not including the small box full of cheaper crap TIMs.
> 
> Could the problem be that I used RTV to glue the die back on? I used the smallest amount I just kind of put a thin film on the corners with a glove. Nothing compared to what it had from the factory BUT I do understand that the IHS is now lower or closer to the chip now because the LM is so much thinner than the original TIM.
> 
> If I had a flat water block I would just direct mount the water block to the DIE LOL but I know for a fact my waterblock is convex the machinist did it on purpose.


Koolance 380i is convex with the jet plate pushing the center out. Still getting fantastic temps with direct die.

It's possible you put too much RTV on, but who can tell? Intel applies .3mm or less. You could try the IHS without the RTV and seeing if temps improve.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> @justinanoldman
> 
> I do not have AS5
> 
> I could use the Gelied GC Extreme or the Antec Diamond that is what I have not including the small box full of cheaper crap TIMs.
> 
> Could the problem be that I used RTV to glue the die back on? I used the smallest amount I just kind of put a thin film on the corners with a glove. Nothing compared to what it had from the factory BUT I do understand that the IHS is now lower or closer to the chip now because the LM is so much thinner than the original TIM.
> 
> If I had a flat water block I would just direct mount the water block to the DIE LOL but I know for a fact my waterblock is convex the machinist did it on purpose.


You don't need AS5, I was just suggesting that since it is so easy to use and clean up. Use whatever TIM you have where you can use a drop in the middle or a thin line, not something you spread. Then mount the cooler, test temps, take the cooler off and takes pics of both surfaces.

Your attempt to glue the IHS back to the pcb could definitely be the problem. Just my guess, but I would suggest undoing everything you did and start over. Undo the glue that you did then apply the CLU to the die and underside again, and take pics. Don't glue the IHS back on, since that is an unknown problem factor. Just use a finger to firmly press down on the IHS when you clamp it into the mobo.

The die is not that big, you can try direct to die if your mounting hardware allows, but it is not easy or without risk.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it's not actually, my other Grandfather passed away this morning, this stress is gonna kill me with finals.... first final is in 3 days. ugh


...my condolences on your loss...and a 'steady ledge' to guide you through your finals at this time of grief


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> So should I do a straight edge check on the top of the IHS (I am guessing we are talking about the top)?
> 
> If I screwed up the internal application I would have seen an increase in temps or odd temps on certain cores right? They all went down and they all got closer just not a big difference at all.
> ...
> 
> The only good news from this de-lid is before I could not get the PWM to not do this in gaming even at 4.0GHz and at least now I have gotten it to stop doing it too much at 4.4GHz and 1.92v I do not know if I can go lower I am taking it down a few steps at a time.
> 
> If these temps sound "decent" or maybe "almost average" then I will be "happy" with my work. If not then I would like to see some change.
> 
> In games the GPU never goes above 45c so again my guess is the water isn't even getting that warm.


...I am on the road w/my laptop so my responses are not that speedy right now...

1.) It really does sound like everything (incl. die-to-IHS) is ok but the IHS to water-block mount...some blocks can only be mounted one/two way(s) (check images of sample systems in Google re your block), but others can be rotated by 45 or 90 degrees - really just searching for the 'correct' fit between the concave IHS and convex block...I have a monster loop myself (over 13 feet of tubes, 2 pumps 3 rads etc) and I know that rotating stuff isn't easy...may be take a rad out of its fixed mount just to see if you can rotate without having to drain it on a temp basis.

2.) Not clear if I understood you correctly, but are you using 1.92v vCore for 4.4 GHz ? ...If so, I strongly recommend to bring that down to 1.5 or lower quickly

...from what you have described, everything seems to check out other than the IHS to water-block zone. I hope you find the problem


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> So should I do a straight edge check on the top of the IHS (I am guessing we are talking about the top)?
> 
> If I screwed up the internal application I would have seen an increase in temps or odd temps on certain cores right? They all went down and they all got closer just not a big difference at all.
> ...
> 
> The only good news from this de-lid is before I could not get the PWM to not do this in gaming even at 4.0GHz and at least now I have gotten it to stop doing it too much at 4.4GHz and 1.92v I do not know if I can go lower I am taking it down a few steps at a time.
> 
> If these temps sound "decent" or maybe "almost average" then I will be "happy" with my work. If not then I would like to see some change.
> 
> In games the GPU never goes above 45c so again my guess is the water isn't even getting that warm.
> 
> 
> 
> ...I am on the road w/my laptop so my responses are not that speedy right now...
> 
> 1.) It really does sound like everything (incl. die-to-IHS) is ok but the IHS to water-block mount...some blocks can only be mounted one/two way(s) (check images of sample systems in Google re your block), but others can be rotated by 45 or 90 degrees - really just searching for the 'correct' fit between the concave IHS and convex block...I have a monster loop myself (over 13 feet of tubes, 2 pumps 3 rads etc) and I know that rotating stuff isn't easy...may be take a rad out of its fixed mount just to see if you can rotate without having to drain it on a temp basis.
> 
> 2.) Not clear if I understood you correctly, but are you using 1.92v vCore for 4.4 GHz ? ...If so, I strongly recommend to bring that down to 1.5 or lower quickly
> 
> ...from what you have described, everything seems to check out other than the IHS to water-block zone. I hope you find the problem
Click to expand...

Thank you for your response... No I am using 1.192-1.200 sorry for the typo









This is my problem... I squeezed in a 480 rad, a 120 rad, the water block, the GPU water block and the pump all into a tiny area and did it with maybe 2 to 2.5FT of tubing... So there isn't going to be any moving of anything LOL!!! The CPU Block moves just enough to get it off the posts so I can remove the CPU







the fill line on the left is longer than all the actual loops tubes put together I think!



I will have to contact Martin from MartinsLiquidLab and see if he can advise me on weather or not the block is rotatable. If it is domed then I would expect it to be rotatable if it is more of an arch than I could understand if the block could only be inserted one way or a 180 degree rotation.

I also am worried that it is possible that the convex profile is designed more for a 3900 series processor... BUT!!! I am not big on low quantity production and one off items... I would not have bought this if it where not that I was buying it from Martin and he spoke highly of it.

I did my own comparisons of this block against my Swiftech HD, Swiftech Apogee XT Extreme, and my XSPC blocks and felt that this block performed as well or better AND that temps would not change at any PWM between 20 and 100 except that at 100 the temps would rise after a few hours from the heat dump. All those observations where on a ice cold 2500K

The problem with having something that not many people have is I have to do all the trial and error myself I can not learn from others mistakes









Plus I think I honestly prefer perfectly flat because then I can just lap the proc and be done with it. With this block if I lap the proc using flat glass as the lapping profile it would only make it worse.

So I am going to try to get some info on the convex profile and if you are correct I will just need to change out some fittings and cut some new hose!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Your system looks beautiful.
But yes resitting, re-doing is a huge part in de-lidding.
A little trial and error goes a long way here.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Thank you for your response... No I am using 1.192-1.200 sorry for the typo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my problem... I squeezed in a 480 rad, a 120 rad, the water block, the GPU water block and the pump all into a tiny area and did it with maybe 2 to 2.5FT of tubing... So there isn't going to be any moving of anything LOL!!! The CPU Block moves just enough to get it off the posts so I can remove the CPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the fill line on the left is longer than all the actual loops tubes put together I think!
> 
> 
> 
> I will have to contact Martin from MartinsLiquidLab and see if he can advise me on weather or not the block is rotatable. If it is domed then I would expect it to be rotatable if it is more of an arch than I could understand if the block could only be inserted one way or a 180 degree rotation.
> 
> I also am worried that it is possible that the convex profile is designed more for a 3900 series processor... BUT!!! I am not big on low quantity production and one off items... I would not have bought this if it where not that I was buying it from Martin and he spoke highly of it.
> 
> I did my own comparisons of this block against my Swiftech HD, Swiftech Apogee XT Extreme, and my XSPC blocks and felt that this block performed as well or better AND that temps would not change at any PWM between 20 and 100 except that at 100 the temps would rise after a few hours from the heat dump. All those observations where on a ice cold 2500K
> 
> The problem with having something that not many people have is I have to do all the trial and error myself I can not learn from others mistakes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Plus I think I honestly prefer perfectly flat because then I can just lap the proc and be done with it. With this block if I lap the proc using flat glass as the lapping profile it would only make it worse.
> 
> So I am going to try to get some info on the convex profile and if you are correct I will just need to change out some fittings and cut some new hose!


...until you can contact the supplier re. the fit between concave and convex shapes, I would suggest that you use MX4 'as a test' if you can...just use a little bit more than you normally would and then tighten down the w-block good...this is what I ended up doing with my 3970X after I double-confirmed that the block was in the correct position...the IHS on the 3970X was never removed (non-delidable) and I did not want to lap a $1k+ brand new processor...the MX4 'good helping' application (approx 110-115 % of the 'line+pea' method) filled all the spaces without starting to insulate it and thus block heat transfer...as I said, the only real test you can run right now without checking with the supplier or draining your w-c loop...hope it works out !!!


----------



## givmedew

Ok... well I contacted the next best thing to the designer which is the guy who the designer trusted the most to test it. MartinLiquidLabs but looking at Martin's site I saw this...



The block in that picture is my block as in literally the same unit just it was given to me with a black and a white spider and a black and a white center I chose to go with white and white.

As you can see it is faced in a different direction...

SOOOOOOOO

I am going to go a head and make this change unless I get an email back first saying that it is unnecessary.

I wanted to put my 4000RPM PWM fans back in and wanted to install some nice looking TFC XTender Shrouds I have laying around so I guess this is the excuse to do all that. I also wanted to seal up the gaps between fans, shrouds and rads with RTV so this will be a project for sure.

I am probably going to put it off for a few days because there are probably some other changes I want to make and I want to do it all at once... Last time I did this it took over 10HRs because I kept building and disassembling the set up till it was absolutely the best I layout I could get to work.

Thanks for the help and wish me luck!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Ok... well I contacted the next best thing to the designer which is the guy who the designer trusted the most to test it. MartinLiquidLabs but looking at Martin's site I saw this...
> 
> 
> 
> The block in that picture is my block as in literally the same unit just it was given to me with a black and a white spider and a black and a white center I chose to go with white and white.
> 
> As you can see it is faced in a different direction...
> 
> SOOOOOOOO
> 
> I am going to go a head and make this change unless I get an email back first saying that it is unnecessary.
> 
> I wanted to put my 4000RPM PWM fans back in and wanted to install some nice looking TFC XTender Shrouds I have laying around so I guess this is the excuse to do all that. I also wanted to seal up the gaps between fans, shrouds and rads with RTV so this will be a project for sure.
> 
> I am probably going to put it off for a few days because there are probably some other changes I want to make and I want to do it all at once... Last time I did this it took over 10HRs because I kept building and disassembling the set up till it was absolutely the best I layout I could get to work.
> 
> Thanks for the help and wish me luck!


...yup, in the 2nd pic the w-c block it is definitely rotated by 45 degrees / quarter turn. That makes all the difference with concave / convex shapes...and if all else fails, lapping BOTH the IHS and the w-c block will also get you there...as a last resort.

...good to take your time with w-c custom loops...I didn't on my first custom loop and ended up redoing it







...now I have gone mad and built one which is siamesing two ROG systems (one loop) and without any case...ahh, the space...







I can exchange the w-c blocks between the two (3770K, 3970X) in less than 10 min without draining the system...in other words: Be careful that you don't get the 'going mad' bug as you build up what looks like a very nice system in your pic









Good Luck !


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Ok... well I contacted the next best thing to the designer which is the guy who the designer trusted the most to test it. MartinLiquidLabs but looking at Martin's site I saw this...
> 
> 
> 
> The block in that picture is my block as in literally the same unit just it was given to me with a black and a white spider and a black and a white center I chose to go with white and white.
> 
> As you can see it is faced in a different direction...
> 
> SOOOOOOOO
> 
> I am going to go a head and make this change unless I get an email back first saying that it is unnecessary.
> 
> I wanted to put my 4000RPM PWM fans back in and wanted to install some nice looking TFC XTender Shrouds I have laying around so I guess this is the excuse to do all that. I also wanted to seal up the gaps between fans, shrouds and rads with RTV so this will be a project for sure.
> 
> I am probably going to put it off for a few days because there are probably some other changes I want to make and I want to do it all at once... Last time I did this it took over 10HRs because I kept building and disassembling the set up till it was absolutely the best I layout I could get to work.
> 
> Thanks for the help and wish me luck!
> 
> 
> 
> ...yup, in the 2nd pic the w-c block it is definitely rotated by 45 degrees / quarter turn. That makes all the difference with concave / convex shapes...and if all else fails, lapping BOTH the IHS and the w-c block will also get you there...as a last resort.
> 
> ...good to take your time with w-c custom loops...I didn't on my first custom loop and ended up redoing it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...now I have gone mad and built one which is siamesing two ROG systems (one loop) and without any case...ahh, the space...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can exchange the w-c blocks between the two (3770K, 3970X) in less than 10 min without draining the system...in other words: Be careful that you don't get the 'going mad' bug as you build up what looks like a very nice system in your pic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good Luck !
Click to expand...

Going mad bug?

I started water cooling my own rigs march last year with the XSPC Rasa 750 240 (best brand for kits to get someone into watercooling). Since then I have built so many rigs for myself it is silly. When I got my Intel I traded my 3.9GHz x6 960T and sabertooth that was water cooled for a Rampage III Extreme w/ full board block and 920 and built that into a super quiet water cooling rig in a lian lan case for my wife.

Then I bought the Obsidian 800D and it was OVER... I even have a Mo-Ra 3 9x120 sitting on the shelf just taunting me like USE ME I DARE YOU!!!










I love it... it's a hobby!


----------



## FtW 420

Sounds like Joa3d43's warning came too late.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Going mad bug?
> 
> I started water cooling my own rigs march last year with the XSPC Rasa 750 240 (best brand for kits to get someone into watercooling). Since then I have built so many rigs for myself it is silly. When I got my Intel I traded my 3.9GHz x6 960T and sabertooth that was water cooled for a Rampage III Extreme w/ full board block and 920 and built that into a super quiet water cooling rig in a lian lan case for my wife.
> 
> Then I bought the Obsidian 800D and it was OVER... I even have a Mo-Ra 3 9x120 sitting on the shelf just taunting me like USE ME I DARE YOU!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love it... it's a hobby!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sounds like Joa3d43's warning came too late.


...Yup, too late, he's a goner - note the Mo-Ra's *talking* to him







...mind you 'WaterCooler' in his avatar is also a strong hint re the susceptibility to the 'going mad' water cooling bug









...water cooling is fantastic fun


----------



## chronicfx

So I just changed out my tubing from the xspc clear to primochill advanced LRT in uv brilliant blue. Looks nice and I will post some pics when I hook my phone up to the computer. I did my leak testing with my gpu's removed and had the system apart only overnight with everything else the same except possibly the top gpu being the bottom gpu now possibly. But now when I open bioshock infinite I am getting a weird error message. I tried starting it about 15 times so far and I get it everytime after the loading screen when the game should supposedly start. I have reinstalled the graphics drivers for the cards and the same thing. Should I re-install the game? Can anyone make head or tails of this message or point me to what forum to post it? thanks.


----------



## chronicfx

Here are some pics but don't forget to help me with my bioshock problem













I am thinking about changing the LED's in the Raystorm to orange to have the blue tubing going into the orange block. I think it may look better like that.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> So I just changed out my tubing from the xspc clear to primochill advanced LRT in uv brilliant blue. Looks nice and I will post some pics when I hook my phone up to the computer. I did my leak testing with my gpu's removed and had the system apart only overnight with everything else the same except possibly the top gpu being the bottom gpu now possibly. But now when I open bioshock infinite I am getting a weird error message. I tried starting it about 15 times so far and I get it everytime after the loading screen when the game should supposedly start. I have reinstalled the graphics drivers for the cards and the same thing. Should I re-install the game? Can anyone make head or tails of this message or point me to what forum to post it? thanks.


Went back a save and it works.. Must have had a corrupt save file.

Edit: nevermind.. when I go back to the place it errored again.. must be the game. I am reinstalling now.


----------



## givmedew

Ok, so I have not spun that sink around yet... I am still playing around a little bit... NOW something kind of crazy is going on right now.

I decided to just LET IT RIP!!!

See what I could really get out of the CPU which I had not done yet.

First I reset windows completely because I was have some issues with something else but anyways.... after re-installing everything

I set my bus to 101 and my multi 48 and it boots with a vcore of 1.32 I lower the multi 47 and run OCCT and so far no problems and my temps are fluctuating between 57 and 67 depending on the core... The 2nd core is still the hottest of them all.

So what gives!

No the room temp did not drop LOL!

These are good temps for that voltage right?

How high of a voltage can I go if I am the cautious type who can not afford a new processor







and how high should I let the temps get?

When all is said and done I will still be trying to keep the temps under 75C motherboard CPU sensor while gaming just because of the fan issues but right now I want to see what my proc can do.


----------



## Swag

@*givmedew*

Good luck!

@*everyone*

I have some money for another keyboard, what do you guys think of me buying a K60 if I like MX Blue switches.


----------



## givmedew

I love that motherboard... Personally I needed a motherboard that had a detatched number pad or no number pad at all because of the tightness on my keyboard tray so I did not get that







I instead got the strike5 which I don't really recommend because there is like a $60 or 70 keyboard with MX switches that has no numberpad but does still have the arrows and what goes above the arrows... unfortunately the strike5 has the arrows on the part of the keyboard with the numpad... So I have to reach off to the side to use the arrows which drives me crazy!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> I love that motherboard... Personally I needed a motherboard that had a detatched number pad or no number pad at all because of the tightness on my keyboard tray so I did not get that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I instead got the strike5 which I don't really recommend because there is like a $60 or 70 keyboard with MX switches that has no numberpad but does still have the arrows and what goes above the arrows... unfortunately the strike5 has the arrows on the part of the keyboard with the numpad... So I have to reach off to the side to use the arrows which drives me crazy!


Lol, I was reading it and I was like, what motherboard has a detached number pad.







I would have recommended a Ducky or Filco.

I already have a Ducky and Filco blue switch and brown switch, I really wanted to try reds but I'm not sure because I may not be able to return it.


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> I love that motherboard... Personally I needed a motherboard that had a detatched number pad or no number pad at all because of the tightness on my keyboard tray so I did not get that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I instead got the strike5 which I don't really recommend because there is like a $60 or 70 keyboard with MX switches that has no numberpad but does still have the arrows and what goes above the arrows... unfortunately the strike5 has the arrows on the part of the keyboard with the numpad... So I have to reach off to the side to use the arrows which drives me crazy!
> 
> 
> 
> Lol, I was reading it and I was like, what motherboard has a detached number pad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would have recommended a Ducky or Filco.
> 
> I already have a Ducky and Filco blue switch and brown switch, I really wanted to try reds but I'm not sure because I may not be able to return it.
Click to expand...

You have those boards in a short version?

If so maybe PM me...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> I love that motherboard... Personally I needed a motherboard that had a detatched number pad or no number pad at all because of the tightness on my keyboard tray so I did not get that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I instead got the strike5 which I don't really recommend because there is like a $60 or 70 keyboard with MX switches that has no numberpad but does still have the arrows and what goes above the arrows... unfortunately the strike5 has the arrows on the part of the keyboard with the numpad... So I have to reach off to the side to use the arrows which drives me crazy!
> 
> 
> 
> Lol, I was reading it and I was like, what motherboard has a detached number pad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would have recommended a Ducky or Filco.
> 
> I already have a Ducky and Filco blue switch and brown switch, I really wanted to try reds but I'm not sure because I may not be able to return it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You have those boards in a short version?
> 
> If so maybe PM me...
Click to expand...

All my boards except my BW Ultimate is a TKL. I don't have any of those small-factor keyboards where there aren't any of those 6 keys above the arrow keys. I don't remember the specific term for that type of keyboard. But yea, all my keyboards are TKL.

I made this post a while back when I bought my Ducky TKL Blues (OCN Version):
http://www.overclock.net/t/1288812/ducky-ocn-tkl-keyboard/0_50


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @*givmedew*
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> @*everyone*
> 
> I have some money for another keyboard, what do you guys think of me buying a K60 if I like MX Blue switches.


I would be tempted to get the Razer Ultimate gaming keyboard if you like blue switches.

If you want browns...then you know I'm going to suggest you to nab a deal on the g710+ at like $100


----------



## Hokies83

LoL found camara here is some pics of ghetto build " work in progress "







When im done ima post a pic of it in the Cosmos 2 club lol.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

that is pretty ghetto.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> LoL found camara here is some pics of ghetto build " work in progress "
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When im done ima post a pic of it in the Cosmos 2 club lol.


It needs some duct/electrical tape and way more random zipties or better yet velcro.


----------



## Hokies83

electrical tape will go over all the multi colored wire.. cause i cannot stand multi colored wires...


----------



## MainStageNews

I see alot of people that use no IHS TIM often get the best results. Do they do this by using this with their EK waterblock? Also what is the best TIM for the dye? Alot of people using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro so im guessing its the best







Just to be clear this stuff right? Thanks


----------



## ivanlabrie

Coollaboratory liquid ultra or pro are best on the die....ihs to waterblock/cooler is less important.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> I see alot of people that use no IHS TIM often get the best results. Do they do this by using this with their EK waterblock? Also what is the best TIM for the dye? Alot of people using Coollaboratory Liquid Pro so im guessing its the best
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just to be clear this stuff right? Thanks


I'm just using CL*U* with my direct die setup. I wouldn't recommend going TIM-less unless you have a known-flat waterblock, and I think nearly all incl. EK and Koolance are convex.

Here's the temps just idling at 5.1:



17C is my water temperature.


----------



## MainStageNews

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Coollaboratory liquid ultra or pro are best on the die....ihs to waterblock/cooler is less important.


Fom my understanding I wouldnt have to have the IHS on at all if I use this with my EK Supremacy Universal Nickel. Also is the pro and Ultra both compaitable with that waterblock? I noticed its not compaitable with some metals but I dont think it should pose a problem.


----------



## plu2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Fom my understanding I wouldnt have to have the IHS on at all if I use this with my EK Supremacy Universal Nickel. Also is the pro and Ultra both compaitable with that waterblock? I noticed its not compaitable with some metals but I dont think it should pose a problem.


You will need the naked Ivy precisemount kit for your Supremacy block if you want to go naked Ivy.
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Fom my understanding I wouldnt have to have the IHS on at all if I use this with my EK Supremacy Universal Nickel. Also is the pro and Ultra both compaitable with that waterblock? I noticed its not compaitable with some metals but I dont think it should pose a problem.


If you use that kit and block you don't need an IHS, you just put the Ultra or Pro on the die and a very thin layer on the block if you want. Ultra is a little easier to work with imo, but either work with nickel and copper, you just can't use them on aluminum.


----------



## Zeek

Holy crap I've missed a lot of post


----------



## MainStageNews

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> If you use that kit and block you don't need an IHS, you just put the Ultra or Pro on the die and a very thin layer on the block if you want. Ultra is a little easier to work with imo, but either work with nickel and copper, you just can't use them on aluminum.


Alright thanks. I was just scared that the Ultra wouldnt agree with nickel. Also may I ask why you need a layer on the water block itself? I would think if you just put it on the die you wouldnt need it on the block....


----------



## plu2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Alright thanks. I was just scared that the Ultra wouldnt agree with nickel. Also may I ask why you need a layer on the water block itself? I would think if you just put it on the die you wouldnt need it on the block....


I didn't use any CLU on the block. Only a tiny layer on the die.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Alright thanks. I was just scared that the Ultra wouldnt agree with nickel. Also may I ask why you need a layer on the water block itself? I would think if you just put it on the die you wouldnt need it on the block....


It is not a matter of need, more personal preference and how much you apply. It took me more than a few tries to get the right amount of Ultra on the die and IHS. You can end up using too much or too little, usually you have to test to come up with the amount that works best for your particular setup. The instructions from CL Ultra manual states "You can apply the Liquid Ultra on one or both surfaces, but the whole applied amount should not be too big."
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/

Some people put enough on the die and don't do the cooler, I like to do the die then with what is left on the brush do a very thin layer or staining of the underside of the IHS (if you use one). Since I use Ultra everywhere, I apply a reasonably small amount on the die and top of the IHS, then just a very thin layer on the bottom of the IHS and the cooler.


----------



## Hokies83

The ghetto rig is Alive yo!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Good to have you back G and yo crew (pc)


----------



## Hokies83

LoL that is my 4th system total i have....

i5 750 + 7790

i5 3570k + 2x 7850s

i7 2600k + gtx 570 Sli

i7 3770k 3x 7950 + 1x 7790


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The ghetto rig is Alive yo!


looks good


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> looks good


LoL not bad if i say so myself





Now to posdt my Cosmos 2 side door window mod in the cosmos 2 club


----------



## ivanlabrie

Why the xfire man?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Why the xfire man?


Why not? 2 is always better then one.. Most of allwhen the 2 are only 240$.. and out perform a 7970 / gtx 680 for half the price...


----------



## ivanlabrie

you know you don't need that cable...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you know you don't need that cable...


wireless? haha


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you know you don't need that cable...


LoL oh but i have it so why not...


----------



## ivanlabrie

I don't use em...only for gaming once I get a second 7950.


----------



## Valgaur

Well im back for a bit, might make a full list of parts for the build to keep me preoccupied. Wonder how much this thing really will be.... quad 7950s and blocks and everything else.

Ooh hey anybody know how to use copper tubing instead of plastic tubing for wc loops or know anyone on here who has? I believe bobo 808 has


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well im back for a bit, might make a full list of parts for the build to keep me preoccupied. Wonder how much this thing really will be.... quad 7950s and blocks and everything else.
> 
> Ooh hey anybody know how to use copper tubing instead of plastic tubing for wc loops or know anyone on here who has? I believe bobo 808 has


...welcome back...a couple of guys in the RIVE thread have used copper tubes...also bit-tech.net / modding and other sites have whole exposees...in addition:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1358365/copper-tubing#post_19240999

http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showthread.php?t=1071421


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well im back for a bit, might make a full list of parts for the build to keep me preoccupied. Wonder how much this thing really will be.... quad 7950s and blocks and everything else.
> 
> Ooh hey anybody know how to use copper tubing instead of plastic tubing for wc loops or know anyone on here who has? I believe bobo 808 has


Ah basement plumbing aye?

see my Cosmos 2 window mod yo


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...welcome back...a couple of guys in the RIVE thread have used copper tubes...also bit-tech.net / modding and other sites have whole exposees...in addition:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1358365/copper-tubing#post_19240999
> 
> http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showthread.php?t=1071421


thanks man i'll take a look through there! not back fully just got some time until the funeral and such since it was way out of the blue.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ah basement plumbing aye?
> 
> see my Cosmos 2 window mod yo


lol I like the control panel on top the best


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> thanks man i'll take a look through there! not back fully just got some time until the funeral and such since it was way out of the blue


...I found what I was looking for earlier...

OCN's 'deafboy' has a big build-log on a system w/copper pipes here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1290854/build-log-the-ultimate-cooling-machine-bmw-inspired-tj07

...and then there is rather famous mod (steam-punk)...'you want copper pipes...we got copper pipes'

http://www.bit-tech.net/modding/2012/12/23/mod-of-the-year-2012/17 , per pic below


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well im back for a bit, might make a full list of parts for the build to keep me preoccupied. Wonder how much this thing really will be.... quad 7950s and blocks and everything else.
> 
> Ooh hey anybody know how to use copper tubing instead of plastic tubing for wc loops or know anyone on here who has? I believe bobo 808 has


welcome back dude.
My guess for the build would be over $5k


----------



## dr/owned

So played with my gpu overclock again tonight. Previously 1225/3200 core/clock was all I could do. Either the chilled rad or new driver let me do 1250/3600 with Heaven and Furmark stability (and no artifacts that I could see). 20% over a stock 680? "but my Ghz edition..." *no*









Max GPU temp of 50C. Memory 35C. VRM 45C


----------



## ivanlabrie

You got lightnings? You should be doing 1500mhz core by now with wc man


----------



## MainStageNews

Does anyone know any like dirt cheap processors that I could parctice delliding on? Maybe used, just anything that is glued not soldered.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Does anyone know any like dirt cheap processors that I could parctice delliding on? Maybe used, just anything that is glued not soldered.


Straight from the OP








Quote:


> Here is a list of CPU's that should be able to be delidded and some are very cheap so great for saving your chips.
> 
> IHS Not Soldered To Die
> 
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> 
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)
> 
> Dual Cores
> 
> -AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
> -Celeron Dual Core E1200
> -Celeron Dual Core E1400
> -Pentium Dual Core E2140
> -Pentium Dual Core E2160
> -Pentium Dual Core E2180
> -Pentium Dual Core E2200
> -Pentium Dual Core E2210
> -Pentium Dual Core E2220
> -Pentium Dual Core E6300
> -Core 2 Duo E4300
> -Core 2 Duo E4400
> -Core 2 Duo E4500
> -Core 2 Duo E4600
> -Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E7200
> -Core 2 Duo E7300
> -Core 2 Duo E7400
> -Core 2 Duo E7500
> -Core 2 Duo E7600


----------



## MainStageNews

Here is a lot of 6 Pentium 4 HT's should I get them to practice?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Here is a lot of 6 Pentium 4 HT's should I get them to practice?


Do the vise block of wood and hammer method and u do not need to practice









Video is in the Op.


----------



## MainStageNews

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Do the vise block of wood and hammer method and u do not need to practice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Video is in the Op.


Thats what I was planning on doing. But would you really not need practice? Is it really not failure prone at all as long as I dont launch the CPU or at least pad the area im hitting towards incase I do launch it a little.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Here is a lot of 6 Pentium 4 HT's should I get them to practice?


They're no good









There's a better list in this thread which tells you ones at aren't soldered and the ones that are. Make sure the model is exact though, for example the 775 Celeron D is soldered, but the 775 Celeron isn't


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> welcome back dude.
> My guess for the build would be over $5k


yeah I was doing some stuff and fell asleep doing it but I'm figuring around 5k with the wc stuff without the waterblocks I
m going to get the asus triple slot 7950's and get the io shield converters to 2 and their blocks are nice. not sure if i wanna wc the RAM as the RAM for good speed are like 4-500 for 32 gigs at 2133







darn dominators......

but the copper tubing and wood isn't even in the prices yet







so this is gonna be some serious spending is what I've gotta say really. about 3 g for hardware and such.


----------



## Splinter007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Do the vise block of wood and hammer method and u do not need to practice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Video is in the Op.


I did this method and it worked on the first try. You should definitely use it if you're hesitant.


----------



## I_shot

hi guys,

is there any information haswell cpu ihs's gonna be TIMed or soldered ?


----------



## MainStageNews

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> They're no good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's a better list in this thread which tells you ones at aren't soldered and the ones that are. Make sure the model is exact though, for example the 775 Celeron D is soldered, but the 775 Celeron isn't


Here is one with a 478 socket. It should be compaitable lookin at the chart. Also do you think I even should practice since I will do the razorless method?


----------



## Hokies83

Im not a fan of copper tubing looks like my basement / back of toilet or under the sink to me...


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Here is one with a 478 socket. It should be compaitable lookin at the chart. Also do you think I even should practice since I will do the razorless method?


If you don't want to practice then go straight ahead and delid, it's a pretty fool proof method if you take your time, be careful and use common sense. Make sure you have the right tools for the job before you begin thoughand I'd prepare the for chip flying backwards from the vice too, which is how 1 chip got killed.

If I had a CPU around to practice delidding on before doing my i5 then of course I would have, but I didn't and I wasn't going to buy one specially for that purpose. There's not a whole lot to tell you if you've failed or not using the vice method though, you will only see damage if you mess up big time and end up with a chunk out of the die or PCB.

Also if you do want to practice you need to make sure you get an A or B core P4, not a C core.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Im not a fan of copper tubing looks like my basement / back of toilet or under the sink to me...


I think it'll look good with the wood color. but I'm trying to find other types there was some other kind which was silver in color. but was crazy exspensive


----------



## luciddreamer124

Quick question for you guys. I've had my 3770k delidded for awhile, and I just recently purchased the EK direct die mount for the EK supremacy. How much of a temp drop can I hope to see out of mounting the waterblock directly to the die? Also, I'm using liquid pro, will it have a soldering effect onto the waterblock over time?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Quick question for you guys. I've had my 3770k delidded for awhile, and I just recently purchased the EK direct die mount for the EK supremacy. How much of a temp drop can I hope to see out of mounting the waterblock directly to the die? Also, I'm using liquid pro, will it have a soldering effect onto the waterblock over time?


I am hoping you can do some good tests and tell us how much of temp drop you get. I have heard people say from just a few degrees difference to upwards of 8c. I think it depends on your chip, the oc, and your cooling.

Ultra or Pro will not harden on the die, but they will leave a stain on your water block. With elbow grease and metal polish you will be able to remove it though, no need for lapping or anything extreme.


----------



## luciddreamer124

Cool thanks. I'll let you guys know what the difference is


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Quick question for you guys. I've had my 3770k delidded for awhile, and I just recently purchased the EK direct die mount for the EK supremacy. How much of a temp drop can I hope to see out of mounting the waterblock directly to the die? Also, I'm using liquid pro, will it have a soldering effect onto the waterblock over time?


I went straight to direct die, so I don't have a comparison, but I can tell you that my temperature is great. Direct die is an improvement over IHS in 3 ways. First, you remove the thickness of the IHS which improves heat transfer. Second, you only have a single TIM layer between the die and waterblock as opposed to another layer between the IHS and waterblock. Third, you're mating 2 mirror finish surfaces (die and waterblock) and get all the benefits of lapping without doing anything.

The only disadvantage to direct die is that a really convex waterblock will be bad, whereas the IHS can flex to conform.


----------



## ChaosAD

I used to need 1.26v for 4.6Ghz and 1.32v for 4.7. I updated bios to 1707 just to see that my vcore is not enough and i get whea errors. I downgraded to 1408 and i need a constant 0.02v more for every stable oc i previously had (1.28v for 4.6Ghz and 1.34 for 4,7Ghz). Degradation maybe? I m folding 24/7 but temps never exceed 55c at 4.7Ghz.


----------



## dr/owned

20mV isn't really a smoking gun. I've heard of constant folding degrading cpu's, but 1.32V isn't that much higher than nominal.


----------



## stickg1

Naw copper tubing is boss. I like the idea Valguar.


----------



## Valgaur

setting up the build log today, I'll post the link in here later. thinking Pandora's Box for the name


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *I_shot*
> 
> hi guys,
> 
> is there any information haswell cpu ihs's gonna be TIMed or soldered ?


From what I've seen & heard so far, TIM. Still tri gate transistors in Haswell & they did not like solder with ivy.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> setting up the build log today, I'll post the link in here later. thinking Pandora's Box for the name


Just don't open Pandora's Box like you did with Franky...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> From what I've seen & heard so far, TIM. Still tri gate transistors in Haswell & they did not like solder with ivy.
> Just don't open Pandora's Box like you did with Franky...


somebody got the joke


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Naw copper tubing is boss. I like the idea Valguar.


The toilet plumbing boss.



Stuff is just tacky reminds me of somebody who would paint there house neon green with bright yellow trim.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The toilet plumbing boss.
> 
> 
> 
> Stuff is just tacky reminds me of somebody who would paint there house neon green with bright yellow trim.


That's $80 at the scrap yard, man I haven't seen copper used like that since the 50's and 60's....


----------



## FtW 420

Just see today there is a new Ice Storm Extreme bench in the latest version of 3dmark, Joa3d43 saw it earlier & has been building on his trophy collection



Linked the 1.1 version download in here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1389319/ice-storm-extreme/0_50

4 global world records for Joa3d43 (nice!), the bar has been set, let the benching begin!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The toilet plumbing boss.
> 
> 
> 
> Stuff is just tacky reminds me of somebody who would paint there house neon green with bright yellow trim.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1212455/mkg-cosmos-ii-case-mod


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1212455/mkg-cosmos-ii-case-mod


The orange i can accept the copper pipe is just tacky would have looked a million times better with orange tubing.


----------



## FtW 420

The copper can look good, just has to be done right & may not be as easy to work on the rig after finishing. I do like the flexible tubing that ivan linked somewhere as well, like the way they do the hoses on high perf. engines.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The orange i can accept the copper pipe is just tacky would have looked a million times better with orange tubing.


these would be the only other pipping id accept


----------



## stickg1

Copper is sweet. I like it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just see today there is a new Ice Storm Extreme bench in the latest version of 3dmark, Joa3d43 saw it earlier & has been building on his trophy collection
> 
> 
> 
> Linked the 1.1 version download in here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1389319/ice-storm-extreme/0_50
> 
> 4 global world records for Joa3d43 (nice!), the bar has been set, let the benching begin!


A big THANKS to FtW







who has helped me a lot over the past few months to get there ...just firing up the delidded IVY now ...it hasn't run this stuff for a few days, and some of its specialties are hotly contested


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Copper is sweet. I like it.


I like copper as well. I'm getting good copper and not the older super tough copper piping.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I like copper as well. I'm getting good copper and not the older super tough copper piping.


Make sure u put a toilet flush knob somewhere on yer build.

Ive seen the fittings they use.. the flow / safety just does not compare to being able to use 1/2 3/4 tubing with a bits power comp fitting...

Just to put toilet pipes in ur pc...
Might as well use the cheap plastic pvcp that whatchamacall it sells.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Copper is sweet. I like it.


me too...like this:



or this










but this went a little too far:


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## ivanlabrie

Cu<3

lol

I'd do a full diamond rig...yeah, diamond. Dat bling!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cu<3
> 
> lol
> 
> I'd do a full diamond rig...yeah, diamond. Dat bling!


I've been siphoning money out of Hokies digital wallet. I wish he would get it together and put some more digital money in there, I'm real close to quad CF-X with 2 7990's...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I've been siphoning money out of Hokies digital wallet. I wish he would get it together and put some more digital money in there, I'm real close to quad CF-X with 2 7990's...


Im Loaded baby







soon to Snag a 7870 Myst ed..









Then allmystsems pci-e slots are full XD i will then look into another g1 sniper 3 lol. find one used for 200$ offer 170$ bring it home so unbeatable for that price.

Then ill get 2 7850s and 2 7870 myst ed running on that comp...

Then everything will go towards Haswell soon as a MB is ready for me for it..


----------



## stickg1

Damn I wish I knew you were in the market for one. My buddy in MA linked a G1 Sniper 3 on his local CL for $100. I almost had him buy it for me for the hell of it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Damn I wish I knew you were in the market for one. My buddy in MA linked a G1 Sniper 3 on his local CL for $100. I almost had him buy it for me for the hell of it.


ill do 120$ shipped right now lol

You sure it was not a g1 sniper m3?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> ill do 120$ shipped right now lol
> 
> You sure it was not a g1 sniper m3?


Yeah he had pics of it. I'll pm him and see if its still around.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah he had pics of it. I'll pm him and see if its still around.


Yah im soon to have 12 HD 7000 series cards... feel like FtW now XD


----------



## Valgaur

Hokies I refuse to put those horrible 90° in there. I will hand bend them all with the 90°in them just gotta do it right is all









Put i may have found copper tubing with a silver overlay which makes it look veeeeeery good.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Just see today there is a new Ice Storm Extreme bench in the latest version of 3dmark, Joa3d43 saw it earlier & has been building on his trophy collection
> 
> 
> 
> Linked the 1.1 version download in here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1389319/ice-storm-extreme/0_50
> 
> 4 global world records for Joa3d43 (nice!), the bar has been set, let the benching begin!


*...copper, silver and gold...setting the* _siamese twins_ *up for record performance; testing and tips*

...just finished a week or so of trying out my new (and still somewhat incomplete) 'Siamese Twins' system by competing for some world records in both Hardware class and also outright open classes (...anything goes)...

...A very BIG thanks to FtW who has been helping me with setup info...thanks also to others here at 'delid' who contributed useful info... I compete for the OCN team in global competitions, but 'delid' is where I picked up a lot of useful info...In turn, I describe some of the ways I build and set up the systems which have proven to be both reliable and very fast- hopefully, others will be able to pick up some tricks of the trade just as I did from folks here.



*The Performance numbers*









7 outright world records, 34 gold cups in hardware class (including single GPU, SLI, Tri-SLI and Quad-SLI)...so meet the Siamese twins behind these numbers...



*For hardware...*

1.) Asus Maximus V Extreme with a delidded 3770K at speeds well > 5 GHz ([email protected] 5GHz = 1.271)
2.) Asus Rampage IV Extreme with a 'standard'3970X at speeds of well > 5 GHz ([email protected] 1.346)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler - Hardware



There are up to 5 vid cards (4x Asus GTX 670, 1x Gigabyte GTX 670) between the two machines, all of the GPUs being air-cooled.

The two CPUs share a common ('siamesed') water cooling system that includes a total of 3 rads / over 900 mm by 60 mm, two MPC 655 pumps and 16x 120 mm Noctua / In-Win fans, 2x 140 / 30mm 3w server 3k rpm fans, and a couple of 200 mm CoolerMaster fans. Water-blocks are a Koolance 370i for the Ivy and an EK Supremacy for the Sandy-E. A tip most of you likely already know: Install separate fans to cool the two VRM areas per mobo...

This shared w-c loop has more than 13 feet of PrimoChill Advanced LRT 1/2 - 3/4 in tubes (9 pieces), and two reservoirs, all topped up by EK fluids....bottom line: You can never have enough cooling, especially as the weather is getting warmer, you game for hours or compete in global benching ! The 'siamese twin' loop has proven more than enough to withstand both system running at full tilt, which comes out to more than 600 watts.

The twins are also connected and can control each other (ie speed, voltages etc) via the special ROG-Connect link and also share several hard drives via an internal network.



*Setup - part 1*

...these are *daily-grind machines*...the only thing different for world record runs are the separate boot drives (SSDs) I use with relatively 'clean and small' Windows 7 / 64 installs on them...As this is part of a bigger "deskputer" build that will also include Haswell / Ivy-E down the line, this is 'free form' as in no case...eventually, all this will be part of a custom acrylic and metal 'thing' : -) ...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



The Ivy was delidded back in early February using the razor method (w/blood and all  )...I took the assembly apart several more times as the IHS was very concave...recently, I lapped both the inside and outside of the IHS, starting w/600 grid paper and finishing off w/2000 grid paper...I know I got it right because on several occasions, the 4 cores show *IDENTICAL temps at idle*, usually at or just 1 C above ambient...

...the Ivy die and IHS top both have a thin layer of *Coollaboratory 'Ultra'* on it...combined with the other changes of a strong custom loop per above, temps at 5 GHz as a standard measurement dropped by over 35 C compared to the 'pre-delid' days w/MX4 on the IHS...and more compared to the fresh 'out-of-the-box' days...back then my first step was to add a Thermaltake Water 2.0 Extreme closed-loop...which I found to be a very strong performer *up to* about 4.9 GHz...then MX4 replaced MX 2,leading to a further drop of about 4 C back then in the pre-delid days. I prefer MX 4 when I can not use liquid metals such as Coollaboratory ultra for whatever reason.

The 3970X Sandy-E had an even more concave IHS...I tried Coollaboratory Ultra, but while temps were 'ok' I knew that there was much more possible if I could deal with the hollow space created by the concavity of the IHS / convexity of the block...I substituted a good helping of MX4 (line-and-pea method at '115%') and that dropped temps of the 3970X by over 20 C...

...eventually, I might go back and lap both the IHS and the water block of the 3970X...speaking of which, I have found that with regular nickel coated copper (which obviously would be taken off by lapping), Coollaboratory Ultra left no marks that couldn't be cleaned up just with Isopropanol, and even the writing of the laser-edged CPU markings by Intel stayed intact - though the caveat is that the longest I had Coollaboratory Ultra 'undisturbed' on an IHS / block was just under two months.



*Setup - part 2*


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



There are plenty of good guides for IVY and Sandy-E for Asus, ASRock, Gigabyte et al on this and other sites...For basic setup of Asus boards in OC, I start with ROG.Asus.com and then look at other guides - many of which seem to be quite similar and relating back to 'Sin0822's ' original guide.

The one area where I differ from most regular guides relates to speeds above 5 GHz...there, you have to watch both the frequency and setting of CPU and DRAM *phases* - I use 'extreme' instead of 'optimal above 5 GHz and different frequencies from the 'standard guides'.

The same holds for running fast memory (ie above DDR2 2400) and/or BCLK above 101.5. I plan to put together a full 'high performance setup' guide in the upcoming build-log of the Siamese Twins which I'll post as a separate thread - and am in the process of recruiting some OC 'cool hands'









....since I also head a software firm that builds its own commercial units that run global clients serving literally tens of millions of users, 'high performance' guides will be tempered with 'reliability' factors....no sense going fast if it only lasts for a block









While I have other machines that are set up using 'the traditional BIOS method' with / without offset, the two record breaking machines here actually use 2 modules of the Asus AI Suite II extensively...the *Turbo-V* for CPU multi, BCLK and all related voltages, and *FanExpert-II* to control fan speeds...put differently, the base BIOS settings are set in the BIOS, but for 4.7 GHz, with Intel SpeedStep and C sleep states all on...this is a bit unusual according to some, but not others - besides, per record summary, it 'works for me'.

The main advantage I see is that I can use the basic setup for various daily grind tasks and even gaming...but with a few mouse clicks go past 5.2 GHz without stressing the CPUs more than they have to be I(because 5+ GHz on a CPU rated for 3.5/4 GHz is stressful, no matter what) ... I have used AI Suite II extensively now for system control for s.th. like 8 months and really like it (the latest version that is, the earlier ones were a bit 'off')...noting also that since *digital controls now govern CPU, DRAM and VRMs on the mob*o, the difference between a straight 'old school' BIOS setup and a more modern approach via Asus AI Suite is much less than folks think...

...a BIOS is also software (just low-level machine language), and the latest BIOS and their windows-based control software counterparts talk to each other anyways...so using one really is not unlike using the other. In the end, Asus AI Suite II for CPU multi, BCLK and related voltage control is just VERY convenient and helps *dial in a system much quicker*....though if you do not plan to run all out but are just looking for a sustainable 24/7 speed for video-intensive applications, the more permanent BIOS method might suit you better....on all other machines in my immediate environment where speed does not change, I use the traditional BIOS method.

Finally, while Asus AI Suite II certainly has become a great tool, I strongly advise against using 'CPU level up' as that will not give you the max overclock and also change parameters unbeknownst to you...there is no substitute for the trial and error method to find the max speed / vCore et al other than through trial, error and a lot of testing.

...and if you reach the limits and start to crash a lot / get BSODs, also make sure to reboot once with a full Win7 load WITHOUT trying any further overclocking, then boot down again before restarting the system for more follies...repeated crashes without a clean Win7 're-load' cycle can lead to other problems.



*Setup - part 3*


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



I used my standard method to dial in both the delidded 3770K and the 3970X. That coonsist of:

1.) ...setting VCCSA (and VTTw/a) to as close to 1.15 as possible...as I use between 16GB and 32GB of TridentX 2400 MHz, this step is important re. evaluation of the IMC...I add that in C2 stepping of the Sandy-E (unlike C1), it really is not recommended to have VCCSA or VTT at more than 1.2v...even though the mobo BIOS set it automatically at over 1.37v !

2.) Run CineBench 11.5...either pick a CPU speed and find out the minimum vCore the CPU will pass 3 runs in a row (which is very stressful on the CPU, btw), or put a hard cap on vCore (ie 1.484v) and find the multiplier or multi / BCLK combo 3 runs of Cinebench 11.5 pass at....

3.) Once I have a basic 'table' of voltages for select speeds and such, I turn to 4.7GHz, 4.9GHz, 5GHz (50x100), 5.1 GHz (50x102.0) and 5.2GHz for fine-tuning and stress testing...for that I use *SuperPi, Intel's XTU, and Aida64 Extreme*...whatever 'min' settings pass that with 32GB of 2400MHz ram (up to 2448MHz) at XMP 'plus' extra tight timings I shared before in this thread become my base settings for each speed.

4.) The first two steps work great and very quickly with Asus AI Suite II., 'finding the range' that I use for the basis of BIOS changes - set up for 4.7 GHz 'as the base' I then use to operate from in WIn 7 re other speeds



*What's next...*

..first, I actually want to finish this 'siamese' build re the '*looks department*'...I did as much benching as I could before taking a break now as the weather is getting very much warmer here...the nightly 'lows' have risen by almost 10 C...once that is finished, I'll return to more competitive benching re some 3D but also some memory and HD tests...

...then the big decision will be if I go to 'Extreme Cooling'...I already compete against that anyways per above record summary...and at least the Ivy is ready for it, once I replace the TIM with the appropriate materials...don't know if / when I will go 'extreme', but it seems like the logical next step...stay tuned !


----------



## Hokies83

Bits power 90s are not restrictive and look sexy.... there curved not a sharp 90.

Then again silver will not look like toilet plumping... but also not safe enough for me to use with the fittings u gotta use for those things i do not trust it at all.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bits power 90s are not restrictive and look sexy.... there curved not a sharp 90.
> 
> Then again silver will not look like toilet plumping... but also not safe enough for me to use with the fittings u gotta use for those things i do not trust it at all.


they will be slow curved not really sharp


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> they will be slow curved not really sharp


I pray for ur sake they do not leak id say there are twice as likely to vs real tubing and highend bits power fittings.


----------



## Arm3nian

Ivy-e in September... Must have... hope this is true


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I pray for ur sake they do not leak id say there are twice as likely to vs real tubing and highend bits power fittings.


you have to use plug fittings where the more pressure the tighter the hold on them so yeah... and waterproof....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Nice writeup Joa, and congrats on them cups mate









I think the OCN Marksman pot will suit your needs well...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Nice writeup Joa, and congrats on them cups mate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think the OCN Marksman pot will suit your needs well...


...thanks IvanL - also for your memory timing tips, they sure came in handy ! ...can't believe that many of the records, including single card are still alive...at one point in time, I was up to 10 global cups and then all the pro's started to run their LN2 stuff on the new 3D Mark...for a brief (that would be very, very brief) moment, I was leading KingPin - then reality set in







- but most of it actually survived the first day


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

Hows it going gents? So I have actually delid two 3770ks. The first one wasnt the greatest performer but the second one I had some pretty amazing results. I wasnt aware of this club at the time so I really didnt have all the information required for membership but I figure Ill post what I got and hope for the best. Also when I reinstalled the CPU I swapped out the motherboard. I went from a Asrock extreme4-M to a Asus maximus v gene and I also lapped the IHS.

Pre-delid on the extreme4-M I was running 50x at 1.432v after about 10-15 minutes I would experience some thermal throttling.
After the delid/lap and on the M5G I used all the exact same setting and ran the test for 15 minutes and the highest core went to 66C but averaged around mid 50s.

OCN name: UPGR4Y3DD
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: N/A
Temp drops: ~50C!
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bits power 90s are not restrictive and look sexy.... there curved not a sharp 90.
> 
> Then again silver will not look like toilet plumping... but also not safe enough for me to use with the fittings u gotta use for those things i do not trust it at all.


What conventional water pipe fittings? They can handle 200psi of water for 30 years no problem. Probably even longer than that but I haven't been around long enough to say for sure. But fittings that a plumber would use with copper tubing are waterproof if done correctly.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UPGR4Y3DD*
> 
> Hows it going gents? So I have actually delid two 3770ks. The first one wasnt the greatest performer but the second one I had some pretty amazing results. I wasnt aware of this club at the time so I really didnt have all the information required for membership but I figure Ill post what I got and hope for the best. Also when I reinstalled the CPU I swapped out the motherboard. I went from a Asrock extreme4-M to a Asus maximus v gene and I also lapped the IHS.
> 
> Pre-delid on the extreme4-M I was running 50x at 1.432v after about 10-15 minutes I would experience some thermal throttling.
> After the delid/lap and on the M5G I used all the exact same setting and ran the test for 15 minutes and the highest core went to 66C but averaged around mid 50s.
> 
> OCN name: UPGR4Y3DD
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: N/A
> Temp drops: ~50C!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


congratz







!


----------



## Annihilator83

Think I got a "not so good" overclocker, after delidding I can only get 4.5 GHz at 1.29 Volts stable, havent managed to get 4.6 GHZ stable yet regardless of the voltages. To be fair I did only try to 1.36 v so there is still headroom. I m running a custom waterloop just for the CPU, and my core temps never get above 50 degrees through normal usage, i ve seen it get to 60 but that was using Prime. Before delidding and using a waterloop i was getting around 80 degrees. Just shows how bad the thermal paste was on the original chip. now using liquid ultra on the die, and some PK 1 on the cpublock.

Idle: 19 - 24 degrees
Average usage temps 50 degrees hottest core


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Annihilator83*
> 
> Think I got a "not so good" overclocker, after delidding I can only get 4.5 GHz at 1.29 Volts stable, havent managed to get 4.6 GHZ stable yet regardless of the voltages. To be fair I did only try to 1.36 v so there is still headroom. I m running a custom waterloop just for the CPU, and my core temps never get above 50 degrees through normal usage, i ve seen it get to 60 but that was using Prime. Before delidding and using a waterloop i was getting around 80 degrees. Just shows how bad the thermal paste was on the original chip. now using liquid ultra on the die, and some PK 1 on the cpublock.
> 
> Idle: 19 - 24 degrees
> Average usage temps 50 degrees hottest core


good temps man.
As for your chip - yeah not the best cip - I would say mediocre to bad type chip.
Mine is at 1.27v at 4.5ghz


----------



## flv1333

The delid was a bit nerve racking. I wish that "no razor" method would have been posted... I would have loved to try that on your chip!







lol


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> What conventional water pipe fittings? They can handle 200psi of water for 30 years no problem. Probably even longer than that but I haven't been around long enough to say for sure. But fittings that a plumber would use with copper tubing are waterproof if done correctly.


Fittings for pc not the same.


----------



## stickg1

1/4" threaded on all your blocks, rads, etc. are common, not just in PC watercooling. They make alot of those fittings and you could pick them up at a local supplier.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> 1/4" threaded on all your blocks, rads, etc. are common, not just in PC watercooling. They make alot of those fittings and you could pick them up at a local supplier.


There not what you use on a pc. Leak leak leak

they rely on Teflon tape instead of gaskets.. pure fail imo really when the heating and contracting and pressure goes up. wil not be long before ppl that used toilet plumbing in a pc are reporting ruined hardware..

I did plumbing on swimming pools for 5 years and the pipes with threads / teflon always fail before ones with gaskets.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Fittings for pc not the same.


http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-metal-tubing/=mnvcl9

the 3/8th's diameter OD

then these fittings

http://www.aquatuning.co.uk/product_info.php/info/p6607_10mm-G1-4-plug-fitting----black-nickel.html

just making sure on the sizings at the moment


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UPGR4Y3DD*
> 
> Hows it going gents? So I have actually delid two 3770ks. The first one wasnt the greatest performer but the second one I had some pretty amazing results. I wasnt aware of this club at the time so I really didnt have all the information required for membership but I figure Ill post what I got and hope for the best. Also when I reinstalled the CPU I swapped out the motherboard. I went from a Asrock extreme4-M to a Asus maximus v gene and I also lapped the IHS.
> 
> Pre-delid on the extreme4-M I was running 50x at 1.432v after about 10-15 minutes I would experience some thermal throttling.
> After the delid/lap and on the M5G I used all the exact same setting and ran the test for 15 minutes and the highest core went to 66C but averaged around mid 50s.
> 
> OCN name: UPGR4Y3DD
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: N/A
> Temp drops: ~50C!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Hate to do this to you but can you do me a favor? wanna copy paste that into a PM for me? I cant access my google drive from where im at and I'll add you later this week once I get back to my rig.

Otherwise! You are in! slap your new sig on, very impressive temp drops! did you switch cooling units as well?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-metal-tubing/=mnvcl9
> 
> the 3/8th's diameter OD
> 
> then these fittings
> 
> http://www.aquatuning.co.uk/product_info.php/info/p6607_10mm-G1-4-plug-fitting----black-nickel.html
> 
> just making sure on the sizings at the moment


I see where the copper tube slides into the fitting a leak hazard.

You have to much stuff going on to do toilet plumbing to many places to risk losing your hardware..

If your dead set on toilet plumbing then atleast do this...

Only use the toilet plumbing where u can see it and use real tubing where u cannot atleast this will cut the risk factor down with out any side effects to the toilet plumbing look.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I see where the copper tube slides into the fitting a leak hazard.
> 
> You have to much stuff going on to do toilet plumbing to many places to risk losing your hardware..
> 
> If your dead set on toilet plumbing then atleast do this...
> 
> Only use the toilet plumbing where u can see it and use real tubing where u cannot atleast this will cut the risk factor down with out any side effects to the toilet plumbing look.


my case size is 2*2*3 2 wide 2 deep and 3 tall (maybe) I see normal tubing just laying there and not being suspended and looking nice is all.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> my case size is 2*2*3 2 wide 2 deep and 3 tall (maybe) I see normal tubing just laying there and not being suspended and looking nice is all.


You will find out.....

your gonna say for like the 100th dammit i should have listened to Hokies.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> You will find out.....
> 
> your gonna say for like the 100th dammit i should have listened to Hokies.


lol I'm still pot shoting but the copper pipping would look nice, if not I'm somewhat redesigning the build a little bit and leaning towards 4 480 rads instead of 5 to make it a bit cleaner. if I did normal tubing though... what color.... hmmmm red? i think red is overused these days...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> lol I'm still pot shoting but the copper pipping would look nice, if not I'm somewhat redesigning the build a little bit and leaning towards 4 480 rads instead of 5 to make it a bit cleaner. if I did normal tubing though... what color.... hmmmm red? i think red is overused these days...


if u want a custom color look get clear and use dye.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> if u want a custom color look get clear and use dye.


thats what I was originally going for.... shoot might even go for a white color in the tubing.... ugh... the choices man....


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> 1/4" threaded on all your blocks, rads, etc. are common, not just in PC watercooling. They make alot of those fittings and you could pick them up at a local supplier.


can you believe fergie is leaving







?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hate to do this to you but can you do me a favor? wanna copy paste that into a PM for me? I cant access my google drive from where im at and I'll add you later this week once I get back to my rig.
> 
> Otherwise! You are in! slap your new sig on, very impressive temp drops! did you switch cooling units as well?


I'll send you that PM just in case


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-metal-tubing/=mnvcl9
> 
> the 3/8th's diameter OD
> 
> then these fittings
> 
> http://www.aquatuning.co.uk/product_info.php/info/p6607_10mm-G1-4-plug-fitting----black-nickel.html
> 
> just making sure on the sizings at the moment


...sounds like it's shaping up to be a real interesting build...one thing just to keep in mind is to also check the compatibility re corrosion etc when using different types of metals, as well as 'bacterial / algae' qualities, ie use of a strip of silver in a reservoir ...copper, nickel and stainless steel are usually pretty good, but not sure if your proposed build will include aluminum anywhere on the 'inside'


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds like it's shaping up to be a real interesting build...one thing just to keep in mind is to also check the compatibility re corrosion etc when using different types of metals, as well as 'bacterial / algae' qualities, ie use of a strip of silver in a reservoir ...copper, nickel and stainless steel are usually pretty good, but not sure if your proposed build will include aluminum anywhere on the 'inside'


Nope no aluminum.... just copper and such not sure I really want 4 gpus anymore... I think 3 would still look amazing as 4 gpus and the materials is right on 6 grand lol. Told mom about that and she wasn't so happy.....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nope no aluminum.... just copper and such not sure I really want 4 gpus anymore... I think 3 would still look amazing as 4 gpus and the materials is right on 6 grand lol. Told mom about that and she wasn't so happy.....


...quite apart from 'mom' / $ issues, 4 GPUs can be a bit of a pain...not only re cooling (I think you plan to w-c-yours)...cable salad is at its worst with 4...gaming and about half of the vid bench scores go down and MOST importantly, the extra watt usage can start to interfere with top-speed CPU and/or other GPU settings as it pushes you towards the limits of most PSUs, once efficiency losses and other overhead usage is taken into account.

...3 GPUs is my 'luxury favorite' and quite manageable, two GPUs is probably the sweet-spot


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...quite apart from 'mom' / $ issues, 4 GPUs can be a bit of a pain...not only re cooling (I think you plan to w-c-yours)...cable salad is at its worst with 4...gaming and about half of the vid bench scores go down and MOST importantly, the extra watt usage can start to interfere with top-speed CPU and/or other GPU settings as it pushes you towards the limits of most PSUs, once efficiency losses and other overhead usage is taken into account.
> 
> ...3 GPUs is my 'luxury favorite' and quite manageable, two GPUs is probably the sweet-spot


im gonna sit with 4 7950's and fulfill the actual build, just need to find what 7950's fit the actual 7950 block on frozencpu.....


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...quite apart from 'mom' / $ issues, 4 GPUs can be a bit of a pain...not only re cooling (I think you plan to w-c-yours)...cable salad is at its worst with 4...gaming and about half of the vid bench scores go down and MOST importantly, the extra watt usage can start to interfere with top-speed CPU and/or other GPU settings as it pushes you towards the limits of most PSUs, once efficiency losses and other overhead usage is taken into account.
> 
> ...3 GPUs is my 'luxury favorite' and quite manageable, two GPUs is probably the sweet-spot


Val is planning a dual purpose rig, the multi gpu can game & benchas well, but the 7950s will be folding most of the time & more is better there.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Val is planning a dual purpose rig, the multi gpu can game & benchas well, but the 7950s will be folding most of the time & more is better there.


...ahh, that makes sense...I keep forgetting about 'folding', if I would remember it, I would get a guilty conscious about my laundry


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Val is planning a dual purpose rig, the multi gpu can game & benchas well, but the 7950s will be folding most of the time & more is better there.


just deciding on fans and wood now really....


----------



## ivanlabrie

World Community Grid is cool too!


----------



## givmedew

I just delidded my proc not too long ago and am wondering.....

Is it normal for the temperature not to change much when increasing the voltage? Going from [email protected] to [email protected] net no measurable difference in temperature.

Sits around hi 60s barely ever gets there but peaks into mid high 70s

its 75c in the room right now.

On my 960T, i7-920, i5-2500k and everything else I have OC'd every bit of voltage has made a noticeable difference in temps.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> I just delidded my proc not too long ago and am wondering.....
> 
> Is it normal for the temperature not to change much when increasing the voltage? Going from [email protected] to [email protected] net no measurable difference in temperature.
> 
> Sits around hi 60s barely ever gets there but peaks into mid high 70s
> 
> its 75c in the room right now.
> 
> On my 960T, i7-920, i5-2500k and everything else I have OC'd every bit of voltage has made a noticeable difference in temps.


"...its 75c in the room right now." ???


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> I just delidded my proc not too long ago and am wondering.....
> 
> Is it normal for the temperature not to change much when increasing the voltage? Going from [email protected] to [email protected] net no measurable difference in temperature.
> 
> Sits around hi 60s barely ever gets there but peaks into mid high 70s
> 
> its 75c in the room right now.
> 
> On my 960T, i7-920, i5-2500k and everything else I have OC'd every bit of voltage has made a noticeable difference in temps.


75C in your room!? dang man....









but yes the temps can barely change sometimes every chip is different.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> I just delidded my proc not too long ago and am wondering.....
> 
> Is it normal for the temperature not to change much when increasing the voltage? Going from [email protected] to [email protected] net no measurable difference in temperature.
> 
> Sits around hi 60s barely ever gets there but peaks into mid high 70s
> 
> its 75c in the room right now.
> 
> On my 960T, i7-920, i5-2500k and everything else I have OC'd every bit of voltage has made a noticeable difference in temps.


You looking at your 4 core temps? Try a few different programs, core temp, real temp, and HWmonitor. I don't see any way you can go from 4.5 and 1.2v to 4.7 and 1.38v without a large temp increase.


----------



## givmedew

75F in the room LOL

Sorry not my fault America uses stupid measuring systems.

Anyways yeh I am using core temp and real temp and we are talking about my hottest core.


----------



## MainStageNews

Is a credit card the safest/best way to get the glue off of the die?


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

There really shouldn't be a need to remove the glue from the die. If you mean the silicon from the PCB then yes use a plastic type card.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Is a credit card the safest/best way to get the glue off of the die?


for the black glue on the pcb then yes a well used debit/credit card


----------



## Hokies83

Getting glue off is the hardest part XD


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Getting glue off is the hardest part XD


Well...and the fact you put a razor to your CPU lol.
Yesterday had a fun chat with some friends of friends - who heard "I review tech".
Conversation went towards PC's at the end and we all laughed about: "Yes you can't say you like tech/hardware when you just built your PC"
My reply was: "haha I agree...BUT have you guys de-lidded?"
They asked me "what's that?"
Me: "that's when you put a razor blade in-between the PCB and the IHS of your CPU"
They look at me: "dayyymeee"

hahaha
Geek kudos points right there.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well...and the fact you put a razor to your CPU lol.
> Yesterday had a fun chat with some friends of friends - who heard "I review tech".
> Conversation went towards PC's at the end and we all laughed about: "Yes you can't say you like tech/hardware when you just built your PC"
> My reply was: "haha I agree...BUT have you guys de-lidded?"
> They asked me "what's that?"
> Me: "that's when you put a razor blade in-between the PCB and the IHS of your CPU"
> They look at me: "dayyymeee"
> 
> hahaha
> Geek kudos points right there.


Dude Fergie retired? Who is gonna replace him???

Val go full on baller and get some wormed chestnut, the most baller wood there is!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Dude Fergie retired? Who is gonna replace him???
> 
> Val go full on baller and get some wormed chestnut, the most baller wood there is!


NO idea man


----------



## ivanlabrie

Who's gonna replace her? lol
I'm from Argentina and I know absolutely nothing about football (soccer is a such stupid name xD)


----------



## FtW 420

Would not be easily replaced...

Soccer & football are very different games though.


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hate to do this to you but can you do me a favor? wanna copy paste that into a PM for me? I cant access my google drive from where im at and I'll add you later this week once I get back to my rig.
> 
> Otherwise! You are in! slap your new sig on, very impressive temp drops! did you switch cooling units as well?


Awesome! Thanks, I just PMed you that info. No, I didnt change anything besides the delid and lap. I may have gotten better contact between the IHS and water block though. Also I sanded the crap out of the IHS. Sanded it down until the bevels on the corners were gone. Figured id give that much more surface area I guess.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Would not be easily replaced...
> 
> Soccer & football are very different games though.


Some interesting facts: http://www.todayifoundout.com/index.php/2010/06/the-origin-of-the-word-soccer/

Football is the sport these guys are talking about, not what Americans call football...for me at least.
Like the metric system, I just can't relate to other terms.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Dude Fergie retired? Who is gonna replace him???
> 
> Val go full on baller and get some wormed chestnut, the most baller wood there is!


how much is that a foot?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UPGR4Y3DD*
> 
> Awesome! Thanks, I just PMed you that info. No, I didnt change anything besides the delid and lap. I may have gotten better contact between the IHS and water block though. Also I sanded the crap out of the IHS. Sanded it down until the bevels on the corners were gone. Figured id give that much more surface area I guess.


holy crap... no wonder why i bet what happened is you sanded so much copper off is that the heat moves even faster.... i bet thats what happened.


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

That's what I was hoping!


----------



## stickg1

It's hard to find. It mostly comes reclaimed from old barns and cabins. Typically like $6 per board foot in a 3"-5" board. It's not that bad in price really, it's just hard to get your hands on and when someone gets a bunch it's usually gone really fast. Wormy Chestnut is one of my favorites. Walnut is nice too but I think for the rich colors especially something that would look good with copper is a nice oak, perhaps red oak, or some maple. Your close to Canada, you might be able to get some maple easily. Buy extra drill bits, its majorly dense and burns up bits and blades fast.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's hard to find. It mostly comes reclaimed from old barns and cabins. Typically like $6 per board foot in a 3"-5" board. It's not that bad in price really, it's just hard to get your hands on and when someone gets a bunch it's usually gone really fast. Wormy Chestnut is one of my favorites. Walnut is nice too but I think for the rich colors especially something that would look good with copper is a nice oak, perhaps red oak, or some maple. Your close to Canada, you might be able to get some maple easily. Buy extra drill bits, its majorly dense and burns up bits and blades fast.


Im thinking either a red oak or dark stained oak as I love oak or a nice cedar stained well. My dad is a master stainer he knows his stuff when staining and we have bits galore along with blades. Finally found the fittings I've been trying to find for a while now, good holdings and looks and no leaks from what I've heard and nice to remove for a cpu swap once you empty the loop







....oh I will need a drain....hmmmm wonder where I will put that at....


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys! the new build Log is up and in my sig so go clicky and read what I got planned for you all


----------



## lagittaja

Not going to join but I'll just post my results from delidding my 3770K. The cpu is 1.160v 4.3Ghz (checked underload with multimeter to be 1.155v)
Going from average temperature across all cores I got a -15.75*C drop. Good enough for me. Put Liquid Pro between the die and IHS. CPU cooler is Thermalright True Spirit with a GT 1850rpm and between cooler/cpu I have MX-2. Case fans are Scythe Slip Stream PWM and a top exhaust X-Silent 140mm. I had all the fans blasting at max (1800, 1300, 1300, 900 ish rpm) for comparable results. Ambient temperature was around 23-24*C on both occasions.



Before cleaning it


----------



## illuz

Nice one mate, what method did you use? Hammer or razor?


----------



## lagittaja

Razor

Sent from my GNote

E: Did some testing. 4.5Ghz is stable at 1.190v (1.186v multimeter)
After some quick 'n' dirty testing 4.8Ghz seemed to be stable somewhere between 1.3-1.35v.
I also tried to get to 5.0Ghz and 1.38-1.40v seems to be the area my chip would work at. I would need to get better cooling for that lol.
I'll probably go for the NH-U14S

E2: Might as well enter, is this below good for entry?

OCN name: lagittaja
CPU: 3770K HT ON
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: MX-2
Mhz gained: 700Mhz
OC after delid: 4.5Ghz/1.190v (1.186v multimeter), AVX IBT/6144MB
Temp drops: -15.75*C on average @4.3Ghz/1.160v (1.155v multimeter)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2798644 Nowhere near stable and can go with lower volts after tuning but right now I have better things to do.


----------



## Joa3d43

*...to Haswell or not to Haswell, that is the question..*








...the plot thickens as new 'real' Hawswell production samples (rather than engineering samples) hit the wild and are bench-marked...Haswell is supposed to be deliddable...per below and other tid-bits of info floating around, the 'stock' numbers between a 3770K Ivy and a 4770K Haswell don't look that different (though some memory bench marks clearly favour Haswell)...BUT, apaprently, Haswell will be a much better over-clocker on a vCore / MHz basis...we'll soon find out...









pic source cpu-world.com


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I might be getting a gaming laptop to review with Haswell in it.
If I do....well...you know I'll post the results







!


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...to Haswell or not to Haswell, that is the question..*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...the plot thickens as new 'real' Hawswell production samples (rather than engineering samples) hit the wild and are bench-marked...Haswell is supposed to be deliddable...per below and other tid-bits of info floating around, the 'stock' numbers between a 3770K Ivy and a 4770K Haswell don't look that different (though some memory bench marks clearly favour Haswell)...BUT, apaprently, Haswell will be a much better over-clocker on a vCore / MHz basis...we'll soon find out...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pic source cpu-world.com


Either i am reading wrong, or it looks like the haswell is not even much of an improvement.....


----------



## lagittaja

And since when was cpu performance to be increased with Haswell when Intel is clearly focusing on lower power/power management and iGPU


----------



## Hokies83

Yup waiting for broadwell.. ddr4 goodness....


----------



## ivanlabrie

Probably a problem with an early bios...I doubt it'll perform worse in any bench.
Same thing happened with Ivy vs SB.


----------



## lilchronic

i got my wc loop done











just need to get rid of this h100 now


----------



## lagittaja

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Yup waiting for broadwell.. ddr4 goodness....


I'm more interested in Skylake








Should be worthy enough upgrade over my 3770K+Z68 combo. Since what I've read, IVB->Hwell will be a similar upgrade as SVB->IVB was. And if Hwell -> Bwell would again be similar boost, then I'd reckon IVB->Skylake will be worthier than IVB->Bwell would be.
But just speculating. If you're into iGPU or perhaps folding then I'd guess the upgrade to Bwell from IVB would be worthy if Bwell is going to really have DDR4 support.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i got my wc loop done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just need to get rid of this h100 now


Very nice!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lagittaja*
> 
> Razor
> 
> Sent from my GNote
> 
> E: Did some testing. 4.5Ghz is stable at 1.190v (1.186v multimeter)
> After some quick 'n' dirty testing 4.8Ghz seemed to be stable somewhere between 1.3-1.35v.
> I also tried to get to 5.0Ghz and 1.38-1.40v seems to be the area my chip would work at. I would need to get better cooling for that lol.
> I'll probably go for the NH-U14S
> 
> E2: Might as well enter, is this below good for entry?
> 
> OCN name: lagittaja
> CPU: 3770K HT ON
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: MX-2
> Mhz gained: 700Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz/1.190v (1.186v multimeter), AVX IBT/6144MB
> Temp drops: -15.75*C on average @4.3Ghz/1.160v (1.155v multimeter)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2798644 Nowhere near stable and can go with lower volts after tuning but right now I have better things to do.


NO!

just kidding I'm in a pretty bumbed mood after the funeral this morning so can you PM me your information? as I am not near my rig and cant add you right now but feel free to put the sig on


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I might be getting a gaming laptop to review with Haswell in it.
> If I do....well...you know I'll post the results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


"...post the results"...no NDA ? I know a couple of guys who're testing Z87 mobos / Haswells, but they are all sworn too secrecy...same here re DDR 3 3000...don't get yourself a vacation in the 'London Tower'


----------



## FtW 420

That is true, don't want it to be the last review by posting screens & results too early.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> "...post the results"...no NDA ? I know a couple of guys who're testing Z87 mobos / Haswells, but they are all sworn too secrecy...same here re DDR 3 3000...don't get yourself a vacation in the 'London Tower'


oh no - well if I do get the opportunity to review them - it will be once they are announced, and released.
So I won't be able to give you guys early benches lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i got my wc loop done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just need to get rid of this h100 now


...that does look *very nice* and colour-coordinated - and inspiring, too







I have a similar / identical case waiting for the assembly of a Sabertooth Z77 / 3770 (non-K, VT-D)...once I finish the current projects...btw, what are you replacing the H100 with ?


----------



## stickg1

T-Dubb, we might lose Rooney but pick up Cronaldo? WTH is going on across the pond...?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...that does look *very nice* and colour-coordinated - and inspiring, too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a similar / identical case waiting for the assembly of a Sabertooth Z77 / 3770 (non-K, VT-D)...once I finish the current projects...btw, what are you replacing the H100 with ?


you do like your "....." I have realised! lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> T-Dubb, we might lose Rooney but pick up Cronaldo? WTH is going on across the pond...?


I highly doubt we will get CR7 or Falcao. Those were speculations that people were saying.
I doubt any big acquisitions will be made by United over the summer, although there was a lot of strong reports suggesting they already put down a 65m down payment on falcao.
Rooney doesn't get enough ball time as it stands. I wouldn't be surprised if he leaves, but I think that's him wanting to leave and getting more ball time, rather than the club wanting him to go or them not already paying him enough.

Also Moyes is the new boss:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22453802

He did great for Everton, and can see him doing great for United.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> you do like your "....." I have realised! lol.


...well, I just don't seem to hate it as much as others







- though perhaps tellingly, it did not make it into the Siamese Twins build...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...well, I just don't seem to hate it as much as others
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - though perhaps tellingly, it did not make it into the Siamese Twins build...


I don't actually hate the board underneath, just not feeling the thermal armor part. Rip that off & it's OK, but then there was no point in getting the sabertooth.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I don't actually hate the board underneath, just not feeling the thermal armor part. Rip that off & it's OK, but then there was no point in getting the sabertooth.


...wasn't necessarily thinking of you (there are even bigger Sabertooth haters out there...many of them... that board is either loved or hated like no other, oddly







) ...though underneath all that ""pretty"" armour is a VRM and DRAM lane design that is 'related' to ROG MVG's implementation...when I ran my 3770K in it, it would do 5.2 giggles easy for longer periods, limited only by the CPU cooling I was using then...but I DO prefer the MV-E by a mile for a whole host of good reasons


----------



## ivanlabrie

It lacks some bios features...and it's overpriced that's all.
For instance I believe it has no vccsa and only has vccio and vccsa auto tied to it in some ratio thingie (correct me if I'm wrong though)

Man, this pentium 4 is so bad for 3dm01 lol
Got the 7950 up and running btw.








Does 1200/1700 with 1.225 and 1.625 respectively...The cpu is killing its performance though. Other than that HIS makes fine gpus.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...that does look *very nice* and colour-coordinated - and inspiring, too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a similar / identical case waiting for the assembly of a Sabertooth Z77 / 3770 (non-K, VT-D)...once I finish the current projects...btw, what are you replacing the H100 with ?


i replaed it with ek waterblock and swirtech 240 rad

i had to use black tubing to connect the gpu's the white tubing kinked to much looks ugly








i want to get these blocks
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/fc-geforce/geforce-gtx-6x0-series/ek-fc680-gtx-acetal.html


----------



## ivanlabrie

It looks great man, congrats!


----------



## Hokies83

Meh cheapest place to buy CL liquid ultra now?

Anybody want a 7850 ?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i replaed it with ek waterblock and swirtech 240 rad
> 
> i had to use black tubing to connect the gpu's the white tubing kinked to much looks ugly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i want to get these blocks
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/fc-geforce/geforce-gtx-6x0-series/ek-fc680-gtx-acetal.html


I like EK's blocks - just in case, there is also 'Heatkiller' which make specific 670 applications http://www.frozencpu.com/brands/brand/b180/Heatkiller.html

...black tubing is fine with your black-and-white theme


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It lacks some bios features...and it's overpriced that's all.
> For instance I believe it has no vccsa and only has vccio and vccsa auto tied to it in some ratio thingie (correct me if I'm wrong though)
> 
> Man, this pentium 4 is so bad for 3dm01 lol
> Got the 7950 up and running btw.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does 1200/1700 with 1.225 and 1.625 respectively...The cpu is killing its performance though. Other than that HIS makes fine gpus.


...will check on the VCCSA 'Q" when I reassemble it...took it offline as I needed to steal its PSU as the AX1200 is not enough







for the 3970X past 5.1 GHz w/4 oc'ed GPUs...will be running the AX1200 and a TX850 together via male / female 24 pin...the Sabertooth will have to do with a 650...

...I can't believe you're running a Pentium 4...though I remember the good old days when I had it 'new' and ran Aquamark...the other day I ran Aquamark on the Ivy and 3970X...I thought there was s.th. wrong it was over so fast...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...will check on the VCCSA 'Q" when I reassemble it...took it offline as I needed to steal its PSU as the AX1200 is not enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> for the 3970X past 5.1 GHz w/4 oc'ed GPUs...will be running the AX1200 and a TX850 together via male / female 24 pin...the Sabertooth will have to do with a 650...
> 
> ...I can't believe you're running a Pentium 4...though I remember the good old days when I had it 'new' and ran Aquamark...the other day I ran Aquamark on the Ivy and 3970X...I thought there was s.th. wrong it was over so fast...


I'm folding my behind off with it. I'll be repairing the MVG either tomorrow or by Monday, and expect to have it ready for next week with some luck. Bad thing is I'm getting charged for the repairs. :/


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm folding my behind off with it. I'll be repairing the MVG either tomorrow or by Monday, and expect to have it ready for next week with some luck. Bad thing is I'm getting charged for the repairs. :/


...hope you get your *MV-G* back soon,without costing you an arm and a leg...I had a close call with my *MV-E* about two weeks ago when I first assembled the 'twin's ' loop...I am always very careful with Coollaboratory products as it is conductive and capacitive liquid metal, yet when I was getting ready to apply some CL-U on the Ivy's IHS, I took the blue cap off and - bingo - a big drop flew off in an arc for about a foot or so and hit the MV-E...it ran right on top of the red, 1st PCI-E slot where all the perforations are...but didn't go in, just about 15 mm x 2mm of CL-U sitting on top...I tried to wipe it off, but with perforations, you really can't...I then just covered it with my trusty MX4 and hoped for the best...fortunately, it booted up with a GPU in PCI-E slot 1...the grey marks are still there..

...somewhat related, I had a disaster with the *Sabertooth Z77* which confirmed my 'liking' of that board...many months ago, well before delidding the Ivy, I was moving it to a new case...it was late, dark and I was tired and working in cramped quarters (I moved everything to a bigger area later)...

...I had just watched a YouTube about the Sabertooth, its armour (which incidentally is meant for 'rugged' applications such as mini networks for military, oil exploration and such dusty 'temporary' assemblies where the extra covers do make sense)...J.J. from Asus also mentioned the *extra surge protection features* in the YouTube vid as part of the military certification the board has....

...so as I was hooking everything up in the dark, I put the Thermaltake Water 2 EX CPU pwm fan header on what I thought was the right spot next to the 24 pin...but as I said, it was dark, cramped and I really couldn't see well where I was fumbling around with the header - and I was too tired to pull it all out into a better lit area.... When I turned the power on, there was a huge spark that seared some of the hairs on my arm, a loud 'pop / bang' noise and A LOT of smoke...'oh cr.___p', now I have done it, this one is fried for good'.

After redoing the connections 'the right way', I held my breath and turned it ion...everything worked just fine...didn't miss a beat...Sabertooth Z77 and Thermaltake Water 2 Extreme - very rugged !


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...wasn't necessarily thinking of you (there are even bigger Sabertooth haters out there...many of them... that board is either loved or hated like no other, oddly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) ...though underneath all that ""pretty"" armour is a VRM and DRAM lane design that is 'related' to ROG MVG's implementation...when I ran my 3770K in it, it would do 5.2 giggles easy for longer periods, limited only by the CPU cooling I was using then...but I DO prefer the MV-E by a mile for a whole host of good reasons


I only like the noobtooth z77 for tis looks, and THAT IS IT. I regret buying it, or anything Asus related even.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i replaed it with ek waterblock and swirtech 240 rad
> 
> i had to use black tubing to connect the gpu's the white tubing kinked to much looks ugly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i want to get these blocks
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/vga-blocks/fc-geforce/geforce-gtx-6x0-series/ek-fc680-gtx-acetal.html


I'm jelly - that looks so good!


----------



## stickg1

Hmm, vise and hammer method put a couple of bumps on the edges of IHS which now stick up and hinder with clean contact with my heatsink. Should have just gone with the old trusty razor.


----------



## stickg1

On a side note, I thought I completely thrashed the IMC on my new 3770K. I was pretty bummed, so I took it out to inspect the pins and there was quite possibly the largest wad of TIM I've ever seen smeered all over my contacts and a huge ball stuck in the LGA socket. LOL

Cleaned it up and all 4 DIMMs work fine now.

#facepalm


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> On a side note, I thought I completely thrashed the IMC on my new 3770K. I was pretty bummed, so I took it out to inspect the pins and there was quite possibly the largest wad of TIM I've ever seen smeered all over my contacts and a huge ball stuck in the LGA socket. LOL
> 
> Cleaned it up and all 4 DIMMs work fine now.
> 
> #facepalm




LoL


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> On a side note, I thought I completely thrashed the IMC on my new 3770K. I was pretty bummed, so I took it out to inspect the pins and there was quite possibly the largest wad of TIM I've ever seen smeered all over my contacts and a huge ball stuck in the LGA socket. LOL
> 
> Cleaned it up and all 4 DIMMs work fine now.
> 
> #facepalm


...and now you can try that on several more CPUs, just cozy up to your favourite Intel dealer... 3770K $60, 3930K $155









http://www.overclock.net/t/1389378/intel-retail-edge-the-summer-deal-i7-3770k-starting-60-shipping-i7-3930k-starting-155-shipping-starting-may-15th


----------



## lilchronic

4770k @ 5ghz with 0.9v ???
http://www.tweaktown.com/news/30292/intel-core-i7-4770k-overclocked-to-5ghz-on-just-0-9v-of-power/index.html

http://www.overclock.net/t/1390063/tweak-town-4770k-overclocked-to-5-ghz/0_20


----------



## ivanlabrie

I call cpu-z bug with on die VRM or just an outdated version.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 4770k @ 5ghz with 0.9v ???
> http://www.tweaktown.com/news/30292/intel-core-i7-4770k-overclocked-to-5ghz-on-just-0-9v-of-power/index.html


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I call cpu-z bug with on die VRM or just an outdated version.


...could be, though the cpu-z also shows that the 4770K had its *HT disabled*...don't doubt though that Haswell will on average clock higher per 0.1 vCore

*@IvanL, FtW* ...what is your take on SB-E C2s running 1.65v RAM kits instead of 1.5v kits...early research papers suggested 1.5 max for SB-Es, but since then, a new stepping and a host of LG2011 quad channel 1.65v stock kits ?


----------



## ivanlabrie

1.65v seemed to be fine for SB...I'm guessing SB-E C2 is the same.

Check the chinese Haswell review, pretty cool!








I've heard from reputable sources that cpu-z screenshots are ALL wrong, vcore wise, so take those with a grain of salt.


----------



## FtW 420

I don't know of any intel desktop platforms that are not OK with 1.65V memory, just have to watch XMP profiles to make sure they aren't overvolting the VTT.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good call


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I don't know of any intel desktop platforms that are not OK with 1.65V memory, just have to watch XMP profiles to make sure they aren't overvolting the VTT.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 1.65v seemed to be fine for SB...I'm guessing SB-E C2 is the same.
> 
> Check the chinese Haswell review, pretty cool!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've heard from reputable sources that cpu-z screenshots are ALL wrong, vcore wise, so take those with a grain of salt.


...thanks







- that would be great...the 32GB 2400MHz quad kit is performing flawlessly with low VTT and VCCSA...didn't want to have to redo all the speed /voltages grid tables I built up

...yeah - I just read the whole Chinese review of the Haswell...very interesting...the only caveat also per your earlier post is 'BIOS" updates for the Haswell...jumping from Ivy w/GPUs is probably not the thing to do for the average user, but contemplating a new rig for a user that does only light gaming and a lot of video editing / YouTube stuff without a separate GPU, Haswell makes much more sense...traditional benchmark excluding iGPU are close, though...one nice new feature: CPU straps for the BCLK clockers out there


----------



## Hokies83

Been slow and boring in here as of late.... to much Nerd talk..

Where is my Von dutch????????


----------



## ivanlabrie

Right, VonDutch! He must out there harassing his kids, making them work for him while he sits there and smokes cuban cigars all day long.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and now you can try that on several more CPUs, just cozy up to your favourite Intel dealer... 3770K $60, 3930K $155
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1389378/intel-retail-edge-the-summer-deal-i7-3770k-starting-60-shipping-i7-3930k-starting-155-shipping-starting-may-15th


....how... gimme that 155$ 3930K right MEOW!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right, VonDutch! He must out there harassing his kids, making them work for him while he sits there and smokes cuban cigars all day long.


Where oh where has my Vooon dutch gone oh where oh where can he beeeeee.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ....how... gimme that 155$ 3930K right MEOW!!!
> *Where oh where* has my Vooon dutch gone oh where oh where can he beeeeee.


...ahem, Holland ?


----------



## mystiksinner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and now you can try that on several more CPUs, just cozy up to your favourite Intel dealer... 3770K $60, 3930K $155
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1389378/intel-retail-edge-the-summer-deal-i7-3770k-starting-60-shipping-i7-3930k-starting-155-shipping-starting-may-15th


HA, I just saw this. This is the biggest thing I will miss about working at Radio Shack... Correction, the ONLY thing I miss about working at Radio Shack. Cheap toys. I would use my employees' deals if they wouldn't so I could get 3-4 chips for the price of one. now i have to pay full retail







:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> HA, I just saw this. This is the biggest thing I will miss about working at Radio Shack... Correction, the ONLY thing I miss about working at Radio Shack. Cheap toys. I would use my employees' deals if they wouldn't so I could get 3-4 chips for the price of one. now i have to pay full retail
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :


I must find a friend for the super cheap 3930K


----------



## stickg1

So would any Best Buy employee be eligible for that deal? I might be able to talk the two guys over there that I know into getting one for me.


----------



## mystiksinner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So would any Best Buy employee be eligible for that deal? I might be able to talk the two guys over there that I know into getting one for me.


Yes, Best Buy employees are eligible.


----------



## CallsignVega

Looking to de-lid a 4770K when it comes in. Some questions for those that have done this on IB:

If you do a direct-die CPU cooler mount, is the die too recessed down for a heat sink to contact it without a heat spreader on? Is there any way to leave the clamp/latch of the CPU off so that the CPU cooler can do the double duty of pressing down on the CPU die which presses down on the pins for contact?

If enough pressure is needed, is cracking the die easy to do? I will be using a Koolance 380i CPU cooler.

Trying to go with direct die to cooling block, would Coolabs liquid ultra be quite a bit better than PK4? I've used coolabds Ultra before but didn't see much better results than PK4, but that was on a normal heat spreader mounting.


----------



## mystiksinner

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Looking to de-lid a 4770K when it comes in. Some questions for those that have done this on IB:
> 
> If you do a direct-die CPU cooler mount, is the die too recessed down for a heat sink to contact it without a heat spreader on? Is there any way to leave the clamp/latch of the CPU off so that the CPU cooler can do the double duty of pressing down on the CPU die which presses down on the pins for contact?
> 
> If enough pressure is needed, is cracking the die easy to do? I will be using a Koolance 380i CPU cooler.
> 
> Trying to go with direct die to cooling block, would Coolabs liquid ultra be quite a bit better than PK4? I've used coolabds Ultra before but didn't see much better results than PK4, but that was on a normal heat spreader mounting.


We still don't know if the 4770k will be soldered or not so it might not be able to be delidded. In my experience with direct die cooling on the 3770k, it is not worth it. I only saw a 2c improvement in temps and it requires a lot of modification. I don't know how much force it would take to crack the die but it can happen and in my opinion, not worth the risk for a couple degrees.


----------



## stickg1

Well if the 4770K is anything like the 3770K then there's a few things worth mentioning.

1) The clamp has to be removed because the waterblock wont be able to make contact with the die without a thick shim

2) The clamp would be useless anyway because it uses the lips on the IHS to lock the chip in and generate the perfect amount of pressure.

3) EK makes a direct die mounting kit now, but IDK if it's compatible with your block.

What I would do is tighten the block down until it gets tough to turn by hand. Test it, if it doesn't post or you get a CPU error code then you likely need more pressure. So keep turning it half a turn until you get the desired amount of pressure.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Looking to de-lid a 4770K when it comes in. Some questions for those that have done this on IB:
> 
> If you do a direct-die CPU cooler mount, is the die too recessed down for a heat sink to contact it without a heat spreader on? Is there any way to leave the clamp/latch of the CPU off so that the CPU cooler can do the double duty of pressing down on the CPU die which presses down on the pins for contact?
> 
> If enough pressure is needed, is cracking the die easy to do? I will be using a Koolance 380i CPU cooler.
> 
> Trying to go with direct die to cooling block, would Coolabs liquid ultra be quite a bit better than PK4? I've used coolabds Ultra before but didn't see much better results than PK4, but that was on a normal heat spreader mounting.


A couple guys have done direct die, sonda5 would be the guy to ask.
If you consider changing blocks, EK has a direct die kit for their supremacy blocks. http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> We still don't know if the 4770k will be soldered or not so it might not be able to be delidded. In my experience with direct die cooling on the 3770k, it is not worth it. I only saw a 2c improvement in temps and it requires a lot of modification. I don't know how much force it would take to crack the die but it can happen and in my opinion, not worth the risk for a couple degrees.


It should be TIM, the 4770k still uses the 3d transistors & that was the reason solder could not be used on ivy bridge.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> So would any Best Buy employee be eligible for that deal? I might be able to talk the two guys over there that I know into getting one for me.


wanna ask them for me on the 3930K? pwetty pwease!?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Looking to de-lid a 4770K when it comes in. Some questions for those that have done this on IB:
> 
> If you do a direct-die CPU cooler mount, is the die too recessed down for a heat sink to contact it without a heat spreader on? Is there any way to leave the clamp/latch of the CPU off so that the CPU cooler can do the double duty of pressing down on the CPU die which presses down on the pins for contact?
> 
> If enough pressure is needed, is cracking the die easy to do? I will be using a Koolance 380i CPU cooler.
> 
> Trying to go with direct die to cooling block, would Coolabs liquid ultra be quite a bit better than PK4? I've used coolabds Ultra before but didn't see much better results than PK4, but that was on a normal heat spreader mounting.


...in addition to other responses, it is also possible to retain the CPU latch mechanism by machining the water-block around the 'outside perimeter', like 'Gdesmo' has done here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1256763/lets-see-some-direct-die-water-cooling-on-ivy-bridge/20#post_19624112

...in addition EK's 'bare die' stand-offs for 3770K (under EU 7) will also be available for Haswell, according to EK

...I'm using a Koolance 370i cooler (related to 380) on a delidded 3770K I have tried 'bare die' but changed back for other reasons, and the spring-loaded thumb-screw locks combined with soft-metal washers would make it really tough to crack the die...I am sure you know to tighten it evenly and by hand only to reduce uneven pressure ridges

...Coollaboratory Ultra on the die gave me the best temps by > 5 C compared to the best non-liquid metal alternatives


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wanna ask them for me on the 3930K? pwetty pwease!?


...after my post on that here, I went down to my regular NCIX store and 'put my name into the hat' for another SB-E...they also mentioned that if all else fails, these kind of Intel promos for associates always end up on Craig's List'...keep your eyes peeled


----------



## CallsignVega

Thanks for the info guys. I'll de-lid the 4770k and run my 380i cooler bare-die with removed bracket and Cool lab Ultra.


----------



## MainStageNews

I am trying to install the naked ivy bridge (EK mount) and I dont have 4 .7mm plastic washers for the m4 screws. What should I do. Also I cant seem to find the the EK Supremacy box so if there are extra washers in there i obviously cant use those. If you want to look at the installation guide go here. Please help me I dont knof if a hardware store would carry something that small.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> I am trying to install the naked ivy bridge (EK mount) and I dont have 4 .7mm plastic washers for the m4 screws. What should I do. Also I cant seem to find the the EK Supremacy box so if there are extra washers in there i obviously cant use those. If you want to look at the installation guide go here. Please help me I dont knof if a hardware store would carry something that small.


...the problem with running direct-die is the reduced depth from stock which affects the 'CPU-to-pin' contacts - too loose or too tight mounting will likely lead to BIOS post issues, and/or partial IMC channel dysfunction...

...the EK standoff kit solves that but the plastic washers are a critical part for the right depth alignment...you might want to give EK a quick call and find out how thick those plastic washers are...once you know that, you can go the the hardware store and pick up plastic ones of that thickness, or even make your own...Home Depot would carry the right thickness of washers, just not sure if they have them in 'Plastic'. ...hope it works out


----------



## martinhal

never mind..........


----------



## lilchronic

I personally dont think direct - die is that much better than having the ihs on. whats another 1 - 2c temp drop, i already dropped 30c .


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> I personally dont think direct - die is that much better than having the ihs on. whats another 1 - 2c temp drop, i already dropped 30c .






His drop was rather massive...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> His drop was rather massive...


that guy had 96c on one core and yet 63c on another.

That's a whopping 33c difference between 2 of the 4 cores.
In other words - his mount was done INCORRECTLY.

I wouldn't trust that video, personally.
I did watch it before de-lidding though, but that's why I thought to create a video myself, showing you true results and a proper explanation (see OP)

EDIT:
And after the delid - due to him putting on "normal paste" he only really sees 5c.

When he says "this mod seems to have fixed this problem"
My reply would be:
"No, this re-sitting of your cooler fixed the problem, not a defective part from intel, nor the de-lidding".
Now if he were to put some CLU - I'm sure his temps would be around the 50 mark, rather than the 60's.


----------



## amd655

Not sure what you are talking about, but my 2500k seems to run hotter than almost everyone else's, unless they fake things.....

75c at 4.5ghz on my H100, 88c at 5ghz on my H100.

Going to say i mounted things wrong too?

I really think intel has lost consistency across the board since SB was released.

Now, take my AMD setup.... i have a Coolit ECO ALC on that, running 4.2ghz, it idles at 22c... and reaches 45c maximum.....
At 4.5ghz, it was stable through benchmarks hitting 53c.

Just saying....


----------



## lilchronic

32c temp drop

before delid and only 19 minutes tested on prime95

12hrs plus of prime 95


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Not sure what you are talking about, but my 2500k seems to run hotter than almost everyone else's, unless they fake things.....
> 
> 75c at 4.5ghz on my H100, 88c at 5ghz on my H100.
> 
> Going to say i mounted things wrong too?
> 
> I really think intel has lost consistency across the board since SB was released.
> 
> Now, take my AMD setup.... i have a Coolit ECO ALC on that, running 4.2ghz, it idles at 22c... and reaches 45c maximum.....
> At 4.5ghz, it was stable through benchmarks hitting 53c.
> 
> Just saying....


I'll just say, HEAT is not the same thing as TEMP.
AMD sensors report temps differently than Intel, 53c on AMD is Intel's equivalent of 95c.


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'll just say, HEAT is not the same thing as TEMP.
> AMD sensors report temps differently than Intel, 53c on AMD is Intel's equivalent of 95c.


62c (Phenom II) is intel's 98c...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, my point still stands...95c is pretty safe for Ivy. 98c would be terrible for SB but for Ivy it's slightly hot.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> His drop was rather massive...


...sometimes also means 'apples and oranges' comparisons (though not necessarily in the vid) ... comes down to 'starting position' for comparisons...originally, my 3770K w/stock cooler showed low-v promise but a lot of high temps - switched to a good closed-loop w/MX4 and had a major temp drop...then delidded, and put CL-U on die - another major temp drop...added a big custom loop - another temp drop...added a bigger custom loop and lapped IHS to deal w/major concave / convex issues - even lower temps.

...finally, tried 'direct-die' - without stand-offs, just experimenting with torque-down pressures for good pin contact until clean boot and dual channel stress testing worked - saved another 2 - 3C , but as temps were low enough already and I'm still planning to try other water blocks arrangements, I reverted back to the lapped-IHS.

...If I would have made a vid showing _initial_ temp drops from stock, the drop would not have been as significant (though still around 18 C+ w/ CL-U) as when comparing initial 'stock' vs 'final' config which would show a drop of more than 30 C, 'all in' - even though both are true...still, delidding brought the single biggest drop, all else being equal.


----------



## stickg1

A couple things.

The guy in the video remounted his cooler a half dozen times and every time the difference in core temps was still in the ballpark of 30C. I've seen some really uneven IHS mounts so that doesn't surprise me.

Watching other people delid is painful for me. I've delidded 3 times now, it takes about a minute. But requires a fresh razorblade and some hair on your junk.

Recon I'm not sure what you're talking about with your SB and temps. What TD was talking about is the difference in core temps on the same chip at the same frequency. If you have a difference of 33C between core #0 and core #3 then chances are you mounted your cooler funky. However, Ivy bridge, it is possible that you remount your cooler a dozen times trying to fix the problem, but you can't because Intel mounted the IHS unevenly.


----------



## amd655

One of my cores is always around 5-10c hotter than the one below it, and the next core down is always 10c hotter than the other 2, this happened with my Noctua NH-U9B-SE2 and this H100, but i am stuck with this problem as SB is soldered


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> One of my cores is always around 5-10c hotter than the one below it, and the next core down is always 10c hotter than the other 2, this happened with my Noctua NH-U9B-SE2 and this H100, but i am stuck with this problem as SB is soldered


...as this is SB rather than Ivy (w.iGPU, some cores get naturally hotter) this sounds indeed like a slightly crooked IHS from the factory or something...have seen that before...ditto for slightly crooked CPU latch mechanisms...once thing you may want to try is to get '*pressure paper*' from the store to get an actual imprint of the contact patterns...that may help to define next potential steps


----------



## stickg1

Unfortunately that seems pretty common with Sandys. The two I owned had a 8C-12C difference between the hottest and coolest cores. I remember on the first one it freaked me out and I spent about 2 hours scouring forums trying to find a fix. Then a bunch of people assured me that it was normal.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 32c temp drop
> 
> before delid and only 19 minutes tested on prime95


Very cool bro!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> 62c (Phenom II) is intel's 98c...


Amen.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Well, my point still stands...95c is pretty safe for Ivy. 98c would be terrible for SB but for Ivy it's slightly hot.


hahahaha

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> A couple things.
> Recon I'm not sure what you're talking about with your SB and temps. What TD was talking about is the difference in core temps on the same chip at the same frequency. If you have a difference of 33C between core #0 and core #3 then chances are you mounted your cooler funky. However, Ivy bridge, it is possible that you remount your cooler a dozen times trying to fix the problem, but you can't because Intel mounted the IHS unevenly.


Mate today watching the game was emotional for me.
Sir Alex's words were beautiful.

In other news this is sensational -watch it till the end - it is the playoffs to the PL, semi-finals.




Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> One of my cores is always around 5-10c hotter than the one below it, and the next core down is always 10c hotter than the other 2, this happened with my Noctua NH-U9B-SE2 and this H100, but i am stuck with this problem as SB is soldered


I have a 8c hotter core - it just is too cool for school.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mate today watching the game was emotional for me.
> Sir Alex's words were beautiful.
> 
> In other news this is sensational -watch it till the end - it is the playoffs to the PL, semi-finals.


I missed the game dammit, had family stuff going on and got side-tracked.

That was a wild finish. I'm glad they missed that penalty, I hate diving. Well unless it benefits my team LOL.


----------



## Joa3d43

...I suppose it comes down to a lot of factors, but if it helps, here are my "Sandy-E' cores at 100% load...there will always be some variance, but I have no idea what differential is considered 'normal and acceptable' by others - if it is over 7 or 8 C in Ivy or Sandy-E, I usually go back and look at the mount / IHS / TIM - or at least test out with pressure paper...


----------



## jokrik

Ok guys I need help real bad
Scenario:
a few days ago i've successfully delidded my ivy without the razor blade method, I've run it on my test bench with the same mobo and ram and it works, temp droped overall about 13c with air cooling
my current rig use water cooling, I decided to grab the EK naked ivy mounting thing
after I removed the clip (as instructed from EK) I moved on to install my cpu without the IHS and straight in touch with my waterblock (thats what the ek naked mount for right?)
installed it with my GPUs , sound card and mount it my case; and after some bleeding on the loop, when i turn it on, the rig didnt wanna start up! it has error code no 55 on the mobo number display (which is ram not installed)
i've tried changin the ram etc and still didnt work

just now I drained the loop and install the clip again and use air cooling just to see how it goes on my test bench (without GPUs and sound card)
amazingly IT STARTED UP!??

what did I do wrong??
should I just ditch the EK mounting thing and use the IHS instead?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jokrik*
> 
> Ok guys I need help real bad
> Scenario:
> a few days ago i've successfully delidded my ivy without the razor blade method, I've run it on my test bench with the same mobo and ram and it works, temp droped overall about 13c with air cooling
> my current rig use water cooling, I decided to grab the EK naked ivy mounting thing
> after remove the clip (as instructed from EK) I moved on to install my cpu without the IHS and straight in touch with my waterblock (thats what the ek naked mount for right?)
> and after some bleeding on the loop, when i turn it on, the rig didnt wanna start up! it has error code no 55 on the mobo number display (which is ram not installed)
> i've tried changin the ram etc and still didnt work
> 
> just now I drained the loop and install the clip again and use air cooling just to see how it goes on my test bench
> amazingly IT STARTED UP!??
> 
> what did I do wrong??
> should I just ditch the EK mounting thing and use the IHS instead?


I bet you put a bit to much pressure from the mounting using the naked kit. It happens sometimes, also maybe a slight bit of static was residing in the mobo, that seems to be my culprit.


----------



## jokrik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I bet you put a bit to much pressure from the mounting using the naked kit. It happens sometimes, also maybe a slight bit of static was residing in the mobo, that seems to be my culprit.


Should I just ditch the ek naked mount?
Am i looking at better temp when using the ek naked mount?

besides I've just tried to run my test bench with my gpu installed just to see if its causing the problem
seems like I can enter windows even with the gpu installed, however i find it abit funny that when i tried to shut down, it just kept restarting
FYI im using an extra PSU i've laying around
does the "restart" thing when shut down cause by bad deliding or just the PSU acting funny you think?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jokrik*
> 
> Should I just ditch the ek naked mount?
> Am i looking at better temp when using the ek naked mount?
> 
> besides I've just tried to run my test bench with my gpu installed just to see if its causing the problem
> seems like I can enter windows even with the gpu installed, however i find it abit funny that when i tried to shut down, it just kept restarting
> FYI im using an extra PSU i've laying around
> does the "restart" thing when shut down cause by bad deliding or just the PSU acting funny you think?


I would possibly give it another try and see if you cant mount it very lightly to the die instead of a tight mount. This way you can rule out the mounting pressure. Then see what happens and I highly doubt it was the delid process thats very very rare when someone uses the vice method. It could possibly be the PSU however.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jokrik*
> 
> what did I do wrong??
> should I just ditch the EK mounting thing and use the IHS instead?


What TIM are you using? Are you using the recommended block to match the EK mount? Did you mount it exactly with the hardware required by EK? Have you lapped your block?

My experience with bare die mount without the EK naked die mount is that you barely need any bolt down pressure. Just a gentle even hand tightness. I'm guessing 5-7 lbs torque pressure. I used Liquid Pro TIM with my mount with a super small drop of it on the die then with the same cotton tip applied thin even coat to the block area that makes contact with the die.

If you torque down too much the block may bow and not make even contact.

I got the same error 55 code the first time I mounted with TIM only applied to the die and torqued down too much. Also I use a .5mm thermal pad layer around the die directly on the pcb of the cpu to help add more surface are so that all the pressure isn't between the die and block and to help increase heat dissipation area on the pcb.

Photos of my custom bare die mount.









Also first part of my fitting testing included using contact paper pressure to determine best orientation of block and to verify proper contact. The pink color shows good contact after test.


----------



## jokrik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would possibly give it another try and see if you cant mount it very lightly to the die instead of a tight mount. This way you can rule out the mounting pressure. Then see what happens and I highly doubt it was the delid process thats very very rare when someone uses the vice method. It could possibly be the PSU however.


+ REP!
problem solved, too much pressure on the cpu

I only half tight it


----------



## jokrik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> What TIM are you using? Are you using the recommended block to match the EK mount? Did you mount it exactly with the hardware required by EK? Have you lapped your block?
> 
> My experience with bare die mount without the EK naked die mount is that you barely need any bolt down pressure. Just a gentle even hand tightness. I'm guessing 5-7 lbs torque pressure. I used Liquid Pro TIM with my mount with a super small drop of it on the die then with the same cotton tip applied thin even coat to the block area that makes contact with the die.
> 
> If you torque down too much the block may bow and not make even contact.
> 
> I got the same error 55 code the first time I mounted with TIM only applied to the die and torqued down too much. Also I use a .5mm thermal pad layer around the die directly on the pcb of the cpu to help add more surface are so that all the pressure isn't between the die and block and to help increase heat dissipation area on the pcb.
> 
> Photos of my custom bare die mount.
> 
> Also first part of my fitting testing included using contact paper pressure to determine best orientation of block and to verify proper contact. The pink color shows good contact after test.


Yes I use the ek supremacy
and using CLU








no worries thx for the advice, problem solved
too much pressure
cant wait to see the result

man I've been wasting 2 days on loop bleeding without noticing this problem
too tired to put all the loop together now, first world problem with water cooling


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jokrik*
> 
> + REP!
> problem solved, too much pressure on the cpu
> 
> I only half tight it


Good! hows it doin now?


----------



## jokrik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Good! hows it doin now?


thing is I cant really test it fully, I have the waterblock installed but too lazy to setup a loop since its midnight here
so what I did is to have 2 fans blowing on the block, all I did is see whether it boot up and I can open some minor softwares for a minute or two

and it did fine

not gonna risk putting the chip on fire









will do full test tomorrow night while the loop bleeds


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jokrik*
> 
> thing is I cant really test it fully, I have the waterblock installed but too lazy to setup a loop since its midnight here
> so what I did is to have 2 fans blowing on the block, all I did is see whether it boot up and I can open some minor softwares for a minute or two
> 
> and it did fine
> 
> not gonna risk putting the chip on fire
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will do full test tomorrow night while the loop bleeds


alright i spose that works.


----------



## illuz

You crazzzy guy, I wouldn't boot up with fans blowing onto a cpu block hah! Let us know the results when you're done


----------



## lagittaja

tl;dr
But jokrik, it comes to mind that your mounting pressure was not even so the CPU doesn't sit in the socket properly -> not all pins make contact.


----------



## MainStageNews

Alright I dellided my 3770k but before I dellided I didnt run the burn test I just did small fft's in Prime95 to test the temp difference is that alright?


----------



## lagittaja

It's alright if you ask me.
If you test before with P95 and now after test with P95 and you have recorded the max temperatures -> then you have temperature difference data.
And nowadays with P95 27.7 (iirc) forward P95 has AVX as well so temperatures with newer P95's reach the same kind of levels as IBT with AVX does.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jokrik*
> 
> + REP!
> problem solved, too much pressure on the cpu
> 
> I only half tight it


...glad it worked out for you - just ask uncle Val







...had the same problem you did the first time I tried 'direct-die'... backed the 4 thumb screws off 1/4 turn and bingo...everything worked


----------



## MainStageNews

OCN name: MainStageNews
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: no ihs
Mhz gained: havent tried to go for more mhz but MIGHT at a latter date and wil update then
OC after delid: havent tried to go for more so still at 4.5Ghz
Temp drops: 4C at idle 17C at load
CPU-Z validation of max OC: havent gone for max yet.


----------



## Swag

My new sexy Corsair K70 that I bought a few days ago but I forgot to post the pictures here.


----------



## stickg1

I delidded my 3770K the other day. My 3rd delid and first 3770K. I have a 15C drop. I didn't really document it or anything. I'm still on air cooling, a CM TX3 92mm dual fan. I was at 4.5GHz hottest core 75C, now hottest core is 60C. But I moved up to 4.9GHz for benching and hottest core is ~84C. Waiting til I get decent cooling to really go nuts.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My new sexy Corsair K70 that I bought a few days ago but I forgot to post the pictures here.


...cool kit !







What DRAM refresh cycle times are you running with that juicy kit ? I noticed on all my DRAM kits, I can lower Dram refresh cycle times far below XMP stock values, which has a direct impact on performance....would be interested to know how far you can push the Corsair K70ies


----------



## FtW 420

Strange vengeance, that sucker looks too big for a ddr3 slot, but all kinds of cool buttons to play with!

Corsair is using the vengeance name on more than terrible memory kits now, trying to give the name a better image?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Nice one swag! But it isn't fully mechanical! That's what put me off it. You really ought to try the Logitech!


----------



## jokrik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> You crazzzy guy, I wouldn't boot up with fans blowing onto a cpu block hah! Let us know the results when you're done


You dont know how desperate I was








temp was ok though, I saw on real temp real quick (somewhere around 10% - 20% load since it just booted up) are around 50-60 hahaha
was so nervous....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...cool kit !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What DRAM refresh cycle times are you running with that juicy kit ? I noticed on all my DRAM kits, I can lower Dram refresh cycle times far below XMP stock values, which has a direct impact on performance....would be interested to know how far you can push the Corsair K70ies


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Strange vengeance, that sucker looks too big for a ddr3 slot, but all kinds of cool buttons to play with!
> 
> Corsair is using the vengeance name on more than terrible memory kits now, trying to give the name a better image?










...at least someone (or two) got it !

...but FtW, just as Corsair is building a brand around 'Vengeance', so is NVidia which apparently, so the rumour goes, is introducing a whole free-standing line around 'Titan' (at least just GPUs for now







)


----------



## Joa3d43

*...more deliddings on the way ?*

...did some ordering at FrozenCPU on the weekend...noticed that there were down to just a few Coollaboratory Ultras then unlike earlier in the week (I left a few...)... just checked and now they're out of stock...late-comers to the Ivy delidding party - or early birds for Haswell ?


----------



## amd655

Gonna Delid my 480 and 2500k, may delid my ram too, also my motherboard mosfets.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Gonna Delid my 480 and 2500k, may delid my ram too, also my motherboard mosfets.


Most of that would work!







Delidding ram is a strange term though and I wouldn't put CLP on mosfets lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> OCN name: MainStageNews
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: no ihs
> Mhz gained: havent tried to go for more mhz but MIGHT at a latter date and wil update then
> OC after delid: havent tried to go for more so still at 4.5Ghz
> Temp drops: 4C at idle 17C at load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: havent gone for max yet.


sorry for the delay but you're in!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My new sexy Corsair K70 that I bought a few days ago but I forgot to post the pictures here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...cool kit !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What DRAM refresh cycle times are you running with that juicy kit ? I noticed on all my DRAM kits, I can lower Dram refresh cycle times far below XMP stock values, which has a direct impact on performance....would be interested to know how far you can push the Corsair K70ies
Click to expand...

I almost broke my DRAM slots by trying to plug in this K70 into it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Strange vengeance, that sucker looks too big for a ddr3 slot, but all kinds of cool buttons to play with!
> 
> Corsair is using the vengeance name on more than terrible memory kits now, trying to give the name a better image?


I do agree, they put the name vengeance to increase the price tag on them to sell them as gaming equipment. I didn't really have the time to wait 3 weeks for shipping for a keyboard online that might come in broken or something I didn't like. This way, I can check out what people are raving about of reds and at the same time be able to return them quickly if need be.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Nice one swag! But it isn't fully mechanical! That's what put me off it. You really ought to try the Logitech!


The Corsair K70s (updated version of the K60) are fully mechanical. All keys are reds.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I almost broke my DRAM slots by trying to plug in this K70 into it..


...should have delidded it first









*...and now, 'Back to the Future'*

...subject to confirmation that Haswell will have CPU straps as well, better dust up on your strap / BCLK oc'ing skills from yesteryear...both according to unofficial Haswell 'leaks' and also my own testing with the 3970x which I'm now running with a 125 MHz strap and 125 MHz BCLK, you not only get more granularity re different CPU speed options as well as more / tighter mem timing options, your CPU VID at a given speed also seems to drop, along with real v-core requirements...at 5 GHz, I went from 1.3761 VID to 1.3461 VID







when going from strap 100 to 125...confirming what other OCers had said earlier.

...with Haswell deliddable, straps are an additional bonus when squeezing out more useful speed at a given vCore


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I almost broke my DRAM slots by trying to plug in this K70 into it.
> I do agree, they put the name vengeance to increase the price tag on them to sell them as gaming equipment. I didn't really have the time to wait 3 weeks for shipping for a keyboard online that might come in broken or something I didn't like. This way, I can check out what people are raving about of reds and at the same time be able to return them quickly if need be.
> The Corsair K70s (updated version of the K60) are fully mechanical. All keys are reds.


Very nice indeed!
Although I absolutely have fallen in love with that white glow of my G710+


----------



## ivanlabrie

Yeah, straps sound delicious...nom nom


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Yeah, straps sound delicious...nom nom


...you're so right ! Almost as good as Avocado salad with barbeque beef in a Malbec + Cognac sauce (...up here they call everything 'fusion' now...I feel so fused







)


Spoiler: Warning: nom nom straps Spoiler!



PSU on 3970X and 4 GPUs throttling but I ordered some parts


----------



## ivanlabrie

Good, good!









Avocado is baws! Couldn't buy any today








Gonna go chew on some butter lol coconut oil helps keep me awake too.


----------



## MainStageNews

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sorry for the delay but you're in!


Awesome thanks. Will it be able to be updated if I try to go for 5Ghz (or just see what my highest clock is)?


----------



## sp00n82

Well I guess you can add me as well.

Code:



Code:


OCN name:        spoonium
CPU:             3570k
on die-TIM:      Liquid Metal Ultra
ihs-TIM:         Arctic Silver 5
Mhz gained:      0
OC after delid:  4300
Temp drops:      11°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: no need for that for such low overclocks

It's been quite a while since I delidded. Unfortunately before the vice method appeared, which I would have gladly used instead, as I was hardly able to fit a razor blade between the PCB and IHS. Took me half an hour to cut through all of that, it was everything but easy. But I had already attached the Macho HR2 cooler for a few month on that chip before I decided to delid, so that may have tightened the adhesive already.

And yeah, my chip is that bad. Couldn't get 4500 stable even with 1.432v Vcore, and am not entirely sure for 4400 yet.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MainStageNews*
> 
> Awesome thanks. Will it be able to be updated if I try to go for 5Ghz (or just see what my highest clock is)?


I will update at any time, so by all means go nuts








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spoonium*
> 
> Well I guess you can add me as well.
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> OCN name:        spoonium
> CPU:             3570k
> on die-TIM:      Liquid Metal Ultra
> ihs-TIM:         Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained:      0
> OC after delid:  4300
> Temp drops:      11°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: no need for that for such low overclocks
> 
> It's been quite a while since I delidded. Unfortunately before the vice method appeared, which I would have gladly used instead, as I was hardly able to fit a razor blade between the PCB and IHS. Took me half an hour to cut through all of that, it was everything but easy. But I had already attached the Macho HR2 cooler for a few month on that chip before I decided to delid, so that may have tightened the adhesive already.
> 
> And yeah, my chip is that bad. Couldn't get 4500 stable even with 1.432v Vcore, and am not entirely sure for 4400 yet.


You're in!







sorry for the wait, also not the best OC'er I see what did you use to OC it?


----------



## Hokies83

Lol ghetto windows install thats whats up yo...


----------



## ivanlabrie

lol, same here...got a dvd drive floatin around.
Man I want more 7950s


----------



## Hokies83

lol my main system os pooped out 50 bsod was her limit.. ... updating it now... so many updates...

Im hopeing it was my drivers /os pooping out as to why my Gpus core clocks on one has dropped over 100mhz and 50mhz on 2 heh


----------



## ivanlabrie

Lotsa driver swapping going on me thinks...crunching data all day isn't likely to harm on water. Plus you don't run really high oc's with them.


----------



## Hokies83

when i started i was running 1375mhz / 1225 mhz / 1275mhz 24/7 that lasted 2 weeks

as of today in same order as above i was at 1235mhz / 1060mhz / 1240mhz

And that would crash time to time.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Real odd...maybe slight instability over time.


----------



## Hokies83

lol think my top gpu is dead..

cannot get into windows with it plugged in soon as windows trys to post insta bsod 116...

I un plugged it plugged dl dvi into gpu 2.. booted fine..

Did same to gpu 3 booted fine..

plugged gpu 1 back in bsod,,


----------



## jokrik

quick question, dont you get any instability issue running 3 different cards at different core clock?
I've mine set at the same speed, top card capable to oc very hard, but the bottom one couldnt
so I put the top card as the same speed as the bottom one

btw the "less pressure" on naked ivy mount works like a charm
was able to boot into windows last night
still bleeding the loop, will have result posted here tonight and join the club


----------



## sp00n82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry for the wait, also not the best OC'er I see what did you use to OC it?


I didn't have to wait, I just didn't post here any sooner.









The CPU is running on a Pro3, low end I know, but even with a better board I doubt I would be able to go much higher. The chip just is that bad.
On the other hand the chip runs rather cool after delidding now, with air cooling (Macho HR02) it wouldn't exceed 80°C even with 1.424v running LinX (LinPack). That's the worst case, haven't seen any scenario where the temperatures got higher than using LinX (or IBT, which also uses LinPack).
The board on the other hand started to thermal throttle already at around 4200MHz due to VRM overheating, so I had to pluck a fan directly on top of the VRM heatspreaders.

I'm back at 4300 now because I just didn't feel comfortable with such a high voltage. I still need 1.352v for 4300 to be WHEA error free / have no freezes in idle (so far...).

// Edit
By the way, the signature code is a bit messy in the OP.
I fixed some errors and removed the unnecessary tags that aren't allowed/considered in the signature:

Code:



Code:


[CENTER]:skull: [URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][B][Official] Delidded Crewman[/B][/URL] :skull:[/CENTER]

(And yes, the link in my sig is smaller than that.)


----------



## jokrik

Its ON!!









OCN name: jokrik
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: none (using naked ivy mounting system)
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.5ghz
Temp drops:21c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Included in the pic

http://s1248.photobucket.com/user/jokrik89/media/Phenomenon/Delided_zpsfedb8434.jpg.html


Spoiler: Before Delid



http://s1248.photobucket.com/user/jokrik89/media/Phenomenon/StressTestLowLoad2_zpsc503ec96.jpg.html





Spoiler: After Delid



http://s1248.photobucket.com/user/jokrik89/media/Phenomenon/Delid25minutes_zps1d5ad716.jpg.html



All stress results were taken after 25 minutes of stress testing since I've only taken records of 25 min stress test result before the delid

Very proud that now I can use the signature!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spoonium*
> 
> I didn't have to wait, I just didn't post here any sooner.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The CPU is running on a Pro3, low end I know, but even with a better board I doubt I would be able to go much higher. The chip just is that bad.
> On the other hand the chip runs rather cool after delidding now, with air cooling (Macho HR02) it wouldn't exceed 80°C even with 1.424v running LinX (LinPack). That's the worst case, haven't seen any scenario where the temperatures got higher than using LinX (or IBT, which also uses LinPack).
> The board on the other hand started to thermal throttle already at around 4200MHz due to VRM overheating, so I had to pluck a fan directly on top of the VRM heatspreaders.
> 
> I'm back at 4300 now because I just didn't feel comfortable with such a high voltage. I still need 1.352v for 4300 to be WHEA error free / have no freezes in idle (so far...).
> 
> // Edit
> By the way, the signature code is a bit messy in the OP.
> I fixed some errors and removed the unnecessary tags that aren't allowed/considered in the signature:
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> [CENTER]:skull: [URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][B][Official] Delidded Crewman[/B][/URL] :skull:[/CENTER]
> 
> (And yes, the link in my sig is smaller than that.)


Thank you very much sir! will fix now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jokrik*
> 
> Its ON!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: jokrik
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: none (using naked ivy mounting system)
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5ghz
> Temp drops:21c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Included in the pic
> 
> http://s1248.photobucket.com/user/jokrik89/media/Phenomenon/Delided_zpsfedb8434.jpg.html
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Before Delid
> 
> 
> 
> http://s1248.photobucket.com/user/jokrik89/media/Phenomenon/StressTestLowLoad2_zpsc503ec96.jpg.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: After Delid
> 
> 
> 
> http://s1248.photobucket.com/user/jokrik89/media/Phenomenon/Delid25minutes_zps1d5ad716.jpg.html
> 
> 
> 
> All stress results were taken after 25 minutes of stress testing since I've only taken records of 25 min stress test result before the delid
> 
> Very proud that now I can use the signature!


You're in as well sir! Slappa dat Sig on!


----------



## jokrik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in as well sir! Slappa dat Sig on!


Aye Captain!


----------



## stickg1

Val, will you put my 3770K on there?

OCN name: stickg1
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Antec Formula 7
Mhz gained: 400MHz
OC after delid: 4.9GHz
Temp drops:16C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2801772

I'll give you a better CPU-Z validation later. That one was just boasting my 2800MHz RAM OC. But you can see under multiplier it's 16-49. I keep power saving features on.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Val, will you put my 3770K on there?
> 
> OCN name: stickg1
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Antec Formula 7
> Mhz gained: 400MHz
> OC after delid: 4.9GHz
> Temp drops:16C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2801772
> 
> I'll give you a better CPU-Z validation later. That one was just boasting my 2800MHz RAM OC. But you can see under multiplier it's 16-49. I keep power saving features on.


You're in for what the third time? and I laughed at that CPU-Z


----------



## Joa3d43

*@ Valgaur*

...bonjour







...have you seen this (re your build and pipe-bending) ?: http://www.overclock.net/t/1280153/pipe-bending-101


----------



## Hokies83

Meh?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh?


...that sort of looks like my 'Siamese twin' build -


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@ Valgaur*
> 
> ...bonjour
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...have you seen this (re your build and pipe-bending) ?: http://www.overclock.net/t/1280153/pipe-bending-101


Yes and I ahve been askin questions there but thanks man!







Got an email back from Bitspower as to what of their fittings work on copper tubing and what size even








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Meh?


lol I'll take a pic of me doing the piping with my crack showing







Just for you buddy


----------



## Hokies83

Make sure u get face palm pics after the fittings leak.


----------



## Molokou

Hello y'all!!

Just delidded my 3770K yesterday night because I couldn't wait to do so while my Liquid Metal Pro/Ultra arrives =)
I wanted to join this club because it was all the info in here what made me decide to do it








That's the hard part of this, so I achieved to have done the worst part by now and just need to wait a few (or should I say several?) weeks to get my order delivered











*OCN name:* Molokou
*CPU:* Intel core i7 - 3770K
*on die-TIM:* Arctic Cooling MX-4
*ihs-TIM:* Arctic Cooling MX-4
*Mhz gained:* 0
*OC after delid:* none so far
*Temp drops:* they actually got a little bit worse than before
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* no OC yet

I thought seriously on not joining the club just yet 'cuz I haven't got any improvement just yet :guiltysmile: and it makes me feel ashamed








Just need to get the LMP/U to make this work worth the price (and a better thermal solution, I have my eyes settled on the Swiftech H220 but it continues out of stock







)









See ya around =P


----------



## ivanlabrie

Newegg has it!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> Hello y'all!!
> 
> Just delidded my 3770K yesterday night because I couldn't wait to do so while my Liquid Metal Pro/Ultra arrives =)
> I wanted to join this club because it was all the info in here what made me decide to do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's the hard part of this, so I achieved to have done the worst part by now and just need to wait a few (or should I say several?) weeks to get my order delivered
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* Molokou
> *CPU:* Intel core i7 - 3770K
> *on die-TIM:* Arctic Cooling MX-4
> *ihs-TIM:* Arctic Cooling MX-4
> *Mhz gained:* 0
> *OC after delid:* none so far
> *Temp drops:* they actually got a little bit worse than before
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* no OC yet
> 
> I thought seriously on not joining the club just yet 'cuz I haven't got any improvement just yet :guiltysmile: and it makes me feel ashamed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just need to get the LMP/U to make this work worth the price (and a better thermal solution, I have my eyes settled on the Swiftech H220 but it continues out of stock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> See ya around =P


You're in Buddy! No prob on the temps wait for CLU/P and show me then with the new cooling


----------



## Joa3d43

*...temps / core differentials on a delidded Ivy*









...as some of you know, I have been playing around with both the delidded Ivy 3770K and the Sandy-E 3970X as part of the Siamese Twins build (...btw. after seeing the contraption with open boards and all the tubes and wires, a friend of mine spontaneously called it *'The Borg')*....

...I recently went back an tried both 'bare die' and 'lapped IHS' (both with CL-U) on the Ivy...while bare die beat lapped IHS by a couple of degrees in temps, I'm running with IHS - for now - as I can switch out the water-blocks between the Ivy and the 3970X in just a few minutes the way it is arranged without draining the system.

I do think that I got the lapping and mounting right this time, noting the *identical core temps* in both 'current' and 'min' temps...the Cinebench run at 5.1GHz was with iGPU (no discreet GPU for that test) which tends to increase core temp differentials a bit under load...though I'm very happy with the 'max temps' for Cinebench at 5.1 giggles (under 70 C w/ambient at 20 C) ...I really do think that lapping the IHS thoroughly was well worth the effort because prior of doing so, even idle temps varied between cores by 4+ C.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Haha ever since someone posted that video, I've been told that I'm a idiot for thinking a 30c temp difference from cores WASN'T due to a poor mount, but instead due to Intel and their bad paste. I'm really laughing so much, it's like trying to teach a bunch of ignorant kids:
http://www.youtube.com/all_comments?v=XXs0I5kuoX4&feature=em-comment_reply_received


----------



## amd655

My own


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...temps / core differentials on a delidded Ivy*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...as some of you know, I have been playing around with both the delidded Ivy 3770K and the Sandy-E 3970X as part of the Siamese Twins build (...btw. after seeing the contraption with open boards and all the tubes and wires, a friend of mine spontaneously called it *'The Borg')*....
> 
> ...I recently went back an tried both 'bare die' and 'lapped IHS' (both with CL-U) on the Ivy...while bare die beat lapped IHS by a couple of degrees in temps, I'm running with IHS - for now - as I can switch out the water-blocks between the Ivy and the 3970X in just a few minutes the way it is arranged without draining the system.
> 
> I do think that I got the lapping and mounting right this time, noting the *identical core temps* in both 'current' and 'min' temps...the Cinebench run at 5.1GHz was with iGPU (no discreet GPU for that test) which tends to increase core temp differentials a bit under load...though I'm very happy with the 'max temps' for Cinebench at 5.1 giggles (under 70 C w/ambient at 20 C) ...I really do think that lapping the IHS thoroughly was well worth the effort because prior of doing so, even idle temps varied between cores by 4+ C.


Fantastic result mate, top job that









Is this on water?


----------



## sp00n82

Yeah, the TIM Intel uses isn't _that_ bad. It's just not as good as Liquid Metal and of course a lot worse than soldering.
Also mounting quality varies. My chip was very very *very* tight, so before I applied CLU to the Die, I've made a test with AS5, and the difference was negligible to not delidded (2-4°C). Only after appliying CLU I saw a noticeable difference of 11°C. And actually the latter was with resealing the gap with black silicone, while the former was the IHS just being hold in place by the socket's fixing mechanism.

People that notice 20+ difference probably have had a worse production/mounting quality.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spoonium*
> 
> Yeah, the TIM Intel uses isn't _that_ bad. It's just not as good as Liquid Metal and of course a lot worse than soldering.
> Also mounting quality varies. My chip was very very *very* tight, so before I applied CLU to the Die, I've made a test with AS5, and the difference was negligible to not delidded (2-4°C). Only after appliying CLU I saw a noticeable difference of 11°C. And actually the latter was with resealing the gap with black silicone, while the former was the IHS just being hold in place by the socket's fixing mechanism.
> 
> People that notice 20+ difference probably have had a worse production/mounting quality.


Well to be honest.
I can understand 20-40c (yup 40) drops in temps through the cores from the original ones with CLU and DIRECT DIE mount.
However...a loss of only 5c for putting normal paste on 2 CORES and then the other 2 CORES to have dropped 30c? Yeah sure - it was Intel's fault...
That said who knows - but from my time of being part of this club, OC'ing PC's and building PC's for the last decade, I haven't notice ONCE a core that had a 30c difference from its other core, without touching anything (ie not de-lidding etc).


----------



## sp00n82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well to be honest.
> I can understand 20-40c (yup 40) drops in temps through the cores from the original ones with CLU and DIRECT DIE mount.
> However...a loss of only 5c for putting normal paste on 2 CORES and then the other 2 CORES to have dropped 30c? Yeah sure - it was Intel's fault...
> That said who knows - but from my time of being part of this club, OC'ing PC's and building PC's for the last decade, I haven't notice ONCE a core that had a 30c difference from its other core, without touching anything (ie not de-lidding etc).


Yeah, me neither. The temp difference in that video before delidding is really extreme, and it could've been an error while mounting the CPU (not enough TIM, cooler not straight, etc) or indeed a production failure where the IHS doesn't have decent contact with the first cores. Although to be honest a user error is just so much more likely.
It's not entirely impossible though, I've heard reports where basically the whole inside of the PCB-IHS space was filled with termal paste.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Very valid points. Although if I ever had a chip like that, I would return it. But the guy thought, why waste time and delidded it. I wouldn't have ever done that. If the TIM application is done badly from the factory, what else could there be wrong with the chip?
I wouldn't have even thought twice about it.


----------



## sp00n82

Hm, I on the other hand would've probably gone the same route as the guy on the video.
If I have my new toy, I want to play with it immediately, and not wait another 3+ weeks before I can!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Fantastic result mate, top job that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is this on water?


...oh yeah, very much so, big custom loop


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Haha ever since someone posted that video, I've been told that I'm a idiot for thinking a 30c temp difference from cores WASN'T due to a poor mount, but instead due to Intel and their bad paste. I'm really laughing so much, it's like trying to teach a bunch of ignorant kids:
> http://www.youtube.com/all_comments?v=XXs0I5kuoX4&feature=em-comment_reply_received


Valgaur or I should say Razgriz946 (darn people taking my Valgaur name everywhere) has posted







let the learning begin.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Valgaur or I should say Razgriz946 (darn people taking my Valgaur name everywhere) has posted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> let the learning begin.


let the fun begin.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spoonium*
> 
> Hm, I on the other hand would've probably gone the same route as the guy on the video.
> If I have my new toy, I want to play with it immediately, and not wait another 3+ weeks before I can!


Haha yes, but I rather wait 3 weeks rather than break it for the future. More so, it should only take a week tops to get a replacement, as you don't have to go via Intel for this, but the reseller for faulty goods.
Who knows he might have bought a second hand one off eBay


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> My own


recon what you been up to lately mayne, you still runnin some 480s? What up with you homeboi??!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Valgaur or I should say Razgriz946 (darn people taking my Valgaur name everywhere) has posted
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> let the learning begin.


It was pretty weird on the OCN livestream at the last bench meet, everyone's OCN usernames were already taken by other people. Strange stuff....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It was pretty weird on the OCN livestream at the last bench meet, everyone's OCN usernames were already taken by other people. Strange stuff....


I agree. everyone had OCN at the end lol


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I agree. everyone had OCN at the end lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It was pretty weird on the OCN livestream at the last bench meet, everyone's OCN usernames were already taken by other people. Strange stuff....


...you mean there are two of me ? Preposterous


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...you mean there are two of me ? Preposterous


I've been submitting really low scoring LN2 cooled benchmarks at HWBot under your username for weeks....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I've been submitting really low scoring LN2 cooled benchmarks at HWBot under your username for weeks....


...well thank you










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> recon what you been up to lately mayne, you still runnin some 480s? What up with you homeboi??!


Yes pal, still running the old slab..


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys its been a while so I just wanted to stop by and say hi... so, hi!!! Lots of newbies around these parts now. I've been so busy over at the watercooling section working on my build log and getting together my loop. Ill be back though... ILL BE BACK


----------



## Joa3d43

*...new ROG Haswell mobo(s)...*

...for those contemplating a nice delidded Haswell upgrade and who like Asus ROG, here is a pic of the new Maximus VI Extreme Z87 board...

source wccftech


...but we know that TD is holding out for something special










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...new ROG Haswell mobo(s)...*
> 
> ...for those contemplating a nice delidded Haswell upgrade and who like Asus ROG, here is a pic of the new Maximus VI Extreme Z87 board...
> 
> source wccftech
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...but we know that TD is holding out for something special
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Is Haswell going to be able to be delidded? If it is, I really want to get it now...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Is Haswell going to be able to be delidded? If it is, I really want to get it now...


..from what I have read, because of tri-gate transistors, it apparently is a similar construction to Ivy and can be delidded..and probably should be because it seems to suffer from the same heat issues Ivy had in oc'ing per the first tests I have seen


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Is Haswell going to be able to be delidded? If it is, I really want to get it now...
> 
> 
> 
> ..from what I have read, because of tri-gate transistors, it apparently is a similar construction to Ivy and can be delidded..and probably should be because it seems to suffer from the same heat issues Ivy had in oc'ing per the first tests I have seen
Click to expand...

Those may just be the test CPUs and not the retail version. I'm not sure but I really hope it is like Ivy and you can delid it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Those may just be the test CPUs and not the retail version. I'm not sure but I really hope it is like Ivy and you can delid it.


...the guys I know who have confirmed it 'privately' are under NDA, but apparently you can buy Haswell production versions right now in little clear plastic bags in Hong Kong, China, Taiwan etc.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Those may just be the test CPUs and not the retail version. I'm not sure but I really hope it is like Ivy and you can delid it.


It has been confirmed by coolaler that retail have tim


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Those may just be the test CPUs and not the retail version. I'm not sure but I really hope it is like Ivy and you can delid it.
> 
> 
> 
> It has been confirmed by coolaler that retail have tim
Click to expand...

That's good, we're going to have to change this club into the Delidded Club rather than just Ivy bridge then.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I want the z87 OC by GB and the MVIG too...maybe the matx oc formula








Oh, and 10 4770ks, and don't forget the new EK cpu and ram pots!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...new ROG Haswell mobo(s)...*
> 
> ...for those contemplating a nice delidded Haswell upgrade and who like Asus ROG, here is a pic of the new Maximus VI Extreme Z87 board...
> 
> source wccftech
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...but we know that TD is holding out for something special
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


LOL TD dat toof!!!


----------



## sp00n82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> It has been confirmed by coolaler that retail have tim












You're going to have to be even more careful because of these new caps. Just screams for the vice method.








You should also probably cover them with something (silicone, clear coat) before applying CLU to the Die.


----------



## illuz

I have a feeling a lot of people are going to kill their new Haswell delidded chips!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spoonium*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're going to have to be even more careful because of these new caps. Just screams for the vice method.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should also probably cover them with something (silicone, clear coat) before applying CLU to the Die.


...good point re caps...I would (will?) use MX4 - non-conductive and non-capacitive, and a proven PCB-delid-a-scratch recovery tool


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> LOL TD dat toof!!!


hahaha


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...new ROG Haswell mobo(s)...*
> 
> ...for those contemplating a nice delidded Haswell upgrade and who like Asus ROG, here is a pic of the new Maximus VI Extreme Z87 board...
> 
> source wccftech
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...but we know that TD is holding out for something special
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


new asrock boards








http://www.overclock.net/t/1391229/cl-upcoming-asrock-z87-a-style-motherboard-features-leaked/0_20


----------



## ivanlabrie

I like the matx oc formula...


----------



## Hokies83

Black and yellow eh...

Transformer bumble bee build eh?

If Asrock comes out with this.. coating the big boys will as well just done better.

What they need to do is make it where pci-e slots can clip on and off so u can change the colors... would make said company much more attractive to buyers.

I think ive shared my Idea with Sin.. he is at computex now benching Haswell on LN2 for gigabyte and will share my idea with them.


----------



## martinhal

Will the Ivy-E have TIM ?


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Will the Ivy-E have TIM ?


Probably not.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

I'm going to be perfectly happy with my maximus v extreme and delidded 3770k for a couple more years. I see no need to drop $600 on a new mobo and cpu for minimal performance increase.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm going to be perfectly happy with my maximus v extreme and delidded 3770k for a couple more years. I see no need to drop $600 on a new mobo and cpu for minimal performance increase.


Broadwell DDR 4


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stay Puft*
> 
> Probably not.


...we'll find out soon...R-IV-E X79 just got a new (somewhat buggy) BIOS that includes 'support for new CPUs' a.k.a. for Ivy-E beta-testers - and that BIOS does change memory mapping...just what you would expect for Ivy-E...

...if Ivy-E has tri-gate transistors, I wonder how they're going to affix the IHS because tri-gate was supposed to be one of the major reasons Intel went to TIM w/Ivy/Haswell


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I'm going to be perfectly happy with my maximus v extreme and delidded 3770k for a couple more years. I see no need to drop $600 on a new mobo and cpu for minimal performance increase.


...I think coming from an MVE / 3770K, it really would not be worth it, unless Haswell turn out to oc better than Ivy's to the tune of 500MHz+ per given vCore


----------



## amd655

Can someone teach me what RIVE is please?


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Can someone teach me what RIVE is please?


https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/RAMPAGE_IV_EXTREME/


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> Can someone teach me what RIVE is please?


ASUS Rampage IV Extreme LGA 2011 Intel X79
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131802

= RIVE
EDIT: also MVE = Maximus V Extreme, MVG = Gene, etc. They are popular boards amongst competitive overclockers so they have acronyms for short.

Joa3d, we can fiddle with BCLK with Haswell do you reckon an i3 Haswell could make 4.0GHz+?


----------



## amd655

LOL silly little names....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> ASUS Rampage IV Extreme LGA 2011 Intel X79
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131802
> 
> = RIVE
> EDIT: also MVE = Maximus V Extreme, MVG = Gene, etc. They are popular boards amongst competitive overclockers so they have acronyms for short.
> 
> Joa3d, we can fiddle with BCLK with Haswell do you reckon an i3 Haswell could make 4.0GHz+?


...I know very little about i3 Haswells other than what's in the forums and such (i3 = 2 core?), but speaking more generally for Haswells, the CPU straps (100, 125, 167) are a great oc'ing tool, especially as with each strap setting, your BCLK automatically adjusts to that speed - but still opens the door for a further 5% to 7% oc'ing on BCLK alone...ditto for way more memory speed options.

...at the very least, you get way more 'granularity' in terms of speed setting and vcore options...so when you're near 'the wall' (the point where your CPU needs much more vcore for the next regular step up than the previous one), you don't just operate in 100MHz blocks, but much smaller increments, which is always better....4 GHz on a i3 Haswell does not sound unreasonable...


----------



## L36

Just as heads up, bought a E2200 dual core to practice for haswell. Razor blade method is hard, although i tried the vice and hammer and it took me literally 30 seconds to delid the CPU. With the razor I count not even penetrate corner... Highly recommend trying the vice and hammer method for people who have it, much easier to do...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Broadwell DDR 4


Mehh still not worth $600 to upgrade. If I was looking to upgrade from an older computer I definetly would jump right to Haswell, but I'll probably upgrade when the generation after Haswell comes out.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Mehh still not worth $600 to upgrade. If I was looking to upgrade from an older computer I definetly would jump right to Haswell, but I'll probably upgrade when the generation after Haswell comes out.


I will upgrade to broad well for free... Samething with 4 of my 7950s and the 8 = 12 HD 89XX i will be getting XD


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Just as heads up, bought a E2200 dual core to practice for haswell. Razor blade method is hard, although i tried the vice and hammer and it took me literally 30 seconds to delid the CPU. With the razor I count not even penetrate corner... Highly recommend trying the vice and hammer method for people who have it, much easier to do...


I looked at first at the bench vise method, but I did not felt confident about smacking it with a hammer and a piece of wood








Instead of that, I took a deep breath, set up my dinner hall table, and started looking around at my IHS edges for a gap to insert the only one old rusty stanley razor blade I found. Fortunately there was a corner with enough spacing to get the blade into, and just took 1 hour and a half to get all the black silicone glue cutted, all without a single scratch











I didn't realized how small the processor was when I first took it out after months of being installed


----------



## Totally Dubbed

haha yes it is a cute little thing


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> haha yes it is a cute little thing


That's what she said...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

hahaha


----------



## ivanlabrie

http://asia.cnet.com/necs-medias-x-smartphone-is-liquid-cooled-62221423.htm

I think they meant that's a heatpipe and not wc...no pump there.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> 
> 
> http://asia.cnet.com/necs-medias-x-smartphone-is-liquid-cooled-62221423.htm
> 
> I think they meant that's a heatpipe and not wc...no pump there.


They are confused about the vapor chamber, or the stock gpus be liquid cooled...


----------



## lilchronic




----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*


Better but id get aqua links to go between the gpus.


----------



## Shafty

im sure this has been answered before but if i were to delid my 3770k when i attach my h100i, is there anything i need to add to the cooler to make it seat right?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shafty*
> 
> im sure this has been answered before but if i were to delid my 3770k when i attach my h100i, is there anything i need to add to the cooler to make it seat right?


No. Assuming you are using the IHS, you just have to hold it down with a finger while you clamp it down to make sure it seats correctly. Then you can use any cooler you want, and it should work fine. I have used an H100i and H220 with my delidded chips without problems.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Better but id get aqua links to go between the gpus.


i just bought one















http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17052/ex-tub-1487/Bitspower_Adjustable_Aqua_Link_Pipe_II_41-69mm_-_Matte_Black_BP-MBDG14AALPII.html#blank

it was a pain in the ass to get that tube on there like that


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Man o man - was just looking at videos on how CPU's are made.
My mind is boggled.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i just bought one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17052/ex-tub-1487/Bitspower_Adjustable_Aqua_Link_Pipe_II_41-69mm_-_Matte_Black_BP-MBDG14AALPII.html#blank
> 
> it was a pain in the ass to get that tube on there like that


...now you get to drain the w-c loop and do it all over again







...speaking of which,: Has anyone got any experience with 'quick-disconnect' w-c fittings ? Do they actually work ? Contemplating addition of a few new things...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i just bought one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/17052/ex-tub-1487/Bitspower_Adjustable_Aqua_Link_Pipe_II_41-69mm_-_Matte_Black_BP-MBDG14AALPII.html#blank
> 
> it was a pain in the ass to get that tube on there like that


Get 2 better results. just turn the pump up a little bit.

Remember start in on far right and last block far left.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...now you get to drain the w-c loop and do it all over again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...speaking of which,: Has anyone got any experience with 'quick-disconnect' w-c fittings ? Do they actually work ? Contemplating addition of a few new things...


They work pretty well, I've never had a leak, they might lose a drop here & there on the disconnect but no real spills.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> They work pretty well, I've never had a leak, they might lose a drop here & there on the disconnect but no real spills.


Tx







I might try some of those...with a large loop w/9 tube pieces and 2.5L liquids, I don't feel like draining it every time I want to add s.th. (which is soon...)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...now you get to drain the w-c loop and do it all over again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...speaking of which,: Has anyone got any experience with 'quick-disconnect' w-c fittings ? Do they actually work ? Contemplating addition of a few new things...


MY koolance V4s leak.


----------



## alancsalt

I have two sets (Koolance Quick Disconnects) in use. Neither of them have ever leaked.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I have two sets (Koolance Quick Disconnects) in use. Neither of them have ever leaked.


My Female end has a steady drip. =/ why im not using it..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I have two sets (Koolance Quick Disconnects) in use. Neither of them have ever leaked.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My Female end has a steady drip. =/ why im not using it..


...fortunately, every one here is of 'pure mind' and wouldn't read any double meaning into any of this







...I think I'll get some quick disconnects to try out and hopefully, my female won't leak too much...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lmao


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My Female end has a steady drip. =/ why im not using it..


PT nuke can cure that


----------



## chronicfx

3x6mm screw will fit m4?

Edit: i meant to google that but if you can answer go ahead. Looking at anti vibration screws for xspc dual bay res.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> 3x6mm screw will fit m4?
> 
> Edit: i meant to google that but if you can answer go ahead. Looking at anti vibration screws for xspc dual bay res.


Does this help?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_case_screws


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Does this help?
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_case_screws


I read that its beyond me still lol


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I read that its beyond me still lol


I guess if the threading is diff then no
Can anyone find m4 anti vib screws. Tried o rings but i screwed right through them.


----------



## markallen1988

de-lidded ivy.PNG 2619k .PNG file


Haven't OCed past 4.3 yet, it was getting much too hot before delidding. 15C temp drop using CLU on the die and NT-H1 on top of the IHS. Temps before were hitting about 78C with 1.2v at 4.3 with a Noctua NH-D14, so 15C temp drop.

Oh, and I used a razor. Was going to do the vice method, but I couldn't wait and I had a razor available.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *markallen1988*
> 
> de-lidded ivy.PNG 2619k .PNG file
> 
> 
> Haven't OCed past 4.3 yet, it was getting much too hot before delidding. 15C temp drop using CLU on the die and NT-H1 on top of the IHS. Temps before were hitting about 78C with 1.2v at 4.3 with a Noctua NH-D14, so 15C temp drop.
> 
> Oh, and I used a razor. Was going to do the vice method, but I couldn't wait and I had a razor available.


Nicely done! Give me more info when you can/when you're ready


----------



## markallen1988

OCN name: markallen1988
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: NT-H1
Mhz gained: 200MHz
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: 23C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2808205

I had tested 4.5 at this voltage before, and hit 90C then so I dropped back down to 4.3. My highest temp doing IBT just now was 67C, so that is a 23C difference at this frequency!


----------



## stasio

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *markallen1988*
> 
> de-lidded ivy.PNG 2619k .PNG file
> 
> 
> Haven't OCed past 4.3 yet, it was getting much too hot before delidding. 15C temp drop using CLU on the die and NT-H1 on top of the IHS. Temps before were hitting about 78C with 1.2v at 4.3 with a Noctua NH-D14, so 15C temp drop.
> 
> Oh, and I used a razor. Was going to do the vice method, but I couldn't wait and I had a razor available.


Will be better to see with IBT running at least after 3-5 runs.
On IBT start temp is still low.
Btw,LinX is hotter.


----------



## markallen1988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stasio*
> 
> Will be better to see with IBT running at least after 3-5 runs.
> On IBT start temp is still low.
> Btw,LinX is hotter.


That was after 5 minutes running with 90% of my RAM utilized, takes about 20 minute a pass with 16GB RAM. I'll do another screenshot with the results after 10 runs of standard. I've bumped it up to 4.5GHz since that screenshot was taken.

EDIT: screenshots


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *markallen1988*
> 
> OCN name: markallen1988
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 200MHz
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: 23C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2808205
> 
> I had tested 4.5 at this voltage before, and hit 90C then so I dropped back down to 4.3. My highest temp doing IBT just now was 67C, so that is a 23C difference at this frequency!


Glad you like your temp differences!!! You're in!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *markallen1988*
> 
> That was after 5 minutes running with 90% of my RAM utilized, takes about 20 minute a pass with 16GB RAM. I'll do another screenshot with the results after 10 runs of standard. I've bumped it up to 4.5GHz since that screenshot was taken.
> 
> EDIT: screenshots


Grats


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...fortunately, every one here is of 'pure mind' and wouldn't read any double meaning into any of this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I think I'll get some quick disconnects to try out and hopefully, my female won't leak too much...


You will want to check it monthly for leaks


----------



## Joa3d43

*...fyi next gen*

...interesting thread re Haswell and 3970X...w/some positive implications for delidders who end up with the right sort of Ivy/Haswell (I added my














)

http://www.overclock.net/t/1392939/coolaler-4-6ghz-4770k-vs-5ghz-3970x-with-gtx-680s-in-quad-sli/50


----------



## Joa3d43

...another nice headline / post that suggests 'more delidding' coming







: *"The default fully loaded breaking 100 ° C i7-4770K retail air-cooled overclocking..."*









...not to clear about actual results of production versions in that test, but I have now read several times that Haswells 'get hot' ...ergo...delid or fry ?! >>> http://www.overclock.net/t/1393019/chinadiy-the-default-fully-loaded-breaking-100-c-i7-4770k-retail-air-cooled-overclocking-experience


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...another nice headline / post that suggests 'more delidding' coming
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> : *"The default fully loaded breaking 100 ° C i7-4770K retail air-cooled overclocking..."*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...not to clear about actual results of production versions in that test, but I have now read several times that Haswells 'get hot' ...ergo...delid or fry ?! >>> http://www.overclock.net/t/1393019/chinadiy-the-default-fully-loaded-breaking-100-c-i7-4770k-retail-air-cooled-overclocking-experience


Ill have to change the name of the thread to just the delidders club


----------



## alancsalt

Tri-Gate Delidders Club?


----------



## Scott1541

"Intel Delidders Club" would probably be better, keeps the AMD delidders away (if there are any around here)

Plus maybe get rid of the irrelevant requirements in the OP, like MHz gained, and anything else OC related as it doesn't really have anything to do with delidding directly.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Tri-Gate Delidders Club?


Lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> "Intel Delidders Club" would probably be better, keeps the AMD delidders away (if there are any around here)
> 
> Plus maybe get rid of the irrelevant requirements in the OP, like MHz gained, and anything else OC related as it doesn't really have anything to do with delidding directly.


I like the chance for people to show what they have gained from delidding also shows that it works to new people looking into it and that its worth it actually. But I will consider it.


----------



## alancsalt

Hey, I was just kidding..


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Lol
> I like the chance for people to show what they have gained from delidding also shows that it works to new people looking into it and that its worth it actually. But I will consider it.


IMO the temp drop is all people really need to see. Then they can draw their own conclusions from there as to whether it will benefit them or not. Everything else is dependent on the temp drop anyway, like how much higher the voltage and thus clock speed can be pushed up.


----------



## martinhal

Cant wait to see the Ivy-E results.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Cant wait to see the Ivy-E results.


Nice Defender you have there in your avatar







Is it yours?


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Nice Defender you have there in your avatar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it yours?


Thanks , yes , great for playing in the mud.





My land Rovers


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *martinhal*
> 
> Thanks , yes , great for playing in the mud.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My land Rovers


Not bad, not bad at all







I don't have any of my own but my dad has 2 right now, a Series 1 and a Freelander 2 (







), although 6 months ago he had a TDCi Defender 90









I need to get my own at some point though, I'm thinking maybe an older TDI Defender 90, Discovery, or even a Series 3 with a TDI engine after I finish uni (starting in september).


----------



## martinhal

The TDI is the way to go , the motor just lasts and lasts. The 90 was a TDI but not much packing space , one of the reasons I sold it. The 110 has way more space . The top pic is in the Kalahari where we had to live out of the car for two weeks .


----------



## Scott1541

I've always wanted to go on some kind of expedition, something like the old Camel Trophy maybe







Even a mini 'expedition' around the UK would be fun, down all of the muddy lanes and through puddles. Not quite as exciting as a desert or jungle, but better than nothing and a whole lot cheaper









The closest I've come to this so far is driving a Ford Fiesta down a farm track and through a ford (oh the irony)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Hey, I was just kidding..


...the ".*..delidding a day keeps the core-fever away.*.." club ? - ...never mind









...what scares me though to some extent is Ivy-E being _potentially_ deliddable...tri-gate transistors et al.....LGA2011 are BIG chips...more silicone glue...the pin pads are more sensitive...twice as many mem channels on the PCB...and the top-end 6+++ cores are not cheap...can you imagine taking an 8, 10 or 12 or even 15 core Ivy-E and screwing up the delid ? Oh dear...


----------



## illuz

Not for the faint hearted that's for sure


----------



## alancsalt

If it's a glued hottie though, someone will do it. Rest assured.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> If it's a glued hottie though, someone will do it. Rest assured.


'...moi aussi'







...best find a big knife and a nice quiet place to do it


----------



## alancsalt

But what about the hammer trick?


----------



## Hokies83

Waiting for Broadwell.

IB to Haswell looks like less performance then SB to IB.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> If it's a glued hottie though, someone will do it. Rest assured.


Freaky with expensive chips. I'll probably try beheading a 4770k, but for ivy-e think I'll just stick to better cooling.

I just hope they can do 6Ghz + like ivy instead of locked max like sandy...


----------



## ivanlabrie

I may go for an x79 board...with plenty of pci-e slots








3d benching here I come (quad 7970 anyone?)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I may go for an x79 board...with plenty of pci-e slots
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 3d benching here I come (quad 7970 anyone?)


...try this one (and not because of the colours







)

http://www.overclock.net/t/1377425/tpu-asus-launches-the-p9x79-e-ws-with-x16-link-4-way-graphics

...and for *AMD FANS:* http://www.amd.com/us/products/desktop/graphics/8000/pages/8000-series.aspx#2


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...try this one (and not because of the colours
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1377425/tpu-asus-launches-the-p9x79-e-ws-with-x16-link-4-way-graphics
> 
> ...and for *AMD FANS:* http://www.amd.com/us/products/desktop/graphics/8000/pages/8000-series.aspx#2


Read my mind, has a nice bios too and would be a nice jack of all trades, even for a server build.








I was thinking a modes ECS x79 board with 4 way sli support but well, that one is much nicer.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Read my mind, has a nice bios too and would be a nice jack of all trades, even for a server build.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was thinking a modes ECS x79 board with 4 way sli support but well, that one is much nicer.


...Asus WS series is rock solid, good BIOS support, good VRM - and of course *16x 4* PCIe...add two strong PSUs and 4x 8970s or so... then open a bottle of wine







and celebrate








...latest Asus X79 BIOS now have (early) support for IB-E, btw.

... and as you say - later on makes a good server too...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...Asus WS series is rock solid, good BIOS support, good VRM - and of course *16x 4* PCIe...add two strong PSUs and 4x 8970s or so... then open a bottle of wine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and celebrate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...latest Asus X79 BIOS now have (early) support for IB-E, btw.
> 
> ... and as you say - later on makes a good server too...


hmmm is that mobo wc able?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmm is that mobo wc able?


...in what sense ? You surely can cool the CPU and GPUs per w-c, but not sure there are custom w-c fittings available for VRMs etc if that's what you mean...but could make your own

...we're looking at that mobo for the fall for a commercial application that needs lots of solid fast PCIe slots...mobo also has dual Intel NICs


----------



## ivanlabrie

It's one of my favorite x79 boards...RIVE or that


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...try this one (and not because of the colours
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1377425/tpu-asus-launches-the-p9x79-e-ws-with-x16-link-4-way-graphics
> 
> ...and for *AMD FANS:* http://www.amd.com/us/products/desktop/graphics/8000/pages/8000-series.aspx#2


Looking at the 8970 specs it's a 7970 refresh. I was hoping the 20nm rumors would be true...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmm is that mobo wc able?


Keep in mind if still planning on some extreme cooling, you would probably have to pull the waterblocks off if you want to freeze it, or at least drain it so there isn't any water in them. Plain water doesn't like subzero much.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking at the 8970 specs it's a 7970 refresh. I was hoping the 20nm rumors would be true...
> Keep in mind if still planning on some extreme cooling, you would probably have to pull the waterblocks off if you want to freeze it, or at least drain it so there isn't any water in them. Plain water doesn't like subzero much.


I'm currently working on a way to quick disconnect the CPU block and having the chip already for LN2 for runs and just choosing pipping really so it will work just need to stop being picky. Workin on the designs right now as I type









(bought damn time right)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm currently working on a way to quick disconnect the CPU block and having the chip already for LN2 for runs and just choosing pipping really so it will work just need to stop being picky. Workin on the designs right now as I type
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (bought damn time right)


...this may come in handy for your build







http://www.overclock.net/t/1393232/hwbot-a-style-waterproof-by-conformal-coating-live-demo


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It's one of my favorite x79 boards...RIVE or that


...yup RIVE, very nice also







per...



....though the P9x79 WS is more versatile, but RIVE probably is a better 'clocker' ...would be nice to run the same chip / RAM in both and find out


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking at the 8970 specs it's a 7970 refresh. I was hoping the 20nm rumors would be true...
> Keep in mind if still planning on some extreme cooling, you would probably have to pull the waterblocks off if you want to freeze it, or at least drain it so there isn't any water in them. Plain water doesn't like subzero much.


I thought that the 8000 branding name is for the oem cpus, and mobile. Are they not skipping to 9970?


----------



## Hokies83

I do not think that is going to be the flag ship AMD gpu this gen it has the exact same specs as a 7970.


----------



## amd655

Oh my GOD

This is absolutely gorgeous.... is this for sale yet?

Please say it is.....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *amd655*
> 
> 
> 
> Oh my GOD
> 
> This is absolutely gorgeous.... is this for sale yet?
> 
> Please say it is.....


YES - ....being shipped now
















http://www.techpowerup.com/182235/asus-launches-the-p9x79-e-ws-with-x16-link-4-way-graphics.html


----------



## amd655

OH LORd..

Saving some pennies


----------



## Hokies83

I think the board is ugly it would have looked fine with the dark blue but the baby blue ruins it.


----------



## amd655

Considering the baby blue is only the Dimm slots and the SATA ports.....

You really are just picking fault lol.


----------



## Hokies83

Um yah i can be picky

It is ******ed using 2 different colors of blue on a board.. Why can they not use just the dark blue.. it looks great.. the baby blue is ugly.

It says Asus on it so it is prolly 25% over priced.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I thought that the 8000 branding name is for the oem cpus, and mobile. Are they not skipping to 9970?


I really hope so! The OEMs will be messing with people thinking the 8970 is some fancy new model...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Um yah i can be picky
> 
> It is ******ed using 2 different colors of blue on a board.. Why can they not use just the dark blue.. it looks great.. the baby blue is ugly.
> 
> It says Asus on it so it is prolly 25% over priced.


Colors mean little to me, if the board performs it can be snot green with diarrhea brown highlights. I have refused to buy a board I wanted because of gun & bullet heatsinks though, so can't say too much.
The ROG boards tend to be a bit more, but for someone who can make use of the features it is worth it.
Not sure about the WS board, I've only tried one WS for x58, think I used it for a day & never looked at another x58 Asus board. It sucked bad enough to turn me off Asus for the whole generation.
I'm sure the BIOS is far better now though.


----------



## Hokies83

But you did see that Gigabyte has the lowest RMA's and sell the most boards...

You know what that tells u who makes the better board


----------



## FtW 420

Gigabyte makes good boards that are generally priced very well, the ud3 models are probably the main reason they have the high sales. It is a helluva board for the money. Mine angers me but I try to push things harder than most.
Different boards almost always have their strengths, weaknesses & uses. I never have just 1, I always end up with multiple brands every generation. Asus has been my fav for 1155 & 2011, Gigabyte was my favorite for 1366 & 775, who knows what z87 will bring.

With less RMAs Gigabyte may be more reliable, but which has the highest overclocks & scores? Better still depends on the intended use.


----------



## Hokies83

Up7 was late to the show... but has over took Asus in plenty of the important benches.

Think if they used the same chip in the u-7 as they did those ME boards...


----------



## illuz

My next board will be Gigabyte. But my P8Z77-V Pro hasn't skipped a beat yet.


----------



## FtW 420

So far for z87 MSI is at the top of my list for favorites, I do plan on getting others as well though.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> So far for z87 MSI is at the top of my list for favorites, I do plan on getting others as well though.


Really? No z87 oc?
I'm not sure...I may go for a p8p67 ws revolution if I ever find one now...sell my MVG and save for a Haswell rig and an ln2 pot.
The p8p67 ws supports Ivy and has 7 pci-e slots








Gonna need a 1600w psu and 7 gpus now!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> So far for z87 MSI is at the top of my list for favorites, I do plan on getting others as well though.


...yeah, for those of us are not compelled by a specific brand, we're free to choose what we want...Having some commercial involvement in computing, I couldn't even list all the brands I have worked with since the mid-90ies

...right now, I am 'partial', if you like, to Asus and Gigabyte though also have good experiences w/some MSI products...though the above-referenced Asus WS board w/4x 16x x PCIe 3 simply has no direct counterpart as of now ...but I hope Gigabyte and MSI step up to the plate in that expanding market segment of $500 to $750 for the mobo...expensive to some but much cheaper to others used to Xeon board pricing


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Really? No z87 oc?
> I'm not sure...I may go for a p8p67 ws revolution if I ever find one now...sell my MVG and save for a Haswell rig and an ln2 pot.
> The p8p67 ws supports Ivy and has 7 pci-e slots
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gonna need a 1600w psu and 7 gpus now!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yeah, for those of us are not compelled by a specific brand, we're free to choose what we want...Having some commercial involvement in computing, I couldn't even list all the brands I have worked with since the mid-90ies
> 
> ...right now, I am 'partial', if you like, to Asus and Gigabyte though also have good experiences w/some MSI products...though the above-referenced Asus WS board w/4x 16x x PCIe 3 simply has no direct counterpart as of now ...but I hope Gigabyte and MSI step up to the plate in that expanding market segment of $500 to $750 for the mobo...expensive to some but much cheaper to others used to Xeon board pricing


I do plan on getting others, like Asrock z87 OC, the Gigabyte z87 OC & a ROG board as well, have to wait until after launch & see how people are doing with them. Not gonna look at new x79 boards until ivy-e is arriving, there will likely be more coming.
I don't really have a hard favorite manufacturer for mobos, more personal preference. I am a fanboy for Lightning gpus, other than that, it's pretty much up to performance (like the user title) & a little bit looks (no gun/bullet crap) & a little bit features.


----------



## ChaosAD

Which z77 mb would you get and which psu to pair it with a 3770k? It will be max oced on air and will run with no gpu. So a dvi out would be helpfull. I will use it as a dedicated wcg cruncher. Obviously i need the cheapest but most solid solution.


----------



## Valgaur

Thread name has changed for possible deliddings for Haswell. Will change if it can't be done.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Which z77 mb would you get and which psu to pair it with a 3770k? It will be max oced on air and will run with no gpu. So a dvi out would be helpfull. I will use it as a dedicated wcg cruncher. Obviously i need the cheapest but most solid solution.


The most efficient 400w psu you can find...Platinum and with good reviews.


----------



## alancsalt

HAHA! Now guys can knock the lids off ancient chips and join the club?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> HAHA! Now guys can knock the lids off ancient chips and join the club?


I think this club should be restricted for the newer CPUs. Not to bash on the older ones but it would mean that people could buy broken chips and delid them and still join. That would take out the integrity of the club in my perspective.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think this club should be restricted for the newer CPUs. Not to bash on the older ones but it would mean that people could buy broken chips and delid them and still join. That would take out the integrity of the club in my perspective.


I agree to a certain point I'll decide on what date of chip to go back to


----------



## Hokies83

Can u join for de lidding ur wife and posting pics ?


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think this club should be restricted for the newer CPUs. Not to bash on the older ones but it would mean that people could buy broken chips and delid them and still join. That would take out the integrity of the club in my perspective.


Why would anyone buy an old CPU and delid it just to join this club? I don't think anyone on OCN is that desperate, this isn't exactly an exclusive club that people are itching to join







I'm not an official member as I don't quite have all of the required entry details, so I don't have the 'official badge'. I'm not bothered though, I've delidded so I'm coming in anyway


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Why would anyone buy an old CPU and delid it just to join this club? I don't think anyone on OCN is that desperate, this isn't exactly an exclusive club that people are itching to join
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not an official member as I don't quite have all of the required entry details, so I don't have the 'official badge'. I'm not bothered though, I've delidded so I'm coming in anyway


but.... I thought we were exclusive and prestigious.......


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Can u join for de lidding ur wife and posting pics ?


only if you got pic's
zoomed in and high resolution


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> only if you got pic's
> zoomed in and high resolution


I has those pics


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> but.... I thought we were exclusive and prestigious.......


Don't worry, it's going to be alright


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Can u join for de lidding ur wife and posting pics ?


hahahaha

Wait a minute.
I should call 911.


----------



## Belial

Does Coollaboratory liquid ultra go bad?

I have a tube of this stuff, I've only used half of it, and like it wouldn't come out, it was stuck. So I used a needle to sort of push it around, unplug it, and it's just all powder. I'm thiking either 2 things happened, 1 is that when I used the stuff some of the solid stuff in it got clumped and I just sort of pushed only the liquid out (like liquid through a cheesecloth or sponge), or the stuff went bad (i always cover it, only used it twice...).

Like I got half a tube, and it's all just like powder. It doesnt even really seem dried out, it just seems like the powder stuff or something. Maybe I should RMA? I mean this is a serious jip...

I unplugged it, i pull the plunger all the way back, and I can just shake it around, just clumps/powder stuff. When I pull a bit out with the needle... it's all just sort of fine powder. I've only had it a few months, surely others have a similar experience?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does Coollaboratory liquid ultra go bad?
> 
> I have a tube of this stuff, I've only used half of it, and like it wouldn't come out, it was stuck. So I used a needle to sort of push it around, unplug it, and it's just all powder. I'm thiking either 2 things happened, 1 is that when I used the stuff some of the solid stuff in it got clumped and I just sort of pushed only the liquid out (like liquid through a cheesecloth or sponge), or the stuff went bad (i always cover it, only used it twice...).
> 
> Like I got half a tube, and it's all just like powder. It doesnt even really seem dried out, it just seems like the powder stuff or something. Maybe I should RMA? I mean this is a serious jip...
> 
> I unplugged it, i pull the plunger all the way back, and I can just shake it around, just clumps/powder stuff. When I pull a bit out with the needle... it's all just sort of fine powder. I've only had it a few months, surely others have a similar experience?


I haven't myself.
I would contact CL about it tbh - doesn't sound right.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> hahahaha
> 
> Wait a minute.
> I should call 911.


Think he means taking the top off, not beheading.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does Coollaboratory liquid ultra go bad?
> 
> I have a tube of this stuff, I've only used half of it, and like it wouldn't come out, it was stuck. So I used a needle to sort of push it around, unplug it, and it's just all powder. I'm thiking either 2 things happened, 1 is that when I used the stuff some of the solid stuff in it got clumped and I just sort of pushed only the liquid out (like liquid through a cheesecloth or sponge), or the stuff went bad (i always cover it, only used it twice...).
> 
> Like I got half a tube, and it's all just like powder. It doesnt even really seem dried out, it just seems like the powder stuff or something. Maybe I should RMA? I mean this is a serious jip...
> 
> I unplugged it, i pull the plunger all the way back, and I can just shake it around, just clumps/powder stuff. When I pull a bit out with the needle... it's all just sort of fine powder. I've only had it a few months, surely others have a similar experience?


Just looked a partial tube of liquid pro that is a couple months old & it is still liquidy. Was the cap tight on yours?


----------



## Belial

Here's Pics:

I push and I push but I can't get it out!



Then I pull back on the plunger, and it's still all clumped as above.. I use a needle to push it around (or, if I didn't squeeze too hard, I can just tap the syringe)



And I push again


Quote:


> Just looked a partial tube of liquid pro that is a couple months old & it is still liquidy. Was the cap tight on yours?


of course, always tight. I would always put it in the original packaging as well, and you can't really put it in there without the cap being tight. This actually was an issue the last time I used the stuff too, but enough liquid came out that I was able to finish the application and figured that the next time I needed to use the stuff, I'd use a needle to unplug it and it'd surely be fine.

I feel like some sort of cheesecloth affect occurred. I mean I don't want to go after Coolaboratory if it's not their fault, but is this an issue of a faulty product, or user error (did i forget to shake it before every use or something?).

And what happens if you do forget the cap? Is the stuff prone to drying out? If this is an affect of drying out, then there must be user error and that's that and maybe I just didn't put the cap on tight enough (i really doubt that, I work with syringes at my job...). So just curious if anyone has had this happen to them. But there is nothing on the box about the stuff drying out or _needing_ to be capped, and at one of my jobs we just had tons of different pastes sitting around with no caps or partially topped and they never dried out (i'd never treat my own paste like that of course, but coworkers would and well if you have 20 tubes of mx-4 and as5 and nothing bad happens...)

ugh this sucks, there was a reason I pulled it out ;/


----------



## FtW 420

I didn't know if the cap on or off would make a difference, if the cap was on yours doesn't look like it matters.
This is the first time I've had liquid TIM sitting in the syringe, had no idea it could dry out. I should probably use up the rest sooner than later just in case...


----------



## MKHunt

So the verdict.... shoot it up before it dries out? If I inject enough CLP maybe I can become Wolverine.


----------



## stickg1

I have a couple of old tubes of Pro and Ultra, all still liquidy.

My buddy gave me a tube of some different German LM TIM. It just says "Paste LM" 1.0 Gramm and the rest is in German. Looks identical to the CL Pro.

Edit: And I just look off the cap and tried to squeeze a little out to check the consistency and it sprayed all over my keyboard and monitor, nice!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have a couple of old tubes of Pro and Ultra, all still liquidy.
> 
> My buddy gave me a tube of some different German LM TIM. It just says "Paste LM" 1.0 Gramm and the rest is in German. Looks identical to the CL Pro.
> 
> Edit: And I just look off the cap and tried to squeeze a little out to check the consistency and it sprayed all over my keyboard and monitor, nice!


...don't lick it off - or you want to go and bite a Wolverine


----------



## Molokou

Good news!

Seems like my set of LMP/LMU arrived without any trouble to my city and amazingly it did in less than 2 weeks all the way from Germany to México using registered mail











It hasn't been delivered to my office yet, but it is sitting on a temporary P.O. Box at the Mail Office that corresponds to that zip code.

I'll check in the morning if it has been already sent to the office or if it keeps sitting in the P.O. Box, and then depending about what the tracking history says perhaps I'll have to personally pick it up and end my cravings


----------



## Joa3d43

*@Valgaur*

...with the name change - you need an updated / new logo on p1 / Avatar


----------



## amd655

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have a couple of old tubes of Pro and Ultra, all still liquidy.
> 
> My buddy gave me a tube of some different German LM TIM. It just says "Paste LM" 1.0 Gramm and the rest is in German. Looks identical to the CL Pro.
> 
> Edit: And I just look off the cap and tried to squeeze a little out to check the consistency and it sprayed all over my keyboard and monitor, nice!


Easy tiger


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *@Valgaur*
> 
> ...with the name change - you need an updated / new logo on p1 / Avatar


very true! Anyone up to do a new logo/sign for the club? I suck at that kind of stuff


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Very random








I got skins for my Xbox and other devices - and it had the monster logo on one of the Xbox skins (titanium):
So I took it, and put the sticker by the ON button of my PC







Looks sexy and like an animal!

__
http://instagr.am/p/Zsm5QXywXj%2F/


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool!









I only had one g.skill sticker on my cm 690 II but peeled it off now...I'm gonna mod the case and that would disrupt the theme.


----------



## luciddreamer124

I'm afraid my 3770k has become a very expensive keychain. I had it delidded for months, it was fine until I tried using the EK naked ivy mount, too much damn liquid pro will do it












Does anyone know a way of safeguarding against this? Obviously next time I will use less paste, but just in case, is there some sort of non conductive coating I could put on that area?


----------



## justanoldman

^Sorry, not really sure what I am looking at. What exactly is wrong with the chip? How can using too much TIM hurt it? Have you confirmed that there is a problem? I have gotten Ultra on the green part of the pcb, many, many, times with no problems.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> I'm afraid my 3770k has become a very expensive keychain. I had it delidded for months, it was fine until I tried using the EK naked ivy mount, too much damn liquid pro will do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does anyone know a way of safeguarding against this? Obviously next time I will use less paste, but just in case, is there some sort of non conductive coating I could put on that area?


your mount could be to tight


----------



## luciddreamer124

Well the system won't boot, and there is the CPU red LED is on on the motherboard. I thought the liquid pro would have shorted the chip on start up?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Well the system won't boot, and there is the CPU red LED is on on the motherboard. I thought the liquid pro would have shorted the chip on start up?


Nope, don't think so.
As my friend Lilchonic posted, too much pressure on the chip, or too little if you were overly cautious. Most people say it takes several tries to get a direct to die pressure just right.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Well the system won't boot, and there is the CPU red LED is on on the motherboard. I thought the liquid pro would have shorted the chip on start up?


what does debug led say, erroe code #


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Well the system won't boot, and there is the CPU red LED is on on the motherboard. I thought the liquid pro would have shorted the chip on start up?


first off unplug you 24pina nd the 8pin of the mobo do a full shut down and leave the rocker on the psu off and unplug the system. Then let it sit for 5-10 mins to get rid of static powa. Then take you mount and put it on VERY gently. it doesnt need much for the mount to be tight against the die. to much pressure and nothing will happen.

let us know whats the outcome and we can keep diagnosing it.


----------



## lilchronic

i had that problem when i first installed my ek supreme waterblock, it was on to tight and i was like shoot it wont boot what the heck. lolz







, i cant remember what dr debug read but i just loosened the pressure a bit and bam it boot right up
actually i dont think it even gave an error code from being to tight ?


----------



## Scott1541

Doesn't the top clamp need to come off if you're using direct die? Also unless there is something between the clamp and PCB to add extra depth where the IHS was it won't be holding the chip in place properly, so that could be the problem.


----------



## luciddreamer124

Thanks for the advice. I hope I haven't killed it just by fiddling around through this whole lmao


----------



## luciddreamer124

Do you recommend putting paste on the underside of the water block and on the chip or just the chip?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Do you recommend putting paste on the underside of the water block and on the chip or just the chip?


Depends on how much you use and the individual person. If you put any on the waterblock it is just a very thin layer, there shouldn't be any extra TIM at all. Or you can just put it on the die, people do both.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> first off unplug you 24pina nd the 8pin of the mobo do a full shut down and leave the rocker on the psu off and unplug the system. Then let it sit for 5-10 mins to get rid of static powa. Then take you mount and put it on VERY gently. it doesnt need much for the mount to be tight against the die. to much pressure and nothing will happen.
> 
> let us know whats the outcome and we can keep diagnosing it.


^^^ that's certainly step 1. Usually, when running 'bare die', the CPU latch mechanism is also taken off per those 3 torx screws - by leaving the IHS off but the CPU latch mechanism on, you fundamentally changed the CPU pin alignment / pressure 'depth'... EK does sell a 'bare-die' mounting kit (less than EU 5), and per other comments, it is also possible to do it without that just by trying to find the right 'looseness / tightness ' of the CPU block mount.

Just as an 'interim measure', you might want to carefully wipe off the CL-P and re-apply a bit less if you are worried about the excess amount, than use the IHS, re-assemble after doing what Valgaur suggested and see if it boots...unless there also scratches on the PCB, this should work. ...hope it works out


----------



## luciddreamer124

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Doesn't the top clamp need to come off if you're using direct die? Also unless there is something between the clamp and PCB to add extra depth where the IHS was it won't be holding the chip in place properly, so that could be the problem.


Well I didn't do this. So I have to take off the latch mechanism?


----------



## luciddreamer124

Ya I bought the EK mount which is why I'm doing this


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Well I didn't do this. So I have to take off the latch mechanism?


You have the EK naked Ivy right? Did you read the instructions? Step 1 is removing the latch.
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IM/EK-IM-3830046990884.pdf


----------



## Solonowarion

Check for socket pins meticulously.


----------



## luciddreamer124

You guys are so damn helpful. Hope is a good thing


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You have the EK naked Ivy right? Did you read the instructions? Step 1 is removing the latch.
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/EK-IM/EK-IM-3830046990884.pdf


oh wow i thought the point of the ek naked die was so you can keep the latch on while still making contact with the die
+1 you old man







lolz


----------



## luciddreamer124

YEEESSS!!

















I totally mounted that completely wrong lmao, it's working now.
I appreciate all of the quick and helpful advice. You guys are the best!!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> YEEESSS!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I totally mounted that completely wrong lmao, it's working now.
> I appreciate all of the quick and helpful advice. You guys are the best!!


...congrats !!!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> YEEESSS!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I totally mounted that completely wrong lmao, it's working now.
> I appreciate all of the quick and helpful advice. You guys are the best!!


AWSOME!


----------



## Hokies83

Well when i tested to see if it was the WB or the chip.. I just booted the PC with no heatsink on it... Your safe all the way to windows loads *" at stock Vcore "*

But mine boots into windows in like 7 seconds..so maybe not if ur using a HDD. but enough to get to the windows logo screen and hitting the power button.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Glad to hear it is working.
Valgaur's advice is also very useful for shorts.
He helped me revive mine, by following those steps.
Always a good keynote.


----------



## luciddreamer124

Temps are a solid 4-5 degrees cooler now









Idles are the most significant difference. Before, CPU idled at around 35, now its in the mid 20s


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> Temps are a solid 4-5 degrees cooler now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Idles are the most significant difference. Before, CPU idled at around 35, now its in the mid 20s


...cool(er)







so to speak...you MIGHT even find that you can reduce vCore just a bit at any given speed...also comes down to your overall cooling solution, though...if you can get stable at slightly less vcore, your load temps will drop further


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luciddreamer124*
> 
> YEEESSS!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I totally mounted that completely wrong lmao, it's working now.
> I appreciate all of the quick and helpful advice. You guys are the best!!


No problem! glad we got it all sorted correctly!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Glad to hear it is working.
> Valgaur's advice is also very useful for shorts.
> He helped me revive mine, by following those steps.
> Always a good keynote.


Yours was a bit difficult that took a lot of time lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only had one g.skill sticker on my cm 690 II but peeled it off now...I'm gonna mod the case and that would disrupt the theme.


I love hardware stickers.... The 3960x is worth the extra $500 over the 3930k just for the black sticker if you ask me LOL.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I love hardware stickers.... The 3960x is worth the extra $500 over the 3930k just for the black sticker if you ask me LOL.


wanna buy me a 3960x? pwetty pwease!


----------



## ivanlabrie

Wanna buy my 3770k sticker lol?

I couldn't care less for those...normally lose them when opening stuff up.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hey my monster logo sticker is sexy mkay?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Wanna buy my 3770k sticker lol?]
> I couldn't care less for those...normally lose them when opening stuff up.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wanna buy me a 3960x? pwetty pwease!


Nope, lol. Waiting for ivy-e


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Hey my monster logo sticker is sexy mkay?


I bet your $1000 hdmi cable from monster is also sexy. jk lol


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I bet your $1000 hdmi cable from monster is also sexy. jk lol


hahaha
No my £8 optical cable is sexier - nom nom nom




It also goes well now with my sexy baby, my Xbox360S:

__
http://instagr.am/p/ZMiOEUSwcA%2F/


----------



## Hokies83

I have a Galaxy Decal that only Galaxy employees have









Galaxy has been very good to me.. i just wish they made Amd gpu's to..


----------



## TSXmike

Nerve racking!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does Coollaboratory liquid ultra go bad?
> 
> I have a tube of this stuff, I've only used half of it, and like it wouldn't come out, it was stuck. So I used a needle to sort of push it around, unplug it, and it's just all powder. I'm thiking either 2 things happened, 1 is that when I used the stuff some of the solid stuff in it got clumped and I just sort of pushed only the liquid out (like liquid through a cheesecloth or sponge), or the stuff went bad (i always cover it, only used it twice...).
> 
> Like I got half a tube, and it's all just like powder. It doesnt even really seem dried out, it just seems like the powder stuff or something. Maybe I should RMA? I mean this is a serious jip...
> 
> I unplugged it, i pull the plunger all the way back, and I can just shake it around, just clumps/powder stuff. When I pull a bit out with the needle... it's all just sort of fine powder. I've only had it a few months, surely others have a similar experience?


When it clogs like that just put it in the sink and run how water over it for a couple minutes. That should make it liquid form again.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I have a Galaxy Decal that only Galaxy employees have
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Galaxy has been very good to me.. i just wish they made Amd gpu's to..


really how does it look?
I'm intrigued.

I also have the title of being world number 1 in the world, for ROM videos of the S1 and S3.
No one has that








Come at me bro


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wanna buy me a 3960x? pwetty pwease!


...should have asked for a 3970X







- and quite a steal compared to the Xeon 4610 for those of us who also make their machines work for a living.... but if we're selling stickers, I've got a black 3970x, 6x 3770s and a pile of Xeons...offers ?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> really how does it look?
> I'm intrigued.
> 
> I also have the title of being world number 1 in the world, for ROM videos of the S1 and S3.
> No one has that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Come at me bro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *


In 1999 2000 and 2001 I won 3 State wrestling champion ships

In 2002 i won the State games and qualified for olympic try outs.

In 2004 i was flown to Japan where my clan won a CTF Unreal tournament

2007 I was flown to new york where i finished 2nd in the world in RFO tournament!

Now im half blind and lose to 8 yearolds in FPS LoL.

But the case badge is not a big deal..

I do however love the shirt they sent me!






Not in the shape i was once in but still decent..


Thats whats up yo..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TSXmike*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nerve racking!


...yup - and congrats for NOT spilling blood










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Epic Hookies! Good job







!!


----------



## Molokou

YIPEEE!!

It is here!!!








And look at those wonderful stamps!











I'm still amazed about how quick it arrived here








I placed my order on May 14th, and it practically was knocking at my door on the 24th!











Now I need to search into this thread for the CLU on-die application, I've never been into contact with this kind of product before








I'll appreciate if someone can point me in the right direction if I fail at finding that info


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> YIPEEE!!
> 
> It is here!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And look at those wonderful stamps!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm still amazed about how quick it arrived here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I placed my order on May 14th, and it practically was knocking at my door on the 24th!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I need to search into this thread for the CLU on-die application, I've never been into contact with this kind of product before
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll appreciate if someone can point me in the right direction if I fail at finding that info


...honestly, best just to go to CL's web site...they have YouTube video of how to apply it on the IHS (very thinly)...same holds for the on-die application...I used the included little red-handle brush, making sure no hairs got stuck on the die (same for Q-tip)...just remember that CL-U is Liquid Metal and thus capacitive and conductive...you don't want any squeezing off onto the PCB (or your mobo) where contact points are.

...really just take a small drop and 'paint it on' for full coverage without excess...and also: Do *not use* it for sub-zero applications


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Guys -I know we had a discussion about the Noobtooth Z77.
Anyone have any suggestions for this guy:

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/1ex1nr/build_ready_looking_for_a_new_highend_pc

He PM'ed me on YouTube and want to help him out








I suggest the Gigabyte U range and the MSI Mpower - good choices?
What would you guys suggest?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Guys -I know we had a discussion about the Noobtooth Z77.
> Anyone have any suggestions for this guy:
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/1ex1nr/build_ready_looking_for_a_new_highend_pc
> 
> He PM'ed me on YouTube and want to help him out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I suggest the Gigabyte U range and the MSI Mpower - good choices?
> What would you guys suggest?


I make fun of the sabertooth but it isn't really a terrible board, just has gimmicky goofy armor. For most people shooting for an average 4.5ghz OC it really isn't bad.
I usually recommend other stuff like the GB UP boards or mpower in case they change their mind about limited overclocks, I imagine a lot of people start a build planning on a nice safe 4.2Ghz OC, but then once it is built & they start to play with it they want more.
When I first joined here building my first rig in 10 years I got some of the stuff that was recommended, & was replacing things 2 months later for higher end.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Haha ok


----------



## lucas.vulcan

OCN name: lucas.vulcan
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: MX-4
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.5GHZ
Temp drops: OCCT 8h = 68-74-78-77 for each cores
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2813551

for best results you advise me which:

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
Coollaboratory Liquid PRO
Arctic Silver 5
Prolimatech PK-3


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Does Coollaboratory liquid ultra go bad?
> 
> I have a tube of this stuff, I've only used half of it, and like it wouldn't come out, it was stuck. So I used a needle to sort of push it around, unplug it, and it's just all powder. I'm thiking either 2 things happened, 1 is that when I used the stuff some of the solid stuff in it got clumped and I just sort of pushed only the liquid out (like liquid through a cheesecloth or sponge), or the stuff went bad (i always cover it, only used it twice...).
> 
> Like I got half a tube, and it's all just like powder. It doesnt even really seem dried out, it just seems like the powder stuff or something. Maybe I should RMA? I mean this is a serious jip...
> 
> I unplugged it, i pull the plunger all the way back, and I can just shake it around, just clumps/powder stuff. When I pull a bit out with the needle... it's all just sort of fine powder. I've only had it a few months, surely others have a similar experience?
> 
> 
> 
> When it clogs like that just put it in the sink and run how water over it for a couple minutes. That should make it liquid form again.
Click to expand...

haha thanks but that didn't work at all. it's just powder in there. There is a tiny, tiny piece of liquid metal as it should be, like the tiniest of drops. There's some sort of cheesecloth affect going on or something here.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lucas.vulcan*
> 
> OCN name: lucas.vulcan
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: MX-4
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5GHZ
> Temp drops: OCCT 8h = 68-74-78-77 for each cores
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2813551
> 
> for best results you advise me which:
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Coollaboratory Liquid PRO
> Arctic Silver 5
> Prolimatech PK-3


...I've had the best results with Coollaboratory *Liquid Ultra* (see temps in spoiler)...for non liquid-metal situations, I prefer MX4


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> haha thanks but that didn't work at all. it's just powder in there. There is a tiny, tiny piece of liquid metal as it should be, like the tiniest of drops. There's some sort of cheesecloth affect going on or something here.


Powder form eh?

Take some up the nostril and see if you get a buzz.


----------



## lucas.vulcan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I've had the best results with Coollaboratory *Liquid Ultra* (see temps in spoiler)...for non liquid-metal situations, I prefer MX4
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Merci Joad3d43
I already use the MX-4 but as you can see the time around 80 C, I will take the L-ULTRA but looking on another forum (I just read on the net that sometimes assembly is welded very strong between the cooler and the ihs) is discouraged me when do you think?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lucas.vulcan*
> 
> Merci Joad3d43
> I already use the MX-4 but as you can see the time around 80 C, I will take the L-ULTRA but looking on another forum (I just read on the net that sometimes assembly is welded very strong between the cooler and the ihs) is discouraged me when do you think?


I have posted a lot about this, and I can go into detail if you want. To keep it simple just use Ultra on the die, and any good TIM on the IHS. You might get better temps with Ultra on the IHS too, but it depends on your particular setup and how well your IHS and cooler match up. Best case is usually 3c better with Ultra on the IHS vs. some other good TIM.

On the die you definitely want to use a liquid metal TIM though. If you do use Ultra on the IHS it will most likely dry out over time, and you will have to use just a bit of force to pull them apart, but it is really not a big deal. All the residue will clean up with metal polish. I use Ultra on the IHS for both my chips, but I don't recommend it to people unless they are prepared to go through the trouble of cleaning it up when you eventually pull them apart.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lucas.vulcan*
> 
> Merci Joad3d43
> I already use the MX-4 but as you can see the time around 80 C, I will take the L-ULTRA but looking on another forum (I just read on the net that sometimes assembly is welded very strong between the cooler and the ihs) is discouraged me when do you think?


...I have used Liquid Ultra on both the die AND the IHS on several assemblies without any problem...as far as I recall, Liquid Ulltra on the IHS (in addition to Liquid Ultra on the die) lowered my temps a further 3.5 to 5 C compared to MX4 on the IHS (the latter I tend to use when I have a very concave IHS / convex CPU block as you have to use liquid metal solutions sparingly - not enough to bridge concave/convex spaces).

I add that on the occasion when I had to removed the TIM (ie when upgrading a water-block), the Liquid Ultra came off the IHS fine with a careful cleaning w/Isoporpanol - no 'eating' the laser-edged Intel codes etc after 2-3 mth at least... Bon chance


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...honestly, best just to go to CL's web site...they have YouTube video of how to apply it on the IHS (very thinly)...same holds for the on-die application...I used the included little red-handle brush, making sure no hairs got stuck on the die (same for Q-tip)...just remember that CL-U is Liquid Metal and thus capacitive and conductive...you don't want any squeezing off onto the PCB (or your mobo) where contact points are.
> 
> ...really just take a small drop and 'paint it on' for full coverage without excess...and also: Do *not use* it for sub-zero applications


I took your advice and tried to do my best








At first I thought there was especial directions about the on-die application, that's why I asked









When I first pushed the plunger the LM didn't came out, and then suddenly a big drop appeared and I had to suck it back to the syringe (or at least tried to)








The die after using the tiny red brush:



I know I used a lot but that thing was hard to control out of the syringe hahaha

My idle temps keep in the mid 30s, but after some testing with Prime95 (blend test) my final thoughts are that the new max sits around 72°C whereas before delidding they were around 90°C

*BEFORE DELIDDING:* In this test I used a blend test for ~15 minutes with a previous version of Prime95 (didn't know there was a new optimized one lol)

*FREQ:* 4600.00Mhz
*Vcore:* 1.336V
*POWER CONSUPTION:* 91.4W
*MAX TEMPS:* 84 92 89 85



*AFTER DELIDDING:* For this test I used a blend test for ~45 minutes with the latest version of Prime95:

*FREQ:* 4600.12Mhz
*Vcore:* 1.336V
*POWER CONSUPTION:* 98.7W
*MAX TEMPS:* 70 74 74 73



This means a 18°C temp drop from hottest core even considering that the before-delid tests were done with lower ambient temps








I would like to do more testing in a controlled ambient temp, because where I live we have pretty high temps nowadays (above 30°C most of the day)

Time to correct this info then:

*on die-TIM:* CooLaboratory Liquid Metal Ultra
*ihs-TIM:* Arctic Cooling MX-4
*Mhz gained:* NA
*OC after delid:* 4600.09Mhz
*Temp drops:* ~18°C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2813657
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and also: Do *not use* it for sub-zero applications


I didn't knew about this!
Due to what?









I don't do any sub-zero (only near-zero







) cooling but I would like to know =P


----------



## ivanlabrie

It hardens and stops transferring heat properly below certain temps...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> I took your advice and tried to do my best
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...I don't do any sub-zero (only near-zero
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) cooling but I would like to know =P


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> It hardens and stops transferring heat properly below certain temps...


...per Ivan's reply...it 'pumps out' at sub zero quicker than you can pull the power plug as your CPU temp shoot up







...this I know from FtW420 (OCN Benchmark Editor) who apparently watched this happening within a few seconds of kicking in 'sub-zero'...









...furthermore...for some reasons, if you re-assemble your delidded Ivy with MX4 or MX2 and then go sub-zero, it will not oc as high as it would have if you never delidded it in the first place...so 'subzero guys' tend to look for CPUs that have never been deldded when they go 'binning'...all that said, unless you plan to freeze things below 0 (never mind down to -189 or more), delidding w/LM is the way to go


----------



## hurleyef

OCN name: hurleyef
CPU: i5 3570k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid: 4.8 GHz
Temp drops: 15c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2814412


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lucas.vulcan*
> 
> OCN name: lucas.vulcan
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: MX-4
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5GHZ
> Temp drops: OCCT 8h = 68-74-78-77 for each cores
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2813551
> 
> for best results you advise me which:
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Coollaboratory Liquid PRO
> Arctic Silver 5
> Prolimatech PK-3


You're in!







Slap a new sig on and be proud of it!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> I took your advice and tried to do my best
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At first I thought there was especial directions about the on-die application, that's why I asked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When I first pushed the plunger the LM didn't came out, and then suddenly a big drop appeared and I had to suck it back to the syringe (or at least tried to)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The die after using the tiny red brush:
> 
> 
> 
> I know I used a lot but that thing was hard to control out of the syringe hahaha
> 
> My idle temps keep in the mid 30s, but after some testing with Prime95 (blend test) my final thoughts are that the new max sits around 72°C whereas before delidding they were around 90°C
> 
> *BEFORE DELIDDING:* In this test I used a blend test for ~15 minutes with a previous version of Prime95 (didn't know there was a new optimized one lol)
> 
> *FREQ:* 4600.00Mhz
> *Vcore:* 1.336V
> *POWER CONSUPTION:* 91.4W
> *MAX TEMPS:* 84 92 89 85
> 
> 
> 
> *AFTER DELIDDING:* For this test I used a blend test for ~45 minutes with the latest version of Prime95:
> 
> *FREQ:* 4600.12Mhz
> *Vcore:* 1.336V
> *POWER CONSUPTION:* 98.7W
> *MAX TEMPS:* 70 74 74 73
> 
> 
> 
> This means a 18°C temp drop from hottest core even considering that the before-delid tests were done with lower ambient temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would like to do more testing in a controlled ambient temp, because where I live we have pretty high temps nowadays (above 30°C most of the day)
> 
> Time to correct this info then:
> 
> *on die-TIM:* CooLaboratory Liquid Metal Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Arctic Cooling MX-4
> *Mhz gained:* NA
> *OC after delid:* 4600.09Mhz
> *Temp drops:* ~18°C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2813657
> I didn't knew about this!
> Due to what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't do any sub-zero (only near-zero
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) cooling but I would like to know =P


DENIED! kidding









You're in as well Nice results as well! Same thing with the sig slap it somewhere!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hurleyef*
> 
> OCN name: hurleyef
> CPU: i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4.8 GHz
> Temp drops: 15c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2814412


Almost missed ya! You're in as well good sir!


----------



## wRRM

Im going to delid my 3770k and was looking for something to clean the TIM off with.

Is 98,9% Isopropyl alcohol safe to use?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I think it is yes. That's what was in arcticlean from what I remember


----------



## wRRM

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I think it is yes. That's what was in arcticlean from what I remember


Awesome, i've used methylated spirit in the past but i've heard it can contain traces of oil of some sort.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wRRM*
> 
> Im going to delid my 3770k and was looking for something to clean the TIM off with.
> 
> Is 98,9% Isopropyl alcohol safe to use?


Yes, high concentrate isopropyl alcohol is a good choice. I used q-tips with it, you just have to make sure you don't leave any bits or hairs of anything you use on the die. Old credit card works well to remove the glue.


----------



## TwirlyWhirly555

Delidded my first ivy bridge , its a Pentium G2020 and it survived , took 4 hits to removed the IHS . I have yet to get a good TIM to see if I got any temp drops , before delid idle was 30 C , 100% 42 C on stock cooler . I mainly did delided it to see if I could









I used isopropanol alcohol on my ivy bridge Pentium G2020 .


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwirlyWhirly555*
> 
> Delidded my first ivy bridge , its a Pentium G2020 and it survived , took 4 hits to removed the IHS . I have yet to get a good TIM to see if I got any temp drops , before delid idle was 30 C , 100% 42 C on stock cooler . I mainly did delided it to see if I could
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used isopropanol alcohol on my ivy bridge Pentium G2020 .


Good job and nice avatar


----------



## TwirlyWhirly555

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Good job and nice avatar


Thanks , and Thanks







, Time to get a i5 and do the same .


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TwirlyWhirly555*
> 
> Thanks , and Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , Time to get a i5 and do the same .


Good luck! I won't do it to my 3770k...I'll wait for Haswell and then contemplate it.


----------



## Asbee

OCN name: Asbee
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Nocuta NT-H1
Mhz gained: +300Mhz (for now







)
OC after delid: 4,8Ghz
Temp drops: 24C


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asbee*
> 
> OCN name: Asbee
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Nocuta NT-H1
> Mhz gained: +300Mhz (for now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> OC after delid: 4,8Ghz
> Temp drops: 24C


First post ever and a 24c drop with the delid.
Very nice job Asbee, and welcome to OCN.


----------



## Asbee

Thank you!







Liquid Pro rocks. First I tried with noctua on die-Tim, but tepms only dropped ~10C.


----------



## wRRM

After a nerv wrecking first hit with the hammer, my CPU is now delided and put back into my PC.

The temps drop is somewhat magical.

Before delid

Core0: 72
Core1: 84
Core2: 85
Core3: 83

After delid

Core0: 58
Core1: 59
Core2: 61
Core3: 61

This is with 1.280V @ 4.5Ghz.

Will definitely overclock higher now!









Idle temps dropped by 15c aswell.

I used COOLLABORATORY Liquid Ultra on the DIE and Arctic silver 5 on the IHS


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wRRM*
> 
> After a nerv wrecking first hit with the hammer, my CPU is now delided and put back into my PC.
> 
> The temps drop is somewhat magical.
> 
> Before delid
> 
> Core0: 72
> Core1: 84
> Core2: 85
> Core3: 83
> 
> After delid
> 
> Core0: 58
> Core1: 59
> Core2: 61
> Core3: 61
> 
> This is with 1.280V @ 4.5Ghz.
> 
> Will definitely overclock higher now!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Idle temps dropped by 15c aswell.
> 
> I used COOLLABORATORY Liquid Ultra on the DIE and Arctic silver 5 on the IHS
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [


...yup, nerve-wrecking...(and congrats, btw







)

...I ended up using the razor method and the first cut was 'nervie' , but either way, what scares me the most per earlier posts are the upcoming *much bigger* and more expensive Ivy-E's which more than likely can also be deliided (not certain yet, but they'll have trigate), so...
._."we gonna need a bigger boat ...vise-and-hammer..."_


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asbee*
> 
> OCN name: Asbee
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Nocuta NT-H1
> Mhz gained: +300Mhz (for now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> OC after delid: 4,8Ghz
> Temp drops: 24C


You're in and WELCOME TO OCN! nice temp frops btw! if you got any questions ask away in here








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wRRM*
> 
> After a nerv wrecking first hit with the hammer, my CPU is now delided and put back into my PC.
> 
> The temps drop is somewhat magical.
> 
> Before delid
> 
> Core0: 72
> Core1: 84
> Core2: 85
> Core3: 83
> 
> After delid
> 
> Core0: 58
> Core1: 59
> Core2: 61
> Core3: 61
> 
> This is with 1.280V @ 4.5Ghz.
> 
> Will definitely overclock higher now!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Idle temps dropped by 15c aswell.
> 
> I used COOLLABORATORY Liquid Ultra on the DIE and Arctic silver 5 on the IHS


Nice temp drops man!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Good job lads


----------



## wRRM

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in and WELCOME TO OCN! nice temp frops btw! if you got any questions ask away in here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice temp drops man!


Thanks!

And btw is there some form to follow for joining the club?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wRRM*
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> And btw is there some form to follow for joining the club?


right on the front page baby!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> right on the front page baby!


...hiding in plain sight - fiendishly clever


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...hiding in plain sight - fiendishly clever


I learn from many a ninja's and practiced the art of making OP shorter than necessary as most people don't read the entirety of them....


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I learn from many a ninja's and practiced the art of making OP shorter than necessary as most people don't read the entirety of them....


...ahh, I see Valgaur-San







, ...probably used the extra-special Samurai sword to cut the OP


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...ahh, I see Valgaur-San
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , ...probably used the extra-special Samurai sword to cut the OP


Ahh yeeees the ancient blade handed down from OP to OP named the Wabasabi. Very ancient magic flows through the blade and empowers the user.


----------



## alancsalt

Hmmmmmm, a koto katana then, and shouldn't that be Wabi-sabi?









I'm definitely warped.


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, I know this is OT again but I really want to know how to do this.

Chrome was updated a while back where the you can't disable hardware acceleration from right-clicking a flash video (like YouTube). Does anyone know how to do it? It annoys me because it causes problems with my gaming when I watch a movie on my other screen or listen to a music video.

Thanks guys.


----------



## wRRM

Here we go.

OCN name: wRRM
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: COOLLABORATORY Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
Mhz gained: 0 (nothing yet alteast)
OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
Temp drops: 20-25c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2813985

Tried to reach 4.7Ghz, will need a good bit above 1.4V for it







and i reasembled my loop yesterday and accidently moved the IHS so i need to reapply the TIM on the DIE aswell.

Pictures and stuff in the post further up









If you are interested in the loop now.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, I know this is OT again but I really want to know how to do this.
> 
> Chrome was updated a while back where the you can't disable hardware acceleration from right-clicking a flash video (like YouTube). Does anyone know how to do it? It annoys me because it causes problems with my gaming when I watch a movie on my other screen or listen to a music video.
> 
> Thanks guys.


Hey m8!

Here's a guide how to do it









http://www.jkwebtalks.com/2011/03/enable-or-disable-hardware-acceleration.html


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wRRM*
> 
> Here we go.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: wRRM
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: COOLLABORATORY Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: 0 (nothing yet alteast)
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
> Temp drops: 20-25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2813985
> 
> Pictures and stuff in the post further up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hey guys, I know this is OT again but I really want to know how to do this.
> 
> Chrome was updated a while back where the you can't disable hardware acceleration from right-clicking a flash video (like YouTube). Does anyone know how to do it? It annoys me because it causes problems with my gaming when I watch a movie on my other screen or listen to a music video.
> 
> Thanks guys.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey m8!
> 
> Here's a guide how to do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.jkwebtalks.com/2011/03/enable-or-disable-hardware-acceleration.html
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot bro! It was a little outdated but knowing the Options page to look in was very helpful. I was able to turn off Hardware Acceleration by looking for the option myself.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> ...
> 
> I'm definitely warped.


^^^







...
.......................


----------



## par

i5 3570k @ def with antec h2o 920 with 2 noctua nf-f12 at 1000 rpm + lapping ihs in and out, and lapping also antec h2o

on die liquid pro , on ihs mx-4

temperatures after 10 minutes of prime95 small FFTs

before
47 - 51 -56 - 46

after
36 - 42 - 47 - 38

how is it?

some photos..

ihs and antec h2o lapping

http://i.imgur.com/CjVYWZwl.jpg - http://i.imgur.com/ZaHUHJ7l.jpg[ - http://i.imgur.com/MKlE3fEl.jpg

pcb with little scratch in corner up on left

http://i.imgur.com/AIkGLZXl.jpg

die

http://i.imgur.com/Mgxa0SJl.jpg

this is useless but I think it's funny XD

http://i.imgur.com/nCSCDI2l.jpg


----------



## Skullwipe

Planning to delid my 3570k after Haswell is released, would you guys recommend the blade or hammer method? It looks to me like the hammer method would both be easier and carry less chance of damaging the chip.

I'm seeing mid 80's on a P95 blend running at 4.5 Ghz on 1.28v using an H220, but the ambient is close to 30c as well.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Most seem extremely successful via the vice method


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wRRM*
> 
> Here we go.
> 
> OCN name: wRRM
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: COOLLABORATORY Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: 0 (nothing yet alteast)
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz
> Temp drops: 20-25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2813985
> 
> Tried to reach 4.7Ghz, will need a good bit above 1.4V for it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i reasembled my loop yesterday and accidently moved the IHS so i need to reapply the TIM on the DIE aswell.
> 
> Pictures and stuff in the post further up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you are interested in the loop now.
> 
> Hey m8!
> 
> Here's a guide how to do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.jkwebtalks.com/2011/03/enable-or-disable-hardware-acceleration.html


You're In! Sorry for the wait







but I got you in now!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Planning to delid my 3570k after Haswell is released, would you guys recommend the blade or hammer method? It looks to me like the hammer method would both be easier and carry less chance of damaging the chip.
> 
> I'm seeing mid 80's on a P95 blend running at 4.5 Ghz on 1.28v using an H220, but the ambient is close to 30c as well.


Did both mine with a razor without any issues, but today I would probably look at the vise/hammer/block of wood method. Just read through that thread and you can watch a bunch of videos of the guys doing it. Three things: get a vise that won't move at all, don't hit it too hard at first, and protect the chip from popping off unexpectedly.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Did both mine with a razor without any issues, but today I would probably look at the vise/hammer/block of wood method. Just read through that thread and you can watch a bunch of videos of the guys doing it. Three things: get a vise that won't move at all, don't hit it too hard at first, and protect the chip from popping off unexpectedly.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade


Yea, my plan is to pick up a 4" drill press vice from Harbor Freight for under $20 and bolt it to a work bench.



Just not sure if it's worth doing with a chip that requires 1.28v for 4.5GHz.


----------



## hurleyef

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Yea, my plan is to pick up a 4" drill press vice from Harbor Freight for under $20 and bolt it to a work bench.
> 
> 
> 
> Just not sure if it's worth doing with a chip that requires 1.28v for 4.5GHz.


For reference: My 3570k required the same voltage for 4.5 GHz. After delidding, I'm running at 4.8 GHz at 1.46v with the same or cooler temps.


----------



## par

uppp








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *par*
> 
> i5 3570k @ def with antec h2o 920 with 2 noctua nf-f12 at 1000 rpm + lapping ihs in and out, and lapping also antec h2o
> 
> on die liquid pro , on ihs mx-4
> 
> temperatures after 10 minutes of prime95 small FFTs
> 
> before
> 47 - 51 -56 - 46
> 
> after
> 36 - 42 - 47 - 38
> 
> *how is it?*
> 
> some photos..
> 
> ihs and antec h2o lapping
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/CjVYWZwl.jpg - http://i.imgur.com/ZaHUHJ7l.jpg[ - http://i.imgur.com/MKlE3fEl.jpg
> 
> pcb with little scratch in corner up on left
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/AIkGLZXl.jpg
> 
> die
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/Mgxa0SJl.jpg
> 
> this is useless but I think it's funny XD
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/nCSCDI2l.jpg


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Yea, my plan is to pick up a 4" drill press vice from Harbor Freight for under $20 and bolt it to a work bench.
> 
> Just not sure if it's worth doing with a chip that requires 1.28v for 4.5GHz.


Only you can answer that. People spend a lot of money on cooling to get another few c here or there, while delidding gives most people 15-20c better temps. You have an average chip so it is a toss-up. Delidding will let you do 4.7 (or 4.8 if that high of voltage doesn't worry you) where you can't now because of temps, but you won't be able to do 4.9 or above.

Also some people just want better temps and are not worried about a higher multiplier. There is nothing out there in the normal range of cooling that can compare with delidding.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Only you can answer that. People spend a lot of money on cooling to get another few c here or there, while delidding gives most people 15-20c better temps. You have an average chip so it is a toss-up. Delidding will let you do 4.7 (or 4.8 if that high of voltage doesn't worry you) where you can't now because of temps, but you won't be able to do 4.9 or above.
> 
> Also some people just want better temps and are not worried about a higher multiplier. There is nothing out there in the normal range of cooling that can compare with delidding.


I just want to be able to run 4.5 GHz 24/7, and while running a P95 blend I'm breaking 85c in under 15 minutes. The reading I've done says worst case I'll see a 10c drop and best case some people are seeing 30c. I guess I want to see how Haswell performs before I do it, I don't expect it to destroy Ivy prices, so I could always sell my UD5H if I damage the CPU.


----------



## Robbieboy

SkullWipe..I used a Razor blade to do mine... it took about 10 min's to take off IHS and clean all the Black silicon & TIM off....

I think a lot of guys mess up because they use a Razor that's too thick or blunt..

The razor needs to be NEW and real THIN (Do Not Use Box Cutter or such knives!!!).... And I have seen people poke the corner of the blade in DO NOT DO THAT!!! just use the middle of the blade bending it a little bit up at the ends. (just a little so it's rubbing against the IHS and not the PCB...

Hope this helps if you go this way to De-Lid...

I will take a pic of the razor I used..
and put it on this post in a bit...


----------



## King4x4

Haswell out... lets see the delid effect \0/


----------



## hurleyef

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Haswell out... lets see the delid effect \0/


This.


----------



## par

after delidded the temps of the four core must be aligned ? in idle I have 12-13° of difference between the hottest and the coldest core.. it's normal?

anyway, it's my result:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/18640#post_20084063

how is it?

thnx


----------



## neofury

Alright so I've delidded two older cpu's (I believe they were P4, not even sure, had them lying around) and on the first one where I took my time the chip looked 100% and on the second one where I rushed it, seemed that the edge of the PCB had a tiny knick on the top middle right around the edge. It was barely noticeable. I don't have a motherboard to test either chip unfortunately but for the most part, they looked OK.

Right now I'm on a 3770K 4.7ghz @ 1.255v with ultra LLC spiking it up to 1.272v. I've done a 12 hour prime 95 run and it was stable.

My temps were brutal 86-93-90-86. I'm planning on switching out my 212+ for a Phanteks with 3x TY-143's and even changing my case because the airflow in this Antec Eleven Hundred is pitiful. I'm hoping to drop 5-10c off that alone. Bare in mind, I'm using standard TIM right now and I'm switching to Arctic Silver 5 when I get my new cooler next week.

My question to you all is, should I delid my 3770k? I'm not going to blame anyone but myself if I screw it up, but I just wonder with CLL Ultra on the die, AS5 on the IHS and all those other changes above listed, what kind of temps I would get in the end. If it would be really worth it to even risk delidding. I wonder what this chip can achieve at around 1.35v to 1.4v if I were to do all that. I'll post an update with my temps and a 12 hour prime 95 after switching the cooler and TIM, and then I'll see what kind of safe overclocks I can achieve pre-delid, and then if I do decide to delid I'll post some after reports as well.

*Tl;dr version:* Is it worthwhile to delid my chip or should I just shutup and be happy with a 4.7ghz stable at 1.255v?


----------



## hurleyef

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Alright so I've delidded two older cpu's (I believe they were P4, not even sure, had them lying around) and on the first one where I took my time the chip looked 100% and on the second one where I rushed it, seemed that the edge of the PCB had a tiny knick on the top middle right around the edge. It was barely noticeable. I don't have a motherboard to test either chip unfortunately but for the most part, they looked OK.
> 
> Right now I'm on a 3770K 4.7ghz @ 1.255v with ultra LLC spiking it up to 1.272v. I've done a 12 hour prime 95 run and it was stable.
> 
> My temps were brutal 86-93-90-86. I'm planning on switching out my 212+ for a Phanteks with 3x TY-143's and even changing my case because the airflow in this Antec Eleven Hundred is pitiful. I'm hoping to drop 5-10c off that alone. Bare in mind, I'm using standard TIM right now and I'm switching to Arctic Silver 5 when I get my new cooler next week.
> 
> My question to you all is, should I delid my 3770k? I'm not going to blame anyone but myself if I screw it up, but I just wonder with CLL Ultra on the die, AS5 on the IHS and all those other changes above listed, what kind of temps I would get in the end. If it would be really worth it to even risk delidding. I wonder what this chip can achieve at around 1.35v to 1.4v if I were to do all that. I'll post an update with my temps and a 12 hour prime 95 after switching the cooler and TIM, and then I'll see what kind of safe overclocks I can achieve pre-delid, and then if I do decide to delid I'll post some after reports as well.
> 
> *Tl;dr version:* Is it worthwhile to delid my chip or should I just shutup and be happy with a 4.7ghz stable at 1.255v?


That's really something that you'd have to ask yourself. However, if you do, I'd strongly recommend using the vice method and not the razor one.


----------



## justanoldman

Par,
Idle temps don't really mean anything, and are often times inaccurate. Your load temps are what matter with your chip oced. In your post it looks like your temps are really low, so I don't see much of a problem. When you oc the chip and run Prime95 with 90% ram usuage for a half hour then you will get a better idea of what your temps look like. A delidded chip should have less than 10c between the highest and lowest max core temps while running a stress test.

Neofury,
4.7 at 1.255 is great and you should be happy with that, but 93c testing temps are not that great. So it is up to you, but you are asking in the delidded club so most of us will say, of course you should delid. Then you can go for 4.9 with probably better temps, but nothing is risk free so it is up to you.

You could wait for your new cooler and see if that is good enough for you. Also AS5 is not all that great, something like MX-4 should give you a couple c better.


----------



## Ukkooh

After seeing haswell reviews I decided to screw haswell and ordered CLU to delid my 3770k. It does 4.5GHz at 1.15V (but at 80 °C) so I hope I can reach 5.0 after delidding. I'll try to RMA my H100 for a H100i because I have one of those rattling pump units. If it still is too hot for my standards I'll do a custom loop.
I'll use the vice method to do the delidding. I'm kind of worried because my vice has rough edges so it might not grip the IHS enough.

Wish me luck!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Good luck - and you can use a soft-ish material to protect that PCB fromt he vice.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

I would just put some tape over the vise where it will grip the IHS


----------



## stickg1

I tried the vise method on my third delid. Ended up just finishing it off with a razor. I think my vise was too old and beat up, it marred the IHS pretty bad, a couple of indentations that had to be lapped down smooth for the cooler to sit flat. I even put a double layer of gorilla tape on either side of the vise to make it less rugged, but it didn't seem to work for me. I never found the razor method very challenging or dangerous so I'm just going to stick to that method. Takes about a minute to get the actual IHS off, and about 5 more minutes to clean off all the adhesive.

I admire the vise method, and I think it's pretty cool, but it's just not for me.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> After seeing haswell reviews I decided to screw haswell and ordered CLU to delid my 3770k. It does 4.5GHz at 1.15V (but at 80 °C) so I hope I can reach 5.0 after delidding. I'll try to RMA my H100 for a H100i because I have one of those rattling pump units. If it still is too hot for my standards I'll do a custom loop.
> I'll use the vice method to do the delidding. I'm kind of worried because my vice has rough edges so it might not grip the IHS enough.
> 
> Wish me luck!


...wishing you luck ! My Ivy was not dissimilar before delidding and extra cooling...In my case, I found that the (quite excellent) 'Thermaltake 2.0 Water Extreme' could control the temps easily to about 4.9 GHz - 5 GHz was certainly possible but it would yield temps at around 85 C (a touch high for me)...after extra CL-U, lapping and adding a huge custom water-loop, 5.1 GHz doesn't eve break into the 70 C range on full stress.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> After seeing haswell reviews I decided to screw haswell and ordered CLU to delid my 3770k. It does 4.5GHz at 1.15V (but at 80 °C) so I hope I can reach 5.0 after delidding. I'll try to RMA my H100 for a H100i because I have one of those rattling pump units. If it still is too hot for my standards I'll do a custom loop.
> I'll use the vice method to do the delidding. I'm kind of worried because my vice has rough edges so it might not grip the IHS enough.
> 
> Wish me luck!


That's what my vise looks like, it gripped the chip just fine, but left dents on the edges of it that I had to lap out.


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.mediafire.com/download/s915yj3phg21h16/m6e0520.rar

I promise you..... anyone who loves delidding... look at what asus has done....


----------



## ftln

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.mediafire.com/download/s915yj3phg21h16/m6e0520.rar
> 
> I promise you..... anyone who loves delidding... look at what asus has done....


What is this file, looks like a premiere plugin ???????????

What has this to do with asus ???????????


----------



## alancsalt

all about the Maximus 6 Extreme


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ftln*
> 
> What is this file, looks like a premiere plugin ???????????
> 
> What has this to do with asus ???????????


The board supports delidding!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The board supports delidding!


...took me 3 conversions to actually see it ...load it 'raw'


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...took me 3 conversions to actually see it ...load it 'raw'


yeah sorry bout that but totally worth seeing that they have holders for naked cpus!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yeah sorry bout that but totally worth seeing that they have holders for naked cpus!


"Take note that anything above 1.80v VCore is potentially dangerous! "

Impressive results I must say!


----------



## Sharl

This question has probably been asked a few times already. But the search didn't help me and I hope you understand I wont read through nearly 2000 pages...

If I delid the CPU, will I have to replace the thermal compound on the die every xx months? With normal thermalpaste like the NH-1? With the coollaboratory products?

Thank you for taking time to answer my question!


----------



## Ukkooh

@Sharl:
I don't have any experience about delidding (yet) but I've heard that with normal TIMs you get the pump out effect and temps get worse in a few weeks and keep getting worse. With CLU or CLP you won't have this effect and they also transfer the heat more efficiently. So if you don't want to replace it every few weeks you should use CLU/P.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Normal TIMs aren't good for the longevity.
So yes, you might have to replace it every 3-4months.
However if you have CLP/U on it, you should be fine forever


----------



## Sharl

Thanks to you two for your quick and helpful answers! I'll patiently wait for the CLP then. Sadly, it's hard to get around here and waiting for new PC stuff to arrive is one of the few things making me VERY nervous


----------



## Totally Dubbed

No problem man. Patience is a key trait for overclocking, so see it as good practice


----------



## ivanlabrie

Guys:

1.314MHz
Timings: CL5-9-7-18 1T (bbse ram on haswell)

yikes...


----------



## Spin Cykle

The plate ASUS designed for a naked Haswell is very interesting. The Maximus VI Extreme should be a great board! Is the plate designed for use with all aftermarket coolers allowing even pressure distribution? Still trying to understand why fabricating a plate like that would help other than even pressure distribution....


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spin Cykle*
> 
> The plate ASUS designed for a naked Haswell is very interesting. The Maximus VI Extreme should be a great board! Is the plate designed for use with all aftermarket coolers allowing even pressure distribution? Still trying to understand why fabricating a plate like that would help other than even pressure distribution....


You figure a normal socket retainer is designed to put pressure on the edges of the IHS, by removing it you lose 1/2mm of thickness. So this must be intended to make up for that loss of thickness, to ensure proper contact with the socket pins.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spin Cykle*
> 
> The plate ASUS designed for a naked Haswell is very interesting. The Maximus VI Extreme should be a great board! Is the plate designed for use with all aftermarket coolers allowing even pressure distribution? Still trying to understand why fabricating a plate like that would help other than even pressure distribution....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> You figure a normal socket retainer is designed to put pressure on the edges of the IHS, by removing it you lose 1/2mm of thickness. So this must be intended to make up for that loss of thickness, to ensure proper contact with the socket pins.


exactly it's meant to better hold the CPU down while you try to do you naked mounts this way you can avoid pin misshaps


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yeah sorry bout that but totally worth seeing that they have holders for naked cpus!


...yeah I finally saw it...GREAT solution... as I am in phase 2 out of 3 of my 'deskputer' build (working on a build-log this week) I am debating what the 3rd board in there - Haswell / ROG Max VI or IVY-E / Rampage V / X89/99...Ivy-E will definitely run in the current X79 Rampage board I have as part of the build, but Haswell, while very nice, isn't quite far enough from a 5.2+ Ivy IMO...hopefully, the first few Haswell delidders will start to post their results...


----------



## justanoldman

So do Haswell delidders have to cover the pcb with something to protect the exposed contacts? I don’t see any way of getting the conductive and capacitive Ultra/Pro on the die without accidentally getting some on those.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.mediafire.com/download/s915yj3phg21h16/m6e0520.rar
> 
> I promise you..... anyone who loves delidding... look at what asus has done....


Do want! Some cool features in there...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> So do Haswell delidders have to cover the pcb with something to protect the exposed contacts? I don't see any way of getting the conductive and capacitive Ultra/Pro on the die without accidentally getting some on those.


If using liquid metal it probably wouldn't hurt to cover those, dab of LET or nail polish or something should be enough to keep from possible bridging contacts.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If using liquid metal it probably wouldn't hurt to cover those, dab of LET or nail polish or something should be enough to keep from possible bridging contacts.


It's amazing how versatile clear nail polish is, another option is liquid electrical tape.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Do want! Some cool features in there...
> If using liquid metal it probably wouldn't hurt to cover those, dab of LET or nail polish or something should be enough to keep from possible bridging contacts.


...or you could glue on some of that plentiful armour you love to take off every Sabertooth







...seriously though, I think you do want to cover the exposed contacts - I ended up getting two 20g MX4 tubes, and the lady of the house refuses to wear that on her nails, so I'm set


----------



## justanoldman

And if you don't have a wife/girlfriend with some nail polish for you to use on your newly delidded Haswell chip, then you should maybe spend less time on your rig and fix that other situation.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> And if you don't have a wife/girlfriend with some nail polish for you to use on your newly delidded Haswell chip, then you should maybe spend less time on your rig and fix that other situation.


that's a win-win


----------



## youwonder

Hey guys, I decided to take the plunge and go for it with my 3570k, but I have a question. In the guide's I've found on youtube, they take the IHS off and then reapply it with different thermal paste and put it all back together. I had thought delidding was actually removing the IHS and putting the HSF on the bare die, was I wrong? Is there a significant difference between the two methods when it comes to temperatures/OC potential? Finally, how dangerous is putting it on the bare die? I have this cooler for reference:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spin Cykle*
> 
> The plate ASUS designed for a naked Haswell is very interesting. The Maximus VI Extreme should be a great board! Is the plate designed for use with all aftermarket coolers allowing even pressure distribution? Still trying to understand why fabricating a plate like that would help other than even pressure distribution....


Can't tell from that picture - are those just surface contacts, or do they stick up a little bit? I'd hate to use the vice method and accidentally knock something off there.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *youwonder*
> 
> Hey guys, I decided to take the plunge and go for it with my 3570k, but I have a question. In the guide's I've found on youtube, they take the IHS off and then reapply it with different thermal paste and put it all back together. I had thought delidding was actually removing the IHS and putting the HSF on the bare die, was I wrong? Is there a significant difference between the two methods when it comes to temperatures/OC potential? Finally, how dangerous is putting it on the bare die? I have this cooler for reference:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065


Well bare die mounting is a bit different. You will have to remove the CPU retention bracket and then probably mod your Hyper 212 mounting system to get the right amount of pressure on the die to make contact with the pins correctly. This is what the IHS and retention bracket does essentially. Unless you have a water-block, or a lot of free time for tweaking and adjusting, I would just put the IHS back on with some liquid metal TIM.


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spin Cykle*
> 
> The plate ASUS designed for a naked Haswell is very interesting. The Maximus VI Extreme should be a great board! Is the plate designed for use with all aftermarket coolers allowing even pressure distribution? Still trying to understand why fabricating a plate like that would help other than even pressure distribution....


Thinking about mounting direct to die, is something like this offered for ivy?


----------



## FtW 420

EK makes a direct die mounting kit for ivy bridge, made specifically to work with their supremacy water blocks though.


----------



## Spin Cykle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> EK makes a direct die mounting kit for ivy bridge, made specifically to work with their supremacy water blocks though.


Does the EK mount work for the Supreme HF blocks too? Or just the Supremacy?


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> EK makes a direct die mounting kit for ivy bridge, made specifically to work with their supremacy water blocks though.


That's exactly why I was asking, lol. I have a supremacy and was looking into that kit. The thing that has me a little concerned though is it relies on waterblock mounting pressure for contact with the pins. Which seems pretty risky and I honestly don't know what kind of temp difference mounting directly to the die with the EK naked kit vs IHS/normal will achieve.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UPGR4Y3DD*
> 
> That's exactly why I was asking, lol. I have a supremacy and was looking into that kit. The thing that has me a little concerned though is it relies on waterblock mounting pressure for contact with the pins. Which seems pretty risky and *I honestly don't know what kind of temp difference mounting directly to the die with the EK naked kit vs IHS/normal will achieve.*


From what I've seen 1C-4C difference if done correctly.

Getting the right amount of pressure shouldnt be too bad, too little pressure and you wont post, too much pressure and you wont post.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spin Cykle*
> 
> Does the EK mount work for the Supreme HF blocks too? Or just the Supremacy?


It says supremacy series, might have to search around & see if that one works with it.
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UPGR4Y3DD*
> 
> That's exactly why I was asking, lol. I have a supremacy and was looking into that kit. The thing that has me a little concerned though is it relies on waterblock mounting pressure for contact with the pins. Which seems pretty risky and I honestly don't know what kind of temp difference mounting directly to the die with the EK naked kit vs IHS/normal will achieve.


Partly why they made the kit, it is tough to get the mounting pressure just right for the board to boot. I tried for about 15 minutes (without the precisemount kit) & didn't get it right, so just put the latch & IHS back on.
I can't remember the exact numbers, but a couple guys have done direct die & shaved off a few degrees (not a lot, but up to 5° or so)


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> From what I've seen 1C-4C difference if done correctly.
> 
> Getting the right amount of pressure shouldnt be too bad, too little pressure and you wont post, too much pressure and you wont post.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It says supremacy series, might have to search around & see if that one works with it.
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
> Partly why they made the kit, it is tough to get the mounting pressure just right for the board to boot. I tried for about 15 minutes (without the precisemount kit) & didn't get it right, so just put the latch & IHS back on.
> I can't remember the exact numbers, but a couple guys have done direct die & shaved off a few degrees (not a lot, but up to 5° or so)


For like $5 figure its at least worth a shot. My biggest concern though is cracking the die.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UPGR4Y3DD*
> 
> For like $5 figure its at least worth a shot. My biggest concern though is cracking the die.


The precisemount kit is made with the standoffs just the right height to get the pressure correct & it should greatly reduce any chance of cracking the die.
I think it would be worth the $5, guys spend a lot more than that for a few extra degrees.


----------



## coolhandluke41

get you blades out boys..I think first retail- Delidded Haswell spot it









http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?286340-4770k-4670K-IHS-Removals


----------



## Ukkooh

It would be awesome if he also posted his OC results.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *coolhandluke41*
> 
> get you blades out boys..I think first retail- Delidded Haswell spot it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?286340-4770k-4670K-IHS-Removals


...cool, err, less hot







Love to see posts on the Haswell OC's and delidded temperatures


----------



## coolhandluke41

.."4770K @ 4.6 (undelidded) = 3770K @ 5.0 (delidded).."


----------



## JQuantum

Hopefully I'll remember to grab temps before I delid my cpu when it comes in.


----------



## LagunaX

No delidded results in yet? Not even a quick IBT run?


----------



## par

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Par,
> Idle temps don't really mean anything, and are often times inaccurate. Your load temps are what matter with your chip oced. In your post it looks like your temps are really low, so I don't see much of a problem. When you oc the chip and run Prime95 with 90% ram usuage for a half hour then you will get a better idea of what your temps look like. A delidded chip should have less than 10c between the highest and lowest max core temps while running a stress test.


thnx.. soon I post temps in oc









little question, maybe little OT.. on p8z77-i deluxe (not only on my, but on all p8z77-i deluxe) the pch have high temp.. like 50-55° in idle..

if i use a copper cooler on it, I will have big temperature advantage using the liquid metal pro there too??


----------



## Leyaena

Did anyone successfully delid their Haswell yet?
Mine's running incredibly hot at the moment, but the voltage does seem quite low in comparison to the clocks.
Thinking I might let it follow in my ivy bridge's footsteps, and take the top off









Got a few more tubes of coollaboratory liquid pro on their way right now, but I was curious to see if anyone did theirs already


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *coolhandluke41*
> 
> get you blades out boys..I think first retail- Delidded Haswell spot it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?286340-4770k-4670K-IHS-Removals


YUS! bout time!







I ahve the spreedsheet updated and ready!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JQuantum*
> 
> Hopefully I'll remember to grab temps before I delid my cpu when it comes in.


DOET NOW
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Did anyone successfully delid their Haswell yet?
> Mine's running incredibly hot at the moment, but the voltage does seem quite low in comparison to the clocks.
> Thinking I might let it follow in my ivy bridge's footsteps, and take the top off
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a few more tubes of coollaboratory liquid pro on their way right now, but I was curious to see if anyone did theirs already


just be a man and delid its!


----------



## Ukkooh

My CLU got shipped so I'll propably receive it tomorrow. I suppose isopropyl alcohol is good for cleaning the TIM and adhesive from the CPU?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> My CLU got shipped so I'll propably receive it tomorrow. I suppose isopropyl alcohol is good for cleaning the TIM and adhesive from the CPU?


Indeed it is perfect for cleaning it


----------



## Spin Cykle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Spin Cykle*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> EK makes a direct die mounting kit for ivy bridge, made specifically to work with their supremacy water blocks though.
> 
> 
> 
> Does the EK mount work for the Supreme HF blocks too? Or just the Supremacy?
Click to expand...

I emailed EK and the Supreme HF line is NOT compatible with the naked ivy mount.


----------



## Leyaena

Okay, just ordered me some tubes of CLLP, will delid this one once they arrive!
I'll probably do it manually, since that worked out just fine for me last time, and I still trust my own hands over whacking my brand-spanking-new cpu with a hammer and a block of wood, call me old-fashioned









I'll be sure to see if I can get some before-temperatures tonight, might be because I'm not used to Asus-motherboards and I messed up one of the settings, but when I tried to go 4.5Ghz last night, I was hitting Tj-max under IBT instantly. Didn't get to play around with it that much yet, but I'll see tonight and report back


----------



## Cyro999

Hey guys, hopefully i'm buying today.

I was looking at the silver arrow that OCUK has for £50 - will it work with socket 1150 out of the box?* I heard socket 1155/1156 heatsinks would work fine and it seems like you can do it with any old nh-d14 but i dont know about the silver arrow. Is there any other or a better cooling solution i could look into? Budget conscious but powerful.

And; What motherboards would you guys reccomend, or where should i look for info? I'm not really sure what i am doing in this area, don't really want to end up with a ****ty z87 board. I want to push to safe limits with delid and higher end (relatively) cooling

Maybe not the right thread for this, but i thought it might be better than making a new one. Ty

Seems OCUK updated the title to include socket 1150 now, even though the description says "2011/1366/1155/1156/775" and i'm pretty sure that was not there before


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hey guys, hopefully i'm buying today.
> 
> I was looking at the silver arrow that OCUK has for £50 - will it work with socket 1150 out of the box?* I heard socket 1155/1156 heatsinks would work fine and it seems like you can do it with any old nh-d14 but i dont know about the silver arrow. Is there any other or a better cooling solution i could look into? Budget conscious but powerful.
> 
> And; What motherboards would you guys reccomend, or where should i look for info? I'm not really sure what i am doing in this area, don't really want to end up with a ****ty z87 board. I want to push to safe limits with delid and higher end (relatively) cooling
> 
> Maybe not the right thread for this, but i thought it might be better than making a new one. Ty
> 
> Seems OCUK updated the title to include socket 1150 now, even though the description says "2011/1366/1155/1156/775" and i'm pretty sure that was not there before


On motherboard front, there are many good choices so just stick with Z87. If your CPU cooler fits 1155, it will fit 1150 as mounting holes are in the same spots.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> YUS! bout time!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I ahve the spreedsheet updated and ready!
> DOET NOW
> just be a man and delid its!


For those lucky ones with haswell step up.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> On motherboard front, there are many good choices so just stick with Z87. If your CPU cooler fits 1155, it will fit 1150 as mounting holes are in the same spots.


I was only looking at z87, just want a decent one that i don't have to worry about limiting my OC etc with, to use a z77 comparison, i want a ud3h, not a pro3  Maybe that's silly/overkill? But i'm looking for high end cooling and delid, don't want to regret my buy or be held back


----------



## Sharl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Do want! Some cool features in there...
> If using liquid metal it probably wouldn't hurt to cover those, dab of LET or nail polish or something should be enough to keep from possible bridging contacts.


Agrre, I think I'd be quiet careless not to protect the contacts.
The tiniest strap of electrical taper or nail polish might do it. But I kinda wonder how they will do in the long term. Let's say you cover them in nail polish and really get the coollaboratory stuff on it. How will the nail polish react to the heat? Don't know how warm it gets on the PCB and I have absolutely no scientific data or experience with it but I can image that the nail polish could get cracks over time which would allow the liquid metal to run through and potentially bridge the contacts.

Any thoughts on this?


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sharl*
> 
> Agrre, I think I'd be quiet careless not to protect the contacts.
> The tiniest strap of electrical taper or nail polish might do it. But I kinda wonder how they will do in the long term. Let's say you cover them in nail polish and really get the coollaboratory stuff on it. How will the nail polish react to the heat? Don't know how warm it gets on the PCB and I have absolutely no scientific data or experience with it but I can image that the nail polish could get cracks over time which would allow the liquid metal to run through and potentially bridge the contacts.
> 
> Any thoughts on this?


I've had good luck with a dab of gorilla glue.. never broke off for years.


----------



## Sharl

Hm, would have to try to import that stuff. Not that there's no glue in my country. But no Gorilla and I have no idea about the electric conductivity of other glues.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sharl*
> 
> Hm, would have to try to import that stuff. Not that there's no glue in my country. But no Gorilla and I have no idea about the electric conductivity of other glues.


Any good epoxy will do the job.. Thin layer is all you need, and contrary to popular belief, thin layer is less likely to break off


----------



## Sharl

How helpful you guys are and how much I'm learning here, thanks!

Glad I found this forum. I thinkI'll stay here


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *par*
> 
> thnx.. soon I post temps in oc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> little question, maybe little OT.. on p8z77-i deluxe (not only on my, but on all p8z77-i deluxe) the pch have high temp.. like 50-55° in idle..
> if i use a copper cooler on it, I will have big temperature advantage using the liquid metal pro there too??


Ultra and pro are conductive and capacitive, I would not want to use them on a motherboard. Usually high mobo temps are helped by better case airflow.


----------



## par

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> *Ultra and pro are conductive and capacitive*, I would not want to use them on a motherboard. Usually high mobo temps are helped by better case airflow.


I know







..in case, i will use some precaution..

i think the problem is the minimal chipset cooler of p8z77-i deluxe.. the temp is always high for all owners, not only me..

so i will change it with an enzotech chipset cooler.. so, i'm thinking also about the possibility of use liquid pro..

could earn extra 10 or more degrees using liquid pro, like happens on cpu die ?

..i do the first oc of my delidded 3570k







...cooler antec h2o 920 + 2 noctua nf-f12 @ 1450 rpm










how is it?


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *par*
> 
> I know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..in case, i will use some precaution..
> 
> i think the problem is the minimal chipset cooler of p8z77-i deluxe.. the temp is always high for all owners, not only me..
> 
> so i will change it with an enzotech chipset cooler.. so, i'm thinking also about the possibility of use liquid pro..
> 
> could earn extra 10 or more degrees using liquid pro, like happens on cpu die ?
> 
> ..i do the first oc of my delidded 3570k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...cooler antec h2o 920 + 2 noctua nf-f12 @ 1450 rpm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how is it?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *par*
> 
> I know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..in case, i will use some precaution..
> i think the problem is the minimal chipset cooler of p8z77-i deluxe.. the temp is always high for all owners, not only me..
> so i will change it with an enzotech chipset cooler.. so, i'm thinking also about the possibility of use liquid pro..
> could earn extra 10 or more degrees using liquid pro, like happens on cpu die ?
> ..i do the first oc of my delidded 3570k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...cooler antec h2o 920 + 2 noctua nf-f12 @ 1450 rpm
> how is it?


Temps are good and voltage is reasonably low for 4.5, everything looks fine to me. Using liquid Pro or Ultra anywhere on the mobo would make me nervous since any accident of getting it where it should not go would be very bad.

Pro and Ultra give us much better temps on the die than a standard TIM, but they only outperform by 2 or 3c better when used in between the IHS and your cooler. I would just be safe and use something good like MX-4 for any non die applications.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I was only looking at z87, just want a decent one that i don't have to worry about limiting my OC etc with, to use a z77 comparison, i want a ud3h, not a pro3  Maybe that's silly/overkill? But i'm looking for high end cooling and delid, don't want to regret my buy or be held back


The UD3H looks like a great board once again, after a few hours of research and feature comparison it's the board my friend settled on, mostly because of the solid caps and power phases. If you don't need full size board the ASUS Gryphon looks like a solid choice as well, better caps and vrm components than their standard boards.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *par*
> 
> how is it?


Your voltage is insanely low, I have to run 1.28v to get 4.5GHz stable.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> The UD3H looks like a great board once again, after a few hours of research and feature comparison it's the board my friend settled on, mostly because of the solid caps and power phases. If you don't need full size board the ASUS Gryphon looks like a solid choice as well, better caps and vrm components than their standard boards.


Thanks.

And yes, 1.2v for 4.5 is a decent bit better than average i'd say


----------



## L36

Delided haswell anyone?
This is my 4770K
http://postimg.org/image/ev2ltn***/full/

http://postimg.org/image/n1z6yzc9v/full/

http://postimg.org/image/d8hzm6a5f/full/

http://postimg.org/image/e88ahvpb7/full/
Used hammer and vice method, took 20 seconds to do. Only temperature differences i have are:

When i tested the system as is with stock fan and MX2 in between the IHS and fan, in the bios the temperature was 52C
Delided with adhesive cleaned and MX2 between the die and ISH and stock fan same bios settings, new temperature was 32C

Yeah, this is a must do mod for anyone who will OC.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> When i tested the system as is with stock fan and MX2 in between the IHS and fan, in the bios the temperature was 52C
> Delided with adhesive cleaned and MX2 between the die and ISH and stock fan same bios settings, new temperature was 32C
> 
> Yeah, this is a must do mod for anyone who will OC.


It's really a shame that Intel has taken a "good enough" approach to the IHS TIM. 20c drop using a traditional thermal paste really says a lot about how bad Intels compound and/or application of it is.Thanks for posting your results!


----------



## Inglewood78

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> When i tested the system as is with stock fan and MX2 in between the IHS and fan, in the bios the temperature was 52C
> Delided with adhesive cleaned and MX2 between the die and ISH and stock fan same bios settings, new temperature was 32C
> 
> Yeah, this is a must do mod for anyone who will OC.


Nice!


----------



## chahahc

A 20c decrease is pretty sad.

Also liquid ultra/pro might be a little risky now that haswell has exposed traces....


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chahahc*
> 
> A 20c decrease is pretty sad.
> 
> Also liquid ultra/pro might be a little risky now that haswell has exposed traces....


If applied properly, i doubt it will pose a risk. I also wish to mention for both runs the fan was locked at 1K RPM and was done in the same ambient environment.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Delided haswell anyone?
> This is my 4770K
> http://postimg.org/image/ev2ltn***/full/
> 
> http://postimg.org/image/n1z6yzc9v/full/
> 
> http://postimg.org/image/d8hzm6a5f/full/
> 
> http://postimg.org/image/e88ahvpb7/full/
> Used hammer and vice method, took 20 seconds to do. Only temperature differences i have are:
> 
> When i tested the system as is with stock fan and MX2 in between the IHS and fan, in the bios the temperature was 52C
> Delided with adhesive cleaned and MX2 between the die and ISH and stock fan same bios settings, new temperature was 32C
> 
> Yeah, this is a must do mod for anyone who will OC.


Yer it!!! Getz 2 overclockin!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Nice Haswell delid right there!
Cheer for the temp difference - I see intel haven't changed their ways


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> If applied properly, i doubt it will pose a risk. I also wish to mention for both runs the fan was locked at 1K RPM and was done in the same ambient environment.


...as posted before, I would recommend MX4 as an 'insurance policy' and cover the exposed contacts / traces on the Haswell...MX4 *is deigned* for such an environment. I have used a lot of CL-U in various applications and am basically paranoid about it (...which is good for extra caution)...

...but the other day, some of it did end up on the ROG Max V mobo...I was about two feet away from the mobo when I removed the little blue cap from the CL-U syringe - it 'popped' off and a drop of CL-U flew through the air in a nice arc and hit the 1st PCI-e slot







...fortunately, it did not go in but ran on top of the edge of it (there are perforations there so hard to wipe anything off)...I let it set and covered it - with MX4.









...speaking of CL-U (CL-P) and MX4, here is a re-post of a YouTube vid comparing the three as IHS to CPU cooler contact material:


----------



## coolhandluke41

.."Used hammer and vice method.." love it


----------



## Inglewood78

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...as posted before, I would recommend MX4 as an 'insurance policy' and cover the exposed contacts / traces on the Haswell...MX4 *is deigned* for such an environment. I have used a lot of CL-U in various applications and am basically paranoid about it (...which is good for extra caution)...
> 
> ...but the other day, some of it did end up on the ROG Max V mobo...I was about two feet away from the mobo when I removed the little blue cap from the CL-U syringe - it 'popped' off and a drop of CL-U flew through the air in a nice arc and hit the 1st PCI-e slot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...fortunately, it did not go in but ran on top of the edge of it (there are perforations there so hard to wipe anything off)...I let it set and covered it - with MX4.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...speaking of CL-U (CL-P) and MX4, here is a re-post of a YouTube vid comparing the three as IHS to CPU cooler contact material:


What do you mean by "insurance policy?" Use MX4 instead of CLU?

Can we use CLU and use nail polish to cover up the traces?


----------



## par

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Using liquid Pro or Ultra anywhere on the mobo would make me nervous since any accident of getting it where it should not go would be very bad.
> 
> *Pro and Ultra give us much better temps on the die than a standard TIM, but they only outperform by 2 or 3c better when used in between the IHS and your cooler*. I would just be safe and use something good like MX-4 for any non die applications.


yes, I know it.. so I'm asking if the liquid pro can give great performance also between chipset and enzotech copper cooler ?

for logic, I think yes.. but an opinion more is always better







thnx!


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> What do you mean by "insurance policy?" Use MX4 instead of CLU?
> 
> Cab we use CLU and use nail polish to cover up the traces?


CLU conducts electricity, MX4 does not. See those tiny resistors down by the die, pretty sure shortening them out would not end well.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> What do you mean by "insurance policy?" Use MX4 instead of CLU?
> 
> Can we use CLU and use nail polish to cover up the traces?


...I mean: Use MX4 to cover the contacts / traces on the Haswell PCB near the die, then use CL-U on the die


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> CLU conducts electricity, MX4 does not. See those tiny resistors down by the die, pretty sure shortening them out would not end well.


^^^ yup

btw, here is a (less than artful) shot of the MX4 covering the CL-U, the latter ending up on top of PCIe slot 1 per my post above...this could have ended more tragically...but everything works, and the MX4 isolates the area when GPU cards are seated there


----------



## Inglewood78

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I mean: Use MX4 to cover the contacts / traces on the Haswell PCB near the die, then use CL-U on the die


Could nail polish take the place of the MX4?


----------



## LagunaX

I bought some of that black thermal gasket sealant previously to reseal my 3770k.

It occurs to me one could cover the exposed side transistors next to the die with the black thermal sealant, let it dry, and then do liquid metal


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> Would nail polish take the place of the MX4?


...according to FtW (who knows a lot more) yes, absolutely...but I have several 20g MX4 tubes...'don't leave home without it...' - as insurance for several syringes of this:



...and a re-stocking last week


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> I bought some of that black thermal gasket sealant previously to reseal my 3770k.
> 
> It occurs to me one could cover the exposed side transistors next to the die with the black thermal sealant, let it dry, and then do liquid metal


I don't want to do that because I'm afraid that i might cook them


----------



## Inglewood78

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...according to FtW (who knows a lot more) yes, absolutely...but I have several 20g MX4 tubes...'don't leave home without it...' - as insurance for several syringes of this:
> 
> ...and a re-stocking last week


I think i have some MX2 lying around. It's the same thing right? I think I'll just use that.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> I think i have some MX2 lying around. It's the same thing right? I think I'll just use that.


...yes...MX2 is not quite as good as MX4 re TIM temps, but for isolating / covering contacts and such it will do just fine


----------



## Valgaur

welcome! Haswell is here and We have one delidded already!

Nice delid btw! been a while since this thread has been crazy busy and it's about time!







I can't wait to start adding even more people into the fro with Haswell chips!









We will have to eb careful with CLU/P for those caps under the IHS now.. so we will need to do some very careful testing for whoever uses CLU/P alright guys?


----------



## justanoldman

We should put together a list of completely non-conductive and non-capacitive TIMs for Haswell users covering those contacts on the pcb, and put it in the OP. So far I would say MX-4, MX-2, Gelid GC-Extreme. I know some people think AS5 is ok, but it is not. Any others for the list for safe use?


----------



## gl0ry

Got my 3770k! It's batch # 3243C807 Costa Rica / C Stepping. Hoping for some nice overclocking magic here.

Delidded straight out of the box.






Waiting for some more hardware before I test it!


----------



## Noupoi

What does everyone think about using some of this liquid electrical tape to insulate the exposed components (capacitors?) on the Haswell substrate? The specs sheet says that its good for up to 200 °F, which works out to about 93 °C.

Edit: Even found someone using it to prep a graphics card for LN2. 




EditEdit: Throwing more ideas out there, what about dielectric grease?

Found a nice, long thread on OCN about liquid electrical tape here that I'm skimming through: http://www.overclock.net/t/1067846/liquid-electrical-tape-is-awesome


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noupoi*
> 
> What does everyone think about using some of this liquid electrical tape to insulate the exposed components (capacitors?) on the Haswell substrate? The specs sheet says that its good for up to 200 °F, which works out to about 93 °C.
> 
> Edit: Even found someone using it to prep a graphics card for LN2.


I love liquid electrical tape, but it's much harder to remove than a non conductive TIM. I personally wouldn't put it on any surface that could be damaged by abrasion...like a PCB.

You'll notice in that video that they don't mention or show the removal of the liquid tape, it's not going to dissolve with Alcohol or any readily available solvent...that won't also damage your PCB.


----------



## dr/owned

Sorry, but why are you guys worried about the resistors up top? If the IHS goes over them then they're lower height than the die itself and thus shorting isn't an issue.

EDIT: For LN2, dielectric grease and cover with some teflon pipe thread tape.

Anyhoo regarding Haswell....I really want one to turn loose my direct die + chilled water loop on it, which pretty much makes thermal throttling non-issue for me on my 3770k no matter the voltage. Then we can see how well it really overclocks.


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> Got my 3770k! It's batch # 3243C807 Costa Rica / C Stepping. Hoping for some nice overclocking magic here.
> 
> Delidded straight out of the box.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Waiting for some more hardware before I test it!


Why is everyone wearing some kind of gloves when doing the vise method delidding? Is it safe to do it bare handed or should I get some gloves? Is this an antistatic measure or something else?

Btw guys here are two stupid questions before I finally perform the delid:
1. When applying CLU on the die should I also apply some to the underside of the IHS? I've seen some guys do that and i've been wondering if you'll get better temps that way or not.
2. Would it be safe to use normal masking tape to tape the pcb to the vise and afterwards clean the contact points with isopropyl alcohol?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Sorry, but why are you guys worried about the resistors up top? If the IHS goes over them then they're lower height than the die itself and thus shorting isn't an issue.


The worry isn't the IHS touching them, it's the risk of the liquid metal TIM accidentally getting on them.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> Got my 3770k! It's batch # 3243C807 Costa Rica / C Stepping. Hoping for some nice overclocking magic here.
> 
> Delidded straight out of the box.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Waiting for some more hardware before I test it!
> 
> 
> 
> Why is everyone wearing some kind of gloves when doing the vise method delidding? Is it safe to do it bare handed or should I get some gloves? Is this an antistatic measure or something else?
> 
> Btw guys here are two stupid questions before I finally perform the delid:
> 1. When applying CLU on the die should I also apply some to the underside of the IHS? I've seen some guys do that and i've been wondering if you'll get better temps that way or not.
> 2. Would it be safe to use normal painting tape to tape the pcb to the vise and afterwards clean the contact points with isopropyl alcohol?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

I wore gloves because it gives me better grip on stuff and I wear them when I'm doing anything involving tools (like safety goggles for my hands). They weren't anti-static in any way. As long as you aren't touching the contacts while walking on shag carpet, these chips are extremely hard to damage. They have static discharge protection integrated.

1. No just apply to die only and as thin as possible.
2. Yes you can use tape and clean any residue off. I pretty much soaked my entire CPU in isopropyl while removing the sealant and it was fine. As long as you don't swing for the fences you sohuldn't be popping the IHS off very much.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Sorry, but why are you guys worried about the resistors up top? If the IHS goes over them then they're lower height than the die itself and thus shorting isn't an issue.
> 
> 
> 
> The worry isn't the IHS touching them, it's the risk of the liquid metal TIM accidentally getting on them.
Click to expand...

Ah. I have some teflon tape with adhesive backing that might work. I don't know yet how tall the haswell die is, but if it's .5mm like Ivy then the tape might be too thick...will measure with calipers when i get home.

Still just putting a ribbon of teflon tape (without adhesive backing) down over those components would probably shield them well enough.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> I love liquid electrical tape, but it's much harder to remove than a non conductive TIM. I personally wouldn't put it on any surface that could be damaged by abrasion...like a PCB.
> 
> You'll notice in that video that they don't mention or show the removal of the liquid tape, it's not going to dissolve with Alcohol or any readily available solvent...that won't also damage your PCB.


I've been putting LET on all my mobos & gpus for a couple years, never scratched a PCB removing it when I need to. Just have to use a fingernail to get an edge lifted, then peel it off. Might have to use tweezers to get any tiny ripped bits for a perfect clean up, but taking 30 seconds to do it instead of 2 seconds can keep the PCB pristine.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Sorry, but why are you guys worried about the resistors up top? If the IHS goes over them then they're lower height than the die itself and thus shorting isn't an issue.
> 
> EDIT: For LN2, dielectric grease and cover with some teflon pipe thread tape.
> 
> Anyhoo regarding Haswell....I really want one to turn loose my direct die + chilled water loop on it, which pretty much makes thermal throttling non-issue for me on my 3770k no matter the voltage. Then we can see how well it really overclocks.


For Ln2, don't delid, at least until someone finds out if it behaves the same as ivy did, where delidding turned golden chips into average chips for extreme cooling.


----------



## Kamrooz

Kinda sucks we have to delid in order to OC with decent temps. Damn you intel =*(.

Considering waiting for Ivy-E or just nabbing a 4770k with a Maximus board once released. But let me get this straight...Been reading around constantly. If I do indeed go through with this, plan to use the hammer vice method. Clean off the residue from the IHS/PCB with a credit card and clean the IHS/CPU with 100% Isopropyl aclohol with a cue-tip. Once I've done that, place Arctic mx4 to cover the exposed circuitry here? How much would I actually have to put on? Enough to coat it and make sure there is no exposed contact? Or?



after the mx4 cover up....Apply Liquid pro directly on die with cue-tip as well as the bottom of the IHS that makes contact with the cpu die.....

Does that pretty much cover it or am I missing anything? Not new to oc'ing, but this will be my first delid....Bit worried I might screw it up, which Is why I don't want to do the razer blade method...lol.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kamrooz*
> 
> Kinda sucks we have to delid in order to OC with decent temps. Damn you intel >_<
> 
> Considering waiting for Ivy-E or just nabbing a 4770k with a Maximus board once released. But let me get this straight...Been reading around constantly. If I do indeed go through with this, plan to use the hammer vice method. Clean off the residue from the IHS/PCB with a credit card and clean the IHS/CPU with 100% Isopropyl aclohol with a cue-tip. Once I've done that, place Arctic mx4 to cover the exposed circuitry here? How much would I actually have to put on? Enough to coat it and make sure there is no exposed contact? Or?
> 
> 
> 
> after the mx4 cover up....Apply Liquid pro directly on die with cue-tip as well as the bottom of the IHS that makes contact with the cpu die.....
> 
> Does that pretty much cover it or am I missing anything? Not new to oc'ing, but this will be my first delid....Bit worried I might screw it up, which Is why I don't want to do the razer blade method...lol.


They don't have to be delidded for great clocks, there is also cooling to look at. Most people would just prefer to delid & use air/water cooling to run 4.5 - 4.8Ghz, but higher clocks are still doable without delidding if the chip is cooled well enough.


----------



## Kamrooz

I'm anal about cooling. ATM I have a i7 920 running @ 4ghz with a Thermal Ultra 120 extreme. But I'm having the upgrade itch and I do not want to see temps above 80c....lol.

I was considering a top end phantek cooler or just nabbing a NZXT Kraken to cool the beast. But I want to make sure I got the delidding procedure down before I attempt it...Did I miss any steps?


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> They don't have to be delidded for great clocks, there is also cooling to look at. Most people would just prefer to delid & use air/water cooling to run 4.5 - 4.8Ghz, but higher clocks are still doable without delidding if the chip is cooled well enough.


The amount of effort i would have to put into getting at 4.8 without deliding is either winning the silicon lottery or chilled wc setup to keep temps under 80. Stop being silly, for proper and safe overclock for most chips out there this is necessary if you care about the longevity of your chip within safe temperatures.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> The amount of effort i would have to put into getting at 4.8 without deliding is either winning the silicon lottery or chilled wc setup to keep temps under 80. Stop being silly, for proper and safe overclock for most chips out there this is necessary if you care about the longevity of your chip within safe temperatures.


Have you overclocked yet?


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Have you overclocked yet?


I'm still waiting for my WC hardware to come in. Getting some new fans for rads and a new block. Titan hasn't gotten here yet so waiting until i get all parts to assemble everything. Should be here by tomorrow or Wednesday. Only cooler i can use is the stock Intel fan as i have no other air coolers on hand.


----------



## dr/owned

I want to slap whoever works at Intel that dropped the ball on publishing 4th Gen Core package dimensions. Overall height of PCB+IHS is the same between 1155 and 1150, but I can't find the drawing that indicates the package dimensions from which the die height can be found. Unless the IHS is more hollowed out than it was with Ivy, the die would be the same height (.5mm).

However, I don't think this is possible as those look like 0402 surface mount components that have a .5mm height (typically). Because the die appears to be at least twice as tall as these components, the die would have to be 1mm or more thick.


----------



## coolhandluke41

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> I love liquid electrical tape, but it's much harder to remove than a non conductive TIM. I personally wouldn't put it on any surface that could be damaged by abrasion...like a PCB.
> 
> You'll notice in that video that they don't mention or show the removal of the liquid tape, it's not going to dissolve with Alcohol or any readily available solvent...that won't also damage your PCB.
> 
> 
> 
> I've been putting LET on all my mobos & gpus for a couple years, never scratched a PCB removing it when I need to. Just have to use a fingernail to get an edge lifted, then peel it off. Might have to use tweezers to get any tiny ripped bits for a perfect clean up, but taking 30 seconds to do it instead of 2 seconds can keep the PCB pristine.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Sorry, but why are you guys worried about the resistors up top? If the IHS goes over them then they're lower height than the die itself and thus shorting isn't an issue.
> 
> EDIT: For LN2, dielectric grease and cover with some teflon pipe thread tape.
> 
> Anyhoo regarding Haswell....I really want one to turn loose my direct die + chilled water loop on it, which pretty much makes thermal throttling non-issue for me on my 3770k no matter the voltage. Then we can see how well it really overclocks.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> For Ln2, don't delid, at least until someone finds out if it behaves the same as ivy did, where delidding turned golden chips into average chips for extreme cooling.
Click to expand...

the only thing I found annoying with LET is hard to apply places since it's pretty thick (if you make it run you will weaken the LET and have to apply multiple times in order to peel easy ),I start using Vaseline and it's not that bad if you use sponge-brush and heat-gun (not hair dryer )


----------



## Ali Man

Is anyone planning to or has already delidded the 4770K?
I really do wanna know if Intel used their low-quality TIM or not?


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Is anyone planning to or has already delidded the 4770K?
> I really do wanna know if Intel used their low-quality TIM or not?


Page 1875


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Watagump*
> 
> Page 1875


Thanks, I guess Haswell and delidding it is then.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ali Man*
> 
> Is anyone planning to or has already delidded the 4770K?
> I really do wanna know if Intel used their low-quality TIM or not?


The TIM intel uses is actually very good, as good or better than what most OCNers use. It's not liquid metal, but right up there with the best of the regular paste types.
The problem was mostly the gap between the die & IHS.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> I'm still waiting for my WC hardware to come in. Getting some new fans for rads and a new block. Titan hasn't gotten here yet so waiting until i get all parts to assemble everything. Should be here by tomorrow or Wednesday. Only cooler i can use is the stock Intel fan as i have no other air coolers on hand.


Understandable


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The TIM intel uses is actually very good, as good or better than what most OCNers use. It's not liquid metal, but right up there with the best of the regular paste types.
> The problem was mostly the gap between the die & IHS.


Maybe intel was counting on the fact that "OVERTIME" the heating would warp and mold the ihs "flatter"? Is this possible?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> Got my 3770k! It's batch # 3243C807 Costa Rica / C Stepping. Hoping for some nice overclocking magic here.
> 
> Delidded straight out of the box.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Waiting for some more hardware before I test it!


Damn man your vice is awful









Good job


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Why is everyone wearing some kind of gloves when doing the vise method delidding? Is it safe to do it bare handed or should I get some gloves? Is this an antistatic measure or something else?
> 
> Btw guys here are two stupid questions before I finally perform the delid:
> 1. When applying CLU on the die should I also apply some to the underside of the IHS? I've seen some guys do that and i've been wondering if you'll get better temps that way or not.
> 2. Would it be safe to use normal masking tape to tape the pcb to the vise and afterwards clean the contact points with isopropyl alcohol?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


I put Clu on both the die and thw bottom of the Ihs. Every one seemed to be doing that in the guides or videos. Not sure if it makes any difference


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Damn man your vice is awful
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good job


Yeah.. No kidding Lol


----------



## Inglewood78

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> I put Clu on both the die and thw bottom of the Ihs. Every one seemed to be doing that in the guides or videos. Not sure if it makes any difference


Id be careful if you are putting it on the bottom of the IHS bc you have to be exact in making sure it aligns with the core and not the surrounding leads.

If you dont protect the leads and happen to overspread CLU on teh IHS, it might be game over.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> Yeah.. No kidding Lol


Good video, you look like jay chou. from that angle, congrats on the delid


----------



## Buska103

I'm planning to make the upgrade from a Phenom II 955 to the 4670K _very_ soon.

I'm also planning to go underwater in the near future. And with EK's Supremacy Naked-Ivy mount released, I don't see why not go with that? Why not just go away with the whole IHS?
Any disadvantages? The kit has been out for a while and there are barely any people out there who use it... no buildlogs or information... all I hear is that it takes a bit of harmless trial&error to get the pressure just right..

Is there any risk of cracking the die, or are people not using it because it's a niche within a niche within a niche (custom pcs w/ watercooling w/ delidded CPU)?

Anyway, it's such a shame that Intel is forcing us to delid this generation too







I was really looking forward to Haswell being everything that Ivy wasn't.


----------



## ivanlabrie

There's no way I'm delidding my 4770k once I get it...I'll run it on air, and freeze it for benching.
Have fun with yours guys


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buska103*
> 
> I'm planning to make the upgrade from a Phenom II 955 to the 4670K _very_ soon.
> 
> I'm also planning to go underwater in the near future. And with EK's Supremacy Naked-Ivy mount released, I don't see why not go with that? Why not just go away with the whole IHS?
> Any disadvantages? The kit has been out for a while and there are barely any people out there who use it... no buildlogs or information... all I hear is that it takes a bit of harmless trial&error to get the pressure just right..
> 
> Is there any risk of cracking the die, or are people not using it because it's a niche within a niche within a niche (custom pcs w/ watercooling w/ delidded CPU)?
> 
> Anyway, it's such a shame that Intel is forcing us to delid this generation too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was really looking forward to Haswell being everything that Ivy wasn't.


I've always felt delid was a blessing in disguise, It runs cooler and more better than sandy...

And if you remember back in the athlon days, we didn't have the lid to start...









I think it's just the noober kids complaining about delid- as delid is how it should be..









I only wish I could delid my sandy... I don't have temperature control stuff to do it well though...


----------



## GaMbi2004

Weee! I cant wait to start hammering on my new expensive CPU ^^
It just seams so.. right!

Frankly, I hope I mess it up so I can order a new one and try again










Spoiler: Hmmm?!


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> Id be careful if you are putting it on the bottom of the IHS bc you have to be exact in making sure it aligns with the core and not the surrounding leads.
> 
> If you dont protect the leads and happen to overspread CLU on teh IHS, it might be game over.


Wait what do you mean? If thats the case ill probably want to redo it... My job was a little sloppy


----------



## Inglewood78

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> Wait what do you mean? If thats the case ill probably want to redo it... My job was a little sloppy


On the IHC, if you spread the CLU on there, it has to match the outline of the cpu core. The issue is the leads right next to the core, you don't want to get CLU on there because its conductive. If area of the CLU on the IHC is bigger than the core or shifted over, it could potential get on the leads when you clamp down the IHC.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> I've always felt delid was a blessing in disguise, It runs cooler and more better than sandy...
> 
> And if you remember back in the athlon days, we didn't have the lid to start...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it's just the noober kids complaining about delid- as delid is how it should be..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only wish I could delid my sandy... I don't have temperature control stuff to do it well though...


Sandy is on 32nm, ivy on 22nm. It should run cooler


----------



## dr/owned

Hold the phone: The ASRock Z87 OC Formula comes with conformal coating already applied at the factory? How the hell did this get past my RSS feeds? Super tempted to throw a second aquarium chiller on my loop and go full sub-dewpoint if I upgrade.


----------



## Darkshadow74

I ordered the Gigabyte OC Force because it comes with a hybrid WC/Air on the board for its cooling. So with my Supremacy I figured would help it alot.


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Hold the phone: The ASRock Z87 OC Formula comes with conformal coating already applied at the factory? How the hell did this get past my RSS feeds? Super tempted to throw a second aquarium chiller on my loop and go full sub-dewpoint if I upgrade.


Comes with an LCD screen on the motherboard as well


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> I ordered the Gigabyte OC Force because it comes with a hybrid WC/Air on the board for its cooling. So with my Supremacy I figured would help it alot.


I just got done reading about this board and it sounds / looks like they ripped off the OC Formula for that idea. (I let the fan cool this heatsink because I didn't want a 3/8 restriction in my 1/2 loop, and it doesn't get that hot anyways)


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I just got done reading about this board and it sounds / looks like they ripped off the OC Formula for that idea. (I let the fan cool this heatsink because I didn't want a 3/8 restriction in my 1/2 loop, and it doesn't get that hot anyways)


3/8" isn't much of a restriction when you consider how much a cpu waterblock or new thin gpu waterblock restricts. Probably restricts less than adding a gpu block to a loop.


----------



## tp4tissue

Premium board for z87 is a waste, everyone knows this.









you'll get 100mhz on air, maybe 200mhz on water.

The pre applied conformal coating is interesting, if they make it NOT a PITA to do exotics, this may very well open a "new market"


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> On the IHC, if you spread the CLU on there, it has to match the outline of the cpu core. The issue is the leads right next to the core, you don't want to get CLU on there because its conductive. If area of the CLU on the IHC is bigger than the core or shifted over, it could potential get on the leads when you clamp down the IHC.


So if i got some of the clu on the side of the die ill probably want to get all of it off and redo it, right? None of the guides warned me about this. Glad i havent powered it on


----------



## Darkshadow74

Here is a 4770k delidded if you want to look I just started looking at it.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?286340-4770k-4670K-IHS-Removals


----------



## LagunaX

No delidded stress test screen shots yet?


----------



## markallen1988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> So if i got some of the clu on the side of the die ill probably want to get all of it off and redo it, right? None of the guides warned me about this. Glad i havent powered it on


You don't have anything to worry about. They are talking about Haswell, not Ivy Bridge. Haswell has additional metal contacts next to the die. You are all good.


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *markallen1988*
> 
> You don't have anything to worry about. They are talking about Haswell, not Ivy Bridge. Haswell has additional metal contacts next to the die. You are all good.


Damn it, I just re-did it all







.



http://imgur.com/1nSMv


OCN approved? I even went as far as to take isopropyl alcohol prep pads to wipe around the die to get any clu off that I could.

The prep pads are fairly soaked with alcohol. That's no problem to wipe the die off with, is it?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kamrooz*


Self-fusing silicone rubber general purpose class H electrical tape over the conductive parts will probably work well for insulating that part of the die for safety for running bare die mount.

I feel like getting a 4770k just to have fun delidding it.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I feel like getting a 4770k just to have fun delidding it.


That's a large part of the reason I have one on the way.


----------



## dr/owned

Someone needs to bust out a depth micrometer and figure out how thick the IHS is at the center and then we can get how tall the die is (Package thickness - IHS thickness - PCB thickness = die height) . My adhesive backed teflon tape is .16mm thick and would be perfect to stick down over those surface mount bits, assuming surface mount + .16mm < die height. I'm working on getting access to cad models of the packaging which will give more info than just the mechanical drawings available publicly.


----------



## Inglewood78

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *markallen1988*
> 
> You don't have anything to worry about. They are talking about Haswell, not Ivy Bridge. Haswell has additional metal contacts next to the die. You are all good.


Huh he doesn't have haswell?


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> Huh he doesn't have haswell?


No I just got a 3770k from retail edge. So I may have ended up replying to someone not knowing they were talking about Haswell.


----------



## cowsgomoo

Anyone has experience running an i5-3570K without the IHS? I'm using a H80i and I'm not able to let the CPU make proper contact with the pins without the IHS; either it doesn't boot or one of the ram is not detected. The problem goes away with the IHS attached. Is there any trick to it?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cowsgomoo*
> 
> Anyone has experience running an i5-3570K without the IHS? I'm using a H80i and I'm not able to let the CPU make proper contact with the pins without the IHS; either it doesn't boot or one of the ram is not detected. The problem goes away with the IHS attached. Is there any trick to it?


I have ran bare die with 3570k and 3770k. Both require gentle even pressure mount and you have to have a nice flat block.


----------



## dr/owned

FYI got ahold of the package mechanical drawing for 1150....it isn't published in the specs for some reason.

News flash: the IHS sealant thickness on Haswell has *much* stricter tolerances than it did for Ivy, where delidding might not even be needed. The IHS is also redesigned.


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> FYI got ahold of the package mechanical drawing for 1150....it isn't published in the specs for some reason.
> 
> News flash: the IHS sealant thickness on Haswell has *much* stricter tolerances than it did for Ivy, where delidding might not even be needed.


Yeah right, like people are really gonna listen to that.


----------



## tw33k

Everything I've seen so far seems to indicate that you would not want to push haswell past 4.7GHz without de-lidding.

The only board not available is the one I want. ASRock OC Formula. I almost grabbed a Gigabyte z87 OC but I really want the LCD on the ASRock.


----------



## Kamrooz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Self-fusing silicone rubber general purpose class H electrical tape over the conductive parts will probably work well for insulating that part of the die for safety for running bare die mount.
> 
> I feel like getting a 4770k just to have fun delidding it.


Would this do?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCOTCH-70-Self-Fusing-Silicone-Rubber-Electrical-Tape-Class-H-1-x-30-ft-GRAY-/150899451551?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item23224ee69f

Not sure regarding thickness of the tape or if there are options. You sure I can't just use Arctic MX-4 on it? =P...Just cover it up and let it sit...lol...

Any other solution?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kamrooz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Self-fusing silicone rubber general purpose class H electrical tape over the conductive parts will probably work well for insulating that part of the die for safety for running bare die mount.
> 
> I feel like getting a 4770k just to have fun delidding it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would this do?
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCOTCH-70-Self-Fusing-Silicone-Rubber-Electrical-Tape-Class-H-1-x-30-ft-GRAY-/150899451551?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item23224ee69f
> 
> Not sure regarding thickness of the tape or if there are options. You sure I can't just use Arctic MX-4 on it? =P...Just cover it up and let it sit...lol...
> 
> Any other solution?
Click to expand...

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004V411D6/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Is .15mm thick on my caliper measurement. It's what I use on my mouse feet so it would be dual-purpose if applied on top of the surface mount components.

Anyone who wants to try it out for thickness on their delidded 4770k, I'll mail a sample in an envelope.


----------



## Kamrooz

If someone else wants to be the guinea pig that would be great. I just placed an order for all my parts mostly. Probably have everything by next week. But I want to order the tape needed asap before my parts arrive =O. God I spent so much money today...=*(


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Everything I've seen so far seems to indicate that you would not want to push haswell past 4.7GHz without de-lidding.
> 
> The only board not available is the one I want. ASRock OC Formula. I almost grabbed a Gigabyte z87 OC but I really want the LCD on the ASRock.


Those same terrible review sites said the same thing about Ivy. You need to delid the chip to really make it shine.

It's like people saying the 7950 is a bad card, well yea, but once you override the stupid stock power limit that throttles the card when it goes over 250w (which it does at stock) it performs great.


----------



## savagepagan

Do all IB's suffer from the poor factory application of the tim or just a bad batch. Has intel corrected this problem with later batches of the 3770k?


----------



## Ukkooh

AFAIK every 3770k suffers from it to some extent.


Any last minute tips? If not then I'm off to the vise.


----------



## tw33k

As has been stated many, many times in this thread (and every other thread on the internet) there is nothing wrong with the quality of the TIM Intel used or the way it has been applied. The high temperatures are caused by the gap between the die and the IHS. Intel has still not come out and said why they chose to manufacture 22nm chips this way as opposed to using solder.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> FYI got ahold of the package mechanical drawing for 1150....it isn't published in the specs for some reason.
> 
> News flash: the IHS sealant thickness on Haswell has *much* stricter tolerances than it did for Ivy, where delidding might not even be needed. The IHS is also redesigned.










noooope..... everything is the same with the IHS and the sealant. Every chip has a different amount of TIM based on production machines, it will never be the same. Also those IHS's.... yeah not new at all my IVY has them.... they are just re branded.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *savagepagan*
> 
> Do all IB's suffer from the poor factory application of the tim or just a bad batch. Has intel corrected this problem with later batches of the 3770k?


I
V
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> As has been stated many, many times in this thread (and every other thread on the internet) there is nothing wrong with the quality of the TIM Intel used or the way it has been applied. The high temperatures are caused by the gap between the die and the IHS. Intel has still not come out and said why they chose to manufacture 22nm chips this way as opposed to using solder.


Thank you! UGH shesh some people need to read the OP, right tweek







Also Intel has stated why they are using TIM. The reason being is that with the smaller die's the solder would actually harm the die from the heat differentiation, IE the expansion and contraction of the solder ruined the dies. CLU/P dont as it is a liquid metal.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> noooope..... everything is the same with the IHS and the sealant. Every chip has a different amount of TIM based on production machines, it will never be the same. Also those IHS's.... yeah not new at all my IVY has them.... they are just re branded.
> I
> V
> Thank you! UGH shesh some people need to read the OP, right tweek
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Also Intel has stated why they are using TIM*. The reason being is that with the smaller die's the solder would actually harm the die from the heat differentiation, IE the expansion and contraction of the solder ruined the dies. CLU/P dont as it is a liquid metal.


hmmm..I've scoured the internet for an answer to this and I also spent a while going through the 2nd Gen Intel® Core™ Processor, LGA1155 Socket: Thermal Guide Where did you get this from?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> 
> Any last minute tips? If not then I'm off to the vise.


Good Luck!

Hmm.. it has been over 3 hours now.. did everything go as planned?


----------



## Sharl

Does anyone have experience with "real" epoxy? Not an epoxy glue but the pure (!) stuff for coating: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b0/Hybridcircuit.jpg

Is it easy to apply in small quantities? Thoughts on heat problems for the covered parts?


----------



## Chewy

Can i run my EK Supreme HF block directly on the die without mods? There isn't much info around on this and would like to know of others using the same block directly on die without the ihs.

Also when applying tim to the die i guess you apply clu/p as thinly as possible? but is this enough to sufficiently cover the distance between the die and the ihs?


----------



## Sozin

Just out of curiosity, would this still improve temps even if you weren't aiming for crazy high clocks? Like if you were running at stock speeds and had high load temps, would you still see a good temperature drop after delidding?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sozin*
> 
> Just out of curiosity, would this still improve temps even if you weren't aiming for crazy high clocks? Like if you were running at stock speeds and had high load temps, would you still see a good temperature drop after delidding?


Yes


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chewy*
> 
> Can i run my EK Supreme HF block directly on the die without mods? There isn't much info around on this and would like to know of others using the same block directly on die without the ihs.
> 
> Also when applying tim to the die i guess you apply clu/p as thinly as possible? but is this enough to sufficiently cover the distance between the die and the ihs?


EK makes a mount for direct die for the supremacy. Not sure if it'll work for the HF also though. If you end up doing it post your results. I'm on the fence about doing it myself.
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


----------



## Ukkooh

Small update on my delidding adventure:
I managed to pop the die off without any damage to it AFAIK. However the IHS suffered a little bit and got some nasty indentations. I think I should be able to lap them so it is going to just take a little bit longer before I can use my rig again. If the IHS is beyond repair I'll haveto order the cheapest IVB celeron and steal the IHS from it. AFAIK the die is the same on all IVB cpus so shouldn't the IHS be the same too?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Just ordered









going from Q6600 + MSI p35
to 4670k + MSI Z87-GD65

Not in stock







so will probably be here on Friday or Monday

I also got
GTX680 + full block
2x4gb Corsair Dominator
Corsair AX760
and Coollab Ultra (for the delidding)

Cant wait ^^
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Small update on my delidding adventure:
> I managed to pop the die off without any damage to it AFAIK. However the IHS suffered a little bit and got some nasty indentations. I think I should be able to lap them so it is going to just take a little bit longer before I can use my rig again. If the IHS is beyond repair I'll haveto order the cheapest IVB celeron and steal the IHS from it. AFAIK the die is the same on all IVB cpus so shouldn't the IHS be the same too?


:O Bummer.. can you elaborate how it happened ? vice tightened too much?
I hope it works out in the end!


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Small update on my delidding adventure:
> I managed to pop the die off without any damage to it AFAIK. However the IHS suffered a little bit and got some nasty indentations. I think I should be able to lap them so it is going to just take a little bit longer before I can use my rig again. If the IHS is beyond repair I'll haveto order the cheapest IVB celeron and steal the IHS from it. AFAIK the die is the same on all IVB cpus so shouldn't the IHS be the same too?


That's surprising. Those IHS are very thick


----------



## lilchronic

@ dr/owned
wow 1.65v for 5.1 ghz







how long have you been running it @ that voltage and what are your temps?

i need 1.65v for 5.4hgz


----------



## bringhimup

Can't you just use something like "dental floss" instead of a sharp knive? Just use the floss at the edges to cut through the IHS glue. It should make it much easier to then use the hammer method to remove the IHS (without distortion of IHS). And the dental floss should not be aggressiv enough to damage anything of the CPU at all (only the glue).


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bringhimup*
> 
> Can't you just use something like "dental floss" instead of a sharp knive? Just use the floss at the edges to cut through the IHS glue. It should make it much easier to then use the hammer method to remove the IHS (without distortion of IHS). And the dental floss should not be aggressiv enough to damage anything of the CPU at all (only the glue).


Hmm.. that sounds like a 3rd and frankly really good method..
I might try that out once I get my CPU..
I wonder why this haven't been suggested anywhere?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hmm.. that sounds like a 3rd and frankly really good method..
> I might try that out once I get my CPU..
> I wonder why this haven't been suggested anywhere?


dental floss has been mentioned somewhere in these 18,000 posts


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> @ dr/owned
> wow 1.65v for 5.1 ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how long have you been running it @ that voltage and what are your temps?
> 
> i need 1.65v for 5.4hgz


Don't do it. My chip has degraded quite badly and needs to be replaced now....just a month or two of running at this voltage. Temps weren't the issue because of direct die + chilled water.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> FYI got ahold of the package mechanical drawing for 1150....it isn't published in the specs for some reason.
> 
> News flash: the IHS sealant thickness on Haswell has *much* stricter tolerances than it did for Ivy, where delidding might not even be needed. The IHS is also redesigned.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> noooope..... everything is the same with the IHS and the sealant. Every chip has a different amount of TIM based on production machines, it will never be the same. Also those IHS's.... yeah not new at all my IVY has them.... they are just re branded.
Click to expand...

I'm telling you, the package mechanical drawing has changed noticeably from Ivy Bridge to Haswell. This document isn't publicly available yet (4th Generation Intel Core Processors and Intel Xeon Processor E3‐1200 v3 Product Family Package Mechanical Drawings), so I can't post it, but eventually it'll show up in Appendix B of this document: http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/guides/4th-gen-core-lga1150-socket-guide.pdf

It's a bit of a head scratcher why it's still unreleased.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> dental floss has been mentioned somewhere in these 18,000 posts


Hehe true.. It would probably be easy to overlook








tbh, I haven't read ALL of the posts in this thread, but the floss does sound like a good idea imo..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hehe true.. It would probably be easy to overlook
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tbh, I haven't read ALL of the posts in this thread, but the floss does sound like a good idea imo..


Yeah I read it back a few months ago..
Not sure how well it'd go, I'll try it on a older gen CPU if I have any left as I need to buy some dental floss









EDIT: We got any delidded haswells yet? Also what's with the little resistors/components on top of the PCB? Maybe Intel is onto us delidders..


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah I read it back a few months ago..
> Not sure how well it'd go, I'll try it on a older gen CPU if I have any left as I need to buy some dental floss
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: We got any delidded haswells yet? Also what's with the little resistors/components on top of the PCB? Maybe Intel is onto us delidders..


I just found the posts about it.. even though he said he was gonna do it and post pic etc, he never posted in this thread again







I gave him a PM in hope of some answers but he haven't been online for almost 2 weeks








Wouldn't IHS be soldered on on older gen CPUs? I guess we would still know it it would go through the glue..

I should have the CPU later this week / early next week.. gonna do some pre delid temps first. so would guess dental floss mid~ next week? ! and move on to vice if it doesn't work out.


----------



## dr/owned

^^ I don't think you will find floss thin enough to get under the IHS. Even if you do, it probably won't be strong enough to do anything without snapping. No reason not to start with the vise method.


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> ^^ I don't think you will find floss thin enough to get under the IHS. Even if you do, it probably won't be strong enough to do anything without snapping. No reason not to start with the vise method.


What about mint flavored floss? At least the CPU might get some minty freshness.


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> *Don't do it. My chip has degraded quite badly and needs to be replaced now....just a month or two of running at this voltage*. Temps weren't the issue because of direct die + chilled water.
> I'm telling you, the package mechanical drawing has changed noticeably from Ivy Bridge to Haswell. This document isn't publicly available yet (4th Generation Intel Core Processors and Intel Xeon Processor E3‐1200 v3 Product Family Package Mechanical Drawings), so I can't post it, but eventually it'll show up in Appendix B of this document: http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/guides/4th-gen-core-lga1150-socket-guide.pdf
> 
> It's a bit of a head scratcher why it's still unreleased.


How badly has it degraded? I'm running [email protected] volts, thinking of trying for a 5 ghz for 24/7 use, just not sure how much more voltage I'll need and how quickly it'll degrade my chip, been running at 4.9 now since ivy release, so roughly 12 months


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> *Don't do it. My chip has degraded quite badly and needs to be replaced now....just a month or two of running at this voltage*. Temps weren't the issue because of direct die + chilled water.
> I'm telling you, the package mechanical drawing has changed noticeably from Ivy Bridge to Haswell. This document isn't publicly available yet (4th Generation Intel Core Processors and Intel Xeon Processor E3‐1200 v3 Product Family Package Mechanical Drawings), so I can't post it, but eventually it'll show up in Appendix B of this document: http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/guides/4th-gen-core-lga1150-socket-guide.pdf
> 
> It's a bit of a head scratcher why it's still unreleased.
> 
> 
> 
> How badly has it degraded? I'm running [email protected] volts, thinking of trying for a 5 ghz for 24/7 use, just not sure how much more voltage I'll need and how quickly it'll degrade my chip, been running at 4.9 now since ivy release, so roughly 12 months
Click to expand...

I used to be able to run 5.1 (what's in my sig) @ 1.65 and 5.0 @ 1.575 (and I think 4.8 @ 1.4, but I can't remember if it was 4.8 or 4.7). Now I can't even run 4.9 @ 1.55 without getting ocassional bsods and programs randomly crashing in windows. It also seems to be getting worse, like once it's degraded the degradation becomes exponential (see: bathtub curve).

I would suggest sticking to Intel specs and not exceeding 1.52V under any circumstance.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> How badly has it degraded? I'm running [email protected] volts, thinking of trying for a 5 ghz for 24/7 use, just not sure how much more voltage I'll need and how quickly it'll degrade my chip, been running at 4.9 now since ivy release, so roughly 12 months


I have not heard of anyone degrading an Ivy chip with less than 1.5v and reasonable temps, so you should be good with 5.0. If you are not at the wall I would think 1.45v or so might do it.

Supposedly we are supposed to be ok up to 1.55v, but I am not sure I would be comfortable with more than 1.5v for 24/7.


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I used to be able to run 5.1 (what's in my sig) @ 1.65 and 5.0 @ 1.575 (and I think 4.8 @ 1.4, but I can't remember if it was 4.8 or 4.7). Now I can't even run 4.9 @ 1.55 without getting ocassional bsods and programs randomly crashing in windows. It also seems to be getting worse, like once it's degraded the degradation becomes exponential (see: bathtub curve).
> 
> I would suggest sticking to Intel specs and not exceeding 1.52V under any circumstance.


Hmm..if I can get it stable at 1.44 or below I guess I'll keep it at 5.0, otherwise it's going back to 4.9


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I have not heard of anyone degrading an Ivy chip with less than 1.5v and reasonable temps, so you should be good with 5.0. If you are not at the wall I would think 1.45v or so might do it.
> 
> Supposedly we are supposed to be ok up to 1.55v, but I am not sure I would be comfortable with more than 1.5v for 24/7.


How long have you been running your 3770k @ 5 ghz and what voltage?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *y2kcamaross*
> 
> How long have you been running your 3770k @ 5 ghz and what voltage?


Just since Jan, I use 1.41v on both my 3770k chips (just a coincidence they are the same). One does 5.0 the other 4.8. Zero problems so far. I read a lot of oc posts, and as I said I have not heard of any problems with less than 1.5v and reasonable temps.

I would think you would be fine at 5.0 if you are below 1.5v, and good temps. I am not sure I would run high 1.4s if I was stressing the machine 24/7 with folding or such and had high temps though.


----------



## Watagump

My 3570k took 1.45v to run 5.0. Didnt feel the need to stay there, or like running that much voltage. I rather be able to sell my chip down the road and not feel I might of sold it with the chance it wont hold up. It may of been fine, but why risk it for slightly more speed I wont even notice.


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Watagump*
> 
> My 3570k took 1.45v to run 5.0. Didnt feel the need to stay there, or like running that much voltage. I rather be able to sell my chip down the road and not feel I might of sold it with the chance it wont hold up. It may of been fine, but *why risk it for slightly more speed I wont even notice*.


because that's what we do here


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Dental floss is way too weak to cut that glue...
Unless your dental floss is made for a T Rex, it won't work.
Just my 50p (lol)


----------



## Ukkooh

Yay my rig booted after delidding.







Atleast I didn't break it and I'm happy for that. Definitely still not happy with the temps though... I tried IBT fast and max core temp was 60 @stock. So pretty much exactly the same as before delidding. The thing is now I have no idea of what is the bottleneck temp wise. It might be my half-lapped IHS, my cooler mounting or IHS mounting. Though I think I managed to apply the CLU to the die pretty well. If the temps are as bad as before with 4.5 I guess I'll have to reapply everything later.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Yay my rig booted after delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Atleast I didn't break it and I'm happy for that. Definitely still not happy with the temps though... I tried IBT fast and max core temp was 60 @stock. So pretty much exactly the same as before delidding. The thing is now I have no idea of what is the bottleneck temp wise. It might be my half-lapped IHS, my cooler mounting or IHS mounting. Though I think I managed to apply the CLU to the die pretty well. If the temps are as bad as before with 4.5 I guess I'll have to reapply everything later.


Told ya so..


----------



## UPGR4Y3DD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Dental floss is way too weak to cut that glue...
> Unless your dental floss is made for a T Rex, it won't work.
> Just my 50p (lol)


If you got a corner started with a razor bet you some high test fishing line would do the job though. Something like a spiderwire.


----------



## lilchronic

i run 5ghz @ 1.37v temps low 60's


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Dental floss is way too weak to cut that glue...
> Unless your dental floss is made for a T Rex, it won't work.
> Just my 50p (lol)


I got reply back from the dude who tried it earlier in this thread, he said that it worked pretty well but took some time.

Im guessing a lot of ppl would think to just pull the floss through it ? ofc that wouldn't work.. I was thinking of "sawing" through the glue.

Something like this.

That should make the floss "burn" its way through the glue quite easy.

and hey.. if it dosnt work, the CPU will already be in the vice and rdy for a bang with the hammer (hopefully I wont get too frustrated over the dental floss, and hit the CPU directly)


----------



## Ukkooh

I just did a quick test on 4.5GHz and max core temp was 67°C. So from 3.9GHz to 4.5GHz only a 7°C increase. I used to get 80-81°C so I guess it is an improvement. Oh and the ambient is definitely higher than with that 80°C run. It was a winter run with my window open.


----------



## Forceman

Yeah, I'd call 14C a worthwhile improvement.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> I just did a quick test on 4.5GHz and max core temp was 67°C. So from 3.9GHz to 4.5GHz only a 7°C increase. I used to get 80-81°C so I guess it is an improvement. Oh and the ambient is definitely higher than with that 80°C run. It was a winter run with my window open.


Congrats







13~14c with higher ambient is a nice boost ^^
So the IHS didnt take damage as previously mentioned?
Did you CLU the chip only? or both chip and IHS? and what did you use for IHS <->Cooler
Also.. I think I missed this







what CPU did you delid?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I got reply back from the dude who tried it earlier in this thread, he said that it worked pretty well but took some time.
> 
> Im guessing a lot of ppl would think to just pull the floss through it ? ofc that wouldn't work.. I was thinking of "sawing" through the glue.
> 
> Something like this.
> 
> That should make the floss "burn" its way through the glue quite easy.
> 
> and hey.. if it dosnt work, the CPU will already be in the vice and rdy for a bang with the hammer (hopefully I wont get too frustrated over the dental floss, and hit the CPU directly)


Fishing line was what we discussed. Floss is sorta weak isn't it?


----------



## L36

Applied some black gasket on the resistors, this is NAPA black liquid gasket which can withstand high temperatures without melting, sensor safe and pretty much rubber so will isolate the resistors from CLU. will mount tonight after it dries a bit more with CLU, my WC gear should be here tomorrow.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Applied some black gasket on the resistors, this is NAPA black liquid gasket which can withstand high temperatures without melting, sensor safe and pretty much rubber so will isolate the resistors from CLU. will mount tonight after it dries a bit more with CLU, my WC gear should be here tomorrow.


I have pulled my cpu apart a few times with clp and clu on it and have never found any but where i applied it. I wouldnt worry about ot running or squeezing out because the layer applied should be pretty thin. If you are un coordinated with the brush it may be a diff matter.


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have pulled my cpu apart a few times with clp and clu on it and have never found any but where i applied it. I wouldnt worry about ot running or squeezing out because the layer applied should be pretty thin. If you are un coordinated with the brush it may be a diff matter.


Its a safety precaution.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have pulled my cpu apart a few times with clp and clu on it and have never found any but where i applied it. I wouldnt worry about ot running or squeezing out because the layer applied should be pretty thin. If you are un coordinated with the brush it may be a diff matter.


^^^ very true i have also taken my chip apart many times and the clp i put on is always where i left it.







but just to be safe i would just put mx-4 over them transitors.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Its a safety precaution.


A good plan, that murphy guy can be a bit of a dick when you get used to things working smoothly & then cut a corner.


----------



## Leyaena

I've done some testing on the i7-4770k before delidding, and the results are nothing short of shocking, temperature-wise:

_For a very modest 4.3GHz overclock:_

*Running at 1.15V:*

Core 1: 83°C
Core 2: 82°C
Core 3: 79°C
Core 4: 69°C
Package: 83°C

*Running at 1.2V:*

Core 1: 89°C
Core 2: 89°C
Core 3: 86°C
Core 4: 75°C
Package: 90°C

*Cooling:* Corsair H100i, stock fans, running at 100%.
*Voltage Control:* Manual, CPU-Z reported no deviation during testing.
*Tested with:* IntelBurnTestV2

*Screenies:*



Needless to say, this has me somewhat disappointed...

As soon as my new syringes of CLP get here, it'll be _off with his head_!

*Edit:* Updated post with all relevant info I could think of, for future reference.


----------



## Cyro999

What cooling? Did you make sure to use Manual voltage?

Also; Why are people using CLP a lot? I thought CLU was better


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> What cooling? Did you make sure to use Manual voltage?


I've got a Corsair H100i in there, stock fans, while I wait for my loop's parts to arrive.
Fans were running at 100% during testing.

Voltage was set to manual, both for 1.15V and 1.2V.

Personally I've always preferred CLP, CLU's a bit easier to work with from what I heard, but last I checked CLP's got a small edge temps-wise.


----------



## Cyro999

I've seen similar temps to yours ([email protected] on h100i) but also far lower. I thought a lot of it was down to people using adaptive voltage (which overvolts a ton if using avx instructions or something like that) creating a massive temperature gap, but concerning if you dont have that problem


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Its a safety precaution.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> A good plan, that murphy guy can be a bit of a dick when you get used to things working smoothly & then cut a corner.


...definitely a very wise move - with little cost so why not do it. Also *L36*, looks like a *very clean* delidding job and glue clean-up - Congrats


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Personally I've always preferred CLP, CLU's a bit easier to work with from what I heard, but last I checked CLP's got a small edge temps-wise.


Dont want to be a noob here, but can you link CLP and CLU where to buy it.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I've seen similar temps to yours ([email protected] on h100i) but also far lower. I thought a lot of it was down to people using adaptive voltage (which overvolts a ton if using avx instructions or something like that) creating a massive temperature gap, but concerning if you dont have that problem


Nope, exactly, I put the voltage control on 'fully manual', and just dialed in on 1.20V during my first test.
During testing I kept an eye on CPU-Z, and it didn't budge from the 1.199V mark at all.

Also worth mentioning, by the way, *I ran IntelBurnTest, not prime95*.

screenies below:


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> Dont want to be a noob here, but can you link CLP and CLU where to buy it.


http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Thermal-Interface-Material/dp/B0039RY3MM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1370387822&sr=8-1&keywords=coollaboratory+liquid+ultra


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> What cooling? Did you make sure to use Manual voltage?
> 
> Also; Why are people using CLP a lot? I thought CLU was better


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've got a Corsair H100i in there, stock fans, while I wait for my loop's parts to arrive.
> Fans were running at 100% during testing.
> 
> Voltage was set to manual, both for 1.15V and 1.2V.
> 
> Personally I've always preferred CLP, CLU's a bit easier to work with from what I heard, but last I checked CLP's got a small edge temps-wise.


I now use CL-U exclusively...though 'better' can depend on a lot of factors (ie application method). I found that CL-U is slightly better than CL-P re temps in my various applications (3 CPUs, 4 GPUs), and also a bit easier to apply / clean up...and here is a YouTube vid I have posted (too many times







?) before comparing CL-U, CL-P and MX4

EDIT - the link:


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> Dont want to be a noob here, but can you link CLP and CLU where to buy it.


heres another i didnt realize they got so expensive i think i paid that for two of them liguid pro and liguid ultra
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html?tl=g8


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Watagump*
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Thermal-Interface-Material/dp/B0039RY3MM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1370387822&sr=8-1&keywords=coollaboratory+liquid+ultra


Thank you. And if I am going to Delid my 4770k, would the Vise and hammer be the best way still? or the blade? I want to take as much of the risk out of this. And should I use CLP and not CLU then on the die?


----------



## Kamrooz

For those who have picked up a haswell chip so far. Mind posting your batch number and info regarding voltage/current OC?

I get my pick of the litter if I decide to go 4770k instead of a 3930k, so if I can at least increase my chances of getting a better chip, why not? ^_^


----------



## Forceman

How much difference does CLU make on the die over something like MX-4? If the gap is the problem, does the paste matter that much?


----------



## markallen1988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> How much difference does CLU make on the die over something like MX-4? If the gap is the problem, does the paste matter that much?


A big difference. Maybe 10C cooler than conventional paste at first, but regular pastes will pump out resulting in higher temps that pre-delid, while CLU/CLP will not.


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kamrooz*
> 
> For those who have picked up a haswell chip so far. Mind posting your batch number and info regarding voltage/current OC?
> 
> I get my pick of the litter if I decide to go 4770k instead of a 3930k, so if I can at least increase my chances of getting a better chip, why not? ^_^


I started a thread here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1397657/plz-post-your-haswell-temps-speed-and-chip-batch but hasnt been much reponse yet.


----------



## L36

is 56gflops the normal result for a stock 4770k with 8 threads at 3900 with HT?
Also, did CLU on the die, MX2 between ihs and heatsink. Temps decreased by about 5-10C vs the test i ran yesterday with MX2 between the die, IHS and cooler.
Would recommend CLU on the die over MX2 but make sure you isolate those resistors.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> Heh, the hardest part is getting the chip in there tight enough without denting it.
> 
> As my sig used to say, razors are a barbarous relic.


You need to have some feel to it, when it gets tigt in the vice, i tighten a slight turn more, maybe like 5 degree turn. Then try to wiggle the cpu in the vice see if it comes off easily. Its easy, just do it.


----------



## LagunaX

L36, post some overclocking screenshots already!


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> make sure you isolate those resistors.


Whats the best way to do this on a 4770k? And the vise and hammer way still works with the change inside?


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> L36, post some overclocking screenshots already!


I'm on the stock fan, my WC stuff comes in tomorrow. Hopefully il have everything up and running by Thursday, i have a final and a 3K paper due this week, I'm stretched thin as is... Besides, i have no idea what a lot of the bios options mean...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> Whats the best way to do this on a 4770k? And the vise and hammer way still works with the change inside?


Vice and hammer is better because with the razor you get very close to those resistors on the bottom of the CPU. The placement does not matter in the vice method, just whack it and when you see it coming lose, wiggle it. Simply hit, check if lose, hit, check if lose ect. It took me 2 hits. Isolating the resistors is simple, just dump non conductive TIM on them or use an automotive rubber gasket which can resist high temps, like i did. This is only necessary if you plan to use CLU, which have clear benefits, see my previous post.

I went the gasket route to ensure that it stays on those resistors, the TIM might slide off when you put and hold the IHS in the socket when mounting.


----------



## LagunaX

The hardest part is finding a neighbor with a vice u can use.


----------



## jamdox

Heh, the hardest part is getting the chip in there tight enough without denting it.

As my sig used to say, razors are a barbarous relic.


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> The hardest part is finding a neighbor with a vice u can use.


Go to home depot, get one of those suction cup vices. They will support all the force you will exert from the whacking. Don't rip off the tags and return it. The only thing you will have to get creative about is a block of wood. Or spend some cash and get a proper vice for any future deliding.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> Heh, the hardest part is getting the chip in there tight enough without denting it.
> 
> As my sig used to say, razors are a barbarous relic.


That's easy, just when it gets tight in the vice, turn maybe 5 degrees more. Try to wiggle with your hands, if it comes out, repeat.


----------



## WenHan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> The hardest part is finding a neighbor with a vice u can use.


For me, the hardest part is finding someone with a vice as DYI stuff isn't too popular in Hong Kong


----------



## jamdox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Go to home depot, get one of those suction cup vices. They will support all the force you will exert from the whacking. Don't rip off the tags and return it. The only thing you will have to get creative about is a block of wood. Or spend some cash and get a proper vice for any future deliding.


Don't want to be a negative nancy, but the suction cup vices aren't stiff enough oftentimes









Czech out the hammer delid thread for proof.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Go to home depot, get one of those suction cup vices. They will support all the force you will exert from the whacking. Don't rip off the tags and return it. The only thing you will have to get creative about is a block of wood. Or spend some cash and get a proper vice for any future deliding.


How wide does the vice need to be able to open?


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> Don't want to be a negative nancy, but the suction cup vices aren't stiff enough oftentimes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Czech out the hammer delid thread for proof.


They're usually enough, you don't need a lot of force to break that adhesive loose. If you do need more force, you're doing it wrong.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> How wide does the vice need to be able to open?


1.5 inches is more than enough.


----------



## jamdox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> They're usually enough, you don't need a lot of force to break that adhesive loose. If you do need more force, you're doing it wrong.


Please be gracious about this and don't double down on bad advice








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> How wide does the vice need to be able to open?


A little bit more than the width of the IHS


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> The hardest part is finding a neighbor with a vice u can use.


I lucked out my dad is a 1st class engineer, so he has like 3 different types. and he would love to watch this be done.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> I lucked out my dad is a 1st class engineer, so he has like 3 different types. and he would love to watch this be done.


Yeah same, well I never used the vice for my CPU, But I guess you could say I own it now..
It's like 25+ years old, apparently she was once red. Haha


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah same, well I never used the vice for my CPU, But I guess you could say I own it now..
> It's like 25+ years old, apparently she was once red. Haha


I am so scared of the razor bit because I am not the most graceful and I also shack alot, and I dont trust anyone else to mess with it, with a vice I can be alittle more ungraceful with out worrying I messed my new chip up and I wont be going to the hospital to be sewn up.


----------



## SonDa5

I think using the vice method could possibly bend the IHS and lead to poor contact between IHS and die. Razer seems like the better delid method to me.


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Go to home depot, get one of those suction cup vices. They will support all the force you will exert from the whacking. Don't rip off the tags and return it. The only thing you will have to get creative about is a block of wood. Or spend some cash and get a proper vice for any future deliding.


The suction cup vice sucks, not because of the suction cup itself (it actually holds pretty damn good) but because the one I got has some weird angle setting on it as well. I have my full delidding experience here.


----------



## SonDa5

Gl0ry congrats. Looks rough but if it worked out all is well. Did your IHS get bent at all?


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Gl0ry congrats. Looks rough but if it worked out all is well. Did your IHS get bent at all?


Not from what I can tell. That IHS is extremely thick, I don't know how it could get bent, but I'm on stock cooling right now so I can't give you normal temps. They're gonna be somewhat high regardless


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> is 56gflops the normal result for a stock 4770k with 8 threads at 3900 with HT?
> Also, did CLU on the die, MX2 between ihs and heatsink. Temps decreased by about 5-10C vs the test i ran yesterday with MX2 between the die, IHS and cooler.
> Would recommend CLU on the die over MX2 but make sure you isolate those resistors.
> You need to have some feel to it, when it gets tigt in the vice, i tighten a slight turn more, maybe like 5 degree turn. Then try to wiggle the cpu in the vice see if it comes off easily. Its easy, just do it.


You need to let updates run all the way through for windows. Sounds like service pack one needs to install if you are using windows 7


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I got reply back from the dude who tried it earlier in this thread, he said that it worked pretty well but took some time.
> 
> Im guessing a lot of ppl would think to just pull the floss through it ? ofc that wouldn't work.. I was thinking of "sawing" through the glue.
> 
> Something like this.
> 
> That should make the floss "burn" its way through the glue quite easy.
> 
> and hey.. if it dosnt work, the CPU will already be in the vice and rdy for a bang with the hammer (hopefully I wont get too frustrated over the dental floss, and hit the CPU directly)


I don't get why you wouldn't just use a hammer and vice and/or a razor?
I guess the risks are LOWER with floss or fishing line etc - but again you might be more prone to shorting the CPU with all that static that you might will be creating by going back and forth with a "weak" tool.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Fishing line was what we discussed. Floss is sorta weak isn't it?


agreed
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Applied some black gasket on the resistors, this is NAPA black liquid gasket which can withstand high temperatures without melting, sensor safe and pretty much rubber so will isolate the resistors from CLU. will mount tonight after it dries a bit more with CLU, my WC gear should be here tomorrow.


EPIC man - well done!


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've done some testing on the i7-4770k before delidding, and the results are nothing short of shocking, temperature-wise:
> 
> _For a very modest 4.3GHz overclock:_
> 
> *Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 83°C
> Core 2: 82°C
> Core 3: 79°C
> Core 4: 69°C
> Package: 83°C
> 
> *Running at 1.2V:*
> 
> Core 1: 89°C
> Core 2: 89°C
> Core 3: 86°C
> Core 4: 75°C
> Package: 90°C
> 
> *Cooling:* Corsair H100i, stock fans, running at 100%.
> *Voltage Control:* Manual, CPU-Z reported no deviation during testing.
> *Tested with:* IntelBurnTestV2
> 
> Needless to say, this has me somewhat disappointed...
> 
> As soon as my new syringes of CLP get here, it'll be _off with his head_!
> 
> *Edit:* Updated post with all relevant info I could think of, for future reference.


Looking forward to your results, i had exactly the same results with my 3770k, after curing time with delid and CLU I cant get my CPU over 60degrees @1.344vcore. Best. Decision. Ever.

Keen to rip into this as well but unsure if to go Haswell or Ivy Birdge - E...


----------



## LagunaX

First delidded i5-4670k result I've seen posted here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1397764/delidded-4670k-results
Should get better when his Liquid Ultra arrives, it was done with PK-3.
Unfortunately only tested so far as of this post at 4.3ghz, not the 4.7-5.0ghz everyone's been waiting for...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Applied some black gasket on the resistors, this is NAPA black liquid gasket which can withstand high temperatures without melting, sensor safe and pretty much rubber so will isolate the resistors from CLU. will mount tonight after it dries a bit more with CLU, my WC gear should be here tomorrow.


I like this idea very much so. the rubber will nullify an juice and will prevent anything if CLU/P moves a smiddgin
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kamrooz*
> 
> For those who have picked up a haswell chip so far. Mind posting your batch number and info regarding voltage/current OC?
> 
> I get my pick of the litter if I decide to go 4770k instead of a 3930k, so if I can at least increase my chances of getting a better chip, why not? ^_^


Batch numbers don't matter at all with Haswell as Ivy turned out to be. This is mainly due to the smaller production sizes of the 22nm (Ivy) and 14nm (Haswell) There simply isn't any difference as different silicon is used and not all from the same area and the density needed makes everything change. they may be "near" each other... but no more than that really. Thats why I coined the Silicon Lottery instead of the chip lottery.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> How much difference does CLU make on the die over something like MX-4? If the gap is the problem, does the paste matter that much?


quite a bit actually if you go to the OP (seriously I made that 100+ member spreadsheet so in-depth for a reason) you can see the differences there but they range from 10-15C in some cases.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamdox*
> 
> Heh, the hardest part is getting the chip in there tight enough without denting it.
> 
> As my sig used to say, razors are a barbarous relic.


Why are you saying your unofficial? in you sig just curious








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I think using the vice method could possibly bend the IHS and lead to poor contact between IHS and die. Razer seems like the better delid method to me.


I prefer the blade as well, I have full control and a totally controlled environment as well.


----------



## illuz

I'd much prefer it if I had the vice myself, took me over an hour to delid with the razor blade purely because I was bricking myself and far too nervous to get stuck into it. I'd have to use the vice method if I were to delid IB-E, no way I'd take a razor to that


----------



## ronnin426850

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*


OP, I suppose you know you have a typo here







(more like a spelling error than a typo, since E and U are rather far apart, but who cares







)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ronnin426850*
> 
> OP, I suppose you know you have a typo here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (more like a spelling error than a typo, since E and U are rather far apart, but who cares
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


What? (sorry 13 straight hours of work get to you lol) make it stupid for me can you? I'm gonna sleep on that note be back in around 8 hours peoples!


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Congrats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 13~14c with higher ambient is a nice boost ^^
> So the IHS didnt take damage as previously mentioned?
> Did you CLU the chip only? or both chip and IHS? and what did you use for IHS <->Cooler
> Also.. I think I missed this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what CPU did you delid?


I delidded my precious 3770k with CLU on die and Phobya hegrease extreme between IHS and cooler. The IHS got some nasty indentations/scratches but I lapped them partly to get rid of them.
A bad quality picture of my IHS before treating it:


After partial lapping (also had scraped some of the adhesive):


I grinded it a bit after that too and the edges ended up being pretty smooth but I couldn't finish the lapping due to a lack of sanding paper.


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What? (sorry 13 straight hours of work get to you lol) make it stupid for me can you? I'm gonna sleep on that note be back in around 8 hours peoples!


Persuit should be pursuit mate


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Persuit should be pursuit mate


someone made it for me


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> someone made it for me


I love how no one noticed till now though.
I guess we are all grammar noobs









PS - change it from IB to just club.


----------



## alancsalt

People noticed, they just didn't say so that they wouldn't look like being "That Guy!".. the grammar nazi... spelling pedant, ... or something..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I love how no one noticed till now though.
> I guess we are all grammar noobs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS - change it from IB to just club.


Haha, didn't even notice myself








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> People noticed, they just didn't say so that they wouldn't look like being "That Guy!".. the grammar nazi... spelling pedant, ... or something..


You're now that guy!


----------



## alancsalt

Aaaaaargh!

Respectfully submit that ronnin426850 is "that guy!".....



Better get the original artist to change it to Delidded Club - background is bit busy to fake quickly...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hahaha


----------



## Darkshadow74

Off the wall question, on Tims, if I delid can I use Indigo Extreme still?


----------



## aweisberg

Thanks for putting the tutorial together at post #1. I am doing my first delid on a 4770k (more money than brains).

It's not going well, I made the mistake of trying to slice instead of pushing and I think I am cutting the IHS on the corner I started with. I am getting gold dust (assuming IHS is nickel coated copper something?).

Also dinged one corner dropping the CPU and one wore away the edge a bit.









http://s105.photobucket.com/user/adweisbe/media/photo2_zps54e09848.jpg.html

How about the method with two people where one holds the CPU and another taps the razor under with a hammer? I push really hard and it doesn't seem to go under.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> Thanks for putting the tutorial together at post #1. I am doing my first delid on a 4770k (more money then brains).
> 
> It's not going well, I made the mistake of trying to slice instead of pushing and I think I am cutting the IHS on the corner I started with. I am getting gold dust (assuming IHS is nickel coated copper something?).
> 
> Also dinged one corner dropping the CPU and one wore away the edge a bit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://s105.photobucket.com/user/adweisbe/media/photo2_zps54e09848.jpg.html
> 
> *How about the method with two people where one holds the CPU and another taps the razor under with a hammer? I push really hard and it doesn't seem to go under.*


I'm sorry but if you're already mining gold it's already too late..
Go try it in a PC, doubt she'll work









EDIT: Upon further inspection.. Have you actually cut into the IHS or the CPU? It could be the IHS and in that case you're safe.. Barely


----------



## LagunaX

Think you've cut into the green pcb and cut some underlying metal - not good.
Stop and see if the processor still works.


----------



## aweisberg

Got it off, the corner I started with is almost fine, there are some nicks, but the rest is great exceeeeept... I cruised through two resistors. Be VERY mindful of the corner where the resistors stick out farther. If anyone can get a macro shot of that it would be super, but it sure looks like I blew it.

http://s105.photobucket.com/user/adweisbe/media/photo3_zps87b5166c.jpg.html


----------



## lilchronic

this chip still works but only single channel memory,



a lil hope for the guy


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> Got it off, the corner I started with is almost fine, there are some nicks, but the rest is great exceeeeept... I cruised through two resistors. Be VERY mindful of the corner where the resistors stick out farther. If anyone can get a macro shot of that it would be super, but it sure looks like I blew it.
> 
> http://s105.photobucket.com/user/adweisbe/media/photo3_zps87b5166c.jpg.html


Might as well try it.. I mean it can't really hurt the motherboard and it MAY still work


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *someone made it for me*


"my dog ate my homework spell-check..." ...or more likely, it was 'That Guy's' dog


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> "my dog ate my homework spell-check..." ...or more likely, it was 'That Guy's' dog


hahah I havea shirt that says that


----------



## aweisberg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Might as well try it.. I mean it can't really hurt the motherboard and it MAY still work


You missed the part about more money than brains







Going to pick up a new one from micro-center tonight. I don't want to spend the time assembling a CPU with busted resistors.

I was emotionally and financially prepared for this outcome. My only regret is not getting the first one from microcenter and paying 60$ extra on Amazon.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> Got it off, the corner I started with is almost fine, there are some nicks, but the rest is great exceeeeept... I cruised through two resistors. Be VERY mindful of the corner where the resistors stick out farther. If anyone can get a macro shot of that it would be super, but it sure looks like I blew it.
> 
> http://s105.photobucket.com/user/adweisbe/media/photo3_zps87b5166c.jpg.html


Looking at the pic, Val should make a haswell note in the OP that with razors, start shoving the razor at the corner opposite the big round dot, & be very careful with the razor on the corners with the big round dot & arrow mark to save the SMD caps on the PCB.


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> Off the wall question, on Tims, if I delid can I use Indigo Extreme still?


I know no one knows if it will work with 1150 yet, I am in contact with the company about if the 1155 will work with the 1150. But on the Ivy when you delided could you then use IE on you lid after placement?


----------



## WiSK

Is this okay? I considered wiping off the excess CLU but then I thought, it's metal, it might scratch the PCB if I wipe it?


----------



## dr/owned

Once its on the PCB you need alcohol to get it off. Should wipe off super easily.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Once its on the PCB you need alcohol to get it off. Should wipe off super easily.


I just drank all the alcohol. But I mean, do I need to get it off? Can I just leave it, or will it eat into the PCB glaze and cause a short circuit underneath?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I love how no one noticed till now though.
> I guess we are all grammar noobs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS - change it from IB to just club.


i cant change it.. i suck at that stuff...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> People noticed, they just didn't say so that they wouldn't look like being "That Guy!".. the grammar nazi... spelling pedant, ... or something..


hey... take out ivy bridge and I'll be happy








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Aaaaaargh!
> 
> Respectfully submit that ronnin426850 is "that guy!".....
> 
> 
> 
> Better get the original artist to change it to Delidded Club - background is bit busy to fake quickly...


come on change it!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking at the pic, Val should make a haswell note in the OP that with razors, start shoving the razor at the corner opposite the big round dot, & be very careful with the razor on the corners with the big round dot & arrow mark to save the SMD caps on the PCB.


I spose i should...


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> You missed the part about more money than brains
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to pick up a new one from micro-center tonight. I don't want to spend the time assembling a CPU with busted resistors.
> 
> I was emotionally and financially prepared for this outcome. My only regret is not getting the first one from microcenter and paying 60$ extra on Amazon.


Buy the $29 CPU warranty from Microcenter that covers ANY damage including anything you do to it. I've used it on a 3770k killed by X-Acto pcb scrape delidding before. And if you don't kill it, you can still trade for a new one later if the current one degrades.

You cruised thru 2 resistors?

As they say in Essos and some parts of Westeros, "Haswell Morghulis."


----------



## L36

This is why i don't like the razor method especially on haswell. Nicking those caps is very easy..


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> 
> 
> Is this okay? I considered wiping off the excess CLU but then I thought, it's metal, it might scratch the PCB if I wipe it?


That looks like waaay too much CLU man (though i'm not certain)


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> 
> 
> Is this okay? I considered wiping off the excess CLU but then I thought, it's metal, it might scratch the PCB if I wipe it?


I would wipe the excess CLU.. also, didnt you put quite a lot on? hard to tell on the pic


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> This is why i don't like the razor method especially on haswell. Nicking those caps is very easy..


Hammer and vice method may be the better choice for HW.

Brain surgeon hands and concentration required for HW delid with razer.


----------



## aweisberg

Thanks that is great advice with the microcenter warranty. Too bad I already picked it up.

I delidded the second one and that went quite a bit better. It was actually harder to get the razor under on this one. I also marked with a sharpy all the important points on the IHS so I knew how far I could go in.

I would not attempt that corner with a razor at all. Do almost everything else and then use a plastic spreader to lift up the IHS.

Here is a photo of the failed delid


And here is a photo of the second one. I think I succeeded, but I won't know till I get to try it tomorrow.


----------



## Cr4zy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> Thanks that is great advice with the microcenter warranty. Too bad I already picked it up.
> 
> I delidded the second one and that went quite a bit better. It was actually harder to get the razor under on this one. I also marked with a sharpy all the important points on the IHS so I knew how far I could go in.
> 
> I would not attempt that corner with a razor at all. Do almost everything else and then use a plastic spreader to lift up the IHS.
> 
> Here is a photo of the failed delid
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And here is a photo of the second one. I think I succeeded, but I won't know till I get to try it tomorrow.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Sucks about the first one, glad the second one worked though, looks good!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> 
> 
> Is this okay? I considered wiping off the excess CLU but then I thought, it's metal, it might scratch the PCB if I wipe it?


CLU comes off very easily from the die or pcb with 90%+ isopropyl alcohol and qtips. Hard to tell from the angle but your die application might be ok. However, you have way, way too much on the IHS. If you place any on the underside of the IHS it should only be a very light staining, no excess of any kind. You can do it with just what remains on the brush from doing the die, and you only need to cover the part where the die goes.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> i cant change it.. i suck at that stuff...
> hey... take out ivy bridge and I'll be happy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> come on change it!
> I spose i should...


Do you have the original PSD file? If not I could make one from scratch this sunday.


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I love how no one noticed till now though.
> I guess we are all grammar noobs


I did looong time ago








But since I'm learning english as a foreign language, I never discarded the possibility of it to be well-written


----------



## alancsalt

with apologies to the original artist for taking liberties...


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> with apologies to the original artist for taking liberties...


We need one that says "Direct Die: Because IHS is for puss**s."


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> I did looong time ago
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But since I'm learning english as a foreign language, I never discarded the possibility of it to be well-written


What's ironic is that in some cases ESL students speak better english than many native speakers.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Good job!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> Thanks that is great advice with the microcenter warranty. Too bad I already picked it up.
> 
> I delidded the second one and that went quite a bit better. It was actually harder to get the razor under on this one. I also marked with a sharpy all the important points on the IHS so I knew how far I could go in.
> 
> I would not attempt that corner with a razor at all. Do almost everything else and then use a plastic spreader to lift up the IHS.
> 
> Here is a photo of the failed delid
> 
> 
> And here is a photo of the second one. I think I succeeded, but I won't know till I get to try it tomorrow.


wait so you bought a 2nd chip to delid without even seeing if the 1st chip was broken or not? Are you ******ed?

What kind of razor blade are you using? Every failed delid I've heard of was because the person used the wrong type of razor blade (there's actually multiple types, some much thicker and hence harder to use than others). Though with the on-die VRM I can see even the right razor being a problem...

Did you use a razor blade or vice for the 2nd chip? If you used a razor for the 2nd time that woudl seem really stupid...


----------



## dr/owned

I don't see why anyone would use the razor method when the vice method only costs < $30 tops, and is far more idiot proof.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I don't see why anyone would use the razor method when the vice method only costs < $30 tops, and is far more idiot proof.


Just because it may seem more idiot proof and $30 tops, I still do the razor method. I like it better and it's easier for me rather than breaking out my vice....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just because it may seem more idiot proof and $30 tops, I still do the razor method. I like it better and it's easier for me rather than breaking out my vice....


i prefer the blade as well


----------



## Belial

yea but with the on-die vrms im worried about delidding with a razor. i would go razor if it werent for those. Maybe I'll do a combination of the two, ie use a razor on part of it, then a vice on that last edge....


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> yea but with the on-die vrms im worried about delidding with a razor. i would go razor if it werent for those. Maybe I'll do a combination of the two, ie use a razor on part of it, then a vice on that last edge....


I think the idea of a razor + a plastic card is the best for Haswell, I'd try it but I'm just another poor uni student haha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> i prefer the blade as well


Same, heh. Without sounding like I'm an emo though


----------



## Forceman

Well, delidded mine tonight (4770K). Used the vice and hammer method - the first three knocks or so didn't seem to do anything, so I gave it one more good whack and the chip flew clean out of the vice. Luckily I had heard the story of the other guy that happened to and put a towel behind the vice, but I was still pretty worried about knocking those surface mount components off. Turns out to be fine, but I'm still stuck using MX-3 on the die until the CLU comes in next week, so I only got a 5-10C reduction. Currently testing at 4.4 @ 1.33V (although it idles at 0.750V) so it appears I didn't get the greatest chip. Still some tweaking to do though.

By the way - how does everyone keep the IHS centered while fastening the socket clip thing? The one on the Gigabyte board is the kind that sort of slides into place, and it keeps moving the IHS when I lock it down.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> That looks like waaay too much CLU man (though i'm not certain)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I would wipe the excess CLU.. also, didnt you put quite a lot on? hard to tell on the pic


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> CLU comes off very easily from the die or pcb with 90%+ isopropyl alcohol and qtips. Hard to tell from the angle but your die application might be ok. However, you have way, way too much on the IHS. If you place any on the underside of the IHS it should only be a very light staining, no excess of any kind. You can do it with just what remains on the brush from doing the die, and you only need to cover the part where the die goes.


It is really thin on both die and IHS, just on the IHS I perhaps wiped it over a bigger area than necessary. But just in case I'll wipe it all off and start again.

Still my actual question was: is it bad to leave some on the PCB?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I don't see why anyone would use the razor method when the vice method only costs < $30 tops, and is far more idiot proof.


Indeed. Two or three sharp taps with the hammer and it's loose. I was surprised how easy that was.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Well, delidded mine tonight (4770K). Used the vice and hammer method - the first three knocks or so didn't seem to do anything, so I gave it one more good whack and the chip flew clean out of the vice. Luckily I had heard the story of the other guy that happened to and put a towel behind the vice, but I was still pretty worried about knocking those surface mount components off. Turns out to be fine, but I'm still stuck using MX-3 on the die until the CLU comes in next week, so I only got a 5-10C reduction. Currently testing at 4.4 @ 1.33V (although it idles at 0.750V) so it appears I didn't get the greatest chip. Still some tweaking to do though.
> 
> By the way - how does everyone keep the IHS centered while fastening the socket clip thing? The one on the Gigabyte board is the kind that sort of slides into place, and it keeps moving the IHS when I lock it down.


place the IHS farther up and slide it back to the normal spot.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Well, delidded mine tonight (4770K). Used the vice and hammer method - the first three knocks or so didn't seem to do anything, so I gave it one more good whack and the chip flew clean out of the vice. Luckily I had heard the story of the other guy that happened to and put a towel behind the vice, but I was still pretty worried about knocking those surface mount components off. Turns out to be fine, but I'm still stuck using MX-3 on the die until the CLU comes in next week, so I only got a 5-10C reduction. Currently testing at 4.4 @ 1.33V (although it idles at 0.750V) so it appears I didn't get the greatest chip. Still some tweaking to do though.
> 
> By the way - how does everyone keep the IHS centered while fastening the socket clip thing? The one on the Gigabyte board is the kind that sort of slides into place, and it keeps moving the IHS when I lock it down.


mx-3 is terrible. Hell, _mx-4 is terrible._. Getting a 5-10C reduction using MX-3 is awesome. You should be able to collect that extra 10-20C using CLU. As in 10-20C over where you are now.

As for the IHS being centered - well, you don't. It doesn't matter. Think about it. It doesnt matter if it's centered, it's all the same.

But really, as it states in the OP, you just put the IHS a bit high, and account for the slide.

Why do you say your chip isn't good? Why aren't you testing higher voltage, like 1.4v+?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> mx-3 is terrible. Hell, _mx-4 is terrible._. Getting a 5-10C reduction using MX-3 is awesome. You should be able to collect that extra 10-20C using CLU. As in 10-20C over where you are now.
> 
> As for the IHS being centered - well, you don't. It doesn't matter. *Think about it. It doesnt matter if it's centered, it's all the same.*
> 
> But really, as it states in the OP, you just put the IHS a bit high, and account for the slide.
> 
> Why do you say your chip isn't good? Why aren't you testing higher voltage, like 1.4v+?


nope wrong.. if you look at the PCB you see the small black line. that if the IHS slides onto it will not have a good contact at all with the die by any means. It's been proven in the thread before, the placement does matter sir.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> Thanks that is great advice with the microcenter warranty. Too bad I already picked it up.
> 
> I delidded the second one and that went quite a bit better. It was actually harder to get the razor under on this one. I also marked with a sharpy all the important points on the IHS so I knew how far I could go in.
> 
> I would not attempt that corner with a razor at all. Do almost everything else and then use a plastic spreader to lift up the IHS.
> 
> Here is a photo of the failed delid
> 
> 
> And here is a photo of the second one. I think I succeeded, but I won't know till I get to try it tomorrow.


...first off - hats off to doing *'that'* twice in a short period









...also, re your first chip, I have seen worse scratches (mind you on Ivy, not Haswell)...but with nothing to loose, try covering the scratches with a non-capacitive and non-conductive TIM like MX4...your 1st chip may yet have some life in it...I really have seen that work on delidded chips which looked far worse than what I see in your pic, though it is always a bit tricky to judge just by looking at a pic rather than the real thing...you didn't actually 'sever' anything in terms of traces on the PCB, I take it ? Anyway, good luck.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Well, delidded mine tonight (4770K). Used the vice and hammer method - the first three knocks or so didn't seem to do anything, so I gave it one more good whack and the chip flew clean out of the vice. Luckily I had heard the story of the other guy that happened to and put a towel behind the vice, but I *was still pretty worried about knocking those surface mount components off. * Turns out to be fine, but I'm still stuck using MX-3 on the die until the CLU comes in next week, so I only got a 5-10C reduction. Currently testing at 4.4 @ 1.33V (although it idles at 0.750V) so it appears I didn't get the greatest chip. Still some tweaking to do though.
> 
> By the way - how does everyone keep the IHS centered while fastening the socket clip thing? The one on the Gigabyte board is the kind that sort of slides into place, and it keeps moving the IHS when I lock it down.


You would have to be using a lot of strength to be able to knock those surface mount bits off. Solder is quite hard to break, as anyone who has tried to de-solder something can attest to.

I'm a bit sad-face I won't be buying a 4770k....I really want to turn my uber-cooling setup loose on it to see what it can really do. No more of this wimpy 4.5 ghz it-runs-too-hot stuff


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Why do you say your chip isn't good? Why aren't you testing higher voltage, like 1.4v+?


Too hot still. Goes 80+ with 1.33V and 90+ with 1.35V (Prime and IBT) - although that's running silent mode on the cooler. So I need the CLU before I can push it higher. Seems like it has a lot of temperature variation also - ranges from 60 to 80 while running a single iteration of IBT, I don't remember my Sandy chip swinging so far.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You would have to be using a lot of strength to be able to knock those surface mount bits off. Solder is quite hard to break, as anyone who has tried to de-solder something can attest to.


I bet the guy who cut them off with the razor blade doesn't think so. I was just shocked that it came completely off - the earlier hits must have loosened the glue more than I thought.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I think the idea of a razor + a plastic card is the best for Haswell, I'd try it but I'm just another poor uni student haha.


^This!
Just cut one corner with the blade and then slide a plastic card all the way through, greatly reduces risk!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...first off - hats off to doing *'that'* twice in a short period
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...also, re your first chip, I have seen worse scratches (mind you on Ivy, not Haswell)...but with nothing to loose, try covering the scratches with a non-capacitive and non-conductive TIM like MX4...your 1st chip may yet have some life in it...I really have seen that work on delidded chips which looked far worse than what I see in your pic, though it is always a bit tricky to judge just by looking at a pic rather than the real thing...you didn't actually 'sever' anything in terms of traces on the PCB, I take it ? Anyway, good luck.


look at the caps on the top left closer buddy I believe they are damaged. If I'm mistaken tell me


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> look at the caps on the top left closer buddy I believe they are damaged. If I'm mistaken tell me


...could be...hard to tell. But at least it is worth a shot to try the 'cover w/MX' (or nail polish) trick before it is just a, what, light-weight paper weight ?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Well, delidded mine tonight (4770K). Used the vice and hammer method - the first three knocks or so didn't seem to do anything, so I gave it one more good whack and the chip flew clean out of the vice. Luckily I had heard the story of the other guy that happened to and put a towel behind the vice, but I was still pretty worried about knocking those surface mount components off. Turns out to be fine, but I'm still stuck using MX-3 on the die until the CLU comes in next week, so I only got a 5-10C reduction. Currently testing at 4.4 @ 1.33V (although it idles at 0.750V) so it appears I didn't get the greatest chip. Still some tweaking to do though.
> 
> By the way - how does everyone keep the IHS centered while fastening the socket clip thing? The one on the Gigabyte board is the kind that sort of slides into place, and it keeps moving the IHS when I lock it down.


I used to do the place the IHS high and have the clamp slide it down method, then I found that I could simply use one finger to firmly hold the IHS in place right where I wanted it. Then I could clamp it down without it moving. Took a few tries to figure out how firmly to hold it so it wouldn't move, but it really wasn't that difficult.

I find this method not only easier but better in the fact I don't want the IHS moving around too much and messing up my CLU application on the die. It works very well on my MVF, but I can't say if other mobos have clamping mechanism that would work or not.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> It is really thin on both die and IHS, just on the IHS I perhaps wiped it over a bigger area than necessary. But just in case I'll wipe it all off and start again.
> 
> Still my actual question was: is it bad to leave some on the PCB?
> Indeed. Two or three sharp taps with the hammer and it's loose. I was surprised how easy that was.


Sorry, yes it ok to have a tiny bit here or there on the pcb of an Ivy chip. How I do it is paint the die with the included brush, then with what is left on the brush I put a very thin amount on the underside of the die, more of staining really. Usually there is the prior stain from the Intel TIM on the underside so you can see where the die will come in contact with it.

Then I take a q-tip with isopropyl alcohol and clean up the pcb since I find it impossible to paint the die properly without getting any traces of CLU on the die. But if somehow I don't get every possible speck of CLU off the pcb there is nothing bad that will happen. Now with Haswell though, I would be worried about covering those contacts and not getting any CLU on them.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> yes it ok to have a tiny bit here or there on the pcb of an Ivy chip.


Thanks, this is what I wanted to know.









So actually I'm going to leave those spills and if it shorts or melts or something, I'll come back and let everyone know not to do that


----------



## JSTe

Delidded my 3570k (4.5Ghz, 1.18v) earlier today.

Pre-delid temps on a standard IBT (10) run were around 72ºC.

So, I took my vice, a hammer and a piece of wood. Couple of hits later the PCB eased itself loose.
Cleaned all surfaces nicely and added a layer of MX-4 to the die, didn't look like it was soaked though after I evened it out.
Put everything back together and added another layer of MX-4 between the IHS and True Spirit 120, again, no soaking.

Ran the same IBT run, temps were around 85ºC

I've read that some TIM's need to be broken in and they only give their best after a period of time. Could this be the case? I can't think of any explanation other than this.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JSTe*
> 
> Delidded my 3570k (4.5Ghz, 1.18v) earlier today.
> 
> Pre-delid temps on a standard IBT (10) run were around 72ºC.
> 
> So, I took my vice, a hammer and a piece of wood. Couple of hits later the PCB eased itself loose.
> Cleaned all surfaces nicely and added a layer of MX-4 to the die, didn't look like it was soaked though after I evened it out.
> Put everything back together and added another layer of MX-4 between the IHS and True Spirit 120, again, no soaking.
> 
> Ran the same IBT run, temps were around 85ºC
> 
> I've read that some TIM's need to be broken in and they only give their best after a period of time. Could this be the case? I can't think of any explanation other than this.


We don't use standard TIMs on the die, we just use liquid metal TIMs llike CL Ultra or Pro. I am guessing you used way too much MX-4 on the die to get measurably worse temps. Usually people get about the same or less than a 10c drop with standard TIMs on the die. Order yourself some CL Ultra, and try redoing the MX-4 on the die while waiting.


----------



## Delta6326

Hey guys I plan on getting a 4770k in about 2weeks, I was hopping to get a couple of these to try out first "INTEL SL9KK Celeron D 3.467GHz/512/533 Socket 775 " Can these be delidded?


----------



## aweisberg

Hooray, I am in business with the 2nd processor. I did CLU on die and on the IHS. I am going to run Memtest86 for a week before I do anything.

I am running a Corsair Carbide 300R with a Noctua NH-D14 and Corsair Dominator GT RAM. I took of the heat sinks off the ram, but I still can't mount the fan low enough mount the side panel. /facepalm. The heat spreader is too tall because it is threaded for the heat sink screws. *Correction, the 140mm Corsair AF-140 side panel fans are hitting the Noctua heatsink fins, not the fan*


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Well, delidded mine tonight (4770K). Used the vice and hammer method - the first three knocks or so didn't seem to do anything, so I gave it one more good whack and the chip flew clean out of the vice. ...
> 
> *By the way - how does everyone keep the IHS centered while fastening the socket clip thing?* The one on the Gigabyte board is the kind that sort of slides into place, and it keeps moving the IHS when I lock it down.


...that's easy, VonDutch, one of the '...originals" put s.th. in the OP way back







...I kept on having the IHS on my delidded chip slide all over the place (very frustrating) until I actually went back to P1 and read that bit...

"*Helpful tips about putting your Delided CPU back in the socket!(Courtesy of VonDutch)*

_...one tip after you done delidding and putting your processor back,
we noticed, that if you put down the bracket again, the IHS will slide a bit forward,

it will do so whatever tim you use,
except if you use a new/other adhesive/glue also

The trick is to start a bit more to the back when placing the IHS back, i think about 0.5- 1mm will do..
lower the load plate until it sits loosely on the top of the CPU package, check if its all good
Now lower it careful until you can snap it under
the stub holder on the side of the socket.
Lowering the lever takes a bit of force because you are compressing the load plate,
which in turn forces the CPU down tightly on the landing pins.

i held it with my finger in the middle if the IHS, but dont forget to clean it again
after youre done(fingerprints)

really, i tried to move it with a screwdriver afterwards, but could not move it,
so you have to get it right, before the lever is under the stub._."


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Haswell benches:
http://www.eteknix.com/computex-corsair-and-intel-host-oc-event-video/


----------



## chronicfx

I just want to see some Haswell overclocks... Air/water please.. Nothing under 1.4v.. and delidded. Is that really too much to ask. What is taking everyone so long.. I woulda had my OC done the first night.. Send me paypal for a chip and motherboard and I will post tomorrow


----------



## Forceman

I don't think you are going to get 1.4V+ with any kind of normal cooling, even delidded. They get hot fast.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JSTe*
> 
> Delidded my 3570k (4.5Ghz, 1.18v) earlier today.
> 
> Pre-delid temps on a standard IBT (10) run were around 72ºC.
> 
> So, I took my vice, a hammer and a piece of wood. Couple of hits later the PCB eased itself loose.
> Cleaned all surfaces nicely and added a layer of MX-4 to the die, didn't look like it was soaked though after I evened it out.
> Put everything back together and added another layer of MX-4 between the IHS and True Spirit 120, again, no soaking.
> 
> Ran the same IBT run, temps were around 85ºC
> 
> I've read that some TIM's need to be broken in and they only give their best after a period of time. Could this be the case? I can't think of any explanation other than this.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> We don't use standard TIMs on the die, we just use liquid metal TIMs llike CL Ultra or Pro. I am guessing you used way too much MX-4 on the die to get measurably worse temps. Usually people get about the same or less than a 10c drop with standard TIMs on the die. Order yourself some CL Ultra, and try redoing the MX-4 on the die while waiting.


I used mx-4 on die when I first delidded the 3770k before the CLU arrived, not as much temp drop as with the CLU, but there was a temp drop. I would guess either too much or not enough paste, temps should not be going up, has to be a paste/mount issue.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aweisberg*
> 
> Hooray, I am in business with the 2nd processor. I did CLU on die and on the IHS. I am going to run Memtest86 for a week before I do anything.
> 
> I am running a Corsair Carbide 300R with a Noctua NH-D14 and Corsair Dominator GT RAM. I took of the heat sinks off the ram, but I still can't mount the fan low enough mount the side panel. /facepalm. The heat spreader is too tall because it is threaded for the heat sink screws. *Correction, the 140mm Corsair AF-140 side panel fans are hitting the Noctua heatsink fins, not the fan*


Memtest86 for a week.

What?
Why?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I just want to see some Haswell overclocks... Air/water please.. Nothing under 1.4v.. and delidded. Is that really too much to ask. What is taking everyone so long.. I woulda had my OC done the first night.. Send me paypal for a chip and motherboard and I will post tomorrow


Limited to air/water, nothing under 1.4V, & delidded. Yes, it is too much to ask.

water, but not 1.4V + & not delidded


1.4V +, but not air/water, or delidded


----------



## aweisberg

Quote:


> Memtest86 for a week.
> 
> What?
> Why?


I have the occasional failure after 3-4 days. I don't have a video card yet so all I am doing now is validating the memory and then overclocking. I am waiting to see what Nvidia 780 options roll in.

I did get bored and try out overclocking and validating with merssenne.org. I will run that overnight and then go back to memtest86. I also believe the memory is operating at 2133Mhz, but I don't have a utility on hand to display it. This is at 1.2 volts.



I haven't overclocked in ages so I was suprised that with turboboost it is impossible to set a fixed clock? I couldn't figure out how to disable turboboost and set the CPU to 4.6Ghz.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I used mx-4 on die when I first delidded the 3770k before the CLU arrived, not as much temp drop as with the CLU, but there was a temp drop. I would guess either too much or not enough paste, temps should not be going up, has to be a paste/mount issue.
> ...
> 
> water, but not 1.4V + & not delidded
> 
> 
> 1.4V +, but not air/water, or delidded


...leave it to *FtW*, or is that *FtW 20* - no wait it is *FtW 420* - sorry, that 'multiple personality thing again (per MrTooshort's Valley post)...anyways, congrats







that's the first time I have seen a Haswell match some of the Ivy in terms of speed


----------



## kikibgd

@FtW 420
what cooling was used in benching ?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 1.4V +, but not air/water, or delidded


and what were the temps? guess you dont need real temp showing


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...leave it to *FtW*, or is that *FtW 20* - no wait it is *FtW 420* - sorry, that 'multiple personality thing again (per MrTooshort's Valley post)...anyways, congrats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that's the first time I have seen a Haswell match some of the Ivy in terms of speed


the 4600Mhz screen was from the same time, I did fix it for the 5200. I still hope the chip has more in it, there is voltage headroom, just have to learn the board better. The basics are still basics, but a lot more bios setting options in z87.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> @FtW 420
> what cooling was used in benching ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> and what were the temps? guess you dont need real temp showing


In the benches without realtemp it was cascade cooled (phase change). Realtemp doesn't read under 0° so no point in leaving it open.


----------



## nanoprobe

I have a delidded 3770k that won't boot. 09 error on MSI board which is soutbridge initialization. Same problem on 2 boards although the other (ASUS) doesn't have the code LEDs. Latest bios on both. Don't know what else to do. Any suggestions?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nanoprobe*
> 
> I have a delidded 3770k that won't boot. 09 error on MSI board which is soutbridge initialization. Same problem on 2 boards although the other (ASUS) doesn't have the code LEDs. Latest bios on both. Don't know what else to do. Any suggestions?


Did it work fine before delidding? If so try a single stick in each channel, a few people have killed a memory channel while delidding.

edit: also check the socket pins & make sure none are bent, likely not the issue if it's with more than one board, but never hurts to double check.
Also, an MSI z77 board, or is it p67/z68? those may need a bios update, they can throw weird debug codes when not updated before dropping in an ivy.


----------



## rv8000

So after taking the lid off my e1200 as a test i was putting my 3570k through its paces. For months now i've been at 4.5 @ 1.24v prime/ibt stable, the chip will boot at 4.7 or 4.8 with 1.35v, but i keep upping it and im at 1.4v in the bios now and 4.7 ghz at that voltage hardly gets through one pass of ibt, not to mention temps instantly sky rocket. Is it even worth delidding tbh?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> So after taking the lid off my e1200 as a test i was putting my 3570k through its paces. For months now i've been at 4.5 @ 1.24v prime/ibt stable, the chip will boot at 4.7 or 4.8 with 1.35v, but i keep upping it and im at 1.4v in the bios now and 4.7 ghz at that voltage hardly gets through one pass of ibt, not to mention temps instantly sky rocket. Is it even worth delidding tbh?


Have you enabled pll over voltage in bios and tried?


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> So after taking the lid off my e1200 as a test i was putting my 3570k through its paces. For months now i've been at 4.5 @ 1.24v prime/ibt stable, the chip will boot at 4.7 or 4.8 with 1.35v, but i keep upping it and im at 1.4v in the bios now and 4.7 ghz at that voltage hardly gets through one pass of ibt, not to mention temps instantly sky rocket. Is it even worth delidding tbh?


Better chip than mine, takes me 1.28v for a stable 4.5Ghz. Debating doing a delid myself, the cost of the CLU and Vice may be better put towards a new GPU or a Haswell.


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Have you enabled pll over voltage in bios and tried?


I think i reloaded a saved profile so I may have forgotten to set it, ill try now but I doubt it'll help. Just find it weird for one reason or another that i can do 4.5 at 1.24 then anything above it requires at least +.01


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> I think i reloaded a saved profile so I may have forgotten to set it, ill try now but I doubt it'll help. Just find it weird for one reason or another that i can do 4.5 at 1.24 then anything above it requires at least +.01


It isn't that strange, most cpus will keep overclocking to a certain point just needing small voltage bumps, then when they hit that point they start needing bigger bumps. The best sandy & ivy bridge cpus would get to 5Ghz + before they need the big vcore bumps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> So after taking the lid off my e1200 as a test i was putting my 3570k through its paces. For months now i've been at 4.5 @ 1.24v prime/ibt stable, the chip will boot at 4.7 or 4.8 with 1.35v, but i keep upping it and im at 1.4v in the bios now and 4.7 ghz at that voltage hardly gets through one pass of ibt, not to mention temps instantly sky rocket. Is it even worth delidding tbh?


Depends do you want that speed? Then if so then delid its all your choice I delidded to save my chip from heat not volts.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> I think i reloaded a saved profile so I may have forgotten to set it, ill try now but I doubt it'll help. Just find it weird for one reason or another that i can do 4.5 at 1.24 then anything above it requires at least +.01


Ivy bridge is this way. For some reason once the multi get above 45 most of the time the power needed starts to exponentially get higher.


----------



## nijikon5

Quick question:

I've had my 3770k de-lidded for about 6 months now. I was thinking about switching from the 212 to a H100. Will the IHS be stuck to the 212 when I try to remove it ( just curious, because I think I gave away my CLU ).


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It isn't that strange, most cpus will keep overclocking to a certain point just needing small voltage bumps, then when they hit that point they start needing bigger bumps. The best sandy & ivy bridge cpus would get to 5Ghz + before they need the big vcore bumps.


I know, it's just personally i've never hit that big of a wall without having a relatively above average overclock. Guess i've been lucky with past chips.

Just ran standard ibt with my 3570 at 4.7 and 1.4v, got through 3 passes then kicked the bucket. Temps were hitting upper 90s. I only really want to delid if i could get 4.7 at a reasonable voltage and run it 24/7 but won't be happening with this chip it seems


----------



## kikibgd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nijikon5*
> 
> Quick question:
> 
> I've had my 3770k de-lidded for about 6 months now. I was thinking about switching from the 212 to a H100. Will the IHS be stuck to the 212 when I try to remove it ( just curious, because I think I gave away my CLU ).


if the cpu is still locked in the socket you have no problem.

run some intel burn test for 10min let it get really hot and then take out the cooler(shutdown the pc first







), dont pull twist\wiggle the heatsink.


----------



## dr/owned

I have to replace both my CPU and watercooling tubing....there goes a full day.

Anyways, any pics of what the die->IHS looks like after a few months of CLU? Even though I'm direct die, my waterblock is nickel plated copper so it's the same thing as the IHS. I'm wondering how much of a hard time I'm going to have.


----------



## kikibgd

is CLU safe to use on copper\nickel base heatsink ?
as i understood its only problem with aluminium?


----------



## dr/owned

CLU is gallium (mostly) which dissolves copper to an extent and makes a cement. It only dissolves a very tiny amount though that can be polished off without much effort.

Nickel is where I'm unsure.

Aluminum will get destroyed by CLU.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> is CLU safe to use on copper\nickel base heatsink ?
> as i understood its only problem with aluminium?


...yes - copper and especially copper + nickel + CL-U ...perfect

...no...unprotected aluminum and CL-U


----------



## JSTe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> We don't use standard TIMs on the die, we just use liquid metal TIMs llike CL Ultra or Pro. I am guessing you used way too much MX-4 on the die to get measurably worse temps. Usually people get about the same or less than a 10c drop with standard TIMs on the die. Order yourself some CL Ultra, and try redoing the MX-4 on the die while waiting.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I used mx-4 on die when I first delidded the 3770k before the CLU arrived, not as much temp drop as with the CLU, but there was a temp drop. I would guess either too much or not enough paste, temps should not be going up, has to be a paste/mount issue.


Okay, thanks.

I ordered a syringe CLU and will redo MX-4 today.

I'll have another 3570k coming soon, so I'll probably be delidding that as well.


----------



## JSTe

Re-pasted the die and also fixed the PCB/IHS mount from the first install, as it looked to be pushed down when I took off the cooler.

Operated like a brain surgeon, and got temps down about -5ºC from my pre-delidded IBT run. Didn't record any exact temps for each core, but only took the average.

Atleast the improvement is definitely there, and thanks for convincing me to take another look.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I have to replace both my CPU and watercooling tubing....there goes a full day.
> 
> Anyways, any pics of what the die->IHS looks like after a few months of CLU? Even though I'm direct die, my waterblock is nickel plated copper so it's the same thing as the IHS. I'm wondering how much of a hard time I'm going to have.


I have just used a paper towel. no clean solutions just a piece of paper towel is all.....


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Hey guys, is 1g of CLP enough? I don't know how much it will take and the cheapest I found it advertised as "1 gram"

Edit : Nevermind, I just went with a tube of Ultra that looked a bit larger for $20

Edit again : I'm not sure if it came with the brush to apply the CLU or not. Does CLU always come with a brush?


----------



## aznpersuazn

Hey guys, has anyone tried placing Fujipoly thermal pads over the PCB and voltage regulators on a Haswell Chip, and has it further decreased your temps?


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> Hey guys, is 1g of CLP enough? I don't know how much it will take and the cheapest I found it advertised as "1 gram"
> 
> Edit : Nevermind, I just went with a tube of Ultra that looked a bit larger for $20
> 
> Edit again : I'm not sure if it came with the brush to apply the CLU or not. Does CLU always come with a brush?


CLU comes with a brush yes, however, it's easier to spread using cotton buds.

Also 1g of CLU/CLP is WAY more than enough. Seriously use a tiny amount and spread it out, you'll be surprised how far this stuff goes


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> CLU comes with a brush yes, however, it's easier to spread using cotton buds.
> 
> Also 1g of CLU/CLP is WAY more than enough. Seriously use a tiny amount and spread it out, you'll be surprised how far this stuff goes


Alright, thanks.

Ill come back with my Haswell delid once the CLU gets here


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yes - copper and especially copper + nickel + CL-U ...perfect
> 
> ...no...unprotected aluminum and CL-U


All it takes is 1 little scratch in the aluminum...


----------



## justanoldman

As to some questions regarding CLU over time, I posted about that before with some pics. Here is a link to the post, and there is a link to another post with previous pics in it as well.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/15350#post_19644142


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> mx-3 is terrible. Hell, _mx-4 is terrible._. Getting a 5-10C reduction using MX-3 is awesome. You should be able to collect that extra 10-20C using CLU. As in 10-20C over where you are now.
> 
> As for the IHS being centered - well, you don't. It doesn't matter. *Think about it. It doesnt matter if it's centered, it's all the same.*
> 
> But really, as it states in the OP, you just put the IHS a bit high, and account for the slide.
> 
> Why do you say your chip isn't good? Why aren't you testing higher voltage, like 1.4v+?
> 
> 
> 
> nope wrong.. if you look at the PCB you see the small black line. that if the IHS slides onto it will not have a good contact at all with the die by any means. It's been proven in the thread before, the placement does matter sir.
Click to expand...

No, you are wrong, again. The IHS will sit slightly on that raised black line when seated perfectly. If anything, you could make the case that you want the IHS seated 'higher' than normal as to avoid that black line. But then your IHS will make contact with those gold dots at the top and I'm not sure what would happen if you did that...


----------



## gl0ry

Hope you guys are enjoying your Haswells, but I got my 3770k from Retail Edge and I'm having a really great time right now. After delidding and getting my full rig together I can say I'm idling around~26c and ~60-68c on full load... This is at 5ghz with 1.39v.

I'm completely ecstatic! Costa Rica Stepping C!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> This is at 5ghz with 1.39v.
> 
> I'm completely ecstatic! Costa Rica Stepping C!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


That is amazing voltage for 5GHZ. What did you use to stress load it?

Stepping C? Is that a new stepping? Mine is stepping 9 revision A1 according to CPU-z?

How did you determine the stepping?

If the stepping has been revised I want to get one.


----------



## dr/owned

There's no such thing as stepping C. It's just a good E1 stepping.


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> There's no such thing as stepping C. It's just a good E1 stepping.


What? There isn't? I was told that by reading the batch it tells you what stepping it is.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> What? There isn't? I was told that by reading the batch it tells you what stepping it is.


Never heard of that. I thought CPU-Z read it.

We have the same mother boards. When you get some time please share your BIOS settings. What did you use to stress load it?


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Never heard of that. I thought CPU-Z read it.
> 
> We have the same mother boards. When you get some time please share your BIOS settings. What did you use to stress load it?


If that's the case then I have a Stepping 9 Revision E1/L1

Im using Prime95 right now as we speak with a blend test and using RealTemp to monitor the temperatures. It's what I've always used in the past.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> If that's the case then I have a Stepping 9 Revision E1/L1
> 
> Im using Prime95 right now as we speak with a blend test and using RealTemp to monitor the temperatures. It's what I've always used in the past.


If you could please post a CPU-Z validation URL to look at your CPU under load.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> If that's the case then I have a Stepping 9 Revision E1/L1
> 
> Im using Prime95 right now as we speak with a blend test and using RealTemp to monitor the temperatures. It's what I've always used in the past.


i also have Stepping 9 revision E1, i need 1.37v for 5ghz batch# 3233B499


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i also have Stepping 9 revision E1, i need 1.37v for 5ghz batch# 3233B499


Nice OC on yours as well.

His is revision E1/L1 which appears to be newer.


----------



## illuz

Seen a 3770k for sale earlier, 5GHz at v1.38 and temps at 70c. Wish I could have bought it and popped the lid, he only lapped it.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Nice OC on yours as well.
> 
> His is revision E1/L1 which appears to be newer.


I haven't really paid attention to the revisions, looking at screens my first (& best) one bought at launch had no revision number in cpu-z, all my 321xxxxx chips were E1, & the newer 322xxxxx show E1/L1


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i also have Stepping 9 revision E1, i need 1.37v for 5ghz batch# 3233B499


Oh yeah? I've only tried 1.4 and 1.39v haven't gone any lower. Maybe I'll try 1.37 if that's the case.

Awesome


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> Oh yeah? I've only tried 1.4 and 1.39v haven't gone any lower. Maybe I'll try 1.37 if that's the case.
> 
> Awesome


whats you're batch #


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> whats you're batch #


3243C807.

By the way when you say 1.37v are you talking in Bios or Windows?

In Bios I'm at 1.39v but in Windows with the Vdroop I'm at an exact 1.36v


----------



## Darkshadow74

Just got my Vice for my deliding, So now have to get my TIMs and i be ready as soon as the wife has a day off.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> 3243C807.
> 
> By the way when you say 1.37v are you talking in Bios or Windows?
> 
> In Bios I'm at 1.39v but in Windows with the Vdroop I'm at an exact 1.36v


ive checked with a voltage meter but on cpu-z it reads 1.368v - 1.385v @ full load and on voltage meter it reads 1.37v-1.384v


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive checked with a voltage meter but on cpu-z it reads 1.368v - 1.385v @ full load and on voltage meter it reads 1.37v-1.38v


Oh ok, my Bios is 1.39v and on windows its 1.36v. Probably not gonna lower it any more then. Either way it's great!


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ive checked with a voltage meter but on cpu-z it reads 1.368v - 1.385v @ full load and on voltage meter it reads 1.37v-1.384v


My ASRock OC Formula reports a higher voltage than the multimeter (quite a bit higher). Looks like yours is pretty accurate. Strange


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> Just got my Vice for my deliding, So now have to get my TIMs and i be ready as soon as the wife has a day off.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Justa an FYI, I have seen people have trouble with that type of vise. They tend to just attach it to a table and when hitting the chip the vise/table will give a little and absorb most of the energy from the hammer blow.

Make sure to attach it to something that will not move, and when you hit the chip you should not see the vise move in any way.


----------



## lilchronic

i use additional turbo voltage and offset voltage in my bios for 5ghz also with C state C1E enabled so i dont set it at a certain voltage.

heres some bios pics 4.8ghz @1.26v in winows and voltage meter


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Darkshadow74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Justa an FYI, I have seen people have trouble with that type of vise. They tend to just attach it to a table and when hitting the chip the vise/table will give a little and absorb most of the energy from the hammer blow.
> 
> Make sure to attach it to something that will not move, and when you hit the chip you should not see the vise move in any way.


Yeah I have a bench set up i work on and it made of heavy wood and its against the wall, I use it to bet stuff up all the time.


----------



## ChIck3n

I think I need a little convincing. I want to delid my new 4770K, but I just can't silence that part of my brain saying "are you REALLY going to hit your new expensive CPU with a hammer?". It seems like most people are running watercooling when they get these 20C temp drops, so would I see similar drops using an air cooler (Hyper 212 EVO with 100CFM fan)? I'm currently on 4.2GHz with 1.22vcore, and getting about 80C when I run Intel burn test. I tried the auto voltage on my motherboard and it cranked it up over 1.4 when I tried 4.4GHz which brought the temps up to 100C, so now I am playing around with various settings in manual.

So, should it be worth it to delid and use CLU between the die/IHS and IHS/Hyper 212?


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChIck3n*
> 
> I think I need a little convincing. I want to delid my new 4770K, but I just can't silence that part of my brain saying "are you REALLY going to hit your new expensive CPU with a hammer?". It seems like most people are running watercooling when they get these 20C temp drops, so would I see similar drops using an air cooler (Hyper 212 EVO with 100CFM fan)? I'm currently on 4.2GHz with 1.22vcore, and getting about 80C when I run Intel burn test. I tried the auto voltage on my motherboard and it cranked it up over 1.4 when I tried 4.4GHz which brought the temps up to 100C, so now I am playing around with various settings in manual.
> 
> So, should it be worth it to delid and use CLU between the die/IHS and IHS/Hyper 212?


I will make this easier for you. You would be hitting it with a piece of wood.


----------



## tw33k

Here's my 4.8GHz but I'm going to tweak it a bit because I think I can drop the voltage some more. You can see the difference between CPU-Z and my DMM...


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Here's my 4.8GHz but I'm going to tweak it a bit because I think I can drop the voltage some more. You can see the difference between CPU-Z and my DMM...


what kind of DMM do u have? how do you do that


----------



## tw33k

It's a DigiTech QM1571. It connects to my PC via wireless USB and records real time using the included software


----------



## Belial

So what's up with ivy? Are all ivies nowadays golden because of some weird manufacturing thing? Or what? What was that whole deal about, did that ever mean anything?

Im considering just buying an ivy instead of haswell...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChIck3n*
> 
> I think I need a little convincing. I want to delid my new 4770K, but I just can't silence that part of my brain saying "are you REALLY going to hit your new expensive CPU with a hammer?". It seems like most people are running watercooling when they get these 20C temp drops, so would I see similar drops using an air cooler (Hyper 212 EVO with 100CFM fan)? I'm currently on 4.2GHz with 1.22vcore, and getting about 80C when I run Intel burn test. I tried the auto voltage on my motherboard and it cranked it up over 1.4 when I tried 4.4GHz which brought the temps up to 100C, so now I am playing around with various settings in manual.
> 
> So, should it be worth it to delid and use CLU between the die/IHS and IHS/Hyper 212?


Honestly you'll get a big improvement, but my recorded improvement was on a Silver Arrow SB-E, I'd say you're looking in the 15c range which is still great. I'd probably wait for more people to de-lid their haswells though to be sure that it has no negative effects on the chip because a 4770k ain't cheap..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I haven't really paid attention to the revisions, looking at screens my first (& best) one bought at launch had no revision number in cpu-z, all my 321xxxxx chips were E1, & the newer 322xxxxx show E1/L1


...from early February' 13 (Costa Rica 'c'







)




...from yesterday, less than 2 Ghz per (...where are *Hokies83 / IvanL* when I need them ?







)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> No, you are wrong, again. The IHS will sit slightly on that raised black line when seated perfectly. If anything, you could make the case that you want the IHS seated 'higher' than normal as to avoid that black line. But then your IHS will make contact with those gold dots at the top and I'm not sure what would happen if you did that...


The glue that holds your ihs negates the black line. Once dellided that black line will lift it up then. I want 100% perfect die contact I don't care if its a quarter of a millimeter. I demand perfect contact. I sanded both the top and bottom of the ihs for the best contact and even made the inner ihs flatter for better temps.

Unless haswells black line isn't beveled and raised like ivy then id say its fine. But any height difference I don't want. No matter how small.

Also the golden pads in the top area wont make contact with your ihs as those pads are slightly receased so it shouldn't be a problem.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...from early February' 13 (Costa Rica 'c'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...from yesterday, less than 2 Ghz per (...where are *Hokies83 / IvanL* when I need them ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...from early February' 13 (Costa Rica 'c'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...from yesterday, less than 2 Ghz per (...where are *Hokies83 / IvanL* when I need them ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Hokies is not having a good day, he is discovering the joy of having a defective apogee pump/waterblock setup that leaked on his board & made it stop working.


----------



## Vinnces

I was wondering what do you use to clean off the old Intel TIM off the DIE once you delided? Just regular alcohol and a cotton swap would be fine?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Hokies is not having a good day, he is discovering the joy of having a defective apogee pump/waterblock setup that leaked on his board & made it stop working.


...oh boy -







how much damage ?

...may be this is not the best time to ask him about AMD HD GPU setups, BIOS etc


----------



## JSTe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vinnces*
> 
> I was wondering what do you use to clean off the old Intel TIM off the DIE once you delided? Just regular alcohol and a cotton swap would be fine?


A soft cloth, like microfiber.


----------



## s74r1

Anyone mount CLC water coolers directly on the die? Or do those too have a risk of cracking die and/or poor contact like heavy air coolers?


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vinnces*
> 
> I was wondering what do you use to clean off the old Intel TIM off the DIE once you delided? Just regular alcohol and a cotton swap would be fine?


Cotton balls and alcohol. Both available within 50 feet of each other at Walmart, and cheap.


----------



## s74r1

I usually use coffee filters for CPU's, zero lint.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> So what's up with ivy? Are all ivies nowadays golden because of some weird manufacturing thing? Or what? What was that whole deal about, did that ever mean anything?
> 
> Im considering just buying an ivy instead of haswell...


I can't be sure because I only have looked at a small number of serial numbers which can be traced back to the wafer, but it might be production recently shifted to D1D from Fab 32 (maybe to make room for Haswell?). You can't tell this from the batch number printed on the box.

This weekend I'm going to see about looking at some parametric data (current and voltage measurements) to see if there's a correlation between this data and better overclocking die.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I can't be sure because I only have looked at a small number of serial numbers which can be traced back to the wafer, but it might be production recently shifted to D1D from Fab 32 (maybe to make room for Haswell?). You can't tell this from the batch number printed on the box.
> 
> This weekend I'm going to see about looking at some parametric data (current and voltage measurements) to see if there's a correlation between this data and better overclocking die.


Interested to see your results. Are the new "D" batch chips i've been seeing manufactured at D1D, you think? Or some other batch?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vinnces*
> 
> I was wondering what do you use to clean off the old Intel TIM off the DIE once you delided? Just regular alcohol and a cotton swap would be fine?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JSTe*
> 
> A soft cloth, like microfiber.


I just used methylated spirits, A tissue and some cotton tips to remove the excess TIM, I do this for many GPU's and CPU's whether they're nekked to the core or have an IHS. Haven't had any problems so far








"Only done" about 20-30 mounts on various things, probably even more haha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Anyone mount CLC water coolers directly on the die? Or do those too have a risk of cracking die and/or poor contact like heavy air coolers?


As far as I see it it should be safe, I'd say they'd weigh about the same as a regular block as a regular block is generally bigger and better made (More metal, more channels. etc). But the H100i etc does have a pump in it, pumps are fairly light though.

That being said any form of direct die is risky business.. I am considering it myself but I'm not sure, I'd kind of like to have a motherboard warranty still


----------



## Cyro999

Guys what's with the >20c rise in temps from using AVX instructions? Installing service pack 1 takes me from struggling to break 67c to poking at the 90's - on an overclock that it DEFINITELY should not - and i can't replicate this temp rise in any kind of game or in x264 etc. It's just, IBT, prime are unusable with service pack 1 installed (avx support)

And i dont mean like, delid, 20c hotter than sandy temps; I mean i'm more than 15c hotter than my friend on a 3570k with the same voltage, clock speed and superior cooling when i have it installed. Off vs off, temps are similar

I didn't delid yet, i'm not sure if i plan to soon, want to get a feel for overclock first because i have no idea w t f is happening


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Guys what's with the >20c rise in temps from using AVX instructions? Installing service pack 1 takes me from struggling to break 67c to poking at the 90's - on an overclock that it DEFINITELY should not - and i can't replicate this temp rise in any kind of game or in x264 etc. It's just, IBT, prime are unusable with service pack 1 installed (avx support)
> 
> And i dont mean like, delid, 20c hotter than sandy temps; I mean i'm more than 15c hotter than my friend on a 3570k with the same voltage, clock speed and superior cooling when i have it installed. Off vs off, temps are similar
> 
> I didn't delid yet, i'm not sure if i plan to soon, want to get a feel for overclock first because i have no idea w t f is happening


Pictures of screen with cpus and then we will need bios settings for your voltage pll and vcciso


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Pictures of screen with cpus and then we will need bios settings for your voltage pll and vcciso


I don't think he'd be very excited to be spending time on being in cpu experiment, but i didn't set either of those. Should i have done?

I expected Haswell oc guides a week after release so i didn't put a lot of effort into reading up. With the lack of them, i'm kinda blind here


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I don't think he'd be very excited to be spending time on being in cpu experiment, but i didn't set either of those. Should i have done?
> 
> I expected Haswell oc guides a week after release so i didn't put a lot of effort into reading up. With the lack of them, i'm kinda blind here


Are we talking of an Ivy Chip or as Haswell one? Either way AVX instructions increase the performance of the chip which in-turn makes it run hotter. If you look at the GFLOPS that you used to get before SP1 and then look at them now they should have doubled.

Unfortunately that's just the way it is, and yeah you're right in the fact that it doesn't effect games or anything that doesn't have AVX.









What cooling do you have? Just out of curiosity


----------



## Cyro999

The temperature rise is see is leagues more than him though, that's my point. I'l post shots with and without sp1. I have a silver arrow


----------



## Delta6326

What are your CPU voltage settings? Once you use avx your CPU will add more voltage it ca go from 1.275 to 1.31 by its self unless your using manual voltage.


----------



## Darkshadow74

Delidding my 4770k as soon as I get my TIMs and I wanted to find out what should I put over the areas that the CLU cant touch? And is CLU the best for this? I bought some Indigo Xtreme the day 4770k was released and wasnt thinking, because they where saying that the coolant mounting holes where same as 1155, so was thinking that IE would work on 4770k, then after i got it I started thinking about what if it runs under the chip? can it, if it turns out that the IE and 4770k work together on the top and Water block? and what do you suggest on the parts that need protection?

My real problem about buying CLP is that if it turns out that EI cant be used, I cant buy both CLP and CLU and I want something like CLU between WC block and top of chip.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

SO if I decided to do a delid. Could I just use PK-1 paste between the IHS? or would the temp drop not be as drastic?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> SO if I decided to do a delid. Could I just use PK-1 paste between the IHS? or would the temp drop not be as drastic?


By all accounts, normal paste doesn't work as well under the lid. 10C difference with CLU over regular paste normally.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> By all accounts, normal paste doesn't work as well under the lid. 10C difference with CLU over regular paste normally.


Well PK-1 is not on same level as AS5 its way better, but if your talking texture or something else, then I hear ya. No worth it to me then. Having to buy vice,hammer, and CLU. I already got a great clocker, guess ill just deal with temps.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Well PK-1 is not on same level as AS5 its way better, but if your talking texture or something else, then I hear ya. No worth it to me then. Having to buy vice,hammer, and CLU. I already got a great clocker, guess ill just deal with temps.


Liquid ultra has more than three times the thermal conductivity of pk-1. 32.6 wmk vs 10 wmk and with the amount of heat being immediately transferred through the small area of the die using pk-1 is a poor choice compared to clu.


----------



## y2kcamaross

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> By all accounts, normal paste doesn't work as well under the lid. 10C difference with CLU over regular paste normally.
> 
> 
> 
> Well PK-1 is not on same level as AS5 its way better, but if your talking texture or something else, then I hear ya. No worth it to me then. Having to buy vice,hammer, and CLU. I already got a great clocker, guess ill just deal with temps.
Click to expand...

You don't have a hammer? @[email protected]


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...oh boy -
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how much damage ?
> 
> ...may be this is not the best time to ask him about AMD HD GPU setups, BIOS etc


Think he is still drying things off & testing. The PSU was fine, hopefully gpus & memory are OK, the board will be hit or miss, if it does still work it might be buggy. Hopefully all will be well!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Well PK-1 is not on same level as AS5 its way better, but if your talking texture or something else, then I hear ya. No worth it to me then. Having to buy vice,hammer, and CLU. I already got a great clocker, guess ill just deal with temps.


Most are delidding to get the kind of clocks you can run as it is. Keping the warranty never hurts, & when you want to sell it, get a screen with the lowest voltage it can boot into windows & finish a run of pi 32m. The extreme overclockers look for the low voltage 5ghz that haven't been delidded, should sell easily for a better than average price.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Liquid ultra has more than three times the thermal conductivity of pk-1. 32.6 wmk vs 10 wmk and with the amount of heat being immediately transferred through the small area of the die using pk-1 is a poor choice compared to clu.


ya just did not wanna invest in much more considering its still risky as well.

On a non-delid 3770K and a crappy H20 620, im getting 4,8GHz at 1.270v max temp in prime is 85c Considering its mostly for gaming im cool with that.

Being greedy will only net me regret. lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Most are delidding to get the kind of clocks you can run as it is. Keping the warranty never hurts, & when you want to sell it, get a screen with the lowest voltage it can boot into windows & finish a run of pi 32m. The extreme overclockers look for the low voltage 5ghz that haven't been delidded, should sell easily for a better than average price.


Ya I agree, I just always dreamed of running 5GHz daily driver. lol I can get 5GHz prime stable at 1.35v but in order to do that I had to disable HT. Wich defeats the purpose of a i7.

I will just be happy with what I got, maybe even buying a H80i will help


----------



## Cyro999

Sorry for delay, i broke my windows install by using system restore to remove service pack 1 after it failed (funny how that works eh)

Here's pics. Exact same bios settings, nothing changed (aside from vcore, which i RAISED slightly for the cooler result because i was not certain of stability), with and without service pack 1




My ambients dropped some, but definately not more than 3-5 degrees. The gap is quite a bit wider in terms of C when you are pushing OC harder, and im kinda concerned over this.. Do AVX instructions really make the CPU run that much hotter? I heard a lot about haswell overvolting in certain stress tests when avx instructions are used, and i can't get temps anywhere remotely close to the sp1 ibt/prime temps outside of stress testing, i'm not sure how to proceed from here. The ivy friend runs 1.1v ~120gflops with max temps of ~60 on hr-02 macho, which means with silver arrow my CPU is 15c hotter than his macho on undelidded ivy at the same voltage to get the same gflops reported, that can't be the case, i have much better case airflow than him, i know a lot more about how to apply thermal paste, my temps are icy outside of stress tests with AVX. Is this really working as intended?


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

I'm pretty sure I got the best deal ever today! A fully working Asus p8vz77-v premium for..... $111! It's $450 on newegg! It didn't come with any of the accessories but I think I can live.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I'm pretty sure I got the best deal ever today! A fully working Asus p8vz77-v premium for..... $111! It's $450 on newegg! It didn't come with any of the accessories but I think I can live.


Sweet


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Sweet


Got to love microcenter







It overclocks so much better than my asrcok extreme 4. Right now at 4.5ghz stable @ 1.3V with temperatures of 43C load! i5-3570k, still going up on overclock.


----------



## Diarrhea

Hi everyone, new guy here. I'm up to page like 250 or something so still got a lot of reading to do but just wanted to say that I will be getting my CLU on tomorrow and I can't wait to start delidding my 3770k









One thing I would like to add is if any of you live in NYC, our public train system has this thing called Metrocards and they're like credit cards but super thin and super flexible. I will use that and a razor blade for the delidding and see how it goes


----------



## Cyro999

You should read some later pages, earlier is some outdated info


----------



## Diarrhea

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You should read some later pages, earlier is some outdated info


Yeah I plan to read up a lot further but that's where I'm up to at the moment. Or maybe I can just skip to like 1000 (or 1500) and read from there


----------



## Cyro999

Big thing i'd consider the vice method which seems much better unless you are really advanced or something. Safer than sticking sharp things under IHS if you don't know what you are doing, nobody talked about it before it was "discovered" more recently


----------



## .theMetal

Another successful delid by smashing it with a hammer












Before:


After:


proc is clocked at 4.22 (auto overclock) for both tests and it dropped 16c pretty much all around.

I honestly couldn't believe how easy it was. just a few solid smacks and just came right off. if I gave it a difficulty rating from 1 to 10, 10 being the easiest it was a 10.









My vise was just sitting on the ground and I braced it up against the edge of my bed post

I went ahead and used clu on the die and between the proc and heatsink. I figured why not use it. that and I ran out of my phanteks paste.

Just ran some prime95 and it wouldn't even leave the upper 50c range @ the same 4.22ghz. its an asus auto tune overclock. I think my proc would do much better when I actually attempt to overclock it right


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I'm pretty sure I got the best deal ever today! A fully working Asus p8vz77-v premium for..... $111! It's $450 on newegg! It didn't come with any of the accessories but I think I can live.


You will love this mobo! I haz it and will always recommend it







mobo buddies








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Diarrhea*
> 
> Hi everyone, new guy here. I'm up to page like 250 or something so still got a lot of reading to do but just wanted to say that I will be getting my CLU on tomorrow and I can't wait to start delidding my 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One thing I would like to add is if any of you live in NYC, our public train system has this thing called Metrocards and they're like credit cards but super thin and super flexible. I will use that and a razor blade for the delidding and see how it goes


Good luck sir! Also jump to page 1300 area will save you lots of time.


----------



## Cyro999

Anyone else experiencing the 20c temp rise with avx instructions?

It seems like a big deal, more temperature difference than delidding


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Anyone else experiencing the 20c temp rise with avx instructions?
> 
> It seems like a big deal, more temperature difference than delidding


Yes. It also went up quite a bit with Sandy and Ivy so it isn't unprecedented, although it does seem to be more pronounced now. I think it is because the chip is silently giving itself more voltage when AVX instructions are being used (coupled with the harder workload).


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Yes. It also went up quite a bit with Sandy and Ivy so it isn't unprecedented, although it does seem to be more pronounced now. I think it is because the chip is silently giving itself more voltage when AVX instructions are being used (coupled with the harder workload).


How are people overclocking when 1.2v on a silver arrow/h100i = thermal throttling? I mean 20c wont save you here. Delidding ivy allowed you to push towards 1.5v on a silver arrow/nhd14 - but you'll barely pass 1.3 at this rate on haswell it seems

Is there some kind of standard here, or ocing guides? I'm so confused. I thought it would be less of a weird mess where nobody knows anything a whole week after the cpu release, this was the first time i tried to buy something on release

I'm a bit hesitant to delid when i can clock to like 4.8 without avx, but then again there's no way i'd get past 4.5 1.19v with ht, 15c ambients and a silver arrow with service pack 1, it's not happening. I didn't expect such groundbreakingly bad results, i didn't buy a silver arrow and get an above average chip to run at lower gflops than any random dude running a decent ivy bridge at the same temperature

I dont even know why i posted in delidding thread, i was very strongly considering it, but i just don't know anything about overclocking Haswell. Thanks


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> No, you are wrong, again. The IHS will sit slightly on that raised black line when seated perfectly. If anything, you could make the case that you want the IHS seated 'higher' than normal as to avoid that black line. But then your IHS will make contact with those gold dots at the top and I'm not sure what would happen if you did that...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The glue that holds your ihs negates the black line. Once dellided that black line will lift it up then. I want 100% perfect die contact I don't care if its a quarter of a millimeter. I demand perfect contact. I sanded both the top and bottom of the ihs for the best contact and even made the inner ihs flatter for better temps.
> 
> Unless haswells black line isn't beveled and raised like ivy then id say its fine. But any height difference I don't want. No matter how small.
> 
> Also the golden pads in the top area wont make contact with your ihs as those pads are slightly receased so it shouldn't be a problem.
Click to expand...

Actually, when you delid, your IHS will not be raised up by that black bar. Some mysterious person posted this gif to show the idea:



You sure about the golden pads? Electricity can jump, and with the IHS squeezed on hard...


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> So what's up with ivy? Are all ivies nowadays golden because of some weird manufacturing thing? Or what? What was that whole deal about, did that ever mean anything?
> 
> Im considering just buying an ivy instead of haswell...
> 
> 
> 
> I can't be sure because I only have looked at a small number of serial numbers which can be traced back to the wafer, but it might be production recently shifted to D1D from Fab 32 (maybe to make room for Haswell?). You can't tell this from the batch number printed on the box.
> 
> This weekend I'm going to see about looking at some parametric data (current and voltage measurements) to see if there's a correlation between this data and better overclocking die.
Click to expand...

So... is everyone getting ivies recently getting golden chips? I mean this was all the rage a month ago, about 5.2ghz on 1.3v and crazy ivies, and suddenly we forget about it when haswell was released? THIS IS WHAT INTEL WANTS YOU TO DO.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Anyone else experiencing the 20c temp rise with avx instructions?
> 
> It seems like a big deal, more temperature difference than delidding


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> So... is everyone getting ivies recently getting golden chips? I mean this was all the rage a month ago, about 5.2ghz on 1.3v and crazy ivies, and suddenly we forget about it when haswell was released? THIS IS WHAT INTEL WANTS YOU TO DO.


Hahaha, Intel.

But yes I remember all the rage about it, a Golden 3570k/3770k will beat a regular Haswell or even a fairly golden one (temperature is the problem still).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Actually, when you delid, your IHS will not be raised up by that black bar. Some mysterious person posted this gif to show the idea:
> 
> 
> 
> You sure about the golden pads? Electricity can jump, and with the IHS squeezed on hard...


I know that gif!







those IHS had the bottom flanges sanded down a great deal like I did myself. But anyways besides this those pads shouldn't make and arcing I think. But for inquisition (no one expects the spanish inquisition!)







why are those pads there anyways? They don't make contact with anything.... at all ever....

Just curious


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> But for inquisition (no one expects the spanish inquisition!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> why are those pads there anyways? They don't make contact with anything.... at all ever....
> 
> Just curious


Probably for chip validation during manufacturing.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Actually, when you delid, your IHS will not be raised up by that black bar. Some mysterious person posted this gif to show the idea:
> 
> 
> 
> You sure about the golden pads? Electricity can jump, and with the IHS squeezed on hard...
> 
> 
> 
> I know that gif!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> those IHS had the bottom flanges sanded down a great deal like I did myself. But anyways besides this those pads shouldn't make and arcing I think. But for inquisition (no one expects the spanish inquisition!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> why are those pads there anyways? They don't make contact with anything.... at all ever....
> 
> Just curious
Click to expand...

Well my IHS did that spinning without any sort of sanding. I really would like to see you test the IHS making contact with those pads








Quote:


> Probably for chip validation during manufacturing.


That sounds interesting, do go more in-depth on what happens.
Quote:


> Hahaha, Intel.
> 
> But yes I remember all the rage about it, a Golden 3570k/3770k will beat a regular Haswell or even a fairly golden one (temperature is the problem still).


AVX2 is going to be a solid 20-30% performance boost. I happen to be one of the few people who will be using an AVX2 program so haswell is actually a leap in performance for me. I'm considering just getting an i5 instead of i7 too. But then I'm also considering just buying a phenom x4 build, and spend my $1200 on a gun lol.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Probably for chip validation during manufacturing.


Maybe, who knows apart from Intel?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Well my IHS did that spinning without any sort of sanding. I really would like to see you test the IHS making contact with those pads
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That sounds interesting, do go more in-depth on what happens.
> AVX2 is going to be a solid 20-30% performance boost. I happen to be one of the few people who will be using an AVX2 program so haswell is actually a leap in performance for me. I'm considering just getting an i5 instead of i7 too. But then I'm also considering just buying a phenom x4 build, and spend my $1200 on a gun lol.


I'd be too scared to spin it around on the core.. haha
Yeah using AVX2 is going to prove a big hit in performance, and why would you downgrade your PC to get a gun? Well it depends what type of gun.. But still!
Just play COD


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'd be too scared to spin it around on the core.. haha


Don't spin a Haswell, you'll clip those surface mount components.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Don't spin a Haswell, you'll clip those surface mount components.


Yeah of course








I have a mere 3570k though


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Actually, when you delid, your IHS will not be raised up by that black bar. Some mysterious person posted this gif to show the idea:
> 
> 
> 
> You sure about the golden pads? Electricity can jump, and with the IHS squeezed on hard...


I want von dutch back!! Where is he


----------



## Daredevil 720

I'm currently waiting for my 3770K to arrive (got it for cheap, 216 euros new!) and I'm considering delidding it.

I read somewhere that delidded Ivys die soon if you go with phase cooling. Is this true? And does this also apply to watercooling? I'm planning on building a custom loop for it in the next 3-6 months and I wouldn't want my sweet 3770K to die on me for no apparent reason.


----------



## illuz

If you plan on using LN2 or anything more extreme than watercooling, below freezing, then yes - do not delid. *I think* but don't quote me on this, the thermal paste actually blocks the transfer of heat at subzero temperatures thus causing the die to heat up instead of freeze - causing it to die.

Don't quote me on it, I'm sure a more experienced bencher whos used extreme cooling can clarify this for you.


----------



## Daredevil 720

I'm not planning on going sub-ambient. Just plain watercooling.

The thing you said about the paste, does this also apply to Intel's TIM? If so then Phase/DICE/LN2 cooling shouldn't be used either way with Ivys.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I'm not planning on going sub-ambient. Just plain watercooling.
> 
> The thing you said about the paste, does this also apply to Intel's TIM? If so then Phase/DICE/LN2 cooling shouldn't be used either way with Ivys.


I'm de-lidded and run a loop just fine, there are many other users too.

Honestly I've noticed a slight bit more voltage needed for the same overclocks, but that is because I was running it at 1.49x volts day by day (that was on air too at the time) but it's fine. I have to re seat as it was my first ever waterblock mount to anything which is different to a CPU cooler in getting right, I think I used too much thermal paste also and it was only MX-2 haha.









I get 28c idle with a 360 RX and say 45-50c load at stock.


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I'm not planning on going sub-ambient. Just plain watercooling.
> 
> The thing you said about the paste, does this also apply to Intel's TIM? If so then Phase/DICE/LN2 cooling shouldn't be used either way with Ivys.


No no, do not replace intels TIM if you plan to use anything more than water cooling. If you want to water-cool, by all means pop the lid and apply CLU/CLP


----------



## Sozin

I delidded yesterday and noticed an immediate 10c drop in temps, but I've noticed today that my temps have shot back up to almost pre-delid. Anyone have a guess as to why? I used CLU between the IHS and chip and some AS5 between the chip and H80. Position of the chip also looks normal (covering part of the black bar at the bottom). Idle temps are 35-37c, load temps hit about 60c, everything at stock.

//edit

So I went back and removed some of the CLU thinking I may have had too much, and now my temps went up even more. What the heck is going on here.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sozin*
> 
> I delidded yesterday and noticed an immediate 10c drop in temps, but I've noticed today that my temps have shot back up to almost pre-delid. Anyone have a guess as to why? I used CLU between the IHS and chip and some AS5 between the chip and H80. Position of the chip also looks normal (covering part of the black bar at the bottom). Idle temps are 35-37c, load temps hit about 60c, everything at stock.
> 
> //edit
> 
> So I went back and removed some of the CLU thinking I may have had too much, and now my temps went up even more. What the heck is going on here.


My simple advice: try again, double check everything, and take pics.
It is very hard for people to assess the situation without seeing how much CLU you used on the die and on the IHS if you used any there. Pics of the CLU application, of the chip in the mobo, of the AS5 application, etc.

I have applied CLU many times, and it is definitely possible to use too much or too little.


----------



## hotrod717

I think I'll be attempting to delid very shortly. Just purchased a 2700k as a back up should I screw myself or should I say if Murphy decides to rear his ugly head. I'm excited about playing with the 2700k as well. Have a nice vise and a variety of wood to choose from. Has anyone tried placing a "cutout" over the pcb and just twisting or is the "glue" more hard than it is pliable and requires the impact to loosen it. If it is RTV silicone it should just come off twisting back and forth.


----------



## Sozin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> My simple advice: try again, double check everything, and take pics.
> It is very hard for people to assess the situation without seeing how much CLU you used on the die and on the IHS if you used any there. Pics of the CLU application, of the chip in the mobo, of the AS5 application, etc.
> 
> I have applied CLU many times, and it is definitely possible to use too much or too little.


Here is a terrible picture of IHS and die. I only applied CLU to the die, the IHS is just transfer after being mounted.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> I think I'll be attempting to delid very shortly. Just purchased a 2700k as a back up should I screw myself or should I say if Murphy decides to rear his ugly head. I'm excited about playing with the 2700k as well. Have a nice vise and a variety of wood to choose from. Has anyone tried placing a "cutout" over the pcb and just twisting or is the "glue" more hard than it is pliable and requires the impact to loosen it. If it is RTV silicone it should just come off twisting back and forth.


I suggested the twisting method quite some time ago, but I am not aware that anyone has actually tried it. With a properly formed cutout I think it would work, but hey, I wouldn't be the one losing the chip if it doesn't work.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sozin*
> 
> Here is a terrible picture of IHS and die. I only applied CLU to the die, the IHS is just transfer after being mounted.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Well, that doesn't look like too little, but it is hard to see from the pic if it is actually too much. I can tell you that I spent a number of hours testing different amounts on the die before I found what worked best for my particular die and IHS.

It also took me awhile to test different configurations and TIM amounts between the IHS and cooler. No two IHS are the exactly the same, so if temps don't seem right then testing different things is the best way to go.

You should also take pic of the AS5 fingerprint on the IHS and cooler when you take it off. That will help you see if your cooler is making good contact.


----------



## Sozin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Well, that doesn't look like too little, but it is hard to see from the pic if it is actually too much. I can tell you that I spent a number of hours testing different amounts on the die before I found what worked best for my particular die and IHS.
> 
> It also took me awhile to test different configurations and TIM amounts between the IHS and cooler. No two IHS are the exactly the same, so if temps don't seem right then testing different things is the best way to go.
> 
> You should also take pic of the AS5 fingerprint on the IHS and cooler when you take it off. That will help you see if your cooler is making good contact.


So I went ahead and reapplied the CLU and my paste, checked for good contact between the H80 and the die, ran IBT and am sitting 48-52-54-58 across all four cores, and my idle temps have improved as well. Safe to say, I think she's back to normal.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sozin*
> 
> So I went ahead and reapplied the CLU and my paste, checked for good contact between the H80 and the die, ran IBT and am sitting 48-52-54-58 across all four cores, and my idle temps have improved as well. Safe to say, I think she's back to normal.


Nice.








Now get to ocing that thing.


----------



## Athelstan

What air cooling options are available for direct-to-die mounting?


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Well my IHS did that spinning without any sort of sanding. I really would like to see you test the IHS making contact with those pads
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That sounds interesting, do go more in-depth on what happens.
> AVX2 is going to be a solid 20-30% performance boost. I happen to be one of the few people who will be using an AVX2 program so haswell is actually a leap in performance for me. I'm considering just getting an i5 instead of i7 too. But then I'm also considering just buying a phenom x4 build, and spend my $1200 on a gun lol.


That's a lot of guess work. Instruction sets always take forever to hit the market. Years in fact, so if your gonna dumb ivy in order to get new instructions, your gonna be disappointed. Heck even the ones that have been out for years are not even being used in everything.

If you have a ivy that can do 4.8+ then your literally just throwing your money away.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> That's a lot of guess work. Instruction sets always take forever to hit the market. Years in fact, so if your gonna dumb ivy in order to get new instructions, your gonna be disappointed. Heck even the ones that have been out for years are not even being used in everything.
> 
> If you have a ivy that can do 4.8+ then your literally just throwing your money away.


He has a point..

Even if it only does 4.4 it is still really a waste, could you keep your rig and still get that gun?








Or sell it and get an i5 rig, and get the gun?


----------



## lilchronic

golden ivy? do i piss you guys of when i post this pic? lol


----------



## justanoldman

^Nope, just waiting for you to get an i7 like the big boys.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> ^Nope, just waiting for you to get an i7 like the big boys.


For all that extra gaming performance...oh wait...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> For all that extra gaming performance...oh wait...


He knows I am just kidding. He beat me in Valley, so I have to give him a hard time about something.


----------



## lilchronic

lol i7's do make me jealouse


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> golden ivy? do i piss you guys of when i post this pic? lol


My i7 does that in its sleep.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> For all that extra gaming performance...oh wait...


Yupper


----------



## King4x4

Well lads... I killed a 3770k tonight...

Tried vice and hammer method on a friends 3770k... Poor lads cpu flew out of the vice (Even though had it gripped tight!) and broke one of the circuits on the underside.

RIP 3770k

Bought him a replacement


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I'm currently waiting for my 3770K to arrive (got it for cheap, 216 euros new!) and I'm considering delidding it.
> 
> I read somewhere that delidded Ivys die soon if you go with phase cooling. Is this true? And does this also apply to watercooling? I'm planning on building a custom loop for it in the next 3-6 months and I wouldn't want my sweet 3770K to die on me for no apparent reason.


With sub-zero cooling you just want to avoid liquid metal tim, delidded should still be fine frozen with regular paste. Delidding ivy just makes it lose overclock headroom for extreme cooling.
Does not apply to watercooling at all, with regular paste you just have to watch for the TIM pump out effect.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Well lads... I killed a 3770k tonight...
> 
> Tried vice and hammer method on a friends 3770k... Poor lads cpu flew out of the vice (Even though had it gripped tight!) and broke one of the circuits on the underside.
> 
> RIP 3770k
> 
> Bought him a replacement


That sucks, second death I've heard about with the vice method due to cpu free fall.
Have to remember, when delidding a friends cpu, make him swing the hammer!


----------



## Leyaena

Still waiting for my CLP to arrive, ordered it a week ago, still hasn't even shipped yet








Will check in again once I've delidded the 4770k, with before-and-after temps!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Well lads... I killed a 3770k tonight...
> Tried vice and hammer method on a friends 3770k... Poor lads cpu flew out of the vice (Even though had it gripped tight!) and broke one of the circuits on the underside.
> RIP 3770k
> Bought him a replacement


Ouch, sorry to hear that.
The pcb flew off or the whole non-delidded chip flew out of the vise? If it was the latter, was it an older vice with worn or uneven edges?


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> My i7 does that in its sleep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yupper


Hmm, I notice a lack of hyperthreading comparison in those images, not a 3570k to be seen.





So in the most popular game currently capable of utilizing hyperthreading, there's no significant difference in average FPS.


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Still waiting for my CLP to arrive, ordered it a week ago, still hasn't even shipped yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will check in again once I've delidded the 4770k, with before-and-after temps!


Did you ordered it directly from CooLaboratory?

If yes, in my particular case using registered mail from Germany to México, it took the system a whole week to notify that the shipment had been sent (after the "we merged you payment with your order" notification







) and another week to have it in my hands









If this is not your case... idk what's happening then


----------



## Athelstan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Athelstan*
> 
> What air cooling options are available for direct-to-die mounting?


bump


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Athelstan*
> 
> What air cooling options are available for direct-to-die mounting?


Don't think I have seen anyone do it yet. Why do you want to go direct die? More work, cost, risk for a few c better. I know some are happy with direct die, but usually they already have a cooler that is easy to set up with direct die mounting.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Hmm, I notice a lack of hyperthreading comparison in those images, not a 3570k to be seen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So in the most popular game currently capable of utilizing hyperthreading, there's no significant difference in average FPS.


Incorrect. Crysis 3 is technically the most current game capable of doing this. As I proved in the screenshots, i7 does better than the i5. Fact. Sorry just the way it is. Also bf3 is known to have issues with hyper threading just google it.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Incorrect. Crysis 3 is technically the most current game capable of doing this. As I proved in the screenshots, i7 does better than the i5. Fact. Sorry just the way it is. Also bf3 is known to have issues with hyper threading just google it.


Again, not really the place for this conversation, but it's not an apples to apples comparison. The 3470 and 3770 in your second graph are only 4 frames apart with a 300 Mhz clock difference, the first graph doesn't even have a quad core i7 in it and even then the minimum frames on that 3550 are only 2 below the hexa core. Take a 3770k run a benchmark then disable HT and run it again, the only real way to get a viable apples to apples comparison.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

It's just a well known fact that games are starting to use more threads. Crysis 3 showed the more threads the better. Sorry just the way it is. Not only that but if you do anything else while gaming, or have massive GPU setups the i7 shines superior to the i5.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> It's just a well known fact that games are starting to use more threads. Crysis 3 showed the more threads the better. Sorry just the way it is. Not only that but if you do anything else while gaming, or have massive GPU setups the i7 shines superior to the i5.


Your own graphs don't support that. I'm not saying newer engines won't benefit from more cores, but HT is not as efficient as physical cores. The 4-6 FPS difference between an i5 and i7 at equal clocks (it can swing either way depending on the engine) is insignificant to all but 120hz gamers at resolutions above 1080p. Most gamers will see better results dropping that extra $100 into a better GPU.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Your own graphs don't support that. I'm not saying newer engines won't benefit from more cores, but HT is not as efficient as physical cores. The 4-6 FPS difference between an i5 and i7 at equal clocks (it can swing either way depending on the engine) is insignificant to all but 120hz gamers at resolutions above 1080p. Most gamers will see better results dropping that extra $100 into a better GPU.


Agree 100%

Typically it's better to put the money into a better GPU no doubt. But saying for gaming a i5 does the same job is just bs. We all overclock but it only nets a few extra fps, so then why OC? Same reason people jump for the i7 cause those few extra fps matter.

Also it has been proven a i7 is better overall, specially if you a multi GPU setup. Seriously just google.

For instance gaming and streaming your game is easier on a i7. There are tons of scenarios where having an i7 is advantageous.


----------



## Skullwipe

Most likely going to move to a 3770k if Haswell drives the price down a bit, can't justify replacing my solid 3570k when what I really need is a new GPU.


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Well lads... I killed a 3770k tonight...
> 
> Tried vice and hammer method on a friends 3770k... Poor lads cpu flew out of the vice (Even though had it gripped tight!) and broke one of the circuits on the underside.
> 
> RIP 3770k
> 
> Bought him a replacement


That sucks man.

Should place cardboard boxes or something to block the possibility of flight in the future.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> That sucks man.
> 
> Should place cardboard boxes or something to block the possibility of flight in the future.


As I'm going to be trying this soon, is that the only danger of the hammer and vice method?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> With sub-zero cooling you just want to avoid liquid metal tim, delidded should still be fine frozen with regular paste. Delidding ivy just makes it lose overclock headroom for extreme cooling.
> Does not apply to watercooling at all, with regular paste you just have to watch for the TIM pump out effect.


Thanks for clarifying! One question though.. What's the TIM pump out effect?


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> As I'm going to be trying this soon, is that the only danger of the hammer and vice method?
> Thanks for clarifying! One question though.. What's the TIM pump out effect?


You seem to be the second person who's ever claimed to have killed a cpu through this method. The first guy stated that his chip flew across the room as well, so I guess that's the main danger.






I documented my personal delidding and I never experienced anything like that, but I did place a small cardboard box in front of it in case it did happen.


----------



## kikibgd

btw why you dont ask someone to hold the cpu? anyhow you are not banging with hammer crazy...


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Well lads... I killed a 3770k tonight...
> 
> Tried vice and hammer method on a friends 3770k... Poor lads cpu flew out of the vice (Even though had it gripped tight!) and broke one of the circuits on the underside.
> 
> RIP 3770k
> 
> Bought him a replacement


...oh dear - though buying him a new one was a nice thing to do.

With the upcoming Ivy-E potentially deliddable (and being a much bigger chip) I probably still come down on the side of the (super careful) razor method rather than the vice-hammer method...more control if you keep your nerve...we'll see


----------



## Belial

^ Crysis 3 is way more GPU dependent than CPU dependent, and is literally the single, only game that appreciates extra cores and is below 60fps on an i5 (only other multi-threaded game is bioshock which will still do 80+ fps on an i5). Cherrypick much?

And as you can see, the i5 significantly outperforms everything but the SB-E, with which it's clearly going to be equivalent or better than SB-E at clock for clock. Crysis3 is the only game that an SB-E will be similar with Ivy, in every other game, an Ivy will outperform it due to the unoptimized nature of gaming.

The 2nd bench isn't as reliable, as CPU is all about minimum FPS. Average fps is useless info as that's just the GPU+CPU results.
Quote:


> I delidded yesterday and noticed an immediate 10c drop in temps, but I've noticed today that my temps have shot back up to almost pre-delid. Anyone have a guess as to why? I used CLU between the IHS and chip and some AS5 between the chip and H80. Position of the chip also looks normal (covering part of the black bar at the bottom). Idle temps are 35-37c, load temps hit about 60c, everything at stock.
> 
> //edit
> 
> So I went back and removed some of the CLU thinking I may have had too much, and now my temps went up even more. What the heck is going on here.


Dude As5 is garbage, that's why. _It's almost as old as DDR1 RAM_. It's significantly older than DDR2. How much has RAM changed since 2003? How much has CPU's changed since then? Likewise, what kind of differences you think paste has gone through? Just as much.

The difference between _modern, high end pastes_ is negligible. Just like in real world use, there's very little difference in 2000mhz RAM and 1600mhz RAM. But we are literally talking 2000mhz DDR3 vs 200mhz DDR1...

Use CLU on both the IHS and die. I see some people use a different paste on the IHS and it's absolutely silly (unless it's aluminum heatsink, but no one who is delidding or using CLU is using an aluminum heatsink). What's best for the die is best for IHS. H80 alsos is just a mid-range cooler, so that may contribute.

Glad to hear a remount fixed the issue though. As you can see, paste application is very important.
Quote:


> That's a lot of guess work. Instruction sets always take forever to hit the market. Years in fact, so if your gonna dumb ivy in order to get new instructions, your gonna be disappointed. Heck even the ones that have been out for years are not even being used in everything.
> 
> If you have a ivy that can do 4.8+ then your literally just throwing your money away.


I know exactly when AVX2 will be utilized by the programs I use... Sorry, I don't just GaMe on my chip. Otherwise I'd be buying a phenom x4 and have more than enough power. There's also consistent reports of starcraft2, the only game I play, appreciating haswell significantly over ivy per clock, a good 15%+ minimums reported.

I already sold my build, but I jumped on the offer of basically a 100% profit off what I spent on the build. I could still buy Ivy instead of Haswell for my new build. But the program I mainly use, uses AVX2, I also use programs that are heavily reliant on RAM overclocks so an IMC that can do more than just 2200mhz on 8gb on air is also a big performance boost for what I do. There's some single sided hynix MFR for $63 on newegg right now, an even better deal than PSC for $50 off ebay that do 2400mhz CL8.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

The way I see the i5 vs i7 debate:
Gamers = go or an i5 and spend the extra money on a better GPU
Anything else, apart from gaming (ie video editing which i do quite a bit) HT is useful thus the i7 (if you got the cash that said)

I got the i7 3770k - and I'm glad I didn't cheap out on the CPU.


----------



## self_slaughter

Cracked the top of my 4770k today









Easiest job ever and 15-20' cooler with mx-4 under the lid.
Liquid pro should be here during the week w00t!!!

You people sending your chips flying are hitting it way to hard!
Took two tiny little love taps with the cpu firmly in the vice for me (probably a bit too firm but it's only a heat spreader lol) and cpu moved less then half a cm when it cracked open.


----------



## Robbieboy

Man you got to love this De-lidding lark....

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/59/tempskm.jpg/


----------



## GaMbi2004

I see it is going well (for most) on the haswell delidding front







thats good to know, since my 4670k + the rest of my new PC should be here tomorrow or the day after.
How did you guys deal with the "over-pcb" resistors or what ever it is? heard a lot of suggestions: electrical tape, MX4, silicon etc..
has anyone used any of it? or are you just leaving them bare?

(pic borrowed from page one)


----------



## chefproject

Hey guys,
long time i didn't post, but now it's time to.......
I slammed on a custom build waterloop on my pc, some modding was necessary, cause the case had an option for wc, but not enough space inside the case to put my tube-res inside so.....
But most importend change is the 7870 with the block from EK, now i have a nice quiet and very cool system



temps after a blend run of prime95
and a full run of 3dmark11

which gives me this on 3dMark11



It's quiet impressive how watercooling can change your system in such a positive way and second of all it's pure fun to do this to your pc.









Here some pics of it


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I see it is going well (for most) on the haswell delidding front
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thats good to know, since my 4670k + the rest of my new PC should be here tomorrow or the day after.
> How did you guys deal with the "over-pcb" resistors or what ever it is? heard a lot of suggestions: electrical tape, MX4, silicon etc..
> has anyone used any of it? or are you just leaving them bare?
> 
> (pic borrowed from page one)


Didn't touch mine but I'm using mx4 on the die so it doesn't really matter for now.
Will be getting some liquid pro this week though.
Decided against the ultra because it looks too liquidy and I didn't wanna risk it rolling off onto the surface mount gear as I'll probably just leave it bare.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> It's quiet impressive how watercooling can change your system in such a positive way and second of all it's pure fun to do this to your pc.


Nice temps








But so many air bubbles! That thing must be noisy as hell churning through the pump.
Once you get them out should be alot quieter and temps should drop a touch more









Mind you at 1.48V I think the voltage will degrade your cpu well before the temps will!
Good excuse for another upgrade I guess when it does bite the bullet


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quick question, do I have a decent i5-3570k? 4.5Ghz @ 1.28V, 4.6Ghz @ 1.325V, 4.7Ghz @ 1.375V?
Thanks!


----------



## Leyaena

CLP arrived!
And ironically, it did so before they actually mailed me the tracking number -_-

Anyway, that means I'll be delidding this chip tonight, most likely


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> CLP arrived!
> And ironically, it did so before they actually mailed me the tracking number -_-
> 
> Anyway, that means I'll be delidding this chip tonight, most likely


Awesome, plan to take a video (Could you?)







I want to see this, well more specifically the results from it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Quick question, do I have a decent i5-3570k? 4.5Ghz @ 1.28V, 4.6Ghz @ 1.325V, 4.7Ghz @ 1.375V?
> Thanks!


Seems pretty decent for a 3570k!


----------



## L36

Just mask the caps on haswell with silicone or just apply non conductive TIM over them and CLU on the die. I went the liquid gasket route and CLU, no problems.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I see it is going well (for most) on the haswell delidding front
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thats good to know, since my 4670k + the rest of my new PC should be here tomorrow or the day after.
> How did you guys deal with the "over-pcb" resistors or what ever it is? heard a lot of suggestions: electrical tape, MX4, silicon etc..
> has anyone used any of it? or are you just leaving them bare?


Do not leave them bare if you are using a TIM that is conductive/capacitive like Ultra or Pro on the die. It is still too new for definitive answers as to which is best in covering them, but something like mx-4 would be pretty easy and safe.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Quick question, do I have a decent i5-3570k? 4.5Ghz @ 1.28V, 4.6Ghz @ 1.325V, 4.7Ghz @ 1.375V?
> Thanks!


Slightly higher voltage requirements than average but not bad at all. There are plenty of Ivy chips out there that need measurably more than 1.3v for 4.5.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> But so many air bubbles! That thing must be noisy as hell churning through the pump.
> Once you get them out should be alot quieter and temps should drop a touch more


The air will naturally propagate to the highest point in the loop, which in this case is a radiator. The easiest way to eliminate this issue is to just put a fitting in the top of your res, place a length of tubing on it and let the loop run until the noise is gone and you don't see any more air bubbles. Then remove the length of tubing and replace the cap on the reservoir after topping it off with distilled or your coolant of choice.


----------



## alancsalt

Hey Haswell peoples, could do with more > 5GHz validations for the [Official] 5GHz Club. Please overclock generously.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Hey Haswell peoples, could do with more > 5GHz validations for the [Official] 5GHz Club. Please overclock generously.


I think that'd be asking a bit too much out of my chip, 4.5 already needs ~1.3V to stay stable!
Unless you mean just a validation, but what's the point in that?


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> I think that'd be asking a bit too much out of my chip, 4.5 already needs ~1.3V to stay stable!
> Unless you mean just a validation, but what's the point in that?


Haswell really seems to be focused towards mobile and general use computing more so than enthusiasts or gamers. It's a shame, because the motherboards look fantastic and offer a bit more diversity than Z77 boards did.

While I don't expect to see the same kind of overclockability we saw in the Core 2 era, it would be nice if the K series was something more than simply chips with an unlocked multiplier. Perhaps a better TIM on the die, or a different IHS material for better heat conductivity.


----------



## Leyaena

*DELID SUCCESSFUL!*

*Chip:* i7-4770k
*Method:* Hammer and Vice
*Covered transistors with:* Electrical Tape


Spoiler: Undelidded Temps - Previous post



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've done some testing on the i7-4770k before delidding, and the results are nothing short of shocking, temperature-wise:
> 
> _For a very modest 4.3GHz overclock:_
> 
> *Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 83°C
> Core 2: 82°C
> Core 3: 79°C
> Core 4: 69°C
> Package: 83°C
> 
> *Running at 1.2V:*
> 
> Core 1: 89°C
> Core 2: 89°C
> Core 3: 86°C
> Core 4: 75°C
> Package: 90°C
> 
> *Cooling:* Corsair H100i, stock fans, running at 100%.
> *Voltage Control:* Manual, CPU-Z reported no deviation during testing.
> *Tested with:* IntelBurnTestV2
> 
> *Screenies:*
> 
> 
> 
> Needless to say, this has me somewhat disappointed...
> 
> As soon as my new syringes of CLP get here, it'll be _off with his head_!
> 
> *Edit:* Updated post with all relevant info I could think of, for future reference.






So here I am again, successfully delidded my i7-4770k a minute ago, ran some IntelBurnTest, and the results are every bit as spectacular as they were back when I delidded my i5-3570k!









*Before:*
*4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*

Core 1: 83°C
Core 2: 82°C
Core 3: 79°C
Core 4: 69°C
Package: 83°C

*After:*
*4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*

Core 1: 55°C
Core 2: 58°C
Core 3: 58°C
Core 4: 55°C
Package: 58°C

As you can see, temperatures evened out, and dropped 15-28°C across the board








Ambients are slightly higher now than during initial test, about +2°C.

*Screenshot:*


I went from shocked and apalled at Haswell's temperatures, to being reasonably happy again








When my custom loop and 900D arrive, I'll probably be sanding down the IHS again. I'd use the one from my 3570k, but that chip's been sold already.

Happy delidding, everyone!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> *DELID SUCCESSFUL!*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> *Chip:* i7-4770k
> *Method:* Hammer and Vice
> *Covered transistors with:* Electrical Tape
> 
> So here I am again, successfully delidded my i7-4770k a minute ago, ran some IntelBurnTest, and the results are every bit as spectacular as they were back when I delidded my i5-3570k!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Before:*
> *4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 83°C
> Core 2: 82°C
> Core 3: 79°C
> Core 4: 69°C
> Package: 83°C
> 
> *After:*
> *4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 55°C
> Core 2: 58°C
> Core 3: 58°C
> Core 4: 55°C
> Package: 58°C
> 
> As you can see, temperatures evened out, and dropped 15-28°C across the board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ambients are slightly higher now than during initial test, about +2°C.
> 
> *Screenshot:*
> 
> 
> I went from shocked and apalled at Haswell's temperatures, to being reasonably happy again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When my custom loop and 900D arrive, I'll probably be sanding down the IHS again. I'd use the one from my 3570k, but that chip's been sold already.
> 
> Happy delidding, everyone!


Oh Wow!! seams you have done it right! Nicely documented!
Would have liked some more pic's though







especially of the Electrical Tape.
Congrats








I just hope mine will turn out as well as yours did!


----------



## justanoldman

I would agree.
It will help new delidders if Haswell people take pics of the pcb with the contacts covered with something and whatever TIM they used on the die. Basically take a pic right before you put the IHS back on and install it.


----------



## chefproject

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> Didn't touch mine but I'm using mx4 on the die so it doesn't really matter for now.
> Will be getting some liquid pro this week though.
> Decided against the ultra because it looks too liquidy and I didn't wanna risk it rolling off onto the surface mount gear as I'll probably just leave it bare.
> Nice temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But so many air bubbles! That thing must be noisy as hell churning through the pump.
> Once you get them out should be alot quieter and temps should drop a touch more
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mind you at 1.48V I think the voltage will degrade your cpu well before the temps will!
> Good excuse for another upgrade I guess when it does bite the bullet


The bubbles are gone meanwhile
it took a few days and actually the pomp makes only noise if i let it go full power but it's throttled down to 1450 rpm so almost noiseless


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chefproject*
> 
> The bubbles are gone meanwhile
> it took a few days and actually the pomp makes only noise if i let it go full power but it's throttled down to 1450 rpm so almost noiseless


Nice









Can't beat a good water cooled setup.
I've gone back to air now since I get bored and swap parts out constantly, but the noise is driving me nuts!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Quick question, do I have a decent i5-3570k? 4.5Ghz @ 1.28V, 4.6Ghz @ 1.325V, 4.7Ghz @ 1.375V?
> Thanks!


It sounds like you have an average one, maybe slightly above. Can you do 4.8, 4.9, 5ghz if you go up to 1.4-1.5v (make sure temps stay below 90C of course)? What can you boot on 1.3v?

Doesn't sound like you have an 'awesome' chip or golden one, ie [email protected], but you might have a great one still. Mine was able to do [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Quote:


> The way I see the i5 vs i7 debate:
> Gamers = go or an i5 and spend the extra money on a better GPU
> Anything else, apart from gaming (ie video editing which i do quite a bit) HT is useful thus the i7 (if you got the cash that said)


I don't necessarily agree. If you have to ask, then you shouldn't get the i7. The i5 is more than capable of holding it's own on video editing, multi-threaded applicatoins, etc. Hyperthreading is only going to give you a 20-40% performance boost _best case scenario._ And that has to be in tasks that you are hitting 95%+ on the i5.

If you got an i7, turn off HT and run your same task and see if you get a significant performance increase or over 95% utilization. I mean I do heavily multi-threaded tasks, I do h264 on very, very slow presets, and even though the i7 was a sizeable increase in performance over the i5 for streaming, an i5 still could do the job very, very well. I'm a semi-professional streamer so if an i5 is good enough for me, it can be good enough for almost anyone.

Problem is people say things like 'well i sometimes run minesweeper AND solitaire' and people just respond with I SEVEN, I SEVEN, MUST BE I SEVEN and it's just ridiculous.

With chips being thermally limited, basically, you are better off putting money into better cooling and better RAM (if you are using programs that rely on HT, then you are likely using programs that appreciate 2000mhz+ RAM).

I've never heard anyone say 'my i5 is just too slow for what i do' or 'my i7 is maxing out in what i do'. 95% of users only game, as TB stated just get an i5, but even the 5% that do heavy programs aren't really pushing an i5 to it's limits, most of the time.

That said I bought my i7 because the profit margin was too great to pass up. Ended up making a profit well of about 100% on it in the end.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> It sounds like you have an average one, maybe slightly above. Can you do 4.8, 4.9, 5ghz if you go up to 1.4-1.5v (make sure temps stay below 90C of course)? What can you boot on 1.3v?
> 
> Doesn't sound like you have an 'awesome' chip or golden one, ie [email protected], but you might have a great one still. Mine was able to do [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]


I'm working on 4.8ghz right now. Ill let you guys know. Another noob question, how much does ram affect cpu overclocking? at all?


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I'm working on 4.8ghz right now. Ill let you guys know. Another noob question, how much does ram affect cpu overclocking? at all?


Up to 4.5 Ghz on my 3570k the only thing I've adjusted has been Vcore and Multiplier, set the LLC to Turbo and the Turbo Current limits to 200a and 300w. Not sure if by adjusting other settings my temps or required voltages may drop, not messed with Offset overclocking at all.


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I'm working on 4.8ghz right now. Ill let you guys know. Another noob question, how much does ram affect cpu overclocking? at all?


It can certainly throw you off and make you unsure of what is causing instability if you don't pass prime blend tests. I overclocked both at the same time because I was confident I could find stability since I had good memory modules and a nice chip.

I'd honestly suggest just focusing on cpu then moving to memory if you wish. Sometimes memory isn't even worth overclocking, barely any real world difference, just synthetic, but it's nice knowing you overclocked everything in your system that you could. That's my opinion anyways.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> It can certainly throw you off and make you unsure of what is causing instability if you don't pass prime blend tests. I overclocked both at the same time because I was confident I could find stability since I had good memory modules and a nice chip.
> 
> I'd honestly suggest just focusing on cpu then moving to memory if you wish. Sometimes memory isn't even worth overclocking, barely any real world difference, just synthetic, but it's nice knowing you overclocked everything in your system that you could. That's my opinion anyways.


So at 4.8ghz @1.4V I am "stable" but google chrome will crash if I am also running prime, this happens all the way up to 1.475V. Whats happening here? Prime gives no errors and if prime is not running chrome is fine.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> So at 4.8ghz @1.4V I am "stable" but google chrome will crash if I am also running prime, this happens all the way up to 1.475V. Whats happening here? Prime gives no errors and if prime is not running chrome is fine.


I bet you're still getting whea errors. Its most likely not stable.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> It can certainly throw you off and make you unsure of what is causing instability if you don't pass prime blend tests. I overclocked both at the same time because I was confident I could find stability since I had good memory modules and a nice chip.
> 
> I'd honestly suggest just focusing on cpu then moving to memory if you wish. Sometimes memory isn't even worth overclocking, barely any real world difference, just synthetic, but it's nice knowing you overclocked everything in your system that you could. That's my opinion anyways.


Did you find tweaking PLL, VTT, or IMC had any noticeable effect on your temps? I guess I could disable the power save features as well since I'm not using offset, but does this really matter?


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> So at 4.8ghz @1.4V I am "stable" but google chrome will crash if I am also running prime, this happens all the way up to 1.475V. Whats happening here? Prime gives no errors and if prime is not running chrome is fine.


Then you're probably not stable. When I did my 16 hour test I was doing a bunch of stuff in the back ground which included using chrome, or watching movies.


----------



## gl0ry

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Did you find tweaking PLL, VTT, or IMC had any noticeable effect on your temps? I guess I could disable the power save features as well since I'm not using offset, but does this really matter?


I left all of those at AUTO. The Z77 Mpower is a great board and pretty much puts all those values at a proper amount. It left PLL at 1.80v which is what I used to use back when I overclocked my 2600k, so I can't really answer your question because I don't know if they have a noticeable effect.

The biggest difference in stability for me was disabling phase control. That seemed to have finalized my overclock and rounded temperatures off a bit better. Even though the max was still about the same, it mostly floated around high 50s - low 60s Celsius


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Well lads... I killed a 3770k tonight...
> 
> Tried vice and hammer method on a friends 3770k... Poor lads cpu flew out of the vice (Even though had it gripped tight!) and broke one of the circuits on the underside.
> 
> RIP 3770k
> 
> Bought him a replacement


You broke my 3970x also, just send me a check for $1,000, I will replace it myself.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gl0ry*
> 
> The biggest difference in stability for me was disabling phase control. That seemed to have finalized my overclock and rounded temperatures off a bit better. Even though the max was still about the same, it mostly floated around high 50s - low 60s Celsius


Hmm, wonder what the equivalent is in the Gigabyte BIOS.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

So even though i already have a super great chip, the temptation to delid was too much.......Went and bought a vice today. Slaped that bad boy in it and procedded to hammer that sucker.

Aftert my first initial fail delid with a razor and a 3570k I was scared. But I had a smashing success (pun intended). Although I only have PK-1 right now, I am buying CLP, but already saw a 11c drop on best core, and a 6c drop on lowest core. Gonna reapply just to be sure they all making contact. but for only PK-1 not bad drops.. Just glad i did not kill my somwhat golden 3770k.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> So even though i already have a super great chip, the temptation to delid was too much.......Went and bought a vice today. Slaped that bad boy in it and procedded to hammer that sucker.
> 
> Aftert my first initial fail delid with a razor and a 3570k I was scared. But I had a smashing success (pun intended). Although I only have PK-1 right now, I am buying CLP, but already saw a 11c drop on best core, and a 6c drop on lowest core. Gonna reapply just to be sure they all making contact. but for only PK-1 not bad drops.. Just glad i did not kill my somwhat golden 3770k.


Kick-ass dude! lets see the pics and and more info ^_^
how many hits? 5? 2 on the fingers and 3 on the chip?









"(pun intended)" funny stuff!


----------



## JSTe

Another 3570k delidded with the hammer and vice -method.

Preliminary results with CLU on die yield 60C on average under IBT Vhigh @ 4.3Ghz/1.2v. Idle is around 25C
(Pre-delid temps were around 32C on idle and 75C under IBT Vhigh load.)

This was on an open testbench, more results and pics will be released on friday.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Hey Haswell peoples, could do with more > 5GHz validations for the [Official] 5GHz Club. Please overclock generously.


...love the new Haswell boards







(ie Max VI Ex), just don't like the 1st consumer batch of Haswell







...may be if you tell me which 5 pins to file off to make my delidded Ivy an LG1150 instead of 1155, I'll post some nice OC results, n'est pas ?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Hey guys, how common is the TIM pump-out effect?


----------



## Dimaggio1103

4.8ghz at 1.27v 30 runs ibt, antec h20 620

Before delid; 90, 95, 97, 91

After delid; , 76, 85, 90, 85

I only used PK-1 paste, but still was expecting better results.

Would buying CLU and a h80i be worth it? Or what else can be done?

I disassembled like 6 times hoping I just did something wrong but this is the best I could get it.


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> 4.8ghz at 1.27v 30 runs ibt, antec h20 620
> 
> Before delid; 90, 95, 97, 91
> 
> After delid; , 76, 85, 90, 85
> 
> I only used PK-1 paste, but still was expecting better results.
> 
> Would buying CLU and a h80i be worth it? Or what else can be done?
> 
> I disassembled like 6 times hoping I just did something wrong but this is the best I could get it.


impressive temps for a lowly antec kuhler 620. and yes an h80i would be a massive upgrade from what you have right now


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Use clu on the die...it has been said around 10,000 Times over. It provides better temps


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> 4.8ghz at 1.27v 30 runs ibt, antec h20 620
> 
> Before delid; 90, 95, 97, 91
> 
> After delid; , 76, 85, 90, 85
> 
> I only used PK-1 paste, but still was expecting better results.
> 
> Would buying CLU and a h80i be worth it? Or what else can be done?
> 
> I disassembled like 6 times hoping I just did something wrong but this is the best I could get it.


I switched from MX-3 to CLU on the die and got a further 10C drop. So I'd do that first, then consider another cooler. Take 10C off those temps and I think you'd be fine where you are.

I played Tomb Raider last night for a while, and my CPU was at 33C. Not a CPU demanding game, of course, but I thought that was a nice temp all the same. Idles around 28C.


----------



## Skullwipe

Seems like a sloppy TIM application or the IHS isn't lined up properly, you shouldn't have a 14c difference in core temps like that regardless of the paste you use.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Seems like a sloppy TIM application or the IHS isn't lined up properly, you shouldn't have a 14c difference in core temps like that regardless of the paste you use.


That's what I thought but I can't help it. I reseated a bunch of times, not sure what to do. That core has always ran super. Hot


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> That's what I thought but I can't help it. I reseated a bunch of times, not sure what to do. That core has always ran super. Hot


It just seems odd that the temperature gap would increase after the delid. For the sake of testing all the variables, could you rotate your 620's block 90°?


----------



## Dimaggio1103

I could try that. You think that will help?

I did notice when at first the temps where bad that my block was not touching the CPU on one corner. I cleaned and added thermal past. Temps got better, but that darn one core is always running hot. I put a level on the mobo, and CPU to make sure everything was straight and it was.

I will try to turn block around when i put my kid down for the night. will post back in a few. Any other ides are welcome, and plus rep for helping me skullwipe.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> It sounds like you have an average one, maybe slightly above. Can you do 4.8, 4.9, 5ghz if you go up to 1.4-1.5v (make sure temps stay below 90C of course)? What can you boot on 1.3v?
> 
> Doesn't sound like you have an 'awesome' chip or golden one, ie [email protected], but you might have a great one still. Mine was able to do [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> 
> 
> I'm working on 4.8ghz right now. Ill let you guys know. Another noob question, how much does ram affect cpu overclocking? at all?
Click to expand...

With Ivy, not much at all in my experience (unlike haswell). That said, tune your CPU overclock first. A 620 is a rather low end cooler so you are probably going to be limited to around 1.4v.
Quote:


> So at 4.8ghz @1.4V I am "stable" but google chrome will crash if I am also running prime, this happens all the way up to 1.475V. Whats happening here? Prime gives no errors and if prime is not running chrome is fine.


Then that isn't stable... a crash is a crash. Ideally people just run stress test alone because it's 'more stressful', but if running chrome at the same time causes a crash, you should be happy that it reveals instability where you might have gone on and assumed it was totally stable and then be pulling your hair out in a month when you are trying to tune a RAM overclock and nothing appears stable and then you are RMAing your RAM and the new ram still isn't stable and you are just going crazy...

Also, make sure you aren't getting WHEA errors. Look up the 'how i got out of wheaville' thread. WHEA errors are a big indicator of instability, and will crash streaming programs instantly or other intensive work.

Finally, make sure you know why you are stress testing. If all you do is game there's hardly a reason to stress test further than an hour or two. I run streaming with large audiences and GPGPU work so stability was extremely important to me.

Just bought haswell, going to delid today or tommorow, won't have the rest of the parts until a week or so. Where's the cheapest place to get CLU?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:
Originally Posted by *Belial* 


> Where's the cheapest place to get CLU?


Probably FrozenCPU.com


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> *DELID SUCCESSFUL!*
> 
> *Chip:* i7-4770k
> *Method:* Hammer and Vice
> *Covered transistors with:* Electrical Tape
> 
> So here I am again, successfully delidded my i7-4770k a minute ago, ran some IntelBurnTest, and the results are every bit as spectacular as they were back when I delidded my i5-3570k!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Before:*
> *4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 83°C
> Core 2: 82°C
> Core 3: 79°C
> Core 4: 69°C
> Package: 83°C
> 
> *After:*
> *4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 55°C
> Core 2: 58°C
> Core 3: 58°C
> Core 4: 55°C
> Package: 58°C
> 
> As you can see, temperatures evened out, and dropped 15-28°C across the board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ambients are slightly higher now than during initial test, about +2°C.
> 
> *Screenshot:*
> 
> 
> I went from shocked and apalled at Haswell's temperatures, to being reasonably happy again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When my custom loop and 900D arrive, I'll probably be sanding down the IHS again. I'd use the one from my 3570k, but that chip's been sold already.
> 
> Happy delidding, everyone!


Submit the info like the front page says and ill add you after work!


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Submit the info like the front page says and ill add you after work!


I was gunna join officially as well but I didn't have a camera to take a photo :'(


----------



## Leyaena

Spoiler: Earlier post



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> *DELID SUCCESSFUL!*
> 
> *Chip:* i7-4770k
> *Method:* Hammer and Vice
> *Covered transistors with:* Electrical Tape
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Undelidded Temps - Previous post
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've done some testing on the i7-4770k before delidding, and the results are nothing short of shocking, temperature-wise:
> 
> _For a very modest 4.3GHz overclock:_
> 
> *Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 83°C
> Core 2: 82°C
> Core 3: 79°C
> Core 4: 69°C
> Package: 83°C
> 
> *Running at 1.2V:*
> 
> Core 1: 89°C
> Core 2: 89°C
> Core 3: 86°C
> Core 4: 75°C
> Package: 90°C
> 
> *Cooling:* Corsair H100i, stock fans, running at 100%.
> *Voltage Control:* Manual, CPU-Z reported no deviation during testing.
> *Tested with:* IntelBurnTestV2
> 
> *Screenies:*
> 
> 
> 
> Needless to say, this has me somewhat disappointed...
> 
> As soon as my new syringes of CLP get here, it'll be _off with his head_!
> 
> *Edit:* Updated post with all relevant info I could think of, for future reference.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So here I am again, successfully delidded my i7-4770k a minute ago, ran some IntelBurnTest, and the results are every bit as spectacular as they were back when I delidded my i5-3570k!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Before:*
> *4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 83°C
> Core 2: 82°C
> Core 3: 79°C
> Core 4: 69°C
> Package: 83°C
> 
> *After:*
> *4.3Ghz, Running at 1.15V:*
> 
> Core 1: 55°C
> Core 2: 58°C
> Core 3: 58°C
> Core 4: 55°C
> Package: 58°C
> 
> As you can see, temperatures evened out, and dropped 15-28°C across the board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ambients are slightly higher now than during initial test, about +2°C.
> 
> *Screenshot:*
> 
> 
> I went from shocked and apalled at Haswell's temperatures, to being reasonably happy again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When my custom loop and 900D arrive, I'll probably be sanding down the IHS again. I'd use the one from my 3570k, but that chip's been sold already.
> 
> Happy delidding, everyone!
Click to expand...





Here's the additional info, as requested:

*OCN name:* Leyaena
*CPU:* i7-4770k
*on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
*ihs-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
*Mhz gained:* None, so far.
*OC after delid:* 4.3Ghz.
*Temp drops:* 15-28°C, 25°C from hottest core to hottest core.
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* I'm at work right now, but I will edit this in when I get back.

The reason I did my before-and-after testing at 4.3Ghz rather than 4.5 or higher is that before delidding, I couldn't get 4.5 stable at 1.2V straight away, and any higher than that caused me to run into major throtling issues.

Since people asked about more details/pictures of how I covered up the transistors with electrical tape, I really wish I had remembered to take a picture of it, but basically what I did was this:

- take a length of standard black electrical tape, slightly longer than the length of the transistors on the chip.
- cut it down to 1/3rd the width.
- pick the piece you like the most, I just used one of the side pieces with the straight(er) outer edge towards the chip.
- put it on there and apply VERY slight pressure to make it hold.
- apply clp/clu to the die
- put on the ihs again

basically for the picture, imagine the chip with a thin length of black tape right next to the die









If there are any more questions, please don't hesitate to ask!


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Where's the cheapest place to get CLU?
> 
> 
> 
> Probably FrozenCPU.com
Click to expand...

Out of stock :X

Only other place I see is like amazon for $30 or something ridiculous...


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Where's the cheapest place to get CLU?
> 
> 
> 
> Probably FrozenCPU.com
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Out of stock :X
> 
> Only other place I see is like amazon for $30 or something ridiculous...
Click to expand...

You could order straight from the manufacturer, but it'd take a good while to get over there from Germany, probably.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Out of stock :X
> 
> Only other place I see is like amazon for $30 or something ridiculous...


I just ordered two sticks of pro from performance-pcs, they had ultra in stock as well but I didn't like the look of that stuff with all the surface mount gear next to haswells die.

Pretty sure frozencpu has the pro in stock as well (though not the ultra as you have already seen)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> I was gunna join officially as well but I didn't have a camera to take a photo :'(


No problem really just give me the info that you can!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> 
> Here's the additional info, as requested:
> 
> *OCN name:* Leyaena
> *CPU:* i7-4770k
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *Mhz gained:* None, so far.
> *OC after delid:* 4.3Ghz.
> *Temp drops:* 15-28°C, 25°C from hottest core to hottest core.
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* I'm at work right now, but I will edit this in when I get back.
> 
> The reason I did my before-and-after testing at 4.3Ghz rather than 4.5 or higher is that before delidding, I couldn't get 4.5 stable at 1.2V straight away, and any higher than that caused me to run into major throtling issues.
> 
> Since people asked about more details/pictures of how I covered up the transistors with electrical tape, I really wish I had remembered to take a picture of it, but basically what I did was this:
> 
> - take a length of standard black electrical tape, slightly longer than the length of the transistors on the chip.
> - cut it down to 1/3rd the width.
> - pick the piece you like the most, I just used one of the side pieces with the straight(er) outer edge towards the chip.
> - put it on there and apply VERY slight pressure to make it hold.
> - apply clp/clu to the die
> - put on the ihs again
> 
> basically for the picture, imagine the chip with a thin length of black tape right next to the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If there are any more questions, please don't hesitate to ask!


You're in! Congratz to the first Haswell delidder! (Officially branded that is!)







Put your Sig on (I see you already do though







)

Also for the CPUz on the OC just PM me it


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in! Congratz to the first Haswell delidder! (Officially branded that is!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Put your Sig on (I see you already do though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Also for the CPUz on the OC just PM me it


Well, I still had the sig back from when I delidded my i5-3570k















Very happy to be able to submit this chip to the club as well, though ^^

Went home over my lunch-break, here's the validation:
http://valid.canardpc.com/2829456


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Well, I still had the sig back from when I delidded my i5-3570k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very happy to be able to submit this chip to the club as well, though ^^
> 
> Went home over my lunch-break, here's the validation:
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2829456


Updated


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No problem really just give me the info that you can!


Here's what I have so far, will update details later once I've had more of a play
Cpu-z submission is slightly funky, probably due to using beta version of cpu-z
I've gone back to stock clocks for now until the CLP arrives then I'll give it a good workout








Loaded up my OC again and gunna have a play with all the cstates etc turned off







I updated the validation url with a good one.

*OCN name*: self_slaughter
*CPU:* i7 4770K
*on die-TIM:* MX-4 (Liquid Pro should be arriving this week)
*ihs-TIM:* MX-4
*Mhz gained:* Haven't pushed it yet
*OC after delid:* Haven't pushed it yet
*Temp drops:* 17'C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2829647[/URL]


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Here's the additional info, as requested:
> 
> *OCN name:* Leyaena
> *CPU:* i7-4770k
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *ihs-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> *Mhz gained:* None, so far.
> *OC after delid:* 4.3Ghz.
> *Temp drops:* 15-28°C, 25°C from hottest core to hottest core.
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* I'm at work right now, but I will edit this in when I get back.
> 
> The reason I did my before-and-after testing at 4.3Ghz rather than 4.5 or higher is that before delidding, I couldn't get 4.5 stable at 1.2V straight away, and any higher than that caused me to run into major throtling issues.
> 
> Since people asked about more details/pictures of how I covered up the transistors with electrical tape, I really wish I had remembered to take a picture of it, but basically what I did was this:
> 
> - take a length of standard black electrical tape, slightly longer than the length of the transistors on the chip.
> - cut it down to 1/3rd the width.
> - pick the piece you like the most, I just used one of the side pieces with the straight(er) outer edge towards the chip.
> - put it on there and apply VERY slight pressure to make it hold.
> - apply clp/clu to the die
> - put on the ihs again
> 
> basically for the picture, imagine the chip with a thin length of black tape right next to the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If there are any more questions, please don't hesitate to ask!


Thx ^^
That paints a good picture


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> I could try that. You think that will help?
> 
> I did notice when at first the temps where bad that my block was not touching the CPU on one corner. I cleaned and added thermal past. Temps got better, but that darn one core is always running hot. I put a level on the mobo, and CPU to make sure everything was straight and it was.
> 
> I will try to turn block around when i put my kid down for the night. will post back in a few. Any other ides are welcome, and plus rep for helping me skullwipe.


The idea behind the rotation is to see if the core discrepancies shift, if they do you know it's related to the block or retention mechanism. I've never used an Asetek based cooler, so I'm not sure if they have tension regulation in place to prevent over tightening...if they do the tiny bit of height lost when removing the IHS glue could be the source of the problem.


----------



## charliew

Great Success, after watching for CLP for a few days (apparantly they dont sell this in sweden)

1 x Coollaboratory Liquid Pro [09CO001] 74,95 74,95
1 x ArctiClean - 60ml Kit (2x30ml) [09AS003] 44,95 44,95
2 x CableModders Single Krympeflex 1m - Sort [CB009] 19,95 39,90
1 x AC Ryan - ATX/VGA Pins - Hun - 40 stk. [AR061] 29,95 29,95
2 x VGA 6+2-pin - Han - Sort [MO044] 8,95 17,90
1 x ATX 24-pin Stik - Han - Sort [MO042] 12,95 12,95
1 x Lamptron Modding Tool MT-1 [LA097] 139,95 139,95
1 x Arctic Cooling MX-4 - 4g [09AC004] 74,95 74,95

I had to order from Denmark to get this, but Im thinking it might be worth it seeing your results.

Might be a good idea to try the cpu before I start delidding to make sure it isnt DOA, since this will most likely void a bit of warranty. But will that make the whole delidding business harder? Also, should I use the H110 for measuring stock heat and comparing that to my after values, or should I use the stock HSF to get a sort of normalized measurement?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *charliew*
> 
> Great Success, after watching for CLP for a few days (apparantly they dont sell this in sweden)
> 
> 1 x Coollaboratory Liquid Pro [09CO001] 74,95 74,95
> 1 x ArctiClean - 60ml Kit (2x30ml) [09AS003] 44,95 44,95
> 2 x CableModders Single Krympeflex 1m - Sort [CB009] 19,95 39,90
> 1 x AC Ryan - ATX/VGA Pins - Hun - 40 stk. [AR061] 29,95 29,95
> 2 x VGA 6+2-pin - Han - Sort [MO044] 8,95 17,90
> 1 x ATX 24-pin Stik - Han - Sort [MO042] 12,95 12,95
> 1 x Lamptron Modding Tool MT-1 [LA097] 139,95 139,95
> 1 x Arctic Cooling MX-4 - 4g [09AC004] 74,95 74,95
> 
> I had to order from Denmark to get this, but Im thinking it might be worth it seeing your results.
> 
> Might be a good idea to try the cpu before I start delidding to make sure it isnt DOA, since this will most likely void a bit of warranty. But will that make the whole delidding business harder? Also, should I use the H110 for measuring stock heat and comparing that to my after values, or should I use the stock HSF to get a sort of normalized measurement?


H110, though I've always wondered what the difference is on a stock cooler.. Hmmm


----------



## charliew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> H110, though I've always wondered what the difference is on a stock cooler.. Hmmm


Maybe I should try that too, must be like the world first overclock on stock HSF for a haswell K-model







.

Lets be honest tho, upping vcore 0,1v would probably:

Melt the side of my chassi.
If using PWM, the maelstrom would probably shoot my chassi through the room.
Global warming would increase by 200% in sweden due to heat buildup.
It would be possible to grow cactae in our appartment due to the climat change indoors.
Our food, still in the freezer, would be instantly cooked.
I would experience heatstroke if I didnt consume enough water.
Birds would change their migration pattern to fly past our appartment due to tropical climat.

etc.

No, that might be a bad idea.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *charliew*
> 
> Might be a good idea to try the cpu before I start delidding to make sure it isnt DOA, since this will most likely void a bit of warranty. But will that make the whole delidding business harder?


Yeah definately try it out first just in case, I ran mine for a couple of days just to be sure everything was 100% and get an idea of before temps.
Mine was delided with two little fairy taps and came off easy as, CPU barely even moved.


----------



## charliew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> Yeah definately try it out first just in case, I ran mine for a couple of days just to be sure everything was 100% and get an idea of before temps.
> Mine was delided with two little fairy taps and came off easy as, CPU barely even moved.


Im too much of a coward to put my cpu in a vice. There are these really high-quality floss that I want to give a go. And I have some really thin kevlar fishing wire that should work wonders too, and then Ill finish it off with a razorblade Im thinking.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *charliew*
> 
> Im too much of a coward to put my cpu in a vice. There are these really high-quality floss that I want to give a go. And I have some really thin kevlar fishing wire that should work wonders too, and then Ill finish it off with a razorblade Im thinking.


remember it's just the heat spreader that's going in the vice, it's not like you're holding it in there by the die.
with all the surface mount stuff next to the die on haswell i wouldn't be too keen on that string. or even a razor really.
vice method is so quick n easy theres no way to stuff it up unless you swing at it like your trying to bash a nail in or something and launch your cpu flying.
Just gotta use some common sense.

but whatever you're comfortable with so long as it gets the job done


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> remember it's just the heat spreader that's going in the vice, it's not like you're holding it in there by the die.
> with all the surface mount stuff next to the die on haswell i wouldn't be too keen on that string. or even a razor really.
> vice method is so quick n easy theres no way to stuff it up unless you swing at it like your trying to bash a nail in or something and launch your cpu flying.
> Just gotta use some common sense.
> 
> but whatever you're comfortable with so long as it gets the job done


Yes, I say blade for Ivy/anything older and hammer for Haswell, hey Hammer and Haswell both start with H


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yes, I say blade for Ivy/anything older and hammer for Haswell, hey Hammer and Haswell both start with H


Why? Recommending the razor method at all seems archaic now considering vice is so much safer.


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Why? Recommending the razor method at all seems archaic now considering vice is so much safer.


The razor method is not A bad way of de-lidding at all.. If you use the right tools.....

1. Ultra thin Razor... (but a new one not one that's blunt and chipped) *** NOT A BOX CUTTER OR ANY SUCH THING***

2. some masking tape to rap around the back side of the blade... ( For more control and to stop you cutting your self)

3. The most important... CONTROL!!! ( If you use controlled pressure... the ultra thin blade goes through silicon like hot butter)

took me like 3-4 mins to cut off the IHS if that!!! it took a lot more time to get the Silicon off the PCB and IHS









I just could not hit my CPU with a Hammer and a bit of wood...









But I would go with the way you feel good about using..


----------



## charliew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> remember it's just the heat spreader that's going in the vice, it's not like you're holding it in there by the die.
> with all the surface mount stuff next to the die on haswell i wouldn't be too keen on that string. or even a razor really.
> vice method is so quick n easy theres no way to stuff it up unless you swing at it like your trying to bash a nail in or something and launch your cpu flying.
> Just gotta use some common sense.
> 
> but whatever you're comfortable with so long as it gets the job done


I know from pics where the transistors are on the pcb







But it will be preeeeetty close:


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> The razor method is not A bad way of de-lidding at all.. If you use the right tools.....
> 
> 1. Ultra thin Razor... (but a new one not one that's blunt and chipped) *** NOT A BOX CUTTER OR ANY SUCH THING***
> 
> 2. some masking tape to rap around the back side of the blade... ( For more control and to stop you cutting your self)
> 
> 3. The most important... CONTROL!!! ( If you use controlled pressure... the ultra thin blade goes through silicon like hot butter)
> 
> took me like 3-4 mins to cut off the IHS if that!!! it took a lot more time to get the Silicon off the PCB and IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just could not hit my CPU with a Hammer and a bit of wood...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I would go with the way you feel good bout using..


I did both methods and found the vice much, much, much more safer, and easier. the fail rate is also much lower. Seems every week there is a thread on here saying, "did I just kill my cpu" using razor method.

Anyways, I ordered CLP will it perform the same as CLU? Excited to see the drop.


----------



## Leyaena

I did my 4770k with the hammer and vice, seemed a lot safer, taking the transistors on top of the PCB into account.
Don't underestimate the risk, they're a lot closer to the edge and stick up quite a bit more than you'd think!

Just a word of warning








Good luck


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Anyways, I ordered CLP will it perform the same as CLU? Excited to see the drop.


Back when I did my 3570k, most reviews were saying that CLP ran slightly less hot than CLU, but that it was a bit trickier to apply, and definitely to remove again.
Personally, I've always preferred CLP, even if CLU now seems to be the crowd favourite


----------



## charliew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Back when I did my 3570k, most reviews were saying that CLP ran slightly less hot than CLU, but that it was a bit trickier to apply, and definitely to remove again.
> Personally, I've always preferred CLP, even if CLU now seems to be the crowd favourite


Pros and cons, reviews seem to differ on which is the best.

I think the CLU actually conducts heat better, and it also oxidizes less according to some people. The thing is the actual backside of the PRO is its liquidness. Its a lot more floaty than CLU, but that also means a lot less airbubbles.

I went with CLP too. Why? Because I saw a video of it in use, the results seem the same and easier its also harder to mess up the application.


----------



## Robbieboy

Yeah your right... But I think it's more about the type and condition of the blade they are using rather than the method it self...

Have you ever looked on youtube at some people de-lidding..









They are asking for problems...

But saying that it was Totally Dubbed Youtube vid made me have ago at it...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> Here's what I have so far, will update details later once I've had more of a play
> Cpu-z submission is slightly funky, probably due to using beta version of cpu-z
> I've gone back to stock clocks for now until the CLP arrives then I'll give it a good workout
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Loaded up my OC again and gunna have a play with all the cstates etc turned off
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I updated the validation url with a good one.
> 
> *OCN name*: self_slaughter
> *CPU:* i7 4770K
> *on die-TIM:* MX-4 (Liquid Pro should be arriving this week)
> *ihs-TIM:* MX-4
> *Mhz gained:* Haven't pushed it yet
> *OC after delid:* Haven't pushed it yet
> *Temp drops:* 17'C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2829647[/URL]


You're In!







put your sig on baby!

ALSO!!! PS4 FTW I wantz it


----------



## Swag

Is it possible to run a 780 and a 680 in the same system?


----------



## Louisxav

OCN name : Louisxav
CPU : i5 4670k
On-die TIM : Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
IHS TIM : Thermalright CF3
Mhz gained : 4.6Ghz
OC after delid : 5.0Ghz
Temp drops : 22C
Validation :


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Louisxav*
> 
> OCN name : Louisxav
> CPU : i5 4670k
> On-die TIM : Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> IHS TIM : Thermalright CF3
> Mhz gained : 4.6Ghz
> OC after delid : 5.0Ghz
> Temp drops : 22C
> Validation :


Knew it could be done!


----------



## Cyro999

Wow

what cooling?

Did you have to play with other voltages much to lower Vcore? digital/analog io, system agent, vrin etc?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Louisxav*
> 
> OCN name : Louisxav
> CPU : i5 4670k
> On-die TIM : Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> IHS TIM : Thermalright CF3
> Mhz gained : 4.6Ghz
> OC after delid : 5.0Ghz
> Temp drops : 22C
> Validation :


What cooling are you using? those temps seams SO low!
Congrats on 5.0! first Iw seen









WE WANT MORE INFO!


----------



## Belial

Why would you get CLP insteaf of CLU? Thats not a great idea... CLP is outdated CLU. They perform similiarly, but CLU spreads easier and less staining. It would be like haswell vs ivy if they were the same price.

As for razer delidding failing, im pretty sure that 100% of people who screwed up the razer method just didnt read the instructions right and used the wrong razor blade. They are just idiots. That said id go hammer with haswell due to those VRMs. Ive heard of one guy already slicing those, not sure if it worked or not for him since he justmbought a new haswell without even trying... dunno why, i think he was just some rich kid off another forum.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

I read the instructions fine. I own a PC repair shop and have been doing it for years. So despite your ignorant insult. I still think its a bad idea. Razor can bend and move under the heat sink. There is simply more variables plain and simple. I consider myself good at what I do and read the instructions a lot and watched videos.

The vice method just felt simpler. Just my opinion though.

Also got clp because it was in stock, and looking at the spreadsheet no difference in temps, so it was a no brainer.


----------



## bce22

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Louisxav*
> 
> OCN name : Louisxav
> CPU : i5 4670k
> On-die TIM : Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> IHS TIM : Thermalright CF3
> Mhz gained : 4.6Ghz
> OC after delid : 5.0Ghz
> Temp drops : 22C
> Validation :






Congratulation Louis! That is an amazing OC at so low voltage and temps!

Best I've seen so far


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Is it possible to run a 780 and a 680 in the same system?


yea but not in sli


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Is it possible to run a 780 and a 680 in the same system?
> 
> 
> 
> yea but not in sli
Click to expand...

Will I have any boost in performance or no? Because I'm contemplating whether to get another 680 or 780. (Of course, down payment of the car comes first so it might take some time anyway)


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> I read the instructions fine. I own a PC repair shop and have been doing it for years. So despite your ignorant insult. I still think its a bad idea. Razor can bend and move under the heat sink. There is simply more variables plain and simple. I consider myself good at what I do and read the instructions a lot and watched videos.
> 
> The vice method just felt simpler. Just my opinion though.
> 
> Also got clp because it was in stock, and looking at the spreadsheet no difference in temps, so it was a no brainer.


thats the problem, you cant rely on things like that. They are very similiar, thats true, but clu is much easier to work with and supposed to be the tiniest fraction better. if its cheaper ofc, get it instead.

If you use the right type of razor blade, as specified in guides, you shouldnt have a problem. Either you used the wrong blade (hey, i did too the first time, i didnt mess it up but i was just as dumb) or you are the only person here at OCN to mess up a delid with the proper razor blade.


----------



## Darkshadow74

Wll can Add me to the Delidding club, I just did my 4770k, but waiting on my CLP that comes tomorrow. I did get up to 4.6 at 1.262v. I am working on 4.7 then 4.8. I can get 4.7and 4.8 to boot, but not stable yet.







I used



its small Ill take a pic off it later attached to my desk.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> thats the problem, you cant rely on things like that. They are very similiar, thats true, but clu is much easier to work with and supposed to be the tiniest fraction better. if its cheaper ofc, get it instead.
> 
> If you use the right type of razor blade, as specified in guides, you shouldnt have a problem. Either you used the wrong blade (hey, i did too the first time, i didnt mess it up but i was just as dumb) or you are the only person here at OCN to mess up a delid with the proper razor blade.


Just search OCN and you will see plenty of delid failures. Sorry bro but you are wrong. Using the right razor does not guarantee anything. I'm not saying its a useless method, but you even admitted vice was easier, so what's the point in recommending a razor method? I just don't understand your logic. I used the right one and failed. The razon hit some Knicks in the pcb and I was going ultra slow and carefull.

Point is a better method is available. No need for razor method.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Just search OCN and you will see plenty of delid failures. Sorry bro but you are wrong. Using the right razor does not guarantee anything. I'm not saying its a useless method, but you even admitted vice was easier, so what's the point in recommending a razor method? I just don't understand your logic. I used the right one and failed. The razon hit some Knicks in the pcb and I was going ultra slow and carefull.
> 
> Point is a better method is available. No need for razor method.


People have destroyed their chips both ways, though it's much easier and more probable to do it with a razor. Not everyone feels comfortable clamping a $250+ piece of hardware into a vice and smacking it with a hammer and a piece of wood, most likely the same people who never had to drop a dot matrix printer from 4 inches to get the damn thing working again.

There's a greater sense of control and precision when using a blade that just isn't there when using a vice and a hammer, and that's something a lot of people aren't willing to give up. Whichever method people use, preparation, education, and patience are the key to not bricking your chip.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> People have destroyed their chips both ways, though it's much easier and more probable to do it with a razor. Not everyone feels comfortable clamping a $250+ piece of hardware into a vice and smacking it with a hammer and a piece of wood, most likely the same people who never had to drop a dot matrix printer from 4 inches to get the damn thing working again.
> 
> There's a greater sense of control and precision when using a blade that just isn't there when using a vice and a hammer, and that's something a lot of people aren't willing to give up. Whichever method people use, preparation, education, and patience are the key to not bricking your chip.


There has been nobody I have seen on OCN that has killed it with the vice at least not nearly the amount as with a razor. I'm sure most members find the vice method easier. I know I do. Not really sure why you two feel the need to debate the matter. It's an opinion, most agree with, but a opinion none the less.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Will I have any boost in performance or no? Because I'm contemplating whether to get another 680 or 780. (Of course, down payment of the car comes first so it might take some time anyway)


You'd be wanting a 770 to go *SLI* with a 680, not saying that it'll work either but different SLi or a BIOS flash will work if you can get either working. You'd be better off getting just another 680 To be honest








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> There has been nobody I have seen on OCN that has killed it with the vice at least not nearly the amount as with a razor. I'm sure most members find the vice method easier. I know I do. Not really sure why you two feel the need to debate the matter. It's an opinion, most agree with, but a opinion none the less.


Yeah, I de-lidded all of my CPU's with a razor (the same one) and I've killed none so I feel confident that the razor is the way to go for me. Unless it's a Haswell.. Because well then the components come into play and I'm not gonna risk it with a razor with that








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Just search OCN and you will see plenty of delid failures. Sorry bro but you are wrong. Using the right razor does not guarantee anything. I'm not saying its a useless method, but you even admitted vice was easier, so what's the point in recommending a razor method? I just don't understand your logic. I used the right one and failed. The razon hit some Knicks in the pcb and I was going ultra slow and carefull.
> 
> Point is a better method is available. No need for razor method.


Razor method isn't for the feint of hearted, I'd rather the razor method as it's cheaper and you're not damaging the IHS. It also takes a lot more skill to do








Of course if you're scared or just don't feel safe with de-lidding don't de-lid or do the hammer method, but not everyone has access to a workbench (I sure don't, not for 100+k's anyway) so a razor is a lot more practical


----------



## yarly

hey guys i delidded my 3770k the other day and replace the stock paste with mx4 but still getting the same temp, im using the noctua nh d14 for cooling, so i was wondering how well the clp stuff will do with dropping my temp down and is it worth buying it


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *yarly*
> 
> hey guys i delidded my 3770k the other day and replace the stock paste with mx4 but still getting the same temp, im using the noctua nh d14 for cooling, so i was wondering how well the clp stuff will do with dropping my temp down and is it worth buying it


Get CLU, you should see night and day differences.


----------



## Belial

CLU back in town:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Coollaboratory-Liquid-ULTRA-thermal-paste-and-cleaning-kit-/271221430201?pt=UK_Computing_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item3f260e97b9

$14 + Shipping from UK, ~$24 US. Kinda sucks but that's just a high price, not like a ridiculous price.

On a side note, all the people selling CLU right now are from Japan (all those nasty $30+ CLUs, suddenly there are like 8 new vendors selling CLU, all from Japan. clrly yakuza jacked a shipment....).


----------



## Louisxav

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> What cooling are you using? those temps seams SO low!
> Congrats on 5.0! first Iw seen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WE WANT MORE INFO!


Corsair h110








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Wow
> 
> what cooling?
> 
> Did you have to play with other voltages much to lower Vcore? digital/analog io, system agent, vrin etc?


Just core voltage and llc


----------



## ChaosAD

Just found a second hand 3770k to buy. The buyer claims 5Ghz rock stable at 1.296v and i m thinking about it tbh. What do you guys think?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Just found a second hand 3770k to buy. The buyer claims 5Ghz rock stable at 1.296v and i m thinking about it tbh. What do you guys think?


Make sure you've got some solid proof before you buy it, and maybe make sure you can send it back if the chip doesn't hold up to the claim.
Otherwise, it sounds like a decent enough chip, to me!


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Just found a second hand 3770k to buy. The buyer claims 5Ghz rock stable at 1.296v and i m thinking about it tbh. What do you guys think?


Get some proof. That's a low voltage for 5.0.


----------



## charliew

This is apparantly the sharpest razorblade that can be easily bought from shaving shops in sweden (seems to be able to get it easily about everywhere):



Will the hole in the middle compromize the stability of the razor, or is it fine to buy double bladed and just dull 1 side so you dont cut yourself?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Will the hole in the middle compromize the stability of the razor, or is it fine to buy double bladed and just dull 1 side so you dont cut yourself?


That's pretty much the same razorblade I did my 3570k with, so it should work just fine, I know that that delid went pretty easy anyway









One hint though, rather than dulling the blade, just put some tape on the side you'll be holding, it gives you a bit of extra grip and prevents you from delidding your fingertips along with the CPU


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Make sure you've got some solid proof before you buy it, and maybe make sure you can send it back if the chip doesn't hold up to the claim.
> Otherwise, it sounds like a decent enough chip, to me!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Get some proof. That's a low voltage for 5.0.


Thats something certain. Brand new cost 310 euros. What do you think its a fair price if its true what he says?


----------



## lilchronic

350 but i doubt it can run 5ghz @ 1.296v


----------



## Leyaena

350 sounds about right if his claims are true.
I can't stress this enough though: *only get the chip if you're absolutely positive that the chip does 5Ghz at that voltage!*


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Louisxav*
> 
> OCN name : Louisxav
> CPU : i5 4670k
> On-die TIM : Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> IHS TIM : Thermalright CF3
> Mhz gained : 4.6Ghz
> OC after delid : 5.0Ghz
> Temp drops : 22C
> Validation :


Nice. That MSI mother board is looking strong!

Too bad micro center doesn't have any of them.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> My suggestion would be to just drop it, Belial. You're being needlessly offensive, and are definitely not getting anywhere with the discusion.
> I get it, great, you've got your opinion, somebody else has got theirs, you probably won't be convincing them, and namecalling's definitely not going to help...


Thank you








Was getting quite annoying to read those two flaming on about one vs the other.. they are both great methods if done right.

Anyways.. My hardware came in today ^_^
so I guess I will hook everything up on air first, to check that everything works
Then put on the water and get some pre delid temps at 4.5ghz~
and then comes the knock on the brain










In front of the MSI Mobo, we have my cooler that I will most definitely be using *cough NOT cough







I dont know how many of those I've tossed in the bin over the years

It seams I know whats on the menu the next few days








wish me luck.


----------



## Leyaena

Conveniently, my 4770k came without a stock cooler when I picked it up from the local retailer


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Louisxav*
> 
> OCN name : Louisxav
> CPU : i5 4670k
> On-die TIM : Coollaboratory Liquid ultra
> IHS TIM : Thermalright CF3
> Mhz gained : 4.6Ghz
> OC after delid : 5.0Ghz
> Temp drops : 22C
> Validation :


You're in! Might I say you should run some 1M and then use the lovely wprime as well! I wanna see those results nice RAM speeds btw try and tighten them at all? Also! Slap your Sig on








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Why would you get CLP insteaf of CLU? Thats not a great idea... CLP is outdated CLU. They perform similiarly, but CLU spreads easier and less staining. It would be like haswell vs ivy if they were the same price.
> 
> As for razer delidding failing, im pretty sure that 100% of people who screwed up the razer method just didnt read the instructions right and used the wrong razor blade. They are just idiots. That said id go hammer with haswell due to those VRMs. Ive heard of one guy already slicing those, not sure if it worked or not for him since he justmbought a new haswell without even trying... dunno why, i think he was just some rich kid off another forum.










I only quoted one of your posts because I didn't want to tick people off with 8 more posts than necessary. Alright as the owner of this thread and club, I am giving you a very serious warning. Don't just go assuming things about people at all sir or even attempt to think how they did it with the incorrect stuff when they used the right equipment. I literally can't express my disgust of how you can get the thought that you have all the answers to the delidding facts and just how everyone failed their delids and that you can just straight judge them. I will type this once, and once only.

*I am watching your posts in this club, if you take any personal attacks against any person or people of how they made a mistake (we all do as we are human and we are perfectly imperfect) I WILL revoke your membership from this club*

I myself still like delidding with a blade as thats what I started with, BUT I would do vice method hands down without a second thought if i had a fresh ivy of haswell. heck I might even do my IVY-E if I can delid it with a vice.

Also CLP/U are so very close performance wise that literally the way you put the TIM on can change which one is better, I've done it and both are amazing.

NOW, be nice. and get along.

Truly,
Valgaur
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkshadow74*
> 
> Wll can Add me to the Delidding club, I just did my 4770k, but waiting on my CLP that comes tomorrow. I did get up to 4.6 at 1.262v. I am working on 4.7 then 4.8. I can get 4.7and 4.8 to boot, but not stable yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used
> 
> 
> 
> its small Ill take a pic off it later attached to my desk.


Heyya can I have more than your username and CPU







I kinda want speeds and temp drops mainly. PM me if you have them whenever but so far your name is on the spreadsheet with the cpu and thats it so can I haz them soon?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> My suggestion would be to just drop it, Belial. You're being needlessly offensive, and are definitely not getting anywhere with the discusion.
> I get it, great, you've got your opinion, somebody else has got theirs, you probably won't be convincing them, and namecalling's definitely not going to help...


Thank you, seriously, one person to take a stand and be the good guy here
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Just found a second hand 3770k to buy. The buyer claims 5Ghz rock stable at 1.296v and i m thinking about it tbh. What do you guys think?


know what I think?! gimme it that's what i thinks!!









SIDE NOTE:

I'm sorry if I'm coming off pretty ticked but seriously..... after a 14 hour long shift at 20 years old, don't want to see people arguing like this. End of discussion, plain and simple.

Truly,
Valgaur


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Stock coolers usually sell for $10 on ebay. Why would you be okay with that?


I should probably have mentioned this straight away, but the chip without the cooler was €15 less than the one that came with the cooler.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I should probably have mentioned this straight away, but the chip without the cooler was 15eur less than the one that came with the cooler.


pretty sure no stock cooler = no warranty. but being in the delidded club I guess that's not a problem lol. Just should of been a lot cheaper then that for a chip with no warranty.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I should probably have mentioned this straight away, but the chip without the cooler was 15eur less than the one that came with the cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> pretty sure no stock cooler = no warranty. but being in the delidded club I guess that's not a problem lol. Just should of been a lot cheaper then that for a chip with no warranty.
Click to expand...

There is a warranty, of course, it's an official intel retail chip.
The official product code for the fanless chip seems to be BXF80646I74770K.

Link to the item on scan.co.uk: link


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> There is a warranty, of course, it's an official intel retail chip.
> The official product code for the fanless chip seems to be BXF80646I74770K.
> 
> Link to the item on scan.co.uk: link


This is a great idea, they should sell the K chips with no HS/F and have them the same price as the non K's..


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> There is a warranty, of course, it's an official intel retail chip.
> The official product code for the fanless chip seems to be BXF80646I74770K.
> 
> Link to the item on scan.co.uk: link


That link says oem, so not exactly a retail chip. but still your warranty is long gone anyway being delidded lol


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> There is a warranty, of course, it's an official intel retail chip.
> The official product code for the fanless chip seems to be BXF80646I74770K.
> 
> Link to the item on scan.co.uk: link
> 
> 
> 
> That link says oem, so not exactly a retail chip. but still your warranty is long gone anyway being delidded lol
Click to expand...

Well, the shop I bought it from states *2 years of carry-in warranty* anyway, was just trying to say that the chip did come with a warranty, even if I happily voided mine ^^

Just glad to save a bit of money on a heatsink I won't use anyway, especially with no real downsides (since you'd still get warranty).


----------



## Janac

So the best TIM for die is Liquid Ultra Pro?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> So the best TIM for die is Liquid Ultra Pro?


CL Ultra or CL Pro, it is up to you. Most tests have them close in performance. Personally I use Ultra because it comes with two brushes and it is a little easier for me to control and spread the way I want.

Pro:
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/
Ultra:
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-ultra/


----------



## GaMbi2004

-_- at this speed I wont be delidding before next week or so.. the water cooling takes SO much longer on brand new components vs my old "go to hell" build. Tissue paper all over the place








The first run (everything on air) was a success! and im not putting together the W/C








5 hours since I got the hardware, probably another 5 before I can boot the system..
Then a day or two of testing etc before knocking off the top of my 4670K
Cant wait


----------



## Janac

Here are my temps of delidded 3570k at 4.2Ghz. I used Ceramique 2, sandpaper the IHS(edges and sides) and didnt helped. Have a Custom WC with EK Supreme LT-UNI and EK 120mm+240mm rad with DC 2.2 pump. Tested the stock ivy cooler and get almost the same temps. Its a new loop, i had before no name pump + **** 360mm with Supreme LTX.

The last idea i have is this Liquid Ultra paste!



And if that wont help...its broken!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Here are my temps of delidded 3570k at 4.2Ghz. I used Ceramique 2, sandpaper the IHS(edges and sides) and didnt helped. Have a Custom WC with EK Supreme LT-UNI and EK 120mm+240mm rad with DC 2.2 pump. Tested the stock ivy cooler and get almost the same temps. Its a new loop, i had before no name pump + **** 360mm with Supreme LTX.
> 
> The last idea i have is this Liquid Ultra paste!
> And if that wont help...its broken!


That should be your first idea, not last. Ceramique 2 will not work well on the die. As has been said 10 thousand times in this thread, you need a liquid metal TIM for the die.

You can see from your max temp spread that your TIM choice and application is causing the IHS to not make good contact with the die.


----------



## Janac

Have also tried MX-2, same result. So u are sure that Liquid Ultra will be much different?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Have also tried MX-2, same result. So u are sure that Liquid Ultra will be much different?


99 out of 100 delidders recommend a liquid metal TIM on the die, like CL Ultra or Pro. It will make a difference, and it will even out your temps.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Have also tried MX-2, same result. So u are sure that Liquid Ultra will be much different?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> 99 out of 100 delidders recommend a liquid metal TIM on the die, like CL Ultra or Pro. It will make a difference, and it will even out your temps.


I delidded and used mx-4 for now, got me a fairly good drop in temps. ~17'C
CLP should be here this week with some luck (cost me over $50 in express shipping for 2 syringes!!!!!111!!one
Having ordered it on Sunday night it would wanna be here this week!)

I'll let ya know how much difference it makes for me anyway as my temps are still higher then I would like


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Well, the shop I bought it from states *2 years of carry-in warranty* anyway, was just trying to say that the chip did come with a warranty, even if I happily voided mine ^^
> 
> Just glad to save a bit of money on a heatsink I won't use anyway, especially with no real downsides (since you'd still get warranty).


A little gasket maker is all it would take to recreate the illusion of a unmodified chip, wouldn't work with Intel, but highly likely a retailer won't do much more than try and boot with the chip.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Both my Gtx 770, and my CLP, will be here tomorrow. :whee:

Tomorrow my upgrades for now are finished and now I can start working on the case mod, and build log.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> I delidded and used mx-4 for now, got me a fairly good drop in temps. ~17'C
> CLP should be here this week with some luck (cost me over $50 in express shipping for 2 syringes!!!!!111!!one
> Having ordered it on Sunday night it would wanna be here this week!)
> 
> I'll let ya know how much difference it makes for me anyway as my temps are still higher then I would like


$50 shipping!?!?!! I forget how privileged some of us are in the states... If i have to pay $5 for shipping i usually am kinda upset..


----------



## bce22

My CLU should arrive today so I can delid my 4770k. Do you put CLU on both the die and the underside of the IHS or just the die?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bce22*
> 
> My CLU should arrive today so I can delid my 4770k. Do you put CLU on both the die and the underside of the IHS or just the die?


You can do either one, but if you place any on the underside of the IHS it should only be a very light staining, no excess of any kind. You can do it with just what remains on the brush from doing the die, and you only need to cover the part where the die goes.


----------



## bce22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You can do either one, but if you place any on the underside of the IHS it should only be a very light staining, no excess of any kind. You can do it with just what remains on the brush from doing the die, and you only need to cover the part where the die goes.


I wonder if putting CLU on the underside could potentially cause problems on haswell due to the caps next to the die. what do you think?

I plan on placing a small amount of mx-4 on the caps.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bce22*
> 
> I wonder if putting CLU on the underside could potentially cause problems on haswell due to the caps next to the die. what do you think?
> 
> I plan on placing a small amount of mx-4 on the caps.


Sorry, I thought we made that clear earlier in the thread.
You absolutely must cover those contacts with something non-conductive, non-capacitive (like mx-4) before getting the Ultra or Pro anywhere near the chip. No one has done any tests to see what would happen if you don't cover them, but I wouldn't be the test subject on that one.

You don't need to put any on the underside if you are uncomfortable with it. The main issue is getting the right amount on the die, you will not get the best temps with too much or too little. It took me several tries to get it right.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bce22*
> 
> I wonder if putting CLU on the underside could potentially cause problems on haswell due to the caps next to the die. what do you think?
> 
> I plan on placing a small amount of mx-4 on the caps.


I would either use one TIM or the other, not both. DIfferent consistencies can cause a very slight pressure delta which, while I can;t say what it would do, is still some sort of delta. Stick to one or the other. I'd use MX4, NTH1, or ICD on any chip with electrical components within 1.5mm of the contact patch. Hence why my Titans do NOT have CLU on the dies, but instead ICD.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I would either use one TIM or the other, not both. DIfferent consistencies can cause a very slight pressure delta which, while I can;t say what it would do, is still some sort of delta. Stick to one or the other. I'd use MX4, NTH1, or ICD on any chip with electrical components within 1.5mm of the contact patch. Hence why my Titans do NOT have CLU on the dies, but instead ICD.


Sorry, that doesn't really make sense to me. The vast majority of delidders have found the best temps with a liquid metal TIM on the die. Many had poor results with any standard TIM.

Now for Haswell we have one line of connectors that need to be covered with something. Whether it is mx-4, LET, or something else those should not interfere in anyway with the die contacting the IHS.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Sorry, that doesn't really make sense to me. The vast majority of delidders have found the best temps with a liquid metal TIM on the die. Many had poor results with any standard TIM.
> 
> Now for Haswell we have one line of connectors that need to be covered with something. Whether it is mx-4, LET, or something else those should not interfere in anyway with the die contacting the IHS.


I was speaking from a safety standpoint, not a temp. Of course the liquid metal tims will outperform. They can be much thinner while keeping more heat-transparent material (be it silver, gallium, carbon, etc) in the microscopic voids. I was saying that for contact areas, he would be best off using one TIM or the other. If he covered the pads of the caps with MX4 then put CLU/CLP on top of the caps and the die, he would still be using CLU/CLP for the contact areas.

Pardon me if my wording was poor. I've been having a bad week with remodeling and have been grinding my teeth so bad at night that I've been waking up in pain. Bleh.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MKHunt*
> 
> I was speaking from a safety standpoint, not a temp. Of course the liquid metal tims will outperform. They can be much thinner while keeping more heat-transparent material (be it silver, gallium, carbon, etc) in the microscopic voids. I was saying that for contact areas, he would be best off using one TIM or the other. If he covered the pads of the caps with MX4 then put CLU/CLP on top of the caps and the die, he would still be using CLU/CLP for the contact areas.
> 
> Pardon me if my wording was poor. I've been having a bad week with remodeling and have been grinding my teeth so bad at night that I've been waking up in pain. Bleh.


No problem, I would just say people want a liquid metal TIM on the die only, but before they apply it cover the exposed contacts to the left of the die with something non-conductive and non-capacitive. There is no reason to get the liquid metal TIM on anything except the die. You can put some on the underside of the IHS but you would only want a staining of it, and only where the die contacts it.


----------



## MKHunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> No problem, I would just say people want a liquid metal TIM on the die only, but before they apply it cover the exposed contacts to the left of the die with something non-conductive and non-capacitive. There is no reason to get the liquid metal TIM on anything except the die. You can put some on the underside of the IHS but you would only want a staining of it, and only where the die contacts it.


Aye, it's how I did it. People need to remember that CLP/CLU does NOT stick immediately, The end result should just look like you polished the IHS and die, not a puddle. The OP needs that in godzila sized font.


----------



## bce22

Thanks for the information. I will be extremely careful with the CLU.

You guys rock.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

^I love your avatar. Love that show.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> ^I love your avatar. Love that show.


Cheers








It's a shame the season has ended again, though...
And still no news on The Winds of Winter yet, either


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Cheers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a shame the season has ended again, though...
> And still no news on The Winds of Winter yet, either


I nearly woke my kid up last week when I was watching the wedding scene I yelled WT*!!! lol

Love that show. I am assuming next season will be the final one?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Cheers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a shame the season has ended again, though...
> And still no news on The Winds of Winter yet, either
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I nearly woke my kid up last week when I was watching the wedding scene I yelled WT*!!! lol
> 
> Love that show. I am assuming next season will be the final one?
Click to expand...

There's many, many more to come!
Next season will be the second half of book 3.

Then there will probably be 2 seasons for book 4 as well,
and quite possibly another 2 for book 5 (the latest release).

By then I'm sure GRRM will have at least released The Winds of Winter, the 6th part in the series, so the show will go on.

There's a total of 7 books planned for the series.


----------



## lilchronic

mesa!


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> There's many, many more to come!
> Next season will be the second half of book 3.
> 
> Then there will probably be 2 seasons for book 4 as well,
> and quite possibly another 2 for book 5 (the latest release).
> 
> By then I'm sure GRRM will have at least released The Winds of Winter, the 6th part in the series, so the show will go on.
> 
> There's a total of 7 books planned for the series.












I was told there were only 3 books, thats why I thought that. I look forward to the episode where Geoffrey gets killed.

Was I alone in feeling sorry for Mr. Greyjoy (not sure spelling) who is being held prisoner? I know he did bad things but thats all a bit much what is happening to him.


----------



## Leyaena

I actually like(d) (avoiding spoilers here) Theon, in the books he's actually way better developed as a character, and definitely more likable.
That said, I absolutely love how they cast Ramsay, and the extended role they gave him in the series.

Oh crap, we're supposed to be talking about delidding!
Well, I guess there was a lot of delidding going on at the Red Wedding


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Here are my temps of delidded 3570k at 4.2Ghz. I used Ceramique 2, sandpaper the IHS(edges and sides) and didnt helped. Have a Custom WC with EK Supreme LT-UNI and EK 120mm+240mm rad with DC 2.2 pump. Tested the stock ivy cooler and get almost the same temps. Its a new loop, i had before no name pump + **** 360mm with Supreme LTX.
> 
> The last idea i have is this Liquid Ultra paste!
> 
> 
> 
> And if that wont help...its broken!


CLU/P man. all the way for us it's amazing stuff
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Have also tried MX-2, same result. So u are sure that Liquid Ultra will be much different?


MX-2 shouldn't even be used near IVY people just buy it because they see all the high reviews but this CLU/P will blow it away.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> 99 out of 100 delidders recommend a liquid metal TIM on the die, like CL Ultra or Pro. It will make a difference, and it will even out your temps.


yeah listen to the Oldman! (no pun intended, I'm kidding totally intended)















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bce22*
> 
> Thanks for the information. I will be extremely careful with the CLU.
> 
> You guys rock.


We are here for people to get the right info, glad you like it!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> There's many, many more to come!
> Next season will be the second half of book 3.
> 
> Then there will probably be 2 seasons for book 4 as well,
> and quite possibly another 2 for book 5 (the latest release).
> 
> By then I'm sure GRRM will have at least released The Winds of Winter, the 6th part in the series, so the show will go on.
> 
> There's a total of 7 books planned for the series.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Song_of_Ice_and_Fire


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> There's many, many more to come!
> Next season will be the second half of book 3.
> 
> Then there will probably be 2 seasons for book 4 as well,
> and quite possibly another 2 for book 5 (the latest release).
> 
> By then I'm sure GRRM will have at least released The Winds of Winter, the 6th part in the series, so the show will go on.
> 
> There's a total of 7 books planned for the series.
> 
> 
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Song_of_Ice_and_Fire
Click to expand...

I think you may have quoted the wrong post?








There's little I don't already know about ASoIaF ^^

Anyways, off for a bit, gonna see if I can up those clocks some!


----------



## Leyaena

Status update:

*Core clock:* 4.6Ghz
*Voltage needed:* looking like 1.235
*Hottest core:* 68°C
*Tested with:* IntelBurnTest V2, 50 reps

Looks like an average chip, definitely didn't strike gold, but then again, I already knew that...
Thoughts?

What say ye, should I go higher?


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Status update:
> 
> *Core clock:* 4.6Ghz
> *Voltage needed:* looking like 1.235
> *Hottest core:* 68°C
> *Tested with:* IntelBurnTest V2, 50 reps
> 
> Looks like an average chip, definitely didn't strike gold, but then again, I already knew that...
> Thoughts?
> 
> What say ye, should I go higher?


Of Course go higher. Use that chip for whatever performance you can.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Status update:
> 
> *Core clock:* 4.6Ghz
> *Voltage needed:* looking like 1.235
> *Hottest core:* 68°C
> *Tested with:* IntelBurnTest V2, 50 reps
> 
> Looks like an average chip, definitely didn't strike gold, but then again, I already knew that...
> Thoughts?
> 
> What say ye, should I go higher?


Go on








If nothing else.. just to see how fare it can go.. and then go back if the temps are too intimidating


----------



## travex

Guys, what is the most effective way to remove the CLU on my 3770k's die ? I want to re-apply the CLU on it, tried to remove the old CLU paste with some soft paper tissue but doesn't look really good


----------



## dmanstasiu

I used the TIM remover that came with my IX ...







I would say use high grit sandpaper to gently remove it.


----------



## Leyaena

Got 4.8Ghz stable under IBT, 25reps
Vcore I needed for that was 1.39 (yikes!)
Hottest core ran 86°C.

Gonna test the 4.6Ghz overclock for 24/7 stability now, as I'm going to bed.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Here are my temps of delidded 3570k at 4.2Ghz. I used Ceramique 2, sandpaper the IHS(edges and sides) and didnt helped. Have a Custom WC with EK Supreme LT-UNI and EK 120mm+240mm rad with DC 2.2 pump. Tested the stock ivy cooler and get almost the same temps. Its a new loop, i had before no name pump + **** 360mm with Supreme LTX.
> 
> The last idea i have is this Liquid Ultra paste!
> 
> 
> 
> And if that wont help...its broken!


This might seem a silly question, but what is your vcore, and have you tried bumping it up?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *travex*
> 
> Guys, what is the most effective way to remove the CLU on my 3770k's die ? I want to re-apply the CLU on it, tried to remove the old CLU paste with some soft paper tissue but doesn't look really good


CLU will come off the die with just 90%+ isopropyl alcohol and some q-tips. You should not need anything abrasive whatsoever to remove Ultra or Pro from any surface. From the pcb or die alcohol will do it, and if it is completely dry on the IHS (or if you used it on your cooler) metal polish will remove it with some work.


----------



## strokercrate

First delid. i5 4670k I only had as5 im ordering clu hoping to get better temps.

First test was done at 23.3c - 72c = 49c

After delid done at 25c - 67c = 42

Difference of 7c

Will clu make that much of a difference from as5?

My chip was a pain to delid. It was so tight I could not knife it. Couldn't get under IHS.

Had to use the vise method which was still a pain It was stuck on so good I had to clamp down hard or it would pop out of the vise because of this i had to sand the IHS. Also a wooden block wasnt hard enough it would just press into the wood. I ended up using a small 4x5x3/4 aluminum block.

I have noticed that before I could run fine with 4.3ghz at 1.16v but now its stable I had to increase to 1.162 so far so good, still testing.


----------



## strokercrate

Forgot to add after. BIOS is set to 1.160 cpuid shows 1.168


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> 
> 
> First delid. i5 4670k I only had as5 im ordering clu hoping to get better temps.
> 
> First test was done at 23.3c - 72c = 49c
> 
> After delid done at 25c - 67c = 42
> 
> Difference of 7c
> 
> Will clu make that much of a difference from as5?
> 
> My chip was a pain to delid. It was so tight I could not knife it. Couldn't get under IHS.
> 
> Had to use the vise method which was still a pain It was stuck on so good I had to clamp down hard or it would pop out of the vise because of this i had to sand the IHS. Also a wooden block wasnt hard enough it would just press into the wood. I ended up using a small 4x5x3/4 aluminum block.
> 
> I have noticed that before I could run fine with 4.3ghz at 1.16v but now its stable I had to increase to 1.162 so far so good, still testing.


Your ambient is also higher so it's more then 7c difference!








But yes you will benefit from CLU/CLP (The liquid metals) over just AS5. Pretty good job!


----------



## strokercrate

Where is a good site to order clu/clp in USA? And which is better?


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Where is a good site to order clu/clp in USA? And which is better?


http://www.frozencpu.com/search.html?mv_profile=keyword_search&mv_session_id=hH6A9IKK&searchspec=coollaboratory&go.x=-679&go.y=-127

Bottom two are the ones you want can't go wrong with either.


----------



## Belial

I just found CLU for cheap. If you go on ebay, you can order it international for ~$18 shipped (US) from germany.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=coollaboratory+liquid+ultra&LH_PrefLoc=2
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Where is a good site to order clu/clp in USA? And which is better?


CLU is statistically insignificantly better than CLP, but it's much easier to spread and work with, and it doesn't stain,damage, or bond with stuff like CLP does. CLU is basically CLP 2.0. It's not much better or much different, but it's just an update to it. I don't think it's a good idea to buy CLP just because CLU is out of stock on a certain website and it's 'good enough'. I think it's a little irresponsible to recommend CLP too.

If you are paying $20+ for thermal paste, you should get the best possible. No, can't go wrong with it, it's still a relatively great product. But why buy a civic 2011 when you can buy a civic 2013 for the same price. I see CLU isn't in stock there but I'd just wait or buy elsewhere than settle for CLP. Like ebay.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I just found CLU for cheap. If you go on ebay, you can order it international for ~$18 shipped (US) from germany.
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=coollaboratory+liquid+ultra&LH_PrefLoc=2
> CLU is statistically insignificantly better than CLP, but it's much easier to spread and work with, and it doesn't stain,damage, or bond with stuff like CLP does. CLU is basically CLP 2.0. It's not much better or much different, but it's just an update to it. I don't think it's a good idea to buy CLP just because CLU is out of stock on a certain website and it's 'good enough'. I think it's a little irresponsible to recommend CLP too.
> 
> If you are paying $20+ for thermal paste, you should get the best possible. No, can't go wrong with it, it's still a relatively great product. But why buy a civic 2011 when you can buy a civic 2013 for the same price. I see CLU isn't in stock there but I'd just wait or buy elsewhere than settle for CLP. Like ebay.


CLP is just a little harder to take off. CLU is just easy to remove CLP. CLP isnt even hard to take off imo. You wont see better cooling with CLU.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> CLP is just a little harder to take off. CLU is just easy to remove CLP. CLP isnt even hard to take off imo. You wont see better cooling with CLU.


He just likes to argue with me. I say go right he say no left you stupid noob.









I have yet to see any data showing CLP is horrid and irresponsible to recommend. Throw up some proof. As it stands users use it just fine AFAIK.


----------



## ripsaw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I just found CLU for cheap. If you go on ebay, you can order it international for ~$18 shipped (US) from germany.
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=coollaboratory+liquid+ultra&LH_PrefLoc=2
> CLU is statistically insignificantly better than CLP, but it's much easier to spread and work with, and it doesn't stain,damage, or bond with stuff like CLP does. CLU is basically CLP 2.0. It's not much better or much different, but it's just an update to it. I don't think it's a good idea to buy CLP just because CLU is out of stock on a certain website and it's 'good enough'. I think it's a little irresponsible to recommend CLP too.
> 
> If you are paying $20+ for thermal paste, you should get the best possible. No, can't go wrong with it, it's still a relatively great product. But why buy a civic 2011 when you can buy a civic 2013 for the same price. I see CLU isn't in stock there but I'd just wait or buy elsewhere than settle for CLP. Like ebay.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> CLP is just a little harder to take off. CLU is just easy to remove CLP. CLP isnt even hard to take off imo. You wont see better cooling with CLU.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> He just likes to argue with me. I say go right he say no left you stupid noob.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have yet to see any data showing CLP is horrid and irresponsible to recommend. Throw up some proof. As it stands users use it just fine AFAIK.


I thought this argument was done with. They're both good, both better than anything else you can get, and you probably won't notice a temperature difference, unless you can apply them both with the same consistency at a microscopic level.







You want to keep arguing over it, you should *make another thread*. This argument is old, and pointless.


----------



## tw33k

I tested them both and found no significant difference between the 2. Personally, I find Ultra easier to work with but that's just me. Healthy and respectful discussion on this is welcome here http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro/0_50 Once I get this new CPU settled I will be running more tests on my test bench and will post in that thread


----------



## Belial

Quick question on the haswell issue in regards to ram overclocking , as i've heard high ram clocks really impact max cpu overclock on it. Can you increase IMC voltage or something to work around this? I mean if someone could explain this issue with haswell in regards to how ram overclocks limit cpu overclock I'd appreciate it.

Makes no logical sense to get CLP nowadays. Why. CLU is the update to CLP. It's the same stuff but easier to work with. It's basically same price. Let the outdated products die and support new, updated product lines.

Proof:
Quote:


> I've had it confirmed by the CEO of Coollaboratory that Liquid Ultra is rated at 38.4w/mk and Liquid Pro is rated at 32.6w/mk.


You can email him yourself, tw33ks words. Completely insigificant difference, mounting makes a bigger impact, this doesnt even account for a degree, etc, etc.... but why would you buy CLP instead of CLU if that's the case. I don't care if CLP and CLU were both 1 penny, I'm just the kind of person who would always choose to support the newer, better product (of similar price) every time. I don't like to settle for 'good enough' with my hard earned money.

People got along 'just fine' with AS5, or 'just fine' with the Z77 Extreme4. It's still a worse choice than PK-1/MX-4 or UD3H. I'm sorry, I must've missed when OCN was about the pursuit of performance and instead the pursuit of 'good enough, dont bother trying to figure out what is best'. It isn't pointless to come to a conclusion to what is best. Even if the difference is microscopic, I don't see that as any reason why one would not pick the better choice. Settling for 'good enough' is not good enough for me.

You are the only one arguing, there isn't any argument here (see how absolutely stupid a comment that is). Last I checked this is a discussion forum.


----------



## Fiked

Non-stop 14 hour journey has just come to an end for 6 or so hours. I spent the day well I feel, I woke up, grew a pair, and smacked that IHS right off its pedestal! Dropped about 15c but I can't find a charger for the life of me, so my photos are trapped for now.


----------



## Cyro999

So i herd you guys liek 20c temp drops

Seriously though, what do you think of data? Am i doing something critically wrong somewhere? With the insane temperatures i thought more people would be looking into it instead of blindly tuning OC's around IBT/Prime with AVX that somehow pulls temps in excess of 20c greater than x264 at 100% cpu load and high priority when it never did so on other CPU's.
Quote:


> ALWAYS THE SAME:
> 
> Gigabyte z87x-ud3h
> 4.5ghz core and uncore
> 2000mhz 10-10-10-28 RAM
> 1.2v uncore
> 1.22vcore, +0.15 analog io, +0.15 digital io, +0.1 system agent, default llc < all volts need a lot of work
> 
> ~20c ambients open case because exhaust fan broken, xigmatek utgard, 120mm front intake
> 170mm top exhaust, silver arrow SE 2x ty-147 fans @1200rpm
> 
> 6 minutes IBT temp, 4gb RAM:
> 
> HT on, avx on - 132 gflops - Max temps 92, 93, 91, 85*****
> 
> HT on, avx off - 67.2 gflops - Max temps 73, 74, 72, 66
> 
> HT off, avx on - 129 gflops - Max temps 83, 84, 82, 79
> 
> HT off, avx off - 67.6 gflops - Max temps 67, 67, 67, 61
> 
> x264 Benchmark HD v5.0.1
> 
> HT on, avx on - Pass 1; 88.12fps - Pass 2; 19.65fps - Max temps 71, 71, 70, 66
> 
> HT on, avx off - Pass 1; 88.08fps - Pass 2; 19.36fps - Max temps 70, 71, 70, 64
> 
> HT off, avx on - Pass 1; 70.98fps - Pass 2; 17.30fps - Max temps 63, 63, 62, 58
> 
> HT off, avx off - Pass 1; 67.39fps - Pass 2; 17.29fps - Max temps 63, 63, 62, 60 ???*
> 
> Starcraft 2: HOTS, maxed physics and effects, reflections on. Med shaders etc. 5 min replay segment, x4 speed
> 
> HT on, avx on - 2013-06-13 13:32:37 - SC2
> Frames: 4022 - Time: 53290ms - Avg: 75.474 - Min: 35 - Max: 114
> 
> HT off, avx off - 2013-06-13 13:58:14 - SC2
> Frames: 4032 - Time: 53368ms - Avg: 75.551 - Min: 35 - Max: 113
> 
> Note; CPU temps ridiculously low when playing sc2. Three cores dipping below 40c - one around 50-53c with ht AND avx.
> No gain from HT and lack of load on other 3 cores = cool fully loaded core
> 
> *Ambients varying within reason; no temperature control
> 
> *****STOP 0x0101 on third run, possible thermal failure?


It's kinda shocking to me how close the sc2 bench is, first try, but not nearly as much just the completely insane temps under prime or IBT (but only when avx enabled)


----------



## bce22

I knocked the top off of my 4770K last night using the hammervice method. Prior to the delid 4.4Ghz at 1.26 vCore was reaching 93C (between 20-21C ambient) in the aida64 stability test.

After replacing with CLU with a dab of MX-4 on the exposed caps the same OC tops out at 71C (ambient the same)!

This is a massive improvement and I am glad I did it. I will submit the necessary information (in the proper format) after work today to join the official club.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Something I just realized is that the table in the OP has no mention of the coolers used! The cooler has a massive impact on the temperature lost, as someone running stock would lose way less then what someone running with a NH-D14 or even a custom loop.

That and IMO i think the Haswell chips should be on the same page as the Ivy Chips because there aren't many of either really. Well not enough to warrant two tables


----------



## Cyro999

I guess you'd also see more C lost as an absolute number the higher your temperature was. 93c losing 20c a lot more plausible than 60c losing 20c with delid


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I guess you'd also see more C lost as an absolute number the higher your temperature was. 93c losing 20c a lot more plausible than 60c losing 20c with delid


Yeah it also depends on the voltage and before temp, but a rough estimate of the voltage is noted in CPU-Z and the temperatures are noted in the forum already.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Something I just realized is that the table in the OP has no mention of the coolers used! The cooler has a massive impact on the temperature lost, as someone running stock would lose way less then what someone running with a NH-D14 or even a custom loop.
> 
> That and IMO i think the Haswell chips should be on the same page as the Ivy Chips because there aren't many of either really. Well not enough to warrant two tables


The other thing that would be nice is if people would note if there a cooler change along with the Delid.


----------



## bce22

Yeah what your looking for is a percentage of a temp drop over ambient. For me it turns out to be approx 30% reduction in temperature with the delid and CLU on both the die and between the IHS and my Silver Arrow.


----------



## GaMbi2004

I have had my 4670K for roughly a day now.. im close to done with all windows updates, BIOS, Benchmarks installed etc..
What would be the best way to go about before / after temps?

Prime95 for half an hour or so on 4.6GHz 1.250V (80,80,75,70 degrees non delidded) or should I go higher in any? (Prime95 duration, higher clock / more volts)?
I wanna have some good before / after info to share with you guys







I think I will be delidding later today ;D

Cooled with custom loop (see sig)


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I have had my 4670K for roughly a day now.. im close to done with all windows updates, BIOS, Benchmarks installed etc..
> What would be the best way to go about before / after temps?
> 
> Prime95 for half an hour or so on 4.6GHz 1.250V (80,80,75,70 degrees non delidded) or should I go higher in any? (Prime95 duration, higher clock / more volts)?
> I wanna have some good before / after info to share with you guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I will be delidding later today ;D
> 
> Cooled with custom loop (see sig)


I personally used 20 runs of ibt. For my before and afters.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I have had my 4670K for roughly a day now.. im close to done with all windows updates, BIOS, Benchmarks installed etc..
> What would be the best way to go about before / after temps?
> 
> Prime95 for half an hour or so on 4.6GHz 1.250V (80,80,75,70 degrees non delidded) or should I go higher in any? (Prime95 duration, higher clock / more volts)?
> I wanna have some good before / after info to share with you guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I will be delidding later today ;D
> 
> Cooled with custom loop (see sig)


Generally an hour of P95 Blend is as close to a standard as I've seen. Document ambient temperature for your baseline and post delid runs, you can normalize them quite easily. Say the mean ambient temperature of your two runs is 25c, simply add or subtract the variance in ambient temperature from your core temperatures.

By doing this you've eliminated the largest variable in the process, and you'll know the exact difference (as close as you can get with software) in cooling.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Cheers Skullwipe and Dimaggio









I m gathering info at the moment.. IBT 20 runs is done, doing one hour Prime95 at the moment.

so I guess I will be delidding in about an hour ^^
Im gonna use hammer and vice method.

I know I was talking about dental floss, but I think that im going straight for the hammer instead.


Am I right in assuming that the best side to hit the PCB would be here? so that the PCB can travel further without doing any damage to the surface mounted thingies.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> 
> Am I right in assuming that the best side to hit the PCB would be here? so that the PCB can travel further without doing any damage to the surface mounted thingies.


I would say that's a fair assessment, I'd place a box or something similar behind the vice to catch the PCB should it decide it wants to go for a small flight. Try and wiggle the PCB after your first two hits, no point in hitting it any more when you can just lift off the IHS with a little effort.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

My CLP and 770 arrive today!!









I have my before shots of 4.6 and 4.8GHz runs. Will post results in a bit, whenever the brown truck decides to drop by.


----------



## GaMbi2004

YEY







Delidding was a success!!!
I had to hit harder then I originally thought, but hey.. it didnt spread its wings







I saw it moving "hm.. probably the IHS thats getting loose again" but no! a little wiggling and it was off ^^

Im testing temps atm.. IBT shows about 20 degree drop (ambient has dropped 2 degrees) but so fare, im happy ^^

I will post results, pic's, club form etc in an hour or so (Prime95 is running atm)

*Edit*

CPU-Z 1.64.3 (beta I think) shows the same core voltage all the time :S in idle AND under load / going from idle to load..

CPU-Z 1.64 (non beta) shows 0.82 or something, all the time even though it is set to 1.2V in BIOS (thats why I got the beta version instead)

Any fixes for this? it cant be right, can it? or dose it matter? 1.2V in bios shows 1.198V in 1.64.3, so seams kinda right.. but no vdrop/vdroop ?


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I have had my 4670K for roughly a day now.. im close to done with all windows updates, BIOS, Benchmarks installed etc..
> What would be the best way to go about before / after temps?
> 
> Prime95 for half an hour or so on 4.6GHz 1.250V (80,80,75,70 degrees non delidded) or should I go higher in any? (Prime95 duration, higher clock / more volts)?
> I wanna have some good before / after info to share with you guys
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I will be delidding later today ;D
> 
> Cooled with custom loop (see sig)


Sucks: I can get 4.3ghz with 1.16v but to jump any higher my volts start climbing fast. If I leave Volts to auto I can get 4.5ghz at 1.28-1.29 volts If i manual adjust them i have to have about 1.32 for 4.5ghz

Why might this be the case? Seems like manual adjusting would be more efficient for OC. Wish I could get 4.6ghz at 1.25v..

Are there anyother settings I can adjust to make OC more stable at lower volts?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Sucks: I can get 4.3ghz with 1.16v but to jump any higher my volts start climbing fast. If I leave Volts to auto I can get 4.5ghz at 1.28-1.29 volts If i manual adjust them i have to have about 1.32 for 4.5ghz
> 
> Why might this be the case? Seems like manual adjusting would be more efficient for OC. Wish I could get 4.6ghz at 1.25v..
> 
> Are there anyother settings I can adjust to make OC more stable at lower volts?


AFAIK it is the "luck of the draw".. some CPUs will go higher on 1.2V then others.. mine is stable at 4.5GHz 1.2V (witch I think puts it in the top 50% of chips?) 4.6 is top 40%, 4.8 top 10%
or though Im not sure about those numbers.. should be pretty close though.

*Edit*

Also, there might be sittings in BIOS you can change to get better results.. but better wait for someone with more knowledge on the subject








I will be needing advice on OCing soon too


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Sucks: I can get 4.3ghz with 1.16v but to jump any higher my volts start climbing fast. If I leave Volts to auto I can get 4.5ghz at 1.28-1.29 volts If i manual adjust them i have to have about 1.32 for 4.5ghz
> 
> Why might this be the case? Seems like manual adjusting would be more efficient for OC. Wish I could get 4.6ghz at 1.25v..
> 
> Are there anyother settings I can adjust to make OC more stable at lower volts?


My 3570k requires 1.165v to be stable at stock settings, so don't feel too bad. I have to run at 1.215v to get 4.4 Ghz 24/7 stable, 1.250v to even get into windows at 4.5 Ghz and 1.285v to be stable for an hour.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by strokercrate View Post
> 
> Sucks: I can get 4.3ghz with 1.16v but to jump any higher my volts start climbing fast. If I leave Volts to auto I can get 4.5ghz at 1.28-1.29 volts If i manual adjust them i have to have about 1.32 for 4.5ghz
> 
> Why might this be the case? Seems like manual adjusting would be more efficient for OC. Wish I could get 4.6ghz at 1.25v..
> 
> Are there anyother settings I can adjust to make OC more stable at lower volts?
> 
> 
> 
> My 3570k requires 1.165v to be stable at stock settings, so don't feel too bad. I have to run at 1.215v to get 4.4 Ghz 24/7 stable, 1.250v to even get into windows at 4.5 Ghz and 1.285v to be stable for an hour.
Click to expand...

Hmm.. those voltages seams so high!
I was hoping for 5.0GHz (can still happen) but I guess Im just happy about my results so fare then


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hmm.. those voltages seams so high!
> I was hoping for 5.0GHz (can still happen) but I guess Im just happy about my results so fare then


You're telling me! My Default BIOS setting is a 1.16 Vcore, but I was getting all kinds of memory and I/O related BSOD's. Over volting slightly solved everything and I've been running 4.4 Ghz 24/7 for months with no issues. Intel has given me the option to RMA since the chip isn't stable at stock speeds and voltages, but I've seen people with even worse chips than mine and I don't really want to risk it.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Woops


----------



## Face2Face

How long does CLU last? If I delid my Ivy and re-install the IHS, will I ever have to replace it?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Here is my new hardware, in and out of the box










The vice and the chip.


IHS + chip cleaning

Apply CL Ultra + close up of resistors (or what ever those surface mounted stuff is) witch is covered with MX-4
I DID clean up that extra TIM on the PCB and between surface mounted and die, but forgot to take new pic










IBT 20 runs before / after delidding
Before: 84, 83, 82, 78 (Ambiant 27C)
After: 64, 63, 62, 62 (Ambiant 26C)


Prime95 Blend Torture Test 1 hour run before / after delidding
Before: 75 , 75, 72, 68 (Ambiant 27C)
After: 61, 62, 60, 58 (Ambiant 26C)

OCN name : GaMbi2004
CPU : Haswell 4670k i5
On-die TIM : Coollab Liquid ultra
IHS TIM : MX-4
Mhz gained : N/A
OC after delid : 4.5GHz so fare..
Temp drops : 19C
Validation :http://valid.canardpc.com/2831865









Thoughts:
I ran out of MX-4 -_- so I might not have enough between IHS->Cooler block.. but seams "OK" at the moment (also, I tend to use a bit too much anyways







so this might be the right amount, lol)
Oh yea.. I might add that the Hammer on pic nr 4 is NOT the one I used ;D I put it next to vice for giggles, hehe.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Face2Face*
> 
> How long does CLU last? If I delid my Ivy and re-install the IHS, will I ever have to replace it?


If you don't remove your cooler then you won't ever need to replace the Liquid Ultra.


----------



## justanoldman

Good job GaMbi2004, and nicely done with the pics and documentation. +rep for the effort.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Face2Face*
> 
> How long does CLU last? If I delid my Ivy and re-install the IHS, will I ever have to replace it?


...if you don't disturb the 'seal' after delidding and remounting, it will last for years...if you subsequently open it ups again, a new application would likely be required


----------



## Watagump

Its so wrong that CLU being sold on Amazon went from $15 to over $30. Thats what it was listed at yesterday at least.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Watagump*
> 
> Its so wrong that CLU being sold on Amazon went from $15 to over $30. Thats what it was listed at yesterday at least.


If it is popular, the price gouging will commence. Look at the samsung low voltage memory, great price performance when it came out at $35 for a kit, but then the price got jacked & at $60 or $70 for the same kit price/performance was not so good anymore.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If it is popular, the price gouging will commence. Look at the samsung low voltage memory, great price performance when it came out at $35 for a kit, but then the price got jacked & at $60 or $70 for the same kit price/performance was not so good anymore.


...I was going to post about that earlier, but said ...nahhh







The company that makes CL-U/P is in a city in Germany that just had massive flooding, along with many other places in Europe...they showed the industrial area of that city on the television / BBC, and the main power transfer station they were trying to save from flooding.

...it could very well be that the price is reacting to a temporary supply-chain disruption


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...it could very well be that the price is reacting to a temporary supply-chain disruption


I would think this would have at least something to do with it. In a couple of weeks, baring damage to shipping and related manufacturing facilities, the price will normalize again.


----------



## Belial

Anyone read German in here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160590896207

This is CLU being sold for ~$16 shipped. However, I just wanted to make sure this isn't some stupid rip off where it's not CLU but like an accessory (you know what listings I talk about, ie "H100 Awesome 240mm Radiator Closed Loop!" and it's really just the 2 fans or some 5 year old asetek). Normally you can confirm if it's legit or not but considering the page is in german....

Thanks. They have high feedback and the price sounds right so I expect it's legit, but I want to make 100% sure.


----------



## bringhimup

I'm a German. It seems to be okay. The most important part is: "Neben der Liquid Ultra selbst liegen der Verpackung zwei kompakte Pinsel, ein Reinigungsset sowie eine mehrsprachige Anleitung bei."

That means that while you get the Liquid Ultra in itself, you also get 2 brushes, cleaning set and multi language instructions manual. And that seems to be the original scope of supply.

Greetings from Berlin (Germany)


----------



## scorpscarx

Just got done delidding my 3570k and putting together a new test bench today. Here's my story, apologies for the rambling, really tired and spent a lot of the day worrying about this







.

I originally knew I would go the razor method because I am really good with my hands, but at the last moment I tried vice method and managed to slightly warp, scratch the sides a lot, and I even chipped a small piece of the pcb covering layer on the bottom edge near the contacts, luckily it stopped right before exposing the copper plain underneath and it booted and runs fine so far. I used a very precise expensive vice and still had issues.

I am not here to argue the merits of either, but I quickly went back to my original plan and spent about 30 minutes carefully prying through with my blade.

Blade ftw that's all I am going to say, no cuts, no dings in the upper pcb, the die is fine etc... contacts are fine.

I used CLP, just covering it as instructed, mirror sheen etc... and replaced the cm tim to Prolimatech PK3. One thing to note is that I just used a qtip to apply the clp, but I don't think any fibers were left behind.

Strangely my idles are exactly the same, and I tested with same cooler and %100 fan rpm same as before, maybe someone has the answer to that riddle.

However under full P95 test for 20 minutes, load temps are indeed 15C less, so it was worth it, and thankfully the block of wood that chipped the lower pcb covering didn't brick my chip.


----------



## Molokou

Guys, and why not getting them directly from CooLaboratory?

I bought some from their online shop and got both CLU and CLP (1 syringe of each one) for ~$23 dlls shipped through registered mail all the way from Germany to Mexico in less than 2 weeks!

In my case that was the only way to get them, but I am really satisfied with the delivery time and the overall shipped pricing for everything









Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4 Beta


----------



## Forceman

Idle temps are already so close to ambient because the chip is essentially turned off that there just isn't much room for reduction there. The impact of the TIM is much less when the temp delta is 5C at idle than when it is 50C at load.


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Idle temps are already so close to ambient because the chip is essentially turned off that there just isn't much room for reduction there. The impact of the TIM is much less when the temp delta is 5C at idle than when it is 50C at load.


Make's sense, thank you.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Finally got my CLP today. Wow, it kinda shot out of the syringe so I had a hell of a ime cleaning it off my chip as its was just to much. Left a regular amount on it, covered it up and went on my way.

I did not see the huge jump I was looking for but I already had a golden chip with below average temps, so its to be expected I guess. I still saw a average of 13.5c drop across the cores, so I'm happy.

Before:
4.8GHz @ 1,270v

90c 95c 97c 91c

After:
4.8GHz @ 1.270v

77c 78c 81c 80c

Keep in mind I have a little antec 620 cooler with stock fans, and in a SFF case. So overall not bad. I plan on moving to a bitfenix case so i might reapply when I do that, and see if I can get slightly better.


----------



## Janac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ripsaw*
> 
> This might seem a silly question, but what is your vcore, and have you tried bumping it up?


This is stock voltage i think... indeed not stable

However im buying CLU, hard to find here in SLO.


----------



## Swag

Does anyone here know if Asus plans to release any new X79 motherboards soon?

It's either I build a new X79 build or I go with some other stuff like another GPU and random stuff.


----------



## illuz

I don't think they do, I'd get another 680, or go for a 780!

Now cooling direct-die with a custom loop. Temps are after a game of Crysis 3 - [email protected] 4.8GHz v1.4


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bringhimup*
> 
> I'm a German. It seems to be okay. The most important part is: "Neben der Liquid Ultra selbst liegen der Verpackung zwei kompakte Pinsel, ein Reinigungsset sowie eine mehrsprachige Anleitung bei."
> 
> That means that while you get the Liquid Ultra in itself, you also get 2 brushes, cleaning set and multi language instructions manual. And that seems to be the original scope of supply.
> 
> Greetings from Berlin (Germany)


Thanks, I'll be buying it then. Anyone else in the market for CLU/CLP should buy it too.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Just got done delidding my 3570k and putting together a new test bench today. Here's my story, apologies for the rambling, really tired and spent a lot of the day worrying about this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> I originally knew I would go the razor method because I am really good with my hands, but at the last moment I tried vice method and managed to slightly warp, scratch the sides a lot, and I even chipped a small piece of the pcb covering layer on the bottom edge near the contacts, luckily it stopped right before exposing the copper plain underneath and it booted and runs fine so far. I used a very precise expensive vice and still had issues.
> 
> I am not here to argue the merits of either, but I quickly went back to my original plan and spent about 30 minutes carefully prying through with my blade.
> 
> Blade ftw that's all I am going to say, no cuts, no dings in the upper pcb, the die is fine etc... contacts are fine.
> 
> I used CLP, just covering it as instructed, mirror sheen etc... and replaced the cm tim to Prolimatech PK3. One thing to note is that I just used a qtip to apply the clp, but I don't think any fibers were left behind.
> 
> Strangely my idles are exactly the same, and I tested with same cooler and %100 fan rpm same as before, maybe someone has the answer to that riddle.
> 
> However under full P95 test for 20 minutes, load temps are indeed 15C less, so it was worth it, and thankfully the block of wood that chipped the lower pcb covering didn't brick my chip.


yea but what about the FIVR? Avoiding that with a razor seems pretty precarious. I mean I'm sure you can still do it, but it goes from "Anyone can delid safely with the razor method except 1 guy" to "This is very dangerous". There's a report of a guy slizing his FIVR doing the razor method... I wish he'd report what happened, I think he was just some spoiled kid and threw it in the garbage before even testing it and bought another haswell (dont quote me on that).

Surprised at your results though. Could you tell us _how exactly_ that happened? I dont understand how all that damage occurred. And i mean... really, you are still a success story. You didn't really damage the chip besides a few dings so I'd say that's a win









Fibers being left behind with a qtip won't be a big deal. Obviously it's not optimal but it shouldnt affect temps by any significant margin. Why not just use a piece of cardboard though, like a business card, that's the spreaders that most small tubes of thermal paste come with.
Quote:


> Finally got my CLP today. Wow, it kinda shot out of the syringe so I had a hell of a ime cleaning it off my chip as its was just to much. Left a regular amount on it, covered it up and went on my way.
> 
> I did not see the huge jump I was looking for but I already had a golden chip with below average temps, so its to be expected I guess. I still saw a average of 13.5c drop across the cores, so I'm happy.


13C drop is pretty solid man, I mean you can't get that anywhere else even if you spend $50+. Your 620 is also going to really hold you back, it's a really outdated cooler by now, it's basically the weakest 120mm closed loop still sold. It was good in it's day, it's still a decent cooler, but it's a solidly lower mid-range heatsink. Getting a better cooler would really get you a solid drop, something like a logisys assassin or nh-d14 for $40-50 off ebay or on sale somewhere, newegg recently had the h100 for $54 (its' commonly $55-65 on ebay), theres been a few high end zalmans for super cheap on newegg too. Thanks for posting your results, really cool stuff.

Is it possible to bin a haswell using the stock heatsink? Would it be too much to just see if it can boot to bios with [email protected] or is that asking for trouble on stock cooler lol.


----------



## Cyro999

I wouldn't say it's possible to bin very well on the stock heatsink because of how many voltages there are.

You have to fine tune VRIN, digital and analog IO voltages, system agent AND vcore to stabilize core frequency. With them, i went from failing ibt at 1.22v to passing at 1.155, for example. It seems what you need to do to them is quite different depending on the board, and individual CPU, so it would be tricky to blindly bin i think.

Go talk on skype if you want data. I have a lot relating to haswell, x264 and sc2.


----------



## Belial

http://www.overclockers.com/3step-guide-to-overclock-intel-haswell

this says just set to 1.25v to bin and crank it up and see what can boot, but I dont know if that'd be too much, just going to bios, on the stock cooler. I mean binning is just if you can boot, not stress testing at all, so you get an idea of how good your chip is.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> this says just set to 1.25v to bin and crank it up and see what can boot


Yea man it's a seriously terrible guide it doesn't even mention half of the things you should be doing. Your "binning" would probably be wildly different depending on the CPU and board used (and default settings) and not very representative of final results


----------



## aweisberg

Quote:


> I wish he'd report what happened, I think he was just some spoiled kid and threw it in the garbage before even testing it and bought another haswell (dont quote me on that).


U MAD BRO?









If someone in the continental US wants to try it out I will ship it to them for free as a favor because I know people are curious. It's going to markallen1988


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Surprised at your results though. Could you tell us _how exactly_ that happened? I dont understand how all that damage occurred. And i mean... really, you are still a success story. You didn't really damage the chip besides a few dings so I'd say that's a win
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fibers being left behind with a qtip won't be a big deal. Obviously it's not optimal but it shouldnt affect temps by any significant margin. Why not just use a piece of cardboard though, like a business card, that's the spreaders that most small tubes of thermal paste come with.


I think the wood wasn't hard enough and the PCB edge imprinted into the side of the 2x4, chipping the bottom layer edge. Should have never tried with the vise. Too be perfectly honest I did not read about the vise method other than a couple of videos, only reason I attempted it last moment was because I found my really nice vise.

I like using a razor and would personally even do it with Haswell, you don't cut so much as you just apply even pressure going in starting at the edges and pry it off. Just-wiggle-it is now my defacto motto for practically everything.

The qtip worked out pretty well because I was able to soak up any excesses into the bud, that CLP is some cool stuff.

However yes, even the hell my chip just went through it survived, delid successful





















.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> I think the wood wasn't hard enough and the PCB edge imprinted into the side of the 2x4, chipping the bottom layer edge. Should have never tried with the vise. Too be perfectly honest I did not read about the vise method other than a couple of videos, only reason I attempted it last moment was because I found my really nice vise.
> 
> I like using a razor and would personally even do it with Haswell, you don't cut so much as you just apply even pressure going in starting at the edges and pry it off. Just-wiggle-it is now my defacto motto for practically everything.
> 
> The qtip worked out pretty well because I was able to soak up any excesses into the bud, that CLP is some cool stuff.
> 
> However yes, even the hell my chip just went through it survived, delid successful
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Congrats on the delid









I didn't read bugger all into the process either, I just saw vice, wood, hammer and applied a bit of common sense lol. Worked well for me anyway (two little taps and it was off)








Still haven't got my CLP though, $50+ in shipping and a week later it's still not here... spewin!
But I noticed it's in the country at least, just not in my hot little hands yet!


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone here know if Asus plans to release any new X79 motherboards soon?
> 
> It's either I build a new X79 build or I go with some other stuff like another GPU and random stuff.


Ivy Bridge E is supposed to launch this fall, so I doubt we'll see much if anything new in the x79 world.


----------



## neofury

OK so as you may know lately its been a rip-off to get CLU on Amazon. I was willing to suck it up and even pay the $30 since FrozenCPU is sold out of CLU. But check this, today I got paid so was going to get it...



That's rich, no pun intended.

Nobody is going to pay these derps 76$ nice try. I'd rather just get Pro from FrozenCPU and hopefully purolator doesn't rip me off like UPS did on my last order. This is downright robbery.


----------



## .theMetal

Wow! that is some price gouging if I've ever seen it. I guess I'm glad I ordered when I did.


----------



## King4x4

New bios on my sniper enabled stable OC with BCLK!



5ghz with 1.58v doing 91'C on the hottest core!


----------



## lilchronic

you crazy 91c







lolz

must have deleted my 5.2 ghz run but temps were in the 90c range also


----------



## hotrod717

Got my 2700k today and should be delidding my 3770k tomorrow.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone here know if Asus plans to release any new X79 motherboards soon?
> 
> It's either I build a new X79 build or I go with some other stuff like another GPU and random stuff.


Not sure about Asus, at least Evga is preparing a new x79 board, I would expect other manufacturers are doing the same. It's been a couple years since x79 came out, I'd be surprised if some new boards didn't launch with ivy-e.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> New bios on my sniper enabled stable OC with BCLK!
> 
> 
> 
> 5ghz with 1.58v doing 91'C on the hottest core!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> you crazy 91c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lolz
> 
> must have deleted my 5.2 ghz run but temps were in the 90c range also


You both crazy! I have forgotten to plug in a pump before, but other than that I've never had a cpu hit 90°.


----------



## tw33k

Just de-lidded my latest 3770K (Costa 3310A566) At 4.7GHz temps dropped from 83c down to 57c on the hottest core (pics will come once testing is finished). That's the best result I've had and I've done a few chips. I always use a razor to de-lid. Takes like 30 seconds to get the IHS off once you've done it a couple times.


----------



## Dangur

Anyone interested in selling his 3570k/3770k lid (will pay for lid+shipping)? I want to make a keychain


----------



## strokercrate

finally got 4.5ghz stable with 1.23v with my 4670k max temps 72c on air had to do a lot of tweakin.

Just ordered CLP $17.95 amazon. Hopefully will lower my temps a little more.

Whats the max volts for vcore, and for svid offset? or should i even adjust svid offset?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Not sure about Asus, at least Evga is preparing a new x79 board, I would expect other manufacturers are doing the same. It's been a couple years since x79 came out, I'd be surprised if some new boards didn't launch with ivy-e.
> 
> You both crazy! I have forgotten to plug in a pump before, but other than that I've never had a cpu hit 90°.


...now, fellas - this is not a race, but you GOT to work on your temps !


----------



## King4x4

Unless you boil water on a cpu I am not calling it an overclock!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...now, fellas - this is not a race, but you GOT to work on your temps !


i want one of these for the temps


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Unless you boil water on a cpu I am not calling it an overclock!


...I'm trying, but every time I boil water...

...it goes to the coffee machine instead...it's so bad I got my own custom coffee mix - bizarrely balanced between 'Yukon blend' and 'Arabica'


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *King4x4*
> 
> Unless you boil water on a cpu I am not calling it an overclock!













Making ice out of water instead of boiling it. I feel so fail now...


----------



## tw33k

Before & after @ 4.7GHz


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Making ice out of water instead of boiling it. I feel so fail now...


...there ought to be a law against that







, besides

...my coffee probably tastes better (...but may be not). I recall s.th. about freeze-dried coffee somewhere...


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Making ice out of water instead of boiling it. I feel so fail now...


I'll be there with a bottle of scotch in 5 minutes!
So what if it's only 9am in the morning!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> I'll be there with a bottle of scotch in 5 minutes!
> So what if it's only 9am in the morning!


9 am, I'm only awake at that time when I haven't gotten to bed yet!

I'll have to try some stress testing on the 4770k tonight, gigaflops at 5.2Ghz should be better than the 3770k...


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Question for you guys. Can I add CLP as the paste on my GPU? Its a tiny die to a big cooler, so Im hoping it will also lower temps a great deal.......Thoughts?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Making ice out of water instead of boiling it. I feel so fail now...


Lol. I'm adding a passive rad when I redo my loop just so I can throw it in a bucket of ice every now and then!


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Lol. I'm adding a passive rad when I redo my loop just so I can throw it in a bucket of ice every now and then!


Get a mini fridge and a reservoir that maximizes surface area and a 120mm (or larger) thick radiator to mount inside. Amazon has a 4 liter micro fridge that cools to 32f below ambient for under $60, drill a few holes for your hoses and you're good to go.


----------



## gorge

How do you take care of condensation?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Question for you guys. Can I add CLP as the paste on my GPU? Its a tiny die to a big cooler, so Im hoping it will also lower temps a great deal.......Thoughts?


CLP and CLU are capacitive and conductive, therefore we are told never to use them on video cards since a drop in the wrong place would spell disaster.

However, since we are all delidders here and therefore a little nuts at least, there are several of us that use them on the die(s) of our gpus. It works well, and you will get a little better temps but nothing like the extreme temp drop from delidding a chip since the main thing there is reducing the space between the die and IHS.

If you are at all worried about it, then go with mx-4, and since we can spend much more on our cards than our chips I can understand people being cautious. So just be very careful if you do it.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> CLP and CLU are capacitive and conductive, therefore we are told never to use them on video cards since a drop in the wrong place would spell disaster.
> 
> However, since we are all delidders here and therefore a little nuts at least, there are several of us that use them on the die(s) of our gpus. It works well, and you will get a little better temps but nothing like the extreme temp drop from delidding a chip since the main thing there is reducing the space between the die and IHS.
> 
> If you are at all worried about it, then go with mx-4, and since we can spend much more on our cards than our chips I can understand people being cautious. So just be very careful if you do it.


Plus rep for response. I already have PK-1 paste, however I hear EVGA uses good paste so I will just leave it be, Temps are not an issue anyways.

I moved over to a prodigy case, so now that is done I can order a bigger CLC to compliment my delided chip.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gorge*
> 
> How do you take care of condensation?


I use a coating of liquid electric tape on the the board, seal the cpu into the socket with eraser, then some paper towels to catch any moisture & have some case fans for airflow. I don't usually use any vaseline in the socket, although that is generally recommended for 24/7 subzero cooling.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I use a coating of liquid electric tape on the the board, seal the cpu into the socket with eraser, then some paper towels to catch any moisture & have some case fans for airflow. I don't usually use any vaseline in the socket, although that is generally recommended for 24/7 subzero cooling.


Would it be possible for someone to come up with something a little less extreme than phase? Basically take it slightly below ambient but above dew point. That would put it between custom water and phase, but we wouldn't have to worry about condensation and it would be much more compact than water with a lot of rad space.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> OK so as you may know lately its been a rip-off to get CLU on Amazon. I was willing to suck it up and even pay the $30 since FrozenCPU is sold out of CLU. But check this, today I got paid so was going to get it...
> 
> 
> 
> That's rich, no pun intended.
> 
> Nobody is going to pay these derps 76$ nice try. I'd rather just get Pro from FrozenCPU and hopefully purolator doesn't rip me off like UPS did on my last order. This is downright robbery.


Dude just order it from ebay:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/160590896207?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
Quote:


> Question for you guys. Can I add CLP as the paste on my GPU? Its a tiny die to a big cooler, so Im hoping it will also lower temps a great deal.......Thoughts?


You can, but it depends on the model. In general, companies use extremely high end paste on graphics cards. So if you are planning to do it to something like a modern GPU such as the 7950 or 770, don't expect a major change in temps, even with something as high end as CLP. If this was something like an older series GTX 280 or a 4870, then yea you will see a significant drop in temps.

It also depends on how much of a temp drop you want. Putting CLP on a 7950 will likely only result in a 1-3C temp drop - is that worth it to you? I only got a 1-2C temp drop using CLU on my Sapphire 7950, and I push extreme temps on it (i also remounted twice to be sure). But my GTX460 saw a 9C temp drop. However my 7950 needed every degree it could get, while my 460 already ran super cool.

If you use something as mediocre as MX-4 on a 7950, you will likely see an increase in temps. That's absolutely terrible advice.
Quote:


> CLP and CLU are capacitive and conductive, therefore we are told never to use them on video cards since a drop in the wrong place would spell disaster.


You have to be pretty stupid to let CLU just spill all over the place and not clean it up... Oh no, I somehow spilled tons of this reflective, mercury like liquid all over my capacitors. I'm just going to ignore it and not wipe it up before turning on the card!


----------



## InCoGnIt0

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php

is where I got my liquid ultra


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Would it be possible for someone to come up with something a little less extreme than phase? Basically take it slightly below ambient but above dew point. That would put it between custom water and phase, but we wouldn't have to worry about condensation and it would be much more compact than water with a lot of rad space.


That is about where TEC cooling is. A couple guys in the TEC section have made controllers to keep the temps just above the dew point, so condensation shouldn't be a concern. It still requires a good water loop though, the better the TEC to keep load temps at bay, the hotter it will run & need more cooling for the TEC.
I have a TEC water chiller that is similar with keeping water just a few degrees below ambient, but it is noisier than most water loops, pretty bulky, & the OC potential gained is pretty small, maybe 100mhz or so.

It's hard to recommend more 'safe' heavier cooling, after air & water I tried the TEC chilled water & it just wasn't enough for me. There can be some gain though, so I guess it depends if the price is right to the individual.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Ok thanks for advice belial. Another question for you speaking of spills. I am a tad bit worried that when I put the IHS back on it will squeeze the rest of the CLP onto the chips PCB. I followed the instructions and got good temps, but if by chance there is currently some CLP sitting on the bare PCB under the IHS will it eventually eat through and damage the PCB, or should I relax, and if its working leave it alone?


----------



## dramabeats

for those who use liquid pro do you use it between your heatsink as well? also do you use the brush to apply it to the die or do you just put on a small drop?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php
> 
> is where I got my liquid ultra


out of stock. or overpriced. but ppcs is out of stock atm.

ebay from germany. get it from the motherland.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Ok thanks for advice belial. Another question for you speaking of spills. I am a tad bit worried that when I put the IHS back on it will squeeze the rest of the CLP onto the chips PCB. I followed the instructions and got good temps, but if by chance there is currently some CLP sitting on the bare PCB under the IHS will it eventually eat through and damage the PCB, or should I relax, and if its working leave it alone?


If you are using so much paste that stuff 'squeezes' then you are doing it wrong. With CLU/CLP you should be using so little that like you never have to even put it on the die or IHS or anything. You just sort of wipe the brush on the edge of the syringe and that should be enough to cover most of the IHS or die or whatever. CLU/CLP is not _corrosive_... except to aluminum i suppose. If you had CLP on the bare pcb, you'd see the silverish stuff on it...

leave it alone. How much of a temp drop did you get?
Quote:


> for those who use liquid pro do you use it between your heatsink as well? also do you use the brush to apply it to the die or do you just put on a small drop?


Of course. What's best for the die is best for the IHS, and vice versa. You do need to use a brush (not _the_ brush necessarily but i mean why not use the one provided...) as it's sort of a weird material, it's not quite like a ceramic in that it'll just spread on it's own. It's more like the t1000 in that if you don't lay it down it'll move around on it's own.


----------



## tw33k

@lucas.vulcan...Like most other posts I've read of yours, this makes no sense. This is not the Prime95 24 hour stress test club. Fancy you calling anyone a n00b.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Built a Haswell i5 build for a mate in my dorm block, he loves it.

*not de-lidding as it's not mine*

But as I installed it the IHS looks a tad smaller then the 3570k's, and it also had black glue/adhesive visible on the outsides of it. I can take some photos in a few weeks as I have to put a Swiftech H220 on it..

Also: 60c at full load in Intel Burn Test on stock with the stock cooler! I might not have AVX installed yet.. Not sure. I'll check that later hey?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Built a Haswell i5 build for a mate in my dorm block, he loves it.

*not de-lidding as it's not mine*

But as I installed it the IHS looks a tad smaller then the 3570k's, and it also had black glue/adhesive visible on the outsides of it. I can take some photos in a few weeks as I have to put a Swiftech H220 on it..

Also: 60c at full load in Intel Burn Test on stock with the stock cooler! I might not have AVX installed yet.. Not sure. I'll check that later hey?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Built a Haswell i5 build for a mate in my dorm block, he loves it.
> 
> *not de-lidding as it's not mine*


sneak into his room at night and delid it. Have him wake up to this:


----------



## JSTe

Here are some results from my hammer-n-vice 3570k delid.



That gray rubber might haswell have been the adhesive holding the IHS in place.

And some temps with CLU on die/IHS and MX-4 on IHS/Block (Kühler 620)

Before:



After:



There is also another 3570k I delidded, with MX-4 on die/IHS and the cooler, results differ but the idea is the same.


----------



## charliew

So Ive really been thinking through this razorblade idea, and been thinking of safer substitutes etc.

Basically I went to the hardware store today and I found these replacement blades for a bench plane. Didnt know they made them this small. And because of the way its used its not very flexible and I tried to break one to see how hard they were, I just cut myself.
Theyre hard allright.



Its the sharpest edge I have ever come across, it cut through waxed paper when I was trying to get it out of its package and I cut myself. I WILL have to dull an edge to make sure I dont cut my hand off.

Also, got a package from germany today







.


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *charliew*
> 
> So Ive really been thinking through this razorblade idea, and been thinking of safer substitutes etc.
> 
> Basically I went to the hardware store today and I found these replacement blades for a bench plane. Didnt know they made them this small. And because of the way its used its not very flexible and I tried to break one to see how hard they were, I just cut myself.
> Theyre hard allright.
> 
> 
> 
> Its the sharpest edge I have ever come across, it cut through waxed paper when I was trying to get it out of its package and I cut myself. I WILL have to dull an edge to make sure I dont cut my hand off.
> 
> Also, got a package from germany today
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Just make sure the blade is not to thick mate!!!

And you can put some masking tape on the back edge to stop cutting you're fingers....


----------



## Daredevil 720

My 3770K seems to be stable at 4.5GHz 1.20-1.22V. I haven't stressed it enough or played with any settings other than the multiplier and Vcore *at all* so it could require more or less than that. The batch number is 3302B543. Will this do well if delidded?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Get a mini fridge and a reservoir that maximizes surface area and a 120mm (or larger) thick radiator to mount inside. Amazon has a 4 liter micro fridge that cools to 32f below ambient for under $60, drill a few holes for your hoses and you're good to go.


That's a pretty good idea, although for 24/7, I doubt that cheap of a fridge would have a decent thermostat to fine tune the temps to avoid condensation.
Quick bath in ice for a few benches and you don't have to worry too much about it.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Ok thanks for advice belial. Another question for you speaking of spills. I am a tad bit worried that when I put the IHS back on it will squeeze the rest of the CLP onto the chips PCB. I followed the instructions and got good temps, but if by chance there is currently some CLP sitting on the bare PCB under the IHS will it eventually eat through and damage the PCB, or should I relax, and if its working leave it alone?


Don't worry about the pcb, if any happens to get on it, nothing bad will happen.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dramabeats*
> 
> for those who use liquid pro do you use it between your heatsink as well? also do you use the brush to apply it to the die or do you just put on a small drop?


I use CLU on the die and on top of the IHS but I don't recommend it to people to use on top unless they understand it can be a real pain to completely clean it off when you eventually pull your cooler and IHS apart. You always want to brush CLU and CLP, they are not a TIM that you use a drop and let the IHS push it around.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> My 3770K seems to be stable at 4.5GHz 1.20-1.22V. I haven't stressed it enough or played with any settings other than the multiplier and Vcore *at all* so it could require more or less than that. The batch number is 3302B543. Will this do well if delidded?


If you delid successfully then you should get a 10 to 20c drop in load temps, sometimes more if you have a particularly hot chip. This will allow you to go several multipliers higher if you wish. I would suggest making sure you find your lowest vCore for 4.5 or 4.6, depending on your temps, then decide.

If you have only changed the multiplier and vCore, then I would suggest your follow the settings and testing procedures of the guide linked below. That should help you find the minimum, reasonably stable, vCore for your multiplier.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards


----------



## charliew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> Just make sure the blade is not to thick mate!!!
> 
> And you can put some masking tape on the back edge to stop cutting you're fingers....


The second pic of me pinching something is actually the blade from the side. Its rediculously thin. Just wanted to give you all a tip if you want something other than a razor.


----------



## Hokies83

Hah! Lots of wet behind the ears new members since i last posted in Hur..

Anywho the Ghetto rig is done.. Well till i get the other 7950 back from rma...

Ill post picture in a min XD

Welp it is a i5 3570k + Extreme 4

X fire 7950s " one if off for rma "

Old cheap raidmax case gutted with a Cosmos 2 Panel / fan controller.










Thats whats up Yo.


----------



## hotrod717

You simply don't understand how simple it is until you have actually delidded a cpu. I built this up in my mind and it took literally all of 10 seconds. Secure in vise tap,tap, and viola! Didn't even have a flying IHS. Saw it move ever so slightly after second tap, twisted and off it popped. Unfortunately I'll have to wait for the clu. What is the easiest way to clean off the black rtv material? Tim was no sweat with a little isopropyl alcohol, but the black gasket seems a bit tougher.


----------



## Dzuks

Please add me.





You could add another category as Conquistador suggested:
OCN name: Dzuks
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
Temp drops: 20~C


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> You simply don't understand how simple it is until you have actually delidded a cpu. I built this up in my mind and it took literally all of 10 seconds. Secure in vise tap,tap, and viola! Didn't even have a flying IHS. Saw it move ever so slightly after second tap, twisted and off it popped. Unfortunately I'll have to wait for the clu. *What is the easiest way to clean off the black rtv material?* Tim was no sweat with a little isopropyl alcohol, but the black gasket seems a bit tougher.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> The best way I've found to get the glue off the PCB and the IHS is to use an old plastic card (eg: credit card) It doesn't take too long and does a great job
Click to expand...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> You simply don't understand how simple it is until you have actually delidded a cpu. I built this up in my mind and it took literally all of 10 seconds. Secure in vise tap,tap, and viola! Didn't even have a flying IHS. Saw it move ever so slightly after second tap, twisted and off it popped. Unfortunately I'll have to wait for the clu. What is the easiest way to clean off the black rtv material? Tim was no sweat with a little isopropyl alcohol, but the black gasket seems a bit tougher.


Old credit card was the easiest way I found to remove the black glue, you just use an edge to carefully scrape it off. Many of us have commented that getting all the glue off was the hardest part of the whole process.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dzuks*
> 
> Please add me.
> You could add another category as Conquistador suggested:
> OCN name: Dzuks
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp drops: 20~C


Nice job. You have room, you going to take the chip higher?


----------



## scorpscarx

Just wanted to say that I recommend a *plastic knife* over a credit card because the tip area is thinner and more flexible to get off the remaining silicon, and a *mat cutter blade* (I do custom framing) for the delidding because it is only sharpened on one side, with a flat back, and they are very thin. Hope that helps someone.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> You simply don't understand how simple it is until you have actually delidded a cpu. I built this up in my mind and it took literally all of 10 seconds. Secure in vise tap,tap, and viola! Didn't even have a flying IHS. Saw it move ever so slightly after second tap, twisted and off it popped. Unfortunately I'll have to wait for the clu. *What is the easiest way to clean off the black rtv material?* Tim was no sweat with a little isopropyl alcohol, but the black gasket seems a bit tougher.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> The best way I've found to get the glue off the PCB and the IHS is to use an old plastic card (eg: credit card) It doesn't take too long and does a great job
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Old credit card was the easiest way I found to remove the black glue, you just use an edge to carefully scrape it off. Many of us have commented that getting all the glue off was the hardest part of the whole process.
> Nice job. You have room, you going to take the chip higher?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks guys, worked like a charm!
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> @lucas.vulcan...Like most other posts I've read of yours, this makes no sense. This is not the Prime95 24 hour stress test club. Fancy you calling anyone a n00b.


Ah it wasn't just me, I saw that last night & thought it must be time for bed or something if my reading comprehension was that far off...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hah! Lots of wet behind the ears new members since i last posted in Hur..
> 
> Anywho the Ghetto rig is done.. Well till i get the other 7950 back from rma...
> 
> Ill post picture in a min XD
> 
> Welp it is a i5 3570k + Extreme 4
> 
> X fire 7950s " one if off for rma "
> 
> Old cheap raidmax case gutted with a Cosmos 2 Panel / fan controller.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats whats up Yo.


I like those heatkiller uni blocks! Much easier to get multi gpu going without trying to get hoses looped around between the blocks without kinks.


----------



## maynard14

Hi there im new here but im reading this thread for some time now,.

so yesterday i finally have the courage to delid my processor and i was successful @ deliding it

it was very easy for me coz my ihs is already lifted at the lower end of my ihs... so i just got my self a razor blade and pop out the ihs and it worked

here is the actual picture of my delided 3570k:

i didn't actually clean all the black glue on my processor because im to scared to scratch the pcb



here is my temp after i delided my processor using cheap thermal paste @ ihs and the processor it self:



as you can see guys it still a bit warm and its on stock speed and idle temp...

its hot here in the Philippines but before i delid my procssor my temp package was 42 c


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> Hi there im new here but im reading this thread for some time now,.
> 
> so yesterday i finally have the courage to delid my processor and i was successful @ deliding it
> 
> it was very easy for me coz my ihs is already lifted at the lower end of my ihs... so i just got my self a razor blade and pop out the ihs and it worked
> 
> here is the actual picture of my delided 3570k:
> 
> i didn't actually clean all the black glue on my processor because im to scared to scratch the pcb
> 
> 
> 
> here is my temp after i delided my processor using cheap thermal paste @ ihs and the processor it self:
> 
> 
> 
> as you can see guys it still a bit warm and its on stock speed and idle temp...
> 
> its hot here in the Philippines but before i delid my procssor my temp package was 42 c


Removing the black rubber silicon & snugging the IHS onto the PCB is one of the main points of delidding, the problem isn't really the paste intel uses, but the extra bit of gap created by all the black goop. Removing that should help a bit more, & using liquid metal TIM like coollaboratory liquid pro or liquid ultra will make a bigger difference yet.
Congratz on the successful delid!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dzuks*
> 
> Please add me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You could add another category as Conquistador suggested:
> OCN name: Dzuks
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp drops: 20~C


You're in!







slap dat Sig on baby!







what other category would others like.


----------



## Dzuks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Old credit card was the easiest way I found to remove the black glue, you just use an edge to carefully scrape it off. Many of us have commented that getting all the glue off was the hardest part of the whole process.
> Nice job. You have room, you going to take the chip higher?


I did make a mistake of scratching the CPU's pcb and for some reason my first two memory slots are not working.


----------



## Ukkooh

A little update to my delidding journey: I'm going to redo the CLU on die and finishing the lapping of my IHS next week. I'm doing that because I RMA'd my H100 and will be getting my H100i next week. Let's see if I can the temps down just a little bit more.







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> i didn't actually clean all the black glue on my processor because im to scared to scratch the pcb


Just use a old (or the one you currently use, like I did) credit card to remove the glue. I pressed it pretty hard against my pcb and got no scratches so it should be idiot proof.


----------



## maynard14

@FtW 420

thank you sir for your fast reply









i really thought the point of deliding is replacing the paste intel uses for the processor to cool it,.. i was wrong hehe

now o know sir thank you for the tip sir!

but i have one problem here in the philippines there is no shop here that sells coollaboratory liquid pro...

huhu,.. all i saw that they sell here @ my local computer shops are noctua nth-1 and zalman stg 1

which one should i use sir?

and if i clean my pcb to remove the black blobs what are the safest way to remove it? i think mine already dried up, i cant remove it with a credit card tip


----------



## maynard14

@ Ukkooh

thank you sir ! im new here but im amaze by the people here they are so helpful









thank you .. i will try it later and take my time to remove the black globs,., maybe ill just buy the noctua thermal paste and im using h100i lqc

thank you again


----------



## ChIck3n

So, just one last check before I delid my 4770K tonight. I remember some people recommending sealing off the caps with some liquid gasket so you don't accidentally short them with CLU. I got some of this, but the guys at the shop weren't sure if it was nonconductive or not (nothing else I could find seemed to have a high enough heat resistance). Is this what you guys use, or something else?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> 
> Here is my new hardware, in and out of the box
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The vice and the chip.
> 
> 
> IHS + chip cleaning
> 
> Apply CL Ultra + close up of resistors (or what ever those surface mounted stuff is) witch is covered with MX-4
> I DID clean up that extra TIM on the PCB and between surface mounted and die, but forgot to take new pic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IBT 20 runs before / after delidding
> Before: 84, 83, 82, 78 (Ambiant 27C)
> After: 64, 63, 62, 62 (Ambiant 26C)
> 
> 
> Prime95 Blend Torture Test 1 hour run before / after delidding
> Before: 75 , 75, 72, 68 (Ambiant 27C)
> After: 61, 62, 60, 58 (Ambiant 26C)
> 
> OCN name : GaMbi2004
> CPU : Haswell 4670k i5
> On-die TIM : Coollab Liquid ultra
> IHS TIM : MX-4
> Mhz gained : N/A
> OC after delid : 4.5GHz so fare..
> Temp drops : 19C
> Validation :http://valid.canardpc.com/2831865
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thoughts:
> I ran out of MX-4 -_- so I might not have enough between IHS->Cooler block.. but seams "OK" at the moment (also, I tend to use a bit too much anyways
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so this might be the right amount, lol)
> Oh yea.. I might add that the Hammer on pic nr 4 is NOT the one I used ;D I put it next to vice for giggles, hehe.


I gotcha now!







slap that sig on now!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> @FtW 420
> 
> thank you sir for your fast reply
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i really thought the point of deliding is replacing the paste intel uses for the processor to cool it,.. i was wrong hehe
> 
> now o know sir thank you for the tip sir!
> 
> but i have one problem here in the philippines there is no shop here that sells coollaboratory liquid pro...
> 
> huhu,.. all i saw that they sell here @ my local computer shops are noctua nth-1 and zalman stg 1
> 
> which one should i use sir?
> 
> and if i clean my pcb to remove the black blobs what are the safest way to remove it? i think mine already dried up, i cant remove it with a credit card tip


The paste intel uses is actually good quality, comparable to paste like mx4 & gelid gc extreme. They don't really compare to the liquid metal paste though, which has about 4x the thermal conductivity of regular paste. If you can order some online, it is worthwhile to do so, since you have delidded & voided the warranty might as well get the most out of it & drop the temps as much as possible.
It is fine to use the noctua, zalman or other paste, they just don't get as dramatic temperature decreases as the liquid metal so I would use it as a temporary fix while awaiting an online order of CLU or CLP (most guys who have tried both recommend the ultra).


----------



## tw33k

I agree with everything FtW wrote and would like to add that TIMs like Noctua NT-H1 tend to "pump out" after a while meaning it needs to be replaced regularly. The liquid metal TIMs should last the life of your CPU if you need it to.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dzuks*
> 
> I did make a mistake of scratching the CPU's pcb and for some reason my first two memory slots are not working.


That sucks, sorry to hear that. It has happened to a few people. Scratching the pcb with the razor can definitely result in having trouble with some ram slots.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChIck3n*
> 
> So, just one last check before I delid my 4770K tonight. I remember some people recommending sealing off the caps with some liquid gasket so you don't accidentally short them with CLU. I got some of this, but the guys at the shop weren't sure if it was nonconductive or not (nothing else I could find seemed to have a high enough heat resistance). Is this what you guys use, or something else?


Can't say if that stuff is safe but we know that MX-4, MX-2, and Gelid GC-Extreme are non-conductive and non-capacitive. Cover the contacts with one of those then use CLU on the die.


----------



## maynard14

thanks again sir Ftw and tw33k

hmmm if only i can order from us or amazon to get the CLU,..

maybe for now ill just use noctua nth1 for tempo or if it pumps ill just replace it,..

i dont know how to order from amazon and i dont have credit card huhuhu too bad for me.

but how long will the noctua nth1 will last before it pump out?


----------



## maynard14

ahmm how about other thermal paste that dont pump out over time? are there any thermal paste that gives decent drop down temp that dont pump up like the noctua?

how about mx4 or zalman stg1

coz this are the thermal paste that are available here in the philippines,..


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> ahmm how about other thermal paste that dont pump out over time? are there any thermal paste that gives decent drop down temp that dont pump up like the noctua?
> 
> how about mx4 or zalman stg1
> 
> coz this are the thermal paste that are available here in the philippines,..


I think your best bet would be to order the CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra/Pro straight from the manufacturer's website, if I recall correctly, they ship it worldwide.
There's really nothing that comes even remotely close to those when it comes to on-die TIM!

You can find their website at www.coollaboratory.com
Happy overclocking!


----------



## ChIck3n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Can't say if that stuff is safe but we know that MX-4, MX-2, and Gelid GC-Extreme are non-conductive and non-capacitive. Cover the contacts with one of those then use CLU on the die.


Ok, I do have some MX-2 I could use, just wasn't sure if it would run over time.


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> ahmm how about other thermal paste that dont pump out over time? are there any thermal paste that gives decent drop down temp that dont pump up like the noctua?
> 
> how about mx4 or zalman stg1
> 
> coz this are the thermal paste that are available here in the philippines,..


I just re applied my paste on the die with AS5 and it dropped about 15c-16c From before I De-lidded... but I don't know how long it will last or if it will pump out....?

But for me it's been trial and error this is the 3rd time I have redone it...

I put a 1mm line of AS5 on the DIE starting about 3mm from one end to 3mm short of the other end...
and the same size line on the top of the IHS to seat the Cooler and it worked a treat...









Note: If you can get some AS5 Make sure it's a line that's ONLY 1MM wide... it can look different on that little die...

Hope it might be some help....









Edit: Not sure if MX2 will spread the same as AS5 mabe someone on here might know....


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> I just re applied my paste on the die with AS5 and it dropped about 15c-16c From before I De-lidded... but I don't know how long it will last or if it will pump out....?
> 
> But for me it's been trial and error this is the 3rd time I have redone it...
> 
> I put a 1mm line of AS5 on the DIE starting about 3mm from one end to 3mm short of the other end...
> and the same size line on the top of the IHS to seat the Cooler and it worked a treat...


AS5 is conductive, I personally wouldn't risk it.


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> AS5 is conductive, I personally wouldn't risk it.


Arctic Silver 5 3.5g is Non-electrically conductive. Will not separate, run, migrate, or bleed

Taken from there Site......


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> Arctic Silver 5 3.5g is Non-electrically conductive. Will not separate, run, migrate, or bleed
> 
> Taken from there Site......


The rest of the quote, "the compound is very slightly capacitive and could potentially cause problems if it bridges two close-proximity electrical paths."

It doesn't matter if you use it on an Ivy die, other than not great temps and pump out, but I would definitely not use it near the exposed contacts on a Haswell chip.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> Arctic Silver 5 3.5g is Non-electrically conductive. Will not separate, run, migrate, or bleed
> 
> Taken from there Site......


Yes, but it is capacitive and their site specifically states to keep away from all traces, pins, or leads.

(While much safer than electrically conductive silver and copper greases, Arctic Silver 5 should be kept away from electrical traces, pins, and leads. While it is not electrically conductive, the compound is very slightly capacitive and could potentially cause problems if it bridges two close-proximity electrical paths.)


----------



## Robbieboy

Ok I sand corrected.....









but he is De-lidding a 3570k...

Well that's what I thought....sorry if i'm wrong...


----------



## tw33k

I'm lovin' my new chip. 4.8GHz<1.2v stable (5 1/2 hours Aida64 so far) 1.184v according to my DMM.

CPU-Z

I've got a few different thermal compounds I want to compare on the top of the IHS.

Liquid Pro
Liquid Ultra
Gelid GC Extreme
MX-4
Phanteks
Antec Formula 7

Should be interesting (when I get the time to do it). Also, here's a good read on the topic of thermal pastes. It's a bit old now but still relevant


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I'm lovin' my new chip. 4.8GHz<1.2v stable (5 1/2 hours Aida64 so far) 1.184v according to my DMM.
> 
> CPU-Z
> 
> I've got a few different thermal compounds I want to compare on the top of the IHS.
> 
> Liquid Pro
> Liquid Ultra
> Gelid GC Extreme
> MX-4
> Phanteks
> Antec Formula 7
> 
> Should be interesting (when I get the time to do it). Also, here's a good read on the topic of thermal pastes. It's a bit old now but still relevant


HOLY WOW, that is amazing!








Is it de-lidded?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I'm lovin' my new chip. 4.8GHz<1.2v stable (5 1/2 hours Aida64 so far) 1.184v according to my DMM.
> 
> CPU-Z
> 
> I've got a few different thermal compounds I want to compare on the top of the IHS.
> 
> Liquid Pro
> Liquid Ultra
> Gelid GC Extreme
> MX-4
> Phanteks
> Antec Formula 7
> 
> Should be interesting (when I get the time to do it). Also, here's a good read on the topic of thermal pastes. It's a bit old now but still relevant


how tested is it? wanna run some wprime 32 m and supa pie runs?


----------



## Swag

Get BF3 Close Quarters for free with the code BF3E3.

Just launch Origin >> Left-click Origin on top-left corner >> Press Redeem Product Code >> Enter BF3E3


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> HOLY WOW, that is amazing!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it de-lidded?


Sure is.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> how tested is it? wanna run some wprime 32 m and supa pie runs?


I don't use Prime95 (never have, never will) See Aida64 vs Prime95 for more on that topic _I just realised you said wPrime not Prime95_

It's a test bench so won't be gaming or watching/encoding video etc but still ran 6 1/2 hours of Aida64 plus 10 runs IBT


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I'm lovin' my new chip. 4.8GHz<1.2v stable (5 1/2 hours Aida64 so far) 1.184v according to my DMM.
> 
> CPU-Z
> 
> I've got a few different thermal compounds I want to compare on the top of the IHS.
> 
> Liquid Pro
> Liquid Ultra
> Gelid GC Extreme
> MX-4
> Phanteks
> Antec Formula 7
> 
> Should be interesting (when I get the time to do it). Also, here's a good read on the topic of thermal pastes. It's a bit old now but still relevant


No way thats stable. Lets see some IBT or prime runs with screenshots. Amazing if true, way golden, but I doubt it.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> No way thats stable. Lets see some IBT or prime runs with screenshots. Amazing if true, way golden, but I doubt it.


You should read the thread properly before you make statements like that. Look at the post above


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> You should read the thread properly before you make statements like that. Look at the post above


I stand by what I said. IBT in windows screen shotted after at least 20 passes on maximum with CPUz. Im not the only one that would require that to be considered stable. Also, WHEA errors.

And why do you have hyper threading disabled?

Did not mean to insult, just saying on here stable means something different.


----------



## Hokies83

Hmmm Stable to me means running months of gaming without crashing.

I think that Super Stable club stuff is stupid.


----------



## Joa3d43

*...delid this...*

...apparently will be deliddable http://www.overclock.net/t/1400890/vr-zone-intel-2014-haswell-e-to-pack-8-cores-ddr4-x99-pch-and-more


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...delid this...*
> 
> ...apparently will be deliddable http://www.overclock.net/t/1400890/vr-zone-intel-2014-haswell-e-to-pack-8-cores-ddr4-x99-pch-and-more


I want a Haswell-E so I can delid. I want to be the first to say I delidded a $1000 CPU!


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> I stand by what I said. IBT in windows screen shotted after at least 20 passes on maximum with CPUz. Im not the only one that would require that to be considered stable. Also, WHEA errors.
> 
> And why do you have hyper threading disabled?
> 
> Did not mean to insult, just saying on here stable means something different.


1st of all, I don't care what you or anyone else calls "stable"

2nd..HT is not disabled

I've been OCing a lot longer than most people so I'll trust my own standards rather than some anonymous member of a web forum
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Hmmm Stable to me means running months of gaming without crashing.
> 
> I think that Super Stable club stuff is stupid.


I agree. I'm running this on a test bench so I don't need/want it 24 hours of Prime95 stable. I'm either in the BIOS or running stress tests. It's funny that there are always 1 or 2 people who for whatever reason have to doubt whenever someone else posts really good results. It's a sign that they are unhappy with their own lot in life.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...delid this...*
> 
> ...apparently will be deliddable http://www.overclock.net/t/1400890/vr-zone-intel-2014-haswell-e-to-pack-8-cores-ddr4-x99-pch-and-more


If it can be delidded that will be my next CPU upgrade. I have had fun delidding 3570k and 3770k and I have thought about delidding 4770k but I can hang with 3770k till Haswell e comes out if it can be delidded. Have something to look forward to.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I want a Haswell-E so I can delid. I want to be the first to say I delidded a $1000 CPU!


...you can train on the Ivy-E which comes out before - 4960x $1,000+


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> 1st of all, I don't care what you or anyone else calls "stable"
> 
> 2nd..HT is not disabled
> 
> I've been OCing a lot longer than most people so I'll trust my own standards rather than some anonymous member of a web forum


Wow.....that escalated quickly.

I was just calling it how I see it. Did not mean offense and I do apologize if you took it that way.

You seemed to have HT disabled because of your GFlops. Your score is consistent with a 3570K at 4.8GHz if you had HT on it would actually show a lower GFlops output. Linpack does that in IBT for some reason always has. Unless I missed a fix for that. So enlighten me bro.

Also, again I did not mean to offend just wanted to see IBT and voltage in same windows after 20 passes as I was curios. I think you got overly defensive. If you don't care why post screenshots at all? I'm intrigued by seeing another Golden chip, so was just wanting some verification is all.


----------



## tw33k

If you set IBT to use 4 threads instead of All, you'll score higher.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> If you set IBT to use 4 threads instead of All, you'll score higher.


I see now. I don't care about the score myself, I do it to make sure i'm stable. I run al threads for 20-30 runs in IBT and follow up with a few hours of prime. If I see no whea errors after that I call it stable. IBT is much harder on a CPU than prime, so I do a combo. people who run for 24 Hours are just crazy. lol IBT will pull that instability out faster than prime.

Well If you feel like showing off I would love to see that IBT run for my own curiosity. if you got time. My chip in my sig is considered golden by a lot of members in my thread, and yours seems to be even better, if stable at that voltage. If true I consider that platinum! lol


----------



## tw33k

How's this?


----------



## lilchronic

if you can run prime85 and play crysis3 without crashing its stable ... LOLz


----------



## tw33k

lol...while watching a bluray movie


----------



## Dimaggio1103

I would call that there chip a Golden one. Welcome to the club, and congrats. See now isn't that a lot easier than getting all offended.


----------



## maynard14

hmmmm maybe ill just buy a mx4 thermal paste until i resolve on how to ordre liquid pro hehe

i think mx 4 is the safest thermal paste


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> hmmmm maybe ill just buy a mx4 thermal paste until i resolve on how to ordre liquid pro hehe
> 
> i think mx 4 is the safest thermal paste


...IMO, MX4 is the best non-liquid metal TIM out there (though for the CPU die I would still use CL-U )

...I have posted this comparison of CL-U / Pro and MX 4 a couple of times before, but a refresher doesn't hurt


----------



## maynard14

thanks bro! i just watch it and im impress though i only use h100i,.. ill order later for the mx 4. thank you so much sir


----------



## maynard14

thanks bro! i just watch it and im impress though i only use h100i,.. ill order later for the mx 4. thank you so much sir


----------



## ChIck3n

Woohoo! Just joined the ranks of the delidded! Popped off no problem using the vice method. Now to sleep off my shakey hands so I can put on CLU in the morning.


----------



## Janac

So cause CLP/CLU is so haaard to get in our country, which termal grease is also good? And has almost the same performance then this CLP/CLU ?


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> So cause CLP/CLU is so haaard to get in our country, which termal grease is also good? And has almost the same performance then this CLP/CLU ?


None comes close. So if you can't get it, try mx4 or PK-1.


----------



## Janac

Is there a big difference beetwen MX-2 and MX-4?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> I would call that there chip a Golden one. Welcome to the club, and congrats. See now isn't that a lot easier than getting all offended.


Is this the ibt stable or ivy overclocking club? I didn't see Ibt listed as a requirement to join.

^^^^^^^*Gelid Extreme GC-03* is highly recommended over mx-2 or mx-4.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Is this the ibt stable or ivy overclocking club? I didn't see Ibt listed as a requirement to join.
> 
> ^^^^^^^*Gelid Extreme GC-03* is highly recommended over mx-2 or mx-4.


Never said it was. But it's the general consensus. The ivy stable club actually requires several hours of prime95 to join, so yea....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Never said it was. But it's the general consensus. The ivy stable club actually requires several hours of prime95 to join, so yea....


LoL aren't you the guy with the 6 core Vishera i used to argue with?

Your the last person i expected to see in this thread... You seemed to be happy with that Fail Cpu lol.

But non the less it is good to see you came to your senses and welcome to the thread


----------



## Daredevil 720

Hey guys, I heard CLU is really hard to clean up for reapplying. Like, so hard that you need to lap your IHS (in case you apply it between the IHS and cooler).

What is the case with CLU application behind the IHS? Is it easy to clean up?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Hey guys, I heard CLU is really hard to clean up for reapplying. Like, so hard that you need to lap your IHS (in case you apply it between the IHS and cooler).
> 
> What is the case with CLU application behind the IHS? Is it easy to clean up?


It can be a pain to completely clean off your cooler and IHS, but no lapping is required. The trouble is not worth it to some so they just use a good normal TIM on top of the IHS. More details and pics can be found in my previous post #15351 here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/15350#post_19644142


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> It can be a pain to completely clean off your cooler and IHS, but no lapping is required. The trouble is not worth it to some so they just use a good normal TIM on top of the IHS. More details and pics can be found in my previous post #15351 here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/15350#post_19644142


Does the metal polish leave any kind of residue on the IHS? That would interfere with the heat transfer wouldn't it?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Does the metal polish leave any kind of residue on the IHS? That would interfere with the heat transfer wouldn't it?


You have to completely remove any residue of the metal polish with 90%+ isopropyl alcohol. I have done it a few times now, it is not really hard or anything, it just takes a long time if you want to make the surface completely clean. You don't have to spend as much time if you are just cleaning it up a little to reapply the same TIM again.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> thanks bro! i just watch it and im impress though i only use h100i,.. ill order later for the mx 4. thank you so much sir


...


----------



## Inglewood78

Is there a recommended way on which sides to grip with the vice and which side to strick withe the hammer or does it matter? For example, I'd grip the IHC on sides A / C and strike on side B.

TIA


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> 
> 
> Is there a recommended way on which sides to grip with the vice and which side to strick withe the hammer or does it matter? For example, I'd grip the IHC on sides A / C and strike on side B.
> 
> TIA


I would rather strike from side D so that just in case the IHS slides more than expected (or anything else happens), it won't harm those SMD









Just my opinion


----------



## Belial

Have you guys heard the theory that Haswell actually runs quite cool? And that current stress test programs using AVX, like p95, etc, are actually causing haswell to increase it's voltages? Hence why if you turn off AVX, the same stress test actually runs similarly to haswell, ie similar temps as same clock/voltage, ie 20-30C cooler.

I believe it was an Asus guy who said this, but I've heard a few people test this and found it to be true (that temp was much lower without avx). I wish someone would confirm it with a multimeter though.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Have you guys heard the theory that Haswell actually runs quite cool? And that current stress test programs using AVX, like p95, etc, are actually causing haswell to increase it's voltages? Hence why if you turn off AVX, the same stress test actually runs similarly to haswell, ie similar temps as same clock/voltage, ie 20-30C cooler.
> 
> I believe it was an Asus guy who said this, but I've heard a few people test this and found it to be true (that temp was much lower without avx). I wish someone would confirm it with a multimeter though.


It's true, but only in auto or offset mode (at least on a Gigabyte motherboard). Fixed voltage stays the same. I checked it with a multimeter and the volts went up 0.1V when the heavy load hit on IBT, which is when I assume the AVX extensions kick in.


----------



## Cyro999

^Temps on my Ud3h freak out on Manual too. As much as ~24c hotter with AVX enabled and not reproducable outside of stress tests


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> ^Temps on my Ud3h freak out on Manual too. As much as ~24c hotter with AVX enabled and not reproducable outside of stress tests


Yeah, the temps still go up just like Sandy and Ivy, but the voltage didn't change in fixed.


----------



## Cyro999

The temp change is much more volatile than ivy in my experience


----------



## FtW 420

I normally get about 0.02V vrise under load with manual voltage on the mpower max when checking with the multimeter, IBT with AVX makes it jump to 0.04V over the set vcore under load.

Noticed another weird thing with haswell, as tweek just pointed out above, running IBT with HT enabled (4c/8t) gets xxx gigaflops, when disabling HT & stressing 4 cores the gigaflops usually go up at the same clock. With my 4770k, HT enabled gets higher flops at the same speed than disabling HT.

Running here with hyperthreading


Figured HT disabled would shoot up over 150 flops, but rebooting & disabling HT with no other changes gave me this


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Inglewood78*
> 
> 
> 
> Is there a recommended way on which sides to grip with the vice and which side to strick withe the hammer or does it matter? For example, I'd grip the IHC on sides A / C and strike on side B.
> 
> TIA


Grip the IHS on side B and D so that B rests on the non moving part of the VICE
This way the IHS wont be able to slide as if you where to hit it from side A/C..
You will knock it from side D.



Also.. just to make clear.
Quote:


> which side to strick withe the hammer or does it matter?


you strike the hammer on the piece of wood, not the CPU itself


----------



## ChIck3n

HOLY MONKEY BOLLOCKS! I was getting up to 100C almost instantly on IBT @ 4.3GHz 1.22v before, now the hottest core barely hits 74C. The core that previously used to run the hottest now only hits 67C. I knew I'd see improvements, but this is just awesome!


----------



## strokercrate

A few of days with the as5 on the die of my delided haswell 4670k has reduced my temps by another 2-3c although I have CLP ordered and on the way, hoping it will drop it at least a good noticeable bit more.

By the way for those who are looking for CLP/CLU (although I can't find any CLU without shipping from Germany) This place at Amazon as about 17 left. Its where I ordered mine from.

http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Thermal-Interface-Material/dp/B001PE5XAC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1371420676&sr=8-2&keywords=coollaboratory+liquid+pro

Btw: What is the vcore safe limits with Haswell? Same as Ivy Bridge?


----------



## Inglewood78

Officially delidded. Hopefully it's still functional haha.

I was surprise how hard you have to hit it. Got me a little nervous but hopefully everything turns on fine. Won't be able to complete my system for another few weeks.


----------



## Cyro999

Hey, wasn't sure where else to ask; What kind of Vcores would you guys say are ok for Haswell 24/7 (not high load 24/7, but as an everyday overclock with lots of usage), and also; what should i do to stabilize 0x0101 bluescreens at higher clocks? I only got 0x0124's at lower clocks that could be fixed with vcore, slight tweaks to vrin (~1.86 seemed to work best) and a bit of digital+analog io + system agent voltage added but now 0x0101's popping up and seem trickier to get rid of. Should i try higher VRIN? something else? *z87x-ud3h

Temps are acceptably cool with good airflow (better when i fix exhaust), silver arrow (soon to add a ty-150 or ty-143 which should give a couple degrees paired with exhaust fan) , sub-20c ambients and either AVX disabled for IBT/prime (massive temp gap with/without.. and avx does not increase temperatures in starcraft 2, x264, anything that i actually do) so load around ~83-87c absolute max with HT i think should be doable, especially under something like x264, which with all the prompting i have given it seems to be a good 3-5c cooler than no-avx-ibt.

http://i.imgur.com/9Hm4MpI.png

^Please don't shoot me and say that doesn't make me stable. I'm well aware.

Curious what you guys can do with delid and air, with the 20c temp drops on top of this. Hopefully one day my brain will be messed up enough to join you and hit a ~$430 (uk..) cpu with hammer.


----------



## Belial

I got a question for you guys:

A friend of mine offered me:
XSPC Rasa + Phobya G Changer 280mm Radiator + XSPC X2O 750 Dual 5.25" Bay Reservoir Pump - Updated Version (the newer impeller and such) + Silver/Chrome XSPC 1/2 x 1/3 barbs and black tubing for $130. Is this a good deal?

I mean 2xap-15s that an h220 come for, at $150 i mean isnt an h220 basically the same price as this set-up fanless? anyways just curious what you guys think... i dont know enough about custom loops. i dont know anything about custom loops.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

That my friend, is an awesome deal! Buy that and have some fun! I'm having a blast with building my loop! I've obtained everything through trades so far. Haven't spent a penny. Sadly I'm out of stuff to trade and I setill need GPU blocks and don't have any money. At least I have a bunch of high end WC stuff in my build. If only GPU blocks were as cheap as CPU blocks...


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I got a question for you guys:
> 
> A friend of mine offered me:
> XSPC Rasa + Phobya G Changer 280mm Radiator + XSPC X2O 750 Dual 5.25" Bay Reservoir Pump - Updated Version (the newer impeller and such) + Silver/Chrome XSPC 1/2 x 1/3 barbs and black tubing for $130. Is this a good deal?
> 
> I mean 2xap-15s that an h220 come for, at $150 i mean isnt an h220 basically the same price as this set-up fanless? anyways just curious what you guys think... i dont know enough about custom loops. i dont know anything about custom loops.


More rad more pump = win. Id offer 110$ tho I justed paid 100$ for a H220 Edge kit. Which is an Apongee HD block 240mm Rad an a MCP 35X pump.

Thats it on the right.


----------



## Belial

I have no intention of ever adding anything to the loop, it would be just for cpu. 7950 blocks are $100+ at the cheapest, used, etc. I will rather just, as i already am doing, use h60 'the mod' type coolers on them for $40-50 total shipped, an extreme 1.3v overclock will still be very cool on a modded h60 with low fan speed so why put it on a loop.

Repd, thanks. ill see if i can maybe get a further drop in price.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I have no intention of ever adding anything to the loop, it would be just for cpu. 7950 blocks are $100+ at the cheapest, used, etc. I will rather just, as i already am doing, use h60 'the mod' type coolers on them for $40-50 total shipped, an extreme 1.3v overclock will still be very cool on a modded h60 with low fan speed so why put it on a loop.
> 
> Repd, thanks. ill see if i can maybe get a further drop in price.


Or you could get some Artic Accelero coolers? Mine runs great!


----------



## self_slaughter

Whoop whoop!

Liquid pro finally arrived!
Scary stuff to work with but craps all over the mx-4 I was using on the die.
Dropped another 20'C









This thing runs far cooler then my 2500k did at the same volts on the same cooler now!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> Whoop whoop!
> 
> Liquid pro finally arrived!
> Scary stuff to work with but craps all over the mx-4 I was using on the die.
> Dropped another 20'C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This thing runs far cooler then my 2500k did at the same volts on the same cooler now!


Nice!









I'll post some pictures up of my perfect application on my HIS 7950, shame that I have none left as I'd have used it with the new coolers..
Oh well the first card I did runs at 55c at 1.25v @ 1200MHz so I'm fairly happy!









EDIT: As good as it gets liquid pro application.



Unfortunately the other photo was too blurry, but trust me there was only a tad more TIM on the core then what there was on the heatsync.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> More rad more pump = win. Id offer 110$ tho I justed paid 100$ for a H220 Edge kit. Which is an Apongee HD block 240mm Rad an a MCP 35X pump.
> 
> Thats it on the right.


For the love of god....dust those fans!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> For the love of god....dust those fans!


Those fans are dusted .. Those fans are from 2008







and are very old. The blades are spotless. Just some old dust type stains on the side there.

And that system is no show piece lol it mines bitcons... " And Nothing else"

This is my show piece...


----------



## Leyaena

Anyone here good with watercooling?

I'm doing my first custom loop, and I'm (hopefully) about to order, but I really need some last-minute tips and tricks from the more experienced people...
Made a quick thread about it here, any input would be greatly appreciated









http://www.overclock.net/t/1401601/first-time-picking-parts-need-help-hopefully-ordering-soon


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Anyone here good with watercooling?
> 
> I'm doing my first custom loop, and I'm (hopefully) about to order, but I really need some last-minute tips and tricks from the more experienced people...
> Made a quick thread about it here, any input would be greatly appreciated
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1401601/first-time-picking-parts-need-help-hopefully-ordering-soon


I'm a first-time builder too..

I'll have a look at your thread though!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Anyone here good with watercooling?
> 
> I'm doing my first custom loop, and I'm (hopefully) about to order, but I really need some last-minute tips and tricks from the more experienced people...
> Made a quick thread about it here, any input would be greatly appreciated
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1401601/first-time-picking-parts-need-help-hopefully-ordering-soon


Hmph wut is water cooling?


----------



## Leyaena

Thank you both for your help so far already, I really appreciate it








Sorry to be such a bother though, I've just got *so many* questions *blush*


----------



## scorpscarx

That is an impressive showpiece, but I have a totally different design philosophy.

I prefer air and simplicity, I hate all lights other than my monitor, and I only use open housings that I have either bought or designed







.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hey, wasn't sure where else to ask; What kind of Vcores would you guys say are ok for Haswell 24/7 (not high load 24/7, but as an everyday overclock with lots of usage), and also; what should i do to stabilize 0x0101 bluescreens at higher clocks? I only got 0x0124's at lower clocks that could be fixed with vcore, slight tweaks to vrin (~1.86 seemed to work best) and a bit of digital+analog io + system agent voltage added but now 0x0101's popping up and seem trickier to get rid of. Should i try higher VRIN? something else? *z87x-ud3h
> 
> Temps are acceptably cool with good airflow (better when i fix exhaust), silver arrow (soon to add a ty-150 or ty-143 which should give a couple degrees paired with exhaust fan) , sub-20c ambients and either AVX disabled for IBT/prime (massive temp gap with/without.. and avx does not increase temperatures in starcraft 2, x264, anything that i actually do) so load around ~83-87c absolute max with HT i think should be doable, especially under something like x264, which with all the prompting i have given it seems to be a good 3-5c cooler than no-avx-ibt.
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/9Hm4MpI.png
> 
> ^Please don't shoot me and say that doesn't make me stable. I'm well aware.
> 
> Curious what you guys can do with delid and air, with the 20c temp drops on top of this. Hopefully one day my brain will be messed up enough to join you and hit a ~$430 (uk..) cpu with hammer.


No comments on this? I thought more people would be at >1.25v


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> No comments on this? I thought more people would be at >1.25v


It's tough to say for safe vcore, temps are being a limit before the vcore gets very high. Running AVX when stress testing really does pack on the heat & voltage compared to running without the AVX instructions.
For the 101 bsod, I would think maybe higher voltage for the uncore (ring), or higher vccin/vrin.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's tough to say for safe vcore, temps are being a limit before the vcore gets very high. Running AVX when stress testing really does pack on the heat & voltage compared to running without the AVX instructions.
> For the 101 bsod, I would think maybe higher voltage for the uncore (ring), or higher vccin/vrin.


It is Sad not to see FtW posting in the club thread


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> It is Sad not to see FtW posting in the club thread


Which club?


----------



## mystiksinner

Finally, after 3 horrible overclockers, my 4th 3770k is a winner. 20c drop after delidding. I am currently running prime 95, going on hour 4. so far i am at 5Ghz at 1.436v, temps in the mid 60's. I also learned a little trick for applying clp. I used one of my girlfriends makeup sponges. worked like a charm.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mystiksinner*
> 
> Finally, after 3 horrible overclockers, my 4th 3770k is a winner. 20c drop after delidding. I am currently running prime 95, going on hour 4. so far i am at 5Ghz at 1.436v, temps in the mid 60's. I also learned a little trick for applying clp. I used one of my girlfriends makeup sponges. worked like a charm.


High density sponges are fantastic for many things...never thought of using one for TIM application.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's tough to say for safe vcore, temps are being a limit before the vcore gets very high. Running AVX when stress testing really does pack on the heat & voltage compared to running without the AVX instructions.
> For the 101 bsod, I would think maybe higher voltage for the uncore (ring), or higher vccin/vrin.


Thanks mate.

I decided against making overclock based on AVX temps, when i plan to actually use the CPU, for gaming, for x264, i don't want to make some freak overclock that is not "100% stable" or something that is "gaming stable" etc, but X264 temps with avx on are cooler than IBT-without-avx-temps which are 25c cooler than IBT-with-avx-temps so i'd rather not give up 300mhz for no reason. I don't think other CPU's behaved in such a way, i overclocked nehalem and ivy and did not hear of such freak temperatures before and just as it turns out, all of the guys complaining or observing high haswell temps are using avx stress tests, the temps are right in line with where you would expect them i think without the abnormal rise caused by them in particular

I think, vcores getting a bit higher up and if i did not delid, temps would be at pretty much limits too - 1.37vcore sounds good? I'm safe with up to ~+0.15v on sys agent and io's? Would just like to run past people instead of making assumptions.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Which club?


One in my sig.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Which club?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> One in my sig.


...I saw that one coming from a mile away









..got two of these coming...figure it's going to take 1 1/2 syringes of CL-U to cover all the right spots


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I saw that one coming from a mile away
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..got two of these coming...figure it's going to take 1 1/2 syringes of CL-U to cover all the right spots


That looks heavy i see a bent pcb and an angry pic-e slot in your future.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> That looks heavy i see a bent pcb and an angry pic-e slot in your future.


...normally yes, but per 'Borg twins' sig, boards are lying down flat instead of vertical mount, so the cards don't hang down but stand up - besides, the weight of the current 2x 7990 fan cooler assembly is about the same - HEAVY to say the least...but unlocked the cards now - very fast but a lot of heat


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...normally yes, but per 'Borg twins' sig, boards are lying down flat instead of vertical mount, so the cards don't hang down but stand up - besides, the weight of the current 2x 7990 fan cooler assembly is about the same - HEAVY to say the least...but unlocked the cards now - very fast but a lot of heat


That's one thing about a case that place the rear I/O on the top or bench style cases like the HAF XB, heavy cards become much less of an issue.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> That's one thing about a case that place the rear I/O on the top or bench style cases like the HAF XB, heavy cards become much less of an issue.


the 7990s are also VERY long...

...eventually three mobos will combine into a 'deskputer' in this build so no case as such at all, but you're right on the HAF...a friend uses it with a RIVE mobo, 3930K and two 7970s for demo purposes of a 4k video development company (see the green box / bottom)


----------



## strokercrate

.


----------



## Hokies83

Not the place to post this man,

Unless it is a card with numbers on it u cannot even sell it on OCN.

Check Anandtech.. u need 200 posts to post in the market place.


----------



## strokercrate

Sorry, didn't know.. But yes its a card with numbers.


----------



## Hokies83

Id edit the post before u get a Pm from a Mod.

You can sell here after 35 reps.

35 is not hard to get if you are helpful " or funny " in the news section.


----------



## strokercrate

Nah, not really worried about it. just thought i'd pass it to someone. Thanks though.


----------



## gorge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hey, wasn't sure where else to ask; What kind of Vcores would you guys say are ok for Haswell 24/7 (not high load 24/7, but as an everyday overclock with lots of usage), and also; what should i do to stabilize 0x0101 bluescreens at higher clocks? I only got 0x0124's at lower clocks that could be fixed with vcore, slight tweaks to vrin (~1.86 seemed to work best) and a bit of digital+analog io + system agent voltage added but now 0x0101's popping up and seem trickier to get rid of. Should i try higher VRIN? something else? *z87x-ud3h
> 
> Temps are acceptably cool with good airflow (better when i fix exhaust), silver arrow (soon to add a ty-150 or ty-143 which should give a couple degrees paired with exhaust fan) , sub-20c ambients and either AVX disabled for IBT/prime (massive temp gap with/without.. and avx does not increase temperatures in starcraft 2, x264, anything that i actually do) so load around ~83-87c absolute max with HT i think should be doable, especially under something like x264, which with all the prompting i have given it seems to be a good 3-5c cooler than no-avx-ibt.
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/9Hm4MpI.png
> 
> ^Please don't shoot me and say that doesn't make me stable. I'm well aware.
> 
> Curious what you guys can do with delid and air, with the 20c temp drops on top of this. Hopefully one day my brain will be messed up enough to join you and hit a ~$430 (uk..) cpu with hammer.


According to this thread you're good up to 1.52V. This is the 'safe' voltage limit determined by intel.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1397433/haswell-guide-thermal-profile-power-limit-safe-voltage-vs-ivy-bridge

I personally am running at 1.370V for 4.4Ghz. Will probably delid and go higher soon.


----------



## strokercrate

I have found so many conflicting views on this subject myself.

Such as here

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1039930707

It looks like some say 1.37 others say 1.61

Right now im 4.3ghz at 1.162v, I got almost stable 4.5ghz at 1.23 but in the end needed 1.245, but to get 4.6ghz im at 1.3v+

Its amazing I can be stable at 4.3ghz with 1.162v but after that the vcore starts jumping fast.


----------



## Hokies83

Ive ran over 1.5v for 8 months no issues







But my cpu stays below are right around 60c.. under load.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> I have found so many conflicting views on this subject myself.
> 
> Such as here
> 
> http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1039930707
> 
> It looks like some say 1.37 others say 1.61
> 
> Right now im 4.3ghz at 1.162v, I got almost stable 4.5ghz at 1.23 but in the end needed 1.245, but to get 4.6ghz im at 1.3v+
> 
> Its amazing I can be stable at 4.3ghz with 1.162v but after that the vcore starts jumping fast.


I am able to get 4.5ghz stable at 1.19 V But that extra 600mhz to get to5.1ghz takes some real V core.


----------



## lilchronic

cough 1.37v for 5ghz cough


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> cough 1.37v for 5ghz cough


Bah! you do not have HT tho lol

LoL u did a horrid job lapping the IHS on that 3570k lol It looked like a piece of copper that had been out in the weather for 20 years lol.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Bah! you do not have HT tho lol
> 
> LoL u did a horrid job lapping the IHS on that 3570k lol It looked like a piece of copper that had been out in the weather for 20 years lol.


lol that chip was horrible it needed 1.35v for 4.5ghz
and a good sanding with 1000 -2000 gri sandpaper would fix that


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol that chip was horrible it needed 1.35v for 4.5ghz
> and a good sanding with 1000 -2000 gri sandpaper would fix that


Its run stock... And i bet with the water block on it that it would do better..

But meh waste of power atm... I do however hate the Extreme 4 lol


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Its run stock... And i bet with the water block on it that it would do better..
> 
> But meh waste of power atm... I do however hate the Extreme 4 lol


lol its not that bad


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lol its not that bad


When your used to a G1 Sniper 3 it is pretty bad lol.

Cheap and works tho all that matters.

Onlything i like better is the pci-e 16x locking.. u can remove more then one card at a time... With the g1 sniper 3 u gotta remove one at a time.. sucks.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gorge*
> 
> According to this thread you're good up to 1.52V. This is the 'safe' voltage limit determined by intel.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1397433/haswell-guide-thermal-profile-power-limit-safe-voltage-vs-ivy-bridge
> 
> I personally am running at 1.370V for 4.4Ghz. Will probably delid and go higher soon.


Intel has never specified a "safe" voltage. The chart everyone references is the VID chart, which shows the highest VID the chip has a code for. It has nothing to do with safe voltages.

And I'm highly skeptical of the max wattage limit divided by max current limit equals max voltage limit theory.


----------



## gorge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Intel has never specified a "safe" voltage. The chart everyone references is the VID chart, which shows the highest VID the chip has a code for. It has nothing to do with safe voltages.
> 
> And I'm highly skeptical of the max wattage limit divided by max current limit equals max voltage limit theory.


Obviously I have a terrible chip if I need 1.370v to do 4.4Ghz. Would you be hesitant to leave it at this voltage or go any higher if temperatures stay under 90C?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gorge*
> 
> Obviously I have a terrible chip if I need 1.370v to do 4.4Ghz. Would you be hesitant to leave it at this voltage or go any higher if temperatures stay under 90C?


What chip do u have?

Im hearing alot of bad things that 4770ks are not clocking to well.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gorge*
> 
> Obviously I have a terrible chip if I need 1.370v to do 4.4Ghz. Would you be hesitant to leave it at this voltage or go any higher if temperatures stay under 90C?


As long as the temps are okay I'd be fine with 1.37 (unless you were running it full speed all the time folding or something). Plenty of people ran Ivy at that voltage, and Haswell should have basically the same voltage tolerance.


----------



## gorge

it's a 4670k running on z87x-d3h


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gorge*
> 
> it's a 4670k running on z87x-d3h


Shame u could not return it and get a 3570k....

The way Haswell is clocking on Avg id have to Suggest Sandy over it..

And remember there was no IPC increase from IB to Haswell Just I Gpu...

Which if your overclocking your going to turn off anyways.. so you can get a lower V core.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Shame u could not return it and get a 3570k....
> 
> The way Haswell is clocking on Avg id have to Suggest Sandy over it..
> 
> And remember there was no IPC increase from IB to Haswell Just I Gpu...
> 
> Which if your overclocking your going to turn off anyways.. so you can get a lower V core.


Sure looks like an IPC increase, same cpu & memory clocks on haswell is faster than on IB in benchmarks.


----------



## ChIck3n

Question for everyone who ordered CLU, how much was in the tube? When I got mine it looked like it was pretty full, but when I went to use it I had to push the plunger down about 3/4 of the way before any started to come out. Even then the first bits looked like some pieces had dried. Thankfully there was enough to do my CPU and get good results, but I still feel kind of ripped off. On closer inspection, it looks like it had somehow seeped out of the tube without the plunger being depressed.


----------



## Forceman

Yeah, the tube is only 1/4 full, at about the 12.5 line on the scale.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sure looks like an IPC increase, same cpu & memory clocks on haswell is faster than on IB in benchmarks.


It's a shame so much of it's increased FPU performance comes from AVX2, which as we've seen in this thread is a major heat generator. The more I hear about Haswell the happier I am I sprung for Ivy instead of holding out when my Core 2 era system finally started to have hardware failure.

The only thing Haswell seems to have going for it are better looking motherboards (with the exception of the blinged out Asus boards), better audio chipsets, a few more SATA 6Gbps, and USB 3 slots. Not really a compelling reason to upgrade if you already have a stable Ivy build.


----------



## gorge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Shame u could not return it and get a 3570k....
> 
> The way Haswell is clocking on Avg id have to Suggest Sandy over it..
> 
> And remember there was no IPC increase from IB to Haswell Just I Gpu...
> 
> Which if your overclocking your going to turn off anyways.. so you can get a lower V core.


Well for those who are interested I just finished delidding my 4670k with mx-2 and got a 7C drop. I think I might have screwed up the thermal paste a bit though.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> What chip do u have?
> 
> Im hearing alot of bad things that 4770ks are not clocking to well.


I've got a 4770k clocked pretty well.

It primes 4.7 under 1.3v, but needs ~1.34vcore to be stable. Did 4.5 on ~1.195v pretty extensive testing, no whea errors etc

Cinebench 11.5: 

I think you've got to be more careful with haswell, you've gotta tweak stuff like IVR-input voltage etc and it seems a bit more funny to clock up than sandy/ivy, but if somebody put a random ivy bridge + a decent z77 on the table next to an average haswell and decent z87, i think it'd be pretty silly to take the ivy. Argument can be had for getting a cheapo 2500k with a "low end" cooler and riding the easy low temp clocks though
Quote:


> And remember there was no IPC increase from IB to Haswell


13% faster in x264 bro, quite a bit faster in many games too. Sc2 seems to love it


----------



## gorge

I reapplied my thermal paste and that seems to have helped. Now getting around 75C at 1.4VCore. Ambient temperature in my house is 15C.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sure looks like an IPC increase, same cpu & memory clocks on haswell is faster than on IB in benchmarks.


Just things that use the I Gpu un less something has changed since the release benchmarks?

IPC looked exactly the same... IGPU was faster.. and things that use it Haswell wins at.. by a nice lil margin.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I've got a 4770k clocked pretty well.
> 
> It primes 4.7 under 1.3v, but needs ~1.34vcore to be stable. Did 4.5 on ~1.195v pretty extensive testing, no whea errors etc
> 
> Cinebench 11.5:
> 
> I think you've got to be more careful with haswell, you've gotta tweak stuff like IVR-input voltage etc and it seems a bit more funny to clock up than sandy/ivy, but if somebody put a random ivy bridge + a decent z77 on the table next to an average haswell and decent z87, i think it'd be pretty silly to take the ivy. Argument can be had for getting a cheapo 2500k with a "low end" cooler and riding the easy low temp clocks though
> 13% faster in x264 bro, quite a bit faster in many games too. Sc2 seems to love it


Stuff using the IGpu lol.


----------



## Cyro999

Igpu? I disabled mine. What are you talking about?




Maybe better places to trash Haswell then OCN, no?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Igpu? I disabled mine. What are you talking about?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe better places to trash Haswell then OCN, no?


LoL

Not trashing anything New Guy...

Just seen The long list of benchmarks and it shown a pretty equal split with Haswell winning in the things that Use the Igpu.

The rest was Split back and forth.


----------



## Cyro999

Nobody is going to buy a 4670k/4770k for the GPU, haswell has "ok" gains in many areas and great gains in some; The fact that you have to attack me in order to defend your point shows that it doesn't hold any weight


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Nobody is going to buy a 4670k/4770k for the GPU, haswell has "ok" gains in many areas and great gains in some; The fact that you have to attack me in order to defend your point shows that it doesn't hold any weight


How am i attacking you LoL? I could Careless about your 150 posts and 2 rep.. I could careless about Haswell.... If it was Great i would have it... Everybody in this thread knows that LoL.

So please stop getting upset over nothing...

The first reviews i seen of Haswell were very bad.....

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/836?vs=551

It has got a lil better since then... But IB/SB still clock higher.. so things kind of even out still.

People should not be getting mad at eachother because of this be Mad at Intel... I sure am.... To the point if Pile Driver SteamRoller is on par with what we got i may switch camps...

These performance increases have been very Sad by Intel.


----------



## Leyaena

Hokies on an AMD chip, now there's something I'd like to see!


----------



## flopper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> To the point if Pile Driver is on par with what we got i may switch camps...
> 
> .


oh my


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> People should not be getting mad at eachother because of this be Mad at Intel... I sure am.... To the point if Pile Driver is on par with what we got i may switch camps...


I agree they've been bad, but 4770k wrecks piledriver in multithreaded while having a >50% performance lead in all of the CPU bound games i play, lets not go that far ;p

Steamroller may be a threat but only because i7's are £275 and fx-8350's are £139.


----------



## Hokies83

Oh Crap i typoed... I ment to say Steamroller lol I would never wish PD upon anyone lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Sure looks like an IPC increase, same cpu & memory clocks on haswell is faster than on IB in benchmarks.


...yup - just not sure a 1st batch / gen average Haswell is worth the upgrade over a fast Ivy.

There are some lucky Haswell owners re fast low-v chips now, but on average, it looks like performance difference between engineering samples and 1st batch consumer samples for Haswell is far more pronounced than when i.e. Ivy came out...you would need a good Haswell example to emphasize the relatively constrained gains over Ivy via better 'paper design'

source extremetech.com


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> It's a shame so much of it's increased FPU performance comes from AVX2, which as we've seen in this thread is a major heat generator. The more I hear about Haswell the happier I am I sprung for Ivy instead of holding out when my Core 2 era system finally started to have hardware failure.
> 
> The only thing Haswell seems to have going for it are better looking motherboards (with the exception of the blinged out Asus boards), better audio chipsets, a few more SATA 6Gbps, and USB 3 slots. Not really a compelling reason to upgrade if you already have a stable Ivy build.


Stuff that has nothing to do with AVX & iGPU run faster as well, superpi has always been a good raw single core test, performance shows ivy --> haswell is about the same increase as sandy --> ivy. Other benches are doing well too.
I do agree that the new motherboards are a bit more exciting than the cpus themselves.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...yup - just not sure a 1st batch / gen average Haswell is worth the upgrade over a fast Ivy.
> 
> There are some lucky Haswell owners re fast low-v chips now, but on average, it looks like performance difference between engineering samples and 1st batch consumer samples for Haswell is far more pronounced than when i.e. Ivy came out...you would need a good Haswell example to emphasize the relatively constrained gains over Ivy via better 'paper design'
> 
> source extremetech.com


For sure, if you have a great ivy chip you would probably kick yourself trading it in for a haswell unless you get lucky with a great haswell too. 4.6 or 4.7Ghz haswell is pretty much like a 5ghz ivy, but trade in a 5ghz 3770k & get a 4.3Ghz capable 4770k =








It's like sandy to ivy, cpu sidegrade except a new board is needed too.


----------



## WiSK

OCN name: *WiSK*
CPU: *i7-3770K*
on die-TIM: *Cool Labs Ultra*
IHS-TIM: *Arctic MX-4*
Mhz gained: *300MHz* to start with...
OC after delid: *4.5GHz @ 1.24V*
Previous temp: *68C while folding at 4.2GHz @ 1.112V* (single AX120 rad)
Temp after delid: *59C after 10xIBT at 4.5GHz @ 1.24V* (single AX120 rad)
Temp drop: *at least 9C* (it was also 6C cooler ambient before the delid)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2836887


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> OCN name: *WiSK*
> CPU: *i7-3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Cool Labs Ultra*
> IHS-TIM: *Arctic MX-4*
> Mhz gained: *300MHz* to start with...
> OC after delid: *4.5GHz @ 1.24V*
> Previous temp: *68C while folding at 4.2GHz @ 1.112V* (single AX120 rad)
> Temp after delid: *59C after 10xIBT at 4.5GHz @ 1.24V* (single AX120 rad)
> Temp drop: *at least 9C* (it was also 6C cooler ambient before the delid)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2836887
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


..Congratsias







...also nice temps w/MX4 and single 120 rad


----------



## ucantescape1992

Don't have a cpu-z validation and I'm currently on holiday







I'll be submitting my form information for official induction soon!

Anywho I used the razor method. In all honestly I did it very aggressively, just making sure the razor was pressured against the IHS and not the PCB. Took 1 or 2 minutes, and I nearly had a heart attack in the process!

Using PK-1 for now, cant wait to get some clu.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> OCN name: *WiSK*
> CPU: *i7-3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Cool Labs Ultra*
> IHS-TIM: *Arctic MX-4*
> Mhz gained: *300MHz* to start with...
> OC after delid: *4.5GHz @ 1.24V*
> Previous temp: *68C while folding at 4.2GHz @ 1.112V* (single AX120 rad)
> Temp after delid: *59C after 10xIBT at 4.5GHz @ 1.24V* (single AX120 rad)
> Temp drop: *at least 9C* (it was also 6C cooler ambient before the delid)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2836887


You're in!!







Slap that Sig on babbay!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> OCN name: *WiSK*
> CPU: *i7-3770K*
> on die-TIM: *Cool Labs Ultra*
> IHS-TIM: *Arctic MX-4*
> Mhz gained: *300MHz* to start with...
> OC after delid: *4.5GHz @ 1.24V*
> Previous temp: *68C while folding at 4.2GHz @ 1.112V* (single AX120 rad)
> Temp after delid: *59C after 10xIBT at 4.5GHz @ 1.24V* (single AX120 rad)
> Temp drop: *at least 9C* (it was also 6C cooler ambient before the delid)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2836887


You're in!!







Slap that Sig on babbay!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap that Sig on babbay!


Thanks


----------



## hotrod717

Can't wait to get my clu and put my delidded 3770k back in, but this 2700k is really growing on me. Maxing 62* at load with 4.6 / 1.344v after 10 runs of ibt. Hoping that the 3770k has better temps with clu, Gelid Extreme and 1.265v., if not the 2700k might be going back in!


----------



## akiles333

hi guys..
just delidded 3770k, and everything went just fine. i used akasa ak-455 on the die and ihs.. before at 4,5 ghz my temps were on all cores were around 80-85 and now they're at 69-80-80-78.. should i buy some liquid ultra? would i see any huge benefits of haveing liquid ultra instead of akasa ak-455?


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> hi guys..
> just delidded 3770k, and everything went just fine. i used akasa ak-455 on the die and ihs.. before at 4,5 ghz my temps were on all cores were around 80-85 and now they're at 69-80-80-78.. should i buy some liquid ultra? would i see any huge benefits of haveing liquid ultra instead of akasa ak-455?


As it has already been stated 29'854,732'154,596 times before in this thread, yes, using CLP/U will improve your temp drop significantly.

Greets


----------



## Spin Cykle

Anyone know if CLU is in stock anywhere in the states?


----------



## strokercrate

You can turn off the integrated gpu? I've looked all through my bios.. Maybe I just over looked it.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Ive ran over 1.5v for 8 months no issues
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *But my cpu stays below are right around 60c.. under load.*
> I am able to get 4.5ghz stable at 1.19 V But that extra 600mhz to get to5.1ghz takes some real V core.


Surely you don't mean 100% load as in IBT or prime? 1.5v and staying at or under 60c seems like a miracle chip. Even with a custom loop.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> You can turn off the integrated gpu? I've looked all through my bios.. Maybe I just over looked it.


What board do you have? Most, if not all, boards let you disable it.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Surely you don't mean 100% load as in IBT or prime? 1.5v and staying at or under 60c seems like a miracle chip. Even with a custom loop.


Guess u never seen a loop then

That is in a 24 C room.... If i had better fans i would be more close to the 50c range then 58-60c but im happy with my temps vs noise.


----------



## stickg1

Hokie does have an absurd amount of rad space. But since it's a loop with his three 7950s in it, he would have to stop mining for several hours for the water to cool back down to ambient for him to do a legitimate test run for you. And that's lost money. So I can understand him not wanting to do it.


----------



## jjpctech

Absolutely crazy rig


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jjpctech*
> 
> Absolutely crazy rig


Thank You Sir








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hokie does have an absurd amount of rad space. But since it's a loop with his three 7950s in it, he would have to stop mining for several hours for the water to cool back down to ambient for him to do a legitimate test run for you. And that's lost money. So I can understand him not wanting to do it.


And if it was up and running you would be right...

I would not stop my money making machine just to prove a point.


----------



## HowHardCanItBe

Settle down everyone.There is no need to blow a fuse over something trivial. Let's keep it civil in here please.


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> What board do you have? Most, if not all, boards let you disable it.


Asus z87-a


----------



## bigredishott

I so want to try this! But, My wife says she would kill me if I tried it and put the $350 I just spent in risk. lol


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigredishott*
> 
> I so want to try this! But, My wife says she would kill me if I tried it and put the $350 I just spent in risk. lol


The key is to not tell your wife. Then when you ruin it you say that it died on its own and then she will give you more slack to buy another







You already broke rule #1


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hokie does have an absurd amount of rad space. But since it's a loop with his three 7950s in it, he would have to stop mining for several hours for the water to cool back down to ambient for him to do a legitimate test run for you. And that's lost money. So I can understand him not wanting to do it.


I know he does. I seen his rig. Thats why I was curious, as he made a statement his 1.5v chip does 60c under load. Another guy has same setup and gets nowhere near his temps. Was just wanting to see proof.

People post stuff all the time in this thread, and people ask for "pics or it didn't happen", I was just doing the same with him, as he has done with me many times over when I had a vishera CPU. So I'm not being a bully, just giving hokies a taste of his own medicine.

As for the proof, he admitted he's not currently running anything, so its more than reasonable for me to ask for proof. I know its not gonna happen, but I gotta ask anyways.

Oh and why would I be jealous of you rig? I don't like my games to stutter, but to each his own.


----------



## Swag

I just bought something to match my Military Green C70.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just bought something to match my Military Green C70.


Swag what up man! Long time no speak. Nice mouse. I'm looking at a similar one but white to match my prodigy build.


----------



## Hokies83

None of my games stutter.

Nobody on ocn is running the same thing as me.

10c can differ in IB de lidding temps depending on your Tim app.

My IHS is also 3500 grit lapped flat....

I could buy 24 San ace fans and do p/p and run near room temp if a really wanted to.

I am happy with my temps and the silence so no need.


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> None of my games stutter.
> 
> Nobody on ocn is running the same thing as me.
> 
> 10c can differ in IB de lidding temps depending on your Tim app.


What's the next best tim for the die after clu/clp?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> What's the next best tim for the die after clu/clp?


I've really become a big fan of PK1 myself what ever i do not put cl Lu on gets pk1.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> None of my games stutter.
> 
> Nobody on ocn is running the same thing as me.
> 
> 10c can differ in IB de lidding temps depending on your Tim app.


I can't and wont go look for the exact screenshot because the game is coming on (USA vs Honduras, quit being haters and watch some soccer, we need the support), but I remember seeing hokie post his temps of his Prime95 run @ 5.0GHz+ being under 60C, somewhere around 55C. Only reason I remember is we got in an argument over it and I didn't talk to him for a few days, lol.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigredishott*
> 
> I so want to try this! But, My wife says she would kill me if I tried it and put the $350 I just spent in risk. lol


...you should say to your wife that *you only spent $350* instead of getting a more powerful but more expensive CPU so that you can spend more on roses and dinners for her --- getting the rest of the extra CPU performance by delidding skill instead - may not work but she might appreciate the try (may be







)


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I can't and wont go look for the exact screenshot because the game is coming on (USA vs Honduras, quit being haters and watch some soccer, we need the support), but I remember seeing hokie post his temps of his Prime95 run @ 5.0GHz+ being under 60C, somewhere around 55C. Only reason I remember is we got in an argument over it and I didn't talk to him for a few days, lol.


Musta been right after i did it when I was getting a feel for temps and before i installed all the Gpus.

But like ive told others there is so much water in my loop it takes 3 hrs or so to heat up.

So i could start a cold run and be 3 to 5 c cooler then after afew hrs it reaches a temp and holds.

Just like my Gpus do.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I can't and wont go look for the exact screenshot because the game is coming on (USA vs Honduras, quit being haters and watch some soccer, we need the support), but I remember seeing hokie post his temps of his Prime95 run @ 5.0GHz+ being under 60C, somewhere around 55C. Only reason I remember is we got in an argument over it and I didn't talk to him for a few days, lol.


...with a good loop, those temps are entirely possible (below a shot of 100 load via Aida for a large single loop that serves two CPUs)...Also: added 2x 7990s, air cooled but w-c parts ordered for their own separate loop...(incidentally, the trusty 4x 670s just sit in the 2nd machine now)...and with the latest AMD drivers (13.6b) I have seen very little / no micro-stutter...go figure


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I just bought something to match my Military Green C70.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Swag what up man! Long time no speak. Nice mouse. I'm looking at a similar one but white to match my prodigy build.
Click to expand...

The only thing I'll tell you about the white (why I returned it) is that it has a plasticky feel on the top versus the black or green which has a matte feel to the top.

Been busy for a while because I got accepted into Engineering.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The only thing I'll tell you about the white (why I returned it) is that it has a plasticky feel on the top versus the black or green which has a matte feel to the top.
> 
> Been busy for a while because I got accepted into Engineering.


Oh, I may have to find another one.

Engineering is excellent. If I could do my degree over again it would be with a major in engineering. I just did a broad science in information tech. Start making those big bucks buddy!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The only thing I'll tell you about the white (why I returned it) is that it has a plasticky feel on the top versus the black or green which has a matte feel to the top.
> 
> Been busy for a while because I got accepted into Engineering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, I may have to find another one.
> 
> Engineering is excellent. If I could do my degree over again it would be with a major in engineering. I just did a broad science in information tech. Start making those big bucks buddy!!
Click to expand...

I got mine for a cheaper price because of the price match. So I had to jump on it...

I want to be able to make money and do something I actually like, this way I can be happy and feed my PC addiction.







My dad did software engineering and then some IT degree, he earns fairly good for the time he spent on his degrees. Especially considering the job market right now.

(Chemical Engineering is what I'm getting into







)


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Glad to hear it bro. Do what you love. I can tell you from my experience, it's worth it. I got my degree and after a few years opened my own business. I go to work everyday as the boss, and I love it. It's been so good we getting ready to open up another location at the end of the year! Just remember if things don't work out in one job, it's because it wasn't for you and there is something better!









You super intelligent from what I've seen so I know you'll be a boss at your your career!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Glad to hear it bro. Do what you love. I can tell you from my experience, it's worth it. I got my degree and after a few years opened my own business. I go to work everyday as the boss, and I love it. It's been so good we getting ready to open up another location at the end of the year! Just remember if things don't work out in one job, it's because it wasn't for you and there is something better!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You super intelligent from what I've seen so I know you'll be a boss at your your career!


Thanks.









Have you gotten a delidded Haswell yet or not?

I wish there was a deliddable Extreme CPU like Haswell-E.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> *I don't like my games to stutter, but to each his own.*


So sad that some people are so misinformed and held back in their ideology because of their impressions on past drivers







That's ok. Some people just regret spending so much on over-hyped GPU's when the more powerful and cheaper solution works out the kinks.



















pce


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> So sad that some people are so misinformed and held back in their ideology because of their impressions on past drivers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's ok. Some people just regret spending so much on over-hyped GPU's when the more powerful and cheaper solution works out the kinks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pce


Yeah I'd be mad if my games were stuttering....

But I like to be able to set max settings in my games and hold 120 fps there is no single Gpu that can do that.... So i use 3 they scale well up to 3 4 is more for looks lol.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For sure, if you have a great ivy chip you would probably kick yourself trading it in for a haswell unless you get lucky with a great haswell too. 4.6 or 4.7Ghz haswell is pretty much like a 5ghz ivy, but trade in a 5ghz 3770k & get a 4.3Ghz capable 4770k =
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's like sandy to ivy, cpu sidegrade except a new board is needed too.


Debating RMAing my average Ivy as it's unstable at stock speeds and voltages, rock solid when OC'd though...but Intel doesn't need to know that, chances are I'll get a better chip. This most recent batch of 3570k's and 3770k's seem to be fantastic, and it can't get much worse than 1.285V for 4.5 Ghz.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Debating RMAing my average Ivy as it's unstable at stock speeds and voltages, rock solid when OC'd though...but Intel doesn't need to know that, chances are I'll get a better chip. This most recent batch of 3570k's and 3770k's seem to be fantastic, and it can't get much worse than 1.285V for 4.5 Ghz.


That is about the same as the worst of 10 x 3770k I tried, 1.28 for 4.5. I never stress tested the best 2 I had, but both could boot & do light benching at 5ghz under 1.3V.
The delidded 3770k I'm using for a daily now could IBT with max memory at 4.5 @ 1.12V, but didn't keep scaling well, by the time it got to 5Ghz the voltage it needed made it nothing special.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is about the same as the worst of 10 x 3770k I tried, 1.28 for 4.5. I never stress tested the best 2 I had, but both could boot & do light benching at 5ghz under 1.3V.
> The delidded 3770k I'm using for a daily now could IBT with max memory at 4.5 @ 1.12V, but didn't keep scaling well, by the time it got to 5Ghz the voltage it needed made it nothing special.


I just want to be able to run 4.5 Ghz 24/7 stable. As it stands I need 1.215v to keep 4.4Ghz stable for 24 hours, and while that's fine for general use...it's not going to allow me to keep up for another 2 years.


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> I just want to be able to run 4.5 Ghz 24/7 stable. As it stands I need 1.215v to keep 4.4Ghz stable for 24 hours, and while that's fine for general use...it's not going to allow me to keep up for another 2 years.


Yes it will? Intel themselves say that normal and safe is 1.3 - 1.4, 1.215 won't degrade your chip if that's what you're referring to... Maybe I am mistaking you but I see all these posts in here saying my chip runs 4.5 under 1.25 etc... and then they diss it saying it is a bad chip...

Mine is 1.320 stable at 4.5, it was a bad batch bought around January, but I am not scared of degradation as that is completely under specs.... So what is up with statement lol.


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Yes it will? Intel themselves say that normal and safe is 1.3 - 1.4, 1.215 won't degrade your chip if that's what you're referring to... Maybe I am mistaking you but I see all these posts in here saying my chip runs 4.5 under 1.25 etc... and then they diss it saying it is a bad chip...
> 
> Mine is 1.320 stable at 4.5, it was a bad batch bought around January, but I am not scared of degradation as that is completely under specs.... So what is up with statement lol.


Not referring to degradation, referring to my chips ability to keep up with Haswell and not bottle neck the 7 series GPU I plan to buy soon.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Not referring to degradation, referring to my chips ability to keep up with Haswell and not bottle neck the 7 series GPU I plan to buy soon.


I would say a 4.5ghz 3570k should push 2 r 3 780s pretty easy.

It also depends alot on this are you a 1080i 120hz gamer or 60hz?

Are you a 2560x1440 60hz gamer?

It takes the most for 120hz gaming it takes a heck of alot Gpu and cpu to do so.

60hz is not so hard to get tho.


----------



## Valgaur

YES! Boss gave me the 5th and 6th off! I can go to toronto for the LN2 event as a bencher finally!


----------



## l0rdraiden

I have seen this video about CLU




And I guess the same thing happens with CLP and metal pad

Have you experience the same? after a year or so will I have to re-apply again a new thermal compound? any solution or workaround? Would be better to get MX-4 or PK1?
http://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/arctic_mx_4_thermal_paste_review.html
http://skinneelabs.com/2011-thermal-paste-review-comparison/2/

There is any multi-brand (generalist) solution to put the CPU Cooler on a naked DIE, what are the advantages and disadvantages/dangers of this.

Thanks in advance


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> YES! Boss gave me the 5th and 6th off! I can go to toronto for the LN2 event as a bencher finally!


Great to hear








Have fun over there!


----------



## kikibgd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l0rdraiden*
> 
> I have seen this video about CLU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I guess the same thing happens with CLP and metal pad
> 
> Have you experience the same? after a year or so will I have to re-apply again a new thermal compound? any solution or workaround? Would be better to get MX-4 or PK1?
> http://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/arctic_mx_4_thermal_paste_review.html
> http://skinneelabs.com/2011-thermal-paste-review-comparison/2/
> 
> There is any multi-brand (generalist) solution to put the CPU Cooler on a naked DIE, what are the advantages and disadvantages/dangers of this.
> 
> Thanks in advance


There is ek supreme wb for nacked mount.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 4 Beta


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> (Chemical Engineering is what I'm getting into
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


You won't be smiling in 2 years when you can't remember the last time you slept for more than 4 hours. Ask me how I know







Drinking energy drinks and still being able to fall asleep in the library while wondering what the hell you were thinking when you signed up for this. Good times, good times.


----------



## maynard14

Finally @ 4.5 ghz and 1.344 volts used turbo oc

delided with razor and used noctua nth1 for the moment (ordered clp otw)



max temp after 1 hour prime 95 is 70c!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> YES! Boss gave me the 5th and 6th off! I can go to toronto for the LN2 event as a bencher finally!


HF


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> HF


Thanks guys







I'll be there with FtW as well, Also Maynard nice job on the delid and OC good temps for that vcore as well with the noctua paste, keep us up to date when clp gets there!


----------



## akiles333

I have some VERY minor scratches on the die.. it's not from the blade... will i still see a huge temp improvement when i get my clu? with akasa ak-455 i get worse temps than with stock intel tim.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> I have some VERY minor scratches on the die.. it's not from the blade... will i still see a huge temp improvement when i get my clu? with akasa ak-455 i get worse temps than with stock intel tim.


Yes with a small area like a cpu die being able to transfer heat is very important.

Cool labs liquid ultra and pro are the best at it and will give the best results.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> I have some VERY minor scratches on the die.. it's not from the blade... will i still see a huge temp improvement when i get my clu? with akasa ak-455 i get worse temps than with stock intel tim.


CLU will do 2 things for you:

- Fill out those tiny scratches with what is basically liquid metal, diminishing the effect of them being there by quite a nice margin.
- Drop your temperatures. A lot. I can't stress enough how good CLU/CLP is compared to other TIM's on the die itself.


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> CLU will do 2 things for you:
> 
> - Fill out those tiny scratches with what is basically liquid metal, diminishing the effect of them being there by quite a nice margin.
> - Drop your temperatures. A lot. I can't stress enough how good CLU/CLP is compared to other TIM's on the die itself.


but its okay to use the akasa till' i get the clu?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> CLU will do 2 things for you:
> 
> - Fill out those tiny scratches with what is basically liquid metal, diminishing the effect of them being there by quite a nice margin.
> - Drop your temperatures. A lot. I can't stress enough how good CLU/CLP is compared to other TIM's on the die itself.
> 
> 
> 
> but its okay to use the akasa till' i get the clu?
Click to expand...

As a placeholder it should be just fine


----------



## Skullwipe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> You won't be smiling in 2 years when you can't remember the last time you slept for more than 4 hours. Ask me how I know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drinking energy drinks and still being able to fall asleep in the library while wondering what the hell you were thinking when you signed up for this. Good times, good times.


You're doing it wrong, put your organic chemistry to work and synthesize something stronger! (not meth...)


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> As a placeholder it should be just fine


how about between the ihs and cpu cooler then? does it really matter what i use there?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> (Chemical Engineering is what I'm getting into
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> You won't be smiling in 2 years when you can't remember the last time you slept for more than 4 hours. Ask me how I know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drinking energy drinks and still being able to fall asleep in the library while wondering what the hell you were thinking when you signed up for this. Good times, good times.
Click to expand...

Exact thing I heard from friends who are in Chemical Engineering right now... It's brutal.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullwipe*
> 
> Debating RMAing my average Ivy as it's unstable at stock speeds and voltages, rock solid when OC'd though...but Intel doesn't need to know that, chances are I'll get a better chip. This most recent batch of 3570k's and 3770k's seem to be fantastic, and it can't get much worse than 1.285V for 4.5 Ghz.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> That is about the same as the worst of 10 x 3770k I tried, 1.28 for 4.5. I never stress tested the best 2 I had, but both could boot & do light benching at 5ghz under 1.3V.
> The delidded 3770k I'm using for a daily now could IBT with max memory at 4.5 @ 1.12V, but didn't keep scaling well, by the time it got to 5Ghz the voltage it needed made it nothing special.


^^^...you know a bit about my 'K' Ivy, though the performance distribution among the non-K 'VM' 3770s I run is also is quite an eye-opener...at up to 4.6 G, one of them would actually beat my low-v delidded 'K' that itself has benched up to 5.3, alas the 'VM' 3770 has a locked multi past 41/43 (w/BCLK 4.6).









...as always, it's where 'the wall' starts and how steep it is with any chip, I guess...I use Cinebench 11.5 to quickly determine the 'pass v-core' requirements of a chip at given MHz settings - I have yet to encounter a single instance where a chip would fail a bench at a v-core that was stable in Cinebench's CPU test. Still, *anything else you recommend beyond Cinebench* to do the 'initial' speed / v-core tables ? I'm not talking bout subsequent stability test such as Intel's XTU, IBT etc but the initial MHz/v-core table creation


----------



## Skullwipe

Well some of my RAM just took a dump, 2 BSOD's in 15 minutes after the second one my UD5H went into a boot loop. I had run Memtest on this pair of sticks about 2 months ago for 24 hours each and got zero errors, but as soon I removed them the system booted right up. I tried my my other pair in both sets of slots and it booted up fine.

Sigh, so maybe I can't blame Intel for my stock instability. I still think the fact that my 3570k needs 1.16v at stock is insane though.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I have yet to encounter a single instance where a chip would fail a bench at a v-core that was stable in Cinebench's CPU test.


Hey mate i passed Cinebench 11.5 below 1.3 volts (score 10.40 on 4.7ghz 4770k with fastish ram) but i need 1.325 or 1.33 for the CPU to hold up under x264 encoding

Can you or everyone else pass fine/is this an individual problem? Either i have an issue i should know about, or your point doesn't hold up and instability is hit in seconds with an everyday program that is also pretty commonly used for benching. To be fair, it seems to stick out (at least for my system) as needing more volts than everything else and i'm not sure why


----------



## Skullwipe

Another quick question for you guys, noticing that my hottest core is consistently 5-7 tests behind the rest of my cores in P95. Is this normal? If not is this core just lazy and in need of a good whoopin, or should I give medication a try before resorting to physical violence?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Yes it will? Intel themselves say that normal and safe is 1.3 - 1.4, 1.215 won't degrade your chip if that's what you're referring to... Maybe I am mistaking you but I see all these posts in here saying my chip runs 4.5 under 1.25 etc... and then they diss it saying it is a bad chip...
> 
> Mine is 1.320 stable at 4.5, it was a bad batch bought around January, but I am not scared of degradation as that is completely under specs.... So what is up with statement lol.


For me complaining about my 'bad' 4.5 @ 1.12 chip, it is about bad scaling. I was looking for a benching chip, & hoping that 4.5 @ 1.12V meant a low voltage at 5Ghz chip, but then it stopped scaling at 4.7Ghz & needed big volts for 5Ghz, so was disappointing & bad as a benching chip.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> YES! Boss gave me the 5th and 6th off! I can go to toronto for the LN2 event as a bencher finally!











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ^^^...you know a bit about my 'K' Ivy, though the performance distribution among the non-K 'VM' 3770s I run is also is quite an eye-opener...at up to 4.6 G, one of them would actually beat my low-v delidded 'K' that itself has benched up to 5.3, alas the 'VM' 3770 has a locked multi past 41/43 (w/BCLK 4.6).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...as always, it's where 'the wall' starts and how steep it is with any chip, I guess...I use Cinebench 11.5 to quickly determine the 'pass v-core' requirements of a chip at given MHz settings - I have yet to encounter a single instance where a chip would fail a bench at a v-core that was stable in Cinebench's CPU test. Still, *anything else you recommend beyond Cinebench* to do the 'initial' speed / v-core tables ? I'm not talking bout subsequent stability test such as Intel's XTU, IBT etc but the initial MHz/v-core table creation


I use cinebench to test bench clocks as well, if it passes at x.xx vcore, that was enough vcore to pass other benches that load up the cpu.
The other one I use is superpi 32m to test IMC & memory, if it passes 32m, it will pass for all the benchies.


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> For me complaining about my 'bad' 4.5 @ 1.12 chip, it is about bad scaling. I was looking for a benching chip, & hoping that 4.5 @ 1.12V meant a low voltage at 5Ghz chip, but then it stopped scaling at 4.7Ghz & needed big volts for 5Ghz, so was disappointing & bad as a benching chip.


O totally, from a "I want this chip to go as high as possible" standpoint I understand the complaints but I seriously doubt the majority of people calling their chips 'bad' in that context actually plan on going much higher than 4.5 GHz anyway.

Btw your avatar is soo awesome







.


----------



## drnilly007

Well after trying to de lid my 3570k using the vice method I broke the pcb of the chip. It was only one medium power hit and cracked the edge of the pcb.

I tried to install in back in my board but cpu led was all that was shown on the motherboard.

R.I.P. 3570k 4.6 1.32v


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drnilly007*
> 
> Well after trying to de lid my 3570k using the vice method I broke the pcb of the chip. It was only one medium power hit and cracked the edge of the pcb.
> 
> I tried to install in back in my board but cpu led was all that was shown on the motherboard.
> 
> R.I.P. 3570k 4.6 1.32v


You... You did put a block of wood between the pub and the hammer, didn't you?


----------



## drnilly007

Yes, I watched the video but what I think I may have done wrong was put the first lip of the IHS on the vice not the second lip so the pcb was1/4 inch higher than the vice.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hey mate i passed Cinebench 11.5 below 1.3 volts (score 10.40 on 4.7ghz 4770k with fastish ram) but i need 1.325 or 1.33 for the CPU to hold up under x264 encoding


Same here. I can run Cinebench all day long on settings that will kill my 4770K in minutes with Aida or IBT. Might be a Haswell specific problem though.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Same here. I can run Cinebench all day long on settings that will kill my 4770K in minutes with Aida or IBT. Might be a Haswell specific problem though.


Other cpus are similar. Cinebench is a decent fast test for semi-stable overclocks, but cinebench at minimum vcore needed for cinebench will not stand up to a real stress test.


----------



## markallen1988

So I am now the proud owner of the first ever(documented) 4770K killed by delidding. Thanks aweisberg for sending it to me, I am now part of history!











I was going to buy a Z87 board and risk it, but I'm not so sure now. The PCB has like 5 tiny gouges in the upper right corner and a deep horizontal scratch on the left side, plus the 2 severed resistors, PLUS the top left corner is chipped, on the front and back of the PCB. Chances of it working are slim to none. Still tempted, I'm sure I could return the mobo if it didn't work. Decisions, decisions...


----------



## FtW 420

Almost 2 weeks late to be the first documented 4770k delidding kill speaking of aweisberg http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/18900_50#post_20122900
Or wasn't that the first?


----------



## markallen1988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Almost 2 weeks late to be the first documented 4770k delidding kill speaking of aweisberg http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/18900_50#post_20122900
> Or wasn't that the first?


He posted in here offering his failed CPU to anyone who wanted to try it out, I just got it in the mail today. My 3770K delid was a smashing success, thank you very much.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

I used the vise and hammer method and I would so recommend that over the razor blade method because of nicking the chip with the razor. My cpu works perfect after the vise and hammer method.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Other cpus are similar. Cinebench is a decent fast test for semi-stable overclocks, but cinebench at minimum vcore needed for cinebench will not stand up to a real stress test.


...or often two Cinebench tests within 2 min of each other...still Cinebench is not a bad, 'quick' method to define a basic vcore / MHz table (for further refinement) and also to find 'the wall', the original intent of my post...I call it a 'range-finder' but have not tried it w/Haswell...


----------



## steven88

I got a question for you gurus

1. How is MX-4 TIM under the IHS? I can't seem to find CLU anywhere









2. Where do you guys buy your razor blades? Any brand or type I should look for?

2. Does the black goo require alot of force to slice thru with a razor? Or does the razor cut right through with a couple of wiggles here and there?


----------



## Forceman

CLU is about 10C better, plus it has better longevity.

Get the double sided kind, not one for a utility knife or something. Then use tape to cover one side so you can hold it.


----------



## Robbieboy

Also if de-lidding with a razor keep it flat and don't try to and stab the corner of the blade in like a knife...

all ways use just the middle of the blade to get under the corner and work to the end of blade by wiggling it to the middle of the edge of the IHS then go the other way..then start on the next corner and do the same....
and when holding the blade... first finger under and your thumb on top you will notice that the blade will bend upwards towards your thumb...

That's good for it to do that but not to much...you want it to bend just a little so as you are slowly pushing the razor in it is rubbing aganst the IHS and not the PCB....

It don't take long to do so slow and steady is the way to go and not to deep....

Hope it helps a bit mate....









Here are some pic of the razor I used....


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> It don't take long to do so slow and steady is the way to go and not to deep....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*


I hate that dude in your Avatar.. i hope he gets stabbed in the eye early next season lol.

And his father Lord Bolton is a Traitor,


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I hate that dude in your Avatar.. i hope he gets stabbed in the eye early next season lol.
> 
> And his father Lord Bolton is a Traitor,


You do Know it's a woman.... not a man!!!!


----------



## Leyaena

I've read the books, so I'd already come to terms with everything that happens a number of years ago.
So, with that in the back of my mind, I really thought they did an admirable job casting Ramsay, and his extended role in the series was very well written and executed. On a related note, I think the red wedding episode was one of the best episodes I've ever seen in any series. They're doing a great job translating the books to the screen, in my opinion. That said, Ramsay's a despicable, cruel character who deserves to die, but he's still more likable than a certain king down in king's landing









Anyway, sorry for the off-topic, just wanted to clarify a few things ^^

PS: the gif is just awesome though, no matter how much you hate the guy


----------



## Hokies83

I never read the books but i seen rob as the good guy never thought he would die....

Kinda was hoping he would ally with the mother of dragons...

But im pretty sure she will give the lanistors whats coming to them.
Could not be much left of them to after the white walkers are done with them.

Also donno who is going to take over the stark house the cripple brother or John Snow?


----------



## Leyaena

I think it's pretty safe to just stop thinking of the Starks as a major player of the Iron Throne, really, or even as a House, for that matter.
Sure, there's still plenty of Starks left (sort of), but their political strength has been totally shattered. The Starks that are left have some REALLY interesting storylines still to come, but I think you'll save yourself a lot of disappointment if you just try and come to terms with the fact that the Starks as a House, are done.

That said, I can promise you Westeros still has plenty of intrigue coming your way


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Haha your avatar always gets someone going. Lol

I too can't wait to see Ramsay get killed. Hope some payback finds him in the first episode.


----------



## Hokies83




----------



## WiSK

If we learn anything from Game of Thrones it's that anyone you have any sympathy or hope for, eventually gets hurt or dies


----------



## Oslo

count me in









4670k + vice + hammer = combowombo wonder









tested and its all ok im waiting for the custom loop and for clu before starting some oc test


----------



## bigredishott

I really want to try this. I am still nervous. The hammer and vice way is safer than razor blade? I know my wife would be angry would have to not tell her. lol
Was it nerve racking beating on your new chip?


----------



## Oslo

actually i would suggest you to use about a 50 mm piece of wood and a rubber hammer, then u have to hit not such hard but quite strong tho, the cpu wont actually detach from the ihs and rocket away unless u hit like thor.... instead you will notice on about the 2-nd or the 3rd swing that the glue will loosen up then proceed with 1 more swing and take off the cpu


----------



## .theMetal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigredishott*
> 
> I really want to try this. I am still nervous. The hammer and vice way is safer than razor blade? I know my wife would be angry would have to not tell her. lol
> Was it nerve racking beating on your new chip?


it is really nerve wrecking. I was shaking the whole time. but it really was just stupid easy, I mean like cheating easy. after I was done, I was like seriously? that was it?

biggest piece of advice IMO is have a really nice vice with really smooth flat surfaces to grip the processor, and brace it as well as you can, you want no movement. I propped mine up against a bed post.

the more solid every thing is (block of wood against processor/processor in vice/and vice its self) the easier you have to tap. I didn't have to tap hard at all and it slowly just came loose.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigredishott*
> 
> I really want to try this. I am still nervous. The hammer and vice way is safer than razor blade? I know my wife would be angry would have to not tell her. lol
> Was it nerve racking beating on your new chip?


It's nerve wracking (I guess there are two official ways to spell that) for sure. I did it twice - the first time nothing seemed to be happening after the first two hits so I swung a little harder the thrid time and knocked the PCB clean off the vise (tip - put a towel behind the vise just in case). The second chip I was too cautious and it took quite a few hits but the PCB just came loose and I was able to pull it off without it flying across the room. So don't get frustrated if it seems to be taking to big a hit, just slowly increase the strength of the hits and check to see if the PCB is loose after each hit. Bracing the vise or having it well mounted makes a big difference also, if it moves it'll take a lot more force from the hammer to get it loose.


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> It's nerve wracking (I guess there are two official ways to spell that) for sure. I did it twice - the first time nothing seemed to be happening after the first two hits so I swung a little harder the thrid time and knocked the PCB clean off the vise (tip - put a towel behind the vise just in case). The second chip I was too cautious and it took quite a few hits but the PCB just came loose and I was able to pull it off without it flying across the room. So don't get frustrated if it seems to be taking to big a hit, just slowly increase the strength of the hits and check to see if the PCB is loose after each hit. Bracing the vise or having it well mounted makes a big difference also, if it moves it'll take a lot more force from the hammer to get it loose.


I was shaking so bad! and i did it with a razor blade, and i also cut myself like 4 times. it was a miracle that i didn't nick the pcb


----------



## Leyaena

You're better off nicking yourself than nicking the pcb


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> You're better off nicking yourself than nicking the pcb


Haha, yeah!







i'm waiting for my clu now though, as my akasa 455 is only good for increasing temps.. -.- should be here by next week


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> I never read the books but i seen rob as the good guy never thought he would die....
> 
> Kinda was hoping he would ally with the mother of dragons...
> 
> But im pretty sure she will give the lanistors whats coming to them.
> Could not be much left of them to after the white walkers are done with them.
> 
> Also donno who is going to take over the stark house the cripple brother or John Snow?


Daenerys. I'd like to do some ally-ing too...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> I've read the books, so I'd already come to terms with everything that happens a number of years ago.
> So, with that in the back of my mind, I really thought they did an admirable job casting Ramsay, and his extended role in the series was very well written and executed. On a related note, I think the red wedding episode was one of the best episodes I've ever seen in any series. They're doing a great job translating the books to the screen, in my opinion. That said, Ramsay's a despicable, cruel character who deserves to die, but he's still more likable than a certain king down in king's landing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, sorry for the off-topic, just wanted to clarify a few things ^^
> 
> PS: the gif is just awesome though, no matter how much you hate the guy


I started reading the books too early, now have too long of a wait for the next one!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bigredishott*
> 
> I really want to try this. I am still nervous. The hammer and vice way is safer than razor blade? I know my wife would be angry would have to not tell her. lol
> Was it nerve racking beating on your new chip?


Have to get the nerves under control, I do a fair bit of modding & being too nervous makes it more difficult, increases the chances of a slip/mistake.
I was binning 3770s so had a few here & delidded the worst of them, didn't care about the chip, not nervous it went smooth as silk with the razor.
Recently modded a Titan, with a $1200 card I couldn't afford to replace it was nerve wracking, & while I got it done & it is alive, I did slip up a couple times & it will never be able to go back to stock condition & work again.

The vice & hammer does look safer. If it is safely locked in the vice, piece of wood that makes good contact, soft padding around to catch the PCB if it does bounce off the lid when it comes off, start off moderately light taps & use just the force needed to get it loose.
No issues & really nothing to be nervous about.


----------



## jjpctech

Due lidding my 3770k tom oz for direct die cooling


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> You're better off nicking yourself than nicking the pcb


...that's what I thought









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> - snip-
> 
> ...The vice & hammer does look safer. If it is safely locked in the vice, piece of wood that makes good contact, soft padding around to catch the PCB if it does bounce off the lid when it comes off, start off moderately light taps & use just the force needed to get it loose.
> No issues & really nothing to be nervous about.


...I'll be calling you to help dellid my Ivy-E in the fall !


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I'll be calling you to help dellid my Ivy-E in the fall !


But it should come in a black box, with an intel extreme case badge. Blue boxes with intel inside badges are for delidding, have to get inside those ones!

Hopefully they just come soldered, or I will probably bug you to quit boiling water on the chip & make ice on it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> But it should come in a black box, with an intel extreme case badge. Blue boxes with intel inside badges are for delidding, have to get inside those ones!
> 
> Hopefully they just come soldered, or I will probably bug you to quit boiling water on the chip & make ice on it.


...hope you know some good ice coffee recipes







...by that time, the current 3970X might want to experience some icy cold winter holidays 'at your lodge'


----------



## akiles333

Is it normal that i get worse temps when i'm not using clu/clp after delidding? because im getting 10-15 worse idle temps and 10 load temps.. i'm using akasa 455 and i'm kinda worried because i have some minor scratches on the die itself.... some guy said that the clu would cover up the scratches though..


----------



## ABAD1DEA




----------



## magicase

I'm planning to delid a 4770k with the wood/hammer/vice method but I don't have any old CPUs to practice on. What is the chance of my killing a 4770k if I was careful in hitting with the hammer gently?


----------



## moowarcow

I hear Coolaboratory Labs Liquid Pro and Ultra is very difficult to remove. Do they ever need to be reapplied once installed? I'm trying to find a good all-round thermal compound that doesn't require much maintenance while not sacrificing performance.


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *moowarcow*
> 
> I hear Coolaboratory Labs Liquid Pro and Ultra is very difficult to remove. Do they ever need to be reapplied once installed? I'm trying to find a good all-round thermal compound that doesn't require much maintenance while not sacrificing performance.


they've just got a three-stage removal kit! http://coollaboratory.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/37


----------



## ABAD1DEA

yes with the metal cleaner you get CLU easy of the IHS. i cleand it 4 times now and always looks like new


----------



## strokercrate

My CLP came in today, Im getting worse temps than with AS5 on the die. As soon as I loaded prime the first core jumped to 95c.. 20c higher than my second core and almost 30 than my others. I didn't apply to much I placed the tiniest dot and spread per instructions and video. So what do you think could be going wrong?


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> My CLP came in today, Im getting worse temps than with AS5 on the die. As soon as I loaded prime the first core jumped to 95c.. 20c higher than my second core and almost 30 than my others. I didn't apply to much I placed the tiniest dot and spread per instructions and video. So what do you think could be going wrong?


from what i've seen on pics and in videos, people apply the clu/clp on both the die and the underside of the ihs(the side facing the die)... Did you apply it only to the die or both?


----------



## ABAD1DEA

and be sure that the IHS sits in the DIE with direct contact


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> My CLP came in today, Im getting worse temps than with AS5 on the die. As soon as I loaded prime the first core jumped to 95c.. 20c higher than my second core and almost 30 than my others. I didn't apply to much I placed the tiniest dot and spread per instructions and video. So what do you think could be going wrong?


Hmm.. Looks like a bad seating of ether IHS or Cooler.

Did the IHS stay where it should while clamping the CPU to the motherboard?

Check that and re-seat the cooler with new TIM









With good contacts, you should see 67C on all cores (if not lower







)


----------



## strokercrate

Ok so i took everything back down to the die and noticed It did not transfer any to the IHS, so... I must have not put enough on. I was a little worried to add to much I have always heard take what you think and cut it in half with CLP or something like that. Anyways I did put about the same amount I seen in a video and it wasn't enough. So I added more to the die and a small thin film to the IHS.. Now its working great.

Here is pre-delid

post delid with as5 

Delid with CLP plus my ambient is 3c higher as well.


----------



## sdcalihusker

OCN name: Sdcalihusker
CPU: i7-4770K
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: CLP
Mhz gained: 0 (so far)
OC after delid: 4799 Mhz
Temp drops: ~14C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2839111


----------



## mercs213

My CLP came today. I will be de-lidding tomorrow. Fun!


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> My CLP came today. I will be de-lidding tomorrow. Fun!


Good luck!


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> My CLP came today. I will be de-lidding tomorrow. Fun!


which method are you going to use?


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Ok so i took everything back down to the die and noticed It did not transfer any to the IHS, so... I must have not put enough on. I was a little worried to add to much I have always heard take what you think and cut it in half with CLP or something like that. Anyways I did put about the same amount I seen in a video and it wasn't enough. So I added more to the die and a small thin film to the IHS.. Now its working great.
> 
> Here is pre-delid
> 
> post delid with as5
> 
> Delid with CLP plus my ambient is 3c higher as well.


forgot to mention that I also lapped the IHS before applying the CLP to the die, that maybe why I had such a good drop from as5..


----------



## ghostrider85

who here lives in orange county? someone help me delid my 3570k please!


----------



## steven88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> who here lives in orange county? someone help me delid my 3570k please!


+1, anybody here in Socal?


----------



## mercs213

Vice method. I toke some whacks at it tonight but I think the wood was too soft.

I think I whacked it pretty good with my hammer and the processor was in tight, but it looks like the side of the processor was just making an indention into the wood.... threw it back in for a quick sloppy boot and it still works.

Can anyone comment on how "hard" the wood should be? I don't think the processor should intent into the wood...

Thanks and hopefully I can get it off tomorrow when I have more courage... lol.


----------



## mercs213

double post oops


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> double post oops


Something like Pine I would think would be too soft. A chuck of a 2x4 should work great.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Is it normal that i get worse temps when i'm not using clu/clp after delidding? because im getting 10-15 worse idle temps and 10 load temps.. i'm using akasa 455 and i'm kinda worried because i have some minor scratches on the die itself.... some guy said that the clu would cover up the scratches though..


Try taking it apart and re-applying and re-seating the IHS. The first time I did mine with MX-4 it was worse, and then when I took it apart it was apparent that the MX-4 hadn't spread out on the die very well. Die with no thermal paste on it doesn't work well at all. Also make sure the IHS didn't move when you locked the socket.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magicase*
> 
> I'm planning to delid a 4770k with the wood/hammer/vice method but I don't have any old CPUs to practice on. What is the chance of my killing a 4770k if I was careful in hitting with the hammer gently?


Pretty low. Take a few low-power swings to get the hang of it, and if it doesn't come right off gradually amp up the strength. I got frustrated after two swings and hit it a lot harder with the third and the chip went flying off. Put a towel behind, and make sure the vise doesn't move.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *moowarcow*
> 
> I hear Coolaboratory Labs Liquid Pro and Ultra is very difficult to remove. Do they ever need to be reapplied once installed? I'm trying to find a good all-round thermal compound that doesn't require much maintenance while not sacrificing performance.


It is very easy to remove from the die itself, but can be hard from the IHS. But you shouldn't ever have to reapply it unless you take the chip apart again. And MX-4 is a solid all around paste.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> Vice method. I toke some whacks at it tonight but I think the wood was too soft.
> 
> I think I whacked it pretty good with my hammer and the processor was in tight, but it looks like the side of the processor was just making an indention into the wood.... threw it back in for a quick sloppy boot and it still works.
> 
> Can anyone comment on how "hard" the wood should be? I don't think the processor should intent into the wood...
> 
> Thanks and hopefully I can get it off tomorrow when I have more courage... lol.


I just used a cut-off piece of 2x8 I had lying around. It did make some indentations in the end anyway though. There isn't a lot of clearance on the bottom, so don't use anything with a rounded edge, like the side of a 2x4. Use the end.


----------



## Dimaggio1103

So anyone know what the quality of the VRMs are on my AsRock z77e board? Im wanting to buy a kraken x60 and shoot for 5GHz+ for 24/7 OC. I know its a 6+2, and my chip does decent on voltage, at 4.8GHz it takes 1.280v to be 100% stable. But if my boards VRMs are to weak I see no point in investing in a better cooler.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sdcalihusker*
> 
> OCN name: Sdcalihusker
> CPU: i7-4770K
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: CLP
> Mhz gained: 0 (so far)
> OC after delid: 4799 Mhz
> Temp drops: ~14C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2839111


You're in!!







nice vcore for that clock as well! Sorry it took me so long to accept you in but guys gotta work right?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> So anyone know what the quality of the VRMs are on my AsRock z77e board? Im wanting to buy a kraken x60 and shoot for 5GHz+ for 24/7 OC. I know its a 6+2, and my chip does decent on voltage, at 4.8GHz it takes 1.280v to be 100% stable. But if my boards VRMs are to weak I see no point in investing in a better cooler.


With ASRock Z77 always check with a multi-meter. My Extreme4 was off by a lot, when comparing actual voltage vs software. My extreme6 was off by a little bit. Some of the even cheaper ones can be off by as much as .1v


----------



## ABAD1DEA

my pro tip is to put the vice to a wall so that the impact hits the PCB directly without loss of energy


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Try taking it apart and re-applying and re-seating the IHS. The first time I did mine with MX-4 it was worse, and then when I took it apart it was apparent that the MX-4 hadn't spread out on the die very well. Die with no thermal paste on it doesn't work well at all. Also make sure the IHS didn't move when you locked the socket.
> Pretty low. Take a few low-power swings to get the hang of it, and if it doesn't come right off gradually amp up the strength. I got frustrated after two swings and hit it a lot harder with the third and the chip went flying off. Put a towel behind, and make sure the vise doesn't move.
> It is very easy to remove from the die itself, but can be hard from the IHS. But you shouldn't ever have to reapply it unless you take the chip apart again. And MX-4 is a solid all around paste.
> I just used a cut-off piece of 2x8 I had lying around. It did make some indentations in the end anyway though. There isn't a lot of clearance on the bottom, so don't use anything with a rounded edge, like the side of a 2x4. Use the end.


Ok, it moved alot when i locked the socket though... Could that be the problem?


----------



## ABAD1DEA

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Ok, it moved alot when i locked the socket though... Could that be the problem?


u need it to hold in place with your hands till you have locked it


----------



## akiles333

Yeah.. I'm gonna try that now and see if anything changes


----------



## sdcalihusker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nice vcore for that clock as well! Sorry it took me so long to accept you in but guys gotta work right?


From the looks of it, I have a pretty decent chip. It should be noted that in my post I put 4799 as the Max OC, but it was 4700 (4699 according to the validation). I'm very new to overclocking Intel Chips and haven't really been able to do much more than raise the multiplier and adjust the vcore to get stable under stress testing.


----------



## akiles333

Btw, on a 3770k do you guys think that a vcore of 1.155 at 4.5ghz is good? Llc is set to high.. If i set it to extreme, i can go down to a vcore of 1.07


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> With ASRock Z77 always check with a multi-meter. My Extreme4 was off by a lot, when comparing actual voltage vs software. My extreme6 was off by a little bit. Some of the even cheaper ones can be off by as much as .1v


Ya I already did that. Now any answer for my question?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Btw, on a 3770k do you guys think that a vcore of 1.155 at 4.5ghz is good? Llc is set to high.. If i set it to extreme, i can go down to a vcore of 1.07


You need to look at CPU-Z while under load to see the vCore being used. It sounds like you are reporting what vCore you type in bios and then changing LLC, but that doesn't tell us anything. Changing LLC will not change what voltage your chips needs for a given multiplier.

Here is a guide to oc your Ivy on Asus if you want:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You need to look at CPU-Z while under load to see the vCore being used. It sounds like you are reporting what vCore you type in bios and then changing LLC, but that doesn't tell us anything. Changing LLC will not change what voltage your chips needs for a given multiplier.
> 
> Here is a guide to oc your Ivy on Asus if you want:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1291703/ivy-bridge-overclocking-guide-asus-motherboards


Ohh, haha







it says 1.1406 i think.... It's below what i set in the bios at least.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimaggio1103*
> 
> Ya I already did that. Now any answer for my question?


I don't know any power users with the ASRock mini-ITX. Might just have to go trial on error on that one. 4.5GHz all day, 5.0GHz might be tough.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Btw, on a 3770k do you guys think that a vcore of 1.155 at 4.5ghz is good? Llc is set to high.. If i set it to extreme, i can go down to a vcore of 1.07


1.15v is good for 4.5ghz mine needs 1.19v for 4.5ghz


----------



## Dimaggio1103

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I don't know any power users with the ASRock mini-ITX. Might just have to go trial on error on that one. 4.5GHz all day, 5.0GHz might be tough.


Plus, rep for trying. I know Intel VRMs (on Intel motherboards) tend to be higher quality, so a lot of them are not needed in comparison to AMD boards. I have not seen any throttling at 4.8 yet, I guess what i'm worried about is longevity. Of the board itself. I mean if going this high or any higher on my board will reduce the life significantly, then Ill just bring her back down to 4.7 and keep my lil antec 620, and save some cash. I know a 4.7GHz i7 is good enough, I just wanna squeeze it for performance.


----------



## akiles333

Is this really bad or will the clu fix it?


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Is this really bad or will the clu fix it?


Does it boot?


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Does it boot?


Yes


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Is this really bad or will the clu fix it?


...if you're referring to scratches on the PCB (same holds for exposed caps / Haswell), CL-U is *not* the right stuff as it is capacitive and conductive...MX4 or even nail polish are the non-capacitive, non-conductive materials of choice to cover those

...if it boots and works on both mem channels, then you are very 'lucky / good' - the scratches if any did not go deep enough then...either way, congrats on the delid


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...if you're referring to scratches on the PCB (same holds for exposed caps / Haswell), CL-U is *not* the right stuff as it is capacitive and conductive...MX4 or even nail polish are the non-capacitive, non-conductive materials of choice to cover those
> 
> ...if it boots and works on both mem channels, then you are very 'lucky / good' - the scratches if any did not go deep enough then...either way, congrats on the delid


Those "scratches" on the pcb is the adhesdive glue that i obviously didnt do a good enough job removing..i'm worried about those scratches on the die.. So will clu fix it? I've run prime95 for 12 hours no problem on small fft's.


----------



## ABAD1DEA

how did you scratch it so badly? didnt you use isopropyl alcohol to clean?


----------



## akiles333

Yeah, i used isopropyl alcohol... But, again, will clu still improve my temps with those scratches on the die?


----------



## h3llkill3r

do you think the cpu is dead?

i am trying to turn on the pc and the fans are turning on than off after 1 second.

21062013303.jpg 523k .jpg file


----------



## ozzy1925

i have seen many videos but not sure which method is safe for a beginner :razor blade or the hammer?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h3llkill3r*
> 
> do you think the cpu is dead?
> 
> i am trying to turn on the pc and the fans are turning on than off after 1 second.
> 
> 21062013303.jpg 523k .jpg file


With IHS or without?

Touchy with the seating after delid.


----------



## h3llkill3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> With IHS or without?
> 
> Touchy with the seating after delid.


what does ihs mean?


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h3llkill3r*
> 
> what does ihs mean?


IHS stands for *Integrated Heat Spreader*, and is the "lid" you just took off.
What SonDa5 asks is that if you are trying to run it with or without the IHS.
If the CPU isn't seated correctly in the socket (not enough or too much pressure is being applied), it would most likely not boot.


----------



## markallen1988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h3llkill3r*
> 
> what does ihs mean?


integrated heat spreader


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Those "scratches" on the pcb is the adhesdive glue that i obviously didnt do a good enough job removing..i'm worried about those scratches on the die.. So will clu fix it? I've run prime95 for 12 hours no problem on small fft's.


Liquid Ultra will give you the best temps but it won't "fix" the scratches. If it boots then you are very lucky


----------



## ghostrider85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *h3llkill3r*
> 
> what does ihs mean?


internal heat simulator


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i have seen many videos but not sure which method is safe for a beginner :razor blade or the hammer?


Based on how much my hands were shaking when I did it, I'd say hammer method for sure.


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Liquid Ultra will give you the best temps but it won't "fix" the scratches. If it boots then you are very lucky


Should i just leave it outside of the system and wait for the clu?


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Liquid Ultra will give you the best temps but it won't "fix" the scratches. If it boots then you are very lucky


Will the scratches make a significant difference if i compared it to another delidded 3770k in terms of temps?


----------



## mercs213

De-lid successful. Harder wood + more force = flying ivy. It landed on my pillows and blanket, glad I setup that up, everyone should.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Will the scratches make a significant difference if i compared it to another delidded 3770k in terms of temps?


Hard to tell from the picture how deep the scratches are, but I would think CLU would fill them and you'll be just fine. How did you scratch it like that?


----------



## akiles333

I honestly have no idea... Probably some dust that i didnt notice before i put the ihs back on.


----------



## h3llkill3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> IHS stands for *Integrated Heat Spreader*, and is the "lid" you just took off.
> What SonDa5 asks is that if you are trying to run it with or without the IHS. o
> If the CPU isn't seated correctly in the socket (not enough or too much pressure is being applied), it would most likely not boot.


i removed the ihs. should i do place the ihs and see if it starts?

EDIT: iassembled the ihs and tried turning on again but same happened.


----------



## razr m3

OCN name: razr m3
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: Still testing
OC after delid: I'm at 4.4GHz (will overclock ,more when I have time)
Temp drops: Dropped ~20C across all cores from 87C to 67C


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *razr m3*
> 
> OCN name: razr m3
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: Still testing
> OC after delid: I'm at 4.4GHz (will overclock ,more when I have time)
> Temp drops: Dropped ~20C across all cores from 87C to 67C


Sweet deal. I'm also going with CLP and AS5, just waiting on the CLP.

Currently I'm at 4.8ghz 1.3v 87c, really hoping to drop 20c also.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Those "scratches" on the pcb is the adhesdive glue that i obviously didnt do a good enough job removing..i'm worried about those scratches on the die.. So will clu fix it? I've run prime95 for 12 hours no problem on small fft's.


,,,good to differentiate between PCB scratches and caps (use MX4 etc) and the scratches on the die...hard to tell from your pic how deep the scratches on the die are...for what it is worth, I have used MX4 on a die before as it gets quite close to CL-U/ P in performance when I ran out of CL...yet is non-conductive / non-capacitive - ideal to insulate scratches in your case, at least for initial testing etc

...posted this 'several times' now but it fits your situation - and yes, I'm a CL-U fan, but still...but for now in your situation, I would apply MX4 on the die until as an initial step


----------



## mercs213

Applied CLP popped in the CPU, put heatsink back on and now my OC of 4.6ghz is no more. Reset settings and reapplied all the settings manually and even though I have the multiplier at x46 the max it goes to in windows is x38 when running prime95. God I hate this mobo -Asus P8Z77-V LK.

Doesn't matter what I set the multiplier at - the max is goes is x38 -_-

Downgrading BIOS and re-updating BIOS to see if this will solve the issue.

FIXED!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> Applied CLP popped in the CPU, put heatsink back on and now my OC of 4.6ghz is no more. Reset settings and reapplied all the settings manually and even though I have the multiplier at x46 the max it goes to in windows is x38 when running prime95. God I hate this mobo -Asus P8Z77-V LK.
> 
> Doesn't matter what I set the multiplier at - the max is goes is x38 -_-


...I run several P8Z77-V LKs - these days as VM work horses but one of them was a 'play' thing before I added ROG boards - that P8Z77 V-LK hit 4.9GHz w/o any problems...

...sounds like the stuck multiplier 'Bios bug' problem which occurred with a certain generation of Z77 Asus BIOS (across many product lines)...IMO, really also was a Win 7 bug...occurs after rebooting following several freezes / oc crashes without a 'clean' non overclocked boot-up / shut down...

...AFAIR, the procedure was to uninstall Asus AI Suite II (and especially FanExpert2), reboot, go in the BIOS and make sure that TURBO etc is on and multi is set to 43 or so...basically do what you would when you first got it form the store...reboot and use CPU-Z to check if it took the new speeds.

...if it works you can eventually reinstall Asus AISuite, FanExpert2 etc...just make sure that as you 'oc' and you end up having a crash / freeze, you reboot at least once, don't oc, open a few files and boot down again before the next boot up followed by more aggressive 'oc'...you want Win and AISUite not to shut down abruptly more than a few times in a row...AISuite really is a direct path to the BIOS, yet also a Windows app...that whole problem came down to the interplay between the two...


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> Applied CLP popped in the CPU, put heatsink back on and now my OC of 4.6ghz is no more. Reset settings and reapplied all the settings manually and even though I have the multiplier at x46 the max it goes to in windows is x38 when running prime95. God I hate this mobo -Asus P8Z77-V LK.
> 
> Doesn't matter what I set the multiplier at - the max is goes is x38 -_-
> 
> Downgrading BIOS and re-updating BIOS to see if this will solve the issue.
> 
> FIXED!


It's a BIOS bug, same problem with my P8Z77-V Pro, after ASUS pretended like it wasn't an issue and I was crazy, I just sold the board and got something else.


----------



## Skullwipe

Is die lapping still done? Is it even needed with modern CPU's?


----------



## Forceman

Some people still lap the IHS, but I've never heard of anyone lapping the die itself. That's pretty ballsy.


----------



## tw33k

I doubt anyone would try lapping the die on a modern CPU.


----------



## markallen1988

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's a BIOS bug, same problem with my P8Z77-V Pro, after ASUS pretended like it wasn't an issue and I was crazy, I just sold the board and got something else.


And then ASUS fixed it quietly with an update, while still pretending it never existed in the first place.


----------



## magicase

Would this vice be big enough for a 4770k?

http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/SCA-Mini-Vice-45mm.aspx?pid=324226#Cross


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magicase*
> 
> Would this vice be big enough for a 4770k?
> 
> http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/SCA-Mini-Vice-45mm.aspx?pid=324226#Cross


You really want smooth jaws instead of crosshatched ones....reduces pressure hot spots when it's one smooth jaw surface. This was the one I bought at my local home improvement store:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Irwin-3-in-Clamp-On-Vise-226303ZR/100537101#.UcVCuBBUUiV

----

Unrelated teaser of the writeup I'm going to get around to on my setup:



1C at full clock speed FTMFW. Tomorrow I have to rebuild my loop with better (read: $7/ft) tubing that will never cloud and swap in a new 3770k.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *magicase*
> 
> Would this vice be big enough for a 4770k?
> 
> http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/online-store/products/SCA-Mini-Vice-45mm.aspx?pid=324226#Cross


Or drop around to Bunnings and get one of these:


http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/1070#post_20244296

suppose if you were going for cheap, then:
Craftright 100mm Swivelling Bench Vice
$28.50 I/N: 6010358
http://www.bunnings.com.au/products_category_clamps-pliers-and-vices_1616.aspx?filter=categoryname--Vices%3bpriceRange--%2420+-+%2450


----------



## darkphantom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Some people still lap the IHS, but I've never heard of anyone lapping the die itself. That's pretty ballsy.


That is a silly thing to do IMO as there is minimal surface area on the die itself not to mention it is risky in my eyes. Lapping the IHS should be more than sufficient in my eyes...but I guess if you're doing on-die cooling...eh?


----------



## magicase

EDIT - Decided to go buy the 100m vice at Bunnings. Masters has the same thing but at $30.

+1 rep for alancsalt


----------



## dr/owned

Alright,I gotta ask. Being in the US, I've never heard of Bunnings or Masters. But being in Aus, have you ever heard of Home Depot or Lowes?

(And when I first read your post my thought was "go out and buy something...it's 2AM")


----------



## Scott1541

Also have either of you heard of B&Q, Wickes or Homebase


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Alright,I gotta ask. Being in the US, I've never heard of Bunnings or Masters. But being in Aus, have you ever heard of Home Depot or Lowes?
> 
> (And when I first read your post my thought was "go out and buy something...it's 2AM")


Yeah, Lowes do menswear. Can't be the same. Home Depot we got, but it's not as cheap as Bunnings.

B&Q, Wickes or Homebase? Nope. I don't know them.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scott1541*
> 
> Also have either of you heard of B&Q, Wickes or Homebase


Homebase yes but only because of Top Gear







More specifically Top Ground Gear Force which isn't officially a Top Gear episode but still pretty good.


----------



## hotrod717

Finally received my CLU and decided to test Gelid Extreme on die and ihs before doing the CLU. I increased my oc and temps seemed pretty good about 12* less than stock at load. I tried to jump from 4.8 to 5.0 and while it seemed to boot fine, had some fatal errors in win7. After bumping volts a couple times and then droping back to 4.9, it seems like I may have to make some other adjustments to get higher than 4.8 IBT stable. I noticed LLC offset between bios and cpu-z increased exponentially and wonder if I have to drop the LLC level to get better stability at higher clocks. I will be putting the CLU on the die later today and continue with Gelid on the ihs. Here's what I got so far:


^^^^ 4.6


^^^^4.8
The ihs skewed a bit on me when I installed it and may not have the best seating. One of the cores is significantly lower than the rest.


----------



## justanoldman

We were just posting about vises in the other delid thread. The clear consensus is use a flat "drill-press" vise such as the one Alancsalt posted. Here is the Home Depot link. It is only $19.97.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Irwin-4-in-Drill-Press-Vise-226340/100578950

The other vises that are move vertical and have one clamp underneath can tilt ever so slightly back and forth and defeat the purpose of how we delid.


----------



## self_slaughter

I just used a normal heavy duty vice at work.
Grippy teeth and metal shavings etc everywhere.
Didn't really phase me if I broke it, Blown more money then that on a big night out on the piss lol

Still, cpu barely moved at all when it came off and vice didn't leave any marks on the IHS.
I think some people just do things rediculously tight and hit it way too hard forgetting that it is a fragile piece of electronics...
A little bit of common sense goes a long way!

I'll have to update my results at some stage since replacing the mx-4 on the die with CLP.
Dropped me another 10-15'C by making the switch.

At stock settings with cpu fans at 600rpm IBT only hits 51,54,54,51 max core temps now








Max core temp after an extended gaming session was 40,43,42,43
Pretty cool running chips once you fix em up


----------



## neofury

I can't wait to get my CLP. I think latest Wednesday I should have it. Then I'll go out and buy the vise, I had already bookmarked that exact vice from home depot as its cheap and appears to be perfect for my needs.


----------



## stasio

Hmm,seems upcoming 4960X coming with soldering IHS:

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=e...%25E5%258B%2592





and other thing is why no Haswell from Costa Rica.


----------



## steven88

lol, big blob of solder ftw


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *razr m3*
> 
> OCN name: razr m3
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: Still testing
> OC after delid: I'm at 4.4GHz (will overclock ,more when I have time)
> Temp drops: Dropped ~20C across all cores from 87C to 67C


You're in! Can I haz your validation? if not it's alright


----------



## Hokies83

Lets hope all IB E come like that.


----------



## justanoldman

I guess I am weird, but I actually like delidding. I am a numbers/finance guy that hires out most things, so being able to build a rig from scratch and delid a chip makes it feel much more like my creation rather than just putting some parts together.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> Lets hope all IB E come like that.


I hope so as well and that even X99 comes out around with it X79 needs an upgrade with the CPU world as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I guess I am weird, but I actually like delidding. I am a numbers/finance guy that hires out most things, so being able to build a rig from scratch and delid a chip makes it feel much more like my creation rather than just putting some parts together.


I agree I'm a very physical on hands kind of man so this is perfect for me!


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I guess I am weird, but I actually like delidding. I am a numbers/finance guy that hires out most things, so being able to build a rig from scratch and delid a chip makes it feel much more like my creation rather than just putting some parts together.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I hope so as well and that even X99 comes out around with it X79 needs an upgrade with the CPU world as well.
> I agree I'm a very physical on hands kind of man so this is perfect for me!


To be honest, that's a good chunk of why I went for haswell. Just to get a little more hands on with em







(plus new+shiny!)
Would of been nicer if we had to solder a few pins together or something to unlock the multis rather then pay an extra $40 for an unlocked chip though!


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I guess I am weird, but I actually like delidding. I am a numbers/finance guy that hires out most things, so being able to build a rig from scratch and delid a chip makes it feel much more like my creation rather than just putting some parts together.


Yeah couldn't tell that from the 7 monitors displaying financial charts


----------



## Hokies83

I do not mind messing with a 320$ chip... id rather not with a 700$ + chip tho.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I guess I am weird, but I actually like delidding. I am a numbers/finance guy that hires out most things, so being able to build a rig from scratch and delid a chip makes it feel much more like my creation rather than just putting some parts together.


AGREED!!


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> AGREED!!


You still mining?

Jump on LTC and fast!!!

MTGox is getting ready to pick it up in later half of july... LTC prices will soar....... 1 LTC for 100$ anyone? Ive already got 150 saved and waiting...









And getting 12 a day Atm


----------



## phillyd

Woot! I have a tube of Junpus thermal paste on its way so I'll FINALLY be delidding my 3770k. Here's the validation of my current OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2841236

Hopefully temps will drop enough to push it to 5GHz (with some tweaking). Please check out the *Build Log*!


----------



## hotrod717

Ok, finally got the CLU on die and have some comparison between:

^^ 2700k with Gelid Extreme 4.8ghz @1.41v High LLC Max 66*


^^ 3770k Delidded w/ Gelid Extreme on die and ihs 4.8ghz @ 1.41v High LLC Max 73*


^^ 3770k Delidded w/ CLU on die and Gelid Extreme on ihs 4.8ghz @ 1.41 Ultra LLC Max 69*

I had some stability issues in game even after passing 10 runs of IBT and had to bump LLC from high to ultra. Although the only game that seemed to have this problem is buggy to begin with - Farcry 3.
I'm happy with the results although it does support arguements that if you already had a 2700k, you really didn't need to upgrade to 3770k for 2 Gflops. According to IBT thats less than 2% increase in performance. Also note that there was a fluctuation in Gflops probably due to my changing a Xtreme Tweak setting in bios. Didn't seem to help.
I am going restest after a few days to see if any breakin occurs. If not I'll probably reseat a few times to ensure consistency of temps.
I also still have to complete watercooling set up and installation in a case, as its on a bench now with a single RX360

OCN Name: hotrod717
CPU: 3770k
On-Die Tim: CLU
IHS Tim: Gelid Extreme GC-3
MHZ Gained: 200
OC After Delid: 4.8
Temp Drops: 20*
CPU Validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2841434


----------



## ozzy1925

Will this work with my i3770?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> 
> Will this work with my i3770?


I think that one may make the delidding harder, so I would go with something like what a linked in my previous post #19702:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/19700#post_20247735


----------



## dr/owned

So...been up 24 hours now since I spent the last 7 rebuilding my loop with new tubing, adding my mobo VRMs into the loop, adding a second pump, changing all the barbs, adding a second water chiller, and swapping in a new 3770k.

*CLU does etch nickel and the die* I was able to clean most of it off with rubbing alcohol and ye-olde cotton balls. Tried boiling water on a q tip and Indigo Xtreme Clean (which blasts through fingerprints and grease like crazy), but no luck.

The die was perfectly mirror finish before I direct-died it




EDIT: Almost forgot...I didn't bother polishing the block before slapping it on a new die (with fresh CLU). Temperatures look unchanged.

Also, now that my VRMs are being chilled-watered, I think the voltage being reported is glitched. It's set to 1.575 in the BIOS but only shows up as 1.50 in CPUz...weird.

New 3770k is a slightly better overclocker than the old one. At least it's not degraded and I can do 5Ghz again.


----------



## justanoldman

I have never had CLU etch or damage anything so far on my two chips. But alcohol doesn’t help much, which is why I use metal cleaner to remove it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Ok, finally got the CLU on die and have some comparison...
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^^ 2700k with Gelid Extreme 4.8ghz @1.41v High LLC Max 66*
> 
> 
> ^^ 3770k Delidded w/ Gelid Extreme on die and ihs 4.8ghz @ 1.41v High LLC Max 73*
> 
> 
> ^^ 3770k Delidded w/ CLU on die and Gelid Extreme on ihs 4.8ghz @ 1.41 Ultra LLC Max 69*
> 
> I had some stability issues in game even after passing 10 runs of IBT and had to bump LLC from high to ultra. Although the only game that seemed to have this problem is buggy to begin with - Farcry 3.
> I'm happy with the results although it does support arguements that if you already had a 2700k, you really didn't need to upgrade to 3770k for 2 Gflops. According to IBT thats less than 2% increase in performance. Also note that there was a fluctuation in Gflops probably due to my changing a Xtreme Tweak setting in bios. Didn't seem to help.
> I am going restest after a few days to see if any breakin occurs. If not I'll probably reseat a few times to ensure consistency of temps.
> I also still have to complete watercooling set up and installation in a case, as its on a bench now with a single RX360
> 
> 
> 
> OCN Name: hotrod717
> CPU: 3770k
> On-Die Tim: CLU
> IHS Tim: Gelid Extreme GC-3
> MHZ Gained: 200
> OC After Delid: 4.8
> Temp Drops: 20*
> CPU Validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2841434


Interesting...







Back in February, I posted CL-U on die / MX4 on IHS, followed by CL-U on die AND IHS...I think the temp difference was also around 3 C to 4 C @ 5GHz on the delidded 3770K...

...went 'back in' several more times as the IHS was very *concave* (and mounted a bit crooked by the factory to begin with)...after 'lapping' both the underside and top of the IHS, I gained another 2 C or so, and also quite even idle / min temps per this earlier posted-pic @ 5.1 (Koolance -w-c block, single RX 360 in those days)...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## skyn3t

how good and bad in having CLU on die and IHS? cuz i'm about to delidded my 3570k it is already lapped.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> how good and bad in having CLU on die and IHS? cuz i'm about to delidded my 3570k it is already lapped.


CLU (or CLP) on the die is required to get the best temps in the opinion of most here. You don't need to use it on top of the IHS though, any good TIM will do there. If you use it on top you might get a couple c better, but it will be a pain to clean later on when you pull it apart.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> how good and bad in having CLU on die and IHS? cuz i'm about to delidded my 3570k it is already lapped.


...if you already lapped the IHS and are about to delid, you might as well go for the 'max' temp savings and use CL-U on both die AND IHS







...having a non-liquid metal TIM on the IHS is certainly not a 'tragedy' and has other advantages, but if the 'max' possible performance is what you're after, I would do both (and did so one one of my machines, the other - a 3970X - uses MX4 on the die for 'concave' reasons)..

...the 3 C to 4 C savings can become part of other 'enhancements' - such as a very capable *custom water-loop* - and by the time all is said and done, all the extra temp savings *add up* to
a.) running (obviously) cooler and
b.) potentially being able to lower v-vore a bit, as was the case with my 3770K.

Just keep in mind that as you already lapped the IHS (and thus got down to 'raw' copper), CL-U will stain that copper / IHS a bit - and is supposed to do that...you can certainly clean it off with Isopropanol later, and a quick additional lapping will take that 'bonding surface layer' off again.

Good luck with the 'delid'


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...if you already lapped the IHS and are about to delid, you might as well go for the 'max' temp savings and use CL-U on both die AND IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...having a non-liquid metal TIM on the IHS is certainly not a 'tragedy' and has other advantages, but if the 'max' possible performance is what you're after, I would do both (and did so one one of my machines, the other - a 3970X - uses MX4 on the die for 'concave' reasons)..
> 
> ...the 3 C to 4 C savings can become part of other 'enhancements' - such as a very capable *custom water-loop* - and by the time all is said and done, all the extra temp savings *add up* to
> a.) running (obviously) cooler and
> b.) potentially being able to lower v-vore a bit, as was the case with my 3770K.
> 
> Just keep in mind that as you already lapped the IHS (and thus got down to 'raw' copper), CL-U will stain that copper / IHS a bit - and is supposed to do that...you can certainly clean it off with Isopropanol later, and a quick additional lapping will take that 'bonding surface layer' off again.
> 
> Good luck with the 'delid'


Nice info you just gave me. I do know the CLU can stain the cooper what about of my  under? it will be damaged somehow or I can still polish it after? looks how nice and shine it is under the cpu block.


----------



## Swag

The only haswell chip I will own is in this.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Nice info you just gave me. I do know the CLU can stain the cooper what about of my  under? it will be damaged somehow or I can still polish it after? looks how nice and shine it is under the cpu block.


...no, not in my experience (I use a Koolance SI 370 for the Ivy)...the nickel plating won't be affected (I guess that's why copper gets plated a lot in the first place...one look at all those 'green' copper domes in an older city relates). Now, I don't know what happens later, but I have opened CL-U-on-nickel-plated copper arrangements up after six months or so and it could all be cleaned up without lapping.


----------



## IvantheDugtrio

Hi guys,

So several months ago I successfully delidded my 3570k and applied Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra between the die and the IHS. Average temps have only dropped a few degrees (2-3 C) and I was wondering if I should reapply my Liquid Ultra?

Currently I have the CPU overclocked to 4.5 GHz with +0.85V offset (it's an ASRock motherboard). Temps idle at 30C and peak 95C under prime95. I am using a Cooler Master GeminII S as my main heatsink.

Perhaps I should get a Corsair H100 or something?


----------



## strokercrate

Opinion?

What do you think is best for a 24/7 clock for both speed and longevity of 4670k cpu?

I can run

4.3ghz at 1.162v temps low 50's
4.5ghz at 1.24 temps mid-high 50's rare low 60's
4.7ghz at 1.35 temps mid high 60's rare low 70's

Is the extra 200mhz worth the 0.08v?
The extra 400mhz worth the 0.183v?


----------



## dr/owned

4.7 otherwise your new cpu is lower performing than my last gen. 1.35V is fine.


----------



## HGooper

I'm about to delid my 3570k, and I'm thinking to lap both IHS and Raystorm, how many improvement I can expect after lapping both?

Also I heard before that lapping waterblock is wasting time as it doesn't provide any improvement at all, is it true?


----------



## dr/owned

Don't lap...you'll regret it when you realize you effectively have an unsellable cpu down the road. Even my delidded 3770k I was able to relid (silicone + clamp) and resell.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> I'm about to delid my 3570k, and I'm thinking to lap both IHS and Raystorm, how many improvement I can expect after lapping both?
> 
> Also I heard before that lapping waterblock is wasting time as it doesn't provide any improvement at all, is it true?


Just go direct die mount with good flat contact block with CLP and you will be golden. Don't lap the IHS to preserve it for resell.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> I'm about to delid my 3570k, and I'm thinking to lap both IHS and Raystorm, how many improvement I can expect after lapping both?
> 
> Also I heard before that lapping waterblock is wasting time as it doesn't provide any improvement at all, is it true?


...whether lapping both the IHS and the water block is useful depends on concavity / convexity of the fit between your particular IHS and water block...a severe concave / convex issue can ruin your temps as it allows for bad metal-to-metal contact or even a bit of air getting trapped. Further, some water blocks are convex and only fit the IHS 'well' in a certain position (rotating by 90 degrees and comparing temps will usually tell you).

I have two CPUs which have a really concave IHS, and several more which don't...putting a sheet of 'pressure paper' in between your IHS and block and test-mounting it will usually show you the specific contact pattern you're dealing with...and so will any test mount w/old TIM you have laying around, just not as clearly...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Ok, finally got the CLU on die and have some comparison between:
> 
> ^^ 2700k with Gelid Extreme 4.8ghz @1.41v High LLC Max 66*
> 
> 
> ^^ 3770k Delidded w/ Gelid Extreme on die and ihs 4.8ghz @ 1.41v High LLC Max 73*
> 
> 
> ^^ 3770k Delidded w/ CLU on die and Gelid Extreme on ihs 4.8ghz @ 1.41 Ultra LLC Max 69*
> 
> I had some stability issues in game even after passing 10 runs of IBT and had to bump LLC from high to ultra. Although the only game that seemed to have this problem is buggy to begin with - Farcry 3.
> I'm happy with the results although it does support arguements that if you already had a 2700k, you really didn't need to upgrade to 3770k for 2 Gflops. According to IBT thats less than 2% increase in performance. Also note that there was a fluctuation in Gflops probably due to my changing a Xtreme Tweak setting in bios. Didn't seem to help.
> I am going restest after a few days to see if any breakin occurs. If not I'll probably reseat a few times to ensure consistency of temps.
> I also still have to complete watercooling set up and installation in a case, as its on a bench now with a single RX360
> 
> OCN Name: hotrod717
> CPU: 3770k
> On-Die Tim: CLU
> IHS Tim: Gelid Extreme GC-3
> MHZ Gained: 200
> OC After Delid: 4.8
> Temp Drops: 20*
> CPU Validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2841434


You're in as well!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Opinion?
> 
> What do you think is best for a 24/7 clock for both speed and longevity of 4670k cpu?
> 
> I can run
> 
> 4.3ghz at 1.162v temps low 50's
> 4.5ghz at 1.24 temps mid-high 50's rare low 60's
> 4.7ghz at 1.35 temps mid high 60's rare low 70's
> 
> Is the extra 200mhz worth the 0.08v?
> The extra 400mhz worth the 0.183v?


I run 4.5 Giggles as when you actually stress the CPU during something you don't wanna get it toasty I dare you to run IBT and tell me what your temps are then







(just kidding temps will soar) but those vcores for your 4.5 is at a good place for normal usage keep it there.


----------



## HGooper

Wow you can actually relid back the ihs? And what's CLP btw?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Wow you can actually relid the ihs? And what's CLP btw?


Coollaboratory Liquid Pro = CLP and yes it is possible to relid. All you do is obtain an adhesive and apply to the sides of the IHS and lid it back on. Very easy and this is what I did to put back my IHS using an epoxy adhesive.


----------



## HGooper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Pro = CLP and yes it is possible to relid. All you do is obtain an adhesive and apply to the sides of the IHS and lid it back on. Very easy and this is what I did to put back my IHS using an epoxy adhesive.


Lol I almost forget about Coollaboratory Liquid, I bought it few months back and kinda forgot about it coz I'm not intended to delid during that time yet.

So I've to find good flat contact block as ihs replacement, I think I just left them untouched lol.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Pro = CLP and yes it is possible to relid. All you do is obtain an adhesive and apply to the sides of the IHS and lid it back on. Very easy and this is what I did to put back my IHS using an epoxy adhesive.
> 
> 
> 
> Lol I almost forget about Coollaboratory Liquid, I bought it few months back and kinda forgot about it coz I'm not intended to delid during that time yet.
> 
> So I've to find good flat contact block as ihs replacement, I think I just left them untouched lol.
Click to expand...

You could always use your IHS.

Use CLP for the die2IHS contact and a normal TIM for IHS2HSF contact. The reason being that if you use CLP on the IHS, the markings will disappear and all your chances to sell your chip will deteriorate like your CPU identifications.


----------



## tw33k

I don't understand why people recommend against using a liquid metal TIM on top of the heatsink. You have just cut the heat sink off to improve temperature so why not use the option that performs best? The warranty is void already and if you're worried about resale value, if someone is willing to buy a de-lidded chip they aren't going to be fussy about the writing on the top of the heat spreader. Also, the liquid metal is going to last the life of the chip so I see no valid reason not to use it.


----------



## Forceman

Mostly because the temp drop from normal TIM to CLU isn't that significant between the IHS and the cooler (unlike the die to IHS) , so it isn't worth the hassle.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I don't understand why people recommend against using a liquid metal TIM on top of the heatsink. You have just cut the heat sink off to improve temperature so why not use the option that performs best? The warranty is void already and if you're worried about resale value, if someone is willing to buy a de-lidded chip they aren't going to be fussy about the writing on the top of the heat spreader. Also, the liquid metal is going to last the life of the chip so I see no valid reason not to use it.


My Cpu cooler cost 150$ id rather not go sanding on it if i do not have to lol.

Pk-1 performs very close to CL Liquid Ultra between IHS and a Heatsink.


----------



## phillyd

Look what arrived today! Anyone know how I should spread this stuff? I plan on using it on both surfaces.


----------



## justanoldman

^You would just use the included spatula to spread it on your IHS, but you would not want to use that on the die.


----------



## phillyd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> ^You would just use the included spatula to spread it on your IHS, but you would not want to use that on the die.


would the spatula work better than the pea sized dot method? And that's how I should spread it on the die right? (smaller dot though)


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> would the spatula work better than the pea sized dot method? And that's how I should spread it on the die right? (smaller dot though)


You should NOT use that on the die.

For one thing, I don't know if that paste with diamond nanoparticles would scratch the die or not, but I am not sure it is worth the risk. The main issue, however, is what has been posted in here ten thousand times, and that is you need a liquid metal TIM on the die to get the best temps and avoid pump out over time.

As far as applying to the IHS, I have not used it myself, but from what I read it is a little bit of pain to get a good smooth application with the included spatula but I am not sure if the single dot method would work with that paste.


----------



## phillyd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> For one thing, I don't know if that paste with diamond nanoparticles would scratch the die or not, but I am not sure it is worth the risk. The main issue, however, is what has been posted in here ten thousand times, and that is you need a liquid metal TIM on the die to get the best temps and avoid pump out over time.
> 
> As far as applying to the IHS, I have not used it myself, but from what I read it is a little bit of pain to get a good smooth application with the included spatula but I am not sure if the single dot method would work with that paste.


Thanks for the warning, I just heard this on facebook from a friend, I'll be getting CLU for the die then.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Mostly because the temp drop from normal TIM to CLU isn't that significant between the IHS and the cooler (unlike the die to IHS) , so it isn't worth the hassle.


What hassle? This is what I don't get. Why risk removing the the IHS if you aren't going to go for the best possible temps?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> My Cpu cooler cost 150$ id rather not go sanding on it if i do not have to lol.
> 
> Pk-1 performs very close to CL Liquid Ultra between IHS and a Heatsink.


Why would you have to sand your heatsink? It's not like you have to replace the the TIM regularly. Apply it and leave it. It will last the life of the chip.

I'm going to run some comparisons between liquid metal vs regular pastes (I have quite a few) to show the benefit of using liquid metal on the IHS. This is OCN after all, every degree matters


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Thanks for the warning, I just heard this on facebook from a friend, I'll be getting CLU for the die then.


Old man beat me to it.....


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> What hassle? This is what I don't get. Why risk removing the the IHS if you aren't going to go for the best possible temps?
> Why would you have to sand your heatsink? It's not like you have to replace the the TIM regularly. Apply it and leave it. It will last the life of the chip.
> 
> I'm going to run some comparisons between liquid metal vs regular pastes (I have quite a few) to show the benefit of using liquid metal on the IHS. This is OCN after all, every degree matters


Because my heatsink is a water block and idvrather not sand on it if i do not have to.

I also will use it in my next main system IB E or broad well.


----------



## justanoldman

I have testes several times and it comes out to about 2-3c better with CLU vs a standard TIM when used on top of the IHS. My IHS are lapped though, so someone with a larger gap between the IHS and their cooler might not get any improvement since a standard thick TIM might fill in any gaps better.

If you needed to RMA your cooler or sell it, you would need to remove any trace or stains left by whatever TIM you use. I can completely clean off AS5 in 60 seconds, but it takes me over a half hour of hard work with metal polish to completely remove any trace of CLU from just the cooler, and another half hour to clean the IHS if need be. That extra work is worth it to me so I use it, but I can see why some not running their max oc, and thus already reasonably low temps might not bother.


----------



## Hokies83

Big Diff between Pk-1 and AS-5 lol


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I don't understand why people recommend against using a liquid metal TIM on top of the heatsink. You have just cut the heat sink off to improve temperature so why not use the option that performs best? The warranty is void already and if you're worried about resale value, if someone is willing to buy a de-lidded chip they aren't going to be fussy about the writing on the top of the heat spreader. Also, the liquid metal is going to last the life of the chip so I see no valid reason not to use it.


Except I can (and did) relid my cpu and put it up on ebay as a normal cpu with a much larger audience than one that looks trashed.

On a different topic, I don't see any advantage to 1-2C lower temps with TIM vs liquid metal on the IHS. I'm running 20C cooler than people running normal water setups and it didn't improve my max OC at all.


----------



## stickg1

I used Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond TIM on the die before. It's really similar to that nano diamond stuff in the picture a few posts up, even comes with the same spactula. For on the die I just put a tiny line, pressed the IHS down on the die and made sure it covered. On top of the IHS I use a slightly thicker line doing along where the die is under the lid. It's decent TIM, I meant to do a longer test on the pump-out effect. After one month of folding for 18 hours and turning the PC off for or not folding for 6 hours I had no pump out at all. It was only a month though. I think I sold that chip, can't remember if I replaced the TIM with LM or not, oh well. It was locally so if something happens the guy will likely call me.

Oh yeah, the nano diamond compound took 8C off my load temps, CLP took 20C off, so LM is a no brainer. And no it did not scratch the die.


----------



## phillyd

Yeah well the 12C is worth using the CLU


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Yeah well the 12C is worth using the CLU


Definitely, I did the Antec 7 as an experiment to simulate pump-out. But forgot about it, lol. But the month while I was actually checking there was no significant rise in temp. Whoops


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in as well!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I run 4.5 Giggles as when you actually stress the CPU during something you don't wanna get it toasty I dare you to run IBT and tell me what your temps are then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (just kidding temps will soar) but those vcores for your 4.5 is at a good place for normal usage keep it there.


Those temps are prime95. Ran IBT and maxed at 68c


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Those temps are prime95. Ran IBT and maxed at 68c


Very nice!


----------



## adamlee05

Any way I can join? Didn't take any pictures during the process, but I'd say this speaks for itself:



OCN name: adamleed05
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: 100
OC after delid: 4900
Temp drops: ~25c @ 4.8Ghz OC
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2840563


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adamlee05*
> 
> Any way I can join? Didn't take any pictures during the process, but I'd say this speaks for itself:
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: adamleed05
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 100
> OC after delid: 4900
> Temp drops: ~25c @ 4.8Ghz OC
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2840563


You're in! Now tote that Sig like you use Teemo shrooms!


----------



## adamlee05

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in! Now tote that Sig like you use Teemo shrooms!


I Gotchu!!!


----------



## Leyaena

What do you guys think of this layout for my watercooling loop?



CPU: Delidded 4770k
CPU block: EK-Supremacy Clean CSQ - Acetal

GPU: MSI GTX 780
GPU block: EK-FC Titan SE - Acetal

Pump: Laing DDC-1T Plus 12V DC Pump
Res: EK-RES X3 250
Radiator: EK-CoolStream RAD XTX (480)


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> What do you guys think of this layout for my watercooling loop?
> 
> 
> 
> CPU: Delidded 4770k
> CPU block: EK-Supremacy Clean CSQ - Acetal
> 
> GPU: MSI GTX 780
> GPU block: EK-FC Titan SE - Acetal
> 
> Pump: Laing DDC-1T Plus 12V DC Pump
> Res: EK-RES X3 250
> Radiator: EK-CoolStream RAD XTX (480)


Negative, res should physically be above the pump!

You don't want it sucking air!

Other then that you can pretty will stick everything else however you want


----------



## Leyaena

On second thought, I made a topic about it here:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1404001/watercooling-loop-layout-advice#post_20268231

Put an updated design in there, with the res over the pump this time.
So the flow direction/order is okay like that?


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> On second thought, I made a topic about it here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1404001/watercooling-loop-layout-advice#post_20268231
> 
> Put an updated design in there, with the res over the pump this time.
> So the flow direction/order is okay like that?


Honestly as long as the pump is being fed water and not air, it doesn't really matter which way everything else goes.
Whatever works out easier / cleaner to tube up









I'm sure you will change your plans once you actually begin to put everything in and realise it doesn't quick work as well as you thought lol.
Usually a good idea to grab an extra couple of 45's and a 90 or two just in case of a change in plans (made the difference between completing my first loop in one go and having to wait a few days for more fittings with no pc lol)


----------



## dr/owned

^^ True dat. My build started in my head with 1-2 right angle fittings and ended with 20 or so. Couldn't avoid it because the tubing is just too stiff.


----------



## self_slaughter

Yeah, When I built my first loop I ordered 2 extra 45's and 2 extra 90's and without em I wouldn't of been able to get my machine up and running that night. (was in a mad rush due to having a clan match on that night!)
As is, it wasn't pretty but it was the only way I could make it work with what I had, without em I would of been screwed!

My main mistake was getting what I thought was in and out on the pump backwards and completely ruining all of my plans lol










Starting off with good intentions.


Rapidly failing


*facepalm*


----------



## Leyaena

In the thread I made, someone suggested to go res > pump > Rad > gpu > cpu > top res.
What do you guys think of that idea?



My main concerns would be wether cooling gets effected, since you basically:

_let fluid rest -> send it out into the loop -> cool it_
rather than
_cool fluid -> let it rest -> send it out into the loop again_

Also, would it affect noise production/aestethics to let the loop come into the reservoir from the top, do you think?


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> In the thread I made, someone suggested to go res > pump > Rad > gpu > cpu > top res.
> What do you guys think of that idea?
> 
> My main concerns would be wether cooling gets effected, since you basically:


It makes almost zero difference. The water travels too fast to really heat up from one component to the next and affect the next components temperature.
Just tube it however works out easiest


----------



## dr/owned

You really do want to go pump->rad->cpu if possible. I have temperature sensors on my inlet and outlet, and idle the outlet is 3C hotter than the inlet (I'm running two D5 pumps in series, but one of them is just for my 25' of tubing and 90 degree restrictions). Under load the temperature difference was 6C or more.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> On second thought, I made a topic about it here:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1404001/watercooling-loop-layout-advice#post_20268231
> 
> Put an updated design in there, with the res over the pump this time.
> So the flow direction/order is okay like that?


...there are different ways of doing these things







, but as already mentioned by others...reservoir(s) should always be near and slightly above the pump(s)...for max efficiency, I use a setup whereby rad-'cool' outlet >> reservoir >> pump >> CPU >> rad-'hot'...essentially, you want max pressure right before the most restrictive bit (in this case CPU w-c block)

...the pic below is of a singular 'siamesed' system serving both a 3970X and a delidded 3770K (up to 5.25GHz and 5.3GHz benching respectively)...now adding a second (separate) loop for 2x 7990s, but with the same sequence, rad-'cold' >>reservoir >>pump >> GPU

Good luck with the w-c - great fun and also very good for component longevity if oc'ed
















EDIT - as an FYI, that 'contraption' below is the lay-out and functionality testing of a 'deskputer'-build...awaiting the separate GPU loop


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *adamlee05*
> 
> Any way I can join? Didn't take any pictures during the process, but I'd say this speaks for itself:
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: adamleed05
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 100
> OC after delid: 4900
> Temp drops: ~25c @ 4.8Ghz OC
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2840563


nice 4770k you got there i think that is the best one ive seen









im sure u can get to 5ghz


----------



## purekhaos

Hello! Came by to say thank you for the wealth of information. I would love to join, but I didn't record all of the relevant information. Any way a mod could PM me and maybe we can work something out?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *purekhaos*
> 
> Hello! Came by to say thank you for the wealth of information. I would love to join, but I didn't record all of the relevant information. Any way a mod could PM me and maybe we can work something out?


I be not a mod but I am the owner of this club







so send me a PM and ill answer in about an. Hour as im at work and we can work things out







(I wanna be a mod though







) ((eh hem mods







))


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *purekhaos*
> 
> Hello! Came by to say thank you for the wealth of information. I would love to join, but I didn't record all of the relevant information. Any way a mod could PM me and maybe we can work something out?
> 
> 
> 
> I be not a mod but I am the owner of this club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so send me a PM and ill answer in about an. Hour as im at work and we can work things out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I wanna be a mod though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) ((eh hem mods
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ))
Click to expand...

Being a mod's got some work to it.







I wanted to be a mod too. Haha. But to be honest, it isn't too hard to take off your CPU cooler and then take a picture of the delidded chip.


----------



## purekhaos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Being a mod's got some work to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wanted to be a mod too. Haha. But to be honest, it isn't too hard to take off your CPU cooler and then take a picture of the delidded chip.


It's the reapplication and cleaning of the Tim I dont want to deal with. Also, the tubing for my watercooling is tight. It's possible to do without bleeding, but definitely not something I want to do.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I be not a mod but I am the owner of this club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so send me a PM and ill answer in about an. Hour as im at work and we can work things out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I wanna be a mod though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) ((eh hem mods
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ))
> 
> 
> 
> Being a mod's got some work to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wanted to be a mod too. Haha. But to be honest, it isn't too hard to take off your CPU cooler and then take a picture of the delidded chip.
Click to expand...

"*Beware of what you wish for* in youth, because you will get it in middle life."
Goethe (1749 - 1832)
_It's not "an old Chinese proverb"_


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> "*Beware of what you wish for* in youth, because you will get it in middle life."
> Goethe (1749 - 1832)
> _It's not "an old Chinese proverb"_


That's why I choose wisely in my wishes, I decided on that goal when I realized just how great this forum is and the people on it. That's why I made this club, simply to help others as that is the best reward anyone can ask for is seeing someone else profit from your guidance/experience and taking nothing for it.

I may be a happy go lucky kind of person but that's what the world needs is caring people that can be stern when needed, to me charisma is everything, not your past, but who you are at the core. Simple as that really









(Don't judge me if this doesn't make sense 14 hour work shift and 4 hours of sleep, insomnia's gonna kill me eventually I swear







)


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*


I see your 2 pumps and raise you a 3rd:


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> "*Beware of what you wish for* in youth, because you will get it in middle life."
> Goethe (1749 - 1832)
> _It's not "an old Chinese proverb"_


...Goethe and 'middle life' was one thing, but apparently he 'chased' a 17teen year old when he was close to his 80ies (...she got away...)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I see your 2 pumps and raise you a 3rd:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


...ahem, it's *4 pumps* ...pic just showed CPU loop, now there is a GPU loop w/2 more MPC 655s for the 2x 7990s - can never have enough pumps


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> "*Beware of what you wish for* in youth, because you will get it in middle life."
> Goethe (1749 - 1832)
> _It's not "an old Chinese proverb"_


It's not Goethe either. If you search Goethe quotes in German, the language he spoke and wrote in, there's nothing like that there.


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> I see your 2 pumps and raise you a 3rd:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...ahem, it's *4 pumps* ...pic just showed CPU loop, now there is a GPU loop w/2 more MPC 655s for the 2x 7990s - can never have enough pumps
Click to expand...

Your build log confuses me. Are you putting 3 computers on 1 loop, because that's really the only way I can see the need for 4 pumps? I've got 30 feet of tubing and 20 right angle fittings along with a 1/2"->3/8" VRM block restriction. 2 pumps was adequate, the 3rd was overkill.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Your build log confuses me. Are you putting 3 computers on 1 loop, because that's really the only way I can see the need for 4 pumps? I've got 30 feet of tubing and 20 right angle fittings along with a 1/2"->3/8" VRM block restriction. 2 pumps was adequate, the 3rd was overkill.


...one of these days, I'll actually update that build log







...had been waiting for the two EK water blocks for the two 7990s which now arrived...GPU loop is completely separate from CPU loop for performance reasons and has its own siamesed system with 2 pumps, 2x RX 360/60 + 1x Black Ice 160/60 - carbon copy of CPU loop


----------



## dr/owned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Your build log confuses me. Are you putting 3 computers on 1 loop, because that's really the only way I can see the need for 4 pumps? I've got 30 feet of tubing and 20 right angle fittings along with a 1/2"->3/8" VRM block restriction. 2 pumps was adequate, the 3rd was overkill.
> 
> 
> 
> ...one of these days, I'll actually update that build log
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...had been waiting for the two EK water blocks for the two 7990s which now arrived...GPU loop is completely separate from CPU loop for performance reasons and has its own siamesed system with 2 pumps, 2x RX 360/60 + 1x Black Ice 160/60 - carbon copy of CPU loop
Click to expand...

I'm all for overkill, but just realize that you're not going to gain more than 1-2C temp difference running fully independent loops vs. a single loop (which won't make any difference for oc-ing), but you effectively double the cost and space requirement.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> "*Beware of what you wish for* in youth, because you will get it in middle life."
> Goethe (1749 - 1832)
> _It's not "an old Chinese proverb"_


...Goethe and 'middle life' was one thing, but apparently he 'chased' a 17teen year old when he was close to his 80ies (...she got away...)







[/quote]

Does that mean it no longer matters what you wish for after youth?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> It's not Goethe either. If you search Goethe quotes in German, the language he spoke and wrote in, there's nothing like that there.


Maybe I was mislead by the anglo interweb:
http://jamie.workingagenda.com/blog/2010/06/12/who-said-be-careful-what-you-wish-for/
http://www.tree.org/advice.htm
http://books.google.com.au/books?id=3zr59A1WnTkC&pg=PT245&lpg=PT245&dq=Beware+of+what+you+wish+for+goethe&source=bl&ots=XktFTwRFBS&sig=Ppo1ZrHCy9iJMyb0T2iyf5ovKso&hl=en&sa=X&ei=1PPKUfv4CcHbkQW76YDgAg&ved=0CEUQ6AEwBQ


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Maybe I was mislead by the anglo interweb:
> http://jamie.workingagenda.com/blog/2010/06/12/who-said-be-careful-what-you-wish-for/
> http://www.tree.org/advice.htm
> http://books.google.com.au/books?id=3zr59A1WnTkC&pg=PT245&lpg=PT245&dq=Beware+of+what+you+wish+for+goethe&source=bl&ots=XktFTwRFBS&sig=Ppo1ZrHCy9iJMyb0T2iyf5ovKso&hl=en&sa=X&ei=1PPKUfv4CcHbkQW76YDgAg&ved=0CEUQ6AEwBQ


Indeed, none of those offer a citation, just the words and his name with it.

Many wise things he actually said are highlighted here http://de.wikiquote.org/wiki/Johann_Wolfgang_von_Goethe


----------



## alancsalt

In which case there may be no reliable attribution for that proverb at all. I guess.


----------



## Hokies83

Made Video of what CL Liquid Ultra does to your fancy 100$ + full cover gpu block.


----------



## justanoldman

^Seriously?
How many times do I have to post the same thing?
That video is completely wrong, telling people to sand it off is more than irresponsible. If you can't be bothered to buy a $3 bottle of metal polish and spend a decent amount of time getting every spec of it off then, no you should not use CLU, leave it for the big boys.
Before:


After:


Same thing applies to gpu blocks.


----------



## dr/owned

Sorry, dumb question: isn't metal polish just liquid sandpaper with a finer grit?

I'd be concerned that any polishing is going to jack up the flatness of the surface, which is possibly more important than some faint etchings caused by CLU.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> ^Seriously?
> How many times do I have to post the same thing?
> That video is completely wrong, telling people to sand it off is more than irresponsible. If you can't be bothered to buy a $3 bottle of metal polish and spend a decent amount of time getting every spec of it off then, no you should not use CLU, leave it for the big boys.
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> Same thing applies to gpu blocks.


Hate to tell you old fellow...

But im a much much bigger boy then you.

Metal polish is just liquid Sand paper.....

And who knows what else.. and the long term effects it could cause.

So ill use my 50 cent piece of sand paper and take 10 mins and get it off.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Sorry, dumb question: isn't metal polish just liquid sandpaper with a finer grit?
> 
> I'd be concerned that any polishing is going to jack up the flatness of the surface, which is possibly more important than some faint etchings caused by CLU.


On what basis would you presume liquid ammonium hydroxide (metal polish) would scratch a metal surface more than sand paper?


----------



## Hokies83

The video was to show those wanting to use it on a heatsink that normal removal methods do not work.

To be ready for it.. not everybody has 2000 Grit plus sand paper or metal polish in there closet.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> The video was to show those wanting to use it on a heatsink that normal removal methods do not work.
> 
> To be ready for it.. not everybody has 2000 Grit plus sand paper or metal polish in there closet.


Answer the question I already posted, how does ammonium hydroxide scratch a metal surface more than fine grit sandpaper? Off topic, but I would seriously doubt you are bigger than me in any sense, so I would suggest being a little more careful.


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Answer the question I already posted, how does ammonium hydroxide scratch a metal surface more than fine grit sandpaper? Off topic, but I would seriously doubt you are bigger than me in any sense, so I would suggest being a little more careful.


I bet in most sense i am bigger then you..

The h220 kit does not make u a big WC player.

My 25 rads 8 pumps 6 res and over 100 fittings does however...

Not to mention my 6 systems









I was a Concrete finisher before i destroyed my Shoulder.. so i had quite the gorilla arms..

My arms are smaller now but still 2-3x the size of the Avg joe.

Not that im using all that WC gear.. but if somebody is selling cheap ill buy it... I guess ive become a pc WC part collector of sorts...

One day i may just make the real Ultimate Water cooled pc...

Not in a case.. but a whole room wil be my case with rads mounted all over the walls and such..... Would be cool...

I just hate breaking down my rigs atm because down time is money lost to me.. and i hate that.


----------



## dr/owned

Reading: http://www.ehow.com/list_7803229_ingredients-metal-polish.html it seems metal polish is more like metal cleaner that contains no abrasives. If this is correct, then this would imply that the markings CLU leaves behind aren't physically damaging the metal? Or is metal polish harsh enough that it dissolves a small amount of the surface of whatever it's being used on?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I bet in most sense i am bigger then you..
> 
> The h220 kit does not make u a big WC player.
> 
> My 25 rads 8 pumps 6 res and over 100 fittings does however...
> 
> Not to mention my 6 systems
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was a Concrete finisher before i destroyed my Shoulder.. so i had quite the gorilla arms..
> 
> My arms are smaller now but still 2-3x the size of the Avg joe.
> 
> Not that im using all that WC gear.. but if somebody is selling cheap ill buy it... I guess ive become a pc WC part collector of sorts...
> 
> One day i may just make the real Ultimate Water cooled pc...
> 
> Not in a case.. but a whole room wil be my case with rads mounted all over the walls and such..... Would be cool...
> 
> I just hate breaking down my rigs atm because down time is money lost to me.. and i hate that
> 
> 
> .


I don't have a ludicrously childish ego like some in this club (and no I am not talking about you), so if I am incorrect about something then I would be much obliged to those providing correct information but it needs to be verifiable not opinion.

OT:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



I am not sure spending an irrelevant amount of money on computers makes you bigger. When you post pics of your seven figure house let me know







. Last time I checked the SWAT team instructors I trained with didn't put too much importance on biceps. But hey, if you can bench over 300 and run the 100 in 11 sec too, then we have something in common. I think people around here should spend less time telling others how great they are and more time being a good dad, that's the hardest job any of us will ever have.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dr/owned*
> 
> Reading: http://www.ehow.com/list_7803229_ingredients-metal-polish.html it seems metal polish is more like metal cleaner that contains no abrasives. If this is correct, then this would imply that the markings CLU leaves behind aren't physically damaging the metal? Or is metal polish harsh enough that it dissolves a small amount of the surface of whatever it's being used on?


I can say that the metal polish I use has ammonium hydroxide and as such is not very abrasive at all, that is the ingredient of many household cleaners. Not being a chemist I can't say if it does something on the microscopic level, but having used very fine grit sandpaper to lap both my chips, and having used the metal polish over 10 times now on multiple coolers, chips, and gpu blocks I can say that, to me, there isn't really a comparison - the sand paper is much, much more abrasive.

You would definitely not want to leave any of the metal polish on anything though, which is why I have posted in the past that you have to spend time completely cleaning any residue of it with 90%+ isopropyl alcohol. Lapping your cooler usually voids the warranty, while using metal polish to remove CLU leaves not marks, stains, or evidence that it was used.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Next topic!. So has anyone tried to convince Coollaboratory to have stuff in stock, in North America? I paid $25.00 for CLU off ebay and waiting 6-8 days for it to get here. Really isn't much difference if i order it off their website either.

#ihatemylife, I won't even have my main pc up and running until next Thursday :/. Wonder if i should do some modding in the mean time. But on the bright side i'm looking forward to 25-20c temp drops once i apply it.

There are a few small nicks on the side of my IHS lid from the razor blade briefly slipping. Can i gently sand those down without much worry?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Also is it safe for 90%+ isopropyl alcohol to touch the CPU die to clean off the existing tim?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> Next topic!. So has anyone tried to convince Coollaboratory to have stuff in stock, in North America? I paid $25.00 for CLU off ebay and waiting 6-8 days for it to get here. Really isn't much difference if i order it off their website either.
> 
> #ihatemylife, I won't even have my main pc up and running until next Thursday :/. Wonder if i should do some modding in the mean time. But on the bright side i'm looking forward to 25-20c temp drops once i apply it.
> 
> There are a few small nicks on the side of my IHS lid from the razor blade briefly slipping. Can i gently sand those down without much worry?


Where exactly are the nicks on the IHS? I would assume they are on the bottom, but you can lap the bottom of the IHS pretty easy if you want. If they are in place that is not contacting anything they shouldn't matter though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> Also is it safe for 90%+ isopropyl alcohol to touch the CPU die to clean off the existing tim?


If it is dangerous then we are all in a lot of trouble.
It is fine to use it on the die and pcb, it works well to remove the Intel TIM.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Where exactly are the nicks on the IHS? I would assume they are on the bottom, but you can lap the bottom of the IHS pretty easy if you want. If they are in place that is not contacting anything they shouldn't matter though.
> If it is dangerous then we are all in a lot of trouble.
> It is fine to use it on the die and pcb, it works well to remove the Intel TIM.


They're right on the sides of the IHS, where the top meets the bottom. On the edges of the IHS so to speak. I have 8 days of waiting so i guess i might as well start watching tv and gently start sanding them out


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> They're right on the sides of the IHS, where the top meets the bottom. On the edges of the IHS so to speak. I have 8 days of waiting so i guess i might as well start watching tv and gently start sanding them out


I lapped the top and bottom of my IHS, but honestly I don't think it made much difference which is why I recommend people really test their IHS to see if lapping is necessary before they do it. For yours though, it sounds like they are on the side which wouldn't be touching anything, so I wouldn't think you need to do anything - unless you just want to.

As long as the scratches or marks would not interfere with the bracket of your mobo touching the wings of the IHS, or are on top where your cooler touches the IHS they shouldn't matter.


----------



## scorpscarx

Hey just posting in to say I have a new cooler en route, and since my 3570K IHS isn't perfect anymore, was just wondering if anyone that went the razor route and has a perfect one would sell and ship it in the US. Thanks.

Just to say, mine has a sharp edge and is slightly warped, I am hoping being seated under my current sink will flatten it, we shall see.


----------



## strokercrate

I was wondering....

When I took off the IHS off the PCB there was one spot open from the black silicon sealant. I suspect this acted as a thermal relief.

If that is the case, when you delid remove the silicon sealant apply CLU/CLP directly to die and replace the IHS although this creates a better contact and also gain the Liquid metal benefit of heat transfer which does drastically lower temps. Wouldn't you now also be creating a heat pocket under the IHS seeing that it is now directly on the PCB without thermal relief spot?

Do you think the temps would decrease more if you filed a notch in one side on the bottom lip of the IHS allowing for thermal relief, or maybe even two notches giving a cross flow of air around the die?

Could be wrong, just a thought, wanted to see what more experienced people think about it.


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> buy a $3 bottle of metal polish and spend a decent amount of time getting every spec of it off.


Hi *justanoldman*!!

Tomorrow I'll be getting my H220 and I would like to re-do the CLU application on the die, and that leads me to this question for you.
¿What metal polish brand do you recommend to get the job done?
I really want to get things done the best way possible, and that includes using (if I can get it) the same products you use









I don't live in the US, but I can try to find whatever product you use (or one with identical chemical composition)









Thanks in advance for your help


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> I was wondering....
> 
> When I took off the IHS off the PCB there was one spot open from the black silicon sealant. I suspect this acted as a thermal relief.
> 
> If that is the case, when you delid remove the silicon sealant apply CLU/CLP directly to die and replace the IHS although this creates a better contact and also gain the Liquid metal benefit of heat transfer which does drastically lower temps. Wouldn't you now also be creating a heat pocket under the IHS seeing that it is now directly on the PCB without thermal relief spot?
> 
> Do you think the temps would decrease more if you filed a notch in one side on the bottom lip of the IHS allowing for thermal relief, or maybe even two notches giving a cross flow of air around the die?
> 
> Could be wrong, just a thought, wanted to see what more experienced people think about it.


When you place the IHS on the delidded chip you will notice that you can actually spin the IHS around without it touching the PCB. The clamping force of the mobo is really pushing the IHS on the die, not so much the IHS on the PCB. That doesn't mean a notch in the IHS wouldn't allow for more heat to escape but I have not heard of anyone trying that with success. I would be surprised if that helped much - even going direct die gives a few c better but nothing dramatic.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> Hi *justanoldman*!!
> 
> Tomorrow I'll be getting my H220 and I would like to re-do the CLU application on the die, and that leads me to this question for you.
> ¿What metal polish brand do you recommend to get the job done?
> I really want to get things done the best way possible, and that includes using (if I can get it) the same products you use
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't live in the US, but I can try to find whatever product you use (or one with identical chemical composition)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance for your help


For the die you really don't need anything but 90%+ isopropyl alcohol. The die is not metal so CLU doesn't really stick to it. The metal polish is seen in the spoiler:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






But you should only need that if you want to clean up CLU when you use it on top of the IHS for your cooler, or on a gpu block. Depending on the length of time, and other factors, you may or may not have a dried buildup on the underside of the IHS. You will just have to see how well the alcohol cleans it up, and if it still seems there is any dried on CLU there then the metal polish would be helpful.


----------



## neofury

I finally got my liquid pro today.



Will probably buy the vice and block of wood in about 1.5 hours once I'm done work. Man I hope I pull this off, my intention is to tighten the vice around the IHS (but not too tight) and push the block of hard wood next to it and just start out with gentle taps. I'll have a pillow and maybe even a towel on the other side, might have a friend hold it up so it doesn't go flying anywhere.

After that I'm going to arcticlean it and use the liquid pro, I'm hoping for some major cooling improvements.


----------



## mercs213

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I finally got my liquid pro today.
> 
> 
> 
> Will probably buy the vice and block of wood in about 1.5 hours once I'm done work. Man I hope I pull this off, my intention is to tighten the vice around the IHS (but not too tight) and push the block of hard wood next to it and just start out with gentle taps. I'll have a pillow and maybe even a towel on the other side, might have a friend hold it up so it doesn't go flying anywhere.
> 
> After that I'm going to arcticlean it and use the liquid pro, I'm hoping for some major cooling improvements.


Don't lightly tap it! Hit it with some mild force like you are driving in a nail and don't be scared; it is hard to screw-up de-lidding via a vice! Also make sure the wood is hard. 2X4 is great. Enjoy your temps! I expect at minimum 15 - 20 C drop on all cores.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> Don't lightly tap it! Hit it with some mild force like you are driving in a nail and don't be scared; it is hard to screw-up de-lidding via a vice! Also make sure the wood is hard. 2X4 is great. Enjoy your temps! I expect at minimum 15 - 20 C drop on all cores.


I really hope I get at least 18-20c, I did notice some people got 30 but I'd imagine it's because of a lower OC like 4.5ghz or using a custom loop.

I've got the phanteks, I just want to push it to 5.0ghz







Thanks for the tips, I was actually going to slowly raise the force if light taps wasn't enough anyways. I just really hope I don't screw it up, would be a shame as my chip is already doing 4.8ghz at 1.3v stable.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

I feel like i'm 8 years old waiting for christmas to come. Its so painful staring at my pc right now :x


----------



## neofury

Oh man, delidding was so easy with a vice/hammer. Can't believe or two people weren't successful. I had to re-apply my AS5 to the top of the IHS and it will take time to cure, but thus far I'm seeing a 20c drop off my hottest core









To anyone who was worried about doing it, don't be. Tick tick tick pop, once I had it in the vice right. The hardest part was getting my cooler seated back on after which isn't related to delidding haha.

Best part is the temps are more stable. It went up to 67 sure, (prime95 90% ram) but it's mostly in the high 50s low 60s. Before it was hitting up to 88c when I had 3-5c lower ambient, with this ambient I was hitting 91-92c! The OC is identical, I had saved the profile.

Buy the vice, buy the CLP/CLU and do this if you haven't. It's a must. Will post temps after 1hr prime 95. Then after I'll try for 5.0ghz


----------



## neofury

OCN name: neofury
CPU: 3770K
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.8ghz
Temp drops: ~20c (As5 not cured yet tho)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2846059

Before:



After:



The AS5 hasn't cured yet and I may need a re-seat, but so far so good. Also ambient is like 3-5c higher now than when I did the before, its been scorching hot here.


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I was actually going to slowly raise the force if light taps wasn't enough anyways.


I used the vise method, it worked great but man my IHS was on there, I tried two different types of wood and had to hit it hard enough to pop the whole cpu out of the vise. To stop this I had to tighten it really hard which caused pressure notches in the side and top of my IHS which I had to sand. It was pretty concave so I lapped it while I was at it. But to finally break it free I had to use a 5" x3"x.75" piece of solid aluminum then hit pretty hard. It didn't fly off even with that, It just loosened it to where I had to pry it with a razor blade and cut a little of the sealant.

Anyone had a really hard one to knock off?


----------



## Spin Cykle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Anyone had a really hard one to knock off?


Mine took two re-seating sessions in the vise and 10-12 solid whacks of the hammer.


----------



## Joa3d43

*...on Liquid metal TIM choices; dangers etc.*

*@Valgaur,* some of this may (or may not







) be useful for *your OP*

1.) ...recently, our European operations folk sent me some extra info about liquid metals available there (like Coollaboratory Ultra and Pro, and others). While some of that info was quite esoteric (did you know that CL-U contains not only Gallium but also small amounts of Rhodium, Indium, Silver , Zinc etc ?), there also is another liquid metal TIM that apparently 'beats' CL-U (by a small margin, mind you).

That stuff is called 'Phoyba LM', and it only costs half as much, though its package contains far fewer accessories (ie no brushes or cleaning pads). While I am a staunch CL-U advocate for LM and MX4 for non-LM applications, it never hurts to see what else is available...I believe aquatuning.us ' might carry 'Phoyba LM' for the US & Canadian markets.

Here re some comparative tests (source: Hardwaremax.net) that also list some other of our favourite TIMs, so a nice comparative chart:



*2.)* Liquid Metals and Aluminum don't play nice together, whether that concerns CPU or GPU applications...many posters here already know this...but this YouTube video is quite instructive as to just HOW QUICKLY things go 'bad'...ie within 2 - 4 hrs...CL-U, CL-P and Phoyba LM should definitely be handled w/care and kept 'far, far away' from any aluminum...


----------



## dr/owned

I've always had the feeling CLU is gallium + some other elements to lower the melting point further so it can be spread at room temperature, where gallium by itself would still be solid.


----------



## Swag

I bought a new mouse pad that is literally in a overkill case...



And my dad surprised me with some Canadian IPA (Nova Scotia), its actually not half-bad. I am actually enjoying the taste of this one.


----------



## Zboy

do you guys have any idea what kind of container i could store some clp in? would a small glass jar be fine? i need to ship some clp with the proc i'm selling, but i still want to keep most of the clp for myself - i plan on emptying out the syringe into my own container, and leaving a few drops in the syringe to ship with the proc


----------



## dr/owned

I would go with plastic of some sort since that's what the syringe is made of.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zboy*
> 
> do you guys have any idea what kind of container i could store some clp in? would a small glass jar be fine? i need to ship some clp with the proc i'm selling, but i still want to keep most of the clp for myself - i plan on emptying out the syringe into my own container, and leaving a few drops in the syringe to ship with the proc


I honestly would purchase another syringe from online or in a medical store for a few cents and use that. You could use an air tight container that is relatively small in volume so the CLP doesn't actually stick onto the walls of it and you lose most of the CLP.

Now the 2 reasons why you should use another syringe is:
1) It is air tight and that means no reaction between the metal and air, causing it to either oxidize or dry out.
2) It is also in a syringe which means that when you need to use it again, it is ready for you to use. It also fixes the problem of you having to scrape some out from a different container if you were to use a jar as the storage media.


----------



## Zboy

alright, guess i'll get a syringe...though the last time my brother bought some, he got interrogated for a few minutes by the pharmacy staff. i'm afraid that i'll have to go through that too lol


----------



## dr/owned

I just bought my syringes from the same place a bunch of steroid abusing body builders do: http://www.bulksyringes.com/ .

Useful to precision apply thermal paste. I can do perfect X's. You might just tell the pharmacist that you're doing electronics work and need to handle a small amount of liquid.


----------



## Zboy

lol i just went down to my local pharmacy and got a 10 pack for 3 bucks. and i brought the clp package with me and immediately showed it to the pharmacist, so there was no interogation









on a side note - i've been priming my brand new 3770k @ 1.145 V, but it dips as low as 1.136 V in cpu-z. is that indicative of anything or would that be problematic at all?


----------



## Hokies83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...on Liquid metal TIM choices; dangers etc.*
> 
> *@Valgaur,* some of this may (or may not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) be useful for *your OP*
> 
> 1.) ...recently, our European operations folk sent me some extra info about liquid metals available there (like Coollaboratory Ultra and Pro, and others). While some of that info was quite esoteric (did you know that CL-U contains not only Gallium but also small amounts of Rhodium, Indium, Silver , Zinc etc ?), there also is another liquid metal TIM that apparently 'beats' CL-U (by a small margin, mind you).
> 
> That stuff is called 'Phoyba LM', and it only costs half as much, though its package contains far fewer accessories (ie no brushes or cleaning pads). While I am a staunch CL-U advocate for LM and MX4 for non-LM applications, it never hurts to see what else is available...I believe aquatuning.us ' might carry 'Phoyba LM' for the US & Canadian markets.
> 
> Here re some comparative tests (source: Hardwaremax.net) that also list some other of our favourite TIMs, so a nice comparative chart:
> 
> 
> 
> *2.)* Liquid Metals and Aluminum don't play nice together, whether that concerns CPU or GPU applications...many posters here already know this...but this YouTube video is quite instructive as to just HOW QUICKLY things go 'bad'...ie within 2 - 4 hrs...CL-U, CL-P and Phoyba LM should definitely be handled w/care and kept 'far, far away' from any aluminum...


http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=46_58_1108&products_id=36775


----------



## hellzlegend

That is pretty cheap compared to CLU.
I think I'll get the Phobya.
From a quick google search, http://www.overclock.net/t/1376460/liquid-metal-versus-non-metal-compounds-update
It seems performance is pretty much the same but $10 cheaper.


----------



## dr/owned

SetTitleMatchMode 1
SetTitleMatchMode Fast


----------



## akiles333

I just got my clu.. Is there anything i need to keep in mind while applying it? I need to apply it to the die and the underside of the ihs, right?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hokies83*
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=46_58_1108&products_id=36775


TX...

...here is another (similar) comparative table

ALSO NOTE: In some European reviews, it says that Phobya LM is relatively hard to get off, harder than removing / cleaning CL-U, while other reviewers rate removal more or less equal to CL-Pro - just s.th. to keep in mind, though its performance is obviously excellent, and the price is right

source hardwareluxx.de


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> OCN name: neofury
> CPU: 3770K
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz
> Temp drops: ~20c (As5 not cured yet tho)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2846059
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> 
> The AS5 hasn't cured yet and I may need a re-seat, but so far so good. Also ambient is like 3-5c higher now than when I did the before, its been scorching hot here.


I have you in good sir!







now slap the sig on and call it a day!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> *...on Liquid metal TIM choices; dangers etc.*
> 
> *@Valgaur,* some of this may (or may not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) be useful for *your OP*
> 
> 1.) ...recently, our European operations folk sent me some extra info about liquid metals available there (like Coollaboratory Ultra and Pro, and others). While some of that info was quite esoteric (did you know that CL-U contains not only Gallium but also small amounts of Rhodium, Indium, Silver , Zinc etc ?), there also is another liquid metal TIM that apparently 'beats' CL-U (by a small margin, mind you).
> 
> That stuff is called 'Phoyba LM', and it only costs half as much, though its package contains far fewer accessories (ie no brushes or cleaning pads). While I am a staunch CL-U advocate for LM and MX4 for non-LM applications, it never hurts to see what else is available...I believe aquatuning.us ' might carry 'Phoyba LM' for the US & Canadian markets.
> 
> Here re some comparative tests (source: Hardwaremax.net) that also list some other of our favourite TIMs, so a nice comparative chart:
> 
> 
> 
> *2.)* Liquid Metals and Aluminum don't play nice together, whether that concerns CPU or GPU applications...many posters here already know this...but this YouTube video is quite instructive as to just HOW QUICKLY things go 'bad'...ie within 2 - 4 hrs...CL-U, CL-P and Phoyba LM should definitely be handled w/care and kept 'far, far away' from any aluminum...


I agree on the listing as well! But i prefer the one below, easier to read simply.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> TX...
> 
> ...here is another (similar) comparative table
> 
> ALSO NOTE: In some European reviews, it says that Phobya LM is relatively hard to get off, harder than removing / cleaning CL-U, while other reviewers rate removal more or less equal to CL-Pro - just s.th. to keep in mind, though its performance is obviously excellent, and the price is right
> 
> source hardwareluxx.de


yeah dat one.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> I used the vise method, it worked great but man my IHS was on there, I tried two different types of wood and had to hit it hard enough to pop the whole cpu out of the vise. To stop this I had to tighten it really hard which caused pressure notches in the side and top of my IHS which I had to sand. It was pretty concave so I lapped it while I was at it. But to finally break it free I had to use a 5" x3"x.75" piece of solid aluminum then hit pretty hard. It didn't fly off even with that, It just loosened it to where I had to pry it with a razor blade and cut a little of the sealant.
> 
> Anyone had a really hard one to knock off?


Mine did take a few attempts for sure, but on the final attempt it was just like in the video. Chip didn't go flying it just popped off, and while I did have to tighten it a lot, it didn't dent my IHS.

My issue now is, the first time I seated it, no go. Second time I seated it, worked for a while but had freezes (although great temps).

This time I seated it again, no freezing issues but it has strange temps, pretty sure I mucked up the TIM job on the IHS though in my haste. Going to re-do it all tonight.

The chip is perfectly clean with no knicks or scratches. Has anyone else had issues like this when seating the chip??

I'm noticing the re-seat/re-TIM on the IHS has cost me 10c on 2 cores (middle two) where as the outside cores (1 + 4) are still giving me the 20c difference. I definitely need to get this re-done sigh. I hope it seats properly once I get it done. Should I unplug everything, keep the chip in the mobo since it's seated properly, use alcohol to clean it while still clamped down, articclean 2 to remove the remaining residue and then re-seat my heatsink? Or should I just suck it up and take it all out and hope I get the CPU seated perfectly again? I'm getting annoyed haha


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zboy*
> 
> on a side note - i've been priming my brand new 3770k @ 1.145 V, but it dips as low as 1.136 V in cpu-z. is that indicative of anything or would that be problematic at all?


That's normal Vdroop, where the voltage sags a bit under really heavy loads. You can increase your setting for Load Line Calibration (LLC) to prevent it if it is causing you instability, otherwise don't worry about it.


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Mine did take a few attempts for sure, but on the final attempt it was just like in the video. Chip didn't go flying it just popped off, and while I did have to tighten it a lot, it didn't dent my IHS.
> 
> My issue now is, the first time I seated it, no go. Second time I seated it, worked for a while but had freezes (although great temps).
> 
> This time I seated it again, no freezing issues but it has strange temps, pretty sure I mucked up the TIM job on the IHS though in my haste. Going to re-do it all tonight.
> 
> The chip is perfectly clean with no knicks or scratches. Has anyone else had issues like this when seating the chip??
> 
> I'm noticing the re-seat/re-TIM on the IHS has cost me 10c on 2 cores (middle two) where as the outside cores (1 + 4) are still giving me the 20c difference. I definitely need to get this re-done sigh. I hope it seats properly once I get it done. Should I unplug everything, keep the chip in the mobo since it's seated properly, use alcohol to clean it while still clamped down, articclean 2 to remove the remaining residue and then re-seat my heatsink? Or should I just suck it up and take it all out and hope I get the CPU seated perfectly again? I'm getting annoyed haha


If you are using CLU or CLP did you put o the thin layer on the die and the IHS? I had to, if I didnt my temps weren't good nor even.

I would take the chip out.. To easy to spread the Liquid metal TIM to something it shouldn't be on that can cause a short.

I would check your pin's to see if there is one bent.. It shouldn't be that hard to seat. Make sure you hold your IHS while you close the cpu leaver as well


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> If you are using CLU or CLP did you put o the thin layer on the die and the IHS? I had to, if I didnt my temps weren't good nor even.


I spread a decent amount of CLP on the die (maybe too much? although before re-seating I was getting 20c off all cores not just 2) and AS5 on the IHS. I think when I re-did the AS5 in between reseating, I may have put too much.

I should probably be more clear. When I'm talking about seating it, I'm referring to seating the heatsink and the lid, not the CPU itself into the socket. It seems that not having the IHS on in a certain way, or having my CPU heat sink sitting on it applying the right pressure, is causing some issues.


----------



## Creator

I delidded a 3770K, and improved temperatures, but now I've got like a ~14C spread on my cores. Cores 0 - 3 are something like 60, 66, 70, 74 under p95 load at 4.8ghz. Where is Core 3 located on the die? I used a thin-layer of CLU so I'm thinking it's more likely poor seating of my block, so I'll try that first, but just in case it's not and I end up having to redo the CLU application...


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Creator*
> 
> I delidded a 3770K, and improved temperatures, but now I've got like a ~14C spread on my cores. Cores 0 - 3 are something like 60, 66, 70, 74 under p95 load at 4.8ghz. Where is Core 3 located on the die? I used a thin-layer of CLU so I'm thinking it's more likely poor seating of my block, so I'll try that first, but just in case it's not and I end up having to redo the CLU application...


After delidding you should have less than a 10c difference between your hottest and coolest core while stress testing. There will always be a spread, even if everything is perfect there is usually at least a 5c difference. Being over 10c difference means the heatsink isn't seated correctly or the TIM application on the die could be improved. It took me quite a few tries to get it right.

I believe core 3 is on the bottom, and cores 1 or 2 are normally the hottest. That would say your cooler is not making good contact on the lower part of the IHS, or the TIM on the die needs to be redone.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Creator*
> 
> I delidded a 3770K, and improved temperatures, but now I've got like a ~14C spread on my cores. Cores 0 - 3 are something like 60, 66, 70, 74 under p95 load at 4.8ghz. Where is Core 3 located on the die? I used a thin-layer of CLU so I'm thinking it's more likely poor seating of my block, so I'll try that first, but just in case it's not and I end up having to redo the CLU application...


...on my first delid / first re-seating, my 3770K's temps diverged by about 9 C...also keep in mind that Intel IHS tend to be more curved (concave) while AMD processors tend to be near-flat, so there is another variable (pressure on block and IHS) which plays a role....I finally ended up lapping the IHS both on the top and the underside as the concavity on my Ivy was quite severe...lapping does help with that, though doing so will take off the factory-edged markings and also the nickel coating. This gives the Liquid Metal TIMs a chance to 'stain' copper just a bit but that can be removed easily enough.









...have a look at the pic below re the arrows and core temps...you'll note totally even 'idle' and 'min' temps (done right after 'lapping'), but even so, there ia a 7 C variance on 'max' after running Cinebench - load temps will always diverge depending on the load on the individual core...another factor is whether you have iGPU on or not (ie via LucidMVP) as that means 'extra work' in a given spot of the CPU. For now.

I would try to reapply CL-U (even if it was perfect to begin with) and re-seat the IHS....the front OP of this thread has a piece by 'VonDutch' re the final steps of holding down the IHS as the locking mechanism *will try to move it*... bon chance


----------



## scorpscarx

Newest HWMonitor shows vid now makes it easier to find your offset, just fyi.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Guys I need some help here. I de-lidded my 3770k a few weeks ago, everything went fine. I used PK-1 on the die because its the best I had. Temps were great.

A few days later temps started hitting TJ-Max under load. I took everything apart, and found that a dry spot had developed on the die. I re-did the paste on the die, this time gently spreading with a plastic bag method to ensure all cores were covered. Once again, temps were great, even among all cores.

Now there is a 22 degree Celsius difference between core 1 and core 2, core 2 being the hotter one. Core 2 is reaching 95 degrees under load, all other cores at least 20 degrees below it.

The problem must lie in the paste I'm using, and contact between the die and IHS.

So please, tell me what to do. The pastes I have on hand are PK-1, AS-5, NT-H1, and Swiftech Tim-Mate.

I can't get CLU just yet, I will ASAP. For now what paste should I use, and how should I apply it to the die?

Notes- Top of IHS is lapped, but I have extensive experience wetsanding and polishing metals. It's lapped to 2000 grit, polished with mothers mag, then cleansed. I used a flat tempered glass sheet to ensure flatness. Cooler being used is H220.

Anyone who helps me gets much deserved rep. This is driving me insane.


----------



## .theMetal

I've never heard of the plastic bag method of spreading tim, but I probably wouldn't trust it. I bet you have an air bubble.

I would re-apply for now, but use the half of a grain of rice method(as apposed to the full grain of rice between the ihs and heatsink), let it spread its self out it will be nearly impossible for it to get a bubble.

and definitely expect this to happen again, where your temps randomly go up. it will be the problem until you get some clu, but I figure you already knew that


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Guys I need some help here. I de-lidded my 3770k a few weeks ago, everything went fine. I used PK-1 on the die because its the best I had. Temps were great.
> 
> A few days later temps started hitting TJ-Max under load. I took everything apart, and found that a dry spot had developed on the die. I re-did the paste on the die, this time gently spreading with a plastic bag method to ensure all cores were covered. Once again, temps were great, even among all cores.
> 
> Now there is a 22 degree Celsius difference between core 1 and core 2, core 2 being the hotter one. Core 2 is reaching 95 degrees under load, all other cores at least 20 degrees below it.
> 
> The problem must lie in the paste I'm using, and contact between the die and IHS.
> 
> So please, tell me what to do. The pastes I have on hand are PK-1, AS-5, NT-H1, and Swiftech Tim-Mate.
> 
> I can't get CLU just yet, I will ASAP. For now what paste should I use, and how should I apply it to the die?
> 
> Notes- Top of IHS is lapped, but I have extensive experience wetsanding and polishing metals. It's lapped to 2000 grit, polished with mothers mag, then cleansed. I used a flat tempered glass sheet to ensure flatness. Cooler being used is H220.
> 
> Anyone who helps me gets much deserved rep. This is driving me insane.


you had pump out baby!!! uuum what you could do it reapply PK-1 and give that a shot but with far less and try to spread it on the die for a more... even coating I suppose and then use the IHS yada yada and try to tighten it down a little less than normal and watch temps and get back to me


----------



## ucantescape1992

Here goes nothing. Going to shorten the lines on my H220 as well. If I don't post back in a day.....something's gone terribly wrong. Lol wish me luck guys.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Here goes nothing. Going to shorten the lines on my H220 as well. If I don't post back in a day.....something's gone terribly wrong. Lol wish me luck guys.


What about trying AS5 instead for now? It's a thick TIM so I figure it won't pump out as easily. Isn't PK-1 pretty liquidy?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> TX...
> 
> ...here is another (similar) comparative table
> 
> ALSO NOTE: In some European reviews, it says that Phobya LM is relatively hard to get off, harder than removing / cleaning CL-U, while other reviewers rate removal more or less equal to CL-Pro - just s.th. to keep in mind, though its performance is obviously excellent, and the price is right
> 
> source hardwareluxx.de


Thank you for posting! Been an advocate for Gelid Extreme for quite some time. In my experience and according to the graph posted( and many others) Gelid is the very best nonconductive tim readily available. Nano diamond is great, but scratches mirrored and lapped surfaces. Gelid is pretty viscous and does not pump out.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Thank you for posting! Been an advocate for Gelid Extreme for quite some time. In my experience and according to the graph posted( and many others) Gelid is the very best nonconductive tim readily available. Nano diamond is great, but scratches mirrored and lapped surfaces. Gelid is pretty viscous and does not pump out.


Gelid extreme is my favorite as well, good for air & water cooling, & is also the best paste for extreme cooling.


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Here goes nothing. Going to shorten the lines on my H220 as well. If I don't post back in a day.....something's gone terribly wrong. Lol wish me luck guys.


Before I got my CLP I used AS5. I had a similar problem when I used the bag and small rice method. The one that worked for me between the DIE and IHS is the line method it gave me a 8c drop from before delid and cores normalized with each other. (CLP gave me around 20c) When you get your CLP/CLU you may need to apply a thin layer to both the DIE and IHS, I had to.

Have you tried that one?


----------



## ucantescape1992

From what you guys have said I'm going to try the line method with AS5. I think the problem was the consistency of PK-1.


----------



## tw33k

Finally got the results of my new chip. Not bad at all



voltage measured with DMM


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Finally got the results of my new chip. Not bad at all
> 
> 
> 
> voltage measured with DMM


You lucky .... !

I should just start sending you money to get my cpus for me.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Finally got the results of my new chip. Not bad at all
> 
> 
> 
> voltage measured with DMM


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You lucky .... !
> 
> I should just start sending you money to get my cpus for me.


No kidding.... gimme that chip for a week tweek ill show it uber colds


----------



## dr/owned

SetTitleMatchMode 1
SetTitleMatchMode Fast


----------



## stickg1

Nice chip tweek! I still have my latest 3770K on stock cooler. I have all the parts for my custom waterloop but I been so busy lately. And the kids are away for a two weeks so me and the Mrs. have been partying more than normal


----------



## .theMetal

I'm jealous of your bad ass chips. mine takes 1.20v for 4.4ghz.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Wow, that's just amazing. I can't get past 4.6, been trying to get 4.7 for so long now.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You lucky .... !
> 
> I should just start sending you money to get my cpus for me.


I got real lucky. 2 really great chips both bought from the same place PC Case Gear


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Finally got the results of my new chip. Not bad at all
> 
> 
> 
> voltage measured with DMM


Nice man! Sure beats my 3570k at 1.53v for 5.0

I agree FTW420


----------



## ucantescape1992

Got everything back together, I used the line method and AS-5. Hopefully this will hold up until I can get some CLU.

How do these temps look? [email protected] AS-5 on die, PK-1 on IHS.



Edit: Sorry the original is 2560x1440


----------



## Gomi

Abort to dissect my 4770K - Which Way is recomended for Haswell, razor or vice? Have razor experience and i noticed the picture on the first post.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Abort to dissect my 4770K - Which Way is recomended for Haswell, razor or vice? Have razor experience and i noticed the picture on the first post.


I think the vise is better since you need to worry about both scratching the PCB and messing up the surface mount components using the razor with Haswell.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Abort to dissect my 4770K - Which Way is recomended for Haswell, razor or vice? Have razor experience and i noticed the picture on the first post.


Vise method is a no brainer! Not that you don't have to be careful, but that it is definately less risky. You'll be amazed at how easy it really is!


----------



## neofury

Just wanted to give an update.

I re-did my whole setup, put the CLP on again, put the AS5 on again and did it properly this time, re-seated the chip AND the IHS (properly this time) and then I put my cooler back on.

83-88-85-80c 4.8ghz v1.3 before delid (3-5c lower ambient)
63-66-68-65 4.8ghz v1.3 (3-5c higher ambient)

Essentially, I shaved off 23c~ not the 20c I originally posted (was 18c~ +2-3 ambient difference before =20, now its 23







)

Thanks for the guide and all the help guys. Will be repping the OP.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Just wanted to give an update.
> 
> I re-did my whole setup, put the CLP on again, put the AS5 on again and did it properly this time, re-seated the chip AND the IHS (properly this time) and then I put my cooler back on.
> 
> 83-88-85-80c 4.8ghz v1.3 before delid (3-5c lower ambient)
> 63-66-68-65 4.8ghz v1.3 (3-5c higher ambient)
> 
> Essentially, I shaved off 23c~ not the 20c I originally posted (was 18c~ +2-3 ambient difference before =20, now its 23
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Thanks for the guide and all the help guys. Will be repping the OP.


Glad everything went better this time!


----------



## akiles333

Guys, is 90C too much when i'm stress-testing? I'm at 4.9 ghz with 1.3 bios voltage and cpu-z is showing 1.336.. 5ghz is possible, but the temps are just too high.. I'm using an aio cooler, seidon 120xl, and i have a sff chassis with poor airflow, silverstone SG09. I going to save for a 350D and then i'll add in a costum loop.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Guys, is 90C too much when i'm stress-testing? I'm at 4.9 ghz with 1.3 bios voltage and cpu-z is showing 1.336.. 5ghz is possible, but the temps are just too high.. I'm using an aio cooler, seidon 120xl, and i have a sff chassis with poor airflow, silverstone SG09. I going to save for a 350D and then i'll add in a costum loop.


Have you delidded yet?

Looks like an awesome chip for that clock and voltage. Temps are definitely too high for normal operation for my taste.

If its not delidded it looks golden to do so.


----------



## SonDa5

*I just bought 4770k, batch number L312B152 made in Malaysia.

I will run it with a Gigabyte Z87X-OC motherboard.
*

Based on what some people at xtremesystems posted it looks like it may be a great batch number.

Once I test it out with the lid on I will decide to delid it or not.

Will test it out on a decent water cooled loop. What speed and voltage should I be looking at for good indication of worthiness for delidding?

With IB seemed like any chip under 1.2v for 4.5GHZ that was stable was a good chip to delid.

Your help is appreciated. I don't want to delid it unless it really is worthy.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Vise method is a no brainer! Not that you don't have to be careful, but that it is definately less risky. You'll be amazed at how easy it really is!


I was thinking about doing a hybrid method using razer on sides that are safe from resistor contact and then using the vice to break the transistor side. Has this been done yet?

By doing this I am hoping to not have to whack it so hard to break just 1 side of glue. I don't think applying blunt force to a sensitive CPU chip is a good idea.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Guys, is 90C too much when i'm stress-testing? I'm at 4.9 ghz with 1.3 bios voltage and cpu-z is showing 1.336.. 5ghz is possible, but the temps are just too high.. I'm using an aio cooler, seidon 120xl, and i have a sff chassis with poor airflow, silverstone SG09. I going to save for a 350D and then i'll add in a costum loop.


That depends on whom you ask. Rule of thumb is too keep stress testing temps below 95c, but that is a little high for me for 24/7 use. I think it would depend on what voltage you are running, and how you actually use the machine. If you are stressing it all the time with folding or something else then I would think you would want lower temps.

1.33v for 4.9 is great, a very nice chip, and with that low of voltage you don't have to worry so much about temps. Is 90c a Prime95 max temp on your hottest core, if so it is version 27.9, or is it some other stress test?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I was thinking about doing a hybrid method using razer on sides that are safe from resistor contact and then using the vice to break the transistor side. Has this been done yet?
> 
> By doing this I am hoping to not have to whack it so hard to break just 1 side of glue. I don't think applying blunt force to a sensitive CPU chip is a good idea.


You are going to be so surprised at how easy it is. I would just use the vise. The greatest risk is scratching the pcb. No razor, no scratch. Just put it in a vise. Make sure the vise won't move. Tighten vise on the cpu just a hint past it touching and make sure the cpu is firm. A piece of wood against the side of pcb and a few firm taps, viola. Check to see if its loose between taps. To ensure the pcb doesn't fly off, you could place a blanket on the non contact side on top of the edge of the cpu. Key is keeping everything firm. cpu in vise, hammer in hand, and wood against pcb. If you keep the wood firm against the pcb, the only blunt force is the hammer against the wood!


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Have you delidded yet?
> 
> Looks like an awesome chip for that clock and voltage. Temps are definitely too high for normal operation for my taste.
> 
> If its not delidded it looks golden to do so.


Yeah, it's delidded.. It's the cooler and the chassis that holds it back.. Had it at 4.5 ghz @ 85C before delid, and after it was at 60C.


----------



## tw33k

Test bench new 24/7 settings:


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Yeah, it's delidded.. It's the cooler and the chassis that holds it back.. Had it at 4.5 ghz @ 85C before delid, and after it was at 60C.


Too hot for my taste. I would look at doing custom water loop for it. What TIM are you using? IHS or direct die?


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Too hot for my taste. I would look at doing custom water loop for it. What TIM are you using? IHS or direct die?


I'm using clu on the die and mx-4 on the ihs. I'm only ok with the high temps because it's only when i'm running prime95 it's gonna hit it.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Too hot for my taste. I would look at doing custom water loop for it. What TIM are you using? IHS or direct die?


That's actually pretty good for 100% load in prime95.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> That's actually pretty good for 100% load in prime95.


It's decent for air cooling but it still seems hot to me.

I like to run as cool as possible.

Air heat sink with IHS on with clu on the die and mx-4 on the ihs isn't my forte so I'll add my final advice to help improve cooling.

I recommend direct die mount with CLP only with the best contact surface available from a light weight well made high quality copper water block for best ambient temp cooling.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> You are going to be so surprised at how easy it is. I would just use the vise. The greatest risk is scratching the pcb. No razor, no scratch. Just put it in a vise. Make sure the vise won't move. Tighten vise on the cpu just a hint past it touching and make sure the cpu is firm. A piece of wood against the side of pcb and a few firm taps, viola. Check to see if its loose between taps. To ensure the pcb doesn't fly off, you could place a blanket on the non contact side on top of the edge of the cpu. Key is keeping everything firm. cpu in vise, hammer in hand, and wood against pcb. If you keep the wood firm against the pcb, the only blunt force is the hammer against the wood!


I have experience using razer with IB and I feel confident and safe about using a razer. I don't feel safe about using the VICE because blunt impact force to a delicate CPU doesn't seem safe. With a razer you can see the damage done if any but when you apply blunt impact force the damage done on the inside can't be seen.

With Hybrid RAZER/VICE method I think that using razer on sides where Haswell resistors are not located and then using vice with less blunt impact force will help reduce possible unseen damage caused by the blunt impact force of the VICE method.

I would rather use the razer on all sides but I don't think I can get around not hitting the resistors.


----------



## Fiked

OCN name: Fiked
CPU: I5-3570k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 200Mhz
OC after delid: 4.6Ghz
Temp drops: 15C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2848242


----------



## TranquilTempest

I have a question about the die. It's my understanding that the dies are thinned by back grinding after a wafer is tested. Of the remaining thickness, how much is inert substrate, and how much is circuitry?

It's obvious the TIM change is the biggest reason for Ivy and Haswell's poor thermal dissipation, but even if it was due to the surface area of the die vs heat release, couldn't that be rendered irrelevant by making the die thinner?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TranquilTempest*
> 
> I have a question about the die. It's my understanding that the dies are thinned by back grinding after a wafer is tested. Of the remaining thickness, how much is inert substrate, and how much is circuitry?
> 
> It's obvious the TIM change is the biggest reason for Ivy and Haswell's poor thermal dissipation, but even if it was due to the surface area of the die vs heat release, couldn't that be rendered irrelevant by making the die thinner?


I can't answer your question about die thickness, but it was tested and confirmed some time ago that the temperature problem is not related to the TIM. It is the poor job Intel does with the black glue that holds down the IHS to the PCB.

It prevents the IHS from making good contact with the die, and thus interferes with the heat transfer process. By delidding we allow the IHS to come in contact with the die without the glue interfering. That is why you seem some chips with pretty good pre-delid temps and some chips with horrible temps.

My 3770k chips were 10c apart with the same cooling and oc pre-delid. The one with good temps was hard to delid because the IHS was very close the PCB, it was difficult to get the razor underneath. You could clearly see the difference in the one with bad temps, there was excess glue holding up the IHS, so it was easy to delid.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fiked*
> 
> OCN name: Fiked
> CPU: I5-3570k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 200Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.6Ghz
> Temp drops: 15C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2848242


You're in!







good temp drops as well pretty decent on the vcore


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I can't answer your question about die thickness, but it was tested and confirmed some time ago that the temperature problem is not related to the TIM. It is the poor job Intel does with the black glue that holds down the IHS to the PCB.
> 
> It prevents the IHS from making good contact with the die, and thus interferes with the heat transfer process. By delidding we allow the IHS to come in contact with the die without the glue interfering. That is why you seem some chips with pretty good pre-delid temps and some chips with horrible temps.
> 
> My 3770k chips were 10c apart with the same cooling and oc pre-delid. The one with good temps was hard to delid because the IHS was very close the PCB, it was difficult to get the razor underneath. You could clearly see the difference in the one with bad temps, there was excess glue holding up the IHS, so it was easy to delid.


That maybe true, but not in all cases such as mine. If you look back to my delid post, you'll notice I stated I could not even start the razor going under my IHS it would just cut into the IHS on the very bottom so I changed to the vise method. Also you would see how I mentioned mine was very hard to delid, even with the vise. So my IHS was sitting pretty much as low as a stock one can sit on the PCB, but after my delid with the temporary applied AS5 i dropped a little over 7c but once I applied the CLP I dropped around 20c.

Not saying its completely wrong. Just different cpu's react differently. The TIM itself may not be applied right from factory (maybe a air bubble or something else) so even a delid on a tight IHS could be a good thing, such as in my case.


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> I can't answer your question about die thickness, but it was tested and confirmed some time ago that the temperature problem is not related to the TIM. It is the poor job Intel does with the black glue that holds down the IHS to the PCB.
> 
> It prevents the IHS from making good contact with the die, and thus interferes with the heat transfer process. By delidding we allow the IHS to come in contact with the die without the glue interfering. That is why you seem some chips with pretty good pre-delid temps and some chips with horrible temps.
> 
> My 3770k chips were 10c apart with the same cooling and oc pre-delid. The one with good temps was hard to delid because the IHS was very close the PCB, it was difficult to get the razor underneath. You could clearly see the difference in the one with bad temps, there was excess glue holding up the IHS, so it was easy to delid.
> 
> 
> 
> That maybe true, but not in all cases such as mine. If you look back to my delid post, you'll notice I stated I could not even start the razor going under my IHS it would just cut into the IHS on the very bottom so I changed to the vise method. Also you would see how I mentioned mine was very hard to delid, even with the vise. So my IHS was sitting pretty much as low as a stock one can sit on the PCB, but after my delid with the temporary applied AS5 i dropped a little over 7c but once I applied the CLP I dropped around 20c.
> 
> Not saying its completely wrong. Just different cpu's react differently. The TIM itself may not be applied right from factory (maybe a air bubble or something else) so even a delid on a tight IHS could be a good thing, such as in my case.
Click to expand...

"it was tested and confirmed some time ago that the temperature problem is not related to the TIM"

I think you misunderstood the tests or the tests methodology was wrong. Those tests probably confirmed that the glue is a problem. I can confirm this from my own findings. However I would say this entire thread is pretty darn good confirmation that the TIM does matter and is part if not completely the problem.

I say it could be completely the problem because of the following.

That RTV (or whatever it is) that they use is also used on chips that are soldered... So either we are just lucky that we can get rid of the RTV and those soldered chips would have been so darn awesome if they hadn't used solder and we could have removed the RTV OR!!! The solder worked a lot better regardless of the RTV.

As for the RTV and it being the cause of the heat issues... well I say "less is more" as in less TIM is better than more TIM and the RTV causes it to have more TIM between the die and the lid. The fault is not the RTV as the RTV was used on the chips that didn't have TIM so the fault can't be completely laid on the RTV.

Regardless though there is proof that not all TIMs are created equal and typically manufacturers (GPU, CPU, laptop, desktop, game console) use cheap TIM. So using better TIM makes a big difference.

So while I don't disagree that the RTV makes the issue worse... regardless of whether or not you believe the RTV or the TIM is the major issue "is not related to the TIM" should not have been in the statement you made.


----------



## justanoldman

^You want to say FtW420 and almost every other person in this thread that has knowledge of the situation is wrong, feel free.

From post #18778 of this thread:
"The TIM intel uses is actually very good, as good or better than what most OCNers use. It's not liquid metal, but right up there with the best of the regular paste types.
The problem was mostly the gap between the die & IHS."
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/18770#post_20108765


----------



## Solonowarion

The problem was "mostly" the gap between the die and ihs.

You buy a car and the wheels are slightly uninflated.

The problem is just that. Tire pressure, not the tires itself. Properly inflating them will give you better results.

sure you can spend more money and get high performance tires but that isnt the issue.

Bad analogy but it makes sense to me.


----------



## steven88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> The problem was "mostly" the gap between the die and ihs.
> 
> You buy a car and the wheels are slightly uninflated.
> 
> The problem is just that. Tire pressure, not the tires itself. Properly inflating them will give you better results.
> 
> sure you can spend more money and get high performance tires but that isnt the issue.
> 
> Bad analogy but it makes sense to me.


Wheels can't be inflated or under inflated. I'm not sure what you're talking about









PS, I love lamp too


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *steven88*
> 
> Wheels can't be inflated or under inflated. I'm not sure what you're talking about
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS, I love lamp too


Tires! Lol my bad.


----------



## TranquilTempest

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> The problem was "mostly" the gap between the die and ihs.
> 
> You buy a car and the wheels are slightly uninflated.
> 
> The problem is just that. Tire pressure, not the tires itself. Properly inflating them will give you better results.
> 
> sure you can spend more money and get high performance tires but that isnt the issue.
> 
> Bad analogy but it makes sense to me.


You don't have to void your warranty to change your tire pressure.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> "it was tested and confirmed some time ago that the temperature problem is not related to the TIM"
> 
> I think you misunderstood the tests or the tests methodology was wrong. Those tests probably confirmed that the glue is a problem. I can confirm this from my own findings. However I would say this entire thread is pretty darn good confirmation that the TIM does matter and is part if not completely the problem.
> 
> I say it could be completely the problem because of the following.
> 
> That RTV (or whatever it is) that they use is also used on chips that are soldered... So either we are just lucky that we can get rid of the RTV and those soldered chips would have been so darn awesome if they hadn't used solder and we could have removed the RTV OR!!! The solder worked a lot better regardless of the RTV.
> 
> As for the RTV and it being the cause of the heat issues... well I say "less is more" as in less TIM is better than more TIM and the RTV causes it to have more TIM between the die and the lid. The fault is not the RTV as the RTV was used on the chips that didn't have TIM so the fault can't be completely laid on the RTV.
> 
> Regardless though there is proof that not all TIMs are created equal and typically manufacturers (GPU, CPU, laptop, desktop, game console) use cheap TIM. So using better TIM makes a big difference.
> 
> So while I don't disagree that the RTV makes the issue worse... regardless of whether or not you believe the RTV or the TIM is the major issue "is not related to the TIM" should not have been in the statement you made.


You can tolerate a much larger gap with solder than with TIM, because solder conducts heat so much better. So saying the glue isn't the problem because they use glue on soldered chips is pretty much a false conclusion.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> "it was tested and confirmed some time ago that the temperature problem is not related to the TIM"
> 
> I think you misunderstood the tests or the tests methodology was wrong. Those tests probably confirmed that the glue is a problem. I can confirm this from my own findings. However I would say this entire thread is pretty darn good confirmation that the TIM does matter and is part if not completely the problem.
> 
> I say it could be completely the problem because of the following.
> 
> That RTV (or whatever it is) that they use is also used on chips that are soldered... So either we are just lucky that we can get rid of the RTV and those soldered chips would have been so darn awesome if they hadn't used solder and we could have removed the RTV OR!!! The solder worked a lot better regardless of the RTV.
> 
> As for the RTV and it being the cause of the heat issues... well I say "less is more" as in less TIM is better than more TIM and the RTV causes it to have more TIM between the die and the lid. The fault is not the RTV as the RTV was used on the chips that didn't have TIM so the fault can't be completely laid on the RTV.
> 
> Regardless though there is proof that not all TIMs are created equal and typically manufacturers (GPU, CPU, laptop, desktop, game console) use cheap TIM. So using better TIM makes a big difference.
> 
> So while I don't disagree that the RTV makes the issue worse... regardless of whether or not you believe the RTV or the TIM is the major issue "is not related to the TIM" should not have been in the statement you made.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> ^You want to say FtW420 and almost every other person in this thread that has knowledge of the situation is wrong, feel free.
> 
> From post #18778 of this thread:
> "The TIM intel uses is actually very good, as good or better than what most OCNers use. It's not liquid metal, but right up there with the best of the regular paste types.
> The problem was mostly the gap between the die & IHS."
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/18770#post_20108765


I don't think anyone is wrong here, but I personally find it more plausible that tim vs. solder is more the issue. We are delidding and placing CLU on the die( very comparable to solder, both are metallic) and getting temps comparable to older cpu's that used solder( 2600k, 2700k). One thing that has changed in manufacture process between Sandy and Ivy is tim vs. solder. Also regarding the gap, I agree if there was a closer tolerance( less gap) the tim would have worked much better, but solder would have been better in either situation. It all depends how you look at it. I'm looking at overall solution, not just making the tim work solution. Hope that makes sense.


----------



## CAVO14

Completely new to this site and my first post







. I am going to delid my i5-3570k around friday when my CLP arrives. I plan to use the vice method which seems to be extremely easy to do as long as I don't whack it across the room. right now I'm at 4.4ghz with a vcore of 1.2 selected in the bios and also cpu-z says the same. I have an H100 and an AsRock z77 extreme4 . my temps on my cores were between 76-85. just replaced tim with as5, so it hasn't cured yet. Before i was getting less than 78. okay my questions are this. Should i put CLP on the die and ontop the IHS? how beneficial is lapping the processor and h100? and if I lap should i lap the ihs while it's still connected to the cpu or do it after i delid?


----------



## Forceman

Using CLP between the die and IHS makes a huge difference, but it makes a much smaller difference between the IHS and cooler, so a lot of people just use regular thermal paste there. And lapping doesn't tend to do as much good as it used to, so I wouldn't bother unless you were still getting really bad temps after delidding, and you eliminated all the other possible causes (bad TIM, bad contact pressure, etc).


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I was thinking about doing a hybrid method using razer on sides that are safe from resistor contact and then using the vice to break the transistor side. Has this been done yet?
> 
> By doing this I am hoping to not have to whack it so hard to break just 1 side of glue. I don't think applying blunt force to a sensitive CPU chip is a good idea.


Just use the vice trust me.

1) Buy 20$ vice with flat sides so it doesn't damage your CPU (not the kind with teeth)
2) Tighten it to the point where the IHS is not able to move at all (but not too tight)
3) Place block of wood next to the PCB, hold it steady
4) Tap wood with hammer, not too hard, but certainly not too weak either.

It pops off and is perfection. Don't risk using a razor on your CPU. This method is fool proof.


----------



## skupples

so, i was getting ready to finally submit my app when i noticed my CPU is idling allot warmer then it use to... I have 3570k at 4.6, 2 titans, 120.3 rad 120.2x 80thick rad...

I use to have cores as low as 10-15 degrees before putting my titan's in. Now my cores are idling closer to 30-35c

Is this from adding the Titans? Or is it more likely that the 10-15 degree readings i was getting at first were from a misreading sensor? I have fully reformatted my system since the last time i checked temps, so is it possible the reformat fixed a possible incorrect sensor reading?

My titans run just as cool as my 670ftw's did, but i guess thats only half the story.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> so, i was getting ready to finally submit my app when i noticed my CPU is idling allot warmer then it use to... I have 3570k at 4.6, 2 titans, 120.3 rad 120.2x 80thick rad...
> 
> I use to have cores as low as 10-15 degrees before putting my titan's in. Now my cores are idling closer to 30-35c
> 
> Is this from adding the Titans? Or is it more likely that the 10-15 degree readings i was getting at first were from a misreading sensor? I have fully reformatted my system since the last time i checked temps, so is it possible the reformat fixed a possible incorrect sensor reading?
> 
> My titans run just as cool as my 670ftw's did, but i guess its completely possible the titans are flooding the system with way more heat.


I would think it is obvious the titans are increasing your temps. I have my cpu on 1 loop and graphics card on another because of this exact thing. Also, being summer, the ambients are higher and you're not going to get get those cool winter temps. A lot of people have winter and summer oc settings because of this.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> It pops off and is perfection. Don't risk using a razor on your CPU. This method is fool proof.


Although I agree, Douglas Adams once poignantly remarked, "a common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely fool proof is to underestimate the ingenuity of fools."


----------



## Boulard83

I delided my 4770k last night









http://www.overclock.net/t/1405535/my-4770k-delid-video-ihs-removal/0_40

I'm now waiting my Liquid Pro for some more testing


----------



## akiles333

Will this fit a gtx780 (http://www.aquatuning.no/product_info.php/info/p14121_EK-Water-Blocks-EK-VGA-Supremacy---Acetal.html)? Is it safe to only cool the core? The cards will be at stock everything btw.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Will this fit a gtx780 (http://www.aquatuning.no/product_info.php/info/p14121_EK-Water-Blocks-EK-VGA-Supremacy---Acetal.html)? Is it safe to only cool the core? The cards will be at stock everything btw.


Not sure if you're in the the right thread, but that universal block should fit a 780 fine. Besides the core, you will want to cool the mosfets in the VRM, some small heatsinks (I cut ramsinks in half to fit nicely) with airflow around them will work.


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> I would think it is obvious the titans are increasing your temps. I have my cpu on 1 loop and graphics card on another because of this exact thing. Also, being summer, the ambients are higher and you're not going to get get those cool winter temps. A lot of people have winter and summer oc settings because of this.


I live in miami... Our winter and summer is only ~10 degree difference, and my house has 2 full size AC units, both set to 74-75f 24/7

I really didn't expect an increase of 15-20degrees at idle on my cpu, though load temps have only gone up 5-10.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> Will this fit a gtx780 (http://www.aquatuning.no/product_info.php/info/p14121_EK-Water-Blocks-EK-VGA-Supremacy---Acetal.html)? Is it safe to only cool the core? The cards will be at stock everything btw.


Off topic... i know... But i don't really understand why people buy gpu only blocks, when you can get a standard block for almost the same price.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> I live in miami... Our winter and summer is only ~10 degree difference, and my house has 2 full size AC units, both set to 74-75f 24/7
> 
> I really didn't expect an increase of 15-20degrees at idle on my cpu, though load temps have only gone up 5-10.
> Off topic... i know... But i don't really understand why people buy gpu only blocks, when you can get a standard block for almost the same price.


Standard blocks like full cover? You generally have to replace them every time you change cards, I gave up on full cover so I can just keep re-using the same blocks on all different cards.


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Standard blocks like full cover? You generally have to replace them every time you change cards, I gave up on full cover so I can just keep re-using the same blocks on all different cards.


Standard, as in any block that covers more then the gpu.

It totally makes sense that those uni-blocks would be preferable to some one who's constantly swapping out hardware.


----------



## hellzlegend

Do people glue back the IHS after?
If so, what do you use?


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hellzlegend*
> 
> Do people glue back the IHS after?
> If so, what do you use?


From what I've seen here, nope, nobody re-do the glue to the IHS.
As it has been stated earlier in the thread, the temperature problem resides in the gap the glue makes.
So, re-gluing the IHS is like taking 20 steps backwards over the process if not done properly (it only comes to my mind using a press or something to squeeze the PCB-IHS sandwich so that the gap between the latter and the die is less than before delidding)

Not worth it in my opinion, I prefer to have it loosen so I can re-do the CLU application whenever it becomes necessary









Greets!


----------



## Clukos

Just a question, i just delided my 3570k but i applied mx 4 on the die till my coollaboratory liquid ultra comes. So far I've seen a difference of 3 degrees Celsius... From 93-94 max to 90-92. Am i doing something wrong or will CLU drop my temperatures more?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clukos*
> 
> Just a question, i just delided my 3570k but i applied mx 4 on the die till my coollaboratory liquid ultra comes. So far I've seen a difference of 3 degrees Celsius... From 93-94 max to 90-92. Am i doing something wrong or will CLU drop my temperatures more?


CLU should drop the temps even more, it has much better thermal conductivity than mx-4.


----------



## Clukos

Actually it was my bad, i just tried to completely clean the glue that was on the ihs and the die and temps got way better. I guess applying CLU will give me even better results!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clukos*
> 
> Actually it was my bad, i just tried to completely clean the glue that was on the ihs and the die and temps got way better. I guess applying CLU will give me even better results!


Yes, the layer of glue is where the temp issues are, the stock intel TIM is good as far as paste goes but the little extra gap between IHS & die is a problem.


----------



## Valgaur

I will be doing a thorough explanation of the IHS/die issues once im off work. (If im still willing to after 11 hours lol )


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> CLU should drop the temps even more, it has much better thermal conductivity than mx-4.


...even on the IHS to block area CL-U improved my temps by 3 to 4 degrees C compared to MX4...but far more critical is obviously liquid metal like CL-U on the die area


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Just use the vice trust me.
> 
> 1) Buy 20$ vice with flat sides so it doesn't damage your CPU (not the kind with teeth)
> 2) Tighten it to the point where the IHS is not able to move at all (but not too tight)
> 3) Place block of wood next to the PCB, hold it steady
> 4) Tap wood with hammer, not too hard, but certainly not too weak either.
> 
> It pops off and is perfection. Don't risk using a razor on your CPU. This method is fool proof.


I trust my confidence and ability to delid with a razer.

I have delidded a 3570k and a 3770k with a razer without any problems and no blunt force in the process. I feel confident using the razer.

I'm leaning more towards all razer IHS removal for Haswell. Was thinking about cutting on 3 sides and then whacking off with vice but I don't want to risk any type of damage by the impact of force of the vice method.

My 4770k delid is going to be all razer.


----------



## maxforces

Room temperature 26C

CoolLaboratory LIquid Ultra--Fresh- 10min


Ic diamond after 7 days


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I trust my confidence and ability to delid with a razer.
> 
> I have delidded a 3570k and a 3770k with a razer without any problems and no blunt force in the process. I feel confident using the razer.
> 
> I'm leaning more towards all razer IHS removal for Haswell. Was thinking about cutting on 3 sides and then whacking off with vice but I don't want to risk any type of damage by the impact of force of the vice method.
> 
> My 4770k delid is going to be all razer.


Old School, I like it!









I tried vise method but mine had teeth and I could see it damaging the IHS so just finished it with a razor. I have 4 delids with razor so far. Soon to be a 5th (another 3770K).


----------



## shinyboy

No proof but just delidded my new 4670k. Never ran it first and haven't exactly learned overclocking for haswell yet as my last cpu was a q6600 and there's way more options now







.
Figured i'd add this just for communal information.

used vice method. Was easy but had to hit harder then I thought.

Cooler is a true120extreme that was lapped. Fans in push/pull, although temps are same with only one fans.
stock settings.

Ambient: 24c
idle: 29c
load prime95 small fft after 5min: 47c
TIM is mx2 on both.


----------



## MME1122

Got off work early and it was a rainy day so I finally got around to delidding







I got my CLU in the mail a few days ago but I haven't had time between work and a new girlfriend. I didn't want to do this while rushed/tired/stressed








I used the hammer/vice method, it worked well. I put some masking tape on the jaws, the IHS doesn't have a scratch. However I started with a rubber mallet and a block of wood, and it didn't come off so I switched to a normal hammer. Then I hit the CPU so hard it went flying across the table. Luckily it hit the back of a chair across the table and landed on the blanket I layed out. I almost had a heart attack









OCN name: MME1122
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: Still testing








OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
Temp drops: 7C, however that's also with lower fan speed. At 50% fan speed, I maxed out at 65C. At 100%, 61C.
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2850459


Spoiler: Screenshots









Spoiler: Photos









So can I join now pretty please?


----------



## Janac

So CLP didnt help me. Iget above 45°c at idle and stock freq. Dont have a clue what to do now. I tried MX-2, Ceramique 2, nov CLP and temps are realy high. Seems that was not good to spend 16euros for CLP.


----------



## Janac

i am really disappointed with CLP.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> So CLP didnt help me. Iget above 45°c at idle and stock freq. Dont have a clue what to do now. I tried MX-2, Ceramique 2, nov CLP and temps are realy high. Seems that was not good to spend 16euros for CLP.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> i am really disappointed with CLP.


what vcre are you using and how much CLP did you use on the die if not enough your contact wont be right and what are you ambients...... (normal air temperatures of the room)


----------



## Janac

ambient temp is around 23-24°C

CPU is at stock with enabled intel speedstep, so at idle i would say 1600MHz and voltage lower than 1V. Nope, i didnt used too much CLP.


----------



## Janac




----------



## TranquilTempest

I wouldn't call 57° load "really high temps"


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*


there's no way that those are all sleeping cores from the temp differences in that pic, 17C difference in cores during normal running is way to far apart. What cooler are you using? and how much of the tube of CLP did you apply?


----------



## Janac

Water in my loop is at 28°c.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Water in my loop is at 28°c.


Shoot up man.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> Water in my loop is at 28°c.


you removed all the glue from the PCB correct? and what TIM on the top of the IHS? I am really leaning towards the application of CLP as 17C spread... usually means that.


----------



## Janac

yes, all glue removed. CLP is on die and on IHS.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> yes, all glue removed. CLP is on die and on IHS.


It's gotta be the application in my mind. Thats all i can really think of. Or atleast for right now (tired from work 5 am here)


----------



## neofury

I'm a delidding noob, and CLP gave me 20c on my first go. Did you spread it evenly on the die and even put some on the bottom side of the IHS? I know some people do this, others don't, but I did it and it seems to have worked. Considering you also used it for the top of the IHS (apparently will give you 2-3c better than normal TIM) I'd have to believe something is wrong, either with the way you seated your cooler, the IHS onto the chip, or the application of CLP. The first time I put the CLP two of my cores ran much hotter than the others. I opened it up again and it seemed like some of my CLP had.... oozed over or something, leaving a spot that was normally covered exposed. Once I fixed that the cores were all good. If you don't seat the IHS properly or apply the CLP properly, it can definitely cause issues. It took me about 3 re-seats to get it right. Again though, I'm a noob with delidding.


----------



## stickg1

You didn't apply properly. 300 people have success and you did not, has to be application in my mind.


----------



## phaseshift

okay goona delid today, I have a pretty good chip but the temps are killing me. I have a few questions that hopefully some of you can answer:

1. Can you use the thermal paste remover from arctic silver to remove the glue and whatever is on the die?



2. I have CoolLaboratory Liquid Pro, how much of that should I put on the die?

I'm thinking of getting double sided tape, putting them on each side of the vice and tightening the cpu in between.


----------



## phaseshift

Also when appling Liquid Pro, should I use the spread method on the die?


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> okay goona delid today, I have a pretty good chip but the temps are killing me. I have a few questions that hopefully some of you can answer:
> 
> 1. Can you use the thermal paste remover from arctic silver to remove the glue and whatever is on the die?
> 
> 
> 
> 2. I have CoolLaboratory Liquid Pro, how much of that should I put on the die?
> 
> I'm thinking of getting double sided tape, putting them on each side of the vice and tightening the cpu in between.


I used it, so I should hope you can









Also, I personally put enough to cover the die completely (spread method) and also covered the inside of the IHS as well just for good measure. Good luck!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> Also when appling Liquid Pro, should I use the spread method on the die?


Yes. But I would check it after a day to see how it looks in there. I don't know why but mine needed a touch up.


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Janac*
> 
> So CLP didnt help me. Iget above 45°c at idle and stock freq. Dont have a clue what to do now. I tried MX-2, Ceramique 2, nov CLP and temps are realy high. Seems that was not good to spend 16euros for CLP.


Idle temps might stay where they were before delidding.
The only important thing in here are the load temps.
For example my ambient temps right now is ~26°C, and my 3770K doing nothing but run Firefox idles with ~40°C hottest core:



You shouldn't be worried about that, but you must consider re-doing your CLU application.
After I reseated mine, max temps across cores were more even (just a 4°C difference at much)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> okay goona delid today, I have a pretty good chip but the temps are killing me. I have a few questions that hopefully some of you can answer:
> 
> 1. Can you use the thermal paste remover from arctic silver to remove the glue and whatever is on the die?


I don't remember just now what have been said about those cleaners when used in the die, but I would rather just use some 90%+ Isopropyl alcohol.
More than enough to take out the Intel TIM and loosen the black glue.

Greets.


----------



## MME1122

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molokou*
> 
> I don't remember just now what have been said about those cleaners when used in the die, but I would rather just use some 90%+ Isopropyl alcohol.
> More than enough to take out the Intel TIM and loosen the black glue.
> 
> Greets.


I used IPA, it's great for the TIM but it didn't dissolve the glue very well for me. I ended up scraping the glue off with a credit card.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MME1122*
> 
> I used IPA, it's great for the TIM but it didn't dissolve the glue very well for me. I ended up scraping the glue off with a credit card.


...credit card is good - even fingernails work (and give great control







)


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> Also when appling Liquid Pro, should I use the spread method on the die?


Both the Die and bottom of IHS (where it contacts the die), spread a layer of CLP.. Also be very careful of the PCB Voltage regulators next to the die.. Its best to cover them with some sort of non conductive/capacitive TIM.


----------



## MME1122

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Both the Die and bottom of IHS (where it contacts the die), spread a layer of CLP.. Also be very careful of the PCB Voltage regulators next to the die.. Its best to cover them with some sort of non conductive/capacitive TIM.


I didn't spread it on the bottom of the IHS..do you think that will make a difference? Also is the CLU like other TIMs where if you pull the heatsink off you need to clean it off and reapply?


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MME1122*
> 
> I didn't spread it on the bottom of the IHS..do you think that will make a difference? Also is the CLU like other TIMs where if you pull the heat sink off you need to clean it off and reapply?


It really did in my case, the thin layer wasn't enough to make good contact with the IHS, after some advice I received from this forum, I applied to both the Die and under the IHS where the die makes contact and made great progress in decreasing my temps. About 20c, and when i lapped i got a little over 25c but I had bad concave in my IHS.

Also no you shouldn't have to clean it, not unless you badly smear it when removing the IHS.. I didn't clean or reapply when I removed it to apply to the IHS.

It could be a part of the problem you are having.Wouldn't hurt to try..


----------



## phaseshift

okay so I delidded today, I think it went well but i'm a little concerned about the temps. Here are some screen shots of before and after

Before:



After:



I did the spread method on the bottom of the IHS and on the die.

one thing is Aida64 seems to fail the first time I run it and but when I run it again it's okay. One thing I did notice or maybe it's been like this all along. On aida64 under statistics the cpu is at 128 temp but the cores are at 37~


----------



## IceDiver

I delidded a while back, got nice temp drops, but used CLU between IHS/Cooler. Yesterday I got my order of MX-4 and went to town with it, and here are the results:

Before Delid
Temp 85 85 84 79
1.23V
4.4Ghz
10 hours Prime95

After Delid (CLU):
Temp 61 66 70 66
4.4Ghz
1.23V
20 hours Prime95

After Delid (MX-4):
Temp 61 62 65 59
4.4Ghz
1.23V
13 hours Prime95

All temps collected with RealTemp and while running Prime95. I am quite satisfied with the results as they are now, though I'm running an H80i, would I be looking at noticeable drops by going over to an H110 or H100i? I'm going to be running a lot of 3D rendering on this machine, so I really would like it to be as cool as possible, even though I think I will push it up to 4.5Ghz just to get a full 1Ghz OC


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> okay so I delidded today, I think it went well but i'm a little concerned about the temps. Here are some screen shots of before and after
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> 
> I did the spread method on the bottom of the IHS and on the die.
> 
> one thing is Aida64 seems to fail the first time I run it and but when I run it again it's okay. One thing I did notice or maybe it's been like this all along. On aida64 under statistics the cpu is at 128 temp but the cores are at 37~


1. what cooelr please








2. don't use aida, use Intel burn test
3. im pretty sure the cpu reading is reading that in Fahrenheit
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IceDiver*
> 
> I delidded a while back, got nice temp drops, but used CLU between IHS/Cooler. Yesterday I got my order of MX-4 and went to town with it, and here are the results:
> 
> Before Delid
> Temp 85 85 84 79
> 1.23V
> 4.4Ghz
> 10 hours Prime95
> 
> After Delid (CLU):
> Temp 61 66 70 66
> 4.4Ghz
> 1.23V
> 20 hours Prime95
> 
> After Delid (MX-4):
> Temp 61 62 65 59
> 4.4Ghz
> 1.23V
> 13 hours Prime95
> 
> All temps collected with RealTemp and while running Prime95. I am quite satisfied with the results as they are now, though I'm running an H80i, would I be looking at noticeable drops by going over to an H110 or H100i? I'm going to be running a lot of 3D rendering on this machine, so I really would like it to be as cool as possible, even though I think I will push it up to 4.5Ghz just to get a full 1Ghz OC


you might drop 5C area with the H100i, I'd say do rendering with it at first and see then decide.







other than that good results sir!


----------



## IceDiver

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> you might drop 5C area with the H100i, I'd say do rendering with it at first and see then decide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> other than that good results sir!


The thing is I accidentally connected the pump rpm cable to a PWM signal header and burned the rpm unit it seems, so I dont really know how reliable the pump is anymore  It runs fine it seems, ran the last prime95 test with it last night, but the led on it is messed up.

I was looking at the Swiftech H220 which seems really nice, but everyone is out of stock on that one, is it out of production or something..?
I would actually prefer the h110 over the h100i, I dont like corsair link very much..


----------



## phaseshift

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1. what cooelr please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2. don't use aida, use Intel burn test
> 3. im pretty sure the cpu reading is reading that in Fahrenheit
> you might drop 5C area with the H100i, I'd say do rendering with it at first and see then decide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> other than that good results sir!


I have an H100i, why do you recommend IBT instead of Aida?

If I redo the Liquid Pro application, I put half a grain on both bottom of IHS and DIE.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

I'm still waiting for my CLU to show up, has anyone experienced ordering from Shiny Hardware Limited, or their ebay page for that matter? . I hate ordering from overseas because of the wait at customs, But i cant find anywhere in North America that sells the stuff. I'm not really worried about who i order it from in the UK, just more or less how long you guys might think it would sit in customs

I ordered on the 27th, I'm assuming its in Canada right now because when i try to track the parcel at royalmail.com i get this..

Your item, posted on 28/06/13 with reference XXXXXXXXXX has been passed to the overseas postal service for delivery in CANADA.

Now honestly that is pretty insane to go from the UK to Canada that fast, i'm pretty impressed by that. But now i'm wondering how long the wait will be from that date until i actually receive it lol.


----------



## phaseshift

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 1. what cooelr please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2. don't use aida, use Intel burn test
> 3. im pretty sure the cpu reading is reading that in Fahrenheit
> you might drop 5C area with the H100i, I'd say do rendering with it at first and see then decide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> other than that good results sir!


here is stock IBT tests


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IceDiver*
> 
> The thing is I accidentally connected the pump rpm cable to a PWM signal header and burned the rpm unit it seems, so I dont really know how reliable the pump is anymore  It runs fine it seems, ran the last prime95 test with it last night, but the led on it is messed up.
> 
> I was looking at the Swiftech H220 which seems really nice, but everyone is out of stock on that one, is it out of production or something..?
> I would actually prefer the h110 over the h100i, I dont like corsair link very much..


I prefer the H100 as well.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> I have an H100i, why do you recommend IBT instead of Aida?
> 
> If I redo the Liquid Pro application, I put half a grain on both bottom of IHS and DIE.


I prefer the IBT more because it stress's the intel architecture much better, plus I've heard a lot that aida missreads, (maybe I'm mistaken? been a while)


----------



## phaseshift

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I prefer the H100 as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I prefer the IBT more because it stress's the intel architecture much better, plus I've heard a lot that aida missreads, (maybe I'm mistaken? been a while)


so how do my temps look in terms of after the delid? I'm thinking of re-applying again, spread or rice grain on the die? I used a qtip to spread it last time. I feel like people are getting less temps with the same setup as mine....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> so how do my temps look in terms of after the delid? I'm thinking of re-applying again, spread or rice grain on the die? I used a qtip to spread it last time. I feel like people are getting less temps with the same setup as mine....


with clu you use a small dot and then spread it very carefully, then if you don't have a small amount of excess (very small) then put a bit on the under IHS for true contact. just be sparing with it as you can put to much and ruin results.

temps look much better and consistent and better spaced out as well


----------



## phaseshift

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> with clu you use a small dot and then spread it very carefully, then if you don't have a small amount of excess (very small) then put a bit on the under IHS for true contact. just be sparing with it as you can put to much and ruin results.
> 
> temps look much better and consistent and better spaced out as well


so I reapplied CLP, I tried to get some under the IHS but for some reason the CLP just balls up and it didn't spread so I removed whatever was on there and just put CLP on the die it'self. Why wasn't CLP spreading under the IHS?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phaseshift*
> 
> so I reapplied CLP, I tried to get some under the IHS but for some reason the CLP just balls up and it didn't spread so I removed whatever was on there and just put CLP on the die it'self. Why wasn't CLP spreading under the IHS?


You need to use isopropyl alcohol to clean both die and IHS before applying CLP/CLU. There's a sachet with a wipe that comes in the package (at least for CLU it does).


----------



## phaseshift

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> You need to use isopropyl alcohol to clean both die and IHS before applying CLP/CLU. There's a sachet with a wipe that comes in the package (at least for CLU it does).


I have to reapply again since there's a 3-4c difference from my first application.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I prefer the H100 as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I prefer the IBT more because it stress's the intel architecture much better, plus I've heard a lot that aida missreads, (maybe I'm mistaken? been a while)


...in addition to IBT, I have also recommended Intel's XTU before - essentially the successor to Intel's earlier IBT...XTU has CPU and Memory tests that 'heat up' the system more so than many of the current favs...only issue is 'result reporting' as it yields no table, just a 'pass' or 'fail' line


----------



## chromedivision

New member!

Just did it a lot because of you guys, who posted so many great things about it. And got enough to do it too...

OCN name: ChromeDivision
CPU: Core i7 4770K
on die-TIM: Artic Silver 5
ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
Mhz gained: 600MHz
OC after delid: 4.8GHz
Temp drops: ~20°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2852567


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> New member!
> 
> Just did it a lot because of you guys, who posted so many great things about it. And got enough to do it too...
> 
> OCN name: ChromeDivision
> CPU: Core i7 4770K
> on die-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> *Mhz gained: 6GHz*
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: ~20°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2852567


*Mhz gained: 6GHz*










If it isn't a typo, I gotta try the as5 again...

Congrats on the successful delid & nicer temps!


----------



## chromedivision

Thanks mate, already corrected. AS 5 still doesn't make miracles...


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hi there folks...I'm not delidding any more chips, but wanted to say hi


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hi there folks...I'm not delidding any more chips, but wanted to say hi


Did you get some new cooling?

I may still delid a haswell to test, but only have one so far & would have to get a better or worse one, so the worst can be delidded.
Still don't know if haswell is like Ivy with the deild --> instant degrade issue.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Did you get some new cooling?
> 
> I may still delid a haswell to test, but only have one so far & would have to get a better or worse one, so the worst can be delidded.
> Still don't know if haswell is like Ivy with the deild --> instant degrade issue.


I'm guessing it'll be the same. Ivy-e will be soldered though, but I won't get that.

I'm getting a 4770k+z87x-oc next month.
Had to change plans, and pay lots of interests and stuff this month. But next month I'll be at ease, financially.
I may add a second 7970 to the rig, to mine and bench some too.

I'll probably order the EK ram and cpu pots in a couple of months (by October probably, or for Christmas along with a proper monitor)
I will be selling my MVG rma replacement for bitcoins in the US too, since importing it back here will generate customs tax I don't wanna pay.

Thoughts?







(GB is the only board that gives me warranty coverage in Argentina, even if the board is imported)


----------



## CAVO14

OCN name: CAVO14
CPU: i5-3570k
on die-TIM: Coollabratory Pro
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: just looking to keep it cooler
OC after delid:4.4ghz
Temp drops: 19c


----------



## ivanlabrie

Pretty good temp drops for AS5.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm guessing it'll be the same. Ivy-e will be soldered though, but I won't get that.
> 
> I'm getting a 4770k+z87x-oc next month.
> Had to change plans, and pay lots of interests and stuff this month. But next month I'll be at ease, financially.
> I may add a second 7970 to the rig, to mine and bench some too.
> 
> I'll probably order the EK ram and cpu pots in a couple of months (by October probably, or for Christmas along with a proper monitor)
> I will be selling my MVG rma replacement for bitcoins in the US too, since importing it back here will generate customs tax I don't wanna pay.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (GB is the only board that gives me warranty coverage in Argentina, even if the board is imported)


I get to play with a z87 OC on the weekend in TO, I'll have to let you know. Should be a solid board though, higher end GB is usually right up there. If it the best manufacturer for warranty there that makes it a pretty easy choice.

I do want to try one of those EK/SF3D pots, the mount & internal heater bits to beat the CBB look interesting.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Pretty good temp drops for AS5.


Hi Ivan!









What you been up to?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> I'm guessing it'll be the same. Ivy-e will be soldered though, but I won't get that.
> 
> I'm getting a 4770k+z87x-oc next month.
> Had to change plans, and pay lots of interests and stuff this month. But next month I'll be at ease, financially.
> I may add a second 7970 to the rig, to mine and bench some too.
> 
> I'll probably order the EK ram and cpu pots in a couple of months (by October probably, or for Christmas along with a proper monitor)
> I will be selling my MVG rma replacement for bitcoins in the US too, since importing it back here will generate customs tax I don't wanna pay.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (GB is the only board that gives me warranty coverage in Argentina, even if the board is imported)


Hi Ivan







- Tx for the tips the other day re '50% Power Level' for the 2x 7990s ( spoiler







)...cards are getting EK water blocks now to deal w/temps...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







...re new Z87 boards, 'ocaholic' has a very nice summary w/various bench results http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1028


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hi Ivan!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What you been up to?


You know, mining, working out...this and that








Oh, and harassing Valgaur via skype.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> New member!
> 
> Just did it a lot because of you guys, who posted so many great things about it. And got enough to do it too...
> 
> OCN name: ChromeDivision
> CPU: Core i7 4770K
> on die-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: 600MHz
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: ~20°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2852567


Oh hey, looking at the validation, 1.55V on a 4770k is scary voltage, it can't really need that much for 4.8Ghz.
I would not want to stress test at that vcore even with some extreme cooling.


----------



## Swag

Does anyone here prefer Haswell over Ivy Bridge? The only people I know are people who own Haswell and did not own an Ivy to match... I gifted a Haswell away after a day of checking the max OC I could get on it but other than that, I didn't like it.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone here prefer Haswell over Ivy Bridge? The only people I know are people who own Haswell and did not own an Ivy to match... I gifted a Haswell away after a day of checking the max OC I could get on it but other than that, I didn't like it.


Haswell isn't bad, the z87 boards are more interesting than z77, but as far as straight up frequency goes ivy is doing better. The OC isn't everything since a 4770k at 4.6 - 4.7Ghz is roughly equivalent to a 3770k at 5ghz, but ivy is still getting higher average numbers.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Does anyone here prefer Haswell over Ivy Bridge? The only people I know are people who own Haswell and did not own an Ivy to match... I gifted a Haswell away after a day of checking the max OC I could get on it but other than that, I didn't like it.
> 
> 
> 
> Haswell isn't bad, the z87 boards are more interesting than z77, but as far as straight up frequency goes ivy is doing better. The OC isn't everything since a 4770k at 4.6 - 4.7Ghz is roughly equivalent to a 3770k at 5ghz, but ivy is still getting higher average numbers.
Click to expand...

4.6-4.7 is the same as 5.0? I would imagine it to be around 4.9 or even mid-high 4.8. The Z87 boards look amazing, all the companies really stepped up their design team when it came to Z87. I think they're realizing the 90% of the consumers don't care for stats like enthusiast, all they think is better looking = better performance with the fact that more expensive = high end. Can't really blame them for trying to earn some money, they did leave us some really good products like the Maximus line.


----------



## FtW 420

Roughly, performance difference may depend on what is being run, but when first testing the 4770k I was surprised at getting over 10 in cinebench at 4.6Ghz.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Roughly, performance difference may depend on what is being run, but when first testing the 4770k I was surprised at getting over 10 in cinebench at 4.6Ghz.


Oh ok, I got you now. I think I'm going to wait until the next series of Extreme chips to upgrade. I'm getting sick and tired of the PPD I'm getting with my 3570k so I really want a 6-core or 8-core. Should I wait till the 8-cores come rolling out or go for the next 6-core?


----------



## .theMetal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Still don't know if haswell is like Ivy with the deild --> *instant degrade issue.*


Hey FtW, are you talking about degrade by adding extreme cooling/direct die once delidded? I only have 1.20 volts running to the proc so I wouldn't think I have to worry, but I know you live in a completely different extreme volt world.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh ok, I got you now. I think I'm going to wait until the next series of Extreme chips to upgrade. I'm getting sick and tired of the PPD I'm getting with my 3570k so I really want a 6-core or 8-core. Should I wait till the 8-cores come rolling out or go for the next 6-core?


Fold with AMD gpus man, core17 cough...you can get two 7950s, mine litecoins with one, fold with the other







(free power for folding)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *.theMetal*
> 
> Hey FtW, are you talking about degrade by adding extreme cooling/direct die once delidded? I only have 1.20 volts running to the proc so I wouldn't think I have to worry, but I know you live in a completely different extreme volt world.


He meant that post delid max oc on ln2 was lower on Ivy.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Oh ok, I got you now. I think I'm going to wait until the next series of Extreme chips to upgrade. I'm getting sick and tired of the PPD I'm getting with my 3570k so I really want a 6-core or 8-core. Should I wait till the 8-cores come rolling out or go for the next 6-core?
> 
> 
> 
> Fold with AMD gpus man, core17 cough...you can get two 7950s, mine litecoins with one, fold with the other
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (free power for folding)
Click to expand...

I know for mining, GPUs are the best, but aren't CPUs better for folding? I still run my server 24/7 for folding. 24 threads


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> New member!
> 
> Just did it a lot because of you guys, who posted so many great things about it. And got enough to do it too...
> 
> OCN name: ChromeDivision
> CPU: Core i7 4770K
> on die-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: 600MHz
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: ~20°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2852567


You're in!







Slap the sig on man!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Did you get some new cooling?
> 
> I may still delid a haswell to test, but only have one so far & would have to get a better or worse one, so the worst can be delidded.
> Still don't know if haswell is like Ivy with the deild --> instant degrade issue.


Hey FtW.... I should delid it at the event lol just grab it right in front of the intel rep... and look at them and slowly cut it off.









Got my new RAM gpu pot and cpu pot! super excited i need to insulate mobo tomorrow with my eraser stuff kinda and any idea how to do LET on my 7970L? (i have no idea....)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CAVO14*
> 
> OCN name: CAVO14
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Pro
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: just looking to keep it cooler
> OC after delid:4.4ghz
> Temp drops: 19c


You're in as well!







put that new amazing sig on baby!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You know, mining, working out...this and that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and harassing Valgaur via skype.


oh you


----------



## ozzy1925

i can get my i3770k working at 4800mhz stable 1.310v but temps are around 90-95c .Is it worth deliding?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know for mining, GPUs are the best, but aren't CPUs better for folding? I still run my server 24/7 for folding. 24 threads


Core17 wu's beg to differ.
http://www.bronyathome.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=123
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i can get my i3770k working at 4800mhz stable 1.310v but temps are around 90-95c .Is it worth deliding?


It's worth a shot


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know for mining, GPUs are the best, but aren't CPUs better for folding? I still run my server 24/7 for folding. 24 threads
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Core17 wu's beg to differ.
> http://www.bronyathome.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=123
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i can get my i3770k working at 4800mhz stable 1.310v but temps are around 90-95c .Is it worth deliding?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's worth a shot
Click to expand...

The simple answer is it's worth it, but asking a thread full of delidders ain't an effective way of getting an unbiased answer.

How do you only allow Core17 WUs to work on?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Not sure, ask the folding guys...I haven't been folding for ages now. (running a pentium d and the 7970 is for mining)


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i can get my i3770k working at 4800mhz stable 1.310v but temps are around 90-95c .Is it worth deliding?


Mine was 1.3v 4.8ghz and 88c, and I thought I had terrible temp issues, so I most definitely think you should delid, worth it imo.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Mine was 1.3v 4.8ghz and 88c, and I thought I had terrible temp issues, so I most definitely think you should delid, worth it imo.


what are the temps now?


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> what are the temps now?


They dropped by 20c and the AS5 I put on top of the IHS hasn't even cured yet. I could probably also switch to CLP on top of the IHS and save another 5c, and I might do it.

So anywhere in the vicinity of 20-25c with a maximum of up to 30c even.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> They dropped by 20c and the AS5 I put on top of the IHS hasn't even cured yet. I could probably also switch to CLP on top of the IHS and save another 5c, and I might do it.
> 
> So anywhere in the vicinity of 20-25c with a maximum of up to 30c even.


i ordered coollab lquid ultra and gelid extreme but really scared to scratch the cpu


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> I'm still waiting for my CLU to show up, has anyone experienced ordering from Shiny Hardware Limited, or their ebay page for that matter? . I hate ordering from overseas because of the wait at customs, But i cant find anywhere in North America that sells the stuff. I'm not really worried about who i order it from in the UK, just more or less how long you guys might think it would sit in customs
> 
> I ordered on the 27th, I'm assuming its in Canada right now because when i try to track the parcel at royalmail.com i get this..
> 
> Your item, posted on 28/06/13 with reference XXXXXXXXXX has been passed to the overseas postal service for delivery in CANADA.
> 
> Now honestly that is pretty insane to go from the UK to Canada that fast, i'm pretty impressed by that. But now i'm wondering how long the wait will be from that date until i actually receive it lol.


That's where I got mine a few weeks ago and it took about a week. It was only place that had it in stock at that time. You should see it soon, but may be delayed because of holiday in USA.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i ordered coollab lquid ultra and gelid extreme but really scared to scratch the cpu


I was scared too. I mean risking a 300$ CPU to gain 200mhz? But I did it with the vice method, and to be honest as long as you're careful and don't smack the thing so hard the PCB goes flying across your room, it's much safer than the razor method. I was able to do the razor method twice on two older CPU's with no scratches either, but having now done the vice method, I'm confident it's the easier and better way to delid.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Pretty good temp drops for AS5.


I think most of the legit temp drops, have everything to do with how much or how little was applied. And that goes for every paste.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I was scared too. I mean risking a 300$ CPU to gain 200mhz? But I did it with the vice method, and to be honest as long as you're careful and don't smack the thing so hard the PCB goes flying across your room, it's much safer than the razor method. I was able to do the razor method twice on two older CPU's with no scratches either, but having now done the vice method, I'm confident it's the easier and better way to delid.


My hands were sweating like crazy and trembling as i went around the corners with the razer blade, I knew only a few mm away was a $350.00 cpu die. My stomach felt 200000x better when i removed the IHS and found a perfectly clean undamaged die. There were a few small surface scratches in the pcb. But after delidding and applying some cheap paste and re-seating,booting, and running prime for 1 1/2hrs i felt fine.

I 100% recommend not rushing it. If i could go back and redo it. I'd probably take a good 2hrs to completely remove the IHS

That being said i'm really hoping i can hit 4.8 now. My temps were holding me back a lot. And that came with how much voltage i was pumping into it. I got a pretty crappy chip. It takes me a little over 1.360 to be stable at 4.6GHz without WHEA errors. I've booted into Windows at 4.8GHz with a little higher voltage, but BSOD instantly running anything.


----------



## Swag

Probably not everyone here will know but I was wondering about compression fittings.

I initially wanted to go the cheap route and save $40 and go with Monsoon or XSPC compression fittings since Bitspower costs oh so much. Anyone have any problems with either XSPC or Monsoon? Also, I will have only 3 components that need fittings (pump/block combo, res, and rad), will 8 ft of tubing be fine? And I want white coolant (distilled water can't be an option since I like the coolant/clear tubing combo), which brand coolant is the best?


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Try swiftech compression fittings... only $3.99 http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=59_346_341&zenid=e960c80de41ba11aafe7c78dad3959e4
Also take a look at dragon ice nanofluid. I have not used it myself but have heard good things about it. tubing depends on your case and layout.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> My hands were sweating like crazy and trembling as i went around the corners with the razer blade, I knew only a few mm away was a $350.00 cpu die. My stomach felt 200000x better when i removed the IHS and found a perfectly clean undamaged die. There were a few small surface scratches in the pcb. But after delidding and applying some cheap paste and re-seating,booting, and running prime for 1 1/2hrs i felt fine.
> 
> I 100% recommend not rushing it. If i could go back and redo it. I'd probably take a good 2hrs to completely remove the IHS
> 
> That being said i'm really hoping i can hit 4.8 now. My temps were holding me back a lot. And that came with how much voltage i was pumping into it. I got a pretty crappy chip. It takes me a little over 1.360 to be stable at 4.6GHz without WHEA errors. I've booted into Windows at 4.8GHz with a little higher voltage, but BSOD instantly running anything.


Oh, you'll hit 4.8







With an H220 and delid, I don't see it taking you much more than 1.45 with your current 4.6 being where it is. Good luck!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> Try swiftech compression fittings... only $3.99 http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=59_346_341&zenid=e960c80de41ba11aafe7c78dad3959e4
> Also take a look at dragon ice nanofluid. I have not used it myself but have heard good things about it. tubing depends on your case and layout.


I'm intrigued by the dragon ice. If I have 2 reservoirs, 2 GPU blocks, 1 CPU block, 2 rads, the whole 9 yards, would 1 bottle be enough liquid? I was thinking it wouldn't be but I've never done custom cooling. Sometime in January when I have the $ saved up I'm going to go nuts and buy a 1000$+ setup. I know I don't need a 2nd res but I'm doing it purely for the look, and as long as it doesn't effect performance I'm going all in. I've put the two potential ideas I had in my sig. Any recommendations from anyone would be greatly appreciated.

I've heard you can get generic GPU blocks instead of specific ones and save $? I'm on the GTX 680 FTW+ 4gb, so it seems the typical blocks don't work for that.

I want the highest end possible h2o I can get, obviously I don't want to spend 2000$ but I thought 1000$ to 1350$~ would be enough to get me a ferrari of water cooling setup.

Also with high end water, does pushing the voltage to 1.5v+ (offset of course) 24/7 become more safe, or at that point is it not a matter of temps being low but rather simply too much voltage?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Probably not everyone here will know but I was wondering about compression fittings.
> 
> I initially wanted to go the cheap route and save $40 and go with Monsoon or XSPC compression fittings since Bitspower costs oh so much. Anyone have any problems with either XSPC or Monsoon? Also, I will have only 3 components that need fittings (pump/block combo, res, and rad), will 8 ft of tubing be fine? And I want white coolant (distilled water can't be an option since I like the coolant/clear tubing combo), which brand coolant is the best?


I've used XSPC compressions exclucively and haven't had any issues. Not one leak. Not to mention one of the few that offer option of blk chrome. Be careful with coolant. Some of them will stain acrylic and leave deposits in waterblocks and radiators. Distilled is the way to go.


----------



## phaseshift

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> with clu you use a small dot and then spread it very carefully, then if you don't have a small amount of excess (very small) then put a bit on the under IHS for true contact. just be sparing with it as you can put to much and ruin results.
> 
> temps look much better and consistent and better spaced out as well


for some reason I was expecting a drop of 15-20c after delid...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *.theMetal*
> 
> Hey FtW, are you talking about degrade by adding extreme cooling/direct die once delidded? I only have 1.20 volts running to the proc so I wouldn't think I have to worry, but I know you live in a completely different extreme volt world.


Yes, just the way ivy behaves when delidded with extreme cold temps. Not really a voltage issue, ivy is just a weirdo & likes getting delidded for air & water cooling, but likes to keep her hat on for extreme cold.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slap the sig on man!
> Hey FtW.... I should delid it at the event lol just grab it right in front of the intel rep... and look at them and slowly cut it off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got my new RAM gpu pot and cpu pot! super excited i need to insulate mobo tomorrow with my eraser stuff kinda and any idea how to do LET on my 7970L? (i have no idea....)
> You're in as well!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> put that new amazing sig on baby!
> oh you


Delidding right in front of the intel rep would be one way to send a message.









For the 7970, I cover the entire back from bracket to about the VRM area, & on the front from bracket to the inductors. Careful not to get it on the gold fingers of the sli & pci-e tabs, & I use a fine paintbrush around any mosfets & memory chips, & in the area around the die. This is all I do for insulation on gpus, from here I just slap the pot on & pour.


----------



## Swag

What black goop did you use?


----------



## FtW 420

Liquid Electric Tape (LET). Works well to keep the moisture from shorting anything, the card will still run with a thick coat of ice & snow on it.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Probably not everyone here will know but I was wondering about compression fittings.
> 
> I initially wanted to go the cheap route and save $40 and go with Monsoon or XSPC compression fittings since Bitspower costs oh so much. Anyone have any problems with either XSPC or Monsoon? Also, I will have only 3 components that need fittings (pump/block combo, res, and rad), will 8 ft of tubing be fine? And I want white coolant (distilled water can't be an option since I like the coolant/clear tubing combo), which brand coolant is the best?


I used the Swiftech compressions fittings, and I honestly have zero worries that they will cause problems. Since you can use a wretch on the fitting and on the collet you can control them much better and get them to the correct tightness. I did, however, ruin a couple while learning. Just don't tighten the fitting too much, and cover the collet with tape before using a wrench.

Basically, I don't see any reason to buy expensive fittings unless you just want to, or like the look better. You would be hard pressed to show they work better. As for ones that have a swivel though, I have read that people prefer higher end fittings since they are much more likely to be a point of failure vs. a simple compression fitting.

Eight feet of tubing is plenty if you don't make any mistakes, or change your mind anywhere in the process. Based on those two things, I am glad I ordered extra tubing when I did it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Delidding right in front of the intel rep would be one way to send a message.


Honestly, I would love to walk up to an Intel rep, with a chip in one hand and a razor blade in the other. Then just start delidding while carrying on a conversation with him, and don't even mention what you are doing until he brings it up.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yes, just the way ivy behaves when delidded with extreme cold temps. Not really a voltage issue, ivy is just a weirdo & likes getting delidded for air & water cooling, but likes to keep her hat on for extreme cold.
> Delidding right in front of the intel rep would be one way to send a message.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the 7970, I cover the entire back from bracket to about the VRM area, & on the front from bracket to the inductors. Careful not to get it on the gold fingers of the sli & pci-e tabs, & I use a fine paintbrush around any mosfets & memory chips, & in the area around the die. This is all I do for insulation on gpus, from here I just slap the pot on & pour.


Thanks man I have some green putty that never drys for my eraser not really putty i guess but it's like eraser just green so i can find it all and remove it lol







where should i put all of that stuff on my mobo? and I'm gonna maybe wait on mobo as i'll need gelid xrtreme at the event from admin to event put the pot to the best use right? because you cover the bracket if im not mistaken


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thanks man I have some green putty that never drys for my eraser not really putty i guess but it's like eraser just green so i can find it all and remove it lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> where should i put all of that stuff on my mobo? and I'm gonna maybe wait on mobo as i'll need gelid xrtreme at the event from admin to event put the pot to the best use right? because you cover the bracket if im not mistaken


Some info for mobo insulation with eraser here http://www.overclock.net/t/612816/frozen-path-sub-zero-cooling-club/0_50#post_7695970

I generally do mobos the same as the card, LET around the socket area & 1st pci-e slot (for frozen gpu), then I use eraser to seal up the socket (no air can get in, no condensation inside), Some bits of shop towel to level up the board with the top of the socket & then a foam cutout for the pot.

Not sure if I have enough eraser to do a full mobo, might just use the vaseline like last year, 2 minutes of insulating to go from air cooled to -196°.


----------



## nubsrevenge

i delidded just now and my temps are like 5 degrees higher... ill reseat again and see if i didnt use enough paste or something...

reseated, i saw that the die has a little section maybe 1/8th that didnt get covered in TIM. but now im just back to "normal" temps

so i went from pre-delid as normal temps, delid and bad TIM coverage +5 temps, delid and better coverage back to normal temps =/

i used AS 5, and from what ive read the coollab ultra is what really makes it better, so ill order that, but with AS5 i at least thought it would have been a little better


my temps are all over the place


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nubsrevenge*
> 
> i delidded just now and my temps are like 5 degrees higher... ill reseat again and see if i didnt use enough paste or something...
> 
> reseated, i saw that the die has a little section maybe 1/8th that didnt get covered in TIM. but now im just back to "normal" temps
> 
> so i went from pre-delid as normal temps, delid and bad TIM coverage +5 temps, delid and better coverage back to normal temps =/
> 
> i used AS 5, and from what ive read the coollab ultra is what really makes it better, so ill order that, but with AS5 i at least thought it would have been a little better
> 
> 
> my temps are all over the place


Did you clean all the glue off of the PCB and the back of the IHS? If not make sure it is clean so that your IHS sits as snug as possible on the die.


----------



## nubsrevenge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Did you clean all the blue off of the PCB and the back of the IHS? If not make sure it is clean so that your IHS sits as snug as possible on the die.


if you meant glue, yes i completely cleaned the entire PCB and die, applied half rice grain of TIM and got it in. I have a new corsair h100i thats installed and ive been wondering if thats the problem though. too many things that could be wrong. but as for delidding alone, it didnt make much of a change at all unless there is still something i could fix


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nubsrevenge*
> 
> if you meant glue, yes i completely cleaned the entire PCB and die, applied half rice grain of TIM and got it in. I have a new corsair h100i thats installed and ive been wondering if thats the problem though. too many things that could be wrong. but as for delidding alone, it didnt make much of a change at all unless there is still something i could fix


How did you apply the TIM on the Die...


----------



## neofury

Make sure you're IHS is flat and not bent and that the block is mounted onto it properly. For the IHS top use the rice method, for the die I don't know if you should spread it with AS5, but that's what I did with CLP.

I even put some on the back side of the IHS to give it what I hope is a better heat transfer.

The H100 could also be defective? Does the pump sound OK? No leaks? It is odd that you get higher temps after a cooler upgrade and a delid. Make sure the IHS is seated properly on the CPU and clamped down firmly. Get CLP/CLU asap.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yes, just the way ivy behaves when delidded with extreme cold temps. Not really a voltage issue, ivy is just a weirdo & likes getting delidded for air & water cooling, but likes to keep her hat on for extreme cold.
> Delidding right in front of the intel rep would be one way to send a message.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...


...I didn't delid in front of an Intel rep, but the store manager where I bought the chip knows it's delidded (and lapped, and CL-Ued)...he and a regional Intel sales rep were chatting with me when the manager (who oc's) tried to buy the chip back from me (sometimes, truth is stranger than fiction







)....the Intel rep just asked what batch number I had...that VID of 1.271v @ 5 GHz seems to get people's attention


----------



## dr/owned

SetTitleMatchMode 1
SetTitleMatchMode Fast


----------



## nubsrevenge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Make sure you're IHS is flat and not bent and that the block is mounted onto it properly. For the IHS top use the rice method, for the die I don't know if you should spread it with AS5, but that's what I did with CLP.
> 
> I even put some on the back side of the IHS to give it what I hope is a better heat transfer.
> 
> The H100 could also be defective? Does the pump sound OK? No leaks? It is odd that you get higher temps after a cooler upgrade and a delid. Make sure the IHS is seated properly on the CPU and clamped down firmly. Get CLP/CLU asap.


i put basmati rice sized(lol) on the die, and pea sized on IHS. pump sounds fine, no leaks, no bubbles that i hear, the pipes dont heat up, the fans change speed. One thing wrong is i cant see any fan speeds or water temp in corsair link which is weird. i hope its just the cooler..


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nubsrevenge*
> 
> i put basmati rice sized(lol) on the die, and pea sized on IHS. pump sounds fine, no leaks, no bubbles that i hear, the pipes dont heat up, the fans change speed. One thing wrong is i cant see any fan speeds or water temp in corsair link which is weird. i hope its just the cooler..


If you look back you'll see I used AS5 as I awaited my CLP. I had around 7-10c temp drop. But I used the line method. I first tried the spread and it didn't work had worse temps. On the rectangle DIE the line method seems to work best (At least in my case it did.) except with CLP/CLU its best with the spread method on DIE and possibly bottom of IHS. Are you also making sure with you re-lock the lever, that you are holding the IHS? If not it will slid forward, smearing the AS5.


----------



## nubsrevenge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> If you look back you'll see I used AS5 as I awaited my CLP. I had around 7-10c temp drop. But I used the line method. I first tried the spread and it didn't work had worse temps. On the rectangle DIE the line method seems to work best (At least in my case it did.) except with CLP/CLU its best with the spread method on DIE and possibly bottom of IHS. Are you also making sure with you re-lock the lever, that you are holding the IHS? If not it will slid forward, smearing the AS5.


yea it pretty much was the line method, though i did let the IHS slide after placing it a littler higher so it slid down into the center, ill try to hold it in place better next time


----------



## .theMetal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yes, just the way ivy behaves when delidded with extreme cold temps. Not really a voltage issue, ivy is just a weirdo & likes getting delidded for air & water cooling, but likes to keep her hat on for extreme cold.


Gotcha I figured so, just making sure.







appreciate it.


----------



## ozzy1925

i found an 2old pc in my my office one of them is amd sempron
http://products.amd.com/pages/DesktopCPUDetail.aspx?id=138&f1=AMD+Sempron%E2%84%A2&f2=&f3=&f4=&f5=&f6=&f7=&f8=&f9=1600&f10=False&f11=False&f12=False
and the other one is p4 2.40 http://www.cpu-world.com/sspec/SL/SL6EU.html
i want to practise deliding with these but how can i know they are soldered or not?


----------



## ozzy1925

well i found out p4 is not soldered it took me 2-3 mins here is the pic:

05072013006.jpg 1119k .jpg file

after cleaning :

05072013008.jpg 1554k .jpg file

sorry for the quality taken from my cell phone


----------



## ivanlabrie

Cool! Most p4's aren't soldered, except for 775 ones, some aren't but most use solder.
Do you have a board to test it?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Cool! Most p4's aren't soldered, except for 775 ones, some aren't but most use solder.
> Do you have a board to test it?


yea i have a pc but missing a vga card will figure out something


----------



## luckymatt

Quote:


> i put basmati rice sized(lol) on the die, and pea sized on IHS. pump sounds fine, no leaks, no bubbles that i hear, the pipes dont heat up, the fans change speed. One thing wrong is i cant see any fan speeds or water temp in corsair link which is weird. i hope its just the cooler..


Pea sized amount of thermal paste? Unless your peas are much smaller than mine, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that's way too much. It's just my method/opinion, but I use as little paste as possible, and try to spread it out first as thin as possible so it is JUST BARELY opaque (i.e. you can't see the top of the lid through it if that makes sense).

Again, just my opinion, but metal to metal contact is best...the paste is there simply to fill in small imperfections in the metal. If cooler base and cpu lid are both lapped, i just "polish" both surfaces with the paste, and wipe off all the excess so the surfaces appear dull.


----------



## Valgaur

Alright vagur has news on clu and long time applications! It does stick on pretty well actually no pics yeah I know im a noob for not doing that but I was getting ln2 stuffs ready didn't have time. So anyways you have to sand it off or atleast I did on the top of the IHS but mine was sanded kinda meh and it was simply filling in the gaps. The underside and die was still perfectly fine


----------



## AlDyer

Hammer and vice method here. Worked so good and it let me go from 4.5 to 4.8 GHz and I am still having lower temps. I'm running 4.8GHz 1.4v

I also ran 4.9 but the voltage required was unsafe at a whopping 1.488v considering someone had already fried their chip at 1.5v

CPU is of course a i5 4670K as you can see from my sig rig.


----------



## tw33k

Having problems with my ASRock OC Formula and was hoping someone could take a look at http://www.overclock.net/t/1306881/asrock-z77-oc-formula-overclocking-troubleshooting-discussion/750_50#post_20321955 and the post after and tell me if I'm missing something or if something really weird is going on. I'd appreciate it.


----------



## Robbieboy

OCN name: Robbieboy
CPU: Core i5 3570k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: ~30°C

Before CLP

Core 1....92c
Core 2....92c
Core 3....91c
Core 4....87c

I turned Aida off after less than 3 mins as it went above 90c ...









With CLP

Core 1....61c
Core 2....61c
Core 3....61c
Core 4....61c

Taken at 20 mins of Aida....









Some pic's



Before


After


----------



## neofury

I don't know what your voltage is but awesome job. If it's pretty low 5ghz should be easy for you.


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I don't know what your voltage is but awesome job. If it's pretty low 5ghz should be easy for you.


That's the problem it scaled great till i got to 4.5Ghz @ 1.284v But i have tested 4.6Ghz @ 1.360v and it still bluescreens after 5-10 mins of Aida or Prime 95....









I hit my Wall i think....


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> That's the problem it scaled great till i got to 4.5Ghz @ 1.284v But i have tested 4.6Ghz @ 1.360v and it still bluescreens after 5-10 mins of Aida or Prime 95....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hit my Wall i think....


For me after 4.8 it scaled crazily. We're talking 1.3v becomes 1.45v for 5.0ghz for me.

What bluescreen # were you getting?

I would guess around 1.284 + .05 = 1.334v or even 1.329v not 1.360

I have had issues before giving too much voltage for a certain OC. But most people around here seem to always say it's lower voltage, but one blue screen is actually raise/lower (one of) and when I was getting that one, it normally meant I had to lower it.

Edit:

0x101 = increase vcore
0x124 = increase/decrease vcore

See 99% of the time if I needed to raise, I got 0x101
80% of the time when I got 0x124, I needed to lower it.

For some people maybe it's different, but for me I had that.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Alright vagur has news on clu and long time applications! It does stick on pretty well actually no pics yeah I know im a noob for not doing that but I was getting ln2 stuffs ready didn't have time. So anyways you have to sand it off or atleast I did on the top of the IHS but mine was sanded kinda meh and it was simply filling in the gaps. The underside and die was still perfectly fine


...good to know - my delidded Ivy had this current CL-U application on for about 5 month now, and I have not noticed any changes in temp on idle / load. I have also read that if left undisturbed, CL-U will last for 'many' (=?) years


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> For me after 4.8 it scaled crazily. We're talking 1.3v becomes 1.45v for 5.0ghz for me.
> 
> What bluescreen # were you getting?
> 
> I would guess around 1.284 + .05 = 1.334v or even 1.329v not 1.360
> 
> I have had issues before giving too much voltage for a certain OC. But most people around here seem to always say it's lower voltage, but one blue screen is actually raise/lower (one of) and when I was getting that one, it normally meant I had to lower it.


Yeah i started at 1.320v and went up 0.010v at a time till i got to 1.360v and then called it a day.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> Yeah i started at 1.320v and went up 0.010v at a time till i got to 1.360v and then called it a day.


Damn that sucks. I edited my post but I'll re-link what I meant:

0x101 = increase vcore
0x124 = increase/decrease vcore

For me this was 100% accurate for 101 and 80% accurate for 124.

Were they all 124's? It could maybe need a bit less than imagined? Even 1.3 is a fair amount of voltage.


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Damn that sucks. I edited my post but I'll re-link what I meant:
> 
> 0x101 = increase vcore
> 0x124 = increase/decrease vcore
> 
> For me this was 100% accurate for 101 and 80% accurate for 124.
> 
> Were they all 124's? It could maybe need a bit less than imagined? Even 1.3 is a fair amount of voltage.


Mabe i will give it another go now i have good temps!!!


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> Mabe i will give it another go now i have good temps!!!


If it's 124 try lowering it. I mean dude it might even be worthwhile trying 1.29 etc just to see if it boots and how long it lasts in prime95, it can't hurt.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...good to know - my delidded Ivy had this current CL-U application on for about 5 month now, and I have not noticed any changes in temp on idle / load. I have also read that if left undisturbed, CL-U will last for 'many' (=?) years


I just pulled my 3770k out of my MVF, pulled off the IHS and used the brush to redistribute the CLU. Put it in my new MVE and am actually showing 3* lower at Idle than I had initially on the first install. It was still wet looking. I haven't run IBT yet, but am expecting lower max temps as well. I initially used the CLU only 2 weeks ago. Wonder how it is after 6 months???


----------



## Icydead

Hey guys Im back, this time with 4770k I just finished delidding. I did razor method but I havent got any photos, because I thought I killed the chip and so I hurried towards turning it on to see if it worked. Currently testing [email protected] - impossible without delid as highest temperature at [email protected] was 89°C at prime 95 8Ks. It looks good so far, max temp in IBT was 65°C on the hottest core with h100i. Ill be back later (gonna see if it survives the night).


----------



## phaseshift

I posted earlier this week about my delid just wanted to post some pictures







the only thing that I can say went wrong was I think I may have clamped it a little too tight as there are a few teeth marks on the IHS from the vice. The chip didn't fly but I wanted to make sure I had enough padding in case it did.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Congrats! I'm tempted to do it as soon as I get my chip, but have to fight back that urge.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> I just pulled my 3770k out of my MVF, pulled off the IHS and used the brush to redistribute the CLU. Put it in my new MVE and am actually showing 3* lower at Idle than I had initially on the first install. It was still wet looking. I haven't run IBT yet, but am expecting lower max temps as well. I initially used the CLU only 2 weeks ago. Wonder how it is after 6 months???


...yeah it took me about 4 tries / CL-U applications over 1 1/2 months before I got it right - the last one w/lapping that dealt with a concavity issue on the IHS


----------



## Valgaur

I request that all applications made in the last 24 hours and the next 2 days to be pmed to myself please as I am no where near a good place to access the file to add you I can get you in on Monday! Until then, happy ocing and.and happy delidding!


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Still no CLU. Because customs likes to steal (kidding, but seriously no idea where it is) If it doesn't show up soon i'm just gonna order it from frozencpu.

So i decided to get some MX-4. From what i can tell, i'm already seeing a 11-12C temp drop with my current OC.


----------



## neofury

That's a good sign. I'm thinking of just putting CLP on the IHS instead of the AS5. Not only do I think I may have applied it incorrectly, but I want to check the die too. One core is like 72c the others are all 78-80-78, and that's just from 10 mins of prime. By about 20-30 mins it should be 74-84-88-84 or some bs like that. I'm hoping I can get everything to like 74-78 instead.

I used the line method with the AS5 but I think maybe I put too much? I have a habit of doing that. If I can shave some C by applying the CLP anyways, and I put the CLP properly, it should yield a good difference.

How should I apply the CLP to the top of the IHS. Dot? Line? Rice? Spread?

EDIT: Yep, 18~ mins prime 80-87-87-83, its the first time that core hit 80. Ambient is extremely high at the moment so it does make sense.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> That's a good sign. I'm thinking of just putting CLP on the IHS instead of the AS5. Not only do I think I may have applied it incorrectly, but I want to check the die too. One core is like 72c the others are all 78-80-78, and that's just from 10 mins of prime. By about 20-30 mins it should be 74-84-88-84 or some bs like that. I'm hoping I can get everything to like 74-78 instead.
> 
> I used the line method with the AS5 but I think maybe I put too much? I have a habit of doing that. If I can shave some C by applying the CLP anyways, and I put the CLP properly, it should yield a good difference.
> 
> How should I apply the CLP to the top of the IHS. Dot? Line? Rice? Spread?
> 
> EDIT: Yep, 18~ mins prime 80-87-87-83, its the first time that core hit 80. Ambient is extremely high at the moment so it does make sense.


On the die i basically used a single dot of tim, like what would just seep it from being turned right side up, it was barely anything. And then on the under side of the IHS i dabbed whatever was on the end of the tube in a vertical line down the middle of it. just so it makes contact with the die TIM.

On the IHS i used a small grain of rice size vertical line, What i have noticed is if you seat your cooler on the IHS and then have to lift it off for whatever reason, maybe to properly screw it into the mounting bracket cause its off on 1 side, its gonna cause problems, lifting off the tim is gonna create air bubbles.

I have used AS5 once testing my delid temps, and yeah it was pretty crappy results. Mostly cause of the break in period, with my MX-4 i instantly saw a 10 to 12c temp drop.

*BEFORE Delid Temps* _H100 + AS5, Tim Mate 2, Cooler Master RTH02 or whatever its called._

*Prime95 Large FTT* 85c 81c 80c 80c









*IBT Custom 8192MB* 101c 92c 91c 91c








*Idle* 41c 39c 37c 37c









*AFTER DELID Temps* _H220 + MX-4_

*Prime95 Large FTT* 71c 65c 67c 64c
*IBT Custom 8192MB* 78c 88c 87c 83c
*Idle* 35c 34c 33c 33c

Comfortable room temp in all tests

Now with all that being said, most of my rooms temp rising comes from my SLI GTX 670 setup that has a bios mod, forced voltage increase/throttle removed OC raising the temps. If i added those to my H220 loop my temps would probably drop a bit more.

When my CLU shows up im planning on lapping the top of the IHS. Cause why not? if its concave and the highest points are along the outside of the IHS then the cooler isn't properly resting on the area that has the most heat.

Also I have a feeling i'm gonna have a very hard time getting to 4.8 on this chip without a suicidal voltage. I messed around with it a bit last night to see what i could get it to run at and not have IBT crash or BSOD. I was going into the 1.470+ range.

To me that seems crazy that i need

1.365v Core
1.500v Cpu PLL
Ultra High LLC (75%)
x46

And for a 200MHz increase i need

1.470v+? Core
1.500v+? Cpu PLL
Ultra High LLC (75%)
x48

I honestly have no idea what i should keep it under or close to for a 24/7 OC. I'm assuming if i have to go into the 1.5v range for 4.8Ghz i should probably just give up.


----------



## Cr4zy

OCN name: Cr4zy
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Coollabs Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: 4300Mhz
Temp drops: ~15c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2855549

Have yet to really try and overclock it just thrown the multi to 43 so far on stock volts.
Ambient temps rose a few c while i was doing it, so it might be closer to 20c gained.

Before:


After:


CPU:


Back in:


Hammer and vice method gave it a test on an old chip went alright, been waiting for new harddrives to arrive but they didnt turn up so got impatient and went and whacked the lid off


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

OCN name: EnthusiastG4m3r
CPU: Intel Core i7 3770k (Costa Rica)
on die-TIM: MX-4
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4600MHz
Temp drops: 11-15c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2855569


----------



## justanoldman

Congrats to everyone on all these successful deliddings.

As far as using CLU on top of the IHS, use it at your own risk, I have posted previously about that. You should get in the neighborhood of 3c better than a standard TIM, but that will vary based on a number of variables.

A large spread in core temps can be a poor on-die TIM application, or a combination of poor IHS to cooler contact with a non-optimal TIM application there too. The longer you run Prime95 the more evened out my max core temps become, but you shouldn't have max temps from your hottest to coldest core differ by 10c or more after delidding.

I redid my die TIM application a few times to get it as good as possible, and you can see from the screenshot below that after 24 hours of Prime 95 my max core temps were 73, 77, 74, 73. So only 4c separated the max temps. I would estimate most delidded chips should be able to get in the 4 to 8c range between hottest and coldest max temps on the cores.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Congrats to everyone on all these successful deliddings.
> 
> As far as using CLU on top of the IHS, use it at your own risk, I have posted previously about that. You should get in the neighborhood of 3c better than a standard TIM, but that will vary based on a number of variables.
> 
> A large spread in core temps can be a poor on-die TIM application, or a combination of poor IHS to cooler contact with a non-optimal TIM application there too. The longer you run Prime95 the more evened out my max core temps become, but you shouldn't have max temps from your hottest to coldest core differ by 10c or more after delidding.
> 
> I redid my die TIM application a few times to get it as good as possible, and you can see from the screenshot below that after 24 hours of Prime 95 my max core temps were 73, 77, 74, 73. So only 4c separated the max temps. I would estimate most delidded chips should be able to get in the 4 to 8c range between hottest and coldest max temps on the cores.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Day to day application use, the hottest core temp can be 10c higher right?, the reason that picture shows one core quite a bit higher is cause its a single core application. I'm gonna try running prime again, if i see a 10c difference ill be lapping, and reapplying

Ok after running Large FTT for about 5 mins, my temps are even now. I guess from not being on for a few days to booting and instantly going to prime is why my cores temps might of been off, i updated my post that had my after delid temps


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

I might of just had an amazing breakthrough... Or im just stupid... So i guess increasing my VCCSA voltage allows for a higher OC.


----------



## neofury

So I just went to put CLP on top of my IHS. I tightened my heatsink all the way and now my comp is fried









I tried re-seating several times and it boots for 2 seconds and goes off and tries again endlessly. If I take out the CPU, it tries one time and stops completely.

I'm pretty sure luckily it's the mobo, I noticed some bent pins







Problem is I don't even know if me putting heatsink pressure bent them, or if I bent them when re-seating the CPU multiple times, though I'm pretty sure the pressure bent them. The CPU looks beautiful still but I see bent pins on the mobo







Pretty weak, all I did was unhook the heatsink, apply CLP instead of AS5, put it back on and tighten it









Then from there, it wouldn't boot. Tried alternate PSU, tried unplugging everything but necessary stuff, etc. Either the board or the chip are fried, I wish I knew which but the chip looks perfect still where as the board has bent pins. Any insight would be great. I'm on a crap laptop until Friday now, then I'll have to go buy another mobo sigh. I just hope I don't buy the mobo put the chip in and have the same issue.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> Day to day application use, the hottest core temp can be 10c higher right?, the reason that picture shows one core quite a bit higher is cause its a single core application. I'm gonna try running prime again, if i see a 10c difference ill be lapping, and reapplying
> 
> Ok after running Large FTT for about 5 mins, my temps are even now. I guess from not being on for a few days to booting and instantly going to prime is why my cores temps might of been off, i updated my post that had my after delid temps


You are correct, there can be a large difference in max temps if you are just using an application that is just using one core. I was just referring to a large spread between max temps after running Prime95, or some other stress program, for a while.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> So I just went to put CLP on top of my IHS. I tightened my heatsink all the way and now my comp is fried
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tried re-seating several times and it boots for 2 seconds and goes off and tries again endlessly. If I take out the CPU, it tries one time and stops completely.
> 
> I'm pretty sure luckily it's the mobo, I noticed some bent pins
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Problem is I don't even know if me putting heatsink pressure bent them, or if I bent them when re-seating the CPU multiple times, though I'm pretty sure the pressure bent them. The CPU looks beautiful still but I see bent pins on the mobo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pretty weak, all I did was unhook the heatsink, apply CLP instead of AS5, put it back on and tighten it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then from there, it wouldn't boot. Tried alternate PSU, tried unplugging everything but necessary stuff, etc. Either the board or the chip are fried, I wish I knew which but the chip looks perfect still where as the board has bent pins. Any insight would be great. I'm on a crap laptop until Friday now, then I'll have to go buy another mobo sigh. I just hope I don't buy the mobo put the chip in and have the same issue.


Sorry to hear that. Do you, or anyone you know have another chip you can try? That would be one easy way to check. If you see bent pins that could definitely be an issue. A number of people have straightened the pins with a mechanical pencil.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You are correct, there can be a large difference in max temps if you are just using an application that is just using one core. I was just referring to a large spread between max temps after running Prime95, or some other stress program, for a while.
> Sorry to hear that. Do you, or anyone you know have another chip you can try? That would be one easy way to check. If you see bent pins that could definitely be an issue. A number of people have straightened the pins with a mechanical pencil.


The mechanical pencil idea is intriguing actually. I don't even get how I did it, one second comp ran fine next second I add some fans and tighten the heatsink after apply different TIM and it wouldn't boot. Then after several seating attempts (which were all fine, the cpu seemed to go right where it should) I look and some pins in one area are bent. I never forced the CPU it always just clicked right in. Only thing I can think of is making it too tight push down hard bending some pins, or I somehow did it with seating, but the issue occurred after no re-seating attempts.

Bahh, guess I'll try and pick up an ROG Friday then. Shame but I could try the pencil idea tonight.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> Also I have a feeling i'm gonna have a very hard time getting to 4.8 on this chip without a suicidal voltage. I messed around with it a bit last night to see what i could get it to run at and not have IBT crash or BSOD. I was going into the 1.470+ range.
> 
> To me that seems crazy that i need
> 
> 1.365v Core
> 1.500v Cpu PLL
> Ultra High LLC (75%)
> x46
> 
> And for a 200MHz increase i need
> 
> 1.470v+? Core
> 1.500v+? Cpu PLL
> Ultra High LLC (75%)
> x48
> 
> I honestly have no idea what i should keep it under or close to for a 24/7 OC. I'm assuming if i have to go into the 1.5v range for 4.8Ghz i should probably just give up.


I wouldn't run 4.8 @ 1.47V long term when you can run 4.6 @ 1.37 instead. That 0.1V increase isn't worth the inconsequential speed increase from 4.6 to 4.8.


----------



## martinhal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> The mechanical pencil idea is intriguing actually. I don't even get how I did it, one second comp ran fine next second I add some fans and tighten the heatsink after apply different TIM and it wouldn't boot. Then after several seating attempts (which were all fine, the cpu seemed to go right where it should) I look and some pins in one area are bent. I never forced the CPU it always just clicked right in. Only thing I can think of is making it too tight push down hard bending some pins, or I somehow did it with seating, but the issue occurred after no re-seating attempts.
> 
> Bahh, guess I'll try and pick up an ROG Friday then. Shame but I could try the pencil idea tonight.


Send MB in for repairs . I did on a Asus cost $50-00 to fix pins.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I wouldn't run 4.8 @ 1.47V long term when you can run 4.6 @ 1.37 instead. That 0.1V increase isn't worth the inconsequential speed increase from 4.6 to 4.8.


I'm running 4.7 @ 1.410v now. I actually tested to see how far i have to push my voltage to not see WHEA errors, and it was 1.51v for 4.8GHz, which is nuts. I have a terrible chip


----------



## bigkahuna360

I...I finally delidded my 3570k!










I also installed 4 Noctua NF-P12 PWMs and it is the greatest purchase I have ever made. Even in P/P they are dead silent..


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

How much degradation will i see in the 1.5v range? Are we talking a couple years and the chip will be poop? And i mean that like 2 years and dead?. Cause if that's the case i dont care. Ill probably have an entirely different pc in 2 years


----------



## ucantescape1992

Edit: Nevermind, found out that my gpu pump (Antec 620) wasn't plugged in properly. GPU was causing the shutdowns.

Can you guys help me figure out why my computer is shutting off.

So I just went in and applied CLU to the die and inside of the IHS, used thin layers on both. I can boot up, and I even got away with running a full pass of IBT. Max temp was 62. This is 4.6Ghz @ 1.280V.

Then it powers off. No errors, no blue screens, no freezes. From running just fine, with great temps, to as if someone unplugged my comp. Then it boots back up again fine....

Does this within the first 5 minutes of being booted up.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> The mechanical pencil idea is intriguing actually. I don't even get how I did it, one second comp ran fine next second I add some fans and tighten the heatsink after apply different TIM and it wouldn't boot. Then after several seating attempts (which were all fine, the cpu seemed to go right where it should) I look and some pins in one area are bent. I never forced the CPU it always just clicked right in. Only thing I can think of is making it too tight push down hard bending some pins, or I somehow did it with seating, but the issue occurred after no re-seating attempts.
> 
> Bahh, guess I'll try and pick up an ROG Friday then. Shame but I could try the pencil idea tonight.


I couldn't recommend the mech. pencil tip for Intel socket pins. When I attempted to fix mine using this, it was horrible. The tip bumps into all the pins around the one you're trying to straighten causing more problems. I ended up using a micro flathead screwdriver and was done in a few minutes. Just carefully prod the pins back into line with the others. That mech. pencil tip would work great on AMD cpu pins, but sucks for Intel socket pins. Goodluck!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I request that all applications made in the last 24 hours and the next 2 days to be pmed to myself please as I am no where near a good place to access the file to add you I can get you in on Monday! Until then, happy ocing and.and happy delidding!


...how is good old Toronto & Grand Champion Series ? ...hope you used up all that LN2 !


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Edit: Nevermind, found out that my gpu pump (Antec 620) wasn't plugged in properly. GPU was causing the shutdowns.
> 
> Can you guys help me figure out why my computer is shutting off.
> 
> So I just went in and applied CLU to the die and inside of the IHS, used thin layers on both. I can boot up, and I even got away with running a full pass of IBT. Max temp was 62. This is 4.6Ghz @ 1.280V.
> 
> Then it powers off. No errors, no blue screens, no freezes. From running just fine, with great temps, to as if someone unplugged my comp. Then it boots back up again fine....
> 
> Does this within the first 5 minutes of being booted up.


...unfortunately, this can be because of a whole host of reasons...you need more info in order to track it....could be 'mechanical' ie a cold' solder spot that breaks contact once the computer warms up (ditto for a pin contact that is just 'barely' on)...but I recently had a similar situation - in that case, it came down to RAM timings which were way too tight (far tighter than manufacturer's specs) before stability testing was even on the menu as I started to loosen the timings a bit to find that potential 'pass range'.

...in addition, it can also relate to a process that kicks in after 5 min (ie anything from screensaver to other 'go to sleep after 5 min if no user input is present') It could be useful to 'time' the shutdown event by letting it run, than sit idle w/o user input...does it always occur at the same exact interval ?


----------



## Bartouille

Just did the delid thing on my 4770k with some nt-h1 and temp drop is barely 5-7C. I need to get some CLU asap. At least the hardest thing is done. It took so many hammer hit to get that PCB from the IHS. Cleaned the glue on the ihs and pcb with my nails and with some random alchool and it's pretty neat. I also kinda messed up re positioning of the IHS with the clip, took about 2 times to get it right.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Cleaned the glue on the ihs and pcb with my nails and with some random alchool and it's pretty neat. I also kinda messed up re positioning of the IHS with the clip, took about 2 times to get it right.


Random alcohol? You been pouring scotch over your chip?


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Random alcohol? You been pouring scotch over your chip?


Methanol 99.9%. I don't know if it's okay it's my dad that handed to me he said it will be fine. I did a pretty good job tbh!


----------



## nagle3092

Number 2 under my belt with a razor.


----------



## scorpscarx

Grats, I too prefer razor method, leaves you with a flawless IHS.


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Grats, I too prefer razor method, leaves you with a flawless IHS.


Yeah its pretty easy, I did get 2 _very_ slight nicks in the pcb thought right at 2 of the corners. But it just looks like they took off the surface and no copper as the chip is running fine (thankfully). I couldn't tell until I cleaned up the chip and took of the sealant.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Grats, I too prefer razor method, leaves you with a flawless IHS.


So you prefer a flawless IHS to a flawless PCB?


----------



## nagle3092

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> So you prefer a flawless IHS to a flawless PCB?


Doesn't matter in the end, I could give a damn less as long as the chip runs afterwards.


----------



## scorpscarx

Hell no, but I assume that to be a given. I've done razor method twice and I trust my own abilities, didn't nick the pcb.


----------



## stickg1

Either method you should have a flawless PCB and IHS, if not, you did it wrong.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nagle3092*
> 
> Doesn't matter in the end, *I could give a damn* less as long as the chip runs afterwards.


You mean couldn't give a damn. "could give a damn" means you care

Phobya Liquid Metal arrived today so I just need some time to run a few comparisons against Liquid Ultra and Liquid Pro


----------



## Molokou

Hello guys!
Just came to say hello and to say I lapped my 3770K IHS and after some testing, got ~2°C improvement









Only got as high as 1200 grit, but the result is fairly acceptable:





Now I'm using CLP on the die instead of CLU, and MX-4 between IHS and waterblock








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> *Phobya Liquid Metal* arrived today so I just need some time to run a few comparisons against Liquid Ultra and Liquid Pro


Hooray!
I'm looking forward to your testing








I've read too much about that TIM that now I want to see someone using it already and know his thoughts about it









Greets!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Phobya Liquid Metal arrived today so I just need some time to run a few comparisons against Liquid Ultra and Liquid Pro


FYI, a member here, I_Shot, did tests with Phobya previously:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1360505/thermal-paste-shootout-intel-generic-cm-htk-002-gelid-extreme-mx-2-phobya-lm

And:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1376460/liquid-metal-versus-non-metal-compounds-update

It will be interesting to see if you come to the same conclusions.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

I wish NCIX would carry CLU & CLP. I'm really not quite sure why they dont. It would be a hot seller. With that being said... I'm still waiting on my CLU, its day 7 of business days


----------



## mojobear

Hi Guys!

Would love to join the club. Got a delidded 4770k running @ 4.7 GHZ with 1.264V. Running on an asus extreme VI. Cooling is with an XSPC raystorm, EK 420 + XSPC RX360.

Here is my validation below.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> I wish NCIX would carry CLU & CLP. I'm really not quite sure why they dont. It would be a hot seller. With that being said... I'm still waiting on my CLU, its day 7 of business days


I asked an NCIX manager (and oc enthusiast) about carrying CL-U / P and other LM products. He said that the volume wasn't enough ITO, apart from FrozenCPU already carrying it...I ordered both 'from the factory' in Germany and from FrozenCPU in the US and it always got here (W.Canada) on time.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mojobear*
> 
> Hi Guys!
> 
> Would love to join the club. Got a delidded 4770k running @ 4.7 GHZ with 1.264V. Running on an asus extreme VI. Cooling is with an XSPC raystorm, EK 420 + XSPC RX360.
> 
> Here is my validation below.


*...congrats* ! Looks very good. I have a delidded Ivy (Maximus V) and a Sandy-E (Rampage IV) and am toying with the idea of adding a Max-6 / Haswell - good to see postings such as yours.

BTW, does Haswell do 'strap125/BCLK125' ? That's what I run on the Sandy-E which allows for a bit more speed options at slightly lower v-core at given speeds...though it also comes down to your memory speed options w/straps & BCLK different than 100


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> FYI, a member here, I_Shot, did tests with Phobya previously:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1360505/thermal-paste-shootout-intel-generic-cm-htk-002-gelid-extreme-mx-2-phobya-lm
> 
> And:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376460/liquid-metal-versus-non-metal-compounds-update
> 
> It will be interesting to see if you come to the same conclusions.


Thanks for those. I didn't realise someone had already done it but I think I'll still go ahead with mine for comparison. I have a number of regular pastes I'm going to compare with the liquid metals as well. I just need to grab some IC Diamond and I'll be ready.


----------



## ivanlabrie

I've been thinking about this, and it looks like Haswell will need to be delidded to run nicely on air, at least for someone like me.
I hope I get an ok clocker on air, and decent ram controller...should have one next month.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> I asked an NCIX manager (and oc enthusiast) about carrying CL-U / P and other LM products. He said that the volume wasn't enough ITO, apart from FrozenCPU already carrying it...I ordered both 'from the factory' in Germany and from FrozenCPU in the US and it always got here (W.Canada) on time.
> *...congrats* ! Looks very good. I have a delidded Ivy (Maximus V) and a Sandy-E (Rampage IV) and am toying with the idea of adding a Max-6 / Haswell - good to see postings such as yours.
> 
> BTW, does Haswell do 'strap125/BCLK125' ? That's what I run on the Sandy-E which allows for a bit more speed options at slightly lower v-core at given speeds...though it also comes down to your memory speed options w/straps & BCLK different than 100


The straps don't really work right, setting the strap to 125 will fail to boot, but leaving the strap on auto & setting 125 bclk will boot & come up as 125 bclk & 1.25 strap in bios. So far for me it has been pretty flaky if/when it gets to desktop though, think I'm missing a setting or voltage somewhere that needs to change.

Congrats Valgaur, checking out the tallied scores from the Toronto event looks like you came in first place on the 2d benching, putting your team over the top.
It was good to meet you there!


----------



## ivanlabrie

I heard Val did good...major props








It was about time!


----------



## Sev7_d

I'm also having wondering about the same thing (BCLK Strap). Has anybody succesfully booted with a 125hz bclk strap? I'd love to lower my vcore and temps.


----------



## FtW 420

One of the guys who has been running at 125 told me to tweak with the IO voltages, but I haven't had a chance to test it myself yet. Have to get the haswell rig back together pretty quick & try it out.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Ask Splave or any of the ram addict thread guys...


----------



## Boulard83

First paste testing. : Noctua NH-1 versus EVGA Frostbite.



Well, the frostbite suck .... loll ! I had good hope on the frostbite paste since it seems to spread well under pressure but it did not deliver good results. I redid the Frostbite application ( wich seemed perfect on removal of the first appkication ) and had very similar result... Frostbite is'nt good at this ! I then searched a bit on the web and found that "EVGA jacob" on EVGA forum seems to recommand a 24h cure time for the Frostbite..... Will retest tomorow !

I also prepared the CPU for the incoming CLP and CLU "TIM".


----------



## Mogwaii

Hi all.

Ive order Coolaboratory Ultra and gonna use it instead of noctua paste ive been using, reason that i am swapping is that 1 core is 12-15 c below the other 3 when i run prime95.
So i was hopen it was bad mounting from my part and ive heard so much about this liquid metall paste.

The instructions on the first page "on this forum" show paste both on the core and inside the IHS , is it not enough to put the paste on the core?,or will that not be enough to touch the ISH when mounting?

Will apply it on a i5 3570k

Best reguards Rickard


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Boulard83*
> 
> First paste testing. : Noctua NH-1 versus EVGA Frostbite.
> 
> 
> 
> Well, the frostbite suck .... loll ! I had good hope on the frostbite paste since it seems to spread well under pressure but it did not deliver good results. I redid the Frostbite application ( wich seemed perfect on removal of the first appkication ) and had very similar result... Frostbite is'nt good at this ! I then searched a bit on the web and found that "EVGA jacob" on EVGA forum seems to recommand a 24h cure time for the Frostbite..... Will retest tomorow !
> 
> I also prepared the CPU for the incoming CLP and CLU "TIM".


uh, why is there a bottle of nail polish next to it


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> uh, why is there a bottle of nail polish next to it


I would guess he was prepared for a possible nick on the PCB.
Good planning, if it got nicked, covering the nick & then testing the cpu is the way to do it. Nicking & testing with a short does the damage, then it is too late to try to fix it after it gets cooked by a short circuit.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> uh, why is there a bottle of nail polish next to it


You can see in the pic the little VRMs seem to have been coated with it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...how is good old Toronto & Grand Champion Series ? ...hope you used up all that LN2 !


It was great! First time on Ln2 and meeting the crazy ocn benchers I've been chatting with for so long finally, great people great gear made for a sweet event. I got ram validation of 2941 mhz cpu at 5.5 (limited speed to keep competition fair) got bclk to 105. I totally forgot about those strapped bclk areas... along with everybody else lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The straps don't really work right, setting the strap to 125 will fail to boot, but leaving the strap on auto & setting 125 bclk will boot & come up as 125 bclk & 1.25 strap in bios. So far for me it has been pretty flaky if/when it gets to desktop though, think I'm missing a setting or voltage somewhere that needs to change.
> 
> Congrats Valgaur, checking out the tallied scores from the Toronto event looks like you came in first place on the 2d benching, putting your team over the top.
> It was good to meet you there!


I barely won that sucker with my Ram and bclk only, I was talkin to gappo and he was surprised at my scores with how everything I got...was all on the same validation lol everything after that was terrible from that moisture issues we were having. Seeing that modded titan was nuts wish the evbot was working right for you though. But watching tony just glare at you after every failed 3d11 run trying to beat yours was hilarious! Great score btw!


----------



## Boulard83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> You can see in the pic the little VRMs seem to have been coated with it


+1 !

Preping for Liquid ultra/pro. it's better to prevent than repair ( kill it .. ). if CLU or CLP drip onto these capacitor and short them together ... bye bye 4770k.,


----------



## stickg1

I have a horrible 3770K specimen. It's my 3rd 3770K I've had, and by far the worst clocker. Needs 1.31v for 4.5GHz stable. Debating on selling it, replacing it, or just delidding it anyway because I want to play with my new waterloop. Right now I'm at 72C full load few hours of Prime95. I have 240mm Black Ice GTX, 240mm RS240, Raystorm, MCP-655, 150ml Bitspower Res. I wouldn't be so bothered if it read 52C







, I got a bunch of LM TIM in the drawer. What should I do?


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have a horrible 3770K specimen. It's my 3rd 3770K I've had, and by far the worst clocker. Needs 1.31v for 4.5GHz stable. Debating on selling it, replacing it, or just delidding it anyway because I want to play with my new waterloop. Right now I'm at 72C full load few hours of Prime95. I have 240mm Black Ice GTX, 240mm RS240, Raystorm, MCP-655, 150ml Bitspower Res. I wouldn't be so bothered if it read 52C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , I got a bunch of LM TIM in the drawer. What should I do?


Sell that crap chip, don't delid it...might lose value.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Sell that crap chip, don't delid it...might lose value.


Ah, Ivan, the voice of reason! I know that's what I should do. I think it's IMC is ~2650MHz tops too. I know I should switch it out but its so tempting to cut it!


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Ah, Ivan, the voice of reason! I know that's what I should do. I think it's IMC is ~2650MHz tops too. I know I should switch it out but its so tempting to cut it!


Get rid of it, don't delid it. I got rid of my 3770k that needed 1.33v for 4.5. I bought that one and my ok 4.8 chip, my wife however bought my good 5.0 chip. Coincidence?


----------



## ivanlabrie

cool...send her to buy me a 4770k please, I'll tip.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> Get rid of it, don't delid it. I got rid of my 3770k that needed 1.33v for 4.5. I bought that one and my ok 4.8 chip, my wife however bought my good 5.0 chip. Coincidence?


I'm trying to get my last one back from the Craigslist guy that bought the system


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> You can see in the pic the little VRMs seem to have been coated with it


I guess that is a pretty good idea to prepare before hand, i totally forgot that it was a 4770k


----------



## ivanlabrie

Well, those might get shorted with LP...I would cover them just in case.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> Does that give any benefit?. I thought clear coat nail polish was just to fix stuff like PCB, previously stated.


Yes it's a non-conductive coating. It would prevent shorts from exposed metal. Meaning a nick in the PCB (exposed copper) or exposed transistors like on Haswell. If liquid metal spread on some on those transistors and caps, connecting them together, that could be a disaster.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have a horrible 3770K specimen. It's my 3rd 3770K I've had, and by far the worst clocker. Needs 1.31v for 4.5GHz stable. Debating on selling it, replacing it, or just delidding it anyway because I want to play with my new waterloop. Right now I'm at 72C full load few hours of Prime95. I have 240mm Black Ice GTX, 240mm RS240, Raystorm, MCP-655, 150ml Bitspower Res. I wouldn't be so bothered if it read 52C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , I got a bunch of LM TIM in the drawer. What should I do?


I feel you on that. I need 1.370 for 100% stable at 4.6. 1.410+ at 4.7, and 1.50+ for 4.8 without whea errors. But i'm also not looking to drop another $400.00 on a cpu just for a "chance" that ill get something better. Id do it in a heart beat if i had a 95% chance of getting a better chip

When my CLU does finally arrive depending on final temps, ill probably go into the 4.8 1.5v range.. Id rather push it to the max degrade in 2 years and then replace, vs dropping $400.00 just because i want 200MHz

I'm getting about 71c under load with prime blend, with an h220 delidded 3770k using MX4.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yes it's a non-conductive coating. It would prevent shorts from exposed metal. Meaning a nick in the PCB (exposed copper) or exposed transistors like on Haswell. If liquid metal spread on some on those transistors and caps, connecting them together, that could be a disaster.


I'm glad i saw these posts then, cause i have a small nick on my 3770k. If i had applied CLU only to accidently get some on that nick i would of been screwed :X


----------



## Bartouille

The VRM the 4770k is what scares me with stuff like CLU on the IHS. They're so close... I guess you have to perfectly place the IHS on the first try and then clip it... no room for mistake.


----------



## Boulard83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> The VRM the 4770k is what scares me with stuff like CLU on the IHS. They're so close... I guess you have to perfectly place the IHS on the first try and then clip it... no room for mistake.


Just put some vernish on the VRM's. I just did it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Boulard83*
> 
> Just put some vernish on the VRM's. I just did it.


...very good precaution that seems like s.th. *Valgaur* may want to put in the OP for Haswell delidders


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> It was great! First time on Ln2 and meeting the crazy ocn benchers I've been chatting with for so long finally, great people great gear made for a sweet event. I got ram validation of 2941 mhz cpu at 5.5 (limited speed to keep competition fair) got bclk to 105. I totally forgot about those strapped bclk areas... along with everybody else lol.
> I barely won that sucker with my Ram and bclk only, I was talkin to gappo and he was surprised at my scores with how everything I got...was all on the same validation lol everything after that was terrible from that moisture issues we were having. Seeing that modded titan was nuts wish the evbot was working right for you though. But watching tony just glare at you after every failed 3d11 run trying to beat yours was hilarious! Great score btw!


..congrats ! And if you have some LN2 left over and a good Haswell sample, here is your new Haswell target







http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2842979


----------



## SonDa5

Found a decent 4770k worthy for delidding.









4.6GHZ, 35 cache, 1.27v in BIOS vcore.
Ambient Temps 23C
Water cooled in custom loop.



http://valid.canardpc.com/2858258

Going to run some more tests with the newest linpack from intel to find max stable OC and temps before I delid.


----------



## Bartouille

I'll try going direct die with my NH-D14. I did the delid with NT-H1 which is a decent paste, even tho it might not be as good as liquid metal but still, NO temps difference, very unhappy.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

CLU - Item out for delivery - VICTORYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY. I can't wait to see the temp drops vs my already 10-12c temp drop the MX-4 gave me.

Edit: Just as i posted that it showed up. OFF TO THE RACES


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I'll try going direct die with my NH-D14. I did the delid with NT-H1 which is a decent paste, even tho it might not be as good as liquid metal but still, NO temps difference, very unhappy.


You really can't comment on a temp drop after delidding until you use a liquid metal TIM on the die, and apply that TIM correctly which may take a few tries to get it right. Many people have tried other TIMs on the die and had disappointing results, that is normal. Get some Ultra or Pro then see what your temps are.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I'll try going direct die with my NH-D14. I did the delid with NT-H1 which is a decent paste, even tho it might not be as good as liquid metal but still, NO temps difference, very unhappy.


I wouldn't use a large heavy air heat sink for direct die mount. For direct die mount light weight well made snug water block is best. Reason you don't want large heavy heat sink is because it can put too much pressure on the bare die. Bare die mount should be gentle and light weight with good contact between die and block surface and CLP has worked great for me.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> You really can't comment on a temp drop after delidding until you use a liquid metal TIM on the die, and apply that TIM correctly which may take a few tries to get it right. Many people have tried other TIMs on the die and had disappointing results, that is normal. Get some Ultra or Pro then see what your temps are.


Yea... Well I'll order CLU and see... I still find it surprising, some people have like 20C drop with stuff like AS5 and MX-4.


----------



## nagle3092

4770K @ 4.8ghz 1.440v *on air*


----------



## Creator

I decided I'm not even going to bother fixing my large temperature variance. If I can run 4.8ghz on my 3770k at 1.32V, and hottest core is around 73-74C, that's fine with me. I could probably get that down to 70C or maybe even less, but I'm not sure it's worth it because my block seems to be a real pain in the ass to get on since there is nothing that holds the mounting bracket behind the motherboard (I have ghetto tape secure it). This morning I was testing 4.5ghz at 1.15v (not sure if stable, left it priming when I left) and the hottest core was like 54C.

If anyone is looking for a decent and very lightly used retail 3570K (I did not delid it), I have one available. It's capable of doing 4.7ghz at around 1.26-1.27V. It seems on par if not just a tiny bit better than my 3770K, but they're basically the same batch which would explain why.


----------



## Mogwaii

Hi all.

Got my COOLLABORATORY Liquid Ultra today in the mail and i removed my old Noctua NT-H1 and after some cleaning i use'd the paste on the core and ihs like the guide on page 1, and then same paste between the ihs and my Ek watercooling block and after a test with prime95 , i see the temperature is 15-20 c less than i had with Noctua NT-H1.

Very nice , i5 3570k @ 4.6ghz around 60c , ambient temp is 30c atm.

Did manage to clock it @ 4.7ghz and about same temperature 1.344vcore but after 30 min prime the computer become slow and freeze.



I like the CLU









//Rickard


----------



## Bartouille

I redid the delid with NT-H1 and it seems better now. I took a flat head screw driver to remove the glue (I had some left over) and redid everything more carefully and now I'm at 4.5ghz 1.26v at 70/73/73/69. I don't think I'm gonna bother with CLU, currently it should be enough for 1.35v and 4.7ghz.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Hey guys I have a delidded 3770k with CLU on the die that runs 4.6 @ 1.272V (1.260V under load). Max temp on the hottest core is 66 (H220). I cannot get past 4.6 though, 4.7 seems impossible no matter what I do.

I've tried every LLC, playing with PLL, every voltage from 1.280 up to 1.480, but I still cant get a stable 4.7.

The closest I've come is successfully passing 10 runs of Very High IBT, and when set to 20 runs it finished 13 before BSOD. Settings for this were BLCK 100, Multi 47, Vcore 1.290, LLC Extreme, PLL 2.0 (UD5H).

Any tips on how to stabilize it more? Is my chip even that good? For reference it does 4.4 @ 1.200V LLC Turbo. 4.6 @ 1.272 LLC Turbo.

Help Please?


----------



## AlDyer

Try lowering your ram speed and uncore. Also put the CPU Current Capability to 130%


----------



## ucantescape1992

uncore?

And good point about the ram. I'm running two 4GB sticks of Corsair Vengeance LP with an XMP profile that sets them to 1600Mhz. I should disable this?


----------



## GaMbi2004

XMP can do bad things to the stability when over cloacking the CPU.. Im no expert, but after I turned off XMP, and set the clock manually, I was able to OC my CPU same/higher without BSOD.
XMP is maid for "standard users" that dosnt want to OC, but want RAM to run at what they are "suppose" to.. if you want full / over clocked RAM/CPU... dont use XMP.

atleast thats my


----------



## ucantescape1992

I'll give it a go with disabling XMP.

What is Uncore, I looked it up but I can't find where to alter it with a 3770k, or in the UD5H bios. Should I add more or less VTT, what about PLL?

Sorry for all the questions







It's just that I really think my chip can do it. I don't want to feel like I delidded for nothing.


----------



## ivanlabrie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> I'll give it a go with disabling XMP.
> 
> What is Uncore, I looked it up but I can't find where to alter it with a 3770k, or in the UD5H bios. Should I add more or less VTT, what about PLL?
> 
> Sorry for all the questions
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's just that I really think my chip can do it. I don't want to feel like I delidded for nothing.


If you have a 3770k you don't have uncore adjustments, that's haswell talk.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Poop.

Alright so I've lowered my ram speed manually. Should VTT be tweaked up or down.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

My CLU arrived today, and I'm pretty blown away. I had already delidded and applied mx4 and saw a decent 10-12c drop across all cores, that put me at about 73c on prime blend and into the 80s when it hit small Ftt. 4.6Ghz needing 1.370v

Now with CLU applied I have seen an additional 12-14c temp drop so in total a 25c temp drop. Right now running prime custom blend using 13107mb of my memory. Before it hit the small Ftt test 15 mins in I was hovering around 51c 53c across all cores, when it hit the small Ftt It went as high as 64c.

I might of actually just done the math wrong there. I might be looking at a 30c temp drop under load.


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Try lowering your ram speed and uncore. Also put the CPU Current Capability to 130%


Ty for the tip , my i5 3570k was set to 140% CPU Current Capability , and when i changed it to 130% instead i now run 4,7ghz without problem , atleast sofaar.
Manage intelburntest 10 runs no error, and atm doing prime95 @ ~60c



tnx









Lets hope it stays ok for a few hours.


----------



## Chomuco

4770k 5.4 !!! new ..http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2858728


----------



## AlDyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Ty for the tip , my i5 3570k was set to 140% CPU Current Capability , and when i changed it to 130% instead
> 
> i now run 4,7ghz without problem , atleast sofaar.
> Manage intelburntest 10 runs no error, and atm doing prime95 @ ~60c
> 
> 
> 
> tnx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lets hope it stays ok for a few hours.


No problem glad that it helped


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> OCN name: Robbieboy
> CPU: Core i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: ~30°C
> 
> Before CLP
> 
> Core 1....92c
> Core 2....92c
> Core 3....91c
> Core 4....87c
> 
> I turned Aida off after less than 3 mins as it went above 90c ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With CLP
> 
> Core 1....61c
> Core 2....61c
> Core 3....61c
> Core 4....61c
> 
> Taken at 20 mins of Aida....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some pic's
> 
> 
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> After


Well still going strong with the CLP instead of AS5 on the Die....

Yesterday i did 20 runs of Intel burn test on high and had temps of 64,64,63,62...









When i had AS5 on the die it started off real good and low about 15c lower than before i de-lidded the chip but after 4-6 weeks it was almost back to the temps i had before...

So anyone thinking of de-lidding without CLP or CLU you might as well leave your chip alone....

Edit: Just waiting to get the thumb's up to become an "Official De-lidder"


----------



## ucantescape1992

Anyone know how to change current capability in the UD5H Bios?


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> Well still going strong with the CLP instead of AS5 on the Die....
> 
> Yesterday i did 20 runs of Intel burn test on high and had temps of 64,64,63,62...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When i had AS5 on the die it started off real good and low about 15c lower than before i de-lidded the chip but after 4-6 weeks it was almost back to the temps i had before...
> 
> So anyone thinking of de-lidding without CLP or CLU you might as well leave your chip alone....
> 
> Edit: Just waiting to get the thumb's up to become an "Official De-lidder"


Nice and gts. I dif the same today using CLU instead of noctua and oc it from 4,5 to 4,7 and temp @4,5 was about 69-73 and now @ 4,7 temp is 57-63


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

I decided to give 4.8ghz a try... Again..

And to my surprise I was actually able to lower my voltage from my original 1.50v down to 1.485v. I'm thinking a fresh install of windows 2 days ago might of helped too. Because before I was getting random bsods , now all I've seen in whea errors ... Anyways to the point

I'm 20 tests into small Ftt on prime and I'm maxing at 75c with only a 1c variance across cores. 5 days ago without CLU I tried this and not only needed 1.5v but I was hitting my tjmax and then some. This stuff is litterally worth every dollar. I'm gonna buy a surplus of it pretty soon because I will never use something else again.

Also I haven't see. Any whea errors yet 22 tests in. Which is a decent sign. Considering before all this I'd get them 5s in running anything less than 1.5

I'm probably gonna stick with 4.8 at my current voltage unless I an error. I really wanted to stay under 1.5v and I might of achieved that. My cooling is handling this with no problems at all


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> I decided to give 4.8ghz a try... Again..
> 
> And to my surprise I was actually able to lower my voltage from my original 1.50v down to 1.485v. I'm thinking a fresh install of windows 2 days ago might of helped too. Because before I was getting random bsods , now all I've seen in whea errors ... Anyways to the point
> 
> I'm 20 tests into small Ftt on prime and I'm maxing at 75c with only a 1c variance across cores. 5 days ago without CLU I tried this and not only needed 1.5v but I was hitting my tjmax and then some. This stuff is litterally worth every dollar. I'm gonna buy a surplus of it pretty soon because I will never use something else again.
> 
> Also I haven't see. Any whea errors yet 22 tests in. Which is a decent sign. Considering before all this I'd get them 5s in running anything less than 1.5
> 
> I'm probably gonna stick with 4.8 at my current voltage unless I an error. I really wanted to stay under 1.5v and I might of achieved that. My cooling is handling this with no problems at all


Still too much voltage for my liking.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Watagump*
> 
> Still too much voltage for my liking.


I'm going to mess around with it some more tomorrow. Would you or anyone know if raising my CPU-PLL voltage will allow me to decrease my Vcore voltage?. Its lowered down to 1.5 atm vs the stock 1.8 because i heard many reports it helps lower cpu temps. But i was wondering if its possible for those effects to be flipped.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> I'm going to mess around with it some more tomorrow. Would you or anyone know if raising my CPU-PLL voltage will allow me to decrease my Vcore voltage?. Its lowered down to 1.5 atm vs the stock 1.8 because i heard many reports it helps lower cpu temps. But i was wondering if its possible for those effects to be flipped.


That only worked for one out of five of my Ivy chips. The other four had no effect when lowering the PLL voltage. Pretty small sample size, but it's worth a shot, just know that it might not work.


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> I'm going to mess around with it some more tomorrow. Would you or anyone know if raising my CPU-PLL voltage will allow me to decrease my Vcore voltage?. Its lowered down to 1.5 atm vs the stock 1.8 because i heard many reports it helps lower cpu temps. But i was wondering if its possible for those effects to be flipped.


With my MSI board I didn't touch the PLL voltage. I run at 4.6 at 1.25v, its ran at 5.0 but took 1.45v. Just luck of the draw for the good ole CPU lottery I guess. I ran at 4.8 at 1.30v for quite a while also, but just decided I really didn't need that speed, both 4.8 and 5.0 are just bragging right speeds.


----------



## lucas.vulcan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Watagump*
> 
> With my MSI board I didn't touch the PLL voltage. I run at 4.6 at 1.25v, its ran at 5.0 but took 1.45v. Just luck of the draw for the good ole CPU lottery I guess. I ran at 4.8 at 1.30v for quite a while also, but just decided I really didn't need that speed, both 4.8 and 5.0 are just bragging right speeds.


origin and how much you're a turbo, that is to say a 3.9GHz, what is your voltage V?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lucas.vulcan*
> 
> origin and how much you're a turbo, that is to say a 3.9GHz, what is your voltage V?


uh


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lucas.vulcan*
> 
> origin and how much you're a turbo, that is to say a 3.9GHz, what is your voltage V?


I have no idea what you are saying.


----------



## Molokou

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lucas.vulcan*
> 
> origin and how much you're a turbo, that is to say a 3.9GHz, what is your voltage V?


Nope, I don't get it no matter how many times I read it


----------



## strokercrate

So, what exactly makes some CPU's of the same model better than others to such a large degree? I know there will be slight differences at times, but it seems like with Intel K models there can be a large variance in OC ability. Is it 100% the cpu? and if so why?

Could it also be affected by the MOBO and PSU? I know the PSU does a good job cutting noise out of the signal, but sometimes, AC noise can still influence the DC output because of something being plugged into the same circuit thats noise (when I had DSL it used to kill the ISP signal when the treadmill was on due to EMI being Back fed to the DC Power supply and it wasn't even on the same circuit) or could it be that some PSU's can less efficient than others at eliminating EMI noise, making a lower volt higher clock more difficult?

In either case, could adding a line filter to further clean up the signal help in producing a stable, Lower Volt Clock? Or does EMI even affect the overclock at all?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> 4770k 5.4 !!! new ..http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2858728


Let me buy it!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> So, what exactly makes some CPU's of the same model better than others to such a large degree? I know there will be slight differences at times, but it seems like with Intel K models there can be a large variance in OC ability. Is it 100% the cpu? and if so why?


There are over a billion transistors on a Haswell CPU, and the 'wires' between them are less than a millionth of an inch thick. Although chip making factories are incredibly precise, there's going to be some minuscule defects in each chip that governs its stability at higher clocks and volts.


----------



## strokercrate

So would decreasing EMI improve OC ability, or with those imperfections it wouldn't matter?


----------



## SonDa5

Here are my results for my maximum performance over clock on my 4770k before I delid it.

Powered by Intel's latest AVX2 linpack code.

Look at the Gflop performance and the heat.

4770k with HT off at 4.4GHZ.
Custom water loop, not delidded yet
Ambient temps 24c



http://valid.canardpc.com/2859272

This chip is worthy and ready for delidding.


----------



## AlDyer

@Strokerkrate If it was the PSU mine would barely boot at stock. I have a crappy PSU and I'm running 24/7 4.8 GHz. So this does not apply in my case at least


----------



## vinclar

Hello fellows,
at the beginning of the next week, I will have all my components to make my PC.
As this thread is extremely large, i couldn't read all, and I don't know if there is somebody
I'm going to delid the 4770k, is it good idea to leave the ihs off using the Swiftech H220, or it would be too much pressure for naked cpu? I don't mind to put the ihs back.

Setup
PSU: LEPA GOLD 750W
MB: ASUS GRYPHON + ARMOR KIT
Case: OBSIDIAN 350D
CPU: i7-4770k
Cooler: Swiftech H220
TlM: CLU and MX2 for the components next to.
RAM: 4x 8GB (Yeah! Lots of VM







)
GPU: GTX 760 OC Gigabyte Rev. 2.0 (i'm not a hardcore gamer, in time I will SLI)
SSD: OCZ Vertex 3 MI 128GB
HD: 1TB Seagate
BD: LG
Display: LG 27EA63


----------



## neofury

I'm getting CLU now because I noobed my CLP and wasted it. Also, the CLP is lousy for spreading (no brush) and I honestly can't wait now lol.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vinclar*
> 
> Hello fellows,
> at the beginning of the next week, I will have all my components to make my PC.
> As this thread is extremely large, i couldn't read all, and I don't know if there is somebody
> I'm going to delid the 4770k, is it good idea to leave the ihs off using the Swiftech H220, or it would be too much pressure for naked cpu? I don't mind to put the ihs back.
> 
> Setup
> PSU: LEPA GOLD 750W
> MB: ASUS GRYPHON + ARMOR KIT
> Case: OBSIDIAN 350D
> CPU: i7-4770k
> Cooler: Swiftech H220
> TlM: CLU and MX2 for the components next to.
> RAM: 4x 8GB (Yeah! Lots of VM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> GPU: GTX 760 OC Gigabyte Rev. 2.0 (i'm not a hardcore gamer, in time I will SLI)
> SSD: OCZ Vertex 3 MI 128GB
> HD: 1TB Seagate
> BD: LG
> Display: LG 27EA63


You can't go direct to die with the H220, you would have to come up with a physical modification of the mounting hardware. There are a few people here who do direct die, but they have mounting systems that accommodate it.

The vast majority just place the IHS back on the chip, then clamp it into the mobo. That way you can just install your cooler the standard way. There are few risks with going direct die, you will a few c better temps, so most don't bother doing it.

As has been stated here, make sure to cover the exposed line of connectors to the left of the die with something non-conductive, and non-capacitive. Then use a liquid metal TIM on the die.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

CLU and CLP come with a needle attached right? Cause if they do that explains why Canadian customs opened my CLU and removed the needle, they even dabbed a little bit on the package to test it I think, lol


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> CLU and CLP come with a needle attached right? Cause if they do that explains why Canadian customs opened my CLU and removed the needle, they even dabbed a little bit on the package to test it I think, lol


No needle. It's a plastic syringe with a wide tip.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> CLU and CLP come with a needle attached right? Cause if they do that explains why Canadian customs opened my CLU and removed the needle, they even dabbed a little bit on the package to test it I think, lol


Wow! This is crazy!! I hope they don't do the same to me


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Weird, I guess customs just decided to test the stuff then. Kind of had a feeling they would, I mean its in a much different syringe if you compare it to something like mx4 lol. I'm just thankful it was the smallest amount possible


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Here are my results for my maximum performance over clock on my 4770k before I delid it.
> 
> Powered by Intel's latest AVX2 linpack code.
> 
> Look at the Gflop performance and the heat.
> 
> 4770k with HT off at 4.4GHZ.
> Custom water loop, not delidded yet
> Ambient temps 24c
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2859272
> 
> This chip is worthy and ready for delidding.


Thanks for posting 'pre'-delid Haswell results....wow - I say with 100 degrees max temps in spite of a custom w-c loop, delidding is actually the reasonable and sane thing to do


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> CLU and CLP come with a needle attached right? Cause if they do that explains why Canadian customs opened my CLU and removed the needle, they even dabbed a little bit on the package to test it I think, lol


Hmmm...I had 8 CL-U and CL-P packages delivered to Canada from Germany and the US since February of this year, and none was opened by customs - though I have heard that it has happened to other folks 'early on', before it was entered in Canada Custom's database. It may also depend on the shipper and their pre-import paper work they send ahead to Canada Customs.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Hmmm...I had 8 CL-U and CL-P packages delivered to Canada from Germany and the US since February of this year, and none was opened by customs - though I have heard that it has happened to other folks 'early on', before it was entered in Canada Custom's database. It may also depend on the shipper and their pre-import paper work they send ahead to Canada Customs.


Yeah I'm not sure where along the line it was opened, but it was. And it was definitely tested. There are very small silver markings on the plastic packaging and the tip to cover the syringe had a little bit on it


----------



## scorpscarx

My CLP from FrozenCPU most definately had the needle attached to the syringe, love this stuff, just wish I had something else to use it on. What is the shelf life of this and other standard TIMS, I have soo many just sitting around.


----------



## Robbieboy

CLP Has a Needle and CLU don't have a Needle....


----------



## strokercrate

Yep, my CLP came with needle also..

Man I'm having some strange results after updating my bios to the latest version. My system fist had to reinstall audio/video/Keyboard/mouse/usb drivers on first boot. A program claimed a missing .dll (after another reboot its working fine)

But the strangest thing is my voltage readings.. I have my volts set to manual 1.24v so it should be static. CPUID shows 1.238v Static. But HWMonitor and Asus AI Suites show my volts as dynamic dropping to 0v and a max of 1.248v.

Before the bios update CPUID worked fine and showed it the same as all others. Also before bios when I set manual it remained static on all monitors, but after its changed.. (although my system is stable at slightly less volts now)

Any ideas?


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *strokercrate*
> 
> Yep, my CLP came with needle also..
> 
> Man I'm having some strange results after updating my bios to the latest version. My system fist had to reinstall audio/video/Keyboard/mouse/usb drivers on first boot. A program claimed a missing .dll (after another reboot its working fine)
> 
> But the strangest thing is my voltage readings.. I have my volts set to manual 1.24v so it should be static. CPUID shows 1.238v Static. But HWMonitor and Asus AI Suites show my volts as dynamic dropping to 0v and a max of 1.248v.
> 
> Before the bios update CPUID worked fine and showed it the same as all others. Also before bios when I set manual it remained static on all monitors, but after its changed.. (although my system is stable at slightly less volts now)
> 
> Any ideas?


Check if Intel Virtualization Technology is enable or disable.

When i uppdated my bios on asus maxumus v formula that setting was enable before the uppdate, after i uppdated to new bios that setting was disabled.
After some reading and benchmarking , that setting didnt do much for my score and i dont need that enable for my kind of use of the computer.
And since i still have it disabled i can do same clockspeed but at slight less vcore.

Maby the same for you?

//Rickard


----------



## strokercrate

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Check if Intel Virtualization Technology is enable or disable.
> 
> When i uppdated my bios on asus maxumus v formula that setting was enable before the uppdate, after i uppdated to new bios that setting was disabled.
> After some reading and benchmarking , that setting didnt do much for my score and i dont need that enable for my kind of use of the computer.
> And since i still have it disabled i can do same clockspeed but at slight less vcore.
> 
> Maby the same for you?
> 
> //Rickard


I had it enabled before and is still after the update. So i dont know if thats what is causing the different voltage reading between monitors now (one static 1.238v, the other two dynamic at 0v - 1.248v)

I've always trusted cpuid more, but two are showing different which makes me wonder if the bios update is affecting CPUID..

But even then why when I set to manual, my voltage is dynamic instead of static like it should be?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> CLU and CLP come with a needle attached right? Cause if they do that explains why Canadian customs opened my CLU and removed the needle, they even dabbed a little bit on the package to test it I think, lol


I think only clp comes with a needle. Clu is just the plastic syringe. I have a tube of both. Only my pro had a needle on it. Both are from frozencpu which doesn't go through customs as i am in the u.s.


----------



## Auxillary Field

Decided to delid my 4670k yesterday using the vise method.



After 3 good whacks with the hammer this was the result:


I wanted to do a direct to die mount instead of putting the lid back on, so I removed the retention bracket and prepared my ud4h with the naked ivy kit for the supremacy:



And secured the cpu to the socket with electrical tape:



I used a few pieces of 0.5mm thick thermal pad to make sure the block would go on straight, and applied a line of PK1 to the die:



Afterwards I secured the block, making sure the pressure was evenly divided:



Some (pleasing) results at 4.7GHz after an hour of prime95 small fft:



Temperatures have dropped atleast 25°C, possibly more since ambient is much higher than when I tested 4.7GHz before. I might try to go to x48 later on, but I'm pleased with this for now.

OCN name: Auxillary Field
CPU: i5 4670k
on die-TIM: Promilatech PK1
ihs-TIM: nope
Mhz gained: 200Mhz
OC after delid: 4.7GHz
Temp drops: ~25°C

Oh and here's a quick validation URL (if it matters):
http://valid.canardpc.com/2860453


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Auxillary Field*
> 
> Decided to delid my 4670k yesterday using the vise method.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After 3 good whacks with the hammer this was the result:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wanted to do a direct to die mount instead of putting the lid back on, so I removed the retention bracket and prepared my ud4h with the naked ivy kit for the supremacy:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And secured the cpu to the socket with electrical tape:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a few pieces of 0.5mm thick thermal pad to make sure the block would go on straight, and applied a line of PK1 to the die:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Afterwards I secured the block, making sure the pressure was evenly divided:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some (pleasing) results at 4.7GHz after an hour of prime95 small fft:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temperatures have dropped atleast 20°C, possibly more since ambient is much higher than when I tested 4.7GHz before. I might try to go to x48 later on, but I'm pleased with this for now.
> 
> OCN name: Auxillary Field
> CPU: i5 4670k
> on die-TIM: Promilatech PK1
> ihs-TIM: nope
> Mhz gained: 200Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.7GHz
> Temp drops: ~20°C
> 
> Oh and here's a quick validation URL (if it matters):
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2860453


Doing EXACTLY the same to my own later today - Got the EK kit ready for some pr0n nakedness and some FujiPoly Ultra Extreme which will go all around the die (For isolating, maintaining even pressure and of course suck up an xtra C or two) - Will be using CLU on the die itself.


----------



## AlDyer

Didn't know we were supposed to fill in this, but here goes









OCN name: AlDyer
CPU: i5 4670K
on-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra (CLU)
ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5 (AS5)
MHz gained: 300MHz
OC after delid: 4.8GHz
Temp drop: ~25 C


----------



## Zikofski

okay i am thinking about deliding my haswell 4770k i want to mount my XSPC Copper WB directly onto the Die has anyone got any advice for me?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zikofski*
> 
> okay i am thinking about deliding my haswell 4770k i want to mount my XSPC Copper WB directly onto the Die has anyone got any advice for me?


If this is your first time doing Direct on Die, I would urge you to spend abit of cash on a EK Supremacy block (The cheapest one) and the EK Supremacy Precise Mount Add-On - It takes alot of the guesstimation out of the equation. Trust me.

Of course, if you are feeling hardcore, there are a few guides here on OCN on how to do it yourself by using washers etc. But as to pressure - That is entirely up to yourself, and you might end up with a cracked die.

And remember! Tighten down the block in "Figure 8" and not more than half a turn per thumbscrew!

Source: AnandTech


----------



## Zikofski

ok cool thanks for that







sorry where is figure 8? you referring to my XSPC block or the EK supremacy block


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zikofski*
> 
> ok cool thanks for that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry where is figure 8? you referring to my XSPC block or the EK supremacy block


There is no "Figure 8" - I was talking about how to tighten down the waterblock. You move in a Figure 8, slowly tightening it down by no more than half a turn per thumbscrew - If you just start in a corner and tighten down with multiple turns on the thumbscrew, you are increasing the chance of cracking the die alot - So take your time, no first prize for the first one done when doing this.


----------



## Zikofski

haha yes i got you now, that picture helped a lot to understand it better think i shall give it ago with my current block like you said i will just be careful, about the stuff to the left of the die, could i get some thermal pads to put over them? this will help them cool a little better with a non conductive source and stop it shorting out with the water block it self?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zikofski*
> 
> haha yes i got you now, that picture helped a lot to understand it better think i shall give it ago with my current block like you said i will just be careful, about the stuff to the left of the die, could i get some thermal pads to put over them? this will help them cool a little better with a non conductive source and stop it shorting out with the water block it self?


You are absolutely correct. Get a Thermal pad which is 0.5mm thick and you are good to go - I am using Fujipoly Ultra Extreme myself, but that *IS* abit overkill


----------



## Valgaur

I shall be trying to get you guys and gals added tomorrow well today actually (working nights messes with your sense of time) so when I wake up ill try to get you guys in! Been workin and main rigs still down so will make time hopefully and get you added to the spreadsheet.


----------



## Zikofski

sweet cheers i shall give it ago today hopefully modding my case at the moment for the huge radiator on top


----------



## AlDyer

my 4.8 is not a max OC btw, but whatever. Also the temp drop is a bit closer to 30 C actually I think, but yeah


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

OCN name: EnthusiastG4m3r
CPU: Intel Core i7 3770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: 100 (But gonna try for more, with tweaking)
OC after delid: 4700
Temp drops: 30c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2860835



















Pics are off my Iphone, Not the best quality but good enough


----------



## AlDyer

Good work with the delid and congratz!


----------



## Nokiron

Im reading alot about the use of Coollaboratory Liquid Pro/Ultra and the results looks amazing.

But there is one question I have about it, will it dry up over time?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Good work with the delid and congratz!


Almost on hour 6 of my 12hr Prime 95 Custom Blend using 13gb of my 16gb, no whea errors yet!. Max temp ive seen is 72c and that took about 4 1/2hrs, but that's only cause the ambient got a little warm. AC kicked it and all is well again.

4.7 1.415v might be able to do 1.410. I went from 1.405 to 1.415


----------



## Gomi

**Laughs maniacally**

Well - Vice method and 4770K works (People already knew this, just adding another "Thumbs up").

Took me 2 good whacks - The chip came off nice and easy, no flying through the room or anything.

This took no more than 20 seconds, including setting up the operation.

I used to use the razor method (On Ivy) - This is just a billion times easier and feels so much more under control.


----------



## ghostrider85

Has anyone tried mounting a heatsing without the lid?

Anyone from orange county, california here that have a vice? I really want to delid my chip but i don't have tools.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> Anyone from orange county, california here that have a vice? I really want to delid my chip but i don't have tools.


Search the thread, an appropriate vice can be had for $20. You could also call around some metal shops if you can use their vice for 5 mins.


----------



## Auxillary Field

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> **Laughs maniacally**
> 
> Well - Vice method and 4770K works (People already knew this, just adding another "Thumbs up").
> 
> Took me 2 good whacks - The chip came off nice and easy, no flying through the room or anything.
> 
> This took no more than 20 seconds, including setting up the operation.
> 
> I used to use the razor method (On Ivy) - This is just a billion times easier and feels so much more under control.


Yeah I found it remarkably simple to do too myself.

Also you probably know this already: but if you're going to go ahead with applying CLU to the die, try to cover up the capacitors next to the die as CLU is conductive.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> Has anyone tried mounting a heatsing without the lid?
> 
> Anyone from orange county, california here that have a vice? I really want to delid my chip but i don't have tools.


Look above.

Also the vise I used only cost €4 and was very stable. I'm sure if you look around a bit you'll be able to find one that's suitable.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Wish me luck. Once i got to the 12hr mark on my Prime 95 custom blend, i said **** it and decided to go for a full 24hr.

That being said i'm on hour 19. Don't fail me now betsy!

Additional Info:

Been running Prime 95 Custom Blend for almost 20hrs now on my delidded 3770k with 1.415v going into it for 4.7. Using CLU on the die and the ihs... Max temp i have seen was 73c (Was only because of a high ambient, ac kicking in fixed that fast). Mostly seeing 48-55c until it hits a Small FTT then it jumps to 63-65c across all cores.

Using an H220 with the stock Typhoon AP-15s as intake. Between CLU and the H220 cooling is amazing. I 100% recommend buying CLU in bulk for anyone who is an enthusiast. I plan to keep no less than 10 on hand at any given time now. Even if the clean up does take a little bit longer when you're removing it and reapping for whatever reason. It's worth the effort

I've had a decent amount of experience with other TIM's over the past 5-6 years of my computer building career. AS5, Mx-2, Mx-4, Tim Mate 1, Tim Mate 2, Stock Paste, Generic Heat Grease, Cooler Master RTH02, Hell i've even use toothpaste to hold me over for 5-6hrs (Yes that really does work)

But never in my life have i seen such a temp drop. I added it up finally and i've seen a 34c temp drop with the same ambient, using CLU. That is absolutely insane that Intel has messed up that badly.

But i guess in their eyes flux soldering vs sealing the ihs with tim on the underside just isn't cost effective. And honestly i don't mind fixing their mistake because you're probably gonna see a bigger temp drop doing so vs it being flux soldered like the Sandy Bridge line


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> But never in my life have i seen such a temp drop. I added it up finally and i've seen a 34c temp drop with the same ambient, using CLU. That is absolutely insane that Intel has messed up that badly.
> 
> But i guess in their eyes flux soldering vs sealing the ihs with tim on the underside just isn't cost effective. And honestly i don't mind fixing their mistake because you're probably gonna see a bigger temp drop doing so vs it being flux soldered like the Sandy Bridge line


I love bare die access cooling and I hope Intel continues this design or improves upon it by selling delidded CPUs in retail.









Congrats!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I love bare die access cooling and I hope Intel continues this design or improves upon it by selling delidded CPUs in retail.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats!


...I think you're onto something there and I have wondered about why Intel is not selling a delidded version, what with flat / reducing CPU sales (re shift to mobile / tablets). They could charge $30 more (+ - 10%) and attach one of their special warranties on top - a market opportunity !

Along similar lines, note the new Asus ROG Maximus VI with a 'bare die' CPU mounting kit included...


----------



## Zikofski

so i delidded my cpu and i got a temp drop os 60c, i must have done something wrong before to get this massive drop, but i am at 4.7ghz overclock was going to say stable at 1.3v but as typing this windows just crashed haha max temp tho on prime is 45c air temp is 27.4 and water temp in my loop is 28.1


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Auxillary Field*
> 
> Yeah I found it remarkably simple to do too myself.
> 
> Also you probably know this already: but if you're going to go ahead with applying CLU to the die, try to cover up the capacitors next to the die as CLU is conductive.


Way ahead of you my friend. I am surrounding the Die with a 0.5mm thick piece of Fujipoly Ultra Extreme. The piece is cut so the die is just free. CLU is then applied on the die per usual. To finish it all off I am using a Supremacy block with the Direct on Die kit from EK.


----------



## ghostrider85

Ok, i succesfully delidded my 3570k without a single scratch on the pcb. Now what is the easiest wat to remove the glue?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> Ok, i succesfully delidded my 3570k without a single scratch on the pcb. Now what is the easiest wat to remove the glue?


80s music, Coca Cola Cherry and an old creditcard.

First two are optional but highly recommended.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> Ok, i succesfully delidded my 3570k without a single scratch on the pcb. Now what is the easiest wat to remove the glue?


fingernail or crdit card. I used a crdit card myself.


----------



## Valgaur

Everyone Who has PM'ed me has been added to the spreadsheet!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> 80s music, Coca Cola Cherry and an old creditcard.
> 
> First two are optional but highly recommended.


spot on









and agree.. credit card and time..

Some might recommend to use alcohol n' stuff for final polish. But it is not a "must".


----------



## sinnedone

So I have a 3770k doing 4.6ghz at 1.20v getting up to 80 degrees on the hottest core.

Someone talk me out of trying to delid it







lol

If I could get a good temp drop it might be beneficial. I went for 4.7ghz, but at 1.22v 2 of my cores hit low 80's.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> So I have a 3770k doing 4.6ghz at 1.20v getting up to 80 degrees on the hottest core.
> 
> Someone talk me out of trying to delid it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> If I could get a good temp drop it might be beneficial. I went for 4.7ghz, but at 1.22v 2 of my cores hit low 80's.


If you're honestly getting 4.6 at 1.20v then you're probably looking at 5Ghz + on 1.35v. Just take your time delidding because you have a good chip


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> So I have a 3770k doing 4.6ghz at 1.20v getting up to 80 degrees on the hottest core.
> 
> Someone talk me out of trying to delid it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> If I could get a good temp drop it might be beneficial. I went for 4.7ghz, but at 1.22v 2 of my cores hit low 80's.


definitely go for it!!

4.6 @ 1.2v is pretty good! and with delid you will get 60-65 degrees (maybe lower)

what are your other cores at?


----------



## sinnedone

The coolest core was 71 then the others were 79 75.

Stable in prime for 20hrs with no whea errors. 

Im thinking of looking for a vice to try that method, just have to research it a bit more. Id like to look at every video out there to see how it looks before I take to it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> The coolest core was 71 then the others were 79 75.
> 
> Stable in prime for 20hrs with no whea errors.
> 
> Im thinking of looking for a vice to try that method, just have to research it a bit more. Id like to look at every video out there to see how it looks before I take to it.


Congrats on a very nice chip







- I'd say definitely a good sample to delid (and also to show why at least in this area, 3770K and the new 4770K are currently priced the same)...and as you say, taking your time for the delid prep makes a lot of sense.

You might be able to hit 5 Ghz at 1.376v under load as it looks close to mine (posts around February '13 on that), and also get much better temps 'post-delid' with a good w-c solution and liquid metal TIM...good luck


----------



## Chillin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Im thinking of looking for a vice to try that method, just have to research it a bit more. Id like to look at every video out there to see how it looks before I take to it.


lol, I think I spent 2 months reading/watching videos before I finally did it. I just woke up one day and said eff it I'm going to do it now. I didn't even have a vice. I just held it against an edge on the table saw and hit the PCB with a rubber mallet. No drama what so ever. In fact, when you have to hold it you can feel the IHS give it up....so no flying across the room senerio.


----------



## skyn3t

My 3570k lapped do very well at 4.5 GHZ @ 1.2v max temp 65 on my new loop 100% stable .I can get it to 4.7 GHz @ 1.35v maybe a bit more for bench but not stable at all I know because app like heaven 3Dmark used to crash before or after the bench start's but no windows crash. any input?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chillin*
> 
> lol, I think I spent 2 months reading/watching videos before I finally did it. I just woke up one day and said eff it I'm going to do it now. I didn't even have a vice. I just held it against an edge on the table saw and hit the PCB with a rubber mallet. No drama what so ever. In fact, when you have to hold it you can feel the IHS give it up....so no flying across the room senerio.


One of the main reasons i did it, is because the room my computers are in is pretty small. And when you're gaming for 4-5+ hrs it ends up being a hot box lol. You step outside the room and its like YES FREEDOM AIRRRRR. So shaving off 30c not only improved my OC and temps for my PC, but made my gaming experiencing much more enjoyable with temps in the room.

That being said. I've now taken apart my GTX 670's until i add them to my loop and applied CLU on the die. Seen a 10-12c drop doing so. Which is pretty massive when im running 1.2v (overvolted) into them for my overclock.

If you do plan to venture off and take your videocards apart, i 100% recommend masking off every area on the card, only leaving the die exposed. One speck of that liquid metal on the pcb anywhere near electrical comps and you're gonna have not only a fried video card, but a fried motherboard, and in turn probably gonna take out other things connected


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> One of the main reasons i did it, is because the room my computers are in is pretty small. And when you're gaming for 4-5+ hrs it ends up being a hot box lol. You step outside the room and its like YES FREEDOM AIRRRRR. So shaving off 30c not only improved my OC and temps for my PC, but made my gaming experiencing much more enjoyable with temps in the room.
> 
> That being said. I've now taken apart my GTX 670's until i add them to my loop and applied CLU on the die. Seen a 10-12c drop doing so. Which is pretty massive when im running 1.2v (overvolted) into them for my overclock.
> 
> If you do plan to venture off and take your videocards apart, i 100% recommend masking off every area on the card, only leaving the die exposed. One speck of that liquid metal on the pcb anywhere near electrical comps and you're gonna have not only a fried video card, but a fried motherboard, and in turn probably gonna take out other things connected


Don't think I'd risk CLU on my Matrix's, Gelid/ Antec 7 does good enough on there own. Do you add a bit of tim on your mem ic's before putting thermal pads on?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Don't think I'd risk CLU on my Matrix's, Gelid/ Antec 7 does good enough on there own. Do you add a bit of tim on your mem ic's before putting thermal pads on?


It's pretty risky yeah. There's a lot more areas you can end up getting the stuff and messing up your card lol. The reference gtx 670 from evga is pretty basic. It doesn't have thermal pads its straight copper block to die. It was held together by about 8 screws and fell off after i unscrewed them. The paste they used looked like dried toothpaste.

But now you have me wondering about the imcs. (sorry about slightly derailing this thread).


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Congrats on a very nice chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - I'd say definitely a good sample to delid (and also to show why at least in this area, 3770K and the new 4770K are currently priced the same)...and as you say, taking your time for the delid prep makes a lot of sense.
> 
> You might be able to hit 5 Ghz at 1.376v under load as it looks close to mine (posts around February '13 on that), and also get much better temps 'post-delid' with a good w-c solution and liquid metal TIM...good luck


Yeah Im hoping voltage scales well with the overclock. Unfortunately H100i in a small case with bad airflow is as good as is going to get for me.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chillin*
> 
> lol, I think I spent 2 months reading/watching videos before I finally did it. I just woke up one day and said eff it I'm going to do it now. I didn't even have a vice. I just held it against an edge on the table saw and hit the PCB with a rubber mallet. No drama what so ever. In fact, when you have to hold it you can feel the IHS give it up....so no flying across the room senerio.


Yeah this is probably the route Im going to take. Im probably going to wait a little bit cause have to clean inside of case for some new pictures, but hopefully soon I'll have some delidded pics with good after results.


----------



## ghostrider85

does the clu bind the ihs to the die? i mean, what about 2nd, 3rd, 4th application? won't it mess up the surfaces after?


----------



## sinnedone

Good question. Im interested in this as well.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> does the clu bind the ihs to the die? i mean, what about 2nd, 3rd, 4th application? won't it mess up the surfaces after?


No, the die is not metal so I have not seen it bind the die the IHS. The IHS to the cooler on the other hand does have some binding over time. I have to use just a bit of force to separate the IHS and cooler using CLU, but the IHS always seem to come off the die with no problem.

If you take the IHS off the die within a short time, you can sometimes get by with just smoothing out the CLU on the die. If you are redoing after some time has passed then you will probably need to clean the die and underside of the IHS and apply new CLU to get the best application.


----------



## sinnedone

How much time before reapplication?


----------



## Ali Man

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> How much time before reapplication?


CLU lasts a lot longer than your average paste. Have personally gone over a year without a problem, keeping in mind that it mostly stays in liquid metal state.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Name: TheLAWNoob
CPU: Intel Celeron D 347 3.06Ghz 133mhz FSB
On die TIM: None
IHS TIM: None
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: None
Temp drops: Unknown
CPU-Z Valid: None

I'm sorry for all the missing data, the only socket 775 mobo I have is not capable of OC, and it is fried and damaged beyond repairs.

My CPU is a socket 775 Celeron D 347 @3.06Ghz. The IHS is soldered onto the CPU die (probably liquid metal).

Here are some pics:





Here's a little bonus









/\ That is a Radeon HD4650 with a low profile 1st gen Intel i3 heatsink.

If anyone want to test my delided Celeron please send me a PM. The CPU die has no visible damage, and it is fully functional before the delid. I'll ship free to anywhere in Canada.

I also have a 1st gen i3-550 @3.20Ghz that I'm looking forward to delid, stay tuned


----------



## ghostrider85

I'm thinking about going IHSless with an h80i, is this a good idea?


----------



## Swag

Sorry, this is OT again.







I'll put it in a spoiler if some of you don't want to even bother with it!


Spoiler: Off Topic Swag



I just bought 6 games from Steam because of the Summer Sales.







My biggest purchase that wasn't an indie game was Black Ops 2 (always wanted to try a COD game on PC). I do own BF3 already and I love it!

Any other games worth buying for the price? I was thinking Tomb Raider but I wasn't sure if it was worth it over $25 for Civ5. Never really played a Civ game and thought I may not like it.


----------



## Swag

I don't know if you guys didn't realize but the Intel CPU thread is being bombarded by people asking if they should delid.







Amazing to see how much progress we came from, going from no guide, to one guide, to the 7 original members of this club to becoming one of the most rapidly growing extreme clubs in this forum.









Congratulations to everyone who has attempted to delid regardless of passing or failing, and congratulations to Valgaur for keeping this club growing strong.


----------



## alancsalt

Hear, hear!


----------



## ghostrider85




----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*


I think that is one of the most well done? (cant think good day) cleanign job I've seen on a die yet! might be the lighting and angle but I say good job to you sir! fill out teh info's and I shall add's thee!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> I'm thinking about going IHSless with an h80i, is this a good idea?


I wouldn't do it.

Better to go with high quality low weight copper block that is easy to mount.

Also I wouldn't put a pump motor directly on the die. The die is fragile.


----------



## Daredevil 720

What do you guys think of the Phobya Liquid Metal TIM? I can't find CLP/CLU near me and Phobya LM is pretty cheap too.

I really don't want to compromise in terms of quality, so I want an answer with just performance in mind.

Would you use it in your rig? (talking about Die<->IHS application)


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> What do you guys think of the Phobya Liquid Metal TIM? I can't find CLP/CLU near me and Phobya LM is pretty cheap too.
> 
> I really don't want to compromise in terms of quality, so I want an answer with just performance in mind.
> 
> Would you use it in your rig? (talking about Die<->IHS application)


It is newer to the market. I saw a chart posted in this thread a while back that had it performing just as well as clu/clp and if i am not mistaken the testing was done on die. I am just going off of memory here but normally i remember correctly







whatever the result if you cannot find clu or clp it is gonna beat anything else you can use. I say go for it if that is what is available to you.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think that is one of the most well done? (cant think good day) cleanign job I've seen on a die yet! might be the lighting and angle but I say good job to you sir! fill out teh info's and I shall add's thee!


...very true - and the last pic also shows very clearly the thin surface cover of the visible PCB lanes and why they are so easily scathed etc...a candidate for the OP pic collection ?


----------



## Stige

Mother of god, my Dual Channel decided to start working again!

I couldn't get it to work after delidding no matter what I did but now it works just perfect.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Mother of god, my Dual Channel decided to start working again!
> 
> I couldn't get it to work after delidding no matter what I did but now it works just perfect.


Did you change waterblock or anything the likes ? Encountered a few posts where this was narrowed down to pressure on the CPU from the block.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Did you change waterblock or anything the likes ? Encountered a few posts where this was narrowed down to pressure on the CPU from the block.


Not a single change in the setup since then but I had my suspicions about improper pressure aswell when it first happened but just didn't bother with it.


----------



## kikibgd

hey guys i am about to delid my 4770k what is the best way to protect the transistors?

i tought to just cut small piece of electrical insulation tape and put it over transistors, but what will happen over time when its running on 60-80c?
will it stay there, since the glue on the tape wont hold it any other suggestions ?


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> hey guys i am about to delid my 4770k what is the best way to protect the transistors?
> 
> i tought to just cut small piece of electrical insulation tape and put it over transistors, but what will happen over time when its running on 60-80c?
> will it stay there, since the glue on the tape wont hold it any other suggestions ?


MX-4, MX-2, and Gelid GC-Extreme because they are non-conductive and non-capacitive. Also someone used clear nail polish, others liquid electrical tape. Don't know if we have enough info to know what is best, but I would have to assume one of the TIMs above would be safe.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> hey guys i am about to delid my 4770k what is the best way to protect the transistors?
> 
> i tought to just cut small piece of electrical insulation tape and put it over transistors, but what will happen over time when its running on 60-80c?
> will it stay there, since the glue on the tape wont hold it any other suggestions ?


Just use CLU, everything else could be considered awful in comparison and if you are delidding then you shouldn't be using anything but CLU.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> hey guys i am about to delid my 4770k what is the best way to protect the transistors?
> 
> i tought to just cut small piece of electrical insulation tape and put it over transistors, but what will happen over time when its running on 60-80c?
> will it stay there, since the glue on the tape wont hold it any other suggestions ?
> 
> 
> 
> Just use CLU, everything else could be considered awful in comparison and if you are delidding then you shouldn't be using anything but CLU.
Click to expand...

If only Indigo Xtreme created a TIM pad for the die.







It would result in amazing heat transfer.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Just use CLU, everything else could be considered awful in comparison and if you are delidding then you shouldn't be using anything but CLU.


Actually the difference between using Gelid Extreme and CLU between IHS and die was only a few degrees different for me. Using CLU is worth it, but others shouldn't be overlooked if CLU isn't available. Not having CLU or access to it shouldn't deter someone from delidding. A lot of issues I've seen have more to do with application and installation than tim itself. Also CLP and Phobya's counter part shouldn't be overlooked. Changing Intels stock tim to anything else makes a good difference in load temps.


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> hey guys i am about to delid my 4770k what is the best way to protect the transistors?
> 
> i tought to just cut small piece of electrical insulation tape and put it over transistors, but what will happen over time when its running on 60-80c?
> will it stay there, since the glue on the tape wont hold it any other suggestions ?


I used CLU and then surrounded the Die (and thereby covered the small transistors) with Fujipoly Ultra Extreme - It isolates, draws heat away like a sponge and is over the top (But this is OCN).

Just make sure to use the 0.5mm in thickness.

Usng this method on my 4770K, Direct on die with EK Supremacy and their Bare die mounting kit.

Example photo, not mine as I currently am without a camera:


----------



## kikibgd

no on die i will use CLU for sure, i ordered allready but i want to protect the transistors on the side of the die, i am thinking the best is to put some tape over them put CLU when finished and everything clean take tape off? this is ok ? what you think?


----------



## Gomi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> no on die i will use CLU for sure, i ordered allready but i want to protect the transistors on the side of the die, i am thinking the best is to put some tape over them put CLU when finished and everything clean take tape off? this is ok ? what you think?


The problem, when it comes to Haswell, is that if you get the "Pump out"-effect you might fry the CPU as the CLP/CLU would short the transistors.

For peace of mind, put some clear nail-polish on those transisters, or a thin (0.5mm) piece of thermap pad in order to isolate it.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> no on die i will use CLU for sure, i ordered allready but i want to protect the transistors on the side of the die, i am thinking the best is to put some tape over them put CLU when finished and everything clean take tape off? this is ok ? what you think?


A lot of people just cover them with non-conductive TIM like MX-4. Seems to work fine.


----------



## kikibgd

anyone got photo with transistors covered in mx-4, how much they put ?

i think maybe nail polish is better pass few times and thats it?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> i think maybe nail polish is better pass few times and thats it?


One thick coat Rimmel Oyster Pink pearlescent nail varnish, let dry, then clear gloss over it


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> anyone got photo with transistors covered in mx-4, how much they put ?
> 
> i think maybe nail polish is better pass few times and thats it?


Not a very good pic, but this was the first time I did it. I ended up re-doing it and used less the second time but I didn't take a picture of it.


----------



## stickg1

Well I couldn't help myself. I ended up delidding this 3770K even though I should have gone for a better specimen. Temps are good though. I had about an 18C drop this time around.

http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/stickg1/media/deliddedWCloopRADseries_zps2c00231a.jpg.html

I had drained my loop to change it around some and decided to just go ahead and delid the sucker. This is number 5. Did my usual setup, CLU on the die, Antec Formula 7 between IHS and Raystorm.


----------



## justanoldman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> no on die i will use CLU for sure, i ordered allready but i want to protect the transistors on the side of the die, i am thinking the best is to put some tape over them put CLU when finished and everything clean take tape off? this is ok ? what you think?


While some people don't bother to read, I answered your question as to what they should be covered with before applying a liquid metal TIM to the die.

As to temporarily covering them while you apply the TIM to the die, then uncovering them we don't know how safe that is long term. Theoretically, from what I have seen with CLU over time, you would be ok if your die application was careful and conservative.

The safe way, however, is to just cover them with a safe substance, as I mentioned before, and leave them covered.


----------



## kikibgd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> One thick coat Rimmel Oyster Pink pearlescent nail varnish, let dry, then clear gloss over it


good you really know your nail polish








it is fabulous









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justanoldman*
> 
> While some people don't bother to read, I answered your question as to what they should be covered with before applying a liquid metal TIM to the die.
> 
> As to temporarily covering them while you apply the TIM to the die, then uncovering them we don't know how safe that is long term. Theoretically, from what I have seen with CLU over time, you would be ok if your die application was careful and conservative.
> 
> The safe way, however, is to just cover them with a safe substance, as I mentioned before, and leave them covered.


nah i just wanted to cheap out on 7e tim like intel done to us i guess i will order mx-4

but this with nail polish is looking much cleaner, i will check tommorow if i can find some fancy nail polish and i can pass 3-4 times over transistors i guess to be 100% sure
will keep you updated (and spammed with questions if i find some more)


----------



## stickg1

IBT run 4.7GHz 1.44v after delid

http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/stickg1/media/IBTrun4700_zps3db07550.jpg.html


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well I couldn't help myself. I ended up delidding this 3770K even though I should have gone for a better specimen. Temps are good though. I had about an 18C drop this time around.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/stickg1/media/deliddedWCloopRADseries_zps2c00231a.jpg.html
> 
> 
> 
> I had drained my loop to change it around some and decided to just go ahead and delid the sucker. This is number 5. Did my usual setup, CLU on the die, Antec Formula 7 between IHS and Raystorm.


Man if I know I would get temp drops like that Id get it done now! Unfortunately I don't have a nice custom loop.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Man if I know I would get temp drops like that Id get it done now! Unfortunately I don't have a nice custom loop.


If you still have the 2500k in your sig rig, you wouldn't want to try it. That one is soldered to the IHS.


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Man if I know I would get temp drops like that Id get it done now! Unfortunately I don't have a nice custom loop.


I just have a Coolermaster V8 with a NF-F12 in it and i got a 30c drop on my temps...With some CLP on the Die...


----------



## Gankfest

How long should I wait to delid my 3570k to make sure it isn't faulty...? I don't want to delid it out of the box and a month later burns out due to manufacturer error and I'm out on the warranty.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> The problem, when it comes to Haswell, is that if you get the "Pump out"-effect you might fry the CPU as the CLP/CLU would short the transistors.
> 
> For peace of mind, put some clear nail-polish on those transisters, or a thin (0.5mm) piece of thermap pad in order to isolate it.


Am I missing something about the Haswell (Well I wouldn't be suprise if they were worse than Ivy, just like Ivy was worse than Sandy) but I'm pretty sure Ivy never had any sort of issues about shorting transistors.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Am I missing something about the Haswell (Well I wouldn't be suprise if they were worse than Ivy, just like Ivy was worse than Sandy) but I'm pretty sure Ivy never had any sort of issues about shorting transistors.


He's talking about the surface mount capacitors that are under the IHS on Haswell chips. If the CLU/CLP were to leak onto those, you might have problems.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> How long should I wait to delid my 3570k to make sure it isn't faulty...? I don't want to delid it out of the box and a month later burns out due to manufacturer error and I'm out on the warranty.


Right meow! I delidded my new chip on day one.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> How long should I wait to delid my 3570k to make sure it isn't faulty...? I don't want to delid it out of the box and a month later burns out due to manufacturer error and I'm out on the warranty.


I go about 10 days of every day use and over clocking and stress testing.


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If you still have the 2500k in your sig rig, you wouldn't want to try it. That one is soldered to the IHS.


I need to update that sorry. I now have a z77 board and 3770k


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> IBT run 4.7GHz 1.44v after delid
> 
> http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/stickg1/media/IBTrun4700_zps3db07550.jpg.html


What is your cooling?


----------



## Daredevil 720

I'll try to delid my 3770K today using the vice-hammer method. Luckily my father has all the tools necessary to get the job done, so that's zero cost. What I don't have is a liquid metal TIM, so I'll just use some MX-4 on the die which I'm also using on the IHS right now. Once I get my hands on some liquid metal TIM I'll replace the MX-4 on the die with it.

In the meantime, will I notice any temp drop with the MX-4? My chip runs quite hot, at 4.5GHz - 1.200V (stable) I get 75C max core temp on Prime95 with a room temp of 30C, and that's with a 240 radiator.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I'll try to delid my 3770K today using the vice-hammer method. Luckily my father has all the tools necessary to get the job done, so that's zero cost. What I don't have is a liquid metal TIM, so I'll just use some MX-4 on the die which I'm also using on the IHS right now. Once I get my hands on some liquid metal TIM I'll replace the MX-4 on the die with it.
> 
> In the meantime, will I notice any temp drop with the MX-4? My chip runs quite hot, at 4.5GHz - 1.200V (stable) I get 75C max core temp on Prime95 with a room temp of 30C, and that's with a 240 radiator.


If everything goes well, you should see approximately a 10C drop. Good luck and take your time!


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If you still have the 2500k in your sig rig, you wouldn't want to try it. That one is soldered to the IHS.


I delided a soldered Celeron D just fine...

Anyways, why do people call their CPUs "delidded" if they put the lid back on??

I remembered someone said that they are afraid to crush the die with too much pressure, well you obviously never took the heatsink off of a video card.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Man if I know I would get temp drops like that Id get it done now! Unfortunately I don't have a nice custom loop.


I got a 20c drop on air. With an h100 you should get a similar drop.


----------



## Daredevil 720

I just delidded my 3770K using the hammer. The IHS got worse than I expected. It has little teeth coming up on the sides that the vice was holding it. It would scratch the waterblock if I were to use it as is. Lapping is a must I have to admit.









On the other hand I'm also having a hard time cleaning the black glue. Got any tips?


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> I remembered someone said that they are afraid to crush the die with too much pressure, well you obviously never took the heatsink off of a video card.


That reminds me of about how I wayyy overtightened my accellero extreme onto my 6970, a year and a half since and it still works, but I know I made it too tight, it's just a huge ass cooler. Also KF avatars ftw







.


----------



## Gankfest

Quote:


> I go about 10 days of every day use and over clocking and stress testing.


Thanx I was thinking about that just to bench anyway to see how much my temps drop after the delid.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I just delidded my 3770K using the hammer. The IHS got worse than I expected. It has little teeth coming up on the sides that the vice was holding it. It would scratch the waterblock if I were to use it as is. Lapping is a must I have to admit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On the other hand I'm also having a hard time cleaning the black glue. Got any tips?


Same thing happened to me. I tried my best but I couldn't get a perfect IHS using hammer. Lapping will fix it hopefully.


----------



## SonDa5

Set yourself free. Don't get stuck in THE LID.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> That reminds me of about how I wayyy overtightened my accellero extreme onto my 6970, a year and a half since and it still works, but I know I made it too tight, it's just a huge ass cooler. Also KF avatars ftw
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Where is Ms. Foster?


----------



## neofury

Yay! My CLU came today. Hopefully the brushes make it easier to apply than the CLP with its stupid cotten swabs. I'm running 4.8ghz right now because when I fried my mobo I thought the CPU was seat badly, ended up cleaning it off etc and had too little CLP to get it sorted out in the end.

Back to 5ghz when I get home


----------



## SonDa5

4770k delidded. All razors.


----------



## kikibgd

wow nice looking, what you put on the transistors? nailpolish?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Here is my chip.. I used MX-4 on the transistors


----------



## Stige

Oh now I see what all the fuss is about shorting them out on a Haswell.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> On the other hand I'm also having a hard time cleaning the black glue. Got any tips?


Scrape it with a fingernail or a credit card (held vertically). Then clean it with some alcohol.


----------



## flamie

Should I paint CLU on the die and underside of the ihs or just the die itself?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> wow nice looking, what you put on the transistors? nailpolish?


Similar...

This stuff.

http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10001&pa=2120559&productId=2120559&keyCode=WSF&CID=GOOG&gclid=CMep8a6osrgCFcFxQgodiRkAIA


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *flamie*
> 
> Should I paint CLU on the die and underside of the ihs or just the die itself?


Just the die really. but folks (me included) tend to use the remaining CLU on the brush for the underside of the IHS witch will clean the brush nicely.
It shouldnt make much of a difference in temps, but every degree counts, right?


----------



## Chomuco

new!! goood!! 4770k 4.8 / 1.2v 58C









4.8 / 1.2v (43C) = 15C -


















4770K 5Ghz 1.25v bios stable IntelBurnTest Watercooler Link http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9091/mx92.jpg

Batch: L313B329







http://hwbot.org/challenge/hadess_xtu_global_challenge___jul_8_2013_until_aug_7_2013/

http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9091/mx92.jpg


----------



## mojobear

Hey guys,

I wanted to share so interesting results with my 4770K - it seems like when I increase vcore above a certain level, regardless of how high VCCIOD (up to 2 V), I would hard crash with BSOB 124 or weird ones like 3B.

For example: My overclock is at 4.75 ghz stable using 47 x 101 BCLK with Vcore 1.25V. However when I increase Vcore above 1.3V regardless of my overclock I get BSOD with some of the above codes. Initially I thought it could be due to VCCIOD, but I have tried higher VCCIODs (up to 2V) with no luck. Also tried low cache multiplers, same issue.

Temperature is not an issue. I delidded + custom watercooling -> temps go up to 71C with IBT - AVX on.

Anyone else seen this phenomenon?

Thanks!


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> new!! goood!! 4770k 4.8 / 1.2v 58C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.8 / 1.2v (43C) = 15C -
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4770K 5Ghz 1.25v bios stable IntelBurnTest Watercooler Link http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9091/mx92.jpg
> 
> Batch: L313B329
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9091/mx92.jpg


Your GFlops are very low - are you running Win 7 SP1? Should be 120+ at 5.0. Scores that low means it isn't using AVX extensions, which doesn't put the same load on the CPU.


----------



## Daredevil 720

I cleaned up the PCB and the IHS, then lapped the IHS pretty quickly (only with size 600 sandpaper) because I'm currently having a LAN party.









I did the worst TIM application ever with some Gelid GC Extreme on the die and IHS to assemble it all back together to be ready for the LAN party.

Even though I haven't finished the job yet I notice a drop of 10C in max temp!







When I finish my lapping and apply some liquid metal TIM I hope for the drop to reach 25-30C.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Your GFlops are very low - are you running Win 7 SP1? Should be 120+ at 5.0. Scores that low means it isn't using AVX extensions, which doesn't put the same load on the CPU.


Wow those are low, I'm at 4.7 on a 3770k and i see 100's across the board. Might have something to do with IBT and a haswell chip. Doesn't the haswell use AVX-2? Ivy only uses AVX?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> I delided a soldered Celeron D just fine...
> 
> Anyways, why do people call their CPUs "delidded" if they put the lid back on??
> 
> I remembered someone said that they are afraid to crush the die with too much pressure, well you obviously never took the heatsink off of a video card.


They can be delidded, it is just more difficult, higher chances of damaging the cpu, & not as worthwhile since they are already soldered.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> Wow those are low, I'm at 4.7 on a 3770k and i see 100's across the board. Might have something to do with IBT and a haswell chip. Doesn't the haswell use AVX-2? Ivy only uses AVX?


With AVX haswell also gets high in the Gflops, at 5Ghz using 6Gb + of memory it is up around 145Gflops in IBT.


----------



## neofury

Alright I definitely need some help.

Before I fried my motherboard, I had 5ghz same voltage and IBT/p95 would give me: 79-86-88-83

I bought a new motherboard but had run out of CLP, so I bought some CLU. Before I had CLP on the die, CLP under the IHS, and AS5 on top of the IHS.

Now I have CLU on the die, CLU under the IHS and CLU on top of the IHS

Now, the ambient is for sure 5c hotter today, it's the hottest day here so far this summer. But still, this makes no sense at all. CLU is supposed to be better than CLP and CLU is definitely better than AS5.

Check this: IBT gave me: 83-96-96-96, the 4 degrees increase from 79 makes sense, the ambient is likely 5c higher easily.

Why in the heck am I getting +10c-+8c-+13c though?

I spread the CLU on the die evenly, same with the IHS. As for the top of the IHS, I didn't put a lot and may have not put enough? It was maybe a dime shaped circle spread out evenly.

Some help would be greatly appreciated. I was hoping for something like 77-84-85-80, or a the very least even 83-83-83-83

I'm pretty concerned, my cooling and overclock/voltage is identical to before and passes IBT still.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Alright I definitely need some help.
> 
> Before I fried my motherboard, I had 5ghz same voltage and IBT/p95 would give me: 79-86-88-83
> 
> I bought a new motherboard but had run out of CLP, so I bought some CLU. Before I had CLP on the die, CLP under the IHS, and AS5 on top of the IHS.
> 
> Now I have CLU on the die, CLU under the IHS and CLU on top of the IHS
> 
> Now, the ambient is for sure 5c hotter today, it's the hottest day here so far this summer. But still, this makes no sense at all. CLU is supposed to be better than CLP and CLU is definitely better than AS5.
> 
> Check this: IBT gave me: 83-96-96-96, the 4 degrees increase from 79 makes sense, the ambient is likely 5c higher easily.
> 
> Why in the heck am I getting +10c-+8c-+13c though?
> 
> I spread the CLU on the die evenly, same with the IHS. As for the top of the IHS, I didn't put a lot and may have not put enough? It was maybe a dime shaped circle spread out evenly.
> 
> Some help would be greatly appreciated. I was hoping for something like 77-84-85-80, or a the very least even 83-83-83-83
> 
> I'm pretty concerned, my cooling and overclock/voltage is identical to before and passes IBT still.


hmm to me that looks like not enough or too much was put on, When you put your cooler back on did you do it in 1 attempt? Meaning you didn't pull it off to adjust it slightly?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

http://imgur.com/gFCDb5k



CLU is def the king with good cooling. Those are my idle temps with 1.415v 24/7 into the cpu.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> hmm to me that looks like not enough or too much was put on, When you put your cooler back on did you do it in 1 attempt? Meaning you didn't pull it off to adjust it slightly?


Thanks for the quick response. I actually took the cooler off completely, cleaned the block on the cooler, cleaned the die, the IHS on both sides, completely with arcticlean. Everything was 100% clean. I then re-applied CLU to everything and put it all back together. That was my 1st attempt.

I just checked the IHS and it wasn't enough. Now I'm at 78-88-87-87 which is basically equivalent to before I broke my mobo and was running it with AS5 on the IHS and CLP on everything else. I'm wondering if the IHS seating could cause this. I've always had a big difference between core 0 and 1 2 and 3 no matter which arrangement I've tried. Obviously my TIM job on top of the IHS wasn't enough, but for the inside of the IHS and the die, it's basically spread evenly across the die and the same area on the bottom of the IHS. Only thing I can think of is:

1) The IHS isn't seated properly on the CPU
2) The cooler isn't seated properly (Doubt it to be honest)

But I've seated this cooler numerous times always re-doing the backplate and everything, and I always seem to get core 0 about 8-10c lower than the rest. Since the ambient is like 5c higher than when I did my last test with AS5 on the IHS, 78-88-87-87 is actually very good. It basically means I dropped 5c. I can live with that because on a normal day it'll be 73-83-82-82, which is a big improvement for me. I also forgot to mention, my top exhaust fan is currently disconnected. Completely forgot about that. But I have a strong back exhaust. Do you think putting the top exhaust back (it's one of those weak 200mm stock ones) would improve my CPU temps at all?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Thanks for the quick response. I actually took the cooler off completely, cleaned the block on the cooler, cleaned the die, the IHS on both sides, completely with arcticlean. Everything was 100% clean. I then re-applied CLU to everything and put it all back together. That was my 1st attempt.
> 
> I just checked the IHS and it wasn't enough. Now I'm at 78-88-87-87 which is basically equivalent to before I broke my mobo and was running it with AS5 on the IHS and CLP on everything else. I'm wondering if the IHS seating could cause this. I've always had a big difference between core 0 and 1 2 and 3 no matter which arrangement I've tried. Obviously my TIM job on top of the IHS wasn't enough, but for the inside of the IHS and the die, it's basically spread evenly across the die and the same area on the bottom of the IHS. Only thing I can think of is:
> 
> 1) The IHS isn't seated properly on the CPU
> 2) The cooler isn't seated properly (Doubt it to be honest)
> 
> But I've seated this cooler numerous times always re-doing the backplate and everything, and I always seem to get core 0 about 8-10c lower than the rest. Since the ambient is like 5c higher than when I did my last test with AS5 on the IHS, 78-88-87-87 is actually very good. It basically means I dropped 5c. I can live with that because on a normal day it'll be 73-83-82-82, which is a big improvement for me. I also forgot to mention, my top exhaust fan is currently disconnected. Completely forgot about that. But I have a strong back exhaust. Do you think putting the top exhaust back (it's one of those weak 200mm stock ones) would improve my CPU temps at all?


I don't think the IHS off being off a hair length would make a 10c difference. When i re-seated my IHS i probably spent at least 15 mins being OCD until it looked perfectly centered. But i highly doubt that it being DEAD on manufac center is going to get you more balance. Now what could be happening is depending how the cores are arranged your hotter cores could be near the top of your case where that exhaust fan that isn't working is. The only way to test that i guess is to find a fan stick it there and see if it makes a difference


----------



## neofury

You're right. I'm going to do that. I'm just going to do a 20-30 prime 95 because I happen to know from experience with this chip, 2-3 of the cores maximum temps over a 12hr period happen around the 20-30 mark.

Plus now I also recall that my pics are of temps with just prime 95, and IBT has always seemed to be able to push the chip further in the past. I want to compare this IBT with the 30 min prime real quick and then I'll put the fan back.

Thanks

EDIT: Wow. So around 17 minutes prime actually outdid IBT 80-89-90-87 by a whole 2c, and I happen to know the last core is always the one that shoots up at the 40 minute mark. Its funny how you get used to these things. Going to install the fan then do a 12hr run. Ty for your input.

EDIT2: I just noticed my 2nd CPU fan was on backwards smh. I've added the 200mm fan and I've also moved a 140mm fan and added another 200mm next to my video cards to keep them cooler too. (We'll see how it goes lol)

It's funny alarm bells went off in my head and I realized I had used the clips backwards on the middle fan.

Running prime95 again now. At the same mark, I got 78-87-86-86. Considering the ambient is 5c higher right now, this is really good news. Thanks for the help.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> new!! goood!! 4770k 4.8 / 1.2v 58C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.8 / 1.2v (43C) = 15C -
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4770K 5Ghz 1.25v bios stable IntelBurnTest Watercooler Link http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9091/mx92.jpg
> 
> Batch: L313B329
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://hwbot.org/challenge/hadess_xtu_global_challenge___jul_8_2013_until_aug_7_2013/
> 
> http://imageshack.us/a/img833/9091/mx92.jpg


...that does look like a very nice Haswell w/plenty of headroom in temps, vcore for 5GHz *plus +*


----------



## mayandude

Hi to everybody!

I have been reading your forums for weeks but today i decided to join before i die for a stroke cause by my delidded I7 3770 (no K and no S).

I'm building a new cheap server and i bought a suspciously cheap but brand new(i guess) core i7 3770.

Since it's going to be for a server, i was not planning on overclocking it but i live in a place where summer can get seriously hot, with averages above 38 degrees celsius for 4 long and boiling months and no money for conditioned air and bills....

This is why after watching some videos on youtube i decided to delid it, now knowing that there are connections on the PCB.

After delidding it (and it was much harder and time consuming that the people on youtube) i got the lid off but i didn't know there are connections on top of the PCB.

I found it out after the lid was removed, but it was too late.

After seeing the PCB scaratched on 3 corners i started searching for info and found this nice forum. (Thing that i should have done before delidding)

Also i live in the middle of nowhere so the mobo took a month to arrive, and i didn't want to wait to delid.

When the mobo finally arrived I tested that CPU on the mobo with also a brand new Thermaltake PSU but as soon as i turn in on, i see a slight movemente on both PSU fan and CPU fan but then it never turns on. It looks like there is a short circuit.

Then i removed the RAM, the CPU and the Mobo is connected only to the PSU but still, as soon as i turn it on, there is a slight movement on those 2 fans but nothing else happens. everything stays off.

I usually never turned mobos without CPUs but when i did, they did turn fully on. This time it didn't.

(I should have tested the mobo without the CPU before using that delidded CPU)

It could be that the power supply blew the mobo up, it could be that the CPU blew the mobo up, or it could be that that Asus mobo was not even good.

I'm afraid to test that delidded Core i7 into another mobo because it could fry it, and i don't have any other Intel Core 3xxx CPUs to test in that mobo.

I do have another cheap power supply and when i connected it to the mobo, it did the same thing as the Thermaltake.

I will not delid again because i will keep using AMD or i will just underclock and undervolt the next Core I7 i get without delidding it.

It's a shame what i did delidding and without testing stuff before modifying it, but it's also a shame what intel does with its new ivy briges and haswells.

I hoped that scratches on the PCB where only on ground connections only or cutting just test tracks used by intel to test CPUs....
but that was just a hope.

Here there are some pics:


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mayandude*
> 
> Hi to everybody!
> 
> I have been reading your forums for weeks but today i decided to join before i die for a stroke cause by my delidded I7 3770 (no K and no S).
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I'm building a new cheap server and i bought a suspciously cheap but brand new(i guess) core i7 3770.
> 
> Since it's going to be for a server, i was not planning on overclocking it but i live in a place where summer can get seriously hot, with averages above 38 degrees celsius for 4 long and boiling months and no money for conditioned air and bills....
> 
> This is why after watching some videos on youtube i decided to delid it, now knowing that there are connections on the PCB.
> 
> After delidding it (and it was much harder and time consuming that the people on youtube) i got the lid off but i didn't know there are connections on top of the PCB.
> 
> I found it out after the lid was removed, but it was too late.
> 
> After seeing the PCB scaratched on 3 corners i started searching for info and found this nice forum. (Thing that i should have done before delidding)
> 
> Also i live in the middle of nowhere so the mobo took a month to arrive, and i didn't want to wait to delid.
> 
> When the mobo finally arrived I tested that CPU on the mobo with also a brand new Thermaltake PSU but as soon as i turn in on, i see a slight movemente on both PSU fan and CPU fan but then it never turns on. It looks like there is a short circuit.
> 
> Then i removed the RAM, the CPU and the Mobo is connected only to the PSU but still, as soon as i turn it on, there is a slight movement on those 2 fans but nothing else happens. everything stays off.
> 
> I usually never turned mobos without CPUs but when i did, they did turn fully on. This time it didn't.
> 
> (I should have tested the mobo without the CPU before using that delidded CPU)
> 
> It could be that the power supply blew the mobo up, it could be that the CPU blew the mobo up, or it could be that that Asus mobo was not even good.
> 
> I'm afraid to test that delidded Core i7 into another mobo because it could fry it, and i don't have any other Intel Core 3xxx CPUs to test in that mobo.
> 
> I do have another cheap power supply and when i connected it to the mobo, it did the same thing as the Thermaltake.
> 
> I will not delid again because i will keep using AMD or i will just underclock and undervolt the next Core I7 i get without delidding it.
> 
> It's a shame what i did delidding and without testing stuff before modifying it, but it's also a shame what intel does with its new ivy briges and haswells.
> 
> I hoped that scratches on the PCB where only on ground connections only or cutting just test tracks used by intel to test CPUs....
> but that was just a hope.
> 
> Here there are some pics:


Those are some pretty serious scratches. Try covering them with a non-conductive coating. Nail polish or Arctic MX-4 seem to be popular on here.


----------



## TechonNapkins

I posted a youtube video of my delidding experience on my i5-4570:


----------



## sinnedone

Pretty good video, voice changer not so much.


----------



## Valgaur

Those cuts are pretty deap in a few spots.....

What might have happened is that a arc accored (shut up can't spell today)







anyways but it occured (hahahaha! Got it







) and might have killed it that way. Is there a red light around the cpu socket area on your mobo when you turn it on? And if not take the mobo etc out of the case do the psu test and then let everything de static for a bit by holding the plugged in psu and touching everything but the cpu. Then let them all sit, then rebuild out of case and see if that works.










One should never give up!

Do some reading on the OP or original post and read the whole page.... yeah it looks short but its long. PM me if you need anything


----------



## TechonNapkins

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Pretty good video, voice changer not so much.


Well, speeding it up 1.25x shaved over 2 minutes off the time, and made me chuckle, so I thought... Do it live!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Here are my results for my maximum performance over clock on my 4770k before I delid it.
> 
> Powered by Intel's latest AVX2 linpack code.
> 
> Look at the Gflop performance and the heat.
> 
> 4770k with HT off at 4.4GHZ.
> Custom water loop, not delidded yet
> Ambient temps 24c
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2859272
> 
> This chip is worthy and ready for delidding.


*Delidded no IHS direct core mount*.
Same water cooling as before.
Same BIOS settings as before.
Coolaboratory Liquid Pro TIM between DIE and Block.



http://valid.canardpc.com/2865214

Process Gflop performance is up!
With ambient temps taken into consideration temps dropped at least *29C* per core!
Also important to note that 100C TDP heat was topping out and the CPU slows down a little by itself to keep from heating up. So max operation temps were never seen for the before delid test.

Conclusion:

*Delidding was a big win for my hot 4770k.*

Razor delid.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mayandude*


Hi mayandude, I think what you should do is use some nail polish over the areas like others have mentioned.

Also, take a flash light and look at the actual CPU socket on the motherboard, check from different angles and angle the light differently. Do you see any bent pins? When I bent my pins on my old mobo, this is what happened.


----------



## Bartouille

Someone has to explain me this nail polish thing. It is known vrm run extremely hot (sometimes even hotter than the cpu itself), wouldn't that melt the nail polish? Also nail polish is flammable, I'm not this sure is a good idea tbh.


----------



## Scott1541

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Someone has to explain me this nail polish thing. It is known vrm run extremely hot (sometimes even hotter than the cpu itself), wouldn't that melt the nail polish? Also nail polish is flammable, I'm not this sure is a good idea tbh.


I don't think nail polish it is flammable when it's dry, although you wouldn't catch me using it either way.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Someone has to explain me this nail polish thing. It is known vrm run extremely hot (sometimes even hotter than the cpu itself), wouldn't that melt the nail polish? Also nail polish is flammable, I'm not this sure is a good idea tbh.


I've drenched my gtx 670's in nail polish to stop coil whine (it actually does work), just let it dry and its fine.


----------



## Bartouille

Thanks I might give it a try!


----------



## luckymatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Someone has to explain me this nail polish thing. It is known vrm run extremely hot (sometimes even hotter than the cpu itself), wouldn't that melt the nail polish? Also nail polish is flammable, I'm not this sure is a good idea tbh.
> 
> 
> 
> I've drenched my gtx 670's in nail polish to stop coil whine (it actually does work), just let it dry and its fine.
Click to expand...

That was my question...do those little transistors on the 4770k generate much heat? If they do the nail polish will act as an insulator and not allow them to dissipate heat effectively, if at all.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> That was my question...do those little transistors on the 4770k generate much heat? If they do the nail polish will act as an insulator and not allow them to dissipate heat effectively, if at all.


From the people i've seen post that do cover them, no. They just do it as a precaution. Those same people are getting 30c temp drops on the haswells. I think if you put too much on and it interferes with the IHS then yeah you're gonna have a problem. But people shouldn't be doing more than 2 passes with a nail polish brush on them

I was prepared to use it on my ivy bridge. But i ended up only surface scratching the side of the pcb on the chip. which wasn't directly connected to anything it was just surface area to fit in the 1155 slot.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Thanks I might give it a try!


Just make sure to spread it around even. I took apart my 670's down to the gpu die and then started applying it around the choke points. some of them are closed chokes, they look like black squares with no exposed copper coil. Cant do anything about those. But anything you see on the PCB with exposed copper coil, lube it up. Most coil whine these days comes from an overclock on the card. But back on topic...

Also you're gonna be trippin on fumes for a few hours as the cards heat up (even if its dry), but its worth it. Cheapest high you will ever experience! (Kidding, never do drugs







)

If you're talking about applying it to the CPU, i highly advise you make sure to not use a massive gob. And only do 1/2 passes over scratch marks or transistors. You don't need a lot, just enough to shield it from stuff like Liquid Metal.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> That was my question...do those little transistors on the 4770k generate much heat? If they do the nail polish will act as an insulator and not allow them to dissipate heat effectively, if at all.


...if that is the case (either might apply), it is actually another reason to delid if not run IHS-less. With delidiing and no black silicone glue replacement, the little gap re IHS to PCB would allow hot air to escape...and running w/o IHS would probable be even better.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> That was my question...do those little transistors on the 4770k generate much heat? If they do the nail polish will act as an insulator and not allow them to dissipate heat effectively, if at all.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...if that is the case (either might apply), it is actually another reason to delid if not run IHS-less. With delidiing and no black silicone glue replacement, the little gap re IHS to PCB would allow hot air to escape...and running w/o IHS would probable be even better.


Exactly. If they needed to dissipate heat then Intel wouldn't have them just sitting there inside the IHS with no airflow.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Someone has to explain me this nail polish thing. It is known vrm run extremely hot (sometimes even hotter than the cpu itself), wouldn't that melt the nail polish? Also nail polish is flammable, I'm not this sure is a good idea tbh.


They aren't VRMs, they are just surface mount capacitors. If they got hot then there would most likely have been some provision for cooling them under the IHS.


----------



## luckymatt

Quote:


> They aren't VRMs, they are just surface mount capacitors. If they got hot then there would most likely have been some provision for cooling them under the IHS.


This makes sense, thanks. Nail polish it is (when I get around to it anyway).


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Someone has to explain me this nail polish thing. It is known vrm run extremely hot (sometimes even hotter than the cpu itself), wouldn't that melt the nail polish? Also nail polish is flammable, I'm not this sure is a good idea tbh.


The stuff that I am using is sold as an Electrical rated conforming coating. Not nail polish.

http://www.jameco.com/Jameco/Products/ProdDS/2120559.pdf

I am going to put .5mm layer of fujipoly thermal pad around the die which will make contact between the coated SMD capacitors and the heat sink. This may help cool them off if they get hot. It will look like this.



I left if off for first mount because the acrylic coating needs some time to cure.


----------



## Auxillary Field

Those things next to the die aren't transistors but SMD capacitors. There really is no reason to cool them at all, and to be honest I'd avoid putting thermal padding over them as it will just put a lot of pressure on them, making it more likely they will come off.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Auxillary Field*
> 
> Those things next to the die aren't transistors but SMD capacitors. There really is no reason to cool them at all, and to be honest I'd avoid putting thermal padding over them as it will just put a lot of pressure on them, making it more likely they will come off.


I doubt they will come off. The pressure is on the die not capacitors. With the Thermal pad I am using these capacitors will barely be making contact withe the thermal pad in between and the thermal pad I am using is very thin and soft and kind of like play doh. It molds.


----------



## Daredevil 720

I delidded my 3770K yesterday, cleaned off the black glue, and then did a really hasty job (was on a hurry) lapping the upper side of the IHS with size 600 sandpaper and applying excess amounts of Gelid GC Extreme on both the die and IHS.

This resulted in nearly a 10C drop in max core temp.

Today I decided to finish the job, so I took out the CPU and finished the lapping with size 600/800/1200/1500/2000 sandpaper. I then proceeded applying MX-4 correctly (at least I think so) both on the die and IHS, then I started the PC up.

The temperature got worse (about 5C drop relative to before-delidding-temp).

I was quite shocked by this. I mean, a half-done lapping job and excess amounts of TIM resulting in better temps?

What I think might have gone wrong:

1) Maybe I didn't apply the MX-4 correctly? I spread a thin layer of it on the die and on the bottom side of the IHS. Then I also spread a thin layer on top of the IHS. Maybe adding a bit more below the IHS would help?

2) When I removed the CPU to finish the lapping, I hastily cleaned up the Gelid with some cotton and 95 grade ethanol. It left some marks on the CPU waterblock (EK Supremacy Copper Acetal) which I thought I would be able to clean up completely later when I was to put the CPU back in. Unfortunately when I finished lapping, I tried cleaning it up and the staining wouldn't go away. I can't feel the stain, but it's really visible. This is the only other thing that could be messing with my temps (highly doubt it). i could lap the waterblock with some 2000 size sandpaper if needed.


----------



## Forceman

Probably a bad TIM application on the die - getting just the right amount of something like MX-4 is hard. Less is better under the IHS, as long as it is enough to cover.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Do I have to fill a gap with the TIM under the IHS? Or is the die (almost) in contact with the IHS? Should I apply the same amount of TIM I used outside of the IHS or more?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Do I have to fill a gap with the TIM under the IHS? Or is the die (almost) in contact with the IHS? Should I apply the same amount of TIM I used outside of the IHS or more?


Use less TIM under the IHS than on top of it (smaller area and better contact). The IHS presses straight down on the die once you remove the black glue, so there is no gap to fill.


----------



## SmokinWaffle

Quick question that's probably been answered..CLP or CLU?

Been pretty hot the last week, 26C+ ambient (hot for the UK







) and my 3570k is touching 70C at stock...not good. Although a Khuler 620 is a terrible choice for my odd case, might swap it with an Alaska Venom Voodoo I have waiting to be used and retire the 620 to my girlfriends upcoming rig. Might swap these GT's for something a bit more powerful too.


----------



## Watagump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokinWaffle*
> 
> Quick question that's probably been answered..CLP or CLU?
> 
> Been pretty hot the last week, 26C+ ambient (hot for the UK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and my 3570k is touching 70C at stock...not good. Although a Khuler 620 is a terrible choice for my odd case, might swap it with an Alaska Venom Voodoo I have waiting to be used and retire the 620 to my girlfriends upcoming rig. Might swap these GT's for something a bit more powerful too.


CLU.


----------



## sinnedone

So is the consensus that clu is better to apply, but clp gets slightly better temps while being harder to apply?

What about this phobya liquid metal in the first post graph? Does it perform the same or worse? Any graphs or reviews between the three?


----------



## Daredevil 720

I will be ordering my liquid metal TIM today, so I would also like to know which one of the three to choose.







Probably the CLU.


----------



## Chillin

CLU is supposed to be easier to apply and have higher thermal transfer then CLP. I think CLP is 31 w/mk and CLU is 38 w/mk. I used CLP because the place I bought from was out of CLU at the time....it is hard to apply.... not rocket science either though.


----------



## SonDa5

CLP vs. CLU. Which ever applies the thinnest and most evenly is best. CLP last a long time as well. I have done about 10 applications from a single tube so far. Going to try CLU once I run out of CLP.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chillin*
> 
> CLU is supposed to be easier to apply and have higher thermal transfer then CLP. I think CLP is 31 w/mk and CLU is 38 w/mk. I used CLP because the place I bought from was out of CLU at the time....it is hard to apply.... not rocket science either though.


CLP is easy to apply, Key is having clean surface on die. Alcohol works well for prepping die before applying.


----------



## Swag

I used to prefer CLP because it had a thinner application but now I prefer CLU. The consistency is easier to apply and it can transfer heat better than CLP (84 vs 36 (something like that)).

I highly recommend CLU because of that and the fact that it doesn't use a needle, I was so scared of accidentally scratching or even injecting the die by accident...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Here are my results for my maximum performance over clock on my 4770k before I delid it.
> 
> Powered by Intel's latest AVX2 linpack code.
> 
> Look at the Gflop performance and the heat.
> 
> 4770k with HT off at 4.4GHZ.
> Custom water loop, not delidded yet
> Ambient temps 24c
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2859272
> 
> This chip is worthy and ready for delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> *Delidded no IHS direct core mount*.
> Same water cooling as before.
> Same BIOS settings as before.
> Coolaboratory Liquid Pro TIM between DIE and Block.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2865214
> 
> Process Gflop performance is up!
> With ambient temps taken into consideration temps dropped at least *29C* per core!
> Also important to note that 100C TDP heat was topping out and the CPU slows down a little by itself to keep from heating up. So max operation temps were never seen for the before delid test.
> 
> Conclusion:
> 
> *Delidding was a big win for my hot 4770k.*
> 
> Razor delid.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...

BTW SonDa5, congratulations.







It looks amazing, I use the razor method for the Ivys and have delidded actually more than a few friends' Haswells. I prefer the razor for the Ivy because if the cleaner cut but the vice method for the Haswell so I don't accidentally hit the transistors. Also, since I have a rubberized vice ($20 sale @Walmart), it doesn't leave those little grooves on the side with a normal vice.


----------



## Chillin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> CLP is east to apply, Key is having clean surface on die. Alcohol work well for prepping die before applying.


Hmm, it was my first experience using anything like that. Compared to TIM it was more difficult. I can only describe it as putting a blob of semi hard/soft solder on the die and holding the Qtip on it for a few seconds to 'melt' it. Using the Qtip push around this semi molten/solid stuff until you have an even thin layer.

...but yeah I've changed lots of HSF setups over the years and they always get the 99% Isopropyl alcohol treatment first.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokinWaffle*
> 
> Quick question that's probably been answered..CLP or CLU?
> 
> Been pretty hot the last week, 26C+ ambient (hot for the UK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and my 3570k is touching 70C at stock...not good. Although a Khuler 620 is a terrible choice for my odd case, might swap it with an Alaska Venom Voodoo I have waiting to be used and retire the 620 to my girlfriends upcoming rig. Might swap these GT's for something a bit more powerful too.


I use ultra myself, easy stuff to play with and I find that with either one really you need to just give the TIM time to attach to the die when you first but it on as it just balls up and sits there and you try to spred it and nothing happens except you simply move it around. I normally use the q tip to gently press down on it while breathing on it closely to heat it up to become more maleable, seems to make the spreading process easier.

@ daredevil, (if I butcheered the name I apologize phone would let me quote you







)

If your gonna put a real TIM on your cpu then I really do suggest something other than MX-4,
I simply don't like that paste. I even don't know why really im really just not a fan of it. Atleast not after seeing my clu temp drops


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> @ daredevil, (if I butcheered the name I apologize phone would let me quote you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> If your gonna put a real TIM on your cpu then I really do suggest something other than MX-4,
> I simply don't like that paste. I even don't know why really im really just not a fan of it. Atleast not after seeing my clu temp drops


I was initially worried about the staining, but since I already oxidized my waterblock with stupid mistakes I say YOLO, lapping for life.









I'm probably going to apply CLU both on the die and IHS.

One noob question though. There's no way CLU can "flow" out of the socket and onto other stuff, right? All I'll have to worry about is TIM pump-out below the IHS, correct?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> @ daredevil, (if I butcheered the name I apologize phone would let me quote you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> If your gonna put a real TIM on your cpu then I really do suggest something other than MX-4,
> I simply don't like that paste. I even don't know why really im really just not a fan of it. Atleast not after seeing my clu temp drops
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was initially worried about the staining, but since I already oxidized my waterblock with stupid mistakes I say YOLO, lapping for life.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm probably going to apply CLU both on the die and IHS.
> 
> One noob question though. There's no way CLU can "flow" out of the socket and onto other stuff, right? All I'll have to worry about is TIM pump-out below the IHS, correct?
Click to expand...

I don't think the socket is capable of releasing CLU, if that were the case, I would've saved my money on importing it from Germany and gotten it from the socket.







Haha, anyway, as long as you do the vertical drip test and you pass; you should be good.

Steps for that said test:
1. Apply CLU to the location desired
2. Hold the location vertical so it ain't lying flat
3. Observe and take note if anything drips, any drip means too much. Use a Q-tip or something to remove the excess

Also, unless you push the entire syringe and release all the CLU, you shouldn't have a problem.

My Question:
Anyone know which AV is the best and lightest? (Not MSE, I used it and got a bad virus from a site I used to go to with no problems and no it ain't porn)
My Kaspersky License expires in 10 days and my BD license expired 1 month ago, I'm rolling with no protection.







Mama always said to use protection...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I was initially worried about the staining, but since I already oxidized my waterblock with stupid mistakes I say YOLO, lapping for life.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm probably going to apply CLU both on the die and IHS.
> 
> One noob question though. There's no way CLU can "flow" out of the socket and onto other stuff, right? All I'll have to worry about is TIM pump-out below the IHS, correct?


Yuppers! CLU cants go anywhere but the PCB as the IHS holds it there.

Also when you lapped the underside of the IHS did you lap the part that makes direct contact with the die or the little step down lips that touch the pcb?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yuppers! CLU cants go anywhere but the PCB as the IHS holds it there.
> 
> Also when you lapped the underside of the IHS did you lap the part that makes direct contact with the die or the little step down lips that touch the pcb?


I just lapped the outer side of the IHS, not the inside. Should I do the inside as well?

BTW I just ordered a piece of CLU from eBay. I hope it'll be enough for both on-die and on-IHS application, plus more for reapplying.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I just lapped the outer side of the IHS, not the inside. Should I do the inside as well?
> 
> BTW I just ordered a piece of CLU from eBay. I hope it'll be enough for both on-die and on-IHS application, plus more for reapplying.


nope leave the inner under IHS alone









But the CLU be very very slim in the amount you use. I use maybe half a grain, to a third of a pea. Then you just put it on the die and spread it on the die and when putting the cpu back into the socket with the delidded cpu make sure to hold the lid while the clamp tries to move the IHS down.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nope leave the inner under IHS alone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But the CLU be very very slim in the amount you use. I use maybe half a grain, to a third of a pea. Then you just put it on the die and spread it on the die and when putting the cpu back into the socket with the delidded cpu make sure to hold the lid while the clamp tries to move the IHS down.


Can't I just use the slide compensation method? Or am I not supposed to slide the IHS at all?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Can't I just use the slide compensation method? Or am I not supposed to slide the IHS at all?


That one works as well I just hold it down with a finger or two to help with the process as sometimes one side catches first and leans in more than the other. Just make it look straight and somewhat normal (as I guess a lapped IHS can look normal really....







)


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmokinWaffle*
> 
> Quick question that's probably been answered..CLP or CLU?
> 
> Been pretty hot the last week, 26C+ ambient (hot for the UK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and my 3570k is touching 70C at stock...not good. Although a Khuler 620 is a terrible choice for my odd case, might swap it with an Alaska Venom Voodoo I have waiting to be used and retire the 620 to my girlfriends upcoming rig. Might swap these GT's for something a bit more powerful too.


Trust me on this one, CLU. The CLP doesn't come with brushes, it comes with cotton swabs that do absolutely nothing. The CLU brushes are easy to use and do the job well. I've had a much better overall experience with CLU, I wish I never got CLP in the first place. The stuff is rubbish due to the application method and it has a needle too which is stupid, it wouldn't come out and then when it would, it would shoot out. The CLU came out of the tube perfectly.

In every conceivable way, CLU is better. It's better at heat transfer, application, etc.


----------



## sinnedone

How does clu compare to phobya liquid metal?


----------



## Robbieboy

Well i used CLP when i done mine...I used the cotton bud that came with it the first time, when i looked at it with a loop i saw some tiny hairs on the die so i cleaned it all off again used a better quality cotton bud and applyed the CLP again on the die and the underside of ihs with the smallest amount you could imagine.... It's amazing how far this stuff goes....

Anyway CLP works Great in my opinion i have a 30c drop in temps across all four cores and I'm on Air....


----------



## kikibgd

hey guys anyone of you ordered trough CLU webshop ?
how long was the shipping in europe,

i oredered mine 2 days ago and i didnt even got tracking number
i have chosen DHL as shipping option.

how many days i am looking at?


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> hey guys anyone of you ordered trough CLU webshop ?
> how long was the shipping in europe,
> 
> i oredered mine 2 days ago and i didnt even got tracking number
> i have chosen DHL as shipping option.
> 
> how many days i am looking at?


Mine took 4 days from germany to norway, but depending on what country you live in it may take anywhere between 3 to 5 days, and then another 1 to 3 days to reach your local post office. For comparison, mine took 2 days to reach my post office in norway.


----------



## kikibgd

i am in portugal, usualy when it arrives in the country next day its by me, but i didnt get any shipping number or anything from CoolLaboratory, and its saying Order Pending...


----------



## akiles333

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> i am in portugal, usualy when it arrives in the country next day its by me, but i didnt get any shipping number or anything from CoolLaboratory, and its saying Order Pending...


You should send them an email and ask why its taking so long. I had to send them like 3 emails before they sent me the tracking number.


----------



## thestache

Hey guys,

Few quick questions.

Thinking about playing with haswell until ivy-e. I want to delid a 4770k, use phobya LM and a direct die mount with my EK Supremacy/a EK naked kit and was wondering if anyone has has any experience with the kit?

When installing since the kit is made specifically for delidded CPUs are you able as per the instructions to just screw down the block until it stops/bottoms out (like regular installing of a Supremacy) since EKs taken the guess work out of it or should you be more careful since everyone seems to claim the die is fragile?

Also with the liquid metal, is covering the exposed parts next to the die with some nail polish/or silicone a good idea just to be safe?

Thank any help is appreciated.


----------



## kikibgd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akiles333*
> 
> You should send them an email and ask why its taking so long. I had to send them like 3 emails before they sent me the tracking number.


ye i did, hopefully they will respond on first one.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> CLP vs. CLU. Which ever applies the thinnest and most evenly is best. CLP last a long time as well. I have done about 10 applications from a single tube so far. Going to try CLU once I run out of CLP.


...I still have several unused packages of both CL-P and CL-U, though they will be used up soon re. a CPU and 4x GPU application....given previous applications, I probably give the nod to CL-U to run slightly lower temp and also being just a tad 'less clumpy' than CL-P during application, and easier to clean up months later. But in the greater scope of things, they are very close to each other...I still plan to do a half-and-half (Cl-P and CL-U) on an IHS just for the fun of it and see how that works


----------



## Clukos

Are these temperatures ok for a delided 3570k at that voltage? I applied Mx4 on the die and the ihs. I dont have CLP yet so that was my only option. I am just asking in case i messed up something and the temperatures are off


----------



## ghostrider85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clukos*
> 
> 
> 
> Are these temperatures ok for a delided 3570k at that voltage? I applied Mx4 on the die and the ihs. I dont have CLP yet so that was my only option. I am just asking in case i messed up something and the temperatures are off


1.280 for 4.4ghz? can't you lower that? mine is 4.5ghz 1.208v

what is your room temp?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clukos*
> 
> 
> 
> Are these temperatures ok for a delided 3570k at that voltage? I applied Mx4 on the die and the ihs. I dont have CLP yet so that was my only option. I am just asking in case i messed up something and the temperatures are off


We need you ambients (normal air temperature in the room) to really decide but from what I can tell. It looks a little to warm for my take but then again you are using MX-4, what cooler are you using and what case?

I also agree on those vcores and clocks that really a lot of vcore for that speed.

Let us know so we can helps yous!


----------



## Clukos

Well, i am using the auto vcore setting on the MSI Z77A GD65 because it doesn't have offset voltage and i want it to lower voltage when the processor runs in idle. Because it's summer my room temperatures are pretty high, i would assume over 25 degrees Celsius. And my processor needs a lot of voltage to run stable from what I've tested, maybe it's just a bad chip. I'll try lowering the voltage and post some results. So far it's been running stable for 3 hours on prime95 small ftts.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clukos*
> 
> Well, i am using the auto vcore setting on the MSI Z77A GD65 because it doesn't have offset voltage and i want it to lower voltage when the processor runs in idle. Because it's summer my room temperatures are pretty high, i would assume over 25 degrees Celsius. And my processor needs a lot of voltage to run stable from what I've tested, maybe it's just a bad chip. I'll try lowering the voltage and post some results. So far it's been running stable for 3 hours on prime95 small ftts.


dont use auto, or offset, I uise manual and it works perfectly once you dial in your vcore needs. Auto tends to over due voltage sometimes.


----------



## Clukos

The problem with my mobo is that when i set a fixed vcore voltage the voltage stays the same even when the processor is under-clocked and idling. I want it to under-volt as well so that is why i keep it on auto. I might search if there's another way of undervolting when not under load. Thanks anyways! I think i'll stick to this overclock for now, under normal load the processor doesn't pass 65 degrees so it should be fine.


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clukos*
> 
> The problem with my mobo is that when i set a fixed vcore voltage the voltage stays the same even when the processor is under-clocked and idling. I want it to under-volt as well so that is why i keep it on auto. I might search if there's another way of undervolting when not under load. Thanks anyways! I think i'll stick to this overclock for now, under normal load the processor doesn't pass 65 degrees so it should be fine.


Change cpu core vdroop in the bios to 50% or so instead of auto. That should drop voltage by 0.2v,or just experiment what percentage gives you the desire voltage. It works a little like offset voltage control if cpu voltage is left on auto


----------



## kikibgd

by disabling intel integrated graphics do you get lower temps or better oc?


----------



## ghostrider85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Change cpu core vdroop in the bios to 50% or so instead of auto. That should drop voltage by 0.2v,or just experiment what percentage gives you the desire voltage. It works a little like offset voltage control if cpu voltage is left on auto


You sure you know what you are talking about?


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ghostrider85*
> 
> You sure you know what you are talking about?


I have the same board. Msi Z77A-GD65

Why do you think that's wrong info?


----------



## Clukos

Thanks for the info! I'll try this out tomorrow when i have time and post results


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Have you guys/gals tried de-lidding with a heat gun to help loosen the glue? Then using either the razor or razorless methond. Or will the heat kill the CPU?


----------



## Clexzor

I delided my 3770k today took only and hour I evcen dropped it on the floor oops







haa still works fine replaced with CLU...

Before 4.8ghz 1.38v 80c during bf3 and 81c in 3DMark never primed would cap out.

After delid CLU and AS5 4.8ghz 1.38v 64c bf3 after an hour lol and only 61 in 3dmark haven't primed yet would prly hit high 80s

Anyways wanted to say thanks for info all worked out great nice and cool!


----------



## kikibgd

passed 3 days since i oreded my clu from coollaboratory.com order still in Pending status, i am getting nuts i want to hammer my 4770k already.

anyone else had problem with coollaboratory online shop?
i chose DHL shipping as more expensive (fastest) one....


----------



## Clexzor

not sure got mine from frozencpu.com they always deliver super quick.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clexzor*
> 
> I delided my 3770k today took only and hour I evcen dropped it on the floor oops
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> haa still works fine replaced with CLU...
> 
> Before 4.8ghz 1.38v 80c during bf3 and 81c in 3DMark never primed would cap out.
> 
> After delid CLU and AS5 4.8ghz 1.38v 64c bf3 after an hour lol and only 61 in 3dmark haven't primed yet would prly hit high 80s
> 
> Anyways wanted to say thanks for info all worked out great nice and cool!


Glad it worked well for you! Enjoy the temps my delidded friend!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clexzor*
> 
> not sure got mine from frozencpu.com they always deliver super quick.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> passed 3 days since i oreded my clu from coollaboratory.com order still in Pending status, i am getting nuts i want to hammer my 4770k already.
> 
> anyone else had problem with coollaboratory online shop?
> i chose DHL shipping as more expensive (fastest) one....


I have had deliveries of CL-U and CL-P to Canada from both the Coollaboratory.com (Germany) shop and from FrozenCPU (USA)...on the former, the extra-cost DHL option did not work very well - all told just under two weeks (Coollaboratory moved quickly, but then it got stuck in a Dutch DHL depot for just under a week).

I have ordered twice from FrozenCPU, and the delivery time - without extra-fast courier charges - also just under two weeks > exactly as the online tracker predicted to the time / day.


----------



## kikibgd

i dont know since i live in portugal it shouldnt take more then 3-4 days(usualy when i recieve) for dhl, but i believe Coollaboratory didnt even ship it, i hope i am wrong.... anyway they are not responding on any kind of email i even tryed the phone and i cant reach them.... i hate this kind of things....

i sent message on FB wall hope they somehow respond since they took the money


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> i dont know since i live in portugal it shouldnt take more then 3-4 days(usualy when i recieve) for dhl, but i believe Coollaboratory didnt even ship it, i hope i am wrong.... anyway they are not responding on any kind of email i even tryed the phone and i cant reach them.... i hate this kind of things....
> 
> i sent message on FB wall hope they somehow respond since they took the money


...not sure what is going on in your particular case, but CoolLab. did respond to my emails in a timely fashion before (January 2013)...keep in mind though that their city (Magdeburg) was hit really hard by the recent floods, including the industrial area's main power station...may be that has something to do with it - may be not


----------



## DeadlyPaperBag

So today i felt super confident in my own abilities, so i decided to delid my prosessor







)) using the safe vise method:

¨


So I clean of the old paste and apply some new, put it back together in my system, and she boots fine!
but!!!!!!! my temps have not improved -. - ( wth right!?) I used som Noctua NT-H1, btw. why is this ???

Pre delid:


Post delid:


Did i not apply the new thermal paste correctly? too much maybe, or not enough?

HELP! really do not feel this "improvment" was worth the risk...

would like to be added to the club though







))


----------



## stickg1

Did you read the first post of this thread?


----------



## Skullwipe

Has anyone tried an alternate liquid metal compound? I've gained access to a couple different types, and I'm wondering how different they are from from the Liquid Pro. They're made by a company called Indium Corporation, sadly they don't seem to do retail sales, so if it proves more or equally effective there's not really a way to go about getting it in small quantities.

http://www.indium.com/thermal-interface-materials/other/liquid-metal/

The two I that I can test are both primarily Gallium, the first is 95% Gallium 5% Indium, the second is more exotic, 61% Gallium 25% Indium 13% Tin 1% Zinc. Going to be testing on an old C2D, we'll see how it compares to the Liquid Ultra I have.


----------



## stickg1

Shouldn't be too far off, those are the metals used in other liquid metal TIMs.


----------



## chromedivision

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> So today i felt super confident in my own abilities, so i decided to delid my prosessor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )) using the safe vise method:
> 
> ¨
> 
> 
> So I clean of the old paste and apply some new, put it back together in my system, and she boots fine!
> but!!!!!!! my temps have not improved -. - ( wth right!?) I used som Noctua NT-H1, btw. why is this ???
> 
> Pre delid:
> 
> 
> Post delid:
> 
> 
> Did i not apply the new thermal paste correctly? too much maybe, or not enough?
> 
> HELP! really do not feel this "improvment" was worth the risk...
> 
> would like to be added to the club though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ))


You really did it locking the ihs in the vice instead the chip?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> You really did it locking the ihs in the vice instead the chip?


What? You always put the IHS in the vise, not the PCB.


----------



## chromedivision

My mistake! Guess I'm high. lol

I did it by razor and guitar pick method. Thought that thing flying on YouTube videos were the ihs. Didn't pay attention to that.


----------



## DeadlyPaperBag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Did you read the first post of this thread?


What do you mean? ofc I read it?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> What do you mean? ofc I read it?


Did you remove the black glue? What TIM did you use as well?


----------



## DeadlyPaperBag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Did you remove the black glue? What TIM did you use as well?


I removed quite a bit of it, but not all though, and I used Noctua NT-H1


----------



## Valgaur

Id remove all the glue and get some better TIM if you can get your hands on any. What cooler you using as well (knew I forgot one)


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> I removed quite a bit of it, but not all though, and I used Noctua NT-H1


U must remove all glue , and then use clu instead of noctua paste, my temp dropped 15 c with clu compare to noctua


----------



## kikibgd

ok i recieved dhl tracking number with this comment
"Please note: It can take some time until the tracking at Deutsche Post will be useable. The shipment can't possibly be tracked completely."

good i ordered 2clu so i dont need to order again from them in a long time hopefully it will arrive next week


----------



## HGooper

Finally delid my 3570k with vice, just wanna ask how thin should I apply the CLP to die?


----------



## Jetskyer

Just a nice even spread, no 'bubbles' or anything. When you apply a little to the underside of the IHS as well you'll be fine


----------



## Swag

Assuming you got a perfectly clean IHS and the PCB (glue cleaned), very thin, but post pics to get an idea.


----------



## HGooper

Is this the correct way to do?


----------



## Jetskyer

Yes it is. Only problem with the q-tips is that they can leave small fibers on the die, resulting in a little less than perfect mount.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> What do you mean? ofc I read it?


Well because it mentions how important it is to remove all of the glue and the best results are had with liquid metal TIM. You didn't do either and your wondering why your results vary. Hmmmm


----------



## Mogwaii

Do i need to upload some photo of my delided cpu to join the club? =)

my i5 3570k is delided with clu on it

photo.jpg 661k .jpg file


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well because it mentions how important it is to remove all of the glue and the best results are had with liquid metal TIM. You didn't do either and your wondering why your results vary. Hmmmm


Where do I buy this liquid metal TIM. I'm might have to De-Lid. No satisfied with temps under water.


----------



## Jetskyer

Depends on where you live. For in the states I believe frozencpu is your go-to place.
In Europe you can get it from highflow.nl, directly from Coollaboratory.com, or try your luck on eBay (I got mine there for less than 5 euro's incl shipping in an auction)


----------



## neofury

In Canada I got it from FrozenCPU, had it sent by USPS and got no additional fees.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=46_58_1100&zenid=f2d60bee2455d60d383d084a6520109f

performance pcs is a good site.


----------



## DeadlyPaperBag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well because it mentions how important it is to remove all of the glue and the best results are had with liquid metal TIM. You didn't do either and your wondering why your results vary. Hmmmm


Oh, sorry bout that, i did not read about the importance of removing all the glue :O I thought the most important part was to replace the TIM, to better conduct the heat from the CPU to the IHS :/ but thank you for telling me







) i'm really a noob when it comes to delid so... but since i didnt remove the glue and my temps stay practically the same, i understand that the glue needs to go, and that the actual TIM intel used on these CPUs really is not that bad.

also just read this from the first post:
"the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS"

so I will remove all the glue.

I did however read about the liquid metal, but i chose to use noctua NT-H1 instead since thats what my local store had to offer







but i will be picking up some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra from amazon if (read "when") my temps improve from removing the glue


----------



## neofury

I think CLU will give you 15c over Noctua TIM.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> I did however read about the liquid metal, but i chose to use noctua NT-H1 instead since thats what my local store had to offer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i will be picking up some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra from amazon if (read "when") my temps improve from removing the glue


No, the Intel TIM is much much better than your NTH1 stuff. So on the one hand, you are removing the glue to improve temps, but then using a poorer paste which will _relatively speaking_ increase temps. Just order the CLU


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> Oh, sorry bout that, i did not read about the importance of removing all the glue :O I thought the most important part was to replace the TIM, to better conduct the heat from the CPU to the IHS :/ but thank you for telling me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) i'm really a noob when it comes to delid so... but since i didnt remove the glue and my temps stay practically the same, i understand that the glue needs to go, and that the actual TIM intel used on these CPUs really is not that bad.
> 
> also just read this from the first post:
> "the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS"
> 
> so I will remove all the glue.
> 
> I did however read about the liquid metal, but i chose to use noctua NT-H1 instead since thats what my local store had to offer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i will be picking up some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra from amazon if (read "when") my temps improve from removing the glue


Why you no read my OP!! Seriously its there to read and it takes 5 minutes..... every bit of information that any delidder needs is on the OP.

Sorry just me ranting


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Well because it mentions how important it is to remove all of the glue and the best results are had with liquid metal TIM. You didn't do either and your wondering why your results vary. Hmmmm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, sorry bout that, i did not read about the importance of removing all the glue :O I thought the most important part was to replace the TIM, to better conduct the heat from the CPU to the IHS :/ but thank you for telling me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) i'm really a noob when it comes to delid so... but since i didnt remove the glue and my temps stay practically the same, i understand that the glue needs to go, and that the actual TIM intel used on these CPUs really is not that bad.
> 
> also just read this from the first post:
> "the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS"
> 
> so I will remove all the glue.
> 
> I did however read about the liquid metal, but i chose to use noctua NT-H1 instead since thats what my local store had to offer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but i will be picking up some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra from amazon if (read "when") my temps improve from removing the glue
Click to expand...

99% of the temp drop results from the removal of the gap height caused by the die, understanding that, you should know that the TIM plays a very small factor in this entire equation. If you aren't necessarily willing to coff up the money for the CLP/CLU, you wouldn't be losing possible temp drops by using NT-H1.

When I first delidded, I didn't even use CLP/CLU. I learned about that TIM when Valgaur showed it to me after I delidded and well after I made my guide about it. My temps dropped around 20C and after the CLP, I dropped only 1-2C after that.

And again, it would be helpful for all the members of this club not be hassled by questions that can be answered by reading the OP. A common courtesy that entails with joining and interacting in a forum.


----------



## stickg1

Oh hey Swag! How's it going? You get that car yet?

@Val - you build anything yet?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Oh hey Swag! How's it going? You get that car yet?
> 
> @Val - you build anything yet?


Doing good and spending a lot of money on random stuff.







I did get the car. I got the Scion FRS over the BRZ mainly due to the fact that Scion was willing to add the Five AD kit onto the car for only $1100 which was a great deal considering it was even made out of something that wouldn't shatter after going over a speed bump.









How about you? Enjoying this blazing hot summer?


----------



## FlamingBeatz

I'm pretty sure this question has been asked loads of times before but there are jsut too many pages to go look for it lol.

How risky is delidding actually? Are there many people who failed?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> I'm pretty sure this question has been asked loads of times before but there are jsut too many pages to go look for it lol.
> 
> How risky is delidding actually? Are there many people who failed?


There are two methods, the razor and the hammer.

Going with the razor method is quite risky. Many people have scratched their CPU's PCB and most of them critically. I wouldn't advise going this way especially if you're a beginner.

The hammer method, on the other hand, is far safer. The only way to kill your CPU this way is having it fly across the room if you don't take some precautions. Place an empty cardbox behind the vice and some towels here and there and you're pretty much 99% safe. Worst case scenario, you scratch your IHS with the vice - easily countered with IHS lapping.


----------



## Chillin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> I'm pretty sure this question has been asked loads of times before but there are jsut too many pages to go look for it lol.
> 
> How risky is delidding actually? Are there many people who failed?


Anytime you start modifying something there will always be some risk involved. That's what makes it fun/interesting for some/most of us. I searched around for people who had failed using the hammer/vise method but I didn't find much. Personally I think it's more about the person using the tools then the tools themselves.

I've known about the razor method for a long time but don't feel comfortable doing it. When I first saw the hammer/vise method I thought it was ridiculous. Over the next 2 months I read/watched enough about it I did it too and damn it was sooooo easy. I just think it's so funny that a hammer is the proper tool to modify your high tech Intel processor.









ironic...

I don't know if this has been asked a million times but why wouldn't Intel at least use solder on the 'K' type processors? bastards!


----------



## Belial

I'm pretty certain only a single person has failed with the razor delid method on Ivy when using the right type of thin razor blade (and not using a big thick utility blade, exacto knife, breakaway blade, or a knife).

I don't think a single person has messed up the vice method.

There are a more people who failed putting the chip back in the board and fried it because they slipped when putting it in and bent pins, or forgot the motherboard stand-offs. There's a few people who scratched their PCB using the wrong blade and could only run single-channel (i'd say worth the 30C temp drop) on ivy. There's a few who cut the FIVR on haswell (dont use razor delid on haswell, no reason to use razor delid with the vice method really).

Is it risky to delid? it's 'risky'. Is it risky if you take time, research the method, watch a few videos? I'd say the risk is extremely small.

If you are the type of person who is nervous about these kinds of things, and very nervous about it all, then I'd say just don't do it. If you are confident with your hands, love taking things apart, kind of guy, and think delidding is a fun thing and actually prefer it, then go for it. A bit of chicken and egg, or whatever.

Here's a video of me delidding my haswell i7-4770k. It looks like I'll be stable around [email protected]//1.94VRIN with a max temp ~79C in a no a/c, very hot room, delidded CLU/CLU H110 with 4x Yate Loon High Blues, with a below average chip (won't begin to load OS at [email protected], needs ~1.3 for 4.6 to be stable).


----------



## ghostrider85

i will say that i delidded my chip surprisingly easy. you just need to know 3 things.

1. use the right blade. i got a pack of 5 single edge razor blade at home depot for 1.99
2. always lay the blade flat on the pcb, always.
3. be patient, take your time and pay attention to what you are doing.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> I'm pretty certain only a single person has failed with the razor delid method on Ivy when using the right type of thin razor blade (and not using a big thick utility blade, exacto knife, breakaway blade, or a knife).
> 
> I don't think a single person has messed up the vice method.
> 
> There's a few who cut the FIVR on haswell (dont use razor delid on haswell, no reason to use razor delid with the vice method really).


I delided 4770k with razor and to me it is much safer than vice. With vice you have to apply blunt force to the chip and with billions of transistors carefully in place it seems like the chip may be damaged from the force and even if it boots up it may no longer have the same conductivity effectiveness. I feel that razor has more control and delicacy. With razor you have to be precise but if you study a delided 4770k you can see the safe distance to maintain and its not that hard to do if you are patient and are good with your hands.

My delidded 4770k done with Razor.


----------



## Belial

I dunno, vice is pretty easy. As long as you use like a towel, electrical tape, etc, it isn't bad. It's like hitting it with a mallet, there's a huge difference between a mallet and hammer even if you are applying the same force (i think the difference is the impact).

They are both pretty safe methods, but when I did the razor method, all 3 times took about half an hour and was kinda intense. The hammer method is really easy, and i dont think anyone has messed it up yet. The transistors aren't glued in place, they are part of the die itself. If you know how a chip is manufactered, it's like they have a piece of silicon, then sand out channels, and then fill it with a liquid that solidifies, and then fills a layer on top. They make all sorts of channels and topology just laying these solidified gases and liquids, you can't really knock the transistors apart.

I could understand still using the razor on an ivy, but a few people have scratched off the FIVR with the razor (not sure if it did any damage though, those people were spoiled brats and just threw it in the garbate without bothering to boot and just bought another i7 like no thing happened).


----------



## kikibgd

more i think about hammering cpu more i want to do razor delid but anyone tried like to do 3 sides with razor the 4th side where are transistors not to touch and just lift the ihs?

or

start with razor try to slip under the ihs credit card, and work your way around?
this sounds not so possible because credit card is kinda tick.

next week clu arrives and i am buzzed with toughts of killing cpu already...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> more i think about hammering cpu more i want to do razor delid but anyone tried like to do 3 sides with razor the 4th side where are transistors not to touch and just lift the ihs?
> 
> or
> 
> start with razor try to slip under the ihs credit card, and work your way around?
> this sounds not so possible because credit card is kinda tick.
> 
> next week clu arrives and i am buzzed with toughts of killing cpu already...


Don't worry about it, Im not saying don't think your scott free. Simply think of it this way, the more you worry the more chances you have of getting distracted while doing it or preparing for the delidding.

I sugest heavily read through the front page, then watch the video of totally dubbeds delidding and watch his hands as he goes he's a bit nervous but I would be to honestly. When I did mine I spent 4 hours on my first delid I was one of the very first few along with Swag, so we had like no info on this stufff at all. As long as the information is there one can always learn new things not just from the words but from the experience of the user/typer.

Also either way of delidding is fine but its not just one or the other. There are two options for a reason.

Normal blade for the people with good hand skills and not finger issues like shaking or anything of the sort. I have seen I believe 3 or 5 actual dead chips (haven't checked in a while really)

Then with the vice makes for a great way for handy men to easily do it quickly, I've actually heard of a dead chip from the vice sadly and I think an injured one as well.

Did I even make sense? (Far to much work for the week and not enough sleep)


----------



## tasospaok123

Today i reapplied my external thermal compound, and this time i used some Noctua NT-H1. I ran prime95 @ 4.5Ghz and 1.24v and the temp difference between the hottest and the coolest core was too much. Core #1 was at 80-82c while core #4 was at a cool 62-64c. At first i thought that the paste didn't spread well so i checked it and it was fine. Temps continue to be that uneven. Time for delidding?
Thing is that my CPU probably has a Mhz Wall @ 4.8Ghz. I need 1.24v for 4.5, 1.29 for 4.6, 1.36 for 4.7 and i can't get it stable at 4.8 because of the temps. Will i be able to push 1.4v under a NH-D14 if i delid it?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Then with the vice makes for a great way for handy men to easily do it quickly, I've actually heard of a dead chip from the vice sadly and I think an injured one as well.


Link? What happened?

Seriously, failures should be linked in the OP. And like a poll option should be added "did you delid successfully" with only a single option, so we can see that X number of people did it fine (too many people would say no to mess things up, or because something that isn't a big deal like a small scuff, ding on IHS, single channel, etc).


----------



## Jetskyer

I believe one guy sent his chip flying through the room whereafter it didn't work anymore. I know it was quite a while ago, finding that post is like looking for a needle in a haystack.
He wasn't that smart about it though anyways, he started off with a few light taps and when that didn't do anything he got impatient and gave his chip one seriously solid whack sending the poor chip through the room.

I don't know about the damaged one though. Only remember one person that ripped off one of the surface-mount capacitors while trying to remove the black glue. His chip worked ok at first glance but I believe it failed to do any overclocking.


----------



## givmedew

Personally I would take a razor over whacking my chip anyday of the week but I delidded my 3570K with no issues at all. Then I went to delidd my 4770K with a razorblade and NO FRIGGIN WAY is a razorblade going to fit anywhere under my IHS... I don't care who you are you are not delidding my chip with a blade. I really really really do not want to do this whith a vice, a block, and a hammer... but there is no way it is happening with a razerblade either... so I really have no choice.

I have a huge loop with all high end components and there is only one way I am bringing the temps down on haswell (besides dice or ln2) and that is delidding. SO!!! vice block and hammer it is!!!


----------



## DeadlyPaperBag

Just a bit of electrical tape, enough to prevent the chip from flying but not so much that it wont move, thats what you need and then you pretty much cant go wrong with the vise


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> I believe one guy sent his chip flying through the room whereafter it didn't work anymore. I know it was quite a while ago, finding that post is like looking for a needle in a haystack.
> He wasn't that smart about it though anyways, he started off with a few light taps and when that didn't do anything he got impatient and gave his chip one seriously solid whack sending the poor chip through the room.


Put a towel or cardboard box behind chip, or use a vice that holds the chip vertically (and then have a towel on the ground under it). That guy was just an idiot.

How do you rip off one of the caps? You should onyl be using fingernails, paper towel, or a plastic utensil. People find ways to screw anything up...
Quote:


> Just a bit of electrical tape, enough to prevent the chip from flying but not so much that it wont move, thats what you need and then you pretty much cant go wrong with the vise smile.gif


This dones't sound right. You use electrical tape on the vice teeth to hold the IHS in place without metal on metal contact causing scrapes and nicks, but that isn't going to hold the PCB/Chip when you separate the 2. You shouldn't be using electrical tape on your chip at all, because electrical tape leaves residue, and tape isn't going to stop something being hit with a hammer mallet from flying.

Just put a towel or cardboard box behind the chip, or better yet use a vice that you can rotate so you rotate the vice so that the chip stands vertically, and you thwack it onto the ground 2 inches away where you got a towel laid down. It's not very complicated, as long as the chip doesn't land on a hard surface it's fine.


----------



## Anth Seebel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> more i think about hammering cpu more i want to do razor delid but anyone tried like to do 3 sides with razor the 4th side where are transistors not to touch and just lift the ihs?
> 
> or
> 
> start with razor try to slip under the ihs credit card, and work your way around?
> this sounds not so possible because credit card is kinda tick.
> 
> next week clu arrives and i am buzzed with toughts of killing cpu already...


I did all 4 sides with razor and only did a bit of the top left corner then twisted IHS off. If using a razor you need to be careful not to cut through black glue too fast and decrease force when you nearly cut through it so you dont slip and damage resistors or die. I did one slip in bottom left corner (impatience I would put it down too in hindsight) and I think I knicked the die, at this point I wrote the cpu off as die damage usually = dead cpu. Couldnt believe it when after I CLP'ed and glued back IHS that it booted fine and passes all stress tests (phew!).

I used a one sided razor blade that was not very flexible as this helps the blade keep relatively flat so you dont chip pcb. Angle the blade slightly upwards away from pcb. I cut some neoprene to fit under the chip as I cut with my hands, not on a table. DISCLAIMER: only do this if are confident with your hands and can risk killing the chip. I would say vice method would be much easier/safer if you can use something like a rubber vice that doesnt damage the IHS. I know there is concern that you may damage the cpu with vice method from the physical shock but I havent seen any reports of that as yet.


----------



## givmedew

whoa.... sounds even worse than I thought LOL!!!

I am going to have to watch a few videos... razerblade was in my hands... whacking a chip with a mallet!!! that is in gods hands! AND I DONT BELIEVE IN GOD!!!


----------



## Daredevil 720

If you're going to do the hammer and vice method and want to take some precautions, make sure you put a towel below the vice as well, not just next to it. While I was hammering my chip it fell directly below the vice a few times.

Also in case the IHS gets damaged (like mine did) it is a sign from the universe that you must lap your chip.


----------



## BenQ

Greetings,

i'm new here at OCN - what a great community!

Delidded my i7-3770k, with outstanding results!

I used the Razor Blade method, and added the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the die and for the IHS i used HeGrease Extreme.

I did the following, used a 20 micron sandpaper on the die(not sure if this was a very stupid idea), cleaned it all with ArtiClean - The IHS and the die. Added the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra on the die and placed the IHS, added the Phobya HeGrease Extreme(cross pattern)

*My system:*
i7-3770k @ stock frequency with stock cooler (just for now)
ASUS Maximus V Gene
Corsair Dominator Platinum 1866MHz 16GB
AMD Radeon HD 7950 Sapphire (GTX 780 sometimes next month)
Corsair AX 760 80+ Platinum PSU
Samsung 840 Pro Series 256GB SSD
Seagate 7200rpm 64mb cache 1TB HDD
Home-Made Test Bench. (Waiting for the Corsair Carbide 540 Air to go live @ Europe)

*A picture of the delidded CPU:*


*A screenshot of my temps before deliding, just about 30 seconds and it reached 90 degrees (HWMonitor didn't read my RPM of my fans very well here, huh?):*


*A screenshot of my temps after deliding, Prime95 for just about 10minutes (not sure if the rpm is read correct here either, but seems more legit than the first):
*

I know that 10minutes of prime is not enough to measure the actual temps, but i believe that 10minutes showed just about enough results!







Even forgot to plug in all my fans in the last test.

Thank you very much for these delidding guides! *I'm so much more happy about my Ivy Bridge now.*

*Also downloaded realtemp and gave it a try (for temperature measurement, which software do you recommend?):*


*Ambient Temps before deliding ~ 22,9c.
Ambient Temps after deliding ~ 19,2c.*

Now, how do i join this club?


----------



## Daredevil 720

These drops are outstanding! You must be one happy man!


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> These drops are outstanding! You must be one happy man!


I sure am! Now its just time for some new hardware - i'm thinking the H220 from Swiftech, Corsair Carbide 540 Air and a GTX 780







And then i'll be overclock ready!


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> I sure am! Now its just time for some new hardware - i'm thinking the H220 from Swiftech, Corsair Carbide 540 Air and a GTX 780
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And then i'll be overclock ready!


Good choices. People with H220s and delidded CPUs tend to reach quite high clocks.


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Good choices. People with H220s and delidded CPUs tend to reach quite high clocks.


Purchasing the H220 today then, i cannot wait for the shipping - cause i'm so impatient.. Going to the store near by right away!







I hope they got it in stock!


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> Purchasing the H220 today then, i cannot wait for the shipping - cause i'm so impatient.. Going to the store near by right away!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope they got it in stock!


If only the shops in my area were like this.. Products like the H220 which are not that mainstream are very hard to find here.

BTW why did you use sandpaper on the die? Haven't heard of this before, and it sounds risky as hell.


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> If only the shops in my area were like this.. Products like the H220 which are not that mainstream are very hard to find here.
> 
> BTW why did you use sandpaper on the die? Haven't heard of this before, and it sounds risky as hell.


It seemed like the die had suffered from some small scratches, probably from when i removed the IHS.. So i found the smallest micron sandpaper i could find and tried to smooth it up abit.. Not sure if it was a very clever idea, but the outcome of it has been great.. http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=212&num=1 was the product i used.


----------



## Jetskyer

20 micron is still quite coarse, it actually lies somewhere between p800 and p1000.
Still is great that your chip still works, although you sir have guts of steel


----------



## kikibgd

i got i3 3225 in my htpc so i wil experiment on it today, i go to the supermarket to buy razor, its killing time


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> i got i3 3225 in my htpc so i wil experiment on it today, i go to the supermarket to buy razor, its killing time


Good luck!







May the force be with you


----------



## kikibgd

force will be thats for sure


----------



## ozzy1925

my cpu is stable at 4.8 ghz with 1.320v but getting 92c load (ibt 20 runs)(corsair h110) room temp. almost 30c you think i have a good chip worth deliding?


----------



## BenQ

To me it seems very good, the question is - would you take the risk's? If yes, then go ahead and delid it









92c after 20 runs ibt i'd say is a great temp at 4.8GHz, and its not sure that you would even get 10c+ cooler CPU. Remember, delidding also removes your warranty









I did it because mine could barely stay below 95c with stock clock speed.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> I did it because mine could barely stay below 95c with stock clock speed.


which cooler are you using ?


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

After a week of being stable at 4.7GHz @ 1.415 passing prime 95 custom blend for 24hrs i got 1 whea error over night randomly. I'm thinking its break in voltage. I'm gonna bump it by .005 and monitor it


----------



## kikibgd

ok delid done, after i tried vice and hammer i smacked few times and didnt come off so i took razor and start working around here is the progress









started with a razor on the corners then full side then i put my nail in and slipped the card and worked with card
got minor pcb scratch tin as hair and not deep at all, you can barely see it on the last photo down left corner

i want in DA club


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> Greetings,
> 
> i'm new here at OCN - what a great community!
> 
> Delidded my i7-3770k, with outstanding results!
> 
> I used the Razor Blade method, and added the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the die and for the IHS i used HeGrease Extreme.
> 
> I did the following, used a 20 micron sandpaper on the die(not sure if this was a very stupid idea), cleaned it all with ArtiClean - The IHS and the die. Added the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra on the die and placed the IHS, added the Phobya HeGrease Extreme(cross pattern)
> 
> *My system:*
> i7-3770k @ stock frequency with stock cooler (just for now)
> ASUS Maximus V Gene
> Corsair Dominator Platinum 1866MHz 16GB
> AMD Radeon HD 7950 Sapphire (GTX 780 sometimes next month)
> Corsair AX 760 80+ Platinum PSU
> Samsung 840 Pro Series 256GB SSD
> Seagate 7200rpm 64mb cache 1TB HDD
> Home-Made Test Bench. (Waiting for the Corsair Carbide 540 Air to go live @ Europe)
> 
> *A picture of the delidded CPU:*
> 
> 
> *A screenshot of my temps before deliding, just about 30 seconds and it reached 90 degrees (HWMonitor didn't read my RPM of my fans very well here, huh?):*
> 
> 
> *A screenshot of my temps after deliding, Prime95 for just about 10minutes (not sure if the rpm is read correct here either, but seems more legit than the first):
> *
> 
> I know that 10minutes of prime is not enough to measure the actual temps, but i believe that 10minutes showed just about enough results!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even forgot to plug in all my fans in the last test.
> 
> Thank you very much for these delidding guides! *I'm so much more happy about my Ivy Bridge now.*
> 
> *Also downloaded realtemp and gave it a try (for temperature measurement, which software do you recommend?):*
> 
> 
> *Ambient Temps before deliding ~ 22,9c.
> Ambient Temps after deliding ~ 19,2c.*
> 
> Now, how do i join this club?


First off welcome!! Then the way to join is induct thee self into then own compuper! Alright im just messing









The way to join is to use the format from the original Post (OP) and then post it right in here for me to add! Amazing temp drops btw! And I've been wondering for a while on how the die sand would go I wouldn't recomend it but I guess these puppies really are tough little stinkers huh!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> ok delid done, after i tried vice and hammer i smacked few times and didnt come off so i took razor and start working around here is the progress
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> started with a razor on the corners then full side then i put my nail in and slipped the card and worked with card
> got minor pcb scratch tin as hair and not deep at all, you can barely see it on the last photo down left corner
> 
> i want in DA club


Look above thee! Nice job fitting a credit card under that IHS that's pretty tough actually! Well done!


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> which cooler are you using ?


Stock though.


----------



## kikibgd

ok i will try with noctua nt-h1 and will post temps but but i dont know how the temps were before since i didnt monitor and its non k processor, still counts right


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EnthusiastG4m3r*
> 
> After a week of being stable at 4.7GHz @ 1.415 passing prime 95 custom blend for 24hrs i got 1 whea error over night randomly. I'm thinking its break in voltage. I'm gonna bump it by .005 and monitor it


What other BIOS voltages have you tweaked with?|


----------



## Daredevil 720

While waiting for my CLU to arrive I decided to push my delidded 3770K (MX4) to 4.8GHz. I've been running a custom blend in Prime95 for about 4 hours now and it seems to be stable at 1.350V. I might even be able to lower it a bit.

Max core temp is 90C, do you think I'm in for a 15-20C drop when I apply the CLU? I'm going to apply it both on the die and on the IHS. 70C would be an awesome temperature for 4.8GHz.


----------



## stickg1

That's the first i3 I've seen delidded. I had to double take because the die looked so much smaller. Well done.


----------



## EnthusiastG4m3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> What other BIOS voltages have you tweaked with?|


just the pll voltage, which is at 1.7


----------



## Robbieboy

Well if anyone is thinking it's not worth De-lidding.......Think again!!!

When i did mine i hoped to just get into the mid/High 60'sC but got to 61cC across the four cores but now after 3+ weeks i tested again and to my amazement it's gone lower....











I think it must be that the AS5 has cured now... I'm at 32+C drop in temps since Delid and putting CLP on the die...

I'm still using my Coolermaster V8 for cooling....So can't wait till i get my Koolance custom loop installed in the next two months...


----------



## Valgaur

Now that I finally have time... time to rebuild the compuper! Enough laptop running. I want a real mans computer!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Now that I finally have time... time to rebuild the compuper! Enough laptop running. I want a real mans computer!


You've had a borrowed marksman sitting there for a couple weeks & using a laptop instead of freezing a desktop?









I finally got some cold juice to try my retail 4770k cold, does about the same as the ES 4770k I was using in TO. Have to work the uncore next...


----------



## Bartouille

1-2 weeks since I've delided using NT-H1 on die and ihs and now the temps are worse then pre-delid. This is ridiculous.







1.26v I was barely getting 80c across the cores before (even within the first week I delid) and now it's at 85C+ after 1 min. I tried 1.35v and it freaking reached 100C at 4.8!! I need to get this CLU asap -_- (on P95)

Edit: nvm not gonna get clu or anything, just gonna sell 4770k and mobo and get a 3930k instead. I'm tried of this heat issue


----------



## FlamingBeatz

You all have convinced me to do it lol, I think i'll do it in a couple of weeks.

Another question, should I use CLU on the IHS aswell or regular TIM?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> You all have convinced me to do it lol, I think i'll do it in a couple of weeks.
> 
> Another question, should I use CLU on the IHS aswell or regular TIM?


CLU cleans like normal TIM so it would be fine using it on the IHS but it makes no difference between using a regular TIM vs CLU on the IHS. Most of the temp drops results in the removal of the glue/gap and the rest being the fact that the CLU gets a perfect connection to the underbelly of the IHS to the die.

Using regular TIM on the IHS vs CLU should result in no difference, based on my findings.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> CLU cleans like normal TIM so it would be fine using it on the IHS but it makes no difference between using a regular TIM vs CLU on the IHS. Most of the temp drops results in the removal of the glue/gap and the rest being the fact that the CLU gets a perfect connection to the underbelly of the IHS to the die.
> 
> *Using regular TIM on the IHS vs CLU should result in no difference, based on my findings*.


I don't agree. I tested a number of TIMs including Liquid Ultra and Pro and found the liquid metals to be better by 2-3c.

For example:

*MX-4*


*Liquid Ultra*


Be good to see your results


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> You all have convinced me to do it lol, I think i'll do it in a couple of weeks.
> 
> Another question, should I use CLU on the IHS aswell or regular TIM?
> 
> 
> 
> Using regular TIM on the IHS vs CLU should result in no difference, based on my findings.
Click to expand...

You must've applied it wrong then. I got an 8C temp drop going from the best ceramique thermal paste, PK-3, to CLU (from 15C delid to 23C delid temp drop). Everyone else found an improvement too, a huge improvement.

And you should always use the best paste you can on both IHS and die. If you got CLU, use CLU on both IHS and die. It's silly to use different pastes on the die and IHS (unless you got an aluminum heatsink, can't use CLU/CLP with aluminum, not to be confused with nickel-plated copper, silver =/ aluminum, or you got yourself indigo xtreme for the IHS).
Quote:


> 1-2 weeks since I've delided using NT-H1 on die and ihs and now the temps are worse then pre-delid. This is ridiculous. mad.gif 1.26v I was barely getting 80c across the cores before (even within the first week I delid) and now it's at 85C+ after 1 min. I tried 1.35v and it freaking reached 100C at 4.8!! I need to get this CLU asap -_- (on P95)
> 
> Edit: nvm not gonna get clu or anything, just gonna sell 4770k and mobo and get a 3930k instead. I'm tried of this heat issue thumb.gif


Well what heatsink are you using?

As long as you use proper cooling, Haswell will overclock just the same as Ivy. The problem is people using either outdated, old LGA1366 era heatsinks like the NH-D14, or low end, budget $20-40 heatsinks on a premium $300 CPU, and then complaining it gets hot. No derp. With a proper high end closed loop or custom loop, you should be able to run haswell just fine.

And yea, replacing the stock Intel TIM with an even worst thermal paste is going to be a bad time. Wait until your CLU arrives.

It's absolutely silly to want to switch to the 3930K, a $600 CPU, instead of just getting proper $100 cooling for your Haswell. Not to mention, Haswell is a good 10-20% better per IPC than the 3930K. Unless you do extremely multi-threaded, intensive, professional level tasks that aren't bottlenecked by any single-threaded applications (ie streaming by gaming& capture method), then it'll do okay, but otherwise haswell is way better for it's single threaded performance. Gaming, general usgae, even a lot of multi-threaded stuff, will do way better on haswell. Not to mention the cost difference...

User error, basically. Quit blaming haswell, when you are using the wrong equipment. NH-T1, likely an air cooler...


----------



## HGooper

Already delid my 3570k, and I notice that temp of each core is not that even, 2nd core has the lowest temp while 3rd core has unusual high temp compare with the rest. Should I reapply CLU and reseat the IHS+HS again?


----------



## Skullwipe

This is going to sound weird, but I do believe I've found the perfect applicator. High density foam eyeshadow brushes.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Well what heatsink are you using?
> 
> As long as you use proper cooling, Haswell will overclock just the same as Ivy. The problem is people using either outdated, old LGA1366 era heatsinks like the NH-D14, or low end, budget $20-40 heatsinks on a premium $300 CPU, and then complaining it gets hot. No derp. With a proper high end closed loop or custom loop, you should be able to run haswell just fine.
> 
> And yea, replacing the stock Intel TIM with an even worst thermal paste is going to be a bad time. Wait until your CLU arrives.
> 
> It's absolutely silly to want to switch to the 3930K, a $600 CPU, instead of just getting proper $100 cooling for your Haswell. Not to mention, Haswell is a good 10-20% better per IPC than the 3930K. Unless you do extremely multi-threaded, intensive, professional level tasks that aren't bottlenecked by any single-threaded applications (ie streaming by gaming& capture method), then it'll do okay, but otherwise haswell is way better for it's single threaded performance. Gaming, general usgae, even a lot of multi-threaded stuff, will do way better on haswell. Not to mention the cost difference...
> 
> User error, basically. Quit blaming haswell, when you are using the wrong equipment. NH-T1, likely an air cooler...


Haswell doesn't overclock as well as Ivy from what I've seen so far. But that's not my problem atm. NH-D14 is a beast and more than enough for a little chip that doesn't even consume 100w even overclocked. Heck, remember when those cooled i7 920 overclocked at 4ghz that pulled over 200w and even now, stuff like the 3930k? I might have done something wrong, but I'm not sure. My chip has some marks on the side due to holding it with the vice. I'll lap it when I got time. I still don't understand why, the day I delid, everything was perfectly fine, temps dropped about 5-7C compared to non-delid, then I check 3 weeks later, and it's running 10-15C hotter? I can't even run 1.35v anymore, and barely 1.26v that did fine before delidding? What could have happened during these 3 weeks? Thermal paste cured probably? Isn't that a good thing and is supposed to happen anyway? I didn't do nothing to the PC in these 3 weeks, just normal usage, haven't moved the case or anything. It pisses me off. Now I hope CLU and lapping will do the trick because if not I'm throwing this to the garbage and getting a 3930k. Not because I truly need it, but because that's the closest chip to the 4770k in terms of performance and it doesn't have to be separated in half with some barbarian method because Intel decide to use some cheap method instead of soldering.


----------



## Swag

I just took a photo op of my build (just my monthly cable maintenance, and someone asked for new pics) with a DSLR so pictures should look creamier.








This is also with my newly delidded 3770k, upgraded from my previous 3570k. Sold that one for around $140 to my brother.









Here, I'll put in a spoiler so for people who have seen my build enough won't have to deal with it:



Spoiler: Exterior of Venus











Spoiler: Interior of Venus












Spoiler: Backpanel of Venus


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Already delid my 3570k, and I notice that temp of each core is not that even, 2nd core has the lowest temp while 3rd core has unusual high temp compare with the rest. Should I reapply CLU and reseat the IHS+HS again?


This is how it's supposed to be. Different cores are different temps. Think about it logically, they are located on different parts of the die. Generally the 2 middle cores get hottest, but not always the case (one side has the imc and agent on it's side, other has nothing). Also, idle temps really mean nothing, the diode isn't even calibrated for lower temps.
Quote:


> Haswell doesn't overclock as well as Ivy from what I've seen so far.


That's because people are using the same heatsinks on a much hotter, higher wattage chip than the ivy and sandy. It's also really dumb to be using a $50 heatsink on a $300 CPU, if you buy a ferrari you dont put tires from the salvage yard on it. They also aren't delidding. People also said Ivy overclocked worse when it first came out too, turns out those people didn't know what they were doing, weren't using adequate cooling, and didn't delid. Once you delid, ivy actually runs cooler than sandy, and it can withstand WAY more voltage than Sandy, allowing for higher overclocks even though it bins the same and hits the same frequencies at same voltages as Sandy.

Likewise with haswell, if you use an nh-d14 on a non-delidded Haswell, you are going to have a bad time. If you use proper cooling, you'll find that haswell overclocks the same as ivy, if not better. These same people would cry about how DDR3 sucks if they could manage it make it work with a Pentium 2.
Quote:


> NH-D14 is a beast and more than enough for a little chip that doesn't even consume 100w even overclocked.


um... no? Nh-D14 is hardly a 'beast', it's an LGA1366 era cooler. it's way outdated, and nowadays it's more like a mid-range heatsink than a high end one. Even when it was made, in it's heyday, it was never meant to be a 'beast', but rather a quiet heatsink, as there is a huge gaps between the fins to make the heatsink quieter, at the cost of cooling performance. On top of that, the Nh-D14 comes with some of the worst fans out there, with some of the worst static pressure, and on top of that, they are run at only 1200RPM, so they are low speed fans. Low speed fans don't cool well, low speed fans with really bad CFM/dBa and super weak static pressure cool even worse.

And I don't know what you mean 'little chip that doesn't consume 100w even overclocked'... Haswell i7 consumes almost 200w when overclocked, easily. With a higher overclock near it's max voltage and overclocked Uncore and system agents, I'm sure it's very easy to consume around 250w on load. Now PSU and motherboard efficiency are a factor too, but my chip's POUT is over 150w WITHOUT factorying in ~85% motherboard efficiency and ~85% PSU efficiency.

My Ivy Bridge consumed well over 200w on the CPU alone, with Power-Input it was over 220w, and again, that isn't including efficiency of the motherboard and PSU. So if you think some 100w cooler is all you need, you are sadly mistaken. You might hit only ~100w on some 4.3ghz overclock, but you'll consume far more with proper cooling and a proper overclock.

I used an NH-D14 on Ivy (hey, at the regular $45 it sells for on ebay, it's not half bad), and it overheated on a delidded chip with 1.5v using CLU, So there's no way it's going to be compatible with a Haswell.
Quote:


> My chip has some marks on the side due to holding it with the vice. I'll lap it when I got time.


Don't do that... marks on the side mean nothing, your IHS doesn't contact your heatsink/block from the sides. Lapping is also a bad idea, something to do with concaves, convexes, and CLU being good enough. Seriously, bad idea mang.
Quote:


> I still don't understand why, the day I delid, everything was perfectly fine, temps dropped about 5-7C compared to non-delid, then I check 3 weeks later, and it's running 10-15C hotter?


Really? Everyone else does. The summer is getting hotter, ambient temps have an expontential impact on load temps, ie 1C ambient increase is ~2-4C increase in load temps. And you are using a weak paste. It's also extremely likely you used wayyy too much paste, you should be using a tiny dot on the die, like 1/4 of a rice grain.
Quote:


> Now I hope CLU and lapping will do the trick because if not I'm throwing this to the garbage and getting a 3930k. Not because I truly need it, but because that's the closest chip to the 4770k in terms of performance and it doesn't have to be separated in half with some barbarian method because Intel decide to use some cheap method instead of soldering.


Lapping will hurt your temps, and at best do nothing. Seriously dude, you are using a sub-par thermal paste, and you replace the superior intel paste, what do you expect would happen? You seem full of misconceptions, you are using a weak cooler for haswell, you are using awful fans. Nh-D14 is only good enough if you got 120/140/140mm fans on it and 3+ case fans or strong A/C going. Maybe you shouldn't complain that a $45 heatsink from 2009 isn't working with a $350 premium, modern CPU that's known to consume more power and run hotter. Whoever told you an overclocked haswell only consumes 100w is completely off their rocker, try 200w.

Getting a 3930k is a joke, they are even hotter running, and it's nowhere close to the 4770K in performance. The closest chip to haswell in performance IPC per core is Ivy bridge. Sandy Bridge-Extreme is, surprise surprise, just a Sandy Bridge with more cores (and a bit more cache). In single threaded applications like games and general usage, Haswell > Ivy Bridge > Sandy Brridge = SB-E, because most applications don't care about any more than 2-4 cores.

That's why in gaming, Haswell > Ivy > SB-E = SB. There are only 3 games that'll even come close to appreciating the extra cores of the SB-E (over an i5.. i7 has the hytperthreading to work), and those 3 games are heavily GPU dependent and will still run 100+ fps on a stock i5 with a strong enough GPU (c3 might be an exception, but isn't going to care about sb-e any more than sb i7). That's the same reason why intel i5's crush FX CPUs when it comes to gaming on OC vs OC, even those 3 multi-threaded games.

No one uses a hyper 212+ or even an nh-d14 to cool a 3930K. Likewise, you are being silly to complain about heat when you aren't using CLU, on an nh-d14. Did you not listen when everyone said Haswell is a hot chip?
Quote:


> it doesn't have to be separated in half with some barbarian method because Intel decide to use some cheap **** method instead of soldering.


It's not a barbarian method, the smaller dies put out a lot of heat per square inch, solder cracks under that much heat per inch. Tim doesn't crack. Now why didn't intel just use a glue instead of a thick tar, I don't know, but delidding really isn't difficult to do. Maybe you should've done your research and realized Ivy/haswell requires a delid to really overclock.


----------



## tzvia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> Haswell doesn't overclock as well as Ivy from what I've seen so far. But that's not my problem atm. NH-D14 is a beast and more than enough for a little chip that doesn't even consume 100w even overclocked. Heck, remember when those cooled i7 920 overclocked at 4ghz that pulled over 200w and even now, stuff like the 3930k? I might have done something wrong, but I'm not sure. My chip has some marks on the side due to holding it with the vice. I'll lap it when I got time. I still don't understand why, the day I delid, everything was perfectly fine, temps dropped about 5-7C compared to non-delid, then I check 3 weeks later, and it's running 10-15C hotter? I can't even run 1.35v anymore, and barely 1.26v that did fine before delidding? What could have happened during these 3 weeks? Thermal paste cured probably? Isn't that a good thing and is supposed to happen anyway? I didn't do nothing to the PC in these 3 weeks, just normal usage, haven't moved the case or anything. It pisses me off. Now I hope CLU and lapping will do the trick because if not I'm throwing this to the garbage and getting a 3930k. Not because I truly need it, but because that's the closest chip to the 4770k in terms of performance and it doesn't have to be separated in half with some barbarian method because Intel decide to use some cheap method instead of soldering.


You need to use a liquid metal TIM between the DIE and IHS to prevent pump-out; the TIM migrating due to repeated heating and cooling. This has been mentioned a lot around here. When I delidded my 3770k, while waiting impatiently for my Ultra to arrive, I used some AS5 I had laying around, and dang if the temp drop was only like 6c, then temps began to rise over a short time. I was elated to find my temperature drop was about 18c once I got Ultra, and I have had no pump-out issue with it.

Also, if you have bite marks from the vise, those can be high spots keeping the cooler from making good contact with the IHS. When I delidded my brother's chip (he is not PC savvy so I built him a new gamer) the marks looked minor but a moment with a straight edge and strong back-light told me otherwise. Yea, lap it. Can't blame the chip or the delid process for pumped out regular TIM on the DIE and poor contact of your HSF due to marring on the IHS. Take your time, do it right if you want the results to be correct.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Already delid my 3570k, and I notice that temp of each core is not that even, 2nd core has the lowest temp while 3rd core has unusual high temp compare with the rest. Should I reapply CLU and reseat the IHS+HS again?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is how it's supposed to be. Different cores are different temps. Think about it logically, they are located on different parts of the die. Generally the 2 middle cores get hottest, but not always the case (one side has the imc and agent on it's side, other has nothing). Also, idle temps really mean nothing, the diode isn't even calibrated for lower temps.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Haswell doesn't overclock as well as Ivy from what I've seen so far.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That's because people are using the same heatsinks on a much hotter, higher wattage chip than the ivy and sandy. It's also really dumb to be using a $50 heatsink on a $300 CPU, if you buy a ferrari you dont put tires from the salvage yard on it. They also aren't delidding. People also said Ivy overclocked worse when it first came out too, turns out those people didn't know what they were doing, weren't using adequate cooling, and didn't delid. Once you delid, ivy actually runs cooler than sandy, and it can withstand WAY more voltage than Sandy, allowing for higher overclocks even though it bins the same and hits the same frequencies at same voltages as Sandy.
> 
> Likewise with haswell, if you use an nh-d14 on a non-delidded Haswell, you are going to have a bad time. If you use proper cooling, you'll find that haswell overclocks the same as ivy, if not better. These same people would cry about how DDR3 sucks if they could manage it make it work with a Pentium 2.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> NH-D14 is a beast and more than enough for a little chip that doesn't even consume 100w even overclocked.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> um... no? Nh-D14 is hardly a 'beast', it's an LGA1366 era cooler. it's way outdated, and nowadays it's more like a mid-range heatsink than a high end one. Even when it was made, in it's heyday, it was never meant to be a 'beast', but rather a quiet heatsink, as there is a huge gaps between the fins to make the heatsink quieter, at the cost of cooling performance. On top of that, the Nh-D14 comes with some of the worst fans out there, with some of the worst static pressure, and on top of that, they are run at only 1200RPM, so they are low speed fans. Low speed fans don't cool well, low speed fans with really bad CFM/dBa and super weak static pressure cool even worse.
> 
> And I don't know what you mean 'little chip that doesn't consume 100w even overclocked'... Haswell i7 consumes almost 200w when overclocked, easily. With a higher overclock near it's max voltage and overclocked Uncore and system agents, I'm sure it's very easy to consume around 250w on load. Now PSU and motherboard efficiency are a factor too, but my chip's POUT is over 150w WITHOUT factorying in ~85% motherboard efficiency and ~85% PSU efficiency.
> 
> My Ivy Bridge consumed well over 200w on the CPU alone, with Power-Input it was over 220w, and again, that isn't including efficiency of the motherboard and PSU. So if you think some 100w cooler is all you need, you are sadly mistaken. You might hit only ~100w on some 4.3ghz overclock, but you'll consume far more with proper cooling and a proper overclock.
> 
> I used an NH-D14 on Ivy (hey, at the regular $45 it sells for on ebay, it's not half bad), and it overheated on a delidded chip with 1.5v using CLU, So there's no way it's going to be compatible with a Haswell.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> My chip has some marks on the side due to holding it with the vice. I'll lap it when I got time.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Don't do that... marks on the side mean nothing, your IHS doesn't contact your heatsink/block from the sides. Lapping is also a bad idea, something to do with concaves, convexes, and CLU being good enough. Seriously, bad idea mang.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> I still don't understand why, the day I delid, everything was perfectly fine, temps dropped about 5-7C compared to non-delid, then I check 3 weeks later, and it's running 10-15C hotter?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Really? Everyone else does. The summer is getting hotter, ambient temps have an expontential impact on load temps, ie 1C ambient increase is ~2-4C increase in load temps. And you are using a weak paste. It's also extremely likely you used wayyy too much paste, you should be using a tiny dot on the die, like 1/4 of a rice grain.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Now I hope CLU and lapping will do the trick because if not I'm throwing this to the garbage and getting a 3930k. Not because I truly need it, but because that's the closest chip to the 4770k in terms of performance and it doesn't have to be separated in half with some barbarian method because Intel decide to use some cheap **** method instead of soldering.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Lapping will hurt your temps, and at best do nothing. Seriously dude, you are using a sub-par thermal paste, and you replace the superior intel paste, what do you expect would happen? You seem full of misconceptions, you are using a weak cooler for haswell, you are using awful fans. Nh-D14 is only good enough if you got 120/140/140mm fans on it and 3+ case fans or strong A/C going. Maybe you shouldn't complain that a $45 heatsink from 2009 isn't working with a $350 premium, modern CPU that's known to consume more power and run hotter. Whoever told you an overclocked haswell only consumes 100w is completely off their rocker, try 200w.
> 
> Getting a 3930k is a joke, they are even hotter running, and it's nowhere close to the 4770K in performance. The closest chip to haswell in performance IPC per core is Ivy bridge. Sandy Bridge-Extreme is, surprise surprise, just a Sandy Bridge with more cores (and a bit more cache). In single threaded applications like games and general usage, Haswell > Ivy Bridge > Sandy Brridge = SB-E, because most applications don't care about any more than 2-4 cores.
> 
> That's why in gaming, Haswell > Ivy > SB-E = SB. There are only 3 games that'll even come close to appreciating the extra cores of the SB-E (over an i5.. i7 has the hytperthreading to work), and those 3 games are heavily GPU dependent and will still run 100+ fps on a stock i5 with a strong enough GPU (c3 might be an exception, but isn't going to care about sb-e any more than sb i7). That's the same reason why intel i5's crush FX CPUs when it comes to gaming on OC vs OC, even those 3 multi-threaded games.
> 
> No one uses a hyper 212+ or even an nh-d14 to cool a 3930K. Likewise, you are being silly to complain about heat when you aren't using CLU, on an nh-d14. Did you not listen when everyone said Haswell is a hot chip?
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> it doesn't have to be separated in half with some barbarian method because Intel decide to use some cheap **** method instead of soldering.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It's not a barbarian method, the smaller dies put out a lot of heat per square inch, solder cracks under that much heat per inch. Tim doesn't crack. Now why didn't intel just use a glue instead of a thick tar, I don't know, but delidding really isn't difficult to do. Maybe you should've done your research and realized Ivy/haswell requires a delid to really overclock.
Click to expand...

1) The NH-D14 is actually still considered a beast, it performs amazing for an air cooler and it's one of the best buys on the market. Maybe under the SA but that's negligible. And this isn't a biased answer because I used to own one, it's the fact.
2) There are some Haswells that can OC amazingly and those that can't even achieve a 4.3 OC, but based on clocks, more Ivys can reach a higher clock than its successor Haswell.
3) Lapping may not help temps considerably but it certainly won't hurt it. By lapping, you're making the IHS flat meaning the HSF can have a cleaner contact rather than the middle being slightly concaved as stock.
4) SB-E may not make a huge difference in gaming, but it still makes a difference. Especially when you're dealing with multi-GPU setups. I would recommend a 3930k (when on sale) for futureproofing (if you believe in that kind of thing) and it will handle any situation that arises.
5) Intel i7 930 (Bloomfield) was a very hot chip, it used soldering as well. It ran on a 4.0OC @ 90+C on average due to the wattage it needed. Many people cooled that with a 212+ and the D14. Just because the coolers are a bit old doesn't mean they shouldn't be used with new tech. People still use the 980X even though it has been succeeded by 3 generations already...

And your comparison of Ferrari and using cheap wheels only matters if they were using the donut wheels (stock HSF). It's like comparing the Nokian Hakkapeliitta 7 vs Pirelli Snowsport. They're both winter tires. Both well known and perform great, while some say one is better than the other. The H7 however is only $140/tire vs the SS which is $200/tire. The difference is huge for no performance gain. My point is, just because you own a high end CPU doesn't mean you need the most expensive cooler on the market to assist it in operation. Cheaper options will do the same job as the most expensive.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> 1) The NH-D14 is actually still considered a beast, it performs amazing for an air cooler and it's one of the best buys on the market. Maybe under the SA but that's negligible. And this isn't a biased answer because I used to own one, it's the fact.


Hardly. It is not considered a beast at all, it is overshadowed by every other dual tower heatsink but the Frio Extreme (and maybe zalman cnps14x if you consider it, that's supposed to be a budget sink though). Noctua specifically engineered it to be 'quiet' rather than a 'beast' by making it have very few fins per inch, and it was made in 2009. No one would argue blue in the face about how DDR2 RAM is a 'beast', yet here you are.

$39 LQ-320 on sale newegg, $50 assassin for a year on performance pcs (best air heatsink in the world, rebrand alpenfohn), H100s on sale for $40-70 and ebay for $50-60, NZXT X60/H110 for $80-110, H220 for $139, are much better value when you value haswell 100mhz @ $30 (a very fair estimate I would say).

Best buy on the market? Is that a joke? It's only considerable at $45 or less, at it's normal market price of $80+ it's an absolute rip-off, always was. It uses some of the worst fans around, with terrible CFM/dBa and non-existent static pressure as well. $5 yate loons absolutell destroy the NF-p12/p14s.

I used an Nh-D14 for a year, but I paid $43, which is the most anyone should pay for it. Noctua's support is awesome, but the thing was a weak cooler. It barely held my Ivy together, that was a delid, 8 case fans, and 120/140/140 fans on it all on full blast with open case.
Quote:


> 2) There are some Haswells that can OC amazingly and those that can't even achieve a 4.3 OC, but based on clocks, more Ivys can reach a higher clock than its successor Haswell.


Any haswell can do 4.5-4.6ghz if you give it enough voltage. I have a terribly binned Haswell, it's well below average, but I'm able to make 4.7ghz perfectly stable on 1.4v with adequate cooling and a delid. The 4.3 figures are based on non-delidded chips using low end heatsinks like the Nh-D14. Haswells overclock the exact same as Ivy, as you can see, it hits the same frequencies at the same voltages. It just does so at higher temps, so especially when people don't delid, they don't push as high voltages.
Quote:


> 3) Lapping may not help temps considerably but it certainly won't hurt it. By lapping, you're making the IHS flat meaning the HSF can have a cleaner contact rather than the middle being slightly concaved as stock.


Actually lapping will hurt it. Modern heatsinks are concaved to account for the shape of the IHS. A perfetly flat surface is actually worse because you get a thin layer of tim insulating the heat. Lapping was only necessary back in the TRUE-120 days when heatsinks were extremely coarse.
Quote:


> 4) SB-E may not make a huge difference in gaming, but it still makes a difference. Especially when you're dealing with multi-GPU setups. I would recommend a 3930k (when on sale) for futureproofing (if you believe in that kind of thing) and it will handle any situation that arises.


Yea, a negative one. You will lose performance on an SB-E compared to a haswell on a moderate, 4.5ghz overclock.

Future-proofing? That is absolutely ridiculous thing to say. Gaming is hardly CPU intensive, if you buy a 3930k for gaming that's just a joke. Single threaded performance is way more important, that's why Haswell > Ivy > SB=SB-E.

You remind me of the people in 2009 that said 'oh buy a phenom x6 for the 6-threaded games' or who said 'oh ps2/xbox 360 are going to make all games 6-cores!' and it still hasn't even happened. Please, wrong, wrong, wrong, and doesnt matter when people here upgrade every year or two anyways. Even an i7-920 will still play any modern game very well. Single-threaded performance is FAR more important than thread count for gaming, even in the 3 games that appreciated more than 4 cores, which care way more about GPU performance than CPU. Until you got 4-way SLI Titans, there is no reason to get a 3930K.
Quote:


> 5) Intel i7 930 (Bloomfield) was a very hot chip, it used soldering as well. It ran on a 4.0OC @ 90+C on average due to the wattage it needed. Many people cooled that with a 212+ and the D14. Just because the coolers are a bit old doesn't mean they shouldn't be used with new tech. People still use the 980X even though it has been succeeded by 3 generations already...


People who used the 212+ couldn't push high overclocks, and you weren't maxing out a 930 on a D14. The difference is a high OC on a 930 is the same heat as a low OC on a haswell.
Quote:


> And your comparison of Ferrari and using cheap wheels only matters if they were using the donut wheels (stock HSF). It's like comparing the Nokian Hakkapeliitta 7 vs Pirelli Snowsport. They're both winter tires. Both well known and perform great, while some say one is better than the other. The H7 however is only $140/tire vs the SS which is $200/tire. The difference is huge for no performance gain. My point is, just because you own a high end CPU doesn't mean you need the most expensive cooler on the market to assist it in operation. Cheaper options will do the same job as the most expensive.


My haswell is very poorly binned, and I'm using pretty much the weakest cooler that should really be used for haswell, an h110 with 4x yate loons on high speed (with a fan controller of course). But using a $45 D14 on a $300 haswell is absurd, you should be spending more money on cooling if you know that haswell is so hot.

You do kinda need the most expensive cooler for haswell. It's not the chip that's the problem (well, maybe, if you want to put it that way), you just need decent cooling. You should do 4.5-5ghz just fine on haswell if you got the delid + cooling.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You've had a borrowed marksman sitting there for a couple weeks & using a laptop instead of freezing a desktop?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I finally got some cold juice to try my retail 4770k cold, does about the same as the ES 4770k I was using in TO. Have to work the uncore next...


I wanted to but with no dewar makes it kinda tough







but im getting error codes now and i just wanna get windows running again.... ugh and Delta murdered my monitor really badly and I'm not in the best mood for this lol








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 1) The NH-D14 is actually still considered a beast, it performs amazing for an air cooler and it's one of the best buys on the market. Maybe under the SA but that's negligible. And this isn't a biased answer because I used to own one, it's the fact.
> 2) There are some Haswells that can OC amazingly and those that can't even achieve a 4.3 OC, but based on clocks, more Ivys can reach a higher clock than its successor Haswell.
> 3) Lapping may not help temps considerably but it certainly won't hurt it. By lapping, you're making the IHS flat meaning the HSF can have a cleaner contact rather than the middle being slightly concaved as stock.
> 4) SB-E may not make a huge difference in gaming, but it still makes a difference. Especially when you're dealing with multi-GPU setups. I would recommend a 3930k (when on sale) for futureproofing (if you believe in that kind of thing) and it will handle any situation that arises.
> 5) Intel i7 930 (Bloomfield) was a very hot chip, it used soldering as well. It ran on a 4.0OC @ 90+C on average due to the wattage it needed. Many people cooled that with a 212+ and the D14. Just because the coolers are a bit old doesn't mean they shouldn't be used with new tech. People still use the 980X even though it has been succeeded by 3 generations already...
> 
> And your comparison of Ferrari and using cheap wheels only matters if they were using the donut wheels (stock HSF). It's like comparing the Nokian Hakkapeliitta 7 vs Pirelli Snowsport. They're both winter tires. Both well known and perform great, while some say one is better than the other. The H7 however is only $140/tire vs the SS which is $200/tire. The difference is huge for no performance gain. My point is, just because you own a high end CPU doesn't mean you need the most expensive cooler on the market to assist it in operation. Cheaper options will do the same job as the most expensive.


Swag is right the ND-D14 is comparable to my H100. Also sometimes changign the in IHS TIM doesn't change things I've done it with multiple TIM's IX included (one of the few that no one uses) and I saw like 1-2C difference.


----------



## Belial

Well the H100 is a bit outdated, so yea, the nh-d14 is kinda comparable to a first gen coolit alc240. But I don't know why you'd say that, on a high overclock there's a good 5-10C difference between the two on stock vs stock. And if you use 4x fans on the h100, it blows the nh-d14 out of the water.

What kind of overclocks are you talking about? If you used an h100 on a [email protected], then yea you aren't going to see much difference with changing TIMs or heatsinks. But a [email protected] or a haswell at 1.4v, you'll see a huge gap in performance.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> Well the H100 is a bit outdated, so yea, the nh-d14 is kinda comparable to a first gen coolit alc240. But I don't know why you'd say that, on a high overclock there's a good 5-10C difference between the two on stock vs stock. And if you use 4x fans on the h100, it blows the nh-d14 out of the water.
> 
> What kind of overclocks are you talking about? If you used an h100 on a [email protected], then yea you aren't going to see much difference with changing TIMs or heatsinks. But a [email protected] or a haswell at 1.4v, you'll see a huge gap in performance.


from 4.3 Giggles all the way to my 5.5 Giggles sir. from 1.1 vcore to 1.96. I had a Malay chip and an early one at that.


----------



## Belial

so at 5.5giggles and the requisite voltage, you found no difference between the h100 and nh-d14? And using what fans?

Because I'm finding a massive difference between an h110 and nh-d14 (granted h110 is a great deal better than an h100i, which is better than an h100).


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> so at 5.5giggles and the requisite voltage, you found no difference between the h100 and nh-d14? And using what fans?
> 
> Because I'm finding a massive difference between an h110 and nh-d14 (granted h110 is a great deal better than an h100i, which is better than an h100).


The H110 is not even close to being a "great deal better" than the H100i.


It even performs better than the H110. Only way it will beat the H100i is if you get aftermarket fans for the H110.

And with the D14, I was able to achieve really high clocks too and it lasted 5.0 24/7 for folding a while back.


----------



## BenQ

Pretty much no temp difference from stock to 4.5GHz after delidding







4.5GHz with 1.2VCore running around 50c full load







(stock cooler)

I'll post resulsts etc later so that i can join the delid club


----------



## Valgaur

By the way my idles were below zero my room was around -5f when I was benching at those clocks. And I wasn't comparing the ndh14 with my h100 i was comparing my TIMs i used and saw around 1 to maybe 3c difference. Where'd you get a nd-h14 in my last post









Anyways for the most part of a normal person and their computer from delidding most mid to high TIMs are perfectly fine for the top of the IHS. A few degree differences are perfectly fine for normal usage but if a person benches then you need the temps there.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> so at 5.5giggles and the requisite voltage, you found no difference between the h100 and nh-d14? And using what fans?
> 
> Because I'm finding a massive difference between an h110 and nh-d14 (granted h110 is a great deal better than an h100i, which is better than an h100).
> 
> 
> 
> The H110 is not even close to being a "great deal better" than the H100i.
> 
> 
> It even performs better than the H110. Only way it will beat the H100i is if you get aftermarket fans for the H110.
> 
> And with the D14, I was able to achieve really high clocks too and it lasted 5.0 24/7 for folding a while back.
Click to expand...

Wow, are intentionally trying to be misleading? Why don't you post the acoustic results from that same review?



It's clear you would rather critisize than have an honest discussion here, so I'm not going to bother to look up more tests. Being able to fit 4x140mm fans is an advantage on it's own, and you need to compare apples to apples tests, ie identical fans on all (put 4x120 on the h110, or 4x140 to showcase the advantage of being able to hold 140mm fans).

Thermal reviews on stock fans are meaningless. Heatsink companies take some crappy heatsink, like an EVO, slap ramped up crappy fans on it that blow a ton of air at an extremely loud level, and then the heatsink is hailed as an awesome heatsink, when in reality it's perform way worse with apples to apples fans. The H100i is only similar to the h110 when it's over 3 times as loud. Put those same 120mm fans on the H110, and it'll outperform it by a mile.

You keep making absurd comments like CLU isn't any better than conventional ceramique, that the NH-D14 is somehow a high end, relevant cooler still, and now that an h100i is better than an h110. You need to compare apples to apples fans for honest heatsink reviews, on high temp overclocks. H110 is far better than the h100i, it's more in line with the h220 than the h100i.


----------



## Belial

From the KitGuru's conclusion of the review you pulled Swag:

*The H110... provides superior cooling performance (to the H100i), allowing enthusiasts additional headroom for overclocking... Cons: Cheap Fans
*

With comparable fans, h110 >>> h100i

TechPowerUp
Quote:


> As the charts show, the Corsair Hydro Series H110 is a massive improvement over the H100 in terms of noise levels. Even though it usually falls into the middle of the pack, the fan noise, while audible, is not unpleasant. It is simply not a contest at maximum fan speeds: The Corsair Hydro Series H110 is a full 15 dBA quieter than the H100


Anandtech. A terrible heatsink review, but one of many that say h110 > h100i, and significantly quieter.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








It appears there are no real, good apples to apples comparisons of the H100i to h110, not even any attempt to (ie cooling performance at same dBa, cooling performance with same 2x/4x 120mm fans, cooling performance with 2x/4x 120mm fans at X RPM or X type like yate loon vs 2x/4x 140mm fans at X RPM or X type, performance with no fans at all), but there's enough information out there to show that, with similar fans, or just the fact you can put 4x140mm fans on the h110, it's a significantly higher performing heatsink than the h100i.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tzvia*
> 
> You need to use a liquid metal TIM between the DIE and IHS to prevent pump-out; the TIM migrating due to repeated heating and cooling. This has been mentioned a lot around here. When I delidded my 3770k, while waiting impatiently for my Ultra to arrive, I used some AS5 I had laying around, and dang if the temp drop was only like 6c, then temps began to rise over a short time. I was elated to find my temperature drop was about 18c once I got Ultra, and I have had no pump-out issue with it.
> 
> Also, if you have bite marks from the vise, those can be high spots keeping the cooler from making good contact with the IHS. When I delidded my brother's chip (he is not PC savvy so I built him a new gamer) the marks looked minor but a moment with a straight edge and strong back-light told me otherwise. Yea, lap it. Can't blame the chip or the delid process for pumped out regular TIM on the DIE and poor contact of your HSF due to marring on the IHS. Take your time, do it right if you want the results to be correct.


I'll wait quietly for that CLU to come. Hopefully by the time it's here my chip won't run at 100c at idle LOL


----------



## ozzy1925

is this razor too thick for deliding?should i get a smaller one?


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> is this razor too thick for deliding?should i get a smaller one?


Pull out the blade so we can see, there are different sizes of such knifes


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> Pull out the blade so we can see, there are different sizes of such knifes


well i gave that back and got a smaller one


----------



## stickg1

Use a straight single side razor, or even better would be an old school shaving razor.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Agreed, if you're going to take the razor route you should do it right. Many mistakes have been done with such knives.


----------



## ozzy1925

i couldnt find any single side razor here i did practise with that razor knife with my old pentium and amd it took 2mins and didnt have any straches on the pcb but some on the back of the ihs still not sure if i3770k is harder?i can go with a old style double sided razor


----------



## TranquilTempest

If you go the razor route, use single edge razor blades, you can usually find a box of them for pretty cheap.

Basically every hobby store, and every place that sells paint should stock them.


----------



## FlamingBeatz

Nvm about delidding my cpu in a few weeks, I decided to delid my 3770k using the hammer + vice method today. Everything looked good while delidding, no scratches or anything but when I tried to boot up I got a memory error. After some fiddling around with it I found out 2 memory lanes died. Not a very big deal, I guess ill just sell this 4 x 4 gb kit and get a 2 x 8 gb kit.

The temps however look very good. I was planning to use CLU but I thought lets try the Noctua NT-H1 I have left first. Temp drops are over 20 degrees C so I might just keep using this TIM.

Here is a screenshot. Ambient temps before delid were 27C and after were 30C


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> well i gave that back and got a smaller one


This is the type you need.....


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> Nvm about delidding my cpu in a few weeks, I decided to delid my 3770k using the hammer + vice method today. Everything looked good while delidding, no scratches or anything but when I tried to boot up I got a memory error. After some fiddling around with it I found out 2 memory lanes died. Not a very big deal, I guess ill just sell this 4 x 4 gb kit and get a 2 x 8 gb kit.
> 
> The temps however look very good. I was planning to use CLU but I thought lets try the Noctua NT-H1 I have left first. Temp drops are over 20 degrees C so I might just keep using this TIM.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Here is a screenshot. Ambient temps before delid were 27C and after were 30C


No bent pins in the socket?


----------



## FlamingBeatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> No bent pins in the socket?


A few spots on the socket looked diffrent, I thought they were empty pin holes that were not being used or something. After comparing my socet with some pics of other sockets it looks like I've bent some pins. I think my H100i pump hit it while dangling from the tubes :/


----------



## ozzy1925

i got a shaving blade


that will work ?


----------



## Swag

Please compare the differences between the temps of CLU and comventional. On average, you're going to be getting a 2-3C difference especially when used on the IHS. CLU is also not ideal for extreme cooling.

I used NT-H1 and CLU both on the IHS and die and the difference was in favor of CLU by 2C.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i got a shaving blade
> 
> 
> that will work ?


I can't spoiler the pics so sorry. I'm on my phone.

Short and quick answer: yes you can.

It works because it's very thin and extremely sharp. Good luck.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> A few spots on the socket looked diffrent, I thought they were empty pin holes that were not being used or something. After comparing my socet with some pics of other sockets it looks like I've bent some pins. I think my H100i pump hit it while dangling from the tubes :/


That's probably why you lost one memory channel. You might want to search on how to correct the pins. I believe some (ASUS at least) have some kind of (paid) service to set everything right, and you probably can go at it yourself but you could risk making matters worse. Just depends on how bad it is and wether or not you want to take that risk.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Please compare the differences between the temps of CLU and comventional. On average, you're going to be getting a 2-3C difference especially when used on the IHS. CLU is also not ideal for extreme cooling.
> 
> I used NT-H1 and CLU both on the IHS and die and the difference was in favor of CLU by 2C.


I think the biggest difference between the two is that CLU is so much easier to apply in a way that doesn't compromise your temps. It is easy to use too much or too little of a paste like MX-4, CLU seems more forgiving. So the difference in perfect applications isn't so much, but the difference in sub-optimal applications can be large.


----------



## Belial

^ I've found a variance of about 5C on CLU, you can definitely use too little or too much. I think you just need to use the bare minimum to cover the ihs or die, but unlike TIM, you should cover both sides, ie IHS and heatsink, die and IHS. But I mean you shouldn't even have to apply any CLU, you should literally just have to wipe your brush against the tip of the syringe and you'll get enough CLU to cover the IHS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> is this razor too thick for deliding?should i get a smaller one?


Yes, breakaway blades are way too big









This is why a few people messed up delids. Not a single person has messed up their delid using the right tools, but when people use breakaway blades or utility blades or knives, it goes wrong. Then, they go around saying how delidding is so dangerous, when in reality no one has messed up delidding when they used a _razor_ blade except one person.

Razor blades are extremely thin. Breakaway and utility blades are not. Thick blade = scratch PCB, much harder to stick it in causing it to cut jerkier and you do things like push really hard and then once you get through glue you slam it on through to the die or scratch pcb. Razor blade slips in like butter, utility or breakaway blade is very difficult to use.

I mean I was dumb enough to use a utility blade the first time, nothing bad happened but I was sweating, that's how hard it was to get the blade through. razor blade, on the other hand, just slips right in.


----------



## kikibgd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Please compare the differences between the temps of CLU and comventional. On average, you're going to be getting a 2-3C difference especially when used on the IHS. CLU is also not ideal for extreme cooling.
> 
> I used NT-H1 and CLU both on the IHS and die and the difference was in favor of CLU by 2C.


are you sure that NT-H1 vs CLU on die will result only 2c difference ?? anyone else can back up that statement ?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> are you sure that NT-H1 vs CLU on die will result only 2c difference ?? anyone else can back up that statement ?


It can vary, but regular paste on the die just doesn't normally give as much of a temp drop as the liquid metal.
I think swag was talking more about the paste on the IHS, there the liquid metal doesn't give another big temp drop like it does on the die, so regular paste --> liquid metal paste on the IHS is a much smaller temp change.

For example (making up numbers) delid & use regular paste on die & IHS = 10° temp drop. LM on die & regular paste on IHS = 25° temp drop. LM on die & on IHS = 27° temp drop.


----------



## FlamingBeatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It can vary, but regular paste on the die just doesn't normally give as much of a temp drop as the liquid metal.
> I think swag was talking more about the paste on the IHS, there the liquid metal doesn't give another big temp drop like it does on the die, so regular paste --> liquid metal paste on the IHS is a much smaller temp change.
> 
> For example (making up numbers) delid & use regular paste on die & IHS = 10° temp drop. LM on die & regular paste on IHS = 25° temp drop. LM on die & on IHS = 27° temp drop.


Hmm, my temps dropped over 20C though, with regular paste (Noctua NT-H1) on both the die and IHS. Temp drops per core are 24C, 27C, 20C, 21C. Check my post on page 2045 for the screenshot.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> Hmm, my temps dropped over 20C though, with regular paste (Noctua NT-H1) on both the die and IHS. Check my post on page 2045 for the screenshot.


It can vary from person to person, depends on how much glue intel had on & how big the gap was, thier TIM application, etc. & how the person delidding cleaned the PCB & applied the TIM.

When I first delidded the 3770k the CLU was in the mail so I used mx-4 inside & out, I did get about 10° or so better temps, but then the CLU came so that went on die & the temp drop was over 20°.


----------



## kikibgd

Darn, i would delid but this h70 is pain in the ass to mount, anyway i will get clu in wednesday if i am lucky same goes for h220... Hate waiting for postage


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> Darn, i would delid but this h70 is pain in the ass to mount, anyway i will get clu in wednesday if i am lucky same goes for h220... Hate waiting for postage


The joy of cases, cooler & hardware changes is why I stopped using cases altogether, I change things too much. Better temps were just a bonus.

Val, looking at this thread http://www.overclock.net/t/1410882/delid-and-new-cooler-system-keeps-turning-on-off-before-post-and-monitor-signal/0_50#post_20452068
There is a scratched PCB with copper showing, dunno if this one got cooked or not, but might not hurt to add to the OP that in case of scratches & nicks where copper can be seen it would be a good idea to cover the scratches before ever trying to put the cpu back in the rig & powering it on. Most of the time where I see people advising to cover the nicks, it is after the cpu has been powered up to test & it is too late to try to prevent short circuiting it.


----------



## sinnedone

I'm so tempted to Delid right now. lol I should really unsubscribe from this thread,


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> I'm so tempted to Delid right now. lol I should really unsubscribe from this thread,


----------



## Dynamo11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> I'm so tempted to Delid right now. lol I should really unsubscribe from this thread,


I say do it man, the worst part for when I did it was getting the right TIM. The actual delidding was easy


----------



## kikibgd

OCN name: Kikibgd
CPU: Intel i7 4770k
on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
ihs-TIM:Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4200mhz
Temp drops:~15c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2870005

Pre


Post


Process
** Sorry for crappy photos Desire HD aint the best tool for taking photos in the night...


----------



## MiiX

Vice&Hammer or Razor? Whats safest?


----------



## kikibgd

vice and hammer much safer, but if you are careful razor can do the same job but it will take time and a lot of patients


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> OCN name: Kikibgd
> CPU: Intel i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> ihs-TIM:Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4200mhz
> Temp drops:~15c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2870005
> 
> Pre
> 
> 
> Post
> 
> 
> Process
> ** Sorry for crappy photos Desire HD aint the best tool for taking photos in the night...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You are in!







good idea for applicating the protection of the transistors.


----------



## 316320

OCN name: gregg1494
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 15C+
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2870029
Voltage is @ 1.225, I think PLL was on that's why it's at 1.236

Before


After


Probably seeing close to 20C temp drop avg, my before is one of the lower temp ones I have done


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gregg1494*
> 
> OCN name: gregg1494
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 15C+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2870029
> Voltage is @ 1.225, I think PLL was on that's why it's at 1.236
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> After
> 
> 
> Probably seeing close to 20C temp drop avg, my before is one of the lower temp ones I have done


You're in as well!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Vice&Hammer or Razor? Whats safest?


Varies by the person, I prefer razor. DO IT NOW! Get in the club!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> vice and hammer much safer, but if you are careful razor can do the same job but it will take time and a lot of patients


DO IT TOO! It's something amazing and at the end of delidding, magical ponies carrying amazingly hot girls come knocking on your door. So do it now!


----------



## Chomuco

Model: Intel Core i7 4770K 'Haswell'
Cooling: Water Cooling
Speed: 3.500 @ 5.200MHz



http://hwbot.org/image/997193.jpg


----------



## kikibgd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You are in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> good idea for applicating the protection of the transistors.


ye i wanted to make it only in that area so i put electrical tape, didnt have paper tape for painting witch much better because it will not start to unglue in the middle of drying but pass everything ok


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> Model: Intel Core i7 4770K 'Haswell'
> Cooling: Water Cooling
> Speed: 3.500 @ 5.200MHz
> 
> 
> 
> http://hwbot.org/image/997193.jpg


nicely done.

what were your ambients?


----------



## neofury

As someone who has achieved 5ghz 24/7 on air with a Phanteks TC14PE, I must say the H110, H100i, etc are really overrated on here and around the web.

I get better temps than most benchmarks get on higher volts than they used. (Most of the time on benchmarks, they'll use an open bench with 4.5 or 4.8ghz, not 5.0)

Now if you're talking about a real custom loop or at the bare minimum one of the higher end swifttech models, then we're talking an improvement.

But for a Phanteks with a fan upgrade it's like $125. An H100/etc with a fan upgrade will likely run you similar or more cash, and the H220 definitely will. Any bare bones water kit is going to run you $200 too, and it might not even be that good since it's a very low end kit.

To conclude, any non-expandable water cooling solution (closed loop) is extremely overrated. The Noctua, Phanteks and Silver Arrow are all very powerful air coolers and with the right fans can cool like crazy, especially if you delid.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet

Check the thread, sort by cooling. Check the clocks people get, the temps they have. Only problem is it doesn't specify if they've delidded or not.

An easy example:
Solonowarion 5000.2mhz 1.528v 23hrs 71-77-75-71 WATER - EK Supreme 3570k
bebimbap 5100.5mhz 1.520v 18hrs 74-83-85-81 AIR - Noctua NH-D14 3770k

A Noctua versus a real kit, true it's the 3570k vs a 3770k, but still. We're talking 3-10c difference between the D14 and a real custom loop.

For the record, 1.52v for 18hrs of prime not breaking 85c is amazing. With my ambient right now I'll hit 88 at 5ghz at 1.45v on the phanteks. During the winter I'll likely hit around 83. Not bad at all imo for air.


----------



## Stige

My water set cost me about ~300€ total, and is propably decent enough to keep an Ivy CPU at bay upto propably 1.65V atleast.

Max temps I hit on my 2500K running at 1.595V was 72-73C.

So in theory, you could say my setup is a bit overkill with just the CPU in the loop, if you got anywhere near a decent CPU then you can run it at 5GHz with a cheap Thermalright TrueSpirit.
But damn does it feel good knowing that my setup won't run out of cooling power in any foreseeable future.


----------



## tw33k

I own a H100i, H100 & Phanteks PH-TC14PE. I have also owned a Silver Arrow and Silver Arrow SB-E. The closed loop coolers beat the air coolers by only a few degrees but I wouldn't call them over-rated. They are cheap, they look good and a large air cooler is not always practical. Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the top performing air coolers but I like my closed loop coolers better. See my thread on High End Air Cooling vs Closed Loop Water Cooling


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> My water set cost me about ~300€ total, and is propably decent enough to keep an Ivy CPU at bay upto propably 1.65V atleast.
> 
> Max temps I hit on my 2500K running at 1.595V was 72-73C.
> 
> So in theory, you could say my setup is a bit overkill with just the CPU in the loop, if you got anywhere near a decent CPU then you can run it at 5GHz with a cheap Thermalright TrueSpirit.
> But damn does it feel good knowing that my setup won't run out of cooling power in any foreseeable future.


That's an awesome setup man









Yep it really does depend on the chip and of course delid. I do know some folks who even have hit a wall around 4.5ghz where the amount of voltage required to go higher is bordering on unfair. In my opinion, if you're buying a K series chip it should be a chip that is tested to hit 4.5ghz at 1.2v~, otherwise what's the point? I'm guessing their reasoning is that they don't want people going out and spending 80$ on a cooler and 330$ on a chip and being able to push it further than the 999$ chip.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I own a H100i, H100 & Phanteks PH-TC14PE. I have also owned a Silver Arrow and Silver Arrow SB-E. The closed loop coolers beat the air coolers by only a few degrees but I wouldn't call them over-rated. They are cheap, they look good and a large air cooler is not always practical. Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the top performing air coolers but I like my closed loop coolers better.


Fair enough. I just wouldn't want to put a closed loop water solution near my rig. It's a matter of preference I guess. If I were to go with water, I'd want it to be a custom loop, but I can definitely see why the size puts people off, but I have seen tests where the H100 did worse than my phanteks, might be an issue with ambient, seating, or possibly a delid vs non-delid type scenario. I have noticed that when you push it pretty hard the closed loops really do start to become more noticeable, but the problem I have with it is a lot of the time it's getting to the point where I wouldn't want to push my chip that far anyways.

Another reason I may be seeing a few degrees better on my TC14PE versus the benchmark tests I see with the H100/etc is that I have 3x TY-143's rather than the 2 stock phanteks fans. So in theory, if you do put better fans on the closed loops you could probably see much better results too.

EDIT: Just checked out your thread, thanks for posting the results.


----------



## Chardicus

Hello you bunch of crazy warranty voiders









amateur overclocker here.. just picked up my new 4770k to replace my old 920
after reading alot about it i delidded it straight away (vice method is easy as) but im still waiting for my mobo to arrive before applying CLU, cleaned off all the black muck easily enough with a credit card but there's still one thing I'm still not sure of..

I've noticed some people putting nail polish or similar on the little voltage regulators next to the die to stop any accidental leakage of CLU onto it (i dont plan on putting on that much anyway) I'm thinking about putting a small amount of non conductive TIM like Noctua NT-H1 on them .. do those little suckers get hot at all? just leave them bare?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chardicus*
> 
> Hello you bunch of crazy warranty voiders
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> amateur overclocker here.. just picked up my new 4770k to replace my old 920
> after reading alot about it i delidded it straight away (vice method is easy as) but im still waiting for my mobo to arrive before applying CLU, cleaned off all the black muck easily enough with a credit card but there's still one thing I'm still not sure of..
> 
> I've noticed some people putting nail polish or similar on the little voltage regulators next to the die to stop any accidental leakage of CLU onto it (i dont plan on putting on that much anyway) I'm thinking about putting a small amount of non conductive TIM like Noctua NT-H1 on them .. do those little suckers get hot at all? just leave them bare?


Welcome to the forum









so the CPU is untested? you (and the rest of us) are gonna miss out on the "before / after" temps









but hey.. we got loads of those reported already, so..

Nail polish will give you a better looking result than non conductive TIM, but the result should be the same..
I would recommend going for one of em, leaving them bare MIGHT cause problems later on.

They do not get that hot and wont be damaged by covering with ether polish or TIM.

I guess if you have a case that has the CPU lying flat, the risk of CLU running down the CPU is smaller, but I would still cover them up.

Good luck!


----------



## Chardicus

Quote:


> Welcome to the forum biggrin.gif
> 
> so the CPU is untested? you (and the rest of us) are gonna miss out on the "before / after" temps frown.gif
> but hey.. we got loads of those reported already, so..
> 
> Nail polish will give you a better looking result than non conductive TIM, but the result should be the same..
> I would recommend going for one of em, leaving them bare MIGHT cause problems later on.
> 
> They do not get that hot and wont be damaged by covering with ether polish or TIM.
> 
> I guess if you have a case that has the CPU lying flat, the risk of CLU running down the CPU is smaller, but I would still cover them up.
> 
> Good luck!


Awesome man cheers for that








Case sits upright so ill be making sure i dont put on too much CLU that it dribbles down and yeh ill chuck some nt-h1 on those vrm's as u suggested








Abit of an amateur here i usually just overclock my basic air cooled setups as much as i can to get a few extra frames for gaming, upgrading from a C0 step i7 920 which has been running at 3.5ghz stable for a few years now using the stock cooler








going abit more into it this time with the delid and a noctua u12p se2.. hoping for something around 4.4ghz for 24/7 use
will let ya's know how it goes and what temps i get


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Welcome to the forum
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so the CPU is untested? you (and the rest of us) are gonna miss out on the "before / after" temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but hey.. we got loads of those reported already, so..
> 
> Nail polish will give you a better looking result than non conductive TIM, but the result should be the same..
> I would recommend going for one of em, leaving them bare MIGHT cause problems later on.
> 
> They do not get that hot and wont be damaged by covering with ether polish or TIM.
> 
> I guess if you have a case that has the CPU lying flat, the risk of CLU running down the CPU is smaller, but I would still cover them up.
> 
> Good luck!


That is what I did aswell, delid my first 3570K instantly and never got it to boot









FEARSOME!!1


----------



## kikibgd

anyone lapped inside of ihs?


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> anyone lapped inside of ihs?


I would say pretty risky propably as even the glue between the CPU and the IHS can create big enough gap already to cause temperature issues, if you were to lap it inside you might actually increase the gap = increase your temperatures.
Also how would you go on about lapping it from the inside?

I guess I could lap it on the surface because I could just machine it at work lol, would take like 2 minutes to get it all tidy.
If I can be bothered...


----------



## kikibgd

i had an wild idea to do it







but since i hate lapping i will probably just do outside and finish with it


----------



## FlamingBeatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I would say pretty risky propably as even the glue between the CPU and the IHS can create big enough gap already to cause temperature issues, if you were to lap it inside you might actually increase the gap = increase your temperatures.
> Also how would you go on about lapping it from the inside?
> 
> I guess I could lap it on the surface because I could just machine it at work lol, would take like 2 minutes to get it all tidy.
> If I can be bothered...


Well if you lap the same amout on the edge of the underside and the inside it wont be a problem right?


----------



## sinnedone

CLU comes in tomorrow! I'll see how long I make myself wait to delid though.









Anyone try this CLU on a PS3? I think the heatsink is nickel plated but not sure.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> Well if you lap the same amout on the edge of the underside and the inside it wont be a problem right?


Derp me!

You are right lol


----------



## FlamingBeatz

OCN name: FlamingBeatz
CPU: Intel i7 3770k
on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.6
Temp drops: 25 C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2867344

Temps before:


Temps after:


And a video:



Unfortunately no footage of the actual delidding itsself as I didn't have anything to hold my phone/camera lol


----------



## The Real Deal

Post to follow


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> anyone lapped inside of ihs?


...yup - carefully. My 3770K had a really concave IHS and since I lapped the top of the IHS, I did the underside as well...worked out great, though I was careful not to take too much off....started w/coarser grid paper, then finished w/2000 grid before applying CL-U on the die and just a tiny bit on the (now lapped) underside of the IHS as well.


----------



## kikibgd

thanks for the info, i might do it since inside is a bit rough i mean more rough then outside


----------



## HairyGamer

I'm going to be delidding my 4770K in the next day or two when my CLU arrives in the mail...

*Can anybody recommend a method of covering the VRM on the chip to keep the CLU from shorting them out?*

I've seen somebody use MX4 smeared onto the VRM but that seems like it would only insulate them and make them run hot while still leaving a chance for the CLU to come into contact with them.

I've seen somebody use clear nail polish to coat them but I'm not sure if that can be conductive in any way (doubt it but you never know, it's nail polish not liquid electrical tape) and I'm doubting its ability to stand up to 85C for any extended period of time.

I've also seen somebody use Fujipoly thermal pads (non conductive) and that seemed like the most "legit" route but I'd have to put off delidding for a week or so if I go that road. I don't mind waiting to do things "right" though.

Should I use a non-cunductive thermal pad cut to fit around the die and under the IHS? If so, can anybody recommend something that I can get shipped quickly in the US, preferably Newegg since I get free 2-day shipping from them (which is usually actually overnight







)

Also, the easiest solution for me (I think) would be to just use liquid electrical tape... it has an operating temp of up to 93C (not sure how hot the VRM gets but I doubt that hot) and I can just brush it on and have a nice non-conductive coating that should peel off without trouble if need be. Anybody have anything to say about this idea?

Thanks OCN geeks


----------



## Stige

They are just capacitors, not VRM, they do not get hot.

I'm pretty sure that has been posted before.


----------



## Cr4zy

I left mine untouched, CLU on-die too, if it manages to magically run sideways ill have a problem, but I cant say i've had it run anywhere before.

I guess if you want to be super safe tho anything non-conductive should be fine


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> I'm going to be delidding my 4770K in the next day or two when my CLU arrives in the mail...
> 
> *Can anybody recommend a method of covering the VRM on the chip to keep the CLU from shorting them out?*
> 
> I've seen somebody use MX4 smeared onto the VRM but that seems like it would only insulate them and make them run hot while still leaving a chance for the CLU to come into contact with them.
> 
> I've seen somebody use clear nail polish to coat them but I'm not sure if that can be conductive in any way (doubt it but you never know, it's nail polish not liquid electrical tape) and I'm doubting its ability to stand up to 85C for any extended period of time.
> 
> I've also seen somebody use Fujipoly thermal pads (non conductive) and that seemed like the most "legit" route but I'd have to put off delidding for a week or so if I go that road. I don't mind waiting to do things "right" though.
> 
> Should I use a non-cunductive thermal pad cut to fit around the die and under the IHS? If so, can anybody recommend something that I can get shipped quickly in the US, preferably Newegg since I get free 2-day shipping from them (which is usually actually overnight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Also, the easiest solution for me (I think) would be to just use liquid electrical tape... it has an operating temp of up to 93C (not sure how hot the VRM gets but I doubt that hot) and I can just brush it on and have a nice non-conductive coating that should peel off without trouble if need be. Anybody have anything to say about this idea?
> 
> Thanks OCN geeks


Don't use electrical tape, that just will insulate and is permanent. You can just apply a ceramique thermal paste over it, good to go. I don't really think you need to cover it at all, the die is higher up than the capacitors, there's no way it's going to make metal to metal shorting, people here (myself included) are just paranoid.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlamingBeatz*
> 
> OCN name: FlamingBeatz
> CPU: Intel i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.6
> Temp drops: 25 C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2867344
> 
> Temps before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps after:
> 
> 
> And a video:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunately no footage of the actual delidding itsself as I didn't have anything to hold my phone/camera lol


You are in!







You still having memory lane issues?


----------



## BenQ

Here i am, ready to join the club.. I hope that 7 intel burn test runs is enough as i did not have time for 10 last night. If its not enough i will ofcourse make a new run 10 times instead.

OCN name: BenQ
CPU: Intel i7 3770k @ Stock Cooler.
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra (CLU)
ihs-TIM: Phobya HeGrease Extreme (Cross pattern)
Mhz gained: 600
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: ~25 C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2871150


Spoiler: Picture of the delided CPU:



Here is a picture of the delidded CPU:







Spoiler: Temps before delid:



Unfortunately i did not test it with Intel Burn Test, however i ran Prime95 for a couple of seconds when my temperatures reached this:







Spoiler: Temps after delid:



My delidded temps with stock frequency:



My delidded temps with an OC of 4.5GHz aswell as signature and IBT screenshot:





Sorry for the two different temperature readers i used..

Regards,
BenQ


----------



## Disseverment

Still waiting on my water cooling parts, so I don't have any before temps

OCN name: Disseverment
CPU: Intel i7 4770k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC
Mhz gained: ?
OC after delid: ?
Temp drops: ?


----------



## FlamingBeatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You are in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You still having memory lane issues?


Thanks









Yup I do, I think I messed up some cpu sucket pins though. The cpu itsself should be fine.


----------



## HairyGamer

Alright guys thanks for the answers - I'll leave them bare and just be careful not to get anything on them - I'm usually pretty careful about things like that so I don't see it being a problem.


----------



## john7up

OCN name: John7up
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Liquid Collaboratory Pro
ihs-TIM: Arctic Cooling MX4
Mhz gained: Not yet tested
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 30C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2870991

Here's my best way to show my deliding pics and also temp drops, through prime before and after, on custom watercooling.


----------



## BenQ

Lol nice clean PCB John!







How did you remove the "glue" that well?


----------



## kikibgd

ok this is getting annoying, i ordered CLU from their website and apparently it takes more then 7days with DHL to arrive from germany to portugal, yea right, until now i had around 10+ shipments from inside EU and all took like 3-4 days maximum to arrive....


----------



## ucantescape1992

What are you Haswell guys protecting the vrms with? I'm about to do my 4770k. Is it just clear nail polish?

Do you think that the protectant will remain in-tact and continue working even under extreme heat?


----------



## kikibgd

nail polish/ some kind of acrylic/ electrical tape/ thermal insulator/ nothing
your choice


----------



## ucantescape1992

I think my chip is a piece of crap....then again I've only been trying for a day.

For 4.4 it needs 1.265 or more, and temps pass 90.

I'm wondering if its even worth it to delid it.


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> I think my chip is a piece of crap....then again I've only been trying for a day.
> 
> For 4.4 it needs 1.265 or more, and temps pass 90.
> 
> I'm wondering if its even worth it to delid it.


No worries, at least you are 100mhz more than what I'm getting. Stuck at 4.3 at 1.21 vCore. I can't seem to find a stable voltage at 4.5. I I figured if the overclock at 4.3 was good at 1.21 vCore. 4.5mhz should be around 1.22 - 1.30 vCore.

I might be de-lidding because I'm pissed at the CPU ahahah..


----------



## kikibgd

i have the same, anyway i delided since i wont be changing cpu till skylake.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Yolo. Shutting down and going in the vice now.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Yolo. Shutting down and going in the vice now.


Good Luck!!


----------



## kikibgd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Yolo. Shutting down and going in the vice now.


hammer time


----------



## HairyGamer

I'm going to get my vice tomorrow from Harbor Freight. I found a decent one for $23 that I can return when I'm finished, since I own two of them already but the jaws are too beat up and I don't want teeth marks all over my IHS.

My CLU should also be here tomorrow ...if not then I'll have to wait until Thursday or Friday to delid.










I'm going to be using Permatex liquid electrical tape to cover up the _capacitors_ to the side of the die for added protection from contact with the CLU. I'm not concerned about "insulating" them because they have no way of being cooled right now anyway - they just sit under the IHS and bake when the cores heat up as it is. It has an operating temp of 204C so I'm not worried about the tape peeling or degrading over time. It will also peel off easily if I ever want to remove it.

I'll post pics and video of the process and results when I'm through


----------



## thestache

Got my new 4770k today, checked it wasn't DOA and delidded it.

Beat the hell out of it because my vice was dodgy so I'm hoping I didn't ruin it by hitting it so many times but I will find out in a minute I guess. Found a pretty deep scratch on it though so not sure. Damn.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Got my new 4770k today, checked it wasn't DOA and delidded it.
> 
> Beat the hell out of it because my vice was dodgy so I'm hoping I didn't ruin it by hitting it so many times but I will find out in a minute I guess. Never dropped it or anything though so fingers crossed.
> 
> Have to admit I didn't enjoy the process at all and the glue is a pain to get off.


That looks like more glue than either if the two I delidded. Maybe that's why it was harder to get off.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> That looks like more glue than either if the two I delidded. Maybe that's why it was harder to get off.


Found a pretty deep scratch. Not good. Is there anything you can do if you scratch it or is it hit and miss if you killed it or not?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Found a pretty deep scratch. Not good. Is there anything you can do if you scratch it or is it hit and miss if you killed it or not?


Try covering it with something non-conductive so it doesn't short out, but unfortunately any damage is likely already done. Where is the scratch?


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Try covering it with something non-conductive so it doesn't short out, but unfortunately any damage is likely already done. Where is the scratch?


Scratch is on the left in the picture. Right next to the glue. It boots to BIOS but oh we'll I will find out soon how damaged it actually is.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Try covering it with something non-conductive so it doesn't short out, but unfortunately any damage is likely already done. Where is the scratch?
> 
> 
> 
> Scratch is on the left in the picture. Right next to the glue. It boots to BIOS but oh we'll I will find out soon how damaged it actually is.
Click to expand...

If it's the one I'm looking at where there is a small strand of glue hanging close over it, it looks like it'll be okay.







It seems very far away from the center and it looks like it's in the area that is not covered by the IHS when not delidded so the chances of you hitting something there is really low. I can't make promises though.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If it's the one I'm looking at where there is a small strand of glue hanging close over it, it looks like it'll be okay.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems very far away from the center and it looks like it's in the area that is not covered by the IHS when not delidded so the chances of you hitting something there is really low. I can't make promises though.


Yes you're right. That nick, the IHS doesn't cover it either I could see gold so that's why I was worried. When the PCB came away from the IHS it must have caught on something I guess.

I put some clear nail polish on the scratch.

I've got my loop running and the CPU boots/is overclocked to 4.4GHZ just using auto voltage on the desktop so maybe it will be okay. Once my drivers and loaded and everything then I'll start pushing it to +4.8GHZ with Prime95 and see if I'm in the clear or not. Fingers crossed.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If it's the one I'm looking at where there is a small strand of glue hanging close over it, it looks like it'll be okay.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems very far away from the center and it looks like it's in the area that is not covered by the IHS when not delidded so the chances of you hitting something there is really low. I can't make promises though.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes you're right. That nick, the IHS doesn't cover it either I could see gold so that's why I was worried. When the PCB came away from the IHS it must have caught on something I guess.
> 
> I put some clear nail polish on the scratch.
> 
> I've got my loop running and the CPU boots/is overclocked to 4.4GHZ just using auto voltage on the desktop so maybe it will be okay. Once my drivers and loaded and everything then I'll start pushing it to +4.8GHZ with Prime95 and see if I'm in the clear or not. Fingers crossed.
Click to expand...

Sounds good, wish you best of luck with that.









Can anyone explain to me why people have to put that clear stuff on the little transistors on the Haswell chip? I'm guessing insulation but can't put my finger on it...


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sounds good, wish you best of luck with that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can anyone explain to me why people have to put that clear stuff on the little transistors on the Haswell chip? I'm guessing insulation but can't put my finger on it...


Fear of shorts.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1412059/liquid-electrical-tape-to-protect-4770k-smd-capacitors-on-chip


----------



## john7up

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> Lol nice clean PCB John!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How did you remove the "glue" that well?


Thanks mate! Well at the end a bitof alcohool 96% concentration and with a lot of patience with a wooden toothpick because they don't scratch and a bit with my nails(tough one because they're short)

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 4 Beta


----------



## Gankfest

Add me:









Thanx!


----------



## ejic

*ADD ME*

*OCN name: ejic
CPU: 4670k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.5 Ghz
Temp drops: 18 C
CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2871846


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Disseverment*
> 
> Still waiting on my water cooling parts, so I don't have any before temps
> 
> OCN name: Disseverment
> CPU: Intel i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC
> Mhz gained: ?
> OC after delid: ?
> Temp drops: ?


You are in!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *john7up*
> 
> OCN name: John7up
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Collaboratory Pro
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Cooling MX4
> Mhz gained: Not yet tested
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 30C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2870991
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Here's my best way to show my deliding pics and also temp drops, through prime before and after, on custom watercooling.


You're in as well








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gankfest*
> 
> Add me:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanx!


You're not actually! I would like to have it done in the format from the OP (Original Post)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ejic*
> 
> *ADD ME*
> 
> *OCN name: ejic
> CPU: 4670k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5 Ghz
> Temp drops: 18 C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2871846


You're Also in!


----------



## thestache

I damaged mine (nicked it and now it overclocks like balls) but whatever heres my submission and results from my die mount in my water loop.

OCN name: thestache
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
OC after delid: 4700mhz

Shame since the temps are really low and it could have so much room to OC but isn't even stable on the desktop at 4800mhz at 1.5v. Idles in the 20s, games in the 40-45s (with a GTX Titan at 1202mhz) and stress testing doesn't exceed 54deg.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> I damaged mine (nicked it and now it overclocks like balls) but whatever heres my submission and results from my die mount in my water loop.
> 
> OCN name: thestache
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
> OC after delid: 4700mhz
> 
> Shame since the temps are really low and it could have so much room to OC but isn't even stable on the desktop at 4800mhz at 1.5v. Idles in the 20s, games in the 40-45s (with a GTX Titan at 1202mhz) and stress testing doesn't exceed 54deg.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're in as well with the bunch!


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> I damaged mine (nicked it and now it overclocks like balls) but whatever heres my submission and results from my die mount in my water loop.
> 
> OCN name: thestache
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
> OC after delid: 4700mhz
> 
> Shame since the temps are really low and it could have so much room to OC but isn't even stable on the desktop at 4800mhz at 1.5v. Idles in the 20s, games in the 40-45s (with a GTX Titan at 1202mhz) and stress testing doesn't exceed 54deg.


You must be the third person to damage his CPU with the vice & hammer method.

I'm curious as to how that scratch happened. Did your CPU fly or fall somewhere? If that was the side you were hitting it from there's also a possibility that your piece of wood was soft, and the CPU dag into it (in that case check the bottom of the PCB as well). Could you please comment on this?

I also had to hit my CPU countless times due to bad vice mount. This resulted in pretty bad IHS damage which I fixed with lapping. No damage was done to the PCB though and the CPU OCs above average.

Having said all this, I don't believe the damage on your PCB ruined your OC, this doesn't make sense. If it's really that bad of a scratch then something might be malfunctioning, but that's not your frequency. Neither could the shock from the hits have such an effect. I must have hit my CPU more times than anyone else in here to get it open and it's all fine.

It would be nice to know if the scratch was something easily avoided, to warn others too.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> You must be the third person to damage his CPU with the vice & hammer method.
> 
> I'm curious as to how that scratch happened. Did your CPU fly or fall somewhere? If that was the side you were hitting it from there's also a possibility that your piece of wood was soft, and the CPU dag into it (in that case check the bottom of the PCB as well). Could you please comment on this?
> 
> I also had to hit my CPU countless times due to bad vice mount. This resulted in pretty bad IHS damage which I fixed with lapping. No damage was done to the PCB though and the CPU OCs above average.
> 
> Having said all this, I don't believe the damage on your PCB ruined your OC, this doesn't make sense. If it's really that bad of a scratch then something might be malfunctioning, but that's not your frequency. Neither could the shock from the hits have such an effect. I must have hit my CPU more times than anyone else in here to get it open and it's all fine.
> 
> It would be nice to know if the scratch was something easily avoided, to warn others too.


The PCB moved maybe a inch total when it separated from the IHS. I honestly thought I'd done a perfect job until I was cleaning it and noticed the nick.

I think it was the vice. So I guess I would say tape the vice and its edges so they don't scratch the PCB and/or only clamp the IHS. Don't clamp the IHS where it's glued to the PCB. I guess that's where I went wrong. I did that because clamping the IHS the was bending the PCB and I thought that was a bad idea.

The CPU runs 4700mhz at 1.44v. That's it's max overclock. I've gone 1.51v and 4800mhz isn't stable on the desktop. 4500mhz is stable at 1.4v so I guess there is some damage but it is working and I'm sure it'd be fine at default clocks. Temps are great, it's sitting at 26deg currently and does low 40s in games and it didn't exceed 54deg in prime95.

I'm sure if I had gone to the hardware store and bought a new/proper vice and did this the way I should have then everything would have been 100% perfectly fine.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> The PCB moved maybe a inch total when it separated from the IHS. I honestly thought I'd done a perfect job until I was cleaning it and noticed the nick.
> 
> *I think it was the vice. So I guess I would say tape the vice and its edges so they don't scratch the PCB and/or only clamp the IHS. Don't clamp the IHS where it's glued to the PCB. I guess that's where I went wrong. I did that because clamping the IHS the was bending the PCB and I thought that was a bad idea.*
> 
> The CPU runs 4700mhz at 1.44v. That's it's max overclock. I've gone 1.51v and 4800mhz isn't stable on the desktop. 4500mhz is stable at 1.4v so I guess there is some damage but it is working and I'm sure it'd be fine at default clocks. Temps are great, it's sitting at 26deg currently and does low 40s in games and it didn't exceed 54deg in prime95.
> 
> I'm sure if I had gone to the hardware store and bought a new/proper vice and did this the way I should have then everything would have been 100% perfectly fine.


That's a no-no. It's definitely what went wrong.

Oh well, 4.7 isn't that bad, as long as it's really stable. Because 1.4 for 4.5 and 1.44 for 4.7 seems a little off to me.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> That's a no-no. It's definitely what went wrong.
> 
> Oh well, 4.7 isn't that bad, as long as it's really stable. Because 1.4 for 4.5 and 1.44 for 4.7 seems a little off to me.


Maybe they should include that in the OP or something so nobody else makes the same mistake.

Never had a CPU behave this way, so it has to be damage, I'm just glad I guess it's not worse. Will probably give the CPU/Mobo to someone when Ivy-e comes out.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> Maybe they should include that in the OP or something so nobody else makes the same mistake.
> 
> *Never had a CPU behave this way,* so it has to be damage, I'm just glad I guess it's not worse. Will probably give the CPU/Mobo to someone when Ivy-e comes out.


I assume you never had a Haswell chip as well. Only a few can hit 4.8 and even 4.7 is above average.
Your temps are great though, I might have missed it, but which waterblock are you using?


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> I assume you never had a Haswell chip as well. Only a few can hit 4.8 and even 4.7 is above average.
> Your temps are great though, I might have missed it, but which waterblock are you using?


EK supremacy with the EK naked kit.

Nah my first Haswell, wanted to try out a 4770K as it'll probably be my last ever four core CPU after Ivy-e releases. When everyone keeps saying some can't hit a certain clock speed do people actually mean they can't hit those speeds (like mine) or are people just not willing to run them with higher volts like 1.45v-1.5v?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> EK supremacy with the EK naked kit.
> 
> Nah my first Haswell, wanted to try out a 4770K as it'll probably be my last ever four core CPU after Ivy-e releases. When everyone keeps saying some can't hit a certain clock speed do people actually mean they can't hit those speeds (like mine) or are people just not willing to run them with higher volts like 1.45v-1.5v?


From what I could gather, people really can't seem to get it stable at certain speeds. I remember one guy writing, he can get his CPU stable at 4.7ghz if he turns off HT, but it's 4.5ghz at most with HT on, no way to get the BSODs etc. fixed at more than that. This is while it looked like there should be room to increase vcore etc.


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in as well with the bunch!


How about me Valgaur?

Or is it because i only ran 7 ibt?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thestache*
> 
> The PCB moved maybe a inch total when it separated from the IHS. I honestly thought I'd done a perfect job until I was cleaning it and noticed the nick.
> 
> I think it was the vice. So I guess I would say tape the vice and its edges so they don't scratch the PCB and/or only clamp the IHS. Don't clamp the IHS where it's glued to the PCB. I guess that's where I went wrong. I did that because clamping the IHS the was bending the PCB and I thought that was a bad idea.
> 
> The CPU runs 4700mhz at 1.44v. That's it's max overclock. I've gone 1.51v and 4800mhz isn't stable on the desktop. 4500mhz is stable at 1.4v so I guess there is some damage but it is working and I'm sure it'd be fine at default clocks. Temps are great, it's sitting at 26deg currently and does low 40s in games and it didn't exceed 54deg in prime95.
> 
> I'm sure if I had gone to the hardware store and bought a new/proper vice and did this the way I should have then everything would have been 100% perfectly fine.


Just because it isn't stable at 4.8 doesn't mean you did any real damage to it. There's no guarantee of any oc. Your chip is fine, it's just not a great oc'er. Luck of the draw.


----------



## ozzy1925

i killed my i-3770k


----------



## chromedivision

I used a razor to cut in a corner and a thin guitar pick to cut the glue around the ihs. Guess it's safer because the pick is made of plastic and there's almost no problem IF you hit something.

Since the first time I saw the vice method didn't like it.


----------



## john7up

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> I used a razor to cut in a corner and a thin guitar pick to cut the glue around the ihs. Guess it's safer because the pick is made of plastic and there's almost no problem IF you hit something.
> 
> Since the first time I saw the vice method didn't like it.


This is probably the best way I've ever heard! And I have a couple guitar picks at home,cool stuff! I personally did traditional method.

Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 4 Beta


----------



## neofury

I don't get why people still use the razor method. I mean, I've done it with that method without a problem either but the vice method just seems much safer.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I don't get why people still use the razor method. I mean, I've done it with that method without a problem either but the vice method just seems much safer.


may be because its easier to find a razor than vice?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I remember one guy writing, he can get his CPU stable at 4.7ghz if he turns off HT, but it's 4.5ghz at most with HT on, no way to get the BSODs etc. fixed at more than that


Hey, that was me. It was awful gigabyte bios, i think. F6 seems to work.

Belial's running 4.75 on ~1.44vcore and i should be able to do it quite a ways below 1.4*, but i'm not delidded atm. His chip's not great, just some brute force with delid and pushpushpullpull h110. I've yet to be convinced that haswell is any worse in terms of clocks than ivy, if you can handle the heat. It's ridiculous to judge an overclock on avx2 synthetics temperatures, because they'll run you over 90c on stock settings with a silver arrow, stuff like chaining cinebench runs or using x264 as a stress test give you temps that are more in the expected range and not the cpu-socket-filled-with-lava type stuff people complain about. The gap between real, full cpu loads like x264 or cinebench and synethics that abuse AVX is massive with haswell, much much bigger than previous CPU's, and it scares a lot of people off, or makes them call the chips hot/bad which is just confusing and wrong IMO. Try it yourself, i did. 3.4ghz manual, no turbo and 1v vcore with avx2 runs hotter than 4.5ghz, 1.2v running with either AVX disabled, or in something that runs a load that is not primarily avx, like cinebench/x264 as opposed to linpack.

*got 4.625 on 125mhz strap @1.25v or so.. one multi won't cost me 0.15, not even close, i played around 4.7, 4.8, 4.9 before and even when i had crazy instability i could make them work for quick passes of pretty much anything, they just had a habit of falling face first off a cliff when put under extended loads or some weird stuff like 4.7 which passed 14 hours of prime and then failed in 12 seconds with x264


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> may be because its easier to find a razor than vice?


When you're talking about putting a razor through a 300$ chip versus either not doing it, or doing it a much safer way, spending the 20$ or the 30 minutes to find somebody with a vice is just more practical. I'd understand if it were opening a kinder surprise







but it's an expensive CPU. For the peace of mind, I think taking a moment to make a few calls or spending the extra 20$ is more worthwhile than risking it, but hey, that's just me.


----------



## SonDa5

I'd rather not smack the cpu around delidding with a vice and carefully delid the with a razor.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> When you're talking about putting a razor through a 300$ chip versus either not doing it, or doing it a much safer way, spending the 20$ or the 30 minutes to find somebody with a vice is just more practical. I'd understand if it were opening a kinder surprise
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but it's an expensive CPU. For the peace of mind, I think taking a moment to make a few calls or spending the extra 20$ is more worthwhile than risking it, but hey, that's just me.


Well i just scratch my pcb very badly and killed my cpu. I did practise with 2 old cpus with a razor blade there wasnt any scratch but with the 3770k i tried old style shaving razor and i failed so hard and yes vice method seems %90 more safer but its too pricey to find a good one here in my country sorry for the pic quality taken from my cell phone


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I'd rather not smack the cpu around delidding with a vice and carefully delid the with a razor.


Not denying the razor works, but you can't exaggerate the vice method either. Thus far around here we see a lot more failures from the razor than vice.

It would be like if I were to say "I'd rather not slice my CPU open with a scalpal when I can just carefully chip it open with a vice". People aren't smacking the CPU around delidding with a vice, like the razor method, it requires a certain amount of gentile force.

Having done both methods without any issues, to me it's pretty obvious the vice method is safer, but obviously both methods can be done incorrectly.

That having been said, I know the vice method sounds pretty bad, but the razor method can be made to sound pretty awful too if you word it badly, and it has a worse success rate from what can be seen on this forum, again though, not saying razor can't be done properly, just that it isn't the safer of the two methods.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> How about me Valgaur?
> 
> Or is it because i only ran 7 ibt?


I knew I forgot someone! I'll look back here in a sec








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i killed my i-3770k


Well sir.... I really hate to see that but yeah..... that PCB is pretty rough... what razor did you use? Also how did you go about it as well?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Not denying the razor works, but you can't exaggerate the vice method either. Thus far around here we see a lot more failures from the razor than vice.


There are 1.4 billion transistors in a 4770k and applying blunt force to it can't be good for them. You may not be able to see any physical damage but I don't think holding the IHS with a vice and then whacking at the CPU with a rubber hammer or block of wood till it separates from the IHS is healthy for those 1.4 billion transistors.

I've done 3 delids so far with 100% success rate using a razor. 2 with IB and 1 with HW.

I know there are risks involved with delidding. I think the Razor method requires more skill and is safer if done correctly.


----------



## WiLd FyeR

you guys know if I will get good temps to using MX-4 on the PCB. CLU is going to take awhile and I'd like to try hammer time out soon.


----------



## WiLd FyeR

you guys know if I will get good temps to using MX-4 on the PCB. CLU is going to take awhile and I'd like to try hammer time out soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenQ*
> 
> Here i am, ready to join the club.. I hope that 7 intel burn test runs is enough as i did not have time for 10 last night. If its not enough i will ofcourse make a new run 10 times instead.
> 
> OCN name: BenQ
> CPU: Intel i7 3770k @ Stock Cooler.
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra (CLU)
> ihs-TIM: Phobya HeGrease Extreme (Cross pattern)
> Mhz gained: 600
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: ~25 C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2871150
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Picture of the delided CPU:
> 
> 
> 
> Here is a picture of the delidded CPU:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Temps before delid:
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunately i did not test it with Intel Burn Test, however i ran Prime95 for a couple of seconds when my temperatures reached this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Temps after delid:
> 
> 
> 
> My delidded temps with stock frequency:
> 
> 
> 
> My delidded temps with an OC of 4.5GHz aswell as signature and IBT screenshot:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry for the two different temperature readers i used..
> 
> Regards,
> BenQ


You're in as well! (Finally I suppose







)


----------



## BenQ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in as well! (Finally I suppose
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Hah, yeah - thank you man


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I knew I forgot someone! I'll look back here in a sec
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well sir.... I really hate to see that but yeah..... that PCB is pretty rough... what razor did you use? Also how did you go about it as well?


i used this and i was doing really slowly. there was 1 corner is really hard to get the razor in .the weird thing there is nothing on that corner but damaged others well i am sure that cpu able to reach 5.0+ cause i tried 20 times ibt and prime almost 5 hours 4.8 with 1.320v itwas stable.anyways nomore adventure for me


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> There are 1.4 billion transistors in a 4770k and applying blunt force to it can't be good for them. You may not be able to see any physical damage but I don't think holding the IHS with a vice and then whacking at the CPU with a rubber hammer or block of wood till it separates from the IHS is healthy for those 1.4 billion transistors.
> 
> I've done 3 delids so far with 100% success rate using a razor. 2 with IB and 1 with HW.
> 
> I know there are risks involved with delidding. I think the Razor method requires more skill and is safer if done correctly.


Fair enough. You might be right about that. We'll have to agree to disagree








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i used this and i was doing really slowly. there was 1 corner is really hard to get the razor in .the weird thing there is nothing on that corner but damaged others well i am sure that cpu able to reach 5.0+ cause i tried 20 times ibt and prime almost 5 hours 4.8 with 1.320v itwas stable.anyways nomore adventure for me


Have you tried covering it with nail polish and testing it? I know the chances are slim but hey, you never know.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sounds good, wish you best of luck with that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can anyone explain to me why people have to put that clear stuff on the little transistors on the Haswell chip? I'm guessing insulation but can't put my finger on it...
> 
> 
> 
> Fear of shorts.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1412059/liquid-electrical-tape-to-protect-4770k-smd-capacitors-on-chip
Click to expand...

I tried +rep you but I couldn't.







So thanks for the info!


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> There are 1.4 billion transistors in a 4770k and applying blunt force to it can't be good for them. You may not be able to see any physical damage but I don't think holding the IHS with a vice and then whacking at the CPU with a rubber hammer or block of wood till it separates from the IHS is healthy for those 1.4 billion transistors.
> 
> I've done 3 delids so far with 100% success rate using a razor. 2 with IB and 1 with HW.
> 
> I know there are risks involved with delidding. I think the Razor method requires more skill and is safer if done correctly.


There have been zero reports on dead chips from the force of hammering. I thought that too, but after seeing the almost perfect success rate of this method I just did it and everything works fine. You have to do something really wrong to mess up your CPU with the vice. As a person with skillful hands I'm sure I would have been fine with a razor as well, but I decided to go the safest (as well as the fastest) way.

BTW I would advise you to learn a few things about they way CPUs are made. It's not like these transistors are soldered onto something separate.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiLd FyeR*
> 
> you guys know if I will get good temps to using MX-4 on the PCB. CLU is going to take awhile and I'd like to try hammer time out soon.


I'm currently running my CPU this way while waiting for CLU to arrive. You will notice a 10-15C temp drop, depending on how well you apply the MX-4.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> BTW I would advise you to learn a few things about they way CPUs are made. It's not like these transistors are soldered onto something separate.


1.4 Billion transistors. Hammer and vice method can't be good for it. Just watch this video and think about the damage that could happen.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 1.4 Billion transistors. Hammer and vice method can't be good for it. Just watch this video and think about the damage that could happen.


I've watched the video. It seems to me that they can withstand the force. As I said they're not separate, the whole die is one thing.

If they were this vulnerable then more than half of the CPUs delidded with a hammer would fail. They don't though.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I've watched the video. It seems to me that they can withstand the force. As I said they're not separate, the whole die is one thing.
> 
> If they were this vulnerable then more than half of the CPUs delidded with a hammer would fail. They don't though.


Exactly. Hell, the die survives being cut by a circular saw, that's blunt force + vibration. The only thing you could possibly be worried about is the bond between PCB and the die, since that's only soldered. But the bond between the die and PCB is definitely a great deal tougher than die-IHS.
As long as you don't go break the PCB or sent the chip flying the vice method definitely is a lot safer for 'general use'


----------



## chromedivision

Again, has someone else tried to do it as I said? I mean, not exactly with a guitar pick, but with something thin and made of plastic? I delided my 4770k and my brother's 3770k, both using a razor to cut just a little bit in the corner to insert the guitar pick and use it to separate de glue.

I think the risks are lower this way.

In the end, there's no safe method if you're not careful enough. There's always a chance to something goes wrong.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> Again, has someone else tried to do it as I said? I mean, not exactly with a guitar pick, but with something thin and made of plastic? I delided my 4770k and my brother's 3770k, both using a razor to cut just a little bit in the corner to insert the guitar pick and use it to separate de glue.
> 
> I think the risks are lower this way.
> 
> In the end, there's no safe method if you're not careful enough. There's always a chance to something goes wrong.


I did a couple of months ago with a very thin credit card. I think it was one of those arcade cards lol.
I do believe this is the best way to delid.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Fair enough. You might be right about that. We'll have to agree to disagree
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have you tried covering it with nail polish and testing it? I know the chances are slim but hey, you never know.


yea tried that also i have more than 4 scratch on the pcb and one of them is very deep i think the razor had failed me i will get better pics tomorrow


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> Again, has someone else tried to do it as I said? I mean, not exactly with a guitar pick, but with something thin and made of plastic? I delided my 4770k and my brother's 3770k, both using a razor to cut just a little bit in the corner to insert the guitar pick and use it to separate de glue.
> 
> I think the risks are lower this way.
> 
> In the end, there's no safe method if you're not careful enough. There's always a chance to something goes wrong.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I did a couple of months ago with a very thin credit card. I think it was one of those arcade cards lol.
> I do believe this is the best way to delid.


Shutting down my PC now to try this. My CLP came today and I was going to buy a vice tomorrow after work but I like what you guys have done









I'll upload pics/video when I'm through, wish me luck!

I found a couple of plastic cards, the size of a CC but about half to two-thirds the thickness. We'll see how it goes.


----------



## stickg1

I'm still partial to the razor blade method, I'm not against new methods though and enjoy hearing the success stories no matter which method is applied. I've done five now, three 3570K's and two 3770K's. Never a scratch and always a temp drop!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> Again, has someone else tried to do it as I said? I mean, not exactly with a guitar pick, but with something thin and made of plastic? I delided my 4770k and my brother's 3770k, both using a razor to cut just a little bit in the corner to insert the guitar pick and use it to separate de glue.
> 
> I think the risks are lower this way.
> 
> In the end, there's no safe method if you're not careful enough. There's always a chance to something goes wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> I did a couple of months ago with a very thin credit card. I think it was one of those arcade cards lol.
> I do believe this is the best way to delid.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Shutting down my PC now to try this. My CLP came today and I was going to buy a vice tomorrow after work but I like what you guys have done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll upload pics/video when I'm through, wish me luck!
> 
> I found a couple of plastic cards, the size of a CC but about half to two-thirds the thickness. We'll see how it goes.
Click to expand...

Good Luck!


----------



## sinnedone

Quick question about CLU.

When applying you should try to pull as much of it off as possible while spreading with the brush?


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 1.4 Billion transistors. Hammer and vice method can't be good for it. Just watch this video and think about the damage that could happen.


Whats your point? An intrusive razor that can easily damage the PCB is a better alternative?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Whats your point? An intrusive razor that can easily damage the PCB is a better alternative?


My point is that these CPUS are incredibly complex in their fabrication and as such should be treated as being fragile. Hammer and vice seems like way to much force to be applying to this cpu.

As others and I have have stated there are risks involved when you delid with either method. I haven't had any problems with the razor and all 3 times I have done it with care and patience when holding the cpus in my hand. I have not applied any type of blunt force to the the CPU. With the right razor and proper hand control, delidding with a razor isn't hard to do. In the end the person who is determined to delid is going to use one of these methods and when having the choice to choose I recommend the razor method because of the care and precision involved when doing this.

The other benefit to the razor method that I haven't mentioned yet is that the IHS will not be warped or damaged at all. Biting down on the IHS with a VICE can probably warp the IHS or leave marks.

Every time I see a video of somebody delidding with a hammer and vice I cringe. It just doesn't seem like the proper technique.


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> My point is that these CPUS are incredibly complex in their fabrication and as such should be treated as being fragile. Hammer and vice seems like way to much force to be applying to this cpu.
> 
> As others and I have have stated there are risks involved when you delid with either method. I haven't had any problems with the razor and all 3 times I have done it with care and patience when holding the cpus in my hand. I have not applied any type of blunt force to the the CPU. With the right razor and proper hand control delidding with a razor isn't hard to do. In the end the person who is determined to delid is going to use one of these methods and when having the choice to choose I recommend the razor method because of the care and precision involved when doing this.
> 
> The other benefit to the razor method that I haven't mentioned yet is that the IHS will not be warped or damaged at all. Biting down on the IHS with a VICE can probably warp the IHS or leave marks.


Razor isn't hard to do? Ive done it and killed 2 CPUs. Razor method is silly when i can take off the lid in 10 seconds with minimal force. Warping the IHS? Well sure if you tighten the IHS to the vice with a fury of an angry god which is not required because of the way the force is applied the PCB. You point out the flaws of the vice and hammer method yet fail to acknowledge the downfalls of the razor method.
Not impressed by your argument.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Not impressed by your argument.


Just putting out the information. I can understand why you wouldn't agree with 2 failed razor delids.

There are pros and cons to each method but with the hammer and vice method you can't avoid the blunt force that can possibly be damaging the internal circuitry of the chip and the human eye can't see it. I'd rather have peace of mind with all electrical connections in the chip in proper shape and form from factory than possibly tweaked from the damage of the force of a hammer hitting it.

In my mind I can't get past the possibility of some type of internal damage happening when using the hammer and vice method. With the razor method I don't have to worry about internal damage.


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Just putting out the information. I can understand why you wouldn't agree with 2 failed razor delids.
> 
> There are pros and cons to each method but with the hammer and vice method you can't avoid the blunt force that can possibly be damaging the internal circuitry of the chip and the human eye can't see it. I'd rather have all electrical connections in the chip in proper shape and form from factory than possibly tweaked from the damage of the force of a hammer hitting it.


I'm unconvinced with the lack of evidence of the possible potential damage on behalf of your claims.
I think I'll stick with my vice, hammer and block of wood.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> I'm unconvinced with the lack of evidence of the possible potential damage on behalf of your claims.
> I think I'll stick with my vice, hammer and block of wood.


I'll stick with my uncommon sense and skill with a twist of luck when using a razor to delid.


----------



## scorpscarx

I too can understand you being defensive with 2 failed using the razor, but you don't exactly list points either. I am in the razor camp but I do find it pretty interesting how heated some people get with one method or the other.

What we need is a way to put a razor edge on a piece of plastic







.


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> I too can understand you being defensive with 2 failed using the razor, but you don't exactly list points either. I am in the razor camp but I do find it pretty interesting how heated some people get with one method or the other.
> 
> What we need is a way to put a razor edge on a piece of plastic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I really dont care what people do with their electronics. I like it because it takes me seconds to take off that lid.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> In my mind I can't get past the possibility of some type of internal damage happening when using the hammer and vice method. With the razor method I don't have to worry about internal damage.


I don't know what kind of damage it could possibly do. Unless it is changing the molecular structure of the die itself there isn't really anything to damage. Hitting it isn't going to make the traces suddenly get closer together or something, and it's not like the transistors are physical switches. Integrated circuits have been used in extremely high vibration environments for years without any kind of problems - I mean, they put them on rockets and bombs (think of the impact a bomb fuse stands up to without being damaged). The die is basically a single piece of silicon once it is completed, the transistors are integral to the structure itself.

I guess you could physically knock the die loose from the substrate, I don't know how much force that would require. Those solder connections are pretty solid.

I know where you care coming from with the concern for damage, but based on the internal structure of the die I just don't see it happening. You really aren't hitting it very hard when you delid it. I think you'd break something on the macro level (like the PCB) before you damaged the internal components.


----------



## sinnedone

Im going to add to this discussion being that I just performed the hammer/vice method.

First of all when done correctly there is barely any pressure on the ihs itself when in the vise (if done correctly)

Second thing is the literally takes very little force to get the lid off. (Again if done correctly) A couple of light taps is all it took for me (2 taps)

Third when using a piece of wood it acts as an insulator and absorbs the inpact of the hammer. The blunt force does not get transferred in full to the pcb.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Im going to add to this discussion being that I just performed the hammer/vice method.
> 
> First of all when done correctly there is barely any pressure on the ihs itself when in the vise (if done correctly)
> 
> Second thing is the literally takes very little force to get the lid off. (Again if done correctly) A couple of light taps is all it took for me (2 taps)
> 
> Third when using a piece of wood it acts as an insulator and absorbs the inpact of the hammer. The blunt force does not get transferred in full to the pcb.


Good to hear. Congrats!









My fears are more towards damage that the eye can't see but things could get nasty with hammer and vice method if something went wrong.


----------



## Turt1e

I tried delidding on an old 478 Pentium 4, not sure if its soldered or not but there was a lot of wood dust. Is that normal? I cut my block of wood with a saw.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Good to hear. Congrats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My fears are more towards damage that the eye can't see but things could get nasty with hammer and vice method if something went wrong.


What the hell happened to that PCB? Almost looks like mice had lunch there..


----------



## HairyGamer

Just got my PC back together after a successful Haswell delidding.

I used a razor blade for 85% of the work and then a thin plastic card to finish it off as safely as possible.

I used liquid electrical tape (rated for ~95C) on the capacitors to the left of the die to protect them from contact with the CLP.

Pics to come tomorrow, I really need to get to bed because I have to go to work in ~6 hours.

Anyway - the good news is that I went from 86C to 54C!! That's a sick 32C drop









I feel like the coolest geek on OCN right now, lol j/k

Edit for a few pics... more tomorrow.



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!




Liquid tape on capacitors and anything that could be perceived as a nick although they were really hardly even scratches.

If you look closely you can see the scratch on the top right of the pic, covered it with liquid tape since I'm paranoid.


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Good to hear. Congrats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My fears are more towards damage that the eye can't see but things could get nasty with hammer and vice method if something went wrong.


Oh definitely. When I was thinking about using the vise method that picture exactly popped in my head. I'm pretty sure it could happen with excessive force to.


----------



## chromedivision

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Just got my PC back together after a successful Haswell delidding.
> 
> I used a razor blade for 85% of the work and then a thin plastic card to finish it off as safely as possible.
> 
> I used liquid electrical tape (rated for ~95C) on the capacitors to the left of the die to protect them from contact with the CLP.
> 
> Pics to come tomorrow, I really need to get to bed because I have to go to work in ~6 hours.
> 
> Anyway - the good news is that I went from 86C to 54C!! That's a sick 32C drop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I feel like the coolest geek on OCN right now, lol j/k
> 
> Edit for a few pics... more tomorrow.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Liquid tape on capacitors and anything that could be perceived as a nick although they were really hardly even scratches.
> 
> If you look closely you can see the scratch on the top left of the pic, covered it with liquid tape since I'm paranoid.


Welcome aboard. At the first time I did it also felt that way.


----------



## chromedivision

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> What the hell happened to that PCB? Almost looks like mice had lunch there..


I guess it was just excess of stupidity that made this mess.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Good to hear. Congrats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My fears are more towards damage that the eye can't see but things could get nasty with hammer and vice method if something went wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh definitely. When I was thinking about using the vise method that picture exactly pooped in my head. I'm pretty sure it could happen with excessive force to.
Click to expand...

That looks like excessive force and chipping a part of it or something that basically sanded the PCB. The graining of it reminds me of a piece of unsanded wood. Imagine a block of wood and you look at the top and bottom of it.


----------



## Auxillary Field

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in as well! (Finally I suppose
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Hey Valgaur could you also add me while you're at it?









I posted a while back: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/20150_50#post_20381769


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Auxillary Field*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in as well! (Finally I suppose
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Valgaur could you also add me while you're at it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I posted a while back: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/20150_50#post_20381769
Click to expand...

I got you!







You're in.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Good to hear. Congrats!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My fears are more towards damage that the eye can't see but things could get nasty with hammer and vice method if something went wrong.


It's obvious that the PCB got hit one-sided. The person who did this did not use a straight piece of wood, and also used too much force.

It's much easier to avoid stupid mistakes like these (which is the only way to ruin your CPU with hammer/vice) than to learn how to use the razor right.


----------



## Auxillary Field

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I got you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're in.


Tnx man








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> It's obvious that the PCB got hit one-sided. The person who did this did not use a straight piece of wood, and also used too much force.
> 
> It's much easier to avoid stupid mistakes like these (which is the only way to ruin your CPU with hammer/vice) than to learn how to use the razor right.


I think the only way to do this kind off damage is by basicly hitting the pcb directly with a steel hammer, or maybe a thin, hard piece of wood. I actually ried to replicate this problem earlier using a hammer with a hard plastic head (basicly between rubber and steel) on an old P4 Northwoord that I found, but even hitting the PCB directly (and quite hard) only resulted in very minor damage compared to that picture.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> Welcome aboard. At the first time I did it also felt that way.


Me too. Congrats HairyGamer!







Nice results.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> My point is that these CPUS are incredibly complex in their fabrication and as such should be treated as being fragile. Hammer and vice seems like way to much force to be applying to this cpu.
> 
> As others and I have have stated there are risks involved when you delid with either method. I haven't had any problems with the razor and all 3 times I have done it with care and patience when holding the cpus in my hand. I have not applied any type of blunt force to the the CPU. With the right razor and proper hand control, delidding with a razor isn't hard to do. In the end the person who is determined to delid is going to use one of these methods and when having the choice to choose I recommend the razor method because of the care and precision involved when doing this.
> 
> The other benefit to the razor method that I haven't mentioned yet is that the IHS will not be warped or damaged at all. Biting down on the IHS with a VICE can probably warp the IHS or leave marks.
> 
> Every time I see a video of somebody delidding with a hammer and vice I cringe. It just doesn't seem like the proper technique.


I didn't warp my IHS at all. I still don't get how people end up doing that. If you follow the guide and don't over tighten the IHS, it's pretty easy to do. That being said, I'll personally go with the method that has had a higher success rate regardless of the person doing it. Razor method is fine but I don't see how one can justify to themselves that digging a razor into the side of their CPU while holding it in their hand is better than a somewhat controlled environment where the CPU is held in place by a vice and you're merely popping it off the top.

I used to think the vice method was crazy too, but I think it's one of those things you just have to do in order to truly understand how much better it is. Having used the razor method on two chips, I can easily say the vice method was easier and less scary. Personally though, as long as people are delidding with success I'm happy for them. I just frequently see razor'd up PCB's and cringe because having done the vice method I realize how simple and easy it actually is. I'm glad the razor method works for some people and if it works for you keep at it. We should probably keep a list of people who delidded and what method they used and if it was a success or not just for fun though.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromedivision*
> 
> Again, has someone else tried to do it as I said? I mean, not exactly with a guitar pick, but with something thin and made of plastic? I delided my 4770k and my brother's 3770k, both using a razor to cut just a little bit in the corner to insert the guitar pick and use it to separate de glue.
> 
> I think the risks are lower this way.
> 
> In the end, there's no safe method if you're not careful enough. There's always a chance to something goes wrong.


What about dental floss? Would that work and get into the silicone glue? And maybe using a vice to hold the chip while working on it with the floss.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> What about dental floss? Would that work and get into the silicone glue? And maybe using a vice to hold the chip while working on it with the floss.


...seen dental floss discussed before re delidding, but not sure what the outcome actually was (if any).

Somewhat related, does anyone know the 'melting temp' (or at least 'pliable'' temp) of the black silicon securing the IHS to the PCB ? Wondering about the 'heated thin metal wire' approach to cut the IHS loose...


----------



## FlamingBeatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...seen dental floss discussed before re delidding, but not sure what the outcome actually was (if any).
> 
> Somewhat related, does anyone know the 'melting temp' (or at least 'pliable'' temp) of the black silicon securing the IHS to the PCB ? Wondering about the 'heated thin metal wire' approach to cut the IHS loose...


I think the pcb would burn before the glue melts lol


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...seen dental floss discussed before re delidding, but not sure what the outcome actually was (if any).
> 
> Somewhat related, does anyone know the 'melting temp' (or at least 'pliable'' temp) of the black silicon securing the IHS to the PCB ? Wondering about the 'heated thin metal wire' approach to cut the IHS loose...


I thought about dental floss, but what really would be great is a piece of Kevlar thread. They use it to sew highend boots and such.


----------



## HairyGamer

Dental floss or fishing line is an excellent idea - especially if you put the chip in a hobby vice with rubber teeth while you work on it. I'd imagine it would take a while to get started but once a corner was loosened up I'm sure things would move along nicely. I use a razor for most of the work on my chip and then used a thin piece of plastic to finish off the rest of the glue. I wish I had thought to use the dental floss last night!


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Wow it's been a while since I've popped in thread...wut's new peeps? Anything new to know about delidding Haswell chips?

I just saw the dental floss idea that's a very interesting thought.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Hey guys! Two days ago I posted saying "YOLO, going in the vice now". Within 5 minutes of posting that I was done.

I have some tips for and info on the vice method for people who have never done it, or are still afraid of this method. For the record, I successfully delided my 3770K with a THICK box cutting razor. There was not a scratch on the PCB, and it took me all of 5 minutes. I'll admit I was careless, but I'm damn good with my hands.

Onto the vice method!

For those that don't want to buy a Vice, or think that the razor method is cheaper and safer, THINK AGAIN! Two days ago I bought a 4" Drill Press Vice from Lowe's for $19. The Part number is BV-DP40. This is probably the best vice for the job. And for all you people who don't want to drop $20 on a vice just to delid, Lowe's has a 90 day return policy! I don't feel guilty about returning the vice because: 1. The box is in perfect condition, 2. The vice jaws were covered in blue painters tape to protect both the jaws, and my IHS, and 3. The vice has not a scratch on it, and was never bolted to a bench/ table. So after you're done, return it! That's a free delid folks.

Here's the vice I used. It's 30 on amazon, but only $19 at Lowe's! And at Lowe's you have 90 days to return it.

http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-BV-DP40-Drill-Press-Vise/dp/B0057PUDLY

Onward. Here's how I positioned the vice. The operation was completed on my kitchen counter. I have a board underneath the vice to protect my counter, and a board held vertically behind the vice that serves two purposes. 1: To protect my kitchen counter molding, and 2: To give the vice a solid backing, since all of the force will be directed that way.

With this setup, the vice will not move, and will be just as secure as if it were bolted to a work bench.



Now for the positioning of the IHS in the vice. I haven't seen this discussed much so I'll add my suggestion for how it should be placed. For Haswell, secure the IHS in the vice so that the VRM side is facing you, meaning you will be hitting the VRM side with your block.

Why? Because this minimizes the risk of both the VRM's and the Die itself from hitting anything after it is free of the IHS. Take a look in my pictures at the layout of the 4770k after I crack it open. You'll see that the side of the chip which has the most clearance between the die and the edge of the PCB or IHS is the side opposite that of the VRM side. You want to hit the VRM side because once your chip is free it will move forward, and when oriented this way your VRM's and die are furthest from the threats they are approaching. For Ivy, just make sure your vice is clamping the flanged sides of the IHS, this will allow the most safety clearance for the die. Phew that was a lengthy explanation for such a simple concept. Here's an example of how a 4770K/4670K should be clamped.



Now for what material your hitting block should be made of. PINE. That's it, no other woods, don't even think about it. Pine is soft enough to not damage the PCB, yet strong enough to break the seal easily. Use a section of 2x4 (Two by Four) with nice square edges. I'd recommend a length no shorter than 8", and no longer than 14". The shorter the block, the less force it can absorb meaning the PCB will take more brute force. Too long, and it may become difficult to hold and control.

Now hold the block, with its clean flat and square side, directly parallel to the PCB. Apply pressure towards the PCB with your hand, this eliminates the chance of the block slipping off, or a slapping effect on the PCB which we DO NOT WANT.

Hit the thing, hard. However technique is also involved in this stage. When you're hitting a nail, you swing hard and follow through; the point being to drive the nail with the follow through of your hammer's blow. This isn't the type of swing you want. We want concise yet powerful taps, no follow through. If you hit the PCB with a full blown nail driving follow through, you'll send it flying. Bad. So to reiterate: Strong, yet controlled and concise hits. Your PCB should be free in a few hits, and it shouldn't even go flying if you follow this technique. When I did mine, the PCB broke free and rested right on top on the IHS, no drama whatsoever.




After the PCB was free I inspected the edge that was hit. It was immaculate, not even a micro-scratch or dent to be seen. My block of wood (2x4 cut in half laying in my garage, PINE) took all the force. You can see here how the block fared afterwards. This proves that the PCB is much stronger than pine.



As for cleaning off the glue, I've heard some people complain saying it's hard to get off. >_> Get real. Use the corner of a credit card and scrape it off. Scrape as hard as you want, I promise you the plastic your card is made of WILL NOT scratch the PCB, even if you tried.

In conclusion, I've done both methods. Use a vice. It's safer, its faster, and it can even be cheaper if you have no qualms about returning your $20 vice.

Hope this post wan't too long, and that it helps some of you out. Happy deliding. I'll post my results and validation here in a few minutes.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Add me please







This is my second delid, just never submitted this for the first.

OCN name: Ucantescape1992
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: PK-1
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: 4.4Ghz
Temp drops:20+
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2873238


----------



## MiiX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Hey guys! Two days ago I posted saying "YOLO, going in the vice now". Within 5 minutes of posting that I was done.
> 
> I have some tips for and info on the vice method for people who have never done it, or are still afraid of this method. For the record, I successfully delided my 3770K with a THICK box cutting razor. There was not a scratch on the PCB, and it took me all of 5 minutes. I'll admit I was careless, but I'm damn good with my hands.
> 
> Onto the vice method!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> For those that don't want to buy a Vice, or think that the razor method is cheaper and safer, THINK AGAIN! Two days ago I bought a 4" Drill Press Vice from Lowe's for $19. The Part number is BV-DP40. This is probably the best vice for the job. And for all you people who don't want to drop $20 on a vice just to delid, Lowe's has a 90 day return policy! I don't feel guilty about returning the vice because: 1. The box is in perfect condition, 2. The vice jaws were covered in blue painters tape to protect both the jaws, and my IHS, and 3. The vice has not a scratch on it, and was never bolted to a bench/ table. So after you're done, return it! That's a free delid folks.
> 
> Here's the vice I used. It's 30 on amazon, but only $19 at Lowe's! And at Lowe's you have 90 days to return it.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-BV-DP40-Drill-Press-Vise/dp/B0057PUDLY
> 
> Onward. Here's how I positioned the vice. The operation was completed on my kitchen counter. I have a board underneath the vice to protect my counter, and a board held vertically behind the vice that serves two purposes. 1: To protect my kitchen counter molding, and 2: To give the vice a solid backing, since all of the force will be directed that way.
> 
> With this setup, the vice will not move, and will be just as secure as if it were bolted to a work bench.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for the positioning of the IHS in the vice. I haven't seen this discussed much so I'll add my suggestion for how it should be placed. For Haswell, secure the IHS in the vice so that the VRM side is facing you, meaning you will be hitting the VRM side with your block.
> 
> Why? Because this minimizes the risk of both the VRM's and the Die itself from hitting anything after it is free of the IHS. Take a look in my pictures at the layout of the 4770k after I crack it open. You'll see that the side of the chip which has the most clearance between the die and the edge of the PCB or IHS is the side opposite that of the VRM side. You want to hit the VRM side because once your chip is free it will move forward, and when oriented this way your VRM's and die are furthest from the threats they are approaching. For Ivy, just make sure your vice is clamping the flanged sides of the IHS, this will allow the most safety clearance for the die. Phew that was a lengthy explanation for such a simple concept. Here's an example of how a 4770K/4670K should be clamped.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for what material your hitting block should be made of. PINE. That's it, no other woods, don't even think about it. Pine is soft enough to not damage the PCB, yet strong enough to break the seal easily. Use a section of 2x4 (Two by Four) with nice square edges. I'd recommend a length no shorter than 8", and no longer than 14". The shorter the block, the less force it can absorb meaning the PCB will take more brute force. Too long, and it may become difficult to hold and control.
> 
> Now hold the block, with its clean flat and square side, directly parallel to the PCB. Apply pressure towards the PCB with your hand, this eliminates the chance of the block slipping off, or a slapping effect on the PCB which we DO NOT WANT.
> 
> Hit the thing, hard. However technique is also involved in this stage. When you're hitting a nail, you swing hard and follow through; the point being to drive the nail with the follow through of your hammer's blow. This isn't the type of swing you want. We want concise yet powerful taps, no follow through. If you hit the PCB with a full blown nail driving follow through, you'll send it flying. Bad. So to reiterate: Strong, yet controlled and concise hits. Your PCB should be free in a few hits, and it shouldn't even go flying if you follow this technique. When I did mine, the PCB broke free and rested right on top on the IHS, no drama whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After the PCB was free I inspected the edge that was hit. It was immaculate, not even a micro-scratch or dent to be seen. My block of wood (2x4 cut in half laying in my garage, PINE) took all the force. You can see here how the block fared afterwards. This proves that the PCB is much stronger than pine.
> 
> 
> 
> As for cleaning off the glue, I've heard some people complain saying it's hard to get off. >_> Get real. Use the corner of a credit card and scrape it off. Scrape as hard as you want, I promise you the plastic your card is made of WILL NOT scratch the PCB, even if you tried.
> 
> 
> In conclusion, I've done both methods. Use a vice. It's safer, its faster, and it can even be cheaper if you have no qualms about returning your $20 vice.
> 
> Hope this post wan't too long, and that it helps some of you out. Happy deliding. I'll post my results and validation here in a few minutes.


Helps me a lot on the question "Vice or no vice?" Vice it is! Nice guide for someone like me who hardly ever has done a hardware mod(except for cases)


----------



## ucantescape1992

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Helps me a lot on the question "Vice or no vice?" Vice it is! Nice guide for someone like me who hardly ever has done a hardware mod(except for cases)


Glad I could help! The vice method isn't anything to be afraid of.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Hey guys! Two days ago I posted saying "YOLO, going in the vice now". Within 5 minutes of posting that I was done.
> 
> I have some tips for and info on the vice method for people who have never done it, or are still afraid of this method. For the record, I successfully delided my 3770K with a THICK box cutting razor. There was not a scratch on the PCB, and it took me all of 5 minutes. I'll admit I was careless, but I'm damn good with my hands.
> 
> Onto the vice method!
> 
> For those that don't want to buy a Vice, or think that the razor method is cheaper and safer, THINK AGAIN! Two days ago I bought a 4" Drill Press Vice from Lowe's for $19. The Part number is BV-DP40. This is probably the best vice for the job. And for all you people who don't want to drop $20 on a vice just to delid, Lowe's has a 90 day return policy! I don't feel guilty about returning the vice because: 1. The box is in perfect condition, 2. The vice jaws were covered in blue painters tape to protect both the jaws, and my IHS, and 3. The vice has not a scratch on it, and was never bolted to a bench/ table. So after you're done, return it! That's a free delid folks.
> 
> Here's the vice I used. It's 30 on amazon, but only $19 at Lowe's! And at Lowe's you have 90 days to return it.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-BV-DP40-Drill-Press-Vise/dp/B0057PUDLY
> 
> Onward. Here's how I positioned the vice. The operation was completed on my kitchen counter. I have a board underneath the vice to protect my counter, and a board held vertically behind the vice that serves two purposes. 1: To protect my kitchen counter molding, and 2: To give the vice a solid backing, since all of the force will be directed that way.
> 
> With this setup, the vice will not move, and will be just as secure as if it were bolted to a work bench.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for the positioning of the IHS in the vice. I haven't seen this discussed much so I'll add my suggestion for how it should be placed. For Haswell, secure the IHS in the vice so that the VRM side is facing you, meaning you will be hitting the VRM side with your block.
> 
> Why? Because this minimizes the risk of both the VRM's and the Die itself from hitting anything after it is free of the IHS. Take a look in my pictures at the layout of the 4770k after I crack it open. You'll see that the side of the chip which has the most clearance between the die and the edge of the PCB or IHS is the side opposite that of the VRM side. You want to hit the VRM side because once your chip is free it will move forward, and when oriented this way your VRM's and die are furthest from the threats they are approaching. For Ivy, just make sure your vice is clamping the flanged sides of the IHS, this will allow the most safety clearance for the die. Phew that was a lengthy explanation for such a simple concept. Here's an example of how a 4770K/4670K should be clamped.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for what material your hitting block should be made of. PINE. That's it, no other woods, don't even think about it. Pine is soft enough to not damage the PCB, yet strong enough to break the seal easily. Use a section of 2x4 (Two by Four) with nice square edges. I'd recommend a length no shorter than 8", and no longer than 14". The shorter the block, the less force it can absorb meaning the PCB will take more brute force. Too long, and it may become difficult to hold and control.
> 
> Now hold the block, with its clean flat and square side, directly parallel to the PCB. Apply pressure towards the PCB with your hand, this eliminates the chance of the block slipping off, or a slapping effect on the PCB which we DO NOT WANT.
> 
> Hit the thing, hard. However technique is also involved in this stage. When you're hitting a nail, you swing hard and follow through; the point being to drive the nail with the follow through of your hammer's blow. This isn't the type of swing you want. We want concise yet powerful taps, no follow through. If you hit the PCB with a full blown nail driving follow through, you'll send it flying. Bad. So to reiterate: Strong, yet controlled and concise hits. Your PCB should be free in a few hits, and it shouldn't even go flying if you follow this technique. When I did mine, the PCB broke free and rested right on top on the IHS, no drama whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After the PCB was free I inspected the edge that was hit. It was immaculate, not even a micro-scratch or dent to be seen. My block of wood (2x4 cut in half laying in my garage, PINE) took all the force. You can see here how the block fared afterwards. This proves that the PCB is much stronger than pine.
> 
> 
> 
> As for cleaning off the glue, I've heard some people complain saying it's hard to get off. >_> Get real. Use the corner of a credit card and scrape it off. Scrape as hard as you want, I promise you the plastic your card is made of WILL NOT scratch the PCB, even if you tried.
> 
> In conclusion, I've done both methods. Use a vice. It's safer, its faster, and it can even be cheaper if you have no qualms about returning your $20 vice.
> 
> Hope this post wan't too long, and that it helps some of you out. Happy deliding. I'll post my results and validation here in a few minutes.


This should be included in the first post of Delidded club as well as Vice & Hammer club. Best vice & hammer tutorial yet.

One thing to emphasize, it's important to use the right kind of wood. You should use pine, alder, or any other kind of *natural* wood, NOT fake wood like MDF. As mentioned in this tutorial the PCB is harder than the pine and the pine got marked. A piece of MDF would have split in two instead of being just marked. Been there, done that. You don't want your wood block splitting and scratching your PCB.

The way you place the CPU on the vice is also important. Don't clamp the whole IHS, just the thinner part. You don't want the vice teeth to get near your PCB and scratch it. (even though with some tape applied that's impossible to happen)

Other than that, just put some towels everywhere to make sure the CPU has a safe fall in case of a flight, and your delidding is pretty much a guaranteed success.

(it would be good to include this info along with the tutorial, it could save some CPUs)


----------



## Ceadderman

Anyone lapp the cover and delid one of these things? What's your temps like?

I'm considering getting a 4770k and doing just that(Folding System) so I'm lookin to see what is what.









~Ceadder


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Anyone lapp and delid one of these things? What's your temps like?
> 
> I'm considering getting a 4770k and doing just that(Folding System) so I'm lookin to see what is what.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


See the list in the OP regarding temp drops (both on Ivy and Haswell).

As for lapping I don't think it offers more than 1-2C of improvement. I lapped my 3770K since I damaged the IHS with the vice and didn't get any better temps than other people using the same paste without lapping.

So I would say save your time and just delid. Lap if you need to but it's not worth it if you don't.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> This should be included in the first post of Delidded club as well as Vice & Hammer club. Best vice & hammer tutorial yet.
> 
> One thing to emphasize, it's important to use the right kind of wood. You should use pine, alder, or any other kind of *natural* wood, NOT fake wood like MDF. As mentioned in this tutorial the PCB is harder than the pine and the pine got marked. A piece of MDF would have split in two instead of being just marked. Been there, done that. You don't want your wood block splitting and scratching your PCB.
> 
> The way you place the CPU on the vice is also important. Don't clamp the whole IHS, just the thinner part. You don't want the vice teeth to get near your PCB and scratch it. (even though with some tape applied that's impossible to happen)
> 
> Other than that, just put some towels everywhere to make sure the CPU has a safe fall in case of a flight, and your delidding is pretty much a guaranteed success.
> 
> (it would be good to include this info along with the tutorial, it could save some CPUs)


Thanks dude! It'd be awesome to be featured in the OP. I really wish I would have taken pictures showing exactly how it's supposed to be held in the vice.


----------



## xironcrossx

Didn't Delid yet, but I'll throw in my "before" results for now.

A quick question, is my CPU kinda ****ty since it requires 1.25v for 4.5ghz? I tried lower but anything under that and it was BSOD or fail in Prime95/IBT. Will delidding maybe allow me to decrease the volts a bit? (I read somewhere that lower temps allow for lower volts on Ivy)

Before



Verifciation: http://valid.canardpc.com/2873289


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Anyone lapp the cover and delid one of these things? What's your temps like?
> 
> I'm considering getting a 4770k and doing just that(Folding System) so I'm lookin to see what is what.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Check the top of the IHS with a flat surface like the edge of a razor blade, it it is pretty flat lapping doesn't help that much.
If it is like a mountain range with light beaming though between the blade & IHS (not common but happens), lapping can help.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xironcrossx*
> 
> Didn't Delid yet, but I'll throw in my "before" results for now.
> 
> A quick question, is my CPU kinda ****ty since it requires 1.25v for 4.5ghz? I tried lower but anything under that and it was BSOD or fail in Prime95/IBT. Will delidding maybe allow me to decrease the volts a bit? (I read somewhere that lower temps allow for lower volts on Ivy)
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> 
> Verifciation: http://valid.canardpc.com/2873289


Delidding usually doesn't drop temps enough to allow lower voltage at the same clocks, that usually comes with more drastic temp changes like sub-zero cooling.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Check the top of the IHS with a flat surface like the edge of a razor blade, it it is pretty flat lapping doesn't help that much.
> If it is like a mountain range with light beaming though between the blade & IHS (not common but happens), lapping can help.
> Delidding usually doesn't drop temps enough to allow lower voltage at the same clocks, that usually comes with more drastic temp changes like sub-zero cooling.


Once I went from the stock Intel cooler to watercooling (no delidding) my voltage requirement for 4.5GHz dropped a bit, 0.02V for sure maybe more. I wasn't able to run Prime95 for more than 2 minutes with the stock cooler because it went over 95C, but it sometimes threw BSODs related to voltage. With watercooling I achieved 12+ hours of Prime95 stability with lower voltage at the same clock. My max temp with watercooling at 4.5GHz is ~75C.

After delidding my CPU I pushed for 4.8GHz, but I'm reaching 90C and I can't find the right voltage. I'm waiting for my CLU to arrive and after the 10-15C temp drop I'm expecting from it I believe I'll settle at a lower voltage than what I'm using right now to keep it running. I will post about my findings once my CLU arrives and I see the results.

I think that when you're above ~80C your chip requires more volts for stability, so even 10-20C of a temp drop that delidding provides could lower your Vcore a few notches. No miracles are to be expected though.


----------



## FtW 420

It is nice when a good temp drop allows a bit less voltage with the same stability, it would usually take more than a 20 - 30° difference in temps though.
As long as you don't go in expecting a voltage drop it can be a surprise bonus if it happens!


----------



## xironcrossx

Well as long as I see temp drops I'll be happy, even though I don't think mine are particularly atrocious. (Only about ~7C difference between hottest/coldest compared to some people with close to 30C difference)


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xironcrossx*
> 
> Well as long as I see temp drops I'll be happy, even though I don't think mine are particularly atrocious. (Only about ~7C difference between hottest/coldest compared to some people with close to 30C difference)


If you're using some kind of liquid metal TIM and got just a ~7C temp drop then reapply the TIM. If not, get some.









Other than that make sure you clean all the black glue on the PCB/IHS, some people forget to do that.


----------



## josephimports

Already a member, but ill share some new delid results and pics.

Before

After


This time around, I used a drill press vise instead of the clamp style POS. No movement whatsoever. Total procedure time from cpu removal, to delid, and re-installation was 40 minutes.


BIG







to fnarfbargle.

***Update*** 5 GHz 1.45v


----------



## xironcrossx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> If you're using some kind of liquid metal TIM and got just a ~7C temp drop then reapply the TIM. If not, get some.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Other than that make sure you clean all the black glue on the PCB/IHS, some people forget to do that.


Oh no you misunderstood me, I didn't delid yet







. I meant just stock there isn't a huge difference between the 4 cores temperatures as some saw differences of 30C(it was on a YouTube video with a 3570k).


----------



## sniggleface

Apologies if this has already been covered, but if I were to do this should I also use the CLU between the IHS and the heatsink, or continue to use AS5 or a similar paste there? No matter what I'd be purchasing the CLU to use between the die and the IHS.

Thanks!


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sniggleface*
> 
> Apologies if this has already been covered, but if I were to do this should I also use the CLU between the IHS and the heatsink, or continue to use AS5 or a similar paste there? No matter what I'd be purchasing the CLU to use between the die and the IHS.
> 
> Thanks!


On the die is where you get the ~20C drops - on top of the IHS you usually only see 1-2C difference from what I've read. The CLU is a pain to get off, stains things (including CPU blocks) and is conductive so it's best to just keep it under the IHS and use regular paste on top. AS5 isn't really great nowadays compared to other pastes, I'd recommend a more modern paste such as MX2 or 4, or perhaps some Shin Etsu G751 etc.


----------



## Bartouille

I just delid with CLU/CLU instead of NT-H1/NT-H1 and the temps dropped by 20C! Not only that, all my cores are at the same temperature!! No more 5-6C gap between cores.







Maybe it's because I lapped both CPU and heatsink. My CPU IHS was insanely concave, I had to use 220grit sandpaper to get it flat, higher grit sandpaper didn't touch the center of the CPU. Maybe it's because I used vice and hammer and applied too much pressure on the IHS with the vice. 4770k 4.7GHz @ 1.35V currently running Aida64 (it's been 1 hour and a half already) and all cores are at 73C. Bad news is that customs opened my CLU and wasted it a bit. I didn't cover the capacitors, hopefully nothing goes wrong in the future. Way easier to apply then NT-H1 and when it's time to clamp the IHS, it doesn't slip like crazy.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I just delid with CLU/CLU instead of NT-H1/NT-H1 and the temps dropped by 20C! Not only that, all my cores are at the same temperature!! No more 5-6C gap between cores.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe it's because I lapped both CPU and heatsink. My CPU IHS was insanely concave, I had to use 220grit sandpaper to get it flat, higher grit sandpaper didn't touch the center of the CPU. Maybe it's because I used vice and hammer and applied too much pressure on the IHS with the vice. 4770k 4.7GHz @ 1.35V currently running Aida64 (it's been 1 hour and a half already) and all cores are at 73C. *Bad news is that customs opened my CLU and wasted it a bit.* I didn't cover the capacitors, hopefully nothing goes wrong in the future. Way easier to apply then NT-H1 and when it's time to clamp the IHS, it doesn't slip like crazy.


Man I would be PISSED!


----------



## Desmo808

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sniggleface*
> 
> Apologies if this has already been covered, but if I were to do this should I also use the CLU between the IHS and the heatsink, or continue to use AS5 or a similar paste there? No matter what I'd be purchasing the CLU to use between the die and the IHS.
> 
> Thanks!


If your cooler has aluminum in it, use a paste between the IHS and cooler. CLU doesn't play nice with aluminum. With a copper cooler, CLU should be okay over the expected life cycle of your cpu/cooler. BUT, just be aware that CLU will harden over time and you'll have to put in some elbow grease to remove it if you ever have to uninstall the cooler in the future.

Here are two posts where someone successfully applied and removed CLU between IHS (lapped) and cooler.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/15350#post_19644142
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/13230#post_19452973

I mentioned "expected life cycle" because the gallium in CLU does eat copper too, it just takes an order of magnitude longer than it does aluminum. If you don't lap the IHS down to the bare copper, it should be less vulnerable to erosion because it is nickel plated. Same goes for the coldplate of your cooler if it's nickel plated.

For my own build, I'm going with CLU on die, but paste like PK-3 or MX-4 between IHS and cooler. Mainly for ease of use and because I don't want to deal with polishing hardened CLU off the surfaces in the future. I can live with the 2C difference.


----------



## Rayleyne

Not really interested in the whole membership thing, Just Delidded my 3770k Everyone said use a hammer n vice, Didn't work, Went out bought a pack of double sided wilkinson swords (Gillette product) stabbed it in all four corners, Took five minutes, Pop off went the IHS, My idle temps remained the same(Actually went up 3C but margin of error yo)

My 4.8ghz max load temperature dropped though

Arctic silver 5 on die, bare die> Swifttech apogee drive II 4.8ghz load 4 hour folding 75C, Before that it was 98C


----------



## sniggleface

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> On the die is where you get the ~20C drops - on top of the IHS you usually only see 1-2C difference from what I've read. The CLU is a pain to get off, stains things (including CPU blocks) and is conductive so it's best to just keep it under the IHS and use regular paste on top. AS5 isn't really great nowadays compared to other pastes, I'd recommend a more modern paste such as MX2 or 4, or perhaps some Shin Etsu G751 etc.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desmo808*
> 
> If your cooler has aluminum in it, use a paste between the IHS and cooler. CLU doesn't play nice with aluminum. With a copper cooler, CLU should be okay over the expected life cycle of your cpu/cooler. BUT, just be aware that CLU will harden over time and you'll have to put in some elbow grease to remove it if you ever have to uninstall the cooler in the future.
> 
> Here are two posts where someone successfully applied and removed CLU between IHS (lapped) and cooler.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/15350#post_19644142
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/13230#post_19452973
> 
> I mentioned "expected life cycle" because the gallium in CLU does eat copper too, it just takes an order of magnitude longer than it does aluminum. If you don't lap the IHS down to the bare copper, it should be less vulnerable to erosion because it is nickel plated. Same goes for the coldplate of your cooler if it's nickel plated.
> 
> For my own build, I'm going with CLU on die, but paste like PK-3 or MX-4 between IHS and cooler. Mainly for ease of use and because I don't want to deal with polishing hardened CLU off the surfaces in the future. I can live with the 2C difference.


Great info, thanks guys! OP should add this info to the first post.

Since the main source of temp drop is between the core and IHS it makes sense to just apply it there and not risk the heatsink (though they usually don't survive socket generation increments in my experience). Now it's just a matter of finding someone with a vise grip.


----------



## thestache

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hey, that was me. It was awful gigabyte bios, i think. F6 seems to work.
> 
> Belial's running 4.75 on ~1.44vcore and i should be able to do it quite a ways below 1.4*, but i'm not delidded atm. His chip's not great, just some brute force with delid and pushpushpullpull h110. I've yet to be convinced that haswell is any worse in terms of clocks than ivy, if you can handle the heat. It's ridiculous to judge an overclock on avx2 synthetics temperatures, because they'll run you over 90c on stock settings with a silver arrow, stuff like chaining cinebench runs or using x264 as a stress test give you temps that are more in the expected range and not the cpu-socket-filled-with-lava type stuff people complain about. The gap between real, full cpu loads like x264 or cinebench and synethics that abuse AVX is massive with haswell, much much bigger than previous CPU's, and it scares a lot of people off, or makes them call the chips hot/bad which is just confusing and wrong IMO. Try it yourself, i did. 3.4ghz manual, no turbo and 1v vcore with avx2 runs hotter than 4.5ghz, 1.2v running with either AVX disabled, or in something that runs a load that is not primarily avx, like cinebench/x264 as opposed to linpack.
> 
> *got 4.625 on 125mhz strap @1.25v or so.. one multi won't cost me 0.15, not even close, i played around 4.7, 4.8, 4.9 before and even when i had crazy instability i could make them work for quick passes of pretty much anything, they just had a habit of falling face first off a cliff when put under extended loads or some weird stuff like 4.7 which passed 14 hours of prime and then failed in 12 seconds with x264


I might try updating my BIOS then and see if I can't squeeze some extra out of mine then.


----------



## ozzy1925

guys after i failed deliding my i3770k with razor i will get a new chip but i have some questions :the latest i3770k chips are costa rica or malaysia?This time i will try vice method is this much safer than razor?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys after i failed deliding my i3770k with razor i will get a new chip but i have some questions :the latest i3770k chips are costa rica or malaysia?This time i will try vice method is this much safer than razor?


Seems like alot are still CR rather the ML. Try the vice method, seemed the first time your hand wasn't steady enough.

@Everyone,
Can someone recommend me an amazing computer/gaming chair? Not too expensive but I am willing to spend a few hundred on it if it's completely worth it. I am young so no need for lumbar support and stuff.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys after i failed deliding my i3770k with razor i will get a new chip but i have some questions :the latest i3770k chips are costa rica or malaysia?This time i will try vice method is this much safer than razor?


Just look at the batch number, you can tell which year which week the CPU was assembled. (2nd digit for year, 3rd and 4rth for week)

I'd say go for the vice since you've proved you're not a master of the razor.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Desmo808*
> 
> If your cooler has aluminum in it, use a paste between the IHS and cooler. CLU doesn't play nice with aluminum. With a copper cooler, CLU should be okay over the expected life cycle of your cpu/cooler. BUT, just be aware that CLU will harden over time and you'll have to put in some elbow grease to remove it if you ever have to uninstall the cooler in the future.
> 
> Here are two posts where someone successfully applied and removed CLU between IHS (lapped) and cooler.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/15350#post_19644142
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/13230#post_19452973
> 
> *I mentioned "expected life cycle" because the gallium in CLU does eat copper too, it just takes an order of magnitude longer than it does aluminum. If you don't lap the IHS down to the bare copper, it should be less vulnerable to erosion because it is nickel plated. Same goes for the coldplate of your cooler if it's nickel plated.*
> 
> For my own build, I'm going with CLU on die, but paste like PK-3 or MX-4 between IHS and cooler. Mainly for ease of use and because I don't want to deal with polishing hardened CLU off the surfaces in the future. I can live with the 2C difference.


How much corrosion are we talking about here? Is it something that would easily go away with P1200 sandpaper and above or does it corrode deeper?

I'm mainly concerned about my waterblock, but it seems my CPU's IHS is vulnerable too since it's lapped.

Anyone with a deadly scratched 3770K wants to donate an extra IHS for me?


----------



## AlDyer

I love how everyone wears gloves and takes super delicate preventative actions and cover the "VRM"s (they ain't vrms). I took a heavy duty vice from the garage, a block of wood from the shed, went inside, clamped the cpu on to the vice, and smashed it. Came off perfectly fine and temps are brilliant. You have to be quite a genius to manage to destroy it.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> How much corrosion are we talking about here? Is it something that would easily go away with P1200 sandpaper and above or does it corrode deeper?
> 
> I'm mainly concerned about my waterblock, but it seems my CPU's IHS is vulnerable too since it's lapped.


Some guy said he used it multiple times and over a long time and all stains always go away completely with metal polish and an hour of rubbing. That's just what I think I remember. I also don't know if that was talk about stains on the nickel surface of IHS and a typical cooler's base plate or a naked copper surface.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Wow it's been a while since I've popped in thread...wut's new peeps? Anything new to know about delidding Haswell chips?
> 
> I just saw the dental floss idea that's a very interesting thought.


Where you been at man?!


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Some guy said he used it multiple times and over a long time and all stains always go away completely with metal polish and an hour of rubbing. That's just what I think I remember. I also don't know if that was talk about stains on the nickel surface of IHS and a typical cooler's base plate or a naked copper surface.


I think you're talking about justanoldman. He's the one who posted pictures before and after cleaning with metal polish and alcohol. He was just cleaning stains though, no corrosion was noticable and he had the CLU on for quite a while. (IIRC he also had a lapped CPU)


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rayleyne*
> 
> Not really interested in the whole membership thing, Just Delidded my 3770k Everyone said use a hammer n vice, Didn't work, Went out bought a pack of double sided wilkinson swords (Gillette product) stabbed it in all four corners, Took five minutes, Pop off went the IHS, My idle temps remained the same(Actually went up 3C but margin of error yo)
> 
> My 4.8ghz max load temperature dropped though
> 
> Arctic silver 5 on die, bare die> Swifttech apogee drive II 4.8ghz load 4 hour folding 75C, Before that it was 98C


I tried AS5 on die and IHS at one point when I was waiting for CLU. The temp difference was extreme. I would get CLU soon if I were you.


----------



## ozzy1925

off topic question :after doing some search i4770k is 25$ expensive than i3770k but as i saw i4770k is not o/c friendly . Lets say 3770k 4.80mhz and 4770k 4.50mhz which one will get better benchmark results?also i have maximus v formula board thinking of selling it to get 4770k.Is it really worth upgrading?


----------



## neofury

I'd have to imagine a 4770k at 4.8ghz is like a 3770k at 5.25ghz if I'm just going based on the ~10% performance increase from Ivy to Haswell, but maybe somebody more in the know can chime in.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I tried AS5 on die and IHS at one point when I was waiting for CLU. The temp difference was extreme. I would get CLU soon if I were you.


This is what I don't get, I had 17* drop with Gelid on ihs and die. Clu only brought temps down by another 3*. Either I have a great example of ihs / die mating or my wb and ihs mate extremely well or ..... people just have issues with initial tim application.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> This is what I don't get, I had 17* drop with Gelid on ihs and die. Clu only brought temps down by another 3*. Either I have a great example of ihs / die mating or my wb and ihs mate extremely well or ..... people just have issues with initial tim application.


For me with all the same settings, I'd hit TJmax with AS5 on the die, when I used CLU I got 85 tops.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> off topic question :after doing some search i4770k is 25$ expensive than i3770k but as i saw i4770k is not o/c friendly . Lets say 3770k 4.80mhz and 4770k 4.50mhz which one will get better benchmark results?also i have maximus v formula board thinking of selling it to get 4770k.Is it really worth upgrading?


You're right it can be harder to OC Haswell, but clock for clock Haswell has a good jump in performance.

My 3770k @ 4.6 did 107-108 Gflops at most in IBT, my 4770k @ 4.4 does 126. No need to go chasing the dragon with Haswell clocks, its going to be faster. Most of the benefits come on the Z87 platform as well.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> This is what I don't get, I had 17* drop with Gelid on ihs and die. Clu only brought temps down by another 3*. Either I have a great example of ihs / die mating or my wb and ihs mate extremely well or ..... people just have issues with initial tim application.


When I delidded my 3770k and used CLP on the die and IHS my temps went down 27C at full load. That was enough to sell me.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> This is what I don't get, I had 17* drop with Gelid on ihs and die. Clu only brought temps down by another 3*. Either I have a great example of ihs / die mating or my wb and ihs mate extremely well or ..... people just have issues with initial tim application.


I'm currently running comparisons of a few different TIMs and Gelid GC-Extreme is one of them. I hope I get similar results to you (but I won't count on it)


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> This is what I don't get, I had 17* drop with Gelid on ihs and die. Clu only brought temps down by another 3*. Either I have a great example of ihs / die mating or my wb and ihs mate extremely well or ..... people just have issues with initial tim application.


I think it is much easier to mess up the applicaton of regular TIM on the die than it is with liquid metal. A perfect application of regular TIM can drop temps similar to liquid metal, but a bad application won't drop temps nearly as much. It's easy to use too much or not enough regular TIM - liquid metal seems to be easier to do consistently.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Regular TIM is more likely to push out and leave spaces after a period of time. Your temps could be great for a week, then BAM, you're hitting TJMax. Not fun.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Regular TIM is more likely to push out and leave spaces after a period of time. Your temps could be great for a week, then BAM, you're hitting TJMax. Not fun.


That's what happened to me. Be careful with regular paste.


----------



## sinnedone

Add me...









OCN name: sinnedone
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.6
Temp drops: 18c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

The results of a vice method:

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sinnedone/media/Old Computer/IMAG17011_zps1cd2ac0e.jpg.html

Before:

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sin...a-4b5e-aebd-ca4e8ccfde3b_zps9a7ad24c.jpg.html

After:

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sin...8-4c91-badc-eaf71224e86a_zpse7b425cf.jpg.html


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Hey guys! Two days ago I posted saying "YOLO, going in the vice now". Within 5 minutes of posting that I was done.
> 
> I have some tips for and info on the vice method for people who have never done it, or are still afraid of this method. For the record, I successfully delided my 3770K with a THICK box cutting razor. There was not a scratch on the PCB, and it took me all of 5 minutes. I'll admit I was careless, but I'm damn good with my hands.
> 
> Onto the vice method!
> 
> For those that don't want to buy a Vice, or think that the razor method is cheaper and safer, THINK AGAIN! Two days ago I bought a 4" Drill Press Vice from Lowe's for $19. The Part number is BV-DP40. This is probably the best vice for the job. And for all you people who don't want to drop $20 on a vice just to delid, Lowe's has a 90 day return policy! I don't feel guilty about returning the vice because: 1. The box is in perfect condition, 2. The vice jaws were covered in blue painters tape to protect both the jaws, and my IHS, and 3. The vice has not a scratch on it, and was never bolted to a bench/ table. So after you're done, return it! That's a free delid folks.
> 
> Here's the vice I used. It's 30 on amazon, but only $19 at Lowe's! And at Lowe's you have 90 days to return it.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-BV-DP40-Drill-Press-Vise/dp/B0057PUDLY
> 
> Onward. Here's how I positioned the vice. The operation was completed on my kitchen counter. I have a board underneath the vice to protect my counter, and a board held vertically behind the vice that serves two purposes. 1: To protect my kitchen counter molding, and 2: To give the vice a solid backing, since all of the force will be directed that way.
> 
> With this setup, the vice will not move, and will be just as secure as if it were bolted to a work bench.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for the positioning of the IHS in the vice. I haven't seen this discussed much so I'll add my suggestion for how it should be placed. For Haswell, secure the IHS in the vice so that the VRM side is facing you, meaning you will be hitting the VRM side with your block.
> 
> Why? Because this minimizes the risk of both the VRM's and the Die itself from hitting anything after it is free of the IHS. Take a look in my pictures at the layout of the 4770k after I crack it open. You'll see that the side of the chip which has the most clearance between the die and the edge of the PCB or IHS is the side opposite that of the VRM side. You want to hit the VRM side because once your chip is free it will move forward, and when oriented this way your VRM's and die are furthest from the threats they are approaching. For Ivy, just make sure your vice is clamping the flanged sides of the IHS, this will allow the most safety clearance for the die. Phew that was a lengthy explanation for such a simple concept. Here's an example of how a 4770K/4670K should be clamped.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now for what material your hitting block should be made of. PINE. That's it, no other woods, don't even think about it. Pine is soft enough to not damage the PCB, yet strong enough to break the seal easily. Use a section of 2x4 (Two by Four) with nice square edges. I'd recommend a length no shorter than 8", and no longer than 14". The shorter the block, the less force it can absorb meaning the PCB will take more brute force. Too long, and it may become difficult to hold and control.
> 
> Now hold the block, with its clean flat and square side, directly parallel to the PCB. Apply pressure towards the PCB with your hand, this eliminates the chance of the block slipping off, or a slapping effect on the PCB which we DO NOT WANT.
> 
> Hit the thing, hard. However technique is also involved in this stage. When you're hitting a nail, you swing hard and follow through; the point being to drive the nail with the follow through of your hammer's blow. This isn't the type of swing you want. We want concise yet powerful taps, no follow through. If you hit the PCB with a full blown nail driving follow through, you'll send it flying. Bad. So to reiterate: Strong, yet controlled and concise hits. Your PCB should be free in a few hits, and it shouldn't even go flying if you follow this technique. When I did mine, the PCB broke free and rested right on top on the IHS, no drama whatsoever.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After the PCB was free I inspected the edge that was hit. It was immaculate, not even a micro-scratch or dent to be seen. My block of wood (2x4 cut in half laying in my garage, PINE) took all the force. You can see here how the block fared afterwards. This proves that the PCB is much stronger than pine.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for cleaning off the glue, I've heard some people complain saying it's hard to get off. >_> Get real. Use the corner of a credit card and scrape it off. Scrape as hard as you want, I promise you the plastic your card is made of WILL NOT scratch the PCB, even if you tried.
> 
> In conclusion, I've done both methods. Use a vice. It's safer, its faster, and it can even be cheaper if you have no qualms about returning your $20 vice.
> 
> Hope this post wan't too long, and that it helps some of you out. Happy deliding. I'll post my results and validation here in a few minutes.


Not sure it's really worth it to return the vice. Besides it adds to your toolchest for future projects that may require one. Great tutorial though. I'll probably use this method when I am finally able to do one.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> See the list in the OP regarding temp drops (both on Ivy and Haswell).
> 
> As for lapping I don't think it offers more than 1-2C of improvement. I lapped my 3770K since I damaged the IHS with the vice and didn't get any better temps than other people using the same paste without lapping.
> 
> So I would say save your time and just delid. Lap if you need to but it's not worth it if you don't.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Check the top of the IHS with a flat surface like the edge of a razor blade, it it is pretty flat lapping doesn't help that much.
> If it is like a mountain range with light beaming though between the blade & IHS (not common but happens), lapping can help.


Thanks guys for the input. I've lapped CPUs' before so I know what I am doing in that regard. My 955 and 945 chips were both lapped. Was gonna do my 1100T but hadda RMA it and now I am looking at going with Haswell for the new system and hold off on the 1100T for now.

I have some Shin Etsu G751 laying about that I'll probably be using but I'm wondering if it would be better to reglue the lid back onto the IHS? Since all we're doing is replacing the TIM?

Or is everything moot after the operation like when I lapp my CPUs'?









~Ceadder


----------



## sinnedone

If you find a glue that looks similar and bites like the original let me know.

There's a lot of pressure you you clamp the cpu into the motherboard so I don't know if any ol glue will do.


----------



## maynard14

hi there! finally my clp arrive this morning! question guys,..

should i use the q tips that clp comes with or instead use this for much easier application of the clp to the die

http://www.stationeryart.com/productimages/pentel/zbs6/10_1.jpg


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> hi there! finally my clp arrive this morning! question guys,..
> 
> should i use the q tips that clp comes with or instead use this for much easier application of the clp to the die
> 
> http://www.stationeryart.com/productimages/pentel/zbs6/10_1.jpg


About a week back, someone on here recommended a foam makeup applicator. I tried it yesterday and it worked better than expected. I felt i could spread the CLU much more evenly and precise. Plus it doesn't leave any fibers behind like a cotton swab. I highly recommend it.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I have some Shin Etsu G751 laying about that I'll probably be using but I'm wondering if it would be better to reglue the lid back onto the IHS? Since all we're doing is replacing the TIM?
> 
> Or is everything moot after the operation like when I lapp my CPUs'?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I was thinking the same but it would be hard to put enough pressure on the lid to get the same result as Intel. You also will be adding extra gap between the die and IHS which is exactly the reason why we delid (not just to change the TIM). If your lid is in good condition you could try gluing it back on using some black glue (IIRC people had found similar glue to what Intel uses, google it) and using the socket clamp for pressure.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> About a week back, someone on here recommended a foam makeup applicator. I tried it yesterday and it worked better than expected. I felt i could spread the CLU much more evenly and precise. Plus it doesn't leave any fibers behind like a cotton swab. I highly recommend it.


allright sir! im going to buy that later,.. thank you


----------



## nodnarb

Just finished Delidding my 4770k here are some pics:


Just after delidding, cleaning off TIM and glue.


Tools I used:
-Vice from Lowe's ($19.99)
-2 Clamps from Lowe's ($4.99 each)
-Block of wood ($1)
-Electrical Tape ($0.70)
-Hammer (I owned)
-Towels to protect table and catch CPU if it went flying
-Old Gift Card to scrape off Glue


Tape to protect Heat Spreader


How I clamped the vice to the table.
2 clamps on 1 side secured it very well it did not move at all. I figured it was the best way to do it since the only place I had to do it was on my dining room table in my apartment.


TIM applied to CPU, I used CooLaboratory Liquid Ultra
It comes with all the tools to apply it evenly, there is even a video on their website showing you how to do it.


TIM applied to Heat Spreader.
I did this after I installed it in my motherboard to make it a bit easier.


The edge of the Heat Spreader got slightly damaged when I hammered it. A small amount of the nickel plating got pushed up a little bit on the edge.
I used some fine grit sand paper to get it level again, it looks quite bad in this picture. But I assure you it was very smooth to the touch and level again.

Everything seemed to work out fine with the Vice method. The chip did not go flying off or anything, just a few hits with the hammer and it was loose enough to just pull off.

Got it validated 4.8ghz @ 1.33v. Now it's time for some stress tests.


Thanks for all the tips and info from this tread, couldn't do it without you guys!


----------



## Turt1e

I delidded my 4670K but my temps seem to be the same if not worse. It's throttling at 4.6 and 1.37v. Used Swiftech TIM Mate 2 on die and MX-4 on the IHS


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> I delidded my 4670K but my temps seem to be the same if not worse. It's throttling at 4.6 and 1.37v. Used Swiftech TIM Mate 2 on die and MX-4 on the IHS


Try redoing the TIM between the die and the IHS. If you don't use liquid metal it is easy to mess that part up.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Damn jumping back in this thread is making me want to delid the 3770k that's been sitting in my VM server for the past few months. I haven't even tried to OC it yet so I don't even know how good it is but after delidding my first 3770k and three 3570k's with such success...why not?

I don't have a vice ATM...any suggestions on a cheap one?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Add me...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: sinnedone
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.6
> Temp drops: 18c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> The results of a vice method:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sinnedone/media/Old Computer/IMAG17011_zps1cd2ac0e.jpg.html
> 
> Before:
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sin...a-4b5e-aebd-ca4e8ccfde3b_zps9a7ad24c.jpg.html
> 
> After:
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sin...8-4c91-badc-eaf71224e86a_zpse7b425cf.jpg.html


You Sir are in!









I need to find me a good daily mobo for my Ivy cpu as my mobo needs to go to RMA..... any recommendations fellas?


----------



## MiiX

Why do some use the IHS and some dont?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Why do some use the IHS and some dont?


You need something special to make it work without IHS. A special mounting kit for your water cooling block for example. The height is simply different.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Why do some use the IHS and some dont?


Some want even lower temps by ignoring the IHS copper heat dissipation and going straight to the cooling unit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You need something special to make it work without IHS. A special mounting kit for your water cooling block for example. The height is simply different.


Not nessasarily, most blocks will do it no problem it's a matter of getting the pressure right. I could do it with my H100 but I'd have to get it just right.


----------



## MiiX

So do you belive that the Swiftech Apogee Drive II will manage to do the trick? It seems like its just to screw it a bit tighter on each nut?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Add me...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: sinnedone
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.6
> Temp drops: 18c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> The results of a vice method:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sinnedone/media/Old Computer/IMAG17011_zps1cd2ac0e.jpg.html
> 
> Before:
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sin...a-4b5e-aebd-ca4e8ccfde3b_zps9a7ad24c.jpg.html
> 
> After:
> 
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/sin...8-4c91-badc-eaf71224e86a_zpse7b425cf.jpg.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You Sir are in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need to find me a good daily mobo for my Ivy cpu as my mobo needs to go to RMA..... any recommendations fellas?
Click to expand...

Good daily motherboard? Best motherboard price/perf ratio will always be the Maximus V Gene. You can get a great deal on it a lot of times now since it's been transitioned to Haswell... If you want cheaper, look at the Gigabyte boards for $100 but you can easily get an MVG for $140 or less...


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> So do you belive that the Swiftech Apogee Drive II will manage to do the trick? It seems like its just to screw it a bit tighter on each nut?


Nope, the AD2 threads stop at a certain point, which is enough to put sufficient pressure on the IHS, but not far enough if your IHS is missing. You'd need a copper shim to bridge the gap, so you might as well use the IHS which is copper and the exact width


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> So do you belive that the Swiftech Apogee Drive II will manage to do the trick? It seems like its just to screw it a bit tighter on each nut?


I see someone posted on this already but that thing is heavy as heck I wouldn't put a pump/block combo on a die at all...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Good daily motherboard? Best motherboard price/perf ratio will always be the Maximus V Gene. You can get a great deal on it a lot of times now since it's been transitioned to Haswell... If you want cheaper, look at the Gigabyte boards for $100 but you can easily get an MVG for $140 or less...


I've been looking at that one.. but I want 3 monitors this time instead of 1, sick of not enough space for stuff, and I'm using my 7970L only for LN2 benching now so i need a new gpu or gpu's....... I want enough vram for GPU's and such I do not want to run out of GPU RAM.... this is driving me up the wall... the monitors will be 23" and 1920 x 1080 (1440p is far to exspensive to get 3 new monitors) ((plus meh))


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You Sir are in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I need to find me a good daily mobo for my Ivy cpu as my mobo needs to go to RMA..... any recommendations fellas?


I use asus maximus v formula and i love it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> I use asus maximus v formula and i love it.


do you? I'm really looking into that one as well and thinking dual asus dcII 7950's with that bad boy...







but I might be being stupid on the gpus stuff here 1 gpu would be pretty cool not particular to amd or nvidia. Remember 3 monitors need dat GPU RAM









this will all be in a Cosmos 2 btw... yeah I got that monster of a case...


----------



## Daredevil 720

Get a Maximus V Extreme if you're not that budget limited, you won't regret it. Got mine dirt cheap (200 euros) used.


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Damn jumping back in this thread is making me want to delid the 3770k that's been sitting in my VM server for the past few months. I haven't even tried to OC it yet so I don't even know how good it is but after delidding my first 3770k and three 3570k's with such success...why not?
> 
> I don't have a vice ATM...any suggestions on a cheap one?


Definitely go with a "drill press" style vise.









http://www.homedepot.com/p/Irwin-4-in-Drill-Press-Vise-226340/100578950#.UfOuno3Ovkg

http://www.menards.com/main/tools-hardware/hand-tools/fastening-tools/performax-drill-press-vise/p-1655297-c-9135.htm

http://www.lowes.com/pd_209460-52800-BV-DP40_0__?Ntt=209460&UserSearch=209460&productId=3053485&rpp=32


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> Definitely go with a "drill press" style *vise*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.homedepot.com/p/Irwin-4-in-Drill-Press-Vise-226340/100578950#.UfOuno3Ovkg
> 
> http://www.menards.com/main/tools-hardware/hand-tools/fastening-tools/performax-drill-press-vise/p-1655297-c-9135.htm
> 
> http://www.lowes.com/pd_209460-52800-BV-DP40_0__?Ntt=209460&UserSearch=209460&productId=3053485&rpp=32


OMG I just realized I've been typing vise wrong all this time. "Vice"...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Get a Maximus V Extreme if you're not that budget limited, you won't regret it. Got mine dirt cheap (200 euros) used.


lol i kinda wanna splerge on it but I have 1600 left.. the thing is though I'll need another psu, moar RAM (like thats much lol







) a new Marksman LN2 pot (300 bucks) ((can't go without)) then need new gpu... ugh and the 2 other monitors i choose are 340 total....

so basically 640 is taken.... crap forgot about a haswi chip... Swag i need to talk to you about checking your MC for a few certain batches for me if you could?

so basically.... ugh

like 900 is taken. need mobo, psu and baller gpu....


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> I love how everyone wears gloves and takes super delicate preventative actions and cover the "VRM"s (they ain't vrms). I took a heavy duty vice from the garage, a block of wood from the shed, went inside, clamped the cpu on to the vice, and smashed it. Came off perfectly fine and temps are brilliant. You have to be quite a genius to manage to destroy it.


This, it isn't rocket science people.

And it has been posted countless times they are not VRM so why do people keep on insisting that they are?


----------



## maynard14

hi there!

i just tried and put some clp on the die on my 3570k

my problem is i dont see any diff between noctua nth1 and clp

here is my die oicture with clp:



do i need to put more clp or thats enough?


----------



## Jetskyer

Did you spread a bit of CLP on the inner side of the IHS as well? If you didn't that should probably give you a nice temp drop.
Also make sure you have a good mount of your cooler on the IHS


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Did you spread a bit of CLP on the inner side of the IHS as well? If you didn't that should probably give you a nice temp drop.
> Also make sure you have a good mount of your cooler on the IHS


no sir i didnt know that,.. ahah

shoulkd i remove the one that i applied or should i just add clp on the sides?

i put noctua nth1 on ihs using h100i


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> no sir i didnt know that,.. ahah
> 
> shoulkd i remove the one that i applied or should i just add clp on the sides?
> 
> i put noctua nth1 on ihs using h100i


Removing shouldn't be necessary, a little 'touching up' should do just fine. Don't put too much on the inside of the IHS, only a minor 'staining' is fine, definitely not the same amount as used on the die.


----------



## maynard14

thank you sir....i will try it now...thank you....


----------



## maynard14

2 c drops i think.. haha

but still here is my temp;

4.3 ghz vcore of 1.27 i know its a little high i think i have a bad chip


----------



## Jetskyer

Is that while running IBT or Prime95?


----------



## maynard14

no sir huhuhu its just sit @ idle no prime95 nor ibt


----------



## Jetskyer

Ah, that explains.
At idle you'll barely see a temp drop if any, load temp is where it's at, so your application probably is just fine.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Ah, that explains.
> At idle you'll barely see a temp drop if any, load temp is where it's at, so your application probably is just fine.


hmmm i just need to read more,.. to many things i dont know,.. so you mean sir my idle is normal? @! 4.3 ghz and 1.27 volts?

i will try my load temp later


----------



## Mogwaii

Forget idle , test load temp thats what matters
Atm testing my i5 @ 4700 mhz 1,336 vcore ambient temp 30c. Cpu temp atm 55-60c 100% load


----------



## maynard14

i tried 4.5 ghz and 1.3650 volts coz this is the only way to boot at 4.5 ghz i still get whea erros bit my highest load temp is 60c! im really impress with clp. thank you guys i hope someday i will find the sweet spot on my 3570k @ 4.5 ghz and no whea errors.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Did you spread a bit of CLP on the inner side of the IHS as well? If you didn't that should probably give you a nice temp drop.
> Also make sure you have a good mount of your cooler on the IHS


I didn't do that either but my temps are more than fine I reckon, I don't think it's necessary to spread it on the inside of the IHS but ofcourse it does no harm doing so either.

And yeah, there should be a difference between CLP/CLU and any other paste.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> I didn't do that either but my temps are more than fine I reckon, I don't think it's necessary to spread it on the inside of the IHS but ofcourse it does no harm doing so either.
> 
> And yeah, there should be a difference between CLP/CLU and any other paste.


yes sir i already tried putting just a little cpl on the side of the die and my temps are amazing now eveb @ 4.5 ghz and 1.3700 volts. my chip is a bad chip coz of the high voltage required for it to be stable @ 4.5 ghz. im still testing it with prime 95 now no whea errors still n my load highest temp is 61 c only.


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> yes sir i already tried putting just a little cpl on the side of the die and my temps are amazing now eveb @ 4.5 ghz and 1.3700 volts. my chip is a bad chip coz of the high voltage required for it to be stable @ 4.5 ghz. im still testing it with prime 95 now no whea errors still n my load highest temp is 61 c only.


Define "clp on the side of the die?

did u put extra so it cover the side on the core, or do you ment inside of ihs? =)


----------



## HairyGamer

Am I in?









*OCN name:* HairyGamer
*CPU:* 4770K
*on die-TIM:* CLP
*ihs-TIM:* MX4
*Mhz gained:* 200MHz
*OC after delid:* 4.7GHz
*Temp drops:* 24C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2874907

*4700/3500/1866*


*10.19pts on Cinebench*


*Multiplier:* 47
*Uncore:* 35
*Vcore:* 1.375v (1.406v under AVX)
*Vrin:* 1.90-1.96v
*RAM:* 1866 (10-12-12-31 2T) F3-2400C10D-8GTX
*Stability:* OCCT Linpack capable AVX 6hrs: ~80C average ~95C max ~30C idle with 67F ambient
*Batch:* L312B326 (Shipped from Newegg Edison NJ warehouse ~37 days ago.)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Am I in?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* HairyGamer
> *CPU:* 4770K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* MX4
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHz
> *OC after delid:* 4.7GHz
> *Temp drops:* 24C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2874907
> 
> *4700/3500/1866*
> 
> 
> *10.19pts on Cinebench*
> 
> 
> *Multiplier:* 47
> *Uncore:* 35
> *Vcore:* 1.375v (1.406v under AVX)
> *Vrin:* 1.90-1.96v
> *RAM:* 1866 (10-12-12-31 2T) F3-2400C10D-8GTX
> *Stability:* OCCT Linpack capable AVX 6hrs: ~80C average ~95C max ~30C idle with 67F ambient
> *Batch:* L312B326 (Shipped from Newegg Edison NJ warehouse ~37 days ago.)
> 
> [/quote
> 
> You are in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was hoping to have some help on a choice of gpus to help vagur out........ sadness


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Am I in?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* HairyGamer
> *CPU:* 4770K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* MX4
> *Mhz gained:* 200MHz
> *OC after delid:* 4.7GHz
> *Temp drops:* 24C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2874907
> 
> *4700/3500/1866*
> 
> 
> *10.19pts on Cinebench*
> 
> 
> *Multiplier:* 47
> *Uncore:* 35
> *Vcore:* 1.375v (1.406v under AVX)
> *Vrin:* 1.90-1.96v
> *RAM:* 1866 (10-12-12-31 2T) F3-2400C10D-8GTX
> *Stability:* OCCT Linpack capable AVX 6hrs: ~80C average ~95C max ~30C idle with 67F ambient
> *Batch:* L312B326 (Shipped from Newegg Edison NJ warehouse ~37 days ago.)


Heya, if you're testing with AVX could you download the avx2 linpack and check your temps/stability etc?

You'd probably have to drop 200mhz for avx2


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> So do you belive that the Swiftech Apogee Drive II will manage to do the trick? It seems like its just to screw it a bit tighter on each nut?
> 
> 
> 
> I see someone posted on this already but that thing is heavy as heck I wouldn't put a pump/block combo on a die at all...
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Good daily motherboard? Best motherboard price/perf ratio will always be the Maximus V Gene. You can get a great deal on it a lot of times now since it's been transitioned to Haswell... If you want cheaper, look at the Gigabyte boards for $100 but you can easily get an MVG for $140 or less...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I've been looking at that one.. but I want 3 monitors this time instead of 1, sick of not enough space for stuff, and I'm using my 7970L only for LN2 benching now so i need a new gpu or gpu's....... I want enough vram for GPU's and such I do not want to run out of GPU RAM.... this is driving me up the wall... the monitors will be 23" and 1920 x 1080 (1440p is far to exspensive to get 3 new monitors) ((plus meh))
Click to expand...

Are you using a big air cooler right now?


----------



## tw33k

Liquid Ultra vs Liquid Pro vs Phobya Liquid Metal


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Heya, if you're testing with AVX could you download the avx2 linpack and check your temps/stability etc?
> 
> You'd probably have to drop 200mhz for avx2


AVX2 script from Intel only runs two cores at 100% and the other two just bounce around at whatever percentage they want... I'm not the first one to report this behavior. So no, actually, temps are lower than on AVX with OCCT and OCCT finds instabilities faster than the AVX2 script does because the script only loads 50% of the CPU on my system and every other one I've seen


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> AVX2 script from Intel only runs two cores at 100% and the other two just bounce around at whatever percentage they want... I'm not the first one to report this behavior. So no, actually, temps are lower than on AVX with OCCT and OCCT finds instabilities faster than the AVX2 script does because the script only loads 50% of the CPU on my system and every other one I've seen


Looking at the command line & it says you have to change it to set the right number of cores & threads to stress, did you set it for 8 threads?


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looking at the command line & it says you have to change it to set the right number of cores & threads to stress, did you set it for 8 threads?


Nope, because the instructions I found for running it never mentioned that.

I'll give that a shot, thanks









*Edit:* Here's what it had set already - that look correct? Where would I "set" these values? I don't see a config file


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Nope, because the instructions I found for running it never mentioned that.
> 
> I'll give that a shot, thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Edit:* Here's what it had set already - that look correct? Where would I "set" these values? I don't see a config file


Try editing the rune_xeon64.bat file to this (or make a new batch file):

Code:



Code:


@echo off
SETLOCAL

rem Setting up affinity for better threading performance
set KMP_AFFINITY=nowarnings,compact,granularity=fine
rem Setting path to OpenMP library
set PATH=..\..\..\redist\intel64\compiler;%PATH%

echo Running linpack_xeon64.exe. Output can be found in win_xeon64.txt.
start /b /affinity 55 linpack_xeon64.exe lininput_xeon64 > win_xeon64.txt

echo.
echo When this window closes the calculation is done.

ENDLOCAL

That sets the affinity for 4 cores (basically turning off hyperthreading) and lets it run one thread per core like Intel recommends. 4 core/4 thread should give you something above 200 GFlops.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Try editing the rune_xeon64.bat file to this (or make a new batch file):
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> @echo off
> SETLOCAL
> 
> rem Setting up affinity for better threading performance
> set KMP_AFFINITY=nowarnings,compact,granularity=fine
> rem Setting path to OpenMP library
> set PATH=..\..\..\redist\intel64\compiler;%PATH%
> 
> echo Running linpack_xeon64.exe. Output can be found in win_xeon64.txt.
> start /b /affinity 55 linpack_xeon64.exe lininput_xeon64 > win_xeon64.txt
> 
> echo.
> echo When this window closes the calculation is done.
> 
> ENDLOCAL
> 
> That sets the affinity for 4 cores (basically turning off hyperthreading) and lets it run one thread per core like Intel recommends. 4 core/4 thread should give you something above 200 GFlops.


Awesome thanks a lot dude


----------



## Forceman

Be careful though, it will probably get a lot hotter than the regular batch file.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Be careful though, it will probably get a lot hotter than the regular batch file.


Lol, yessir - I figured it was going to get hotter on AVX2.



I'll be fine at 4.6 though - I'll post results in a bit.


----------



## Valgaur

@swag

H100 for cooling and I've decided a big 27" screen and one gpu but deciding what gpu still


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> @swag
> 
> H100 for cooling and I've decided a big 27" screen and one gpu but deciding what gpu still


Isn't the new line of ATI GPUs coming out soon, wait for some reviews on that.


----------



## ucantescape1992

Valgaur you never let me in








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Add me please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my second delid, just never submitted this for the first.
> 
> OCN name: Ucantescape1992
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: PK-1
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: 4.4Ghz
> Temp drops:20+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2873238


and
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Hey guys! Two days ago I posted saying "YOLO, going in the vice now". Within 5 minutes of posting that I was done.
> 
> I have some tips for and info on the vice method for people who have never done it, or are still afraid of this method. For the record, I successfully delided my 3770K with a THICK box cutting razor. There was not a scratch on the PCB, and it took me all of 5 minutes. I'll admit I was careless, but I'm damn good with my hands.
> 
> Onto the vice method!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> For those that don't want to buy a Vice, or think that the razor method is cheaper and safer, THINK AGAIN! Two days ago I bought a 4" Drill Press Vice from Lowe's for $19. The Part number is BV-DP40. This is probably the best vice for the job. And for all you people who don't want to drop $20 on a vice just to delid, Lowe's has a 90 day return policy! I don't feel guilty about returning the vice because: 1. The box is in perfect condition, 2. The vice jaws were covered in blue painters tape to protect both the jaws, and my IHS, and 3. The vice has not a scratch on it, and was never bolted to a bench/ table. So after you're done, return it! That's a free delid folks.
> 
> Here's the vice I used. It's 30 on amazon, but only $19 at Lowe's! And at Lowe's you have 90 days to return it.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-BV-DP40-Drill-Press-Vise/dp/B0057PUDLY
> 
> Onward. Here's how I positioned the vice. The operation was completed on my kitchen counter. I have a board underneath the vice to protect my counter, and a board held vertically behind the vice that serves two purposes. 1: To protect my kitchen counter molding, and 2: To give the vice a solid backing, since all of the force will be directed that way.
> 
> With this setup, the vice will not move, and will be just as secure as if it were bolted to a work bench.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for the positioning of the IHS in the vice. I haven't seen this discussed much so I'll add my suggestion for how it should be placed. For Haswell, secure the IHS in the vice so that the VRM side is facing you, meaning you will be hitting the VRM side with your block.
> 
> Why? Because this minimizes the risk of both the VRM's and the Die itself from hitting anything after it is free of the IHS. Take a look in my pictures at the layout of the 4770k after I crack it open. You'll see that the side of the chip which has the most clearance between the die and the edge of the PCB or IHS is the side opposite that of the VRM side. You want to hit the VRM side because once your chip is free it will move forward, and when oriented this way your VRM's and die are furthest from the threats they are approaching. For Ivy, just make sure your vice is clamping the flanged sides of the IHS, this will allow the most safety clearance for the die. Phew that was a lengthy explanation for such a simple concept. Here's an example of how a 4770K/4670K should be clamped.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for what material your hitting block should be made of. PINE. That's it, no other woods, don't even think about it. Pine is soft enough to not damage the PCB, yet strong enough to break the seal easily. Use a section of 2x4 (Two by Four) with nice square edges. I'd recommend a length no shorter than 8", and no longer than 14". The shorter the block, the less force it can absorb meaning the PCB will take more brute force. Too long, and it may become difficult to hold and control.
> 
> Now hold the block, with its clean flat and square side, directly parallel to the PCB. Apply pressure towards the PCB with your hand, this eliminates the chance of the block slipping off, or a slapping effect on the PCB which we DO NOT WANT.
> 
> Hit the thing, hard. However technique is also involved in this stage. When you're hitting a nail, you swing hard and follow through; the point being to drive the nail with the follow through of your hammer's blow. This isn't the type of swing you want. We want concise yet powerful taps, no follow through. If you hit the PCB with a full blown nail driving follow through, you'll send it flying. Bad. So to reiterate: Strong, yet controlled and concise hits. Your PCB should be free in a few hits, and it shouldn't even go flying if you follow this technique. When I did mine, the PCB broke free and rested right on top on the IHS, no drama whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After the PCB was free I inspected the edge that was hit. It was immaculate, not even a micro-scratch or dent to be seen. My block of wood (2x4 cut in half laying in my garage, PINE) took all the force. You can see here how the block fared afterwards. This proves that the PCB is much stronger than pine.
> 
> 
> 
> As for cleaning off the glue, I've heard some people complain saying it's hard to get off. >_> Get real. Use the corner of a credit card and scrape it off. Scrape as hard as you want, I promise you the plastic your card is made of WILL NOT scratch the PCB, even if you tried.
> 
> In conclusion, I've done both methods. Use a vice. It's safer, its faster, and it can even be cheaper if you have no qualms about returning your $20 vice.
> 
> Hope this post wan't too long, and that it helps some of you out. Happy deliding. I'll post my results and validation here in a few minutes.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Valgaur you never let me in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Add me please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is my second delid, just never submitted this for the first.
> 
> OCN name: Ucantescape1992
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: PK-1
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: 4.4Ghz
> Temp drops:20+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2873238
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ucantescape1992*
> 
> Hey guys! Two days ago I posted saying "YOLO, going in the vice now". Within 5 minutes of posting that I was done.
> 
> I have some tips for and info on the vice method for people who have never done it, or are still afraid of this method. For the record, I successfully delided my 3770K with a THICK box cutting razor. There was not a scratch on the PCB, and it took me all of 5 minutes. I'll admit I was careless, but I'm damn good with my hands.
> 
> Onto the vice method!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> For those that don't want to buy a Vice, or think that the razor method is cheaper and safer, THINK AGAIN! Two days ago I bought a 4" Drill Press Vice from Lowe's for $19. The Part number is BV-DP40. This is probably the best vice for the job. And for all you people who don't want to drop $20 on a vice just to delid, Lowe's has a 90 day return policy! I don't feel guilty about returning the vice because: 1. The box is in perfect condition, 2. The vice jaws were covered in blue painters tape to protect both the jaws, and my IHS, and 3. The vice has not a scratch on it, and was never bolted to a bench/ table. So after you're done, return it! That's a free delid folks.
> 
> Here's the vice I used. It's 30 on amazon, but only $19 at Lowe's! And at Lowe's you have 90 days to return it.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-BV-DP40-Drill-Press-Vise/dp/B0057PUDLY
> 
> Onward. Here's how I positioned the vice. The operation was completed on my kitchen counter. I have a board underneath the vice to protect my counter, and a board held vertically behind the vice that serves two purposes. 1: To protect my kitchen counter molding, and 2: To give the vice a solid backing, since all of the force will be directed that way.
> 
> With this setup, the vice will not move, and will be just as secure as if it were bolted to a work bench.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for the positioning of the IHS in the vice. I haven't seen this discussed much so I'll add my suggestion for how it should be placed. For Haswell, secure the IHS in the vice so that the VRM side is facing you, meaning you will be hitting the VRM side with your block.
> 
> Why? Because this minimizes the risk of both the VRM's and the Die itself from hitting anything after it is free of the IHS. Take a look in my pictures at the layout of the 4770k after I crack it open. You'll see that the side of the chip which has the most clearance between the die and the edge of the PCB or IHS is the side opposite that of the VRM side. You want to hit the VRM side because once your chip is free it will move forward, and when oriented this way your VRM's and die are furthest from the threats they are approaching. For Ivy, just make sure your vice is clamping the flanged sides of the IHS, this will allow the most safety clearance for the die. Phew that was a lengthy explanation for such a simple concept. Here's an example of how a 4770K/4670K should be clamped.
> 
> 
> 
> Now for what material your hitting block should be made of. PINE. That's it, no other woods, don't even think about it. Pine is soft enough to not damage the PCB, yet strong enough to break the seal easily. Use a section of 2x4 (Two by Four) with nice square edges. I'd recommend a length no shorter than 8", and no longer than 14". The shorter the block, the less force it can absorb meaning the PCB will take more brute force. Too long, and it may become difficult to hold and control.
> 
> Now hold the block, with its clean flat and square side, directly parallel to the PCB. Apply pressure towards the PCB with your hand, this eliminates the chance of the block slipping off, or a slapping effect on the PCB which we DO NOT WANT.
> 
> Hit the thing, hard. However technique is also involved in this stage. When you're hitting a nail, you swing hard and follow through; the point being to drive the nail with the follow through of your hammer's blow. This isn't the type of swing you want. We want concise yet powerful taps, no follow through. If you hit the PCB with a full blown nail driving follow through, you'll send it flying. Bad. So to reiterate: Strong, yet controlled and concise hits. Your PCB should be free in a few hits, and it shouldn't even go flying if you follow this technique. When I did mine, the PCB broke free and rested right on top on the IHS, no drama whatsoever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After the PCB was free I inspected the edge that was hit. It was immaculate, not even a micro-scratch or dent to be seen. My block of wood (2x4 cut in half laying in my garage, PINE) took all the force. You can see here how the block fared afterwards. This proves that the PCB is much stronger than pine.
> 
> 
> 
> As for cleaning off the glue, I've heard some people complain saying it's hard to get off. >_> Get real. Use the corner of a credit card and scrape it off. Scrape as hard as you want, I promise you the plastic your card is made of WILL NOT scratch the PCB, even if you tried.
> 
> In conclusion, I've done both methods. Use a vice. It's safer, its faster, and it can even be cheaper if you have no qualms about returning your $20 vice.
> 
> Hope this post wan't too long, and that it helps some of you out. Happy deliding. I'll post my results and validation here in a few minutes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

I'll put you in.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Heya, if you're testing with AVX could you download the avx2 linpack and check your temps/stability etc?
> 
> You'd probably have to drop 200mhz for avx2


Just finished up the test at 4.6GHz with a max temp of 95C and 85C average. Luckily I only had to drop it by 100MHz - It definitely got hot and needed a bit more voltage even for the lower clock though


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'll put you in.


YOU NINJA'd ME!!!










I'm gonna add that vice help/tips stuff as well


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'll put you in.
> 
> 
> 
> YOU NINJA'd ME!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm gonna add that vice help/tips stuff as well
Click to expand...

Right under your nose.







HAHAHAHA!

What monitor do you plan to get btw?


----------



## Gurkburk

I delidded yesterday. Only have normal(MX-4) paste to put on for now. My temps dropped from 100*C~ in Intelburn Test, to max 79*C~ @ 4.5Ghz/1.250V.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> I delidded yesterday. Only have normal(MX-4) paste to put on for now. My temps dropped from 100*C~ in Intelburn Test, to max 79*C~ @ 4.5Ghz/1.250V.


totally worth it now wasn't it!


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> totally worth it now wasn't it!


Haha yeah. But man was i a nervwreck when doing it..

& Especially when this happened, cause i had to take the tape off from the vyce to make it stay.



But temperatures are lower and nothings behaving out of the ordinary.


----------



## Mogwaii

Hi all.

I have a i5 3570k 100% working @ 4.6ghz 1.294 vcore , and i am trying @ 4.7ghz wich i think i am soon there , tryed alot but eventually it ends up with small amount of whea errors. Atm i am trying fixed volt 1.368vcore instead of offset , dont know if it will be ok yet But.

The question i have to all you 3770k owners out there , is the odds of finding a 3770k that clocks atleast 4.7ghz low?

I know the different between 3570 and 3770 isnt much but since haswell rls there wont be a faster cpu for my motherboard and i want to use the best if possible.

Best reguards Rickard


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> Haha yeah. But man was i a nervwreck when doing it..
> 
> & Especially when this happened, cause i had to take the tape off from the vyce to make it stay.
> 
> 
> 
> But temperatures are lower and nothings behaving out of the ordinary.


Thats not bad at all really but good thing that everything is working properly.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Hi all.
> 
> I have a i5 3570k wich i have 100% working @ 4.6ghz 1.294 vcore , and i am trying @ 4.7ghz wich i think i am soon there , tryed alot but eventually it ends up with small amount of whea errors. Atm i am trying fixed volt 1.368vcore instead of offset , dont know if it will be ok yet But.
> 
> The question i have to all you 3770k owners out there , is the odds of finding a 3770k that clocks atleast 4.7ghz low?
> 
> I know the different between 3570 and 3770 isnt much but since haswell rls there wont be a faster cpu for my motherboard and i want to use the best if possible.
> 
> Best reguards Rickard


for the i5's it shouldn't be to hard to get 4.7 I ran 4.8 giggles at I believe 1.35 on my first ivy. but I use fized voltage i don't like offset at all. so use fixed and try 4.7 at 1.38 and see how that goes. and use IBT for quick and dirty runs, try for 20-40 runs at standard. then play games, for a long time that's the best testing method.


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thats not bad at all really but good thing that everything is working properly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> for the i5's it shouldn't be to hard to get 4.7 I ran 4.8 giggles at I believe 1.35 on my first ivy. but I use fized voltage i don't like offset at all. so use fixed and try 4.7 at 1.38 and see how that goes. and use IBT for quick and dirty runs, try for 20-40 runs at standard. then play games, for a long time that's the best testing method.


Atm trying 1.384 vcore and can do IBT few runs "quick test", and playing at max res 2-3 games ,without whea errors. seems like your 1,38 seem to work, will hard test it later tonight. but if i can make it work @ 4.7ghz i dont think i am gonna buy 3770k atm since i cant be sure what clock it will manage


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Atm trying 1.384 vcore and can do IBT few runs "quick test", and playing at max res 2-3 games ,without whea errors. seems like your 1,38 seem to work, will hard test it later tonight. but if i can make it work @ 4.7ghz i dont think i am gonna buy 3770k atm since i cant be sure what clock it will manage


remember each chip is different.. if you live near a MC you can exchange them.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Just finished up the test at 4.6GHz with a max temp of 95C and 85C average. Luckily I only had to drop it by 100MHz - It definitely got hot and needed a bit more voltage even for the lower clock though


Aa that's a big difference man.. Disabled HT and dropped 100mhz and it's still 95c. You'd have to go down to 4.4 probably to get it below 90 (ht on) with delid ^.^


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Aa that's a big difference man.. Disabled HT and dropped 100mhz and it's still 95c. You'd have to go down to 4.4 probably to get it below 90 (ht on) with delid ^.^


No, 4.5 was only 86C max as it requires *way* less voltage than 4.6 and 4.7 do. I don't see a problem with 95C as that's the only test that will ever draw that kind of voltage for that long of a time - I'm a gamer and no game is going to run an AVX2 instruction over and over again like that Intel script can. Also, HT is/was not disabled - not sure where you're getting that from but CPU-Z is definitely showing 4 cores and 8 threads.

If you're referring to the test showing only 4 threads - that's a script provided by Forceman using the parameters recommended by Intel. HT is on in the BIOS.

4.6/3.5/2400 passed the Intel script three times, no errors, 95C max temp avg 85C - I'll be leaving it here 24/7 as 4.7GHz required too much voltage to comfortably pass this script.


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> remember each chip is different.. if you live near a MC you can exchange them.


What is MC? =)

The computer got whea errors @ 1.385vcore , when i got back from the store, its 36c "to hot" in my room so il continue later.

Ive ordered an Nake ivy mount kit and gonna mount it on monday i think , then i can continue with maby slightly less C.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> What is MC? =)
> 
> The computer got whea errors @ 1.385vcore , when i got back from the store, its 36c "to hot" in my room so il continue later.
> 
> Ive ordered an Nake ivy mount kit and gonna mount it on monday i think , then i can continue with maby slightly less C.


hmmmm ambients are far to high for my liking sir.... um.... MC is microcenter







did you order CLP yet?


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmmm ambients are far to high for my liking sir.... um.... MC is microcenter
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> did you order CLP yet?


To hot for me aswell. Its 30c outside atm. My cpu is delided with clu , but tomorrow i will get the naked ivy mount kit , then il remove the ihs and put the waterblock on the die. Even thoe its 36c in my room my cpu isnt passing 60c in prime @4,6ghz tbx to watercooling but i dont wanna try 4.7 at this temp, the thing is that i dont get errors when the cpu is cold , it only comes after 10-20 mins of prime like it get to hot no matter what i cool it with. I so want it to work @ 4,7 ghz







the temp isnt high at 4,7 either ~ 65c.

And with my luck i will surely get a bad i7 3770 if i was to get 1 and try vs my i5 .
After all its like 270 euro and what if i get a sample that wont pass 4,5


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> No, 4.5 was only 86C max as it requires *way* less voltage than 4.6 and 4.7 do. I don't see a problem with 95C as that's the only test that will ever draw that kind of voltage for that long of a time - I'm a gamer and no game is going to run an AVX2 instruction over and over again like that Intel script can. Also, HT is/was not disabled - not sure where you're getting that from but CPU-Z is definitely showing 4 cores and 8 threads.
> 
> If you're referring to the test showing only 4 threads - that's a script provided by Forceman using the parameters recommended by Intel. HT is on in the BIOS.
> 
> 4.6/3.5/2400 passed the Intel script three times, no errors, 95C max temp avg 85C - I'll be leaving it here 24/7 as 4.7GHz required too much voltage to comfortably pass this script.


I meant that you can use other parameters (8 thread) and get it a good 10c hotter. Personally i chose to ignore such results as long as they don't affect me, because they are so wildly different from other stuff, for example this script on 3.4ghz, 1v vcore runs about as hot as 4.5ghz, 1.2-1.25v in x264, which is the most cpu intensive thing i planned to use - basing on Avx2 or even standard avx temps on haswell means that you basically can't overclock without delid, as stock settings (1.127vcore bios 3.7ghz four core turbo) runs into the 85-95c range with a silver arrow while other temperatures are exactly where they would be expected to be

It's really important to note what you are using and how you are stress testing with haswell, 1000x more than prev gen cpu's


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I think it is much easier to mess up the applicaton of regular TIM on the die than it is with liquid metal. A perfect application of regular TIM can drop temps similar to liquid metal, but a bad application won't drop temps nearly as much. It's easy to use too much or not enough regular TIM - liquid metal seems to be easier to do consistently.


I totally agree. There is a lot of user error in application. I have spent the past year and a half buying, testing and selling 1090's and 1100t's. I just got on Intel 3 months ago. I couldn't count the number of times that I've applied tim and feel i got it down pretty good. It doesn't bother me if someone can't beleive you can get good temp drops on reg. tim, but then again, i don't think most have applied it the amount of times I have or played with as many chips. One of the main advantages to CLP or CLU is that it spreads really thin on its own. More viscous reg. tim doesn't and takes a bit more to get it thin. I think most people error on the side of too much. A great trick for helping reg tim is to put it in a plastic bag in hot water for 15-20 and it thins out a lot. I've recommended Gelid since I first got and have used it almost exclusively since.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I meant that you can use other parameters (8 thread) and get it a good 10c hotter. Personally i chose to ignore such results as long as they don't affect me, because they are so wildly different from other stuff, for example this script on 3.4ghz, 1v vcore runs about as hot as 4.5ghz, 1.2-1.25v in x264, which is the most cpu intensive thing i planned to use - basing on Avx2 or even standard avx temps on haswell means that you basically can't overclock without delid, as stock settings (1.127vcore bios 3.7ghz four core turbo) runs into the 85-95c range with a silver arrow while other temperatures are exactly where they would be expected to be
> 
> It's really important to note what you are using and how you are stress testing with haswell, 1000x more than prev gen cpu's


I agree.. I figure if I'm AVX2 stable and able to keep temps in check then for gaming I'm super stable and will be plenty comfortable on temps. I could game at 4.7GHz but technically I wouldn't be 100% stable unless I could pass any test/instruction my CPU was capable of - in this case AVX2 happens to be the most stressful thing our CPU's can do so it makes sense to me to test with it I suppose.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmmm ambients are far to high for my liking sir.... um.... MC is microcenter
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> did you order CLP yet?


Hey Val - ... what CPU did you end up running for your summer-built (and how many did you try out at M-C







) ? Also per your earlier post re 27 inch monitor, I got a couple of 27 inch Samsung LEDs (1080p/HDMI) I picked up on sale in the $250 range last December and am really happy with for both productivity software and gaming.


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Should I try my luck de-lidding a 3770K that can't get past 4.3ghz?

Overclock stability requirements: Needs to pass 12 hours of Prime95 and no WHEA errors.


----------



## sinnedone

what are your ambient and load temps?
what is your load voltage?
what cpu cooler you using?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiLd FyeR*
> 
> Should I try my luck de-lidding a 3770K that can't get past 4.3ghz?
> 
> Overclock stability requirements: Needs to pass 12 hours of Prime95 and no WHEA errors.


Sure! Then you have a 3770k that can't get past 4.3ghz but runs cooler









Seriously though you can probably just bruteforce with a ton of voltage if you have temperature headroom, but no miracles to be had


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> what are your ambient and load temps?
> what is your load voltage?
> what cpu cooler you using?


Went up and down the voltage for 4.5ghz from 1.15 to 1.35 Max Temps 71-75-82-72 The most stable vCore is at 1.23. I ran this vCore like 50 times tweaking settings here and there.
Always crashes at the 7th hour of Prime95 and WHEA errors before it crashes.

Tried both OCN and ROG ASUS site settings

Custom cooling 380i

Stable Clock 4.3ghz at 1.21 vCore


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Hey Val - ... what CPU did you end up running for your summer-built (and how many did you trty out at M-C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) ? Also per your earlier post re 27 inch monitor, I got a couple of 27 inch Samsung LEDs (1080p/HDMI) I picked up on sale in the $250 range last December and am really happy with for both productivity software and gaming.


I found a good one for 280 I believe. I am running my ivy still I canceled this summers build for the TO event and for moar LN2 stuffs my dewar should be coming next week. Getting a 680 dcuII for a rebuild.


----------



## sinnedone

you really shouldn't be putting in other peoples settings and more just use them for a starting point.

I say load optimized defaults, run ram at 1600mhz at stock timings and manual voltage to spec. turn off all s states, LLC to extreme and when you hit a cpu voltage wall might want to try different settings like pll overvoltage or other setting while you ask in the forums.

The temps aren't to bad, whats your ambient in your room/house? 25c/26c?


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> you really shouldn't be putting in other peoples settings and more just use them for a starting point.
> 
> I say load optimized defaults, run ram at 1600mhz at stock timings and manual voltage to spec. turn off all s states, LLC to extreme and when you hit a cpu voltage wall might want to try different settings like pll overvoltage or other setting while you ask in the forums.
> 
> The temps aren't to bad, whats your ambient in your room/house? 25c/26c?


Did tweaks here and there trying to understand what settings will help with stability. I think I BSOD'd like 100+ times LOL..

Anyway back to De-lidding, maybe I'll give it shot or maybe sell my CPU and try my luck on another 3770K/


----------



## Mogwaii

Hi all.

Ive just mounted http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html on my delided i5 , and if it feels nervous to delid i can say it felt worse mounting the i5 without Ihs









But just booted and atm idle ,so the CLU can get stuck to the core , will test it soon , hope i havent broken anything .....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Hi all.
> 
> Ive just mounted http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html on my delided i5 , and if it feels nervous to delid i can say it felt worse mounting the i5 without Ihs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But just booted and atm idle ,so the CLU can get stuck to the core , will test it soon , hope i havent broken anything .....


i hope for even better results!!!! Nighters all


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> i hope for even better results!!!! Nighters all


Did a few quick runs with some random Bsod and whea errors but ended up at 1.352vcore.
Did just a quick test due to the heat outside is above 30c and my room is like 31-32c.



Will stability test it more tonight.

But if it manage to stay withour whea errors the temp is ok due to the high ambient temp atm


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Did a few quick runs with some random Bsod and whea errors but ended up at 1.352vcore.
> Did just a quick test due to the heat outside is above 30c and my room is like 31-32c.
> 
> Will stability test it more tonight.
> 
> But if it manage to stay withour whea errors the temp is ok due to the high ambient temp atm


Congrats.

Looks like you don't have AVX going on your prime95.


----------



## ozzy1925

i asked this in another topic but couldnt find any answer i found 2 used i3770k
1st: batch is 3244C501 the owner says he didnt o/c the cpu and he doesnt know anything about o/c but as i checked the cart 3244c can see 4.9
2nd: batch:3215B645 which can achive 4.8 and he didnt push any further
Which will be a better option? Or should i just go and pick a brand new one?


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i asked this in another topic but couldnt find any answer i found 2 used i3770k
> 1st: batch is 3244C501 the owner says he didnt o/c the cpu and he doesnt know anything about o/c but as i checked the cart 3244c can see 4.9
> 2nd: batch:3215B645 which can achive 4.8 and he didnt push any further
> Which will be a better option? Or should i just go and pick a brand new one?


Depends on the prices being offered to you and what voltage the second one took to achieve 4.8.

If he got it to 4.8 at 1.3v or less then I'd buy it for sure.

I don't know whether or not to believe that a person who bought a K series chip never tried oc'ing it, especially if it was a custom build they did.

Think about it, if the K series chip is bad and he wants to sell it and recoup his loss, of course he's probably going to plead ignorance about its OC quality.


----------



## iPDrop

I should have read this before I did it because I didn't take a picture









OCN name: iPDrop
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: 400
OC after delid: 4.8GHz
Temp drops: hottest core before: 81c and after: 53c (Full Load @ Stock Clocks)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2876453


----------



## stickg1

Batch is irrelevant. The important thing is where in the wafer the chip was cut from. The batch number doesn't tell that though.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Batch is irrelevant. The important thing is where in the wafer the chip was cut from. The batch number doesn't tell that though.


yes i know that but i think i will try to get a new 3230b or 3237b chip which seem to be best choice i saw many people reaching 5.0ghz with those


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> yes i know that but i think i will try to get a new 3230b or 3237b chip which seem to be best choice i saw many people reaching 5.0ghz with those


It's still pointless though as it is pretty much just luck on how well your CPU overclocks.


----------



## mojobear

Hi all,

I love the adaptive voltage and power saving of haswell but I dont love the extra 0.1V with AVX enabled software.

I have been experimenting and now use 1.25V for 4.75 GHZ stable and have turned on C3/6/7 with manual voltage.

Now I get nice idle power of 5-10 W with the added benefit of being able to run handbrake (AVX enabled) without the extra 0.1 V...the extra 0.1 V actually makes my overclock unstable (trust me I've tried increasing VCCIN, etc no help - I think its just the nature of my chip and its not temperature - I've delidded and running watercooling - max temp 71 C with IBT).

Anyways - any harm with running manual voltage with c3/6/7 enabled?

Many thanks. I'm running a delidded 4770K on a MVIE


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I found a good one for 280 I believe. I am running my ivy still I canceled this summers build for the TO event and for moar LN2 stuffs my dewar should be coming next week. Getting a 680 dcuII for a rebuild.


...well, now you can plan for a winter build in the 'frozen thundra'







. The Asus 680 dcUII has the separate voltage boost connections, I believe ? Nice ! I still have my quad 670s and also the 2x7990s, the latter finally getting w-cooled


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Congrats.
> 
> Looks like you don't have AVX going on your prime95.


Downloaded the newer prime95 and have been running it for like 3 hours now. The thing i dont get is , when i run it @ 4.6ghz it looks like this :



And its 100% good , with nice temps and just 1,312volt but if i crank it up to 4,7ghz ,it's decent at around 1,340-1.350vcore , but i get whea errors after some time in prime95.
Ive tryed to bump the vcore upp as high 1,420 and still no good, when i go above 1,385 i get blue screen,s so either my bios is not working with the "normal" asus OC settings or the cpu just dont wanna run at 4,7 without errors, and go higher than 1,420 seems way off and to high when i get it 100% ok @ 4.6 with 1,312.

I mean can a cpu be almost ok at say 1,350 vcore and then between 1,385-1.420 i get bsod , and if i would push it say to 1,450 it will be running ok all the sudden?
When i do prime with 4,7 the temp is like 3-4 c more only but not without errors.
Feels strange to me









I am out of ideas , ive tryed a few different OC guides and all end up the same like above.

//Rickard


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Downloaded the newer prime95 and have been running it for like 3 hours now. The thing i dont get is , when i run it @ 4.6ghz it looks like this :
> 
> 
> 
> And its 100% good , with nice temps and just 1,312volt but if i crank it up to 4,7ghz ,it's decent at around 1,340-1.350vcore , but i get whea errors after some time in prime95.
> Ive tryed to bump the vcore upp as high 1,420 and still no good, when i go above 1,385 i get blue screen,s so either my bios is not working with the "normal" asus OC settings or the cpu just dont wanna run at 4,7 without errors, and go higher than 1,420 seems way off and to high when i get it 100% ok @ 4.6 with 1,312.
> 
> I mean can a cpu be almost ok at say 1,350 vcore and then between 1,385-1.420 i get bsod , and if i would push it say to 1,450 it will be running ok all the sudden?
> When i do prime with 4,7 the temp is like 3-4 c more only but not without errors.
> Feels strange to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am out of ideas , ive tryed a few different OC guides and all end up the same like above.
> 
> //Rickard


Most likely your memory controller needs a bit more juice. Add some to system agent as well.


----------



## Swag

Hey guys, I posted here a while back and I need help.

Should I get 2x 27Q or 1x 30Q.

So basically, I'm asking whether I should get 2 1440p monitors or 1 1600p monitor. What do you guys think?


----------



## Valgaur

Maybe you guys can help Vagur as well.

I am getting a A2 error code bug on my mobo and I can't seem to figure out why..... it always gets stuck on A2 only nothing else and I can't make it to bios because of it. The A2 error means detect IDE.... yes I've cleared cmos yada yada yada. Tried them all and asked asus and they say to RMA but I kinda don't wanna as id have to get my green goop from TO off of it and its a pain in the buns.

Let me know!

Mobo is the P8Z77-V Premium from Asus.

Thanks guys!


----------



## alancsalt

A2? Are you water cooled with no fan? I had this a few days ago on my Asus RIVE and got past it by fitting a fan to the cpu fan out on the mobo. Bingo, booted to bios and I could set ignore fan.

At the same time, one crook ram stick... thing is fixed both at once so cant be totally sure which fixed it, but test those two out..


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Maybe you guys can help Vagur as well.
> 
> I am getting a A2 error code bug on my mobo and I can't seem to figure out why..... it always gets stuck on A2 only nothing else and I can't make it to bios because of it. The A2 error means detect IDE.... yes I've cleared cmos yada yada yada. Tried them all and asked asus and they say to RMA but I kinda don't wanna as id have to get my green goop from TO off of it and its a pain in the buns.
> 
> Let me know!
> 
> Mobo is the P8Z77-V Premium from Asus.
> 
> Thanks guys!


...shooting into the dark here - but have seen stranger things work: take out one memory stick and/or flip RAM sticks ...- try different SATA cable ...- try different drive on different SATA channel - ...unhook DVD drive... ...also: does the P8Z77 V Premium have two BIOS chips ?

Hope you get it working again !


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> A2? Are you water cooled with no fan? I had this a few days ago on my Asus RIVE and got past it by fitting a fan to the cpu fan out on the mobo. Bingo, booted to bios and I could set ignore fan.
> 
> At the same time, one crook ram stick... thing is fixed both at once so cant be totally sure which fixed it, but test those two out..


Ill give that a shot. Might have hooked a fan up wrong possibly and I've done all the sata stuffs a ton as well. Even gave the system a full 2 days de static and still same thing maybe the fan or maybe I tightened my h100 down a little to tight today or in the later day ill take a wack at it again. Anything else you can think of?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...shooting into the dark here - but have seen stranger things work: take out one memory stick and/or flip RAM sticks ...- try different SATA cable ...- try different drive on different SATA channel - ...unhook DVD drive... ...also: does the P8Z77 V Premium have two BIOS chips ?
> 
> Hope you get it working again !


Nope im pretty sure its one I only see one anyways. OH also the red boot device light comes on. How'd I forget to type that one......


----------



## Mogwaii

W
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Most likely your memory controller needs a bit more juice. Add some to system agent as well.


What are the settings in the bios called?

VCCSA and memory voltage?

i use 1,5volt corsair vengeance low profile , how much is a "normal" boost +volt?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> W
> What are the settings in the bios called?
> 
> VCCSA and memory voltage?
> 
> i use 1,5volt corsair vengeance low profile , how much is a "normal" boost +volt?


VCCSA and VCCIO. you can put them at 1.1 probly and be okay. I would go into bios and go under the main page where you change cpu vcore and then below it is usually memory voltage. try 1.55 area


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iPDrop*
> 
> I should have read this before I did it because I didn't take a picture
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: iPDrop
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 400
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: hottest core before: 81c and after: 53c (Full Load @ Stock Clocks)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2876453


You're in! Nice OC as well


----------



## redshoulder

Some questions regarding delid,
Is plywood suitable?
For those that used clu, I have noticed covering the vrms is not necessary as long as you are careful with application, Is this correct?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *redshoulder*
> 
> Some questions regarding delid,
> Is plywood suitable?
> For those that used clu, I have noticed covering the vrms is not necessary as long as you are careful with application, Is this correct?


Guess you're going for the vise.

It would be best to avoid wood like MDF and plywood as it's not hard enough and it can split. You should get a block of _real_ wood.

Regarding the "VRMs" (they're not VRMs) it's up to you if you want to cover them or not. I would.


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> VCCSA and VCCIO. you can put them at 1.1 probly and be okay. I would go into bios and go under the main page where you change cpu vcore and then below it is usually memory voltage. try 1.55 area


Ive tryed all morning now and yes it does feel less unstable with the tweak volt u said, but i still get whea errors, and if i rise the vcore to high i just get bsod.
I found 1 ok volt @ 1.37x wich did quick test in prime95 without whea errors but when i tryed BF3 i had some other errors.

Starting to get tired of rebooting the system and tweak settings









Bluescreenviewer error code is 0124 all the time wich indicate to low? or to high? vcore settings.

And go ahead vs 1.450-1.500 just to gain 100mhz is something i wont do.Not even sure if that will help since i get bsod after 1,9x vcore.

I guess there is way to tweak the voltage in bios to make it run ok , beside vcore , since it runs ok around 1,340-1.370vcore , just the thaem whea errors , hehe

But since i dont know exactly how much to tweak the volt and what typ of volt settings to tweak i feel i have to let it go @ 4,6ghz - 1.294vcore

Tnx for the help and support . if i only could have a good % OC a 3770k i would buy 1 , but since i can get 1 worse than my i5 it feels like a gamble i likely wont win.

I guess there is many out there that wont even reach 4,6ghz but still suck when i have nice temps.

Btw what settings incl LLC are u using @ 4.8ghz?


----------



## arrow0309

Can I join too?









OCN name: arrow0309
CPU: i7-3770K Costa Rica
On die-TIM: CLU
Ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: 200 (for now)
OC after delid: 4.8GHz
Temp drops: hottest core before: 92°C and after: 74°C (Full Load @ 4.6GHz)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2877068

*4.6Ghz 3770K*, CLU on both inner and upper side of the Ihs, no silicon seal or glue, *19°C drop temp*:

*Before, 92°C, 26°C Out* (room temp):



*After, 74°C, 27°C Out*:



*4.8GHz, 88°C, 27° Out*:



Some pics:


----------



## RickRockerr

OCN name: RickRockerr
CPU: i5-3570k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid: 4.8Ghz
Temp drops: Idle ~7 °C on hottest core and full load ~15 °C on same core
CPU-Z validation of max OC: At the moment: http://valid.canardpc.com/2877122


----------



## neofury

You may be able to get better temps by removing the glue, and also maybe adding more CLP? I remember when I had that amount (identical to your pic) it wasn't enough at one point. Worst part was I had run out of CLP. When I got CLU I put more than what is in your pic, and I got great results.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> You may be able to get better temps by removing the glue, and also maybe adding more CLP? I remember when I had that amount (identical to your pic) it wasn't enough at one point. Worst part was I had run out of CLP. When I got CLU I put more than what is in your pic, and I got great results.


I removed the glue few months ago and added more clp but result were same :/


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I removed the glue few months ago and added more clp but result were same :/


Weak







One thing that did put me over the top a little bit was using it on top of the IHS. But you are using MX-4 which is really good anyways. I was using AS5.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Maybe less CLP on the die? It looks too much to me..


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Maybe less CLP on the die? It looks too much to me..


Can't really have too much of CLP.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> You may be able to get better temps by removing the glue, and also maybe adding more CLP? I remember when I had that amount (identical to your pic) it wasn't enough at one point. Worst part was I had run out of CLP. When I got CLU I put more than what is in your pic, and I got great results.
> 
> 
> 
> I removed the glue few months ago and added more clp but result were same :/
Click to expand...

Can you post updated photos of what the IHS looks like and the PCB? We might be able to help you further with more up-to-date info!


----------



## Valgaur

Hello peeps! I shall add peoples later tonight but first good news everyone!

My mobo works! but I am stuck at the starting windows logo for my ssd and my boot disk... any ideas?


----------



## scorpscarx

I'm not following the thread so your issue might be different from this, but I just worked on a client's PC with some similar corruption.... Use ghost or an OS disc to get to a command line, run diskpart /fixboot and /fixmbr. It's not loading Windows?

Throw in a sfc /scannow, and maybe disconnect your drive and reflash the mb.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hello peeps! I shall add peoples later tonight but first good news everyone!
> 
> My mobo works! but I am stuck at the starting windows logo for my ssd and my boot disk... any ideas?


Since you have a separate boot drive, reinstall Windows so you can get rid of those annoying problems. Those fix commands only patch things up, they don't actually pave it in.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Since you have a separate boot drive, reinstall Windows so you can get rid of those annoying problems. Those fix commands only patch things up, they don't actually pave it in.


ythats the thing i can't reinstall it! it stops at the starting windows screen for my booting disc and my ssd.....


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Since you have a separate boot drive, reinstall Windows so you can get rid of those annoying problems. Those fix commands only patch things up, they don't actually pave it in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ythats the thing i can't reinstall it! it stops at the starting windows screen for my booting disc and my ssd.....
Click to expand...

OOOOH! I thought you meant your boot drive (disk).







Hmm, got any extra boot disks? Or a computer you can use to download the new installer and create a new one?

I honestly recommend using a USB, faster and I believe your problem is that the disk is actually physically damaged and can't be read properly.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> OOOOH! I thought you meant your boot drive (disk).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm, got any extra boot disks? Or a computer you can use to download the new installer and create a new one?
> 
> I honestly recommend using a USB, faster and I believe your problem is that the disk is actually physically damaged and can't be read properly.


I'm making another disk as I type and trying a different load link as well.....

i dont have a big enough USB sady.. and I got a wicked deal on a 24" monitor today asus 80M:1 for 120 bucks new! lovely sales


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> OOOOH! I thought you meant your boot drive (disk).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm, got any extra boot disks? Or a computer you can use to download the new installer and create a new one?
> 
> I honestly recommend using a USB, faster and I believe your problem is that the disk is actually physically damaged and can't be read properly.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm making another disk as I type and trying a different load link as well.....
> 
> i dont have a big enough USB sady.. and I got a wicked deal on a 24" monitor today asus 80M:1 for 120 bucks new! lovely sales
Click to expand...

I think it's the same one someone just linked to me earlier today.







I hope you enjoy it though. Just one? Could've picked up 2 for that price.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Can you post updated photos of what the IHS looks like and the PCB? We might be able to help you further with more up-to-date info!


I try to get new pics next week







Im considering to remove ihs and mount block on die. Any tips to mounting without ihs? I have heard that without ihs its very easy to crush die.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Can I join too?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: arrow0309
> CPU: i7-3770K Costa Rica
> On die-TIM: CLU
> Ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 200 (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: hottest core before: 92°C and after: 74°C (Full Load @ 4.6GHz)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2877068
> 
> *4.6Ghz 3770K*, CLU on both inner and upper side of the Ihs, no silicon seal or glue, *19°C drop temp*:
> 
> *Before, 92°C, 26°C Out* (room temp):
> 
> 
> 
> *After, 74°C, 27°C Out*:
> 
> 
> 
> *4.8GHz, 88°C, 27° Out*:
> 
> 
> 
> Some pics:


Up


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Can you post updated photos of what the IHS looks like and the PCB? We might be able to help you further with more up-to-date info!
> 
> 
> 
> I try to get new pics next week
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im considering to remove ihs and mount block on die. Any tips to mounting without ihs? I have heard that without ihs its very easy to crush die.
Click to expand...

Very very easy to crush the die. Understand that unless you want to calculate the right height for the washers, I don't advise mounting direct die.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I think it's the same one someone just linked to me earlier today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope you enjoy it though. Just one? Could've picked up 2 for that price.


I wanted too but only having 180 bucks limits you







and im gonna make another cd and try tomorrow.... any good programs to use?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Can I join too?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: arrow0309
> CPU: i7-3770K Costa Rica
> On die-TIM: CLU
> Ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 200 (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: hottest core before: 92°C and after: 74°C (Full Load @ 4.6GHz)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2877068
> 
> *4.6Ghz 3770K*, CLU on both inner and upper side of the Ihs, no silicon seal or glue, *19°C drop temp*:
> 
> *Before, 92°C, 26°C Out* (room temp):
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After, 74°C, 27°C Out*:
> 
> 
> 
> *4.8GHz, 88°C, 27° Out*:
> 
> 
> 
> Some pics:


You're in!







(sorry about the wait been busy today







)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> OCN name: RickRockerr
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4.8Ghz
> Temp drops: Idle ~7 °C on hottest core and full load ~15 °C on same core
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: At the moment: http://valid.canardpc.com/2877122


You're in as well my good Squire!


----------



## Swag

Use this to make the disk: http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/html/pbPage.Help_Win7_usbdvd_dwnTool

And download the Win7 file from Seans guide.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Use this to make the disk: http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/html/pbPage.Help_Win7_usbdvd_dwnTool
> 
> And download the Win7 file from Seans guide.


yup burning now.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Use this to make the disk: http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/html/pbPage.Help_Win7_usbdvd_dwnTool
> 
> And download the Win7 file from Seans guide.
> 
> 
> 
> yup burning now.
Click to expand...

Ok, update tomorrow or whenever you finish doing whatever.


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I try to get new pics next week
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im considering to remove ihs and mount block on die. Any tips to mounting without ihs? I have heard that without ihs its very easy to crush die.


If u have Ek Supremacy waterblock on cpu u can use http://www.coolerkit.se/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-3683p.html

i use it on my Supremacywater block and it was not hard to install , just take it easy


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hello peeps! I shall add peoples later tonight but first good news everyone!
> 
> My mobo works! but I am stuck at the starting windows logo for my ssd and my boot disk... any ideas?


...wild, wild stab in the dark...but as I have sinned before on 'too much' oc and you have 'Frankie' on your conscious, I wonder if you don't have driver corruption --- but at least you're off the 'A2' code and into actual booting.

Still, now it seems to be 'bootus interruptus' - hate to waste your time, but a reinstall of Windows might help if that's what happened...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...wild, wild stab in the dark...but as I have sinned before on 'too much' oc and you have 'Frankie' on your conscious, I wonder if you don't have driver corruption --- but at least you're off the 'A2' code and into actual booting.
> 
> Still, now it seems to be 'bootus interruptus' - hate to waste your time, but a reinstall of Windows might help if that's what happened...


I get stuck in the reinstall disk at the same spot as well.... so um yeah


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I get stuck in the reinstall disk at the same spot as well.... so um yeah


..tried the F5/8 'repair' during the next boot - as useless as that tends be ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ..tried the F5/8 'repair' during the next boot - as useless as that tends be ?


yup... nothin


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yup... nothin


...and 'Safe-mode' ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...and 'Safe-mode' ?


haven't tried that one....


----------



## stickg1

You try a different drive?


----------



## neofury

I had a problem like that where different drives wouldn't work, the install would get stuck but then eventually a different disc (different windows copy entirely) worked, however the comp would just freeze within using windows for 30 minutes. Turned out to be a bad motherboard. It was some Dell I had lying around so I just stripped it.


----------



## sniggleface

Successfully delidded my 3570K last night using the $20 bessey vise grip. It went quite smoothly, even with a few beers in me









I reassembled with CLU between the core and IHS and then NT-H1 between the HSF and IHS (ordered some MX4 but it was taking forever so I decided to skip it.) Temps went down by about 20C, though I still have a 10C difference between core 0 and the other cores. I might end up doing it again once I get the MX4 in to see if I can fix this. I also wonder if it's because of droop on my gigantic Noctua NH-D14. Do people ever tweak the two main mounting screws to get it on tighter?


----------



## ozzy1925

here is my dead cpu as you see the scratches are too deep


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> here is my dead cpu as you see the scratches are too deep


Image quality is low. Hard to see the damage.

It may work without the IHS on it. If the IHS touches the bare copper it will short out when booted.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> here is my dead cpu as you see the scratches are too deep


Cover the scratches with liquid electrical tape and then see if it boots - It might still work if you didn't already short it out by attempting to power it on like that with the IHS in contact with the copper traces... I used liquid electrical tape on my chip to protect the SMD capacitors from shorting out if any CLP were to somehow get on them since I'm paranoid.


----------



## Oslo

hi guys i need some help from u

i've recently finished my build wich consist in a i5 4670k watercooled rig

my processor is delidded but when i put all the pieces together i only applied the CLP on the top of the ihs and not on die wich have mx-4 applied

i've managed to achieve a 1.25 Vcore 4.5 ghz Overclock

the problem is that in my opinion my cpu run a bit hot (given a 26-30 ° room ambient ) the cpu idle at 40° and during stress test top at 83°

what do you think about ?

here's a pic of the rig


----------



## Cyro999

What type of stress test?

Regular vs AVX vs AVX2 tests will give you vastly different temperatures. What temps do you get from a cinebench 11.5 run?


----------



## Oslo

i forgot to mention (for stress test i intend prime 95 or Intel burn test)
my WC kit consist in a xspc raystorm 750 Ver 4 kit
with an EX 240 Rad (push pull Config)

after a run of cinebench 11.5


----------



## Cyro999

You're hotter than me and i'm not delidded nor on water

the 82 is from cinebench? It should be a lot cooler than an avx heavy stress test, but you quoted 83 for those


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oslo*
> 
> hi guys i need some help from u
> 
> i've recently finished my build wich consist in a i5 4670k watercooled rig
> 
> my processor is delidded but when i put all the pieces together i only applied the CLP on the top of the ihs and not on die wich have mx-4 applied


You really have to use the CLP on the die, the mx4 will pump out within a short period of time and you'll be hitting the Tjmax as soon as that happens.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Oslo*
> 
> hi guys i need some help from u
> 
> i've recently finished my build wich consist in a i5 4670k watercooled rig
> 
> my processor is delidded but when i put all the pieces together i only applied the CLP on the top of the ihs and not on die wich have mx-4 applied
> 
> 
> 
> You really have to use the CLP on the die, the mx4 will pump out within a short period of time and you'll be hitting the Tjmax as soon as that happens.
Click to expand...

yea :S the CLP/CLU is ment for between die and IHS.. you can use the MX-4 between IHS and Cooler (or CLP there too.. I guess you would gain a little that way) but the most important parts is:

Remove all the glue from the PCB and IHS
Apply a THIN layer of CLP/CLU to the die
or do you got some specific reason for using MX-4 on die? :S :S :S


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Cover the scratches with liquid electrical tape and then see if it boots - It might still work if you didn't already short it out by attempting to power it on like that with the IHS in contact with the copper traces... I used liquid electrical tape on my chip to protect the SMD capacitors from shorting out if any CLP were to somehow get on them since I'm paranoid.


i already tried with ihs on and got 00 code from mobo .you think i damaged my mobo if it shorted out?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i already tried with ihs on and got 00 code from mobo .you think i damaged my mobo if it shorted out?


Did a red led under the socket come on? It will be red... and often with code 00 static can do it but usually its dead cpu. So take 10 minutes and unplug all the psu cables for a full destatic and tap the case every few minutes with your socks and shoes off for the best de static chance.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Did a red led under the socket come on? It will be red... and often with code 00 static can do it but usually its dead cpu. So take 10 minutes and unplug all the psu cables for a full destatic and tap the case every few minutes with your socks and shoes off for the best de static chance.


Leaving cables plugged in so the rig is grounded is usually better for static discharge.

With those gouges in the PCB I would say it is probably a dead cpu. Exposed nicks & scratches have to be covered with something before the cpu is ever powered up again, if there was a short circuit & the cpu got powered up, it would be toast.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Leaving cables plugged in so the rig is grounded is usually better for static discharge.
> 
> With those gouges in the PCB I would say it is probably a dead cpu. Exposed nicks & scratches have to be covered with something before the cpu is ever powered up again, if there was a short circuit & the cpu got powered up, it would be toast.


Not necessarily.

I grounded stuff up a lot of times when measuring the VCore from the back of my motherboard without any issues.
Propably shorted the two nodes like 10 times.


----------



## SonDa5

Clear cmos and safe off bare copper on cpu with electrically non conductive material and pop into socket with heat sink and boot up to see if it comes back to life.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Can I join too?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: arrow0309
> CPU: i7-3770K Costa Rica
> On die-TIM: CLU
> Ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 200 (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: hottest core before: 92°C and after: 74°C (Full Load @ 4.6GHz)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2877068
> 
> *4.6Ghz 3770K*, CLU on both inner and upper side of the Ihs, no silicon seal or glue, *19°C drop temp*:
> 
> *Before, 92°C, 26°C Out* (room temp):
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After, 74°C, 27°C Out*:
> 
> 
> 
> *4.8GHz, 88°C, 27° Out*:
> 
> 
> 
> Some pics:


You're in!







(sorry about the wait been busy today







[/quote]
Thanks, maybe a small issue:
There's quite a difference in temps right now of about 15°C between the cores, is it normal?
Used to be lower before the delid


----------



## Oslo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> yea :S the CLP/CLU is ment for between die and IHS.. you can use the MX-4 between IHS and Cooler (or CLP there too.. I guess you would gain a little that way) but the most important parts is:
> 
> Remove all the glue from the PCB and IHS
> Apply a THIN layer of CLP/CLU to the die
> or do you got some specific reason for using MX-4 on die? :S :S :S


no i didnt have some specific reason for using mx-4 on die i just tought it was fine also with that anyway what should i use some isopropyl alchol to remove the mx-4 on die? also for cleaning the clp ?
thnx for the tips

how much room ambient temperature influence the cooling power of a WC setup?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Did a red led under the socket come on? It will be red... and often with code 00 static can do it but usually its dead cpu. So take 10 minutes and unplug all the psu cables for a full destatic and tap the case every few minutes with your socks and shoes off for the best de static chance.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Leaving cables plugged in so the rig is grounded is usually better for static discharge.
> With those gouges in the PCB I would say it is probably a dead cpu. Exposed nicks & scratches have to be covered with something before the cpu is ever powered up again, if there was a short circuit & the cpu got powered up, it would be toast.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Not necessarily.
> I grounded stuff up a lot of times when measuring the VCore from the back of my motherboard without any issues.
> Propably shorted the two nodes like 10 times.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Clear cmos and safe off bare copper on cpu with electrically non conductive material and pop into socket with heat sink and boot up to see if it comes back to life.


i check the manual of mobo it says 00 is cpu error well i had some problem with my mobo it doesnt recognize more than 2 sata 6gb other than 2 top slots.Today i am going to send it to a service , i think they will check


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oslo*
> 
> no i didnt have some specific reason for using mx-4 on die i just tought it was fine also with that anyway what should i use some isopropyl alchol to remove the mx-4 on die? also for cleaning the clp ?
> thnx for the tips
> 
> how much room ambient temperature influence the cooling power of a WC setup?


You'd measure as delta over ambient AFAIK so if you had 50c delta over ambient, you'd run 70c in a 20c room, or 90c in a 40c room


----------



## Valgaur

/windows/system32/drivers/classpnp.sys

thats what i sit on when trying to boot into safe mode... gonna call microsoft tomorrow.... UGH

got my 750 psu today well yesterda technically....


----------



## neofury

For cleaning the die and IHS I've had a lot of success using the two step articclean method. I really love that stuff, does a great job.


----------



## Oslo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> For cleaning the die and IHS I've had a lot of success using the two step articclean method. I really love that stuff, does a great job.


do this clean also the clp/clu?


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oslo*
> 
> do this clean also the clp/clu?


Yep, I had to clean CLP with it. It was by no means perfect for the CLP mind you, but I also didn't put in a full effort either. It does an amazing job with normal TIM. A fairly good job with CLP.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Yep, I had to clean CLP with it. It was by no means perfect for the CLP mind you, but I also didn't put in a full effort either. It does an amazing job with normal TIM. A fairly good job with CLP.


All you need for normal TIM is just a piece of paper lol


----------



## Swag

All you need for normal TIM is 99% isopropyl alcohol and lint-free cloth.

Just get any generic isopropyl alcohol (around $1.50 depending on size), 99% recommended because it dries almost instantaneously. Within a few seconds.
Lint-free cloth, I recommend using coffee filters. Cheap and very effective. Does not leave any cloth.

For CLP/CLU. Same as above but at the end of it, I recommend using some type of metal polisher. It shouldn't remove the markings either way.
There aren't too many problems with CLU, but CLP is known to be a warranty destroyer because it bonds with the actual metal causing it to "blur" out the markings. Blurring it out is a direct void of warranty under "physical damage/alteration". Yes, delidding already destroys warranty but just in case you're just using it on some other IHS, this is important to note. Only happens with CLP.

To fix this, use metal polish and just rub a bit of it onto the IHS. Should remove the CLP and make the IHS look new. Also after this, if you plan to reseat, clean with a bit of alcohol. The polish may leave an oily residue or some type of residue on the IHS.


----------



## MiiX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lint-free cloth, I recommend using coffee filters. Cheap and very effective. Does not leave any cloth.


Cofee filters you say? +rep


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lint-free cloth, I recommend using coffee filters. Cheap and very effective. Does not leave any cloth.
> 
> 
> 
> Cofee filters you say? +rep
Click to expand...

Haha yea, coffee filters work great! Just go to your local Wal-Mart and pick up some of the generic stuff to dedicate to TIM cleaning or if you want, just use the ones you have at home (if you don't have a Keurig or something like that).

Arctic Cleaning is not necessary and I have never actually used it, I just recommend isopropyl alcohol. Cheaper and effective. After all, the Arctic cleaning is basically alcohol.


----------



## Oslo

do you guy think that not having applied clp to the die could be the problem with my watercooling bad temp? (post from 1 or 2 pages above) im looking for other clues


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oslo*
> 
> do you guy think that not having applied clp to the die could be the problem with my watercooling bad temp? (post from 1 or 2 pages above) im looking for other clues


Take pictures of the PCB and Die and the IHS belly.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oslo*
> 
> do you guy think that not having applied clp to the die could be the problem with my watercooling bad temp? (post from 1 or 2 pages above) im looking for other clues


That could definitely be it, also, the raystorm block has a lot of bow, I don't think the CLU will be able to bridge that gap anywhere else but the dead center.
I'd suggest to at least change the MX4 on the die to CLU, that will definitely help with your temps and while your heatsink is off look at the application of CLU on the die. When you place it back only slight 'touching up' is required, you don't have to clean off all the CLU on the top of the IHS.

If temps don't improve (to, say, mid seventies) you might want to change the CLU that's between the IHS and the raystorm waterblock to MX4, but that's just a hunch I have.

All this I'm saying in the supposition that you know for 100% certain that your loop is properly bled and that there is no air trapped inside the waterblock or one of the radiators, this of course could be why you are having elevated temps. Since rocking your case is a lot less work than taking out your CPU again I'd suggest you do this first off, also check if the air coming out of the radiators is warm when you've been stress-testing for over an hour.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> All you need for normal TIM is just a piece of paper lol


I've used 1 + 2 along with a coffee filter and it makes it look brand new.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Yeah I have never used Arctic cleaning, the stuff that I use is: old credit card if there is a lot of stuff to clean, then a toothpick, then goo-gone, then isopropyl alcohol, I use q-tips to rub the goo-gone and alcohol around. This is just my method that I have used many times and have had no problems.

http://googone.com/

There is the link if you don't know what goo-gone is.


----------



## Oslo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> That could definitely be it, also, the raystorm block has a lot of bow, I don't think the CLU will be able to bridge that gap anywhere else but the dead center.
> I'd suggest to at least change the MX4 on the die to CLU, that will definitely help with your temps and while your heatsink is off look at the application of CLU on the die. When you place it back only slight 'touching up' is required, you don't have to clean off all the CLU on the top of the IHS.
> 
> If temps don't improve (to, say, mid seventies) you might want to change the CLU that's between the IHS and the raystorm waterblock to MX4, but that's just a hunch I have.
> 
> All this I'm saying in the supposition that you know for 100% certain that your loop is properly bled and that there is no air trapped inside the waterblock or one of the radiators, this of course could be why you are having elevated temps. Since rocking your case is a lot less work than taking out your CPU again I'd suggest you do this first off, also check if the air coming out of the radiators is warm when you've been stress-testing for over an hour.


im almost sure that the water flow through the sistem and that the sistem is bleed (i left it on for about 17 hours to check for leaks and remove bubbles ) tomorrow im gonna change my psu and by the way applying clp to the die .

If there is air inside the radiator how can i notice it? (warm air in stress test i think) and how i fix it?


----------



## MiiX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha yea, coffee filters work great! Just go to your local Wal-Mart and pick up some of the generic stuff to dedicate to TIM cleaning or if you want, just use the ones you have at home (if you don't have a Keurig or something like that).
> 
> Arctic Cleaning is not necessary and I have never actually used it, I just recommend isopropyl alcohol. Cheaper and effective. After all, the Arctic cleaning is basically alcohol.


Got Arctic Cleaning kit, works great! CPU gets so shiny I dont even want to apply TIM


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oslo*
> 
> im almost sure that the water flow through the sistem and that the sistem is bleed (i left it on for about 17 hours to check for leaks and remove bubbles ) tomorrow im gonna change my psu and by the way applying clp to the die .
> 
> If there is air inside the radiator how can i notice it? (warm air in stress test i think) and how i fix it?


If you get warm air all over the radiator it is probably fine, if there's still air in the radiator it's possible that you hear the water running.
Nevertheless you could try tilting your case all ways, of course all the time making sure the pump doesn't suck in any air from the bay-res.

I hope changing the MX4 on the die over to CLU will help your temps


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> /windows/system32/drivers/classpnp.sys
> 
> thats what i sit on when trying to boot into safe mode... gonna call microsoft tomorrow.... UGH
> 
> got my 750 psu today well yesterda technically....


You need some spare drives. When you get to freezing things you'll want an extra OS or 2 handy in case things go south, really sucks to get frozen & benching then corrupting an OS right off the bat, I've gone through a few in a night before.
Then you end up doing this

http://s775.photobucket.com/user/FtW_420OC/media/Frozen/DSC04323.jpg.html

But installing windows at 6ghz doesn't get any boints & wastes ln2.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> But installing windows at 6ghz doesn't get any boints & wastes ln2.


Does it install it any faster though? Or is your HDD the bottleneck


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You need some spare drives. When you get to freezing things you'll want an extra OS or 2 handy in case things go south, really sucks to get frozen & benching then corrupting an OS right off the bat, I've gone through a few in a night before.
> Then you end up doing this
> 
> http://s775.photobucket.com/user/FtW_420OC/media/Frozen/DSC04323.jpg.html
> 
> But installing windows at 6ghz doesn't get any boints & wastes ln2.


...looks like my office (minus the LN2 pot)


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Does it install it any faster though? Or is your HDD the bottleneck


It actually goes pretty quick, with a well stripped XP (2d benching) it takes about 10 - 15 minutes to get up & running again.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...looks like my office (minus the LN2 pot)


Out in the garage at my place. It is so much nicer to have the small dewar I can take inside now, I used to have to sit out there with the big cylinder. There just wasn't enough time to run outside & fill thermos' while anything was running.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey what's up guys long-time-no-post! Oh I remember when this was the ivy delidded club. Seems like so long ago.


----------



## Valgaur

Im gonna tear parents comp apart and try to do that tonight or tomorrow.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Been waiting half a month for my CLU to arrive. It's probably lost. Damn...


----------



## MiiX

Yes, it is lost. I stole it.








No, not really...

Where did you order it?


----------



## Ukkooh

Decided to finally lap my cpu after being disappointed with delidded temps. Got about a 8°C temp drop so it was definitely worth it.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Im gonna tear parents comp apart and try to do that tonight or tomorrow.


...brilliant plan - after they see that you tore their computer apart, they might do some extra funding support for your 'Pandora's Box'


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...brilliant plan - after they see that you tore their computer apart, they might do some extra funding support for your 'Pandora's Box'


Yeah or say good luck lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...brilliant plan - after they see that you tore their computer apart, they might do some extra funding support for your 'Pandora's Box'


Yeah or say good luck lol


----------



## Belial

I posted a while back about how the CLU I had, had jammed up and clogged, and that Coollaboratory told me it was a manufacturing defect in the batch they made, and that they'd send me a replacement.

Replacement arrived. I know for certain it only took so long due to moving, forwarding addresses, and incompetencies and complications on the part of USPS, not Coollaboratory.

Just wanted to clear that up.


----------



## Daredevil 720

I ordered my CLU from ebay, seller is sth0805 from Germany.

My brother ordered a Thermalright mounting mechanism for his TRUE cooler from FrozenCPU just one day after I ordered my CLU and his stuff has arrived half a week now. I had the chance to order my CLU from FrozenCPU as well for 2-4 euros more, but I didn't because I thought it would arrive faster if I ordered it from within the EU..









Is sth0805 affiliated with Coollaboratory in any way?


----------



## WiLd FyeR

OCN name: WiLd FyeR
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: CLU
IHS TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: TBD
OC after delid: TBD
Temp Drop: 18C

*IBT stress Test: Before De-Lid*


*IBT stress Test: After De-Lid*


----------



## Oslo

hi guys

today my new psu arrived and i had time to apply clp on the die

here's the results

MX-4 ON DIE (after a run of cinebench)



CLP ON DIE (after a run of cinebench)


----------



## neofury

Wow man. That's a massive difference. To think CLU could even improve it a couple degrees, as could just using CLP on the IHS. Thanks for the images looks like you applied it very well.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Grats Oslo!! thats what we like to see ^^ MUCH better now isn't it?


----------



## Oslo

Yes now i have to push this overclock some more i managed to get a stable 1.25V at 4.5ghz on my 4670k but i think i can up some more the multiplier with this voltage


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiLd FyeR*
> 
> OCN name: WiLd FyeR
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: CLU
> IHS TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: TBD
> OC after delid: TBD
> Temp Drop: 18C
> 
> *IBT stress Test: Before De-Lid*
> 
> 
> *IBT stress Test: After De-Lid*


You're in good squire!

So update on vagur wondows stuffs...... he formatted his ssd..... but he didnt get the time to re install wondows at that persons place as he is sick today....... so... im kinda leaning towards the mobo having issues....... but im not sure yet


----------



## arm3nianx

Forgot the pw to my old account... anyway, is this dead? Left gpu die of my 690. Not sure what the hell happened, remove the waterblock then saw this... had CLP on it.


----------



## FtW 420

Yikes looks like a chunk of the die is missing, hard to tell if it was cracked or if something just bonded in that spot & pulled off with the block. I would say the 690 is a single gpu now though.


----------



## arm3nianx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yikes looks like a chunk of the die is missing, hard to tell if it was cracked or if something just bonded in that spot & pulled off with the block. I would say the 690 is a single gpu now though.


There was nothing on the block so idk where the chunk of the die went.
Is it still functional? Sell it for the price of a 680? lol. I don't want someone on ebay to buy it then have their computer release the magic smoke.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arm3nianx*
> 
> There was nothing on the block so idk where the chunk of the die went.
> Is it still functional? Sell it for the price of a 680? lol. I don't want someone on ebay to buy it then have their computer release the magic smoke.


I don't htink there's any way that is still going to work.


----------



## MiiX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arm3nianx*
> 
> There was nothing on the block so idk where the chunk of the die went.
> Is it still functional? Sell it for the price of a 680? lol. I don't want someone on ebay to buy it then have their computer release the magic smoke.


See if it works, report back!


----------



## arm3nianx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiiX*
> 
> See if it works, report back!


No way for me to test, already ripped my computer apart to sell the parts. I guess i'll throw it on ebay as an auction...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arm3nianx*
> 
> No way for me to test, already ripped my computer apart to sell the parts. I guess i'll throw it on ebay as an auction...


dont even bother... do you still ahve your comp parts? I'd assemble out of case quick and try to see if image appears on screen if not... it looks dead to me...


----------



## tw33k

I just polished my H100i with Brasso. I only did a quick 5 minute job to see if it worked and temps dropped 5c. Gave it a mirror finish. I've got more Liquid Ultra coming so I will do a proper job on the heatsink and IHS and see what temps I get.


----------



## katatoni

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I ordered my CLU from ebay, seller is sth0805 from Germany.
> 
> My brother ordered a Thermalright mounting mechanism for his TRUE cooler from FrozenCPU just one day after I ordered my CLU and his stuff has arrived half a week now. I had the chance to order my CLU from FrozenCPU as well for 2-4 euros more, but I didn't because I thought it would arrive faster if I ordered it from within the EU..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is sth0805 affiliated with Coollaboratory in any way?


There are stores within the EU that sell it as well, I know of at least one here in Sweden. And when there's one, there's bound to be more!


----------



## arm3nianx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> dont even bother... do you still ahve your comp parts? I'd assemble out of case quick and try to see if image appears on screen if not... it looks dead to me...










Was gonna sell for ~800 with block, screw my luck.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arm3nianx*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Was gonna sell for ~800 with block, screw my luck.


Well... what I woudl do it talk to EVGA or whoever the manufacturer is really... I would just talk to them about it and just try to see if it runs...

Also did you try to remove the heatsink when it was cold or after it being warm? and how long was the application on there for?


----------



## skyn3t

Hey I just want to share my Delid Process after lapped.
add me in

I had to spoiler because it is a lap and delid process


Spoiler: Guide - i7 3770k get's LapPeD & DeliddeD.: Spoiler!



I just want to share this since I lapped my old fella 3570K 4.7 @ 1.34v temp's dropped very much top was 65 under heave load







in my loop. I decide to follow the same path for my new 3770k









I have seen many video out there using a bunch of sand papers with various grid. and ppl making video part 1 and part 2 to finish the work. I did it in half time and it does worked very well for me. you just need to do it right not just slap the CPU in the sand paper and go back and forth







LOL.

Here is the material list .

CPU








Blue Tape
skyn3t logo








Arcticlean 1 & 2
Brasso silver polish
100% cotton rag. "old shirt"
Flat surface like , Glass table, mirror or even the glass from the photo frame with you picture when you was a baby running naked








Sand paper grit 180
Sand paper grit 220
Sand paper grit 440

*Part I*
Material forgot to take pics from my sand papers sorry














Preparation : I just come out with this idea, just to be sure none of the sand paper and the copper dust won't get into the small chip in the back of the CPU. "Precautions"

tape the back of CPU make a clean cut like it show below


fold the edge's like so.


Now is it protectec










Now is it protectec










Draw a two way arrow, following the DIE direction.


*Part II 180 Grit*
Time to work easy not too much pressure only hold it down let your arm sit a bit on it and back :yessir and forth : 180 Grit
12 section of 50 sanding down+ total 600 times back and forth.
Alwasy follow the arrow












After 600 pass sanding on 180 grit. The 180 grit won't scratch too much deep, you just need to stay in the same lane all the time "don't clean the sand paper dust let it be" remember to work easy. this is the result a got.after 1400 pass










*Part III 220 grit*

I wrote "A" and "B" to the arrow so just to no get lost












result after 1000 pass with 220 grit, just to smooth the 180 grint and work very easy on the flattering surface.


*Part III 440 grit*

This is how I did mine you may disagree with it but I found it way better than just use the dry 440 grit till you smooth it out on almost mirror finish.

The first 400 pass It was drye sand paper.
After 400 passI put two drops of "ArticClean" in the sand paper, pic below show different thing







. I was going to drop and a sprayed the thing a quick paper towel to fix the mess.


here is the result after 1000 with two drops of "articClean" pass with 440 grit. total pass 1400










*Part III Polishing*

Brasso Silver polish
100% Cotton rag
Glass surface.

here you work until you get the result you want, Polishing part is optional but a very clean copper surface polished does look way better.
















*Final part testing temp's*

It may not give you the top temp drop but is does make difference. Few "C" drop's is always welcome
Thermal paste used IC Dimond carat 7, This is the best thermal compound I have used for years no cure time temp's drops right after application and test.

skyn3t
08/02/13

3770k
4.7Ghz @ 1.312
TB Volt +0.020
DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
Offset +0.070

Max tem on IBT and Wprime
78 - 87 - 85 - 82

Max Tem on wPrime
71 - 76 - 73 - 73

After lapped
3770k
4.7Ghz @ 1.312
TB Volt +0.020
DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
Offset +0.070

Max tem on IBT
75 - 83 - 82 - 79

Max Tem on wPrime
67 - 68 - 66 - 67

IBT Before


IBT After


Linx before


Linx after


wPrime before


wprime after


I'm still working in my voltages and temp's

PS: everyone has a different way to work so this is mine hope you guys like it.









Now Is Delid time, I think I'm mad today,









Tools list
skyn3t logo








hammer
CPU
Tiger wood - Why used tiger wood? have a look here and you will know how hard this wood is. since I work with wood we have tons the shop.
WOOD SPECIES (Hardest to Softest) chart



I had to use bamboo Dish plate holder it is about 1/16" of a inch tick to lift up the first knock down wood peace.
so this way the IHS CPU can stay firm the the first peace wood like show in the picture below and the PCB stay on top in the knock down peace wood. I cablled It t" knock down" is because I going to use that peace of wood to hit with the hammed and remove the IHS out










different angle just to have idea what I'm talk about.


It toke me tree hit to remove it, it is very easy and 100% fool proof tha you not going to damage the PCB and trash the CPU after using razor blade. a lot people are using different tolls to remove the IHS with the same method. I was afraid to put my CPU in the Vise Clamp.


























Look how shine the DIE is







can you see my camera lens ?














Now, are you serious Intel? How much crap you put under the IHS LOL , the money you safe in the thermal paste you used in the GLU to hold the IHS in place.












Hey this is the temp after the delid process.
Thermal paste used on DIE and IHS is
IC Diamond Carat 7

wPrime before Lapped



wPrime After Lapped


wPrime after delid












hope you guys like it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Hey I just want to share my Delid Process after lapped.
> add me in
> 
> I had to spoiler because it is a lap and delid process
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Guide - i7 3770k get's LapPeD & DeliddeD.: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I just want to share this since I lapped my old fella 3570K 4.7 @ 1.34v temp's dropped very much top was 65 under heave load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> in my loop. I decide to follow the same path for my new 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen many video out there using a bunch of sand papers with various grid. and ppl making video part 1 and part 2 to finish the work. I did it in half time and it does worked very well for me. you just need to do it right not just slap the CPU in the sand paper and go back and forth
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL.
> 
> Here is the material list .
> 
> CPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Blue Tape
> skyn3t logo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Arcticlean 1 & 2
> Brasso silver polish
> 100% cotton rag. "old shirt"
> Flat surface like , Glass table, mirror or even the glass from the photo frame with you picture when you was a baby running naked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sand paper grit 180
> Sand paper grit 220
> Sand paper grit 440
> 
> *Part I*
> Material forgot to take pics from my sand papers sorry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Preparation : I just come out with this idea, just to be sure none of the sand paper and the copper dust won't get into the small chip in the back of the CPU. "Precautions"
> 
> tape the back of CPU make a clean cut like it show below
> 
> 
> fold the edge's like so.
> 
> 
> Now is it protectec
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now is it protectec
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Draw a two way arrow, following the DIE direction.
> 
> 
> *Part II 180 Grit*
> Time to work easy not too much pressure only hold it down let your arm sit a bit on it and back :yessir and forth : 180 Grit
> 12 section of 50 sanding down+ total 600 times back and forth.
> Alwasy follow the arrow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After 600 pass sanding on 180 grit. The 180 grit won't scratch too much deep, you just need to stay in the same lane all the time "don't clean the sand paper dust let it be" remember to work easy. this is the result a got.after 1400 pass
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Part III 220 grit*
> 
> I wrote "A" and "B" to the arrow so just to no get lost
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> result after 1000 pass with 220 grit, just to smooth the 180 grint and work very easy on the flattering surface.
> 
> 
> *Part III 440 grit*
> 
> This is how I did mine you may disagree with it but I found it way better than just use the dry 440 grit till you smooth it out on almost mirror finish.
> 
> The first 400 pass It was drye sand paper.
> After 400 passI put two drops of "ArticClean" in the sand paper, pic below show different thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I was going to drop and a sprayed the thing a quick paper towel to fix the mess.
> 
> 
> here is the result after 1000 with two drops of "articClean" pass with 440 grit. total pass 1400
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Part III Polishing*
> 
> Brasso Silver polish
> 100% Cotton rag
> Glass surface.
> 
> here you work until you get the result you want, Polishing part is optional but a very clean copper surface polished does look way better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Final part testing temp's*
> 
> It may not give you the top temp drop but is does make difference. Few "C" drop's is always welcome
> Thermal paste used IC Dimond carat 7, This is the best thermal compound I have used for years no cure time temp's drops right after application and test.
> 
> skyn3t
> 08/02/13
> 
> 3770k
> 4.7Ghz @ 1.312
> TB Volt +0.020
> DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
> Offset +0.070
> 
> Max tem on IBT and Wprime
> 78 - 87 - 85 - 82
> 
> Max Tem on wPrime
> 71 - 76 - 73 - 73
> 
> After lapped
> 3770k
> 4.7Ghz @ 1.312
> TB Volt +0.020
> DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
> Offset +0.070
> 
> Max tem on IBT
> 75 - 83 - 82 - 79
> 
> Max Tem on wPrime
> 67 - 68 - 66 - 67
> 
> IBT Before
> 
> 
> IBT After
> 
> 
> Linx before
> 
> 
> Linx after
> 
> 
> wPrime before
> 
> 
> wprime after
> 
> 
> I'm still working in my voltages and temp's
> 
> PS: everyone has a different way to work so this is mine hope you guys like it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now Is Delid time, I think I'm mad today,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tools list
> skyn3t logo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hammer
> CPU
> Tiger wood - Why used tiger wood? have a look here and you will know how hard this wood is. since I work with wood we have tons the shop.
> WOOD SPECIES (Hardest to Softest) chart
> 
> 
> 
> I had to use bamboo Dish plate holder it is about 1/16" of a inch tick to lift up the first knock down wood peace.
> so this way the IHS CPU can stay firm the the first peace wood like show in the picture below and the PCB stay on top in the knock down peace wood. I cablled It t" knock down" is because I going to use that peace of wood to hit with the hammed and remove the IHS out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> different angle just to have idea what I'm talk about.
> 
> 
> It toke me tree hit to remove it, it is very easy and 100% fool proof tha you not going to damage the PCB and trash the CPU after using razor blade. a lot people are using different tolls to remove the IHS with the same method. I was afraid to put my CPU in the Vise Clamp.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look how shine the DIE is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can you see my camera lens ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, are you serious Intel? How much crap you put under the IHS LOL , the money you safe in the thermal paste you used in the GLU to hold the IHS in place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey this is the temp after the delid process.
> Thermal paste used on DIE and IHS is
> IC Diamond Carat 7
> 
> wPrime before Lapped
> 
> 
> 
> wPrime After Lapped
> 
> 
> wPrime after delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hope you guys like it


I enjoyed it a lot actually! very nicely done









As for the adding in on the front page there is a format that you can quickly fill and I'll add you right away!


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I enjoyed it a lot actually! very nicely done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As for the adding in on the front page there is a format that you can quickly fill and I'll add you right away!


yeah... doing it right now. can't find the link there


----------



## zpaf

Finally decide to delid my 3770K.
I am waiting for CLP so I use AS5 on die and IHS.
I couldn't pass linx at 4800 before


----------



## arm3nianx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well... what I woudl do it talk to EVGA or whoever the manufacturer is really... I would just talk to them about it and just try to see if it runs...
> 
> Also did you try to remove the heatsink when it was cold or after it being warm? and how long was the application on there for?


Well it is EVGA... hopefully they have a good warranty system? I had the computer on like an hour ago before I removed, I didn't do anything with it though just booted and wiped my drives. It took quite a bit of force to remove the block, but I don't think I applied enough force to rip the die like that. The same thing happend with my 3770k, I literally had to use pliers to remove the heatsink from the copper block, but the die survived w/o any harm. I've had CLP on them for a year now I think.

Bios is modded, but I don't think anyone can tell now lol. Technically they do support removing the original block since they have their own waterblocks for sale right... Hope I can do something with it, $1200 paperweight = bad.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Hey I just want to share my Delid Process after lapped.
> add me in
> 
> I had to spoiler because it is a lap and delid process
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Guide - i7 3770k get's LapPeD & DeliddeD.: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I just want to share this since I lapped my old fella 3570K 4.7 @ 1.34v temp's dropped very much top was 65 under heave load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> in my loop. I decide to follow the same path for my new 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen many video out there using a bunch of sand papers with various grid. and ppl making video part 1 and part 2 to finish the work. I did it in half time and it does worked very well for me. you just need to do it right not just slap the CPU in the sand paper and go back and forth
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL.
> 
> Here is the material list .
> 
> CPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Blue Tape
> skyn3t logo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Arcticlean 1 & 2
> Brasso silver polish
> 100% cotton rag. "old shirt"
> Flat surface like , Glass table, mirror or even the glass from the photo frame with you picture when you was a baby running naked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sand paper grit 180
> Sand paper grit 220
> Sand paper grit 440
> 
> *Part I*
> Material forgot to take pics from my sand papers sorry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Preparation : I just come out with this idea, just to be sure none of the sand paper and the copper dust won't get into the small chip in the back of the CPU. "Precautions"
> 
> tape the back of CPU make a clean cut like it show below
> 
> 
> fold the edge's like so.
> 
> 
> Now is it protectec
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now is it protectec
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Draw a two way arrow, following the DIE direction.
> 
> 
> *Part II 180 Grit*
> Time to work easy not too much pressure only hold it down let your arm sit a bit on it and back :yessir and forth : 180 Grit
> 12 section of 50 sanding down+ total 600 times back and forth.
> Alwasy follow the arrow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After 600 pass sanding on 180 grit. The 180 grit won't scratch too much deep, you just need to stay in the same lane all the time "don't clean the sand paper dust let it be" remember to work easy. this is the result a got.after 1400 pass
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Part III 220 grit*
> 
> I wrote "A" and "B" to the arrow so just to no get lost
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> result after 1000 pass with 220 grit, just to smooth the 180 grint and work very easy on the flattering surface.
> 
> 
> *Part III 440 grit*
> 
> This is how I did mine you may disagree with it but I found it way better than just use the dry 440 grit till you smooth it out on almost mirror finish.
> 
> The first 400 pass It was drye sand paper.
> After 400 passI put two drops of "ArticClean" in the sand paper, pic below show different thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I was going to drop and a sprayed the thing a quick paper towel to fix the mess.
> 
> 
> here is the result after 1000 with two drops of "articClean" pass with 440 grit. total pass 1400
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Part III Polishing*
> 
> Brasso Silver polish
> 100% Cotton rag
> Glass surface.
> 
> here you work until you get the result you want, Polishing part is optional but a very clean copper surface polished does look way better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Final part testing temp's*
> 
> It may not give you the top temp drop but is does make difference. Few "C" drop's is always welcome
> Thermal paste used IC Dimond carat 7, This is the best thermal compound I have used for years no cure time temp's drops right after application and test.
> 
> skyn3t
> 08/02/13
> 
> 3770k
> 4.7Ghz @ 1.312
> TB Volt +0.020
> DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
> Offset +0.070
> 
> Max tem on IBT and Wprime
> 78 - 87 - 85 - 82
> 
> Max Tem on wPrime
> 71 - 76 - 73 - 73
> 
> After lapped
> 3770k
> 4.7Ghz @ 1.312
> TB Volt +0.020
> DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
> Offset +0.070
> 
> Max tem on IBT
> 75 - 83 - 82 - 79
> 
> Max Tem on wPrime
> 67 - 68 - 66 - 67
> 
> IBT Before
> 
> 
> IBT After
> 
> 
> Linx before
> 
> 
> Linx after
> 
> 
> wPrime before
> 
> 
> wprime after
> 
> 
> I'm still working in my voltages and temp's
> 
> PS: everyone has a different way to work so this is mine hope you guys like it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now Is Delid time, I think I'm mad today,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tools list
> skyn3t logo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hammer
> CPU
> Tiger wood - Why used tiger wood? have a look here and you will know how hard this wood is. since I work with wood we have tons the shop.
> WOOD SPECIES (Hardest to Softest) chart
> 
> 
> 
> I had to use bamboo Dish plate holder it is about 1/16" of a inch tick to lift up the first knock down wood peace.
> so this way the IHS CPU can stay firm the the first peace wood like show in the picture below and the PCB stay on top in the knock down peace wood. I cablled It t" knock down" is because I going to use that peace of wood to hit with the hammed and remove the IHS out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> different angle just to have idea what I'm talk about.
> 
> 
> It toke me tree hit to remove it, it is very easy and 100% fool proof tha you not going to damage the PCB and trash the CPU after using razor blade. a lot people are using different tolls to remove the IHS with the same method. I was afraid to put my CPU in the Vise Clamp.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look how shine the DIE is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can you see my camera lens ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, are you serious Intel? How much crap you put under the IHS LOL , the money you safe in the thermal paste you used in the GLU to hold the IHS in place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey this is the temp after the delid process.
> Thermal paste used on DIE and IHS is
> IC Diamond Carat 7
> 
> wPrime before Lapped
> 
> 
> 
> wPrime After Lapped
> 
> 
> wPrime after delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hope you guys like it


nice job but when you delid most of the stress goes to pcb right?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Hey I just want to share my Delid Process after lapped.
> add me in
> 
> I had to spoiler because it is a lap and delid process
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Guide - i7 3770k get's LapPeD & DeliddeD.: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I just want to share this since I lapped my old fella 3570K 4.7 @ 1.34v temp's dropped very much top was 65 under heave load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> in my loop. I decide to follow the same path for my new 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen many video out there using a bunch of sand papers with various grid. and ppl making video part 1 and part 2 to finish the work. I did it in half time and it does worked very well for me. you just need to do it right not just slap the CPU in the sand paper and go back and forth
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL.
> 
> Here is the material list .
> 
> CPU
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Blue Tape
> skyn3t logo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Arcticlean 1 & 2
> Brasso silver polish
> 100% cotton rag. "old shirt"
> Flat surface like , Glass table, mirror or even the glass from the photo frame with you picture when you was a baby running naked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sand paper grit 180
> Sand paper grit 220
> Sand paper grit 440
> 
> *Part I*
> Material forgot to take pics from my sand papers sorry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Preparation : I just come out with this idea, just to be sure none of the sand paper and the copper dust won't get into the small chip in the back of the CPU. "Precautions"
> 
> tape the back of CPU make a clean cut like it show below
> 
> 
> fold the edge's like so.
> 
> 
> Now is it protectec
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now is it protectec
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Draw a two way arrow, following the DIE direction.
> 
> 
> *Part II 180 Grit*
> Time to work easy not too much pressure only hold it down let your arm sit a bit on it and back :yessir and forth : 180 Grit
> 12 section of 50 sanding down+ total 600 times back and forth.
> Alwasy follow the arrow
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After 600 pass sanding on 180 grit. The 180 grit won't scratch too much deep, you just need to stay in the same lane all the time "don't clean the sand paper dust let it be" remember to work easy. this is the result a got.after 1400 pass
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Part III 220 grit*
> 
> I wrote "A" and "B" to the arrow so just to no get lost
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> result after 1000 pass with 220 grit, just to smooth the 180 grint and work very easy on the flattering surface.
> 
> 
> *Part III 440 grit*
> 
> This is how I did mine you may disagree with it but I found it way better than just use the dry 440 grit till you smooth it out on almost mirror finish.
> 
> The first 400 pass It was drye sand paper.
> After 400 passI put two drops of "ArticClean" in the sand paper, pic below show different thing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . I was going to drop and a sprayed the thing a quick paper towel to fix the mess.
> 
> 
> here is the result after 1000 with two drops of "articClean" pass with 440 grit. total pass 1400
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Part III Polishing*
> 
> Brasso Silver polish
> 100% Cotton rag
> Glass surface.
> 
> here you work until you get the result you want, Polishing part is optional but a very clean copper surface polished does look way better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Final part testing temp's*
> 
> It may not give you the top temp drop but is does make difference. Few "C" drop's is always welcome
> Thermal paste used IC Dimond carat 7, This is the best thermal compound I have used for years no cure time temp's drops right after application and test.
> 
> skyn3t
> 08/02/13
> 
> 3770k
> 4.7Ghz @ 1.312
> TB Volt +0.020
> DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
> Offset +0.070
> 
> Max tem on IBT and Wprime
> 78 - 87 - 85 - 82
> 
> Max Tem on wPrime
> 71 - 76 - 73 - 73
> 
> After lapped
> 3770k
> 4.7Ghz @ 1.312
> TB Volt +0.020
> DRAM 1600Mhz 9-9-9-24-2 @ 1.5v
> Offset +0.070
> 
> Max tem on IBT
> 75 - 83 - 82 - 79
> 
> Max Tem on wPrime
> 67 - 68 - 66 - 67
> 
> IBT Before
> 
> 
> IBT After
> 
> 
> Linx before
> 
> 
> Linx after
> 
> 
> wPrime before
> 
> 
> wprime after
> 
> 
> I'm still working in my voltages and temp's
> 
> PS: everyone has a different way to work so this is mine hope you guys like it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now Is Delid time, I think I'm mad today,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tools list
> skyn3t logo
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hammer
> CPU
> Tiger wood - Why used tiger wood? have a look here and you will know how hard this wood is. since I work with wood we have tons the shop.
> WOOD SPECIES (Hardest to Softest) chart
> 
> 
> 
> I had to use bamboo Dish plate holder it is about 1/16" of a inch tick to lift up the first knock down wood peace.
> so this way the IHS CPU can stay firm the the first peace wood like show in the picture below and the PCB stay on top in the knock down peace wood. I cablled It t" knock down" is because I going to use that peace of wood to hit with the hammed and remove the IHS out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> different angle just to have idea what I'm talk about.
> 
> 
> It toke me tree hit to remove it, it is very easy and 100% fool proof tha you not going to damage the PCB and trash the CPU after using razor blade. a lot people are using different tolls to remove the IHS with the same method. I was afraid to put my CPU in the Vise Clamp.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look how shine the DIE is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can you see my camera lens ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now, are you serious Intel? How much crap you put under the IHS LOL , the money you safe in the thermal paste you used in the GLU to hold the IHS in place.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey this is the temp after the delid process.
> Thermal paste used on DIE and IHS is
> IC Diamond Carat 7
> 
> wPrime before Lapped
> 
> 
> 
> wPrime After Lapped
> 
> 
> wPrime after delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hope you guys like it


Hey, awesome









What are your linx temps (~64gflops) after delid on those clocks, volts vs before?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

OK... I'd finally like to join (already did my 3570K in my work PC but forgot to take down info prior to delid!







) so here is my submission for my 3770K in my main rig which finally lost it's head last night.









OCN name: *DiGiCiDAL*
CPU: *3770K*
on die-TIM: *CLU*
ihs-TIM: *PK-1*
Mhz gained: *400MHz* (temps still good but voltages limited OC)
OC after delid: *4.9GHz* (suicidal voltages) & *4.7GHz* (ultra-stable for 24/7)
Temp drops: 21C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: HERE

Prior to delidding:

Hottest core= 79C Cores Delta=13C vCore required for stability=1.296V

After delidding (at same 4.5GHz clock):

Hottest core=58C Cores Delta=4C vCore required for stability=1.256V









Top OC validated (but voltages too high to run 24/7)... still, I was hitting 100C on a core at 4.7GHz with .15V less vCore prior to delidding this sucker!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> OK... I'd finally like to join (already did my 3570K in my work PC but forgot to take down info prior to delid!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) so here is my submission for my 3770K in my main rig which finally lost it's head last night.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *DiGiCiDAL*
> CPU: *3770K*
> on die-TIM: *CLU*
> ihs-TIM: *PK-1*
> Mhz gained: *400MHz* (temps still good but voltages limited OC)
> OC after delid: *4.9GHz* (suicidal voltages) & *4.7GHz* (ultra-stable for 24/7)
> Temp drops: 21C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: HERE
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Prior to delidding:
> 
> Hottest core= 79C Cores Delta=13C vCore required for stability=1.296V
> 
> After delidding (at same 4.5GHz clock):
> 
> Hottest core=58C Cores Delta=4C vCore required for stability=1.256V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Top OC validated (but voltages too high to run 24/7)... still, I was hitting 100C on a core at 4.7GHz with .15V less vCore prior to delidding this sucker!


You're in!







very nice temp drops sir!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> very nice temp drops sir!


Thank you! And yes they are very nice... I could have delidded and skipped adding a 3rd 360mm radiator, but then again who am I kidding? I'd have still added more rad even if my temps were this good before delidding.

I credit you and all those who have gone topless before me for turning a







CPU into a







CPU!


----------



## Agoniizing

I want to join the club









OCN name: *Agoniizing*
CPU: *3770K*
on die-TIM: *CLP*
ihs-TIM: *PK-1*
Mhz gained: *300MHz*
OC after delid: *4.8GHz (vCore for stability 1.43)*
Temp drops: 21C at 4.5GHz


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Before delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore


After delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore


After delid 4.8GHz 1.43 vCore


My delidded 3770k


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> I want to join the club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *Agoniizing*
> CPU: *3770K*
> on die-TIM: *CLP*
> ihs-TIM: *PK-1*
> Mhz gained: *300MHz*
> OC after delid: *4.8GHz (vCore for stability 1.43)*
> Temp drops: 21C at 4.5GHz
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Before delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore
> 
> 
> After delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore
> 
> 
> After delid 4.8GHz 1.43 vCore
> 
> 
> My delidded 3770k


I can add you, welcome to the club!


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I can add you, welcome to the club!


Thanks babe


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Thank you! And yes they are very nice... I could have delidded and skipped adding a 3rd 360mm radiator, but then again who am I kidding? I'd have still added more rad even if my temps were this good before delidding.
> 
> I credit you and all those who have gone topless before me for turning a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU into a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU!


No problem at all! I made it so people can know everything they will ever need to about it! and if not ask anything (yes even OT stuff







)








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> I want to join the club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *Agoniizing*
> CPU: *3770K*
> on die-TIM: *CLP*
> ihs-TIM: *PK-1*
> Mhz gained: *300MHz*
> OC after delid: *4.8GHz (vCore for stability 1.43)*
> Temp drops: 21C at 4.5GHz
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Before delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore
> 
> 
> After delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore
> 
> 
> After delid 4.8GHz 1.43 vCore
> 
> 
> My delidded 3770k










I GOT NINJA'D AGAIN!!!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I can add you, welcome to the club!


I'm watchin you boy.........


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Thank you! And yes they are very nice... I could have delidded and skipped adding a 3rd 360mm radiator, but then again who am I kidding? I'd have still added more rad even if my temps were this good before delidding.
> 
> I credit you and all those who have gone topless before me for turning a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU into a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU!
> 
> 
> 
> No problem at all! I made it so people can know everything they will ever need to about it! and if not ask anything (yes even OT stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Agoniizing*
> 
> I want to join the club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *Agoniizing*
> CPU: *3770K*
> on die-TIM: *CLP*
> ihs-TIM: *PK-1*
> Mhz gained: *300MHz*
> OC after delid: *4.8GHz (vCore for stability 1.43)*
> Temp drops: 21C at 4.5GHz
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Before delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore
> 
> 
> After delid 4.5GHz 1.24 vCore
> 
> 
> After delid 4.8GHz 1.43 vCore
> 
> 
> My delidded 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I GOT NINJA'D AGAIN!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I can add you, welcome to the club!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm watchin you boy.........
Click to expand...

You can add in the morning and afternoon, I'm far too lazy for that.







I do like adding in the dark though. Hahaha, I'm a true ninja!


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zpaf*
> 
> Finally decide to delid my 3770K.
> I am waiting for CLP so I use AS5 on die and IHS.
> I couldn't pass linx at 4800 before
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


good work buddy, and yep better thermal past will drop it a lot more.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> nice job but when you delid most of the stress goes to pcb right?


Yes,when you put the wood on the pcb make sure it is nice and even on both side this way all the stress stays parallel, this is the key of using this method. it is safe and 100% fool proof to not cut the pcb layer and damage CPU. After saw how amazing the temp is I will not have any more CPU with stock thermal compound.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hey, awesome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What are your linx temps (~64gflops) after delid on those clocks, volts vs before?


Linx Gflops always going to be cut in half when using Hyperthreading cores if you disable the HT it shows like IBT 100's and up. but people has been told the IBT is not good thing when using with Ivy, it does push the temp's way above tha you need to get your stable result'sa. prime95 and linx will be better.


----------



## stickg1

@skyn3t, really enjoying this pump!

http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/stickg1/media/watercoolMVF1_zps42f91082.jpg.html


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> @skyn3t, really enjoying this pump!
> 
> http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/stickg1/media/watercoolMVF1_zps42f91082.jpg.html


this is one of the kinda man.It is good to see you doing great.


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> OK... I'd finally like to join (already did my 3570K in my work PC but forgot to take down info prior to delid!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) so here is my submission for my 3770K in my main rig which finally lost it's head last night.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: *DiGiCiDAL*
> CPU: *3770K*
> on die-TIM: *CLU*
> ihs-TIM: *PK-1*
> Mhz gained: *400MHz* (temps still good but voltages limited OC)
> OC after delid: *4.9GHz* (suicidal voltages) & *4.7GHz* (ultra-stable for 24/7)
> Temp drops: 21C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: HERE
> 
> Prior to delidding:
> 
> Hottest core= 79C Cores Delta=13C vCore required for stability=1.296V
> 
> After delidding (at same 4.5GHz clock):
> 
> Hottest core=58C Cores Delta=4C vCore required for stability=1.256V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Top OC validated (but voltages too high to run 24/7)... still, I was hitting 100C on a core at 4.7GHz with .15V less vCore prior to delidding this sucker!


1024 mb standard run of IBT with 28000+ mb available = no joy.
90% ram usage is generally recommended for optimal testing of stability and makes quite the difference in temps.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> 1024 mb standard run of IBT with 28000+ mb available = no joy.
> 90% ram usage is generally recommended for optimal testing of stability and makes quite the difference in temps.


I don't consider _any_ setting of IBT to be of any value as far as stability is concerned whatsoever... I'm running a 24h Prime95 blend at the moment for that purpose.

However, as per the instructions on submission for membership:
Quote:


> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz (if you are having issues let us know on here and we will help you achieve this!)
> *2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program)*
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started)
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp from your four cores.
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)


If you're interested however, I'll go ahead and run an IBT with 30GB RAM once I'm done with my Prime95 run - assuming it doesn't crash in the 18hr mark which seems to be my luck on the last couple CPUs... previous one actually too two bumps in vCore to beat it (first bump up also saw P95 quit around 18hr)... so took me 5 days to actually complete a 24hr run.









I'll post up my temps on a 30GB RAM run of IBT tomorrow or later today (depending on whether or not it's crashed).


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> @skyn3t, really enjoying this pump!
> 
> http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/stickg1/media/watercoolMVF1_zps42f91082.jpg.html


Is that a Fractal case ??


----------



## MiiX

Ye, I think its an Arc Midi


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey Stick, glad to see you got your loop together. Looks nice! Good job! What pump are you using?

I'm also rocking out my loop in my Fractal Design case. It's a XL R2. Didn't bother doing it neatly though because its only temporary until I get my Mountain Mods Ascension on Thursday. I'm running dual loops with dual MCP655's. Wasn't able to fit all my rads in this case so I'm just using an EK Coolstream 140mm for my CPU and an Alphacool UT60 280mm and XSPC RS240 for my 7950's. Temps are great! Can't wait to get my mountain mods so I can throw my two 360mm rads in there along with all my other rads.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> Is that a Fractal case ??


Yessir, Fractal Arc Midi R2. Absolutely love Fractals. Although I'm a little bummed that the new Mini R2 came out with native support for a 360mm up top. Technically I could do that with my Midi R2 if I drill a few holes because there is plenty of space after removing the 5.25" cage.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey Stick, glad to see you got your loop together. Looks nice! Good job! What pump are you using?
> 
> I'm also rocking out my loop in my Fractal Design case. It's a XL R2. Didn't bother doing it neatly though because its only temporary until I get my Mountain Mods Ascension on Thursday. I'm running dual loops with dual MCP655's. Wasn't able to fit all my rads in this case so I'm just using an EK Coolstream 140mm for my CPU and an Alphacool UT60 280mm and XSPC RS240 for my 7950's. Temps are great! Can't wait to get my mountain mods so I can throw my two 360mm rads in there along with all my other rads.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice! I love Fractals, they're nice and clean looking but not over the top with all sorts of bump outs and flashiness. Although Mountain Mods are in a league of their own!

I'm using a MCP655-b. I wish I had gotten the vario version but I was ignorant to that aspect of my loop when I bought it. But to be fair, skyn3t gave me a smokin' deal on the pump and with it at full speed all the time I can't hear it and the flow rate is on point.

I delidded a pretty nasty 3770K, I need 1.33v for 4.5GHz stable, 5GHz is unattainable. Part of me wants a better chip, but the more sensible half is saying "4.6GHz on a 3770K is plenty".


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yessir, Fractal Arc Midi R2. Absolutely love Fractals. Although I'm a little bummed that the new Mini R2 came out with native support for a 360mm up top. Technically I could do that with my Midi R2 if I drill a few holes because there is plenty of space after removing the 5.25" cage.
> Nice! I love Fractals, they're nice and clean looking but not over the top with all sorts of bump outs and flashiness. Although Mountain Mods are in a league of their own!
> 
> I'm using a MCP655-b. I wish I had gotten the vario version but I was ignorant to that aspect of my loop when I bought it. But to be fair, skyn3t gave me a smokin' deal on the pump and with it at full speed all the time I can't hear it and the flow rate is on point.
> 
> I delidded a pretty nasty 3770K, I need 1.33v for 4.5GHz stable, 5GHz is unattainable. Part of me wants a better chip, but the more sensible half is saying "4.6GHz on a 3770K is plenty".


Yea I have a MCP655-b and a MCP655 in my loop.


----------



## RickRockerr

I decided to lap my already delidded 3570k







Temp drop is about 1°C on each core and temp difference between cores is now only few decrees.


----------



## mojobear

Hi there...delidded for a while but didnt actually test the cpu prior to delid...dododo.







So unfortunately dont have the before delid temps







Hope I can still be added.

OCN name: mojobear
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: Not sure, just delidded like a boss








OC after delid: 4800 mhz
Temp drops: not sure, but I get max 74 C with the IBT
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2882392


----------



## zpaf

Waiting for Phobya Liquid Metal Paste LM.
Here is with AS5 on die and ihs.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mojobear*
> 
> Hi there...delidded for a while but didnt actually test the cpu prior to delid...dododo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So unfortunately dont have the before delid temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope I can still be added.
> 
> OCN name: mojobear
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: Not sure, just delidded like a boss
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OC after delid: 4800 mhz
> Temp drops: not sure, but I get max 74 C with the IBT
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2882392


You're in!







Now go and be a bear! Rawr!


----------



## EarlZ

I am tempted to delid but I am still uncertain if I will be using the vice or razor method. Current with the temps I am getting at h.264 encoding ( its the only work load I do that puts a lot of strain on the CPU for extended amounts of time ) I am getting 93-91-90-80 (4.5Ghz @ 1.344vcore) with NZKT Kraken X60, some are reporting about ~20c drop, should I expect the 80c on one of the cores to drop to something like 75c and the other cores would be something like 1-2c difference between them? I already have my CLP ready.


----------



## Forceman

Use the vise method, and you should expect low 70s across the board after delidding, with the same workload. I've got mine delidded, running 4.4 @ 1.335, and I barely crack 70c running Handbrake with an X60 in silent mode.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EarlZ*
> 
> I am tempted to delid but I am still uncertain if I will be using the vice or razor method. Current with the temps I am getting at h.264 encoding ( its the only work load I do that puts a lot of strain on the CPU for extended amounts of time ) I am getting 93-91-90-80 (4.5Ghz @ 1.344vcore) with NZKT Kraken X60, some are reporting about ~20c drop, should I expect the 80c on one of the cores to drop to something like 75c and the other cores would be something like 1-2c difference between them? I already have my CLP ready.


Expect around 20C drops, most of us experience about that. It all depends on how much glue Intel put on your chip. Mine dropped around 27C. Went from high 80s to the cool 50s.

I am partial towards the razor method unless you have a Haswell, in which I recommend the Vice Method.

Razor Method Guide: Razor Guide By Me 

Vice Method Guide: Vice Guide By Kuufa


----------



## Valgaur

hmmmm Val is considering a new case for his redo of his build.....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119265


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmmm Val is considering a new case for his redo of his build.....
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119265


Why that case? A specific reason why?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mojobear*
> 
> Hi there...delidded for a while but didnt actually test the cpu prior to delid...dododo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So unfortunately dont have the before delid temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope I can still be added.
> 
> OCN name: mojobear
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: Not sure, just delidded like a boss
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OC after delid: 4800 mhz
> Temp drops: not sure, but I get max 74 C with the IBT
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2882392
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


you need to get a better thermal past for the IHS, I do recommend IC Diamond carat 7, "keep in mind when remove it it can fade off the engraved names on the IHS for stock users"







since we are not stock it will drop your temp a lot better than MX-4 "no offence but MX-4 seems to be a worse tim to be used.

have a look here and you will see how good the IC Diamond is









http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-gets-lapped-delidded


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why that case? A specific reason why?


no specific reason really. Just liek the look of it and thinking about a smaller much easier to move case really...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> you need to get a better thermal past for the IHS, I do recommend IC Diamond carat 7, "keep in mind when remove it it can fade off the engraved names on the IHS for stock users"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> since we are not stock it will drop your temp a lot better than MX-4 "no offence but MX-4 seems to be a worse tim to be used.
> 
> have a look here and you will see how good the IC Diamond is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-gets-lapped-delidded


OR be baller and use CLP/CLU on the IHS as well....


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> no specific reason really. Just liek the look of it and thinking about a smaller much easier to move case really...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OR be baller and use CLP/CLU on the IHS as well....


you got it


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Why that case? A specific reason why?
> 
> 
> 
> no specific reason really. Just liek the look of it and thinking about a smaller much easier to move case really...
Click to expand...

Assuming you got an ATX board, why don't you look at the Corsair C70? It's on sale frequently dropping it to $80 - $90 and it looks amazing. Its cable management potential exceeds far more than other cases of its kind.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Assuming you got an ATX board, why don't you look at the Corsair C70? It's on sale frequently dropping it to $80 - $90 and it looks amazing. Its cable management potential exceeds far more than other cases of its kind.


I haz the gene on the way with my baller deal on my 680! Thanks again Capin Crunch!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Assuming you got an ATX board, why don't you look at the Corsair C70? It's on sale frequently dropping it to $80 - $90 and it looks amazing. Its cable management potential exceeds far more than other cases of its kind.
> 
> 
> 
> I haz the gene on the way with my baller deal on my 680! Thanks again Capin Crunch!
Click to expand...

Lol, well the C70 still looks amazing with the Gene.


----------



## Supacasey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> you need to get a better thermal past for the IHS, I do recommend IC Diamond carat 7, "keep in mind when remove it it can fade off the engraved names on the IHS for stock users"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> since we are not stock it will drop your temp a lot better than MX-4 "no offence but MX-4 seems to be a worse tim to be used.
> 
> have a look here and you will see how good the IC Diamond is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-gets-lapped-delidded


Not to start a TIM war, but I used to be a devout IC7 advocate. After MX4 I've seen the light. I've been swapping around 3770k's, was using IC7 but ran out, and tried MX4. No temperature difference and MX4 was much easier to work with (I was so used to IC7 that when I first applied the MX4 I almost squeezed the plunger too hard) and it won't stain the IHS like IC7 almost always does.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmmm Val is considering a new case for his redo of his build.....
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119265


http://www.redharbinger.com/product/pre-sale-us-release-limited-edition-cross-desk/#prettyPhoto


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I haz the gene on the way with my baller deal on my 680! Thanks again Capin Crunch!


Get a Fractal Arc Mini R2. Native support for 360mm up top and 240mm UT up front. Ballin'!!!


----------



## zpaf

Finally I can see low temps after delid with Phobya Liquid Metal.

Ai Overclock Tuner X.M.P
Ratio Limit 47
CPU Manual Voltage 1.275

before



after


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zpaf*
> 
> Finally I can see low temps after delid with Phobya Liquid Metal.
> 
> Ai Overclock Tuner X.M.P
> Ratio Limit 47
> CPU Manual Voltage 1.275
> 
> before
> 
> 
> 
> after


nice


----------



## fnyk

is ther realy no one ther have been doing it to a 2011 scoket cpu ????

i realy need to know the physical structure underneath the metal cover


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnyk*
> 
> is ther realy no one ther have been doing it to a 2011 scoket cpu ????
> 
> i realy need to know the physical structure underneath the metal cover


The IHS is soldered on 2011 socket cpus so delidding would bring max 2°C gains and would be very risky. Though it should be possible with torching if you want to do it for some odd reason.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnyk*
> 
> is ther realy no one ther have been doing it to a 2011 scoket cpu ????
> 
> i realy need to know the physical structure underneath the metal cover


You don't need to do it! You can't improve LGA2011 CPUs. It's not using thermal paste between die and IHS. The IHS is soldered onto the die. It's already the best possible from the start and you can't improve it.


----------



## fnyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You don't need to do it! You can't improve LGA2011 CPUs. It's not using thermal paste between die and IHS. The IHS is soldered onto the die. It's already the best possible from the start and you can't improve it.


you know you can alwase inprove it

like what i have done for new

i have been lapping my 3930k


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnyk*
> 
> you know you can alwase inprove it
> 
> like what i have done for new
> 
> i have been lapping my 3930k


Do you understand what solder is? It's metal. There's nothing you can improve. It already is the best possible solution to conduct heat from die onto the IHS. It would get worse with CLU or CLP.

You'll also probably murder the CPU if you rip off the IHS.


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Do you understand what solder is? It's metal. There's nothing you can improve. It already is the best possible solution to conduct heat from die onto the IHS. It would get worse with CLU or CLP.
> 
> You'll also probably murder the CPU if you rip off the IHS.


Actually it can improfe temps a tiny bit IF he runs direct to die cooling.


----------



## mojobear

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> you need to get a better thermal past for the IHS, I do recommend IC Diamond carat 7, "keep in mind when remove it it can fade off the engraved names on the IHS for stock users"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> since we are not stock it will drop your temp a lot better than MX-4 "no offence but MX-4 seems to be a worse tim to be used.
> 
> have a look here and you will see how good the IC Diamond is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-gets-lapped-delidded


haha....and when you feel like your satisfied with an OC, someone brings up another thing to try. Maybe Ill give it a shot on my next tear down. Been eyeing the next gen AMDs 9970 or whatever they are called now....R7473837-9970s.....

maybe when i tear down my loop for next gen video cards ill try some diamond.


----------



## fnyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Do you understand what solder is? It's metal. There's nothing you can improve. It already is the best possible solution to conduct heat from die onto the IHS. It would get worse with CLU or CLP.
> 
> I know what it is
> 
> I have been working with in 3 years
> 
> You was just saying that you just cut inprove on it
> 
> You'll also probably murder the CPU if you rip off the IHS.


----------



## fnyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mojobear*
> 
> haha....and when you feel like your satisfied with an OC, someone brings up another thing to try. Maybe Ill give it a shot on my next tear down. Been eyeing the next gen AMDs 9970 or whatever they are called now....R7473837-9970s.....
> 
> maybe when i tear down my loop for next gen video cards ill try some diamond.


Dont use diamond its stif and it smeal like fish and Coollaboratory Liquid Pro performance better^^ and its about the same price if i remimber


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fnyk*
> 
> Dont use diamond its stif and it smeal like fish and Coollaboratory Liquid Pro performance better^^ and its about the same price if i remimber


ICD7 you wont use to spread it like other thermal compound you use the old fashioned styles, pea size in the center, cross or six dot's. I don't keep my nose in the cpu to smell the fish thing you talk about LOL. Like I mentioned before, ICD7 is the thermal compound i have been used to years so I have plenty at home so no need to spend another $20 on the past that performance a bit better and my temps are great.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> ICD7 you wont use to spread it like other thermal compound you use the old fashioned styles, pea size in the center, cross or six dot's. I don't keep my nose in the cpu to smell the fish thing you talk about LOL. Like I mentioned before, ICD7 is the thermal compound i have been used to years so I have plenty at home so no need to spend another $20 on the past that performance a bit better and my temps are great.


Then why insist someone to get icd instead of continue using his mx4 when his temps are good already.







just saying


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Then why insist someone to get icd instead of continue using his mx4 when his temps are good already.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just saying


just saying too . not insist


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmmm Val is considering a new case for his redo of his build.....
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119265


The link doesn't work entirely for me.. is it the HAF XB?
I have that one, and I love it ! ^^

One thing though.. it isnt t that "small" hehe.. many gets surprised by that when they actually get it








Did you check out the HAF XB Club here on OCN? loads of cool builds / mods there









oh yea, and also my modest W/C build in that case







you can see it in my build log if interested









Anyways.. awesome case! easy to make a clean, good looking build in!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> The link doesn't work entirely for me.. is it the HAF XB?
> I have that one, and I love it ! ^^
> 
> One thing though.. it isnt t that "small" hehe.. many gets surprised by that when they actually get it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did you check out the HAF XB Club here on OCN? loads of cool builds / mods there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh yea, and also my modest W/C build in that case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you can see it in my build log if interested
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyways.. awesome case! easy to make a clean, good looking build in!


Yessir it is! I have the cosmos 2 nothing is bigger.... at least in normal cases wise and I want something that I can actually move







thinking about it more makes me want it and I need to consider other cases but not sure what ones really.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yessir it is! I have the cosmos 2 nothing is bigger.... at least in normal cases wise and I want something that I can actually move
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thinking about it more makes me want it and I need to consider other cases but not sure what ones really.


Quote:


> Cosmos II: 344 x 704 x 664 mm
> 
> HAF XB: 442 x 330 x 423mm


Yea OK :O That's a big one ^^

I can only say, I never had a case that was this easy to move! and it has to be my heaviest build yet, what with the water cooling and such


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Yea OK :O That's a big one ^^
> 
> I can only say, I never had a case that was this easy to move! and it has to be my heaviest build yet, what with the water cooling and such


I would love to do some awesome mods inside this little guy! I have a ton of ideas already just looking at it hardly. I like my cosmos's space but it's ment for a SR-2 mobo honestly and I don't have that yet









Any other tiny cases anybody can recommend? maximous v gene for mobo and this 680







so tryin to fit this in a tiny spot! and would love to go 2-3 way sli later on and watercooling loop (can mod not a problem for me) and do a 4 monitor setup









680:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121705

Thanks guys


----------



## Valgaur

Yeah yeah double post but this one is important to me!









On behalf of myself and Overclock.net (yeah I can't speak for them yet as I'm not a Mod yet (yet) but I will be one day) I want to thank each and every one of all of the members of this community of overclockers/gamers/techies alike for helping this thread reach this milestone of 500,000 views! We also past 20,000 posts as well (really close to 21,000 as well







)

I am deeply grateful for all the information that everyone provides to each other and with helping all the new people with delidding during my absences (darn work 12 shifts OP) I am greatly satisfied with how fast and steadily this thread and Club have expanded to house a wonderful knowledge base for any one person looking to delid or just for any kind of help in general.

I can't tell you how surprised I am at how fast this club grew and how big has gotten! I thought it would have maybe 50 members at the end of it's life. I am loving the fact every time we add a new crewman/member we are approaching upon the 200 member status!









I truly truly appreciate everything that everyone does for this group, I may not have 1000 rep or a ton of trader rep as well. What matters to me is to provide any kind of help to any one person(s) that I can, and see them prosper off of that. That is my goal here on OCN, besides having fun and benching when I can.

Upon myself, and as the Captain of the Delidded Club, I Sincerely thank each and every one of you, be thee a avid poster or a poster of few all the way to just the viewers that needed the information. Once again I thank you all!

Now lets shoot for 1,000,000 views!









Truly,
Valgaur


----------



## Cyro999

Maybe I'll actually join you soon


----------



## Ukkooh

I've got a quick question about clu: Is it supposed to be smooth or is it normal for it to be chunky? I'm wondering because after delidding+lapping I still can't use more than ~1.35V before getting temp limited. I read about someone having faulty clu and getting bad temps and started to wonder if something is wrong with mine too.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> I've got a quick question about clu: Is it supposed to be smooth or is it normal for it to be chunky? I'm wondering because after delidding+lapping I still can't use more than ~1.35V before getting temp limited. I read about someone having faulty clu and getting bad temps and started to wonder if something is wrong with mine too.


I see no problem with using it and trying and seeing what drops you get honestly.







but hey that's me


----------



## Daredevil 720

My CLU arrived today!







20 days after payment...







Oh well..

Meanwhile I've been trying to keep myself busy by modding my CM690 II Advanced. I cut out a wonderful window to show off my watercooling gear.









I have already delidded and lapped my 3770K but haven't joined the club since I've just been using MX-4 in and out. Now that I'll get my final temps I'll fill in the form and join you guys. Hoping for some good temp drops today.


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I see no problem with using it and trying and seeing what drops you get honestly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but hey that's me


I already used it twice and even after lapping the cpu i get worse results than others do with similar cooling setups. Was your CLU smooth or chunky?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> My CLU arrived today!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 20 days after payment...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh well..
> 
> I have already delidded and lapped my 3770K but haven't joined the club since I've just been using MX-4 in and out. Now that I'll get my final temps I'll fill in the form and join you guys. Hoping for some good temp drops today.


can you post some temps before and after, I do like to see how the MX4 is acting with you delided and lapped 3770k


----------



## skyn3t

double post - grrrrr


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> can you post some temps before and after, I do like to see how the MX4 is acting with you delided and lapped 3770k


I got about 10C of a drop (delidding & lapping together). I seriously believe I didn't apply it right as people mention twice the drops with similar TIMs. It's hard to do the CLU wrong though, so I'm hoping for an extra 15C.


----------



## APhamX

I'm not entirely sure if I can get 4.5ghz. I mean I hit 90C with as5/stock heatsink/stock clocks while rendering videos (although it takes like 5 minutes to reach that time). I don't know how my cpu will fare hitting 4.5ghz 4770k, or even if it can.

I have a z87 asrock extreme 6 board.

The reason why I don't have a good cooler yet is because I want to try to delid the cpu first, if the cpu dies, I'll use the money I was going to spend on watercooling to get a new cpu and just get a h212 till I get enough money for watercooling again. Although I do have an Athlon X2 and pentium 4 I can practice on, but better be safe than sorry?

Maybe I can clock to 4.0 - 4.2 and run an intel burn test w/ 4-5 passes?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *APhamX*
> 
> I'm not entirely sure if I can get 4.5ghz. I mean I hit 90C with as5/stock heatsink/stock clocks while rendering videos (although it takes like 5 minutes to reach that time). I don't know how my cpu will fare hitting 4.5ghz 4770k, or even if it can.
> 
> I have a z87 asrock extreme 6 board.
> 
> The reason why I don't have a good cooler yet is because I want to try to delid the cpu first, if the cpu dies, I'll use the money I was going to spend on watercooling to get a new cpu and just get a h212 till I get enough money for watercooling again. Although I do have an Athlon X2 and pentium 4 I can practice on, but better be safe than sorry?
> 
> Maybe I can clock to 4.0 - 4.2 and run an intel burn test w/ 4-5 passes?


Dude... IBT does a lot more to the temperature than some video rendering. You can forget that. The stock cooler is also *terrible*. If you don't care about things happening instantly, you might want to hunt down a good deal on some used air cooler on ebay over the next few weeks. There's nothing that can break on an air cooler except for the fans, so buying used is fine. If you look at finished auctions, you'll see sometimes there's an NH-D14 that got sold for $30. That happens when the auction is finishing at a stupid time like middle of the week at a time when people are at work, or perhaps when it wasn't correctly sorted into the right category and overlooked by people searching for coolers in general.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *APhamX*
> 
> I'm not entirely sure if I can get 4.5ghz. I mean I hit 90C with as5/stock heatsink/stock clocks while rendering videos (although it takes like 5 minutes to reach that time). I don't know how my cpu will fare hitting 4.5ghz 4770k, or even if it can.
> 
> I have a z87 asrock extreme 6 board.
> 
> The reason why I don't have a good cooler yet is because I want to try to delid the cpu first, if the cpu dies, I'll use the money I was going to spend on watercooling to get a new cpu and just get a h212 till I get enough money for watercooling again. Although I do have an Athlon X2 and pentium 4 I can practice on, but better be safe than sorry?
> 
> Maybe I can clock to 4.0 - 4.2 and run an intel burn test w/ 4-5 passes?


Just use the vise method if you're that scared. Almost guaranteed results.

According to your words If you delid successfully you'll buy a watercooling loop, so you shouldn't worry about what a delidded CPU can do with the stock Intel cooler. For one, it will surely do better than currently.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> I already used it twice and even after lapping the cpu i get worse results than others do with similar cooling setups. Was your CLU smooth or chunky?


CLU should be smooth when applied... but it might be chunky when dispensed. I haven't actually pushed the plunger on mine at all! But I've applied it to two CPUs so far. There was a little bit that came out during shipping in the plastic cover - so first I used that, and then I just used the brush on the tip of the syringe. I got enough off that way to do 2 dies.

You need so little of the CLU that if you can see chunks... you've already got too much. I doubt you've done this, but it should be applied similarly to using gold leaf (except it's liquid instead of thin foil sheets). I just brush until the surface is shiny... then take the little extra that's on the brush and brush it into the stain on the underside of the IHS - where the old Intel TIM stained the surface. That's all I've done in both cases and the results were ~20C drops!

I think many people using CLU accidentally apply way too much thinking it goes on like regular TIM does. I'm quite confident that in the single syringe that I got of it... that I could probably do 20 CPUs (on die only). Even if I used it between my block and the IHS as well I could probably do 7-10 mounts with it. I just don't like what it does to the block and the outside of the IHS so I just use it 'under the hood' and use my regular PK-1 on top.


----------



## APhamX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Just use the vise method if you're that scared. Almost guaranteed results.
> 
> According to your words If you delid successfully you'll buy a watercooling loop, so you shouldn't worry about what a delidded CPU can do with the stock Intel cooler. For one, it will surely do better than currently.


Well I plan on delidding first and comparing the temps before and after with the stock cooler, I just wanted to get in this club haha







, but it seems like I'll have to get some cooling before the delid like a 212+ or something to get temps.

And yeah, I'm still scared looking at the vice method. Vice method seems like the obvious choice, however I question why people are still using the razorblade method, and why OP's first post doesn't exemplify the vice method (or I'm just blind).


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *APhamX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Just use the vise method if you're that scared. Almost guaranteed results.
> 
> According to your words If you delid successfully you'll buy a watercooling loop, so you shouldn't worry about what a delidded CPU can do with the stock Intel cooler. For one, it will surely do better than currently.
> 
> 
> 
> Well I plan on delidding first and comparing the temps before and after with the stock cooler, I just wanted to get in this club haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , but it seems like I'll have to get some cooling before the delid like a 212+ or something to get temps.
> 
> And yeah, I'm still scared looking at the vice method. Vice method seems like the obvious choice, however I question why people are still using the razorblade method, and why OP's first post doesn't exemplify the vice method (or I'm just blind).
Click to expand...

The OP doesn't make the razor method all that great either. I honestly still prefer the razor method because I can finish it in around 5 - 10 minutes and I haven't failed once yet.

The only time I recommend the vice method is when it's on a Haswell in which, the vice would be safer because of the transistors near the glue. It honestly isn't hard either method. I have tried both and once you become calm, your chance of killing your CPU is drastically reduced with either method.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *APhamX*
> 
> Well I plan on delidding first and comparing the temps before and after with the stock cooler, I just wanted to get in this club haha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , but it seems like I'll have to get some cooling before the delid like a 212+ or something to get temps.
> 
> And yeah, I'm still scared looking at the vice method. Vice method seems like the obvious choice, however I question why people are still using the razorblade method, and why OP's first post doesn't exemplify the vice method (or I'm just blind).


Well, the vise method was tried after the success of the blade method. It's mentioned there... it was just a later addition. Some people are very confident (and _competent_) at using a blade. I for one wouldn't ever use a blade... I tried on one of my 3570Ks and after half an hour I was still fighting to get it in just a little ways (it had a crap-ton of glue and a very tight mount of the IHS). With the vise method the top was off after a few good blows and I was on my way 10 minutes later - it seriously took me twice as long to scrape off the glue with a credit card than it did to delid it.

Both methods have risks - there is no truly foolproof method of delidding... the chips simply weren't meant for this to ever happen. However, since Intel decided to be stupid (read "cheap") even on these K series CPUs... a way around had to be found. I'd say the failure rates are about the same for both methods - very low but still probably 10-15%. I feel confident I could delid 100 CPUs a day with the vise method.. but I'm also sure that sooner or later I'd have the block slip just enough for a bad hit and kill at least one. With the blade I was sure I would kill _every chip I tried it on_ - but I'm obviously not as good with it as many in this thread are.

Good luck with whichever method you try. But remember that either way _it is possible to kill your chip_ - so if you absolutely cannot afford to replace it if you mess it up... just leave it alone until you can.


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> CLU should be smooth when applied... but it might be chunky when dispensed. I haven't actually pushed the plunger on mine at all! But I've applied it to two CPUs so far. There was a little bit that came out during shipping in the plastic cover - so first I used that, and then I just used the brush on the tip of the syringe. I got enough off that way to do 2 dies.
> 
> You need so little of the CLU that if you can see chunks... you've already got too much. I doubt you've done this, but it should be applied similarly to using gold leaf (except it's liquid instead of thin foil sheets). I just brush until the surface is shiny... then take the little extra that's on the brush and brush it into the stain on the underside of the IHS - where the old Intel TIM stained the surface. That's all I've done in both cases and the results were ~20C drops!
> 
> I think many people using CLU accidentally apply way too much thinking it goes on like regular TIM does. I'm quite confident that in the single syringe that I got of it... that I could probably do 20 CPUs (on die only). Even if I used it between my block and the IHS as well I could probably do 7-10 mounts with it. I just don't like what it does to the block and the outside of the IHS so I just use it 'under the hood' and use my regular PK-1 on top.


First of all I had to push the syringe hard as hell to get any clu out of it and then it came in a big blob. I didn't even put it directly to the die. I put it on a piece of plastic i cleaned with IPA before to not get any grease on it. Then i dipped the brush on it and applied to the die from the brush. And still there were visible chunks... Does this sound like my CLU could be faulty or is it just me being paranoid?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> First of all I had to push the syringe hard as hell to get any clu out of it and then it came in a big blob. I didn't even put it directly to the die. I put it on a piece of plastic i cleaned with IPA before to not get any grease on it. Then i dipped the brush on it and applied to the die from the brush. And still there were visible chunks... Does this sound like my CLU could be faulty or is it just me being paranoid?


It does sound like something is amiss. With mine, even a tiny blob of it easily 'melted' onto the brush fibers and could be spread thinly on the die. If the chunks are super tiny it should be fine, but even then they should brush around almost like an oil rather than a solid. If it's hard and chunky it might be bad. I would definitely contact them and maybe send a picture of what you're dealing with to see what they (Coollaboratory) thinks.

If it doesn't look like it does in their videos and photographs... I'd contact them for a replacement or at least confirmation... then you're covered either way.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> CLU should be smooth when applied... but it might be chunky when dispensed. I haven't actually pushed the plunger on mine at all! But I've applied it to two CPUs so far. There was a little bit that came out during shipping in the plastic cover - so first I used that, and then I just used the brush on the tip of the syringe. I got enough off that way to do 2 dies.
> 
> You need so little of the CLU that if you can see chunks... you've already got too much. I doubt you've done this, but it should be applied similarly to using gold leaf (except it's liquid instead of thin foil sheets). I just brush until the surface is shiny... then take the little extra that's on the brush and brush it into the stain on the underside of the IHS - where the old Intel TIM stained the surface. That's all I've done in both cases and the results were ~20C drops!
> 
> I think many people using CLU accidentally apply way too much thinking it goes on like regular TIM does. I'm quite confident that in the single syringe that I got of it... that I could probably do 20 CPUs (on die only). Even if I used it between my block and the IHS as well I could probably do 7-10 mounts with it. I just don't like what it does to the block and the outside of the IHS so I just use it 'under the hood' and use my regular PK-1 on top.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First of all I had to push the syringe hard as hell to get any clu out of it and then it came in a big blob. I didn't even put it directly to the die. I put it on a piece of plastic i cleaned with IPA before to not get any grease on it. Then i dipped the brush on it and applied to the die from the brush. And still there were visible chunks... Does this sound like my CLU could be faulty or is it just me being paranoid?
Click to expand...

I didn't know beer could be used to clean your plastics.







Haha, in all seriousness, seems like it may have been stored in a cooler than normal environment and the metal starting globbing up and changing to its solid form. Crystallizing basically. Normally what I do to prep up my CLP for application, I put it in an air tight bag (ziplock, make sure completely sealed) and dunk it in a bowl of extremely hot water. The heat will make sure the CLP/CLU has a nice consistency.
For example, you do this for spray paint to get an even coating.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I didn't know beer could be used to clean your plastics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, in all seriousness, seems like it may have been stored in a cooler than normal environment and the metal starting globbing up and changing to its solid form. Crystallizing basically. Normally what I do to prep up my CLP for application, I put it in an air tight bag (ziplock, make sure completely sealed) and dunk it in a bowl of extremely hot water. The heat will make sure the CLP/CLU has a nice consistency.
> For example, you do this for spray paint to get an even coating.


+1 for that! I forget that not everyone lives where it's 105F outside! Great suggestion... I would think you could also simply hold it closed in your fist for about 5-10 minutes before applying to get a decent consistency (provided the syringe isn't all messy like mine is). But definitely the bag + hot water would work great - for chocolate as well as CLU.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I didn't know beer could be used to clean your plastics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, in all seriousness, seems like it may have been stored in a cooler than normal environment and the metal starting globbing up and changing to its solid form. Crystallizing basically. Normally what I do to prep up my CLP for application, I put it in an air tight bag (ziplock, make sure completely sealed) and dunk it in a bowl of extremely hot water. The heat will make sure the CLP/CLU has a nice consistency.
> For example, you do this for spray paint to get an even coating.
> 
> 
> 
> +1 for that! I forget that not everyone lives where it's 105F outside! Great suggestion... I would think you could also simply hold it closed in your fist for about 5-10 minutes before applying to get a decent consistency (provided the syringe isn't all messy like mine is). But definitely the bag + hot water would work great - for chocolate as well as CLU.
Click to expand...

Normally it should, CLP has properties like galium and melts at low temperatures but since he lives in Finland, I'm going to assume it's kind of chilly when he did it. At my home, we have the AC on in the summer basically 24/7 regulating the temperature at a cool 70F in every room so I have to make sure the CLP is nice and fluid by doing the hot water trick.

It's SO HOT. I hate this, I mean I used to hate doing this but now I just get bags of ice and put it on my shoulders to cool myself down.


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I didn't know beer could be used to clean your plastics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, in all seriousness, seems like it may have been stored in a cooler than normal environment and the metal starting globbing up and changing to its solid form. Crystallizing basically. Normally what I do to prep up my CLP for application, I put it in an air tight bag (ziplock, make sure completely sealed) and dunk it in a bowl of extremely hot water. The heat will make sure the CLP/CLU has a nice consistency.
> For example, you do this for spray paint to get an even coating.


I usually do this to my TIMs but didn't even think about it when i applied my CLU. I guess my ambient of 20-25°C wasn't enough for the clu to stay liquid. Thanks for the advice!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I didn't know beer could be used to clean your plastics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, in all seriousness, seems like it may have been stored in a cooler than normal environment and the metal starting globbing up and changing to its solid form. Crystallizing basically. Normally what I do to prep up my CLP for application, I put it in an air tight bag (ziplock, make sure completely sealed) and dunk it in a bowl of extremely hot water. The heat will make sure the CLP/CLU has a nice consistency.
> For example, you do this for spray paint to get an even coating.
> 
> 
> 
> I usually do this to my TIMs but didn't even think about it when i applied my CLU. I guess my ambient of 20-25°C wasn't enough for the clu to stay liquid. Thanks for the advice!
Click to expand...

I had to use a converter for the celsius.







This is just a hypothesis of why it's like that, it may have been tarnished during shipping or during packaging so be prepared to have no effect when doing this.

I was one of the lucky ones but there have been a few accounts when customs would open the packaging and extract a bit of the metal for testing. Although no accounts yet, but they could easily 'damage' the product by spilling it in which this happened to a few people already.


----------



## Daredevil 720

*OCN Name:* Daredevil 720
*CPU:* 3770K
*On Die-TIM:* CLU
*IHS-TIM:* CLU
*MHz Gained:* N/A
*OC after Delid:* 4800MHz
*Temp Drops:* ~20C
*CPU-Z Validation of Max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2883514


----------



## APhamX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Well, the vise method was tried after the success of the blade method. It's mentioned there... it was just a later addition. Some people are very confident (and _competent_) at using a blade. I for one wouldn't ever use a blade... I tried on one of my 3570Ks and after half an hour I was still fighting to get it in just a little ways (it had a crap-ton of glue and a very tight mount of the IHS). With the vise method the top was off after a few good blows and I was on my way 10 minutes later - it seriously took me twice as long to scrape off the glue with a credit card than it did to delid it.
> 
> Both methods have risks - there is no truly foolproof method of delidding... the chips simply weren't meant for this to ever happen. However, since Intel decided to be stupid (read "cheap") even on these K series CPUs... a way around had to be found. I'd say the failure rates are about the same for both methods - very low but still probably 10-15%. I feel confident I could delid 100 CPUs a day with the vise method.. but I'm also sure that sooner or later I'd have the block slip just enough for a bad hit and kill at least one. With the blade I was sure I would kill _every chip I tried it on_ - but I'm obviously not as good with it as many in this thread are.
> 
> Good luck with whichever method you try. But remember that either way _it is possible to kill your chip_ - so if you absolutely cannot afford to replace it if you mess it up... just leave it alone until you can.


I guess I'll listen to you :O. I'll just put money on watercooling. But noticing here, you guys used liquid metal for the TIM on the cpu, would you recommend using that from my waterblock to cpu? I want to buy a good TIM that I could use for both the waterblock and for the ihs, as I only have as5.
(Also, liquid metals are removable by alcohol or arcticlean, right?)

Sorry for all the questions D:


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> *OCN Name:* Daredevil 720
> *CPU:* 3770K
> *On Die-TIM:* CLU
> *IHS-TIM:* CLU
> *MHz Gained:* N/A
> *OC after Delid:* 4800MHz
> *Temp Drops:* ~20C
> *CPU-Z Validation of Max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2883514


20 all in all or 20 over the mx-4 10?

in any case, gz ^^


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> 20 all in all or 20 over the mx-4 10?
> 
> in any case, gz ^^


I only got 10C lower with the CLU over the MX4, which is 20C all in all (hottest to hottest). Hottest to coldest is 25C.

Core #0 tends to be 5-8C cooler than the other 3 after applying CLU. With the MX-4 they were all withing 2C of each other. Maybe bad CLU application? Should I try reapplying or leave it be?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I only got 10C lower with the CLU over the MX4, which is 20C all in all (hottest to hottest). Hottest to coldest is 25C.
> 
> Core #0 tends to be 5-8C cooler than the other 3 after applying CLU. With the MX-4 they were all withing 2C of each other. Maybe bad CLU application? Should I try reapplying or leave it be?


That could just be because it's the core that's next to the iGPU, and the iGPU is probably off for you.


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I only got 10C lower with the CLU over the MX4, which is 20C all in all (hottest to hottest). Hottest to coldest is 25C.
> 
> Core #0 tends to be 5-8C cooler than the other 3 after applying CLU. With the MX-4 they were all withing 2C of each other. Maybe bad CLU application? Should I try reapplying or leave it be?


You could just leave it alone but If they were even with mx4, then it should be the same with clu. If it isnt a hassle to pull the chip, go ahead and try reapplying everything again.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> I already used it twice and even after lapping the cpu i get worse results than others do with similar cooling setups. Was your CLU smooth or chunky?


Smooth








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> *OCN Name:* Daredevil 720
> *CPU:* 3770K
> *On Die-TIM:* CLU
> *IHS-TIM:* CLU
> *MHz Gained:* N/A
> *OC after Delid:* 4800MHz
> *Temp Drops:* ~20C
> *CPU-Z Validation of Max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/2883514


You're in!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *APhamX*
> 
> I guess I'll listen to you :O. I'll just put money on watercooling. But noticing here, you guys used liquid metal for the TIM on the cpu, would you recommend using that from my waterblock to cpu? I want to buy a good TIM that I could use for both the waterblock and for the ihs, as I only have as5.
> (Also, liquid metals are removable by alcohol or arcticlean, right?)
> 
> Sorry for all the questions D:


I wouldn't recommend using it between the block and the IHS... I've done it, but I wouldn't recommend it. It tends to stain the block (if copper) and in my case it appeared to have pitted the IHS in a couple places (not deeply but still visible). That could have been done taking it off the IHS... which was no small task either IMO. CLU/CLP _does_ come off however - it's not the end of the world if you need to reseat or replace the TIM - but it's definitely not as easy as a non-metal TIM. I use PK-1, but really AS5/MX4/ShinEtsu/etc.. is perfectly fine and if you have it... you should be good. If you're not delidding, you're only going to be talking about a maximum of a degree or two drop from the worst to the best TIM... and if you're planning on delidding in the future... why not make the cleanup and reapplication nice and trouble-free.









The thing to keep in perspective here is this: even with the horrible TIM application that Intel has provided - the 3570K and 3770K are both killer CPUs with decent OC potential. At my work I ran my 3570K @ 4.2GHz on a H100i and never saw load temps over 75C. After delidding I'm still running 4.2GHz but now load temps are in the low 60s - however, even in the 80s you're far below the thermal limits of the CPU.

And even if you couldn't ever OC higher than 4.2GHz - unless you're going to be running extremely high resolutions or multiple monitors - it can feed enough data for almost any game to be limited by your GPU(s) not your CPU.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *APhamX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Well, the vise method was tried after the success of the blade method. It's mentioned there... it was just a later addition. Some people are very confident (and _competent_) at using a blade. I for one wouldn't ever use a blade... I tried on one of my 3570Ks and after half an hour I was still fighting to get it in just a little ways (it had a crap-ton of glue and a very tight mount of the IHS). With the vise method the top was off after a few good blows and I was on my way 10 minutes later - it seriously took me twice as long to scrape off the glue with a credit card than it did to delid it.
> 
> Both methods have risks - there is no truly foolproof method of delidding... the chips simply weren't meant for this to ever happen. However, since Intel decided to be stupid (read "cheap") even on these K series CPUs... a way around had to be found. I'd say the failure rates are about the same for both methods - very low but still probably 10-15%. I feel confident I could delid 100 CPUs a day with the vise method.. but I'm also sure that sooner or later I'd have the block slip just enough for a bad hit and kill at least one. With the blade I was sure I would kill _every chip I tried it on_ - but I'm obviously not as good with it as many in this thread are.
> 
> Good luck with whichever method you try. But remember that either way _it is possible to kill your chip_ - so if you absolutely cannot afford to replace it if you mess it up... just leave it alone until you can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess I'll listen to you :O. I'll just put money on watercooling. But noticing here, you guys used liquid metal for the TIM on the cpu, would you recommend using that from my waterblock to cpu? I want to buy a good TIM that I could use for both the waterblock and for the ihs, as I only have as5.
> (Also, liquid metals are removable by alcohol or arcticlean, right?)
> 
> Sorry for all the questions D:
Click to expand...

It's much easier to remove CLU than CLP. CLP is incredibly hard to remove completely. Only way CLP can be completely removed is by cleaning it first by alcohol and then using a metal polisher. If you have CLU, it is fine to use it on the die and the IHS, however, I'm highly against using CLP on both. I would use CLP on the die and any other TIM on the IHS. You will most of the temp loss from using CLP/CLU on the die and the removal of the glue. As long as the block and the IHS have good contact, you won't be losing any extra degrees by using CLP/CLU on the IHS.


----------



## phillyd

My 3770k has been delidded with the vice method, and I'm using Liquid Ultra on the dye and Junpus between the IHS and the water block.

I cannot seem to get 4.9GHz for anything, even @1.55v. It seemed to do well before, getting 4.6GHz @1.33v


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> My 3770k has been delidded with the vice method, and I'm using Liquid Ultra on the dye and Junpus between the IHS and the water block.
> 
> I cannot seem to get 4.9GHz for anything, even @1.55v. It seemed to do well before, getting 4.6GHz @1.33v


You're not alone! what vcore do you need for 4.8? I have noticed anything beyond 4.8 takes a bigger jump then normal for vcore on Ivy


----------



## phillyd

I haven't gotten it yet but I quit at 1.45v without a boot at 4.8GHz


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> My 3770k has been delidded with the vice method, and I'm using Liquid Ultra on the dye and Junpus between the IHS and the water block.
> 
> I cannot seem to get 4.9GHz for anything, even @1.55v. It seemed to do well before, getting 4.6GHz @1.33v


I'm not surprised at all... with mine:
4.5GHz @ 1.27V (Stable)
4.6GHz @ 1.32V (Stable)
4.7GHz @ 1.448V (Working... I think stable)
4.8GHz validation only @ 1.51V
4.9GHz validation only @ 1.56V
...
5.0GHz - utterly impossible.

Even at 4.7GHz @ 1.45V my temps are fantastic (hottest core on a Prime95 with 90% RAM used hits 72C over 12hr runs)... but doesn't matter - the chip is completely voltage limited.

I'd say if you can't hit 4.6GHz at less than 1.25v you'll never see 4.9GHz stable (even at 1.55V) and at 1.33V for that speed you'll never even see windows desktop most likely at any vCore.

This was my best - and it crashed instantly when the cores were fully loaded:


----------



## phillyd

Any other tweaks you guys would suggest to help me get better clocks per voltage?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> I haven't gotten it yet but I quit at 1.45v without a boot at 4.8GHz


eeeew hmmmmm did you mess with PLL and vccio and Vccia or whatever that other one is?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I'm not surprised at all... with mine:
> 4.5GHz @ 1.27V (Stable)
> 4.6GHz @ 1.32V (Stable)
> 4.7GHz @ 1.448V (Working... I think stable)
> 4.8GHz validation only @ 1.51V
> 4.9GHz validation only @ 1.56V
> ...
> 5.0GHz - utterly impossible.
> 
> Even at 4.7GHz @ 1.45V my temps are fantastic (hottest core on a Prime95 with 90% RAM used hits 72C over 12hr runs)... but doesn't matter - the chip is completely voltage limited.
> 
> I'd say if you can't hit 4.6GHz at less than 1.25v you'll never see 4.9GHz stable (even at 1.55V) and at 1.33V for that speed you'll never even see windows desktop most likely at any vCore.
> 
> This was my best - and it crashed instantly when the cores were fully loaded:


pffffffft MOAR vcore!

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> eeeew hmmmmm did you mess with PLL and vccio and Vccia or whatever that other one is?
> pffffffft MOAR vcore!
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


RIP.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're not alone! what vcore do you need for 4.8? I have noticed anything beyond 4.8 takes a bigger jump then normal for vcore on Ivy


It looks like this for me (i5-3570k):

4.5 -- 1.205v
4.6 -- 1.255v (+0.05)
4.7 -- 1.305v (+0.05)
4.8 -- 1.365v (+0.06)
4.9 -- 1.435v (+0.07)

No idea about 5.0ghz as I'm scared about voltage.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> eeeew hmmmmm did you mess with PLL and vccio and Vccia or whatever that other one is?
> pffffffft MOAR vcore!
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2558184


ROFL! If I was really concerned with hitting a high OC for some reason... I would have just sold this chip and tried another one. If I can get 4.7GHz stable with under 1.46V I'll run that all day long and not even remember I wanted to see 5GHz.


----------



## phillyd

I don't know what to change with VTT and PLL, well how much to change it.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> It looks like this for me (i5-3570k):
> 
> 4.5 -- 1.205v
> 4.6 -- 1.255v (+0.05)
> 4.7 -- 1.305v (+0.05)
> 4.8 -- 1.365v (+0.06)
> 4.9 -- 1.435v (+0.07)
> 
> No idea about 5.0ghz as I'm scared about voltage.


I wouldn't be scared about voltage - if your temps are good I'd go ~1.52v without worrying at all. Sure your chip might not last 10 years... but will you care if it only makes it 5? And even then it won't die - just likely start requiring 1.5v to hit 4.9... then later to hit 4.8v.









In any case, unless you're still running a Pentium III somewhere around your house - you'll be running something else long before the voltages get you on that chip... IMO at least.


----------



## Stige

The VCore jump is exponential on the Ivy series atleast, I was stable at 4.6GHz with only 1.2V :l

Requires 1.49V for 5GHz.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> I don't know what to change with VTT and PLL, well how much to change it.


PLL i set to 1.9 if im tryign to dial in an OC but no higher. then with VTT try .01 or .1 changes be careful with it though. try a few imc tweaks and maybe a memory notch up


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're not alone! what vcore do you need for 4.8? I have noticed anything beyond 4.8 takes a bigger jump then normal for vcore on Ivy


Seems like it's just a matter of time before you hit a wall with ivy/haswell and suddenly need 0.05v (and increasing) per 100mhz, some people hit @4.2, some people hit @4.8 but it's hard to clock more than a couple hundred mhz past it


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> PLL i set to 1.9 if im tryign to dial in an OC but no higher. then with VTT try .01 or .1 changes be careful with it though. try a few imc tweaks and maybe a memory notch up


You should try any PLL settings, it can be anything from 1.5V to 1.9V.

My 2500K ran the most stable at 1.59V or something around there, notch below 1.6V.

This 3570K is just on auto.


----------



## neofury

On my 3770k I needed the following:

For 4.5/4.6 I can't remember what it was, I think it was like 1.2v~
1.255v for 4.7ghz
1.3v for 4.8ghz
1.45v for 5ghz

As you can see, it jumped like crazy between 4.8 and 5ghz, I delidded at 4.8 so I skipped 4.9, don't know what that required. I can only imagine it probably took 1.35~ so it needed roughly a full 0.1 to go from 4.9 to 5.0, and a full .05 to go from 4.8 to 4.9 (roughly)

That means that between 4.7 and 4.8 and even 4.9, it was the same roughly and then for 5ghz it more than doubled.

I've seen a lot of people that around 4.7, 4.8 and 4.9, suddenly they need a lot more voltage.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I delidded at 4.8 so I skipped 4.9, don't know what that required. I can only imagine it probably took 1.35~ so it needed roughly a full 0.1 to go from 4.9 to 5.0


Don't make assumptions, volts required going +0.045, +0.05, +0.1 seems a lot more silly to me than ~~ +0.045, +0.07, +0.085 etc too


----------



## zpaf

Just a try with my delid [email protected]
Max core temp 85c.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Any other tweaks you guys would suggest to help me get better clocks per voltage?


CPU PLL Overvoltage should be ENABLED. This helps a lot with being able to boot up and be stable at higher overclocks. Another help would be what Val said, go to the chart on Sin's or my guide and input the highest recommended voltage for each one (other than the CPU and DRAM) and try again. Also, disabling all the power-saving features can help and using manual voltage will definitely help. Some people experience 3-4 notch drops using manual over offset.

@Valgaur,

No one posted anything so here:
We're very proud of this delidded club and you as the OP has done everything but hinder its growth. Good job at maintaining this club modern and set to acquire more members by expanding it from the Ivy Delidded to the General Delidded Club. I expect nothing but 200+ members in this club soon so encourage everyone who wants to experience 200% more of their CPU by doing this mod! Good job!


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *phillyd*
> 
> Any other tweaks you guys would suggest to help me get better clocks per voltage?


My chip doesn't like more than ~1.85 VRIN - more was not better for me here. I noticed you can trade off VRIN or Vcore but my CPU preferred a modest VRIN and after that just raising the Vcore was preferable for my system. If I raise the VRIN any higher it becomes unstable but if I raise the Vcore instead then she's fine as I raise the CPU multi. I'm not sure if others have experienced this but I thought I'd throw it out there.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> My chip doesn't like more than ~1.85 VRIN - more was not better for me here. I noticed you can trade off VRIN or Vcore but my CPU preferred a modest VRIN and after that just raising the Vcore was preferable for my system. If I raise the VRIN any higher it becomes unstable but if I raise the Vcore instead then she's fine as I raise the CPU multi. I'm not sure if others have experienced this but I thought I'd throw it out there.


In my experience, VRIN is not just some static value that you tune once and leave it there, you should mould it to vcore. 1.85 might work best for ~1.2-1.3 (gotta poke around some) but you need less for less vcore (1.6vrin works a ton better than 1.8 for a tiny vcore attempting like 4-4.2ghz - the difference between complete stability, and not even managing to boot at a given vcore) and you'd use more for more vcore (like belial's using 2.05 for 1.45vcore now i think)

And also, if you don't LLC VRIN, it'll bounce around and droop a lot more, so it's much harder to make assessments of what kind of value you want to target with it


----------



## Mogwaii

OCN Name: Mogwaii
CPU: 3570K
On Die-TIM: CLU
IHS-TIM: None - Using EK naked ivy mount kit
MHz Gained: 200
OC after Delid: 4700MHz
Temp Drops: ~20C
CPU-Z Validation of Max OC : http://valid.canardpc.com/2884417

Just got 4,7ghz stabile @ 1.344vcore been trying alot to get above 4,6 with no succes , but now with LLC 150% it works , dont know if i can OC higher but i am 100% fine with 4,7


----------



## Agoniizing

Am I in the club yet?


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Don't make assumptions, volts required going +0.045, +0.05, +0.1 seems a lot more silly to me than ~~ +0.045, +0.07, +0.085 etc too


I'm not assuming anything, just making an educated guess based on the other bumps increasing. All the volts I posted except for the 4.9ghz one which I admitted I didn't know the exact voltage were tested on 12hr+ prime 95's with no WHEA errors or crashes.

The point still stands either way, at around 4.8ghz a lot of people seem to need quite a bit more voltage to go up in their OC. For me, on the earlier overclocks it didn't require that much of a bump per 100mhz. Then suddenly at 4.8ghz it required a big time bump to get to 5ghz stable. Regardless of the 4.9ghz voltage, the increase for 200mhz was enormous when comparing 4.6 --> 4.8 versus 4.8 --> 5.0ghz. Of course it's to be expected you will need more voltage, but suddenly it became a lot more.


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> On my 3770k I needed the following:
> 
> For 4.5/4.6 I can't remember what it was, I think it was like 1.2v~
> 1.255v for 4.7ghz
> 1.3v for 4.8ghz
> 1.45v for 5ghz
> 
> As you can see, it jumped like crazy between 4.8 and 5ghz, I delidded at 4.8 so I skipped 4.9, don't know what that required. I can only imagine it probably took 1.35~ so it needed roughly a full 0.1 to go from 4.9 to 5.0, and a full .05 to go from 4.8 to 4.9 (roughly)
> 
> That means that between 4.7 and 4.8 and even 4.9, it was the same roughly and then for 5ghz it more than doubled.
> 
> I've seen a lot of people that around 4.7, 4.8 and 4.9, suddenly they need a lot more voltage.


I agree, when your going past 4.5/4.6ghz overclock, the voltage jump increases. BUT it can be subjective as CPU's differ.

*My Prime95 12 hour stable overclocks:*
1.21 for 4.3 ghz
1.23 for 4.5 ghz
1.24 for 4.6 ghz
1.28 for 4.7 ghz


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I'm not assuming anything, just making an educated guess based on the other bumps increasing. All the volts I posted except for the 4.9ghz one which I admitted I didn't know the exact voltage were tested on 12hr+ prime 95's with no WHEA errors or crashes.
> 
> The point still stands either way, at around 4.8ghz a lot of people seem to need quite a bit more voltage to go up in their OC. For me, on the earlier overclocks it didn't require that much of a bump per 100mhz. Then suddenly at 4.8ghz it required a big time bump to get to 5ghz stable. Regardless of the 4.9ghz voltage, the increase for 200mhz was enormous when comparing 4.6 --> 4.8 versus 4.8 --> 5.0ghz. Of course it's to be expected you will need more voltage, but suddenly it became a lot more.


It might be tied to the 1.4v, not the 4.8ghz.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiLd FyeR*
> 
> I agree, when your going past 4.5/4.6ghz overclock, the voltage jump increases. BUT it can be subjective as CPU's differ.
> 
> *My Prime95 12 hour stable overclocks:*
> 1.21 for 4.3 ghz
> 1.23 for 4.5 ghz
> 1.24 for 4.6 ghz
> 1.28 for 4.7 ghz


Of course, I only offered my experiences, not saying all CPU's are the same. I remember for 4.5 I think I need sub 1.2 but I wasn't screenshotting or writing anything down back then









For me personally speaking, going past 4.8ghz is where I really started to see the jump. I'm not denying that it could be 4.9ghz since I didn't try test 4.9ghz, but from what I do need at 5ghz, it's safe to make an educated guess. Not saying I'd be telling other people that's what they need or anything








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> It might be tied to the 1.4v, not the 4.8ghz.


Very true. I can't really say what it's tied to, all I know is for a fair amount of people, that area (both voltage, and ghz) seems to be the point where an average or maybe slightly above/below average chip struggles. I know I can't speak for all chips. There are some people on here that I've even read anything after 4.3ghz they need ridiculous amounts of voltage. Personally speaking, if my chip did that I'd probably try and RMA it LOL. You don't pay for a K series chip to need 1.4v+ to achieve 4.5ghz, at least I didn't.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I'm not assuming anything, just making an educated guess based on the other bumps increasing. All the volts I posted except for the 4.9ghz one which I admitted I didn't know the exact voltage were tested on 12hr+ prime 95's with no WHEA errors or crashes.
> 
> The point still stands either way, at around 4.8ghz a lot of people seem to need quite a bit more voltage to go up in their OC. For me, on the earlier overclocks it didn't require that much of a bump per 100mhz. Then suddenly at 4.8ghz it required a big time bump to get to 5ghz stable. Regardless of the 4.9ghz voltage, the increase for 200mhz was enormous when comparing 4.6 --> 4.8 versus 4.8 --> 5.0ghz. Of course it's to be expected you will need more voltage, but suddenly it became a lot more.


My 4.1 to 4.3 or 4.3 to 4.5 requires a LOT less voltage than 4.5 to 4.7, but the 45x-46x step is almost as expensive as 46x-47x


----------



## t0tum

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> In my experience, VRIN is not just some static value that you tune once and leave it there, you should mould it to vcore. 1.85 might work best for ~1.2-1.3 (gotta poke around some) but you need less for less vcore (1.6vrin works a ton better than 1.8 for a tiny vcore attempting like 4-4.2ghz - the difference between complete stability, and not even managing to boot at a given vcore) and you'd use more for more vcore (like belial's using 2.05 for 1.45vcore now i think)
> 
> And also, if you don't LLC VRIN, it'll bounce around and droop a lot more, so it's much harder to make assessments of what kind of value you want to target with it


Right on the money here. If i take my stable overclock and take 3 notches of VRIn - 101 bsod. If i add 3 notches more - 124 bsod.
Also, giving more System agent needs more VRIN. It appears my system doesnt require sys agent at all to run 1866mem on 4.5 overclock and i was running 0.05 all the time. When i dropped it to 0 i could also drom VRIN and found my sweet spot. I had to key in 0.010 as digital voltage to get it fully stable.


----------



## Chomuco

asus vi hero = 4670k

error 00 ?? bios







CPU killed


----------



## Valgaur

Looks like there are a few scratched on the pcb to me.can you take a really close picture of the pcb?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Most likely another CPU killed by the razor... It's really a shame, knowing it would probably still work if it had had its head taken off with a hammer.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Most likely another CPU killed by the razor... It's really a shame, knowing it would probably still work if it had had its head taken off with a hammer.


lol yeah I feel the same way, I used a hammer too.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Most likely another CPU killed by the razor... It's really a shame, knowing it would probably still work if it had had its head taken off with a hammer.


That's why I did mine with a hammer. I did try two P4 before very carefully one was done right the other you know what happen messed up the pcb. with a hammer is razor cut proof.


----------



## asuka10456

is it possible to glue back on the ihs after applying Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asuka10456*
> 
> is it possible to glue back on the ihs after applying Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra?


You could, but I don't know why you would want to. The retention clip holds the IHS on nicely when you lock it in the socket.


----------



## alancsalt

AFAIK the purpose of removing it is to reduce the gap between die and IHS. You could be returning to the situation before delidding.


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Looks like there are a few scratched on the pcb to me.can you take a really close picture of the pcb?
























codigo bios 00














4670k

pcb ....


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asuka10456*
> 
> I know but I wondering for resale purposes. Some people may not like the the fact that the ihs is not held to the chip. Not that I plan on cheating anyone but its just for the sake of knowing my options before delidding.


Yes you can glue it back. but like alancsalt said. are you going back to the same point? to be honest if one day you sell it you must be tell the true for the buyer.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> codigo bios 00
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4670k
> 
> pcb ....
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


you apply too much tim on the DIE , what tim is that one? it is conductive tim? if yes you just killed the the chip. you may cutted the pcb and short the circuit. look below


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Looks like there are a few scratched on the pcb to me.can you take a really close picture of the pcb?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> codigo bios 00
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4670k
> 
> pcb ....
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...

Too much TIM on that die!

Referring to my guide, use this much TIM on the die (Half-a-rice-grain method):


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> codigo bios 00
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4670k
> 
> pcb ....
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Ouch!

That razor you used looks old and rusty.

It also looks like you traced the heatsink with the blade vertically instead of horizontally. Did you watch the how to videos?

Theres also way to much tim on there even if the cpu did work.

Sorry to see that happen to you as I know it sucks to eat that money.

Lo siento mucho


----------



## asuka10456

I plan on delidding tonight, should Half-a-rice-grain method with CLU?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asuka10456*
> 
> I plan on delidding tonight, should Half-a-rice-grain method with CLU?


With CLU, you don't need a method because you just use the brush and brush it one.


----------



## Supacasey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asuka10456*
> 
> I plan on delidding tonight, should Half-a-rice-grain method with CLU?


With CLU, you brush on a thin layer over the entire face of the die as well as where the stain is from the old TIM on the underside of the IHS.

Think Bob Ross.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiLd FyeR*
> 
> I agree, when your going past 4.5/4.6ghz overclock, the voltage jump increases. BUT it can be subjective as CPU's differ.
> 
> *My Prime95 12 hour stable overclocks:*
> 1.21 for 4.3 ghz
> 1.23 for 4.5 ghz
> 1.24 for 4.6 ghz
> 1.28 for 4.7 ghz


HOLY CRAP! That's great! Are those Prime95 runs custom with 90%+ RAM used or is that just standard blend for 12hrs?!?

I ask because I can run a Prime95 blend for 24 hrs and no problems with as little (for my chip) as 1.34V but I'm now trying my 4th run with 90% RAM used and I'm now at 1.496V. On every other run I have one thread error at either the 4hr mark or 14hr mark... I'm about to give up and drop down just because if it can't get through this run I'll be at over 1.5V just to see 4.7GHz - although on the upside even at that voltage my hottest core is 73C even when my office is running 30C ambient.









I'm totally jealous of your chip - that's a winner in my book.. should see 5.0 with no problems if cooling allows for it.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I ask because I can run a Prime95 blend for 24 hrs and no problems with as little (for my chip) as 1.34V but I'm now trying my 4th run with 90% RAM used and I'm now at 1.496V


That sounds completely wrong to me, +0.15v between one setting and another at the same clock speed? Surely you just have IMC problem or something messed up somewhere if you're fine without RAM usage up, but unstable whatever you do with it up. It would raise serious red flags for other, non-cpu-core (vcore) system components messing things up for me if it was still unstable after like 0.03vcore higher, just from adjusting RAM amount

The last person i know who did prime runs like that for errors late in them just had his RAM clocked slightly too high for the IMC with 4 sticks, and did so many prime runs that he thought he significantly degraded his CPU (from 1.5v stable to 1.55v unstable, with lots of primes to back it up) which is to say, it's probably not a good idea to run hundreds of hours of prime chasing after a small error, at a high voltage, though at this point it's kinda common sense


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> That sounds completely wrong to me, +0.15v between one setting and another at the same clock speed? Surely you just have IMC problem or something messed up somewhere if you're fine without RAM usage up, but unstable whatever you do with it up. It would raise serious red flags for other, non-cpu-core (vcore) system components messing things up for me if it was still unstable after like 0.03vcore higher, just from adjusting RAM amount
> 
> The last person i know who did prime runs like that for errors late in them just had his RAM clocked slightly too high for the IMC with 4 sticks, and did so many prime runs that he thought he significantly degraded his CPU (from 1.5v stable to 1.55v unstable, with lots of primes to back it up) which is to say, it's probably not a good idea to run hundreds of hours of prime chasing after a small error, at a high voltage, though at this point it's kinda common sense


You are correct... I just checked my screen shots for my run on standard blend and apparently I was at 1.44V for that... (I thought my 4.5GHz vcore values were for 4.7) so it's only ~.05V higher actually for the full RAM load... but I've tested the RAM, etc... and I'm running a fresh bare install (drivers and utilities only) so everything else seems fine. It's the same case with IBT - everything is good even on 'very high' (4GB) runs... but when I run it with 30GB RAM... issues arise.









I may pull 2 sticks and drop to 16GB and see what happens then... I'm not worried too much personally (just doing the runs for stable club entry) as the only time I'll be using anything close to the full amount of RAM will just be file storage space for photo/video editing.


----------



## Swag

Ivy Bridge is stronger than you think. It is a very resilient architecture and has been proven to be able to withstand high voltages.

Voltages harm CPUs but Ivy Bridge can technically run fine with 1.5v under its belt as long as temperatures permits! Don't expect to run it 24/7 @ 1.60v but at 1.50v, you should be fine.

According to the problem, what I see is an IMC issue (if his RAM is not faulty and they aren't overclocked). IMC issues are very hard to fix because they are now part of the CPU. As you know, there is only one CPU voltage option and with that, you can't really change the voltage directed to the IMC directly but only through raising the CPU vcore. So the solution lies as increasing vcore. However, I am seeing that this may just be a "dumb" error. There have been occasions where people put 90% of RAM but technically they don't. They put more because of the misunderstanding of 90% of RAM. 90% of RAM does not mean 90% of 16GB (if you have 16GB for example), but it actually is 90% of AVAILABLE RAM which can be found in Windows Task Manager.

There are other possible causes to this problem, for example, you could be experiencing a crash not because of not enough vcore, but because the electricity being sent to the CPU is not being received properly (tuning the other settings) or you are using power-saving features. Power-saving features are ideal for overclocks at the lower marks, and by this, I don't mean lower overclocks by clock speed only. I mean it by noting the blend of the clock speed and the voltage required. Running 4.8 @ 1.30 is a good overclock, and to me, it is still considered a mediocre overclock because the fact that it is running at a low voltage. If it takes 1.45v for the 4.8OC, this would be a high overclock because you are approaching the "limit" of what the CPU can do within reasonable numbers. With high overclocks, a small drop in voltage at the wrong time can lead to a BSOD, crash, or error of some kind. Power-saving features are a long way from being perfect, they drop when they "think" the clock is going to go down but what happens if the clock doesn't? The CPU is left with a thirst for more power but it isn't receiving it so it crashes to prevent itself from damaging itself.

Also, power-saving features (specifically offset) has been shown that using it may result in a need for higher vcore vs its 'manual' brother. Using manual confines the power being sent to the CPU at a constant amount and never dropping at any time even when it clocks down. This prevents the issue stated above.

Hope this helped, sorry if it was kind of long and if it was confusing. You can read my guide on Ivy Bridge Overclocking or Sin's guide (which is amazing to say the least) to see what to do when problems arise!

PS: I wanted to show this because I love showing off my CPU








Swag's 4.8 OC
Swag's 4.6 OC


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Thanks Swag! I have used the guide and I am using 90% of available RAM... with everything loaded and running Prime95 task manager shows ~92% memory usage. I was using the manual voltage settings, but on this run I'm actually going the other direction - and I've switched to offset. My offset settings allow for up to 1.506V under absolute maximum load (running P95 shows fluctuations depending on difficulty between 1.486V and 1.506V). My feeling is that although 1.506 isn't necessary most of the time - allowing for it as demanded might help with the two FFT series that cause the most problems (which is what I hit at 14hr mark - forgot to write down what size it was running when the one thread crashed).

I will re-consult the guides if this still fails to result in a successful 24hr run... although if that's the case I will also go through and double check everything to make sure that I didn't mistakenly set something else. IIRC the only changes I've made are to disable higher C states, increase multiplier and vcore, and enable the PLL OC setting. But it's quite possible I missed something.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> You are correct... I just checked my screen shots for my run on standard blend and apparently I was at 1.44V for that... (I thought my 4.5GHz vcore values were for 4.7) so it's only ~.05V higher actually for the full RAM load... but I've tested the RAM, etc... and I'm running a fresh bare install (drivers and utilities only) so everything else seems fine. It's the same case with IBT - everything is good even on 'very high' (4GB) runs... but when I run it with 30GB RAM... issues arise.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may pull 2 sticks and drop to 16GB and see what happens then... I'm not worried too much personally (just doing the runs for stable club entry) as the only time I'll be using anything close to the full amount of RAM will just be file storage space for photo/video editing.


What you see might not be that strange. I found the lowest possible vcore to run prime95 blend at 4gb memory use for 24 hours. Everything about programs crashing seemed to be fine with that vcore, but it still needed +0.02v increase to get all WHEA warnings to disappear out of the Windows event log. Perhaps the way you can test with those 30gb memory use trips it up in a way that can predict the WHEA warnings I got. My testing was at 1.24v, and yours is at 1.44v and that could multiply the +0.02v into +0.05v.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> HOLY CRAP! That's great! Are those Prime95 runs custom with 90%+ RAM used or is that just standard blend for 12hrs?!?
> 
> I ask because I can run a Prime95 blend for 24 hrs and no problems with as little (for my chip) as 1.34V but I'm now trying my 4th run with 90% RAM used and I'm now at 1.496V. On every other run I have one thread error at either the 4hr mark or 14hr mark... I'm about to give up and drop down just because if it can't get through this run I'll be at over 1.5V just to see 4.7GHz - although on the upside even at that voltage my hottest core is 73C even when my office is running 30C ambient.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm totally jealous of your chip - that's a winner in my book.. should see 5.0 with no problems if cooling allows for it.


Why does it matter though? You will NEVER have a single issue in real world use, Prime is such an overrated program for stability testing.

Personaly, when I overclock, I usually just do 10x IBT Standard to see if it is even remotely stable and then just do normal use and if it's stable = it is stable then.
You don't need 24 hours of Prime to determine if something is stable...

And for temps I just use 30 minutes of Prime, hit the max temps around the 18min mark in it.

~62-63C in ambient of 28-29C in Prime at 1.496V


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Why does it matter though? You will NEVER have a single issue in real world use, *Prime is such an overrated program for stability testing.*
> 
> Personaly, when I overclock, I usually just do 10x IBT Standard to see if it is even remotely stable and then *just do normal use and if it's stable = it is stable then*.
> *You don't need 24 hours of Prime to determine if something is stable*...
> 
> And for temps I just use 30 minutes of Prime, hit the max temps around the 18min mark in it.
> 
> ~62-63C in ambient of 28-29C in Prime at 1.496V


I agree 100%. I've been OCing for years and never used Prime. I run Aida64 for a couple hours and if it makes it through that I have never had a system crash during normal usage.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> What you see might not be that strange. I found the lowest possible vcore to run prime95 blend at 4gb memory use for 24 hours. Everything about programs crashing seemed to be fine with that vcore, but it still needed +0.02v increase to get all WHEA warnings to disappear out of the Windows event log. Perhaps the way you can test with those 30gb memory use trips it up in a way that can predict the WHEA warnings I got. My testing was at 1.24v, and yours is at 1.44v and that could multiply the +0.02v into +0.05v.


Makes sense to me. I've also wondered if there isn't possibly a problem with the sheer amount of RAM involved as well. In this day and age I don't consider 32GB to be an 'abnormally large' amount... but it wasn't that long ago that Microsoft was still saying that 32bit addressing should handle everything a user would ever need (and only 20 years ago it was 1MB)









I've wondered a couple of times doing this if I would have the same issues at the same hardware settings, if I was doing the testing under Linux or FreeBSD vs Windows 7.


----------



## Cyro999

I've had 24h prime pass fail in under 30 seconds for x264 (normal usage, encoding a quick vid to send to someone or livestreaming) but that only further invalidates it ;P


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I've had 24h prime pass fail in under 30 seconds for x264 (normal usage, encoding a quick vid to send to someone or livestreaming) but that only further invalidates it ;P


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Why does it matter though? You will NEVER have a single issue in real world use, Prime is such an overrated program for stability testing.
> 
> Personaly, when I overclock, I usually just do 10x IBT Standard to see if it is even remotely stable and then just do normal use and if it's stable = it is stable then.
> You don't need 24 hours of Prime to determine if something is stable...


I agree - however, I'm not doing it for me to feel it is stable - it's already stable for me (as I said nothing I do other than graphics work will ever hit anything over ~6GB usage) regardless. I can do 10 IBT Standard runs at much, much lower voltages and with temps that never even crack 70C.

The prime runs are simply for entry into the Ivy Stable/Suicide Club. In other words - I'm doing this as a hobby exercise, not because I feel there is actually an issue with the OC.









EDIT: Or I should say "not an issue I will ever see with normal use" - there _is_ an issue of some sort however or nothing would crash... at least not because of hardware... software not so much.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> The prime runs are simply for entry into the Ivy Stable/Suicide Club


*cough* pull 16gb RAM *cough*


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> *cough* pull 16gb RAM *cough*












As I stated above... that will be my very next step if I find a problem still... at this point I kinda just want to see if it's even possible. (I'm stubborn like that).


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As I stated above... that will be my very next step if I find a problem still... at this point I kinda just want to see if it's even possible. (I'm stubborn like that).


Good quality


----------



## Daredevil 720

I reapplied the CLU on my 3770K to fix my 8-10C hottest to coldest core temp difference and made things worse... Hottest to coldest temp difference is still 8C, but all core temps went up by ~12C!!









How could this happen? I applied as much of a thin layer as I could both on the die and the under side of the IHS. I also spread a layer on top of the IHS and and on my waterblock. Is any of this wrong?

I'm thinking maybe I should add a little more under the IHS because the IHS didn't seem to stick on the PCB as it did the first time I applied.

I'm currently hitting 95C in Prime95 with 34C ambient while I used to get about 82C max with the same ambient. HELP!!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I reapplied the CLU on my 3770K to fix my 8-10C hottest to coldest core temp difference and made things worse... Hottest to coldest temp difference is still 8C, but all core temps went up by ~12C!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How could this happen? I applied as much of a thin layer as I could both on the die and the under side of the IHS. I also spread a layer on top of the IHS and and on my waterblock. Is any of this wrong?
> 
> I'm thinking maybe I should add a little more under the IHS because the IHS didn't seem to stick on the PCB as it did the first time I applied.
> 
> I'm currently hitting 95C in Prime95 with 34C ambient while I used to get about 82C max with the same ambient. HELP!!


There's this thread: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal

The guy that did the tests said you can use both too much and too little on the die. As thin as possible isn't the best. He paints all four surfaces you can paint, the die, the inner side of the IHS, the top of the IHS, and the cooler's base. As he did experiment a lot, I guess that's the best method.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Ouch!
> 
> That razor you used looks old and rusty.
> 
> It also looks like you traced the heatsink with the blade vertically instead of horizontally. Did you watch the how to videos?
> 
> Theres also way to much tim on there even if the cpu did work.
> 
> Sorry to see that happen to you as I know it sucks to eat that money.
> 
> Lo siento mucho


This... Don't be too cheap to buy a new razor to delid a $250-$350 CPU. Also, I know people say thin razor is better but I've seen most failures from the razor method when shaving razors are used. Use a regular razor blade like you would use for a window scraper.

A thicker blade has the sharp part of the blade lifted off of the PCB, unlike a thin razor. Also, the thin razors bend when you grip them, bowing them out and gouging the PCB.



See what I mean?

Still, I recommend the vice method. I used a razor because I know I'm very good with my hands and I was more comfortable with it then I was working on the chip in my greasy shop.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> There's this thread: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal
> 
> The guy that did the tests said you can use both too much and too little on the die. As thin as possible isn't the best. He paints all four surfaces you can paint, the die, the inner side of the IHS, the top of the IHS, and the cooler's base. As he did experiment a lot, I guess that's the best method.


I'll try adding a bit more under the hood then, I'm fairly sure this is it.

Important question. Do I have to clean up and reapply or just add?

Also, when I cleaned up to reapply the CLU earlier I couldn't remove all of the CLU from the top of the IHS and the waterblock so I just did the best I could and then painted above it. Is this okay?


----------



## chromejaguar

can a xeon e3 1230 v2 be delidded?


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chromejaguar*
> 
> can a xeon e3 1230 v2 be delidded?


Why would you even want to do that? Absolutely zero benefit from it.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Went back and added a little more CLU under the IHS. Good temps restored!


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Went back and added a little more CLU under the IHS. Good temps restored!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Went back and added a little more CLU under the IHS. Good temps restored!


Did you clean first and replaced everything, or did you just add a little to what was already there?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Did you clean first and replaced everything, or did you just add a little to what was already there?


It was still very fresh and not dried out, so I just added a bit on the die and done.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> It was still very fresh and not dried out, so I just added a bit on the die and done.


Thanks! I guess I'll try doing the same over the weekend to see if temperatures improve if I don't necessarily have to clean all off first.


----------



## Cr4zy

Well, after a month of my delidded 4770k running fine. Today my pc wouldn't boot gave it a look over started pulling everything out and then got to the cpu.



My die somehow cracked itself after a month, not touched, just killed itself sitting under my block.

Got a replacement on the way I hope that its just my cpu that died. Doubt ill delid again after this :/


----------



## luckymatt

Did you replace your IHS or were you running a naked die?


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> Did you replace your IHS or were you running a naked die?


Yeah this... can we get some more info?

*If the IHS was in place*, then we should all re-think our method here. I would loosen my cooler up a bit and maybe even apply some new RTV to glue the IHS back on, leaving a gap for the die - _if he did indeed have the IHS installed._ I'm assuming it was direct die though.

It might not even need all that consideration -- it's possible that the IHS was bowed from being in a vice (perhaps not the best method after all?) and that bowing would have put uneven pressure on the IHS, perhaps causing it to crack.

Anyway, that's a sad sight









*TLDR* - My guess is either a bowed IHS from being in a vice or a direct die gone bad...

If it was the razor method and this still happened then I think we all need to be applying some RTV back onto the PCB after delidding in order to prevent this. The RTV would restore the factory gap from Intel - which would probably hurt temps a bit but the CLU is still far superior to the Intel gunk.


----------



## neofury

Just to pipe in here, my CPU worked fine for a while, I went to switch TIM and re-seated the chip, it went in just fine. When I put the cooler back on it I tightened it up, probably overtightened it. It wouldn't boot. It bent some pins on the motherboard









I've probably taken out and put back a CPU 500+ times in my life, and I've never bent a single pin on any of my boards. Did you check to see if maybe it's the actual motherboard and not the chip?

For me, I was actually relieved when I saw it was the motherboard, didn't want to lose a 5ghz chip! Anyways, you live you learn. Even though I've always been careful when putting a CPU in, I now take even more time when doing it. I still don't know what I did, either the cooler pushed too hard with the pressure or it was slightly misaligned and it crushed the pins









I'm still planning to try the mechanical pencil trick at some point just for fun.









Maybe it's just me, but I don't find that die looks cracked, dirty yes (probably from the TIM or being touched) but the image doesn't appear to be cracked. If anything, the razor scuffs on the PCB is what I'm seeing. Maybe some nail polish over that? A check of the motherboard pins, re-seat and re-try could work?


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Maybe it's just me, but I don't find that die looks cracked, dirty yes (probably from the TIM or being touched) but the image doesn't appear to be cracked. If anything, the razor scuffs on the PCB is what I'm seeing. Maybe some nail polish over that? A check of the motherboard pins, re-seat and re-try could work?














It's cracked.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Yeah this... can we get some more info?
> 
> *If the IHS was in place*, then we should all re-think our method here. I would loosen my cooler up a bit and maybe even apply some new RTV to glue the IHS back on, leaving a gap for the die - _if he did indeed have the IHS installed._ I'm assuming it was direct die though.
> 
> It might not even need all that consideration -- it's possible that the IHS was bowed from being in a vice (perhaps not the best method after all?) and that bowing would have put uneven pressure on the IHS, perhaps causing it to crack.
> 
> Anyway, that's a sad sight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *TLDR* - My guess is either a bowed IHS from being in a vice or a direct die gone bad...
> 
> If it was the razor method and this still happened then I think we all need to be applying some RTV back onto the PCB after delidding in order to prevent this. The RTV would restore the factory gap from Intel - which would probably hurt temps a bit but the CLU is still far superior to the Intel gunk.


Looking at the member list of this club it seems like he did place the IHS back on, using CLU on both sides. We need more info though!

If there's a need for some gap there are easier ways to create it without a glue. You could even do it with some hard paper.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Maybe it's just me, but I don't find that die looks cracked, dirty yes (probably from the TIM or being touched) but the image doesn't appear to be cracked. If anything, the razor scuffs on the PCB is what I'm seeing. Maybe some nail polish over that? A check of the motherboard pins, re-seat and re-try could work?


It's cracked. Zoom in.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Looking at the member list of this club it seems like he did place the IHS back on, using CLU on both sides. We need more info though!
> 
> If there's a need for some gap there are easier ways to create it without a glue. You could even do it with some hard paper.


That would be a good idea.. I'd go that route so I wouldn't have to delid it again, ever.


----------



## Cr4zy

Yes IHS was replaced, IHS is still flat and didn't seem to get bowed or dented after vice delidding.

I think the lack of glue between IHS and pcb caused too much pressure to be appplied to the die.

As already mentioned I had CLU between die and IHS and also between IHS and my EK supreme-hf. Which was tightened as mounting instructions for their optimal pressure.

Die is just dirty because of CLU that I didn't fully clean because I found the crack.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Have there been any other reports on cracked dies? I think it's important and we all should look into this.


----------



## neofury

Yeah, it's cracked. Damn. I'm at work on a crappy monitor and didn't zoom in, my bad. That sucks man


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> Yes IHS was replaced, IHS is still flat and didn't seem to get bowed or dented after vice delidding.
> 
> I think the lack of glue between IHS and pcb caused too much pressure to be appplied to the die.
> 
> As already mentioned I had CLU between die and IHS and also between IHS and my EK supreme-hf. Which was tightened as mounting instructions for their optimal pressure.
> 
> Die is just dirty because of CLU that I didn't fully clean because I found the crack.


Time for me to carefully take the CPU apart and cut out some construction paper to re-create a little bit of a gap between the IHS and the CPU die.

Is there any chance the EK block is one of those slightly concave ones? Also, have you use a razor and checked to see just how straight the IHS is? Trying to pinpoint the issue before I rip my PC apart for no good reason. I think we should all try to find a solution and the paper idea somebody mentioned earlier seems like the best preventative measure..


----------



## Cr4zy

I don't have a razor to hand, straightest thing i can find at the moment is the pcb of the chip itself which sits pretty much perfectly flat.
The only way I can see any bow is if I shine a light from the back and see the very slightest light coming through. Probably a minimal indent from the very slight bow that my waterblock gets from the jetplate being installed.
That very slight gap I see is easily thinner than a hair between the top of the ihs and the pcb side.

There seems to be a noticeable gap around the IHS when on the die which causes it to ever so slighty sit above the pcb or rather rock on it depending which side gets more pressure applied. I am certain that wasn't there when I installed it originally, at least not to the extent it is now.

It certainly looks like the waterblock bow and mounting pressure from my supreme-hf has caused it to bend the IHS the smallest amount, but enough to kill the CPU after a month or so.

It sure sucks and ill hope that my replacement comes tomorrow so I can see if it was just the cpu that died and hope my board is ok.


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Ouch!
> 
> That razor you used looks old and rusty.
> 
> It also looks like you traced the heatsink with the blade vertically instead of horizontally. Did you watch the how to videos?
> 
> Theres also way to much tim on there even if the cpu did work.
> 
> Sorry to see that happen to you as I know it sucks to eat that money.
> 
> Lo siento mucho


hello new 4770k ir


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> I don't have a razor to hand, straightest thing i can find at the moment is the pcb of the chip itself which sits pretty much perfectly flat.
> The only way I can see any bow is if I shine a light from the back and see the very slightest light coming through. Probably a minimal indent from the very slight bow that my waterblock gets from the jetplate being installed.
> That very slight gap I see is easily thinner than a hair between the top of the ihs and the pcb side.
> 
> There seems to be a noticeable gap around the IHS when on the die which causes it to ever so slighty sit above the pcb or rather rock on it depending which side gets more pressure applied. I am certain that wasn't there when I installed it originally, at least not to the extent it is now.
> 
> It certainly looks like the waterblock bow and mounting pressure from my supreme-hf has caused it to bend the IHS the smallest amount, but enough to kill the CPU after a month or so.
> 
> It sure sucks and ill hope that my replacement comes tomorrow so I can see if it was just the cpu that died and hope my board is ok.


That sucks man... I'm definitely thinking the waterblock must have bowed it just enough to crack the die - it wouldn't take much at all. I'm not going to jump the gun on "fixing" mine since you seem to be the only unlucky soul I've seen that has had this happen and my block is perfectly flat. I also used a blade to delid because I was worried about my IHS bowing, perhaps with good reason.

Live and learn, maybe the next chip will be a better clocker


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> hello new 4770k ir


Use the hammer vise method this time.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> hello new 4770k ir
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Use the hammer vise method this time.


good call.


----------



## Cr4zy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> That sucks man... I'm definitely thinking the waterblock must have bowed it just enough to crack the die - it wouldn't take much at all. I'm not going to jump the gun on "fixing" mine since you seem to be the only unlucky soul I've seen that has had this happen and my block is perfectly flat. I also used a blade to delid because I was worried about my IHS bowing, perhaps with good reason.
> 
> Live and learn, maybe the next chip will be a better clocker


Im pretty much the only guy with luck this bad!

Heres hoping it is a one off, maybe ill have to buy a new block and try again :x


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> Im pretty much the only guy with luck this bad!
> 
> Heres hoping it is a one off, maybe ill have to buy a new block and try again :x


not even close... i bought a new mobbo thinking mine is bad.. still can't get do a reinstall of windows........ windows is gonna be the death of me i swear


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not even close... i bought a new mobbo thinking mine is bad.. still can't get do a reinstall of windows........ *windows is gonna be the death of me* i swear


Uh I think the line forms about 5 miles to the left on that one...


----------



## Cr4zy

Well it would appear my mobo is also dead.

Now who knows if the board died and I killed the chip some how dismantling it or the chip died under the block and killed the board


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> Well it would appear my mobo is also dead.
> 
> Now who knows if the board died and I killed the chip some how dismantling it or the chip died under the block and killed the board


I'm going with the chip cracked under the block, and then shorted out the board in the process. Once you crack the die the electrons can just fly around wherever they wanted, surely they would have found their way to a few of the wrong pins.

That really sucks because that's a nice MOBO you had there.. This might be a nice idea if you need a temporary/cheap solution for a board. I got one for $62 on there a few days ago as a "backup" board in case I ever have to deal with Asus' horrid RMA process.


----------



## Cr4zy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> I'm going with the chip cracked under the block, and then shorted out the board in the process. Once you crack the die the electrons can just fly around wherever they wanted, surely they would have found their way to a few of the wrong pins.
> 
> That really sucks because that's a nice MOBO you had there.. This might be a nice idea if you need a temporary/cheap solution for a board. I got one for $62 on there a few days ago as a "backup" board in case I ever have to deal with Asus' horrid RMA process.


I still have my old 920 and board which I've thrown back in, I just hope it still works now.


----------



## kikibgd

what i dont understand when you delided why you didnt buy nacked mounting kit from ek? since you already have their wb.

me my self have also bad luck with this haswell thing..


----------



## Cr4zy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kikibgd*
> 
> what i dont understand when you delided why you didnt buy nacked mounting kit from ek? since you already have their wb.
> 
> me my self have also bad luck with this haswell thing..


I have the Supreme-HF, their naked mount is for the Supremacy block only.


----------



## kikibgd

aa yes my bad... -_-


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> I'm going with the chip cracked under the block, and then shorted out the board in the process. Once you crack the die the electrons can just fly around wherever they wanted, surely they would have found their way to a few of the wrong pins.
> 
> That really sucks because that's a nice MOBO you had there.. This might be a nice idea if you need a temporary/cheap solution for a board. I got one for $62 on there a few days ago as a "backup" board in case I ever have to deal with Asus' horrid RMA process.


That's a picture of the Z87 UD4H but the model number is the description is a Socket 1155 H61 board. That's confusing and probably not a good thing. I would verify with the vendor on which exact board you are getting.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> That's a picture of the Z87 UD4H but the model number is the description is a Socket 1155 H61 board. That's confusing and probably not a good thing. I would verify with the vendor on which exact board you are getting.


I ordered from Amazon, it appears the 3rd party retailers are the ones causing that confusion. If he purchases from Amazon they'll either send the board pictured or have to make it right - I can't speak for the integrity of 3rd party sellers.

I'll update if an H61 board arrives on my door from Amazon next week.


----------



## Cyro999

http://www.overclock.net/t/1417554/killed-my-4770k/0_20

Guys we have two cracked dies in a few days with IHS on?

A little worrying


----------



## alancsalt

Both Haswell 4770K....









Were both hammer method?


----------



## Cyro999

Both hammer method, both with IHS on, one with CLU under + above, one with CLP under and AS5 above, both water blocks on top. One while powered on and priming with avx and adaptive volts (set as 1.32, read as 1.38 at one point but afterwards unmonitored) and the other while powered off


----------



## alancsalt

So is this die more delicate than Ivy, is what I'm wondering....


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Both Haswell 4770K....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Were both hammer method?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> So is this die more delicate than Ivy, is what I'm wondering....


same thing I posted in the cracked DIE thread

how about over tight the CPU cooler or CPU Block? with high temp and cool down it cracked. I cannot thing in any other failure option. heat and cold cracks things


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> So is this die more delicate than Ivy, is what I'm wondering....


It's possible... I used the razor method so I can't confirm but I'm guessing that the issue has something to do with a bowed IHS from the vice. Perhaps some people are tightening the vice up a bit too much?

I'm considering putting a little something (construction paper or a few layers of liquid electrical tape) under the IHS to prevent putting a bit too much pressure on the die just in case it's something else causing this to happen.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> It's possible... I used the razor method so I can't confirm but I'm guessing that the issue has something to do with a bowed IHS from the vice. Perhaps some people are tightening the vice up a bit too much?
> 
> I'm considering putting a little something (construction paper or a few layers of liquid electrical tape) under the IHS to prevent putting a bit too much pressure on the die just in case it's something else causing this to happen.


if you do the tape under the IHS you going back to stage zero again. it makes no sense.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> if you do the tape under the IHS you going back to stage zero again. it makes no sense.


Making a tiny gap and filling it with the CLP/CLU is far better than the huge gap left from the RTV and the crap paste from Intel. If I do it out of paranoia then I'll post my results. I highly doubt it would be enough to send my temps into the danger zone... In any event, slightly higher temps are far superior to a cracked die; it makes *perfect* sense.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Making a tiny gap and filling it with the CLP/CLU is far better than the huge gap left from the RTV and the crap paste from Intel. If I do it out of paranoia then I'll post my results. I highly doubt it would be enough to send my temps into the danger zone... In any event, slightly higher temps are far superior to a cracked die; it makes *perfect* sense.


keep in mind too much thermal compound won't work as it intend to. .


----------



## stickg1

The Intel stock TIM isn't terrible. It's actually really good. The RTV adhesive is the main culprit. A liquid metal TIM does help, needless to say, because it is the closest thing we can get to solder.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The Intel stock TIM isn't terrible. It's actually really good. The RTV adhesive is the main culprit. A liquid metal TIM does help, needless to say, because it is the closest thing we can get to solder.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> keep in mind too much thermal compound won't work as it intend to. .


Yeah, kind of common knowledge on here I figure.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> The Intel stock TIM isn't terrible. It's actually really good. The RTV adhesive is the main culprit. A liquid metal TIM does help, needless to say, because it is the closest thing we can get to solder.


Stock TIM is bad, real bad. RTV isn't helping but the TIM is closing the gap and clearly not transferring the heat nearly as well as the CLP/CLU - If it comes down to it I'll make a small gap as explained (far thinner than the RTV from Intel, I work with RTV often when repairing equipment and I can see Intel used a LOT) and post results. I'd rather have slightly higher temps than a cracked die if the issue is found not to be associated/isolated to the hammer and vice method.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Yeah, kind of common knowledge on here I figure.
> Stock TIM is bad, real bad. RTV isn't helping but the TIM is closing the gap and clearly not transferring the heat nearly as well as the CLP/CLU - If it comes down to it I'll make a small gap as explained (far thinner than the RTV from Intel, I work with RTV often when repairing equipment and I can see Intel used a LOT) and post results. I'd rather have slightly higher temps than a cracked die if the issue is found not to be associated/isolated to the hammer and vice method.


The stock tim is comparable the the best regular pastes. Bad compared to CLP/CLU like other paste, but the main problem is too much of it & the little bit of gap from the glue.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

All I know is that this is yet another reason I'm glad I just decided to stay with Ivy and skip Haswell altogether. I realize that's cold comfort to you 4770K guys... but sometimes it's nice to accidentally make a good decision - usually I go in the other direction and I'm the guy with the dead hardware.


----------



## Daredevil 720

I'm thinking about getting an EK Naked Ivy kit and ditching the IHS to be safe. Don't know if I'll be safer or not though..


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The stock tim is comparable the the best regular pastes. Bad compared to CLP/CLU like other paste, but the main problem is too much of it & the little bit of gap from the glue.


Yeah, wasn't there someone did a test by delidding and reusing the stock paste and got better temps than with MX4?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Yeah, wasn't there someone did a test by delidding and reusing the stock paste and got better temps than with MX4?


Yes. It was posted at Anandtech, I believe. He used a shim to simulate the glue gap and the temps went back up, if I recall correctly. Pretty conclusive that the gap was the issue, not the TIM.


----------



## grimmjow

Was thinking about delidding my new 4670K since my temps are crap even with an H80..heck the intel stock cooler isn't much worse than it right now which leads me to believe not enough heat transfer is occurring under the lid. But I am seeing a few reports of cracked dies and that scares me a bit.

Might stick with a moderate overclock for now a delid later once the culprit for the cracked chips is found.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *grimmjow*
> 
> Was thinking about delidding my new 4670K since my temps are crap even with an H80..heck the intel stock cooler isn't much worse than it right now which leads me to believe not enough heat transfer is occurring under the lid. But I am seeing a few reports of cracked dies and that scares me a bit.
> 
> Might stick with a moderate overclock for now a delid later once the culprit for the cracked chips is found.


I can see how these news would scare ppl off.. If my chip cracked(witch i doubt), I would get a new one and delid again.. the gain out weighs the risk imo..

Keep in mind that this is only two cases out of.. hundreds? and we dont know if they put too much force on the IHS in vise or if they used too much CLP/CLU.

that said, it is great seeing ppl investigating this problem and I'm looking forward to results with that RTV replacement and other solutions you guys might come up with!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Yeah, kind of common knowledge on here I figure.
> *Stock TIM is bad, real bad.* RTV isn't helping but the TIM is closing the gap and clearly not transferring the heat nearly as well as the CLP/CLU - If it comes down to it I'll make a small gap as explained (far thinner than the RTV from Intel, I work with RTV often when repairing equipment and I can see Intel used a LOT) and post results. I'd rather have slightly higher temps than a cracked die if the issue is found not to be associated/isolated to the hammer and vice method.


It's been proven to be a decent paste, better than MX-4 or something comparable. The reason Liquid Metal TIM excels so much in this particular application is because it's the closest thing you can get to actual solder to transfer the heat.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Keep in mind that this is only two cases out of.. hundreds?


You can't really know that. That's the only two people that posted about this, but it might have happened to others.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You can't really know that. That's the only two people that posted about this, but it might have happened to others.


thats why I wrote "hundreds*?*"


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> thats why I wrote "hundreds*?*"


Oh, sorry... Misunderstood because I read too fast.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The stock tim is comparable the the best regular pastes. Bad compared to CLP/CLU like other paste, but the main problem is too much of it & the little bit of gap from the glue.


The TIM is crap *compared to CLU/CLP* and I'm not going to argue about it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Yes. It was posted at Anandtech, I believe. He used a shim to simulate the glue gap and the temps went back up, if I recall correctly. Pretty conclusive that the gap was the issue, not the TIM.


Did anybody read my post? One or two layers of liquid electrical tape *is hardly the thickness of the RTV left my Intel.* The issue is the gap, yes, and also that there is a *better* paste available (CLP/CLU) which Intel chose not to use (probably for cost reasons, or to limit their chips because they don't like overclockers much) and so if I am concerned that the issue with cracked dies is a clearence issue and not just a bowed IHS then how does one fix the issue? He re-creates a bit of a gap, whether it makes temps go up or not - because a dead CPU is no CPU and a hotter CPU at least still does calculations. *Don't try to tell me that one to three layers of liquid electrical tape (which dries hardly thicker than paint) and then applying slightly more CLP/CLU than I have now; that I'm going to be re-creating the problem that Intel has created.* Also, CLP/CLU is a *lot* less sensitive to using too much than other pastes are. It's doesn't insulate in the same way other pastes can when too much is applied, unless you get _real silly._
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> It's been proven to be a decent paste, better than MX-4 or something comparable. The reason Liquid Metal TIM excels so much in this particular application is because it's the closest thing you can get to actual solder to transfer the heat.


It's not decent compared to CLP/CLU or solder, which Intel chose not to use, therefore compared to what I'm using - *Intel used crap paste for such an expensive CPU.*


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> *Intel used crap paste for such an expensive CPU.*


I think the posts around this are just a problem about how people name things. I'm guessing people just don't see CLU as "paste" necessarily (at least it's like this for me). If you only name "paste" the normal stuff like MX-4 etc., what Intel uses is actually excellent paste, at the very top in comparisons. Getting worked up and arguing is a bit stupid if it's just about the definitions used.

About why Intel used paste, I'd guess using something like CLU just would be stupid for them as they can just go for solder like in LGA2011 CPUs if they want something better than paste.


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I think the posts around this are just a problem about how people name things. I'm guessing people just don't see CLU as "paste" necessarily (at least it's like this for me). If you only name "paste" the normal stuff like MX-4 etc., what Intel uses is actually excellent paste, at the very top in comparisons. Getting worked up and arguing is a bit stupid if it's just about the definitions used.
> 
> About why Intel used paste, I'd guess using something like CLU just would be stupid for them as they can just go for solder like in LGA2011 CPUs if they want something better than paste.


Okay, think *paste =TIM* in my mind.

We can play semantics and say that it's _actually_ liquid metal, or that it's _actually_ thermal interface material, or that it's _actually juice from the loins of a unicorn_ if we want to - But if you compare the _unicorn juice_ to the Intel glue then we can see that the _unicorn juice_ is *far superior* _and that is why I call the Intel "paste" crap when compared to the CLP/CLU -_ *end of story.*

Nobody is getting worked up about anything.

Intel used the paste they did because it was cheap enough and it worked for the task at hand, end of story. That doesn't mean any of us have to like it or speak kindly about their decisions.


----------



## stickg1

Intel used paste because solder was cracking with the new (Ivy) die process and 3D transistors.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Intel used paste because solder was cracking with the new (Ivy) die process and 3D transistors.


Can't be as they went back to soldering with things like i7-4820k which is Ivy Bridge. (is that correct?)


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Intel used paste because solder was cracking with the new (Ivy) die process and 3D transistors.


*And thus:*

_"Intel used the paste they did because it was cheap enough and it *worked for the task at hand*, end of story."_

Are we all done here yet?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Okay, think *paste =TIM* in my mind.
> 
> We can play semantics and say that it's _actually_ liquid metal, or that it's _actually_ thermal interface material, or that it's _actually juice from the loins of a unicorn_ if we want to - But if you compare the _unicorn juice_ to the Intel glue then we can see that the _unicorn juice_ is *far superior* _and that is why I call the Intel "paste" crap when compared to the CLP/CLU -_ *end of story.*
> 
> Nobody is getting worked up about anything.
> 
> Intel used the paste they did because it was cheap enough and it worked for the task at hand, end of story. That doesn't mean any of us have to like it or speak kindly about their decisions.


Well Good morning peoples!

Anyways sorry I've been gone for a bit, still trying to get my comp running and getting pretty peed about it. Anyways...

I have had many discussions with managers at Intel about the reasoning behind the TIM instead of solder like sandy bridge. Stig said it was because that they were cracking the dies and killing them. He is completely correct, they said for some reason with the high to low load tranfers of heat that the die would slowly crack over time.

I asked then why the reasoning for some much glue to hold down the IHS. They said it was because with the fluxless soldering on sandy bridge it actually helped hold the IHS on. Which makes sense because if you ever watch a delidding of a sandy bridge and they torch them off they literally pop right off the die when the solder is warm enough. I bet you they were forced to use more glue as more of a precaution to keep these IHSs on for their customer "us" so that trying to takke off a big bulky heat sink and the latch can sometimes were at the bond in the glue and make the IHS simply come off.

Im actually impressed Intel went to so much trouble think about it. They would have had to completely redo their assembly lines and manufacturing processs to make their product perfectly usable. An as a business major that's perfect sense, as you have limited time to redo your process and give enough of these out to sonsumers before the launch. You have to give them credit for that.

The grey "goop" TIM they used is pretty good I've found it once a while back and I need to try it.

Now with the newer ivye chips and the fluxless soldering on those bad boys.

1. Different socket different die size.
2. Die must be bigger to take the 2011 motherboards orders and such including twice the ammount of RAM as its 1155 brother.

Alright im done speeling/ranting I spose









But anyways vagur wants his computer to work and its really bugging him...


----------



## Chomuco

new 4770k =Delidded : 20 g - liquid pro !! exit !!









http://i.imgur.com/izUlvDR.png

http://i.imgur.com/A9Xb2t6.png


----------



## L36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> *And thus:*
> 
> _"Intel used the paste they did because it was cheap enough and it *worked for the task at hand*, end of story."_
> 
> Are we all done here yet?


Stop being ignorant. Intel is using paste so it does not crack its chips.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Stop being ignorant. Intel is using paste so it does not crack its chips.


Took me a couple posts to see what he was getting at as well, had to read between the lines a bit.

The stock paste being bad *compared to CLP/CLU*

Intel couldn't use the solder so they used the cheap paste *cheaped out, since the more expensive liquid metal like CLP/CLU would have been better from the factory*


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *L36*
> 
> Stop being ignorant. Intel is using paste so it does not crack its chips.


Not being ignorant at all... I guess you'll just have to take my word for it and not be ignorant about that. Thanks for repeating what we already know.









@Val - thanks for the info... Is there a chance that the two cracked dies from delidded 4770K's (both were hammer and vice method and cracked about a month after delidding) may be related to the liquid metal TIM we are all using?


----------



## FtW 420

If itt was the liquid metal we would probably be seeing more cracked dies. I've killed a 3770k from extreme temp changes with CLU on the die, but it didn't crack.
My 4770k was seeing some very extreme temp changes just yesterday & still going (100° + temp swings from idle to load & back), with gelid extreme on the die.

I can't say for sure, but think the cracked dies are either from the delidding process with the hammer & vise, or from uneven/too much mounting pressure.

I delidded 2 x 3770k with the double edged razor with no scratches or issues, & delidded the 4770k with the vise & hammer. The vise & hammer was much quicker & seemed pretty foolproof, tightened the vise just enough that the IHS locked in & didn't move, first gentle tap on the 2 x 2 with the hammer, 2nd a bit harder, 3rd hit a bit harder yet did the trick. Took less than 30 seconds once the chip went in the vise.


----------



## Supacasey

My best guess is that the 4770k's are more susceptible to cracking under metal applications. We know that Intel didn't solder 3770k's for that reason because of their process, maybe 4770k's are more sensitive to it due to refinement in the process.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Not being ignorant at all... I guess you'll just have to take my word for it and not be ignorant about that. Thanks for repeating what we already know.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Val - thanks for the info... Is there a chance that the two cracked dies from delidded 4770K's (both were hammer and vice method and cracked about a month after delidding) may be related to the liquid metal TIM we are all using?


No prob







what I'm here for (that phone call took like 3 hours as well was kinda insane)

anyways I am trying to diagnose those 4770K's myself and having a hard time believing that the die itself which is covered by a protective layer of glass to keep TIM's doing what they do from shorting it instantly, and to think that the vise method would be bending IHS's is prettyy silly as the lips for the glue areas are strengthening the entire peice and it wouldn't bend with the slight pressure we are putting on it, you'd have to take a sledgehammer and heat the IHS up to ultiple hunred degrees to really notice.

I am kinda leaning towards the IHS pressure from heatsinks... but im not quite sold on that one yet either... im just wondering why it started on the top part then as if it was pressure it should start in the middle almost where the mass of the weight goes.

Tiss a brain teaser this!


----------



## Forceman

Maybe the pressure on the die was uneven, and that's why they cracked on the ends. Haswell is a little longer, right? So an uneven mount would be putting more pressure on the end than it would on an Ivy chip.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Maybe the pressure on the die was uneven, and that's why they cracked on the ends. Haswell is a little longer, right? So an uneven mount would be putting more pressure on the end than it would on an Ivy chip.


Not necessarily unless they lapped the crap out of the bottom of the stands ont he IHs like i did on my first Ivy were it didn't touch the PCB at all it sat literally on the die.

The die size doesn't really matter since those feets should be sitting on the PCB before the middle IHS really even touches the die as the TIM is there for that reason to make it a flush fit.

I just check on my first IVY and my new ones lid without any lap and it ouches the pcb before it touches the die at all. so unless the did major lapping thats what im thinking is the pressure.

UNLESS and i really hope it's not this but a bad batch of silicon came through with missaligned crystals and the pressure and other things like heat and such may have been the culprit as it is a very small amount of them only 2 as i see that have had this issue.

Whats your take?


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Maybe the pressure on the die was uneven, and that's why they cracked on the ends. Haswell is a little longer, right? So an uneven mount would be putting more pressure on the end than it would on an Ivy chip.


----------



## Swag

Intel TIM is actually really good, I have tried it on my other CPUs and they work just as good as MX-4 and PK-1 (TBH). You can buy your own from their website (showed this to Val a long time ago).

Intel could not use solder because during the process of fixing the IHS onto the die with the solder proved to be fatal basically pull and bend it resulting a crack. Imagine a brand new tech that's 22nm (very delicate) vs the others which are 32nm or 45nm or even 55nm, there are definitely going to be problems not thought out before they actually create the tech. As to the newer Ivy's, whoever said up top, it is a different die size. It will be much more resilient to cracking during the process of soldering.

My guess on why that die crack is because of the pressure put on it by the pounding. So, we all know that CPUs are fairly delicate, they can be handled rough but delicate in physique. It will bend around like a rubber band (obvious joke) with enough force. I'm guessing that when they were pounding the hammer on the wood (thus transferring energy to the PCB), it caused the PCB to slightly bend because the glue had enough adherence to the PCB and IHS holding them together. With every pound, the die would "bend" with the PCB because that is the base of it and after a few bangs, the die would mostly likely have cracked before the IHS even came off.
To better explain it, compare it to the razor method. By using the razor, you aren't physically causing the PCB to have energy passing through it, all you are doing is separating the atoms of the glue from each other and no bending means no cracked die.

This is my honest thought on the matter and to me, this is probably what happened in this case. Of course, this is basing it on the fact that nothing happened afterwards such as a Superman Ivy CPU or the wood hitting the die by accident afterwards.


----------



## Valgaur

Good point and that would be pretty good for the though on the pcb bending as I've seen that stuff bend slightly just from razor methods as well.

hmmmmmmm


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Intel TIM is actually really good, I have tried it on my other CPUs and they work just as good as MX-4 and PK-1 (TBH). You can buy your own from their website (showed this to Val a long time ago).
> 
> Intel could not use solder because during the process of fixing the IHS onto the die with the solder proved to be fatal basically pull and bend it resulting a crack. Imagine a brand new tech that's 22nm (very delicate) vs the others which are 32nm or 45nm or even 55nm, there are definitely going to be problems not thought out before they actually create the tech. As to the newer Ivy's, whoever said up top, it is a different die size. It will be much more resilient to cracking during the process of soldering.
> 
> My guess on why that die crack is because of the pressure put on it by the pounding. So, we all know that CPUs are fairly delicate, they can be handled rough but delicate in physique. It will bend around like a rubber band (obvious joke) with enough force. I'm guessing that when they were pounding the hammer on the wood (thus transferring energy to the PCB), it caused the PCB to slightly bend because the glue had enough adherence to the PCB and IHS holding them together. With every pound, the die would "bend" with the PCB because that is the base of it and after a few bangs, the die would mostly likely have cracked before the IHS even came off.
> To better explain it, compare it to the razor method. By using the razor, you aren't physically causing the PCB to have energy passing through it, all you are doing is separating the atoms of the glue from each other and no bending means no cracked die.
> 
> This is my honest thought on the matter and to me, this is probably what happened in this case. Of course, this is basing it on the fact that nothing happened afterwards such as a Superman Ivy CPU or the wood hitting the die by accident afterwards.


If you hit it totally straight (as instructed) then the PCB won't bend upward. You could also hit it with a slight downward angle to make sure it doesn't bend. So that only leaves you with the hammer shock.


----------



## kikibgd

all dies that were cracked died month later that means it wasn't the hammer vice metod that cracked the die, and if it did cpu would die instantly i wouldnt work.

my bet is on to much and uneven preassure from heatsink.


----------



## neofury

I think personally, that it's a matter of the heatsink being mounted on too tight. Even if it isn't direct die, I could see all that pressure causing a problem. (Waterblock too tight, etc)


----------



## deepor

So... the forum posts linked to in the first post mention the thickness of the glue is 0.09mm. What happens if I put a shim out of a material of 0.09mm thickness between IHS and PCB and use CLU? Will CLU work like magic compared to the original paste and still keep temperatures looking excellent? Is there some example of someone doing this or maybe someone using CLU without cleaning off the glue?


----------



## luckymatt

It's likely that we're only seeing a small percentage of folks admitting that they killed their CPU...I could understand that someone might be too ashamed to post that they broke their $300 CPU. So for all of you in that group...just register a "throwaway" account and post here for the rest of our sakes. Of course I might be bitter too and say "forget it, they can all break their chips too..."

I gotta say that the whole hammer and vice method never struck me as particularly safe. On one page of this thread you've got "oh no you have to put the IHS back on, you can't go naked die because the die is so delicate...now excuse me while I go put my chip in a vice and whack it with a hammer...."


----------



## Supacasey

Assuming it was caused by excessive pressure, what would the recommended amount of pressure be then? In the case of waterblocks, just screw it down until the screws are snug?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> Assuming it was caused by excessive pressure, what would the recommended amount of pressure be then? In the case of waterblocks, just screw it down until the screws are snug?


yea..

my block (and many others) come with springs that should allow you to fully tighten the screws and let the springs "control" the pressure..

do we have any info on the broken chips cooler? would like to know if blocks with spring solution can also apply too much pressure? (if this is even the reason for the cracked cores..)


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> yea..
> 
> my block (and many others) come with springs that should allow you to fully tighten the screws and let the springs "control" the pressure..
> 
> do we have any info on the broken chips cooler? would like to know if blocks with spring solution can also apply too much pressure? (if this is even the reason for the cracked cores..)


One had EK water block, the other some sort of CLC from Antec. That's just from memory as I'd have to search for those posts.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> One had EK water block, the other some sort of CLC from Antec. That's just from memory as I'd have to search for those posts.


Yep, EK Supreme HF and Antec Khuler 620


----------



## GaMbi2004

hmm.. EK has springs and has to be fully tightened (by hand ofc) and therefore hard to put too much / uneven pressure on the CPU, right?
the Antec Khuler 620 on the other hand, dosnt look like it has auto tension and also has pump mounted on the CPU.. hmm

I was hoping to see something comparable, but no


----------



## HairyGamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> hmm.. EK has springs and has to be fully tightened (by hand ofc) and therefore hard to put too much / uneven pressure on the CPU, right?
> the Antec Khuler 620 on the other hand, dosnt look like it has auto tension and also has pump mounted on the CPU.. hmm
> 
> I was hoping to see something comparable, but no


The 620, like my 920, has "nubs" on the ears of the mounting hardware and on the screws themselves to prevent over tightening - I've always bottomed the screws out completely on both my AM3+ systems and my 1150 system without issue.


----------



## Valgaur

The mounting pressure with the IHS doesn't matter as the IHS as it's made to do spreads not just the heat but the pressure itself...

I think it's something else besides normal heatsink pressure with the ihs on... heck I've tightened mine down crazy hard once and never had a problem before.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The mounting pressure with the IHS doesn't matter as the IHS as it's made to do spreads not just the heat but the pressure itself...
> 
> I think it's something else besides normal heatsink pressure with the ihs on... heck I've tightened mine down crazy hard once and never had a problem before.


I'm thinking there's stress on the die because all the pressure from mounting the cooler goes directly into it until the PCB bends enough for the IHS to touch the PCB. This might not be a problem with Ivy Bridge, but Haswell has a longer die and it's more likely to snap and crack from the stress. If the CPU is not delidded there's the glue between IHS and PCB. The PCB flexes less and the stress on the die is less so Intel didn't see a problem.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> So... the forum posts linked to in the first post mention the thickness of the glue is 0.09mm. What happens if I put a shim out of a material of 0.09mm thickness between IHS and PCB and use CLU? Will CLU work like magic compared to the original paste and still keep temperatures looking excellent? Is there some example of someone doing this or maybe someone using CLU without cleaning off the glue?


Somoene tried it and found that using a shim to re-create the gap caused the temps to go back up, which led to the understanding that the problem is the gap itself, not the TIM used. So putting the same size gap back in might not be a good idea, but there might be value in putting a smaller shim in there. Someone with lots of free time should try it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I'm thinking there's stress on the die because all the pressure from mounting the cooler goes directly into it until the PCB bends enough for the IHS to touch the PCB. This might not be a problem with Ivy Bridge, but Haswell has a longer die and it's more likely to snap and crack from the stress. If the CPU is not delidded there's the glue between IHS and PCB. The PCB flexes less and the stress on the die is less so Intel didn't see a problem.


Interesting idea - the way the mounting stress bends the motherboard itself shows how much pressure there is. You'd think the socket would stop the bending of the chip PCB but maybe the new sockets aren't as strong or something. Or maybe the sockets aren't engineered as well and the socket itself is causing the PCBs to bow a little. With a glued on IHS the IHS would take a lot of the stress and keep the PCB flat, but without the glue the PCB is free to bend a little.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Somoene tried it and found that using a shim to re-create the gap caused the temps to go back up, which led to the understanding that the problem is the gap itself, not the TIM used. So putting the same size gap back in might not be a good idea, but there might be value in putting a smaller shim in there. Someone with lots of free time should try it.
> Interesting idea - the way the mounting stress bends the motherboard itself shows how much pressure there is. You'd think the socket would stop the bending of the chip PCB but maybe the new sockets aren't as strong or something. Or maybe the sockets aren't engineered as well and the socket itself is causing the PCBs to bow a little. With a glued on IHS the IHS would take a lot of the stress and keep the PCB flat, but without the glue the PCB is free to bend a little.


Not really .09mm of glue is hardly anything to think about with the pressure we are talking about here.... thats calculated height btw.


----------



## Valgaur

Alright guys I think my cpu is shot so I'm gonna cross ship it and here's how my conversation went!

I HIGHLY RECOMMEND YOU READ THIS! epic guy I talked to here!










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Allan: Hello. Thank you for using the Intel Customer Chat Support service. We are glad to be of service. How may I help you?
Jonathan Puhl: hello!
Allan: hi
Jonathan Puhl: I have a heck of a problem with my cpu
Jonathan Puhl: I have an issue with my cpu
Jonathan Puhl: woop[s
Allan: what is the processor model?
Jonathan Puhl: 3770K
Allan: ok, how may I help?
Jonathan Puhl: I have spent the last month and 800 dollars to diagnose my issue with booting into windows and it sadly points to my processor
Jonathan Puhl: but it boots fine through bios with no errors but i can't make it into any OS or reinstall my w7
Allan: what is the motherboard model number?
Allan: and memory speed or part number>
Allan: ?
Jonathan Puhl: i have 2 motherboards i've tried this on
Jonathan Puhl: the p8z77-v premium
Jonathan Puhl: and maximus V gene
Jonathan Puhl: 1600 mhz memory as well
Allan: what would you like to do with the processor? I can offer warranty for it since this is covered for 3 years
Jonathan Puhl: how long would it take to get a replacement through you guys though?
Jonathan Puhl: im in a pretty tight time crunch
Allan: Please read our replacement process as follows:
Allan: you need to send the processor back to us, as soon as we receive it, we will release the new item and the estimated delivery time will be approximately 7 - 10 business days. Product returned with Physical Damage (damage to the product due to external causes) will be returned as received
Allan: or the other option is cross ship it
Allan: For urgent part replacements, we offer the Cross Ship option "depending on our inventory", we will ship the part first, then you can return the defective part in the same box, with the prepaid label that will be included.
Allan: This procedure has a non-refundable cost of $25.
Allan: Once we gather CC information we will charge the total amount price of the processor and the shipping cost. Once we receive your processor back we will refund the cost of the processor
Jonathan Puhl: hmmm
Jonathan Puhl: how many days does cross shippign take usually?
Jonathan Puhl: 7 days area liek normal?
Allan: If I place the order for cross ship, Intel will ship the processor next business day
Jonathan Puhl: how long will it take to get to me though?
Allan: by tomorrow afternoon you will get it or Wednesday morning.. For sure is next business day
Jonathan Puhl: wow thats pretty crazy shipping actually
Jonathan Puhl: I have another question
Allan: sure
Jonathan Puhl: a buudy of somone I know is curious about being able to send in a Delidded Ivy bridge I believe a 3570K
Jonathan Puhl: the IHS is all normal with information on it and he can glue the IHS back on no problem
Jonathan Puhl: would you guys take those?
Allan: if the processor 3570k is under warranty, Intel will replace it.
Allan: But bear in mind, it's one processor per order
Jonathan Puhl: even with the IHS being taken off and put back on?
Allan: yes, that is no problem, actually, if you send in the 3770k, you need to pull it out to read off the markings
Jonathan Puhl: actually
Jonathan Puhl: i have the IHS near me
Allan: with processor markings engraved on it, we validate the warranty
Jonathan Puhl: thats amazing
Allan: ok, in order to setup the RMA, I need complete processor information, this is located on the metal surface from top to bottom.
Jonathan Puhl: do you need the 4 digit code loccated ont eh PCb?
Allan: yes, that is correct.. I need every line on the processor
Jonathan Puhl: that bottom line I don't have as it's in my comp but i can come back later and set this up
Allan: sure, that's no problem
Allan: see here to check how the processor marking looks like
Allan: http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-030330.htm
Allan: please take note of your service ticket number. This will serve as the reference number for your inquiry today 8000751148
Jonathan Puhl: thank you very much Allan I really appreciate this, I will gett he information you need and Glue the IHS back ona dn get it ready for you guys
Jonathan Puhl: i ahve the referance number thanks
Allan: you are welcome.
Jonathan Puhl: One quick question I have for you guys
Allan: yes
Jonathan Puhl: I have seen 2 accounts of cracked dies on 4770K's
Jonathan Puhl: any idea why that might have occured?
Jonathan Puhl: they delidded their cpus and then they were running and then it stopped workign and the dies were cracked?
Allan: cracked as an "damage"
Allan: ?
Jonathan Puhl: yes they have a hairline crack int he die itself
Jonathan Puhl: the cpu's wont run or post
Allan: for that, Intel will request some pictures before replacing the unit. there is an inspection before approving any RMA
Jonathan Puhl: here i can link you a picture
Allan: This type of damage is not covered under warranty, that is why we need pictures
Jonathan Puhl: exactly
Jonathan Puhl: http://www.overclock.net/t/1417554/killed-my-4770k
Allan: please send the picture at *****************************
Jonathan Puhl: I will pass forward that information to them
Allan: sure
Jonathan Puhl: thank you so much for the help Allan. If there is a ratig I can do after this i'd be more than happy
Allan: sure, thanks



I blocked the email as I will save it for people who need to use it so if you'd liek to give it one last shot! PM me for the email address!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Alright guys I think my cpu is shot so I'm gonna cross ship it and here's how my conversation went!
> 
> I HIGHLY RECOMMEND YOU READ THIS! epic guy I talked to here!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Allan: Hello. Thank you for using the Intel Customer Chat Support service. We are glad to be of service. How may I help you?
> Jonathan Puhl: hello!
> Allan: hi
> Jonathan Puhl: I have a heck of a problem with my cpu
> Jonathan Puhl: I have an issue with my cpu
> Jonathan Puhl: woop[s
> Allan: what is the processor model?
> Jonathan Puhl: 3770K
> Allan: ok, how may I help?
> Jonathan Puhl: I have spent the last month and 800 dollars to diagnose my issue with booting into windows and it sadly points to my processor
> Jonathan Puhl: but it boots fine through bios with no errors but i can't make it into any OS or reinstall my w7
> Allan: what is the motherboard model number?
> Allan: and memory speed or part number>
> Allan: ?
> Jonathan Puhl: i have 2 motherboards i've tried this on
> Jonathan Puhl: the p8z77-v premium
> Jonathan Puhl: and maximus V gene
> Jonathan Puhl: 1600 mhz memory as well
> Allan: what would you like to do with the processor? I can offer warranty for it since this is covered for 3 years
> Jonathan Puhl: how long would it take to get a replacement through you guys though?
> Jonathan Puhl: im in a pretty tight time crunch
> Allan: Please read our replacement process as follows:
> Allan: you need to send the processor back to us, as soon as we receive it, we will release the new item and the estimated delivery time will be approximately 7 - 10 business days. Product returned with Physical Damage (damage to the product due to external causes) will be returned as received
> Allan: or the other option is cross ship it
> Allan: For urgent part replacements, we offer the Cross Ship option "depending on our inventory", we will ship the part first, then you can return the defective part in the same box, with the prepaid label that will be included.
> Allan: This procedure has a non-refundable cost of $25.
> Allan: Once we gather CC information we will charge the total amount price of the processor and the shipping cost. Once we receive your processor back we will refund the cost of the processor
> Jonathan Puhl: hmmm
> Jonathan Puhl: how many days does cross shippign take usually?
> Jonathan Puhl: 7 days area liek normal?
> Allan: If I place the order for cross ship, Intel will ship the processor next business day
> Jonathan Puhl: how long will it take to get to me though?
> Allan: by tomorrow afternoon you will get it or Wednesday morning.. For sure is next business day
> Jonathan Puhl: wow thats pretty crazy shipping actually
> Jonathan Puhl: I have another question
> Allan: sure
> Jonathan Puhl: a buudy of somone I know is curious about being able to send in a Delidded Ivy bridge I believe a 3570K
> Jonathan Puhl: the IHS is all normal with information on it and he can glue the IHS back on no problem
> Jonathan Puhl: would you guys take those?
> Allan: if the processor 3570k is under warranty, Intel will replace it.
> Allan: But bear in mind, it's one processor per order
> Jonathan Puhl: even with the IHS being taken off and put back on?
> Allan: yes, that is no problem, actually, if you send in the 3770k, you need to pull it out to read off the markings
> Jonathan Puhl: actually
> Jonathan Puhl: i have the IHS near me
> Allan: with processor markings engraved on it, we validate the warranty
> Jonathan Puhl: thats amazing
> Allan: ok, in order to setup the RMA, I need complete processor information, this is located on the metal surface from top to bottom.
> Jonathan Puhl: do you need the 4 digit code loccated ont eh PCb?
> Allan: yes, that is correct.. I need every line on the processor
> Jonathan Puhl: that bottom line I don't have as it's in my comp but i can come back later and set this up
> Allan: sure, that's no problem
> Allan: see here to check how the processor marking looks like
> Allan: http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-030330.htm
> Allan: please take note of your service ticket number. This will serve as the reference number for your inquiry today 8000751148
> Jonathan Puhl: thank you very much Allan I really appreciate this, I will gett he information you need and Glue the IHS back ona dn get it ready for you guys
> Jonathan Puhl: i ahve the referance number thanks
> Allan: you are welcome.
> Jonathan Puhl: One quick question I have for you guys
> Allan: yes
> Jonathan Puhl: I have seen 2 accounts of cracked dies on 4770K's
> Jonathan Puhl: any idea why that might have occured?
> Jonathan Puhl: they delidded their cpus and then they were running and then it stopped workign and the dies were cracked?
> Allan: cracked as an "damage"
> Allan: ?
> Jonathan Puhl: yes they have a hairline crack int he die itself
> Jonathan Puhl: the cpu's wont run or post
> Allan: for that, Intel will request some pictures before replacing the unit. there is an inspection before approving any RMA
> Jonathan Puhl: here i can link you a picture
> Allan: This type of damage is not covered under warranty, that is why we need pictures
> Jonathan Puhl: exactly
> Jonathan Puhl: http://www.overclock.net/t/1417554/killed-my-4770k
> Allan: please send the picture at *****************************
> Jonathan Puhl: I will pass forward that information to them
> Allan: sure
> Jonathan Puhl: thank you so much for the help Allan. If there is a ratig I can do after this i'd be more than happy
> Allan: sure, thanks
> 
> 
> 
> I blocked the email as I will save it for people who need to use it so if you'd liek to give it one last shot! PM me for the email address!


I'm sure they will conclude that the cracked dies were due to user error, whatever it may have been









My delidded 4770k is going a bit higher after delid, I could manage 5ghz but not 5.1Ghz before delidding, now handling 5.1Ghz + at least in IBT.
Have to get some more cold juice & see how ln2 clocks are affected.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I'm sure they will conclude that the cracked dies were due to user error, whatever it may have been
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My delidded 4770k is going a bit higher after delid, I could manage 5ghz but not 5.1Ghz before delidding, now handling 5.1Ghz + at least in IBT.
> Have to get some more cold juice & see how ln2 clocks are affected.


still a chance of RMA is better than none in my mind lol


----------



## ClaggyPants

Finally plucked up the courage this weekend and seem to have had decent results;

OCN name:ClaggyPants
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Cool laboratory ultra
ihs-TIM:Cool laboratory ultra
Mhz gained:200 Mhz
OC after delid:4800Mhz
Temp drops:unknown
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2887879

Could never get above 4.6 at 1.3v before and I've been able to drop the voltage to 1.25v at 4.8 since the delid. Started with the razer blade method and bottled it when I started to get close to where the core lies so I stuck it in the vice to finish it off. Hopefully have done no damage to the chip but I suppose time will tell.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ClaggyPants*
> 
> Finally plucked up the courage this weekend and seem to have had decent results;
> 
> OCN name:ClaggyPants
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Cool laboratory ultra
> ihs-TIM:Cool laboratory ultra
> Mhz gained:200 Mhz
> OC after delid:4800Mhz
> Temp drops:unknown
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2887879
> 
> Could never get above 4.6 at 1.3v before and I've been able to drop the voltage to 1.25v at 4.8 since the delid. Started with the razer blade method and bottled it when I started to get close to where the core lies so I stuck it in the vice to finish it off. Hopefully have done no damage to the chip but I suppose time will tell.


I can't add you right now but everything looks good so You will be entered by Swag if he can read this post later on if not I'll try to get you in later tonight!!!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ClaggyPants*
> 
> Finally plucked up the courage this weekend and seem to have had decent results;
> 
> OCN name:ClaggyPants
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Cool laboratory ultra
> ihs-TIM:Cool laboratory ultra
> Mhz gained:200 Mhz
> OC after delid:4800Mhz
> Temp drops:unknown
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2887879
> 
> Could never get above 4.6 at 1.3v before and I've been able to drop the voltage to 1.25v at 4.8 since the delid. Started with the razer blade method and bottled it when I started to get close to where the core lies so I stuck it in the vice to finish it off. Hopefully have done no damage to the chip but I suppose time will tell.
> 
> 
> 
> I can't add you right now but everything looks good so You will be entered by Swag if he can read this post later on if not I'll try to get you in later tonight!!!
Click to expand...

Yea, I'll add him right now. Welcome to the club!


----------



## ClaggyPants

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I'll add him right now. Welcome to the club!


Thanks man, much appreciated. The main reason for me doing this was I'm a bit OCD about the differences in temps between cores. Not sure why but mine are worse since the delid. core #1 running about 6 degrees celsius hotter than core #0. Is it worth re applying the clu or should I just be happy with what I've got?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ClaggyPants*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, I'll add him right now. Welcome to the club!
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks man, much appreciated. The main reason for me doing this was I'm a bit OCD about the differences in temps between cores. Not sure why but mine are worse since the delid. core #1 running about 6 degrees celsius hotter than core #0. Is it worth re applying the clu or should I just be happy with what I've got?
Click to expand...

I would try it myself by reapplying the paste (be a bit more generous when putting the CLU) and hope for the best. Honestly, I like my temps being all within 2C within each other and they're all really cool.


----------



## Cyro999

I have a gap between my hottest and coolest core that expands to as much as 12c+ if i push the CPU (consistently through half a dozen remounts, and it seems like one core is cold rather than the other 3 being hot), not delidded though. I think people usually get tighter than 6c with delid


----------



## Daredevil 720

My first core is usually about 4-5C colder than the last core, which in turn is about 3-4C colder than the middle two. Hottest to coldest difference is ~8C.


----------



## ClaggyPants

Think I'll definitely give it a go tomorrow night. Have noticed that the idle temp differences are consistent with the load temps differences.


----------



## Big Texas

Is a 4770k that can run 4.5 GHz and 2400 mhz RAM stably at 1.25v a good candidate for a delid?

EDIT: That's 1.25v vCore


----------



## josephimports

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Big Texas*
> 
> Is a 4770k that can run 4.5 GHz and 2400 mhz RAM stably at 1.25v a good candidate for a delid?
> 
> EDIT: That's 1.25v vCore


Sure it is. With CLU and a decent cooler, you should net 200mhz. 4.7GHz sounds nice.


----------



## Cyro999

Yes. What VRIN are you using? Throw on VRIN LLC if it's not on already and try VRIN around 1.75 and up and down a bit, see if you can cut a bit of the vcore off.


----------



## Big Texas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> Sure it is. With CLU and a decent cooler, you should net 200mhz. 4.7GHz sounds nice.


these cracked dies scare the crap out of me though...would i be fine with an H100i? To me at least it seems like too much pressure on the die but i JUST built this system around July 20th


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Intel TIM is actually really good, I have tried it on my other CPUs and they work just as good as MX-4 and PK-1 (TBH). You can buy your own from their website (showed this to Val a long time ago).
> 
> Intel could not use solder because during the process of fixing the IHS onto the die with the solder proved to be fatal basically pull and bend it resulting a crack. Imagine a brand new tech that's 22nm (very delicate) vs the others which are 32nm or 45nm or even 55nm, there are definitely going to be problems not thought out before they actually create the tech. As to the newer Ivy's, whoever said up top, it is a different die size. It will be much more resilient to cracking during the process of soldering.
> 
> My guess on why that die crack is because of the pressure put on it by the pounding. So, we all know that CPUs are fairly delicate, they can be handled rough but delicate in physique. It will bend around like a rubber band (obvious joke) with enough force. I'm guessing that when they were pounding the hammer on the wood (thus transferring energy to the PCB), it caused the PCB to slightly bend because the glue had enough adherence to the PCB and IHS holding them together. With every pound, the die would "bend" with the PCB because that is the base of it and after a few bangs, the die would mostly likely have cracked before the IHS even came off.
> To better explain it, compare it to the razor method. By using the razor, you aren't physically causing the PCB to have energy passing through it, all you are doing is separating the atoms of the glue from each other and no bending means no cracked die.
> 
> This is my honest thought on the matter and to me, this is probably what happened in this case. Of course, this is basing it on the fact that nothing happened afterwards such as a Superman Ivy CPU or the wood hitting the die by accident afterwards.
> 
> 
> 
> If you hit it totally straight (as instructed) then the PCB won't bend upward. You could also hit it with a slight downward angle to make sure it doesn't bend. So that only leaves you with the hammer shock.
Click to expand...

Assuming someone can even hit it completely straight, the glue will still make it bend. As an experiment, glue a big block of wood onto something slightly bendable, like a thin metal. Hit the block of wood and you'll see that the metal will still bend regardless of how straight you hit it. Unless the block is in the direct middle of the metal, it will bend slightly. Just as how the IHS is not directly in the middle, it will bend because the IHS is trying to get away and fly but the glue is making it stay at its spot. The energy you sent into the IHS has to disperse somewhere and some of that energy will go to the air and the rest will vibrate through the IHS to the PCB consequently making the PCB bend towards the original energy's direction.

I honestly doubt it is from being too tight on the IHS. I have a NH-D14 and H100 and H100i. The D14 is heavy and no problems, the H100 has been known to have problems with too tight and still no problems. I took off all the glue and sanded down a bit of the lips. I honestly doubt it is the IHS being too tight down on the die.


----------



## Big Texas

Even though its soldered, would I be able to do a delid "test" on an '03 Pentium 4 520?


----------



## zpaf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I have a gap between my hottest and coolest core that expands to as much as 12c+ if i push the CPU (consistently through half a dozen remounts, and it seems like one core is cold rather than the other 3 being hot), not delidded though. I think people usually get tighter than 6c with delid


I Had the same problem after delid.

First with MX4 on die and IHS.
14c gap.









Second try with Phobya Liquid Metal on die and IHS
Just put a drop and then screwed H100.
1c gap.









Third try with Phobya Liquid Metal on die and IHS.
Spread Liquid Metal all over IHS and then screwed H100.
5c gap but 10c lower than before.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Hey guys, with the appearance of the 2 cracked dies lately I've been pretty concerned and trying to figure them out (as many others in here).

I just remembered this kinda old post in our club: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/20390#post_20444025

Read it carefully and also read the follow up conversation I had with him. He said he used a 20 micron sandpaper (pretty rough) on his 3770K's die because he saw scratches on it right after delidding (razor method). Now, if he had his die cracked after that I think he would have come back and reported it as he was a frequent poster here. So it's safe to assume his 3770K is still working.

*This totally debunks all the scratches-from-CLU/CLP/IC Diamond-that-propagated myths, that's for certain.*


----------



## IronAge

CL LM Ultra - parts aside the die covered with shin etsu microsi thermal paste as a non conductive protection.

http://abload.de/image.php?img=i7_4770k_l308b_lm_172jbq.jpg

Needs about 20mV less than before delidding and temps went down from around 70 degree.

Cooling: Prolimatech Megahalems with Gelid GC Extreme and one 12cm Fan @ 1050-1350 rpm.


----------



## nnoitra

Hello overclock community. I registered here because I have a few questions which I hope you can answer me. I have a 3770K and delidded him, due to the terrible heat problem (95c at 1.23v in IBT before delid, at Noctua NH-D14, without case). After properly delid (using CLU) now my temperature is 90c at 1.35V (ambient 15c). As you can see the temperature drop is huge, but it is still high compared to other users. Why is my cpu is still so hot? My pc is without case, and have very good cooler (NH-D14). I hope I will be able to achieve 1.4-1.5v but it seems impossible. I thought after delid, temperatures should be similar to others Ivy cpu? Or maybe I'm wrong, and each processor heats up differently? The second question. I was able to achieve a stable 4.8ghz at 1.36v (48hours prime blend). Is it safe to keep it on that voltage 24/7? On my motherboard, LLC is not working properly and I am forced to use a constant voltage. Thanks for all the replies and sorry for bad english (I use the google translator). Greetings


----------



## Swag

Off-Topic!


Spoiler: Just got this in the mail!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Hey guys, with the appearance of the 2 cracked dies lately I've been pretty concerned and trying to figure them out (as many others in here).
> 
> I just remembered this kinda old post in our club: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/20390#post_20444025
> 
> Read it carefully and also read the follow up conversation I had with him. He said he used a 20 micron sandpaper (pretty rough) on his 3770K's die because he saw scratches on it right after delidding (razor method). Now, if he had his die cracked after that I think he would have come back and reported it as he was a frequent poster here. So it's safe to assume his 3770K is still working.
> 
> *This totally debunks all the scratches-from-CLU/CLP/IC Diamond-that-propagated myths, that's for certain.*


I wouldn't expect to see a single Ivy core crack like that. I think it's more likely a product of the Haswell design. My guess is with moving the VRMs onto the CPU as well as general design changes (most likely) in fabrication make the Haswell dies more likely to crack under pressure (or as I am more inclined to believe heat spikes) than Ivy cores.

Granted the current evidence is anecdotal at best since we're just talking about two CPUs but the fact that there have been literally hundreds of delidded IB CPUs out there - but there isn't a bunch of youTube videos saying "how I delidded my CPU and cracked the die three weeks later..." as well as the posts in this thread and the vise thread tell me there's a fundamental difference that's coming into play.

Either the glass substrate is less durable, the connection to the PCB is more fragile, the thermal resistance is more significant, or ???

The fact that in the relatively (in comparison to Ivy at least) short period of time people have been delidding Haswell's and the presence of at least two cracked dies in that process - compared to the complete lack of reports of similar damage to IB dies... leads me to believe that the design or manufacturing process of the new chips is somehow inherently less tolerant of delidding. It's possible that this is a product of the shock of vise delidding, or IHS clearances...

Considering how hard I had to clobber my two Ivy's - and there are many similar stories - only to have them both work flawlessly... coupled with the fact that although they are different _models_ they are cooled similarly to the cracked samples (one custom loop with a Raystorm block, the other with an H100i - both tightened completely down, with normal paste on top and CLU on die) I have to say the obvious difference is Haswell. The _cause_ is still merely speculation however.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nnoitra*
> 
> Hello overclock community. I registered here because I have a few questions which I hope you can answer me. I have a 3770K and delidded him, due to the terrible heat problem (95c at 1.23v in IBT before delid, at Noctua NH-D14, without case). After properly delid (using CLU) now my temperature is 90c at 1.35V (ambient 15c). As you can see the temperature drop is huge, but it is still high compared to other users. Why is my cpu is still so hot? My pc is without case, and have very good cooler (NH-D14). I hope I will be able to achieve 1.4-1.5v but it seems impossible. I thought after delid, temperatures should be similar to others Ivy cpu? Or maybe I'm wrong, and each processor heats up differently? The second question. I was able to achieve a stable 4.8ghz at 1.36v (48hours prime blend). Is it safe to keep it on that voltage 24/7? On my motherboard, LLC is not working properly and I am forced to use a constant voltage. Thanks for all the replies and sorry for bad english (I use the google translator). Greetings


You might not have cleaned off all the glue after delid. You should also use one of the liquid metals like "Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra" or maybe "Phobya LM" between die and IHS. You can stay with normal paste between the IHS and NH-D14.


----------



## Darylrese

I have a golden 3770k I am tempted to delid but i'm also very scared of bricking the chip because its such a good overclocker.

Should I go ahead with delidding? I'm a very careful person with lots of experience

Can you reglue the IHS back on when the time comes to sell? If so, how?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I have a golden 3770k I am tempted to delid but i'm also very scared of bricking the chip because its such a good overclocker.
> 
> Should I go ahead with delidding? I'm a very careful person with lots of experience
> 
> Can you reglue the IHS back on when the time comes to sell? If so, how?


Can you define golden 3770k?


----------



## Darylrese

My 3770k does 4.5ghz @ 1.164v and 4.6ghz @ 1.206v...it requires much less voltage for the overclock compared to a lot of chips


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> My 3770k does 4.5ghz @ 1.164v and 4.6ghz @ 1.206v...it requires much less voltage for the overclock compared to a lot of chips


That's good. But what about if you pass 4.7 and up stable not just up the core?


----------



## Darylrese

Don't know yet as I haven't tried going any higher. Its not worth the extra temperature at the moment, although I did just fit an XSPC watercooling kit at the weekend!

Your 3700k @ 4.6 only reaches 59c??? Mines getting to 73c at the moment but I haven't delidded yet. Have you?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Don't know yet as I haven't tried going any higher. Its not worth the extra temperature at the moment, although I did just fit an XSPC watercooling kit at the weekend!
> 
> Your 3700k @ 4.6 only reaches 59c??? Mines getting to 73c at the moment but I haven't delidded yet. Have you?


You can test all about your CPU without delidding and decide after that. Experiment in the very early morning when you can get the temperature in the room to drop to 15c. You'll not be far off from what you'll see on the hottest summer day after the delid. You will be able to see what overclock you can get with a vcore around 1.4v. You'll maybe find out that your watercooling can run this 24/7 even without delid if you ignore high temperatures for IBT in a normal room. After the delidding, you would have core temperatures so low that you would be limited by high voltage being dangerous.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Don't know yet as I haven't tried going any higher. Its not worth the extra temperature at the moment, although I did just fit an XSPC watercooling kit at the weekend!
> 
> Your 3700k @ 4.6 only reaches 59c??? Mines getting to 73c at the moment but I haven't delidded yet. Have you?


Yes I did, lapped and delidded .


----------



## Darylrese

Oh man i'm tempted haha I just don't want to destroy the chip!

I had a go earlier with a E2140 which worked fine after a few hits but with the real thing i'm gonna be bricking it!

Did you place anything in the vice to stop it from scratching the IHS?

This was the e2140....haven't tested it yet in a pc.



Is there a way of mounting the IHS back on if I want to sell it?


----------



## deepor

What's with all those light spots on the E2140's PCB? Did the PCB get scratched up and are copper lines from the inside exposed? The photo is too blurry to see what's up.


----------



## nnoitra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You might not have cleaned off all the glue after delid. You should also use one of the liquid metals like "Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra" or maybe "Phobya LM" between die and IHS. You can stay with normal paste between the IHS and NH-D14.


Already used the Collaboratory Liquid Ultra on die, and Zalman stg-2 between IHS and Noctua. I'm sure I cleaned all the glue from pcb. looks like my cpu is very hot even after delid. I have no idea, why is that. And how about my second question, can i safely keep constant voltage 1.35V 24/7 let's say year or two without degradation?


----------



## Darylrese

It was dust from the wood I used...it was clean cut off the machine...obviously when I come to do it on my 3770k ill use a clean piece free of wood dust


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nnoitra*
> 
> Already used the Collaboratory Liquid Ultra on die, and Zalman stg-2 between IHS and Noctua. I'm sure I cleaned all the glue from pcb. looks like my cpu is very hot even after delid. I have no idea, why is that. And how about my second question, can i safely keep constant voltage 1.35V 24/7 let's say year or two without degradation?


You can try to use more or less of the CLU.

If you want to try less, I guess you have to clean all off first. You can use very little CLU and can still cover a very large area with it if you use a lot of time and brush and brush and brush.

If you already did it like this and used very little CLU and want to try more, you can add to what is already on the die without wiping the old CLU off.

Before you experiment with CLU on the die you could first only try to take off the NH-D14 and check how the paste looks like and repeat installing the cooler and paste.

I think 1.35v is fine.


----------



## skupples

Iv'e re-applied the CLU to my die at least 4 times now, never a scratch on it. I used razor method, only took about 5 minutes.

good ol' clu secret, less is more... I have seen my best results from my most conservative applications. I literally dabbed the brush on the overflow of the needle.


----------



## Eastrider

Count me in!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/aoii055mahkh5pz/2013-08-12%2011.46.55.jpg

But I'm having terrible issues as well... temps did not drop a single ºC...









Here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1418152/issues-after-deliding


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> It's likely that we're only seeing a small percentage of folks admitting that they killed their CPU...I could understand that someone might be too ashamed to post that they broke their $300 CPU. So for all of you in that group...just register a "throwaway" account and post here for the rest of our sakes. Of course I might be bitter too and say "forget it, they can all break their chips too..."
> 
> I gotta say that the whole hammer and vice method never struck me as particularly safe. On one page of this thread you've got "oh no you have to put the IHS back on, you can't go naked die because the die is so delicate...now excuse me while I go put my chip in a vice and whack it with a hammer...."


The same can be said about the razor method. "The PCB is so delicate, now please excuse me while I use a razor blade to cut into it...."

I mean, both methods have their pros and cons, ultimately it's up to the user to know how to do it properly and what kind of force to apply when doing either of these methods.


----------



## Eastrider

And naked-die-to-waterblock is total and 100% unrecommended? I mean... pressure is the same or even less due to the IHS not being packed inbetween. The difference in the pressure distribution can actually crack the die? THAT easily?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> And naked-die-to-waterblock is total and 100% unrecommended? I mean... pressure is the same or even less due to the IHS not being packed inbetween. The difference in the pressure distribution can actually crack the die? THAT easily?


There were two people with die cracked the last few days. It was Haswell CPU. People are unsure what caused it. It could be there's some sort of uneven pressure and the die gets slightly bent and the stress causes it to shatter. Before the delid the IHS isn't necessarily resting on the die itself and there's only the paste making contact, but after the delid and cleaning off the glue the die gets touched directly. The other theory is that it's stress from the hammering in the vice introduced in its structure.


----------



## luckymatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> It's likely that we're only seeing a small percentage of folks admitting that they killed their CPU...I could understand that someone might be too ashamed to post that they broke their $300 CPU. So for all of you in that group...just register a "throwaway" account and post here for the rest of our sakes. Of course I might be bitter too and say "forget it, they can all break their chips too..."
> 
> I gotta say that the whole hammer and vice method never struck me as particularly safe. On one page of this thread you've got "oh no you have to put the IHS back on, you can't go naked die because the die is so delicate...now excuse me while I go put my chip in a vice and whack it with a hammer...."
> 
> 
> 
> The same can be said about the razor method. "The PCB is so delicate, now please excuse me while I use a razor blade to cut into it...."
> 
> I mean, both methods have their pros and cons, ultimately it's up to the user to know how to do it properly and what kind of force to apply when doing either of these methods.
Click to expand...

Oh I'm with ya there, I wasn't necessarily saying either are good for the cpu.

However, after watching a few videos, I think one key to the razor method is using a blade that's longer than the pcb itself...it appears some of the scratches from the blade method are from the corner of the blade digging into the surface. But if you use a long razor (like one of those long ones with the little break-off blade sections, like in a utility knife), it seems less likely to dig into the pcb...keep the blade as close to parallel to the pcb as possible. If the "angle of attack" is close to 0, there's no chance that the blade can dig into the pcb.


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> (like one of those long ones with the little break-off blade sections, like in a utility knife).


Just chiming in to say I would definitely avoid utility knives at all costs, they flex far too much which is what is going to scratch the pcb more than anything else. The single sided razors like the ones made for mat cutters, are the safest imo because you can isolate the cutting edge against the IHS bottom rather than the other way around. I had success with it at least.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Hey guys, I've gotten the batch codes of the two cracked dies from their owners. Here they are:

L307B240
L316B291

So what do we see here:

They're stepping B and both were assembled in Malaysia within ~8 weeks of each other.

If anyone can extract any other info from these batch codes please do tell.

We should keep the batch codes of these chips and see if we can find a pattern (if more show up).


----------



## deepor

Yesterday, I had that idea that those cracked dies might show up with Haswell but not with Ivy Bridge because of the die being a lot longer. I tried looking up numbers and only found out that die sizes are 177mm^2 for Haswell and 160mm^2 for Ivy Bridge. I couldn't find numbers for length, so I looked at pictures and measured the width and height in pixels and got to these guesses for die sizes:

Haswell: 21.9 mm * 8.1 mm
Ivy Bridge: 19.5 mm * 8.2 mm

I don't know if it makes sense to blame uneven pressure cracking Haswell but not Ivy Bridge. Those 2.4 mm added length don't sound like much of a difference. I'm guessing there would have been reports with some unlucky Ivy Bridge. I also can't imagine the dies being of different thickness. It's the same process so it should be the same waver.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> My 3770k does 4.5ghz @ 1.164v and 4.6ghz @ 1.206v...it requires much less voltage for the overclock compared to a lot of chips


Sorry to say it but I wouldn't call that "golden". Mine does 4.8GHz @ 1.20v


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Sorry to say it but I wouldn't call that "golden". Mine does 4.8GHz @ 1.20v


I hate you









But yours would be platinum imo haha


----------



## Darylrese

I was gonna say yours must be platinum at that voltage and clock....mad! lol


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I was gonna say yours must be platinum at that voltage and clock....mad! lol


Well, don't feel bad... mine's somewhere between lead and bronze...









Takes me 1.45V to get stable at 4.7GHz... so you can both just shut it.


----------



## Darylrese

HOLY....

I had an OEM 3770k and it couldnt do 4.5ghz on 1.3v so i took it straight back to the store tbh lol

This time seems i got lucky!

Before that i had two i5 3570k's and they would only do 4.4ghz at 1.288v


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I was gonna say yours must be platinum at that voltage and clock....mad! lol


Agreed. I thought my 1.3v for 4.8ghz was great! But 1.2v for the OC he has is ridiculous.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> HOLY....
> 
> I had an OEM 3770k and it couldnt do 4.5ghz on 1.3v so i took it straight back to the store tbh lol
> 
> This time seems i got lucky!
> 
> Before that i had two i5 3570k's and they would only do 4.4ghz at 1.288v


Well mine could do 4.5GHz pretty much right at 1.3v... but it got ugly from there... 4.6 took 1.37 and 4.8 took 1.5v, and 4.9 took 1.56v.

On the upside, after delidding, and running [email protected] in a room that was ~30C most of a 24hr prime run I still never had a core over 72C.


----------



## Darylrese

Thats some really good temps. I am VERY tempted to delid mine. Im getting those temps and higher on 4.6ghz at the moment


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Thats some really good temps. I am VERY tempted to delid mine. Im getting those temps and higher on 4.6ghz at the moment


Well before the delid I had to stop my 24hr prime run because I had a core hit 100C! Didn't like that... so I hit it with a hammer (a calibrated hammer however







) a few times... problem solved.


----------



## Darylrese

Thats the part that scares me....hitting it with a hammer lol

Also the fact you have removed the IHS will kill its resale value


----------



## Valgaur

I've seen a 5ghz at 1.1vcore once


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I have a golden 3770k I am tempted to delid but i'm also very scared of bricking the chip because its such a good overclocker.
> 
> Should I go ahead with delidding? I'm a very careful person with lots of experience
> 
> Can you reglue the IHS back on when the time comes to sell? If so, how?


You can reglue it when you want to sell it, if you have any automotive knowledge then you have heard of RTV sealant ( permatex silicone) that's what it is.


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I've seen a 5ghz at 1.1vcore once


lol

My current is 4.6ghz at 1.20v, I haven't tried anything higher but hoping it scales well and hits 5 at a lower than average voltage.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> My 3770k does 4.5ghz @ 1.164v and 4.6ghz @ 1.206v...it requires much less voltage for the overclock compared to a lot of chips


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> Sorry to say it but I wouldn't call that "golden". Mine does 4.8GHz @ 1.20v


This ^.
You pretty much have to test the vcore needed for 5ghz + to see if a chip could be golden or not, I have a 3770k that did 4.5Ghz IBT stable at 1.12V, 4.6Ghz at 1.17V. But it stopped scaling well at 4.7Ghz & by the time it got to 5Ghz it was only a decent chip, no where near golden. Great for 4.5ghz doesn't just mean great overall.


----------



## Darylrese

Ok fair enough, it's by far better than any chip i have owned for overclocking so far and better than a lot i have read about on here. I dont have much interest in pushing it past 4.6ghz if i'm honest....4.8ghz maybe.


----------



## Eastrider

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> Count me in!
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/aoii055mahkh5pz/2013-08-12%2011.46.55.jpg
> 
> But I'm having terrible issues as well... temps did not drop a single ºC...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1418152/issues-after-deliding


I'll quote myself in a small hunt for a few more opinions... my ass fell when I saw the price of CLU in my country...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Ok fair enough, it's by far better than any chip i have owned for overclocking so far and better than a lot i have read about on here. I dont have much interest in pushing it past 4.6ghz if i'm honest....4.8ghz maybe.


Yes, still a great chip for air & water cooling whether considered golden overall or not.

I spent a ridiculous amount of money on ivy bridge in search of a golden one...


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> my ass fell when I saw the price of CLU in my country...


You can get the Phobya Liquid Metal for like 4 euro at aquatuning.es

If you want CLU specifically, then I think highflow.nl still has some stock. You can email and ask the owner Freddy what the shipping charge is to Spain.


----------



## magicase

I know when you delid you also take out the surrounding glue with this the distance between the die and heat spreader decreases. My question is how much thermal paste do I apply? The same amount you would normally put when applying a cooler on a CPU?


----------



## Darylrese

If you watch the video on the OP, it shows you to apply a VERY thin layer of CLU and spread it over the die on the CPU using the included brush.

Im not sure if you can then use CLU ontop of the heatsink aswell


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> You can reglue it when you want to sell it, if you have any automotive knowledge then you have heard of RTV sealant ( permatex silicone) that's what it is.


Ok cool, might be a possibility then....depends how brave i'm feeling! I have ordered some CLU anyway as its only a tenner.


----------



## Eastrider

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> You can get the Phobya Liquid Metal for like 4 euro at aquatuning.es
> 
> If you want CLU specifically, then I think highflow.nl still has some stock. You can email and ask the owner Freddy what the shipping charge is to Spain.


The problem is, Aquatuning.es is just a "rebrand" version of the german one, and the shipping costs are a few times the cost of the TIM itself...

I'll ask in Highflow.nl. Thanks for the tip









EDIT: I found some in eBay http://www.ebay.es/itm/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Ultra-Cleaning-Kit-CPU-Thermal-Compound-/161068917349?pt=UK_Computing_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item258074a265 for quite a reasonable price. Is this the one? And, is it safe to use waterblock->IHS? (my waterblock is made of copper)


----------



## ClaggyPants

Just some thoughts on the cracking issue - and I dont know if this has already been mentioned elsewhere. Once all the glue was removed from mine, the IHS rested on top of the die with a noticeable gap between the surface of the pcb and the bottom of the IHS. Once this has all been compressed together inside the socket mount is there going to be extra pressure on the outside of the pcb? From what I've seen the cracks happen along the length of the die which of course is parallel with the sides of the die where the pressure is applied from the socket mount.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ClaggyPants*
> 
> Just some thoughts on the cracking issue - and I dont know if this has already been mentioned elsewhere. Once all the glue was removed from mine, the IHS rested on top of the die with a noticeable gap between the surface of the pcb and the bottom of the IHS. Once this has all been compressed together inside the socket mount is there going to be extra pressure on the outside of the pcb? From what I've seen the cracks happen along the length of the die which of course is parallel with the sides of the die where the pressure is applied from the socket mount.


yea.. I was thinking, if the IHS is allowed to move doing the clamp down to mobo, that could potentially do some damage. Putting force downwards on the die ( no problem) but adding a slighting motion at the same time? I have no idea how fragile the die is, but I would think that that could make a dent in one of the corners without showing any problems afterwards..
Over time, by the swings in temps / moving the case around, might force this small dent to travel throe the die (like a piece of glass with a dent will crack MUCH easier than a non-dented piece of glass)

just a thought.

*edit*
Not saying that this proves it, but it dosnt disagrees with it ether


----------



## stickg1

This is just my own personal opinion, beat me up for it if you want. But if you are planning on sealing a chip back up for resale, I think you should mention that it was _delidded_ and has been _resealed_. Even if there's no noticeable difference between a stock chip and your resealed chip, I just think in a situation like this it is best to be honest about it.

Mostly because some people use the same CPU for several years, since nobody has had a delidded Ivy for several years yet, there's no way to tell the longevity of your TIM application. Intel used the paste they use because it was tested and didn't pump out. I don't think LM TIM will pump out, but if you reintroduce the gap that existed prior to delidding, whose to say that the LM TIM will be as effective and no have negative consequences when the die is not completely tight to the IHS as it was when you delidded and removed the glue. You can guess or theorize all you want, but with a chip that's only been available for retail sale for less than a year and half, nobody can know for sure. That's why in my opinion, honesty is the best policy. Unless you're an a-hole that doesn't really give a ****, lol, then go for it!


----------



## HairyGamer

Yeah lets not start gluing chips back together and selling them as if they were never delidded... That's the kind of talk that keeps me from ever buying used PC parts, especially from the OCN Marketplace. It's sad but I don't trust people and as you can see by somebody's comment in here, I have good reason not to.

It's kind of like the guys in the marketplace who tell you that they have a chip for sale but they're unsure how it clocks because they never tried to OC it. First off, this OCN - who do you think you're fooling? Then you read through somebody's posts/threads and you find out how much of a dog their chip is and you get a pretty clear picture of what's going on


----------



## Big Texas

Got some spare cash I MAY be able to spend...a second gtx 770 or another 4770k for deliding and extreme OC'ing?


----------



## Darylrese

Yeah, that's why i would NEVER buy second hand CPU's or GPU's because you don't know what the previous owner has done to them. Also no doubt it overclocked badly which is why they are selling in first place.

I think to delid you have to accept the fact resale value is very low and you can probably only sell to a limited market.

At the moment i have a i5 2500k on ebay and its going for £100, i only paid £179 brand new. If i delidded my 3770k having only got it last week for £280 i dread to think what it would be worth when i come to sell it if i delid. Probably £80

Can defiantly see why people do it but you have to remember what your doing to it may well effect its value when the time comes to upgrade again!

You might get lucky and find someone who doesnt care you delidded it but 90% of people will.

I remember when i sold my GTX 580 on ebay, i had made a custom bios for it and the amount of people who messaged me but were then put off by the fact i had done something to it was staggering.


----------



## stickg1

I would buy a delidded CPU, it doesn't bother me. If I could get it for 15% less than the current used market value for the same stock product; that is just a bonus. However, if I bought a CPU that I thought was stock, then cut it open and saw that there was liquid metal and not Intel's stock TIM, I would never buy/sell/trade with that individual ever again. And possibly even discourage others from doing so. I don't mind modding, I do mind dishonesty.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Yeah, that's why i would NEVER buy second hand CPU's or GPU's because you don't know what the previous owner has done to them. Also no doubt it overclocked badly which is why they are selling in first place.
> 
> I think to delid you have to accept the fact resale value is very low and you can probably only sell to a limited market.
> 
> At the moment i have a i5 2500k on ebay and its going for £100, i only paid £179 brand new. If i delidded my 3770k having only got it last week for £280 i dread to think what it would be worth when i come to sell it if i delid. Probably £80
> 
> Can defiantly see why people do it but you have to remember what your doing to it may well effect its value when the time comes to upgrade again!
> 
> You might get lucky and find someone who doesnt care you delidded it but 90% of people will.
> 
> I remember when i sold my GTX 580 on ebay, i had made a custom bios for it and the amount of people who messaged me but were then put off by the fact i had done something to it was staggering.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I would buy a delidded CPU, it doesn't bother me. If I could get it for 15% less than the current used market value for the same stock product; that is just a bonus. However, if I bought a CPU that I thought was stock, then cut it open and saw that there was liquid metal and not Intel's stock TIM, I would never buy/sell/trade with that individual ever again. And possibly even discourage others from doing so. I don't mind modding, I do mind dishonesty.


This, some people may want an already delidded cpu so it can be a selling point for some, but if I saw a nicely binned cpu for sale & bought it to discover it had been delidded I'd be kinda upset, since for my purposes delidded with liquid metal on die can be very bad.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> This, some people may want an already delidded cpu so it can be a selling point for some, but if I saw a nicely binned cpu for sale & bought it to discover it had been delidded I'd be kinda upset, since for my purposes delidded with liquid metal on die can be very bad.


Hey man, my fiancee and I have decided we are going to Vancouver for our honeymoon. Might be the perfect place for a good herbal cleanse!


----------



## FtW 420

If you come up this way we'll have to a little OCN get together!


----------



## Valgaur

I have a working computer finally!

after 3 ram kits 2 motherboards 2 psus and much debunking it was my CPU! (wait that doesn't make sense?)

for some reason I have a workign cpu that wont run things? hmmmmm

oh well don't care its on now.. good enough for me!


----------



## Cyro999

Yay!


----------



## ozzy1925

it could be off topic but i am going to receive my new mobo(z 87 mpower max)and next week will be going to a local computer shop to get a new i 4770k .And this time i will be trying vise method.I know its silicon lottery but i checked google and it seems malaysia chips are better than costa rica ones for now. People getting good results with batch# L310b and L312b.Should i try to get these 2 batches or any malaysia ones?How about costa rica ?Anybody getting good o/c results with costa rica ?


----------



## Cyro999

My Malay L310b does 4.7, linpack without avx at 1.285vcore and x264+games etc, every real world load i threw at it at, at 1.315.

I don't know how much OC results is reliant on batch, though. Heard it's just pretty random these days


----------



## Valgaur

With haswii there is a little play apparently some batches have been wicked good I kinda don't wanna show them as they are ment for LN2


----------



## Bourgeoisie

OCN name: Bourgeoisie
CPU: i5-4670k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Gelid
Mhz gained: X (no OC yet)
OC after delid: X (no OC yet)
Temp drops: Approx. 8-10C on all cores

Considering trying no IHS for a test run...is it safe? =P (my waterblock, EK Supremacy, is pretty light).

(Also I'll update this post with pics, so be on the lookout).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> OCN name: Bourgeoisie
> CPU: i5-4670k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Gelid
> Mhz gained: X (no OC yet)
> OC after delid: X (no OC yet)
> Temp drops: Approx. 8-10C on all cores
> 
> Considering trying no IHS for a test run...is it safe? =P (my waterblock, EK Supremacy, is pretty light).
> 
> (Also I'll update this post with pics, so be on the lookout).


Finally I can use internets on something more than a one core!

You're in!







I'll be waiting for the pics as well







Also ont he IHS-less stuff you can but it takes lots of time and patience to get the pressure just right.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be waiting for the pics as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also ont he IHS-less stuff you can but it takes lots of time and patience to get the pressure just right.


Sweet! Ok, picture time:

Started with a razor and a CPU:


I realized this was a BAD idea after scuffing the corners of my CPU's pcb. I'm not sure if it was me or my CPU, but this method was not working for me. So I went out and bought a $20 vice (great price!) and here's the results:


Closeup shot of the gunk on the processor (why intel, why), minus a bit of "thermal paste" I rubbed off:


Post-cleaning, not perfect but very good:


Put some CLU on the die:


Finally, I will say that I do have tiny indents on the IHS from using the vice. Not sure if that effects anything. But I think I want to go IHS-less anyway, so, it shouldn't matter. How will I know if I have the proper amount of pressure from the waterblock on the die? Don't really want to buy that fancy paper unless absolutely needed. =P


----------



## camborambo

Hey guys, I am planning to delid my 3770k this weekend once my CLP comes in. I'm running a custom loop and temps are 75c at 1.27v @ 4.5ghz. The voltage and temps goes crazy after that.

Will CLP be permanent once I apply it on the die? Can I remove the IHS once it's on? For instance, what if I need to change mobo. It's going to be a busy weekend since I'll have to remove and flush my loop.
Thx for the help!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Sweet! Ok, picture time:
> 
> Started with a razor and a CPU:
> 
> 
> I realized this was a BAD idea after scuffing the corners of my CPU's pcb. I'm not sure if it was me or my CPU, but this method was not working for me. So I went out and bought a $20 vice (great price!) and here's the results:
> 
> 
> Closeup shot of the gunk on the processor (why intel, why), minus a bit of "thermal paste" I rubbed off:
> 
> 
> Post-cleaning, not perfect but very good:
> 
> 
> Put some CLU on the die:
> 
> 
> Finally, I will say that I do have tiny indents on the IHS from using the vice. Not sure if that effects anything. But I think I want to go IHS-less anyway, so, it shouldn't matter. How will I know if I have the proper amount of pressure from the waterblock on the die? Don't really want to buy that fancy paper unless absolutely needed. =P


you will have to judge that all by feel seriously. you have to compensate for the IHS not being there and if memory serves right you have to take the Latching mechanism off the mobo as well for IHS-less or direct die mounting.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *camborambo*
> 
> Hey guys, I am planning to delid my 3770k this weekend once my CLP comes in. I'm running a custom loop and temps are 75c at 1.27v @ 4.5ghz. The voltage and temps goes crazy after that.
> 
> Will CLP be permanent once I apply it on the die? Can I remove the IHS once it's on? For instance, what if I need to change mobo. It's going to be a busy weekend since I'll have to remove and flush my loop.
> Thx for the help!


CLU/CLP has no issues under the IHS on the die so you should be fine. I didnt have any issues with mine at all


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> you will have to judge that all by feel seriously. you have to compensate for the IHS not being there and if memory serves right you have to take the Latching mechanism off the mobo as well for IHS-less or direct die mounting.


Hmm ok, if I decide to stick with direct-die I'll just always have to remember to flip the PC on its side for CPU maintenance stuff! Haha


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Hmm ok, if I decide to stick with direct-die I'll just always have to remember to flip the PC on its side for CPU maintenance stuff! Haha


Ask Sonda5 he is the pro behind direct die stuffs


----------



## Swag

Direct-Die Method:
1. Remove the CPU retainer off the motherboard
2. Measure (with an actual ruler) the total height of the motherboard PCB to top of die for the washers you're going to need
3. Get the washers and put them on the holes where you're going to mount your CPU cooler

If you calculated properly and you're using non-squishy material for the washers, you can tighten the CPU cooler to the max and you should be good.







When I had done it, it took me a while to understand what exactly to do and I just read some previous accounts of the attempt. I will tell you, this isn't for the feint of heart. One little mistake and you could crush the die and this is why I recommend you run with the IHS on. There is no temp drop from w/IHS to direct-die.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I realize it's a little late to comment but hey - we all have to sleep sometime.







As far as affecting resale value I don't see delidding of a K series SKU being that significant a detriment to resale, provided you have _full disclosure_ of that fact in your listing of it. By far most people that are looking for an unlocked CPU are looking to overclock that CPU - and many of those IMO are just as likely to appreciate the fact that it's already delidded and operating successfully. I think if you provided overclocking levels, voltages, and cooling description in the listing - you might even get a little _more_ for it than a retail version (provided that it's not a loser like my chip).

I certainly know that if someone with a delidded 3770K can show me a 5GHz running stress tests at between 1.2-1.3v, and provide a close up photograph of the PCB and the die itself prior to sale can pretty much get full retail money from someone like myself. Naturally, that would only be the case if I would consider buying _anything_ from that person (i.e. they have a good reputation and sales history).

But when it really comes down to it... how much does resale factor in for most people? Maybe I'm the exception, but I tend to run CPUs until at least a generation or two later - so if I'm lucky I'm figuring I'm getting less than half what I paid for it anyway. It's a depreciating asset - and one that starts depreciating the moment you purchase it for the most part. YMMV of course.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> One little mistake and you could crush the die and this is why I recommend you run with the IHS on. There is no temp drop from w/IHS to direct-die.


Hmm interesting...yeah, it would be a pain in the butt, although this could make it easier: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=WC-350-EK&groupid=962&catid=1519&subcat=2287

Is there really no additional temp drop? I was hoping it might compensate for the 10C smaller drop I got than basically everyone else =P


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I realize it's a little late to comment but hey - we all have to sleep sometime.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As far as affecting resale value I don't see delidding of a K series SKU being that significant a detriment to resale, provided you have _full disclosure_ of that fact in your listing of it. By far most people that are looking for an unlocked CPU are looking to overclock that CPU - and many of those IMO are just as likely to appreciate the fact that it's already delidded and operating successfully. I think if you provided overclocking levels, voltages, and cooling description in the listing - you might even get a little _more_ for it than a retail version (provided that it's not a loser like my chip).
> 
> I certainly know that if someone with a delidded 3770K can show me a 5GHz running stress tests at between 1.2-1.3v, and provide a close up photograph of the PCB and the die itself prior to sale can pretty much get full retail money from someone like myself. Naturally, that would only be the case if I would consider buying _anything_ from that person (i.e. they have a good reputation and sales history).
> 
> But when it really comes down to it... how much does resale factor in for most people? Maybe I'm the exception, but I tend to run CPUs until at least a generation or two later - so if I'm lucky I'm figuring I'm getting less than half what I paid for it anyway. It's a depreciating asset - and one that starts depreciating the moment you purchase it for the most part. YMMV of course.


I don't really look at resale value. I just normally either use it until the tech is old and it can't run modern programs anymore or I stop using it and hang it in my wall of previous tech. I have already 5 generations of it.









Pertaining to your resale value, if you were to sell that CPU in a forum such as OCN, then you could yield a nice sale but it wouldn't be more than retail. Understand people are still not willing to pay more than retail for a used CPU that's been physically modded. The only time that would really happen is when the buyer is looking for a delidded CPU and gets one specifically ordered for himself, and normally, it would be asking for a brand new one with the service of a delid. I know I wouldn't pay over retail for a delidded CPU!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> One little mistake and you could crush the die and this is why I recommend you run with the IHS on. There is no temp drop from w/IHS to direct-die.
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm interesting...yeah, it would be a pain in the butt, although this could make it easier: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=WC-350-EK&groupid=962&catid=1519&subcat=2287
> 
> Is there really no additional temp drop? I was hoping it might compensate for the 10C smaller drop I got than basically everyone else =P
Click to expand...

That works only for the EK Supremacy Water cooling blocks. It won't work with your other coolers if you don't have the appropriate block.

And yes, there is no additional temp drop, you might yield a 1C cooler but what we had concluded a while back when this thread was getting started that it was about 1/2C different on each core (using a gun to record). It looks like the main cause (judging from your pictures) is that you aren't putting CLU on the underbelly of the IHS. Put the same amount of CLU you put on the die under the IHS and you should get better temps. Also, use CLU on the top of the IHS as well and use a bit more. Some people say the thinnest is possible but that's not going to work with CLU. If you apply CLU too thin, it won't be properly touching the IHS and it can't transfer heat resulting in awful temps. The reason why there is a rule to get the thinnest possible for regular TIM is because it's a paste, it's thicker in nature and having too much will have hinder temperatures which is the complete opposite of liquid metal pastes.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That works only for the EK Supremacy Water cooling blocks. It won't work with your other coolers if you don't have the appropriate block.
> 
> And yes, there is no additional temp drop, you might yield a 1C cooler but what we had concluded a while back when this thread was getting started that it was about 1/2C different on each core (using a gun to record). It looks like the main cause (judging from your pictures) is that you aren't putting CLU on the underbelly of the IHS. Put the same amount of CLU you put on the die under the IHS and you should get better temps. Also, use CLU on the top of the IHS as well and use a bit more. Some people say the thinnest is possible but that's not going to work with CLU. If you apply CLU too thin, it won't be properly touching the IHS and it can't transfer heat resulting in awful temps. The reason why there is a rule to get the thinnest possible for regular TIM is because it's a paste, it's thicker in nature and having too much will have hinder temperatures which is the complete opposite of liquid metal pastes.


Thanks for the tips. Yeah, direct-die sounds like a waste of time then.

I want to experiment with more CLU but they gave me so little in the syringe. Did I get ripped off or is it always sold in such small quantity? Lol, I'm sure I have enough to make it work though. Maybe =/ (And I did put some on the underbelly but not very much).


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I don't really look at resale value. I just normally either use it until the tech is old and it can't run modern programs anymore or I stop using it and hang it in my wall of previous tech. I have already 5 generations of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pertaining to your resale value, if you were to sell that CPU in a forum such as OCN, then you could yield a nice sale but it wouldn't be more than retail. Understand people are still not willing to pay more than retail for a used CPU that's been physically modded. The only time that would really happen is when the buyer is looking for a delidded CPU and gets one specifically ordered for himself, and normally, it would be asking for a brand new one with the service of a delid. I know I wouldn't pay over retail for a delidded CPU!


I agree with that, I wouldn't pay _over_ retail for any CPU - I'm not that obsessed with OC levels - which is why I'm happy with my chip that doesn't run very fast and requires a great deal of voltage to get there. I bought it with the belief that as soon as I hit it with a hammer... it was worthless (potentially _completely_ worthless if I botched the delid) and I was fine with it then... the fact that it works great and is now very cool is like a bonus really.

I tend to just give away all of my hardware to relatives/friends because by the time I'm done with it - there probably isn't enough value to even mess with fees, shipping, etc... Which is why I have a cabinet full of every generation of Xeon from a 450MHz drake (PII) to a Conroe - I'm pretty sure the shipping would cost more than the value... despite the fact that they were all more than $1K/ea when they were brand new.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That works only for the EK Supremacy Water cooling blocks. It won't work with your other coolers if you don't have the appropriate block.
> 
> And yes, there is no additional temp drop, you might yield a 1C cooler but what we had concluded a while back when this thread was getting started that it was about 1/2C different on each core (using a gun to record). It looks like the main cause (judging from your pictures) is that you aren't putting CLU on the underbelly of the IHS. Put the same amount of CLU you put on the die under the IHS and you should get better temps. Also, use CLU on the top of the IHS as well and use a bit more. Some people say the thinnest is possible but that's not going to work with CLU. If you apply CLU too thin, it won't be properly touching the IHS and it can't transfer heat resulting in awful temps. The reason why there is a rule to get the thinnest possible for regular TIM is because it's a paste, it's thicker in nature and having too much will have hinder temperatures which is the complete opposite of liquid metal pastes.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the tips. Yeah, direct-die sounds like a waste of time then.
> 
> I want to experiment with more CLU but they gave me so little in the syringe. Did I get ripped off or is it always sold in such small quantity? Lol, I'm sure I have enough to make it work though. Maybe =/ (And I did put some on the underbelly but not very much).
Click to expand...

You can't blame the company for it, mine arrived with a lot in my syringe, it actually is all up to the customs agents. In the states, if you buy it from CL's website; more than likely your package will be opened and tested to see if you aren't importing dangerous metals. If you purchase it through a large company, they won't be as strict as with individuals. I know mine came with only a bit taken off (only on the CLP) and the CLU was untouched.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can't blame the company for it, mine arrived with a lot in my syringe, it actually is all up to the customs agents. In the states, if you buy it from CL's website; more than likely your package will be opened and tested to see if you aren't importing dangerous metals. If you purchase it through a large company, they won't be as strict as with individuals. I know mine came with only a bit taken off (only on the CLP) and the CLU was untouched.


Oh? I bought mine through frozencpu. Seems like it has nothing in it almost. I was pretty surprised.









But I can always buy more later, if need be.


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can't blame the company for it, mine arrived with a lot in my syringe, it actually is all up to the customs agents. In the states, if you buy it from CL's website; more than likely your package will be opened and tested to see if you aren't importing dangerous metals. If you purchase it through a large company, they won't be as strict as with individuals. I know mine came with only a bit taken off (only on the CLP) and the CLU was untouched.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh? I bought mine through frozencpu. Seems like it has nothing in it almost. I was pretty surprised.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I can always buy more later, if need be.
Click to expand...

You reaaally don't need a lot of it though, it spreads out like crazy


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You can't blame the company for it, mine arrived with a lot in my syringe, it actually is all up to the customs agents. In the states, if you buy it from CL's website; more than likely your package will be opened and tested to see if you aren't importing dangerous metals. If you purchase it through a large company, they won't be as strict as with individuals. I know mine came with only a bit taken off (only on the CLP) and the CLU was untouched.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh? I bought mine through frozencpu. Seems like it has nothing in it almost. I was pretty surprised.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I can always buy more later, if need be.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You reaaally don't need a lot of it though, it spreads out like crazy
Click to expand...

Don't drown it in CLU but you have to have quite a bit. Or else it won't be enough for each of them to touch each other and that's where the problems start.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Don't drown it in CLU but you have to have quite a bit. Or else it won't be enough for each of them to touch each other and that's where the problems start.


Agreed, I certainly have enough to fix the issue as far as the die. However, I'm not sure I'll have enough to use between the IHS and waterblock. We shall see. (My amount of CLU was beneath the 7 or 8 line when I started).


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Agreed, I certainly have enough to fix the issue as far as the die. However, I'm not sure I'll have enough to use between the IHS and heatsink. We shall see. (My amount of CLU was beneath the 7 or 8 line when I started).


You need a thinner layer on the IHS than on the die. That's because the heatsink is tightened on the IHS so the metals will be in touch and CLU will just have to fill in the anomalies. The inside of the IHS and the die aren't in contact though (at least on mine) so you need more CLU there as it's the connecting part.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Appreciate it guys, this will definitely help me get that extra 10C now! Makes a lot more sense. I'll update with my new temps when I get a chance to mess with my CPU tomorow. I'm glad I've had some results and didn't break anything though

Night!


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Appreciate it guys, this will definitely help me get that extra 10C now! Makes a lot more sense. I'll update with my new temps when I get a chance to mess with my CPU tomorow. I'm glad I've had some results and didn't break anything though
> 
> Night!


The amount of CLU you use on the die is critical. I reapplied my CLU some days ago and my temps got worse by >10C. I went back and added a little more on the die and good temps were restored. So we're talking about a difference of 10-15C between a good and a bad CLU application.

If you think you've used too little CLU on the die then don't clean it up, just add to it (since have little amount). Make sure you paint the under side of the IHS too, right on the stain from the original TIM.

To conserve some more CLU try picking some from the edge of the syringe and the blue cap, I'm sure they're swimming in CLU.


----------



## NamesLucky

I delidded my 3570k awhile back when I went for a high oc on my sub-ambient cooled computer (-35C). After reading a bit of the recent posts I guess I may have been better off not to, but I haven't seen the reason, anyone know why it's recommended to not delid with cold temps? I never tested it before I delidded, so I wouldn't have any useful info for the topic either.
On another note, I'm looking to build a new portable gaming rig, using an asrock z87e-itx. I'm putting it together now, but am fairly sure I'm not going to score a great overclock with an itx board, even if the chip isn't bad. It will be cooled by a regular, non super cooled, H100i, so I"m up in the air about delidding this one.
I would be more inclined to do it if the knife method was "safe". Is it much harder to not damage the chip/pcb/caps, than it was delidding an ivy bridge? I delidded my ivy with no problems, just took my time with a small razor. I understand there are now printed caps under the IHS, but can't they be worked around?
The hammer/vice method just looks ridiculous to me lol, and I don't think I would do that myself, nothing against the innovators and successful people doing it, I'm just not in the habit of hitting my $300 processors with a hammer, which I think says alot coming from a guy that has put some of his parts through chilled oil cooling.

Edited for (some) grammar mistakes


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NamesLucky*
> 
> I delidded my 3570k awhile back when I went for a high oc on my sub-ambient cooled computer (-35C). After reading a bit of the recent posts I guess I may have been better off not to, but I haven't seen the reason, anyone know why it's recommended to not delid with cold temps? I never tested it before I delidded, so I wouldn't have any useful info for the topic either.
> On another note, I'm looking to build a new portable gaming rig, using an asrock z87e-itx. I'm putting it together now, but am fairly sure I'm not going to score a great overclock with an itx board, even if the chip isn't bad. It will be cooled by a regular, non super cooled, H100i, so I"m up in the air about this delidding this one.
> I would be more inclined to do it if the knife method was "safe". Is it much harder to not damage the chip/pcb/caps, than it was delidding an ivy bridge? I delidded my ivy with no problems, just took my time with a small razor. I understand there are not printed caps under the IHS, but can't they be worked around?
> The hammer/vice method just looks ridiculous to me lol, and I don't think I would do that myself, nothing against the innovators and successful people doing it, I'm just not in the habit of hitting my $300 processors with a hammer, which I think says alot coming from a guy that has put some of his parts through chilled oil cooling.


First off, the cold temps part. I have read that for some reason if you delid your chip it won't be able to reach as high clocks as before when you do LN2/DICE runs. We're talking about a 200-300MHz drop, still upward of 5.5GHz IIRC. Also at very cold temps you're running the risk of having the TIM pump out effect happen, which is when the TIM under the IHS spreads instantly out of place and your chip dies from very high temps.

If you want to be on the safe side I wouldn't suggest you to delid a Haswell until this thing with the cracked dies either goes away or is figured out.

And the fact that delidding with a hammer seems crazy even to you doesn't say anything BTW.


----------



## NamesLucky

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> First off, the cold temps part. I have read that for some reason if you delid your chip it won't be able to reach as high clocks as before when you do LN2/DICE runs. We're talking about a 200-300MHz drop, still upward of 5.5GHz IIRC. Also at very cold temps you're running the risk of having the TIM pump out effect happen, which is when the TIM under the IHS spreads instantly out of place and your chip dies from very high temps.
> 
> If you want to be on the safe side I wouldn't suggest you to delid a Haswell until this thing with the cracked dies either goes away or is figured out.


Thanks, never heard of the TIM pump out effect, but I wasn't at LN temps, so maybe that didn't affect me. I think I'm leaning towards not delidding as well, but just wanted to know the difficulty level of knife method ivy vs haswell if anyone has experience. These cracked die are bad, and if resultant of uneven pressure from IHS and not stress from the hammer/vice method it is not something I would risk trying right now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> And the fact that delidding with a hammer seems crazy even to you doesn't say anything BTW.


Not sure if this was meant as insult? Either way, thanks for the response, appreciate the advice on waiting to delid.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NamesLucky*
> 
> Not sure if this was meant as insult? Either way, thanks for the response, appreciate the advice on waiting to delid.


It wasn't meant as an insult, rather than just a reminder that you need proof to convince someone about something on OCN, especially here when the hammer and vise method has such a high success rate. The fact that you've experimented with exotic cooling doesn't make you any more knowledgeable than the rest of us on the matter of the hammer.


----------



## NamesLucky

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> It wasn't meant as an insult, rather than just a reminder that you need proof to convince someone about something on OCN, especially here when the hammer and vise method has such a high success rate. The fact that you've experimented with exotic cooling doesn't make you any more knowledgeable than the rest of us on the matter of the hammer.


Understandable, I can see how I may have come off arrogant, definitely not intended, only meant to imply I'm accustomed to irregular treatment of hardware. I see your point on the hammer experience though, I don't have any knowledge on that topic.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NamesLucky*
> 
> The hammer/vice method just looks ridiculous to me lol, and I don't think I would do that myself, nothing against the innovators and successful people doing it, I'm just not in the habit of hitting my $300 processors with a hammer, which I think says alot coming from a guy that has put some of his parts through chilled oil cooling.


As someone who assumed that opinion before, I at first agreed with you. However, I think the razor method is by far more risky! If you look at my CPU you can see the little scuffs where I used the razor on the corners. I have no scratches or damage from the hammer + vice (well, except a couple little indents that don't matter, but that was my fault for tightening too hard and hitting the wrong way at first, lmao).

But anyway, with hammer and vice, it plops right off, and if you don't tap very hard you can just pull off you processor from the IHS before it goes flying. As long as the vice is properly tightened and you hit with the proper direction and force, it really is a safe method. If I had to buy another CPU I'd do it in a heartbeat.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> As someone who assumed that opinion before, I at first agreed with you. However, I think the razor method is by far more risky! If you look at my CPU you can see the little scuffs where I used the razor on the corners. I have no scratches or damage from the hammer + vice (well, except a couple little indents that don't matter, but that was my fault for tightening too hard and hitting the wrong way at first, lmao).
> 
> But anyway, with hammer and vice, it plops right off, and if you don't tap very hard you can just pull off you processor from the IHS before it goes flying. As long as the vice is properly tightened and you hit with the proper direction and force, it really is a safe method. If I had to buy another CPU I'd do it in a heartbeat.


I think that quite a lot of us have had that opinion when we first heard about delidding,

I was "against" it at first, but when I had the chip in my hands, I immediately forgot all about razor, dental floss, plastic cards and what have we








The vise / hammer was so much easier! a thin cloth in the vise to prevent foot prints in the IHS, a thick towel behind the vise, a few good hits on a decent piece of wood, and BLAMOO! Perfect delid ^_^
Quote:


> before it goes flying.


hehe yea.. the flying PCB is the only proven danger with this method. There is many ways to prevent this.. have a pillow or a towel directly behind it or a cardboard box.
I myself just used a piece of wood that wasn't too long so I could hold it in one hand, and at the same time have a finger on the PCB, that way I was able to feel exactly when the PCB let go of the glue









and NamesLucky, Im sure your intentions was good







but we have had quite a few flame wars on this topic, razor vs hammer /vise.. and many of us are getting bored with it. the usual outcome is that both methods are good!
If you have steady hands, read up on the subject (if first timer) and don't like the idea of hitting your CPU with a hammer.. go ahead and try with razor.
But Hammer / vise is much faster and safer, if you think you will scratch the PCB (happens a lot sadly) and haven't done this kind of thing with hardware before.

And in the end, we are all friends again ^_^


----------



## FtW 420

I did a couple 3770k with a razor blade, & used the hammer & vise for the 4770k. I was all good with both, no damage done either way, but the hammer & vise was much faster & easier.

Although I'm still a believer in heavier cooling over delidding. Run it cool enough, chips all do 5ghz + delidded or not


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Well, I think I've bottlenecked on temps, or I might just need more CLU. (I had less remaining than I thought, only a couple tiny drops sadly). My temps might be a tiny bit lower but not any noticeable difference after adding the little bit of CLU I had left. Man, I really had almost nothing to add though...I feel like I want to test with a bit more. I also want to try it on the IHS/waterblock side but have nothing to put on there. Oh well.

EDIT- To be exact, my max temps seem to be approx. 1-2C lower, which shows that there may be gains remaining to be had...perhaps


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Well, I think I've bottlenecked on temps, or I might just need more CLU. (I had less remaining than I thought, only a couple tiny drops sadly). My temps might be a tiny bit lower but not any noticeable difference after adding the little bit of CLU I had left. Man, I really had almost nothing to add though...I feel like I want to test with a bit more. I also want to try it on the IHS/waterblock side but have nothing to put on there. Oh well.
> 
> EDIT- To be exact, my max temps seem to be approx. 1-2C lower, which shows that there may be gains remaining to be had...perhaps


Only with a new syringe and a few reapplications you'll have a clear picture unfortunately..


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Only with a new syringe and a few reapplications you'll have a clear picture unfortunately..


Yeah, I'll definitely buy some new CLU. Once I try that out I'll let you guys know if I have any success. I'm sure I just need a little more.


----------



## purekhaos

Hello! I finally got around to using Coollab Pro. I am the 8th down on the haswell page. I was able to go from a change of 12 c to 22c, an additional 10 c from the cool lab. Was hoping to have it updated.

Happy overclocking!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Well, I think I've bottlenecked on temps, or I might just need more CLU. (I had less remaining than I thought, only a couple tiny drops sadly). My temps might be a tiny bit lower but not any noticeable difference after adding the little bit of CLU I had left. Man, I really had almost nothing to add though...I feel like I want to test with a bit more. I also want to try it on the IHS/waterblock side but have nothing to put on there. Oh well.
> 
> EDIT- To be exact, my max temps seem to be approx. 1-2C lower, which shows that there may be gains remaining to be had...perhaps


try going throe the images in this thread annd compare to your own.. it is a really thin layer that needs to be applied!
maybe post a pic of your core before adding / removing anything?

I would fix this problem before you put CLP / CLU on the IHS/waterblock (you wont gain much from that anyways)
Im not sure if this has been clarified already.. but you DID remember to remove all the glue from the IHS and PCB?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *purekhaos*
> 
> Hello! I finally got around to using Coollab Pro. I am the 8th down on the haswell page. I was able to go from a change of 12 c to 22c, an additional 10 c from the cool lab. Was hoping to have it updated.
> 
> Happy overclocking!


It is not more than 10 hours ago I was looking at the list and noticed your score / tim ^^
Congratz" that is a nice improvement!!

did you compare to your old pre delid results, or did you run a fresh test pre CLP and after?
I guess im asking, did you take ambient temps into consideration?

Im sure Val would like some info if he is to change results


----------



## NASzi

Just delidded, ran two passes of intel burn test before and after the delid, 3770k OC'd to 4.6 @ 1.41 V Max (I Know, my CPU sucks at OC'ing)

Before

http://minus.com/lbh2UHlJUsampa

After

http://minus.com/l9FH1jEiPV6v3

Package temp dropped 24 Degrees C, Pretty good improvement if you ask me


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> Just delidded, ran two passes of intel burn test before and after the delid, 3770k OC'd to 4.6 @ 1.41 V Max (I Know, my CPU sucks at OC'ing)
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://minus.com/lbh2UHlJUsampa
> 
> After
> 
> http://minus.com/l9FH1jEiPV6v3
> 
> 
> 
> Package temp dropped 24 Degrees C, Pretty good improvement if you ask me


1.41v for 4.6 seams a bit high yes.. but the temps seams awesome! you only got 240 rad for CPU? and is GPU in the loop?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *purekhaos*
> 
> Hello! I finally got around to using Coollab Pro. I am the 8th down on the haswell page. I was able to go from a change of 12 c to 22c, an additional 10 c from the cool lab. Was hoping to have it updated.
> 
> Happy overclocking!


You are updated! I love seeing even better temp drops well done sir!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> Just delidded, ran two passes of intel burn test before and after the delid, 3770k OC'd to 4.6 @ 1.41 V Max (I Know, my CPU sucks at OC'ing)
> 
> Before
> 
> http://minus.com/lbh2UHlJUsampa
> 
> After
> 
> http://minus.com/l9FH1jEiPV6v3
> 
> Package temp dropped 24 Degrees C, Pretty good improvement if you ask me


I agree!







throw me the info and I'll add ya good fellow!


----------



## NASzi

thanks for the compliments guys, too lazy to do everything required but here's what I have

OCN name: NASzi
CPU: Intel i7 3770K
on die-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
Mhz gained: Didn't OC further yet
OC after delid: 4.6 Will be pushing further
Temp drops: 24C at 4.6 OC
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> 1.41v for 4.6 seams a bit high yes.. but the temps seams awesome! you only got 240 rad for CPU? and is GPU in the loop?


Yes a CPU only loop with a 240 rad


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> thanks for the compliments guys, too lazy to do everything required but here's what I have
> 
> OCN name: NASzi
> CPU: Intel i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
> Mhz gained: Didn't OC further yet
> OC after delid: 4.6 Will be pushing further
> Temp drops: 24C at 4.6 OC
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


you're in!







and as a great deal for any gamer that is a delidder!!! go here meow! https://www.humblebundle.com/


----------



## camborambo

Hey guys,

Finally got the vice in and delidded my chip. The results are great with my custom water loop. Please add me in the member list ;-)

OCN name: CamboRambo
CPU: I7 3770K
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Pro
ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
Mhz gained: Left it at 4.5ghz
OC after delid: I am going to push it more after more testing
Temp drops: 21c @ 4.5ghz
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Will be doing some OC later.

I only had images from my prime95 test. Using IBT it was about 10c higher.



I chipped the pcb a bit but glad it's still working! I must've hit the wood too hard.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *camborambo*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> Finally got the vice in and delidded my chip. The results are great with my custom water loop. Please add me in the member list ;-)
> 
> OCN name: CamboRambo
> CPU: I7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Pro
> ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: Left it at 4.5ghz
> OC after delid: I am going to push it more after more testing
> Temp drops: 21c @ 4.5ghz
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Will be doing some OC later.
> 
> I only had images from my prime95 test. Using IBT it was about 10c higher.
> 
> 
> 
> I chipped the pcb a bit but glad it's still working! I must've hit the wood too hard.


You're in!







you're the 150th ivy member!


----------



## camborambo

Sweet! Looks like I am going to be up all night seeing how far I can push this chip now.


----------



## Darylrese

This is what scares me smacking the chip with a block of wood and damaging it!...how many times has this happened to members or people attempting it?...did you hit the actual chip with the hammer or did you use a block of wood?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Hitting the PCB with a hammer is a big no no!

You need to hold a perfectly flat piece of real wood to the side of the PCB (possessed wood may be too fragile or soft) and giving the wood a few good whacks..
we dont have any members that have damaged the chip by doing this (unless they are not careful and end up sending he chip flying)

oh yea.. we DID see one case where the PCB got destroyed.. I think the pic was from another forum or something.. it looked like it was hit with a small hammer directly , witch is still a big no no..


----------



## camborambo

I used a piece of wood just like everyone else I saw in the videos. I had a helping hand also to make sure it was aligned perfectly. It took a good few hits before it flew out. I had a towel on the end to catch it safely.

Im pretty sure the wood and pressure did that. I smam glad that it's working but be very careful! I was just lucky that it didn't chip any larger.

Currently overclocked to 4.8ghz @ 1.45v. Still stress testing.


----------



## Darylrese

This scares me even more that you did use some wood!

1.45v for 4.8ghz? Ouch! Mine can do 4.6ghz on 1.206v and 4.8ghz on about 1.290v


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> This scares me even more that you did use some wood!
> 
> 1.45v for 4.8ghz? Ouch! Mine can do 4.6ghz on 1.206v and 4.8ghz on about 1.290v


nice chip!
I havent gotten this fare yet.. I cant get 4.5 stable @ 1.25v

why does it scare you that he used wood? would you prefer to hit the PCB directly? :S
Direct impacts are way more damaging to the PCB rather than transferring the force throe a material before getting to the PCB.
that is common knowledge.


----------



## camborambo

Make sure the wood is a nice solid block. I took a look at the wood block I used and it had the chips line which means it was pressed in a bit. Yea, I got a horrible chip or it could be my sabertooth mobo.


----------



## Darylrese

No what scares me is he used the correct equipment and it still chipped his CPU!


----------



## AlDyer

Darylrese you have a good chip. What are you stressing it with?


----------



## Darylrese

12 hours of prime95 mate and yep I got lucky with the silicone lottery this time round! This is why I both want to delid but also am do cautious. I'd be totally gutted if I chipped or broke it. I did a delid on an e2140 I have which worked fine but knowing my luck it will go wrong on my 3770k lol


----------



## camborambo

Don't let my bad luck scare you off. The temp drops is remarkable. I decided to stick with 4.5ghz @ 1.26 for 24/7 use. I got it up to 4.8ghz stable at 79c highest core. Just worried that 1.48v would cause degradation on my chip.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> No what scares me is he used the correct equipment and it still chipped his CPU!










Giving two people a hammer and a nail doesn't mean the nail will end up in the wall right the first time







or second, or third


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *camborambo*
> 
> Don't let my bad luck scare you off. The temp drops is remarkable. I decided to stick with 4.5ghz @ 1.26 for 24/7 use. I got it up to 4.8ghz stable at 79c highest core. Just worried that 1.48v would cause degradation on my chip.


Yeah I wouldnt run 1.4v + 24/7 myself its not worth it. When I tried 4.8ghz it was no better in terms of real life performance anyway


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I don't worry at all about running at 1.45v on my chip. Although high voltage can indeed be a problem - it's high voltages coupled with high temperatures that cause leakage and degradation (well at least within intel specs). So considering that IIRC the intel max voltage spec for Ivy is something like 1.53v and the max thermal spec is 105C - if you're running temps in the upper 60s to lower 70s and are under 1.5v I wouldn't expect to see degradation at all - even if you're running 24/7. If you're using offset voltages and not folding with it... then you could max it out without any problems - since all the time you're just browsing the web, watching a video, etc... it will be running somewhere around 1600MHz, 1.0v and have cores that are in the upper 20s or lower 30s depending on cooling solution.


----------



## neofury

I have my chip running at 1.45v 24/7/365 with no WHEA errors or anything. Haven't noticed any degradation yet. Of course, that's my target vcore and I use offset. You might say it offsets the degradation if there were to be any










The chip is between 20-30c when idle, 30-40c during normal use and goes up to 60c when gaming. I think that should be fine for 24/7. Anyone have any reason for me to reconsider? I'm just such a geek, I love having 5ghz and will probably end up keeping it at that regardless


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> No what scares me is he used the correct equipment and it still chipped his CPU!


Oooh.. it all makes sense now. I must have missed that..
sorry for the confusion


----------



## Darylrese

Thats ok mate

]Just curious...has anyone used any type of padding or protection when using the vice on their chip? One thing i did notice when i did the e2140 is it does mark the IHS....How about putting some foam tape on each side of the vice or will this cause the chip to slip out of the vice?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Thats ok mate
> 
> ]Just curious...has anyone used any type of padding or protection when using the vice on their chip? One thing i did notice when i did the e2140 is it does mark the IHS....How about putting some foam tape on each side of the vice or will this cause the chip to slip out of the vice?


I had problems keeping it securely clamped in the vice so I'm guessing I couldn't have just done something half-assed that would have worked for me. It really needed to bite well into the IHS, metal to metal, to get kept in place.

There are other vices out there that are better machined and are perfectly smooth and probably won't nick the IHS. There are also vices with hard rubber pads and those might work well while just stuffing some rubber into a normal vice wouldn't.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> Well, after a month of my delidded 4770k running fine. Today my pc wouldn't boot gave it a look over started pulling everything out and then got to the cpu.
> 
> 
> 
> My die somehow cracked itself after a month, not touched, just killed itself sitting under my block.
> 
> Got a replacement on the way I hope that its just my cpu that died. Doubt ill delid again after this :/


is this the second time a haswell chip has cracked out of nowhere????
haswell die must be really weak


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> is this the second time a haswell chip has cracked out of nowhere????
> haswell die must be really weak


That was actually the first one, the one in the thread "Killed my 4770K" was the second to crack.


----------



## lilchronic

man if i were a delidded haswell owner id be worried







what tim was being used?? and what would cause the die to crack... heat ...too much pressure?


----------



## Clexzor

just picked up a second 4770k delid it 5ghz 1.42v


----------



## WiLd FyeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> is this the second time a haswell chip has cracked out of nowhere????
> haswell die must be really weak


It could be weak but at the same time, it could be user error overtightening the CPU block. Overtime, the DIE just collapses from the pressure. Intel may have made a gap for a reason.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Thats ok mate
> 
> ]Just curious...has anyone used any type of padding or protection when using the vice on their chip? One thing i did notice when i did the e2140 is it does mark the IHS....How about putting some foam tape on each side of the vice or will this cause the chip to slip out of the vice?


I just used some painters tape on the jaws of the vise & tightened it to where it held & gave it an extra 1/8 turn or so. Put a towel in behind the vise to catch the pcb if it flew, tapped it fairly lightly, then a bit more force, then a bit more yet & it popped off into the towel. No noticeable marks on the PCB or IHS.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I just used some painters tape on the jaws of the vise & tightened it to where it held & gave it an extra 1/8 turn or so. Put a towel in behind the vise to catch the pcb if it flew, tapped it fairly lightly, then a bit more force, then a bit more yet & it popped off into the towel. No noticeable marks on the PCB or IHS.


...sounds easier than the razor method I used...but are you not concerned that tiny micro-fractures are potentially introduced on the die via hammer+vise. I have read of several Haswells delidded w/hammer+vise cracking the die weeks / months later 'for no apparent reason'...could of course be completely unrelated...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds easier than the razor method I used...but are you not concerned that tiny micro-fractures are potentially introduced on the die via hammer+vise. I have read of several Haswells delidded w/hammer+vise cracking the die weeks / months later 'for no apparent reason'...could of course be completely unrelated...


It was quicker & easier than the razor was on my 3770k. But I also did the hammer delid on the 4770k before the couple reports of cracked die came in.

Looking good so far though, the 4770k is still working, & extreme temp swings aren't affecting it. Chilled down to -100° starting up IBT at 5.3Ghz can still drive temps up 100° in seconds & it still runs so must not be cracking.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Thats ok mate
> 
> ]Just curious...has anyone used any type of padding or protection when using the vice on their chip? One thing i did notice when i did the e2140 is it does mark the IHS....How about putting some foam tape on each side of the vice or will this cause the chip to slip out of the vice?


I agree with the others.. flat metal (aluminum maybe) jaws or hard plastic jaws..

I didnt have access to either.. so I just threw a piece of cloth between my "raped" steel jaws, used short piece of wood(compared to many of our members







) enabling me to have a finger on the CPU while holding the wood.. my finger eliminates the risk of flying chip and gave me great feel for when the PCB was about to let go.

make sure not to tighten too much..
You dont really need to have it tightened at all, as long as the CPU is steady, and the side furthest away from the wood / hammer, is stable and wont move when swinging the hammer.

I while back someone posted pics, having the IHS between two hard pieces of wood and the one furthest away from hammer / vice, was resting against a wall..
That is a perfectly good way for doing this! ^_^


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...sounds easier than the razor method I used...but are you not concerned that tiny micro-fractures are potentially introduced on the die via hammer+vise. *I have read of several Haswells delidded w/hammer+vise cracking the die weeks / months later 'for no apparent reason'*...could of course be completely unrelated...


Lets not start spreading a false rumor OK? It's not several Haswells, it's just two, and we don't know if it was the hammer and vise method that caused the cracks.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Lets not start spreading a false rumor OK? It's not several Haswells, it's just two, and we don't know if it was the hammer and vise method that caused the cracks.


Agree.. we only have two cases.. and since hammer / vice is the most used method(right?), odds are that both cases would be that method.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I just used some painters tape on the jaws of the vise & tightened it to where it held & gave it an extra 1/8 turn or so. Put a towel in behind the vise to catch the pcb if it flew, tapped it fairly lightly, then a bit more force, then a bit more yet & it popped off into the towel. No noticeable marks on the PCB or IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> ...sounds easier than the razor method I used...but are you not concerned that tiny micro-fractures are potentially introduced on the die via hammer+vise. I have read of several Haswells delidded w/hammer+vise cracking the die weeks / months later 'for no apparent reason'...could of course be completely unrelated...
Click to expand...

I don't buy that micro fractures idea, because the way I'm imagining things to work, the 22nm features of the CPU inside of the die would already be broken by the tiniest fracture. It's also not like materials for an airplane where parts flex a lot and micro fractures build up until things break. It's some kind of silicon crystal where I'm not sure it can actually flex at all (Google search doesn't help). I'm imagining the material behaving such that it's either shattered or not shattered with nothing in-between possible.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I don't buy that micro fractures idea, because the way I'm imagining things to work, the 22nm features of the CPU inside of the die would already be broken by the tiniest fracture. It's also not like materials for an airplane where parts flex a lot and micro fractures build up until things break. It's some kind of silicon crystal where I'm not sure it can actually flex at all (Google search doesn't help). I'm imagining the material behaving such that it's either shattered or not shattered with nothing in-between possible.


I was also wandering the same thing when I first read about the cracks being propagated micro-fractures. It just doesn't seem to me that such a big crack is required for a 22nm processor to stop working.


----------



## Darylrese

I just had a thought, althought its probably already been discussed or thought of before....

Has anyone ever delidded by clamping the CPU in place, then used a second hand held clamp and twisted it to delid?

I have workbenches with vices on at work so its ideal either way for me i just need to pluck up the courage to do it


----------



## Forceman

You'd have to be careful how much you twisted it, especially with a Haswell, you wouldn't want to twist the IHS into the die or the capacitors on a Haswell. I wonder if you could put enough torque on it to break the glue free by hand though, it takes a decent amount of force to break it free with the hammer.


----------



## Darylrese

yeh interesting to find out more!

If i do it, i'm going for the hammer and vice method as i work in a school and we have a tech lab with all the decent equipment like mounted vices and solid wood blocks...the e2140 i tested was a breeze.

Only thing putting me off really is the whole resale thing.

I just sold my i5 2500k on ebay for £128 which is crazy and paid for half of my 3770k. If i delid this CPU, its going to lose value fast. Its something i need to seriously consider before i do it. I know its only a couple of hundred so not a huge amount to lose if i couldn't sell it what so ever.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> yeh interesting to find out more!
> 
> If i do it, i'm going for the hammer and vice method as i work in a school and we have a tech lab with all the decent equipment like mounted vices and solid wood blocks...the e2140 i tested was a breeze.
> 
> Only thing putting me off really is the whole resale thing.
> 
> I just sold my i5 2500k on ebay for £128 which is crazy and paid for half of my 3770k. If i delid this CPU, its going to lose value fast. Its something i need to seriously consider before i do it. I know its only a couple of hundred so not a huge amount to lose if i couldn't sell it what so ever.


Hard call on the resale value after delidding, it would be worth less to someone who wants the warranty, or to bench it with extreme cooling.
But for someone who is considering buying a chip & delidding it, pre-delidded & tested is kind of a bonus since the potentially scary (depending on the person) step is done.


----------



## Eastrider

Im about to receive my CLU in my home... and I have three tiny, fast questions!

1) I've heard you can screw up badly if you apply to much, as it'll "melt" and come out of the IHS-die gap and short the socket and cpu pins. True? Unlikely?

2) I've heard it's convenient to spread CLU in the die AND in the underside of the IHS. True? How does this combine with 1) question?

3) Should I use CLU in my IHS-to-heatsink too? (Copper waterblock) I'm not lapped.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> Im about to receive my CLU in my home... and I have three tiny, fast questions!
> 
> 1) I've heard you can screw up badly if you apply to much, as it'll "melt" and come out of the IHS-die gap and short the socket and cpu pins. True? Unlikely?
> 
> 2) I've heard it's convenient to spread CLU in the die AND in the underside of the IHS. True? How does this combine with 1) question?
> 
> 3) Should I use CLU in my IHS-to-heatsink too? (Copper waterblock) I'm not lapped.


1: besides the risk of traveling TIM, you wont get as good temps if you put too much ether..
What CPU? (where is your sig rig?)
haswell also has surface mounted tings that dosnt like to get in contact with the CLU.

2: The general idea is to spread a THIN (but not too thin, lol) layer on the dye, and then use the CLU left on your brush for the underside of the IHS just above the dye,, not the entire surface.. this layer cant be too thin though









3: You CAN.. but most reports about doing this have had non to small effect.. I would stick with a normal TIM for this..


----------



## Darylrese

1) Not heard of that myself but im guessing you will need to apply a hell of a lot for that to happen. You need to apply an ultra thin layer

2) Yes that's what i've seen in tutorial videos too. Again a VERY thin layer applied with the supplied brush

3) I have heard not to do this as its a total nightmare to remove, I personally would use a high end TIM such as Diamond IC for IHS to heatsink


----------



## neofury

I've heard mixed feelings on your #3 question.

Some folks say CLP is terrible but CLU isn't so bad, some folks say either is good, others flat out say don't do it.

I used CLU and it did give me a temp drop over AS5. Probably like 4-5c


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Yeah I got a smallish drop using CLU - but I will have to say that I wouldn't recommend it really. In my case it stained the CPU block's copper bottom and a little on the IHS. I could have lapped both to get rid of it, but since (in theory) the staining is simply the CLU sitting in milling/polishing gaps - I just cleaned it really, really well with Articlean first and 91% alcohol second until there wasn't any tinting of the wipes (lint free glasses wipes). Then applied my PK-1 which, of course, goes on and off like a dream no matter how old it is.

The CLU on the die is another matter entirely as it never hardens at all and comes right off (at least mine did after my test bench runs ~48hrs). The CLU between the IHS and the Raystorm was already hard and crusty after just 36hrs - half of which the PC was powered down for.


----------



## Cyro999

^Why exactly is this?


----------



## Eastrider

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> for the underside of the IHS just above the dye,, not the entire surface.. this layer cant be too thin though


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Again a VERY thin layer applied with the supplied brush


whaaaa?







or did Gambi mean, as thin as possible? (My English is not native).

Regarding my CPU, it's a 3570k, so no VRMs on the PCB sitting there, asking to get shorted.

Ohh, and a small thing. Cleaning paste with "wounds alcohol" (96° in here) and coffee filters is fine? I was sort of worried about sediments, but i guess they're too despreciable of an amount, considering that the isopropyl alcohol napkin in the CLU pack is 70°...


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> Im about to receive my CLU in my home... and I have three tiny, fast questions!
> 
> 1) I've heard you can screw up badly if you apply to much, as it'll "melt" and come out of the IHS-die gap and short the socket and cpu pins. True? Unlikely?
> 
> 2) I've heard it's convenient to spread CLU in the die AND in the underside of the IHS. True? How does this combine with 1) question?
> 
> 3) Should I use CLU in my IHS-to-heatsink too? (Copper waterblock) I'm not lapped.


For #3 I have run tests and found that using liquid metal on top of the IHS will get temps 3-5c lower than using something like MX-4. Liquid metal is not hard to remove either. Removing it is is easy as with normal paste ie: a little bit of 95%+ alcohol will do the trick. It may leave that has no impact on temps but which can easily be removed with some metal polish. The thing is tho, unless your changing cooling equipment there should be no need to remove the liquid metal from the top of the IHS anyway. It's made to apply and then forget about.


----------



## Eastrider

And thanks everyone for the answers! I will rep as soon as I get on my pc.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> Ohh, and a small thing. Cleaning paste with "wounds alcohol" (96° in here) and coffee filters is fine? I was sort of worried about sediments, but i guess they're too despreciable of an amount, considering that the isopropyl alcohol napkin in the CLU pack is 70°...


I don't know much about chemistry, but there are a whole bunch of alcohols, and isopropyl alcohol ("2-propanol" where I'm from) is very different compared to ethanol. It cleans things like crusty black oily dirt from a bike much better.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> For #3 I have run tests and found that using liquid metal on top of the IHS will get temps 3-5c lower than using something like MX-4. Liquid metal is not hard to remove either. Removing it is is easy as with normal paste ie: a little bit of 95%+ alcohol will do the trick. It may leave that has no impact on temps but which can easily be removed with some metal polish. The thing is tho, unless your changing cooling equipment there should be no need to remove the liquid metal from the top of the IHS anyway. It's made to apply and then forget about.


I think there is quite a bit of variance either in the manufacturing of CLU or at the least in the storage, etc... I found mine applied very easily - but what you describe in your threads about it simply 'wiping off' after application is the exact opposite of my experience. I found it had hardened completely and would 'flake' off and crack - but it took me well over an hour to get both the IHS and the CPU block cleaned well. The consistency was very, very different from what it was when it was applied.

I'm perfectly accepting of the possibility that the 'early application' (i.e. at the very end of the syringe) was perhaps different - as the CLU I applied on my die was still flawless when I moved it to my main machine - and I expect it to continue to be so. In any case, my experience, temperature-wise at least, was similar and I did find better temps. However, based on my experience cleaning (which was _nothing_ like the CLU video of doing it) caused me to prefer a slight increase in temps over the possible maintenance hassle down the road.

And with peak temps (post-delid) in the upper 60s to low 70s on 25 IBT runs and a 24hr Prime95 run... I'm not worried about those 3-4C additional I might get by using CLU on both sides.


----------



## tw33k

I must have applied and re-applied Liquid Ultra 20+ times by now to the CPU in my test bench (I just finished doing it twice more) and removing it has been as simple as using a cloth with some methylated spirits and wiping it off. If either or both the IHS and block are stained, I use some Brasso, rub it in and clean it off with more metho. The whole process takes a minute, 2 at the most and both the IHS and H100i block are perfectly clean. It's strange to hear your experience is so different and I'm at a loss to explain why.


----------



## deepor

The difference could be something with mirror finish vs. a brushed or matte look. And there's also nickel plated, and CLU might stain less with that.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> Originally Posted by GaMbi2004 View Post
> 
> for the underside of the IHS just above the dye,, not the entire surface.. this layer cant be too thin though wink.gif
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Darylrese View Post
> 
> Again a VERY thin layer applied with the supplied brush
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> whaaaa? biggrin.gif or did Gambi mean, as thin as possible? (My English is not native).
> 
> Regarding my CPU, it's a 3570k, so no VRMs on the PCB sitting there, asking to get shorted.
> 
> Ohh, and a small thing. Cleaning paste with "wounds alcohol" (96° in here) and coffee filters is fine? I was sort of worried about sediments, but i guess they're too despreciable of an amount, considering that the isopropyl alcohol napkin in the CLU pack is 70°...
> Edited by Eastrider - Yesterday at 8:21 pm
Click to expand...

Sorry.. I guess that can be read in two ways







I ment "the layer under the IHS should be thin"

Quote:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by GaMbi2004 View Post
> and then use the CLU left on your brush for the underside of the IHS


its not easy to make a thicker layer with that amount







unless you emptied your entire CLU in the brush ;D


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I must have applied and re-applied Liquid Ultra 20+ times by now to the CPU in my test bench (I just finished doing it twice more) and removing it has been as simple as using a cloth with some methylated spirits and wiping it off. If either or both the IHS and block are stained, I use some Brasso, rub it in and clean it off with more metho. The whole process takes a minute, 2 at the most and both the IHS and H100i block are perfectly clean. It's strange to hear your experience is so different and I'm at a loss to explain why.


Me too. I purchased the CLU for the express purpose of being able to use it both under the IHS and on top... my experience with it being under was as expected - but the behavior of it on top was totally unexpected. I've read numerous stories of people with both CLU and CLP having it harden (completely solidify) but they always mentioned it taking months. Additionally, although a few comments indicated a problem occurring with temps after this change, for the most part the consensus was that temps were unaffected. I didn't find the former to be true (i.e. my temps were perfectly fine when I removed the chip for delidding - well fine for the normal crap temps on this chip). However, I did find it to be almost as difficult to remove as the CLP stories indicated.

I'm wondering if I got a tube of CLP that was incorrectly labeled and packaged as CLU - or if there is simply a variance between batches (i.e. different purity, etc...). In any case it seems likely that mine, and a few others, are the 'oddball' behavior and that yours is the more common - which is why you haven't seen a variance over multiple tubes. This would also explain why the videos they have posted of how 'easy to remove' CLU is are similar to your experience and very different from my own.


----------



## Krullmeister

Got mine done earlier tonight!









CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: IC7
Mhz gained: n/a
OC after delid: 4.5ghz
Temp drops: 13 degrees on hottest core
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2892229





I'll give 5ghz a go tomorrow, it's a bit late now. Hopefully I can get a bit of extra performance out of this baby.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Krullmeister*
> 
> Got mine done earlier tonight!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: IC7
> Mhz gained: n/a
> OC after delid: 4.5ghz
> Temp drops: 13 degrees on hottest core
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2892229
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll give 5ghz a go tomorrow, it's a bit late now. Hopefully I can get a bit of extra performance out of this baby.


You're in!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Val... its been too long since you said "Slap your sig on!"


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Val... its been too long since you said "Slap your sig on!"


I guess he's getting Alzheimer's... Feel sad for him since hes so young. Hahahaha


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Krullmeister*
> 
> Got mine done earlier tonight!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...
> I'll give 5ghz a go tomorrow, it's a bit late now. Hopefully I can get a bit of extra performance out of this baby.


If you're at 4.5GHz with only 1.2v vcore - I have no idea what you're cooling it with, but I'm _positive_ you should be able to see 5GHz without issue.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Val... its been too long since you said "Slap your sig on!"


indeedly that is true...


----------



## El Media Vida

Hello, what is the best method to remove the IHS? razor or clamp+hammer?


----------



## Krullmeister

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> If you're at 4.5GHz with only 1.2v vcore - I have no idea what you're cooling it with, but I'm _positive_ you should be able to see 5GHz without issue.


Did a bit of testing and got it stable at 4,7 @ 1.36v. Temps are around 88-95 across the cores during IBT.

Cooling it with a H100i with two NF-f12's.

Tried 4.8ghz but it would only semi complete IBT at 1.44v and most likely needs a bit more to be fully stable. Temps were over 100 though so turned that off very fast.

Was hoping to go a bit further after delidding but I'm quite happy with 4.7 for now.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Hello, what is the best method to remove the IHS? razor or clamp+hammer?


There is no "best" method.. only a method that is best for YOU!
Razor can give peace of mind for those who dosnt like to hammer on their CPU, but has by fare, the most cases of CPU death







you need a steady hand for this mod.
The Hammer/Vise method is faster and easier for most people and has vary few cases of CPU death or damage.

make sure to read up on any method you choose to use and good luck


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> If you're at 4.5GHz with only 1.2v vcore - I have no idea what you're cooling it with, but I'm _positive_ you should be able to see 5GHz without issue.


My Haswell passed IBT @4.5ghz, 1.158vcore.. needs a touch over 1.2 for 4.5 to actually be stable in everything (aparantly it's easy to pass prime with haswell while wildly unstable in some areas) and needs ~1.32 for 4.7 and probably 1.4 for 4.8, so i wouldn't give it a free pass without good cooling. 3770k on the other hand that i played with primed @4.4, 1.13 and superpi 32m'd @4.9, 1.28, so i'm sure it would wreck 5ghz with delid. Both of those chips do 4.4 on similar numbers, but they're 0.1v apart for 500mhz higher


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> My Haswell passed IBT @4.5ghz, 1.158vcore.. needs a touch over 1.2 for 4.5 to actually be stable in everything (aparantly it's easy to pass prime with haswell while wildly unstable in some areas) and needs ~1.32 for 4.7 and probably 1.4 for 4.8, so i wouldn't give it a free pass without good cooling. 3770k on the other hand that i played with primed @4.4, 1.13 and superpi 32m'd @4.9, 1.28, so i'm sure it would wreck 5ghz with delid. Both of those chips do 4.4 on similar numbers, but they're 0.1v apart for 500mhz higher


Does anyone have this data: How are temps compared?
Ivy vs haswell at same vcore (1,4v or something) and / or at same core speed (4.5ghz~) running IBT

Im at 4.4ghz 1.2v.. I need over 1.25v for 4.5ghz stable and temps gets a bit high.
I got some major cooling upgrade coming in tomorrow! Cant wait to see how good / bad it will OC









Would there be any reason to take a look under the IHS when im rebuilding anyway? or is it safer to just keep the CPU clamped in?

*Off topic
A pic of my latest project, 3xWindow mod
Turned out great









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## El Media Vida

I decided! i'll delid my future 3770k but, i have a couple doubts. Is recomendable try the cpu before do delid (if is brand new)? how i'll have better temps, with or without IHS?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> I decided! i'll delid my future 3770k but, i have a couple doubts. Is recomendable try the cpu before do delid (if is brand new)? how i'll have better temps, with or without IHS?


Definitely check it first to make sure it isn't DOA, since you won't be able to RMA it once you delid. And unless you have a waterblock that is set up for running with a naked core, you are better off with the IHS on.


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Definitely check it first to make sure it isn't DOA, since you won't be able to RMA it once you delid. And unless you have a waterblock that is set up for running with a naked core, you are better off with the IHS on.


Ok. And i have a XSPC raystorm, i think i can remove the bracket.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Does anyone have this data: How are temps compared?
> Ivy vs haswell at same vcore (1,4v or something) and / or at same core speed (4.5ghz~) running IBT
> 
> Im at 4.4ghz 1.2v.. I need over 1.25v for 4.5ghz stable and temps gets a bit high.
> I got some major cooling upgrade coming in tomorrow! Cant wait to see how good / bad it will OC
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would there be any reason to take a look under the IHS when im rebuilding anyway? or is it safer to just keep the CPU clamped in?
> 
> *Off topic
> A pic of my latest project, 3xWindow mod
> Turned out great
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


It's very variable, between chips there's some gap because of the glue job unless you delid, but mainly:

Haswell heats up a lot more with avx and especially avx2, if you run full cpu load with x264, the temps will be much closer to ivy, if you run avx1 linpack the margin between them widens a lot, and if you run avx2 tests the chip becomes literally lava with any kind of voltage applied unless you're delidded on high end cooling below like 1.3v


----------



## Darylrese

So i have my i7 3770k stable at 4.8ghz @ 1.296v , temps 82,92,91,84 with my XSPC Raystorm, tempted to delid but happy with these temps considering i haven't done so yet.

Are those temps ok for 4.8ghz? how about the voltage? I'm using offset so i flickers between 1.296v and 1.304v in IBT but 90% of the time is running 1.296v under load.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> It's very variable, between chips there's some gap because of the glue job unless you delid, but mainly:
> 
> Haswell heats up a lot more with avx and especially avx2, if you run full cpu load with x264, the temps will be much closer to ivy, if you run avx1 linpack the margin between them widens a lot, and if you run avx2 tests the chip becomes literally lava with any kind of voltage applied unless you're delidded on high end cooling below like 1.3v


I see.. I ment dilidded ivy and haswell







guess I should have mentioned that..

Anyways.. that is the answer I needed, cheers


----------



## Cyro999

It's the same with delidded too. Haswell somehow disobeys the laws of physics to get hotter while half as much power is running through the same chip surface area or whatever. Does anyone have power readings for Avx2 actually?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Krullmeister*
> 
> Did a bit of testing and got it stable at 4,7 @ 1.36v. Temps are around 88-95 across the cores during IBT.
> 
> Cooling it with a H100i with two NF-f12's.
> 
> Tried 4.8ghz but it would only semi complete IBT at 1.44v and most likely needs a bit more to be fully stable. Temps were over 100 though so turned that off very fast.
> 
> Was hoping to go a bit further after delidding but I'm quite happy with 4.7 for now.


I'd be very happy... it takes me 1.45v to get 4.7GHz fully stable... however you will have much better temps if you delid. On the other hand, there's nothing that's likely to actually _need_ even 4.5GHz. Those temps are OK but I'd definitely recommend either delidding it or dropping back down to 4.5GHz. Technically you're still within Intel spec, 95C is pretty warm - although during normal use you'll never see the kind of loads you do during an IBT run. At a guess those load temps would drop into the upper 70s after a delid. Your cores are reasonably close together so that's something at least. Before delidding there was a 14C difference between my cores - and you have half that much.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> So i have my i7 3770k stable at 4.8ghz @ 1.296v , temps 82,92,91,84 with my XSPC Raystorm, tempted to delid but happy with these temps considering i haven't done so yet.
> 
> Are those temps ok for 4.8ghz? how about the voltage? I'm using offset so i flickers between 1.296v and 1.304v in IBT but 90% of the time is running 1.296v under load.


Although I've said it before - I'll say it again: I'm jelly. I would delid that sucker in a heartbeat. However, I can understand the hesitation - you've got a great chip there and it would suck if it were damaged. That being said if you're careful, that's a fairly remote possibility - but not zero.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> So i have my i7 3770k stable at 4.8ghz @ 1.296v , temps 82,92,91,84 with my XSPC Raystorm, tempted to delid but happy with these temps considering i haven't done so yet.
> 
> Are those temps ok for 4.8ghz? how about the voltage? I'm using offset so i flickers between 1.296v and 1.304v in IBT but 90% of the time is running 1.296v under load.


I'm happy with my 4.8GHz OC and don't want any more out of my 3770K. I'm already at 1.375V though so that decision is also based on that.

Your voltage for 4.8 is really low and as a result your temps are relatively low too. If I were you I would just add another rad to my loop and keep the chip safe. If you want to go for more than 4.8 though you'll need to delid. It's not worth it IMO.


----------



## Swag

Just got a new Samsung 840 to pair with my 830. The reason why the non-Pro because I got it for free as a gift from my dad's boss because I did the networking for their small office.







Going to RAID it tonight with my 830!


----------



## Krullmeister

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I'd be very happy... it takes me 1.45v to get 4.7GHz fully stable... however you will have much better temps if you delid. On the other hand, there's nothing that's likely to actually _need_ even 4.5GHz. Those temps are OK but I'd definitely recommend either delidding it or dropping back down to 4.5GHz. Technically you're still within Intel spec, 95C is pretty warm - although during normal use you'll never see the kind of loads you do during an IBT run. At a guess those load temps would drop into the upper 70s after a delid. Your cores are reasonably close together so that's something at least. Before delidding there was a 14C difference between my cores - and you have half that much.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although I've said it before - I'll say it again: I'm jelly. I would delid that sucker in a heartbeat. However, I can understand the hesitation - you've got a great chip there and it would suck if it were damaged. That being said if you're careful, that's a fairly remote possibility - but not zero.


I did delid this saturday







So yea, that's why I'm a bit alarmed at the temps. Still 10 degrees drops at my 4.5ghz speeds, didn't try 4.7 prior to delidding so don't know how much that has changed.

Got about 70 degrees at 4.7ghz in Battlefield 3 so that's not as scary


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Krullmeister*
> 
> I did delid this saturday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So yea, that's why I'm a bit alarmed at the temps. Still 10 degrees drops at my 4.5ghz speeds, didn't try 4.7 prior to delidding so don't know how much that has changed.
> 
> Got about 70 degrees at 4.7ghz in Battlefield 3 so that's not as scary


Oh I misunderstood your post - I thought that was _prior_ to delidding. Hmmm... those do seem a little high. I realize I can't compare directly because there's a big difference between my cooling setup and yours (like around 5-6 time the cooling capacity) but that still seems a little too high even on an H100i. I've got one of those (H100i) in my work rig, which although it's only running a 3570K is also delidded so I'll see if I can get reasonably stable at your exact settings (that chip is better than my 3770K, voltage wise at least). It will be a fun exercise anyway because I haven't really bothered to OC it fully... I just upped it to where it was stable without touching the voltages at all... which in my case was ~4.3GHz. That's actually 4.1GHz more speed than I honestly _require_ at the office, but whatever... I like to have extra.









I've been meaning to actually set it up properly and see what OC that chip can hit now... although it's probably gonna be stuck around 4.7GHz as well. I'll post back to give you an idea. It's possible you need to reapply TIM or try reseating the H100i, it's also possible that you don't have enough under the IHS... although that's definitely the _least_ likely scenario IMO.


----------



## skyn3t

Another delidde done my skyn3t









CPU : 3770k
Bath # : 3233C596

Material used to clean the IHS and Die.
ArcitClean 1 & 2

Work is done very smooth cuz i don't like flying pcb .







I always blu tape the back of the PCB just to be safe
"better be safe than lucky"











It only take 3 smooth hit to get it of by hand.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Another delidde done my skyn3t
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU : 3770k
> Bath # : 3233C596
> 
> Material used to clean the IHS and Die.
> ArcitClean 1 & 2
> 
> Work is done very smooth cuz i don't like flying pcb .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I always blu tape the back of the PCB just to be safe
> "better be safe than lucky"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It only take 3 smooth hit to get it of by hand.


So you're using two blocks of wood rather than a vise... I like that... then using what (a third block I'm assuming) to hit the PCB to do the delid?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> So you're using two blocks of wood rather than a vise... I like that... then using what (a third block I'm assuming) to hit the PCB to do the delid?


yup, check out my guide here you will see how I have done it.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> yup, check out my guide here you will see how I have done it.


+rep for that... very nice and saves buying a vise for those that considered that expense onerous. Slightly off-topic, but your voltages make me want to scream and cry. You're stable at more than .4v less than my chip _at the same speed_.









Did you have to go through a bunch to get that one or did you simply get lucky in the lottery?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> +rep for that... very nice and saves buying a vise for those that considered that expense onerous. Slightly off-topic, but your voltages make me want to scream and cry. You're stable at more than .4v less than my chip _at the same speed_.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did you have to go through a bunch to get that one or did you simply get lucky in the lottery?


just my lucky @ MC







. I always get good chip there.


----------



## Darylrese

I'm at 4.8ghz stable on my i7 3770k 1.328v...is that good? Max temp is 91c in PRIME95 after 12 hours, should i go ahead with delid?


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I'm at 4.8ghz stable on my i7 3770k 1.328v...is that good? Max temp is 91c in PRIME95 after 12 hours, should i go ahead with delid?


I would. I needed 1.3v for 4.8ghz which is pretty similar and I'm running 1.45v at 5ghz. The drive for 5!


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I'm happy with my 4.8GHz OC and don't want any more out of my 3770K. I'm already at 1.375V though so that decision is also based on that.
> 
> Your voltage for 4.8 is really low and as a result your temps are relatively low too. If I were you I would just add another rad to my loop and keep the chip safe. If you want to go for more than 4.8 though you'll need to delid. It's not worth it IMO.


I also managed to get the 4.8GHz OC at 1.380v summer stable and with the ram at 2400 c9-11-11-31-1T, after the cpu delid and the performance from the 4.6GHz is increased in every test, like from 108 to 113Gflops with linx and from 9.32 to 9.80 cpu score with the cinebench
Do you think it's 100% safe running the cpu this way 24/7? The vcore seems a bit high to me








I do have a nice, improved D14 cooling (fans in sig) and I'm getting a max 65°C on the hottest core while gaming
And I'm always running my 3770K with the eist only (no other power savings), windows "balanced" profile with a 50% at min cpu perf in order to get an idle freq of 2.5Ghz, no offset
What do you think?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> I also managed to get the 4.8GHz OC at 1.380v summer stable and with the ram at 2400 c9-11-11-31-1T, after the cpu delid and the performance from the 4.6GHz is increased in every test, like from 108 to 113Gflops with linx and from 9.32 to 9.80 cpu score with the cinebench
> Do you think it's 100% safe running the cpu this way 24/7? The vcore seems a bit high to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do have a nice, improved D14 cooling (fans in sig) and I'm getting a max 65°C on the hottest core while gaming
> And I'm always running my 3770K with the eist only (no other power savings), windows "balanced" profile with a 50% at min cpu perf in order to get an idle freq of 2.5Ghz, no offset
> What do you think?


Those temps and vcore are perfectly fine for running 24/7 - even if you were folding and it was sitting at (at a guess) 80C or so - although then it might be pushing things too much IMO. If by 24/7 you mean doing basically nothing for 8-12 hours a day, browsing the web for 2-3 hours per day, and gaming hard for 6-8 hours per day... yeah it's not going to be a problem at all. If gaming is the hardest thing you're asking of the CPU and it's only hitting 65C you're great at 1.38v... well below all of the known thresholds for Ivy.


----------



## Darylrese

Never EVER talk to KrullMeister....he makes you do things...naughty things...things that make you go 'ohhhhhh'...

*My Beloved i7 3770k*



*All wrapped up - I don't fancy my chances!*



*Enter the school workshop*



*Pull some worried faces with a hammer...*





*Electrical tape for extra protection...*



*Here we go!...*



*Few hits and Its off!!*





*Clean off old TIM and silicone sealant*



*Extra shiny, can see the phone camera lens!*



*Apply CLU in a thin layer with a brush...*

*Fit into socket....*

*Poo your pants...*

*Keep on pooing...*

*Turn PC on...*

*SUCCESS!!!*



Temps before delid:

85,91,87,83

Temps after Delid

59,65,65,59

GO FIGURE!!! Thats with a 4.8ghz overclock at 1.328v / 1.336v!!!!!!!

Thats like a 26c drop on the hottest core and similar for the others!!

Can i join now please?


----------



## Cyro999

Good job man!


----------



## GaMbi2004

YES!!!
The last few days I was considering posting "Come on dude -_- take the plunge and just do it already!!"
I never seen a delid this well protected! awesome temp gain!!!
Is this rated a golden chip?
Quote:


> Can i join now please?


Haha ^^ fill out the form from OP and I doubt you will have any problems.. this looks like one of the best temp gains on a "golden chip?", posted in this thread!
Darylrese for president!
(my build log is updated.. take a look if you are bored..)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Never EVER talk to KrullMeister....he makes you do things...naughty things...things that make you go 'ohhhhhh'...
> 
> *My Beloved i7 3770k*
> 
> 
> 
> *All wrapped up - I don't fancy my chances!*
> 
> 
> 
> *Enter the school workshop*
> 
> 
> 
> *Pull some worried faces with a hammer...*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Electrical tape for extra protection...*
> 
> 
> 
> *Here we go!...*
> 
> 
> 
> *Few hits and Its off!!*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Clean off old TIM and silicone sealant*
> 
> 
> 
> *Extra shiny, can see the phone camera lens!*
> 
> 
> 
> *Apply CLU in a thin layer with a brush...*
> 
> *Fit into socket....*
> 
> *Poo your pants...*
> 
> *Keep on pooing...*
> 
> *Turn PC on...*
> 
> *SUCCESS!!!*
> 
> 
> 
> Temps before delid:
> 
> 85,91,87,83
> 
> Temps after Delid
> 
> 59,65,65,59
> 
> GO FIGURE!!! Thats with a 4.8ghz overclock at 1.328v / 1.336v!!!!!!!
> 
> Thats like a 26c drop on the hottest core and similar for the others!!
> 
> Can i join now please?


I the the poo your pants... keep on pooing







fill out the first pages information and I will add ya asap!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> YES!!!
> The last few days I was considering posting "Come on dude -_- take the plunge and just do it already!!"
> I never seen a delid this well protected! awesome temp gain!!!
> Is this rated a golden chip?
> Haha ^^ fill out the form from OP and I doubt you will have any problems.. this looks like one of the best temp gains on a "golden chip?", posted in this thread!
> Darylrese for president!
> (my build log is updated.. take a look if you are bored..)


lol i see that tiny font!


----------



## skyn3t

Nice work
Darylrese.


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Hey guys. I'm just wondering how these temps look, as I never thought to record them before I delidded and got a new cooler.

So, room temperature is 65C (Air conditioner on).

H100i with stock fans

Stock 4770k With Die -> CLU -> IHS -> AS5 -> H100i

(Its my sig rig)

No load - 32C

100% load - 63C average

I came from Phenom II, so maybe I'm hard to impress, but how are these temps? They seem like nothing special to me....I'd expect this with my stock cooler and no delid...

So, did I do something wrong along the way, or are these temps "good"?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> Hey guys. I'm just wondering how these temps look, as I never thought to record them before I delidded and got a new cooler.
> 
> So, room temperature is 65C (Air conditioner on).
> H100i with stock fans
> Stock 4770k With Die -> CLU -> IHS -> AS5 -> H100i
> (Its my sig rig)
> 
> No load - 32C
> 100% load - 63C average
> 
> I came from Phenom II, so maybe I'm hard to impress, but how are these temps? They seem like nothing special to me....I'd expect this with my stock cooler and no delid...
> 
> So, did I do something wrong along the way, or are these temps "good"?


That is not possible.. with any kind of air / water cooling, you wont be able to get the CPU cooler than the ambient temp.. if CPU would be 5 degrees over ambient on idle, your ambient would cause the CPU to be 70 degrees on idle.. so your temps are AWESOME!! im 100% sure that you are using sub zero cooling system
or more likely, you posted 65C wrong.. wouldnt make sense to have 65 C with AC on ether hehe..
Sorry for trolling







im just quite drunk right now ^^

I cant figure your ambient temp.. but im guessing 21? in that case, your temps seams quite high for delidded haswell on stock clock..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> That is not possible.. with any kind of air / water cooling, you wont be able to get the CPU cooler than the ambient temp.. if CPU would be 5 degrees over ambient on idle, your ambient would cause the CPU to be 70 degrees on idle.. so your temps are AWESOME!! im 100% sure that you are using sub zero cooling system
> or more likely, you posted 65C wrong.. wouldnt make sense to have 65 C with AC on ether hehe..
> Sorry for trolling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im just quite drunk right now ^^
> 
> I cant figure your ambient temp.. but im guessing 21? in that case, your temps seams quite high for delidded haswell on stock clock..


Lol, I'm also guessing the 65 is supposed to have an F after it, otherwise, I suspect the AC is installed backwards







Exhaust into the house & cool the planet!


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, I'm also guessing the 65 is supposed to have an F after it, otherwise, I suspect the AC is installed backwards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exhaust into the house & cool the planet!


no words


----------



## Cyro999

Choked on my drink while reading


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, I'm also guessing the 65 is supposed to have an F after it, otherwise, I suspect the AC is installed backwards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exhaust into the house & cool the planet!


help global warming!!! everyone turn your ac's backwards!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, I'm also guessing the 65 is supposed to have an F after it, otherwise, I suspect the AC is installed backwards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Exhaust into the house & cool the planet!
> 
> 
> 
> help global warming!!! everyone turn your ac's backwards!
Click to expand...

Or we can go to an Ice Planet, drill out a huge piece of ice, and drop it into our ocean to cool the planet for another year of scorching hot rays from our very own sun.







(Futurama)


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Or we can go to an Ice Planet, drill out a huge piece of ice, and drop it into our ocean to cool the planet for another year of scorching hot rays from our very own sun.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Futurama)


...I saw that episode I think







..might as well get an extra piece of ice from that planet and bring it back for us OCers for chilled water setups


----------



## Swag

This is how I learned global warming in Layman's terms.







And it would be nice to harness all that amazing coolness for OCing!


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...I saw that episode I think
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ..might as well get an extra piece of ice from that planet and bring it back for us OCers for chilled water setups


not a futurama, but down for a adventure let's get that ICE


----------



## skyn3t

Now LappeD after DeliDded









Some gold dust .











final stage


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Nice work
> Darylrese.


Thanks mate!

Temps are just perfect at 4.8ghz now.

I have been trying for 5.0ghz over night, went all the way up to 1.430v but PRIME95 is crashing after about 3 hours.

What sort of voltage should i be looking at for 5.0ghz if i can do 4.8ghz at 1.328v?

I'm scared to go higher than 1.4v


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Nice work
> Darylrese.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks mate!
> 
> Temps are just perfect at 4.8ghz now.
> 
> I have been trying for 5.0ghz over night, went all the way up to 1.430v but PRIME95 is crashing after about 3 hours.
> 
> What sort of voltage should i be looking at for 5.0ghz if i can do 4.8ghz at 1.328v?
> 
> I'm scared to go higher than 1.4v
Click to expand...

Try around 1.38-1.39v for 4.9ghz and up to 1.45v for 5ghz.

Do you have vcore numbers for 4.7, 4.6, 4.5, 4.4? You can guess starting from those. On my 3570k, if it's put into a graph (ghz/vcore), you can pretty much draw a straight line through the dots. It wants a bit more than what the straight line predicts as it approaches 1.4v.


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Try around 1.39v for 4.9ghz and 1.45v for 5ghz.
> 
> Do you have vcore numbers for 4.7, 4.6, 4.5, 4.4? You can guess starting from those. On my 3570k, if it's put into a graph (ghz/vcore), you can pretty much draw a straight line through the dots. It wants a bit more than what the straight line predicts as it approaches 1.4v.


Thanks mate, yep here you go:

4.5ghz @ 1.175v
4.6ghz @ 1.204v
4.8ghz @ 1.328v
[email protected] ?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Thanks mate, yep here you go:
> 
> 4.5ghz @ 1.175v
> 4.6ghz @ 1.204v
> 4.8ghz @ 1.328v
> [email protected] ?
> 
> 
> 
> 4.5 -- I guess that one's boring
> 4.6 -- 1.20v
> 4.7 -- 1.26v (that's 0.06 added)
> 4.8 -- 1.32v (again 0.06)
> 4.9 -- 1.38v (same)
> 5.0 -- 1.44v (same)
> 
> That's what I meant with "straight line".
Click to expand...


----------



## Darylrese

Thanks! I will try 1.44v...is that a safe voltage though for normal use? I'm using offset so it downclocks when i'm not playing games to save the added strain on the CPU.


----------



## Eastrider

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Now LappeD after DeliDded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some gold dust .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> final stage


What was the temp improvement?


----------



## skyn3t

Dunno I has been sent out to the owner. We will find out soon.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Thanks mate!
> 
> Temps are just perfect at 4.8ghz now.
> 
> I have been trying for 5.0ghz over night, went all the way up to 1.430v but PRIME95 is crashing after about 3 hours.
> 
> What sort of voltage should i be looking at for 5.0ghz if i can do 4.8ghz at 1.328v?
> 
> I'm scared to go higher than 1.4v


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Dunno I has been sent out to the owner. We will find out soon.


Why not try 4.9 first. 5.0 will suck too much volt. and yeah it will be around around 1.4.2v up for 5Ghz.


----------



## SonDa5

A little direct die mount love for a tiny mother board.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> A little direct die mount love for a tiny mother board.


It's so cute! Man I want one so bad but I still haven't finish my MVF/3770K build!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Need advice.. since I upgraded my cooling (water temps is now 1-2C over ambiant 3-5C after hours of stress testing / gaming) I decided to move on with my OCing.. was stuck at 4.4ghz and i'm now moving on

here are my findings so fare:
4.4ghz @ 1.2V 100% stable
4.5ghz @ 1.26V, stable
4.7ghz @ 1.35V stable
4.8ghz @ 1.35, 1,37 1,4 1,42 and 1.44V not stable

Did I just hit my wall at 4.7? or is there some other settings I can play with? Im only changing vcore and multiplier.. everything else is on auto..
maybe my volt jumps are too big, and I moved over the stable setting? as in too much vcore?

*edit*
I can get it to pass IBT 20 runs.. but I found that [email protected] on full will BSOD.. is [email protected] to blame? or can it actually be used as a stress tester as im doing?


----------



## Clexzor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Need advice.. since I upgraded my cooling (water temps is now 1-2C over ambiant 3-5C after hours of stress testing / gaming) I decided to move on with my OCing.. was stuck at 4.4ghz and i'm now moving on
> 
> here are my findings so fare:
> 4.4ghz @ 1.2V 100% stable
> 4.5ghz @ 1.26V, stable
> 4.7ghz @ 1.35V stable
> 4.8ghz @ 1.35, 1,37 1,4 1,42 and 1.44V not stable
> 
> Did I just hit my wall at 4.7? or is there some other settings I can play with? Im only changing vcore and multiplier.. everything else is on auto..
> maybe my volt jumps are too big, and I moved over the stable setting? as in too much vcore?
> 
> *edit*
> I can get it to pass IBT 20 runs.. but I found that [email protected] on full will BSOD.. is [email protected] to blame? or can it actually be used as a stress tester as im doing?


increase input voltage aka vccin/vrin to around 1.85-1.95 and test
also whats ur uncore at? keep it within 500mhz of ur overclock so 4.8 needs a ring bus/uncore of 4.2 and then make the ring bus/uncore voltage to maybe 1.2v and try


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clexzor*
> 
> increase input voltage aka vccin/vrin to around 1.85-1.95 and test
> also whats ur uncore at? keep it within 500mhz of ur overclock so 4.8 needs a ring bus/uncore of 4.2 and then make the ring bus/uncore voltage to maybe 1.2v and try


4.8 needs 4.2 ring? I did 4.3 as that would be within the 500 and 4.2 is 600







dont know if it matters that much? :S

Ill go back into bios and play around some more!

*Edit*
Even though it says "current vcore" is higher than what I set it to after I raised vccin, CPUID (AIDA64's CPUID) reads my core as 1.32V as set in bios (but reads higher in bios)

My 4.7 seams more stable with your tweaks.. I will move on to 4.8 now.. hopefully it will run at 1.36~

*Edit 2*
4.8 @ 1.385, instant IBT crash.. @ 1.380, passed IBT. Temps peaked at 80.
It seams Im back on track.. didnt think 0.005 could do that much of a difference
Suggestions for 4.9 and 5.0? move the ring ration up 100mhz so 500 below on all OCs, still with 1.2v ring or do I have to up that too?


----------



## GaMbi2004

I spoke too soon, crashed on 2nd IBT.. tried lowering another 0.005 resulting in no boot.. so trying 1.39V now.. seams a bit high compared to most of what I have seen posted in this thread :/


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> I also managed to get the 4.8GHz OC at 1.380v summer stable and with the ram at 2400 c9-11-11-31-1T, after the cpu delid and the performance from the 4.6GHz is increased in every test, like from 108 to 113Gflops with linx and from 9.32 to 9.80 cpu score with the cinebench
> Do you think it's 100% safe running the cpu this way 24/7? The vcore seems a bit high to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do have a nice, improved D14 cooling (fans in sig) and I'm getting a max 65°C on the hottest core while gaming
> And I'm always running my 3770K with the eist only (no other power savings), windows "balanced" profile with a 50% at min cpu perf in order to get an idle freq of 2.5Ghz, no offset
> What do you think?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Those temps and vcore are perfectly fine for running 24/7 - even if you were folding and it was sitting at (at a guess) 80C or so - although then it might be pushing things too much IMO. If by 24/7 you mean doing basically nothing for 8-12 hours a day, browsing the web for 2-3 hours per day, and *gaming hard for 6-8 hours per day*... yeah it's not going to be a problem at all. If gaming is the hardest thing you're asking of the CPU and it's only hitting 65C you're great at 1.38v... well below all of the known thresholds for Ivy.
Click to expand...

+Rep, You're close








Maybe even less gaming and definitely not everyday
Some bench / stress test occasionally









Btw, tested right now with the 3DMark Vantage, 75°C max
And a nice, *34625* Cpu score, am I in line for the 4.8?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Hmm.. Ill better give up?



4.7ghz @ 1.325V
4.8ghz @ 1.43V with temps peaking 85C
That is over 10C and 0.1V (and still not stable)

4.7 @ 1.325V should be plenty of safe for 24/7 [email protected] and gaming / videos, yes?
Thoughts?


----------



## Darylrese

I find i pass IBT with much lower voltage, but PRIME95 crashes within minutes! I am upto 1.440v for 5.0ghz and still not stable yet. Max temp is 85c

4.8ghz though i'm rock solid at 1.324v and max temp 65c so i feel for you mate. What LLC are you using? Anything other than Ultra High and my overclock hates it!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> A little direct die mount love for a tiny mother board.


Is that the Impact? I want one, it would be my first mini-mobo! The maximus V gene is the smallest I have used to date.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hmm.. Ill better give up?
> 
> 
> 
> 4.7ghz @ 1.325V
> 4.8ghz @ 1.43V with temps peaking 85C
> That is over 10C and 0.1V (and still not stable)
> 
> 4.7 @ 1.325V should be plenty of safe for 24/7 [email protected] and gaming / videos, yes?
> Thoughts?


You are using the standard setting, that will not be much of a stress test, use lots of memory if you really want to test the thing.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I find i pass IBT with much lower voltage, but PRIME95 crashes within minutes! I am upto 1.440v for 5.0ghz and still not stable yet. Max temp is 85c
> 
> 4.8ghz though i'm rock solid at 1.324v and max temp 65c so i feel for you mate. What LLC are you using? Anything other than Ultra High and my overclock hates it!


LLC? I dont know anything about this. plz do go on! is there a setting for it called "ultra high"?







and what does it do (if you know?)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Is that the Impact? I want one, it would be my first mini-mobo! The maximus V gene is the smallest I have used to date.
> You are using the standard setting, that will not be much of a stress test, use lots of memory if you really want to test the thing.


are you sure? I mean yea, sure.. there might be more complications if RAM is utilized to the max at the same time.. but the stress to the CPU would still be the same, wouldnt it?
I normaly test my RAM with memtest86 for about 24 hours.. so I dont feel like I need further testing on RAM









*Edit*
Ooh.. just startet IBT with max ram usage.. it seams the CPU draws data from the ram to stress test?
A 20 run with 16 gig is gonna take some time -_-
I will post back once it is done








380 sec pr run, lol


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> +Rep, You're close
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe even less gaming and definitely not everyday
> Some bench / stress test occasionally
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Btw, tested right now with the 3DMark Vantage, 75°C max
> And a nice, *34625* Cpu score, am I in line for the 4.8?


You could definitely get to 4.8 or even higher... but probably not for 24/7 use. You'll start needing better cooling soon at that point (although it does depend on the chip a great deal). However, if you want to just get into Windows to get a CPU-Z validation then you can easily go higher (my chip is absolute crap, but just for grins I got my validation at 4.9GHz - unfortunately it takes so much vCore to hit it that 5.0 isn't possible even for validation on this CPU):



I'm starting the buy and return cycle now for a new chip... since I'm perfectly fine at 4.7GHz for daily use I can take my time until I come up with a 4.5GHz at ~1.0V chip... or at least close to it.







(I don't have good enough cooling on my test bench to hit top OC while it's lidded most likely... but if I can see 4.5 at ~1v then I figure it's worth the investment to go further with it in my main rig).


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> LLC? I dont know anything about this. plz do go on! is there a setting for it called "ultra high"?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and what does it do (if you know?)
> are you sure? I mean yea, sure.. there might be more complications if RAM is utilized to the max at the same time.. but the stress to the CPU would still be the same, wouldnt it?
> I normaly test my RAM with memtest86 for about 24 hours.. so I dont feel like I need further testing on RAM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Edit*
> Ooh.. just startet IBT with max ram usage.. it seams the CPU draws data from the ram to stress test?
> A 20 run with 16 gig is gonna take some time -_-
> I will post back once it is done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 380 sec pr run, lol


Stability testing in windows does have to include the memory, memtest86 is an error checking program & not for testing a memory overclock, it can test memory all day & find no errors if the kit isn't defective, but when in windows it could fail because of the memory in minutes.


----------



## Darylrese

LLC = Load Line Calibration and is effectively Vdroop. It will add / lower voltage on your CPU under stress. For example, my 4.8ghz overclock will mainly run at 1.328v under load, however because of vdroop, it often goes as low as 1.308v and flickers between the two.

On ASUS motherboards, its located in the main overclocking options. Not sure where it is or what its called on MSI boards but it does make the difference between a stable overclock and a not stable one on my system.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> You could definitely get to 4.8 or even higher... but probably not for 24/7 use. You'll start needing better cooling soon at that point (although it does depend on the chip a great deal). However, if you want to just get into Windows to get a CPU-Z validation then you can easily go higher (my chip is absolute crap, but just for grins I got my validation at 4.9GHz - unfortunately it takes so much vCore to hit it that 5.0 isn't possible even for validation on this CPU):
> 
> I'm starting the buy and return cycle now for a new chip... since I'm perfectly fine at 4.7GHz for daily use I can take my time until I come up with a 4.5GHz at ~1.0V chip... or at least close to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I don't have good enough cooling on my test bench to hit top OC while it's lidded most likely... but if I can see 4.5 at ~1v then I figure it's worth the investment to go further with it in my main rig).


Im probably gonna stay on 4.7 for daily use







but woudnt mind having a validation too








I doubt I can get much better cooling unless I go sub zero







check my build log if you wanna see it








Just "finished" it yesterday








Im delidded (ofc) and going to lap the IHS soon.. probably wont help that much, but every C counts !
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Stability testing in windows does have to include the memory, memtest86 is an error checking program & not for testing a memory overclock, it can test memory all day & find no errors if the kit isn't defective, but when in windows it could fail because of the memory in minutes.


I crashed after using all 16 gigs of ram. so I see your point









I think I found that LLC setting lets see if that helped


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> LLC = Load Line Calibration and is effectively Vdroop. It will add / lower voltage on your CPU under stress. For example, my 4.8ghz overclock will mainly run at 1.328v under load, however because of vdroop, it often goes as low as 1.308v and flickers between the two.
> 
> On ASUS motherboards, its located in the main overclocking options. Not sure where it is or what its called on MSI boards but it does make the difference between a stable overclock and a not stable one on my system.


I think I found it..

CPU Core Voltage Offset Mode (+)
and
CPU Core Voltage Offset (+0.200)

does that sound right?


----------



## Loktar Ogar

I think the LLC for MSI Boards are the 50%-75% -100% settings...


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I think I found it..
> 
> CPU Core Voltage Offset Mode (+)
> and
> CPU Core Voltage Offset (+0.200)
> 
> does that sound right?


The offset isn't the same as LLC, they are 2 different ways of achieving the same goal though. On MSI mobos the LLC is called vdroop offset control.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> The offset isn't the same as LLC, they are 2 different ways of achieving the same goal though. On MSI mobos the LLC is called vdroop offset control.


hmm.. will take another look.
Im having problems with reading my vcore though







CPUZ shows the same as i specify in bios, it never changes.. and AIDA64 does change, but only +/- 0.002
Is that correct? and if so, is it enough to worrie about?


----------



## GaMbi2004

had to raise vcore 0.01 to get it stable.. will do some prime 95 over night to make sure.. but it looks okay for now.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> hmm.. will take another look.
> Im having problems with reading my vcore though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPUZ shows the same as i specify in bios, it never changes.. and AIDA64 does change, but only +/- 0.002
> Is that correct? and if so, is it enough to worrie about?


CPU-Z 1.65.x does that, either use 1.64.0 or something else like HWInfo.


----------



## El Media Vida




----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*


wood blocks


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> wood blocks


It's a safe it method? what are the complications that could i have?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> It's a safe it method? what are the complications that could i have?


it could become a rouge chip and go flying.... unless you put a towel up


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it could become a rouge chip and go flying.... unless you put a towel up


...which is not the same as 'throwing in the towel'







I did use a towel for the razor method when delidding my 3770K - for the blood, as you may recall


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Is that the Impact? I want one.


Yes. Hope to have it up and running ASAP.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Yes. Hope to have it up and running ASAP.


Looks like they just arrived at NCIX at the warehouse here, haven't gone out to the stores yet. I will have to get one!


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it could become a rouge chip and go flying.... unless you put a towel up


Not really, I can put a 3" nail with one hit trust me I know it







so smooth hit and hard hit is all about experience.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...which is not the same as 'throwing in the towel'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did use a towel for the razor method when delidding my 3770K - for the blood, as you may recall


don't lose your finger or have a half finger print









PS: I just got the Gelid GC extreme I will test it with my next delid work on 4770k


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> +Rep, You're close
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe even less gaming and definitely not everyday
> Some bench / stress test occasionally
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Btw, tested right now with the 3DMark Vantage, 75°C max
> And a nice, *34625* Cpu score, am I in line for the 4.8?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You could definitely get to 4.8 or even higher... but probably not for 24/7 use. You'll start needing better cooling soon at that point (although it does depend on the chip a great deal). However, if you want to just get into Windows to get a CPU-Z validation then you can easily go higher (my chip is absolute crap, but just for grins I got my validation at 4.9GHz - unfortunately it takes so much vCore to hit it that 5.0 isn't possible even for validation on this CPU):
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm starting the buy and return cycle now for a new chip... since I'm perfectly fine at 4.7GHz for daily use I can take my time until I come up with a 4.5GHz at ~1.0V chip... or at least close to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I don't have good enough cooling on my test bench to hit top OC while it's lidded most likely... but if I can see 4.5 at ~1v then I figure it's worth the investment to go further with it in my main rig).
Click to expand...

Did a quick (first) shot at 5GHz @1.5v, llc extreme, it seems ok with the super pi 1M








I can live with this cpu









http://valid.canardpc.com/2895276



Gonna try a 32M of SuperPi

Edit:
No way, the 32M will definitely require more vcore, got a nice, 124 bsod


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Whats the rough estimate on the temps I should be expecting from a delidded 4770k @ stock speeds and an H100i cooler (fans set up in push @ 100% speed)?

Room temperature is ~19C if that helps.


----------



## Darylrese

You normally get around 20c drop in load temps as a rule, idle temps will stay the same!


----------



## Eastrider

When my CLU arrives (if it ever does... damn, it's been a whole week) I'll hand out my delid join from.

And in case anyone is interested, I can test how a watercooled, delided CPU behaves at 34ºC ambient, given where I live


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Eastrider*
> 
> When my CLU arrives (if it ever does... damn, it's been a whole week) I'll hand out my delid join from.
> 
> And in case anyone is interested, I can test how a watercooled, delided CPU behaves at 34ºC ambient, given where I live










those ambient temps though... icky!


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Want to delid after having got a Phanteks PH-TC14PE, temps over 90C running Prime at 4.5Ghz with 1.26v. Is delidding likely to fix my problem? Or should I try something else? I've always had bad temps, idles at 50C no matter what cooler I have on it.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> Want to delid after having got a Phanteks PH-TC14PE, temps over 90C running Prime at 4.5Ghz with 1.26v. Is delidding likely to fix my problem? Or should I try something else? I've always had bad temps, idles at 50C no matter what cooler I have on it.


Do you mean it's jumping up to 50c for a moment while on the desktop doing nothing? Or is it 50c all the time? If it's 50c all the time, something else is wrong for you. It should be about 5c over your room temperature most of the time when idle. You have to research what you are doing wrong before thinking of delidding.


----------



## GaMbi2004

agree.. if it is idle 50C.. do you got [email protected] running or anything? what is CPU usage when 50?

The temps over 90 at load is normal before delid.. but the idle seams really hight! do you know your ambient?


----------



## Cookybiscuit

CPU usage is basically 0, a few percent used up by EVGA LED controller but thats it. Even at idle putting the CPU fans up all the way doesn't drop it below 45 or so. Live in the UK so ambients are pretty cool, been idling hot for ages so I don't think its high ambients throwing it off.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> Whats the rough estimate on the temps I should be expecting from a delidded 4770k @ stock speeds and an H100i cooler (fans set up in push @ 100% speed)?
> Room temperature is ~19C if that helps.


Depends on stock voltage, and depends MASSIVELY on how you test.

With silver arrow @1.1v no delid - x264* or some stress test that doesn't use avx, ~35c above ambient, avx2 linpack, 55-60c or so above ambient

*To clarify, x264 uses and benefits heavily from AVX. It just doesn't run pretty much entirely AVX code and blow up the CPU like linpack does

The 20c that people quote when delidded is probably taking like 80c < 60c most of the time, if your CPU is 25c above room temp, delid can't drop it to 5c above

You should be able to push like 1.4-1.45v in x264 or any real program if you want to.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> Whats the rough estimate on the temps I should be expecting from a delidded 4770k @ stock speeds and an H100i cooler (fans set up in push @ 100% speed)?
> Room temperature is ~19C if that helps.


I run delidded 4770k @ stock speed with h100i, CLP on die and MX-2 on IHS. When running at 3.9GHZ at all cores (enhanced turbo boost which gives me 1.244V), they have max temp of 63,63,64,62°C - fans at quiet [email protected] My ambient temp is 23-24 °C


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> CPU usage is basically 0, a few percent used up by EVGA LED controller but thats it. Even at idle putting the CPU fans up all the way doesn't drop it below 45 or so. Live in the UK so ambients are pretty cool, been idling hot for ages so I don't think its high ambients throwing it off.


Well, no idea what to say. I pretty much don't need the CPU fans running at all on the desktop, also using a large two-tower style air cooler. Temperatures stay around 10c over room temperature just from the case fans.

You might have failed seriously in mounting the cooler, but what doesn't fit is that your prime95 temperatures look alright.

You have to look at how your case is set up maybe. In general, it's perhaps a good idea to have the case fans add up to about as much air moving as what you have on the CPU cooler. If you don't have that, perhaps move one of the two 140mm fans on the Phanteks somewhere else.

You also didn't say anything about what exactly your CPU is. i5 or i7? i5 is 10c cooler for things like prime95. Ivy Bridge 3570k/3770k or Haswell 4670k/4770k?

Perhaps you look at the wrong temperature reading in whatever program you use or that program is off?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> CPU usage is basically 0, a few percent used up by EVGA LED controller but thats it. Even at idle putting the CPU fans up all the way doesn't drop it below 45 or so. Live in the UK so ambients are pretty cool, been idling hot for ages so I don't think its high ambients throwing it off.


Do you have the power saving stuff enabled? EIST, C1E, C3, and C6? It sounds like they might be disabled if your idle is that high with reasonable load temps.


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> I run delidded 4770k @ stock speed with h100i, CLP on die and MX-2 on IHS. When running at 3.9GHZ at all cores (enhanced turbo boost which gives me 1.244V), they have max temp of 63,63,64,62°C - fans at quiet [email protected] My ambient temp is 23-24 °C


Do you have any idea of your room temperature? I assume I should be only slightly above room temp when my CPU usage is at 0%.

I'm delidded, but not impressed with my temps. I'm wondering if I should reseat my IHS and cooler.


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Well, no idea what to say. I pretty much don't need the CPU fans running at all on the desktop, also using a large two-tower style air cooler. Temperatures stay around 10c over room temperature just from the case fans.
> 
> You might have failed seriously in mounting the cooler, but what doesn't fit is that your prime95 temperatures look alright.
> 
> You have to look at how your case is set up maybe. In general, it's perhaps a good idea to have the case fans add up to about as much air moving as what you have on the CPU cooler. If you don't have that, perhaps move one of the two 140mm fans on the Phanteks somewhere else.
> 
> You also didn't say anything about what exactly your CPU is. i5 or i7? i5 is 10c cooler for things like prime95. Ivy Bridge 3570k/3770k or Haswell 4670k/4770k?
> 
> Perhaps you look at the wrong temperature reading in whatever program you use or that program is off?


i5 3570K. I have 2 120mm intakes, 2 140mm exhausts, and another 1 120mm exhaust, though everything but the 120mm exhaust is off when the system is idling, including CPU fans (which might explain some of it). I've mounted it 4 times so I'd probably get it right atleast once, tried it with AS-5 and the Phanteks compound. Monitoring temps with Speedfan (temps for each core), temps are exactly the same in RealTemp and HWinfo.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Do you have the power saving stuff enabled? EIST, C1E, C3, and C6? It sounds like they might be disabled if your idle is that high with reasonable load temps.


I'm not sure about the specifics but I have Intel Turbo Boost disabled and using a fixed voltage, doing so because I heard it provides better stability. Seems to be true so far, I used to need alot more voltage to reach 4.5.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> Do you have any idea of your room temperature? I assume I should be only slightly above room temp when my CPU usage is at 0%.
> 
> I'm delidded, but not impressed with my temps. I'm wondering if I should reseat my IHS and cooler.


Ambient temp is my room temp. As I said - 23-24°C. Max temp is tested by prime95 @ 8K test


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Ambient temp is my room temp. As I said - 23-24°C. Max temp is tested by prime95 @ 8K test


Oh yes, my bad. I thought you were stating Idle temps


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> they have max temp of 63,63,64,62°C


Again, it depends what you're testing with, there's a gap as high as 25 or 30c between full load in some applications and full load on others in Haswell which makes temp info worthless unless you specify exactly what you're testing with


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Again, it depends what you're testing with, there's a gap as high as 25 or 30c between full load in some applications and full load on others in Haswell which makes temp info worthless unless you specify exactly what you're testing with


prime95 8K (said in the next post) and later 32K run in place. I always test it like that. Of course I wouldnt state max temp just from using some everyday app.


----------



## illuz

Got my new chip and board running last night, direct-die again.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> prime95 8K (said in the next post) and later 32K run in place. I always test it like that. Of course I wouldnt state max temp just from using some everyday app.


But avx loads give unrealistic max temps, compared to previous CPU's


----------



## Darylrese

So...i have pretty much given up on 5.0ghz.

PRIME95 still runs fine, no errors atall after 12hours 1.448v but in event viewer there are a handful of WHEA-LOGGER errors. Its annoying me!

Any ideas? More voltage needed? Im a bit concerned voltage is getting a bit high now seen as 4.8ghz only needs 1.324v


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> So...i have pretty much given up on 5.0ghz.
> 
> PRIME95 still runs fine, no errors atall after 12hours 1.448v but in event viewer there are a handful of WHEA-LOGGER errors. Its annoying me!
> 
> Any ideas? More voltage needed? Im a bit concerned voltage is getting a bit high now seen as 4.8ghz only needs 1.324v


Tweak memory timings and memory voltage and CPU voltage related to memory over clocking.


----------



## Darylrese

My memory is running totally stock mate


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> My memory is running totally stock mate


That means you can loosen it up. Tweak voltage. Play around with it. I under clocked my GSKILL 2400MHZ CL9 kit by loosening up timings and lowering ram voltage and 4770k more stable at over clocked speed.


----------



## Darylrese

Ok cool cheers. I don't think an extra 200mhz on my CPU is worth under-clocking my memory so i think ill settle with 4.8ghz for now, appreciate the help


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> i5 3570K. I have 2 120mm intakes, 2 140mm exhausts, and another 1 120mm exhaust, though everything but the 120mm exhaust is off when the system is idling, including CPU fans (which might explain some of it). I've mounted it 4 times so I'd probably get it right atleast once, tried it with AS-5 and the Phanteks compound. Monitoring temps with Speedfan (temps for each core), temps are exactly the same in RealTemp and HWinfo.
> 
> I'm not sure about the specifics but I have Intel Turbo Boost disabled and using a fixed voltage, doing so because I heard it provides better stability. Seems to be true so far, I used to need alot more voltage to reach 4.5.


Maybe you should consider to increase to ~ 700-900rpm all your case & cpu fans (even with the Speedfan), especially the two Phanteks cooler fans first of all
Second I'd change to all intakes (except for the one on the rear) the fans of the case
And third, yes, deliding your cpu will improve the idle temps too









One last thing, even with the fixed vcore you should try to use the Eist (Enhanced Intel Speedstep) only like I do, lowering the idle freq will also help improoving the idle coretemp









My idle & net browsing temps and cpu cooler fan speeds (4.8GHz, delided):


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> So...i have pretty much given up on 5.0ghz.
> 
> PRIME95 still runs fine, no errors atall after 12hours 1.448v but in event viewer there are a handful of WHEA-LOGGER errors. Its annoying me!
> 
> Any ideas? More voltage needed? Im a bit concerned voltage is getting a bit high now seen as 4.8ghz only needs 1.324v


Are you using offset for overclocking? If yes, try a lower LLC setting and increasing offset to get back to those 1.448v while prime95 is running.


----------



## Darylrese

I am indeed using offset, with ultra high LLC. When PRIME95 is running, it does stay at 1.448v already more or less. I will try changing them round though, thanks


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I am indeed using offset, with ultra high LLC. When PRIME95 is running, it does stay at 1.448v already more or less. I will try changing them round though, thanks


For me at 4.8ghz, when running fixed, it needs 1.34v and best is the second highest LLC setting. If using offset with the same LLC setting, it wants something like 1.37v for all WHEA-Logger warnings to disappear. I can tweak that a little with turning LLC down (a lot). The max voltage HWINFO records will be pretty high but I can have it run prime95 at around those 1.34v with no WHEA warnings in the event viewer.


----------



## Darylrese

OK cool so reduce LLC and increase voltage to counteract? Ill give it a go. Last time i reduced LLC it became unstable much sooner.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Ok cool cheers. I don't think an extra 200mhz on my CPU is worth under-clocking my memory so i think ill settle with 4.8ghz for now, appreciate the help


I'd keep LLC up, or at like second highest setting. You probably just need more vcore. 0.12v or less for 200mhz once you're cliffed isn't a really insane amount, it's high, but not unusual


----------



## Valgaur

Horray... move in day at college again.... barely fit the dewar for LN2 stuff in my passenger seat put a tshirt on it. looks like a human being weirds me out a bit









Also hope you guys don't mind me changing my avatar saw this one and couldn't pass it up


----------



## cestessr

OCN Name/ cestessr
CPU/3770k
TIM Gelid Extreme on die and ihs
OC after delid/5.1 GHz
Temp 20 degrees C. avarage temp 79.5c @5.28 vcore
200MHz gain
http://valid.canardpc.com/2895424


----------



## Big Texas

Got myself a stable OC at 4.5 ghz 1.23v core/4.2 ghz uncore 1.155v 1.820v vccin 2400 mhz ram @1.65v.

i MIGHT be able to drop the volts a bit more, didn't toy with it yet.

IBT jacks it up to ~90*C.

my h100i isnt mounted perfectly but pretty decently (backplate issues)

so tempted to delid but i'm gonna be using this system for years...do you guys think ~4.7 ghz is within range if i was to delid? that would make it worth it for me.

and what percentile would you guys rank this chip? i think its decent, but would like opinions


----------



## Forceman

Sounds like you are pretty much temp limited, which would make you a good candidate for a delid. 1.23V @ 4.5 gives you a lot of voltage headroom for 4.7 if you can bring the temps down.


----------



## Big Texas

ran through 2 cinebench runs...tweaked some things, gonna test for stability

unbelievably scared to delid though lol

EDIT: Played crysis 2, got a bsod. Dropped VCCIN and i passed 5 cinebench runs. cooool


----------



## Cyro999

Try a lot lower VIN. ~1.75 works best for me at ~1.25vcore. Less for less.

Percentile? Very hard to say, since very few of the people reporting haswell voltages know how to set VRIN etc and stuff like io voltages if they need them so generally seem to be using too much volts, some of them far too much, but better than 30-65% of chips i guess


----------



## Big Texas

Z87 gd65 isn't letting me go below 1.8vrin oddly


----------



## Gurkburk

Just tested a little overclocking once again just to see if it wouldnt get my that 100mhz higher and it didnt..

My 4770k is probably destined to be at 4.6ghz and not higher







Tested 4.7ghz at 1.460V, not sure how much higher i can go, but its a .100V higher than 4.6ghz so prolly not worth it in the end either way.

Now I'm running adaptivemode with maxV 1.360 and it's working so far i think. Before i could boot up i got some RAM errors about volt 0x50 and 1A. Not sure what to think about that.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Big Texas*
> 
> 
> 
> ran through 2 cinebench runs...tweaked some things, gonna test for stability
> 
> unbelievably scared to delid though lol
> 
> EDIT: Played crysis 2, got a bsod. Dropped VCCIN and i passed 5 cinebench runs. cooool


That's a nice comparison of the two 3° gen and 4° gen occed i7, I'm having the 2400 G.Skill as well
Got a similar cpu score at 4.8GHz, that's 300Mhz higher than your 4770K











Btw, I got scared to delid too, than I finally decided to use the hammer & vice
Simply use a nice, solid vice and put some tape on the jaws, you'll be surprised how simple and safe is


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cestessr*
> 
> OCN Name/ cestessr
> CPU/3770k
> TIM Gelid Extreme on die and ihs
> OC after delid/5.1 GHz
> Temp 20 degrees C. avarage temp 79.5c @5.28 vcore
> 200MHz gain
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2895424


You're in!







looks like you got that direct mount issue fixed as well! Very nicely done and good chip sir.

ALSO!!!!

On my story of my return of my fully KNOWN delidded Ivy to Intel I have gotten my replacement and they accepted it giving me my refund in cash as well! Keep those IHS's pretty boys and girls!


----------



## Cyro999

Wow


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illuz*
> 
> Got my new chip and board running last night, direct-die again.


"Direct-die again"? What happened last time?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> On my story of my return of my fully KNOWN delidded Ivy to Intel I have gotten my replacement and they accepted it giving me my refund in cash as well! Keep those IHS's pretty boys and girls!


Did they ask you to glue the IHS back on?

Also are you sure this hasn't anything to do with the overclocker's insurance plan?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> "Direct-die again"? What happened last time?
> Did they ask you to glue the IHS back on?
> 
> Also are you sure this hasn't anything to do with the overclocker's insurance plan?


Nope the delid was covered by normal warranty! no insurance plan needed. I glued my IHS back on to make it easier for them.


----------



## Big Texas

Wait...so delidding is 100% safe now? They just take it back if you break it?


----------



## GaMbi2004

sounds too good to be true









In witch case.. if my CPU broke, I would buy a new one, take the IHS off and glue it to the broken one.. (witch has a lapped IHS soon)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Big Texas*
> 
> Wait...so delidding is 100% safe now? They just take it back if you break it?


awhile back about 2 weeks ago i posted the chat log and he fully understood that it was delidded. he took it no problem and he said to me.

"As long as the numbers on the IHS match with the number on the bottom of the chip PCB your in warranty"

I take that as Intel going we know they run hot, so your good.

*RESULTS MAY VARY*

**JUST A REMINDER IS ALL**


----------



## Darylrese

Please can i be added to the club?

i7 3770k, 4.8ghz 1.328v, max temp 66c, 24c temp drop after delidding.


----------



## Big Texas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Please can i be added to the club?
> 
> i7 3770k, 4.8ghz 1.328v, max temp 66c, 24c temp drop after delidding.


damn. sweet results. gonna push harder?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Please can i be added to the club?
> 
> i7 3770k, 4.8ghz 1.328v, max temp 66c, 24c temp drop after delidding.


You're in!









*I NEED YOUR TIM AND MHZ GAINED IF POSSIBLE* (sorry caps make it easier for people to notice)


----------



## Darylrese

Oh yeh sorry mate, TIM was CLU on die and IC Diamond on IHS, mhz gained is 200mhz cheers

And yeh i have been trying for 5.0ghz, problem is PRIME95 runs for 12hours at 1.448v but i get WHEA-LOGGER errors. I don't really know what to do, dont want to keep going higher and higher with voltage, need to know whats safe first. Max temp for 5.0ghz at that voltage was 86c

Strange i can get 4.8ghz at 1.328v but cant get 5.0ghz at 1.448v!...my LLC setting means my voltage fluctuates a fair bit, its possibly causing it to dip too low, will have to test with different LLC and voltage settings...


----------



## illuz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> "Direct-die again"? What happened last time?
> Did they ask you to glue the IHS back on?
> 
> Also are you sure this hasn't anything to do with the overclocker's insurance plan?


New board and chip mate, last one was direct die too.

Good news on the warranty too!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Oh yeh sorry mate, TIM was CLU on die and IC Diamond on IHS, mhz gained is 200mhz cheers
> 
> And yeh i have been trying for 5.0ghz, problem is PRIME95 runs for 12hours at 1.448v but i get WHEA-LOGGER errors. I don't really know what to do, dont want to keep going higher and higher with voltage, need to know whats safe first. Max temp for 5.0ghz at that voltage was 86c
> 
> Strange i can get 4.8ghz at 1.328v but cant get 5.0ghz at 1.448v!...my LLC setting means my voltage fluctuates a fair bit, its possibly causing it to dip too low, will have to test with different LLC and voltage settings...


I got you updated!


----------



## El Media Vida

Hi guys, i have a question, why most users do delid to the 3770K? Can it be done to the 3570K?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Hi guys, i have a question, why most users do delid to the 3770K? Can it be done to the 3570K


Yes, a lot of people have delidded 3570k, the 3770k was just more popular.


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Yes, a lot of people have delidded 3570k, the 3770k was just more popular.


Why? I mean, is it worthy to do it 3570K?, i want do OC at 4.5 or more, obviously with water cooling.


----------



## GaMbi2004

they are the same when considering gain in temps.. 3770k was / is more popular since it is i7 and not i5 as 3570k









"worth it" hehe







you are in the delidding thread.. im sure everyone in here would think that it is.

if you need to OC and your temps gets too high, it is totally worth it
I doubt you will see reasonable temps at 4.5 or higher without a dilidding, even with WC,

Go for it!
It is not that hard! most of the info is on the main page, but feel free to ask any questions here if you are in doubt!

Good luck!


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> they are the same when considering gain in temps.. 3770k was / is more popular since it is i7 and not i5 as 3570k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "worth it" hehe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you are in the delidding thread.. im sure everyone in here would think that it is.
> 
> if you need to OC and your temps gets too high, it is totally worth it
> I doubt you will see reasonable temps at 4.5 or higher without a dilidding, even with WC,
> 
> Go for it!
> It is not that hard! most of the info is on the main page, but feel free to ask any questions here if you are in doubt!
> 
> Good luck!


Thanks bro, you what method did use it? vice or razor?


----------



## FtW 420

It is still worthwhile for a 3570k, if you are hitting a temperature wall where you don't want to push the voltage any higher for a higher overclock, delidding can drop the temps & open up a bit more headroom.

3770k vs. 3570k is a personal choice for people, for hardcore gamers who play games that never use more than 4 ores & threads, 3570k being cheaper in price made it an easy choice. Guys who do use multithread will pay a bit more for the extra threads that speed things up.

The 3770k are generally binned higher than 3570k too, for guys looking to get 5Ghz stable or have better chances at running 2666 or 2800mhz memory, it was easier to find a 3770k that could do it. Luck is always part of it, but there are just more high clocking 3770k out there than 3570k.


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It is still worthwhile for a 3570k, if you are hitting a temperature wall where you don't want to push the voltage any higher for a higher overclock, delidding can drop the temps & open up a bit more headroom.
> 
> 3770k vs. 3570k is a personal choice for people, for hardcore gamers who play games that never use more than 4 ores & threads, 3570k being cheaper in price made it an easy choice. Guys who do use multithread will pay a bit more for the extra threads that speed things up.
> 
> The 3770k are generally binned higher than 3570k too, for guys looking to get 5Ghz stable or have better chances at running 2666 or 2800mhz memory, it was easier to find a 3770k that could do it. Luck is always part of it, but there are just more high clocking 3770k out there than 3570k.


Actually i'll buy the cpu but, i don't choose yet, if 3770K or 3570K, i consider myself gamer. For that reason i think is most convenient get the 3570K. I have a 8GB of ram at 2400MHz.


----------



## FtW 420

If you never really use the hyperthreading feature the 3570k is a good choice. Some games are starting to be able use more cores but only a couple (as far as I know), it will likely be a slow change so the 3570k should be good for a long time yet.


----------



## alancsalt

If you are crazy for Crysis3, Civ 5, chess games, or do video/audio de/encoding, then maybe.......



http://techreport.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=86637


----------



## Cookybiscuit

I find it unbelievable that Intel still honours warranty after delid, thats amazing. I wonder if that would be the same if someone tried to return it through the store.

I guess if you use CLU, it would just stick anyway and they wouldn't even know?


----------



## skyn3t

Question for all you guys.

Do you know what thermal compound is used under the IHS on the 2500k chip?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Question for all you guys.
> 
> Do you know what thermal compound is used under the IHS on the 2500k chip?


It is soldered on, no TIM on Sandy.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> It is soldered on, no TIM on Sandy.


My question was just for curiosity. I just delidded a 25k today. I will post pics with details in a sec









here is a quick sneak peek





the rest is here
Yeah , 2500k get naked and stripped


----------



## Cyro999

You.. Why?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You.. Why?


who? why?!


----------



## Cyro999

I mean, why would you delid a 2500k









Temp changes?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I mean, why would you delid a 2500k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temp changes?


a lot 4.9 top temp 55c


----------



## Master__Shake

so a sandy was not soldered??

how can this be?


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Master__Shake*
> 
> so a sandy was not soldered??
> 
> how can this be?


they decide to went cheap. but the good side is we still can remove the IHS and change it.


----------



## rickyman0319

I am wondering if I can just put the bottom without the top cover and use the h80i or not.


----------



## Master__Shake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> they decide to went cheap. but the good side is we still can remove the IHS and change it.


i thought it was widely believed that ivy was the first one to be tim and not solder?

was this not the case with all 1155 sandys?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Master__Shake*
> 
> so a sandy was not soldered??
> 
> how can this be?
> 
> 
> 
> they decide to went cheap. but the good side is we still can remove the IHS and change it.
Click to expand...

It was soldered looking at your own picture. That's metal, isn't it? But I'm only seeing the picture. You're the one who has seen it in person.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> It was soldered looking at your own picture. That's metal, isn't it? But I'm only seeing the picture. You're the one who has seen it in person.


it is fluxless solder a bit different than normal solder. but still darn good TIM but wondering what the TIM changes gained or loss? TELL ME SKY!


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it is fluxless solder a bit different than normal solder. but still darn good TIM but wondering what the TIM changes gained or loss? TELL ME SKY!


The Gelid Extreme GC droped almost 9c on that chip it idles at 32c and mx temp is 55c. I don't have it in hands now but IIRC the top temp at 4.7 was 64c to 68c

I will going to search the old temp pic's and post it here

edited my mistake the temp was not that high

here the old temp 4.7 @ 1.368v top temp was 64c

so after delid it i gained -0.032 actual voltage at 4.9 is 1.336v and 200Mhz and droped 9c on top so it is a huge improvement.



Edited the wrong info


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Why? I mean, is it worthy to do it 3570K?, i want do OC at 4.5 or more, obviously with water cooling.


I haven't had a single 3570K (I've had about 5 of them) that couldn't hit 4.5GHz as it is... and many of them were on air. So on that note - unless you get one that requires a ton of voltage to hit 4.5GHz you don't _have_ to delid. On the other hand, more than half of mine were heat limited at that value... and even the best one at 4.7GHz on water (peak temps ~92C). So as far as temps are concerned I can't see any Ivy Bridge CPU not benefiting from delidding. As to whether that helps with the OC or not is dependent on the chip itself. None of mine would have ever gotten higher than 4.7GHz without requiring more than 1.52v Vcore so I only delidded one of them and the rest I've either sold or put in regular builds at near stock speeds.

However, if you look in the 5GHz thread... there are obviously some very good 3570K's out there - just not any that were ever in my possession.

By the same token, I've never had a 3770K that wouldn't do at least 4.8GHz - including the disaster in my main rig which couldn't do 5GHz even with 1.56v - but runs 4.7GHz @ 1.42v without going over 70C after the delid (on max IBT runs even).







My new one will do 4.7 _on air_ with only 1.28v - lidded - so I can wait to uncap it and get it under water.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It is still worthwhile for a 3570k, if you are hitting a temperature wall where you don't want to push the voltage any higher for a higher overclock, delidding can drop the temps & open up a bit more headroom.
> 
> 3770k vs. 3570k is a personal choice for people, for hardcore gamers who play games that never use more than 4 ores & threads, 3570k being cheaper in price made it an easy choice. Guys who do use multithread will pay a bit more for the extra threads that speed things up.
> 
> The 3770k are generally binned higher than 3570k too, for guys looking to get 5Ghz stable or have better chances at running 2666 or 2800mhz memory, it was easier to find a 3770k that could do it. Luck is always part of it, but there are just more high clocking 3770k out there than 3570k.


This completely. In my experience, the same clocks will require up to .15v more on a 3570K SKU than they do on a 3770K - but I've purchased them at varying times so that's really not definitive in any way. One thing I will say is my very latest 3770Ks were all very close in peak temps across the cores - so I'm wondering if Intel didn't tweak their TIM & glue assembly process slightly after reading this thread.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> It was soldered looking at your own picture. That's metal, isn't it? But I'm only seeing the picture. You're the one who has seen it in person.


Yep that's solder alright. I guess the biggest fear I would have with SB is that has to put more shearing force on the die than the TIM does... I'd want to see a longer timeframe to be sure there were issues with die cracking on that like the two Haswell delids - although I think it's pretty safe to assume those were either loading pressures or temp related. Still breaking solder is a bigger deal.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> the tim on the sandy is crappy too. The Gelid Extreme GC droped almost 30c on that chip it idles at 32c and mx temp is 55c. I don't have it in hands now but IIRC the top temp at 4.7 was 78C to 83c
> 
> I will going to search the old temp pic's and post it here
> 
> edited my mistake the temp was not that high
> 
> here the old temp 4.7 @ 1.368v top temp was 64c
> 
> so after delid it i gained -0.032 actual voltage at 4.9 is 1.336v and 200Mhz and droped 9c on top so it is a huge improvement.


How did you clean the solder off the die and IHS? Not like wiping it with alcohol is going to do much (or at least I would think so). Did you heat and wick or ??? Good job on just plowing ahead on that... I assume you figured it would result in a dead chip initially?


----------



## Krullmeister

Okay, so I'm gonna help my friend delid his 4670k, however I have a small question. Do you need to put some electrical tape, regular tim or some other non conductive material over the VRM's? I've seen people do it without it as well as with various compounds. Which would be best?


----------



## Leyaena

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Krullmeister*
> 
> Okay, so I'm gonna help my friend delid his 4670k, however I have a small question. Do you need to put some electrical tape, regular tim or some other non conductive material over the VRM's? I've seen people do it without it as well as with various compounds. Which would be best?


It's pretty simple:

- If the TIM you use on the die is conductive (CLU and CLP, for example), you will *have* to put something over the VRM's to protect them (everything you mentioned would work fine), or risk frying the chip by shorting out the VRM's if/when the on-die TIM pumps out.

- if the TIM is non-conductive, I wouldn't worry too much about covering up the VRM's, even if it does pump out, it won't be able to do any damage.

As always, for best results, use Coollaboratory Liquid Pro (CLP) or Liquid Ultra (CLU) on-die.


----------



## Darylrese

I have finally got 5.0ghz stable after a 10hour PRIME95 test woohoo! 1.448v - 1.454v fluctuating due to offset voltage but mainly staying on 1.448v. No more WHEA-LOGGER errors.

Tax temps: *77, 83, 84, 78* ...is this good?

Will 1.448v degrade my chip or is it fairly safe? The CPU idles at around 1.018v when not in use so will only be at 1.448v when gaming or under stress.


----------



## Krullmeister

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Leyaena*
> 
> It's pretty simple:
> 
> - If the TIM you use on the die is conductive (CLU and CLP, for example), you will *have* to put something over the VRM's to protect them (everything you mentioned would work fine), or risk frying the chip by shorting out the VRM's if/when the on-die TIM pumps out.
> 
> - if the TIM is non-conductive, I wouldn't worry too much about covering up the VRM's, even if it does pump out, it won't be able to do any damage.
> 
> As always, for best results, use Coollaboratory Liquid Pro (CLP) or Liquid Ultra (CLU) on-die.


Thanks, that's exactly what I needed to know! +rep!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I have finally got 5.0ghz stable after a 10hour PRIME95 test woohoo! 1.448v - 1.454v fluctuating due to offset voltage but mainly staying on 1.448v. No more WHEA-LOGGER errors.
> 
> Tax temps: *77, 83, 84, 78* ...is this good?
> 
> Will 1.448v degrade my chip or is it fairly safe? The CPU idles at around 1.018v when not in use so will only be at 1.448v when gaming or under stress.


Those temps are very good. a bit sparced out and I'd try to dial them in more but hey thats just me







what cooler?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I have finally got 5.0ghz stable after a 10hour PRIME95 test woohoo! 1.448v - 1.454v fluctuating due to offset voltage but mainly staying on 1.448v. No more WHEA-LOGGER errors.
> 
> Tax temps: *77, 83, 84, 78* ...is this good?
> 
> Will 1.448v degrade my chip or is it fairly safe? The CPU idles at around 1.018v when not in use so will only be at 1.448v when gaming or under stress.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice! Those temps and voltages should be fine - provided you're not folding 24/7 on that rig I don't see an issue. Technically, it shouldn't be in danger of degradation even if you maintained a 100% load 24/7 at those values - but that's where technical specs and real-world experience possibly diverge. According to Intel specs:
Quote:


> At condition outside functional operation condition limits, neither functionality nor long term reliability can be expected. If a device is returned to conditions within functional operation limits after having been subjected to conditions outside these limits, but _within the absolute maximum and minimum ratings_, the device may be functional, but with its lifetime degraded on exposure to conditions exceeding the functional operation condition limits.


This note is made in reference to the VID values which are provided in a table - the range of which is 0.00v - 1.52v. I believe this is where people get the '1.52v is the vcore limit per intel' - however, as we are all well aware - the VID values are not necessarily anywhere close to the actual vCore values required for stability (hence offset). However, if we infer the above note to apply to both - then as far as voltages are concerned, any value less than 1.52v seems to be deemed "inside functional operation condition limits" and not _necessarily_ a causal factor in degradation.

That being said - until several people who have been running their chips at ~1.52v for more than 3-5 years - there simply isn't any concrete evidence one way or the other. Just a good guess that lower values will be fine and slightly higher values _might_ degrade performance. The TjMAX values are well known at 105C - so I think it's safe to say that anything that reaches those temps will experience degradation eventually... despite throttling allowing limited operation for a period of time.

I've seen a ton of very conservative views... but I personally feel that anything less than 1.52v and less than 95C should at the very least be good for a warranty replacement should degradation occur (as this is within the whitepaper stated envelope for each value). On the 'practical side' there is some wiggle room I think as there are several people that have run 1.55v for reasonably long periods without significant degradation issues.

I think it's important to remember the relationship between heat and voltages in causing leakage and degradation. Since you are far, far below the thermal envelope even under unnaturally stressful conditions - and are comfortably within the voltage limits as well... you should be fine for several years IMO. On the other hand, if you aren't paying attention and have your pump fail while gaming... it's pretty likely (depending on how long it takes you to diagnose the 'spontaneous crashes' as a cooling failure) that it will experience at least some degradation and may require more vcore or lower clocks at the same values to again be stable.

In the end, if it _only_ lasted you the warranty period before having degradation that required adjustments... are you going to care? By that time you can pick up a 4770K on closeout for probably $200 or less. Sorry for writing that novel.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> That being said - until several people who have been running their chips at ~1.52v for more than 3-5 years - there simply isn't any concrete evidence one way or the other.


Belial88 said he degraded his 3770k from being stable a touch below 1.5v to needing >1.54, but he primed on it for like hundreds of hours with temps in the 80's


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't had a single 3570K (I've had about 5 of them) that couldn't hit 4.5GHz as it is... and many of them were on air. So on that note - unless you get one that requires a ton of voltage to hit 4.5GHz you don't _have_ to delid. On the other hand, more than half of mine were heat limited at that value... and even the best one at 4.7GHz on water (peak temps ~92C). So as far as temps are concerned I can't see any Ivy Bridge CPU not benefiting from delidding. As to whether that helps with the OC or not is dependent on the chip itself. None of mine would have ever gotten higher than 4.7GHz without requiring more than 1.52v Vcore so I only delidded one of them and the rest I've either sold or put in regular builds at near stock speeds.
> 
> However, if you look in the 5GHz thread... there are obviously some very good 3570K's out there - just not any that were ever in my possession.
> 
> By the same token, I've never had a 3770K that wouldn't do at least 4.8GHz - including the disaster in my main rig which couldn't do 5GHz even with 1.56v - but runs 4.7GHz @ 1.42v without going over 70C after the delid (on max IBT runs even).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My new one will do 4.7 _on air_ with only 1.28v - lidded - so I can wait to uncap it and get it under water.
> This completely. In my experience, the same clocks will require up to .15v more on a 3570K SKU than they do on a 3770K - but I've purchased them at varying times so that's really not definitive in any way. One thing I will say is my very latest 3770Ks were all very close in peak temps across the cores - so I'm wondering if Intel didn't tweak their TIM & glue assembly process slightly after reading this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yep that's solder alright. I guess the biggest fear I would have with SB is that has to put more shearing force on the die than the TIM does... I'd want to see a longer timeframe to be sure there were issues with die cracking on that like the two Haswell delids - although I think it's pretty safe to assume those were either loading pressures or temp related. Still breaking solder is a bigger deal.
> 
> 
> How did you clean the solder off the die and IHS? Not like wiping it with alcohol is going to do much (or at least I would think so). Did you heat and wick or ??? Good job on just plowing ahead on that... I assume you figured it would result in a dead chip initially?


This time I used Valgaur style to remove the fluxless










working very carefully cutting layer by layer not too deep just enough so you can slice the flux less ( solder ) easy. top to the bottom always pushing the blade to the same direction.

I started to cut the layers where my red line is. bellow the red line was the last part in cutting the flux ( solder ) off. I did not want to hit the DIE in the corner with the blade and damage it. It was a pure delicate work like you remove the IHS with Valgaur style Blade. so if you guys are thinking in attempt it just take your time and do it right once.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> This time I used Valgaur style to remove the fluxless
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> working very carefully cutting layer by layer not too deep just enough so you can slice the flux less ( solder ) easy. top to the bottom always pushing the blade to the same direction.
> 
> I started to cut the layers where my red line is. bellow the red line was the last part in cutting the flux ( solder ) off. I did not want to hit the DIE in the corner with the blade and damage it. It was a pure delicate work like you remove the IHS with Valgaur style Blade. so if you guys are thinking in attempt it just take your time and do it right once.


It seperates the men from the boys


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> This time I used Valgaur style to remove the fluxless
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> working very carefully cutting layer by layer not too deep just enough so you can slice the flux less ( solder ) easy. top to the bottom always pushing the blade to the same direction.
> 
> I started to cut the layers where my red line is. bellow the red line was the last part in cutting the flux ( solder ) off. I did not want to hit the DIE in the corner with the blade and damage it. It was a pure delicate work like you remove the IHS with Valgaur style Blade. so if you guys are thinking in attempt it just take your time and do it right once.


Very impressive. I have seen a few of them with multiple blades and the matches to heat the solder up liquefying it to literally "pop" the IHS off.


----------



## katemis

hello guys.i'm new on your forum and i stuck to this thread!







i'm ultranoooooob to Pc's but you convinced me to proceed deliding.(3770k)

my question is..what silicon should i put to glue the copper with pcb?black silicon for automotive is good for this job?
i'm thinking to put a drop in 4 corners of tha copper so the heat will have space to get out.
thanks in advance









ps
bad english..

ps 2
sorry i'm also noob to forums...can a moderetor move my post to" how to delid" thread?


----------



## Forceman

Don't glue it back on, just use the socket retention mechanism to hold it together in the socket.


----------



## katemis

ok.
but i have 2 mobos and i want to be sure that if i change mobo i don't have to re paste the cpu.(the inside of cpu)that's why i want to glue it.
thanks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> ok.
> but i have 2 mobos and i want to be sure that if i change mobo i don't have to re paste the cpu.(the inside of cpu)that's why i want to glue it.
> thanks


if you try to keep the IHS on while changing mobo's you will be fine even if you open the IHS up and you use CLU/P you are more than fine (temps might waver from IHS moving during mobos switch and such but it happens







)


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Those temps are very good. a bit sparced out and I'd try to dial them in more but hey thats just me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what cooler?


Hi,

Thank-you! I'm glad to hear my overclock is good. How would i manage to get the temps closer together?

I have a XSPC Raystorm EX240 750 v4 Watercooling Kit as the cooler.


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Does this photo give any identification to the problem that caused core 2&3 to be 10C warmer than core 1&4? Can it explain why my temps were nothing special? Too much CLU maybe? Help me out guys.

Also, how do I clean CLU off the die for re-application? I've heard it scratched the die so I'm kinda worried.

ALSO. The IHS does move around after delidding right? Mine slid when clamping the CPU socket down, which I couldn't imagine was good for the CLU under there? Should I stop this and how?


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does this photo give any identification to the problem that caused core 2&3 to be 10C warmer than core 1&4? Can it explain why my temps were nothing special? Too much CLU maybe? Help me out guys.
> 
> Also, how do I clean CLU off the die for re-application? I've heard it scratched the die so I'm kinda worried.
> 
> ALSO. The IHS does move around after delidding right? Mine slid when clamping the CPU socket down, which I couldn't imagine was good for the CLU under there? Should I stop this and how?
Click to expand...

That is correct about the IHS sliding when you close the CPU clamp. You need to lock it down in place just before you push the arm down to lock in place and keep it as central as you can with some fingers whilst locking the lever in place.

There should be a wipe that came with the CLU, in the cleaning kit which should take it off? If not Articlean should do it.

Use a REALLY thin layer, its so thin it only just covers it. I then did an even thinner layer on the underneath of the IHS itself.

I got 24c off load temps. What kind of drop did you get?


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> That is correct about the IHS sliding when you close the CPU clamp. You need to lock it down in place just before you push the arm down to lock in place and keep it as central as you can with some fingers whilst locking the lever in place.
> 
> There should be a wipe that came with the CLU, in the cleaning kit which should take it off? If not Articlean should do it.
> 
> Use a REALLY thin layer, its so thin it only just covers it. I then did an even thinner layer on the underneath of the IHS itself.
> 
> I got 24c off load temps. What kind of drop did you get?


I didn't take a before temperature, which wasnt very smart of me.

I believe an H100i (with push/pull hyperboreas) should take a 1.3v 4770K in stride, but I was hitting 100C at times


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Thank-you! I'm glad to hear my overclock is good. How would i manage to get the temps closer together?
> 
> I have a XSPC Raystorm EX240 750 v4 Watercooling Kit as the cooler.


hmmmm then maybe a redo of the TIM would make them a bit closer sometimes it happens though. They aren't that far apart but could be improved if you'd like them to be.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does this photo give any identification to the problem that caused core 2&3 to be 10C warmer than core 1&4? Can it explain why my temps were nothing special? Too much CLU maybe? Help me out guys.
> 
> Also, how do I clean CLU off the die for re-application? I've heard it scratched the die so I'm kinda worried.
> 
> ALSO. The IHS does move around after delidding right? Mine slid when clamping the CPU socket down, which I couldn't imagine was good for the CLU under there? Should I stop this and how?


Yes actually. What it looks like is a little to little amount of the middle of the die. Give the die another shot of your TIm not much maybe just a beebee size dot.

With the IHS moving it happens all the time. So what you do or atleast i do is hold the IHS by the bottom to compensate for the hold downs to grabbing and sliding the IHS that way it doesn't move or moves very little.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does this photo give any identification to the problem that caused core 2&3 to be 10C warmer than core 1&4? Can it explain why my temps were nothing special? Too much CLU maybe? Help me out guys.
> 
> Also, how do I clean CLU off the die for re-application? I've heard it scratched the die so I'm kinda worried.
> 
> ALSO. The IHS does move around after delidding right? Mine slid when clamping the CPU socket down, which I couldn't imagine was good for the CLU under there? Should I stop this and how?


I wouldnt glue the IHS back on.. you would loose temp gain that way (witch is the reason we dilid in the first place, right?) I haven't changed Mobo with my CPU, but had the IHS off 2 times without changing / repairing the TIM and temp gain of 19-20 hasnt changed









It looks like you put on quite a lot of CLU.. I would just brush over it and clean some of it off / evening it out..
Also, you didnt cover the (what do we call those?) surface mounted things, next to the core?
It can be done without protection, but if you put that much CLU on the die, the risk of getting them shorted is grater.

Clean off some of the CLU (to a thinner even layer) and maybe cover up those surface mounted suckers









Good luck and welcome to OCN!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Belial88 said he degraded his 3770k from being stable a touch below 1.5v to needing >1.54, but he primed on it for like hundreds of hours with temps in the 80's


And I'm not doubting his findings at all - however a single chip is not indicative of the overall behavior or engineering limitations of the mean. There haven't been a bunch more shattered dies from Haswell delidders so despite that being a trend (of sorts) it's still not indicative of the mean - which appears to be surviving delidding without issue. It's quite possible that there were manufacturing issues which caused, or at least exacerbated, the degradation caused by running close to the limits.

Basically, what I was saying in my post was that in cases like Belial88's (which is definitely not indicative of 'normal use' in any way) I believe he should have returned the CPU for replacement and I believe that Intel would have honored the warranty - provided he retained the IHS, etc. Valgaur's experience with Intel support/returns seems to support this theory.

My belief is based not so much on Intel, but rather manufacturing and product engineering in general. An automobile with a 6 year 60K mile warranty has been engineered (hopefully) to meet or exceed those ranges under a wide range of "normal operating conditions". Just because one person shifts at redline every single time they drive doesn't mean they will wind up stranded on the side of the road - and just because a grandmother drives well under the speed limit everywhere she goes, doesn't mean she won't need a new transmission well within the warranty period.

Pushing something to the limit is guaranteed to cause a product with an inherent defect or production flaw to fail much faster - but unless you are looking at a sample size of at least 5-10% of all identical products produced from a single production facility... it's impossible to know whether a failure on a specific unit is due to use/abuse or simply a foregone conclusion which was merely accelerated by the additional stress put upon it.

My







at least.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> And I'm not doubting his findings at all - however a single chip is not indicative of the overall behavior or engineering limitations of the mean. There haven't been a bunch more shattered dies from Haswell delidders so despite that being a trend (of sorts) it's still not indicative of the mean - which appears to be surviving delidding without issue. It's quite possible that there were manufacturing issues which caused, or at least exacerbated, the degradation caused by running close to the limits.
> 
> Basically, what I was saying in my post was that in cases like Belial88's (which is definitely not indicative of 'normal use' in any way) I believe he should have returned the CPU for replacement and I believe that Intel would have honored the warranty - provided he retained the IHS, etc. *Valgaur's experience with Intel support/returns seems to support this theory.*
> 
> My belief is based not so much on Intel, but rather manufacturing and product engineering in general. An automobile with a 6 year 60K mile warranty has been engineered (hopefully) to meet or exceed those ranges under a wide range of "normal operating conditions". Just because one person shifts at redline every single time they drive doesn't mean they will wind up stranded on the side of the road - and just because a grandmother drives well under the speed limit everywhere she goes, doesn't mean she won't need a new transmission well within the warranty period.
> 
> Pushing something to the limit is guaranteed to cause a product with an inherent defect or production flaw to fail much faster - but unless you are looking at a sample size of at least 5-10% of all identical products produced from a single production facility... it's impossible to know whether a failure on a specific unit is due to use/abuse or simply a foregone conclusion which was merely accelerated by the additional stress put upon it.
> 
> My
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> at least.


With that they said just make sure the numbers match up and are readable (AKA NO LAPPING) and you will be able to send dead chips in no problem. just glue the IHS back on to make it easier for them and the shipping process it's the least you can do to be nice and thank them for letting you RMA the delidded CPU.







This will also help them realise we appreciate what they do for us in this and continue doing it.


----------



## ethan319

subbed


----------



## Gurkburk

Just tried talking to Intel over chat, didn't get anywhere though. They made me run a test he sent on a link. The test crashed my Coretemp, and after the test it said my CPU was running 38*C below maximum which is not the case lol. Perhaps during gaming, well not even then sometimes. If i run Crysis or Splinter cell blacklist, I'm up at 70*C~.

Grab from the chatlog with intel.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Intel guy: so well *Snip* it looks like the processor is working perfectly fine
Me: Alright then. But as it's delidded, would warranty still take it if something was wrong with it?
Intel guy: if the processor is defective the warranty will cover it
Me: Even though it's delidded?
Intel guy: well the processor seems to be working fine
Intel(automatic message): Sorry, agents are not available right now.



Wonder, what was the reason behind OPs replacement on his CPU?


----------



## Valgaur

What program?


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What program?


"Intel Processor Diagnostic Tool".


----------



## Valgaur

Hmm haven't heard of that one.what's your voltage and overclock also cooler


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hmm haven't heard of that one.what's your voltage and overclock also cooler


My temps aren't bad i suppose. I just wanted to test the waters with intel pretty much







Corsair H80i 2x scythefans, 1.36v and 4.6Ghz.

Edit: I'm running Adaptivemode, but my maxvolt is at 1.36v which was where I found my sweetspot without crashes.


----------



## luckymatt

There's no way Intel would honor a warranty on a delidded chip, right? I think the low-level Intel support guys folks have been talking to have NO idea what "delidded" means when it is slipped into a conversation. I think to get a real idea of whether they would honor the warranty, I'd like to hear that somebody clearly explained exactly what "delidding" means to the support rep and the support rep actually replied with the actual words "yes, we understand you have removed the heatsink from your chip, and yes even under those circumstances we will honor your warranty".


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hmm haven't heard of that one.what's your voltage and overclock also cooler
> 
> 
> 
> My temps aren't bad i suppose. I just wanted to test the waters with intel pretty much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corsair H80i 2x scythefans, 1.36v and 4.6Ghz.
> 
> Edit: I'm running Adaptivemode, but my maxvolt is at 1.36v which was where I found my sweetspot without crashes.
Click to expand...

1.36v is quite a lot for the 4.6Ghz, are you sure it won't hold with less?
Try with the fixed vcore and a higher LLC


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> My temps aren't bad i suppose. I just wanted to test the waters with intel pretty much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corsair H80i 2x scythefans, 1.36v and 4.6Ghz.
> 
> Edit: I'm running Adaptivemode, but my maxvolt is at 1.36v which was where I found my sweetspot without crashes.


Haswell? Or ivy
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *luckymatt*
> 
> There's no way Intel would honor a warranty on a delidded chip, right? I think the low-level Intel support guys folks have been talking to have NO idea what "delidded" means when it is slipped into a conversation. I think to get a real idea of whether they would honor the warranty, I'd like to hear that somebody clearly explained exactly what "delidding" means to the support rep and the support rep actually replied with the actual words "yes, we understand you have removed the heatsink from your chip, and yes even under those circumstances we will honor your warranty".


*cough* *cough* I did wheni sent mine in.


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> 1.36v is quite a lot for the 4.6Ghz, are you sure it won't hold with less?
> Try with the fixed vcore and a higher LLC


It wont hold with less. Actually had ONE random BSOD with 1.35v.

Vcore set @ what and is there a stock LLC, what should i test mine at ?


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Just checking, is this the right stuff?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Ultra-Cleaning-Kit-CPU-Thermal-Compound-/161068917349?pt=UK_Computing_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item258074a265

and is there anything I have to do before putting it on? Something about covering things up on the PCB to stop it conducting?


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> 1.36v is quite a lot for the 4.6Ghz, are you sure it won't hold with less?
> Try with the fixed vcore and a higher LLC
> 
> 
> 
> It wont hold with less. Actually had ONE random BSOD with 1.35v.
> 
> Vcore set @ what and is there a stock LLC, what should i test mine at ?
Click to expand...

I was wondering if you were just using the offset or fixed vcore, sometimes the fixed voltage works better and you can use the highest level of the LLC (loadline calibration) in order to compensate the vdrop, what mainboard do you have?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> Just checking, is this the right stuff?
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Ultra-Cleaning-Kit-CPU-Thermal-Compound-/161068917349?pt=UK_Computing_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item258074a265
> 
> and is there anything I have to do before putting it on? Something about covering things up on the PCB to stop it conducting?


That's the right stuff, what cpu?


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Thanks. 3570K.


----------



## nemm

About 3 weeks ago I noticed my pc cooling wasn't as it should be since my feet under the desk were rather toasty as was the air blowing from the top of the case so I did a quick 3-run 6144mb Linx test and I was not impressed and my suspicions were confirmed. Full water cooling loop with a top mounted 360mm EX360 (intakes from back and front) and bottom mounted 240mm UT60 (intake from underneath) radiators in push/pull configuration gave the following results.

75-96-105-104, core difference 30degC, avg 95degC, ambient 22degC


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I looked for a previous post I made in this thread to find my past results, no mention of ambient but it is usually 20-22degC.

before delid 78-97-96-80, core difference 19degC, avg 87.75degC *mx4 ihs
after delid 72-90-90-75, core difference 18degC, avg 81.75degC *mx4 die and ihs
lapped 72-87-87-73, core difference 15degC, avg 79.75degC *mx4 die and ihs
different paste 62-71-70-61, core difference 10degC, avg 66.00degC *gc extreme die and ihs

As you can see something serious has gone wrong so I began investigating by first checking the thermal applications for both under and on top of the IHS, the imprints were fine but reapplied and retested giving near the same results. No other option but to drain the system and flush through for which I discovered the CPU block was blocked. Block cleaned, loop reassembled and removed all bar slight amount of trapped air to obtain much better results but not as they were previous.

76-85-84-78, core difference 9degC, avg 80.75degC, ambient 28degC


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Time to transfer all components to the much bigger and better Phantom 630 with same EX360 top mounted radiator in same configuration as before but UT60 is now upright and front mounted. Sourced myself some CLU to apply on to the die but keeping the gc extreme for the ihs to block thermal application. After the system was all back up and running with the loop free from air the testing once again began.

63-73-71-65, core difference 10degC, avg 68degC. ambient 28degC


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Much better results now being similar to previous performance but with with a higher ambient currently 6-8degC at present.

To anyone considering delidding I would seriously do it since the temperature reduction is worth it if you are willing to take the risk. As for which thermal compound to use, I have to agree with all the rest and highly recommend CLU/CLP instead of paste based compounds. MX4 was an improvement over Intel's clay compound but GC extreme was better but not as good as CL. With my new setup I can happily run the machine with all fans on lowest speed and pump on max setting to keep all cool whilst being inaudible which is ultimately what I desired when choosing to water cool.

No photo of delidded chip but end results are

CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC extreme
Mhz gained: Not pushed any further
OC after delid: 4800
Temp drops: 24-30degC on hottest core


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> 
> 
> Does this photo give any identification to the problem that caused core 2&3 to be 10C warmer than core 1&4? Can it explain why my temps were nothing special? Too much CLU maybe? Help me out guys.
> 
> Also, how do I clean CLU off the die for re-application? I've heard it scratched the die so I'm kinda worried.
> 
> ALSO. The IHS does move around after delidding right? Mine slid when clamping the CPU socket down, which I couldn't imagine was good for the CLU under there? Should I stop this and how?


Alright, good news!

After following the advice from some fellow delidders, I was able to drop my load temperatures 30 Degrees!

I re-applied the CLU, using a VERY small amount on both die and IHS.

I then applied my AS5 with a VERY small amount aswell....(I think that was a big part of my problem. I had always thought "pea size" and it always worked....on my bigger AM3/AM2 chips...)

I'm now 15 minutes stable with 4.5Ghz @ 1.32 V Load : ~69 C. Cores 2 & 3 continue to be the hottest, but they are still manageable.

I was running 100C with this OC!

Edit : Wow, instantly I jumped up 20C to 90C....

Should 1.33V really get me 90C with an H100i (push pull hyperboreas?)


----------



## Clexzor

What I have noticed after deliding 3 3770k's and 4 4770k's is that the lids on the 4770k bend much easier seriosuly they do. Even with less pressure they will tweak and its noticeable ive had to straightin out 2 and just been using this on 3770k lid in its place for now lol its straight as an arrow

>


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> About 3 weeks ago I noticed my pc cooling wasn't as it should be since my feet under the desk were rather toasty as was the air blowing from the top of the case


Wouldn't that go the other way around? If the heat's being taken from the CPU, the CPU wouldn't get hot but your exhaust air would. It's not like messing up something will cause the CPU to draw a ton more power and throw out more heat, the chip getting hot is just a result of the same amount of heat not being handled in the same way

Though this is nitpicking a bit


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nemm*
> 
> About 3 weeks ago I noticed my pc cooling wasn't as it should be since my feet under the desk were rather toasty as was the air blowing from the top of the case so I did a quick 3-run 6144mb Linx test and I was not impressed and my suspicions were confirmed. Full water cooling loop with a top mounted 360mm EX360 (intakes from back and front) and bottom mounted 240mm UT60 (intake from underneath) radiators in push/pull configuration gave the following results.
> 
> 75-96-105-104, core difference 30degC, avg 95degC, ambient 22degC
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I looked for a previous post I made in this thread to find my past results, no mention of ambient but it is usually 20-22degC.
> 
> before delid 78-97-96-80, core difference 19degC, avg 87.75degC *mx4 ihs
> after delid 72-90-90-75, core difference 18degC, avg 81.75degC *mx4 die and ihs
> lapped 72-87-87-73, core difference 15degC, avg 79.75degC *mx4 die and ihs
> different paste 62-71-70-61, core difference 10degC, avg 66.00degC *gc extreme die and ihs
> 
> As you can see something serious has gone wrong so I began investigating by first checking the thermal applications for both under and on top of the IHS, the imprints were fine but reapplied and retested giving near the same results. No other option but to drain the system and flush through for which I discovered the CPU block was blocked. Block cleaned, loop reassembled and removed all bar slight amount of trapped air to obtain much better results but not as they were previous.
> 
> 76-85-84-78, core difference 9degC, avg 80.75degC, ambient 28degC
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time to transfer all components to the much bigger and better Phantom 630 with same EX360 top mounted radiator in same configuration as before but UT60 is now upright and front mounted. Sourced myself some CLU to apply on to the die but keeping the gc extreme for the ihs to block thermal application. After the system was all back up and running with the loop free from air the testing once again began.
> 
> 63-73-71-65, core difference 10degC, avg 68degC. ambient 28degC
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Much better results now being similar to previous performance but with with a higher ambient currently 6-8degC at present.
> 
> To anyone considering delidding I would seriously do it since the temperature reduction is worth it if you are willing to take the risk. As for which thermal compound to use, I have to agree with all the rest and highly recommend CLU/CLP instead of paste based compounds. MX4 was an improvement over Intel's clay compound but GC extreme was better but not as good as CL. With my new setup I can happily run the machine with all fans on lowest speed and pump on max setting to keep all cool whilst being inaudible which is ultimately what I desired when choosing to water cool.
> 
> No photo of delidded chip but end results are
> 
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC extreme
> Mhz gained: Not pushed any further
> OC after delid: 4800
> Temp drops: 24-30degC on hottest core


You're in!







Very nice temp drops!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> Alright, good news!
> After following the advice from some fellow delidders, I was able to drop my load temperatures 30 Degrees!
> 
> I re-applied the CLU, using a VERY small amount on both die and IHS.
> 
> I then applied my AS5 with a VERY small amount aswell....(I think that was a big part of my problem. I had always thought "pea size" and it always worked....on my bigger AM3/AM2 chips...)
> 
> I'm now 15 minutes stable with 4.5Ghz @ 1.32 V Load : ~69 C. Cores 2 & 3 continue to be the hottest, but they are still manageable.
> 
> I was running 100C with this OC!
> 
> Edit : Wow, instantly I jumped up 20C to 90C....
> Should 1.33V really get me 90C with an H100i (push pull hyperboreas?)


what are your ambient temps??


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what are your ambient temps??


65F

Idles at 40C

Prime95 - sticks between 70 and 100, only hitting 100 once if at all.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> 65F
> Idles at 40C
> Prime95 - sticks between 70 and 100, only hitting 100 once if at all.


that range is far to fluttered... your on a 4770K correct? if so don't use Prime95 use IBT or aida 64 nicer on the cpu


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> that range is far to fluttered... your on a 4770K correct? if so don't use Prime95 use IBT or aida 64 nicer on the cpu


I've been through four runs of IBT so far.

Just hit 99C. Calling it a day. I don't want to test this OC over night as I'm right on the max safe temp.

1.33v seems very low for a thermal ceiling...I feel like I read of a H100i user using 1.37v. Maybe he was just using some crazy loud push/pull fans.

Just found this...

Quote:


> From what I've seen people can get to about 1.3-1.35V and around 4.5Ghz (depending on the chip) on the h100's.


He hit the nail on the head for me. 1.33v at 4.5Ghz.

Hmm....I wonder if he accounted for delidding...


----------



## Big Texas

FOR ALL MSI Z87 GD-65 OWNERS:

The new 1.4 bios was released today. Voltages are now more fine tunable and vccin can go below 1.8v.

download from their website on the product page for it.

edit: this could also apply to any of the other z87 msi boards. they could've released them all in a wave, who knows.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Voltages are now more fine tunable and vccin can go below 1.8v


Awesome, that's a pretty basic feature, 1.8 is far too high for low volts/clocks. It seems overkill for stock, even with droop, lower seems flat out superior in terms of stability at a given vcore for me all the way up to 1.3vcore or close to it with llc'd VIN


----------



## shremi

Well my fellow crewman yesterday i got my brand new haswell

99°C @ 4.5 with this low vcore ???? you gotta be kidding me .



I got up to date and used the new vice method and lapped the CPU why not ????

Here are the results

























I love this club


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Well my fellow crewman yesterday i got my brand new haswell
> 
> 99°C @ 4.5 with this low vcore ???? you gotta be kidding me .
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got up to date and used the new vice method and lapped the CPU why not ????
> 
> Here are the results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love this club


me to!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *shremi*
> 
> Well my fellow crewman yesterday i got my brand new haswell
> 
> 99°C @ 4.5 with this low vcore ???? you gotta be kidding me .
> 
> 
> 
> I got up to date and used the new vice method and lapped the CPU why not ????
> 
> Here are the results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I love this club


~1.27vcore is kinda high end for an avx test *cringe*

Check your temperatures with x264 ^.^


----------



## shremi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> ~1.27vcore is kinda high end for an avx test *cringe*
> 
> Check your temperatures with x264 ^.^


I have been out of the game for a while what do you recommend me for stress testing ?????


----------



## Cyro999

I said x264 right there









Not the best for finding instability, but then again prime seems bad at that with Haswell anyway. If you're going to blow up your temperatures with AVX (the only reason to do that is to find some theoretical absolute max heat situation or something along those lines, AFAIK) then you might as well be using avx2 linpack because it's a lot hotter; in terms of stability they don't even seem like solid indicators so there's not much point for them

Ivy bridge = prime for 48 hours with 7000mb RAM, call it stable and laugh, haswell, prime for 48 hours, crash in a minute and a half ingame. Very annoying. A lot of stuff seems ok for catching some instability, but there's more to catch and you can be completely fine with one stress test or usage of the CPU and massively unstable in another usage. I'd probably just reccomend using various programs that max out CPU (x264, there's some guy using a chess engine for example) as well as doing the stuff you want to do on the system for stress testing, gaming etc whatever

Gz on the successful delid


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I said x264 right there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not the best for finding instability, but then again prime seems bad at that with Haswell anyway. If you're going to blow up your temperatures with AVX (the only reason to do that is to find some theoretical absolute max heat situation or something along those lines, AFAIK) then you might as well be using avx2 linpack because it's a lot hotter; in terms of stability they don't even seem like solid indicators so there's not much point for them
> 
> Ivy bridge = prime for 48 hours with 7000mb RAM, call it stable and laugh, haswell, prime for 48 hours, crash in a minute and a half ingame. Very annoying. A lot of stuff seems ok for catching some instability, but there's more to catch and you can be completely fine with one stress test or usage of the CPU and massively unstable in another usage. I'd probably just reccomend using various programs that max out CPU (x264, there's some guy using a chess engine for example) as well as doing the stuff you want to do on the system for stress testing, gaming etc whatever


On that note about prime95 and Ivy Bridge... I tried stressing my Ivy Bridge with chess engines like the guy that made the Haswell Overclocking Thread. It's seriously impressively fast in coaxing WHEA-Logger warnings out of the system for an overclock at the edge of stability. A WHEA warning will show up within minutes while prime95 would be able to run for hours.

I used the Arena 3.0 chess UI. Then I went around and searched for strong but free engines. There's Stockfish 4, Critter 1.6a, Rybka 2.3.2a, Houdini 1.5a.

All those four engines seemed to make WHEA-Logger warnings show up. They create 60c temperatures on an overclock that will go up to 80c with IBT. The Critter engine is prone to sometimes crash for those VCore settings that seem perfectly stable in prime95 and IBT but throw WHEA warnings on normal PC use. It won't crash for a stable overclock.

The Arena UI can run engine tournaments and will automatically let the engines play matches against each other. Before starting the first tournament, the Stockfish 4 engine has to be loaded normally once and configured to run on four threads instead of just one or it won't stress all cores. It's done in the context menu of the engine output window which won't be available when it's used in a tournament.

From what I've seen, I'd go as far as say that stressing with chess for half an hour is better than a day of prime95. The way I remember my overclocking experiments in the past, I ran prime95 for up to 24 hours, and then still had WHEA-Logger events show up in the event viewer over the next few days of normal PC use. The chess engines will make WHEA warnings show up within 10 minutes for the same settings that used to run prime95 fine.

I tried stressing with chess for both offset and fixed vcore voltage. It worked fine in detecting the edge of what's stable for both. This is with an i5-3570k and Gigabyte board. Fixed voltage was run on "Turbo" LLC (that's a perfect zero vdroop on my board), offset with pretty much everything (Low, Medium, High, Turbo, Extreme).

IBT seems worthless for stability. It's good to find the absolute max temperatures and see the highest possible VID value and check the LLC isn't set too low when going from fixed to offset vcore.

There's a thread somewhere on overclock.net explaining how to make the WHEA-Logger event create a message window on the desktop whenever an event happens which is pretty neat for testing for stability like this.


----------



## Darylrese

Yesterday I left my computer idle for about half an hour, came back, monitor was off and wouldn't wake up. I restarted PC, went into event viewer and i had a single WHEA-LOGGER error....GRRR!

Its been working perfectly in gaming and PRIME95 blend test for 12hours then BOOM...annoyed! Will see if its a one off, i don't expect it will be though.


----------



## HairyGamer

Streaming BF3 multiplayer at 720p 45fps (playing at 1080p 50-120fps) was very good for testing stability. I thought I was stable (used the PC for a week without issue) so I began streaming and proceeded to crash after a few hours. I dropped the CPU from 4.8 to 4.7 and the cache from 4.3 to 4.2 and everything has been just fine since then.

Haswell is a bear to test with, but I've noticed a mix of things (like gaming while encoding) seems to find instability on Haswell far quicker and more effectively than any stress testing software I've run. P95, OCCT, IBT, Aida64, etc were all just a massive waste of time.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Big Texas*
> 
> FOR ALL MSI Z87 GD-65 OWNERS:
> 
> The new 1.4 bios was released today. Voltages are now more fine tunable and vccin can go below 1.8v.
> 
> download from their website on the product page for it.
> 
> edit: this could also apply to any of the other z87 msi boards. they could've released them all in a wave, who knows.


Thansk for the heads up







It is not 1 week ago I updated 1.2 to 1.3.. guess I should have waited a little longer.
Here we go again.. flashing of both BIOS's (gotta love that dual bios thing, I feel so much safer with it.)


----------



## GaMbi2004

Question about lapping the IHS..
My temps are 1C degree apart (54 55 56 57)~
Isnt lapping mostly to bring the temps closer together? in witch case I dont really need it.. and if warranty is still there after delidding, it surely will be lost if I start lapping the IHS.
I already got the sand papers, but now im no as up to it as I was when I ordered..

Should I go for it or just leave it as is?


----------



## deepor

I think lapping is more about fixing a situation in which your cooler does not make good contact with the IHS. Normally, the IHS is somewhat concave. The currently sold coolers try to counteract that by having a somewhat convex base. If you take the cooler off and look at the picture the thermal paste makes and it looks bad, you can make both IHS and cooler's base perfectly flat with lapping and fix this.

If you go ahead and lap your IHS without need, you will worsen the contact between IHS and your cooler.


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Anyone able to say what kind of performance they are getting out of higher overclocks? I'm at 4.5 now, 1.26V at what seems to be stable, no issues after a week. Temperature limited obviously, but it turns out 4.6 isn't stable at 1.3V. I was planning on delidding and aiming for 4.8, but clock wise thats a 7% difference, and performance doesn't scale with clocks 1:1 (not to my knowledge).

Is 4.5 to 4.8 even going to matter?


----------



## Cyro999

Depends what you mean by that, could you blind test it? Probably not. Feel a little faster in general, probably if you do lots of CPU bound stuff


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TehOnlyMITTENS*
> 
> I've been through four runs of IBT so far.
> Just hit 99C. Calling it a day. I don't want to test this OC over night as I'm right on the max safe temp.
> 1.33v seems very low for a thermal ceiling...I feel like I read of a H100i user using 1.37v. Maybe he was just using some crazy loud push/pull fans.
> Just found this...
> 
> He hit the nail on the head for me. 1.33v at 4.5Ghz.
> Hmm....I wonder if he accounted for delidding...


So I'm just a taaaaad above average with my 4770k at [email protected] ? ^^


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I think lapping is more about fixing a situation in which your cooler does not make good contact with the IHS. Normally, the IHS is somewhat concave. The currently sold coolers try to counteract that by having a somewhat convex base. If you take the cooler off and look at the picture the thermal paste makes and it looks bad, you can make both IHS and cooler's base perfectly flat with lapping and fix this.
> 
> If you go ahead and lap your IHS without need, you will worsen the contact between IHS and your cooler.


Cheers. my TIM looks like it is evenly compressed over the entire IHS, so I guess Ill just leave it







that way I get to keep my warranty too (maybe?)









Thanks for the pointer!


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Depends what you mean by that, could you blind test it? Probably not. Feel a little faster in general, probably if you do lots of CPU bound stuff


I only game. I know for GPU's 7% increase in clock speed doesn't mean 7% more performance, is that any different for CPU's because of multiple cores or something?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> I only game. I know for GPU's 7% increase in clock speed doesn't mean 7% more performance, is that any different for CPU's because of multiple cores or something?


Depends. In some stuff it's pretty much linear, in others it's less, for Starcraft 2 minimum FPS, a 30% increase in clock speed can give you consistently like 50% higher


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> So I'm just a taaaaad above average with my 4770k at [email protected] ? ^^


It took me 1.4V to get there, but I'm in the top 20% with my stable 4.7 OC


----------



## rickyman0319

if u delidded ur 4770k cpu, what is ur temp for it?

even though I delidded my 4770k, my core 1 temp is almost 90-100C. is that normal.

and it is only 4.4 ghz @ 1.312 ( I think)


----------



## TehOnlyMITTENS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> if u delidded ur 4770k cpu, what is ur temp for it?
> 
> even though I delidded my 4770k, my core 1 temp is almost 90-100C. is that normal.
> 
> and it is only 4.4 ghz @ 1.312 ( I think)


It all depends on the CPU cooler you are using. You'd have to provide that information.


----------



## rickyman0319

my cpu cooler is H80i .


----------



## pandalin

Did the guy that damaged his delidded cpu try to rma it glued back on ? Any success ? Just curious.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pandalin*
> 
> Did the guy that damaged his delidded cpu try to rma it glued back on ? Any success ? Just curious.


you're gonna have to be specific.. many have damaged their cpu's









not many but a few let me correct myself


----------



## pandalin

As in physical damage. I think there were two guys actually with cracks after delidding. But i guess any delidded cpu sent successfully to rma would confirm that intel takes delidded cpus glued back on.


----------



## Swag

Came back from a camping trip.










Being away from my PC was agonizing but at the same time, I realize that the heat from the sun is incomparable to the heat generated by my PC.







I wish there was more you could do to a CPU other than delid it to make it cooler. Haha.


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Came back from a camping trip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Being away from my PC was agonizing but at the same time, I realize that the heat from the sun is incomparable to the heat generated by my PC.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish there was more you could do to a CPU other than delid it to make it cooler. Haha.


It's called....WATERCOOLING





































Beautiful scenery by the way!


----------



## skyn3t

@ Valgaur you may want to see this. Tell me what you think.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-gets-lapped-delidded/50#post_20702106


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Came back from a camping trip.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Being away from my PC was agonizing but at the same time, I realize that the heat from the sun is incomparable to the heat generated by my PC.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish there was more you could do to a CPU other than delid it to make it cooler. Haha.
> 
> 
> 
> It's called....WATERCOOLING
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Beautiful scenery by the way!
Click to expand...

I know... I want to get custom water soon but I spent all my money on other stuff like a car.








Thanks too.

Also, as companies are exchanging their equipment after 2 years of hard use, they collect dust in their storage area. My dad got me 4 1-year old dual-CPU servers.







Each is 4c/8t dual CPU, so each 8c/16t for each server. Once winter comes, let the folding begin.


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HairyGamer*
> 
> Streaming BF3 multiplayer at 720p 45fps (playing at 1080p 50-120fps) was very good for testing stability. I thought I was stable (used the PC for a week without issue) so I began streaming and proceeded to crash after a few hours. I dropped the CPU from 4.8 to 4.7 and the cache from 4.3 to 4.2 and everything has been just fine since then.
> 
> Haswell is a bear to test with, but I've noticed a mix of things (like gaming while encoding) seems to find instability on Haswell far quicker and more effectively than any stress testing software I've run. P95, OCCT, IBT, Aida64, etc were all just a massive waste of time.


It's because of the voltage drops the CPU experiences while ramping up and down. I've been experiencing this too, my CPU will run stable on a prime test for 12+ hours but with the same settings, CS:GO crashes every 5 minutes. I found either raising the voltage or raising LLC helped with the issue.

While running a stress test, the CPU is under full load therefore it gets a pretty stable voltage from the motherboard allowing it to make it's calculation, while gaming there are times where the CPU isn't working as hard as others and if the CPU goes to complete a calculation and there's not enough voltage, BAM, BSOD or Game crash


----------



## HemiRick

Yes I have seen a post where someone said Intel took back a delidded chip that had had the IHS glued back on


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> @ Valgaur you may want to see this. Tell me what you think.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-gets-lapped-delidded/50#post_20702106


gimme it to LN2







thats epic btw most baller batch i've seen
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HemiRick*
> 
> Yes I have seen a post where someone said Intel took back a delidded chip that had had the IHS glued back on


That was me


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> gimme it to LN2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thats epic btw most baller batch i've seen
> That was me


Yeah I know. That thing still boxed. My. Asus MVIF was in my desk for almost two weeks waiting for a 4770k now I have it right beside my boxed mobo lol and don't know what to do. Im going to wait till saturday I may have something income than I will know what to do with that chip.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Yeah I know. That thing still boxed. My. Asus MVIF was in my desk for almost two weeks waiting for a 4770k now I have it right beside my boxed mobo lol and don't know what to do. Im going to wait till saturday I may have something income than I will know what to do with that chip.


hurry up! i have a MVIE that i wanna use soooo badly


----------



## arrow0309

Gonna buy a new, sealed 3770k but without the slip or receipt
Will this still be covered by the Intel's direct warranty?
If yes, for how long?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Gonna buy a new, sealed 3770k but without the slip or receipt
> Will this still be covered by the Intel's direct warranty?
> If yes, for how long?


Intel's warranty goes by batch number and the information on the IHS and the pcb number. there should be warranty but not sure how long though...


----------



## Shaldome

i has a question!
After delidding, do you "paint" the under side of the heatspreader with Liquid Ultra as well or just the die? In the picture in the OT is looks like both sides are covered.
I will reseat my CPU water block this weekend as my temps seem to high for me.. I don't know if the heatspreader is not sitting correctly on the die or if there is another problem.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> i has a question!
> After delidding, do you "paint" the under side of the heatspreader with Liquid Ultra as well or just the die? In the picture in the OT is looks like both sides are covered.


Yes, paint underside of IHS as well.


----------



## Cr4zy

I wouldn't add additional CLU udner the IHS. Most people cover the die and just wipe the excess off on the udnerside of the IHS, an even covering on the die is more than enough to fill the gap.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> I wouldn't add additional CLU udner the IHS. Most people cover the die and just wipe the excess off on the udnerside of the IHS, an even covering on the die is more than enough to fill the gap.


sometimes it is. Some IHS's are a bit more convex than other so it does help


----------



## Gurkburk

It's dependant on how good the contact is on each CPU betwen the IHS.

My CPU needed a lot of CLU to make good contact.

Edit: Well, not a lot, but more than normal.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sometimes it is. Some IHS's are a bit more convex than other so it does help


^^^...definitely words of wisdom (if you mean concave by convex for the IHS







) ...Of 8 recent CPU purchases (some for biz), 2 have extremely concave IHS to the point that test fittings with either TIM or even pressure paper showed that a good 100% contact 'seating' was not possible, even w/double-sided CL-U application.

Unfortunately, one of those 2 is the delidded Ivy 3770K, but once I lapped the IHS, everything was fine (not withstanding some of the 'warranty' drawbacks with lapped IHS / unreadable serial numbers !)


----------



## pilotter

is there a thread / guide for delidding and the EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy. That's my plan to do in my new build.


----------



## Shaldome

Ah well, reseating and reapplying did not help. Stll temps about 70 C at stock with just BOINC running.
At least I fond out, that only one fan on my 360 Radiator was running. But unfortunately this did not help with the temps.
Both GPUs are chilling at 40 C though, so it has to revolve to something with the CPU.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shaldome*
> 
> Ah well, reseating and reapplying did not help. Stll temps about 70 C at stock with just BOINC running.
> At least I fond out, that only one fan on my 360 Radiator was running. But unfortunately this did not help with the temps.
> Both GPUs are chilling at 40 C though, so it has to revolve to something with the CPU.


if your full loop has gpus in the 40C idle then that would make sense temp wise with BOINC running. I had a plan for a WC build and to deal with the heat i was going to go WAY overboard on the raddage 5 480mm long 80mm thick rads.... BUT i did have a very special and hot CPU cooler for that as well..


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if your full loop has gpus in the 40C idle then that would make sense temp wise with BOINC running. I had a plan for a WC build and to deal with the heat i was going to go WAY overboard on the raddage 5 480mm long 80mm thick rads.... BUT i did have a very special and hot CPU cooler for that as well..


If you do plan to build a killer loop do it before freezing stuff.
Water cooling just isn't as fun once you get everything for sub-zero & start doing it. Before freezing those water cooled scores are fun & exciting, after freezing it's hard to get excited about scores when you know you are going to stomp them with better cooling.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if your full loop has gpus in the 40C idle then that would make sense temp wise with BOINC running. I had a plan for a WC build and to deal with the heat i was going to go WAY overboard on the raddage 5 480mm long 80mm thick rads.... BUT i did have a very special and hot CPU cooler for that as well..


...







...I thought I went way overboard, with a total of 4 pumps and 6 rads for 1760mm x 60mm+ for CPU and 4x GPUs...but I see you have a different definition of 'way overboard' - I like it


----------



## Shaldome

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if your full loop has gpus in the 40C idle then that would make sense temp wise with BOINC running. I had a plan for a WC build and to deal with the heat i was going to go WAY overboard on the raddage 5 480mm long 80mm thick rads.... BUT i did have a very special and hot CPU cooler for that as well..


Well BOINC uses both GPUs as well and using some Benchmarks they only hit about 50 C.
Maybe I should just start overclocking tomorrow and see how it goes.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> If you do plan to build a killer loop do it before freezing stuff.
> Water cooling just isn't as fun once you get everything for sub-zero & start doing it. Before freezing those water cooled scores are fun & exciting, after freezing it's hard to get excited about scores when you know you are going to stomp them with better cooling.


that is true... i need pot first for LN2 and found a good LN2 dispencer for my 50L


----------



## Gurkburk

What could a custom watercooling loop cost to make? Buying new things for the computer to build is so much fun,but when its all set up afterwards I am very sad
















And how hard is it to install?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> What could a custom watercooling loop cost to make? Buying new things for the computer to build is so much fun,but when its all set up afterwards I am very sad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And how hard is it to install?


well it can be around 500 area for a low end or if you want one like i had planned like 1.7 grand in just WC stuff not including fans....


----------



## Aeonyx

Just curious guys, I have a 4770k and a 4670k. The 4670k is delidded however I haven't used it again as I need to purchase some liquid metal, however, I am curious as to what further overclocking results that you were able to achieve after delidding? For example, after lots of tweaking, I seem to have my 4770k 24/7 stable at 4.6GHz w/ 1.35v with a Corsair H120, but at 4.7 it crashes after like 90 seconds of Prime 95.

Anywho, what gains have you guys seen in real world overclocks with the same cooling? I know that the temp drop depends on the chip, but has anyone seen 200MHz - 400MHz gains? For example, if I wasn't previously able to boot into windows at 4.8, should I expect any likely hood of this being possible? Or are the real gains from being able to stay under tj max at higher voltages?

Thanks!


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aeonyx*
> 
> Or are the real gains from being able to stay under tj max at higher voltages?


It's that.

So whatever that increased voltage gets you, speed-wise, is what you can get. I could never have run 1.35V or higher without delidding, which would have limited me to something below 4.4. I can now run 1.4V+ (if I wanted to ) which might be able to get me 4.6 - my chip sucks). So maybe 200 MHz from the extra voltage - but it is going to vary a lot by chip.


----------



## Aeonyx

Interesting. I can seem to get into windows and get prime going until like test 2 at 4.7 w/ 1.4v, but 4.8 will crash pretty much as soon as I turn prime on. Will be very interesting to see what delidding makes happen!


----------



## Darylrese

I have been having some very weird problems recently, games locking up, crashing and restarting, power just cutting out from machine and a couple of random single WHEA-LOGGER errors, i'm back on 4.8ghz and all good again....hmmm It was fine for about a week then just started doing some very weird things


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> I have been having some very weird problems recently, games locking up, crashing and restarting, power just cutting out from machine and a couple of random single WHEA-LOGGER errors, i'm back on 4.8ghz and all good again....hmmm It was fine for about a week then just started doing some very weird things


IMO 5GHz is too much for 24/7 use. Just be happy knowing you can use it for some benches and stuff, but for daily use I wouldn't run more than 4.8.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> IMO 5GHz is too much for 24/7 use. Just be happy knowing you can use it for some benches and stuff, but for daily use I wouldn't run more than 4.8.


Some peeps takes 1.3v for 5ghz, others 1.6


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> IMO 5GHz is too much for 24/7 use. Just be happy knowing you can use it for some benches and stuff, but for daily use I wouldn't run more than 4.8.


Yeah i'm very happy with 4.8ghz and 5.0ghz passes PRIME95 12 hour blend test so all good. 5.0ghz needs 1.448v and 4.8ghz needs 1.328v


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Sooooo, I just bought a 4770k, with a maximus hero and zalman lq 315. Writing this right now at 4.7 @ 1.27, passed burn test and cinebench 10.23. Good chip?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> Sooooo, I just bought a 4770k, with a maximus hero and zalman lq 315. Writing this right now at 4.7 @ 1.27, passed burn test and cinebench 10.23. Good chip?


Sounds great. Any idea what date the batch is for the 4770k?

Costa rica or Malaysia?


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Malaysia, but i have a feeling it also has to do with my motherboard and platinum power supply.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> Malaysia, but i have a feeling it also has to do with my motherboard and platinum power supply.


I think it may have more to do with the chip. i've seen high end mother boards with high end Platinum PSU not do well with chip.

Do you know if your MB is C2 revision?

The best ROG board right now is looking like the IMPACT and it is the only ROG z87 board that uses international Rectifier IR3553 parts on the VRM and it has the C2 revision. All the other Z87 ROG boards uses Ti NexFet power which isn't as good quality and I haven't seen any othe ROG Z87 C2 mother boards yet.


----------



## Speedster159

How much of a difference would temperature be running bare die and with IHS?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> How much of a difference would temperature be running bare die and with IHS?


Proper even surface mount with proper application of high quality TIM between 2 surfaces is the best situation. Not sure what the numbers are but it would be interesting to see the differences over a range of different loads. I don't think anybody has done it yet.

Bare die mount is die/TIM/block
With IHS mount you get die/TIM/IHS/TIM/block.

Bare die is better IMO and easier to set up once you figure out how to get the mount set up properly.


----------



## Speedster159

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> How much of a difference would temperature be running bare die and with IHS?
> 
> 
> 
> Proper even surface mount with proper application of high quality TIM between 2 surfaces is the best situation. Not sure what the numbers are but it would be interesting to see the differences over a range of different loads. I don't think anybody has done it yet.
> 
> Bare die mount is die/TIM/block
> With IHS mount you get die/TIM/IHS/TIM/block.
> 
> Bare die is better IMO and easier to set up once you figure out how to get the mount set up properly.
Click to expand...

But what if you don't do it right bare die?


----------



## Daredevil 720

There's a Precise Mount kit from EK, designed to be used with the EK Supremacy waterblock. It's shown to drop temps by about 5C more than a perfect mount with the IHS.

I'm considering getting it but I'm worried about the stiffness of my tubing messing things up.


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

could'nt tell you about the revision but I got this chip from newegg with mobo. wonder if i should even de lid, got the vice and some liquid electrical tape in an online shopping cart from loews. Gotta love overclock.net full of geniuses!!! Still got some liquid pro left over from ivy. Had 3570k de lidded. Temps were so good I tried to push 5 ghz at 1.7!! She's still kickin but she ain't what she used to be 1.27 just to get to 4.0 now =( Degradation is real.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> But what if you don't do it right bare die?


Yout temps will suffer and worst case the CPU will not boot because the socket pins are not making good even contact. (that is another problem)


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> could'nt tell you about the revision but I got this chip from newegg with mobo. wonder if i should even de lid, got the vice and some liquid electrical tape in an online shopping cart from loews. Gotta love overclock.net full of geniuses!!! Still got some liquid pro left over from ivy. Had 3570k de lidded. Temps were so good I tried to push 5 ghz at 1.7!! She's still kickin but she ain't what she used to be 1.27 just to get to 4.0 now =( Degradation is real.


1.7 is ridiculous no wonder your CPU crapped out.

Use CPU-Z to see if you have C2 revision.


----------



## Speedster159

Well if the temperature with or without the IHS is just 5c, i would rather have the IHS and be sure to post.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> Well if the temperature with or without the IHS is just 5c, i would rather have the IHS and be sure to post.


Some people say it could be safer without the IHS if using the Precise Mount kit. I'm not convinced yet though.


----------



## Speedster159

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> Well if the temperature with or without the IHS is just 5c, i would rather have the IHS and be sure to post.
> 
> 
> 
> Some people say it could be safer without the IHS if using the Precise Mount kit. I'm not convinced yet though.
Click to expand...

Precise mount kit?


----------



## Daredevil 720

http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html

This one. (also called Naked Ivy)


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

revision c0


----------



## Speedster159

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
> 
> This one. (also called Naked Ivy)


Oh... just for waterblocks.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> Oh... just for waterblocks.


If you plan on using a regular air heat sink IMO you are better off using the IHS. The IHS helps support the die. Naked bare mounts work best with light weight low profile water blocks like the one in the photo.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> revision c0


That is day one release. The Impact is using the C2.


----------



## Speedster159

What do you guys put between the Die and IHS? Also how would you glue the IHS back on?


----------



## rickyman0319

1. how do u clean the TIM on the Die?
2. how do u clean the glue on both pcb and IHS?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> 1. how do u clean the TIM on the Die?
> 2. how do u clean the glue on both pcb and IHS?


1. I just wiped carefully until it looked clean, then used a clean cloth with a drop of alcohol to make sure.
2. I used my fingernails and a lot of time.


----------



## rickyman0319

is this bad on the die?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> is this bad on the die?


Here's how someone else did it: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/11720#post_19289118

Perhaps try to copy that.


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> What do you guys put between the Die and IHS? Also how would you glue the IHS back on?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> 1. how do u clean the TIM on the Die?
> 2. how do u clean the glue on both pcb and IHS?


Both answers are in the tutorials on the OP.

Between Die and IHS your best bet is Coolabritories liquid ultra and you dont glue the IHS back on, you just rest it on top.

To remove black glue from CPU and IHS use a credit card and scrape it off carefully.


----------



## Darylrese

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> is this bad on the die?


Hard to tell....what is it exactly?


----------



## RickRockerr

Just ordered more clp and EK-Supremacy PreciseMount kit. Is there any change to crush the core with that kit? Can i just tighten thumb screws to end of the screw?


----------



## rickyman0319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Hard to tell....what is it exactly?


it has CLU on the die? it is i7 4770k cpu.


----------



## Darylrese

Oh right....application looks OK aslong as its a VERY thin layer.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Just ordered more clp and EK-Supremacy PreciseMount kit. Is there any change to crush the core with that kit? Can i just tighten thumb screws to end of the screw?


I'm considering getting it too. Make sure you share your experience!

From what I know the screws are designed that way to be tightened fully, so don't hesitate on that (also mentioned in the manual I think). I would advise against the use of stiff tubing though as it could put unwanted pressure in a non-balanced way.


----------



## $ilent

anyone know the ideal way to use CL LP on the die?

Ive tried 3 different ways (small amount, bigger amount, bigger amound + line under IHS) and best temps I can manage in a caseless setup with a megahalems and 2x corsair Sp120 fans leaves me still getting temps over 80C at 4.9gzh with 1.41v.

I used to get like 70C max...i cant understand it.


----------



## Daredevil 720

That's what I'm getting with an AX240 radiator & AP-15s at 4.8/1.375. I don't think you can do better with that cooler.

What's your ambient?


----------



## $ilent

id have to guess but 20C max?

I dont have thermometer but my central heating isnt on and my rooms not hot, just normal.


----------



## Daredevil 720

You should be between 20-25C then? My temps are at 30C ambient.

How did you measure your temps?

(Your setup is also caseless, forgot about that. Should make a slight difference.)


----------



## $ilent

measuring with realtemp


----------



## paulb787

I am going for it. I think i have a good understanding of what to do. This is a great thing you guys have done and without it I would not be attempting this at all!
So good job. I have IC Diamond and MX-4 available to use as of now. Would IC Diomand be ok? It does scratch the IHS wich bothers some people but not me as it gives me 5c cooler over mx-4. I am not sure however how this will work with the die itself?

Thank you,
Paul


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paulb787*
> 
> I am going for it. I think i have a good understanding of what to do. This is a great thing you guys have done and without it I would not be attempting this at all!
> So good job. I have IC Diamond and MX-4 available to use as of now. Would IC Diomand be ok? It does scratch the IHS wich bothers some people but not me as it gives me 5c cooler over mx-4. I am not sure however how this will work with the die itself?
> 
> Thank you,
> Paul


You should probably forget it if you don't have CLU instead of paste. People that try to use normal paste often seem to report that the temperatures will go back up again after a short while. It seems normal paste doesn't stay put on the die. It gets squeezed out over time. Besides possibly having to renew the paste every few days, it's also just not that good in general. You will likely be disappointed about the temperature drop you will get.

I don't know if this is true about all normal thermal paste, so better wait on someone using IC Diamond or MX-4 answering.

The system you have as your rig in your forum signature is old? It's a PC with i7-2600k. I hope that's old because i7-2600k can't be delidded or at least shouldn't.


----------



## defiler2k

Can I throw my 4770K on the list?

OCN nameefiler2k
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:4.7GHz
Temp drops:19C on load
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2897918



I was rushing through when I did it so I forgot to put a paper with my name when I took the picture.

I'm going to replace the Artic Silver with MX4 this week. And see how far I can push this chip.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I'm considering getting it too. Make sure you share your experience!
> 
> From what I know the screws are designed that way to be tightened fully, so don't hesitate on that (also mentioned in the manual I think). I would advise against the use of stiff tubing though as it could put unwanted pressure in a non-balanced way.


I always fully tighten the screws but just worried if running naked there is a change to crush core even with naked ivy kit. Im going to post installation and results after kit arrives


----------



## Speedster159

Is it a bad idea to run bare die with regular air coolers?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Can I throw my 4770K on the list?
> 
> OCN nameefiler2k
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:4.7GHz
> Temp drops:19C on load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2897918
> 
> 
> 
> I was rushing through when I did it so I forgot to put a paper with my name when I took the picture.
> 
> I'm going to replace the Artic Silver with MX4 this week. And see how far I can push this chip.


You're in! Now Slappa dat Sig on man!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> Is it a bad idea to run bare die with regular air coolers?


Yes, bad idea.

You run bare die without the socket retention system and the cpu is floating directly on the pins and its kind of a sloppy fit and some sockets that use "gold" coated pins are soft and more difficult to seat right. When you read about people not being able to boot after doing a delid there are many instances when the CPU doesn't boot because the cpu is not making good contact with all of the socket pins.

Big, awkward, heat sink isn't going to be nice to bare die cpu.

You need low profile, light weight water block for good bare die mount.

Here are some photos of bare die mounts that I have done.


----------



## Speedster159

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> Is it a bad idea to run bare die with regular air coolers?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, bad idea.
> 
> You run bare die without the socket retention system and the cpu is floating directly on the pins and its kind of a sloppy fit and some sockets that use "gold" coated pins are soft and more difficult to seat right. When you read about people not being able to boot after doing a delid there are many instances when the CPU doesn't boot because the cpu is not making good contact with all of the socket pins.
> 
> Big, awkward, heat sink isn't going to be nice to bare die cpu.
> 
> You need low profile, light weight water block for good bare die mount.
> 
> Here are some photos of bare die mounts that I have done.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...

I'm not watercooling... if i were to watercool it would probably be a AIO.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> I'm not watercooling... if i were to watercool it would probably be a AIO.


AIO is to much vibration directly on the cpu socket for my taste. Even a heat sink with a fan constantly vibrating is something that I avoid.

But... if you want to use a heat sink then you are better off not doing a bare die mount. Use the IHS with the heat sink.


----------



## self_slaughter

How about a bare die mount on the stock cooler? hahahaha, as stupid as it sounds that would probably work well for my chip lol.

Only running 4.3Ghz @ 1.187V.

Kinda wasted my time chucking a full water loop at it


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> How about a bare die mount on the stock cooler? hahahaha, as stupid as it sounds that would probably work well for my chip lol.
> 
> Only running 4.3Ghz @ 1.187V.
> 
> Kinda wasted my time chucking a full water loop at it


If the MB has the soft "Gold" coated socket pins you may end up jacking them up because they are so soft. My Z77 Mpower MB has rigid tough socket pins in comparison to my Gigabye Z87X-OC.

Stock cooler may work out for bare die because it is so low profile and relatively light weight. Also it has a nice copper surface for liquid metal TIM but you have to be careful to no let the CLP/CLU tough the aluminum because its a chemical mess and will be a mess.

Hardest part about using the stock heat sink is going to be carefully sticking MB with those plastic pressure attachments. I think you run risk of damaging socket if you don't have nice even pressure on the mount.


----------



## Speedster159

For the Die > IHS TIM what do you use? CLU or CLP?


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> For the Die > IHS TIM what do you use? CLU or CLP?


I use cl liquid pro on the die and a line under the ihs of liquid pro too. Then on top of the ihs I use pk nano.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> For the Die > IHS TIM what do you use? CLU or CLP?


I have never used the IHS since I delidded.


----------



## Speedster159

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> For the Die > IHS TIM what do you use? CLU or CLP?
> 
> 
> 
> I use cl liquid pro on the die and a line under the ihs of liquid pro too. Then on top of the ihs I use pk nano.
Click to expand...

Overall what is better, CLU or CLP?


----------



## $ilent

I think I read on here people said liquid pro is better


----------



## deepor

I read Liquid Ultra is better.


----------



## SonDa5

I have used both and off the top of my head I know the CLU is a degree or 2 better. I like how CLP spreads. CLP seems to last alot longer as well. But CLP is very difficult to clean from block.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 1.7 is ridiculous no wonder your CPU crapped out.
> 
> Use CPU-Z to see if you have C2 revision.


This. Your problem was definitely NOT running 5GHz... it was _how_ you were running it. IMO (and backed up by Intel whitepaper) as long as your temps are well below 105C and your voltages are well below 1.52V you shouldn't have problems. Now if you're way below either the other could be over - i.e. if you're around -40C then your 1.7V really wouldn't be an issue, on the other hand if you're at 1.35v and you have cores peaking at 95C you're probably also fine... although I definitely like keeping my cores under the 80C limit personally.

I'm running 5GHz @ 1.42v on my new chip and after delidding I don't even hit 75C on an IBT run. I certainly could be wrong (and I'll definitely post back if I am) but I don't expect to see any significant degradation over the use-lifetime of that chip - since that's just 2 years at most for me.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in! Now Slappa dat Sig on man!


Yey ^^ he said it


----------



## $ilent

Hi guys

I just picked up some isopropanol, is it safe to clean gpu die, gpu pcb and ihs with this?

Thanks


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have never used the IHS since I delidded.


like a boss


----------



## paulb787

I have got my tools and am going to use the knife method. I do not have clu or clp. Is this a must have? I have AS5 IC diomand and MX-4. Can I put IC Diomand on there? what are other peoples results without clu or clp. I can always order some and re-apply right? Also are you guys using the IHS or contact paper?

thanks


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paulb787*
> 
> I have got my tools and am going to use the knife method. I do not have clu or clp. Is this a must have? I have AS5 IC diomand and MX-4. Can I put IC Diomand on there? what are other peoples results without clu or clp. I can always order some and re-apply right? Also are you guys using the IHS or contact paper?
> 
> thanks


These are my temps using CL LP on the cpu die and PK nano on the ihs.


----------



## Stoffie22

Hi guys, i have a question about de-lidding my 3370K.

I have it running for about a year now but i have read on various forums ect. that some people had trouble de-lidding, once the chip had been in use for a while.
Even somewere they said you only can de-lid a fresh chip.

is there any thruth to that or can i de-lid my 3370K using the vice method with a reasonable chance of success?


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stoffie22*
> 
> Hi guys, i have a question about de-lidding my 3370K.
> 
> I have it running for about a year now but i have read on various forums ect. that some people had trouble de-lidding, once the chip had been in use for a while.
> Even somewere they said you only can de-lid a fresh chip.
> 
> is there any thruth to that or can i de-lid my 3370K using the vice method with a reasonable chance of success?


I think that there might be a change that glue gets little harder over time but I think that doesn't matter. You can always try vice method


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Hi guys
> 
> I just picked up some isopropanol, is it safe to clean gpu die, gpu pcb and ihs with this?
> 
> Thanks


It is fine, the higher the alcohol content the faster it evaporates off, but as long as there is a good amount of alcohol in it it will work fine for cleaning hardware.
I use the 99% isopropyl.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stoffie22*
> 
> Hi guys, i have a question about de-lidding my 3370K.
> 
> I have it running for about a year now but i have read on various forums ect. that some people had trouble de-lidding, once the chip had been in use for a while.
> Even somewere they said you only can de-lid a fresh chip.
> 
> is there any thruth to that or can i de-lid my 3370K using the vice method with a reasonable chance of success?


It can still be done, hard to say how much more difficult it may or may not be after the chip has been locked under the latch & heated up for a long time, but others have delidded well used chips.


----------



## $ilent

thanks ftw, I used isopropanol on the cpu die, IHS no problems.


----------



## Stoffie22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I think that there might be a change that glue gets little harder over time but I think that doesn't matter. You can always try vice method


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It can still be done, hard to say how much more difficult it may or may not be after the chip has been locked under the latch & heated up for a long time, but others have delidded well used chips.


Thanx guys for the quick replies!

De-lidding it is then.... have some CLU and some PLM on order, but seen contradicting tests as to wich is better, somebody with experience with both of these LM TIM's here?

and is there a difference if you use it between the DIE and IHS, or IHS and Cool/Water Block? or is there no such thing as one being better at a specific application?

I have partial read this threat: http://www.overclock.net/t/1376460/liquid-metal-versus-non-metal-compounds-update/0_20

But here the PLM beats the CLU, http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f136/11-waermeleitpasten-im-vergleich-831414.html


So im a bit confused now...


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stoffie22*
> 
> Thanx guys for the quick replies!
> 
> De-lidding it is then.... have some CLU and some PLM on order, but seen contradicting tests as to wich is better, somebody with experience with both of these LM TIM's here?
> 
> and is there a difference if you use it between the DIE and IHS, or IHS and Cool/Water Block? or is there no such thing as one being better at a specific application?
> 
> I have partial read this threat: http://www.overclock.net/t/1376460/liquid-metal-versus-non-metal-compounds-update/0_20
> 
> But here the PLM beats the CLU, http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f136/11-waermeleitpasten-im-vergleich-831414.html
> 
> 
> So im a bit confused now...


Look here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal

I think there's also some interesting updates on new experiments on one of the later pages.


----------



## Stoffie22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Look here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal
> 
> I think there's also some interesting updates on new experiments on one of the later pages.


YES very interesting, thanks, got to get me some pressure paper, as well, verry usefull check for contact!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have pressure paper tested my block for proper surface contact against die.
> 
> Direct to die.
> 
> 
> 
> Block to IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> The solid color shows good even contact. You can clearly see that with only the top part of the heat sink there is alot of bad contact going on and that is where you will get alot of inconsistencies when comparing different TIMS. Its that uneven space that the TIM is trying to fill and there is no way to get a good mount with it.
> 
> Don't forget about the bottom side of the die against the IHS which also has to be looked at for proper contact. I never tested the gap in between the bottom of the IHS and the die so I can't show any proof for it like I have with the IHS and DIE but with my photos I hope you understand my point about how important good even contact is.


As i am allso planning to do some lapping while im @ it.


----------



## Valgaur

I really enjoy being able to walk away and letting the people I have taught on this thread help others. Really appreciate it guys!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stoffie22*
> 
> As i am allso planning to do some lapping while im @ it.


You have to first see if your cooler isn't already shaped to worked very well with the IHS of your CPU. In the picture you've linked, that impression on the paper for the IHS is like that because the block that's used is perhaps lapped and as flat as it can be. But that's not how current coolers work. They don't have a flat base. Years ago, the first cooler with with a convex shaped base instead of flat base came out. I've seen people say that nowadays all coolers are built like that. If your cooler has a convex base, lapping the IHS will make contact worse. This means you would have to lap both your IHS and your cooler.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Wow.. that pressure paper seams like a really good idea! shows contact pressure really well! might help out a lot of the folks having trouble getting good temps ^^

Nice find! should be added to OP


----------



## Turt1e

OCN name: Turt1e
CPU: i5-4670K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4600 MHz
Temp drops: 30c from stock/20c from MX-4 on die
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2898086


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> OCN name: Turt1e
> CPU: i5-4670K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4600 MHz
> Temp drops: 30c from stock/20c from MX-4 on die
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2898086


so? you had 99-103C before delid?
and what programs did you use for stress test / temp test?

In any case.. that is a massive drop in temps! gratz.


----------



## Turt1e

Used IBT. It was throttling too so if it's probably more.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> OCN name: Turt1e
> CPU: i5-4670K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4600 MHz
> Temp drops: 30c from stock/20c from MX-4 on die
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2898086


You're in! Now Slappa dat Sig on man!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in! Now Slappa dat Sig on man!


Should have said he was turtley enough for the turtle club









a movie reference, not turtle as in slow...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Should have said he was turtley enough for the turtle club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> a movie reference, not turtle as in slow...


touche sir!


----------



## skyn3t

Time for one more naked CPU, I'm about to delid my 4770k evil chip lol it does run hot on bench .

some mixed setting's but I'm working in tune it a bit more before delid.
right now my settings are

x45
Vcore 1.36
Vring 1.25
Vrin 1.9
C states all enable.



The rest is here


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Wow.. that pressure paper seams like a really good idea! shows contact pressure really well! might help out a lot of the folks having trouble getting good temps ^^
> 
> Nice find! should be added to OP


Thank you. I think I was the first delidder to do that.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Time for one more naked CPU, I'm about to delid my 4770k evil chip lol it does run hot on bench .
> 
> some mixed setting's but I'm working in tune it a bit more before delid.
> right now my settings are
> 
> x45
> Vcore 1.36
> Vring 1.25
> Vrin 1.9
> C states all enable.
> 
> 
> 
> The rest is here


Why are you benching/stressing with an avx1 test? If you're going to use avx, why not avx2?

I talked about this a little here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1423077/i7-3770k-overclock-running-too-hot/20_20

avx2 is a lot hotter than avx which is a lot hotter than any real program (such as x264) or non avx tests - why are so many people using a middle ground? Where is the standard here?

It seems like everybody is ignoring this rather important issue


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Why are you benching/stressing with an avx1 test? If you're going to use avx, why not avx2?
> I talked about this a little here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1423077/i7-3770k-overclock-running-too-hot/20_20
> avx2 is a lot hotter than avx which is a lot hotter than any real program (such as x264) or non avx tests - why are so many people using a middle ground? Where is the standard here?
> It seems like everybody is ignoring this rather important issue


Although I can only speak for myself - I only stress test with IBT for an initial check on peak temps (I usually only run 5-10 1GB or 2GB RAM runs). As nothing I do after that will generate more heat it's pointless to use AVX2 or anything else for that matter. For stability testing I'll run some Prime95 with 90% RAM usage over night, and then from there do some transcoding, play a few recent games, and throw up a BTC miner on the GPUs for stressing. If it crashes during any of that I'll either give it another .01v vcore, drop 100MHz, or relax timings... depending on what fails and why.

I realize for the 24/7 folding crew this might not be enough - but I don't fold on my rig (I've got an old Dell server I'm going to re-purpose for that) and gaming and some light 3D rendering and photo manipulation are the hardest tasks I'll ever ask of my machine after the initial testing and benching.

I guess the better question is: Do you stress test to try to break a system - or just to see if it's stable enough to use normally? I do the latter so AVX2 (or AVX for that matter) is completely pointless. Even Prime95 is completely pointless for me... but in both cases they help identify problems somewhat faster than just jumping into a game and finding out if it's a bad config.


----------



## SonDa5

Linpack with AVX2 is not pointless on Haswell. Haswell features AVX2 processing ability so IMO its best to test max load temps with AVX2 on Haswell to determine load stability at desired speeds.

Also if you want to measure Haswell heatsink/waterblock/ thermal cooling performance you get the highest temp load range possible running AVX2 for before and after temps when testing different cooling methods.

Linpack AVX2 is the BOSS LOAD for Haswell.

GFLOP performance is indicative of total CPU/memory Frequency performance. It's pure.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I guess the better question is: Do you stress test to try to break a system - or just to see if it's stable enough to use normally? I do the latter so AVX2 (or AVX for that matter) is completely pointless.


That's exactly what i'm trying to say. To absolutely break a system or check peak temps, you go straight to avx2. To test "normal" stability and temps, you use non-avx AND real world uses of avx/avx2 like in the x264 encoder that don't have to blow up the CPU like synthetics. Linpack with avx disabled is hotter than anything i use, notably hotter than x264, for example, also. It seems everyone is using avx1 versions of IBT and Prime though and i can't see why. A variety of testing is good for determining stability, but why those tests or versions? Habit?


----------



## Cyro999

Heya dudes took some numbers:

4.0ghz 1.1vcore, 1.65vrin, super conservative settings because i don't have a 4ghz profile

avx2 linpack - linx 0.6.5 - - - max temps 76/79/79/77c - 113w cpu package power

avx1 linpack - old version from IBT - - - max temps 67/70/70/67c - 95w cpu package power

linpack without avx - occt 4.4 version - - - max temps 59/60/60/56c - 76w cpu package power

I can compare the temperatures and reported CPU package power stat to other loads, but i'm pretty sure they're pretty tightly knit together and it takes a LOT more voltage to get it anywhere near 115w with other loads

edit:

x264 encoder using avx2 - - - max temps 56/57/57/55c, 72w cpu package power - you guys see what i'm getting at?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I guess you could call it habit... but the reason I use IBT/Prime95 is that they are both fairly compact (total less than 40MB uncompressed), portable (can run from thumbdrive), and are used by the majority of overclockers/enthusiasts to a large extent.

So I can get rapid results without installing software I will later want to uninstall, no additional .Net libraries etc. to download first, and I can relate the results to those of literally thousands of others with the same hardware. As that will inevitably change over time - so will my selections of programs for stress testing and benchmarking. However, the only thing I really care about is getting a starting point to make sure that I'm not way off base in my config... after that I'm perfectly fine just saying "it works for me - so SHUT IT!"









On that note...

My new 3770K for my main rig...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!





...and my newly 're-calibrated delidding block'...

...is much easier to control precisely.


And the results...



Of particular note and comparison (both after 10 IBT runs, a CPU/GPU run of Cinebench, a Furmark run, and a few hours of Prime95 - although I forgot to screen cap the initial run so I just ran another 10 mins for that cap.







)

My old chip ran like this:

The new one like this:











Same TIMs and cooling system used for both (CLU on die, PK-1 on IHS).


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I guess you could call it habit... but the reason I use IBT/Prime95 is that they are both fairly compact (total less than 40MB uncompressed), portable (can run from thumbdrive), and are used by the majority of overclockers/enthusiasts to a large extent.


You misunderstand partly:

I get those reasons. You want to use linpack, good. Why are saying hey, here's 3 versions: One without avx, one with avx1, one with avx2. The avx2 is best for simulating worst case stability and power/heat by far - the one that doesn't use avx is still slightly hotter than real world loads. Lets use the middle one!

Like people are specifically picking out pre-haswell versions of prime and IBT, refusing to use avx2 but also refusing to use non-avx or real world avx in favor of a bad middle ground. I don't understand, and it concerns me that few people seem to put a lot of thought into it. Am i wrong with anything i'm saying?

It applies mostly to Haswell.

Grats on the 5ghz chip!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You misunderstand partly:
> 
> I get those reasons. You want to use linpack, good. Why are saying hey, here's 3 versions: One without avx, one with avx1, one with avx2. The avx2 is best for simulating worst case stability and power/heat by far - the one that doesn't use avx is still slightly hotter than real world loads. Lets use the middle one!
> 
> Like people are specifically picking out pre-haswell versions of prime and IBT, refusing to use avx2 but also refusing to use non-avx or real world avx in favor of a bad middle ground. I don't understand, and it concerns me that few people seem to put a lot of thought into it. Am i wrong with anything i'm saying?
> 
> Grats on the 5ghz chip!


I get your reasons too... however a few minor points:

I do not now, nor am I likely ever to have a Haswell - at least not in my main rig (at least not unless there's something I find that a 5GHz 3770K can't handle... but somehow a 4770K can). If I replace my Ivy with anything it will be IB-E on X79 (although I would prefer to wait until X99 and do another 3-4 year cycle) - so it does not make sense to stress with avx2 whatsoever. It would make _some_ sense to stress with non-avx linpack - and I've used OCCT on some occasions as well... however, it's footprint is nowhere near as 'lean' as IBT - so it gets less use from me.

*In other words, the middle one is the only synthetic stressor that does make sense to use...*









I think the bottom line is that you are worrying about nothing IMO - and essentially it's the same as 'worrying' about people using one OS or driving one brand of car over another. If you're NOT developing the cure for cancer, designing a solution for homeless housing, or plotting trajectories to Mars for manned launches.... who cares what you do with your system... and if you are - for the love of God, please don't overclock... just let it take a couple more minutes and get it right the first time.

On the other hand if the worst thing that could happen is you lose your progress since the last savegame... it was probably time to just go outside or read a book anyway.


----------



## Cyro999

Ok, thanks for your opinion, much easier to think now 

I'd like for more people to be aware of the differences and different types of stress etc, especially with the very wide gap (+50% power usage on the same voltage and clock speed) and resultant temperature eruption (that it seems everybody was freaking out about) just in general. It's good to know and understand more


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stoffie22*
> 
> Hi guys, i have a question about de-lidding my 3370K.
> 
> I have it running for about a year now but i have read on various forums ect. that some people had trouble de-lidding, once the chip had been in use for a while.
> Even somewere they said you only can de-lid a fresh chip.
> 
> is there any thruth to that or can i de-lid my 3370K using the vice method with a reasonable chance of success?


I just did my buddies 3770K yesterday that he had been using for over a year, and the glue does stiffen a bit more but I didn't use more force than on my month old 4770K just a couple of extra hits with the hammer and it was out, overall nothing too difficult.


----------



## rickyman0319

do u guys put TIM on the die? a small dot or a line on it?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> do u guys put TIM on the die? a small dot or a line on it?


I spread CLU on my die with the included brushes to ensure it was an even application.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Ok, thanks for your opinion, much easier to think now
> 
> I'd like for more people to be aware of the differences and different types of stress etc, especially with the very wide gap (+50% power usage on the same voltage and clock speed) and resultant temperature eruption (that it seems everybody was freaking out about) just in general. It's good to know and understand more


I think that is a very good thing - more education rarely results in an intellectual deficit (at least up to a point).









I agree that there is not a lot of readily available information or analysis of the differences of avx vs avx2 vs no-avx processing - specifically as it pertains to Linpack testing. I think your thread will hopefully serve to rectify that (at least on this site). However, I also think that the value of synthetic stress tests and benchmarks have been significantly overstated in general - and I think it's also possible to get lost in the minutiae of testing methodologies and miss the bigger picture.

I just wanted to provide a counterpoint to the position... I hope it didn't come across as anything other than that.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> do u guys put TIM on the die? a small dot or a line on it?


I put a small blob of CL LP on the die then spread it out evenly with a q tip until its even like a mirror. I then put a smaller dot on the underside part of the IHs that will be making contact with cpu die then make that out to be the same shape as the cpu die too.


----------



## arrow0309

What version of linx do we, ivy bridge owners, have to use in order to get the avx1 extension only, less bsod & issues, less vcore and temps?
Also trying to get stable with various versions of linx at 4.8ghz I often get the 124 bsod, do you confirm it's vcore (low) related and not vtt related like the old I7 920's? I'm using a 1.20v vtt and ram at 1.65v (2400 @ 9-11-11-31-1T)
Thanks


----------



## Stoffie22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You have to first see if your cooler isn't already shaped to worked very well with the IHS of your CPU. In the picture you've linked, that impression on the paper for the IHS is like that because the block that's used is perhaps lapped and as flat as it can be. But that's not how current coolers work. They don't have a flat base. Years ago, the first cooler with with a convex shaped base instead of flat base came out. I've seen people say that nowadays all coolers are built like that. If your cooler has a convex base, lapping the IHS will make contact worse. This means you would have to lap both your IHS and your cooler.


Thanx for that advice! guess ill be lapping both then.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> I just did my buddies 3770K yesterday that he had been using for over a year, and the glue does stiffen a bit more but I didn't use more force than on my month old 4770K just a couple of extra hits with the hammer and it was out, overall nothing too difficult.


Exelent! Good to hear such a story, gives me some reassurance.









Thanks all you guys, u're the best


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I guess you could call it habit... but the reason I use IBT/Prime95 is that they are both fairly compact (total less than 40MB uncompressed), portable (can run from thumbdrive), and are used by the majority of overclockers/enthusiasts to a large extent.
> 
> So I can get rapid results without installing software I will later want to uninstall, no additional .Net libraries etc. to download first, and I can relate the results to those of literally thousands of others with the same hardware. As that will inevitably change over time - so will my selections of programs for stress testing and benchmarking. However, the only thing I really care about is getting a starting point to make sure that I'm not way off base in my config... after that I'm perfectly fine just saying "it works for me - so SHUT IT!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On that note...
> 
> My new 3770K for my main rig...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and my newly 're-calibrated delidding block'...
> 
> ...is much easier to control precisely.
> 
> 
> And the results...
> 
> 
> 
> Of particular note and comparison (both after 10 IBT runs, a CPU/GPU run of Cinebench, a Furmark run, and a few hours of Prime95 - although I forgot to screen cap the initial run so I just ran another 10 mins for that cap.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> My old chip ran like this:
> 
> The new one like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same TIMs and cooling system used for both (CLU on die, PK-1 on IHS).


I'm quite jealous, my 3770k runs like your old chip, take a ****load of volts for a Medium to High OC. Currently running at 4.5 Ghz @ 1.32 volts, very stable, I have to jump up to about 1.45 also for 4.7, 4.8 is obtainable but only at around 1.51 v and I can't even get 4.9 to boot


----------



## $ilent

^damm thats tough, my 3770 does 4.7 at 1.26 p95 stable, but 4.9 takes 1.4v


----------



## rickyman0319

how do u guys put the IHS and PCB in a socket?

what do u guys use to protrect the contact thing next to the Die?


----------



## skyn3t

As a promise I did probe my mobo today and here are the result Idle and under load included screen shot.
Probe points on Asus MVI Formula
Software used
Asus AI suite 3, HWiNFO, HwMonitor & CPU-Z.

*IDLE*

V-in - 1.75
V-core - 1.37
IO-D - 1.01
IO-A - 1.01
SA - 0.88
RING - 1.26
DRAM - 1.51
PCH - 1.04
PCH-IO 1.50
___________________

*Underload*

V-in - 1.75
V-core - 1.38
IO-D - 1.02
IO-A - 1.02
SA - 0.88
RING - 1.27
DRAM - 1.51
PCH - 1.04
PCH-IO - 1.50
For better reading right click on this image and open new tab to full screen.


Post your comments.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> how do u guys put the IHS and PCB in a socket?
> 
> what do u guys use to protrect the contact thing next to the Die?


Simple









After coating the die with your preferred TIM, place it gently in its socket and make sure it sits right, then place the IHS on top of it and try to center it as good as possible.
I used the socket clamp to guide the IHS as close to center as possible.
The clamp will slight forward when closing, so make sure to have a firm grip on the IHS so it doesn't slight with it.
Some might put the IHS a bit higher, so the clamp slighting will bring the IHS down to center. I believe this to be somewhat stressful to the die.. so I would suggest holding the IHS in place rather than letting it slight.


----------



## rickyman0319

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Simple
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After coating the die with your preferred TIM, place it gently in its socket and make sure it sits right, then place the IHS on top of it and try to center it as good as possible.
> I used the socket clamp to guide the IHS as close to center as possible.
> The clamp will slight forward when closing, so make sure to have a firm grip on the IHS so it doesn't slight with it.
> Some might put the IHS a bit higher, so the clamp slighting will bring the IHS down to center. I believe this to be somewhat stressful to the die.. so I would suggest holding the IHS in place rather than letting it slight.


I am wondering if I can just put the PCB only not the IHS. then I put the H80I on the Die. will it works or not?

what thing u guys use to protect the contact?

I think I will use GC extreme into the die. it is not conductive like CLU.

what do u guys use to protect from contact ( the thing next to the die) from CLU/CLP?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> I am wondering if I can just put the PCB only not the IHS. then I put the H80I on the Die. will it works or not?
> 
> what thing u guys use to protect the contact?
> 
> I think I will use GC extreme into the die. it is not conductive like CLU.
> 
> what do u guys use to protect from contact ( the thing next to the die) from CLU/CLP?


I don't think an H80i will work with bare die - it is designed to fit on the IHS and so might not make good contact with the die itself. Also the IHS is what locks the CPU in the socket, so to run bare die you need something that will put the right amount of force to hold the CPU in there securely. In short, don't bother.

And you can use a non-conductive TIM to cover those on-chip surface mount capacitors.


----------



## rickyman0319

can I use GC extreme or x32 TIM for the contact?

can I use this? MASSCOOL G751 Shin-Etsu Thermal Interface Material


----------



## Forceman

The Gelid Extreme and the Shin-Etsu should both be fine. I'm not familiar with the x32.


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Reading more about this conductivity has confused me. If I just delid, put CLU on and nothing else, is that bad? This is Ivy (3570K).


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> Reading more about this conductivity has confused me. If I just delid, put CLU on and nothing else, is that bad? This is Ivy (3570K).


It's fine on Ivy. It's only a [possible] issue on Haswell because it has exposed electrical contacts under the IHS.


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Right thanks, just want to be as screw up free as I can. What about voltages? I'm at 4.5 with 1.26 currently. I didn't mess with it for long (100C+ the second I start up Prime), but playing games for a few hours seemed to be stable at 4.7 with 1.37v. I'm on air, don't use turbo boost, slightly concerned about having the system at 1.37v 24/7.


----------



## Forceman

Why not set up the power saving features then? They work well with overclocking Ivy, and they'll save wear and tear on the CPU.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Why not set up the power saving features then? They work well with overclocking Ivy, and they'll save wear and tear on the CPU.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> I'm quite jealous, my 3770k runs like your old chip, take a ****load of volts for a Medium to High OC. Currently running at 4.5 Ghz @ 1.32 volts, very stable, I have to jump up to about 1.45 also for 4.7, 4.8 is obtainable but only at around 1.51 v and I can't even get 4.9 to boot


Believe me, I feel your pain... I've moved the old chip into my workstation at the office - and I just have it set so that it runs on all defaults with turbo ratio upped to 4.3GHz (all I do is write code and browse the web mostly on this machine - so it's way overpowered for it's intended use). I tried my best to just be satisfied with the old chip... but decided that it was pretty stupid to have dumped this much money into a custom loop and related hardware only to put one of the worst clocking 3770K's I've heard of in it.
 








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> I am wondering if I can just put the PCB only not the IHS. then I put the H80I on the Die. will it works or not?
> what thing u guys use to protect the contact?
> I think I will use GC extreme into the die. it is not conductive like CLU.
> what do u guys use to protect from contact ( the thing next to the die) from CLU/CLP?


I would definitely not recommend going bare die with an H80i - since I'm assuming that it's identical to the H100i I'm using at my office. It's simply not adjustable enough to get a reliable contact without risking too much pressure (or too little possibly as well). You really need a block and mount with a spring loaded retention mechanism to pull that off. Obviously the blocks designed for bare-die (EK has one) are best... but really the IHS, provided the TIM is good (CLU/CLP/etc) and the application is correct, doesn't add much thermal resistance to the equation and it does provide a great deal of protection for the die itself.

I've heard of people using nail polish on the VRMs, or plasti-dip too, although I think I'd probably go with the suggested non-conductive TIM on them... the heat isn't an issue, so all you really need is to protect them from runoff. If you are applying CLU/CLP with the brushes as a very thin layer and either put none on the underside of the IHS or only a very small amount directly in the middle of the stain from the Intel stuff... you shouldn't really need anything. When I pulled my 3770K and checked the CLU on the die there was absolutely no runoff at all (a tiny amount was on the side of the die itself, but there was none on the surrounding 'glue' between the die and the PCB face).

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Why not set up the power saving features then? They work well with overclocking Ivy, and they'll save wear and tear on the CPU.


This. In addition to the fact that you save money for electricity and possibly cooling (if you're running the A/C more because of a hot PC in the room with you)... you are reducing the possibility of long term stresses/leakage causing degradation. Yet you still get 100% of your OC for when you actually need it... seems win-win to me!


----------



## NIK1

I Delided my I5 3570k yesterday with the vice method and all went fine. I am picking up some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra later today to use between the dye and the IHS. Yesterday,I used some Arctic mx4 between the dye and the IHS and got a 8-9 degree drop in temps at load with prime. When I pick up the ultra I will put it between the dye and the IHS and test it.Would you recommend I put the Ultra also on the cpu cover too. My water block is a swiftech h220 and its all copper.Or,should I use another Tim on the cover/water block like, Arctic MX4 or IC Diamond 7 .What do you recommend for best results.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> Right thanks, just want to be as screw up free as I can. What about voltages? I'm at 4.5 with 1.26 currently. I didn't mess with it for long (100C+ the second I start up Prime), but playing games for a few hours seemed to be stable at 4.7 with 1.37v. I'm on air, don't use turbo boost, slightly concerned about having the system at 1.37v 24/7.


That happened to me and it turns out I didn't have enough tim on the cup die.


----------



## YounGMessiah

Got my IHS off , when I get home from work I will apply the CLU and put back my NH-D14.

Tried to do the vice method first, but no luck and didn't want to keep trying, so I just got a decent razor blade and took me about 30 seconds to get it off haha


----------



## Cookybiscuit

I turned off Turbo Boost because it supposedly improves stability, I haven't tried it in a while but I used to be getting BSOD's everywhere with Turbo Boost turned on and the same multiplier and voltage I have now. I'll have to retest them.


----------



## YounGMessiah

After delidding my i5-3570K, messing up on the first application lol and hitting 105 C jeez! I redid the application and got it right! Now on loads I hit max 62 C, before it used to 75-85 C, so as you see thats a 13-23 degree difference! Its real epic and amazing









Idle improved from 5-10 C


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YounGMessiah*
> 
> After delidding my i5-3570K, messing up on the first application lol and hitting 105 C jeez! I redid the application and got it right! Now on loads I hit max 62 C, before it used to 75-85 C, so as you see thats a 13-23 degree difference! Its real epic and amazing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Idle improved from 5-10 C


The application of the CL LP on the cpu die makes all the difference. I used small amount got 80C+ temps, used even less got instant 100C temps upon load, put more CL LP on and a line of CL LP under the ihs, temps maxed out at 70C.


----------



## thfallen

OCN name: thfallen
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: clu
IHS TIM: clu
Mhz gained: dunno (delid when i took it out of the box)
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: dunno (delid when i took it out of the box)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thfallen*
> 
> OCN name: thfallen
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: clu
> IHS TIM: clu
> Mhz gained: dunno (delid when i took it out of the box)
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: dunno (delid when i took it out of the box)


You're in! Slappa dat sig on man!


----------



## kvickstick

OCN Name: Kvickstick
CPU: Intel Core i7 3770K
On Die-TIM: CLU
IHS-TIM: No IHS installed
Mhz Gained: 300
OC after delid: 5000 Mhz
Temp drops: 25
Cooler: EK-Supremacy with PreciseMount Add-On
CPU-Z Validation Of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2898447


----------



## Supacasey

Haven't checked on this thread in a while, any more developments on those two 4770k's that cracked?


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Ive got a 3770k.

It does 4.7 giggles on cheap air, at 80c

I slap on my raystorm and its still Getting to 80c, it even tops 100c after 10 munites.

Delided it and the temps didn't change much.

I Was going to write a very Angry letter to xspx until i realized that my water is cool even When cpu runs at 100c.

A while later i Figured my water is running the Wrong way xD Expect A 40c drop once i fix my loop.

That poor 3770k... it even have a few scraches from a rusty blade


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kvickstick*
> 
> OCN Name: Kvickstick
> CPU: Intel Core i7 3770K
> On Die-TIM: CLU
> IHS-TIM: No IHS installed
> Mhz Gained: 300
> OC after delid: 5000 Mhz
> Temp drops: 25
> Cooler: EK-Supremacy with PreciseMount Add-On
> CPU-Z Validation Of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2898447


You're in!







Slappa that sig on!


----------



## Stoffie22

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Ive got a 3770k.
> 
> It does 4.7 giggles on cheap air, at 80c
> 
> I slap on my raystorm and its still Getting to 80c, it even tops 100c after 10 munites.
> 
> Delided it and the temps didn't change much.
> 
> I Was going to write a very Angry letter to xspx until i realized that my water is cool even When cpu runs at 100c.
> 
> A while later i Figured my water is running the Wrong way xD Expect A 40c drop once i fix my loop.
> 
> That poor 3770k... it even have a few scraches from a rusty blade


WOW LOL Lucky U're on the North-Pole then! Or it would have been fried.


----------



## luckymatt

I'm planning on running with the lid on for awhile, I'm taking my sweet time with the overclock and want to see how far I can go with the thermals...

I'm lapping lid and waterblock today, and just wondering about using the CLU instead of AS5 for IHS to Waterblock interface. I've seen that the CLU can stain the surface of the block/heatsink, but is there's no actual "damage" from that, right? I mean as far as heat capacity etc. Both materials are copper (well the IHS will be after the lapping), so there should be no damage like there would be if it were aluminum?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rickyman0319*
> 
> I am wondering if I can just put the PCB only not the IHS. then I put the H80I on the Die. will it works or not?
> 
> what thing u guys use to protect the contact?
> 
> I think I will use GC extreme into the die. it is not conductive like CLU.
> 
> what do u guys use to protect from contact ( the thing next to the die) from CLU/CLP?


I use Liquid Electrical tape to cover the components on my 4770K, I pan to run without a lid but Im waiting for my EK kit to do so but the best way to protect the electrical components next to the die on haswell would be liquid electrical tape, you can just peel it off if you do it wrong and it can stand the heat quite easily.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Finally, fixed the temperature problems.




It's amazing how powerfull these Ivys are. Using a single core at 5Ghz its twices as fast as a 3.2Ghz i3 550 or a 4.2Ghz FX6100.

Definately an upgrade over my FX6100









I'm using Raystorm EX360 1200rpms fans. At 4.8Ghz it only needs 1.33V, tops out at 80C.

I'm sure I can lower the temps even more if I remount my IHS, since core 0 is about 20C cooler than the rest under full load.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hello







!

What happened tot he OP's list !?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Hello
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> What happened tot he OP's list !?


OCN is being a bit weird today, there have been some disappearing & reappearing quotes & text.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> OCN is being a bit weird today, there have been some disappearing & reappearing quotes & text.


Are you guys overclocking your Intel SSDs already ?


----------



## Chomuco

Coolaboratory CLU-CLP removal and installation - Video


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> OCN is being a bit weird today, there have been some disappearing & reappearing quotes & text.


yup IB thread - the whole thing disappeared.
No idea why they've changed the look of the "images" etc

YUP had to do the same for my Antec thread :/


----------



## Chomuco

sorry


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Hello
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !
> 
> What happened tot he OP's list !?
> 
> 
> 
> OCN is being a bit weird today, there have been some disappearing & reappearing quotes & text.
Click to expand...

Fixed.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Fixed.


wait... w...what?


----------



## alancsalt

So far today I have encountered three threads (and expecting more) where the OP is only showing one or two sentences. Rest of content failing to display. I assume either a glitch or update glitch, don't know.

Can be fixed by cutting content and pasting into notepad. Submit and save a short sentence like "Thread under repair" Then repost the original content. A simple resubmission without saving a nearly empty post in between has not worked for me.

So far: Fixed
Ivy Bridge Overclocking Guide ► Asus Motherboards
[Official] Delidded Club
[Official] ASUS ROG Rampage IV X79 Owner's Club

EDIT:
Also:
Nvidia GeForce GTX TITAN Owners' club
*[Official] 5GHz Overclock Club*

If you find others, give me a PM...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Actually the easiest way (No mod did it for me on the Antec thread, I did it myself) - is to go to "previous versions" and "restore earlier versions"


----------



## alancsalt

You didn't lose the last edit?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> You didn't lose the last edit?


Doesnt' look like it.
Unless I forgot about something I added to the OP lol (which is quite probable)

http://www.overclock.net/t/990111/official-antec-k-hler-h2o-620-920-owners-club/4710#post_20684937

Last thing I added - and that was there.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> Haven't checked on this thread in a while, any more developments on those two 4770k's that cracked?


They are probably broke.

Were they delidded with Razer or Hammer?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> They are probably broke.
> 
> Were they delidded with Razer or Hammer?


If i remember correctly they were vice method but I think it was a manufacturing defect. I also asked Intel about helping these guys out but sadly they could as their IHS's were lapped..... SO that being said I don't recommend Lapping anymore as Intel will let you glue it back on and RMA it. The reason being is they do so with the numbering system on the IHS and if thats gone... welp...


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If i remember correctly they were vice method but I think it was a manufacturing defect. I also asked Intel about helping these guys out but sadly they could as their IHS's were lapped..... SO that being said I don't recommend Lapping anymore as Intel will let you glue it back on and RMA it. The reason being is they do so with the numbering system on the IHS and if thats gone... welp...


Whoa. I wasn't aware that Intel was cool with the warranty when glueing IHS back on. Nice. Alot more incentive to delid a hot IB/HW CPU.

Also another reason to not use the VICE method which IMO can cause the IHS to warp and not sit right. Razer seems more kosher for protecting IHS.


----------



## pandalin

The guy that was contacted from intel was tech support, and they generally are unaware of these matters. That's why i asked earlier if the two guys with the delidded broken cpus actually sent them to intel and if they got replacements.


----------



## Cr4zy

I didn't send my cracked 4770k back to anyone, just chalked it up as bad luck and bought a new one. Which I then promptly also killed by putting it into the motherboard that my cracked cpu came from. So I had to rma both the cpu and board.

Everything works now, runs stupidly hot, but I don't want to delid again unless I buy a new non bowed water block.


----------



## self_slaughter

Grabbed my 2nd 4770K today, 70'C at stock settings under water.... *sigh*

Gunna play with it a bit over the weekend and decide if I wanna delid it when I go back to work on Tuesday or sell it and get a 4930K and never have to worry about this business again lol.

Hmm, actually I wonder if there's a vice in the shed at home... hahahaha

Time for a quick looksie!

edit: Turns out I do have a vice lol... time for a quick feed of pizza while I let IBT run for a bit then I'll knock the top off her and see how she fares


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Grabbed my 2nd 4770K today, 70'C at stock settings under water.... *sigh*


What testing? Some stress tests draw 50% more power than other stuff that maxes the CPU. Hwinfo has a reading for CPU package power which is very strongly correlated to temps


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> What testing? Some stress tests draw 50% more power than other stuff that maxes the CPU. Hwinfo has a reading for CPU package power which is very strongly correlated to temps


IBT... go hard or go home I reckon









I just went and got pizza, came home and delidded the cpu already lol.

Went from about 78'C max to about 58'C so pretty happy with that for a quick n lazy effort









Core 3 seems about 4' higher then the rest now though ~62'C so I might of been a bit sloppy with the paste but not enough of an issue to bother remounting anything.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Whoa. I wasn't aware that Intel was cool with the warranty when glueing IHS back on. Nice. Alot more incentive to delid a hot IB/HW CPU.
> 
> Also another reason to not use the VICE method which IMO can cause the IHS to warp and not sit right. Razer seems more kosher for protecting IHS.


I'm not sure how many vise-delids you've done, but I'm on my fourth now and there's no warping or marring at all - the socket retention bracket does way more damage to the IHS just clamping down on the side bars. Not saying there can't be warping if someone is really aggressive when clamping it down, but if they're warping anything - they're already doing it wrong.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *self_slaughter*
> 
> IBT... go hard or go home I reckon
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just went and got pizza, came home and delidded the cpu already lol.
> 
> Went from about 78'C max to about 58'C so pretty happy with that for a quick n lazy effort
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Core 3 seems about 4' higher then the rest now though ~62'C so I might of been a bit sloppy with the paste but not enough of an issue to bother remounting anything.


I've found that unless I run a test for a very, very long time (at least 14+ hrs) there's often a 4-6 degree difference between the cores even on the best application. The biggest thing is that your hottest core is at a temperature that's still very far below the limit... so I wouldn't worry about that at all. Even if you were perfect, it's unlikely you could ever perfectly load all 4 cores to create exactly the same temps... at least not with an OS running underneath it... there's always a handful of threads for Windows creating slightly higher loading on one or more of the cores during testing.

Regardless, good job and congratulations!


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I'm not sure how many vise-delids you've done, but I'm on my fourth now and there's no warping or marring at all - the socket retention bracket does way more damage to the IHS just clamping down on the side bars. Not saying there can't be warping if someone is really aggressive when clamping it down, but if they're warping anything - they're already doing it wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've found that unless I run a test for a very, very long time (at least 14+ hrs) there's often a 4-6 degree difference between the cores even on the best application. The biggest thing is that your hottest core is at a temperature that's still very far below the limit... so I wouldn't worry about that at all. Even if you were perfect, it's unlikely you could ever perfectly load all 4 cores to create exactly the same temps... at least not with an OS running underneath it... there's always a handful of threads for Windows creating slightly higher loading on one or more of the cores during testing.
> 
> Regardless, good job and congratulations!


Cheers,

This one delidded real easy to!
First one moved about 2 cms when it came free.
This one didn't move at all, just seen it move then come back after I hit it and it just peeled off by hand after that








Still, 20'C drop for all of 5 minutes work is pretty good value!
Even managed to do it without pulling my loop down again hahaha, so lazy









I haven't put any marks on mine either in the 2 that I've done.
I think some people just do it way too tight and hit it way too hard....
A little common sense goes a long way!


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Whoa. I wasn't aware that Intel was cool with the warranty when glueing IHS back on. Nice. Alot more incentive to delid a hot IB/HW CPU.
> 
> Also another reason to not use the VICE method which IMO can cause the IHS to warp and not sit right. Razer seems more kosher for protecting IHS.


Cool if intel will honor their warranty after a delid, I didnt think they would.

The vice method if done carefully should not warp the IHS, I have done 4770K's and 3770K's without warping it just requires some caution.


----------



## Speedster159

Anybody got a link to the two cracked 4770k's? I wanna read.

How does the Intel glueing the IHS back on thing go?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> Anybody got a link to the two cracked 4770k's? I wanna read.
> 
> How does the Intel glueing the IHS back on thing go?


Here is a thread on reglueing.

http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=377338

Personally I don't see the point. The glue causes the IHS to not sit as snug on the die. If you use a good TIM like CLU/CLP it is so thin that you want the IHS to sit as snug as possible to the die.

Adding glue to IHS is a waste of time IMO. The only time you should ever have to do it is when you want to send it back to Intel to be serviced under warranty if needed.

If you delid correctly and safely over clock no higher than 1.52v on IB I don't think the IB will die within the 3 year warranty period unless the chip is running extremely hot but when you delid and properly cool with a good heat sink the chip is going to last longer.

I don't recommend CLU/CLP on top of IHS because it will more than likely take the markings off when you clean off the TIM and if you ever need to send the chip to Intel the markings are required.

Best mount for delid is NO IHS. Just bare die with a good water block.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I'm not sure how many vise-delids you've done!


0 and I never plan on using Vise and hammer method.

I have done 3 delids with 3570k, 3770k, and 4770k without any problems and have had good results on each, ALL RAZOR.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 0 and I never plan on using Vise and hammer method.
> 
> I have done 3 delids with 3570k, 3770k, and 4770k without any problems and have had good results on each, ALL RAZOR.


Well then, that completely explains it.... I feel exactly the same about using a razor.

However despite the fact that I would never, under any circumstances try another delid with a razor (my experience was nearly disastrous - to both my die and my fingers) I wouldn't tell people that it isn't a good idea. I was under the impression that you were speaking from experience and had somehow had a problem with the vise method yourself. I also have done 3 vise-delids and two razor attempts... only the first razor was a fail - the second one was aborted before it wound up like the first... and got me to try the vise... it was off and running 21C cooler within 8 mins of that decision.









(In either case, I think it depends mostly on what you're comfortable with and to some extent the clearance between the PCB and the IHS pre-delid)


----------



## faygokris

OK can someone answer this question here.

My cpu will be under an SS phase unit, if I delid my 4770k do i need to reseal the IHS to prevent condensation from forming underneath the IHS?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *faygokris*
> 
> OK can someone answer this question here.
> 
> My cpu will be under an SS phase unit, if I delid my 4770k do i need to reseal the IHS to prevent condensation from forming underneath the IHS?


Admittedly I'm far to inexperienced with sub-zero cooling to be your best bet for an answer... but off the top of my head I would say A) don't bother with the delid or B) reseal completely. Naturally, the biggest issue will be the amount of humidity in the air at the time of resealing and the heat put off by the die should eliminate significant condensation... but at the very least you would want to have the VRM bank coated with liquid electrical tape or non-conductive resin, etc... Beyond that I don't see the condensation doing anything more to the rest of the chip PCB than anything else... but if you're going to -30C... do you really care about a relatively small difference. I'm figuring that the 20C+ some of us see on the _plus_ side of freezing will not be anything very impressive on the other side... I'm figuring a difference of less than 1C is quite likely.

However, as I haven't actually _done it_ this is purely conjecture and I'd love to hear what your results are if you don't mind doing some runs pre-delid and post delid. It would be really cool to know if the difference is completely proportional or simply a factor of TIM thermal conductivity over die dissipation.


----------



## Hyolyn

Can the Noctua NT-H1 be used on a delid, and how good is it compared to the others?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hyolyn*
> 
> Can the Noctua NT-H1 be used on a delid, and how good is it compared to the others?


Anything can be used on a delid - even the AS5 should do slightly better than the OEM paste - although not because the OEM stuff isn't as good... but because the gap caused by the glue... as long as the TIM is better than air... it's better than a bad seat on the IHS.

On the other side of your question - it's definitely not going to be as good as CLU/CLP, and probably not as good as MX4 or PK-1 even for that matter... but it will still run cooler _after_ delidding than it did before (or it _should_ at the very least).

There are many good review of different TIMs - lookup "thermal paste shootout" "TIM reviews" or similar... there are some on here and several on other enthusiast sites (there are a few in this very thread and you can just search for them).


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *faygokris*
> 
> OK can someone answer this question here.
> 
> My cpu will be under an SS phase unit, if I delid my 4770k do i need to reseal the IHS to prevent condensation from forming underneath the IHS?


I don't personally have experience, but I remember FTW (OCN member who benches) said, that you shouldn't de-lid if you are putting it under an LN2 pot or whatnot. It actually makes the chip less capable of achieving higher OC's for some reason.
I can't tell you why, but that's what I remember him saying.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Admittedly I'm far to inexperienced with sub-zero cooling to be your best bet for an answer... but off the top of my head I would say A) don't bother with the delid or B) reseal completely. Naturally, the biggest issue will be the amount of humidity in the air at the time of resealing and the heat put off by the die should eliminate significant condensation... but at the very least you would want to have the VRM bank coated with liquid electrical tape or non-conductive resin, etc... Beyond that I don't see the condensation doing anything more to the rest of the chip PCB than anything else... but if you're going to -30C... do you really care about a relatively small difference. I'm figuring that the 20C+ some of us see on the _plus_ side of freezing will not be anything very impressive on the other side... I'm figuring a difference of less than 1C is quite likely.
> 
> However, as I haven't actually _done it_ this is purely conjecture and I'd love to hear what your results are if you don't mind doing some runs pre-delid and post delid. It would be really cool to know if the difference is completely proportional or simply a factor of TIM thermal conductivity over die dissipation.


Good response

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hyolyn*
> 
> Can the Noctua NT-H1 be used on a delid, and how good is it compared to the others?


By this you mean ON or BELOW the IHS?
You should ONLY use CLU/P on the DIE.
When it comes to ON the IHS - that can be argued, but Noctua or MX2/4 is more than good enough.


----------



## OpenFerret

Hi all,

Can I join club and promote my new build log for a delidded 4770K?

Pics can be seen here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1424810/new-watercooling-build-4770k#post_20757641


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OpenFerret*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Can I join club and promote my new build log for a delidded 4770K?
> 
> Pics can be seen here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1424810/new-watercooling-build-4770k#post_20757641


submit the required information from the front page and I'll throw you in!!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *faygokris*
> 
> OK can someone answer this question here.
> 
> My cpu will be under an SS phase unit, if I delid my 4770k do i need to reseal the IHS to prevent condensation from forming underneath the IHS?


Shouldn't really matter if the IHS is sealed to the PCB or not, you will want to seal up everything under the latch so the socket is airtight. If running 24/7 with the SS you will probably want to grease the socket before putting the cpu in as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I don't personally have experience, but I remember FTW (OCN member who benches) said, that you shouldn't de-lid if you are putting it under an LN2 pot or whatnot. It actually makes the chip less capable of achieving higher OC's for some reason.
> I can't tell you why, but that's what I remember him saying.
> Good response
> By this you mean ON or BELOW the IHS?
> You should ONLY use CLU/P on the DIE.
> When it comes to ON the IHS - that can be argued, but Noctua or MX2/4 is more than good enough.


Delidding mainly affected the absolute max clocks with ivy bridge, so really only mattered for ln2 cooling. Looks like the 4770k is similar although not as drastic, most extreme coolers delidding ivy were losing about 200mhz off the previous max, the report I've seen for 4770k was that after delidding it lost about 50mhz.

But air, water & phase cooled, delidding still drops the temps & helps the clocks.
Just makes me sad to see the really golden ln2 monster chips that could be breaking records get beheaded.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Thanks for confirming!


----------



## OpenFerret

Will get back to you, haven't even finished rig or even turned it on yet, just went straight to delidding!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OpenFerret*
> 
> Will get back to you, haven't even finished rig or even turned it on yet, just went straight to delidding!


----------



## Agoniizing




----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> By this you mean ON or BELOW the IHS?
> You should ONLY use CLU/P on the DIE.


You shouldn't use CLP on anything you want to reuse. After a few months like in my case, CLP requires pliers to remove from copper to copper, and excessive strength to remove from die to copper, and can result in the die cracking, like my 690 for example. Have not tried CLU for that long of a time period.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You shouldn't use CLP on anything you want to reuse. After a few months like in my case, CLP requires pliers to remove from copper to copper, and excessive strength to remove from die to copper, and can result in the die cracking, like my 690 for example. Have not tried CLU for that long of a time period.


my H100 to IHS was kinda tough to pop off but it was turned off for around a week before hand. my die and underside IHS no problem still like normal.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> my H100 to IHS was kinda tough to pop off but it was turned off for around a week before hand. my die and underside IHS no problem still like normal.


Yes same for my 3770k, if I remember correctly my 3770k slipped right off of the IHS. I had to damage my waterblock's inlets/outlets with pliers to get it off the IHS because I couldn't get it off the socket retention bracket. Got my GPU waterblock off using my hands, had to twist a little, but half the die went off with it, it almost looked like there was no die to begin with, could not find the broken piece anywhere. Had the system on an hour before I did this.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Thanks for confirming!


T-Dub back in action? Long time no see buddy!


----------



## iPDrop

Just hit 12k on the 3DM11 performance physics score with my delidded 3770k @ 4.9 GHz























http://www.3dmark.com/3dm11/7130829


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> T-Dub back in action? Long time no see buddy!


haha Yeah I un-subbed the delid thread as I was spending too much time here







!
Been quite in action my friend, check my post count and even the extra flames


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Previously de lidded 3570k, scratched pcb to the guts...chip still worked. Upgraded to 4770k de lidded razor method, no scratches on pcb this time, used microfiber towel and rubbing alcohol to remove TIM from die. Applied CLP with soft makeup brush. Put it in my maximus vi hero: No Display on powerup but I can hear windows loading on my speaker, also no error code just A0. Don't know what went wrong, Chip is cleaner than a babies bottom. Tried different chip, everything working perfectly. Could die become damage from rubbing off TIM?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> Previously de lidded 3570k, scratched pcb to the guts...chip still worked. Upgraded to 4770k de lidded razor method, no scratches on pcb this time, used microfiber towel and rubbing alcohol to remove TIM from die. Applied CLP with soft makeup brush. Put it in my maximus vi hero: No Display on powerup but I can hear windows loading on my speaker, also no error code just A0. Don't know what went wrong, Chip is cleaner than a babies bottom. Tried different chip, everything working perfectly. Could die become damage from rubbing off TIM?


Try resetting cmos/bios.


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Thanks for the advice, but why then would it work perfectly with another 4770k?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> Thanks for the advice, but why then would it work perfectly with another 4770k?


I thought you tried your 3570k not another 4770k, usually when installing new hardware you should reset cmos to avoid problems. What CPU did you have in there before? I know windows sometimes has problems with new hardware, and a reinstall fixes it, but that shouldn't be the case if you cannot see your bios or anything on boot.

Maybe some of the TIM is making contact with the pcb? If you think you may have damaged it then examine the pcb and die under a lens, looking for scratches in the traces and maybe small chips in the die? You might have damaged it with static while cleaning, anything could have happened really.

I would try playing around with the motherboard and the display side of things first, and if that doesn't work try and remount it.


----------



## rickyman0319

I am wondering if I can put nail polish remover on the the contact or not? or I have can put TIM or nail polish ( any color ) is okay?


----------



## HemiRick

Its NOT your CPU if you heard it boot and it said A0 it was in Windows you just had no display......


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

It has to be CPU. Let me clarify: I de lidded a 4770k no display, I tested it with another 4770k, display came back no problemo. I've tried everything so far, integrated graphics instead of video card, clearing cmos, reseating and reseating, wiping clean, re-applying, spit shining, that thing you do when you drop food on the floor and pick it back up....NOTHING. PCB does have ever so slight nick, as for the die I've seen videos of people wiping the thermal paste with their grubby thumbs with no issue, I used microfiber towel and alcohol could it be that sensitive?


----------



## SonDa5

It's probably not seated right. What mother board are you using?


----------



## HemiRick

Thats very weird then because if the CPU wasnt working if could NOT get into windows and it would never have said A0, so it sure sounds like it was working and you just had no video.


----------



## $ilent

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> You shouldn't use CLP on anything you want to reuse. After a few months like in my case, CLP requires pliers to remove from copper to copper, and excessive strength to remove from die to copper, and can result in the die cracking, like my 690 for example. Have not tried CLU for that long of a time period.


So it welds to copper but not the zinc coating of the ihs?


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

maximus hero, i reseated 1000 times


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

worked right away with a different chip, switched to de lid chip no video again. Im not sure it is'nt a motherboard thing, dont have an extra mobo tho


----------



## Totally Dubbed

If the other chip works, it has to do with the chip.
How are you displaying it? I'm thinking if you can hear sound, and the monitor is connected to on board, then that would suggest you iGPU is gone on your new chip.


----------



## self_slaughter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> worked right away with a different chip, switched to de lid chip no video again. Im not sure it is'nt a motherboard thing, dont have an extra mobo tho


Try clean the bottom of the delidded chip? make sure nothings shorting?
Can't be assed scrolling back to see what I've missed but is there any visible damage?

You might of busted whatever part controls the pci-e bus on the cpu....


----------



## Chomuco

new ,nice ! 4770k wc http://i.imgur.com/32Hbata.jpg


----------



## Hyolyn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Anything can be used on a delid - even the AS5 should do slightly better than the OEM paste - although not because the OEM stuff isn't as good... but because the gap caused by the glue... as long as the TIM is better than air... it's better than a bad seat on the IHS.
> 
> On the other side of your question - it's definitely not going to be as good as CLU/CLP, and probably not as good as MX4 or PK-1 even for that matter... but it will still run cooler _after_ delidding than it did before (or it _should_ at the very least).
> 
> There are many good review of different TIMs - lookup "thermal paste shootout" "TIM reviews" or similar... there are some on here and several on other enthusiast sites (there are a few in this very thread and you can just search for them).


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I don't personally have experience, but I remember FTW (OCN member who benches) said, that you shouldn't de-lid if you are putting it under an LN2 pot or whatnot. It actually makes the chip less capable of achieving higher OC's for some reason.
> I can't tell you why, but that's what I remember him saying.
> Good response
> By this you mean ON or BELOW the IHS?
> You should ONLY use CLU/P on the DIE.
> When it comes to ON the IHS - that can be argued, but Noctua or MX2/4 is more than good enough.


Thanks, i meant below.

It was the only thing i had home but i guess i'll go with that thing rated best can't remember the name just to be sure.
I already know the reason of the temperatures, and it's mainly not the Intel paste but the gap between the die and ihs cause by to much glue.

Also my personal theory can be when delidding and using ln2 it allows condensation to be built under the hs and ruining the chemistry inside the applied paste thus reducing the capability.

However using a better paste probably drops the temperatures even further, i have a rather poor clocker but it's still worth a delid.


----------



## Cr4zy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Speedster159*
> 
> Anybody got a link to the two cracked 4770k's? I wanna read.
> 
> How does the Intel glueing the IHS back on thing go?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/21000_50#post_20577146

http://www.overclock.net/t/1417554/killed-my-4770k/0_50


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Lads,

A youtuber commented on my video and sent me this link:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34297433&po%C2%ADstcount=67

Thoughts?

He has trouble finding CLU/P in Egypt and has the Noctua in his possession.
If he doesn't go bare die, and puts the IHS - what would be the outcome of the delid.
I've come to understand that if you really want a real gain in temps you should use CLU/P correct?


----------



## skyn3t

4770k get's DeliddeD result before and after delid
more result link above









Cinebench before - 71-73-72-67
Cinebench after - 59-63-62-57
Gain - 12-10-10-10


----------



## Chomuco

skyn3t they work perfectly


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Lads,
> 
> A youtuber commented on my video and sent me this link:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34297433&po%C2%ADstcount=67
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> He has trouble finding CLU/P in Egypt and has the Noctua in his possession.
> If he doesn't go bare die, and puts the IHS - what would be the outcome of the delid.
> I've come to understand that if you really want a real gain in temps you should use CLU/P correct?


the noctua paste or the heat sink? if it's the paste then it will do until he can find the CLU and such OR he could have someone buy it for him and ship it his way.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the noctua paste or the heat sink? if it's the paste then it will do until he can find the CLU and such OR he could have someone buy it for him and ship it his way.


the paste brother.
What are his disadvantages of using the noctua on the die vs clu/p?

Check the link btw







!


----------



## deepor

It might get squeezed out after a few days and temperature will explode. That seems to happen with some of the normal paste. I don't know which normal paste behaves like that and which will stay in place. You have to wait for someone that tried the Noctua paste for a good bit of time to see if it's good or not. I think I've seen someone mention that MX-4 will stay in place and work, but I don't know in what thread that post was.

In that thread you linked, I guess it's that "pump out" effect discussed.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> the paste brother.
> What are his disadvantages of using the noctua on the die vs clu/p?
> 
> Check the link btw
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


Well... the pump out may occur after a week or so. I'd still recommend CLU for the die but for his circumstances I'd say try the noctua and see how it goes and just watch the temps as they will go up but not a huge amount really but they should go up after a bit.

UGH k guys I need more Ram im only running 8gb and maxing it out far to often any good deals anywhere I want another 8gb for 16gb total.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Thanks for the input lads +rep!


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> skyn3t they work perfectly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Yup it does work very well. now i need moar cpu to delid







, gonna buy a bunch of cpu delid and sell it lolz









@ Captain Valgaur

OCN name: skyn3t
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme GC
ihs-TIM: Gelid Extreme GC
Mhz gained: dunno yet
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 25c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2899040

Now you can add me up this is my RiG.
Now I'm going to pump this OC a bit more with low temps









Cinebench before - 71-73-72-67
Cinebench after - 59-63-62-57
Gain - 12-10-10-10

Intel burn test before - 98-99-99-96
Intel burn test after - 82-87-88-83
Gain - 16-12-11-13

Linx before - 77-77-75-67
Linx after - 62-64-64-58
Gain - 15-13-11-9

superPI before - 57-57-59-57
superPI after - 46-47-48-47
Gain - 11-10-11-10

Wprime before - 71-73-70-65
Wprime after - 59-61-61-57
Gain - 12-12-9-8

XUT before - 75-75-72-65
XUT after - 60-62-63-58
Gain - 15-13-9-7

XUT bench before - 94-93-88-81
XUT bench after - 69-71-70-65
Gain - 25-22-18-16


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Yup it does work very well. now i need moar cpu to delid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , gonna buy a bunch of cpu delid and sell it lolz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @ Captain Valgaur
> 
> OCN name: skyn3t
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme GC
> ihs-TIM: Gelid Extreme GC
> Mhz gained: dunno yet
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2899040
> 
> Now you can add me up this is my RiG.
> Now I'm going to pump this OC a bit more with low temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Cinebench before - 71-73-72-67
> Cinebench after - 59-63-62-57
> Gain - 12-10-10-10
> 
> Intel burn test before - 98-99-99-96
> Intel burn test after - 82-87-88-83
> Gain - 16-12-11-13
> 
> Linx before - 77-77-75-67
> Linx after - 62-64-64-58
> Gain - 15-13-11-9
> 
> superPI before - 57-57-59-57
> superPI after - 46-47-48-47
> Gain - 11-10-11-10
> 
> Wprime before - 71-73-70-65
> Wprime after - 59-61-61-57
> Gain - 12-12-9-8
> 
> XUT before - 75-75-72-65
> XUT after - 60-62-63-58
> Gain - 15-13-9-7
> 
> XUT bench before - 94-93-88-81
> XUT bench after - 69-71-70-65
> Gain - 25-22-18-16


You're in!







Slappa dat sig on for the how ever many times this is


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa dat sig on for the how ever many times this is


right one


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HemiRick*
> 
> Thats very weird then because if the CPU wasnt working if could NOT get into windows and it would never have said A0, so it sure sounds like it was working and you just had no video.


A0 is good code for susccessful boot up. Probably is a problem with video out put.

Could try booting from Mother board video out puts and the video card out puts and mess with display video out put selections on monitor.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> So it welds to copper but not the zinc coating of the ihs?


I wouldn't use the term "weld", more like lightly soldered. But yes you are correct, it sticks to copper, like my GPU waterblock and my CPU IHS to copper waterblock. I sanded the top of the CPU IHS so no coating was left. Did not sand the bottom of the IHS where the die makes contact to it.

Not sure of this but stress testing might have made a difference before removing, but I really doubt it, because my GPU cores did not really get hot, 35c was the max I saw with an OC and 100% load (compared to 60c-80c+ on a cpu). And plus, how would anyone remove a block in a water cooling loop only seconds after powering the computer down, does not sound realistic at all.


----------



## SonDa5

More like paint is how I would describe clp/clu Tim application on copper but it doesn't bond to the die. Sticky but comes apart. Cleans off of die with alcohol and with lots of elbow grease come clean from copper block. I used brasso polish to remove with the scrub pad that comes with Tim. Kind of like fine sand paper.. . Not fine enough for mirror finish.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> More like paint is how I would describe clp/clu Tim application on copper but it doesn't bond to the die. Sticky but comes apart. Cleans off of die with alcohol and with lots of elbow grease come clean from copper block. I used brasso polish to remove with the scrub pad that comes with Tim. Kind of like fine sand paper.. . Not fine enough for mirror finish.


CLP die to copper does bond, quite a bit actually. Destroyed my $1000 GPU due to it (near a year of a usage I think). I had to clean the CLP off of the die using a flat-head screwdriver, 91% alcohol didn't do anything. CLP copper to copper after a year is ridiculous, need pliers to get it off, and need to sand quite a bit of the material to get it off.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> CLP die to copper does bond, quite a bit actually. Destroyed my $1000 GPU due to it (near a year of a usage I think). I had to clean the CLP off of the die using a flat-head screwdriver, 91% alcohol didn't do anything. CLP copper to copper after a year is ridiculous, need pliers to get it off, and need to sand quite a bit of the material to get it off.


3 months is longest I left on and it came clean for me. Hardware is fine.


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

I tried with both igp and video display, no cigar, chip is dead, has to be. Thing that bothers me most is that I can't pinpoint what went wrong to avoid for next time. I used a small make up brush to apply CLP on the die. Its spreads very evenly that way, also used a micro fiber towel and rubbing alcohol to remove TIM. There was a tiny scratch on lower vrm side of chip but it was hard to see and I doubt it could have had an effect. Gonna try vice method next.


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Im thinking this as well, CPU controls everything. Just could'nt see how I messed it up, looked pretty good to me. Im now here at a mighty 4.0 idle-ing around 40 with a load of 80 at a dangerous 1.13v. There's a knife in my hand and a strange look on my face. Trying to relax.


----------



## pilotter

can I use Arctic Silver ArctiClean to clean the the die? Then I have Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for on the die.

I have the option to go with the EK naked, but I think I will put the IHS back. Between IHS and CPU I can use MX4?

Reason why I doubt going naked, is that I will use acrylic tubing, and when I put this on the cpu block I think there might be to much friction when installing.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> I tried with both igp and video display, no cigar, chip is dead, has to be. Thing that bothers me most is that I can't pinpoint what went wrong to avoid for next time. I used a small make up brush to apply CLP on the die. Its spreads very evenly that way, also used a micro fiber towel and rubbing alcohol to remove TIM. There was a tiny scratch on lower vrm side of chip but it was hard to see and I doubt it could have had an effect. Gonna try vice method next.


I killed my gpu that was worth 3x more don't sweat too much.

Anyway, as I said in my previous post examine the cpu closer, and I guess you did fine a scratch. Seems little, but could be the cause.


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Ouch, thats harsh about the gpu. Im only sweating the fact that this has made me unsure about the whole de lidding process. But I'm still determined to do it.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> Ouch, thats harsh about the gpu. Im only sweating the fact that this has made me unsure about the whole de lidding process. But I'm still determined to do it.


Could have been the physical delid with the razor, could have been static (unlikely), could have been TIM in the wrong places during powerup. If you're still determined and want that extra performance go for it, if not then go IVY-E


----------



## Sidewinder_Computers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> can I use Arctic Silver ArctiClean to clean the the die? Then I have Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for on the die.
> 
> I have the option to go with the EK naked, but I think I will put the IHS back. Between IHS and CPU I can use MX4?
> 
> Reason why I doubt going naked, is that I will use acrylic tubing, and when I put this on the cpu block I think there might be to much friction when installing.


Sure Arcticlean works fine for cleaning the core. You can use any thermal grease between the ihs and core, but like so many others I've found the best results from using Cool Lab Ultra or Pro.


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Static: the assassin that is never caught and never suspected. As for tim, i wiped the whole thing down with rubbing alcohol. Recent saw a video of a guy applying CLP to a haswell with a small metal paving tool. He was banging the die over and over trying to spread it. I cringed. Although Im sure he did not break his chip.


----------



## pilotter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sidewinder_Computers*
> 
> Sure Arcticlean works fine for cleaning the core. You can use any thermal grease between the ihs and core, but like so many others I've found the best results from using Cool Lab Ultra or Pro.


thanks, 99% alcohol is difficult to find.


----------



## SonDa5

Johnyblaze if you'd like mail me the 4770k and I will see if I can get it to boot.


----------



## HemiRick

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> thanks, 99% alcohol is difficult to find.


goto a Liquor store and ask for Pure Grain Alcohol or PGA.


----------



## RickRockerr

Finally here


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

Thanks for the offer SonDa5, but I must refuse, considering how well it now balances my couch


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> Thanks for the offer SonDa5, but I must refuse, considering how well it now balances my couch


Bummer man. I had some hope for with that A0 error that I have seen before myself and I have seen it from others that have thought their chips was failing. I think you may have had a MB issue. Maybe a good full CLEAR CMOS could have helped.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> can I use Arctic Silver ArctiClean to clean the the die? Then I have Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for on the die.
> 
> I have the option to go with the EK naked, but I think I will put the IHS back. Between IHS and CPU I can use MX4?
> 
> Reason why I doubt going naked, is that I will use acrylic tubing, and when I put this on the cpu block I think there might be to much friction when installing.


indeed that's the cleaning set I used from arctic.As for your question, you got CLU, why would you apply mx4 instead on bare die? Use mx4 between the water block and ihs, anything under that should be clu/p


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

I hear you, I cleared the cmos, even took the battery out, booted 15 times then no display again


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoHnYBLaZe*
> 
> I hear you, I cleared the cmos, even took the battery out, booted 15 times then no display again


the thing that doesn't make sense is that you can boot into Windows, but not see anything. That would really suggest gpu or on board display.
You can try something:
Put the good CPU in, make sure your prime95 file is easily accessible on the desktop.
Put in your broken CPU, launch prime blind folded.
See if the pc crashes or restarts.
That might give you a better indication as to what's going on.
Have you also tried the really simple: removing all sticks of ram? Could be for some odd reason conflicting?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> thanks, 99% alcohol is difficult to find.


You're from the Netherlands - try asking at Kruidvat for 96% ethanol.


----------



## JoHnYBLaZe

first of all I appreciate your input, the fact that everything works fine with another chip screams cpu damage to me. cpu's can have all kinds of malfunctions afaik. anyway dont have access to chip anymore


----------



## RickRockerr

Up and running. Direct die mount with EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy set. I got about 5°C lower temps in load on core #0 and #1. Idle temp are now 2°C lower.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Stains on die from clp:


clp applied


Results:
Before:


After:


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Up and running. Direct die mount with EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy set. I got about 5°C lower temps in load on core #0 and #1. Idle temp are now 2°C lower.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Stains on die from clp:
> 
> 
> clp applied
> 
> 
> Results:
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:


Was you running the IHS before?

How long did you spend on cleaning the die? I don't think the cloudy layer left on the die from CLP will hurt it.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Was you running the IHS before?
> 
> How long did you spend on cleaning the die? I don't think the cloudy layer left on the die from CLP will hurt it.


Oh, sorry. Yes I was running with IHS before, and I cleaned the die about 2mins. It's maybe possible to get the die shiny again but I was too lazy


----------



## The Real Deal

Please fellas, where i can buy this plate ? Ideally in Europe


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darylrese*
> 
> Thanks! I will try 1.44v...is that a safe voltage though for normal use? I'm using offset so it downclocks when i'm not playing games to save the added strain on the CPU.


Anything below 1.52V is safe.


----------



## Cyro999

You could say that through technicalities, but nobody will disagree that if you run a CPU @1.5v and 90c load for two or three years that it'd lose a lot of value


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You could say that through technicalities, but nobody will disagree that if you run a CPU @1.5v and 90c load for two or three years that it'd lose a lot of value


Why would you run 3 years constantly at 90C?

If you do that then you need to invest in proper cooling to begin with, but I still can't understand why your CPU would be at 100% load for 3 years straight.

My 2500K ran at constant 1.5V for over 2 years without any degradation, before I fried it by booting at 1.8V lol

No issues running 1.5V+ on this one either.

I say degradation is just a myth.


----------



## Artikbot

I don't think I qualify for the club as I am no Intel owner...

But my AMD A10-5700 runs delidded XD


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Artikbot*
> 
> I don't think I qualify for the club as I am no Intel owner...
> 
> But my AMD A10-5700 runs delidded XD


Did you note down temps before/after? Just curious.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Artikbot*
> 
> I don't think I qualify for the club as I am no Intel owner...
> 
> But my AMD A10-5700 runs delidded XD
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did you note down temps before/after? Just curious.
Click to expand...

thats risky business! there is a whole lot to screw up with not much room for error.


----------



## alancsalt

to boldly go where no man has gone before


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I must say, that AMD chip looks really well built - excellent job for not screwing it up. Real props to you!


----------



## SMK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Real Deal*
> 
> Please fellas, where i can buy this plate ? Ideally in Europe :thumb:[URL=http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1651315/width/500/height/1000%5B/IMG]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1651315/width/500/height/1000[/IMG[/URL]][/QUOTE]
> 
> What is that?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SMK*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *The Real Deal*
> 
> Please fellas, where i can buy this plate ? Ideally in Europe :thumb:[URL=http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1651315/width/500/height/1000%5B/IMG]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1651315/width/500/height/1000[/IMG[/URL]][/QUOTE]
> 
> What is that?[/QUOTE]
> 
> That is a low profile screw down type latch for a processor to replace the latch system used to hold the processor down to the motherboard. Having it low profile allows you to direct die cool without the trouble of screwing down your cooling plate to get the right pressure and evenly distributed power. I need one too, and as to my knowledge the are only sold with one revision of one motherboard, and are not sold individually...but it sure would be nice if they would!
Click to expand...


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Up and running. Direct die mount with EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy set. I got about 5°C lower temps in load on core #0 and #1. Idle temp are now 2°C lower.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Stains on die from clp:
> 
> 
> clp applied
> 
> 
> Results:
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:


I remember asking you to post the results when done. Thanks for doing so, +rep!









Now I'm going to get one too.


----------



## Artikbot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Did you note down temps before/after? Just curious.


Minor, but welcome (4ºC or so), as I am thermally constrained. From running at the thermal limit, 71ºC, to 67ºC. So while just a handful of degrees, it gives the chip a lot of room to breathe.

Although I don't trust the readings








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I must say, that AMD chip looks really well built - excellent job for not screwing it up. Real props to you!


Lol thanks! I used a dismantled one-use razor blade. Real slow because I didn't know what was under the die, and I kept having a bad feeling I'd smash something if I were to rush it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Artikbot*
> 
> Minor, but welcome (4ºC or so), as I am thermally constrained. From running at the thermal limit, 71ºC, to 67ºC. So while just a handful of degrees, it gives the chip a lot of room to breathe.
> 
> Although I don't trust the readings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol thanks! I used a dismantled one-use razor blade. Real slow because I didn't know what was under the die, and I kept having a bad feeling I'd smash something if I were to rush it


That's what it was like for us who started delidding. Had no idea where we were going and how far...


----------



## Noupoi

Just delidded my 4770k!



OCN name: Noupoi
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Arctic MX4
Mhz gained: 100 MHz
OC after delid: 4700 MHz
Temp drops: 18C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/n9xpkd

I'm not having much luck with overclocking. Despite the big bump in Vcore (from 1.35V to 1.45V) and a few other voltages, I can't seem to get more than 4.7GHz without 0x101 clock_watchdog_timeout errors. Any suggestions on what to try?


----------



## NIK1

Just wondering when applying the liquid ultra between the dye and the IHS should I also put a little non conductive Tim on the contacts that are on the bottom of the chip, the little gold strip below the dye. I've seen some pics where some have covered them with tape or a non conductive tim.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Artikbot*
> 
> Minor, but welcome (4ºC or so), as I am thermally constrained. From running at the thermal limit, 71ºC, to 67ºC. So while just a handful of degrees, it gives the chip a lot of room to breathe.
> 
> Although I don't trust the readings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol thanks! I used a dismantled one-use razor blade. Real slow because I didn't know what was under the die, and I kept having a bad feeling I'd smash something if I were to rush it


great patience on your part - have a rep on me for bravery!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noupoi*
> 
> Just delidded my 4770k!
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Noupoi
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX4
> Mhz gained: 100 MHz
> OC after delid: 4700 MHz
> Temp drops: 18C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/n9xpkd
> 
> I'm not having much luck with overclocking. Despite the big bump in Vcore (from 1.35V to 1.45V) and a few other voltages, I can't seem to get more than 4.7GHz without 0x101 clock_watchdog_timeout errors. Any suggestions on what to try?


I must say, that is one sexy vice.
Good job though!


----------



## GoLDii3

Meh.

I just can have lower temps as i have a bad chip. So no MHz gain for me.

But do you think 75C on IBT is too much for delidded 3570K with CLU on die and MX-4 on the H60 Block? Im at 4,4 GHz at something like 1,20-1,25V. I dont know exactly as my vcore should be "1,14V" but as we know the Z77 Extreme4 has faulty vcore reading and in the worst case you can get +0,10V.

Previously i had a custom loop with XSPC Raystorm,EX240+RX120 and EK-DCP 4.0 and i had the same temps at that voltage but the cpu was not delidded.

At stock i got max. 56C.

Room temperature is 25C and i idle at 30-35.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Meh.
> 
> I just can have lower temps as i have a bad chip. So no MHz gain for me.
> 
> But do you think 75C on IBT is too much for delidded 3570K with CLU on die and MX-4 on the H60 Block? Im at 4,4 GHz at something like 1,20-1,25V. I dont know exactly as my vcore should be "1,14V" but as we know the Z77 Extreme4 has faulty vcore reading and in the worst case you can get +0,10V.
> 
> Previously i had a custom loop with XSPC Raystorm,EX240+RX120 and EK-DCP 4.0 and i had the same temps at that voltage but the cpu was not delidded.
> 
> At stock i got max. 56C.
> 
> Room temperature is 25C and i idle at 30-35.


sounds about right if you ask me.
I have the antec 920 and I get around 60c-70c with IBT


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Meh.
> 
> I just can have lower temps as i have a bad chip. So no MHz gain for me.
> 
> But do you think 75C on IBT is too much for delidded 3570K with CLU on die and MX-4 on the H60 Block? Im at 4,4 GHz at something like 1,20-1,25V. I dont know exactly as my vcore should be "1,14V" but as we know the Z77 Extreme4 has faulty vcore reading and in the worst case you can get +0,10V.
> 
> Previously i had a custom loop with XSPC Raystorm,EX240+RX120 and EK-DCP 4.0 and i had the same temps at that voltage but the cpu was not delidded.
> 
> At stock i got max. 56C.
> 
> Room temperature is 25C and i idle at 30-35.


You have 1.14v set for 4.4ghz and you're calling it a bad chip? Sure, your board gives more vcore under the hood, but even if it was 1.24v for 4.4ghz it wouldn't be a particularly bad chip, it depends on scaling. Even with the low end cooling (h60 with one fan?) you got good temps now, you can push voltage more


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally posted by *NIK1*
> 
> Just wondering when applying the liquid ultra between the dye and the IHS should I also put a little non conductive Tim on the contacts that are on the bottom of the chip, the little gold strip below the dye. I've seen some pics where some have covered them with tape or a non conductive tim.


Most people do, just to be safe. Some normal non-conductive TIM seems to work fine.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You have 1.14v set for 4.4ghz and you're calling it a bad chip? Sure, your board gives more vcore under the hood, but even if it was 1.24v for 4.4ghz it wouldn't be a particularly bad chip, it depends on scaling. Even with the low end cooling (h60 with one fan?) you got good temps now, you can push voltage more


I mean a bad chip for benchmark. There's no sense pushing a 3570K further 4.2-4.5 GHz. Meanwhile if you do it for bench its cool and fun to have a 5 GHz chip to benchmark.

Its not that much low-end. I have the 2013 edition wich i think its far superior of the previous version. I have it with Corsair SP120 High Perfomance edition P/P.

Anyhow i was able to bench at 4,9 GHz under wc but didn't feel very comfortable giving 1,50-1,55V to the cpu. Then i saw the vcore problem thread and i discovered maybe they were 1,60V-1.65V .


----------



## Totally Dubbed

8pack, uk no1 ocer, I had a great chat with himabout chips. He runs 5ghz on something ridiculously low as 1.2v.
His gone through a lot of chips lol


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> 8pack, uk no1 ocer, I had a great chat with himabout chips. He runs 5ghz on something ridiculously low as 1.2v.
> His gone through a lot of chips lol


5ghz at 1.2 dam, he should play the real lottery lol


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 5ghz at 1.2 dam, he should play the real lottery lol


He gets to play with a lot of cpus to find the best ones though, like buying hundred of lottery tickets.
Wish I could... I'm jelly.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 5ghz at 1.2 dam, he should play the real lottery lol


nop if he has been constantly buying CPUs and motherboards.
He told me he has over 100 motherboards and CPUs, GPUs etc at home. Because he had to go through a lot to find the right one. At least that's what he told me in person







!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Noupoi*
> 
> Just delidded my 4770k!
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Noupoi
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX4
> Mhz gained: 100 MHz
> OC after delid: 4700 MHz
> Temp drops: 18C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/n9xpkd
> 
> I'm not having much luck with overclocking. Despite the big bump in Vcore (from 1.35V to 1.45V) and a few other voltages, I can't seem to get more than 4.7GHz without 0x101 clock_watchdog_timeout errors. Any suggestions on what to try?


You're in!







Slappa dat Sig on!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> He gets to play with a lot of cpus to find the best ones though, like buying hundred of lottery tickets.
> Wish I could... I'm jelly.


Same here...... Vagur wants hardware....








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> nop if he has been constantly buying CPUs and motherboards.
> He told me he has over 100 motherboards and CPUs, GPUs etc at home. Because he had to go through a lot to find the right one. At least that's what he told me in person
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> !


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> 8pack, uk no1 ocer, I had a great chat with himabout chips. He runs 5ghz on something ridiculously low as 1.2v.
> His gone through a lot of chips lol


goohttp://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?286333-Haswell-i5-4670K-i7-4770K-batch-and-o-c-results&p=5201984&viewfull=1#post5201984


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> goohttp://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?286333-Haswell-i5-4670K-i7-4770K-batch-and-o-c-results&p=5201984&viewfull=1#post5201984


beastly


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> goohttp://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?286333-Haswell-i5-4670K-i7-4770K-batch-and-o-c-results&p=5201984&viewfull=1#post5201984


Passing SuperPI? Seriously? That is just like taking a CPU-Z validation and claiming your CPU is a beast lol
Worthless.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Passing SuperPI? Seriously? That is just like taking a CPU-Z validation and claiming your CPU is a beast lol
> Worthless.


no but it boots to windows and does at least one bench.
Not saying THAT is a stable rig, but at least it can boot at that voltage.
Mine won't boot at 1.55v even if I wanted it to lol.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Passing SuperPI? Seriously? That is just like taking a CPU-Z validation and claiming your CPU is a beast lol
> Worthless.


Worthless if you don't know what you are looking at.
Try passing superpi 32m at 5ghz & see where your chip stands. All the stability testing in the world at 4.5ghz won't tell you if your chip might be great or not.


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> beastly


nice ! woww ! 
http://i.imgur.com/I2Ykntc.jpg


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Worthless if you don't know what you are looking at.
> Try passing superpi 32m at 5ghz & see where your chip stands. All the stability testing in the world at 4.5ghz won't tell you if your chip might be great or not.


Running.

But since when has SuperPI indicated any sort of stability lol

EDIT: Here you go:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Worthless if you don't know what you are looking at.
> Try passing superpi 32m at 5ghz & see where your chip stands. All the stability testing in the world at 4.5ghz won't tell you if your chip might be great or not.


^this
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Running.
> 
> But since when has SuperPI indicated any sort of stability lol


Because Benchmarks liek superpi and wprime are far harder than stability tests and they are short. for example when I was running my cpu in toronto I could barely do 5ghz super pi and thats with really bad RAM timings. Once you get a low voltage and good chip and can take the vcore to the absolute lowest part and pass that bench fully that chip is amazing 5 giggles at 1.2 is like 6 ghz at 1.3vcore thats an amazing chip there. I WANT.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Running.
> 
> But since when has SuperPI indicated any sort of stability lol


Quite some time for "suicide" runs.
It just prove your chip CAN boot into windows and run a "simple" benchmark.

When I talked about 8pack and stability, he HAD a PC on 5ghz 24/7 usage and FULLY stable. Not commenting on that picture linked as I have no idea about that guys situation.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Running.
> 
> But since when has SuperPI indicated any sort of stability lol
> 
> EDIT: Here you go:


It doesn't take a lot of stability, but needing close to 1.5v shows that yours wouldn't be a great chip to bench. The ones that need 1.2 - 1.25V to bench pi 32m at 5ghz will not only be able to reach higher clockspeeds when going all out, they still stability test at lower voltage than average chips too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quite some time for "suicide" runs.
> It just prove your chip CAN boot into windows and run a "simple" benchmark.
> 
> When I talked about 8pack and stability, he HAD a PC on 5ghz 24/7 usage and FULLY stable. Not commenting on that picture linked as I have no idea about that guys situation.


Yes! How does 8pack find those great chips? He doesn't spend hours on each one, he tests the voltage needed to boot 5ghz & run pi. The lowest voltage chips are worthy for more testing on ln2.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It doesn't take a lot of stability, but needing close to 1.5v shows that yours wouldn't be a great chip to bench. The ones that need 1.2 - 1.25V to bench pi 32m at 5ghz will not only be able to reach higher clockspeeds when going all out, they still stability test at lower voltage than average chips too.
> Yes! How does 8pack find those great chips? He doesn't spend hours on each one, he tests the voltage needed to boot 5ghz & run pi. The lowest voltage chips are worthy for more testing on ln2.


Honestly? I couldn't care less about trying how low voltage I can run something like SuperPI at lol
All that really matters is everyday stability. I just ran it while watching movies with my daily clocks.

I do not have money to waste on countless CPUs to run SuperPIs on either to find the best and ditch the rest, this is my third 3570K I guess, broke my first one while delidding and I told them to just cancel the order while I just order a new one but instead they sent me a warranty replacement (Which was rubbish in terms of clocks).

One thing I would wish for? CPUs that can take higher voltage as my cooling is way overkill for anything right now, Prime95 doesn't push it above 62-63C on current settings.

So yeah, I do not understand why people run SuperPI unless all you do is bench 24/7 and are just trying to hit some toplist for it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Honestly? I couldn't care less about trying how low voltage I can run something like SuperPI at lol
> All that really matters is everyday stability. I just ran it while watching movies with my daily clocks.
> 
> I do not have money to waste on countless CPUs to run SuperPIs on either to find the best and ditch the rest, this is my third 3570K I guess, broke my first one while delidding and I told them to just cancel the order while I just order a new one but instead they sent me a warranty replacement (Which was rubbish in terms of clocks).
> 
> One thing I would wish for? CPUs that can take higher voltage as my cooling is way overkill for anything right now, Prime95 doesn't push it above 62-63C on current settings.
> 
> So yeah, I do not understand why people run SuperPI unless all you do is bench 24/7 and are just trying to hit some toplist for it.


I don't think you understand the difference between needing 1.5v and 1.2v....
Ther'es a huge difference.
Long story short: You won't be stable for 24hrs P95 on that chip @ 5ghz (unless you run at like 1.6v and burn your chip), yet the guy that could get it to boot etc on 1.2v will be able to get it 24hrs stable on probably 1.25-1.3v.
In other words, YOU can't get 5ghz stable, the guy with LOW VOLTAGE CAN.


----------



## Arm3nian

4930k in stock at newegg.

EDIT: So is 4960x


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Honestly? I couldn't care less about trying how low voltage I can run something like SuperPI at lol
> All that really matters is everyday stability. I just ran it while watching movies with my daily clocks.
> 
> I do not have money to waste on countless CPUs to run SuperPIs on either to find the best and ditch the rest, this is my third 3570K I guess, broke my first one while delidding and I told them to just cancel the order while I just order a new one but instead they sent me a warranty replacement (Which was rubbish in terms of clocks).
> 
> One thing I would wish for? CPUs that can take higher voltage as my cooling is way overkill for anything right now, Prime95 doesn't push it above 62-63C on current settings.
> 
> So yeah, I do not understand why people run SuperPI unless all you do is bench 24/7 and are just trying to hit some toplist for it.


It's a quick test for cpus to see if they are what you are after.
Benchers set 5ghz & find what vcore it needs to manage pi, lowest voltage chip is generally the one to keep & bench.
Works similar for stability testers, if you want a good chip, boot 5ghz & look for low vcore. Lowest vcore chips should go the farthest with good voltage for daily overclocked use.

It isn't about stability in that XS thread, it's about finding good chips. If someone doesn't bin it won't mean much, except a quick test to see how good the chip might be.
Superpi 32m can be handy for testing memory, it does take decent memory stability to pass & is pretty quick. If the mem can't pass pi 32m, no point in a long heavy stability test since the memory will fail.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I don't think you understand the difference between needing 1.5v and 1.2v....
> Ther'es a huge difference.
> Long story short: You won't be stable for 24hrs P95 on that chip @ 5ghz (unless you run at like 1.6v and burn your chip), yet the guy that could get it to boot etc on 1.2v will be able to get it 24hrs stable on probably 1.25-1.3v.
> In other words, YOU can't get 5ghz stable, the guy with LOW VOLTAGE CAN.


I ran Prime for 30 min and it was stable, IBT for 10 runs and it was stable and has never caused any issues since.

So yes, it is stable at those settings I run it at.
Also 1.6V won't burn it in a short time either, my 2500K ran for 3-4 months at 1.6V because of the crappy Z77 E4 motherboard.

And this motherboard has the same issues as the Z77 E4 but not as major as it did, actual VCore is maybe 0.04 higher than CPU-Z reports.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Well that's great for you! I would never run my chip for a period of time at 1.45v or more.


----------



## alancsalt

I suppose everyone but me knew about these?
Quote:


> Decapped Quad Core Xeon E5520 2.26ghz/8mb
> From Mac Pro
> They're FCLGA1366 and should be compatible with X58 chipsets.
> What makes these interesting is that they do not have the IHS from the factory. They do come with plastic shims to protect them from accidental damage.
> http://ark.intel.com/products/40200


----------



## katemis

put me in the club if you want please.
i just unlocked another noob achievement
*achievement delid your 3770k and loose your warranty because you are ultra noob and you make scratches on the copper* :*UNLOACKED*











i didn't mesure the temps but in stock i'm from 58-60c to 48-50c

edit:
i forgot to say that i use CLU and artic mx4 for IHS/cpu cooler

here is a foto on stock delided

and 4,5ghz delided


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> put me in the club if you want please.
> i just unlocked another noob achievement
> *achievement delid your 3770k and loose your warranty because you are ultra noob and you make scratches on the copper* :*UNLOACKED*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i didn't mesure the temps but in stock i'm from 58-60c to 48-50c


you didn't scratch the copper though did you?
I can't see any problems looking at the pic


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Just bought these to practice with for when I get my 3570k


----------



## katemis

yes i scratch it with the Vice from outside.
the vice teeth was worn and i didn't notice.everything else gone perfect


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Just bought these to practice with for when I get my 3570k


but does it blend?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> yes i scratch it with the Vice from outside.
> the vice teeth was worn and i didn't notice.everything else gone perfect


oh so the outer rim of the PCB?
IT SHOULD BE fine as the outer rim has "nothing" on it - there';s a small wall between the actual transistors and the edge of the PCB

But if it works, no worries anyway!


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> but does it blend?


We'll find out after they've been de-lidded!


----------



## katemis

not the pcb,the copper plate(IHS if i'm not wrong).i don't know very good English...i'm sorry for the misunderstanding.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> We'll find out after they've been de-lidded!


hehehe
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> not the pcb,the copper plate(IHS if i'm not wrong).i don't know very good English...i'm sorry for the misunderstanding.


Ah don't worry about the IHS bro







!


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> Just wondering when applying the liquid ultra between the dye and the IHS should I also put a little non conductive Tim on the contacts that are on the bottom of the chip, the little gold strip below the dye. I've seen some pics where some have covered them with tape or a non conductive tim.


Might be better to put some liquid electrical tape that once its dried you can just peel off if needed and will not damage anything.


----------



## JohnnyEars

I delidded my Haswell 4670k today








Using hammer method and it came off _really_ easy (1st tap)
CLU on die and IC Diamond on cooler
I haven't had a chance to check load temps yet, as I spent all day doing acrylic tubing


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> put me in the club if you want please.
> i just unlocked another noob achievement
> *achievement delid your 3770k and loose your warranty because you are ultra noob and you make scratches on the copper* :*UNLOACKED*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i didn't mesure the temps but in stock i'm from 58-60c to 48-50c


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JohnnyEars*
> 
> I delidded my Haswell 4670k today
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Using hammer method and it came off _really_ easy (1st tap)
> CLU on die and IC Diamond on cooler
> I haven't had a chance to check load temps yet, as I spent all day doing acrylic tubing


GIMME TEH INFER BERTH YER THERN IR ERD YUR!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> GIMME TEH INFER BERTH YER THERN IR ERD YUR!


I have no idea what you just said - but have a Snickers


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Is Arctic Silver 5 any good for replacing the TIM in a 3570k? or is it worth investing in something else?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Is Arctic Silver 5 any good for replacing the TIM in a 3570k? or is it worth investing in something else?


Definitely go with CLU or CLP instead..
The only reason I would go with a lower "quality" would be to get rid of the conductivity of CLU/P and I believe AS5 is conductive as well.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Definitely go with CLU or CLP instead..
> The only reason I would go with a lower "quality" would be to get rid of the conductivity of CLU/P and I believe AS5 is conductive as well.


AS5 is not electrically conductive
http://www.arcticsilver.com/as5.htm

However CLU has no cure period and would perform better between the DIE and the IHS than AS5, the problem with AS5 is the cure period. With CLP or CLU you do have to be careful as those are conductive.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> AS5 is not electrically conductive
> http://www.arcticsilver.com/as5.htm


It's not conductive but it is capacitive, which can be just as bad. Don't use it on exposed contacts.
Quote:


> (While much safer than electrically conductive silver and copper greases, Arctic Silver 5 should be kept away from electrical traces, pins, and leads. While it is not electrically conductive, the compound is very slightly capacitive and could potentially cause problems if it bridges two close-proximity electrical paths


----------



## Valgaur

I really recommend LET Liquid Electric Tape much easier to apply and it's a solid seal.


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> AS5 is not electrically conductive
> http://www.arcticsilver.com/as5.htm
> 
> However CLU has no cure period and would perform better between the DIE and the IHS than AS5, the problem with AS5 is the cure period. With CLP or CLU you do have to be careful as those are conductive.


So what's the best TIM to use for inbetween the DIE and the IHS? Sounds like CLP or CLU.
And what's the best for inbetween CPU and cooler? CLP or CLU again?

I've heard about the liquid metal TIMs sometimes being tricky to clean. And as for them being conductive, what are the main worries about that and what can I do to prevent anything bad happening?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> So what's the best TIM to use for inbetween the DIE and the IHS? Sounds like CLP or CLU.
> And what's the best for inbetween CPU and cooler? CLP or CLU again?
> 
> I prefer CLU on both but PK or some high end TIM will do fine on the top of the IHS.
> 
> I've heard about the liquid metal TIMs sometimes being tricky to clean. And as for them being conductive, what are the main worries about that and what can I do to prevent anything bad happening?


For the 3770K no issues. but the 4770K or haswell series in general they have component on the side of the die you should cover with LET so avoid any mishaps while CLU/P is on the die.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> So what's the best TIM to use for inbetween the DIE and the IHS? Sounds like CLP or CLU.
> And what's the best for inbetween CPU and cooler? CLP or CLU again?
> 
> I've heard about the liquid metal TIMs sometimes being tricky to clean. And as for them being conductive, what are the main worries about that and what can I do to prevent anything bad happening?


CLU or CLP betweren die and IHS,
I would use whatever you usually use between IHS and CPU cooler. AS5, MX-4, etc etc..

As for cleaning; After getting a good contact with CLU/P you wont need to clean it ever again.
If you choose to use it between IHS and CPU cooler, it should be cleanable.. harder to clean 100% compared to "normal" TIMs but the stains left, dose not reduce the coolability
Guides for cleaning has been posted a few pages back.

Thinking back, we had folks using their normal TIM vs CLU between IHS and CPU cooler with a gain of 2-3 degrees.. so not worth it IMO..

The conductivity issue is not really a problem with your 3570K. Haswell however, has some surface mounted bits that doesn't like to be shorted out by the conductive CLU/CLP


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Great info guys, thanks. Right now I'm using a CM 612S cooler but I'm soon going to be water cooled. The only place I order from only has CLP, is that alright?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> *but does it blend?*
> oh so the outer rim of the PCB?
> IT SHOULD BE fine as the outer rim has "nothing" on it - there';s a small wall between the actual transistors and the edge of the PCB
> 
> But if it works, no worries anyway!


You be looking at the wrong page for blend


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Great info guys, thanks. Right now I'm using a CM 612S cooler but I'm soon going to be water cooled. The only place I order from only has CLP, is that alright?


CLP is good.
Since I have only use CLU, I cant be 100% on this. But I seam to recall that it is a bit harder to spread out since it only comes with a plastic pad of some kind where as CLU comes with a brush that makes it much easier to spread out.
some ppl has reported that a non used makeup brush is ideal for CLP / CLU spreading. Dont use a q-tip, it will leave unwanted particles in the CLP.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> About a week back, someone on here recommended a foam makeup applicator. I tried it yesterday and it worked better than expected. I felt i could spread the CLU much more evenly and precise. Plus it doesn't leave any fibers behind like a cotton swab. I highly recommend it.


Also I would suggest skimming through this tread. There are MANY helpful tips and also answers for all of your questions









Good luck!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Is Arctic Silver 5 any good for replacing the TIM in a 3570k? or is it worth investing in something else?


I suggest CLU/P ON the die and ON the IHS something like MX2/MX4


----------



## Arm3nian

CLP is garbage stop recommending that thing, unless you like killing hardware.

I've used CLU but only for like 2 weeks so idk if that solders/welds.


----------



## Magical Eskimo

What make CLP so bad compared to CLU?


----------



## chronicfx

Anyone used CLP on their GPU? Just got a 7990 and the xspc razor hd waterblock and plan to put it together this weekend? I on the border with this one. I know it is conductive but I have some experience spreading it with the delidding of my 3570k, so I feel like I can handle it without making a mess.. My main concern is the size of the die.. Is it so big that there really isn't any thermal difference? My other two choices are the supplied K2 and my Noctua-NT-H1.


----------



## dmanstasiu

i used clp on my 7970 and it dropped by 8C (avg)


----------



## inedenimadam

Does anyone have a link to the EK block that was designed for direct die ivy?


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html

http://www.ekwb.com/news/324/19/EK-first-to-support-cooling-of-delided-Ivy-Bridge-CPUs/


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Anyone used CLP on their GPU? Just got a 7990 and the xspc razor hd waterblock and plan to put it together this weekend? I on the border with this one. I know it is conductive but I have some experience spreading it with the delidding of my 3570k, so I feel like I can handle it without making a mess.. My main concern is the size of the die.. Is it so big that there really isn't any thermal difference? My other two choices are the supplied K2 and my Noctua-NT-H1.


Used that on my GTX 690. Chipped one of the cores taking the block off. Use CLU if you want to go that route.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmanstasiu*
> 
> i used clp on my 7970 and it dropped by 8C (avg)


Good luck removing the block.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> What make CLP so bad compared to CLU?


It sticks/welds/solders w/e you want to call it. It stuck to die to copper in my case, I had to use a flat head to scrape it off the die that wasn't chipped. Obviously no warranty for physical damage, so $1000 down the drain due to $5 paste, better off using CLU or something else. Posted pictures a few pages back.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Used that on my GTX 690. Chipped one of the cores taking the block off. Use CLU if you want to go that route.
> Good luck removing the block.
> It sticks/welds/solders w/e you want to call it. It stuck to die to copper in my case, I had to use a flat head to scrape it off the die that wasn't chipped. Obviously no warranty for physical damage, so $1000 down the drain due to $5 paste, better off using CLU or something else. Posted pictures a few pages back.


Ooh, I do remember seeing a pic of a gpu that had CLP on it, after the block was removed & the top of the gpu core came off with the block.

Was that you?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ooh, I do remember seeing a pic of a gpu that had CLP on it, after the block was removed & the top of the gpu core came off with the block.
> 
> Was that you?


Unfortunately yes

EDIT: I'll post better pictures of it when I get home, I have a 300mm lens lol so I have to put it like 3 meters away.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/news/324/19/EK-first-to-support-cooling-of-delided-Ivy-Bridge-CPUs/


Awesome, another question, I assume this only works with the supremacy block, but do I also need to purchase a separate back plate? Or is the one that comes with the block sufficient?

I am looking at this kit http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-kit-h3o-240-hfx.html but I am not sure if I need a backplate for the cpu block as well as the add on naked kit.

Edit to add: nevermind, I just found http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/block-spare-parts/mounting-mechanisms/cpu/ek-supremacy-precisemount-nickel.html which I assume is the necessary back plate.

Sorry if this is in the wrong place, but i figured if anybody knows how to cool a naked ivy, it would be the guys in this thread.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Awesome, another question, I assume this only works with the supremacy block, but do I also need to purchase a separate back plate? Or is the one that comes with the block sufficient?
> 
> I am looking at this kit http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-kit-h3o-240-hfx.html but I am not sure if I need a backplate for the cpu block as well as the add on naked kit.
> 
> Edit to add: nevermind, I just found http://www.ekwb.com/shop/blocks/block-spare-parts/mounting-mechanisms/cpu/ek-supremacy-precisemount-nickel.html which I assume is the necessary back plate.
> 
> Sorry if this is in the wrong place, but i figured if anybody knows how to cool a naked ivy, it would be the guys in this thread.


You don't need a separate backplate. You use the one that comes with the EK Supremacy block.

The kit you're looking at has an EK Supremacy block in it, so it has the backplate too. All you need is *this*.

The PreciseMount you linked is not the Naked Ivy one. It's designed to be used with normal chips.


----------



## skyn3t

I left pc running a stress test last night and this morning I completely forgot to shut it down before going to work and look what i just found









XUT 6 hours prime. 4.5Ghz @ 1.36 offset mode


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Ooh, I do remember seeing a pic of a gpu that had CLP on it, after the block was removed & the top of the gpu core came off with the block.
> 
> Was that you?


Nope... Sounds like i will be the guy using regular tim


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Unfortunately yes
> 
> EDIT: I'll post better pictures of it when I get home, I have a 300mm lens lol so I have to put it like 3 meters away.


That does indeed suck. The pic of the core with the top layer gone was pretty cool looking though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Nope... Sounds like i will be the guy using regular tim


Same here, I've never bothered to try the liquid metal on one since i change the cooling too often on the newer cards, even before I saw that pic.


----------



## Apple Pi

I was looking at doing this to my 4770k but I just got it built up and running so I may just wait until I upgrade my GPU...


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Anyone used CLP on their GPU? Just got a 7990 and the xspc razor hd waterblock and plan to put it together this weekend?


With hd7950 and nickel plated heat killer Water block and another hd7950 with a copper water block. No problems on either and performance is great.


----------



## iwasaperson

Tldr; Delidded an E4300 with the 2x4 and vice method. First time, big success.

Just delidded my first CPU. An E4300. It was a practice run for my 3570K. I used the 2x4 method. I just saw a random piece laying around, and I have my vice that's bolted to a table in my garage. The 2x4 got dented quite a bit, and the sides of the IHS are scratched up (no warranty, otherwise, who cares?).

Covered the pads with painter's tape because I couldn't find my electrical tape. I had to hammer quite a bit to get it off. Took me around 20 minutes total. I repasted with Shin Etsu 7783D, because the only other paste I have is IC Diamond, and I'm afraid that that will scratch the die.


----------



## Sirstiv

Here's my progress guys. Bought the 4770k, bought the vice, didn't care to test before. It was BORN to be DELIDDED!!!



After i removed the lid. Note that i taped the wood since dust chips were flying onto the cpu lol.



applied this stuff on the capacitors next to the die.



a better look.



application of cooler laboratory ultra (liquid metal on a cleaned cpu die etc etc.



installation of corsair cooler







.



fitment + colour change of corsair logo lol.

Runs 4.5ghz easy @ like 72-85degrees on prime. It did do 4.6ghz but needs finer tuning. Idle temps is like 30-38. Board temps range from 26-30degrees.

I ended up fitting both fans(push/pull) on the H80i in the SG08 case.







. Is it possible to reach 5ghz with these chips on water?... Running asus maximus impact board. Case may appear messy but the finished fitment which i never took a pic off looks really sexy/neat lol.

Are these good temps? Never bothered to look up normal haswell temps, I was just after the delidding/ocing challenge. (Note: Used Z5 Cool on the lid and CLU on the die)

Took me like 50 hits to get the lid off because i was using a small vice and small hammer lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sirstiv*
> 
> Here's my progress guys. Bought the 4770k, bought the vice, didn't care to test before. It was BORN to be DELIDDED!!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After i removed the lid. Note that i taped the wood since dust chips were flying onto the cpu lol.
> 
> 
> 
> applied this stuff on the capacitors next to the die.
> 
> 
> 
> a better look.
> 
> 
> 
> application of cooler laboratory ultra (liquid metal on a cleaned cpu die etc etc.
> 
> 
> 
> installation of corsair cooler
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> fitment + colour change of corsair logo lol.
> 
> Runs 4.5ghz easy @ like 72-85degrees on prime. It did do 4.6ghz but needs finer tuning. Idle temps is like 30-38. Board temps range from 26-30degrees.
> 
> I ended up fitting both fans(push/pull) on the H80i in the SG08 case.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Is it possible to reach 5ghz with these chips on water?... Running asus maximus impact board. Case may appear messy but the finished fitment which i never took a pic off looks really sexy/neat lol.
> 
> Are these good temps? Never bothered to look up normal haswell temps, I was just after the delidding/ocing challenge. (Note: Used Z5 Cool on the lid and CLU on the die)
> 
> Took me like 50 hits to get the lid off because i was using a small vice and small hammer lol.


Nice!







gimme the info and I'll throw you into the Crew!


----------



## Sirstiv

Sure, will do some more OC testing. Would be good to also add what cooler people are using, i see some people are getting 60-70 degrees in the 4.7ghz-5ghz range on haswell... pretty impressive. Don't think i can reach those temps on my H80i.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> i see some people are getting 60-70 degrees in the 4.7ghz-5ghz range on haswell


How are they doing that? Good chips? I mean on high end air with hyperthreading, i'd be at like 90c (so 70 accounting for delid) by 1.35v encoding and other stuff is hotter (some non-avx stress tests draw a little more power.. avx1 is a wide gap and avx2 draws ~50% more power at a given vcore and i'm pretty sure you can just pull 200 watts at 1.35vcore and be hotter than ivy at 1.5v)


----------



## katemis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> GIMME TEH INFER BERTH YER THERN IR ERD YUR!


FUUUUUUUU
i dod't have any measures before deliding.
i use CLU for the inside and mx4 for the outside.also i put tinny drops of black silicone on the 4 corners of IHS to stick it with pcb.i suppose i can't be in the club but i demand to gime my ACHIEVEMENT


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> FUUUUUUUU
> i dod't have any measures before deliding.
> i use CLU for the inside and mx4 for the outside.also i put tinny drops of black silicone on the 4 corners of IHS to stick it with pcb.i suppose i can't be in the club but i demand to gime my ACHIEVEMENT


fill out what you can







I'll throw ya in just need something


----------



## ozzy1925

guys after failed razor delid attempt to my 3770k finally i get a new i4770k i tried 30mins of aida64 and seems [email protected] but 1st core temp is 93C where the 4th is 82-83.Is this chip worth deliding? i will try vice method this time


----------



## Cyro999

vcore/vrin?

and probably


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys after failed razor delid attempt to my 3770k finally i get a new i4770k i tried 30mins of aida64 and seems [email protected] but 1st core temp is 93C where the 4th is 82-83.Is this chip worth deliding? i will try vice method this time


What voltage for 4.7?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> What voltage for 4.7?


vccin 2.0
core voltage 1.30


----------



## katemis

*OCN name:*katemis
*CPU:*3770k
*on die-TIM:*CLU
*ihs-TIM:*artic mx4
*Mhz gained:*-
*OC after delid:*-
*cooler:*h100 push/pull(with slim and stock fans)low profile
*Temp drops:*don't know







approx 10~15c as i can remember.
here some test i made for you after delid( i don't have before delid)
stock


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







oc 4.5ghz


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> vccin 2.0
> core voltage 1.30


Be very careful delidding it. Looks good.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Be very careful delidding it. Looks good.


thanks i am really nervous about deliding dont want to fail this time


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> thanks i am really nervous about deliding dont want to fail this time


I would try the vise this time if I were you.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I would try the vise this time if I were you.


i just ordered this


----------



## deepor

That vise you ordered would not have worked with my CPU. The hits I needed were pretty hard. I'm guessing that suction cup at the bottom would not have kept a vise in place for those hits. That rotating part also looks suspicious. I bet it would have turned with every hit. You should buy something more simple without that rotating swivel in the middle and without suction cup for mounting to a table.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> That vise you ordered would not have worked with my CPU. The hits I needed were pretty hard. I'm guessing that suction cup at the bottom would not have kept a vise in place for those hits. That rotating part also looks suspicious. I bet it would have turned with every hit. You should buy something more simple without that rotating swivel in the middle and without suction cup for mounting to a table.


i just saw this post http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/21800_100#post_20785011
and this

is this different one?


----------



## Magical Eskimo

This makes me realise I'm lucky to have a good quality vice bolted on to a workbench in my shed!
£5 if anyone wants to use it! haha


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> This makes me realise I'm lucky to have a good quality vice bolted on to a workbench in my shed!
> £5 if anyone wants to use it! haha


I use the razor, so no thanks









I'm contemplating de-lidding my mum's I3....she doesn't need it but stock voltages etc shes at 50c lol


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I use the razor, so no thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm contemplating de-lidding my mum's I3....she doesn't need it but stock voltages etc shes at 50c lol


I always cut myself with knives and blades so I'm gonna use the vice when I get the balls to delid my 3570k... It arrived today in the post I think







hurry up 5 o'clock!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> I always cut myself with knives and blades so I'm gonna use the vice when I get the balls to delid my 3570k... It arrived today in the post I think
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hurry up 5 o'clock!


haha good luck







!
Take your time


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i just saw this post http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/21800_100#post_20785011
> and this
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is this different one?


Looks like the same you ordered and the same I got.. but im skeptic it will hold.. the ball mounting thing sucks big time! it wont hold the force needed to loosen the IHS
or maybe it will.. it didnt hold for me







and I tightened it all it could take!

I would go with the low profile clamps that has been linked earlier or simply two hard pieces of wood,


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






This or,


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






It seams Skyn3t uses one piece to rest IHS on and the other to hit the PCB
I would rest IHS on both pieces and get a 3rd piece to "hit" the PCB

Good luck! seams like you have a pretty good chip there!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> *OCN name:*katemis
> *CPU:*3770k
> *on die-TIM:*CLU
> *ihs-TIM:*artic mx4
> *Mhz gained:*-
> *OC after delid:*-
> *cooler:*h100 push/pull(with slim and stock fans)low profile
> *Temp drops:*don't know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> approx 10~15c as i can remember.
> here some test i made for you after delid( i don't have before delid)
> stock
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oc 4.5ghz
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're in!







Welcome to the Crew and Slappa dat Sig on!


----------



## GaMbi2004

lol







dont know what it is.. it just makes me smile every time I see that "Slappa dat Sig on!" lol ^^

and welcome katemis ^^


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys... got a new ram kit in.. and I shoudl be showign 16 gigs... but for some reason it's only showing 8......


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys... got a new ram kit in.. and I shoudl be showign 16 gigs... but for some reason it's only showing 8......


where is it only showing 8?
Re-flash bios would be my initial thoughts.


----------



## Agoniizing

A couple of months ago, I entered my info to join the club. How do I know if im in?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> where is it only showing 8?
> Re-flash bios would be my initial thoughts.


Most likely only a reseat of the RAM is required... you shouldn't need to flash BIOS just to see a change in the RAM size... normally it will detect immediately and only perhaps give you an "F1 to continue..." message... if only half is showing up, I'm guessing one of the two that were added isn't seated 100%. Either that or there a bad stick or slot (unlikely but possible).

OP (Valgaur) - Try swapping the pairs (old RAM to new slots, new RAM to old slots). If that still comes up with just 8, try just the new RAM by itself... if it's coming up good... then either slot is bad or _then_ perhaps try clearing the BIOS and see.

Usually in your BIOS somewhere it will show you which slots are populated and with what RAM... that's the first place to check to see which aren't registering correctly.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Most likely only a reseat of the RAM is required... you shouldn't need to flash BIOS just to see a change in the RAM size... normally it will detect immediately and only perhaps give you an "F1 to continue..." message... if only half is showing up, I'm guessing one of the two that were added isn't seated 100%. Either that or there a bad stick or slot (unlikely but possible).
> 
> OP (Valgaur) - Try swapping the pairs (old RAM to new slots, new RAM to old slots). If that still comes up with just 8, try just the new RAM by itself... if it's coming up good... then either slot is bad or _then_ perhaps try clearing the BIOS and see.
> 
> Usually in your BIOS somewhere it will show you which slots are populated and with what RAM... that's the first place to check to see which aren't registering correctly.


they are all seated correctly and even cpu-z valids show this. they wont show in task manager or resource monitor. But for SOME reason my 1600 mhz vengences are staying on 665 for some reason... heres the link..... http://valid.canardpc.com/yq4whf

see what I mean? I put 1600 in the bios and they wont budge...

A couple of months ago, I entered my info to join the club. How do I know if im in?

Check the front page silly!


----------



## Agoniizing

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> they are all seated correctly and even cpu-z valids show this. they wont show in task manager or resource monitor. But for SOME reason my 1600 mhz vengences are staying on 665 for some reason... heres the link..... http://valid.canardpc.com/yq4whf
> 
> see what I mean? I put 1600 in the bios and they wont budge...
> 
> A couple of months ago, I entered my info to join the club. How do I know if im in?
> 
> Check the front page silly!


Duh


----------



## Valgaur

k switched slots for the new sticks and have the old out at the moment and the sticks are at 1600 now whiel those vcenegnces were at 1333 for some reason.... gonna put them in the other lanes and see if 16 shows up now im gonna update bios as well.


----------



## Magical Eskimo

I'm not delidded yet but... here's my results of my 3570k with MSI OCgenie enabled, cpuZ says 1.144v, to me this sounds very low for 4.2GHz? is something not right?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> k switched slots for the new sticks and have the old out at the moment and the sticks are at 1600 now whiel those vcenegnces were at 1333 for some reason.... gonna put them in the other lanes and see if 16 shows up now im gonna update bios as well.


May not hurt to check the cpu heatsink as well if it just won't show up, I haven't seen it since x58 but back then tightening the heatsink on the cpu a bit too much could make memory disappear.

Also doesn't hurt to boot 1 stick, shut down & add another & boot up again, repeat until all the sticks are in as long as they keep showing up in windows while adding.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> I'm not delidded yet but... here's my results of my 3570k with MSI OCgenie enabled, cpuZ says 1.144v, to me this sounds very low for 4.2GHz? is something not right?


Pretty normal, 1.14v for only 4.2ghz

Why use OC genie? D:


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Pretty normal, 1.14v for only 4.2ghz
> 
> Why use OC genie? D:


Ah okay I wasn't sure, well it's late at night and I literally just wanted to install the CPU, check it worked fine, and then see what OC genie did. I suppose I could spare another half an hour in to the night to give it a quick go myself haha


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> they are all seated correctly and even cpu-z valids show this. they wont show in task manager or resource monitor. But for SOME reason my 1600 mhz vengences are staying on 665 for some reason... heres the link..... http://valid.canardpc.com/yq4whf
> 
> see what I mean? I put 1600 in the bios and they wont budge...
> 
> A couple of months ago, I entered my info to join the club. How do I know if im in?
> 
> Check the front page silly!


that suggests bios - just like on OC'ing when the values don't change.


----------



## Valgaur

......the corsairs are still at 1333...... it shows 8 with 3 sticks in... this is getting annoying really fast.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ......the corsairs are still at 1333...... it shows 8 with 3 sticks in... this is getting annoying really fast.


1 bad stick can mess all the ram up. Probably should rma the entire kit if you can't get it working soon.


----------



## Cyro999

I'd still try it in another system first


----------



## Valgaur

it's two different kits kingston and corsair. I just don't understand why the corsairs are at a lower speed....


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it's two different kits kingston and corsair. I just don't understand why the corsairs are at a lower speed....


did you re-flash the bios....?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> did you re-flash the bios....?


yuuuuuup


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yuuuuuup


Compatibility problem then?


----------



## Sirstiv

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i just saw this post http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/21800_100#post_20785011
> and this
> 
> is this different one?


That's the one







.

Costed me $28 in australia.

It's not the best but it does the job. You'll need to take more hits than required.

Don't use the rubber grips, don't be scared to overclamp it abit. As i said took like 50 taps with a small hammer and small vice.

Felt like a psychopath by the end of it.


----------



## Chomuco

@ 4770k a 4.5 1.260v sli 680 light , http://gyazo.com/7b5e3d291407b010bea4f78dbe1df22a.png


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Compatibility problem then?


I got it fixed just swapped for a 2x8 gb kit is all so i have 16 now thanks to a buddy


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I got it fixed just swapped for a 2x8 gb kit is all so i have 16 now thanks to a buddy


2x8gb is better anyway for 1155/1150. Only reason to get 4x4gb is for 2011 for quad channel.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 2x8gb is better anyway for 1155/1150. Only reason to get 4x4gb is for 2011 for quad channel.


agreed


----------



## touki

I delidded mine. I was in a hurry and didn't have the right size vice. Anyway I damaged one of the pins a little. It works fine and benches seem to be close to what it was but my second card only sits at x4 when it should be x8 (z77). Could this be something else like heatsink too tight/loose?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *touki*
> 
> I delidded mine. I was in a hurry and didn't have the right size vice. Anyway I damaged one of the pins a little. It works fine and benches seem to be close to what it was but my second card only sits at x4 when it should be x8 (z77). Could this be something else like heatsink too tight/loose?


Need more info







4770K ? are you running without IHS or with? what cooler? how damaged? any pics?


----------



## Magical Eskimo

So I performed my first ever delid, okay so it's a single core celeron, but I want practice for my 3570k! I have 1 more celeron and a celeron dual core left, both of which I'm gonna try the vice method with


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I got it fixed just swapped for a 2x8 gb kit is all so i have 16 now thanks to a buddy


Hi Val







- ...glad you got your RAM working (more on that below)...thought I just mention that after playing with the Sandy-E mostly for HWBot and the delidded 3770K being my daily fun machine, that I have had not discernible degradation after 7 months or so of delidded goodness and 5GHz+ daily speeds (top validation http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2673163 )

...also ended up getting 4 x4 sticks of TridentX 2666 (which actually work great @ Sandy-E) and decided to try them out in the delidded 3770K just to see / fun...DDR3 2800 @ stock DDR voltage was no problem, including for gaming and hard benching...even got past DDR3 2933 (again stock DDR-v) with all 4 sticks ( http://valid.canardpc.com/2898267 ) and a bit higher just choosing 1 of the 4...

I suspect that there are several delidded club members with Ivy CPUs which could 'rejuvenate ' / boost performance with this kind of RAM...it does come down to your individual CPU's IMC, but I have seen plenty of other 3770K etc doing similar stuff at the bot.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> Hi Val
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> - ...glad you got your RAM working (more on that below)...thought I just mention that after playing with the Sandy-E mostly for HWBot and the delidded 3770K being my daily fun machine, that I have had not discernible degradation after 7 months or so of delidded goodness and 5GHz+ daily speeds (top validation http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2673163 )
> 
> ...also ended up getting 4 x4 sticks of TridentX 2666 (which actually work great @ Sandy-E) and decided to try them out in the delidded 3770K just to see / fun...DDR3 2800 @ stock DDR voltage was no problem, including for gaming and hard benching...even got past DDR3 2933 (again stock DDR-v) with all 4 sticks ( http://valid.canardpc.com/2898267 ) and a bit higher just choosing 1 of the 4...
> 
> I suspect that there are several delidded club members with Ivy CPUs which could 'rejuvenate ' / boost performance with this kind of RAM...it does come down to your individual CPU's IMC, but I have seen plenty of other 3770K etc doing similar stuff at the bot.


What happened to you! Same for Hokies and Ivan, not the same club anymore!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> What happened to you! Same for Hokies and Ivan, not the same club anymore!


...some travel ... and playing around with the 6c-Sandy-Es - FORTUNATELY, you can't delid those (ditto for the Ivy-Es)...but at least I got some CL-U on the 3970X IHS -


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811139022

I'mma get this case and WC it


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811139022
> 
> I'mma get this case and WC it


Have you seen the new mini case labs case









http://www.caselabs-store.com/mercury-s5-case/


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Have you seen the new mini case labs case
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.caselabs-store.com/mercury-s5-case/


not worth that price tag


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not worth that price tag


Maybe, I think quite a nice looking watercooling build could be accomplished in it. It is cheaper than the rest tho


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Maybe, I think quite a nice looking watercooling build could be accomplished in it. It is cheaper than the rest tho


I like the form factor of the corsair one plus I hate the white color...


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I like the form factor of the corsair one plus I hate the white color...


Don't you like aluminum?









White is special, looks bad with certain color schemes, but amazing with others.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Don't you like aluminum?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> White is special, looks bad with certain color schemes, but amazing with others.


eeeehh. I like the look and all but the corsair is much sleeker and I can do a nice loop in there for my setup easily


----------



## touki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> [quote name="touki" url="/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/21880#post_20793013"]I delidded mine. I was in a hurry and didn't have the right size vice. Anyway I damaged one of the pins a little. It works fine and benches seem to be close to what it was but my second card only sits at x4 when it should be x8 (z77). Could this be something else like heatsink too tight/loose?


Need more info







4770K ? are you running without IHS or with? what cooler? how damaged? any pics?[/QUOTE]

3770k
Running with IHS
Koolance 380i water block
CLU between CPU & IHS

No pics but basically the layers of green stuff seperated a little right in the middle on one side, moving a pin a little bit. I was able to smooth out the pin by pressing the cpu together. If that makes sense.


----------



## 100Stress

*Hi guys*

This is my first post on this forum, and just want to say I got delidded my i5 3570K, using both methods:









Razor-blade to cut just the corners!

Vice Drill Press to finish the job [ *just one strike* ]

OCN name: NZXT Switch 810
CPU: 3570K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory liquid ultra
IHS TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: Not testing
OC after delid: testing........
Temp drops: ????

I'll try the 4.5GHz, but need help in settings because I'm not able to boot at that speed.

I apologize for my bad English


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I like the form factor of the corsair one plus I hate the white color...


You can order a CL case in one of many colors, you know that right?

The main reason I haven't got a CL case yet is because I don't live in the US. The already steep price along with the shipping and import taxes makes modding a CM690 II Adv. feel so natural.







I will save up for an M8 someday though.

Sure thing is I'm never going to buy a cheap case ever again.


----------



## katemis

guys
are my temps ok?i'm thinking that i made something wrong...
i hit 79c to the hottest core and 69c to coldest core at 4.5ghz to intel burn test standart
room temp 27-28c


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> guys
> are my temps ok?i'm thinking that i made something wrong...
> i hit 79c to the hottest core and 69c to coldest core at 4.5ghz to intel burn test standart
> room temp 27-28c


What voltages? If that's after delidding then it does sound a bit high


----------



## Schmuckley

IN!

Delidded 4670K


----------



## katemis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> What voltages? If that's after delidding then it does sound a bit high


yes its after deliding.in test the voltage to cpu-z is 1.255-1.265.in idle it goes up to 1.300 and i don't know why.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> guys
> are my temps ok?i'm thinking that i made something wrong...
> i hit 79c to the hottest core and 69c to coldest core at 4.5ghz to intel burn test standart
> room temp 27-28c


Does seem a little high.
But that said so is 1.3v. Are you on AUTO vcore?
How did you do your OC?


----------



## katemis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Does seem a little high.
> But that said so is 1.3v. Are you on AUTO vcore?
> How did you do your OC?


Νο i put it manually to 1.27 but when idles is 1.3!on stress test it drops to 1.255-1.265.(stupid chip....lottery gone bad)should i put llc extreme?i have an asus board
my stock temps it seems to be similar with other chips at 4.5ghz


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> Νο i put it manually to 1.27 but when idles is 1.3!on stress test it drops to 1.255-1.265.(stupid chip....lottery gone bad)should i put llc extreme?i have an asus board
> my stock temps it seems to be similar with other chips at 4.5ghz


you need to follow the OC guide - check my sig for my BIOS pics


----------



## katemis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> you need to follow the OC guide - check my sig for my BIOS pics


ok i'm looking at this now.thank you.
but what should i do?repaste again or some chips are so bad to temps?


----------



## Magical Eskimo

I am delidded! I'm still just working out my temp drops, It's lookng to be quite good I hope








OCN name: MAGICAL ESKIMO
CPU: i5 3570K - Malay L222A830
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: in progress
OC after delid: in progress
Temp drops: I used an hour of p95 for this and got drops of about 16c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: in progress, at 4.5 at the moment http://valid.canardpc.com/ia1kbh but I know I can go higher, this is just for working out the temp changes.

About to go under the knife/hammer. I cut in to the corners a little bit before I put it in to the vice, worked quite well


Success! Main worries are over now, nothing was damaged










The aftermath on my desk







yes I I used cotton buds at times, but I was using a lint free cloth for the final wipes on anything


----------



## Schmuckley

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> I am delidded! I'm still just working out my temp drops, It's lookng to be quite good I hope
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: MAGICAL ESKIMO
> CPU: i5 3570K - Malay L222A830
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: in progress
> OC after delid: in progress
> Temp drops: I used an hour of p95 for this and got drops of about 16c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: in progress, at 4.5 at the moment http://valid.canardpc.com/ia1kbh but I know I can go higher, this is just for working out the temp changes.
> 
> About to go under the knife/hammer. I cut in to the corners a little bit before I put it in to the vice, worked quite well
> 
> Success! Main worries are over now, nothing was damaged
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The aftermath on my desk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yes I I used cotton buds at times, but I was using a lint free cloth for the final wipes on anything


Coffee Filters, FTW!


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> Coffee Filters, FTW!


Coffee filters? There's no coffee filters on my desk! haha


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *katemis*
> 
> ok i'm looking at this now.thank you.
> but what should i do?repaste again or some chips are so bad to temps?


copy and paste the bios settings - apart from RAM & the manual vcore should be at 1.25 @ 4.5ghz to start off with.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Coffee filters? There's no coffee filters on my desk! haha


Looks good dude - I mean the delid!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I will save up for an M8 someday though.
> 
> Sure thing is I'm never going to buy a cheap case ever again.




I highly recommend it...







The only thing I regret about my M8 is not getting it sooner... that or just getting a TH10 right from the start rather than M8 and adding the pedestal later for even more money.

However, I will definitely never get anything else from here on out... already spec'ing my second one now in fact.


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Oh yeah, should intel turbo boost be turned off when doing manual overclocks? I've had mine on all this time so far, just wondering if I'll find it easier getting it stable with it off


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Oh yeah, should intel turbo boost be turned off when doing manual overclocks? I've had mine on all this time so far, just wondering if I'll find it easier getting it stable with it off


Turbo disables automatically when you pass 3.9ghz. I suggest you follow the OC guide mate


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Turbo disables automatically when you pass 3.9ghz. I suggest you follow the OC guide mate


Ah okay, it's alright I'm getting the hang of overclocking, here's my latest validation I've got running P95 at the moment while I'm out http://valid.canardpc.com/2depjm


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> Coffee Filters, FTW!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Coffee filters? There's no coffee filters on my desk! haha


When shmuckley is liquored up, do not drink the coffee if his ears look clean!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Ah okay, it's alright I'm getting the hang of overclocking, here's my latest validation I've got running P95 at the moment while I'm out http://valid.canardpc.com/2depjm


stop that immediately 1.41v !?
You are either overshooting, or have not set a manual voltage.

Take this to the OC thread, in order not to derail.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *100Stress*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Hi guys*
> 
> This is my first post on this forum, and just want to say I got delidded my i5 3570K, using both methods:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Razor-blade to cut just the corners!
> 
> Vice Drill Press to finish the job [ *just one strike* ]
> 
> OCN name: NZXT Switch 810
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory liquid ultra
> IHS TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: Not testing
> OC after delid: testing........
> Temp drops: ????
> 
> I'll try the 4.5GHz, but need help in settings because I'm not able to boot at that speed.
> 
> I apologize for my bad English
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig on and join the Crew!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> You can order a CL case in one of many colors, you know that right?
> 
> The main reason I haven't got a CL case yet is because I don't live in the US. The already steep price along with the shipping and import taxes makes modding a CM690 II Adv. feel so natural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will save up for an M8 someday though.
> 
> Sure thing is I'm never going to buy a cheap case ever again.


After buying and owning a Cosmos 2..... I guess I don't mind the size of it but I have no Watercooling room and I want to do a WC loop at least just one for my daily and I want a special look with it is all








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> IN!
> 
> Delidded 4670K


Yes Schmuck you are in







Be a pal and Smack Sig on








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> I am delidded! I'm still just working out my temp drops, It's lookng to be quite good I hope
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: MAGICAL ESKIMO
> CPU: i5 3570K - Malay L222A830
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: in progress
> OC after delid: in progress
> Temp drops: I used an hour of p95 for this and got drops of about 16c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: in progress, at 4.5 at the moment http://valid.canardpc.com/ia1kbh but I know I can go higher, this is just for working out the temp changes.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> About to go under the knife/hammer. I cut in to the corners a little bit before I put it in to the vice, worked quite well
> 
> 
> Success! Main worries are over now, nothing was damaged
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The aftermath on my desk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yes I I used cotton buds at times, but I was using a lint free cloth for the final wipes on anything


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on! Welcome to the Crew!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Ah okay, it's alright I'm getting the hang of overclocking, here's my latest validation I've got running P95 at the moment while I'm out http://valid.canardpc.com/2depjm


Updated!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> After buying and owning a Cosmos 2..... I guess I don't mind the size of it but I have no Watercooling room and I want to do a WC loop at least just one for my daily and I want a special look with it is all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Updated!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> You can order a CL case in one of many colors, you know that right?
> The main reason I haven't got a CL case yet is because I don't live in the US. The already steep price along with the shipping and import taxes makes modding a CM690 II Adv. feel so natural.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will save up for an M8 someday though.
> Sure thing is I'm never going to buy a cheap case ever again.


I currently have the cosmos 2, looks nice but it isn't designed very well, not much rad space up top, and the bottom doesn't seem very roomy. I have a TH10 with some added features and I can put 8x 480mm rads as thick as I want lol w/o any mods. I plan on a unique build using a pedestal and the double sided feature of the case for optimized airflow plus watercooling.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I currently have the cosmos 2, looks nice but it isn't designed very well, not much rad space up top, and the bottom doesn't seem very roomy. I have a TH10 with some added features and I can put 8x 480mm rads as thick as I want lol w/o any mods. I plan on a unique build using a pedestal and the double sided feature of the case for optimized airflow plus watercooling.


those cases just seem far to exspensive for me...I want small and compact and be able to mod it to make it even better. Like if I do the Idea I have on the Corsair 540 I will have a thick 240 on the top nice thick 360 in the fron will mod my res in there somewhere and then have another 2 240's in the back modded in


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> those cases just seem far to exspensive for me...I want small and compact and be able to mod it to make it even better. Like if I do the Idea I have on the Corsair 540 I will have a thick 240 on the top nice thick 360 in the fron will mod my res in there somewhere and then have another 2 240's in the back modded in


Awful amount of radiators for a case that small. Don't tell me you're planning to have rads on the outside of the case -.-


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Awful amount of radiators for a case that small. Don't tell me you're planning to have rads on the outside of the case -.-


nope all interior i like having plenty of cool down room in a build.


----------



## wermad

I have decapitated my cpu









Temps weren't that bad (~75-80c load @ 4.8) but now im in the mid 60s. Have plenty of room to start pushing for 4.9-5.0













Tried the block-block method and it didn't work. Got my old and trusty vise out and that did the trick very quickly.

Is there's a cure time for ID-7 btw? Just wondering if I should expect better temps some time soon. I'm quite happy with the current temps as its a tad bit better then my old SB at the same clock


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> I have decapitated my cpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps weren't that bad (~75-80c load @ 4.8) but now im in the mid 60s. Have plenty of room to start pushing for 4.9-5.0
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tried the block-block method and it didn't work. Got my old and trusty vise out and that did the trick very quickly.
> 
> Is there's a cure time for ID-7 btw? Just wondering if I should expect better temps some time soon. I'm quite happy with the current temps as its a tad bit better then my old SB at the same clock


did you use IC-7 on the die? if so i wouldn't.


----------



## Daredevil 720

That thing about the IC-7 cracking delidded CPU dies was just a speculation. No dies have actually been cracked because of it AFAIK. IIRC there was a person who sanded (!) his die and it worked just fine. What could go wrong with IC-7?









@wermad: I wouldn't use a "normal" TIM under the IHS for long. It is possible that the TIM will "pump out" and dislocate itself worsening the temps constantly. Only liquid metal TIMs are recommended for die to IHS application.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Would you guys want me to open up my PC and see how the CLU is doing?
Or has someone already done it after numerous hours?

Last time I opened my CPU again, it slid off as easy it wasn't "solidified" or anything.


----------



## wermad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> That thing about the IC-7 cracking delidded CPU dies was just a speculation. No dies have actually been cracked because of it AFAIK. IIRC there was a person who sanded (!) his die and it worked just fine. What could go wrong with IC-7?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @wermad: I wouldn't use a "normal" TIM under the IHS for long. It is possible that the TIM will "pump out" and dislocate itself worsening the temps constantly. Only liquid metal TIMs are recommended for die to IHS application.


Ic-7 for the die and ihs. Gelid/EK tim on the water block and ihs


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> That thing about the IC-7 cracking delidded CPU dies was just a speculation. No dies have actually been cracked because of it AFAIK. IIRC there was a person who sanded (!) his die and it worked just fine. What could go wrong with IC-7?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @wermad: I wouldn't use a "normal" TIM under the IHS for long. It is possible that the TIM will "pump out" and dislocate itself worsening the temps constantly. Only liquid metal TIMs are recommended for die to IHS application.


I like to be careful is all


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I like to be careful is all












I can just picture you carefully upping the vcore to 1.8V on poor franky!


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Would you guys want me to open up my PC and see how the CLU is doing?
> Or has someone already done it after numerous hours?
> 
> Last time I opened my CPU again, it slid off as easy it wasn't "solidified" or anything.


Do it for science!!

Kind of bummed about the game today. We won yeah, but we couldn't score in the open field vs a 10 man Crystal Palace...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can just picture you carefully upping the vcore to 1.8V on poor franky!


Shhhhh


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> That thing about the IC-7 cracking delidded CPU dies was just a speculation. No dies have actually been cracked because of it AFAIK. IIRC there was a person who sanded (!) his die and it worked just fine. What could go wrong with IC-7?


CLP on the other hand...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Do it for science!!
> 
> Kind of bummed about the game today. We won yeah, but we couldn't score in the open field vs a 10 man Crystal Palace...


I know man!


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Would you guys want me to open up my PC and see how the CLU is doing?
> Or has someone already done it after numerous hours?
> 
> Last time I opened my CPU again, it slid off as easy it wasn't "solidified" or anything.


I just removed the CLU of my 4770K since Im rebuilding my loop to go direct die with the EK precise kit. The CLU came off rather easily without an issue. I used alcohol to clean it off and it whipped clean no issues.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> I just removed the CLU of my 4770K since Im rebuilding my loop to go direct die with the EK precise kit. The CLU came off rather easily without an issue. I used alcohol to clean it off and it whipped clean no issues.


thanks for letting me know - how long was it ON for, when you removed it?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> CLP on the other hand...


I personally would never apply CLP to anything. I don't understand why people think it's better than CLU. It's worse in all fronts, and above all dangerous.


----------



## rusky1

Currently debating whether I should delid or not. Seems like my cpu falls into the decent chip category. I did a quick intel burn test to make sure that its more than just validation stable. At 4.7, at the same voltage, I can validate but it won't pass the test. Temps are 34C idle, 76C load. Using CLP between IHS and the h110 block.

http://valid.canardpc.com/4t2xfz
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I personally would never apply CLP to anything. I don't understand why people think it's better than CLU. It's worse in all fronts, and above all dangerous.


What exactly is dangerous about it?


----------



## iPDrop

As some one who used the hammer vice wood method to delid a 3770k i will recommend doing it, its ridiculously easy and no harm is done!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I personally would never apply CLP to anything. I don't understand why people think it's better than CLU. It's worse in all fronts, and above all dangerous.


Agree 100%


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rusky1*
> 
> Currently debating whether I should delid or not. Seems like my cpu falls into the decent chip category. I did a quick intel burn test to make sure that its more than just validation stable. At 4.7, at the same voltage, I can validate but it won't pass the test. Temps are 34C idle, 76C load. Using CLP between IHS and the h110 block.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/4t2xfz
> What exactly is dangerous about it?


As CLP hardens and dries it is increasingly hard to clean off specially things like CPU blocks. It's as if it welded things together.

Both CLP and CLU are conductive which is something you have to be careful with. Also, it is not recommended for aluminum blocks as it will eat it away.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rusky1*
> 
> Currently debating whether I should delid or not. Seems like my cpu falls into the decent chip category. I did a quick intel burn test to make sure that its more than just validation stable. At 4.7, at the same voltage, I can validate but it won't pass the test. Temps are 34C idle, 76C load. Using CLP between IHS and the h110 block.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/4t2xfz
> What exactly is dangerous about it?


It tends to weld surfaces together, which can cause damage on delicate things like dies when disassembling.


----------



## wermad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iPDrop*
> 
> As some one who used the hammer vice wood method to delid a 3770k i will recommend doing it, its ridiculously easy and no harm is done!


This, so this









My ihs was already loose I didn't realize it until i saw it. Much easier then the block-block method. I didn't dare try the blade method.


----------



## rusky1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> As CLP hardens and dries it is increasingly hard to clean off specially things like CPU blocks. It's as if it welded things together.
> 
> Both CLP and CLU are conductive which is something you have to be careful with. Also, it is not recommended for aluminum blocks as it will eat it away.


Thanks for the reply! How exactly would it dry up? I thought it was metal.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rusky1*
> 
> Thanks for the reply! How exactly would it dry up? I thought it was metal.


Kinda like this and ends up taking the die with it when you remove the block.



It is incredibly hard to take a picture of this, the light just bounces on the shiny jagged surface, but I think this one is decent, especially for not having a macro lens. If you look at the original pic and zoom in enough you can see inside the die, looks like something copper color.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Kinda like this and ends up taking the die with it when you remove the block.
> 
> 
> 
> It is incredibly hard to take a picture of this, the light just bounces on the shiny jagged surface, but I think this one is decent, especially for not having a macro lens. If you look at the original pic and zoom in enough you can see inside the die, looks like something copper color.


Whoa, you aren't the only person who has killed a gpu removing a block with CLP, I remember seeing a picture before but that wasn't it, I was thinking of one with worse damage yet & pretty sure it was an AMD card.

edit: Searched a bit & found the pics, not sure whose they were


----------



## rusky1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Whoa, you aren't the only person who has killed a gpu removing a block with CLP, I remember seeing a picture before but that wasn't it, I was thinking of one with worse damage yet & pretty sure it was an AMD card.
> 
> edit: Searched a bit & found the pics, not sure whose they were


Both of those examples are of gpu's which I assume had aluminum heatsinks? I can tell the one with the worst damage was. Does CLP simply bind with aluminum on a molecular level?


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rusky1*
> 
> Both of those examples are of gpu's which I assume had aluminum heatsinks? I can tell the one with the worst damage was. Does CLP simply bind with aluminum on a molecular level?


Not aluminum at all, mine was a full copper xspc block. The other die on the 690 was perfectly fine. The cracked one on mine isn't as severe as the amd one, but it still renders the entire GPU useless.


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> stop that immediately 1.41v !?
> You are either overshooting, or have not set a manual voltage.
> 
> Take this to the OC thread, in order not to derail.


Well intels max recommended is 1.52v isn't it? I have set it manually, vdroop is auto. And my temps aren't too bad and I've seen plenty of people with more than 1.41v


----------



## Valgaur




----------



## Totally Dubbed

So direct die, isn't suggested, yet there's nothing wrong with putting clu/p on the die, under the ihs? Especially seeing as I don't see many people wanting to remove that


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Whoa, you aren't the only person who has killed a gpu removing a block with CLP, I remember seeing a picture before but that wasn't it, I was thinking of one with worse damage yet & pretty sure it was an AMD card.
> 
> edit: Searched a bit & found the pics, not sure whose they were


Not sure who's they are? Somebody has to have story about this. First I have heard of it.

Looks photo chopped to me.


----------



## RickRockerr

Well, I think I have clp on gpu, Im never going to disassemble my block







How long clp takes to dry?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> So direct die, isn't suggested, yet there's nothing wrong with putting clu/p on the die, under the ihs? Especially seeing as I don't see many people wanting to remove that


This talk is about CLP specifically. CLP won't stay fluid over time. CLU doesn't seem to change like that.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rusky1*
> 
> Both of those examples are of gpu's which I assume had aluminum heatsinks? I can tell the one with the worst damage was. Does CLP simply bind with aluminum on a molecular level?


That looks like a copper water block to me. The silvery surface is the color of the old, hardened CLP, not aluminum.

For CLU/CLP and what it does to aluminum, go to Youtube and search for "gallium aluminum" and watch one of the videos you'll find. It's a lot worse than you'd think. It does not just bind to the surface. It will go deep into the material and change all of it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Interesting! Thanks for the info +rep


----------



## RickRockerr

Here's A good video about gallium on intel's stock cooler:


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Wow that was amazing!
Interesting info - looks JUST like CLU/P


----------



## Daredevil 720

One of the reasons I haven't gone direct-to-die yet is because I'm afraid of what CLU could do. I know it's not CLP, but it makes you wonder.

I guess I could do it with some "normal" TIM and see if I'm satisfied or not.

Has anyone tried this Indigo Extreme phase change TIM on a naked die installation? Would it outperform liquid metal?


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> One of the reasons I haven't gone direct-to-die yet is because I'm afraid of what CLU could do. I know it's not CLP, but it makes you wonder.
> 
> I guess I could do it with some "normal" TIM and see if I'm satisfied or not.
> 
> Has anyone tried this Indigo Extreme phase change TIM on a naked die installation? Would it outperform liquid metal?


Here's what happens to clu over time


----------



## deepor

Perhaps someone at Coollaboratory made a mistake and that syringe used for that laptop had Liquid Pro instead of Ultra?

Or maybe Coollaboratory buy the raw ingredients for their Liquid Ultra and mix it themselves by hand, and someone just made a mistake for the batch that was mixed and used in that syringe.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Here's what happens to clu over time


Does it also weld or just dry up?


----------



## iPDrop

That is so strange because I've used CLU and CLP on the IHS and die. I've removed my block several times from the IHS and never had something like this happen. I don't know about the die because I haven't removed the IHS to see, but removing the block does nothing like this to the IHS!! The only annoying thing is that both CLU and CLP are very difficult almost impossible to completely clean off.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Does it also weld or just dry up?


I had CLP on my GPU and CPU (both die to ihs and ihs to block) and the performance did not degrade at all after a year, maybe 1-2c? compared to CLU.
Maybe it does have something to do with temperatures, because my temperatures did not get that high due to watercooling.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Well intels max recommended is 1.52v isn't it? I have set it manually, vdroop is auto. And my temps aren't too bad and I've seen plenty of people with more than 1.41v


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Not sure who's they are? Somebody has to have story about this. First I have heard of it.
> 
> Looks photo chopped to me.


Lol, rather than just copy the pics I searched for the source & ended up back here, in the delid thread








http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/6000_50#post_18887063


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *VonDutch*
> 
> wow...should i wait a few months , and see how the removal on the older cards i have
> done with liquid pro also..
> should send those pics to coollaboratory, ask for refund ..LOL
> yea, heating up before removing helps,
> gallium has a low melting point, so it should help a bit at least..


Speaking of a member I miss - what the hell happened to VONDUTCH!?


----------



## ABAD1DEA

i7 3770k

scratched it a bit but still working!


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ABAD1DEA*
> 
> i7 3770k
> 
> scratched it a bit but still working!


...lucky







(or good - doesn't matter)...just put some MX4 or even nail polish on the scratch to be on the safe side before mounting IHS


----------



## ozzy1925

i unistalled my h110 and found out the 1st core was 14 or 15C was higher than the 4th is that because of this?

you think the left corner didnt seat good?i check the cpu the same corner didnt have thermal compound sorry for the bad pic flash was open its hard to see










here is a better one:


----------



## dixson01974

I have a question here.
Can you delid the cpu and take off the socket lever then use a WC block to hold it in place. To have a cpu die in direct contact with the WC block?


----------



## rusky1

Someone may correct me on this but I believe some places sell adapters or even whole water blocks designed to be used in direct-to-die setups.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> I have a question here.
> Can you delid the cpu and take off the socket lever then use a WC block to hold it in place. To have a cpu die in direct contact with the WC block?


If you have EK-Supremacy block you can use this: http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


----------



## dixson01974

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> If you have EK-Supremacy block you can use this: http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


You should be able to use that with any wc block. Thanx for that link.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> I have a question here.
> Can you delid the cpu and take off the socket lever then use a WC block to hold it in place. To have a cpu die in direct contact with the WC block?
> 
> 
> 
> If you have EK-Supremacy block you can use this: http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
Click to expand...

How many people here have used this? have one en-route and could use some feedback on installing it.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> You should be able to use that with any wc block. Thanx for that link.


It's possible to do screws for any wc block but you have to be very accurate.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> How many people here have used this? have one en-route and could use some feedback on installing it.


Well Im using that ´kit, Very easy to install. Lowered my temps about 5°C


----------



## ozzy1925

guys i bought a vice from internet it arrived this morning but i think it has a problem with the teeth part.You think it will work or the teeth part must be flat?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> You should be able to use that with any wc block. Thanx for that link.
> 
> 
> 
> It's possible to do screws for any wc block but you have to be very accurate.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> How many people here have used this? have one en-route and could use some feedback on installing it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well Im using that ´kit, Very easy to install. Lowered my temps about 5°C
Click to expand...

That's reassuring, thanks. I might end up sending you a couple PM's if I get stuck! This is technically still my first build, and my first delid, and my first water loop. But I have done my research, and I just got the Corsiar Air 540, which has enough room in the back half to make even an amateur build look good.

2 quick questions:
1.Did you use CLU?
2.How did you orient your block?


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That's reassuring, thanks. I might end up sending you a couple PM's if I get stuck! This is technically still my first build, and my first delid, and my first water loop. But I have done my research, and I just got the Corsiar Air 540, which has enough room in the back half to make even an amateur build look good.
> 
> 2 quick questions:
> 1.Did you use CLU?
> 2.How did you orient your block?


For the second question, EK recommends the normal orientation of the waterblock.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys i bought a vice from internet it arrived this morning but i think it has a problem with the teeth part.You think it will work or the teeth part must be flat?


Seems good as long as the IHS doesn't go below that top flat part.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys i bought a vice from internet it arrived this morning but i think it has a problem with the teeth part.You think it will work or the teeth part must be flat?


Um, it is flat. You're going to use the very top of the vise.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys i bought a vice from internet it arrived this morning but i think it has a problem with the teeth part.You think it will work or the teeth part must be flat?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I drew you a picture!



That's the only way I see that it might work.


----------



## dirtydigs

@ Inedenimadam, I asked EK which jet plate to use, and got this

thank you for contacting EK Support. We would recommend jet plate J1 (1mm) and normal orientation of the CPU water block.

Best Regards,
EK Support

Ticket ID: 4675
Subject: Naked Ivy
Department: EK Support
Priority: Low
Date Submitted: Sep 7 2013, 5:16 AM


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> I have a question here.
> Can you delid the cpu and take off the socket lever then use a WC block to hold it in place. To have a cpu die in direct contact with the WC block?


Yes, this is how you do direct die unless you buy a kit. It might take a couple of tries to get the pressure just right.


----------



## Sirstiv

OCN name: SirStiv
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Z5 Cool
Mhz gained: mehhhh
OC after delid: I never bothered, went straight to OC. >> 4.6ghz
Temp drops: i get like 28-32 on idle, and 40-50 normal operating. Runs alot cooler on 4.5ghz. Halp me OC it better/further!
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

http://valid.canardpc.com/2900230



Note: i re edited this post fully. I was getting 85-90 degrees before. I lowered my CPU volt, tried to get everything more 1:1.
Lowered my ram mhz abit, OC's through the BCLCK strap abit and got a cooler, better overclock







.

Using a H80i cooler







and running fans @ full. Am i in the clerbbb?







.

Note: i'm running g.skill trident-x's @ 2400mhz, but i chose to run them @ 1800ish for a smoother OC. They show up as 900mhz.
At 4.6ghz i can boot into windows @ 1.3-1.31 volts but crashes on stress test... I'm guessing my chip is an intermediate one?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I drew you a picture!
> 
> 
> 
> That's the only way I see that it might work.


thanks for the pic


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sirstiv*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: SirStiv
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Z5 Cool
> Mhz gained: mehhhh
> OC after delid: I never bothered, went straight to OC. >> 4.6ghz
> Temp drops: i get like 28-32 on idle, and 40-50 normal operating. Runs alot cooler on 4.5ghz. Halp me OC it better/further!
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2900230
> 
> 
> 
> Note: i re edited this post fully. I was getting 85-90 degrees before. I lowered my CPU volt, tried to get everything more 1:1.
> Lowered my ram mhz abit, OC's through the BCLCK strap abit and got a cooler, better overclock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Using a H80i cooler
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and running fans @ full. Am i in the clerbbb?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Note: i'm running g.skill trident-x's @ 2400mhz, but i chose to run them @ 1800ish for a smoother OC. They show up as 900mhz.
> At 4.6ghz i can boot into windows @ 1.3-1.31 volts but crashes on stress test... I'm guessing my chip is an intermediate one?


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on! Welcome to The Crew!


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That's reassuring, thanks. I might end up sending you a couple PM's if I get stuck! This is technically still my first build, and my first delid, and my first water loop. But I have done my research, and I just got the Corsiar Air 540, which has enough room in the back half to make even an amateur build look good.
> 
> 2 quick questions:
> 1.Did you use CLU?
> 2.How did you orient your block?


I use CLP at the moment but im going to go with CLU soon.
and Daredevil already answered to the second question


----------



## RickRockerr

Does somebody know how long does it take to clu to dry?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> How many people here have used this? have one en-route and could use some feedback on installing it.


I just remounted using the precise kit and it was a snap. I have not completed building the loop so I cant report back as to temperatures but so far that was the easiest part of my rebuild.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> How many people here have used this? have one en-route and could use some feedback on installing it.
> 
> 
> 
> I just remounted using the precise kit and it was a snap. I have not completed building the loop so I cant report back as to temperatures but so far that was the easiest part of my rebuild.
Click to expand...

Awesome! That's the type of feedback I was looking for. I have never built a water loop before, and was worried that I had thrown in another level of confusion. But this makes me feel confident that it wont be a problem. I may not have ever built a water-loop, but I have installed hot water heaters leak free on the first shot...I think I got this...just waiting on frozencpu.com or rather UPS to get my parts from NY to Atlanta!


----------



## Sirstiv

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Does somebody know how long does it take to clu to dry?


From my understanding and what i've seen, it doesn't on-die.

I took my lid off a week later to re-apply because i wasn't happy with how i lapped it on initially.

Was still wet. Just got the brush and re-spread it all over even again.

I think it only dries on like copper water cooler surfaces? I've read it turns into 'bird ****'


----------



## Jcapulet786

Just delided my 3770k - got up to 4.9 ghz and if i take off hyper threading i can get 5.0 - its such a beast!


----------



## Sirstiv

Do the rules of delidding and overclocking allow us to turn hyperthreading off? or is this frowned upon abit?









I thought about turning it off to see if i could hit higher...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sirstiv*
> 
> Do the rules of delidding and overclocking allow us to turn hyperthreading off? or is this frowned upon abit?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought about turning it off to see if i could hit higher...


no, people actually sometimes turn HT off to make it a fairer "fight" vs i5's.
As for OC'ing you can see how high you can go.

Personally I see no need to go higher and waste the potential of HT.
I have a i7 3770k myself.


----------



## wermad

Lol, back to the "turn off phyx in 3d Vantage" for the amd gpu crowd complaints







. If you're going to bench, get the higher end chip and you won't have to worry about a "disadvantage" for a lesser chip/product.

Frankly, i'm sick of benching for the competitive nature. Seems like there's always some one out there who wants to prove they have a bigger e-peen then you. I just bench for stability. I game so I have need major need to run 8 threads vs 4 on my lil i5. Edit: and no, BF3/BF4 are not my life-blood so I won't miss out


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> Lol, back to the "turn off phyx in 3d Vantage" for the amd gpu crowd complaints
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . If you're going to bench, get the higher end chip and you won't have to worry about a "disadvantage" for a lesser chip/product.
> 
> Frankly, i'm sick of benching for the competitive nature. Seems like there's always some one out there who wants to prove they have a bigger e-peen then you. I just bench for stability. I game so I have need major need to run 8 threads vs 4 on my lil i5. Edit: and no, BF3/BF4 are not my life-blood so I won't miss out


It's the nature of competitive benching. You do great on air & get beat by water cooled, water cool & get beat by ln2, ln2 cool & get beat by kingpin & 8pack anyway.

if you don't have fun doing it, it isn't worthwhile. Big e-peen is useless when it gets you no e-vag....


----------



## stickg1

I just smoke an e-spliff and forget about it


----------



## wermad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's the nature of competitive benching. You do great on air & get beat by water cooled, water cool & get beat by ln2, ln2 cool & get beat by kingpin & 8pack anyway.
> 
> if you don't have fun doing it, it isn't worthwhile. *Big e-peen is useless when it gets you no e-vag*....










This made my day









Ok, going back to work on 4.9 and then beyond


----------



## ozzy1925

after failed with razor and killed my 3770k able to delid this time with the vice method.It was very easy and safer then razor just 3 hits and the pcb is out :








OCN name: Ozzy1925
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Gelid extreme
Mhz gained: none uncore gained 100
OC after delid: 4.7ghz, uncore 4.6ghz
Temp drops: i get like 18-20c on load. Before I couldnt even ibt with lower ram speed and uncore was 4.5 and was hitting 100c.
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/uxgu8x


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You do great on air & get beat by water cooled, water cool & get beat by ln2, ln2 cool & get beat by kingpin & 8pack anyway.


Absolute zero > kingpin 8pack


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> after failed with razor and killed my 3770k able to delid this time with the vice method.It was very easy and safer then razor just 3 hits and the pcb is out :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Ozzy1925
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Gelid extreme
> Mhz gained: none uncore gained 100
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz, uncore 4.6ghz
> Temp drops: i get like 18-20c on load. Before I couldnt even ibt with lower ram speed and uncore was 4.5 and was hitting 100c.
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/uxgu8x


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on! Welcome to the Crew!


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys i bought a vice from internet it arrived this morning but i think it has a problem with the teeth part.You think it will work or the teeth part must be flat?


Thats fine man. Go for it!

Actually looks good because it will sit in there nice and flat/level


----------



## lilchronic

whats up with all the hate torwards CLP.








you people are scaring me , i have that stuff on every thing and for the past 9 months, thou i havent tried taking off my gpu blocks or cpu block yet and i dont think i ever want too


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> whats up with all the hate torwards CLP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you people are scaring me , i have that stuff on every thing and for the past 9 months, thou i havent tried taking off my gpu blocks or cpu block yet and i dont think i ever want too


Well when you take the blocks off post it


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sirstiv*
> 
> From my understanding and what i've seen, it doesn't on-die.
> 
> I took my lid off a week later to re-apply because i wasn't happy with how i lapped it on initially.
> 
> Was still wet. Just got the brush and re-spread it all over even again.
> 
> I think it only dries on like copper water cooler surfaces? I've read it turns into 'bird ****'


I had CLU on my die for about a month and a half and didn't have any issues. It whipped right off the die, the IHS was another story, I had to use the Artic polish to remove the residue but it wasn't much harder than removing aged artic silver.


----------



## neofury

The reason I hated CLP was the applicator and the fact that it doesn't come with a brush. The stupid cotton swabs they give you do a horrendous job imo.

The CLP comes out much more smoothly (my CLP would either not come out or explode, probably an old batch) and the brush spreads it with ease.

Aside from that, I think it was a 2-3c difference, but the application being better could probably account for that.

I just got back from my honeymoon last week and my comp had been down for a full 2 weeks. Booted it back up, works perfectly. Doing some burn tests right now just for fun on max ram.

Before I'd hit up to 88c (hottest core) on a hot day. Now with the temperature being so much better I'm getting: 70-79-81-78

For 5ghz on air, I'm certainly pleased.


----------



## JMattes

I currently have a 2700k that obviously doesn't benefit from delidding.. However the Ivy Bridge and Haswel do.. If I were to move to one of those chips and I were to delid for extra preformance how would I go about hooking it up to the EK HF Supreme?

Can it be mounted on a delidded chip or do I need a whole new waterblock? I modified the mounting system and use a high pressure mounting as it is and not the original fix location.. I can move it closer to the board if needed so is it just a matter of making contact with the delidded chip?

From what I read the 1150 socket has the same dimensions as the 1155 so it will fit if I dont delid it..

What do you guys think? As I dont know.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JMattes*
> 
> I currently have a 2700k that obviously doesn't benefit from delidding.. However the Ivy Bridge and Haswel do.. If I were to move to one of those chips and I were to delid for extra preformance how would I go about hooking it up to the EK HF Supreme?
> 
> Can it be mounted on a delidded chip or do I need a whole new waterblock? I modified the mounting system and use a high pressure mounting as it is and not the original fix location.. I can move it closer to the board if needed so is it just a matter of making contact with the delidded chip?
> 
> From what I read the 1150 socket has the same dimensions as the 1155 so it will fit if I dont delid it..
> 
> What do you guys think? As I dont know.


well, if I get it right you are talking about bare die mount. If you delid you have 2 options: 1. You just delid and put IHS back OR you can run bare die mount. If you go bare die then you need modified mounting system


----------



## ozzy1925

guys today i realized when i plug my hdmi cable to the back of the motherboard i can hear windows sound but no screen but when i plug to my gtx 680 it works fine.Could it be because i damaged the igpu when delided?


----------



## JMattes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> well, if I get it right you are talking about bare die mount. If you delid you have 2 options: 1. You just delid and put IHS back OR you can run bare die mount. If you go bare die then you need modified mounting system


Well a modified mounting system how? Like making sure the block presses again the chip? Or does the chip without the lid no longer pass the plane of the cage its in?

Put IHS back? TIM? Mind explaining more?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys today i realized when i plug my hdmi cable to the back of the motherboard i can hear windows sound but no screen but when i plug to my gtx 680 it works fine.Could it be because i damaged the igpu when delided?


could be - but also is your GTX installed when you plug it in?
I remember asking this question AGES ago on the asus part of the forums - and people said:
If you GPU is plugged into a PCIe slot, then you won't be able to run on-board.
However, when you disconnect the GPU and REMOVE it from your rig completely, it should work.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys today i realized when i plug my hdmi cable to the back of the motherboard i can hear windows sound but no screen but when i plug to my gtx 680 it works fine.Could it be because i damaged the igpu when delided?
> 
> 
> 
> could be - but also is your GTX installed when you plug it in?
> I remember asking this question AGES ago on the asus part of the forums - and people said:
> If you GPU is plugged into a PCIe slot, then you won't be able to run on-board.
> However, when you disconnect the GPU and REMOVE it from your rig completely, it should work.
Click to expand...

I don't know MSI or ASUS bios, but ASRock has an option for primary display adapter in BIOS and will boot blank if cables are not plugged into the device listed as primary.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JMattes*
> 
> Well a modified mounting system how? Like making sure the block presses again the chip? Or does the chip without the lid no longer pass the plane of the cage its in?
> 
> Put IHS back? TIM? Mind explaining more?


Sorry for my nonspecific answer,
with modified mounting system I meant that you have to measure screws to right length so there is proper pressure. Enough for proper contact between cpu and socket but not too much because die is very fragile. If you choose bare die mount you have to remove original cpu holder or whatever its name is. Or you can just delid , scratch old tim and that black glue away, apply new tim and put the IHS back. liquid pro and ultra are best choices between die and IHS. Hope that helps, and sorry if I have misspelled something because english isn't my national language.

Here's pic of my direct mount.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## JMattes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Sorry for my nonspecific answer,
> with modified mounting system I meant that you have to measure screws to right length so there is proper pressure. Enough for proper contact between cpu and socket but not too much because die is very fragile. If you choose bare die mount you have to remove original cpu holder or whatever its name is. Or you can just delid , scratch old tim and that black glue away, apply new tim and put the IHS back. liquid pro and ultra are best choices between die and IHS. Hope that helps, and sorry if I have misspelled something because english isn't my national language.
> 
> Here's pic of my direct mount.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Well right now I have a custom high pressure mount with through screws so technically I can put it as close to the board as it needs to be and make it as tight as I want.. Would that work?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> could be - but also is your GTX installed when you plug it in?
> I remember asking this question AGES ago on the asus part of the forums - and people said:
> If you GPU is plugged into a PCIe slot, then you won't be able to run on-board.
> However, when you disconnect the GPU and REMOVE it from your rig completely, it should work.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I don't know MSI or ASUS bios, but ASRock has an option for primary display adapter in BIOS and will boot blank if cables are not plugged into the device listed as primary.


noob me! thanks both for the info and rep + i unplugged my gtx 680 and enabled igpu from bios now it seem to works


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JMattes*
> 
> Well right now I have a custom high pressure mount with through screws so technically I can put it as close to the board as it needs to be and make it as tight as I want.. Would that work?


I cant see why not


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> noob me! thanks both for the info and rep + i unplugged my gtx 680 and enabled igpu from bios now it seem to works


glad it did!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> whats up with all the hate torwards CLP.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> you people are scaring me , i have that stuff on every thing and for the past 9 months, thou i havent tried taking off my gpu blocks or cpu block yet and i dont think i ever want too


Maybe clp isn't designed to be taken off lol. I would stress the gpus to make them a bit hot, then try removing the block. If it doesn't come off easily I would just leave it like that or you're going to have expensive paper weights like me.


----------



## wermad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JMattes*
> 
> I currently have a 2700k that obviously doesn't benefit from delidding.. However the Ivy Bridge and Haswel do.. If I were to move to one of those chips and I were to delid for extra preformance how would I go about hooking it up to the EK HF Supreme?
> 
> Can it be mounted on a delidded chip or do I need a whole new waterblock? I modified the mounting system and use a high pressure mounting as it is and not the original fix location.. I can move it closer to the board if needed so is it just a matter of making contact with the delidded chip?
> 
> From what I read the 1150 socket has the same dimensions as the 1155 so it will fit if I dont delid it..
> 
> What do you guys think? As I dont know.


EK offers a "naked" mounting kit for the Supremacy block to use without the ihs. New Supremacy start ~$60 or looked used ~$40. The naked kit is like $5-10.


----------



## JMattes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> EK offers a "naked" mounting kit for the Supremacy block to use without the ihs. New Supremacy start ~$60 or looked used ~$40. The naked kit is like $5-10.


Anyway you can send me a link.. I tried to find it on performance PC.. I didnt see it..


----------



## dixson01974

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JMattes*
> 
> Anyway you can send me a link.. I tried to find it on performance PC.. I didnt see it..


http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1032&products_id=37453


----------



## wermad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JMattes*
> 
> Anyway you can send me a link.. I tried to find it on performance PC.. I didnt see it..


http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1032&products_id=37453



Keep in mind this is only for the newer Supremacy and not the older Supreme HF.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> It's the nature of competitive benching. You do great on air & get beat by water cooled, water cool & get beat by ln2, ln2 cool & get beat by kingpin & 8pack anyway.
> 
> if you don't have fun doing it, it isn't worthwhile. Big e-peen is useless when it gets you no e-vag....


So quotable.







I fully expect to see this quoted in no less than 10 sigs by the end of the year.


----------



## dixson01974

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1032&products_id=37453
> Keep in mind this is only for the newer Supremacy and not the older Supreme HF.


You should be able to do it with a XSPC RayStorm block, but you need to get the XSPC Raystorm Intel Aluminum Bracket. You just need to carefully to get even tension on the bracket.


----------



## Schmuckley

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can just picture you carefully upping the vcore to 1.8V on poor franky!












Hey [email protected] I can't find it now;but *Whoever is using IC-Diamond on their die:This is a BAD thing*
The diamond bits can scrach and abrade the die.If it erodes print off of an IHS..It can't be good for a bare CPU.


----------



## nemm

A couple of weeks ago I posted my results after system rebuild with a custom water cooling loop and a delidded 3770k running at 4800MHz @1.344 which gave the following result.

CPU configuration: Die > CLU > IHS > GC Extreme > CPU Block
Ambient 28degC 63-73-71-65



Today I decided to test again with the following conditions changed

CPU Configuration: Die > CLU > IHS > CLU > CPU Block
Ambient 25degC



Result 57-66-65-58

Accounting for the 3degC change in ambient you can see the difference is only a marginal improvement when using CLU on the IHS > CPU Block opposed to using a good thermal paste. The improvement in thermals was the ultimate goal and although this was achieved, it was not worth using CLU for this application in my opinion. However CLU is a definite for Die > IHS application.


----------



## wermad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> You should be able to do it with a XSPC RayStorm block, but you need to get the XSPC Raystorm Intel Aluminum Bracket. You just need to carefully to get even tension on the bracket.


Technically its feasible with any block. You just have to use long screws rather then posts. Some blocks are still sold with screws but more and more are moving on to the quicker mounting of the post system. My old DD M6 just used 50mm long M4 screws that you anchored on the mb w/ nuts and washers. Simple


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nemm*
> 
> A couple of weeks ago I posted my results after system rebuild with a custom water cooling loop and a delidded 3770k running at 4800MHz @1.344 which gave the following result.
> 
> CPU configuration: Die > CLU > IHS > GC Extreme > CPU Block
> Ambient 28degC 63-73-71-65
> 
> 
> 
> Today I decided to test again with the following conditions changed
> 
> CPU Configuration: Die > CLU > IHS > CLU > CPU Block
> Ambient 25degC
> 
> 
> 
> Result 57-66-65-58
> 
> Accounting for the 3degC change in ambient you can see the difference is only a marginal improvement when using CLU on the IHS > CPU Block opposed to using a good thermal paste. The improvement in thermals was the ultimate goal and although this was achieved, it was not worth using CLU for this application in my opinion. However CLU is a definite for Die > IHS application.


we already know this - but +rep for taking time to test anyway and confirming








!


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey [email protected] I can't find it now;but *Whoever is using IC-Diamond on their die:This is a BAD thing*
> The diamond bits can scrach and abrade the die.If it erodes print off of an IHS..It can't be good for a bare CPU.


No paste/metal that has a chance to damage hardware is worth using, including IC-Diamond in your case and CLP in mine and others. Unless you're going for world record oc's, it's not worth 2 degrees (which is probably just plus or minus in the application quality). And plus, records are set with ln2 not paste.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Lol, rather than just copy the pics I searched for the source & ended up back here, in the delid thread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/6000_50#post_18887063


Gomi didn't give out any names either.

Not sure what video card that is and that block looks odd with only 2 mount holes. Maybe the original owner cranked down unevenly and cracked the die.

I have sapped out block with CLP many times on video cards and cpus and never had any type of glue like bonding problem.

I have see the cpu stick to the block on my bare die mounts but with a little twist it separates and it is more of a suction type of bond than glue effect. Comes apart very easy with a little spin.

That photo does look photo chopped to me.


----------



## SonDa5

Many people have had problems with IC Diamond to include me. Here is damage on my video card using IC Diamond. Go over to techpower up you can find threads on people having problems with it. I even got accused of photo shopping my photos.









Here is the photos of the damage I had.

Mark on DIE.


Mark on Block.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Gomi didn't give out any names either.
> 
> Not sure what video card that is and that block looks odd with only 2 mount holes. Maybe the original owner cranked down unevenly and cracked the die.
> 
> I have sapped out block with CLP many times on video cards and cpus and never had any type of glue like bonding problem.
> 
> I have see the cpu stick to the block on my bare die mounts but with a little twist it separates and it is more of a suction type of bond than glue effect. Comes apart very easy with a little spin.
> 
> That photo does look photo chopped to me.


Doesn't really look shooped to me, also hard to say the circumstances, the CLP at room temp is liquidy, but if it was in a cold garage or room it may be harder & tend to stick more or something.
It does look like some kind of oddball heatsink that was modded to work on the card.


----------



## mandrix

Since delidding my 4770K a few weeks ago, you can see the difference in core temps, which is pretty puzzling to me.....not really sure why there is such difference between core 2 and core 4. CLP was used under IHS and MX4 on top under the Raystorm.
Here I'm running IBT:


I thought about pulling it down and re-applying the CLP, but I can't see as that would make any difference. But for sure the results are strange compared to my delidded 3770K.

Anyone else seen such a spread in temps like this?


----------



## inedenimadam

Just to be clear...has there been reports of this damage with CLU? Or has it been reserved to it's predecessor CLP and the diamond TIMs?


----------



## Chomuco

Hello !! test Collaboratory Liquid Pro VS Collaboratory Liquid Ultra

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra DIE , IHS
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/Javier/CoollaboratoryLiquidUltra.jpg~original



Coollaboratory liquid Pro DIE , IHS
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/Javier/CoollaboratoryLiquidPro.jpg~original


----------



## GaMbi2004

really ? 12 degrees ?
That is just stupid :S How many times did you apply? seams to me like you might have put too much / too little on, with the CLU

We had quite a few of other comparisons from others that lines them equal. Some times CLU wins some times CLP wins. but never by 12 degrees :S
That is why we are talking about "easy to apply" and "dry out time" since the temps is roughly the same.

12 degrees? :S


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> really ? 12 degrees ?
> That is just stupid :S How many times did you apply? seams to me like you might have put too much / too little on, with the CLU
> 
> We had quite a few of other comparisons from others that lines them equal. Some times CLU wins some times CLP wins. but never by 12 degrees :S
> That is why we are talking about "easy to apply" and "dry out time" since the temps is roughly the same.
> 
> 12 degrees? :S


Agreed, need to test at least 5 times for each. Correct application is like 99% of the difference between the temperatures.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

12 degrees is huge - and from the members...not quite sure I believe that.
Run prime for 2hrs with each, then show me that


----------



## Arm3nian

It makes no sense, why would they make CLU if the difference was 12 degrees LOWER than CLP, that is like reverse marketing. They made CLU because CLP kills hardware and offers the same temps.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Since I like most of the ppl posting here, I would like to invite you to my latest project:GPU Backplate
I need ppl with a graphical knowledge.
Im making a DYI Backplate for my GPU and need input on the look








Help me out ^^


----------



## Chomuco

sorry nice CLP @ 5 , 1290v 45g full









http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/5045c.jpg~original


----------



## Sirstiv

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> sorry nice CLP @ 5 , 1290v 45g full
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/5045c.jpg~original


What's your cooler setup? 45degrees on full load @ 5ghz? on a 4770k is very good!

I might try copy your settings lol. Is hyper threading on or off?


----------



## defiler2k

So I redid my mount with EK's direct die kit for the supremacy. I have to say Im very dissapointed as my temperatures are 5C higher than with my old Raystorm and IHS setup. I would think that direct contact would provide better performance. Thinking I did something wrong I re did the mount on the CPU I switched out to MX4 to see if that made a difference and still running 5C higher on idle and a full 15C higher on load than with the IHS and the Raystorm. I was expecting better temperatures since I added to the mix a new 480. I wonder if my Mayhem coolant is not performing as it should. I had never used Mayhem before but that is the only variable left to factor out of the equation other than switching back to the Raystorm with the IHS. Any thoughts?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sirstiv*
> 
> What's your cooler setup? 45degrees on full load @ 5ghz? on a 4770k is very good!
> 
> I might try copy your settings lol. Is hyper threading on or off?


He won the silicon lotto.. 90% of all haswell chips probably wont be able to run 5.0 @ 1.3v. I cant even get 4.6GHz stable at 1.3v


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I redid my mount with EK's direct die kit for the supremacy. I have to say Im very dissapointed as my temperatures are 5C higher than with my old Raystorm and IHS setup. I would think that direct contact would provide better performance. Thinking I did something wrong I re did the mount on the CPU I switched out to MX4 to see if that made a difference and still running 5C higher on idle and a full 15C higher on load than with the IHS and the Raystorm. I was expecting better temperatures since I added to the mix a new 480. I wonder if my Mayhem coolant is not performing as it should. I had never used Mayhem before but that is the only variable left to factor out of the equation other than switching back to the Raystorm with the IHS. Any thoughts?


Obviously, you would be able to get better temps with naked die kit.. it all depends on MINOR details..
I never ran with naked die kit myself, but im 100% sure that having the cooler mounted directly to the DIE would be running cooler than having a copper plate between the DIE and the cooler..
It is probably due to the application of the TIM. CLU/CLP is vary sensitive on how thick / thin a layer you apply..

Direct to DIE is only for those who have experiance on this field and willing to reapply 5-10 times to get it just right. It is not for the (sorry the expression) noobs








It seams your old cooler had a better contact to the IHS than your new cooler has on the DIE. or that you put too much / too little TIM on it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Schmuckley*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey [email protected] I can't find it now;but *Whoever is using IC-Diamond on their die:This is a BAD thing*
> The diamond bits can scratch and abrade the die.If it erodes print off of an IHS..It can't be good for a bare CPU.


^ what the Schmuck said!!!


----------



## Cyro999

Linus reccomended IC Diamond over i think CLP a few days back for delidded CPU, not sure if he misunderstood the question on twitter or he was suggesting to use under IHS, it doesn't seem like a common reccomendation
Quote:


> Santiago M ‏@ImOnly2Day 13 Sep
> 
> @LinusTech would you go for ic diamond or liquid pro for a delidded haswell?
> Expand
> Linus Sebastian ‏@LinusTech 13 Sep
> 
> @ImOnly2Day IC diamond.


----------



## Sirstiv

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> He won the silicon lotto.. 90% of all haswell chips probably wont be able to run 5.0 @ 1.3v. I cant even get 4.6GHz stable at 1.3v


lol i reckon you can, tune your bclk like i did @ 1.344v *multiplier like 115)

I want silicon lottery







. Is 1.4v the max we should go on watercooling ?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> He won the silicon lotto.. 90% of all haswell chips probably wont be able to run 5.0 @ 1.3v. I cant even get 4.6GHz stable at 1.3v


i dont think its his cpu unless he got a new one and a new mobo http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/21800_100#post_20791661
http://www.3dmark.com/cg/780882


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Linus reccomended IC Diamond over i think CLP a few days back for delidded CPU, not sure if he misunderstood the question on twitter or he was suggesting to use under IHS, it doesn't seem like a common reccomendation


How many delids has Linus done?


----------



## Cyro999

No idea, it caught me off guard that he actively replied to a tweet to recommend it


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> How many delids has Linus done?


I'm pretty sure = 0


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> How many delids has Linus done?


never heard of him doing them.... hmmmm interesting


----------



## neofury

12 degrees for CLP vs CLU = bad application. No two ways around it. Either that or poor contact.

Regardless, I've used both and they were essentially the same, maybe with a slight advantage to CLU cause I applied it a bit better.


----------



## mandrix

Earlier I had posted about uneven core temps after delidding.
So I pulled the cpu out and laid a straightedge across the IHS....it was very concave. So I pulled out the sand paper and kept at it until the IHS was level, then finished it off with 1500 grit wet. Then I reapplied the CLU under the IHS and MX4 on top the IHS and remounted the Raystorm.
Results?
No runaway core, and my P95 28.1 temps with 12K fft's are 72 max.
Before sanding the IHS level, the same test had one core up to 85!

So here's a lesson, I guess....if you delid and something doesn't look right, maybe lay a straightedge across the IHS and see if you need to work on it. Mine was WAY concave, so obviously the Raystorm wasn't making great contact with the IHS.

*After delidding.*


*After delidding & sanding IHS level.*


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> sorry nice CLP @ 5 , 1290v 45g full
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/5045c.jpg~original


What batch is your 4770k? Impressive nonetheless!


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sirstiv*
> 
> What's your cooler setup? 45degrees on full load @ 5ghz? on a 4770k is very good!
> 
> I might try copy your settings lol. Is hyper threading on or off?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> He won the silicon lotto.. 90% of all haswell chips probably wont be able to run 5.0 @ 1.3v. I cant even get 4.6GHz stable at 1.3v


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> What batch is your 4770k? Impressive nonetheless!


check this :http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/22000_100#post_20821401
his cpu is @4.5ghz


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> check this :http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/22000_100#post_20821401
> his cpu is @4.5ghz


Thanks but I was wondering what batch # is his cpu.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> Thanks but I was wondering what batch # is his cpu.


The real owner of that cpu must be son of bill gates


----------



## Chomuco

chip malasia..a 5.2 y 5.4 + vcore ,WC
http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/Javier/CINEBENCHR115Multicore.jpg~original



http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/Javier/CINEBENCHR115Singlecore.jpg~original



http://hwbot.org/image/993373.jpg

validado ..5.5 = WC http://valid.canardpc.com/2877449



RIG 2)









http://hwbot.org/image/1004546.jpg

rig 24/7 chip costa rica 312B7XX http://valid.canardpc.com/2899610 , http://valid.canardpc.com/2899222


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> chip malasia..a 5.2 y 5.4 + vcore ,WC
> http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb456/JavierOlivera/Javier/CINEBENCHR115Multicore.jpg~original


why is the @5.2ghz cpu screenshot is from 21/07?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> why is the @5.2ghz cpu screenshot is from 21/07?


Possibly because that was when he ran it?


----------



## Chomuco

...ram ! ++

http://imageshack.us/a/img13/8112/qyjn.jpg





nice,nice





















sorry !!


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Possibly because that was when he ran it?










ok!!


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Possibly because that was when he ran it?


well he could be but tell me please, why would a person who owns 5.2ghz cpu on water(%3-%5 chance of all 4770k malaychips)wanted to buy second cpu which can achive 4.5ghz and do benchmarks with it?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ok!!


sorry for going off topic but mate do you have a real proof of your @5.2ghz malay chip?I mean a fresh screenshot with the cpuz and your nickname in the ss


----------



## mercs213

RMA'ed a CPU to Intel. Why is the package they are sending me back weigh 11 pounds.. I don't think a processor weighs 11 pounds + packaging... lol? Maybe they are giving me awhole bunch of processors!


----------



## jlaw3x7

I am thinking of delid on my 4770k to get a slightly better overclock. I'm stable @ 4.6 but get blue screens or reboots in IBT @ 4.7. I noticed when I run @ 4.7 temps spike to 95C+. From reading, it seems almost everyone uses CLU/P but Phobya LM is slightly better in the graph linked in the first post. I have GC Extreme but it sounds like I need to order some Liqud Metal TIM for the die / IHS. I guess I should stay away from CLP? So what should I get?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> RMA'ed a CPU to Intel. Why is the package they are sending me back weigh 11 pounds.. I don't think a processor weighs 11 pounds + packaging... lol? Maybe they are giving me awhole bunch of processors!


if they do - give me one


----------



## Sirstiv

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jlaw3x7*
> 
> I am thinking of delid on my 4770k to get a slightly better overclock. I'm stable @ 4.6 but get blue screens or reboots in IBT @ 4.7. I noticed when I run @ 4.7 temps spike to 95C+. From reading, it seems almost everyone uses CLU/P but Phobya LM is slightly better in the graph linked in the first post. I have GC Extreme but it sounds like I need to order some Liqud Metal TIM for the die / IHS. I guess I should stay away from CLP? So what should I get?


Get CLU.

And don't just do it for the better overclock/cooling, do it for the challenge


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> RMA'ed a CPU to Intel. Why is the package they are sending me back weigh 11 pounds.. I don't think a processor weighs 11 pounds + packaging... lol? Maybe they are giving me awhole bunch of processors!


Lol ^^ 1.1 pounds would be more realistic









Why did you RMA? what CPU? was it delidded? did they know it was delidded?


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> RMA'ed a CPU to Intel. Why is the package they are sending me back weigh 11 pounds.. I don't think a processor weighs 11 pounds + packaging... lol? Maybe they are giving me awhole bunch of processors!


Sending you a small vice for delid?


----------



## mercs213

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Lol ^^ 1.1 pounds would be more realistic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why did you RMA? what CPU? was it delidded? did they know it was delidded?


i5-3570k, yes was delidded. Delidding didn't kill it though.









Was installing a fan controller and when I was finished, put my side panel back on, I turned on my computer and I guess one of the unused male 3pin fan plugins touched the back of my motherboard because the computer wouldn't display anything on screen when you turned it on.... killed my CPU & PSU. Not fun.


----------



## mercs213

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> will they rma it?


Yes, get an RMA from here: http://www.intel.com/p/en_US/support/contactsupport

They will ask you what you did to diagnose the CPU to determine it was faulty. You won't need an invoice.

Edit: Oh and if you broke your CPU from delidding, you shouldn't be sending it back to Intel. You toke the chance and it isn't their fault or a result from a manufacturing defect, etc. *If you can't afford to buy a new CPU then don't delid!*


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> Yes, get an RMA from here: http://www.intel.com/p/en_US/support/contactsupport
> 
> They will ask you what you did to diagnose the CPU to determine it was faulty. You won't need an invoice.
> 
> Edit: Oh and if you broke your CPU from delidding, you shouldn't be sending it back to Intel. You toke the chance and it isn't their fault or a result from a manufacturing defect, etc. *If you can't afford to buy a new CPU then don't delid!*


I agree!
If your CPU dies or cracks AFTER a successful delid, it is AWESOME that intel will take it back!
But if you kill the chip while delidding, that is 100% your own fault!
This is fraud and is not tolerated on OCN! I got a worning + removal of post for suggesting less then that..
I wouldn't do it if I was you, and i'm fairly sure Intel will discover the self maid scratches to the PCB and charge you for the time spent finding the problem.

Take it like a man and buy a new one.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> thanks for the worning but i already bought a new one


Good man, get right back on that horse








You are gonna delid again? and what method this time ?









Best of luck no matter what method ^^


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> Yes, get an RMA from here: http://www.intel.com/p/en_US/support/contactsupport
> 
> They will ask you what you did to diagnose the CPU to determine it was faulty. You won't need an invoice.
> 
> Edit: Oh and if you broke your CPU from delidding, you shouldn't be sending it back to Intel. You toke the chance and it isn't their fault or a result from a manufacturing defect, etc. *If you can't afford to buy a new CPU then don't delid!*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I agree!
> If your CPU dies or cracks AFTER a successful delid, it is AWESOME that intel will take it back!
> But if you kill the chip while delidding, that is 100% your own fault!
> This is fraud and is not tolerated on OCN! I got a worning + removal of post for suggesting less then that..
> I wouldn't do it if I was you, and i'm fairly sure Intel will discover the self maid scratches to the PCB and charge you for the time spent finding the problem.
> 
> Take it like a man and buy a new one.


Did no one read my post about how i told Intel i De lidded and they said yeah no problem? If one tells the truth people will say yes more be a good person and karma will treat you right.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Good man, get right back on that horse
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are gonna delid again? and what method this time ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Best of luck no matter what method ^^


you can check my latest delid:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/22000_100#post_20813034


----------



## GaMbi2004

Isn't both of your quotes saying the same thing?








Just because you already said it, dosnt mean it will never have to me said again








We probably picked up our good attitude from you tho, hehe


----------



## inedenimadam

EK Naked Ivy mount installed w/GELID GC Extreme on die...47C max P95... 45x...1.096V

F'nA I like this!


----------



## highendpcgamer

Add me!!!

Overclock Name: Highendpcgamer
CPU: i7 4770k
on die-TIM:Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond
ihs-TIM:Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond
Mhz gained:200Mhz
OC after delid:4.7Ghz
Temp drops:10c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/0ji2n9

OCN name:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *highendpcgamer*
> 
> Add me!!!
> 
> Overclock Name: Highendpcgamer
> CPU: i7 4770k
> on die-TIM:Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond
> ihs-TIM:Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond
> Mhz gained:200Mhz
> OC after delid:4.7Ghz
> Temp drops:10c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/0ji2n9
> 
> OCN name:


You're in!







Slappa that sig on and welcome to the Crew!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa that sig on and welcome to the Crew!


you're starting to sound Italian:
"Slappa that sig oooon" hahaha


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> you're starting to sound Italian:
> "Slappa that sig oooon" hahaha


Oh no I better stop then


----------



## stickg1

Um did I just see 4.7GHz @ 1.9v?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Oh no I better stop then


but ma pizzaaaaa


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Um did I just see 4.7GHz @ 1.9v?


Holy crap.... sir tone that back omg..... we don't want another Franky


----------



## highendpcgamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Holy crap.... sir tone that back omg..... we don't want another Franky


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Um did I just see 4.7GHz @ 1.9v?


For some reason CPU-z displays my input voltage not Vcore which is 1.45v


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *highendpcgamer*
> 
> For some reason CPU-z displays my input voltage not Vcore which is 1.45v


okay thats better


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *highendpcgamer*
> 
> For some reason CPU-z displays my input voltage not Vcore which is 1.45v


I was gonna say... "and tomorrow it will take 1.9V just to boot at stock speeds..." but 1.45v is much more palatable.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *highendpcgamer*
> 
> For some reason CPU-z displays my input voltage not Vcore which is 1.45v


but your input in your BIOS is 1.9v!?


----------



## highendpcgamer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> but your input in your BIOS is 1.9v!?


Yes input voltage is set to 1.9v


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Holy crap.... sir tone that back omg..... we don't want another Franky


Franky was medium-well, 1.95 is well done.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> but your input in your BIOS is 1.9v!?


This is haswell, 1.9 is perfectly sane VR input voltage (VRIN, VCCIN) even 1.8 is stock


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ohhhh ok


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> This is haswell, 1.9 is perfectly sane VR input voltage (VRIN, VCCIN) even 1.8 is stock


sorry haven't taken much into haswii info yet my 4770K is coming soon for LN2 so i better start reading


----------



## xion

Delidded my I5 4670k and my friends 4670k, both using the razor blade method. Its by far the easiest. I tried the vice method but it really scared me, and the wood I was using was soft so the CPU would go inside the wood. Replaced the tim with arctic silver 5.

I highly suggest doing this. I'm at 4.4ghz 1.26 volts and its idles between 25 and 35, and gaming is mid 60s. Which is way better than my old I7 930. Do the razor blade method, trust me, its not that hard or bad.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sorry haven't taken much into haswii info yet my 4770K is coming soon for LN2 so i better start reading


Of course 1.9vcore is ridiculous but 1.9vrin is actually a bit low i'd think for past 1.4vcore even, i'm sure ln2 has different rules though


----------



## Livefreeordie89

Running 4.9 at 1.38 give or take








Used the vise method, VERY VERY EASY! RECOMMENDED!



Might I add using CL ultra TIM on Die with only a 212+ Heat sink
Same temps, but was able to jump from 4.6 at 1.25 to 4.9 at 1.38 without getting any hotter.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Livefreeordie89*
> 
> 
> 
> Running 4.9 at 1.38 give or take
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Used the vise method, VERY VERY EASY! RECOMMENDED!
> 
> 
> 
> Might I add using CL ultra TIM on Die with only a 212+ Heat sink
> Same temps, but was able to jump from 4.6 at 1.25 to 4.9 at 1.38 without getting any hotter.


No way those are your load temps on a 212! What is this magic you show us?


----------



## Livefreeordie89

It does get slightly hotter, maybe 72C or so with prime after a few hours, Ill run a 12 Hour test for you guys to prove it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Livefreeordie89*
> 
> 
> 
> Running 4.9 at 1.38 give or take
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Used the vise method, VERY VERY EASY! RECOMMENDED!
> 
> 
> 
> Might I add using CL ultra TIM on Die with only a 212+ Heat sink
> Same temps, but was able to jump from 4.6 at 1.25 to 4.9 at 1.38 without getting any hotter.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Livefreeordie89*
> 
> It does get slightly hotter, maybe 72C or so with prime after a few hours, Ill run a 12 Hour test for you guys to prove it.


Is the bottom of the 212 copper or aluminum?


----------



## Livefreeordie89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Is the bottom of the 212 copper or aluminum?


copper.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Livefreeordie89*
> 
> It does get slightly hotter, maybe 72C or so with prime after a few hours, Ill run a 12 Hour test for you guys to prove it.










sounds good! I like my water loop, but you are making me feel silly for throwing so much money at it.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sounds good! I like my water loop, but you are making me feel silly for throwing so much money at it.


Hehe.. you dont say!
Well, I came from 212 and my W/C gave me (if my memory dosnt play tricks on me) 20-30 degrees improvement over 212.
212 on haswel 4.7 1.38v 72C just sounds insane!
Is this a chip that somehow forgot how to generate heat?


----------



## miamiblazed

OCN name: miamiblazed
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.6GHz @ 1.28V
Temp drops: 18C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2900991
I didn't think of taking pictures before I delided, I know, silly mistake, but you can take my word for the temp drop, lol, I was getting near 78C on average (max was around 81-82)



Custom watercooling loop set up, 240mm rad with a VPP655 pump, if that helps.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *miamiblazed*
> 
> OCN name: miamiblazed
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.6GHz @ 1.28V
> Temp drops: 18C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/2900991
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think of taking pictures before I delided, I know, silly mistake, but you can take my word for the temp drop, lol, I was getting near 78C on average (max was around 81-82)
> 
> 
> 
> Custom watercooling loop set up, 240mm rad with a VPP655 pump, if that helps.


I added you to the spreadsheet, you can slap the sig on.









I guess I do this once in a while to contribute to the thread. Hahahah!


----------



## miamiblazed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I added you to the spreadsheet, you can slap the sig on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess I do this once in a while to contribute to the thread. Hahahah!


Tried to convince my friend to delid, I told them, there is nothing more satisfying then putting your 300$ CPU in a vice and whacking the thing with a piece of wood and hammer, lol, of course he didn't share my enthusiasm.

Thanks for adding me!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *miamiblazed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I added you to the spreadsheet, you can slap the sig on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess I do this once in a while to contribute to the thread. Hahahah!
> 
> 
> 
> Tried to convince my friend to delid, I told them, there is nothing more satisfying then putting your 300$ CPU in a vice and whacking the thing with a piece of wood and hammer, lol, of course he didn't share my enthusiasm.
> 
> Thanks for adding me!
Click to expand...

I can understand the fear with delidding. Especially to people who really can't afford to risk the chance of a $300 paperweight. Even I had a hard time justifying risking the death of my CPU and I didn't even pay for my CPU.







I guess it's a perk from still being young.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I can understand the fear with delidding. Especially to people who really can't afford to risk the chance of a $300 paperweight. Even I had a hard time justifying risking the death of my CPU and I didn't even pay for my CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess it's a perk from still being young.


This. Although when you're older you can still achieve the same thing via expense accounts - that is provided your workplace doesn't scrutinize your expenses too thoroughly. (Or more accurately doesn't know the difference between unlocked SKUs and normal ones.)


----------



## neofury

I also came from a 212 and things started to get really hot at 4.5ghz+, then I switch to the TC14PE and delidded, now I get lower temps than the 212+ @ 4.5ghz non delidded but at 5ghz on the TC14PE. I'm pretty sure the newest version of prime95 should end up 80c+ on a 212 even delidded at 4.9ghz, but I'm not really sure how much it varies between the 4770k and the 4670k in terms of temps.

Then again, my chip was always pretty awful pre-delidding compared with others. Custom water cooling is my next step, probably going to go all out on my next build.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I added you to the spreadsheet, you can slap the sig on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess I do this once in a while to contribute to the thread. Hahahah!


Ninja'd me again!


----------



## Livefreeordie89

Well only after 3 hours, been working a lot to start off the week.



And the proof



ambient about 55*F or 13*C

PS the Alienware desktop is a troll, I hate their overpriced Dells.


----------



## Cyro999

Hahaha 13c ambient

wish i could put up with that, gotta take regular hot water breaks when i dip to 15-17c


----------



## Livefreeordie89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hahaha 13c ambient
> 
> wish i could put up with that, gotta take regular hot water breaks when i dip to 15-17c


I am from NH, this is nothing.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

That picture is uploaded so small that I can't even make out anything.
And that's exactly why you shouldn't trust temperature readings without full proof.
13c ambient?
I'm more at 30c ambient lol


----------



## Livefreeordie89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> That picture is uploaded so small that I can't even make out anything.
> And that's exactly why you shouldn't trust temperature readings without full proof.
> 13c ambient?
> I'm more at 30c ambient lol


you live in a room thats 86*F?

Click to enlarge photo, wouldn't let me load large size.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Livefreeordie89*
> 
> you live in a room thats 86*F?
> 
> Click to enlarge photo, wouldn't let me load large size.


Well, at least my CPU temp is idle at 30c.
My room is always around 20-22c (room temp).

As for click to large size - did that, still didn't enlarge it.
Even opened in separate tab.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Livefreeordie89*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> That picture is uploaded so small that I can't even make out anything.
> And that's exactly why you shouldn't trust temperature readings without full proof.
> 13c ambient?
> I'm more at 30c ambient lol
> 
> 
> 
> you live in a room thats 86*F?
> 
> Click to enlarge photo, wouldn't let me load large size.
Click to expand...

58C delta over ambient @ 1.368...while its not quite as amazing as it was before I knew you were a full 15C lower ambient than I am, its still speaks volumes for the quality of that cooler, and of your chip. Congrats!

I too am like Totally Dubbed...my ambient is closer to 28-30C. AC ain't cheap and Georgia Summers are hot









13C is really freakin' cold...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yup that's super cold for comfort for me!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Yup that's super cold for comfort for me!


wait until i go LN2 in about a month my ambients from outside and 2 fans will be like -20C


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Well, at least my CPU temp is idle at 30c.
> My room is always around 20-22c (room temp).
> 
> As for click to large size - did that, still didn't enlarge it.
> Even opened in separate tab.


Once it's opened.. you should have a magnifier cursor over the picture... click it to get 100% enlargement... but if it helps here's a nice crop enlargement for ya with the critical bits.



tl:dr

Low ambient, 3hr prime = totally doable at those temps on air with that cooler... as to whether you 'respect' the result I couldn't help ya... people all have their own version of what's "stable enough" - and unless it's for competition I don't actually care. Maybe the OC nazis do, but not me.


----------



## ozzy1925

guys can we say 20C drop is good for i [email protected] load(4.7 1359v)?i used CLU on the die, back of the ihs and gelid extreme between ihs and the cooler.Should i re- apply clu?I was gettng 96C now getting 76C.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> guys can we say 20C drop is good for i [email protected] load(4.7 1359v)?i used CLU on the die, back of the ihs and gelid extreme between ihs and the cooler.Should i re- apply clu?I was gettng 96C now getting 76C.


Yes, 20C is good. You won't get much better than that, in all likelihood, so it's not worth trying again.


----------



## Livefreeordie89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 58C delta over ambient @ 1.368...while its not quite as amazing as it was before I knew you were a full 15C lower ambient than I am, its still speaks volumes for the quality of that cooler, and of your chip. Congrats!
> 
> I too am like Totally Dubbed...my ambient is closer to 28-30C. AC ain't cheap and Georgia Summers are hot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 13C is really freakin' cold...


its about 1.376v bounces back and forth to 1.368v. As for the delta I am happy with it for now, obviously the delta temp is the only way to compare apples to apples between regions.

Man all of you guys are little girls when it comes to winter







Just wait till its 15*F and snowing.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I think some perspective is well warranted when considering the advantages of delidding... when you think about everything else that enthusiasts tweak their systems with to get better cooling or performance... this right here is the equivalent of twin-turbos with a fat intercooler. Whether you wind up with as little as 10C better temps or as much as 25C... there is simply no other single performance improvement that does as much (at least for Ivy/Haswell). Although part of it is due to Intel cutting corners - when you consider the fact that even with the "crappy" stock clocks and volts that Ivy/Haswell runs at - they are very fast, reasonably cool chips... spending 5 minutes and a nominal amount of risk to achieve at least 200-300% better temperature improvements than all the lapping in the world would get you... is incredible.

Instead of getting overly concerned about getting the 'perfect mount' or which TIM is going to give you that extra 1% advantage... we can enjoy the fact that simply by delidding and using _almost anything_ in between the cooler and the IHS or the IHS and the die... a delidded CPU on inexpensive air setups... has temps similar to a non-delid in exotic custom loops... and for those of us with custom loops... it's like getting 50% of the headroom of DICE/LN2 with less than 1% of the headache!

No point really... just mostly "thinking out loud"...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Livefreeordie89*
> 
> its about 1.376v bounces back and forth to 1.368v. As for the delta I am happy with it for now, obviously the delta temp is the only way to compare apples to apples between regions.
> 
> Man all of you guys are little girls when it comes to winter
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just wait till its 15*F and snowing.


I could say the same about people like you when it's 119F here in July.


----------



## Livefreeordie89

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I could say the same about people like you when it's 119F here in July.


I agree on that, I enjoy hot days, but man thats near death.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Once it's opened.. you should have a magnifier cursor over the picture... click it to get 100% enlargement... but if it helps here's a nice crop enlargement for ya with the critical bits.
> 
> 
> 
> tl:dr
> 
> Low ambient, 3hr prime = totally doable at those temps on air with that cooler... as to whether you 'respect' the result I couldn't help ya... people all have their own version of what's "stable enough" - and unless it's for competition I don't actually care. Maybe the OC nazis do, but not me.


no what I meant by the temps is that some people complain of not reaching a certain temp with they coolers due to them seeing others online with lower temps. More often than not it's people living in colder places or having a lot more fans running. That's why I said one cannot trust what people say without evidence and people looking should be wary.


----------



## neofury

Either way, he's using an old version of prime that will have a 10c+ difference in some instances. When I moved from that version to 27.9 it was a massive difference in heat.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> Either way, he's using an old version of prime that will have a 10c+ difference in some instances. When I moved from that version to 27.9 it was a massive difference in heat.


Good catch! Just out of curiosity I downloaded the older version. I only ran it for the first two tests (30 mins), the voltage was lower by .016 with the older version, I cant speak for the temps because 30 minutes is hardly enough time to settle temperatures. But there is less heat implied with less voltage.

Edit to add a general question to the thread:

NAKED IVY PEOPLE and CLU users:

I switched from the GELID GC extreme to CLU and saw 0C drop...should I attempt to reapply? Or is CLU really not any better than the gelid stuff?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I cant speak for the temps because 30 minutes is hardly enough time to settle temperatures


If you have a good reading for CPU Package Power, i found it to be amazing for quick tells for how hot something will get


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Good catch! Just out of curiosity I downloaded the older version. I only ran it for the first two tests (30 mins), the voltage was lower by .016 with the older version, I cant speak for the temps because 30 minutes is hardly enough time to settle temperatures. But there is less heat implied with less voltage.
> 
> Edit to add a general question to the thread:
> 
> NAKED IVY PEOPLE and CLU users:
> 
> I switched from the GELID GC extreme to CLU and saw 0C drop...should I attempt to reapply? Or is CLU really not any better than the gelid stuff?


as i read clu is better too keep temperatures stable in long term.i mean your temps will be higher with gelid after 15-20days


----------



## neofury

Actually I'd say 30 minutes is the perfect amount of time in prime 95 to figure out your "very close to max temps" for a CPU. A lot of the time when I run it for 12 hours, some of the cores barely change since that first 20-30 minutes. However please don't confuse my comments for saying that it's stable if it goes 30 minutes, talking about heat only.

Like when I compare 20 minutes to 12 hours, usually each core bumps up by like 1-2c tops between 20 mins and 12 hours, sometimes not at all. I've done about 20 of these 12 hour prime runs, and at least for my chip, it seems like a theme.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> NAKED IVY PEOPLE and CLU users:
> 
> I switched from the GELID GC extreme to CLU and saw 0C drop...should I attempt to reapply? Or is CLU really not any better than the gelid stuff?


If you want to try different amounts of CLU, you can add to it without wiping the old one off. You only have to clean it if you want to try a lower amount than what you are currently using.


----------



## Janac

This is what i got from Intel when i said that my CPU is delidded....
Quote:


> "I wrote you earlier that I have checked your service ticket notes. You mentioned that a processor was damaged and then you glued back the IHS and tried to RMA the processor in Slovenia, but the place where you bought the processor from, declined to replace it because of physical damage. So the processor is physically damaged and cannot be replaced. The warranty doesn't cover damage to the Product due to external causes, including accident, problems with electrical power, abnormal electrical, mechanical or environmental conditions, usage not in accordance with product instructions, misuse, neglect, alteration, repair, improper installation, or improper testing.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Mother of god:


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mother of god:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I posted that many times? I swear I've only posted on rare occasions. Most of my communications with people on OCN now are on Skype or PM. I feel more special that way. Hahahaha!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mother of god:


Lol, I'm not even an official club member, hadn't realized how much I've posted in here...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> wait until i go LN2 in about a month my ambients from outside and 2 fans will be like -20C


Another month, still waiting on the pot?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

It's OK guy - you are always special to me - no ****.
Swag for his guides
FTW420 for his benches and advice


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mother of god:


dam i posted a lot bs here


----------



## Cyro999

Sad that i'm not on, guess i didn't post that much









I guess 200 is a looot of posts for one thread


----------



## Valgaur

1562 for me 0.0 I guess it makes sense as I am the owner and all


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Yes, 20C is good. You won't get much better than that, in all likelihood, so it's not worth trying again.


ok, also after delid i have 10c difference between core 2 and core 4.Do you think its related to my clu application?Although it was 13c difference between 2 cores before delid.


----------



## Forceman

Normally you'd expect to see the core temps closer after a delid - they won't match up, but usually it is less than 10C afterwards. So you could have a little bit of a thin (or thick) area in there, but if the overall temps are good I probably wouldn't mess with it. A 10C split by itself is nothing to worry about, even if it is a bit unusual.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Normally you'd expect to see the core temps closer after a delid - they won't match up, but usually it is less than 10C afterwards. So you could have a little bit of a thin (or thick) area in there, but if the overall temps are good I probably wouldn't mess with it. A 10C split by itself is nothing to worry about, even if it is a bit unusual.


...re core differentials, it took s.th. like three CL-U application tries + lapping the IHS to get this right (posted before re this deliided 3770K)...also note the idle temps...yet under load, there are always differences, especially with other factors such as iGPU running or not


----------



## inedenimadam

3570k
1.320V
50x
61C Max on load
This is my everyday overclock now that I am delidded, naked ivy, and underwater.

I hear so many conflicting stories about "safe voltage" that I don't even know what is real and what isn't. I hear everything from 1.350 to 1.550 as "good to go" underwater. I want more, I know I don't need more...but this IS overclock.net. Where is the point where I stop being an enthusiast and just become plain dumb for pumping that much voltage into a chip?


----------



## Cyro999

Belial ran 1.5v with max temp a touch off 90c for a few dozen 24h primes iirc, i doubt you'd even see degradation with 1.4v and those kinds of temps on ivy, in any short period of time at least. I mean 1.35v wouldn't scare me at all, it depends in the end if you're going to be at full load 24/7/365 for a couple years, or if you're an actual user who does stuff like web browsing, gaming, in which case if you're loaded for four hours a day consistently, the CPU will be idle 5/6'ths of the time with moderate load the other 1/6'th, it's not like priming all year


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 3570k
> 1.320V
> 50x
> 61C Max on load
> This is my everyday overclock now that I am delidded, naked ivy, and underwater.
> 
> I hear so many conflicting stories about "safe voltage" that I don't even know what is real and what isn't. I hear everything from 1.350 to 1.550 as "good to go" underwater. I want more, I know I don't need more...but this IS overclock.net. Where is the point where I stop being an enthusiast and just become plain dumb for pumping that much voltage into a chip?


5ghz @1.32v very nice chip there


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 5ghz @1.32v very nice chip there


Thanks! Would you push further or stop there?


----------



## iPDrop

push it!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Thanks! Would you push further or stop there?


if you can get 5.1ghz @ 1.4v or under i would do it







personally i wouldent run over 1.4v for 24/7 use. i could run 5.1 @ 1.45v but it's a lil high for me, i just run bench marks and stuff with over 1.4v


----------



## Loktar Ogar

OCN name: Loktar Ogar
CPU: Intel i5 3570K @ 4.5 1.265v (Manual), but i'm currently on offset.
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: n/a
OC after delid: n/a
Temp drops: 20c



Can i join? I do not have the pics on my delidded chip and i hope i can still join. I've sent a message to Swag about this and told me to post some Prime95 and RealTemp results and i run it for 20 mins. I've already glued back the IHS so i will never have to reapply the CLU but i made sure that i put a good amount to it.









I'm not sure why i have weird Core # 4 temperature with 11c difference from Core # 1? The weird temps was already there before i made the delid and hoping for the fix, my guess is probably due to Noctua NH-D14 base? Also, I'm planning for an AIO watercooler upgrade in the near future and will try 4.7 to 5.0 OC!









EDIT: Carefully delidded using Razor blade method.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Normally you'd expect to see the core temps closer after a delid - they won't match up, but usually it is less than 10C afterwards. So you could have a little bit of a thin (or thick) area in there, but if the overall temps are good I probably wouldn't mess with it. A 10C split by itself is nothing to worry about, even if it is a bit unusual.


It has been 10 days since i applied the clu will it be hard to remove it?Max core is 86c @4.7ghz 1.360v(4770k) and lowest is 76c tested with IBT.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> ...re core differentials, it took s.th. like three CL-U application tries + lapping the IHS to get this right (posted before re this deliided 3770K)...also note the idle temps...yet under load, there are always differences, especially with other factors such as iGPU running or not
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


i dont use igpu could it be because of that?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> It has been 10 days since i applied the clu will it be hard to remove it?Max core is 86c @4.7ghz 1.360v(4770k) and lowest is 76c tested with IBT.


No, it shouldn't be. I replaced mine after a month and it wiped right off.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> No, it shouldn't be. I replaced mine after a month and it wiped right off.


i checked many 4770k owners screenshots many of them having 8-9 difference between cores on higher speeds but i am still curious will it worth a try or not


----------



## Cyro999

Yea that stuff is killer, at 75c on a couple cores i've got one down at like 68 but if i push it hard, my temps are like 92, 95, 95, 84, seems more common now for fourth core to do that?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i checked many 4770k owners screenshots many of them having 8-9 difference between cores on higher speeds but i am still curious will it worth a try or not


After going direct die and remounting with CLU I managed to get the temp difference between cores to ~5C. But even on idle there is a slight temp difference. If you feel your overall temperatures are good, I wouldn't bother.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loktar Ogar*
> 
> OCN name: Loktar Ogar
> CPU: Intel i5 3570K @ 4.5 1.265v (Manual), but i'm currently on offset.
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: n/a
> OC after delid: n/a
> Temp drops: 20c
> 
> 
> 
> Can i join? I do not have the pics on my delidded chip and i hope i can still join. I've sent a message to Swag about this and told me to post some Prime95 and RealTemp results and i run it for 20 mins. I've already glued back the IHS so i will never have to reapply the CLU but i made sure that i put a good amount to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not sure why i have weird Core # 4 temperature with 11c difference from Core # 1? The weird temps was already there before i made the delid and hoping for the fix, my guess is probably due to Noctua NH-D14 base? Also, I'm planning for an AIO watercooler upgrade in the near future and will try 4.7 to 5.0 OC!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Carefully delidded using Razor blade method.


You're in!







nicely done I prefer the traditional razor method. Slappa dat Sig on and welcome to the Crew!


----------



## Loktar Ogar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nicely done I prefer the traditional razor method. Slappa dat Sig on and welcome to the Crew!


WOW! Thanks Val... Let me try to update my sig.. Hmmm. I'm new to this forum thing... lol


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> After going direct die and remounting with CLU I managed to get the temp difference between cores to ~5C. But even on idle there is a slight temp difference. If you feel your overall temperatures are good, I wouldn't bother.


i think the longer you run the test the temps will even out more over all the core's
and also with higher voltages and different test's temps may have more of a spread


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loktar Ogar*
> 
> WOW! Thanks Val... Let me try to update my sig.. Hmmm. I'm new to this forum thing... lol


go to page one then copy signature then go to your page and scroll down and paste it in!


----------



## grimmjow

OCN name: grimmjow
CPU: i5 4670k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Coolermaster E2
Mhz gained: 200
OC after delid: 4400 @ 1.28v
Temp drops: ~15
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/008kqh

Actually went to the store and bought a vice and a block of wood just so I can delid. It dropped my temps around 15 and it fixed the 10 degree difference between my cores. I am now running 1.28 volts at 4400mhz and 3500mhz ring. My cpu is a dog for sure! Temps max around 75 with these settings with a corsair h80. Could probably shoot for 4.5 but that will probably put me well into the 1.3v range

No pics from me either...was too much in a hurry to put it back together


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *grimmjow*
> 
> OCN name: grimmjow
> CPU: i5 4670k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Coolermaster E2
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4400 @ 1.28v
> Temp drops: ~15
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/008kqh
> 
> Actually went to the store and bought a vice and a block of wood just so I can delid. It dropped my temps around 15 and it fixed the 10 degree difference between my cores. I am now running 1.28 volts at 4400mhz and 3500mhz ring. My cpu is a dog for sure! Temps max around 75 with these settings with a corsair h80. Could probably shoot for 4.5 but that will probably put me well into the 1.3v range
> 
> No pics from me either...was too much in a hurry to put it back together


You're in!







Slappa dat Sig on! Welcome to the Crew!


----------



## Loktar Ogar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i think the longer you run the test the temps will even out more over all the core's
> and also with higher voltages and different test's temps may have more of a spread


My new i5 3570K OC inspiration and goal!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loktar Ogar*
> 
> My new i5 3570K OC inspiration and goal!


sadly over the past 9 months i had to slowly up vcore to get rid of game crashes from whea errors, currently running 1.398v-1.406v @5ghz .... not sure if it could be degradation or what ftw420 mentioned in another thread, that it could just be the ambient temps getting hotter and hotter ?

it is summer time now and it was cold back in january when i was testing for stability


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> sadly over the past 9 months i had to slowly up vcore to get rid of game crashes from whea errors, currently running 1.398v-1.406v @5ghz .... not sure if it could be degradation or what ftw420 mentioned in another thread, that it could just be the ambient temps getting hotter and hotter ?
> 
> it is summer time now and it was cold back in january when i was testing for stability


how are the core temps when you enable HT?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> how are the core temps when you enable HT?










HT ..... i dont have it just a i5 3570k.

im scared to get a i7 cause if it dont clock my i5 ill be sad


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HT ..... i dont have it just a i5 3570k.
> 
> im scared to get a i7 cause if it dont clock my i5 ill be sad


aww didnt know i5 doesnt have HT noob me


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HT ..... i dont have it just a i5 3570k.
> 
> im scared to get a i7 cause if it dont clock my i5 ill be sad


I hear ya man. I'm tempted to upgrade to 4770k but I worry about the same thing. If its a bum chip and 1.45v gives me like 4.5ghz I'll cry.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

My 3770k has ht on at all times and I'm running 1.27v at around 70c folding temps de-lidded


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

A note on core temps... it's also entirely possible that the thermisistor is faulty for a single core (or poorly calibrated at the very least). I've got that situation on one of mine (it reads faulty on lower temps - higher temps it's correct however).









Example:


Note the low temp on the third core... my ambient temps were around ~25C... so that's totally crap... however, the peak temps seem much more reasonable for a 24h prime run. Unless I've magically found the way to hit sub-ambient temps on water...


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Mine is and will always be around 8c cooler on one core.
Core 0/1 is always cooler lol


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Mine is and will always be around 8c cooler on one core.
> Core 0/1 is always cooler lol


Yeah under load all of the Ivy's I've got (delidded or not) run cooler on the first core.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Yeah under load all of the Ivy's I've got (delidded or not) run cooler on the first core.


nah non-delidded the temps were extremely similar.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Yeah under load all of the Ivy's I've got (delidded or not) run cooler on the first core.


That's how mine has been and is after delidding too, but I think it's an issue that can be resolved with lapping. Or maybe it's because I disabled iGPU?

No clue. But my 1st core is like 8c lower than the rest on load, and oddly on idle my 4th core is the lowest by 5-8c haha, it's quite odd.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Anyone got an i5 3570k for sale?
Delidded even better!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> A note on core temps... it's also entirely possible that the thermisistor is faulty for a single core (or poorly calibrated at the very least). I've got that situation on one of mine (it reads faulty on lower temps - higher temps it's correct however).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Example:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Note the low temp on the third core... my ambient temps were around ~25C... so that's totally crap... however, the peak temps seem much more reasonable for a 24h prime run. Unless I've magically found the way to hit sub-ambient temps on water...


I don't remember specifically where I read it, but I recall reading that the temperature sensors are designed to be most accurate at 105C, and that the accuracy diminishes the colder you get. My idle temps are wonky too. Sometimes I get readings of 20 or less across all core, and I know for a fact that its 24C here in Georgia.


----------



## Loktar Ogar

I have some update from my previous 4.5 OC. I have pushed my CPU to the limit up until 4.7 1.380V. Sadly i cannot go higher and don't want to risk it, for 4.8 i needed 1.5V for stable Prime95 for 30min and for 4.9 i'm pretty sure it will be more volts needed. I've tried 5.0 with 1.5V+ but it just loading until Windows desktop and restart loops. I'm happy for 200 Mhz gain but did not win the silicon lottery. lol









I'm not sure if its worth buying an AIO watercooler (H100i or similiar) since from this test i know now that i cannot go higher due to voltage limitation and i can only assume that the max temps will be lowered as much a 10c.


----------



## mercs213

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Anyone got an i5 3570k for sale?
> Delidded even better!


I did have one for sale on amazon last week. Sold within 12 hours of posting it. I would of even delidded it for you









Caught me to late!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> I did have one for sale on amazon last week. Sold within 12 hours of posting it. I would of even delidded it for you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Caught me to late!


dayme!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loktar Ogar*
> 
> I have some update from my previous 4.5 OC. I have pushed my CPU to the limit up until 4.7 1.380V. Sadly i cannot go higher and don't want to risk it, for 4.8 i needed 1.5V for stable Prime95 for 30min and for 4.9 i'm pretty sure it will be more volts needed. I've tried 5.0 with 1.5V+ but it just loading until Windows desktop and restart loops. I'm happy for 200 Mhz gain but did not win the silicon lottery. lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not sure if its worth buying an AIO watercooler (H100i or similiar) since from this test i know now that i cannot go higher due to voltage limitation and i can only assume that the max temps will be lowered as much a 10c.


updated!


----------



## Swag

Sigh, the ever increasing disparity between my download and upload speed.



Also, just wanted to vent my somewhat anger, I hate how I have to RMA both my 680s!

I'm getting ridiculous artifacts in FFXIV and I've narrowed it down to my GPUs. I tried both cards separately with 1 monitor too and both cards have it. This is on 314.22 driver too...


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sigh, the ever increasing disparity between my download and upload speed.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, just wanted to vent my somewhat anger, I hate how I have to RMA both my 680s!
> 
> I'm getting ridiculous artifacts in FFXIV and I've narrowed it down to my GPUs. I tried both cards separately with 1 monitor too and both cards have it. This is on 314.22 driver too...


That sucks about the 680s... and quite a bit less on the bandwidth... at least you have close to a 100mb/s downstream... better than most!









Although that is indeed pretty sad since I have 50% more upstream than you have... and less than 60% of the downstream.


----------



## battleaxe

Holy cow! 97Mbps?

That's insane.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sigh, the ever increasing disparity between my download and upload speed.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, just wanted to vent my somewhat anger, I hate how I have to RMA both my 680s!
> 
> I'm getting ridiculous artifacts in FFXIV and I've narrowed it down to my GPUs. I tried both cards separately with 1 monitor too and both cards have it. This is on 314.22 driver too...
> 
> 
> 
> That sucks about the 680s... and quite a bit less on the bandwidth... at least you have close to a 100mb/s downstream... better than most!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although that is indeed pretty sad since I have 50% more upstream than you have... and less than 60% of the downstream.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Holy cow! 97Mbps?
> 
> That's insane.


I'm super bummed about the 680s! Well, I guess it's time to do the buy and return thing for now. Gonna buy a 780 and use it then return it... I don't think I can last without a decent GPU with my FFXIV addiction.









For the speedtest, my normal download speed is around 125mb/s but there's been construction where I live (new community so new houses being built) and the internet suffers with it. The upload was 10mb/s and it lasted for around 4 months but my ISP started saying that 5mb/s is all it could manage now and it's within the contract. What a waste. I'm paying for a "business" internet too.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm super bummed about the 680s! Well, I guess it's time to do the buy and return thing for now. Gonna buy a 780 and use it then return it... I don't think I can last without a decent GPU with my FFXIV addiction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the speedtest, my normal download speed is around 125mb/s but there's been construction where I live (new community so new houses being built) and the internet suffers with it. The upload was 10mb/s and it lasted for around 4 months but my ISP started saying that 5mb/s is all it could manage now and it's within the contract. What a waste. _I'm paying for a "business" internet too._


So am I - and actually just ran a test and saw that my upstream is lower right now as well... although part of that is a backup streaming offsite at the moment... but that's never eaten up more than 700-900Kbps so it's still worse than the 7-8Mbps I used to get.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm super bummed about the 680s! Well, I guess it's time to do the buy and return thing for now. Gonna buy a 780 and use it then return it... I don't think I can last without a decent GPU with my FFXIV addiction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the speedtest, my normal download speed is around 125mb/s but there's been construction where I live (new community so new houses being built) and the internet suffers with it. The upload was 10mb/s and it lasted for around 4 months but my ISP started saying that 5mb/s is all it could manage now and it's within the contract. What a waste. _I'm paying for a "business" internet too._
> 
> 
> 
> So am I - and actually just ran a test and saw that my upstream is lower right now as well... although part of that is a backup streaming offsite at the moment... but that's never eaten up more than 700-900Kbps so it's still worse than the 7-8Mbps I used to get.
Click to expand...

Just wondering, how much are you paying for your service? And is it OFC?


----------



## battleaxe

I noticed all the companies have been bottle-necking their speeds to the minimum now. There must be new technology out that lets them limit it so they don't offer more bandwidth than they absolutely have to. It happened about 6 mos ago to the best of my knowledge.

Bummer about your 680's, that's really lame.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> I noticed all the companies have been bottle-necking their speeds to the minimum now. There must be new technology out that lets them limit it so they don't offer more bandwidth than they absolutely have to. It happened about 6 mos ago to the best of my knowledge.
> 
> Bummer about your 680's, that's really lame.


I'm guessing they did this so they could make you upgrade to the next tier. I've learned to just look at their "minimum" guaranteed speed when I shop for the internet. I hate it but it's what we get for allowing a single provider in my area to control 60% of the shares.







If only we had Japanese/Korean speeds, we'd be much better off and for a much cheaper price too. However, I don't think I can use their maximum download size. I download around 2TB of data a month, even the person handling my complaints was wondering what in the hell was happening in my house to use so much data.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just wondering, how much are you paying for your service? And is it OFC?


Not OFC - cable (although it's optical to the CO in the business park I believe). We pay $179/mo for it... so it's not like I can really complain... my frac-T3 at my old office was $600/mo and less than 6Mbps (although at least that was synchronous bandwidth). They have a higher tier that I could get... (150/15Mbps I think for something like $375/mo.) but I don't really need the extra at the moment - my client that connects to me is using a T1... so fully saturated they can't even tie up 15% of my upstream.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/2995614970

This is the best that I can get, wish I had those kinda speeds.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just wondering, how much are you paying for your service? And is it OFC?
> 
> 
> 
> Not OFC - cable (although it's optical to the CO in the business park I believe). We pay $179/mo for it... so it's not like I can really complain... my frac-T3 at my old office was $600/mo and less than 6Mbps (although at least that was synchronous bandwidth). They have a higher tier that I could get... (150/15Mbps I think for something like $375/mo.) but I don't really need the extra at the moment - my client that connects to me is using a T1... so fully saturated they can't even tie up 15% of my upstream.
Click to expand...

That dungeon run took longer than I expected.







$179/month seems reasonable. I'm paying $125 for my mine so it's a bit better. I hope they don't start increasing my costs because of what's happening with the government. Costs and all. Although, I wish they could start being nice to all their customers and increase our upload speed! Still, it's better than Incognito's!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/2995614970
> 
> This is the best that I can get, wish I had those kinda speeds.


How much are you paying for your internet?


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Just wondering, how much are you paying for your service? And is it OFC?
> 
> 
> 
> Not OFC - cable (although it's optical to the CO in the business park I believe). We pay $179/mo for it... so it's not like I can really complain... my frac-T3 at my old office was $600/mo and less than 6Mbps (although at least that was synchronous bandwidth). They have a higher tier that I could get... (150/15Mbps I think for something like $375/mo.) but I don't really need the extra at the moment - my client that connects to me is using a T1... so fully saturated they can't even tie up 15% of my upstream.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That dungeon run took longer than I expected.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> $179/month seems reasonable. I'm paying $125 for my mine so it's a bit better. I hope they don't start increasing my costs because of what's happening with the government. Costs and all. Although, I wish they could start being nice to all their customers and increase our upload speed! Still, it's better than Incognito's!
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/2995614970
> 
> This is the best that I can get, wish I had those kinda speeds.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> How much are you paying for your internet?
Click to expand...

Somewhere around $45


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/2995793000

I'll just leave this here....









I have seen my speeds at 100 100 before but lots of people are hitting it hard with consoles so upload is kinda shotty. We have fiber in one building and they get 800 down and 300 up lol









http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/2995800400


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sigh, the ever increasing disparity between my download and upload speed.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, just wanted to vent my somewhat anger, I hate how I have to RMA both my 680s!
> 
> I'm getting ridiculous artifacts in FFXIV and I've narrowed it down to my GPUs. I tried both cards separately with 1 monitor too and both cards have it. This is on 314.22 driver too...


I actually updated by driver on the 680s - I know you didn't like the newer ones but I got a BSOD on those drivers with my 680 whilst folding!
Updated it to the latest (released earlier this month) drivers and had 0 problems folding!

As for speeds - I got 38 down and 8 up


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/2995793000
> 
> I'll just leave this here....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen my speeds at 100 100 before but lots of people are hitting it hard with consoles so upload is kinda shotty. We have fiber in one building and they get 800 down and 300 up lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/2995800400


Oh Val, how much you want to rub it into my face. Nice speeds.... I wish I could have those speeds! Goddamn California!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sigh, the ever increasing disparity between my download and upload speed.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, just wanted to vent my somewhat anger, I hate how I have to RMA both my 680s!
> 
> I'm getting ridiculous artifacts in FFXIV and I've narrowed it down to my GPUs. I tried both cards separately with 1 monitor too and both cards have it. This is on 314.22 driver too...
> 
> 
> 
> I actually updated by driver on the 680s - I know you didn't like the newer ones but I got a BSOD on those drivers with my 680 whilst folding!
> Updated it to the latest (released earlier this month) drivers and had 0 problems folding!
> 
> As for speeds - I got 38 down and 8 up
Click to expand...

I already sent out my 680s.







It sucks but I really don't want to waste time until then.


----------



## lilchronic




----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Sigh, the ever increasing disparity between my download and upload speed.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, just wanted to vent my somewhat anger, I hate how I have to RMA both my 680s!
> 
> I'm getting ridiculous artifacts in FFXIV and I've narrowed it down to my GPUs. I tried both cards separately with 1 monitor too and both cards have it. This is on 314.22 driver too...


I'm not sure which driver is the newest one (at work) but the other day (I also have 2x EVGA GTX 680) I updated to the newest drivers. Suddenly StarCraft II started having major freezing issues, noticeable lag, etc. (Stock settings not OC'd)

I had to revert back to the previous driver and now all is well. Not sure what the deal is with the new driver but it messed my rig up pretty fierce.

PS, I have two of these lines:


----------



## iatacs19

Is anyone getting rid of their IHS completely and going straight to cpu-die with the heatsink or waterblock?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iatacs19*
> 
> Is anyone getting rid of their IHS completely and going straight to cpu-die with the heatsink or waterblock?


already there, there are a few others as well.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I'm not sure which driver is the newest one (at work) but the other day (I also have 2x EVGA GTX 680) I updated to the newest drivers. Suddenly StarCraft II started having major freezing issues, noticeable lag, etc. (Stock settings not OC'd)
> 
> I had to revert back to the previous driver and now all is well. Not sure what the deal is with the new driver but it messed my rig up pretty fierce.
> 
> PS, I have two of these lines:


You should try the beta drivers I ran some issues with the WHQL drivers on my 770's that were fixed on their beta.

On the internet convo, I switched out to a modem I bought my self and Im consistently getting higher speeds than with the leased modem. They cant fine tune your personal modem like they do the leased


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> already there, there are a few others as well.


I have gone direct die with the EK Precise mounting kit with CLU and I'm pretty much at ambient on idle.


----------



## battleaxe

Is there any way to unlock a modem? If so what models can be unlocked? The point being so we can get around this false bottleneck..


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Is there any way to unlock a modem? If so what models can be unlocked? The point being so we can get around this false bottleneck..


The only way I found around it was buying my own, before I was within their SLA for business 20Mbps/10Mbps once I switched thats when things boosted.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I'm not sure which driver is the newest one (at work) but the other day (I also have 2x EVGA GTX 680) I updated to the newest drivers. Suddenly StarCraft II started having major freezing issues, noticeable lag, etc. (Stock settings not OC'd)
> 
> I had to revert back to the previous driver and now all is well. Not sure what the deal is with the new driver but it messed my rig up pretty fierce.
> 
> PS, I have two of these lines:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should try the beta drivers I ran some issues with the WHQL drivers on my 770's that were fixed on their beta.
> 
> On the internet convo, I switched out to a modem I bought my self and Im consistently getting higher speeds than with the leased modem. They cant fine tune your personal modem like they do the leased
Click to expand...

Man that looks good, but it didn't work for me. When I initially used theirs, it was maxing out at around 60down/3up. With mine, it's going up to 125down/5up. I must say though, the speed isn't really 'noticeable' but whatever. My router and modem costs me hundreds each so I ain't about to just throw them into my closet.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> The only way I found around it was buying my own, before I was within their SLA for business 20Mbps/10Mbps once I switched thats when things boosted.


What kind of boost are you talking about?


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Man that looks good, but it didn't work for me. When I initially used theirs, it was maxing out at around 60down/3up. With mine, it's going up to 125down/5up. I must say though, the speed isn't really 'noticeable' but whatever. My router and modem costs me hundreds each so I ain't about to just throw them into my closet.


Wow. That's about double. You probably don't notice cause that's already blazing fast at 60. But if you had 5, then going to 10 is a pretty big deal.


----------



## Swag

I wanted to ask you guys, someone told me not to sell my 680s and upgrade so I thought of a different option. How about get another 680 on top of mine. That's what I decided.

EVGA has this thing called "B-Stock" and AFAIK, it's refurbished or returns that actually had no problems when it was received. Most returns were because they couldn't overclock as well. Now, there's a 680 Classified available there for $450, my question is: should I get that for $450 or get their 680 FTW LE for $500. So the Classified is a 4GB card vs the LE which is only 2GB, but is the Classified worth the 'risk'?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Man that looks good, but it didn't work for me. When I initially used theirs, it was maxing out at around 60down/3up. With mine, it's going up to 125down/5up. I must say though, the speed isn't really 'noticeable' but whatever. My router and modem costs me hundreds each so I ain't about to just throw them into my closet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow. That's about double. You probably don't notice cause that's already blazing fast at 60. But if you had 5, then going to 10 is a pretty big deal.
Click to expand...

Yea, the higher things get; the smaller the impact as you increase.







Still, an increase is still an increase no matter how small.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Suddenly StarCraft II started having major freezing issues, noticeable lag, etc


You talking about this?  or something else?

If game time pauses slightly, it's network side. You can tell pauses caused by the game waiting for other people by all of your frametimes suddenly being consistent (when the game is otherwise terrible with them) and it maybe does that for network side pauses too, but not sure



But i'm struggling with a completely different issue..



Maybe 314 drivers work

The guy that single handedly coded sc2 engine needed to be fired a long time ago


----------



## battleaxe

You guys that bought your own modems and saw a substantial increase;

What modem did you buy?

I want to pick one up and see if it increases my down/up speed.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wanted to ask you guys, someone told me not to sell my 680s and upgrade so I thought of a different option. How about get another 680 on top of mine. That's what I decided.
> 
> EVGA has this thing called "B-Stock" and AFAIK, it's refurbished or returns that actually had no problems when it was received. Most returns were because they couldn't overclock as well. Now, there's a 680 Classified available there for $450, my question is: should I get that for $450 or get their 680 FTW LE for $500. So the Classified is a 4GB card vs the LE which is only 2GB, but is the Classified worth the 'risk'?
> Yea, the higher things get; the smaller the impact as you increase.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still, an increase is still an increase no matter how small.


why even go for the le? one you wont OC it if you have freakign 3 680's as the OC ability over multiple cards gets tough from the different cards and such for good stability so just get the cheaper one and do that. FTW LE is just a sticker on a better binned card.... all they are.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> You guys that bought your own modems and saw a substantial increase;
> 
> What modem did you buy?
> 
> I want to pick one up and see if it increases my down/up speed.


Just get a new one doesn't matter really i just got one from netgear works fine. sometimes it's not just the router call your provider ask them what you are payign for and show them your speeds and they can redo the wiring for free. I did that this summer was only getting 2 down and .1 up so i yelled a lot and swore a bit and then they fixed it giving me my payign rate of 6 down and 5 up


----------



## Arm3nian

should be higher since its on a 10gig connection but have to test it through ssh since no GUI so it kinda sucks lol

I have 150down 20up on my home, can't really post a pic because i'm on wireless with the worst router in existence because I have no desktop currently yay!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I wanted to ask you guys, someone told me not to sell my 680s and upgrade so I thought of a different option. How about get another 680 on top of mine. That's what I decided.
> 
> EVGA has this thing called "B-Stock" and AFAIK, it's refurbished or returns that actually had no problems when it was received. Most returns were because they couldn't overclock as well. Now, there's a 680 Classified available there for $450, my question is: should I get that for $450 or get their 680 FTW LE for $500. So the Classified is a 4GB card vs the LE which is only 2GB, but is the Classified worth the 'risk'?
> Yea, the higher things get; the smaller the impact as you increase.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still, an increase is still an increase no matter how small.
> 
> 
> 
> why even go for the le? one you wont OC it if you have freakign 3 680's as the OC ability over multiple cards gets tough from the different cards and such for good stability so just get the cheaper one and do that. FTW LE is just a sticker on a better binned card.... all they are.
Click to expand...

Yea, I guess so. I don't want to overclock my GPU anymore mainly for the reason that I don't want any chance of getting artifacts hence the reason why I need another card!







Haha, well I guess I'll order the Classified then. Not bad at that price to me.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> 
> should be higher since its on a 10gig connection but have to test it through ssh since no GUI so it kinda sucks lol
> 
> I have 150down 20up on my home, can't really post a pic because i'm on wireless with the worst router in existence because I have no desktop currently yay!


Wireless sucks.


----------



## JSTe

Here's one just for the hell of it.

Ivy Pentium G2030



Idle and load temps both down 5°C


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JSTe*
> 
> Here's one just for the hell of it.
> 
> Ivy Pentium G2030
> 
> 
> 
> Idle and load temps both down 5°C


The vice is the way to go.

Delidding is one of those things that we are initially afraid to do... but once done, it must be done again and again.


----------



## Mogwaii

Bought myself a i7 3770k and replaced my i5 3570k











http://valid.canardpc.com/kz3xjz

Didnt even bother to try it out. i went out deliding it with vice method. Smoth and nice.
CLU with naked mount kit.


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You talking about this?  or something else?
> 
> If game time pauses slightly, it's network side. You can tell pauses caused by the game waiting for other people by all of your frametimes suddenly being consistent (when the game is otherwise terrible with them) and it maybe does that for network side pauses too, but not sure
> 
> 
> 
> But i'm struggling with a completely different issue..
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe 314 drivers work
> 
> The guy that single handedly coded sc2 engine needed to be fired a long time ago


No, I have a beast wireless AC setup with very stable internet. The actual game froze (no artifacts tho) and needed to be restarted. As soon as I went back to the beta driver pre-this release, it was fine.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Bought myself a i7 3770k and replaced my i5 3570k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/kz3xjz
> 
> Didnt even bother to try it out. i went out deliding it with vice method. Smoth and nice.
> CLU with naked mount kit.


What did u do with your i5?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> Bought myself a i7 3770k and replaced my i5 3570k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> IMG]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1679087/[/IMG]
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/kz3xjz
> 
> Didnt even bother to try it out. i went out deliding it with vice method. Smoth and nice.
> CLU with naked mount kit.


lucky you, 5ghz i7 @1.39v


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> What did u do with your i5?


Its right beside me . It does 4,6ghz @ 1.294vcore.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> No, I have a beast wireless AC setup with very stable internet. The actual game froze (no artifacts tho) and needed to be restarted. As soon as I went back to the beta driver pre-this release, it was fine.


Oh hard lock. I didn't see any of that. Interesting and thanks for warning!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> lucky you, 5ghz i7 @1.39v


Lucky is 5ghz on 1.28v, though 5ghz 1.4v chips are extremely beautiful and >







worthy! <3


----------



## ozzy1925

look what i got today from intel


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> look what i got today from intel


HAPPY DAYS!


----------



## ozzy1925

if i decide to buy ek water block with naked ivy kit,the cpu block should be copper? Clu can not be used on aluminium right?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> if i decide to buy ek water block with naked ivy kit,the cpu block should be copper? Clu can not be used on aluminium right?


Correct, it will eat the aluminium. However copper should be fine.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Correct, it will eat the aluminium. However copper should be fine.


we cant use this right? http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/EK-Supremacy-Elite-CSQ-CPU-Waterblock-for-Intel-1156-1155-1150--Full-Nickel-pid-16746.html
best option will be this?http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/EK-Supremacy-CSQ-Universal-CPU-Waterblock--Full-Copper-pid-16442.html


----------



## Pimphare

Hi all! I haven't delidded yet, but have plans to with my I5-3570k. Can I be added before I delid? Good stuff right here!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pimphare*
> 
> Hi all! I haven't delidded yet, but have plans to with my I5-3570k. Can I be added before I delid? Good stuff right here!


I prefer to keep it to after a delid as the results can be added at the same time.


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I prefer to keep it to after a delid as the results can be added at the same time.


Fair enough. I'm waiting until I get all of my water cooling parts beforehand.


----------



## Osco

Holy crap, I did it! I don't know if I have ever felt so apprehensive as I did before hitting that 2x4 with a mallet!!
Haven't had time to test anything yet, so hopefully I didn't break it. lol...


What are you guys using to clean the adhesive off with? Mine does not want to come off with the credit card method. I seriously think I need a chisel!!


----------



## wermad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Holy crap, I did it! I don't know if I have ever felt so apprehensive as I did before hitting that 2x4 with a mallet!!
> Haven't had time to test anything yet, so hopefully I didn't break it. lol...
> 
> 
> What are you guys using to clean the adhesive off with? Mine does not want to come off with the credit card method. I seriously think I need a chisel!!


credit card. I was recommended AS 1&2 cleaning solution after using the credit card to remove the majority of the crud.


----------



## Arm3nian

I wonder if you can bake the cpu to soften up the glue. Hmmmm anyone give this a try?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Holy crap, I did it! I don't know if I have ever felt so apprehensive as I did before hitting that 2x4 with a mallet!!
> Haven't had time to test anything yet, so hopefully I didn't break it. lol...
> 
> 
> What are you guys using to clean the adhesive off with? Mine does not want to come off with the credit card method. I seriously think I need a chisel!!


Did you clamp the CPU and hit the IHS with the wooden block? Thought it was standard to clamp the ridge on the IHS and hit the CPU


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Did you clamp the CPU and hit the IHS with the wooden block? Thought it was standard to clamp the ridge on the IHS and hit the CPU


I clamped my IHS and hit the cpu , felt safer


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> credit card. I was recommended AS 1&2 cleaning solution after using the credit card to remove the majority of the crud.


I'll have to try some of that stuff. I did get most of it off with the card, but there is a residue that just won't come up and I don't want to scrape too hard with the card and mess up the cpu.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> I wonder if you can bake the cpu to soften up the glue. Hmmmm anyone give this a try?


I used a heat gun to soften up the adhesive before hitting the IHS. But it gets really hot fast, so I couldn't keep it on there long. Not sure I want to risk that again with the exposed cpu....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> I clamped my IHS and hit the cpu , felt safer


For some reason I felt safer clamping the cpu and hitting the IHS! I think I was too worried about smashing the cpu.

Thanks all for the help/advice!


----------



## Zoroastrian

did you put the lid back on ?


----------



## Osco

Not yet. Still waiting on my CLU to get here.


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> I used a heat gun to soften up the adhesive before hitting the IHS. But it gets really hot fast, so I couldn't keep it on there long. Not sure I want to risk that again with the exposed cpu....


At first I looked at the IHS and thought might as well use oxy-acetylene, but then remembered there is also glue on the cpu itself.









Heatgun is still too hot for it, only heat I would risk is maybe a 100 degree oven, that shouldn't have an effect on anything besides the glue I think. This is only if no other method works for removing the glue of course. When I delidded, I just left the glue on the cpu, still got amazing temps with CLP (still don't recommend CLP to anyone), not sure if the same would occur with other pastes. I did spend 3 days sanding waterblock and heatsink surfaces by hand


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I had gobs of glue on one of mine - but it came off with a credit card... just do it while watching TV or listening to some music and be patient. Took me nearly 30 minutes of working it with CC for me to get 90% of the glue off but it eventually came off. The problem with using something harder/sharper is you will then run the risk of scratching either the PCB (dangerous) or the IHS (not dangerous, naturally). With the CC or a pointed plastic spudger (electrical/beauty/art supply stores will all have these) and you can apply as much pressure as you want without scratching anything important.


----------



## blackhole2013

If i get my chip professionally delided where its put back together like you never knew it was done and I have intels Oc warranty do you think they would replace my chip if it dies


----------



## Totally Dubbed

They would. But discussing these things on here is against the rules


----------



## alancsalt

Valgaur says you can tell them the truth and as long as the writing on your IHS is intact it is all AOK.

No need for shenanigans.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *butthole2013*
> 
> If i get my chip professionally delided where its put back together like you never knew it was done and I have intels Oc warranty do you think they would replace my chip if it dies


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Valgaur says you can tell them the truth and as long as the writing on your IHS is intact it is all AOK.
> 
> No need for shenanigans.


^ this.

Seriously. When you go to a company and tell them everything was fine and you simply improved their product by better cooling they understand. and I believe I still ahve the transcript of my interaction with Intels Rep telling him about 5 times that i delidded it even so much as getting approval to help the 2 fellow with the broken dies but sadly the IHS's of theirs were sanded down makign the warranty on the chips non existent as Intel only need the numbers (all of them) on the IHS and the number ont he black part of the PCB to fill a claim.

The Truth is better than being shady and trying to cheat the system.









Let me know if you'd like my transcript to read


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Valgaur says you can tell them the truth and as long as the writing on your IHS is intact it is all AOK.
> 
> No need for shenanigans.


This. They (as well they should) cover their warranty exactly as they stated it:
Quote:


> EXTENT OF LIMITED WARRANTY
> Intel does not warrant that the Product will be free from design defects or errors known as "errata." Current characterized errata are available upon request. Further, this Limited Warranty does NOT cover:
> • any costs associated with the repair or replacement of the Product including labor, installation or other costs incurred by you, and in particular, any costs relating to the removal or replacement of any Product that is soldered or otherwise permanently affixed to any printed circuit board; OR
> • damage to the Product due to external causes, including accident, problems with electrical power, abnormal electrical, mechanical or environmental conditions, usage not in accordance with product instructions, misuse, neglect, alteration, repair, improper installation, or improper testing; OR
> • any Product which has been modified or operated outside of Intel's publicly available specifications or where the original identification markings (trademark or serial number) has been removed, altered or obliterated from the Product.


Therefore - as long as the damage does not occur as a result of the delidding itself (i.e. you scratched the PCB during delidding with a blade or cracked it using a vise) and the damage is not otherwise excluded (i.e. electrical system short, etc.) then it should be covered. I would think their take on this is similar to other consumer goods as related to the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act. Essentially, that just says that a warranty provider cannot void that warranty just because you didn't use it _exactly_ as expected - provided that you didn't directly and/or intentionally damage the product through misuse. If it weren't for that - a company like Intel could refuse to support a warranty simply because you used an aftermarket CPU cooler - or because you used it on a non-Intel motherboard.

It's rare, but occasionally the government actually works to the advantage of the populace.









So the tl;dr is - if the delidding process kills the chip... you're out a chip... if it doesn't and the chip is bad for another reason not excluded by the warranty... it's a valid return.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> we cant use this right? http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/EK-Supremacy-Elite-CSQ-CPU-Waterblock-for-Intel-1156-1155-1150--Full-Nickel-pid-16746.html
> best option will be this?http://specialtech.co.uk/spshop/customer/EK-Supremacy-CSQ-Universal-CPU-Waterblock--Full-Copper-pid-16442.html


You can use either one, the heat spreader on the IHS is nickel plated copper so it should work as well as it does with copper. I guess the only difference is personal preference. According to the manufacturer the application on copper is a bit easier than on nickel, Ive used it on both and I can attest that it spreads a lot easier on copper.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> You can use either one, the heat spreader on the IHS is nickel plated copper so it should work as well as it does with copper. I guess the only difference is personal preference. According to the manufacturer the application on copper is a bit easier than on nickel, Ive used it on both and I can attest that it spreads a lot easier on copper.


hmm, i thought the nickel one is aluminium in real so its safe to use with clu, but you suggest to get the copper one which is alot cheaper than the nickel and gives better performance am i right?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> hmm, i thought the nickel one is aluminium in real so its safe to use with clu, but you suggest to get the copper one which is alot cheaper than the nickel and gives better performance am i right?


I went with the full copper on my rig because it was cheaper and the performance was the same.
I have it mounted with the precise kit for direct die install without any issues. I even re-mounted a number of times to ensure that I got a good mount without the CLU damaging the block or the CPU.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> You can use either one, the heat spreader on the IHS is nickel plated copper so it should work as well as it does with copper. I guess the only difference is personal preference. According to the manufacturer the application on copper is a bit easier than on nickel, Ive used it on both and I can attest that it spreads a lot easier on copper.
> 
> 
> 
> hmm, i thought the nickel one is aluminium in real so its safe to use with clu, but you suggest to get the copper one which is alot cheaper than the nickel and gives better performance am i right?
Click to expand...

Perhaps nickel is even better than copper?

I've only seen CLU touch nickel and it was always fine. I used it with two different air coolers with nickel finish (and copper base underneath the nickel). The IHS is also copper with nickel finish.

If your waterblock is 100% nickel, no aluminium underneath the nickel, I would assume it's safe.


----------



## battleaxe

I have a h80i, but I've noticed that it cannot clamp down far enough without the IHS in place. So right now I"m using the IHS with Phobya HE Grease and it has worked really well. My temps are no worse than my Sandy Bridge CPU, both are clocked to 4.7Ghz and about the same voltage.

What kind of gains will I see from totally removing the IHS and how do I do it with the h80i since it won't clamp down far enough without the extra thickness of the IHS?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> I have a h80i, but I've noticed that it cannot clamp down far enough without the IHS in place. So right now I"m using the IHS with Phobya HE Grease and it has worked really well. My temps are no worse than my Sandy Bridge CPU, both are clocked to 4.7Ghz and about the same voltage.
> 
> What kind of gains will I see from totally removing the IHS and how do I do it with the h80i since it won't clamp down far enough without the extra thickness of the IHS?


You will have to remove the bracket that holds the ihs down. Then carefully tighten your h80 onto the bare die this will take lots of time and care. Is called direct die


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Perhaps nickel is even better than copper?
> 
> I've only seen CLU touch nickel and it was always fine. I used it with two different air coolers with nickel finish (and copper base underneath the nickel). The IHS is also copper with nickel finish.
> 
> If your water-block is 100% nickel, no aluminium underneath the nickel, I would assume it's safe.


In my opinion i prefer the copper because it is easier to get the correct application and spread evenly. To spread on nickel is a little easier. I did not notice any performance difference on temperatures when I tried Nickel vs copper. In the end Im using an EK Supremacy copper block with the acrylic top to show the coolant flow. Honestly I saw more of a delta in temperatures when switching coolants than switching between full metal blocks to a plexi top block.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> I have a h80i, but I've noticed that it cannot clamp down far enough without the IHS in place. So right now I"m using the IHS with Phobya HE Grease and it has worked really well. My temps are no worse than my Sandy Bridge CPU, both are clocked to 4.7Ghz and about the same voltage.
> 
> What kind of gains will I see from totally removing the IHS and how do I do it with the h80i since it won't clamp down far enough without the extra thickness of the IHS?


You will have to get creative with the mounting for direct die, i think there are a few that have done conversions in this thread...or you could do like defiler2k and I, and purchase the naked ivy kit with a supremacy block. once you take the lid off, you will be relying on the pressure from your cooler to keep the mobo pins pressed into the chip...and that is a fair amount of pressure.

I ordered the naked ivy at the same time i ordered the block, so i cant dont have a temp drop number to give you. What i can tell you is that at 4.5ghz i dont see 50C under prime, and i dont see 40C while gaming. Naked is the way to go as far as i can tell.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> I have a h80i, but I've noticed that it cannot clamp down far enough without the IHS in place. So right now I"m using the IHS with Phobya HE Grease and it has worked really well. My temps are no worse than my Sandy Bridge CPU, both are clocked to 4.7Ghz and about the same voltage.
> 
> What kind of gains will I see from totally removing the IHS and how do I do it with the h80i since it won't clamp down far enough without the extra thickness of the IHS?


Removing the IHS will yield better temperatures depending on your install. Right now Im at a delta of 1-3 degrees over ambient on idle with direct die and Mayhem coolant, with just straight distilled I would be flat at idle. With the IHS I was at 3~5 over ambient while idle on water and 5-10 with mayhem. It takes time and patience, to get your mounting right and to a level you are comfortable. I reseated and reapplied paste for each application at least 5 times each and settled on the mount that yielded less of a delta between cores.

If you remove the CPU retention bracket from your motherboard you should be able to go direct die if your blocks mounting mechanism allows it.


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> At first I looked at the IHS and thought might as well use oxy-acetylene, but then remembered there is also glue on the cpu itself.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heatgun is still too hot for it, only heat I would risk is maybe a 100 degree oven, that shouldn't have an effect on anything besides the glue I think. This is only if no other method works for removing the glue of course. When I delidded, I just left the glue on the cpu, still got amazing temps with CLP (still don't recommend CLP to anyone), not sure if the same would occur with other pastes. I did spend 3 days sanding waterblock and heatsink surfaces by hand


3 days? Wow!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I had gobs of glue on one of mine - but it came off with a credit card... just do it while watching TV or listening to some music and be patient. Took me nearly 30 minutes of working it with CC for me to get 90% of the glue off but it eventually came off. The problem with using something harder/sharper is you will then run the risk of scratching either the PCB (dangerous) or the IHS (not dangerous, naturally). With the CC or a pointed plastic spudger (electrical/beauty/art supply stores will all have these) and you can apply as much pressure as you want without scratching anything important.


I finally got most of the adhesive off, just have the residual that almost looks like a "stain" on the cpu board. Would this spudger work for future projects? http://www.ifixit.com/Tools/Spudger/IF145-002
The IHS looks stained from the TIM also. Whatever it is, it won't come off with 91% isopropyl alcohol at least.
However, I did notice something that I am hoping isn't bad. A small nick out of he edge of the cpu board. Should I be concerned? Am I screwed?!
Bad picture, I know. I will get a better one when I get home.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You will have to get creative with the mounting for direct die, i think there are a few that have done conversions in this thread...or you could do like defiler2k and I, and purchase the naked ivy kit with a supremacy block. once you take the lid off, you will be relying on the pressure from your cooler to keep the mobo pins pressed into the chip...and that is a fair amount of pressure.
> 
> I ordered the naked ivy at the same time i ordered the block, so i cant dont have a temp drop number to give you. What i can tell you is that at 4.5ghz i dont see 50C under prime, and i dont see 40C while gaming. Naked is the way to go as far as i can tell.


Right now Im stress testing Haswell at 4.8 with the intel stress test and my temperatures hold at 55C with my current session that has been on for the past 48 hours, before direct die 4.7 was flakey at best (would pass on a fresh boot but if the system had been running for a day no way) and 4.8 was just not an option (no boot), before delid I was stuck at 4.6 hitting the 70's on prime.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Removing the IHS will yield better temperatures depending on your install. Right now Im at a delta of 1-3 degrees over ambient on idle with direct die and Mayhem coolant, with just straight distilled I would be flat at idle. With the IHS I was at 3~5 over ambient while idle on water and 5-10 with mayhem. It takes time and patience, to get your mounting right and to a level you are comfortable. I reseated and reapplied paste for each application at least 5 times each and settled on the mount that yielded less of a delta between cores.
> 
> If you remove the CPU retention bracket from your motherboard you should be able to go direct die if your blocks mounting mechanism allows it.


may i know :whats your cpu voltage, cpu mhz ,ram speed max temp under IBT?i see 86c with h110 @4.7 1.36v ram speed 2400mhz


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *butthole2013*
> 
> If i get my chip professionally delided where its put back together like you never knew it was done and I have intels Oc warranty do you think they would replace my chip if it dies


Yes, been there, done that.
Though I just resealed it myself.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> In my opinion i prefer the copper because it is easier to get the correct application and spread evenly. To spread on nickel is a little easier. I did not notice any performance difference on temperatures when I tried Nickel vs copper. In the end Im using an EK Supremacy copper block with the acrylic top to show the coolant flow. Honestly I saw more of a delta in temperatures when switching coolants than switching between full metal blocks to a plexi top block.


I didn't mean temperatures (I guess copper should theoretically be better for that). I meant regarding that worrying about CLU reacting with things, staining metals and possibly hardening and fusing everything together.


----------



## blackhole2013

My 4670K can do 4.9 core at 1.38v and 4.6 NB I got the intel OC warranty so I guess no delid for me this chip can do 5.0 1.44v but it needs to be delidded..


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> 3 days? Wow!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I finally got most of the adhesive off, just have the residual that almost looks like a "stain" on the cpu board. Would this spudger work for future projects? http://www.ifixit.com/Tools/Spudger/IF145-002
> The IHS looks stained from the TIM also. Whatever it is, it won't come off with 91% isopropyl alcohol at least.
> However, I did notice something that I am hoping isn't bad. A small nick out of he edge of the cpu board. Should I be concerned? Am I screwed?!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bad picture, I know. I will get a better one when I get home.


Yes that is bad... the picture I mean. As far as the PCB is concerned - it will probably work just fine, but you will probably (read extremely likely) not be able to RMA the chip if anything is wrong. I had a small nick in one of my 3770K's and I was really worried... but it works perfectly, so no harm no foul. Basically the concern is if it's deep enough to hit any traces... if it is you are indeed screwed - if it's just the very outside edge of the PCB where there aren't any pins/traces - then it should be fine. I can't tell from the picture other than the fact that there's some small damage to the PCB - as to how bad it is - the other side will tell a more meaningful story. But you really won't know until you're running it whether something was damaged or not for sure.


----------



## Osco

lol, yes I am very ashamed of the picture quality! The nick is just on the top outer edge and doesn't go all the way through. Definitely no pins damaged and hopefully no traces. I need to get one of those mounted magnifying lamps to be able to see anything on these friggin things!


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> may i know :whats your cpu voltage, cpu mhz ,ram speed max temp under IBT?i see 86c with h110 @4.7 1.36v ram speed 2400mhz


Right now I am at 1.345 with a .005 offset, 4.8GHz on core and 4.4GHz uncore, running ram @2000mhz with 1.65v while I settle on my OC but I can run it at 2400 (corsair dominator platinums). Max temp under a max load of IBT is 66, Stress Test in the Extreme Tuning utility I get 55. My proffered testing method is the Tuning Utility.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Just skimmed the last few pages (sadly I dont got much screen time the last few weeks) and noticed pics that looked like they are clamping down the PCB and hitting the IHS?
This is not a good idea! the force of the hit is transfered almost equally to the PCB and IHS (no matter witch one you clamp down) but the PCB can bend, and IHS can not! (at least not as much) and therefore you will bring more stress to the PCB when trying to knock the IHS off the PCB rather than the other way around.

Also you have almost dubble the surface (not mentioning 10 times the structural integrity ) by clamping the IHS vs PCB.
Be careful out there! Rather not read about more broken chips ^^


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Right now I am at 1.345 with a .005 offset, 4.8GHz on core and 4.4GHz uncore, running ram @2000mhz with 1.65v while I settle on my OC but I can run it at 2400 (corsair dominator platinums). Max temp under a max load of IBT is 66, Stress Test in the Extreme Tuning utility I get 55. My proffered testing method is the Tuning Utility.


wow 20c cooler than mine as i see your signature you have a great custom cooling stuff


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> wow 20c cooler than mine as i see your signature you have a great custom cooling stuff


Don't forget the room his PC is in might be a lot colder than where you are.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> wow 20c cooler than mine as i see your signature you have a great custom cooling stuff


Yes I have a serious investment in cooling components, plus a total of 22 fans (16 for push pull on both 480 rads). I will be replacing the XSPC rads with EK rads, I'm keeping my fingers crossed that they at least perform as well as the XSPC ones.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Don't forget the room his PC is in might be a lot colder than where you are.


That is key too, my ambient right now is between 23~24 but it goes all the way down to 19 at times.


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Yes that is bad... the picture I mean. As far as the PCB is concerned - it will probably work just fine, but you will probably (read extremely likely) not be able to RMA the chip if anything is wrong. I had a small nick in one of my 3770K's and I was really worried... but it works perfectly, so no harm no foul. Basically the concern is if it's deep enough to hit any traces... if it is you are indeed screwed - if it's just the very outside edge of the PCB where there aren't any pins/traces - then it should be fine. I can't tell from the picture other than the fact that there's some small damage to the PCB - as to how bad it is - the other side will tell a more meaningful story. But you really won't know until you're running it whether something was damaged or not for sure.


Here is the location of the nick on the cpu board.


Here is a macro close-up of the nick on the cpu board. Am I SOL as far as it working?


----------



## inedenimadam

ouch








only way to find out is to fire it up


----------



## Cyro999

Ouch









I'd personally be super careful with delid (though you need some initiative to get something like that done!) and would never have done it clamping the PCB instead of the IHS, but there's always potentials for issues. We are of course sticking sharp things within centimeters of expensive hardware, or hitting them with hammers in the first place. Sorry if it's dead/damaged


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I THINK you will be OK - as it is on the OUTER edge - where there might not be any wires running through it.
FYI: A youtubers posted on my video to say he screwed up his de-lid, didn't look bad on pictures but he gets no boot - told him to RMA and be honest with intel - see where that gets him.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I THINK you will be OK - as it is on the OUTER edge - where there might not be any wires running through it.
> FYI: A youtubers posted on my video to say he screwed up his de-lid, didn't look bad on pictures but he gets no boot - told him to RMA and be honest with intel - see where that gets him.


Ask Valgaur for his RMA transcripts. Since his RMA was ground zero for this case of RMA, it's nice to have for reference. I tried it as well, I have my transcripts too if you want. They said I had to send it in first and couldn't give me cross-ship option but it worked. However, it wasn't my chip, it was my brother's.


----------



## alancsalt

Should post or link that in OP? Then you can always point to it....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Should post or link that in OP? Then you can always point to it....


done














top end of page


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Should post or link that in OP? Then you can always point to it....
> 
> 
> 
> done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> top end of page
Click to expand...

That transcript looks similar to mine other than them saying that they wanted me to not do cross-ship first.









Anyway, does anyone know a solution to why I can't go full screen on some video players in Chrome? Whenever I watch on vodly, some of the links that lead to a video player that I can't go full screen gets annoying; and sometimes, they're the only players that actually load at a decent speed.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Thanks guys


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Here is a macro close-up of the nick on the cpu board. Am I SOL as far as it working?


I'm not very hopeful I'm sorry to say.







It sure looks like a trace or two can be seen in that spot. I guess the real question is whether they still have contact or not. No way to tell for sure until you put it in and fire it up - but I think it might be a goner.


----------



## battleaxe

Oh man...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I'm not very hopeful I'm sorry to say.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It sure looks like a trace or two can be seen in that spot. I guess the real question is whether they still have contact or not. No way to tell for sure until you put it in and fire it up - but I think it might be a goner.


put LET on it and then try it.


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> put LET on it and then try it.


LET ??.. error bios 00 , killer ,??







c gillete..


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> put LET on it and then try it.
> 
> 
> 
> LET ??.. error bios 00 , killer ,??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> c gillete..
Click to expand...

"Liquid Electrical Tape"


----------



## Osco

Thanks for all the help guys!

I will cross my fingers, put a dab of LET on it, see if it fires up and hope the lesson I have learned does not turn out to be an expensive one!!


----------



## Ovrclck

I just did something similar...My 4770k popped out of the vice and fell on the floor, doh! knicked a corner. I should be okay as it doesn't seem to have damaged any traces right?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> I just did something similar...My 4770k popped out of the vice and fell on the floor, doh! knicked a corner. I should be okay as it doesn't seem to have damaged any traces right?


Looks like that'll be fine. There shouldn't be anything out on the very corner.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Looks like that'll be fine. There shouldn't be anything out on the very corner.


That's what I figured. I just noticed a small scratch on one of the gold contacts, It should be okay?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> That's what I figured. I just noticed a small scratch on one of the gold contacts, It should be okay?


I would think so, a scratch shouldn't affect anything.


----------



## Limo Wreck

Hey guys, do I need to let this clu sit any length of time before I start my machine back up?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Limo Wreck*
> 
> Hey guys, do I need to let this clu sit any length of time before I start my machine back up?


No, it'll be fine right away.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I would think so, a scratch shouldn't affect anything.


Right on!







I'll give it a test tonight after work.


----------



## dixson01974

Just letting you guys know. You can use a EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy on other CPU blocks too with some minor modding.
I order the following and add some nuts to hold it together.
EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy
EK-LGA115x TRUE Backplate
XSPC Raystorm Intel Aluminum Bracket - Black



It work perfectly. I haven't delid my CPU yet, but planning on it.


----------



## Osco

Ok, so I did a quick mobo/ram/cpu (w/stock cooler) boot up and got to the bios. This is a good sign, right... right?!??


----------



## stickg1

Yeah that's a good sign. But 42C idle is kinda high imo


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Yeah that's a good sign. But 42C idle is kinda high imo


Yes, I saw that too. I was hoping it was just because I was using the stock cooler and the mobo is sitting on top of its box. Hopefully not me messing up the delid.
However, I have a Fluke IR Thermometer and it was only reading 33.8*C on the back of the mobo directly underneath the cpu. That was the warmest spot anywhere on the board.
*sigh* it can't ever be easy, can it!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I wouldn't worry about the temps too much seeing as how it's a stock cooler and probably not seated well (and I'm guessing using stock TIM) - although I would expect it to be better. It's entirely possible that there's not enough TIM on the die or that the reading is off by a little.

On the other note - it's a very good sign, especially since it's detecting RAM and all readings are being returned to the MB. However, you won't really be able to tell until you run it for awhile (there still could be weird errors when actually _using_ the CPU to do something other than drive the display of the BIOS screens).









However, it definitely works well enough to build the full system together and do some testing with a real cooler and real software... looks like you dodged a bullet!


----------



## scramz

Hi guys

Just delided and scared the hell out of me! But i am happy with the results!

OCN name: scramz
CPU: i7-3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
IHS MX-4
Mhz gained:500mhz stable on 5 runs 8000mb intel burn
OC after delid: 4.8GHZ stable on on 5 runs 8000mb intel burn (WIll OC higher!)
Temp drops: Average of 25C per core during Intel burn test.

I will give aid and other programs a try now.


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scramz*
> 
> Hi guys
> 
> Just delided and scared the hell out of me! But i am happy with the results!
> 
> OCN name: scramz
> CPU: i7-3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> IHS MX-4
> Mhz gained:500mhz stable on 5 runs 8000mb intel burn
> OC after delid: 4.8GHZ stable on on 5 runs 8000mb intel burn (WIll OC higher!)
> Temp drops: Average of 25C per core during Intel burn test.
> 
> I will give aid and other programs a try now.


Nice, i get about the same with my i7 3770k @ 5ghz , but with no ihs and watercooling.

To bad we cant buy CPU without ihs , and dont have to worry about messing it up. I did vice method on my i7 , much easyer than with razorblade.


----------



## Osco

Well that is definitely some good news!

I read that the stock idle temps should be between 28-35*C though. So I think I should go back and redo the CLU under the IHS and reseat it before moving on with the build. Any suggestions for re-securing the IHS?

Thanks for all the help! This is a great forum!


----------



## scramz

I did the vice method. Was very easy just scary smacking a CPU with some wood and a hammer lol.

I will push higher now


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Well that is definitely some good news!
> 
> I read that the stock idle temps should be between 28-35*C though. So I think I should go back and redo the CLU under the IHS and reseat it before moving on with the build. Any suggestions for re-securing the IHS?
> 
> Thanks for all the help! This is a great forum!


get rid of it and go direct die!


----------



## dixson01974

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> get rid of it and go direct die!


Direct die is the best thing you can do. I'll planning on doing it too.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> get rid of it and go direct die!
> 
> 
> 
> Direct die is the best thing you can do. I'll planning on doing it too.
Click to expand...

I actually think with the naked ivy mount from EK I felt better about the overall mount than trying to get the IHS back in the right place while messing with that clamp.


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> get rid of it and go direct die!


lol you are killing me inedenimadam! I just barely survived delidding!








I have an Alphacool NexXxoS XP³ Light - Black Chrome Edition cpu block. Not sure that one will work direct die...


----------



## dixson01974

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I actually think with the naked ivy mount from EK I felt better about the overall mount than trying to get the IHS back in the right place while messing with that clamp.


Yep. Plus you can use them on other CPU Blocks too.
This is with the EK naked ivy mount with my XSPC cpu block.


----------



## Cr4zy

OK I'm back!

After my first 4770k delid went fine but then subsequently killed itself .

I had been running a new 4770k for the past month or so without a delid at 4.3GHz. However, even under water the thing was touching 90c under avx2 loads and hitting good 70c on other 100% loads, and because I render a lot on my CPU, those temps suck.

So I gave in, and delidded this one, Vice yet again a bit of electrical tape to hold the PCB to the IHS so it doesnt go flying and everything went smoothly.



But because last time I figured the IHS and bow of my water block resulted in death of a CPU, i'm not running direct-to-die thanks to a Supremacy and naked mount









But I couldn't find my CLU so im on Gelid Extreme this time, which is hopefully safer considering the vrms.



OCN name: Cr4zy
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme
ihs-TIM: No IHS, Direct-to-die
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: 4300Mhz
Temp drops: ~30c

Here's to hoping this one doesn't kill itself after a month! *touch wood*


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> get rid of it and go direct die!
> 
> 
> 
> lol you are killing me inedenimadam! I just barely survived delidding!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have an Alphacool NexXxoS XP³ Light - Black Chrome Edition cpu block. Not sure that one will work direct die...
Click to expand...

I dont know either, but direct die will net the best temps, you are effectivly removing a layer of TIM and a hunk of metal..putting that water as close to the top of the die as possible short of spraying it with a garden hose.


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> Yep. Plus you can use them on other CPU Blocks too.
> This is with the EK naked ivy mount with my XSPC cpu block.


But is that mounted on the IHS or naked die?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I dont know either, but direct die will net the best temps, you are effectivly removing a layer or TIM and a hunk of metal..putting that water as close to the top of the die as possible short of spraying it with a garden hose.


Hmmm, spray it with a garden hose eh? Now _that_ sounds like something I would do! lol









If I understand correctly, to direct die mount, I need to remove the cpu clamping mechanism from the mobo? Also I must make sure whatever cpu block I use, it is completely flat to get the best contact with the die and not crush it? Plus use a kit like the EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy (that will hopefully work on Haswell)?


----------



## dixson01974

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> But is that mounted on the IHS or naked die?
> Hmmm, spray it with a garden hose eh? Now _that_ sounds like something I would do! lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I understand correctly, to direct die mount, I need to remove the cpu clamping mechanism from the mobo? Also I must make sure whatever cpu block I use, it is completely flat to get the best contact with the die and not crush it? Plus use a kit like the EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy (that will hopefully work on Haswell)?


That is with the IHS on it, but I can use it without it easily. Hoping to have it naked by next weekend.


----------



## Mogwaii

I can recommend naked mount aswell, its not as hard as it sounds, just dont move the cooling block when mounting it, and just turn the mounting screws evenly and slowly.

ive done it with both my i5 and my i7 , both worked nicely.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mogwaii*
> 
> I can recommend naked mount aswell, its not as hard as it sounds, just dont move the cooling block when mounting it, and just turn the mounting screws evenly and slowly.
> 
> ive done it with both my i5 and my i7 , both worked nicely.


I have remounted several times trying to get the TIM right, I have yet to have a "no boot", it really was pretty easy...

I cant quite call this my first build, but it is everything out of my first build with a new case and a waterloop, and it booted first shot.


----------



## Ovrclck

I clamped my chip into my board after putting CLP. I just noticed CLP fell into the crevice of my dimm slot. Im off to the hardware store to find something small enough to remove the clp, any suggestions?









Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4


----------



## Ovrclck

Just cant get a break it seems lol.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> I clamped my chip into my board after putting CLP. I just noticed CLP fell into the crevice of my dimm slot. Im off to the hardware store to find something small enough to remove the clp, any suggestions?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4


a needle full of alcohol and a well placed towel...?

toothpick and a prayer?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> Just cant get a break it seems lol.
> 
> Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4


Why don't you just dish wash it? It's quick and easy and removes all the dirt saved up in those tiny places. You don't know, they might be conspiring to one day build up and electrocute something and your entire rig is rendered useless. Don't underestimate those sneaky dust bunnies!



P.S.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



I don't think I've done anything useful to this thread in forever other than updating the spreadsheet.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> [quote name="BGKris" url="/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/22300#post_20928963"]I clamped my chip into my board after putting CLP. I just noticed CLP fell into the crevice of my dimm slot. Im off to the hardware store to find something small enough to remove the clp, any suggestions?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent[/URL] from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4


a needle full of alcohol and a well placed towel...?toothpick and a prayer?[/QUOTE]

Hah thanks, looking for a needle right now.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> OK I'm back!
> 
> After my first 4770k delid went fine but then subsequently killed itself .
> 
> I had been running a new 4770k for the past month or so without a delid at 4.3GHz. However, even under water the thing was touching 90c under avx2 loads and hitting good 70c on other 100% loads, and because I render a lot on my CPU, those temps suck.
> 
> So I gave in, and delidded this one, Vice yet again a bit of electrical tape to hold the PCB to the IHS so it doesnt go flying and everything went smoothly.
> 
> 
> 
> But because last time I figured the IHS and bow of my water block resulted in death of a CPU, i'm not running direct-to-die thanks to a Supremacy and naked mount
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I couldn't find my CLU so im on Gelid Extreme this time, which is hopefully safer considering the vrms.
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Cr4zy
> 
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme
> ihs-TIM: No IHS, Direct-to-die
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: 4300Mhz
> Temp drops: ~30c
> 
> Here's to hoping this one doesn't kill itself after a month! *touch wood*


what was the vcore and vccin of your first cpu ?


----------



## Ovrclck

Phewwwww, talk about a close one lol! I'm up and running. Took me 2 hours, but I was able to remove everything from the dimm slot.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> lol you are killing me inedenimadam! I just barely survived delidding!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have an Alphacool NexXxoS XP³ Light - Black Chrome Edition cpu block. Not sure that one will work direct die...


You and me both!


----------



## Cr4zy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> what was the vcore and vccin of your first cpu ?


Pretty sure the vcore was 1.21 although honestly I can't be certain. I have no idea what the vccin was.


----------



## t0tum

For anyone that recently delided Ivy which was run from launch day, how is the condition of the stock tim, still smooth? I remember taking coolers from 2 year old heavily used GPU's and the stuff was as hard as cement.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *t0tum*
> 
> For anyone that recently delided Ivy which was run from launch day, how is the condition of the stock tim, still smooth? I remember taking coolers from 2 year old heavily used GPU's and the stuff was as hard as cement.


was hard as cement too on the CPU for the stock Tim


----------



## brollann

I delidded my 4770k vice way, everything went well i picked of the cpu from the ihs, cleaned it up i put cpl on the core and put back it on the m-b. I can't see any scratches or any damage but the computer wont boot. I use stockcooler because of my wc haven't arrived.
This is how it does now, 



 teststed with 1stick mem and so on.
My setup: gigabyte z87x ud4
Kingston Beast 16gb 2133hz
Bequiet dark pro 10 850w
Asus gtx 780 dc2
And this is how the core looks like with clp.
I think i need a new cpu but im going to test psu to before i order one new cpu.


----------



## deepor

This area:



Is this just dust and dirt, or is the PCB cracked?

You should check the socket for bent pins.


----------



## brollann

I think it is dirt but im not shore going to check both that and pins now.

It was glue and no bent pins or cracking on cpu as i can see.


----------



## scramz

I went back to 4.4 and the temps are crazy low compared to before!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cr4zy*
> 
> OK I'm back!
> 
> After my first 4770k delid went fine but then subsequently killed itself .
> 
> I had been running a new 4770k for the past month or so without a delid at 4.3GHz. However, even under water the thing was touching 90c under avx2 loads and hitting good 70c on other 100% loads, and because I render a lot on my CPU, those temps suck.
> 
> So I gave in, and delidded this one, Vice yet again a bit of electrical tape to hold the PCB to the IHS so it doesnt go flying and everything went smoothly.
> 
> 
> 
> But because last time I figured the IHS and bow of my water block resulted in death of a CPU, i'm not running direct-to-die thanks to a Supremacy and naked mount
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I couldn't find my CLU so im on Gelid Extreme this time, which is hopefully safer considering the vrms.
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Cr4zy
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme
> ihs-TIM: No IHS, Direct-to-die
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: 4300Mhz
> Temp drops: ~30c
> 
> Here's to hoping this one doesn't kill itself after a month! *touch wood*


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!

in other news


----------



## Totally Dubbed

^hothothothot!
I mean COLD, nice


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!
> 
> in other news


----------



## Osco

Ok, I made a ghetto test bench and installed Windows 7 Pro on a Samsung 840 Pro SSD. I also put RealTemp, HWMonitor, CPU-Z and IntelBurnTest on it.
Both HWMonitor and RealTemp were showing idle in windows at 30~32*C.
During a quick IntelBurnTest run, the max was 84*C. Is that about normal for a stock cooler on a delidded Haswell with CLU between the die and IHS? Or should I still be worried? Or do I need to run a much longer test to find out??


----------



## Swag

I got a brand new chip (3770k) and now I'm going to delid!







Hmm, let's see how this goes. I've tested the chip already and it seems to be able to do 4.5 with 1.20vcore which is nice to me, I think. I'll aim for a bit higher after. This won't be going into my main rig because that's fine how it is, this is going to my family's HTPC rig.

Delidding start!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Ok, I made a ghetto test bench and installed Windows 7 Pro on a Samsung 840 Pro SSD. I also put RealTemp, HWMonitor, CPU-Z and IntelBurnTest on it.
> Both HWMonitor and RealTemp were showing idle in windows at 30~32*C.
> During a quick IntelBurnTest run, the max was 84*C. Is that about normal for a stock cooler on a delidded Haswell with CLU between the die and IHS? Or should I still be worried? Or do I need to run a much longer test to find out??


Seems hot. Very hard to say for ~1.13vcore on stock cooler


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Seems hot. Very hard to say for ~1.13vcore on stock cooler


I have to second this. There has not been extensive testing (that I have seen) of haswell + delid + stock cooler, come to think of it, you might be the only one providing this data so it is hard to compare your results to anybody elses. I would just consider it a win if you are running IBT on a stock cooler and you havent blown it up yet.


----------



## Swag

Anyone here good with security?

I just wanted to ask, what does an antivirus really do?

I was wondering because I don't know if I should have antivirus or have internet security. My network switch has a built-in firewall that's supposedly good enough to protect a company from those viruses (obviously not all but most) and considering I paid a fortune for my switch, I think it warrants its claim.


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Seems hot. Very hard to say for ~1.13vcore on stock cooler


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have to second this. There has not been extensive testing (that I have seen) of haswell + delid + stock cooler, come to think of it, you might be the only one providing this data so it is hard to compare your results to anybody elses. I would just consider it a win if you are running IBT on a stock cooler and you havent blown it up yet.


Think this may have something to do with those temps? Doesn't look like a good connection.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I just wanted to ask, what does an antivirus really do?


Can scan your files, check for known malware. Most of the "useful" function IMO is stuff like real-time scanning of files before you open them, but they run in background, use RAM, CPU and often mess with what you're trying to do so i avoid the heavy stuff in favor of etc malwarebytes occasional scans and not being a moron in general

^Yea that looks terrible contact. The gap and lack of spreading from the top between the three lines shows there's no pressure there at all to even spread the paste a tiny amount though it was touching a little bit

Edit: Did you put it on the wrong way round?


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> ... ^Yea that looks terrible contact. The gap and lack of spreading from the top between the three lines shows there's no pressure there at all to even spread the paste a tiny amount though it was touching a little bit
> 
> Edit: Did you put it on the wrong way round?


I didn't think it made a difference which way you put the stock heat sink on.... or does it??


----------



## Cyro999

AFAIK the holes are rectangular, not square. I mean it's like 3am here so i may be going crazy, but look at the picture


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> ... ^Yea that looks terrible contact. The gap and lack of spreading from the top between the three lines shows there's no pressure there at all to even spread the paste a tiny amount though it was touching a little bit
> 
> Edit: Did you put it on the wrong way round?
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think it made a difference which way you put the stock heat sink on.... or does it??
Click to expand...

no, it really shouldnt make much of a difference...the lack of contact will. It looks like maybe the push pins were not pushed all the way.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone here good with security?
> 
> I just wanted to ask, what does an antivirus really do?
> 
> I was wondering because I don't know if I should have antivirus or have internet security. My network switch has a built-in firewall that's supposedly good enough to protect a company from those viruses (obviously not all but most) and considering I paid a fortune for my switch, I think it warrants its claim.


Anti-virus progs look for "trojans" and "viruses". Viruses destroy or change data. Trojans steal data - like passwords or personal info. Not all anti-virus progs look for malware. Malware can be ad-tracking cookies, or even progs that redirect you to websites not of your choosing...There would be other malware varieties I'm not remembering in the moment too. (like Rootkits..) Because anti-virus didn't search for this stuff, anti-malware programs surfaced. It is only in the last couple of years (??) that some antivirus progs have included some malware in their definitions. I think that's the "Internet Security" suites you could be referring to.

Some ppls argue you don't need an anti-virus if careful. Personally I don't agree, but see it as an individual decision. We all have to decide which advice we do or don't accept...

Whether a good firewall is "enough" I don't know.

I believe no one antivirus catches ALL viruses, but you can only have one active one because they can clash. Similarly no malware prog catches all malware, so personally I keep Super Anti Spyware and Malware Bytes. I think the risk seems to have lessened in the last couple of years. Perhaps the "Hate Bill Gates" feeling is finally subsiding?


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> AFAIK the holes are rectangular, not square. I mean it's like 3am here so i may be going crazy, but look at the picture


lol, no worries Cyro! Get some sleep man! I appreciate the help!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> no, it really shouldnt make much of a difference...the lack of contact will. It looks like maybe the push pins were not pushed all the way.


I made sure it was in all the way... the second time, because it wasn't the first time I put it on!


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> AFAIK the holes are rectangular, not square. I mean it's like 3am here so i may be going crazy, but look at the picture


I think it's just the angle the picture is taken at. It should be a square.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> lol, no worries Cyro! Get some sleep man! I appreciate the help!
> I made sure it was in all the way... the second time, because it wasn't the first time I put it on!


currently i am using the stock cooler and i just made a test(clu on the die,gelid extreme on the ihs)[email protected] speed 1.053vcore under load


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone here good with security?
> 
> I just wanted to ask, what does an antivirus really do?
> 
> I was wondering because I don't know if I should have antivirus or have internet security. My network switch has a built-in firewall that's supposedly good enough to protect a company from those viruses (obviously not all but most) and considering I paid a fortune for my switch, I think it warrants its claim.


I use ESET NOD32 - best anti virus ever for me. I've tried a few, this one is one of the very few that doesn't slow down your system and I haven't received any malware/virus etc in the last 6 years because of it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> I didn't think it made a difference which way you put the stock heat sink on.... or does it??


It shouldn't no. That application is barely put - you probably forgot to tighten the top screws or something. Make sure it CLICKS next time.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> currently i am using the stock cooler and i just made a test(clu on the die,gelid extreme on the ihs)[email protected] speed 1.053vcore under load


Looks good mate - try getting that OC'ed now.


----------



## neofury

I use ESET NOD32 as well, and I keep spyware S&D and malwarebytes up to date as well, S&D for immunization, Malware for anything ESET doesn't pick up.

I did recently get a virus (first in like 5 years that this combo didn't detect/clean/fix) and had to install Kaspersky to clean it, but that app hogs resources like there's no tomorrow.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Yup that's why I love eset so much, no problems with games, internet nor hogging memory.


----------



## neofury

Also, no don't rely on a hardware firewall. I got that virus at work where I have one, it's funny at home I don't and this combo of apps has kept me clean a really long time. It's a bare minimum imo to have at least ESET + Malwarebytes for me. I just use S&D for peace of mind too.


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> currently i am using the stock cooler and i just made a test(clu on the die,gelid extreme on the ihs)[email protected] speed 1.053vcore under load.


Yeah, those are much better temps than mine. Not sure how much the difference in vcore makes, but that gives me something to shoot for. Thanks for sharing those ozzy!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I use ESET NOD32 - best anti virus ever for me. I've tried a few, this one is one of the very few that doesn't slow down your system and I haven't received any malware/virus etc in the last 6 years because of it.


I second (third, etc.) ESET. Best one I have used too! I also use ESET Smart Security at our businesses. Good product!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> It shouldn't no. That application is barely put - you probably forgot to tighten the top screws or something. Make sure it CLICKS next time.


I will go back and try the stock cooler again, making doublely (triplely) sure it is secured this time! lol








EDIT: Random thought, Is it at all possible that the lack of adhesive below the IHS is lowering the height enough that the stock heat sink is not making good contact?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Yeah, those are much better temps than mine. Not sure how much the difference in vcore makes, but that gives me something to shoot for. Thanks for sharing those ozzy!
> I second (third, etc.) ESET. Best one I have used too! I also use ESET Smart Security at our businesses. Good product!
> I will go back and try the stock cooler again, making doublely (triplely) sure it is secured this time! lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Random thought, Is it at all possible that the lack of adhesive below the IHS is lowering the height enough that the stock heat sink is not making good contact?


due to the delid?
Sure it makes contact a mini-millimetre difference - but it isn't going to the point that you won't have ANY contact - as shown in your picture.
That's why bare-die people have to calculate the distance etc.
But normal delidders like myself - don't have to worry as the cooling block is super tight on the CPU pre and post de-lid.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

On the security discussion it totally depends on what your definition of 'careful' is. Here is an example of what I consider an acceptable no-AV solution:

1) The PC running without AV is firewalled at all times and locked down (i.e. run with a user account that has nearly no rights whatsoever) - preferrably this PC runs linux which is updated first - but only by elevating the process never by logging in with an account with root access! (*Read last note about this*)
2) That PC acts as host to two VMs running whatever OS you prefer to use for web access and testing of software.
3) One VM runs antivirus, antimalware, and a secondary software firewall (if windows the built-in is fine... just basically securing ports nothing fancy).
4) Torrents, software, patches, etc... are downloaded on this VM - and thoroughly scanned. Then the downloads are installed/played/etc... on that VM after a snapshot is taken. If everything is OK... the snapshot is rolled back and the source file(s) copied to the local shared storage on the host OS. If not the snapshot is rolled back and the file deleted.
5) Once verified, the first VM is shut down and the second VM is loaded, snapshotted, and the software installed. Proceed as normal now.

* If you are looking for a 'secure gaming pc' then this solution won't work... since you can't play most things in a VM at native hardware performance speeds. However, since games are the largest and most common attack vector for hacks/viruses (possibly second only to social media sites) if you are looking for either of these things on a computer then, no, you should never run without a hardware firewall, software firewall, antivirus, and most importantly _never as an admin user account_.

On the other topic - yeah, that looks like bad contact with that HSF - and if you were having that small of a contact patch (looks like less than 40% of the HS was in full contact with the IHS) and having those temps at idle and IBT loads... I'd call that a win! With a real cooler you shouldn't have any problems OC'ing well beyond those levels and staying nice and cool.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> On the security discussion it totally depends on what your definition of 'careful' is. Here is an example of what I consider an acceptable no-AV solution:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 1) The PC running without AV is firewalled at all times and locked down (i.e. run with a user account that has nearly no rights whatsoever) - preferrably this PC runs linux which is updated first - but only by elevating the process never by logging in with an account with root access! (*Read last note about this*)
> 2) That PC acts as host to two VMs running whatever OS you prefer to use for web access and testing of software.
> 3) One VM runs antivirus, antimalware, and a secondary software firewall (if windows the built-in is fine... just basically securing ports nothing fancy).
> 4) Torrents, software, patches, etc... are downloaded on this VM - and thoroughly scanned. Then the downloads are installed/played/etc... on that VM after a snapshot is taken. If everything is OK... the snapshot is rolled back and the source file(s) copied to the local shared storage on the host OS. If not the snapshot is rolled back and the file deleted.
> 5) Once verified, the first VM is shut down and the second VM is loaded, snapshotted, and the software installed. Proceed as normal now.
> 
> * If you are looking for a 'secure gaming pc' then this solution won't work... since you can't play most things in a VM at native hardware performance speeds. However, since games are the largest and most common attack vector for hacks/viruses (possibly second only to social media sites) if you are looking for either of these things on a computer then, no, you should never run without a hardware firewall, software firewall, antivirus, and most importantly _never as an admin user account_.
> 
> 
> 
> On the other topic - yeah, that looks like bad contact with that HSF - and if you were having that small of a contact patch (looks like less than 40% of the HS was in full contact with the IHS) and having those temps at idle and IBT loads... I'd call that a win! With a real cooler you shouldn't have any problems OC'ing well beyond those levels and staying nice and cool.


I REP'd you for the information.







Thanks.

In addition to that, I was wondering about viruses in general. Can you get a virus from simply visiting a site? Like all ads are blocked and stuff but can you still get a virus? I've always assumed you can and that's why I don't really visit sites people link me to unless I know the site is safe. I only check it on my MacBook if someone gives me a site I don't know or sounds fishy.









I'm really scared of getting viruses. Especially things that can take my passwords. I run CCleaner every time I finish a PC session even after gaming only. This computer isn't used for anything but media/gaming so I don't have sensitive information saved on the computer, however, when I use Chrome; I use an extension for my passwords, LastPass, as a password manager. If a virus does infect my PC and I go into Chrome and type in my password into the extension for it to auto input my passwords into the site, can the virus take the LastPass password and have access to all my passwords?


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> due to the delid?
> Sure it makes contact a mini-millimetre difference - but it isn't going to the point that you won't have ANY contact - as shown in your picture.
> That's why bare-die people have to calculate the distance etc.
> But normal delidders like myself - don't have to worry as the cooling block is super tight on the CPU pre and post de-lid.


I was just curious because after delidding and removing the stock TIM and adhesive, the IHS will easily spin on top of the die. I wasn't sure if that was good, bad or just to be expected nor what effect it might have on IHS contact with the stock heat sink.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> On the other topic - yeah, that looks like bad contact with that HSF - and if you were having that small of a contact patch (looks like less than 40% of the HS was in full contact with the IHS) and having those temps at idle and IBT loads... I'd call that a win! With a real cooler you shouldn't have any problems OC'ing well beyond those levels and staying nice and cool.


That is good news. I am going to try again with the stock heat sink/fan and see if I can get a better connection and temps more like ozzy1925 did. Then move ahead with the water cooling fun!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Your motherboard should clamp down your ihs so that it doesn't move.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I REP'd you for the information.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> In addition to that, I was wondering about viruses in general. Can you get a virus from simply visiting a site? Like all ads are blocked and stuff but can you still get a virus? I've always assumed you can and that's why I don't really visit sites people link me to unless I know the site is safe. I only check it on my MacBook if someone gives me a site I don't know or sounds fishy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm really scared of getting viruses. Especially things that can take my passwords. I run CCleaner every time I finish a PC session even after gaming only. This computer isn't used for anything but media/gaming so I don't have sensitive information saved on the computer, however, when I use Chrome; I use an extension for my passwords, LastPass, as a password manager. If a virus does infect my PC and I go into Chrome and type in my password into the extension for it to auto input my passwords into the site, can the virus take the LastPass password and have access to all my passwords?


Totally depends on a few things. First of all - as with any password keepers, or none for that matter - you're only as secure as your password itself. So if you aren't using two-factor security, very strong passwords (which is the point of keeper utilities after all - who wants to type "s#[email protected]@!kem" every time they do an online EFT?) as well as encrypting the local filestore for it... then you're not _totally_ secure.

However, the important thing to remember as well is perspective. If you're spending 15 minutes on security for something worth less than 1 minute of work... then you're being overly paranoid and wasting efficiency for security. That's something the US seems to be doing really well right now. We spend hundreds of billions on security in order to foil plans that affect far fewer people than things like hunger, unemployment, disease, accidents, etc... and in many cases we spend far less on all of those other things _combined_. So a good rule of thumb (IMO only of course) is if you are spending 10-15% of your resources on security - you're probably secure enough. A $10 dead-bolt lock is inadequate for security a $300K house, likewise a $5K security system is ridiculous on a car that's worth only $12K. That's what _insurance_ is for.

So just limit your exposure, which it seems like you're doing a decent job of already. Don't post personally identifying information anywhere (at least no more personal than your basic contact information - and be judicious with that as well). If you're using strong passwords, but feel LastPass could be more easily cracked - which it could if that password isn't equally strong - then try adding two-factor security to the equation by using a USB Key or biometrics. The other thing you can do that's even easier is simply use a LiveCD recent Linux distro for 'sensitive' online activity. Cold boot to the CD/DVD and then go online (note that this assumes you have a separate firewall on your actual router/modem) and do what you want - since the actual OS cannot be modified, you don't have to worry about malware or other scripts embedding themselves anywhere. Once you're done making your purchase, adjusting your portfolio, etc... then shutdown, pull the CD/DVD, and reboot - and go back to gaming. It costs absolutely nothing - other than the extra time for the reboot - and it's much more secure, and practical IMO than flushing and scanning your system after every session.

No system that is connected to a network (any network) is truly secure - and even that system is only as secure as it's physical location - so don't get too wrapped up in worrying about it. It's much more important to have a good, thorough backup strategy than it is to worry about every little script and virus in existence. If you have a good historical catalog of backups of your critical data, and a good habit of testing those - you don't need to worry. If something were to happen, just wipe and restore - just make sure you know when to restore to (and that you have historical backups so you have an option other than just the last one). You might go many years without getting a virus or spyware infection - you will likely not go very many years without experiencing catastrophic data loss if you don't backup.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I REP'd you for the information.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> In addition to that, I was wondering about viruses in general. Can you get a virus from simply visiting a site? Like all ads are blocked and stuff but can you still get a virus? I've always assumed you can and that's why I don't really visit sites people link me to unless I know the site is safe. I only check it on my MacBook if someone gives me a site I don't know or sounds fishy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm really scared of getting viruses. Especially things that can take my passwords. I run CCleaner every time I finish a PC session even after gaming only. This computer isn't used for anything but media/gaming so I don't have sensitive information saved on the computer, however, when I use Chrome; I use an extension for my passwords, LastPass, as a password manager. If a virus does infect my PC and I go into Chrome and type in my password into the extension for it to auto input my passwords into the site, can the virus take the LastPass password and have access to all my passwords?
> 
> 
> 
> Totally depends on a few things. First of all - as with any password keepers, or none for that matter - you're only as secure as your password itself. So if you aren't using two-factor security, very strong passwords (which is the point of keeper utilities after all - who wants to type "s#[email protected]@!kem" every time they do an online EFT?) as well as encrypting the local filestore for it... then you're not _totally_ secure.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> However, the important thing to remember as well is perspective. If you're spending 15 minutes on security for something worth less than 1 minute of work... then you're being overly paranoid and wasting efficiency for security. That's something the US seems to be doing really well right now. We spend hundreds of billions on security in order to foil plans that affect far fewer people than things like hunger, unemployment, disease, accidents, etc... and in many cases we spend far less on all of those other things _combined_. So a good rule of thumb (IMO only of course) is if you are spending 10-15% of your resources on security - you're probably secure enough. A $10 dead-bolt lock is inadequate for security a $300K house, likewise a $5K security system is ridiculous on a car that's worth only $12K. That's what _insurance_ is for.
> 
> So just limit your exposure, which it seems like you're doing a decent job of already. Don't post personally identifying information anywhere (at least no more personal than your basic contact information - and be judicious with that as well). If you're using strong passwords, but feel LastPass could be more easily cracked - which it could if that password isn't equally strong - then try adding two-factor security to the equation by using a USB Key or biometrics. The other thing you can do that's even easier is simply use a LiveCD recent Linux distro for 'sensitive' online activity. Cold boot to the CD/DVD and then go online (note that this assumes you have a separate firewall on your actual router/modem) and do what you want - since the actual OS cannot be modified, you don't have to worry about malware or other scripts embedding themselves anywhere. Once you're done making your purchase, adjusting your portfolio, etc... then shutdown, pull the CD/DVD, and reboot - and go back to gaming. It costs absolutely nothing - other than the extra time for the reboot - and it's much more secure, and practical IMO than flushing and scanning your system after every session.
> 
> No system that is connected to a network (any network) is truly secure - and even that system is only as secure as it's physical location - so don't get too wrapped up in worrying about it. It's much more important to have a good, thorough backup strategy than it is to worry about every little script and virus in existence. If you have a good historical catalog of backups of your critical data, and a good habit of testing those - you don't need to worry. If something were to happen, just wipe and restore - just make sure you know when to restore to (and that you have historical backups so you have an option other than just the last one). You might go many years without getting a virus or spyware infection - you will likely not go very many years without experiencing catastrophic data loss if you don't backup.
Click to expand...

I know, I bought ESET NOD32 with the recommendation of Totally Dubbed. Completely love this AV suite, it's light and efficient. I love it. It's much better than MSE (my previous) and Bitdefender (before MSE but switched over to MSE because this was really slow and intrusive)! My password is 15 digits long with 2 special characters 6 numbers and 2 capital letters. Haha, it's crazy man, I only remember it for that password manager; my email and bank accounts have a separate password not in use with the password manager.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know, I bought ESET NOD32 with the recommendation of Totally Dubbed. Completely love this AV suite, it's light and efficient. I love it. It's much better than MSE (my previous) and Bitdefender (before MSE but switched over to MSE because this was really slow and intrusive)! My password is 15 digits long with 2 special characters 6 numbers and 2 capital letters. Haha, it's crazy man, I only remember it for that password manager; my email and bank accounts have a separate password not in use with the password manager.


You should be fine really. Viruses (just like the real ones) are not as common as many would like to have you believe - and your risk of infection is likewise almost totally related to your behavior rather than your mere presence. As long as you're not going to 'risky' websites (however, remember that most social media sites are potentially more dangerous than Russian porn sites







) and you're not downloading and installing a bunch of non-certified software or drivers on your machine... you're probably safe already from 95% of the malware in existence. These days there's much more risk from phishing messages/sites - and you just have to be a good skeptic/cynic to avoid almost all of those.

As far as scripts/worms - a good AV with decent heuristics and active scanning should prevent them from embedding/triggering (and NOD32 is really good for this). I think at this point you've done your due-diligence and you should stop worrying about it so much and just remain vigilant - without getting too paranoid. After all - the NSA is watching/reading everything you do anyway - so in some cases there's really nothing much more you can do before simply using the computer becomes more of a pain than it's worth.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I know, I bought ESET NOD32 with the recommendation of Totally Dubbed. Completely love this AV suite, it's light and efficient. I love it. It's much better than MSE (my previous) and Bitdefender (before MSE but switched over to MSE because this was really slow and intrusive)! My password is 15 digits long with 2 special characters 6 numbers and 2 capital letters. Haha, it's crazy man, I only remember it for that password manager; my email and bank accounts have a separate password not in use with the password manager.
> 
> 
> 
> You should be fine really. Viruses (just like the real ones) are not as common as many would like to have you believe - and your risk of infection is likewise almost totally related to your behavior rather than your mere presence. As long as you're not going to 'risky' websites (however, remember that most social media sites are potentially more dangerous than Russian porn sites
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and you're not downloading and installing a bunch of non-certified software or drivers on your machine... you're probably safe already from 95% of the malware in existence. These days there's much more risk from phishing messages/sites - and you just have to be a good skeptic/cynic to avoid almost all of those.
> 
> As far as scripts/worms - a good AV with decent heuristics and active scanning should prevent them from embedding/triggering (and NOD32 is really good for this). I think at this point you've done your due-diligence and you should stop worrying about it so much and just remain vigilant - without getting too paranoid. After all - the NSA is watching/reading everything you do anyway - so in some cases there's really nothing much more you can do before simply using the computer becomes more of a pain than it's worth.
Click to expand...

Haha, thanks for the assurance! Also, I don't even use social media sites too much. I only get on Facebook when I need to contact someone without a phone or someone tells me to get on it for a brief time. I don't see how you can spend looking at what your friends do all the time, I'd rather watch anime.







I reinstall Windows once a month and only have like 6 programs installed at a time (other than the necessary like drivers). I think the hackers are getting bored of trying to go about it this way because it isn't as much money, they probably like hacking specific targets now. I remember when people would hack systems or computers to gain recognition in the internet community but that's slowly going away. The only hackers really well known are whistleblowers or people who hack big corporations like 'Anonymous' with PS3.


----------



## AlDyer

You reinstall Windows once a month? Oh god...


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> You reinstall Windows once a month? Oh god...


My OS drive:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







All my other files are on a separate server rack containing all my media. On this, I only have basics like Skype and Chrome.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> You reinstall Windows once a month? Oh god...


I never wind up actually doing it more than a couple times per year - but if I was still a student or retired... I would totally do this. As long as you have a fast drive (I think striped SSDs probably counts







) and a fast USB stick based installer... the whole wipe and reinstall process should take less than 15 minutes. With some careful scripting and a PXE deployment package you could simply have all the source media on the server, wipe your HDD (zero-fill it at least), and reboot right before going to bed. In the morning you'd have a fresh Windows, all patches downloaded and installed, as well as all of your codecs and 3rd party software - and absolutely no registry bloat, failed uninstallers, etc...

Naturally, that's only fast _after_ you've spent the mind-numbing _weeks_ scripting, testing, scripting, testing... over and over again - but if you go through that and you're still sane... then you can pretty much walk into any shop with more than 500 screens in their enterprise and walk out with a nice six-figure salary (granted low six-figure... but still).


----------



## outofmyheadyo

So I finally did it, with the VICE method, a few good whacks with a hammer and the IHS came off, I had to use the Noctua NT-H1 because my CLP is not here yet, cooling is Noctua NH-D14 + Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v with ambient @ 23c


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






Temp @ default


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






Temp @ delided+Noctua NT-H1


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I hope to get a lot lower with the CLP/CLU =)


----------



## Cyro999

That looks awfully hot to me, what are your other settings? Also; you're aware you are running linx 0.65.0 without avx enabled? It'd blow up much harder if your gflops number was in the 200's (dont run it past like 1.15vcore)


----------



## outofmyheadyo

It is @ 1.270vcore everything else is mostly auto, and yes i know its running avx disabled


----------



## AlDyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I never wind up actually doing it more than a couple times per year - but if I was still a student or retired... I would totally do this. As long as you have a fast drive (I think striped SSDs probably counts
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and a fast USB stick based installer... the whole wipe and reinstall process should take less than 15 minutes. With some careful scripting and a PXE deployment package you could simply have all the source media on the server, wipe your HDD (zero-fill it at least), and reboot right before going to bed. In the morning you'd have a fresh Windows, all patches downloaded and installed, as well as all of your codecs and 3rd party software - and absolutely no registry bloat, failed uninstallers, etc...
> 
> Naturally, that's only fast _after_ you've spent the mind-numbing _weeks_ scripting, testing, scripting, testing... over and over again - but if you go through that and you're still sane... then you can pretty much walk into any shop with more than 500 screens in their enterprise and walk out with a nice six-figure salary (granted low six-figure... but still).


I haven't even activated my windows, because I used the code too many times or some dumb poop. Not gonna pay 200€ for that poo again...


----------



## Cyro999

You should manually set like, uncore 34x (so it doesn't turbo to 40x) and ring to ~1.15-1.2v for guaranteed stability while clocking core, and then more importantly set VRIN LLC to a pretty high level and manually give it ~1.85vrin (more not always better)

Stock vrin with droop is too low for pushing 1.3 load vcore (1.27 +~0.02 from ivr) as it's designed for like 1.1vcore load, so it'll hurt your temps and/or stability being too low (weird sounding logic i know)

Linpack without avx has a ceiling around 80c for me, just ran for 5 mins 6gb RAM, max 79

But i'm on 1.32v bios, without ht. So 0.05v more, and no ht - you're 8c hotter. I think my temps are cooler than yours, but i'm not delidded. I'm on a Silver Arrow, so comparable on that front


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> I haven't even activated my windows, because I used the code too many times or some dumb poop. Not gonna pay 200€ for that poo again...


You don't have to pay again. Click on that message where it says Windows is not activated. A window will open. Clicking around in there will guide you through an automated activation process. Windows will be activated at the end.

It will give you a free phone number to call. If you call that number, you will talk to a robot, not a human. Just follow its instructions. It will want you to type numbers on the phone's keypad and then dictate numbers and letters to type into that window on your PC.


----------



## AlDyer

Yeah, but I dont have that message anymore and I am


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You should manually set like, uncore 34x (so it doesn't turbo to 40x) and ring to ~1.15-1.2v for guaranteed stability while clocking core, and then more importantly set VRIN LLC to a pretty high level and manually give it ~1.85vrin (more not always better)
> 
> Stock vrin with droop is too low for pushing 1.3 load vcore (1.27 +~0.02 from ivr) as it's designed for like 1.1vcore load, so it'll hurt your temps and/or stability being too low (weird sounding logic i know)
> 
> Linpack without avx has a ceiling around 80c for me, just ran for 5 mins 6gb RAM, max 79
> 
> But i'm on 1.32v bios, without ht. So 0.05v more, and no ht - you're 8c hotter. I think my temps are cooler than yours, but i'm not delidded. I'm on a Silver Arrow, so comparable on that front


Whats ur ambient, and other temps everything is @ 5v in my case I dont want to hear my pc


----------



## Cyro999

20 or so, and my case isn't heated much. If i was running gpu's at load etc i'd have adequate airflow to make sure they didn't have much effect on CPU temps

Your nh-d14 fans are at 5v?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> I haven't even activated my windows, because I used the code too many times or some dumb poop. Not gonna pay 200€ for that poo again...


Well, if you reinstalled it every two weeks... you'd never have to activate it again! For that matter you would never have to buy any Windows again because you'd always be in a trial period... as you would for all the other software you installed. Naturally, I'm not advocating this as a way to avoid paying for software... I'm just saying...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You don't have to pay again. Click on that message where it says Windows is not activated. A window will open. Clicking around in there will guide you through an automated activation process. Windows will be activated at the end.
> 
> It will give you a free phone number to call. If you call that number, you will talk to a robot, not a human. Just follow its instructions. It will want you to type numbers on the phone's keypad and then dictate numbers and letters to type into that window on your PC.


This.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Yeah, but I dont have that message anymore and I am


What do you mean the message isn't there anymore? It's a permanent part of the properties dialog for non-activated copies of Windows. If it's not there then it means your copy _is activated_ - regardless of the means you took to achieve that. Not sure what there is to be mad about - unless it's that your copy of Windows isn't a different OS (in which case I can certainly understand your anger).


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> I haven't even activated my windows, because I used the code too many times or some dumb poop. Not gonna pay 200€ for that poo again...
> 
> 
> 
> Well, if you reinstalled it every two weeks... you'd never have to activate it again! For that matter you would never have to buy any Windows again because you'd always be in a trial period... as you would for all the other software you installed. Naturally, I'm not advocating this as a way to avoid paying for software... I'm just saying...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You don't have to pay again. Click on that message where it says Windows is not activated. A window will open. Clicking around in there will guide you through an automated activation process. Windows will be activated at the end.
> 
> It will give you a free phone number to call. If you call that number, you will talk to a robot, not a human. Just follow its instructions. It will want you to type numbers on the phone's keypad and then dictate numbers and letters to type into that window on your PC.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> This.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Yeah, but I dont have that message anymore and I am
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What do you mean the message isn't there anymore? It's a permanent part of the properties dialog for non-activated copies of Windows. If it's not there then it means your copy _is activated_ - regardless of the means you took to achieve that. Not sure what there is to be mad about - unless it's that your copy of Windows isn't a different OS (in which case I can certainly understand your anger).
Click to expand...

The biggest reason why I reinstall Windows atleast once a month is because of driver updates and bloatware. As you use Windows updates, it causes buildup in your system. It's basically writing over old cold and sooner or later, it'll cause your system to slow down and you'll end up having a PC that lags even with the smallest task! That and I like keeping my system clean as possible.

Also, my Windows 7 installer is on a USB3.0 and it takes around 5 minutes for it to install Windows 7 onto the drive. My dad has this USB that I've been using for a long time, it downloads and updates all the Windows updates automatically and reboots and downloads more if there; normally it takes about 1 hour to finish it all.







Then I do the rest of Seans guide doing my drivers and everything and I'm done with a PC that's good as new.







And this is all when my PC is overclocked so it's even faster!

P.S. I think the reason why it doesn't show is because he probably bought an OEM OS. Microsoft OS's that aren't OEM can be used multiple times as long as there is only one PC using it at a single time. If it isn't OEM and you can't activate it, then you can contact Microsoft and complain for a new key. They'll definitely give it to you.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> The biggest reason why I reinstall Windows atleast once a month is because of driver updates and bloatware. As you use Windows updates, it causes buildup in your system. It's basically writing over old cold and sooner or later, it'll cause your system to slow down and you'll end up having a PC that lags even with the smallest task! That and I like keeping my system clean as possible.
> 
> Also, my Windows 7 installer is on a USB3.0 and it takes around 5 minutes for it to install Windows 7 onto the drive. My dad has this USB that I've been using for a long time, it downloads and updates all the Windows updates automatically and reboots and downloads more if there; normally it takes about 1 hour to finish it all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then I do the rest of Seans guide doing my drivers and everything and I'm done with a PC that's good as new.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And this is all when my PC is overclocked so it's even faster!
> 
> P.S. I think the reason why it doesn't show is because he probably bought an OEM OS. Microsoft OS's that aren't OEM can be used multiple times as long as there is only one PC using it at a single time. If it isn't OEM and you can't activate it, then you can contact Microsoft and complain for a new key. They'll definitely give it to you.


You should just image the drive after the fresh install... then you could merely apply the image and do an update cycle for the latest hotfixes - and make a new image. I love PING for that (Partimage Is Not Ghost) - but there are plenty other options. Your way works perfectly however, so it's not a big deal but why even mess with the download/reboot cycles if you don't need to.









That's true about OEM copies - although usually with those there isn't activation at all - it comes autoactivated, it just won't install on a non-branded piece of hardware without hacking. That's the way all my Dell's have been (even though I've yet to run the OS that came with them other than for a week or so during testing/return period).









It's so true... nothing runs as well as a fresh installed OS... with as little software and drivers as possible. To me running long installs (1 year plus) is like wearing the same underwear for a week... and I don't know anyone that enjoys that (although I can't say for sure because I haven't actually tried it).


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The biggest reason why I reinstall Windows atleast once a month is because of driver updates and bloatware. As you use Windows updates, it causes buildup in your system. It's basically writing over old cold and sooner or later, it'll cause your system to slow down and you'll end up having a PC that lags even with the smallest task! That and I like keeping my system clean as possible.
> 
> Also, my Windows 7 installer is on a USB3.0 and it takes around 5 minutes for it to install Windows 7 onto the drive. My dad has this USB that I've been using for a long time, it downloads and updates all the Windows updates automatically and reboots and downloads more if there; normally it takes about 1 hour to finish it all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then I do the rest of Seans guide doing my drivers and everything and I'm done with a PC that's good as new.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And this is all when my PC is overclocked so it's even faster!
> 
> P.S. I think the reason why it doesn't show is because he probably bought an OEM OS. Microsoft OS's that aren't OEM can be used multiple times as long as there is only one PC using it at a single time. If it isn't OEM and you can't activate it, then you can contact Microsoft and complain for a new key. They'll definitely give it to you.
Click to expand...

You should just image the drive after the fresh install... then you could merely apply the image and do an update cycle for the latest hotfixes - and make a new image. I love PING for that (Partimage Is Not Ghost) - but there are plenty other options. Your way works perfectly however, so it's not a big deal but why even mess with the download/reboot cycles if you don't need to.









That's true about OEM copies - although usually with those there isn't activation at all - it comes autoactivated, it just won't install on a non-branded piece of hardware without hacking. That's the way all my Dell's have been (even though I've yet to run the OS that came with them other than for a week or so during testing/return period).









It's so true... nothing runs as well as a fresh installed OS... with as little software and drivers as possible. To me running long installs (1 year plus) is like wearing the same underwear for a week... and I don't know anyone that enjoys that (although I can't say for sure because I haven't actually tried it).









I would do an image since it is basically the same thing, just wiping it and putting those files in. It's fine that way but then if I installed the updates already in the image then my new installation will have old updates and end up having me update it again, causing overwrite.







I'm pretty particular when it comes to my installations! Hahahaha!

I used to have an OEM OS that I got from Fry's for my PC but then that happened, it didn't let me use it again after I reinstalled my PC. Luckily I got a job at my dad's office to fix a lot of computers and their networking and his boss gave me an Enterprise key good for 1000 PCs to install on their newly issued laptops. I still use it till now and have given it to friends.







I guess the only person who'd be fine with wearing the same underwear for a year is a shut-in. That or Valgaur. I mean, look at him. All he does now is sit in his house and bench and do LN2 runs. He's going to end up freezing random parts of his body so the moisture will keep him slightly clean.


----------



## lightsout

I will have my first delidded CPU in a couple days. Not my handy work. Getting it from a member here good chance it's already in this club. Thanks for all the info here.


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## outofmyheadyo

When im using CLP/CLU I need to cover the capacitors ( marked with red on the picture ) but should I bother with the things on the left hand side aswell ( marked with green ) or if the CLU/CLP gets anywhere near there its under the CPU aswell and inside the socket and then its game over anyways ?
Bought some clear nailpolish but im not all that sure if it works well for this or not. In not even 100% sure if its conductive or not ( the nailpolish ) but it shouldnt be.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> When im using CLP/CLU I need to cover the capacitors ( marked with red on the picture ) but should I bother with the things on the left hand side aswell ( marked with green ) or if the CLU/CLP gets anywhere near there its under the CPU aswell and inside the socket and then its game over anyways ?
> Bought some clear nailpolish but im not all that sure if it works well for this or not. In not even 100% sure if its conductive or not ( the nailpolish ) but it shouldnt be.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


The best thing to use is liquid electrical tape, if you don't have any you can use regular electrical tape. This would be for the part you have circled in red next to the dye.

The part in green doesn't need to be covered. Just be sure when you put the IHS back on, it doesn't touch those spots, could cause your cpu to short out


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> When im using CLP/CLU I need to cover the capacitors ( marked with red on the picture ) but should I bother with the things on the left hand side aswell ( marked with green ) or if the CLU/CLP gets anywhere near there its under the CPU aswell and inside the socket and then its game over anyways ?
> Bought some clear nailpolish but im not all that sure if it works well for this or not. In not even 100% sure if its conductive or not ( the nailpolish ) but it shouldnt be.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You can also just cover them with normal non-conductive thermal paste, like MX-4, if you don't want to use the nail polish.


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## DevilGear44

How long is the razor method taking everybody? I've been hacking at my 4770K for 2 and a half hours with a single edge razor, and I can't even get into a corner. Any advice? Also, due to my living situation the vice method is not an option.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DevilGear44*
> 
> How long is the razor method taking everybody? I've been hacking at my 4770K for 2 and a half hours with a single edge razor, and I can't even get into a corner. Any advice? Also, due to my living situation the vice method is not an option.


I'm gonna go and say it, if your living situation is that you can't use the vice method and that costs like $30, I don't think delidding is the option. Understanding you have a chance in killing the CPU and that's $300.


----------



## DevilGear44

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm gonna go and say it, if your living situation is that you can't use the vice method and that costs like $30, I don't think delidding is the option. Understanding you have a chance in killing the CPU and that's $300.


I live in a barracks room. I have nowhere to put a vise.


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## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DevilGear44*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I'm gonna go and say it, if your living situation is that you can't use the vice method and that costs like $30, I don't think delidding is the option. Understanding you have a chance in killing the CPU and that's $300.
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a barracks room. I have nowhere to put a vise.
Click to expand...

If that's the case, I recommend buying the vice, doing the delid and then returning it.







It'll be faster and easier. Especially if you have a Haswell CPU.


----------



## DevilGear44

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If that's the case, I recommend buying the vice, doing the delid and then returning it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It'll be faster and easier. Especially if you have a Haswell CPU.


Problem #2: I literally have nowhere to attach a vise to in my room.

Found the likely culprit; the razors get amazingly dull after only a few passes. I only found out how dull they were when I tried to slit my wrists and nothing happened.


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## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DevilGear44*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If that's the case, I recommend buying the vice, doing the delid and then returning it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It'll be faster and easier. Especially if you have a Haswell CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> Problem #2: I literally have nowhere to attach a vise to in my room.
> 
> Found the likely culprit; the razors get amazingly dull after only a few passes. I only found out how dull they were when I tried to slit my wrists and nothing happened.
Click to expand...

I guess that's the problem too, I don't think something that fails to cut skin will succeed in cutting adhesive.

Someone reverted my BIOS settings back to default and my PC became really unstable. I wonder why my OC settings at 4.8 and running at 1.27v runs prime for 12 hours but fails to run stock. The mysteries of OC...


----------



## Swag

SIGH.





































































































I know the reason why my overclock was failing and why default settings were unstable. Temps were crazy high and guess why... My H100i is broken. The pump is shot and I need to get it replaced ASAP. I'm currently using my backup cooler which is the D14 and temps are now back to a cool 28C. Well, tomorrow is shopping day for coolers I guess....



Look at that, I had thought the reason why my PC was overheating was my overclock so I lowered it... *God, I am maaaaad!* At 0.6%, I was hitting 80C; at 100% load, it was logging 105C and throttled to back down to stock speed in attempt to lower temperatures!


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## Magical Eskimo

Oh dayum, does your CPU still live?!


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## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magical Eskimo*
> 
> Oh dayum, does your CPU still live?!


Yea, it does. Luckily and when I go buy my new replacement cooler tomorrow, I'm going to re-evaluate my OC to see if there was any damage to my CPU, but so far it is running. I ain't really mad that the CPU got really hot, it's just that the H100i broke in like 4 months... $120 down the drain like that, I guess I'm gonna go for a quality product this time around. I wish it had broken during Christmas so I could have an excuse to buy full watercooling...


----------



## AlDyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DevilGear44*
> 
> How long is the razor method taking everybody? I've been hacking at my 4770K for 2 and a half hours with a single edge razor, and I can't even get into a corner. Any advice? Also, due to my living situation the vice method is not an option.


I just put the vice on the floor and hit the CPU. Maybe a bit fatalist, but worked


----------



## Mogwaii

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DevilGear44*
> 
> How long is the razor method taking everybody? I've been hacking at my 4770K for 2 and a half hours with a single edge razor, and I can't even get into a corner. Any advice? Also, due to my living situation the vice method is not an option.


My i5 3570k took me about 30min with razor method.

My new i7 3770k took me about 10-15sec with wize hammer method.


----------



## DevilGear44

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> I just put the vice on the floor and hit the CPU. Maybe a bit fatalist, but worked


Glad to hear - I'll definitely be doing this then. Thanks!


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## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> SIGH.
> 
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> 
> I know the reason why my overclock was failing and why default settings were unstable. Temps were crazy high and guess why... My H100i is broken. The pump is shot and I need to get it replaced ASAP. I'm currently using my backup cooler which is the D14 and temps are now back to a cool 28C. Well, tomorrow is shopping day for coolers I guess....
> 
> 
> 
> Look at that, I had thought the reason why my PC was overheating was my overclock so I lowered it... *God, I am maaaaad!* At 0.6%, I was hitting 80C; at 100% load, it was logging 105C and throttled to back down to stock speed in attempt to lower temperatures!


That totally sucks. I have an h80i and its been great. I'd be so mad if it died.... so I feel your frustration.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DevilGear44*
> 
> Glad to hear - I'll definitely be doing this then. Thanks!


After having done the vice method I would never attempt a razor blade again. No way.

I actually used a furniture clamp to remove mine, not a vice. But it worked the same way, although I think the vice would probably be a little better. Still, it came off without issue or any problems.

The furniture clamp (mine are very heavy duty) clamps the IHS same as the vice does. Then I clamped the whole thing down to the table and used a 2x4 and hammer to remove the pcb. Did all this over carpet so if it came flying out it wouldn't hit a hard floor but carpet (which it did).


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, it does. Luckily and when I go buy my new replacement cooler tomorrow, I'm going to re-evaluate my OC to see if there was any damage to my CPU, but so far it is running. I ain't really mad that the CPU got really hot, it's just that the H100i broke in like 4 months... $120 down the drain like that, I guess I'm gonna go for a quality product this time around. I wish it had broken during Christmas so I could have an excuse to buy full watercooling...


How many time it was at 105c? I've hit something like 100c 5 or 6 times. The first was 103 when doing a wprime at 4,8 GHz and insane voltage. The second and third was when mounting my wc setup,the pump didn't work so the wb had not dissipation. The fourth and fifth time was when i was mounting my H60 wich had broken mounting screws,so i had just 2 screws and it wasn't tigh enough to make the wb touch the cpu. Last time was when i was mounting the cpu after delidd,forgot about the 3 pin connector of the H60 pump,but that time magicly the temperature was 30c at bios,lol.

From this i can tell you that if it was much time you were having that temps prob. you haven't killed your cpu but you have degraded it,so it won't reach the same voltages as before. I was doing 4,4 GHz at -0,10 Offset and now its +0,10 lol.


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## Valgaur

thats why I think the H100i is much worse than the H100 honestly.... every time a "new" version of something comes out that kicked butt it either stinks or breaks randomly thats the 4th H100i I have heard of doing that in under a month from people i personally know.....


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## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DevilGear44*
> 
> Glad to hear - I'll definitely be doing this then. Thanks!


i put my vice on the floor, leaned to the wall and my wife step on both sides of the vice and i hit the cpu was very easy


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## neofury

@Swag, I doubt you damaged your CPU. Pretty sure voltage will do a lot more damage than a little heat here and there. I think TJMax is 105 for a reason, they know it won't do any damage as long as it doesn't surpass 105. I've had some CPU's in the past running very hot for extended periods of time and never had a CPU die on me from heat.

My current CPU on the other hand, not too sure. I've tried adding more voltage to no avail. I've decided to drop back down to stock for the time being









Worst part is the cooling is just fine, I think the voltage (1.45v) caused degradation though


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## outofmyheadyo

I just bought my vice from the hardware store for 7eur, attached it to my computer table and poped the lid of with few swift blows =)
Here are a few pictures of the process cooler is Noctua NH-D14 + 1x Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v
And yes i know im not using the linx with avx enabled, but still you can see the decent temp drops vs default vs delid + NT-H1 vs delid + clp +nth1
I didnt use CLP between the IHS and Cooler because i have plans to change the NH-D14 to something better in a few days and i didnt want to mess with the CLP cleanup for a few days worth of usage.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







4770K @ 4500 @ NOMOD @ 1.270v ( IHS -> NT-H1 -> Noctua NH-D14 + Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Temp @ 4500 @ DELID @ 1.270v (core -> NT-H1 -> IHS -> NT-H1 -> Noctua NH-D14 + Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







4770K @ 4500 @ DELID @ 1.270v ( core -> CLP -> IHS > NT-H1 -> Noctua NH-D14 + Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







@ finally tools of the trade =)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



[/spoile]


----------



## Loktar Ogar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> I just bought my vice from the hardware store for 7eur, attached it to my computer table and poped the lid of with few swift blows =)
> Here are a few pictures of the process cooler is Noctua NH-D14 + 1x Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v
> And yes i know im not using the linx with avx enabled, but still you can see the decent temp drops vs default vs delid + NT-H1 vs delid + clp +nth1
> I didnt use CLP between the IHS and Cooler because i have plans to change the NH-D14 to something better in a few days and i didnt want to mess with the CLP cleanup for a few days worth of usage.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
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> 4770K @ 4500 @ NOMOD @ 1.270v ( IHS -> NT-H1 -> Noctua NH-D14 + Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
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> Temp @ 4500 @ DELID @ 1.270v (core -> NT-H1 -> IHS -> NT-H1 -> Noctua NH-D14 + Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v
> 
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> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
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> 4770K @ 4500 @ DELID @ 1.270v ( core -> CLP -> IHS > NT-H1 -> Noctua NH-D14 + Noctua NF-P12 @ 5v
> 
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> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
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> @ finally tools of the trade =)
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> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
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> [/spoile]


Good job! Very detailed.


----------



## Ovrclck

What a incredible difference with CLP!







Proof in the pudding.


----------



## Cyro999

His delidded temperatures are worse than my non-delidded ones.. o.0


----------



## THEStorm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Yea, it does. Luckily and when I go buy my new replacement cooler tomorrow, I'm going to re-evaluate my OC to see if there was any damage to my CPU, but so far it is running. I ain't really mad that the CPU got really hot, it's just that the H100i broke in like 4 months... $120 down the drain like that, I guess I'm gonna go for a quality product this time around. I wish it had broken during Christmas so I could have an excuse to buy full watercooling...


I would suggest warranting your H100i. I just warrantied my H100 (after 2 years in use, but they have a 5 year warranty) and got back a H100i. Had no issues warranting though. That or this may be a good opportunity to make your own custom loop







.

Lots of good info in here, I just picked up a 3770k that I after I test to ensure it's working properly (waiting on my last couple parts to finish the build) I will be delidding I am sure as I am used to temps under 60 at full load on my 2500k at 4.5. I will definitely be using the vise method, and have already ordered my CLU.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> His delidded temperatures are worse than my non-delidded ones.. o.0


You must have gotten a decent IHS mount from Intel. You're the exception to the rule fo sho.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> You must have gotten a decent IHS mount from Intel. You're the exception to the rule fo sho.


I don't think so, other people i talked to have comparable temps. I think setting VRIN etc maybe has a significant effect on temps, ~1.7-1.75vrin for close to 1.3vcore load isn't good (dunno if he fixed that yet)

96c for 1.27v linpack > without avx < ?

That seems terrible to me, really really terrible. My non delid temps are better than his delid temps and ive seen people beating me by 25c with delid and clc's. I'm confused - the NH-D14 fans are 5-volted with worse ambients and also worse airflow than me or something?


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I don't think so, other people i talked to have comparable temps. I think setting VRIN etc maybe has a significant effect on temps, ~1.7-1.75vrin for close to 1.3vcore load isn't good (dunno if he fixed that yet)


VRIN? maybe I'm doing this wrong too?

What is it? I knew about setting the PLL down, but hadn't heard of this...


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I don't think so, other people i talked to have comparable temps. I think setting VRIN etc maybe has a significant effect on temps, ~1.7-1.75vrin for close to 1.3vcore load isn't good (dunno if he fixed that yet)
> 
> 96c for 1.27v linpack > without avx < ?
> 
> That seems terrible to me, really really terrible. My non delid temps are better than his delid temps and ive seen people beating me by 25c with delid and clc's. I'm confused - the NH-D14 fans are 5-volted with worse ambients and also worse airflow than me or something?


All of the 3 fans I have in my case are running @ 5v ( 2x Fractal design R2 140mm ( 1 front intake 1 back exhaust) + 1x Noctua NF-P12 @ the Noctua )
My Vrin is @ default wich is 1.760 as it turns out, i did manually set core volt to 1.270 thats about all ive done + the uncore to 34


----------



## battleaxe

My BIOS doesn't have VRIN. So guess I didn't miss anything.


----------



## Cyro999

IVR input voltage is for haswell, sandy doesn't even have an IVR
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> All of the 3 fans I have in my case are running @ 5v ( 2x Fractal design R2 140mm ( 1 front intake 1 back exhaust) + 1x Noctua NF-P12 @ the Noctua )
> My Vrin is @ default wich is 1.760 as it turns out, i did manually set core volt to 1.270 thats about all ive done + the uncore to 34


no wonder you have terrible temps, bad setting and cooling


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I cant really stand using my pc if i can hear it, but about the settings i should check the haswell oc thread


----------



## Swag

Yea, I know. I don't think my CPU got damaged at all, I'm just really mad at this annoying problem.

I'm going to buy another cooler today so we'll see how it fairs.


----------



## Chomuco

NEW cpuz 1.67







CPU-Z 1.67 ®

http://valid.canardpc.com/ukqkdv

http://www.cpuid.com/medias/files/softwares/cpu-z/cpu-z_1.67-setup-en.exe

http://www.cpuid.com/medias/files/softwares/cpu-z/cpu-z_1.67-en.zip


----------



## Cyro999

^It's labeling VID as "core voltage" for me (version 1.67)

back to 1.64.0 which reads vcore properly like hwinfo on my board (giga)


----------



## Chomuco

nice! my asus hero !










http://gyazo.com/69d71a96e16c3e8eaae0c3124b5512a9.png


----------



## Swag

Well, I decided to just buy another H100i and return it. I can't afford to spend too much right now since I'm trying to save up for something.







Holidays are coming up so money is very important right now!

Temps are better and they're idling at a cool 25C.







So happy right now!


----------



## Quamba

OCN name:quamba
CPU:i7 3770k
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

will post the rest when able. doing this from my laptop so bear with me. decided to LAPP and delidd my 3770k at the same time , inclued pics, enjoy, will update wiht pics afterdry time


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quamba*
> 
> OCN name:quamba
> CPU:i7 3770k
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> will post the rest when able. doing this from my laptop so bear with me. decided to LAPP and delidd my 3770k at the same time , inclued pics, enjoy, will update wiht pics afterdry time


You're in for now just let me know when to update you! Slappa dat sig on!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quamba*
> 
> OCN name:quamba
> CPU:i7 3770k
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> will post the rest when able. doing this from my laptop so bear with me. decided to LAPP and delidd my 3770k at the same time , inclued pics, enjoy, will update wiht pics afterdry time
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I'm confused... you delidded your chip with a moving truck? I can't seem to find a chip, vise, or hammer anywhere in that pic... maybe it's the wrong one?


----------



## Swag

Oh yes!


Spoiler: In her birthday suit







And:


Spoiler: Oh, my beautiful Venus!


----------



## Quamba

was a little tipsy when i posted thoes pics last night, here are the real ones...


----------



## tttttc

hey guys, I was trying to delid my 3570k last night using the blade method. My cpu has been in the socket for 1+ yr. I could not see any visible gap/weak spot between the PCB and IHS, so I just picked one corner. .... I was using a single-edge safety razor, was very difficult to pry in, and once I am ~1mm in (seriously), I tried to wiggle the blade, but the blade didn't go further, and that apparently left some mark/indentation on the PCB, so I stopped.

Here's my thought, are unmounted cpu's easier to delid than mounted because the heat of cpu and pressure of the retention bracket may cause the adhesive to become more spread out over time (1+ yr)?

I may try using a double-edge razor blade (thinner ones), but I doubt it... the other three corners won't budge at all with the single-edge razor... I was astonished seeing people delid with an even thicker utility knife...

so here's the question: do you think I should go with the vice method? But I guess if it's really because increased adhesion, then the vice method won't be easy either...

let me know what you think and thanks in advance!


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tttttc*
> 
> hey guys, I was trying to delid my 3570k last night using the blade method. My cpu has been in the socket for 1+ yr. I could not see any visible gap/weak spot between the PCB and IHS, so I just picked one corner. .... I was using a single-edge safety razor, was very difficult to pry in, and once I am ~1mm in (seriously), I tried to wiggle the blade, but the blade didn't go further, and that apparently left some mark/indentation on the PCB, so I stopped.
> 
> Here's my thought, are unmounted cpu's easier to delid than mounted because the heat of cpu and pressure of the retention bracket may cause the adhesive to become more spread out over time (1+ yr)?
> 
> I may try using a double-edge razor blade (thinner ones), but I doubt it... the other three corners won't budge at all with the single-edge razor... I was astonished seeing people delid with an even thicker utility knife...
> 
> so here's the question: do you think I should go with the vice method? But I guess if it's really because increased adhesion, then the vice method won't be easy either...
> 
> let me know what you think and thanks in advance!


if you love your cpu go with the vice


----------



## tttttc

Quote:
Originally Posted by tttttc View Post

hey guys, I was trying to delid my 3570k last night using the blade method. My cpu has been in the socket for 1+ yr. I could not see any visible gap/weak spot between the PCB and IHS, so I just picked one corner. .... I was using a single-edge safety razor, was very difficult to pry in, and once I am ~1mm in (seriously), I tried to wiggle the blade, but the blade didn't go further, and that apparently left some mark/indentation on the PCB, so I stopped.

Here's my thought, are unmounted cpu's easier to delid than mounted because the heat of cpu and pressure of the retention bracket may cause the adhesive to become more spread out over time (1+ yr)?

I may try using a double-edge razor blade (thinner ones), but I doubt it... the other three corners won't budge at all with the single-edge razor... I was astonished seeing people delid with an even thicker utility knife...

so here's the question: do you think I should go with the vice method? But I guess if it's really because increased adhesion, then the vice method won't be easy either...

let me know what you think and thanks in advance!
if you love your cpu go with the vice

thank you very much!

Anyone else would like to weigh in? (sorry, messed up with the quote function)


----------



## outofmyheadyo

razor vs vice is like taking the stairs to the top of Burj Khalifa vs the elevator, both can be done but i choose the elevator.


----------



## deepor

Think about how the vise method works theoretically, if you can explain what each part of it does and why you need it. This will make you feel confident about the method.

There's the vise, attaching it to a table or putting it next to a wall, where exactly it clamps onto the CPU, a piece of hard wood, a hammer, something to keep PCB from flying off.


----------



## tttttc

Any thought on delidding a brand new vs mounted cpu? Are mounted cpu's usually more difficult/tighter, or is mine just sealed really well in the first place?


----------



## Quamba

so epic fail, cpu lid shifted sometime while i was sleeping, glue shorted the contacts at the bottom of the chip. time to get another cpu ...


----------



## outofmyheadyo

how did the cpu lid move if its clamped in by the socket clamp?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> how did the cpu lid move if its clamped in by the socket clamp?


Must be the bit of slide when the latch was clamped down, that thing is tight, it would be hard to force the thing to move once it is clamped down.

Glue should have kept it from moving either way though. Quamba did you use some black silicone or some kind of form-a gasket stuff & clamp it on wet? Most of that kind of stuff is an insulator (when dry at least), conductive silicone, etc. can be found but not usually in hardware stores.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Must be the bit of slide when the latch was clamped down, that thing is tight, it would be hard to force the thing to move once it is clamped down.
> 
> Glue should have kept it from moving either way though. Quamba did you use some black silicone or some kind of form-a gasket stuff & clamp it on wet? Most of that kind of stuff is an insulator (when dry at least), conductive silicone, etc. can be found but not usually in hardware stores.


agreed silicon usually isn't conductive even especially in paste form for electronics. what q-code are you getting quam?


----------



## Chomuco

new ,delidded ! woww

http://www.overclock.net/t/1413905/official-asus-maximus-vi-hero-owners-and-overclocking-club/520#post_20976228

http://www.overclock.net/t/1413905/official-asus-maximus-vi-hero-owners-and-overclocking-club/520#post_20976345


----------



## DevilGear44

Thanks to the advice here, I bought a small clamp on vise and remorselessly whacked the IHS off my chip, and she lives!

4.4GHz @ 1.2v, idles at 30, stresses at 70-80, and normal gaming is 50-60. And this is on a single 240mm rad shared with a GTX 780. Very impressed.


----------



## tttttc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tttttc*
> 
> hey guys, I was trying to delid my 3570k last night using the blade method. My cpu has been in the socket for 1+ yr. I could not see any visible gap/weak spot between the PCB and IHS, so I just picked one corner. .... I was using a single-edge safety razor, was very difficult to pry in, and once I am ~1mm in (seriously), I tried to wiggle the blade, but the blade didn't go further, and that apparently left some mark/indentation on the PCB, so I stopped.
> 
> Here's my thought, are unmounted cpu's easier to delid than mounted because the heat of cpu and pressure of the retention bracket may cause the adhesive to become more spread out over time (1+ yr)?
> 
> I may try using a double-edge razor blade (thinner ones), but I doubt it... the other three corners won't budge at all with the single-edge razor... I was astonished seeing people delid with an even thicker utility knife...
> 
> so here's the question: do you think I should go with the vice method? But I guess if it's really because increased adhesion, then the vice method won't be easy either...
> 
> let me know what you think and thanks in advance!


Today I used the vice/hammer method. Felt much more comfortable with the procedure. Long live the guy who came up with this method! Especially if you have a chip that is particularly well-sealed, vice is the only way to go.


----------



## Quamba

yea it was totally my fault. as i kinda mentioned i wasn't totally sober when i did it and used a different type of glue when i put it back together and it slipped when i clamped it back down and in that state i didn't realize what i had just done, so eh, lessons learned...


----------



## WheelZ0713

Hey guys, just a quick question.

I'm consider delidding my Haswell 4770K but i can't seem to find any of the cool lab products in Australia.

Are any of these suitable for using between the die and the heatspreader?
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=207_163&zenid=f646a6fb2b9813950c4db0f6c2994f8b

Also, what is the best option to use to hold the heat spreader back on the cpu itself?

Thanks


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> Hey guys, just a quick question.
> 
> I'm consider delidding my Haswell 4770K but i can't seem to find any of the cool lab products in Australia.
> 
> Are any of these suitable for using between the die and the heatspreader?
> http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=207_163&zenid=f646a6fb2b9813950c4db0f6c2994f8b
> 
> Also, what is the best option to use to hold the heat spreader back on the cpu itself?
> 
> Thanks


I am a fan of the Gelid extreme, it comes with EK's kits (that says something in itself), I installed it with my naked ivy kit, and it was only a couple Cs hotter than CLU, and it took me several applications to get the CLU to get those few Cs. I cant speak for the longevity of it, but it did a fine job for a couple weeks.


----------



## rossb

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> I'm consider delidding my Haswell 4770K but i can't seem to find any of the cool lab products in Australia.


I just ordered some CLP here:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=171149517783


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rossb*
> 
> I just ordered some CLP here:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=171149517783


You should have gone with CLU instead, unless you plan on putting new paste every 2 months, maybe more often.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> You should have gone with CLU instead, unless you plan on putting new paste every 2 months, maybe more often.


clu lasts longer ?!

i heard it hardness and loses it's heat conductivity after 1 year of use ...


----------



## tw33k

I've had CLU on my main CPU for over 12 months. When I installed my water loop a few weeks ago, the CLU was like brand new. I just used a brush and made sure it was spread nice and even. My temps are still great.


----------



## dixson01974

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dixson01974*
> 
> Yep. Plus you can use them on other CPU Blocks too.
> This is with the EK naked ivy mount with my XSPC cpu block.


It's naked now.


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I've had CLU on my main CPU for over 12 months. When I installed my water loop a few weeks ago, the CLU was like brand new. I just used a brush and made sure it was spread nice and even. My temps are still great.


He said he ordered CLP, not CLU, CLP is known to get hard over time


----------



## outofmyheadyo

How often should I reapply CLP? I delided my 4770K like a week ago and plan on switching from my Noctua NH-D14 to the EK naked ivy kit + EK supremacy block, i quess i should order some CLU?


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> He said he ordered CLP, not CLU, CLP is known to get hard over time


CL*P* -- I've been running a 24/7 OC with ambients constantly around 30C for 7 months so far and haven't noticed any temperature degradation, yet.

If it does, harden, does that mean you could possibly damage the die if you tried to remove the IHS? Should I take it off now and reapply before too much time passes?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> CL*P* -- I've been running a 24/7 OC with ambients constantly around 30C for 7 months so far and haven't noticed any temperature degradation, yet.
> 
> If it does, harden, does that mean you could possibly damage the die if you tried to remove the IHS? Should I take it off now and reapply before too much time passes?


Does it harden on the die? I think it needs some other metal to do that and the die is silicon. If I understood it right, your IHS will look ugly but that won't matter for performance.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> CL*P* -- I've been running a 24/7 OC with ambients constantly around 30C for 7 months so far and haven't noticed any temperature degradation, yet.
> 
> If it does, harden, does that mean you could possibly damage the die if you tried to remove the IHS? Should I take it off now and reapply before too much time passes?


Mine was hardened at around 8 to 10 months, can't remember exactly and temps were up by atleast 30C from what they used to be.
Pics in here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/190#post_20966043


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Mine was hardened at around 8 to 10 months, can't remember exactly and temps were up by atleast 30C from what they used to be.
> Pics in here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/190#post_20966043












Well damn, looks like your application was solid....

I'll have to start monitoring my temps again and keep a close eye on it, thank you for posting.

Looks like Frozen has some in-stock, I might order some because I have been meaning to change from pk3 to mx4 on the cooler as well.


----------



## lilchronic

just reapplied the clp on my 3570k, it was completely dried up. but temps were still good
skipped putting clp between the ihs and waterblock cause i was to lazy to take another 10 minutes to spread it


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just reapplied the clp on my 3570k, it was completely dried up. but temps were still good
> skipped putting clp between the ihs and waterblock cause i was to lazy to take another 10 minutes to spread it


as far as i can see from here thats alot clp


----------



## Solonowarion

That looks like so much clp. Do you apply clp differently tha clu?


----------



## inedenimadam

I have to agree with everyone, there is enough juice on that die to cover both sides twice.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*


Way too much CLP.

You only need a drop about 1/4 the size of your drop and you can use the same drop to cover the die and the area on the block that makes contact with it.

This drop that I put on my HD7950 that has a larger die size than your IB cpu was more than enough to cover my die and block area.


----------



## WheelZ0713

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rossb*
> 
> I just ordered some CLP here:
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=171149517783


Rad, thanks for that. on it.


----------



## mxthunder

LOL I de lidded a Pentium D tonight and it had a soldiered on IHS!

I got my hands on a crap ton of them from work to practice on for when I get an Ivy Bridge CPU.

It was super easy using the vice method. my vice wasnt even bolted down to the bench!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> as far as i can see from here thats alot clp


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> That looks like so much clp. Do you apply clp differently tha clu?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have to agree with everyone, there is enough juice on that die to cover both sides twice.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Way too much CLP.
> 
> You only need a drop about 1/4 the size of your drop and you can use the same drop to cover the die and the area on the block that makes contact with it.
> 
> This drop that I put on my HD7950 that has a larger die size than your IB cpu was more than enough to cover my die and block area.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


thats how i want it, used the same amount last time and it dried up over 6 months.
all of the clp stayed on the die and didnt run off....... so yall can say it looks like too much but to me its just right


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Worth delidding an i3-4130? I've delidded all my previous IB chips (2 3770Ks and 2 3570K's). Now I'm building a custom NUS device in an mini-ITX case that has little to no air flow near the CPU/motherboard. Wondering if it would be in my best interest to delid this i3 I just got for the build.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Worth delidding an i3-4130? I've delidded all my previous IB chips (2 3770Ks and 2 3570K's). Now I'm building a custom NUS device in an mini-ITX case that has little to no air flow near the CPU/motherboard. Wondering if it would be in my best interest to delid this i3 I just got for the build.


Can't overclock it so my answer is no. Unless it's reaching temps over 90, then there is no point.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Can't overclock it so my answer is no. Unless it's reaching temps over 90, then there is no point.


I figured so but I wanted to determine this before I installed it because it's a pain in the butt to install/un-install the mobo/cpu in this case. I guess I'll just have to see how it goes.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Can't overclock it so my answer is no. Unless it's reaching temps over 90, then there is no point.
> 
> 
> 
> I figured so but I wanted to determine this before I installed it because it's a pain in the butt to install/un-install the mobo/cpu in this case. I guess I'll just have to see how it goes.
Click to expand...

Don't even think of letting it temp you because honestly, if you end up with a dead chip, it's going to be worse!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Worth delidding an i3-4130? I've delidded all my previous IB chips (2 3770Ks and 2 3570K's). Now I'm building a custom NUS device in an mini-ITX case that has little to no air flow near the CPU/motherboard. Wondering if it would be in my best interest to delid this i3 I just got for the build.


The amount of heat you have coming out the CPU is still the same. With delidding it just gets put into the case faster. The air in the case should be the same temperature after a while.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> The amount of heat you have coming out the CPU is still the same. With delidding it just gets put into the case faster. The air in the case should be the same temperature after a while.


Good point. I'm going to have to monitor my CPU and MB temps closely.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> I've had CLU on my main CPU for over 12 months. When I installed my water loop a few weeks ago, the CLU was like brand new. I just used a brush and made sure it was spread nice and even. My temps are still great.


^^^ very similar observation...was adding some bits to the w-c loop on the deliided 3770K Ivy w/CLU - was just as I left it back late last winter (CL/U on both on die and on IHS)...similar experience w/3970x that has CL/U on the IHS


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> The amount of heat you have coming out the CPU is still the same. With delidding it just gets put into the case faster. The air in the case should be the same temperature after a while.


While technically true - that is the whole point. I actually delidded one of my crap (OC-wise) 3570Ks just for this very purpose. It's actually running underclocked and undervolted in an HTPC. However, the point of delidding is to make the IHS and cooler more efficient - whether this has more to do with better TIM (or TIM application) or simply by reducing the gap created by the IHS glue is a matter of conjecture - but the efficiency gained is certainly not.

Unless there is absolutely no air movement/exchange and the chassis used is somehow a perfect insulator (which any metal certainly is not) it will still net you better on-die temps to have the heat away from the CPU rather than trapped in it. I would also argue that it's inherently _less_ of a 'risk' (financially speaking) to do this to cheaper CPUs - especially ivy i3's which can currently be purchased at a pretty deep discount.

As with anything YMMV - but I say delid everything that you're planning on keeping close to EOL for the tech anyway.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> The amount of heat you have coming out the CPU is still the same. With delidding it just gets put into the case faster. The air in the case should be the same temperature after a while.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> While technically true - that is the whole point. I actually delidded one of my crap (OC-wise) 3570Ks just for this very purpose. It's actually running underclocked and undervolted in an HTPC. However, the point of delidding is to make the IHS and cooler more efficient - whether this has more to do with better TIM (or TIM application) or simply by reducing the gap created by the IHS glue is a matter of conjecture - but the efficiency gained is certainly not.
> 
> Unless there is absolutely no air movement/exchange and the chassis used is somehow a perfect insulator (which any metal certainly is not) it will still net you better on-die temps to have the heat away from the CPU rather than trapped in it. I would also argue that it's inherently _less_ of a 'risk' (financially speaking) to do this to cheaper CPUs - especially ivy i3's which can currently be purchased at a pretty deep discount.
> 
> As with anything YMMV - but I say delid everything that you're planning on keeping close to EOL for the tech anyway.


Here is the space issues I'm dealing with:




However you can see that if I put my HSF in a pull orientation it would pull the hot air away from the cooler and towards the rear exhausts.



So maybe it would still make sense to delid if I could effectively remove the heat through using a pull orientation with the fan instead of a push.


----------



## Darkcon

Just delidded my i5-3570K besides some minor bumps(tiny) on the ihs(which i sanded off anyway with a fine grit) from the bad vice I was using, it went really well and easy, not a mark or scratch on the die/pcb

waiting on the motherboard now, I'll test it and post results


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PuffinMyLye*
> 
> Here is the space issues I'm dealing with:
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> However you can see that if I put my HSF in a pull orientation it would pull the hot air away from the cooler and towards the rear exhausts.
> 
> 
> 
> So maybe it would still make sense to delid if I could effectively remove the heat through using a pull orientation with the fan instead of a push.


Yep... I think that would make the most sense by far... and although tight - you will have plenty of air movement. That case is really hard to wrap my mind around for a couple of reasons, but it seems like you've got a perpendicular ITX layout on the side, micro PSU located above the drive array and (at a guess) there are louvered sections on the panel that covers the chassis that handles intake volume? I do hope that it's not going to be in a terribly dusty environment... or that you'll have dust covers for the outside. With that much negative pressure it is going to act like an air filter for whatever space it's located in.









One other possibility might be to reverse the exhaust fans to be intake fans, and simply filter the back of the case. The drives are getting a ton of cooling (and they don't really need it unless you're using 15KRPM SAS drives) while the MB & CPU get almost nothing. I still think you're probably better off delidded, but the thing you might need to test - which sucks in that tight space (as you correctly stated in your first post) is what the MB temps are without active cooling. It's too bad you don't have the space for something along these lines:


That way the RAM and chipset are actively cooled as much as possible. It's hard to tell the exact amount of space you have to work with but obviously even something that small (58mm tall) would require at least losing the rightmost HDD slot... and possibly modding the carrier frame edge to have a small cutout for it. I think your case is much more designed for boards with embedded CPU/cooling solutions like this one - so even an i3 is much more wattage than I think the designers were anticipating. Although if you at least got the i3-4130T (35W TDP vs 54W TDP on the non-"T" SKU) you'd be closer to being good.


----------



## PuffinMyLye

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Yep... I think that would make the most sense by far... and although tight - you will have plenty of air movement. That case is really hard to wrap my mind around for a couple of reasons, but it seems like you've got a perpendicular ITX layout on the side, micro PSU located above the drive array and (at a guess) there are louvered sections on the panel that covers the chassis that handles intake volume? I do hope that it's not going to be in a terribly dusty environment... or that you'll have dust covers for the outside. With that much negative pressure it is going to act like an air filter for whatever space it's located in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One other possibility might be to reverse the exhaust fans to be intake fans, and simply filter the back of the case. The drives are getting a ton of cooling (and they don't really need it unless you're using 15KRPM SAS drives) while the MB & CPU get almost nothing. I still think you're probably better off delidded, but the thing you might need to test - which sucks in that tight space (as you correctly stated in your first post) is what the MB temps are without active cooling. It's too bad you don't have the space for something along these lines:
> 
> 
> That way the RAM and chipset are actively cooled as much as possible. It's hard to tell the exact amount of space you have to work with but obviously even something that small (58mm tall) would require at least losing the rightmost HDD slot... and possibly modding the carrier frame edge to have a small cutout for it. I think your case is much more designed for boards with embedded CPU/cooling solutions like this one - so even an i3 is much more wattage than I think the designers were anticipating. Although if you at least got the i3-4130T (35W TDP vs 54W TDP on the non-"T" SKU) you'd be closer to being good.


Hmmmm you've given me more to consider as I have all my parts but they're unopened. I went with the i3-4130 originally because I wanted a little juice to run my ZFS scrubs at a decent rate however this heat issue now is giving me second thoughts.

I'll be using all 8 HDD trays so modding the case really isn't an option. It's just a matter of if my 4130 will put too much heat into the case or not.


----------



## morencyam

Is there anyone using the phobya liquid metal TIM? I know it doesn't perform quite as well as CLU and CLP, but what are your thoughts on it. I'm just a little curious as to why it's about $10 cheaper than CLU and CLP.


----------



## tw33k

answered here


----------



## Hereisphilly

Long time lurker here guys, thought I would post my 1st post in this thread!
I'm gearing up for my 1st all out custom watercooling build, got all the gear, just waiting for my phanteks enthoo primo case to be released.

Got an ek supremacy, i5-4670k and Really tempted by the vice method, as it seems the easiest for me
My question is, has anyone had experience with the naked ivy mount for it, or would it be better to put the IHS back on?

From my reading not putting the IHS back on makes sure that I put the right load on the die without fear of using a buckled IHS, but if I use the naked mount I have to remove the socket retention clip, so there is a greater risk of bent pins.

Anyone have any reccomendations?
When I get it all plumbed in in a few weeks, I'll post my temps before delidding!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Long time lurker here guys, thought I would post my 1st post in this thread!
> I'm gearing up for my 1st all out custom watercooling build, got all the gear, just waiting for my phanteks enthoo primo case to be released.
> 
> Got an ek supremacy, i5-4670k and Really tempted by the vice method, as it seems the easiest for me
> My question is, has anyone had experience with the naked ivy mount for it, or would it be better to put the IHS back on?
> 
> From my reading not putting the IHS back on makes sure that I put the right load on the die without fear of using a buckled IHS, but if I use the naked mount I have to remove the socket retention clip, so there is a greater risk of bent pins.
> 
> Anyone have any reccomendations?
> When I get it all plumbed in in a few weeks, I'll post my temps before delidding!


I have one generation earlier supremacy naked mount. It was also my first build. the buckle problem only arises if you dont remount the backplate after taking the stock retention bracket back on. It is in the instructions, so any body that is suffering buckle on the pcb didn't do their homework. As far as mounting the supremacy block itself, the install is exactly the same as the regular supremacy just with slightly shorter standoffs. The only extra detail is that you need to make sure you turn opposite corners when you are tightening it. But it is designed to be completely tightend, so if your hands stop turning at roughly the same time, then you did just fine.

I think with the VRMs (?) on the pcb people are suggesting LET to help prevent shorts (which should not happen if you get the mount right). or you could just stick a piece of electrical tape over it.


----------



## Hereisphilly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have one generation earlier supremacy naked mount. It was also my first build. the buckle problem only arises if you dont remount the backplate after taking the stock retention bracket back on. It is in the instructions, so any body that is suffering buckle on the pcb didn't do their homework. As far as mounting the supremacy block itself, the install is exactly the same as the regular supremacy just with slightly shorter standoffs. The only extra detail is that you need to make sure you turn opposite corners when you are tightening it. But it is designed to be completely tightend, so if your hands stop turning at roughly the same time, then you did just fine.
> 
> I think with the VRMs (?) on the pcb people are suggesting LET to help prevent shorts (which should not happen if you get the mount right). or you could just stick a piece of electrical tape over it.


Cool, thanks for that! So you recon its better than using the IHS and messing around with clu?
I figured its a good option as I have the right compatible block, and its only costs £3!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have one generation earlier supremacy naked mount. It was also my first build. the buckle problem only arises if you dont remount the backplate after taking the stock retention bracket back on. It is in the instructions, so any body that is suffering buckle on the pcb didn't do their homework. As far as mounting the supremacy block itself, the install is exactly the same as the regular supremacy just with slightly shorter standoffs. The only extra detail is that you need to make sure you turn opposite corners when you are tightening it. But it is designed to be completely tightend, so if your hands stop turning at roughly the same time, then you did just fine.
> 
> I think with the VRMs (?) on the pcb people are suggesting LET to help prevent shorts (which should not happen if you get the mount right). or you could just stick a piece of electrical tape over it.
> 
> 
> 
> Cool, thanks for that! So you recon its better than using the IHS and messing around with clu?
> I figured its a good option as I have the right compatible block, and its only costs £3!
Click to expand...

I came from a cheap zalman air cooler and it took me a minute to realize that P95 was in fact working, because I was so used to temps in the 80-90 range that I couldn't fathom that under load I wouldn't see 50C....EVER. I dont know how much of that is due to the naked+ supremacy vs. supremacy alone, because I installed both the supremacy and naked at the same time, but the end result was only 5 minutes and 5 dollars to install over the supremacy alone. Going naked removes a thick chunk of copper and an extra layer of thermal compound from the equation, I cant give you a precise number as to what that does to temperatures, but judging by how much even just a bad thermal application can skyrocket (looking at you intel!) temps, I am 100% sure that the naked kit has a large chunk to do with how small my delta temps are.


----------



## Hereisphilly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I came from a cheap zalman air cooler and it took me a minute to realize that P95 was in fact working, because I was so used to temps in the 80-90 range that I couldn't fathom that under load I wouldn't see 50C....EVER. I dont know how much of that is due to the naked+ supremacy vs. supremacy alone, because I installed both the supremacy and naked at the same time, but the end result was only 5 minutes and 5 dollars to install over the supremacy alone. Going naked removes a thick chunk of copper and an extra layer of thermal compound from the equation, I cant give you a precise number as to what that does to temperatures, but judging by how much even just a bad thermal application can skyrocket (looking at you intel!) temps, I am 100% sure that the naked kit has a large chunk to do with how small my delta temps are.


Repped you for that, cheers! Goons get it ordered along with my last rad, and then get back to you guys on my temps
No problems with bent pins on the install? Anything I have to be careful about?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I came from a cheap zalman air cooler and it took me a minute to realize that P95 was in fact working, because I was so used to temps in the 80-90 range that I couldn't fathom that under load I wouldn't see 50C....EVER. I dont know how much of that is due to the naked+ supremacy vs. supremacy alone, because I installed both the supremacy and naked at the same time, but the end result was only 5 minutes and 5 dollars to install over the supremacy alone. Going naked removes a thick chunk of copper and an extra layer of thermal compound from the equation, I cant give you a precise number as to what that does to temperatures, but judging by how much even just a bad thermal application can skyrocket (looking at you intel!) temps, I am 100% sure that the naked kit has a large chunk to do with how small my delta temps are.
> 
> 
> 
> Repped you for that, cheers! Goons get it ordered along with my last rad, and then get back to you guys on my temps
> No problems with bent pins on the install? Anything I have to be careful about?
Click to expand...

I have had no problems at all with bent pins, the pcb has notches that line up to the socket, makes it pretty easy to align the cpu. If you still have the cover for your socket that came with the board, leave it in as long as possible, might help when flipping the board around and also when you uninstall the latch as you will have tools 1/4" from the pins. If your motherboard has extremely long contacts on the back around where the mounting bracket goes, you can snip them down a tad to keep them from pushing through the padding and shorting on the bracket.

Good luck!


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Long time lurker here guys, thought I would post my 1st post in this thread!
> I'm gearing up for my 1st all out custom watercooling build, got all the gear, just waiting for my phanteks enthoo primo case to be released.
> 
> Got an ek supremacy, i5-4670k and Really tempted by the vice method, as it seems the easiest for me
> My question is, has anyone had experience with the naked ivy mount for it, or would it be better to put the IHS back on?
> 
> From my reading not putting the IHS back on makes sure that I put the right load on the die without fear of using a buckled IHS, but if I use the naked mount I have to remove the socket retention clip, so there is a greater risk of bent pins.
> 
> Anyone have any reccomendations?
> When I get it all plumbed in in a few weeks, I'll post my temps before delidding!


I'm curious to see how much better the Phanteks Enthoo Primo case is versus say... the Corsair 900D.

The Phanteks case intrigues me.


----------



## drew666

hi guys sorry for the noob question,, here it goes, will there be a massive drop in temp from a non-delidded to a dellided cpu when using lets say a decent air cpu cooler such as a hyper evo or one from noctua? Thermal paste is Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra, thanks









will also add custom water loop, when there's money in the pocket









UPDATE..
crap, sorry, just did a quick search and found the answer


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drew666*
> 
> hi guys sorry for the noob question,, here it goes, will there be a massive drop in temp from a non-delidded to a dellided cpu when using lets say a decent air cpu cooler such as a hyper evo or one from noctua? Thermal paste is Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra, thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will also add custom water loop, when there's money in the pocket
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> UPDATE..
> crap, sorry, just did a quick search and found the answer


You call Hyper Evo decent? lol


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> You call Hyper Evo decent? lol


I would call it decent... what would you call it? Now if he'd said decent _cooling_ (without specifying air) I could understand your response. It's very close to the NH-D14 in performance - which is likewise very close to the performance of single fan CLC's.


----------



## Cyro999

The hyper 212 isn't close to the best air coolers in performance, nor are single fan CLC's.

That review puts the h60 0.1c worse than the nh-d14 (and better than the dark rock pro 2), it's flawed in many ways and ridiculous


----------



## Hereisphilly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neofury*
> 
> I'm curious to see how much better the Phanteks Enthoo Primo case is versus say... the Corsair 900D.
> 
> The Phanteks case intrigues me.


There are a load of us over in the owners club getting excited as the usa pre-orders are about to be shipped out, I unfortunately have to wait a bit longer as UK pre-orders are due in a few weeks
I personally much prefer it over the 900d, its a lot more innovative, great price and there is huge potential for water cooling without modification
I've got a 240 xt45, a 280 monsta and a 420xt all lined up for the case when it gets here!
Swing by if you are interested!


----------



## drew666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> You call Hyper Evo decent? lol


Lol? What kind of response is that? How about recommending a decent air cooler? Now that would have been a helpful response


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> The hyper 212 isn't close to the best air coolers in performance, nor are single fan CLC's.
> 
> That review puts the h60 0.1c worse than the nh-d14 (and better than the dark rock pro 2), it's flawed in many ways and ridiculous


What would you recommend that is anywhere close to the price? I'm quite curious - I don't use air cooling on anything anymore, but when I did I found the older Hyper212 to perform quite favorably against anything in the sub-$40 range... And even some in the $50-60 range. Granted that was some time ago, but it's not like the design has changed significantly in the past four or five years!

A quick google of reviews turns up relatively glowing reviews on numerous sites... I guess every one of them is horribly flawed as well. Perhaps you should post your complete results here so the truth can be known.


----------



## neofury

The Hyper 212+/212 evo ARE decent air coolers. Without a delid I was able to safely get 4.7ghz iirc.

Are they the best? Heck no, but he said decent, and it is decent. It costs like 20$ what more do you want from a 20$ cooler?

Anyways, I'd go with the TC14PE for air cooling, that or the noctua, and maybe upgrade the fans. Definitely comparable to most of the CLC's if you do upgrade the fans, and no need to put a CLC with a pump directly on your CPU.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> What would you recommend that is anywhere close to the price? I'm quite curious - I don't use air cooling on anything anymore, but when I did I found the older Hyper212 to perform quite favorably against anything in the sub-$40 range... And even some in the $50-60 range. Granted that was some time ago, but it's not like the design has changed significantly in the past four or five years!
> 
> A quick google of reviews turns up relatively glowing reviews on numerous sites... I guess every one of them is horribly flawed as well. Perhaps you should post your complete results here so the truth can be known.


Seriously, it's a review that puts h60 0.1c away from nh-d14. They specifically state also that they are running a single, 5-volted case fan. The delta over ambients are really low, the cpu's are only at 60c. There's so many things wrong with the review and the tier list

If you want to provide a link or two to a haswell, ivy bridge, sb-e or ib-e review that shows a 212 or h60 performing anywhere near the best air coolers, i will gladly critique it in greater detail

212 is decent at $20, but it's a terrible cooler compared to the more powerful stuff unless you're on a sandy bridge or delidded quad core CPU that's not aggressively volting


----------



## tw33k

saying the EVO is "decent" is relative. It's "decent" compare to other cheap coolers but I would hardly call it decent when comparing it to the top air coolers. If money is an issue then I would go for a Xigmatek Loki or something similar


----------



## outofmyheadyo

So I added 5x GT AP-15 fans to my setup first pic @ 1.270v + Noctua [email protected] Noctua NF-P12 + 2x Fractal R2 140mm @5v vs second pic 1.260v Noctua [email protected] Noctua NF-P12 + 5x Scythe Gentle Typhoon @ 5v

before:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







after:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I know someoone will say oh those temps are terrible I get better with passive cooling and non delided chip but i think its a decent drop and everything is runnin 5v and silent.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Seriously, it's a review that puts h60 0.1c away from nh-d14. They specifically state also that they are running a single, 5-volted case fan. The delta over ambients are really low, the cpu's are only at 60c. There's so many things wrong with the review and the tier list
> 
> If you want to provide a link or two to a haswell, ivy bridge, sb-e or ib-e review that shows a 212 or h60 performing anywhere near the best air coolers, i will gladly critique it in greater detail
> 
> 212 is decent at $20, but it's a terrible cooler compared to the more powerful stuff unless you're on a sandy bridge or delidded quad core CPU that's not aggressively volting


Oh believe me, I agree that it's far from a great cooler.... I found the exact same to be the case with the H100 - absolute garbage, IMO. I could (based on my experience entirely) state that the only decent cooling possible is a custom loop - but then again I have almost twice as much invested in _fittings alone_ as any cooler in that lineup costs. However, saying that would be neither helpful for the poster - nor relevant to the discussion he raised. The word 'decent' to me implies better at dissipating wattage than the stock cooler - so if you believe that the Intel box HSF is better than a 212... then I would agree with laughing at the suggestion. On the other hand - even the H60 which is definitely a crap cooler (even by AIO CLC standards) - costs almost 2X as much as the 212 EVO... but it is definitely not 2X better at cooling. The H100 is nearly 5X more - but is likewise nowhere near 5X the performance.

As far as reviews... I could link all of them and it wouldn't really matter - as there are always concessions made in the testing for almost every review... that's just the way it is. On the other side, if you're looking for results in actual system of actual users running actual CPUs that are reasonably pleased with their results (which are available in their respective posts): look no further than right here at OCN.

The nh-d14 is a better air cooler by a decent margin, and those tests (however flawed they may be) bear those results out. Regardless of whether you have the very best air cooler or only a mediocre one - you're not going to get results like this (mine):


But that doesn't mean that you can't get a _decent_ OC - delidded or not - with a _decent_ $20-30 air cooling solution... but I don't think he or anyone else shopping in that price range is expecting to run 5GHz or more 24/7 either.


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> currently i am using the stock cooler and i just made a test(clu on the die,gelid extreme on the ihs)[email protected] speed 1.053vcore under load


Ozzy, is that vcore something you set or is it just automatic on your mobo?
Thanks!


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> Ozzy, is that vcore something you set or is it just automatic on your mobo?
> Thanks!


everything was set to auto


----------



## AlDyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Oh believe me, I agree that it's far from a great cooler.... I found the exact same to be the case with the H100 - absolute garbage, IMO. I could (based on my experience entirely) state that the only decent cooling possible is a custom loop - but then again I have almost twice as much invested in _fittings alone_ as any cooler in that lineup costs. However, saying that would be neither helpful for the poster - nor relevant to the discussion he raised. The word 'decent' to me implies better at dissipating wattage than the stock cooler - so if you believe that the Intel box HSF is better than a 212... then I would agree with laughing at the suggestion. On the other hand - even the H60 which is definitely a crap cooler (even by AIO CLC standards) - costs almost 2X as much as the 212 EVO... but it is definitely not 2X better at cooling. The H100 is nearly 5X more - but is likewise nowhere near 5X the performance.
> 
> As far as reviews... I could link all of them and it wouldn't really matter - as there are always concessions made in the testing for almost every review... that's just the way it is. On the other side, if you're looking for results in actual system of actual users running actual CPUs that are reasonably pleased with their results (which are available in their respective posts): look no further than right here at OCN.
> 
> The nh-d14 is a better air cooler by a decent margin, and those tests (however flawed they may be) bear those results out. Regardless of whether you have the very best air cooler or only a mediocre one - you're not going to get results like this (mine):
> 
> 
> But that doesn't mean that you can't get a _decent_ OC - delidded or not - with a _decent_ $20-30 air cooling solution... but I don't think he or anyone else shopping in that price range is expecting to run 5GHz or more 24/7 either.


Is that your 24/7?? Because somebody had apparently burned their chip with 1.4v... I wouldn't keep it there, but I'm tempted to try because temp wise I could get there easily even with the CPU and gpu on a H220 and one rad. Not all AIO's are bad


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Is that your 24/7?? Because somebody had apparently burned their chip with 1.4v... I wouldn't keep it there, but I'm tempted to try because temp wise I could get there easily even with the CPU and gpu on a H220 and one rad. Not all AIO's are bad


I run my i5 3570k at 5 ghz at 1.524 volts. Going strong for 9+ months now. This is on a custom loop but you would have no problem with your 220.


----------



## AlDyer

Okay I'll try it out when I get home. Im going to Italy for a week. I was wondering what the guy had done wrong because I agree that it shouldn't die from that low voltage. +REP for you sir


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Okay I'll try it out when I get home. Im going to Italy for a week. I was wondering what the guy had done wrong because I agree that it shouldn't die from that low voltage. +REP for you sir


Yeah must have been a freak accident or had used a piece of toast as a cooler. 1.4 shouldnt blow a chip.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Although mostly already answered by Solonowarion, yes that is my 24/7 OC - although not truly 24/7 naturally as I'm not folding on that system and I run offset voltage so under absolute peak loads (IBT Extreme) it can rise up to 1.48V actually... in the screen shot it's during one of the 'lulls' in a P95 run. During normal use it mostly runs between 1.03V (idle @ 1.6GHz) and 1.395V (gaming @ 5.0GHz). As stated previously I basically always make sure I'm operating within Intel spec - and if it fails under those conditions... I have no problem demanding an RMA from them (just got a new 2500K from an RMA - they're much easier to deal with than ASUS in that department).

That being said, the 2500K didn't degrade from a high clock/vcore - it just died period. I've never had a CPU degrade on me that was well within temp and voltage specs - which on IB is 105C and 1.52V. That isn't to say that on a crappier MB, or with inadequate cooling that you _couldn't_ experience degradation, but I feel that issue is really overblown. My original 3570K is still running strong after a year of 4.7GHz @ 1.45V and average temps in the 75C range under load.

I think the biggest issues with degradation on these chips comes from cheaper MBs with poorly cooled VRM sections (or at least pooly selected caps and chokes) - although this is merely conjecture based on years of electronics ownership. I've had high-end amps and receivers last for over a decade - surviving poor ventillated cabinet locations, power surges/outtages, etc... and I've likewise had much cheaper models die within a year or so under much less harsh conditions.

With almost any sensitive electronic component - the cleanliness of the power (and stability of voltages/current levels) is actually much more important than the level itself - at least unless the set level is way out of spec for the component it's feeding. In general if you have a very good PSU and a very good MB with excellent component selection... and provided you have adequate cooling to keep it well within the thermal envelope - there's no reason you shouldn't get 3-5 years of a high OC running in the 1.5V vcore range. However, that's just based on my personal experience - and each chip is different... or else there wouldn't be a 'silicon lottery' concept.


----------



## AgustinXtreme

i've just delidded my i5 4670k! Batch L315B336




before:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







after:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AgustinXtreme*
> 
> i've just delidded my i5 4670k! Batch L315B336
> 
> 
> 
> 
> before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> after:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I added thee!







Slappa dat Sig on!


----------



## Swag

Update on my Ivy Bridge: I might need to RMA it, it isn't stable anymore even on stock.







I'm going to guess the problem was caused by my initial H100i dying and my CPU running at extreme temps for a long period of time (1 week with constant folding). If I have to RMA this chip, I'll update you guys on the RMA process. So far, my email to them inquiring about delidded CPU RMAs (using anonymous email) was returned with a message saying that delidded CPUs aren't valid for RMA process. I hope it goes better this time around rather than the practice that I was doing.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Update on my Ivy Bridge: I might need to RMA it, it isn't stable anymore even on stock.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to guess the problem was caused by my initial H100i dying and my CPU running at extreme temps for a long period of time (1 week with constant folding). If I have to RMA this chip, I'll update you guys on the RMA process. So far, my email to them inquiring about delidded CPU RMAs (using anonymous email) was returned with a message saying that delidded CPUs aren't valid for RMA process. I hope it goes better this time around rather than the practice that I was doing.


No wonder you got that answer. So far i think the only solution is glue back the IHS.


----------



## AgustinXtreme

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I added thee!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa dat Sig on!


thanks! here are some pics


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## neofury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Update on my Ivy Bridge: I might need to RMA it, it isn't stable anymore even on stock.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to guess the problem was caused by my initial H100i dying and my CPU running at extreme temps for a long period of time (1 week with constant folding). If I have to RMA this chip, I'll update you guys on the RMA process. So far, my email to them inquiring about delidded CPU RMAs (using anonymous email) was returned with a message saying that delidded CPUs aren't valid for RMA process. I hope it goes better this time around rather than the practice that I was doing.


Good luck man, this is why I don't fold 24/7. Sure it checks stability but why would I want to push my chip 24/7? If god forbid a piece of hardware were to fail, like the fan or the cooler, yikes.

Anyways hope you get a new (and even better) chip!


----------



## skyn3t

AgustinXtreme
That's a good temp drop


----------



## AgustinXtreme

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> AgustinXtreme
> That's a good temp drop


i was really surprised because the cpu wasn't too hot in gaming or other tests, low 60's only at 4,5ghz, after delid i saw an improvement of about 10 to 12ºc gaming, 15ºc at prime95 and an outstanding 25ºc at LinX 0.6.5 (uses new AVX2 instruction set, that's why warms the cpu a lot)


----------



## tomxlr8

Can Q6600 be delidded? I want to practise my hammer swing before taking to 4770k


----------



## Mozz13

Hey guys, just a quick one before I delid my 3770k. I'm planning to run it direct die with ek precise mount. When I mount the block, do I just go all the way on the screw? I mean I don't want to put excess pressure against the chip and break it.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mozz13*
> 
> Hey guys, just a quick one before I delid my 3770k. I'm planning to run it direct die with ek precise mount. When I mount the block, do I just go all the way on the screw? I mean I don't want to put excess pressure against the chip and break it.


All the way down. screw opposite corners evenly.


----------



## Mozz13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> All the way down. screw opposite corners evenly.


Sweet!! Thanks man.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tomxlr8*
> 
> Can Q6600 be delidded? I want to practise my hammer swing before taking to 4770k


Yes but there is tin between HS and die so you probably end up with cracked die.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tomxlr8*
> 
> Can Q6600 be delidded? I want to practise my hammer swing before taking to 4770k


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Yes but there is tin between HS and die so you probably end up with cracked die.


As RR said - probably not the best practice.. and on another note I just recently sold my Q6600 for $40 - so there's still about 15-20% of retail value in them in the market. Depends on whether or not you really want the practice - but if you do there are better options:

See the list HERE (2.0 outline point in first post).
Quote:


> IHS Not Soldered To Die
> 
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> 
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)
> 
> Dual Cores
> 
> -AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
> -Celeron Dual Core E1200
> -Celeron Dual Core E1400
> -Pentium Dual Core E2140
> -Pentium Dual Core E2160
> -Pentium Dual Core E2180
> -Pentium Dual Core E2200
> -Pentium Dual Core E2210
> -Pentium Dual Core E2220
> -Pentium Dual Core E6300
> -Core 2 Duo E4300
> -Core 2 Duo E4400
> -Core 2 Duo E4500
> -Core 2 Duo E4600
> -Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E7200
> -Core 2 Duo E7300
> -Core 2 Duo E7400
> -Core 2 Duo E7500
> -Core 2 Duo E7600
> 
> As of right now thats the list, soon as I find out more about the unverified ones they will be changed, and this list will be updated as new CPUs launch.


----------



## Topsu

If you know someone has destroyed hes chip with hammer n vice method, please tell me what he did wrong I so might avoid that.








Going to delid tomorrow, got my clu today n_n

Also, is it dangerous if some CLU misses the core (xd) and goes on the pcb?


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Topsu*
> 
> If you know someone has destroyed hes chip with hammer n vice method, please tell me what he did wrong I so might avoid that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to delid tomorrow, got my clu today n_n
> 
> Also, is it dangerous if some CLU misses the core (xd) and goes on the pcb?


Well if you have ivy there is no problem with little CLU on the pcb but with haswell you need to bee careful.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Topsu*
> 
> If you know someone has destroyed hes chip with hammer n vice method, please tell me what he did wrong I so might avoid that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to delid tomorrow, got my clu today n_n
> 
> Also, is it dangerous if some CLU misses the core (xd) and goes on the pcb?


One guy clamped the PCB instead of the IHS and might have killed it. If he didn't he got extremely lucky. So don't try it that way.


----------



## Chomuco

hamer !


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> One guy clamped the PCB instead of the IHS and might have killed it. If he didn't he got extremely lucky. So don't try it that way.


That was me and yes, I got lucky! Do *not* do what I did!


----------



## scramz

how does this look for temps?

4.4 @ 1.16 volts


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Osco*
> 
> That was me and yes, I got lucky! Do *not* do what I did!


Sorry, didn't mean to throw you under the bus. Glad it still works for you!


----------



## scramz

Did it again with the fans running for a little longer.

Running 2 SP120 quiet editions.

4.4 @ 1.153 volts under load

Are these temps ok


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scramz*
> 
> Did it again with the fans running for a little longer.
> 
> Running 2 SP120 quiet editions.
> 
> 4.4 @ 1.153 volts under load
> 
> Are these temps ok


yeah, you're fine.


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scramz*
> 
> Did it again with the fans running for a little longer.
> 
> Running 2 SP120 quiet editions.
> 
> 4.4 @ 1.153 volts under load
> 
> Are these temps ok


Temps look great.


----------



## scramz

Did a little bit of tweaking and now the hottest cores are 42 48 50 48.

I only set the CPU block and hour ago, time to let it bed in i think


----------



## battleaxe

With those temps and that voltage I'd be going higher on the OC for sure.


----------



## scramz

I did reach 5gz but I did not IBT for that long. When I get some time tomorrow evening I will give it ago


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scramz*
> 
> I did reach 5gz but I did not IBT for that long. When I get some time tomorrow evening I will give it ago


What voltage?


----------



## scramz

1.42v but I didn't test if it was full stable. Booted and ran fine just need to stress it


----------



## megawatz

1.42 is really high. I wouldn't leave it at that voltage.


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scramz*
> 
> 1.42v but I didn't test if it was full stable. Booted and ran fine just need to stress it


What chip do you have. I run 5 ghz at 1.543 on my i5 3570k. Been going strong for 9+ months now


----------



## megawatz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> What chip do you have. I run 5 ghz at 1.543 on my i5 3570k. Been going strong for 9+ months now


You're also under water (according to your sig)


----------



## Cyro999

I don't think 1.42v is super high for delidded ivy bridge, considering peeps ran 1.5 on high end air or closed loop coolers in the past, or even higher on water like said.

>1.4v is more of a 24/7 clock than a "folding 24/7" clock i think though


----------



## scorpscarx

Pulled off my IHS today after 8 months on CLP because people were talking about the stuff drying up and temps climbing....

The CLP wasn't dry yet at all, I'm glad I got to refine my application a tad and switch over to CLU.

Also changed my TIM from PK3 to MX4 for the cooler, my temps are about exactly the same but a little more even.... as expected I suppose.

It was pretty easy to remove the CLP... basically I would say they are VERY similar to each other.

Also cleaned the pre-applied MX-4 from my Arctic Accelero and damn did they put too much on there, although my temps are the same now in the vga department also....


----------



## Osco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Sorry, didn't mean to throw you under the bus. Glad it still works for you!


lol, no worries battleaxe! I was just reiterating what you said. I was _very_ lucky that lesson didn't end up with me buying another cpu!!


----------



## Solonowarion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> You're also under water (according to your sig)


Yeah but if your temps are good your temps are good. Especially if you have a good chip.


----------



## Topsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Well if you have ivy there is no problem with little CLU on the pcb but with haswell you need to bee careful.


So, if some clu gets on the pcb, what should I clean it with?


----------



## Topsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Well if you have ivy there is no problem with little CLU on the pcb but with haswell you need to bee careful.


So, if some clu gets on the pcb, what should I clean it with?


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Topsu*
> 
> So, if some clu gets on the pcb, what should I clean it with?


get some isopropyl alcohol


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Topsu*
> 
> So, if some clu gets on the pcb, what should I clean it with?


There's no cleaning product that does something special to it. You just have to wipe it away. Because it doesn't do anything special together with soap or alcohol, you probably shouldn't use a cloth. You will not really be able to clean the cloth afterwards. I guess best is simply using some sort of paper. Use toilet paper or a kitchen paper towel so you can throw it away after you wiped CLU with it.


----------



## Hereisphilly

As I'm still waiting on my case to be delivered before I can set up my loop and delid my 4670k, I figured I might get some practice in.

Found a Pentium Dual Core E2140 on eBay for £3!!!! Its in that list that someone posted a few pages back, so I thought I'd have a go with the hammer and vice method. Anyone done one of those before?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Pulled off my IHS today after 8 months on CLP because people were talking about the stuff drying up and temps climbing....
> 
> The CLP wasn't dry yet at all, I'm glad I got to refine my application a tad and switch over to CLU.
> 
> Also changed my TIM from PK3 to MX4 for the cooler, my temps are about exactly the same but a little more even.... as expected I suppose.
> 
> It was pretty easy to remove the CLP... basically I would say they are VERY similar to each other.
> 
> Also cleaned the pre-applied MX-4 from my Arctic Accelero and damn did they put too much on there, although my temps are the same now in the vga department also....


How did you remove the CLP from the core ? I might have to do the same once my CLU arrives


----------



## scorpscarx

99.9999% iso and qtips, you'll be surprised by how incredibly normal it is to get off. For the underside of the IHS... same thing plus some added elbow grease circular scrubbing, but the core it mostly just balls right off.

To reapply, I used those makeup wands that resemble qtips but have a little foam applicator on one side, spreads nicely and no fibers.


----------



## scramz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> What chip do you have. I run 5 ghz at 1.543 on my i5 3570k. Been going strong for 9+ months now


I7 3770k.

Done a few runs on IBT and temp don't peak 65-70


----------



## scramz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> Yeah but if your temps are good your temps are good. Especially if you have a good chip.


I installed a XSPC D5 EX360 last night, gone run a few go with this cooler. My H100i was a champ but I want to extend to my SLI


----------



## Topsu

Damn, didn't find any nice sized wood for the hammer n vice. >









Is there any other object I could use for delid besides wood?

Also would it to be possible to like heat the chip with air dryer so the glue melts and then pull the pcb off?


----------



## lordhinton

dont heat it up. do you have a rolling pin?


----------



## Topsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lordhinton*
> 
> dont heat it up. do you have a rolling pin?


Why not? =(


----------



## alancsalt

Besides wood.. one guy did it with a dead hard drive housing...


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *megawatz*
> 
> 1.42 is really high. I wouldn't leave it at that voltage.


Not even close to high.
Been running at 1.52V for about a year now and my previous 2500K lasted for over 2 years with constant 1.5V before I booted it at 1.8V :l


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> As I'm still waiting on my case to be delivered before I can set up my loop and delid my 4670k, I figured I might get some practice in.
> 
> Found a Pentium Dual Core E2140 on eBay for £3!!!! Its in that list that someone posted a few pages back, so I thought I'd have a go with the hammer and vice method. Anyone done one of those before?


Yeah, lots of us have.

Its pretty easy (very easy) just follow the video on the OP to a tee and you will have no worries mate!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> As I'm still waiting on my case to be delivered before I can set up my loop and delid my 4670k, I figured I might get some practice in.
> 
> Found a Pentium Dual Core E2140 on eBay for £3!!!! Its in that list that someone posted a few pages back, so I thought I'd have a go with the hammer and vice method. Anyone done one of those before?


I did a Pentium4 before I did my 3570k, both with the razor method. Practice makes perfect!


----------



## Hereisphilly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I did a Pentium4 before I did my 3570k, both with the razor method. Practice makes perfect!


Yeah there are loads on eBay going dirt cheap, so i think I may try a few
My colleague at work has a big vice at home, so thats what I'm going to go with!


----------



## newt111

I did mine today, details over here
http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade/1290_30#post_21050878

4ghz @ 1.2 volts for those temps. I'll try to push it further later on.


----------



## rossb

I just delidded my 4770k. Before that I was getting up to 100 degrees in Prime95 at 4.5Ghz and 1.30v. Now after de-lidding I am getting ... exactly the same temperatures.

I have CLU on the die and NT-H1 on the IHS, using an H100i. What am I doing wrong?

Incidentally, I tried the hammer and vice method. I whacked the bejesus out of that cpu about 20 times and the IHS would not shift. I ended up using a razor blade and it took 5 minutes.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

perhaps ur h100i is broken, no way in hell should it reach 100c


----------



## scramz

You think I should push this chip more?

i7 3770k

4.5 @ 1.1680 volts under load.

Max temps after 20 IBT runs are 50 57 58 57


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I would give it enough juice to run on 5ghz stable








Should be doable since 4.5 only takes so little.


----------



## scramz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> I would give it enough juice to run on 5ghz stable
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Should be doable since 4.5 only takes so little.


That is with sp120 quiet edition fans too


----------



## Quamba

Finally got my replacement 3770k in. delided this one right this time and seeing a noticable drop in temps. i'll be updating with pics tomorrow, night shift workin at the moment. OC'd it to 4.7Ghz and its been runing solid for about 9 hours now under prime, temps hovering around 58-61c with the corsair H100 cooler and CLU TIM depending on what core you look at. turned off prime and let my FAH client get some numbers in while im at work so we'll see how it does with that tomorrow when i get off work. cant wait to get back home and push it some more, mabey join that 5Ghz club as well. updates to follow.


----------



## Mozz13

Hey guys, need help. I just delid my 3770k and now i cant boot the systems. It stuck at code 55 and wont event let me go to bios. I updated to the latest bios before i delid it and the ram passed memtest. What did i do wrong?? Help..


----------



## scramz

HHow did you delid it? blade or vice?


----------



## Swag

Error Code 55 on motherboards are linked to memory errors.

Unfortunately, this means your CPU is probably dead. Sorry.


----------



## Mozz13

I did the vice method. Yes it took me a while to whack it off but no harm done to the chip. Can someone post me a pict of a good cpu socket?? Wanna check there is bent or not. Sorry i only can reply from mobile.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mozz13*
> 
> I did the vice method. Yes it took me a while to whack it off but no harm done to the chip. Can someone post me a pict of a good cpu socket?? Wanna check there is bent or not. Sorry i only can reply from mobile.


If you got Dual Channel, try running them on Single Channel, I had that issue at first because of bad contact apparently but it fixed itself later somehow and now my Dual Channel works just fine, I guess the CPU must have been sitting bad in the socket or bent or something when I razored it open.


----------



## Mozz13

Need to put my loop together again and try to turn it on. I really hope i didnt break it. On other note, i used the precisemount from ek on the naked die, i can screw it all the way down right?? I mean thats the point of having the precisemount is it??


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mozz13*
> 
> Need to put my loop together again and try to turn it on. I really hope i didnt break it. On other note, i used the precisemount from ek on the naked die, i can screw it all the way down right?? I mean thats the point of having the precisemount is it??


More than likely you're not getting good contact for some reason. Do your mount again and make sure even pressure gets applied to the PCB all around the die. Sounds like some pins aren't touching for some reason.


----------



## Mozz13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> More than likely you're not getting good contact for some reason. Do your mount again and make sure even pressure gets applied to the PCB all around the die. Sounds like some pins aren't touching for some reason.


I reseat the block again and still nana. I think i call it a night and try again tomorrow without the precise mount. Thanks for your help. Will update here again.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mozz13*
> 
> I reseat the block again and still nana. I think i call it a night and try again tomorrow without the precise mount. Thanks for your help. Will update here again.


No problem. Let us know how it goes.


----------



## scramz

Check the PCB for marks, it could be possible you may of hit the memory controller.

I have started moving my OC up now.

4.6 @ 1.2240 volts under load.

Intel Burn Test @ 8000mb Stress level

Hottest Temps 54 63 64 63.

I sure this will be fine for a 24/7 OC.

What is the max voltage you guys recommend for a 24/7 OC?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

some people run 1.5+ here for close to a year now if you were willing to take the chance to kill ur cpu with the delid, and u have adequate cooling then why not go 1.5v you didnt pay all that money for ur loop to fiddle around with 1.2v im not saying u should go straight to 1.5v but increase step by step and if u happen to get to 1.5v and temps are fine then why not








All of that on proper watercooling ofcourse


----------



## scramz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> some people run 1.5+ here for close to a year now if you were willing to take the chance to kill ur cpu with the delid, and u have adequate cooling then why not go 1.5v you didnt pay all that money for ur loop to fiddle around with 1.2v im not saying u should go straight to 1.5v but increase step by step and if u happen to get to 1.5v and temps are fine then why not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All of that on proper watercooling ofcourse


I delid my 3770k a month ago and the temps dropped by 20-30 degrees on load.

I have a xspc D5 EX360mm rad which is currently installed but I only have 2 SP120 Quiet edition fans on it as I am waiting for the rest to be delivered and I cba to fit the XSPC fans then to have to remove them. I have another EX240mm rad which I will be installing when I get a water block for my AMD R9 290x.

I find my temps rise about 3-5 degree for every 100mhz I add to the OC.

I am now stressing 4.7 then I will move up 100mhz for every time im stable and making a note of the OC.

What would you say is acceptable temps on loads for gaming? I mean playing BF3/4 for hours at a time.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I would like things to stay under 80 while playing specially under such good cooling, I am no expert tho just personal preference


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scramz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> some people run 1.5+ here for close to a year now if you were willing to take the chance to kill ur cpu with the delid, and u have adequate cooling then why not go 1.5v you didnt pay all that money for ur loop to fiddle around with 1.2v im not saying u should go straight to 1.5v but increase step by step and if u happen to get to 1.5v and temps are fine then why not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All of that on proper watercooling ofcourse
> 
> 
> 
> I delid my 3770k a month ago and the temps dropped by 20-30 degrees on load.
> 
> I have a xspc D5 EX360mm rad which is currently installed but I only have 2 SP120 Quiet edition fans on it as I am waiting for the rest to be delivered and I cba to fit the XSPC fans then to have to remove them. I have another EX240mm rad which I will be installing when I get a water block for my AMD R9 290x.
> 
> I find my temps rise about 3-5 degree for every 100mhz I add to the OC.
> 
> I am now stressing 4.7 then I will move up 100mhz for every time im stable and making a note of the OC.
> 
> What would you say is acceptable temps on loads for gaming? I mean playing BF3/4 for hours at a time.
Click to expand...

Your question should be what is the maximum acceptable temp on load because it doesn't matter what you are doing. Although there is some flex to it, you shouldn't worry about temps as long as it is under 90C. 105C of Ivy Bridge is the MAXIMUM temperature you should allow it to go, however that is not acceptable. Try to keep it under 90C, but going up slightly won't hurt it either.


----------



## scramz

Great, thank you for the replies.

Just tested 4.7 now for 4.8

4.7 @ 1.2960 volts under load. IBT Very High max temps 64-72-73-72

I had to jump up .065 volts to gain 100mhz.


----------



## scramz

I love this delidding stuff! It is great!

4.8 @ 1.360 volts. IBT Very High max temps 69-78-80-78.

again 0.06 volts for another 100mhz.

Im sure this will be fine for a 24/7 OC. Time to try 4.9 now


----------



## outofmyheadyo

What are your other setting for the 4.8 clock other than the vcore?
Great stuff


----------



## scramz

Turbo Disabled
Spread Spectrum Disabled
Vdroop Offsdet +100%
Digital Compensation Level High
C1E Support Enabled
Overspeed Protection Enabled
C-State Disabled
HT Enabled.

Did i miss anything? Or is there anything I could change to improve?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

That definitely seems like a winner and I wouldn't worry even the tinniest bit about running at that voltage 24/7... even higher would be fine - but at 1.36V you're still at a level where some of the worst samples are at stock speeds. I can't remember where, but I remember reading of someone who's 3770K actually made me feel good about my first one - which is horrible. I think at stock settings they were at something like 1.32V or so and basically could only get to about 4.3GHz before it was already requiring over 1.5V.

Yours is very similar to mine so you should have no problems running 5GHz at ~1.46V if you wanted, but at 4.8GHz/1.36V and peak temps at or under 80C... you should be able to run that for years without issue - and it's not like it's not going to be fast enough for anything 'normal' like games or media encoding. Congrats!


----------



## scramz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> That definitely seems like a winner and I wouldn't worry even the tinniest bit about running at that voltage 24/7... even higher would be fine - but at 1.36V you're still at a level where some of the worst samples are at stock speeds. I can't remember where, but I remember reading of someone who's 3770K actually made me feel good about my first one - which is horrible. I think at stock settings they were at something like 1.32V or so and basically could only get to about 4.3GHz before it was already requiring over 1.5V.
> 
> Yours is very similar to mine so you should have no problems running 5GHz at ~1.46V if you wanted, but at 4.8GHz/1.36V and peak temps at or under 80C... you should be able to run that for years without issue - and it's not like it's not going to be fast enough for anything 'normal' like games or media encoding. Congrats!


Cheers mate









With a bit of fine tuning i got my vcore down a bit so temps have dropped a bit. I am only running SP120 quiet fans as i like a quiet system.

I think i will leave it at this









I got to 4.8 @ 1.3550 volts and IBT Very High stress the temps are 68-77-78-76.


----------



## Mozz13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> No problem. Let us know how it goes.


soooo. I took out the precise mount and put back the heatsink to the cpu and boot it up. Still nothing. Still gave me code 55 even with single channel. I think at this point i can say i wrecked it.







now on my way to buy the cheapest 1155 proc i can find in the store before declaring a bad mb as well. I would rather buy a proc compare to a mb since i hate reinstalling everything. Let hope not.


----------



## Mozz13

Just got myself a cheap celeron proc and it booted up fine (writing from the system actually). So, bottom line is my 3770k is dead. Have no idea what went wrong. Probably I did something wrong when hitting it. Just a reminder for other who think to delid their cpu, vice method is indeed safer meaning way less possibility to scratch the pcb and whatnot but something still can go wrong with the whole process. I'm saying this not to discourage you guys. Me myself is the victim of curiosity. I thought that it is safe enough to guarantee a 100% success rate. Always delid knowing the exact worst outcome and I'd say only do it when you have a extra money to spend on new hardware just in case something went wrong. Like me. Now, off I go to buy 3570k.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mozz13*
> 
> Just got myself a cheap celeron proc and it booted up fine (writing from the system actually). So, bottom line is my 3770k is dead. Have no idea what went wrong. Probably I did something wrong when hitting it. Just a reminder for other who think to delid their cpu, vice method is indeed safer meaning way less possibility to scratch the pcb and whatnot but something still can go wrong with the whole process. I'm saying this not to discourage you guys. Me myself is the victim of curiosity. I thought that it is safe enough to guarantee a 100% success rate. Always delid knowing the exact worst outcome and I'd say only do it when you have a extra money to spend on new hardware just in case something went wrong. Like me. Now, off I go to buy 3570k.


can we see pictures of the victim? I am curious.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Sorry to hear about your loss Mozz, IMO deliding using a razor is the safest if you have a steady hand.

Heck, you could scratch the PCB but the CPU would run fine.

Check out my soldered CPU delid in my sig


----------



## Mozz13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> can we see pictures of the victim? I am curious.


Say hello to my dead friend.







Honestly, I still couldn't find any fault with it. Apologies for the bad quality. Just took it with my lumia.




Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Sorry to hear about your loss Mozz, IMO deliding using a razor is the safest if you have a steady hand.
> 
> Heck, you could scratch the PCB but the CPU would run fine.
> 
> Check out my soldered CPU delid in my sig


So you managed to delid a soldered cpu with the razor method? How did you do it? When I looked at how narrow the gap that I need to cut, I thought it would be a bad idea to use a razor even though I have steady hands. Saying that, I still don't believe that my cpu died. I think the pressure distribution is not even thus bad contact. I'm waiting for shipment of fittings and thermal pads. I'll try again with the thermal pads sometimes next week. Have my 3570k set up and running already. Oh well.


----------



## inedenimadam

Those are pretty decent pictures for a cell phone. I don't see any copper traces, it doesn't look like it was damaged at all. I have a hard time believing it was killed with such a clean razor job. How about the socket itself...have you checked for bent pins? Did you maybe go a little to deep and hit the side of the die?

Edit to add: anybody with a compatible mobo that would let you try it ?


----------



## Mozz13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Those are pretty decent pictures for a cell phone. I don't see any copper traces, it doesn't look like it was damaged at all. I have a hard time believing it was killed with such a clean razor job. How about the socket itself...have you checked for bent pins? Did you maybe go a little to deep and hit the side of the die?
> 
> Edit to add: anybody with a compatible mobo that would let you try it ?


I checked with bent pins and all good. Tried my own system with 2 diff cpus already (a celeron and now using a 3570k). Unfortunately all of my friends are laptop users. They complained on how hassling a desktop is.







FYI, i used the vice method. Didn't have the balls to do razor. Nah, I didn't hit the die. When I hit the cpu, it didn't flew away. I hit it to the point where I can wiggle it off the hsf. It's weird eh?? I'll try remounting again when I have my thermal pads to even the mounting pressure.


----------



## Badness

Is it safe to use thermal paste with the synthetic diamonds in it on the bare CPU?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badness*
> 
> Is it safe to use thermal paste with the synthetic diamonds in it on the bare CPU?


Yea, you shouldn't have a problem. The top part of the die that you see is actually not the die, there's a thin film of glass that's applied over the actual body of the die to prevent damage from scratches during the production process.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Badness*
> 
> Is it safe to use thermal paste with the synthetic diamonds in it on the bare CPU?


diamond harder than die, diamond scratch die, scratches bad.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mozz13*
> 
> I checked with bent pins and all good. Tried my own system with 2 diff cpus already (a celeron and now using a 3570k). Unfortunately all of my friends are laptop users. They complained on how hassling a desktop is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FYI, i used the vice method. Didn't have the balls to do razor. Nah, I didn't hit the die. When I hit the cpu, it didn't flew away. I hit it to the point where I can wiggle it off the hsf. It's weird eh?? I'll try remounting again when I have my thermal pads to even the mounting pressure.


Did you use a antistatic wrist strap or something like that to prevent ESD?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Did you use a antistatic wrist strap or something like that to prevent ESD?


You can if you want to. It never hurts. I didn,t because i get tired off snapping it on and off constantly if i get up. I just touch my psu in between picking everything up. Haven't had a problem yet.


----------



## Mozz13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Did you use a antistatic wrist strap or something like that to prevent ESD?


I never use the wrist strap. Never had any problem before. I always touch my case before i start anything. I used to have shocks from touching the case if i have static built up in me.


----------



## Epsi

I was thinking, would it maybe work to diled a 3770k with some sort of thin wire/rope cutting technique? Or has maybe someone done it before?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Epsi*
> 
> I was thinking, would it maybe work to diled a 3770k with some sort of thin wire/rope cutting technique? Or has maybe someone done it before?


Someone said he would try it with fishing line or something like this, but I don't think he reported back what the result was.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Epsi*
> 
> I was thinking, would it maybe work to diled a 3770k with some sort of thin wire/rope cutting technique? Or has maybe someone done it before?


Yea, it has been attempted and from what I remember, it was a success. I don't remember the exact details but I know they used a line probably floss or one of those fishing lines. I know the person had to make a cut in one of the corners with a razor blade first and then started running it around with the line.


----------



## Epsi

Ahh, that's too bad. If it works, i think i might looks like a much safer way tho.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Someone said he would try it with fishing line or something like this, but I don't think he reported back what the result was.


That was probably me.. I read about this method that wasnt concluded and wanted to try it / report results
but when I got the CPU and saw the tiny gap, I abandoned the idea and vice / hammered it instead








If you can find floss strong enough, or fishing line thin enough, it can probably be done!

Epsi, if you end up trying this, plz take loads of pics and report the results as I failed at this








Good luck!


----------



## Turt1e

I got a lot of components fried, so I checked for markings on my CPU. Theres CLU on the die and I took off the lid. Do I have a to reapply it or is it fine if I just put it back on?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> I got a lot of components fried, so I checked for markings on my CPU. Theres CLU on the die and I took off the lid. Do I have a to reapply it or is it fine if I just put it back on?


what fried your components ?!


----------



## Turt1e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> what fried your components ?!


Not exactly sure, I think my H220 leaked but I'm getting an RMA on everything to be safe.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> Not exactly sure, I think my H220 leaked but I'm getting an RMA on everything to be safe.


ouch, isn't the coolant inside corsair stuff non conductive ?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> ouch, isn't the coolant inside corsair stuff non conductive ?


It probably is when they put it in... but nothing that is in direct contact with metal stays non-conductive forever (or even very long for that matter). DI water is non-conductive for the most part - but within a matter of a few hours of being in a loop it has enough stray copper molecules and other contaminants in it to be slightly conductive... and over the course of several months much more so. I guess unless you flushed, assembled, filled, and sealed your loop in a vacuum or at least a clean-room.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> It probably is when they put it in... but nothing that is in direct contact with metal stays non-conductive forever (or even very long for that matter). DI water is non-conductive for the most part - but within a matter of a few hours of being in a loop it has enough stray copper molecules and other contaminants in it to be slightly conductive... and over the course of several months much more so. I guess unless you flushed, assembled, filled, and sealed your loop in a vacuum or at least a clean-room.


i think they do fill and assemble those all in one coolers in vacuum as air bubbles inside the loop are no good ....


----------



## Turt1e

Don't know if the coolant Swiftech uses is non conductive. It's also a Swiftech H220, not Corsair sorry. It's Hydrx PM/2


----------



## ooostephen

What's the story on covering the 4770k's capacitors next to the die, do they need to be covered with nail polish or super glue, or anything at all?


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> What's the story on covering the 4770k's capacitors next to the die, do they need to be covered with nail polish or super glue, or anything at all?


Anything non conductive will work. LET, mx-4,nail farnish etc.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk


----------



## ooostephen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> You reinstall Windows once a month? Oh god...


I like this idea and have thought about how to go about it. Making a system image or windows equivalent after a fresh initial install, along with the apps and such, should make it quick and painless to reinstall. I might keep app config files in a cloud system too. Heck, do a secure erase on your SSD and you'll always have a top performing machine, virus free, clean and pristine. Now I just wish there was a utility that would automate all this.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> You reinstall Windows once a month? Oh god...
> 
> 
> 
> I like this idea and have thought about how to go about it. Making a system image or windows equivalent after a fresh initial install, along with the apps and such, should make it quick and painless to reinstall. I might keep app config files in a cloud system too. Heck, do a secure erase on your SSD and you'll always have a top performing machine, virus free, clean and pristine. Now I just wish there was a utility that would automate all this.
Click to expand...

I do secure erase only every 3 months, I don't like using an entire cycle for just 1 Windows installation.

I knew that post looked familiar... Yea, I do a full Windows installations with no cloning/imaging/restore because I want it straight brand new. It is overkill but it has become a practice with all my PCs now.


----------



## feznz

I am just wondering how many people have experienced degrading?
I done a few runs with my last 3770k 1.6-1.62V for about an hour then I could only get my chip stable 4.3Ghz so I pulled the pin and Brought another chip just seemed a waste with the full custom loop I am on.
This is what my new baby can do
http://valid.canardpc.com/84939m

I am still yet to delid my chip but I did look rather golden to me it seems it will do 5Ghz on 1.3V But I am hitting 105degrees so I cannot tell if it would be stable but the above screen shot is what I think is stable but yet to do a 12hr prime run as temps are an issue and I am going to nurse this little baby but I know I am going to delid it I going to have to get some liquid metal TIM.
All the members in the front page @ 5+Ghz seem to also using 1.5+V
What is the lowest voltage have you guys seen for 5Ghz?


----------



## Gil80

Hi all,

So after reviewing all sorts of de-lidding guides and what not, I've decided to take the plunge on my 3770k only to scratch my PCB :/

Here is an image:


The problem I'm facing is that my Asus P8Z77-V-Deluxe refuses to boot when DIMM A1 or A2 or both are occupied.
Otherwise, the PC runs fine with DIMM B1 & B2 occupied @ 4.5Ghz / 1.224 volts (offset +0.02) at 68deg max (ambient is ~25deg).
I ran PRIME95 Blend test for 18 hours with no errors and the max avg temp that was registered = 72deg.

I'm not 100% sure it's the CPU's fault or the motherboard regardless what I've just described.

Can someone know by looking at the picture if I hit an area which might cause this?

It's either buying a new PCU or replacing the motherboard by warranty (I hope it's the motherboard). Feeling bad at the moment









Thanks


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> So after reviewing all sorts of de-lidding guides and what not, I've decided to take the plunge on my 3770k only to scratch my PCB :/
> 
> Here is an image:
> 
> 
> The problem I'm facing is that my Asus P8Z77-V-Deluxe refuses to boot when DIMM A1 or A2 or both are occupied.
> Otherwise, the PC runs fine with DIMM B1 & B2 occupied @ 4.5Ghz / 1.224 volts (offset +0.02) at 68deg max (ambient is ~25deg).
> I ran PRIME95 Blend test for 18 hours with no errors and the max avg temp that was registered = 72deg.
> 
> I'm not 100% sure it's the CPU's fault or the motherboard regardless what I've just described.
> 
> Can someone know by looking at the picture if I hit an area which might cause this?
> 
> It's either buying a new PCU or replacing the motherboard by warranty (I hope it's the motherboard). Feeling bad at the moment
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks


killing dual channel is quite common when scratching your pcb, was it working fine before the delid ?!

why didn't you do it vice and hammer style ? the razor style delidding is obsolete at this point with the tried and true vice and hammer almost fail safe method ...


----------



## Gil80

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> killing dual channel is quite common when scratching your pcb, was it working fine before the delid ?!
> 
> why didn't you do it vice and hammer style ? the razor style delidding is obsolete at this point with the tried and true vice and hammer almost fail safe method ...


Yes it was working before but not quite as you'd think.
I ran many MEMtest86 on my RAM sticks before de-lidding so two days before delidding, I had only 1 RAM stick in place. Anyway, before I put all the 4 sticks in place I decided that since my PC is open I should just delid it and that's it.

I don't have the tools to do it with vice and hammer.

Plus I read this guy's thread: http://www.overclock.net/t/1357638/my-i7-3770k-delidding-adventure


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Yes it was working before but not quite as you'd think.
> I ran many MEMtest86 on my RAM sticks before de-lidding so two days before delidding, I had only 1 RAM stick in place. Anyway, before I put all the 4 sticks in place I decided that since my PC is open I should just delid it and that's it.
> 
> I don't have the tools to do it with vice and hammer.


idk but the scratches look kinda big and bad, best way to know is to try that cpu in a different mobo if it does the same then it's the reason behind this

maybe you will have to sell that one as it is for very cheap to someone who is willing to deal with this problem and get yourself another ....


----------



## Gil80

Thanks... I don't have how to test that.... :/


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I am just wondering how many people have experienced degrading?
> I done a few runs with my last 3770k 1.6-1.62V for about an hour then I could only get my chip stable 4.3Ghz so I pulled the pin and Brought another chip just seemed a waste with the full custom loop I am on.
> This is what my new baby can do
> http://valid.canardpc.com/84939m
> 
> I am still yet to delid my chip but I did look rather golden to me it seems it will do 5Ghz on 1.3V But I am hitting 105degrees so I cannot tell if it would be stable but the above screen shot is what I think is stable but yet to do a 12hr prime run as temps are an issue and I am going to nurse this little baby but I know I am going to delid it I going to have to get some liquid metal TIM.
> All the members in the front page @ 5+Ghz seem to also using 1.5+V
> What is the lowest voltage have you guys seen for 5Ghz?


I run mine at 1.500v on the dot. LLC goes as low as 1.476v under loads for 5ghz. I am curious too how many people are running near 1.5v for their everyday clocks and haven't seen issues yet? I personally have not but I am having my computer off for most of the day and gaming 2-3 hours a night.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I am just wondering how many people have experienced degrading?
> I done a few runs with my last 3770k 1.6-1.62V for about an hour then I could only get my chip stable 4.3Ghz so I pulled the pin and Brought another chip just seemed a waste with the full custom loop I am on.
> This is what my new baby can do
> http://valid.canardpc.com/84939m
> 
> I am still yet to delid my chip but I did look rather golden to me it seems it will do 5Ghz on 1.3V But I am hitting 105degrees so I cannot tell if it would be stable but the above screen shot is what I think is stable but yet to do a 12hr prime run as temps are an issue and I am going to nurse this little baby but I know I am going to delid it I going to have to get some liquid metal TIM.
> All the members in the front page @ 5+Ghz seem to also using 1.5+V
> What is the lowest voltage have you guys seen for 5Ghz?
> 
> 
> 
> I run mine at 1.500v on the dot. LLC goes as low as 1.476v under loads for 5ghz. I am curious too how many people are running near 1.5v for their everyday clocks and haven't seen issues yet? I personally have not but I am having my computer off for most of the day and gaming 2-3 hours a night.
Click to expand...

I dont know my exact VCore, because ASRock screwed the pooch on the Z77 ext 4 voltage reading, but CPU-Z shows 1.34 for 5.0, have been running it for about a couple months on a 3570k...real voltage is somewhere between 1.4 and 1.5., so i believe i fall into that "close to 1.5" that you are referring to. I lost my DMM in my last move so I cant give an exact.


----------



## Clexzor

Quick question all has anyone delided and removed the glue and put his back on leaving the stock tim in place?

I have delided several chips but have used clu I need to delid for bf4 release tonight lol and my clu wont be here till wed.???


----------



## chronicfx

Why don't you just play with whatever overclock you can get until then? Worst case scenario it doesn't work and you miss playing today and tomorrow. Get the chip to 4.5-4.6 and play for the week. Delid it next saturday.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clexzor*
> 
> Quick question all has anyone delided and removed the glue and put his back on leaving the stock tim in place?
> 
> I have delided several chips but have used clu I need to delid for bf4 release tonight lol and my clu wont be here till wed.???


Surely you have some kind of TIM laying around? Can you scrape it off a stock cooler you may never have installed?


----------



## ooostephen

I can't say for sure, but I nicked a corner and lost all voltage and temp readings, though I could still boot into the OS.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I can't say for sure, but I nicked a corner and lost all voltage and temp readings, though I could still boot into the OS.


that's bad









if youi ever attempt deliding again, don't use a razor ever, vice and hammer all the way !


----------



## fizzif

hello delidders, nooby here. In a few days my vice will get to me I feel ready and did my research. Ha I don't want to screw my chip so i want to be as safe as possible. How do i know which side to hammer the block to so i dont scratch something.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fizzif*
> 
> hello delidders, nooby here. In a few days my vice will get to me I feel ready and did my research. Ha I don't want to screw my chip so i want to be as safe as possible. How do i know which side to hammer the block to so i dont scratch something.


read the first post there must be a guide for haswell chips


----------



## Barefooter

^^ yes click on the first link under the first video and it explains how to position it.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I am just wondering how many people have experienced degrading?
> All the members in the front page @ 5+Ghz seem to also using 1.5+V
> What is the lowest voltage have you guys seen for 5Ghz?


It's just the lowest I've seen _personally_ since it's my rig - but I've definitely seen lower and it's far from a golden chip... your's is actually closer I would say and you should be able to hit 5.0 at well under 1.5v on it unless it get's stupid-thirsty after 4.8.


And yes - I run this all the time (3 months now) but I don't run 24/7 and I'm also on offset voltage so most of the time it's idling at 1.6GHz @ 1.03v


----------



## feznz

I should have had a look here for some info
http://www.overclock.net/t/678487/official-5ghz-overclock-club/5460_20#post_21081555
Thanks for the replies not so easy to find out how much it takes to degrade but I am going to take I easy on this one.

I am pretty sure I going to need about 1.40V for 5Ghz 24/7 and a delid which I have done before hammer style
http://valid.canardpc.com/stubnn
The absolute minimum voltage required to get into windows and validate.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I should have had a look here for some info
> http://www.overclock.net/t/678487/official-5ghz-overclock-club/5460_20#post_21081555
> Thanks for the replies not so easy to find out how much it takes to degrade but I am going to take I easy on this one.
> 
> I am pretty sure I going to need about 1.40V for 5Ghz 24/7 and a delid which I have done before hammer style
> http://valid.canardpc.com/stubnn
> The absolute minimum voltage required to get into windows and validate.


Well, based purely on Intel's specifications (which is all I really consider - since they built the thing after all) you were begging for degradation on that last chip. Per IB spec the limits are 1.52v and 105C - now naturally they don't specify that degradation cannot occur within those limits - but I think it's safe to say they _will_ outside of them. So I never run more than ~1.45v unless it's just to boot and validate (and I don't even care about that with my chip so I've just left it at the settings shown).

The thermal ceiling is very difficult to breach due to throttling - so not much to worry about there, but I would definitely expect to see degradation - and pretty fast at that in the 1.62v levels you were running your other chip. At least without subzero cooling. If your chip is that far below the thermal limit - then I think 1.7v, 1.8v or even 1.9v would be fairly safe... for short periods of time at least.

On water or air (regardless of how exotic or efficient your loop might be) I'd keep it under that 1.52v specified limit. After all - even if you've got 3000mm of rad space... you'll never get under ambient + 5-10C temps on the chip.. and fully loaded probably never be able to get it under 60C at the cores.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Well, based purely on Intel's specifications (which is all I really consider - since they built the thing after all) you were begging for degradation on that last chip. Per IB spec the limits are 1.52v and 105C - now naturally they don't specify that degradation cannot occur within those limits - but I think it's safe to say they _will_ outside of them. So I never run more than ~1.45v unless it's just to boot and validate (and I don't even care about that with my chip so I've just left it at the settings shown).
> 
> The thermal ceiling is very difficult to breach due to throttling - so not much to worry about there, but I would definitely expect to see degradation - and pretty fast at that in the 1.62v levels you were running your other chip. At least without subzero cooling. If your chip is that far below the thermal limit - then I think 1.7v, 1.8v or even 1.9v would be fairly safe... for short periods of time at least.
> 
> On water or air (regardless of how exotic or efficient your loop might be) I'd keep it under that 1.52v specified limit. After all - even if you've got 3000mm of rad space... you'll never get under ambient + 5-10C temps on the chip.. *and fully loaded probably never be able to get it under 60C at the cores.*


In before someone does it!

With my 360 Rad + 6x GT 1850RPM when my loop was new, I topped out at 63C in Prime95 with CPU-Z showing 1.496V, and with this crappy Z77 AsRock board it is closer to 1.55V in reality.
I reckon if you got some XSPC CPU Block and a monster rad you should be able to keep temps sub-60C easily at 1.52V, in Prime atleast.
Real world temps will ofcourse be even lower than that.
Don't even need that.

EDIT: Scratch that, I was actually on my 2500K with the Z77 E4 back then, and the voltage was closer to 1.6V on that when under load in Prime (see my other thread about the issue).
So even with my setup I should relatively easily hit below 60C in Prime at 1.52V.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> In before someone does it!
> ...
> EDIT: Scratch that, I was actually on my 2500K with the Z77 E4 back then, and the voltage was closer to 1.6V on that when under load in Prime (see my other thread about the issue).
> So even with my setup I should relatively easily hit below 60C in Prime at 1.52V.


Yes, naturally it is 'possible' - which is why I said "_PROBABLY_" - it is not *probable*... If I opened up my windows and got my office down in the 16C area right now I'm sure I could keep things well below 60C under load - most of the time in Prime95 my temps look just like they did in my screenshot above - which are below that point. However, the point I was _trying_ to make was that if the delta to TjMAX isn't at least 60C-70C... (i.e. using sub-zero cooling) then it's much riskier to go above the 1.52v level.

Also when I said "fully loaded" I was much more referring to an AVX load (IBT run or similar) rather than P95.









You are completely free to run every chip you have at 1.6v or even higher... that's up to you to decide. However, based on Intel specifications, you could definitely see degradation in your chip at that level.


----------



## Hereisphilly

Pentium E2140 done!


Time to do this for real next week!
In order to join the club, do i have to get temp readings before and after i delid, or will after suffice?
Im currently on the Intel stock cooler as i'm in limbo between an H80 and a full custom loop with an EK supremacy.
I'm going naked, and dont really want the hassle of mounting once with my loop, getting a reading, then breaking it down to delid


----------



## Swag

MAX Vcore: *To Infinity and Beyond!*



I don't run mine too crazy high but I know our resident







(Valgaur) likes to run ridiculous voltages on air cooling... Hahahahahah!

My first post in forever! <3


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> MAX Vcore: *To Infinity and Beyond!*
> 
> 
> 
> I don't run mine too crazy high but I know our resident
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Valgaur) likes to run ridiculous voltages on air cooling... Hahahahahah!
> 
> My first post in forever! <3


no no mesa no heres


----------



## ooostephen

I'm concerned about Liquid Metal Pro/Ultra running onto the capacitors. I know you can put super glue or nail polish over them, but when that dries its taller than the die, and may make for a poor contact with the die for a bare mount. I'd like to know how have others handled this?


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I'm concerned about Liquid Metal Pro/Ultra running onto the capacitors. I know you can put super glue or nail polish over them, but when that dries its taller than the die, and may make for a poor contact with the die for a bare mount. I'd like to know how have others handled this?


Put some non conductive paste over them.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Yes, naturally it is 'possible' - which is why I said "_PROBABLY_" - it is not *probable*... If I opened up my windows and got my office down in the 16C area right now I'm sure I could keep things well below 60C under load - most of the time in Prime95 my temps look just like they did in my screenshot above - which are below that point. However, the point I was _trying_ to make was that if the delta to TjMAX isn't at least 60C-70C... (i.e. using sub-zero cooling) then it's much riskier to go above the 1.52v level.
> 
> Also when I said "fully loaded" I was much more referring to an AVX load (IBT run or similar) rather than P95.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are completely free to run every chip you have at 1.6v or even higher... that's up to you to decide. *However, based on Intel specifications, you could definitely see degradation in your chip at that level.*


But I haven't yet, not on my 2500K or this 3570K.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I'm concerned about Liquid Metal Pro/Ultra running onto the capacitors. I know you can put super glue or nail polish over them, but when that dries its taller than the die, and may make for a poor contact with the die for a bare mount. I'd like to know how have others handled this?


I used liquid electrical tape. Very thin layer as you can see in the picture.









Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk


----------



## Quamba

OCN name:Quamba
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: 500
OC after delid: 4.8Ghz
Temp drops: ~24c

I did lapp the IHS at the same time i delidded it so there is some room for temperature variance in there. here are some pics!




temps are still around the same at 4.8ghz that they were at 4.3, still need to mess with some voltages to see if i can get it to drop some more, running a little higher than i like.

validation: Your verified dump is now viewable here : http://valid.canardpc.com/iiqp87


----------



## Barefooter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I'm concerned about Liquid Metal Pro/Ultra running onto the capacitors. I know you can put super glue or nail polish over them, but when that dries its taller than the die, and may make for a poor contact with the die for a bare mount. I'd like to know how have others handled this?


I had this same concern. I just got some clear nail polish, but have not performed the delid yet. I have not been able to find much info on the nail polish part. I'm just going to put a thin coat and let it dry real good first. I have to cover the capacitors, don't want to risk not covering them.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quamba*
> 
> OCN name:Quamba
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 500
> OC after delid: 4.8Ghz
> Temp drops: ~24c
> 
> I did lapp the IHS at the same time i delidded it so there is some room for temperature variance in there. here are some pics!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> temps are still around the same at 4.8ghz that they were at 4.3, still need to mess with some voltages to see if i can get it to drop some more, running a little higher than i like.
> 
> validation: Your verified dump is now viewable here : http://valid.canardpc.com/iiqp87


You're in!







hasn't been a sub in a while!







Slappa dat Sig on! Very nice Oc onto that chip sir


----------



## ooostephen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Barefooter*
> 
> I had this same concern. I just got some clear nail polish, but have not performed the delid yet. I have not been able to find much info on the nail polish part. I'm just going to put a thin coat and let it dry real good first. I have to cover the capacitors, don't want to risk not covering them.


I decided to go with plain old electrical tape. With the tape on, I flipped the CPU upside down on a glass surface and i was able to clearly see it was lower than the die.

Still not sure what to do about the possibility of any CLU run off, and I'm doing a bare mount.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> But I haven't yet, not on my 2500K or this 3570K.


And you might never see any... but despite what you may think, your experience is not indicative of everyone's (as this line of discussion was started in the first place by someone who saw significant degradation at 1.6v). I know many smokers who have neither heart disease nor cancer, I know heavy drinkers who have healthy livers... does this mean that cigarettes and excessive alcohol consumption are actually harmless? I'm glad that your experience is a good one - but it's specious reasoning to believe that such an experience is conclusive evidence against the specified limits.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Barefooter*
> 
> I had this same concern. I just got some clear nail polish, but have not performed the delid yet. I have not been able to find much info on the nail polish part. I'm just going to put a thin coat and let it dry real good first. I have to cover the capacitors, don't want to risk not covering them.
> 
> 
> 
> I decided to go with plain old electrical tape. With the tape on, I flipped the CPU upside down on a glass surface and i was able to clearly see it was lower than the die.
> 
> Still not sure what to do about the possibility of any CLU run off, and I'm doing a bare mount.
Click to expand...

CLU, when applied correctly, should not have "run off". You only need the thinnest layer of it. I would poke a guess I used 1/4 or less than the usual "grain of rice" method to get the best results, with absolutely 0 run off. If it is squeezing out the sides and onto the the pcb, you have missed the mark.


----------



## Barefooter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I decided to go with plain old electrical tape. With the tape on, I flipped the CPU upside down on a glass surface and i was able to clearly see it was lower than the die.
> 
> Still not sure what to do about the possibility of any CLU run off, and I'm doing a bare mount.


Good to know the die is lower. Looks like the tape will work fine. Easy to remove later too.


----------



## ooostephen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> CLU, when applied correctly, should not have "run off". You only need the thinnest layer of it. I would poke a guess I used 1/4 or less than the usual "grain of rice" method to get the best results, with absolutely 0 run off. If it is squeezing out the sides and onto the the pcb, you have missed the mark.


Thanks for the tip.
My first couple of mounts using EK Precision kit left me with the impression the block was not applying enough pressure to make for a good mount, and so a thicker layer of TIM would be needed increasing runoff potential. I'm now leaning away from that idea and hopefully a thinner layer of CLU with the EK mount will give me good results.


----------



## djthrottleboi

wow i find this after i did it
well i'm at a stable 4.7 GHz on my i5-3570k with games and heavy activites topping out at 72 though intelburn test will pull a 94 vcore is at 1.300
http://puu.sh/54nkf here a link and http://puu.sh/54ntI
http://puu.sh/54njJ last one is temps


----------



## Quamba

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hasn't been a sub in a while!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa dat Sig on! Very nice Oc onto that chip sir


Thanks! tweaked with the voltage some more and could not get 4.8ghz to stabalize under 1.336v core v. I did get it to stabalize(I think) at 5.0ghz @ 1.376v core v for some reason with the same temps, weird. I am saying I think because thats only after 2 hours of prime. Currently at work so I left it running. when I get off in the next 10 hours and make it home has not crashed by then i'll call it good.

Your verified dump is now viewable here : http://valid.canardpc.com/gwqh4u


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quamba*
> 
> Thanks! tweaked with the voltage some more and could not get 4.8ghz to stabalize under 1.336v core v. I did get it to stabalize(I think) at 5.0ghz @ 1.376v core v for some reason with the same temps, weird. I am saying I think because thats only after 2 hours of prime. Currently at work so I left it running. when I get off in the next 10 hours and make it home has not crashed by then i'll call it good.
> 
> Your verified dump is now viewable here : http://valid.canardpc.com/gwqh4u


Very nice if it remains stable at that level - seems like you could hit 5.2GHz on that chip pretty easily.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quamba*
> 
> Thanks! tweaked with the voltage some more and could not get 4.8ghz to stabalize under 1.336v core v. I did get it to stabalize(I think) at 5.0ghz @ 1.376v core v for some reason with the same temps, weird. I am saying I think because thats only after 2 hours of prime. Currently at work so I left it running. when I get off in the next 10 hours and make it home has not crashed by then i'll call it good.
> 
> Your verified dump is now viewable here : http://valid.canardpc.com/gwqh4u


Updated!







Nice Oc btw


----------



## staffy007

I finally bit the bullet and delidded my 3770k( hammer and block of wood).got the weirdest look from my friend when I asked to use his vice and a hammer and pulled the cpu out of my pocket








I used coollabs liquid pro and wow ,@4853 1.29v max temps in Intels UTX is 63c was up around 82+c before delid ,so going to try 5ghz and check temps. a bit trickier on the z77 mpower than the asrock z68 professional this thing needs more volts


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *staffy007*
> 
> I finally bit the bullet and delidded my 3770k( hammer and block of wood).got the weirdest look from my friend when I asked to use his vice and a hammer and pulled the cpu out of my pocket
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used coollabs liquid pro and wow ,@4853 1.29v max temps in Intels UTX is 63c was up around 82+c before delid ,so going to try 5ghz and check temps. a bit trickier on the z77 mpower than the asrock z68 professional this thing needs more volts


i say go for it i have 4.7 stable but switching to a bigger case brought my temps up which i find weird cause it has an aio sitting on it with a 120mm fan on both sides of the rad plus the case fans and 2 extras


----------



## Hereisphilly

Does anyone have any recommendations for cleaning up a delidded chip? Specifically what implement to use for scraping off the silicone glue off the chip without damaging it.
Will a credit card work or should i use fingernails?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Does anyone have any recommendations for cleaning up a delidded chip? Specifically what implement to use for scraping off the silicone glue off the chip without damaging it.
> Will a credit card work or should i use fingernails?


I used isopropyl alcohol and a credit card to scrape it off. A CPU isn't as fragile as you think, it's actually one of the parts in the entire PC that's pretty sturdy especially since they've gotten rid of the pins on Intel chips.


----------



## Hereisphilly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I used isopropyl alcohol and a credit card to scrape it off. A CPU isn't as fragile as you think, it's actually one of the parts in the entire PC that's pretty sturdy especially since they've gotten rid of the pins on Intel chips.


Cool, thanks for that, i guess i was a bit concerned with all the reports of scratched pcbs, but i guess all those were done using a hard razor


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I dont even think its possible to scratch the pcb with the creditcard, just be careful and dont rush it


----------



## Scott1541

I scraped my glue off with a credit card, but I did end up leaving a very thin layer on because I didn't want to scrape too hard. I'd heard they were fairly tough but I didn't want to risk it for not much gain.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Does anyone have any recommendations for cleaning up a delidded chip? Specifically what implement to use for scraping off the silicone glue off the chip without damaging it.
> Will a credit card work or should i use fingernails?


I wanted to be safe and used my fingernails. It took pretty long to have it perfect. Using a cloth to soak the silicon glue in alcohol (not isopropyl, normal ethanol) seemed to do something to the glue, possibly making it somewhat brittle.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I wanted to be safe and used my fingernails. It took pretty long to have it perfect. Using a cloth to soak the silicon glue in alcohol (not isopropyl, normal ethanol) seemed to do something to the glue, possibly making it somewhat brittle.


i preferred my fingernails
i say its the safest way or a credit card maybe


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I also used a credit card - and don't worry about it scratching the PCB... the CC is way less durable. One of the other things you can use is a plastic spudger if you have one - that's actually the best, but it didn't occur to me until I was done and the CC was right there with me.

If you push really, really hard (as I did on a couple spots) your CC will actually start deforming... but the PCB will be completely unharmed.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I also used a credit card - and don't worry about it scratching the PCB... the CC is way less durable. One of the other things you can use is a plastic spudger if you have one - that's actually the best, but it didn't occur to me until I was done and the CC was right there with me.
> 
> If you push really, really hard (as I did on a couple spots) your CC will actually start deforming... but the PCB will be completely unharmed.


does this make us crafters wish i would have paid more attention to arts and crafts now rofl


----------



## Raikkok

Hi everybody.

I´m a 4770k owner and i´m seriously thinking about delided my cpu.

i want to use an image, that i find here, in overclock.net

i want to use a razor as method to delid the cpu but i have a question:

ce143256_CIMG1929.jpeg 268k .jpeg file


with the razon..could i damage the part that is inside the red circle?

what methods do you use to protect the VRM when you apply CLP or CLU?

thanks bros









p.d. anybody try with a glue or similar to joint again the his with die?


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raikkok*
> 
> Hi everybody.
> 
> I´m a 4770k owner and i´m seriously thinking about delided my cpu.
> 
> i want to use an image, that i find here, in overclock.net
> 
> i want to use a razor as method to delid the cpu but i have a question:
> 
> ce143256_CIMG1929.jpeg 268k .jpeg file
> 
> 
> with the razon..could i damage the part that is inside the red circle?
> 
> what methods do you use to protect the VRM when you apply CLP or CLU?
> 
> thanks bros
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> p.d. anybody try with a glue or similar to joint again the his with die?


if you aren't scraping it with a razor then it will be fine you just rest the razor on it then slide it in and go to town lol

and no need to put glue on it but it can be done just its easier to let the bracket hold in place unless you have a specifically compatible glue laying around since i'm not sure whats safe to use with a cpu


----------



## HardwareDecoder

just purchased a delidded 3770k from a guy here on ocn. I should be receiving it very shortly as he isn't far from me.

He says it has AS5 on the die I want to put noctua nt-h1 on it, what is the best way to clean the bare die?

I'm guessing a microfiber (lint free) cloth + a little rubbing alcohol is perfectly safe?

and for applying the noctua tim i'm guessing the ihs puts pressure on the die to where I can just use the rice grain method just like it was the top of the ihs ?


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> just purchased a delidded 3770k from a guy here on ocn. I should be receiving it very shortly as he isn't far from me.He says it has AS5 on the die I want to put noctua nt-h1 on it, what is the best way to clean the bare die?I'm guessing a microfiber (lint free) cloth + a little rubbing alcohol is perfectly safe?and for applying the noctua tim i'm guessing the ihs puts pressure on the die to where I can just use the rice grain method just like it was the top of the ihs ?


I usually use tissue and rubbing alcohol.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> I usually use tissue and rubbing alcohol.
> 
> Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk


tissue? I'd imagine that could leave a bunch of fibers behind impeding cooling. Rubbing alcohol is safe then good to know i'll use the microfiber cloth and alcohol then.


----------



## sd5f58s3d2se

I have used IC Daimond many times on bare GPU die and I only had one bad problem with scratches and damage to a block 1 time and that was from what I think was a bad batch of IC Diamond.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sd5f58s3d2se*
> 
> I have used IC Daimond many times on bare GPU die and I only had one bad problem with scratches and damage to a block 1 time and that was from what I think was a bad batch of IC Diamond.


the real matter with that is wether or not you want to take a risk personally i haven't heard anything but rumors about the stuff but i dont have 219 to shell out if it is truth you know. i say if it works for you keep going but be prepared just in case.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> just purchased a delidded 3770k from a guy here on ocn. I should be receiving it very shortly as he isn't far from me.
> 
> He says it has AS5 on the die I want to put noctua nt-h1 on it, what is the best way to clean the bare die?
> 
> I'm guessing a microfiber (lint free) cloth + a little rubbing alcohol is perfectly safe?
> 
> and for applying the noctua tim i'm guessing the ihs puts pressure on the die to where I can just use the rice grain method just like it was the top of the ihs ?


I have always used Isopropyl alcohol wipes made by BD. They always seem to work well and if you make one last straight wipe after all is cleaned you can pick up any strands that were left behind although it never really does leave them anyways unless you are catching them on the corners of the die. As for TIM the die is a much smaller surface than an IHS so the grain of rice may be large for it. I recommend using liquid ultra from cool laboratories for the die always.


----------



## Solonowarion

I use coffee filters for final wipe down.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I use coffee filters for final wipe down.


That is amazingly good idea. Why did I not think of that?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have always used Isopropyl alcohol wipes made by BD. They always seem to work well and if you make one last straight wipe after all is cleaned you can pick up any strands that were left behind although it never really does leave them anyways unless you are catching them on the corners of the die. As for TIM the die is a much smaller surface than an IHS so the grain of rice may be large for it. I recommend using liquid ultra from cool laboratories for the die always.


according to a very well done review I saw the noctua stuff cooled just as good as liquid ultra without all the risks of ultra.

atleast one Amazon review I saw on ultra the Guy said it turned hard as a rock after a year and insulated the chip causing overheating.

so I will stick to the noctua stuff. that being said I did use liquid PRO a year ago for a friend with no issue so far


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raikkok*
> 
> Hi everybody.
> 
> I´m a 4770k owner and i´m seriously thinking about delided my cpu.
> 
> i want to use an image, that i find here, in overclock.net
> 
> i want to use a razor as method to delid the cpu but i have a question:
> 
> ce143256_CIMG1929.jpeg 268k .jpeg file
> 
> 
> with the razon..could i damage the part that is inside the red circle?
> 
> what methods do you use to protect the VRM when you apply CLP or CLU?
> 
> thanks bros
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> p.d. anybody try with a glue or similar to joint again the his with die?


I would rate your chances of damaging the CPU 10X higher using a razor blade than using the hammer and vice method


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Solonowarion*
> 
> I use coffee filters for final wipe down.


Yep, that's what I do as well. The filters don't work as well to pick up large amounts of TIM residue, so I just use a tissue and alcohol for the first few wipes folding it over each time for a clean section. Then I use Indigo Xtreme Clean solvent on a coffee filter for the final wipes to remove tissue fibers and any oily residue that was left over. Every time it looks like it did coming out of the retail box (or maybe even a little cleaner actually).


----------



## HardwareDecoder

anyone here do bare-die mounting with say a 212 cooler or some such? wondering how much better the cooling would be vs using the ihs at all. How dangerous is it to bare-die mount anyway? I would imagine it isn't that dangerous unless you decide to screw it down super hard


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> anyone here do bare-die mounting with say a 212 cooler or some such? wondering how much better the cooling would be vs using the ihs at all. How dangerous is it to bare-die mount anyway? I would imagine it isn't that dangerous unless you decide to screw it down super hard


You dont really need to go with bare die mount and risk anything. My 3770K i sold three months ago was delided, i used Phobya LM between die-ihs. The guy that bought it used a CM 212 Evo. With fans at 85-90%, silent for me, folding at 4.5Ghz with 1.24v, max temps was at 60C with 25c ambient. Now if you insint on going with bare die, there is a kit from EK for this job. It has a stop to prevent from going super tight and risking any damage on the die. People that use water setups report an average of 5C gain. My guess is on air will be less.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> You dont really need to go with bare die mount and risk anything. My 3770K i sold three months ago was delided, i used Phobya LM between die-ihs. The guy that bought it used a CM 212 Evo. With fans at 85-90%, silent for me, folding at 4.5Ghz with 1.24v, max temps was at 60C with 25c ambient. Now if you insint on going with bare die, there is a kit from EK for this job. It has a stop to prevent from going super tight and risking any damage on the die. People that use water setups report an average of 5C gain. My guess is on air will be less.


Yeah i'm not gonna bare mount I don't think. I keep going back and forth between ordering some liquid ultra or not. I already ordered the noctua paste for the ihs>heatsink side.

Seems people have amazing results with liquid ultra but i'm just worried that it seems to be a basically permanent thing once you put it on. I have also seen one claim that it dried out and hardened on a guys chip causing bad thermal performance. If that were to happen idk how I would even get it off.

one review on anandtech said they had about the same performance but there were claims that the guy used way too much liquid ultra invalidating the results.

Maybe I will just order some liquid pro since I put it on a buddy's 3570k and it is still running fine after a year. I really don't want to do anything bad to my new 3770k im getting


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is amazingly good idea. Why did I not think of that?


I use old dirty shop rags with lots of grease and dirt on them and a hershey bar. Works great.


----------



## pilotter

guys, if going bare mount with the Ekwb mount on a supremacy, would you use mx4 or Liquid ultra (both in house), between the block and the die?

Also what would be best elektro tape or nail polish. Think if I use MX4 I don't need to use mx4 on the vrm.


----------



## Cyro999

mx4 i believe is only very slightly worse for direct die, not 1000% sure though


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> mx4 i believe is only very slightly worse for direct die, not 1000% sure though


mx4 is garbage from every review i've seen.


----------



## Cyro999

Well he asked mx4 or CLU for naked mount, IIRC the gap was only a couple degrees like putting it on the IHS (but it's been a while)


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Well he asked mx4 or CLU for naked mount, IIRC the gap was only a couple degrees like putting it on the IHS (but it's been a while)


----------



## Cyro999

Ok good info! It was NT-H1 that was that close to CLU hm..


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Ok good info! It was NT-H1 that was that close to CLU hm..


supposedly..... but in the article it seemed like the guy put on way too much liquid ultra for it to be a valid comparison. He drenched the thing.... He did post pics showing him using a more reasonable amount and claiming the temps were actually worse so idk....

his pic using what appears to be about 20x more ultra than necessary











also he was testing using bare die and not the ihs so i'm thinking the gap between nt-h1 and clu is higher if you actually use the ihs.

link to article: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=34297429

I have actually ordered both the nt-h1 and the liquid ultra since I was going to use it on the heatsink side of the ihs and on my windforce 7950s

i'm going to put nt-h1 on the die and if I am happy with my overclock/temps I will leave it at that, if not i'll use the liquid ultra.

Can anyone advise me on how easy ultra actually is to remove/clean up? supposedly it isn't a pita like pro is....


----------



## Cyro999

LOL that's a lot of CLU

I was under the impression that CLU was pretty much neccesary under-ihs, but not so for bare die or on top of ihs


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> LOL that's a lot of CLU
> 
> I was under the impression that CLU was pretty much neccesary under-ihs, but not so for bare die or on top of ihs


yeah He got called on using way too much but he posted pics later showing a resonable amt and actually claimed the temps were worse with the reasonable amount. Idk the guy really does seem to have a very thorough test setup if you read the article and does not appear to be a dummy so....


----------



## deepor

On top of the IHS, CLU really does not do much compared to normal, good paste. I think I got something like 2C out of it. I feel it might be impossible to make mistakes in the application compared to normal paste, so that's great. You can also reseat the cooler without necessarily cleaning and reapplying it from scratch. It should theoretically keep working perfect forever, but I did not yet use it for more than a year without reseating the cooler for various reasons. I have never seen that hardening behavior people talk about.

That's just the plus sides I see. I'd still recommend to use normal paste on top of the IHS.

MX-4 looking so bad in that comparison is suspicious. The guy might have made a mistake in its application?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> On top of the IHS, CLU really does not do much compared to normal, good paste. I think I got something like 2C out of it. I feel it might be impossible to make mistakes in the application compared to normal paste, so that's great. You can also reseat the cooler without necessarily cleaning and reapplying it from scratch. It should theoretically keep working perfect forever, but I did not yet use it for more than a year without reseating the cooler for various reasons. I have never seen that hardening behavior people talk about.
> 
> That's just the plus sides I see. I'd still recommend to use normal paste on top of the IHS.
> 
> MX-4 looking so bad in that comparison is suspicious. The guy might have made a mistake in its application?


according to the guide he tried it multiple times.


----------



## pilotter

so it should be, or better clu on the die direct with waterblock, and nailpolish or electric tape on the vrm?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I would rate your chances of damaging the CPU 10X higher using a razor blade than using the hammer and vice method


not really, go slow and pay attention and it's very easy.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> supposedly..... but in the article it seemed like the guy put on way too much liquid ultra for it to be a valid comparison. He drenched the thing.... He did post pics showing him using a more reasonable amount and claiming the temps were actually worse so idk....
> 
> his pic using what appears to be about 20x more ultra than necessary
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also he was testing using bare die and not the ihs so i'm thinking the gap between nt-h1 and clu is higher if you actually use the ihs.
> 
> link to article: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=34297429
> 
> I have actually ordered both the nt-h1 and the liquid ultra since I was going to use it on the heatsink side of the ihs and on my windforce 7950s
> 
> i'm going to put nt-h1 on the die and if I am happy with my overclock/temps I will leave it at that, if not i'll use the liquid ultra.
> 
> Can anyone advise me on how easy ultra actually is to remove/clean up? supposedly it isn't a pita like pro is....


vay to much









Sorry i was away for a bit! was busy this weekend on my 775 platform



just a few scores









http://hwbot.org/submission/2446707_
http://hwbot.org/submission/2446720_
http://hwbot.org/submission/2447228_
http://hwbot.org/submission/2447230_
http://hwbot.org/submission/2447231_
http://hwbot.org/submission/2447232_

Rampage extreme motherboard is so pretty!


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> 
> 
> .


Did you miss the CPU with your brush ? If thats after brushed then I am a donkey


----------



## HardwareDecoder

not my pic


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> according to a very well done review I saw the noctua stuff cooled just as good as liquid ultra without all the risks of ultra.
> 
> atleast one Amazon review I saw on ultra the Guy said it turned hard as a rock after a year and insulated the chip causing overheating.
> 
> so I will stick to the noctua stuff. that being said I did use liquid PRO a year ago for a friend with no issue so far


Nothing from Noctua comes even close to performance of CLP/CLU.

CLP hardens, don't know about CLU yet, only had it for a few weeks.
My CLP hardened after 8-10 months of use.


----------



## Lionheart1980

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Nothing from Noctua comes even close to performance of CLP/CLU.
> 
> CLP hardens, don't know about CLU yet, only had it for a few weeks.
> My CLP hardened after 8-10 months of use.


I would go with Gelid Extreme... imo. i had Noctua and still have em.. but when i switched to Gelid.. oh my what a difference. Few deg dropped.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> according to a very well done review I saw the noctua stuff cooled just as good as liquid ultra without all the risks of ultra.
> 
> atleast one Amazon review I saw on ultra the Guy said it turned hard as a rock after a year and insulated the chip causing overheating.
> 
> so I will stick to the noctua stuff. that being said I did use liquid PRO a year ago for a friend with no issue so far


That is on a full sized heatsink not on a die of smaller area. You are welcome to try the noctua but i think you will not be very satisfied with the result. It is well documented in this thread that coolabs beats regular tims in on die performance by at least 10c. I have also used both myself and observed a 15c difference.


----------



## Cyro999

It's maybe different for direct die though


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Nothing from Noctua comes even close to performance of CLP/CLU.
> 
> CLP hardens, don't know about CLU yet, only had it for a few weeks.
> My CLP hardened after 8-10 months of use.


if it hardens on the chip what does that mean exactly? Is the chip screwed, is it removeable without damaging the chip at that point? Cause if I'm gonna end up ruining a chip for cooler temps I won't put it anywhere near my chip


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> yeah He got called on using way too much but he posted pics later showing a resonable amt and actually claimed the temps were worse with the reasonable amount. Idk the guy really does seem to have a very thorough test setup if you read the article and does not appear to be a dummy so....


same thing happend to me every one say's i put to much


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








but look at them temps









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!




i no it was cold out


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> if it hardens on the chip what does that mean exactly? Is the chip screwed, is it removeable without damaging the chip at that point? Cause if I'm gonna end up ruining a chip for cooler temps I won't put it anywhere near my chip


It was barely hardened on my core when I took my loop apart, on the IHS-CPU Block it was much harder than it was on Core-IHS.
Also the little hardened bit that the Core had came off very easily where as on the IHS it took some effort to get the hardened stuff off.

So I would say there is nothing to worry about even if it does harden on your Core as it comes off very easily regardless.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> if it hardens on the chip what does that mean exactly? Is the chip screwed, is it removeable without damaging the chip at that point? Cause if I'm gonna end up ruining a chip for cooler temps I won't put it anywhere near my chip


It's liquid pro that hardens not liquid ultra I think you'll be okay because neither of them will stick to the die the only stick to the metal of the heat sink after a long time Which is also removable it just takes scrubbing


----------



## djthrottleboi

do you think i can mount my corsair h60 direct die?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Okay cool I think i'm gonna use ultra on my cpu.

I took apart my 7950's to change the paste on them and have been thinking about using ultra on them.

See these pics here

http://www.overclock.net/t/1439691/gigabyte-radeon-7950-windforce-3-rev-2-0-dissasembly-guide-with-crappy-pictures

it seems like the heatsink contact to the die is copper, what scares me is the tiny little parts near the chip. Ultra being electrically conductive it is probably a bad idea to use any cool labs product with those tiny little parts so close right?


----------



## ooostephen

I don't like to download images so I didn't see the red spots, but in general you can damage any area of the package. Be careful to keep the blade on a level plain with the package, and move the blade left to right, not up and down, while your trying to get under the IHS. For the VRMs, I just went with electrical tape.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I don't like to download images so I didn't see the red spots, but in general you can damage any area of the package. Be careful to keep the blade on a level plain with the package, and move the blade left to right, not up and down, while your trying to get under the IHS. For the VRMs, I just went with electrical tape.


I always tried to have the blade angled prying
Upwards so the point would always be facing the ihs rather than the pcb. I didn't make any scratches like that.


----------



## ooostephen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I always tried to have the blade angled prying
> Upwards so the point would always be facing the ihs rather than the pcb. I didn't make any scratches like that.


I know what you mean. Once I've gotten securely under the IHS I try to get the blade to scrape the bottom of the IHS as much as possible. When I most definitely do not use angular force is when trying to get under the IHS. That tends to cause the blade to pop out in a sudden jerky fashion, and that scratches the pcb. I think the delid video at the start of this threads shows that happening. I've done it, its easy to do, and it kills the cpu.


----------



## stickg1

I bought a couple of 3570Ks and think I have a winner. This one ended up being stable at 1.16v so far for 12 hours Prime95 custom blend. The temps across the cores are all really tight too.



The voltage above is when I was trying "how low can you go" I got down to 1.125v before I would fail a core quickly. I think I can get away with 1.145v but 1.16v seems rock solid. I haven't delidded yet and I'm just using CM's Hyper T4 for cooling.


----------



## Gil80

Dudes,

Which timer are you using to de-lid the IHT?
I read it should be Pine but it's quite hard. At first I was thinking of using balsa wood but I cannot find it here in Sydney.

Are there specific types of Pine I should look for?

Thanks!


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I bought a couple of 3570Ks and think I have a winner. This one ended up being stable at 1.16v so far for 12 hours Prime95 custom blend. The temps across the cores are all really tight too.
> 
> 
> 
> The voltage above is when I was trying "how low can you go" I got down to 1.125v before I would fail a core quickly. I think I can get away with 1.145v but 1.16v seems rock solid. I haven't delidded yet and I'm just using CM's Hyper T4 for cooling.


thats about the same i got stable with 1.118 though but man its quite a jump above 4.5 like i'm at 4.9 and vcore is stable 1.4


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Dudes,
> 
> Which timer are you using to de-lid the IHT?
> I read it should be Pine but it's quite hard. At first I was thinking of using balsa wood but I cannot find it here in Sydney.
> 
> Are there specific types of Pine I should look for?
> 
> Thanks!


I first used something that was too soft and deformed where it was hit and where it touched the CPU's PCB. I couldn't get the PCB and IHS to separate with that even when hitting pretty hard and getting scared. After switching to something harder, it came off with the third hit.

There's also some guy here in this thread that did it with a broken HDD, which means he used metal (aluminium?) instead of wood. So it apparently works with something totally random, it just has to be hard enough instead of soft.


----------



## Swag

I don't know what 'timer' means.









I haven't seen a regular post on this thread in so long.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I first used something that was too soft and deformed where it was hit and where it touched the CPU's PCB. I couldn't get the PCB and IHS to separate with that even when hitting pretty hard and getting scared. After switching to something harder, it came off with the third hit.
> 
> There's also some guy here in this thread that did it with a broken HDD, which means he used metal (aluminium?) instead of wood. So it apparently works with something totally random, it just has to be hard enough instead of soft.


i just used a flat head to pry just slid and lift cause the razor got most of the muck off lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Dudes,
> 
> Which timer are you using to de-lid the IHT?
> I read it should be Pine but it's quite hard. At first I was thinking of using balsa wood but I cannot find it here in Sydney.
> 
> Are there specific types of Pine I should look for?
> 
> Thanks!


any hard wood. oak works.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Dudes,
> 
> Which timer are you using to de-lid the IHT?
> I read it should be Pine but it's quite hard. At first I was thinking of using balsa wood but I cannot find it here in Sydney.
> 
> Are there specific types of Pine I should look for?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> any hard wood. oak works.
Click to expand...

Any 'hard wood'. Very common in the morning.







Hahahahah! I'm bored. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Any 'hard wood'. Very common in the morning.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hahahahah! I'm bored. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻


rofl same here


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Any 'hard wood'. Very common in the morning.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hahahahah! I'm bored. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻


----------



## Barefooter

I just used two pine blocks worked perfect, third hit and it popped right off. I followed the method in this thread http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded

I lapped it too while it was delidded.


----------



## ooostephen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djthrottleboi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I first used something that was too soft and deformed where it was hit and where it touched the CPU's PCB. I couldn't get the PCB and IHS to separate with that even when hitting pretty hard and getting scared. After switching to something harder, it came off with the third hit.
> 
> There's also some guy here in this thread that did it with a broken HDD, which means he used metal (aluminium?) instead of wood. So it apparently works with something totally random, it just has to be hard enough instead of soft.
> 
> 
> 
> i just used a flat head to pry just slid and lift cause the razor got most of the muck off lol
Click to expand...

After the difficulty I had with the razor blade approach, I'm thinking that investing in a vice is the way to go for next time.

How about baking it first to loosen up the glue? I saw post where the guy left it in the front seat of his car on a sunny day, for half a day. The IHS go too hot to touch, but the glue was soft and it easily separated.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


>


LoL! (yea.. Im slow -_-)


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> After the difficulty I had with the razor blade approach, I'm thinking that investing in a vice is the way to go for next time.
> 
> How about baking it first to loosen up the glue? I saw post where the guy left it in the front seat of his car on a sunny day, for half a day. The IHS go too hot to touch, but the glue was soft and it easily separated.


thats a great idea if i wasn't in wisconsin lol


----------



## djthrottleboi

i think i will lap it now that its delidded


----------



## Chomuco

fail go nooooo,, ja!!


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> fail go nooooo,, ja!!


that has to hurt


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> fail go nooooo,, ja!!


What happened? Was that with the hammer/vice?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> fail go nooooo,, ja!!


ouch! it doesnt look like any traces actually died....if it was me, i would put a piece of electrical tape over it and see if it boots. it might be silly, but you never know.


----------



## battleaxe

Lemme guess. Razor blade method and pried it off before all glue was cut through?

That sucks.


----------



## Lionheart1980

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Lemme guess. Razor blade method and pried it off before all glue was cut through?
> 
> That sucks.


Nah, its looks like hammer and vise method.. imo.. ouchy


----------



## Sirstiv

buy some liquid electrical tape. apply ****loads.


----------



## Swag

Duck tape. 'nuff said!

Looks like it was a razor method. He probably cut into it a bit and when he tried prying off the lid, it pulled off the top with the weak point being the little cut. I don't see how it would be a vice method problem unless he did it wrong because the glue shouldn't have THAT much adherence to the PCB and IHS.


----------



## battleaxe

My money says razor. Lets get a little wager going on this...


----------



## Swag

I'm taking in E-peen points right now.

I'll start it off by betting 50 E-peen points on razor!


----------



## battleaxe

I dont' even know what E-peen is but I'm in for razor being the culprit.

I'll bet a plus 1 to everyone in here that says its hammer and if I lose (if the hammer vice method was what did it) (can I do that?) If that's not legal let me know.
But I figure it makes it fun at least.


----------



## battleaxe

While we're at it lets get a wager going that it is still alive. My bet is that it will still work. Fully functional.


----------



## Valgaur

its razor look at the blade mark in the top right corner.

Sorry to see a chip go like that man, hopefully you can get another soon and get your rig back going!


----------



## lilchronic

to me it looks like hammer and vice method went bad but could also be razor method with that blade mark.

hopefully chomuco dosent leave us hanging for too long and tell us what happend









actually at the top right it looks more like a crack instead of a razor mark now that i blew it up and looked at it more

@battleaxe my money is on vice and hammer


----------



## Swag

A bit OT but just wondering, does normal LED yellow over time like OLED?


----------



## InCoGnIt0

I am going to have to say razor cause if you use the hammer and vise method the TIM always gets mushed up on one side cause it slides sideways when you hit it.


----------



## Gil80

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Any 'hard wood'. Very common in the morning.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hahahahah! I'm bored. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻




Now... what is lapping?


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> 
> 
> Now... what is lapping?


With a cpu, it is sanding the top of the IHS flat. Some are flat, some a bit concave or convex.

In relation to hard wood, something that will disappoint your girlfriend if you don't do it.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> With a cpu, it is sanding the top of the IHS flat. Some are flat, some a bit concave or convex.
> 
> In relation to hard wood, something that will disappoint your girlfriend if you don't do it.


LOL... oh no....


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I kind of want to know his answer though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it hammer or knife???


I'm asking the moderator involved if (and I assume it is) it's OK to PM him in Spanish to attempt to get to the bottom of the matter. I understand the fact that there was apparently abuse/circumvention of content-restriction clauses in the rules by non-English posters... but still.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I kind of want to know his answer though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it hammer or knife???
> 
> 
> 
> I'm asking the moderator involved if (and I assume it is) it's OK to PM him in Spanish to attempt to get to the bottom of the matter. I understand the fact that there was apparently abuse/circumvention of content-restriction clauses in the rules by non-English posters... but still.
Click to expand...

Hmm, not sure about that.







You can ask and tell us what happens!


----------



## alancsalt

I would say go to PM with this. Make it an "all-party" PM.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

If he replies to PM I will post response here (in English of course) so everyone will know. I have to say based on the scratches in the glue visible in the lower right corner that it's almost definitely a razor blade failure... but I could be wrong about that.

EDIT: I was wrong about that... it was a hammer & vise. He said:

"Hammer and vise hit very hard and it did that" (my crude translation)


----------



## Swag

It took me a little longer but I wanted to verify to make sure I understood what he meant.









Yea, he did use the hammer&vice method. He gave it 3 strong whacks and it came off like that. I guess we can count the very first vice method death.







I don't see how that glue could have stronger adherence to the PCB versus to itself... Makes no sense but I guess that's that.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Wow I was 99% sure it was a razor cause if you hit it with the hammer and it pushes the TIM to one side of the die, but I was wrong.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> If he replies to PM I will post response here (in English of course) so everyone will know. I have to say based on the scratches in the glue visible in the lower right corner that it's almost definitely a razor blade failure... but I could be wrong about that.
> 
> EDIT: I was wrong about that... it was a hammer & vise. He said:
> 
> "Hammer and vise hit very hard and it did that" (my crude translation)


i knew it lolz


----------



## Mozz13

WOAHHH.. Now that is something that you won't see everyday. I thought I was hammering mine hard enough until I saw that.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> My money says razor. Lets get a little wager going on this...


I will go with razor/tack hammer

Edit: wow hammer vice?? He must have hit it with a baseball swing...


----------



## battleaxe

Well, I guess I owe some of you +1's on this one. I can't believe it was the hammer method. Wow. I think he Happy Gilmore'd!

LOL

Edited: you've been +1'd if you voted Hammer!


----------



## Valgaur

enough guys don't make people feel bad......


----------



## HardwareDecoder

All you guys talking crap should grow up and realize that could easily have been you. It isn't like delidding is an exact science


----------



## Swag

Hahahahaha! He doesn't mind. He was mad that he didn't get it successfully but apparently he's going to buy a new chip soon to do it again.









So I guess whoever is in charge of the Hammer and Vice method thread should include the very first recorded account of a CPU dying from that method. It is sad since that method had a really good streak but everything great must come to an end. Although, that method is still very good and should not be hindered by this one failure. We all should learn from this failure that whacking it too hard could pull it off its PCB and create a $300 paperweight. Small whacks.

Something we all should've taken out of this account: Short, multiple bangs completely outweigh one bang.







One bang could result in the physical instability of the CPU or financial instability of a man. Hahahaha! PS, married people.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Hahahahaha! He doesn't mind. He was mad that he didn't get it successfully but apparently he's going to buy a new chip soon to do it again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I guess whoever is in charge of the Hammer and Vice method thread should include the very first recorded account of a CPU dying from that method. It is sad since that method had a really good streak but everything great must come to an end. Although, that method is still very good and should not be hindered by this one failure. We all should learn from this failure that whacking it too hard could pull it off its PCB and create a $300 paperweight. Small whacks.
> 
> Something we all should've taken out of this account: Short, multiple bangs completely outweigh one bang.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One bang could result in the physical instability of the CPU or financial instability of a man. Hahahaha! PS, married people.


I've always preferred short multiple bangs my self


----------



## Sirstiv

took me like 50-60 short bangs.... makes most sense, the damn chip isn't an anvil and your not a blacksmith!


----------



## battleaxe

About four smacks on er' and I got er' off with no problem.


----------



## djthrottleboi

this is my first time oc'ing and all and i delidded with the razor method in 10 minutes so it couldn't be the razor method because it was way too easy


----------



## ivanlabrie

Hi guys...long time no see, since I moved away from that beeyetch 1155/1150 mainstream platform. Had a terrible experience with it and Asus








Enjoying my hassle free x79 rig now








I decided it would be better to focus on 3d benchmarking on water than going for max 2d perf and decent all around 3d. I'm saving for a 4930k, and already got a 3820 and a CM Glacer 240l.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> Hi guys...long time no see, since I moved away from that beeyetch 1155/1150 mainstream platform. Had a terrible experience with it and Asus
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enjoying my hassle free x79 rig now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I decided it would be better to focus on 3d benchmarking on water than going for max 2d perf and decent all around 3d. I'm saving for a 4930k, and already got a 3820 and a CM Glacer 240l.


hurry your slow butt up and let me see scores!


----------



## ooostephen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djthrottleboi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> After the difficulty I had with the razor blade approach, I'm thinking that investing in a vice is the way to go for next time.
> 
> How about baking it first to loosen up the glue? I saw post where the guy left it in the front seat of his car on a sunny day, for half a day. The IHS go too hot to touch, but the glue was soft and it easily separated.
> 
> 
> 
> thats a great idea if i wasn't in wisconsin lol
Click to expand...

I like the idea of baking it. My oven's low is 170F/76c, which is less than 212 tjmax of Haswell. I don't know of any harm in baking it, as long as nothing conductive comes in contact with it.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I like the idea of baking it. My oven's low is 170F/76c, which is less than 212 tjmax of Haswell. I don't know of any harm in baking it, as long as nothing conductive comes in contact with it.


doesn't that tjmax refer to the die it's self, I'd wonder at what temp the pcb would melt... I'm not sure an oven is a good idea.


----------



## tw33k

You know how crazy we must seem to people? We take a $300+ computer component, slice it with a razor, whack it with a hammer and now you wanna bake it in the oven? The things OCing makes you do


----------



## lilchronic

just throwing this out there so no one feels bad









my first delid was a fail ...... well i thought it was broken till about six months later i decided to try it with one stick of ram and it worked



..... i sold it to hokies


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> You know how crazy we must seem to people? We take a $300+ computer component, slice it with a razor, whack it with a hammer and now you wanna bake it in the oven? The things OCing makes you do


Hahaha, epic quote


----------



## ooostephen

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> doesn't that tjmax refer to the die it's self, I'd wonder at what temp the pcb would melt... I'm not sure an oven is a good idea.


Hadn't thought of that. Come to think of it, I don't know what material the PCB is made of. I had assumed some type composite wood/paper. I did see a post on the L2N board where a guy put his mobo through the dishwasher, which seems to get pretty hot.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Hahaha, epic quote


lol ikr after i got done i felt like i was a drug addict after a fix i was pushing for 4.9 hard lol and i didn't stop either


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ooostephen*
> 
> I like the idea of baking it. My oven's low is 170F/76c, which is less than 212 tjmax of Haswell. I don't know of any harm in baking it, as long as nothing conductive comes in contact with it.


yea but i was scared of baking the other parts cause i know the die's tjmax but not the temp max on everything else as this is my first time i figured i was taking enough chances lol i got 4.9 GHz on my first oc now though lol now to push for 5.2


----------



## Swag

The PCB definitely won't melt in the oven... We plop in GPUs inside the ovens, I'm pretty sure a CPU can handle the same process.


----------



## Gil80

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> With a cpu, it is sanding the top of the IHS flat. Some are flat, some a bit concave or convex.
> 
> In relation to hard wood, something that will disappoint your girlfriend if you don't do it.


LOL!

Thanks for the creative reply









Why would anyone want to sand the IHS?

P.S. - I just got my replacement 3770K after a failed 1st de-lid with a Boxcutter.
Going to Vice+Hammer... I need some pointers... though I feel the fear of trying it again... I know I won't resist the urge


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> LOL!
> 
> Thanks for the creative reply
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why would anyone want to sand the IHS?
> 
> P.S. - I just got my replacement 3770K after a failed 1st de-lid with a Boxcutter.
> Going to Vice+Hammer... I need some pointers... though I feel the fear of trying it again... I know I won't resist the urge


It depends on the IHS. They are usually pretty flat & sanding doesn't make much if any difference, but sometimes you get one that has all the edges higher than the center & they can struggle with temps a bit more. Lapping can even it out better & improve the temps.


----------



## defiler2k

So I'm in the process of rebuilding my loop with hard tubing and when I pulled my block I was met with dried CLU on my block. The die was fine and cleaned up easy however the copper block had a crust that I literally had to sand off. Now I have to re polish and re do the finish on the block, any advise on how to get that mirror finish back?

I took some pictures. 


Lessons learned CLU still dries out on metals other than the Plating of the IHS. The good thing is that my chip was in perfect shape, it just whipped clean.


----------



## djthrottleboi

guess all thats left now is to see if i can save a few more degrees by lapping


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djthrottleboi*
> 
> guess all thats left now is to see if i can save a few more degrees by lapping


You can give it the razor blade test to see if it's flat, run the edge vertically across the IHS in the light & if you get light beaming through between the center of the IHS & the blade it's a good candidate, or if the center is too high & the blade rocks (convex) that can't be too good for the mount.
I tried it on a cpu once without checking, it obviously wasn't needed & lapping made no difference.

The blade has many uses!


----------



## Swag

Lapping doesn't help as much any more versus back in the day. Mainly because nowadays, CPU cooler producers create their products to fit the CPUs shape. Before, they would always make them a certain way regardless of the CPUs having a concave shape. You will be lucky to see a 1 - 2C drop.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lapping doesn't help as much any more versus back in the day. Mainly because nowadays, CPU cooler producers create their products to fit the CPUs shape. Before, they would always make them a certain way regardless of the CPUs having a concave shape. You will be lucky to see a 1 - 2C drop.


And based on Valgaur's Intel RMA conversation (and mine actually was similar) the one thing you can _guarantee_ to eliminate the possibility of getting a replacement chip if something should go wrong. To me that's worth a heck of a lot more than a couple of degrees in the best case scenario. Not to mention that you've further reduced the likelihood of resale as there's no visual proof that the chip is what you say it is. On the other hand - if you're selling on OCN that's probably not a big deal - especially since it's delidded as well.

Regardless I think those are a couple of arguments that are at least worth considering before you start lapping a CPU.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Lapping doesn't help as much any more versus back in the day. Mainly because nowadays, CPU cooler producers create their products to fit the CPUs shape. Before, they would always make them a certain way regardless of the CPUs having a concave shape. You will be lucky to see a 1 - 2C drop.
> 
> 
> 
> And based on Valgaur's Intel RMA conversation (and mine actually was similar) the one thing you can _guarantee_ to eliminate the possibility of getting a replacement chip if something should go wrong. To me that's worth a heck of a lot more than a couple of degrees in the best case scenario. Not to mention that you've further reduced the likelihood of resale as there's no visual proof that the chip is what you say it is. On the other hand - if you're selling on OCN that's probably not a big deal - especially since it's delidded as well.
> 
> Regardless I think those are a couple of arguments that are at least worth considering before you start lapping a CPU.
Click to expand...

I was about to say that, it completely takes away your warranty. I've actually had the same exact experience with Intel already. I've had a yes/no situation from them, I've had my first dead chip from the Corsair PSU incident replace but I did the same thing to a friend's CPU and it resulted in them denying the RMA.









Although, yea, lapping is definitely not worth the warranty void!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I'm in the process of rebuilding my loop with hard tubing and when I pulled my block I was met with dried CLU on my block. The die was fine and cleaned up easy however the copper block had a crust that I literally had to sand off.


Did you try first with isopropyl alcohol?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Did you try first with isopropyl alcohol?


Yup tried alcohol and thermal compound cleaning products. Nothing worked!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Yup tried alcohol and thermal compound cleaning products. Nothing worked!


this is what scares me about possibly using liquid ultra...... I don't want to lose a chip for better temps


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Yup tried alcohol and thermal compound cleaning products. Nothing worked!
> 
> 
> 
> this is what scares me about possibly using liquid ultra...... I don't want to lose a chip for better temps
Click to expand...

They are refering to the metal on the water block. It comes off the die without any issues whatsoever.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> They are refering to the metal on the water block. It comes off the die without any issues whatsoever.


why does it come off the die without any issues if it doesn't come off other surfaces easily ?


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> why does it come off the die without any issues if it doesn't come off other surfaces easily ?


Chemical reactions between metals. Silicon doesn't react the same.


----------



## defiler2k

The chip cleaned up easily just a wipe with alcohol and it was clean however, the block is another story. The layer that was left on the block was dry and hard. I had noticed increasing temps but thought it was because of gunk buildup on my block as a result of my mayhem coolant. However I was surprised when I pulled the block and noticed the crust of CLU.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Chemical reactions between metals. Silicon doesn't react the same.


the die is metal isn't it ? I always thought it was since it is so shiny
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> The chip cleaned up easily just a wipe with alcohol and it was clean however, the block is another story. The layer that was left on the block was dry and hard. I had noticed increasing temps but thought it was because of gunk buildup on my block as a result of my mayhem coolant. However I was surprised when I pulled the block and noticed the crust of CLU.


how long before temps started going up ?


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> the die is metal isn't it ? I always thought it was since it is so shiny


They are different types of metal. Silicon is a metaloid. The stuff is actually grown in a growing chamber. I used to work at a company that made the stuff. Copper and Silicon have completely different chemical properties. Read this for a not so brief description if you are interested; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicon


----------



## defiler2k

The die is a glass like silicone surface that does not react to the CLU in fact what was left on the die was still liquid.

I switched to Mayhem 7 weeks ago and 3 weeks in to the switch things started to change.

What's funny is that I had used CLU on the Die with the IHS for a lot longer and had no issues. I went direct die with this last implementation which yielded these results.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was about to say that, it completely takes away your warranty. I've actually had the same exact experience with Intel already. I've had a yes/no situation from them, I've had my first dead chip from the Corsair PSU incident replace but I did the same thing to a friend's CPU and it resulted in them denying the RMA.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although, yea, lapping is definitely not worth the warranty void!


doesn't delidding void the warranty?


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> You can give it the razor blade test to see if it's flat, run the edge vertically across the IHS in the light & if you get light beaming through between the center of the IHS & the blade it's a good candidate, or if the center is too high & the blade rocks (convex) that can't be too good for the mount.
> 
> I tried it on a cpu once without checking, it obviously wasn't needed & lapping made no difference.
> 
> The blade has many uses!


will definitely use this if i cant get a better cooler


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djthrottleboi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was about to say that, it completely takes away your warranty. I've actually had the same exact experience with Intel already. I've had a yes/no situation from them, I've had my first dead chip from the Corsair PSU incident replace but I did the same thing to a friend's CPU and it resulted in them denying the RMA.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although, yea, lapping is definitely not worth the warranty void!
> 
> 
> 
> doesn't delidding void the warranty?
Click to expand...

Yes and no. Technically they say it does but some of us have been able to RMA chips that have been delidded.







First was Valgaur, and then either me or the other guy.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Chemical reactions between metals. Silicon doesn't react the same.


there is a small layer of glass that covers the silicon just in case so technically the TIM touches glass and nothing else.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djthrottleboi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I was about to say that, it completely takes away your warranty. I've actually had the same exact experience with Intel already. I've had a yes/no situation from them, I've had my first dead chip from the Corsair PSU incident replace but I did the same thing to a friend's CPU and it resulted in them denying the RMA.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Although, yea, lapping is definitely not worth the warranty void!
> 
> 
> 
> doesn't delidding void the warranty?
Click to expand...

yuppers was me







if you tell them the truth and ask politely they will be nice back karma is your friend. did it twice actually. be nice and so will they









i actually put my conversation with intel on the OP as well take a read of it.


----------



## Swag

I put the entire thing in a spoiler for those who don't want to read it or have read it already.










Spoiler: PlayStation Vita



My new PS Vita Slim arrived today! The screen has not even a SINGLE bit of yellow tint and it looks amazing. Yes, it is a downgrade from the OLED but I definitely won't miss the OLED!









Here are some pictures!

The packaging outside was basic and looked really bad, however, the packaging inside was amazing! No dents, bends, or scuffing on any of the contents!


Spoiler: Outer Packaging









Well this is the fun part! My new white PS Vita Slim with a 64GB card.







And Play-Asia even included a free case even if it wasn't eligible for it.


Spoiler: Package Contents!











That's me taking forever to completely understand what the instructions were trying to get me at for the screen protector, second image is the screen protector on, looks like it's not even there!


Spoiler: Screen Protector








Just my cute 64GB card laying on top of a Slim body, and first bootup of the Vita


Spoiler: Some extra shots


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> And based on Valgaur's Intel RMA conversation (and mine actually was similar) the one thing you can _guarantee_ to eliminate the possibility of getting a replacement chip if something should go wrong. To me that's worth a heck of a lot more than a couple of degrees in the best case scenario. Not to mention that you've further reduced the likelihood of resale as there's no visual proof that the chip is what you say it is. On the other hand - if you're selling on OCN that's probably not a big deal - especially since it's delidded as well.
> 
> Regardless I think those are a couple of arguments that are at least worth considering before you start lapping a CPU.


Good catch, I should have mentioned lapping & removing the info off the IHS means bye bye to any chance of warranty, even with the optional extra replacement plan.

Not really worth it unless the IHS is uneven like a mountain range which isn't common.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I'm in the process of rebuilding my loop with hard tubing and when I pulled my block I was met with dried CLU on my block. The die was fine and cleaned up easy however the copper block had a crust that I literally had to sand off. Now I have to re polish and re do the finish on the block, any advise on how to get that mirror finish back?
> 
> I took some pictures.
> 
> 
> Lessons learned CLU still dries out on metals other than the Plating of the IHS. The good thing is that my chip was in perfect shape, it just whipped clean.


Look around for different metal polish products. There is stuff that just cleans, but there is also metal polish that is slightly abrasive. That will get you a perfect mirror finish back. I think you can get Brasso in the UK and US and it has particles in it that makes it abrasive. I don't know if the recipe is different in the different regions, the UK one is abrasive I think.

After using the metal polish, you should use alcohol as the polish might leave a layer of something on the metal if it's marketed as "protecting" the surface or similar.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Look around for different metal polish products. There is stuff that just cleans, but there is also metal polish that is slightly abrasive. That will get you a perfect mirror finish back. I think you can get Brasso in the UK and US and it has particles in it that makes it abrasive. I don't know if the recipe is different in the different regions, the UK one is abrasive I think.
> 
> After using the metal polish, you should use alcohol as the polish might leave a layer of something on the metal if it's marketed as "protecting" the surface or similar.


Trying that tonight, will report back on the progress.


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Look around for different metal polish products. There is stuff that just cleans, but there is also metal polish that is slightly abrasive. That will get you a perfect mirror finish back. I think you can get Brasso in the UK and US and it has particles in it that makes it abrasive. I don't know if the recipe is different in the different regions, the UK one is abrasive I think.
> 
> After using the metal polish, you should use alcohol as the polish might leave a layer of something on the metal if it's marketed as "protecting" the surface or similar.


Brasso is exactly what I use and it works great (see this thread). Even if there is some staining that you can't remove don't worry. It has no impact on temps.


----------



## skyn3t

I have not posted here for a long time. and I was diggin like I always do and I found a log info like wise. but I had to quote this cuz I love this guy

He may speak monkey who knows lol
Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> *fail go nooooo,, ja!!*
Click to expand...


----------



## alancsalt

Swag spoke to him in PM, hammer and vise, fail.


----------



## skyn3t

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Swag spoke to him in PM, hammer and vise, fail.


That was a big fail. he may hit the darn pcb so hard for the first time and the glue pilled of the pcb protection.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> I have not posted here for a long time. and I was diggin like I always do and I found a log info like wise. but I had to quote this cuz I love this guy
> 
> He may speak monkey who knows lol


Pretty sure he's Spanish, the English is good enough to understand though, fail go nooooo,, ja!! with the pic is easily understood.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> there is a small layer of glass that covers the silicon just in case so technically the TIM touches glass and nothing else.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yuppers was me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you tell them the truth and ask politely they will be nice back karma is your friend. did it twice actually. be nice and so will they
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i actually put my conversation with intel on the OP as well take a read of it.


i think i might try it then


----------



## kot0005

Join me up please


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kot0005*
> 
> Join me up please
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736792/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736794/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736796/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736797/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]


yours ;looks like mine did i used the razor. what did you use?


----------



## kot0005

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *djthrottleboi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *kot0005*
> 
> Join me up please
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736792/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736794/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736796/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]
> 
> [IMG alt="
> "]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1736797/width/350/height/700/flags/LL[/IMG]
> 
> 
> 
> yours ;looks like mine did i used the razor. what did you use?
Click to expand...

Vice mate.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kot0005*
> 
> Vice mate.


wanna give me some more info like the OP says?







good delid though nice and clean


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Pretty sure he's Spanish, the English is good enough to understand though, fail go nooooo,, ja!! with the pic is easily understood.


sorry , nice ! 's Spanish argentina.

















y MX4 !!


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kot0005*
> 
> Vice mate.


sweet i dont have a vice lo i'm at home i had to buy those razors


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> fail go nooooo,, ja!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


How big was that swing? took 3 light taps with that bad boy hammer
But after a successful delid I was getting ready to grind the lip off a little to ensure a zero gap between heat spreader and Die, I noticed that there was already a gap between the PCB and heat spreader that was the opposite to what I expected.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> How big was that swing? took 3 light taps with that bad boy hammer
> But after a successful delid I was getting ready to grind the lip off a little to ensure a zero gap between heat spreader and Die, I noticed that there was already a gap between the PCB and heat spreader that was the opposite to what I expected.


That seems about right... once it's clamped down in the socket it should be almost perfectly flat overall. Definitely be careful with over-tightening the block on to that however... but the temps should be great if with IHS on.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> That seems about right... once it's clamped down in the socket it should be almost perfectly flat overall. Definitely be careful with over-tightening the block on to that however... but the temps should be great if with IHS on.


yea i have been getting unexpected awesome temps from the corsair h60 that allowed me to hit 4.9GHz but if too tight it squeezes thermal paste off the die and it will just be die touching ihs with thermal paste residue


----------



## kot0005

Quote:

Its a lot easier and less time consuming with the



> Originally Posted by *djthrottleboi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *kot0005*
> 
> Vice mate.
> 
> 
> 
> sweet i dont have a vice lo i'm at home i had to buy those razors
Click to expand...

Lol, you should have tried your local hardware store. I asked my local hardware store if I can use it for a tick and he asked me what I needed it for. Told him that I wanted to open my cpu and he agreed to use it for free

Its a lot easier and less time consuming with the vice. Using razors makes it vulnerable to scratches and its a pain in the ass.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kot0005*
> 
> Lol, you should have tried your local hardware store. I asked my local hardware store if I can use it for a tick and he asked me what I needed it for. Told him that I wanted to open my cpu and he agreed to use it for free
> 
> Its a lot easier and less time consuming with the vice. Using razors makes it vulnerable to scratches and its a pain in the ass.


wish they were that nice up here but one messes it up for all


----------



## HardwareDecoder

when you guys use ultra/pro do you put it on the underside of the ihs also or only on the die? the guy that I bought my alrdy delid 3770k from is saying put a bit on the underside of the ihs and the die.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> when you guys use ultra/pro do you put it on the underside of the ihs also or only on the die? the guy that I bought my alrdy delid 3770k from is saying put a bit on the underside of the ihs and the die.


Thats what I did, well die and waterblock, but same concept...both sides of the equation.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

The general consensus on the heatsink side of the ihs is to just use a high quality normal tim right?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> The general consensus on the heatsink side of the ihs is to just use a high quality normal tim right?


Yes, CLU does not help much there, and you will avoid any future headaches about cleaning.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Yes, CLU does not help much there, and you will avoid any future headaches about cleaning.


cool liquid ultra on the die, and noctua nt-h1 on the top of the ihs it is.


----------



## brucethemoose

But why wouldn't you use CLU on the heatsink if it isn't bare aluminum? Does it dry up or something?


----------



## AlDyer

I whacked my CPU like a madman, so the guy who killed theirs might have accidentally had the wrong angle or something?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brucethemoose*
> 
> But why wouldn't you use CLU on the heatsink if it isn't bare aluminum? Does it dry up or something?


It doesn't dry up because it's not got any water in it. Technically speaking it freezes.

The Gallium/Indium used in CLU becomes liquid at room temperature, but over time it will mix with a the surface of the copper block. It won't make an alloy with the copper, but at a certain point there is enough copper floating in the gallium to make a solid structure. I believe if your block is entirely clean untarnished pure copper then gallium would take a long long time to harden, but I'm not an expert.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> It doesn't dry up because it's not got any water in it. Technically speaking it freezes.
> 
> The Gallium/Indium used in CLU becomes liquid at room temperature, but over time it will mix with a the surface of the copper block. It won't make an alloy with the copper, but at a certain point there is enough copper floating in the gallium to make a solid structure. *I believe if your block is entirely clean untarnished pure copper then gallium would take a long long time to harden, but I'm not an expert*.


correct


----------



## brucethemoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> It doesn't dry up because it's not got any water in it. Technically speaking it freezes.
> 
> The Gallium/Indium used in CLU becomes liquid at room temperature, but over time it will mix with a the surface of the copper block. It won't make an alloy with the copper, but at a certain point there is enough copper floating in the gallium to make a solid structure. I believe if your block is entirely clean untarnished pure copper then gallium would take a long long time to harden, but I'm not an expert.


But nickel is alot harder than copper, and wouldn't have that problem right? I think they even use it as a "diffusion barrier" between softer metals.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> I whacked my CPU like a madman, so the guy who killed theirs might have accidentally had the wrong angle or something?


Yea, I was thinking that too. maybe he hit it upwards, "peeling" the PCB from the IHS rather than "pushing" it.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brucethemoose*
> 
> But nickel is alot harder than copper, and wouldn't have that problem right? I think they even use it as a "diffusion barrier" between softer metals.


That could very well be so









I think the important thing is to properly clean both surfaces with isopropyl alcohol and then the CLU will stay liquid for a long while


----------



## HardwareDecoder

so most of you using watercooling setups are actually using liquid ultra on the top of the die? I just ordered an xspc water cooling kit and I don't think I want my block getting all stained up like i've seen in pics.


----------



## djthrottleboi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> so most of you using watercooling setups are actually using liquid ultra on the top of the die? I just ordered an xspc water cooling kit and I don't think I want my block getting all stained up like i've seen in pics.


sadly i think i'm limited to aio's since i have not the money for a watercooling kit


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> so most of you using watercooling setups are actually using liquid ultra on the top of the die? I just ordered an xspc water cooling kit and I don't think I want my block getting all stained up like i've seen in pics.


I would say so, yes.
I use CLU on DIE->IHS and MX-4 IHS->WaterBklock


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I would say so, yes.
> I use CLU on DIE->IHS and MX-4 IHS->WaterBklock


Yeah I meant to say CLU on top of the IHS. I've seen a few people do it But i'm gonna avoid the hassle of having to clean it off the waterblock etc.

I'm gonna do same as you except with noctua nt-h1

This is going to be my first custom loop so I want to keep it as simple as possible don't need any extra hassles


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> so most of you using watercooling setups are actually using liquid ultra on the top of the die? I just ordered an xspc water cooling kit and I don't think I want my block getting all stained up like i've seen in pics.


On top of the die, or on top of the IHS? Use CLU between the die and IHS, and then normal TIM between the IHS and block.

Edit: Just saw your follow up. Use normal paste on top of the IHS, CLU doesn't provide enough of a benefit there to make it worth the hassle in most people's minds.


----------



## brucethemoose

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> On top of the die, or on top of the IHS? Use CLU between the die and IHS, and then normal TIM between the IHS and block.
> 
> Edit: Just saw your follow up. Use normal paste on top of the IHS, CLU doesn't provide enough of a benefit there to make it worth the hassle in most people's minds.


Is the hassle cleaning it later on, or are you talking about applying it?

I'm planning on delidding and using the stuff between the die and IHS, IHS and 212+, as a well as my GPU and it's heatsink. I don't care about a tricky application/removal, but I'd rather not have to re-apply the stuff every few months if that's what ya'll are talking about.


----------



## Arm3nian

Does CLU stick to nickel plated copper? Gpu die to nickel plated block or cpu ihs non lapped to nickel plated block.


----------



## tw33k

Once you apply the liquid metal, you won't need to change it. People avoid using it on top of the IHS because it can be difficult to remove but if you plan on keeping it then go for it. You'll get a few degrees better over regular paste. I've had CLU on my main PC for almost a year and haven't needed to change it. When I put it under water, I just used to brush to get it spread evenly and my temps are still great.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Does CLU stick to nickel plated copper? Gpu die to nickel plated block or cpu ihs non lapped to nickel plated block.


nope clu likes nickel just hates aluminum very much. so go nuts sir


----------



## Arm3nian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nope clu likes nickel just hates aluminum very much. so go nuts sir


Do you have to sand it off nickel? And also would it erase the lettering on the cpu? I tried CLP on copper already, won't try that again lol.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arm3nian*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nope clu likes nickel just hates aluminum very much. so go nuts sir
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have to sand it off nickel? And also would it erase the lettering on the cpu? I tried CLP on copper already, won't try that again lol.
Click to expand...

The IHS itself is nickel plated, I think? It comes off fine from there. There were some tiny spots that looked a bit suspicious. This was after a few months of use. Those suspicious spots still came off after some rubbing. What was annoying was this: the cloth I used did not stop to get black streaks when wiping the IHS. This went on and on.

Metal polish that's not abrasive was helping a lot when I cleaned it a second time. I used paper to get the CLU off, afterwards a drop of metal polish and some rubbing, then alcohol to finish. That was fast. Most metal polish that's sold in the supermarket for household use on silverware should be non-abrasive, so that's not hard to find.

The writing on the IHS is still visible after all that.

I have seen CLU on a Thermalright cooler with nickel plated base and mirror finish. It also behaved as I described for the IHS on that one. There were some specks that needed rubbing and scratching with a finger nail.


----------



## wermad

Temps are ridiculously high on my cpu now







. used to get 4.9 w/ temps ~60 with my fans in the lowest voltage on the controller. Now I'm spiking 99c at any clock (4.5-5.0). Using the same oc guide I used before. Here's what's changed:

-Added Logitech keyboard and things got screwy; cleared my cmos and ran stock for the last few weeks.
-Changed to a new psu (ST1500 preowned, old one was an Enermax 1350W gold).
-Added four 7970 Lightnings
-removed the mb w/ the cpu still attached to redo my top mounted radiator.
-Used Ceramique, rather then the Gelid that I used initially when i got my new EK block. I still have some Gelid left but there shouldn't be a huge jump of 30-40c just switching to an older, but still decent tim.

Any help would be appreciated and +1. I'm going to break down my rig again since i'm moving it to a new case in the next week so I'll switch to the Gelid tim then.

edit: delided a few months ago and I'm running Ice Diamond 7. Temps were great at 4.9 for those few months.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brucethemoose*
> 
> Is the hassle cleaning it later on, or are you talking about applying it?
> 
> I'm planning on delidding and using the stuff between the die and IHS, IHS and 212+, as a well as my GPU and it's heatsink. I don't care about a tricky application/removal, but I'd rather not have to re-apply the stuff every few months if that's what ya'll are talking about.


You might wanna re think that.. CLU is excellent between Die and IHS, but you will only see (if even) a few degrees with CLU vs. a normal TIM between IHS and 212+ or GPU and heatsink
Also, CLU is conductive! You do not wanna get any of this stuff on these components:

or your mother board for that matter.
Also, changing every few months? a good "normal" paste like MX-4 or NT-H1 wont need changing for 6-12 months (I think that is how often I would replace / check on CLU anyways, together with W/C flush)
Just my


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> Temps are ridiculously high on my cpu now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . used to get 4.9 w/ temps ~60 with my fans in the lowest voltage on the controller. Now I'm spiking 99c at any clock (4.5-5.0). Using the same oc guide I used before.


My guess is either bad mount or pump issue.


----------



## Swag

@wermad

Yea, I agree with ChaosAD. That actually doesn't sound like a bad mount position anymore, it sounds more like a pump issue. I had a problem with my H100i a few weeks back and that's what caused it, the pump was broken. It doesn't sound like a bad mount because normally bad mounts are just medium-severity temp jumps whereas bad pumps tend to increase it to the max. I'd suggest checking you loop as soon as possible.


----------



## morencyam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> edit: delided a few months ago and I'm running Ice Diamond 7. Temps were great at 4.9 for those few months.


What are your thoughts on IC Diamond 7 on the die? Have you noticed any scratching on the surface of the die or anything like that? Any change in temps from the time you delided to now (other than the current temp problem you are having)?


----------



## defiler2k

So an update on my block, I couldn't find Brasso at my local stores however I found a similar metal polish. Along with my dremmel buffing pad, I was able to return the shine to my block. The silver looking stain is still there but there is no pitting on the surface like before.


----------



## Gil80

Does the LiquidUltra requires refreshing / cpu maintenance once the cpu is delidded?
How often do you need to replace it if that's the case


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Does the LiquidUltra requires refreshing / cpu maintenance once the cpu is delidded?
> How often do you need to replace it if that's the case


3-4 months if you are paranoid, I think every 5-6 months is plenty.

Not sure what it has got to do with delidding though as it will harden regardless.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

my 3770k came today, and somehow I can't find my tube of liquid ultra that I never even took out of the packaging it came in.... I think my wife threw it away somehow....

Sucks cause my water cooling loop comes tomorrow too and I had to order another package of it.


----------



## Gil80

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> 3-4 months if you are paranoid, I think every 5-6 months is plenty.
> 
> Not sure what it has got to do with delidding though as it will harden regardless.


Most people who delid their CPU, use liquidUltra between the DIE and IHS. If this requires a constant maintenance every 6 months then what's the point?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> 3-4 months if you are paranoid, I think every 5-6 months is plenty.
> 
> Not sure what it has got to do with delidding though as it will harden regardless.
> 
> 
> 
> Most people who delid their CPU, use liquidUltra between the DIE and IHS. If this requires a constant maintenance every 6 months then what's the point?
Click to expand...

very few systems are designed maintenance free, especially water cooled ones need attention every now and again. I don't think replacing TIM every so often is too much to ask for....

here is a maintenance free system, rather a system that is free of maintenance for your viewing pleasure (not mine)


----------



## Gil80

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> very few systems are designed maintenance free, especially water cooled ones need attention every now and again. I don't think replacing TIM every so often is too much to ask for....
> 
> here is a maintenance free system, rather a system that is free of maintenance for your viewing pleasure (not mine)


My real intention is not about fire and forget. You are providing an example which requires dusting - A much easier task in my opinion and almost risk free as oppose to taking off your CPU cooler and then your CPU and carefully removing liquid metal without scratching the surface of the DIE or having the liquid over the PCB and then carefully replacing the liquid ultra again.

Also with water cooling system - Once you set it correctly, your maintenance is topping up and adding biocide and not taking your system apart.

So if you ask me, taking apart your system at least twice a year and exposing your expensive CPU to risks and adding to the already "dusting + water topping" maintenance for the sake of shaving some degrees is redundant. That's my opinion of course.

If I could go off without replacing liquid ultra for over a year, I might go for it. And you also have to bare in mind that if you want to sell the system in the future for the sake of upgrading everything, then it's going to be hard to sell to someone that the CPU was delidded and the buyer must replace the TIM on the DIE. Not many will know what the hell are you talking about and far few will agree to buy the system


----------



## alancsalt

Bit more to water cooling maintenance than that..


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> very few systems are designed maintenance free, especially water cooled ones need attention every now and again. I don't think replacing TIM every so often is too much to ask for....
> 
> here is a maintenance free system, rather a system that is free of maintenance for your viewing pleasure (not mine)


that guy needs one of these


----------



## wermad

Sorry for the late reply, got side tracked with other stuff








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> My guess is either bad mount or pump issue.


Pump was running fine as the gpu was at normal temps too. I did redo my ihs tim and I got nothing. I'm guessing it had to do w/ the oc guide I was using (ocn haswell oc guide). I fallowed it to the tee and it just happened to spike. I paused for a while trying to remember what I did before (lost the sheet w/ my settings written on it) and i started tweaking it with what ever I could remember. Its back to normal









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @wermad
> 
> Yea, I agree with ChaosAD. That actually doesn't sound like a bad mount position anymore, it sounds more like a pump issue. I had a problem with my H100i a few weeks back and that's what caused it, the pump was broken. It doesn't sound like a bad mount because normally bad mounts are just medium-severity temp jumps whereas bad pumps tend to increase it to the max. I'd suggest checking you loop as soon as possible.


It was the settings. From what i could tell, it was the uncore ratio. I don't recall 100% if I did mess w/ that in the past but this time I did change it fallowing the instructions of the OCN haswell oc guide and it started spiking my temps. I eventually just went on my own trying to recall from memory what I did before it seems to be back to normal. I had to break down my system one more time to prep my old case for sale so I'm crossing my fingers it stays the same (cpu still locked on the mb).

Since i run my 35x at full speed, i can tell if there's something wrong w/ the flow as the pump would start to stall. Loop is fine. I broke it down as well and everything was cool.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *morencyam*
> 
> What are your thoughts on IC Diamond 7 on the die? Have you noticed any scratching on the surface of the die or anything like that? Any change in temps from the time you delided to now (other than the current temp problem you are having)?


For me, its great. I did redo it thinking it was the cause of the spike in temps i just had but it doesn't seem like it was. I did inspect the die after cleaning it w/ AC cleaning kit (1&2) and all was good







. New dab of ID7 and minimized moment on the ihs w/ locking the cpu on the mb but it sadly didn't do anything for the temp issue. I got the issued fixed after I just did the oc settings on my own rather then fallowing the Haswell (ocn) guide.

I'm sure this guide is not at fault since YMMV and its meant to be as universal as possible for Haswell users. I guess following it 100% doesn't work for my setup, which can true for some and not for others. Thanks for the input fellas


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wermad*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Too long
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry for the late reply, got side tracked with other stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> My guess is either bad mount or pump issue.
> 
> 
> 
> Pump was running fine as the gpu was at normal temps too. I did redo my ihs tim and I got nothing. I'm guessing it had to do w/ the oc guide I was using (ocn haswell oc guide). I fallowed it to the tee and it just happened to spike. I paused for a while trying to remember what I did before (lost the sheet w/ my settings written on it) and i started tweaking it with what ever I could remember. Its back to normal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> @wermad
> 
> Yea, I agree with ChaosAD. That actually doesn't sound like a bad mount position anymore, it sounds more like a pump issue. I had a problem with my H100i a few weeks back and that's what caused it, the pump was broken. It doesn't sound like a bad mount because normally bad mounts are just medium-severity temp jumps whereas bad pumps tend to increase it to the max. I'd suggest checking you loop as soon as possible.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> It was the settings. From what i could tell, it was the uncore ratio. I don't recall 100% if I did mess w/ that in the past but this time I did change it fallowing the instructions of the OCN haswell oc guide and it started spiking my temps. I eventually just went on my own trying to recall from memory what I did before it seems to be back to normal. I had to break down my system one more time to prep my old case for sale so I'm crossing my fingers it stays the same (cpu still locked on the mb).
> 
> Since i run my 35x at full speed, i can tell if there's something wrong w/ the flow as the pump would start to stall. Loop is fine. I broke it down as well and everything was cool.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *morencyam*
> 
> What are your thoughts on IC Diamond 7 on the die? Have you noticed any scratching on the surface of the die or anything like that? Any change in temps from the time you delided to now (other than the current temp problem you are having)?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> For me, its great. I did redo it thinking it was the cause of the spike in temps i just had but it doesn't seem like it was. I did inspect the die after cleaning it w/ AC cleaning kit (1&2) and all was good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . New dab of ID7 and minimized moment on the ihs w/ locking the cpu on the mb but it sadly didn't do anything for the temp issue. I got the issued fixed after I just did the oc settings on my own rather then fallowing the Haswell (ocn) guide.
> 
> I'm sure this guide is not at fault since YMMV and its meant to be as universal as possible for Haswell users. I guess following it 100% doesn't work for my setup, which can true for some and not for others. Thanks for the input fellas
Click to expand...

This is why sometimes I'm against some guides on any forum. They tell people what to change but don't actually teach the person what they are actually doing. I would definitely take some time and go into BIOS and just learn about each and every setting there is in it. That way, you know the in and outs of your motherboard and you can properly adjust what you need to fix in the case of any problem. This way, you can step up from just a plug-and-play overclocker (plug in any value someone tells you to) to an actual overclocker.

I used to be a plug-and-play and after fiddling around with my Ivy Bridge, I started loving overclocking more and more and slowly got into it even more. And although overclocking introduced me to one of the most expensive hobbies I could think of, I don't regret any bit of it because now, I am slowly studying computers and have even gotten into 2nd-year university-level programming.

*But glad to hear your CPU is doing well and there isn't actually any need to spend money to fix your rig.*


----------



## Matt-Matt

Back after a long time! Been on the watercooling scene for a bit but due to an RMA I've been on the stock cooler for a bit :/
Clocked in at a mere 4GHz,

Anyway, ordering some liquid ultra/pro soon and I was just wondering what would be better for my CPU/GPU's etc?

Cheers,

p.s One is easier to remove, and the other is better at contact yes? I can't really remember


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Back after a long time! Been on the watercooling scene for a bit but due to an RMA I've been on the stock cooler for a bit :/
> Clocked in at a mere 4GHz,
> 
> Anyway, ordering some liquid ultra/pro soon and I was just wondering what would be better for my CPU/GPU's etc?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> p.s One is easier to remove, and the other is better at contact yes? I can't really remember


Liquid pro is the one that hardens 100% after a while. There's pictures of someone's GPU die cracked when removing the cooler because of liquid pro fusing things together.

I don't think pro is ever really better than ultra. It might just be application and random if that happens.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Liquid pro is the one that hardens 100% after a while. There's pictures of someone's GPU die cracked when removing the cooler because of liquid pro fusing things together.
> 
> I don't think pro is ever really better than ultra. It might just be application and random if that happens.


Oh okay, well I used pro (the blue one?) on my 7950.. It's been cleaned since then but yeah okay.
Keen to use ultra now


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Oh okay, well I used pro (the blue one?) on my 7950.. It's been cleaned since then but yeah okay.
> Keen to use ultra now


The blue one is Ultra







as long as the metal surface being applied to is nickel plated it will comeoff cleanly.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> My real intention is not about fire and forget. You are providing an example which requires dusting - A much easier task in my opinion and almost risk free as oppose to taking off your CPU cooler and then your CPU and carefully removing liquid metal without scratching the surface of the DIE or having the liquid over the PCB and then carefully replacing the liquid ultra again.
> 
> Also with water cooling system - Once you set it correctly, your maintenance is topping up and adding biocide and not taking your system apart.
> 
> So if you ask me, taking apart your system at least twice a year and exposing your expensive CPU to risks and adding to the already "dusting + water topping" maintenance for the sake of shaving some degrees is redundant. That's my opinion of course.
> 
> If I could go off without replacing liquid ultra for over a year, I might go for it. And you also have to bare in mind that if you want to sell the system in the future for the sake of upgrading everything, then it's going to be hard to sell to someone that the CPU was delidded and the buyer must replace the TIM on the DIE. Not many will know what the hell are you talking about and far few will agree to buy the system


You can really go without replacing ultra for a longer period of time it just depends on the application and the metals that are in play. In the different rigs I have setup I have not seen ultra dry and harden between the die and the IHS, however when you throw in direct die mounting that is a totally different story. In my case the last installation I had CLU between a copper block and the die and that did harden, the CLU was absorbed by the copper block.


----------



## castl3bravo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *morencyam*
> 
> What are your thoughts on IC Diamond 7 on the die? Have you noticed any scratching on the surface of the die or anything like that? Any change in temps from the time you delided to now (other than the current temp problem you are having)?


I wouldn't do it as I had something I would call a "ICdiamond Rock" between my IHS and die left by IC7







I was shocked at the pit it left in the IHS (whatever was in the IC7 went through the nickel plating into the copper). The IC7 also left a mark on the die too, but it appears to be ok. I've got my fingers crossed it didn't pierce the silicon nitride layer on the Intel die. If it did the copper from the IHS and/or TIM might begin contaminating the Intel die









Anyone have an extra IHS laying around (pm me)?


----------



## Gil80

No I will only use Liquid Ultra between the DIE and IHS. For IHS and cooling devices I would use regular thermal paste.

So am I to expect to replace liquid ultra every year between DIE and IHS?


----------



## Swag

I change my LP every 6 - 9 months depending on how lazy I am.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

ugh I just got my first custom loop installed -- no leaks!!! my wife must have thrown by brand new never opened liquid ultra away though, new one won't be here till saturday/monday


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> ugh I just got my first custom loop installed -- no leaks!!! my wife must have thrown by brand new never opened liquid ultra away though, new one won't be here till saturday/monday


Welcome to water cooling!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Welcome to water cooling!


You are from the qnix thread right? I remember talking to you there a bunch of times.

Yeah man I have a thread about my water cooling experience so far also includes a question at the end.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1441416/first-custom-loop-installed-question-about-fan-positioning-on-radiator


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Welcome to water cooling!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are from the qnix thread right? I remember talking to you there a bunch of times.
> 
> Yeah man I have a thread about my water cooling experience so far also includes a question at the end.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1441416/first-custom-loop-installed-question-about-fan-positioning-on-radiator
Click to expand...

That is an interesting way to mount a radiator, it wouldnt fit inside the case?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is an interesting way to mount a radiator, it wouldnt fit inside the case?


nah didn't have enough room up top in the case to mount it with the way the mobo goes in. It actually says in the install guide that top mount has better temps than inside mount anyway.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is an interesting way to mount a radiator, it wouldnt fit inside the case?
> 
> 
> 
> nah didn't have enough room up top in the case to mount it with the way the mobo goes in. It actually says in the install guide that top mount has better temps than inside mount anyway.
Click to expand...

It probably does by enough to be a valid talking point...I just cringe cause I have small children in the house.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> It probably does by enough to be a valid talking point...I just cringe cause I have small children in the house.


haha no kids here, just a crazy 1 year old female black lab she prefers to chew clothes not computer luckily. I still put things out of her reach though


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gomi*
> 
> Just stumbled across a post on the Danish "Overclock" forum.
> 
> Person used CLP on his HD6970, ran with it for about 3 months and upon re-doing his loop he wanted to redo / clean up his GPU application.
> 
> As expected, the block would not budge, so he had to twist it slightly counter-clockwise - Unfortunately his GPU looked like this when he removed the block:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Could this have been prevented by heating up the block before removal ? Probably - But this is just a small warning when removing your Block / IHS - Its fine on Block/IHS - But Block/Die and its abit trickier.
> 
> Before anyone starts flaming the poor guy, need to mention he is well-known here in Denmark for extreme cooling and as such, so its no "rookie" when it comes to alternative cooling and the adventures we go through


This kinda happened to my 7950 + h60.Fortunately, it stuck to the h60 not the gpu. I had to use a tack hammer to knock the shim off my h60, which scratched up the h60 as well as the stuff just stuck on it. It took about 5 minutes of scrubbing with the inclued CLU scrubber to basically sand it off.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

see it is that kind of stuff that really scares me about liquid ultra..... I think if my temps are good enough with my loop and I hit an oc I want i'm gonna just stick with the noctua tim on the die


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> The blue one is Ultra
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as long as the metal surface being applied to is nickel plated it will comeoff cleanly.


Thanks man, I've got copper plated blocks and air coolers.. What would that be like to remove off?

Cheers
+Rep


----------



## Swag

Removing CLU is very easy and it doesn't adhere or stain the metals it touches like CLP. CLU will clean like normal TIM and just as easily, CLP needs a polishing agent to come off just as cleanly.

















Wanted to ask you guys on your opinion on the OT:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



I have a Scion FR-S, heavily modded, I have a buyer for 28K. Should I sell it, buy a 2007 328i and mod that one? 328i has 55k miles on it.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Removing CLU is very easy and it doesn't adhere or stain the metals it touches like CLP. CLU will clean like normal TIM and just as easily, CLP needs a polishing agent to come off just as cleanly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wanted to ask you guys on your opinion on the OT:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I have a Scion FR-S, heavily modded, I have a buyer for 28K. Should I sell it, buy a 2007 328i and mod that one? 328i has 55k miles on it.


That is incorrect, CLU does adhere and stain copper and other metals from first hand experience.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







This was after a month and a half of use, the CLU was beginning to harden and meld in to the copper. The die had no issues however the block was ruined as you can see in the next picture.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I had to sand the block and polish with metal polish and my dremel to get the mirror finish back and remove the hardened CLU however, the silver stain is still there.
After the cleanup exercise I went back and installed the block using MX-4 and my performance on 3 out of the 4 cores on my 4770K is the same as with CLU, one core is 1C higher.

Now, before going direct die I was running CLU between the IHS and the die and that cleaned up easily without any staining of any of the part. It was when CLU came in contact with copper that I had issues. The die cleaned up easily on both occasions so my chip is perfectly fine.

On your OT - I had a same generation BMW 3 series and that was one of the most fun cars to drive I've ever had until my brother crashed it head on against a concrete light post. So if it were me I would do it but then again I'm partial to BMW's








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Thanks man, I've got copper plated blocks and air coolers.. What would that be like to remove off?
> 
> Cheers
> +Rep


If your blocks are copper you will have the same issues I had, it will harden and it will be a pain to clean off. If you are going with nickel plated blocks it should be different. Personally after my first hand experience, I believe that CLU is only meant to be used between the IHS and the die.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> That is incorrect, CLU does adhere and stain copper and other metals from first hand experience.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This was after a month and a half of use, the CLU was beginning to harden and meld in to the copper. The die had no issues however the block was ruined as you can see in the next picture.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had to sand the block and polish with metal polish and my dremel to get the mirror finish back and remove the hardened CLU however, the silver stain is still there.
> After the cleanup exercise I went back and installed the block using MX-4 and my performance on 3 out of the 4 cores on my 4770K is the same as with CLU, one core is 1C higher.
> 
> Now, before going direct die I was running CLU between the IHS and the die and that cleaned up easily without any staining of any of the part. It was when CLU came in contact with copper that I had issues. The die cleaned up easily on both occasions so my chip is perfectly fine.
> If your blocks are copper you will have the same issues I had, it will harden and it will be a pain to clean off. If you are going with nickel plated blocks it should be different. Personally after my first hand experience, I believe that CLU is only meant to be used between the IHS and the die.


This is precisely why I use Gelid Extreme. Not worth it IMO. Mostly I just don't want the hassle, for those willing to put up with the hassle. Go for it. But not for me.


----------



## Swag

I haven't seen a single CLU actually do that.







With all my applications, my block comes out like normal after being cleaned and my IHS looks spotless. My first application of CLP destroyed my IHS by permanently botching it with a huge ugly stain on it.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> That is incorrect, CLU does adhere and stain copper and other metals from first hand experience.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This was after a month and a half of use, the CLU was beginning to harden and meld in to the copper. The die had no issues however the block was ruined as you can see in the next picture.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had to sand the block and polish with metal polish and my dremel to get the mirror finish back and remove the hardened CLU however, the silver stain is still there.
> After the cleanup exercise I went back and installed the block using MX-4 and my performance on 3 out of the 4 cores on my 4770K is the same as with CLU, one core is 1C higher.
> 
> Now, before going direct die I was running CLU between the IHS and the die and that cleaned up easily without any staining of any of the part. It was when CLU came in contact with copper that I had issues. The die cleaned up easily on both occasions so my chip is perfectly fine.
> 
> On your OT - I had a same generation BMW 3 series and that was one of the most fun cars to drive I've ever had until my brother crashed it head on against a concrete light post. So if it were me I would do it but then again I'm partial to BMW's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If your blocks are copper you will have the same issues I had, it will harden and it will be a pain to clean off. If you are going with nickel plated blocks it should be different. Personally after my first hand experience, I believe that CLU is only meant to be used between the IHS and the die.


I actually did get a bit on my Heatkiller Rev 3.0, I have brasso to clean it though. It's really good stuff!
I opened it before and had a sniff and swear I got high, haha. I got all my friends to sniff it to saying that it smelt nice hahaha, funny times!


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> This kinda happened to my 7950 + h60.Fortunately, it stuck to the h60 not the gpu. I had to use a tack hammer to knock the shim off my h60, which scratched up the h60 as well as the stuff just stuck on it. It took about 5 minutes of scrubbing with the inclued CLU scrubber to basically sand it off.


I would have to ask the question if the CLU had adhered that good, after reapplying CLU was there any difference in temp.
Not trying to smart just asking because I am thinking long term no maintenance use CLU between die and heat spreader and glue back down.
Just Intel had applied the TIM for the expected lifespan of the chip.


----------



## invincible20xx

CLU Applied finally




temps with CLU and H100i @ 4.5 GHz @ 1.3v bios with the extreme 6 board that could very well be 1.35v actual running through the chip ....



what do you guys think about my application ? good ? are the temps right for this speed/voltage and the h100i slapped on top of it ?

also is 1.35v too much for ivy or still in the safe zone ?

also i think i should have applied CLU to a smaller area on the back of the IHS, or is it fine like that ?


----------



## Cyro999

60c after a few mins under small fft @1.35v with a h100i you're pretty much laughing

Knowing ivy, and with those load temps - i don't think i'd hesitate to run 1.4v. 1.45v with some balls, 1.5v 24/7 if you're Belial.

Oh, but get a vcore readout of some kind if you're pushing it, knowing asrock..


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> 60c after a few mins under small fft @1.35v with a h100i you're pretty much laughing
> 
> Knowing ivy, and with those load temps - i don't think i'd hesitate to run 1.4v. 1.45v with some balls, 1.5v 24/7 if you're Belial.
> 
> Oh, but get a vcore readout of some kind if you're pushing it, knowing asrock..


it's been on load for an hour now and it pretty much topped out on the same temps as in this photo 59 ~ 60 c

also the fans on the h100i are doing 1200 RPM only, those fans are capable of 2200 RPM, they are cooler master xtra flo

also what do you mean by "laughing" are my results bad or good ?!









also i heard ivy degrades after 1.35v, i think 4.5ghz is a cool stable point for 7/24

not a crazy OC but still, i also overclocked my GPUs slightly because i like to have a quit machine


----------



## Cyro999

They're good.

You heard ivy degrades at [email protected]? Where?

If you got degradation within 2 years running at 1.45v/75c in prime, with normal gaming, encoding, whatever use that wasn't folding (cpu at 100% load 24/7 for years) it'd be news on OCN, AFAIK. 1.4v with those kind of temps, certainly, is safe enough on Ivy.

Other people want to weigh in?


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> They're good.
> 
> You heard ivy degrades at [email protected]? Where?
> 
> If you got degradation within 2 years running at 1.45v/75c in prime, with normal gaming, encoding, whatever use that wasn't folding (cpu at 100% load 24/7 for years) it'd be news on OCN, AFAIK. 1.4v with those kind of temps, certainly, is safe enough on Ivy.
> 
> Other people want to weigh in?


ok based on the voltage i have to push through my chip 1.35v for 4.5ghz, how far could this chip go ? i'm guessing 4.7 GHz max before i hit 1.5v+, no ?


----------



## Cyro999

Hard to say, especially without a vcore readout. 100-300mhz more depending how hard you want to push it i think


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hard to say, especially without a vcore readout. 100-300mhz more depending how hard you want to push it i think


i think i will just settle for 4.5 GHz, what's another 100 mhz ? i'll just enjoy the cool& quite CPU, @ 4.5 it's still plenty fast for pretty much anything out there, no ?


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> see it is that kind of stuff that really scares me about liquid ultra..... I think if my temps are good enough with my loop and I hit an oc I want i'm gonna just stick with the noctua tim on the die


Why don't you just use IHS then? I mean the moral of the story to me is just don't mount directly to die...
Quote:


> Removing CLU is very easy and it doesn't adhere or stain the metals it touches like CLP. CLU will clean like normal TIM and just as easily, CLP needs a polishing agent to come off just as cleanly. tongue.gif


Eh, not always. Don't get me wrong, I'd never hesitate to use CLU (not on aluminum though, it literally melts through aluminum in seconds like blood from alien, i tried it without realizing my mosfet sinks were aluminum once). It doesn't _stain_ (penetrate into the metal), but it will surface-level adhere very toughly, meaning you basically have to scrub it off. I've noticed that you can basically scrub copper with IPA, but the scrubber included does a good job.

It's really not a big deal, all you are doing is just polishing the copper or NPC. Once your heatsink is used, even with regular paste, it'll get marks and scuffs on it so as to not look 100% brand new anymore anyways.
Quote:


> That is incorrect, CLU does adhere and stain copper and other metals from first hand experience.


That's not staining, that's just residual CLU on your block. If you use the included scrubber or fine grit it'll come off. Staining means you could literally shave that metal, like if you cut it in half with a samurai blade, you'll see it impregnated into the metal, and that's just not what's happening. It's literally on top of the metal there.

It's like paint on a wall. As opposed to stain on wood. You say it's still there after sanding and such, but I think you just didn't get it all off.
Quote:


> also i heard ivy degrades after 1.35v, i think 4.5ghz is a cool stable point for 7/24


_weighing in_ I don't believe this. Where did you hear this? Because I don't think this is true. Either made up, something else was the factor, or I think maybe it was a different number.

Maybe, what you heard, is that _Sandy Bridge_ degrades at 1.35v+, which is true. 22nm chips like IB and haswell so far, as far more resilient than SB, and degradation is unheard of below 1.45v. There's been just a handful of cases of degradation (and no cases of death except with high VRIN 2.5v+ on haswell) with 24/7 overclock/air overclocks on IB/HW and they've always been at 1.5v+, and only a loss of 100mhz after months of running something like prime95 or [email protected] for 24/7 non-stop.

That said, if you need 1.35v for 4.5ghz, then it sounds like you have a poor chip (ie like ~50% of them are). You might max out at [email protected] depending on how stable that [email protected] is. Is that 24 hours of prime95 with 80%+ ram used stable, or like just 50 runs of IBT stable, or just gaming stable? Depending on how stable your [email protected] is, I really don't see you doing 4.7 on that chip.

My first ivy was so bad that it did [email protected] Second one did [email protected] My 'good' ivy did 5ghz... at 1.55v. Hitting 5ghz really just means either extreme luck, or extreme cooling + extreme voltage.

I'm always the person to say utilize your chip to the fullest, go to 1.4v+ and just settle for the overclock that you can do there, smoke em if you got em kind of deal. But if your chip is so poor that you are at [email protected] just settle. Save yourself some money, sell off your h100i which is just being wasted on such a poor clocker, buy yourself something simple like a H60 or comparable mid-range cooler for ~$30-40, or heck get a hyper 212+ for $19 and really pocket some cash, and then use that money to upgrade something else in your system.

Or, just push it and try to see if you can do [email protected] I mean you got the cooling for it with an h100i w/4x fans easily. I guess either path is really fine. Worst case scenario a crappy 4.5 chip goes to 4.4ghz in about a year or three (depending on how you use the chip, ie p95 24/7 vs gaming and minesweeper, and how hot you run it, ie right at 90C or more breathing room like 80C) so not a big deal, the chip still retains it's full market value as long as it's capable of running stock speeds.

I've got a couple ivy systems, I had degradation on the one that I ran prime95 24/7 for almost a year, lost 100mhz basically. Not a big deal, sold it as a 4.9ghz system with full disclosure and bought haswell with money to spare.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> That's not staining, that's just residual CLU on your block. If you use the included scrubber or fine grit it'll come off. Staining means you could literally shave that metal, like if you cut it in half with a samurai blade, you'll see it impregnated into the metal, and that's just not what's happening. It's literally on top of the metal there.
> 
> It's like paint on a wall. As opposed to stain on wood. You say it's still there after sanding and such, but I think you just didn't get it all off


That picture is before i went at it with the scrubber. I after a long time with the scrubber I managed to get off the hardened CLU from the block but the silver stain was still there, I gave it a good long go with fine grit paper and then polishing with metal polish and the buffer on my dremel to the point that the surface was once again reflective including the silver spot in the middle of the block so yes CLU stained the copper beyond what a sanding can clean up unless you are willing to really sand deep in to the block, IMHO CLU just melds in to the copper and that's why we have this effect. If it didn't meld with the other metals we wouldn't have to use the buffer to clean it up a simple wipe with alcohol would have been enough.


----------



## SonDa5

Hey guys just wanted to stop by and share a photo of my delidded 4770k in its new Asus Maximus VI Impact mini-ITX mother board.



Wouldn't be able to get all this performance without delidding.



Delidding works.

Yes I am running naked bare die mount without the IHS and only the water block securing the 4770k to the socket.


----------



## Swag

That is a sexy ITX board.







+1 for those shots.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> That is a sexy ITX board.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +1 for those shots.


Thanks bro!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Hey guys just wanted to stop by and share a photo of my delidded 4770k in its new Asus Maximus VI Impact mini-ITX mother board.
> 
> 
> 
> Wouldn't be able to get all this performance without delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> Delidding works.
> 
> Yes I am running naked bare die mount without the IHS and only the water block securing the 4770k to the socket.


Looks awersome! But why the tiny board!


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Looks awersome! But why the tiny board!


Looks like a pretty small case, & the tiny board leaves room to work in there.

That tiny board packs a serious punch for a little guy!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Looks like a pretty small case, & the tiny board leaves room to work in there.
> 
> That tiny board packs a serious punch for a little guy!


This. Plus if you're positive that you're not going to want to run multiple GPUs... why bother. Other than for servers and a much over-built HTPC I'd actually prefer to use ITX boards in almost everything. Not only do you have more room but especially if it's air-cooled, a large HSF will cool the entire board efficiently. Sure you might want a sound card - but if you really want good sound, you're better off spending the same money on an AVR or DAC and just using that.

Now that a good ITX board allows full overclocking options, dual NIC (some server-targeted models with even 4-5 NICs), support for at least 4 and often 6 SATA devices, tons of USB, as well as many with built-in WiFi/BT modules... a big MB is basically only good for multi-GPU configurations. And with cards like the 7990 and the GTX Titan/780 or even the rumored upcoming GTX 790/Titan Ultra... you can still have the same power even on a tiny board.


----------



## Belial

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Belial*
> 
> That's not staining, that's just residual CLU on your block. If you use the included scrubber or fine grit it'll come off. Staining means you could literally shave that metal, like if you cut it in half with a samurai blade, you'll see it impregnated into the metal, and that's just not what's happening. It's literally on top of the metal there.
> 
> It's like paint on a wall. As opposed to stain on wood. You say it's still there after sanding and such, but I think you just didn't get it all off
> 
> 
> 
> That picture is before i went at it with the scrubber. I after a long time with the scrubber I managed to get off the hardened CLU from the block but the silver stain was still there, I gave it a good long go with fine grit paper and then polishing with metal polish and the buffer on my dremel to the point that the surface was once again reflective including the silver spot in the middle of the block so yes CLU stained the copper beyond what a sanding can clean up unless you are willing to really sand deep in to the block, IMHO CLU just melds in to the copper and that's why we have this effect. If it didn't meld with the other metals we wouldn't have to use the buffer to clean it up a simple wipe with alcohol would have been enough.
Click to expand...

interesting. Well this wouldn't deter me from using it, but that's good to know.


----------



## RNBananers

OCN name: RNBananers
CPU: i5 4670k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM :shin-etsu
Mhz gained: 100mhz
OC after delid: 4.2ghz
Temp drops: ~25C drop
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/eq44ri

Validation.png 813k .png file


----------



## Cyro999

^Do you need 1.273vid (a hair under 1.3 load vcore) for 4.2? I've not actually seen that before.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Hey guys just wanted to stop by and share a photo of my delidded 4770k in its new Asus Maximus VI Impact mini-ITX mother board.
> 
> 
> 
> Wouldn't be able to get all this performance without delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> Delidding works.
> 
> Yes I am running naked bare die mount without the IHS and only the water block securing the 4770k to the socket.


Very nice and tiny beast you got going on there, but what sort of res is this ? I am looking for something small to go with my D5 your res seems to be ideal








And is that a 290 or 290x ? I can only dream of such 2011 score on my 780
Radiator seems pretty juicy aswell


----------



## RNBananers

Tried lowering it, my chip only runs stable at 1.275v sadly.


----------



## Cyro999

What's your VRIN, vrin llc etc at? I've never seen a chip remotely close to being that bad from anyone who changed other settings and especially stability tested as opposed to maybe p28.1


----------



## RNBananers

Tbh I left all that stuff on auto, I didn't feel safe tinkering with it, I only changed the vcore and multiplier. I should probably go back in a play around with the VRIN.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> Very nice and tiny beast you got going on there, but what sort of res is this ? I am looking for something small to go with my D5 your res seems to be ideal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And is that a 290 or 290x ? I can only dream of such 2011 score on my 780
> Radiator seems pretty juicy aswell


290x.

My radiator is my res.










The clear box thing you see is a Alphacool HF D5 TOP -Plexi G1/4. Offers 2 different locations ins and 2 different locations outs. Looks nice. Supposed to help flow. Not sure if it really helps flow but I like to be able to see if there is any bubbles in the pump top.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RNBananers*
> 
> Tbh I left all that stuff on auto, I didn't feel safe tinkering with it, I only changed the vcore and multiplier. I should probably go back in a play around with the VRIN.


Yes indeed. Try manually set 1.8vrin with a med to high level of LLC, 34x uncore, 1.15 ring/cache voltage. Auto is often something silly like 1.7vrin with no llc and it's important to twist all of the knobs with haswell especially if something seems out of place. My chip's average at best and can do 4.2 on over 0.15 less vcore


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RNBananers*
> 
> OCN name: RNBananers
> CPU: i5 4670k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM :shin-etsu
> Mhz gained: 100mhz
> OC after delid: 4.2ghz
> Temp drops: ~25C drop
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/eq44ri
> 
> Validation.png 813k .png file


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> 290x.
> 
> My radiator is my res.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The clear box thing you see is a Alphacool HF D5 TOP -Plexi G1/4. Offers 2 different locations ins and 2 different locations outs. Looks nice. Supposed to help flow. Not sure if it really helps flow but I like to be able to see if there is any bubbles in the pump top.


Very nice build btw man really like that tiny mobo.


----------



## TonicX

Hi everyone just stop in to see how your are doing and research the date on my bare-die-mount. have had no issues at 48x for "unknown" months will know in a few. it does cineabench in 9.5ish


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *homestyle*
> 
> Is the pump out effect based on actual facts or just theory?
> 
> Im planning on using regular tim.
> 
> Ive seen bare die gpus with tim like as5 last for years.


I hope this is true


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Good! I think so too. That makes my day. I bet we could really come up with some innovative concepts. and the renders will be realistic enough to fool some into thinking they are real builds. I gotta sleep - but read my http://www.overclock.net/t/1372332/wood-case-designer-spitball (just one -page) and visit my site http://www.iversondigital.com and check-out ANIMATION page. we can talk about the first build design tomorrow. maybe we should get a virtual meeting account of some kind - I know they give em away free for new starters. just a thought. I will look for you when I get rolling on Saturday.


Val did you every get to play around with Cinema 4d? I have been out of the loop with moving into downtown Minneapolis an such sorry, but im checkin yer thread out know at least


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Val did you every get to play around with Cinema 4d? I have been out of the loop with moving into downtown Minneapolis an such sorry, but im checkin yer thread out know at least


I did but I didnt have enough income for the build sadly.


----------



## TonicX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TonicX*
> 
> Its OFFICIAL! TonicX is running his 3770K BARE-DIE and has the best temps ever.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought about this since before I gave my chip a shave. but needed time to work out the details.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Disclaimer: this is not advise or a guide, simple: This is how I did it.
> 
> With a metal coat hanger, yep, that's right a staple for any Modder. It is heavy duty though - so don't worry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> first I took the underside stand-off nuts to the grinding wheel, so the stand-off would screw down tight to the MOBO.
> 
> 
> 
> I just eyeballed the thickness of the IHS and tried to lower the block that much.
> The COAT HANGER IS UNDER THE BRACKET - trust me. Im a professional
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU was applied so Intel should take note!


Just a little over 6 months ago! I have my air intake routed from cool air from a slightly open widow and fans set to ramp up but even during full cpu they don't make noise except at first. once the cool air hits the radiator it drops back to almost idle rpms . very quite all and all. but it takes crazy vcore for anything like 4900 MHz or any 5+to not crash cinebench. just sayin: I don't mess with it much any more.
but if ravage is still around thanks for the good info on MOBOs I love my Maximus V GENE. Sup?


----------



## RNBananers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Yes indeed. Try manually set 1.8vrin with a med to high level of LLC, 34x uncore, 1.15 ring/cache voltage. Auto is often something silly like 1.7vrin with no llc and it's important to twist all of the knobs with haswell especially if something seems out of place. My chip's average at best and can do 4.2 on over 0.15 less vcore


Tried that and was able to drop my voltage to 1.265. Thanks, repped.


----------



## Swag

Maximus V Gene has got to be the BEST looking, BEST value motherboard for 1155. If you can forgive its small factor size, it is definitely the top motherboard out for the socket.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RNBananers*
> 
> Tried that and was able to drop my voltage to 1.265. Thanks, repped.


Np, but that's still hardly anything. 1.265vid for 4.2ghz on core is like one of the worst chips this site has seen for ivy+haswell AFAIK


----------



## RNBananers

Well it was stable for 30 runs of IBT on very high and 12 hours of Small FFT, BSOD while playing BF4







. This is legitimately the worst chip ever.


----------



## Cyro999

x264 better stability checker IMO for cpu core. Why don't you check out the haswell oc thread (with statistics), bit of a mess recently but good ocing


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

WOW... I really thought 1.35 for 4.5GHz was horrible on my first 3770K... I'm gonna say that chip needs to be sold or returned if possible. I guess there have to be lottery losers as well or it wouldn't be a lottery....







Sucks though.


----------



## Kokin

I'm doing 4.7GHz (1.264V) on my non-delid/non-lapped 3570K and I max out at around 70C for Prime95. Is it worth delidding?

I've been happy with this chip for the past year, but whenever I want to bench for 5GHz, I cannot get it stable enough as it requires 1.4+V and core temps hit 90+C.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> I'm doing 4.7GHz (1.264V) on my non-delid/non-lapped 3570K and I max out at around 70C for Prime95. Is it worth delidding?
> 
> I've been happy with this chip for the past year, but whenever I want to bench for 5GHz, I cannot get it stable enough as it requires 1.4+V and core temps hit 90+C.


mucho mucho hot what cooler?


----------



## Cyro999

You can't handle 1.4v with that kind of water setup?

I'd delid, but a little surprised you see 90c at 1.4v on i5


----------



## stickg1

I have a similar 3570k. I actually sold my 3770k after getting this i5.

My previous 3770k was a terrible overclocker.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> mucho mucho hot what cooler?


Custom waterloop using an XSPC Raystorm block. For my 4.7GHz @ 1.264V, my typical idle is 20~30C and load is 50~60C.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RNBananers*
> 
> Well it was stable for 30 runs of IBT on very high and 12 hours of Small FFT, BSOD while playing BF4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . This is legitimately the worst chip ever.


Nope, mine needs 1.2v for 4GHz, it needs 1.35 for 4.4 and it needs 1.48ish for 4.6, 4.7 was partially stable at 1.52v..
I can't return the chip either, i got in on release off an eBay seller (new) for $230. I can't complain, but yeah, I plan to get a 3770k and de-lid that one day.. After I get a soundcard, wrist wrest and stuff.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> I'm doing 4.7GHz (1.264V) on my non-delid/non-lapped 3570K and I max out at around 70C for Prime95. Is it worth delidding?
> 
> Yes, yes it is. You might be able to do 5 with 1.4v or so which is pretty sweet!
> 
> I've been happy with this chip for the past year, but whenever I want to bench for 5GHz, I cannot get it stable enough as it requires 1.4+V and core temps hit 90+C.


Unless you're already de-lidded... DE-LID!


----------



## Valgaur

Well guys question.

What should I get for Christmas.

150 limit new keyboard? Case? Or other? I have no ideas


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well guys question.
> 
> What should I get for Christmas.
> 
> 150 limit new keyboard? Case? Or other? I have no ideas


Specs are as of your sig?

You have a Cosmos II... Don't get a new case,

You could sell the H100 and get a H220/H320/similar, and then get a block for your 7970 lightning?

That or get a Mechanical Keyboard, may I suggest either a Ducky Shine II/Shine III or a Das for that.

EDIT: Well hold of on the block for the card, but get a upgradable CLC or even a Custom water kit and then grab your block later down the road.


----------



## Valgaur

The cosmos 2 now has 2 580s in it and missing a side panel


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The cosmos 2 now has 2 580s in it and missing a side panel


Oh okay.. Why 2x 580's from a 7970?

Why is the side panel missing too?









So you've got a 3770k, the ASUS board as per your specs, two 580's 8GB of RAM, a Vertex 4 of unknown size, a H100 and a sidewinder x6, along with a AX-1200..

Probably best off to go with either the H220 still and when you get a single better card get a block for it, maybe some more HDD space too.
That or a mech keyboard straight out, a side panel for the case would be good too







.


----------



## Valgaur

Well the 7970 I still have but for Ln

The the 580s were for the 680 I owned but they are worth it completely.

Also lol now 4770k and m6e in there benching man makes you change rig faster than you can type lol


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Well the 7970 I still have but for Ln
> 
> The the 580s were for the 680 I owned but they are worth it completely.
> 
> Also lol now 4770k and m6e in there benching man makes you change rig faster than you can type lol


Yeah haha, well hmmm...

Probably just go with a mechanical keyboard, seeing as you change your hardware more then your underwear.. 'cause if you upgrade something now you'll likely just change it later


----------



## Valgaur

That's why I can't decide. ..... ugh


----------



## Kokin

I would say go for the keyboard; it's a big difference especially when you're typing quite often.


----------



## Swag

Is anyone experiencing extremely long page load times for OCN these past days/weeks?

I've been experiencing this and I'm unsure whether it is my browser, PC, or ISP. What y'all think?

Also, just a straight forward answer, how's Firefox fairing against Chrome these days? I'm starting to feel bitter towards Chrome so that's why I'm asking.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> I would say go for the keyboard; it's a big difference especially when you're typing quite often.


Now that I've had a 'couple of beers and thought about it yes I feel the same.

I got a mech keyboard recently and love it, my typing speed has increased quite a bit too and it's so much better and I love the sound of the clicking as I type.


----------



## Valgaur

I'm thinking the ducky shine 3 or the razer black widow ultimate


----------



## pilotter

guys, going to delid and naked die in a few days, what Tim between the ekwb surpremacy and the die? CLP or MX4, I have both available.


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Is anyone experiencing extremely long page load times for OCN these past days/weeks?
> 
> I've been experiencing this and I'm unsure whether it is my browser, PC, or ISP. What y'all think?
> 
> Also, just a straight forward answer, how's Firefox fairing against Chrome these days? I'm starting to feel bitter towards Chrome so that's why I'm asking.


Yes I was getting slow loading times last night. Though it was my computer for a second. lol


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> guys, going to delid and naked die in a few days, what Tim between the ekwb surpremacy and the die? CLP or MX4, I have both available.


Well with CLP you get lower temps but it needs to be changed more often than MX-4.


----------



## pilotter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Well with CLP you get lower temps but it needs to be changed more often than MX-4.


for the clp, what timeframe am I looking at? not really looking forward to change every 3 or 4 month for a couple of degrees.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Well with CLP you get lower temps but it needs to be changed more often than MX-4.
> 
> 
> 
> for the clp, what timeframe am I looking at? not really looking forward to change every 3 or 4 month for a couple of degrees.
Click to expand...

Did you see the pictures of a cracked GPU die after CLP was used for a long time to mount a copper GPU waterblock? That might be a good reason why you should check on the CLP often if you want to use it. If you find that post where the pictures were first posted, it should mention how long the waterblock was on the GPU before it was removed and ripped the GPU die in half.

It should definitely solidify with time, and stick and fuse with the metal of your block. You can remove it mechanically and polish the block, so it's not really destroying the block.

I'd use MX4 or similar normal paste.


----------



## pilotter

thanks, will go for mx4. One more question....... how much mx4 to use on the die. It's non conductive right?


----------



## Pimphare

Does it really make much of a difference in temps with the cpu block mounted directly to the die? Reason I ask is that I was contemplating delidding my cpu but not sure about the whole direct die thing.


----------



## RickRockerr

Sorry, I got CLP messed with ultra







I have used CLP with EK-Supremacy and precise mount kit about 3 months now and the CLP isn't dry yet, I also used CLP between die and HS About 7 months and it didn't get solid.


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm thinking the ducky shine 3 or the razer black widow ultimate


Get the Ducky Shine no questions asked! You ll be addicted to typing


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> guys, going to delid and naked die in a few days, what Tim between the ekwb surpremacy and the die? CLP or MX4, I have both available.


I used CLU on my die with the naked ivy kit and now I'm on MX4 the temp difference is about 1 degree or less. However, CLU and CLP have a bad habit of melding in to other metals. I had to sand and re polish my block to get the CLU off however it permanently stained my block. Honestly the 1 degree difference is not with the headache of dealing with CLU.


----------



## Valgaur

new ducky shine 3 or new headset... not sure what headset either 150 limit as well...... my headset literally just broke....


----------



## pilotter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> I used CLU on my die with the naked ivy kit and now I'm on MX4 the temp difference is about 1 degree or less. However, CLU and CLP have a bad habit of melding in to other metals. I had to sand and re polish my block to get the CLU off however it permanently stained my block. Honestly the 1 degree difference is not with the headache of dealing with CLU.


So CLU is a no go, CLP might......., MX4 will not damage or dry and is 1 degree difference.







How much MX4 should I put on the die?


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm thinking the ducky shine 3 or the razer black widow ultimate


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> new ducky shine 3 or new headset... not sure what headset either 150 limit as well...... my headset literally just broke....


The Razer Black Widow Ultimate is not a bad keyboard. In fact I had my hands on two other mechs before I settled on this one.

Granted the ultimate I got was $60, and I never owned a Ducky, so I wouldnt know on that front..


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> So CLU is a no go, CLP might......., MX4 will not damage or dry and is 1 degree difference.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How much MX4 should I put on the die?


I have heard worse results from CLP however ultra cleaned completely off the chip but not the block.

As far as how much, with direct die go with a thin line, I did try various ways to apply paste and what worked best was a thin line. Remember the die is much smaller than the IHS thus the amount of paste needed is very little. That was the only mounting option that yielded results better than with the IHS on all others were the same. Right now my idle temps are at ambient with Direct Die and MX4.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pimphare*
> 
> Does it really make much of a difference in temps with the cpu block mounted directly to the die? Reason I ask is that I was contemplating delidding my cpu but not sure about the whole direct die thing.


If you get a really good mount on your CPU you could see ambient or near ambient temps with direct die on idle and a delta of 5 lower or even more depending on your block on load. For me it meant that my 4770k was no longer stuck at 4.6Ghz.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Get the Ducky Shine no questions asked! You ll be addicted to typing


The Shine 2 is better as it has media keys (Play/Pause, Previous Song, Next Song and stop), whereas the Shine II doesn't. Just thought I'd put that out there!









Also yeah, the Shine III over the Razer anyday, better quality build and no lame Razer Branding.


----------



## Valgaur

I need to find a headset now sadly mines hitting the fan hard...







just not sure what to get really.....


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need to find a headset now sadly mines hitting the fan hard...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just not sure what to get really.....


Get a nice set of headphones + a nice desk mic, such as a Blue Snowball.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pilotter*
> 
> So CLU is a no go, CLP might......., MX4 will not damage or dry and is 1 degree difference.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How much MX4 should I put on the die?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> I have heard worse results from CLP however ultra cleaned completely off the chip but not the block.
> 
> As far as how much, with direct die go with a thin line, I did try various ways to apply paste and what worked best was a thin line. Remember the die is much smaller than the IHS thus the amount of paste needed is very little. That was the only mounting option that yielded results better than with the IHS on all others were the same. Right now my idle temps are at ambient with Direct Die and MX4.


CLP will also leave stains on block. With me there was 5°C difference between MX-4 and CLP.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need to find a headset now sadly mines hitting the fan hard...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just not sure what to get really.....


Bro-brah, just get like a $75 headset and $75 mech. Those Coolermaster Mechs are pretty nice and reasonably priced, often go on sale. Headsets and keyboards I know people can be picky on. I really do enjoy my Razer BWU, I also got a junky Razer headset at Best Buy for $50. They're comfortable, sound is like a 7.5/10, long ass cord, not too bad. Definitely not a Sennheiser or anything but hey, it makes noises and fits on my head.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Bro-brah, just get like a $75 headset and $75 mech. Those Coolermaster Mechs are pretty nice and reasonably priced, often go on sale. Headsets and keyboards I know people can be picky on. I really do enjoy my Razer BWU, I also got a junky Razer headset at Best Buy for $50. They're comfortable, sound is like a 7.5/10, long ass cord, not too bad. Definitely not a Sennheiser or anything but hey, it makes noises and fits on my head.


That's a point, get the matching CM kit?


----------



## Hereisphilly

Can I join the club?



Running an i5-4670k with a custom loop
EK supremacy with EK naked mount and Gelid GC extreme as the TIM
Alphacool 420 XT 45 in push pull
Alphacool 280 monsta in push pull
Alphacool 240 in push

1.25V @ 4.6, temps never go above 55 degrees!
Ran AIDA for 2 hours yesterday, going for a longer run today to see whats what


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Can I join the club?
> 
> 
> 
> Running an i5-4670k with a custom loop
> EK supremacy with EK naked mount and Gelid GC extreme as the TIM
> Alphacool 420 XT 45 in push pull
> Alphacool 280 monsta in push pull
> Alphacool 240 in push
> 
> 1.25V @ 4.6, temps never go above 55 degrees!
> Ran AIDA for 2 hours yesterday, going for a longer run today to see whats what


submit the info through the format on the OP and i will add you good squire! :thumb"


----------



## Hereisphilly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> submit the info through the format on the OP and i will add you good squire! :thumb"


Awesome! Here you go!

OCN name: Hereisphilly
CPU: i5-4670k
on die-TIM: Gelid GC-Extreme
ihs-TIM: No IHS, (EK Naked ivy mount)
Mhz gained: 100mhz (for now, gonna dial in the over clock once I've finished with the custom loop)
OC after delid: 4.6ghz @ 1.25v
Temp drops: 23°C average, core 1 and 4 saw a 28°C drop!!!


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Get a nice set of headphones + a nice desk mic, such as a Blue Snowball.


This is the path I went. Got a used Sennheiser HD555 (foam removed to sound like 595s) for $65 used and bought a Blue Snowball for $30 (had a $30 Amazon GC). Amazing entry-level professional audio equipment for the prices I paid.









If you care about quality and having it last a long time, definitely go for the more expensive options. Headsets tend to die after a year or so and it's a waste of money buying one every year or two.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Awesome! Here you go!
> 
> OCN name: Hereisphilly
> CPU: i5-4670k
> on die-TIM: Gelid GC-Extreme
> ihs-TIM: No IHS, (EK Naked ivy mount)
> Mhz gained: 100mhz (for now, gonna dial in the over clock once I've finished with the custom loop)
> OC after delid: 4.6ghz @ 1.25v
> Temp drops: 23°C average, core 1 and 4 saw a 28°C drop!!!


You're in!







Slappa dat Sig on!

I might hunt for a really nice pair of headphones and a mic then gonna see whats out there


----------



## Hereisphilly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa dat Sig on!
> 
> I might hunt for a really nice pair of headphones and a mic then gonna see whats out there


Thanks! I think its time to throw some more volts in and see what this thing can do!


----------



## Daredevil 720

I stopped following this thread a few months ago, had 800 unread posts. Did I lose anything?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> I stopped following this thread a few months ago, had 800 unread posts. Did I lose anything?


One guy from South America (Chile?) ripped the PCB in half through the hammer-and-vise method. Those pictures were neat. You could see the wiring that's hidden inside the PCB.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> One guy from South America (Chile?) ripped the PCB in half through the hammer-and-vise method. Those pictures were neat. You could see the wiring that's hidden inside the PCB.


Pics?









By the way did we have any more cracked dies after the first two? That's about when I stopped following.

Also what's the situation regarding TIMs? Any new incident caused by liquid metals? Do people still use them?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Pics?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By the way did we have any more cracked dies after the first two? That's about when I stopped following.
> 
> Also what's the situation regarding TIMs? Any new incident caused by liquid metals? Do people still use them?


Start reading here and he was from Argentina actually.

I'm using CLU... as are many I think.


----------



## Turt1e

How can I test if my CPU is dead? It's delidded but it's been working. My motherboard died and I got it back from ASUS but it doesnt POST.


----------



## stickg1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> How can I test if my CPU is dead? It's delidded but it's been working. My motherboard died and I got it back from ASUS but it doesnt POST.


Make sure the underside of the CPU, the contact pads are nice and clean. If there is debris it wont make clean contact with the LGA pins. Also check to make sure all your LGA pins are straight and in tact.


----------



## Turt1e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Make sure the underside of the CPU, the contact pads are nice and clean. If there is debris it wont make clean contact with the LGA pins. Also check to make sure all your LGA pins are straight and in tact.


They don't look bent. It just turns on for half a second and turns back off.


----------



## stickg1

Did you check the pads? One time I had smeared TIM on the underside of the CPU and it caused me trouble.

Did you clear the CMOS?


----------



## Turt1e

The CPU Led is also on. And the bottom of the CPU looks clean


----------



## hotdun

I'd say motherboard or RAM is the issue. Try removing all except 1 DIMM and make sure to clear CMOS.

Check post codes/beep codes each time.


----------



## naved777

will it be wise to Use Coolermaster TIM under the Die and IHS ?

This is the stuff i got now


i can get AS5 in here but not a fan of its curing time
and CLP / Gelid GC xtreme will take some time to arrive in here
so confused will i use the coolermaster ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> will it be wise to Use Coolermaster TIM under the Die and IHS ?
> 
> This is the stuff i got now
> 
> 
> i can get AS5 in here but not a fan of its curing time
> and CLP / Gelid GC xtreme will take some time to arrive in here
> so confused will i use the coolermaster ?


i wouldn't.... i want good tim under the hood of mine.

Alright guys vagur needs assistance..... i have choosen between two...

A40's PC edition
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826306003

Razer Tiamat 7.1
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826153089&Tpk=tiamat%207.1

i really can't decide...... halp meeee


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> will it be wise to Use Coolermaster TIM under the Die and IHS ?
> 
> This is the stuff i got now
> 
> 
> i can get AS5 in here but not a fan of its curing time
> and CLP / Gelid GC xtreme will take some time to arrive in here
> so confused will i use the coolermaster ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i wouldn't.... i want good tim under the hood of mine.
> 
> Alright guys vagur needs assistance..... i have choosen between two...
> 
> A40's PC edition
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826306003
> 
> Razer Tiamat 7.1
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826153089&Tpk=tiamat%207.1
> 
> i really can't decide...... halp meeee
Click to expand...

Definitely the A40. Should've asked me on Skype man, I thought I told you I have the A40 (Xbox version) and the A50 (Xbox version).







Although I do love the wireless version of the A50, I prefer the wired version. The wireless gets a lot of interference when coupled with all my devices near it. My mom has the Tiamat, she uses it to watch Filipino dramas







, and it's not bad. Honestly, it isn't bad but the A40 blows past it for gaming. Tiamat is like one of those mediocre products made by a company and they can only sell because they added a nice brand to it. It would be good for $50 but definitely not for $160.

The cream of the A40 though is the MixAmp but even though that one doesn't have the MixAmp, I'd still get it over the Tiamat.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hereisphilly*
> 
> Awesome! Here you go!
> 
> OCN name: Hereisphilly
> CPU: i5-4670k
> on die-TIM: Gelid GC-Extreme
> ihs-TIM: No IHS, (EK Naked ivy mount)
> Mhz gained: 100mhz (for now, gonna dial in the over clock once I've finished with the custom loop)
> OC after delid: 4.6ghz @ 1.25v
> Temp drops: 23°C average, core 1 and 4 saw a 28°C drop!!!
> 
> 
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa dat Sig on!
> 
> I might hunt for a really nice pair of headphones and a mic then gonna see whats out there
Click to expand...

I bought an asus orion pro headset and iv been very happy with it. It gives you the option to run it with usb also.

http://www.asus.com/ROG_ROG/Orion_PRO/


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

If you're planning on using them for listening to music mostly there are probably much better choices in that price range - but if you want mic-headphone combos then those should be good.

Other options would require a separate mic (I believe someone mentioned a Blue which are very good).

Something like this would leave you with plenty of mic budget (maybe even fit a keyboard in there if it's really reasonably priced). You could also check a pro-audio store for some good black friday deals probably... and you'll definitely get better audio.

Anyway food for thought.


----------



## ssgwright

So I finally pulled the lid from my 3770k!



everything went perfectly and my temps improved, my question is what are the risks of running the WB directly on the die? I heard you can crack it easliy but what if you just screw it on lightly ... verrry carefullllly


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssgwright*
> 
> So I finally pulled the lid from my 3770k!
> 
> 
> 
> everything went perfectly and my temps improved, my question is what are the risks of running the WB directly on the die? I heard you can crack it easliy but what if you just screw it on lightly ... verrry carefullllly


yes be very cautious when tightening that block down. other than the pressure risk there is the probability that you could move the chip and miss align a pin in the socket.


----------



## ssgwright

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yes be very cautious when tightening that block down. other than the pressure risk there is the probability that you could move the chip and miss align a pin in the socket.


is it worth it? what are the temp differences from a delid with cover and a naked straight to block?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssgwright*
> 
> is it worth it? what are the temp differences from a delid with cover and a naked straight to block?


usually 3-4 C in temp decrese i don't see it personally as you can mess it up quite easily so i try to use the IHS where i can.


----------



## ssgwright

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> usually 3-4 C in temp decrese i don't see it personally as you can mess it up quite easily so i try to use the IHS where i can.


thanks! ok I don't think I'll risk it, maybe in the future I'll by the EK block and kit.

so I think I'm going to pick up some coollab liquid ultra, do you use this just between the die and cover or also between the wb and cover? - stupid question lol did some digging.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssgwright*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> usually 3-4 C in temp decrese i don't see it personally as you can mess it up quite easily so i try to use the IHS where i can.
> 
> 
> 
> thanks! ok I don't think I'll risk it, maybe in the future I'll by the EK block and kit.
> 
> What is the best thermal compoud to use? It's probably on the first page isn't it lol
Click to expand...

Quick read through some pages on this, the redundant paste that everyone uses is CLP or CLU. Coollaboratory Liquid Pro or Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Quick read through some pages on this, the redundant paste that everyone uses is CLP or CLU. Coollaboratory Liquid Pro or Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra.


what swaggity said







and yes between die and under the IHS is best than a very good quality TIM for wb and ihs I use gelid extreme as i have 5 tubes of it


----------



## Swag

Yea, I only use CLP/CLU on the die now, I can't afford to spend so much on so many tubes of CLP/CLU. Don't use aluminum coolers with it though and assuming you live in the US because you have that US Army avatar, you can order some CLP/CLU from Amazon, Collaboratory's website, or FrozenCPU. Amazon and FrozenCPU has cheaper shipping and I think Newegg might be carrying them too.


----------



## ssgwright

I just grabbed some from frozencpu, so is it ok to use it between the IHS and a copper WB? Is it because of price that people just use it for the die?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssgwright*
> 
> I just grabbed some from frozencpu, so is it ok to use it between the IHS and a copper WB? Is it because of price that people just use it for the die?


Get CLU, the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra. It is easier to use and apply, and yes it is fine. Copper and/or Silver coolers are 100% okay to use with CLP/CLU, ONLY aluminum is not allowed to be used with it. It creates an alloy when it comes into contact with aluminum and then when it touches oxygen, it oxidizes and then the aluminum collapses. In layman's terms, it basically eats away the aluminum.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssgwright*
> 
> I just grabbed some from frozencpu, so is it ok to use it between the IHS and a copper WB? Is it because of price that people just use it for the die?


between the IHS and the copper not a problem the only this is is that CLU/P combine with copper over time as it is filling the smallest of molecular gaps that the liquid fills and combines the metals making a new alloy. so the color changes but i don;t understand why people complain about this as it doesn't harm the metal at all it just changes it's color... and you don't see it anyways


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ssgwright*
> 
> I just grabbed some from frozencpu, so is it ok to use it between the IHS and a copper WB? Is it because of price that people just use it for the die?
> 
> 
> 
> between the IHS and the copper not a problem the only this is is that CLU/P combine with copper over time as it is filling the smallest of molecular gaps that the liquid fills and combines the metals making a new alloy. so the color changes but i don;t understand why people complain about this as it doesn't harm the metal at all it just changes it's color... and you don't see it anyways
Click to expand...

People like to judge with looks.







Hahaha! I don't mind if my block looks ugly underneath since I never see it unless I change the TIM. In which, I only see it like 5 minutes...


----------



## Kokin

CLU ends up merging with a copper block after a few months, so if you don't mind the staining of your copper block, it's fine to use between IHS and block. It's the most recommend TIM for using between Die and IHS, especially if you want to maximize cooling performance.

I'm still contemplating between delidding mine or not, as I don't have the funds to replace my CPU in case I mess up. My chip already does 4.7Ghz @ 1.264V, so the only benefit I get from delidding would be getting 5GHz stable.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> CLU ends up merging with a copper block after a few months, so if you don't mind the staining of your copper block, it's fine to use between IHS and block. It's the most recommend TIM for using between Die and IHS, especially if you want to maximize cooling performance.
> 
> I'm still contemplating between delidding mine or not, as I don't have the funds to replace my CPU in case I mess up. My chip already does 4.7Ghz @ 1.264V, so the only benefit I get from delidding would be getting 5GHz stable.


Vice method. Go to Walmart, buy vice, delid, return vice, and be happy.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Vice method. Go to Walmart, buy vice, delid, return vice, and be happy.


Haha that's kind of messed up. I might just go to one of the workshops in my university and try it out; there are lots of vices in the Art building in my school.









So the Vice method is pretty much the safest method to go about it? Also has there only been one incident of the Vice method actually not working (that one post from 2 weeks ago)?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Haha that's kind of messed up. I might just go to one of the workshops in my university and try it out; there are lots of vices in the Art building in my school.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So the Vice method is pretty much the safest method to go about it? Also has there only been one incident of the Vice method actually not working (that one post from 2 weeks ago)?


so far yes.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Vice method. Go to Walmart, buy vice, delid, return vice, and be happy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha that's kind of messed up. I might just go to one of the workshops in my university and try it out; there are lots of vices in the Art building in my school.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So the Vice method is pretty much the safest method to go about it? Also has there only been one incident of the Vice method actually not working (that one post from 2 weeks ago)?
Click to expand...

1 in 1000 delids that will happen. As long as you hit it flatly and you're gentle, you won't break it like him.







Also, it might sound messed up but I recommend it to most people because it is more economic. I didn't do it because my dad has a huge workshop in our basement so it was more than enough to have a simple delid accommodated.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> People like to judge with looks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hahaha! I don't mind if my block looks ugly underneath since I never see it unless I change the TIM. In which, I only see it like 5 minutes...


I didnt see enough of a difference with CLU between the block and ihs, there is a definite benefit if you put it between the IHS and the die as it cleans easily and you can gain some C's there. It does harden on copper making it a pain to clean (requiring sanding and polishing to get it off). Im doing direct with MX4, might try gelid but right now the temps are the same as I was with direct die and CLU. If your block is nickel plated then that is a different story, I have not seen it harden or stain nickel plated surfaces.


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Vice method. Go to Walmart, buy vice, delid, return vice, and be happy.


Lol I like your way of thinking.


----------



## ssgwright

thanks for all the help, you guys are awesome... I love these forums


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ssgwright*
> 
> thanks for all the help, you guys are awesome... I love these forums


Hahahaha! Just people with too much time on their hands.







I should be studying right now for exams but I'm too lazy and I kind of want to just post on OCN randomly.


----------



## towtol

The Microcenter near where I live just brought the price down on the i7-4770k to $199 USD so I decided to pick one up (along with an ASRock Z87 Extreme 4 mobo for $89 USD) to replace my aging Phenom 965/ASRock 990FX. I was going to wait until Thanksgiving weekend to see if any stores reduced their prices for this Xmas holiday season but this was too good of a deal to pass up. I did purchase an NZXT Kraken X60 from Newegg which should be here Saturday.

I'm still debating on whether I want to delid my first ever Intel cpu but I really want to get the best possible oc performance out of my 4770k. If I do delid, I was planning on using Tuniq TX-4 thermal compound in between the die and IHS and just use the pre-applied thermal paste (shin etsu x23-7783d) between the IHS and Kraken.

Should I go ahead and install everything before delidding to get a baseline for voltages and temps or just delid and get it over with? And will using the Tuniq and Shin Etsu thermals give me enough of a performance increase to warrant the delidding?


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *towtol*
> 
> The Microcenter near where I live just brought the price down on the i7-4770k to $199 USD so I decided to pick one up (along with an ASRock Z87 Extreme 4 mobo for $89 USD) to replace my aging Phenom 965/ASRock 990FX. I was going to wait until Thanksgiving weekend to see if any stores reduced their prices for this Xmas holiday season but this was too good of a deal to pass up. I did purchase an NZXT Kraken X60 from Newegg which should be here Saturday.
> 
> I'm still debating on whether I want to delid my first ever Intel cpu but I really want to get the best possible oc performance out of my 4770k. If I do delid, I was planning on using Tuniq TX-4 thermal compound in between the die and IHS and just use the pre-applied thermal paste (shin etsu x23-7783d) between the IHS and Kraken.
> 
> Should I go ahead and install everything before delidding to get a baseline for voltages and temps or just delid and get it over with? And will using the Tuniq and Shin Etsu thermals give me enough of a performance increase to warrant the delidding?


I'd get a baseline personally, always nice to know what your efforts have gained. That's what I did anyway. Makes it seem more worthwhile to me. And it seriously doesn't take very long. I thought it was a fun process, but I enjoy tearing my rig apart and redoing things.


----------



## Icydead

Guys what do you think about hair scratches on die (possibly created in the process of cleaning clp), are they nothing to worry about ?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys what do you think about hair scratches on die (possibly created in the process of cleaning clp), are they nothing to worry about ?


Simply put, no. You don't have to worry about them at all.







The reason is because on top of the die, there is a thin piece of glass that they put over. This is meant to protect the die because it is actually really sensitive to even the tiniest scratches, without this film of glass, Intel themselves wouldn't be able to put TIM and the IHS on because the chances of it scratching the die is extremely high.

So don't worry about tiny, minute scratches. If the scratch is deep or large, then that is when you need to worry.


----------



## Icydead

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Simply put, no. You don't have to worry about them at all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The reason is because on top of the die, there is a thin piece of glass that they put over. This is meant to protect the die because it is actually really sensitive to even the tiniest scratches, without this film of glass, Intel themselves wouldn't be able to put TIM and the IHS on because the chances of it scratching the die is extremely high.
> 
> So don't worry about tiny, minute scratches. If the scratch is deep or large, then that is when you need to worry.


Ok thanks


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Alright I think I got it all figured out.

Got all the air out of the Loop my second cool lab liquid ultra finally came after a week (no idea what happened to the first tube of it)

delid 3770k running at 4.8ghz llc level 2 +0.160 offset (chip isn't an amazing ocer I know)

Getting 65-75 across all cores @ full load I'd say that is really pretty good for 1.408 vcore as reported by cpu-z

Don't add me to the club or anything though cause I didn't delid my 3570k or 3770k my self. And I screwed up the one I did try a long time ago









i did put the liquid ultra on both my self though.

My 3570k that does 4.4 @ +0.025 offset used to hit 80c with a 212 evo before it was delid. I popped it in to try and it did the same @ 53c max with my new raystorm 240mm kit and liquid ultra









i7 pic


----------



## Supacasey

ArctiClean alright for cleaning up the underside of the IHS and die?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> ArctiClean alright for cleaning up the underside of the IHS and die?


Yes, I used it on my setup without an issue.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Simply put, no. You don't have to worry about them at all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The reason is because on top of the die, there is a thin piece of glass that they put over. This is meant to protect the die because it is actually really sensitive to even the tiniest scratches, without this film of glass, Intel themselves wouldn't be able to put TIM and the IHS on because the chances of it scratching the die is extremely high.
> 
> So don't worry about tiny, minute scratches. If the scratch is deep or large, then that is when you need to worry.


The same with AMD (Confirmed this one myself) and nVidia (I assume). I was putting some CLP on my top 7950 and I accidentally dug the needle into the core a bit...
Works fine to this day though!


----------



## riverdief

Hey guys, and girls







,
i want to show you some results. I am testing 30min in prime 27.9 (2 complete runs with 864k costum, this is a very big stress for vcore, so good for stability!)

My actual CPU is a 3770k delided







@ 5.1GHZ 24/7

To cut a long story short here are some reults of my best CPUs:

before delidding [email protected]
http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_4500unus97.png

before delidding [email protected]
http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_4800u88s49.png

after that








[email protected]
http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_5000go8s5j.png

[email protected]
http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_5100gqmsfg.png

[email protected] (watertemp:17°C)
http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_5300gx7syx.png

3570k

[email protected],496V prime 26.6 1.5h costum (delidded)
http://abload.de/image.php?img=3570k_kandidat6_5300_6xjuo.png

[email protected] 27.9 864k
http://abload.de/image.php?img=3570k_kandidat6_5300_p1k54.png

[email protected]
http://abload.de/image.php?img=3570k_kandidat6_5000_e2ed7.png

sorry for my bad english









Greetz

Luca from Italy but living in Germany


----------



## Cyro999

^That looks exactly like a chip a friend of mine had. Glad to see it pushed further than 4.5ghz after passing prime @5.0, ~1.27!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *riverdief*
> 
> Hey guys, and girls
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ,
> i want to show you some results. I am testing 30min in prime 27.9 (2 complete runs with 864k costum, this is a very big stress for vcore, so good for stability!)
> 
> My actual CPU is a 3770k delided
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @ 5.1GHZ 24/7
> 
> To cut a long story short here are some reults of my best CPUs:
> 
> before delidding [email protected]
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_4500unus97.png
> 
> before delidding [email protected]
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_4800u88s49.png
> 
> after that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [email protected]
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_5000go8s5j.png
> 
> [email protected]
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_5100gqmsfg.png
> 
> [email protected] (watertemp:17°C)
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=kandidat1_3770k_5300gx7syx.png
> 
> 3570k
> 
> [email protected],496V prime 26.6 1.5h costum (delidded)
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=3570k_kandidat6_5300_6xjuo.png
> 
> [email protected] 27.9 864k
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=3570k_kandidat6_5300_p1k54.png
> 
> [email protected]
> http://abload.de/image.php?img=3570k_kandidat6_5000_e2ed7.png
> 
> sorry for my bad english
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greetz
> 
> Luca from Italy but living in Germany


wanna swap that i7 for a nice shiny new 3770K? I wanna bench that chip man


----------



## riverdief

No sorry,
but i can give you another chip:

[email protected],184V
http://abload.de/img/kandidat2_3770k_4500ulso74.png
[email protected],304V
http://abload.de/img/kandidat2_3770k_4800ukhs19.png

ungekoepft means = not delidded yet









More chips ( some with the same FPO as the number one) are incomming tomorrow, or saturday.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *riverdief*
> 
> No sorry,
> but i can give you another chip:
> 
> [email protected],184V
> http://abload.de/img/kandidat2_3770k_4500ulso74.png
> [email protected],304V
> http://abload.de/img/kandidat2_3770k_4800ukhs19.png
> 
> ungekoepft means = not delidded yet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More chips ( some with the same FPO as the number one) are incomming tomorrow, or saturday.


thought I would try is all


----------



## riverdief




----------



## TSXmike

so i come here to ask for help.

anyone running a naked chip?

if so, do you plan on using the heat spreader for anything? if not, please PM me.


----------



## hotdun

Just finished delidding a 4770K using the vice method with no issues.

My main question: Is CLP safe for a 4770K die or should I:

1. Go with a non-conductive thermal paste like MX4 or IC Diamond?

2. Coat the resistors with nail polish/liquid electrical tape and then apply CLP?

3. Any other suggestions?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotdun*
> 
> Just finished delidding a 4770K using the vice method with no issues.
> 
> My main question: Is CLP safe for a 4770K die or should I:
> 
> 1. Go with a non-conductive thermal paste like MX4 or IC Diamond?
> 
> 2. Coat the resistors with nail polish/liquid electrical tape and then apply CLP?
> 
> 3. Any other suggestions?


If you are going to use CLP or CLU you should apply Liquid electrical tape as those are conductive and Liquid Electrical Tape removes cleanly. If you are planning on running with the IHS then yes you can use CLU/P on the die to IHS area, if you are going direct die I wouldn't recommend it.


----------



## Supacasey

I left a small gap between the black rectangle on the PCB and the IHS so it's sitting a bit high, that alright?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> I left a small gap between the black rectangle on the PCB and the IHS so it's sitting a bit high, that alright?


Meh. It doesn't matter too much, only thing that could affect is the curvature of the IHS. Normally, the concave part of the IHS sits around where the middle of the die is so each core gets proportional cooling. But this probably won't make a difference because the IHS isn't actually touching the die.


----------



## naved777

went ahead to Delid mine
but the gap between IHS and PCB was just too less !
i can't even slide a thin dual sided blade LET alone a utility knife blade







even if i force i can guarantee that i will nick the PCB so now will go with the vise method


----------



## MengNa

Well...
I completely botched my first delidding attempt








Tried the vice method on my 4770k and got this:




At first I thought I wasn't hitting it hard enough, but it was only afterwards that I realize it was because of the vice I used:



The clamping bit is a bit raised from the vice body, so most of the energy was wasted on it.
After that I tried again this time hitting from the side of the vice and did manage to delid it. Even though the CPU slid down the vice and flew out a couple of times.
A bit too late though, by that time the CPU was deader than dead









I'll go and get a new CPU tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure I won't attempt to delid it again. Too bad though, was really hoping for better temps.
Too bad you can't buy them delidded.

Edit: I'm not sure if it had something to do with it, but I didn't have a suitable piece of wood so I used a dead optical drive.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> Well...
> I completely botched my first delidding attempt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tried the vice method on my 4770k and got this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At first I thought I wasn't hitting it hard enough, but it was only afterwards that I realize it was because of the vice I used:
> 
> 
> 
> The clamping bit is a bit raised from the vice body, so most of the energy was wasted on it.
> After that I tried again this time hitting from the side of the vice and did manage to delid it. Even though the CPU slid down the vice and flew out a couple of times.
> A bit too late though, by that time the CPU was deader than dead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll go and get a new CPU tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure I won't attempt to delid it again. Too bad though, was really hoping for better temps.
> Too bad you can't buy them delidded.
> 
> Edit: I'm not sure if it had something to do with it, but I didn't have a suitable piece of wood so I used a dead optical drive.


Ouch...Sorry to hear that. A piece of pine is softer and less likely to do what happened to you here. I think that makes two now I have seen killed by the vise method. Best of luck on the next one.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I think that makes two now I have seen killed by the vise method. Best of luck on the next one.


To be fair, i don't think anyone's done any damage when they were using a more suitable vice and the right type of wood at the right angle - the vast majority of delid fails are people using the wrong razor or something that would probably make me cringe beforehand, and that's pretty sucky. I don't think it should hurt failure rates reputation though if somebody breaks a chip using the wrong blade, or by using a not ideal vice and an optical drive


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Finally decided to add CLP between the ihs and the cooler aswell temps seem to be OK








Because it turns out CLP is really easy to clean off with some isopropyl alcohol










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

















Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

















Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> Finally decided to add CLP between the ihs and the cooler aswell temps seem to be OK
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because it turns out CLP is really easy to clean off with some isopropyl alcohol :]


!! nice ! temp ?? ide , full ??


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Temps are with H100i @ GT AP-15 fans @ 7v
My cpu seems to be a bit of a potato oc wise, altho I might be the potato since all i did was increase the vcore and multi, I need to reasearch some other options to change


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> Well...
> I completely botched my first delidding attempt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tried the vice method on my 4770k and got .


sorri , nice !


----------



## MengNa

This thread is quite long and hard to sift through, so I've got a couple of questions in case I manage to work up the nerve to try this again.
Which vice is the best kind to try with?
Which kind of wood is the best to use?
What is the best orientation of the CPU on the vice and which direction should I hit from?
What's the easiest way to clean the black goo afterwards?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> This thread is quite long and hard to sift through, so I've got a couple of questions in case I manage to work up the nerve to try this again.
> Which vice is the best kind to try with?
> Which kind of wood is the best to use?
> What is the best orientation of the CPU on the vice and which direction should I hit from?
> What's the easiest way to clean the black goo afterwards?


I am no expert as I have just done 1 delid but I just used a random 7€ vice from the hardware store its really tiny and didnt open much more then was needed to put the cpu between the jaws, so i would say just about any vice will work, just make sure you secure it to a steady table or whatever, and if the table doesnt weigh a ton press it next to the wall so it doesnt move, and make sure the vice has nice edges, because if they are rounded the cpu just wont stay there ( the edge u have to clamp to is pretty small ) and make sure to cover the jaws with some painters tape or something if you dont want to ruin your ihs.

I just used a random piece of wood i found I have no idea wich one was it but damn it was not very soft, quite the opposite i belive.

And i cleaned the clue with a credit card, just be careful dont rush it, and watch out for the thingies left of the core, you dont want to shave those off


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> This thread is quite long and hard to sift through, so I've got a couple of questions in case I manage to work up the nerve to try this again.
> Which vice is the best kind to try with?
> Which kind of wood is the best to use?
> What is the best orientation of the CPU on the vice and which direction should I hit from?
> What's the easiest way to clean the black goo afterwards?


The vice just has to be something that does not move. It does not have to be expensive necessarily. It just means it should probably not have rubber (at least nothing soft), and it should not have be something where the head can be twisted around. Those are for hobby projects where you don't need go at things with violence.

Probably the hardest wood you can find. It may not deform. If it changes shape where it touches the CPU, you risk the wood you use eating into the PCB and destroying it.

No idea. I think I've seen people use both directions according to their pictures. I clamped my CPU with the sides that has those little "flaps" on the IHS on the vice clamps.

Probably a credit card. I guess the idea is just that you have to use something that's softer than the PCB, so that the PCB does not get destroyed by your scratching. I wanted to be safe and used my finger nails. That should be the most control you can have regarding the scratching you will have to do. It took me a long time with finger nails.

About your vice and wood questions, you might be interested to know that there's a guy that delidded several CPUs without using an actual vice. He just used blocks of wood. I think his setup was like this (the wood was something hard and cut well, the pieces were pretty large):



There's pictures somewhere in this thread or the hammer+vice thread.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> Well...
> I completely botched my first delidding attempt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Tried the vice method on my 4770k and got this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At first I thought I wasn't hitting it hard enough, but it was only afterwards that I realize it was because of the vice I used:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The clamping bit is a bit raised from the vice body, so most of the energy was wasted on it.
> After that I tried again this time hitting from the side of the vice and did manage to delid it. Even though the CPU slid down the vice and flew out a couple of times.
> A bit too late though, by that time the CPU was deader than dead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll go and get a new CPU tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure I won't attempt to delid it again. Too bad though, was really hoping for better temps.
> Too bad you can't buy them delidded.
> 
> Edit: I'm not sure if it had something to do with it, but I didn't have a suitable piece of wood so I used a dead optical drive.


OUCH! Sorry about that...







The optical drive likely didn't have much to do with it... I've done 4 delids now (albeit all on ivy's - haven't done a haswell yet.. but will before the end of the year most likely) all with a stripped HDD frame:


However, the first time I used it I nearly had the same failure you did... because that time the drive wasn't stripped. The problem (at least for me) is control - not hardness of the block used. Used properly a striker block has only one purpose - distributing the force of the hit. I can tell just by looking at the damage that at least one of your hits was not completely parallel to the PCB - which is what causes it to crack/split. The heaver or wider the block is - the less likely you can hold it perfectly flush with the side of the PCB - once I stripped my HDD down to the case - which also meant I could hold it like the picture - every delid since then has gone smoothly and taken less than 30 seconds to complete.

Of course, none of that really matters to you right now. But I don't think your vice was the biggest problem. If you do it again - remember to take your time, check the seating of the CPU every hit (make sure it's flat - parallel to the top of the vice lips) and that your block - whatever it's made of - is _completely_ flat and held perfectly flush against the side of the PCB.

Of course, I could also understand why you would just want to scrap this idea for at least a year or so.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> Well...
> I completely botched my first delidding attempt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Tried the vice method on my 4770k and got this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At first I thought I wasn't hitting it hard enough, but it was only afterwards that I realize it was because of the vice I used:
> 
> 
> 
> The clamping bit is a bit raised from the vice body, so most of the energy was wasted on it.
> After that I tried again this time hitting from the side of the vice and did manage to delid it. Even though the CPU slid down the vice and flew out a couple of times.
> A bit too late though, by that time the CPU was deader than dead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll go and get a new CPU tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure I won't attempt to delid it again. Too bad though, was really hoping for better temps.
> Too bad you can't buy them delidded.
> 
> 
> Edit: I'm not sure if it had something to do with it, but I didn't have a suitable piece of wood so I used a dead optical drive.


you are right the OPTICAL DRIVE is folded sheet metal it has no structure to prevent deforming.
I used a piece of nylon block but ever you use it has to be solid and have absolute square straight edges.

The vice looks good but I would suggest maybe a heavier hammer as a smaller hammer will need you to take golf swings where a big hammer will allow small more controlled hits.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Yea, I was thinking that too. maybe he hit it upwards, "peeling" the PCB from the IHS rather than "pushing" it.


----------



## MengNa

Thanks for all the replies!
I'm working up the courage to try again, so I really appreciate all the tips.
If I do it again I'll make sure to use a piece of wood and a bigger hammer.
I'll also take the vice back to the store and see if they have a more suitable one.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> Thanks for all the replies!
> I'm working up the courage to try again, so I really appreciate all the tips.
> If I do it again I'll make sure to use a piece of wood and a bigger hammer.
> I'll also take the vice back to the store and see if they have a more suitable one.


gl to ya I failed my first one also, (chip only runs in single channel memory mode now, buddy using it for a gaming rig)

I decided to just pay someone to do my other ones 25$ a piece well spent.


----------



## Gilly225

Decided to Delid my 4770k after some research...Used the Vice method, everything went smooth. Running on 4.6 at 1.25 topping out at 62C under prime 95.

-4770k
-h100i
-Asus Vi hero


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gilly225*
> 
> Decided to Delid my 4770k after some research...Used the Vice method, everything went smooth. Running on 4.6 at 1.25 topping out at 62C under prime 95.
> 
> -4770k
> -h100i
> -Asus Vi hero


Would you mind running on 46x

1.3v core
1.3v uncore @ auto multi
and intelburntest @ default settings ? Would be nice to compare because I have exactly the same everything


----------



## Gilly225

I ran it at 1.25 for the moment, running some applications I need before a restart...I'll get back to you

Time (s) Speed (GFlops) Result
7.564 118.1720 3.156799e-002
7.703 116.0510 3.156799e-002
7.568 118.1127 3.156799e-002
7.576 117.9953 3.156799e-002
7.593 117.7298 3.156799e-002
7.539 118.5687 3.156799e-002
7.574 118.0260 3.156799e-002
7.773 115.0027 3.156799e-002
8.298 107.7213 3.156799e-002
7.667 116.5830 3.156799e-002


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I mean t compare the temps =)


----------



## Gilly225

I was actually surprised here were my temps...

Core 0 - 35/79
Core 1 - 35/83
Core 2 - 37/88
Core 3- 33/74
Package - 37/87

Wasn't expecting those high of temps but Still stable and that was the highest I've seen.
Also Ai Suite is messing with my Mobo Settings and changing my Fans RPMs


----------



## Supacasey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Meh. It doesn't matter too much, only thing that could affect is the curvature of the IHS. Normally, the concave part of the IHS sits around where the middle of the die is so each core gets proportional cooling. But this probably won't make a difference because the IHS isn't actually touching the die.


around where would be the "best" spot for the IHS to sit then? I'm being a little obsessive about this since I'm trying to get everything as "perfect" as I can before I assemble my loop, and there's next to no info about seating after a delid other than keeping the IHS off the black rectangle.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> around where would be the "best" spot for the IHS to sit then? I'm being a little obsessive about this since I'm trying to get everything as "perfect" as I can before I assemble my loop, and there's next to no info about seating after a delid other than keeping the IHS off the black rectangle.


Well, probably the "best" location is exactly where Intel had it... which is basically centered on the PCB (and therefore centered in the retention bracket) - that should give the most even contact with the die and therefore the most thermal transfer to the IHS from the die.


----------



## Supacasey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Well, probably the "best" location is exactly where Intel had it... which is basically centered on the PCB (and therefore centered in the retention bracket) - that should give the most even contact with the die and therefore the most thermal transfer to the IHS from the die.


That's what I thought, but going by the residue outline left from the glue, that'd put the lip of the IHS over the bevel of the black rectangle. Wouldn't make a difference with glue since there's already a small gap, but with the IHS flush against the PCB I imagine that might create a new gap.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> That's what I thought, but going by the residue outline left from the glue, that'd put the lip of the IHS over the bevel of the black rectangle. Wouldn't make a difference with glue since there's already a small gap, but with the IHS flush against the PCB I imagine that might create a new gap.


Yeah the corner of the lips usually are against that rectangle... but just barely:


That's where I've got mine and it does 5GHz at 1.44v vCore and never sees anything over 72C at the cores... Is it possible that I could get another .5C by repositioning it? Maybe, but the thing is you could get a larger variance just from one TIM application and mount to the next. There simply isn't a magic bullet approach that will guarantee the best application and mount every single time - just ways to make it more likely. No matter what that rectangle isn't high, and it's printed on a fairly soft substrate - so it should deform if necessary once under the pressure of the retention mechanism.

But if you're really that worried about it - then run it as you have it...







Either that or spend the extra for a naked-die mount and run without it... that way you don't have to worry about placement at all... just about not over tightening the block...


----------



## Supacasey

I'm tempted to put the stock fan on it and run a little test, but... Too lazy. Middle of the PCB it is.


----------



## Supacasey

That looks centered.

I removed the IHS from the PCB and re-dispersed the CLU with the included brush before I set it back down to center it instead of applying new/more CLU, that's alright, right? I know that with typical TIM if you remove contact between the IHS and heatsink that you have to clean and re-apply it, but I figure since you have to spread CLU yourself it should be fine. I originally applied it 12 hours ago when I put the IHS in that raised position.


----------



## naved777

I know this question have been asked again and again
But which one to get CLU or CLP ?
After going through almost 500 pages all I see is CLP BUT is CLP between die and IHS is bad for long run?
Will it damage the die say after 6 months if I want to change the TIM ?
I have seen a post somewhere that the mirror thingy from die stuck to IHS after it was taken off which was a bit unpleasant. Can't say the same about CLU since very few are using it and is it true CLU is easier to clean than CLP ?
And after how many months will I have to change CLP or CLU if I apply it between IHS and CPU block or should I avoid it completely ?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> I know this question have been asked again and again
> But which one to get CLU or CLP ?
> After going through almost 500 pages all I see is CLP BUT is CLP between die and IHS is bad for long run?
> Will it damage the die say after 6 months if I want to change the TIM ?
> I have seen a post somewhere that the mirror thingy from die stuck to IHS after it was taken off which was a bit unpleasant. Can't say the same about CLU since very few are using it and is it true CLU is easier to clean than CLP ?
> And after how many months will I have to change CLP or CLU if I apply it between IHS and CPU block or should I avoid it completely ?


Use CLU. CLP can harden over time and sort of weld the two parts together, which is very bad. Most everyone is using CLU between the die and IHS.


----------



## naved777

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Use CLU. CLP can harden over time and sort of weld the two parts together, which is very bad. Most everyone is using CLU between the die and IHS.


Thanx !
CLU it is


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> sorri , nice !


Looks sweet. Although you are putting force not directly in the plane of the PCB which could potentially be bad.
When using two different clamp heights one could position the CPU perfectly horizontal. Since there's no risk of flying CPU's nor blunt force this would definitely be my method of choice.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That looks centered.
> 
> I removed the IHS from the PCB and re-dispersed the CLU with the included brush before I set it back down to center it instead of applying new/more CLU, that's alright, right? I know that with typical TIM if you remove contact between the IHS and heatsink that you have to clean and re-apply it, but I figure since you have to spread CLU yourself it should be fine. I originally applied it 12 hours ago when I put the IHS in that raised position.










Looks good and yeah you're fine as far as the CLU is concerned. I did exactly the same thing to my 3570K after 6 months... I just added a tiny dot more to the application, rebrushed it on the die and the underside of the IHS... and remounted it... got slightly _better_ temps! Although, considering the fact that it was a different motherboard, and (obviously) I also changed out the TIM application between the IHS and the block as well... hard to say conclusively where the difference came from. However, many others have simply 'adjusted' their CLU application after some time and been just fine with it.


----------



## Vodkacooling

Man. After reading this thread. I reay want to try this on my 4770k. I do not have a vice and am a little sketched to try razor blade. I guess I could try and find a vice at home depot. Do they have them on display? Lol. I could do it in the store? Hahahah. Will a cheap vice work?

I'd love to bring the temps down and up the voltage and get another 200-300mhz. I'm currently doing 1.275-1.29 volts on my 4770k for 4.7ghz.

I got nothing left to mess with in my comp.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> Man. After reading this thread. I reay want to try this on my 4770k. I do not have a vice and am a little sketched to try razor blade. I guess I could try and find a vice at home depot. Do they have them on display? Lol. I could do it in the store? Hahahah. Will a cheap vice work?
> 
> I'd love to bring the temps down and up the voltage and get another 200-300mhz. I'm currently doing 1.275-1.29 volts on my 4770k for 4.7ghz.
> 
> I got nothing left to mess with in my comp.


what temps you getting with those settings?


----------



## Vodkacooling

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> what temps you getting with those settings?


In bf4 usually around 60-70 prime95 goes into 80-85c.

I have a water loop with 2 780s running on ex24 +ex360 +rx120.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> In bf4 usually around 60-70 prime95 goes into 80-85c.
> 
> I have a water loop with 2 780s running on ex24 +ex360 +rx120.


that sounds really good without even delidding.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> Man. After reading this thread. I reay want to try this on my 4770k. I do not have a vice and am a little sketched to try razor blade. I guess I could try and find a vice at home depot. Do they have them on display? Lol. I could do it in the store? Hahahah. Will a cheap vice work?
> 
> I'd love to bring the temps down and up the voltage and get another 200-300mhz. I'm currently doing 1.275-1.29 volts on my 4770k for 4.7ghz.
> 
> I got nothing left to mess with in my comp.


doet
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> In bf4 usually around 60-70 prime95 goes into 80-85c.
> 
> I have a water loop with 2 780s running on ex24 +ex360 +rx120.


pssssst doet


----------



## hotdun

OCN name: hotdun
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: IC Diamond 24
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
Temp drops: N/A
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/agpigh

Covered resistors with IC Diamond. Max temp 60C with custom watercooling.


----------



## Cyro999

^Your CPU-Z validation shows 3.5ghz









Whats your final OC settings? Stuff like vcore, vrin, sa/io volts?


----------



## PinkJackal

What method do you guys recommend for deliding, razor or vise?
I have them both, but I want to do it as safe as possible!!!


----------



## TSXmike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PinkJackal*
> 
> What method do you guys recommend for deliding, razor or vise?
> I have them both, but I want to do it as safe as possible!!!


i used an ultra thin razor. was a breeze.


----------



## PinkJackal

Is this good enough, or is too thin?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PinkJackal*
> 
> Is this good enough, or is too thin?


awesome...watch your fingers on the backside of that blade!


----------



## PinkJackal

Don't worry my friend, I will blunt the other side with sandpaper!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PinkJackal*
> 
> Is this good enough, or is too thin?


The razor guys usually say that's too thin. It will twist and cut into the PCB. A thick razor, like for cutting carpets or something, is suggested.

Use vice.







It's easy. You pretty much just have to make sure to not hold the piece of wood at an angle, and nothing can go wrong.


----------



## PinkJackal

Use vice.







It's easy. You pretty much just have to make sure to not hold the piece of wood at an angle, and nothing can go wrong.[/quote]

Do you really need to use a piece of wood, or you can use something similar?


----------



## Vodkacooling

Hmmm. Ill go to home depot in a week and see what they got. Piece of wood. Mallet and vice. Then some CLU. And in set. Hmmm. Lately I've been spending a lot on my comp and messsing with it lol.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PinkJackal*
> 
> Do you really need to use a piece of wood, or you can use something similar?


Someone used a broken hard drive. So that was a block of aluminium.

Another dude failed with an old optical drive. The CPU was destroyed.

So overall, I guess you need to make sure to have something with a flat, hard edge. It may not deform where it touches the PCB. It does not need to be wood. The idea of holding that block to the PCB and hitting that block is about making sure the energy from the hammer hit gets distributed equally into the PCB's side.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> The razor guys usually say that's too thin. It will twist and cut into the PCB. A thick razor, like for cutting carpets or something, is suggested.
> 
> Use vice.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's easy. You pretty much just have to make sure to not hold the piece of wood at an angle, and nothing can go wrong.


Nope. I used very thin blades and nothing happened. You just have to be careful.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotdun*
> 
> OCN name: hotdun
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: IC Diamond 24
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.9 Ghz
> Temp drops: N/A
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/agpigh
> 
> Covered resistors with IC Diamond. Max temp 60C with custom watercooling.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on! (btw wanna send me an updated cpu-z?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PinkJackal*
> 
> Is this good enough, or is too thin?


http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/820909/820909542001lg.jpg

those blades are the best sturdy and sharp as heck and easy to handle! (plus i'll be doing my 6th this way







(if it survives LN2 better than the last one!)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Someone used a broken hard drive. So that was a block of aluminium.
> 
> Another dude failed with an old optical drive. The CPU was destroyed.
> 
> So overall, I guess you need to make sure to have something with a flat, hard edge. It may not deform where it touches the PCB. It does not need to be wood. The idea of holding that block to the PCB and hitting that block is about making sure the energy from the hammer hit gets distributed equally into the PCB's side.


Thats why each way is fine really... Just need to be patient and careful of what you are doing and just take your time. Patients is king.


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PinkJackal*
> 
> Is this good enough, or is too thin?


I agree with Valgaur Use this Kind


----------



## davwman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PinkJackal*
> 
> Is this good enough, or is too thin?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with Valgaur Use this Kind
Click to expand...

Definitely use the utility blade, not the straight edge. I messed up a chip bad once with a straight edge, due to the straight edge blade chipping and causing an uneven edge.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> I agree with Valgaur Use this Kind


Those single sided are the ones I used for a couple 3770k, all went well.

I used the vise & hammer for the 4770k, I preferred the vise, it was easy & quicker, seemed like less chances of damage although a few posts have shown you have to be a bit careful with the choice of vise & material used between the hammer & chip. I used a basic bench vise & a piece of standard 2x2.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Those single sided are the ones I used for a couple 3770k, all went well.
> 
> I used the vise & hammer for the 4770k, I preferred the vise, it was easy & quicker, seemed like less chances of damage although a few posts have shown you have to be a bit careful with the choice of vise & material used between the hammer & chip. I used a basic bench vise & a piece of standard 2x2.


exactly its quicker but i just can take a wack at something like that lol. seems wrong


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Despite having great success with all of my delids using the HDD casing - there are better solutions (that's just what was easy and available). With the HDD case you have to carefully select the location to use as the sides are not uniformly flat (there are indents, and mount points that aren't flush). I think the best non-wood suggestion made here has been the striker block for hardwood flooring - which I had at home but not at the office, otherwise I would have used mine.

They're pretty cheap and I think worth it: here's the one that I have.

I also have one of these which I'll use the next time I delid as well: dead-blow hammer.

Are they necessary? Nope. All of my delids work great after getting topless via HDD casing and regular hammer... but if there are better tools for less than the cost of a budget heatsink... why not?

As far as vise - if you have a Harbor Freight nearby or are willing to wait for the shipment... these are great and can be attached to almost any table/counter and then put away until needed again (besides, a good vise is almost as useful as a good set of screwdrivers or a dremel). Although if you have a workbench or something you can anchor a vise to... THIS would be about the best imaginable as you could easily hold the block flush and stable against the lips for near perfect control.

I won't comment on the razor possibility as all but one of my chips had such fine tolerances as far as the PCB-to-IHS gap was concerned that even a surgical scalpel I had couldn't get under them easily and I chickened out before completion.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> As far as vise - if you have a Harbor Freight *The Man Store* nearby or are willing to wait for the shipment...


FTFY... <3 me some Harbor Freight


----------



## asuindasun

So I'm about to delid my 3770k and started reading through this again... last time I was looking at delidding (and bought the die/IHS TIM) CLP was recommended, but seeing that that may be a bad idea now? Is there any harm in using the CLP vs CLU if I've no intention of taking the IHS off again?


----------



## ozzy1925

after 2.5 months of clu i decided to go with stock cooler and i want try gelid extreme on the die .Should i spread the gelid extreme just like clu and add some more on the back of the ihs?


----------



## towtol

I ordered some Turniq TX-4 from newegg and it finally arrived today. I didn't feel comfortable with CLP/CLU so I opted for the next best TIM (imho).

I delidded my i7-4770k a couple of hours ago and it was a success. I used the razor blade(s) method.

Once I got thru the glue on a corner it was easy enough to work it around the sides. The IHS pulled off after I got thru most of the top, right, and bottom sides. I stayed away from that left side.

There was a close call when the small xacto blade I was using pushed thru and I thought I hit the die but it turned out I missed it.

The die was missing TIM in one whole corner (upper left). All shiny. No TIM on die nor IHS in that spot. Looks like the machine that was applying it got off target.

I did nick up the pcb with the razor and gold was showing thru in quite a few spots. Not huge nicks... had to turn it in the light just right to see therm but they were there.

I put a thick line of Turniq down the center of the die and I took some generic Cooler Master TIM I had from a Hyper TX3 heatsink and used that to trace over where the glue was and were the nicks were. If I didn't short out anything in the pcb I didn't want the IHS to cause any shorts. I put a thin layer on the whole top of the IHS as Tuniq suggested and then hooked up the Kraken X60.

It's working!

Temps are about 15C less than what I was getting for same clocks running prime95. And the temps between the cores are tighter together. I was getting one core that would spike into the 90s while the rest were in the 70s before I delidded.

I'm OCd 4.7 @ 1.375. Ring is at 4.4 no offset. My 1600 ram is OCd to 2133 and it does fine on prime95. It takes 1.575 to get it to pass prime95 at 4.9Ghz but thats without any mem OC.

It seems for right now my best performance is at 4.7Ghz @ 1.375. I can play B4, C3, and Skyrim without crashing.

I'll play with it more as time goes on.


----------



## Swag

Off-Topic but:

Autumn Steam Sale Happening right now!

Gift from a friend:


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> FTFY... <3 me some Harbor Freight


LOL yeah me too... some of the stuff is just OK (cheap imports) but that's everywhere these days.


----------



## asuindasun

Well that was a lot less scary than I thought it'd be.



OCN name: asuindasun
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: TBD
OC after delid: TBD
Temp drops: 25C

Now going to see how far I can push it...


----------



## Nooblit

Officially delidded my 3770k. Applied CLU to the die and the ihs. Computer turned on, so that's good. But here's the thing:

Before running any stress tests whatsoever i wanted to make sure the computer was running at a normal temp. My idle temps are around 35-40c. There's literally no real difference in idle temp after delidding.







Is that normal? My p95 temps are significantly lower however, dropping from around 85-100c to hovering somewhere near 55c, so that's something to definitely be happy about. I'm just worried about the idle temps. Can anyone confirm that i am indeed ok?


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> Officially delidded my 3770k. Applied CLU to the die and the ihs. Computer turned on, so that's good. But here's the thing:
> 
> Before running any stress tests whatsoever i wanted to make sure the computer was running at a normal temp. My idle temps are around 35-40c. There's literally no real difference in idle temp after delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that normal? My p95 temps are significantly lower however, dropping from around 85-100c to hovering somewhere near 55c, so that's something to definitely be happy about. I'm just worried about the idle temps. Can anyone confirm that i am indeed ok?


I wouldn't worry about idle temps if you dropped 30+C on load lol.

That is one heck of a drop. I have a hard time figuring out how much my CLU application dropped my temps since I also went from a cheapo air cooler to a custom water cooling loop at the same time and changed from a 3570k to a 3770k.

I do know my 3570k hit 80c+ with my 4.5ghz oc on air cooler / no delid and it was 55c max after CLU application and water loop install.

I do know my 3770k idles at <20C on some cores and around 30 on the highest core.

What are your ambient temps? It's pretty cold in my house right now as i'm cheap and don't like to pay for heat



pic I just took while running intel burn test with 1.38~ vcore.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> Officially delidded my 3770k. Applied CLU to the die and the ihs. Computer turned on, so that's good. But here's the thing:
> 
> Before running any stress tests whatsoever i wanted to make sure the computer was running at a normal temp. My idle temps are around 35-40c. There's literally no real difference in idle temp after delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that normal? My p95 temps are significantly lower however, dropping from around 85-100c to hovering somewhere near 55c, so that's something to definitely be happy about. I'm just worried about the idle temps. Can anyone confirm that i am indeed ok?


Idle temps are fake, they can't be properly recorded using a software.


----------



## Nooblit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> I wouldn't worry about idle temps if you dropped 30+C on load lol.
> 
> That is one heck of a drop. I have a hard time figuring out how much my CLU application dropped my temps since I also went from a cheapo air cooler to a custom water cooling loop at the same time and changed from a 3570k to a 3770k.
> 
> I do know my 3570k hit 80c+ with my 4.5ghz oc on air cooler / no delid and it was 55c max after CLU application and water loop install.
> 
> I do know my 3770k idles at <20C on some cores and around 30 on the highest core.
> 
> What are your ambient temps? It's pretty cold in my house right now as i'm cheap and don't like to pay for heat


I wanna say when i started it was around 26c in my room. I just opened up my window to get the temp down a bit to see if it affects it at all. But yeah, i'm pretty happy with the load temp drop. I am stressing it with the stock clock speed however... i suppose it'll rise a bit when i bring it back up to 4.5ghz.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Idle temps are fake, they can't be properly recorded using a software.


This is news to me. Guess i shouldn't worry about it then?

One thing i would also like to note, not sure if it's normal or not: Core 2 and 4 run about 5c hotter than the other two. I'm almost entirely sure it was the same way before i delidded but still, i feel like i should voice all my concerns around other people with experience.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> I wanna say when i started it was around 26c in my room. I just opened up my window to get the temp down a bit to see if it affects it at all. But yeah, i'm pretty happy with the load temp drop. I am stressing it with the stock clock speed however... i suppose it'll rise a bit when i bring it back up to 4.5ghz.
> This is news to me. Guess i shouldn't worry about it then?


he is technically right, the temp sensor gets much much more accurate closer to the tjmax of a chip.

That being said, I def used to idle alot higher before the delid/water loop install









Oh and yeah, some cores do run 5-10c hotter than others


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> I wanna say when i started it was around 26c in my room. I just opened up my window to get the temp down a bit to see if it affects it at all. But yeah, i'm pretty happy with the load temp drop. I am stressing it with the stock clock speed however... i suppose it'll rise a bit when i bring it back up to 4.5ghz.
> This is news to me. Guess i shouldn't worry about it then?
> 
> 
> 
> he is technically right, the temp sensor gets much much more accurate closer to the tjmax of a chip.
> 
> That being said, I def used to idle alot higher before the delid/water loop install
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh and yeah, some cores do run 5-10c hotter than others
Click to expand...

Yea, they work to a degree but are really inaccurate as they get lower. The sensors aren't made to be that accurate at lower temps because they weren't specifically made to allow overclockers to monitor their temps, they were made to properly make sure that the chip doesn't reach a temp where the chip will get damaged.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Long time I've posted in here - but thought to post this:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1444861/nominations-the-most-helpful-people-on-oc-net

Please go an vote for Swag and Valgaur for their contributions to the de-lidded club.
If it weren't for those two, there would have never been any delidding that would have taken place on OCN - at least not in that manner.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Long time I've posted in here - but thought to post this:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1444861/nominations-the-most-helpful-people-on-oc-net
> 
> Please go an vote for Swag and Valgaur for their contributions to the de-lidded club.
> If it weren't for those two, there would have never been any delidding that would have taken place on OCN - at least not in that manner.


Haha thanks.









Anyone who wants Audiosurf, it's $1.99 on Steam right now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asuindasun*
> 
> Well that was a lot less scary than I thought it'd be.
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: asuindasun
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: TBD
> OC after delid: TBD
> Temp drops: 25C
> 
> Now going to see how far I can push it...


You're In!







Now go and SLappa Dat Sig on! Welcome to the club!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> Officially delidded my 3770k. Applied CLU to the die and the ihs. Computer turned on, so that's good. But here's the thing:
> 
> Before running any stress tests whatsoever i wanted to make sure the computer was running at a normal temp. My idle temps are around 35-40c. There's literally no real difference in idle temp after delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that normal? My p95 temps are significantly lower however, dropping from around 85-100c to hovering somewhere near 55c, so that's something to definitely be happy about. I'm just worried about the idle temps. Can anyone confirm that i am indeed ok?


Those kinds of temp drops are amazing and as Swag mentioned the idles no need to worry honestly full load is what you need to be careful off and with 55C high is amazing.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> I wanna say when i started it was around 26c in my room. I just opened up my window to get the temp down a bit to see if it affects it at all. But yeah, i'm pretty happy with the load temp drop. I am stressing it with the stock clock speed however... i suppose it'll rise a bit when i bring it back up to 4.5ghz.
> This is news to me. Guess i shouldn't worry about it then?
> 
> One thing i would also like to note, not sure if it's normal or not: Core 2 and 4 run about 5c hotter than the other two. I'm almost entirely sure it was the same way before i delidded but still, i feel like i should voice all my concerns around other people with experience.


usually during idles in the desktop format the cpu "shuts down" a few cores are active to power the idle programs during normal desktop usage so it's more than normal.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Haha thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone who wants Audiosurf, it's $1.99 on Steam right now.


ermagaaad
Just tried the demo - love at first sight - bough the game instantly








+rep for recommendation.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> Officially delidded my 3770k. Applied CLU to the die and the ihs. Computer turned on, so that's good. But here's the thing:
> 
> Before running any stress tests whatsoever i wanted to make sure the computer was running at a normal temp. My idle temps are around 35-40c. There's literally no real difference in idle temp after delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is that normal? My p95 temps are significantly lower however, dropping from around 85-100c to hovering somewhere near 55c, so that's something to definitely be happy about. I'm just worried about the idle temps. Can anyone confirm that i am indeed ok?


My idle temps stayed the same, too. As the old tim would be fine for the small amount of heat at idle.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

My idle temps are similar, although a little lower. Before I was at 33c and after delidding I went to around 29c.
I wouldn't honestly worry about your idle temps though, worry about your max temp, which seems to have been drastically improved


----------



## Cr4zy

Agreed, idle temps will barely change. When I went direct-to-die I noticed minor idle temp drops, but astounding load temp drops, that's what de-lidding aims for.


----------



## asuindasun

Update to my TBD...

OCN name: asuindasun
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 200
OC after delid: 5.1Ghz
Temp drops: 25C

http://valid.canardpc.com/i5p9ee


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asuindasun*
> 
> Update to my TBD...
> 
> OCN name: asuindasun
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 5.1Ghz
> Temp drops: 25C
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/i5p9ee


updated!


----------



## skupples

Hello delid club... I'm seeking information on lapping e-series CPU's. More specifically, how to not fill the IHS hole with water, shavings, & compounds.


----------



## MengNa

Well I'm not sure what's going on, so I'm bringing this to the experts









I got a replacement 4770k after my unfortunate incident with the hammer (just to be clear, what happened was entirely my fault for using the rong tools and shouldn't dissuade anyone from trying to delid), and after I installed it with the stock Intel cooler at stock settings it reported 100C temp on all but one core (which seems to max out at 95C+-) when using IBT and Linx.

So I took it back to the store and they sent it to the lab. Today they brought it back to me saying that they tested with the stock cooler and maxed out at 82C with linpack.

I put it back and it still reports a temp of 100C for me, but after using IBT and Linx for the last hour I'm not sure what's going on.

Edit: also wanted to add that I'm getting around 45-50C at idle



The Linx on the left is without AVX and the one on the right is with AVX.

The Asus AI Suite 3 reports no more than 88-90 degrees, but from what I know their reading is an average of what the CPU reports and a thermal probe they placed underneath the socket.

RealTemp and HWMonitor report pretty much the same thing at around 100C for all cores.
I'm not sure, but I don't think the CPU is throttling, it seems to stay at 3.6-3.9Ghz on all cores during the tests. All the voltages seem in order and MB and VRM temps are in line.

When I put my hand over the CPU HSF I don't really get a blast of heat as I would expect when running these kinds of temps. I should also note that this is the same HSF I used on my previous 4770k at stock setting with the temps staying at under 80C, and I also used it on the Pentium I was using while waiting for the new CPU and it didn't go over 55C. I also tried to reseat the HSF multiple times and each time I took it off I saw the thermal paste (MX2) application was perfect.

This is getting long so I'll cut to the chase:

Is my CPU throttling according to the Linx/IBT results? Linx with no AVX gives me an average of of 51 GFlofs and Linx with AVX and IBT give an average of 82-83 GFlops. Are these the expected results at stock settings?

Is this temp reading simply false? Later I'm planning on taking the CPU to a friend to see if it gives the same readings on his MB. Maybe it's just giving me false readings on my MB (Maximus VI Formula).

Could the CPU actually be reaching these temps? Personally I would expect it to shut my PC down or something at these temps, or at least do some serious throttling.

Do you think delidding it would solve the issue? If it is a false reading my problem is that once it goes over 75C all my fans go to 100% speed, and I'm going to have 14 Corsair SP12 PWM high performance fans and a Swiftech MCP 35X2 off the CPU header, and I can't have them running at full blast whenever I put the least bit of stress on the PC.

If the temp reading is indeed false and only on my MB I might just sell it off and get a different one. Will probably lose some money in the process, but if there's no other choice...


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Is my CPU throttling according to the Linx/IBT results? Linx with no AVX gives me an average of of 51 GFlofs and Linx with AVX and IBT give an average of 82-83 GFlops. Are these the expected results at stock settings?


I would guess that you're using adaptive voltage (you need cpu-z 1.64.0 or hwinfo to display vcore..) and it's getting the 1.2v shown in your monitoring software, which will ofc give 100c with stock cooler and AVX load.

Unthrottled with AVX at stock is in the leagues of 100gflops, avx2 in the leagues of 200gflops
Quote:


> Edit: also wanted to add that I'm getting around 45-50C at idle


Just saw this - your cooler is installed incorrectly most likely then. If it's been tested elsewhere..

Idle power loads are in the leagues of 5 or 10 watts. There's nothing to heat up a cooler if the heat is being removed from die.
Quote:


> When I put my hand over the CPU HSF I don't really get a blast of heat as I would expect when running these kinds of temps.


Dies heat up very fast, coolers do not. You can easily have an fx-8350 at 50c giving off 300 watts, and a 4770k at 95c giving off 80 watts - you don't feel how hot the die is (unless you're physically touching it while it's on) just how much heat it has given off, or rather how much the cooler has heated up. 80 watts for a few seconds might make the die 100c, but it won't heat up even a stock cooler at all. 200 watts for 5 minutes will heat up anything, though - it's 75x as much heat energy as 80w for 10 seconds.

Big problem i'd say though is just Vcore. Temp sensors are on the CPU die, as is voltage delivery - but different mobo's tell the IVR on-die to behave differently. Don't stress with adaptive voltage - ever. Stressing Haswell's with adaptive voltage is WAAAY up there on the list of how people have killed them flat out - and there's not many dead chips. On stock clocks, you'll just end up with silly temps like this, if you manual like 1.3vcore adaptive and stress, you can flat out kill a chip.

Don't go replacing your board, especially if it's a kickass one that costs >2x as much as an awesome board like the d3h that'll run as much voltage as you could possibly want for haswell on water without degrading the chip to death (1.45+) - just learn the asus settings, first lesson is no adaptive mode on voltage - ever, if possible, but i don't know what options you have for regular use or volt dropping (like on gigabyte) but just never ever ever ever using adaptive voltage for stress, especially avx/avx2 stress is extremely important


----------



## MengNa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I would guess that you're using adaptive voltage (you need cpu-z 1.64.0 or hwinfo to display vcore..) and it's getting the 1.2v shown in your monitoring software, which will ofc give 100c with stock cooler and AVX load.
> 
> Unthrottled with AVX at stock is in the leagues of 100gflops, avx2 in the leagues of 200gflops
> Just saw this - your cooler is installed incorrectly most likely then. If it's been tested elsewhere..


I dunno if it was using adaptive voltage as everything in the bios was still set to default. In my naivety I assumed that the stock speeds and stock setting were not meant to fry my CPU. I haven't bothered learning Haswell overclocking yet as I was planning to do so when I delidded and assembled my watercooling loop.
You were right though, the HSF wasn't seated properly this time.
I reseated it and locked the VCore voltage to the lowest possible with manual mode: 1.056 V which runs Linx and IBT without crashing at stock speeds.



Now Linx (AVX) stressing gives a result of 101-103 GFlops. which I assume is correct (if it's not please let me know







), and the temps seem to hover around 70-75 with occasional 5 second jumps to 85-90.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Idle power loads are in the leagues of 5 or 10 watts. There's nothing to heat up a cooler if the heat is being removed from die.
> Dies heat up very fast, coolers do not. You can easily have an fx-8350 at 50c giving off 300 watts, and a 4770k at 95c giving off 80 watts - you don't feel how hot the die is (unless you're physically touching it while it's on) just how much heat it has given off, or rather how much the cooler has heated up. 80 watts for a few seconds might make the die 100c, but it won't heat up even a stock cooler at all. 200 watts for 5 minutes will heat up anything, though - it's 75x as much heat energy as 80w for 10 seconds.


With the HSF properly seated now it does give off more heat when doing a long stressing session.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Big problem i'd say though is just Vcore. Temp sensors are on the CPU die, as is voltage delivery - but different mobo's tell the IVR on-die to behave differently. Don't stress with adaptive voltage - ever. Stressing Haswell's with adaptive voltage is WAAAY up there on the list of how people have killed them flat out - and there's not many dead chips. On stock clocks, you'll just end up with silly temps like this, if you manual like 1.3vcore adaptive and stress, you can flat out kill a chip.
> 
> Don't go replacing your board, especially if it's a kickass one that costs >2x as much as an awesome board like the d3h that'll run as much voltage as you could possibly want for haswell on water without degrading the chip to death (1.45+) - just learn the asus settings, first lesson is no adaptive mode on voltage - ever, if possible, but i don't know what options you have for regular use or volt dropping (like on gigabyte) but just never ever ever ever using adaptive voltage for stress, especially avx/avx2 stress is extremely important


Nah the board is great and there's no other I'd trade it in for.
What's the problem with adaptive voltage that causes this issue? I used offset mode on my 2500K before with no problems for 2 years, and I thought that adaptive was just an extension of offset mode.
Well hopefully the temps will drop down to much better levels when I delid and put it under water.
Really starting to miss my 2500K and how easy it was to overclock... Doubt I'll manage to get the same 5GHz overclock on the 4770K.
The fun is just beginning








I still have no idea why this 4770K performed so much worse at stock settings than the previous one I broke... Same settings, completely different results.
Thanks for all the help!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> What's the problem with adaptive voltage that causes this issue?


Adaptive changes vcore depending on load, especially with avx/avx2 loads.

There was a guy who set his chip to like 1.3vcore adaptive, went afk during prime and came back to a dead chip - different fft sizes will give different vcore etc. "stock" is pretty bad and means different stuff on different boards, as shown. If asus tells the chip to use adaptive voltage, it can use 1.25 or even more volts under avx2 load, for no real reason, and draw like 50 watts more power

On gigabyte, the Manual option gives idles of ~0.1-0.7vcore, and load of whatever you set. Some of the other boards have different options - if you could only set adaptive or solid voltage 100% of the time, i'd be disappointed, but i dunno what asus can do

np and hf! enjoy haswell


----------



## MengNa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Adaptive changes vcore depending on load, especially with avx/avx2 loads.
> 
> There was a guy who set his chip to like 1.3vcore adaptive, went afk during prime and came back to a dead chip - different fft sizes will give different vcore etc. "stock" is pretty bad and means different stuff on different boards, as shown. If asus tells the chip to use adaptive voltage, it can use 1.25 or even more volts under avx2 load, for no real reason, and draw like 50 watts more power
> 
> On gigabyte, the Manual option gives idles of ~0.1-0.7vcore, and load of whatever you set. Some of the other boards have different options - if you could only set adaptive or solid voltage 100% of the time, i'd be disappointed, but i dunno what asus can do
> 
> np and hf! enjoy haswell


That sort of manual control over both idle and load VCore seems to be a Gigabyte only thing afaik.
I'm not into benching or folding, and am just looking for a good 24/7 OC for standard use. I guess after I use manual VCore to find a stable OC and voltage I'll switch to adaptive mode. I'm not really using anything with AVX, so should be fine.
What programs should I use for stability testing without AVX? Are Prime95 (blend) and wPrime sufficient?

I'm still testing and now running Linx with larger memory use (8 gigs) and the temp spikes go a bit higher to 95C and last much longer.
Do you think delidding and proper cooling (triple+quad rads P/P) will tame this CPU? It's always possible I just got a lemon on my hands...


----------



## CallsignVega

Many of you guys able to get Haswell to 5 GHz once de-lidded?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I'm not really using anything with AVX, so should be fine


All of the modern video encoders use AVX, like x264. Not that they crazily spike voltages or anything, but i really would not be comfortable setting adaptive voltage myself after what i've seen. Not when my Vcore is in the 1.3+ range.

Prime95 uses avx; look at the haswell OC thread (statistics one run by darkwizzie) x264 is great for stability testing, though with anything haswell, you'll have to run whatever programs/games and tweak a bit to get final stability once you have settings that are 99% there.

Lemon? Why do you say that? Because you have completely normal temperatures? Don't run Linx and three or four rads push/pull if you're not setting an overclock to run Linx. Anyone can get 200gflops, doesn't mean it's worth anything or at all representative of typical use.

I set up a power limit that would throttle my core clock when i used synthetic avx loads etc - and then i realized a few days later - why did i bother? I don't actually do that - Ever.

On a silver arrow, i'm testing 4.7ghz atm. 1.32 vcore bios (~1.34 load) with other settings correct - my average temp on hottest core is literally 69c with HT off (newest x264 encoder, ~99% avg cpu load for 12 mins). Don't (freaking) worry about it if you're on water. You can add 0.1vcore and HT - but then you're brickwalled unless you want to run into degradation anyway, and you can cool that just fine with water.

Quote:


> Many of you guys able to get Haswell to 5 GHz once de-lidded?


You don't need to delid, but it's down to luck. It's a bit harder than ivy - it's a bit trickier to work out stability with the 101's and 9c's for example, and you can't power vcore as hard - i'd stay 0.05v or 0.1v lower on Haswell than Ivy which sets a ceiling, but if you get a good chip, sure.

I think on high end air or equivalent, avg chip should do ~4.3 - 5ghz. 4.3, 4.4, 4.9 and 5.0 are pretty rare.


----------



## MengNa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> All of the modern video encoders use AVX, like x264. Not that they crazily spike voltages or anything, but i really would not be comfortable setting adaptive voltage myself after what i've seen. Not when my Vcore is in the 1.3+ range.
> 
> Prime95 uses avx; look at the haswell OC thread (statistics one run by darkwizzie) x264 is great for stability testing, though with anything haswell, you'll have to run whatever programs/games and tweak a bit to get final stability once you have settings that are 99% there.
> 
> Lemon? Why do you say that? Because you have completely normal temperatures? Don't run Linx and three or four rads push/pull if you're not setting an overclock to run Linx. Anyone can get 200gflops, doesn't mean it's worth anything or at all representative of typical use.
> 
> I set up a power limit that would throttle my core clock when i used synthetic avx loads etc - and then i realized a few days later - why did i bother? I don't actually do that - Ever.
> 
> On a silver arrow, i'm testing 4.7ghz atm. 1.32 vcore bios (~1.34 load) with other settings correct - my average temp on hottest core is literally 69c with HT off (newest x264 encoder, ~99% avg cpu load for 12 mins). Don't (freaking) worry about it if you're on water. You can add 0.1vcore and HT - but then you're brickwalled unless you want to run into degradation anyway, and you can cool that just fine with water.


I don't know how you can call running a CPU at stock settings with a stock cooler and getting 100C and the CPU throttling down normal. Granted I didn't do extensive stability testing on my previous 4770K but it sure as hell didn't reach 100C within 60 seconds of starting Linx. It didn't even break 85 with those same default settings.
Maybe Intel just really screwed up the TIM and IHS installation on this sample and delidding it will fix everything, but you can probably get my anxiety, cause if I delid and it's still acting like a small nuclear reactor I won't be able to RMA or sell it off to anyone and that's money down the drain This is already the second CPU I bought and I'm not keen on buying another one.

Edit: Even now after 2 hours of Prime95 stressing it holds at around 85-88 degrees. And I know the stock cooler isn't the best ever, but with such a low VCore voltage I'd have expected it to be much lower. Doing Linx again it's back to 90-95 degree peaks...


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I don't know how you can call running a CPU at stock settings with a stock cooler and getting 100C and the CPU throttling down normal.


100c and throttling is not normal

but on haswell it is

haswell

not even once

No, i'm serious though. If you're set to adaptive voltage i'd be surprised at anything but 100c.. Prime and linpack? They light up high end air, we're talking like 70 degrees at 1.1v. They don't run too well on the stock cooler.

It doesn't matter, though, because nobody runs prime28.1 and linpack all day, and the temperatures are, compared to other CPU architectures, disproportionally high under certain types of loads

Quote:


> I don't know how you can call running a CPU at stock settings with a stock cooler and getting 100C and the CPU throttling down normal. Granted I didn't do extensive stability testing on my previous 4770K but it sure as hell didn't reach 100C within 60 seconds of starting Linx. It didn't even break 85 with those same default settings.


Default settings are not the same, Especially with adaptive voltage. If you want to tell me that two samples are different, manual the same profile onto both of them with for example 1.1vcore fixed profile with the same vrin etc, then list temperature differences with cpu-z 1.64.0 or multimeter vcore readout - that's the only way.

There's two orders of magnitude more people thinking that they have special snowflake broken CPU's then there are actually mis-applied TIM under the IHS - auto settings are just completely worthless, and so is prime28.1/linpack, especially considering that you can change the temperatures in prime by 25 degrees celcius by toggling avx support or installing service pack 1 of windows 7

Intel's stock cooler is designed to keep the CPU cool under typical loads. If you're benching linpack at 200gflops, it's not typical load. The IVR going wild with adaptive voltage just blows that out of proportion even further - Haswell 101 is fixed voltage for stress or go home because of that


----------



## Totally Dubbed

I feel as if your mount is incorrectly done, or the paste isn't applied properly or the clu isn't enough or there's too much of it.
100c is ridiculously high. Even a stock Intel cooler can do better


----------



## Swag

Actually, Intel specifies that their stock cooler can keep the CPU within reasonable temperatures under stock circumstances regardless of usage. This means that on stock, the stock cooler will cool the CPU under the throttle temperature even with Linpack.

I'm going to guess that the mounting is bad, either on the die or the IHS.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually, Intel specifies that their stock cooler can keep the CPU within reasonable temperatures under stock circumstances regardless of usage. This means that on stock, the stock cooler will cool the CPU under the throttle temperature even with Linpack.
> 
> I'm going to guess that the mounting is bad, either on the die or the IHS.


agreed but isn't he overclocked? If so then that Intel guarantee goes out the window.
What cooler does he have? Maybe it isn't getting enough power? I know that's one is the common problems with the Antec ones, when people don't install it correctly


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually, Intel specifies that their stock cooler can keep the CPU within reasonable temperatures under stock circumstances regardless of usage. This means that on stock, the stock cooler will cool the CPU under the throttle temperature even with Linpack.
> 
> I'm going to guess that the mounting is bad, either on the die or the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> agreed but isn't he overclocked? If so then that Intel guarantee goes out the window.
> What cooler does he have? Maybe it isn't getting enough power? I know that's one is the common problems with the Antec ones, when people don't install it correctly
Click to expand...

Well process of elimination:
Given:
His cooler is definitely better than stock Intel cooler
Temperatures are reaching 100C

Problem:
Temperatures are reaching 100C

Question to ask:
Is the overclock to blame? - Check by reverting to stock and seeing if temperatures are reaching high temps
If the first didn't fix the problem, then by process of elimination, it has to be the mounting.

If the first one was to blame, re-evaluate overclock and make sure the voltages are being entered properly.


----------



## MengNa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> 100c and throttling is not normal
> 
> but on haswell it is
> 
> haswell
> 
> not even once
> 
> No, i'm serious though. If you're set to adaptive voltage i'd be surprised at anything but 100c.. Prime and linpack? They light up high end air, we're talking like 70 degrees at 1.1v. They don't run too well on the stock cooler.
> 
> It doesn't matter, though, because nobody runs prime28.1 and linpack all day, and the temperatures are, compared to other CPU architectures, disproportionally high under certain types of loads
> Default settings are not the same, Especially with adaptive voltage. If you want to tell me that two samples are different, manual the same profile onto both of them with for example 1.1vcore fixed profile with the same vrin etc, then list temperature differences with cpu-z 1.64.0 or multimeter vcore readout - that's the only way.
> 
> There's two orders of magnitude more people thinking that they have special snowflake broken CPU's then there are actually mis-applied TIM under the IHS - auto settings are just completely worthless, and so is prime28.1/linpack, especially considering that you can change the temperatures in prime by 25 degrees celcius by toggling avx support or installing service pack 1 of windows 7
> 
> Intel's stock cooler is designed to keep the CPU cool under typical loads. If you're benching linpack at 200gflops, it's not typical load. The IVR going wild with adaptive voltage just blows that out of proportion even further - Haswell 101 is fixed voltage for stress or go home because of that


That's why I said I hope that delidding will fix it. I'm sure as hell going to stay anxious about it until I delid it and see it fixed though.
It's not on adaptive anymore and it's set to the lowest possible VCore and still getting 95C in Linx and 85C in Prime95.
I'd gladly compare it to my previous CPU, but after my little accident with the hammer it's barely a paperweight now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> I feel as if your mount is incorrectly done, or the paste isn't applied properly or the clu isn't enough or there's too much of it.
> 100c is ridiculously high. Even a stock Intel cooler can do better


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually, Intel specifies that their stock cooler can keep the CPU within reasonable temperatures under stock circumstances regardless of usage. This means that on stock, the stock cooler will cool the CPU under the throttle temperature even with Linpack.
> 
> I'm going to guess that the mounting is bad, either on the die or the IHS.


It is the stock Intel cooler, running at stock speed with default settings.
I reseated the HSF about 7 times on this CPU, and only had 1 bad mount. It's not easy to mess up the stock cooler's installation as it's simply push-in. And this same HSF worked fine on my previous 4770K sample as well as my 2500K for several MONTHS before putting that under water.
This 4770K I have is simply bad temperature wise. Hopefully delidding will fix it.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

So stock cooler on stock hitting 100c?
Something isn't right dude. Have you got thermal paste applied correctly?
I agree the mount is almost impossible to get wrong, it needs to click 4x and you're done


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Many of you guys able to get Haswell to 5 GHz once de-lidded?


the front page has a listing of the members cpu's and theor OC's with them. I believe there are a few as well.


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> That's why I said I hope that delidding will fix it. I'm sure as hell going to stay anxious about it until I delid it and see it fixed though.
> It's not on adaptive anymore and it's set to the lowest possible VCore and still getting 95C in Linx and 85C in Prime95.
> I'd gladly compare it to my previous CPU, but after my little accident with the hammer it's barely a paperweight now.
> 
> It is the stock Intel cooler, running at stock speed with default settings.
> I reseated the HSF about 7 times on this CPU, and only had 1 bad mount. It's not easy to mess up the stock cooler's installation as it's simply push-in. And this same HSF worked fine on my previous 4770K sample as well as my 2500K for several MONTHS before putting that under water.
> This 4770K I have is simply bad temperature wise. Hopefully delidding will fix it.


You should RMA it before delidding, if you delid and it doesn't help that much than you are screwed. Prior to delliding and watercooling, my 3770k (Iknow haswell is hotter) didn't break 70 degrees at stock voltage stock clocks and stock fan under intel burn test, prime 95 or anything I could throw at it. 100 degrees at stock is never normal. oh and I'm sure it probably is but make sure the fan is actually working


----------



## MengNa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chann3l*
> 
> You should RMA it before delidding, if you delid and it doesn't help that much than you are screwed. Prior to delliding and watercooling, my 3770k (Iknow haswell is hotter) didn't break 70 degrees at stock voltage stock clocks and stock fan under intel burn test, prime 95 or anything I could throw at it. 100 degrees at stock is never normal. oh and I'm sure it probably is but make sure the fan is actually working


I tried returning it to the store. They just returned it back to me 4 days later saying that they didn't see temps higher than 82 in the lab.
I can try again, but my past experiences with this specific store chain tells me it won't help much. I might try sending it directly to Intel, but I'm not sure if it's even possible in my country...
I knew I shouldn't buy it from that store, but my store of choice was out of stock and I couldn't remain without a CPU...


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> I tried returning it to the store. They just returned it back to me 4 days later saying that they didn't see temps higher than 82 in the lab.
> I can try again, but my past experiences with this specific store chain tells me it won't help much. I might try sending it directly to Intel, but I'm not sure if it's even possible in my country...
> I knew I shouldn't buy it from that store, but my store of choice was out of stock and I couldn't remain without a CPU...


sucks to be you, that store is terrible


----------



## chann3l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MengNa*
> 
> I tried returning it to the store. They just returned it back to me 4 days later saying that they didn't see temps higher than 82 in the lab.
> I can try again, but my past experiences with this specific store chain tells me it won't help much. I might try sending it directly to Intel, but I'm not sure if it's even possible in my country...
> I knew I shouldn't buy it from that store, but my store of choice was out of stock and I couldn't remain without a CPU...


I know its a pain but if you can try taking a video of your temps under load and showing them. If you feel you have exhausted all rma options than delid, order some liquid ultra from coollaboratory and lap the heatspreader. Most likely either the heatspreader isn't flat or there is poor contact with the die. If your lucky you'll have a perfect chip when your done


----------



## InCoGnIt0

If you delid your CPU you can still send it back to Intel, but once you lap the IHS you can not send it back to Intel just FYI.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> If you delid your CPU you can still send it back to Intel, but once you lap the IHS you can not send it back to Intel just FYI.


^

What he said







not like I put that info in the front page or anything


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> If you delid your CPU you can still send it back to Intel, but once you lap the IHS you can not send it back to Intel just FYI.
> 
> 
> 
> ^
> 
> What he said
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not like I put that info in the front page or anything
Click to expand...

More and more people read the OP less.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> More and more people read the OP less.


its because the OP for here is long but for good reason honestly lots of stuff to consider in this decision.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> More and more people read the OP less.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its because the OP for here is long but for good reason honestly lots of stuff to consider in this decision.
Click to expand...

People PM me for my Ivy Bridge OC guide questions clearly answered in the OP. I had someone PM me about what settings for Prime95 and which ones I use and it's on the OP. It even has it's own header so you don't miss it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> People PM me for my Ivy Bridge OC guide questions clearly answered in the OP. I had someone PM me about what settings for Prime95 and which ones I use and it's on the OP. It even has it's own header so you don't miss it.


exactly


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> People PM me for my Ivy Bridge OC guide questions clearly answered in the OP. I had someone PM me about what settings for Prime95 and which ones I use and it's on the OP. It even has it's own header so you don't miss it.
> 
> 
> 
> exactly
Click to expand...

Did you watch Dreamhack? TaeJa won SC2 and FNatic won CSGO. I was rooting for NiP but whatever!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Did you watch Dreamhack? TaeJa won SC2 and FNatic won CSGO. I was rooting for NiP but whatever!


no sadly the turkey got in my way! along with pies..... way to many pies.... omg never again

even got up at a good time yesterday and scored a great sound card and got it half off and then found my older one as well!


----------



## ozzy1925

i was thinking of setting a new loop (ekblock with naked ivy).It would take 3-4 months to be ready.I had clu on the die with stock cooler and i tought it will be hard to remove clu after 3-4 months so i ddidnt want to risk it and installed gelid extreme on the die now my temps are 11-12 higher is that normal?


----------



## Valgaur

Yes the temps should be higher but not that much higher. Might need to reseat it.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yes the temps should be higher but not that much higher. Might need to reseat it.


i think i have applied too much gelid on the die and i also applied gelid at the back of ihs.But when i cleaned the clu on the die i see hazing on the corners and some minor scratches. Could it be because of that?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i was thinking of setting a new loop (ekblock with naked ivy).It would take 3-4 months to be ready.I had clu on the die with stock cooler and i tought it will be hard to remove clu after 3-4 months so i ddidnt want to risk it and installed gelid extreme on the die now my temps are 11-12 higher is that normal?


The gelid (the stuff supplied by EK) was only 1-3C higher in my experience, and I had to reseat several times with the CLU to get the lower temperatures. I run naked with an EK block.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> The gelid (the stuff supplied by EK) was only 1-3C higher in my experience, and I had to reseat several times with the CLU to get the lower temperatures. I run naked with an EK block.


i used this method:

should i spread the gelid on the die?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> The gelid (the stuff supplied by EK) was only 1-3C higher in my experience, and I had to reseat several times with the CLU to get the lower temperatures. I run naked with an EK block.
> 
> 
> 
> i used this method:
> 
> should i spread the gelid on the die?
Click to expand...

I did not spread, and that looks about double what I used.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I did not spread, and that looks about double what I used.


did you use about 1 rice just on the center?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I did not spread, and that looks about double what I used.
> 
> 
> 
> did you use about 1 rice just on the center?
Click to expand...

yeah, one in the center.

edit: next time I wash my loop I am going back to the gelid. the bottom of my waterblock looks like hell now that I have used the CLU. CLU is great stuff, dont get me wrong, but I think it has more of a justified use between the die and IHS then die and heatsink. There are others here that will tell you different, this is just my experience.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i used this method:
> 
> should i spread the gelid on the die?


that's a ridiculous amount of TIM you got there.
You need half, if not 1/3rd of what you put on there.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> yeah, one in the center.
> 
> edit: next time I wash my loop I am going back to the gelid. the bottom of my waterblock looks like hell now that I have used the CLU. CLU is great stuff, dont get me wrong, but I think it has more of a justified use between the die and IHS then die and heatsink. There are others here that will tell you different, this is just my experience.


can you check if you have these kind of hazing on the corners of the die?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> that's a ridiculous amount of TIM you got there.
> You need half, if not 1/3rd of what you put on there.


ok i think i need re apply that because i have also added some more at the back of the ihs


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> can you check if you have these kind of hazing on the corners of the die?
> 
> ok i think i need re apply that because i have also added some more at the back of the ihs


why are you applying that and not CLU?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> yeah, one in the center.
> 
> edit: next time I wash my loop I am going back to the gelid. the bottom of my waterblock looks like hell now that I have used the CLU. CLU is great stuff, dont get me wrong, but I think it has more of a justified use between the die and IHS then die and heatsink. There are others here that will tell you different, this is just my experience.
> 
> 
> 
> can you check if you have these kind of hazing on the corners of the die?
> 
> 
> Next time I pull the loop apart, sure I will. But I have a solid mount right now and I dont want to have to go through the shuffle to get it all taken apart and put back together.
Click to expand...


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Totally Dubbed*
> 
> why are you applying that and not CLU?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/23100_100#post_21297632
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> can you check if you have these kind of hazing on the corners of the die?
> 
> 
> Next time I pull the loop apart, sure I will. But I have a solid mount right now and I dont want to have to go through the shuffle to get it all taken apart and put back together.


ok np


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/23100_100#post_21297632
> ok np


got it and agreed with your decision!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i used this method:
> 
> should i spread the gelid on the die?


Normally half a grain of rice is the best. You have mucho tim squire


----------



## Vodkacooling

I purchased a Vice from home depot (hopefully I can return it after). Ordered CLU and some NTH1 thermal paste. Should all get here around wednesday. Got a block of wood and a regular hammer. Ill try the hair dryer method first. Saw the hair dryer method on youtube, im not sure if its fake or not.


----------



## HarriDoesGaming

Hey guys,

I was thinking of Delidding my i7 3770k and I have all the necessary tools im going to do the razar method but I may end up buying a vice. One question I want to know 100% before I do this is once I do the procedure which thermal paste should I use to put in the DIE (CPU) some say they have used NT-H1 or CLU. From my understanding its best to use a thin layer on CLU on the DIE then use NT-H1 paste on the IHS ?? I also have Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond Thermal Paste has anyone had any good results with that ??

EDIT: Forgot to ask as well, once you remove the glue that holds the IHS on the PCB wont the CPU sit lower once its back in your motherboard ?? Would you need to modify your CPU cooler to sit lower somehow or is the difference really nothing to be concerned about ?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HarriDoesGaming*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I was thinking of Delidding my i7 3770k and I have all the necessary tools im going to do the razar method but I may end up buying a vice. One question I want to know 100% before I do this is once I do the procedure which thermal paste should I use to put in the DIE (CPU) some say they have used NT-H1 or CLU. From my understanding its best to use a thin layer on CLU on the DIE then use NT-H1 paste on the IHS ?? I also have Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond Thermal Paste has anyone had any good results with that ??
> 
> EDIT: Forgot to ask as well, once you remove the glue that holds the IHS on the PCB wont the CPU sit lower once its back in your motherboard ?? Would you need to modify your CPU cooler to sit lower somehow or is the difference really nothing to be concerned about ?


1) As much as possible, use CLU/CLP on the die and you can use whatever paste you want on the IHS. If you do not have CLU/CLP, then use whatever paste you have on the die.

2) You do not need to modify anything, the only modification in this entire mod is the delidding of the CPU's IHS. Nothing else. Once you remove the glue, the IHS will sit more flush with the die but it will still not touch it completely and therefore you need the thermal paste on it.


----------



## Zhood

So I want to delid my 3570k, just have a few questions.

1: Can someone post a link to a good solution to put on the die once I have the IHS off?

2: So once you actually take the physical IHS off, you don't put it back on? Am I missing something?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zhood*
> 
> So I want to delid my 3570k, just have a few questions.
> 
> 1: Can someone post a link to a good solution to put on the die once I have the IHS off?
> 
> 2: So once you actually take the physical IHS off, you don't put it back on? Am I missing something?


you use a better TIM under the IHS Normally CLU for the temp drops that you want. then put the IHS back on without glue and put the bad boy back into the socket all ready to stay cooler!

CLU = Coollaboratory Ultra


----------



## HarriDoesGaming

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 1) As much as possible, use CLU/CLP on the die and you can use whatever paste you want on the IHS. If you do not have CLU/CLP, then use whatever paste you have on the die.
> 
> 2) You do not need to modify anything, the only modification in this entire mod is the delidding of the CPU's IHS. Nothing else. Once you remove the glue, the IHS will sit more flush with the die but it will still not touch it completely and therefore you need the thermal paste on it.


Thanks Mate!! Also another thing I have the Artec Clean 2 step kit is that ok to use on the DIE and PCB to clean off all the glue and thermal paste rubbish used by intel ??


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HarriDoesGaming*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> 1) As much as possible, use CLU/CLP on the die and you can use whatever paste you want on the IHS. If you do not have CLU/CLP, then use whatever paste you have on the die.
> 
> 2) You do not need to modify anything, the only modification in this entire mod is the delidding of the CPU's IHS. Nothing else. Once you remove the glue, the IHS will sit more flush with the die but it will still not touch it completely and therefore you need the thermal paste on it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks Mate!! Also another thing I have the Artec Clean 2 step kit is that ok to use on the DIE and PCB to clean off all the glue and thermal paste rubbish used by intel ??
Click to expand...

Well, the thermal paste they use isn't actually bad, it probably rivals AS5 and NT-H1. But to your question, yes it is fine to use it. After all, that clean stuff is basically only purified water + isopropyl alcohol.







Remove the glue, put some thermal paste, put it in the socket, put the IHS back on, and clamp it down. The clamp will do all work, just make sure it doesn't move the IHS too much because it will press down and forward so it'll shift the IHS. Hold down the IHS while you clamp it down to prevent the shifting!


----------



## bpmcleod

Just thought I would throw my two cents out. I used the vice method and it worked well but left some god awful teeth marks that had to be sanded out and forced me to lap the cpu. I then decided on a different method. I took three blocks of wood (cut off peices from 2x6s) and used them. I put the cpu between two blocks bracing one against a padded wall (to prevent damage to the wall) and put pressure on the second block squeezing the cpu between them. The third block went up against the cpu and was able to hold it down with the same hand putting pressure on the second block. Took a hammer and hit the top block with a little force and voila. Same delid as the vice method without the teeth marks. You can also takesome thing cloth and cover the blocks and cpu if wanted but wasn't neccesary for me. I'm going to be using this method again on my 4770k once my CLU arrives.


----------



## Gilly225

You noted you were using the same cooler as before..Some of the thermal paste may have been removed after removing the heat sink multiple times, which would explain the high temperatures.


----------



## ozzy1925

today i cleaned gelid and i see these minor scratches



i re-applied gelid on the die :

and this is the amount on the cpu

and temperatures are still same


----------



## Valgaur

y u no use clu on die!


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> y u no use clu on die!


because i wil use ek naked kit in 3-4 months and as i heard clu gets dry and removing from the die will be hard or not?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> because i wil use ek naked kit in 3-4 months and as i heard clu gets dry and removing from the die will be hard or not?


it's very easy to remove from the die it's the block that people care about even though you never see the bottom of them... irritates me honestly.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it's very easy to remove from the die it's the block that people care about even though you never see the bottom of them... irritates me honestly.


ok then i will apply clu again


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it's very easy to remove from the die it's the block that people care about even though you never see the bottom of them... irritates me honestly.


`

Here is my block after direct die and CLU along with the CPU. The CLU had hardened on to the block and required sanding to get it all removed, plus there is a permanent silver stain on the block. But the die was perfectly fine, cleaned up with alcohol quickly.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## ozzy1925

i re applied clu


temps only 2-3 higher than before
1 lesson learned.Never ever remove clu again!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i re applied clu
> 
> 
> temps only 2-3 higher than before
> 1 lesson learned.Never ever remove clu again!


Is that some CLU on the capacitors?


----------



## deepor

I think that might be reflections in clear nail polish that's covering the capacitors.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I think that might be reflections in clear nail polish that's covering the capacitors.


Maybe.







Hope so, it'll be bad if it isn't.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I think that might be reflections in clear nail polish that's covering the capacitors.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Maybe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope so, it'll be bad if it isn't.


yea thats the reflection of the nail polish if not i couldnt even post ths


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> i re applied clu
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> temps only 2-3 higher than before
> 1 lesson learned.Never ever remove clu again!


Since I have only applied CLU once, I'm no expert. But it kinda looks like you have quite a lot of CLU on the IHS?
What I did (and many others) is to make the thin layer on the die and then just use the left over on the prush under the IHS, no need to squeeze out more from the syringe.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Since I have only applied CLU once, I'm no expert. But it kinda looks like you have quite a lot of CLU on the IHS?
> What I did (and many others) is to make the thin layer on the die and then just use the left over on the prush under the IHS, no need to squeeze out more from the syringe.


thanks for the warning but i prefer it to stay like this till i buy naked evy kit


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Since I have only applied CLU once, I'm no expert. But it kinda looks like you have quite a lot of CLU on the IHS?
> What I did (and many others) is to make the thin layer on the die and then just use the left over on the prush under the IHS, no need to squeeze out more from the syringe.


I did inbetween what he did and what you are saying.

I did a thin layer on the actual die and used the left overs / another tiny tiny drop on the underside of the ihs and my temps are fantastic under water now.

75c max @ 1.45 vcore @ 4.8ghz is pretty amazing for these chips.


----------



## Willi

count me in


Finally delidded my 3570K, used Coollaboratory Liquid Pro (also took my time to use it on the GPU)
I don't have a consistent temp difference on full so far, but I noticed my temps are 4~8C lower on idle, which is awesome.

Also, Liquid pro is a bit of a pain to apply, gotta be REALLY carefull with that thing...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Willi*
> 
> count me in
> 
> 
> Finally delidded my 3570K, used Coollaboratory Liquid Pro (also took my time to use it on the GPU)
> I don't have a consistent temp difference on full so far, but I noticed my temps are 4~8C lower on idle, which is awesome.
> 
> Also, Liquid pro is a bit of a pain to apply, gotta be REALLY carefull with that thing...


wait until you see full load temps blows your mind!







Fill out the info from the front page and I'll throw ya in!


----------



## Gil80

guys, can you recommend on other ways to delid?

I can't afford vice. It's very expensive here. The cheapest one costs over $50 and I only need it for like 5 minutes and that's it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> guys, can you recommend on other ways to delid?
> 
> I can't afford vice. It's very expensive here. The cheapest one costs over $50 and I only need it for like 5 minutes and that's it.


buy it... then return it....







or use razor or do 2 pieces of hard woods. Oak would work well


----------



## Nooblit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> guys, can you recommend on other ways to delid?
> 
> I can't afford vice. It's very expensive here. The cheapest one costs over $50 and I only need it for like 5 minutes and that's it.


In all honesty, as someone who JUST delidded, there's nothing bad about using a straight razor for delidding aside from having your hand ache in the one spot that was constantly put pressure on when getting the blade in. I'd recommend it. All it takes is patience.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> guys, can you recommend on other ways to delid?
> 
> I can't afford vice. It's very expensive here. The cheapest one costs over $50 and I only need it for like 5 minutes and that's it.
> 
> 
> 
> buy it... then return it....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or use razor or do 2 pieces of hard woods. Oak would work well
Click to expand...

This is pretty much the best idea. Buy it then return it.

If you don't want to do razor, then the next best option would be the wall/wood method.

Get a 2 identical blocks of wood. Make sure to use a level surface, and place the table on the wall. Line 1 block on the wall and put the CPU (IHS face down) between the block of wood next to the wall and the other block of wood. Get any other solid wood and smack that CPU a few love tops.







Basically, you make a make-shift vice with 2 blocks of wood and a wall.


----------



## Gil80

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> In all honesty, as someone who JUST delidded, there's nothing bad about using a straight razor for delidding aside from having your hand ache in the one spot that was constantly put pressure on when getting the blade in. I'd recommend it. All it takes is patience.


I already tried last month and I killed two RAM channels. I got a new CPU now and I don't think I'll go that path again...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This is pretty much the best idea. Buy it then return it.
> 
> If you don't want to do razor, then the next best option would be the wall/wood method.
> 
> Get a 2 identical blocks of wood. Make sure to use a level surface, and place the table on the wall. Line 1 block on the wall and put the CPU (IHS face down) between the block of wood next to the wall and the other block of wood. Get any other solid wood and smack that CPU a few love tops.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically, you make a make-shift vice with 2 blocks of wood and a wall.


Buy and return sounds like an idea









Thanks.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> In all honesty, as someone who JUST delidded, there's nothing bad about using a straight razor for delidding aside from having your hand ache in the one spot that was constantly put pressure on when getting the blade in. I'd recommend it. All it takes is patience.
> 
> 
> 
> I already tried last month and I killed two RAM channels. I got a new CPU now and I don't think I'll go that path again...
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> This is pretty much the best idea. Buy it then return it.
> 
> If you don't want to do razor, then the next best option would be the wall/wood method.
> 
> Get a 2 identical blocks of wood. Make sure to use a level surface, and place the table on the wall. Line 1 block on the wall and put the CPU (IHS face down) between the block of wood next to the wall and the other block of wood. Get any other solid wood and smack that CPU a few love tops.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically, you make a make-shift vice with 2 blocks of wood and a wall.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Buy and return sounds like an idea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks.
Click to expand...

Should thank Valgaur for this one because he beat me to it to recommending it to you.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

OK guys i seriously need help cause i am over it completely.
I am running A delidded i7 3770K With EK NAKED IVY KIT!
WIth Gelid GC extreme and Custom water CPU only ATM i am reaching temps of 90C @ 1.24V.

Someone want to chime in and help me out here?
Gelid GC extreme was almost impossible to spread.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> OK guys i seriously need help cause i am over it completely.
> I am running A delidded i7 3770K With EK NAKED IVY KIT!
> WIth Gelid GC extreme and Custom water CPU only ATM i am reaching temps of 90C @ 1.24V.
> 
> Someone want to chime in and help me out here?
> Gelid GC extreme was almost impossible to spread.


pump speed and rad size?? need to know that then fans as well ambient temps in your room and why aren't you using CLU/P!









Also @swag Darn right i beat you! Mah club foo!


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> pump speed and rad size?? need to know that then fans as well ambient temps in your room and why aren't you using CLU/P!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also @swag Darn right i beat you! Mah club foo!


Nah its not the water cooling loop i dont think!
Pump is XSPC Bay and Res D5 Vario. 1x240rad 2x120rad.
I think its just my application but i redid it a few times.

EDIT: May add the Pump is on level 2/5 Increase it too 5 only nets me a 2c change. So no point.


----------



## Nooblit

Well i'm officially stable at 4.6ghz. Might boost it when i have time to sit around for stress tests again, i feel like i could get 4.8 out of this no problem at these temps.

Add me!

OCN name:*Nooblit*
CPU:*3770k*
on die-TIM:*Liquid Ultra*
ihs-TIM:*Liquid Ultra*
Mhz gained:*100mhz (so far)*
OC after delid:*4.6 ghz http://valid.canardpc.com/jk566u*
Temp drops:*idle = 10c, load = 40c!*


----------



## Willi

OCN name: *Willi*
CPU: *3570K*
on die-TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Pro*
ihs-TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Pro*
Mhz gained: *- (didn't increase OC)*
OC after delid: *4.6Ghz*
Temp drops: *21C*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/97itjr

Really... I didn't believe when I saw a 21C drop on full load... I hope intel keeps avoiding fluxless solder, I can only imagine what a direct-die contact cooling can do... (a metal square so the processor can be placed in the socket without damage by the pressure plate and the waterblock/LN2 pot/whatever sits in direct contact with the die, with only the TIM between them).
Also, I think I should try lowering the voltage sometime...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Nah its not the water cooling loop i dont think!
> Pump is XSPC Bay and Res D5 Vario. 1x240rad 2x120rad.
> I think its just my application but i redid it a few times.
> 
> EDIT: May add the Pump is on level 2/5 Increase it too 5 only nets me a 2c change. So no point.


hmmmmmmmm your probably gonna need to reseat your loop on the cpu again... what vcore you running?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nooblit*
> 
> Well i'm officially stable at 4.6ghz. Might boost it when i have time to sit around for stress tests again, i feel like i could get 4.8 out of this no problem at these temps.
> 
> Add me!
> 
> OCN name:*Nooblit*
> CPU:*3770k*
> on die-TIM:*Liquid Ultra*
> ihs-TIM:*Liquid Ultra*
> Mhz gained:*100mhz (so far)*
> OC after delid:*4.6 ghz http://valid.canardpc.com/jk566u*
> Temp drops:*idle = 10c, load = 40c!*


You're in!







Slappa dat Sig on!







40C! Holy temp drop batman!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Willi*
> 
> OCN name: *Willi*
> CPU: *3570K*
> on die-TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Pro*
> ihs-TIM: *Coollaboratory Liquid Pro*
> Mhz gained: *- (didn't increase OC)*
> OC after delid: *4.6Ghz*
> Temp drops: *21C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/97itjr
> 
> Really... I didn't believe when I saw a 21C drop on full load... I hope intel keeps avoiding fluxless solder, I can only imagine what a direct-die contact cooling can do... (a metal square so the processor can be placed in the socket without damage by the pressure plate and the waterblock/LN2 pot/whatever sits in direct contact with the die, with only the TIM between them).
> Also, I think I should try lowering the voltage sometime...


You're in!







Slappa dat Sig on!







With LN2 on direct die the die breaks even delidded the die has issues as it cools to quickly. me and FtW420 can reassure you on this


----------



## Nooblit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa dat Sig on!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 40C! Holy temp drop batman!!!quote]
> 
> Seriously! When i tried pushing it to 4.5 before the delid i was 2-3c right below tjmax. That's just no good. Sig added!


----------



## tzvia

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> OK guys i seriously need help cause i am over it completely.
> I am running A delidded i7 3770K With EK NAKED IVY KIT!
> WIth Gelid GC extreme and Custom water CPU only ATM i am reaching temps of 90C @ 1.24V.
> 
> Someone want to chime in and help me out here?
> Gelid GC extreme was almost impossible to spread.


While I haven't used Gelid GC extreme, what i have read about it indicates it is not one of the liquid metal TIMS. So I would start by removing your block (as it sounds to not be mounted properly anyway), cleaning the TIM off and using something like Liquid Ultra. Regular TIMS can pumpout. That is, the heating/cooling cycling from the ON/OFF cycles can cause the compound to expand, migrate out. I had used AS5 while waiting for Liquid Ultra order, and the temps did slowly rise over the week I waited. In your case it really sounds like a very bad mount however. Make sure you had cleaned off that black goop from the PCB, (don't know if you did) as the thickness of that stuff may be enough to keep the block from resting in contact with the DIE. Beyond that, we are talking basic physics. Good contact of block on die for heat transfer to the block. Water and no air bubbles in block/tubes/rad/pump. Nothing clogging the rad (properly flushed before use). Water actually flowing through loop- OUT of res to IN on pump, and water flow direction through block is correct. No kinks in lines restricting water flow. Block opened up and cleaned before first use or re-use. Radiator fins clean, no mat of fido's hair under the fans.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> OK guys i seriously need help cause i am over it completely.
> I am running A delidded i7 3770K With EK NAKED IVY KIT!
> WIth Gelid GC extreme and Custom water CPU only ATM i am reaching temps of 90C @ 1.24V.
> 
> Someone want to chime in and help me out here?
> Gelid GC extreme was almost impossible to spread.


I have the NZXT bay res and to check flow I shake my whole side to side case and see how fast the micro air bubbles go round BTW I am not joking.
If that is ok it could be a partially blocked water block the temps should vary immensely across cores i.e. 10+ degrees
I would assume your rads are clear of debris and have good flow of air but that should result in low temp then gradually climbing as the loop accumulates heat.
Otherwise it is a bad mount you could try a vanilla TIM AS5 for ease of use


----------



## Jetskyer

Hi guys,
I'm in the process of making my very own waterblock (for direct-die) and I was wondering what the dimensions are of the IHS;
Most importantly the width and height of the IHS (the 'raised' part that has the intel lettering on it and has to protrude through the retention bracket) also the radius of the corners would be interesting to know.
Also I'm wondering how much lower the chips lies with the IHS removed (so basically the thickness of the IHS)

Thanks!


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Nah its not the water cooling loop i dont think!
> Pump is XSPC Bay and Res D5 Vario. 1x240rad 2x120rad.
> I think its just my application but i redid it a few times.
> 
> EDIT: May add the Pump is on level 2/5 Increase it too 5 only nets me a 2c change. So no point.


2C is a difference!

You think we are in here to see what is reasonable? HELL NO!

TO THE MAX BABY!


----------



## kevosuki

Hey OCN. I just delidded my 4770k with a vice. I noticed that i warped the pcb a little (whoops). Do you think it's dead?


----------



## Cyro999

Hm doesn't look like fatal damage to me


----------



## RickRockerr

I think it's alive but you never know before you test it


----------



## kevosuki

haha thanks thanks. I'm waiting for CLU to show up in the mail so I won't find out till later


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> I already tried last month and I killed two RAM channels. I got a new CPU now and I don't think I'll go that path again...
> Buy and return sounds like an idea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks.


Heh that is what I did with my first 3570k, killed two ram channels.

I bought my i7 already delid, and got my new 3570k delid for $25


----------



## NightHawk06

Hey guys I plan on delid my i5 4670k cpu and wanted to know if this would fit my New CPU??
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=37453

Is this a good thermal paste to use for the die? http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=27832


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> Hey guys I plan on delid my i5 4670k cpu and wanted to know if this would fit my New CPU??
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=37453
> 
> Is this a good thermal paste to use for the die? http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=27832


I can't see why naked ivy set wouldn't work with Haswell and CLU is good paste for die but it have to be changed time by time because it gets hard.

E: Yep it works
"EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy is an add-on
that allows the use of delided 3rd- (Ivy Bridge) and 4th (Haswell)
generation Intel® Core i3/i5/i7 processors with EK-Supremacy series CPU water blocks."

Directly from EK.


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I can't see why naked ivy set wouldn't work with Haswell and CLU is good paste for die but it have to be changed time by time because it gets hard.
> 
> E: Yep it works
> "EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy is an add-on
> that allows the use of delided 3rd- (Ivy Bridge) and 4th (Haswell)
> generation Intel® Core i3/i5/i7 processors with EK-Supremacy series CPU water blocks."
> 
> Directly from EK.


what gets hard the thermal paste?? Thanks for the info on the naked ivy







I seen it only works with EK water blocks but then again I found this
link on here that someone used a XSPC Water block and it Fits without a problem!! I just order both parts cant wait to delid


----------



## kevosuki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevosuki*
> 
> Hey OCN. I just delidded my 4770k with a vice. I noticed that i warped the pcb a little (whoops). Do you think it's dead?


Checking back in incase anyone cares: it's alive! Max temps in x264 = 63 - 64 - 63 - 55C so down around 15C each core.
4770k 4.6GHz @ 1.25V


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevosuki*
> 
> Checking back in incase anyone cares: it's alive! Max temps in x264 = 63 - 64 - 63 - 55C so down around 15C each core.
> 4770k 4.6GHz @ 1.25V


very nicely done! what cooler??


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I can't see why naked ivy set wouldn't work with Haswell and *CLU is good paste for die but it have to be changed time by time because it gets hard.*
> 
> E: Yep it works
> "EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy is an add-on
> that allows the use of delided 3rd- (Ivy Bridge) and 4th (Haswell)
> generation Intel® Core i3/i5/i7 processors with EK-Supremacy series CPU water blocks."
> 
> Directly from EK.


not really.... CLU will be fine for 6 months area and one SHOULD do a tear down every 6 months for computer love and care cleaning yada yada.


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not really.... CLU will be fine for 6 months area and one SHOULD do a tear down every 6 months for computer love and care cleaning yada yada.


so that Thermal paste I got... gotta clean it every 6 months or so? I'm new to this thermal paste so have no idea lol


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevosuki*
> 
> Checking back in incase anyone cares: it's alive! Max temps in x264 = 63 - 64 - 63 - 55C so down around 15C each core.
> 4770k 4.6GHz @ 1.25V


GJ! Also interested in cooling. If you want my help pushing it a bit, throw me a pm. I'd happily take ~70-75c average on hottest core encoding, you might even be able to shoot for 5ghz with ht off depending on the scaling*. I've got two profiles, one with ht one without, 200mhz (0.11v) apart with similar temps

*That's actually probably a bit aggressive, especially if you mean 1.25 vid (bios vcore - IVR targets 20mv or 0.02v higher) but should be able to do good


----------



## twitchyzero

some newb questions

is on-die TIM something you leave on and never have to deal with again?

Does on-die TIM and IHS TIM both using Coolab Ultra generally yield best results? Yes I know results are posted page 1...but I'm just curious why most aren't using coolab on IHS as well

How much does 1 tube usually last you? 3 applications?

Where do you guys buy the Coolab? I dont see newegg carrying any...only amazon and frozsencpu


----------



## kevosuki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> GJ! Also interested in cooling. If you want my help pushing it a bit, throw me a pm. I'd happily take ~70-75c average on hottest core encoding, you might even be able to shoot for 5ghz with ht off depending on the scaling*. I've got two profiles, one with ht one without, 200mhz (0.11v) apart with similar temps
> 
> *That's actually probably a bit aggressive, especially if you mean 1.25 vid (bios vcore - IVR targets 20mv or 0.02v higher) but should be able to do good


Haha i've been stalking the haswell overclocking thread quite a bit so i know what i'm doing







. I am running a 360mm rad raystorm block. Hmm yeah i might try to shoot for 5ghz just for fun with HT off. Hopefully my chip doesn't wall on me >.<

I put 1.25 override on my z87 g45 while i was running stress tests. CPUz confirmed 1.25.


----------



## Cyro999

Then it's probably wrong version of cpu-z (you need 1.64.0 or something like hwinfo)

Gl!


----------



## kevosuki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Then it's probably wrong version of cpu-z (you need 1.64.0 or something like hwinfo)
> 
> Gl!


ah ha you're right sir. hwinfo64 reports 1.28 under load. i'll PM you my settings for fun and see what you can do with it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> so that Thermal paste I got... gotta clean it every 6 months or so? I'm new to this thermal paste so have no idea lol


I clean my whole rig every 6 months for 4 hours doing entire rig sweep. and I reapply cpu TIM's I keep CLP on my cpu year round but change it every 6 months, better safe then sorry








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *twitchyzero*
> 
> some newb questions
> 
> is on-die TIM something you leave on and never have to deal with again?
> 
> Does on-die TIM and IHS TIM both using Coolab Ultra generally yield best results? Yes I know results are posted page 1...but I'm just curious why most aren't using coolab on IHS as well
> 
> How much does 1 tube usually last you? 3 applications?
> 
> Where do you guys buy the Coolab? I dont see newegg carrying any...only amazon and frozsencpu


I leave my die to IHS TIM on for again 6 months you should redo it every 6 months.

Coollab has to touch copper or nickle plated cooper it can't touch aluminum or else it will erode it. honestly Die-CLU/P-IHS- any TIM-heatsink is more than enough unless you want to put CLU/P for best results go right ahead but it'll be a few C lower is all.

you buy it from Frozen CPU.com right here

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html

my tube which has lasted 15 applications (you need very little honestly) has about 1/4th left in the tube


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I clean my whole rig every 6 months for 4 hours doing entire rig sweep. and I reapply cpu TIM's I keep CLP on my cpu year round but change it every 6 months, better safe then sorry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I leave my die to IHS TIM on for again 6 months you should redo it every 6 months.
> 
> Coollab has to touch copper or nickle plated cooper it can't touch aluminum or else it will erode it. honestly Die-CLU/P-IHS- any TIM-heatsink is more than enough unless you want to put CLU/P for best results go right ahead but it'll be a few C lower is all.
> 
> you buy it from Frozen CPU.com right here
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html
> 
> my tube which has lasted 15 applications (you need very little honestly) has about 1/4th left in the tube


Thanks for the info I will do exactly that every 6 months... is that Thermal paste any good or the one you listed here? gonna use this
on CPU Die when I delid

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/10740/thr-77/Coollaboratory_Liquid_Ultra_100_Metal_Thermal_Interface_Material.html


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> not really.... CLU will be fine for 6 months area and one SHOULD do a tear down every 6 months for computer love and care cleaning yada yada.


With time by time I meant 4-8Months


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> Thanks for the info I will do exactly that every 6 months... is that Thermal paste any good or the one you listed here? gonna use this
> on CPU Die when I delid
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/3784/thr-26/Coollaboratory_Liquid_PRO_Thermal_Interface_Material.html
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/10740/thr-77/Coollaboratory_Liquid_Ultra_100_Metal_Thermal_Interface_Material.html


use Pro as thats what i do
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> With time by time I meant 4-8Months


Ah gotcha!


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> use Pro as thats what i do
> Ah gotcha!


is that better then the other thermal paste?? I already order those Ultra thermal paste I can turn around order that other if its any better?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> is that better then the other thermal paste?? I already order those Ultra thermal paste I can turn around order that other if its any better?


nah its pretty much the same stuff


----------



## stickg1

Hey Val, how you been? What type of hardware you running these days?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Hey Val, how you been? What type of hardware you running these days?


uuuuuh dual 580s 750 watter psu 4770K (going under LN2 soon







) m6e mobo soundblasterZ sound card..... maybe i should update my rig...


----------



## Imprezzion

Guys guys guys









I bought a used 3770K which has been pre-delidded by the previous owner.
I bought that specific CPU cause it's one hell of a clocker in terms of Mhz / volts.

Now, I got a question or two.

The dude didn't glue the IHS back on but just clamped it on using the CPU socket so the Liquid Pro that's on it will not be usable after he pulls it from his rig.

I have a Swiftech H320 cooler and I was seriously considering direct die cooling as the mount for the H320 should be able to do this without modding. All I need to do is remove the CPU retention bracket.

But, is direct die cooling (with regular paste like PK-1 or Phanteks PH-NDC which is even better) even a smart thing to do?

I do move my PC quite a lot and I do go to LAN party's and such with it so i'm very scared the waterblock will move and slide across the die somehow and causes damage to the die.

Is my concern correct or do you guys say, with the mount Swiftech uses, that the die can handle this and moving my PC is fine.

It currently runs 24 hours Prime95 stable on 4.95Ghz (49x101) with 1.375v load. Temps on a simple air cooler (CM TPC-800 with 1 fan) didn't exceed 75c. My cooler should be ~10c or even more better plus he used a ITX board (P8Z77-I Deluxe) and I use a P8Z77-V Pro with more phases and such.
Is it possible for this beast to run 5.1-5.2Ghz on a decent voltage / temperature? And is direct die a smart idea for lower temps?

If keeping the IHS on is smart, I need to order some liquid paste first, but which is better for die-ihs cooling. Liquid Ultra or Liquid Pro.


----------



## Swag

Get CLU (Ultra) because it is easier to apply. The temp differences between the two make really no difference but the biggest contributor is how good the application is.


----------



## Imprezzion

Ok







I used Ultra before myself but never used Pro so don't know the difference first-hand.

But still, direct-die or with IHS.. That's the million dollar question


----------



## HarriDoesGaming

Hey Guys

Well I decided to delid and the luckily for me I didn't scratch or damaged the DIE or PCB, I used the razor method. I cleaned up all the old glue and TIM left from Intel and nicely spreaded out some CLP on the DIE then used some Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on the IHS. Before I was getting about 58 64 65 57 degree's on an OC of 4.5ghz @ 1.2v. Its been about 4 hrs now and the temps once I put everything back together are about -3c difference on each core. I was kinda hoping for at least -10c drop like many people have achieved. Im wondering if I did something wrong and would like to know what are the main factors in achieving that awesome -20c drop!

Im thinking I either put to much CLP on the DIE - I only used a small drop or maybe my Antec Formula 7 on the IHS isnt really good ?? I do have some NT-H1 if I don't see any improvements I might try it again using that TIM on the DIE and IHS. Im also wondering how long does it take for CLP and the Antec TIM to cure or wat ever ??


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Ok
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used Ultra before myself but never used Pro so don't know the difference first-hand.
> 
> But still, direct-die or with IHS.. That's the million dollar question


use IHs far less hassle
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HarriDoesGaming*
> 
> Hey Guys
> 
> Well I decided to delid and the luckily for me I didn't scratch or damaged the DIE or PCB, I used the razor method. I cleaned up all the old glue and TIM left from Intel and nicely spreaded out some CLP on the DIE then used some Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond on the IHS. Before I was getting about 58 64 65 57 degree's on an OC of 4.5ghz @ 1.2v. Its been about 4 hrs now and the temps once I put everything back together are about -3c difference on each core. I was kinda hoping for at least -10c drop like many people have achieved. Im wondering if I did something wrong and would like to know what are the main factors in achieving that awesome -20c drop!
> 
> Im thinking I either put to much CLP on the DIE - I only used a small drop or maybe my Antec Formula 7 on the IHS isnt really good ?? I do have some NT-H1 if I don't see any improvements I might try it again using that TIM on the DIE and IHS. Im also wondering how long does it take for CLP and the Antec TIM to cure or wat ever ??


remove the antec 7 and use a better TIM above the IHS then reapply the CLP on the die again also make sure all the glue is off the green pcb for the best contact with the die


----------



## NightHawk06

Anyone know where I can get a Naked IVY?? They're both sold out on Frozen and Performance PC takes 1-18 days to Restock
is there other stores shop at only 2 sites I know

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=37453


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> Anyone know where I can get a Naked IVY?? They're both sold out on Frozen and Performance PC takes 1-18 days to Restock
> is there other stores shop at only 2 sites I know
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=37453


http://www.frozencpu.com/products/19464/ex-blc-1437/EK_Supremacy_Precise_Mount_Add-On_Naked_Ivy_CPU_Block_Adapter_Hardare_EK-Supremacy_PreciseMount_Add-on_Naked_Ivy.html


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/19464/ex-blc-1437/EK_Supremacy_Precise_Mount_Add-On_Naked_Ivy_CPU_Block_Adapter_Hardare_EK-Supremacy_PreciseMount_Add-on_Naked_Ivy.html


Thanks ya that what i'm saying both sites are sold out its been 3 days waiting around till they restock
is there any other sites I can shop at and might have it there??


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> Thanks ya that what i'm saying both sites are sold out its been 3 days waiting around till they restock
> is there any other sites I can shop at and might have it there??


says in stock for me....


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> says in stock for me....


how many in stock lol it says out of stock for me hmmm what site frozen?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> how many in stock lol it says out of stock for me hmmm what site frozen?


frozen no limit currently where are you located?


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> frozen no limit currently where are you located?


Missouri i'm bout to get my kit today from them suppose ship here anytime today but ya that what it says out of stock when I order it
says they will ship it out once they get more but who knows when that be and they are di*ks by the wayy see this when I asked bout status update LOL
hopefully I get my full order not missing anything


----------



## Vodkacooling

I did it!!!! Priming now! Used a vice and hammer method. Did very small light-medium taps. Never hit hard like those youtube videos to see the chip fly. I just tapped it, felt it give. checked the chip and it needed a little more tap. Tapped it again, saw it give. Took IHS off. Covered the vrms with electrical tape. Applied CLU between core and ihs then added NTH1 onto the heatspreader.

Now im priming to see if its as stable as before. Its freezing cold in my house right now so its difficult to say how many degrees I have dropped. Compared to previous runs on a cold day, so far it looks like I dropped about 10 C will have to play BF4 later and to test.

What else can I run to make it hot?

Man im so excited!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> I did it!!!! Priming now! Used a vice and hammer method. Did very small light-medium taps. Never hit hard like those youtube videos to see the chip fly. I just tapped it, felt it give. checked the chip and it needed a little more tap. Tapped it again, saw it give. Took IHS off. Covered the vrms with electrical tape. Applied CLU between core and ihs then added NTH1 onto the heatspreader.
> 
> Now im priming to see if its as stable as before. Its freezing cold in my house right now so its difficult to say how many degrees I have dropped. Compared to previous runs on a cold day, so far it looks like I dropped about 10 C will have to play BF4 later and to test.
> 
> What else can I run to make it hot?
> 
> Man im so excited!


instead of the long run of prime use Intel Burn Test heres the link

http://www.xgamingstudio.com/files/IntelBurnTest.zip

Nice job by the way







wanna gimme the info and i can add you to the list here!


----------



## Swag

If you really wanna see a CPU burn up, use IBT w/ Linpack (the most current IBT will have Linpack pre-installed). For stress-testing, Prime95 or go commando. Commando, I mean don't stress test and live life on the edge. Writing a 5000 word paper with no auto-save or saving with a crazy commando OC. I really wanna hear a story about this, sounds really humorous.


----------



## Imprezzion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If you really wanna see a CPU burn up, use IBT w/ Linpack (the most current IBT will have Linpack pre-installed). For stress-testing, Prime95 or go commando. Commando, I mean don't stress test and live life on the edge. Writing a 5000 word paper with no auto-save or saving with a crazy commando OC. I really wanna hear a story about this, sounds really humorous.


^^ This.

I usually run like, a hour of LiNX (same as IBT but better UI IMO) with AVX and Linpack and if it passes 1 hour with temps <80c I just go game on it.
If it doesn't crash in the games / apps I run it's stable enough for me..

I just had a couple of crashes, hell even a BSOD or two with my 2600K so I had to ramp voltag even higher to 1.536v to keep it stable lol. This gives 83c in LinX after 1 hour and about 60c in-game but then again, CPU only has to last for about 3 more days without degrading









That's why I bought a secondhand 3770K which is already delidded and does a guaranteed 4.95Ghz @ 1.375v.
I wanna push it way past 5Ghz but k.

I ordered some new CLU for the IHS-Die connection and i'm using PK1 / PH-NDC for IHS-waterblock. (Or I can go CLU there as well but it's one big ass surface area to cover..)


----------



## Vodkacooling

Ill log in under a new username and post info when I get home. Ill run ibt or linx tonight. I'm trying to push for 4.8ghz stable but couldn't do it last night. I'm at 4.7ghz.

I hope I applied enough clu I went light on it.


----------



## Razor 116

Just delidded yesterday, won't be joining the club as I didn't test beforehand at 4.5 GHz. I could reach 4.3 GHz with no voltage increase so 4.5GHz would have likely been a small bump. I run and have ran since I got my CPU at 4.7 GHz @ 1.280v. I Am air cooled (Soon to be WC) so 5GHz may be out of reach although I can boot with 5GHz at 1.280 it crashes instantly with P95, also alot of WHEA errors beforehand.


----------



## Cyro999

Prime28.1 and avx2 linpack are still pretty crazy tests for Haswell - i don't know anyone who actually insists on using them aside from Belial, and he lost like 300mhz from stable air OC because of that


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Hey guys just wanted to drop in and say high to my old friends. I've been MIA lately but recently discovered algie growing in my loop! :-( so I ripped it apart and cleaned everything so I decided to add some stuff to it while I had the chance. Here is my new component list: My Mountain Mods Ascension CYO custom Anodized Black, ASUS Maximus V Extreme, my good ole Intel 3770k Delidded with a Swiftech Apogee HD block, three 7950s all fitted with fullcover Alphacool waterblocks, Ripjaws X 2133Mhz RAM, two Kingston HyperX 128Gb SSDs along with an OCZ Verrtex 4 128gb SSD, an Alphacool Bay Reservoir holding two MCP655s in parallel, the first one shoots water directly into another MCP655 to increase head pressure and then from there it eenters a Thermochill 360mm rad > Alphacool Monsta 240mm rad > then it goes through all three 7950s and back to the res. For the CPU loop it goes from the other MCP655 into an Alphacool UT60 280mm rad and then through the CPU and back to the res. This MM case is ridiculously awesome. The Thermochill 360mm and Alphacool 280mm is running push/pull configuration while the Alphacool Monsta 240mm is only running push because adding pull fans will make contact with the motherboard tray. I'm also running three fan controllers for all of the fans in the build. Two NZXT Sentrys and one Phobya TPC 4 channel. So yep! That's my update! Ill try to still around and post some pics soon! Nice to see all you old school catz are still lurkin around in here!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> If you really wanna see a CPU burn up, use IBT w/ Linpack (the most current IBT will have Linpack pre-installed). For stress-testing, Prime95 or go commando. Commando, I mean don't stress test and live life on the edge. Writing a 5000 word paper with no auto-save or saving with a crazy commando OC. I really wanna hear a story about this, sounds really humorous.











Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> Ill log in under a new username and post info when I get home. Ill run ibt or linx tonight. I'm trying to push for 4.8ghz stable but couldn't do it last night. I'm at 4.7ghz.
> 
> I hope I applied enough clu I went light on it.


Nice I'll wait for ya








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Razor 116*
> 
> Just delidded yesterday, won't be joining the club as I didn't test beforehand at 4.5 GHz. I could reach 4.3 GHz with no voltage increase so 4.5GHz would have likely been a small bump. I run and have ran since I got my CPU at 4.7 GHz @ 1.280v. I Am air cooled (Soon to be WC) so 5GHz may be out of reach although I can boot with 5GHz at 1.280 it crashes instantly with P95, also alot of WHEA errors beforehand.


Nah your fine just give me al the info you can and thats good enough honestly







(Join us) ((One of us One of us))








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hey guys just wanted to drop in and say high to my old friends. I've been MIA lately but recently discovered algie growing in my loop! :-( so I ripped it apart and cleaned everything so I decided to add some stuff to it while I had the chance. Here is my new component list: My Mountain Mods Ascension CYO custom Anodized Black, ASUS Maximus V Extreme, my good ole Intel 3770k Delidded with a Swiftech Apogee HD block, three 7950s all fitted with fullcover Alphacool waterblocks, Ripjaws X 2133Mhz RAM, two Kingston HyperX 128Gb SSDs along with an OCZ Verrtex 4 128gb SSD, an Alphacool Bay Reservoir holding two MCP655s in parallel, the first one shoots water directly into another MCP655 to increase head pressure and then from there it eenters a Thermochill 360mm rad > Alphacool Monsta 240mm rad > then it goes through all three 7950s and back to the res. For the CPU loop it goes from the other MCP655 into an Alphacool UT60 280mm rad and then through the CPU and back to the res. This MM case is ridiculously awesome. The Thermochill 360mm and Alphacool 280mm is running push/pull configuration while the Alphacool Monsta 240mm is only running push because adding pull fans will make contact with the motherboard tray. I'm also running three fan controllers for all of the fans in the build. Two NZXT Sentrys and one Phobya TPC 4 channel. So yep! That's my update! Ill try to still around and post some pics soon! Nice to see all you old school catz are still lurkin around in here!


Been while huh man! did you finish your build log yet? the MM case if i remember correctly. I wanna do a loop but I am curious how adding bleach would be to the system as it will kill all the bacteria's.... but maybe im an idiot


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Yea you don't want to use bleach in a loop. I believe that it oxidizes with the metal. I was just lazy before and didn't buy any anti-bacterial stuff. I just bought some Liquid Utopia which is anti-bacterial that you mix with the distilled water along with a silver bullet plug which also helps. Now I will be fine. No more algie for me! HOPEFULLY!
You definitely should go with water man. I could never go back to air lol its so amazing!


----------



## Vodkacooling

What
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Prime28.1 and avx2 linpack are still pretty crazy tests for Haswell - i don't know anyone who actually insists on using them aside from Belial, and he lost like 300mhz from stable air OC because of that


What is a good test? I'm noticing vrin helping me at like 2.2v some say its dangerous.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Hi guys,
> I'm in the process of making my very own waterblock (for direct-die) and I was wondering what the dimensions are of the IHS;
> Most importantly the width and height of the IHS (the 'raised' part that has the intel lettering on it and has to protrude through the retention bracket) also the radius of the corners would be interesting to know.
> Also I'm wondering how much lower the chips lies with the IHS removed (so basically the thickness of the IHS)
> 
> Thanks!


Anyone with a caliper lying around willing to measure for me? I went through all the intel spec sheets and even though I got a ton of information about the retention bracket it oddly enough didn't specify the cutout through which the IHS protrudes


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Anyone with a caliper lying around willing to measure for me? I went through all the intel spec sheets and even though I got a ton of information about the retention bracket it oddly enough didn't specify the cutout through which the IHS protrudes


with direct die you have to take the latch mechanism off the mobo and set the cpu in very carefully and then line up the block so you'll have noo need for dimensions just make the block not humongous and then gently apply it to the die, again being careful


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> What
> What is a good test? I'm noticing vrin helping me at like 2.2v some say its dangerous.


2.2vrin is silly unless you're already at/near high degradation on air/water level vcore. x264 is a pretty good stability test, but with Haswell i'd always reccomend doing something like that, and then tweaking a little bit at signs of instability if they show up after. It's hard to do something like 24h prime 28.1 and even if you pass that, you can still get the signs of instability anyway


----------



## fleetfeather

As per suggestion








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I'm keen to get in on this. I have a slight problem:
> 
> 1. I don't have access to a vice
> 2. I'm not steady with a razor/knife
> 
> Are there any solutions out there for me? Preferably low in cost since the Ti Classy is due in the next few days.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> As per suggestion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I'm keen to get in on this. I have a slight problem:
> 
> 1. I don't have access to a vice
> 2. I'm not steady with a razor/knife
> 
> Are there any solutions out there for me? Preferably low in cost since the Ti Classy is due in the next few days.
Click to expand...

Well, there are numerous ways to delid but those are the most popular methods. The next best method would be creating a make-shift vice:

Materials:
3 identical solid blocks of wood
1 hammer
1 table
1 wall

Steps:
1. Line the table against the wall
2. Place a block of wood against the wall on top of the table
3. Squeeze the CPU's IHS (Pins up, face down) with the block of wood against the wall and another block of wood
4. While supporting the second block of wood, put the third block of wood on top of the second and hammer on the third block of wood.

Essentially, you create your own vice doing this. Only do this if you absolutely don't have access to a vice.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Well, there are numerous ways to delid but those are the most popular methods. The next best method would be creating a make-shift vice:
> 
> Materials:
> 3 identical solid blocks of wood
> 1 hammer
> 1 table
> 1 wall
> 
> Steps:
> 1. Line the table against the wall
> 2. Place a block of wood against the wall on top of the table
> 3. Squeeze the CPU's IHS (Pins up, face down) with the block of wood against the wall and another block of wood
> 4. While supporting the second block of wood, put the third block of wood on top of the second and hammer on the third block of wood.
> 
> Essentially, you create your own vice doing this. Only do this if you absolutely don't have access to a vice.


that's ghetto/10 haha. i'll deffs keep it in mind if I get desperate







cheers


----------



## Swag

Other than that, I would highly recommend the razor method if you can't hands on a vice. It takes probably less that 3 minutes if you know what you're doing to delid with a vice and I can delid a CPU with a razor in 3 - 5 minutes now.


----------



## NightHawk06

just got my kit yesterday Xspc Raystorm ex240 and I just overclock my CPU today haswell i5 4670k at 4.8ghz wit 1.42v complete stable tested 9hrs highest temps of
79c 78c 76c 68c on all cores time to delid when get my Ultra metel thermal paste









idle temps


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> with direct die you have to take the latch mechanism off the mobo and set the cpu in very carefully and then line up the block so you'll have noo need for dimensions just make the block not humongous and then gently apply it to the die, again being careful


I was hoping to keep the latching mechanism in place. I read about people having trouble with their memory lanes since the PCB will curve up around the die. When using the latching mechanism to hold down the sides it would be a lot easier to get uniform pressure down on the pins.
Since it's no problem at all to make a waterblock that fits when going direct-die with the latching mechanism still in place I rather do that.

I believe the IHS is about 2mm thick (or less ofc) and have estimated it being 35x35mm, but I rather know for sure of course.


----------



## HGooper

What's this EK PreciseMount thing actually? Does it provide better performance compare with usual IHS mount with CLP? Can I use this PreciseMount on my Raystorm?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> What's this EK PreciseMount thing actually? Does it provide better performance compare with usual IHS mount with CLP? Can I use this PreciseMount on my Raystorm?


It allows you to have a precise height for mounting an EK waterblock on a naked CPU. That's basically all it does, if you use the IHS, then don't worry about this product.


----------



## HGooper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It allows you to have a precise height for mounting an EK waterblock on a naked CPU. That's basically all it does, if you use the IHS, then don't worry about this product.


Actually I prefer naked mount, IHS is quite troublesome to mount since delided. Does it provide any temp improvement compare with IHS mount? And again does it work for Raystorm?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It allows you to have a precise height for mounting an EK waterblock on a naked CPU. That's basically all it does, if you use the IHS, then don't worry about this product.
> 
> 
> 
> Actually I prefer naked mount, IHS is quite troublesome to mount since delided. Does it provide any temp improvement compare with IHS mount? And again does it work for Raystorm?
Click to expand...

When I tried it out, I got maybe 1C or none. Some people report 2 ~ 5C decrease across the board but really, it depends on each individual CPU.


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Actually I prefer naked mount, IHS is quite troublesome to mount since delided. Does it provide any temp improvement compare with IHS mount? And again does it work for Raystorm?


ya I heard temps knocked off around -10c or higher







I'm waiting myself on the part to stock up so I can purchase a couple myself kits....
and on the Raystorm fit yes it will fit you will need all this make it fit if you have this water block?

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_498_1124&products_id=32331

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1036&products_id=38688

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1032&products_id=30745

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1032&products_id=37453

Some misc. Bolts to put on the EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy.


----------



## HGooper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> ya I heard temps knocked off around -10c or higher
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm waiting myself on the part to stock up so I can purchase a couple myself kits....
> and on the Raystorm fit yes it will fit you will need all this make it fit if you have this water block?
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_498_1124&products_id=32331
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1036&products_id=38688
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1032&products_id=30745
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59_971_410_1032&products_id=37453
> 
> Some misc. Bolts to put on the EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy.


I do think Raystorm works on PreciseMount as the holes and gaps are quite large and flexible on Raystorm. I'll get one myself as I didn't get much improvement on my current IHS mount somehow, maybe I didn't mount it properly.

Btw is it safe to run die naked?


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> I do think Raystorm works on PreciseMount as the holes and gaps are quite large and flexible on Raystorm. I'll get one myself as I didn't get much improvement on my current IHS mount somehow, maybe I didn't mount it properly.
> 
> Btw is it safe to run die naked?








well here are some pictures this guy got it fit any water cooler just gotta get the other parts







This is my first time doing the naked die so have no idea it looks safe without the heatspreader that thing sucks lol put a water block right on that delid cpu temps prob knock off more then -10c+ for sure


----------



## Swag

It is safe to run the CPU without the IHS, however, it just isn't as safe as running it with the IHS. The IHS is a heat spreader, but in fact, its basis is the larger surface area. With the larger surface area, you spread the heat and the pressure from the CPU cooler. With the die, it will be better for cooling theoretically because there would be less heat transferring from medium to medium, but it will also hinder the safety aspect of practically diluting the pressure caused from the cooler.


----------



## Vodkacooling

I'm thinking of reapplying clu. Do I wipe the old stuff off? Or do I just add more over the top?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> I'm thinking of reapplying clu. Do I wipe the old stuff off? Or do I just add more over the top?


Wipe off the old and apply a new layer, don't reuse paste that's already been mounted.


----------



## Vodkacooling

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wipe off the old and apply a new layer, don't reuse paste that's already been mounted.


I just thought since its metal that it would be different from something like thermal paste


----------



## HGooper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It is safe to run the CPU without the IHS, however, it just isn't as safe as running it with the IHS. The IHS is a heat spreader, but in fact, its basis is the larger surface area. With the larger surface area, you spread the heat and the pressure from the CPU cooler. With the die, it will be better for cooling theoretically because there would be less heat transferring from medium to medium, but it will also hinder the safety aspect of practically diluting the pressure caused from the cooler.


I wonder dust will cause any problem since the cpu is exposed without IHS.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Wipe off the old and apply a new layer, don't reuse paste that's already been mounted.
> 
> 
> 
> I just thought since its metal that it would be different from something like thermal paste
Click to expand...

Most thermal paste is metal, just isn't as pure as CLU/CLP. But still remove the old and add a new layer, air bubbles are still there and after you mount the CLU/CLP and run it, the heat would've incited the molecules and cause degradation of the paste much quicker (drying out).


----------



## Razor 116

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice I'll wait for ya
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nah your fine just give me al the info you can and thats good enough honestly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Join us) ((One of us One of us))
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Been while huh man! did you finish your build log yet? the MM case if i remember correctly. I wanna do a loop but I am curious how adding bleach would be to the system as it will kill all the bacteria's.... but maybe im an idiot


Ok, Temps before delid maxing around 85c during P95 Blend with max memory. Now hits 75c on hottest core. This is with air cooling Hyper 212, On die TIM AS5 on IHS TIM AS5. I have a delta of 5-10c from hottest to coldest core so I will be remounting when my CLU TIM is delivered.

I tried direct die mounting with the Hyper 212, surprisingly it mounts and the system boots up however the H212 mounting mechanism is poor and the 3570k die is not in the center of the chip so the H212 mechanism makes the heatsink mount one side with more pressure than the other. The temps were incredible on 2 of the four cores though, maxing out at 65c during a p95 blend unfortunaltely the other two cores were skyrocketing and hitting high 90's so a terrible mount. Still I had to try it.


----------



## Vodkacooling

I can't stabilize at 4.8ghz







. Delid of 4.7 is fine at 1.325v

4.8ghz might be stable at 1.425v after delid and cold temps inside, the temps are nice but the volts make me uneasy.


----------



## Razor 116

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> I can't stabilize at 4.8ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Delid of 4.7 is fine at 1.325v
> 
> 4.8ghz might be stable at 1.425v after delid and cold temps inside, the temps are nice but the volts make me uneasy.


Don't immediately assume it's voltage related unless you get an instant crash upon loading all cores or a BSOD with vcore related code. Try altering other settings, I do not know of the different options for tweaking Haswell when compared to Ivy Bridge. Raising the pll is normally a good place to start if you have lowered it (I run mine at 1.5v ). Asus VRM Switching frequency, this instantly made 4.8 GHz stable for me at 1.305v.

I like you am uneasy with high volts, 1.35 is the max I'll run on mine (Until I watercool it







) and even then I don't like running that high.


----------



## Banedox

So is it worth Delidding a XEON 1366 X5660 chip I will soon be getting?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> I can't stabilize at 4.8ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Delid of 4.7 is fine at 1.325v
> 
> 4.8ghz might be stable at 1.425v after delid and cold temps inside, the temps are nice but the volts make me uneasy.


1.425 is more than fine I had a 4.8 giggle hertz at 1.48vcore for folding 24/7


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Banedox*
> 
> So is it worth Delidding a XEON 1366 X5660 chip I will soon be getting?


You would need to find out if it is soldered or using thermal paste. I'd guess it's soldered so this delidding business would not be for you.


----------



## Banedox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You would need to find out if it is soldered or using thermal paste. I'd guess it's soldered so this delidding business would not be for you.


Yeah im pretty sure the 1366 chips were soldered...


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Here is a couple pics of the current state of my MM. Before I show you guys let me just say that I'm in love with Performance-PCs right now! I got an MSI TFIII 7950, an Alphacool 7950 waterblock (traded it to him a couple months back and decided to buy it back), and an OCZ Vertex 4 SSD for 0.2BTC a couple days ago (I know, amazing deal). Turns out the MSI TFIII is the newer v277 which is on a 7970 PCB so the waterblock wouldn't fit. The block is still brand new in the vacuum sealed packaging, but I ordered it from PPC in July. I emailed them today asking if I could RMA it for store credit so I could buy the correct block and even though they don't normally do that they said it was fine, but just a one time thing. I was so happy that I didn't have to blow $100 on a new block for my new card. Anyways, here are a some pics of the rebuild as it stands.


and the rest in here to not spam up the thread.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## fleetfeather

how wide does the jaw width need to be on a vice? im thinking about picking up a cheap-as-chips hobby vice for delidding


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> how wide does the jaw width need to be on a vice? im thinking about picking up a cheap-as-chips hobby vice for delidding


The IHS's specifications are 2.9cm x 2.9cm.

Therefore, to allow a CPU to fit and be delidded with a vice, you need at the very least a width of 2.9cm, ideally, 3.0cm or larger.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The IHS's specifications are 2.9cm x 2.9cm.
> 
> Therefore, to allow a CPU to fit and be delidded with a vice, you need at the very least a width of 2.9cm, ideally, 3.0cm or larger.


too easy, found a hobby vice with a 50mm jaw width







cheers


----------



## Gil80

Hi All...

So after a failed 1st attempet with box cutter, I got it the second time with Vice and Hammer and a lot of adrenaline rush









I replaced the 3770k cheap paste with LiquidUltra

This image was taken when ambient temp was 30deg:

Avg 81.5 - 30 = 51.5deg above ambient

And this was taken just now when ambient temp is a whapping 37deg in my room (no air con, and that's typical Sydney summer







)


Avg 73.5 - 37 = 36.5deg above ambient

CPU: 3770K @ 4.7Ghz delidded
MB: Asus P8Z77-V-Deluxe
RAM: 4x4GB Corsair Vengeance 1600
Cooling: Swiftech H220
Manual Vcore: 1.205v


----------



## Razor 116

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Hi All...
> 
> So after a failed 1st attempet with box cutter, I got it the second time with Vice and Hammer and a lot of adrenaline rush
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I replaced the 3770k cheap paste with LiquidUltra
> 
> This image was taken when ambient temp was 30deg:
> 
> Avg 81.5 - 30 = 51.5deg above ambient
> 
> And this was taken just now when ambient temp is a whapping 37deg in my room (no air con, and that's typical Sydney summer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> Avg 73.5 - 37 = 36.5deg above ambient
> 
> CPU: 3770K @ 4.7Ghz delidded
> MB: Asus P8Z77-V-Deluxe
> RAM: 4x4GB Corsair Vengeance 1600
> Cooling: Swiftech H220
> Manual Vcore: 1.205v


1.205v for a 4.7GHz OC is extremely good, 5GHz with less than 1.35v(also incredible) may be possible for you. Those ambient temps omg.


----------



## Imprezzion

Got my secondhand pre-delidded 3770K in the mail just now!

It's lapped to 2000 grit and all.

I put some Liquid Ultra on it, mounted the IHS with the CPU in the socket, clamped it down, put PK1 on the IHS, put my H320's waterblock on her and went straight for the 5Ghz test.

I know it used to run 4.95 (49x101) on 1.375v load however every board is different.

Now testing 50x100 with 1.408v load (Offset, just picked a random number near 1.40v which I estimated to be about +0.200 and nailed it with 1.408v load







) and so far it seems to be working or at least close to stable.

Point is, I got miles and miles of room on my temps. With my pump and rad fans on 40% the highest it has gotten so far after 10 minutes of LinX with AVX is 72c.


----------



## pkrexer

Add me to the list as of last night. I was tempted to pick up a $30 vice from Home Depot but said screw it and went to the knife area and picked up a .009 thick $2 box of razors. Glad I saved the money because while it was a little nerve racking at first, it still only took me maybe 10 minutes of being careful to get it off. People who cut their CPU must have been really careless...

Put a nice thin layer of Liquid Ultra on the die and layer of PK3 on the spreader.... the results were amazing. This combo with my H100 cooler has me running at a max of 75c across all cores after a 10 pass Extreme IBT: 4.6ghz @ 1.4vcore... crazy.

Prior of removing the spreader, I was easily hitting 90c + with only 1.3vcore. I could only run 4.4ghz and even that was borderline stable... now I'm running 4.6 stable and could possibly run 4.7 (going to take bit more work on that one)


----------



## Imprezzion

Initial testing with a 45 minute LinX AVX run on my 3770K shows that the 1.408v (ok, 1.416v on the screenshot, it was a little jumpy) is probably enough for reasonable stability at 5Ghz.
Temps peaked at 75c with fans and pump on 40% PWM.

Die-IHS is CLU, IHS-Block is PK1. Might even try direct-die as the H320 mount is capable of that or just use CLU on both sides of the IHS


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Initial testing with a 45 minute LinX AVX run on my 3770K shows that the 1.408v (ok, 1.416v on the screenshot, it was a little jumpy) is probably enough for reasonable stability at 5Ghz.
> Temps peaked at 75c with fans and pump on 40% PWM.
> 
> Die-IHS is CLU, IHS-Block is PK1. Might even try direct-die as the H320 mount is capable of that or just use CLU on both sides of the IHS


Wow very nice voltage for 5Ghz! Congrats on the good chip! Personally, I don't think direct die is worth it. I would just put CLU on the IHS and block and get a custom loop if you really want better temps! My 3770k @ 4.8Ghz with 1.45v never goes above 52c when stress testing with my custom loop. Playing games never gets above 43c. I don't think I could ever run on air again. My 7950s max out at 39c while mining at 1100/1600.


----------



## Razor 116

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Initial testing with a 45 minute LinX AVX run on my 3770K shows that the 1.408v (ok, 1.416v on the screenshot, it was a little jumpy) is probably enough for reasonable stability at 5Ghz.
> Temps peaked at 75c with fans and pump on 40% PWM.
> 
> Die-IHS is CLU, IHS-Block is PK1. Might even try direct-die as the H320 mount is capable of that or just use CLU on both sides of the IHS


Any WHEA warnings in event viewer? 1.4v for 5GHz, that's a great chip you've got there. Are you not worried running that voltage 24/7 even with low temps?


----------



## Imprezzion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Razor 116*
> 
> Any WHEA warnings in event viewer? 1.4v for 5GHz, that's a great chip you've got there. Are you not worried running that voltage 24/7 even with low temps?


Now that you mention that, yes lol.

Logs are full of WHEA errors. It's one massive list of WHEA errors looool.
Time to check how much vcore I need to make it stop WHEA errors..

Problem is, even in BF4 my temps are hitting ~60-62c now lol. It does put 75-80% load on the CPU but doing something like running 7 memtests @ 2000MB will push temps to 65-66c.

How high can I run a Ivy in terms of temps in daily usage... Is 60-65c acceptable?


----------



## Razor 116

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Now that you mention that, yes lol.
> 
> Logs are full of WHEA errors. It's one massive list of WHEA errors looool.
> Time to check how much vcore I need to make it stop WHEA errors..
> 
> Problem is, even in BF4 my temps are hitting ~60-62c now lol. It does put 75-80% load on the CPU but doing something like running 7 memtests @ 2000MB will push temps to 65-66c.
> 
> How high can I run a Ivy in terms of temps in daily usage... Is 60-65c acceptable?


That was the same with me, thought I was stable @ 5GHz with no BSOD or errors in LinX and P95, but WHEA will always bite you in the ass


----------



## Imprezzion

I remounted it with a tad more CLU between the die and the IHS and I also decided to use the remaining CLU for double CLU usage.
I'm now running CLU between die and IHS and between block and IHS.

Testing 1.424v now. I wonder how much the double CLU mount dropped temps compared to CLU-PK1..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gil80*
> 
> Hi All...
> 
> So after a failed 1st attempet with box cutter, I got it the second time with Vice and Hammer and a lot of adrenaline rush
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I replaced the 3770k cheap paste with LiquidUltra
> 
> This image was taken when ambient temp was 30deg:
> 
> Avg 81.5 - 30 = 51.5deg above ambient
> 
> And this was taken just now when ambient temp is a whapping 37deg in my room (no air con, and that's typical Sydney summer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> Avg 73.5 - 37 = 36.5deg above ambient
> 
> CPU: 3770K @ 4.7Ghz delidded
> MB: Asus P8Z77-V-Deluxe
> RAM: 4x4GB Corsair Vengeance 1600
> Cooling: Swiftech H220
> Manual Vcore: 1.205v


Nice stuff man! Welcome to the club







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Now that you mention that, yes lol.
> 
> Logs are full of WHEA errors. It's one massive list of WHEA errors looool.
> Time to check how much vcore I need to make it stop WHEA errors..
> 
> Problem is, even in BF4 my temps are hitting ~60-62c now lol. It does put 75-80% load on the CPU but doing something like running 7 memtests @ 2000MB will push temps to 65-66c.
> 
> How high can I run a Ivy in terms of temps in daily usage... Is 60-65c acceptable?


Lololol I hate them damn WHEA errors! Ivys are rated up to 105c so as long as you keep them under 85c I think that would be a happy medium. Bump up that vcore! Let's see a stable 5Ghz OC! I still say get a custom loop and enjoy cooool temps


----------



## Vodkacooling

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> I remounted it with a tad more CLU between the die and the IHS and I also decided to use the remaining CLU for double CLU usage.
> I'm now running CLU between die and IHS and between block and IHS.
> 
> Testing 1.424v now. I wonder how much the double CLU mount dropped temps compared to CLU-PK1..


Post your results when you can because I think I need to redo my clu applicatuon


----------



## Imprezzion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> Post your results when you can because I think I need to redo my clu applicatuon


Results: I'm blown away!

I put a slight bit more CLU on the die this time and used the remaining CLU on the IHS-Block connection and temps on 1.440v are now lower then they were with PK1 on 1.416v.

I maxed LinX at 72c and BF4 64 player map @ 2880x1620 all Ultra no AA maxed at 58c.

On 1.440v the WHEA errors are gone so I guess 1.440v will do for stability even though Prime and LinX will pass at much lower.


----------



## Vodkacooling

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Results: I'm blown away!
> 
> I put a slight bit more CLU on the die this time and used the remaining CLU on the IHS-Block connection and temps on 1.440v are now lower then they were with PK1 on 1.416v.
> 
> I maxed LinX at 72c and BF4 64 player map @ 2880x1620 all Ultra no AA maxed at 58c.
> 
> On 1.440v the WHEA errors are gone so I guess 1.440v will do for stability even though Prime and LinX will pass at much lower.


Well looks like I have to reapply then. I wonder if I should put clu between my block and ihs instead of nth1. I think ill try.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> Well looks like I have to reapply then. I wonder if I should put clu between my block and ihs instead of nth1. I think ill try.


I didn't see much improvement putting CLU between the block and IHS. If you are going to reapply then redo the application on the die. Just put a thin but complete layer on the die and the bottom of the IHS that touches the die.


----------



## fleetfeather

summer ambients without aircon were breaking my balls. Vice and CLP should be here in 2 days (i'll get some CLU eventually, I have to get it sent from overseas).


----------



## Vodkacooling

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> I didn't see much improvement putting CLU between the block and IHS. If you are going to reapply then redo the application on the die. Just put a thin but complete layer on the die and the bottom of the IHS that touches the die.


Thank you for the heads up. Ill do that.


----------



## NightHawk06

I manage to get 4.8ghz at 1.42v stable wasnt sure if voltage was safe? so went down 4.7ghz 1.32v can't wait till delid my cpu and prob will go Naked Ivy mount
on this raystorm waterblock







can't wait to see Results


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> I manage to get 4.8ghz at 1.42v stable wasnt sure if voltage was safe? so went down 4.7ghz 1.32v can't wait till delid my cpu and prob will go Naked Ivy mount
> on this raystorm waterblock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> can't wait to see Results


1.42v isn't a bad voltage, but if you can go 100Mhz lower for that huge .1v drop then I would say that is more worth it.


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 1.42v isn't a bad voltage, but if you can go 100Mhz lower for that huge .1v drop then I would say that is more worth it.


oh ya if 1.42v aint bad then cant wait till delid see whats sup







and the voltage went down alot to handle 4.7Ghz
I have to ask is this normal what shows here on the NB Freq? I have the CPU Ratio OC at 4.7ghz but shows here 3.8ghz

I have a MSI Z87 G45 mobo


----------



## defiler2k

Getting a new 4770K and will delid right away, I managed to squeeze 4.9 out of my previous one, hope this one can do 5.0....Ive done so many hammer vice delids between mine and my friends that its just second nature and feels like one more step in the process of building a rig...


----------



## Vodkacooling

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Getting a new 4770K and will delid right away, I managed to squeeze 4.9 out of my previous one, hope this one can do 5.0....Ive done so many hammer vice delids between mine and my friends that its just second nature and feels like one more step in the process of building a rig...


Lucky! I had to go through like 5 cpus before I found a 4.7ghz one.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vodkacooling*
> 
> Lucky! I had to go through like 5 cpus before I found a 4.7ghz one.


I know and there are so many variables with this generation of CPU's that its hard to understand if it is that you are doing something wrong or if it is the chip. I saved my mobo settings for 4.9 if this new one cant handle that it will be off to the next. I did notice something interesting through my testing though, more voltage doesn't really mean you get the best OC. For that previous CPU I was testing in the 1.4 ranges and it wasn't until I fat fingered my settings to a 1.35 with a .03 offset that I got it stable on 4.9. But I wouldn't have even tried without the delid. Hence why out of the box this is going to the vice.


----------



## YounGMessiah

Just curious guys, if I delidded back in September (the 4th to be exact), when is a good time to redo my application of CLU?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YounGMessiah*
> 
> Just curious guys, if I delidded back in September (the 4th to be exact), when is a good time to redo my application of CLU?


Did you put it on the die or on the IHS, if on the IHS to the die you should be good specially if you haven't noticed your temps going up. If on the Block or direct die and your temps are going up I would take a look. I think the main sign that things need a check is if your temps start creeping up.


----------



## YounGMessiah

I put it on the die, not outside of the IHS, and okay my temperatures are still great 

Thanks


----------



## Stoffie22

Hi every one, i took the step and delidded my I7 3770K !

My 3770k has been running 24/7 on a 4,2Ghz.
1.2Vcore
TIM: NT-H1
On AIR.
So under load its now about 80 degrees celcius.Real temp:
Core 1 - 72
Core 2 - 81
Core 3 - 79
Core4 - 78.






And now for the results:
Total diff from start:
Taken from Real temp:
Core 1 - 72 - Lapped>Delided,CLU> 55 = - 17 degrees Celcius
Core 2 - 81 - Lapped>Delided,CLU> 64 = - 17degrees Celcius
Core 3 - 79 - Lapped>Delided,CLU> 61 = - 18 degrees Celcius
Core4 - 78. - Lapped>Delided,CLU> 63 = - 15 degrees Celcius


Full report:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1443275/3770k-lapping-delidding-wc-results/0_20

So i guess i earned that SIG!?


----------



## Valgaur

Gimme the info needed stated in the Op and Then you will


----------



## 2wiced

Woo hoo.







Add me up.

OCN name: 2wiced
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: NTH1
Mhz gained: (still working on 4.8ghz)
OC after delid: 4.7ghz
Temp drops: ~6-10C


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> 1.42v isn't a bad voltage, but if you can go 100Mhz lower for that huge .1v drop then I would say that is more worth it.


Ok post to this guy: 0.1v for 100mhz..

Since your uncore is at stock + turbo, you're probably not adjusting VRIN or VRIN llc either, what bluescreens? You can't just throw vcore up to the limits of the chip (1.42 bios for 1.44 load is pretty damn close for haswell) without playing with other settings and expect it to work


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2wiced*


Hokies tubing is all I can think of looking at this pic lulz


----------



## 2wiced

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hokies tubing is all I can think of looking at this pic lulz


hokies tubing? I dont get it? Am I missing a reference?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2wiced*
> 
> hokies tubing? I dont get it? Am I missing a reference?


Hokies is this crazy son of a gun that roams around in the official mining thread. Your new thats why you don't get it









Anyways, welcome to the forum! I'm suprised that you only got a 10C temp drop. I seen 25c drops. Did you put a think layer of CLU on the die and the bottom of the IHS that touches the die?


----------



## 2wiced

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hokies is this crazy son of a gun that roams around in the official mining thread. Your new thats why you don't get it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyways, welcome to the forum! I'm suprised that you only got a 10C temp drop. I seen 25c drops. Did you put a think layer of CLU on the die and the bottom of the IHS that touches the die?


yes I did. When I took off the lid, the amount of paste underneath the IHS was spread evenly. Maybe thats why?


----------



## 2wiced

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Hokies is this crazy son of a gun that roams around in the official mining thread. Your new thats why you don't get it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyways, welcome to the forum! I'm suprised that you only got a 10C temp drop. I seen 25c drops. Did you put a think layer of CLU on the die and the bottom of the IHS that touches the die?


I actually reapplied it twice. Applied it the first time and temps seemed to be the same or a little better. then I reapplied and it worked better.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2wiced*
> 
> I actually reapplied it twice. Applied it the first time and temps seemed to be the same or a little better. then I reapplied and it worked better.


Yea a 10c drop is still good. What are you using to cool your CPU?


----------



## 2wiced

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Yea a 10c drop is still good. What are you using to cool your CPU?


1 x ex240 1x RX120 1 x ex360

Cooling 2 GTX 780s overclocked at 1.25v and a 4770k 1.33v 4.7ghz


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2wiced*
> 
> 1 x ex240 1x RX120 1 x ex360
> 
> Cooling 2 GTX 780s overclocked at 1.25v and a 4770k 1.33v 4.7ghz


What CPU temps are you getting with that setup after delidding?


----------



## 2wiced

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> What CPU temps are you getting with that setup after delidding?


Playing BF4 right now, dont really know the room temps, Currently CPU temp is around 55-62


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2wiced*
> 
> Playing BF4 right now, dont really know the room temps, Currently CPU temp is around 55-62


Well that's not bad at all! No worries there! Congrats on the successful delid!


----------



## 2wiced

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RavageTheEarth*
> 
> Well that's not bad at all! No worries there! Congrats on the successful delid!


Max temp showed to be 67 on one core. But when I monitor with my keyboard LCD, they hover around 55-60 in game.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *2wiced*
> 
> 
> 
> Woo hoo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Add me up.
> 
> OCN name: 2wiced
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: NTH1
> Mhz gained: (still working on 4.8ghz)
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz
> Temp drops: ~6-10C


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Roboyto

OCN Name: Roboyt0

CPU: 4770k

On-Die TIM: Xigmatek PTI-G4512

IHS-TIM: Xigmatek PTI-G4512

MHz Gained: Unknown

OC After Delid: 4.4 GHz

Temp Drops: Unknown - Idles at 23-26 C

I am sorry that I don't have any information for gains after Delid. The reason for this is because I was very anxious to chop the top on my 4770k after breaking my 3770k
















After I broke it, I then disappontedly walked into the parts department at the dealership I work at and grabbed a new razor blade. Fearless at this point, I stuffed the razor blade under a corner and had the top off in ~45 seconds. I was happy that I got it off, but also aggravated as well. The night before I attempted to delid with a cheapo iWork "xacto knife", and none of the blades were thin enough to get under a corner...which was why I opted for the wood/hammer method.




For the life of me I could not get the IHS to pop off. I had it clamped as tight as I felt comfortable and it was slowly 'inching' along in the vice after each whack. I was using a block of wood as is seen on numerous videos.





The only bit of interesting information I can add is this...After I delidded I used the stock Intel cooler to make sure I didn't brick the chip. I fired up Prime95, at 4.2 GHz, only running on 2 threads; more than 2 threads and it would surpass 95C rather quickly. With the stock cooler and the delid it was stable running at 94C on hottest core after 30 minutes. I didn't run the test any longer as I was satisfied that the chip was fine. Before delid, at stock 3.9 GHz turbo, on 2 threads, it couldn't maintain a safe temperature for even a minute. I have no pictures to support my claims, so take this information however you will. I was too antsy to document my findings.

Live and learn.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> For the life of me I could not get the IHS to pop off. I had it clamped as tight as I felt comfortable and it was slowly 'inching' along in the vice after each whack. I was using a block of wood as is seen on numerous videos.


You don't hit it along the length of the jaws, you hit it across the jaws so it can't move. Hit it left to right in your picture, not front to back.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN Name: Roboyt0
> 
> CPU: 4770k
> 
> On-Die TIM: Xigmatek PTI-G4512
> 
> IHS-TIM: Xigmatek PTI-G4512
> 
> MHz Gained: Unknown
> 
> OC After Delid: 4.4 GHz
> 
> Temp Drops: Unknown - Idles at 23-26 C
> 
> I am sorry that I don't have any information for gains after Delid. The reason for this is because I was very anxious to chop the top on my 4770k after breaking my 3770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After I broke it, I then disappontedly walked into the parts department at the dealership I work at and grabbed a new razor blade. Fearless at this point, I stuffed the razor blade under a corner and had the top off in ~45 seconds. I was happy that I got it off, but also aggravated as well. The night before I attempted to delid with a cheapo iWork "xacto knife", and none of the blades were thin enough to get under a corner...which was why I opted for the wood/hammer method.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the life of me I could not get the IHS to pop off. I had it clamped as tight as I felt comfortable and it was slowly 'inching' along in the vice after each whack. I was using a block of wood as is seen on numerous videos.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The only bit of interesting information I can add is this...After I delidded I used the stock Intel cooler to make sure I didn't brick the chip. I fired up Prime95, at 4.2 GHz, only running on 2 threads; more than 2 threads and it would surpass 95C rather quickly. With the stock cooler and the delid it was stable running at 94C on hottest core after 30 minutes. I didn't run the test any longer as I was satisfied that the chip was fine. Before delid, at stock 3.9 GHz turbo, on 2 threads, it couldn't maintain a safe temperature for even a minute. I have no pictures to support my claims, so take this information however you will. I was too antsy to document my findings.
> 
> Live and learn.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!!!


----------



## Roboyto

Don't know how I didn't realize that at the time


----------



## fleetfeather

Omg... Nearly killed my cpu with the vice method lol. Need to work up the courage to try again









edit: to clarify, I have a chip in my pcb similar to @Roboyto except my chip is more on the pin-side of the pcb rather than the IHS-side. I think it's been caused by my block of wood


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Omg... Nearly killed my cpu with the vice method lol. Need to work up the courage to try again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit: to clarify, I have a chip in my pcb similar to @Roboyto except my chip is more on the pin-side of the pcb rather than the IHS-side. I think it's been caused by my block of wood


Block of wood chipped mine as well. I didn't even try to put it in a board to test it since it looks like some of the IC was affected.

My suggestion would be the razor blade method. All you have to do is get under one corner and you're good. The PCB of the processor will keep the razor blade flat so it won't do any damage. Just make sure you don't have more than 1/4", or 6mm, of the blade under the IHS on any side and you will be golden; On the two sides where the chip is closest to the edge of the PCB it is 3/8" of an inch or 9mm. Mark the whole length of the razor blade at 1/4" with a sharpie and don't let it slide in any further than that. Just go slow









From what I've read the other style razor blade depicted at the beginning of this thread is thinner and easier to get under the IHS, but harder to find locally and harder to handle since you need to cover one end with something to hold it.

What is sad is that the TIM on the inside of the 4770k, brand new out of the box, was just as crusty/crappy as my 3770k that I had used for at least a year clocked at at least 4.5


----------



## fleetfeather

Well, I bailed on the vice method. Honestly that crap is a fair bit riskier than people are making it out to be; I dodged a fairly high caliber bullet with my chipped PCB. After all that happened, I went down to Big W (I think that's the Aussie equivalent of walmart) and bought some razor blades.









Protip: walking into a store in a long-sleeve hoodie (where no one can see your forearms) and attempting to buy nothing but a pack of razor blades makes the cashiers very, very nervous rofl. I got the whole 20-questions grilling, I got my ID checked (I'm 22y/o), and I even got given the freecall number for Lifeline (which I actually volunteer at as a psychology graduate haha)... Anyways.......

OCN Name: fleetfeather
CPU: 4770k
On-Die TIM: *CLP* (waiting for international order of CLU >.<)
IHS-TIM: MX-4
MHz Gained: 100
OC After Delid: 4.5
Temp Drops: *~25C* with ambient normalised (85C down to 60C)
CPU-Z: http://valid.canardpc.com/rr4y2a


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Well, I bailed on the vice method. Honestly that crap is a fair bit riskier than people are making it out to be; I dodged a fairly high caliber bullet with my chipped PCB. After all that happened, I went down to Big W (I think that's the Aussie equivalent of walmart) and bought some razor blades.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Protip: walking into a store in a long-sleeve hoodie (where no one can see your forearms) and attempting to buy nothing but a pack of razor blades makes the cashiers very, very nervous rofl. I got the whole 20-questions grilling, I got my ID checked (I'm 22y/o), and I even got given the freecall number for Lifeline (which I actually volunteer at as a psychology graduate haha)... Anyways.......
> 
> OCN Name: fleetfeather
> CPU: 4770k
> On-Die TIM: *CLP* (waiting for international order of CLU >.<)
> IHS-TIM: MX-4
> MHz Gained: 100
> OC After Delid: 4.5
> Temp Drops: *~25C* with ambient normalised (85C down to 60C)
> CPU-Z: http://valid.canardpc.com/rr4y2a


You're in! Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Well, I bailed on the vice method. Honestly that crap is a fair bit riskier than people are making it out to be; I dodged a fairly high caliber bullet with my chipped PCB. After all that happened, I went down to Big W (I think that's the Aussie equivalent of walmart) and bought some razor blades.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Protip: walking into a store in a long-sleeve hoodie (where no one can see your forearms) and attempting to buy nothing but a pack of razor blades makes the cashiers very, very nervous rofl. I got the whole 20-questions grilling, I got my ID checked (I'm 22y/o), and I even got given the freecall number for Lifeline (which I actually volunteer at as a psychology graduate haha)... Anyways.......


LOL... never would have thought of that. Pretty funny.


----------



## defiler2k

So I got my new chip in and things look promising. So far without delid Im topping out at 4.8GHz with 1.35v, I will delid today and report back to see if I can get past 4.8 otherwise off to the next chip


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I got my new chip in and things look promising. So far without delid Im topping out at 4.8GHz with 1.35v, I will delid today and report back to see if I can get past 4.8 otherwise off to the next chip


Crack that top baby!!!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I got my new chip in and things look promising. So far without delid Im topping out at 4.8GHz with 1.35v, I will delid today and report back to see if I can get past 4.8 otherwise off to the next chip


Cant wait to see those results nice chip by the way man!!


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Well, I bailed on the vice method. Honestly that crap is a fair bit riskier than people are making it out to be; I dodged a fairly high caliber bullet with my chipped PCB. After all that happened, I went down to Big W (I think that's the Aussie equivalent of walmart) and bought some razor blades.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> /quote]
> 
> Balls of steel :-D


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I got my new chip in and things look promising. So far without delid Im topping out at 4.8GHz with 1.35v, I will delid today and report back to see if I can get past 4.8 otherwise off to the next chip


Ivy or Haswell?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Ivy or Haswell?


Haswell i7 4770K


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Haswell i7 4770K


Very fortunate to hit 4.8 out of the box, mine struggles to make 4.5 :-(

I remember reading in a review on Toms Hardware, or something of that sort, that ASUS told them they only had 10% of the 4770k they tested to hit 4.8GHz

Let us see those results after the delid. :-D


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Very fortunate to hit 4.8 out of the box, mine struggles to make 4.5 :-(
> 
> I remember reading in a review on Toms Hardware, or something of that sort, that ASUS told them they only had 10% of the 4770k they tested to hit 4.8GHz
> 
> Let us see those results after the delid. :-D


Yeah Im aching to get home and smack it with the hammer









Its batch L310B492 if anyone is curious.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Yeah Im aching to get home and smack it with the hammer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its batch L310B492 if anyone is curious.


Not that the 300 MHz really makes that much of a difference in performance, but it's that magical 5GHz number.

I'm nearly positive my 3770k would have made 5GHz after delid if I didn't break it. I got it to 5GHz, but CoreTemp immediately shut down my PC after Windows fully loaded because all cores were over 95C.

However, I picked up a new 3570k at Microcenter on black Friday for $150. I think it might be a magical chip as it's stable 4.5Ghz at 1.16V and only Hitting low 70s with an Antec 620 using one ARCTIC F12 PWM fan. Need to chop the top and see where I end up.


----------



## Pimphare

Okay fellas, I plan on delidding my 3570K soon. I'll probably put the IHS back on before installing the XSPC Raystorm as I'm too chicken to keep it naked. I know this has been asked a thousand times before, but I'd rather not flip back through all of the pages to get a definitive answer. So question being, what tim/thermal paste do you recommend I use directly on the die and on the outer surface of the IHS?


----------



## Gunderman456

I want to join the club!

OCN name: Gunderman456
CPU: i7 4770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-4
Mhz gained: 100MHz (so far)
OC after delid: 4.5GHz to a comfortable 4.6GHz
Temp drops: On average 15-20C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: See build log for "The Hawaiian Heat Wave" (in sig) for tons more info!

I also lapped the IHS using 180, 220, 400 and 2000 grit.

I did not test with the IntelBurn Test but used x264.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pimphare*
> 
> Okay fellas, I plan on delidding my 3570K soon. I'll probably put the IHS back on before installing the XSPC Raystorm as I'm too chicken to keep it naked. I know this has been asked a thousand times before, but I'd rather not flip back through all of the pages to get a definitive answer. So question being, what tim/thermal paste do you recommend I use directly on the die and on the outer surface of the IHS?


Depends on if you want maximum performance that will require more effort to apply and may need maintenance, or set it and forget it. Coolaboratory liquid pro or liquid ultra will likely yield the best temperatures, but can be difficult to work with if you have never used them before. They may require maintenance in the form of re-application after X amount of time; I am uncertain of this fact as I have personally never used them before. However, I have read a fair bit on them and considered using them before. The little bit extra performance wasn't worth it to me; delidding alone usually yields fairly drastic temperature drops by itself.

A traditional TIM like Arctic MX-4 would likely be the 'easiest' choice. Everyone knows it performs, it is readily available, easy to apply, is non-conductive if you Oops and get it where it shouldn't be, doesn't require a cure time to achieve max performance, and Arctic Cooling advertises at least an 8 year lifespan between applications.

I have personally become fond of the Xigmatek PTI-G4512 as it also doesn't require a cure time.

Just keep in mind, any TIM only works as well as you apply it. Too much, too little, or improper procedure can make any TIM perform disappointingly.

Just my 2 cents

Either way...just DO IT! Totally worth it


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> I want to join the club!
> 
> OCN name: Gunderman456
> CPU: i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-4
> Mhz gained: 100MHz (so far)
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz to a comfortable 4.6GHz
> Temp drops: On average 15-20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: See build log for "The Hawaiian Heat Wave" (in sig) for tons more info!
> 
> I also lapped the IHS using 180, 220, 400 and 2000 grit.
> 
> I did not test with the IntelBurn Test but used x264.


Unique method with no vice. Very nice!


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Unique method with no vice. Very nice!


Thanks, something I picked-up from Skyn3t, almost fool proof!


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Depends on if you want maximum performance that will require more effort to apply and may need maintenance, or set it and forget it. Coolaboratory liquid pro or liquid ultra will likely yield the best temperatures, but can be difficult to work with if you have never used them before. They may require maintenance in the form of re-application after X amount of time; I am uncertain of this fact as I have personally never used them before. However, I have read a fair bit on them and considered using them before. The little bit extra performance wasn't worth it to me; delidding alone usually yields fairly drastic temperature drops by itself.
> 
> A traditional TIM like Arctic MX-4 would likely be the 'easiest' choice. Everyone knows it performs, it is readily available, easy to apply, is non-conductive if you Oops and get it where it shouldn't be, doesn't require a cure time to achieve max performance, and Arctic Cooling advertises at least an 8 year lifespan between applications.
> 
> I have personally become fond of the Xigmatek PTI-G4512 as it also doesn't require a cure time.
> 
> Just keep in mind, any TIM only works as well as you apply it. Too much, too little, or improper procedure can make any TIM perform disappointingly.
> 
> Just my 2 cents
> 
> Either way...just DO IT! Totally worth it


I already have some Artic MX-4 on hand so I'll just go with that. So I can put this on both the outer side of the IHS and directly on the die?


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I want to join the club!
> 
> OCN name: Gunderman456
> CPU: i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-4
> Mhz gained: 100MHz (so far)
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz to a comfortable 4.6GHz
> Temp drops: On average 15-20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: See build log for "The Hawaiian Heat Wave" (in sig) for tons more info!
> 
> I also lapped the IHS using 180, 220, 400 and 2000 grit.
> 
> I did not test with the IntelBurn Test but used x264.


Thanks! Posted this just in time. I've heard of this method but haven't seen any pics of it.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pimphare*
> 
> I already have some Artic MX-4 on hand so I'll just go with that. So I can put this on both the outer side of the IHS and directly on the die?


Yup!


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Yup!


Alrighty then! Thank you sir for your help!


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pimphare*
> 
> Alrighty then! Thank you sir for your help!


No problem


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> I want to join the club!
> 
> OCN name: Gunderman456
> CPU: i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-4
> Mhz gained: 100MHz (so far)
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz to a comfortable 4.6GHz
> Temp drops: On average 15-20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: See build log for "The Hawaiian Heat Wave" (in sig) for tons more info!
> 
> I also lapped the IHS using 180, 220, 400 and 2000 grit.
> 
> I did not test with the IntelBurn Test but used x264.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Jetskyer

Guys, I'm wanting to go direct-die (using CLU)
Now I've heard a lot about CLU hardening over time, not on the die itself since that's glass, but on the copper surfaces.
If I remember correctly I've seen a thing or two about how nickel plated blocks don't have that issue, is this correct?

Still debating between the MIPS Iceforce and the Aquacomputer Kryos HF and if having a nickel base is significantly better that could make the decision for me


----------



## fleetfeather

how many months between CLP/CLU changes peeps?


----------



## Cyro999

6 seems pretty safe. I think many go much longer


----------



## fleetfeather

Nice, cheers mate. I'll probs switch to CLU by the time autumn hits then. I'll be sure to do a video of my CLP cleaning attempt haha

Another protip for you all: if you get a teeny tiny amount of CLP on your hand, don't just try to rub it off on the side of your leg, unless you're trying to look like the Silver Surfer


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> how many months between CLP/CLU changes peeps?


Just keep your eyes on your temps, if you see they start climbing and there are no changes to your loop or ambient temps then it might be time to change.


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Nice, cheers mate. I'll probs switch to CLU by the time autumn hits then. I'll be sure to do a video of my CLP cleaning attempt haha
> 
> Another protip for you all: if you get a teeny tiny amount of CLP on your hand, don't just try to rub it off on the side of your leg, unless you're trying to look like the Silver Surfer


Haha this made me LOL literally. Nothing but the truth from this guy!! ^


----------



## defiler2k

So I'm going to MC today and pickup yet another 4770K since my last one didn't live up to expectations. I should just settle for 4.8GHz but I'm on a mission...lol


----------



## Teplous

you're crazy 2k


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I'm going to MC today and pickup yet another 4770K since my last one didn't live up to expectations. I should just settle for 4.8GHz but I'm on a mission...lol


wanna buy me one as well for christmas!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teplous*
> 
> you're crazy 2k


^ i hear that







(hardly any gain over 4.8 to 5.0 giggles anyways but who wants to stop a man on a mission)


----------



## fleetfeather

What real-world gain will you get going above 4.6 giggles? Specifically in CPU bound games, is it going to make a difference?

Curious as to what I'm missing out on









Edit: Nevermind, google is my friend haha


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> What real-world gain will you get going above 4.6 giggles? Specifically in CPU bound games, is it going to make a difference?
> 
> Curious as to what I'm missing out on
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Nevermind, google is my friend haha


Games? who cares about games. It's all about benchmarks and the feeling you have when you know your chip can hit 5 GHz.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> What real-world gain will you get going above 4.6 giggles? Specifically in CPU bound games, is it going to make a difference?
> 
> Curious as to what I'm missing out on
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Nevermind, google is my friend haha


MOAR SC2 POWER


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Games? who cares about games. It's all about benchmarks and the feeling you have when you know your chip can hit 5 GHz.


Dat FSE life validation









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> MOAR SC2 POWER


Omg brb binning chips







actually it's interesting to see uncore play a decent role at higher core multi's


----------



## Cyro999

I wasn't benching for uncore, though i should probably go back and do that. AFAIK most of the gain from the last jump was the RAM (see earlier in chart for 2200c9 ram speed change)

It's hard to say if the jump is really that big, considering you have to restart OS to change RAM settings. The other stuff was done in-OS without unloading a replay using tweaklauncher


----------



## fleetfeather

Ahh right right, I totally overlooked the ram change. Ugh I've just realised there's a stability improving BIOS update for my mobo, and I'm about to hop on a plane to my folks place for Xmas and NYE. Guess ill have to wait a week or so to do some more experimenting of my own


----------



## Cyro999

To be honest, it's more interesting to be able to say solidly that RAM helps for more than a few games and it's 1000% worth grabbing a decent kit that costs just a bit more than 1600c9









hf


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I'm going to MC today and pickup yet another 4770K since my last one didn't live up to expectations. I should just settle for 4.8GHz but I'm on a mission...lol


I DID THE SAME WITH A 3770K It is worth it when you pick a winner like me [email protected] 1.41V I got to wait till winter to try beat my personal best benches.
Are you going to hand pick it? I ordered mine on line


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I DID THE SAME WITH A 3770K It is worth it when you pick a winner like me [email protected] 1.41V I got to wait till winter to try beat my personal best benches.
> Are you going to hand pick it? I ordered mine on line


5ghz @ 1.4v... Surely you could do better binning chips


----------



## RickRockerr

I posted this on water cooling club ans I post this here:
Little advice for all of you who are using EK -Supremacy PreciseMount kit. DON'T SCREW THE SCREWS ALL WAY DOWN! Today I changed my CLP which wasn't hardened at all after 6 months.
And after I putted my block back I got mem error at boot (DIMM A 1 and 2 wasn't working at all). After 6 hours off trying everything I got it working and it seems that EK-Supremacy PreciseMount kit has bend my mobo.
Now I'm running same setup expect screws of block are now on half way and everything is running normally.


----------



## Jetskyer

It seems more likely that not your motherboard but the PCB of your chip bends a little. When going direct-die you only press down on the center of the chip/PCB. When applying too much pressure the PCB will indeed bend a bit causing the outer pins to loose proper contact, so among other things, the pins for your memory lanes.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> It seems more likely that not your motherboard but the PCB of your chip bends a little. When going direct-die you only press down on the center of the chip/PCB. When applying too much pressure the PCB will indeed bend a bit causing the outer pins to loose proper contact, so among other things, the pins for your memory lanes.


Agreed. There are indeed quite a few memory lanes and voltage lanes on the outer edges of the haswell chip, and screwing a block down too tightly will flex the chip PCB much like a razor blade flexes the PCB (but in the other way)


----------



## 0xSigh

So, I'm positive that I messed up my delidding (did the awful razor method), and I'm pretty sure I the chip is toast, but it still sorta works in the oddest way. I can still get access to memory if I use my third or fourth slot, but it only runs at ~800 MHz, no matter what try running.

On the plus side, it runs cool, I guess...


----------



## Shadovex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0xSigh*
> 
> So, I'm positive that I messed up my delidding (did the awful razor method), and I'm pretty sure I the chip is toast, but it still sorta works in the oddest way. I can still get access to memory if I use my third or fourth slot, but it only runs at ~800 MHz, no matter what try running.
> 
> On the plus side, it runs cool, I guess...


Sounds like a warped PCB just like how the previous 3 posts talked about the EK-Supremacy Precise mount warping the PCB if screwed on too tight.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Agreed. There are indeed quite a few memory lanes and voltage lanes on the outer edges of the haswell chip, and screwing a block down too tightly will flex the chip PCB much like a razor blade flexes the PCB (but in the other way)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> It seems more likely that not your motherboard but the PCB of your chip bends a little. When going direct-die you only press down on the center of the chip/PCB. When applying too much pressure the PCB will indeed bend a bit causing the outer pins to loose proper contact, so among other things, the pins for your memory lanes.


That's more likely than mobo







But my point is that I don't recommend to fully tighten the screws although manual said otherwise.


----------



## incog

Oh hey, was just wondering, has anyone ever considered or tried actually soldering the IHS to the die?


----------



## NightHawk06

hey guys just Delid my i5 4670k and I'm in need of help! I just put CLP on the Die.. and when I turn on PC
it started up then shut down turn back on then shut down... I turn it off fully then took off cpu block and it looked like the CLP wasnt making any contact or w/e was going on I spread it all over the die like in the videos idk if i didnt use enough?

here my results before 4.7ghz 1.34 vcore 4.5ghz NB freq 1.280v reads 1.310v VCCIN 1.880v reads 1.905
cant find old picture of my results. I did 1 hr stress test and got this Results


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> hey guys just Delid my i5 4670k and I'm in need of help! I just put CLP on the Die.. and when I turn on PC
> it started up then shut down turn back on then shut down... I turn it off fully then took off cpu block and it looked like the CLP wasnt making any contact or w/e was going on I spread it all over the die like in the videos idk if i didnt use enough?
> 
> here my results before 4.7ghz 1.34 vcore 4.5ghz NB freq 1.280v reads 1.310v VCCIN 1.880v reads 1.905
> cant find old picture of my results. I did 1 hr stress test and got this Results
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Are you saying that you put CLP on the die, put the IHS back on, and you did not see a thumbprint of the die on the underside of the IHS when you pulled it back off?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Oh hey, was just wondering, has anyone ever considered or tried actually soldering the IHS to the die?


I wondered the same thing myself, but I ended up going direct die instead of entertaining the idea any further.


----------



## Swag

Merry Christmas or Christmas Eve!


----------



## Slomo4shO

Currently have my 4770K delidded and running at 4.6GHz at 1.196V. Getting a custom loop up finally so I will see if I can break 5GHz on the chip (have been able to obtain 4.9GHz around 1.36V). I guess it is time I finally join this club.





I also have a delidded 3770K which is now retired


----------



## 0xSigh

Wow, I guess I didn't actually didn't say this in the post, but I chipped the pcb, which I would guess would be the more likely culprit. While I'm worried about the memory, I'm really more confused by the low clock speed...


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0xSigh*
> 
> Wow, I guess I didn't actually didn't say this in the post, but I chipped the pcb, which I would guess would be the more likely culprit. While I'm worried about the memory, I'm really more confused by the low clock speed...


When you say it's 800MHz for the memory, do you mean it's running like a 1600MHz DDR DRAM kit or do you mean it's actually running at 400MHz?

If it's running like a 1600 kit (meaning it shows 800MHz in CPU-Z), it might just be your BIOS freaking out and being a little broken. That happened more than once on my Gigabyte board, the BIOS not reacting to any changes I made. 1600 for memory is the default nowadays.

The solution to the stuck BIOS settings was seeing if loading optimized defaults and re-doing all settings helped, or possibly flashing a new BIOS from USB stick.


----------



## Valgaur

May your blades be sharp as well as your brains for all the goodies ye shall receive! (also may your eggnog be nice and sharp as well!)


----------



## Ukkooh

What is the best way to get the IHS off the cpu without taking the cpu off the socket? I'd like to redo the clu on die when my wc stuff arrives.

Ps. Written on a athlon xp 1800+.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> What is the best way to get the IHS off the cpu without taking the cpu off the socket? I'd like to redo the clu on die when my wc stuff arrives.
> 
> Ps. Written on a athlon xp 1800+.


Why not just keep it like it is? Are temperatures looking bad?

I really would not do it in the socket, replacing the CLU. I found random tiny drops of CLU on my desk after working on the CPU. I have no idea how it happened, did not notice anything about this while working with the syringe and brush. That would be seriously dangerous if it had happened inside the case over the motherboard.


----------



## 0xSigh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> When you say it's 800MHz for the memory, do you mean it's running like a 1600MHz DDR DRAM kit or do you mean it's actually running at 400MHz?
> 
> If it's running like a 1600 kit (meaning it shows 800MHz in CPU-Z), it might just be your BIOS freaking out and being a little broken. That happened more than once on my Gigabyte board, the BIOS not reacting to any changes I made. 1600 for memory is the default nowadays.
> 
> The solution to the stuck BIOS settings was seeing if loading optimized defaults and re-doing all settings helped, or possibly flashing a new BIOS from USB stick.


I meant to say 800 MHz for the processor... wrote that when I was a bit too tired


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Why not just keep it like it is? Are temperatures looking bad?
> 
> I really would not do it in the socket, replacing the CLU. I found random tiny drops of CLU on my desk after working on the CPU. I have no idea how it happened, did not notice anything about this while working with the syringe and brush. That would be seriously dangerous if it had happened inside the case over the motherboard.


The last time I put the IHS on it slid a bit so I'm not sure if it has proper contact. I just hate these fragile Intel sockets and intsalling cpus to them. I'd rather delid another cpu than take the cpu off its socket.
And yes my temps are bad but it is caused by very uneven surface on my h110i. Only about 75% of the block is in contact with the cpu.


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Are you saying that you put CLP on the die, put the IHS back on, and you did not see a thumbprint of the die on the underside of the IHS when you pulled it back off?
> I wondered the same thing myself, but I ended up going direct die instead of entertaining the idea any further.


Ya I put CLP on the die spread it all over die like people do in Videos and mount the waterblock on top of it Naked Ivy Mount wit no IHS
and I turn on Computer it just keeps shutting down and Restarting.. So I took it apart and I look at the waterblock had no CLP on thermal paste
and I not for sure if i didnt use enough CLP or what but used some other thermal paste System fires up


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> Ya I put CLP on the die spread it all over die like people do in Videos and mount the waterblock on top of it Naked Ivy Mount wit no IHS
> and I turn on Computer it just keeps shutting down and Restarting.. So I took it apart and I look at the waterblock had no CLP on thermal paste
> and I not for sure if i didnt use enough CLP or what but used some other thermal paste System fires up


The best is to also spread a little CLP/CLU on the contact area of your waterblock, this will ensure good heat transition.

This doesn't explain the restarting though, which more likely is due to the naked-mount. Altering the pressure of the mount will most likely fix your restart problems (if your delid indeed was successful of course)
Start with a very light pressure and add up slowly, trying to boot with every full turn on the nuts or so until your system fires right up.
Once you hit that sweet spot you can try to add a bit more pressure to ensure steady operation and you're good to go.


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> The best is to also spread a little CLP/CLU on the contact area of your waterblock, this will ensure good heat transition.
> 
> This doesn't explain the restarting though, which more likely is due to the naked-mount. Altering the pressure of the mount will most likely fix your restart problems (if your delid indeed was successful of course)
> Start with a very light pressure and add up slowly, trying to boot with every full turn on the nuts or so until your system fires right up.
> Once you hit that sweet spot you can try to add a bit more pressure to ensure steady operation and you're good to go.


ya I finally tried it again and finally got the CLP on the die and also took out the Naked ivy mount and put on the IHS
I was 4.7ghz stable at 1.340vcore and now i'm stable at 4.7ghz 1.280vcore since I delid that huge drop on voltage lol
Temps look really good too was using Intel burn test that gives more Temps then any other program


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Oh hey, was just wondering, has anyone ever considered or tried actually soldering the IHS to the die?


Yeah, it was mentioned briefly few months ago. It was said you need factory conditions to do this. Very high chance of damage doing it at home. Also, it's a one way street. If solder has not flowed correctly then you can't undo the procedure very easily.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> ya I finally tried it again and finally got the CLP on the die and also took out the Naked ivy mount and put on the IHS
> I was 4.7ghz stable at 1.340vcore and now i'm stable at 4.7ghz 1.280vcore since I delid that huge drop on voltage lol
> Temps look really good too was using Intel burn test that gives more Temps then any other program


Delidding does not change the voltage needed for stability. Delidding only drops temperatures


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Delidding does not change the voltage needed for stability. Delidding only drops temperatures


But dropping temperatures affects the voltage needed for stability.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> But dropping temperatures affects the voltage needed for stability.


I was helping Nighthawk with his OC in the Haswell Overclocking thread. Temps weren't a issue for him previously, so a reduction in temps wont be a major player here. Furthermore, no amount of temp decrease is going to account for 60mv :/


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> But dropping temperatures affects the voltage needed for stability.


Marginally


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I was helping Nighthawk with his OC in the Haswell Overclocking thread. Temps weren't a issue for him previously, so a reduction in temps wont be a major player here. Furthermore, no amount of temp decrease is going to account for 60mv :/


I agree with you 60mV is way too much. 5-10mV is very well possible if you're one of those getting a 40-50°C drop with a temp sensitive chip.
I should have read NightHawk06's post more carefully, my apologies.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> I agree with you 60mV is way too much. 5-10mV is very well possible if you're one of those getting a 40-50°C drop with a temp sensitive chip.
> I should have read NightHawk06's post more carefully, my apologies.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> But dropping temperatures affects the voltage needed for stability.


The drop is quite substantial if you go from like 80c to close to 0 with phase for example from what i understand; but 20c, it's hard to see any notable difference


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> I agree with you 60mV is way too much. 5-10mV is very well possible if you're one of those getting a 40-50°C drop with a temp sensitive chip.
> I should have read NightHawk06's post more carefully, my apologies.


No need to apologise mate


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Delidding does not change the voltage needed for stability. Delidding only drops temperatures


ya well idk I wasnt stable anywhere under 1.3vcore and after I delid I lower voltage got 1.290v stable over 10hrs stress testing
that weird cause before I couldnt even boot up at 1.290v now I'm stable after I delid


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NightHawk06*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Delidding does not change the voltage needed for stability. Delidding only drops temperatures
> 
> 
> 
> ya well idk I wasnt stable anywhere under 1.3vcore and after I delid I lower voltage got 1.290v stable over 10hrs stress testing
> that weird cause before I couldnt even boot up at 1.290v now I'm stable after I delid
Click to expand...

I second this. Dropping the temps as significantly as I did when I delidded allowed me to reduce my loaded VCore without sacrificing stability.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I second this. Dropping the temps as significantly as I did when I delidded allowed me to reduce my loaded VCore without sacrificing stability.


Fair enough







how much of a drop? (as in, from X Vcore to Y Vcore)


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I second this. Dropping the temps as significantly as I did when I delidded allowed me to reduce my loaded VCore without sacrificing stability.










when I delid my cpu temps went down like -20c+ and it allowed me to lower my Vcore tested out so many ways till it Crashed it did
at 1.270v


----------



## NightHawk06

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I was helping Nighthawk with his OC in the Haswell Overclocking thread. Temps weren't a issue for him previously, so a reduction in temps wont be a major player here. Furthermore, no amount of temp decrease is going to account for 60mv :/


when you talked bout 60mv what in world is that lol??


----------



## Cyro999

10mv = 0.01v


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I second this. Dropping the temps as significantly as I did when I delidded allowed me to reduce my loaded VCore without sacrificing stability.
> 
> 
> 
> Fair enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> how much of a drop? (as in, from X Vcore to Y Vcore)
Click to expand...

I dont remember the specific number anymore, because I only ran at the same clockspeed for a few days before cranking out a stable daily 5.0. And it would be hard to attribute the overall VCore drop to just delidding, as I also ran direct die water-cooling too. But it was somewhere in the .010 range that the VCore came down at load. not huge, but a couple notches.

It just makes sense though...like with the 7970's that have that magic threshold somewhere in 50-60C that they start to artifact. Same principal, different transistor layout.


----------



## The EX1

Used the hammer and vice method. Killed my CPU on the first attempt. Bought another haswell and here we are.

*OCN name:*The_EX1
*CPU:* i7 4770k
*on die-TIM:*CLU
*ihs-TIM:*Gelid GC-1
*Mhz gained:*300
*OC after delid:*4.8 @ 1.415
*Temp drops:* 14C from hottest core to hottest core





PRE DELID


POST DELID


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The EX1*
> 
> Used the hammer and vice method. Killed my CPU on the first attempt. Bought another haswell and here we are.
> 
> *OCN name:*The_EX1
> *CPU:* i7 4770k
> *on die-TIM:*CLU
> *ihs-TIM:*Gelid GC-1
> *Mhz gained:*300
> *OC after delid:*4.8 @ 1.415
> *Temp drops:* 14C from hottest core to hottest core


What killed the cpu on your first try? Grats on getting it right on the second try though!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The EX1*
> 
> Used the hammer and vice method. Killed my CPU on the first attempt. Bought another haswell and here we are.
> 
> *OCN name:*The_EX1
> *CPU:* i7 4770k
> *on die-TIM:*CLU
> *ihs-TIM:*Gelid GC-1
> *Mhz gained:*300
> *OC after delid:*4.8 @ 1.415
> *Temp drops:* 14C from hottest core to hottest core
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PRE DELID
> 
> 
> POST DELID


You're in!







Nice job on the cleaning btw, I really like using the gloves just to be safe myself! Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## incog

Yes, I'm also curious to hear about how you killed your CPU on your first try. This is a good thing to tell to others.


----------



## PontiacGTX

I have a question, can a delidded cpu be relidded?
The cpu has arctic silver 5, another question,which one is better for delidding? clu or clp?


----------



## RavageTheEarth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PontiacGTX*
> 
> I have a question, can a delidded cpu be relidded?
> The cpu has arctic silver 5, another question,which one is better for delidding? clu or clp?


What do you mean by relidded? It would be very difficult to reglue the IHS back on, but I don't know what the point of that would be unless you are attempting an RMA on a messed up chip (which is illegal btw). If you hold the IHS down while locking the CPU in the socket it won't move if that is what you are worried about.

As for your second question, CLU FTW!


----------



## InCoGnIt0

You can relid it and send it back to Intel, it has been done before. NOT ILLEGAL. you reglue it with permatex.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Re delid I mean.and someone with a delidded cpu can take photos to the cpu with nake die without hassles?


----------



## PontiacGTX

Can someone reply my questiin above? Thanks


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PontiacGTX*
> 
> Can someone reply my questiin above? Thanks


There are some pics of a naked 4770k die just 8 posts above, the 3770k die is identical except for the line of SMD caps beside the die on the PCB, the 3770k doesn't have those.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> There are some pics of a naked 4770k die just 8 posts above, the 3770k die is identical except for the line of SMD caps beside the die on the PCB, the 3770k doesn't have those.


so removing the ihs after delidding is removable?
Btw how much personshave scratched their cpu in the DIE during the delidding?


----------



## Valgaur

when you buy a delidded CPU the IHS is free moving and held down by the socket of the motherboard. so no need to take a razor to it you can literally just pick it off the cpu with your fingers reapply better TIM and then if you want lapp the IHS down to be perfectly flat.

if it's already delidded then all the hard work is all done for you


----------



## PontiacGTX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> when you buy a delidded CPU the IHS is free moving and held down by the socket of the motherboard. so no need to take a razor to it you can literally just pick it off the cpu with your fingers reapply better TIM and then if you want lapp the IHS down to be perfectly flat.
> 
> if it's already delidded then all the hard work is all done for you


thanks +rep


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PontiacGTX*
> 
> so removing the ihs after delidding is removable?
> Btw how much personshave scratched their cpu in the DIE during the delidding?


Delidding = taking the lid off
the IHS is the "lid" of the CPU
So.. by delidding, you will make the IHS removable, yes.

Here is an old pic of my delidded CPU:

It is a 4670k (i5 Haswell)

I dont be-leave many persons have scratched their DIE.. If you are using razor method, chances are you will scratch the PCB or surface mounted SMD caps before scratching the die itself.
If you use the hammer / vise method, you wont risk scratches on DIE or PCB.. but may risk scratching the IHS








It all depends on how well you are prepared, and if it is done the right way.

Also, I think it is legal to re glue the IHS to the CPU and send it back IF! Intel has been made aware of the fact that the CPU has been deliddid and relidded.
But the numbers on IHS and CPU has to match.. so if you lapped your IHS, the warranty is gone.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Delidding = taking the lid off
> the IHS is the "lid" of the CPU
> So.. by delidding, you will make the IHS removable, yes.
> 
> Here is an old pic of my delidded CPU:
> 
> It is a 4670k (i5 Haswell)
> 
> I dont be-leave many persons have scratched their DIE.. If you are using razor method, chances are you will scratch the PCB or surface mounted SMD caps before scratching the die itself.
> If you use the hammer / vise method, you wont risk scratches on DIE or PCB.. but may risk scratching the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It all depends on how well you are prepared, and if it is done the right way.
> 
> Also, I think it is legal to re glue the IHS to the CPU and send it back IF! Intel has been made aware of the fact that the CPU has been deliddid and relidded.
> But the numbers on IHS and CPU has to match.. so if you lapped your IHS, the warranty is gone.


my main concern if the die and pcb

is it necessary remove the TIM on the Die if I want to check?

I dontthiink the seller would want to apply tim


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PontiacGTX*
> 
> my main cocern if the die and pcb


Very few have done any damage to the die, when using a razor you just have to be a little careful not to go too deep on the cuts through the glue. A fair number of people have scratched the PCB to different degrees, some having no ill effects, some losing a memory channel, & a few outright deaths.

The hammer & vise method does seem safer & quicker, the main concern being the PCB flying across the room with too hard a hit. Putting a towel or something behind it is an easy fix, & start off light hits then go heavier so as to not use more force than necessary. Also hit it straight on, don't angle the wooden block upwards to lift the PCB off the IHS, there was a pic from a member who tore a good chunk off the PCB a while back. Not sure if he was hitting it at an angle, but looked like that would have done it.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Very few have done any damage to the die, when using a razor you just have to be a little careful not to go too deep on the cuts through the glue. A fair number of people have scratched the PCB to different degrees, some having no ill effects, some losing a memory channel, & a few outright deaths.
> 
> The hammer & vise method does seem safer & quicker, the main concern being the PCB flying across the room with too hard a hit. Putting a towel or something behind it is an easy fix, & start off light hits then go heavier so as to not use more force than necessary. Also hit it straight on, don't angle the wooden block upwards to lift the PCB off the IHS, there was a pic from a member who tore a good chunk off the PCB a while back. Not sure if he was hitting it at an angle, but looked like that would have done it.


Ok so I will say him to send me pics of the CPU without IHS


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PontiacGTX*
> 
> Ok so I will say him to send me pics of the CPU without IHS


I feel you are a little confused. No one glues the IHS back on. After delid, they are two totally separate parts! Even if the thermal paste the guy used makes the IHS stick a little to the CPU's die, it will still not be possible to ship it without things moving around. You will definitely have to reapply new thermal paste (or better, CLU) when you install stuff in your board.


----------



## PontiacGTX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I feel you are a little confused. No one glues the IHS back on. After delid, they are two totally separate parts! Even if the thermal paste the guy used makes the IHS stick a little to the CPU's die, it will still not be possible to ship it without things moving around. You will definitely have to reapply new thermal paste (or better, CLU) when you install stuff in your board.


I was a bit confused. now I dont. Valgaur clarified all.
I will apply CLU


----------



## bond32

I haven't taken my block off since I de-lid, does the CLU cause the heat spreader to stay on the pcb?


----------



## incog

As far as I know there's no real way to have the IHS stick to the PCB once the CPU has been delidded. So I don't think so. CLU or Thermal paste is only there to transfer heat, it doesn't do any "sticking".

hmm

There's no need to for it to stick anyway, the motherboard does that job for you.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bond32*
> 
> I haven't taken my block off since I de-lid, does the CLU cause the heat spreader to stay on the pcb?


You just want to do maintenance for the block and stuff? Why would you open that lever for the mechanism that clamps down on the CPU? Just leave everything about that closed and don't touch the CLU, just work on the top surface of the IHS and block.


----------



## bond32

I was just curious. I don't plan to take it off any time soon. Thought if I needed to flip my block or anything...


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Very few have done any damage to the die, when using a razor you just have to be a little careful not to go too deep on the cuts through the glue. A fair number of people have scratched the PCB to different degrees, some having no ill effects, some losing a memory channel, & a few outright deaths.
> 
> The hammer & vise method does seem safer & quicker, the main concern being the PCB flying across the room with too hard a hit. Putting a towel or something behind it is an easy fix, & start off light hits then go heavier so as to not use more force than necessary. Also hit it straight on, don't angle the wooden block upwards to lift the PCB off the IHS, there was a pic from a member who tore a good chunk off the PCB a while back. Not sure if he was hitting it at an angle, but looked like that would have done it.


I chipped my i7 on the edge of the PCB, but it wasn't due to hitting it on an angle. If you use the vice method, make sure you hit across the vice so the chip won't slide through the vice; it will because that glue is quite strong.

After trying the vice method and failing, then using a Razor blade, I think the razor is the way to go. Unless you're really rough it's kind of hard to mess it up. Once the razor is under one corner you're good to go. The PCB keeps the razor flat and straight. If you're doing Haswell just be aware of the VRMs, it's roughly 1/4" on the one side, just don't go in further than 1/4". Mark your razor blade with a sharpie to make sure it doesn't go in past that point.







[/URL]


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I chipped my i7 on the edge of the PCB, but it wasn't due to hitting it on an angle. If you use the vice method, make sure you hit across the vice so the chip won't slide through the vice; it will because that glue is quite strong.
> 
> After trying the vice method and failing, then using a Razor blade, I think the razor is the way to go. Unless you're really rough it's kind of hard to mess it up. Once the razor is under one corner you're good to go. The PCB keeps the razor flat and straight. If you're doing Haswell just be aware of the VRMs, it's roughly 1/4" on the one side, just don't go in further than 1/4". Mark your razor blade with a sharpie to make sure it doesn't go in past that point.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/URL]


I was thinking of a different one posted a while back, can't remember where or who, it was a good size chunk of the PCB pulled up with the IHS though.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I chipped my i7 on the edge of the PCB, but it wasn't due to hitting it on an angle. If you use the vice method, make sure you hit across the vice so the chip won't slide through the vice; it will because that glue is quite strong.


----------



## FtW 420

Had to dig around for a while but found it http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/22700_50#post_21137394



I do miss the search on the old OCN, only thing I don't like about huddler is that search became next to useless...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Had to dig around for a while but found it http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club/22700_50#post_21137394
> 
> 
> 
> I do miss the search on the old OCN, only thing I don't like about huddler is that search became next to useless...


I hope they fix that search bar with the next update.


----------



## fleetfeather

My PCB got chipped using the vice method too, however my vice attempt was in line with the method seen in the various video guides. Razor got the job done for me, the riskiest part isn't hitting the die, but rather gouging the PCB


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> My PCB got chipped using the vice method too, however my vice attempt was in line with the method seen in the various video guides. Razor got the job done for me, the riskiest part isn't hitting the die, but rather gouging the PCB


Yiiiiis join the cutters!


----------



## bond32

I used the razor method too. My final attempt on it was made much easier after I let the cpu get rather warm.


----------



## fleetfeather

Anyone got any figures for the delta between CLP and CLU under load?


----------



## Chomuco

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Anyone got any figures for the delta between CLP and CLU under load?


mmm


----------



## PontiacGTX

http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal


----------



## fleetfeather

Hmmm well I have CLP on the die atm, and MX4 on the IHS.

From that graph, it's clear that I should at least be using CLP on the IHS too, but I'm looking for numbers to demonstrate the benefit of importing some CLU rather than sticking with CLP...

CLU is going to cost over 40 bucks to import, so naturally I want to weigh up the benefits it brings

Edit: thanks for the link Pontiac, looks like a pretty interesting mix of results


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Hmmm well I have CLP on the die atm, and MX4 on the IHS.
> 
> From that graph, it's clear that I should at least be using CLP on the IHS too, but I'm looking for numbers to demonstrate the benefit of importing some CLU rather than sticking with CLP...
> 
> CLU is going to cost over 40 bucks to import, so naturally I want to weigh up the benefits it brings
> 
> Edit: thanks for the link Pontiac, looks like a pretty interesting mix of results


For me CLP give's 5°C lower max temps than CLU but CLU gives 2°C lower idle temps. I tested this several times in same room temp.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> For me CLP give's 5°C lower max temps than CLU but CLU gives 2°C lower idle temps. I tested this several times in same room temp.


Yeah the link above features majority of results in line with yours too. Given all this, ill be sticking with CLP; max load temps are of greater importance to me personally than max idle temps.

Cheers for the insight


----------



## Cyro999

5c seems like a pretty insane amount for load temps


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> 5c seems like a pretty insane amount for load temps


At first I was like that too, that's why I reapplied several times.


----------



## alucardis666

I've had so much fun reading so many posts in this thread... I can't wait to delid my new 4770k this wednesday!

I'll post up how it goes.

Tried the razor blade but didn't have one thin enough laying around and didn't want to damage the cpu.... *Hopping I didn't*

Anyway... Still waiting for parts to come in but I should have my new system up Wednesday night or Thursday the latest


----------



## bond32

Unless you have a heat gun, I strongly recommend you run some stress tests and get it hot, then take it out quick. Made mine much easier (I attempted the razor method 3 times, third was successful).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> I've had so much fun reading so many posts in this thread... I can't wait to delid my new 4770k this wednesday!
> 
> I'll post up how it goes.
> 
> Tried the razor blade but didn't have one thin enough laying around and didn't want to damage the cpu.... *Hopping I didn't*
> 
> Anyway... Still waiting for parts to come in but I should have my new system up Wednesday night or Thursday the latest


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bond32*
> 
> Unless you have a heat gun, I strongly recommend you run some stress tests and get it hot, then take it out quick. Made mine much easier (I attempted the razor method 3 times, third was successful).


just use these blades very thin very strong. what most of us have used.


no need to heat it up it cools down far to fast and you can actually damage it with a heat gun they get far to hot.


----------



## fleetfeather

Personally, I had my cpu sitting outside of the system 3 days before I attempted the razor method. You can see in my video that the initial cut took a bit of force, but the glue wasn't overly difficult to cut through.


----------



## alucardis666

Well... I tried the razor method, but as previously mentioned... I didn't have a blade thin enough to get in there... so I bought a cheapo bessy Vise on amazon for $20 and it was utter crap... Darn thing would absorb too much of the impact and rattle and shake... even launched my CPU 3x... The fact that it even still works after the hell I put it through astonishes me.

Luckily it does and for that I'm thankful. I've been towerless for 8 long days... and I just couldn't wait anymore. I may delid later... but for now I got windows installing and I'm pretty happy. Sad that I can't join the club though...

Idle in bios on stock my cpu was sitting at 30 degrees... I know it could be worlds better...

Till next time guys.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Well... I tried the razor method, but as previously mentioned... I didn't have a blade thin enough to get in there... so I bought a cheapo bessy Vise on amazon for $20 and it was utter crap... Darn thing would absorb too much of the impact and rattle and shake... even launched my CPU 3x... The fact that it even still works after the hell I put it through astonishes me.
> 
> Luckily it does and for that I'm thankful. I've been towerless for 8 long days... and I just couldn't wait anymore. I may delid later... but for now I got windows installing and I'm pretty happy. Sad that I can't join the club though...
> 
> Idle in bios on stock my cpu was sitting at 30 degrees... I know it could be worlds better...
> 
> Till next time guys.


we will be eagerly waiting


----------



## The EX1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> What killed the cpu on your first try? Grats on getting it right on the second try though!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Yes, I'm also curious to hear about how you killed your CPU on your first try. This is a good thing to tell to others.


The block of wood I was using slipped at an upward angle after tapping it with the hammer. Block slide across the top of the chip and knocked off 1 of the SMD capacitors....wasn't pretty









I just delidded a friend's 4770k as well. I think I am getting pretty good at it


----------



## bond32

Something weirdly satisfying about the feeling when you finally get the heat spreader just to the point you can take it off...

I would gladly do it again now that I have done my own


----------



## lilchronic

just finished deliding a 3770k 5Ghz @ 1.420v











sorry thats the only pic i took


----------



## naved777

using Vice method i chipped the PCB at one corner and there's a crack too








immediately gave up hope by the look of the damage because 99% of chip with this kind of damage didn't worked

BUT still plugged it in and it booted !
so basically i cant delid it







since i cant slide a razer in between PCB and heatspreader because there's no gap ! i have scrape the PCB to get it in and Vice method proved to be dangerous for me


----------



## rabidz7

OCN name:
CPU: 4930K
Bare-Die TIM: Arctic Silver V
Mhz gained: 0MHz
OC after delid: 4.4GHz
Temp drops: 10C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/0l50it

This CPU has a soldered IHS. I put it in my BGA oven and set it to 225C. I then removed it and, while still hot, popped it into a vice and pounded it with a hammer. I wanted to run this thing bare die and I succeeded.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> OCN name:
> CPU: 4930K
> Bare-Die TIM: Arctic Silver V
> Mhz gained: 0MHz
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz
> Temp drops: 10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/0l50it
> 
> This CPU has a soldered IHS. I put it in my BGA oven and set it to 225C. I then removed it and, while still hot, pounded it into a vice and hammer. I wanted to run this thing bare die and I succeeded.


Well I will be a monkey's uncle. There is something you dont see every day. You have balls...big shiny brass ones. Can we see some pics from this?


----------



## rabidz7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Well I will be a monkey's uncle. There is something you dont see every day. You have balls...big shiny brass ones. Can we see some pics from this?


This is in the PC that I am typing this post from. So... Um...


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> OCN name:
> CPU: 4930K
> Bare-Die TIM: Arctic Silver V
> Mhz gained: 0MHz
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz
> Temp drops: 10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/0l50it
> 
> This CPU has a soldered IHS. I put it in my BGA oven and set it to 225C. I then removed it and, while still hot, popped it into a vice and pounded it with a hammer. I wanted to run this thing bare die and I succeeded.


Did you really get a drop or are you just playing?
I would think that a Soldered IHS would have better heat transfer then direct die.
I do not believe 10C one bit without pictures and proof.


----------



## fleetfeather

What VID/Vcore are you pushing for that 10C drop


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Well I will be a monkey's uncle. There is something you dont see every day. You have balls...big shiny brass ones. Can we see some pics from this?
> 
> 
> 
> This is in the PC that I am typing this post from. So... Um...
Click to expand...

You have to understand my disappointment...I am trying to avoid making a porn analogy, but dang it would have been nice to see that chip hot, naked, and beaten with some wood.


----------



## alucardis666

So in the wake of my disappointment with this chip I am bidding on a delidded 4770k atm.... we'll see how it goes...


----------



## fleetfeather

As someone who has previously sold a used 4770k, I would never advise someone to buy one.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> As someone who has previously sold a used 4770k, I would never advise someone to buy one.


Why's that if you don't mind my asking?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Why's that if you don't mind my asking?


A lot of people run crazy voltages and don't admit to it; a lot of others will feign ignorance to get a bad chip off their hands


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> OCN name:
> CPU: 4930K
> Bare-Die TIM: Arctic Silver V
> Mhz gained: 0MHz
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz
> Temp drops: 10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/0l50it
> 
> This CPU has a soldered IHS. I put it in my BGA oven and set it to 225C. I then removed it and, while still hot, popped it into a vice and pounded it with a hammer. I wanted to run this thing bare die and I succeeded.


nicely done sir. i would ahve loved to see the die of the 2011 socket cpus..... especially since with solder you have to heat the cpu to like 600 degrees to reflow it unless you simply got lucky and it cracked the solder before the die. Just curious on my end is all. Means we need a new slot for the delidded club!!







Slappa dat Sig on! (you are currently in your own socket type I would really like to see pictures if at all possible for the OP) Also why AS5? why not CLU/P?? you'd drop even more. Just curious is all







(what cooler btw)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Did you really get a drop or are you just playing?
> I would think that a Soldered IHS would have better heat transfer then direct die.
> I do not believe 10C one bit without pictures and proof.


I can see a drop in only one way.... that would be a height reduction from the cooling unit and the bigger die size against a solid copper cold plate from the cooler.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> A lot of people run crazy voltages and don't admit to it; a lot of others will feign ignorance to get a bad chip off their hands


Gotcha. Alright then. I've retracted my bid. Shame... was really hoping for more outta the haswell. Guess I'll have to delid this one myself and see how it goes...

Here's where I'm at right now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Gotcha. Alright then. I've retracted my bid. Shame... was really hoping for more outta the haswell. Guess I'll have to delid this one myself and see how it goes...
> 
> Here's where I'm at right now.


use realtemp and cpuz. definetly cpuz for correct vcore measuring.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> use realtemp and cpuz. definetly cpuz for correct vcore measuring.


And most definately version 1.64.0 (hwinfo is actually better and more consistent AFAIK for vcore;; but check vcore, not VID)


----------



## alucardis666

I'm convinced something must be wrong with my TIM application... I tried the burn in test at 4.2 with 1.2Vcore and my temps shoot up to 105C on all cores...

What gives?


----------



## Cyro999

Linpack gets very hot on avx2 chips


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Linpack gets very hot on avx2 chips


That is an amazingly informative chart.

+Rep

I think this clears up allot of my confusion about the various stress testing programs. I have been using Aida64 CPU/FPU more recently, but it never gets as hot when I use P95, nor does Aida seem to demand the same voltage out of the chip (only by -.008). I think it is time for me to do some reading on the AVX set, cause there is obviously a gap in my knowledge here.


----------



## HardwareDecoder

well i'm done using ibt/prime95 for testing of my oc is stable ever. I decided to go down to 4.6 on my 3770k since 4.7 requires around double the offset voltage.

I ran 18 hours of p95 @ 4.6/+0.075 and it had no whea's

I'm up to 0.100 now on 4.6 and everything below it has given whea errors in BF4 so far. Seems BF4 multiplayer is the real stress test.


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> well i'm done using ibt/prime95 for testing of my oc is stable ever. I decided to go down to 4.6 on my 3770k since 4.7 requires around double the offset voltage.
> 
> I ran 18 hours of p95 @ 4.6/+0.075 and it had no whea's
> 
> I'm up to 0.100 now on 4.6 and everything below it has given whea errors in BF4 so far. Seems BF4 multiplayer is the real stress test.


Yeh I'm with you there. BF4, Sleeping Dogs, Plex Media Server, Youtube HD, and others will fail on 24HR stable setups all the time. Stress testing is basically pointless and generates huge amounts of heat that your system would never see in the first place.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HardwareDecoder*
> 
> well i'm done using ibt/prime95 for testing of my oc is stable ever. I decided to go down to 4.6 on my 3770k since 4.7 requires around double the offset voltage.
> 
> I ran 18 hours of p95 @ 4.6/+0.075 and it had no whea's
> 
> I'm up to 0.100 now on 4.6 and everything below it has given whea errors in BF4 so far. Seems BF4 multiplayer is the real stress test.


Playing games beats watching benches any day. I guess I got some BF4 to play.

Thanks.


----------



## skyn3t

Happy new year for everyone









skyn3t wishes the best for you and family.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Happy new year for everyone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> skyn3t wishes the best for you and family.


Likewise Bud, Happy New Year!


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Linpack gets very hot on avx2 chips


What about Intel Burn Test, that one is supposed to run Intel chips very hot.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> What about Intel Burn Test, that one is supposed to run Intel chips very hot.


It's IBT 2.54 on that chart.


----------



## Swag

Unless I'm stress testing for temperature only for my servers, I don't use Linpack. I don't get close to Prime95 temps even on folding on my main PC so there is no point using Linpack. IBT, sometimes I use it for checking temps just in case, but I don't see why people would go crazy to use Linpack.







I can hear their CPUs scream!


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Unless I'm stress testing for temperature only for my servers, I don't use Linpack. I don't get close to Prime95 temps even on folding on my main PC so there is no point using Linpack. IBT, sometimes I use it for checking temps just in case, but I don't see why people would go crazy to use Linpack.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can hear their CPUs scream!


both ipt and p95 smal fft have the same temps for me. but like I said other than figuring out max temps a cpu will reach, they are terrible stability tests


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is an amazingly informative chart.
> 
> +Rep
> 
> I think this clears up allot of my confusion about the various stress testing programs. I have been using Aida64 CPU/FPU more recently, but it never gets as hot when I use P95, nor does Aida seem to demand the same voltage out of the chip (only by -.008). I think it is time for me to do some reading on the AVX set, cause there is obviously a gap in my knowledge here.


AVX stress tests are pretty insane; i use x264 as a stability test now, as i use it all of the time, it's the highest load i put on my CPU (consistent near-100% usage of 8 threads, but not perfect because it's not perfectly parallel being a real life program, so usually ~90-98% as it waits for some stuff to finish on other threads) and it does use the AVX and AVX2 instruction sets (just not like linpack does); few hours of encoder version ~2377? and i've never been more than a few hairs adjustments from 24/7 game/encode/stream stable without indications of problems, so i think it's best for Haswell

The chart was the work of Darkwizzie (go rep him too! but thanks for rep)


----------



## PontiacGTX

It seems that I will have to delid the cpu(unless someone sell me a used i7 SB)...the dude fooled. Me about the selling date and sold to someone else.


----------



## XxCryptOrchidxX

OCN name: XxCryptOrchidxX
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: stock
OC after delid: stock
Temp drops: 17 °C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: stock


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skyn3t*
> 
> Happy new year for everyone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> skyn3t wishes the best for you and family.


Thank you very much sky. I hope to see this thread double in views this year








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PontiacGTX*
> 
> It seems that I will have to delid the cpu(unless someone sell me a used i7 SB)...the dude fooled. Me about the selling date and sold to someone else.


Dang man.... but I'd rather delid one myself then take a gamble on someones elses, unless they are from the club and a frequent poster.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XxCryptOrchidxX*
> 
> OCN name: XxCryptOrchidxX
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: stock
> OC after delid: stock
> Temp drops: 17 °C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: stock


You're in!







nice clean up job as well! Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> What about Intel Burn Test, that one is supposed to run Intel chips very hot.
> 
> 
> 
> It's IBT 2.54 on that chart.
Click to expand...

ah Thank you, I now feel dumb not seeing it before.


----------



## alucardis666

Found the Razor I needed today at work for the delid!!!!





MX4 used on the die to the IHS and as well as on the IHS both using the line method.

Temps dropped 12C at idle.

Gonna start clocking now.


----------



## fleetfeather

If any Aussies are chasing some blades for delidding, hit me up. I've got a ten pack of blades from my successful delid just sitting around the house. Pay for postage and they're yours lol


----------



## alucardis666

Is it possible a chip just can;t go past a certain multi? I can't even post at anything above 4.5.... and this is with pumping 1.46Volts through her...


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Is it possible a chip just can;t go past a certain multi? I can't even post at anything above 4.5.... and this is with pumping 1.46Volts through her...


wow that is a bad chip then


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Is it possible a chip just can;t go past a certain multi? I can't even post at anything above 4.5.... and this is with pumping 1.46Volts through her...


Yep, that is entirely possible


----------



## alucardis666

Damn... guess I'll have to settle at 4.5 :-/


----------



## HardwareDecoder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Damn... guess I'll have to settle at 4.5 :-/


don't feel bad my chip can seemingly do 4.6 @ +0.100 offset but 4.7 takes atleast +0.200 your wall is at 4.5 mine is at 4.6 no biggie.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Damn... guess I'll have to settle at 4.5 :-/


Keep your head up; a 4770k at 4.2ghz = a 3770k at 4.5ghz.

Settling for 4.5 must be equal to around 5.0ghz on a 3770k (that's a guess)


----------



## alucardis666

I might've spoke too soon. Just got into windows at 4.6...

There may just be some hope yet... However it's probably safe to say that 4.7 is out of my reach.

Nnm... 4.6 BSOD... and it only booted at 1.4v.... which is outta my comfort zone... I'm running 4.5 now at 1.36V.

I can haz add to list?

CPU: i7-4770k
On die - AC MX 4
IHS-TIM: AC MX 4
Mhz gained: 100Mhz
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: 12C Idle Load TBD.
CPU-Z validation


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> I might've spoke too soon. Just got into windows at 4.6...
> 
> There may just be some hope yet... However it's probably safe to say that 4.7 is out of my reach.
> 
> Nnm... 4.6 BSOD... and it only booted at 1.4v.... which is outta my comfort zone... I'm running 4.5 now at 1.36V.
> 
> I can haz add to list?
> 
> CPU: i7-4770k
> On die - AC MX 4
> IHS-TIM: AC MX 4
> Mhz gained: 100Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: 12C Idle Load TBD.
> CPU-Z validation


You can haz add to list







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## alucardis666

YAY!!!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Is it possible a chip just can;t go past a certain multi? I can't even post at anything above 4.5.... and this is with pumping 1.46Volts through her...


What kind of VRIN are you using? 2.1?

If you're using stock which is like 1.7v then good look getting anywhere with a 0.24v vcore delta lol (my stable 4.7 requires a ~>0.6 delta)


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> I might've spoke too soon. Just got into windows at 4.6...
> 
> There may just be some hope yet... However it's probably safe to say that 4.7 is out of my reach.
> 
> Nnm... 4.6 BSOD... and it only booted at 1.4v.... which is outta my comfort zone... I'm running 4.5 now at 1.36V.
> 
> I can haz add to list?
> 
> CPU: i7-4770k
> On die - AC MX 4
> IHS-TIM: AC MX 4
> Mhz gained: 100Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: 12C Idle Load TBD.
> CPU-Z validation


Did you maybe start to high with your voltage for 4.6?
I know that when i used to try with High Vcores, it would not boot and putting it lower and lower made it more stable.
Know i just start from 1.00V On IVY and work my way up slowly, go 4.4 @ 1.095V and im currently at 5Ghz 1.375V


----------



## naved777

Finally !


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Socks keep you warm*
> 
> Did you maybe start to high with your voltage for 4.6?
> I know that when i used to try with High Vcores, it would not boot and putting it lower and lower made it more stable.
> Know i just start from 1.00V On IVY and work my way up slowly, go 4.4 @ 1.095V and im currently at 5Ghz 1.375V


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> What kind of VRIN are you using? 2.1?
> 
> If you're using stock which is like 1.7v then good look getting anywhere with a 0.24v vcore delta lol (my stable 4.7 requires a ~>0.6 delta)


I'll try working my way back up then. and Vrin i believe is set to auto.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> Finally !


Nicely done!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> I'll try working my way back up then. and Vrin i believe is set to auto.


You can't just adjust vcore and nothing else and expect a high overlock (1.4v) to work; no wonder you see issues


----------



## RagingCain

Anybody with 3770 / 4770 delid and a Heatkiller REV 3.0 waterblock direct-to-die experience?

I noticed that removing the springs and retention bracket, the waterblock can sit perfectly on the die with no accessories needed.

While I am just over finger tight myself (there is no spring load so I am being very careful to apply tension equally), I am very curious to see if anybody purchased any nuts/bolts from hardware stores for a more secure fitting?

3770K @ 4.89 GHz @ 1.314v @ 60c load (max of my hottest core, lowest is 49c, average about 55c)

ICDiamond was the TIM between Waterblock and Die.

End result is approximately a 35c drop in Prime 95 Small FFT temperature (temp after 5minutes).


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You can't just adjust vcore and nothing else and expect a high overlock (1.4v) to work; no wonder you see issues


Well what would you suggest? ahaha


----------



## Cyro999

Read a half decent guide like the one on the oc.net haswell overclocking thread (darkwizzie's) and use basics like vcore/vrin + vrin LLC with turned down uncore and RAM first. and also read my posts on the last page here


----------



## Keyzman

CPU: i7-4770k
On die: CLU
IHS-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: 300Mhz
OC after delid: 4.6 GHz
Temp drops: 17C Load


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Keyzman*
> 
> CPU: i7-4770k
> On die - CLU
> IHS-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 300Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.6 GHz
> Temp drops: 17C Load


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Cyro999

Slappa dat sig on >.>

maybe i should hear those words some day


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Slappa dat sig on >.>
> 
> maybe i should hear those words some day


did you put a sub up? if so where is it so the blind vagur can add you


----------



## Cyro999

Nah, i didn't delid. Bought CLU with my 4770k, hitting £275 cpu with hammer would make me feel funny









If i has more money..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Nah, i didn't delid. Bought CLU with my 4770k, hitting £275 cpu with hammer would make me feel funny
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If i has more money..


doet...doet with razer doet doet doet...uh doet


----------



## alucardis666

Btw I just made a new thread about my OC adventuring if anyone is interested... please check it out over here...

http://www.overclock.net/t/1455978/4770k-maximus-hero-overclocking-to-4-6ghz


----------



## xweemanx

I think I'm made a collosal screw up Iv deldded my i5 3570k and have had to clock it back to default as my temps are massive like.. 39idle an I I freaked out when it spiked at 104 so stopped it immediately have I ruined it


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> I think I'm made a collosal screw up Iv deldded my i5 3570k and have had to clock it back to default as my temps are massive like.. 39idle an I I freaked out when it spiked at 104 so stopped it immediately have I ruined it


Maybe too much TIM?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> I think I'm made a collosal screw up Iv deldded my i5 3570k and have had to clock it back to default as my temps are massive like.. 39idle an I I freaked out when it spiked at 104 so stopped it immediately have I ruined it


What type of cooling solution do you use? If you can boot, then you have not screwed up your delliding, probably just your cooler mounting. Try reinstalling your CPU and cooler, and like alucardis666 hinted at, make sure you do not use more TIM than you need.


----------



## Socks keep you warm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> I think I'm made a collosal screw up Iv deldded my i5 3570k and have had to clock it back to default as my temps are massive like.. 39idle an I I freaked out when it spiked at 104 so stopped it immediately have I ruined it


Too much thermal paste or not enough!
Took me a solid 10 proper reseats to get the temps i wanted!
First i was hitting 105C On Delid at 5Ghz Custom loop.
Now i'm at 76C Tops








Just keep on reseating you will get it eventually.

EDIT: 76C On LINX BTW


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> I think I'm made a collosal screw up Iv deldded my i5 3570k and have had to clock it back to default as my temps are massive like.. 39idle an I I freaked out when it spiked at 104 so stopped it immediately have I ruined it


what TIM and how much??? what cooler and ambient temps the more info the more help we can give.


----------



## Balanar

Got 2 chips, 3770K & 4670K, coming in tonight after being delidded by a professional here locally. They were brand new and sealed so I don't have 'before' temps but I will some 'after' temps soon!


----------



## fleetfeather

"delidded by a professional" = ?


----------



## alucardis666

Professional Delidding?! Pfffft. I ought to get in on that Racket. did mine in 3 minutes once I had the right type of blade... haha


----------



## Balanar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Professional Delidding?! Pfffft. I ought to get in on that Racket. did mine in 3 minutes once I had the right type of blade... haha


Well I should have clarified. By professional I simply meant he has done it several times for members locally. Not like he claims to be an expert.


----------



## xweemanx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what TIM and how much??? what cooler and ambient temps the more info the more help we can give.


h100i and cheap thermal compound


----------



## xweemanx

27degrees ambient


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> h100i and cheap thermal compound


use CLU/P under the IHS and better TIM on top of the IHS


----------



## xweemanx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> use CLU/P under the IHS and better TIM on top of the IHS


I'm sorry u just lost me there


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> I'm sorry u just lost me there


he's saying to use Coolaboratory Liquid Pro or Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra between the cpu die and the metal heatspreader, and to use a quality thermal paste on top of the metal heatspreader


----------



## xweemanx

Thanks will arctic silver 5 do on both till I can get clp/u stuff?


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> Thanks will arctic silver 5 do on both till I can get clp/u stuff?


It will do, temporarily. Over time (could be a day, could be couple of weeks) there will occur pump out causing your temps to skyrocket.


----------



## neofury

Don't use AS5 trust me, just a waste of time and effort. Get the CLU ASAP.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> It will do, temporarily. Over time (could be a day, could be couple of weeks) there will occur pump out causing your temps to skyrocket.


How long does this take? I've had mine on a couple months and haven't noticed anything. So I'm guessing it takes longer than that? Why does it pump out?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> How long does this take? I've had mine on a couple months and haven't noticed anything. So I'm guessing it takes longer than that? Why does it pump out?


its dependent on the TIM batch itself and what occurs is that with the pressure of the cooler on the IHS that pressure slowly over time pushes your TIM out making it much thinner and eventually to thin to work properly the temps slowly rise over time so its kinda hard to notice.


----------



## rabidz7

Just run it bare-die.


----------



## Jetskyer

Even when running bare-die you'll have pump out over time.


----------



## naved777

at Idle i am getting almost 10c difference between core 2 and core 3,4
not that its new because there was same 10c difference before deliding
thought deliding would solve that so is this normal or should i apply CLU again ?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> at Idle i am getting almost 10c difference between core 2 and core 3,4
> not that its new because there was same 10c difference before deliding
> thought deliding would solve that so is this normal or should i apply CLU again ?


Are you getting the same spread under full load? at idle I wouldnt much worry about it. The sensors are less acurate the further they are from TJMax, and you could also have some level of background task keeping a thread dinging that one core. At full load, 10C is worth trying to normalize, but not worth loosing sleep over if a solid reseat doesnt take care of it. I have a 10C gap, no biggie. Your temps look fine.


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xweemanx*
> 
> Thanks will arctic silver 5 do on both till I can get clp/u stuff?


It shouldn't take that long. I ordered CLU through FrozenCPU and shipping USPS took only 3 days to Hawaii. Gonna be delidding tonight after I write my essay.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> at Idle i am getting almost 10c difference between core 2 and core 3,4
> not that its new because there was same 10c difference before deliding
> thought deliding would solve that so is this normal or should i apply CLU again ?


sometimes thats just normal but it might be worth a shot to see if your ambients can get closer. I'd leave it as delidding is mainly for the load temps and seeing yours and how close together they are is perfectly fine.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> at Idle i am getting almost 10c difference between core 2 and core 3,4
> not that its new because there was same 10c difference before deliding
> thought deliding would solve that so is this normal or should i apply CLU again ?
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> I read this the other day it is very interesting facts about temps
> Inedenimadam is right the further from TJmax the sensors can be any thing upto 10+/- degrees from actual
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/476469/the-truth-about-temperatures-and-voltages/0_20
Click to expand...


----------



## MillerLite1314

just did the delid and my temps skyrocketed on my 3570k. Gonna have to pull the ihs back off and reapply CLU. it shifted on my when I was trying to seat the IHS and might have ruined the integrity of the CLU.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Why do all these people put an IHS back on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? RUN IT FREAKING BARE DIE!!!


Because not everyone has a mounting system for a bare die, or wants to risk cracking it over pretty minimal temp gains (all things considered)?


----------



## rabidz7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Because not everyone has a mounting system for a bare die, or wants to risk cracking it over pretty minimal temp gains (all things considered)?


I use PowerPC CPUs and I've never cracked a die. Only someone who doesn't know what they are doing would damage the die.


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Why do all these people put an IHS back on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? RUN IT FREAKING BARE DIE!!!


Edit: run it bare with my H80i? Maybe when i upgrade to an EK kit in the spring with a direct die hardware pack. Until then keep that **** to yourself unless you have some helpful advice


----------



## rabidz7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MillerLite1314*
> 
> Edit: run it bare with my H80i? Maybe when i upgrade to an EK kit in the spring with a direct die hardware pack. Until then keep that **** to yourself unless you have some helpful advice


Tape the CPU to the socket and attach the 'sink as normal.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> I use PowerPC CPUs and I've never cracked a die. Only someone who doesn't know what they are doing would damage the die.


So you're making that judgement based on your completely irrelevant experience with PowerPCs?


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Tape the CPU to the socket and attach the 'sink as normal.


... wow


----------



## rabidz7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> So you're making that judgement based on your completely irrelevant experience with PowerPCs?


x86 and PowerPC are similar enough to compare heatsinks.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Why do all these people put an IHS back on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? RUN IT FREAKING BARE DIE!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Because not everyone has a mounting system for a bare die, or wants to risk cracking it over pretty minimal temp gains (all things considered)?
Click to expand...

For 5 bucks, EK offers the bare die kit...I have to admit, it does seem kind of silly that so many would undertake such a HUGE risk of dellidling, but not take the few extra steps to run bare die. It really is not that complicated, nor is it all that risky. Even if you dont have a block compatible with the EK naked kit, all you have to do is figure out how to get the block closer to the die by the thickness of the IHS, maybe a smidge more for good mounting pressure. Could be as simple as adding a couple washers to the backplate, or buying shorter screws. With Haswell having some exposed stuff under the IHS, a little more care should go into ensure that you dont cause a short with the block, but that is what they make liquid electrical tape for!!!

For gods sake...we took razor blades and hammers to our CPUs...getting a good direct mount seems a whole lot less dangerous.


----------



## MillerLite1314

Just realized my clu had a crack in the tube. It was small though so i dont think it could have any effect on the compound itself.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> For 5 bucks, EK offers the bare die kit...I have to admit, it does seem kind of silly that so many would undertake such a HUGE risk of dellidling, but not take the few extra steps to run bare die. It really is not that complicated, nor is it all that risky. Even if you dont have a block compatible with the EK naked kit, all you have to do is figure out how to get the block closer to the die by the thickness of the IHS, maybe a smidge more for good mounting pressure. Could be as simple as adding a couple washers to the backplate, or buying shorter screws. With Haswell having some exposed stuff under the IHS, a little more care should go into ensure that you dont cause a short with the block, but that is what they make liquid electrical tape for!!!


Isn't that kit only for the Supremacy block though?

For most people it just isn't worth the hassle and risk of making some kind of do-it-yourself mounting system for a normal cooler/block that's only going to knock a couple of more degrees off the temps.


----------



## rabidz7

I have a delidded 4930. I duct taped that CPU and put a Kraken X60 on like if it was never delidded.


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> I have a delidded 4930. I duct taped that CPU and put a Kraken X60 on like if it was never delidded.


thats good for you. I dont want to do that so dont flame me because i want better temps without putting duct tape on my hardware.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> For 5 bucks, EK offers the bare die kit...I have to admit, it does seem kind of silly that so many would undertake such a HUGE risk of dellidling, but not take the few extra steps to run bare die. It really is not that complicated, nor is it all that risky. Even if you dont have a block compatible with the EK naked kit, all you have to do is figure out how to get the block closer to the die by the thickness of the IHS, maybe a smidge more for good mounting pressure. Could be as simple as adding a couple washers to the backplate, or buying shorter screws. With Haswell having some exposed stuff under the IHS, a little more care should go into ensure that you dont cause a short with the block, but that is what they make liquid electrical tape for!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't that only for the Supremacy block though?
> 
> For most people it just isn't worth the hassle and risk of making some kind of do-it-yourself mounting system for a normal cooler/block that's only going to knock a couple of more degrees off the temps.
Click to expand...

yeah,the 5 dollar kit is only for the supremacy...but for about the same at the hardware store you could do a h100 like this:



tighten it down cross-corner evenly until it boots.

You are correct about the benefits though, only a few degrees better, but again.,we just attacked our CPUs with destructive tools for better temperatures...the risk and reward are all relative.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> I have a delidded 4930. I duct taped that CPU and put a Kraken X60 on like if it was never delidded.


still wanna see pictures... also the die of that cpu..... show us how its done so we can teach others!


----------



## mav2000

Any idea on the glue that is used to reattach the shim back to the chip?

I have been running de lidded for almost a year now with impressive results, but just thought I would get an idea on the glue that some may have used. Also with the glue, has anyone seen temps move back up, as the glue will add a small layer between the die and the shim


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mav2000*
> 
> Any idea on the glue that is used to reattach the shim back to the chip?
> 
> I have been running de lidded for almost a year now with impressive results, but just thought I would get an idea on the glue that some may have used. Also with the glue, has anyone seen temps move back up, as the glue will add a small layer between the die and the shim


why would you re glue it?


----------



## Lance01

My Delid results. Just some quick results I did not run any elaborate tests. I cut the corners with a razor blade and then used a vice to tap it off easily. When I put it back together I used CLU for both. I was using Arctic Silver 5 before the delid.

I7-4770K at 4.5 ghz
H100i (Closed water loop)
Aida 64 FPU only - 10 minutes.
Before 87, 87, 85, 77
After 66, 65, 65, 62

Lance


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lance01*
> 
> My Delid results. Just some quick results I did not run any elaborate tests. I cut the corners with a razor blade and then used a vice to tap it off easily. When I put it back together I used CLU for both. I was using Arctic Silver 5 before the delid.
> 
> I7-4770K at 4.5 ghz
> H100i (Closed water loop)
> Aida 64 FPU only - 10 minutes.
> Before 87, 87, 85, 77
> After 66, 65, 65, 62
> 
> Lance


nice temp drops!

crewman listing up on the op for you guys??


----------



## FtW 420

I don't see any member's list under the heading for it.


----------



## Lance01

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nice temp drops!
> 
> crewman listing up on the op for you guys??


Thanks, and thank you for the walk through!

I will see if I can get a higher overclock out of it eventually.

Settings right now are as follows - Stable for 8 hours a few nights back

CPU Ratio 45
Ring Ratio 42
CPU Core 1.27
Ring Voltage 1.18


----------



## ClaggyPants

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> why would you re glue it?


I'd be happy enough to re-glue mine. The chip has now been de-lidded, CLU applied and temps dropped. I dont need the hassle of every time I remove the CPU having to re-align the IHS. I know that's a bit anti-OCN but honestly I like the convenience of being able to remove a processor and not have to worry about it falling into 2 pieces.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ClaggyPants*
> 
> I'd be happy enough to re-glue mine. The chip has now been de-lidded, CLU applied and temps dropped. I dont need the hassle of every time I remove the CPU having to re-align the IHS. I know that's a bit anti-OCN but honestly I like the convenience of being able to remove a processor and not have to worry about it falling into 2 pieces.


4 dab's one in each corner


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 4 dab's one in each corner


Thanks for the tip!


----------



## MillerLite1314

removed IHS again, reapplied CLU, reseated IHS, AS5 and reseated cooler and temps still aren't normalizing. Used the half grain of rice method with the CLU this time instead of the brush but still getting crap.

Edit: running out of CLU and I know for a fact that the PCB isn't scratched.


----------



## RagingCain

I just wanted to confirm since I couldn't get any info on it before hand. The Heatkiller CPU Rev 3.0 block and it's screws fit perfectly without the springs and the retention bracket removed for direct to die.

You just have to manually adjust tension evenly.


----------



## MillerLite1314

This is where I'm at now running prime95 blend tests at stock settings and I'm out of CLU. Bout to place another order for two more tubes and try and figure this thing out.


----------



## rabidz7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MillerLite1314*
> 
> 
> 
> This is where I'm at now running prime95 blend tests at stock settings and I'm out of CLU. Bout to place another order for two more tubes and try and figure this thing out.


Do dis bare-die!


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Do dis bare-die!


Do you have before and after shots of bare die temps?


----------



## Hanshin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MillerLite1314*
> 
> 
> 
> This is where I'm at now running prime95 blend tests at stock settings and I'm out of CLU. Bout to place another order for two more tubes and try and figure this thing out.


Just out of curiosity, did you clean the black glue on the chip and IHS after delidding? If not, it may be the problem.


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> Just out of curiosity, did you clean the black glue on the chip and IHS after delidding? If not, it may be the problem.


i got most of it off the ihs except for little specs on the inside of the rim. On the pcb the only thing left is an outline of where the glue was.


----------



## Hanshin

You want the IHs to seat as flat as possible, the gap created by the black glue being the problem. Maybe try to clean the IHS one more time.
Also, if you have another TIM (like MX-4), give it a try.
How did you you delid your CPU? Have you damaged/bent the IHS or the PCB?


----------



## alucardis666

Would there be any reason why I can't run with the IHS off and my H100 strapped direct to the die? I tried it once and couldn't get my system to detect the cpu... put the IHS back and everything works... My load temps are a a bit high so I was debating running without the IHS...

Any advice?


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> You want the IHs to seat as flat as possible, the gap created by the black glue being the problem. Maybe try to clean the IHS one more time.
> Also, if you have another TIM (like MX-4), give it a try.
> How did you you delid your CPU? Have you damaged/bent the IHS or the PCB?


I used razer blade method. Pretty sure the pcb is still straight. The lip on the ihs is completely clean but I'll pull it again and reclean the ihs entirely along with pcb. All i have left is some AS5 but I'll soon be out of that also.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Would there be any reason why I can't run with the IHS off and my H100 strapped direct to the die? I tried it once and couldn't get my system to detect the cpu... put the IHS back and everything works... My load temps are a a bit high so I was debating running without the IHS...
> 
> Any advice?


My idle temp is between 36-40C and ambient room temp is about 25-26C But loading in P95 my CPU hits 100C within 5 minutes of running.

Gaming though it never goes about 77C. What do you all think?


----------



## Hanshin

Well, try first to clean the IHS with sand paper/alcohol/credit card and be sure there is no glue anymore at the corners.
A friend of mine had the same problem and it appeared it was the problem.

If the problem is not resolved, try to replace the CLU with AS5.

Also, what do you use between the IHS and the CPU cooler? AS5 or CLU?


----------



## Hanshin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> My idle temp is between 36-40C and ambient room temp is about 25-26C But loading in P95 my CPU hits 100C within 5 minutes of running.
> 
> Gaming though it never goes about 77C. What do you all think?


Same as MillerLite1314. Make sure there is contact between the die and the IHS. Did you carefully removed all the black glue? What TIM do you use on the die? On the IHS?

Edit: sorry for the double post.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> Well, try first to clean the IHS with sand paper/alcohol/credit card and be sure there is no glue anymore at the corners.
> A friend of mine had the same problem and it appeared it was the problem.
> 
> If the problem is not resolved, try to replace the CLU with AS5.
> 
> Also, what do you use between the IHS and the CPU cooler? AS5 or CLU?


MX-4 on the Die and the IHS I got all the stock paste off but not much of the glue...


----------



## fa5terba11

Can I still join this group if I didn't document what my temps were before I delidded? I read the tips on this forum and jumped right in. I now cool a bare die with my naked ivy bridge mount from ek and my temps are amazing!


----------



## Hanshin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> MX-4 on the Die and the IHS I got all the stock paste off but not much of the glue...


You have to remove all the glue on both PCB and IHS to make sure there is contact between die and IHS. You can take it off with a credit card/ flat head screwdriver, it is very easy.









http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj163/idontcare_photo_bucket/Intel%20Core%20i7-3770K/Deliddedpre-cleanup.jpg


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fa5terba11*
> 
> Can I still join this group if I didn't document what my temps were before I delidded? I read the tips on this forum and jumped right in. I now cool a bare die with my naked ivy bridge mount from ek and my temps are amazing!


your more than fine


----------



## MillerLite1314

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> Well, try first to clean the IHS with sand paper/alcohol/credit card and be sure there is no glue anymore at the corners.
> A friend of mine had the same problem and it appeared it was the problem.
> 
> If the problem is not resolved, try to replace the CLU with AS5.
> 
> Also, what do you use between the IHS and the CPU cooler? AS5 or CLU?


AS5. I had read CLP & CLU were the best for the die. First reseat the core temps were all uneven so i knew the IHS wasnt making contact because the temps were 20C apart on each core in descending order. This last reseat makes me think it is more glue from what i just read on another forum.


----------



## Hanshin

Yeah, the glue can be a problem if not removed carefully. Just take your time and verify one more time.









For the TIM, you might want to try something between the IHS and the cooler. AS is getting old, and you will find better for less money.
For the die, CLU is the best, no doubt!


----------



## MillerLite1314

Ok i'll look around. Maybe prolimatech or gelid.


----------



## Hanshin

MX-4 and Gelid GC-extreme would be my first choices.


----------



## MillerLite1314

Will do


----------



## alucardis666

Alright, so... Took out the CPU, cleaned off all the gunk and reapplies MX-4 to both sides of the IHS and my idle temp dropped another 2C and Load in P95 after 10 minutes is now at 77C @ 4.4 with 1.344V.

Guess that did the trick.

Thank you!


----------



## Hanshin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Alright, so... Took out the CPU, cleaned off all the gunk and reapplies MX-4 to both sides of the IHS and my idle temp dropped another 2C and Load in P95 after 10 minutes is now at 77C @ 4.4 with 1.344V.
> 
> Guess that did the trick.
> 
> Thank you!


Sounds great!

Happy you resolved your problem!


----------



## alucardis666

Thanks. +Rep Given


----------



## fleetfeather

I personally found (by accident) that having some residue CLP between where the PCB and IHS meet lowered temps a few degrees. It may be margin of error, but I think it might be facilitating further heat transfer away from the die


----------



## fa5terba11

So my little corner work space at home gets really cold. Occasionally I would run Intel Burn Test just to warm my corner up a bit. In reality it probably didn't warm the anything but mentally I thought I could feel the warm exhaust. Since I delidded, however and removed the IHS to cool the die directly, I no longer feel the warmth of the exhaust. If it's there it fades too quickly to begin to feel it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fa5terba11*
> 
> So my little corner work space at home gets really cold. Occasionally I would run Intel Burn Test just to warm my corner up a bit. In reality it probably didn't warm the anything but mentally I thought I could feel the warm exhaust. Since I delidded, however and removed the IHS to cool the die directly, I no longer feel the warmth of the exhaust. If it's there it fades too quickly to begin to feel it.


I'm not sorry for your coldness!


----------



## alucardis666

Played "Remember Me" for 3 hours highest temp CPU reached at 4.4 with 1.337 volts was 85C. is this Ok? Figured it'd be much cooler.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Played "Remember Me" for 3 hours highest temp CPU reached at 4.4 with 1.337 volts was 85C. is this Ok? Figured it'd be much cooler.


I'm just curious why your only running 4.4 and your pumping in 1.337v? That seems like a lot of voltage for only 4.4. Either your got screwed in the silicon lottery, or you might be pushing to much volts for that OC. I would hate to see temps in the 80+ range just gaming!


----------



## alucardis666

Sadly it seems necessary with my chip. It's a super crappy clocker.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Sadly it seems necessary with my chip. It's a super crappy clocker.


Did you know that before you did your delid? Personally, I would have sold that thing off and bought another. What's the CPU?? 4670k 4770k??


----------



## alucardis666

No I did not. And yes it's a 4770K. System specs are in my sig.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> No I did not. And yes it's a 4770K. System specs are in my sig.


On mobile ATM, so no sigs. But, I would look at the delid again and see if it's making the proper contact between IHS and die, and reapply TIM to both as needed. Just my two cents.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> On mobile ATM, so no sigs. But, I would look at the delid again and see if it's making the proper contact between IHS and die, and reapply TIM to both as needed. Just my two cents.


Yup. Sadly I've already done this 4x lol. This seems to be the best I'll get.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Yup. Sadly I've already done this 4x lol. This seems to be the best I'll get.


Wow, ok. Well, I'm sorry that that proc is such a crummy OC'er for you. I'm putting together another system right now, thinking about delid for it, and it is a 4770k, so I'll let you know and the rest here in this club know how it goes. Good luck to ya'.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Wow, ok. Well, I'm sorry that that proc is such a crummy OC'er for you. I'm putting together another system right now, thinking about delid for it, and it is a 4770k, so I'll let you know and the rest here in this club know how it goes. Good luck to ya'.


Ya, Thanks bud. I can push 4.5 but it needs 1.42V... and I'm just not down for that. lol.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Ya, Thanks bud. I can push 4.5 but it needs 1.42V... and I'm just not down for that. lol.


Ouch, I wouldn't be either.


----------



## alucardis666

Truth be told I Think 4.2 would be the optimum OC for me given the heat this thing is spitting out. Just hard to justify that when I just upgraded from a 4.6Ghz 2600k... Was hopping this chip would at least do 4.6, ideally hit 4.8... but that seems to be a pipe dream.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Truth be told I Think 4.2 would be the optimum OC for me given the heat this thing is spitting out. Just hard to justify that when I just upgraded from a 4.6Ghz 2600k... Was hopping this chip would at least do 4.6, ideally hit 4.8... but that seems to be a pipe dream.


Yeah, Haswell sucks at OC compared to IB/SB, I've got a 2700K that runs @5.5 stable with 1.29v, my 3770k will only do 4.8, but that's with 1.41v, I can push it to 4.9/1.43, but it gets really hot REALLY fast. I haven't run my 4770k yet, and my 4670k is in a Maximus 6 Impact in a Silverstone SG05 case and I only have a 450w psu in it, so I've only pushed it to 4.6/1.35v, any more and it makes the psu shut down due to pulling to much juice, it's a mobile gamer, so there is an OC'ed 780Ti in with it, lol. Hoping I can get a 600w for it soon.


----------



## alucardis666

5.5 huh? That's really impressive...

Part of me thinks maybe I should play with a speedstep OC to push it further and cut back on the heat...


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> 5.5 huh? That's really impressive...
> 
> Part of me thinks maybe I should play with a speedstep OC to push it further and cut back on the heat...


Lol, yeah, the 2700k's ALL seemed to be cherry picked by intel, at stock it was 3.5Ghz and it did that at 0.98v, so I knew it was gonna OC well.

I'm not sure about Speedstep OC, I guess it could be beneficial, I've always got it turned off, C states also, I have my procs run at full speed OC while on. Not good for electric bill, but, oh well, I don't run them for hours a day usually.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Lol, yeah, the 2700k's ALL seemed to be cherry picked by intel, at stock it was 3.5Ghz and it did that at 0.98v, so I knew it was gonna OC well.
> 
> I'm not sure about Speedstep OC, I guess it could be beneficial, I've always got it turned off, C states also, I have my procs run at full speed OC while on. Not good for electric bill, but, oh well, I don't run them for hours a day usually.


Well my PC is usually on 24/7 so I think it could be wins all around if I can get 3.8 - 4.6Ghz on demand. Just need to play with it I guess...


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Lol, yeah, the 2700k's ALL seemed to be cherry picked by intel, at stock it was 3.5Ghz and it did that at 0.98v, so I knew it was gonna OC well.


my pretty average 4770k does 4ghz at like ~1.05v, 3.5 @1.0v is np np, 5.5 stable on air below 1.3v though? dafuq?







pics?


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> my pretty average 4770k does 4ghz at like ~1.05v, 3.5 @1.0v is np np, 5.5 stable on air below 1.3v though? dafuq?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pics?


I never said that was on AIR, that's under an EK supremacy block. I'll post a screen shot when I get it back from my friend, it's been relegated to a backup machine as it's only got 2 580's in it. I'm letting him use it while we build his new rig.


----------



## alucardis666

Alright here's what I did... I set the max CPU volt in the Bios to be 1.38V and set it to adaptive rather than manual. bumped my OC up to 4.5Ghz and set the cache min to be 43 and the max to 45 and sync all cores... Now in windows went the power options and set the cpu min to be 88% and the max left at 100. Temps are down to 26C at idle and I gained an extra 100mhz with the adaptive vcore and cache and speed step on, and so far I haven't seen the cpu drop below 3.2Ghz.

This seems pretty awesome IMO. I'm gonna try and push for 4.6 and see how it goes.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Alright here's what I did... I set the max CPU volt in the Bios to be 1.38V and set it to adaptive rather than manual. bumped my OC up to 4.5Ghz and set the cache min to be 43 and the max to 45 and sync all cores... Now in windows went the power options and set the cpu min to be 88% and the max left at 100. Temps are down to 26C at idle and I gained an extra 100mhz with the adaptive vcore and cache and speed step on, and so far I haven't seen the cpu drop below 3.2Ghz.
> 
> This seems pretty awesome IMO. I'm gonna try and push for 4.6 and see how it goes.


Watch the voltage - some boards don't respect the max voltage setting in adaptive and will blow crazy high voltages through the chip.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Watch the voltage - some boards don't respect the max voltage setting in adaptive and will blow crazy high voltages through the chip.


Noted. Will keep an eye on it.


----------



## Cyro999

1.38v adaptive is dangerous it can just flash into the upper 1.5 range; there's no room for "hey does this load increase my vcore" type testing. If possible just don't use it at all. If somebody said "I accidentally killed my 4770k, guess how" then i would put most of my money onto having ~1.3-1.4vcore on adaptive mode. Very very dodgy stuff.


----------



## fleetfeather

a friend of mine OC'd his 4770k and thought he was stable at a certain frequency with a certain voltage. But he did all his testing with half his cores parked (rofl). Is he going to run into potential stability issues now that he's unparked the cores?


----------



## Cyro999

Cores will unpark under multithreaded stress, or at least they are supposed to.. Performance stuff with parking/unparking is often down to them not unparking super easily, but that's in a situation like playing bf4, not really like hitting cinebench or prime. TBH 4770k at any overclock has like 5 watt idle anyway so there's little reason for a feature that can hurt performance or be annoying

I have different settings for ht stable vs non-ht stable, so if he's testing 4c/4t somehow without the cores unparking, maybe slight tweaks needed. I don't know what kind of multithreaded stability test would not unpark cores, though o.0


----------



## fleetfeather

ahh makes sense. I had him using x264 so, as you said, the parked cores probably got unparked. I've got him running x264 again tonight to check for stability. Ill let everyone know if he comes up with any instability as a result of this change.


----------



## Cyro999

If he had parked cores, he'd be scoring like an i5 on x264 and cinebench. I've seen parked cores be ignored with lower CPU loads though (like 60% across four cores on x264 live encode) at times where it adversely affected performance


----------



## vieuxchnock

*I bought a "EKWB - EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy" should I use Coolaboratory Ultra or another Tim on the naked die? (MX-4 or Gelid CG)*


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vieuxchnock*
> 
> *I bought a "EKWB - EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy" should I use Coolaboratory Ultra or another Tim on the naked die? (MX-4 or Gelid CG)*


CLU will give better temps, but be aware...it a pain in the rear to get off the block. I saw 3-4c better with Ultra over Gelid with direct die.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Why's that if you don't mind my asking?


It depends on the seller honestly, I have sold a few delid chips on ebay that performed really well and didnt have crazy voltages.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Is it possible a chip just can;t go past a certain multi? I can't even post at anything above 4.5.... and this is with pumping 1.46Volts through her...


I would say check your settings, from experience more volts dont necesarily mean a higher multi, I have gotten many chips past 4.6 in less than 1.4v fiddling with other things where if I just pushed the vcore to 1.4 or above they wouldnt budge past 4.5.


----------



## bond32

Def possible. I have mine stable at 4.8 ghz with 1.44 vcore. I tried hard for 49x, but won't go over 1.5 vcore which I think it needed if at all.


----------



## RickRockerr

No more direct die for me....
My 3570k is dead, or not literally but I cant get picture with pci-e so it's dead to me








I tested with another 3570k and it works perfectly and when I looked the cpu it was really badly bend.
I tried to get it work for 2 days but nothing so I guess I'll just buy new 3570K.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> No more direct die for me....
> My 3570k is dead, or not literally but I cant get picture with pci-e so it's dead to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tested with another 3570k and it works perfectly and when I looked the cpu it was really badly bend.
> I tried to get it work for 2 days but nothing so I guess I'll just buy new 3570K.


How did you kill it?

Just saw that it was bent. So you think it is not making contact with all the pins? What method of direct die mounting did you use?


----------



## RickRockerr

Ek's naked ivy set. There is no good connection or there is micro fracture in the cpu


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Yeah, Haswell sucks at OC compared to IB/SB, I've got a 2700K that runs @5.5 stable with 1.29v, my 3770k will only do 4.8, but that's with 1.41v, I can push it to 4.9/1.43, but it gets really hot REALLY fast. I haven't run my 4770k yet, and my 4670k is in a Maximus 6 Impact in a Silverstone SG05 case and I only have a 450w psu in it, so I've only pushed it to 4.6/1.35v, any more and it makes the psu shut down due to pulling to much juice, it's a mobile gamer, so there is an OC'ed 780Ti in with it, lol. Hoping I can get a 600w for it soon.


Sandy has lower max overclocks though, my 2600k can do 59x, & doesn't OC as high as my 3770k, 4770k or 4670k, & scores lower even with a higher overclock.
For any of them, you do have to find good silicon for better clocks though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> No more direct die for me....
> My 3570k is dead, or not literally but I cant get picture with pci-e so it's dead to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tested with another 3570k and it works perfectly and when I looked the cpu it was really badly bend.
> I tried to get it work for 2 days but nothing so I guess I'll just buy new 3570K.


If tightening the direct die enough to bend the cpu PCB, I hope the pins in the socket are OK...


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Ek's naked ivy set. There is no good connection or there is micro fracture in the cpu


You should try to put back the IHS and have it spread the pressure more evenly on the PCB to see if you can get good contact again. My first de-lid had that issue and that is how I fixed it after a while I was able to go back to direct die but did not tighten the bolts all the way down.


----------



## RickRockerr

Already tried that but nothing :/ I think that if I cant get this to work I will buy 2600k or 2700k


----------



## vieuxchnock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> You should try to put back the IHS and have it spread the pressure more evenly on the PCB to see if you can get good contact again. My first de-lid had that issue and that is how I fixed it after a while I was able to go back to direct die but did not tighten the bolts all the way down.


*If you don't tighten the bolts all the way, instead of using EK naked kit, is it better to keep the regular waterblock fixing kit?*


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vieuxchnock*
> 
> *If you don't tighten the bolts all the way, instead of using EK naked kit, is it better to keep the regular waterblock fixing kit?*


In my case the regular kit did not go down far enough on the DIE. I did not have enough pressure to make good contact between the CPU and MOBO, I tried it before buying the kit and thats why I ended getting it. Maybe some thinner washers on the screws might make a difference but I figured that if I needed to get any spare parts to make it work might as well get the kit since its rather cheap.


----------



## Daredevil 720

So the Naked Ivy kit is not perfect huh? I was considering getting it..


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bond32*
> 
> Def possible. I have mine stable at 4.8 ghz with 1.44 vcore. I tried hard for 49x, but won't go over 1.5 vcore which I think it needed if at all.


What settings do you recommend I play with?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> So the Naked Ivy kit is not perfect huh? I was considering getting it..


At least for me it wasn't perfect, if I tightened the bolts all the way it would cause some flex on the PCB of the CPU. After my latest CPU swap I did take some pliers and was able to further tighten the bolts, I remember reading somewhere from EK that the plastic washers are supposed to compress down when you tighten the bolts all the way which might be the difference in my case. When I put in my new CPU I will tighten all the way and see if it is still causing flex on the CPU.


----------



## RickRockerr

Is picture of the ihs enough for intel if cpu is sended to RMA?
My "dead" 3570K is lapped and I'm selling it, someone asked that because he maybe buys it and tries to RMA it.
Found a picture of it when it was brand new


----------



## fa5terba11

Quote:


> So the Naked Ivy kit is not perfect huh? I was considering getting it..


I think the Naked Ivy kit is a great product. I realize everyone's experience differs but with my MSI mobo it fit perfectly and held the bare die perfectly and now my temps are better than ever. I reached 4.8 w/o going above 80 degrees after 4 hours of Aida64.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Is picture of the ihs enough for intel if cpu is sended to RMA?
> My "dead" 3570K is lapped and I'm selling it, someone asked that because he maybe buys it and tries to RMA it.
> Found a picture of it when it was brand new


No. If you lap your cpu means you lose the batch number,and that means no warranty no matter if you have a picture of it before lapping.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fa5terba11*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> So the Naked Ivy kit is not perfect huh? I was considering getting it..
> 
> 
> 
> I think the Naked Ivy kit is a great product. I realize everyone's experience differs but with my MSI mobo it fit perfectly and held the bare die perfectly and now my temps are better than ever. I reached 4.8 w/o going above 80 degrees after 4 hours of Aida64.
Click to expand...

I second this opinion! Awesome, one of a kind, designed for this club hardware, for $5.00 bucks. You cant get a Big Mac meal for that. I installed the naked ivy alongside my first ever water loop. It booted first go, and has booted first time after several reseats. 5.0 barely breaks 60C p95 testing on this 3570k w/gpu on a single 360 rad. Love my naked ivy.


----------



## RickRockerr

Can't wait for new cpu


----------



## Daredevil 720

Is CLU/CLP recommended for bare die setups or is normal TIM like Gelid preferred?


----------



## inedenimadam

CLU, and it will stain your block. I only noticed a couple or 3-4C gains over the Gelid, but every little bit counts in overkill overclocking!


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Is CLU/CLP recommended for bare die setups or is normal TIM like Gelid preferred?


Ive used both CLU and MX-4 and the difference between CLU and MC-4 is just a couple of degrees, if you need to have the most drop then go with CLU/P. Now if you have a copper block CLU/P will stain the block like inedenimadam pointed out. However, with some patience elbow grease metal polish and fine grit sand paper you can turn a stained block from this



to this


----------



## Heimdallr

i've read several guides on how to delid the cpu but i have a question on how to apply CLU afteri delid, in particular i would like to know if there is any chance the tim will slip out the die?
Also, the IHS will be kept together to the PCB only thanks to the retention bracket?

thanks


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heimdallr*
> 
> i've read several guides on how to delid the cpu but i have a question on how to apply CLU afteri delid, in particular i would like to know if there is any chance the tim will slip out the die?
> Also, the IHS will be kept together to the PCB only thanks to the retention bracket?
> 
> thanks


You apply a THIN thin layer of CLU to the die with the brush that comes with it. After that, you apply the remaining CLU that is already on the brush from before, to the underside of the IHS for better contact.
You will be surprised how well this stuff spreads.. even the smallest amount.


There is indeed a risk of the CLU getting pushed off the die potential shortening something = bad
If you dont apply too much CLU, there is really only one place that bad things can happen:

You can cover this line of surface mounted thingies with nail polish or a non-conductive tim (mx4 etc) NOT AS5.

Yes, the IHS will "only" be held in place by the retention bracket.. but that sucker gives hell of a lot of pressure and the IHS will not move after the bracket is locked








You just have to be aware that it will "slight" when you lock it and risk moving the IHS with it..
You should ether, move the IHS further back so it slights to the right position after the bracket locks. but I dont like the thought of the IHS slighting on the die with down pressure at the same time..
OR you can put the IHS as it is suppose to sit and then have a friend help you hold it in place while bracket is being locked. (can also be done alone







)


----------



## Heimdallr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> CUT
> Yes, the IHS will "only" be held in place by the retention bracket.. but that sucker gives hell of a lot of pressure and the IHS will not move after the bracket is locked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You just have to be aware that it will "slight" when you lock it and risk moving the IHS with it..
> You should ether, move the IHS further back so it slights to the right position after the bracket locks. but I dont like the thought of the IHS slighting on the die with down pressure at the same time..
> OR you can put the IHS as it is suppose to sit and then have a friend help you hold it in place while bracket is being locked. (can also be done alone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Thanks a lot for the help, i also heard of the nail polish method, i guess i will have to borrow some


----------



## GaMbi2004

Np. Im sure you have some of your own ;D hehe
I love your avatar ^^ made me laugh.


----------



## RickRockerr

Getting new 3570k tomorrow so I have plans for weekend







But I'm out of CLP so I have to go with ultra








I personally prefer CLP because it has given me better temps than CLU.


----------



## Hhead

CLU on both die and IHS only gave me 7-10 degress difference. i want my 20 degrees!


----------



## GaMbi2004

pics would help








You may have put on too much or not enough..
Also, it is possible that your chip had a "good" contact before the delid, and therefore you wont see a 20 degree drop.
What is you OC, Cooling and temps under load?


----------



## Hhead

well i aplied the paste twice in case i did something wrong at first.

well currently my multiplier is 45x for 2 core and 44x for the other 2. im having hard time stabilizing the 45X. giving it 1.38 vcore. its damn too much.
cache ratio is 35x and 1.15v
vccin 2.0v

rams 1600. 1.51v

i just passed 5 loops of phase 2 of x264 without a bsod. temps 78-83

i have h100i.


----------



## Etaloche

Delidded my Haswell i7-4770K!!!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Etaloche*
> 
> Delidded my Haswell i7-4770K!!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Hmm.. I sense a lag of information here?









*Edit
How much CLP/U is on that chip? looks like a LOT!!
and did you cover the surface mounted ¤%?¿&'s next to the die, with anything?


----------



## Etaloche

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hmm.. I sense a lag of information here?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Edit
> How much CLP/U is on that chip? looks like a LOT!!
> and did you cover the surface mounted ¤%?¿&'s next to the die, with anything?


Sorry to scare you a little







but ya I put some non-conductive paste on the voltage regulators beside the die, as for the amount... better too much than not enough I guess...? hahaha


----------



## StillFunkyB

Used a razor on my 3770K and had no issues, was pretty easy.

Used the vice method on the 4770K and that was even easier. I didn't have a vice, so I went over to Lowe's and got a clamp mount one for $25.


----------



## alucardis666

Just purchased some CLU.... very excited for it to get here...


----------



## chobitz

Can I please join this awesome club







I am new here and please let me know if my format is wrong





My original highest temperature prior delid my 4770k was somewhere above 95 degree (@4.6G, vcore 1.24 v) with IE (I does see the IE applied perfectly, not sure what was the reason).
The best temperature I got prior delid was 85 degree after 8 hours of IBT (@4.6, vcore 1.234v uncore 45, 2402 RAM), 93 degree after 8 hours of AIDA64 FPU 4.6G @1.248v.

The best temperature I got after delid I got until now is about 78 degree (hottest core, lowest core was 68) after 5 hours of IBT (@4.6, vcore 1.234v uncore 45, 2402 RAM) while I applied CLP between die and IHS, Indigo xtreme between IHS and block.

I will keep working on my temperature (Never given up)

I have put as much log as I could into my build log http://www.overclock.net/t/1458503/monster-on-fire


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chobitz*
> 
> Can I please join this awesome club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am new here and please let me know if my format is wrong
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My original highest temperature prior delid my 4770k was somewhere above 95 degree (@4.6G, vcore 1.24 v) with IE (I does see the IE applied perfectly, not sure what was the reason).
> The best temperature I got prior delid was 85 degree after 8 hours of IBT (@4.6, vcore 1.234v uncore 45, 2402 RAM), 93 degree after 8 hours of AIDA64 FPU 4.6G @1.248v.
> 
> The best temperature I got after delid I got until now is about 78 degree (hottest core, lowest core was 68) after 5 hours of IBT (@4.6, vcore 1.234v uncore 45, 2402 RAM) while I applied CLP between die and IHS, Indigo xtreme between IHS and block.
> 
> I will keep working on my temperature (Never given up)
> 
> I have put as much log as I could into my build log http://www.overclock.net/t/1458503/monster-on-fire


Good work


----------



## chobitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alucardis666*
> 
> Good work


How to obtain the delid club tag







I'd love to put one in my sign, like you did


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chobitz*
> 
> How to obtain the delid club tag
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd love to put one in my sign, like you did


Wait for OP to spot you and say "slappa dad sig on!". Then go to first post and get the tag from there


----------



## chobitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Wait for OP to spot you and say "slappa dad sig on!". Then go to first post and get the tag from there


Damn that "slappa dad sig on!" start singing in my head already


----------



## GaMbi2004

hehe, While you wait, I suggest you go put your rig in your sig








Guide


----------



## chobitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> hehe, While you wait, I suggest you go put your rig in your sig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Guide


Thanks for suggestion,
I think it might be better until I 100% finish two of my builds
1. http://www.overclock.net/t/1458488/multimedia-itx-build
2. http://www.overclock.net/t/1458503/monster-on-fire


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chobitz*
> 
> Can I please join this awesome club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am new here and please let me know if my format is wrong
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My original highest temperature prior delid my 4770k was somewhere above 95 degree (@4.6G, vcore 1.24 v) with IE (I does see the IE applied perfectly, not sure what was the reason).
> The best temperature I got prior delid was 85 degree after 8 hours of IBT (@4.6, vcore 1.234v uncore 45, 2402 RAM), 93 degree after 8 hours of AIDA64 FPU 4.6G @1.248v.
> 
> The best temperature I got after delid I got until now is about 78 degree (hottest core, lowest core was 68) after 5 hours of IBT (@4.6, vcore 1.234v uncore 45, 2402 RAM) while I applied CLP between die and IHS, Indigo xtreme between IHS and block.
> 
> I will keep working on my temperature (Never given up)
> 
> I have put as much log as I could into my build log http://www.overclock.net/t/1458503/monster-on-fire


I see an eager new face!!!!









I don't know maybe you shouldn't get the Sig









I'm just kidding, really clean delid there buddy.....BUT you sadly didnt give my enough info. DENIED

JK

You're In! Slappa Dat Sig on!!


----------



## bond32

Yeah, his looks really clean for sure. Might be the cleanest I have seen yet! Very nice work man!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chobitz*
> 
> Thanks for suggestion,
> I think it might be better until I 100% finish two of my builds
> 1. http://www.overclock.net/t/1458488/multimedia-itx-build
> 2. http://www.overclock.net/t/1458503/monster-on-fire


Sure thing







we just love to know the current or future spec of the ppl we are helping / congratulating.
For example, I cant see what cooling you are using.. unless iw read your log







awesome build btw!!
and welcome to the club!! Looks like a good delid! seams odd you only saw a 8 degree drop :S
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I see an eager new face!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know maybe you shouldn't get the Sig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just kidding, really clean delid there buddy.....BUT you sadly didnt give my enough info. DENIED
> 
> JK
> 
> You're In! Slappa Dat Sig on!!


ROFL Valgaur!! cant help but laugh ^^ (loud if you ask the folks in my room)
Sorry for spelling "Dat" wrong


----------



## chobitz

Well, I can proudly showing off this elite sign








Love the magic word "Slappa Dat Sig on"


----------



## mat459

I didn't take any pictures. I don't really need to join the club, but I did accomplish a successful delid 2 days ago. My CLP arrived today and I used it on the die and underside of the IHS. All I can really say is "WOW".
I don't have the best chip. Before the delid, I got max temps of 93ºC running prime. That's at stock speed, with an H100 in push/pull. I was able to get 4.5Ghz, pretty stable, but I wasn't able to test for stability 100% due to heat and throttling.
After delid, P95 tops out at 63ºC @ stock speed. THAT'S A 30ºC DROP!
Right now I'm stress testing @ 4.7Ghz @ 1.424v. Max temp 80ºC! That's at least 23ºC drop, as it used to max out at 103ºC and throttle, and I would just stop the test.


As i said, I used CLP on the die, and the underside of the IHS. A very thin layer spread out with the Q-tip on each. I tinted the waterblock with AS5, and used the line method on the top of the IHS with the AS5.


----------



## chobitz

Great work, thats some good temp drop there, also awesome temperature for vcore @1.4x v


----------



## mat459

Yes, and I had almost given up on ever having decent temps


----------



## IMI4tth3w

well looks like a delid may be in my future. did a quick oc to 4.5 with my 4770k at 1.349V and my hottest core hit 100 QUICK on intel burn test.

4770k is cooled by an h110 with two noctua 140mm pwm fans in push config. probably make an order for some CLP and do the vice method. really hope i can bring that temp down as much as possible!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMI4tth3w*
> 
> well looks like a delid may be in my future. did a quick oc to 4.5 with my 4770k at 1.349V and my hottest core hit 100 QUICK on intel burn test.
> 
> 4770k is cooled by an h110 with two noctua 140mm pwm fans in push config. probably make an order for some CLP and do the vice method. really hope i can bring that temp down as much as possible!


Ivy got hot...but shame on Intel for not only failing to address the issue, but making it worse with Haswell. Freakin 4.5 and a h110 cant keep it under control? SHAME Intel....SHAME!!!!


----------



## chobitz

@mat459 I am not sure whether you could lower your vcore down a bit for your clock speed or you need that much to make it stable.
If you could, I can imaging you could get even better temp, imo
@IMI4tth3w also you could try low down your vcore a bit







it helps if it stables


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Ivy got hot...but shame on Intel for not only failing to address the issue, but making it worse with Haswell. Freakin 4.5 and a h110 cant keep it under control? SHAME Intel....SHAME!!!!


Actually it's not their fault here.

Simply put the smaller transistor sizes have caused to great of heat output and temperature deltas involved for the fluxless solder to handle... thus making the die crack and shatter from the heat differences (from actual Intel testing), Thus the reasoning behind the paste they used but the real issue isnt the paste like most people assume it's the spacing of the IHS and the pcb which is the glue holding the IHS down as it hardens it expands slightly making a biger space for the heat to go through more TIM.

The more you know!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Ivy got hot...but shame on Intel for not only failing to address the issue, but making it worse with Haswell. Freakin 4.5 and a h110 cant keep it under control? SHAME Intel....SHAME!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually it's not their fault here.
> 
> Simply put the smaller transistor sizes have caused to great of heat output and temperature deltas involved for the fluxless solder to handle... thus making the die crack and shatter from the heat differences (from actual Intel testing), Thus the reasoning behind the paste they used but the real issue isnt the paste like most people assume it's the spacing of the IHS and the pcb which is the glue holding the IHS down as it hardens it expands slightly making a biger space for the heat to go through more TIM.
> 
> The more you know!
Click to expand...

All they had to do was shave a little off the bottom of the IHS and apply some pressure while the glue drys. Some of the most amazing, mind blowing engineering goes into the manufacturing of these microprocessors, but then they give it to Barney Fife to get the lid on it.


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> All they had to do was shave a little off the bottom of the IHS and apply some pressure while the glue drys. Some of the most amazing, mind blowing engineering goes into the manufacturing of these microprocessors, but then they give it to Barney Fife to get the lid on it.


Rofl


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> All they had to do was shave a little off the bottom of the IHS and apply some pressure while the glue drys. Some of the most amazing, mind blowing engineering goes into the manufacturing of these microprocessors, but then they give it to Barney Fife to get the lid on it.


Lol


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Actually it's not their fault here.
> 
> Simply put the smaller transistor sizes have caused to great of heat output and temperature deltas involved for the fluxless solder to handle... thus making the die crack and shatter from the heat differences (from actual Intel testing), Thus the reasoning behind the paste they used but the real issue isnt the paste like most people assume it's the spacing of the IHS and the pcb which is the glue holding the IHS down as it hardens it expands slightly making a biger space for the heat to go through more TIM.
> 
> The more you know!


If it really is because of the smaller process then how come ivy-e is indeed soldered?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> If it really is because of the smaller process then how come ivy-e is indeed soldered?


I heard somebody blame the iGPU before >.>

Really, hard to know. I won't pretend to have a clue what's going on, and few people will unless intel comes out and says something


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> If it really is because of the smaller process then how come ivy-e is indeed soldered?


been waiting for that one!

With ivy-e being a 2011 socket and having more ompf in the processor itself like the 6 core for example the die is much larger resulting in a better heat distribution over the IHS. the 1155 and 1150 sockets have a hard time since the die is long and so narrow. more surface area more heat distribution.

if anyone has questions like these don't hesitate to ask


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> been waiting for that one!
> 
> With ivy-e being a 2011 socket and having more ompf in the processor itself like the 6 core for example the die is much larger resulting in a better heat distribution over the IHS. the 1155 and 1150 sockets have a hard time since the die is long and so narrow. more surface area more heat distribution.
> 
> if anyone has questions like these don't hesitate to ask


Makes sense..
In other words.. Intel should ditch the iGPU on the K-line making the die more square-sized so they can solder those chips again









Obviously Intel would never ever do that, guess it's a good thing we all got the nerve to smack the chip with a hammer ^^


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Makes sense..
> In other words.. Intel should ditch the iGPU on the K-line making the die more square-sized so they can solder those chips again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Obviously Intel would never ever do that, guess it's a good thing we all got the nerve to smack the chip with a hammer ^^


I think without the igpu the problem would still exist since the die would be even smaller.

but I agree I'd rather improve tech and make changes in the world than sit there going... im sorry your so hot!! T.T


----------



## mat459

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chobitz*
> 
> @mat459 I am not sure whether you could lower your vcore down a bit for your clock speed or you need that much to make it stable.
> If you could, I can imaging you could get even better temp, imo
> @IMI4tth3w also you could try low down your vcore a bit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it helps if it stables


Any lower vCore and I get fatal errors in P95, and then crash if I don't stop the test in time. I bumped up the voltage 1 notch at a time till it could pass P95, IBT, and AIDA64. I'm pretty sure that's as low as I can go. As I said, I didn't get a very good chip. It needs over 1.2v for stock. 4.5Ghz is where It hits a wall, and I really needed a lot of vCore for that extra 200Mhz. My 3570k, on the other hand, I would say is above average, but I plan to sell it, not delid it.


----------



## Daredevil 720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> been waiting for that one!
> 
> With ivy-e being a 2011 socket and having more ompf in the processor itself like the 6 core for example the die is much larger resulting in a better heat distribution over the IHS. the 1155 and 1150 sockets have a hard time since the die is long and so narrow. more surface area more heat distribution.
> 
> if anyone has questions like these don't hesitate to ask


Why can't they make the die more square with some new topology?


----------



## maynard14

Hi its been a while

im pushing my 3570k on its limits and im just thinking if i push my 3570k to 1.41 volts for 24.7 use is ok?

here is my temps and vcore

:


----------



## Cyro999

Should be fine enough on ivy bridge AFAIK


----------



## maynard14

ok sir thank you while stressing with intel burn test my max temp is only 66c

ok sir thank you for answering my questions









deliding this chips are really a miracle


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Why can't they make the die more square with some new topology?


My guess is that IGPU was made as an "extension" of the die,, removing it would only make the surface area smaller.. but if the IGPU wasnt there, they could have kept the rest of the core "enlarged" and therefore more surface area.. but the CPU business dosnt work that way.. tick / tock.. Since Nehalem, the DIE has only grown thinner and longer (such as shrink + extensions) making the heat generating areas located to a smaller area of the DIE and the extensions (like iGPU that isnt really used int most builds) to fill the rest.
and therefore more dependent of a "perfect" contact from DIE to IHS..

Correct me if im wrong.. this is only based on my own view of things.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> Hi its been a while
> 
> im pushing my 3570k on its limits and im just thinking if i push my 3570k to 1.41 volts for 24.7 use is ok?
> 
> here is my temps and vcore
> 
> :


I have been doing somewhere in that neighborhood to run 5.0 for a while now (hard to know the exact VCore on this craptastic voltage misreporting ASRock board), with no noticeable degradation for 24/7. If I blow it up, I blow it up...but it does not show signs of wanting to blow up.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have been doing somewhere in that neighborhood to run 5.0 for a while now (hard to know the exact VCore on this craptastic voltage misreporting ASRock board), with no noticeable degradation for 24/7. If I blow it up, I blow it up...but it does not show signs of wanting to blow up.


but mine is only clock @ 4.5 ghz hahaha i think this is the worst 3570k


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have been doing somewhere in that neighborhood to run 5.0 for a while now (hard to know the exact VCore on this craptastic voltage misreporting ASRock board), with no noticeable degradation for 24/7. If I blow it up, I blow it up...but it does not show signs of wanting to blow up.
> 
> 
> 
> but mine is only clock @ 4.5 ghz hahaha i think this is the worst 3570k
Click to expand...

silicone lottery...but hey...your still coming out ahead! that unlocked to 290x GPU should more than make up a bad draw on the CPU...its not like I unlocked my 3570k to a 3770k or something!


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> silicone lottery...but hey...your still coming out ahead! that unlocked to 290x GPU should more than make up a bad draw on the CPU...its not like I unlocked my 3570k to a 3770k or something!


haha yeah im not worried it my 3570k will burn someday haha planning to max it all out and if ever it decided to degrade so be it haha ill replace it with 3770k









aha yeah guess i was lucky that i got a 290 unlockable to 290x









deliding is like a miracle hehe


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> Why can't they make the die more square with some new topology?


someone already hit on it but i'll say a bit.

The topology cant change as the layout for the circuitry is ment to be in that manner where it files through but if they changed it and made it into a square it would result in a smaller die


----------



## IMI4tth3w

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Ivy got hot...but shame on Intel for not only failing to address the issue, but making it worse with Haswell. Freakin 4.5 and a h110 cant keep it under control? SHAME Intel....SHAME!!!!


at first i thought it was my application of AS5 i just did on the heat spreader. went back to do a reapplication and noticed it could have used a slight bit more. reapplied and did a quick test.0.2 seconds into intel burn test straight back up to 100. :nono:

and yeah not too excited about that much heat even with the H110. i've got 8 noctua fans moving some serious air through my case as well. getting minimum temps around 22-24 C across the board. which is basically ambient temps.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chobitz*
> 
> @mat459 I am not sure whether you could lower your vcore down a bit for your clock speed or you need that much to make it stable.
> If you could, I can imaging you could get even better temp, imo
> @IMI4tth3w also you could try low down your vcore a bit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it helps if it stables


meh couldn't find where to adjust vcore but i think its on some sort of auto setting. it sits at 1.277 not under load but when it got under load during intel burn test it went up to 1.349 again. only been doing basic overclocks for less than a year now so still a bit of a noob. need to play around a little more with asus' bios to get a hang of all the features. i think most of it is auto so its not over working during light usage times.

probably just going to drop it back to 4.3GHz. it was maxing about 85* on IBT. i can deal with it. will be curious to see how it does after a delid.


----------



## Swag

Anyone really good at Photoshop here? I need help.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone really good at Photoshop here? I need help.


What's the problem??


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Anyone really good at Photoshop here? I need help.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What's the problem??
Click to expand...

Man, you are quick at replying.







I want to make a nice logo but I want some good videos to learn how to. My goal is to be able to make something like this:


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Man, you are quick at replying.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to make a nice logo but I want some good videos to learn how to. My goal is to be able to make something like this:


Ok, standby for PM from my PC, I'm on my mobile.


----------



## Jimhans1

Ah heck, figured I put this here so everyone can have access to them









http://www.garysimon.net/logotutorial/

http://spyrestudios.com/30-excellent-logo-design-tutorials-and-walkthroughs/

http://ibrandstudio.com/tutorials/50-photoshop-tutorials-logo-design











http://www.rocktheshotforum.com/2012/07/20/how-to-design-a-logo-in-adobe-photoshop/

http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-a-cool-logo-in-Photoshop-in-10-minutes-or-les/

http://www.creativebloq.com/graphic-design/pro-guide-logo-design-21221

Hope this helps.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Man, you are quick at replying.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want to make a nice logo but I want some good videos to learn how to. My goal is to be able to make something like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, standby for PM from my PC, I'm on my mobile.
Click to expand...

Thaaaank!









Anyway, I haven't posted in this thread for a while, any problems? Anything new?


----------



## Steam PCAXE

One question and a crazy idea.

Anyone succeeded to delid his 4770K and found the right sort of glue to put everything back together like nothing happened?
Im really interested did anyone delid his Haswell, got it killed somehow and was successful in passing the warranty and getting a new CPU?

Crazy idea.
Did anyone try to leave the lid off the CPU and apply watercooling directly? Just like an ordinary waterblock only without the copper part.
Just glue the plexiglas to the CPU and let water run over the CPU itself. I know there are some tricky resistors on haswell, but a drop of varnish or something else could protect it. I know it sounds crazy, but it would be fun to try!


----------



## powerdemon292

Just delidded with vise method, CPU cleaned, and about to put CLP on it, still need to test to make sure it works, will reply back with pictures and results


----------



## Etaloche

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> One question and a crazy idea.
> 
> Anyone succeeded to delid his 4770K and found the right sort of glue to put everything back together like nothing happened?
> Im really interested did anyone delid his Haswell, got it killed somehow and was successful in passing the warranty and getting a new CPU?
> 
> Crazy idea.
> Did anyone try to leave the lid off the CPU and apply watercooling directly? Just like an ordinary waterblock only without the copper part.
> Just glue the plexiglas to the CPU and let water run over the CPU itself. I know there are some tricky resistors on haswell, but a drop of varnish or something else could protect it. I know it sounds crazy, but it would be fun to try!


Not too sure with the glue, I actually chipped a tiniest piece off my i7-4770K die while delidding and CPU still works perfectly fine (OH THANK GOD) and had similar questions but since it works not much of a concern to me

In terms of naked mounts EK already has something on the market
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
But looks like it's only for ivy for now but I'm sure they have a Haswell version on the way


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Etaloche*
> 
> Not too sure with the glue, I actually chipped a tiniest piece off my i7-4770K die while delidding and CPU still works perfectly fine (OH THANK GOD) and had similar questions but since it works not much of a concern to me
> 
> In terms of naked mounts EK already has something on the market
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
> But looks like it's only for ivy for now but I'm sure they have a Haswell version on the way


The naked IVY kit works for both haswell and IVY, I've used it with a few 4770Ks.


----------



## IMI4tth3w

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> The naked IVY kit works for both haswell and IVY, I've used it with a few 4770Ks.


says it right on the webpage that it works for both ivy and haswell
Quote:


> EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy is an add-on that allows the use of delided 3rd- (Ivy Bridge) and 4th (Haswell) generation Intel® Core i3/i5/i7 processors with EK-Supremacy series CPU water blocks.


----------



## Etaloche

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> The naked IVY kit works for both haswell and IVY, I've used it with a few 4770Ks.


Too bad it won't work with my full mobo block for the Maximus VI Impact


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Etaloche*
> 
> Too bad it won't work with my full mobo block for the Maximus VI Impact


Yeah those full board blocks are tricky I don't see how you could go direct die with those.

I would have gone with a supremacy for that but yeah I understand your desire to do full board, those look very nice!


----------



## Etaloche

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Yeah those full board blocks are tricky I don't see how you could go direct die with those.
> 
> I would have gone with a supremacy for that but yeah I understand your desire to do full board, those look very nice!


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Etaloche*
> 
> This is just my every day gaming rig I cared enough about looks and performance but I'm not willing to give up on the bitspower full block for couple of degrees >.<


I hear ya, I'm contemplating an ITX build for the living room and although I love the supremacy, I think I would go with a full board block to simplify things.


----------



## lilchronic

just delidded a 4770k














4.7Ghz @ 1.275v batch # 3332B372


----------



## powerdemon292

UPDATE: Here is my 3570k










 Before

 After

Now it's rockin' some sexy CLP, with my raystorm hovering over it. My victory has come


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> One question and a crazy idea.
> 
> Anyone succeeded to delid his 4770K and found the right sort of glue to put everything back together like nothing happened?
> Im really interested did anyone delid his Haswell, got it killed somehow and was successful in passing the warranty and getting a new CPU?


Are you suggesting warranty fraud? that is illegal, and we wont help you with that.
HOWEVER! we have reports of delidded CPUs being replaced under warranty. Just make sure to tell them that you dilidded it to reduce the temperature, and that no damage has been made to the CPU in doing so..

It is always a good idea to check if the CPU is working before delidding it. If the chip dies after the delid, it is most likely your own fault and wont be covered.


----------



## Steam PCAXE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Etaloche*
> 
> Not too sure with the glue, I actually chipped a tiniest piece off my i7-4770K die while delidding and CPU still works perfectly fine (OH THANK GOD) and had similar questions but since it works not much of a concern to me
> 
> In terms of naked mounts EK already has something on the market
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html
> But looks like it's only for ivy for now but I'm sure they have a Haswell version on the way


No, thats not what i ment about naked CPU!











Imagine u lose the copper part, and glue the plexiglas part straigt to the CPU. Why does there have to be a copper part
that goes on the CPU? But like i said, its just a super crazu idea.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Are you suggesting warranty fraud? that is illegal, and we wont help you with that.
> HOWEVER! we have reports of delidded CPUs being replaced under warranty. Just make sure to tell them that you dilidded it to reduce the temperature, and that no damage has been made to the CPU in doing so..
> 
> It is always a good idea to check if the CPU is working before delidding it. If the chip dies after the delid, it is most likely your own fault and wont be covered.


I am not suggesting it, i was asking did anyone pull it off. I don`t need to suggest something that crossed almost everyones mind.
I am asking because i live in a not so friendly country where they deny your warranty sometimes just for fun. A warranty fraud would be buying a graphics card, using it for almost 2 years, and then when its "outdated", you take a tazer and kill it to get a newer better one.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just delidded a 4770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4.7Ghz @ 1.275v batch # 3332B372


your 4.7ghz score is lower than my 4.6 o.0

Great pics though! Not shooting for 5g's to see how it scales? (at least with ht off)

should be pretty freezing under encoding load, considering this ~







- w/ ~1.365v load, on air, no delid


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> One question and a crazy idea.
> 
> Anyone succeeded to delid his 4770K and found the right sort of glue to put everything back together like nothing happened?
> Im really interested did anyone delid his Haswell, got it killed somehow and was successful in passing the warranty and getting a new CPU?
> 
> 
> 
> Are you suggesting warranty fraud? that is illegal, and we wont help you with that.
> HOWEVER! we have reports of delidded CPUs being replaced under warranty. Just make sure to tell them that you dilidded it to reduce the temperature, and that no damage has been made to the CPU in doing so..
> 
> It is always a good idea to check if the CPU is working before delidding it. If the chip dies after the delid, it is most likely your own fault and wont be covered.
Click to expand...

Yes, there are reports of people being able to RMA a CPU that has been delidded. For education purposes, there is a type of glue that you can use that is as close as you can get to Intel's stock glue, and all you have to look for is black epoxy glue.

And yes, there are people who have cooled their CPU's without the IHS and that is called being 'naked'.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> No, thats not what i ment about naked CPU!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Imagine u lose the copper part, and glue the plexiglas part straigt to the CPU. Why does there have to be a copper part
> that goes on the CPU? But like i said, its just a super crazu idea.
> I am not suggesting it, i was asking did anyone pull it off. I don`t need to suggest something that crossed almost everyones mind.
> I am asking because i live in a not so friendly country where they deny your warranty sometimes just for fun. A warranty fraud would be buying a graphics card, using it for almost 2 years, and then when its "outdated", you take a tazer and kill it to get a newer better one.


Letting water flow directly over the die isn't going to so your temps any good. The waterblocks have either channels or pins just in order to increase the surface area to transfer the energy to the water. Once you ditch this baseplate you'll end up with way less surface area. Even though you remove a layer of thermal paste and a millimeter copper that restricts the energy-transfer, you'll still end up getting way worse temps.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Letting water flow directly over the die isn't going to so your temps any good. The waterblocks have either channels or pins just in order to increase the surface area to transfer the energy to the water. Once you ditch this baseplate you'll end up with way less surface area. Even though you remove a layer of thermal paste and a millimeter copper that restricts the energy-transfer, you'll still end up getting way worse temps.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chobitz*
> 
> Thanks for suggestion,
> I think it might be better until I 100% finish two of my builds
> 1. http://www.overclock.net/t/1458488/multimedia-itx-build
> 2. http://www.overclock.net/t/1458503/monster-on-fire


Interesting and good to know!


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Letting water flow directly over the die isn't going to so your temps any good. The waterblocks have either channels or pins just in order to increase the surface area to transfer the energy to the water. Once you ditch this baseplate you'll end up with way less surface area. Even though you remove a layer of thermal paste and a millimeter copper that restricts the energy-transfer, you'll still end up getting way worse temps.


side question, wouldn't water flowing directly on a die cause shorting lol?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Letting water flow directly over the die isn't going to so your temps any good. The waterblocks have either channels or pins just in order to increase the surface area to transfer the energy to the water. Once you ditch this baseplate you'll end up with way less surface area. Even though you remove a layer of thermal paste and a millimeter copper that restricts the energy-transfer, you'll still end up getting way worse temps.
> 
> 
> 
> side question, wouldn't water flowing directly on a die cause shorting lol?
Click to expand...

glass top, if we can put liquid metal on it, water would be fine. While we are talking theoretical. I would be more concerned about the pcb soaking up some of the liquid, sealing the block to the pcb, and removing the glued on block if you need to get in there.


----------



## Johri

Just delidded my 4770k using the vice method, testing as we speak (or post...)!

The actual delidding required a lot more force than I had thought, but it eventually came off after I found a heavier hammer









I had it running stock before hitting mid to high 70s during the realtemp prime95 test under a Corsair H110 and Prolimatech PK-1.

Here's some pictures of the process:

Cleaned up!


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!















Pulling out the CLU...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!















CLU (and nail polish on the VRMs) applied! (wow, that was ridiculously easy!)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!















Putting it back where it belongs.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!















And alas, my new results with the realtemp prime95 quick test, same old H110 and PK-1:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!















Will be building my custom watercooling loop for the 4770k and my R9 290 tomorrow, not much point going down the overclocking route now when I'm going to change the setup tomorrow. Will probably test it a couple of days and start overclocking next weekend, see how far I can get it (it is a pretty bad clocker from what I tested when I initially got it, and it was hot as well so that's why it was running stock for so long; have had this CPU since summer last year).


----------



## Steam PCAXE

Guess i will delidding my sample soon.... I will be using NT-H1 for sure.


----------



## Gunderman456

The Delid is under water now.



I did some temp testing Post Delid and now Post Custom Water Loop - refer to my build log "The Hawaiian Heat Wave" (in sig) for results, but on average the water loop reduced temps by another 8-9C!


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> The Delid is under water now.
> 
> 
> 
> I did some temp testing Post Delid and now Post Custom Water Loop - refer to my build log "The Hawaiian Heat Wave" (in sig) for results, but on average the water loop reduced temps by another 8-9C!


Nice! Keep pushing it!


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> Letting water flow directly over the die isn't going to so your temps any good. The waterblocks have either channels or pins just in order to increase the surface area to transfer the energy to the water. Once you ditch this baseplate you'll end up with way less surface area. Even though you remove a layer of thermal paste and a millimeter copper that restricts the energy-transfer, you'll still end up getting way worse temps.


I think you are right, but man I have an urge to try it. Not sure the CPU itself is big enough to get two fittings on top of though.


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I think you are right, but man I have an urge to try it. Not sure the CPU itself is big enough to get two fittings on top of though.


There used to be a waterblock that did almost exactly what you want. It was in the time where IHS's were still soldered so it cooled the IHS directly with water. It was the DT-direct. Stren even had it in his 2012 roundup, the review of the block can be seen here
As you can see it was about 5 degrees worse on average.

This was on the IHS of a 3930k, so a whooooole lot more surface-area than the teeny-tiny die of a 4770k for example, resulting in even worse performance. In other words: if you even are able to get a perfect seal around the die (so the PCB doesn't get wet) then you can only expect to see temps worse than before delidding your chip.

If you think you're up for it I'd love to see the results, but you should not do it to with performance in mind.


----------



## Steam PCAXE

Just a question for those who have his Haswell delidded. I can see that the temperatures drop for everyone, but for those on air cooling, did hot air start coming out of the heatsink while running prime or any other stress test? I write cooler reviews for a Serbian page, and not so long ago i swapped my test machine from 1366 i7 930 to 4770K. The 1366 platform was great, when CPU temp was 70-80°C hot air was blasting out of the heatsink, which meant i was really testing the cooler. Now with the Haswell, tempertures soar to almost 100°C and all of the heatpipes are literally cold! No hot air coming out of the heatsink body, and the base of the cooler is cold also. Like no heat transfer whatsoever.
If delidding doesnt help this situation, i just might not do it. Its best that i get a second AMD FX based test rig to heat coolers to their limits.
Another concern about delidding is about the fact and proof that after delidding, the IHS sits right on the CPU die.



I know its okay to delid the CPU, replace the thermal paste, put the IHS back, put the cooler back, enjoy the results and never touch it again. Will i stress the CPU with various coolers being mounted every few days? Every cooler has its own way of mounting and some mounting kits apply a really big amount of force. Since the IHS sits on the CPU, is there a physical hazard of constant cooler replacement?

Thanks!


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> Just a question for those who have his Haswell delidded. I can see that the temperatures drop for everyone, but for those on air cooling, did hot air start coming out of the heatsink while running prime or any other stress test? I write cooler reviews for a Serbian page, and not so long ago i swapped my test machine from 1366 i7 930 to 4770K. The 1366 platform was great, when CPU temp was 70-80°C hot air was blasting out of the heatsink, which meant i was really testing the cooler. Now with the Haswell, tempertures soar to almost 100°C and all of the heatpipes are literally cold! No hot air coming out of the heatsink body, and the base of the cooler is cold also. Like no heat transfer whatsoever.
> If delidding doesnt help this situation, i just might not do it. Its best that i get a second AMD FX based test rig to heat coolers to their limits.
> Another concern about delidding is about the fact and proof that after delidding, the IHS sits right on the CPU die.
> 
> 
> 
> I know its okay to delid the CPU, replace the thermal paste, put the IHS back, put the cooler back, enjoy the results and never touch it again. Will i stress the CPU with various coolers being mounted every few days? Every cooler has its own way of mounting and some mounting kits apply a really big amount of force. Since the IHS sits on the CPU, is there a physical hazard of constant cooler replacement?
> 
> Thanks!


I get what you mean completely. My coolers never seem to get very hot while on this chip. Which is odd... And my temps do get rather high as well. From all I've gathered this appears normal. All you can do is ensure your cooler is properly mounted and making good contact. Should you delid, ensure that the IHS is secured properly to the die with a light sheen of paste and that it is centered over the die under the CPU retention clamp. Secure your cooler to the IHS/CPU with a light sheen of paste as well. Tighten a hair over finger tight 2-3 quarter turns. Don't screw it in too snug or you COULD damage something. (Crack the die/bend CPU socket pins.)

I'd say you probably SHOULDN'T Swap your cooler so frequently... but if its absolutely necessary just be cautious. Or invest in a second system simply for testing...









if you can afford it


----------



## Steam PCAXE

Its either an FX based system or i have to build a synthetic CPU cooler tester platform. I will probably go with option no 2.

Thanks for the help!


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> Its either an FX based system or i have to build a synthetic CPU cooler tester platform. I will probably go with option no 2.
> 
> Thanks for the help!


No worries!


----------



## SgtRotty

Hello,
I havnt got the grapefruits for delidding my 4770k yet. I was curious if its safe to use CLP on the IHS with a H100? I saw a pic of a gpu that melted together with the cooler. Thats why im asking and being cautious. Thx!


----------



## Cyro999

Not really worth on IHS in my opinion (and quite a few others; though some like it) it's just a lot of bother for a degree or two


----------



## SgtRotty

Would CLP be better than AS5 on the IHS?


----------



## Cyro999

Yea, but it stains etc. If the writing on your IHS is gone, so is your warranty. There's complications/difficulties like that; I'm not 100% sure on the details; but delid is like 10x as much return, so it's an optimizing thing - like adding an extra fan to case to improve temps


----------



## SgtRotty

Thx for the reply,i may just pop the damn thing open then!


----------



## stickg1

Long time since I popped in. I got a really decent 3570K a few months ago that I never bothered delidding. I run 4.7GHz @ 1.27v on it. Built a water loop and temps were okay. I had torn the loop down and pulled the CPU block off to polish off the finger prints and what not. I figured ah what the heck. Pulled out a razor blade and put down some CLP I had lying around. All my tubes of CLU were empty but I had two brand new tubes of the Pro. Glad I did, I cut off a solid 25C on Prime95 loads and about 17C off of [email protected] loads. I didn't really document much. I've been a member for a while, having 5 or 6 successful delids under my belt. This one yielded the best results though. Happy I did it now!


----------



## jaytrinitron

Alright, so I am planning on delidding a 4770k haswell chip. My questions are, specifically for the haswell design, which method is easier, quicker, and safer (vice or razor, or something else perhaps) (I have read some of this delid guide but Haswell maybe different from Ivy... on some chipsets razor is easy to do). Right now I am planning on using the vise method, and if I do use it I need to get a vise. I was wondering what kind of vise would work best for this. I know based on the delid guide you're supposed to get something with sharp teeth, but it is also recommended I get a "precision" vise, and I know nothing about vises. I was looking at these: http://www.amazon.com/PanaVise-Model-201-Junior-Miniature/dp/B000B61D22/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004S9KO/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_6?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER. Would either of these work for the vise that makes delidding as easy, quick, and safe as possible? Should I look elsewhere?
Also, where would I get the wood block that you're supposed to tap against the cpu in the vise? Would home depot have it?
And finally, will a regular old metal hammer work best for this process?

Sorry, I know I'm kind of a noob lol.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jaytrinitron*
> 
> Alright, so I am planning on delidding a 4770k haswell chip. My questions are, specifically for the haswell design, which method is easier, quicker, and safer (vice or razor, or something else perhaps) (I have read some of this delid guide but Haswell maybe different from Ivy... on some chipsets razor is easy to do). Right now I am planning on using the vise method, and if I do use it I need to get a vise. I was wondering what kind of vise would work best for this. I know based on the delid guide you're supposed to get something with sharp teeth, but it is also recommended I get a "precision" vise, and I know nothing about vises. I was looking at these: http://www.amazon.com/PanaVise-Model-201-Junior-Miniature/dp/B000B61D22/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004S9KO/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_6?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER. Would either of these work for the vise that makes delidding as easy, quick, and safe as possible? Should I look elsewhere?
> Also, where would I get the wood block that you're supposed to tap against the cpu in the vise? Would home depot have it?
> And finally, will a regular old metal hammer work best for this process?
> 
> Sorry, I know I'm kind of a noob lol.


Well I have used both methods and I think razor is better because you have more control when doing delid but vice method is much quicker and "easier".
If you delid with razor you have to be careful not hitting those little thing next to die








First vice have better clamps but second one looks way more sturdy. My vice delid wasn't pretty one







I just used first wood block that i could find and old vice with not so good clamps but it did the trick









Maybe someone else could give you more info about right vices and wood block for this.


----------



## CallsignVega

Had time to do my first De-lidding after binning four 4770K's. Took all of 2 minutes using the vice method with my twist of adding some heat with a heat gun. I wouldn't use the razor method when the vice method is so quick, easy and less risk.

Baby is all polished up for my EK Supremecy with bare-die delid kit, just added some liquid Ultra:



Idle temps 1.45v @ 4.9 GHz



Prime95 temps 1.45v @ 4.9 GHz



Pretty cool temps! This chip should last quite a while even with higher voltages for benching..


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Had time to do my first De-lidding after binning four 4770K's. Took all of 2 minutes using the vice method with my twist of adding some heat with a heat gun. I wouldn't use the razor method when the vice method is so quick, easy and less risk.
> 
> Baby is all polished up for my EK Supremecy with bare-die delid kit:
> 
> 
> 
> Idle temps 1.45v @ 4.9 GHz
> 
> 
> 
> Prime95 temps 1.45v @ 4.9 GHz
> 
> 
> 
> Pretty cool temps! This chip should last quite a while even with higher voltages for benching..


Very impressive!


----------



## iwasaperson

Just delidded my 3570K. Took me a while. My motherboard's dead, so I'll post pics and results once I get a new one.


----------



## larymoencurly

Does anybody put a stop on their razor or knife blade (even several layers of tape, slightly behind the edge) so it can't possibly stick in too far?


----------



## Valgaur

So busy in here!!!!! i don't see any submissions though!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So busy in here!!!!! i don't see any submissions though!


Once the next line of CPU's roll out, they'll be a lot of submissions so don't worry.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So busy in here!!!!! i don't see any submissions though!


Mr Valgaur ! - long time, no talk - I hope you're doing well...









...re your post, I not only still have my delidded 3770K but recently added a 3570K (delidded) as well, though most of my systems are now 'undeliddable' Sandy-E and Ivy-Es







I did want to share something though after close to a year of running the delidded 3770K...while it remains a fantastic performer, with '0' measurable degradation even at 5.1 to 5.3 GHz etc...I did notice something odd in the temperature department recently which may affect others as well...you may recall this pic, what with near-even core temps and all that



...a few months back, I noticed that the temps all had gone up, but especially so for the outer two cores > even though the system had remained sealed...because it sits in a giant water-loop that also cools two Hexacores which are not always 'on', this temp rise was nowhere near critical, in fact under load it barely broke 50 C - but still, something clearly had changed.

I finally took it apart the other day and was quite shocked...almost all the CL-U had 'disappeared', even though it had been such a successful application per above pic and no further 'disturbance' since then...

...now, I had 'lapped' both the underside of the IHS as well as the top because of a severe IHS 'concavity' issue, that in turn had exposed the copper...it turns out that the copper had reacted w/ the CL-U not in any corrosive manner but it had 'absorbed' it almost completely, thus reducing the 'TIM' functionality - and the subsequent temp rise...so if you have a delidded CPU w/lapped IHS and CL-U, you might want to do some checking...


----------



## CallsignVega

What temps under load are you running Joa?


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> What temps under load are you running Joa?


With the big, shared w-c loop (which wasn't configured like it is now in the earlier screenie), I'm in the mid-50 C range w/Cinebench load at 5.1 GHz with 22 C ambient


----------



## jaytrinitron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Well I have used both methods and I think razor is better because you have more control when doing delid but vice method is much quicker and "easier".
> If you delid with razor you have to be careful not hitting those little thing next to die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First vice have better clamps but second one looks way more sturdy. My vice delid wasn't pretty one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just used first wood block that i could find and old vice with not so good clamps but it did the trick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe someone else could give you more info about right vices and wood block for this.


Ok thanks. What do you mean I couldn't hit those things on the side? Could you give me an example?


----------



## Steam PCAXE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Joa3d43*
> 
> I finally took it apart the other day and was quite shocked...almost all the CL-U had 'disappeared', even though it had been such a successful application per above pic and no further 'disturbance' since then...


I have read more than once about the CL-U drying up and disintegrating, thats why i will use NT-H1 when i delid my CPU. Maybe the CL is 1-2°C better, but its not worth the risk and hassle.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *larymoencurly*
> 
> Does anybody put a stop on their razor or knife blade (even several layers of tape, slightly behind the edge) so it can't possibly stick in too far?


I didn't personally, but I think others have. Another option is to mark off two lines with a sharpie:

a 6mm deep line - do not exceed when wiggling through the sides
a 8mm deep line - do not exceed when wiggling through a corner

that should keep you well away from any delicate areas, whilst still allowing enough depth to break the glue seal. Honestly though, it was pretty easy to tell when the glue had given way on a side, just due to the reduction of pressure felt across the blade. Nevertheless, if it makes you feel more comfortable....


----------



## lilchronic

temps pretty good but some weird stuff here for 4.7Ghz i need 1.375v an when i go to 4.8Ghz i need 1.525v just to get it stable?


----------



## Stay Puft

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> temps pretty good but some weird stuff here for 4.7Ghz i need 1.375v an when i go to 4.8Ghz i need 1.525v just to get it stable?


Pretty normal. That's just the voltage wall


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jaytrinitron*
> 
> Ok thanks. What do you mean I couldn't hit those things on the side? Could you give me an example?


If you look there is a pic of delidded haswell on first post. You have to be careful not hitting those things left side of the die.


----------



## Joa3d43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> I have read more than once about the CL-U drying up and disintegrating, thats why i will use NT-H1 when i delid my CPU. Maybe the CL is 1-2°C better, but its not worth the risk and hassle.


...probably a safer route (I use Gelid Extreme, MX4 and NT-H1 for many other 'non-liquid-metal' applications). That said, I have gone through something like 5x CL-U syringes for various applications over the last 12 months (CPUs, GPUs), and the above-described issue was the only problem I encountered - all other applications seem to be fine as the CL-U sits on the Nickel coating, s.th. that obviously was taken off when lapping per above...unprotected copper-CL-U I can confirm as 'not good'


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> temps pretty good but some weird stuff here for 4.7Ghz i need 1.375v an when i go to 4.8Ghz i need 1.525v just to get it stable?


Like Stay said, voltage wall won't let you go higher no matter how far your temps are in check. I've found after about 1.4 to 1.45v, dumping any more won't really do anything. On my best chip, 1.4v will get me ~4.9 GHz for 24/7 use (temps stay under 55C), and upwards of 1.45-1.5v will get me 5 GHz for some benching, but then she gives up the goose.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Steam PCAXE*
> 
> I have read more than once about the CL-U drying up and disintegrating, thats why i will use NT-H1 when i delid my CPU. Maybe the CL is 1-2°C better, but its not worth the risk and hassle.


It doesn't dry out - there's no water or oil in it like normal thermal compounds. It's a mix of metals that have a low melting point. Those few people who've damaged their CPU/PCB trying to remove solidified CLU, might have had more success if they'd tried a hairdryer to melt the CLU instead of immediately using force.


----------



## Steam PCAXE

So... you are saying i am making it up?









And i suppose Joa3d43 is making it all up too?














Edit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_metal

Rapid warming of liquid metal on top of an oven or by any other method is not recommended.

And hey, if mercury evaporates, maybe the same goes to CL.


----------



## CallsignVega

Dang, my 4770K must have a good IMC as I'm running my RAM at 2933 MHz (2x 8GB) in conjunction with a 4.9 GHz overclock on the core. Something like that is fairly rare isn't it?


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> Dang, my 4770K must have a good IMC as I'm running my RAM at 2933 MHz (2x 8GB) in conjunction with a 4.9 GHz overclock on the core. Something like that is fairly rare isn't it?


Depends, what is the stock speed of the memory? I had a 16gb (2x8) set of the 2933 G skill running fine on my 4770k for a short bit......


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Pretty cool temps! This chip should last quite a while even with higher voltages for benching..


You're priming with 1.455v set (1.475 load vcore*) and want to use more for benching D:

What VRIN? It seems common to need >1.95 for ~1.35vcore load, but one - 4770k with ht, two - 1.475vcore, three - prime - your power draw is way way way higher, do you need like 2.3vrin or is the chip fine with less?

I really don't think Haswell is that resilient - let me know how degradation is or if it dies









*Since you maybe didn't get the memo along with thousands of other people, cpu-z since 1.64.0 shows the VID sensor and not vcore, at least for most boards. Hwinfo is best for sensors for many, it has the correct vcore as well as cpu-z 1.64.0


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> temps pretty good but some weird stuff here for 4.7Ghz i need 1.375v an when i go to 4.8Ghz i need 1.525v just to get it stable?


Quote:


> Pretty normal. That's just the voltage wall


Looks to me like it's not a voltage wall at all - just a chip starved of VRIN or some other setting. Having a vcore sensor helps, as the VID sensor in cpu-z current versions is pretty useless - hwinfo "vcore" or cpu-z 1.64.0

Both the correct vcore sensors to use and VRIN are in Haswell 101 though, i've been surprised to see so many people miss them.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Looks to me like it's not a voltage wall at all - just a chip starved of VRIN or some other setting. Having a vcore sensor helps, as the VID sensor in cpu-z current versions is pretty useless - hwinfo "vcore" or cpu-z 1.64.0
> 
> Both the correct vcore sensors to use and VRIN are in Haswell 101 though, i've been surprised to see so many people miss them.


??? i put vrin to 2.050v and still cant get 4.8Ghz. please enlighten me on what setting im missing


----------



## 2wiced

Me too. I'm interested in it as well. Because if that's the case what's the setting? Or what's the max vrin that's safe? I'm willing to push mine to get 4.8ghz or 4.7ghz and reduce vcore voltage.


----------



## Cyro999

You probably can't reduce Vcore if it was properly and tightly tuned, 2wiced
Quote:


> temps pretty good but some weird stuff here for 4.7Ghz i need 1.375v an when i go to 4.8Ghz i need 1.525v just to get it stable?


2.05vrin - You are setting the 1.375vcore in bios? That means ~1.395 load

I need ~2.0 for ~1.36 load.

I would try your 4.8 at 2.2vrin (with llc at max or 1 lower than max value - you extreme OC at your own risk though - i'm far more worried for the 1.5vcore), and specifically note both what the correct vcore sensor says (vs what you set in bios) and also what errors or crashes you get.

There's not a lot of data for pushing hard over 1.4v's


----------



## CallsignVega

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Depends, what is the stock speed of the memory? I had a 16gb (2x8) set of the 2933 G skill running fine on my 4770k for a short bit......


It's a high end 2933 G.Skill kit. Did you have it running at 2933 and a core at 4.8+ GHz? From what I've been reading with the overclock guides, usually the high core overclocks drop mem overclocks down quite a bit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> You're priming with 1.455v set (1.475 load vcore*) and want to use more for benching D:
> 
> What VRIN? It seems common to need >1.95 for ~1.35vcore load, but one - 4770k with ht, two - 1.475vcore, three - prime - your power draw is way way way higher, do you need like 2.3vrin or is the chip fine with less?
> 
> I really don't think Haswell is that resilient - let me know how degradation is or if it dies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Since you maybe didn't get the memo along with thousands of other people, cpu-z since 1.64.0 shows the VID sensor and not vcore, at least for most boards. Hwinfo is best for sensors for many, it has the correct vcore as well as cpu-z 1.64.0


VRIN is 1.9v. I don't run HT and think it's silly, so less heat there. As for degrading, I've always pushed chips hard and never had a single one degrade. I am under the firm belief that keeping temps in check you don't have to worry about voltage as much. 24/7 looks like I am going to settle on 4.8 GHz at 1.38v. 27C idle, ~45-50C max temps during gaming, can't beat that. All with 2933MHz RAM.


----------



## Cyro999

1.9? Hm

There seems to be a general trend for VRIN requirement - but there's also some numbers like that which are just outright confusing, not sure why
1.38 with cool temps is really nice


----------



## lilchronic

im stable now @ 4.7Ghz but i dont like the sound of 4.7 i want 4.8Ghz







i just dont under stand why it take so much voltage to go from 4.7 to 4.8 Ghz ?
im guna go up to 2.2v vrin see if that helps i have only gone up to 2.05 vrin


ill run it at 1.5v till it dies with intel's tuning plan


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CallsignVega*
> 
> It's a high end 2933 G.Skill kit. Did you have it running at 2933 and a core at 4.8+ GHz? From what I've been reading with the overclock guides, usually the high core overclocks drop mem overclocks down quite a bit.
> VRIN is 1.9v. I don't run HT and think it's silly, so less heat there. As for degrading, I've always pushed chips hard and never had a single one degrade. I am under the firm belief that keeping temps in check you don't have to worry about voltage as much. 24/7 looks like I am going to settle on 4.8 GHz at 1.38v. 27C idle, ~45-50C max temps during gaming, can't beat that. All with 2933MHz RAM.


Yes, it was running at 2933, but my clocks were only at 4.7ghz, I sold it before Christmas to a friend moving back east.


----------



## lilchronic

i did a 3dmark11 run with 2933Mhz but needs 1.8v


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i did a 3dmark11 run with 2933Mhz but needs 1.8v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


At least my memory only needed 1.6v lol. Sweet run though.


----------



## stickg1

My last 3770K was a terrible overclocker but had a beastly IMC. Funny how that works.

Needed 1.375v for 4.5. Ran some TridentX Sammies at 2933 though. Same sticks on this 3570K can't even post 2800. However 4.5GHz @ 1.13v.


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys and gals.

Got a question im gonna do a major rehaul on my rig (bout time) and watercool it hard core buuut im not sure what to throw in for gpu's im thinking dual 780's right now.

I need help deciding is all really.... I'm going to LN2 my haswell soon and would love to watercool the mobo as well in my rehaul.

T.T

halp Vagur decide....


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys and gals.
> 
> Got a question im gonna do a major rehaul on my rig (bout time) and watercool it hard core buuut im not sure what to throw in for gpu's im thinking dual 780's right now.
> 
> I need help deciding is all really.... I'm going to LN2 my haswell soon and would love to watercool the mobo as well in my rehaul.
> 
> T.T
> 
> halp Vagur decide....


Any particular reason for the 780 instead of the 780TI ? Why not 290x ?


----------



## stickg1

Just buy two 780's. One for me, one for you. We both win! I'll love you long time!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Any particular reason for the 780 instead of the 780TI ? Why not 290x ?


not really just looking at options and might do 3 280x's actually and wc them for pretty build


----------



## lilchronic

im selling a 780 ti classified that +ln2 +haswell +more LN2 should be fun


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Any particular reason for the 780 instead of the 780TI ? Why not 290x ?
> 
> 
> 
> not really just looking at options and might do 3 280x's actually and wc them for pretty build
Click to expand...

Sig rig? with the 7970 lightning? you could save a few bucks by going the 280x route and keeping that lightning in the rotation


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Sig rig? with the 7970 lightning? you could save a few bucks by going the 280x route and keeping that lightning in the rotation


soo that sig rig is kinda... changed lol everything is different benching made that happen so lightning is for benching now since it is all ready for it


----------



## stickg1

I think I found my CPU soul mate. It took 5 or 6 different Ivy chips. But I think I found one that I will keep forever (or until I kill it)

http://valid.canardpc.com/6xllx7

That validation was during an IBT High run.


----------



## Pimphare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> Just buy two 780's. One for me, one for you. We both win! I'll love you long time!


Make that three....me love thee longer time!


----------



## fragamemnon

Well, I just delidded!
Using a friend of mine's vice (and mind you, not just any vice! "Сделано в СССР" - "Made in USSR"), things went smooth.

I will post the required data for the official application later, as I don't have the time now.

However, I would like to share some experience.

The wood that you use as a buffer between the hammer and the PCB should _not_ be pine or anything soft like it. Oak or beech do fine. (This might have been written, however I haven't seen it.







)
I had a large splinter (_rather a piece_) completely separated where the edge of the PCB was when I used the cut to shape pine block. But, well, the wood wasn't hard







so it did no damage. Whew!

Pre-delid I was going over 100oC in IBT @ 4.8GHz/1.32V (never really finished the run, was too close to TJMax) and I just competed a run with a highest core temp of 76o.
While mining it has shaved ~20oC for me. Down to 62 from 82.

I'm a happy camper.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> Well, I just delidded!
> Using a friend of mine's vice (and mind you, not just any vice! "Сделано в СССР" - "Made in USSR"), things went smooth.
> 
> I will post the required data for the official application later, as I don't have the time now.
> 
> However, I would like to share some experience.
> 
> The wood that you use as a buffer between the hammer and the PCB should _not_ be pine or anything soft like it. Oak or beech do fine. (This might have been written, however I haven't seen it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> I had a large splinter (_rather a piece_) completely separated where the edge of the PCB was when I used the cut to shape pine block. But, well, the wood wasn't hard
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so it did no damage. Whew!
> 
> Pre-delid I was going over 100oC in IBT @ 4.8GHz/1.32V (never really finished the run, was too close to TJMax) and I just competed a run with a highest core temp of 76o.
> While mining it has shaved ~20oC for me. Down to 62 from 82.
> 
> I'm a happy camper.


Nice! better hurry, been a while since I've added someone might have forgotten how!


----------



## stickg1

I have to redo mine. 12C difference between core 0 & 3. If I can get them all at core 0 temps then it would really be a 30C drop. That would be by far my best delid ever.


----------



## alucardis666

Delided my friend's 4770K today.... So I now have 2 successful Delids under my belt! Wooo!


----------



## fragamemnon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I have to redo mine. 12C difference between core 0 & 3. If I can get them all at core 0 temps then it would really be a 30C drop. That would be by far my best delid ever.


Eh. Same here, but my chip has always been like that. Core #0 is the coldest one and Core #1 - the hottest. The temp difference between them varies between 10-14oC under different loads.


----------



## GaMbi2004

GZ to the new delids








I have 2-4 degrees diff between hottest and coldest core under load







with a 19degree drop after delid.. the chip doesnt OC over 4.6ghz, so not the best clocker.. but darn close core temps!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> GZ to the new delids
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have 2-4 degrees diff between hottest and coldest core under load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> with a 19degree drop after delid.. the chip doesnt OC over 4.6ghz, so not the best clocker.. but darn close core temps!


I love seeing those temps dial in and making everything nice and perfect


----------



## fragamemnon

OCN name: fragamemnon
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: MX-2
Mhz gained: [pending updates]
OC after delid: 4.8GHz before delid [pending updates]
Temp drops: 20oC while mining @ 4.8GHz (62oC, down from 82oC); over 25oC while IBT.


Spoiler: IBT @ 4.5GHz






I actually made 2x10 runs.








CPU-Z validation of max OC: [pending updates]

Well, I will update post soon [hopefully].


----------



## xxpantherrrxx

I just ordered the stuff for my first ever delid on my i7 4770K, the cooler I am using is a Corsair H100i with SP120 High performance PWM fans

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material
Noctua NT-H1 Thermal Compound
ArctiClean 1 & 2 (Thermal Material Remover and Surface Purifier) - 60ml Kit

This came out to 39 bucks and change

I will be studying this guide on how to do it correctly so i don't damage anything


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> OCN name: fragamemnon
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: MX-2
> Mhz gained: [pending updates]
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz before delid [pending updates]
> Temp drops: 20oC while mining @ 4.8GHz (62oC, down from 82oC); over 25oC while IBT.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: IBT @ 4.5GHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I actually made 2x10 runs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: [pending updates]
> 
> Well, I will update post soon [hopefully].


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxpantherrrxx*
> 
> I just ordered the stuff for my first ever delid on my i7 4770K, the cooler I am using is a Corsair H100i with SP120 High performance PWM fans
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material
> Noctua NT-H1 Thermal Compound
> ArctiClean 1 & 2 (Thermal Material Remover and Surface Purifier) - 60ml Kit
> 
> This came out to 39 bucks and change
> 
> I will be studying this guide on how to do it correctly so i don't damage anything


I'll be waiting







Let me know if you have any questions.


----------



## fragamemnon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!


Awwww yisssssssssssss









On a side note, I think I'll apply CLU to the IHS too.


----------



## Valgaur

yiiiiiiiiis


----------



## fragamemnon

WELP...
I dun goofed.

Apparently the CM Hyper 212+ has an aluminum plate that keeps the copper pipes in place.
CLU ate through it.

I totally derped and forgot that the plate was actually aluminum, although it's quite obvious.

On a side note, this is the first time I have my box cooler installed...ever.



Spoiler: ...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> WELP...
> I dun goofed.
> 
> Apparently the CM Hyper 212+ has an aluminum plate that keeps the copper pipes in place.
> CLU ate through it.
> 
> I totally derped and forgot that the plate was actually aluminum, although it's quite obvious.
> 
> On a side note, this is the first time I have my box cooler installed...ever.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: ...


(facepalm)


----------



## fragamemnon

That's what you get for carelessly messing around with stuff when you haven't slept for over 40 hours.

/shrug oh well, at least I'm running with VCore <1.0V

I'm still kind of sad though.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> That's what you get for carelessly messing around with stuff when you haven't slept for over 40 hours.
> 
> /shrug oh well, at least I'm running with VCore <1.0V
> 
> I'm still kind of sad though.


Ouch...got pics? I want to see what the damage looks like.


----------



## fragamemnon

Potatoes inbound..


----------



## battleaxe

Wow... that's impressive! Nice job!

What is it that 's in CLU? Anyone know what compound it is that reacts with aluminum (AL)?


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Wow... that's impressive! Nice job!
> 
> What is it that 's in CLU? Anyone know what compound it is that reacts with aluminum (AL)?


It's the gallium.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> It's the gallium.


I was wondering that... nice


----------



## fragamemnon

Oh well... I will have to either wait for next month's paycheck to get the rest of my watercooling setup, or do it now...
_I had this planned for later.._









I can't believe how much I derped. Kind of funny, but I had a special relationship with that cooler.

Good night, crewmen! I'm off to dreamless sleep.

@the guy who repped me for showing the effects of improper CLU application - I hope you were being sarcastic.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Wow... that's impressive! Nice job!
> 
> What is it that 's in CLU? Anyone know what compound it is that reacts with aluminum (AL)?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Evil Genius Jr*
> 
> It's the gallium.


It's like water touching a sugar cube. The aluminium just crumbles.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> Oh well... I will have to either wait for next month's paycheck to get the rest of my watercooling setup, or do it now...
> _I had this planned for later.._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't believe how much I derped. Kind of funny, but I had a special relationship with that cooler.
> 
> Good night, crewmen! I'm off to dreamless sleep.
> 
> @the guy who repped me for showing the effects of improper CLU application - I hope you were being sarcastic.


That was me...no sarcasm...it is a good reminder to the community who (self included) use the C.L. on blocks. I had only heard of the effects it could have, never has anyone(that I know of) posted pictures of the full effect. Despite your emotional attachment to that cooler, it was only a 212 and is going to push you into a custom loop. So in the end, it got you motivated to improve your build, and we all got to get a learnin'. I say its a win-win.


----------



## xxpantherrrxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> Potatoes inbound..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WOW! Does CLU have some kind of warning on it that says it cannot come in contact with aluminum?


----------



## xxpantherrrxx

WOW!, Does CLU have a warning on it saying it cannot come into contact with aluminum?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxpantherrrxx*
> 
> WOW!, Does CLU have a warning on it saying it cannot come into contact with aluminum?


Yeah, but who the heck reads labels...


----------



## SenpuuKyaku

Finally gave into the temptation of delidding my 3570k and it took me a good hour or so to get the IHS off with a razor blade. Used CLU on the die and MX-4 on the IHS.


Temps before delidding (using IBT):


Temps after delidding:


That's a near 30ºC difference on load temps!

I'm extremely happy with the results and can't wait to push my OC even further.
Thanks to all the guides that were posted on here! They've been a ton of a help.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SenpuuKyaku*
> 
> Finally gave into the temptation of delidding my 3570k and it took me a good hour or so to get the IHS off with a razor blade. Used CLU on the die and MX-4 on the IHS.
> 
> 
> Temps before delidding (using IBT):
> 
> 
> Temps after delidding:
> 
> 
> That's a near 30ºC difference on load temps!
> 
> I'm extremely happy with the results and can't wait to push my OC even further.
> Thanks to all the guides that were posted on here! They've been a ton of a help.


one of us. one of us.


----------



## fragamemnon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *xxpantherrrxx*
> 
> WOW!, Does CLU have a warning on it saying it cannot come into contact with aluminum?
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, but who the heck reads labels...
Click to expand...

Hey now! I read it, and I was aware.
I also knew the possible effects beforehand.

I just worked exhausted and I shouldn't have done so.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> Oh well... I will have to either wait for next month's paycheck to get the rest of my watercooling setup, or do it now...
> _I had this planned for later.._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can't believe how much I derped. Kind of funny, but I had a special relationship with that cooler.
> 
> Good night, crewmen! I'm off to dreamless sleep.
> 
> @the guy who repped me for showing the effects of improper CLU application - I hope you were being sarcastic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That was me...no sarcasm...it is a good reminder to the community who (self included) use the C.L. on blocks. I had only heard of the effects it could have, never has anyone(that I know of) posted pictures of the full effect. Despite your emotional attachment to that cooler, it was only a 212 and is going to push you into a custom loop. So in the end, it got you motivated to improve your build, and we all got to get a learnin'. I say its a win-win.
Click to expand...

Haha, I was just joking, buddy. No offense taken.









Yeah. It's a win-win..and a loss for the little champ.








Still, this cooler won't be simply tossed away. I might fabricate a little pedestal of sorts for it.









It is a good reminder, indeed. Might want to add it to OP with a little red-coloured spoiler.


----------



## RickRockerr

Sorry to hear about you little incident fragamemnom.


----------



## incog

RIP 212, RIP


----------



## incog

Just to be sure about something here, someone tell me if I'm going to do anything wrong. To delid my CPU, I'm going to:

1. Use vice method. This is fairly straightforward, I put the CPU's IHS into a vice and tap it (gently but firmly) until the PCB comes off. I'll have seperated the IHS from the PCB.

2. Take the PCB and scrape off all the black epoxy glue. I do this first with my fingernails, then I'll do a second pass with a credit card to scrape off all the glue that creates the gap between the IHS and the die. Then, do the same for the IHS.

3. I'll have to clean off intel's TIM. This is the part I'm most unsure about. I get some 90%+ rubbing alcohol and a micro-fibre cloth (would a towel work?) and use that to wipe off the TIM from the die. I also wipe off the TIM from the IHS.

The goal of a delid isn't really to replace intel's TIM, it's more about getting rid of the gap between the IHS and the die which limits thermal conductivity. We get rid of this gap by getting rid of the black glue.

4. I seat the PCB back into the motherboard's socket, without the IHS on. I apply half a grain of rice of my own TIM (sorry, don't have CLP/CLU) onto the die. I then gently put the IHS back onto the die and use the motherboard's clapse to hold everything in place.

5. treat it as a normal CPU in a motherboard.

edit: oh, my bad for double post.

Sound all right? Step 3 is the part I'm least sure of, alcohol being alcohol, I don't think it'll damage a PCB, though this is a nice little CPU we're talking about here so I want to be sure.


----------



## fragamemnon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Just to be sure about something here, someone tell me if I'm going to do anything wrong. To delid my CPU, I'm going to:
> 
> 1. Use vice method. This is fairly straightforward, I put the CPU's IHS into a vice and tap it (gently but firmly) until the PCB comes off. I'll have seperated the IHS from the PCB.
> 
> 2. Take the PCB and scrape off all the black epoxy glue. I do this first with my fingernails, then I'll do a second pass with a credit card to scrape off all the glue that creates the gap between the IHS and the die. Then, do the same for the IHS.
> 
> 3. I'll have to clean off intel's TIM. This is the part I'm most unsure about. I get some 90%+ rubbing alcohol and a micro-fibre cloth (would a towel work?) and use that to wipe off the TIM from the die. I also wipe off the TIM from the IHS.
> 
> The goal of a delid isn't really to replace intel's TIM, it's more about getting rid of the gap between the IHS and the die which limits thermal conductivity. We get rid of this gap by getting rid of the black glue.
> 
> 4. I seat the PCB back into the motherboard's socket, without the IHS on. I apply half a grain of rice of my own TIM (sorry, don't have CLP/CLU) onto the die. I then gently put the IHS back onto the die and use the motherboard's clapse to hold everything in place.
> 
> 5. treat it as a normal CPU in a motherboard.
> 
> edit: oh, my bad for double post.
> 
> Sound all right? Step 3 is the part I'm least sure of, alcohol being alcohol, I don't think it'll damage a PCB, though this is a nice little CPU we're talking about here so I want to be sure.


1.







Apply a tad bit more force each hit until it comes off. _You won't succeed with gentle hits._

2. I used a card all along, dislike using my fingernails for such stuff.

3. Yes, 90% alcohol is perfectly fine. I used a kitchen roll and then a special breed of q-tip that wouldn't leave threads all over the place. Although I presume normal q-tips will do just fine.

4. Yes. Still, liquid TIM is recommended for better performance. Also be mindful that once you start pushing the lever down, the force will drag the IHS a bit forward. Make sure to position it ~1.5mm off from the place it should be because you can't move it back once everything is in place and tightened. Hold it with your thumb.

5. No. Abuse it. (just make sure to clean the IHS again because of your fingerprints, etc.)


----------



## OpiaTool

Hey everyone, I had a question on temperatures.

A friend and I went ahead and delidded my 3570k over the summer and everything has been running great although my idle temp spread still bugs me and today was a bit of an extreme case that propelled me to post here on it.

I currently run:
ASRock Extreme 4-M
CoolerMaster Hyper212 with 1 Noctua NF-F12 fan set for pull
Intel i5-3570k (delidded)
EVGA 780Ti
Bitfenix Prodigy M case with 5 Noctua NF-F12 fans, 2 intake and 3 exhaust.

CPU is running at stock clock right now.

I'm working on getting a better air cooler for this summer but the tight confines of the case make it a bit difficult to fit some of the larger air coolers on the market.

Yesterday, 1/23/2014, when I got home from work I turned on the computer. I unfortunately don't know ambient temp of the room but would have to estimate it around 40-45 degrees F. The room has poor ventilation so I leave the door closed most of the day so it doesn't get heated very much during the day.

My 3570k has always had about a 8-10*C variance in core temperatures at idle but after a few hours of gaming the max temperatures will mostly even out and usually only have a spread of around 1-4*C.

Today just as it booted there was about a 15*C variance in idle temps.
I left Planetside 2 running to try and simulate normal case temps with the added heat of the GPU and the cores ranged from 42-48*C.

It is the idle temperature that still bugs me as a 15*C range from coldest to warmest seems large.

The picture I attached shows the temperatures almost right after the computer loaded and are almost the coldest idle temps I have seen on this machine. It is side by side with a second picture of temps taken less than a minute after closing Planetside 2 that I had opened to put a load on both the cpu and the gpu to try and increase case temperatures. Game was open and I did play the game for about 45 minutes.

Is that range of temperatures okay when it is at idle and am I worried over nothing?

Edit: I should mention that I used CoolLaboratory Liquid Pro as the replacement TIM and then put Noctua NT-H1 between the heat spreader and the CoolerMaster Heatsink

COMBO.png 104k .png file


----------



## GaMbi2004

you could try something like this:

(Pic from post #12.)

Pressure paper that you stick between DIE->IHS and IHS-> cooler to check for bad contact.
Your IHS or Cooler might be warped or something.


----------



## Keyzman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Your IHS or Cooler might be warped or something.


What method was used for the delid? If it was done using a vice, the IHS could have been slightly bent if the vice was over-tightened.


----------



## OpiaTool

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Keyzman*
> 
> What method was used for the delid? If it was done using a vice, the IHS could have been slightly bent if the vice was over-tightened.


I did use a vice to knock it loose.

I ordered a few of those contact papers to test out the contact patch to see if it is warped or not.

I did a quick search and did not see replacement heat spreaders so if it is warped I either deal with it, try and bend it back flat or replace the whole cpu?


----------



## GaMbi2004

If the paper shows bad contact between DIE->IHS.. than I dont really know what to do..
If the paper shows bad contact bwtween IHS->Cooler.. You can order a "lapping kit" to make toe surface 100% flat. Works both on IHS and cooler..
I dont think you can get a IHS replacement.. and if you CAN, keep the original as it will be needed if the CPU should require an RMA..

Oh yea, if you lap the IHS, the warranty of the CPU is voided. but might be the only way to bring down temp difference.


----------



## incog

Went ahead and gave it a delid! Though unlike all you guys, I'm a guy with a locked i5 4670 on a B85 motherboard using intel's stock heatsink in a budget case called the Core 1000. I wanted to delid for the experience of having done so. It was an interesting experience, don't regret it at all. My temperature gains aren't fantastic, but they're there.

I used MSI Intel Extreme Tuning to stress the CPU and get it to heat up. I'm not going to lie, this program is damn useless. I only used the stress test, which probably isn't even that great a test. I just wanted something to compare temperatures though so it ended up working out. I used Afterburner and Rivatuner to measure temperatures. I did 10 minute stress tests and afterwards I take temperaures off the last 8 minutes of the test. Results:

First test, before delid: http://i.imgur.com/fa9z5i4.png

Noteworthy is the fact that I took out my case fan for this test and did every test without the case fan and without the side cover. Anyway, somewhat high temperatures were attained here, almost 70°C average. This temperature is, as far as I know, relatively safe. Though it's still high. Room temperature was 21°C.

So then we delid. First test after delid: http://i.imgur.com/uiSIptl.png

Same test condition as before, though my room is 19-20°C now (I spent the afternoon rebuilding the PC instead of putting everything back together asap). Now we have an average of 66°C, which is a noticeable improvement, though it's not much. One thing to note is that in the first test (pre delid) the CPU fan was running at 2050-2100 RPM whereas in the second test it was done to 1800-1850 RPM. This was noticeably quieter though nothing extravagent.

Third test, where I go into BIOS to adjust the fan curve. I adjusted "highest temp" setting went from 70°C to 60°C. Almost no difference whatsoever: http://i.imgur.com/hHDUVK4.png

For the fourth and final test, I take the stock intake fan that came with the case and put it on the side vent as an intake*. I noticed when the case was open that this helped GPU temperatures. Anyway, with the side panel back on and the case fan blowing air onto the GPU and CPU, we get the last result: http://i.imgur.com/L5BLD6A.png

Which surprised me. 59°C now. That's an 11°C drop; snot bad. Airflow is super important apparently. I'll be ordering that 92mm exhaust fan soon to experiment with more set ups.

All in all, was a fun experience. It took a while to actually get the IHS off the die though because I just couldn't bring myself to hit my poor CPU hard enough to actually delid.

*With rubber grommets and screws that were supposed to be used for HDDs..

bad quality PIX:


http://imgur.com/rzEmB6R




http://imgur.com/l3NFV5Z




http://imgur.com/5c1kzoE




http://imgur.com/zqxXUyl


----------



## Cyro999

Hey Incog, did you use liquid metal etc on the die?


----------



## DarkReign32

I'm planning on delidding but I'm having some trouble finding liquid pro/ultra. Any other recommendations for TIM to use on the core? I was thinking AS Ceramique.


----------



## Valgaur

nice incog


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Went ahead and gave it a delid! Though unlike all you guys, I'm a guy with a locked i5 4670 on a B85 motherboard using intel's stock heatsink in a budget case called the Core 1000. I wanted to delid for the experience of having done so. It was an interesting experience, don't regret it at all. My temperature gains aren't fantastic, but they're there.
> 
> I used MSI Intel Extreme Tuning to stress the CPU and get it to heat up. I'm not going to lie, this program is damn useless. I only used the stress test, which probably isn't even that great a test. I just wanted something to compare temperatures though so it ended up working out. I used Afterburner and Rivatuner to measure temperatures. I did 10 minute stress tests and afterwards I take temperaures off the last 8 minutes of the test. Results:
> 
> First test, before delid: http://i.imgur.com/fa9z5i4.png
> 
> Noteworthy is the fact that I took out my case fan for this test and did every test without the case fan and without the side cover. Anyway, somewhat high temperatures were attained here, almost 70°C average. This temperature is, as far as I know, relatively safe. Though it's still high. Room temperature was 21°C.
> 
> So then we delid. First test after delid: http://i.imgur.com/uiSIptl.png
> 
> Same test condition as before, though my room is 19-20°C now (I spent the afternoon rebuilding the PC instead of putting everything back together asap). Now we have an average of 66°C, which is a noticeable improvement, though it's not much. One thing to note is that in the first test (pre delid) the CPU fan was running at 2050-2100 RPM whereas in the second test it was done to 1800-1850 RPM. This was noticeably quieter though nothing extravagent.
> 
> Third test, where I go into BIOS to adjust the fan curve. I adjusted "highest temp" setting went from 70°C to 60°C. Almost no difference whatsoever: http://i.imgur.com/hHDUVK4.png
> 
> For the fourth and final test, I take the stock intake fan that came with the case and put it on the side vent as an intake*. I noticed when the case was open that this helped GPU temperatures. Anyway, with the side panel back on and the case fan blowing air onto the GPU and CPU, we get the last result: http://i.imgur.com/L5BLD6A.png
> 
> Which surprised me. 59°C now. That's an 11°C drop; snot bad. Airflow is super important apparently. I'll be ordering that 92mm exhaust fan soon to experiment with more set ups.
> 
> All in all, was a fun experience. It took a while to actually get the IHS off the die though because I just couldn't bring myself to hit my poor CPU hard enough to actually delid.
> 
> *With rubber grommets and screws that were supposed to be used for HDDs..
> 
> bad quality PIX:
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/rzEmB6R
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/l3NFV5Z
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/5c1kzoE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/zqxXUyl


Load temps after the delid are pretty even, don't see them all that close usually, nice!

XTU stress test does suck, the minute or 2 the XTU benchmark takes are harder on the cpu than hours of the stress test. To see what the real max temps are at the worst conditions, a few runs of IBT (w/avx) using max memory or custom choosing most of the free memory is pretty heavy stress testing & will show temps about as hot as they could ever get under load. Probably hotter than the chip will ever get in real world use.


----------



## AlDyer

Hey guys, how often should I replace my Liquid Ultra? I could replace it soon as I am getting some new watercooling equipment so I have to take everything off anyway, but I am only worried about removing the paste... What about using Arctic Cooling ArctiClean thermal material remover, if I can find it somewhere? CLU is notoriously difficult to remove once it has been applied :S I am a little worried about scratching the die.


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Hey guys, how often should I replace my Liquid Ultra? I could replace it soon as I am getting some new watercooling equipment so I have to take everything off anyway, but I am only worried about removing the paste... What about using Arctic Cooling ArctiClean thermal material remover, if I can find it somewhere? CLU is notoriously difficult to remove once it has been applied :S I am a little worried about scratching the die.


I asked this question before here with no response.

I don't think many know. This delidding and applying CLP/CLU is pretty new and there is not enough data to determine the long term viscosity of CLP/CLU.

However, there is some evidence to suggest (one who posted on you tube with evidence of his own) that CLP/CLU will dry out in about 9 months.

I suggest to keep an eye on temps and should things get hotter overtime, I'd investigate.

I plan to do the same when it's time to change my coolant for my custom water loop.


----------



## incog

How do you even remove CLU/CLP lol?


----------



## towtol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> I asked this question before here with no response.
> 
> I don't think many know. This delidding and applying CLP/CLU is pretty new and there is not enough data to determine the long term viscosity of CLP/CLU.


What does viscosity have to do with anything in this kind of situation?

As far as I am familiar with viscosity there needs to be some kind of flow or movement on the physical level.


----------



## Gunderman456

Like you would remove regular thermal paste.

They give you a wipe with alcohol on it (one use), however just use 90% alcohol or Arctic Silver 1&2 Arcticlean whatever you have laying around.


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *towtol*
> 
> What does viscosity have to do with anything in this kind of situation?
> 
> As far as I am familiar with viscosity there needs to be some kind of flow or movement on the physical level.


I meant whether it stays liquidy (semifluid) or dries up.


----------



## towtol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> I meant whether it stays liquidy (semifluid) or dries up.


I think that as heat is transferred there has to be some electron loss in the CLP/CLU along with some bonding with the mating materials. This would cause it to "dry up" as atoms lose their energy level.

Lots of variables... too many, I feel, to determine a "one fits all" re-application time frame. I might go through maybe a couple of re-apps with normal paste on one CPU but then I'm on to the next CPU. No time to make any determinations.


----------



## AlDyer

Well I should probably change it out just in case anyway, but CLU and CLP aren't as easy to remove as regular paste AFAIK. Would the ArctiClean make it easier, I know it does with regular paste but this is a bit different...


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AlDyer*
> 
> Well I should probably change it out just in case anyway, but CLU and CLP aren't as easy to remove as regular paste AFAIK. Would the ArctiClean make it easier, I know it does with regular paste but this is a bit different...


When I was applying it, I'd slip here and there and rubbing alcohol on a Q-Tip did the trick.


----------



## AlDyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> When I was applying it, I'd slip here and there and rubbing alcohol on a Q-Tip did the trick.


Okay I guess that's what I'll do then, thanks


----------



## Reefa_Madness

From Page 1, post #1
Quote:


> **RMA TRANSCRIPT FOR DELIDDERS TO READ** (Jon = me, A= rep)


http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/0_40#post_18302283

From post #23775 above
Quote:


> Oh yea, if you lap the IHS, the warranty of the CPU is voided. but might be the only way to bring down temp difference.


I was linked to this thread in a discussion about whether, or not, the delid process voids the Intel warranty.

The transcript was used as the "proof" that Intel honors the warranty on a delidded processor, however, there is no follow up in that first post, at least none that I saw, confirming that in fact Intel did replace the processor in question. The transcript is only a discussion with an Intel CSR that may, or may not have completely understood what was being said.

This thread is huge so instead of searching thru the proverbial haystack for the answer I'll just ask if there have been documented cases of a failed delidded processor being approved for RMA? I really hope that they do, but it really seems so unlikely that they would not object to a physical modification of the processor, such as removing the IHS, but object to you sanding it down while still intact (yes, I know the markings are removed during lapping).

Links to confirmations or more discussions on this subject would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance for any info on this topic.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> This thread is huge so instead of searching thru the proverbial haystack for the answer I'll just ask if there have been documented cases of a failed delidded processor being approved for RMA? I really hope that they do, but it really seems so unlikely that they would not object to a physical modification of the processor


Don't believe they've ever done that, if you break your CPU trying to delid, you broke it.

No warranty on lapped is because or at least partially because no writing etc like you said


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> This thread is huge so instead of searching thru the proverbial haystack for the answer I'll just ask if there have been documented cases of a failed delidded processor being approved for RMA? I really hope that they do, but it really seems so unlikely that they would not object to a physical modification of the processor
> 
> 
> 
> Don't believe they've ever done that, if you break your CPU trying to delid, you broke it.
> 
> No warranty on lapped is because or at least partially because no writing etc like you said
Click to expand...

It has happened, I've done it and Valgaur has done it. I believe he has the chat on the OP, please check it out.


----------



## Reefa_Madness

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> It has happened, I've done it and Valgaur has done it. I believe he has the chat on the OP, please check it out


Yes, I know that the chat with the Intel Rep is in the OP...I mentioned it and then linked to it in my previous post.

I was trying to find out if the RMA was actually done. A copy of a chat with a rep is only the first step.

On the other hand you have just stated that you were able to RMA a delidded processor with Intel. I'm truly surprised, but glad to get a confirmation. I'm guessing that you glued the IHS back on prior to submitting it?

Also curious, was the lid on your processor removed with a blade, or knocked off with a hammer.?

On the flip side, has anyone had theirs denied?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It has happened, I've done it and Valgaur has done it. I believe he has the chat on the OP, please check it out.


Your CPU broke well AFTER the delid didnt it? that is something else








If you damage it doing the delid(flying chips / blades to the PCB), that would void warranty.. If it dies AFTER for other reasons, warranty should be intact.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> It has happened, I've done it and Valgaur has done it. I believe he has the chat on the OP, please check it out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your CPU broke well AFTER the delid didnt it? that is something else
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you damage it doing the delid(flying chips / blades to the PCB), that would void warranty.. If it dies AFTER for other reasons, warranty should be intact.
Click to expand...

It doesn't matter, under Intel warranty, any physical alteration voids the warranty from that second on. However, there are still some good people out there willing to give a helping hand to someone who is nice. Just be friendly when you ask and if they grant it be happy, if they don't, then move on or try again.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Reefa_Madness*
> 
> Yes, I know that the chat with the Intel Rep is in the OP...I mentioned it and then linked to it in my previous post.
> 
> I was trying to find out if the RMA was actually done. A copy of a chat with a rep is only the first step.
> 
> On the other hand you have just stated that you were able to RMA a delidded processor with Intel. I'm truly surprised, but glad to get a confirmation. I'm guessing that you glued the IHS back on prior to submitting it?
> 
> Also curious, was the lid on your processor removed with a blade, or knocked off with a hammer.?
> 
> On the flip side, has anyone had theirs denied?


Hey Reefa!

When I did that RMA for myself I actually went through their customer service twice and they both said that it was fine. It seems that Intel understood that the TIM they used really inhibited the customers and technically all they did was just improve the product themselves while keeping the information on the IHS they will honor this. When I did mine i didn't even glue the IHS back on to this thing I sent sent it there and a few days later got a new one back.

I have yet to see anyone who has damaged the pcb try this and am curious myself, however I would say that if you damage that pcb while delidding then just silicon it back on to cover the markings and send it in honestly. But like Swag has stated I would definitely just tell them the truth and when people do that better things happen than just lying. If you need anything else let me know!


----------



## Swag

I started out the conversation with the rep I got with, does Intel cover a delidded CPU for RMA. He answered, technically no, but at the same time it is under the discretion of the representative whether or not they will allow it or not. In the end, he said that he would allow it because when the CPU arrives at the facility, they have to actually delid it themselves to see the markings on the PCB to make sure that the chip is actually an Intel Ivy Bridge and not another family.







I guess in our own weird way, we saved an employee the trouble of having to delid it themselves!


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I started out the conversation with the rep I got with, does Intel cover a delidded CPU for RMA. He answered, technically no, but at the same time it is under the discretion of the representative whether or not they will allow it or not. In the end, he said that he would allow it because when the CPU arrives at the facility, they have to actually delid it themselves to see the markings on the PCB to make sure that the chip is actually an Intel Ivy Bridge and not another family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess in our own weird way, we saved an employee the trouble of having to delid it themselves!


Now i'm curious as to how Intel delids their processors.


----------



## DarkReign32

Well...I have a delidded chip. Unfortunately I'm a clumsy oaf. I dropped it and it chipped a corner of the PCB. How screwed am I?




The vice method is pretty much fool proof. Unfortunately I'm a grander fool than most.


----------



## Reefa_Madness

Quote:


> Now i'm curious as to how Intel delids their processors.


They have a Zillion dollar machine with a special, million dollar Gillette blade attached to the end of a robotic arm for doing those types of tasks.

Its true...I read it on the Internet.









All kidding aside, it would be interesting to see how they do it, but I honestly would expect it to be mostly automated.


----------



## Reefa_Madness

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> Hey Reefa!
> 
> When I did that RMA for myself I actually went through their customer service twice and they both said that it was fine. It seems that Intel understood that the TIM they used really inhibited the customers and technically all they did was just improve the product themselves while keeping the information on the IHS they will honor this. When I did mine i didn't even glue the IHS back on to this thing I sent sent it there and a few days later got a new one back.
> 
> I have yet to see anyone who has damaged the pcb try this and am curious myself, however I would say that if you damage that pcb while delidding then just silicon it back on to cover the markings and send it in honestly. But like Swag has stated I would definitely just tell them the truth and when people do that better things happen than just lying. If you need anything else let me know!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> It doesn't matter, under Intel warranty, any physical alteration voids the warranty from that second on. However, there are still some good people out there willing to give a helping hand to someone who is nice. Just be friendly when you ask and if they grant it be happy, if they don't, then move on or try again.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> I started out the conversation with the rep I got with, does Intel cover a delidded CPU for RMA. He answered, technically no, but at the same time it is under the discretion of the representative whether or not they will allow it or not. In the end, he said that he would allow it because when the CPU arrives at the facility, they have to actually delid it themselves to see the markings on the PCB to make sure that the chip is actually an Intel Ivy Bridge and not another family. smile.gif I guess in our own weird way, we saved an employee the trouble of having to delid it themselves!


Thank you both for taking the time to share your personal experiences. I believe that you guys were both extremely fortunate that you got a CSR that was willing to work with you.

It would appear, based on what Swag said he was told ( "He answered, technically no, but at the same time it is under the discretion of the representative whether or not they will allow it or not."), that you can't really expect it to be covered, but you stand a chance, especially if the CPU is otherwise in good physical condition.

Will have to bookmark this discussion for future reference. Again, thanks for taking the time to reply.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Reefa_Madness*
> 
> Thank you both for taking the time to share your personal experiences. I believe that you guys were both extremely fortunate that you got a CSR that was willing to work with you.
> 
> It would appear, based on what Swag said he was told ( "He answered, technically no, but at the same time it is under the discretion of the representative whether or not they will allow it or not."), that you can't really expect it to be covered, but you stand a chance, especially if the CPU is otherwise in good physical condition.
> 
> Will have to bookmark this discussion for future reference. Again, thanks for taking the time to reply.


No problem Reefa


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Well...I have a delidded chip. Unfortunately I'm a clumsy oaf. I dropped it and it chipped a corner of the PCB. How screwed am I?
> 
> 
> 
> The vice method is pretty much fool proof. Unfortunately I'm a grander fool than most.


That's actually probably still okay. I'd just cover the exposed copper with something non-conductive before putting it in the socket, but there shouldn't be any traces way out there on the corner.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> That's actually probably still okay. I'd just cover the exposed copper with something non-conductive before putting it in the socket, but there shouldn't be any traces way out there on the corner.


Will do!









What would you suggest to use as a cover up? A dab of silicone? Or would something like a nail hardener do the trick?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Will do!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What would you suggest to use as a cover up? A dab of silicone? Or would something like a nail hardener do the trick?


A little silicon is good, but nail polish would work also.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> A little silicon is good, but nail polish would work also.


Wait..nail polish as in any old nail polish?


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Will do!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What would you suggest to use as a cover up? A dab of silicone?


Nail polish works very well but silicone could also work. But it might start peeling off over time.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quick question for you guys. Is it recommended to cover the on-die vrm with nail polish or nail hardener when using CLP/CLU? I have some on the way and I'd just like to be prepared.







That's also assuming my CPU is still in working order.

Edit:

I actually mean the little cap like things to the left of the cpu die. Not the on die vrm cause well...it's kinda sorta on the die and covered and all.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Quick question for you guys. Is it recommended to cover the on-die vrm with nail polish or nail hardener when using CLP/CLU? I have some on the way and I'd just like to be prepared.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's also assuming my CPU is still in working order.
> 
> Edit:
> 
> I actually mean the little cap like things to the left of the cpu die. Not the on die vrm cause well...it's kinda sorta on the die and covered and all.


Most people do, just to be on the safe side. Chances are the CLU won't get in them, but why take the chance. You can also cover them with non-conductive TIM, like MX-4 or something.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Most people do, just to be on the safe side. Chances are the CLU won't get in them, but why take the chance. You can also cover them with non-conductive TIM, like MX-4 or something.


Good to know! I didn't know I could use TIM as well. I have a tube or 4 of MX-4 somewhere. Might put them to use.








Thanks again for the info.


----------



## lilchronic

i put two coats of nail polish, then CLP on the die


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i put two coats of nail polish, then CLP on the die


Thanks! Does the colour of the nail polish matter? I'm joking of course. Although I should probably make sure there aren't any metal flakes in there.


----------



## DarkReign32

It still works! I used NT-H1 on the die and IHS. I have CLU on the way so I'll be changing it in about two weeks.

I don't have pre-delid result @ 4.5 with IBT. Does that mean I can't join the delid crew?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> It still works! I used NT-H1 on the die and IHS. I have CLU on the way so I'll be changing it in about two weeks.
> 
> I don't have pre-delid result @ 4.5 with IBT. Does that mean I can't join the delid crew?


gimme info and ill add you!


----------



## DarkReign32

OCN name: DarkReign32
CPU: i5 4670k
on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1 (for now)
ihs-TIM: Notctua HT-H1
Mhz gained: 100 (for now)
OC after delid: 4.9GHz
Temp drops: ~9C (based on XTU)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4f1ij9


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> OCN name: DarkReign32
> CPU: i5 4670k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1 (for now)
> ihs-TIM: Notctua HT-H1
> Mhz gained: 100 (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.9GHz
> Temp drops: ~9C (based on XTU)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4f1ij9


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> OCN name: DarkReign32
> CPU: i5 4670k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1 (for now)
> ihs-TIM: Notctua HT-H1
> Mhz gained: 100 (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.9GHz
> Temp drops: ~9C (based on XTU)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4f1ij9


wich metod do you use it? and, what results do you have with that TIM? i want buy it too, because is the only TIM than i can buy on my city


----------



## Cyro999

He dropped 9c, and you'd expect ~20 with good application of clu


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> wich metod do you use it? and, what results do you have with that TIM? i want buy it too, because is the only TIM than i can buy on my city


I used the vice method. Very simple and relatively safe. i did as the guide said and place the VRM's towards me just in case. A few good taps and it loosened. Also, yes approximately ~9C with NT-H1. I do have CLU on the way. I bought it off eBay. I found a seller that includes duties in the shipping cost. Where abouts do you live? NT-H1 was very easy to apply. You can try Gelid extreme as well. I would've tried with that first but I needed something right away.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!


Mwahahaha thanks! Another badge of honour.


----------



## Imprezzion

OCN name: Imprezzion
CPU: i7 3770K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: 250
OC after delid: 4.95Ghz
Temp drops: 22c. They glue of my IHS was very uneven and temps where very high even for stock clocks. I removed the glue entirely and used the clamping force of the socket to hold the IHS in place on the die. Works very very well and temps are scary low now.
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4xzzki



I just remembered I never even filled this in lol!

I am now running 4.95Ghz at 1.408v (load, my preferred LLC setting of ''High'' overvolts slightly idle to 1.440v but it doesn't matter as I have C-States and EIST enabled) and temps in LinX / IBT AVX are a max of 72c and in regular daily usage (lots of BF4 mostly







) they are usually around 58c max. 72c at 1.408v and nearly 5Ghz. That is scary low for a simple Swiftech H320 watercooling kit imo.

Oh also, check my RAM speed and timings in the CPU-Z validation. I looooove these handpicked Crucial Ballistix Elite's! Samsung HCH9 chips, bench decently high at 2500 9-10-10-24 and can do these clocks (actually they do 2200 as well) / timings 24/7 stable. 1000% memtest86+ tested and 14 hours of Prime95


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> I used the vice method. Very simple and relatively safe. i did as the guide said and place the VRM's towards me just in case. A few good taps and it loosened. Also, yes approximately ~9C with NT-H1. I do have CLU on the way. I bought it off eBay. I found a seller that includes duties in the shipping cost. Where abouts do you live? NT-H1 was very easy to apply. You can try Gelid extreme as well. I would've tried with that first but I needed something right away.


I'm living in Mexico City but the price of the TIM with taxes is ~17-18USD and is very difficult find TIMs from others brands.


----------



## Imprezzion

Little update on my post above.

It seems I found out what would get me to do 5Ghz. I needed a tad more VCCSA for it strangely enough.

I also slightly upped vCore by 0.025v for 1.432v load.

Here's my temps and such after 30 minutes of AVX LinX.
They are scary low.. ALmost so low I can't believe it... I mean, still didn't hit 70c and i'm running a 14.5GB AVX stresstest ffs... It's also not subzero in my room, it aint warm either but I don't consider 17c all that strangely cold?



Remember, this is not meant as a 100% stable test. Just preliminary as it usually BSOD's within 2-5 minutes of testing on 5Ghz.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> I'm living in Mexico City but the price of the TIM with taxes is ~17-18USD and is very difficult find TIMs from others brands.


That's actually better than what I paid. CLU wound up costing me $32 including shipping and tax.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> OCN name: Imprezzion
> CPU: i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: 250
> OC after delid: 4.95Ghz
> Temp drops: 22c. They glue of my IHS was very uneven and temps where very high even for stock clocks. I removed the glue entirely and used the clamping force of the socket to hold the IHS in place on the die. Works very very well and temps are scary low now.
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4xzzki
> 
> 
> 
> I just remembered I never even filled this in lol!
> 
> I am now running 4.95Ghz at 1.408v (load, my preferred LLC setting of ''High'' overvolts slightly idle to 1.440v but it doesn't matter as I have C-States and EIST enabled) and temps in LinX / IBT AVX are a max of 72c and in regular daily usage (lots of BF4 mostly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) they are usually around 58c max. 72c at 1.408v and nearly 5Ghz. That is scary low for a simple Swiftech H320 watercooling kit imo.
> 
> Oh also, check my RAM speed and timings in the CPU-Z validation. I looooove these handpicked Crucial Ballistix Elite's! Samsung HCH9 chips, bench decently high at 2500 9-10-10-24 and can do these clocks (actually they do 2200 as well) / timings 24/7 stable. 1000% memtest86+ tested and 14 hours of Prime95


You're in! (and updated







) Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> That's actually better than what I paid. CLU wound up costing me $32 including shipping and tax.


But i mean the Noctua.

Wich is better? AS5, NT-H1, MX-2, MX-4? I order a XSPC Raystorm 750 EX240


----------



## Cyro999

I chose mx4, may not be the best option - decent pastes are all reasonably close though. I'd avoid AS5 for the ridiculous curing time and capacitance


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> But i mean the Noctua.
> 
> Wich is better? AS5, NT-H1, MX-2, MX-4? I order a XSPC Raystorm 750 EX240


OH! I'm sorry I misunderstood. I would go with Gelid Extreme or the Noctua NT-H1. I've heard of MX-4 drying out a little quicker and from what I've seen the test results haven't been spectacular. If you're thinking AS5 then look for AS Ceramique. It should be half the price with close to equal performance. If I can find the thread that shows a few TIM's being tested, I will post.


----------



## arrow0309

Hi guys!
I "may" have an issue with my 3770K, successfully delidded last summer.
The cpu was starting to give me some stability issues, especially with the ram at 2133+ freqs (I used to have a Z77X-UP5 TH and the TridentX F3-2400C9D-8GTXD)
Later I first downclocked the ram from 2400 c9 (used to give a 1.20v of vccio even at 4.6ghz) at 2133 and then I finally decided to change the both MoBo and ram only keeping the cpu
So I recently set up this year my new system with the Z77 OC Formula and the RipjawsX 2x8Gb (F3-2133C9D-16GXH)

http://www.overclock.net/t/1041926/how-to-decide-on-a-case-for-air-cooling-warning-pics/2030#post_21643033

Ok, but this time I simply cannot use the 2133 and above freq certified for my ram wit any combination of the timings and/or manually set of the values or voltages (up to 1.65v vdram and 1.141v for the vccio)
All testing with the default cpu speed

I even started a 3d on the G.Skill forum, here:

http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?p=74193#post74193

I only managed to get the 2133 c9 @1.60v Xmp Profile 1 working with both of the ram modules on the middle (yellow) A2 dimm slot, but the other one (yellow) B2 slot is not working well
Downclocked at 1866 cl 9-10-10-28-1T @1.5v is working like a charm, lowering a lot my cpu vcore down to 1.208v (in offset at +0.030) in full load with Linx 0.6.5 (I used to give about 1.25-1.26v at 4.6Ghz for stability):

http://s27.postimg.org/et9bqs1cx/First_stable_LLC_Level_3.jpg

At this point do you confirm "it could be" the cpu's MC a bit faulty since my OCF is bran new?
I've even tested my Ripjaws on a friend's system with the Maximus V Extreme and worked fine "out of the box"

I'm planning to sell the cpu, doing well?
Or maybe I should try the RMA with the Intel directly?
However I live in Italy and I also used the CLU on the Ihs too, the readings are still visible though


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Hi guys!
> I "may" have an issue with my 3770K, successfully delidded last summer.
> The cpu was starting to give me some stability issues, especially with the ram at 2133+ freqs (I used to have a Z77X-UP5 TH and the TridentX F3-2400C9D-8GTXD)
> Later I first downclocked the ram from 2400 c9 (used to give a 1.20v of vccio even at 4.6ghz) at 2133 and then I finally decided to change the both MoBo and ram only keeping the cpu
> So I recently set up this year my new system with the Z77 OC Formula and the RipjawsX 2x8Gb (F3-2133C9D-16GXH)
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1041926/how-to-decide-on-a-case-for-air-cooling-warning-pics/2030#post_21643033
> 
> Ok, but this time I simply cannot use the 2133 and above freq certified for my ram wit any combination of the timings and/or manually set of the values or voltages (up to 1.65v vdram and 1.141v for the vccio)
> All testing with the default cpu speed
> 
> I even started a 3d on the G.Skill forum, here:
> 
> http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?p=74193#post74193
> 
> I only managed to get the 2133 c9 @1.60v Xmp Profile 1 working with both of the ram modules on the middle (yellow) A2 dimm slot, but the other one (yellow) B2 slot is not working well
> Downclocked at 1866 cl 9-10-10-28-1T @1.5v is working like a charm, lowering a lot my cpu vcore down to 1.208v (in offset at +0.030) in full load with Linx 0.6.5 (I used to give about 1.25-1.26v at 4.6Ghz for stability):
> 
> http://s27.postimg.org/et9bqs1cx/First_stable_LLC_Level_3.jpg
> 
> At this point do you confirm "it could be" the cpu's MC a bit faulty since my OCF is bran new?
> I've even tested my Ripjaws on a friend's system with the Maximus V Extreme and worked fine "out of the box"
> 
> I'm planning to sell the cpu, doing well?
> Or maybe I should try the RMA with the Intel directly?
> However I live in Italy and I also used the CLU on the Ihs too, the readings are still visible though


first off check the IHS and I am kind of curious why your ram is having these issues and that's kind of why I'm wary to get super high end ram above 2133 in my mind. Anywho, maybe I'm tired but have you talked with Gskill and requested an RMA of the RAM simply? thats what I would RMA first not the cpu but the RAM and then with the cpu it should be more than fine.

If i didnt make any sense there... I apologize sleepy val is sleepy. Nighty Night OCN Val off.


----------



## Swag

Would try RMA the RAM since it is quicker and faster than RMAing the CPU. Sounds like a RAM issue, but then again, the IMC may have been damaged during the delid.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Would try RMA the RAM since it is quicker and faster than RMAing the CPU. Sounds like a RAM issue, but then again, the IMC may have been damaged during the delid.


I kinda wanna say if anything on the cpu the IMC is a bit weaker from the high speed RAM. what you think?


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> first off check the IHS and I am kind of curious why your ram is having these issues and that's kind of why I'm wary to get super high end ram above 2133 in my mind. Anywho, maybe I'm tired but have you talked with Gskill and requested an RMA of the RAM simply? thats what I would RMA first not the cpu but the RAM and then with the cpu it should be more than fine.
> 
> If i didnt make any sense there... I apologize sleepy val is sleepy. Nighty Night OCN Val off.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Would try RMA the RAM since it is quicker and faster than RMAing the CPU. Sounds like a RAM issue, but then again, the IMC may have been damaged during the delid.


Ok, so I said the ram is 100% working on another pc with the M5E and 3770K, tested at 2133 with both 9-11-11-31 @1.60v and 11-11-11-31 @1.45v, it works fine

However my cpu too is OK, right now I even have a lower temp difference between the cores, I used to have more than 10°C before, now it's 6-7°C
And I even managed to improve a lot my 4.7Ghz offset daily, with a nice full load vcore:



It can't be the cpu









It's just a strange incompatibility between the G.Skill at 2133+ and my MoBo, confirmed one hour ago even by a friend of mine with the same OCF and G.Skills at 2133, had lots of freezes and was only solving by replacing the G.Skills with the Corsair Dominator 2133








I was happy to find out at least one more proof of the weird ram behaviour and maybe I'll do the same too
For now, at 1866 cl 9-10-10 @1.50v my cpu is running fine with inferior voltages


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Ok, so I said the ram is 100% working on another pc with the M5E and 3770K, tested at 2133 with both 9-11-11-31 @1.60v and 11-11-11-31 @1.45v, it works fine
> 
> However my cpu too is OK, right now I even have a lower temp difference between the cores, I used to have more than 10°C before, now it's 6-7°C
> And I even managed to improve a lot my 4.7Ghz offset daily, with a nice full load vcore:
> 
> 
> 
> It can't be the cpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's just a strange incompatibility between the G.Skill at 2133+ and my MoBo, confirmed one hour ago even by a friend of mine with the same OCF and G.Skills at 2133, had lots of freezes and was only solving by replacing the G.Skills with the Corsair Dominator 2133
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was happy to find out at least one more proof of the weird ram behaviour and maybe I'll do the same too
> For now, at 1866 cl 9-10-10 @1.50v my cpu is running fine with inferior voltages


get rid of all the mobos!!!!


----------



## arrow0309

Ok! I'll make an exception for you!








From now on, no more *mo*ther*bo*ard*s* in this 3d


----------



## Valgaur

Are you going to get a different motherboard?


----------



## arrow0309

Are you kidding?!?
No way, I may test the ram on another system with the same OCF just for the final proof of incompatibility
And then I'll have to either stay like this (1866 cl9) or swap the G'Skills with the Dominators (or the Vengeance Pro) but only with the 2133 2x8Gb Kit


----------



## Swag

My opinion is either CPU, RAM or clocks. I barely see mobos fail nowadays especially how they're built. I'd recommend going to stock and trying to see if the RAM actually needs more VDIMM than what is said. Take this as a learning curve, learn from it and diagnose it yourself. If you can do it, you can finally say you're a PC enthusiast.


----------



## Swag

A question to any of you, does anyone know how to stop DDOS?


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My opinion is either CPU, RAM or clocks. I *barely see mobos fail nowadays* especially how they're built. I'd recommend going to stock and trying to see if the RAM actually needs more VDIMM than what is said. Take this as a learning curve, learn from it and diagnose it yourself. If you can do it, you can finally say you're a PC enthusiast.


Lol, I will always try to diagnose the mobo first unless it's an AMD system, intel's, I look at board first, then ram (especially GSkill, I've had horrible luck with them in our shop) and if not them, then CPU. Just my experience from 7 years of computer store ownership.....

I should say that I will usually suspect a motherboard before most any other part in a build.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My opinion is either CPU, RAM or clocks. I *barely see mobos fail nowadays* especially how they're built. I'd recommend going to stock and trying to see if the RAM actually needs more VDIMM than what is said. Take this as a learning curve, learn from it and diagnose it yourself. If you can do it, you can finally say you're a PC enthusiast.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol, I will always try to diagnose the mobo first unless it's an AMD system, intel's, I look at board first, then ram (especially GSkill, I've had horrible luck with them in our shop) and if not them, then CPU. Just my experience from 7 years of computer store ownership.....
> 
> I should say that I will usually suspect a motherboard before most any other part in a build.
Click to expand...

I look at PSU first, then RAM. PSUs tend to have a lot of problems no matter what brand so I check it regardless. Also since RAM can cause a crash in 1 second if a single hiccup happens, I check that too.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I look at PSU first, then RAM. PSUs tend to have a lot of problems no matter what brand so I check it regardless. Also since RAM can cause a crash in 1 second if a single hiccup happens, I check that too.


I agree, but what I will check first really depends on the symptoms the system/client present it with. Always a variable in there somewhere!!!


----------



## incog

I don't think it's possible to stop DDOS.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A question to any of you, does anyone know how to stop DDOS?


Phone your provider.

If a DDOS attack is able to reach your network, it's too late to really stop it. Your provider needs to block/filter it before it reaches its target.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> A question to any of you, does anyone know how to stop DDOS?
> 
> 
> 
> Phone your provider.
> 
> If a DDOS attack is able to reach your network, it's too late to really stop it. Your provider needs to block/filter it before it reaches its target.
Click to expand...

Thanks. Will try that method.


----------



## lilchronic

bout to RMA my delided 4770k will see how it goes, it died because i bought a open box mobo on newegg and had bent pins in the socket







it worked for a few day's and then one morning it just never turned back on, so i took it out inspected everything and found bent pins on the mobo so RMA'd it . just got a new board today and i get the same error (00) code. so i got my RMA accepted @ intel and will be sending it tomorrow.

hopefully everything goes well

i also glued the ihs back on but i left the clp on maybe i should of put regular tim on before i glued it ?


----------



## alucardis666

Best of luck bud!


----------



## lilchronic

yeah thanks will see how it goes









this is what im using now , i tried the asus ROG motherboard and it killed my 4770k







had to go back to the trusty ol oc formula what a great board


----------



## Turt1e

My 4670K is dead and delidded. Do you guys think Intel will approve my RMA?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> My 4670K is dead and delidded. Do you guys think Intel will approve my RMA?


Did you kill it while delliding?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> My 4670K is dead and delidded. Do you guys think Intel will approve my RMA?


are their scratches on the pcb?? can we have a picture?


----------



## lilchronic

yeah the first time i delided i messed up my cpu didnt bother trying to RMA since physically ruined it


this time it just died...... im pretty sure from the bent pins on the mobo


----------



## Turt1e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> are their scratches on the pcb?? can we have a picture?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Did you kill it while delliding?


I didn't kill it from delidding, it worked for 4 months and suddenly failed.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> I didn't kill it from delidding, it worked for 4 months and suddenly failed.


oh then seal it adn send it in... you didnt LAP it correct?


----------



## Turt1e

No. What should I seal it with?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Turt1e*
> 
> No. What should I seal it with?



thats what i used


----------



## incog

^ You should be more explicit as to what it is so people don't have to squint at their screens to try to figure out what kind of glue it is, how much it costs, where it can be found, etc. No doubt it's inexpensive and can be found at hardware stores, but I still don't know what kind of glue that is.


----------



## DarkReign32

I believe it says 3M Black Super Weatherstrip Adhesive.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> ^ You should be more explicit as to what it is so people don't have to squint at their screens to try to figure out what kind of glue it is, how much it costs, where it can be found, etc. No doubt it's inexpensive and can be found at hardware stores, but I still don't know what kind of glue that is.


You know you can click on any picture at OCN to see a bigger version, and then click on Original under that to see the full sized version


----------



## mercs213

Is it possible to delid an i3-4130 or i5-4670?


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> ^ You should be more explicit as to what it is so people don't have to squint at their screens to try to figure out what kind of glue it is, how much it costs, where it can be found, etc. No doubt it's inexpensive and can be found at hardware stores, but I still don't know what kind of glue that is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know you can click on any picture at OCN to see a bigger version, and then click on Original under that to see the full sized version
Click to expand...

My bad. q_q i apologize for the mistake.

still though, what kind of glue is feather glue?

also you can delid a i5 4670 or i3 4xxx if you want to, however there's no real need to because the way it's clocked, even with the stock cooler, it'll never attain dangerous temperatures. delids are useful when you're overclocking a haswell chip, 4670k or 4770k for example, and you want to drop your temperatures so your overclock isn't limited by very high temperatures. aside from getting a good cooler, a delid will knock off quite a few degrees, especially with the use and proper application of CLU.

I think the TDP limit for soldering on Intel chips is 95, I could be wrong.


----------



## mercs213

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> also you can delid a i5 4670 or i3 4xxx if you want to, however there's no real need to because the way it's clocked, even with the stock cooler, it'll never attain dangerous temperatures. delids are useful when you're overclocking a haswell chip, 4670k or 4770k for example, and you want to drop your temperatures so your overclock isn't limited by very high temperatures. aside from getting a good cooler, a delid will knock off quite a few degrees, especially with the use and proper application of CLU.
> 
> I think the TDP limit for soldering on Intel chips is 95, I could be wrong.


Oh I know.. this is overclock.net though...


----------



## incog

Damn right. I myself use a 4670 ... which I delidded. It doesn't really serve a purpose but that doesn't mean you can't do it for the learning experience or fun. So, yes, the 4670 can be dlidded.


----------



## vieuxchnock

*I want to delid my 4770k. I will use the EK precise mount naked kit for my cpu block.Should I use CLU or Gelid CG Extrem on the dye as I wont put back the IHS?*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vieuxchnock*
> 
> *I want to delid my 4770k. I will use the EK precise mount naked kit for my cpu block.Should I use CLU or Gelid CG Extrem on the dye as I wont put back the IHS?*


CLU


----------



## vieuxchnock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> CLU


*Thanks.*


----------



## fragamemnon

Spoiler: off-topic



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> ^ You should be more explicit as to what it is so people don't have to squint at their screens to try to figure out what kind of glue it is, how much it costs, where it can be found, etc. No doubt it's inexpensive and can be found at hardware stores, but I still don't know what kind of glue that is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You know you can click on any picture at OCN to see a bigger version, and then click on Original under that to see the full sized version
Click to expand...

Or middle-click it.



On a side note, I am still sad of the temps the stock cooler handles my chip at.








While mining, I'm up to 80oC. 3570k.


----------



## fleetfeather

Why aren't people recommending CLP for naked die mounts? Just curious


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Why aren't people recommending CLP for naked die mounts? Just curious


I have used CLP and CLU and CLU performs a little better on the temps. Only by a degree or two. CLU is easier to clean up and it spreads a little easier thicker than the CLP. The challenge of a good naked die mount is making sure all the surface of the block is making good flat contact with the die and the thinner the TIM the more difficult it is to do. If good contact isn't made the chip will heat up fast and not boot. Also don't mount so tight. Just a gentle hand tight mount on naked die mount. Has to be just right or the chip won't boot.


----------



## fleetfeather

Fair enough


----------



## incog

It's important to not use CLP/CLU in direct contact with an aluminium baseplate (or whatever it's called), unless I'm mistaken. CLP/CLU just eats through aluminium.

Not 100% sure, more like 90%, which isn't enough, so maybe someone can confirm. Either way, something to take into account if doing naked die.


----------



## fragamemnon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> It's important to not use CLP/CLU in direct contact with an aluminium baseplate (or whatever it's called), unless I'm mistaken. CLP/CLU just eats through aluminium.
> 
> Not 100% sure, more like 90%, which isn't enough, so maybe someone can confirm. Either way, something to take into account if doing naked die.


Yes. It is the Gallium in it.


Spoiler: I'll just leave this here ...again



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fragamemnon*
> 
> Potatoes inbound..


----------



## incog

So looks like it's safe to put on copper ?

Dang, I feel bad for that cooler. RIP cooler.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> So looks like it's safe to put on copper ?
> 
> Dang, I feel bad for that cooler. RIP cooler.


Only high quality copper.


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Hey guys, so I just delidded my 3770k successfully but I'm only seeing about a 5c drop in temps. I used CLU on the die and have an H60 CPU cooler. I run 4.6GHz at 1.3v under load, 1.37v before droop.

I think I messed something up, I should be getting a bigger drop in temps, right?

When I clamped the CPU down the IHS slid a bit (maybe 1mm), could this drastically affect temps? Also, I'm not sure if I applied the CLU correctly. Here's a pic.



I only applied it to the die, I smoothed it out a little after this pic was taken. Did I use too much? Should I have put CLU on the IHS? Also, I'm used TX-2 TIM.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> Hey guys, so I just delidded my 3770k successfully but I'm only seeing about a 5c drop in temps. I used CLU on the die and have an H60 CPU cooler. I run 4.6GHz at 1.3v under load, 1.37v before droop.
> 
> I think I messed something up, I should be getting a bigger drop in temps, right?
> 
> When I clamped the CPU down the IHS slid a bit (maybe 1mm), could this drastically affect temps? Also, I'm not sure if I applied the CLU correctly. Here's a pic.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only applied it to the die, I smoothed it out a little after this pic was taken. Did I use too much? Should I have put CLU on the IHS? Also, I'm used TX-2 TIM.


Did you use that q-tip to apply the CLU?
didnt it come with a brush?
It kinda looks like you put on a REALLY thin layer of CLU and then dumped a handful of flower on it.. I would get it out of the PC fast, before something happens..
Clean the die with alchohol or what ever you use and restart..
It should looks something like this:

Not the "Perfect" application, but I get 19 degree drop.
If you can, re apply and send a pic before putting it back in the PC, we will tell you if it looks ok









A tiny drop on the die, spread it with the brush..
Apply the rest of the CLU left on the brush, to the underside of the IHS.

Other than that, it looks like a healthy delid (with bad CLU application) so, congratz!









*Edit
Just saw the pic in full size.. might not be q-tip material, but just the light..
If there is NO q-tip material in the CLU (as I first thought), then maybe you put on too much.


----------



## lilchronic

it really should look like this











... u dont want that stuff splattering all around either, it can be very messy


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

No, I used the brush. The qtip was in the background, I used that to remove TIM.

Also I just tore apart my entire PC and I found that the TIM application on the IHS wasn't all too good so that might have something to do with it. Regardless I'm going to reapply the CLU...

So, more or less? Or just more evenly? I got it as evenly as I could, the provided brush seems to make streaks.


----------



## lilchronic




----------



## GaMbi2004

@lilchronic On my pic, there is indeed some splatter.. I cleaned it up before putting it back together, just forgot to take a new pic









@chiknnwatrmln hard to tell from a pic.. I would guess less, and the streaks that you see on my pics isnt that big of a deal.. they will get flatend out when IHS comes back on.
You also mentioned that the IHS moved in the vice.. is there any visible damage to it? pics?
Good luck on the re application







hope you see a bit better temps!


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

The IHS moves when the CPU is clamped down in the socket, not on the vice. I used a razor to delid.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> The IHS moves when the CPU is clamped down in the socket, not on the vice. I used a razor to delid.


Oooh








Well, I would think, aslong as the flaps on both sides of the IHS is more or less centered, your fine..
You can ether:
Move the IHS higher so that it will slight down to center, or
Hold the IHS in place while you clamp it down
I prefer the latter since I dont like the idea of the IHS slighting on top of the die WITH pressure on it

*Edit
Nice job on the delid again.. didnt know you used razor







I dont see ANY scratches in the PCB, nicely done


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Thanks, I was super careful, getting the IHS off alone took like 20 min.


----------



## Hanshin

A little tip for those who want to delid with razor or do not have access to a vice: open one corner with the razor, and use a plastified card (I used a member card of some store here in Japan) to cut all the other sides.
Here some example by someone on Youtube:





I delidded myself 2 CPUs like that, and delidding my 4770k took me 45 seconds.








Just be careful on the SMD capacitators side of the 4770k, but there are a lot less risks than the razor alone.


----------



## Cyro999

^Looks good to me! I'd probably go around the die though instead of just jamming card in


----------



## Hanshin

@Cyro999 That's what I did, as I didn't want to damage the capacitators and I wasn't comfortable with the "slice" technic of the video. Very fast, and no risk of scratching the pcb (well, apart the initial cut







).


----------



## GaMbi2004

I bet he/she only went over the die to make a speed delid for the vidoe..
Looks insane ;D I vote for video on the OP.. Ill definitely be using that method next time I have to delid.. awesome stuff ^^


----------



## Valgaur

teaser for new build








build log in the works so give vagur time









(have been busy failing on my benching this weekend, but I'm back now)


----------



## Valgaur

http://www.overclock.net/t/1464058/build-log-sr-2-folding-ultimate-rig-2013


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

So I went to remove the CLU because I thought it wasn't applied correctly..

I found pretty bad contact with the IHS, so I thought I'd redo it.

I went to remove the CLU and scratched the living daylights out of my die, enough that I head the scratching and stopped immediately. I used a qtip and iso and gently as I could removed the rest of it.... Here's the damage.



Now my die already had marks on it before I did anything, even apply CLU. The scratches don't seem deep enough to do real damage, but I know that they will affect thermal conductivity.

I really hope I didn't kill my CPU, this chip is pretty good and I don't want to buy another.

I guess I will find out once I get my loop built.

Edit: I lapped on a ton of CLU to the point where, when the chip is held vertically, a lot would gather near the bottom of the die. I ended up wiping off just enough so that didn't happen, but the entire die was still covered. It's near impossible to get a perfect application of this stuff, there were still a bunch of spots where it wasn't smooth. Oh well. If my temps are that bad I'll remove this stuff and use some TX-2.


----------



## Cyro999

Should hopefully be ok, die is under a cover anyway


----------



## TheSimon

For deliding the 4770k do i need something to cover exposed transistors or will TIM be fine?


----------



## Hanshin

If you use CLU, you should cover the capacitors with tape while you apply the CLU on the die by security.
Once you reput the IHS in place, you can choose to let them exposed or cover it with non conductive paste/electrical tape/nail polish.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheSimon*
> 
> For deliding the 4770k do i need something to cover exposed transistors or will TIM be fine?


MX-4 will work on those but I take the safe route and always suggest LET (Liquid Electrical Tape)


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

If you get CLU where you don't want it, learn from me and don't just wipe it off... Liquid metal is very abrasive.

A qtip with iso alcohol and gentleness works perfectly.


----------



## Supacasey

So I went to a friend's house to delid his 4770k for him. Vice method, went fine, cleaned it up, insulated caps with LET, was ready to apply my CLU when I noticed it wasn't budging. It looks like it hardened in the syringe. Anything I can do about it or am I stuck ordering another tube? I don't know why it hardened, I stored it with the cap on and in my living room that gets no hotter or colder than 76f.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> So I went to a friend's house to delid his 4770k for him. Vice method, went fine, cleaned it up, insulated caps with LET, was ready to apply my CLU when I noticed it wasn't budging. It looks like it hardened in the syringe. Anything I can do about it or am I stuck ordering another tube? I don't know why it hardened, I stored it with the cap on and in my living room that gets no hotter or colder than 76f.


It's gonna sound weird, but, try heating a cup of water in the microwave for 90 seconds, take the hot cup of water and put the syringe in it for about 5-10 minutes, it should flow really well after that!!

DO NOT PUT THE CLU IN THE MICROWAVE!!!!!! Just the water to heat it!!!

Edit: IF that doesn't work, it's time for a new tube.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> So I went to a friend's house to delid his 4770k for him. Vice method, went fine, cleaned it up, insulated caps with LET, was ready to apply my CLU when I noticed it wasn't budging. It looks like it hardened in the syringe. Anything I can do about it or am I stuck ordering another tube? I don't know why it hardened, I stored it with the cap on and in my living room that gets no hotter or colder than 76f.


This happened to @Belial too. Throw him a PM


----------



## Valgaur

Some times batches just have a bad mix. So sadly you'll need a different one


----------



## Supacasey

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> It's gonna sound weird, but, try heating a cup of water in the microwave for 90 seconds, take the hot cup of water and put the syringe in it for about 5-10 minutes, it should flow really well after that!!
> 
> DO NOT PUT THE CLU IN THE MICROWAVE!!!!!! Just the water to heat it!!!
> 
> Edit: IF that doesn't work, it's time for a new tube.


I actually tried something close to that, I filled two ziplock bags with boiling water and sandwiched the tube between them. No dice.

What concerns me now is that I delidded the processor in a current build and used that same tube before it hardened, about two months ago. I have yet to try running it. The CLU in the cap and around the nozzle of the syringe weren't hardened, though... How boned am I?


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> I actually tried something close to that, I filled two ziplock bags with boiling water and sandwiched the tube between them. No dice.
> 
> What concerns me now is that I delidded the processor in a current build and used that same tube before it hardened, about two months ago. I have yet to try running it. The CLU in the cap and around the nozzle of the syringe weren't hardened, though... How boned am I?


I think you will be ok. But, that's just my opinion. The CLU "hardens" once it's applied to you CPU in the first place, it's just that it hardened in the tube here also.......


----------



## Supacasey

Tried the hot water dunk, no difference.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> Tried the hot water dunk, no difference.


Time for a new tube then, sorry dude!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> I actually tried something close to that, I filled two ziplock bags with boiling water and sandwiched the tube between them. No dice.
> 
> What concerns me now is that I delidded the processor in a current build and used that same tube before it hardened, about two months ago. I have yet to try running it. The CLU in the cap and around the nozzle of the syringe weren't hardened, though... How boned am I?


that happened to me also ..... i contacted coolabs and told them what happened and how i only got one application out of the tube. they sent me another one for free but i alo bought one so they gave me two for the price of one


----------



## GaMbi2004

doe to the recent posts, I checked my CLU syringe.. it is still as fluid as when I first got it (7 months ago). seams like a bad batch on all who have hardened CLU or bad storage? mine has been in the dark at 25-27 degree C.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> bout to RMA my delided 4770k will see how it goes, it died because i bought a open box mobo on newegg and had bent pins in the socket
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it worked for a few day's and then one morning it just never turned back on, so i took it out inspected everything and found bent pins on the mobo so RMA'd it . just got a new board today and i get the same error (00) code. so i got my RMA accepted @ intel and will be sending it tomorrow.
> 
> hopefully everything goes well
> 
> i also glued the ihs back on but i left the clp on maybe i should of put regular tim on before i glued it ?


got a new cpu back


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Add me please.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!




CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: TX-2 (for now, going to switch to Indigo Xtreme when I get around to it)
Mhz gained: 200
OC after delid: 4.8GHz daily
Temp drops: 25c (also switched to custom loop)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/6rrcjn


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> got a new cpu back


Gratz body!!
Did you tell them the whole story? glued it back together?
When will the new one be delidded? ;D
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> Add me please.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: TX-2 (for now, going to switch to Indigo Xtreme when I get around to it)
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz daily
> Temp drops: 25c (also switched to custom loop)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/6rrcjn


Gratz!
Dunno about the 25 degree drop since you changed the cooler.. might only be 10 degree gain from delid and 15 from new cooler








Would guess closer to 15-20 and rest from cooler.. but a good drop no matter what!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Gratz body!!
> Did you tell them the whole story? glued it back together?
> When will the new one be delidded? ;D
> Gratz!
> Dunno about the 25 degree drop since you changed the cooler.. might only be 10 degree gain from delid and 15 from new cooler
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would guess closer to 15-20 and rest from cooler.. but a good drop no matter what!


no i didnt tell them that i delided it









and ill delid it in a lil bit guna get some test in so i can show before and after temps


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> Add me please.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: TX-2 (for now, going to switch to Indigo Xtreme when I get around to it)
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz daily
> Temp drops: 25c (also switched to custom loop)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/6rrcjn


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Sweet.

My 3770k ran around 85c at 1.3v at 4.6GHz before, now I'm running 1.39v at 4.8GHz and under 65c, depending on ambient. Custom loop beats out H60 any day.

At the same speeds as before I don't think I broke 60c.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

This is a damn good video of how to delid a processor and not mess it up. And do it in 45 seconds.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> This is a damn good video of how to delid a processor and not mess it up. And do it in 45 seconds.


thats how ive done mine the past 3 times









guna need a new card next time it's pretty beat up


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thats how ive done mine the past 3 times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> guna need a new card next time it's pretty beat up


Can you still go right through with the haswell's? Not that a piece of plastic would harm the caps on the side but just curious.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Can you still go right through with the haswell's? Not that a piece of plastic would harm the caps on the side but just curious.


i kinda go around the outside only where the glue is


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i kinda go around the outside only where the glue is


Yeah figured as much. Better safe than sorry. I may give this method a go with my friends 4770. So far I've tried the vice method. Worked great. This method seems just as easy.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Yeah figured as much. Better safe than sorry. I may give this method a go with my friends 4770. So far I've tried the vice method. Worked great. This method seems just as easy.


it works great really easy and a lot harder to damage the chip like that although you do have to find a corner thats easy to get under with a razor then finish it off with the card


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> it works great really easy and a lot harder to damage the chip like that although you do have to find a corner thats easy to get under with a razor then finish it off with the card


I figure I'll get some super thin blades and start far far way from the caps near the left of the cpu lol.


----------



## RickRockerr

Because i'm not running direct die anymore I felt like testing CLU & CLP with IHS.
I used MX-4 between IHS and block on both test.
I made both tests in same ambient and started with same water temp.

Here's the results:
3570K @ 4.8Ghz 1.3V

IBT standard test:

CLU

Max: 62,64,62,59
Average: 52,52,51,52

CLP

Max:57,59,62,58
Average: 48,48,51,48


----------



## Drop4205

Well I delidded my 3770k and followed the forum here. I was a little scared at first as this is my first build, but I wanted to see if it was worth all the hype. Before delid prime 95 running 4.7 at 1.260v my temps were 79,84,89,86. After delid with coollabratory liquid ultra on die and tx-4 on lapped heatsink my temps were high of 56,60,66,62. Absolutely amazed at how it turned out cause at first my idle temps were only 3c cooler after delid. Its not till the load hits where u see the differences. 




My system is Thermaltake level 10gt,Maximus5Formula,3770k,Corsair h100i, gtx670,samsung pro840 356gb, Corsair 860i, 8g gskill 1866 ram


----------



## Icydead

Guys so is Intel accepting delidded cpus for replacement or not ? From the transcript at the beggining of this topic I understand that they DO, but I just spoke with intel agent on chat, and he said that no way.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Icydead*
> 
> Guys so is Intel accepting delidded cpus for replacement or not ? From the transcript at the beggining of this topic I understand that they DO, but I just spoke with intel agent on chat, and he said that no way.


From everything I have read it goes like this. If you tell intel you delided you are not getting an rma. However if you do not include that info anywhere and the lid is secured to the pcb .You will most likley get an RMA.

Is it dishonest? I guess we all have different values so thats up to the individual.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> From everything I have read it goes like this. If you tell intel you delided you are not getting an rma. However if you do not include that info anywhere and the lid is secured to the pcb .You will most likley get an RMA.
> 
> Is it dishonest? I guess we all have different values so thats up to the individual.


^^ this









and also we shouldent have to delid to get better temps....... so it's there fault







i dont think it's wrong


----------



## Icydead

Ok ok


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> From everything I have read it goes like this. If you tell intel you delided you are not getting an rma. However if you do not include that info anywhere and the lid is secured to the pcb .You will most likley get an RMA.
> 
> Is it dishonest? I guess we all have different values so thats up to the individual.


Val got his though


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> ^^ this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and also we shouldent have to delid to get better temps....... so it's there fault
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i dont think it's wrong


honestly it's not Intel fault.

The reason the Ivy and Haswell families aren't fluxless solder is because the die transistor of the manometers is so small and compact is that it can't move the heat fast enough. However with fluxless solder on families like Sandy they were having issues with cracked dies and cpu's just breaking during normal stuff on Ivy, Haswell with the solder. So Intel had to use the paste that they did. which actually is pretty good TIM, HOWEVER the issue is the glue they use is a bit different in that it expands a smidge creating more space and material for the heat to go through creating a bigger heat build up in the TIM resulting in the heat that we see.


----------



## lilchronic

i didnt really test good enough to compare
but before delid @ 4.6Ghz with 1.325v temps were hitting 80c


this was all the thermal paste..........? well there also was i small piece dried up right out of the camera view but that was it very little themal paste when i took it apart i was kinda shocked


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> this was all the thermal paste..........? well there also was i small piece dried up right out of the camera view but that was it very little themal paste when i took it apart i was kinda shocked


That's perfectly covered. Too much TIM can be worse than too little. It only needs to fill up the pits and remove the air between ajoining surfaces.


----------



## El Media Vida

Can i join?


----------



## Wihglah

OCN name: Wihglah
CPU: 4770K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: Gelid GE-E
Mhz gained: +100mhz
OC after delid : 4500Mhz
Temp drops: On average dropped ~14*C

http://s295.photobucket.com/user/wihglah/media/Mobile Uploads/20140208_202517_zpse169a91e.jpg.html

http://s295.photobucket.com/user/wihglah/media/Mobile Uploads/20140208_205229_zps3d02dee9.jpg.html



http://valid.canardpc.com/dy0v84



Highest core temp : 54*C

No lapping, minor polishing with metal polish only.

Damn - forgot to write my name on the photos. Not taking it out again though.

Is there a bed in period for the CLP?


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

I don't think there is.


----------



## Wihglah

I'm going to go ahead and call 4.5Ghz stable - which is a 100mhz improvement over before.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> OCN name: Wihglah
> CPU: 4770K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: Gelid GE-E
> Mhz gained: +100mhz
> OC after delid : 4500Mhz
> Temp drops: On average dropped ~14*C
> 
> http://s295.photobucket.com/user/wihglah/media/Mobile Uploads/20140208_202517_zpse169a91e.jpg.html
> 
> http://s295.photobucket.com/user/wihglah/media/Mobile Uploads/20140208_205229_zps3d02dee9.jpg.html
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/dy0v84
> 
> 
> 
> Highest core temp : 54*C
> 
> No lapping, minor polishing with metal polish only.
> 
> Damn - forgot to write my name on the photos. Not taking it out again though.
> 
> Is there a bed in period for the CLP?


You're in!!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## bartledoo

OCN name: Bartledoo
CPU: 3570k
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: mx-4
Mhz gained: 0
Temp drops: about 20C


----------



## Wirerat

OCN name: Wirerat
CPU: 4670k
On-die TIM: Gelid Solutions
IHS TIM: Gelid Solutions
Mhz gained: 100 mhz
OC after delid : 4.7Ghz
Temp drops: On average dropped ~14*C
H110 Cooler

I gave it a shot Using Gelid Solutiions. I believe this is good enough for me seeing as I dont want to add anymore voltage for higher OC.



Here is the max settings I could run IBT before delid. You can see its scary high temps and only 200mb runs. Standard settings IBT run would shut my pc down.



after delid on same weak 200mb. Much better.

[

Here is a IBT run on High. I can actually pass it now.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bartledoo*
> 
> OCN name: Bartledoo
> CPU: 3570k
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: mx-4
> Mhz gained: 0
> Temp drops: about 20C


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> OCN name: Wirerat
> CPU: 4670k
> On-die TIM: Gelid Solutions
> IHS TIM: Gelid Solutions
> Mhz gained: 100 mhz
> OC after delid : 4.7Ghz
> Temp drops: On average dropped ~14*C
> H110 Cooler
> 
> I gave it a shot Using Gelid Solutiions. I believe this is good enough for me seeing as I dont want to add anymore voltage for higher OC.
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the max settings I could run IBT before delid. You can see its scary high temps and only 200mb runs. Standard settings IBT run would shut my pc down.
> 
> 
> 
> after delid on same weak 200mb. Much better.
> 
> [
> 
> Here is a IBT run on High. I can actually pass it now.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## El Media Vida

OCN name: El Media Vida
CPU: 4670K
On-die TIM: AS5
IHS TIM: AS5
OC after delid : 4300Mhz
Temp drops: I don't know, i don't test it before dellid.







GPU-Z Validator http://valid.canardpc.com/jzlqhp


----------



## feznz

Another successful delid with my favorite rusty hammer.
I could do a bit better on the TIM spread was 85+ degrees on all cores with about 5degree variance. now 12degrees variance but all in all almost a 20degree drop on core1 and 10degrees on the rest is not bad.
I think I might get a fresh tube I might go for some PK1 as I just used the XSPC K2 TIM included with my waterblock it had signs of separation


----------



## GaMbi2004

OMG ;D was that 6 new delids in 24 hours?
awesome ^^

Congrats to all of you!









*edit.
Closer to 12 hours







and another 3-4 delids 24 hours before that..


----------



## Wihglah

I lapped and polished my IHS.

Results seem small so far - maybe 1 or 2*C.

I suppose I'm into diminishing returns now.

My full load temps are now comparable to when I had my chiller (which idled the CPU at 0*C)


----------



## Fuzzysham

OCN name: Fuzzysham
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS TIM: NT-H1
OC after delid : 4500
Temp drops: 15-25c depending on H100i fan speeds (i.e. quiet, performance, custom)

Deliding is the most "overclocky" type thing I've done and I am quite impressed with the results.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> OCN name: El Media Vida
> CPU: 4670K
> On-die TIM: AS5
> IHS TIM: AS5
> OC after delid : 4300Mhz
> Temp drops: I don't know, i don't test it before dellid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GPU-Z Validator http://valid.canardpc.com/jzlqhp


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another successful delid with my favorite rusty hammer.
> I could do a bit better on the TIM spread was 85+ degrees on all cores with about 5degree variance. now 12degrees variance but all in all almost a 20degree drop on core1 and 10degrees on the rest is not bad.
> I think I might get a fresh tube I might go for some PK1 as I just used the XSPC K2 TIM included with my waterblock it had signs of separation


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Fuzzysham*
> 
> OCN name: Fuzzysham
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: NT-H1
> OC after delid : 4500
> Temp drops: 15-25c depending on H100i fan speeds (i.e. quiet, performance, custom)
> 
> Deliding is the most "overclocky" type thing I've done and I am quite impressed with the results.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!







(Didn't see you as I kept my page open last night to remind myself of the other two, but you're in now)


----------



## Tcoppock

How is this Delid? Is This Chip Good?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tcoppock*
> 
> How is this Delid? Is This Chip Good?


I'f it's totally stable the yeah thats pretty darn good


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Yeah, my 3770k requires just under 1.3v for 4.6GHz..


----------



## El Media Vida

Hi guys, i want OC my 4670k @4.5 (or more) but i don't know too much, what things have to change on the BIOS to maintain stable OC? I have a Asus M6H. On IB was more easy do OC but on haswell i think is more difficult.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Hi guys, i want OC my 4670k @4.5 (or more) but i don't know too much, what things have to change on the BIOS to maintain stable OC? I have a Asus M6H. On IB was more easy do OC but on haswell i think is more difficult.


I recommend starting here. It's a good guide.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-thread-with-statistics


----------



## rabidz7

No need to delid a Power8... Each die is a CPU with its own front side bus. 7GHz stock, 36MB L3 cache, 64-Bit PowerPC


----------



## Heimdallr

I have delidded a 4770K and i want to use it naked, tomorrow the EK kit for the Supremacy will hopefully be delivered.
I want to use it naked and i would like to know how do you guys apply the thermal paste, do you use the pea method or it's better to apply a line on the cores?

Thanks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Are so many peoples here so blatantly stupid that they put an IHS onto a CPU that has been already delidded?!


removing the glue and then using the IHS with better TIM is what delidding is about. Watch what you say in this thread without reading








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heimdallr*
> 
> I have delidded a 4770K and i want to use it naked, tomorrow the EK kit for the Supremacy will hopefully be delivered.
> I want to use it naked and i would like to know how do you guys apply the thermal paste, do you use the pea method or it's better to apply a line on the cores?
> 
> Thanks


I use a pea method but I also flatten it out to make sure it covers the entire die.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heimdallr*
> 
> I have delidded a 4770K and i want to use it naked, tomorrow the EK kit for the Supremacy will hopefully be delivered.
> I want to use it naked and i would like to know how do you guys apply the thermal paste, do you use the pea method or it's better to apply a line on the cores?
> 
> Thanks


naked requires a lot less thermal paste, because the die is roughly 1/4-1/3 the size of the IHS on the top, so dont use more than 1/2 grain of rice...a pea size glob is WAAAAAAAAAAY too much. I like the line method spread even with a credit card. You should also look into Coolabratory Lidquid Pro/Utlra, it has a different spread method, but is in a class of its own for TIM on die.


----------



## rabidz7

Deliding is the use of a CPU without a lid. ANY use of an IHS is a great way to boost heat for no reason! Use a half-rice size amount of paste on every centimeter^2 of die. Trust me. I've had a PowerPC970MP where I used a pea size of thermal paste on its tiny centimeter die; the paste got under the gasket and shorted a few capacitors. I thought I'd fried it, but I then saw the paste everywhere! I dishwashed the CPU and it worked great afterwards, true story.


----------



## Krullmeister

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> Deliding is the use of a CPU without a lid. ANY use of an IHS is a great way to boost heat for no reason! Use a half-rice size amount of paste on every centimeter^2 of die. Trust me. I've had a PowerPC970MP where I used a pea size of thermal paste on its tiny centimeter die; the paste got under the gasket and shorted a few capacitors. I thought I'd fried it, but I then saw the paste everywhere! I dishwashed the CPU and it worked great afterwards, true story.


Delidding is the act of removing the IHS, nothing says you can't put it back again. Fact is, that it's much easier to run with the IHS on and you don't lose a lot of by doing it. It can be a real pain going naked without a naked mounting kit trying to get the correct pressure for the CPU.


----------



## Heimdallr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> removing the glue and then using the IHS with better TIM is what delidding is about. Watch what you say in this thread without reading
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I use a pea method but I also flatten it out to make sure it covers the entire die.


Ok thanks, what did you use to spread the thermal paste?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> naked requires a lot less thermal paste, because the die is roughly 1/4-1/3 the size of the IHS on the top, so dont use more than 1/2 grain of rice...a pea size glob is WAAAAAAAAAAY too much. I like the line method spread even with a credit card. You should also look into Coolabratory Lidquid Pro/Utlra, it has a different spread method, but is in a class of its own for TIM on die.


Yes i also have the CLU but i've read around the web that with the naked die it's better to use the standard thermal paste.
I have both CLU and MX-4 now at home.

Thanks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heimdallr*
> 
> Ok thanks, what did you use to spread the thermal paste?
> Yes i also have the CLU but i've read around the web that with the naked die it's better to use the standard thermal paste.
> I have both CLU and MX-4 now at home.
> 
> Thanks


I use either a spreader or a q tip depending on what I have next to me and what I use for TIM


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Heimdallr*
> 
> Ok thanks, what did you use to spread the thermal paste?
> Yes i also have the CLU but i've read around the web that with the naked die it's better to use the standard thermal paste.
> I have both CLU and MX-4 now at home.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> I use either a spreader or a q tip depending on what I have next to me and what I use for TIM
Click to expand...

I like the credit card method myself for traditional TIM, but have used the qtip with success for traditional tim and CLU.


----------



## Heimdallr

Hopefully tomorrow i will have the time and the components to update my liquid cooling loop.

thanks


----------



## tombom

Just another random delid success story here. Decided on a whim to finally get around to delidding my 3570k. Kinda disappointed with my temps with AS5 atm (any tips?), so I might remount later, but as far as the delidding process itself, it went super well. The chip was a little loose on the vice for the first handful of whacks but on the 3/4 try I managed to get it. Unfortunately, I've got marks on the side of my IHS but I don't really care about that. I'm more interested in the temp drop. Anyways, thanks a lot to everyone at OCN for keeping this kind of stuff awesome! Good luck guys.


----------



## rabidz7

How would I put a bare die 4930K back in the socket?


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

You can't delid LGA 2011 CPU's, they're soldered.

Same with Sandy Bridge CPU's, I believe.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> How would I put a bare die 4930K back in the socket?


You would have to take the holding bracket off and then carefully mount the watercooler (can't use normal heatsinks)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> You can't delid LGA 2011 CPU's, they're soldered.
> 
> Same with Sandy Bridge CPU's, I believe.


You can delid themk but it's a very very delicate operation you have to melt the solder with a lighter and have blades in so the IHS falls off. It's pretty tough and really hard on the CPU because all the heat it's being moved away from the die.


----------



## El Media Vida

Someone has tried XSPC Raystorm direct die?


----------



## rabidz7

I was planning on sanding the IHS off.


----------



## Tcoppock

Would you say that this processor is decent?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rabidz7*
> 
> I was planning on sanding the IHS off.


No.....


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Delidding 2011 seems pointless imo...

The solder and IHS conduct heat very well and protect the die. Uneven pressure on the bare die can crack it.


----------



## DarkReign32

I just received my tube of Liquid Ultra! Wooooooo. I'm rebuilding in a new case tomorrow so I get to test it out. I'll post screenies pre-delid, post delid with NT-H1, and post delid with CLU.


----------



## Oneminde

Hey guy's. I am reading this tread an on page 9, yeah, a long way to go.. lol, but I have a question.

*How about Coollaboratory Liquid Metalpad - they show in their demonstartion video that they use it on a cpu core directly. Any comments ?* I will continue reading.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> Hey guy's. I am reading this tread an on page 9, yeah, a long way to go.. lol, but I have a question.
> 
> *How about Coollaboratory Liquid Metalpad - they show in their demonstartion video that they use it on a cpu core directly. Any comments ?* I will continue reading.


I would just use the normal CLU and spread it out.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would just use the normal CLU and spread it out.


kewl, thanks for the reply. Does anyone know the distance between the IHS and the core ? I found the tread for the distance. I have never done delidding before and I am planing right now to keep the glue and use it as a "pillow" for the IHS. So should I spread a thin layer on the IHS as well as the core so that both surfaces makes contact properly ?


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> kewl, thanks for the reply. Does anyone know the distance between the IHS and the core ? I found the tread for the distance. I have never done delidding before and I am planing right now to keep the glue and use it as a "pillow" for the IHS. So should I spread a thin layer on the IHS as well as the core so that both surfaces makes contact properly ?


No, remove the glue.

You want the IHS to contact the die. The entire point of delidding is to remove the extra space the glue provides, as TIM is nowhere near as conductive as the IHS.

Scrape off all the glue from the IHS and PCB and use CLU.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> No, remove the glue.
> 
> You want the IHS to contact the die. The entire point of delidding is to remove the extra space the glue provides, as TIM is nowhere near as conductive as the IHS.
> 
> Scrape off all the glue from the IHS and PCB and use CLU.


I C, so the IHS and pressure from the clamp on the motherboard will not cause any problems ?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I C, so the IHS and pressure from the clamp on the motherboard will not cause any problems ?


not one person I read about in this thread has had a issue with any damage being caused buy the clamp using the ihs.


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> not one person I read about in this thread has had a issue with any damage being caused buy the clamp using the ihs.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> not one person I read about in this thread has had a issue with any damage being caused buy the clamp using the ihs.


Thank you, I guess its a go then







Looking forward joining the club.


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

IIRC the mobo clamps put pressure on the IHS itself, not the CPU.

All it really does it hold the CPU in place by putting pressure on the side of the IHS, when you clamp it down the IHS may move a bit which can disturb the TIM. I held the IHS in place with one finger while clamping the socket and it worked fine.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> kewl, thanks for the reply. Does anyone know the distance between the IHS and the core ? I found the tread for the distance. I have never done delidding before and I am planing right now to keep the glue and use it as a "pillow" for the IHS. So should I spread a thin layer on the IHS as well as the core so that both surfaces makes contact properly ?


the glue is the real issue honestly. I take it off as it can keep the IHS separated from the die a bit causing some heat issues.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> kewl, thanks for the reply. Does anyone know the distance between the IHS and the core ? I found the tread for the distance. I have never done delidding before and I am planing right now to keep the glue and use it as a "pillow" for the IHS. So should I spread a thin layer on the IHS as well as the core so that both surfaces makes contact properly ?


Remove the glue.. the "pillow" effect you are talking about is the biggest problem that we are fixing by delidding.. the glue creates a distance between the DIE and the IHS, and therefore reduces the ability of moving the heat to the next surfacer.. aka DIE -> IHS


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Remove the glue.. the "pillow" effect you are talking about is the biggest problem that we are fixing by delidding.. the glue creates a distance between the DIE and the IHS, and therefore reduces the ability of moving the heat to the next surfacer.. aka DIE -> IHS


Right. So the process is as follow.

1. Open / remove the IHS and glue.

2. Clean off the Intel past, use isopropanol on the core and on the IHS surface.

3. Apply a thin layer of CLU
4. Polish the surface on the IHS facing the cooler and the cooler surface (Corsair H100i)
5. Mount all parts.
6 Enjoy lower and more stable temperature.
7. OC to a comfortable level - considering 4.2-4.3 Ghz - I don't want to over do it or PUSH the cpu too hard

8. DONE.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> Right. So the process is as follow.
> 
> 1. Open / remove the IHS and glue.
> 2. Clean off the Intel past, use isopropanol on the core and on the IHS surface.
> 3. Apply a thin layer of CLU
> 4. Polish the surface on the IHS facing the cooler and the cooler surface (Corsair H100i)
> 5. Mount all parts.
> 6 Enjoy lower and more stable temperature.
> 7. OC to a comfortable level - considering 4.2-4.3 Ghz - I don't want to over do it or PUSH the cpu too hard
> 8. DONE.


Something like that.
I personally wouldnt polish (lapp / whetsand) the IHS since it removes the warranty.. but the difference between my highest / lowest core temps are 1-2 degrees.. if you have more than 10 degree difference, you might wanna conciser a lapping..


----------



## Oneminde

I polished the H100i surface with Autosol, the best polish product there is. See picture for result. 
PS: Sorry for the crapy img quality, waiting on another camera.



Spoiler: Before and after


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I polished the H100i surface with Autosol, the best polish product there is. See picture for result.
> 
> PS: Sorry for the crapy img quality, waiting on another camera.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Before and after


Did you lap the surface as well or just apply the polish?


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Did you lap the surface as well or just apply the polish?


This is roughly 15-20 min of Autosol only. It is a magical product







I could probably spend a bit more time on it, but looking at it now, I would say that the surface is mirror finish and good enough


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> This is roughly 15-20 min of Autosol only. It is a magical product
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could probably spend a bit more time on it, but looking at it now, I would say that the surface is mirror finish and good enough


Just make sure there is no Ammonia in it, it will eat the copper and any brass it comes in contact with if left with using solvent to remove afterwards!!


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> This is roughly 15-20 min of Autosol only. It is a magical product
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I could probably spend a bit more time on it, but looking at it now, I would say that the surface is mirror finish and good enough


Would you say you've noticed any improvement with the use of Autosol? I'm interested and I may just give this stuff a go.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Just make sure there is no Ammonia in it, it will eat the copper and any brass it comes in contact with if left with using solvent to remove afterwards!!


Good to know! I'll check into the "ingredients". Hopefully they're listed.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Would you say you've noticed any improvement with the use of Autosol? I'm interested and I may just give this stuff a go.
> Good to know! I'll check into the "ingredients". Hopefully they're listed.


There is a small amount of ammonia in it, but ammonia evaporates quickly and using *Isopropyl alcohol* to clean it will get rid of every residue.

I am still waiting for parts, you can follow the build in my [Build log] NZXT H440 Dream Build


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> There is a small amount of ammonia in it, but ammonia evaporates quickly and using *Isopropyl alcohol* to clean it will get rid of every residue.


Awesome, thanks! I'll check the hardware store to see if they carry it there. I noticed they have a domestic use product that works with aluminum and copper as well. I may give that a go if they don't have the particular product you used.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Just make sure there is no Ammonia in it, it will eat the copper and any brass it comes in contact with if left with using solvent to remove afterward!!


It is true that ammonia oxidize copper and brass, but only as long as it is in contact with the metal. Autosol (25 % NH3) will dry within 10 min and the process stops. Cleaning the surface afterwords will one further stop the process from occurring and NH3 is used as part of getting rid of surface material. Isopropyl alcohol will get rid of and neutralize the process, so there is no harm in using this product.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Awesome, thanks! I'll check the hardware store to see if they carry it there. I noticed they have a domestic use product that works with aluminum and copper as well. I may give that a go if they don't have the particular product you used.


Ebay is our friend here ... lol. I've used this stuff since 1994 and it works wonder on all metals.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xautosol&_nkw=autosol&_sacat=0&_from=R40


----------



## Oneminde

@ *DarkReign32*

I mentioned that I am waiting for parts, so I can't give any feedback on the delidding process and results yet. But I will publish it here and in my build tread.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> @ *DarkReign32*
> 
> I mentioned that I am waiting for parts, so I can't give any feedback on the delidding process and results yet. But I will publish it here and in my build tread.


Oh I totally missed that! My apologies. I'll just keep on an eye on this thread and hope to see some results. I hope they're good for you!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> 7. OC to a comfortable level - considering 4.2-4.3 Ghz - I don't want to over do it or PUSH the cpu too hard


Some chips can do 4.2ghz on 1.0v.. other chips use 1.2v at stock

what is pushing it too hard lol, average 4670k can go ~at/above 4.5 without delid


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Some chips can do 4.2ghz on 1.0v.. other chips use 1.2v at stock
> 
> what is pushing it too hard lol, average 4670k can go ~at/above 4.5 without delid


I guess the TMP's are one thing, hence why I will delid it. Pushing it is going to the edge, maximum clock. The reason I am delidding is to get a higher clock and at the same time running the cpu sub 65-70 C at full load. The cooler the better. I am not an extreme OC'er. Perhaps use CLU on the GPU cooler as well. I will run the Palit GTX 780 Super Jetstream in SLI - so I should be able to notice lower temps there too - I'll collect and post the data for that as well.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> The reason I am delidding is to get a higher clock and at the same time running the cpu sub 65-70 C at full load. The cooler the better.












^air no delid with 1.26v (4.5g, but voltage is far more important than frequency)

so you can put like.. 1.35-1.4v and still meet those conditions with delid lol

Basically whatever volts you want on a delidded 4670k on higher end air or clc without temps being at all an issue


----------



## Oneminde

I don't know if a safe or maximum CV question is dumb, but I am looking at that as well. I guess it is the silicone lottery for that one .. lol -but thanks for the info


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Lapping might drop 1-3 degrees but just putting polish on it I don't think will do anything. That is just my point of view.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I don't know if a safe or maximum CV question is dumb, but I am looking at that as well. I guess it is the silicone lottery for that one .. lol -but thanks for the info


Max V ~1.3vcore safe, 1.4vcore normal/edgy if cool, 1.45 if a little nuts

standard is [email protected] and ~4.7 by 1.4 but pretty wide variation - might get 4.4-4.5 @1.4v, or 5ghz+

you must do a few things, etc scaling VRIN properly and using the right tests


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Max V ~1.3vcore safe, 1.4vcore normal/edgy if cool, 1.45 if a little nuts
> 
> standard is [email protected] and ~4.7 by 1.4 but pretty wide variation - might get 4.4-4.5 @1.4v, or 5ghz+
> 
> you must do a few things, etc scaling VRIN properly and using the right tests


I intend to read up on the 4670k and 4770k OC so I know what I am doing.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> Lapping might drop 1-3 degrees but just putting polish on it I don't think will do anything. That is just my point of view.


I can always redo the process to get the surface as flat as possible. So I might actually do that


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I can always redo the process to get the surface as flat as possible. So I might actually do that


Just remember to test your chip first and the easy way to check on if your IHS is flat is to take a razor blade and put it against the IHS and see if there is a gap. And if you LAP your warranty it out the door (along with some of the IHS







)


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just remember to test your chip first and the easy way to check on if your IHS is flat is to take a razor blade and put it against the IHS and see if there is a gap. And if you LAP your warranty it out the door (along with some of the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


I am aware of that. On another note, the surface of the IHS will be full of hills and valleys (magnified), when using a liquid metal, it should fill the gaps and using a very flat surface like on the H100i should theoretically create a good contact surface area between them. So I am at first only going to lapp and polish (redo) the copper base of the H100i and not the IHS - after some basic benchmarking of the 4670k, got to check that it is working properly first.

The middle ground is often the best


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I am aware of that. On another note, the surface of the IHS will be full of hills and valleys (magnified), when using a liquid metal, it should fill the gaps and using a very flat surface like on the H100i should theoretically create a good contact surface area between them. So I am at first only going to lapp and polish (redo) the copper base of the H100i and not the IHS - after some basic benchmarking of the 4670k, got to check that it is working properly first.
> 
> The middle ground is often the best


sounds good to me


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I intend to read up on the 4670k and 4770k OC so I know what I am doing.


May i suggest that you start here ^.^

http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-thread-with-statistics/


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> May i suggest that you start here ^.^
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-thread-with-statistics/


I did actually locate that tread an hour ago, so started reading - a very good and thorough tread, but thanks for the tip.


----------



## DarkReign32

Well I just applied CLU to the die and NT-H1 to the IHS. Not much of a difference really. Possibly a bad job applying the TIM to the IHS. Or I just didn't use enough clu. I did cover the whole die though.

This is with NT-H1 on the die:



This is with CLU on the die:


----------



## GaMbi2004

4.8ghz on 1.35v? awesome







im 4.6 at 1.3 and cant even get 4.7 stable with 1.4v
But temps aren't that bad.. What was pre delid temps? cant seam to find that info..
I find it odd that you went from 3 degree difference between hottest and coldest core to 11..
It would seam you should be able to get all cores down to 65~ witch is a healthy 8degree lower with CLU.
I wouldnt be worried about running with that OC and those temps, but would be nice to even them out a bit.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> 4.8ghz on 1.35v? awesome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> im 4.6 at 1.3 and cant even get 4.7 stable with 1.4v
> But temps aren't that bad.. What was pre delid temps? cant seam to find that info..
> I find it odd that you went from 3 degree difference between hottest and coldest core to 11..
> It would seam you should be able to get all cores down to 65~ witch is a healthy 8degree lower with CLU.
> I wouldnt be worried about running with that OC and those temps, but would be nice to even them out a bit.


WORD


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Well I just applied CLU to the die and NT-H1 to the IHS. Not much of a difference really. Possibly a bad job applying the TIM to the IHS. Or I just didn't use enough clu. I did cover the whole die though.
> 
> This is with NT-H1 on the die:
> 
> 
> 
> This is with CLU on the die:


Sadly I don't have a pre-delid test while running IBT. I was hitting 77-78 with Aida. I can only assume it would be around 82-84 with IBT. I think I'll reapply the TIM. But this time I'm using the MX-4 I have. I quite certain I used more than enough CLU too.

On a side note, stay away from the CM sickle flow fans unless you have a fan controller. They hum quite a bit. The LED's aren't very bright either.


----------



## alucardis666

Deleted.


----------



## Wirerat

not going to go over well. you dont meet the requirments to list things for sale here. Plus no cross listing is allowed.

http://www.overclock.net/t/60879/for-sale-wanted-section-rules-updated-30-nov-2012


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> not going to go over well. you dont meet the requirments to list things for sale here. Plus no cross listing is allowed.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/60879/for-sale-wanted-section-rules-updated-30-nov-2012


Thanks for the heads up


----------



## Wihglah

Bear in mind, this CPU was topped out at 4400mhz before I delidded.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> Bear in mind, this CPU was topped out at 4400mhz before I delidded.


That's awesome!


----------



## ckoons1

has anyone put any sealent on the vrms next to the die to protect them or is this even necessary?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> Bear in mind, this CPU was topped out at 4400mhz before I delidded.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Sweeeet!!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> has anyone put any sealent on the vrms next to the die to protect them or is this even necessary?


You mean on haswell? yea







I think most are doing that, and we usually recommend it in this thread. Some non conductive TIM like MX-4, Nail polish (clear) or liquid electrical tape.
If you dont cover them up, and use too much CLP/CLU, you risk having a bad time.


----------



## ckoons1

clear nail polish will work?

this ok? http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/100119178?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&N=5yc1v&R=100119178


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> clear nail polish will work?
> 
> this ok? http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/100119178?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&N=5yc1v&R=100119178


That will work perfect.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> has anyone put any sealent on the vrms next to the die to protect them or is this even necessary?


yes many people have and it should be done


----------



## ckoons1

just to be sure nail polish [clear]will work just as well ?

i'm a little leary putting thermal paste on it even though some are suppose to be non conductive


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> just to be sure nail polish [clear]will work just as well ?
> 
> i'm a little leary putting thermal paste on it even though some are suppose to be non conductive


I used nail hardener. But to answer your question, yes that will work.

I had shipped the corner of the PCB and used nail hardener on that, and also on the caps next to the die. No issues.


----------



## ckoons1

is nail hardner better or does it not matter as long as they are sealed?


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> is nail hardner better or does it not matter as long as they are sealed?


It doesn't matter really. I just used it because it's clear. The point is to seal it off in case you're using a conductive material i.e. CLU/CLP etc...

Edit:

I did notice one thing when looking through the cosmetics aisle (sounds worse than it was). Some nail polishes do contain metals so I would avoid those just to be safe.


----------



## ckoons1

oh wow that would not be good.

appreciate that


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> oh wow that would not be good.
> 
> appreciate that


Not a problem! Good luck in your delidding adventure. It's a fun one


----------



## Valgaur

*laughs maniacally at all the delidders lately* Yiiiiiis YIIIIIIS Join us, one of us one of us


----------



## CanadaSpy007

How do I join this club, delidded my intel 4770k cpu with liquid pro on the tim and mx4 on the ihs. used the vice method hardest part was putting on the liquid pro with a q tip that was coming apart on me .

delidded.jpg 80k .jpg file


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CanadaSpy007*
> 
> How do I join this club, delidded my intel 4770k cpu with liquid pro on the tim and mx4 on the ihs. used the vice method hardest part was putting on the liquid pro with a q tip that was coming apart on me .
> 
> delidded.jpg 80k .jpg file


on the first page has the info required for acceptance, and then I'll add you


----------



## CanadaSpy007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> on the first page has the info required for acceptance, and then I'll add you


OCN name: CanadaSpy007
CPU: Intel haswell I7 4770k
on die-TIM: coollabratory liquid pro
ihs-TIM: mx- 4
Mhz gained: 100mhz
OC after delid: 4700 mhz
Temp drops: 20 degrees in aida64
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/ehbyf1


----------



## lilchronic

im letting my 4770k go for the low if any one is interested







.... just tryin to get it off my hands asap
http://www.overclock.net/t/1466154/delidded-4770k-4-7ghz/0_50


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CanadaSpy007*
> 
> OCN name: CanadaSpy007
> CPU: Intel haswell I7 4770k
> on die-TIM: coollabratory liquid pro
> ihs-TIM: mx- 4
> Mhz gained: 100mhz
> OC after delid: 4700 mhz
> Temp drops: 20 degrees in aida64
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/ehbyf1


you're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Kokin

Just bought a 4" drill press vice ($20 from Home Depot) after my class today and I've spent the last 3 hours taking my loop apart. Once I get my CPU out, it's time to delid!!!

I'll be switching out of a Bitfenix Prodigy and on to a Caselabs Mercury S3 today as well.


----------



## Kokin

Wow, I don't even.... I'm running the same 4.7GHz @ 1.264V with the *stock Intel cooler*! I couldn't even boot with these settings before, but now it's allowing a few minutes of Prime95 Blend (before it crashes). These settings were the same for my custom watercooling loop, so I'm just dumbfounded right now.

A quick screenshot:



I'll post again once I get my CaseLabs Mercury S3 + loop setup this weekend and I'll do a membership submission as well as photos.

Paste inside: Phanteks PH-NDC
Paste outside: Arctic MX-2


----------



## ckoons1

i noticed a tiny nick on the upper left outer edge in the lite green border area of my just delidded 4770k

right above the outer edge copper dot

it is the same color as the wafer outer edge - off white

did i ruin it?


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> i noticed a tiny nick on the upper left outer edge in the lite green border area of my just delidded 4770k
> 
> right above the outer edge copper dot
> 
> it is the same color as the wafer outer edge - off white
> 
> did i ruin it?


You're most likely fine if it was in the light-green area. The dark green parts are traces for the circuit, so as long as you didn't damage that you should be good. I also nicked part of the PCB where the light green border is (where the numbers are in the light-green area), but it survived and is running fine.

When placing it back, make sure all the pins on your mobo are straight and that there aren't any pieces of TIM or glue on the back of the CPU.


----------



## ckoons1

well thats great news









it is definately in the lite green area

should i put nail polish over it or leave it be?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ckoons1*
> 
> well thats great news
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it is definately in the lite green area
> 
> should i put nail polish over it or leave it be?


Put on some nail polish just to be safe (if you have some) but I wouldnt worry too much about it..
Any chance you have a pic of it? helps us out a lot when trying to help.


----------



## ckoons1




----------



## GaMbi2004

I dont even see the nick.. Where is it again?
Anyways.. just leave it as it is.. you are in no danger on that one.


----------



## Kokin

I think it's right on the corner where the circle is. If that is where it is, you should be good. The nail polish isn't necessary, but it's a good precaution.


----------



## ckoons1

yes that is exactly where it is on the lite green area near the circle

would i put the nail polish only on the chip or the surrounding area also [ circle etc...)

thank you


----------



## Gunderman456

Cover the chips, no need for any nail polish on the PCB.


----------



## Tcoppock

I want in this club!
CPU-Z Validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/d9ec16












My 24/7 stable 4.7GHZ @ 1.21V highest core IBT 78C

If I done a custom WC loop how much lower could my temps be?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tcoppock*
> 
> I want in this club!
> CPU-Z Validation: http://valid.canardpc.com/d9ec16
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My 24/7 stable 4.7GHZ @ 1.21V highest core IBT 78C
> 
> If I done a custom WC loop how much lower could my temps be?


What cooler are you on now?
You should put your rig in your sig so we can easily see what you got








[email protected] 1.21v? :O that is NICE! Im running 4.6 @ 1.3v with better temps







but I have costume loop








With a good loop, you should be able to see 60-65 degree, is my guess..

*Edit
And what TIM are you using? that is definitely not CLU/CLP.. you will gain quite a bit more if you switch to that.


----------



## Tcoppock

Im on an H100 With G.T. Fans. I will put it in my sig!


----------



## Tcoppock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> What cooler are you on now?
> You should put your rig in your sig so we can easily see what you got
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [email protected] 1.21v? :O that is NICE! Im running 4.6 @ 1.3v with better temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but I have costume loop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With a good loop, you should be able to see 60-65 degree, is my guess..
> 
> *Edit
> And what TIM are you using? that is definitely not CLU/CLP.. you will gain quite a bit more if you switch to that.


Rig is now in my sig!
What would be an inexpensive custom loop?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tcoppock*
> 
> Im on an H100 With G.T. Fans. I will put it in my sig!


gimme the info i need and consider yourself in!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tcoppock*
> 
> What would be an inexpensive custom loop?


XSPC makes great inexpensive (not cheap) kits that perform quite well for just a couple bucks more than most people spend on CLC water coolers.

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/21235/ex-wat-270/XSPC_Raystorm_750_EX240_Universal_CPU_Water_Cooling_Kit_New_Rev_4_Pump_Included_w_Free_Dead-Water.html?tl=g59c683

This would be a good kit to start with. As you upgrade components, or add them, you just change the loop around or add more radiators/blocks. I like EK stuff, but it is far from justifiable from a dollar/performance standpoint. EK is beautiful and top notch, but XSPC is not far behind in performance, but is a good chunk more affordable. FrozenCPU and PerformancePCS have a ton of kits to look at, find one that fits your budget/case if you dont like the one I linked.


----------



## Wihglah

You can fit a 360 rad in the top of your case for your CPU, then use your H100 on your GPU with it mounted to the front.


----------



## Tcoppock

OCN name: Tcoppock
CPU: 3570K
On-die TIM:Noctua NT-H1
IHS TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: +400MHz (for now)
OC after delid: I'm at 4.7GHz @ 1.21V
Temp dropped idle 26c load 78Cfrom 38C idle 92c load


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> You can fit a 360 rad in the top of your case for your CPU, then use your H100 on your GPU with it mounted to the front.


I am considering a similar solution. Keep the H100 /H100i pump, corsair link and replace the rad to a 360 and external reservoir. That will be a fairly cheap upgrade.


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I am considering a similar solution. Keep the H100 /H100i pump, corsair link and replace the rad to a 360 and external reservoir. That will be a fairly cheap upgrade.


my advice is - don't:


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> my advice is - don't:


Uhm.... did you have to do that, now my mind is screaming ....








Oh well, I will get a custom loop when I am ready to add one for my Palit GTX 780 Super Jetstream SLI as well ... he he


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tcoppock*
> 
> OCN name: Tcoppock
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM:Noctua NT-H1
> IHS TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: +400MHz (for now)
> OC after delid: I'm at 4.7GHz @ 1.21V
> Temp dropped idle 26c load 78Cfrom 38C idle 92c load


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tcoppock*
> 
> OCN name: Tcoppock
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM:Noctua NT-H1
> IHS TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: +400MHz (for now)
> OC after delid: I'm at 4.7GHz @ 1.21V
> Temp dropped idle 26c load 78Cfrom 38C idle 92c load


Keep an eye on your temps.

There have been reports of regular TIM "pumping" out of the interface.


----------



## CanadaSpy007

Hey everyone, when i original delidded my 4770k and added liquid pro to the TIM, the liquid pro application process was a nightmare and was not necessarily happy with it, and lately ive been debating on maybe re applying it this time using a paint brush not horrible q tips. my question is, is there a way to clean the CLP off the tim and re apply ? And whats the easiest way if so ? thanks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CanadaSpy007*
> 
> Hey everyone, when i original delidded my 4770k and added liquid pro to the TIM, the liquid pro application process was a nightmare and was not necessarily happy with it, and lately ive been debating on maybe re applying it this time using a paint brush not horrible q tips. my question is, is there a way to clean the CLP off the tim and re apply ? And whats the easiest way if so ? thanks


I just use normal everyday paper towels and very meticulously clean it


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CanadaSpy007*
> 
> Hey everyone, when i original delidded my 4770k and added liquid pro to the TIM, the liquid pro application process was a nightmare and was not necessarily happy with it, and lately ive been debating on maybe re applying it this time using a paint brush not horrible q tips. my question is, is there a way to clean the CLP off the tim and re apply ? And whats the easiest way if so ? thanks


Others have said alcohol is fine to use as well, so just use some with paper towel or coffee filters (so fibers aren't an issue) to wipe it off.


----------



## Gunderman456

...and baby wipes!


----------



## CanadaSpy007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I just use normal everyday paper towels and very meticulously clean it


i thought CLP was really hard to get off ? its been on for 3 monthes or more. but thanks for the advice i do have alcohol wipes, and TIM cleaner so should be good.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CanadaSpy007*
> 
> i thought CLP was really hard to get off ? its been on for 3 monthes or more. but thanks for the advice i do have alcohol wipes, and TIM cleaner so should be good.


it should be decent to use wetting it very lightly will help, did for myself


----------



## Oneminde

When it comes to cleaning electrical components, get *Isopropyl alcohol*. It is also know as electrical cleaner. I cleaned all my NES cartridges with it and the pcb therminals become like new.


----------



## Kokin

Just be sure to avoid applying alcohol on plastic or acrylic pieces, as it does eat away at the material.


----------



## CanadaSpy007

Thanks guys. hopefully all goes well when i set aside the time to tackle it definitely thinking my temps will benifit my core 3 is always like 10-20 degrees hotter (when stressing ) than core 1 and core 2, core 4 is almost as hot as core 3 at times.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Just be sure to avoid applying alcohol on plastic or acrylic pieces, as it does eat away at the material.


Not Isopropyl alcohol. I assure you it do not react with plastics. Acetone reacts with plastics.


----------



## CanadaSpy007

Alcohol definately effects acrylic and whatever those clear reservoirs are made of. And yeah acetone is how we use to build a circuit on a pcb board in electronics class in school.


----------



## Ukkooh

Is my contact between die and IHS ok as I'm reaching 75°C with 5.0Ghz and ~1.4V vcore in IBT? Ambient is 21-22°C. The loop details are in my sig rig.


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Is my contact between die and IHS ok as I'm reaching 75°C with 5.0Ghz and ~1.4V vcore in IBT? Ambient is 21-22°C. The loop details are in my sig rig.


Sounds OK to me


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> Is my contact between die and IHS ok as I'm reaching 75°C with 5.0Ghz and ~1.4V vcore in IBT? Ambient is 21-22°C. The loop details are in my sig rig.


idle temps??


----------



## Ukkooh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> idle temps??




Edit: hwinfo64 reports 23°C, 27°C, 26°C and 26°C after another boot.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ukkooh*
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: hwinfo64 reports 23°C, 27°C, 26°C and 26°C after another boot.


you're good


----------



## DefCoN

I just delidded my i7 4770k @ 4.2GHz - time to overclock it some more now









Before delid (encoding video) -









After delid (encoding video) -


----------



## Heimdallr

I finally installed my 4770K naked with the EK kit.
I have to say that the drop in temperature is around 20°, unfortunately I don't have screen of prime95 before the procedure but i'm very happy of the results.
I have the CPU overclocked to 4.5ghz with 1,28v and while playing GW2 i have max 40° on the hottest core, I also gave a run to Diablo3 yesterday and I'm around 30° or less while playing.

I used the vice method and I must say I had to hit the CPU a lot of times with a lot of strength, from what i had gathered on the forums and youtube i imagined it would have been much easier









I'm glad I did it.


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heimdallr*
> 
> I finally installed my 4770K naked with the EK kit.
> I have to say that the drop in temperature is around 20°, unfortunately I don't have screen of prime95 before the procedure but i'm very happy of the results.
> I have the CPU overclocked to 4.5ghz with 1,28v and while playing GW2 i have max 40° on the hottest core, I also gave a run to Diablo3 yesterday and I'm around 30° or less while playing.
> 
> I used the vice method and I must say I had to hit the CPU a lot of times with a lot of strength, from what i had gathered on the forums and youtube i imagined it would have been much easier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm glad I did it.


Did you run it at all with the IHS back on?


----------



## Heimdallr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> Did you run it at all with the IHS back on?


That was the original plan but I ended up mounting the CPU naked, from what I've read the differences is small but i can't tell for sure.


----------



## cdnGhost

OCN name: cdnGhost
CPU: i7-4770k
on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
ihs-TIM:none
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

Currently system is in peices.....
But prior to delid my set up was
OC to 4.4ghz volts at 1.258
Temps in IBT were mid high 80s to 91 on hottest core, I think that was also in part to the
Air in one of my rads....

During gaming average temps wet mid 60s

Once I am back up and running I will update with new temps
And CPU-z validation

Here are a few pics of my i7







Tools used
Vice
2 x 4 scrap
Framing hammer
Rubbing alcohol
iPhone spluger to remove glue


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> OCN name: cdnGhost
> CPU: i7-4770k
> on die-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> ihs-TIM:none
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> Currently system is in peices.....
> But prior to delid my set up was
> OC to 4.4ghz volts at 1.258
> Temps in IBT were mid high 80s to 91 on hottest core, I think that was also in part to the
> Air in one of my rads....
> 
> During gaming average temps wet mid 60s
> 
> Once I am back up and running I will update with new temps
> And CPU-z validation
> 
> Here are a few pics of my i7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tools used
> Vice
> 2 x 4 scrap
> Framing hammer
> Rubbing alcohol
> iPhone spluger to remove glue


very clean delid! I'll add you whne some more info comes in







unless you don't have any then I'll add you


----------



## cdnGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> very clean delid! I'll add you whne some more info comes in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> unless you don't have any then I'll add you


As of now won't have more for a week or so lol waiting on parts and money to buy more parts...

But question how is the best way to apply paste to the die?
And how much?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> As of now won't have more for a week or so lol waiting on parts and money to buy more parts...
> 
> But question how is the best way to apply paste to the die?
> And how much?


put a bit on there and flatten it out with a q tip


----------



## NKrader

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> XSPC makes great inexpensive (not cheap) kits that perform quite well for just a couple bucks more than most people spend on CLC water coolers.
> 
> http://www.frozencpu.com/products/21235/ex-wat-270/XSPC_Raystorm_750_EX240_Universal_CPU_Water_Cooling_Kit_New_Rev_4_Pump_Included_w_Free_Dead-Water.html?tl=g59c683
> 
> This would be a good kit to start with. As you upgrade components, or add them, you just change the loop around or add more radiators/blocks. I like EK stuff, but it is far from justifiable from a dollar/performance standpoint. EK is beautiful and top notch, but XSPC is not far behind in performance, but is a good chunk more affordable. FrozenCPU and PerformancePCS have a ton of kits to look at, find one that fits your budget/case if you dont like the one I linked.


where is the one that fits in my silverstone ft03


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NKrader*
> 
> where is the one that fits in my silverstone ft03


check the silverstone ft03 club thread. I think you might want to consider a case with a little more room for your first loop. It can, and has been done, but it doesnt look like it is a project for the feint of heart. Beautiful case though.


----------



## NKrader

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> check the silverstone ft03 club thread. I think you might want to consider a case with a little more room for your first loop. It can, and has been done, but it doesnt look like it is a project for the feint of heart. Beautiful case though.


who said first loop? i had a quad rad with hk in my dangerden tower 26


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NKrader*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> check the silverstone ft03 club thread. I think you might want to consider a case with a little more room for your first loop. It can, and has been done, but it doesnt look like it is a project for the feint of heart. Beautiful case though.
> 
> 
> 
> who said first loop? i had a quad rad with hk in my dangerden tower 26
Click to expand...

Ah! Then you can take the measurements and open up your imagination on the loop, I dont have that case, so I wont be able to help pick what will fit...but it doesnt look like you have allot of room to work with


----------



## cdnGhost

Up top most 120mm rads in push pull will work
For the lower part the Black ice M160 will fit with a slight mod to the case
And there is room to fit most pumps and tube reservoirs


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> As of now won't have more for a week or so lol waiting on parts and money to buy more parts...
> 
> But question how is the best way to apply paste to the die?
> And how much?


I put a line of Phanteks PH-NDC (I don't have any CLP/CLU) and just let the IHS flatten it down. It's one of the best TIMs on the market and it's sadly not even sold.


----------



## MrBiology

Blind delid/lap ("hammer" and vice method) of a 4670k for my upcoming build. No pre temps, most parts haven't arrived yet so no post data yet either. It's a secret to everybody!
Post delid, pre lap


Post lap


Tools of the trade (such as they are...better than a chef knife!)


Will update in a couple of weeks with temps once the rest of the parts arrive.


----------



## Kokin

Here are pictures of my 3570K delid. I'll do an official submission once I get my rig back up.











Currently running 4.7GHz with 1.264V with stock Intel cooler (same settings for my custom loop prior to delid).







Really excited to see results once I have my custom loop back up.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Yey








Congrats on all the new delids!







Looking good ^ ^


----------



## cdnGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> I put a line of Phanteks PH-NDC (I don't have any CLP/CLU) and just let the IHS flatten it down. It's one of the best TIMs on the market and it's sadly not even sold.


Thanks for the info, I am using the Noctua TIM for now... not sure if I will to switch to CLP/CLU.... partly because it ends up costing me almost 25 buck per tube as opposed to 9 bucks for the Noctua... so for now we shall see what my temps are like... later today I will fire up my system on the stock intel cooler... Just waiting on some parts to rebuild my water loop.... including the EK naked mount kit!


----------



## TheSchnitzelkil

Count me in please









OCN name: TheScnitzelkil
CPU: I5 3570k
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM:Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: 200mhz
OC after delid: 4400 mhz
Temp drops: 31c on hottest core
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/vfdtc5

So after having horrible temperatures at low OC's, i finally decided to delid my cpu. I used the vice method.
only thing is that i dented the ihs in the process, but i managed to straighten out the ihs. Still looks ugly








Currently i am experimenting with higher OC's. before the delid i could'nt get higher than 4.2 ghz without losing stability.
Look like i have one of the worst OC'ers out of the batch,really need to crank my voltage up to reach moderate OC's (1.37v for only 4.4







)
Left the chip alone for about a year, but after seeing temps spikes over 100c i decided to be brave and stuck my cpu between my vice









Process of delid:






Temps before delid using as5 with a corsair h60










Temps after delid with CLU/NT-H1, same h60:


W00T, thats more than 30c in temp decrease, only because intel decided to cheap out on using TIM instead of solder


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheSchnitzelkil*
> 
> Count me in please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: TheScnitzelkil
> CPU: I5 3570k
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM:Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 200mhz
> OC after delid: 4400 mhz
> Temp drops: 31c on hottest core
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/vfdtc5
> 
> So after having horrible temperatures at low OC's, i finally decided to delid my cpu. I used the vice method.
> only thing is that i dented the ihs in the process, but i managed to straighten out the ihs. Still looks ugly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Currently i am experimenting with higher OC's. before the delid i could'nt get higher than 4.2 ghz without losing stability.
> Look like i have one of the worst OC'ers out of the batch,really need to crank my voltage up to reach moderate OC's (1.37v for only 4.4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> Left the chip alone for about a year, but after seeing temps spikes over 100c i decided to be brave and stuck my cpu between my vice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Process of delid:
> 
> [I
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> MG ALT=""]http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1899320/width/350/height/700[/IMG]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Temps before delid using as5 with a corsair h60
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps after delid with CLU/NT-H1, same h60:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> W00T, thats more than 30c in temp decrease, only because intel decided to cheap out on using TIM instead of solder


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Wirerat

I wanted to share the delta in having Gelid Solutions Extreme on die VS C. Liquid Pro. Testing done with H110.

This is before Delid. I wasnt even able to run standard. it would throttle. its on 200mb










Gelid Solutions Extreme


C. Liquid Pro


Looking at 2C to 5C delta in favor of the CLP


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Is it normal for a delidded 3770k to run hotter on the package than cores? I know some cores run hotter than others, but all of mine are within 5c but my package is constantly 10c hotter than the hottest core.

I heard that the package is measured from the motherboard, is this true? The temps are still low (30c idle, 65c Prime95 on 1.4v).


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> Is it normal for a delidded 3770k to run hotter on the package than cores? I know some cores run hotter than others, but all of mine are within 5c but my package is constantly 10c hotter than the hottest core.
> 
> I heard that the package is measured from the motherboard, is this true? The temps are still low (30c idle, 65c Prime95 on 1.4v).


Could be just the sensor it self. My "CPU" temp is at a constant 58C and doesn't budge regardless of idle/load, while my cores are the ones I just keep track off.


----------



## alucardis666

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheSchnitzelkil*
> 
> Count me in please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> W00T, thats more than 30c in temp decrease, only because intel decided to cheap out on using TIM instead of solder


Nicely done bud!


----------



## FractinJex

Hey all just wanted to drop by and show latest delid results. This is the 9-10th 4770k I have delided for myself and friends/others. Im using this one for myself as I ave my g/f the one I was using which was also a 4.9ghz.

costa rica 333Cxxx

delid using vice and coolabs ultra with as5 on lid.

4.9 vcore: 1.45v cache rato 40-44 1.23v

input voltage 1.9v

SA voltage offset + 0.200
IO volts + 0.100

llc 100%


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> Is it normal for a delidded 3770k to run hotter on the package than cores? I know some cores run hotter than others, but all of mine are within 5c but my package is constantly 10c hotter than the hottest core.
> 
> I heard that the package is measured from the motherboard, is this true? The temps are still low (30c idle, 65c Prime95 on 1.4v).


Mine runs about the same as the cores at idle, but cooler under load and rarely gets above 50*C


----------



## Ziver

Hello, I have made delided before but because I use core with MX4 I did not experience any reduction in temperature values. I’ll try this again with CLU but I have a question in mind. Do I have to safeguard chips which are near the core strictly? If so, what can I use for this? For instance, if I apply CLU after I coated them with MX4 and close the IHS on them will I experience an issue?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ziver*
> 
> Hello, I have made delided before but because I use core with MX4 I did not experience any reduction in temperature values. I'll try this again with CLU but I have a question in mind. Do I have to safeguard chips which are near the core strictly? If so, what can I use for this? For instance, if I apply CLU after I coated them with MX4 and close the IHS on them will I experience an issue?


Just clean the die correctly to a mirror finish so no more residue TIM from your MX-4 then remove all the glue from the PCB of the chip with a credit card our finger nail. Then apply CLU and even it out across the die. Look in the OP for examples.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just clean the die correctly to a mirror finish so no more residue TIM from your MX-4 then *remove all the glue from the PCB of the chip with a credit card our finger nail*. Then apply CLU and even it out across the die. Look in the OP for examples.


http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183

The primary reason for temperature drops is removing the thickness of the adhesive. In the link the poster even saved and reused the stock Intel thermal paste and the temperature drops were better with the Intel TIM compared to Noctua NT-H1!

Your MX-4 should work fairly well, not as good as the CLP/CLU, but you should be experiencing temperature drops.


----------



## Korruptive

I'm going to delid my CPU (done it before) but was wondering about putting a cooler directly onto the die.

I have a sheet of thermal pad 0.5mm, very thin. I feel this will cushion the die from the cooler.
Any tips so that I don't crack my CPU?

Load temps are 70c atm, I feel removing the IHS and internal thermal paste from the equation will drop temps a lot.
I also plan to WC in a few months.

I have a dead CPU I will try this out on, hopefully it won't crack so I can feel comfortable doing it.


----------



## evolution999

I just found this ''official'' thread so post here ..

I make it finally! after fighting with cpu 2hours, dat cpu was fried with intel thermal paste pretty hard even hammer method wont work rofl, destroyed 5 razer blades









*84° C before*


*61° C after*


Used Coollaboratory Liquid Pro - CPU / Liquid MetalPad - GPU

Noctua NH-D14, Asus gtx670 DC II TOP, i7 3770k 4.5GHz - 0.075v

gpu before 71° C, after 67° C

JUST AWESOME









even the fan speed lower

THANKS OVERCLOKERS









*SAFETY* just one thing what I found you can destroy die / gpu die using copper!!! I was googling some stuff I found dat copper eats(dissolve) into gallium and silicon chips quite fast! thus its covered by thin layer of Silicon Nitride, so if you scratch die(or gpu die) for your safety do not apply ANY METAL THERMAL PASTE(this apply to liquid metal pad as well which contains high ammount of copper thus its the MOST dangerous to scratched die)

quote from other website ''Copper is known to rapidly diffuse through Si and SiO. It is such a risk during the manufacturing process that fabs go to great lengths to segregate equipment and tools which come into contact with wafers with copper on them. I remember being told about an experiment were you place a penny on the surface of a Si wafer and leave it overnight. Copper will be easily detectable on the back side of the wafer such that you can make out the image of the penny. Bad things happen when copper atoms enter the active transistor regions.

There is a nitride layer on the back of the bare die which should act as an effective barrier to copper diffusion. However, if there are micro scratches in the nitride layer it could open up a pathway for copper diffusion to occur. IC Diamond in particular seems a risky compound to use. I believe it's possible this could have been what killed IDC's 3770K.''

There are already know oc ppl which destroyed die with copper fan, if you clean die use 100% cotton cloth and Izopropylalkohol.

*Coollaboratory Liquid MetalPad* which contains copper + gallium + indium
copper diffuse to silicon and gallium at room temps
gallium diffuse to sillicon at 700°C
bismuth diffuse to sillicon at 1050°C
indium diffuse to sillicon at 800°C

*Coollaboratory Liquid Pro* which contains gallium
copper diffuse to silicon and gallium at room temps


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *evolution999*
> 
> I just found this ''official'' thread so post here ..
> 
> I make it finally! after fighting with cpu 2hours, dat cpu was fried with intel thermal paste pretty hard even hammer method wont work rofl, destroyed 5 razer blades
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *84° C before*
> 
> 
> *61° C after*
> 
> 
> Used Coollaboratory Liquid Pro - CPU / Liquid MetalPad - GPU
> 
> Noctua NH-D14, Asus gtx670 DC II TOP, i7 3770k 4.5GHz - 0.075v
> 
> gpu before 71° C, after 67° C
> 
> JUST AWESOME
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> even the fan speed lower
> 
> THANKS OVERCLOKERS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *SAFETY* just one thing what I found you can destroy die / gpu die using copper!!! I was googling some stuff I found dat copper eats(dissolve) into gallium and silicon chips quite fast! thus its covered by thin layer of Silicon Nitride, so if you scratch die(or gpu die) for your safety do not apply ANY METAL THERMAL PASTE(this apply to liquid metal pad as well which contains high ammount of copper thus its the MOST dangerous to scratched die)
> 
> quote from other website ''Copper is known to rapidly diffuse through Si and SiO. It is such a risk during the manufacturing process that fabs go to great lengths to segregate equipment and tools which come into contact with wafers with copper on them. I remember being told about an experiment were you place a penny on the surface of a Si wafer and leave it overnight. Copper will be easily detectable on the back side of the wafer such that you can make out the image of the penny. Bad things happen when copper atoms enter the active transistor regions.
> 
> There is a nitride layer on the back of the bare die which should act as an effective barrier to copper diffusion. However, if there are micro scratches in the nitride layer it could open up a pathway for copper diffusion to occur. IC Diamond in particular seems a risky compound to use. I believe it's possible this could have been what killed IDC's 3770K.''
> 
> There are already know oc ppl which destroyed die with copper fan, if you clean die use 100% cotton cloth and Izopropylalkohol.
> 
> *Coollaboratory Liquid MetalPad* which contains copper + gallium + indium
> copper diffuse to silicon and gallium at room temps
> gallium diffuse to sillicon at 700°C
> bismuth diffuse to sillicon at 1050°C
> indium diffuse to sillicon at 800°C
> 
> *Coollaboratory Liquid Pro* which contains gallium
> copper diffuse to silicon and gallium at room temps


glad the guide helped you!







Nice temp drops as well!


----------



## Oneminde

I've lapped and polished the copper baseplate on the H100i and figured I could share that with you. Its not the highest quality, it is after all a Nikon D40 camera








I used 320, 800, 1200 and 2000 grit paper and finished with Autosol polish. Here is the result.



Spoiler: Pictures of the process.


----------



## Oneminde

I got the CLU w/cleaning kit the other day, and guess what the cleaning chemical is (?) isopropyl alcohol


----------



## InCoGnIt0

I just wish Intel would share on how they delid their own processors, since i'v heard they do to make sure someone didn't put a different lid on a cheaper processor and try to pass it off as a more expensive chip.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> I've lapped and polished the copper baseplate on the H100i and figured I could share that with you. Its not the highest quality, it is after all a Nikon D40 camera " src="https://www.overclock.net/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif" style="border-style:none;border-width:medium;">
> 
> I used 320, 800, 1200 and 2000 grit paper and finished with Autosol polish. Here is the result.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Pictures of the process.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> src="http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1902287/width/500/height/1000/flags/LL" style="border:1px solid rgb(208,208,208);margin:0px 1px 1px 0px;padding:1px;width:500px;height:333px;">


Did you need to drain the res or pump before removing the plate?

Edit: I guess you'd be draining the unit in itself if anything.


----------



## Oneminde

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarkReign32*
> 
> Did you need to drain the res or pump before removing the plate?
> 
> Edit: I guess you'd be draining the unit in itself if anything.


No, no need for that. There are gaskets under the copper base and as long as the unit / pump is flat while unscrewing the copper base, the water contained in the unit itself will not cause any problems. It is full to the brim, so a few drops might find their way out, but this is no problem... I was meaning to take a photo of the unit open, but oops, sorry for that.


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Oneminde*
> 
> No, no need for that. There are gaskets under the copper base and as long as the unit / pump is flat while unscrewing the copper base, the water contained in the unit itself will not cause any problems. It is full to the brim, so a few drops might find their way out, but this is no problem... I was meaning to take a photo of the unit open, but oops, sorry for that.


Nice thanks. I wonder if the TT Water 2.0 is similar in disassembly. Time to google!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> I just wish Intel would share on how they delid their own processors, since i'v heard they do to make sure someone didn't put a different lid on a cheaper processor and try to pass it off as a more expensive chip.


Where did you hear that? pretty sure there are much easier ways to determine what chip it is, and also the 3570 and 3770 are visually similar, so that wouldnt even be a good way to do it.


----------



## Kokin

Couldn't they just read the numbers on the PCB? The numbers probably represent some sort of serial number they can look up.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Where did you hear that? pretty sure there are much easier ways to determine what chip it is, and also the 3570 and 3770 are visually similar, so that wouldnt even be a good way to do it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Couldn't they just read the numbers on the PCB? The numbers probably represent some sort of serial number they can look up.


That little black rectangle with yellow/gold writing on it, and a QR style code and 4 digit number is all intel needs to identify the exact processor. That 4 digit number is the last 4 of the serial number, and the QR code has all of the rest of the pertinent info on the CPU.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> That little black rectangle with yellow/gold writing on it, and a QR style code and 4 digit number is all intel needs to identify the exact processor. That 4 digit number is the last 4 of the serial number, and the QR code has all of the rest of the pertinent info on the CPU.


Cool didn't know about that. +1


----------



## FractinJex

Question......I have delidded a handful of chips now but wanted to know if anyone has delided and left the original tim intel has used? just removing the glue???

I thought I read somewhere in the post someone did just couldn't locate it and wanted to know the results. I have always used clu but wanted to try one leaving the stock tim...imo it should be just fine as ur only removing the gap.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> Question......I have delidded a handful of chips now but wanted to know if anyone has delided and left the original tim intel has used? just removing the glue???
> 
> I thought I read somewhere in the post someone did just couldn't locate it and wanted to know the results. I have always used clu but wanted to try one leaving the stock tim...imo it should be just fine as ur only removing the gap.


the tim on my chip was rubbery and pretty thick. If you only removed the glue that thick tim might still be an issue. It worth a try. I m interested to find out.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> the tim on my chip was rubbery and pretty thick. If you only removed the glue that thick tim might still be an issue. It worth a try. I m interested to find out.


Good point about the tim thickness didn't consider that...however I am going to try it for now as I have ran out of CLU and its on the way lol however today is my only chance to use my vice before I pack it up for a move....









anyways I will report back on how the stock tim is after a delid and report results.


----------



## rluker5

A RAM FIX

Thank you VALGULAR.

I just delidded my 4770k and I wouldn't have done it without your picture and practice suggestion (used atholon 64x2 5000, blade).
My computer was maxed out at 4.5(1,2) and 4.4(3,4) running between high 70s-low 80s
Now it's 4.8(1,2) and 4.7(3,4) running from high 50s-low 60s, and I'm only a rudimentary overclocker.
I used coolabs pro on die and AS5 on outside since my lowest price coolermaster waterblock was too cupped to hold the good stuff.

I did have a problem with my ASUS Z87 deluxe mobo. Since the cpu assembly was slightly thinner, not all of the pins were touching and B1, B2 ram slots were not working, leaving me with single channel ram. I put paper shims (just 1 thick) on the heat spreader tabs and that fixed the problem. After I did this I noticed the likely adjustable screw on the front of the clamp, but why fix what aint broke?

It was totally worth it. thanks for the help.


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> A RAM FIX
> 
> I did have a problem with my ASUS Z87 deluxe mobo. Since the cpu assembly was slightly thinner, not all of the pins were touching and B1, B2 ram slots were not working, leaving me with single channel ram. I put paper shims (just 1 thick) on the heat spreader tabs and that fixed the problem. After I did this I noticed the likely adjustable screw on the front of the clamp, but why fix what aint broke?
> .


Chalk up another titbit if knowledge for the community.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> Good point about the tim thickness didn't consider that...however I am going to try it for now as I have ran out of CLU and its on the way lol however today is my only chance to use my vice before I pack it up for a move....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways I will report back on how the stock tim is after a delid and report results.


If the results from this thread on AnandTech hold true, the Intel TIM is actually pretty good. It out performed Noctua NT-H1 in his findings.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> Good point about the tim thickness didn't consider that...however I am going to try it for now as I have ran out of CLU and its on the way lol however today is my only chance to use my vice before I pack it up for a move....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyways I will report back on how the stock tim is after a delid and report results.
> 
> 
> 
> If the results from this thread on AnandTech hold true, the Intel TIM is actually pretty good. It out performed Noctua NT-H1 in his findings.
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183
Click to expand...

Isn't the biggest reason to delid is to get rid of the gap the black epoxy glue causes between the die and the IHS? After that, TIM is TIM. CLU gets better results that TIM.

Wouldn't overthink about which TIM is the best, though I guess I could be wrong. Differences between best TIM and worst TIM should be a few degrees, maybe 5°C, I think that as long as you get decent TIM you're fine.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> If the results from this thread on AnandTech hold true, the Intel TIM is actually pretty good. It out performed Noctua NT-H1 in his findings.
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183


Yup the TIM is very good actually I have tested it myself just never needed to post the results really. the issue is that the glue/epoxy when it dries expands slightly when wet making the TIM have a bigger gap to cover creating a bigger heat distance delta to overcome.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Isn't the biggest reason to delid is to get rid of the gap the black epoxy glue causes between the die and the IHS? After that, TIM is TIM. CLU gets better results that TIM.
> 
> Wouldn't overthink about which TIM is the best, though I guess I could be wrong. Differences between best TIM and worst TIM should be a few degrees, maybe 5°C, I think that as long as you get decent TIM you're fine.


The TIM does matter surprisingly enough, the biggest temp drops I've seen on someones PC was 43C on every core


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> If the results from this thread on AnandTech hold true, the Intel TIM is actually pretty good. It out performed Noctua NT-H1 in his findings.
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183
> 
> 
> 
> Yup the TIM is very good actually I have tested it myself just never needed to post the results really. the issue is that the glue/epoxy when it dries expands slightly when wet making the TIM have a bigger gap to cover creating a bigger heat distance delta to overcome.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Isn't the biggest reason to delid is to get rid of the gap the black epoxy glue causes between the die and the IHS? After that, TIM is TIM. CLU gets better results that TIM.
> 
> Wouldn't overthink about which TIM is the best, though I guess I could be wrong. Differences between best TIM and worst TIM should be a few degrees, maybe 5°C, I think that as long as you get decent TIM you're fine.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The TIM does matter surprisingly enough, the biggest temp drops I've seen on someones PC was 43C on every core
Click to expand...

For a delid you mean?? Even for a delid that's quite a lot. Did he go from stock cooler to water cooling or something?









Still though, as long as the TIM is decent (a reputated brand; ie known for being good/decent TIM), should be fine though? If some TIM is especially better than others I'd be curious to listen. Never hurts knowing this stuff.


----------



## RickRockerr

I'll just leave this here:


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> *Isn't the biggest reason to delid is to get rid of the gap the black epoxy glue causes between the die and the IHS?* After that, TIM is TIM. CLU gets better results that TIM.
> 
> Wouldn't overthink about which TIM is the best, though I guess I could be wrong. Differences between best TIM and worst TIM should be a few degrees, maybe 5°C, I think that as long as you get decent TIM you're fine.


Yup, that's exactly what Idontcare proved in that link.


----------



## Strata

I just did my first delid last night on my new 4770K, using a safety utility blade: 

Honestly it worked amazingly. You need to enter with the bottom edge flat to the pcb, and as you start to cut through the epoxy gently pry upwards for a few seconds before resuming pushing through. I did the same for the VRM side only much slower and more methodically.Once I felt I had cut deep enough I used some Bead Landing Transite filament from Michael's, though fishing line will work the same, to ensure that the epoxy had been completely cut without damaging the innards. You will know the line is cutting right if slivers of the epoxy come out when you pull the cord out.

Sadly I have no before temps for you, as I'm jumping straight to the delid, and no current temps yet, as that was my first step before I continue my house from IVB to HW. As soon as I have them I'll let you guys know.


----------



## cdnGhost

I guess I should have asked this prior to my delid...... So when I OC my chip i am stable at 4.6ghz @ 1.31v.....
My question is this

Should I just be happy and keep it or roll the dice and see if intel will let me use my PTPP
and hope for a chip than can OC higher at lower volts.......

Not sure if they will since i did a delid but what do you guys think?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> I guess I should have asked this prior to my delid...... So when I OC my chip i am stable at 4.6ghz @ 1.31v.....
> My question is this
> 
> Should I just be happy and keep it or roll the dice and see if intel will let me use my PTPP
> and hope for a chip than can OC higher at lower volts.......
> 
> Not sure if they will since i did a delid but what do you guys think?


4.6 @ 1.31 is pretty good. I wouldn't gamble on getting something better than that.


----------



## cdnGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> 4.6 @ 1.31 is pretty good. I wouldn't gamble on getting something better than that.


Thanks for the reply!
Just had one of those "if I don't ask its going to consume me and keep me up at night" kinda moments


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> I guess I should have asked this prior to my delid...... So when I OC my chip i am stable at 4.6ghz @ 1.31v.....
> My question is this
> 
> Should I just be happy and keep it or roll the dice and see if intel will let me use my PTPP
> and hope for a chip than can OC higher at lower volts.......
> 
> Not sure if they will since i did a delid but what do you guys think?


For most normal day to day stuff your setup is fine I used to be super anal about if i could squeeze more into my daily, but hardly any gains are to be had really. Just use a good above normal OC and you're fine


----------



## cdnGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> For most normal day to day stuff your setup is fine I used to be super anal about if i could squeeze more into my daily, but hardly any gains are to be had really. Just use a good above normal OC and you're fine


Thanks, yeah I don't know why but i figure hey if I can why not....


----------



## Valgaur

trying to find new fans for my case to either paint or have them be white.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> I guess I should have asked this prior to my delid...... So when I OC my chip i am stable at 4.6ghz @ 1.31v.....
> My question is this
> 
> Should I just be happy and keep it or roll the dice and see if intel will let me use my PTPP
> and hope for a chip than can OC higher at lower volts.......


Sometimes you just have to sit back and ask yourself..

"I rolled a ~6/10. Do i really want to take another shot at this?"

Even if nobody else is affected by the choice, it's free and instantly a new chip appears in front of you.. it's probably a bad one. You'd need a top ~20% chip to have a significant upgrade. Bottom 60% would be worse or equal at best - the odds are waay against you

There's no shame in having a chip around average, especially if you clock it well. If you get a 200-300mhz worse chip though it'd really hurt and be a much bigger deal than you getting one that was 100 or even 200mhz better (that's really unlikely)

Also, isn't it the case that you can only use performance tuning plan once? Like if you have chip replaced, you can't get it again - or do they just allow you to daisy chain chips every month with it if you pay them like $15 for each one?


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> trying to find new fans for my case to either paint or have them be white.


White you say? I painted my GTs white:



There are also the Swiftech Helix fans if you wanna buy them already white.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Sometimes you just have to sit back and ask yourself..
> 
> "I rolled a ~6/10. Do i really want to take another shot at this?"
> 
> Even if nobody else is affected by the choice, it's free and instantly a new chip appears in front of you.. it's probably a bad one. You'd need a top ~20% chip to have a significant upgrade. Bottom 60% would be worse or equal at best - the odds are waay against you
> 
> There's no shame in having a chip around average, especially if you clock it well. If you get a 200-300mhz worse chip though it'd really hurt and be a much bigger deal than you getting one that was 100 or even 200mhz better (that's really unlikely)
> 
> Also, isn't it the case that you can only use performance tuning plan once? Like if you have chip replaced, you can't get it again - or do they just allow you to daisy chain chips every month with it if you pay them like $15 for each one?


so true lol out of about 20 4770ks we had only 1 that would do above 4.8ghz under 1.37v and 1 that did 4.9ghz at 1.41v

oh and btw I delided but didn't leave the stock tim I managed to open my clu syringe and get jst enough for delid 19-21c shaved off now running 4.7ghz 1.38v


----------



## Kokin

Here is my officially submission:

*OCN name:* Kokin
*CPU:* Intel i5 3570K
*on die-TIM:* Phanteks PH-NDC
*ihs-TIM:* Phanteks PH-NDC
*Mhz gained:* Kept 4.7GHz @ 1.264V
*OC after delid:* Max - 5.120GHz
*Temp drops:* 7-14C depending on core
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* 5.120GHz
http://valid.canardpc.com/y7k94e
*Cooling:* Custom loop, Swiftech Apogee Drive II waterblock

Pre-delid temps:



Post-delid temps:



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Here are pictures of my 3570K delid.


----------



## Macnb

Anyone else tried this new way to delid? :

Just a vice to slowly split the IHS from the PCB ...no hammer...no blades...no flying chips....just a vice.
Seems much safer.

Just watch the first 2 min.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Macnb*
> 
> Anyone else tried this new way to delid? :
> 
> Just a vice to slowly split the IHS from the PCB ...no hammer...no blades...no flying chips....just a vice.
> Seems much safer.
> 
> Just watch the first 2 min.


Looks more risky since he's actually pushing down on the center of the PCB/components while tightening up the vice. You could easily deform the IHS that way as well.

It's very similar to using 2 pieces of wood + wall, but I still think the vice, hammer, and wood method is the safest and quickest method.

Edit: Wow he's pretty badass for running the CPU without any heatsink/block at the end of the video.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Macnb*
> 
> Anyone else tried this new way to delid? :
> 
> Just a vice to slowly split the IHS from the PCB ...no hammer...no blades...no flying chips....just a vice.
> Seems much safer.
> 
> Just watch the first 2 min.


There's a post of exactly this on this page lol (maybe the last page if you're on default settings)


----------



## MrBiology

That does seem like a much less violent way to do it, though I'd be concerned about the additional stress placed on the PCB with this method- with the hammer/vice all of the force is lateral, ideal for shearing the adhesive. With the CPU at an angle there's going to be some perpendicular force, which will translate as bowing, however slight. It may or may not be enough to matter, but it is worth considering.


----------



## Macnb

Someone else doing it the same way:





Not sure there any bowing of the PCB.
This one gives way very easily.
There's no way of damaging the IHS as it is way harder than the black seal which gives way as the IHS is pushed across the PCB.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> White you say? I painted my GTs white:
> 
> 
> 
> There are also the Swiftech Helix fans if you wanna buy them already white.


How where they to paint and take apart?


----------



## InCoGnIt0

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835345045
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811999344
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186033
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835426015
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835352006

BitFenix, Arctic, Fractal Design, Silverstone and Gelid make white fans.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Macnb*
> 
> Someone else doing it the same way:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure there any bowing of the PCB.
> This one gives way very easily.
> There's no way of damaging the IHS as it is way harder than the black seal which gives way as the IHS is pushed across the PCB.


lol hes shakin like a leaf...I member first time me and my buddy delided a 3570k/3770k same time we were both freaked and stoned/on coffee







out now ive done dozens lol and just whack away
















also I have bowed the his on several 4770k's on my vice using the block/hammer method due to I think tightening the vice to tight but one thing I noticed and cannot be denied is the 3570k/3770ks have a stronger thicker IHS I have also weighd both the IHS and cannot recall the exact weight but the 3570k's IHS weight approx. 8% more lol and didn't bow as easily


----------



## Tcoppock

4.9ghz @ 1.34v
So my CLU came in running on a H100 (waiting on my Swiftech H220 should be here this week), much better performance from clu than Noctua Thermal paste.
How are these temps, and shouldn't they be much better when my H220 arrives?


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> How where they to paint and take apart?


Taking them apart is easy, but you need a lot of patience for the c-clips. The ones on GT fans are metallic, so you can use something magnetic to prevent them from flying away and getting lost.

Painting is also easy, but it may be difficult to get it fully coated at some edges due to how GT fan blades are designed. Just make sure to only apply a few coats so that your fan stays balanced.

You can do it in a few hours, at least that's how long it took me to paint 8 GTs. Make sure to let the paint dry for 12-24 hours and to buy paint specifically for plastic, such as Krylon Fusion.


----------



## Roboyto

To anyone with an XSPC Raystorm who wants to go naked







It's quite easy without the EK naked bracket

http://www.overclock.net/t/1468701/xspc-raystorm-naked-ivy-haswell-mounting-no-additional-hardware


----------



## Valgaur

these look pretty sick

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835345045


----------



## DarkReign32

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> these look pretty sick
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835345045


I'm using two of those for the "pull" side. They're quite good. I have them at 1100 RPM. I have to say, I quite like Bitfenix fans. They're quiet and they do move a good amount of air. Plus they look nice.


----------



## Tmfs

Picked up a small table vise today and did the deed. Chip lived but how do you guys recommend removing the black adhesive around the chip? Getting it off the ihs was easy but getting it off the chip is proving a little more difficult.

I'm currently seeing about -15 on what was my hottest core which is now my coolest core lol... I'm just using some prolimatech pk-1 so nothing too fancy. Plan to replace it with something better in the future.


----------



## Tcoppock

either a credit card or fingernails is what i would use.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Picked up a small table vise today and did the deed. Chip lived but how do you guys recommend removing the black adhesive around the chip? Getting it off the ihs was easy but getting it off the chip is proving a little more difficult.
> 
> I'm currently seeing about -15 on what was my hottest core which is now my coolest core lol... I'm just using some prolimatech pk-1 so nothing too fancy. Plan to replace it with something better in the future.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tcoppock*
> 
> either a credit card or fingernails is what i would use.


everyone beats me to it T.T


----------



## maynard14

hi its been a while,. question guys,.. do i need to replace the Coollaboratory pro every once a year? or its not necessary,. still my temps are good as new since i put the clp on my 3570k


----------



## LagunaX

Liquid Pro solidifies into a hard solder like material while ultra may need to replaced every so often from reading other ppl's posts


----------



## Tmfs

Pretty sure my chip is dead now. Pulled it out to finish cleaning off the adhesive and I either nicked a trace or messed the core up. There are what look like a bunch of tiny scratches in the center of it. Sad day when the chip lives through the actually delid but I find a way to ruin it afterwards.









Edit: sorry about that


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Liquid Pro solidifies into a hard solder like material while ultra may need to replaced every so often from reading other ppl's posts


i see, so thats a good news about the clp,. no need to change the tim ,.







im much happy now,.. btw if i decide to sell the 3570k,. if it solidifies, it means the IHS cover wont come off if i remove the prcoessor right?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Pretty sure my chip is dead now. Pulled it out to finish cleaning off the adhesive and I either nicked a trace or messed the core up. There are what look like a bunch of tiny scratches in the center of it. Sad day when the chip lives through the actually delid but I find a way to ruin it afterwards.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: sorry about that


gimme teh piccys!!!! maybe we can save thee


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> gimme teh piccys!!!! maybe we can save thee


Sure I'll take some pictures. I think something got on my paper towel and I didn't notice then procceded to scratch it all up.


----------



## Tmfs

Pictures.... still a small amount of adhesive on it but as you can see the dye is all messed up.



http://imgur.com/Gwb3w


----------



## MR-e

hey guys, i bought a tube of clu and currently awaiting shipment. question, did i buy the wrong one?
i plan on delidding and using clu, but won't have time to re apply the paste every so often. should i have gone with clp?


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Pictures.... still a small amount of adhesive on it but as you can see the dye is all messed up.
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/Gwb3w


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> gimme teh piccys!!!! maybe we can save thee


hope you can still fix it up sir,... hope someone with the knowledge will help you about your problem


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> hope you can still fix it up sir,... hope someone with the knowledge will help you about your problem


Thanks but I'm pretty sure it's toast. I was just being a little too careless. Shame too that was a strong chip, could do x46 p95 stable at 1.280v.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Sure I'll take some pictures. I think something got on my paper towel and I didn't notice then procceded to scratch it all up.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Pictures.... still a small amount of adhesive on it but as you can see the dye is all messed up.
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/Gwb3w


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Thanks but I'm pretty sure it's toast. I was just being a little too careless. Shame too that was a strong chip, could do x46 p95 stable at 1.280v.


I have seen "dies" with scratches on them before and they still worked just fine. Clean the surcharge with a q-tip, apply some plain old TIM, and test the chip. Surface scratches aren't the end of the world, chips missing from the die areas or cracks are, because they go much deeper than just the surface!!


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> I have seen "dies" with scratches on them before and they still worked just fine. Clean the surcharge with a q-tip, apply some plain old TIM, and test the chip. Surface scratches aren't the end of the world, chips missing from the die areas or cracks are, because they go much deeper than just the surface!!


Tested no post.


----------



## INCREDIBLEHULK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Liquid Pro solidifies into a hard solder like material while ultra may need to replaced every so often from reading other ppl's posts


give, more, info!

I thought it was the other way around? I did sell a chip a bit ago here to an OCN member and when I had cleaned the CLU to re-apply it had seemed the same from when I had first installed it ~6months prior.
How long we talking for CLP / CLU drying periods? If it's something like ~2years I can definitely understand, but for the CLP is it similar?

My understanding is they relatively provide same cooling? Just a different end result when cleaning?

I whacked the hammer on a 4770k, using CLU now, might be long till I mess with it but guess I will do some more research







I remember only choosing CLU because it was said to be easier to clean


----------



## Buttsy

Hey everyone!

I de-lidded my 4770k over the weekend (using the vice method) so, so easy, just a couple of decent taps and the IHS popped straight off. Used a credit card to scrape the glue gunk off and the cleaning kit in the CLU to clean the die.

*OCN name:* Buttsy
*CPU:* 4770k
*on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
*ihs-TIM:* Arctic MX2
*Mhz gained:* 111MHz (so far fro 4.5 - 4.611)
*OC after delid:* 4.611GHz (53 x 87.02)
*Temp drops:* 66c before delid 59c after, full load P95 & IBT
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/dst8x2

Photos:


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Tested no post.


And there are no bent pins in the socket, correct? I only ask, as the die really doesn't look that bad. Also, did you try and clear your CMOS? And I'm assuming your trying to put it back into the same board you first tested the CPU in also, yes?


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> And there are no bent pins in the socket, correct? I only ask, as the die really doesn't look that bad. Also, did you try and clear your CMOS? And I'm assuming your trying to put it back into the same board you first tested the CPU in also, yes?


Yeah I'm typing from the same motherboard right now with a different 4770k in it. I didn't think it looked that bad either but it refuses to post for some reason. I have a UD4H so I have post codes and it doesn't even get past the first one. Not sure how I killed it.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Yeah I'm typing from the same motherboard right now with a different 4770k in it. I didn't think it looked that bad either but it refuses to post for some reason. I have a UD4H so I have post codes and it doesn't even get past the first one. Not sure how I killed it.


Well that sucks brother. Sorry it isn't working!


----------



## Tmfs

It's a bummer for sure but it's not the first chip I've killed and probably won't be the last.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> It's a bummer for sure but it's not the first chip I've killed and probably won't be the last.


lay the case on its side and pull the chip and reseat it. After I delidded my chip it started being picky on exactly how I place my chip into the socket. Before delid I could just throw it in basically. Its worth a try. My mobo cpu light was on with no post and I had to pull the cpu whipe the out side paste and place it again 3 times to get it working correctly. 1st time no post. 2nd I got some memory error i never seen before. 3rd everthing works fine. It was a pin or two not landing exactly right I guess.

Good luck.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *INCREDIBLEHULK*
> 
> give, more, info!
> 
> I thought it was the other way around? I did sell a chip a bit ago here to an OCN member and when I had cleaned the CLU to re-apply it had seemed the same from when I had first installed it ~6months prior.
> How long we talking for CLP / CLU drying periods? If it's something like ~2years I can definitely understand, but for the CLP is it similar?
> 
> My understanding is they relatively provide same cooling? Just a different end result when cleaning?
> 
> I whacked the hammer on a 4770k, using CLU now, might be long till I mess with it but guess I will do some more research
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I remember only choosing CLU because it was said to be easier to clean


imo CLU should last every bit of 4-6 years or better esp. if you use the PC daily/weekly and do not allow the CLU to sit for long periods of time...

as long as no damage or internal damage as done to the chip during delid that could present an issue in the future...id gamble to say that deliding properly could.should increase the lifsespand of the chip given you take into account overclocking.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Pictures.... still a small amount of adhesive on it but as you can see the dye is all messed up.
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/Gwb3w


Those scratches don't even look that bad honestly. They just seem to be small marks on the glass.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sexpot*
> 
> hey guys, i bought a tube of clu and currently awaiting shipment. question, did i buy the wrong one?
> i plan on delidding and using clu, but won't have time to re apply the paste every so often. should i have gone with clp?


nope you're fine just check on it every 6 months or so.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buttsy*
> 
> Hey everyone!
> 
> I de-lidded my 4770k over the weekend (using the vice method) so, so easy, just a couple of decent taps and the IHS popped straight off. Used a credit card to scrape the glue gunk off and the cleaning kit in the CLU to clean the die.
> 
> *OCN name:* Buttsy
> *CPU:* 4770k
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Arctic MX2
> *Mhz gained:* 111MHz (so far fro 4.5 - 4.611)
> *OC after delid:* 4.611GHz (53 x 87.02)
> *Temp drops:* 66c before delid 59c after, full load P95& IBT
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.canardpc.com/dst8x2
> 
> Photos:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig on! btw!!~~~ pretty sure you can get a better OC by using a 100 fsb instead of that odd 87 than going with a 46 multi or even 48 and 1.45 is quite a bit of vcore in my mind.


----------



## MR-e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nope you're fine just check on it every 6 months or so.


Can I leave it longer than 6 months? I don't really service my loop more than once a year.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sexpot*
> 
> Can I leave it longer than 6 months? I don't really service my loop more than once a year.


loops should be serviced every 3 months, or at least well maintained


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> loops should be serviced every 3 months, or at least well maintained


WHAA?









I only clean my loops if:
I can see goo in water
I have to add something to the loop
6-12 months before last cleaning.
cleaning every 3 months would scare a lot of ppl away from water cooling, I think.

But im fairly new to all this, so.. but I will check the CLU state when im getting my water block for my new GPU and the acrylics (with any lucky, I will get it later this week)
I still dont see any heat changes on my CPU, and I delidded over 8 months ago, so im guessing it is about time to refresh the CLU. My system is running 24/7 more or less.


----------



## MR-e

every 3 months is too excessive. it depends on how well you prep your components before going under water. i've had systems that range from gunked up loops within 6 months of service to systems that had pristine water and blocks after 1.5 years of service. all that changed was how thorough the parts were cleaned before filling. with that said, i've gone ahead and re-ordered clp.


----------



## Tcoppock

So after delid and CLU 5ghz stable @ 1.44v


----------



## Valgaur

The 3 months is my personal feelings as you spend hundreds if not over a grand to wc a system and you just leave it. normal dusting is every 3 months or 2 in my mind and with a wc system I take every precaution as should everyone. I'd rather take the time to care for it then have to take the time repairing it.


----------



## MR-e

dusting every 3 months is fine in my books, but i just can't be bothered to tear down a loop and clean the blocks every 3 months. that's why i make sure to prep the rad and blocks prior to filling it.


----------



## Tmfs

OMG IT'S ALIVE!!!! A big thank you to Wirerat. If it wasn't for your suggestion I probably wouldn't of gone back and tried it again. I had already re-seated the chp twice last night but after reading your reply I thought it was a long shot but decided to go back and give it a third and final try when I got up today. Guess third time really is a charm lol... Also thank to you to everyone else that tried to help and the kind words.

Guess I'm back in the club boys!



I'll get back with better details on actual temp drops and all that jazz when I get some free time tonight.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Agree








I wouldnt bother tearing down the entire system for cleaning unless you have a feeling that the blocks are getting gunked up..
My system is running clean so fare.. I will check if the blocks are also still clean and corrosion free, soon.
If it all looks good, Im gonna put it back together and aim for a flush ever 6-12 months, aka draining and refilling..
no need to tear down the entire loop for maintenance if the water is clear


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> OMG IT'S ALIVE!!!! A big thank you to Wirerat. If it wasn't for your suggestion I probably wouldn't of gone back and tried it again. I had already re-seated the chp twice last night but after reading your reply I thought it was a long shot but decided to go back and give it a third and final try when I got up today. Guess third time really is a charm lol... Also thank to you to everyone else that tried to help and the kind words.
> 
> Guess I'm back in the club boys!
> 
> 
> 
> I'll get back with better details on actual temp drops and all that jazz when I get some free time tonight.


I am very happy for you. I thought it was just my mobo. I guess these delided chips just dont seat that well sometimes.

Really glad I could help!!


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Agree
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wouldnt bother tearing down the entire system for cleaning unless you have a feeling that the blocks are getting gunked up..
> My system is running clean so fare.. I will check if the blocks are also still clean and corrosion free, soon.
> If it all looks good, Im gonna put it back together and aim for a flush ever 6-12 months, aka draining and refilling..
> no need to tear down the entire loop for maintenance if the water is clear


If the blocks start to get clogged up you will likely notice a temperature difference if you watch you temps on a daily basis. Idle and load will change, once mine came up about 5-8C across all cores I knew something was up.

Need to dig to find the picture, but I will post it as soon as I can so you can see what a partially clogged block will look like.

*This is what happens when you purchase the cheap barbs that are called "Silver Diamond" that don't actually have any silver in them to prevent them from corroding.*

It was my first leap into watercooling and the initial expense can be quite large, gimme a break OK











*The little pieces that flaked off the edges of the barbs got stuck in the fin array.*



*And then starting collecting some sort of funk on them. It looks like mold or something, but it was 90% solid and came out in little chunks.*

Very evident where it came from once I noticed the barbs.



*This happened even while using Dead-Water biocide and having (2) .999 silver kill coils in my reservoir.*


----------



## Buttsy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on! btw!!~~~ pretty sure you can get a better OC by using a 100 fsb instead of that odd 87 than going with a 46 multi or even 48 and 1.45 is quite a bit of vcore in my mind.


Cheers, thanks bro! I have been messing around with the CPU Straps and Bclk overclocking and running suicide runs trying to find the limits of my chip. I couldn't get thru a full boot running 100 x46 even pumping the vcore up to 1.69v and playing around with VCCIN up to 1.89v So I have been finding ways around it









I have been getting stable overclocks using sub 100 Bclk on the 100MHz CPU Strap and also 110+ using the 125MHz CPU Strap. My chip really doesn't like the 167 and 200 Straps lol. But then again my chip has been a terrible overclocker! I really didn't win the silicon lottery on this one.


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I am very happy for you. I thought it was just my mobo. I guess these delided chips just dont seat that well sometimes.
> 
> Really glad I could help!!












My experiences exactly after I had delidded 2 3770k's.

They would post no problems b4 delidding but afterwards took either several reseats or a reseat with my old 2600k prior to posting.


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My experiences exactly after I had delidded 2 3770k's.
> 
> They would post no problems b4 delidding but afterwards took either several reseats or a reseat with my old 2600k prior to posting.


Thank goodness it was that and not a dead chip. I wonder what is causing this after a delid. Anyone have any ideas?


----------



## LagunaX

In my case I had used the razor blade/x-acto knife method and I suspect it was due to the minor PCB nicks I had that actually killed another cpu but that is another story...


----------



## Tmfs

OCN name: Tmfs
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
Mhz gained: unknown
OC after delid: unknown
Temp drops: ~17C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: unknown

Before


After


Very happy, especially since I'm not using a super high end TIM.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> OCN name: Tmfs
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
> ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
> Mhz gained: unknown
> OC after delid: unknown
> Temp drops: ~17C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: unknown
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> After
> 
> 
> Very happy, especially since I'm not using a super high end TIM.


Congrats on getting the chip up and running again! It looked way too good to be damaged.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> OCN name: Tmfs
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
> ihs-TIM: Prolimatech PK-1
> Mhz gained: unknown
> OC after delid: unknown
> Temp drops: ~17C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: unknown
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> After
> 
> 
> Very happy, especially since I'm not using a super high end TIM.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!


Where's mine?









http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24130#post_21842451


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Here is my officially submission:
> 
> *OCN name:* Kokin
> *CPU:* Intel i5 3570K
> *on die-TIM:* Phanteks PH-NDC
> *ihs-TIM:* Phanteks PH-NDC
> *Mhz gained:* Kept 4.7GHz @ 1.264V
> *OC after delid:* Max - 5.120GHz
> *Temp drops:* 7-14C depending on core
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* 5.120GHz
> http://valid.canardpc.com/y7k94e
> *Cooling:* Custom loop, Swiftech Apogee Drive II waterblock
> 
> Pre-delid temps:
> 
> 
> 
> Post-delid temps:


*ninja's you in*









You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on! (Sorry i missed ya had crazy amounts of papers this week so my mind is pretty flimsy.







)


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *ninja's you in*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on! (Sorry i missed ya had crazy amounts of papers this week so my mind is pretty flimsy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Yippie! Thanks.

I've been up all night doing schoolwork as well, so you are not alone.







Probably won't get any sleep until this afternoon.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Wrong thread








*Edit
Congrats / welcome to the new members


----------



## mk16

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Celeron-BX80557420-1-60GHZ-Processor/dp/B000QJ15SG/ref=sr_1_5?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1393452316&sr=1-5&keywords=Intel+Celeron+420

so this celley has TiM on it right?
wanna give deliding a go on a $10 part first.
can get this one friday
http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Celeron-1-6Ghz-800Mhz-SL9XP/dp/B003CO53WG/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1393452316&sr=1-1&keywords=Intel+Celeron+420

its is the right part, right?


----------



## lilchronic

OCN name: lilchronic
CPU: Intel i7 4770k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: Gelid gc extreme
Mhz gained: Kept 4.6ghz
OC after delid: Max - not tested
Temp drops: 30c
CPU-Z validation of max OC


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mk16*
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Celeron-BX80557420-1-60GHZ-Processor/dp/B000QJ15SG/ref=sr_1_5?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1393452316&sr=1-5&keywords=Intel+Celeron+420
> 
> so this celley has TiM on it right?
> wanna give deliding a go on a $10 part first.
> can get this one friday
> http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Celeron-1-6Ghz-800Mhz-SL9XP/dp/B003CO53WG/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1393452316&sr=1-1&keywords=Intel+Celeron+420
> 
> its is the right part, right?


check the list in the OP, it might be in there








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> OCN name: lilchronic
> CPU: Intel i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: Gelid gc extreme
> Mhz gained: Kept 4.6ghz
> OC after delid: Max - not tested
> Temp drops: 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC


You're in! (again







)







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## mk16

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> check the list in the OP, it might be in there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're in! (again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!


the 420 is in the op just wanted to double check before i bought.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mk16*
> 
> the 420 is in the op just wanted to double check before i bought.


should be good then


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> check the list in the OP, it might be in there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're in! (again
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!












this is my 3rd 4770k, figured id do it properly this time


----------



## LagunaX

My rep rating is way too low to post in the WANTED section for months but if anyone hears of a proven, delidded and resealed with liquid pro 4770k capable of 4.6-4.7ghz+ stable (linx, prime95 with AVX, IBT max, etc.) please send them my way.

My 4.8ghz delidded 3770k is lovely but I have a new Maximus Hero board waiting for the right chip...


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> first off check the IHS and I am kind of curious why your ram is having these issues and that's kind of why I'm wary to get super high end ram above 2133 in my mind. Anywho, maybe I'm tired but have you talked with Gskill and requested an RMA of the RAM simply? thats what I would RMA first not the cpu but the RAM and then with the cpu it should be more than fine.
> 
> If i didnt make any sense there... I apologize sleepy val is sleepy. Nighty Night OCN Val off.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Would try RMA the RAM since it is quicker and faster than RMAing the CPU. Sounds like a RAM issue, but then again, the IMC may have been damaged during the delid.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ok, so I said the ram is 100% working on another pc with the M5E and 3770K, tested at 2133 with both 9-11-11-31 @1.60v and 11-11-11-31 @1.45v, it works fine
> 
> However my cpu too is OK, right now I even have a lower temp difference between the cores, I used to have more than 10°C before, now it's 6-7°C
> And I even managed to improve a lot my 4.7Ghz offset daily, with a nice full load vcore:
> 
> 
> 
> It can't be the cpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's just a strange incompatibility between the G.Skill at 2133+ and my MoBo, confirmed one hour ago even by a friend of mine with the same OCF and G.Skills at 2133, had lots of freezes and was only solving by replacing the G.Skills with the Corsair Dominator 2133
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was happy to find out at least one more proof of the weird ram behaviour and maybe I'll do the same too
> For now, at 1866 cl 9-10-10 @1.50v my cpu is running fine with inferior voltages
Click to expand...

Hi guys, here I am back and finally found the cpu (or it's IMC) responsible for the high speed ram failure
Tested for two days with a 2600K and everything came back working good:

http://s27.postimg.org/l1ahjm1mp/Cpu_4_5_offset_1_256_load_Xmp_Hyperpi.jpg
http://s3.postimg.org/reo3igspd/Cpu_4_6_offset_Xmp.jpg

So I started a RMA chat discussion with an Intel guy, even tellin him that it was about a delidded cpu, and with the top writings barely visible because of the CLU tim that I've used:



And here's a copy of the chat:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



*info*: You are now chatting with Arun
*Arun*: Hello. Thank you for using the Intel Customer Chat Support service. We are glad to be of service. How may I help you?
*Me*: Hi, yes, I wanted to ask for a RMA procedure for my cpu 3770K due to its faulty IMC
*Arun*: I apologize for the inconvenience caused to you. I will try my best to help you with this issue.
*Arun*: John, may I know the exact issue with your processor?
*Me*: Yes, it worked fine with my old ram, 2x4Gb Crucial Tactical Tracer 1866 c9 (even if I had some small issues with my motherboard Gigabyte Z77-UP5 TH) and I simply bought a new mainboard, the Asrock Z77 OC Formula and a new kit of 2x8 Gb G.Skill RipjawsX F3-2133C9D-16GXH
*Me*: And then, it started, lots of errors with the Xmp at 2133 enabled
*Me*: I even started some discussions like here: http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?p=74193
*Arun*: Thank you for the information.
*Me*: And here http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f219/asrock-z77-oc-formula-intel-z77-chipsatz-913640-168.html
*Arun*: John, you can test your processor by running IPDT(Intel processor diagnostic tool ) to isolate the issue with the processor.
*Arun*: John, may I know the operating system that you are using in your desktop?
*Me*: I've removed the cpu and tested for a couple of days with a 2600K, everything is allright:
*Me*: http://s27.postimg.org/l1ahjm1mp/Cpu_4_5_offset_1_256_load_Xmp_Hyperpi.jpg
*Me*: http://s29.postimg.org/b1cdc3fth/Cpu_4_5_offset_1_256_load_Xmp.jpg
*Me*: I'm using windows 7 x64
*Me*: I wanted to mention that my 3770K also worked well but only with the ram at 1866 cl 9-10-10-28
*Arun*: Have tested your i7-3770K processor with IPDT(Intel processor diagnostic tool ) ?
*Me*: No, I haven't, it was clear for me after lots of testings that it wasn't the motherboard or the ram respnsible for that
*Arun*: Thank you for the information. Please be online for 3 - 4 minutes while I check the details for you.
*Arun*: Thank you for staying online.
*Arun*: John, I do realize the importance of the issue and urgency and will surely expedite the process as I need to escalate this to your local warranty team and will create service ticket for your reference and will route the service ticket to them with priority recommending for RMA.
*Me*: Thanks!
*Me*: Can I ask some minor things?
*Arun*: In order to process the request further, Please provide the details mentioned below: -
*Arun*: - Complete Name (First name and last name)
*Arun*: - Company name (If applicable)
*Arun*: - Complete address with postal pin code / Zip code number.
*Arun*: - Email Address
*Arun*: - Contact phone number with STD / Area code number.
*Arun*: - Convenient time.
*Arun*: Sure please go ahead.
*Me*: So, I bought this cpu on an online eshop about one year ago, however they didn't ever send me the (online, pdf) receipt
*Arun*: Please help us with the complete details of the processor to validate the warranty.
*Arun*: FPO batch number.(Fifth line on processor.
*Arun*: ATPO number.(Sixth and seventh Line on processor)
*Arun*: Please click on the web links below. The web link may help you provide the correct processor markings.
*Arun*: http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-030330.htm
*Me*: Will do in a minute. One other thing is that the cpu is delidded in order to use the Colllaboratory Liquid Ultra as Tim
*Me*: And here's a recnt pic of it: http://www.xtremeshack.com/photos/20140226139342846180507.jpg
*Arun*: John, do you have the processor box with you?
*Me*: Yes, of course
*Arun*: Please provide me the batch number of the processor mentioned on the box.
*Me*: So, the batch is 3244C470
*Me*: Barely but still visible even on it's Ihs
*Arun*: Please provide me the ATPO number/serial number of the processor mentioned on the box.
*Me*: Sorry, and what is this number, the product code?
*Me*: OK, the S/N number!
*Arun*: It is the s/n number.
*Me*: 2L232261A4526
*Arun*: I see that the processor is currently under warranty and the purchase bill is not mandatory for warranty replacement.
*Arun*: Kindly provide me the above requested details to create a service ticket and process further.
*Me*: Ok, so:
*Me*: - ... Adress given ...
*Arun*: Thank you for the information.
*Me*: Thank you for your help!
*Arun*: Please be online for 3 - 4 minutes while I create the service ticket number.
*Me*: Ok, tell me,
*Me*: Do I have to clean the TIM (CLU) applied between the cpu and its Ihs?
*Me*: Or do I have to reseal it with silicon glue?
*Arun*: You will have to clean the Thermal interface material and submit for warranty replacement.
*Arun*: Kindly be online for 3 - 4 minutes while I create a profile and service ticket number for you.
*Me*: Thanks!
*Arun*: Thank you for staying online.
*Arun*: The service ticket number: ... ... . You will be contacted by the local warranty team within 24-48 hours regarding warranty support.
*Arun*: Kindly wait for further communication from our end.
*Arun*: I hope I have answered all your queries. Is there anything else that I may assist you with ?
*Me*: Ok, I will have to send the cpu box and cooler too?
*Arun*: If the cooler/CPU fan is supplied along with the processor at the time of purchase, yes you will have to submit both.
*Me*: Ok, got it








*Me*: Thank you for your kindness!
*Arun*: Is there anything else I can assist you with?
*Arun*: You are welcome, it my pleasure assisting you.
*Me*: Have a good day!
*Arun*: Thank you for using Intel products and services, you have a wonderful day.
*Arun*: Thank you for using Intel's live chat. Please complete the online survey when you have finished the chat session. We value your feedback and will use it to improve our service. Thank you!



I obtained a RMA ticket however I didn't understand quite well this part:
Quote:


> _*Me*: Do I have to clean the TIM (CLU) applied between the cpu and its Ihs?
> *Me*: Or do I have to reseal it with silicon glue?
> *Arun*: You will have to clean the Thermal interface material and submit for warranty replacement._


So, what do you think, do I have to re-seal the IHS with the silicon glue, remove the inner CLU, both things or simply do nothing?









Waiting for your tip


----------



## lilchronic

just seal it back up you can leave clp on the die................. no need to tell them you delidded if they dont ask.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just seal it back up you can leave clp on the die................. no need to tell them you delidded if they dont ask.


This

Never offer an out for the company your seeking rma from.


----------



## arrow0309

Ok, thanks!
Will seal the IHS


----------



## Imprezzion

I played with my OC a bit again and look what I got out of my delidded 3770K. The temps compared to stock dropped well over 20c. Closer to 30c even.

[Clickable]


i7 3770K.
Asus P8Z77-V Pro
4x4GB Crucial Ballistix Elite 2133C9 Samsung HCH9

102.1x49 = 5002Mhz
RAM @ 2179Mhz 9-10-10-21-120-1T
1.448v load vcore (+0.250v offset & High LLC)
1.05v VCCSA / 1.15v VCCIO
1.70v VDIMM

Just ran a little LinX AVX test of about 100 minutes and it ran fine, no errors, no eventvwr errors which always popped up even though LinX / Prime are stable.
Going to run a 12-18 hour Prime run tonight if I feel like it just to be sure.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Hi guys, here I am back and finally found the cpu (or it's IMC) responsible for the high speed ram failure
> Tested for two days with a 2600K and everything came back working good:
> 
> http://s27.postimg.org/l1ahjm1mp/Cpu_4_5_offset_1_256_load_Xmp_Hyperpi.jpg
> http://s3.postimg.org/reo3igspd/Cpu_4_6_offset_Xmp.jpg
> 
> So I started a RMA chat discussion with an Intel guy, even tellin him that it was about a delidded cpu, and with the top writings barely visible because of the CLU tim that I've used:
> 
> 
> 
> And here's a copy of the chat:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> *info*: You are now chatting with Arun
> *Arun*: Hello. Thank you for using the Intel Customer Chat Support service. We are glad to be of service. How may I help you?
> *Me*: Hi, yes, I wanted to ask for a RMA procedure for my cpu 3770K due to its faulty IMC
> *Arun*: I apologize for the inconvenience caused to you. I will try my best to help you with this issue.
> *Arun*: John, may I know the exact issue with your processor?
> *Me*: Yes, it worked fine with my old ram, 2x4Gb Crucial Tactical Tracer 1866 c9 (even if I had some small issues with my motherboard Gigabyte Z77-UP5 TH) and I simply bought a new mainboard, the Asrock Z77 OC Formula and a new kit of 2x8 Gb G.Skill RipjawsX F3-2133C9D-16GXH
> *Me*: And then, it started, lots of errors with the Xmp at 2133 enabled
> *Me*: I even started some discussions like here: http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?p=74193
> *Arun*: Thank you for the information.
> *Me*: And here http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f219/asrock-z77-oc-formula-intel-z77-chipsatz-913640-168.html
> *Arun*: John, you can test your processor by running IPDT(Intel processor diagnostic tool ) to isolate the issue with the processor.
> *Arun*: John, may I know the operating system that you are using in your desktop?
> *Me*: I've removed the cpu and tested for a couple of days with a 2600K, everything is allright:
> *Me*: http://s27.postimg.org/l1ahjm1mp/Cpu_4_5_offset_1_256_load_Xmp_Hyperpi.jpg
> *Me*: http://s29.postimg.org/b1cdc3fth/Cpu_4_5_offset_1_256_load_Xmp.jpg
> *Me*: I'm using windows 7 x64
> *Me*: I wanted to mention that my 3770K also worked well but only with the ram at 1866 cl 9-10-10-28
> *Arun*: Have tested your i7-3770K processor with IPDT(Intel processor diagnostic tool ) ?
> *Me*: No, I haven't, it was clear for me after lots of testings that it wasn't the motherboard or the ram respnsible for that
> *Arun*: Thank you for the information. Please be online for 3 - 4 minutes while I check the details for you.
> *Arun*: Thank you for staying online.
> *Arun*: John, I do realize the importance of the issue and urgency and will surely expedite the process as I need to escalate this to your local warranty team and will create service ticket for your reference and will route the service ticket to them with priority recommending for RMA.
> *Me*: Thanks!
> *Me*: Can I ask some minor things?
> *Arun*: In order to process the request further, Please provide the details mentioned below: -
> *Arun*: - Complete Name (First name and last name)
> *Arun*: - Company name (If applicable)
> *Arun*: - Complete address with postal pin code / Zip code number.
> *Arun*: - Email Address
> *Arun*: - Contact phone number with STD / Area code number.
> *Arun*: - Convenient time.
> *Arun*: Sure please go ahead.
> *Me*: So, I bought this cpu on an online eshop about one year ago, however they didn't ever send me the (online, pdf) receipt
> *Arun*: Please help us with the complete details of the processor to validate the warranty.
> *Arun*: FPO batch number.(Fifth line on processor.
> *Arun*: ATPO number.(Sixth and seventh Line on processor)
> *Arun*: Please click on the web links below. The web link may help you provide the correct processor markings.
> *Arun*: http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-030330.htm
> *Me*: Will do in a minute. One other thing is that the cpu is delidded in order to use the Colllaboratory Liquid Ultra as Tim
> *Me*: And here's a recnt pic of it: http://www.xtremeshack.com/photos/20140226139342846180507.jpg
> *Arun*: John, do you have the processor box with you?
> *Me*: Yes, of course
> *Arun*: Please provide me the batch number of the processor mentioned on the box.
> *Me*: So, the batch is 3244C470
> *Me*: Barely but still visible even on it's Ihs
> *Arun*: Please provide me the ATPO number/serial number of the processor mentioned on the box.
> *Me*: Sorry, and what is this number, the product code?
> *Me*: OK, the S/N number!
> *Arun*: It is the s/n number.
> *Me*: 2L232261A4526
> *Arun*: I see that the processor is currently under warranty and the purchase bill is not mandatory for warranty replacement.
> *Arun*: Kindly provide me the above requested details to create a service ticket and process further.
> *Me*: Ok, so:
> *Me*: - ... Adress given ...
> *Arun*: Thank you for the information.
> *Me*: Thank you for your help!
> *Arun*: Please be online for 3 - 4 minutes while I create the service ticket number.
> *Me*: Ok, tell me,
> *Me*: Do I have to clean the TIM (CLU) applied between the cpu and its Ihs?
> *Me*: Or do I have to reseal it with silicon glue?
> *Arun*: You will have to clean the Thermal interface material and submit for warranty replacement.
> *Arun*: Kindly be online for 3 - 4 minutes while I create a profile and service ticket number for you.
> *Me*: Thanks!
> *Arun*: Thank you for staying online.
> *Arun*: The service ticket number: ... ... . You will be contacted by the local warranty team within 24-48 hours regarding warranty support.
> *Arun*: Kindly wait for further communication from our end.
> *Arun*: I hope I have answered all your queries. Is there anything else that I may assist you with ?
> *Me*: Ok, I will have to send the cpu box and cooler too?
> *Arun*: If the cooler/CPU fan is supplied along with the processor at the time of purchase, yes you will have to submit both.
> *Me*: Ok, got it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Me*: Thank you for your kindness!
> *Arun*: Is there anything else I can assist you with?
> *Arun*: You are welcome, it my pleasure assisting you.
> *Me*: Have a good day!
> *Arun*: Thank you for using Intel products and services, you have a wonderful day.
> *Arun*: Thank you for using Intel's live chat. Please complete the online survey when you have finished the chat session. We value your feedback and will use it to improve our service. Thank you!
> 
> 
> 
> I obtained a RMA ticket however I didn't understand quite well this part:
> 
> So, what do you think, do I have to re-seal the IHS with the silicon glue, remove the inner CLU, both things or simply do nothing?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Waiting for your tip


just clean the ihs and seal it back up.

Honestly I see no reason to be truthfully honest with a company when you are concerned on something. truth will get you farther than swindling no matter what the issue is. Thats what I believe though.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> just clean the ihs and seal it back up.
> 
> Honestly I see no reason to be truthfully honest with a company when you are concerned on something. truth will get you farther than swindling no matter what the issue is. Thats what I believe though.


I agree. There is big difference in being dishonest and not offering any extra info that they didnt even ask for though.


----------



## Ryanboost

4770K in vice...check

Towel set down to catch processor...check

One wack on the wood and it splinters, slides over the processor and breaks one of the nubs on the bottom off...DOH!

Had a gut feeling I should of used the razor blade method.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ryanboost*
> 
> 4770K in vice...check
> 
> Towel set down to catch processor...check
> 
> One wack on the wood and it splinters, slides over the processor and breaks one of the nubs on the bottom off...DOH!
> 
> Had a gut feeling I should of used the razor blade method.


man. I really hated to read that.







sorry for your luck.


----------



## LagunaX

If I don't find a used predelidded CLP sealed one then I'm gonna do the vice method too but the newer vice method with slower gradual cranks of the vice until the IHS loosens up...


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> If I don't find a used predelidded CLP sealed one then I'm gonna do the vice method too but the newer vice method with slower gradual cranks of the vice until the IHS loosens up...


If I was going to do it again, I would do a hybrid method.

I would use the razor to put a partial cut in the non-VRM side, then use the new vice method.

My thinking is that the initial cut in the clue would tear a lot easier.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ryanboost*
> 
> 4770K in vice...check
> 
> Towel set down to catch processor...check
> 
> One wack on the wood and it splinters, slides over the processor and breaks one of the nubs on the bottom off...DOH!
> 
> Had a gut feeling I should of used the razor blade method.


Sorry about that man.







My piece of wood started splintering as well, but my wacks were not that hard so it took about 10 minutes of hammering to get it done.


----------



## Buttsy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ryanboost*
> 
> 4770K in vice...check
> 
> Towel set down to catch processor...check
> 
> One wack on the wood and it splinters, slides over the processor and breaks one of the nubs on the bottom off...DOH!
> 
> Had a gut feeling I should of used the razor blade method.


Wow, that sucks completely man







Commiserations.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Sorry about that man.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My piece of wood started splintering as well, but my wacks were not that hard so it took about 10 minutes of hammering to get it done.


I must have just been very very lucky when I de-lidded my 4770k, it took 3 moderate whacks (less than a minute) with the hammer and my PCB popped straight off the IHS, it didn't even fly out and get caught by the towels like I have read so many times. All I used was a 4"x1" piece of Hoop Pine about 15cm long and a regular Claw Hammer. It just popped up and off and sat on top of the IHS almost diagonally to each other. I wonder if Intel has used different glue on different batches of CPUs?


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buttsy*
> 
> Wow, that sucks completely man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Commiserations.
> 
> I must have just been very very lucky when I de-lidded my 4770k, it took 3 moderate whacks (less than a minute) with the hammer and my PCB popped straight off the IHS, it didn't even fly out and get caught by the towels like I have read so many times. All I used was a 4"x1" piece of Hoop Pine about 15cm long and a regular Claw Hammer. It just popped up and off and sat on top of the IHS almost diagonally to each other. I wonder if Intel has used different glue on different batches of CPUs?


It was probably due to my piece of wood. It was just a little larger than an index card and it wasn't a solid piece of wood, there were layers to it.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> It was probably due to my piece of wood. It was just a little larger than an index card and it wasn't a solid piece of wood, there were layers to it.


The new safest method going around posted a couple posts back. Basically you put the chip in the vice at a slight angle only one of the vice arms flushes up against the back of the pcb and angle the front on the IHS lip to ther other vice arms and simply tighten...

requires no hammering anything...took like 2 minutes of tightening to loosen the IHS and peeled it off....also this completely removes the possibility of the IHS bending like I have seen from hammering


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> The new safest method going around posted a couple posts back. Basically you put the chip in the vice at a slight angle only one of the vice arms flushes up against the back of the pcb and angle the front on the IHS lip to ther other vice arms and simply tighten...
> 
> requires no hammering anything...took like 2 minutes of tightening to loosen the IHS and peeled it off....also this completely removes the possibility of the IHS bending like I have seen from hammering


this can do damage directly to your pcb by the way


----------



## incog

I think the vice method that's been used for a while now is safest. You have to use a proper vice at a proper spot, a proper piece of wood and some common sense.


----------



## mercs215

I've delidded like 10 processors (Ivy and Haswell variants) now and all have survived







. It's very addicting...


----------



## GaMbi2004

lol








Welcome to OCN then.. hehe ^_^

Im almost done with my acrylic project, so it is soon time to check on the CLU status before putting it all back together..
Will post pics of its situation, if it has dryed out or anything like that.








Time to party down








Have a nice weekend you guys!


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> this can do damage directly to your pcb by the way


I can see see how if you angle the cpu to much but after doing 3 like this if you angle it nicely it does nothing to the pcb youd havto angle the crap out of it...

I found this method faster and is easier on the entire chip if done correctly...it also completely removes the possibility of the IHS bowing like i have seen...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> I can see see how if you angle the cpu to much but after doing 3 like this if you angle it nicely it does nothing to the pcb youd havto angle the crap out of it...
> 
> I found this method faster and is easier on the entire chip if done correctly...it also completely removes the possibility of the IHS bowing like i have seen...


also depends on the vice though. Some have very aggressive grip on the clamps and some are very smooth.


----------



## Ryanboost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> man. I really hated to read that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorry for your luck.


Strangest thing it still works.

Tossed it in and powered up just fine.

Ran the Intel Processor Diagnostic Tool and it passed.

How in the heck is that possible after breaking off one of those things on the bottom of the processor?

What are they and or what do they do?

Here is a picture of the one that is broken off/missing.


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ryanboost*
> 
> Strangest thing it still works.
> 
> Tossed it in and powered up just fine.
> 
> Ran the Intel Processor Diagnostic Tool and it passed.
> 
> How in the heck is that possible after breaking off one of those things on the bottom of the processor?
> 
> What are they and or what do they do?
> 
> Here is a picture of the one that is broken off/missing.


Ahh! that's either the performance limitation IC, the electro-core heater or the Megahertz Restrictor .


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ryanboost*
> 
> Strangest thing it still works.
> 
> Tossed it in and powered up just fine.
> 
> Ran the Intel Processor Diagnostic Tool and it passed.
> 
> How in the heck is that possible after breaking off one of those things on the bottom of the processor?
> 
> What are they and or what do they do?
> 
> Here is a picture of the one that is broken off/missing.


Looks like an SMC capacitor, mainly used to filter high frequency noise, & they store a small charge to help smooth out power ripple.
Hard to say what might be affected, although I like the explanation above


----------



## LagunaX

Dude, that was the 4.6ghz+ flux capacitor vrm you broke off!


----------



## Ryanboost

Hmm now I have to decide whether or not to use it.

I've got a brand new 4770k on my desk since I thought this was shot but it's hard to open it since this one seems to be working.

Decisions...decisions...


----------



## LagunaX

Stress test the old one first and see...


----------



## mk16

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Stress test the old one first and see...


meh if he has the old up and running i would just make it in to a cheap pc and give it to someone.


----------



## LagunaX

Or buy the Intel/Microcenter damage warranty on the new one for use on a 4770k u own,,,


----------



## rv8000

I delidded my 4670k this past weekend with the vice method no issues. Went with a relatively conservative amount of clu on the die, temps seemed to plateau around 78c @ 4.5ghz 1.85 vrin and 1.27vcore (read by hwmonitor) after 10 loops of the x264 benchmark. These temps are using an h220. I went to lap the ihs of the cpu today because the vice chewed the edge slightly and just to get a small temp improvement, I noticed the clu almost "seemed" to have dried up in certain spots (only a week later) and decided to go with a more modest amount remounting. The clu was painted on the die, I did not however brush the underside of the ihs with clu as I figured the extra clu on the die would suffice. I used the pea method when mounting the h220 (spread was perfect last mount) and my temps seem to be about 5-6 degrees higher and I also seem unstable now. Just after 3 minutes of gw2 I had hit 82c on the hottest core, this seems wrong to me as other people are getting better results with similar cooling setups and higher voltages on their chips







. Opinions?

*ambient temp is approx. 21c


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> I delidded my 4670k this past weekend with the vice method no issues. Went with a relatively conservative amount of clu on the die, temps seemed to plateau around 78c @ 4.5ghz 1.85 vrin and 1.27vcore (read by hwmonitor) after 10 loops of the x264 benchmark. These temps are using an h220. I went to lap the ihs of the cpu today because the vice chewed the edge slightly and just to get a small temp improvement, I noticed the clu almost "seemed" to have dried up in certain spots (only a week later) and decided to go with a more modest amount remounting. The clu was painted on the die, I did not however brush the underside of the ihs with clu as I figured the extra clu on the die would suffice. I used the pea method when mounting the h220 (spread was perfect last mount) and my temps seem to be about 5-6 degrees higher and I also seem unstable now. Just after 3 minutes of gw2 I had hit 82c on the hottest core, this seems wrong to me as other people are getting better results with similar cooling setups and higher voltages on their chips
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Opinions?
> 
> *ambient temp is approx. 21c


hmmmm can you take pics of the amounts you have on it? I wanna say just to much CLU but I wanna make sure here.


----------



## Ziver

OCN name: Ziver
CPU: 4770K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 100Mhz
OC after delid: 4.4Ghz
Temp drops: 21" c

CPU-Z validation of max OC: 

Thanks for eveyone







)


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmmm can you take pics of the amounts you have on it? I wanna say just to much CLU but I wanna make sure here.





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









The vrms are covered, the excess at the bottom and sides is not on die, the layer on both the die and bottom of the ihs are relatively thinly spread with the brush.



@ stock

-Idling at 36c hottest 30c coolest
-Pump at 2000 rpm (seems to be the sweet spot so far)
-2 fans on rad pushing air through @ 1800 rpm
-standard intel burntest hit 82c on hottest core
-gw after 5 mins in lions arch area hitting about 69c hottest 63c coolest


----------



## Wirerat

Anyone who has never used CLU, CLP. Be prepared to smush the sliver balls it makes when you squeeze it out.

I had no idea it behaves like mercury. It was running from my credit card and then I thought I had spread out and it balled back up lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ziver*
> 
> OCN name: Ziver
> CPU: 4770K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 100Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.4Ghz
> Temp drops: 21" c
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> Thanks for eveyone
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The vrms are covered, the excess at the bottom and sides is not on die, the layer on both the die and bottom of the ihs are relatively thinly spread with the brush.
> 
> 
> 
> @ stock
> 
> -Idling at 36c hottest 30c coolest
> -Pump at 2000 rpm (seems to be the sweet spot so far)
> -2 fans on rad pushing air through @ 1800 rpm
> -standard intel burntest hit 82c on hottest core
> -gw after 5 mins in lions arch area hitting about 69c hottest 63c coolest


I would say to much CLP/CLU still that looks like far to much really.


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would say to much CLP/CLU still that looks like far to much really.


I've briefly gone through a few pages of this thread and I've had a hard time finding a good post video showing the initial amount of clu/clp used before spreading it on the die/ihs. I checked a few of the videos and guides linked in the original post but most of it is just about the delidding process. Know of any good photos/videos off hand? Thanks


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> I've briefly gone through a few pages of this thread and I've had a hard time finding a good post video showing the initial amount of clu/clp used before spreading it on the die/ihs. I checked a few of the videos and guides linked in the original post but most of it is just about the delidding process. Know of any good photos/videos off hand? Thanks


 this was the thinest amount that would lay down. When tried to use any less it was wiping away.


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> this was the thinest amount that would lay down. When tried to use any less it was wiping away.


That's essentially how I spread it the first time minus putting some on the ihs, I had enough just so that it wouldnt wipe away. I'm still curious as to how large of a bead/ball size was initially used for spreading to get optimal results. About ready to just get rid of the h220 and pick up a good air cooler, having to run the pump @ 2K + starts to get to noisy to get any sort of benefit which is disappointing. I guess today will be full of a billion remounts


----------



## lilchronic

should look like this


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> should look like this


^^^

what he shows is the right amount i usually do half a pea and then breathe on it to warm it and it flows much better.


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ^^^
> 
> what he shows is the right amount i usually do half a pea and then breathe on it to warm it and it flows much better.


So just a single half pea for both the ihs and die?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> So just a single half pea for both the ihs and die?


for the entire thing is half pea


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> for the entire thing is half pea


Yea thats what I was going for, bad wording







thank you both.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Acrylic is done









Many more pics in my build log (linked in my sig)

I also did a CLU checkup to see how it was doing (after 8 months of operation)

Kinda looked dried out when I first opened up.. but it was still "brushable".. I added a tiny bit more and put it all back together


----------



## devlovE

Hey guys I'm new here! Just finished the delid this week. Was pretty nervous but here are my results.

However, I am wondering why core 0 seems to be so much cooler under load. Also cores 2 and 3 run about 10c hotter at idle than 0 and 1. Already tried to re-paste and pretty much got the same results. Not using the ihs here either.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devlovE*
> 
> Hey guys I'm new here! Just finished the delid this week. Was pretty nervous but here are my results.
> 
> However, I am wondering why core 0 seems to be so much cooler under load. Also cores 2 and 3 run about 10c hotter at idle than 0 and 1. Already tried to re-paste and pretty much got the same results. Not using the ihs here either.


Welcome to OCN! Looks like some fairly nice temps there.. just odd that core0 is that much off :S
Need.. Moar.. Info...









What CPU are you running? what cooler? (guessing EK direct mount?)

Did you test the CPU before delidding? how was temp difference then? (from hottest core to coolest)


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devlovE*
> 
> Hey guys I'm new here! Just finished the delid this week. Was pretty nervous but here are my results.
> 
> However, I am wondering why core 0 seems to be so much cooler under load. Also cores 2 and 3 run about 10c hotter at idle than 0 and 1. Already tried to re-paste and pretty much got the same results. Not using the ihs here either.


Welcome to OCN!

A variance in temps can come from several places. If you have already ruled out the possibility of uneven TIM and bad cooler mount, then I would not worry about it.

Core0 is at the very top of the die, it only has a neighbor on one side to share heat with (well there is the display controler and system agent, but its small, and I dont think they get that hot), compared to Core1, Core2, and Core3, that have other core neighbors, with Core3 sharing one side with the on board graphics. I have had the exact same issue on the exact same core throughout different mounting applications, including undillided on air, dellided on air, dillided on water, and naked on water. Core0, for me, is always about 10C cooler.


----------



## devlovE

Its a 3770k under water with an xspc raystorm block. I had tested about a year ago. I don't have the pics anymore sadly so I can't directly compare. I do remember that the spread was less than 10C though which is why I'm sort of questioning what's going on.

Here's my idle temps for comparison.

Screenshot16.png 1182k .png file


And my rig.

guts.jpg 1112k .jpg file


Sorry for the low quality.


----------



## devlovE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Welcome to OCN!
> 
> A variance in temps can come from several places. If you have already ruled out the possibility of uneven TIM and bad cooler mount, then I would not worry about it.
> 
> Core0 is at the very top of the die, it only has a neighbor on one side to share heat with (well there is the display controler and system agent, but its small, and I dont think they get that hot), compared to Core1, Core2, and Core3, that have other core neighbors, with Core3 sharing one side with the on board graphics. I have had the exact same issue on the exact same core throughout different mounting applications, including undillided on air, dellided on air, dillided on water, and naked on water. Core0, for me, is always about 10C cooler.


Thanks! That's a little bit relieving to hear. I might give it another go with the paste purely based on the fact that my idle temps are also seeing a 10-14 degree spread between cores which seems odd after looking at everyone's results.


----------



## sWaY20

OCN name: sway20
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: clu
ihs-TIM: gelid gc extreme
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid: 4.8ghz
Temp drops: 30c

This chip is horrible after 4.5ghz which required 1.3v, im running it at 4.8ghz with 1.5v 24/7 after delid. I was getting 95c before the delid on itb and prime, now I'm at 65c on both. I was hoping for 5ghz but not with this pos.


----------



## rv8000

Last remount for today as I think im out of clu. Got maybe a 4-5c drop since the last mount.



Still really disappointed in temps at this point. Hottest core at stock in standard ibt run still hit 81c. I've tried with the pump between 1200 rpm to 2200 rpm, 2k rpm still seems to give the best results. But I believe temps should not be nearly this high @ stock with an h220


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sWaY20*
> 
> OCN name: sway20
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: clu
> ihs-TIM: gelid gc extreme
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz
> Temp drops: 30c
> 
> This chip is horrible after 4.5ghz which required 1.3v, im running it at 4.8ghz with 1.5v 24/7 after delid. I was getting 95c before the delid on itb and prime, now I'm at 65c on both. I was hoping for 5ghz but not with this pos.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> Last remount for today as I think im out of clu. Got maybe a 4-5c drop since the last mount.
> 
> 
> 
> Still really disappointed in temps at this point. Hottest core at stock in standard ibt run still hit 81c. I've tried with the pump between 1200 rpm to 2200 rpm, 2k rpm still seems to give the best results. But I believe temps should not be nearly this high @ stock with an h220


What are your ambient temps? what TIM you using on the top of the IHS?


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What are your ambient temps? what TIM you using on the top of the IHS?


Ambient is ~22c right now, I'm using mx-4 on top of the die. I've tried both the line and pea method and both have given good spreads with a good amount of tim.

5min of gw2 at stock, pump @ 2k rpm, 2x helix non pwm fans @ 1800rpm.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devlovE*
> 
> Thanks! That's a little bit relieving to hear. I might give it another go with the paste purely based on the fact that my idle temps are also seeing a 10-14 degree spread between cores which seems odd after looking at everyone's results.


10-14 spread on idle? I'm not delidded, but three of my cores are only about 10c over room temp idle. You have one ~20c + over room temp?

Possibility of sensor just being screwed or less accurate at lower temps


----------



## devlovE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> 10-14 spread on idle? I'm not delidded, but three of my cores are only about 10c over room temp idle. You have one ~20c + over room temp?
> 
> Possibility of sensor just being screwed or less accurate at lower temps


Ambient is about 22C with the cores reading as follows:

Core 0 - 20c
Core 1 - 22c
Core 2 - 31c
Core 3 - 34c


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devlovE*
> 
> Ambient is about 22C with the cores reading as follows:
> 
> Core 0 - 20c
> Core 1 - 22c
> Core 2 - 31c
> Core 3 - 34c


Tried disabling iGPU? Sorry, i read up and missed some info you said before. With three of your cores being very close at load, i don't think it's a big problem


----------



## devlovE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Tried disabling iGPU? Sorry, i read up and missed some info you said before. With three of your cores being very close at load, i don't think it's a big problem


Yeah I just checked to make sure and it is in fact disabled. Seems my temp sensor might just be a little odd or maybe my waterblock isn't perfectly flat. Either way the temps under load seem to be pretty fair. Intel burn test maxed out at 70C @ 4.6 - 1.28v .


----------



## Tmfs

Want to pick up some Coollaboratory Pro or Ultra for die TIM. What do you guys recommend? Looks like can't really go wrong with either.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Want to pick up some Coollaboratory Pro or Ultra for die TIM. What do you guys recommend? Looks like can't really go wrong with either.


CLP


----------



## GaMbi2004

Why? I remember a time not long ago where CLU was better than CLP, now its the other way around?

I dont think you can go wrong with ether.. Im running CLU, and just checked up on it yesterday after 8 months of running, still looked fine.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Why? I remember a time not long ago where CLU was better than CLP, now its the other way around?
> 
> I dont think you can go wrong with ether.. Im running CLU, and just checked up on it yesterday after 8 months of running, still looked fine.


I also have several chips running clu at about 8-9 months with still excellent results and also had checked one about 2 months back after switching mobos and the application looked exactly the same from the sec I had originaly delied lol.

imo the clp will shave 2 or so celcius off but also be more of a pain in the long run and imo the clu should remain about the same over a longer period of time. vs the clp


----------



## mk16

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Why? I remember a time not long ago where CLU was better than CLP, now its the other way around?
> 
> I dont think you can go wrong with ether.. Im running CLU, and just checked up on it yesterday after 8 months of running, still looked fine.


from what i've seen on a test someone did on here there 100% the same.


----------



## devlovE

Well after a lot of extensive reading I'm figuring that the direct mount is the cause of my uneven core temps. I had used gelid extreme between the die and waterblock; however I just rush ordered some clp and clu. Ill remount later this week with the ihs back in place and will post the results. I did notice some light scuffing on the die after I did the last remount and I'm hoping that it won't get any worse. Is there a way to just lightly buff the die back to its mirror finish?


----------



## pkrexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> should look like this
> 
> 
> So I'm not even breaking 60c with my 1.36vcore playing BF4.


I don't know if putting CLU on the spreader is necessary. I put a thin layer just on the cpu die and had good results.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pkrexer*
> 
> I don't know if putting CLU on the spreader is necessary. I put a thin layer just on the cpu die and had good results.


I assume it makes sure that the CLU stays everywhere on the die. When applying it, it really does not like to stick to the die. It might contract again and expose parts of the die if you put the IHS on, but that will not happen if there's also CLU on the IHS.


----------



## rv8000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I assume it makes sure that the CLU stays everywhere on the die. When applying it, it really does not like to stick to the die. It might contract again and expose parts of the die if you put the IHS on, but that will not happen if there's also CLU on the IHS.


This actually happened to me just after a week of use. I had only spread a thin layer on the die initially and when I removed the ihs to remount/reapply I found the clu coverage to be spotty. So definitely best to spread a layer on both the die and ihs.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I assume it makes sure that the CLU stays everywhere on the die. When applying it, it really does not like to stick to the die. It might contract again and expose parts of the die if you put the IHS on, but that will not happen if there's also CLU on the IHS.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rv8000*
> 
> This actually happened to me just after a week of use. I had only spread a thin layer on the die initially and when I removed the ihs to remount/reapply I found the clu coverage to be spotty. So definitely best to spread a layer on both the die and ihs.


----------



## eR1k

Count me in









OCN name: eR1k
CPU: *3770k (LD PC-V2 Phase Change)*
on die-TIM: Gelid GC-Extreme
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC-Extreme
Mhz gained: 100 MHz +
OC after delid: 5.3 GHz
Temp drops: evap temp is approximately 4C colder when controlling for other variables (e.g. voltage level, room temperature). Unfortunately the temperature readout of the CPU cores with a software package is very unreliable below zero degrees C.

Delidding was a piece of cake with the vice - hammer method. However, the process of mounting the evaporator directly on the die turned out to be a real challenge. After removing the retention bracket I was unable to get a proper mount, which resulted in an inability to boot the system. I decided to put the IHS back on, reinstalled the mounting bracket, and still I needed many tries to get the perfect mount. In fact, the mounting of the evaporator turned out to be a really precarious job: if I turn the nuts clockwise for an additional ~20 degrees, the system will no longer boot (i.e. error 55). At one time I accidentally hit the table my benchtable is standing on ever so slightly, and I had to spend a full 30 minutes to get a decent mount again. I can't believe how difficult it is to get a proper mount, I definitely underestimated this. The metal braided suction line puts a lot of asymmetrical pressure on the CPU, which makes it even more difficult to get the mount just right.

I use my pc mainly to play Guild Wars 2; which is very CPU heavy. So the final result is that I'm able to play Guild Wars 2 at 5.3 GHz (1.585 vcore), whereas I previously played at 5.2 GHz (1.545 vcore). Before the mod 5.3 GHz wasn't stable regardless of the voltage thrown at it. The evaporator also runs significantly cooler by about 4C, which is excellent in my opinion. I can even play at 5.4 GHz now, but that requires 1.680 vcore.

In retrospect I don't think the mod was worth it for me personally: the mounting difficulties outweigh the MHz gain and temperature drop.



*Click here* for a fullsize screenshot


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eR1k*
> 
> Count me in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: eR1k
> CPU: *3770k (LD PC-V2 Phase Change)*
> on die-TIM: Gelid GC-Extreme
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC-Extreme
> Mhz gained: 100 MHz +
> OC after delid: 5.3 GHz
> Temp drops: evap temp is approximately 4C colder when controlling for other variables (e.g. voltage level, room temperature). Unfortunately the temperature readout of the CPU cores with a software package is very unreliable below zero degrees C.
> 
> Delidding was a piece of cake with the vice - hammer method. However, the process of mounting the evaporator directly on the die turned out to be a real challenge. After removing the retention bracket I was unable to get a proper mount, which resulted in an inability to boot the system. I decided to put the IHS back on, reinstalled the mounting bracket, and still I needed many tries to get the perfect mount. In fact, the mounting of the evaporator turned out to be a really precarious job: if I turn the nuts clockwise for an additional ~20 degrees, the system will no longer boot (i.e. error 55). At one time I accidentally hit the table my benchtable is standing on ever so slightly, and I had to spend a full 30 minutes to get a decent mount again. I can't believe how difficult it is to get a proper mount, I definitely underestimated this. The metal braided suction line puts a lot of asymmetrical pressure on the CPU, which makes it even more difficult to get the mount just right.
> 
> I use my pc mainly to play Guild Wars 2; which is very CPU heavy. So the final result is that I'm able to play Guild Wars 2 at 5.3 GHz (1.585 vcore), whereas I previously played at 5.2 GHz (1.545 vcore). Before the mod 5.3 GHz wasn't stable regardless of the voltage thrown at it. The evaporator also runs significantly cooler by about 4C, which is excellent in my opinion. I can even play at 5.4 GHz now, but that requires 1.680 vcore.
> 
> In retrospect I don't think the mod was worth it for me personally: the mounting difficulties outweigh the MHz gain and temperature drop.
> 
> 
> 
> *Click here* for a fullsize screenshot


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Jetskyer

OCN name: Jetskyer
CPU: i5 4670k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: -- direct die
Mhz gained: -- haven't pushed the chip jet
OC after delid: 4.5 Ghz, 1.35 volts (must be able to lower the voltage, or raised the clock speed but haven't put much time in it yet)
Temp drops: 25 degrees ( 80 => 55. water temperature @ 30 degrees)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: *will be added later on, desktop hasn't got internet atm

Delidded using an alternative vice method. Instead of using a hammer I just put the pcb against one claw of the vice (with enough padding of course) and the IHS against the other, tightened the vice till the IHS shifted, turned it around and tightened the vice again and that was it. 30 seconds and no blunt force exerted to my CPU.

Must say I'm very pleased with the temps. Even though 80 degrees wasn't high to start with I still got a 25 degree drop.
Pretty impressive too when the fans are just running at 550 rpm while the system is drawing 500watts, keeping the water only 10 degrees above ambient. Hooray for water-cooling


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jetskyer*
> 
> OCN name: Jetskyer
> CPU: i5 4670k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: -- direct die
> Mhz gained: -- haven't pushed the chip jet
> OC after delid: 4.5 Ghz, 1.35 volts (must be able to lower the voltage, or raised the clock speed but haven't put much time in it yet)
> Temp drops: 25 degrees ( 80 => 55. water temperature @ 30 degrees)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: *will be added later on, desktop hasn't got internet atm
> 
> Delidded using an alternative vice method. Instead of using a hammer I just put the pcb against one claw of the vice (with enough padding of course) and the IHS against the other, tightened the vice till the IHS shifted, turned it around and tightened the vice again and that was it. 30 seconds and no blunt force exerted to my CPU.
> 
> Must say I'm very pleased with the temps. Even though 80 degrees wasn't high to start with I still got a 25 degree drop.
> Pretty impressive too when the fans are just running at 550 rpm while the system is drawing 500watts, keeping the water only 10 degrees above ambient. Hooray for water-cooling


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## GlowingBurrito

Just came back from Lowes to pick up a vise. CLU just shipped. WIll have pics up of mine as soon as the CLU gets here







nervous and excited lol


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GlowingBurrito*
> 
> Just came back from Lowes to pick up a vise. CLU just shipped. WIll have pics up of mine as soon as the CLU gets here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nervous and excited lol


Dont be nervous! be steady.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Dont be nervous! be steady.


lol ive been using the 30$ cheap vice from lowe's







ive done like 15 or so cpu's on it last 4 I did were the tightening method worked good.the vice has flat grips so it doesn't hurt the pcb.

if u do the tightening method be sure to use a towel on ur hand that tiny ass lever is a biotch to turn once its hard lol


----------



## lilchronic

just got a new 4770k today and i want to delid it sooo bad but i ran out of thermal paste barely had enough to put it in and test it


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> just got a new 4770k today and i want to delid it sooo bad but i ran out of thermal paste barely had enough to put it in and test it


Looks like a strong chip. What's the batch #, cooling and ambient temp?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Looks like a strong chip. What's the batch #, cooling and ambient temp?


Batch# L319B929 currently testing 4.7Ghz @ 1.275vid - 1.3v vcore - 2.0v vccin ambient temps 21c
havent touched uncore yet, really want to delid before i push this chip. was thinking of picking up some artic silver or something from radio shack









but got some gelid gc extreme and also a new CLP are on the way


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Batch# L319B929 currently testing 4.7Ghz @ 1.275vid - 1.3v vcore - 2.0v vccin ambient temps 21c
> havent touched uncore yet really want to delid before i push this chip guna pick up some artic silver or something from radio shack


Sounds like a keeper to me, congrats!


----------



## Buttsy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Batch# L319B929 currently testing 4.7Ghz @ 1.275vid - 1.3v vcore - 2.0v vccin ambient temps 21c
> havent touched uncore yet, really want to delid before i push this chip. was thinking of picking up some artic silver or something from radio shack
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but got some gelid gc extreme and also a new CLP are on the way


Aww man I'm so so jealous!!! It seems the later batches are not just better but way way way better than the earlier ones. Damn refinement! OCN User Rextn has his 4770k up over 5 GHz







and is batch L317.

I'm thinking I need a newer 4770k, but I want a 4790k too..... my 4770k is batch L311







Doesn't matter what I do I can't push it any further han 4.611GHz . LOL


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buttsy*
> 
> Aww man I'm so so jealous!!! It seems the later batches are not just better but way way way better than the earlier ones. Damn refinement! OCN User Rextn has his 4770k up over 5 GHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and is batch L317.
> 
> I'm thinking I need a newer 4770k, but I want a 4790k too..... my 4770k is batch L311
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Doesn't matter what I do I can't push it any further han 4.611GHz . LOL


Where did the batch #'s for the 4770k's start at? Mine is still sealed in the box, batch# 3335B913. I could probably swap it if that's a low batch number.....!


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Where did the batch #'s for the 4770k's start at? Mine is still sealed in the box, batch# 3335B913. I could probably swap it if that's a low batch number.....!


Your chip was made in week 35 of 2013. I'm not sure what the most recent batches are but production has probably shifted to the refresh line of chips by now. I have no evidence to back that up just a guess.

Edit: A quick look around google and seems week 51 of 2012 (L251A899) was the earliest I could find which looks like a ES sample. Week 6 of 2013 (L306B335) looks like the earliest retails.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Your chip was made in week 35 of 2013. I'm not sure what the most recent batches are but production has probably shifted to the refresh line of chips by now. I have no evidence to back that up just a guess.
> 
> Edit: A quick look around google and seems L251A899 was the earliest I could find. So week 51 of 2012 which is probably an ES sample.


Thanks for the info, +rep. Is there a link to the formula for the batch numbers?? Which numbers/letters mean what? I know how to decipher the SN's for Asus, asrock, gigabyte, and most other board and GPU makers. But not the CPUs.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Thanks for the info, +rep. Is there a link to the formula for the batch numbers?? Which numbers/letters mean what? I know how to decipher the SN's for Asus, asrock, gigabyte, and most other board and GPU makers. But not the CPUs.


http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?278-HOWTO-Read-an-Intel-CPU-FPO-Batch-Code


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?278-HOWTO-Read-an-Intel-CPU-FPO-Batch-Code


Thx @lilchronic +Rep for that too!!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Thx @lilchronic +Rep for that too!!


----------



## Jetskyer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> lol ive been using the 30$ cheap vice from lowe's
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ive done like 15 or so cpu's on it last 4 I did were the tightening method worked good.the vice has flat grips so it doesn't hurt the pcb.
> 
> if u do the tightening method be sure to use a towel on ur hand that tiny ass lever is a biotch to turn once its hard lol


Some copper grease (or just plain oil) on the thread of the vice will make your life so much easier. Did the tightening-method as well and the IHS was loose before I even had to tighten my grip on the tiny lever. Worked like a charm


----------



## FractinJex

delid results on clu

chip from previous post.... 3333C costa rica

4.9ghz 1.48v load 1.5v adaptive will run 24/7








uncore 43x 1.21vv

Input V - initial 2.0v eventual 2.0v

System agent v + 0.300 something like 1.25v should be safe

IO + 0.150v

Extreme phase 140% cuurent value

ram 2400 MHz 1.655v

load temp during GW2 max 67c on cooler master glacer 240l - -

CLU

also to Note: I attempted to get 5ghz some what stable without any luck up to 1.55-1.57v and 2.1-.2.2 input voltage...she would still bsod/freeze pissed me off lol


----------



## Valgaur

Let vagur know if you see any good psu deals I need a 700-800 watter for under 90 max







needs to be a tough sucker gonna be my benching psu


----------



## devlovE

Well I got my clu and redid my paste. core 0 still running about 10 under; however the temps look great. 9 hours into p95 test and max core temp was 58. I'll post the results once it's done.


----------



## devlovE

Already posted this in the ivy stable thread, hopefully it's alright to post it again here. Just finished that 12 hour p95 run. Max Core temp was 58c.



Screenshot20.png 495k .png file


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devlovE*
> 
> Already posted this in the ivy stable thread, hopefully it's alright to post it again here. Just finished that 12 hour p95 run. Max Core temp was 58c.
> 
> 
> 
> Screenshot20.png 495k .png file


The temp variation is pretty common among Ivy chips. My core0 is also about 10C lower than my hottest core. Your temps are much better than mine despite having similar settings and ambient temps.

What were your temps before the CLU? I'm using Phanteks PH-NDC and I'm not sure if I want to get CLU or CLP since it's only a few C difference.


----------



## devlovE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> The temp variation is pretty common among Ivy chips. My core0 is also about 10C lower than my hottest core. Your temps are much better than mine despite having similar settings and ambient temps.
> 
> What were your temps before the CLU? I'm using Phanteks PH-NDC and I'm not sure if I want to get CLU or CLP since it's only a few C difference.


I had used gelid extreme on the die before, but also went with a direct mount. Decided to use the ihs this time and the temps have gone down around 8c since I switched to the clu. I ordered both the clu and clp but found the clu to be a lot easier to work with.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devlovE*
> 
> I had used gelid extreme on the die before, but also went with a direct mount. Decided to use the ihs this time and the temps have gone down around 8c since I switched to the clu. I ordered both the clu and clp but found the clu to be a lot easier to work with.


Wow that's a big drop. Thanks for your reply.


----------



## devlovE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Wow that's a big drop. Thanks for your reply.


It seems that the liquid metal tims do much better when placed on the die whereas they are only slightly better than other tims between the ihs and heatsink.


----------



## Jugurnot

Just 2 quick questions...

i5-3570k oc'd to 5.0ghz @ 1.36 vcore passes IBT on high setting. 87 degree max temp.

Currently cooled by a stock h220.

Is this worth delidding if all I really do is game? and...

How long on average do these chips last at 5.0ghz?


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just 2 quick questions...
> 
> i5-3570k oc'd to 5.0ghz @ 1.36 vcore passes IBT on high setting. 87 degree max temp.
> 
> Currently cooled by a stock h220.
> 
> Is this worth delidding if all I really do is game? and...
> 
> How long on average do these chips last at 5.0ghz?


Ideally max 75C on a 3570k, of which I've overclocked to 4.6GHz on mine. 87C is too high.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> Ideally max 75C on a 3570k, of which I've overclocked to 4.6GHz on mine. 87C is too high.


So what you are saying is, yes, I should delid to achieve 75c or less?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just 2 quick questions...
> 
> i5-3570k oc'd to 5.0ghz @ 1.36 vcore passes IBT on high setting. 87 degree max temp.
> 
> Currently cooled by a stock h220.
> 
> Is this worth delidding if all I really do is game? and...
> 
> How long on average do these chips last at 5.0ghz?


At 1.36? quite a while I would imagine. I have been running 5.0 at 1.35 for quite a while now. I have not needed to bump voltage or change anything. Still rock solid after about a year. Custom loop with direct die, I top out at 70C in the heat of the summer.

Edit to add: yes, lower temperatures are better, break its head off.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> At 1.36? quite a while I would imagine. I have been running 5.0 at 1.35 for quite a while now. I have not needed to bump voltage or change anything. Still rock solid after about a year. Custom loop with direct die, I top out at 70C in the heat of the summer.
> 
> Edit to add: yes, lower temperatures are better, break its head off.


Well a year is all I really want to be happy lol. But longer is always nice too









And by direct die, you mean block right on die without IHS?


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> So what you are saying is, yes, I should delid to achieve 75c or less?


Either that, which I did for my 4770k, or down clock it.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> And by direct die, you mean block right on die without IHS?


yup.


----------



## LagunaX

Either drop down to 4.8ghz which should put u at 1.28v and load high 60's/low 70's or delid.


----------



## GaMbi2004

I vote for delid! Its a shame to have a chip like that, and not run it at its full potential!

1.36v for 5.0 is awesome! mine is 4.6 at 1.3v








1.36 is totally safe for 24/7 use, and the temps arent too bad ether.. are you planing on upgrading cooler?
Delidding should put you at 67-72 degrees with that 1.36v OC (IBT) witch would be ? 60-65 while gaming?

I for one, is jealous on your chip









But if you are not confident with doing stuff like this, I would lower to 4.8 and lower vcore for some cooler temps.


----------



## Kokin

You're only getting 87C in IBT right? How are your load temps outside of stress testing? 70~80C is acceptable if those are your load temps during gaming. Since the max temp of the CPU is 105C, I would say 90C is a good temp ceiling.

By all means, do delid though! It took me many months to decide to do it, but I'm glad when I did do it. It only took a bit of my time and the results were beyond my expectations.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> At 1.36? quite a while I would imagine. I have been running 5.0 at 1.35 for quite a while now. I have not needed to bump voltage or change anything. Still rock solid after about a year. Custom loop with direct die, I top out at 70C in the heat of the summer.
> 
> Edit to add: yes, lower temperatures are better, break its head off.


lol that chip will last way beyond 6 + years at those volts....my friends still has a 3770k 5ghz delid @ 1.54v 24/7 for almost a year now without a single hiccup...most likely the chip will start to show degration around 3-5 yeasrs time and will require tiny bump if any....and will last well beyond point of upgrade...

running my 4770k now at 4.9ghz 1.51v 24/7 inpout voltage 2.0 custom loop max temp with clu 73c:thumb:









its been said by intel ina couple of vids to stay within 10% of the chips max...well the max is prly around 1.5v so you get the idea


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I vote for delid! Its a shame to have a chip like that, and not run it at its full potential!
> 
> 1.36v for 5.0 is awesome! mine is 4.6 at 1.3v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.36 is totally safe for 24/7 use, and the temps arent too bad ether.. are you planing on upgrading cooler?
> Delidding should put you at 67-72 degrees with that 1.36v OC (IBT) witch would be ? 60-65 while gaming?
> 
> I for one, is jealous on your chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But if you are not confident with doing stuff like this, I would lower to 4.8 and lower vcore for some cooler temps.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> You're only getting 87C in IBT right? How are your load temps outside of stress testing? 70~80C is acceptable if those are your load temps during gaming. Since the max temp of the CPU is 105C, I would say 90C is a good temp ceiling.
> 
> By all means, do delid though! It took me many months to decide to do it, but I'm glad when I did do it. It only took a bit of my time and the results were beyond my expectations.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> lol that chip will last way beyond 6 + years at those volts....my friends still has a 3770k 5ghz delid @ 1.54v 24/7 for almost a year now without a single hiccup...most likely the chip will start to show degration around 3-5 yeasrs time and will require tiny bump if any....and will last well beyond point of upgrade...
> 
> running my 4770k now at 4.9ghz 1.51v 24/7 inpout voltage 2.0 custom loop max temp with clu 73c:thumb:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its been said by intel ina couple of vids to stay within 10% of the chips max...well the max is prly around 1.5v so you get the idea


Thanks alot! I will delid. I havent had time to game yet at that clock speed, tonight ill do some more tests and make sure I am completely stable.

Just making sure I understand this right, I want to pop the top off my chip, replace the thermal compound with (clu)? Put the IHS back on and im done? Ive seen videos of removing the IHS, but none that actually put it all back together and boot up.

Thanks in advance

EDIT: Forgot to mention I probably wont be upgrading the h220 for the life of the chip, but I may expand and add a 120 rad.


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys quick inquiry should I find a good mousepad or keep my old 2 dolla one


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just making sure I understand this right, I want to pop the top off my chip, replace the thermal compound with (clu)? Put the IHS back on and im done? Ive seen videos of removing the IHS, but none that actually put it all back together and boot up.


Yep, you remove the IHS, clean up the black glue (this is what causes the high temps) and you can choose to keep or replace the Intel TIM.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Yep, you remove the IHS, clean up the black glue (this is what causes the high temps) and you can choose to keep or replace the Intel TIM.


Ooooohh.... I was thinking the stock paste was the culprit. Good to know.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> lol that chip will last way beyond 6 + years at those volts....my friends still has a 3770k 5ghz delid @ 1.54v 24/7 for almost a year now without a single hiccup...most likely the chip will start to show degration around 3-5 yeasrs time and will require tiny bump if any....and will last well beyond point of upgrade...
> 
> running my 4770k now at 4.9ghz 1.51v 24/7 inpout voltage 2.0 custom loop max temp with clu 73c:thumb:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its been said by intel ina couple of vids to stay within 10% of the chips max...well the max is prly around 1.5v so you get the idea


so your Haswell is at 1.5v without issue? Is that 1.5v under load?

I been scared to go above 1.45v.

Currently my 4670k sits at 4.7 with 1.375v (1.408 under load) for my 24/7. I have booted 5.0 but I never stressed it cause it took 1.48v. My temps are under 83c when running ibt.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> so your Haswell is at 1.5v without issue? Is that 1.5v under load?
> 
> I been scared to go above 1.45v.
> 
> Currently my 4670k sits at 4.7 with 1.375v (1.408 under load) for my 24/7. I have booted 5.0 but I never stressed it cause it took 1.48v. My temps are under 83c when running ibt.


For me its no problem...as I live near several places to buy cpu's if anything ever happens









also the intel tuning plan for 25$ lets you basically do whatever you want ha...

For some people running a high voltage overclock may make them feel like it might die or sometin which is understandable...

But if you can keep the temps reasonable under everyday load running a high vcore etc shouldn't hinder the chip to much...

keep in mind the tj max is 100c meaning basically you can run that chip up to or right below that numder and it should last for years++ at stock volts...so factor in the rest.









besides I didn't delid and build a custom loop to be ocd about lifespan etc haaa


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> For me its no problem...as I live near several places to buy cpu's if anything ever happens
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also the intel tuning plan for 25$ lets you basically do whatever you want ha...
> 
> For some people running a high voltage overclock may make them feel like it might die or sometin which is understandable...
> 
> But if you can keep the temps reasonable under everyday load running a high vcore etc shouldn't hinder the chip to much...
> 
> *keep in mind the tj max is 100c meaning basically you can run that chip up to or right below that numder and it should last for years++ at stock volts...so factor in the rest.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> besides I didn't delid and build a custom loop to be ocd about lifespan etc haaa


I kind of disagree there that 100C is for not long term longevity in terms of reliability it can handle that heat yes but not for to long as it will fatigue. I always say keep it below 85C and then you're perfect really.


----------



## Jugurnot

Just did a little research on the clu. Since it is conductive, is there anything it could possibly short on or around the die?

And does anyone know of any canadian retailers that sell the compound?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just did a little research on the clu. Since it is conductive, is there anything it could possibly short on or around the die?
> 
> And does anyone know of any canadian retailers that sell the compound?


4770K has the resistors on the pcb so cover them with nail polish to prevent a short but other than that your good


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just did a little research on the clu. Since it is conductive, is there anything it could possibly short on or around the die?
> 
> And does anyone know of any canadian retailers that sell the compound?


Yes it is conductive and should not touch any capacitors around the cpu but it is also very tacky and you could literally turn your cpu upside down and shake it after brushing it on and nothing would move. Basically if you painted it onto your ceiling properly (not a huge glob of it but a thin film like painting) it would never drip. I personally see no risk and no way it would get onto the capacitors from a proper application but some people like to cover the capacitors with regular TIM to reduce the risk of contact with clu.


----------



## Jugurnot

Thanks for the help!


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just did a little research on the clu. Since it is conductive, is there anything it could possibly short on or around the die?
> 
> And does anyone know of any canadian retailers that sell the compound?


Amazon.ca and Hookbag have it but they are both charging double at $35 (does not include shipping).

I'd also try buying from Amazon.com for between $12-$15. Some of these 3rd partners are willing to ship to Canada for cheap. That is one of my favorite tricks.

Also, another avenue would be to get it from FrozenCPU (next door to Ontario anyway), like I have, for $15 and paying the shipping and you'd still be way ahead.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> Amazon.ca and Hookbag have it but they are both charging double at $35 (does not include shipping).
> 
> I'd also try buying from Amazon.com for between $12-$15. Some of these 3rd partners are willing to ship to Canada for cheap. That is one of my favorite tricks.
> 
> Also, another avenue would be to get it from FrozenCPU (next door to Ontario anyway), like I have, for $15 and paying the shipping and you'd still be way ahead.


Yeah ive ordered from frozen before. Cheapest shipping but then there are customs charges on top of that.

I have arctic silver 5 on hand. Would this give me similar results? I take it the most important thing with delidding is getting rid of the black glue.


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Ooooohh.... I was thinking the stock paste was the culprit. Good to know.


It is both the gap caused by the excessive sealant and probably too much or thick thermal paste.
The thermal paste supposedly isn't that bad at all but the gap and resultant thick layer of it is the culprit.


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Yeah ive ordered from frozen before. Cheapest shipping but then there are customs charges on top of that.
> 
> I have arctic silver 5 on hand. Would this give me similar results? I take it the most important thing with delidding is getting rid of the black glue.


You can chose USPS and there should be no custom charges.

I've had an order over $300 with no custom charges. Shipping is like $7-$8 for that weight.

No AS5 would be no where near giving you CLU results. AS5 is outdated and really should not be used even on regular applications. Examples of what is best out there is things like Gelid, MX-4, Phobia, Prolimatech PK1 etc...

And with the AS5 there is that long curing time.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> You can chose USPS and there should be no custom charges.
> 
> I've had an order over $300 with no custom charges. Shipping is like $7-$8 for that weight.
> 
> No AS5 would be no where near giving you CLU results. AS5 is outdated and really should not be used even on regular applications. Examples of what is best out there is things like Gelid, MX-4, Phobia, Prolimatech PK1 etc...
> 
> And with the AS5 there is that long curing time.


Hmm im learning alot here. Can you describe this curing process? What happens to the paste over time and how does it effect temperatures?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Yeah ive ordered from frozen before. Cheapest shipping but then there are customs charges on top of that.
> 
> I have arctic silver 5 on hand. Would this give me similar results? I take it the most important thing with delidding is getting rid of the black glue.


AS5 will not give you the temps you are seeing others achieve here. You want to have a liquid metal on the die. I use CLU.


----------



## NASzi

hey gents i'm sure this has been discussed before in here but I have a simple question, I have a delidded 3770k, and a new motherboard on the way. I will be taking the 3770K out of my old board and placing it in my new board. Chip has been delidded for about 6-12 months. Should I replace the CLU?


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Hmm im learning alot here. Can you describe this curing process? What happens to the paste over time and how does it effect temperatures?


It takes about 200 hours to cure AS5. The other thermal pastes I described are non conductive and need no curing time. Also AS5 tends to dry out, while these others will stay wet.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> hey gents i'm sure this has been discussed before in here but I have a simple question, I have a delidded 3770k, and a new motherboard on the way. I will be taking the 3770K out of my old board and placing it in my new board. Chip has been delidded for about 6-12 months. Should I replace the CLU?


Some people checked their application after 8-12 months and some report dryness in places, however when they reheated the CLU (blowing soft hot air on it) it came back to liquid. Best to check, reheat the CLU, brush it back on the die and add a bit more if necessary.


----------



## MrStrat007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Yeah ive ordered from frozen before. Cheapest shipping but then there are customs charges on top of that.
> 
> I have arctic silver 5 on hand. Would this give me similar results? I take it the most important thing with delidding is getting rid of the black glue.


USPS has never charged me customs/shipping to Ontario from Frozencpu!


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Yeah ive ordered from frozen before. Cheapest shipping but then there are customs charges on top of that.
> 
> I have arctic silver 5 on hand. Would this give me similar results? I take it the most important thing with delidding is getting rid of the black glue.


Removing the black glue just reduces the space between the die and the IHS, so there is better heat transfer. The point of getting better TIM also helps to transfer heat more efficiently. I would suggest using CLU/CLP if you want the best results or at least one of the top-performing TIMs around (see Gunderman's recommendations a few posts up).

Before delidding, the fins from the stock Intel cooler would never heat up, but after delidding, the fins got easily hot, especially when overclocking. It's surprising to me since it finally acted more like my old 2550K, it always seemed unnatural for the heatsinks to never heat up for Ivy chips, despite the high load temps.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just 2 quick questions...
> 
> i5-3570k oc'd to 5.0ghz @ 1.36 vcore passes IBT on high setting. 87 degree max temp.
> 
> Currently cooled by a stock h220.
> 
> Is this worth delidding if all I really do is game? and...
> 
> How long on average do these chips last at 5.0ghz?


The frequency won't degrade them, only the heat and voltage. Delid would put you to pretty freezing temps and your voltage is really quite safe at your current temps but especially with 20c cut off


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hey guys quick inquiry should I find a good mousepad or keep my old 2 dolla one


Grab yourself something lovely like a puretrak talent, get/use good mouse sensor* and use 1:1 ~800dpi on 1920x1080 (1920/800 = 2.4 inches to cross screen on X axis, ~1-4 inches is good) for non-fps-engines and a med-low sens for fps (10-30cm/180)









*If you still have deathadder 3.5g, it's among the best. PM me if you want a few settings for the mouse to perform better, or to improve mouse accuracy etc

^dunno what you're using ATM but if it's a lot worse you'd thank me in a month or two
















Wow, that turned a bit ranty >.>


----------



## coelacanth

Thinking of delidding. I can't be happy with anything. I have to ruin everything.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Grab yourself something lovely like a puretrak talent, get/use good mouse sensor* and use 1:1 ~800dpi on 1920x1080 (1920/800 = 2.4 inches to cross screen on X axis, ~1-4 inches is good) for non-fps-engines and a med-low sens for fps (10-30cm/180)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *If you still have deathadder 3.5g, it's among the best. PM me if you want a few settings for the mouse to perform better, or to improve mouse accuracy etc
> 
> ^dunno what you're using ATM but if it's a lot worse you'd thank me in a month or two
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, that turned a bit ranty >.>


hmmmm I already have deathadder setup correctly had it for years







i'll look at the pad thanks


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> hmmmm I already have deathadder setup correctly had it for years
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i'll look at the pad thanks


The 3.5g requires very specific settings to work optimally. Unless you natively use 1800dpi, you need to select that and use on-the-fly sensitivity to adjust it downwards from that sensor mode, preferably using the hotkey so that you can hold a mouse button and scroll wheel up/down in 0.5 increments (5 sens = 50% multiplier, 10 sens = 100% - so 1800dpi and 5 sens would be called 900dpi as it travels ~900 pixels in 1 inch)

If you don't do that, some performance characteristics are sacrificed with the other DPI settings in driver. A lot of people don't know that, and also that 1000hz is weirdly unstable so it's often better to use 500hz









^Not really relevant for most people, but for many people, particularly lowering sense in FPS games, main problem is massive loss of max speed you can move the mouse without it stopping tracking


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *coelacanth*
> 
> Thinking of delidding. I can't be happy with anything. I have to ruin everything.


lol you wont ruin anything...deliding is the pursuit of performance!









take your time be gentle look at the guids its very easy and hard to actualy damage anything unless your sloppy and or drop the chip or sometin


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FractinJex*
> 
> lol you wont ruin anything...deliding is the pursuit of performance!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> take your time be gentle look at the guids its very easy and hard to actualy damage anything unless your sloppy and or drop the chip or sometin


i almost damaged my chip back in the only razor delidding method days, exactly a year back


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i almost damaged my chip back in the only razor delidding method days, exactly a year back


keyword is almost


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> keyword is almost


I did a test deliding on an already fried 3770K

Trust me, if it hadn't been broke before, it sure was afterward.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Just did a little research on the clu. Since it is conductive, is there anything it could possibly short on or around the die?
> 
> And does anyone know of any canadian retailers that sell the compound?


Just wanted to add, 3570K does not have anything around the die that could be shorted.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> keyword is almost


well i did scratch the pcb but the processor worked just fine like before with all cores all threads memory controller pci-e lanes no problem what so ever the scratch was so tiny however .... the the reduction in temps was worth it though, shaved 30c off of it under load !!


----------



## Legonut

2nd successful delid here, 4770k with vice method. Have not tested temps yet but it only took 5 whacks to get the ihs off, very easy and not nearly as scary as the razor method.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Just wanted to add, 3570K does not have anything around the die that could be shorted.


That is good to know. Thanks again gambi! Your rig continues to be an inspiration.







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Legonut*
> 
> 2nd successful delid here, 4770k with vice method. Have not tested temps yet but it only took 5 whacks to get the ihs off, very easy and not nearly as scary as the razor method.


Can you comment on the force of blow applied? What can it be related to? Hitting a finishing nail? Framing nail?

Im worried I will over compensate and send my chip flying across the shop hahaha. Just picturing it now


----------



## RickRockerr

Just waiting that someone invent's delidding machine


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Can you comment on the force of blow applied? What can it be related to? Hitting a finishing nail? Framing nail?
> 
> Im worried I will over compensate and send my chip flying across the shop hahaha. Just picturing it now


I wrapped a cloth around the vice and CPU, so there was no chance of anything flying around after the PCB coming off.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Just waiting that someone invent's delidding machine


You got me thinking....

Couldn't I just apply even and steady force against the pcb to push it off, instead of using blows?

For example if I made a wood jig that fits in a vice, on one side it presses the IHS, and the other presses the PCB, and I just tighten the vice to seperate the two? I wish I had a 'practice' chip
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I wrapped a cloth around the vice and CPU, so there was no chance of anything flying around after the PCB coming off.


Thanks for the tip!


----------



## LagunaX

That is the new vice method.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> That is the new vice method.


Can you link this method to me?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Just waiting that someone invent's delidding machine


I have been thinkign about a way to make a simple item to do this for 25 bucks or so


----------



## GaMbi2004

IHS resting on one side of the vice, PCB resting on the other.. in this video, a heat gun is used to soften up the "glue"
It is a fairly new method of delidding, but seams to work for those who tried it.

I used the hammer method, holding the piece of wood AND the chip with one hand, hammer with the other.
So little to no risk of making the chip fly (also used a pillow to catch the chip IF it should end up flying)


----------



## GlowingBurrito

Well it is done! Just cleaning up the pcb and still waiting for the mail for my CLU. All in all it was a super easy process lol


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IHS resting on one side of the vice, PCB resting on the other.. in this video, a heat gun is used to soften up the "glue"
> It is a fairly new method of delidding, but seams to work for those who tried it.


Yup that is what I am going to do. Just need some CLU.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IHS resting on one side of the vice, PCB resting on the other.. in this video, a heat gun is used to soften up the "glue"
> It is a fairly new method of delidding, but seams to work for those who tried it.
> 
> I used the hammer method, holding the piece of wood AND the chip with one hand, hammer with the other.
> So little to no risk of making the chip fly (also used a pillow to catch the chip IF it should end up flying)


I have used Hammer + vice and razor method but that vice + hair dryer seems fast and easy


----------



## GlowingBurrito

Got everything back together.

OCN name: GlowingBurrito
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: n/a (haven't tried pushing higher)
OC after delid: 4.5ghz before and after
Temp drops: ~15c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/peap8t

Edit: Post with pic http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24340#post_21915671


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GlowingBurrito*
> 
> Got everything back together.
> 
> OCN name: GlowingBurrito
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: n/a (haven't tried pushing higher)
> OC after delid: 4.5ghz before and after
> Temp drops: ~15c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/peap8t
> 
> Edit: Post with pic http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24340#post_21915671


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!

Welcome to OCN Enjoy your stay


----------



## cestessr

After delidding has anybody tried milling the ihs down to about 1/2 it`s thickness lapping both sides and remounting w/o clamp with coolabatorys tim on both.
I now have direct die mount an have had some problems with it not seating well my friend owns a shop so we cut the ihs d
own I lapped it and have not done my waterblock yet just wanted to know if anyone has tried. my w/b is a EKWB Supermacy with Naked IB mounting.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cestessr*
> 
> After delidding has anybody tried milling the ihs down to about 1/2 it`s thickness lapping both sides and remounting w/o clamp with coolabatorys tim on both.
> I now have direct die mount an have had some problems with it not seating well my friend owns a shop so we cut the ihs d
> own I lapped it and have not done my waterblock yet just wanted to know if anyone has tried. my w/b is a EKWB Supermacy with Naked IB mounting.


I had lapped 3570k with CLP on die and ihs + EK supremacy. Didn't notice difference vs direct die.


----------



## cestessr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I
> had lapped 3570k with CLP on die and ihs + EK supremacy. Didn't notice difference vs direct die.


I`m not trying to make it run any cooler than direct die but what you givs me hope that it will work as good as direct die contact. I am shooting for more even pressure on entire CPU with just as good cooling results.Thanks


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cestessr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I
> had lapped 3570k with CLP on die and ihs + EK supremacy. Didn't notice difference vs direct die.
> 
> 
> 
> I`m not trying to make it run any cooler than direct die but what you givs me hope that it will work as good as direct die contact. I am shooting for more even pressure on entire CPU with just as good cooling results.Thanks
Click to expand...

I would honestly play with the mount some more. The naked kit has worked flawless for me for quite a while now, and has allowed me to get to a point that voltage is the thing holding my clocks back as opposed to temperatures.

What exactly is the issue that you are experiencing with the naked kit? Maybe we could help troubleshoot it for you. There are plenty of us here with the exact kit that post regularly.


----------



## invincible20xx

hey guys i got un-even core temps with 10c difference between hottest and coolest core so i wanted to re-seat my cpu should i clean old clu or just add a little bit more to the existing amount ? clu is very expensive to get here and i would rather not waste it


----------



## deepor

You can still brush it as if it's new after you disassemble everything. Just do that and make sure it looks good before putting everything back together. I guess only add some CLU to what's already there if you think it needs that.

You might want to try to warm everything up by doing something on the PC before shutting it off and working on it. Someone mentioned hardened CLU spots are only there if things are cold, so perhaps only when you start working on the PC after it was off all night in a cold room or something.

Also, don't expect too much about those 10C temperature differences. It's normal that the first and last cores are colder than the two in the middle in a stress test because the two cores in the middle have hot neighbors on both sides instead of just one side.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You can still brush it as if it's new after you disassemble everything. Just do that and make sure it looks good before putting everything back together. I guess only add some CLU to what's already there if you think it needs that.
> 
> You might want to try to warm everything up by doing something on the PC before shutting it off and working on it. Someone mentioned hardened CLU spots are only there if things are cold, so perhaps only when you start working on the PC after it was off all night in a cold room or something.
> 
> Also, don't expect too much about those 10C temperature differences. It's normal that the first and last cores are colder than the two in the middle in a stress test because the two cores in the middle have hot neighbors on both sides instead of just one side.


i had lower temp difference between cores before ... 4 ~ 5c only and i have screenshots that shows this from old overclocking tests


----------



## invincible20xx

ok i just did a test run before taking pc apart and i was surprised the temp difference is not as big ...



what do you guys think ? should i not bother reseating my cpu ? this is the results after 10 min stress small ftt 4.6 ghz @ 1.35v


----------



## cestessr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I would honestly play with the mount some more. The naked kit has worked flawless for me for quite a while now, and has allowed me to get to a point that voltage is the thing holding my clocks back as opposed to temperatures.
> 
> What exactly is the issue that you are experiencing with the naked kit? Maybe we could help troubleshoot it for you. There are plenty of us here with the exact kit that post regularly.


After insdtalling CPU memory fails so I reseated still nogood reseated again but wiggled Waterblock before it was tight and it posted and worked I also removed nylon washers on mount . After cutting down and lapping IHS and waterblock which was very flat to begin with yea EKWB still not using clamp because IHS machining it was to low everthing worked fine but as expected temps went up a little. IBT Very High passed @5.0 Ghz @ 90c before about 85c


----------



## ClaggyPants

I moved to the naked ivy kit at the weekend and my temps have shot up from the high 50s at full load to the low 80s. It's like I've gone back to before I was de-lidded. Using gelid extreme on the die.


----------



## Macnb

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> I did a test deliding on an already fried 3770K
> 
> Trust me, if it hadn't been broke before, it sure was afterward.


Hey Wihglah, sorry to hear about your fried 3770K.
How about giving life to another 3770K as I have damaged the lid of my 3770K ?








My chip works fine but the Lid has dents (due to the vice) and I am sure it's not making good contact with the cooler.
If you are not using the lid, I'll take it off your hands with adequate compensation


----------



## cestessr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> ok i just did a test run before taking pc apart and i was surprised the temp difference is not as big ...
> 
> 
> 
> what do you guys think ? should i not bother reseating my cpu ? this is the results after 10 min stress small ftt 4.6 ghz @ 1.35v


I have close to 8 degrees diff from1 to 4 1,2,3 are all close yet 4 has always been hottest. Right now 1=31 2=32 3=34 4=38 I think it`s random and depends on ind cores


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ClaggyPants*
> 
> I moved to the naked ivy kit at the weekend and my temps have shot up from the high 50s at full load to the low 80s. It's like I've gone back to before I was de-lidded. Using gelid extreme on the die.


The block probably isn't sitting perfectly flat, I like direct die and all but it gets annoying sometimes whats all in your loop as well?


----------



## Wihglah

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Macnb*
> 
> Hey Wihglah, sorry to hear about your fried 3770K.
> How about giving life to another 3770K as I have damaged the lid of my 3770K ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My chip works fine but the Lid has dents (due to the vice) and I am sure it's not making good contact with the cooler.
> If you are not using the lid, I'll take it off your hands with adequate compensation


It's yours if you cover postage.

Shoot me a PM with your address.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> It's yours if you cover postage.
> 
> Shoot me a PM with your address.


generous man lol









REP+


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> It's yours if you cover postage.
> 
> Shoot me a PM with your address.


+rep for not being stingy.


----------



## Macnb

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> It's yours if you cover postage.
> 
> Shoot me a PM with your address.


Very generous. Thx








PM sent.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> ok i just did a test run before taking pc apart and i was surprised the temp difference is not as big ...
> 
> 
> 
> what do you guys think ? should i not bother reseating my cpu ? this is the results after 10 min stress small ftt 4.6 ghz @ 1.35v


guys please opinions to reseat or not to reseat ?! note my h100i fans are on the lowest possible RPM 1000 only because i like my rig to be as quit as possible ...


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> guys please opinions to reseat or not to reseat ?! note my h100i fans are on the lowest possible RPM 1000 only because i like my rig to be as quit as possible ...


I wouldn't, my cores have differences of 8 degrees sometimes.

Also, at idle 1 core will be running hotter, then at 100% a different core will be running hotter. I think its just in the chip and there is nothing to do about it.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> I wouldn't, my cores have differences of 8 degrees sometimes.
> 
> Also, at idle 1 core will be running hotter, then at 100% a different core will be running hotter. I think its just in the chip and there is nothing to do about it.


temps are good over all for my clock , voltage and cooling ?!


----------



## ClaggyPants

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The block probably isn't sitting perfectly flat, I like direct die and all but it gets annoying sometimes whats all in your loop as well?


That would tie in with whats happened this weekend. Had a little bit of action going on with the supremacy block. CLU was fused with the block from when I first de-lidded and no matter what I did would get it off so I had to use wet & dry to get it off. The block still has the convex profile to it but its probably not sitting right now. Core 1 runs 10c cooler than the other 3 cores. A little bit of research today says I probably shouldn't have lapped it. Hey ho, now I get to buy a new block and transplant the old one into my media machine.

The loop currently consists of ddc 18w ultra with ek x-res acetal top, supremacy block and ek block on the 780 plus 240mm black ice GT Stealth in the roof and an alphacool 360 xt45 in front. And I love it.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> temps are good over all for my clock , voltage and cooling ?!


Looks pretty decent to me, but im no expert. Voltage is higher than im what used to seeing on my 3570k for similar speeds, but your temps are about what I get at 1.365v with an h220


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Looks pretty decent to me, but im no expert. Voltage is higher than im what used to seeing on my 3570k for similar speeds, but your temps are about what I get at 1.365v with an h220


your chip is delidded ?


----------



## Jugurnot

No its not

Edit: I havent run prime at that speed yet, just ibt. But I also had really cool ambient temps. For reference my chip at 4.5ghz 1.14vcore after 12 hours on prime maxed 65ish. But I think I have an above average performing chip
(This was on a thermaltake 2.0 performer 120mm aio)


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> No its not
> 
> Edit: I havent run prime at that speed yet, just ibt. But I also had really cool ambient temps. For reference my chip at 4.5ghz 1.14vcore after 12 hours on prime maxed 65ish. But I think I have an above average performing chip
> (This was on a thermaltake 2.0 performer 120mm aio)


you can't use 1.35v on a non delid chip without it shooting up in the 90's .... i know because i have tried


----------



## Jugurnot

Well this is a 3570k. Yours is a 3770k. Not sure if there are differences between the two that account for different temps. But I do know not all chips are built exactly the same and there will slight diferences.

Just waiting for this run to finish, ill post some proof.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> you can't use 1.35v on a non delid chip without it shooting up in the 90's .... i know because i have tried


3570K is about 10°-15°c cooler than a chip with HT (3770k)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Well this is a 3570k. Yours is a 3770k. Not sure if there are differences between the two that account for different temps. But I do know not all chips are built exactly the same and there will slight diferences.
> 
> Just waiting for this run to finish, ill post some proof.


delid that chip and you''ll have temps like this


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 3570K is about 10°-15°c cooler than a chip with HT (3770k)
> delid that chip and you''ll have temps like this


Yes please









Just gotta pick me up some clu!


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> 3570K is about 10°-15°c cooler than a chip with HT (3770k)
> delid that chip and you''ll have temps like this


i had a 3570k before and it was the same temps as the 3770k


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i had a 3570k before and it was the same temps as the 3770k


I have got a feeling you don't have the coolest 3770k around.


----------



## Valgaur

Hey guys if I didn't reply to anybody or anything let me know been insanely busy today and I'm going to go pass out now tomorrow is my day


----------



## MaKe OuT

got it. Should I delid now or check the oc on it first?


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> got it. Should I delid now or check the oc on it first?


I think its always good practice to do before and after tests, that way you always have numbers to compare with. But thats just me


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i had a 3570k before and it was the same temps as the 3770k


My 3570K only hit 90C+ around 1.45V and that was before the delid.

After delidding, I normally see 80~90C when I'm going past 1.5V.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> got it. Should I delid now or check the oc on it first?


Always test first, make sure it's even worth it


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Always test first, make sure it's even worth it


will do. thanks. Is there a defined "worth it" threshold?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> will do. thanks. Is there a defined "worth it" threshold?


if it is a complete dud. Like cannot exceed 4.3ghz below 1.4v. Deliding will most likley not help.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> will do. thanks. Is there a defined "worth it" threshold?


Also if your temps are acceptable. Say 60~70C for around 1.3V.

I was getting those temps before my delid, so I didn't really need to delid, but it was just more for the experience. Despite my temps dropping 7~15C, my voltage limits were still the same, so the only benefit I got from delidding was being able to push my chip past 1.55V where it starts to hit 90C+. I'm still happy with the result and I haven't even used CLU/CLP yet.

By voltage limits, I mean the lowest voltage that will keep that OC stable for my chip. These are the voltage limits I found for my chip, it seems to follow a voltage curve when going to the next 100MHz. I haven't tried for 4.8 and 4.9GHz yet, but I plan to do it when I have the time this coming Spring Break.









4.5GHz ~1.15V
4.6GHz ~1.2V
4.7GHz ~1.264V
5.0GHz ~1.45V+


----------



## ClaggyPants

Got my new block yesterday and temps have come back to acceptable levels but core 0 reading a full 10c cooler than 1 and 2. This is running the chip naked and it's driving me slightly nuts. everything seems to run fine and stable but I'm just a little worried at such a large difference between the cores. When I ran it with the ihs still on the temps were different in that core 1 ran a couple of degrees hotter than the rest with 0 being the coolest but only by a couple if degrees.
Should I be worried?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Also if your temps are acceptable. Say 60~70C for around 1.3V.


By warned, if you 100% load the CPU with one load, you might get 55c. If you 100% load it with another, you might get 95c. The gap is that big with haswell and the worst case scenario heat tests - basically nobody uses them now. For temp checks i would suggest x264 or prime custom fft 1344-1344 with >90% of max RAM - though be sure to manually set your vcore, preferably set uncore manual @33/1.15 while testing too, use VRIN LLC and up VRIN if neccesary


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> set uncore manual @33/1.15 while testing too, use VRIN LLC and up VRIN if neccesary


setting uncore to below stock multi helps with getting a higher oc stability?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> setting uncore to below stock multi helps with getting a higher oc stability?


No, it just rules out the unpredictable behavior caused by automatic setting overclocking it when you raise core multiplier with many boards and automatically raising ring/cache/uncore volts at the same time


----------



## Kokin

I'm completely out of the loop with Haswell, but thank you for pointing that out.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> I'm completely out of the loop with Haswell, but thank you for pointing that out.


np, it's just that there are some tests which hit 100c by about 1.25v on the best air coolers and clc's. 250gflops is really really hard on the power draw and blows everything up; any actual use of avx2 is either so much faster on haswell than other cpu's to the point where you can run at 1.0vcore and laugh at winning easily (due to 100% optimized avx2 instructions) or is a load like x264, where avx2 adds ~5% performance, yet does not really notably impact thermals because they are only a small fraction of cpu time


----------



## Aemonn

Hello all. I finally decided to take the leap. Loving the temp drop... still in the process of running everything and drooling over my temp readings!









Weapon of choice:


Freshly Delidded



All cleaned up!


Ready to get back to work.


----------



## MaKe OuT

is it worth the time to lap the top of ihs for better interface with cooler block?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> is it worth the time to lap the top of ihs for better interface with cooler block?


You will loose the ability to send it in for warranty, and the temp gain is minimal at best.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> is it worth the time to lap the top of ihs for better interface with cooler block?


You really need to check the picture the thermal paste makes on the cooler's base. If it's already looking perfect, you might make it worse with lapping. To counteract the IHS not being totally flat, there are a lot of coolers that are using an intentionally slightly convex shaped base instead of a flat base (Google Image Search finds examples from Prolimatech and Thermalright if you are interested). On your Corsair H110, I think this is also happening, the middle of the base might be the slightest bit raised and those eight screws at the edge pull the copper plate into a slightly convex shape.


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You will loose the ability to send it in for warranty, and the temp gain is minimal at best.


As if de-lidding doesn't void warranty...








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You will loose the ability to send it in for warranty, and the temp gain is minimal at best.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You really need to check the picture the thermal paste makes on the cooler's base. If it's already looking perfect, you might make it worse with lapping. To counteract the IHS not being totally flat, there are a lot of coolers that are using an intentionally slightly convex shaped base instead of a flat base (Google Image Search finds examples from Prolimatech and Thermalright if you are interested). On your Corsair H110, I think this is also happening, the middle of the base might be the slightest bit raised and those eight screws at the edge pull the copper plate into a slightly convex shape.


This is a good response, thanks.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You will loose the ability to send it in for warranty, and the temp gain is minimal at best.
> 
> 
> 
> As if de-lidding doesn't void warranty...
Click to expand...

There have been a couple people that have sent in delidded chips, some still loose, some glued back. I lapped my IHS, and my temperature gain was within margin of error.








at someone else


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> As if de-lidding doesn't void warranty...


There is a change to get damaged chip through warranty even if it's delidded.


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> at someone else


brb still choosing to rolleye at your response. thanks.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> at someone else
> 
> 
> 
> brb still choosing to rolleye at your response. thanks.
Click to expand...


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> As if de-lidding doesn't void warranty...


If you damage your CPU _while delidding_, then obviously the warranty is void.

But if your CPU has another issue, that is unrelated to removing the IHS, then Intel will accept it for return provided the markings on the IHS are legible.

So, do delid, don't lap.


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> If you damage your CPU _while delidding_, then obviously the warranty is void.
> 
> But if your CPU has another issue, that is unrelated to removing the IHS, then Intel will accept it for return provided the markings on the IHS are legible.
> 
> So, do delid, don't lap.


thanks.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You will loose the ability to send it in for warranty, and the temp gain is minimal at best.


talk to Lilchronic he did a warrenty exchange after delided.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You will loose the ability to send it in for warranty, and the temp gain is minimal at best.
> 
> 
> 
> talk to Lilchronic he did a warrenty exchange after delided.
Click to expand...

he did not lap his IHS.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> he did not lap his IHS.


correct do not lap the ihs , warrenty goes out the window and the temp drops are minimal 1-2c at best.

all you need to do is glue the ihs back on and put it in that plastic cap to make sure you get it lined up so it looks like it's never even been removed


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> If you damage your CPU _while delidding_, then obviously the warranty is void.
> 
> But if your CPU has another issue, that is unrelated to removing the IHS, then Intel will accept it for return provided the markings on the IHS are legible.
> 
> So, do delid, don't lap.


so the need for return is because the chip fails or because its overclock potential does not satisfy?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> so the need for return is because the chip fails or because its overclock potential does not satisfy?


you wont get a return for a chip that doesnt OC well







I would have send my chip for replacement a loooong time ago if they accepted that








If you put a blade to the chip and kill it that way, warranty is gone, if you do a clean delid with no damage and the chip dies for what ever reason AFTER the delidding, you stand a chance of getting a return under warranty.


----------



## Goone

Question for the pro, I just dellided my cpu save around 15 degree but my temp is around 10-12 degrees different from core 1 and core 4
1 is hotter, I thought after dellid your ihs put equal thermal paste on the core itself temp should be all in line, I don't want to lap the ihs but will try to use another ihs cap from some old cpu i had around


----------



## GaMbi2004

more info plz








is the 10-12 degrees evenly spread? or just one of the cores acting up?
is it same difference when it idles and when putting load on it?
What CPU? what cooler? what thermal paste?


----------



## Goone

Core 1, 2, 3 minimal diffrences around 3-4 degrees only Core 4 is way less all this happen when load running prime 95, OCCT
CPU is 4770k motherboard asus hero, cooler noctua NH D14 paste Gelid Solutions GC-Extreme
Thanks for response


----------



## lilchronic

did you put clp/clu on the bottom of the ihs as well?


----------



## Goone

I don't believe so only on the core itself, hum?


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> did you put clp/clu on the bottom of the ihs as well?


It doesn't seem like he's using CLP/CLU.

I'm not using either, I'm just using a regular paste and I'm encountering the same thing (this happened before delid though).


----------



## Goone

What is CLP/CLU


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Goone*
> 
> What is CLP/CLU


it is the absolute best TIM for under the IHS
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-pro/


----------



## chronicfx

Tried intel burn test for the first time in about 6 months and two cores logged 105.. I am going to retim with liquid ultra tonight or this weekend. Anyone know if arcticlean will remove residue from an indigo xtreme pad which i am using between the waterblock and ihs? I have liquid pro in the die but i have some prior experience taking that off.

Edit: i dont think the tim went bad, i suspect it is because have pulled the hoses off the waterblock about a dozen times changing tubing configs while it was mounted.


----------



## Wirerat

So what type of paste can be used if someone wants to secure the lid back on?

I realize its not necessary. My friend delided his and wants to resecure it permanently. I dnt know what paste/glue to suggest. He wants it glued on so it doesnt slide when securing it to mobo.


----------



## cdnGhost

Really no need, but you can use an epoxy that should do the trick for ya....


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Really no need, but you can use an epoxy that should do the trick for ya....


I told him not need..

So two part epoxy?


----------



## cdnGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I told him not need..
> 
> So two part epoxy?


Yeah just double check what it can and cant be used on but I don't see why not...
But why delid then reseal? what if the time he applied ends up giving bad temps....

just my 2 cents but talk him out of it.... Deliding the first time for me was a heart pounding experience...
wouldn't have to want to do it all over again just because I messed up my thermal paste...








besides once its clamped down your good to go...


----------



## TG_bigboss

Hey guys so I made the switch to Intel and I'm in the process of trying to delid using a vice i pick up from harbor freight for 13 bucks. I'm using a wood shim and a hammer because I don't have a block of wood but no luck. The head spreader is really stuck on there! I'm afraid of hammering too hard a bending it. Any help?


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TG_bigboss*
> 
> Hey guys so I made the switch to Intel and I'm in the process of trying to delid using a vice i pick up from harbor freight for 13 bucks. I'm using a wood shim and a hammer because I don't have a block of wood but no luck. The head spreader is really stuck on there! I'm afraid of hammering too hard a bending it. Any help?


Answered via your thread.


----------



## TG_bigboss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Answered via your thread.


Thanks for you help! Got it off using vice/razor blade method. Used the Razor blade to help separate it and then the vice did the rest of the work. :thumbs: Spent 45mins cleaning the glue....god. So much glue!!!!
I cleaned it really well and there is no residue left at all!

Time to disassemble the old rig, flush the loop, and install the new stuff







But first to harbor freight for massive sale they having! haha.


----------



## Valgaur

That info was on this threads OP btw <.< feel like people are ignoring the OP


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Really no need, but you can use an epoxy that should do the trick for ya....
> 
> 
> 
> I told him not need..
> 
> So two part epoxy?
Click to expand...

Better don't use epoxy! You won't ever get it off again, I guess.

There's silicone glue that can take high temperatures. You should be able to get something like this in shops selling stuff for work on cars and other type of machinery or a fireplace or whatnot.

This product says up to 230 C (450 F), so would be good, I'd guess: http://www.amazon.com/Permatex-81158-Silicone-Adhesive-Sealant/dp/B000AL6WLA/

Buy something that's black and it will look just like Intel's original glue.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That info was on this threads OP btw <.< feel like people are ignoring the OP


Not sure what you're talking about in particular, but people rarely read OP's, even on OCN from what i've seen


----------



## lilchronic

i use 3M black super weatherstrip adhesive to glue IHS back on
4 little daps in each corner will do


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> i use 3M black super weatherstrip adhesive to glue IHS back on
> 4 little daps in each corner will do


thanks


----------



## Propanelgen

Isn't gluing the IHS back onto the PCB defeating the purpose?
The point is to bring the IHS closer to the die, so if you delid, remove epoxy residue, then add new glue, you are back at the start?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Propanelgen*
> 
> Isn't gluing the IHS back onto the PCB defeating the purpose?
> The point is to bring the IHS closer to the die, so if you delid, remove epoxy residue, then add new glue, you are back at the start?


they use way to much glue if you olny put a little it's no problem


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> thanks


I use Loctite Black Max 380, it's a very thin glue, and black that matches the color of the intel OEM stuff, but it's VERY thin stuff, so it doesn't have the issue the stock junk does!!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I use Loctite Black Max 380, it's a very thin glue, and black that matches the color of the intel OEM stuff, but it's VERY thin stuff, so it doesn't have the issue the stock junk does!!
Click to expand...

And if anybody is worried about the extra height from the glue...lap the underside of the lip before the glue goes back on to make up the difference


----------



## Ovrclck

Curious, how long is clu good for? I've read that some peeps had it on for 8 months and it's still good. I'm about to reinstall my block and was wondering if it's worth going through the hassle again. My 4770k has been delidded for about 7 months.

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk


----------



## Forceman

CLU shouldn't harden, it's CLP that sometimes has that issue. I wouldn't mess with it unless your temps are a problem.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> Curious, how long is clu good for? I've read that some peeps had it on for 8 months and it's still good. I'm about to reinstall my block and was wondering if it's worth going through the hassle again. My 4770k has been delidded for about 7 months.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk


I just redid my last week after 6 months and it was still as wet as the day I put it on.


----------



## maynard14

mime i use clp, its been 9 months no, still the same temp as before







.. but im curios if i remove it i wolud like to know if the clp will keep the ishs and die intact?


----------



## Supacasey

Just started a friend's computer that's running a 4770k I delidded, currently running 29c at idle (havent installed all the stressing stuff yet) and a VID of 0.72v, are we looking at a winner?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> Just started a friend's computer that's running a 4770k I delidded, currently running 29c at idle (havent installed all the stressing stuff yet) and a VID of 0.72v, are we looking at a winner?


light it up and find out!


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> CLU shouldn't harden, it's CLP that sometimes has that issue. I wouldn't mess with it unless your temps are a problem.


Exactly what I wanted to hear. Thanks
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I just redid my last week after 6 months and it was still as wet as the day I put it on.


Awesome, thanks!


----------



## acanom

Hi there,

anyone tried the hair dryer method with success? Or ist vice and hammer still the better way to go?

And can sombody tell me, if the CLU should be applied to both the die and the inside of the ihs or is only on the die enough?

Thank you!


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *acanom*
> 
> Hi there,
> 
> anyone tried the hair dryer method with success? Or ist vice and hammer still the better way to go?
> 
> And can sombody tell me, if the CLU should be applied to both the die and the inside of the ihs or is only on the die enough?
> 
> Thank you!


Some people have delidded with hair dryer combined with hammer and vice. You can get better contact by putting CLU on die and inside of the IHS.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Supacasey*
> 
> Just started a friend's computer that's running a 4770k I delidded, currently running 29c at idle (havent installed all the stressing stuff yet) and a VID of 0.72v, are we looking at a winner?


Don't check VID, check Vcore. Cpu-z 1.64.0 (newer is broken on many boards) and hwinfo64 are good but make sure to check vcore not vid, especially for load voltage

29c is hotter than me idle, but two things: Firstly, it's >heavily< dependant on room temperatures etc.. secondly, you're at ~0.72v idle which means you're idling, but not using c6/c7 state. You probably have integrated graphics on too - Manually enabling those idle states as well as disabling iGPU if you're not using it will cut some watts and degrees.

Both of those things you said are basically not indicative at all of CPU quality - everyone has them. If you want to check CPU quality and do basic stability testing, i would highly reccomend:

Use all voltages Manual/Override, not adaptive or offset.

Manual 33x for Uncore/ring/cache, not default. Use 1.15v for it - you can overclock it after you have your max stable core overclock and everything works fine. If you leave this at default, on many motherboards it turbo's and uses for example ~40x with 1.25v if you have overclocked your core multiplier. This adds variables and can be confusing or worse, cause instability if something weird happens with it, and you don't want to deal with that until you're at 45 or 47x whatever core and you want to overclock uncore after. 47x/40x is better than 46x/46x in most applications, too - it's really a secondary concern, unless you have some niche where it is important - even so, you'd probably still want to overclock this way.

Set 1.8vrin
set VRIN llc max to stabilize that ~1.8
set 1.23vcore (IVR increases this to ~1.25v under load)
set core multiplier to etc.. 42, 44, download this - http://download1346.mediafire.com/pf1y1esf6qhg/2laifu8xqi6vz2g/x264+Stability+Test.7z

^With those voltages, you can change only the core multiplier. Your CPU might be stable at anything from ~41x-~48x core, most likely 43 or 44. This is a solid profile where basically nothing can go wrong and you can narrow down on what works with a little testing, and then work from there. If it doesn't work, don't change any voltages - just lower the core multi til it does, then work up after everything is verified stable and working, nice and slowly









I mostly do/recommend this because there's some weird stuff with Haswell. Throwing way too much vcore can make you unstable, for example. Changing multiple variables with Uncore, Core and IMC can all make you unstable, they all throw the same BSOD codes and it's quite confusing - as it is now, the best OC practice is to narrow things down so that the only ways you can be unstable are vcore and vrin, then play with them so that you can guess constructively what is causing you to bluescreen, as opposed to randomly changing stuff and hoping for the best~

If any issues/questions, the haswell overclocking thread with statistics here on OCN has lots of info and people to help with troubleshooting. This turned far more ranty than i intended









As a final note, the goal of x264 isn't to crash you as hard/fast as possible. It also won't give you anywhere near absolute worst case synthetic tests in terms of temperatures - it should be good enough for you to make an OC that never shows any signs of instability for whatever criteria of work/gameplay that you want, however


----------



## rwpritchett

Please add me to the club. I wasn't really looking for more OC headroom... I just wanted to quiet things down. Running at stock, my desktop gets rather noisy when I encode video (hits the CPU really hard). For practice, I first performed a delid on my HTPC Celeron CPU, since I would like it to run cooler too in order to keep fan noise down. Since it went smoothly, I went ahead and knocked the lid off my i7-4770k. Details for both below.


Spoiler: Haswell Celeron G1820 Delid



*I think I may be the first person in the world to delid this chip. OCN exclusive LOL.*

Here it is after smacking it with a hammer:


One peculiar point of interest with the Haswell Celeron, there are actually some delicate points *under the IHS adhesive* that aren't there on the i5 and i7 Haswells. I think the vice-and-hammer method is the only safe way to delid one of these chips. I don't know if the Pentium or i3 chips have this too:





Anyway, after applying CLU to the underside and using RTV silicon to put it all back together, everything is working fine. I didn't take a screenshot of Realtemp before the delid, so you'll just have to take my word for it that the hottest core would hit 53°C running Prime95 with large FFT. Here it is after while running Prime95 large FFT (stock cooler):



It didn't even break *40°C*! HA!!





Spoiler: Haswell Core i7-4770k Delid



There's hundreds of pictures of 4770k delids so I'll just throw mine up without narration:







*Prime95 Before:*


*Prime95 After:*




OCN name: rwpritchett
CPU: Celeron G1820 & i7-4770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
Mhz gained: 300MHz
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: ~15°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/n0t6z5


----------



## Lionheart1980

http://www.overclock.net/t/1474715/build-log-genesis-tron-my-1st-build-log/0_20

First ever build log.. delidded ivy cpu as well


----------



## jsx821

I completed my first build last week. And I just finished my first delid tonight, and the overall process went smooth.I used the vice/hammer/wood method and used AS5. Took about 3hits and it popped off. Yup- returning the vice to Home Depot tomorrow







.... I wasn't really going to delid my cpu, but sadly I bought a below average chip to overclock with.

*I5-4670K Batch #:* 3339B838 (purchased at Micro Center about 2-3weeks ago)
*Mobo:* Asus Z87-A
*PSU:* Corsair CX600M
*Ram:* 2x4Gb Corsair Vengeance 1600mhz (9-9-9-24)
*Stock Idle Temp via Hyper 212 Evo and AS5:* 27C-33C
*Ambient Temps:* Not sure I live near the coast its about 13-20c outside

*Test 1 (AS5 Core + IHS)*
Core Ratio Multiplier: 40
Cache "Ring" Ratio Multiplier: 38
Core Voltage: 1.180
Core Voltage Mode: Manual
Cache Voltage: Auto (Adaptive)
Core Voltage Mode: Auto (Adaptive)
Idle Temp: 36C-42C
Max Core Temp: 79C
Max Temps: 79C, 78C, 78C, 74C
Stability Test: Prime95 blend test for 10hours 17mins.

*Test 2 (AS5 Core + IHS)*
Core Ratio Multiplier: 40
Cache "Ring" Ratio Multiplier: 38
Core Voltage: 1.165v
Core Voltage Mode: Manual
Cache Voltage: Auto (Adaptive)
Core Voltage Mode: Auto (Adaptive)
Idle Temp: 36C-42C
Max Core Temp: 78C
Max Temps: 78C, 77C, 76C, 73C
Stability Test: Prime95 blend test for 1hour 20mins.

*Test 3 (after delid used Test 1 Configuration) (AS5 Core + IHS)*
Core Ratio Multiplier: 40
Cache "Ring" Ratio Multiplier: 38
Core Voltage: 1.180
Core Voltage Mode: Manual
Cache Voltage: Auto (Adaptive)
Core Voltage Mode: Auto (Adaptive)
Idle Temp: 36C-42C
Max Core Temp: 72C
Max Temps: 68C, 69C, 72C, 71C
Stability Test: Prime95 blend test for 1hr.. currently running and going to leave it on overnight.

I did my best to remove the black glue off the IHS but didn't remove all of it. Not sure if that is the problem. I might use a hairdryer to melt/remove most of it off this upcoming weekend. I carefully used a flat screwdriver to apply the AS5 (did it about 4x) and used it to 'paste' a thin layer. It looks like I'm only going to see about ~5C-7C difference on max core temp. I was hoping for at least double.. My Idle temps before delidding and after delidding seems to remain the same.

I guess the upside is that if I lower the voltage like I did in Test 2, my max temp will be around 70C or maybe even less. I also like to mention that I have 2noctua push/pull fans (which I regret purchasing) on my Hyper 212 EVO, 1 noctua exhaust fan, and 2 corsair intake fans. Oh well- I guess my goal of a 4.2oc with less than 1.2v/70C seems to be just a dream.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Question about Liquid pro... I just ordered some, and will be delidding when it gets here.. I am going over to the Liquid Pro thread as well, but I am curious with the Nickel Plated EK block, if I should put the Liquid Pro on the outside between the IHS and waterblock as well? I am seeing in very few places that it supposedly works wonderful with Nickel Plated Copper... Just want to see if anyone has direct input here as well.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Question about Liquid pro... I just ordered some, and will be delidding when it gets here.. I am going over to the Liquid Pro thread as well, but I am curious with the Nickel Plated EK block, if I should put the Liquid Pro on the outside between the IHS and waterblock as well? I am seeing in very few places that it supposedly works wonderful with Nickel Plated Copper... Just want to see if anyone has direct input here as well.


no dont do it, it will mess up you waterblock and the top of the ihs which will void warrenty and you will not be able to send it back if it dies


----------



## jsx821

I was thinking about using the Liquid Pro on the Core, but use AS5/PK3 on the IHS.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> no dont do it, it will mess up you waterblock and the top of the ihs which will void warrenty and you will not be able to send it back if it dies


Hmm... That wouldn't be good. Why does collaboratory say that it is really good for nickel plated copper if it will ruin a nickel plated copper block? That seems counter productive as I would go after them for misinformation.



If my block is Nickel plated Copper.... It would seem that they would be a perfect mate... but if it ruins it, then coollab is generally Effing people over with that highlighted section, because I was going to use it for the TIM material in between the Die and IHS and then the IHS and Block...


----------



## jsx821

One question - do you guys keep your cpu fan speed at max speed during stability testing? What about your chassis fans during stability testing?
Lastly, what do you guys keep it after stability testing during everyday use @ your particular overclock.


----------



## Cyro999

I max fans during stability testing, just because it's usually hotter than anything else on system

Chassis fans, fan controller and throw up when sustained combined cpu+gpu load

gpu fan it's own curve, cpu fans either pwm or solid on 1300rpm


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Hmm... That wouldn't be good. Why does collaboratory say that it is really good for nickel plated copper if it will ruin a nickel plated copper block? That seems counter productive as I would go after them for misinformation.
> 
> 
> 
> If my block is Nickel plated Copper.... It would seem that they would be a perfect mate... but if it ruins it, then coollab is generally Effing people over with that highlighted section, because I was going to use it for the TIM material in between the Die and IHS and then the IHS and Block...


It's fine for nickel plated, but it doesn't provide much of a temp decrease between the IHS and waterblock, so most people don't bother putting it there. It can be a pain to clean off, even if it doesn't damage anything.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> It's fine for nickel plated, but it doesn't provide much of a temp decrease between the IHS and waterblock, so most people don't bother putting it there. It can be a pain to clean off, even if it doesn't damage anything.


The mess part makes perfect sense!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rwpritchett*
> 
> Please add me to the club. I wasn't really looking for more OC headroom... I just wanted to quiet things down. Running at stock, my desktop gets rather noisy when I encode video (hits the CPU really hard). For practice, I first performed a delid on my HTPC Celeron CPU, since I would like it to run cooler too in order to keep fan noise down. Since it went smoothly, I went ahead and knocked the lid off my i7-4770k. Details for both below.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Haswell Celeron G1820 Delid
> 
> 
> 
> *I think I may be the first person in the world to delid this chip. OCN exclusive LOL.*
> 
> Here it is after smacking it with a hammer:
> 
> 
> One peculiar point of interest with the Haswell Celeron, there are actually some delicate points *under the IHS adhesive* that aren't there on the i5 and i7 Haswells. I think the vice-and-hammer method is the only safe way to delid one of these chips. I don't know if the Pentium or i3 chips have this too:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, after applying CLU to the underside and using RTV silicon to put it all back together, everything is working fine. I didn't take a screenshot of Realtemp before the delid, so you'll just have to take my word for it that the hottest core would hit 53°C running Prime95 with large FFT. Here it is after while running Prime95 large FFT (stock cooler):
> 
> 
> 
> It didn't even break *40°C*! HA!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Haswell Core i7-4770k Delid
> 
> 
> 
> There's hundreds of pictures of 4770k delids so I'll just throw mine up without narration:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Prime95 Before:*
> 
> 
> *Prime95 After:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: rwpritchett
> CPU: Celeron G1820 & i7-4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
> Mhz gained: 300Hz
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: ~15°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/n0t6z5


PM me


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Does anyone have time to post about cleaning the IHS and Die? I apologize for not being able to look, but I need to study. I have Artic Clean, if that helps me at all.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Does anyone have time to post about cleaning the IHS and Die? I apologize for not being able to look, but I need to study. I have Artic Clean, if that helps me at all.


your finger nail or a credit card works great for scraping the old tim off. The black glue is more difficult but you can remove it the same way.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> your finger nail or a credit card works great for scraping the old tim off. The black glue is more difficult but you can remove it the same way.


Then just give it a once over with the artic clean to make it pretty and shiny?

Also, since they are $4.99 I just ordered the EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy set of screws.. Good Idea to run a bare Die to get the best results or just put the IHS back on with CLP and a light silicone glue to keep it in place?


----------



## welshy46

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Then just give it a once over with the artic clean to make it pretty and shiny?
> 
> Also, since they are $4.99 I just ordered the EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy set of screws.. Good Idea to run a bare Die to get the best results or just put the IHS back on with CLP and a light silicone glue to keep it in place?


Yeah, not just for clean and shinyness. Also to remove any foreign material such as grease from skin and other contaminants. You don't need to glue the IHS back on as your cpu will be sandwiched between your socket and the heat sink block.

De lidded my 4770k last night on a whim while my rig is in bits .




IHS replaced upside down to denote it's been delidded.Delidding easily the simplest mod I've done to date, but the most stress inducing.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *welshy46*
> 
> Yeah, not just for clean and shinyness. Also to remove any foreign material such as grease from skin and other contaminants. You don't need to glue the IHS back on as your cpu will be sandwiched between your socket and the heat sink block.
> 
> De lidded my 4770k last night on a whim while my rig is in bits .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IHS replaced upside down to denote it's been delidded.Delidding easily the simplest mod I've done to date, but the most stress inducing.


Nicely done. I am waiting for CLP to here here and then I will be going through the process.


----------



## tpwilko08

I have a 3770k running on water i am real tempted to delid this 3770k because it can do 4.8Ghz at 1.22v stable which i think is quite a low voltage but the temps are about 70c under full load. do you guys think this 3770k could be a good overclocker delided since it takes so low volts to clock...


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> I have a 3770k running on water i am real tempted to delid this 3770k because it can do 4.8Ghz at 1.22v stable which i think is quite a low voltage but the temps are about 70c under full load. do you guys think this 3770k could be a good overclocker delided since it takes so low volts to clock...


Check what it can do 5g's at IMO. 90c for quick stability testing is fine, just questionable for a 24/7 clock to run that hot


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> I have a 3770k running on water i am real tempted to delid this 3770k because it can do 4.8Ghz at 1.22v stable which i think is quite a low voltage but the temps are about 70c under full load. do you guys think this 3770k could be a good overclocker delided since it takes so low volts to clock...


That would be a pretty good benching chip


----------



## jsx821

One question- does anyone know why my core voltage spikes up +0.1v on CPU-Z during stress testing? For example, I have 1.13v on adaptive @ 4.1ghz on my I5-4670K. When I run Prime95 the core voltage jumps to 1.221. Then when I stop the stress test it reverts back. I have seen youtube videos where the user sets the core voltage on adaptive mode like I did but the core voltage is fixed on their CPU-Z during stress testing. I have changed LLC to various low numbers 1-4 out of 7, still nothing.

I'm getting about 62C for my max temp which is pretty decent, but does anyone know why it fluctuates?

Here are pictures of my delidding.
I'm going to lap it this weekend.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> One question- does anyone know why my core voltage spikes up to 0.1v on CPU-Z during stress testing? For example, I have 1.13v on adaptive @ 4.1ghz on my I5-4670K.


Because you didn't read the haswell overclocking guide on ocn









people without voltage spike on adaptive are often just monitoring the wrong sensor because so many people get confused between vid and vcore which isn't helped by bad labeling on stuff like cpu-z which can show the wrong one


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Because you didn't read the haswell overclocking guide on ocn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> people without voltage spike on adaptive are often just monitoring the wrong sensor because so many people get confused between vid and vcore which isn't helped by bad labeling on stuff like cpu-z which can show the wrong one


I see, so technically- I am on 1.226v @ 4.1ghz not at 1.126v, correct?


----------



## Cyro999

Yea, use manual volts. Since manual drops at idle, there's little reason to use anything else, especially with the kinda nuts ways that adaptive can behave

few people who discuss stress/stability tests are blending with latest version of prime also


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Yea, use manual volts. Since manual drops at idle, there's little reason to use anything else, especially with the kinda nuts ways that adaptive can behave
> 
> few people who discuss stress/stability tests are blending with latest version of prime also


Looks like I can only get 4.1ghz @ 1.200v with max temps to 70c on manual. While idling at 40c.
So the adaptive voltage I mentioned earlier about sounds right, actually.

I can only get 4.2ghz by going over 1.3v, but the temperatures get crazy high and freezes- forcing me to power reset.

With my current delid i'm using AS5 for the PCB and IHS.

My solutions I will be trying this weekend:
1.) I have liquid pro TIM on the way to use it for the PCB rather than AS5.
2.) PK3 rather than AS5 on IHS (I know- getting a little desperate)
3.) I'm also going to lap the IHS this weekend using 220grit up to 2500grit following a thread from anandtech.

I'm going with these three solutions since its cheaper than getting a better cooler. Plus I'm only trying to clock to 4.2-4.4ghz so my 212 Evo with push/pull should be more than enough.

If I don't see at least 10c-20c difference preventing me to clock to 4.2. I'm going to curse my chip







and wave the white flag.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Looks like I can only get 4.1ghz @ 1.200v with max temps to 70c on manual. While idling at 40c.
> So the adaptive voltage I mentioned earlier about sounds right, actually.
> 
> I can only get 4.2ghz by going over 1.3v, but the temperatures get crazy high and freezes- forcing me to power reset.


Quote:


> I'm going to curse my chip


..did you read the guide?

sounds like PEBKAC issue to me


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> ..did you read the guide?
> 
> sounds like PEBKAC issue to me


You're probably right. I just want a quick dirty way to get to 4.2ghz.


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Check what it can do 5g's at IMO. 90c for quick stability testing is fine, just questionable for a 24/7 clock to run that hot


Ive had it 5GHz 1.24v before but that was with HT off and that was stable... will be interesting to see what voltage it does with HT on.


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That would be a pretty good benching chip


Its just seem to clock so easy but it just the temps holding it back. Are usual benching chips (Ln2) usually low voltage to clock...


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Ive had it 5GHz 1.24v before but that was with HT off and that was stable... will be interesting to see what voltage it does with HT on.


Mine is at 1.315v at 4.5... I wish I had your chip.


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Mine is at 1.315v at 4.5... I wish I had your chip.


Whats your temps like, have you delided?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Whats your temps like, have you delided?


Touching 80 under water sitting at 4.5ghz and 1.315. Delidding when the CLP arrives. Hopefully it will be here next week at the latest.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Touching 80 under water sitting at 4.5ghz and 1.315. Delidding when the CLP arrives. Hopefully it will be here next week at the latest.


I think you and I have the same chip. Whats your Batch #?
Also, what were your voltage(s) at 4.3ghz/4.4ghz?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> I think you and I have the same chip. Whats your Batch #?
> Also, what was your voltage at 4.4ghz?


Will try to let you know tonight when I get home. I don't remember off the top of my head.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Will try to let you know tonight when I get home. I don't remember off the top of my head.


Ok thanks.
I actually figured out what was wrong with my OC. Lol, I'm able to obtain 4.3ghz @ 1.236ghz stable @ 74c under air. Before I could only get to 4.3ghz at 1.3xx @ 80c+ under air. Looks like my CLLP is arriving the same time as yours. But I got impatient already delidded


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Touching 80 under water
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Ok thanks.
> I actually figured out what was wrong with my OC. Lol, I'm able to obtain 4.3ghz @ 1.236ghz stable @ 74c under air. Before I could only get to 4.3ghz at 1.3xx @ 80c+ under air. Looks like my CLLP is arriving the same time as yours. But I got impatient already delidded


I want to go ahead and do it, but I want to wait for the CLP to be close or on hand.

The information I can see in the picture I took, with AS5 covering a few letters, is SR147 3.5ghz and L317B80... I can really make out the rest and not honestly sure which is the batch number.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Touching 80 under water
> I want to go ahead and do it, but I want to wait for the CLP to be close or on hand.
> 
> The information I can see in the picture I took, with AS5 covering a few letters, is
> 
> SR147 3.5ghz


Is that the Asus Z87-A? If so- were twins. I think the batch # is on the actual manufacturer box.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Is that the Asus Z87-A? If so- were twins. I think the batch # is on the actual manufacturer box.


Z87-Pro V Edition. And I will look at the box when I get off work. I keep EVERYTHING, lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Its just seem to clock so easy but it just the temps holding it back. Are usual benching chips (Ln2) usually low voltage to clock...


Yes might be good but wont know until its cold


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Is that the Asus Z87-A? If so- were twins. I think the batch # is on the actual manufacturer box.


Batch # L317B801

Very serious question alert.... If I get another water block, would it make sense to go Bare IHS with CLP to get the absolute best temp out of this, and just replace the block and chip if it doesn't work out, instead of cleaning everything off?


----------



## jsx821

Update: installed h100i. Best mod ever.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Batch # L317B801
> 
> Very serious question alert.... If I get another water block, would it make sense to go Bare IHS with CLP to get the absolute best temp out of this, and just replace the block and chip if it doesn't work out, instead of cleaning everything off?


I wouldn't see why not- if you're talking about lapping the IHS. I already bought 3M wetordry grit sheets (silica carbide) in 220, 400, 600, 1000, 1500, 2000, 2500. Total cost was about ~$40 bucks. My thinking is that if you're going to delid, why not go the extra step? Delidding, IMO, is way more risky.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Update: installed h100i. Best mod ever.
> I wouldn't see why not- if you're talking about lapping the IHS. I already bought 3M wetordry grit sheets (silica carbide) in 220, 400, 600, 1000, 1500, 2000, 2500. Total cost was about ~$40 bucks. My thinking is that if you're going to delid, why not go the extra step? Delidding, IMO, is way more risky.


I am extremely nervous about delidding, but I want to do it so bad. So far I have had really good luck with everything, so I think I will take my time and go for it.

Also, I don't know anything about lapping at all... Not sure how or what to do.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I am extremely nervous about delidding, but I want to do it so bad. So far I have had really good luck with everything, so I think I will take my time and go for it.
> 
> Also, I don't know anything about lapping at all... Not sure how or what to do.


Search anandtech.They got some real good tutorials.

PS- What was your voltage/temp stability at 4.3ghz?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

I went from stock to 4.4 then 4.5. I don't have the notes wrote down for 4.4 though :-(


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> improved TIM!
> http://wccftech.com/intel-haswell-refresh-processors-codenamed-devils-canyon-launching-mid-2014-unlocked-design-improved-tim/


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> w-w-w-w-w-w-whaaaaat
> 
> reading now
> 
> Ok, now i'm curious.


Big news!

Probably won't beat out CLU or naked but the fact that it's being mentioned is a big thing as far as i'm concerned


----------



## jsx821

I see- after installing my h100i last night (with dual Noctua-NF-F12's). Temps are so much better at full load. However, when I go for 4.4ghz + and up, temps are above 60c. So, 4.3ghz will do for now. Just waiting to lap the IHS + waiting for my CLP to arrive so I can crank this baby up.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Big news!
> 
> Probably won't beat out CLU or naked but the fact that it's being mentioned is a big thing as far as i'm concerned


Indeed, very interesting. I wonder if they'll introduce it at the same price. Probably not


----------



## MaKe OuT

The non k version should be around $330 so I don't expect the k version to break $370. maybe less.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Indeed, very interesting. I wonder if they'll introduce it at the same price. Probably not


I think we already have the prices? Since my 4770k is struggling for [email protected]~1.4 with ht off i might flip it for one of those i5's if they have a better solution or especially if they are binned better (probably not though)

I don't actually need or really benefit from HT


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> I think we already have the prices? Since my 4770k is struggling for [email protected]~1.4 with ht off i might flip it for one of those i5's if they have a better solution or especially if they are binned better (probably not though)
> 
> I don't actually need or really benefit from HT


Sorry- but what do you mean by HT? Jk.it just hit me.


----------



## Cyro999

My 4770k is so much faster than my i7 950 - i thought i'd need hyperthreading for the ~1.15-1.2x speedup, but even a 4670k is so much faster that encoding is a breeze


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> My 4770k is so much faster than my i7 950 - i thought i'd need hyperthreading for the ~1.15-1.2x speedup, but even a 4670k is so much faster that encoding is a breeze


Do you think ther would be any significant diff. To delid the new chips?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Do you think ther would be any significant diff. To delid the new chips?


If you mean the haswell refresh/broadwell chips, nobody knows~


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Any more input on whether I should go with a bare die to heat sink, and then just order a spare block for the future, if I need it?

Or should I just put the IHS back on?


----------



## chiknnwatrmln

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Any more input on whether I should go with a bare die to heat sink, and then just order a spare block for the future, if I need it?
> 
> Or should I just put the IHS back on?


I would put the IHS back on, uneven or too much pressure on the bare die can crack it.

I recall a couple OCN members who overtightened their 290x heatsink and cracked the die. Granted that's a GPU, but same idea.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> I would put the IHS back on, uneven or too much pressure on the bare die can crack it.
> 
> I recall a couple OCN members who *overtightened their 290x heatsink and cracked the die*. Granted that's a GPU, but same idea.


But that was junk AMD glass!


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chiknnwatrmln*
> 
> I would put the IHS back on, uneven or too much pressure on the bare die can crack it.
> 
> I recall a couple OCN members who overtightened their 290x heatsink and cracked the die. Granted that's a GPU, but same idea.


I have ordered the Naked Ivy add-on for the EK block... I don't want to break the Die, but I won't be rushing and supposedly won't be able to over tighten it either.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

These Temps are really bothering me, so I am going to delid now. I wanted to wait, but there is a 12 difference and it is increasing almost daily.

Got pictures of the heat sink prior to delidding and the spread, so I will update later.

Wish me luck.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

I JUST HIT MY CPU WITH PIECE OF WOOD AND HAMMER!!!

Hands were shaking like a leaf in a hurricane... I am absolutely terrified I might have broke it.



It looks like small marks on the very edge, right side below the arrow indicator.. Are they going to cause issues?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Anyone have any quick input? I really want this to work, but I am utterly terrified that the small marks on the side are going to be the death of this chip.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Wow.. that thing is in bad shape








Do you got a pic of the wood used? looks like it wasnt completely flat or not a big enough surface area..
maybe some softer wood with with a hard knot in it.

Anyways, a few ppl have done damage like this, without damaging the processor it self. only one way to find out









*Edit
Thanks for the last pic







show it a bit better..
It looks like you are safe, the dents are only on the light green part of the PCB, witch does not have anything in it..
I think you are safe.

Why does the DIE look scratched? not finished cleaning it?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Wow.. that thing is in bad shape
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you got a pic of the wood used? looks like it wasnt completely flat or not a big enough surface area..
> maybe some softer wood with with a hard knot in it.
> 
> Anyways, a few ppl have done damage like this, without damaging the processor it self. only one way to find out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Edit
> Thanks for the last pic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> show it a bit better..
> It looks like you are safe, the dents are only on the light green part of the PCB, witch does not have anything in it..
> I think you are safe.
> 
> Why does the DIE look scratched? not finished cleaning it?


No pictures of the wood. I put paper towels, tripled over, around the base to keep it from gambling anything, but is doesn't seem to ha e worked like I hoped.

I can not see any metallic traces around the spots at all, but I don't currently have my microscope or anything to verify with :-(...

I guess I will give it a try and pray for the best.

I just cleaned the die  looks pristine.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Should I go with AS5, the Tim included with EK blocks or ceramique 2?

I have the EK Tim on my blocks and they stay chilly, so I was thinking possibly the same for this.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Anyone have any quick input? I really want this to work, but I am utterly terrified that the small marks on the side are going to be the death of this chip.


Whoa those are some pretty deep gashes... seems like your piece of wood was not flat or you must have hit the CPU pretty hard.

Luckily, the gashes are mostly on the light green border edge, so the traces of the CPU should be safe. There's no guarantee it will work, but it's worth a shot.


----------



## GaMbi2004

beautiful!








My best bet is that you are safe.. Let us know


----------



## Kokin

Make sure you don't put AS5 on the die, as it is conductive TIM and those little capacitors right next to the die are susceptible to damage with conductive TIM. Use a non-conductive TIM on the die or put some clear nail polish over the capacitors to protect them from a conductive TIM.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kokin*
> 
> Make sure you don't put AS5 on the die, as it is conductive TIM and those little capacitors right next to the die are susceptible to damage with conductive TIM. Use a non-conductive TIM on the die or put some clear nail polish over the capacitors to protect them from a conductive TIM.


Used the Ectotherm from EK. It is only until the CLP gets here anyway. Temp checks to see how everything works after realizing my Temps were getting silly pretty quick.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Well.. I must report back now. 20°celcius Drop!

Can I join the club now?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Congrats on the functional chip. awesome temp drop








what programs are used for stress test / heat test?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Congrats on the functional chip. awesome temp drop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what programs are used for stress test / heat test?


Right now, prime 95 is the only one I have. It is at 15 minutes and then Temps haven't gone up at all.

I think I will try to naked Ivy Add-on when it arrives, see if I can pull 3-4 more °c down and aim for 5GHz.

*edit* I meant to say that the gashes were on the vice side, not the side where the piece of wood was. When i hit the 3770K next month, I will put a small piece of rubber or thin piece of wood behind the chip so it has a flat surface... I only have access to one Vice, and the teeth on it are fairly deep, which is what caused the dents. there were 6 on the bottom, but they were much smaller than the top. All is well, and I am running steady


----------



## tpwilko08

Anyone know which is better Coollaboratory Liquid Pro or Ultra?


----------



## Aemonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Right now, prime 95 is the only one I have. It is at 15 minutes and then Temps haven't gone up at all.
> 
> I think I will try to naked Ivy Add-on when it arrives, see if I can pull 3-4 more °c down and aim for 5GHz.
> 
> *edit* I meant to say that the gashes were on the vice side, not the side where the piece of wood was. When i hit the 3770K next month, I will put a small piece of rubber or thin piece of wood behind the chip so it has a flat surface... I only have access to one Vice, and the teeth on it are fairly deep, which is what caused the dents. there were 6 on the bottom, but they were much smaller than the top. All is well, and I am running steady


When you place your processor in the vice, you want to clamp it on the side face of the IHC with those metal tabs that the retention bracket clamps on between the processor and your vice. It looks like you put the processor in the vice right up against the PCB and that's what caused the damage. As long as you mount it properly in the vice, it's nearly impossible to do what you've done. All you need to do is put some tape on the vice grips if they have textured grips so they don't mar anything... but if mounted properly the only thing that would get marked up without tape is the IHS not the CPU PCB.


----------



## Aemonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Anyone know which is better Coollaboratory Liquid Pro or Ultra?


From what I know, CLU is easier to clean up than CLP... that's the primary difference. If you have the option, pick up CLU.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aemonn*
> 
> When you place your processor in the vice, you want to clamp it on the side face of the IHC with those metal tabs that the retention bracket clamps on between the processor and your vice. It looks like you put the processor in the vice right up against the PCB and that's what caused the damage. As long as you mount it properly in the vice, it's nearly impossible to do what you've done. All you need to do is put some tape on the vice grips if they have textured grips so they don't mar anything... but if mounted properly the only thing that would get marked up without tape is the IHS not the CPU PCB.


I mounted it exactly how you suggest here, and had paper towels in between. Next time I will use some tape, and make it cleaner and make sure this doesn't happen again.

I am currently running at 4.7Ghz and 1.408v according to CPU-z at 75°c on the three hot cores and 69° on the cold core.


----------



## MaKe OuT

TFW you have to use the same voltage as the dude who gets 4.7 just to get 4.4.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> TFW you have to use the same voltage as the dude who gets 4.7 just to get 4.4.


What does TFW mean? All of the silly acronyms kill me and make no sense...


----------



## MaKe OuT

That Feel When

Basically means "the feeling you get when".


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> That Feel When
> 
> Basically means "the feeling you get when".


Oooohhhhh lol. I had to go up some more. It wasn't stable after a few minutes. Still trying.


----------



## acanom

It´s finaly done, went very quick and smooth, 2 hits with the hammer and off was the IHS:





OCN name: acanom
CPU: i7-4770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: no further OC done at the moment,did it mainly for the temps and because I can








OC after delid: 4,6Ghz
Temp drops: -18°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/dpqkw9

Before:


After:


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aemonn*
> 
> From what I know, CLU is easier to clean up than CLP... that's the primary difference. If you have the option, pick up CLU.


I have the option of both so i will just get CLU since its easier to clean up..


----------



## MaKe OuT

edited


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Anyone know which is better Coollaboratory Liquid Pro or Ultra?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aemonn*
> 
> From what I know, CLU is easier to clean up than CLP... that's the primary difference. If you have the option, pick up CLU.


There really should be some info of CLU/CLP in the first post because so many people are asking this.
I can say from my own experience:

CLP Pros:

Little bit lower temp's compared to CLU (~3°C)
Last longer
CLP Cons:

Harder to apply/clean
CLU Pros:

Easier to apply/clean
CLU Cons:

Little bit higher temp's compared to CLP
Have to be replaced every 6 month's (estimated)

I have used CLP & CLU between die and IHS and with naked mount. After four month's CLU started to get hard and temp's started to raise slowly, with CLP I don't have that problem.


----------



## deepor

I did not touch my CLU application for about a year (it's eleven months I think), and the temperatures did not change at all.


----------



## GaMbi2004

same here,
Did a checkup on my CLU after 8 months of running.. no temp change and still "liquid".. added a tiny bit more and brushed it all out.
I have no doubt it could have lasted over a year.


----------



## FractinJex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> same here,
> Did a checkup on my CLU after 8 months of running.. no temp change and still "liquid".. added a tiny bit more and brushed it all out.
> I have no doubt it could have lasted over a year.


Im not sure why ive seen so many saying you need to replace it every 6 months or a year ...lol

I stated like almost a year ago that the clu if applied properly and if the cpu does not sit for any extened period of time should last for years...as in prly around 3 years before possibly needing to clean it and reapply....

even then you can prly get away with never replacing it and still have descent temps but id say if the cpu is used a lot for years then prly right around 2 1/2 years would be a good time to cleana nd reapply...or you can simply do it once a year whatever


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Right now, prime 95 is the only one I have. It is at 15 minutes and then Temps haven't gone up at all.
> 
> I think I will try to naked Ivy Add-on when it arrives, see if I can pull 3-4 more °c down and aim for 5GHz.
> 
> *edit* I meant to say that the gashes were on the vice side, not the side where the piece of wood was. When i hit the 3770K next month, I will put a small piece of rubber or thin piece of wood behind the chip so it has a flat surface... I only have access to one Vice, and the teeth on it are fairly deep, which is what caused the dents. there were 6 on the bottom, but they were much smaller than the top. All is well, and I am running steady


Hey, i'd recommend reading the guide on OCN~ "Haswell overclocking guide (with statistics)"


----------



## InCoGnIt0

I checked my CLU after 1 year and its still the same and the temps are still the same.

over 1 year.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Hey, i'd recommend reading the guide on OCN~ "Haswell overclocking guide (with statistics)"


Can you give a little insight. I will fully read it when possible, but that may be a few months from now, if I remember.

I have to study for a promotion, and I have been focused on the computer and not the books.. Gotta place priorities.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Can you give a little insight. I will fully read it when possible, but that may be a few months from now, if I remember.
> 
> I have to study for a promotion, and I have been focused on the computer and not the books.. Gotta place priorities.


Not much i can say without writing a paragraph, i'd reccomend 5 min read over it for anyone before touching bios stuff though, it's one of the best guides/threads on the web and the best that i know of


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Not much i can say without writing a paragraph, i'd reccomend 5 min read over it for anyone before touching bios stuff though, it's one of the best guides/threads on the web and the best that i know of


Done and done.


----------



## jsx821

Edges are still somewhat concave, but I can live with that. I used a ruler and flashed light through. Seems pretty flat to me. Cheers.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edges are still somewhat concave, but I can live with that. I used a ruler and flashed light through. Seems pretty flat to me. Cheers.


How long did it take?


----------



## MaKe OuT

Can anyone tell me if you would delid in my case:

Voltage required for 44 multi: 1.40 Vcore which bumps to 1.424V at load. 2.10 VCCIN bumps to 2.14 at load.
x264 temps has my hottest core 79 and coolest core 70.

I am limited at this voltage, no way I am getting 45 multi. The temps aren't terrible IMO. Would you just leave it be making it easier to sell and grab a Haswell refresh (if it is compatible on Z87 mobo)? Thanks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Well.. I must report back now. 20°celcius Drop!
> 
> Can I join the club now?


give the info that is needed so i can add you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *acanom*
> 
> It´s finaly done, went very quick and smooth, 2 hits with the hammer and off was the IHS:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: acanom
> CPU: i7-4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: no further OC done at the moment,did it mainly for the temps and because I can
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OC after delid: 4,6Ghz
> Temp drops: -18°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:http://valid.canardpc.com/dpqkw9
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Will do as soon as I get home. Been busy and forgot to post.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Will do as soon as I get home. Been busy and forgot to post.


no problem!


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

OCN Name: Scarlet-Tech
CPU: i7-4770k
On Die-TIM: Ek EctoTherm (changing with Coollaboratory Pro when it arrives and going bare die)
ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
MHZ Gained: +200
OC After delid: 4.7 GHZ
Temp Drops: -20c @ 4.5 ghz
CPU-Z Validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/zjyyz1

Prior to Delid:



Post Delid, (with higher ambient as it warmed up today):



*I have to stress that When I tested this the first time, when I was getting 80 and such, it was 0c outside... Now is it 14c, and I have my window open with the CPUs as close as possible, as the room doesn't have temp control and stays at a staggering 25 compared. Taken today, the temps don't look that great, lol


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> OCN Name: Scarlet-Tech
> CPU: i7-4770k
> On Die-TIM: Ek EctoTherm (changing with Coollaboratory Pro when it arrives and going bare die)
> ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> MHZ Gained: +200
> OC After delid: 4.7 GHZ
> Temp Drops: -20c @ 4.5 ghz
> CPU-Z Validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/zjyyz1
> 
> Prior to Delid:
> 
> 
> 
> Post Delid, (with higher ambient as it warmed up today):
> 
> 
> 
> *I have to stress that When I tested this the first time, when I was getting 80 and such, it was 0c outside... Now is it 14c, and I have my window open with the CPUs as close as possible, as the room doesn't have temp control and stays at a staggering 25 compared. Taken today, the temps don't look that great, lol


Sorry I had a real bad headache when doing my lapping. I went to bed immediately after I posted the pics on here. Lol.. To answer your question- the lapping took me like 2-3hours. I would suggest marking the IHS- so you can keep track during 45 deg turns. The key is to keep it consistent. I did 15-20 laps/45deg turn. When I got finish with one cycle I'd off the metal shavings on the IHS, then clean the sandpaper with water. I used 220 --- > 400 ---> 600 ----> 1000 ----> 1500. I stopped at 1500 because I thought going to 2000 was a bit overkill. I don't the key is to get it "shiny", it's to keep it evenly flat. Don't put any 'pressure' when doing lapping- although I know it's tempting. You're going need a lot of patience and some beer. Guiness worked for me.









Will post results later on today. I'm idling at 25. ;D
Oh- i forgot to mention this is without CLP.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Sorry I had a real bad headache when doing my lapping. I went to bed immediately after I posted the pics on here. Lol.. To answer your question- the lapping took me like 2-3hours. I would suggest marking the IHS- so you can keep track during 45 deg turns. The key is to keep it consistent. I did 15-20 laps/45deg turn. When I got finish with one cycle I'd off the metal shavings on the IHS, then clean the sandpaper with water. I used 220 --- > 400 ---> 600 ----> 1000 ----> 1500. I stopped at 1500 because I thought going to 2000 was a bit overkill. I don't the key is to get it "shiny", it's to keep it evenly flat. Don't put any 'pressure' when doing lapping- although I know it's tempting. You're going need a lot of patience and some beer. Guiness worked for me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will post results later on today. I'm idling at 25. ;D
> Oh- i forgot to mention this is without CLP.


I will probably Lap the 3770k, if I pull it out after I test for my next rank. I have about 4 months after testing to stress about missing it again, so I figure that will be the perfect time to keep myself busy.

I found 100grit yesterday, but I was surprised when the next highes ti could find was 150.. looks like it would be something I order and have to wait a few weeks to show up :-(

Congrats and I can't wait to see the results.. It looks beautiful. I have a lot of patience, now that I have pretty much done everything once that I am able to do...

Now if I could figure out how to solder 3Gb of extra ram on to each Classified and get it to function, LOL... (That would never happen.. )


----------



## acanom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Thanks!









It´s like a got a different CPU now.

Before starting at 1.32 my temps went ape**** instantly up to 90°C and at 1.35 they passed 100°C.

I´m running 1.38 at the moment and I´m at 66°C. It barley changes the temps from 1.28 to 1.37.

Delidding was definitely worth it for me!









Idle temps are still the same though, but I´m running a waterloop and they match my water temps more or less.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *acanom*
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It´s like a got a different CPU now.
> 
> Before starting at 1.32 my temps went ape**** instantly up to 90°C and at 1.35 they passed 100°C.
> 
> I´m running 1.38 at the moment and I´m at 66°C. It barley changes the temps from 1.28 to 1.37.
> 
> Delidding was definitely worth it for me!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Idle temps are still the same though, but I´m running a waterloop and they match my water temps more or less.


I just dropped my voltage from 1.315 to 1.299 and Wow, the temps went down crazy fast... I am thinking that Delidding was worth it for my system as well :-D


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> Can anyone tell me if you would delid in my case:
> 
> Voltage required for 44 multi: 1.40 Vcore which bumps to 1.424V at load. 2.10 VCCIN bumps to 2.14 at load.
> x264 temps has my hottest core 79 and coolest core 70.
> 
> I am limited at this voltage, no way I am getting 45 multi. The temps aren't terrible IMO. Would you just leave it be making it easier to sell and grab a Haswell refresh (if it is compatible on Z87 mobo)? Thanks


If you are hitting the voltage wall before the thermal wall then delidding will not make a difference.

Most people delid to get past the thermal barrier to see how far they can push their chip prior to hitting the voltage barrier.

In your case you seem to be hitting the voltage barrier first, so it's probably not worth a delid.


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> If you are hitting the voltage wall before the thermal wall then delidding will not make a difference.
> 
> Most people delid to get past the thermal barrier to see how far they can push their chip prior to hitting the voltage barrier.
> 
> In your case you seem to be hitting the voltage barrier first, so it's probably not worth a delid.


Makes sense to me.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> OCN Name: Scarlet-Tech
> CPU: i7-4770k
> On Die-TIM: Ek EctoTherm (changing with Coollaboratory Pro when it arrives and going bare die)
> ihs-TIM: Artic Silver 5
> MHZ Gained: +200
> OC After delid: 4.7 GHZ
> Temp Drops: -20c @ 4.5 ghz
> CPU-Z Validation of Max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/zjyyz1
> 
> Prior to Delid:
> 
> 
> 
> Post Delid, (with higher ambient as it warmed up today):
> 
> 
> 
> *I have to stress that When I tested this the first time, when I was getting 80 and such, it was 0c outside... Now is it 14c, and I have my window open with the CPUs as close as possible, as the room doesn't have temp control and stays at a staggering 25 compared. Taken today, the temps don't look that great, lol


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## jsx821

Question- how long does it take for CLP to 'settle in' like AS5? Or does it not? I'm getting max temp of 29 at idle, on two of the cores, while the other two at 25. I may have to reseat cooler. Currently at 4.5ghz @ 1.290v for 5hours on prime95. Going to try 4.6 @ 1.290v and call it a day.


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> Question- how long does it take for CLP to 'settle in' like AS5? Or does it not? I'm getting max temp of 29 at idle, on two of the cores, while the other two at 25. I may have to reseat cooler. Currently at 4.5ghz @ 1.290v for 5hours on prime95. Going to try 4.6 @ 1.290v and call it a day.


No curing time needed for CLU/CLP.


----------



## jsx821

I see-- good to know. It's probably the seating of the cooler then. After my first try- the temps were up to 35c. So I took off the cooler and the CLP was stuck on half of the cooler, lol. I guess I should do the 'star' method. I just did 'two thumbscrews' at a time on my h100i that were diagonal to each other.. then the last two. Laziness







. Either way I'm happy


----------



## deepor

What? You have to paint with CLP using some sort of brush. It does not work like normal paste. Please don't do the rice grain method or something with CLP.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> What? You have to paint with CLP using some sort of brush. It does not work like normal paste. Please don't do the rice grain method or something with CLP.


I did use a brush? I'm talking about seating the cooler on the IHS.


----------



## deepor

I got scared when you wrote "CLP was stuck on half the cooler" and thought you used CLP there and with the normal paste method.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I got scared when you wrote "CLP was stuck on half the cooler" and thought you used CLP there and with the normal paste method.


Lol- I seated the cooler with uneven force, by screwing the thumb screws two at a time. Which probably explains why two of my cores are perhaps higher.


----------



## jsx821

I don't know if many of you have H100i's--- but my backplate was extremely unstable due to gap of the pin and the plastic washer behind my ASUS motherboard. So, I went out to my local hardware store and got some nylon washers (all eight was like $1.50). Now the standoffs are 98% stable as opposed to before- it was really flimsy. This makes seating the the cooler extremely EASY after re-pasting TIM. Just thought I throw that out there.

So I took it slow this time and applied CLP carefully. Oh and I had to relap the IHS, because the CLP did not want to come off at all. I knew I was seating it incorrectly this whole time. The lapping didn't do that much probably about 2c-3c. I think going bare die is the way to go. Here's my results as of right now, as I am still in the process of undervolting at 4.5ghz. That third core is a b*tch


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> I don't know if many of you have H100i's--- but my backplate was extremely unstable due to gap of the pin and the plastic washer behind my ASUS motherboard. So, I went out to my local hardware store and got some nylon washers (all eight was like $1.50). Now the standoffs are 98% stable as opposed to before- it was really flimsy. This makes seating the the cooler extremely EASY after re-pasting TIM. Just thought I throw that out there.
> 
> So I took it slow this time and applied CLP carefully. Oh and I had to relap the IHS, because the CLP did not want to come off at all. I knew I was seating it incorrectly this whole time. The lapping didn't do that much probably about 2c-3c. I think going bare die is the way to go. Here's my results as of right now, as I am still in the process of undervolting at 4.5ghz. That third core is a b*tch


Does that version of cpu-z report vcore correctly*? I've never seen a haswell vcore sensor throw 1.315, it's usually like 1.308, 1.32

*many of them don't, depending on board


----------



## jsx821

I have no idea, I updated it yesterday*


----------



## Aemonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> In your case you seem to be hitting the voltage barrier first, so it's probably not worth a delid.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> Can anyone tell me if you would delid in my case:


I just want to add that delidding also has the benefit of keeping your processor cooler moving into the summer if you set your OC during a season when ambient temp is lower.

My max temp pre-delid was fine with my OC, but as summer comes and ambient rises I'd like to keep my processor below 65C. Being that I now run 50-52C max with 21C ambient I think i'll be able to do that without adjusting my OC on those hotter days.

Personally, its such an easy thing to do with the vice method I can't see why you wouldn't do it if you're comfortable with the procedure.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aemonn*
> 
> I just want to add that delidding also has the benefit of keeping your processor cooler moving into the summer if you set your OC during a season when ambient temp is lower.
> 
> My max temp pre-delid was fine with my OC, but as summer comes and ambient rises I'd like to keep my processor below 65C. Being that I now run 50-52C max with 21C ambient I think i'll be able to do that without adjusting my OC on those hotter days.
> 
> Personally, its such an easy thing to do with the vice method I can't see why you wouldn't do it if you're comfortable with the procedure.


why only 65C?? that seems a bit low honestly i put my max to 80C during daily. That is just me though.


----------



## Aemonn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> why only 65C?? that seems a bit low honestly i put my max to 80C during daily. That is just me though.


It is low. No reason really other than it's the number I've chosen for myself. I run my OC @ 4.5ghz and 1.2v as my default but I can turn it up if I ever need to... so 65C gives me plenty of thermal headroom and makes me feel like I'm babying my CPU and it's not like I sacrifice anything for it.

When I rotate this rig into my secondary rig in a few years that's when I'll go ball-to-the-wall 24x7 OC on this gear.. in the meantime I'll turn it up if I feel the need.. but currently unless I'm benching I don't see a need as I need to go up in volts quite a bit relatively speaking to go above 4.5GHZ.

I like to find the sweet spot where volts are still low and I get a decent OC. I then set a thermal goal.


----------



## chronicfx

I like to set my thermal goal after my overclock goal too.. I usually push to 5ghz then say I don't really want to get hotter than this.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I like to set my thermal goal after my overclock goal too.. I usually push to 5ghz then say I don't really want to get hotter than this.


1.48v is too high imho ...


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> 1.48v is too high imho ...


Eh, belial ran a tiny bit higher, i'd imagine at this point you kinda accept degradation happening over shorter timespans


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Eh, belial ran a tiny bit higher, i'd imagine at this point you kinda accept degradation happening over shorter timespans


i think my cpu degraded at 1.35v should i give it a little extra juice or tone down the oc a bit ?!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> 1.48v is too high imho ...


Been running this since hurricane sandy.. Whenever that was, we had no power for week so I grabbed a razorblade and delidded this puppy by candlelight







it was romantic. No hint of degradation and it has almost made it completely through haswell. I plan to buy the next chip anyways. It will make it.


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Been running this since hurricane sandy.. Whenever that was, we had no power for week so I grabbed a razorblade and delidded this puppy by candlelight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it was romantic. No hint of degradation and it has almost made it completely through haswell. I plan to buy the next chip anyways. It will make it.


what are you buying next 3570k is still pretty high end even by today's standard


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> what are you buying next 3570k is still pretty high end even by today's standard


Uh, I disagree there. The 3570k is the ENTRY level overclock capable CPU from Intel. I would not say that it was ever a "pretty high end" chip personally, and I own two of them for my LAN rigs. Just my


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Uh, I disagree there. The 3570k is the ENTRY level overclock capable CPU from Intel. I would not say that it was ever a "pretty high end" chip personally, and I own two of them for my LAN rigs. Just my


I think he probably means as a performance CPU, it is still up there compared to all of the currently released mainstream CPUs. Almost all the CPUs that do outperform the 3570K are generally hundreds of $$$$ more expensive. If anything, I personally believe Sandy Bridge CPUs were the kings of OCing @ entry level, 5GHz+ was super easy to hit on my old 2550K, while my 3570K needs crazy amounts of voltage to do 5GHz+.

Most people don't really need more than the 3570K and 90% of them don't even fully utilize it outside of gaming. I would probably fall into that category as the only other CPU-intensive thing I do is encode anime to put into my phone. I do notice *encoding makes my CPU run hotter* than Prime95 Blend. It even brings my temps right back up to where they were before my delid (about 10~15C higher).


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> encoding makes my CPU run hotter than Prime95 Blend.


Never heard of that being the case, not even close, i would check four things:

Prime95 version

You're not just checking the first test of blend, which often runs for 15 minutes and is cool?

avx enabled OS, this means installing w7 service pack 1 and scoring 100+gflops on ibt

asrock z77 board so vcore might be significantly different between them. Multimeter should tell, if the board has readout points


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> encoding makes my CPU run hotter than Prime95 Blend.
> 
> 
> 
> Never heard of that being the case, not even close, i would check four things:
> 
> Prime95 version
> 
> You're not just checking the first test of blend, which often runs for 15 minutes and is cool?
> 
> avx enabled OS, this means installing w7 service pack 1 and scoring 100+gflops on ibt
> 
> asrock z77 board so vcore might be significantly different between them. Multimeter should tell, if the board has readout points
Click to expand...

IIRC it was just the extreme4and extreme6 that had the issue with voltage reporting.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> IIRC it was just the extreme4and extreme6 that had the issue with voltage reporting.


I said might because i wasn't sure

Prime should definately be hotter than encoding, though. I do a lot of encoding on this haswell rig and built a system for someone w/ 3770k entirely for encoding, if prime peaks 10-15c colder instead of at least notably hotter then that just seems really weird to me


----------



## dangerdan87

Delided my first CPU (4770k). I was a bit nervous but I got the IHS off. I used the vice method and somehow I ended up splitting the PCB a little with my block of wood. The split is at the top of the CPU where the little gold thingies are (sorry, I don't know all the areas of the CPU







). The split is on the side of the PCB.
It scared the crap out if me as I was being very cautious. I scraped off the black glue and filled the split with super glue and put the chip back in my MOBO to test it. Luckily, it works and my MOBO still POSTs and recognizes my CPU. I have some article silver and CLP on the way.


----------



## Ironman75

Ok I want to be in the club. I have an i7 3770k delidded and naked with the EK supremacy copper cpu block and indigo xtreme thermal interface. Running 4.8ghz 24/7 custom waterloop. Temps never higher then 58c at full load. So what now do I get a t - shirt lol.....


----------



## acanom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ironman75*
> 
> Ok I want to be in the club. I have an i7 3770k delidded and naked with the EK supremacy copper cpu block and indigo xtreme thermal interface. Running 4.8ghz 24/7 custom waterloop. Temps never higher then 58c at full load. So what now do I get a t - shirt lol.....


Man, you are a baller


----------



## exodus1500

I am wondering if you guys could take a minute and look at my temps, I am not sure they are normal. here is my temp readings from aquasuite. I am concerned by the spikes, they drop down pretty quickly, but I am worried that I might not be making full contact between my water block and processor, which is naked.

These spikes are just running normal operations, like opening browsers, looking at a video, etc.

I am still able to OC it to around 4.6Ghz at around 80* in prime, though, so I am not sure.

My setup is a naked 4770k with a Bitspower Summit water block.

THANKS!!!!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *exodus1500*
> 
> I am wondering if you guys could take a minute and look at my temps, I am not sure they are normal. here is my temp readings from aquasuite. I am concerned by the spikes, they drop down pretty quickly, but I am worried that I might not be making full contact between my water block and processor, which is naked.
> 
> These spikes are just running normal operations, like opening browsers, looking at a video, etc.
> 
> I am still able to OC it to around 4.6Ghz at around 80* in prime, though, so I am not sure.
> 
> My setup is a naked 4770k with a Bitspower Summit water block.
> 
> THANKS!!!!


Pretty sure that just happens, you're not hitting 50c. Prime is also pretty much expected to be that hot, the more aggressive heat tests are way hotter vs real loads on Haswell vs most other chips


----------



## Frimbles

Need some advice as to what I should do with my 4670k.

As seen in the picture below, I can run 4.6GHz @ 1.25v with the hottest core reaching 77 degrees Celsius. However I'm not sure if I'm stressing it right. AIDA produced the results in the image below, but to be certain I ran P95 28.4. My 4670k reached 95 degrees in literally a few seconds, never again will I run 28.4. Older versions of Prime produce roughly the same temperatures as the AIDA stress tests.

Is it worth delidding? I've booted into 4.8GHz @ 1.3v however it BSoD'ed after a few seconds, I'm guessing it's achievable with a voltage of say 1.31-1.32v.

If I was to delid would I need specific tim's? I currently only have artic silver 5 and I hear people use specific tim's for the cpu die.

*Image is circled as cpu-z gave inaccurate vcore readouts*



Thanks


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frimbles*
> 
> Need some advice as to what I should do with my 4670k.
> 
> As seen in the picture below, I can run 4.6GHz @ 1.25v with the hottest core reaching 77 degrees Celsius. However I'm not sure if I'm stressing it right. AIDA produced the results in the image below, but to be certain I ran P95 28.4. My 4670k reached 95 degrees in literally a few seconds, never again will I run 28.4. Older versions of Prime produce roughly the same temperatures as the AIDA stress tests.
> 
> Is it worth delidding? I've booted into 4.8GHz @ 1.3v however it BSoD'ed after a few seconds, I'm guessing it's achievable with a voltage of say 1.31-1.32v.
> 
> If I was to delid would I need specific tim's? I currently only have artic silver 5 and I hear people use specific tim's for the cpu die.
> 
> *Image is circled as cpu-z gave inaccurate vcore readouts*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks


Newer version of linx, IBT & prime95 that use the AVX instruction sets do really drive the temps up, you also have to watch using adaptive voltage when running them, the voltage will boost considerably & just make temps worse.
Worth delidding is always up to the user, there is some risk & it all depends if the risk is worth the reward, being able to run a bit higher voltage & get the clocks up with more temperature headroom.
The liquid metal TIMs like coollaboratory liquid pro & ultra (there are a couple other brand LM tims as well) are definitely preferred for on the die, you can still get better temps delidding & using normal paste since getting the layer of glue between the PCB & IHS makes a difference right away, but more dramatic results with the liquid metals, they are worth it for delidded chips.

All software is somewhat inaccurate for voltage, I've checked before with cpu-z, hwmonitor & hwinfo all giving slightly different readings, & none of them were the same as the actual voltage measured on a DMM. I think hwmonitor was closest to actual though, but software is the best most users have & as long as it is consistent & shows the changes, that is as good as it gets.


----------



## Frimbles

I've been using the manual vcore setting along with the C7 state enabled since I've started overclocking, I read it doesn't affect stability in the slightest. Vcore sit's at something ridiculous like 0.125v idle. Is it safe to say AIDA is a qualified stability stress tester, that is to say in comparison to IBT, Prime and so on?

I hear there's hardly any risk involved with the vice method, obviously I'm not going to go at my 4670k with a knife. If I was to do it I take it the vice method is the best route of action.

I'll admit I honestly don't need the extra MHz, I'd want to do it... just because


----------



## acanom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frimbles*
> 
> I've been using the manual vcore setting along with the C7 state enabled since I've started overclocking, I read it doesn't affect stability in the slightest. Vcore sit's at something ridiculous like 0.125v idle. Is it safe to say AIDA is a qualified stability stress tester, that is to say in comparison to IBT, Prime and so on?
> 
> I hear there's hardly any risk involved with the vice method, obviously I'm not going to go at my 4670k with a knife. If I was to do it I take it the vice method is the best route of action.
> 
> I'll admit I honestly don't need the extra MHz, I'd want to do it... just because


Just order a bunch of cheap CPUS from the list in the OP and practice on them. That´s what I did. You can get them for a few bucks.

And yes, breaking the CPU with the vice method is pretty hard. IF you do it correct that is.
It´s more likely to dmg it afterwards imo than during the delidding.

I used that guide


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frimbles*
> 
> Need some advice as to what I should do with my 4670k.
> 
> As seen in the picture below, I can run 4.6GHz @ 1.25v with the hottest core reaching 77 degrees Celsius. However I'm not sure if I'm stressing it right. AIDA produced the results in the image below, but to be certain I ran P95 28.4. My 4670k reached 95 degrees in literally a few seconds, never again will I run 28.4. Older versions of Prime produce roughly the same temperatures as the AIDA stress tests.
> 
> Is it worth delidding? I've booted into 4.8GHz @ 1.3v however it BSoD'ed after a few seconds, I'm guessing it's achievable with a voltage of say 1.31-1.32v.
> 
> If I was to delid would I need specific tim's? I currently only have artic silver 5 and I hear people use specific tim's for the cpu die.
> 
> *Image is circled as cpu-z gave inaccurate vcore readouts*
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks


Read the guide on OCN

Haswell overclocking thread with statistics


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ironman75*
> 
> Ok I want to be in the club. I have an i7 3770k delidded and naked with the EK supremacy copper cpu block and indigo xtreme thermal interface. Running 4.8ghz 24/7 custom waterloop. Temps never higher then 58c at full load. So what now do I get a t - shirt lol.....


Fill out the information from the front page and I will add you.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *exodus1500*
> 
> I am wondering if you guys could take a minute and look at my temps, I am not sure they are normal. here is my temp readings from aquasuite. I am concerned by the spikes, they drop down pretty quickly, but I am worried that I might not be making full contact between my water block and processor, which is naked.
> 
> These spikes are just running normal operations, like opening browsers, looking at a video, etc.
> 
> I am still able to OC it to around 4.6Ghz at around 80* in prime, though, so I am not sure.
> 
> My setup is a naked 4770k with a Bitspower Summit water block.
> 
> THANKS!!!!


Run full load and monitor the temps idle won't tell us anything.


----------



## jsx821

Crappy CPU


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

OH BOY!!!!!!!! Just an Update, The 4770K is naked AND 10 degrees cooler than after the initial Delid!!!



This is just an update. I know I am not sending the required info, but I haven't changed anything other than dropping substantial temps, making them more stable and even across the cores, and the ambient temp is approximately 5c warmer.. I can't help the Korean weather unfortunately.

Have a good day and Happy Delidding to All!!! (I am addicted, flat out)


----------



## MaKe OuT

I am thinking about doing this even though I am voltage limited (so not to push OC higher, just temps cooler) as the summer months are coming and it will be getting hot folding all day. Delidding cold help keep my room a little cooler.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> I am thinking about doing this even though I am voltage limited (so not to push OC higher, just temps cooler) as the summer months are coming and it will be getting hot folding all day. Delidding cold help keep my room a little cooler.


Colder means it last longer... I think I am voltage locked as well. I tried my hardest to get stable at 4.6 and just kept feeding it more, and it didn't care, just kept shutting off. Maybe with the bare naked booty out there, we can find some hidden gold.


----------



## MaKe OuT

I have CLU and Gelid GC Extreme on hand. Once I throw everything into my new case (whenever the 760T will finally arrive) I think I will just fix this crappy TIM issue. I ain't got much to lose. If I screw it up, I buy a new chip to replace this dud. And, if I am lucky, Haswell refresh will work on this Z87 board. Who knows, maybe I should break the chip, sell the board, and go Z97 all together.


----------



## White Wind

Hi, I'm gonna delid and watercool a 4670k and I'd like to know what's the best way to go ( temps-wise ). The infos I can find contradict themselves so I don't know what to do and what will be the coolest :

- CLU between die/IHS and CLU between IHS/block ?
- CLU between die/IHS and prowled thermal grease between IHS/block ?
- prowled thermal grease between die/IHS and CLU between IHS/block ?
- prowled thermal grease between die/IHS and prowled thermal grease between IHS/block ?
- CLU between die/block ( no IHS )
- prowled thermal grease between die/block ( no IHS )

..assuming the grease chosen is the best of its kind.

I would have thought there'd be a consensus on that question, but it seems that not... even amongst tests the results go both way
So I prefer to ask


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> I am thinking about doing this even though I am voltage limited (so not to push OC higher, just temps cooler) as the summer months are coming and it will be getting hot folding all day. Delidding cold help keep my room a little cooler.


That was also why I delidded my 3570k. When summer came around, it started crashing. It only needed +0.005 or +0.010 V more Vcore, but it was enough to make me flip out and delid.









You are by the way mistaken about the room getting colder. It's overall the same amount of heat being produced inside your room. The PC will still pull the same amount of power and all of that gets turned into heat. After the delid, it just gets put a little bit faster into your room than previously.


----------



## inedenimadam

Your processor does not dump less heat into your room unless you are also able to use less voltage, it simply means that you are pulling that heat away from your processor quicker. The air around you heats up just the same.


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> That was also why I delidded my 3570k. When summer came around, it started crashing. It only needed +0.005 or +0.010 V more Vcore, but it was enough to make me flip out and delid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are by the way mistaken about the room getting colder. It's overall the same amount of heat being produced inside your room. The PC will still pull the same amount of power and all of that gets turned into heat. After the delid, it just gets put a little bit faster into your room than previously.


ahhh, you are correct! i can't believe i said that.







I know better. smh. I'm going to need to buy a chiller for just the cpu room haha.


----------



## White Wind

I hope my question won't get burried x) ..oh well mignt as well open a new thread
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> I'm going to need to buy a chiller for just the cpu room haha.


I had myself a nasty thought crossing my mind, that was to dig a hole in the wall to push the rad heat into the other room haha... hem


----------



## MaKe OuT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> Hi, I'm gonna delid and watercool a 4670k and I'd like to know what's the best way to go ( temps-wise ). The infos I can find contradict themselves so I don't know what to do and what will be the coolest :
> 
> - CLU between die/IHS and CLU between IHS/block ?
> - CLU between die/IHS and prowled thermal grease between IHS/block ?
> - prowled thermal grease between die/IHS and CLU between IHS/block ?
> - prowled thermal grease between die/IHS and prowled thermal grease between IHS/block ?
> - CLU between die/block ( no IHS )
> - prowled thermal grease between die/block ( no IHS )
> 
> ..assuming the grease chosen is the best of its kind.
> 
> I would have thought there'd be a consensus on that question, but it seems that not... even amongst tests the results go both way
> So I prefer to ask


AFAIK folks cannot say anything beyond this: metallic (CLU for example) die/ihs and any decent TIM paste ihs/block works quite well. you could use CLP for die/ihs but it is harder to clean off if. It seems the CLU/metallics or CLP work best for die/ihs.
CLU and Naked may work best as long as your block is making good contact with die.

HTH, not really sure what else you are asking for?


----------



## White Wind

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MaKe OuT*
> 
> HTH, not really sure what else you are asking for?


Nothing else than that, just trying to know what people think about it







get opinions, maybe hear about experiences..

just like you did, thank you


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> I would have thought there'd be a consensus on that question, but it seems that not... even amongst tests the results go both way
> So I prefer to ask


There is consensus. It's all written in the first post.

The Intel stock paste isn't so bad. Replacing with another paste does not result in significant temp drop. It's the liquid metallic formulas that allow Ivy/Haswell to transfer heat similarly as soldered chips.

However, maybe surprisingly, liquid metal isn't so super between IHS and block. Well it's good, but not worth the clean-up. You see, sometimes CLU can be absorbed into the copper surface of the block. Not on the IHS because it is nickel.

So long story short: CLU on die, grease on block.


----------



## inedenimadam

Its been a year since I put CLP/CLU on...which one was the one that has better performance? I think I had Ultra, but cant remember...and I lost my tube somewhere.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> There is consensus. It's all written in the first post.
> 
> The Intel stock paste isn't so bad. Replacing with another paste does not result in significant temp drop. It's the liquid metallic formulas that allow Ivy/Haswell to transfer heat similarly as soldered chips.
> 
> However, maybe surprisingly, liquid metal isn't so super between IHS and block. Well it's good, but not worth the clean-up. You see, sometimes CLU can be absorbed into the copper surface of the block. Not on the IHS because it is nickel.
> 
> So long story short: CLU on die, grease on block.


Thank you, people never look in the original information anymore


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> OH BOY!!!!!!!! Just an Update, The 4770K is naked AND 10 degrees cooler than after the initial Delid!!!
> 
> 
> 
> This is just an update. I know I am not sending the required info, but I haven't changed anything other than dropping substantial temps, making them more stable and even across the cores, and the ambient temp is approximately 5c warmer.. I can't help the Korean weather unfortunately.
> 
> Have a good day and Happy Delidding to All!!! (I am addicted, flat out)


I'm Korean too. What are you doing over there? Teaching English? Lol. (that's what most of my friends have done)
Temps look pretty good. What was your vcore? I'm thinking about going bare die, but I don't mind 4.6hz @ 70C at full load.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> I'm Korean too. What are you doing over there? Teaching English? Lol. (that's what most of my friends have done)
> Temps look pretty good. What was your vcore? I'm thinking about going bare die, but I don't mind 4.6hz @ 70C at full load.


I am here with the military.

I am sitting at 1.315v-1.320v right now. It seems that some days it wants a sip more than others, so I usually leave it at 1.32 and let it be happy. I haven't made it to 4.6 stable as of yet, but I am going to try again soon.


----------



## jsx821

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I am here with the military.
> 
> I am sitting at 1.315v-1.320v right now. It seems that some days it wants a sip more than others, so I usually leave it at 1.32 and let it be happy. I haven't made it to 4.6 stable as of yet, but I am going to try again soon.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I am here with the military.
> 
> I am sitting at 1.315v-1.320v right now. It seems that some days it wants a sip more than others, so I usually leave it at 1.32 and let it be happy. I haven't made it to 4.6 stable as of yet, but I am going to try again soon.


I'm curious to see what your voltages are at 4.6. Looks like we have the same chip.


----------



## White Wind

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> There is consensus. It's all written in the first post.
> 
> The Intel stock paste isn't so bad. Replacing with another paste does not result in significant temp drop. It's the liquid metallic formulas that allow Ivy/Haswell to transfer heat similarly as soldered chips.
> 
> However, maybe surprisingly, liquid metal isn't so super between IHS and block. Well it's good, but not worth the clean-up. You see, sometimes CLU can be absorbed into the copper surface of the block. Not on the IHS because it is nickel.
> 
> So long story short: CLU on die, grease on block.


Thank you very much for the explanations. I'm still curious to see how "(die) CLU (IHS) grease (copper block)" compare to "(die) CLU (nickel block)" without the IHS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thank you, people never look in the original information anymore


Aw I'm sorry OP, 'till later yesterday I just didn't realise that CLU meant Coollab Liquid Ultra (..duh) and then missed to understand that part about liquid metal in the first post. By all means don't feel like your work isn't appreciated, as it is really helpful and makes things easier and safer, especially for noobs


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> Thank you very much for the explanations. I'm still curious to see how "(die) CLU (IHS) grease (copper block)" compare to "(die) CLU (nickel block)" without the IHS.


It will depend on several factors of course. If you are curious enough, you can read SonDa5's posts, early on in the thread. He did direct-die and showed temps for various situations.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Its been a year since I put CLP/CLU on...which one was the one that has better performance? I think I had Ultra, but cant remember...and I lost my tube somewhere.


People report both, CLP better or CLU better. What's better might change depending on the temperatures. It might depend on how it was applied exactly, the amount of it, how the cooler is mounted etc., random differences.

I think somewhere I've seen the numbers Coolaboratory themselves mention for thermal conductivity of their products and CLU had slightly better numbers.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> People report both, CLP better or CLU better. What's better might change depending on the temperatures. It might depend on how it was applied exactly, the amount of it, how the cooler is mounted etc., random differences.
> 
> I think somewhere I've seen the numbers Coolaboratory themselves mention for thermal conductivity of their products and CLU had slightly better numbers.


the delta is so small between the two when compared to the 25c reduction vs stock.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> Thank you very much for the explanations. I'm still curious to see how "(die) CLU (IHS) grease (copper block)" compare to "(die) CLU (nickel block)" without the IHS.
> Aw I'm sorry OP, 'till later yesterday I just didn't realise that CLU meant Coollab Liquid Ultra (..duh) and then missed to understand that part about liquid metal in the first post. By all means don't feel like your work isn't appreciated, as it is really helpful and makes things easier and safer, especially for noobs


Thank you very much, sorry sometimes feels like peeps don't read the stuffs anymore


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> People report both, CLP better or CLU better. What's better might change depending on the temperatures. It might depend on how it was applied exactly, the amount of it, how the cooler is mounted etc., random differences.
> 
> I think somewhere I've seen the numbers Coolaboratory themselves mention for thermal conductivity of their products and CLU had slightly better numbers.
> 
> 
> 
> the delta is so small between the two when compared to the 25c reduction vs stock.
Click to expand...

Thank you both. I am going to order some ultra. I couldnt find my tube when I was cleaning my loop, and ended up putting EK tim that comes with the GPU blocks on it. Temps are about 10C higher, and I had to bump voltage +.012 to stabilize again. Voltage/Temps are a dirty little cycle.


----------



## White Wind

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sorry sometimes feels like peeps don't read the stuffs anymore


Np







and saddly that's true. Though I admit I may have lost some patience myself, it is now more than one year that I'm planning my build haha ( and doing it on a really crappy comp







) I didn't even know what a cpu is x) .. Really want to be part of it ! post my numbers here and on ocn, and do all those things







You guys are inspiring ^_^

Okay so I will do direct-to-die cooling with CLU and an EK copper block and its PreciseMount kit.. since I'm headed towards high-end cooling ( Phobya 1260 for cpu + SLI ) might as well go full for it, as direct-die will yield better temps. Even if it could be hard to clean the CLU off of the copper block afterwards, that's no biggie as I want to stick with copper blocks within my loop.
I'll just be careful as hell when processing.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> Okay so I will do direct-to-die cooling with CLU and an EK copper block and its PreciseMount kit..


I wish someone would have made this suggestion before I went direct die-->CLU :

Go with a nickel block. The pricing is only a little more, you will not experience the same staining that many of us here have. The CLU is almost impossible to get off of copper, I had to sand mine off to get it clean. I dont believe you will notice any temperature difference, but it might be worth not having the cleaning headache later.


----------



## White Wind

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I wish someone would have made this suggestion before I went direct die-->CLU


Well, I think that was curiosity and..just luck that made me know about that... rather lucky on this one








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Go with a nickel block.
> you will not experience the same staining that many of us here have
> it might be worth not having the cleaning headache later.


Well, if it's just about getting stains and having to sand, I don't think that would bother me that much, plus I won't be dismounting the block from the cpu until I've decided to upgrade it ( or should I, for maintenance purpose ? )

You said you can't tell if yours was CLP or CLU.. maybe that was CLP which is known to be the one hard to clean ?

And you're probably right about temps difference between copper and nickel, I can't tell myself, that's just that it is said that copper is a better conductor, and if I chose nickel I would have to go nickel on my gpu's too.. maybe the few degrees will be there when considering the whole loop.. I don't know

EDIT: oh, the "suggestion" you were talking about is the one you made about nickel block lol.. okay got it now x)


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> Well, I think that was curiosity and..just luck that made me know about that... rather lucky on this one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, if it's just about getting stains and having to sand, I don't think that would bother me that much, plus I won't be dismounting the block from the cpu until I've decided to upgrade it ( or should I, for maintenance purpose ? )
> 
> You said you can't tell if yours was CLP or CLU.. maybe that was CLP which is known to be the one hard to clean ?
> 
> And you're probably right about temps difference between copper and nickel, I can't tell myself, that's just that it is said that copper is a better conductor, and if I chose nickel I would have to go nickel on my gpu's too.. maybe the few degrees will be there when considering the whole loop.. I don't know
> 
> EDIT: oh, the "suggestion" you were talking about is the one you made about nickel block lol.. okay got it now x)


Just gonna throw my







in here:

The reason that BOTH CLU and CLP stain the copper is that the Gallium (that's the metal) in the CLP/U is actually absorbed by the copper. In time (and it's not a consistent amount of time, as the different alloys of copper used will absorb the gallium at different rates), the gallium is no longer actually making a proper bond as a TIM between the two surfaces and the temps will start to rise because of it. So from my own experiences with this, I will only use a "normal" TIM when doing a direct die mount and an unplated copper block, and in all honesty, i do the same for the plated blocks if direct die. I would only recommend the Coolabs TIMs if you are going to put the IHS back on, not for a naked die. Going naked die will benefit you more temps than using the CLP/U as a TIM in this situation, in naked die the CLP/U might net you an extra 1c, maybe 2c. But for how long?

And remember, the block is copper, even if it's nickel plated, it's still copper, the plating is VERY thin, so there isn't a temp difference between the plain copper block and the nickel plated copper block.


----------



## White Wind

Good post thanks ! I wasn't aware at all that the TIM bond could suffer as well. So okay, no full copper + CLU on a naked die.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Going naked die will benefit you more temps than using the CLP/U as a TIM in this situation


There, you mean that going "naked-die + grease" will get me higher temps than "naked-die + CLU", right ?..( I'm not a native english speaker sorry )
Or maybe you meant "naked-die + grease" not as good as "IHS on + CLU".. I wonder about it now.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> And remember, the block is copper, even if it's nickel plated, it's still copper, the plating is VERY thin, so there isn't a temp difference between the plain copper block and the nickel plated copper block.


Ow I thought that when we were talking about nickel blocks it was about full nickel blocks... so plated blocks are not plated just on the upside lol.. okay got it x)
That may be the way to go for me then. But in my radiator, the tubes will be made from copper, do I risk any corrosion if I opt for nickel-plated copper blocks ?
Now to see if EK make nickel-plated copper blocks, I'm to check that


----------



## MrStrat007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> Good post thanks ! I wasn't aware at all that the TIM bond could suffer as well. So okay, no full copper + CLU on a naked die.
> There, you mean that going "naked-die + grease" will get me higher temps than "naked-die + CLU", right ?..( I'm not a native english speaker sorry )
> Or maybe you meant "naked-die + grease" not as good as "IHS on + CLU".. I wonder about it now.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Ow I thought that when we were talking about nickel blocks it was about full nickel blocks... so plated blocks are not plated just on the upside lol.. okay got it x)
> That may be the way to go for me then. But in my radiator, the tubes will be made from copper, do I risk any corrosion if I opt for nickel-plated copper blocks ?
> Now to see if EK make nickel-plated copper blocks, I'm to check that


Naked die + normal TIM/grease will give temps maybe 1-2C higher than naked+CLP/U. Naked die itself with any TIM is only a few degrees C cooler than IHS+ CLU/P.

However, iff using the ihs, clu/p will give better temps (~5-20C) than using normal TIM on die without suffering from "pump out effect".


----------



## White Wind

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrStrat007*
> 
> Naked die + normal TIM/grease will give temps maybe 1-2C higher than naked+CLP/U. Naked die itself with any TIM is only a few degrees C cooler than IHS+ CLU/P.
> 
> However, iff using the ihs, clu/p will give better temps (~5-20C) than using normal TIM on die without suffering from "pump out effect".


I couldn't hope for a better input lol.. thank you ^_^ I have a couple more questions if you don't mind

So normal TIM on naked die can too be pumped out when in contact with copper ?

And if I go naked die + CLU + nickel-plated block ( so no pump out effect there ), would my loop suffer from corrosion? as the tubes in my radiator will be made from copper..
If yes and if I go that way, would there be something I could add in the loop to prevent/counteract that corrosion ?

Which way would you go ?lol ..I'll just take on your advice and be done with it ^_^ ..and stop the endless talk haha. But nevertheless big thanks ! ( again ) it is appreciated


----------



## deepor

That "pump out" stuff has nothing to do with copper or nickel or whatever. It's just that some thermal paste products don't stay where you've put it on such a tiny area like the die. The temperature changes and pressure make it move away. It gets squeezed out at the sides over time. You need to use a paste where people reported they had no problems. I think Arctic MX-4 might be good? or Noctua NT-H1? I don't remember really.


----------



## MrStrat007

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *White Wind*
> 
> I couldn't hope for a better input lol.. thank you ^_^ I have a couple more questions if you don't mind
> 
> So normal TIM on naked die can too be pumped out when in contact with copper ?
> 
> And if I go naked die + CLU + nickel-plated block ( so no pump out effect there ), would my loop suffer from corrosion? as the tubes in my radiator will be made from copper..
> If yes and if I go that way, would there be something I could add in the loop to prevent/counteract that corrosion ?
> 
> Which way would you go ?lol ..I'll just take on your advice and be done with it ^_^ ..and stop the endless talk haha. But nevertheless big thanks ! ( again ) it is appreciated


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> That "pump out" stuff has nothing to do with copper or nickel or whatever. It's just that some thermal paste products don't stay where you've put it on such a tiny area like the die. The temperature changes and pressure make it move away. It gets squeezed out at the sides over time. You need to use a paste where people reported they had no problems. I think Arctic MX-4 might be good? or Noctua NT-H1? I don't remember really.


Like Deepor said, Pump-out is usually seen when using normal TIM or grease between the die and IHS. It is caused by the clamping pressure and thermal cycling of the cpu causing minute expansion/contractions of the TIM itself. Over time, this causes the TIM to shift, effectively "pumping out" from on top of the die, reducing contact with the IHS. This isn't caused by any particular metal, and if you wait for a few of the guys who run naked die, I'm sure they will post with their favourite TIM's for naked die operation and their experiences with them.

iirc The only corrosion you would get with naked+CLU+nickel would be if the CLU got through the plating to the copper base, at which point you have the same thing happen as using a pure copper block. There are corrosion inhibitors for your loop, such as Mayhems product and various standalone options, BUT they are more to prevent the effects of mixed metals in the same loop. Even if you used an all-copper cpu block, CLU would not affect your loop, only your block.

However, given the tiny temperature differences, if you choose to go bare die I would just use a regular TIM like MX4 of NT-H1, etc. and not worry about using the CLU/P. More peace of mind, basically the same performance, and less to worry about


----------



## Clexzor

i7 4770k delid results 3332Bxxx costa rica

only had time to test lower clocks atm...

4.5ghz/4.2ghz 1.22v load 1.229v/uncore v 1.17v adaptive both--

SA-+ 0.180v
IO- + 0.100v

8gb 2400mhz 1.65v

msi gd65

delided with CLU using tightening method.

max temp on IXT for almost 6 hours 58c

max temp gaming so far 47c


----------



## White Wind

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> That "pump out" stuff has nothing to do with copper or nickel or whatever. It's just that some thermal paste products don't stay where you've put it on such a tiny area like the die. The temperature changes and pressure make it move away. It gets squeezed out at the sides over time. You need to use a paste where people reported they had no problems. I think Arctic MX-4 might be good? or Noctua NT-H1? I don't remember really.


Oh okay I mixed up that pump out effect with the fact that copper may absorb gallium, my bad.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrStrat007*
> 
> iirc The only corrosion you would get with naked+CLU+nickel would be if the CLU got through the plating to the copper base, at which point you have the same thing happen as using a pure copper block. There are corrosion inhibitors for your loop, such as Mayhems product and various standalone options, BUT they are more to prevent the effects of mixed metals in the same loop. Even if you used an all-copper cpu block, CLU would not affect your loop, only your block.
> 
> However, given the tiny temperature differences, if you choose to go bare die I would just use a regular TIM like MX4 of NT-H1, etc. and not worry about using the CLU/P. More peace of mind, basically the same performance, and less to worry about


Phew okay ! I've learnt some, that's good, thanks. I'm heading that way so ! And now I can tell I know why







Will dig around a bit to see what paste people use for that job.
Thank you again guys !


----------



## Jugurnot

Hey guys, going to delid soon but all I can get my hands on is some GELID Extreme paste. Anything I need to consider when using this compound?


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Hey guys, going to delid soon but all I can get my hands on is some GELID Extreme paste. Anything I need to consider when using this compound?


Nope, that is one of the premier standard cooling pastes on the market, it is the only stuff I will use anymore, even on a delid between the die and IHS, it's only a degree or two worse than clp/u in that situation, but without the headaches of using the coolabs product.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Hey guys, going to delid soon but all I can get my hands on is some GELID Extreme paste. Anything I need to consider when using this compound?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Nope, that is one of the premier standard cooling pastes on the market, it is the only stuff I will use anymore, even on a delid between the die and IHS, it's only a degree or two worse than clp/u in that situation, but without the headaches of using the coolabs product.


What he said







Just remember a little goes a long way.

Pretty sure it's non-conductive and has no break in time. If EK lists it in their instruction manuals, it's probably pretty good


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Nope, that is one of the premier standard cooling pastes on the market, it is the only stuff I will use anymore, even on a delid between the die and IHS, it's only a degree or two worse than clp/u in that situation, but without the headaches of using the coolabs product.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> What he said
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just remember a little goes a long way.
> 
> Pretty sure it's non-conductive and has no break in time. If EK lists it in their instruction manuals, it's probably pretty good


Thanks guys! hitting the confirm order button.


----------



## mr sadistics

guys im running this



this chip its good candidate for delidded ???? im try to reach at least 4.9 ghz! whit low temps , im stuning on 4-8 1.260 vcore and 1.586 PPL.

im wondering if i got nice chip or commun one!

sorry for my bad english!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mr sadistics*
> 
> guys im running this
> 
> 
> 
> this chip its good candidate for delidded ???? im try to reach at least 4.9 ghz! whit low temps , im stuning on 4-8 1.260 vcore and 1.586 PPL.
> 
> im wondering if i got nice chip or commun one!
> 
> sorry for my bad english!


try 1.33 vcore and run ibt try to kmeep temps under 90-95 for that quick run. Good luck!


----------



## tpwilko08

Can join the club lol...

Successful 3770k Delid using the vice method only no wood or hammer would recommend this way to anyone only took a couple of minutes...

Using CLP on die and antec 7 diamond on IHS

Load On prime 95..1 hour

Temp before delid at 5.0Ghz 1.3v load 88c max

After Delid at 5.0Ghz 1.3v load 62c max could may go lower with the volts but not tried yet as happy with these temps.

Temp Drop 26c

http://valid.x86.fr/8ckbpm


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Can join the club lol...
> 
> Successful 3770k Delid using the vice method only no wood or hammer would recommend this way to anyone only took a couple of minutes...
> 
> Using CLP on die and antec 7 diamond on IHS
> 
> Load On prime 95..1 hour
> 
> Temp before delid at 5.0Ghz 1.3v load 88c max
> 
> After Delid at 5.0Ghz 1.3v load 62c max could may go lower with the volts but not tried yet as happy with these temps.
> 
> Temp Drop 26c
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/8ckbpm


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## KeepWalkinG

The new Haswell Refresh comes with the same IHS problem?

Or will we have to do for them Delidded Club topic


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KeepWalkinG*
> 
> The new Haswell Refresh comes with the same IHS problem?
> 
> Or will we have to do for them Delidded Club topic


Depends as they say they are going to use a better Tim so that means they are listening to what we have here and have been doing! This club finally did what it was truly meant for!

I truly Thank each and every person in this club taking the risk to improve your own hardware let's keep this going!

-Val


----------



## blackmagic12345

OCN name: blackmagic12345
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: Noctua NH-H1
IHS TIM: same as on die (heh all I had handy XD)
MHZ gained: 100
OC after delid: 4.8 GHz (finally stable)
Temp drops: 20°C

Wtb membership, I'm gonna edit this post as soon as I hit 2hrs in prime so I can add cpu-z screens

Pics of delid process:









[/URL]


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mr sadistics*
> 
> guys im running this
> 
> 
> 
> this chip its good candidate for delidded ???? im try to reach at least 4.9 ghz! whit low temps , im stuning on 4-8 1.260 vcore and 1.586 PPL.
> 
> im wondering if i got nice chip or commun one!
> 
> sorry for my bad english!


asrock z77 - which board is this?

Some of them are known to give significantly higher voltage than you set (to the chip and to sensor displays) so you can set 1.25, have it show 1.25 at load, yet it can be like 1.32 for example - or 1.45vcore set, going to 1.6

just making you aware if you are not already - many "good" chips turned out to just be being overvolted enough to gain a couple hundred mhz by the boards and it can be dangerous if you're using higher volts.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blackmagic12345*
> 
> OCN name: blackmagic12345
> CPU: 3770K
> On-die TIM: Noctua NH-H1
> IHS TIM: same as on die (heh all I had handy XD)
> MHZ gained: 100
> OC after delid: 4.8 GHz (finally stable)
> Temp drops: 20°C
> 
> Wtb membership, I'm gonna edit this post as soon as I hit 2hrs in prime so I can add cpu-z screens
> 
> Pics of delid process:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/URL]


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## mr sadistics

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> asrock z77 - which board is this?
> 
> Some of them are known to give significantly higher voltage than you set (to the chip and to sensor displays) so you can set 1.25, have it show 1.25 at load, yet it can be like 1.32 for example - or 1.45vcore set, going to 1.6
> 
> just making you aware if you are not already - many "good" chips turned out to just be being overvolted enough to gain a couple hundred mhz by the boards and it can be dangerous if you're using higher volts.


the board its fatality z77 profesional in bios setting 1.260 volts! i read about that u said! i dont have multimeter to read volts! but u said my voltajes can up! from 1.260 to 1.45v its scared! im think of 1.320 for max vcore! i can confirm its z77 profesional got the same bug a z77 ex4

temps in gaming dont reach even 60 degrees 50 - 55 ! what u think ? im gonna delideed today or tomorrow!

thanks sorry for my b english


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mr sadistics*
> 
> the board its fatality z77 profesional in bios setting 1.260 volts! i read about that u said! i dont have multimeter to read volts! but u said my voltajes can up! from 1.260 to 1.45v its scared! im think of 1.320 for max vcore! i can confirm its z77 profesional got the same bug a z77 ex4
> 
> temps in gaming dont reach even 60 degrees 50 - 55 ! what u think ? im gonna delideed today or tomorrow!
> 
> thanks sorry for my b english


It probably won't increase that much even if the board is bugged. 1.32v is not dangerous on Ivy Bridge

It's just the case, some people get a cpu and they need to use say like 1.34v to get 4.7ghz, and then they run it in an asrock z77 board and they put in 1.27v and it works, they think the board is amazing but in reality it's just being secretly overvolted, with the types of volts people set with delid (think like 1.4-1.5) it can be way more dangerous then


----------



## IMKR

are ivy and haswell the only chips worth deliding?


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMKR*
> 
> are ivy and haswell the only chips worth deliding?


Pretty much, dunno about the new haswell.


----------



## welshy46

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMKR*
> 
> are ivy and haswell the only chips worth deliding?


ivy and Has well are the current unruly hot heads from Intel, but any CPU that isn't soldered to the IHS could see a benefit from delidding and rpasting with some higher quality thermal paste/liquid metal.
. Maybe not to the levels you benefit from delidding the latest Intel chips, but as they say. Every little helps.


----------



## tpwilko08

Whats peoples load temps after delidding on each individual core?

mine seem to vary a bit between cores

54c
58c
62c
59c

does this seem normal?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Whats peoples load temps after delidding on each individual core?
> 
> mine seem to vary a bit between cores
> 
> 54c
> 58c
> 62c
> 59c
> 
> does this seem normal?


Very normal.

Before I delided mine had a difference of 15c at times. They just never are in sync temperature wise.

What tim did you use on die? And ihs?


----------



## GaMbi2004

8 degree difference isnt unusual, and I wouldn't worry about it.
I got lucky with mine and only see 2-3 degrees difference between hottest and coldest (under load)


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Very normal.
> 
> Before I delided mine had a difference of 15c at times. They just never are in sync temperature wise.
> 
> What tim did you use on die? And ihs?


I used clp on the die and antec diamond 7 on the ihs. Not that am complaining about the temps just thought it was strange.

this is at 5ghz 1.31 volts.


----------



## Zyzzyx

9/10 of the TIM on my new 4770k was outside the die, sorry for the lighting but there was barely any left on the die. Last pic is the Liquid Ultra, and I can't wait to hook up the water loop to make sure it still works. I highly recommend the vise method, if a klutz like me can do it.


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyzzyx*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 9/10 of the TIM on my new 4770k was outside the die, sorry for the lighting but there was barely any left on the die. Last pic is the Liquid Ultra, and I can't wait to hook up the water loop to make sure it still works. I highly recommend the vise method, if a klutz like me can do it.


Did you use the vise only without wood or hammer?


----------



## Zyzzyx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> Did you use the vise only without wood or hammer?


Sorry, nope! That thing was oooon there. I used a regular hammer and a fairly small piece of wood. Maybe a 1x1 piece about a foot and a half long. I had to hit pretty dang hard before it broke free.


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyzzyx*
> 
> Sorry, nope! That thing was oooon there. I used a regular hammer and a fairly small piece of wood. Maybe a 1x1 piece about a foot and a half long. I had to hit pretty dang hard before it broke free.


I did it the vise only way, turned the cpu upside down had one of the sides of the vise on the pcb and the other on the ihs and turned it till it popped off worked a treat. I had a test cpu that i bought for £3 lol and did it on that first.....


----------



## blackmagic12345

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tpwilko08*
> 
> I did it the vise only way, turned the cpu upside down had one of the sides of the vise on the pcb and the other on the ihs and turned it till it popped off worked a treat. I had a test cpu that i bought for £3 lol and did it on that first.....


good.
from first timer to first timer, a practice chip is always a good thing.
a few tips:
make sure that you dont grip it from the base, theres a protrusion closer to the PCB, do not grip it there. Grip it from the top of the IHS
Contrary to popular assumption, force is required. I tapped mine a little, and all i did was damage the IHS and make it so i had to use a dremel to mirror it. It damaged my NH-D14 cooler a little too...
DO NOT GLUE THE IHS BACK ON. RESOCKET THE CHIP WITH THE IHS LOOSE. make sure it is centered, but do not glue it. The best way is to just put the chip in the socket without the IHS, then proceed to putting TIM on and then and only then putting the IHS back on. When you close the socket, press down on the IHS hard enough so it doesnt move and clip the whole thing in the socket. Then, slap ya cooler on and go crazy with OC. I got mine to 4.8 with a crapload of headroom without a problem.

Good luck and dont break the glass.


----------



## Etaloche

Delidded 4770K that was destroyed due to bad power supply.
I delidded this 4770K about a month ago and have been putting together my build for a bit now.
A bad PSU took out my mobo, fan controller, and CPU.

The mobo I bought didn't work so took it back to NCIX and upon inspection the employee pointed out a black spot on the PCB.
Upon closer inspection inside I could see that the die was scorched in multiple places and the CPU was dead.

I contacted Intel about it. They asked me some info on the CPU like S/N and etc. within 4 hours of setting up a RMA ticket a representative gave me a call about my credit card info.
I chose the cross shipping method wich was they send me a new chip with $25 expense for shipping it to me and prepaid post to ship the bad unit back to them also a deposit for the price of the CPU in case I didn't ship back the bad one.
I had a new 4770K at my door steps within 24 hours. Best customer service yet! I simply epoxyed the CPU back together and shipped it back to them.
Within 2 days I got an email saying they received my CPU and that the refund process was already in progress.
They never asked me about delidding and never asked me a thing once the CPU was back with them.

Once the new CPU arrived I delidded it once more and put it back in my build.

Here you can see the burnt area on the die



And under the PCB



There was even a fracture on the die after I cleaned it up for inspection.



New CPU!



I used the razor method last time but decided to use the vice method this time. It was easier, faster, and less messy.
Hand was so shacky after hammering at the CPU that I couldn't take a steady photo haha



All cleaned up



Ready to go back into the build. Used liquid pro as TIM



Almost finished build







Just need the PSU to come back from RMA as well.



Unfortunately I won't be able to see how much the temp dropped on this chip after delidding as I was never able to check the temps before delidding.


----------



## Clexzor

^^^ mean PSU ;]

glad you got it worked out man!!! intel rma is speedy!!!


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clexzor*
> 
> ^^^ mean PSU ;]
> 
> glad you got it worked out man!!! intel rma is speedy!!!


I hope so too. I need to either send a 3770k back, possibly.. any idea how to run one through the paces to figure out if the problem is the MoBo or the CPU? I have another thread trying to figure out why Little Brother is shutting down constantly with no BSOD.


----------



## Clexzor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I hope so too. I need to either send a 3770k back, possibly.. any idea how to run one through the paces to figure out if the problem is the MoBo or the CPU? I have another thread trying to figure out why Little Brother is shutting down constantly with no BSOD.


really the only way to know for sure if its the mobo or the cpu is to get another mobo or try a buddys pc if he has the same chipset...you could also buy a board localy test it out and return it...







ive done this before you gotta do what you gotta do lol


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clexzor*
> 
> really the only way to know for sure if its the mobo or the cpu is to get another mobo or try a buddys pc if he has the same chipset...you could also buy a board localy test it out and return it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ive done this before you gotta do what you gotta do lol


something that was a possibility... I pulled the 24 pin off of Big Brother, jumping Little brothers PSU, and connected Big to Little.... (couldn't pull the 8 pin form either system without remove radiators and fans).. let it run for 30 minutes, which is the most I have been able to get in 3 days...

another user suggested a short, said it could be grounding out.. what I found was 100 times dumber than that.. the 24 pin rto the PSU was about 1/2way out, hidden under all the other wires.. I think that may have been the issue.. putting everything together now to test it out and see what happens.

So frustrating to have it run for a month and something silly bring down the whole system. LOL.


----------



## Clexzor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> something that was a possibility... I pulled the 24 pin off of Big Brother, jumping Little brothers PSU, and connected Big to Little.... (couldn't pull the 8 pin form either system without remove radiators and fans).. let it run for 30 minutes, which is the most I have been able to get in 3 days...
> 
> another user suggested a short, said it could be grounding out.. what I found was 100 times dumber than that.. the 24 pin rto the PSU was about 1/2way out, hidden under all the other wires.. I think that may have been the issue.. putting everything together now to test it out and see what happens.
> 
> So frustrating to have it run for a month and something silly bring down the whole system. LOL.


lol its all good man....the little things can be the worst to troubleshoot....its not uncommon to here someone has rescently moved their pc after its been sittings for months only to have it not turn on right after moving...simply due to a connector barely making contact and the slightest movement cuased the connecton to be weak etc like in ur case the connector wasn't seated fully...


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Clexzor*
> 
> lol its all good man....the little things can be the worst to troubleshoot....its not uncommon to here someone has rescently moved their pc after its been sittings for months only to have it not turn on right after moving...simply due to a connector barely making contact and the slightest movement cuased the connecton to be weak etc like in ur case the connector wasn't seated fully...


I appreciate all of the users here that are so patient with helping people as these little things happen.. I was so panicked, as the reason Big Brother exists is because of a bad Mother Board for the Original Little Brother build.. lol I bought a new Mother Board and CPU (didn't have the Z77 boards in stock at the local Japanese electronic store).. quite a lot of money later, I have a far superior system and much happiness between the two.. Looking at a 3rd, but don't want to spend any more just yet...

Either way, back to the Delidding topic and also, considering taking the 3770k down the delid lane, but its temps are decent right now. maybe next month... :-D


----------



## Deaf Jam

Just did the delid by hammer and vice on my 3750K. Couldn't have been easier. Now waiting on some CLU. Using AS5 in the mean time with a decent temp drop under load. So close to 5 Ghz now.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Deaf Jam*
> 
> Just did the delid by hammer and vice on my 3750K. Couldn't have been easier. Now waiting on some CLU. Using AS5 in the mean time with a decent temp drop under load. So close to 5 Ghz now.


Im curious, what kind of numbers exactly have you got using as5?


----------



## Deaf Jam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Im curious, what kind of numbers exactly have you got using as5?


7 C under load at 1.385 volts at 4.8 ghz under water.


----------



## Zyzzyx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Deaf Jam*
> 
> 7 C under load at 1.385 volts at 4.8 ghz under water.


Do you live in Antarctica?


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyzzyx*
> 
> Do you live in Antarctica?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Deaf Jam*
> 
> 7 C under load at 1.385 volts at 4.8 ghz under water.


Quite certain what he meant was a 7 degree drop in temperature.


----------



## Deaf Jam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyzzyx*
> 
> Do you live in Antarctica?


Actually voltages are higher. Full of pain pills at the moment from kidney stones, so I got confused. 1.385 was for 4.7 Ghz. 1.435 is needed for 4.8 Ghz . Temps still decreased about 6-7C at 1.385 Ghz at 4.7 though. I don't know if I'm going to make it 5ghz for 24/7 running. I may have to settle at 4.9 Ghz to stay under 1.5 volts and 90C though. It just has to make it until the new 8 core comes out.

I was hoping my Sandy would have made it, it should have. Being under load all day every day for about two months combined with the occasional manual reset under load was too much. Lost a stick of 8gb ram and the CPU because of running stuff past my rams capacity makes for windows being unable to kill worker processes from Simulation CFD. The parent program closes on it's own. Rather annoying of Autodesk, although not surprising. I've waited over a day before without closure, so I just started to hit reset because I don't have days to wait to rerun what I need to run. Totally useless simulations as well, but that would require a few pages of ranting, and I'm trying to move on from that at this time. One month left until graduation and I can forget about it.

Anyhow, no, I live in southern Louisiana. I just have 2 560x140 rads and 2 360x180 rads in a well insulated and baffled box. So fans are cranked up since there are no sound penalities. The box was well worth the time to construct. 30 ft of tubing probably dissipates a bit of heat as well.


----------



## Deaf Jam

CLU was totally worth it.

At 1.375 volts and 4.6 ghz stock, temps reached 88C

At 1.435 volts and 4.8 ghz, temps reached 89C

At 1.435 volts and 4.8 ghz with Cool Laboratory Ultra, temps reached 70C.

All temps recorded under IBT using very high test settings for 5 passes. Highest temperature is as recorded by RealTemp. CLU is some awesome stuff.


----------



## kirb112

Thanks for the awesome guide! Please allow me into the club.

OCN name: *kirb112*
CPU: *i7 3770K*
on die-TIM: *CooLaboratory Liquid Pro*
ihs-TIM: *Arctic Silver 5. Will be replacing with CooLaboratory Liquid Pro*
Mhz gained: *No more OCing as of yet. Looking forward to doing it this week.*
OC after delid: *4.6GHz*
Temp drops: *Hottest core was 86C. After delidding, hottest core was 63C*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: *CPU-Z Validation Kirb112*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kirb112*
> 
> Thanks for the awesome guide! Please allow me into the club.
> 
> OCN name: *kirb112*
> CPU: *i7 3770K*
> on die-TIM: *CooLaboratory Liquid Pro*
> ihs-TIM: *Arctic Silver 5. Will be replacing with CooLaboratory Liquid Pro*
> Mhz gained: *No more OCing as of yet. Looking forward to doing it this week.*
> OC after delid: *4.6GHz*
> Temp drops: *Hottest core was 86C. After delidding, hottest core was 63C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: *CPU-Z Validation Kirb112*


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Henleyz

What do you all think of this at the moment?

i7 4770k
Noctua NH-D14
Clocked at 4.4ghz with the vcore at 1.145 and it's stable! (Using the thermal paste that came with the cooler)
Temps reach a maximum of 60c under load

Is this okay? I'm still going to delid I think when all my stuff arrive...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Henleyz*
> 
> What do you all think of this at the moment?
> 
> i7 4770k
> Noctua NH-D14
> Clocked at 4.4ghz with the vcore at 1.145 and it's stable! (Using the thermal paste that came with the cooler)
> Temps reach a maximum of 60c under load
> 
> Is this okay? I'm still going to delid I think when all my stuff arrive...


do it and see what you can really achieve!


----------



## nonomos

Delidding done! Never understood the hammer and block procedure so I went the razor way instead. Installed a a new cooler in the process as well, the H110.



Running a autoclock right now, it goes up to 4,2ish. Going for a manual later this week, but I am impressed, at 4,5 I guess it still should be able to keep it under 60c.

Thanks to this I can almost turn down my fans to 600-500rpm, it almost feels unreal!


----------



## welshy46

Why anyone would want to hit their CPU with a hamner is beyond me too. 20 seconds with a blade and the kobs done. No risk, no worries. Top job there


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *welshy46*
> 
> Why anyone would want to hit their CPU with a hamner is beyond me too. 20 seconds with a blade and the kobs done. No risk, no worries. Top job there


I've done it both ways, had no issues either way, although the vise & hammer went faster. I spent a few minutes being careful with the blade, the hammer method was about 20 seconds, also seemed less risky than the blade (a few destroyed the PCB with a blade, there have been less hammer fails).


----------



## funkyhunky

I have my 4770k, and I want to delid it. I am very good when it comes to precise, detailed tasks on a small scale and I have no doubts I can successfully remove an IHS with a razorblade. My only concern is: how often to chips actually go bad? What is the chance that a chip will burn out before the 3 year warranty is up, as I know that delidding voids the warranty

thanks


----------



## GaMbi2004

.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funkyhunky*
> 
> I have my 4770k, and I want to delid it. I am very good when it comes to precise, detailed tasks on a small scale and I have no doubts I can successfully remove an IHS with a razorblade. My only concern is: how often to chips actually go bad? What is the chance that a chip will burn out before the 3 year warranty is up, as I know that delidding voids the warranty
> 
> thanks


Depends on many things.. most chips will last over 3 years if taken care of properly..
OCing can shorten its lifespan, but delidding can potentially lengthen the life of the chip since it offers better cooling.
The warranty doesnt necessarily void when you delid.. we have had a few chips die after delidding, of other reasons than "a blade through the chip" or "a hammer made it fly into a wall", and was successfully accepted under warranty.
As long as the printing on top of the IHS matches the chip and you havent done any damage to the CPU, they should accept it under warranty.


----------



## welshy46

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> I've done it both ways, had no issues either way, although the vise & hammer went faster. I spent a few minutes being careful with the blade, the hammer method was about 20 seconds, also seemed less risky than the blade (a few destroyed the PCB with a blade, there have been less hammer fails).


True. I've seen people do some dumb things with blades, me included. I used a retractable blade knife. We call them Stanley knives. I believe Americans call them box cutters.Left about 10-15mm of blade showing so I couldn't cut in too deep into the CPU or my fingers. Slowly worked it round and lifted the IHS straight off. The glue is only around the to make room for the paste. A razor blade is too easy to cut too deep. That whole vice and hammer style for me just leaves too much room for error.


----------



## FtW 420

Whichever method someone is more comfortable with would probably be best, being nervous about doing it is probably the reason for at least some of the failed attempts with either method. Shaky hands while trying to keep the blade out of the PCB or while swinging the hammer could make things more difficult.


----------



## funkyhunky

I asked a intel rep via chat earlier today if delidding voids the warranty, he said removing the IHS would void the warranty.... I can post the text if u wanna read the chat log?

I'm the kind of guy that doesn't upgrade until my rig can no longer hold 20+ fps on current games, so my priority isn't overclocks but for the chip to last a good 5 years, I know low temps definitely help with that. what should be an acceptable max load temperature be if I'm interested in processor longevity? 80 C? I'm thinking that once I get the rest of my pc parts in the mail I will do some stress tests + overclock at 1.2 volts to see what temperatures I get with my Noctua D14 cooler...


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funkyhunky*
> 
> I have my 4770k, and I want to delid it. I am very good when it comes to precise, detailed tasks on a small scale and I have no doubts I can successfully remove an IHS with a razorblade. My only concern is: how often to chips actually go bad? What is the chance that a chip will burn out before the 3 year warranty is up, as I know that delidding voids the warranty
> 
> thanks


I've never seen a CPU fail for any other reason except for the blatantly obvious. "Oh look here, the inside of this tower looks like dust bunnies have been making babies in it for the last 10 years...I wonder why it overheated?"









Razor is my method of choice. I've done (3) 4770K, (1) 3770K, and my 3570K is next on the chopping block.



Just take extra care to avoid the voltage regulator. It is on the side of the chip with the arrow and gold dot.

Odds are the delid will increase life expectancy since voltage requirements usually come down as well as temps.

Several people in this thread have RMAd their chips after delidding. I think as long as you re-attach the IHS in a neat manner, you shouldn't have any issues.


----------



## funkyhunky

so if I delid, it works fine and something goes wonky a year down the line i should reattach the IHS with something like this? http://www.walmart.com/ip/Permatex-Ultra-Black-Hi-Temp-RTV-Silicone-Gasket-Maker/16777009

I am just an extreme engineer, I love modding my stuff so I think I am going to do this no matter what. Is the motherboard clip and heat sink sufficient in applying enough force to hold the IHS on without resealing? I will be using an Asus z87 PRO


----------



## blackmagic12345

A small tip to all that are thinking of delidding their ivy bridge using the ham!er and vice method: get some emery board beforehand. You will need to sand down the edges of your chip to achieve optimal performance as there is a very high chance of doing some slight damage to the IHS. Only do this if you are using a full steel vice with no padding on the edges. I slightly damaged my IHS delidding and after a good sanding, I dropped another 10°c while under full load. In other words, be careful when you delid.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funkyhunky*
> 
> so if I delid, it works fine and something goes wonky a year down the line i should reattach the IHS with something like this? http://www.walmart.com/ip/Permatex-Ultra-Black-Hi-Temp-RTV-Silicone-Gasket-Maker/16777009
> 
> I am just an extreme engineer, I love modding my stuff so I think I am going to do this no matter what. Is the motherboard clip and heat sink sufficient in applying enough force to hold the IHS on without resealing? I will be using an Asus z87 PRO


No, go find some Loctite Black Max glue, that stuff you listed is way to thick a substance for IHS.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funkyhunky*
> 
> so if I delid, it works fine and something goes wonky a year down the line i should reattach the IHS with something like this? http://www.walmart.com/ip/Permatex-Ultra-Black-Hi-Temp-RTV-Silicone-Gasket-Maker/16777009
> 
> I am just an extreme engineer, I love modding my stuff so I think I am going to do this no matter what. Is the motherboard clip and heat sink sufficient in applying enough force to hold the IHS on without resealing? I will be using an Asus z87 PRO


I have silicone glue that should be similar to what you linked to at home. I used it a bunch of times (not on the CPU, I mean I used it somewhere else) and it really seems to be a very similar material to what Intel used to glue the IHS. At least it seemed like that to me comparing what I've seen after delidding my CPU. If you work cleanly, I can't imagine them noticing anything if you send a broken CPU in for RMA.

You don't need to worry about that bracket not holding the IHS well. Things really can't be moved at all after you pull that lever and clamp things down. It seems perfect to me, no need to do anything more.


----------



## xelectroxwolfx

*OCN name: xelectrowolfx
CPU: 4770k
On-die TIM: Artic Silver 5
IHS TIM: Artic Silver 5
Mhz gained: +400mhz (for now)
OC after delid: 4.6GHz
Temp drops: ~25C - 30C*

Hey everyone!!I succesfully Dellided my i7 4770k! Please let me in! and if you've seen my thread you know all the trouble I have gone through for this performance between broken CPU and thermal Caps --->http://www.overclock.net/t/1474002/problem-with-stock-corei7-4770k-and-talking-with-intel-didnt-help/30#post_22075067


Spoiler: Warning: Results!




My patients was running thin at this point as you can see
















Woot Its off!!









All cleaned up!!







When I put As5 on Die I put an extremely small amount (similar to Liquid Pro) and spread it with a credit card - that seems to have given me the BEST results

Put back in case and Hooked up As5 on CPU core and on IHS, I used an X method with a dot inbetween each gap for the IHS (THIN)

Before delid temps @ 4.2ghz/4.2 1.18vcore 2133mhz ram *MAX TEMP 80°c As5 h80i 2 fans MAX SPEED*









After delid temps @ 4.2ghz/4.2 1.18vcore 2133mhz ram *MAX TEMP 60°c As5 on die and IHS h80i 1 fan!! 60% Fan Speed*









*Stable @ 4.5ghz/4.2ghz 1.266vcore MAX Temp 71°c @99w TDP!!!! h80i 1 fan 60% Fan Speed!!!!!!!!!! Thats as cool as running my PC at stock Speeds!*









And a chart showing how my CPU scales , My CPU's Vcore chart/100mhz, Blender Render time w/ Overclocks, and Delid vs Stock Temps Prime 95










What you have to remember is that this is the temps I have just _30mins_ after putting on my As5 _*I expect these temps to drop ~ 8°c*_ on the hottest core. As you can see I used the Razor method, I practiced on an Old '02 2.4ghz Celeron 478 CPU, and got a feel for not scratching the PCB, *I DID BEND my i7 PCB though*.... I carefully bent it back, and its working just fine. Minor cosmetic wear at the corners on the PCB of the cpu, if it bothers me I may just use clear nailpolish to fill them back in. The razors I used were Surgical Grade Carpet Razors, these things cut so smooth and are really thin, *YOU WILL CUT YOURSELF HOWEVER* hahaha







.
_SO SO SO SO Happy I did this_, I may not even try Liquid pro Ultra unless I really really feel I have too. However 20°c with just As5 _*BEFORE BREAK IN*_ is just fantastic!!
So there.. thats my story! Will edit back when I hit my thermal Cap








EDIT:
4.7ghz/3.5ghz 1.4vcore MAX Temp 85°c @110w TDP h80i 1 fan Max Speed.
I hit my safe voltage limit thats for sure. But Considering I couldnt really safely go over 4.2ghz without hitting 80°c ++ this is Astounding and once again these are just As5 Temps for today!!!

Edit Managed to hit 4.7ghz/4.2ghz 1.41vcore 2417mhz Ram MAX Temp 91°c


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xelectroxwolfx*
> 
> *OCN name: xelectrowolfx
> CPU: 4770k
> On-die TIM: Artic Silver 5
> IHS TIM: Artic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: +400mhz (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.6GHz
> Temp drops: ~25C - 30C*
> 
> Hey everyone!!I succesfully Dellided my i7 4770k! Please let me in! and if you've seen my thread you know all the trouble I have gone through for this performance between broken CPU and thermal Caps --->http://www.overclock.net/t/1474002/problem-with-stock-corei7-4770k-and-talking-with-intel-didnt-help/30#post_22075067
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Results!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My patients was running thin at this point as you can see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Woot Its off!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All cleaned up!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When I put As5 on Die I put an extremely small amount (similar to Liquid Pro) and spread it with a credit card - that seems to have given me the BEST results
> 
> Put back in case and Hooked up As5 on CPU core and on IHS, I used an X method with a dot inbetween each gap for the IHS (THIN)
> 
> Before delid temps @ 4.2ghz/4.2 1.18vcore 2133mhz ram *MAX TEMP 80°c As5 h80i 2 fans MAX SPEED*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After delid temps @ 4.2ghz/4.2 1.18vcore 2133mhz ram *MAX TEMP 60°c As5 on die and IHS h80i 1 fan!! 60% Fan Speed*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Stable @ 4.5ghz/4.2ghz 1.266vcore MAX Temp 71°c @99w TDP!!!! h80i 1 fan 60% Fan Speed!!!!!!!!!! Thats as cool as running my PC at stock Speeds!*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And a chart showing how my CPU scales , My CPU's Vcore chart/100mhz, Blender Render time w/ Overclocks, and Delid vs Stock Temps Prime 95
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What you have to remember is that this is the temps I have just _30mins_ after putting on my As5 _*I expect these temps to drop ~ 8°c*_ on the hottest core. As you can see I used the Razor method, I practiced on an Old '02 2.4ghz Celeron 478 CPU, and got a feel for not scratching the PCB, *I DID BEND my i7 PCB though*.... I carefully bent it back, and its working just fine. Minor cosmetic wear at the corners on the PCB of the cpu, if it bothers me I may just use clear nailpolish to fill them back in. The razors I used were Surgical Grade Carpet Razors, these things cut so smooth and are really thin, *YOU WILL CUT YOURSELF HOWEVER* hahaha
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> _SO SO SO SO Happy I did this_, I may not even try Liquid pro Ultra unless I really really feel I have too. However 20°c with just As5 _*BEFORE BREAK IN*_ is just fantastic!!
> So there.. thats my story! Will edit back when I hit my thermal Cap
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT:
> 4.7ghz/3.5ghz 1.4vcore MAX Temp 85°c @110w TDP h80i 1 fan Max Speed.
> I hit my safe voltage limit thats for sure. But Considering I couldnt really safely go over 4.2ghz without hitting 80°c ++ this is Astounding and once again these are just As5 Temps for today!!!
> 
> Edit Managed to hit 4.7ghz/4.2ghz 1.41vcore 2417mhz Ram MAX Temp 91°c


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funkyhunky*
> 
> so if I delid, it works fine and something goes wonky a year down the line i should reattach the IHS with something like this? http://www.walmart.com/ip/Permatex-Ultra-Black-Hi-Temp-RTV-Silicone-Gasket-Maker/16777009
> 
> I am just an extreme engineer, I love modding my stuff so I think I am going to do this no matter what. *Is the motherboard clip and heat sink sufficient in applying enough force to hold the IHS on without resealing?* I will be using an Asus z87 PRO


Absolutely.


----------



## josephimports

I tried the "vise only" method on a retired Intel E4500. No visible damage on the PCB or IHS.







I cant power it on to verify it still works, but im sure it does.


----------



## tpwilko08

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> I tried the "vise only" method on a retired Intel E4500. No visible damage on the PCB or IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cant power it on to verify it still works, but im sure it does.


I did the vice only method on my 3770k and it worked fine afterwoods. The best and easiest way to delid if you ask me...


----------



## Jugurnot

Vice only delid last night. But for some reason my clock of 4.5ghz is no longer stable at 1.14v, had to bump to 1.145v. Besides the voltage increase, I had a drop of 10 degrees across the board.

3570k @ 4.5ghz 1.145 in bios (cpuid shows lower)
Gelid Extreme paste on die and IHS
Max temps across cores 46-48-54-49 using Maximum on IBT
Cooling with h220

Going to do a 5.0ghz run tonight









Thanks for the help everyone!


----------



## xelectroxwolfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Vice only delid last night. But for some reason my clock of 4.5ghz is no longer stable at 1.14v, had to bump to 1.145v. Besides the voltage increase, I had a drop of 10 degrees across the board.
> 
> 3570k @ 4.5ghz 1.145 in bios (cpuid shows lower)
> Gelid Extreme paste on die and IHS
> Max temps across cores 46-48-54-49 using Maximum on IBT
> Cooling with h220
> 
> Going to do a 5.0ghz run tonight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the help everyone!


So jelly @ those Volts


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Vice only delid last night. But for some reason my clock of 4.5ghz is no longer stable at 1.14v, had to bump to 1.145v


is so small a change that it probably had no measurable effect, you were probably just very slightly unstable and used the OC long enough to hit a problem


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> is so small a change that it probably had no measurable effect, you were probably just very slightly unstable and used the OC long enough to hit a problem


Thats sounds about right. in the past, every so often a run on ibt would fail but it never crashed while gaming. I just hope it isnt a sign of early degradation








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xelectroxwolfx*
> 
> So jelly @ those Volts


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Vice only delid last night. But for some reason my clock of 4.5ghz is no longer stable at 1.14v, had to bump to 1.145v. Besides the voltage increase, I had a drop of 10 degrees across the board.
> 
> 3570k @ 4.5ghz 1.145 in bios (cpuid shows lower)
> Gelid Extreme paste on die and IHS
> Max temps across cores 46-48-54-49 using Maximum on IBT
> Cooling with h220
> 
> Going to do a 5.0ghz run tonight
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the help everyone!
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice low voltage









Quote:



> Originally Posted by *xelectroxwolfx*
> 
> So jelly @ those Volts


That's about where my 3570k hit 4.5GHz, I believe mine was 1.16 without delid.

Just dismantled that rig and formatted the SSD, don't have any pics now but I will be delidding and rebuilding soon


----------



## Jugurnot

Finally got to run this chip at 5ghz+.... I was pleasantly surprised









Delidded 3570k @ 5.025ghz 1.352vcore
Gelid Extreme on die and on IHS between block
Cooled using H220 fans at 1450rpm
Ambient room temp 19c
Max Core temps 61-68-72-68c


Spoiler: Warning: Proof!


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Finally got to run this chip at 5ghz+.... I was pleasantly surprised
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delidded 3570k @ 5.025ghz 1.352vcore
> Gelid Extreme on die and on IHS between block
> Cooled using H220 fans at 1450rpm
> Ambient room temp 19c
> Max Core temps 61-68-72-68c
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Proof!


Very nice. You have definitely inspired me to delid and see how far my 3570k can go.

P.S. Nice Avatar


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Very nice. You have definitely inspired me to delid and see how far my 3570k can go.
> 
> P.S. Nice Avatar


Heck yes! Its a good feeling when you finally get to see the numbers and gains achieved. This was my first delid and it was so easy. No razor, no hammer, no block of wood, just the tightening of a vice and bam, done.

Thanks, I was a 90's child lol


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Heck yes! Its a good feeling when you finally get to see the numbers and gains achieved. This was my first delid and it was so easy. No razor, no hammer, no block of wood, just the tightening of a vice and bam, done.
> 
> Thanks, I was a 90's child lol


I've done 4 chips so far, and my 3570k will be #5. I have the razor method down pat at this point like a









3570k will have an Antec 620 cooling it. I'm unsure







if it will suffice for 5GHz on the 3570k...I know it is capable of taming a 4770k 4.5GHz 1.260V with a single Corsair SP120...maybe without the VR and HT it will be possible








to growing up in the 90's


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

I am going to delid my 3770k just to get the Temps down. I am not a fan of that chip or motherboard (p8z77-v) as I turn the tpu feature on, and the chips sets to 4.1 automatically, but if I try for even 4.2, I get constant BSOD issues without even pushing anything at all. I feel it is the motherboard, as it allows the 4.1 with the tpu, but nothing over that for any reason that I can find. I just don't want to buy a new mobo to test my theory. I have been folding and crunching with that system, and the CPU temp never goes over 70 at 4.12 (total that I can attain from the tpu selector).

It is running at 1.191 volts from what everything I can see on HWinfo says.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Heck yes! Its a good feeling when you finally get to see the numbers and gains achieved. This was my first delid and it was so easy. No razor, no hammer, no block of wood, just the tightening of a vice and bam, done.
> 
> Thanks, I was a 90's child lol


Ohhh what method is this? Can you link or explain. I used a razor blade and know about the vice and wood block method but this sounds newer.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Ohhh what method is this? Can you link or explain. I used a razor blade and know about the vice and wood block method but this sounds newer.


I can try amd explain as im on my phone and cant find a link.

You use the clamping force of the vice alone to split the ihs from the chip. Place the chip upside down in the vice, but with one side of the vice jaw against the PCB, and the other jaw will be against the top edge of the ihs. As you tighten the vice, the glue will shear and you pull the ihs off by hand. Same principle as the block and hammer method. But instead of a quick blow to shear the glue, the vice provides a very steady and very controlled force that will seperate the pieces. There is a video on youtube of it being done with a blow dryer to heat the glue right before the final tightening of the vice, but I skipped this.


----------



## Chomuco

new !!


----------



## Teplous

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> new !!


where can i get this and what socket is it for?


----------



## Swag

Socket is Haswell and MSI's new motherboard will be featuring that.


----------



## Teplous

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Socket is Haswell and MSI's new motherboard will be featuring that.


would it be possible to just get the bracket?


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Socket is Haswell and MSI's new motherboard will be featuring that.


Of course nothing like this coming in the near future for 1155, or...?


----------



## Swag

AFAIK, the product hasn't been released yet and therefore we have no way to tell whether or not we can take it out of the motherboard and put it on other motherboards. To be honest, with diligence , you can easily make your own bracket. When I find the washers I used when I did a naked Ivy run, I'll post here the sizes and everything or tell Valgaur to post the information.









I honestly doubt anything like that will come out for 1155 as delidding only became mainstream (in the enthusiast market) after Haswell came out because of its horrible stock temps.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> AFAIK, the product hasn't been released yet and therefore we have no way to tell whether or not we can take it out of the motherboard and put it on other motherboards. To be honest, with diligence , you can easily make your own bracket. When I find the washers I used when I did a naked Ivy run, I'll post here the sizes and everything or tell Valgaur to post the information.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I honestly doubt anything like that will come out for 1155 as delidding only became mainstream (in the enthusiast market) after Haswell came out because of its horrible stock temps.


But Haswell is only like 5-10c worse than ivy when running the same load, the jump from sandy to ivy was much more dramatic


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> AFAIK, the product hasn't been released yet and therefore we have no way to tell whether or not we can take it out of the motherboard and put it on other motherboards. To be honest, with diligence , you can easily make your own bracket. When I find the washers I used when I did a naked Ivy run, I'll post here the sizes and everything or tell Valgaur to post the information.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I honestly doubt anything like that will come out for 1155 as delidding only became mainstream (in the enthusiast market) after Haswell came out because of its horrible stock temps.
> 
> 
> 
> But Haswell is only like 5-10c worse than ivy when running the same load, the jump from sandy to ivy was much more dramatic
Click to expand...

But 80C temps from Ivy weren't pushing the limit, some Haswells have been seen to hit 100C on stock clocks. That's when people start finding ways to lower temps.

Although I think Ivy should get a product similar to this, I don't think it will happen. That's my personal opinion on the matter. Just remember that in a couple of years, people will probably start upgrading and hopefully that type of bracket will be sold on all brands.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> But 80C temps from Ivy weren't pushing the limit, some Haswells have been seen to hit 100C on stock clocks. That's when people start finding ways to lower temps.
> 
> Although I think Ivy should get a product similar to this, I don't think it will happen. That's my personal opinion on the matter. Just remember that in a couple of years, people will probably start upgrading and hopefully that type of bracket will be sold on all brands.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Of course nothing like this coming in the near future for 1155, or...?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teplous*
> 
> would it be possible to just get the bracket?


If it's working on an 1150 socket, it will work for 1155, and 1156 also, THEY USE THE SAME CPU retention brackets!!!!!!

The only question is, will MSI sell it separately?

Edit: Just going by the photos of the bracket, it just replaces the hold down clamp assembly just as the CPU/board blocks do for the Impact/P8Z77-I blocks from EK and Bitspower do.

So it should work on any LGA 115X boards.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> But 80C temps from Ivy weren't pushing the limit, some Haswells have been seen to hit 100C on stock clocks. That's when people start finding ways to lower temps.
> 
> Although I think Ivy should get a product similar to this, I don't think it will happen. That's my personal opinion on the matter. Just remember that in a couple of years, people will probably start upgrading and hopefully that type of bracket will be sold on all brands.


@1.265vcore, i'm peaking ~77 encoding with HT on, not hitting 70 with it off, on air, no delid

it's hardly 20c hotter than ivy bridge - a bit, but not that much.

Most of the added heat is from running stuff faster. They draw a completely ridiculous amount of power pushing 200-250gflops in Linpack


----------



## Teplous

im getting an LGA 1155 ivy bridge Celeron G1610, i wont be overclocking. however, it will be running 24/7 at about 20-40% load with a passive cooler and a 200 mm fan above it, is De-lidding worth it on this processor


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Teplous*
> 
> im getting an LGA 1155 ivy bridge Celeron G1610, i wont be overclocking. however, it will be running 24/7 at about 20-40% load with a passive cooler and a 200 mm fan above it, is De-lidding worth it on this processor


Probably not, unless you want to do it. There won't be much heat going out - with a 3770k/4770k @1.4v, you can be approaching 200 watts that needs to get out of the die - but with this, it's probably much less. It says 55w tdp, but it won't use that much power, so the heat should get out of the die and into the heatsink at a more than acceptable rate, your only worry is cooling the heatsink (delid would not help you to do that, as it just moves heat from cpu to heatsink more easily, does not change the amount of it)


----------



## Teplous

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Probably not, unless you want to do it. There won't be much heat going out - with a 3770k/4770k @1.4v, you can be approaching 200 watts that needs to get out of the die - but with this, it's probably much less. It says 55w tdp, but it won't use that much power, so the heat should get out of the die and into the heatsink at a more than acceptable rate, your only worry is cooling the heatsink (delid would not help you to do that, as it just moves heat from cpu to heatsink more easily, does not change the amount of it)


ok, thanks for the insight.


----------



## Valgaur

Yiiiiiiiiiiiis use vagurs info in the real world let the lawsuits begin MUHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Guess who is Back? Oh Yeah, the 3770k is done and running right meow. I have only run a 5 minute Prime 95 test so far, and I am downloading Intel Burn Test as I type. I did use the Vice only method mentioned a few days ago. You can see the vice that I used for the 4770k, and how deep the teeth are on it. I took video, and have uploaded it to YouTube, but I have no idea how good it turned out, since I uploaded it without watching it.

More information later, but for now, enjoy my Rudimentary setup (Deep teeth and NO Smooth surface on the vice.. watch my improvising mind go to work.)




P.S. If you can't tell, I had my phone. The microphone is not all that great. Sorry about that. I should have grabbed a picture of the teeth on the vic.. I would say they are about 1/16 of an inch deep.. That was what scarred the 4770k that I use the mallet and wood method to Delid.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*


and
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*


are the first two I see mentioning the vice only method. They deserve the credit for the idea at least. I don't know who gets it first, but the vide is proof as to how CRAZY easy it is.

Adding temps pictures.


----------



## xelectroxwolfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Guess who is Back? Oh Yeah, the 3770k is done and running right meow. I have only run a 5 minute Prime 95 test so far, and I am downloading Intel Burn Test as I type. I did use the Vice only method mentioned a few days ago. You can see the vice that I used for the 4770k, and how deep the teeth are on it. I took video, and have uploaded it to YouTube, but I have no idea how good it turned out, since I uploaded it without watching it.
> 
> More information later, but for now, enjoy my Rudimentary setup (Deep teeth and NO Smooth surface on the vice.. watch my improvising mind go to work.)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S. If you can't tell, I had my phone. The microphone is not all that great. Sorry about that. I should have grabbed a picture of the teeth on the vic.. I would say they are about 1/16 of an inch deep.. That was what scarred the 4770k that I use the mallet and wood method to Delid.


Great method alot safer than both hammer and vice / razor, without any damage to PCB or ihs as long as both sides of the vice are perfectly flat. Will try this if I ever get a new i7


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xelectroxwolfx*
> 
> Great method alot safer than both hammer and vice / razor, without any damage to PCB or ihs as long as both sides of the vice are perfectly flat. Will try this if I ever get a new i7


I forget which user was the one that mentioned doing this first, but I will go back and tag him in this and in my other post so that he can see the appreciation.. I only provide the video. 

*Edit* Video post edited.


----------



## moccor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> new !!


I was just about to ask if anyone knew if they sold these sort of guards somewhere, but since many people seem to be surprised at it, I guess not. Sad thing is, MSI chose a ugly brown/light black color with their gaming motherboards and I'm not much of a yellow guy either, so maybe others too will implement something like this


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

The 3770k is at 4.5 Ghz, for the first time ever, and just ran IntelBurnTest two revolutions of 10 tests on high settings, and is stable at 1.27! Temps touched 72 on the highest core, but I didn't push any harder for now.. 120mmAIO is all I can fit in the case, so I have the Enermax ELC120 as listed in the Little Brother Build

A Clue.. From ASUS: Go into advanced settings, AI Tweaker, then CPU Configuration, then configure Enhanced intel Speedstep and CPU C1E to Disabled.. I did that and BOOM, Straight to 4.5 with relatively lower voltage than even my 4770k.

Hope that helps someone else. I am going to see if I can do the same for the 4770k and get the voltage down or make it more stable overall and hope to pull another 100-200mhz out of it.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> The 3770k is at 4.5 Ghz, for the first time ever, and just ran IntelBurnTest two revolutions of 10 tests on high settings, and is stable at 1.27! Temps touched 72 on the highest core, but I didn't push any harder for now.. 120mmAIO is all I can fit in the case, so I have the Enermax ELC120 as listed in the Little Brother Build
> 
> A Clue.. From ASUS: Go into advanced settings, AI Tweaker, then CPU Configuration, then configure Enhanced intel Speedstep and CPU C1E to Disabled.. I did that and BOOM, Straight to 4.5 with relatively lower voltage than even my 4770k.
> 
> Hope that helps someone else. I am going to see if I can do the same for the 4770k and get the voltage down or make it more stable overall and hope to pull another 100-200mhz out of it.


Thats great that you got it stable at reasonable voltages, but doesnt disabling speed step and C1E mean that the computer is running 4.5 at full voltage 24/7?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Tat that is what I am guessing. It seems that it only downloads one or two cores, and not much or for long. At least I can edit for benchmarking now.


----------



## FtW 420

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Thats great that you got it stable at reasonable voltages, but doesnt disabling speed step and C1E mean that the computer is running 4.5 at full voltage 24/7?


Keep in mind running the full voltage without power saving features means it pulls about 20 - 50 watts more power at idle, & will idle a few degrees higher. Under load everything is the same with power savings enabled or disabled. Power savings disabled doesn't mean the cpu is under full load 24/7 at idle.

So the extra few watts can mean a few dollars on the power bill & that is about it When I tested a 3770k at 4.8Ghz 1.34V 24/7 vs. idling at 1.6Ghz 0.9V, the difference was close to 40 watts in the idle state, I calculated it would cost me about $3 a month with the cost of hydro where I am.

Saving is saving so I never recommend people _not_ to use the power saving features, I just don't bother with it myself since I prefer to see the clockspeed & voltage I'm using in screens taken in the idle state.


----------



## Wirerat

I leave all the stepping enabled. If I switch from balanced to performance mode in windows it locks at max clocks/volts.


----------



## blackmagic12345

I got a question... Would anyone have any tips on running a naked chIP (in Sig) under a Noctua d14? I can get a backup mounting bracket for little to no cost a and was wondering if it would be feasable to run her naked..


----------



## veedubfreak

Knocked the lid off my 4770 last weekend and redid it with Liquid Ultra. Was surprisingly easy. I also switched from a Koolance 350 to the new EK block and bumped core from 4.3ghz to 4.6ghz. Temps went down from 70c to 50c. Can't seem to go much faster as I'm already at 1.4v and don't want to push more voltage. Plus it's not like I really *need* to go faster.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blackmagic12345*
> 
> I got a question... Would anyone have any tips on running a naked chIP (in Sig) under a Noctua d14? I can get a backup mounting bracket for little to no cost a and was wondering if it would be feasable to run her naked..


Really not recommended to run a naked chip under a tower cooler since you can't crank the tower tight, it usually ends up being a bad seat to the chip, doing damage to the chip, or damaging the socket itself.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *blackmagic12345*
> 
> I got a question... Would anyone have any tips on running a naked chIP (in Sig) under a Noctua d14? I can get a backup mounting bracket for little to no cost a and was wondering if it would be feasable to run her naked..
> 
> 
> 
> Really not recommended to run a naked chip under a tower cooler since you can't crank the tower tight, it usually ends up being a bad seat to the chip, doing damage to the chip, or damaging the socket itself.
Click to expand...

I second this. I would just run with the IHS while you are on air. You are already seeing the benefits of running a dellided chip. Get water before going naked.


----------



## moccor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I second this. I would just run with the IHS while you are on air. You are already seeing the benefits of running a dellided chip. Get water before going naked.


What about using a AIO water cooler without the IHS?


----------



## veedubfreak

What's the max "safe" voltage for a 4770k anyway?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> I can try amd explain as im on my phone and cant find a link.
> 
> You use the clamping force of the vice alone to split the ihs from the chip. Place the chip upside down in the vice, but with one side of the vice jaw against the PCB, and the other jaw will be against the top edge of the ihs. As you tighten the vice, the glue will shear and you pull the ihs off by hand. Same principle as the block and hammer method. But instead of a quick blow to shear the glue, the vice provides a very steady and very controlled force that will seperate the pieces. There is a video on youtube of it being done with a blow dryer to heat the glue right before the final tightening of the vice, but I skipped this.


Any fails yet using this method?


----------



## chronicfx

Found the video of delidding by squeezing in a vice. Looks like the way to go. Hopefully the glue is never strong enough to bend the pcb. I am debating to hold off a month for devils canyon though. Seems like it could be a smart move.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Any fails yet using this method?


Not that I know of. I dont see many ways to screw it up. As long as the vice edge is clean and flat to apply even force on the pcb and ihs, there should be no problems. At work today I actually replaced my vice jaws with plastic that is used for cutting boards, I bet that would be 100% fail proof... but im sure we all know that is never possible haha.

I wish I took a pic of it... I will tomorrow


----------



## veedubfreak

Honestly, the amount of force it takes to remove the lid using a hammer is very very light. I clamped the lid and just kind of tapped the wood block 3 times and off it came.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *veedubfreak*
> 
> Honestly, the amount of force it takes to remove the lid using a hammer is very very light. I clamped the lid and just kind of tapped the wood block 3 times and off it came.


They sound equally easy. I worry about the vice method with the wood in that i feel squeezing the ihs like that may make it convex and lessen the contact area with your clu.


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *veedubfreak*
> 
> Honestly, the amount of force it takes to remove the lid using a hammer is very very light. I clamped the lid and just kind of tapped the wood block 3 times and off it came.


Its the shearing of the glue which makes both methods very easy. I personally think the vice only method is superior, it offers much more control and less tools is always nice.


----------



## veedubfreak

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> They sound equally easy. I worry about the vice method with the wood in that i feel squeezing the ihs like that may make it convex and lessen the contact area with your clu.


Didn't think about that. But I only clamped the lid tight enough that it wouldn't move. Another thing to look at is just how thick the actual heat spreader is. It's quite a bit thicker than I was expecting it to be. You'd have to clamp it down reaaaly hard to deform it.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *moccor*
> 
> What about using a AIO water cooler without the IHS?


To a degree, it's the same issue, none of the AIO coolers have hold down brackets that are rigid enough to keep the cold plate perfectly parallel to the die, so you still run the same risks, but to a slightly lesser degree.

Naked die has almost always been reserved for custom liquid loops for those reasons.


----------



## moccor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> To a degree, it's the same issue, none of the AIO coolers have hold down brackets that are rigid enough to keep the cold plate perfectly parallel to the die, so you still run the same risks, but to a slightly lesser degree.
> 
> Naked die has almost always been reserved for custom liquid loops for those reasons.


That's what I had thought. Hopefully when MSI releases their new motherboards, they will offer to sell, even if as 'replacements' their DIE-protection thing. Because it's so much less of a pain to simply delid rather than to lap the IHS


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Found the video of delidding by squeezing in a vice. Looks like the way to go. Hopefully the glue is never strong enough to bend the pcb. I am debating to hold off a month for devils canyon though. Seems like it could be a smart move.


I watched carefully and it did not flex any at all. I was terrified it may, but nothing in the end. Well worth the time. It took longer to find the parts that it did to use the method and completely remove it.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Its the shearing of the glue which makes both methods very easy. I personally think the vice only method is superior, it offers much more control and less tools is always nice.


I agree with the vice method being superior, as with the hammer, even after the glue releases, you have to account for the force already put into the piece of wood moving over the chip and possibly allowing the IHS to hit the Die.. with the vice only method, the moment it pops, nothing has really moved as there is no where for it to go, really. It just breaks the glue and sits there. I was amazed at the ease and simplicity.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> [/I][/SPOILER]


Would you like to include a new video? 



 This is the vice only method.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I agree with the vice method being superior, as with the hammer, even after the glue releases, you have to account for the force already put into the piece of wood moving over the chip and possibly allowing the IHS to hit the Die.. with the vice only method, the moment it pops, nothing has really moved as there is no where for it to go, really. It just breaks the glue and sits there. I was amazed at the ease and simplicity.


When I was using the vice + block + hammer method on my 3570k, I gradually increased the force of the hits and the IHS did not fully come off for me. The last bit of glue I separated by hand (by pulling on the PCB). I don't know if I was lucky or anyone can do it like that if being careful.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> When I was using the vice + block + hammer method on my 3570k, I gradually increased the force of the hits and the IHS did not fully come off for me. The last bit of glue I separated by hand. I don't know if I was lucky or anyone can do it like that if being careful.


My lid didn't completely come off either, all the glue separated though. Watch videos on YouTube and you can hear the IHS fly sometimes. I would rather take the less risky option and feel safe. It took my 4 hits the first time with increasing pressure on each hit, but it only took half a turn total with the vice, and it leaves no stored energy/motion.


----------



## deepor

Yeah, what happened to me was that I was terribly scared hitting the CPU. I don't remember if I noticed something while hitting it with the hammer. I bet I only found out that the PCB was partly separated and moving because I pulled on it after every hit. I don't think I'd have heard the separation happening with the hammer hit being as loud as it was. In your video it was very obvious that something had happened and the glue had ripped.

I had seen one of those videos you mention and wrapped a cloth around the vise and CPU so it couldn't have flown off for me.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Had a BSOD this morning. I do not like this motherboard at all. I just put it back to 4.1 where it has always been stable. At least I know the chip is capable of better, but I have RMA ed this board once and it just isn't up to par for stability in my eyes. Maybe next time.


----------



## chronicfx

Sooo. How does heat transfer using CLU on a die compare to a soldered chip? I am thinking devils canyon 4790k vs. properly delidded 4770k?


----------



## mrazster

I´m about to delid my 4770..and I´m going to use CLU between the die and IHS.
However I´m a bit conserned abot the small chips next to the die...I´ve seen some use things as nailpolish, silicon and other stuff.

But have anyone used dielectric siliconbased grease ?


----------



## BenJaminJr

Is this at all true?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *angelotti*
> 
> Delidded chip with a heavy air cooler is not such a good idea, the pressure is not symmetrical (unless the cooler is vertical and the MB horizontal). The chip might crack at high temperatures. That glue helps even-out the pressure and over a larger area.
> 
> high density + high temps + mechanical pressure, might equal to "a disaster"
> 
> I'm not talking from experience, but i don't think that the actual chip itself is supposed to take the weight of a big air cooler. A water block is going to be only 2/300 grams.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenJaminJr*
> 
> Is this at all true?


I used a D14 for over 6 months in a Haf932. No issues.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenJaminJr*
> 
> Is this at all true?
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *angelotti*
> 
> Delidded chip with a heavy air cooler is not such a good idea, the pressure is not symmetrical (unless the cooler is vertical and the MB horizontal). The chip might crack at high temperatures. That glue helps even-out the pressure and over a larger area.
> 
> high density + high temps + mechanical pressure, might equal to "a disaster"
> 
> I'm not talking from experience, but i don't think that the actual chip itself is supposed to take the weight of a big air cooler. A water block is going to be only 2/300 grams.
Click to expand...

I agree with chronicfx, I used a tower cooler on a dellided chip for a while without issue, and it works just fine. However, for a naked mount there is an inkling of truth to the asymmetrical pressure from a non-solid plate. I would be a bit timid trying a naked mount with a tower cooler without lapping the cooler to a near mirror finish, and having a methodology that tightened all 4 corners at the same rate to avoid pressure to the edges. The weight certainty is not an issue though, the amount of pressure that my naked water block requires is in excess of that required to mount a tower cooler, which essentially means it weighs heavier on the die.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrazster*
> 
> I´m about to delid my 4770..and I´m going to use CLU between the die and IHS.
> However I´m a bit conserned abot the small chips next to the die...I´ve seen some use things as nailpolish, silicon and other stuff.
> 
> But have anyone used dielectric siliconbased grease ?


Liquid electrical tape is great stuff
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenJaminJr*
> 
> Is this at all true?


That issue was risen when someone wanted to do direct mount of aircooler to the die itself, reusing the IHS on the die makes for a great combo for aircoolers


----------



## mrazster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Liquid electrical tape is great stuff


Will this do the trick ?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Performix-Liquid-Electrical-Tape-4-oz-Resealable-Can-RED-/201066538799?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ed07fe72f


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrazster*
> 
> Will this do the trick ?
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Performix-Liquid-Electrical-Tape-4-oz-Resealable-Can-RED-/201066538799?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ed07fe72f


yup and use the paint on one. not the spray can.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrazster*
> 
> Will this do the trick ?
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Performix-Liquid-Electrical-Tape-4-oz-Resealable-Can-RED-/201066538799?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ed07fe72f


Fingernail polish also works wonderful.. I have CLLP on my 750Ti right now, with Fingernail polish protecting the circuitry. No issues as of yet 

P.s. Everything I use has Fingernail polish protecting the circuits. That being 5 GPUS and 2 CPUs, and it costed a $1.99 and didn't need to be shipped since you can buy it.. anywhere.


----------



## mrazster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Fingernail polish also works wonderful.. I have CLLP on my 750Ti right now, with Fingernail polish protecting the circuitry. No issues as of yet
> 
> P.s. Everything I use has Fingernail polish protecting the circuits. That being 5 GPUS and 2 CPUs, and it costed a $1.99 and didn't need to be shipped since you can buy it.. anywhere.


Yeah I just did that...just before I read your post. Works perfectly fine !


----------



## veedubfreak

CLU is super super easy to put on the die without making a mess. I didn't bother covering the other stuff under the lid.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *veedubfreak*
> 
> CLU is super super easy to put on the die without making a mess. I didn't bother covering the other stuff under the lid.


it only takes one mistake to fry your chip, i dont think applying fingernail polish, or a temporary strip of painters tape is a bad investment of time judging by the possible repercussions


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> it only takes one mistake to fry your chip, i dont think applying fingernail polish, or a temporary strip of painters tape is a bad investment of time judging by the possible repercussions


Agreed, the very minimal effort of putting a little fingernail polish on is for sure worth it imo.


----------



## arrow0309

*Next-gen MSI OC Series Motherboard to Feature "Delid Die Guard"*


----------



## Valgaur

Someone beat you to the news. Thanks though







was a good read


----------



## Bartouille

I don't know if this happened to anyone but here's what happened to me...

I used CLU between the ihs and heatsink (both lapped), and after nearly 1 year, the heatsink and the ihs nearly fusioned!! I had to use brute force to remove my noctua d14 from the ihs. It was so fusioned, just to give you an idea, I could have removed all mounting, and the heatsink wouldn't have felt. And keep in mind the d14 is freaking heavy. I don't think I'll ever be using liquid metal pastes other than this delid case. Also it stained both of my ihs and d14 very bad, I had to lap them again to remove all the crap.

Consider twice before using liquid metal pastes other than on the die...


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrazster*
> 
> I´m about to delid my 4770..and I´m going to use CLU between the die and IHS.
> However I´m a bit conserned abot the small chips next to the die...I´ve seen some use things as nailpolish, silicon and other stuff.
> 
> But have anyone used dielectric siliconbased grease ?


Just be careful and you don't need to cover up anything. I did the delid twice and nothing happened. Plus it doesn't slip like regular paste when you try to put the ihs back (with the retention bracket). I also think it looks very unprofessional when people cover those capacitors with non conductive thermal paste or whatever.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I don't know if this happened to anyone but here's what happened to me...
> 
> I used CLU between the ihs and heatsink (both lapped), and after nearly 1 year, the heatsink and the ihs nearly fusioned!! I had to use brute force to remove my noctua d14 from the ihs. It was so fusioned, just to give you an idea, I could have removed all mounting, and the heatsink wouldn't have felt. And keep in mind the d14 is freaking heavy. I don't think I'll ever be using liquid metal pastes other than this delid case. Also it stained both of my ihs and d14 very bad, I had to lap them again to remove all the crap.
> 
> Consider twice before using liquid metal pastes other than on the die...


I thought Coollaboratory said Not to use CLLU or CLLP on copper... That it could have negative effects and cause issues, which you probably are seeing after using on bare copper.

Also, everywhere says that lapping is required to remove CLLP or CLLU for the most part, that CLLU is just easier to remove.


----------



## Bartouille

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I thought Coollaboratory said Not to use CLLU or CLLP on copper... That it could have negative effects and cause issues, which you probably are seeing after using on bare copper.
> 
> Also, everywhere says that lapping is required to remove CLLP or CLLU for the most part, that CLLU is just easier to remove.


I never read that it shouldn't be applied on copper. I know aluminium is a big no-no tho.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I never read that it shouldn't be applied on copper. I know aluminium is a big no-no tho.


Wear as the Coolabs stuff will destroy the aluminum because clp/clu are made of Gallium, Gallium will be absorbed/bond to copper at a molecular level, it should ONLY be applied to blocks that are Nickel Plated, as gallium will not do anything to it. Bare copper and aluminum are no-no's though. Personally, I only use standard thermal pastes now, even on delided CPUs; the difference in temp between clp/clu and my favorite Gelid GC-Extreme in my delid was a max of 2c, not worth the hassle and cost of the Coolabs.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I never read that it shouldn't be applied on copper. I know aluminium is a big no-no tho.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Wear as the Coolabs stuff will destroy the aluminum because clp/clu are made of Gallium, Gallium will be absorbed/bond to copper at a molecular level, it should ONLY be applied to blocks that are Nickel Plated, as gallium will not do anything to it. Bare copper and aluminum are no-no's though. Personally, I only use standard thermal pastes now, even on delided CPUs; the difference in temp between clp/clu and my favorite Gelid GC-Extreme in my delid was a max of 2c, not worth the hassle and cost of the Coolabs.


Always, always, always read in great detail  notice the bonding part above... I read for two weeks prior to going naked die to nickel block with CLLP. I am not worried about staining the block as I can replace it (have spare in hand) and I get decent temp drops over thermal compounds and IHS. I like being nekkid... Just saying...


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I never read that it shouldn't be applied on copper. I know aluminium is a big no-no tho.
> 
> 
> 
> Wear as the Coolabs stuff will destroy the aluminum because clp/clu are made of Gallium, Gallium will be absorbed/bond to copper at a molecular level, it should ONLY be applied to blocks that are Nickel Plated, as gallium will not do anything to it. Bare copper and aluminum are no-no's though. Personally, I only use standard thermal pastes now, even on delided CPUs; the difference in temp between clp/clu and my favorite Gelid GC-Extreme in my delid was a max of 2c, not worth the hassle and cost of the Coolabs.
Click to expand...

The GC Extreme is my favorite too, already in use on my both cpu/heatsink (new 3770K, still undelidded) and my gpu 290








Are you sure there are only 2°C difference between the Coolaboratory (CLU or CLP?) and the GC-Extreme?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> The GC Extreme is my favorite too, already in use on my both cpu/heatsink (new 3770K, still undelidded) and my gpu 290
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you sure there are only 2°C difference between the Coolaboratory (CLU or CLP?) and the GC-Extreme?


He's right. Things like this depend on where it's used. CLU/CLP can only beat normal paste by a large amount of degrees if used between die and IHS. On a larger surface like between IHS and cooler, the difference gets hidden.

The guys that run without IHS and put the waterblock directly onto the CPU die can also run fine with normal paste, so what I think about the larger surface hiding what CLU does is probably somewhat wrong. It might instead work so great between die and IHS because there's something going on with bad contact, and CLU works around that issue as it's metal.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bartouille*
> 
> I don't know if this happened to anyone but here's what happened to me...
> 
> I used CLU between the ihs and heatsink (both lapped), and after nearly 1 year, the heatsink and the ihs nearly fusioned!! I had to use brute force to remove my noctua d14 from the ihs. It was so fusioned, just to give you an idea, I could have removed all mounting, and the heatsink wouldn't have felt. And keep in mind the d14 is freaking heavy. I don't think I'll ever be using liquid metal pastes other than this delid case. Also it stained both of my ihs and d14 very bad, I had to lap them again to remove all the crap.
> 
> Consider twice before using liquid metal pastes other than on the die...


Wow. I had some residue left on my d14 that i needed to use the included pad and scratch up the d14's surface to remove all of my coolabs but the die was not stuck. This was after 6-7 months. Interesting, it seems odd the clu adhering to the die with such strength, it is not the right material for that. Thanks for the info!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Wow. I had some residue left on my d14 that i needed to use the included pad and scratch up the d14's surface to remove all of my coolabs but the die was not stuck. This was after 6-7 months. Interesting, it seems odd the clu adhering to the die with such strength, it is not the right material for that. Thanks for the info!


I could remove CLU perfectly simply using some metal polish cleaning product out of the supermarket. It was also a nickel plated cooler like the NH-D14, though it had a mirror finish, not those lines the D14 has. The metal polish I used wasn't abrasive like some are, so it did absolutely nothing to the cooler's base and everything looked like new after enough rubbing.

That cleaning pad that comes in the CLU package is actually metal wire or foam or something and will scratch things up massively, but I guess you found that out by now.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

So, I decided to clean up the lines in Big Brother, and reroute some of the stuff while replacing a reservoir... As I got to the block, where I had installed small filter (it was worthless), I decided to do away with said filter. After I pulled the tubes, I decided to pull the block (Ek Supremacy with "In" centered and "out" at the top. I wanted to rotate it 90 to the right, and have in and out where they were originally meant for, so that the water would flow across the die as designed rather than bottom to top.

So, let's not forget that I put CLLP on the die and mounted the block to the nekkid die. As I get it off the mounts, I turn it over, grab a damp paper towel that I had used to block water from dropping, and just wipe the CLLP off.... Nothing left except a tiny dark spot....



I immediately thought, "with what everyone says, that can't be right", so I grab the CPU and give it a wipe, carefully, and the CLLP is gone...



Did I just get lucky or something? I thought it was going to be hard to get off, or "nearly impossible"

Temps maxed out at 51 on the hottest core... Ha, that is another 10 off the top while Crunching. I need to run it under Prime or something to see how hot it really gets. Before the task today, it was running 64, lol.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> The GC Extreme is my favorite too, already in use on my both cpu/heatsink (new 3770K, still undelidded) and my gpu 290
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you sure there are only 2°C difference between the Coolaboratory (CLU or CLP?) and the GC-Extreme?
> 
> 
> 
> He's right. Things like this depend on where it's used. CLU/CLP can only beat normal paste by a large amount of degrees if used between die and IHS. On a larger surface like between IHS and cooler, the difference gets hidden.
> 
> The guys that run without IHS and put the waterblock directly onto the CPU die can also run fine with normal paste, so what I think about the larger surface hiding what CLU does is probably somewhat wrong. It might instead work so great between die and IHS because there's something going on with bad contact, and CLU works around that issue as it's metal.
Click to expand...

My bad
I thought he was talking about the die/ihs contact









So, do you guys still recommend the razor delid over the vice & hammer method?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> My bad
> I thought he was talking about the die/ihs contact
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, do you guys still recommend the razor delid over the vice & hammer method?


Vice Method. I posted this a few days ago, so take a look.. 3 minutes of your life, and no hammers or razors.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> My bad
> I thought he was talking about the die/ihs contact
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, do you guys still recommend the razor delid over the vice & hammer method?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vice Method. I posted this a few days ago, so take a look.. 3 minutes of your life, and no hammers or razors.
Click to expand...

+Rep!
Excellent work, I can't wait to have it done on my new 3770K








Now I'll only have to wait for the CLU
One question, how did you aligned the ihs on the vice?
Or it doesn't matter at all?


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> My bad
> *I thought he was talking about the die/ihs contact*


I was referring to using standard TIM between the Die and IHS, in my system, with GC-Extreme between the Die and IHS, the temps are 2c warmer at both idle and full burn versus the exact same setup, but using CLP. The temp drop was so small, I even cleaned and reapplied with CLU this time, figuring I didn't do it correct. Nope, same exact temp as previous install.

You get a larger temp difference just doing the delid and removing the IHS glue and reapplying a good TIM than you do using the CLU/CLP in place of a standard TIM.

And as I stated before, since the temp difference is so tiny, it's a waste IMHO to go through the hassle of CLU/CLP when it's such a small gain, and costs so much. And, I don't need to worry about if a block or cooler is gonna get screwed up.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> +Rep!
> Excellent work, I can't wait to have it done on my new 3770K
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I'll only have to wait for the CLU
> One question, how did you aligned the ihs on the vice?
> Or it doesn't matter at all?


The PCB was against the light socket cover, so that it had a fully flat surface.

The tabs on the side of the IHS is where the the vice should touch, making sure the other side of the PCB will go over the vice itself. The spot that the vice should touch is pointed out here:


I just left the square (another full flat surface) rest against the IHS right where the prongs touch.

Someone else mentioned the idea prior. I just made a video as I needed/wanted to delid again. I will continue the trend if I can.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> So, I decided to clean up the lines in Big Brother, and reroute some of the stuff while replacing a reservoir... As I got to the block, where I had installed small filter (it was worthless), I decided to do away with said filter. After I pulled the tubes, I decided to pull the block (Ek Supremacy with "In" centered and "out" at the top. I wanted to rotate it 90 to the right, and have in and out where they were originally meant for, so that the water would flow across the die as designed rather than bottom to top.
> 
> So, let's not forget that I put CLLP on the die and mounted the block to the nekkid die. As I get it off the mounts, I turn it over, grab a damp paper towel that I had used to block water from dropping, and just wipe the CLLP off.... Nothing left except a tiny dark spot....
> 
> 
> 
> I immediately thought, "with what everyone says, that can't be right", so I grab the CPU and give it a wipe, carefully, and the CLLP is gone...
> 
> 
> 
> Did I just get lucky or something? I thought it was going to be hard to get off, or "nearly impossible"
> 
> Temps maxed out at 51 on the hottest core... Ha, that is another 10 off the top while Crunching. I need to run it under Prime or something to see how hot it really gets. Before the task today, it was running 64, lol.


No, you didn't get lucky, the die has always been easy to clean the Coolabs off of, it will either wipe off, or flake off with a fingernail. And the block is nickel plated, so you shouldn't have had an issue there, which you didn't.

It's bare copper that Coolabs has had various issues with, from just minor pitting, to heavy pitting/bonding/staining with.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> My bad
> *I thought he was talking about the die/ihs contact*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was referring to using standard TIM between the Die and IHS, in my system, with GC-Extreme between the Die and IHS, the temps are 2c warmer at both idle and full burn versus the exact same setup, but using CLP. The temp drop was so small, I even cleaned and reapplied the CLP figuring I didn't do it correct. Nope, same exact temp as previous install.
> 
> You get a larger temp difference just doing the delid and removing the IHS glue and reapplying a good TIM than you do using the CLU/CLP in place of a standard TIM.
> 
> And as I stated before, since the temp difference is so tiny, it's a waste IMHO to go through the hassle of CLU/CLP when it's such a small gain, and costs so much. And, I don't need to worry about if a block or cooler is gonna get screwed up.
Click to expand...

Wow, that's nice!
Then I did got what you meant, right now I'm seriously considering the GC-Extreme use both inside and outside the cpu









@Scarlet-Tech
Just wondering, won't you risk anything like the bending of the ihs with the hammerless vice method?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> No, you didn't get lucky, the die has always been easy to clean the Coolabs off of, it will either wipe off, or flake off with a fingernail. And the block is nickel plated, so you shouldn't have had an issue there, which you didn't.
> 
> It's bare copper that Coolabs has had various issues with, from just minor pitting, to heavy pitting/bonding/staining with.


Ok, I had just been warned prior to putting it on the the block that I shouldn't because it would be hard to get off. Good stuff, thanks for the info.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Wow, that's nice!
> Then I did got what you meant, seriously considering the GC-Extreme use both inside and outside the cpu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Scarlet-Tech
> 
> Just wondering, won't you risk anything like the bending of the ihs with the hammerless vice method?


Not if you use flat surface. The IHS is too thick to bend with the minimal amount of pressure actually needed. The part that had me nervous was bending the PBC itself, as the pressure seemed like it would be uneven, but it didnt even flex in the tiniest bit.


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Just finished delidding my E7200.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1483439/core-2-duo-e7200-delid

Haven't run it yet, but I'm excited


----------



## Levelog

So after getting my new motherboard, I can get a 4.5GHZ OC on my 4670k at 1.17 volts, but it gets a bit toasty with my 212 EVO at 87C with an ambient of 22C. Do you think it's worth delidding before I get the rest of my custom loop in?


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> So after getting my new motherboard, I can get a 4.5GHZ OC on my 4670k at 1.17 volts, but it gets a bit toasty with my 212 EVO at 87C with an ambient of 22C. Do you think it's worth delidding before I get the rest of my custom loop in?


My E7200 was pretty easy. I wouldn't be too worried about trying it on a 4670k. If you have some old CPU that can do it lying around I would highly suggest practicing on that, and using it to find the easiest method, then you'll be set to do it to your more expensive i5.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> So after getting my new motherboard, I can get a 4.5GHZ OC on my 4670k at 1.17 volts, but it gets a bit toasty with my 212 EVO at 87C with an ambient of 22C. Do you think it's worth delidding before I get the rest of my custom loop in?


I would wait to see what your temps are like with custom loop.


----------



## Levelog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> I would wait to see what your temps are like with custom loop.


Alright. The reason I was going to beforehand is that I only have money for either the custom loop OR a new i5 if I mess it up.


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

http://www.overclock.net/t/1417554/killed-my-4770k

I read through a few pages of this, and I am rather astounded.

My thoughts are in line with the idea that the origin of the cracking is with the delidding causing bending in the substrate and chip.

Would have thought the best way to avoid this would be to hit the PCB on the side, perpendicular to the length of the chip. By hitting down the length of the silicon you would bend the whole length of the chip. Because of the length of the chip this could very easily crack the silicon. By hitting across the side, therefore making most of the flexing be across the small width of the chip, you could potentially reduce the stress on the chip.

Another possible problem is the IHS bowing, which was mentioned somewhere around the 10th page of that thread, quite plausible too. To avoid this I would avoid using a vise to hold the IHS, instead use a thin sheet of metal, which would rest on the table with the lip of the IHS on top of it. This would avoid the unnecesary possibility of bending the IHS when fastening it. I used a similar method for my E7200 and it seemed to work fine, I never had to squeeze the IHS by its length.

There are potential problems with the first part about hitting perpendicular to the chip. Firstly, if the TIM is hard, it will put more stress on the chip as it will put pressure back on the silicon along the FULL LENGTH of the die. Also, the 4770k that was broken in the other post had cracks mainly down its length, rather than across it, which would lead me to believe that the die was bent across the short side, which is exactly the stress that hammering from the side would impose on the chip.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> Alright. The reason I was going to beforehand is that I only have money for either the custom loop OR a new i5 if I mess it up.


Custom loop all the way, if you're at 4.5 at 1.17v. There's a good possibility you don't need to delidd.


----------



## Shweller

OCN name: shweller
CPU: i5 4670K
on die-TIM: Diamond 7 carart
ihs-TIM: Diamond 7 carart
OC after delid: Stock right now use to be at 4.5GHz @ 1.2V (will Update)
Temp drops: 10°C

Hello, I lapped and delided my 4670K today. Thanks to this thread for the great help and advice.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> So after getting my new motherboard, I can get a 4.5GHZ OC on my 4670k at 1.17 volts, but it gets a bit toasty with my 212 EVO at 87C with an ambient of 22C. Do you think it's worth delidding before I get the rest of my custom loop in?


My 4770k with HT off, at 1.265vcore, peaks in the high 60's encoding now on air without delid - you must be running some crazy hot tests to get those kinds of temps, a solid 15c worse corrected for ambients with 0.1 less vcore.










Pick your poison - a lot of Haswell OCers now found themselves perfectly capable of finding stable settings using cooler tests (by as much as 40c+) and i found no real reason yet to use anything hotter than x264, or for a more aggressive test, prime27.9 custom 1344-1344 fft - though i hear 28.5 1344-1344 is really hard to pass without being hot either


----------



## Levelog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> My 4770k with HT off, at 1.265vcore, peaks in the high 60's encoding now on air without delid - you must be running some crazy hot tests to get those kinds of temps, a solid 15c worse corrected for ambients with 0.1 less vcore.


What are you running as a cooler though? The 212 EVO is only a midrange, and I'm running 10 runs of Burn Test on max.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> What are you running as a cooler though? The 212 EVO is only a midrange, and I'm only running 10 runs of Burn Test on max.


The test you run and how you run it can make a 45c difference or even more, as shown above. The difference between CPU being 30c above ambient, or 70c above.

I'm running a Silver Arrow, but i don't believe that would make a gap of 25c at such a low voltage. Even if it did - the test ran is more important.

Linpack w/ avx1 (IBT) is neither the hottest test, nor the hardest, nor the most effective at bringing down a system (for Haswell), so i don't use or recommend it any more. The ones i just said i believe to be good for finding solid settings, and if you want the hottest and hardest power test, you can grab avx2 version of linpack and score ~200gflops @4ghz (i could probs hit 210 with this RAM)

Given that i can run 1.4v ht off on air and encode/game/everythingelse, your custom loop would probably be fine. If you're happier with 60c instead of 80, though, gogo delid


----------



## Levelog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> The test you run and how you run it can make a 45c difference or even more, as shown above. The difference between CPU being 30c above ambient, or 70c above.
> 
> I'm running a Silver Arrow, but i don't believe that would make a gap of 25c at such a low voltage.


Would you suggest something else than burn test then? It has unfortunately been only recently that I've started building another desktop. Last rig I had was a Phenom X4 several years back.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> Would you suggest something else than burn test then? It has unfortunately been only recently that I've started building another desktop. Last rig I had was a Phenom X4 several years back.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> My 4770k with HT off, at 1.265vcore, peaks in the high 60's encoding now on air without delid - you must be running some crazy hot tests to get those kinds of temps, a solid 15c worse corrected for ambients with 0.1 less vcore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pick your poison - a lot of Haswell OCers now found themselves perfectly capable of finding stable settings using cooler tests (by as much as 40c+) and i found no real reason yet to use anything hotter than x264, or for a more aggressive test, prime27.9 custom 1344-1344 fft - though i hear 28.5 1344-1344 is really hard to pass without being hot either


Sorry, i edited and you maybe didn't see~

For x264 test, see here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-guide-with-statistics/10980_30#post_21941059

I have not ran this particular version yet, but should be good. If you get asked, use 8 threads for encoding on 4670k (2x per core)

x264 is not a perfect catch-all test, so you sometimes have to make adjustments afterwards to stop whea's or crashes. You should be able to make an OC that will never show any signs of instability with some level of ease and no ridiculous temperatures though.


----------



## marrawi

*My Delidding Journey







*







*Before (Stock TIM, Raystorm WB, triple radiator custom loop):*



*After (Noctua nh-t1 on die and on wb):*



I went with Noctua nh-t1 as it is safer than CLU (in my case, haswell bs), when I upped the clock to 4.7 I started getting pre-delid like temps







:



So I grabbed my [email protected]!!$ and put some CLU on die, nh-t1 on block and...







:



I am a believer in CLU, don't waste your time like I stupidly did.

Now to the showoff










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Levelog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Sorry, i edited and you maybe didn't see~
> 
> For x264 test, see here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-guide-with-statistics/10980_30#post_21941059
> 
> I have not ran this particular version yet, but should be good. If you get asked, use 8 threads for encoding on 4670k (2x per core)
> 
> x264 is not a perfect catch-all test, so you sometimes have to make adjustments afterwards to stop whea's or crashes. You should be able to make an OC that will never show any signs of instability with some level of ease and no ridiculous temperatures though.


Thanks for the link man. Shaved 25C off my normal 4.4ghz @ 1.15v OC. I did however have to go all the way up to 1.22v for the 4.5 test due to getting MCE crashes every step until then. Still, I never went past 70C on it.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> Thanks for the link man. Shaved 25C off my normal 4.4ghz @ 1.15v OC. I did however have to go all the way up to 1.22v for the 4.5 test due to getting MCE crashes every step until then. Still, I never went past 70C on it.


i'm somewhere around peaking 70 hottest core w/ [email protected] 4c4t @20c ambient with silver arrow i think. Good airflow, soon to be better, but that doesn't really seem to help temps as much as it keeps them from rising over longer sessions (basically at all)

Can get pretty good CPU load now


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> i'm somewhere around peaking 70 hottest core w/ [email protected] 4c4t @20c ambient with silver arrow i think. Good airflow, soon to be better, but that doesn't really seem to help temps as much as it keeps them from rising over longer sessions (basically at all)
> 
> Can get pretty good CPU load now


I found that most cases seem to get a buildup of warm air above the CPU heatsink... This takes time, but slowly the temps start rising because of that.

My 4440 is running in a 550D with a stock cooler, and when I don't have a top fan P95 gets the CPU to 85c in 30 sec, but after 10 more minutes temps are getting into high 90s. With top fan it peaks at around 92-94, there is still a buildup, but smaller.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorbazTheDragon*
> 
> I found that most cases seem to get a buildup of warm air above the CPU heatsink... This takes time, but slowly the temps start rising because of that.
> 
> My 4440 is running in a 550D with a stock cooler, and when I don't have a top fan P95 gets the CPU to 85c in 30 sec, but after 10 more minutes temps are getting into high 90s. With top fan it peaks at around 92-94, there is still a buildup, but smaller.


My build (got a pic in sig) won't have that problem







(though i'm still messing with fan orientation and need my 3x 120mm front)

With a very small heatsink like the stock cooler or some of the smaller air coolers, there is a real heat buildup over time, one of the benefits of something big like a Silver Arrow is less effect from liquid or heatsink heating up, just solid flat temps

Delid still overpowered though, -20c. I think i'l do it for science as soon as this chip is somewhat expendable


----------



## urbanman2004

Razor method. i7-4770K


----------



## marrawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorbazTheDragon*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1417554/killed-my-4770k
> 
> I read through a few pages of this, and I am rather astounded.
> 
> My thoughts are in line with the idea that the origin of the cracking is with the delidding causing bending in the substrate and chip.
> 
> Would have thought the best way to avoid this would be to hit the PCB on the side, perpendicular to the length of the chip. By hitting down the length of the silicon you would bend the whole length of the chip. Because of the length of the chip this could very easily crack the silicon. By hitting across the side, therefore making most of the flexing be across the small width of the chip, you could potentially reduce the stress on the chip.
> 
> Another possible problem is the IHS bowing, which was mentioned somewhere around the 10th page of that thread, quite plausible too. To avoid this I would avoid using a vise to hold the IHS, instead use a thin sheet of metal, which would rest on the table with the lip of the IHS on top of it. This would avoid the unnecesary possibility of bending the IHS when fastening it. I used a similar method for my E7200 and it seemed to work fine, I never had to squeeze the IHS by its length.
> 
> There are potential problems with the first part about hitting perpendicular to the chip. Firstly, if the TIM is hard, it will put more stress on the chip as it will put pressure back on the silicon along the FULL LENGTH of the die. Also, the 4770k that was broken in the other post had cracks mainly down its length, rather than across it, which would lead me to believe that the die was bent across the short side, which is exactly the stress that hammering from the side would impose on the chip.


if you read on the second page, he had vcroe on adaptive with off-set voltage and ran prime95







. that'll do it whether cpu is delidded or not.


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

I don't think a high voltage would cause that kind of damage, unless somehow magically your motherboard managed to push a few KV through the chip...

Thermal expansion of silicon is very small and I'd think the material is flexible enough to deal with it.


----------



## DeadlyPaperBag

was browsing some pictures of some of the new z97 boards, and found this! Delid die guard, for direct contact :00


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Yeah it's quite a nice idea.

What I'd like to see is Intel making CPUs designed for direct contact. Throw out the IHS and use a ceramic substrate, maybe with a brace around the chip to prevent uneven loading, like they have around the GPU dies.

If they did that for the k and x-series CPUs I'd they'd have a good shot at setting some world records.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeadlyPaperBag*
> 
> was browsing some pictures of some of the new z97 boards, and found this! Delid die guard, for direct contact :00


I am curious if buying this seperate will work on another board... IE, I like my chip Nekkid... and I am very interested as I am moving MOBOs anyway,.


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

It should. Looks like they attach it with the same screw holes that the hold down bracket uses.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorbazTheDragon*
> 
> It should. Looks like they attach it with the same screw holes that the hold down bracket uses.


Exactly what I was thinking :-D Hopefully I can get my hands on one pretty soon.. I will let everyone know, if I can. I am going to attempt changin out everything without removing more than the GPUs from my Loop, and leave the Block attached. This will be the FIRST time that anyone else is allowed to put their hands inside my case... as full year, and No other paws :-D Just this once though...


----------



## nX3NTY

I'm planning to go Haswell but is it really necessary to delid the CPU when I wanted to overclock it? I have delid before on old Sempron 2500+ so I do have experience with it, the thing is Intel CPU are expensive and if anything happen to it I gonna go ape


----------



## welshy46

It's not essential to delid to overclock, but with the extra overclock. You will get extra heat, and Haswell cpu's aren't the greatest at transferring the heat From the chip due to their cheap themal paste.

So although in all likelihood you will be able to overclock higher before hitting the thermal limit of the cpu. It's not necessary to delid, but after delidding and applying a better thermal medium. You should be able to run a higher overclock at lower temps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shweller*
> 
> OCN name: shweller
> CPU: i5 4670K
> on die-TIM: Diamond 7 carart
> ihs-TIM: Diamond 7 carart
> OC after delid: Stock right now use to be at 4.5GHz @ 1.2V (will Update)
> Temp drops: 10°C
> 
> Hello, I lapped and delided my 4670K today. Thanks to this thread for the great help and advice.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## CanadaSpy007

It's worth it and easy if you do the vice method Aswell as use liquid pro for TIM. Definately worth it especially if you get a lemon like I did. If you're not sure, it's a good idea to test to find out how good you're haswell chip performs before the delid. I can't remember the exact voltages but I do know it's 4.2ghz OC to start with 1.2?? Volts then bump it up to 4.5ghz at 1.2?? Then go all out and bump it to 4.8ghz at some voltage and If it's stable then you're chip is over average and such. Mine failed miserably lol 1.4v to maintain 4.7ghz lol if it does fail and you need over 1.30v to maintain over 4.5 ghz than delidding would be benificial for those temps at higher voltage.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nX3NTY*
> 
> I'm planning to go Haswell but is it really necessary to delid the CPU when I wanted to overclock it? I have delid before on old Sempron 2500+ so I do have experience with it, the thing is Intel CPU are expensive and if anything happen to it I gonna go ape


With a good air cooler or ~240mm clc/equivelant, you can probably use about 1.25vcore on i7 before you're averaging over 75 on hottest core with 100% cpu load from encoding (i can use about 1.275 on air, but most people don't have my case temps) and about ~1.33 or so on i5. That will get you about 4.55ghz on an average 4670k, ~4.4 on an average 4770k


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nX3NTY*
> 
> I'm planning to go Haswell but is it really necessary to delid the CPU when I wanted to overclock it? I have delid before on old Sempron 2500+ so I do have experience with it, the thing is Intel CPU are expensive and if anything happen to it I gonna go ape


Haswell run hotter than any of the other chips with voltage regulation on die. I would just do it, you will be happy you did.

If you get a "bad" chip temps can be horrendous out of the gate.


----------



## Shweller

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Thanks! Update: I am at stable 4.6GHz @ 1.25 volts as a DD. Will shoot for 5 in the near future and report back.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shweller*
> 
> Thanks! Update: I am at stable 4.6GHz @ 1.25 volts as a DD. Will shoot for 5 in the near future and report back.


You need to use cpu-z 1.64.0 or the hwinfo "Vcore" sensor (not VID) to see your correct vcore. With 1.25 in bios, it will almost certainly say ~1.264 or ~1.272 (as the sensor is approximate , updates in those steps and IVR overshoots by 20mv)


----------



## gatesmarch

Hi guys,

I'm extremely upset right now. I successfully delidded my 3570k without a hitch. I put new (gelid ultra) tim on, and went to reinstall the processor. It was a little tricky clipping it back down with the lid being loose but I got it done...apparently something went wrong. I proceeded to reinstall my hyper 212 and boot up. One of my cores was running much hotter than the other 3. It was basically 74c vs 36,34,36c. I powered down, gave the heatsink a little wiggle and went to restart. Then it kept cycling..power on, no display for 5 seconds, power off, power on, no display, power off....over and over. I removed everything and saw a few pins on the socket were bent. I then saw a few small black marks on the edge of the lid and the heatsink...obviously some wonderful electrical arcing occurred between the lid and heatsink when the pins got screwed. Now here's my dilemma. Obviously the motherboard is a total loss, I just don't know what to do regarding the processor. Do I dare try it in a new motherboard??? Or just by a new cpu AND motherboard which would suck because I'll be without a computer for two months if that's the case. I've put so much time and money in this rig. I saved up and got a pump and radiator last month and this month I was going to buy an ek waterblock for my gtx 780 classy. I'm just so angry right now...I started hitting the whiskey as soon as I pulled my mobo.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gatesmarch*
> 
> Hi guys,
> 
> I'm extremely upset right now. I successfully delidded my 3570k without a hitch. I put new (gelid ultra) tim on, and went to reinstall the processor. It was a little tricky clipping it back down with the lid being loose but I got it done...apparently something went wrong. I proceeded to reinstall my hyper 212 and boot up. One of my cores was running much hotter than the other 3. It was basically 74c vs 36,34,36c. I powered down, gave the heatsink a little wiggle and went to restart. Then it kept cycling..power on, no display for 5 seconds, power off, power on, no display, power off....over and over. I removed everything and saw a few pins on the socket were bent. I then saw a few small black marks on the edge of the lid and the heatsink...obviously some wonderful electrical arcing occurred between the lid and heatsink when the pins got screwed. Now here's my dilemma. Obviously the motherboard is a total loss, I just don't know what to do regarding the processor. Do I dare try it in a new motherboard??? Or just by a new cpu AND motherboard which would suck because I'll be without a computer for two months if that's the case. I've put so much time and money in this rig. I saved up and got a pump and radiator last month and this month I was going to buy an ek waterblock for my gtx 780 classy. I'm just so angry right now...I started hitting the whiskey as soon as I pulled my mobo.


Don't risk another motherboard. If you can clearly see where it had an arc, then it may cause a problem.. Not worth it.


----------



## marlone

just delidded my 4770k (using AS5 for both, but will change in a week).
i was limited to 4.4 @1.3 (not stabilized) due to temps going above 90c using
im now trying to stabilize 4.5 @ 1.31 and have ran cinebench several times with temps not going above 80C.

very happy with my results!


----------



## Jugurnot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gatesmarch*
> 
> Hi guys,
> 
> I'm extremely upset right now. I successfully delidded my 3570k without a hitch. I put new (gelid ultra) tim on, and went to reinstall the processor. It was a little tricky clipping it back down with the lid being loose but I got it done...apparently something went wrong. I proceeded to reinstall my hyper 212 and boot up. One of my cores was running much hotter than the other 3. It was basically 74c vs 36,34,36c. I powered down, gave the heatsink a little wiggle and went to restart. Then it kept cycling..power on, no display for 5 seconds, power off, power on, no display, power off....over and over. I removed everything and saw a few pins on the socket were bent. I then saw a few small black marks on the edge of the lid and the heatsink...obviously some wonderful electrical arcing occurred between the lid and heatsink when the pins got screwed. Now here's my dilemma. Obviously the motherboard is a total loss, I just don't know what to do regarding the processor. Do I dare try it in a new motherboard??? Or just by a new cpu AND motherboard which would suck because I'll be without a computer for two months if that's the case. I've put so much time and money in this rig. I saved up and got a pump and radiator last month and this month I was going to buy an ek waterblock for my gtx 780 classy. I'm just so angry right now...I started hitting the whiskey as soon as I pulled my mobo.


Ooo no









Not enough whisky in the world to take that pain away.

I think even though the chip may not damage a new motherboard, it probably has got some damage done to it and you will never know for sure.
Buy a new bundle.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marlone*
> 
> just delidded my 4770k (using AS5 for both, but will change in a week).
> i was limited to 4.4 @1.3 (not stabilized) due to temps going above 90c using
> im now trying to stabilize 4.5 @ 1.31 and have ran cinebench several times with temps not going above 80C.
> 
> very happy with my results!


That's hot

i can run with basically those temps on air no delid, but we're talking case temps of 20 or a touch below


----------



## marlone

i am running on air, and right now its hot in my apartment.
ambients are around 32


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marlone*
> 
> i am running on air, and right now its hot in my apartment.
> ambients are around 32


Aha, no wonder then if you're playing from mordor









better paste on-die would still make it better probably


----------



## marlone

yeah sorry i forgot to mention where i was from and the ambients.
im very happy with the results.
temps can definitely go down if I use CLU on the die, probably later on in the future.


----------



## gd350turbo

OCN name: *GD350TURBO*
CPU: *3570K*
On-die TIM: *Collaboratory Liquid Pro*
IHS TIM: *MX4*
Mhz gained: *+~200 MHZ* STABLE *+~400MHz *BENCH
OC after delid: *4.8GHz* for daily use, *5.0GHz* for bench

Temp drops: *On average dropped ~25*


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jugurnot*
> 
> Ooo no
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not enough whisky in the world to take that pain away.
> 
> I think even though the chip may not damage a new motherboard, it probably has got some damage done to it and you will never know for sure.
> Buy a new bundle.


Yeah my thought exactly. I've alread submitted an RMA for the motherboard with ASRock. It looks like it'll cost like $50 to have it fixed. I'm also going to attempt warranty service on the processor...can't hurt. I've seen other delidders have success...my only issue will be getting the black marks off. Either way it's worth a shot I guess.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gd350turbo*
> 
> OCN name: *GD350TURBO*
> 
> CPU: *3570K*
> 
> On-die TIM: *Collaboratory Liquid Pro*
> 
> IHS TIM: *MX4*
> 
> Mhz gained: *+~200 MHZ* STABLE *+~400MHz *BENCH
> 
> OC after delid: *4.8GHz* for daily use, *5.0GHz* for bench
> Temp drops: *On average dropped ~25*


You're in!







SLappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## gd350turbo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SLappa Dat Sig On!


Done !


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gd350turbo*
> 
> OCN name: *GD350TURBO*
> 
> CPU: *3570K*
> 
> On-die TIM: *Collaboratory Liquid Pro*
> 
> IHS TIM: *MX4*
> 
> Mhz gained: *+~200 MHZ* STABLE *+~400MHz *BENCH
> 
> OC after delid: *4.8GHz* for daily use, *5.0GHz* for bench
> Temp drops: *On average dropped ~25*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gd350turbo*
> 
> Done !


Welcome aboard!


----------



## g0nz0

Just delidded and lapped my 4670k. After 2 hrs of AIDA64 my average temperature (for a multiplier of 47) is 54.25 C. Voltages are as follows:-
Vcore 1.2
Vin 1.8
Vring 1.15

Corsair 100i fans set to balanced!

I couldn't be more pleased! This is a 13.75C degree drop for me!

I will see how far I can now push the CPU later this weekend!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0nz0*
> 
> Just delidded and lapped my 4670k. After 2 hrs of AIDA64 my average temperature (for a multiplier of 47) is 54.25 C. Voltages are as follows:-
> Vcore 1.2
> Vin 1.8
> Vring 1.15
> 
> Corsair 100i fans set to balanced!
> 
> I couldn't be more pleased! This is a 13.75C degree drop for me!
> 
> I will see how far I can now push the CPU later this weekend!


jeez [email protected]! That's an insane chip if that holds up!

http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-guide-with-statistics/10980_30#post_21941059

the 295MB build here should be better than adia AFAIK - use 8 threads on i5

you can push vcore into the 1.3-1.35 range at least, keep vin about ~0.6v above it, use a mid-level llc on vin and it should -fly-!


----------



## g0nz0

BOOM....7 hours 20 mins of AIDA64 and my temps were 58, 59, 55, and 53 (AVG 56.25). Voltages were as originally posted (Vcore 1.2 & Vin 1.8).

Corsair 100i fans set to balanced.

Tomorrow I will see how far I can push it...would be great to make the 5 GHz overclock club







.


----------



## FtW 420

Very nice for a retail chip! I posted my ES 4670k results in the haswell guide thread although it didn't get added to the spreadsheet, very similar though, 4.7Ghz stable at ~1.19V.
You should be able to boot 5Ghz pretty easily for the validation, took mine about 1.26v to get to desktop.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FtW 420*
> 
> Very nice for a retail chip! I posted my ES 4670k results in the haswell guide thread although it didn't get added to the spreadsheet, very similar though, 4.7Ghz stable at ~1.19V.
> You should be able to boot 5Ghz pretty easily for the validation, took mine about 1.26v to get to desktop.


Even i was able to valid 5g without >1.4vcore or >2.1vrin and this chip asks for those kinds of volts to be stable @4.7 with ht off lol


----------



## Drmoreau

OCN name: Drmoreau
CPU: 4670K
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: CLP
Mhz gained: -
OC after delid: 4.2 for now will tweak it later
Temp drops: around 10 C

Used the vice method

Before delid:

After:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Drmoreau*
> 
> OCN name: Drmoreau
> CPU: 4670K
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: CLP
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: 4.2 for now will tweak it later
> Temp drops: around 10 C
> 
> Used the vice method
> 
> Before delid:
> 
> After:


You're in! Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## g0nz0

OCN name: G0nz0
CPU: 4670K
on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: - TBC
OC after delid: 4.7 with Vcore @1.2 ...I will push it later!
Temp drops: 13.75


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0nz0*
> 
> OCN name: G0nz0
> CPU: 4670K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: - TBC
> OC after delid: 4.7 with Vcore @1.2 ...I will push it later!
> Temp drops: 13.75


Nice!

x264


----------



## g0nz0

So I've tried x264 and it keeps giving me the BSOD after the second or third loop. Temperatures are low (below 50deg). Any ideas?

test-1080p
50 loops
8 threads
normal priority


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0nz0*
> 
> So I've tried x264 and it keeps giving me the BSOD after the second or third loop. Temperatures are low (below 50deg). Any ideas?
> 
> test-1080p
> 50 loops
> 8 threads
> normal priority


raise vcore +.03 try again.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0nz0*
> 
> So I've tried x264 and it keeps giving me the BSOD after the second or third loop. Temperatures are low (below 50deg). Any ideas?
> 
> test-1080p
> 50 loops
> 8 threads
> normal priority


Which BSOD? 124, 101?

You can probably adress and fix basic problems by raising Vcore while keeping VRIN to 0.6 above it and setting VRIN LLC to Turbo.


----------



## g0nz0

Thanks for all your help.

BSOD 101, which a quick google search informs me I should up Vcore!

I guess I should have been more specific with my question. So I would equate the CPU temps with how much work or stress I was putting on my CPU. The initial temps I was getting with A64DA64 were higher than what I was getting with x264 yet my after maybe 5 minutes or so I was getting the BSOD using x264.

So what is it about the x264 test that is more difficult for my CPU. I guess I'm looking for an understanding of the difference between the two types of test.

Lastly can I put the delid signature on my profile...annnnd how in gods name do I do this?!!!

I hope everyones weekend has been a good one!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0nz0*
> 
> OCN name: G0nz0
> CPU: 4670K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: - TBC
> OC after delid: 4.7 with Vcore @1.2 ...I will push it later!
> Temp drops: 13.75


You're in! SLappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0nz0*
> 
> Thanks for all your help.
> 
> BSOD 101, which a quick google search informs me I should up Vcore!
> 
> I guess I should have been more specific with my question. So I would equate the CPU temps with how much work or stress I was putting on my CPU. The initial temps I was getting with A64DA64 were higher than what I was getting with x264 yet my after maybe 5 minutes or so I was getting the BSOD using x264.
> 
> So what is it about the x264 test that is more difficult for my CPU. I guess I'm looking for an understanding of the difference between the two types of test.
> 
> Lastly can I put the delid signature on my profile...annnnd how in gods name do I do this?!!!
> 
> I hope everyones weekend has been a good one!


Well, Linpack can be over 50c hotter than x264. x264 with this test is usually as hot or hotter than any max CPU load, though, and it's quite hard to pass.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Got my new mobo in, and will try to get over 4.6 stable. Finally made it to 4.6 on this mother board and still not happy with that.


----------



## marrawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Got my new mobo in, and will try to get over 4.6 stable. Finally made it to 4.6 on this mother board and still not happy with that.


what's the cpu and mobo?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Got my new mobo in, and will try to get over 4.6 stable. Finally made it to 4.6 on this mother board and still not happy with that.


You may simply be limited by the capabilities of the chip. 4.6 is solid for a 4770k. Haswell can perform just as well, or better than, Ivy even if you're a couple hundred MHz behind.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marrawi*
> 
> what's the cpu and mobo?


Delid, bare die, 4770k currently in a Z87-pro moving over to a Z87 Classified tonight.

Big Brother is the one getting the upgrade.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> You may simply be limited by the capabilities of the chip. 4.6 is solid for a 4770k. Haswell can perform just as well, or better than, Ivy even if you're a couple hundred MHz behind.


The mobo has been a pain in my butt since I bought it. It was a very spur of the moment buy when I had to RMA another board.

The 4.6 was after a lot of hard pushing and kicking to get it to go there. Hoping a better, more suited mobo will provide better range, even if it is just allowing the graphics to run better.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> You may simply be limited by the capabilities of the chip. 4.6 is solid for a 4770k. Haswell can perform just as well, or better than, Ivy even if you're a couple hundred MHz behind.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Delid, bare die, 4770k currently in a Z87-pro moving over to a Z87 Classified tonight.
> 
> Big Brother is the one getting the upgrade.
> The mobo has been a pain in my butt since I bought it. It was a very spur of the moment buy when I had to RMA another board.
> 
> The 4.6 was after a lot of hard pushing and kicking to get it to go there. Hoping a better, more suited mobo will provide better range, even if it is just allowing the graphics to run better.


normal chip gets like 4.5-4.8 on 1.4v, pretty much


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> normal chip gets like 4.5-4.8 on 1.4v, pretty much


I just want it to be stable. I have finally had this motherboard remain stable for 24+ hours. I didn't realize I needed to bump the input voltage. A slight increase, and the whole system is smoother.

Now, if I can get just a little more, with a better board, I will be extremely happy. I like this little chip a lot.


----------



## g0nz0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> Nice!
> 
> x264


So finally got everything stable for x264, details below.

Loops:25 (~5 and a half hours)
Vcore: 1.224
Temps: 54, 55, 53 50. Avg 53

I still dont understand why compared to AIDA64 the temps were lower but I had to up Vcore!

Now to 5GHz!!


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0nz0*
> 
> So finally got everything stable for x264, details below.
> 
> Loops:25 (~5 and a half hours)
> Vcore: 1.224
> Temps: 54, 55, 53 50. Avg 53
> 
> I still dont understand why compared to AIDA64 the temps were lower but I had to up Vcore!
> 
> Now to 5GHz!!


Quote:


> I still dont understand why compared to AIDA64 the temps were lower but I had to up Vcore!


Drawing more power (being hotter) does not neccesarily correlate to being more demanding on stability, and there are some tests (avx2 linpack, up to ~210gflops @4ghz) that draw so much more power than others (on the leagues of like nearly twice as much as maxing your cpu with x264, hitting 100c before x264 hits 55 sometimes!) that are just beyond silly to run

x264 + maybe a few slight tweaks (but even that might be unnecessary now, with recent encoder versions increasing stress some) should be good to go, GL on 5ghz


----------



## titter

OCN name: titter
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: GELID GC-Extreme
ihs-TIM: GELID GC-Extreme
Mhz gained: 200mhz so far
OC after delid: 4.8 but still benching and needing a lot of vcore voltage to get there >1.4 and >2 Vin. I have to do a lot more research into the other voltages.
Temp drops: OCCT large data set 85C prior to delid at 4.6 1.28V. After delid 62C at 4.6 1.28V. Drop of 23C. I might have used a little less tim than I should have the first time on the H100i block, and increased the amount slighty. It spread very well and coverage was good, but just thin.
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Still working on it.

Used the vice method



The paste was barely on the die itself. This could have been why my core temps were so high. The glue around the outside was extremely bulky. There had to be a good gap.



Core info.


So for now I need to figure out why I need such a huge voltage increase to add 200 more mhz. It ran OCCT for 2 hours at 4.6 under at 1.28 volts with a uncore multiplier of 42. Time to test







Open to suggestions. Asus Maximus IV Hero, 4770k, 16GB Vengenance Pro DDR3 2400, H100i push with 2 high performance SP120 PWM's, 2x140mm AF140 intakes, 1x120mm AF120 exhaust, 300R case. Motherboard temps are 25C, ambient is 22C.


----------



## titter

Also just because I had this Xeon sitting around, I used it as my test cpu before hammering on the brand new 4770k.

I thought this was interesting to see. Look how much better the coverage is compared to the newer chips.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *titter*
> 
> Also just because I had this Xeon sitting around, I used it as my test cpu before hammering on the brand new 4770k.
> 
> I thought this was interesting to
> 
> see. Look how much better the coverage is compared to the newer chips.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That is a lot of difference.

What is the maximum temp a PCB should get to? I am asking out of curiosity toward soldering compared to TIM.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *titter*
> 
> OCN name: titter
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: GELID GC-Extreme
> ihs-TIM: GELID GC-Extreme
> Mhz gained: 200mhz so far
> OC after delid: 4.8 but still benching and needing a lot of vcore voltage to get there >1.4 and >2 Vin. I have to do a lot more research into the other voltages.
> Temp drops: OCCT large data set 85C prior to delid at 4.6 1.28V. After delid 62C at 4.6 1.28V. Drop of 23C. I might have used a little less tim than I should have the first time on the H100i block, and increased the amount slighty. It spread very well and coverage was good, but just thin.
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Still working on it.
> 
> Used the vice method
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The paste was barely on the die itself. This could have been why my core temps were so high. The glue around the outside was extremely bulky. There had to be a good gap.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Core info.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So for now I need to figure out why I need such a huge voltage increase to add 200 more mhz. It ran OCCT for 2 hours at 4.6 under at 1.28 volts with a uncore multiplier of 42. Time to test
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Open to suggestions. Asus Maximus IV Hero, 4770k, 16GB Vengenance Pro DDR3 2400, H100i push with 2 high performance SP120 PWM's, 2x140mm AF140 intakes, 1x120mm AF120 exhaust, 300R case. Motherboard temps are 25C, ambient is 22C.


You're in! Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## superV

hi all.i have 2x 4770k with delid and every time i mount these cpus my maximus vi extreme(i do direct mounting,cooler on the chip), says memory error so then i have to do lost of times memOK or to screw or unscrew a bit the waterblock and after works.
what can be the problem ?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superV*
> 
> hi all.i have 2x 4770k with delid and every time i mount these cpus my maximus vi extreme(i do direct mounting,cooler on the chip), says memory error so then i have to do lost of times memOK or to screw or unscrew a bit the waterblock and after works.
> what can be the problem ?


The mount being too tight can cause that.


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superV*
> 
> hi all.i have 2x 4770k with delid and every time i mount these cpus my maximus vi extreme(i do direct mounting,cooler on the chip), says memory error so then i have to do lost of times memOK or to screw or unscrew a bit the waterblock and after works.
> what can be the problem ?


Socket pins slightly off because of uneven pressure on mount.


----------



## superV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> Socket pins slightly off because of uneven pressure on mount.


yep you right,i removed motherboard cpu brackets so i put the cpu with some electrical tape to fix it a bit before i put the waterblock so without the brackets it doesnt make good contact.now it works very good both cpus.i saw that msi bracket for delidded cpus...dammm thats so good


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superV*
> 
> yep you right,i removed motherboard cpu brackets so i put the cpu with some electrical tape to fix it a bit before i put the waterblock so without the brackets it doesnt make good contact.now it works very good both cpus.i saw that msi bracket for delidded cpus...dammm thats so good


you gave him credit but i said it first lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> The mount being too tight can cause that.


Glad you resolved it.


----------



## cdnGhost

OCN name: CdnGhost
CPU: i7-4770k
on die-TIM: GELID GC-Extreme
ihs-TIM: not in use.
Mhz gained: 200mhz so far
OC after delid: 4.6ghz
Temp drops: prior to delid was running around 89-95 at 4.6ghz..... now low 70s on intel burn test max...
CPU-Z validation of max OC: not sure what my max is yet... but here is mine running at 4.6ghz http://valid.x86.fr/wrcfwq

I used the vice method which i previously posted a million posts back lol.... ill see if i can find it and link it to this post later...

did i miss anything? or can I finally join? !


----------



## SgtRotty

hello, i have a quick question or two. i delidded my 4770k last night with razor method. i applied CLP under the IHS and covered the die. how much is considered to much CLP? for example, i applied to the die with the cpu out of my case/MB, when holding it in the light, i can tilt it back and forth and visibly see the CLP sliding back and forth. is that too much? i installed it as i described, it boots works as it did with cooler temps. but not as much as i thought it would be. i also have a low overclock so i wasnt expecting a dramatic drop.

also, second question, i used AS5 on top of IHS to the cooler. i know that AS5 takes a long time to cure, i dont care about any warranty, will CLP make a bigger difference on the IHS than AS5 before it cures? thx!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> OCN name: CdnGhost
> CPU: i7-4770k
> on die-TIM: GELID GC-Extreme
> ihs-TIM: not in use.
> Mhz gained: 200mhz so far
> OC after delid: 4.6ghz
> Temp drops: prior to delid was running around 89-95 at 4.6ghz..... now low 70s on intel burn test max...
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: not sure what my max is yet... but here is mine running at 4.6ghz http://valid.x86.fr/wrcfwq
> 
> I used the vice method which i previously posted a million posts back lol.... ill see if i can find it and link it to this post later...
> 
> did i miss anything? or can I finally join? !


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SgtRotty*
> 
> hello, i have a quick question or two. i delidded my 4770k last night with razor method. i applied CLP under the IHS and covered the die. how much is considered to much CLP? for example, i applied to the die with the cpu out of my case/MB, when holding it in the light, i can tilt it back and forth and visibly see the CLP sliding back and forth. is that too much? i installed it as i described, it boots works as it did with cooler temps. but not as much as i thought it would be. i also have a low overclock so i wasnt expecting a dramatic drop.
> 
> also, second question, i used AS5 on top of IHS to the cooler. i know that AS5 takes a long time to cure, i dont care about any warranty, will CLP make a bigger difference on the IHS than AS5 before it cures? thx!


A picture would help, but yea.. sounds like WAAY too much CLP,
This is how much I used (19 degree drop)


You only need a tiny tiny drop, and then brush it out to a really thin layer.. then just apply whatever is left on your brush / q-tip to the underside of the IHS

CLP is great for die->ihs, but you wont see too much of a temp difference using it IHS->Cooler vs say, MX4.. maybe a degree or two.


----------



## SgtRotty

Too much?? Or to little?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Hmm,, it actually doesnt look too bad, but I see 3 big blobs on the die and 4 small ones on ISH.
Try to get rid of most of that and even out whats left.

It is hard to tell when you are not standing next to it, but I would say that one or two of the big blobs would be enough for the entire die + ihs.


----------



## SgtRotty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hmm,, it actually doesnt look too bad, but I see 3 big blubs on the die and 4 small ones on ISH.
> Try to get rid of most of that and even out whats left.
> 
> It is hard to tell when you are not standing next to it, but I would say that one or two of the big blobs would be enough for the entire die + ihs.


Thx for the response. I moved it around a little better. I did see a littlepart of the die showing. Appreciate your time!


----------



## GaMbi2004

np







thats why im here..
Sorry for the delay.. was playing dead space


----------



## MxPhenom 216

Anyone here delid their chips, then use the EK Delid Naked kit to run their CPU with no IHS?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MxPhenom 216*
> 
> Anyone here delid their chips, then use the EK Delid Naked kit to run their CPU with no IHS?


Yes. My die is nekid and I am using the EK bare die kit. It works exactly as if the die was still on. Super easy and have been using it for almost 2 months. Any questions?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MxPhenom 216*
> 
> Anyone here delid their chips, then use the EK Delid Naked kit to run their CPU with no IHS?


Yep, with multiple remounts, zero issues. Wonderful kit, easy to install, great temps.

Pro tip: careful around the socket when you are removing the latch assembly, if you still have the blank socket filler that came with your motherboard, stick it in there until it is time to drop in the chip.


----------



## superV

any brackets to keep the cpu fixed for direct chip cooling?
i saw that from msi looks amazing,but cant find nothing similar.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superV*
> 
> any brackets to keep the cpu fixed for direct chip cooling?
> i saw that from msi looks amazing,but cant find nothing similar.


I wish. If someone finds one, let me know. I am using tape to hold it in place right now.


----------



## superV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I wish. If someone finds one, let me know. I am using tape to hold it in place right now.


me too, electrical tape on both sides.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Lol, nice








So you are one happy camper right now.
Congrats.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *superV*
> 
> any brackets to keep the cpu fixed for direct chip cooling?
> i saw that from msi looks amazing,but cant find nothing similar.


That MSI one has been teased for a while, and I dont know if they are even going to be selling it sans board. If you water cool, EK makes a naked kit, but it is not a bracket over the die, it is just a slightly shorter mount kit for the supremacy block.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That MSI one has been teased for a while, and I dont know if they are even going to be selling it sans board. If you water cool, EK makes a naked kit, but it is not a bracket over the die, it is just a slightly shorter mount kit for the supremacy block.


I used the Naked Mount Kit and it is nice, but it is kind of a pain not being able to take the block off to change the motherboard or anything, because you have to lay the case on its side or risk dropping the CPU if tape doesn't hold.


----------



## SonDa5

That MSI retention block is best bare die retention gadget that I have seen. Hope MSI sells it as an accessory to anyone that wants one.


----------



## superV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> That MSI retention block is best bare die retention gadget that I have seen. Hope MSI sells it as an accessory to anyone that wants one.


----------



## Frostnacht

Hey guys...

OK, let's see:

OCN name: Frostnacht
CPU: i7-4770K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM:CLU
Mhz gained:
OC after delid: actually 4,5 (didnt changed yet). will be done next days, wanna hit 4,7GHz
Temp drops: 18°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/41e9sd

Unfortunately, I have seen after delidding you use Intel Burn Tets for reference.
Have tested it with prime95, please be merciful!











Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



pre delid

opened case, no airflow

delidded

closed case, airflow



Frostl


----------



## Cyro999

^Heya m8, grab cpu-z 1.64.0 to show the right vcore sensor









hwinfo is good too (not hwmonitor) for the "Vcore" sensor (not VID)

Looks like you can shoot for ~4.7 with HT


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frostnacht*
> 
> Hey guys...
> 
> OK, let's see:
> 
> OCN name: Frostnacht
> CPU: i7-4770K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM:CLU
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid: actually 4,5 (didnt changed yet). will be done next days, wanna hit 4,7GHz
> Temp drops: 18°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/41e9sd
> 
> Unfortunately, I have seen after delidding you use Intel Burn Tets for reference.
> Have tested it with prime95, please be merciful!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> pre delid
> 
> opened case, no airflow
> 
> delidded
> 
> closed case, airflow
> 
> 
> 
> Frostl


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!























AND WELCOME TO OCN!


----------



## vtecjunkie81

Hey all, I'm getting ready to delid my 4670k and was wondering if it would be safe to mark the PCB with a permanent marker. I was thinking of doing a test fit of clamping down the IHS and marking it once I got it into the initial position to clamp it down. That way once I put the CLU on and go to clamp down the IHS I'll know exactly where to put it.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vtecjunkie81*
> 
> Hey all, I'm getting ready to delid my 4670k and was wondering if it would be safe to mark the PCB with a permanent marker. I was thinking of doing a test fit of clamping down the IHS and marking it once I got it into the initial position to clamp it down. That way once I put the CLU on and go to clamp down the IHS I'll know exactly where to put it.


Not necessary. But you can if you feel better about it that way. Its going to slide when your tightening the clamp down anyway.


----------



## marrawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vtecjunkie81*
> 
> Hey all, I'm getting ready to delid my 4670k and was wondering if it would be safe to mark the PCB with a permanent marker. I was thinking of doing a test fit of clamping down the IHS and marking it once I got it into the initial position to clamp it down. That way once I put the CLU on and go to clamp down the IHS I'll know exactly where to put it.


I haven't tried permanent marker, but I wouldn't think it might harm the PCB, markers are not conductive (at least when dry). With that said, you don't really need to mark it, you just have to slide the IHS up a tiny bit before clamping the CPU as it'll slide down during the process. It worked fine with me. Good luck dude!


----------



## Frostnacht

Cyro, it was rather my intention, but instead hwinfo i got hwmonitor... dont know why i didnt noticed it!







thanks!









Finally it's running with 4,7GHz... After deinstalling XTU (it was struggeling the whole time. Every time i booted the vcore, power, etc changed on a ridiclous way) I defaulted the BIOS settings.

After many tries i got it, so actually the coolest stable setting:
Vcore 1.350V
CPU Ring 1.080V
Uncore 40x (automatically adjusted)
VRIN 1.900V
DRAM voltage 1.65V (for 2400MHz)

With Prime95 it ran for 25min:

the power consumption is blasting!

and ITB for reference:


VICTORY!









@Valgaur Thanks alot!









Frostl

Edit: on load the sensor said VCore 1.368

Edit2: Prime was running with max FPS stress test!


----------



## Valgaur

No problem this is what the guide and community are here for


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

So, funny story of fear and regret. I decided to redo my entire loop last night, and change tubing and fitting, and add two cards to the loop... So, I put the Fittings on the CPU block, and start pushing the tubing on, and *POP* happens.. At this point, my heart drops, as nothing moved near the case...

To this minute, I do not know what it was, but my initial thought was that I had just smashed the die, and the CPU was fried.. It was not that, as it is still working just fine. I have no clue what it was though..


----------



## blackmagic12345

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> So, funny story of fear and regret. I decided to redo my entire loop last night, and change tubing and fitting, and add two cards to the loop... So, I put the Fittings on the CPU block, and start pushing the tubing on, and *POP* happens.. At this point, my heart drops, as nothing moved near the case...
> 
> To this minute, I do not know what it was, but my initial thought was that I had just smashed the die, and the CPU was fried.. It was not that, as it is still working just fine. I have no clue what it was though..


Possibly a rather thick cable got stuck in one of the fans and when you switched it on it got slapped out the way (like the song







) and hit the case?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blackmagic12345*
> 
> Possibly a rather thick cable got stuck in one of the fans and when you switched it on it got slapped out the way (like the song
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and hit the case?


No, I was pushing the tube onto the fitting.. No power to the case, and that was the only thing moving... What ever it was, I am just glad it wasn't the Die.


----------



## Ponteral

Hi guys, I just delidded my i7-4770k (photo below) and I guess I did it wrong. My chip is okey, I mean apply new TIM.

I used AC-MX4 on the DIE and between IHS and cooler. I use Gelid revision 2. and Look ad the images. I guessed that temperatures will be lower, but it's the same. Where may I make mistake? Bad apply of TIM? Bad Cooler (I will buy Noctua NH-D15 next month). I have CLU, but I'm little worry to apply it. Can you give and advice, what do you use to cover eletric regulators on the left side of the chip? I know it's something non-conductive, but what exactly?

I have only one fan in my case for the exhaust. I have now case without side panels. It's Nanoxia Deep Silence 1.

I have overclocked my haswell to 4.7 GHz. VCORE I have 1.285V.

Here my delidded chip



Before -



after delidd



Thanks before for advices.


----------



## Valgaur

To much or bad application. why not use CLU/CLP????


----------



## Ponteral

Little scary I guess. And also I read, that it's very hard to remove it, isn't it? That's the reason why I don¨t use it yet. first I need to buy liquid electrical tape







then I will apply CLU. I got it at home









After some time, is it necessary to re-aply CLU? Can you tell me that?

Tomorrow I will reapply MX4, let's see what happens


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ponteral*
> 
> Little scary I guess. And also I read, that it's very hard to remove it, isn't it? That's the reason why I don¨t use it yet. first I need to buy liquid electrical tape
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> then I will apply CLU. I got it at home
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After some time, is it necessary to re-aply CLU? Can you tell me that?
> 
> Tomorrow I will reapply MX4, let's see what happens


You could also use some blue painters tape over the delicate stuff while you apply the CLU and then pull it back off. Clear fingernail polish would do the trick as well.

Edit: Is this a refresh chip or one of the older haswells? Reason I ask is that there were rumors Intel is doing something to fix the thermal issues with the refresh chips. Just wondering if yours is one of the new new chips.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Ok..
You can cover the regulators with many things.. liquid electrical tape, clear nail polish, or even MX4.
Iw used CLU for over 8 months now.. just to test, I opened to check on the state of it.. still "liquidy", and was easy to clean (but no need so I just closed it up again)
It isnt hard to clean off the die or under the IHS.. If you use CLP/CLU on IHS->Cooler and the cooler is copper, you might have a hard time cleaning it.. just use it on DIE->IHS it will be easy to clean (but not needed for a long time)
You will see much better temp drop with CLP/CLU vs MX4.

Heres a pic of my 4670K with regulators covered in MX4







I would use nail polish if I had it, but I didnt.. soo.. yea









19 degree temp drop.


----------



## Ponteral

Well, I tried it again, but I have immediately BSOD. I putted off my cooler, and TIM between base and IHS was not over all surface now. So I'm litlle worried if I flexed my IHS in vice. but I did not keep it in there so hard, just little. Is it possible to flex IHS in vice when dellid? I hope not... so I will try again stress test in Prime

edit: temperatures are around 80°C now, max 82.

So it's now better, but not that much as I hoped for...


----------



## blackmagic12345

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ponteral*
> 
> Well, I tried it again, but I have immediately BSOD. I putted off my cooler, and TIM between base and IHS was not over all surface now. So I'm litlle worried if I flexed my IHS in vice. but I did not keep it in there so hard, just little. Is it possible to flex IHS in vice when dellid? I hope not... so I will try again stress test in Prime
> 
> edit: temperatures are around 80°C now, max 82.
> 
> So it's now better, but not that much as I hoped for...


def possible if you over torque the vice


----------



## Ponteral

I did that very carefully, just like that chip was holding there, not to strong... I think this is okey, temperatures dropped, not to much, but dropped... First time it was the same and TIM was over the whole surface of my cooler. I'm probably tired, I have 4 am in here...









EDIT: On stock frequency on idle temperatures dropped around 5°C, before delidd it was around 30-31°C. Now it's around 25-26°C in real temp. On one core is even 22°C... I think IHS is okey. I just applied TIM badly..


----------



## SonDa5

Summer 2014 the Razer is coming out for 4790K!!!!


----------



## TonicX

Still running OC bare-die setup with cool lab liquid ultra and copper water block. Have not altered or inspected it for over 14 months.


----------



## Ponteral

So, I set my max setting. CPU 4.7 Ghz at 1.285V and RAM 2200 Mhz; 11 - 12 -11 - 30. I have 2x8GB Kingston HyperX genenis 1600 Mhz. 9-9-9-27.

I had before delidd 92°C in Prime95 with these setting, after delidd and MX4 on the DIE it's little bit better 85°C, so 7°C dropped. As the cooler I use gelid tranquillo rev.2

I will definitely use CLU next month and also I will buy Noctua NH-D15, so hope it will be a lot better with CLU and new cooler...


----------



## naved777

is there any way to remove CLU safely from IHS without scratching ?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> is there any way to remove CLU safely from IHS without scratching ?


Go to the supermarket and look in the section with the cleaning products. Buy metal polish that is not abrasive (that's what you have to look out for, if it's abrasive or not). Then go at it with a drop of the metal polish and a cloth. If the metal polish mentions that it "protects", that means you'll afterwards have to clean with alcohol as it'll leave some sort of grease or something.

Did you already try wiping it off with a paper towel and that didn't work? It might just come off fine like that.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> is there any way to remove CLU safely from IHS without scratching ?


easiest way is to use a paper towel in my mind. I find it very easy no need for special materials


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> is there any way to remove CLU safely from IHS without scratching ?


Alcohol wipe that came with it or a paper towel. I usually dampen the paper towel and CLLP and CLLU seem to just wipe off with a damp rag.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Go to the supermarket and look in the section with the cleaning products. Buy metal polish that is not abrasive (that's what you have to look out for, if it's abrasive or not). Then go at it with a drop of the metal polish and a cloth. If the metal polish mentions that it "protects", that means you'll afterwards have to clean with alcohol as it'll leave some sort of grease or something.
> 
> Did you already try wiping it off with a paper towel and that didn't work? It might just come off fine like that.


Coollaboratory shows them using an alcohol wipe. They even have a 1 minute long video about it, lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> easiest way is to use a paper towel in my mind. I find it very easy no need for special materials


Agreed


----------



## rustypixel

Got the nerve to do this using the razor blade method a few days back. Used a pair of surgical gloves and six single edge razor blades. I bought a bunch of blades and used a fresh one at each corner and a couple for the sides. Used a slight, but firm wiggling motion at the corners and found that using a fresh blade on each corner made things really easy. I felt the blade cutting through the glue and when I had a majority of the adhesive cut I gently wiggled off the IHS. It literally took me less than 4 minutes to get this done and that includes a pee break








It took me longer to clean the IHS and the chip itself than it took me to delid. I got rid of all the TIM and as much of the dried adhesive as I could but didn't want to get rid of all the old glue as I expected it to act as a bit of a grip to help keep the IHS in place when reinserting the chip onto the clamp. I used CL Ultra on the die and put a bead of MX-4 on the capacitors right next to the die to protect them from any stray CL Ultra getting on them. I carefully placed the IHS back on and let the whole thing sit over night before putting the CPU back onto the mobo clamp. I didn't have a single issue with the IHS shifting or moving.
I was way too focused to take any pictures before, during or after so I'm not sure I am eligible for the club but I'm just here to say that it's easier than I thought and wouldn't hesitate to do it again.

Edited for spelling booboos.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Currently i have a delidded 4770k, but no clu or clp, but i do have a abundance of nth1, gelid, as5, tx2, mx4, among others, is there any preferred those that i can use between the die and IHS, and IHS and waterblock? atleast for the time being until my CLU comes in? thanks guys


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Currently i have a delidded 4770k, but no clu or clp, but i do have a abundance of nth1, gelid, as5, tx2, mx4, among others, is there any preferred those that i can use between the die and IHS, and IHS and waterblock? atleast for the time being until my CLU comes in? thanks guys


gelid


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Currently i have a delidded 4770k, but no clu or clp, but i do have a abundance of nth1, gelid, as5, tx2, mx4, among others, is there any preferred those that i can use between the die and IHS, and IHS and waterblock? atleast for the time being until my CLU comes in? thanks guys


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> gelid


If it's the Gelid GC-Extreme, use that, even when the CLP/CLU comes in, it's not worth the 1-2c @ full load IMHO to use the Coollabs stuff.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Sweet, I didn't see your post yet but I wanted to put my cpu block on so I just used gelid anyways lol

Holy moly. So first try I did I didn't clean off all the glue, like in the very deep crevices, that or I just didn't paste very well, and was getting pretty raunchy high Temps, probably a little higher than stock.

I cleaned out all of the glue, reseated, and now I'm getting 4.5 @ 1.3v at high 70c, before I delidded I would spike into the 90s here and there.

I haven't really played with my voltages and my clock speed to much yet but all I know is with this cpu, I am not able to do [email protected] lol, I'm still a little new to oc'ing, so I don't really know how to play with the core ratio and voltage ratios and other what not, I just toss it in manual and see if it posts and is stable.

I'm still trying to learn it all, but boy oh boy I'm happy with the delid.

Waiting for my clu to come in, and hopefully it'll be even better hehe

Anyone try the Indigo extreme kits they sell? I saw one at frys and picked it up just because I heard of it somewhere, I wonder how clu on the die, and Indigo is on the IHS.

I also ordered the naked Ivy /haswell brackets from Ek, anyone use those? If you did, did you get better Temps than with the IHS?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Sweet, I didn't see your post yet but I wanted to put my cpu block on so I just used gelid anyways lol
> 
> Holy moly. So first try I did I didn't clean off all the glue, like in the very deep crevices, that or I just didn't paste very well, and was getting pretty raunchy high Temps, probably a little higher than stock.
> 
> I cleaned out all of the glue, reseated, and now I'm getting 4.5 @ 1.3v at high 70c, before I delidded I would spike into the 90s here and there.
> 
> I haven't really played with my voltages and my clock speed to much yet but all I know is with this cpu, I am not able to do [email protected] lol, I'm still a little new to oc'ing, so I don't really know how to play with the core ratio and voltage ratios and other what not, I just toss it in manual and see if it posts and is stable.
> 
> I'm still trying to learn it all, but boy oh boy I'm happy with the delid.
> 
> Waiting for my clu to come in, and hopefully it'll be even better hehe
> 
> Anyone try the Indigo extreme kits they sell? I saw one at frys and picked it up just because I heard of it somewhere, I wonder how clu on the die, and Indigo is on the IHS.
> 
> I also ordered the naked Ivy /haswell brackets from Ek, anyone use those? If you did, did you get better Temps than with the IHS?


indigo is pretty good for on top of the IHS to the cooler. but for the die to IHS its CLU/CLP all the way.


----------



## Jimhans1

I only saw a full burn temp decrease of 1-2c going to clu/clp on die vs the Gelid GC-Extreme, not worth it IMHO, since I got a 20c temp decrease doing the delid and using GC-extreme. Just my







and Indigo is dang sure not worth the hassle.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> I only saw a full burn temp decrease of 1-2c going to clu/clp on die vs the Gelid GC-Extreme, not worth it IMHO, since I got a 20c temp decrease doing the delid and using GC-extreme. Just my
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and Indigo is dang sure not worth the hassle.


I ran tests that gained 2c to 5c. Gelid is very nice tim.

Clp vs gelid http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24090_10#post_21822222


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I ran tests that gained 2c to 5c. Gelid is very nice tim.
> 
> Clp vs gelid http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24090_10#post_21822222


Cool, I'm glad your system did better with it, 5c is almost enough of a gain for me to think it would be worth the hassle of their product, but still not quite honestly IMHO.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Cool, I'm glad your system did better with it, 5c is almost enough of a gain for me to think it would be worth the hassle of their product, but still not quite honestly IMHO.


I already had both. If you have the gelid already just use that inside and out.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Thanks guys I really appreciate it i need to order more gelid lol

Originally I tried nth1 that didn't do too good


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Thanks guys I really appreciate it i need to order more gelid lol
> 
> Originally I tried nth1 that didn't do too good


if you use gelid correctly, one tube will last a really long time. I got about 20 applications from one before buying more. I keep gelid around always now.


----------



## Serandur

Hello, I've got a relatively new 3770K and just got a PH-TC14PE to cool it as I overclocked and so there's no doubt about it now (especially with my hottest core getting up to 15C hotter than my coolest) that my 3770K is highly thermally-limited and would stand to benefit quite a bit from a delid. My chip's not the best as far as voltage goes, being stable at 4.3 GHz requires about 1.18v with the hottest core getting to 78C, 4.4 requires 1.23 with the hottest getting to mid-80s, and 4.5 needs ~1.28-1.29 with the hottest core peaking at about 90.

Anyway, I'm still preparing, but I have read quite a bit about it and have a few questions. Is it likely I might see noticeable decrease in vcore necessary to remain stable at those hotter frequencies given how hot my chip is running? I've also come to the conclusion I would feel safer with the hammer and vice method, but I do not own a vice and could use a recommendation for a cheap and able one. Thank you.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Hello, I've got a relatively new 3770K and just got a PH-TC14PE to cool it as I overclocked and so there's no doubt about it now (especially with my hottest core getting up to 15C hotter than my coolest) that my 3770K is highly thermally-limited and would stand to benefit quite a bit from a delid. My chip's not the best as far as voltage goes, being stable at 4.3 GHz requires about 1.18v with the hottest core getting to 78C, 4.4 requires 1.23 with the hottest getting to mid-80s, and 4.5 needs ~1.28-1.29 with the hottest core peaking at about 90.
> 
> Anyway, I'm still preparing, but I have read quite a bit about it and have a few questions. Is it likely I might see noticeable decrease in vcore necessary to remain stable at those hotter frequencies given how hot my chip is running? I've also come to the conclusion I would feel safer with the hammer and vice method, but I do not own a vice and could use a recommendation for a cheap and able one. Thank you.


A substantial decrease in vcore required after delid is not going to happen. At the higher clocks/ temps it will help with stability. It just is not going to allow much if any lower vcore for certain clock speed.


----------



## wgoldingful

Hi,

Does adding CLP between the die and IHS glue them together in any way? Specifically, would they come apart if I held them upside down? Same goes for thermal paste.
Also, if applying CLP, does the chip need time to set before using?

Thanks


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wgoldingful*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Does adding CLP between the die and IHS glue them together in any way? Specifically, would they come apart if I held them upside down? Same goes for thermal paste.
> Also, if applying CLP, does the chip need time to set before using?
> 
> Thanks


.no it is not glued. it is two pieces after delid. There is no reason to glue it together either. When you lock down the cpu into the mobo the IHS is secured.


----------



## wgoldingful

Out of interest, would regular thermal paste act as an adhesive?

Also, does CLP need time to set after applying?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wgoldingful*
> 
> Out of interest, would regular thermal paste act as an adhesive?
> 
> Also, does CLP need time to set after applying?


no setup time. Thermal PASTE is paste so yes. But regular TIM is not a paste. Pastes are normally for different applications. Like VRM heatsinks. Not used for CPUs.

if you want to glue the IHS back down You need a two part epoxy. just use the epoxy where the old epoxy you removed was. You still use improved tim (clp or gelid) on the die. I do not recommend this though. The only time to glue it back on is if its going back to intel for RMA


----------



## Talon720

Well been reading this thread for a bit. . A few pages back I saw a vice only method and decided to try it. My vice can kinda move, which is why the vice and hammer ended up not working as well. Well after anxiety sweat I tightened the vice slowly anticipating the pop....well I heard a pop the edge of the pcb bent/snapped not all the way through, like the top layer did.Im pretty sure it's dead lol. I dunno how well the intel protection plan it can't be that good to take this back. I guess I have a practice chip now. I knew I shoulda tried the razor blade method first since I'm pretty good with them. My super sweaty hands was kinda deterring me. Kinda ****ty no way can I wait for devils canyon but buying a haswell now and overnighting it kinda sucks. I'm just praying that maybe ill get lucky enough to hit the silicon lottery


----------



## rustypixel

Ouch. Hope things work out for you. If you ever feel like trying it again I'd recommend the razor blade method. Using 6 new blades it took me literally less than 4 minutes. I'm as much a noob as anyone can be and it was super easy. Good luck.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Talon720*
> 
> Well been reading this thread for a bit. . A few pages back I saw a vice only method and decided to try it. My vice can kinda move, which is why the vice and hammer ended up not working as well. Well after anxiety sweat I tightened the vice slowly anticipating the pop....well I heard a pop the edge of the pcb bent/snapped not all the way through, like the top layer did.Im pretty sure it's dead lol. I dunno how well the intel protection plan it can't be that good to take this back. I guess I have a practice chip now. I knew I shoulda tried the razor blade method first since I'm pretty good with them. My super sweaty hands was kinda deterring me. Kinda ****ty no way can I wait for devils canyon but buying a haswell now and overnighting it kinda sucks. I'm just praying that maybe ill get lucky enough to hit the silicon lottery


----------



## Talon720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rustypixel*
> 
> Ouch. Hope things work out for you. If you ever feel like trying it again I'd recommend the razor blade method. Using 6 new blades it took me literally less than 4 minutes. I'm as much a noob as anyone can be and it was super easy. Good luck.


Thanks just ordered a new chip it will be here Saturday. Lol funny you said something you were one of the people I was reading about and how they did it. Well that makes me feel better a little. Thanks I feel like I'm gonna need the luck


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Talon720*
> 
> Thanks just ordered a new chip it will be here Saturday. Lol funny you said something you were one of the people I was reading about and how they did it. Well that makes me feel better a little. Thanks I feel like I'm gonna need the luck


don't rush things in all seriousness. as being one of the first people doing this I took 4 hours to plan everything discharge every few minutes with gloves and just care as well as making the pcb perfectly clean as well as the pads.


----------



## Jeronbernal

I had a shaky ghetto vice, and that actually messed up my first two Delids


then I ran into skyn3ts guide to use two blocks of wood instead, and since then I've delidded 3 total no problem, two for me one for my cousin, here's a link on how he did it

http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded

I didn't lap them incase of rma issues, but I have gotten the usual 20c decrease, just using gelid aswell, I did just get some clu in today, which I need to try, but with gelid I'm doing better than I expected

Which reminds me... Does anyone have a guide for Clu application?
Both between the die and IHS, and secondly a guide for naked die application using Ek naked haswell kit


----------



## Anth Seebel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wgoldingful*
> 
> Out of interest, would regular thermal paste act as an adhesive?
> 
> Also, does CLP need time to set after applying?


I used Permatex Black Silicon adhesive to glue the IHS back on my haswell cpu. It is similar stuff to the Intel glue.

I used CLP on the die and my case is upright , and I didnt want the IHS to move around when placing cpu into bracket and locking it down. So to avoid all that I glued IHS back on after apllying CLP to die and under IHS. Then left it for 15-20 mins so it was mostly dry then installed cpu. I didnt want it to completely dry as I wanted the cpu bracket to push down the IHS to the pcb as much as possible. You dont need much, I placed 4 small drops in each corner.

This is the stuff I used:


----------



## Swag

CLU/CLP does not need time to cure.

Black epoxy tends to be the generally accepted type of adhesive that people use to reglue their IHS back onto the die.

For CLP, use about a quarter or half of a rice grain on the die. Don't use too much or else it will actually hinder performance. You want it to cover the die but just enough to actually cover it. It is only there to fill in the miniscule imperfections on the glass on top of the die and the belly of the IHS.









I'm bored.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Talon720*
> 
> Well been reading this thread for a bit. . A few pages back I saw a vice only method and decided to try it. My vice can kinda move, which is why the vice and hammer ended up not working as well. Well after anxiety sweat I tightened the vice slowly anticipating the pop....well I heard a pop the edge of the pcb bent/snapped not all the way through, like the top layer did.Im pretty sure it's dead lol. I dunno how well the intel protection plan it can't be that good to take this back. I guess I have a practice chip now. I knew I shoulda tried the razor blade method first since I'm pretty good with them. My super sweaty hands was kinda deterring me. Kinda ****ty no way can I wait for devils canyon but buying a haswell now and overnighting it kinda sucks. I'm just praying that maybe ill get lucky enough to hit the silicon lottery


Sorry to hear that. Can you post pictures of the aftermath so others can see?


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> CLU/CLP does not need time to cure.
> 
> Black epoxy tends to be the generally accepted type of adhesive that people use to reglue their IHS back onto the die.
> 
> For CLP, use about a quarter or half of a rice grain on the die. Don't use too much or else it will actually hinder performance. You want it to cover the die but just enough to actually cover it. It is only there to fill in the miniscule imperfections on the glass on top of the die and the belly of the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm bored.


Should I spread the CLU on the die?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Should I spread the CLU on the die?


yes as thin as you can get it. Spread it on ihs too. Just be sure to protect the vrm area to the left of the die. I used clear finernail polish.



Good luck.


----------



## Swag

Yes, you definitely spread the CLU/CLP. They will *NOT* spread by themselves from gravity!

And as Wirerat indicated, you have to protect those little bumps on the side of the die on Haswells. If you link them with a bit of CLU/CLP, you're going to have a dead CPU in a few seconds as death runs through them.


----------



## Talon720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> don't rush things in all seriousness. as being one of the first people doing this I took 4 hours to plan everything discharge every few minutes with gloves and just care as well as making the pcb perfectly clean as well as the pads.


Yea good advice. I thought I planned enough maybe not. I have a grounding mat too all hooked up, how well they really work in real world applications i guess ill find out. I kinda know what went wrong and shoulda backed out... my own fault obviously. Wasnt sure how hard this thing is really stuck on. I had a metal ruler straight edge against the pcb like in the video a few pages back where he uses just a vice. Mine kept creeping up, so I kept readjusting I figured the ihs would pop off first before a layer of the pcb could crack, but that slight angle is what did it. Never broke a pcb like that wasnt sure what to expect. For the razor method the blades are the utility knife ones that are shorter at the top and longer at the bottom where its sharp. Hope so cause thoes are the ones I bought
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> I had a shaky ghetto vice, and that actually messed up my first two Delids
> 
> then I ran into skyn3ts guide to use two blocks of wood instead, and since then I've delidded 3 total no problem, two for me one for my cousin, here's a link on how he did it
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded
> I didn't lap them incase of rma issues, but I have gotten the usual 20c decrease, just using gelid aswell, I did just get some clu in today, which I need to try, but with gelid I'm doing better than I expected
> Which reminds me... Does anyone have a guide for Clu application?
> Both between the die and IHS, and secondly a guide for naked die application using Ek naked haswell kit


Thanks ill check that out. Yea the vice i had sucks to the table, which worked supringly well, I wasnt about to drill in my brand new ikea desk. The vice part though had a collar that loosend and allowed the vice to swivel and pivot then tightend back down. The vice clamp part also had rubber protectors and thoes slid off, and underneath was smooth metal. I figured no teeth was great. Maybe the collar wasnt tight enough when i hit it with the board and hammer it gave a little bit... No good. I know clp and clu aplly differently. Ive always used the ultra and it comes with brushes to brush on, which totally goes against everything ive done with paste(grain of rice method). A little bit goes a long way it seems too. I own the ek direct die kit. I was under the impression it didnt give much if any improvement the ihs helped transfer heat off the small die. Granted it would seem as long as the waterblock was larger than the ihs whats the difference. One less material to transfer heat through seems like it would be more efficient. If you have the supremecy block tighting it down to get even pressure on the die as not to crack it seems easier on it. Id just tightened down the screws in a criss cross half turn increments.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Sorry to hear that. Can you post pictures of the aftermath so others can see?


Yea, might as well have others learn from my mistake







Im at work so when i get home ill take em and post em. To think this started with adding a pump to fix my trifire 290x in parallel temp issues i was having. There goes my caselab case budget. Im starting to outgrow my corsair 540.


----------



## Jeronbernal

would putting clear fingernail polish on the vrm area affect performance?


----------



## Gunderman456

no


----------



## Talon720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> would putting clear fingernail polish on the vrm area affect performance?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> no


It seems like it would insulate the vrm more. Not that its in contact with a heatsink, but still. It seems like a plenty of people do it


----------



## Talon720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Sorry to hear that. Can you post pictures of the aftermath so others can see?


Here's the chip. I decided to use it as practice for my new 4770k comming. The razor method was so much easier for me. I didn't even scuff the pcb other than what was damaged already. So hoping my new chip isn't a complete dud. As it was this wasn't the best, but not the worst. Kinda sucks I was gonna wait for the 4790k so if I did screw up I'd just grab that. I keep hearing though the "k" part won't fit in z87, which seems like a rumor.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Talon720*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Here's the chip. I decided to use it as practice for my new 4770k comming. The razor method was so much easier for me. I didn't even scuff the pcb other than what was damaged already. So hoping my new chip isn't a complete dud. As it was this wasn't the best, but not the worst. Kinda sucks I was gonna wait for the 4790k so if I did screw up I'd just grab that. I keep hearing though the "k" part won't fit in z87, which seems like a rumor.


Razor method looks really clean for you. Thanks for sharing the pictures, and sorry that happened with the vice method. Did you vice have any grooves or lanes for traction that could have caused uneven pressure on the edge of the chip?

I hope that is a horrific rumor about the 4970k, but it doesn't make any sense as to why just the K series wouldn't work when the rest of the line goes. I guess we will find out all in due time of course.


----------



## Talon720

I think I know the answer, but I just got my 4770k which I'm gonna delid no matter what. Should I put it in make sure everything works. Even if its not a stellar ocer delidding will at least help in pushing volts higher. I just don't wanna have to refrain my loop take the chip back out delid it, and the rebelled my whole loop. My fist chip was a Costa Rica chip 3331CO49 and the new chip is Malay L349B868 not that it matters most likely,but I guess I'll see.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Atm i have two Costas and one broken Malay, the two Costas I have are completely on different sides of the spectrum lol
One stable at 1.2 4.5ghz
Other... Not so much still playing with 1.275v for 4.2 lol


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Talon720*
> 
> I think I know the answer, but I just got my 4770k which I'm gonna delid no matter what. Should I put it in make sure everything works. Even if its not a stellar ocer delidding will at least help in pushing volts higher. I just don't wanna have to refrain my loop take the chip back out delid it, and the rebelled my whole loop. My fist chip was a Costa Rica chip 3331CO49 and the new chip is Malay L349B868 not that it matters most likely,but I guess I'll see.


Might as well if it's not much trouble - but if it's a pain in the butt, then it could be seen as a waste of time
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Atm i have two Costas and one broken Malay, the two Costas I have are completely on different sides of the spectrum lol
> One stable at 1.2 4.5ghz
> Other... Not so much still playing with 1.275v for 4.2 lol


ehh it happens, at least you got one good one bad, that's pretty nice









1.2 isn't enough for 4.4 for my chip, yet 1.4 is enough for 4.7, so you can probably clock well with it. If you're quoting bios vcore though, actual load vcore, depending on the board and settings, is often 0.02 higher, occasionally 0.03 or 0.04. It's hard to measure properly sometimes


----------



## sweenytodd

I'm planning to delid my 4670K with a PH-TC14PE air cooler. Would an air cooler a bad idea? I'm thinking it will crush the die while still using the IHS. Maybe I'm misinformed. Here are my stats by the way. 20C ambient, gaming is 64C max.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> I'm planning to delid my 4670K with a PH-TC14PE air cooler. Would an air cooler a bad idea? I'm thinking it will crush the die while still using the IHS. Maybe I'm misinformed. Here are my stats by the way. 20C ambient, gaming is 64C max.


It won't crush the die when using the IHS


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> I'm planning to delid my 4670K with a PH-TC14PE air cooler. Would an air cooler a bad idea? I'm thinking it will crush the die while still using the IHS. Maybe I'm misinformed. Here are my stats by the way. 20C ambient, gaming is 64C max.


as long as you use the ihs like you said its no problem. The only dies that get cracked by air coolers are from ppl trying to direct die a giant air cooler.


----------



## Talon720

Man I'm so hopingi didn't ruin this new chip. Some small scratches and nicks I don't think I went deep enough to scratch the copper wires. I wish my 2nd chip went as smooths my first. Well I'm hoping its gonna be alright its the bottom left corner. Time for a break...


----------



## gatesmarch

Well I finally got it done. I did the razor method, I have to admit there was a small nick and I could see gold...not copper. I don't know if there's a layer of metal between the PCB and Copper, but thankfully everything went well. I used coolabratory ultra on the die, and Gelid Extreme on the heatsink. I can't BELIEVE the difference. I have a Hyper 212 Evo. I've run IBT and P95 temps are easily -15 to -20 on average... even more. My average temps on IBT Max settings is mid 60's, used to be mid 80's up to 90. I am just blown away, well worth the effort in my opinion. I'll post a pic of the delidded cpu to get in the club tomorrow!!


----------



## Talon720

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gatesmarch*
> 
> Well I finally got it done. I did the razor method, I have to admit there was a small nick and I could see gold...not copper. I don't know if there's a layer of metal between the PCB and Copper, but thankfully everything went well. I used coolabratory ultra on the die, and Gelid Extreme on the heatsink. I can't BELIEVE the difference. I have a Hyper 212 Evo. I've run IBT and P95 temps are easily -15 to -20 on average... even more. My average temps on IBT Max settings is mid 60's, used to be mid 80's up to 90. I am just blown away, well worth the effort in my opinion. I'll post a pic of the delidded cpu to get in the club tomorrow!!


Yea everything turned out well for me as well. I also put nail polish on the vrm area. The whole putting the his on and then clamping it, and not being able to see freaked me out. I'm just happy it turned on I haven't tested anything yet so I'm hoping I applied everything well. Good job by the way


----------



## angelotti

Delided, razor method, in the end...

It was a pain in the a**. There was no space between the IHS and the PCB, literally! My razor method was actually "razor + hammer" method.
It was so tight, i left grooves in the IHS and then i had to file it because of the copper splinters. Inside, there was nowhere near the amount of TIM or rubber i have seen here, on OCN or youtube.. Which explains the poor temperature drop, only ~ 7°C. I used AC MX-4.

I had to try, though. Because of the crap MB + CPU combo that i have, i need 1.285V for 4.2 GHz and 1.350V for 4.3GHz, both only x264 stable (prime 28.5 stops either one or two workers within a minute).

So there's a tip, if you can't see the rubber adhesive and the IHS is tight against the PCB, then there will be very little to gain by delidding.


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Talon720*
> 
> Yea everything turned out well for me as well. I also put nail polish on the vrm area. The whole putting the his on and then clamping it, and not being able to see freaked me out. I'm just happy it turned on I haven't tested anything yet so I'm hoping I applied everything well. Good job by the way


I hear ya. What I did do was buy permatex high temp rtv gasket sealant. It's black and looks just like the stuff Intel used. I applied a small amount around the edge of the heatsink and let it set for a day. It was just like installing as though I never modded it...no movement on the lid at all.


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *angelotti*
> 
> Delided, razor method, in the end...
> 
> It was a pain in the a**. There was no space between the IHS and the PCB, literally! My razor method was actually "razor + hammer" method.
> It was so tight, i left grooves in the IHS and then i had to file it because of the copper splinters. Inside, there was nowhere near the amount of TIM or rubber i have seen here, on OCN or youtube.. Which explains the poor temperature drop, only ~ 7°C. I used AC MX-4.
> 
> I had to try, though. Because of the crap MB + CPU combo that i have, i need 1.285V for 4.2 GHz and 1.350V for 4.3GHz, both only x264 stable (prime 28.5 stops either one or two workers within a minute).
> 
> So there's a tip, if you can't see the rubber adhesive and the IHS is tight against the PCB, then there will be very little to gain by delidding.


I hear ya. The whole reason I did this was to OC to 4.6. Now it appears my mobo (asrock z77 pro-4m) is throttling the cpu because the vrms are getting too hot. Definitely not the cpu it's maxing out at 75 on Prime95 and mainly stays at 60. I read somewhere that they used very low quality vrms. Time to buy a new mobo.


----------



## Jimhans1

Might be the PRO-4M, I have two Extrem4-Ms both running i7s @4.7+ w/1.35v no throttling issues.....


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Might be the PRO-4M, I have two Extrem4-Ms both running i7s @4.7+ w/1.35v no throttling issues.....


Yeah, I know the Extremes have more power phases. A Hardcop review of the Pro-4m also stated the vrms were extremely hot to the touch when at 4.6. Seeing how this is an RMA mobo, I'm not surprised by this anyway.


----------



## deepor

The Z77 Pro4-M definitely has issues like that. It was my first Z77 board and throttled when approaching 1.3V Vcore for me if I remember right. I freaked out thinking about what the summer temperatures would do. The shop I bought it at thankfully took it back and let me replace it with something more expensive.

Some time later, I found someone here on OCN that had problems trying to run a Sandy Bridge CPU on the board. That worked even worse as it uses more power than Ivy Bridge.


----------



## angelotti

I can tell you how hot they get (the vrm's).., 68 to 72°C! (i only checked two), on asrock Z87*M* Extreme4. I used the thermal probe from a multimeter to get that reading.
Anything over 50°C will degrade the quality of the VCCIN current, eventually resulting in BSOD.
Just today i placed a 70mm fan to blow on them (slightly), but i doubt it will do much difference.


----------



## SaFiS

Hi guys...

New to the forum...
Delidded (razor method) my 4770K after seeing terrible temps @4.4Ghz (*40°C* at idle and *95°C* at Full Load).
Running a Corsair H110 with 2xAF140 in push configuration on an Obsidian 650D.

My info:

OCN name: SaFiS
CPU: i7-4770K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Arctic MX4
Mhz gained: 200Mhz
OC after delid: 4.6Ghz at 1.175V
Temp drops: *10°C* at idle (idle temps are now between 26°C & 30°C), *28°C* at Full Load
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/in8alt





Unfortunately, no "Before" screenshots...
Hope that's OK...


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gatesmarch*
> 
> Well I finally got it done. I did the razor method, I have to admit there was a small nick and I could see gold...not copper. I don't know if there's a layer of metal between the PCB and Copper, but thankfully everything went well. I used coolabratory ultra on the die, and Gelid Extreme on the heatsink. I can't BELIEVE the difference. I have a Hyper 212 Evo. I've run IBT and P95 temps are easily -15 to -20 on average... even more. My average temps on IBT Max settings is mid 60's, used to be mid 80's up to 90. I am just blown away, well worth the effort in my opinion. I'll post a pic of the delidded cpu to get in the club tomorrow!!


Well here it is. I circled the little nick I spoke of. For some reason it looks worse in the picture. Clicking the pic will enlarge it so you can see it hehe. At any rate...please add me to the club!!!


----------



## derfer

If you use gelid then you don't need to insulate right? Being non-conductive.


----------



## Serandur

So, I'm planning on delidding my 3770K, but I have no vice. Can anyone recommend a cheap and adequate one for the job? Thanks.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> If you use gelid then you don't need to insulate right? Being non-conductive.


You are correct.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> So, I'm planning on delidding my 3770K, but I have no vice. Can anyone recommend a cheap and adequate one for the job? Thanks.


You could go buy a vice from Lowes or Home Depot and then return it when you are done, they have one that will work and it costs about $20.00


----------



## Talon720

The new chip I got seems a touch better than my last one haven't really pushed it yet. Last chip at 1.25 at 4.4 ghz would bsod super fast and needed 1.336 for 4.4 new chip did it for awhile longer before a bsod. I think I'll get away with lower volts either way I just want to be able to do 4.5-4.6 and any more is a bonus in my book.


----------



## Kokin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> So, I'm planning on delidding my 3770K, but I have no vice. Can anyone recommend a cheap and adequate one for the job? Thanks.


As stated, you can find a 4-inch drill vice at Home Depot or Lowe's (if you live in the US) for about $20.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> You could go buy a vice from Lowes or Home Depot and then return it when you are done, they have one that will work and it costs about $20.00


This is why crap gets handed out already scratched and worn. People use it, and then return it. $20 is worth having it around for more projects for later. Returning it means you get to waste fuel getting another and returning it if you ever need to use one for something you had not thought of before.


----------



## Jeronbernal

I'd just do the two blocks thing, easier cheaper, and safer IMHO. I'm not a super experienced delidded, but the first two times I failed both razor and vice method. Last three times with two wood blocks I passed.

Fail

Pass

Pass


I'm a D- student =)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SaFiS*
> 
> Hi guys...
> 
> New to the forum...
> Delidded (razor method) my 4770K after seeing terrible temps @4.4Ghz (*40°C* at idle and *95°C* at Full Load).
> Running a Corsair H110 with 2xAF140 in push configuration on an Obsidian 650D.
> 
> My info:
> 
> OCN name: SaFiS
> CPU: i7-4770K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX4
> Mhz gained: 200Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.6Ghz at 1.175V
> Temp drops: *10°C* at idle (idle temps are now between 26°C & 30°C), *28°C* at Full Load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/in8alt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunately, no "Before" screenshots...
> Hope that's OK...


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## Talon720

For anyone who thinks delidding dosnt or isnt worth it must'a done it wrong. Granted im on water but at 4.6 ghz @ 1.38v my highest temp has been 70. I know its not the best chip in the world, but its better than my last. I was just plagued by 101 bsod fix that then 124 fix that back to 101. It had a hard time going above 4.4ghz @ 1.36 and the temps would go into the low 90s. Also since delidding ive noticed my water temps have gone up. Finally feel like my water loop works on this chip. I finally met my goal of 4.6 ghz which was huge jump from 4.4 and 4.5 ghz guess i might as well go for 4.7. Im just so impressed at the temps and how the are barely moving up. Of course im sure an avx2 load would change all that.


----------



## Cyro999

SaFiS, are you using idle states properly? I'm idling mid 20's on air no delid with ~20c room~ Gotta manually enable c6/c7 and set power plan properly (default balanced is good) though other c-states and EIST probably help too

Quote:


> Of course im sure an avx2 load would change all that.


It's the synthetic FPU loads that kill Haswell, Linpack with avx2 at 100% CPU load, without too hard of a RAM and/or uncore bottleneck, will hit 100c before 100% cpu load with x264 passes 50c or so


----------



## chumanga

Guys i'm attempted to delid my i7 4770k with the vice method, but im a bit in doubt about vrm beside die. I see a video of deliding where the guy put i think the same thermal silicone to glue ihs back to pcb.

Is that safe to paste this silicone into VRM?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chumanga*
> 
> Guys i'm attempted to delid my i7 4770k with the vice method, but im a bit in doubt about vrm beside die. I see a video of deliding where the guy put i think the same thermal silicone to glue ihs back to pcb.
> 
> Is that safe to paste this silicone into VRM?


if you are NOT sending the cpu to intel for rma please do not glue the his back on. There is nothing to gain and you might need it open again sometime.


----------



## chumanga

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> if you are NOT sending the cpu to intel for rma please do not glue the his back on. There is nothing to gain and you might need it open again sometime.


I dont pretend to glue the IHS back but need to use something to keep him fixed at replacing it to bracket, probably will use sekisui tape. But my first question is about using this silicone at VRM to prevent some contact with CLU/CLP while pasting it at die. I will use a air cooler.


----------



## gatesmarch

Well I "glued" mine back on with an extremely minimal amount of this using a tooth pick. It was just enough to prevent the lid from sliding around and will be very easy to remove if needed. Essentially a small dab on each corner.


----------



## NickF

Any word on that MSI bracket being sold without buying teh M-POWER? I altready have a Z97 board. If I'm gonna take the IHS off my CPU.... why would I put it back on?! I'm surprised no one has thought of this before MSI.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chumanga*
> 
> I dont pretend to glue the IHS back but need to use something to keep him fixed at replacing it to bracket, probably will use sekisui tape. But my first question is about using this silicone at VRM to prevent some contact with CLU/CLP while pasting it at die. I will use a air cooler.


I see. Just use clear fingernail polish to protect the on die VRM.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NickF*
> 
> Any word on that MSI bracket being sold without buying teh M-POWER? I altready have a Z97 board. If I'm gonna take the IHS off my CPU.... why would I put it back on?! I'm surprised no one has thought of this before MSI.


Bare-die mounting a big air cooler is probably bad idea


----------



## NickF

I have a xspc raystorm.... not a big air cooler. People mount these direct die with....electrical tape


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NickF*
> 
> I have a xspc raystorm.... not a big air cooler. People mount these direct die with....electrical tape


Quote:


> If I'm gonna take the IHS off my CPU.... why would I put it back on?!


I was just giving an example~


----------



## NickF

I just de-lided using the vice method. Very easy to do, took about 20 minutes to take my system down, de-lid and remount








My cmu is still on the way, but for now I mounted with XSPC K2, temps are about the same, maybe 1 degree warmer, which is basically as I suspected with the goop I used.

Now, The real question is--- is it viable to use CMU on both surfaces? I'm afraid it will fuse the block to the CPU in a way which would lead to a die-crack when I do my water loop service...
I think I'm gonna use the GELID paste from IHS to cooler


----------



## Jimhans1

Use gelid for both


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Use gelid for both


This is perfectly acceptable. it was what I did at first.


----------



## derfer

Delidded my friends Haswell and used GC. 20C drop at stock, figure it will be greater with the overclock. Was a real pain to do though, using a very modified version of the two wood blocks method.


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> Delidded my friends Haswell and used GC. 20C drop at stock, figure it will be greater with the overclock. Was a real pain to do though, using a very modified version of the two wood blocks method.


I commend your balls of steel for doing this to someone else's cpu.


----------



## Swag

A lot of people are willing to delid a friend's CPU for them, although, if I were to do it, I'd have to inform my friend I won't be liable for the damages just in case. I mean, I trust that I will do it, but if I do happen to make a mistake, I don't want to pay for it.







Haven't had a single CPU die on my due to delidding though, most of my delids are by the blade method, but now, I'm starting to move to the hammer/vice method.


----------



## Jeronbernal

i forsaken the blade method. i have 2x proof of my unstable hands. lol and 4x proof of my stable hammer whacking skills









*just did a delid this morning btw, i think im addicted to delidding, and i think ive convinced all my friends it's the "TROOF"


----------



## Swag

Well, to be honest, if you have a Haswell and you don't delid it. I automatically assume you aren't enlightened or are not too bright.









Or maybe you just like to live life dangerously? Where your CPU could explode any second.


----------



## wgoldingful

Thanks for the guide. I just delidded my 3570K.



I'm going to use some Noctua thermal paste before my CLP arrives.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

OK, Thinking back to my 4770k: When I delidded it, I set it up wrong, after looking at this:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wgoldingful*


My PCB on the back side (where the damage was) 
was resting against the vice, and the teeth in the vice caused the damage. I had braced the PCB rather than hit the PCB, so I am really lucky I didn't screw up worse. The wood block was directly against the the IHS.

I feel like a dummie, but everything still works, so that makes me happy, and I am STILL running so I guess a learning curve has come and I won't make that mistake twice.


----------



## wgoldingful

Good to hear it's still OK. How're your temps? Mine dropped by >20 C.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wgoldingful*
> 
> Good to hear it's still OK. How're your temps? Mine dropped by >20 C.


I dropped about 30c instantly, and have sense added 2 more GPUs to the loop,... Well... 1 and a 1/14 since the 750 doesn't count for much, lol. And it just made it back up to 74 in my loop, so I am expanding from a 280mm rad to a 360 in an attempt to smash a few more degrees off the top. I may split the loop in the near future as well.


----------



## NickF

I ordered both GC Extreme and the CMU, CMU didn't come yet so I used the GC Extreme. Works well--- dropped >20*c running IBT.
Devils Shmanyon:thumb:


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I dropped about 30c instantly, and have sense added 2 more GPUs to the loop,... Well... 1 and a 1/14 since the 750 doesn't count for much, lol. And it just made it back up to 74 in my loop, so I am expanding from a 280mm rad to a 360 in an attempt to smash a few more degrees off the top. I may split the loop in the near future as well.


Dual loops don't usually benefit from better temps in most situations, only better flow rates, depending on your blocks.


----------



## Chomuco

http://i.gyazo.com/3bd61ebbaf6716f273d956e8e5a23953.gif

my 4770k:


----------



## NTME9

I just delidded my 4770k (vice method). I ordered some CLU about 3hrs ago but got impatient and decided to do the deed and use some AS5 I had on hand. The AS5 dropped prime95 temps from ~70c to ~65c (5c), and IBT from ~90c to ~80c (10c). Hopefully the CLU will get me these 20 to 30c drops I keep reading about. Fingers crossed.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Dual loops don't usually benefit from better temps in most situations, only better flow rates, depending on your blocks.


Then I will waste my time planning something else, lol. Everything is EK supremacy, except one EK Supreme... They work well.


----------



## Heremod

Dear all.
A few days ago I delidded my rather good OCer 3770k (1.200V(max on CPU-Z) for 4.5 GHZ.Rock solid stable).
The result was partially successfull... The PCIeX16 i.e. the GPU was no longer working. The sound card PCIeX1 was fully functional.
Alas, I continued to use my system with the onboard graphics until one day... Pooof!
The PC would not boot. The error according to the onboard LED diagnostics was BOOT ERROR. Maybe another part on the cpu went bad? I do not know...
My question is this: Since there can be no miraculous way to restore my CPU to its former glory, is there the possibility of RMA'ing it?
Thank you for your time.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heremod*
> 
> Dear all.
> A few days ago I delidded my rather good OCer 3770k (1.200V(max on CPU-Z) for 4.5 GHZ.Rock solid stable).
> The result was partially successfull... The PCIeX16 i.e. the GPU was no longer working. The sound card PCIeX1 was fully functional.
> Alas, I continued to use my system with the onboard graphics until one day... Pooof!
> The PC would not boot. The error according to the onboard LED diagnostics was BOOT ERROR. Maybe another part on the cpu went bad? I do not know...
> My question is this: Since there can be no miraculous way to restore my CPU to its former glory, is there the possibility of RMA'ing it?
> Thank you for your time.


Did you check the CPU socket? Do the pins look alright and not bent anywhere?

Are you trying to run direct-die without the IHS and the socket's retention bracket? It seems that might need some careful fiddling around even if using a direct-die mounting kit.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heremod*
> 
> Dear all.
> A few days ago I delidded my rather good OCer 3770k (1.200V(max on CPU-Z) for 4.5 GHZ.Rock solid stable).
> The result was partially successfull... The PCIeX16 i.e. the GPU was no longer working. The sound card PCIeX1 was fully functional.
> Alas, I continued to use my system with the onboard graphics until one day... Pooof!
> The PC would not boot. The error according to the onboard LED diagnostics was BOOT ERROR. Maybe another part on the cpu went bad? I do not know...
> My question is this: Since there can be no miraculous way to restore my CPU to its former glory, is there the possibility of RMA'ing it?
> Thank you for your time.


i had issues after deliding as well. I reseated the cpu over and over. On the third try everything was working with no more errors. The Cpu sometimes do not seat that well after deliding. I would reseat it and inspect the pins.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heremod*
> 
> Dear all.
> A few days ago I delidded my rather good OCer 3770k (1.200V(max on CPU-Z) for 4.5 GHZ.Rock solid stable).
> The result was partially successfull... The PCIeX16 i.e. the GPU was no longer working. The sound card PCIeX1 was fully functional.
> Alas, I continued to use my system with the onboard graphics until one day... Pooof!
> The PC would not boot. The error according to the onboard LED diagnostics was BOOT ERROR. Maybe another part on the cpu went bad? I do not know...
> My question is this: Since there can be no miraculous way to restore my CPU to its former glory, is there the possibility of RMA'ing it?
> Thank you for your time.


read the first post shows that you can RMA it if you want help on this let me know.

BUT a boot error is usually mobo in my mind i only consider cpu when the cpu red led comes on. takes whole rig out of case destatic it alla nd take cmos battery out then try to reboot it outside of the case on a cardboard box


----------



## Heremod

Thank you all for your responces. To answer them in order:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Did you check the CPU socket?
> *Yes I did. Everything is fine. As a matter of fact I have installed another CPU and runs without a problem.*
> Do the pins look alright and not bent anywhere?
> *My first reply answers the second question about the pins.*
> 
> Are you trying to run direct-die without the IHS and the socket's retention bracket? It seems that might need some careful fiddling around even if using a direct-die mounting kit.
> *No. I have put the IHS back on the die with NT-H1.*


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> i had issues after deliding as well. I reseated the cpu over and over. On the third try everything was working with no more errors. The Cpu sometimes do not seat that well after deliding. I would reseat it and inspect the pins.


*I did not need to reseat. It was working with the problems stated in my first post. then the PC would not boot.*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> read the first post shows that you can RMA it if you want help on this let me know.
> 
> BUT a boot error is usually mobo in my mind i only consider cpu when the cpu red led comes on. takes whole rig out of case destatic it alla nd take cmos battery out then try to reboot it outside of the case on a cardboard box


The mobo is not faulty. Already sold it and working fine. Before seling it I installed another CPU which again worked without any issues whatsoever. Did clear cmos many times. No luck.

I am sorry that in my first post I failed to state that I "managed"







to scratch the pcb a little (razor method). That I suppose is why the PCIex16 was out of order. Nevertheless the CPU was running fine apart from that fact. I have no clue as to what might have occurred and now I have no post....
If I am able to RMA, without that being any kind of "fraud" or anything, I would be happy to take any useful notes/tips.

Thanks again!


----------



## alancsalt

My interpretation of this is:

If you tell them what you've done and an rma is approved, that is not rma fraud.
If you try to hide or disguise the fact of delidding, then we don't want to read about it in the forums.

We are family friendly and industry friendly, not any sort of outlaw site, and as a result we have giveaways, competitions and prizes... we also have industry reps happy to give advice.


----------



## Heremod

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> My interpretation of this is:
> 
> If you tell them what you've done and an rma is approved, that is not rma fraud.
> If you try to hide or disguise the fact of delidding, then we don't want to read about it in the forums.
> 
> We are family friendly and industry friendly, not any sort of outlaw site, and as a result we have giveaways, competitions and prizes... we also have industry reps happy to give advice.


I would not think otherwise. That is why i am posting here; to get advice on my issue. NOT to get advice how to disguise the whole fact of delidding to INTEL.
But the whole interpretation proccess, makes me think that INTEL might or might not accept my delidded CPU for RMA. Is there not a rule about such things? Of course there is. We are talking about an altered/damaged product by the end user here, which means (I suppose) NOT eligible for RMA.

In need of advice...


----------



## Wirerat

Heremod. The problem you described may have due to pins not making proper contact. My cpu was working with channels of memory not showing up. You seem confindent of otherwise. I would atleast remove the heatsink and wiggle the cpu versus an rma without trying anything.

Many people have complained of specific issues on this thread that a reseat did fix.

Good luck with it. I always hate to read about something as expensive as a cpu failing.


----------



## koekwau5

Guys, quick question before I start delidding my i7-4770K. Liquid Pro should arrive in 2 days and making some preparations.

To prevent the CPU from static electricity I'm thinking of putting on some latex gloves since I can't seem to find anti-static gloves anywhere here in Holland.
Will latex gloves to the trick or could it cause static electricity?

Ofcourse I will post some pics of me in action and hopefully the CPU will survive =)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Heremod*
> 
> Thank you all for your responces. To answer them in order:
> 
> *I did not need to reseat. It was working with the problems stated in my first post. then the PC would not boot.*
> The mobo is not faulty. Already sold it and working fine. Before seling it I installed another CPU which again worked without any issues whatsoever. Did clear cmos many times. No luck.
> 
> I am sorry that in my first post I failed to state that I "managed"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to scratch the pcb a little (razor method). That I suppose is why the PCIex16 was out of order. Nevertheless the CPU was running fine apart from that fact. I have no clue as to what might have occurred and now I have no post....
> If I am able to RMA, without that being any kind of "fraud" or anything, I would be happy to take any useful notes/tips.
> 
> Thanks again!


just tell intel everything and they might be willing to help truth is far better than lies and will always lead to the best outcome.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> My interpretation of this is:
> 
> If you tell them what you've done and an rma is approved, that is not rma fraud.
> If you try to hide or disguise the fact of delidding, then we don't want to read about it in the forums.
> 
> We are family friendly and industry friendly, not any sort of outlaw site, and as a result we have giveaways, competitions and prizes... we also have industry reps happy to give advice.


Exactly thats why i straight up asked intel on one of my chips and posted it here as a guide of how to ask and make sure that you might have a shot at a new chip through the correct way of RMA'ing with intel after delidding.

Thanks Mr. Salt









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Guys, quick question before I start delidding my i7-4770K. Liquid Pro should arrive in 2 days and making some preparations.
> 
> To prevent the CPU from static electricity I'm thinking of putting on some latex gloves since I can't seem to find anti-static gloves anywhere here in Holland.
> Will latex gloves to the trick or could it cause static electricity?
> 
> Ofcourse I will post some pics of me in action and hopefully the CPU will survive =)


those gloves will be fine no need for anti static wrist bands and everything. Good luck!


----------



## Wirerat

I was just reading though the chat of rma in op. I love how the intel rep doesnt give a crap about the lid being attached or not.

I was expecting him to have put valgaur on hold and talk to his supervisor or something. Hes just like "yea, ok can your read me the numbers blah bla".

People get so worried about trying to hide that it was delided and they do not even care.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> those gloves will be fine no need for anti static wrist bands and everything. Good luck!


Thnx for the info =)
Will need the luck ghehe!

I'll keep you guys posted.


----------



## derfer

Weird issue. I did this with a 4770k and GC and got a 20C drop in IBT at stock speeds. Now a few days later it gets up to 89C. I spread the paste on the die, on the IHS and did a big fat X on top. So what could have gone wrong? Paste coverage is thorough, pressure should be sufficient. Scratching my head on this.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> Weird issue. I did this with a 4770k and GC and got a 20C drop in IBT at stock speeds. Now a few days later it gets up to 89C. I spread the paste on the die, on the IHS and did a big fat X on top. So what could have gone wrong? Paste coverage is thorough, pressure should be sufficient. Scratching my head on this.


Fans are spinning? Overclock it recently? Kink in your water line? double check mount? Any BIOS changes?

GC Extreme is decent stuff, but Haswell sounds like it runs super hot with AVX2. 89 max sounds almost acceptable if you are on air with a decent overclock


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> Weird issue. I did this with a 4770k and GC and got a 20C drop in IBT at stock speeds. Now a few days later it gets up to 89C. I spread the paste on the die, on the IHS and did a big fat X on top. So what could have gone wrong? Paste coverage is thorough, pressure should be sufficient. Scratching my head on this.


Most likely what happened is the TIM had some pump out effect especially with the X method I find that pretty common, I usually do the pea method and then spread it a small amount in the direction and size of the die on the IHS. Then with the mounting pressure it spreads it out farther that way.


----------



## derfer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Fans are spinning? Overclock it recently? Kink in your water line? double check mount? Any BIOS changes?
> 
> GC Extreme is decent stuff, but Haswell sounds like it runs super hot with AVX2. 89 max sounds almost acceptable if you are on air with a decent overclock


It was lows 60s a few days ago. No other variables changed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Most likely what happened is the TIM had some pump out effect especially with the X method I find that pretty common, I usually do the pea method and then spread it a small amount in the direction and size of the die on the IHS. Then with the mounting pressure it spreads it out farther that way.


So you think pump out between the IHS and cooler? I can try the pea. Has anyone seen pump out on the die with GC? If that were the case I think I'd need to switch to CLP.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> It was lows 60s a few days ago. No other variables changed.
> So you think pump out between the IHS and cooler? I can try the pea. Has anyone seen pump out on the die with GC? If that were the case I think I'd need to switch to CLP.


pump out can happen with any TIM


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> So you think pump out between the IHS and cooler? I can try the pea. Has anyone seen pump out on the die with GC? If that were the case I think I'd need to switch to CLP.


Pump out should not happen THAT quick with any TIM. And I have run GC extreme much longer that just a few days with no pump out.


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Pump out should not happen THAT quick with any TIM. And I have run GC extreme much longer that just a few days with no pump out.


This ^^^^*

I've been using GC-EX for a long time now, never had a single pump out issue, I would check the HS mount first personally.


----------



## derfer

It's a H110. Not sure why that would loosen up over the course of a few days.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> It's a H110. Not sure why that would loosen up over the course of a few days.


PFM? Pure *Flippin* Magic? Hopefully it is nothing serious going on. I know I couldn't boot at first, and I ended up having to loosen the mount a 1/4 of a turn on one screw (EK block not AIO). Strange things happen. Do you have enough TIM to check everything and see how it looks?


----------



## derfer

Tonight I'll be working on it from the IHS up. Tightening screws, checking temps, pea method, checking temps. If neither helps something must have happened between the die and IHS. If it half helps something happened between both.


----------



## elcono

Hi

Recently delided my 4770k. It was odd as I could post at up to 4.8Ghz but any benchmarks would send the crazy temps sky high with throttling. at stock with IBT on standard it would pretty much sit on 99 degrees. After 30 minutes of trying the vice method I couldn't get the IHS off

Switched to the razor method (at this point I was adamant the chip was messed up) and within 10 minutes the business was done. I found a standard razor from a disposable blade worked best. They bend so much that you can bend away from the PCB. Once one edge is up I slid in a toothpick and the rest kind of just came off

Anyway, booted to windows with a 4.2Ghz overclock and ran IBT for 10 passes on standard. Peak temperature was 51 degrees

Many thanks to the mod and to everyone who has posted useful info on here! im chuffed and pretty amazed that this worked, always put delliding down to black magic or something

Cheers all


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elcono*
> 
> Hi
> 
> Recently delided my 4770k. It was odd as I could post at up to 4.8Ghz but any benchmarks would send the crazy temps sky high with throttling. at stock with IBT on standard it would pretty much sit on 99 degrees. After 30 minutes of trying the vice method I couldn't get the IHS off
> 
> Switched to the razor method (at this point I was adamant the chip was messed up) and within 10 minutes the business was done. I found a standard razor from a disposable blade worked best. They bend so much that you can bend away from the PCB. Once one edge is up I slid in a toothpick and the rest kind of just came off
> 
> Anyway, booted to windows with a 4.2Ghz overclock and ran IBT for 10 passes on standard. Peak temperature was 51 degrees
> 
> Many thanks to the mod and to everyone who has posted useful info on here! im chuffed and pretty amazed that this worked, always put delliding down to black magic or something
> 
> Cheers all


Glad she worked for ya!







Enjoy the temps


----------



## koekwau5

Wh00t .. me is back still on the same processor.

Some quick results. Test setup in BIOS:

Stock speed
Memory @ 2400MHz XMP @ 1.75V
CPU + Cache @ 1.15V

Stress test: LinX with AVX2 8192MB RAM 10 run test

Before delid

Min temps: 35/33/32/31 (4 degrees temp diff)
Max temps: 81/82/82/75 (7 degrees temp diff)

After delid

Min temps: 28/27/25/25 (3 degrees temp diff)
Max temps: 61/63/62/61 (3 degrees temp diff)

Pic's gonna follow in a few minutes





Look at the freaking glue near the cpu cores. Gonna show these pictures to some Intel engineers on the next Intel party. They have something to explain









Played with the macro function on my crappy Lumia 710. Look how sharp the reflection is lawl.


And I'm simply amazed by this ... *pops another beer and makes victory circle with chair*

Edit:

Ohh and to enter the club:

OCN name: koekwau5
CPU: Intel Core i7-4770K
on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
Mhz gained: still gotta find out.
OC after delid: still gotta find out.
Temp drops: 20 degrees so far


----------



## Jeronbernal

Which do u think is better z97 deluxe or maximus vii hero


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Which do u think is better z97 deluxe or maximus vii hero


I'm torn myself. I really like the MSI M Power...it has the Metro Last Light look to it lol. Or I want the Maximus Hero.


----------



## Jeronbernal

picked up the hero, hopefully it'll be alright,... never owned a hero, only formula, impact, gene, and extreme iv and vi

hope it'll be alright... don't really like the fact that its so close to the bottom of the food chain....
not much choice for a atx board for z97 from asus yet, if i decided to go back to matx, id definitely go with the gene, that was a great board


----------



## maynard14

me too i still have my 4770k sealed just waiting for asus to release z97 boards here in the philippines, im almost temp to buy msi mpower or gigabyte soc force but ill wait for asus haha


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Wh00t .. me is back still on the same processor.
> 
> Some quick results. Test setup in BIOS:
> 
> Stock speed
> Memory @ 2400MHz XMP @ 1.75V
> CPU + Cache @ 1.15V
> 
> Stress test: LinX with AVX2 8192MB RAM 10 run test
> 
> Before delid
> 
> Min temps: 35/33/32/31 (4 degrees temp diff)
> Max temps: 81/82/82/75 (7 degrees temp diff)
> 
> After delid
> 
> Min temps: 28/27/25/25 (3 degrees temp diff)
> Max temps: 61/63/62/61 (3 degrees temp diff)
> 
> Pic's gonna follow in a few minutes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look at the freaking glue near the cpu cores. Gonna show these pictures to some Intel engineers on the next Intel party. They have something to explain
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Played with the macro function on my crappy Lumia 710. Look how sharp the reflection is lawl.
> 
> 
> And I'm simply amazed by this ... *pops another beer and makes victory circle with chair*
> 
> Edit:
> 
> Ohh and to enter the club:
> 
> OCN name: koekwau5
> CPU: Intel Core i7-4770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: still gotta find out.
> OC after delid: still gotta find out.
> Temp drops: 20 degrees so far


is it me or is your chip blue o.o;


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> is it me or is your chip blue o.o;


I other that you. The delid looks awesome.


----------



## Jeronbernal

what?


----------



## Jimhans1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> is it me or is your chip blue o.o;


Costa Rica chips usually have a green PCB, Malay chips usually have either green or blue.

Edit: I'll email/PM in the AM about our previous conversation


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I other that you. The delid looks awesome.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> what?


Tried typing on a phone in the sun, which was Supposed to say, I noticed that too, and have no idea how I accomplished the above.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Ooooo all mine a green lol


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimhans1*
> 
> Costa Rica chips usually have a green PCB, Malay chips usually have either green or blue.
> 
> Edit: I'll email/PM in the AM about our previous conversation


Sounds good! Jimhans1 the man =)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Tried typing on a phone in the sun, which was Supposed to say, I noticed that too, and have no idea how I accomplished the above.


Lol it happens to me too, even when I'm just watching TV I love phone typos

There's a auto correct fail website, some of them are funny some are just soooooooo staged


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> is it me or is your chip blue o.o;


Lol .. you are right.
Didn't noticed the difference until I read this.

Hopefully I can find some time today to pump up the Mhz a lil more =)


----------



## MaKe OuT

Anyone got a link to the "block method"? I know it may be in this thread somewhere but you could save me some time searching. I don't have a vice and I am not sure if I want to use the razor method. I believe you take two blocks and a hammer and give her some taps to knock the IHS off. Just want to see the thread on it first.









edit: nvm found it http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Wh00t .. me is back still on the same processor.
> 
> Some quick results. Test setup in BIOS:
> 
> Stock speed
> Memory @ 2400MHz XMP @ 1.75V
> CPU + Cache @ 1.15V
> 
> Stress test: LinX with AVX2 8192MB RAM 10 run test
> 
> Before delid
> 
> Min temps: 35/33/32/31 (4 degrees temp diff)
> Max temps: 81/82/82/75 (7 degrees temp diff)
> 
> After delid
> 
> Min temps: 28/27/25/25 (3 degrees temp diff)
> Max temps: 61/63/62/61 (3 degrees temp diff)
> 
> Pic's gonna follow in a few minutes
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look at the freaking glue near the cpu cores. Gonna show these pictures to some Intel engineers on the next Intel party. They have something to explain
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Played with the macro function on my crappy Lumia 710. Look how sharp the reflection is lawl.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I'm simply amazed by this ... *pops another beer and makes victory circle with chair*
> 
> Edit:
> 
> Ohh and to enter the club:
> 
> OCN name: koekwau5
> CPU: Intel Core i7-4770K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: still gotta find out.
> OC after delid: still gotta find out.
> Temp drops: 20 degrees so far


You're in!


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!


Added it to my signature and proud to be in =)


----------



## diabetes

Hi everyone!
I just delidded my i5-4670K and decided to use the Liquid Metalpad but installing it was quite adventerous as it wouldnt properly burn in, not even when i put avx load and increased voltages on the CPU. So i decided to put the CPU into the stove for 45 minutes at 65°C with the cut-to-size metalpad on the die and heatspreader held in posistion on the die by four clothespins. After that, the heatspreader and the metalpad were successfully soldered together.

Here are my new temps @ 4,4Ghz, 1.232V when using a non AVX-Workload:



After Intel BurnTest 2.54 @ 4,4Ghz,1,310V(due to AVX load):



Before delid, normal load, 4,4Ghz, 1.232V:

Min temps: 36/37/35/31
Max temps: 75/77/76/70

After delid, normal load:

Min temps: 25/25/24/25
Max temps: 66/67/63/60

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K
on die-TIM: Liquid Metalpad
ihs-TIM: Akasa 450 >9.5W/mC
Mhz gained: none
OC after delid: 4,4Ghz
Temp drops: 10°C average, I'm happy with it









http://valid.x86.fr/em55xx


----------



## derfer

So I redid the paste between the IHS and block and took a picture before cleaning off the old X method application for signs of pump out. Looking at it it does seem slightly thin to me in spots with a good bit over the sides. I'm use to seeing more paste still on the surface of the block and chip. The temp result is about a 5C drop going to the pea method, but that's still miles away from where it was right after the delid so something is wrong between the die and IHS, and the only thing I can think of is massive pump out, but I don't know why that would be. I did observe that this batch of gelid is runnier than normal but idk if that would really be the cause or not.

I'm wondering if the X method hurt here because of their being too much paste, then could it also be that there was too much on the die? I applied it to the die with the included spreader, then I applied it to backside of the IHS the same way because I had seen it done like that for CLP, but maybe that's the wrong way when using gelid?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*


That looks like uneven and weak mount pressure. You had air in your paste. I have never mounted an AIO, but maybe the hoses were pulling it one direction, or it was not screwed down evenly. I have had pretty good success with the line method.


----------



## derfer

It could be the mount, but then why would it have worked fine the first day? Whatever went wrong took a day or two to occur and resulted in a 30C temp change. And now the 5C drop from switching to the pea method has disappeared as well. Could it be a combination of runny paste and poor mount pressure leading to accelerated pump out? Whatever the explanation it has to account for that gradual change.


----------



## MrBlunt

PHEW!!!







I did it!!


----------



## towtol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *towtol*
> 
> I ordered some Turniq TX-4 from newegg and it finally arrived today. I didn't feel comfortable with CLP/CLU so I opted for the next best TIM (imho).
> 
> I delidded my i7-4770k a couple of hours ago and it was a success. I used the razor blade(s) method.
> 
> Once I got thru the glue on a corner it was easy enough to work it around the sides. The IHS pulled off after I got thru most of the top, right, and bottom sides. I stayed away from that left side.
> 
> There was a close call when the small xacto blade I was using pushed thru and I thought I hit the die but it turned out I missed it.
> 
> The die was missing TIM in one whole corner (upper left). All shiny. No TIM on die nor IHS in that spot. Looks like the machine that was applying it got off target.
> 
> I did nick up the pcb with the razor and gold was showing thru in quite a few spots. Not huge nicks... had to turn it in the light just right to see therm but they were there.
> 
> I put a thick line of Turniq down the center of the die and I took some generic Cooler Master TIM I had from a Hyper TX3 heatsink and used that to trace over where the glue was and were the nicks were. If I didn't short out anything in the pcb I didn't want the IHS to cause any shorts. I put a thin layer on the whole top of the IHS as Tuniq suggested and then hooked up the Kraken X60.
> 
> It's working!
> 
> Temps are about 15C less than what I was getting for same clocks running prime95. And the temps between the cores are tighter together. I was getting one core that would spike into the 90s while the rest were in the 70s before I delidded.
> 
> I'm OCd 4.7 @ 1.375. Ring is at 4.4 no offset. My 1600 ram is OCd to 2133 and it does fine on prime95. It takes 1.575 to get it to pass prime95 at 4.9Ghz but thats without any mem OC.
> 
> It seems for right now my best performance is at 4.7Ghz @ 1.375. I can play B4, C3, and Skyrim without crashing.
> 
> I'll play with it more as time goes on.


I've been running 2 R9 290x ref cards in xfire and decided to water cool one that has been running really hot.

After rigging up a Corsair H90 to the card, I found (after much troubleshooting) that my second PCI-e slot isn't working correctly now.

Everything is fine with either card in the first slot but nothing works in the second slot.

Is it possible that the nicks in the cpu pcb from delidding the i7-4770k (see above quote from one of my previous posts) might be coming back to haunt me?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> It could be the mount, but then why would it have worked fine the first day? Whatever went wrong took a day or two to occur and resulted in a 30C temp change. And now the 5C drop from switching to the pea method has disappeared as well. Could it be a combination of runny paste and poor mount pressure leading to accelerated pump out? Whatever the explanation it has to account for that gradual change.


Try a different paste. Keep in mind that there is little chance of damaging the CPU from over tightening, I thought I was going to crack my die when I mounted my supremacy for the first time, but as it turns out it requires that much pressure for the naked kit to work properly. That was with direct mount, you have an added layer of protection with the IHS back on, tighten that sucker down. Also, I am always suspect of the AIO coolers having less than awesome pumps, and maybe there is something going on inside the pump that is causing a restriction. But that is just anecdotal speculation, I have no real experience with them.


----------



## Gunderman456

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *towtol*
> 
> I've been running 2 R9 290x ref cards in xfire and decided to water cool one that has been running really hot.
> 
> After rigging up a Corsair H90 to the card, I found (after much troubleshooting) that my second PCI-e slot isn't working correctly now.
> 
> Everything is fine with either card in the first slot but nothing works in the second slot.
> 
> Is it possible that the nicks in the cpu pcb from delidding the i7-4770k (see above quote from one of my previous posts) might be coming back to haunt me?


Many have reported nicks in PCB while using the razor method for delidding equatting to PCIe slot malfunction. Sorry.


----------



## towtol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gunderman456*
> 
> Many have reported nicks in PCB while using the razor method for delidding equatting to PCIe slot malfunction. Sorry.


I'm going to pull the cooling head off and see if re-seating the cpu with some new TIM does anything. I'm also getting a USB Controller error in my device manager but both USB 2.0 and 3.0 ports seem to be working.

I don't plan on purchasing another i7-4770k (got this one for $199 @ microcenter last year). I'll run this into the ground and then update to the Haswell Refresh and Z97.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *towtol*
> 
> I'm going to pull the cooling head off and see if re-seating the cpu with some new TIM does anything. I'm also getting a USB Controller error in my device manager but both USB 2.0 and 3.0 ports seem to be working.
> 
> I don't plan on purchasing another i7-4770k (got this one for $199 @ microcenter last year). I'll run this into the ground and then update to the Haswell Refresh and Z97.


while pcb nick could damage a pcie or memory lane so could a bad seat. You are on the right track. Repaste and seat it again. Before you place the ihs on top of the die give the cpu pcb a wiggle inside the socket. There is a tiny amount of play there. It helps settle the pins in place.

Goid luck.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *diabetes*
> 
> Hi everyone!
> I just delidded my i5-4670K and decided to use the Liquid Metalpad but installing it was quite adventerous as it wouldnt properly burn in, not even when i put avx load and increased voltages on the CPU. So i decided to put the CPU into the stove for 45 minutes at 65°C with the cut-to-size metalpad on the die and heatspreader held in posistion on the die by four clothespins. After that, the heatspreader and the metalpad were successfully soldered together.
> 
> Here are my new temps @ 4,4Ghz, 1.232V when using a non AVX-Workload:
> 
> 
> 
> After Intel BurnTest 2.54 @ 4,4Ghz,1,310V(due to AVX load):
> 
> 
> 
> Before delid, normal load, 4,4Ghz, 1.232V:
> 
> Min temps: 36/37/35/31
> Max temps: 75/77/76/70
> 
> After delid, normal load:
> 
> Min temps: 25/25/24/25
> Max temps: 66/67/63/60
> 
> CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K
> on die-TIM: Liquid Metalpad
> ihs-TIM: Akasa 450 >9.5W/mC
> Mhz gained: none
> OC after delid: 4,4Ghz
> Temp drops: 10°C average, I'm happy with it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/em55xx


You're in! SLappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## koekwau5

Some new results according minimum temps. Left the windows open last night and went out for a smoke. After I came back it cooled down pretty hard and noticed the minimum temps. I was stunned haha:


----------



## NickF

I can't believe how many people are using the razor method to do this...putting a razor blade near a fairly large investment that is VERY sensitive is crazy to me. The vice method is much safer and much easier.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NickF*
> 
> I can't believe how many people are using the razor method to do this...putting a razor blade near a fairly large investment that is VERY sensitive is crazy to me. The vice method is much safer and much easier.


Maybe for you. Some people (like myself) are better with blades than hammers. The vice method has been shown to be imperfect too. It really boils down to which way the individual feel like they are less likely to mess up.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NickF*
> 
> I can't believe how many people are using the razor method to do this...putting a razor blade near a fairly large investment that is VERY sensitive is crazy to me. The vice method is much safer and much easier.


I did a couple vice tests with old Pentium D processors. Conclusion: I could not find wood hard enough to withstand the hammer wacks.
This caused the small wood to slip over the CPU and rip off some small capacitors or something. This happened to me 3 times in a row with different pieces of wood.
I think the wood here in Holland is simply crap








Had an old i3 s1155 and tried opening that one with a stanley knife, no problemo. It was done in less then 3 minutes and it was functional.

Ohh and whut I did before I started was take huge glass of Whiskey and some of the Dutch stuff(Holland ey) and just say YOLO and went to work








With my i7-4770K I used a larger and more sharp stanley knife tho, causing me to cut off a lil of the IHS corners. Grinded those straigt with very fine sanding paper.
And while typing this I realized I might have closed the gap a lil more by sanding the corners of the IHS a lil more causing these much lower minimum temps.
Gonna find out the maximum temps @ 4.5Ghz hopefully soon.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NickF*
> 
> I can't believe how many people are using the vice method to do this...putting a hammer near a fairly large investment that is VERY sensitive is crazy to me. The razor method is much safer and much easier.


Ftfy

It can go either way really. I seen someone split a pcb into splinters when the wood busted. Razor only after that. I just go slow. I have done 3 with no fallen soldiers to date. Knock wood.


----------



## koekwau5

Could't wait to do a lil test:

Intel Core i7-4770K
Core speed: 4.0Ghz
Cache speed: 4.0Ghz
CPU + Cache Voltage: 1.1V
CPU Eventual Input: 1.8V
MEM speed: 2133Mhz
Timings: 10-11-11-32-1N
Type: Kingston HyperX Beast 2x 8GB 2400Mhz 11-13-13-34-2N
Test: LinX Linpack AVX2 8192MB 30 minutes heat stress test
Will give it a 8 hour Prime95 AVX stress test tomorrow. For now the temps are still amazing:


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> I think the wood here in Holland is simply crap


Did you use _vuren_ (like the stuff that Ikea beds are made from)? Next time go to Gamma and ask for _hardhout_









Anyway, did you have the PCB or the IHS between the vice?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*


The left side looks like it's not making contact. There is so much paste there, it could not have been touching completely.

Is it possible that bank of capacitors to the left of the CPU are impeding good mounting of the waterblock? Try putting the block down a few mm to the right and then sliding it left, before screwing in the bolts.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The left side looks like it's not making contact. There is so much paste there, it could not have been touching completely.
> 
> Is it possible that bank of capacitors to the left of the CPU are impeding good mounting of the waterblock? Try putting the block down a few mm to the right and then sliding it left, before screwing in the bolts.
Click to expand...

That was my thought too, looks like the thermal paste was able to make the gap until it got hot and started to ooze out.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Did you use _vuren_ (like the stuff that Ikea beds are made from)? Next time go to Gamma and ask for _hardhout_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, did you have the PCB or the IHS between the vice?


geen idee wat voor hout het was. het eerste rechte blok wat ik kon vinden








no idea what kind of wood it was. the first straight piece of wood i could find









and the IHS was between the vice but it was just the type of wood causing the failure.
at work i tried again with a better piece of wood and it went alot better but I still felt more comfortable with the stanley knife solution

en tevens een repje omdat je de eerste hollander bent die ik tegenkom


----------



## WiSK

I'm done with blades and with vices to be honest. I've found a thin but strong plastic store card that can take off an IHS with no chance of scratches. Just use a heatgun a little beforehand to soften the glue


----------



## NTME9

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drewfus*
> 
> I just delidded my 4770k (vice method). I ordered some CLU about 3hrs ago but got impatient and decided to do the deed and use some AS5 I had on hand. The AS5 dropped prime95 temps from ~70c to ~65c (5c), and IBT from ~90c to ~80c (10c). Hopefully the CLU will get me these 20 to 30c drops I keep reading about. Fingers crossed.


Just got the CLU put on, now at ~60c in P95 and ~70c in IBT. So a 20c drop with IBT from 90c. I'm pleased.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I'm done with blades and with vices to be honest. I've found a thin but strong plastic store card that can take off an IHS with no chance of scratches. Just use a heatgun a little beforehand to soften the glue


See that is the very smart way to do it, if you wanna go the 'razor' method.


----------



## Evil Genius Jr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I'm done with blades and with vices to be honest. I've found a thin but strong plastic store card that can take off an IHS with no chance of scratches. Just use a heatgun a little beforehand to soften the glue


Exactly how I did mine, perfect method with no chance of damage.


----------



## MrBlunt

ok so what do i put over the little things next to the die? clear nail polish i've heard. i'd rather use something like that then a thermal paste. any specific kind? what is the best kind? also how should i apply?

second, what about a naked mount. thats what i would really like to do. can i get some details on that? i'm pretty good with tools, and working with my hands so i dont think cracking the pcb would be an issue. what about dust or stuff like that?

thanks guys! always super helpful


----------



## tamw

Isnt there anyone that has delidded a 3930k on here?









I badly need to know where the small ******* are around the core for some sweet deliddin


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tamw*
> 
> Isnt there anyone that has delidded a 3930k on here?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I badly need to know where the small ******* are around the core for some sweet deliddin


The 3930K is soldered isn't it?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tamw*
> 
> Isnt there anyone that has delidded a 3930k on here?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I badly need to know where the small ******* are around the core for some sweet deliddin
> 
> 
> 
> The 3930K is soldered isn't it?
Click to expand...

yeah. there is a guy somewhere in this thread that says he did his for direct die, but never came up with proof. I cant imagine anything would really be better than solder.


----------



## Swag

Solder is good, however, not all soldering jobs are done well or they try to cheap out on the material that it results in bad cooling performance.

There is a reason why old soldered chips were delidded.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrBlunt*
> 
> ok so what do i put over the little things next to the die? clear nail polish i've heard. i'd rather use something like that then a thermal paste. any specific kind? what is the best kind? also how should i apply?
> 
> second, what about a naked mount. thats what i would really like to do. can i get some details on that? i'm pretty good with tools, and working with my hands so i dont think cracking the pcb would be an issue. what about dust or stuff like that?
> 
> thanks guys! always super helpful


first one:
I dont use nail polish, so I dont know much about it..
Having said that, I would go with the cheapest you can find.. the more expensive ones might contain metal flakes for a glitter effect or something.
You can also get some liquid electrical tape witch is probably the best way to go, but costs more.

I personally used MX4 course thats what I had at hand.. its all good!
A few folks has also left the "little things next to the die" bare with no problem.. the CLU would have to travel quite fare to get to them. but yea.. depends on how much CLP/U you put on I guess..

2nd one:
Naked mount dont crack the PCB but rather the die itself.. it is fragile and requires an even tightening all around so you dont apply too much force on one side vs the other.
Naked mount often brings temps down another 2-5 degrees (depending on how well the previous IHS install was installed)
it is fairly easy to install, but is not without extra risk
Also, CLU between die / IHS works well, but CLU between die / cooler can also have a bad outcome depending on the cooler material..

Hope that is answer enough, or someone else will chip in








Good luck!

*edit
how to apply: Just brush on 3-4 lairs to be safe.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Has anyone ever used a plastic razor blade to delid?

http://www.autogeek.net/scraperite-plastic-razor-blades.html


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> Has anyone ever used a plastic razor blade to delid?
> 
> http://www.autogeek.net/scraperite-plastic-razor-blades.html


Genius!

Next one will be like that if I dont jump to x99


----------



## CanadaSpy007

Hammer + vice method is the easiest and safest method esp with the haswell cpu's.


----------



## Pu239

Hey guys,

I want to contribute with my story, looks like i killed my 4770K with the razor method.

Yesterday i tried to delid it, everything went fine, but i had a little scratch after delid. It was not good but I heard that many of you had more serious looking scratches after and had no problem, the CPU worked. Well i took a very thin layer of adhesive tape on the scratch (I don't have nail polish at home), then reapplied thermal paste and reassemblied my rig. When i pressed the power button, leds lighted up but there were no POST beeps. It's clearly the sign of the CPU problem as far as I know. I took out the CPU again and another thing I could see: One of the studs (maybe it's not the correct term in English, but I don't know what it is called) in the socket has been bent. It is very strange that it happened now, after/during delidding.
I don't know if there is any corresponence between the two. Now I have a little hope, that my CPU is still working, only need to fix my motherboard.

What do you think by looking at the pictures?
Thanks

Scratches:
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00140_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00141_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg

Mobo socket:
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00136e_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00135e_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140601/CAM00142_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140601/CAM00145_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140601/CAM00148_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg


----------



## CanadaSpy007

That does not look good man. But first thing to try would be to bend the motherboard socket pin back. And see if it posts. If that doesn't work you might be out a cpu and even tho it's too late for this situation, I definately recommend the hammer + vice method for future delidding endeavors. I used that method and surprisingly if your patient and procise with you're hits the IHS comes loose quite easy and quick.


----------



## Pu239

I think I won't try razor method again







But if I buy another 4770k that probably should be delidded too. I don't have acces to a vice but I will get one then.


----------



## CanadaSpy007

I know it seems shady but if you only plan to use the vice once, you can put electrical tape on the vice clamps then use the vice and than return it. And for wood you want a 6 inch to 8 inch 1 by 4 piece of pine, cedar or any other soft wood. There's a video on YouTube showing the hammer + vice method procedure.


----------



## Pu239

No need to use that trick, I think I have acquaintances who might have one.


----------



## Wirerat

I th
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pu239*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I want to contribute with my story, looks like i killed my 4770K with the razor method.
> 
> Yesterday i tried to delid it, everything went fine, but i had a little scratch after delid. It was not good but I heard that many of you had more serious looking scratches after and had no problem, the CPU worked. Well i took a very thin layer of adhesive tape on the scratch (I don't have nail polish at home), then reapplied thermal paste and reassemblied my rig. When i pressed the power button, leds lighted up but there were no POST beeps. It's clearly the sign of the CPU problem as far as I know. I took out the CPU again and another thing I could see: One of the studs (maybe it's not the correct term in English, but I don't know what it is called) in the socket has been bent. It is very strange that it happened now, after/during delidding.
> I don't know if there is any corresponence between the two. Now I have a little hope, that my CPU is still working, only need to fix my motherboard.
> 
> What do you think by looking at the pictures?
> Thanks
> 
> Scratches:
> http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00140_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
> http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00141_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
> 
> Mobo socket:
> http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00136e_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
> http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140531/CAM00135e_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
> http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140601/CAM00142_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
> http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140601/CAM00145_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg
> http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140601/CAM00148_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg


that bent/broke socket pin could possibly be the issue. If you are replacing both. I suggest you get the mobo first.


----------



## deepor

CanadaSpy007 wrote use "soft wood", but it definitely cannot be very soft one like spruce where you can even make indentations with your finger nails. That will break the PCB because it's a mix of very soft and not-so-soft lines in there. When it deforms, it will also absorb the energy from the hammer hit and the PCB and IHS will not separate, instead you'll just get indentations in the wood. Pine is perhaps the softest that may be used? It's also important that it's not a crappy piece of wood that can splinter. If it splinters and is a mix of softer and harder material, the harder parts will also make the PCB splinter.


----------



## Pu239

As I gather more and more information I also think that it is rather the fault of the mobo socket. It would be great, because it would cost less than 10% of the price of a new cpu. So I really hope now that it is the case. Next week I'm going to fix the mobo and check the CPU. Anyway, I will keep you informed.


----------



## SgtRotty

I used the plastic razor blades. They work great once u have a corner edge started. Mine was used for 9 months before i delidded, the glue was as hard as a rock.


----------



## feznz

Personally I would use anything that hard and has a square edge wood is Ok but there are safer options.
I have seen even an old HHD, I used a piece of Nylon block that way you minimize the risk of the block deforming/splintering especially the corner and mashing the PCB, this tends to happen when the force of the blow is not evenly distributed along the entire side of the PCB squarely.
I have delidded 3 CPU successfully in under 30sec like this



I like to use a big hammer so you don't need to take golf swings at the block.


----------



## HGooper

Quick question, I'm going to apply CLU on die, but do I need to apply CLU on waterblock as well?


----------



## Cyro999

No, and it's unsafe or questionable to do so on certain types of blocks. The gains are small on others


----------



## HGooper

Do you mean putting waterblock on the top of die will kill the CPU? Sorry I can't understand your answer, I've raystorm anyway.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Do you mean putting waterblock on the top of die will kill the CPU? Sorry I can't understand your answer, I've raystorm anyway.


CLP/CLU (at least one, or both) eat aluminum and bond to copper, having issues with even some nickel-plated copper stuff. Putting it between your IHS and water block/heatsink isn't really an option with those materials because of that


----------



## HGooper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> CLP/CLU (at least one, or both) eat aluminum and bond to copper, having issues with even some nickel-plated copper stuff. Putting it between your IHS and water block/heatsink isn't really an option with those materials because of that


Really? I haven't been following delid thing quite some time ago, last I heard CLU is the best thermal paste to put on delid CPU with or without IHS, I even bought CLU at that time but only put it with IHS, recently I've some free time so thinking to do it naked without IHS, and didn't know anything about the thing that you've mentioned.

So what can I do now? use normal thermal paste instead of CLU?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> Really? I haven't been following delid thing quite some time ago, last I heard CLU is the best thermal paste to put on delid CPU with or without IHS, I even bought CLU at that time but only put it with IHS, recently I've some free time so thinking to do it naked without IHS, and didn't know anything about the thing that you've mentioned.
> 
> So what can I do now? use normal thermal paste instead of CLU?


You do this:

(1) CLU between die and IHS

(2) Normal paste between IHS and waterblock


----------



## HGooper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You do this:
> 
> (1) CLU between die and IHS
> 
> (2) Normal paste between IHS and waterblock


So basically nobody is doing naked mount anymore due to this issue?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> So basically nobody is doing naked mount anymore due to this issue?


naked mount with gelid extreme would be fine.

Just keep clu/clp off the mount.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> So basically nobody is doing naked mount anymore due to this issue?


The raystorm has copper base right?
you are gonna have a hard time getting it off the die with CLP/CLU and even risk cracking the die in the process.
CLP/CLU is still highly recommended for delidders between die and IHS, but not as effective on naked mounts and can have problems as mentioned above.
gelid extreme is better / more safe for naked mounts.
You CAN use CLP/CLU for naked, but this club hates to see a good chip be damaged.. thats why we are advising against it.

If you dont mind me asking, why do you even want to go naked? more risky and the gain is small.. like 1-3 degree over the normal IHS / CLU solution. (some reports 5degree and above, but I think that is just be course the IHS solution was not applied properly)


----------



## HGooper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> The raystorm has copper base right?
> you are gonna have a hard time getting it off the die with CLP/CLU and even risk cracking the die in the process.
> CLP/CLU is still highly recommended for delidders between die and IHS, but not as effective on naked mounts and can have problems as mentioned above.
> gelid extreme is better / more safe for naked mounts.
> You CAN use CLP/CLU for naked, but this club hates to see a good chip be damaged.. thats why we are advising against it.
> 
> If you dont mind me asking, why do you even want to go naked? more risky and the gain is small.. like 1-3 degree over the normal IHS / CLU solution. (some reports 5degree and above, but I think that is just be course the IHS solution was not applied properly)


As I mentioned before I did mount with IHS along with CLU last time, but I didn't get any improvement on temp at all, maybe bad mount, then I didn't touch it again because I was quite busy at that time, laziness was part of it lol, and I didn't recall there was any issue with CLU at that time.

This time around I just want to try naked mount because wanna try new thing and see whether I can get any improvement, if this is the case then I'll go with IHS mount again and pray I get something good lol.

P/S 1 : Do I have to apply CLU on the IHS as well beside the die?

P/S 2 : Is prolimatech pk-3 any good for naked mount?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HGooper*
> 
> As I mentioned before I did mount with IHS along with CLU last time, but I didn't get any improvement on temp at all, maybe bad mount, then I didn't touch it again because I was quite busy at that time, laziness was part of it lol, and I didn't recall there was any issue with CLU at that time.
> 
> This time around I just want to try naked mount because wanna try new thing and see whether I can get any improvement, if this is the case then I'll go with IHS mount again and pray I get something good lol.
> 
> P/S 1 : Do I have to apply CLU on the IHS as well beside the die?
> 
> P/S 2 : Is prolimatech pk-3 any good for naked mount?


Did you scrape all of the black glue off? That's usually the reason that makes people not see any improvement after delidding.

About painting both die and inside of the IHS, I painted the CLU onto the die first, then took what was left on the brush and painted the inside of the IHS in roughly the area where the die would be touching it. I didn't squeeze anything extra out of the syringe, only used what was on the brush after doing the die. That's what people told me to do.

About PK-3, I only know it's a good thermal paste, but no idea if it's good for naked mount.


----------



## wgoldingful

I had some issues with a bad CLU mount (IHS-die) where I was idling at 1.4v on a 3570k (4.8ghz) and unable to POST with ram slot 1 filled on my P8z77-i Deluxe.

After a reapplication, I got it to idle at 1.120 and max out at 1.376, at between 60 and 70 C (down from 77) on a 212 Evo (upgrading soon). I used Linx, IBT, AIDA and Prime.

However, sometimes it spikes to 1.41 randomly when doing things such as opening new programs or right clicking (apparently labour intensive).

Should this all go away when I install a better cooler, e.g. the NH-D14 I bought recently? I'm using the NT-H1 paste that came with it.

Also, is it bad if the CLU runs slightly off the die onto the PCB? It was like that in my bad mount and I cleaned it off.


----------



## Pu239

Hey guys,

I found a guy who want to sell his i7-4770k, which he bought 2 weeks ago. He delidded it and he wanted to sell it for more money because he tought it will be more valuable this way. He did not realize that voiding the warrancy will make it rather cheaper instead. Well, for me it's still better because I'd have delidded it anyway so here comes the question:

He said it's stable with IBT on 4.3 GHz at 1.26V

It's too damn high Voltage for that clock so it would be a crappy chip, but then he said, he overclocked it with Asus AI Suite 3, because he's not familiar with manual overclocking. So I think (and as I searched the web I found some evidences) that these softwares raise Vcore too high for a certain clock to "over-ensure" stability (I never used such softwares, always overclocked via BIOS/UEFI so don't have experinece in them). So i think that this processor is not that bad, and worth buying it.

The chip

So what are your thoughts? Can you confirm me?

Thanks


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pu239*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I found a guy who want to sell his i7-4770k, which he bought 2 weeks ago. He delidded it and he wanted to sell it for more money because he tought it will be more valuable this way. He did not realize that voiding the warrancy will make it rather cheaper instead. Well, for me it's still better because I'd have delidded it anyway so here comes the question:
> 
> He said it's stable with IBT on 4.3 GHz at 1.26V
> 
> It's too damn high Voltage for that clock so it would be a crappy chip, but then he said, he overclocked it with Asus AI Suite 3, because he's not familiar with manual overclocking. So I think (and as I searched the web I found some evidences) that these softwares raise Vcore too high for a certain clock to "over-ensure" stability (I never used such softwares, always overclocked via BIOS/UEFI so don't have experinece in them). So i think that this processor is not that bad, and worth buying it.
> 
> The chip
> 
> So what are your thoughts? Can you confirm me?
> 
> Thanks


Any motherboard auto overclock gives a drastic amount of unnecessary voltage; I have experience with ASRock, ASUS, and Gigabyte boards for Z77 and Z87.I would say grab it as long as there isn't any physical damage to it.

Don't be shocked if you don't get past 4.4-4.5Ghz though as you could just get an underwhelming chip due to silicon lottery. One thing to keep in mind though is that Haswell doed perform slightly better clock for clock even if it's a few hundred MHz slower than sandy/Ivy.

My first 4770k wouldn't clear 4.4GHz and that took 1.328V to make that speed.


----------



## Cyro999

if it's IBT stable @4.3 @1.26 load, it's like 100mhz below average (maybe a little more, hard to say because few use IBT for haswell these days) and can probably do 4.5-4.6

need more voltages, more tweaking and of course manual vcore set though.

In terms of clock for clock speed advantages, it's less for gaming (~10-15% sandy to haswell, probably, which translates into 4ghz haswell being as fast as ~4.4-4.6 sandy) but for video encoding, x264 performance benefits a lot and you see as much as ~13% gains over ivy and ~20% over sandy, clock for clock. Video encoding and emulating are where Haswell shines.


----------



## Pu239

Ok, thanks for the answers, I thought so.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pu239*
> 
> Ok, thanks for the answers, I thought so.


You're welcome, and thanks for the +rep.

I went back and looked at my review for the Gigabyte Z87X-UD5H I did for NewEgg; I forgot how outlandish the auto overclock voltage was.

Auto OC through BIOS for 4.4GHz was giving 1.372V!

Manually adjusting I got it down to 1.265V for 4.5GHz.


----------



## derfer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> The left side looks like it's not making contact. There is so much paste there, it could not have been touching completely.
> 
> Is it possible that bank of capacitors to the left of the CPU are impeding good mounting of the waterblock? Try putting the block down a few mm to the right and then sliding it left, before screwing in the bolts.


I just remounted with some washers to increase the tightness of the mount, checked the cap clearance and it was fine (much lower than they look), and for good measure I ran the test physically pushing down on the pump. All that made maybe a few degrees difference. I now think it's safe to say whatever has gone wrong is between the die and the IHS. What I can do about it I'm not sure, because the only thing I can think of is pump out, which shouldn't have happened to that extent, but if it did I don't see how to stop it from happening over and over again.


----------



## wgoldingful

Is that true? Do people value warranty over better performance of delidding?

If so, what about Ivy bridges which I think have a 3 year warranty? That should expire this year or next.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wgoldingful*
> 
> Is that true? Do people value warranty over better performance of delidding?
> 
> If so, what about Ivy bridges which I think have a 3 year warranty? That should expire this year or next.


many ppl have used warrenty after deliding. Read the Op.


----------



## wgoldingful

I meant for resale value. I might sell my 3570k when Broadwell or what comes after arrives.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wgoldingful*
> 
> I meant for resale value. I might sell my 3570k when Broadwell or what comes after arrives.


I see 3570k selling for $160 to $190 on this forum. Delided or not. As long as that chip is fully functional it will sell.


----------



## Pu239

It is just a very small community in my country who overclock in such a level to appreciate a well delidded chip. So at first it might be logical to think that a well delidded chip might sell better but he couldn't find costumers for the product...


----------



## elamelo

I am in Atlanta, GA in the United States. I have a technical question. I wanted to know if I could delid my i7-4770K and mount it without the IHS with the asus impact full cover block (3831109821060). Will it make good contact? I do not believe that I can use the naked mount kit with the asus impact full cover block (3831109821060). Should I be looking for another strategy to delid my cpu and drop my temps? Should I reinstall the IHS once I improve my TIM then install the full cover block?


----------



## InCoGnIt0

It is possible to direct mount, you just have to use the right spacers/washers. From what I have read you only gain 1-2 degrees cooler by going direct mount, if that. So would just use the IHS, but thats just me.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> It is possible to direct mount, you just have to use the right spacers/washers. From what I have read you only gain 1-2 degrees cooler by going direct mount, if that. So would just use the IHS, but thats just me.


I went from die->CLU->IHS->GC extreme->supremacy to Die->CLU->Supremacy and got 10C across all cores. You are removing a hunk of metal and a layer of TIM, bringing the die that much closer to the water, and using a much larger surface to spread the heat. This is running at 5.0 1.45. My guess is that the difference is not going to be as big running 4.5 @1.2 or something. The benefits scale with Delta to my best knowledge.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> It is possible to direct mount, you just have to use the right spacers/washers. From what I have read you only gain 1-2 degrees cooler by going direct mount, if that. So would just use the IHS, but thats just me.
> 
> 
> 
> I went from die->CLU->IHS->GC extreme->supremacy to Die->CLU->Supremacy and got 10C across all cores. You are removing a hunk of metal and a layer of TIM, bringing the die that much closer to the water, and using a much larger surface to spread the heat. This is running at 5.0 1.45. My guess is that the difference is not going to be as big running 4.5 @1.2 or something. The benefits scale with Delta to my best knowledge.
Click to expand...

Yeah you are right, the more you overclock your CPU the hotter it gets. So you will get some better gains with a direct mount, if you overclock it as much as 5.0


----------



## SonDa5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elamelo*
> 
> I am in Atlanta, GA in the United States. I have a technical question. I wanted to know if I could delid my i7-4770K and mount it without the IHS with the asus impact full cover block (3831109821060). Will it make good contact? I do not believe that I can use the naked mount kit with the asus impact full cover block (3831109821060). Should I be looking for another strategy to delid my cpu and drop my temps? Should I reinstall the IHS once I improve my TIM then install the full cover block?


Look into ordering the MSI bare die retention bracket. It should be compatible with all IB/HW bare die mounts.

I hope MSI will selll it to anyone who wants one.


----------



## Gunderman456

Hi Folks;

By endless Stress Testing/Benching, I have proven that in upping VCore and if required in tandem with VCCIN you can reach previously unattainable overclocks on the GPU.

Please refer to the last two pages of "The Hawaiian Heat Wave" Build Log (in sig) for irrefutable proof!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elamelo*
> 
> I am in Atlanta, GA in the United States. I have a technical question. I wanted to know if I could delid my i7-4770K and mount it without the IHS with the asus impact full cover block (3831109821060). Will it make good contact? I do not believe that I can use the naked mount kit with the asus impact full cover block (3831109821060). Should I be looking for another strategy to delid my cpu and drop my temps? Should I reinstall the IHS once I improve my TIM then install the full cover block?


You will have to keep the IHS. It can't see how it would possibly work without it as the waterblock you talk about seems to cover a lot more than the CPU and the height will be different without IHS.


----------



## MrBlunt

how about you mount it with TIM and see what the impression of TIM on the waterblock looks like when you remove it? Just on then off.. that TIM impression will give you a good idea if you are getting enough pressure on it.


----------



## ODSTjoker

Hello Delidded club, I would like to join the club.

Here are some pics, I had delidded before I decided to join the club, so here are some pics.



I also lapped




I used 600, 1500, and 2000 grain, and it worked perfectly, before the lapping the IHS was concave, after it was perfectly flat.

For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.

OCN name: ODSTjoker
CPU: Intel Core i7 4770k @ 4.5 GHz
on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5 (Planning on getting IC Diamond)
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
Temp drops: 21C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4tubp8


----------



## Pu239

Hey guys!

I promised I will keep you updated on the condition of my 4770K (and my mobo as well) which I almost killed (at comment #25065). Well I asked an expert to fix it if he can. Now it looks like I did the best I could do. This guy's a semi-god in electronics. He replaced the bent socket pin (well that's not big of a magic for experts) and he managed to bring my CPU back from death! Oh, my God, I still hardly belive it. It turned out, that it was not the scratch which I showed on the pics was responsible for the problem. There were little scars on the PCB that one couldn't see with bare eyes:

CPU scratch #1
You can see a needle on the side of the die, just to perceive the sizes.

The guy fixed the lines, and did an outstanding work:
CPU scratch #1 fixed

But it was not the only scratch:
CPU scratch #2

After the repair he tested the CPU and it worked properly! Man, I resigned that I killed my CPU and this guy just resurrected it! I couldn't be happier








Can't wait it to arrive to me again and test it. There's a very little chance that not everything works perfectly but I don't think there will be any problems.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ODSTjoker*
> 
> Hello Delidded club, I would like to join the club.
> 
> Here are some pics, I had delidded before I decided to join the club, so here are some pics.
> 
> 
> 
> I also lapped
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used 600, 1500, and 2000 grain, and it worked perfectly, before the lapping the IHS was concave, after it was perfectly flat.
> 
> For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> 
> OCN name: ODSTjoker
> CPU: Intel Core i7 4770k @ 4.5 GHz
> on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5 (Planning on getting IC Diamond)
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp drops: 21C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4tubp8


You're in! SLappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pu239*
> 
> Hey guys!
> 
> I promised I will keep you updated on the condition of my 4770K (and my mobo as well) which I almost killed (at comment #25065). Well I asked an expert to fix it if he can. Now it looks like I did the best I could do. This guy's a semi-god in electronics. He replaced the bent socket pin (well that's not big of a magic for experts) and he managed to bring my CPU back from death! Oh, my God, I still hardly belive it. It turned out, that it was not the scratch which I showed on the pics was responsible for the problem. There were little scars on the PCB that one couldn't see with bare eyes:
> 
> CPU scratch #1
> You can see a needle on the side of the die, just to perceive the sizes.
> 
> The guy fixed the lines, and did an outstanding work:
> CPU scratch #1 fixed
> 
> But it was not the only scratch:
> CPU scratch #2
> 
> After the repair he tested the CPU and it worked properly! Man, I resigned that I killed my CPU and this guy just resurrected it! I couldn't be happier
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't wait it to arrive to me again and test it. There's a very little chance that not everything works perfectly but I don't think there will be any problems.


Haha, awesome dude! congrats!!








And thx for sharing pics







or though you should upload with OCN instead of just linking to them


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ODSTjoker*
> 
> Hello Delidded club, I would like to join the club.
> 
> Here are some pics, I had delidded before I decided to join the club, so here are some pics.
> 
> 
> 
> I also lapped
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used 600, 1500, and 2000 grain, and it worked perfectly, before the lapping the IHS was concave, after it was perfectly flat.
> 
> For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> 
> OCN name: ODSTjoker
> CPU: Intel Core i7 4770k @ 4.5 GHz
> on die-TIM: Coolabratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5 (Planning on getting IC Diamond)
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4.5 GHz
> Temp drops: 21C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/4tubp8


Dont use IC Diamond with your shiny IHS. You are gonna regret it.


----------



## Serandur

I've got a shiny PH-TC14PE dual-tower air cooler slapped on non-delidded 3770K with Arctic MX-4. It idles in the low-mid 20s, but even at stock hits 63C soon after starting up IBT. At 4.5 GHz and ~1.28v, it gets into the lower 90s (on the hottest core, coolest is a full 13-15C cooler). Definitely time to pop that top off, right? What temperatures should I expect to get after a proper delidding and application of Coolaboratory Pro or Ultra?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> I've got a shiny PH-TC14PE dual-tower air cooler slapped on non-delidded 3770K with Arctic MX-4. It idles in the low-mid 20s, but even at stock hits 63C soon after starting up IBT. At 4.5 GHz and ~1.28v, it gets into the lower 90s (on the hottest core, coolest is a full 13-15C cooler). Definitely time to pop that top off, right? What temperatures should I expect to get after a proper delidding and application of Coolaboratory Pro or Ultra?


average in temp drops is around 20C at load so that should be the ball park for you


----------



## Serandur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> average in temp drops is around 20C at load so that should be the ball park for you


Great, thanks.


----------



## naved777

My CPU and h100 after 6 months of CLU





After using the provided rubbing alcohol pad most of the stuff were gone but there were stains.I don't have metal polish so used JIF











After rubbing with JIF







all i can say CLU is good
It comes off easily from the IHS just takes some patience to get it off the cooler


----------



## maynard14

quick question guys.. im planning to use clp on my r9 290x gpu core with antec kuhler 920 aio cooler. the pump surface is made of cooper. will the clp and cooper will not damage or bond together with the gpu die? just being cautious


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> quick question guys.. im planning to use clp on my r9 290x gpu core with antec kuhler 920 aio cooler. the pump surface is made of cooper. will the clp and cooper will not damage or bond together with the gpu die? just being cautious


There's pictures somewhere in this thread I think. Someone's GPU die got ripped apart from exactly what you want to do. The CLP got hard and the cooler and GPU were glued together. Those photos look super neat as you can see a hint of the structures inside the GPU on them.

*EDIT:*

I found the post by scrolling through the gallery of this thread:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/6000#post_18887063


----------



## cdnGhost

Hey, just curious can the following be delided??

X5650
X5660
X5670
X5680
X5690

Thanks


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Hey, just curious can the following be delided??
> 
> X5650
> X5660
> X5670
> X5680
> X5690
> 
> Thanks


No need to delid soldered processors

the "main" delid CPU's are the ivy bridge and haswell quad cores, you can delid a few other cpu's that are not soldered but with less gains (and not those cpu's AFAIK)


----------



## cdnGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> No need to delid soldered processors
> 
> the "main" delid CPU's are the ivy bridge and haswell quad cores, you can delid a few other cpu's that are not soldered but with less gains (and not those cpu's AFAIK)


Doing an upgrade on a 2009 mac pro to add dual Hex core processors but the IHS adds to much height for the apple heat sinks as the processors currently housed inside it are delided...
So is there any way to delid them or is there a huge chance I will damage the processors....


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Doing an upgrade on a 2009 mac pro to add dual Hex core processors but the IHS adds to much height for the apple heat sinks as the processors currently housed inside it are delided...
> So is there any way to delid them or is there a huge chance I will damage the processors....


why not mod the case and change the heatsinks?


----------



## cdnGhost

That is a good idea... Lol never thought of that for some dumb reason


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> That is a good idea... Lol never thought of that for some dumb reason


there are many coolers out there to fit small enclosures I bet you can find something.


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Doing an upgrade on a 2009 mac pro to add dual Hex core processors but the IHS adds to much height for the apple heat sinks as the processors currently housed inside it are delided...
> So is there any way to delid them or is there a huge chance I will damage the processors....


I think somebody delidded a 4930k. I agree with case mod thing though - it's easier than trying to delid a pair of soldered 6-cores


----------



## cdnGhost

Hmm now to find some replacement coolers... And figure out how to trick the ego into not running all the fans at 100% as there is some sort of fail safe attached to using the stock coolers and it thinkin the cup fans are dead if they are not plugged in


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> There's pictures somewhere in this thread I think. Someone's GPU die got ripped apart from exactly what you want to do. The CLP got hard and the cooler and GPU were glued together. Those photos look super neat as you can see a hint of the structures inside the GPU on them.
> 
> *EDIT:*
> 
> I found the post by scrolling through the gallery of this thread:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/6000#post_18887063


oh my..... thats crazy! cant imagine seeing my 290x rip off like that. thank you so much for the info. i will not ever put clp on my gpu die. thank you. ill just use regular paste. thnks again bro


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> oh my..... thats crazy! cant imagine seeing my 290x rip off like that. thank you so much for the info. i will not ever put clp on my gpu die. thank you. ill just use regular paste. thnks again bro


there isnt any real proof that it was clu/clp really I still kind of doubt it myself but wouldn't risk it anyway and I like to use gelid on GPUs as its amazing on those dies


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> oh my..... thats crazy! cant imagine seeing my 290x rip off like that. thank you so much for the info. i will not ever put clp on my gpu die. thank you. ill just use regular paste. thnks again bro


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> there isnt any real proof that it was clu/clp really I still kind of doubt it myself but wouldn't risk it anyway and I like to use gelid on GPUs as its amazing on those dies


I've seen another one where CLP damaged the heatsink when removing. Both instances the chips were being run at high >80C temperatures. I wonder if this has something to do with it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I've seen another one where CLP damaged the heatsink when removing. Both instances the chips were being run at high >80C temperatures. I wonder if this has something to do with it.


temps makes no difference except when you remove the block and such, just be careful on the make/material the block is CLu/CLp will eat aluminum


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> temps makes no difference except when you remove the block and such, just be careful on the make/material the block is CLu/CLp will eat aluminum


Eh? I mean temperature that those broken chips has been run at before the owner tried to remove the heatsink. There was a discussion sometime last year, where a guy showed his copper heatsinks fused onto the die. He had been running his chip >90C in a very small enclosure. I'm wondering if 90C continuous facilitates the gallium dissolving into the copper to produce an alloy that doesn't flow at room temperature.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Eh? I mean temperature that those broken chips has been run at before the owner tried to remove the heatsink. There was a discussion sometime last year, where a guy showed his copper heatsinks fused onto the die. He had been running his chip >90C in a very small enclosure. I'm wondering if 90C continuous facilitates the gallium dissolving into the copper to produce an alloy that doesn't flow at room temperature.


no copper and gallium combine regardless of temperature it may have had a very small increase in the process but nothing to notice I had CLU on my 3770K while folding at 5 giggles and at around 85C for weeks and nothing happened to it. clu/clp can make a bond to any surface technically but it's not a fuse type of bond its just a strong grip as the metal has cooled and solidified slightly from the copper gallium combo just need to heat it up a bit and it will come right off. (if this doesn't make complete sense im exhausted and can re write it







)


----------



## Swag

This isn't the right topic area, but it's a club with a lot of knowledgeable people so I will ask here.

Is there a way for me to plug in a USB drive into my PC, that may have malware on it, without it infecting my PC so I can scan it and clean it?


----------



## deepor

How would it infect your PC? I think Microsoft has all "auto-run" stuff disabled in their current Windows?

If you are worried a lot, you could download something like a Linux LiveCD or Windows LiveCD that has an antivirus and other malware scan programs installed. There should be something like that out there. Using Windows there's "Hiren's". You then put it on a USB stick and boot from it, connect the external drive and scan it in there. You can also perhaps disable the SATA ports of your SSDs and HDDs in the BIOS so that you feel totally safe.


----------



## Swag

I have Windows 7, not Windows 8.


----------



## Valgaur

if you have drivers installed for the usb already then you should be fine technically. just plug and wipe it which is super easy. or you could turn the pc off and plug it in then boot and go to safe mode and wipe it there.


----------



## Swag

Thanks valgaur.

Will boot into safe mode and do it.


----------



## Pu239

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> temps makes no difference except when you remove the block and such, just be careful on the make/material the block is CLu/CLp will eat aluminum


Yes, I think so, and well... hope so. Because I applied CLU on my GTX 780Ti yesterday







And on my 4770K as well (below the IHS, GC Extreme between the IHS and the cooler), but noone ever mentioned that would be a problem with the latter.


----------



## bloodindark

Hello. I really need your help, specially those who have been through my situation.the cpu is i53570k @4,4ghz @ 1.145v)
i had a hyper 212 ,with it the temperature reached 73-76 (AS5 paste). I decided to get a silver arrow ib's extreme,with it I have not seen a big difference, which annoyed me terribly 70-72 degrees . I dielidded the cpu, initially i applied AS5 between the die and IHS and same between IHS and HS. temperature reached 65 degrees, which was gorgeous, but after 2-3 days temperature increased again to 72 degrees ... after that I changed to MX4 paste, same story. I decided to leave the cpu without IHS, bare die / naked die, nothing, same problem, and I tried this even with Thermalright Chill Factor 3. i've got some ideas that would cause (dried paste?, or the paste not ok with that extreme temperature on die), but I want your opinion. I took noctua nh-1 paste, I have not tried it yet , as I think it will be a lost cause too. I thought about buying gelid extreme to see how it goes, if is not ok i will eventually go with coolaboratory ultra ,and ihs back , and between ihs - die go with CLU, and between IHS - HS to put gelid extreme.Awaiting your responses , Thank you


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> Hello. I really need your help, specially those who have been through my situation.the cpu is i53570k @4,4ghz @ 1.145v)
> i had a hyper 212 ,with it the temperature reached 73-76 (AS5 paste). I decided to get a silver arrow ib's extreme,with it I have not seen a big difference, which annoyed me terribly 70-72 degrees . I dielidded the cpu, initially i applied AS5 between the die and IHS and same between IHS and HS. temperature reached 65 degrees, which was gorgeous, but after 2-3 days temperature increased again to 72 degrees ... after that I changed to MX4 paste, same story. I decided to leave the cpu without IHS, bare die / naked die, nothing, same problem, and I tried this even with Thermalright Chill Factor 3. i've got some ideas that would cause (dried paste?, or the paste not ok with that extreme temperature on die), but I want your opinion. I took noctua nh-1 paste, I have not tried it yet , as I think it will be a lost cause too. I thought about buying gelid extreme to see how it goes, if is not ok i will eventually go with coolaboratory ultra ,and ihs back , and between ihs - die go with CLU, and between IHS - HS to put gelid extreme.Awaiting your responses , Thank you


Sounds like you have a mounting issue, too much paste or not distributed evenly accross the cores. How are you applying the paste can you show pictures of your mounting?


----------



## bloodindark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Sounds like you have a mounting issue, too much paste or not distributed evenly accross the cores. How are you applying the paste can you show pictures of your mounting?


i can't now since i'm at work , but i spread it with a plastic card , can it be an issue with the heatpipes of the heatsink?i'm guessing if the paste wasn't applied correctly , i would have had problems from the start , not after 2-3 days. first day/2 days i get same temp :58-62-65-59, then something happens with 2 cores the ones on the top of the die , temp increase by 8 degrees.also the times i did this trial an error we're at the count of 6 , everytime the same problem. The user "Idontcare" from anandtech forums said : "You need CLU or ICD for bare-die application. "It is called the "pump-out effect" and this thread has a bunch of references to it earlier on if you skim through.Both ICD and CLU avoid the pump-out effect." this is his thread http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595


----------



## sweenytodd

The "pea" or dot method will solve your temp problems. It will spread evenly in a circle when mounting the cooler square to the IHS.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> i can't now since i'm at work , but i spread it with a plastic card , can it be an issue with the heatpipes of the heatsink?i'm guessing if the paste wasn't applied correctly , i would have had problems from the start , not after 2-3 days. first day/2 days i get same temp :58-62-65-59, then something happens with 2 cores the ones on the top of the die , temp increase by 8 degrees.also the times i did this trial an error we're at the count of 6 , everytime the same problem. The user "Idontcare" from anandtech forums said : "You need CLU or ICD for bare-die application. "It is called the "pump-out effect" and this thread has a bunch of references to it earlier on if you skim through.Both ICD and CLU avoid the pump-out effect." this is his thread http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595


I think your problem is the application, spreading the thermal paste only is appropriate for things like CLU, the best option (specially for coolers like the 212 and coolers with pipes) is the pea method like sweenytodd mentioned. This method allows for the paste to be distributed evenly and prevent issues and air pockets that could cause temperature differences, also if you are doing direct die mounting, make sure there is good contact. A lot of these kits do not include the necessary hardware for the block to go far enough down to make good contact on a naked die.

Personally I used MX4 for direct die applications and worked well paired with the EK Supremacy with the naked ivy kit.


----------



## bloodindark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> I think your problem is the application, spreading the thermal paste only is appropriate for things like CLU, the best option (specially for coolers like the 212 and coolers with pipes) is the pea method like sweenytodd mentioned. This method allows for the paste to be distributed evenly and prevent issues and air pockets that could cause temperature differences, also if you are doing direct die mounting, make sure there is good contact. A lot of these kits do not include the necessary hardware for the block to go far enough down to make good contact on a naked die.
> 
> Personally I used MX4 for direct die applications and worked well paired with the EK Supremacy with the naked ivy kit.


an your temp didn't change after some time?


----------



## bloodindark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> The "pea" or dot method will solve your temp problems. It will spread evenly in a circle when mounting the cooler square to the IHS.


i am on bare die (cooler on top of the die without ihs), so is the pea or dot meathod still gonna solve my problem?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> The "pea" or dot method will solve your temp problems. It will spread evenly in a circle when mounting the cooler square to the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> i am on bare die (cooler on top of the die without ihs), so is the pea or dot meathod still gonna solve my problem?
Click to expand...

Line method for direct die with traditional TIMs


----------



## defiler2k

There
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> an your temp didn't change after some time?


They settled within 1-3 degrees, but that has to do a lot with ambient too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> i am on bare die (cooler on top of the die without ihs), so is the pea or dot meathod still gonna solve my problem?


I have used that method in the past, basically, if your block is not one solid surface like a water block you want to use the pea or short line method, the last might work best for naked die due to the shape of the die. Mounting directly to the die takes a little bit of practice too to ensure you have even distribution and even application.


----------



## sweenytodd

Try using the line method proportional with the die.


----------



## bloodindark

10x guys i will try it in the next days ,see if the temp will become stable with the line method


----------



## fateswarm

Am I right assuming an NH-D15 may damage a bare die? I'm thinking of the lateral forces produced when the motherboard is on an upright position. And the fact dies are practically a form of glass.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Am I right assuming an NH-D15 may damage a bare die? I'm thinking of the lateral forces produced when the motherboard is on an upright position. And the fact dies are practically a form of glass.


The mounting mechanism should distribute the pressure evenly to prevent these types of issues. Otherwise even with the IHS the cooling would be uneven. The challenge would be if the cooler goes down low enough for direct die mounting.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Am I right assuming an NH-D15 may damage a bare die? I'm thinking of the lateral forces produced when the motherboard is on an upright position. And the fact dies are practically a form of glass.


Anything you mount direct may damage a bare die. I would be hesitant mounting such a large cooler for the exact reason you stated, with the added problem of needing to account for the height of the IHS. If you are real careful about it, and maybe turn your case on its side, it might be possible, but still dangerous to the chip. The best bet is to take the plunge and get an EK watercooling kit with the naked add on for a few bucks. Between air non delid on a 212 style tower and water naked CLU, I saw 50C drop @ 4.5. Yes..50C, naked on water is the way to go.


----------



## bloodindark

silver arrow ib-e extreme is about the same size , weight as nh-d15 so dont be afraid , i made mine work , with some modifications , mainly removing the washers the mounting mechanism dropped 1-2 mm , and i added on the plate (the one maintaining the hs on the die with 2 screws) a credit card cut out the same size as the plate to maintain more pressure on the die , since it was a bit loose ,these modifications made the hs unmovable


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> The mounting mechanism should distribute the pressure evenly to prevent these types of issues. Otherwise even with the IHS the cooling would be uneven. The challenge would be if the cooler goes down low enough for direct die mounting.


So you think it's perfectly safe? I guess it's a question if I can do it on my hardware. Can it be done on a ga-z97x-gaming 7 with an nh-d15?

PS. Oh just noticed a response on negative.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> silver arrow ib-e extreme is about the same size , weight as nh-d15 so dont be afraid , i made mine work , with some modifications , mainly removing the washers the mounting mechanism dropped 1-2 mm , and i added on the plate (the one maintaining the hs on the die with 2 screws) a credit card cut out the same size as the plate to maintain more pressure on the die , since it was a bit loose ,these modifications made the hs unmovable


Excellent. I'm bookmarking this post. And thread.


----------



## bloodindark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> So you think it's perfectly safe? I guess it's a question if I can do it on my hardware. Can it be done on a ga-z97x-gaming 7 with an nh-d15?
> 
> PS. Oh just noticed a response on negative.


you need to remove th retention of the processor socket too , i needed too







since the base of the hs firstly touched the retention not the die (couldn;t because the base is bigger than the cpu itself , that is why it touched the retention , since the retention is 1-2mm higher),


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> you need to remove th retention of the processor socket too , i needed too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> since the base of the hs firstly touched the retention not the die (couldn;t because the base is bigger than the cpu itself , that is why it touched the retention , since the retention is 1-2mm higher),


Is that safe? And can it be put back?


----------



## bloodindark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Is that safe? And can it be put back?


safe so-so , since the retention offers some kind of resistance mainly to the socket/motherboard , you can put it back easily , it has 3 screws , part of the retention is o nthe front , other half on the back of the motherboard


----------



## fateswarm

Hrm. OK, thanks. I'll research it a bit too since this is obviously not an endeavor for the hasty.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Hrm. OK, thanks. I'll research it a bit too since this is obviously not an endeavor for the hasty.


You are right this is not for the faint of heart. You have to be careful you do not damage any pins in the process.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Hrm. OK, thanks. I'll research it a bit too since this is obviously not an endeavor for the hasty.


If you still have the plastic socket cover that came with the motherboard, put it back in before you go sticking a screwdriver/hex key next to your socket, and be aware, once that bracket is gone, the pins are that much closer to everything that can damage them.


----------



## bloodindark

i just applied nt-h1 , line method , 58-64-64-58 , let's see how it develops , since mx-4 , as5 , CFIII , did the same , but in matter of days , temps went nuts...


----------



## MrBlunt

i put Mx-4 on both the die and between ihs and waterblock.. im good right?


----------



## bloodindark

from the tests i did nt-h1 is 2 degrees better than mx-4 , i'm very dissapointed with how mx-4 turned out on the cpu and even on the gpu


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrBlunt*
> 
> i put Mx-4 on both the die and between ihs and waterblock.. im good right?


You should be fine, MX-4 is non conductive.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> from the tests i did nt-h1 is 2 degrees better than mx-4 , i'm very dissapointed with how mx-4 turned out on the cpu and even on the gpu


According to the benchmarks nt-h1 is a little better than MX4 depending on the cooler, mounting has a lot to do with which one comes out better than the other. Hopefully this installation will yield you better long term results, do keep in mind that after burn in temps can go up a little depending on the paste.


----------



## marrawi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrBlunt*
> 
> i put Mx-4 on both the die and between ihs and waterblock.. im good right?


I'd vote for CLP/CLU on die and MX4 on block, check out my results: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24790#post_22139242


----------



## Pu239

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> Hello. I really need your help, specially those who have been through my situation.the cpu is i53570k @4,4ghz @ 1.145v)
> i had a hyper 212 ,with it the temperature reached 73-76 (AS5 paste). I decided to get a silver arrow ib's extreme,with it I have not seen a big difference, which annoyed me terribly 70-72 degrees . I dielidded the cpu, initially i applied AS5 between the die and IHS and same between IHS and HS. temperature reached 65 degrees, which was gorgeous, but after 2-3 days temperature increased again to 72 degrees ... after that I changed to MX4 paste, same story. I decided to leave the cpu without IHS, bare die / naked die, nothing, same problem, and I tried this even with Thermalright Chill Factor 3. i've got some ideas that would cause (dried paste?, or the paste not ok with that extreme temperature on die), but I want your opinion. I took noctua nh-1 paste, I have not tried it yet , as I think it will be a lost cause too. I thought about buying gelid extreme to see how it goes, if is not ok i will eventually go with coolaboratory ultra ,and ihs back , and between ihs - die go with CLU, and between IHS - HS to put gelid extreme.Awaiting your responses , Thank you


Put CLU/CLP between the die and the IHS. Non of the above will drop your temps so low. Use the other pastes (GC Extreme, NH-1, PK-3 and others you mentioned) between the IHS and the cooler. If you take the risk of not using the IHS, I still vote for the CLU.


----------



## bloodindark

btw guys , do you think it may be something wrong with the cooler (hs) itself? problem with the pipes or something , from your experience?since at first i only saw 2-3 degrees between hyper 212 and silver arrow ib-extreme?


----------



## fateswarm

How do these results compare to delided 4770k non-bare?

http://www.sweclockers.com/recension/18924-intel-core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon/21#pagehead

Will deliding i7-4790K be required?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> btw guys , do you think it may be something wrong with the cooler (hs) itself? problem with the pipes or something , from your experience?since at first i only saw 2-3 degrees between hyper 212 and silver arrow ib-extreme?


Unless the surface of the coolers are bad (have cracks or gaps were paste can get trapped) it should be more of a mounting issue than anything else.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> How do these results compare to delided 4770k non-bare?
> 
> http://www.sweclockers.com/recension/18924-intel-core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon/21#pagehead
> 
> Will deliding i7-4790K be required?


I looked at the benches and the compared samples (4790k sample vs. a retail 4770K) and the differences were about 5 degrees from each other. Which means that the difference will be a lot less in final production models. So in my opinion I will delid mine when it arrives on the 20th.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> btw guys , do you think it may be something wrong with the cooler (hs) itself? problem with the pipes or something , from your experience?since at first i only saw 2-3 degrees between hyper 212 and silver arrow ib-extreme?


Technically without delidding most changes between coolers doesn't make much of a difference especially for idle loads its all about the real load temps that change as big hs can move more delta of heat change in heat that is.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> How do these results compare to delided 4770k non-bare?
> 
> http://www.sweclockers.com/recension/18924-intel-core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon/21#pagehead
> 
> Will deliding i7-4790K be required?


I hope they will be, I hear that the TIM isn't great but it is better stating like 2c lower at idle... ooooh aaaaah

I could be wrong though


----------



## fateswarm

From the review

1.35V 4770K 4.4GHz, 90C
1.35V 4790K 4.4GHz, 77C

What would a delidded one likely do?

They had
Cooler: H100i full
Ambient, I suspect something around 25C since they're near santa.


----------



## Pu239

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> From the review
> 
> 1.35V 4770K 4.4GHz, 90C
> 1.35V 4790K 4.4GHz, 77C
> 
> What would a delidded one likely do?
> 
> They had
> Cooler: H100i full
> Ambient, I suspect something around 25C since they're near santa.


What?? 1.35V is way too much for 4.4 Ghz


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> From the review
> 
> 1.35V 4770K 4.4GHz, 90C
> 1.35V 4790K 4.4GHz, 77C
> 
> What would a delidded one likely do?
> 
> They had
> Cooler: H100i full
> Ambient, I suspect something around 25C since they're near santa.


Delided based on those temps would be 30c less. So 60c for the 4770k using clp. The 4790k would gain closer to 20c since it already has improved TIM.

Different programs can create different temps but 30c gains are common for 4770k.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Delided based on those temps would be 30c less. So 60c for the 4770k using clp. The 4790k would gain closer to 20c since it already has improved TIM.
> 
> Different programs can create different temps but 30c gains are common for 4770k.


in all honestly you might see 15C on the new ones i think


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pu239*
> 
> What?? 1.35V is way too much for 4.4 Ghz


They used 1.35V to be able to compare them with regards to temperatures.


----------



## fateswarm

Yep, an exceptional test on heating dissipation. I wish more sites did that. Instead they usually keep going on about mandane things all overclockers know already.


----------



## AKA1

I just delidded my 4770k and it drop from 91c to 60c @ 4,5GHz @ 1.25v


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AKA1*
> 
> I just delidded my 4770k and it drop from 91c to 60c @ 4,5GHz @ 1.25v


Wow! sounds like a new record.
Congrats!

did you note ambients? what did you use to test the max temp?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AKA1*
> 
> I just delidded my 4770k and it drop from 91c to 60c @ 4,5GHz @ 1.25v


Thermal compounds?


----------



## AKA1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Wow! sounds like a new record.
> Congrats!
> 
> did you note ambients? what did you use to test the max temp?


my ambient temp is 22C, i only ran aida64 for 5 min.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Thermal compounds?


I used coollaboratory liquid pro on top and bottom. I used the stock corsair h100i thermal compound before i delidded

these are my before and after temps for running aida64 for only 5 min. not quite 30c drop



http://imgur.com/CA7xS


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Just spent 2 days, after buying CLLU from an EVGA user, talking to him about delidding... I convinced him to open the cllu and delid before shipping, as he bought the cllu for that purpose... It was a success and I am trying to get him to post his results here.

You guys led me to doing this. Great people, good times, lots of fun learning to be had.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Just spent 2 days, after buying CLLU from an EVGA user, talking to him about delidding... I convinced him to open the cllu and delid before shipping, as he bought the cllu for that purpose... It was a success and I am trying to get him to post his results here.
> 
> You guys led me to doing this. Great people, good times, lots of fun learning to be had.


yiiiiis add more to my army!!!!


----------



## maynard14

quick question guys.. is amd sempron 2007 model 2 ghz delid is the same as deliding a 4770k.? i practice delid with my sempron and i successfully delid it using a very thin kitchen knife and it works! but i dont know if its the same for intel 4770k


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> quick question guys.. is amd sempron 2007 model 2 ghz delid is the same as deliding a 4770k.? i practice delid with my sempron and i successfully delid it using a very thin kitchen knife and it works! but i dont know if its the same for intel 4770k


my guess would be the epoxy intel uses is tougher. I dulled 6 utility knife razor blades getting the lid to pop off one of my delids.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> quick question guys.. is amd sempron 2007 model 2 ghz delid is the same as deliding a 4770k.? i practice delid with my sempron and i successfully delid it using a very thin kitchen knife and it works! but i dont know if its the same for intel 4770k


Chances are yes. However, I would not recommend using a kitchen knife. If you have any workshops or own a vice, I'd recommend that method if you do not have a precision razor.

There are 2 types of adhesive that Intel uses, a soldered die and a glued die. However, a soldered die needs to be heated for it to be delidded and for that reason, it would be logical to assume the CPU you delidded is held by glue.


----------



## maynard14

hi sir...im planning to delid the 4770k i have right now. but i dont have vice. but i might buy a precision blade.

but pls check this picture:



that exactly what i did sir


----------



## Swag

Let me emphasize again, DO NOT ATTEMPT WITH THAT KNIFE.

It looks like the glue similar to Intel's adhesive, can you please take a picture of it with the lid off? With that, we can see the die and see if it has traces of what seems to be solder.


----------



## maynard14

yes sir,.here it is



its a sempron SDH1150IAA3DE


----------



## Swag

Looks like black epoxy adhesive and TIM, very similar to what looks like in an Intel CPU. That's a CPU you can practice on.


----------



## maynard14

yes sir i delid 2 sempron as of now, and no scratches on the pcb but i think i wont delid for now ahaha. i chicken out aha


----------



## Swag

Try looking for a friend or family that has a vice and borrow it from them. Lower your chance of failure by any means necessary.


----------



## maynard14

ok sir, will do, thank you


----------



## fateswarm

The razors people usually buy are very cheap. Or at least very affordable.

By the way am I right to assume the safest way to use a razor method is to constantly always add a little bit of force towards pushing the side of the blade towards the IHS? I mean while I would cut through the glue, I would also add a little force to keep the razor always towards the IHS and away from the PCB.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The razors people usually buy are very cheap. Or at least very affordable.
> 
> By the way am I right to assume the safest way to use a razor method is to constantly always add a little bit of force towards pushing the side of the blade towards the IHS? I mean while I would cut through the glue, I would also add a little force to keep the razor always towards the IHS and away from the PCB.


Yes. I did the razor method without a hitch. If I am to do it again on another chip, I will first try with a very slim credit card, or bus pass, or whatever the thinnest card I could find was. Someone in this thread has posted a picture of the card he used, and it seems like out of all the methods being used here, it is the safest, as there is practically zero chance of damaging anything, even if you completely screw up. Using a thin card and a hair dryer to warm the glue up a bit I think is the way to go.

If you do use a razor, start in the corners and try to bend it back a bit and keep the sharp edge from digging into the PCB. Haswell and newer are kind of scary with the straight razor, I would look at other options first.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The razors people usually buy are very cheap. Or at least very affordable.
> 
> By the way am I right to assume the safest way to use a razor method is to constantly always add a little bit of force towards pushing the side of the blade towards the IHS? I mean while I would cut through the glue, I would also add a little force to keep the razor always towards the IHS and away from the PCB.


utility knife blades are the best. They are not as flimsy.

Go into the corners using the center of the blade. The glue is hard but the safe bet is keep getting a fresh blade and only apply constant pressure. After all corners are open its rather easy. Just go slow.

I am 3 for 3 so far successful.


----------



## fateswarm

The dryer should be obligatory for any method. Hah, come to think of it, even touching a soldering iron on it for 2 seconds might be enough. Nah, nevermind, it's not as safe.

The utility blades might be better sometimes because if you insert with the blade at the top (side-view) there are better chances it stays at the IHS.

The resistors or capacitors of 4790K scare me a bit.


----------



## maynard14

Quick question guys. Im on the process of cleaning the 4770k can i use 70percent alcohol on the vrm regulator of the 4770k and die?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> Quick question guys. Im on the process of cleaning the 4770k can i use 70percent alcohol on the vrm regulator of the 4770k and die?


What's the 30% rest? I used 100% alcohol and can confirm that didn't break anything.


----------



## maynard14

i dont know the 30 percent hahah

btw here is the pic can i use the alcohol and colorless revlon? and any clear nailpolish can i apply to the vrm ? i dont wanna rush it













thank you so much for your time


----------



## sweenytodd

"Lakas ng loob lang" maynard14. Damn bro, you have some guts, I wanna delid mine too.


----------



## maynard14

hahahah this is my 2nd delid atemp bro, first the 3570k last year using blades also, but i bought that 3570k for cheap so im not that nervous but this 4770k i bought it new! hahah im so nervous but i really wanna delid so i just take my time and read ocns advices and heres the result, but im still not cleaning it until someone replies me of my questions haha


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> hahahah this is my 2nd delid atemp bro, first the 3570k last year using blades also, but i bought that 3570k for cheap so im not that nervous but this 4770k i bought it new! hahah im so nervous but i really wanna delid so i just take my time and read ocns advices and heres the result, but im still not cleaning it until someone replies me of my questions haha


Yes and yes. Alcohol on a cloth is fine, and yes, clear nail polish over the VRMs.

Edit to add: If you are nervous and shaking, put some painters tape over the die when you are painting with fingernail polish to keep it off the die.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Yes and yes. Alcohol on a cloth is fine, and yes, clear nail polish over the VRMs.
> 
> Edit to add: If you are nervous and shaking, put some painters tape over the die when you are painting with fingernail polish to keep it off the die.


ok i will bro,. thank you so much







ill post back


----------



## Cakewalk_S

I really want to know how all these guys on OCN seem to have endless supplies of clear nail polish...
I can't see a dude walking into Kroger just to get nail polish for his delided chip...


----------



## maynard14

Done. Haha. Its still working. Yay yes i got the nail polish from my sister. Its revlon btw. Hahah. Thank you so much guys. Gotta test it now. Im so happy!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> I really want to know how all these guys on OCN seem to have endless supplies of clear nail polish...
> I can't see a dude walking into Kroger just to get nail polish for his delided chip...


My gun collection requires me to have fingernail polish on hand too. I actually have a pretty impressive collection of different colors considering I have never worn any of it.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> I really want to know how all these guys on OCN seem to have endless supplies of clear nail polish...
> I can't see a dude walking into Kroger just to get nail polish for his delided chip...


One bottle will last forever. It's not like we paint it in the chip every day because it is chipping off :-D


----------



## fateswarm

Ask for film-forming polymer dissolved in a volatile organic solvent, like a man.


----------



## maynard14

Still not stable even at 1.38 volts for 4.6 ghz... Hahah. Crazy. Im done for now. Max temp though is 72 c from 98c!


----------



## MrBlunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Ask for film-forming polymer dissolved in a volatile organic solvent, like a man.


----------



## fateswarm

I ordered a liquid pro 'cause I found it cheap for 10 euros total. I'm scared and I have no idea if I delid eventually an i7-4790K with a razor. But I'll keep reading about it and see if the benefit would exist.


----------



## Graffy

just a quick note.

Pics will follow, just a comparison for some of you.

i5 3570k delid and laping, with clu on die and cooler all copper (Arctic-Cooling Freezer Xtreme Rev.2).

@ 4600mhz 1,336v game stable example Tomb Raider.

Prime95 before hottest core 102c (Ta 25c), after delid and laping drop to 72c (Ta 27c)  so very very happy!!!

Greets









ps. big thank you to all for the encouragement to delid my i5
I used the clamp method and it worked quit easily 
So can calmly recommend it as long as you take it easy and check to see if the pcb loosens
after each hit with the hammer. Once slightly loose it will just peel of.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I ordered a liquid pro 'cause I found it cheap for 10 euros total. I'm scared and I have no idea if I delid eventually an i7-4790K with a razor. But I'll keep reading about it and see if the benefit would exist.


if it turns out to be a very good chip voltage wise, it would be a shame not to delid.

Whats your planned cooler?


----------



## derfer

So after figuring the issue was coming from between the IHS and die I finally got around to re-pasting that part. I used less gelid this time and even recycled the stuff that was pushed over the sides hoping it would be dried out some and might stay put this time. 35C temperature drop. Even better than the first time, however 2 days later it's now risen about 8-10c. Why gelid won't stay put and keeps pumping out like this I can only guess. There's no leftover black stuff in the way and there's plenty of pressure on the IHS. I have noted this batch of paste being greasier than normal, but could that really be why it's flowing off so much? Only explanation I have so far. I'm going to keep watching it but I suspect I'll be needing CLP and that black silicone stuff. If it is a bad batch of gelid I'll need a new paste for on top of the IHS as well, and that's not cheap buying all this paste. By the time this is done with it seems like buying DC would have been better.


----------



## xxroxx

Hello guys! I have to say, I'm pretty keen on the idea of delliding my 4770k. Just a few quick questions:

1) can I do it with the non-razor metod, securing the cpu on something and giving it a little hit with a piece of wood?

2) how can I watercool a delidded cpu? I mean, the bare die will be under the shield, no?

3) how ***ile is the bare die? can I accidentaly crush it with a waterblock?

thks!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxroxx*
> 
> Hello guys! I have to say, I'm pretty keen on the idea of delliding my 4770k. Just a few quick questions:
> 
> 1) can I do it with the non-razor metod, securing the cpu on something and giving it a little hit with a piece of wood?
> 
> 2) how can I watercool a delidded cpu? I mean, the bare die will be under the shield, no?
> 
> 3) how ***ile is the bare die? can I accidentaly crush it with a waterblock?
> 
> thks!


1)is that something is a vice, then yes

2)put the IHS back on, use EK supremacy Naked kit, or shim the mounts for your non-EK waterblock

3)yes, more fragile than with an IHS, when you are tightening your waterblock, screw opposite corners evenly so the pressure remains even across the die.


----------



## Magical Eskimo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxroxx*
> 
> Hello guys! I have to say, I'm pretty keen on the idea of delliding my 4770k. Just a few quick questions:
> 
> 1) can I do it with the non-razor metod, securing the cpu on something and giving it a little hit with a piece of wood?
> 
> 2) how can I watercool a delidded cpu? I mean, the bare die will be under the shield, no?
> 
> 3) how ***ile is the bare die? can I accidentaly crush it with a waterblock?
> 
> thks!


1) yes you can, there's loads of people that have delidded using the vice method, search through the thread for all the information on what to do.

2) yes you can just like a normal cpu

3)not sure but EK sell a mount for watercooling a naked die.

To be honest, all this information is available in the thread.


----------



## Graffy

not an expert on bare die but,

I glued the IHS back on the pcb, but laped it before doing that. I myself feel better with the IHS on.

And the vice method in my opinion is the safest way to delid.


----------



## MrBlunt

in all fairness this thread is 2500 pages lol..


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxroxx*
> 
> Hello guys! I have to say, I'm pretty keen on the idea of delliding my 4770k. Just a few quick questions:
> 
> 1) can I do it with the non-razor metod, securing the cpu on something and giving it a little hit with a piece of wood?
> 
> 2) how can I watercool a delidded cpu? I mean, the bare die will be under the shield, no?
> 
> 3) how ***ile is the bare die? can I accidentaly crush it with a waterblock?
> 
> thks!


The die is fragile glass so you want to be careful. The EK naked die mount works extremely well. Just keep in mind that naked mounting takes practice and it is not for the faint of heart.

I used the EK naked kit and was very happy with the results. I have delided 5 4770k's with the vice method (securing it and hitting it with wood) and have had 0 issues. In fact I plan to do so for my 4790k when I pickup this Friday.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> if it turns out to be a very good chip voltage wise, it would be a shame not to delid.
> 
> Whats your planned cooler?


I got an nh-d15.


----------



## fateswarm

There's something about the vice that doesn't sit well with me. Electronics, fragile ceramics, glass and blunt forces never seemed to go well together. I'm inclined to "tech man up" and be meticulous with the more surgical method.

Though I'm open to corrections.


----------



## defiler2k

T
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> There's something about the vice that doesn't sit well with me. Electronics, fragile ceramics, glass and blunt forces never seemed to go well together. I'm inclined to "tech man up" and be meticulous with the more surgical method.
> 
> Though I'm open to corrections.


hats why you don't go swinging like you are trying to hit a home run. But if you have a steady hand with a knife then the razor method might be best. For me I don't trust myself with a knife as I like having all my finger in their place but I'm good with the vice and hammer. It just goes down to what you are most comfortable with. It is still a risk either way.


----------



## fateswarm

I'm comfortable with understanding the concept of the method's process. I may be more comfortable even with handling it. But the whole idea of hitting electronics with blunt forces violates all I know about electronics, glass and ceramics.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> There's something about the vice that doesn't sit well with me. Electronics, fragile ceramics, glass and blunt forces never seemed to go well together. I'm inclined to "tech man up" and be meticulous with the more surgical method.
> 
> Though I'm open to corrections.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm comfortable with understanding the concept of the method's process. I may be more comfortable even with handling it. But the whole idea of hitting electronics with blunt forces violates all I know about electronics, glass and ceramics.


Or, you do the vice only method which requires no swinging and is very easy to watch what you are doing very close. It really is simple..






I tried this after damaging my 4770k by setting the chip in the vice wrong. I didn't break the chip, and am lucky it still works, but the 3770k was super simple and worked in less time with no swinging of hammers.


----------



## fateswarm

Interesting method, hard to find. Thanks. It still seems a bit violent, more potential force or bending on the pcb, more force if it flies off.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Interesting method, hard to find. Thanks. It still seems a bit violent, more potential force or bending on the pcb, more force if it flies off.


its no less violent than you will be when that blade knicks the green layor right through to the shiney center of the pcb.

I was lucky. That nick in the first delid I done didnt matter. I did coat the area with clear polish when I was protecting the caps and hoped for the best.

The two I done after that were perfect.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Interesting method, hard to find. Thanks. It still seems a bit violent, more potential force or bending on the pcb, more force if it flies off.


Don't let it fly off. It's that simple. Notice how close I watched it? I used a ruler that had a groove for a flat surface, giving it no where to slip. I also had towels under it in case...

The PCB is fiberglass and shouldn't flex, unless you put it on an uneven surface, then you risk it peeling a layer off the PCB.. I uses a metal ruler on the IHS to give it the flames surface possible.

Just posted a few days ago.. I bought cllu from an EVGA user who had never opened it because he was scared to delid. I convinced him to delid with this method and he reported back successful results as well.

If the vice has groves or lanes to keep items from moving, then make sure something flat covers them and you can tape the flat surface on so it can't move. Place a light rag over the chip, and if we're to slip, the towel will stop it from going up.. Of course, lots of towels under so that it has light surface to stay on if it does fall when the IHS pulls off.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> that blade knicks the green layor right through to the shiney center of the pcb.
> 
> I was lucky. That nick in the first delid I done didnt matter.


Did you apply a little vertical force at the same time with the main force to keep the cutting part of the razor towards the IHS?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Did you apply a little vertical force at the same time with the main force to keep the cutting part of the razor towards the IHS?


Back and forth with the razor? If thats what you mean the yes a little.

They can vary on how much epoxy is used from the factory. So getting the blade edge on the epoxy and not the corner of ihs can be tough. I actually shaved off the corner of the ihs on the 2nd cpu I done.

I was trying hard not to create a nick in pcb. It didnt really hurt anything but I seen the tiny shaving after it separated. Also the bottum corner of the ihs had some discoloration.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Back and forth with the razor? If thats what you mean the yes a little.


No. I meant, as you were going forth, or back and forth, did you also try to keep the blade towards the IHS at the same time?

For the same reason, I suspect some blades that have the cutting edge biased towards the IHS may be safer.

But they can't be too thick I guess.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> No. I meant, as you were going forth, or back and forth, did you also try to keep the blade towards the IHS at the same time?
> 
> For the same reason, I suspect some blades that have the cutting edge biased towards the IHS may be safer.
> 
> But they can't be too thick I guess.


Did you see that several people managed to cut through the glue with a thin plastic card instead of a metal blade? I mean a card like what you might get as customer loyalty card in the supermarket etc. That seems super safe to me if you can find a plastic card thin enough to get between IHS and PCB. I'd hope the plastic of the card isn't harder than the PCB, so that means it can't hurt it.









Also, you say you'll buy a 4790k. Perhaps hold your horses until you got it and experimented with it? Whatever improvements Intel might have made to the thermal paste material compared to 4770k might be good enough for you, and you might not want to delid any more.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Did you see that several people managed to cut through the glue with a thin plastic card instead of a metal blade? I mean a card like what you might get as customer loyalty card in the supermarket etc. That seems super safe to me if you can find a plastic card thin enough to get between IHS and PCB. I'd hope the plastic of the card isn't harder than the PCB, so that means it can't hurt it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, you say you'll buy a 4790k. Perhaps hold your horses until you got it and experimented with it? Whatever improvements Intel might have made to the thermal paste material compared to 4770k might be good enough for you, and you might not want to delid any more.


I even tried plastic razor blades. A store card prolly took someone hours.

My plastic razors were good for cleaning the goo off but not at freeing the ihs.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

If only I had a dirt cheap or free 2500k or similar chip... I'd give it a go delidding soldered on chips... I've seen people either use a lighter or soldering iron to delid a soldered ihs


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> If only I had a dirt cheap or free 2500k or similar chip... I'd give it a go delidding soldered on chips... I've seen people either use a lighter or soldering iron to delid a soldered ihs


A soldered ihs is already good enough. The advantages of direct die mount vrs a soldered ihs is not that great imo.

Just lap the ihs until its much thinner.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Did you see that several people managed to cut through the glue with a thin plastic card instead of a metal blade? I mean a card like what you might get as customer loyalty card in the supermarket etc. That seems super safe to me if you can find a plastic card thin enough to get between IHS and PCB. I'd hope the plastic of the card isn't harder than the PCB, so that means it can't hurt it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, you say you'll buy a 4790k. Perhaps hold your horses until you got it and experimented with it? Whatever improvements Intel might have made to the thermal paste material compared to 4770k might be good enough for you, and you might not want to delid any more.


Oh definitely. I'm not touching that thing before I'm absolutely sure it's a benefit. I'm researching here.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I even tried plastic razor blades. A store card prolly took someone hours.


There's a video of someone delidding with a store card in about 20 seconds. Can't find it now, on phone, but will have a look for it later for you.


----------



## fateswarm

Hair dryer too I guess to help?


----------



## WiSK

Yep, probably. But if I remember correctly he only shows the deed itself. For all we know he might have soaked the cpu in some meths or something beforehand to break down the glue.


----------



## fateswarm

Hrm. Boiling in a liquid that is safe for electronics. I might be on to something.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Yep, probably. But if I remember correctly he only shows the deed itself. For all we know he might have soaked the cpu in some meths or something beforehand to break down the glue.


Something.. I mean it almost feels like the blade is never going to cut it at first. Then finally it slides in 1mm and it's on. Repeat 3 more times.


----------



## fateswarm

Say I take that liquid people use to cool motherboars in tanks. I boil it.

Boom, best delidding ever.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Say I take that liquid people use to cool motherboars in tanks. I boil it.
> 
> Boom, best delidding ever.


There's this: http://www.amazon.com/18026-Caulk-Be-Gone-Caulk-Remover-5-5-Ounce/dp/B000DZBPJM/

It's supposed to soften silicone glue and stuff like that if I'm not mistaken. It might work on the black glue that Intel used. I have no idea if it will also start to dissolve whatever the PCB is made out of.









*EDIT:* Someone in the Amazon comments mentioned it won't work on silicone, is only good to soften latex.


----------



## fateswarm

There's definitely something here. I mean, come on. A liquid that gets in there, doesn't kill anything and still takes a common glue out.


----------



## Sweetcheeba

Plucked up the courage and delidded my 3770k earlier, hammer and vice method.

Took more force than I thought, I had to whack it hard a good few times









Can't wait to get it under water


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sweetcheeba*
> 
> Plucked up the courage and delidded my 3770k earlier, hammer and vice method.
> 
> Took more force than I thought, I had to whack it hard a good few times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't wait to get it under water


congrats!


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sweetcheeba*
> 
> Plucked up the courage and delidded my 3770k earlier, hammer and vice method.
> 
> Took more force than I thought, I had to whack it hard a good few times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can't wait to get it under water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Congrats









Did the IHS go flying or something? looks to me like there are some nasty indentations on the lower left corner? remember to take care of that before trying to put a cooler on it








or maybe it is just the light..?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> There's definitely something here. I mean, come on. A liquid that gets in there, doesn't kill anything and still takes a common glue out.


Well, my first suggestion (meths = white spirit) might damage the clearcoat on the PCB, but will be okay for the PCB itself. But alcohol is fine for the clear coat I believe - and could break down the glue enough to loosen.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Well, my first suggestion (meths = white spirit) might damage the clearcoat on the PCB, but will be okay for the PCB itself. But alcohol is fine for the clear coat I believe - and could break down the glue enough to loosen.


I would be afraid to fully submerge the pcb in any liquid. What if it absorbs some liquid in between the pcb layers?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I would be afraid to fully submerge the pcb in any liquid. What if it absorbs some liquid in between the pcb layers?


Yeah, probably best to soak only the glue-foam, and not let the liquid near the edges of the PCB. Although they are pretty densely compressed, the fibreglass used on CPUs is not like cheap printboard that you get at Radioshack, but indeed it could still absorb I guess.


----------



## fateswarm

hrm. If something volatile like alcohol is safe I wouldn't worry about liquid alcohol. A hair dryer would force it to get out in gaseous form on high pressure wherever it found an entrance to in seconds.


----------



## inedenimadam

People wash motherboards in the dishwasher, why would the CPU PCB be any more subject to damage?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> People wash motherboards in the dishwasher, why would the CPU PCB be any more subject to damage?


you might be right. I m not going first though.


----------



## maynard14

Even at 1.4 vcore 4.6 ghz multi is not stable. Temps are very good but stil bsod whea error. Maybe this is what they called overclock wall


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> Even at 1.4 vcore 4.6 ghz multi is not stable. Temps are very good but stil bsod whea error. Maybe this is what they called overclock wall


um yea. Fall back to 4.5ghz.


----------



## fateswarm

Hrm. What if, warm alcohol soaking it a bit while cutting softly, hairdrying it softly for a minute later.


----------



## maynard14

Yes sir. I thought deliding will make me oc much higher multi core. But i think my chip simple is not capable of higher clock. Currently stress testing 4.5 ghz. I thought booting to os at 4.6 ghz is a sign that i can make it stable at that multi. I was wrong.


----------



## Sweetcheeba

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Congrats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did the IHS go flying or something? looks to me like there are some nasty indentations on the lower left corner? remember to take care of that before trying to put a cooler on it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or maybe it is just the light..?


Thanks guys.

The jaws of the vice left some small indentations. The camera flash has exaggerated these and made them look nasty. I used one of the suction cup type vices on my kitchen worktop fixed in a vertical position with an oven glove underneath to provide a soft landing







That way nothing could go flying.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Hrm. What if, warm alcohol soaking it a bit while cutting softly, hairdrying it softly for a minute later.


Honestly, delidding with a hammer and vice is a piece of cake. I explored other options, bought a couple of packs of plastic razor blades which turned out to be good for scraping off the glue but completely useless for cutting off the IHS. Now that I've done one with the hammer and vice I wouldn't use any other method


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Congrats
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did the IHS go flying or something? looks to me like there are some nasty indentations on the lower left corner? remember to take care of that before trying to put a cooler on it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> or maybe it is just the light..?


Looks like that might be from the vice.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> Yes sir. I thought deliding will make me oc much higher multi core. But i think my chip simple is not capable of higher clock. Currently stress testing 4.5 ghz. I thought booting to os at 4.6 ghz is a sign that i can make it stable at that multi. I was wrong.


deliding is only going to help overclock more if you are hitting a temperature wall at a relativly low voltage. The cpu is throttling at 1.3v for example. That chip would need a delid to run 1.35volts.

I been through thousands of posts in this thread. The most common gain is 100mhz when someone delids.

My cpu runs the same 4.7 ghz (1.370v)it did before delid. The only difference is now it can run ibt and prime95 without throttling.

I can run 4.8 (1.43v)but not at a vcore I am comfortable with for 24/7 so its not very useful.

I like the non synthetic load of 55c with 25c idle though. So I would delid again for the great temps.


----------



## bloodindark

about my problem , the problem with the thermal paste persisted , so i decided to buy CLU , i've put back the retention socket too , and the ihs , between die-ihs i used CLU , beautifully spreaded , then nt-h1 between ihs and HS. it;s the second day and no increase in temp yet , i'm very satisfied , 58-61-61-56 IBT load, the temps are stable and 2-4 degrees better than fresh nt-h1 (if used on die). did anyone use CLU on a video card (evga acx 780ti)? please share the experience


----------



## darkphantom

Have you guys seen the delid using two vices? kinda scary to think about twisting it off...I just used the one vice with the wooden block trick. Worked fine for me


----------



## bloodindark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkphantom*
> 
> Have you guys seen the delid using two vices? kinda scary to think about twisting it off...I just used the one vice with the wooden block trick. Worked fine for me


nope , link please !


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> about my problem , the problem with the thermal paste persisted , so i decided to buy CLU , i've put back the retention socket too , and the ihs , between die-ihs i used CLU , beautifully spreaded , then nt-h1 between ihs and HS. it;s the second day and no increase in temp yet , i'm very satisfied , 58-61-61-56 IBT load, the temps are stable and 2-4 degrees better than fresh nt-h1 (if used on die). did anyone use CLU on a video card (evga acx 780ti)? please share the experience


The challenge with CLU is that it eats metals like aluminum so you have to make sure the cooler is either nickel (preferible) or copper to prevent damage to the die. There are quite a few pictures out there of damaged GPU dies where the block fused to the GPU and cracked it.


----------



## incog

Does the hairdryer method work by the way?


----------



## gatesmarch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Does the hairdryer method work by the way?


Not sure about a hairdryer...I know a heat gun works.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Does the hairdryer method work by the way?


might but I wouldn't use it as a tool as rubber doesn't get all that malleable at those temps.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gatesmarch*
> 
> Not sure about a hairdryer...I know a heat gun works.


This is actually not recommended as heat guns put out far to much heat and all that heat staying on the silicon and pcb can actually damage it right off the bat as it wasn't meant to take that kind of heat


----------



## fateswarm

Yeah, I thought of touching it with a soldering iron but that scared me too.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Don't people delid amds and extreme editions with blow torches? Lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Don't people delid amds and extreme editions with blow torches? Lol


there are some certain ones for example the sandy bridge family you would have to use 4 box cutter blades under the corners of the IHS and make sure all the adhesive was gone and then use a match to heat the solder and then the IHS would sometimes fall off or bring the die with it.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> there are some certain ones for example the sandy bridge family you would have to use 4 box cutter blades under the corners of the IHS and make sure all the adhesive was gone and then use a match to heat the solder and then the IHS would sometimes fall off or bring the die with it.


Probably not suggested procedure though, correct? Do you think the old, stick it in the oven method would work.clean the glue around the edges, then warm the chip in the oven and pick the IHS off as soon as it is warm enough?

I personally will NOT be attempting such with my 3930k when it arrives. I will be happy with how it is already set.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Probably not suggested procedure though, correct? Do you think the old, stick it in the oven method would work.clean the glue around the edges, then warm the chip in the oven and pick the IHS off as soon as it is warm enough?
> 
> I personally will NOT be attempting such with my 3930k when it arrives. I will be happy with how it is already set.


good idea 3930k does *not* need delided.


----------



## bloodindark

guys , i have a new "problem" , not with temps this time. after seeing those good tems with CLU , i wanted more from my cpu (3570k) , so from 4,4ghz @ 1,140v (it's stable even lower @~1,100v), i found it to be stable at 4,6 @ 1,200V. i have 2 custom profiles in the bios one for 4,4ghz , one for 4,6ghz. now the problem , if i load 4,4 ghz start windows , shut down , and power on pc it keeps every setting , but with 4,6 ghz profile following those steps , when powering on every setting is loaded as it should , except the cpu voltage , i dont know why but it is 1,080 instead of 1,200.i tried saving the 4,6 profile on another slot in the bios profile , same thing , also cleared cmos..nothing ...any help would be appreciated motherboard model is gigabytre z77x d3h.10x


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> good idea 3930k does *not* need delided.


Exactly why I wouldn't, but I am always so curious...


----------



## fateswarm

There's always a chance the solder is not optimally placed. inb4 No, I do not mean that is usual.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> guys , i have a new "problem" , not with temps this time. after seeing those good tems with CLU , i wanted more from my cpu (3570k) , so from 4,4ghz @ 1,140v (it's stable even lower @~1,100v), i found it to be stable at 4,6 @ 1,200V. i have 2 custom profiles in the bios one for 4,4ghz , one for 4,6ghz. now the problem , if i load 4,4 ghz start windows , shut down , and power on pc it keeps every setting , but with 4,6 ghz profile following those steps , when powering on every setting is loaded as it should , except the cpu voltage , i dont know why but it is 1,080 instead of 1,200.i tried saving the 4,6 profile on another slot in the bios profile , same thing , also cleared cmos..nothing ...any help would be appreciated motherboard model is gigabytre z77x d3h.10x


This is a bios issue, I have the same problem with my G1 Sniper 5, the board does not retain certain config a between profiles. I keep a sheet sheet with the settings I need to adjust when I switch.


----------



## bloodindark

and you switch it everytime you power on your pc?what i mean is , since my 4,6 ghz defaults as 1,080v , the pc halts at bios screen and can;t enter windows , since that voltage isn't stable for 4,6 , so i need to reset cmos , enter bios and load profile , and do this everytime i power on pc , after it has been shut down , this does not happen with 4,4ghz @ 1,140v


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bloodindark*
> 
> and you switch it everytime you power on your pc?what i mean is , since my 4,6 ghz defaults as 1,080v , the pc halts at bios screen and can;t enter windows , since that voltage isn't stable for 4,6 , so i need to reset cmos , enter bios and load profile , and do this everytime i power on pc , after it has been shut down , this does not happen with 4,4ghz @ 1,140v


No what I do is load the profile and then edit it, once edited I save it as if I'm just saving a custom batch of setting and it boots normally every time.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Probably not suggested procedure though, correct? Do you think the old, stick it in the oven method would work.clean the glue around the edges, then warm the chip in the oven and pick the IHS off as soon as it is warm enough?
> 
> I personally will NOT be attempting such with my 3930k when it arrives. I will be happy with how it is already set.


no oven doesn't do it either I don't believe it gets hot enough


----------



## Quantum Reality

The thread being rather large, this may have been answered already -

Has anyone air cooled a delidded CPU with direct heatpipe contact to the die?


----------



## Swag

Any heatsink can be used to cool a bare die. The only thing you have to do is measure how think of washer you need to compensate for the removal of the latch and make sure the die doesn't get crushed.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quantum Reality*
> 
> The thread being rather large, this may have been answered already -
> 
> Has anyone air cooled a delidded CPU with direct heatpipe contact to the die?


air cooing direct die is a bad idea. Its been covered in the thread. The weight of the air coolers is too much. It will end bad.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quantum Reality*
> 
> The thread being rather large, this may have been answered already -
> 
> Has anyone air cooled a delidded CPU with direct heatpipe contact to the die?


Direct die with air coolers is a challenge. The weight of the cooler alone can damage the die. Also, if you are going to use CLU or CLP you have to be mindful of the material used for the cooler as those paste can eat certain metals.


----------



## fateswarm

I would risk it with a horizontal board. But I won't find a setup like that.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Quantum Reality*
> 
> The thread being rather large, this may have been answered already -
> 
> Has anyone air cooled a delidded CPU with direct heatpipe contact to the die?
> 
> 
> 
> Direct die with air coolers is a challenge. The weight of the cooler alone can damage the die. Also, if you are going to use CLU or CLP you have to be mindful of the material used for the cooler as those paste can eat certain metals.
Click to expand...

I would almost agree with you other than the fact that I have installed a naked kit, and the pressure necessary to install it was far greater than the weight of any air cooler. The part that makes me agree with you is that I installed a perfectly flat, mirror finished, copper block. Heat pipes that are anything less than perfect may not give an even mounting pressure across the entire die. The bottom surface on tower coolers is rarely ever a perfect surface, sometimes even including mixed metal bases to fill in the gaps around the pipes. Also I am not sure that the heatpipes would not deform under the necessary pressure. Also I would not trust the mounting brackets on most of the tower cooler to maintain shape under that type of added stress either.

Thats just my two cents.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I would almost agree with you other than the fact that I have installed a naked kit, and the pressure necessary to install it was far greater than the weight of any air cooler. The part that makes me agree with you is that I installed a perfectly flat, mirror finished, copper block. Heat pipes that are anything less than perfect may not give an even mounting pressure across the entire die. The bottom surface on tower coolers is rarely ever a perfect surface, sometimes even including mixed metal bases to fill in the gaps around the pipes. Also I am not sure that the heatpipes would not deform under the necessary pressure. Also I would not trust the mounting brackets on most of the tower cooler to maintain shape under that type of added stress either.
> 
> Thats just my two cents.


I agree with you, the naked die kit does require a lot of pressure, but the kit is designed to prevent the block from going too far down and damaging the die.

Heat pipes are a challenge because like you pointed out they don't always use the same material to fill the gap between the pipes and that can provide uneven cooling, it's better to have a solid piece coming in to contact with the die to ensure even cooling since the die is such a small surface area.


----------



## fateswarm

I heard of an improvement over the razor method is to hold the IHS with a plumbers grips and then push on corners until one of them gives. Then move on from there. Supposedly this avoids having to do the first cut with a blade, putting it potentially closer to the PCB.

That push on corners sounds risky.


----------



## inedenimadam

If I get another "needs dellidding" chip, I am going to gently place the PCB in a vice and try some 20lb test fishing line...making a loop around the glue and then twisting the cut ends in a drill to tension the loop.

Just a thought....

by twisting i mean sort of like this :


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!











Whatcha guys think?


----------



## MrBlunt

dont use a drill... use a hand tool in the loop.. it will be much easier to handle, more controllable torque.


----------



## MrBlunt

but u will need to brace it against something.. hmmm


----------



## bloodindark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> This is a bios issue, I have the same problem with my G1 Sniper 5, the board does not retain certain config a between profiles. I keep a sheet sheet with the settings I need to adjust when I switch.


i solved the issue , cleared cmos , dmi pool , , erased bios , and write it again , all profiles work perfectly now


----------



## fateswarm

The fishing line has elasticity (and a high yield point). i.e. it may break through the glue and right onto resistors or die.


----------



## fateswarm

A safe method I had derived would be also hard to implement, but maybe reasonable for someone doing it routinely: A sort-of vice holds the die securely, another sort-of vice holds a blade at a calibrated position (taking extra care to incline it towards the top of IHS) then with some sort of controlled lever you slowly move the blade-vice towards the die and slowly but forcefully enter the glue from each side. It avoids explosively going through the glue and onto a sensitive area.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrBlunt*
> 
> but u will need to brace it against something.. hmmm


easy way to test the fish line method would be. get a round wood pole that is smaller that "1 diameter and then spin it putting controlled pressure through the line.... however I bet 20lb test wont be enough and those transistors under the hood aren't that strong even like other people said (I just can't remember your name right now T.T)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> A safe method I had derived would be also hard to implement, but maybe reasonable for someone doing it routinely: A sort-of vice holds the die securely, another sort-of vice holds a blade at a calibrated position (taking extra care to incline it towards the top of IHS) then with some sort of controlled lever you slowly move the blade-vice towards the die and slowly but forcefully enter the glue from each side. It avoids explosively going through the glue and onto a sensitive area.


No as when you will be cutting under the IHS and with any type of angle the downward force of the IHS bond will bend the blade and force a slice into the pcb.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No as when you will be cutting under the IHS and with any type of angle the downward force of the IHS bond will bend the blade and force a slice into the pcb.


Not if that's adjusted accordingly.


----------



## fateswarm

OK this is definitely a superior method to vice. It's as if the vice method stole the idea and made it more fancy for public consumption. Why isn't it discussed more often?

http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded/0_100


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> OK this is definitely a superior method to vice. It's as if the vice method stole the idea and made it more fancy for public consumption. Why isn't it discussed more often?
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded/0_100


It essentially is the vice method, just without the vise to hold it steady. I dont think it is superior, equal maybe in its effectiveness and likelyhood of success. However, both would seem superior to the razor method.


----------



## MrBlunt

one worry, would be that the pcb gets crushed between the two pieces of wood.. i could see that happening.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Add another of my chips to the club =) 4790k


----------



## Quantum Reality

That takes some nerves of steel! I wouldn't try delidding a $350 CPU


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> It essentially is the vice method, just without the vise to hold it steady. I dont think it is superior, equal maybe in its effectiveness and likelyhood of success. However, both would seem superior to the razor method.


I used a similar method, where I had the IHS against a thin sheet of metal and pushed the PCB off, rather than clamping it into the vice. The only difference I'd see is that you are less likely to bend/damage the IHS.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quantum Reality*
> 
> That takes some nerves of steel! I wouldn't try delidding a $350 CPU


After doing it on my old E7200 I wouldn't mind giving a 4770k a shot.


----------



## fateswarm

The "vice is superior" is a blunt statement from what I had derived. It's easy to get the illusion of "100%" success rate in clubs but once in a while you notice people saying "I failed a few times before I succeeded", it seesm a lot are ashamed to admit it and only few honest people do. It appears it's very common for the pcb to be destroyed with massive pieces from the sides flying off if the force is not perfectly distributed evenly on the side of the die, also the blade method appears to fail a lot when it's done very hastely and wrongly.

The 2xblocks method sounds very superior to the vice method for people that do not have a perfect vice because it's easier to control the possession of good blocks, but very hard for many people to have the perfect vice.

In general I see a lot of exaggeration about the success rate of any method, a lot of carelessness on the razor method, but also some blunt destructions that have happened on the vice method.


----------



## fateswarm

I still think there is chance to win this battle with a liquid that dissolves the glue without destroying anything else. I heard of acetone. If any liquid does this, it beats any method hands down.

Even if it has to be heated in a pan.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I still think there is chance to win this battle with a liquid that dissolves the glue without destroying anything else. I heard of acetone. If any liquid does this, it beats any method hands down.
> 
> Even if it has to be heated in a pan.


Issue that I see is that the liquid that dissolves glue, may not also dissolve the clearcoat that is on the PCB (it protects against oxidation).

I don't know what Intel uses, but I would guess it's some kind of polyurethane, and that could be damaged with acetone.

We need to know the exact composition of the glue, and of the clearcoat, and then we need to find an industrial chemist


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The "vice is superior" is a blunt statement from what I had derived. It's easy to get the illusion of "100%" success rate in clubs but once in a while you notice people saying "I failed a few times before I succeeded", it seesm a lot are ashamed to admit it and only few honest people do.
> 
> In general I see a lot of exaggeration about the success rate of any method, a lot of carelessness on the razor method, but also some blunt destructions that have happened on the vice method.


Its never seemed like 100% success rate to me. There are a lot of failed reports in the thread that included some horrifying pictures of wasted $350 cpus.

I expected to fail the first time I done one. I wouldn't even try until I had a 2nd 4670k already here. I only suggest someone attempt it who has the cash to cover the loss.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Its never seemed like 100% success rate to me. There are a lot of failed reports in the thread that included some horrifying pictures of wasted $350 cpus.
> 
> I expected to fail the first time I done one. I wouldn't even try until I had a 2nd 4670k already here. I only suggest someone attempt it who has the cash to cover the loss.


Nothing is foolproof. People watch a video, the method is correct, but they misunderstand.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The "vice is superior" is a blunt statement from what I had derived. It's easy to get the illusion of "100%" success rate in clubs but once in a while you notice people saying "I failed a few times before I succeeded", it seesm a lot are ashamed to admit it and only few honest people do. It appears it's very common for the pcb to be destroyed with massive pieces from the sides flying off if the force is not perfectly distributed evenly on the side of the die, also the blade method appears to fail a lot when it's done very hastely and wrongly.
> 
> The 2xblocks method sounds very superior to the vice method for people that do not have a perfect vice because it's easier to control the possession of good blocks, but very hard for many people to have the perfect vice.
> 
> In general I see a lot of exaggeration about the success rate of any method, a lot of carelessness on the razor method, but also some blunt destructions that have happened on the vice method.


Following the vice method thread, it seemed to me there were more people with problems finding the correct piece of wood, so this wood-only block method would not work at all! The vice was usually fine as it technically doesn't matter if the IHS gets clamp marks or not. The people destroyed the PCBs of their CPUs through splintering wood or wood that didn't have a perfectly clean cut edge, and that kind of wood would then also make this block method worthless.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Issue that I see is that the liquid that dissolves glue, may not also dissolve the clearcoat that is on the PCB (it protects against oxidation).
> 
> I don't know what Intel uses, but I would guess it's some kind of polyurethane, and that could be damaged with acetone.
> 
> We need to know the exact composition of the glue, and of the clearcoat, and then we need to find an industrial chemist


Sounds easy with the right equipment. Find composition of glue -> see what dissolves it, find composition of other components -> find if it's safe. It might not be perfectly safe without trials since some hidden components might not be analysed but an educated guess might be derived.

Also the temperature of the equipment/solvent might play a role.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Following the vice method thread, it seemed to me there were more people with problems finding the correct piece of wood, so this wood-only block method would not work at all! The vice was usually fine as it technically doesn't matter if the IHS gets clamp marks or not. The people destroyed the PCBs of their CPUs through splintering wood or wood that didn't have a perfectly clean cut edge, and that kind of wood would then also make this block method worthless.


That might be true, but it would also keep the vice method unreliable since it still needs wood or other equipment.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That might be true, but it would also keep the vice method unreliable since it still needs wood or other equipment.


Yeah, I guess with the vice there's a theoretical possibility to use crappier wood than what you'd need for the block-only-method, but it can't be much different wood so can't be a lot easier to find. I'm just saying your second paragraph felt super strange to me, with you thinking the block-only-method would be "very superior". Who knows what could go wrong with those two blocks as the CPU is just leaning on one of the blocks, suspended in the air... With the vice, the CPU can't move at all, and literally the cheapest, crappiest vice in the home improvement store will be good enough in my experience.


----------



## fateswarm

I meant many people will find it easier to find two good blocks of wood than one good block of wood and a good vice.

PS. I still find either method more risky than the popular culture portrays it to be.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I meant many people will find it easier to find two good blocks of wood than one good block of wood and a good vice.
> 
> PS. I still find either method more risky than the popular culture portrays it to be.


Yeah, it also seems suspicious to me with the hitting.

Chemicals feel suspicious because of possibly also reacting with the PCB's material, not just with the glue.

I guess the best method would be something that will physically cut through the glue without any chance to cut into the PCB. I don't know if something like that exists. The fishing line idea sounds the best for that, but no one reported that it worked. There's one or two people reporting that they could cut the glue with a plastic card, so there's that.

Some people obviously are confident that they can use a razor without ever slipping. It might very well be true that the tool can be controlled well enough to feel if it's currently cutting in the right direction or not. For those people, razor seems to be obviously better and safe compared to the hammer. Perhaps you are one of those people but you can't know until you try it?


----------



## GaMbi2004

I agree with just about every statements made the last few days..

None of the methods are "safe".. the safest thing is to not delid at all.. but since folks visiting this thread WANTS to delid, we refer to the different methods.
Folks with steady hands and basic knowledge of razors, might find this to be the safest. But as I see it, the majority of reported damaged CPUs is from this method.
In those cases, the vise-hammer is probobly safer.. I for one, was thinking of going razor, but when I saw the gap between PCB and IHS, I went with vise-hammer instead.
The brick-brick method is also often suggested in this thread to those who does not have / dont know anyone who has a vise.

Also, depending on haswell or not.. the haswell has its surface mounted caps that could easily be damaged with razor, plastic cards or even fishing line / floss line.
But I guess this is also relevant with the vise-hammer unless you turn the CPU the right way.

It seams like once a months or so, this subject reemerges.. "what is the best method?"
Well.. it depends from person to person.
The best thing to do is to give people the different options that has been tested and is generally used with high success rate and let them decide for them self.

PS. the new "liquid dessolvant" method that has been disguised is entreating! if such a substance could be found, all other methods would indeed be obsolete.
Who wanna go first?


----------



## fateswarm

I'm oscillating between 2xblocks+hair dryer or a very, very, slow razor session.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> PS. the new "liquid dessolvant" method that has been disguised is entreating! if such a substance could be found, all other methods would indeed be obsolete.
> Who wanna go first?


Need a chemistry expert indeed as someone hinted. Alternatively, if the substances can be determined and confirmed, we could do research on them. It seems we lack knowledge of exact materials.


----------



## scorpscarx

Razor is my preferred way, if you have a mountain of patience it's pretty impossible to mess it up.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Razor is my preferred way, if you have a mountain of patience it's pretty impossible to mess it up.


Exactly plain and simple. Take your time, and you'll be fine. My motto right there


----------



## fateswarm

So many people are afraid though that the gap is too thin to even start at it safely. I heard of a weird method. You grab IHS with a plumbers grips, you push down the pcb corners until one gives, and then go on with razor from there.


----------



## koekwau5

Had a fun day today. Replaced a whole lot of computers and servers at companies due to XP retirement.
Took back a whole lot of Intel based HP workstations and pulled out all the CPU's.
Grabbed myself a hammer and retried the hammer / vice method. With the correct type of wood it goes much better. Did my own i7-4770K with razor cuz I always wacked of capacitors on the bottom side due to the wood that splinters.

After a couple of Core2Duo E4500 units I stumbled on a PC with a Core2Duo E6300.
Delidded that one and found myself a very weird coolingpaste which is nearly impossible to remove with TIM cleaner.
You have to use your nails to scratch it off.
Can anyone tell me what kind of material it is? I'm curious since I cannot figure out what it is.
Photo:



Thnx in advance!

Edit: Pictures of the Core2Duo E4500 unit:


Edit 2: Found myself some old P35-DS3R Gigabyte motherboards. Think I'm gonna try em out saturday.


----------



## MrBlunt

is it solder?


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrBlunt*
> 
> is it solder?


I was thinking the same, but for thats it's to squishy.
This is weird! I also keep on removing layer after layer with my nail.
No die to be found yet.

This is just a test sample so any wicked ideas bring em in!


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Had a fun day today. Replaced a whole lot of computers and servers at companies due to XP retirement.
> Took back a whole lot of Intel based HP workstations and pulled out all the CPU's.
> Grabbed myself a hammer and retried the hammer / vice method. With the correct type of wood it goes much better. Did my own i7-4770K with razor cuz I always wacked of capacitors on the bottom side due to the wood that splinters.
> 
> After a couple of Core2Duo E4500 units I stumbled on a PC with a Core2Duo E6300.
> Delidded that one and found myself a very weird coolingpaste which is nearly impossible to remove with TIM cleaner.
> You have to use your nails to scratch it off.
> Can anyone tell me what kind of material it is? I'm curious since I cannot figure out what it is.
> Photo:
> 
> 
> 
> Thnx in advance!
> 
> Edit: Pictures of the Core2Duo E4500 unit:
> 
> 
> Edit 2: Found myself some old P35-DS3R Gigabyte motherboards. Think I'm gonna try em out saturday.


I had the same stuff on my E7200... Don't have thermal paste remover so I just used alcohol and my nails for both the paste and the glue.

I'm still looking for a good motherboard to throw that CPU in, only got just over 3 gigs on my P5KPL... Rampage Extreme anyone?


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GorbazTheDragon*
> 
> I had the same stuff on my E7200... Don't have thermal paste remover so I just used alcohol and my nails for both the paste and the glue.
> 
> I'm still looking for a good motherboard to throw that CPU in, only got just over 3 gigs on my P5KPL... Rampage Extreme anyone?


Had one but died sadly =(
Stil I have an amazing Gigabyte P35-DS3R which was able to run my E8400 @ 4.5Ghz stable. Saturday I'm gonna give it some more voltages and lets see how fast the E4500 will go ghehe.

Edit: Turns out the second board I have is a EP45-DS3R. Dunno if that one was a good clocker. Gonna figure that out


----------



## fateswarm

At an i7-4790K here the glue is well sandwiched and protruding from all sides and corners without leaving noticeable gaps. It seems questionable I could control even the thinnest blade to start from the roof of IHS at a corner safely. In any case I should leave it for now since I haven't even tested the chip yet.


----------



## Jeronbernal

so far did all the leak testing last night and today.... hooked up the aquaero, and just did a quick & dirty OC run to see what i can push real quick out of the DC chip... and so far 1 1/2 hour stable @ 4.9ghz with 1.3v

http://valid.x86.fr/u63x41

http://valid.x86.fr/u63x41

i've got to say, putting white LED's on my black 760T case makes it look muuuuch nicer than when it had red LED's for the power/reset/hdd lights





gonna rip apart everything tomorrow because my aquacomputer mps flowmeter/temp sensor came in late @[email protected] but was sooooo curious how the devils canyon chip would do XD especially delidded


----------



## fateswarm

Jeronbernal, vice+block?


----------



## Jeronbernal

I used the double block method skyn3t wrote a guide on

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&ei=I--rU7fsEci3yASHwoKYDg&url=http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded/60&cd=6&ved=0CDIQFjAF&usg=AFQjCNFy39HJRLff8imCUx7auDz31qhdPQ


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> I used the double block method skyn3t wrote a guide on
> 
> https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&ei=I--rU7fsEci3yASHwoKYDg&url=http://www.overclock.net/t/1415190/guide-i7-3770k-4770k-gets-lapped-delidded/60&cd=6&ved=0CDIQFjAF&usg=AFQjCNFy39HJRLff8imCUx7auDz31qhdPQ


Oh right, I know that method. I find it better than the vice method for people without an exceptional vice.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Valgaur, I was just wondering if you are going to add Devil's Canyon to the front page.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> Valgaur, I was just wondering if you are going to add Devil's Canyon to the front page.


I want to snag one of those little buggers and do some testing for the club and give my analysis to see if the gain is worth the lose. BUT I iz a poor person at the moment this summer is a little break from computers and focusing on drag racing for me







Also on devils if someone does delid one I will be adding it immediately


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> Valgaur, I was just wondering if you are going to add Devil's Canyon to the front page.
> 
> 
> 
> I want to snag one of those little buggers and do some testing for the club and give my analysis to see if the gain is worth the lose. BUT I iz a poor person at the moment this summer is a little break from computers and focusing on drag racing for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also on devils if someone does delid one I will be adding it immediately
Click to expand...

Cool


----------



## Moejoe

Hi all, just wanted to thank everyone in this thread for info.

My first time building/overclocking and delidding, went straight in at the deep end and took my new 4790k apart. Wanted to thank Scarlet-Tech for post #25225. Using a Vice without the need for a hammer felt very controlled and everything worked perfectly. Seeing a temp drop of about 11-13c across all cores.

20140628_025525_resized.jpg 503k .jpg file


20140627_204706_resized.jpg 490k .jpg file


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Moejoe*
> 
> Hi all, just wanted to thank everyone in this thread for info.
> 
> My first time building/overclocking and delidding, went straight in at the deep end and took my new 4790k apart. Wanted to thank Scarlet-Tech for post #25225. Using a Vice without the need for a hammer felt very controlled and everything worked perfectly. Seeing a temp drop of about 11-13c across all cores.
> 
> 20140628_025525_resized.jpg 503k .jpg file
> 
> 
> 20140627_204706_resized.jpg 490k .jpg file


noice!!!







gib vagur info and i'll add ya as numbero uno!


----------



## Moejoe

Thank you Valgaur, im extremely pleased not to have broken anything (bar the record for 'the most pairs of underwear soiled in an hour')

However I do believe Jeronbernal a few pages back (Post #25299) has that honor


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Add another of my chips to the club =) 4790k


Gib me info!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Moejoe*
> 
> Thank you Valgaur, im extremely pleased not to have broken anything (bar the record for 'the most pairs of underwear soiled in an hour')
> 
> However I do believe Jeronbernal a few pages back (Post #25299) has that honor


Much humble, many kind ( still need teh info!







)


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Moejoe*
> 
> Hi all, just wanted to thank everyone in this thread for info.
> 
> My first time building/overclocking and delidding, went straight in at the deep end and took my new 4790k apart. Wanted to thank Scarlet-Tech for post #25225. Using a Vice without the need for a hammer felt very controlled and everything worked perfectly. Seeing a temp drop of about 11-13c across all cores.
> 
> 20140628_025525_resized.jpg 503k .jpg file
> 
> 
> 20140627_204706_resized.jpg 490k .jpg file


I just found a small vice at work, almost the size of a cpu, and will be acquiring it for future ventures. 

How did the TIM look from start to finish compared to the 4770k


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Gib me info!
> Much humble, many kind ( still need teh info!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Heya Valgaur, what info do ya need?

Thanks Moejoe for being humble







+


----------



## fateswarm

It turns out I probably don't have to delid at all since at 4.7 I get a big jump in voltage requirements that I wouldn't want to run 24/7 anyway. On 4.6 the thermals do not appear to be the limiting factor in most scenarios (up to prime95-blend at least). Good thing since I avoid the risk for now.


----------



## MrBlunt

i'm terrible at overclocking =( i cant even get past 4.2


----------



## Moejoe

What info do you require Valgaur?

Credit where credit is due Jeronbernal









I have no idea how the TIM compares to the 4770k, though i did have a 4770k, I pretty much sent it back straight away, as I could not stabily clock past 4.2Ghz, and for £20 extra I could exchange for 4790k, which is currently stable at 4.7Ghz.

I found pretty much exactly the same fateswarm, perfectly stable at 4.6Ghz with Vcore 1.25 (could maybe have brought voltage down a bit as well) and good thermals. I hit a thermal wall around 1.28-1.3V, having Delid I can go much further, but 4.7Ghz requires 1.344V to be stable so far, almost 0.1V More! I just had a target of 4.7 and I wanted to try a Delid. (So much for the 5Ghz Intel promised on Air







)

Could anyone advise me, Would 1.344V be just that bit to much to run 24/7? Temps of 70c Occt: linpack, 80c IBT max settings. I see a lot of differant opinions for voltage ranging from 1.3 to 1.45V.

Thanks


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Moejoe*
> 
> Hi all, just wanted to thank everyone in this thread for info.
> 
> My first time building/overclocking and delidding, went straight in at the deep end and took my new 4790k apart. Wanted to thank Scarlet-Tech for post #25225. Using a Vice without the need for a hammer felt very controlled and everything worked perfectly. Seeing a temp drop of about 11-13c across all cores.
> 
> 20140628_025525_resized.jpg 503k .jpg file
> 
> 
> 20140627_204706_resized.jpg 490k .jpg file


Gonna try this technique on some older samples.
I like to see the impact on the IHS. It has to be bend / out of shape a lil or not?

Also your TIM is also applied just as crappy as on my i7-4770K.
My TIM was mixed up with the black adhesive ... go Intel!

Edit: Pics of my crappy i7-4770K here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-guide-with-statistics/12820#post_22333046

Good choice delidding yours and enjoy the temps =)


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Moejoe*
> 
> What info do you require Valgaur?
> 
> Credit where credit is due Jeronbernal
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have no idea how the TIM compares to the 4770k, though i did have a 4770k, I pretty much sent it back straight away, as I could not stabily clock past 4.2Ghz, and for £20 extra I could exchange for 4790k, which is currently stable at 4.7Ghz.
> 
> I found pretty much exactly the same fateswarm, perfectly stable at 4.6Ghz with Vcore 1.25 (could maybe have brought voltage down a bit as well) and good thermals. I hit a thermal wall around 1.28-1.3V, having Delid I can go much further, but 4.7Ghz requires 1.344V to be stable so far, almost 0.1V More! I just had a target of 4.7 and I wanted to try a Delid. (So much for the 5Ghz Intel promised on Air
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Could anyone advise me, Would 1.344V be just that bit to much to run 24/7? Temps of 70c Occt: linpack, 80c IBT max settings. I see a lot of differant opinions for voltage ranging from 1.3 to 1.45V.
> 
> Thanks


for over 6 months I have been feeding both my 4670ks 1.376volts in bios. Thats 1.392 under a avx load. Not a sign of degradation.

You are going to have to make a judgment call on your own in this.

I followed the haswell oc thread a long time. The reports of degradation is a tiny percentage on top of the the fact that some of that tiny percentage may have had faulty cpus or done something like feed 1.5vcore 2.4 input to it.

Also the ones that really have degraded like darkwizzie ran a huge amount of stress tests everyday.

My cpus are not that great of clockers either. You guys with chips that scale great at 1.25volts are prolly at more risk running high vcore. I needed that 1.376 for 4.7ghz to be stable.


----------



## Valgaur

read the OP (Original Post/ page 1 post 1)







it has the required info needed


----------



## MrBlunt

hey guys, so i'm a noob when it come's to overclocking. i'm trying to overclock and not very successfully i might add. I know there are threads on here and stuff.. but i'm not good at following a long list of info.. if anybody would be willing to walk me through some of it, in a thread i'll start. i would be extremely greatful!! i even have a pretty badass oc'ng board. Maximus VI Extreme 4770k cpu. i have no problem delidding too if need be















anyways, thanks in advance


----------



## RKDxpress

Have to ask as my search brought up too much debate. Can I delidd my 4770k and use arctic silver 5 on the die and for the heat sink? This is the best tim I can find localy. Should I just wait an order ultra? Yes I have read dozens of pages done my homework practiced on some old chips. Now I'm ready for the Haswell. Thanks in advance. RKDxpress


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RKDxpress*
> 
> Have to ask as my search brought up too much debate. Can I delidd my 4770k and use arctic silver 5 on the die and for the heat sink? This is the best tim I can find localy. Should I just wait an order ultra? Yes I have read dozens of pages done my homework practiced on some old chips. Now I'm ready for the Haswell. Thanks in advance. RKDxpress


you "can" use it. It just does not offer the same improvement clp/clu or gelid extreme do. I suggest waiting on the better tim to arrive.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RKDxpress*
> 
> Have to ask as my search brought up too much debate. Can I delidd my 4770k and use arctic silver 5 on the die and for the heat sink? This is the best tim I can find localy. Should I just wait an order ultra? Yes I have read dozens of pages done my homework practiced on some old chips. Now I'm ready for the Haswell. Thanks in advance. RKDxpress


I agree with what wirerat says, ive played with a few tims that weren't clu or gelid, and between the die and ihs, some of them make it feel as if it wasn't delidded to begin with

That and be careful with as5, from what I hear it's conductive, and you wouldn't want to short out a vrm next to your die if gets in contact from the pump out effect


----------



## RKDxpress

Alright I'll try and be paitent. Got tomorrow off and wanted to mod my case drilling holes while everything was striped out. It can wait rather get it right. Thanks again.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> I agree with what wirerat says, ive played with a few tims that weren't clu or gelid, and between the die and ihs, some of them make it feel as if it wasn't delidded to begin with
> 
> That and be careful with as5, from what I hear it's conductive, and you wouldn't want to short out a vrm next to your die if gets in contact from the pump out effect


As5 is not conductive you can use it without a problem. I've used it while I was waiting for my CLU and it did well enough. I actually have a buddy that has his 3770K delided and pasted with ARtic Silver with no issues.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> As5 is not conductive you can use it without a problem. I've used it while I was waiting for my CLU and it did well enough. I actually have a buddy that has his 3770K delided and pasted with ARtic Silver with no issues.


It's not conductive, but it is capacitive, and you wouldn't want to get it on the caps under the IHS. It may not cause any problem, but then again, it might. As long as you were careful with the application, it should be fine, but still.

And really, if you are going to delid you want to use something other than normal paste under the IHS. Normal pastes don't provide nearly the same benefits temp-wise as the liquid metals, and they have a tendency to pump out over time, leaving you worse off than you were when you started.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> It's not conductive, but it is capacitive, and you wouldn't want to get it on the caps under the IHS. It may not cause any problem, but then again, it might. As long as you were careful with the application, it should be fine, but still.
> 
> And really, if you are going to delid you want to use something other than normal paste under the IHS. Normal pastes don't provide nearly the same benefits temp-wise as the liquid metals, and they have a tendency to pump out over time, leaving you worse off than you were when you started.


liquid metals do have some negatives though. I was going to replace my clp with more clp after 6 months but I did not like that clean up. I had to basically lap the under side of my ihs to get it off and where it was eating into the ihs left a few tiny marks on the die.

So I went back with gelid under the die. I feel comfortable about leaving it for the life of the build and I only sacrificed 2c.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Just out curiosity, where is the member list anyways? Is it in the OP? Having a hard time finding it. I see the "" members list but nothing under it


----------



## Swag

I believe the problem is with only you, I see it perfectly fine.

And with that, I'm joking. I think it just hasn't been made because honestly, there is not a necessity for it. As well, if people who attempt to delid their CPU and fail and are not allowed to join the club, it could open a rift between the two parties resulting in not helping each other. And with that, the club will fail and a breeding ground of hate within OCN may start.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Just out curiosity, where is the member list anyways? Is it in the OP? Having a hard time finding it. I see the "" members list but nothing under it


There is a code error that doesnt let the link from google docs show it properly. I think the file might be to big or something? I'm still adding each and every person and such just irritates me that it doesnt show up.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I believe the problem is with only you, I see it perfectly fine.
> 
> And with that, I'm joking. I think it just hasn't been made because honestly, there is not a necessity for it. As well, if people who attempt to delid their CPU and fail and are not allowed to join the club, it could open a rift between the two parties resulting in not helping each other. And with that, the club will fail and a breeding ground of hate within OCN may start.


I actually kind of like this idea more than anything really, doesnt make the people who fail or have issues feel so bad then.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> There is a code error that doesnt let the link from google docs show it properly. I think the file might be to big or something? I'm still adding each and every person and such just irritates me that it doesnt show up.


Fixed that for you. Maybe make the validation link column bigger in your spreadsheet?


----------



## fleetfeather

any thoughts on a delidded Panni? (pentium anniversary g3258)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Fixed that for you. Maybe make the validation link column bigger in your spreadsheet?


I think I will do that but not much of a reason to as you just click the sauce for it and it goes but I'll widen it







what was the issue with the listing in the code?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> any thoughts on a delidded Panni? (pentium anniversary g3258)


If someone does it by all means go for it!


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Fixed that for you. Maybe make the validation link column bigger in your spreadsheet?
> 
> 
> 
> I think I will do that but not much of a reason to as you just click the sauce for it and it goes but I'll widen it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> what was the issue with the listing in the code?
Click to expand...

I can't be sure.. what I did was copy one of my spreadsheet links and put your spreadsheet keycode into it, rather than play with the original. If you hit edit you'll see your old frames/link code still there above my paste and edit, still not displaying.


----------



## Cozmo85

Would Gelid extreme be fine between die and IHS. How much of a benefit is having clp?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> Would Gelid extreme be fine between die and IHS. How much of a benefit is having clp?


only 2c difference.


----------



## Cozmo85

Anyone else here use the vice only method? Does it seem as safe or safer than the hammer and wood?


----------



## Jeronbernal

I don't have a good mounting spot for a vice, and I've tried two brands of vices and failed each time, so I just use the no vice, two blocks of wood method. I am now 6/8 1 failed vice, 1 failed vice then razor


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> Would Gelid extreme be fine between die and IHS. How much of a benefit is having clp?


I just took the liquid metal plunge with CLU and would say your difference will probably range between 10-20C depending on core; CLU typically a few C better performance than CLP from what I have read.

I was using Xigmatek PTI-G4512 which I have found to be as good as or better than Gelid GC Extreme.

Delidded 4770k @ 4.4GHz 1.260V VRIN @ 1.800V

8GB Team Vulcan @ 2400MHz 1.680V

While using an Arctic i30 Extreme I saw temps drop 11-14-17-14

Whiles using my 'hybrid' H100 radiator with H55 pump, I saw even better temp drops of 16-18-19-16.

I was still using the Xigmatek paste on the outside of the IHS, but between the die/IHS is where most of the performance gains lie with CLP/CLU.



Spoiler: CLU















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> Anyone else here use the vice only method? Does it seem as safe or safer than the hammer and wood?


I chipped my 3770k PCB while improperly executing the hammer/wood method; the CPU still functions perfectly fine surprisingly enough.

The vice method does seem pretty fool proof IMO.

I have delidded 7 chips now using the razor method and am extremely comfortable doing so...will probably continue with this method since it is effortless to me at this point.



Spoiler: Damaged PCB


----------



## MrBlunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> I don't have a good mounting spot for a vice, and I've tried two brands of vices and failed each time, so I just use the no vice, two blocks of wood method. I am now 6/8 1 failed vice, 1 failed vice then razor


have you seen the viceless piece of wood way? i have to find the post.. but basically a few pieces of wood act like a vice. or atleast put pressure at hte right spots.


----------



## lilchronic

here's my delidded 4790k..... didn't do any befor and after for temps sorry my next one i'll do it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I can't be sure.. what I did was copy one of my spreadsheet links and put your spreadsheet keycode into it, rather than play with the original. If you hit edit you'll see your old frames/link code still there above my paste and edit, still not displaying.


Thanks again Mr Salt
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> here's my delidded 4790k..... didn't do any befor and after for temps sorry my next one i'll do it


Noice!


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> here's my delidded 4790k..... didn't do any befor and after for temps sorry my next one i'll do it


----------



## fateswarm

Look at that glue on the resistors. Blowing the IHS off may just take them with it.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Look at that glue on the resistors. Blowing the IHS off may just take them with it.


Dang indeed.
I cannot understand why Intel managed to screw it up once again!


----------



## fateswarm

The "dissolve the glue with chemistry" method must be pursued.


----------



## Swag

Dump the CPU in HCl, the glue will definitely be dissolved. I can't guarantee the other parts won't be dissolved though.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> Would Gelid extreme be fine between die and IHS. How much of a benefit is having clp?


I used Gelid between die and IHS. I wouldn't even bother with CLP or CLU, just my opinion. Gelid extreme works very well. Just a bb sized dot on the die and you're good to go.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Dump the CPU in HCl, the glue will definitely be dissolved. I can't guarantee the other parts won't be dissolved though.


Hm. But really. Will they?









Wait, what if q-tip

on sides.


----------



## Blaise170

Didn't do any research on Pentium 4, apparently Prescott was one of the series soldered to the die. Kinda broke my die a little bit.











Pentium 4 630 @ 3.0 GHz


----------



## Tmfs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blaise170*
> 
> Didn't do any research on Pentium 4, apparently Prescott was one of the series soldered to the die. Kinda broke my die a little bit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pentium 4 630 @ 3.0 GHz


Rip


----------



## Blaise170

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tmfs*
> 
> Rip


Ah well, they're only like $3 on eBay.









http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-Pentium-4-630-3-0-GHz-Desktop-Processor-PX911AV-/321442023693?pt=CPUs&hash=item4ad770090d


----------



## Swag

Using a Q-tip would be impossible.







And without knowing how much glue there actually is, theoretically we can't limit the amount of HCl we use and we can't accurately put it only on the glue.

Here's a video of what HCl does to metals:



Very strong stuff, we have HCl in our stomach which makes a part of our gastric acid. Imagine how much food you eat and how strong this stuff has to be to be able to break down all your food to tiny particles.


----------



## Blaise170

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Using a Q-tip would be impossible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And without knowing how much glue there actually is, theoretically we can't limit the amount of HCl we use and we can't accurately put it only on the glue.
> 
> Here's a video of what HCl does to metals:
> 
> 
> 
> Very strong stuff, we have HCl in our stomach which makes a part of our gastric acid. Imagine how much food you eat and how strong this stuff has to be to be able to break down all your food to tiny particles.


I sometimes forget that the US and UK pronounce aluminum differently.


----------



## fateswarm

HCl is out of the question. We must look deeper. Where are the chemical engineers when you need them?


----------



## Swag

I'm in Chemical Engineering (in university) right now and for the most part, I don't think we do that kind of thing. As far as I know (from my dad), all he does is find new ways/monitor the current ways of manufacturing products from already known chemicals. Such as hydrocarbons (fossil fuels), he monitors the production of petroleum-based products mainly gasoline but sometimes monitors beauty supplies. And sometimes, even checks out the site of the extraction to make sure everything is working fine.


----------



## fateswarm

Hm. A Chemist then.


----------



## Swag

Hmmmm, a mad chemist who can create a solution that can dissolve select materials?







The birth of the 'dipping' method.


----------



## fateswarm

OMG. That's like the perfect name.


----------



## Swag

Materials:
CPU
Dissolving solution
Ruler
Beaker large enough to hold CPU around 8 inches deep
Floss

Step 1:
Fill beaker with solution about 4 inches high

Step 2:
Tie a cross around the CPU with the floss to secure it and have a lead of about 5 inches

Step 3:
Tie the end of the floss to the ruler

Step 4:
Hang the CPU in the beaker with the ruler holding the CPU in suspension.

Step 5:
Wait for solution to work and IHS falls off

Step 6:
Let solution dissolve remaining glue

Step 7:
Completely dry CPU and enjoy the delid!

Was this too much for a non-existent method?


----------



## Blaise170

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Materials:
> CPU
> Dissolving solution
> Ruler
> Beaker large enough to hold CPU around 8 inches deep
> Floss
> 
> Step 1:
> Fill beaker with solution about 4 inches high
> 
> Step 2:
> Tie a cross around the CPU with the floss to secure it and have a lead of about 5 inches
> 
> Step 3:
> Tie the end of the floss to the ruler
> 
> Step 4:
> Hang the CPU in the beaker with the ruler holding the CPU in suspension.
> 
> Step 5:
> Wait for solution to work and IHS falls off
> 
> Step 6:
> Let solution dissolve remaining glue
> 
> Step 7:
> Completely dry CPU and enjoy the delid!
> 
> Was this too much for a non-existent method?


Haha I believe it was, but a good read either way.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blaise170*
> 
> I sometimes forget that the US and UK pronounce aluminum differently.


Charles Hall, the American who patented the separation of aluminium from its ore, spelled it wrong in his marketing literature. (Although, in the patents themselves, it's spelled correctly.)


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blaise170*
> 
> Didn't do any research on Pentium 4, apparently Prescott was one of the series soldered to the die. Kinda broke my die a little bit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pentium 4 630 @ 3.0 GHz


It should work just fine. Go ahead and put that back in the puter man! You're good to go!


----------



## ChaosAD

Today i decided to delid my 4770k. Its not my first time, i have also delided my previous 3770k with success. Once again i used the razor method and once again i had a little blood on my finger









Before:



After:



I used Phobya Liquid Metal on die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme on IHS.

Temps dropped ~18-15-15-11 while running WCG (Folding) at 4.5Ghz, 1.2vcore, 1.85vrin, 2666 11-13-13-30 1T, 1.7vdimm
I was expecting +20c drop on temps tbh but anyway! The difference between the coldest and hottest core dropped from 11C to 5C though.

Ambient 27C


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Today i decided to delid my 4770k. Its not my first time, i have also delided my previous 3770k with success. Once again i used the razor method and once again i had a little blood on my finger
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used Phobya Liquid Metal on die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme on IHS.
> 
> Temps dropped ~18-15-15-11 while running WCG (Folding) at 4.5Ghz, 1.2vcore, 1.85vrin, 2666 11-13-13-30 1T, 1.7vdimm
> I was expecting +20c drop on temps tbh but anyway! The difference between the coldest and hottest core dropped from 11C to 5C though.
> 
> Ambient 27C
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Temperature drop might be better when using heavier stress tests.
4.5Ghz @ 1.2V Folding stable is very nice!
What batch number?


----------



## sweenytodd

Looks good. I will delid mine this week when CLP arrives. I think you must look at average cpus, 4.5GHz @ 1.3V like mine to see a 20C+ drop


----------



## fateswarm

Do you actually have to cut near the glue on the resistors? Or can it be forced off if other 3 corners are free?


----------



## Swag

Once you cut most of it off, you just wiggle it off.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Do you actually have to cut near the glue on the resistors? Or can it be forced off if other 3 corners are free?


I only used that blade to barely open the corner on that side. With the other side free already it will pry off.


----------



## Blaise170

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> It should work just fine. Go ahead and put that back in the puter man! You're good to go!


The die is still attached to the IHS, so kinda a problem there.


----------



## battleaxe

It was a joke man.


----------



## Blaise170

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> It was a joke man.


Just playing along.


----------



## fateswarm

Question. Is a used-up CPU easier to delid? I recall my brand new 4790K's glue looked shiny against a strong light, I wonder if it's burned up now.


----------



## ChaosAD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Temperature drop might be better when using heavier stress tests.
> 4.5Ghz @ 1.2V Folding stable is very nice!
> What batch number?


24/7 WCG is the heaviest workload on my pc, so thats what im interested in actually!
Batch Number is L310B487 and btw i am testing 4.6Ghz @ 1.25v for folding atm, max temp 63-60-60-59 with 27C ambient.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Question. Is a used-up CPU easier to delid? I recall my brand new 4790K's glue looked shiny against a strong light, I wonder if it's burned up now.


i kinda think i would be harder because the chip has been heated up and the IHS squashed on the pcb from the pressure of a heatsink or waterblock, harder to get razor to slide in..... i dont know just my









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Thanks again Mr Salt
> Noice!


thanks .... friday my 2nd one should be here, will definitely do my submission to join the club since the chart is working now









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*


lolz


----------



## max883

i7 4790K Batch L418c133









Delided With CLU ! 4.8GHz 1.3v Max temp in Prime 95 Large FFP 64c !!!!!!!!!









Before delid Temp was 87c !!!


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *max883*
> 
> i7 4790K Batch L418c133
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delided With CLU ! 4.8GHz 1.3v Max temp in Prime 95 Large FFP 64c !!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before delid Temp was 87c !!!


How about temps on small?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> liquid metals do have some negatives though. I was going to replace my clp with more clp after 6 months but I did not like that clean up. I had to basically lap the under side of my ihs to get it off and where it was eating into the ihs left a few tiny marks on the die.
> 
> So I went back with gelid under the die. I feel comfortable about leaving it for the life of the build and I only sacrificed 2c.


I have had this issue with CLU aswel, thats why I just ditched it and went Direct die with MX4 and now im using gelid.


----------



## Gunderman456

I'm already a member of this club, having delidded my own 4770k.

My brother came to visit over the weekend and asked me to delid his 3570k.

I whipped out the 2 same 2x4s that I used previously on my 4770k.

I took my time in placing the chip correctly - this is the key to the whole process. As in pic below; PCB edge against the wooden block and the lipped side of the IHS against the edge of the other wooden block.

I stopped after 2 to 3 moderate whacks against the exposed face of the wooden block to see if I could move the IHS. If not repeat.

It took me about 8 to 10 whacks. Upon inspection, I noticed that the IHS was loose on one side, so all I had to do then was peel it off!

Here she is exposed.

I used some rubbing alcohol to remove the thermal paste with aid of a Q-tip.

Here it is free of the poor Intel thermal paste.

I then used a plastic card to remove the glue from both the underside of the IHS and the PCB.

Here it is now both free of thermal paste and glue.

Here is the collection of waste garnered from the procedure.

I placed a small drop of CLU on a clean surface.

I then applied a thin layer of CLU on both the CPU die and the underside of the IHS where the die makes contact.

I placed the PCB in the MOBO socket, placed and held the IHS as I clamped it in place; making sure the IHS lips were correctly aligned before clamping it down.


Success!


----------



## MadHatter5045

This thread has been a good read! My new Block and other watercooling gear gets here Wednesday and that's when I'm planning to delid my 4770K, so questions:

1. Did anyone ever figure out what made the dies crack on the first two reported dead 4770Ks?

2. Is the hammer method still valid (as that's what I'm planning to do)?

3. Are there any new developments with delidding and Haswell that I should be aware of?

Thank you everybody in advance!


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MadHatter5045*
> 
> 3. Are there any new developments with delidding and Haswell that I should be aware of?


There will be if we find a Chemist that can dissolve the glue without hurting the rest.


----------



## fateswarm

Will this little beast be sufficient?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Will this little beast be sufficient?


yup. The wood selection seems to cause the most problems in that method. You need a very hard wood. If it splits into splinters it can also split the pcb or knock off a resistor.

The vice look plenty strong enough. I have been following this thread 7 months and the vice not holding has never been the issue. The wood busting however is rather common in the failed reports.


----------



## fateswarm

I'm thinking of vice + hair dryer only. Look at this.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm thinking of vice + hair dryer only. Look at this.


vice only method. I like it.

But a quick question for you. isnt your 4790k at 4.6ghz 1.25volts ( or less volts) ? I mean you do not seem to want to pump more voltage into to. So why delid ? Are temps still a problem at 1.25 volts ?

I know that doesnt get asked in this thread. I just see no need in the risk unless you do not like your temps or plan to increase voltage.


----------



## fateswarm

Yes. It does seem unlikely to be of any realistic benefit in performance, provided the voltages remain at very safe levels.

It may bring down fan noise though.


----------



## fateswarm

Daaaaam, I put way more force than I'm comfortable with. The IHS was pretty hot too with the dryer. I'm lucky it's alive to be honest.

I'm not trying this again unless I figure out a very safe method (like a liquid dissolving the glue).

With the force I had put if it flew off, it would most probably die.


----------



## Cozmo85

I think im comfortable now with the vice only method. Need to order another tube of gelid.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I'm thinking of vice + hair dryer only. Look at this.


That looks more like a heat gun then a hair dryer, a heat gun gets way hotter.


----------



## Valgaur

Don't use a heatgun like I've said before they get far to hot as to the point you can damage the cpus silicon. The IHS's aren't that easy to remove either they are tough little buggers some good amount of force is needed.


----------



## fateswarm

They are. The pcb isn't. Or the resistors.


----------



## fleetfeather

i hope there never becomes an "Easy way" to delid. The riskiness of it is what makes it such an enthusiast thing to do haha...

materials you should always need for delidding (imo):

- vice or razor
- big pair of balls


----------



## Cozmo85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> i hope there never becomes an "Easy way" to delid. The riskiness of it is what makes it such an enthusiast thing to do haha...
> 
> materials you should always need for delidding (imo):
> 
> - vice or razor
> - big pair of balls


Can it get easier?


----------



## fleetfeather

oh, well that's a bit sad then... you should at least have to run the gauntlet with the hammer and wood block.


----------



## theplagueza

Hey guys,after recently hearing about delidding,i was a bit bored to day,now im now an overclocker or even have a k series chip,i was just curious and wanted to give it a bash(excuse the pun),i first had a spark core 2 due chip i decided to practice on.well i plased the chip in my vice at work,i tried a piece or wood,but what i had was only a small soft piece and every time i knocked it the chip would push into the soft wood,so besides be was a piece or metal plate about 200x100x5mm thick,i used that,gave it a soft tap to get a feel for it,gave a few medium to hardish hits(3) then the chip loosened with out even flying off,and i was like "wow" this was really easy.now i wanted to try it on my i7 3770 (non k)which i picck up a few weeks back for 1000 rands(about $95) ,still being a lil paranoid i went down to my local electronics store and picked up a antistatic wrist band to use.doing the above procedure,it came loose very nicely,cleaned it up applied some xigmatek PTI-G3606 (thats all i have at the moment,i have some arctic silver 5 coming in the post,but will try that and then perhaps order come CLPro,(depending on the results)which they have on our online stores.

well running prime95 and realtemp my results after 35 mins

current reading: 46 53 55 49
and max temp was: 49 56 57 53

before i delidded my max temp was 60 on core 3

my specs

i7 3770
msi h77 mobo
thermaltake h21 case
deepcool frostwin v2 cooler
gigabyte 7950
120gb Trancend 340 ssd
1tb seagate hdd
2 120mm intake pans
1 rear ex fan
corsair TX650 psu
8gb Kingston Hyperblue ram(4x2)

will post more results when i get the arctic silver 4


----------



## Cozmo85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theplagueza*
> 
> Hey guys,after recently hearing about delidding,i was a bit bored to day,now im now an overclocker or even have a k series chip,i was just curious and wanted to give it a bash(excuse the pun),i first had a spark core 2 due chip i decided to practice on.well i plased the chip in my vice at work,i tried a piece or wood,but what i had was only a small soft piece and every time i knocked it the chip would push into the soft wood,so besides be was a piece or metal plate about 200x100x5mm thick,i used that,gave it a soft tap to get a feel for it,gave a few medium to hardish hits(3) then the chip loosened with out even flying off,and i was like "wow" this was really easy.now i wanted to try it on my i7 3770 (non k)which i picck up a few weeks back for 1000 rands(about $95) ,still being a lil paranoid i went down to my local electronics store and picked up a antistatic wrist band to use.doing the above procedure,it came loose very nicely,cleaned it up applied some xigmatek PTI-G3606 (thats all i have at the moment,i have some arctic silver 5 coming in the post,but will try that and then perhaps order come CLPro,(depending on the results)which they have on our online stores.
> 
> well running prime95 and realtemp my results after 35 mins
> 
> current reading: 46 53 55 49
> and max temp was: 49 56 57 53
> 
> before i delidded my max temp was 60 on core 3
> 
> my specs
> 
> i7 3770
> msi h77 mobo
> thermaltake h21 case
> deepcool frostwin v2 cooler
> gigabyte 7950
> 120gb Trancend 340 ssd
> 1tb seagate hdd
> 2 120mm intake pans
> 1 rear ex fan
> corsair TX650 psu
> 8gb Kingston Hyperblue ram(4x2)
> 
> will post more results when i get the arctic silver 4


Are you running with no IHS? balls son


----------



## theplagueza

lol no haha ,i put it back just never took a picture,as i was in a bit of a rush to leave for somewhere(excuse my bad camera also)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> i hope there never becomes an "Easy way" to delid. The riskiness of it is what makes it such an enthusiast thing to do haha...
> 
> materials you should always need for delidding (imo):
> 
> - vice or razor
> - big pair of balls


exactly you never know what is being done to the pcb with a vice in my mind but with a blade you have tactile feedback
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theplagueza*
> 
> Hey guys,after recently hearing about delidding,i was a bit bored to day,now im now an overclocker or even have a k series chip,i was just curious and wanted to give it a bash(excuse the pun),i first had a spark core 2 due chip i decided to practice on.well i plased the chip in my vice at work,i tried a piece or wood,but what i had was only a small soft piece and every time i knocked it the chip would push into the soft wood,so besides be was a piece or metal plate about 200x100x5mm thick,i used that,gave it a soft tap to get a feel for it,gave a few medium to hardish hits(3) then the chip loosened with out even flying off,and i was like "wow" this was really easy.now i wanted to try it on my i7 3770 (non k)which i picck up a few weeks back for 1000 rands(about $95) ,still being a lil paranoid i went down to my local electronics store and picked up a antistatic wrist band to use.doing the above procedure,it came loose very nicely,cleaned it up applied some xigmatek PTI-G3606 (thats all i have at the moment,i have some arctic silver 5 coming in the post,but will try that and then perhaps order come CLPro,(depending on the results)which they have on our online stores.
> 
> well running prime95 and realtemp my results after 35 mins
> 
> current reading: 46 53 55 49
> and max temp was: 49 56 57 53
> 
> before i delidded my max temp was 60 on core 3
> 
> my specs
> 
> i7 3770
> msi h77 mobo
> thermaltake h21 case
> deepcool frostwin v2 cooler
> gigabyte 7950
> 120gb Trancend 340 ssd
> 1tb seagate hdd
> 2 120mm intake pans
> 1 rear ex fan
> corsair TX650 psu
> 8gb Kingston Hyperblue ram(4x2)
> 
> will post more results when i get the arctic silver 4


very nice!


----------



## theplagueza

@Valgaur thanks alot


----------



## Quantum Reality

With all you guys delidding it seems to me like Intel came up with a way to make y'all void your warranties by the truckload


----------



## MadHatter5045

Warranties? Where we're going we don't need warranties


----------



## Cozmo85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quantum Reality*
> 
> With all you guys delidding it seems to me like Intel came up with a way to make y'all void your warranties by the truckload


I know its joking but you can re silicon the ihs pretty easily.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> i hope there never becomes an "Easy way" to delid. The riskiness of it is what makes it such an enthusiast


Nah, that's just common teenage narcissism.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Quantum Reality*
> 
> With all you guys delidding it seems to me like Intel came up with a way to make y'all void your warranties by the truckload


If you read the front page it does not void your warranty.


----------



## Cozmo85

When you apply your paste to the die do you put any on the bottom of the IHS or just leave it clean (not using liquid ultra or pro)

edit: redid thrmal paste on die and IHS. 14c drop now. Nice.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> When you apply your paste to the die do you put any on the bottom of the IHS or just leave it clean (not using liquid ultra or pro)


If you are using one of the liquid metals most people kind of "tint" the underside of the IHS, but with normal paste I would just leave it alone.


----------



## Cozmo85

Yea, thats what i did when i redid the paste. Made a simple line, pressed ihs down, made a line on top of IHS and pressed water block down. Working much better. Using gelid extreme.


----------



## tp4tissue

Hi xperts..

Do ya'll know if the new G3258 is safe to delid.. and what the circuits underneath looks like ?


----------



## Blaise170

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> Hi xperts..
> 
> Do ya'll know if the new G3258 is safe to delid.. and what the circuits underneath looks like ?


After a little googling it seems to be, but don't take my word for it.


----------



## fateswarm

There's a report in the DC club that unlike 4770K, 4790K may not be able to take vice only and may need heating and blade. I may be with one of those batches since even with hair dryer and tons of vice force it wouldn't badge. I wonder if anyone else with experience in both 4770 and DC has seen this.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blaise170*
> 
> After a little googling it seems to be, but don't take my word for it.


Hi blaise, txx for the report

could you linky a ref plzz ..


----------



## Blaise170

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> Hi blaise, txx for the report
> 
> could you linky a ref plzz ..


From anandtech.
Quote:


> With this in mind, users looking to delid their CPUs might see a material the same color as the normal Haswell CPUs, but Intel is stating that this is a new material.


Source


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Blaise170*
> 
> From anandtech.
> Source


awesome.. I am hopeful..

Here's the issue... do you guys think the die might be TOO SMALL after the delid for effective cooling using a very roughly milled direct heat pipe cooler?


----------



## Lolkrayd

Hey all,

I recently delidded my 4770k and currently in the process of ordering the liquid ultra.
Currently using Freezing point G4718 for the time being.

I found something a bit odd, that only one core seem to have dropped in temp.
Using aida64 fpu test and my chip overclocked to 4.2 @ 1.175v
my temps range from
80-84 for core 1 and 2 (same temp as before delidding)
75-80 for core 3 (minor improvement)
but core 4 will be in the 70s and below (significant improvement)

I thought it was just me making a mistake, so I redid it several times.
Made sure my h100i was making contact correctly as well.

Why did only 1 core make such a significant improvement? Did I somehow damage it during the installation process?


----------



## Anth Seebel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lolkrayd*
> 
> Hey all,
> 
> I recently delidded my 4770k and currently in the process of ordering the liquid ultra.
> Currently using Freezing point G4718 for the time being.
> 
> I found something a bit odd, that only one core seem to have dropped in temp.
> Using aida64 fpu test and my chip overclocked to 4.2 @ 1.175v
> my temps range from
> 80-84 for core 1 and 2 (same temp as before delidding)
> 75-80 for core 3 (minor improvement)
> but core 4 will be in the 70s and below (significant improvement)
> 
> I thought it was just me making a mistake, so I redid it several times.
> Made sure my h100i was making contact correctly as well.
> 
> Why did only 1 core make such a significant improvement? Did I somehow damage it during the installation process?


Once you remove all the glue and have the IHS flat on the die that is the optimal outcome (IHS should be able to spin freely on the die). There will also be core-temp variance due to each core needing different voltage (you can check this in HWINFO64). CLP/CLU will also help.


----------



## sweenytodd

Failed to delid my 4670k, wood is soft.















Will have to get a vise soon


----------



## Jeronbernal

Tiger Wood is a good option, I didn't have tiger Wood the first few times, I used red cedar, and it works just as well in my opinion. If you decide to use a vice make sure you have something to help you catch the cpu incase it goes flying, also make sure to bolt down that vice really really good.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Tiger Wood is a good option, I didn't have tiger Wood the first few times, I used red cedar, and it works just as well in my opinion. If you decide to use a vice make sure you have something to help you catch the cpu incase it goes flying, also make sure to bolt down that vice really really good.


what's wrong with Pine ?


----------



## Jeronbernal

not really sure the density of pine... but here. this might help pick a wood that doesn't chip.

wood that chips can cause the delid to fail.

WOOD SPECIES (Hardest to Softest Chart)
(courtesy of skyn3t)

i've used softer woods in the past, and either the chip's PCB gets pounded in between a layer of wood, or the wood chips, and the cpu just pops out of place between the two blocks, causing you to have to start all over again.

harder woods stay solid, which in turn brings less variables that can go wrong.


----------



## fateswarm

Interestingly, I've noticed a kitchen cutting board I have around has very strong wood. With flat edges as well. Though I probably don't attempt this again soon.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> what's wrong with Pine ?


I delidded two with a piece of 2x4, so I'd say nothing is wrong with pine.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> what's wrong with Pine ?


Depends which pine. Some species of pine are soft.. like pinus radiata..if it dents too easily with a hammer blow, maybe too soft..


----------



## fateswarm

You have to see this.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brpc*
> 
> Hi, first post here.
> 
> Got my i7-4790k on 6/26, batch L418C169 with 1.056vid... was having horrible temps with NT-H1 and an H100, like 100C+ @ 1.27v horrible. Paste application was not a problem, re-applied multiple times to no avail.
> 
> Decided to delid because I felt like I had no other choice if I wanted to get past 4.6, which runs fine at 1.260v - even with this I was getting high 80s - mid 90s under normal stress test (IBT "High")
> 
> Anyway, this is what I found when I delided; I was utterly shocked (yet not surprised, given my temps):
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, that's a massive air bubble. On the stock die-IHS TIM.
> 
> More pics here:
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/6wmOX
> 
> 
> Since delidding and switching to Gelid GC (03) Extreme, I can pump it up to 1.32v (farthest I've gone so far) and it only hits mid 90s. Still tweaking, but pretty much have 4.7 stable. I wanted 4.8 but I think that's my chip's limit. Not comfortable running mid 1.3's but I'll see what I can do by increasing CPU Cache voltage.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> You have to see this.


Look how much epoxy they used. That is what causes the problems more than the tim.

There are temperature improvements even if you use the stock tim and just clean off all the glue.

Fateswarm, the way you describe your ihs being very tight against the pcb is the way it should be. Your cpu prolly has way less epoxy than this image.


----------



## brpc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Look how much epoxy they used. That is what causes the problems more than the tim.
> 
> There are temperature improvements even if you use the stock tim and just clean off all the glue.
> 
> Fateswarm, the way you describe your ihs being very tight against the pcb is the way it should be. Your cpu prolly has way less epoxy than this image.


Yeah I think my chip is an outlier in terms of application, but then again, maybe not. Either way, too much epoxy or just right, there should not have been a huge air bubble in the TIM.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brpc*
> 
> Yeah I think my chip is an outlier in terms of application, but then again, maybe not. Either way, too much epoxy or just right, there should not have been a huge air bubble in the TIM.


you are correct. I bet there are smaller less visible bubbles in a lot of them.


----------



## fateswarm

It is done



Tested to work. It's only tested though because it's on a noctua tim badly applied for now. I have to research how to remove the adhesive safely









Vice-only + Hairdryer method + I put some tape around the middle of the chip (with some paper under it to not mess the grid with glue) to alleviate me from the fear of it flying off on a brick wall.

It popped off after I put up some strong hair drying + some extra force. I believe it's the best method because the grip of the vice is very good, not as perfect as the vice + wood method but the tape helps + you avoid the instability of having to use wood.

Thing that surprised me: It was done with a "boop" sound.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> It is done
> 
> 
> 
> Tested to work. It's only tested though because it's on a noctua tim badly applied for now. I have to research how to remove the adhesive safely
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vice-only + Hairdryer method + I put some tape around the middle of the chip (with some paper under it to not mess the grid with glue) to alleviate me from the fear of it flying off on a brick wall.
> 
> It popped off after I put up some strong hair drying + some extra force. I believe it's the best method because the grip of the vice is very good, not as perfect as the vice + wood method but the tape helps + you avoid the instability of having to use wood.
> 
> Thing that surprised me: It was done with a "boop" sound.


Use the edge of a credit card and just scrape the adhesive off.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Ive had my i7 4770k delidded for about 2-3 months now but im a bit puzzled by my temps. When i first delidded and did my stressing to check temps on a custom loop, they were, decent, with 4.4 GHz @1.24V sitting around 65-70C, but after a month or so, if i attempted to stress CPU temps were easily in the 85-90+C range under those same tests. So i pulled it back out re-applied the paste, to get better temps, but i notice that they're beginning to creep back up again when gaming.

Should I try adding more Gelid paste to the die when reapplying? Or is it possibly another issue at hand?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Use the edge of a credit card and just scrape the adhesive off.


I did! It went well. Then I had a monumental accident, right when I was putting it in, I bent at least 3 pins of the LGA and it wouldn't even try to boot.

Out of some weird act of gods, I managed to fix it by fiddling with it with a pin of a multimeter under a strong light.

It appears I get at least 10C less on this air cooling and OC settings. It's probably fine since it was already ok.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Ive had my i7 4770k delidded for about 2-3 months now but im a bit puzzled by my temps. When i first delidded and did my stressing to check temps on a custom loop, they were, decent, with 4.4 GHz @1.24V sitting around 65-70C, but after a month or so, if i attempted to stress CPU temps were easily in the 85-90+C range under those same tests. So i pulled it back out re-applied the paste, to get better temps, but i notice that they're beginning to creep back up again when gaming.
> 
> Should I try adding more Gelid paste to the die when reapplying? Or is it possibly another issue at hand?


If its not to much trouble to I would suggest taking your CPU out again one more time completely cleaning the die and taking a picture of how much paste you use on it. I will be on here all day and can reply quickly as well as many people in the club. We can figure this out for you


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

I'm too busy to take my system apart at the moment, but I've been using a roughly pea-sized ball of paste then using a plastic card to smooth it out across the whole die since i don't know if spillage towards the VRM could cause trouble. Especially since i believe that i might have nicked 2 of them off the die. Though, i've seen people use clear nail polish to cover them for just-in-case purposes.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I'm too busy to take my system apart at the moment, but I've been using a roughly pea-sized ball of paste then using a plastic card to smooth it out across the whole die since i don't know if spillage towards the VRM could cause trouble. Especially since i believe that i might have nicked 2 of them off the die. Though, i've seen people use clear nail polish to cover them for just-in-case purposes.


nail polish works great to cover those little guys. But the pea size is pretty common and then spread it out vertically along the die but leave it a bit balled up not spread out as the pressure of the latch and heatsink will spread it well. then have you removed the glue from the PCB?


----------



## Cozmo85

With gelid extreme I just did a thin line down the die and it worked perfectly. let the IHS spread it.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nail polish works great to cover those little guys. But the pea size is pretty common and then spread it out vertically along the die but leave it a bit balled up not spread out as the pressure of the latch and heat sink will spread it well. then have you removed the glue from the PCB?


Ok cool. I guess i'll have to pick up some of that soon then and re apply once it dries.
I haven't bothered to remove the glue since i'm using EK's "Naked Ivy" kit for their Supremacy.

If it fails again, i might try the CLU route and be sure to clean the glue off the pcb.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Ok cool. I guess i'll have to pick up some of that soon then and re apply once it dries.
> I haven't bothered to remove the glue since i'm using EK's "Naked Ivy" kit for their Supremacy.
> 
> If it fails again, i might try the CLU route and be sure to clean the glue off the pcb.


with the naked route you need to mount that sucker very flat. As in set it down with the screw mounts aligned and hold it down until you get the nuts finger tight then go criss cross in order to tighten a bit more.


----------



## theplagueza

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theplagueza*
> 
> Hey guys,after recently hearing about delidding,i was a bit bored to day,now im now an overclocker or even have a k series chip,i was just curious and wanted to give it a bash(excuse the pun),i first had a spark core 2 due chip i decided to practice on.well i plased the chip in my vice at work,i tried a piece or wood,but what i had was only a small soft piece and every time i knocked it the chip would push into the soft wood,so besides be was a piece or metal plate about 200x100x5mm thick,i used that,gave it a soft tap to get a feel for it,gave a few medium to hardish hits(3) then the chip loosened with out even flying off,and i was like "wow" this was really easy.now i wanted to try it on my i7 3770 (non k)which i picck up a few weeks back for 1000 rands(about $95) ,still being a lil paranoid i went down to my local electronics store and picked up a antistatic wrist band to use.doing the above procedure,it came loose very nicely,cleaned it up applied some xigmatek PTI-G3606 (thats all i have at the moment,i have some arctic silver 5 coming in the post,but will try that and then perhaps order come CLPro,(depending on the results)which they have on our online stores.
> 
> well running prime95 and realtemp my results after 35 mins
> 
> current reading: 46 53 55 49
> and max temp was: 49 56 57 53
> 
> before i delidded my max temp was 60 on core 3
> 
> my specs
> 
> i7 3770
> msi h77 mobo
> thermaltake h21 case
> deepcool frostwin v2 cooler
> gigabyte 7950
> 120gb Trancend 340 ssd
> 1tb seagate hdd
> 2 120mm intake pans
> 1 rear ex fan
> corsair TX650 psu
> 8gb Kingston Hyperblue ram(4x2)
> 
> will post more results when i get the arctic silver 4


So my AC5 came to day temps are much better,applies a small line of AC5 to the delidded chip and applied a line to the cpu cooler,temps are much better after 30 mins of prime =)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theplagueza*
> 
> So my AC5 came to day temps are much better,applies a small line of AC5 to the delidded chip and applied a line to the cpu cooler,temps are much better after 30 mins of prime =)


have any better paste than that? you could drop even more with some better stuff


----------



## theplagueza

Well it seems like I'm kind of getting very addicted/obbsessed with trying to get my cpu temps as low as possible. . . And I'm not even overclocking!perhaps all this will make me invest in a k series chip and better board.but moving on.no that's the only paste I have.plus there is not a very large varaity here(south africa) well that I know of,bases one the options you have to choose on overseas sites,our online store has clpro,I can order but won't be able to apply it to my cooler tho as its alu.but can get ity for the internal heat sink on the chip?was also looking at the indigo ex on the international sites but did not really find a lot of reviews and its a bit pricey if I don't apply it right(price + shipping) then will prob have to order 2 kits to be on the safe side,what do you recomend?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> with the naked route you need to mount that sucker very flat. As in set it down with the screw mounts aligned and hold it down until you get the nuts finger tight then go criss cross in order to tighten a bit more.


That's actually what I did when re-mounting it. I think it just might be bubbles that formed when trying to smoothen out the paste.


----------



## fateswarm

Are women the most pro delidders? I've already considered using nail polish and a mascara paint brush for spreading. And it's not even my final form yet.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Are women the most pro delidders? I've already considered using nail polish and a mascara paint brush for spreading. And it's not even my final form yet.


Apparently in Corea, cosmetics for men is a fast booming industry...


----------



## Jeronbernal

Supposedly so is plastic surgery and donut implants lol


----------



## Wirerat

Slightly of topic but related. Does intel require the original receipt when using a tuning plan RMA or standard rma ?


----------



## fateswarm

PS. Add this to the vault of knowledge:*provitamin* nail polish works without shorting them. Yeah.. the mini market didn't have clear polish







but I doubt it wouldn't be "provitamin"







.

Hrm. Interesting. After my first clumsy attempt to apply pastes, I went back and did a careful reapplication of CLP on the die (after I somewhat insulated the resistors) and also tried for a "mirror"-like application on the back cover of the ihs.

I then also applied CLP on the top of IHS for the cooler. The thing is I noticed the temps are now better, but there is a slight variation on the 'middle' two cores (core1,2).

I suspect I can't do much about it, since the application wasn't that bad and it's possible it's related to the cooler since the designer reports it is slightly curved.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> PS. Add this to the vault of knowledge:*provitamin* nail polish works without shorting them. Yeah.. the mini market didn't have clear polish
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but I doubt it wouldn't be "provitamin"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Hrm. Interesting. After my first clumsy attempt to apply pastes, I went back and did a careful reapplication of CLP on the die (after I somewhat insulated the resistors) and also tried for a "mirror"-like application on the back cover of the ihs.
> 
> I then also applied CLP on the top of IHS for the cooler. The thing is I noticed the temps are now better, but there is a slight variation on the 'middle' two cores (core1,2).
> 
> I suspect I can't do much about it, since the application wasn't that bad and it's possible it's related to the cooler since the designer reports it is slightly curved.


cllp on top of IHS will destroy the writing on your cpu. you cannot rma after that happens. just a heads up.


----------



## GHADthc

Just ordered a G3258 to play with!, has anybody delidded one yet?...mite be interesting to see what I can get out of it.


----------



## fateswarm

Yeah, I know the ramifications, the possible ramifications. After the beating it got after the delid, I considered it not a good candidate for warranty returns anyway.

I would probably never kill it with voltage but with blunt force.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GHADthc*
> 
> Just ordered a G3258 to play with!, has anybody delidded one yet?...mite be interesting to see what I can get out of it.


Yes, there is a thread around the forum very recently if you look around. The die looks shorter as expected.


----------



## GHADthc

Ah I see, I will have a hunt around, I'm excited to see what I can get one to hit, mite dellid it and give it some clu, its a shame I don't have a waterloop running atm, I would direct die mount a block to it, and really give it a crank!


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Weber*
> 
> here is a g3258 delid pic


----------



## GHADthc

Thanks! Seems that certain heatsinks may not make full contact with the die if I were to try and mount them directly, though a waterblock wouldn't be a problem.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> Supposedly so is plastic surgery and donut implants lol


the donut thing isn't an implant.. it's a saline injection, and you just put ur finger in the middle of your forhead to make the donut hole.. it's a temporary thing, goes away after a while..

It's like a "fun" thing to do over there... i don't get it either.. but whateves.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Lol, I could only imagine doing that would give you some type of stretch mark on your head over time or saggy skin @[email protected]

Extreme modding


----------



## Cozmo85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> PS. Add this to the vault of knowledge:*provitamin* nail polish works without shorting them. Yeah.. the mini market didn't have clear polish
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but I doubt it wouldn't be "provitamin"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Hrm. Interesting. After my first clumsy attempt to apply pastes, I went back and did a careful reapplication of CLP on the die (after I somewhat insulated the resistors) and also tried for a "mirror"-like application on the back cover of the ihs.
> 
> I then also applied CLP on the top of IHS for the cooler. The thing is I noticed the temps are now better, but there is a slight variation on the 'middle' two cores (core1,2).
> 
> I suspect I can't do much about it, since the application wasn't that bad and it's possible it's related to the cooler since the designer reports it is slightly curved.


The middle cores will usually be hottest because they are sandwiched between the other two cores.


----------



## fateswarm

I wonder why CLP looks like graphite out of a pencil when trying to clean it or once spread out a lot.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> The middle cores will usually be hottest because they are sandwiched between the other two cores.


Thanks! Though Now I wonder how the cores are enumerated on the sensors according to the topology.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I wonder why CLP looks like graphite out of a pencil when trying to clean it or once spread out a lot.


when it dry's up it does.............bought a tube of CLU and it was all dried up. i told them about when i put another order in and they sent me 2 extra tube's


----------



## fateswarm

I suspect the secret of a good application of CLP is at the *back* of the IHS rather than on the "glass" of the silicon die. This is because the nature of the die appears to make it harder to make a good "mirror-like" surface, and it's already relatively glassy anyway. The IHS on the other hand is relatively rough and it would benefit much more from a "mirror-like" application of CLP.

That might also mean it might be important if your cooler is not very "mirror-like", to benefit a lot from CLP, if you use CLP on the cooler-side too.


----------



## Kioto

4790k delidded...



Temps did not change. I was sitting at around 90-96 in Prime small FFT's, after delid, I sit in the same temps. I am Prime stable though.

Currently my 4790k is OC'd to 4.7Ghz @ 1.25V, nothing else changed (everything else auto).
Mem is OC'd from 2133Mhz to 2400 Mhz from 1.5V to 1.65V.

I'm running a custom water loop, I was expecting lower temps. I'm using IC Diamond as both TIMs.


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kioto*
> 
> 4790k delidded...
> 
> 
> 
> Temps did not change. I was sitting at around 90-96 in Prime small FFT's, after delid, I sit in the same temps. I am Prime stable though.
> 
> Currently my 4790k is OC'd to 4.7Ghz @ 1.25V, nothing else changed (everything else auto).
> Mem is OC'd from 2133Mhz to 2400 Mhz from 1.5V to 1.65V.
> 
> I'm running a custom water loop, I was expecting lower temps.


TIM used between die and IHS?


----------



## Kioto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> TIM used between die and IHS?


IC Diamond.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Slightly of topic but related. Does intel require the original receipt when using a tuning plan RMA or standard rma ?


I believe if yhou purchase the plan and it dies you call them and tell them the insurance number of the plan.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GHADthc*
> 
> Just ordered a G3258 to play with!, has anybody delidded one yet?...mite be interesting to see what I can get out of it.


Yes I've seen 2 of them
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ChaosAD*
> 
> Today i decided to delid my 4770k. Its not my first time, i have also delided my previous 3770k with success. Once again i used the razor method and once again i had a little blood on my finger
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> 
> I used Phobya Liquid Metal on die and Phobya HeGrease Extreme on IHS.
> 
> Temps dropped ~18-15-15-11 while running WCG (Folding) at 4.5Ghz, 1.2vcore, 1.85vrin, 2666 11-13-13-30 1T, 1.7vdimm
> I was expecting +20c drop on temps tbh but anyway! The difference between the coldest and hottest core dropped from 11C to 5C though.
> 
> Ambient 27C


NOICE alrughty you need to fill out the necessary info from the OP and I will add you


----------



## tp4tissue

Via Vice.. wood=pine


----------



## tw33k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kioto*
> 
> IC Diamond.


The big drops in temp come from using a liquid metal between the die and IHS. Also, IC Diamond is not a good idea because the tiny particles can scratch the die.


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> The big drops in temp come from using a liquid metal between the die and IHS. Also, IC Diamond is not a good idea because the tiny particles can scratch the die.


is IC diamond even real diamond.. i've always wondered if they just ground up some pencil lead and said.. Here you go.. MICRO diamonds..


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tw33k*
> 
> The big drops in temp come from using a liquid metal between the die and IHS. Also, IC Diamond is not a good idea because the tiny particles can scratch the die.


+1, I got a 20C drop in temp with liquid metal. Prior to CLP arriving, my first application was a thick tim, phobya grease, temps were almost identical to intels, the thick tim did not spread and I put too much on, really looked like intels application when I removed it...despite having removed the adhesive that causes the gap. I then tried Pk1 which I used sparingly and it is thinner tim, but still only saw about 10C drop. I would stick with clu/clp.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> Via Vice.. wood=pine


Dang that one is very clean and shiny.
How did you remove the adhesive that well without doing damage to the upper pcb layer?


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Dang that one is very clean and shiny.
> How did you remove the adhesive that well without doing damage to the upper pcb layer?




Like this..

nawh.. I just used a cored power drill and a felt polishing wheel.. Make sure to keep the wheel WET with alcohol, that keeps the temp down while you polish, if you use water, it will heat up more..


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> OCN name: Robbieboy
> CPU: Core i5 3570k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: ~30°C
> 
> Before CLP
> 
> Core 1....92c
> Core 2....92c
> Core 3....91c
> Core 4....87c
> 
> I turned Aida off after less than 3 mins as it went above 90c ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With CLP
> 
> Core 1....61c
> Core 2....61c
> Core 3....61c
> Core 4....61c
> 
> Taken at 20 mins of Aida....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some pic's
> 
> 
> 
> Before
> 
> 
> After


OK it's been over a year since i De-lidded my chip...and temps are even lower noW with a Noctua NH-U14S with Extra NF-A15 fan Cooling my chip. (Old cooler was a V8 Coolermaster)

Core 1....56c
Core 2....54c
Core 3....54c
Core 4....48c

Taken at 20 mins of Aida










But i have a Question will i ever need to reapply the CLP...?


----------



## tw33k

there should be no reason to change the liquid metal on the die. Having said that tho, i don't think anybody has used it like this for more than a year or so, so there's not really any long term testing.


----------



## Kioto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> is IC diamond even real diamond.. i've always wondered if they just ground up some pencil lead and said.. Here you go.. MICRO diamonds..


I used IC Diamond in my previous build and it worked awesome. I had it on my 920 and both of my video cards. I recently took it apart and I had no damage, so I figured I'd use it again. But I have the good stuff (CLP) coming in on Tuesday, I hope it helps, these temps are driving me crazy.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> Via Vice.. wood=pine


Very nice!


----------



## defiler2k

So I decided to go lidless with my brand new 4790K! Did it vice only and wow was it a snap. I was surprised by the amount of air pockets in the stock tim. I will report temps back once it's all installed.


Also for those worried about warping the IHS here are some pics of how flat mine still is.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> So I decided to go lidless with my brand new 4790K! Did it vice only and wow was it a snap. I was surprised by the amount of air pockets in the stock tim. I will report temps back once it's all installed.
> 
> 
> Also for those worried about warping the IHS here are some pics of how flat mine still is.


Very nice I'll be waiting


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Did it vice only and wow was it a snap.


Grats on using the best method in the universe.







Hairdrying it also helps. I believe in that method a lot because it avoids all the instability of having to position a wood block well, hit it well each time or even get a good vice that makes it rest well on it.

The only worse thing it had is that the grip is not as perfect, since one side goes on the pch the other on the ihs. I alleviated that problem by just bracing the middle of the chip around the vice with electrical tape. I used some paper on the grid to not mess it up with tape glue.


----------



## Jeronbernal

the hairdrying method with the vice seems like a cool method, maybe next time i'll do that. i fell in love with the double wood block method, just because i haven't had issues with it yet. but less risk the better i'd say









im curious if i should start binning again for a better cpu... so far the one i've got does a stable 5.0 @ 1.35v and i could validate 5.1 @ 1.375/1.4v but her brain powers die after any extensive stress testing

would i have a hard time finding anything better you guys think? or just call it a day?

also, how could i adjust my bios settings to lower my voltage and still keep it stable @ 5.0ghz? i only have the core multiplier and voltage adjusted.. but is there anything else i could adjust? i believe fate said something about setting the ring to 8x and something else to 8x. I also believe darkwizzie said something about adjusting the core ratio to 4.0 & the voltage to something..

right now i just have it sitting at 1.25v @ 4.8ghz because i don't really want to keep my voltages too high because im a wimp. although i can dissipate the heat. i'm still unclear what would be a top safe voltage would be for daily use, if i can keep it lower than 80c load


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> i believe fate said something about setting the ring to 8x and something else to 8x.


Oh that's just for validations. Abysmal speed on memory, uncore, disabled igpu, all that. It's a bit of gimmick though if it's just for that, I'm more impressed about sub-1.35 voltages on high performance settings.


----------



## Wirerat

8x cache speed would not really open up any headroom. I just set 41 or 40 and 1.175v on cache and never touch it again. Its really not even worth the time to tweak. I get bigger bench improvements overclocking/tweaking ram.


----------



## fateswarm

It does on suicide runs on validations sometimes, when you get to extremities tiny differences like that matter. x8 memory helped to go 5.1G on 1.35v for example. It's probably exactly as you say for anything sane, but for those tries to go above anything reasonable.


----------



## MR-e

hey, question guys. I just received my tube of CLP and plan on deliding a 4790k. can someone confirm that clp is the paste that i will set it and forget it?

clu is the one that needs to be reapplied over time correct?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sexpot*
> 
> hey, question guys. I just received my tube of CLP and plan on deliding a 4790k. can someone confirm that clp is the paste that i will set it and forget it?
> 
> clu is the one that needs to be reapplied over time correct?


Are you going bare die or are you going to use the IHS? CLP has documented cases of it harening and causing issues in non nickel surfaces. What you want is CLU, it will still stain your block but it will not cause problems where it sticks to the die.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Probably wait for someone else to answer.. but is 4790 even worth delidding? how much gain do we get from those chips by delidding?

For your question, I thought that CLP was the one that would dry out faster of the two? (not by much)
I opened my CPU running CLU after 9 months of running, and it was still liquid and my temps had not risen a single degree since I first applied it. (counting ambient temp)
Might be worth mentioning that my PC is running 24/7 more or less.. dont know if that factors in?

CLP and CLU are both long lasting TIMs and you wont need to replace it any sooner than any other TIM.. maybe even less often.
CLP, I think, stains a bit more on your CPU cooler (witch is not a factor since you will be using it between DIE and IHS)
Other then that, they are quite similar in terms of cooling ability / maintenance.

No matter witch one you end up using, it is still good practice to replace your TIM once a year~ (some would say half a year)


----------



## fateswarm

The gain I got was quieter fans. I doubt most get any higher OCs, and that shows on the historical stats. It's because temp-limited overclocks are usually restricted to subzero or other extreme differences.


----------



## MR-e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Are you going bare die or are you going to use the IHS? CLP has documented cases of it harening and causing issues in non nickel surfaces. What you want is CLU, it will still stain your block but it will not cause problems where it sticks to the die.


sorry i forgot to include that info. I will not be going bare die and will use clp inbetween the die and ihs. for ihs to cpu block, i will be using gelid extreme 2.

yes, i plan to replace tim once a year everytime i service my loop. im just worried clp will need to be reapplied every 6 months.


----------



## brpc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Probably wait for someone else to answer.. but is 4790 even worth delidding? how much gain do we get from those chips by delidding?


We gain a lot, considering Intel's application of the TIM is horrible... my air bubble pic was reposted from the i7-4790k owners thread.

It will increase your ability to overclock just as much as some cool stickers will... but that said, it will reduce temps (and thus increase your thermal limit) by a lot to delid and *correctly* apply your TIM of choice... In other words: it wont help you get more stable, but you will get better temps for your voltages (which may help you get more stable).

Edit: forgot to mention I got a minimum of 25C drop at load, and a 5C drop at idle, and I'm only using gelid gc extreme 3 right now (between die and IHS and HS).
Edit2: It's worth mentioning as well that I was not able to use my current volts before delidding, because I was getting 100C+ at 1.27v and now I max out at low/mid 90s at 1.305v (using IBT High).


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brpc*
> 
> We gain a lot, considering Intel's application of the TIM is horrible... my air bubble pic was reposted from the i7-4790k owners thread.
> 
> It will increase your ability to overclock just as much as some cool stickers will... but that said, it will reduce temps (and thus increase your thermal limit) by a lot to delid and *correctly* apply your TIM of choice... In other words: it wont help you get more stable, but you will get better temps for your voltages (which may help you get more stable).
> 
> Edit: forgot to mention I got a minimum of 25C drop at load, and a 5C drop at idle, and I'm only using gelid gc extreme 3 right now (between die and IHS and HS).
> Edit2: It's worth mentioning as well that I was not able to use my current volts before delidding, because I was getting 100C+ at 1.27v and now I max out at low/mid 90s at 1.305v (using IBT High).


Of course I meant temp "gain"







not overclockability (stable at less Vcore..)
I havent been following the threat too much lately :S Just heard that 4790 had significantly better TIM..
25C drop? :O NICE!







well that answers my question.. 4790 / 4690 can definitely still benefit from delidding..
Is 25~ a extrema result? or normal?
4770 / 4670 has average of about 18-20 degree drop


----------



## brpc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Of course I meant temp "gain"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not overclockability (stable at less Vcore..)
> I havent been following the threat too much lately :S Just heard that 4790 had significantly better TIM..
> 25C drop? :O NICE!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well that answers my question.. 4790 / 4690 can definitely still benefit from delidding..
> Is 25~ a extrema result? or normal?
> 4770 / 4670 has average of about 18-20 degree drop


I think my case was a little extreme, but I've been hearing others have had bubbles as well. I'll reiterate with this picture:



But assuming you don't have this kind of air bubble, then I'd still wager you'll gain at least 10C drop with a good TIM.

I don't think the "NGTIM" intel used is bad at all by itself, but whatever process they are using to apply it is terrible.


----------



## Serandur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brpc*
> 
> I think my case was a little extreme, but I've been hearing others have had bubbles as well. I'll reiterate with this picture:
> 
> 
> 
> But assuming you don't have this kind of air bubble, then I'd still wager you'll gain at least 10C drop with a good TIM.
> 
> I don't think the "NGTIM" intel used is bad at all by itself, but whatever process they are using to apply it is terrible.


Seriously, how much money are Intel saving by not applying fluxless solder to these things? That glue... the gap is the biggest problem making delidding a profitable endeavor (or necessity for OCN) and their process has air bubbles in the TIM too. 4790Ks are like $350. Seriously Intel?


----------



## lilchronic

intel used very good tim on the 4790k . i put arctic silver on my delidded 4790k and my temps were worse. stock tim temps were in the upper 80's, with arctic silver temp's almost broke into the 100's 98c max, clp temps stay in the mid 70's with same overclock


----------



## tp4tissue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> intel used very good tim on the 4790k . i put arctic silver on my delidded 4790k and my temps were worse. stock tim temps were in the upper 80's, with arctic silver temp's almost broke into the 100's 98c max, clp temps stay in the mid 70's with same overclock


this sounds fluke-ish... LOL.. you probably just got a better mount across the few attempts.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tp4tissue*
> 
> this sounds fluke-ish... LOL.. you probably just got a better mount across the few attempts.


all i got to say about that is................try it you're self.


----------



## MrBlunt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> intel used very good tim on the 4790k . i put arctic silver on my delidded 4790k and my temps were worse. stock tim temps were in the upper 80's, with arctic silver temp's almost broke into the 100's 98c max, clp temps stay in the mid 70's with same overclock


Have you tried dif TIM and a remount?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MrBlunt*
> 
> Have you tried dif TIM and a remount?


im sure my mount was fine, i have gelid gc extreme but havent tried it on the die........ ill have to do that


----------



## MrBlunt

even if you are POSITIVE it's fine.. remount it anyway..














Never hurts to triple check your work


----------



## RKDxpress

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> im sure my mount was fine, i have gelid gc extreme but havent tried it on the die........ ill have to do that


Please do that if you have time. I just orderd gelid extreme today. watch for your results.


----------



## Wirerat

I have gelid on die and ihs of my 4770k. Its only 2c-3c off from clp.

I have clp available here but when I used it on the die of my 4670k for 6months it was very hard to clean off the bottom of the ihs. I had to lap it off. I don't like it eating away the ihs so I only use gelid now.


----------



## fateswarm

That dark color it leaves behind may not be detrimental.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That dark color it leaves behind may not be detrimental.


it was not just black smudges bro. You will see. It startes eating into the material. The silver color was gone. I could see the copper exposed when I wiped it was not coming off without sandpaper.

That was 6 full months of one application of clp.

The die was not affected though.


----------



## fateswarm

I will try not to demount the cooler and die at all.







I've a good application at the moment, it even matches the theoretical temps the core numbers should have according to the topology on the architecture.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> I will try not to demount the cooler and die at all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've a good application at the moment, it even matches the theoretical temps the core numbers should have according to the topology on the architecture.


clp eventually fusses the die and ihs. Ppl reported it becoming solid in this thread.


----------



## fateswarm

The company claims it does not "eat" stuff, but it gets into gaps. Are you sure you're not confusing it with that?

But I guess that "gets into" might be similar in some cases to end results of that sort in reality.

What they call "alloying".


----------



## Robbieboy

OH....

My De-Lidded chip i did about 13 months ago....

It Is still getting great temp's, do you think i should check it and re apply new or just leave it alone....?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> The company claims it does not "eat" stuff, but it gets into gaps. Are you sure you're not confusing it with that?
> 
> But I guess that "gets into" might be similar in some cases to end results of that sort in reality.
> 
> What they call "alloying".


The silver color was gone. Raw copper exposed. It might still be completely safe for long term. but given that I know for a fact gelid is safe for the same application to last years and I only sacrificed 2c. Im feeling better about using the gelid on my new to me i7.


----------



## fateswarm

Hrm. The mechanism is probably it "gets into gaps" as they say, then it is "alloying" as they say, so it's sort of like having a thin layer of "alloyed plaster" wherever you put it. Thing is, I don't see a reason I should be fiddling with it a lot, considering that state of it is a sort-of natural state of it, now that I've applied it anyway.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Hrm. The mechanism is probably it "gets into gaps" as they say, then it is "alloying" as they say, so it's sort of like having a thin layer of "alloyed plaster" wherever you put it. Thing is, I don't see a reason I should be fiddling with it a lot, considering that state of it is a sort-of natural state of it, now that I've applied it anyway.


i was only in there because I was swapping cpus. It made me want to just use the gelid on the incoming cpu though.


----------



## sweenytodd

Hopping into the crew.

OCN name: *sweenytodd*
CPU: *4670K*
on die-TIM: *CLP*
ihs-TIM: *MX-4*
Mhz gained: *100MHz*
OC after delid: *4.6GHz*
Temp drops: *22C*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/njk04g










Temps before delid:



Temps after delid:



Temp drops:
X264 before = 80 - 79 - 77 - 70
X264 after = 66 - 66 - 64 - 59

AIDA64 FPU before = 96 - 96 - 93 - 83
AIDA64 FPU after = 74 - 75 - 74 - 67
_______________________________________________________________________________

Voltages are only for the delidding part. I would definitely fine tune my 4.6GHz overclock for lower voltages.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> Hopping into the crew.
> 
> OCN name: *sweenytodd*
> CPU: *4670K*
> on die-TIM: *CLP*
> ihs-TIM: *MX-4*
> Mhz gained: *100MHz*
> OC after delid: *4.6GHz*
> Temp drops: *22C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/njk04g
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Temps before delid:
> 
> 
> 
> Temps after delid:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temp drops:
> X264 before = 80 - 79 - 77 - 70
> X264 after = 66 - 66 - 64 - 59
> 
> AIDA64 FPU before = 96 - 96 - 93 - 83
> AIDA64 FPU after = 74 - 75 - 74 - 67
> _______________________________________________________________________________
> 
> Voltages are only for the delidding part. I would definitely fine tune my 4.6GHz overclock for lower voltages.


You're in! Slappa Dat Sig on!









Also for the peeps curious as to why Intel is using paste still compared to fluxless. I've said this multiple times throughout the thread but I'll keep saying it. The reason Intel did this switch from fluxless to paste is due to the difference in manufacturing and the nm size difference and the heat output of them little suckers. Apparently when I was talking to one of Intel's head engineers they couldn't use fluxless as during their test cpus they were dying from the dies cracking from the heat exchange taking place, so they tried paste and it has yet to crack a single die, which is why its still in use.


----------



## fateswarm

I saw an intel engineer on an interview being more blunt and I'd rather believe that more: The mainstream platform also makes the low cost chips and it can't afford it, it would raise the price etc. The higher(-er) end platform can afford it.


----------



## WiSK

Yep I agree; likely both is true. They probably have two or more methods they would use for soldering die to IHS. The cheaper method that they would normally use for mainstream, cracks the dies on the newer tech. While the more expensive methods can only be financially justified for the high end CPUs.


----------



## defiler2k

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> Hopping into the crew.
> 
> OCN name: *sweenytodd*
> CPU: *4670K*
> on die-TIM: *CLP*
> ihs-TIM: *MX-4*
> Mhz gained: *100MHz*
> OC after delid: *4.6GHz*
> Temp drops: *22C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/njk04g
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps before delid:
> 
> 
> 
> Temps after delid:
> 
> 
> 
> Temp drops:
> X264 before = 80 - 79 - 77 - 70
> X264 after = 66 - 66 - 64 - 59
> 
> AIDA64 FPU before = 96 - 96 - 93 - 83
> AIDA64 FPU after = 74 - 75 - 74 - 67
> _______________________________________________________________________________
> 
> Voltages are only for the delidding part. I would definitely fine tune my 4.6GHz overclock for lower voltages.






Congrats on the drops, looking at your CLU application looks like you have a little too much but still those are good temps.


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> 
> Congrats on the drops, looking at your CLU application looks like you have a little too much but still those are good temps.


Thanks. Yes, a little bit much. I thought the TIM became hardened and I accidentally put that amount. Maybe after a year, I will lap the heat spreader and definitely redo the TIM application. By the way is CLP


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> Thanks. Yes, a little bit much. I thought the TIM became hardened and I accidentally put that amount. Maybe after a year, I will lap the heat spreader and definitely redo the TIM application. By the way is CLP


I maqde the same mistake the first time I delid, just for reference you want your die to look something like this.


----------



## lilchronic

if you have to much on you can suck it back into the syringe if you use clp


----------



## fateswarm

You can wipe it off. Especially on the glass it doesn't even leave stains. I doubt even the IHS stains are important though in heat dissipation.


----------



## lilchronic

why waste it ? .....and yes the IHS will stain a little, that's why people dont use it on the top of the IHS cause it will stain it and you wont be able to see the marking if you ever need to rma


----------



## fateswarm

Just saying, it's an option. It's also not that little as it seems. I accidentally squeezed it way more than needed and it spilled way more than needed and there's still plenty for various applications.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> OH....
> 
> My De-Lidded chip i did about 13 months ago....
> 
> It Is still getting great temp's, do you think i should check it and re apply new or just leave it alone....?


Hmmm.... if you leave it on for too long, the die and IHS might "fuse" together.. (or so I heard in this thread)
On the other hand, if temps are still fine, why refresh?
On the other other hand.. it is good practice to renew TIM once a year or so..

Just be careful when removing the IHS from the DIE.. dont pull too hard since the IHS is now sticking directly to the DIE and not just IHS to PCB (glue before delidding) so you cant apply half the force you did when first removing the IHS. You risk ripping the die off of the PCB.
Try to remove it. if it resists, give it a gentle twist, if it still doesnt move, I would just leave it as is.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> Hopping into the crew.
> 
> OCN name: *sweenytodd*
> CPU: *4670K*
> on die-TIM: *CLP*
> ihs-TIM: *MX-4*
> Mhz gained: *100MHz*
> OC after delid: *4.6GHz*
> Temp drops: *22C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/njk04g
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps before delid:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps after delid:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temp drops:
> X264 before = 80 - 79 - 77 - 70
> X264 after = 66 - 66 - 64 - 59
> 
> AIDA64 FPU before = 96 - 96 - 93 - 83
> AIDA64 FPU after = 74 - 75 - 74 - 67
> _______________________________________________________________________________
> 
> Voltages are only for the delidding part. I would definitely fine tune my 4.6GHz overclock for lower voltages.


Nice clean delid there! good job, and welcome to the club








Good temps too! or though I agree it looks like a lot of tim on there








Good thing you covered the surface mounted caps


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Just saying, it's an option. It's also not that little as it seems. I accidentally squeezed it way more than needed and it spilled way more than needed and there's still plenty for various applications.


yeah the one thing you dont want to do is drop some because it will get everywhere! ...............one syringe should last 20 + application's ive been through one syring already with all the chips ive dellided


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yeah the one thing you dont want to do is drop some because it will get everywhere! ...............one syringe should last 20 + application's ive been through one syring already with all the chips ive dellided


I can attest to this, I had an old syringe that lasted for at least 10 applications, last night it flew out of my hands as I applied it to my new 4970K and I spent more time cleaning the spill than mounting motherboard , deliding and mounting the cpu and cooler!


----------



## fateswarm

Yeah I spilled it on a keyboard in front of the chip I was handling. Good thing I didn't spill it on a motherboard or something. That'd be a disaster.


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Nice clean delid there! good job, and welcome to the club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good temps too! or though I agree it looks like a lot of tim on there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good thing you covered the surface mounted caps


Thanks man. It is really a lot. I had to wait at least 4 hours for the liquid electrical tape to dry before applying the CLP. I believe the TIM already touches the caps. Good thing I did two coats for good measure and insurance to prevent shorting out.

So that excess TIM, it's probably touching the electrical tape on the caps right now. Do you think after prolong use, the tape will melt and can cause me problems?

This is the technical data sheet by the way. Temp range is -54C to 204C


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Very nice I'll be waiting


I couldn't help myself and decided to do a quick run with just half my loop running (it is extremely ugly since I did not want to bend acrylic to just do the test so I used all scraps and fittings to connect some areas but here is a first pass.

OCN name: defiler2k
CPU: 4790K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: N/A Bare Die
Mhz gained: N/A Didnt bother testing before Delid
OC after delid: 4.8GHz
Temp drops: N/A

Ambient 20C Idle 22C Load ETU:47C Peak Stabilizes 41C



I will run some more tests tonight to provide more details.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> I couldn't help myself and decided to do a quick run with just half my loop running (it is extremely ugly since I did not want to bend acrylic to just do the test so I used all scraps and fittings to connect some areas but here is a first pass.
> 
> OCN name: defiler2k
> CPU: 4790K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: N/A Bare Die
> Mhz gained: N/A Didnt bother testing before Delid
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: N/A
> 
> Ambient 20C Idle 22C Load ETU:47C Peak Stabilizes 41C
> 
> 
> 
> I will run some more tests tonight to provide more details.


You're in! Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## GHADthc

Seems like I've got myself a real gem here...though I don't know if its going to be prime stable for a few hours, we'll see...
This is on air, dellided with CLP on the die, and GC-Extreme on the IHS, using a Phanteks PH-TC14PE, the motherboard is probably helping with this clock as well a bit, Maximus VI Extreme...using a $79AUD CPU in a $500 mobo (well when I bought it)...lol

That voltage is pretty high though...don't think this chip is going to stand up to this abuse for very long!


----------



## Derp

After three releases in a row that show significant gains after delid (Ivy,Haswell and Devil's Canyon), do you think we will start seeing companies sell some kind of safe contraption specifically designed for delidding processors?

MSI has already started to offer a direct die guard with one of their motherboards.


----------



## fateswarm

With blunt force or cutting, no. The forces are too big and the nuances too delicate to make it 100% safe on any "semi automatic" method.

Unless they sell some kind of dissolving agent for the glue..


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> OH....
> 
> My De-Lidded chip i did about 13 months ago....
> 
> It Is still getting great temp's, do you think i should check it and re apply new or just leave it alone....?


What TIM are you using I am asking this as I am suffering from "bleed out" I am currently using Noctua NT-H1.
I am after a low maintenance solution replacing the TIM every 4-5months is too much effort for me.
I was going to order some CLU but it is not available here in New Zealand so I will have to order it from the US


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I was going to order some CLU but it is not available here in New Zealand so I will have to order it from the US


Mate if you would like a CLP instead of a CLU, I bought from this seller from Germany. Delivered within one in Canada.

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/161141156776?redirect=mobile


----------



## Robbieboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> What TIM are you using I am asking this as I am suffering from "bleed out" I am currently using Noctua NT-H1.
> I am after a low maintenance solution replacing the TIM every 4-5months is too much effort for me.
> I was going to order some CLU but it is not available here in New Zealand so I will have to order it from the US


I'm using CLP on the *Die* ans AS5 on the *IHS*

Well i did take the plunge two days ago and redo the CLP on the die as i got worried after reading some comments on here...But

After taking it all apart i was happy to see CLP was still as good as the day i put it on 13+ months ago...

i cleaned it all off with some Toilet role, Coffee Filters and Alcohol, then i used the cleaning pad that comes with the CLP to get rid of the stain left on the under side of the IHS (rubbing real softly as to not mess it up )

Then Put the new CLP Application on with a good brand of Cotton Bud and put it all together and all's good....









Temp's are as good as before or maybe 1C better....







Good for another 12 month's me thinks....









*Before Cleaning*


*After Cleaning*


----------



## StoryofJob

Guys I wondered if its possible to delid and leave the lid off, connecting the cooling product directly to the chip? has anybody done this?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StoryofJob*
> 
> Guys I wondered if its possible to delid and leave the lid off, connecting the cooling product directly to the chip? has anybody done this?


Its called direct die and it can be done, I do it myself with my EK Supremacy and my 4790K. I just use the precise mount kit for my block.



You just have to be very careful as it is easier to get a bad mount without the IHS or even damage your CPU socket.


----------



## StoryofJob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Its called direct die and it can be done, I do it myself with my EK Supremacy and my 4790K. I just use the precise mount kit for my block.
> 
> You just have to be very careful as it is easier to get a bad mount without the IHS or even damage your CPU socket.


Great, do you notice any improvments using direct die vs delidding(and relidding)?
Thanks


----------



## defiler2k

Yes in my case the difference was noticeable between the two we are talking at least 10 degrees on load when going lidless and using CLU


----------



## StoryofJob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Yes in my case the difference was noticeable between the two we are talking at least 10 degrees on load when going lidless and using CLU


Thats awesome, so from Stock to normal delid to direct die overall you probably achieved around 30C drop?
Sounds very much a worthwhile procedure.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StoryofJob*
> 
> Thats awesome, so from Stock to normal delid to direct die overall you probably achieved around 30C drop?
> Sounds very much a worthwhile procedure.


I wouldnt be able to tell you the difference between stock and delidded I just went delid from the get go and then went bare die. You can see my bare die temps here


----------



## StoryofJob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> I wouldnt be able to tell you the difference between stock and delidded I just went delid from the get go and then went bare die. You can see my bare die temps here


Thats great, Nice OC too, what voltage was you able to stabelize at?


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Robbieboy*
> 
> I'm using CLP on the *Die* ans AS5 on the *IHS*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Well i did take the plunge two days ago and redo the CLP on the die as i got worried after reading some comments on here...But
> 
> After taking it all apart i was happy to see CLP was still as good as the day i put it on 13+ months ago...
> 
> i cleaned it all off with some Toilet role, Coffee Filters and Alcohol, then i used the cleaning pad that comes with the CLP to get rid of the stain left on the under side of the IHS (rubbing real softly as to not mess it up )
> 
> Then Put the new CLP Application on with a good brand of Cotton Bud and put it all together and all's good....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temp's are as good as before or maybe 1C better....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good for another 12 month's me thinks....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Before Cleaning*
> 
> 
> *After Cleaning*


Thanks even if they fused together would that be a bad thing, the only reason I would be re-applying the TIM is bad temps

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> Mate if you would like a CLP instead of a CLU, I bought from this seller from Germany. Delivered within one in Canada.
> 
> http://www.ebay.ca/itm/161141156776?redirect=mobile


I have to ask I have had a look and I have to ask what exactly is the difference between CLU and CLP
they both corrode aluminum and seep into copper I am rather confused about the pros and cons between the two

Edit I read the manuals
http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/manual_liquid_pro_englisch.pdf
http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/manual_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf

It seems Ultra is user friendly compared to Pro No warnings of corroding aluminum or staining copper. Easy to clean up.

Pro seems to be more stable long term, But will eat aluminum, stain copper and possibly harden and bond over time.

well that's how I interpret the manuals


----------



## brpc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> Thanks even if they fused together would that be a bad thing, the only reason I would be re-applying the TIM is bad temps
> I have to ask I have had a look and I have to ask what exactly is the difference between CLU and CLP
> they both corrode aluminum and seep into copper I am rather confused about the pros and cons between the two
> 
> Edit I read the manuals
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/manual_liquid_pro_englisch.pdf
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/manual_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf
> 
> It seems Ultra is user friendly compared to Pro No warnings of corroding aluminum or staining copper. Easy to clean up.
> 
> Pro seems to be more stable long term, But will eat aluminum, stain copper and possibly harden and bond over time.
> 
> well that's how I interpret the manuals


Ultra has gallium in it still, and still has the same warning on the back of the package to use it with pretty much anything EXCEPT aluminum. Too lazy to take a pic of the package, but it's there


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brpc*
> 
> Ultra has gallium in it still, and still has the same warning on the back of the package to use it with pretty much anything EXCEPT aluminum. Too lazy to take a pic of the package, but it's there


This ^^^

Both CLP and CLU will eat Aluminum


----------



## RKDxpress

Hi: wanted to share my first delid! I'm not to swift with the keyboard and only have cell phone pics so here goes. OCN name RKDxpress, CPU 4770K, On die tim Gelid Gc Extreme, IHS tim gc extreme, MHZ gained TBD, OC after delid 4500 mhz, Temp drops 17* CPU Z Valadation 

I used the vise method then tapped the vise with a hammer to jar the lid off in my hand.
As I found it inside
Got a few more pics if you want or ask a question. RKDxpress


----------



## sweenytodd

What stress test did you use before and after the delid? Cooling solution?


----------



## RKDxpress

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> What stress test did you use before and after the delid? Cooling solution?


I used real temps sensor test for a quick check of temputures to compare before and after. Adia 64 and prime 95 previously to test stability. Cooling soloution: Im just using a cooler master Seidon 120 closed loop.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RKDxpress*
> 
> Hi: wanted to share my first delid! I'm not to swift with the keyboard and only have cell phone pics so here goes. OCN name RKDxpress, CPU 4770K, On die tim Gelid Gc Extreme, IHS tim gc extreme, MHZ gained TBD, OC after delid 4500 mhz, Temp drops 17* CPU Z Valadation
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used the vise method then tapped the vise with a hammer to jar the lid off in my hand.
> As I found it inside
> 
> 
> Got a few more pics if you want or ask a question. RKDxpress


Welcome to OCN!

Also You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## sweenytodd

Your first pic has only 1% load. We would love to see the difference on full load










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## RKDxpress

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> Your first pic has only 1% load. We would love to see the difference on full load
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Here is another shot. Just finished a half hour of aida 64 so that is what shows in the maximum temputures. Again close to twenty degrees lower!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RKDxpress*
> 
> Here is another shot. Just finished a half hour of aida 64 so that is what shows in the maximum temputures. Again close to twenty degrees lower!


I have not had the best of luck with Aida64 for stability testing. I can do 24 hours of Aida using "Stress CPU" and still be a good ways off from being gaming stable. And the "Stress FPU" cooks my chip to significantly higher than P95 or IBT temps, so it is also not all that useful, and extremely unrealistic.

Maybe it is different for Haswell, but with Ivy I found that P95 was a better program for stress testing.


----------



## lilchronic

Lilchronic
i7 - 4790k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: GELID GC EXTREME
Mhz gained: 300Mhz
OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
Temp drops: -12c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/c47358

before delid stock settings


After Delid stock setting's


Max oc before delid - 4.7Ghz


Max oc after delid - 5.0Ghz


........... the last 4790k was only around a 12 -15c drop also , compared to the 4770ks and ivy bridges dropping 20 - 30c


----------



## inedenimadam

Aida64 making a comeback? I am never stable after a 24 hour aida CPU test. Did I miss a big update or something?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Aida64 making a comeback? I am never stable after a 24 hour aida CPU test. Did I miss a big update or something?


i just use aida to compare temps and get a understanding on how stable my cpu is.......


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Aida64 making a comeback? I am never stable after a 24 hour aida CPU test. Did I miss a big update or something?
> 
> 
> 
> i just use aida to compare temps and get a understanding on how stable my cpu is.......
Click to expand...

I updated my BIOS a while back (wipes my overclock presets), and decided to use Aida to stabilize, and my 5.0 stabilized at 1.320 at 55C in Aida (still crashed in games), but did not stabilize til 1.352 at 70C with P95...that is a BIG discrepancy in voltage and temperature. I dont think I could even use it for ball parking chips, because its just no good for me.
Note: I suffer from ASRock Z77 syndrome and my Vcore is closer to 1.45ish, but the bug shows it lower in CPU-Z


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Lilchronic
> i7 - 4790k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: GELID GC EXTREME
> Mhz gained: 300Mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
> Temp drops: -12c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/c47358
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> before delid stock settings
> 
> 
> After Delid stock setting's
> 
> 
> Max oc before delid - 4.7Ghz
> 
> 
> Max oc after delid - 5.0Ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ........... the last 4790k was only around a 12 -15c drop also , compared to the 4770ks and ivy bridges dropping 25 - 30c


Your're In!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> Lilchronic
> i7 - 4790k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: GELID GC EXTREME
> Mhz gained: 300Mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
> Temp drops: -12c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/c47358
> 
> before delid stock settings
> 
> 
> After Delid stock setting's
> 
> 
> Max oc before delid - 4.7Ghz
> 
> 
> Max oc after delid - 5.0Ghz
> 
> 
> ........... the last 4790k was only around a 12 -15c drop also , compared to the 4770ks and ivy bridges dropping 25 - 30c


Nice clock! Does a delidded 4790k offer any improvement over the delidded 4770k? I am seeing 5ghz is that a rare chip?


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Nice clock! Does a delidded 4790k offer any improvement over the delidded 4770k? I am seeing 5ghz is that a rare chip?


a little bit dropped my temps 12c, that 5ghz is not stable cant get it stable with 1.4v so i back down a little and ive got 4.9Ghz stable @ 1.325v but cant seem to get 5 ghz stable, lowest voltage too boot 5ghz is 1.325v, 1.35v to run aida any more and i get constant 101 bsod raised VRIN too 2.1v and still not stable... idk i got some playing around to do


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> a little bit dropped my temps 12c, that 5ghz is not stable cant get it stable with 1.4v so i back down a little and ive got 4.9Ghz stable @ 1.325v but cant seem to get 5 ghz stable, lowest voltage too boot 5ghz is 1.325v, 1.35v to run aida any more and i get constant 101 bsod raised VRIN too 2.1v and still not stable... idk i got some playing around to do


You'll get it. Congrats on a nice chip!


----------



## t3h0th3r

tried this russian "vise only/no hammer" method (was too much of a wuss to hammer my CPU) and it worked like a charm :



will post results when direct die mount kit arrives.


----------



## fateswarm

Yep, best method around. Hair drying it helps. It's a bit scary that the grip is less secured, less aligned, but some tape bracing it alleviates that.


----------



## t3h0th3r

i tried first with a hairdryer/heatgun on an older CPU. i found that it actually makes it harder to get the IHS off, since the gunk gets more flexible the IHS won't really pop off, had to give it a flick with the hammer afterwards.
with the 3570K i didn't use any heating and it went off super easy


----------



## fateswarm

I don't think it's obligatory either. I think it helps because it's too rubber-y and some heat may make it more loose. But, excess heat may take moisture away and make it worse I guess.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *t3h0th3r*
> 
> tried this russian "vise only/no hammer" method (was too much of a wuss to hammer my CPU) and it worked like a charm :
> 
> 
> 
> will post results when direct die mount kit arrives.


Nice


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *t3h0th3r*
> 
> i tried first with a hairdryer/heatgun on an older CPU. i found that it actually makes it harder to get the IHS off, since the gunk gets more flexible the IHS won't really pop off, had to give it a flick with the hammer afterwards.
> with the 3570K i didn't use any heating and it went off super easy


Hmmmmmmmmmm....
Anyone wanna try throwing a CPU in liquid nitrogen / dry ice or even a deep freezer? would be fun to see if the glue gets fragile..
Would be awesome if it could be twisted off by hand (no tools needed, just a pair of gloves) lol


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *t3h0th3r*
> 
> i tried first with a hairdryer/heatgun on an older CPU. i found that it actually makes it harder to get the IHS off, since the gunk gets more flexible the IHS won't really pop off, had to give it a flick with the hammer afterwards.
> with the 3570K i didn't use any heating and it went off super easy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmmmmmmmmmm....
> Anyone wanna try throwing a CPU in liquid nitrogen / dry ice or even a deep freezer? would be fun to see if the glue gets fragile..
> Would be awesome if it could be twisted off by hand (no tools needed, just a pair of gloves) lol
Click to expand...

I was thinking the same thing, stick it in the freezer for a few hours, maybe over night and then put it in the vise. I think it should make the 'glue' brittle and it should come off easier.


----------



## Wanescotting

For shame...think it will still work with a missing smd?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> I was thinking the same thing, stick it in the freezer for a few hours, maybe over night and then put it in the vise. I think it should make the 'glue' brittle and it should come off easier.


Hardly, I do LN2 benching on ivy and haswell and theres no difference they are stuck on even harder, I even had the cpu down to -250 F soooo, yeah


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wanescotting*
> 
> 
> 
> For shame...think it will still work with a missing smd?


In all honesty try it, nothing to lose but only to gain, and sometimes those smd's are grounds anyways


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> I was thinking the same thing, stick it in the freezer for a few hours, maybe over night and then put it in the vise. I think it should make the 'glue' brittle and it should come off easier.
> 
> 
> 
> Hardly, I do LN2 benching on ivy and haswell and theres no difference they are stuck on even harder, I even had the cpu down to -250 F soooo, yeah
Click to expand...

Damn, well that throws that idea out the window lol.


----------



## fateswarm

Nothing in my intuition indicates cold would make it better. Extreme heat may make it worse too since it may dry it further. Since it's rubber-y the limited heat of a strong hair dryer might be best.


----------



## Swag

The vice method is working pretty well and I don't see as much dead CPUs from it apart from certain circumstances where the error is 100% on the user like not preparing or holding the CPU from the PCB rather than on the lid.

Trying to improve the method by hair dryer or freezing looks like it may add more chances to go wrong than to go right.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> The vice method is working pretty well and I don't see as much dead CPUs from it apart from certain circumstances where the error is 100% on the user like not preparing or holding the CPU from the PCB rather than on the lid.
> 
> Trying to improve the method by hair dryer or freezing looks like it may add more chances to go wrong than to go right.


I see the hair dryer as a minor help. The main improvement I see over the vice+block method is not using a block at all and going straight to vice-only. It avoids all the quality control dangers of needing a good block, a good vice to stand the block, and a good handling of the block.


----------



## t3h0th3r

(i haven't delidded any CPU before the 2 yesterday, so my experience is somewhat limited)
the heat actually made it harder for the IHS to come off, without heating it only took 1 - 2 full turns of the handle once the jaws were flush on the CPU. after that i could pick up the IHS. with heat the glue was smeared and the IHS was still sticking to the PCB.
i used a vise with flat jaws. that's probably a good idea to prevent indentations on the PCB, also the large handle makes it very easy to just deliver as little force as is needed for the IHS to come off.
pics:


----------



## fateswarm

It's a bit uncertain what's going on on the same try. e.g. you may be pushing for it by doing something and then popping it off after doing something else. The first thing though might have damaged the glue already so it might not be that the second method did all the work.


----------



## t3h0th3r

Ah it was 2 different CPUs, an older P4 for practice and then the Ivy.


----------



## Valgaur

Most BA vice ever! (side note) totally jelly of your machine... wish i had one to make some prototype equipment that i wanna do eventually


----------



## Huppakee

Delidded my i5 3570k.
Really impressed with the temp drop.

Before delid and 30m Prime95:

i5-stock TIM-IHS-Artic 5-stock cooler
Min temp:42°C
Max temp:102°C(BSOD)

After delid and 8h Prime 95:

i5-Artic MX4-IHS-Artic MX4-Be Quiet Dark Rock Pro 3
Min temp:27°C
Max temp:62°C


----------



## t3h0th3r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Most BA vice ever! (side note) totally jelly of your machine... wish i had one to make some prototype equipment that i wanna do eventually


it's not mine unfortunately. it's in our company's workshop, but at least i have access to it


----------



## gobblebox

Hey everyone! First time poster, long time lurker here! I've decided to delid my 4790k using the vise method on Monday (when the supplies arrive); I get a stable 4.8GHz @ 1.28, but the temps on this thing are awful, even with a Push/Pull H100i, several remounts, and 3 different TIMs, it still hits 82 in just Intel XTU - I won't even touch prime95 with these temps. It looks like I've run out of thermal headroom & I should be able to hit 5.0 GHz with this chip (Batch L420 if anyone is interested).

This is my first time delidding, but as a corporate systems admin, I feel pretty confident taking this thing apart; not to say that I don't have _any_ worries. My biggest question is, should I coat the VRMs with something just as a fail-safe in case my CLP runs a little? I understand that I am supposed to use such a minimal amount of CLP that it shouldn't be necessary, but I would feel better knowing the VRMs won't be touched by it; and I also read somewhere that it tends to bead/run a little more than CLU. My crafty wife has some liquid electrical tape lying around, should that do the job without future issues?

Finally, what have y'all found to be the best method for removing the adhesive on the PCB? I'm a little concerned about scratching it. I've seen suggestions like soap baths (I will not do this), IPA baths, IPA with microfiber, credit card, etc. I wonder if the 2 step Arctic Cool TIM remover would help remove it a little easier... any suggestions and/or advice is greatly appreciated!

I hope to become a member very shortly!

Best regards,
Ryan


----------



## fateswarm

Keep in mind whatever you rub against each other, the weaker one can't scratch the other. The PCB will be very easily scratched with any regular metal. But some credit cards are probably weaker, store cards with weaker plastic are probably better.

Careful to not hit a resistor/capacitor with it whatever the plastic.


----------



## gobblebox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Keep in mind whatever you rub against each other, the weaker one can't scratch the other. The PCB will be very easily scratched with any regular metal. But some credit cards are probably weaker, store cards with weaker plastic are probably better.
> 
> Careful to not hit a resistor/capacitor with it whatever the plastic.


Would it be okay to cover the VRMs with liquid electrical tape?


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gobblebox*
> 
> Would it be okay to cover the VRMs with liquid electrical tape?


Yup, it's what I used mine. It has a temp range of -54C to 204C so it will not melt easily and safer than nail polish.



Full details of my delidded chip is in my sig if you wanna check it out.


----------



## gobblebox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> Yup, it's what I used mine. It has a temp range of -54C to 204C so it will not melt easily and safer than nail polish.
> 
> 
> 
> Full details of my delidded chip is in my sig if you wanna check it out.


Right on, thanks man, I appreciate the advice.


----------



## Pandora51

Hey guys. I have a question. Might be possible that Im missing the obvious.

I want to delidd my i7-3770k and delidded for training purpose a Intel celeron g1610. When I install the cpu without the IHS the mainboard wont post. When I install it with the IHS it works. So the cpu is not dead.

But you put the cpu without IHS back on, right? How does it work? Through the pressure from the cooler because I used none for the short test?
Im confused


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pandora51*
> 
> Hey guys. I have a question. Might be possible that Im missing the obvious.
> 
> I want to delidd my i7-3770k and delidded for training purpose a Intel celeron g1610. When I install the cpu without the IHS the mainboard wont post. When I install it with the IHS it works. So the cpu is not dead.
> 
> But you put the cpu without IHS back on, right? How does it work? Through the pressure from the cooler because I used none for the short test?
> Im confused


If you do not have a kit to mount the cpu without the IHS the block will not go down far enough for the CPU to make good contact with the board. What CPU bloch are you using?


----------



## Huppakee

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pandora51*
> 
> Hey guys. I have a question. Might be possible that Im missing the obvious.
> 
> I want to delidd my i7-3770k and delidded for training purpose a Intel celeron g1610. When I install the cpu without the IHS the mainboard wont post. When I install it with the IHS it works. So the cpu is not dead.
> 
> But you put the cpu without IHS back on, right? How does it work? Through the pressure from the cooler because I used none for the short test?
> Im confused


As far as I know,a D2D mount with an aircooler is not recommended.The weight can crush or chip the die.
I think most delid to replace the stock TIM and all the adhesive between the IHS and PCB.The adhesive creates a larger gap between die and IHS.This creates the need for more TIM.The more direct contact between die and IHS,the better heattransfer will be.

I placed my IHS back on secured it in place using the Intel bracket.


----------



## Pandora51

Thanks
I will propably get a H100i if that helps but other than that I need to use the IHS? I was never thinking about this issue untill I encountered it.


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pandora51*
> 
> Thanks
> I will propably get a H100i if that helps but other than that I need to use the IHS? I was never thinking about this issue untill I encountered it.


Unless you find a way to modify the mounting bracket for the H100 you will need the IHS. When you go lidless you need to make sure your block goes down further than normally to account for the gap between the IHS and the bare die.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Unless you find a way to modify the mounting bracket for the H100 you will need the IHS. When you go lidless you need to make sure your block goes down further than normally to account for the gap between the IHS and the bare die.


its easy to swap it out for bolts and studs.


----------



## Lolkrayd

Hey everyone,
I got my hand on a pentium g3258 and thought I would delid as I gather the rest of the parts. I am pretty sure I damaged it, but the cpu still works at least so far. (booted to desktop and could run things fine).
Just curious if there are potential damage later on.


----------



## fateswarm

A regular advice is to use something like nail polish on the spot for some insulation. It may be placebo though. I'd personally just forget about it and not fiddle with it at that position.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lolkrayd*
> 
> Hey everyone,
> I got my hand on a pentium g3258 and thought I would delid as I gather the rest of the parts. I am pretty sure I damaged it, but the cpu still works at least so far. (booted to desktop and could run things fine).
> Just curious if there are potential damage later on.


I wanna say you went through the ground lanes in the pcb which could be why its not dead, I would use LET instead of nail polish to cover that up due to the LET being able to flex where the nail polish could chip and get places you don't want.

I have seen people leave those spots alone and simply run them and haven't heard from them yet.


----------



## fateswarm

I was thinking the IHS itself may short them by simply touching them both (it's two holes or more). In that way of thinking even just some electrical tape may be adequate.


----------



## Lolkrayd

Excuse my ignorance, but what is LET and where can I get it?

Well I know the chip still functions, but kind of nervous to overclock it now.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lolkrayd*
> 
> Excuse my ignorance, but what is LET and where can I get it?


Liquid Electrical Tape - can be found at Home Depot or similar. But I think nail polish is more sturdy that Valgaur gives it credit


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Liquid Electrical Tape - can be found at Home Depot or similar. But I think nail polish is more sturdy that Valgaur gives it credit


it is but would rather be careful


----------



## Lolkrayd

Thanks for the suggestions

Will probably use nail polish, since I have access to those already.
But, I am assuming since it is still working, there wouldn't be any harm in overclocking it right?


----------



## fateswarm

Most probably none.


----------



## Cata1yst

Eh, if anything you may have scraped off the top enamel.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lolkrayd*
> 
> Thanks for the suggestions
> 
> Will probably use nail polish, since I have access to those already.
> But, I am assuming since it is still working, there wouldn't be any harm in overclocking it right?


Fire it up!


----------



## tictoc

tictoc
i7-4790k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-4 
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.7 Ghz 
Temp drops: -18° C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/ct2uqv





I used the razor to just get under one corner of the IHS, and then I used the sharpened credit card to cut through the rest of the adhesive.

Cooling is currently a Thermaltake Frio Extereme, while I wait for my new block and various other parts to arrive.

Temps dropped 18° running IBT per the settings in the OP. P95 v28.5 Small FFTs max out at 88°. Prior to delidding, temps were flying up to 100+° running the Small FFT's.

Current stable OC (P95 Blend, XTU, and various BOINC projects) is 4.7 Ghz @ 1.296v (under 100% load).

I may be able to push up to 4.8Ghz now that the temps are manageable.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tictoc*
> 
> tictoc
> 
> i7-4790k
> 
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> 
> ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-4
> 
> Mhz gained: N/A
> 
> OC after delid: 4.7 Ghz
> 
> Temp drops: -18° C
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/ct2uqv
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used the razor to just get under one corner of the IHS, and then I used the sharpened credit card to cut through the rest of the adhesive.
> 
> Cooling is currently a Thermaltake Frio Extereme, while I wait for my new block and various other parts to arrive.
> 
> Temps dropped 18° running IBT per the settings in the OP. P95 v28.5 Small FFTs max out at 88°. Prior to delidding, temps were flying up to 100+° running the Small FFT's.
> 
> Current stable OC (P95 Blend, XTU, and various BOINC projects) is 4.7 Ghz @ 1.296v (under 100% load).
> I may be able to push up to 4.8Ghz now that the temps are manageable.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!







and welcome another Editor!


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tictoc*
> 
> tictoc
> 
> i7-4790k
> 
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> 
> ihs-TIM: Tuniq TX-4
> 
> Mhz gained: N/A
> 
> OC after delid: 4.7 Ghz
> 
> Temp drops: -18° C
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/ct2uqv
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *I used the razor to just get under one corner of the IHS, and then I used the sharpened credit card to cut through the rest of the adhesive.*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Cooling is currently a Thermaltake Frio Extereme, while I wait for my new block and various other parts to arrive.
> 
> Temps dropped 18° running IBT per the settings in the OP. P95 v28.5 Small FFTs max out at 88°. Prior to delidding, temps were flying up to 100+° running the Small FFT's.
> 
> Current stable OC (P95 Blend, XTU, and various BOINC projects) is 4.7 Ghz @ 1.296v (under 100% load).
> I may be able to push up to 4.8Ghz now that the temps are manageable.


in my opinion that's the best way, ive done many just like that


----------



## KnownDragon

I want to join. Doing naked die cooling.


----------



## derfer

I finally locked down the temp swing on my friend's 4770k. Switched the paste to CLP, used the old gelid paste to insulate the side stuff, and used metal washers to get the H110 far far tighter than what the mount would normally provide. Temps around 60c with AVX.


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *derfer*
> 
> I finally locked down the temp swing on my friend's 4770k. Switched the paste to CLP, used the old gelid paste to insulate the side stuff, and used metal washers to get the H110 far far tighter than what the mount would normally provide. Temps around 60c with AVX.


I was looking into that too. Have a 3770k that needs naked die cooling.


----------



## ozzy1925

anybody tried to glue die to the ihs after delid?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> anybody tried to glue die to the ihs after delid?


I used two part epoxy and glued it down before rma.

Do not glue it together for any other reason. You will need to change the paste again someday.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I used two part epoxy and glued it down before rma.
> 
> Do not glue it together for any other reason. You will need to change the paste again someday.


was the epoxy brand this?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835100013&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=6146846&SID=1vj0vts2nxlgf

and this stuff can be used on the die like clu or clp?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> was the epoxy brand this?
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835100013&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=6146846&SID=1vj0vts2nxlgf
> 
> and this stuff can be used on the die like clu or clp?


I used https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0044F9JWM/ref=cm_sw_r_udp_awd_PsNZtb0HMFMRZ3Y5 mixed a dime sized amount of each tube then put a thin line on the wide area of the ihs on both sides.

Thats stronger than the original glue though. I only advise it if u are rma it.

Its just like jb weld.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I used https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0044F9JWM/ref=cm_sw_r_udp_awd_PsNZtb0HMFMRZ3Y5 mixed a dime sized amount of each tube then put a thin line on the wide area of the ihs on both sides.
> 
> Thats stronger than the original glue though. I only advise it if u are rma it.
> 
> Its just like jb weld.


as you say,your stuff works for the dead chips,but i want my cpu to be in use after glue process .I am thinking of using clu on the die and arctic alumina on the corners .


----------



## gobblebox

I finally finished my delid last night and got a temp drop of ~10-15 C (I'll post the results later tonight)... but I wonder, is it possible that I am not getting optimal contact with my CLP application?

*Here's the only reason that I ask:*
I applied the CLP to the die only (very thin layer), placed the chip in the socket, then first placed the IHS a little further back on the chip (to compensate for the supposed forward movement of the IHS when latching), but then I realized that the IHS didn't slide forward at all, so, to make sure the IHS was centered when I closed the latching mechanism, I opened the latch again, slid the IHS (without lifting it) back to the center of the PCB, then closed the latch again.

Would this have caused any bubbles or poor/uneven contact/thermal conductivity from sliding the IHS about 1-2mm back to the center of the PCB? Might I see an even higher temp decrease if I reapply the CLP and simply center the IHS from the get-go? I'm not worried about the work involved, I actually enjoy doing it, but I want to know if it would even be necessary to begin with.

Also, I used MX-4 for this application, but I also have a few fresh batches of Shin-Etsu x23-7783D - anyone recommend one over the other for best thermal conductivity? I can't find any comparisons with specifically these 2 TIMs.

[Edit] One more question.


----------



## ozzy1925

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gobblebox*
> 
> I finally finished my delid last night and got a temp drop of ~10-15 C (I'll post the results later tonight)... but I wonder, is it possible that I am not getting optimal contact with my CLP application?
> 
> *Here's the only reason that I ask:*
> I applied the CLP to the die only (very thin layer), placed the chip in the socket, then first placed the IHS a little further back on the chip (to compensate for the supposed forward movement of the IHS when latching), but then I realized that the IHS didn't slide forward at all, so, to make sure the IHS was centered when I closed the latching mechanism, I opened the latch again, slid the IHS (without lifting it) back to the center of the PCB, then closed the latch again.
> 
> Would this have caused any bubbles or poor/uneven contact/thermal conductivity from sliding the IHS about 1-2mm back to the center of the PCB? Might I see an even higher temp decrease if I reapply the CLP and simply center the IHS from the get-go? I'm not worried about the work involved, I actually enjoy doing it, but I want to know if it would even be necessary to begin with.
> 
> Also, I used MX-4 for this application, but I also have a few fresh batches of Shin-Etsu x23-7783D - anyone recommend one over the other for best thermal conductivity? I can't find any comparisons with specifically these 2 TIMs.
> 
> [Edit] One more question.


thats the same reason why i want to glue the ihs back


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ozzy1925*
> 
> as you say,your stuff works for the dead chips,but i want my cpu to be in use after glue process .I am thinking of using clu on the die and arctic alumina on the corners .


clu/clp will need to be changed out. You do not gain anything from glueing it back. Its not more safe or anything.

All you are doing it making it hard on you when the temps start getting bad and the tim needs changed.

The clamp is fine for holding the ihs in place.

Raising the ihs and sliding it is not putting bubbles in the clp. There is no room for buubbles after the glue is removed.

Every senior member of this thread will advise against glueing it back for use.


----------



## lilchronic

i just hold the IHS still with my thumb while i clamp the latch down.

also if you leave the glue on the bottom of the IHS it wont move around as much
just remove all the glue on the PCB and around the die, the IHS you can leave as is


----------



## Valgaur

Here's what I have to say on the re-gluing process.

There's no need,

1. We delid these chips from the start to remove the heat issue and this isn't just from the TIM on the die but the epoxy on the surrounding edges as well.

2. Very complex and precise machines do that gluing process that are far more expensive than I'd like to know, so why "try" to get to that when it's going to create problems when you won't need it anyways? the IHS doesn't move under the latch and it never will under pressure, especially a heatsink.

I'm not trying to be a little stinker, but we get this thing a lot about regluing the IHS back to the CPU for daily usage and that defeats the purpose of delidding and the many processes of doing it safely, the glue is far more trouble than its worth, trust me. Leave the PCB nakey and it's all good


----------



## rwpritchett

I'll play devil's advocate. I re-glued my IHS with silicone adhesive and I prefer it that way. #1, I swap CPU's often and I don't want a loose IHS to deal with. #2, just a dot of silicone adhesive on each corner is enough to hold the IHS on, but it doesn't prevent you from easily removing the IHS again in the future.


----------



## gobblebox

Finally... here is my delid:

*Here was my work area - yes, I was that paranoid... this was my first attempt ever, thus the extra precautions







*


*4790K Before the delid:*



*4790K After the delid:*


*Here's a close up following the delid - it looks like the TIM was actually pretty even, but it was pretty thick:*


*After the cleanup:*


*CLP + maybe a little more LET than necessary on the VRMs, but like I said... paranoid:*


*And here are the results:*
*Before:*

*After:*


It looks like a successful delid! I'm pretty happy with the results - those averages in the second picture are off because I let it sit at idle for quite a bit longer before taking the screenshot. About 10-15 decrease @ load! Why is that 4th core always so much lower?


----------



## fateswarm

The only thing that happens without glue is that it may slide a bit when trying to insert (especially with non-naked) it and that to mess the application of CLP a bit. But that's probably little.


----------



## gobblebox

I should also add that the ambients in my "Before Delid" results were quite a bit lower than the "After Delid" results, so after more stressing with similar ambients, I've found that the delid has resulted in a drop of 15-20 C.

What happened to all of the activity here? Also, how are people OCing with Intel Turbo Boost disabled? When I disable it, the multi defaults to stock at the desktop... is there anyway around this?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gobblebox*
> 
> I should also add that the ambients in my "Before Delid" results were quite a bit lower than the "After Delid" results, so after more stressing with similar ambients, I've found that the delid has resulted in a drop of 15-20 C.
> 
> What happened to all of the activity here? Also, how are people OCing with Intel Turbo Boost disabled? When I disable it, the multi defaults to stock at the desktop... is there anyway around this?


it gets busy sometimes then fades, i mean we only have 25000 posts









with the turbo disabled no reason to disable it really, OC the chip set your stuff to how ya like and then in windows set the power options to maximum and it won't down shift to a lower frequency


----------



## gobblebox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it gets busy sometimes then fades, i mean we only have 25000 posts
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> with the turbo disabled no reason to disable it really, OC the chip set your stuff to how ya like and then in windows set the power options to maximum and it won't down shift to a lower frequency


Thanks, that was exactly what I was looking for! I guess I won't be disabling it then. I wish we could define the frequency range & voltage range rather than have it by default at 800Mhz - OC (4.0 - 4.9 @ 1.1v - 1.4v would be cool)


----------



## gobblebox

Since delidding and dropping about 15 at load, just a day or two ago, I've noticed my idle & load temps being significantly higher, ~5 C higher than right after the delid. I understand that ambients play a big role in CPU temps, but what would cause this if the ambients are the same as they were immediately following the delid?


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gobblebox*
> 
> Since delidding and dropping about 15 at load, just a day or two ago, I've noticed my idle & load temps being significantly higher, ~5 C higher than right after the delid. I understand that ambients play a big role in CPU temps, but what would cause this if the ambients are the same as they were immediately following the delid?


Pastes. What are they? Or maybe movement of the contacts between cooler and cpu, disturbing the peace.

A relevant theoretical guess: if a paste becomes brittle after drying completely, a shake may break it.


----------



## gobblebox

TIM on die is CLP with a pretty thin layer. TIM on IHS is Shin-Etsu x23-7783D, which I've always had great results with. Think I should go back to MX-4?


----------



## xioros

Hi there,

I'm about to delid my 4770K and have some questions:

I will be using CLU between the die and IHS. What should I use between my waterblock and CPU? Also CLU? Or MX-4?
Pros and cons?

Also:
I've picked up this video:




He also uses black silicone to glue it together again.
Worth it?

-Xio


----------



## defiler2k

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xioros*
> 
> Hi there,
> 
> I'm about to delid my 4770K and have some questions:
> 
> I will be using CLU between the die and IHS. What should I use between my waterblock and CPU? Also CLU? Or MX-4?
> Pros and cons?
> 
> Also:
> I've picked up this video:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He also uses black silicone to glue it together again.
> Worth it?
> 
> -Xio






I wouldn't bother with the glue to get the IHS back one. Saves you from having to re-delid the CPU if you have to reapply tim or check on it.

As far as between the IHS and block, if you are using a nickel block you can use CLU as it shouldn't react with the nickel however, if you are using a copper block go with something like MX-4 or gelid as CLU reacts to the copper and it will harden over time and will also stain your block and you might need to lap your CPU to get the dried paste off which would then make it impossible to get warranty from Intel on it.


----------



## hornedfrog86

Thanks, is that your CPU Batch: L420B748?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gobblebox*
> 
> Finally... here is my delid:
> 
> *Here was my work area - yes, I was that paranoid... this was my first attempt ever, thus the extra precautions
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *4790K Before the delid:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *4790K After the delid:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Here's a close up following the delid - it looks like the TIM was actually pretty even, but it was pretty thick:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After the cleanup:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *CLP + maybe a little more LET than necessary on the VRMs, but like I said... paranoid:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *And here are the results:*
> *Before:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like a successful delid! I'm pretty happy with the results - those averages in the second picture are off because I let it sit at idle for quite a bit longer before taking the screenshot. About 10-15 decrease @ load! Why is that 4th core always so much lower?


----------



## gobblebox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hornedfrog86*
> 
> Thanks, is that your CPU Batch: L420B748?


yes it is, and it looks like a good one


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hornedfrog86*
> 
> Thanks, is that your CPU Batch: L420B748?


Duude!
Do you mind using a spoiler when you quote a post with that many pictures?









*Edit
1: Edit your post.
2: Highlight the picture links in the quoted post
3: Click "Spoiler" in the tool bar (black square speech bubble)
4: Submit

Thanks


----------



## hornedfrog86

Will do! Sorry.


----------



## defiler2k

Has anyone faced stronger than usual glue on 4790Ks?

I just attempted to delid a buddy's chip and the glue did not budge. Tried both vice methods and pcb started to bow so I stopped. I offered to replace the chip but he wanted to test it out and decided against it, I wanted to keep it and see what would go first the PCB or the glue but he didn't let me. I tested the chip with him there and we were able to run without issues and I told him that if he did have issues I would replace it on the spot.

I spoke with a bud from my local Microcenter and he mentioned that they have increased returns on the latest shipment of these chips from what he thinks are botched vice delids. He even admitted botching one himself but the chip works so he kept it. I will try to get batch numbers tomorrow for reference.


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Has anyone faced stronger than usual glue on 4790Ks?
> 
> I just attempted to delid a buddy's chip and the glue did not budge. Tried both vice methods and pcb started to bow so I stopped. I offered to replace the chip but he wanted to test it out and decided against it, I wanted to keep it and see what would go first the PCB or the glue but he didn't let me. I tested the chip with him there and we were able to run without issues and I told him that if he did have issues I would replace it on the spot.
> 
> I spoke with a bud from my local Microcenter and he mentioned that they have increased returns on the latest shipment of these chips from what he thinks are botched vice delids. He even admitted botching one himself but the chip works so he kept it. I will try to get batch numbers tomorrow for reference.


Word is people have been warming up the glue in order to get it to work via the vice method. I used the razor blade method and it felt different from the 3770k I delidded. I was able to delid it but had to use a slightly thicker razor blade in order to get it to work. If you look at the outside of the silicon it looks like something shiny is covering the silicon maybe a hardener or clear apoxy.


----------



## yenclas

I want to glue back ihs, but with the possibility that in the future I can delid again. Is it possible ? What type of glue ? Thank you very much and sorry by my bad English


----------



## GHADthc

I noticed recently when I dellided my G3258 that the glue seemed much stronger, took three hits with the hammer to get the IHS to come off, unlike my old 3570K I dellided, the IHS flew off that in a single hit..


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *yenclas*
> 
> I want to glue back ihs, but with the possibility that in the future I can delid again. Is it possible ? What type of glue ? Thank you very much and sorry by my bad English


If you wish to glue it back on which I advise against in my opinion. I would get a rtv gasket silicon and use four small drops in the corners and the rtv gasket is automotive and will withstand temps. After applying put chip on towel then set book on it to hold down the ihs. Let set for the amount of time the gasket says it takes to set.


----------



## mothman

After de-lidding and cleaning off the glue and tim, has anyone actually placed the IHS back on, as a test without tim, to see if there is good contact with the die? Does the IHS sit flush with the PCB or is there a gap?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mothman*
> 
> After de-lidding and cleaning off the glue and tim, has anyone actually placed the IHS back on, as a test without tim, to see if there is good contact with the die? Does the IHS sit flush with the PCB or is there a gap?


the IHS should be just "just" above the PCB like paper thin distance if not touching the PCB. For the die contact and being flush you should put a super thin application of TIM on the die and then put the IHS on and look at the TIM covering when you put the IHS back on and see if the bottom of the IHS is concave or not. metal rulers also can tell you if its flat or not.


----------



## mothman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the IHS should be just "just" above the PCB like paper thin distance if not touching the PCB. For the die contact and being flush you should put a super thin application of TIM on the die and then put the IHS on and look at the TIM covering when you put the IHS back on and see if the bottom of the IHS is concave or not. metal rulers also can tell you if its flat or not.


Thanks for the tip..........It seems to me that the contact between the die and the underside of the IHS is the critical factor in getting good temps from a de-lid. I'll bet that the difference in chip temps is directly related to how flat the underside of the IHS is.
I have an i5-4690K I'm gonna de-lid after practicing on a couple older chips I have.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mothman*
> 
> Thanks for the tip..........It seems to me that the contact between the die and the underside of the IHS is the critical factor in getting good temps from a de-lid. I'll bet that the difference in chip temps is directly related to how flat the underside of the IHS is.
> I have an i5-4690K I'm gonna de-lid after practicing on a couple older chips I have.


the severness of that concave part of the IHS is extremely small though which is why we use TIM under the IHS to fill that. So the shape becomes somewhat not a factor


----------



## opt33

I used vice only method, with IHS against one side of vice and PCB against other, slowly turned, it was significant pressure before ihs started to slide/give....but pcb did not bend that I could see.


----------



## gobblebox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> I used vice only method, with IHS against one side of vice and PCB against other, slowly turned, it was significant pressure before ihs started to slide/give....but pcb did not bend that I could see.


I feel like this method could easily be modified by adding some sort of rigid flat object like a piece of wood/metal to extend the height of one jaw so that you can just lay the cpu flat in the vise with the PCB edge against the extension and the IHS against the other jaw. Of, course the extension would need to be firmly secured to the to the jaw that it's on, or it'll just pop off.


----------



## naved777

its been 6 months since i delidded my 3770k and recently i am noticing temps have increased quite a bit
at 4.8ghz temps rush towards 85 on all cores
at STOCK during gaming the temps are 75,76,77,77 before it used to stay in mid 60s
I used Coollaboratory Ultra so i guess its time to change it ? But problem is i dont have any CL ultra left and will take some time to arrive here. Can i use AC MX4 and hope to get some significant drop in temps ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> its been 6 months since i delidded my 3770k and recently i am noticing temps have increased quite a bit
> at 4.8ghz temps rush towards 85 on all cores
> at STOCK during gaming the temps are 75,76,77,77 before it used to stay in mid 60s
> I used Coollaboratory Ultra so i guess its time to change it ? But problem is i dont have any CL ultra left and will take some time to arrive here. Can i use AC MX4 and hope to get some significant drop in temps ?


I would and take a pic of the CLU as well I wanna see if theres anything different.


----------



## xelectroxwolfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> its been 6 months since i delidded my 3770k and recently i am noticing temps have increased quite a bit
> at 4.8ghz temps rush towards 85 on all cores
> at STOCK during gaming the temps are 75,76,77,77 before it used to stay in mid 60s
> I used Coollaboratory Ultra so i guess its time to change it ? But problem is i dont have any CL ultra left and will take some time to arrive here. Can i use AC MX4 and hope to get some significant drop in temps ?


Even though I had really great results with my delid and just AS5 the time it took for those temps to change was about 1-2weeks depending on the amount of tim used. It suffered the pump out effect and the temps got bad again. So im now trying GC GELID EXTREME, and for the first application at 4.7ghz my temps were @ 60*c max load. I thought things looked weird and then I tightened my h80i and the temps rose to what i was used too. Haven't touched it since and that was about a month ago. Although I really should mess with it xD.

MY temps are pretty much exactly what your describing with your cpu. However, I never got my 4770k to 4.8ghz stable, that requires about 1.45-1.5vcore and thats just too much TDP for me. Whats the voltage like on your chip man?


----------



## naved777

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xelectroxwolfx*
> 
> Even though I had really great results with my delid and just AS5 the time it took for those temps to change was about 1-2weeks depending on the amount of tim used. It suffered the pump out effect and the temps got bad again. So im now trying GC GELID EXTREME, and for the first application at 4.7ghz my temps were @ 60*c max load. I thought things looked weird and then I tightened my h80i and the temps rose to what i was used too. Haven't touched it since and that was about a month ago. Although I really should mess with it xD.
> 
> MY temps are pretty much exactly what your describing with your cpu. However, I never got my 4770k to 4.8ghz stable, that requires about 1.45-1.5vcore and thats just too much TDP for me. Whats the voltage like on your chip man?


thanks for the input








my chip needs 1.22v with ULTRA LLC for 4.8ghz (stable and running for 6 months now) until recently the temps went bad
Guess i can try the MX4 then


----------



## xelectroxwolfx

Holy crap was your chip touched by god before it left the factory?


----------



## naved777

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xelectroxwolfx*
> 
> Holy crap was your chip touched by god before it left the factory?


Everyone thinks so


----------



## GaMbi2004

and you are sure the room temp just hasent increased?







my CPU runs about 10 degrees hotter the last few weeks due to some fairly sweet weather! Peaks of 36 degrees C in my room, so not much facetime with the PC, hehe.. the PC holds up just fine.. but I cant take the heat









6 months for CLU to go dry, seams a bit fast :S
My CLU ran for.. 9 months? before I checked on it.. it still looked the same and my temps had not changed.

I forget.. are you running naked die? if not.. are you using mx4 between IHS and cooler?
I would check this TIM before opening the CPU.. but if you do, plz take pictures


----------



## Cozmo85

Anyone else have temp increases after transporting your pc? I use gelid extreme and prime95 small FFt will run 87c or so. If i drive my PC to work and back they immediately hit 100c until i retim . Seems like gelid cures and then sudden shocks of being in the car breaks the bond. Talking about between ihs and die. not ihs and heatsink.


----------



## Chomuco

new info

http://www.ocdrift.com/intel-core-i7-5960x-de-lidded-haswell-e-uses-soldered-thermal-interface-material-tim/


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Intel soldered the chip's die to the IHS with a strong epoxy


That's confusing, because epoxy is glue, not solder..


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> That's confusing, because epoxy is glue, not solder..


I don't want to jump the gun but you can have epoxies that turn to solder. Just has some turn to concrete. Or some that turn to weld. Maybe epoxy is the way to do it without causing thermal damage.


----------



## alancsalt

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder
Quote:


> a fusible metal alloy used to join together metal workpieces and having a melting point below that of the workpiece(s)


AFAIK epoxy solder is a marketing term used to describe conductive epoxies that have metal powder in them. Thermal adhesive?

Maybe language will shift, or already has, to include epoxies ...I'm just old and stuck in the learning of my day....


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solder
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> a fusible metal alloy used to join together metal workpieces and having a melting point below that of the workpiece(s)
> 
> 
> 
> AFAIK epoxy solder is a marketing term used to describe conductive epoxies that have metal powder in them. Thermal adhesive?
> 
> Maybe language will shift, or already has, to include epoxies ...I'm just old and stuck in the learning of my day....
Click to expand...

So my question is...did intel do a good job with this stuff? I see the black silicone is still holding it around the edges, should we be worried about it creating a larger gap between the die and IHS that just gets filled with epoxy.

Can the epoxy be disolved? reflow?


----------



## alancsalt

Good question, but I don't know... my suspicion is that heat would embrittle an epoxy?

We'll find out in September?


----------



## Jeronbernal

So I've managed to disassemble my golden seven pc, and am amidst parting it out on the marketplace for cheap. While I'm in the process of doing that, I have my 4790k out, it's already delidded, Lapped. What other things can I possibly do to it? Would lapping it More help? Lol

I'm bored and have nothing to do, I'm waiting for some parts on my list to be released... M7i Is taking its sweet time. Among other things...

Downsizing from a semi full tower to itx, because my room is packed @[email protected] gf can barely get around my pc to get to the closet lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chomuco*
> 
> new info
> 
> http://www.ocdrift.com/intel-core-i7-5960x-de-lidded-haswell-e-uses-soldered-thermal-interface-material-tim/


give me the 12 core doit


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> give me the 12 core doit


Yeah 12 core but Intel will "only" sell 8 core at max. Is the yield of the production so bad?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Good question, but I don't know... my suspicion is that heat would embrittle an epoxy?


I have been running direct die now for long enough, and I am suspicious enough of intels TIM antics, that I would cut the silicone and find someone to flow the TIM off the die...so long as it gets confirmed first that the TIM will melt.


----------



## skruppe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Yeah 12 core but Intel will "only" sell 8 core at max. Is the yield of the production so bad?


The yield is probably great, not that it matters really. Intel is just milking it as slow as possible until they get some competition.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skruppe*
> 
> The yield is probably great, not that it matters really. Intel is just milking it as slow as possible until they get some competition.


I bet it's going to be the same chip as some 12 core Xeons. Thus the 8 cores are going to be some chips that didn't turn out with all the 12 cores working. And so on.

---

How much of an improvement temperature wise is there with the change of TIM from Haswell to DC?
Same question, stock DC compared to delidded DC chip with CLU under IHS?

What TIMs are usable under the IHS that do not get pumped out and keep consistent performance for years and not only for weeks?


----------



## KnownDragon

If someone wants to donate a 12 core chip my way I have no problems taking care of it.


----------



## opt33

That is solder in the delidded 5960X, not epoxy. The person that delidded either has poor english or did not know the difference between solder and epoxy, especially since they stated soldered with epoxy. most epoxy thermal conductance similar to paste, ie no more than 5 w/mk. solder 87 w/mk. so other way to tell if solder or not is boot up prime 28.5 at stock, if the cpu runs at 100C and all of them are rmaed to intel for failure to achieve thermal specs, then it is epoxy.

And anyone that has delidded soldered chips before with too little heat and too much force will recognize the thick, bright solder at edge of that chip (red arrow).


----------



## fateswarm

Yep, it's just a die sliced in half in the picture. It proves without a shadow of a doubt that it's not paste. It's not even glue (well unless it's the of chance of an insanely strong glue that breaks the glass in half almost perfectly, I doubt it).


----------



## ivanlabrie

why would you kill that chip? that's beyond ******ed. it's a small package for a high density big core count chip. it'd be rather unlikely for Intel to use Tim instead of solder, duh.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> why would you kill that chip? that's beyond ******ed. it's a small package for a high density big core count chip. it'd be rather unlikely for Intel to use Tim instead of solder, duh.


+1, everyone knew it would be solder without having to kill the chip given 130W tpd isnt going to meet cooling specs without solder. and if he wanted to delid the soldered chip,at least heat it so you dont kill the chip....just prying apart a perfectly good chip


----------



## fateswarm

They had an intel engineer at linus and he said explicitly 'we can't put solder on mainstream because [costs] but we can on the enthusiast platform' so yeah..


----------



## Serandur

Regarding delidding, how does it affect the resale value of a CPU? I can't imagine many people would like to purchase one for anywhere near the same price they would a non-delidded one.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> They had an intel engineer at linus and he said explicitly 'we can't put solder on mainstream because [costs] but we can on the enthusiast platform' so yeah..


Do you have link to that? Sounds interesting, but I can't find it through Google.

Naturally, my response to such a statement would include the fact that Intel used to put such solder on mainstream i5s up until Sandy Bridge with no huge cost issues and today's "mainstream" i7s are at least quite expensive enough to warrant getting what i5s used to get. They're cheaping out in an area they really shouldn't be. It amazes me how they can design these incredibly complex and advanced microprocessors, screw up something so relatively easy in comparison to microprocessor design as the bloody thermal transfer interface, and then charge almost as much for them as the lower-end extreme edition chips (which now have more cores than the mainstream i7s) while they're pretty much inept for their marketed "unlocked" purposes. Thankfully, delidding is an option, but still...


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Regarding delidding, how does it affect the resale value of a CPU? I can't imagine many people would like to purchase one for anywhere near the same price they would a non-delidded one.


The value of a CPU that has been dellided is the same as one that is not. Getting rid of one might be harder than one with an IHS, but the value should be retained if it saves someone from the trouble of doing it themselves.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Regarding delidding, how does it affect the resale value of a CPU? I can't imagine many people would like to purchase one for anywhere near the same price they would a non-delidded one.
> Do you have link to that? Sounds interesting, but I can't find it through Google.
> 
> Naturally, my response to such a statement would include the fact that Intel used to put such solder on mainstream i5s up until Sandy Bridge with no huge cost issues and today's "mainstream" i7s are at least quite expensive enough to warrant getting what i5s used to get. They're cheaping out in an area they really shouldn't be. It amazes me how they can design these incredibly complex and advanced microprocessors, screw up something so relatively easy in comparison to microprocessor design as the bloody thermal transfer interface, and then charge almost as much for them as the lower-end extreme edition chips (which now have more cores than the mainstream i7s) while they're pretty much inept for their marketed "unlocked" purposes. Thankfully, delidding is an option, but still...


I bought my 4770k I was looking for one already delidded so sometimes it might even help sell it.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> They had an intel engineer at linus and he said explicitly 'we can't put solder on mainstream because [costs] but we can on the enthusiast platform' so yeah..


_Because we have no competition on mainstream and we can do as we please, milk the cow while it lasts. Why would we give you free performance with little to no additional cost when we can earn a little more and sell you worse chips at the same price?
Solder is nice but then we wouldn't have anything to "improve" to sell you a newer generation when you would run IB or Haswell for another decade._

I call it BS. The chips are not cheap and solder is not rare, it's only Intel doing what ever they like so they can earn a little more.

The moment there is a true competition they will stop doing such BS moves.


----------



## fateswarm

Yep. That's how business works. First lesson in business school is the fundamental reason of any business is the generation of profit.


----------



## opt33

In order to use solder, the silicone die first has to be metalized so the solder can attach and withstand thermal cycling, and this additional step along with higher cost of indium solder adds cost to cpu (order some indium solder vs tim you can purchase both, the cost difference is significant). Bean counters dont look at one cpu, they look at millions in savings from all of them.

Business is business. If solder were cheaper than tim, and solder process did not require metalization of silicone die adding another cost, these chips would have solder. Or if these chips required solder to meet thermal specs like 130W cpus do, they would have solder. But intel isnt going to use higher cost, higher cost process solder with a chip that doesnt require it to meet thermal specs at stock.

Like fateswarm said, first lesson in business school is profit.


----------



## Matt-Matt

I just realised there's a sheet for socket 2011 and it has a 4930k.. So they're not soldered? :O

Also the temp gains from devils canyon is amazing too!


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I just realised there's a sheet for socket 2011 and it has a 4930k.. So they're not soldered? :O
> 
> Also the temp gains from devils canyon is amazing too!


TDP is 130W, so yes the 4930K is soldered. Not to mention the person who posted the delidded 4930K had a thread discussing sanding or heating to remove the soldered IHS, and a second thread asking about thickness of ihs to sand it off.

Although what is interesting is the person says he is using artic silver 5 as tim1, which is listed as 8.7 w/mk. He likely got similar or worse temps as he failed to consider surface area for critical tim1 interface, instead made the common mistake of thinking removing a layer is always better. He removed tim2 interface (beneficial) but failed by replacing the much more critical small surface area tim1 interface with a 10x worse thermal conductance tim (solder 87 w/mk versus artic silver 8.7 w/mk). If he replaced with clp (82 w/mk) then may have seen a few C better temps providing contact resistance between solder and clp were similar.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> _Because we have no competition on mainstream and we can do as we please, milk the cow while it lasts. Why would we give you free performance with little to no additional cost when we can earn a little more and sell you worse chips at the same price?
> Solder is nice but then we wouldn't have anything to "improve" to sell you a newer generation when you would run IB or Haswell for another decade._
> 
> I call it BS. The chips are not cheap and solder is not rare, it's only Intel doing what ever they like so they can earn a little more.
> 
> The moment there is a true competition they will stop doing such BS moves.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Yep. That's how business works. First lesson in business school is the fundamental reason of any business is the generation of profit.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> In order to use solder, the silicone die first has to be metalized so the solder can attach and withstand thermal cycling, and this additional step along with higher cost of indium solder adds cost to cpu (order some indium solder vs tim you can purchase both, the cost difference is significant). Bean counters dont look at one cpu, they look at millions in savings from all of them.
> 
> Business is business. If solder were cheaper than tim, and solder process did not require metalization of silicone die adding another cost, these chips would have solder. Or if these chips required solder to meet thermal specs like 130W cpus do, they would have solder. But intel isnt going to use higher cost, higher cost process solder with a chip that doesnt require it to meet thermal specs at stock.
> 
> Like fateswarm said, first lesson in business school is profit.


Then let me riddle you this. Why would Intel make a huge fuss about the new chip with a better TIM (which is better) and change the process they use for that and materials needed in the manufacturing process. ALSO if they really were milking the cow per say, they wouldn't need to make an ES chips for testing to make better and faster chips.

I'm starting to get sick of this argument that Intel's a big bad company that doesn't care about there stuff which is completely false, I've said this before many times, The reason they didn't use Fluxless solder on the last few families of chip is due to the heat output and the density of the transistors in the dies. which caused far to much heat to quickly and caused some chips dies to physically crack from the heat stress of heating then cooling down to quickly. Which makes sense as well as right on the top of the die is a very thin piece of glass which will act just like is always does when heat changes far to quickly, it cracks from heat shock. It's not a matter of "It's super expensive herp derp derp" Wrong they have the equipment at the plants already does anybody remember that Sandy was soldered? hello nearly identical PCB size as well as die specs. They were protecting their products from breaking by sacrificing a bit on temperature control, I'd take that any day over a product that might break itself.

Also business 101 is not make a profit, it's how to keep customers and your business afloat, I own 3 business's and am a Entrepreneur as well as a marketer, it's not always about the money especially as a big company in a huge industry.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I just realised there's a sheet for socket 2011 and it has a 4930k.. So they're not soldered? :O
> 
> Also the temp gains from devils canyon is amazing too!


They are totally soldered, one CAN delid a soldered chip but it's very very risky and takes a ton of preparations to do it correctly.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Then let me riddle you this. Why would Intel make a huge fuss about the new chip with a better TIM (which is better) and change the process they use for that and materials needed in the manufacturing process. ALSO if they really were milking the cow per say, they wouldn't need to make an ES chips for testing to make better and faster chips.
> 
> I'm starting to get sick of this argument that Intel's a big bad company that doesn't care about there stuff which is completely false, I've said this before many times, The reason they didn't use Fluxless solder on the last few families of chip is due to the heat output and the density of the transistors in the dies. which caused far to much heat to quickly and caused some chips dies to physically crack from the heat stress of heating then cooling down to quickly. Which makes sense as well as right on the top of the die is a very thin piece of glass which will act just like is always does when heat changes far to quickly, it cracks from heat shock. It's not a matter of "It's super expensive herp derp derp" Wrong they have the equipment at the plants already does anybody remember that Sandy was soldered? hello nearly identical PCB size as well as die specs. They were protecting their products from breaking by sacrificing a bit on temperature control, I'd take that any day over a product that might break itself.
> 
> Also business 101 is not make a profit, it's how to keep customers and your business afloat, I own 3 business's and am a Entrepreneur as well as a marketer, it's not always about the money especially as a big company in a huge industry.
> They are totally soldered, one CAN delid a soldered chip but it's very very risky and takes a ton of preparations to do it correctly.


You might want to go view the video where the intel engineer clearly said they did not use solder for cost reasons.

And I never said intel is bad, they are a business, no reason to put solder on chip that doesnt require it for 99% users. It isnt good or bad, it is just business as expected.

And wow, please link your reference for :
Quote:


> the reason they didn't use Fluxless solder on the last few families of chip is due to the heat output and the density of the transistors in the dies. which caused far to much heat to quickly and caused some chips dies to physically crack from the heat stress of heating then cooling down to quickly. Which makes sense as well as right on the top of the die is a very thin piece of glass which will act just like is always does when heat changes far to quickly, it cracks from heat shock.


that is the most bizarre and nonsensical post I ever read.

You do realize they are soldering IVY E correct, and Haswell E right? And you do realize that there is solder underneath die regardless, right?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> You might want to go view the video where the intel engineer clearly said they did not use solder for cost reasons.
> 
> And I never said intel is bad, they are a business, no reason to put solder on chip that doesnt require it for 99% users. It isnt good or bad, it is just business as expected.
> 
> And wow, please link your reference for :
> that is the most bizarre and nonsensical post I ever read.
> 
> You do realize they are soldering IVY E correct, and Haswell E right? And you do realize that there is solder underneath die regardless, right?


nooooo never knew the E's had soder.

I will state this now, the referance for that statement was during a nearly hour long call, trying to get the delidding process and RMA'ing it to Intel Okayed with Intel, and one of Intels heads and making this easier for users who weren't very keen on the temps their products were providing and he later told me thats the reason behind the TIM instead of the solder.

I really would love to have that phone call on record for people to hear I would but I don't sadly.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> nooooo never knew the E's had soder.
> 
> I will state this now, the referance for that statement was during a nearly hour long call, trying to get the delidding process and RMA'ing it to Intel Okayed with Intel, and one of Intels heads and making this easier for users who weren't very keen on the temps their products were providing and he later told me thats the reason behind the TIM instead of the solder.
> 
> I really would love to have that phone call on record for people to hear I would but I don't sadly.


I would love for you to have saved it as well, because whoever told you that was clearly not an intel engineer. The whole reason for them developing solder as clearly outlined in previous linked intel white paper is because solder (87 w/mk) is necessary to keep up with higher power density cpus heat output. As for heating and cooling down too quickly causing die to break with solder...what???? The reason they use solder for 130W TDP haswell e and ivy E is because the chip would throttle AT STOCK unless solder is there to provide a high enough thermal conductivity for heat to "escape" via cooling solution. Paste (10x lower thermal conductance ,ie 5-8 W/mk) is what will cause the chip to overheat if they attempted to use it on 130W TDP cpus. You can fire up 4790k with high enough vcore to hit 130W tdp with paste tim with stock cooler and watch what happens.

In intels striving for power efficiency, they now have stock cpus in 80 W tdp range which simply do not need solder to meet thermal specs at stock. Only when we overclock them to much higher range do they exceed paste tim specs. 99.9% of people dont overclock, hence tim paste it is.

And funny part, fateswarm and I were partially defending intel (certainly not being critical), simply by stating the obvious that a company is delivering a product for profit for masses as all companys do, and _echoing what the intel engineer confirmed_, the chip doesnt warrant solder tim at stock specs, and they have cost contraints.

But I dont see how offering statements that defy common sense, engineering principles, and the laws of thermodynamics help intel, even if uttered by someone from intel clearly devoid of any engineering experience.


----------



## Mifec

Hello friends I plan on delidding my 3570k in the next 10 or so days and came here to ask you a few questions before I do so, if you don't mind?

Is the new vice only method the best one? I'm not doing razor and I have a vice so vice + hammer or vice only is the way to go for me.

If it is the best can someone link me to a guide, there is no vice only guide in the OP.

Any info I should need other than the standard guide info for both guides is also welcome. Thanks to everyone who decided to respond.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> TDP is 130W, so yes the 4930K is soldered.


That's not why it's soldered. It's part of the corporate products line in terms of manufacturing. The mainstream Ks are put together with low end cpus that will never need any special treatment.

This is according to Intel engineering. Not my head.

Their reasoning is it's ..costs.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mifec*
> 
> Hello friends I plan on delidding my 3570k in the next 10 or so days and came here to ask you a few questions before I do so, if you don't mind?
> 
> Is the new vice only method the best one? I'm not doing razor and I have a vice so vice + hammer or vice only is the way to go for me.
> 
> If it is the best can someone link me to a guide, there is no vice only guide in the OP.
> 
> Any info I should need other than the standard guide info for both guides is also welcome. Thanks to everyone who decided to respond.


here ya go for guide on vice and hammer method, I prefer razor myself but i believe the vice + hammer is best, others who have used them will know though

http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade


----------



## fateswarm

Vice-only and maybe some hair drying is best. IMO. But it may need some bracing with some tape since it's slightly less securely fixed on the vice.

The biggest advantage is there is no need to get a good block, to handle the block properly or to get a good vice that accommodates the block.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> here ya go for guide on vice and hammer method, I prefer razor myself but i believe the vice + hammer is best, others who have used them will know though
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade


Yes same, because if you know what you're doing you won't mess it up and it's also safer because there is no chance that you'll be sending the CPU across the room. Vice + Hammer is best if you have someone to catch it or you can not send it flying somehow.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They are totally soldered, one CAN delid a soldered chip but it's very very risky and takes a ton of preparations to do it correctly.


Yeah, I've seen a Q6600 "De-lidded" before, I thought it was soldered but after seeing that someone had done it I wanted to make sure that it was haha. I'm giving that guys posts a read now it shall be interesting


----------



## TamaDrumz76

Hey guys.

So after much fighting with bad temps on my 3770K and my new water-loop, I decided to de-lid. De-lid process went smoothly, no problems with that.

The problem is the temps have a HUGE range, which means something obviously isn't sitting right. However, in an acrylic tube system, it's super difficult to remount the CPU block...

So, the temps range from pretty good to about as horrible as possible.

Running small data set in OCCT, the cores are the following at load at 4.8GHz (which is the speed I was using prior to delid and prior to upgrading my cooling system):

Core #0: 65
Core #1: 85
Core #2: 96
Core #3: 105

Yeah, funny thing is... Core #2 & #3 seems to have the lowest idle temps. Other than the Core #0, these temps are worse than they were prior by a long shot (especially Core #2, #3). If they were all around Core #0, that would be ideal. I just spent an entire night doing this little endeavor (basically 6 hours), not including the hours it took yesterday to drain and dismantle the loop...

Anyone have any tips on how to guarantee a better mount with a de-lidded CPU so that I do not have to drain and dismantle basically my entire system every damn time I need to remount the CPU block?

I made sure that the IHS remained centered when I clamped the CPU down into the socket.

Thanks for any input.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> That's not why it's soldered. It's part of the corporate products line in terms of manufacturing. The mainstream Ks are put together with low end cpus that will never need any special treatment.
> 
> This is according to Intel engineering. Not my head.
> 
> Their reasoning is it's ..costs.


Yes it is cost. Which is why they only use solder where there is need. Intels modern high power density 130W cpu would not meet thermal specs with paste. Again fire up the 4790k with stock cooler dissipating 130 watts and cpu will be throttling, intel cant release a chip that throttles at stock specs with a cooling solution designed for that spec tdp. The reason they transitioned from PTIM to STIM was increasing power density at high enough tdp that required better thermals, see white paper quote below. Intel even has to release their 8 core Haswell E at max turbo of 3.3 with likely lower vcore, vs lower cores max turbo to 3.8-4ghz, and again that is to stay within the same power envelope 130-140W, for which their cooling solution was designed.

If intel released a 4790k with tdp of 130W, they would either use solder or they would have released a cpu that throttles at their cooling design limit, ie they would not meet their own specs.

Quote:


> In order to meet thermal dissipation
> targets, Intel introduced polymer thermal interface
> materials (PTIM) initially with 3-4 W/moK bulk thermal
> conductivity and then successfully transitioned to Pb-free
> solder-based thermal interface material to meet the ever
> increasing demand for thermal cooling capability as
> shown in Figure 16 [5]


http://www.lsi.usp.br/~acseabra/grad/2613_files/%5B4%5D%20Materials%20Technology%20for%20Environmentally%20Green%20Microelectronic%20Packaging.pdf


----------



## koekwau5

Was able to swap my poor overclocking i7-4770K @ work. Test pc died and they needed replacement. Boss agreed taking my i7-4770K so I could order a new 4790K without extra costs =)
Photo's of delid are here: http://imgur.com/UX7rYgn,OSleIv5,pp4rDcn,9K1TWPP,TDZSUkr,LO0tBbR,pVpDgYG,YbO29FM,LT23AFW,HUpAFf4

As you can see after applying multiple layers of tape and other tapes still bitemarks! This fella was holding on tight to its PCB! Way better than my i7-4770K.

Currenty running Prime95 28.5V 4.0Ghz @ 1.1V (lowest Maximus VI EXtreme can go) for over an hour now and all good!
Max temp reported 60 degrees (bloody hot upper room of the house)


----------



## hatlesschimp

Man the 4790k chip runs HOT! I thought i had a dodgy h100i or an uneven lock down on the cpu. Seriously thinking of deliding the chip and watercooling when the Gtx 880 arrives. Never delided before lol. Great thread by the way!


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Was able to swap my poor overclocking i7-4770K @ work. Test pc died and they needed replacement. Boss agreed taking my i7-4770K so I could order a new 4790K without extra costs =)
> Photo's of delid are here: http://imgur.com/UX7rYgn,OSleIv5,pp4rDcn,9K1TWPP,TDZSUkr,LO0tBbR,pVpDgYG,YbO29FM,LT23AFW,HUpAFf4
> 
> As you can see after applying multiple layers of tape and other tapes still bitemarks! This fella was holding on tight to its PCB! Way better than my i7-4770K.
> 
> Currenty running Prime95 28.5V 4.0Ghz @ 1.1V (lowest Maximus VI EXtreme can go) for over an hour now and all good!
> Max temp reported 60 degrees (bloody hot upper room of the house)


That IHS looks pretty screwed up.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hatlesschimp*
> 
> Man the 4790k chip runs HOT! I thought i had a dodgy h100i or an uneven lock down on the cpu. Seriously thinking of deliding the chip and watercooling when the Gtx 880 arrives. Never delided before lol. Great thread by the way!


Give it a knock, IMO it's worth. If you can trust yourself with a chisel you can delid a CPU.


----------



## blackmagic12345

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Was able to swap my poor overclocking i7-4770K @ work. Test pc died and they needed replacement. Boss agreed taking my i7-4770K so I could order a new 4790K without extra costs =)
> Photo's of delid are here: http://imgur.com/UX7rYgn,OSleIv5,pp4rDcn,9K1TWPP,TDZSUkr,LO0tBbR,pVpDgYG,YbO29FM,LT23AFW,HUpAFf4
> 
> As you can see after applying multiple layers of tape and other tapes still bitemarks! This fella was holding on tight to its PCB! Way better than my i7-4770K.
> 
> Currenty running Prime95 28.5V 4.0Ghz @ 1.1V (lowest Maximus VI EXtreme can go) for over an hour now and all good!
> Max temp reported 60 degrees (bloody hot upper room of the house)


Best way to get rid of bite marks is by sanding them down and then buffing the IHS. My 3770k is completely polished off and all that's left of the bite marks is a couple of small dents on the side of the IHS. Downside is you won't be able to RMA the chip if it does go since you are effectively erasing the product info on the heat spreader.


----------



## Shogon

Well I gave in



It never stood a chance









I think 4.7 GHz will be my new daily clock thanks to the temp drop lol. I can't wait for winter...









Might try higher speeds but my chip really needs stupid amount of vcore, needed 1.385v for 4.7. I have the tuning plan so I am not worried about killing it slowly over time.


----------



## jfry94

Hi guys im shaking like crazy but i just delided my 3770k and need to know if i can use this tim on it, http://www.novatech.co.uk/products/components/cooling/thermalandcompounds/0832199002080.html Im not expecting it to be the best but i just want something to replace the stock crap and last like a month 2 tops before i get some liquid pro. Btw i delided using cut up coke can.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jfry94*
> 
> Hi guys im shaking like crazy but i just delided my 3770k and need to know if i can use this tim on it, http://www.novatech.co.uk/products/components/cooling/thermalandcompounds/0832199002080.html Im not expecting it to be the best but i just want something to replace the stock crap and last like a month 2 tops before i get some liquid pro. Btw i delided using cut up coke can.


Welcome to the club! Never heard of the coke can technique lol, doesn't sound too bad of a idea if I were to ever go the slicing and dicing method again =p

Can't really give you any pointers on ceramique, but I do know that gelid gc extreme worked a lot better than when I tried noctua nth1....if it's non conductive and you already have ceramique in possession, I guess why not and give it a shot lol, I'd wait for another user to give some input =p


----------



## jfry94

I don't know what I was thinking lol. I haven't got any Tim yet basically I delided didn't change the Tim on the die or the stock cooler that came with it. I just scraped the black stuff of with a finger nail and stuck it back in my pc. It boots into windows and works fine its just very hot around 50c at idle and throttles under a load. I don't think I've killed it. I haven changed any Tim at all just chucked it back together again. I'm just not going to use it until Monday when I can get some new paste and a slightly better cooler. As for the coke can method I just used a cut up coke can the same way people use a razer to do it. CHRIST what was I thinking not having all the stuff to do it. I'm literally praying that it's not damaged I don't think it is but I can't tell.


----------



## koekwau5

@GorbazTheDragon no affects on temps and coolpaste flow. Sanded the bumps out before placing it.


----------



## TamaDrumz76

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jfry94*
> 
> I don't know what I was thinking lol. I haven't got any Tim yet basically I delided didn't change the Tim on the die or the stock cooler that came with it. I just scraped the black stuff of with a finger nail and stuck it back in my pc. It boots into windows and works fine its just very hot around 50c at idle and throttles under a load. I don't think I've killed it. I haven changed any Tim at all just chucked it back together again. I'm just not going to use it until Monday when I can get some new paste and a slightly better cooler. As for the coke can method I just used a cut up coke can the same way people use a razer to do it. CHRIST what was I thinking not having all the stuff to do it. I'm literally praying that it's not damaged I don't think it is but I can't tell.


If it works, it seems like it's fine.

You're experiencing bad temps because you didn't replace the TIM between the heats-preader and the die (by popping it off, you broke the contact between those two, and the Intel stuff is fairly dry, so it's likely not going to seat back into well at all, meaning bad contact). Scrape that Intel gunk off, replace with vastly better stuff, and then also use good stuff between the heat-spreader and a good cooler, and you should be golden.


----------



## jfry94

[quote name="Jeronbernal" url="/t/1313

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TamaDrumz76*
> 
> If it works, it seems like it's fine.
> 
> You're experiencing bad temps because you didn't replace the TIM between the heats-preader and the die (by popping it off, you broke the contact between those two, and the Intel stuff is fairly dry, so it's likely not going to seat back into well at all, meaning bad contact). Scrape that Intel gunk off, replace with vastly better stuff, and then also use good stuff between the heat-spreader and a good cooler, and you should be golden.


Ive just ordered a h100 and some coolermaster e1 thermal paste.(not going to be great but it's cheap and should work until I can get some liquid pro) also ordered a msi r9 290x lightning.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TamaDrumz76*
> 
> If it works, it seems like it's fine.
> 
> You're experiencing bad temps because you *didn't replace the TIM* between the heats-preader and the die (by popping it off, you broke the contact between those two, and the Intel stuff is fairly dry, so it's likely not going to seat back into well at all, meaning bad contact). Scrape that Intel gunk off, replace with vastly better stuff, and then also use good stuff between the heat-spreader and a good cooler, and you should be golden.


That isn't entirely true, most of the gains from delidding are due to reducing the gap between the IHS and die when using a 'traditional' paste TIM. This link shows that the stock Intel paste actually outperforms Noctua NT-H1 by a few degrees.

See here: http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=566

And here: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855

When you make the switch to something like CLU/CLP between the IHS/Die, then you get another large drop in temperatures. TIM between the IHS and your heatsink/waterblock doesn't make nearly as much of a difference overall.


----------



## jprovido

another high temp 3770k ivybridge chip bites the dust!

successful delid #2 2 out of 2 so far both with hammer method









I will oc this bad boy and see what clocks i can get


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> another high temp 3770k ivybridge chip bites the dust!
> 
> successful delid #2 2 out of 2 so far both with hammer method
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will oc this bad boy and see what clocks i can get


Good luck!


----------



## jfry94

Does anyone know good thread or guide on overclocking for a complete noob


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jfry94*
> 
> Does anyone know good thread or guide on overclocking for a complete noob


Well I must say that is a very minimalistic post. What chip and what mobo do you have? Cooling and are you delidded? Because I can point you to amd or Intel some for asrock and some for gigabyte, asus and so on and so on.


----------



## jfry94

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnownDragon*
> 
> Well I must say that is a very minimalistic post. What chip and what mobo do you have? Cooling and are you delidded? Because I can point you to amd or Intel some for asrock and some for gigabyte, asus and so on and so on.


Oh sorry I thought it was all pretty much the same. Delided 3770k cooled by a h100 on a z77 asus sabertooth.


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Good luck!


my 3770k is not a good overclocker. my i5 3570k can do 5ghz easy but this i7 3770k even after delid can only go upto 4.8ghz semi stable (maybe with more tweaking I can get it stable) and 4.7ghz stable.


----------



## pun3D

OCN name: pun3D
CPU: Intel 4770k
on die-TIM: CoolLab Pro
ihs-TIM: CoolLab Pro
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 30 C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/atp33f

Will work on getting a picture I have deleted it from my phone and will have to dig around.


----------



## jtom320

So I just delidded my 4770k. In my haste to get it back in and make sure it's working I forgot to take a picture.

Regardless as most people have reported my temp drop is insane. I'm not even sure quite what it is yet since I haven't properly run it through it's paces yet but it's pretty dang good. 20+ so far.

Also switched to TX-4 and Gentle Typhoons on all rads so I'm about as optimized as my current hardware can get.

The surprising thing honestly is that it's really not that difficult.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pun3D*
> 
> OCN name: pun3D
> CPU: Intel 4770k
> on die-TIM: CoolLab Pro
> ihs-TIM: CoolLab Pro
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 30 C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/atp33f
> 
> Will work on getting a picture I have deleted it from my phone and will have to dig around.


Welcome.

I found it weird how you said, "Was pretty easy hopefully". Hahaha.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pun3D*
> 
> OCN name: pun3D
> CPU: Intel 4770k
> on die-TIM: CoolLab Pro
> ihs-TIM: CoolLab Pro
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 30 C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/atp33f
> 
> Will work on getting a picture I have deleted it from my phone and will have to dig around.


You're in!







Salppa Dat Sig on!


----------



## jfry94

Can I join the club?







I used a coke can to delid my 3770k, it actually works really well. Now to learn how to overclocking lol


----------



## fateswarm

Wow. You are brave. I wouldn't trust that flimsy bendy thing.

Vice-only+hairdrying for the win.

Original though. Grats.


----------



## jfry94

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> Wow. You are brave. I wouldn't trust that flimsy bendy thing.
> 
> Vice-only+hairdrying for the win.
> 
> Original though. Grats.


The flexibility of the coke can was useful it would just bend if I was pushing to hard, so it forced me to take it slow. But if you hold so It follows the curve of your fumb, there's not much flex to it.


----------



## jfry94

It lives... Using a h105 with coolermaster e1 thermal paste on die I get max temps of 56-59-62-62 while running prime 95. I will get some clp in a couple of weeks.


----------



## pun3D

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Welcome.
> 
> I found it weird how you said, "Was pretty easy hopefully". Hahaha.


Lol ya I'm sure the rest of the text reads hopefully I didn't break it as I did scratch some of the pcb.


----------



## akhilv1

So I finally got around to delidding my 3570k and i dropped a whole 20 C with the use of Coollabrotory Liquid Ultra @4.6. Turns out though after I booted up windows, I have no audio although my motherboard does recognize things plugged in and in the mixer I see audio outputs. I'm using the built in ALC892 on the P8Z77-V and it used to work before so it's driving me nuts.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> So I finally got around to delidding my 3570k and i dropped a whole 20 C with the use of Coollabrotory Liquid Ultra @4.6. Turns out though after I booted up windows, I have no audio although my motherboard does recognize things plugged in and in the mixer I see audio outputs. I'm using the built in ALC892 on the P8Z77-V and it used to work before so it's driving me nuts.


Check if the onboard audio is still enabled in the BIOS.
Also try a reseat of the CPU although I do not think this is anything related to delidding.
The audio could only be broken if you damage the chip on the motherboard. There is nothing audio related in the CPU AFAIK.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jfry94*
> 
> 
> 
> Can I join the club?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a coke can to delid my 3770k, it actually works really well. Now to learn how to overclocking lol


provide the info needed as stated in the OP please








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> So I finally got around to delidding my 3570k and i dropped a whole 20 C with the use of Coollabrotory Liquid Ultra @4.6. Turns out though after I booted up windows, I have no audio although my motherboard does recognize things plugged in and in the mixer I see audio outputs. I'm using the built in ALC892 on the P8Z77-V and it used to work before so it's driving me nuts.


try resetting cmos? might be static rolling around the mobo or some weird sound settings, happens to me sometimes, un plug everything and then replug and put cmos back in as well


----------



## Perdition

I am hoping to soon be delidding my 4770k but need a few questions answered and some misinformation cleared up:


Are there any issues with CL Liquid Pro being hard to remove etc?
Also, I keep reading reviews that Gallium won't play nice with Aluminum but I'm assuming the copper block from an H100i wouldn't have any issues. Also, I'm assuming EK Nickel or Copper cpu blocks would not have any issues either.
I've also read that it drys hard as a rock. Does this mean it will be difficult to redo should I need to repeat the process in the future? Thanks.


----------



## NIK1

I have had Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra on my 3570k for about a year now. Should I be redoing it soon in case it dries out. My temps for a 4.5 oc at 1.216 v is around 29-32 Celsius idle, when gaming like WOT, it might hit 49 and prime never goes much past 65 stress testing max.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I have had Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra on my 3570k for about a year now. Should I be redoing it soon in case it dries out. My temps for a 4.5 oc at 1.216 v is around 29-32 Celsius idle, when gaming like WOT, it might hit 49 and prime never goes much past 65 stress testing max.


There is nothing to dry out. It is 100% metal, mostly gallium. The only reason to redo it would be if you shifted the IHS somehow and messed up your application.

2. COMPOSITION/INFORMATION ON CONSTITUENTS
2.1 Chemical characterization: Alloy of the metal components gallium, indium, rhodium, silver, zinc and stannous, bismuth; suspended in a graphite-copper matrix .
Contents materials: GALLIUM CAS-Nr.: 7440-55-3 EG-Nr.: 231-163-8


----------



## MacClipper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jfry94*
> 
> ... I used a coke can to delid my 3770k, it actually works really well. Now to learn how to overclocking lol


Bravo, refreshingly innovative!!!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> There is nothing to dry out. It is 100% metal, mostly gallium.


Indeed, it doesn't "dry" out, but there have been cases of copper being absorbed into the CLP / CLU producing an alloy that is no longer liquid. Joa3d43 had this and made a video about it. Apparently nickel doesn't have this issue. So if you use CLU between die and IHS then it will stay liquid, but if you use CLU between the IHS and a copper heatsink then you might have the issue.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Indeed, it doesn't "dry" out, but there have been cases of copper being absorbed into the CLP / CLU producing an alloy that is no longer liquid. Joa3d43 had this and made a video about it. Apparently nickel doesn't have this issue. So if you use CLU between die and IHS then it will stay liquid, but if you use CLU between the IHS and a copper heatsink then you might have the issue.


Possible, but more likely a precipitate from gallium and copper reaction (if any) with the suspension of copper-graphite than something dissolved from the heatsink. It would be interesting to see what that is and how it would affect performance. Easy enough to do... I can run an ICP-MS, perhaps coolabs should outsource a sample to someone to see exactly what it is.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Possible, but more likely a precipitate from gallium and copper reaction (if any) with the suspension of copper-graphite than something dissolved from the heatsink. It would be interesting to see what that is and how it would affect performance. Easy enough to do... I can run an ICP-MS, perhaps coolabs should outsource a sample to someone to see exactly what it is.


Well, I think it's interesting to know what it is exactly. I believe Joa3d43 issue came after sustained use above 80C with a copper heatsink.

Still, it's good to realise that for the layman this appears to be that the gallium does "dry out", you could also say it "freezes" I guess. Anyway, when it does this then it takes more than just isopropyl alcohol to get it off the copper surface. Then you realise why Cool Labs enclose that coarse scouring pad


----------



## lilchronic




----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*


How did it clean up? I always use BD Alcohol pads (the kind for injections) and they seem to work well on everything.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> How did it clean up? I always use BD Alcohol pads (the kind for injections) and they seem to work well on everything.


alcohol got most of it off but it left a stain on the water block and on the IHS. I had to lap it again to get it clean. after lapping the water block there is still some on the block, it's like it seeped into the copper . it will need further sanding to get it all out.


----------



## Shogon

Another success!

I didn't think the Pentium was so small on the inside, or maybe I don't remember if the i5 was slightly larger lol


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another success!
> 
> I didn't think the Pentium was so small on the inside, or maybe I don't remember if the i5 was slightly larger lol


Nice and clean one with the vice.
No traces of teethmarks from the vice unlike my 4790K =)
Gonna buy one for fun as well. I see yours is from Costa Rica.
Do they all get made there?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Not trying to spoil the pics, buuuut.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another success!
> 
> I didn't think the Pentium was so small on the inside, or maybe I don't remember if the i5 was slightly larger lol


Is this the first G3258 De-lid?


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Is this the first G3258 De-lid?


Nope I delidded mine about a month ago to practice before cutting my canyon open. I used to thin of a blade for mine though and nicked the pcb but covered with nail polish and haven't had issues. Temps are so stupid though really didn't need to delid.


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Is this the first G3258 De-lid?


I doubt it, but I wish









I bought my chip late and I'm sure I saw a few pics in here with Pentium's already de-lidded before I did mine. So far I have 4.5 GHz, 1.215v, 53C is the max temp so far with this loop in stress tests/gaming.


----------



## LagunaX

Please put me in the Delidded Devil's Canyon club









i7-4970k L352C119.

Went straight to delidding, Cool Laboratory's Liquid Pro









Cooling with a Corsair h80i - gonna have to replace the stock fans they are so damn loud!















Pretty happy with 4.7ghz Core, 4.4ghz Uncore


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Please put me in the Delidded Devil's Canyon club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Went straight to delidding, Cool Laboratory's Liquid Pro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cooling with a Corsair h80i - gonna have to replace the stock fans they are so damn loud!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pretty happy with 4.7ghz Core, 4.4ghz Uncore


that looks like a lot of clp on the die. once you put the lid on that paste will spread out and possibly get on the resistors
it should look similar to this


if you do plan to remove some of that extra clp you can just suck it back into the syringe


----------



## koekwau5

Indeed that is too much CLP!
Only a layer as thin as a newspaper page is enough.
Try remove some and respread it.
Remember: shiny CLP = too much CLP
It has to look ribbled like lilcronic's photo's show.

Indeed, when some of the CLP runs to the outside (lil chance since it'll run downwards cuz of CPU position) it could get into contact with the transistors and fry itself!


----------



## LagunaX

LOL thanks guys, I did remove some after the pic but didn't bother to retake any pics








The transistors on the side were painted with clear fingernail polish prior for protection


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> LOL thanks guys, I did remove some after the pic but didn't bother to retake any pics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The transistors on the side were painted with clear fingernail polish prior for protection


Nice work!
Got me scared tho ghehe.
Was hoping you were reading this quick enough before your chip fried.
Luckily you took measures allready.
Well done delid with vice! Better then mine vice teeth gouged really well glued i7-4790K
Pics here: http://imgur.com/UX7rYgn,OSleIv5,pp4rDcn,9K1TWPP,TDZSUkr,LO0tBbR,pVpDgYG,YbO29FM,LT23AFW,HUpAFf4#0

Forgot photo of CLP application I now see. *smacks his head*


----------



## LagunaX

I used a fat rubber band against the green pcb on one side, the other side was fine bare metal against IHS metal


----------



## koekwau5

I applied multiple layers of tape to prevent damage. Worked with my own i7-4770K and with other i7-4770K's of friends and colleges.
But this new i7-4790K was very well glued. Had to rotate it multiple times to get it loose eventually.
After that I saw the damage due to the force needed .. dang!
But it does not seem to affect temps to far.

My own i7-4770K is in PC @ work.
So when IHS is giving problems I can always swap the 2 =)
Then I'll have a 4790K disguised as a 4770K .. awesome

Edit: I now see you marked the corners where the IHS is located with a markerstift? Lawl!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Please put me in the Delidded Devil's Canyon club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i7-4970k L352C119.
> 
> Went straight to delidding, Cool Laboratory's Liquid Pro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cooling with a Corsair h80i - gonna have to replace the stock fans they are so damn loud!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pretty happy with 4.7ghz Core, 4.4ghz Uncore


I need the required information that is on the OP of the first page of this thread


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need the required information that is on the OP of the first page of this thread


Here ya go








OCN name: LagunaX
CPU: i7-4790k Devil' Canyon L352C119
on die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: NA (straight to delid)
OC after delid: 4.7ghz core 4.4ghz uncore
Temp drops: NA (straight to delid but probably at least 10-15c)

CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/1mr3qg


IBT temps:


----------



## akhilv1

Can I be added to the club?
OCN name: akhilv1
CPU: i5-3570k
CPU Cooler: CoolerMaster Hyper 212 Evo
DIE-TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 100 (WHEA errors at 4.7 so I keep it at 4.6)
OC after delid: 4.7ghz core
Temp drops: 15C+ (I was throttling before at max temp)


----------



## akhilv1

Quote:


> Check if the onboard audio is still enabled in the BIOS.
> Also try a reseat of the CPU although I do not think this is anything related to delidding.
> The audio could only be broken if you damage the chip on the motherboard. There is nothing audio related in the CPU AFAIK.


Same thing I thought, since my motherboard is a pain to get out and test, I decided to just go for a PCI sound card made by SoundBlaster. It's a piece of crap compared to the 892 but I'll have to settle for now.


----------



## jprovido

pretty dissapointed with the i7 that I got even after delidding. I only use my pc for gaming what do you guys think would be better? an i5 3570k @ 5ghz or an i7 3770k @ 4.7ghz?


----------



## ROGRO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> pretty dissapointed with the i7 that I got even after delidding. I only use my pc for gaming what do you guys think would be better? an i5 3570k @ 5ghz or an i7 3770k @ 4.7ghz?


Personally I have a 3570k and I'm perfectly fine with it. You might have just gotten a bad i7 if I had to guess.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> pretty dissapointed with the i7 that I got even after delidding. I only use my pc for gaming what do you guys think would be better? an i5 3570k @ 5ghz or an i7 3770k @ 4.7ghz?


I think you will see a little advantage with the higher clocked chip, until you run into a game that can properly utilize the extra cores, at that point I imagine that gains will be more apparent than the difference in clock speed could make up for.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROGRO*
> 
> Where would I find a fried o broken Ivy Bridge CPU to practice a delid on?


There is a list somewhere of CPUs that can be had real cheap to practice on.

Edit to add:

It was in the first post


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Hyperthreading/Single Cores

-(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
-(S-478) Celeron
-(S-775) Celeron
-Celeron 420
-Celeron 430
-Celeron 440
-AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
-AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)

Dual Cores

-AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
-Celeron Dual Core E1200
-Celeron Dual Core E1400
-Pentium Dual Core E2140
-Pentium Dual Core E2160
-Pentium Dual Core E2180
-Pentium Dual Core E2200
-Pentium Dual Core E2210
-Pentium Dual Core E2220
-Pentium Dual Core E6300
-Core 2 Duo E4300
-Core 2 Duo E4400
-Core 2 Duo E4500
-Core 2 Duo E4600
-Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
-Core 2 Duo E7200
-Core 2 Duo E7300
-Core 2 Duo E7400
-Core 2 Duo E7500
-Core 2 Duo E7600


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> pretty dissapointed with the i7 that I got even after delidding. I only use my pc for gaming what do you guys think would be better? an i5 3570k @ 5ghz or an i7 3770k @ 4.7ghz?


3570k, Not many games use HT and if they do the 3570k runs it fine anyway. 5Ghz on a 3570k is more of an achievement then 4.7GHz on a 3770k too lol. Plus you're saving ~$100 too
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> There is a list somewhere of CPUs that can be had real cheap to practice on.
> 
> Edit to add:
> 
> It was in the first post
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> 
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)
> 
> Dual Cores
> 
> -AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
> -Celeron Dual Core E1200
> -Celeron Dual Core E1400
> -Pentium Dual Core E2140
> -Pentium Dual Core E2160
> -Pentium Dual Core E2180
> -Pentium Dual Core E2200
> -Pentium Dual Core E2210
> -Pentium Dual Core E2220
> -Pentium Dual Core E6300
> -Core 2 Duo E4300
> -Core 2 Duo E4400
> -Core 2 Duo E4500
> -Core 2 Duo E4600
> -Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E7200
> -Core 2 Duo E7300
> -Core 2 Duo E7400
> -Core 2 Duo E7500
> -Core 2 Duo E7600


Heh, "cheap". When I practiced my old school was giving away celerons that were de-liddable on socket 775, along with some de-liddable P4's that I had collected over the years for keychains.

I also had some old E2200's and E2120's in my posession, I think I did like a good 8 CPU's and destroyed the second one because I was too rough and just messing around. De-lidding with a razor is quite easy. I will say to actually have a photo of the new processor de-lidded on your phone/tablet/other PC because the actual core runs one way and you've gotta be careful on those sides as opposed to the edges. Along with the row of resistors on Haswell (or newer) chips needs to be considered.


----------



## ROGRO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> There is a list somewhere of CPUs that can be had real cheap to practice on.
> 
> Edit to add:
> 
> It was in the first post
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> 
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)
> 
> Dual Cores
> 
> -AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
> -Celeron Dual Core E1200
> -Celeron Dual Core E1400
> -Pentium Dual Core E2140
> -Pentium Dual Core E2160
> -Pentium Dual Core E2180
> -Pentium Dual Core E2200
> -Pentium Dual Core E2210
> -Pentium Dual Core E2220
> -Pentium Dual Core E6300
> -Core 2 Duo E4300
> -Core 2 Duo E4400
> -Core 2 Duo E4500
> -Core 2 Duo E4600
> -Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E7200
> -Core 2 Duo E7300
> -Core 2 Duo E7400
> -Core 2 Duo E7500
> -Core 2 Duo E7600


These are all soldered on so it would be a different experience.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROGRO*
> 
> These are all soldered on so it would be a different experience.


Nope, they're not. I know that the E2xxx and the Celerons on socket 478/Pentium 4's were and some of the socket 775 celerons as I have them here de-lidded.
Why would anyone say that they're not soldered if they were?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROGRO*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> There is a list somewhere of CPUs that can be had real cheap to practice on.
> 
> Edit to add:
> 
> It was in the first post
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> 
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)
> 
> Dual Cores
> 
> -AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
> -Celeron Dual Core E1200
> -Celeron Dual Core E1400
> -Pentium Dual Core E2140
> -Pentium Dual Core E2160
> -Pentium Dual Core E2180
> -Pentium Dual Core E2200
> -Pentium Dual Core E2210
> -Pentium Dual Core E2220
> -Pentium Dual Core E6300
> -Core 2 Duo E4300
> -Core 2 Duo E4400
> -Core 2 Duo E4500
> -Core 2 Duo E4600
> -Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E7200
> -Core 2 Duo E7300
> -Core 2 Duo E7400
> -Core 2 Duo E7500
> -Core 2 Duo E7600
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These are all soldered on so it would be a different experience.
Click to expand...

I did an old Northwood P4 as practice because I had one and it was on the list. 100% not soldered.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Here ya go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: LagunaX
> CPU: i7-4790k Devil' Canyon L352C119
> on die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: NA (straight to delid)
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz core 4.4ghz uncore
> Temp drops: NA (straight to delid but probably at least 10-15c)
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/1mr3qg
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IBT temps:


You're in! Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> Can I be added to the club?
> OCN name: akhilv1
> CPU: i5-3570k
> CPU Cooler: CoolerMaster Hyper 212 Evo
> DIE-TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 100 (WHEA errors at 4.7 so I keep it at 4.6)
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz core
> Temp drops: 15C+ (I was throttling before at max temp)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're in as well! Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## LagunaX

Cool beans









Just for everyone's FYI I delidded using the hammerless vice method, which I believe to be the most brainless and safest, where once you have the padded green chip PCB against one edge and the top shelf of the metal IHS against the other edge, gradually little twists of the vice will give you your delid without the potential of cutting into the PCB or knocking a resistor off.


----------



## cstkl1

Thread is insanely long. can i ask inquire what is the consensus of using nail polish to protect the IVR on haswell??


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Thread is insanely long. can i ask inquire what is the consensus of using nail polish to protect the IVR on haswell??


Yes the consensus is to use nail polish, brush-on superglue or liquid electrical tape (ie. liquid _insulating_ tape).


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Yes the consensus is to use nail polish, brush-on superglue or liquid electrical tape (ie. liquid _insulating_ tape).


ok going with nail polish.. i am guessing clear type.. will be a awkward asking wifey for it later.

shall i assume that the liquid electrical tape has lower melting point than a hardened nail polish??


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> ok going with nail polish.. i am guessing clear type.. will be a awkward asking wifey for it later.
> 
> shall i assume that the liquid electrical tape has lower melting point than a hardened nail polish??


I have no idea. Can test them in boiling water? Since the TJmax of an Intel CPU is only just above 100C.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> ok going with nail polish.. i am guessing clear type.. will be a awkward asking wifey for it later.
> 
> shall i assume that the liquid electrical tape has lower melting point than a hardened nail polish??


I had looked that up when deciding what to use. Nail polish typically melts at 120C. Liquid electrical tape temperature 100C for the common rubber variant, up to much higher depending on product, ie 180C for silicone based LET.

But even if your core temperatures are 100C and throttling, those vrm components on pcb are going to be much cooler, probably no more than 60's or so max.


----------



## fateswarm

I used a nasty white 'provitamin' polish from the shop because it didn't have any other. It worked.


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I have no idea. Can test them in boiling water? Since the TJmax of an Intel CPU is only just above 100C.


Liquid Electrical Tape is from -54C to 204C


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## LifeDisturbens

I have a really quick question for you guys here at the Delidclub!

I'm going to perform a delid on a 4770k this weekend, and my question is what cooling paste i should use between IHS and die? Some people told me i should use non-conductive paste. Some others told me i should use liquid metal.

These are the ones i have at home:

Artic Silver 5.
Artic Cooling MX-2.
Noctua NT-H1.

What should i use? (I have read the forums and i have read the guide on the front, and will perform the delid after this guide. Just wanted a quick explanation on what i should use. Cheers!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> I have a really quick question for you guys here at the Delidclub!
> 
> I'm going to perform a delid on a 4770k this weekend, and my question is what cooling paste i should use between IHS and die? Some people told me i should use non-conductive paste. Some others told me i should use liquid metal.
> 
> These are the ones i have at home:
> 
> Artic Silver 5.
> Artic Cooling MX-2.
> Noctua NT-H1.
> 
> What should i use? (I have read the forums and i have read the guide on the front, and will perform the delid after this guide. Just wanted a quick explanation on what i should use. Cheers!


if those are just the options that you have on hand and plan to get better TIM or not I'd say the Noctua option pretty good stuff, although CLP/CLU would be best but for your options Noctua.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

First overclocked thread i didn't get bashed for not knowing things.









Also, i read about paste drying up and becoming worthless. Will it happen? Do i need to change the paste every year or so? (Just saw that people here have used the NT-H1, is it generally a better paste than Artic Silver 5?).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> First overclocked thread i didn't get bashed for not knowing things.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, i read about paste drying up and becoming worthless. Will it happen? Do i need to change the paste every year or so? (Just saw that people here have used the NT-H1, is it generally a better paste than Artic Silver 5?).


I don't like knocking on knowledge in the forum it's pointless we all have our own strengths and faults.

as for the TIM part most TIM dries over a period of time usually just depends on the batch and brand. NT-H1 is better that AS-5 (Artic Silver 5) I personally don't like AS5 at all it's outdated and I've had issues with it for a long time.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I don't like knocking on knowledge in the forum it's pointless we all have our own strengths and faults.
> 
> as for the TIM part most TIM dries over a period of time usually just depends on the batch and brand. NT-H1 is better that AS-5 (Artic Silver 5) I personally don't like AS5 at all it's outdated and I've had issues with it for a long time.


Should i skip the Silver totally? Even for generall cooling usage with my Noctua?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Should i skip the Silver totally? Even for generall cooling usage with my Noctua?


in all honesty I would as Noctua TIM is pretty good stuff.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Then i will give it a shot! Loads of testing hardware this weekend, guess i'll post the results here and join as a member too..


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Should i skip the Silver totally? Even for generall cooling usage with my Noctua?


There are plenty of great TIMs out there, AS5 is still a valid option, but I have had equal or better success with most other TIMs...MX4, Noctura, GC-Extreme.

I think the AS5 is a bit long in the tooth, (particularly with the 200hour and several thermal cycle break in period) and like Valguar, I would say skip it.


----------



## Vuzer

Guys, how strong can the chip handle pressure? I'm currently have IHS on top of the CPU, clamp down with standard retention bracket and secure with Hyper Evo 212 heavy heatsink, without the adhesive the IHS is not sitting on the PCB i think, that's alot of pressure force will it be okay for the long run?


----------



## inedenimadam

I dont know where my IHS is, or my latch for that matter. The die can handle pressure.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Should i skip the Silver totally? Even for generall cooling usage with my Noctua?


AS5 is good for general PC builds and a good backup. But if you really want the best you need to get some liquid metal. I'd use the Noctua now and then see what it's like and when it dries up/when you change your past next have some liquid metal handy. AS5 is a no-go for the core as there are better pastes out there and it's also conductive (don't use it on GPU's please).


----------



## ROGRO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Nope, they're not. I know that the E2xxx and the Celerons on socket 478/Pentium 4's were and some of the socket 775 celerons as I have them here de-lidded.
> Why would anyone say that they're not soldered if they were?


Interesting. I never thought they would be since I was hearing about the E8xxx being soldered and I tried an E6xxx which was also soldered.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROGRO*
> 
> Interesting. I never thought they would be since I was hearing about the E8xxx being soldered and I tried an E6xxx which was also soldered.


It was certain processors that were because they fell under a certain TDP and the high end chips weren't either. So the E8xxx line was soldered, as were all of the Qxxx line because of the higher TDP's (Two dual cores in one die). However the E7xxx's were pasted as they weren't made for enthusiasts/overclocking so much. I suppose it was less noticeable as the TDP on them is a lot lower then Ivy Bridge, Haswell, etc. They generally weren't overclocked as far either because of the locked multipliers. Obviously the E2xxx line was pasted for this reason also, but again the TDP wasn't really a problem as the chips generally put out less heat. I've ran quite a few of these chips and you can't really tell what's pasted and what's not based off temperatures. Because each chip is a lot different.

However in the case of the E7xxx and E8xxx that's exactly why the E7xxx ran a bit hotter despite the E8xxx being clocked higher/more cache etc.

I think that with Ivy/Haswell Intel is pushing the limits of the paste from factory and that's where our problem lies.

Just to add my experience recently with a few de-lids for the fun of it and to keep the skill. I found that the paste on these older CPU's is really dried up and temperature drops are crazy. So if you're running an E7xxx or a E2xxx chip I'd suggest to de-lid it for slightly better temps if you're overclocking it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vuzer*
> 
> Guys, how strong can the chip handle pressure? I'm currently have IHS on top of the CPU, clamp down with standard retention bracket and secure with Hyper Evo 212 heavy heatsink, without the adhesive the IHS is not sitting on the PCB i think, that's alot of pressure force will it be okay for the long run?


in terms of the pressure in the delid chips as long as the retention brackets two little notches are pushign down on those little outrigs on the IHS lip you are more than fine.


----------



## Vuzer

I kinda explained poorly back there. Its the CPU socket latch with the lever + the retention bracket that to secure the heatsink. Also the rig is sitting up there should be extra pressure on the bottom chip to handle the heatsink weight.









Also anyone interested in my vice? Is 2 chairs + a wall








http://imgur.com/wwOvX1u,ZHIU59C


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> in terms of the pressure in the delid chips as long as the retention brackets two little notches are pushign down on those little outrigs on the IHS lip you are more than fine.


If you look at some if the test done in at forum, its that epoxy thickness thats causing the issue.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> AS5 is good for general PC builds and a good backup. But if you really want the best you need to get some liquid metal. I'd use the Noctua now and then see what it's like and when it dries up/when you change your past next have some liquid metal handy. AS5 is a no-go for the core as there are better pastes out there and it's also conductive (don't use it on GPU's please).


Dries up? Do i need to change the paste between the IHS and die too because it dries up? How long does that take?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Dries up? Do i need to change the paste between the IHS and die too because it dries up? How long does that take?


I don't know, I personally haven't had a cooler for more then a year at a time so I just use new paste when I re-mount for whatever reason haha.

Yeah you will though, it won't be hard or take long. It's the same as doing the CPU twice I guess, but you've only got to pull 1 cooler off.

I have CLU or CLP (I've long forgotten) on my die and it's dried hard. I actually tried to remove it to do a better application and I can't because I risk taking a chunk out of the die and having no CPU. I do have a spare dual core but I have no money for a new i5/i7 and my PC is pretty useless without a quadcore.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I don't know, I personally haven't had a cooler for more then a year at a time so I just use new paste when I re-mount for whatever reason haha.
> 
> Yeah you will though, it won't be hard or take long. It's the same as doing the CPU twice I guess, but you've only got to pull 1 cooler off.
> 
> I have CLU or CLP (I've long forgotten) on my die and it's dried hard. I actually tried to remove it to do a better application and I can't because I risk taking a chunk out of the die and having no CPU. I do have a spare dual core but I have no money for a new i5/i7 and my PC is pretty useless without a quadcore.


I replaced my clp after 4 months. It was still the same liquid as when I applied it. The only difference was I had to lap the underside of the ihs to clean where it had slightly soaked into the copper.


----------



## GaMbi2004

I checked on my CLU after 7-8 months of 24/7 running.. had same temps and same liquid state as when I originally applied it. I ended up just brushing it evenly out and reseating..


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I replaced my clp after 4 months. It was still the same liquid as when I applied it. The only difference was I had to lap the underside of the ihs to clean where it had slightly soaked into the copper.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> I checked on my CLU after 7-8 months of 24/7 running.. had same temps and same liquid state as when I originally applied it. I ended up just brushing it evenly out and reseating..


Oh yeah mine was fine after around 8 months when I first went watercooled, but I had problems so I had to run with stock. I never replaced the liquid metal and it hardened. It's almost been on there for 2 years now. I never had any paste at the time to replace it with. I have two tubes now because I was hoping to re-do it but alas it's been done now I can't get it off.

It was pro that I used, as Ultra was used on the top of the IHS (I got one of each tube).


----------



## bern43

Had to take off my cpu block due to some flow issues. Contemplating a delid. Anybody else use the "vice only method" that's recently come up. I'm honestly nervous about this whole thing and am looking for the most relatively safe non-razor method. No bending PCB issues?


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Is it dangerous if the NT-H1 dries up under the cap?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Is it dangerous if the NT-H1 dries up under the cap?


Nope, you'll just get slightly worse temps. You may not even notice them thoguh. I've de-lidded older chips like the E2200 and old Pentium 4's on socket 478 and they still ran fine beforehand and those were over 5 years old at the time.

I would however advise changing the paste every so often, just so you do actually get good temperatures.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bern43*
> 
> Had to take off my cpu block due to some flow issues. Contemplating a delid. Anybody else use the "vice only method" that's recently come up. I'm honestly nervous about this whole thing and am looking for the most relatively safe non-razor method. No bending PCB issues?


The vice method isn't too new, I personally prefer the razor method but either way works. I'll advise you to get some old chips to practice on and see if you feel confident doing it first.

I'll also say to make sure you have the money for a new chip incase it doesn't work. But really not many of them break with the vice method. The razer method only had them break due to user error, which it was around a 75% chance for it to work. If you have a steady hand made that even higher.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Just want to fix the 100C 4.2Ghz 1.97 volt issue.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Just want to fix the 100C 4.2Ghz 1.97 volt issue.


1.97v? I know you're joking but when I first read that I almost died haha.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> If you look at some if the test done in at forum, its that epoxy thickness thats causing the issue.


i guess you didnt realize valgaur is the thread creator your telling him stuff he already knows








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Just want to fix the 100C 4.2Ghz 1.97 volt issue.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> 1.97v? I know you're joking but when I first read that I almost died haha.


unless its a typo it's probably cpu-z reading the VCCIN


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> 1.97v? I know you're joking but when I first read that I almost died haha.


Oh lol, typo misstake. It's supposed to be "1.197v".


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Oh lol, typo misstake. It's supposed to be "1.197v".


Oh haha, do you really get 100c at 1.2v? That's mad, I could do 1.25v on a SB-E with my 3570k pre-de-lid. Anything higher then 1.25ish was going past 80c straight to 100c+


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Oh haha, do you really get 100c at 1.2v? That's mad, I could do 1.25v on a SB-E with my 3570k pre-de-lid. Anything higher then 1.25ish was going past 80c straight to 100c+


My 4770k runs hotter than my OC'd 8320 @ 4.6Ghz with an U12P from Noctua. It's hard to aknowledge that my now doublepriced processor runs so much hotter than my old 8320.


----------



## bern43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> The vice method isn't too new, I personally prefer the razor method but either way works. I'll advise you to get some old chips to practice on and see if you feel confident doing it first.
> 
> I'll also say to make sure you have the money for a new chip incase it doesn't work. But really not many of them break with the vice method. The razer method only had them break due to user error, which it was around a 75% chance for it to work. If you have a steady hand made that even higher.


Just ebayed a Celeron 430 for a little test. Will pick up vice at home depot over the weekend. We'll see how the test goes. Anything to be aware of when doing vice only? I have visions of my pcb bending from the pressure of the vice.


----------



## lilchronic

RMA it, it's defective

tell them temps are in the 100c area they will accept rma


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bern43*
> 
> I have visions of my pcb bending from the pressure of the vice.


Thing is the PCB doesn't touch the vice at all, only the copper heatsink on the CPU.

You can watch this video if you like, I watched it a few times (probably because of the music lol) and basically copied what he did. Worked like a charm for me, and having the vice taped like that helps prevent marks on the IHS. I used my triple A card to scrape off all the TIM junk, but any plastic card would do nicely.




Probably going to delid my 3rd chip in a few weeks if I can convince my friend to spending the $ on my z97-p board and this i5 of mine.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bern43*
> 
> Just ebayed a Celeron 430 for a little test. Will pick up vice at home depot over the weekend. We'll see how the test goes. Anything to be aware of when doing vice only? I have visions of my pcb bending from the pressure of the vice.


Yeah, I think I had like 2-3 430's or 330's maybe. I can't remember it was a long time ago, I didn't do vice only but just be aware of the vice actually damaging the PCB itself. The video linked below was actually a good example. You may want to have a mate handy to catch the CPU/Make sure it doesn't just go flying across the room. I've also seen it be done with smaller taps and just slowly get bigger and bigger till it tears the black stuff clean off.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> My 4770k runs hotter than my OC'd 8320 @ 4.6Ghz with an U12P from Noctua. It's hard to aknowledge that my now doublepriced processor runs so much hotter than my old 8320.


Really? That's crazy haha. 8320's were always not great for heat. I didn't know Haswell was so much worse then Ivy (so it seems to me right now anyway)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> Thing is the PCB doesn't touch the vice at all, only the copper heatsink on the CPU.
> 
> You can watch this video if you like, I watched it a few times (probably because of the music lol) and basically copied what he did. Worked like a charm for me, and having the vice taped like that helps prevent marks on the IHS. I used my triple A card to scrape off all the TIM junk, but any plastic card would do nicely.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Probably going to delid my 3rd chip in a few weeks* if I can convince my friend to spending the $ on my z97-p board and this i5 of mine.


That's an awesome video, nice music too as you mentioned.

Awesome to hear that you're doing your third chip soon! Keep it up


----------



## bern43

I was thinking of the "vice only" method as the one where you have the pcb on one end of the vice and the IHS on the other and you just slowly crank the vice. The videos of that seemed really easy, but I still can imagine the PCB bending or chipping as its directly against the vice. Maybe the wood block method is the way to go.

Few other questions.

1. How tight do you have to crank the vice to keep the IHS from coming lose?

2 Consensus seems to be a harder wood is better. Should I just see if a hammer dents the wood easily to tell if it's dense? I've got a few pieces of wood lying around, but no idea whether they're soft or not.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bern43*
> 
> I was thinking of the "vice only" method as the one where you have the pcb on one end of the vice and the IHS on the other and you just slowly crank the vice. The videos of that seemed really easy, but I still can imagine the PCB bending or chipping as its directly against the vice. Maybe the wood block method is the way to go.
> 
> Few other questions.
> 
> 1. How tight do you have to crank the vice to keep the IHS from coming lose?
> 
> 2 Consensus seems to be a harder wood is better. Should I just see if a hammer dents the wood easily to tell if it's dense? I've got a few pieces of wood lying around, but no idea whether they're soft or not.


Vice only is my favorite (also in conjunction with some hair-drying to help a bit). This is because it does not need a good block, it does not need handling a block well, and it doesn't need a vice that can hold a block well. Though a video may make it look too easy since it may have it pre-delidded (force might have to be slightly more), and it's slightly worse in grip on the vice since it doesn't hold only the IHS but both a side of the IHS and the PCB's but I think that fear is alleviated if it's braced with some tape around.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> RMA it, it's defective
> 
> tell them temps are in the 100c area they will accept rma


Doesn't apply when overclocking. At stock it's doing just fine.


----------



## KnownDragon

Hey guys I don't think I have been added to the club yet. I am in the right place right? Or am I not doing something right?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnownDragon*
> 
> Hey guys I don't think I have been added to the club yet. I am in the right place right? Or am I not doing something right?


Did you post the required information in post one. If so, I suggest linking the address to the one had the information.


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bern43*
> 
> I was thinking of the "vice only" method as the one where you have the pcb on one end of the vice and the IHS on the other and you just slowly crank the vice. The videos of that seemed really easy, but I still can imagine the PCB bending or chipping as its directly against the vice. Maybe the wood block method is the way to go.
> 
> Few other questions.
> 
> 1. How tight do you have to crank the vice to keep the IHS from coming lose?
> 
> 2 Consensus seems to be a harder wood is better. Should I just see if a hammer dents the wood easily to tell if it's dense? I've got a few pieces of wood lying around, but no idea whether they're soft or not.


I did the vice only method.
Easy.
You can pad the PCB side with a fat rubber band too.
No PCB bending, it loosens and shifts before any bending if u go slow.


----------



## cstkl1

does anybody here can tell me whats the dimension of the heatsink

gonna buy those small vices.

edit nvrmind got the dimension of the cpu 37.5 x 37.5..

saw a baby vice for 40mmx60mm. think gonna get that.


----------



## Shogon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, I think I had like 2-3 430's or 330's maybe. I can't remember it was a long time ago, I didn't do vice only but just be aware of the vice actually damaging the PCB itself. The video linked below was actually a good example. You may want to have a mate handy to catch the CPU/Make sure it doesn't just go flying across the room. I've also seen it be done with smaller taps and just slowly get bigger and bigger till it tears the black stuff clean off.
> Really? That's crazy haha. 8320's were always not great for heat. I didn't know Haswell was so much worse then Ivy (so it seems to me right now anyway)
> That's an awesome video, nice music too as you mentioned.
> 
> Awesome to hear that you're doing your third chip soon! Keep it up


I usually don't like music like that, but for some reason it fit the video perfectly, or my mood at the time









Only downside is I don't want to drain my waterloop lol, it's only been a few weeks if that and the Mayhems stuff never seems to last me long enough. Also I'm hoping going with an i7 this time brings a bigger overclock, I'll be slightly sad if it can't match my i5 in core speed. But, tis the joy of overclocking


----------



## speedy2721

I just delided my 3570k and I installed my Glacier 240L but I was wondering if it is normal for there to be a 10c difference between the cores while running prime?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *speedy2721*
> 
> I just delided my 3570k and I installed my Glacier 240L but I was wondering if it is normal for there to be a 10c difference between the cores while running prime?


Normal? No. But you can check your Heat spreader and the block for flat, check the TIM, and remount. If the issue persists I wouldnt worry about it too much. I suffer from the same issue, but dont have a solid answer for why it happens. I am dellided and run naked, so there is VERY little chance that my mount is the cause. It might be a bad sensor, or it could be that one core has a few cycles earmarked for non intensive OS related tasks and is not doing the same amount of work in P95, or maybe it is that the coolest core is up against the iGPU and the dark silicon is acting like an extra heat sink...again, I dont know, but I dont sweat it too much anymore. Check for flat, check your TIM, remount and call it done.

Edit to add: In my scenario, I am banking on the cycles being thrown at HWmonitor, because I have it open and graphing various sensors and it runs like 1-2% load on one core.


----------



## gmm26

Hi, this is my first post on OCN. This community has been a great source of information, and I have spent many hours reading mod threads, reviews... you know, the good stuff









I started building my pc's back in 2012 and, honestly, it has been an extremely fun activity.Now, after having gained a bit of experience with overclocking, I attempted to delid my 4670k. It all went pretty good!










removed processor from mb


preparing vise


omg I'm really gonna do this!


yay!


lets clean this mess...


AS5 on die... It should do it for now


heatspreader ready to install




According to my DMM, ambient temperature is 23 ºC / 73 ºF

As of now, my temperatures dropped 5 ºC / 9 ºF. I should give the tim some time to cure before making final conclusions. Also, hammering the processor with a piece of wood in between wasn't working (I suppose too much energy was being absorbed) so I decided to grab a short brass bar and wrap it in electrical tape to make a wood substitute.


----------



## Leftfield2263

I successfully delided my 4770k last night and (honestly) wasn't really hard or scary. Watching enough videos of the people telling you to "use a lot of force" calmed my nerves when doing it. I went the razor method since it seemed the most controlled and easiest. I also dont have a vice and dont really need one =). I didnt take any pics but id be happy to also answer any questions for peeps since its fresh for me.

Full Disclosure: Im still waiting on my CLP to ship and in the mean time used some XSPC K2 thermal grease on die and between IHS and water block. Load temps seemed to have dropped by 10C and for the first time in my life my idle temps have been under 30C for any CPU by both AMD & Intel. Well worth it. Can't wait to see what the CLP does.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shogon*
> 
> I usually don't like music like that, but for some reason it fit the video perfectly, or my mood at the time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only downside is I don't want to drain my waterloop lol, it's only been a few weeks if that and the Mayhems stuff never seems to last me long enough. Also I'm hoping going with an i7 this time brings a bigger overclock, I'll be slightly sad if it can't match my i5 in core speed. But, tis the joy of overclocking


Yeah I know how you feel. I've gotta mate who told me to try some of his Noctua fans on my rad and I had to explain that it wasn't that simple.. Lol
He doesn't get it at all, he's still on a H110 haha.


----------



## cstkl1

Tried baby vice . Cpu hsf kept escaping from the grip, will try again with another vice.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Tried baby vice . Cpu hsf kept escaping from the grip, will try again with another vice.


My i7-4790K was holding on strong as well.
Tip: rotate the cpu in the vice to break the glue on all sides. It should come off more easily.
I kept wacking one side after I noticed there was no movement.
Rotated it once and pop!

Sadly enough I then found out the IHS had some teethmarks on it due to force wacking on the first side.


----------



## Letmefly

hey peeps, finally decided to delid my cpu everything has gone well temps aren't a issue only the vcore is abit worrying i am nearly hitting 1.5 trying to get stable 4.8ghz but no luck, at 4.7ghz at 1.44 i am stable however i am abit worried if i need to pump over 1.5vcore is it safe? Temps are amazing atm 60-65max with prime.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Letmefly*
> 
> hey peeps, finally decided to delid my cpu everything has gone well temps aren't a issue only the vcore is abit worrying i am nearly hitting 1.5 trying to get stable 4.8ghz but no luck, at 4.7ghz at 1.44 i am stable however i am abit worried if i need to pump over 1.5vcore is it safe? Temps are amazing atm 60-65max with prime.


No anything above 1.4 on air or water is exceptionally dangerous. On 1.5 it risks imminent death. On 1.45v it's already considered risky.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Tried baby vice . Cpu hsf kept escaping from the grip, will try again with another vice.


several including myself bought this small drill press table vice from home depot or lowes, cost $20 and works well.


----------



## Letmefly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> No anything above 1.4 on air or water is exceptionally dangerous. On 1.5 it risks imminent death. On 1.45v it's already considered risky.


so it doesn't matter how good the temps are it all come down to how much voltage that is used? Well based on your advice i shall leave my cpu at 4.7ghz @1.44vcore in game temps are really good barley hit 60c.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Just delidded my 4770k and put some NT-H1 on there. Atleast 15C cooler at the same ****ty clock, looks like i'm pressing forward to the 4.5Ghz mark! Thank you Delidclub!







¨

EDIT: 4.5Ghz mark 75C on 1.241V. Using an D15 and NT-H1, i will order some liquid metal next month or so. I'm so happy right now.









Gonna pump up 4.6Ghz on air and leave it there.


----------



## Shogon

I did it again.







I say if you are going to delid a "fresh" CPU, it's probably best to heat it up somehow to warm up the stuff on the die/IHS. Took me a while to get the darn thing off this time











I think I have to do some more stability testing because these voltages seem like a dream to me after years of okay chips. Maybe some benchmarks also to make sure it's actually stable for one thing, and then do some BF3/Red Orchestra 2 runs for a while (best test for instability CPU wise in my experience). 4.8 GHz for 1.23v seems laughable to me after this i5 and Pentium experience needing 1.375v or higher for 4.7. Could not go past 4.7 though.



Might try higher if this is actually stable, you know the goal is 5.0







.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Letmefly*
> 
> hey peeps, finally decided to delid my cpu everything has gone well temps aren't a issue only the vcore is abit worrying i am nearly hitting 1.5 trying to get stable 4.8ghz but no luck, at 4.7ghz at 1.44 i am stable however i am abit worried if i need to pump over 1.5vcore is it safe? Temps are amazing atm 60-65max with prime.


Tad bit high if you ask me. Even though I wanted higher I stopped at 1.383v for my i5 and I have a pretty capable loop to keep it cool. I would try and see what 4.6 GHz clock would yield you in terms of voltage, it's not much slower yet temperatures will most likely drop a bit. I battled within myself between the 4.5 @ 1.22v or the 4.7 @ 1.383v with a temp difference of 9C or so between the two. I picked the latter of course, but if I didn't have the tuning plan from Intel I wouldn't even think of pumping that much voltage into it for daily usage.


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> several including myself bought this small drill press table vice from home depot or lowes, cost $20 and works well.


Cant find that in malaysia. Sourcing for a engineering vice


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Letmefly*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *fateswarm*
> 
> No anything above 1.4 on air or water is exceptionally dangerous. On 1.5 it risks imminent death. On 1.45v it's already considered risky.
> 
> 
> 
> so it doesn't matter how good the temps are it all come down to how much voltage that is used? Well based on your advice i shall leave my cpu at 4.7ghz @1.44vcore in game temps are really good barley hit 60c.
Click to expand...

It's worse with temps but voltage alone can kill. There are several phenomena that kill and they become worse in combination. There are ways to degrade it with temps alone, current alone, or voltage alone.


----------



## MacClipper

Practice makes perfect...

Grab a few cheap G3258 and start practising, just look at the numerous success stories in this thread. Always better to teach yourself to fish... you can stop paying for stale fish thereafter.

Scruffing = inadequate preparation, tape & pad the vice well enough so it won't happen again. Wish you luck!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MacClipper*
> 
> Practice makes perfect...
> 
> Grab a few cheap G3258 and start practising, just look at the numerous success stories in this thread. Always better to teach yourself to fish... you can stop paying for stale fish thereafter.
> 
> Scruffing = inadequate preparation, tape & pad the vice well enough so it won't happen again. Wish you luck!


Don't use G3258's to practice on! Go get some of the socket 775 celerons, Pentium 4's or whatever. They'll be much cheaper and not mean much if you do end up breaking them.


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Don't use G3258's to practice on! Go get some of the socket 775 celerons, Pentium 4's or whatever. They'll be much cheaper and not mean much if you do end up breaking them.


+1 this. I have a pair of E7200s I delidded a few months back. You can snag 775s for 10 quid if you look hard.


----------



## Serandur

Hey guys, some time back I asked whether delidding my 3770K would ruin its resale value or not and was given the answer that some people may prefer to buy one already delidded, but specifically in the case of my 3770K, it's not a great overclocker (needs about 1.28-1.29v for 4.5 GHz stable) and I was actually pretty set on upgrading to either Skylake, Skylake-E, or Cannonlake (while hopefully selling my 3770K).

So, I'd just like to get some advice or speculation from anyone in here. If I were to sell my 3770K in a year or two through, say, ebay or any enthusiast sites, how might delidding affect it? I'm a bit torn on whether to go through with delidding it or not for this reason. Thanks.


----------



## B rad

OCN name: B rad
CPU: 4790K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid:5000
Temp drops:18c @ 4.7Ghz
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/bxjp2z







So am I in the club?


----------



## B rad

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Hey guys, some time back I asked whether delidding my 3770K would ruin its resale value or not and was given the answer that some people may prefer to buy one already delidded, but specifically in the case of my 3770K, it's not a great overclocker (needs about 1.28-1.29v for 4.5 GHz stable) and I was actually pretty set on upgrading to either Skylake, Skylake-E, or Cannonlake (while hopefully selling my 3770K).
> 
> So, I'd just like to get some advice or speculation from anyone in here. If I were to sell my 3770K in a year or two through, say, ebay or any enthusiast sites, how might delidding affect it? I'm a bit torn on whether to go through with delidding it or not for this reason. Thanks.


A year or 2 from now your 3770K will not be affected much from delidding IMO. Because it's over all value will be low since it will be older tech. Now if it was a great overclocker might be a different story. But if it was a great overclocker you wouldn't be thinking about delidding it.
Also keep in mind you might kill that 3770K attempting to delid it. Which would make it worthless.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Hey guys, some time back I asked whether delidding my 3770K would ruin its resale value or not and was given the answer that some people may prefer to buy one already delidded, but specifically in the case of my 3770K, it's not a great overclocker (needs about 1.28-1.29v for 4.5 GHz stable) and I was actually pretty set on upgrading to either Skylake, Skylake-E, or Cannonlake (while hopefully selling my 3770K).
> 
> So, I'd just like to get some advice or speculation from anyone in here. If I were to sell my 3770K in a year or two through, say, ebay or any enthusiast sites, how might delidding affect it? I'm a bit torn on whether to go through with delidding it or not for this reason. Thanks.


You should be fine as long as the pcb doesn't get any marks during the delidding process itself, not sure on value or anything like that in that amount of time though








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B rad*
> 
> OCN name: B rad
> CPU: 4790K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid:5000
> Temp drops:18c @ 4.7Ghz
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/bxjp2z
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So am I in the club?


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## LifeDisturbens

I think something really bad just happend to my delid.

As stated before, it clocked happely 4.5Ghz 70C without any problems. But now, several days later. It's horrible?


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







What actually happend?

EDIT: It draws 100C instant with burntest. Someone that knows what anything about this?


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> I think something really bad just happend to my delid.
> 
> As stated before, it clocked happely 4.5Ghz 70C without any problems. But now, several days later. It's horrible?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What actually happend?
> 
> EDIT: It draws 100C instant with burntest. Someone that knows what anything about this?


The tim under the lid failed?


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> The tim under the lid failed?


Using NT-H1 at the moment. What do you mean by failed? Should i replace it with the same TIM?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> The tim under the lid failed?
> 
> 
> 
> Using NT-H1 at the moment. What do you mean by failed? Should i replace it with the same TIM?
Click to expand...

This sounds like a pump on a h100 failing, but I see you are using a tower cooler. Check your mount. Check your Vcore, check if you are using adaptive


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> I did the vice only method.
> Easy.
> You can pad the PCB side with a fat rubber band too.
> No PCB bending, it loosens and shifts before any bending if u go slow.


Vise only exerts way more pressure than using a wood block and a hammer. You can put a crazy amount of pressure through a vise.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Using NT-H1 at the moment. What do you mean by failed? Should i replace it with the same TIM?


Did you take pictures or video, especially of the TIM application? Sounds like you have very little contact with the TIM.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Did you take pictures or video, especially of the TIM application? Sounds like you have very little contact with the TIM.


I didnt really know how to proper apply the TIM under the lid. We made a thin stripe from one short end to the other, and spread it out a bit with the top of the TIM tube. Then we placed the CPU in the socket, put the lid on. And since it worked just fine when we tested it afterwards and overclocked it we didnt put much thought to it. How do you get the maximal contact with the TIM?

EDIT: Something like this.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> This sounds like a pump on a h100 failing, but I see you are using a tower cooler. Check your mount. Check your Vcore, check if you are using adaptive


The V-core is the same, tested without adaptive and didnt help. Did a quick inspect of the mount, sits just fine and sturdy.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

I have only used regular Tim under the lid temporarily, and I put a stripe down the middle, not very thick, and then installed the IHS back on and bolted everything back in. I only spread the cllp when I applied it, because there is no other way to apply it. I would suggest pulling everything back out, taking a picture each and every time you remove another part, until you get everything exposed. Once you get there, clean everything up, and start over.

What may have happened, possibly, was uneven pressure caused the material to pump out of one side. This is why it will be important to have pictures as you progress, so you can look back and see what happened.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I have only used regular Tim under the lid temporarily, and I put a stripe down the middle, not very thick, and then installed the IHS back on and bolted everything back in. I only spread the cllp when I applied it, because there is no other way to apply it. I would suggest pulling everything back out, taking a picture each and every time you remove another part, until you get everything exposed. Once you get there, clean everything up, and start over.
> 
> What may have happened, possibly, was uneven pressure caused the material to pump out of one side. This is why it will be important to have pictures as you progress, so you can look back and see what happened.


Thanks for the help, i will look in to it! Posting results when i get around doing it. (Need some cleaning material. I have nothing to remove the TIM with, and i guess paper wont work lol).


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> Vise only exerts way more pressure than using a wood block and a hammer. You can put a crazy amount of pressure through a vise.


The pressure is on the black sealant, the sealant will give before the PCB bends.
At least that is what I saw personally.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Thanks for the help, i will look in to it! Posting results when i get around doing it. (Need some cleaning material. I have nothing to remove the TIM with, and i guess paper wont work lol).


QTips initially, coffee filters to clean up at the end, and moisten each with rubbing alcohol. The higher the percentage, the better.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> QTips initially, coffee filters to clean up at the end, and moisten each with rubbing alcohol. The higher the percentage, the better.


I have some ArtiClean if that works, because the ammount of alcohol we have here is pretty small at the moment. I have Qtips and filters though.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> Vise only exerts way more pressure than using a wood block and a hammer. You can put a crazy amount of pressure through a vise.


The vice will put exactly the amount of pressure to dislodge the adhesive and no more, because once you surpass the force of the adhesive, the IHS slides and vice pressure is gone. Same with the hammer. So either method is going to put the same amount of pressure, which is whatever is required to overcome the adhesive and move ihs. Just the vice is slower and more controlled, and when you are turning the vice, you can feel the ihs give and vice becomes loose.


----------



## akhilv1

So I recently came across an old broken core i5-2310 Sandy Bridge CPU that someone tried to delid without heat and ripped the silicon off the IC. This gave me an idea, how would the Ivy Bridge CPU do when it was soldered with flux less solder? To explore this phenomenon, I came up with a plan, get 2 identical Core 2 Duo E2xxx CPUs and a coupe crappy soldered pentiums (for IHS with prepared solder) and test the the temperature difference between the flux less soldered, unsoldered, flux soldered, and TIM replaced CPUs and see if desoldering a cpu doesn't kill it. In the process of forming this hypothesis, I figured out an efficient way to get the solder nicely onto the IHS. Here is my research so far for the extraction of the i5-2310. If the testing with the E2xxx goes well and warrants a high enough difference between flux less, flux and CLU, I might take the chance and solder my 3570K with the soldered IHS.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> I have some ArtiClean if that works, because the ammount of alcohol we have here is pretty small at the moment. I have Qtips and filters though.


That is perfect.


----------



## Valgaur

@LifeDisturbens

take the cpu out and don't clean it right away take pictures for us to see what exactly happened with your TIM and or bracket this way we can see clearly what your dealing with


----------



## ROGRO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> So I recently came across an old broken core i5-2310 Sandy Bridge CPU that someone tried to delid without heat and ripped the silicon off the IC. This gave me an idea, how would the Ivy Bridge CPU do when it was soldered with flux less solder? To explore this phenomenon, I came up with a plan, get 2 identical Core 2 Duo E2xxx CPUs and a coupe crappy soldered pentiums (for IHS with prepared solder) and test the the temperature difference between the flux less soldered, unsoldered, flux soldered, and TIM replaced CPUs and see if desoldering a cpu doesn't kill it. In the process of forming this hypothesis, I figured out an efficient way to get the solder nicely onto the IHS. Here is my research so far for the extraction of the i5-2310. If the testing with the E2xxx goes well and warrants a high enough difference between flux less, flux and CLU, I might take the chance and solder my 3570K with the soldered IHS.


Nice job akhilv1! Keep us posted on the progress


----------



## LagunaX

Yes, if the results are good I'll be mailing u my 3770k for you to solder!


----------



## akhilv1

false
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Yes, if the results are good I'll be mailing u my 3770k for you to solder!


We'll see. For now, I just hope that it doesn't fry the CPU when I heat up the IHS to resolder as that's my main concern.


----------



## akhilv1

I was doing further research on my little experiment, and I ran across this:
Quote:


> *Solder Alloy Selection*
> Thermal expansion of components in a thermal assembly may stress solder TIMs. For this reason, brittle alloys should not be used as thermal interface materials. Bismuth containing alloys are especially poor choices because of their low thermal conductivity and brittle nature.
> Au/Sn alloys handle stress well, although they may not be soft enough for some applications where the heated materials expand at markedly different rates. It is important to choose a solder that will be able to compensate for CTE mismatch. Design of the solder thermal interface requires understanding the interconnect materials to minimize the effects of intermetallic formation and performance degradation. Additionally, the solder must provide for the compliance of the thermal expansion mismatch between the semiconductor and the heat sink. Solder alloys with a range of mechanical strength from <300 psi to >20,000 psi and can be tailored to the strength or compliance needed for the application.
> Concerning interface compliance, indium may be the best solder to use as a thermal interface. Pure indium metal provides a unique combination of high conductivity (86 W/m-oC) and compliance (60 psi shear flow stress and no work hardening). Indium is applied in the mechanical sealing of metallic and non-metallic surfaces with excellent integrity. Since indium will wet to non-metallic substrates, it is especially well suited for use against many materials that are commonly
> used in semiconductor packages. This mixture
> of properties makes indium uniquely suited
> to thermal interface solutions with or without reflowing. Indium can also be cold welded in applications where normal soldering temperatures are detrimental to the device.(From a PDF about TIM released by the Indium Corporation)


I wonder if Intel is using a pure Indium or Indium based flux less solder and if I don't need to jump through hoops such as deluding old Pentium 4's to acquire the required solder.


----------



## fateswarm

Hrm. I wonder if it will burn the glass at the temperatures most soldering irons operate.


----------



## Wirerat

I bet intel uses some form of colder soldering to keep from damaging the silicon.
http://science.howstuffworks.com/cold-heat.htm

Or the type of solder they use simply doesnt require much heat.

I work electronics for a living. Aviation electronics to be exact and regular fluxless solder is definitely going to scorch a silicon die.


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I bet intel uses some form of colder soldering to keep from damaging the silicon.
> http://science.howstuffworks.com/cold-heat.htm
> 
> Or the type of solder they use simply doesnt require much heat.
> 
> I work electronics for a living. Aviation electronics to be exact and regular fluxless solder is definitely going to scorch a silicon die.


Thanks for the input. That sounds legit. Now I wonder if most people that might try to use regular solder would still succeed since it may survive with a few micrometers of glass burnt.


----------



## opt33

Intels solder melts at 157C, same white paper linked before with conductivity of their indium solder. And there are machines that attach IHS with solder and ramp the temp up to melt the solder in 30 seconds using directed microwaves, it does a rack of cpus at once. They sell those machines and list specs on their sites, but too long ago cant remember their names. Silicon doesnt heat near as well with microwaves as does solder. The silicon die is metalized with microthin plating, solder attaches to microthin metal plating on silicon. Silicon melts at 1,414C. So 30 seconds exposed to 160C temps doesnt do anything to silicon. And many, including myself have removed soldered IHS with blowtorches melting solder, cpu still works fine.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> Intels solder melts at 157C, same white paper linked before with conductivity of their indium solder. And there are machines that attach IHS with solder and ramp the temp up to melt the solder in 30 seconds using directed microwaves, it does a rack of cpus at once. They sell those machines and list specs on their sites, but too long ago cant remember their names. Silicon doesnt heat near as well with microwaves as does solder. The silicon die is metalized with microthin plating, solder attaches to microthin metal plating on silicon. Silicon melts at 1,414C. So 30 seconds exposed to 160C temps doesnt do anything to silicon. And many, including myself have removed soldered IHS with blowtorches melting solder, cpu still works fine.


if I needed something better than clp I would go direct die. Direct die is superior to solder. I think direct die is even less risky.

I am very interested in it(solder) being done though.


----------



## bern43

Off to Home Depot to buy my vise tonight. Any suggestions for what to look for? Any old vise will work? I'll probably do the deed tonight or tomorrow and I'll take some pictures to document the hopeful success.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> if I needed something better than clp I would go direct die. Direct die is superior to solder. I think direct die is even less risky.
> 
> I am very interested in it(solder) being done though.


If you remove solder, and go bare die with 40 w/mk liquid metal tim, then yes you will get better temps, but not by much, just a few C, since the gradient across 87 w/mk solder and 400 w/mk copper isnt much.

If you remove solder, and go bare die with 5 w/mk mx2, you will get a larger spread typically of core temps, and slightly worse temps, because it is less efficient to cool hot spots on die with very low surface area at 5 w/mk, versus use the IHS to spread heat to larger surface area with solder/copper prior to running into piss poor thermal conductivity user tim with 15x lower bulk thermals and multiples lower contact resistance. Two people have failed to produce better temps with mx2 direct die vs solder using calibrated probes to accurately measure water to 0.1C, I was one of them. Fallwind on Xtreme did one better and tried to cool the die directly with water, even more of a complete failure in surface area, trying to cool die with 0.6 w/mk water with no surface area, complete disaster, stock was near throttling.


----------



## akhilv1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> Intels solder melts at 157C, same white paper linked before with conductivity of their indium solder. And there are machines that attach IHS with solder and ramp the temp up to melt the solder in 30 seconds using directed microwaves, it does a rack of cpus at once. They sell those machines and list specs on their sites, but too long ago cant remember their names. Silicon doesnt heat near as well with microwaves as does solder. The silicon die is metalized with microthin plating, solder attaches to microthin metal plating on silicon. Silicon melts at 1,414C. So 30 seconds exposed to 160C temps doesnt do anything to silicon. And many, including myself have removed soldered IHS with blowtorches melting solder, cpu still works fine.


I plan on using eutectic In52Sn48 that has a melting point of 118C in the final test because i don't have the equipment to finely control the temperature, and with this, I wouldn't have to risk shattering the die because of quick expansion.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> I plan on using eutectic In52Sn48 that has a melting point of 118C in the final test because i don't have the equipment to finely control the temperature, and with this, I wouldn't have to risk shattering the die because of quick expansion.


Post your results if you do it, would be kind of cool to see one soldered and see the temp results.


----------



## akhilv1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> Post your results if you do it, would be kind of cool to see one soldered and see the temp results.


Thats the plan, I should have everything I need by Monday, and then I'll be doing some experiments with Core 2 Duos.


----------



## Vario

Do you have a jig to make sure the lid goes down level?


----------



## akhilv1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> Do you have a jig to make sure the lid goes down level?


I'm trying to work something out for that, any ideas on what I could do? the best idea i have so far is to heat it up using a kitchen stove and gently place i on and center it while the solder is cooling or to place the solder on the die and heat it up and place the IHS on top of that.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> I'm trying to work something out for that, any ideas on what I could do? the best idea i have so far is to heat it up using a kitchen stove and gently place i on and center it while the solder is cooling or to place the solder on the die and heat it up and place the IHS on top of that.


I would suspect that the solder would solidify FAST when putting the cold IHS back on the DIE with melted solder on top..

The stove idea aint half bad!
I would place the IHS on the stove till the solder liquifies, turn off the stove, but leave the IHS on it! place the chip "in" the IHS and let it cool slowly.. that should give you plenty of time to make sure the IHS is centered.
(Didnt understand what you meant "gently place i on and center it while the solder is cooling" place the IHS on the chip? or the chip on the IHS? if the latter, then I just suggested the same thing as you did, do'h









You could also make a frame for the IHS to lie in as the solder is heated, and a wider frame on top of that for the PCB.. that way it will be dead centered as soon as you put "on" the PCB.

Keep us updated!


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> If you remove solder, and go bare die with 40 w/mk liquid metal tim, then yes you will get better temps, but not by much, just a few C, since the gradient across 87 w/mk solder and 400 w/mk copper isnt much.
> 
> If you remove solder, and go bare die with 5 w/mk mx2, you will get a larger spread typically of core temps, and slightly worse temps, because it is less efficient to cool hot spots on die with very low surface area at 5 w/mk, versus use the IHS to spread heat to larger surface area with solder/copper prior to running into piss poor thermal conductivity user tim with 15x lower bulk thermals and multiples lower contact resistance. Two people have failed to produce better temps with mx2 direct die vs solder using calibrated probes to accurately measure water to 0.1C, I was one of them. Fallwind on Xtreme did one better and tried to cool the die directly with water, even more of a complete failure in surface area, trying to cool die with 0.6 w/mk water with no surface area, complete disaster, stock was near throttling.


I switched my mounting hardware to straight studs with nuts and plastic washers. I was going to mount my h110 bare die but my temps on non synthetic loads are 55c.

Running ibt one or two cores hit 70c. Thats very good temps to me. So I havent removed the clamp and tried bare die yet but the better mounting hardware is still an improvement.



Good luck with the solder!!!


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bern43*
> 
> Off to Home Depot to buy my vise tonight. Any suggestions for what to look for? Any old vise will work? I'll probably do the deed tonight or tomorrow and I'll take some pictures to document the hopeful success.


The cheapest $20 vise worked for me (from Lowes) with the hammerless technique as all you have to do is turn.
If you are doing a hammer technique, then you need something that can clip to a table or surface if it is not heavy enuf.


----------



## bern43

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> The cheapest $20 vise worked for me (from Lowes) with the hammerless technique as all you have to do is turn.
> If you are doing a hammer technique, then you need something that can clip to a table or surface if it is not heavy enuf.


Might go that route. My work bench actually has an old vice with wood clamps on it that I may try with my "practice" cpu that I got off ebay. As long as I can get the thing to clamp, I'm assuming it should still work. We shall see.


----------



## akhilv1

I was bored today so I decided to see how well the solder I had lying around would work with my stove idea. Given the fact that I'm not willing to risk my 3570K just yet and I don't have any of the 775 test CPUs yet, I just wedded around with the IHS of the i5-2310 that i had in the last post. When it came to solder, I had 2 types of really generic solder lying around that I got at surplus store both of which have rosin cores, the first gets quite hard after being used which I concluded was a Bismuth/Lead containing solder which is a no go due to the expansion while heating and the brittleness of the solder. The other solder I have is a softer solder that flows much neater than the bismuth solder and remains relatively pliable after being used which I concluded is Indium based since the package it came in stated that it was lead free. The second was my choice for todays test of how well the stove would perform for desoldering CPUs.

As I said, it's quite the generic solder:


The IHS after adding additional solder:


Since the rosin floats on top after melting, I was able to push it off to one side with a razor to get a mirror finish on the solder itself. then I tried to suck up as much rosin and dirty solder as possible with a soldering pump which due to the sheer amount of solder, clogged it.

After cooling, the solder had quite a lackluster finish:


So I decided to buff it up a little to get any overlaying rosin off:


Then I scraped it to get the rest of the rosin from the edges of the IHS:


----------



## akhilv1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bern43*
> 
> Might go that route. My work bench actually has an old vice with wood clamps on it that I may try with my "practice" cpu that I got off ebay. As long as I can get the thing to clamp, I'm assuming it should still work. We shall see.


I don't know why people use the vice method, but I'd rather just use the razor method with either an X-Acto knife or something sharp like that. The vice method requires me to go out and buy stuff while I don't have to for the razor.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> I don't know why people use the vice method, but I'd rather just use the razor method with either an X-Acto knife or something sharp like that. The vice method requires me to go out and buy stuff while I don't have to for the razor.


Hehe.. for me its the other way around.. Why go out and buy a deadly weapon when I can just use my vice and a harmless hammer?


Joker pic.. I did not use that mallet next to the chip.. also the vice wasnt any good for this particular job, so went to the workshop and used the industrial bench mounted vice instead







.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hehe.. for me its the other way around.. Why go out and buy a deadly weapon when I can just use my vice and a harmless hammer?
> 
> 
> Joker pic.. I did not use that mallet next to the chip.. also the vice wasnt any good for this particular job, so went to the workshop and used the industrial bench mounted vice instead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Yup, same for me. Vice is free. I'd have to go buy razors and I know I'm not doing that with a perfectly good hammer and vice laying around.

Actually, I did the job on my 3570k with a furniture clamp instead of a vice. Just clamped it in there and... smack. Job done. No damage.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I was bored today so I decided to see how well the solder I had lying around would work with my stove idea. Given the fact that I'm not willing to risk my 3570K just yet and I don't have any of the 775 test CPUs yet, I just wedded around with the IHS of the i5-2310 that i had in the last post. When it came to solder, I had 2 types of really generic solder lying around that I got at surplus store both of which have rosin cores, the first gets quite hard after being used which I concluded was a Bismuth/Lead containing solder which is a no go due to the expansion while heating and the brittleness of the solder. The other solder I have is a softer solder that flows much neater than the bismuth solder and remains relatively pliable after being used which I concluded is Indium based since the package it came in stated that it was lead free. The second was my choice for todays test of how well the stove would perform for desoldering CPUs.
> 
> As I said, it's quite the generic solder:
> 
> 
> The IHS after adding additional solder:
> 
> 
> Since the rosin floats on top after melting, I was able to push it off to one side with a razor to get a mirror finish on the solder itself. then I tried to suck up as much rosin and dirty solder as possible with a soldering pump which due to the sheer amount of solder, clogged it.
> 
> After cooling, the solder had quite a lackluster finish:
> 
> 
> So I decided to buff it up a little to get any overlaying rosin off:
> 
> 
> Then I scraped it to get the rest of the rosin from the edges of the IHS:


Have you tried putting one back together yet?


----------



## akhilv1

I don't have any sacrificial CPUs to use so I haven't tried yet.


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> I don't have any sacrificial CPUs to use so I haven't tried yet.


You can buy some practice CPUs for around $5 on ebay that have glued lids. Look for model # Celeron 420.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> You can buy some practice CPUs for around $5 on ebay that have glued lids. Look for model # Celeron 420.


I didn't even realize that there was a 420.. Hahaha, that's amazing.

Depending on how old you are/where you work your school/work could be throwing away old PC's. This is the best place because it's generally free and you have a system to test your de-lidded chips on and you can sell off/keep the other stuff too.

Some Pentium 4's are glued too, I'm sure there's someone on here selling some old P4's.

EDIT: Oh wow...


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> That is perfect.


I've gathered pictures. And i hope i did something right, atleast.

The pictures are taken from the bottom and up.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## koekwau5

Nice delid! PCB almost perfect clean =)

If you got some spare time, get your CPU out again and look under the IHS.
See how the coolpaste is located.
From the pictures it look like a pretty thick line which might be a lil' bit too much.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Nice delid! PCB almost perfect clean =)
> 
> If you got some spare time, get your CPU out again and look under the IHS.
> See how the coolpaste is located.
> From the pictures it look like a pretty thick line which might be a lil' bit too much.


It was too much, so i took it off and removed and put not as much. It's hard with the tube since it spits out really much. I think im going for some Liquid Ultra for the next run.










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Alltough i got higher temps now, the paste maybe doesn't fail in the long run?


----------



## koekwau5

Which paste you using?
Looks like Arctic Silver 5.
Some paste need some time to spread out.
AS5 could take up to a month for example.

Edit: And for the speed those temps aint bad at all!! Considering you are using air cooling you are doing very well! You are getting close to AIO watercooler temps!


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I didn't even realize that there was a 420.. Hahaha, that's amazing.
> 
> Depending on how old you are/where you work your school/work could be throwing away old PC's. This is the best place because it's generally free and you have a system to test your de-lidded chips on and you can sell off/keep the other stuff too.
> 
> Some Pentium 4's are glued too, I'm sure there's someone on here selling some old P4's.
> 
> EDIT: Oh wow...


When I delidded a 3570k I did 4 420s as practice. The hammer/vice was much easier than the blade. I did 2 with blade and 2 with hammer/vice.


----------



## lilchronic

in my opinion it pointless to delid if you're not going to use CLP / CLU.


----------



## moccor

How do yous mount aftermarket HSF or CLC's to a delidded CPU safely? You can't all be using waterblocks, can you? haha


----------



## Wirerat

u mean direct die mounting?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *moccor*
> 
> How do yous mount aftermarket HSF or CLC's to a delidded CPU safely? You can't all be using waterblocks, can you? haha


The IHS goes back on. It looks exactly like before the delidding when you look at the CPU in the socket.

That black glue getting cleaned off after delidding makes the IHS sit directly on the die. That's a lot of where the temperature improvement comes from. Some more improvement comes from using that "Liquid Ultra" metal stuff instead of normal paste on the die (under the IHS).


----------



## Leftfield2263

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Hey guys, some time back I asked whether delidding my 3770K would ruin its resale value or not and was given the answer that some people may prefer to buy one already delidded, but specifically in the case of my 3770K, it's not a great overclocker (needs about 1.28-1.29v for 4.5 GHz stable) and I was actually pretty set on upgrading to either Skylake, Skylake-E, or Cannonlake (while hopefully selling my 3770K).
> 
> So, I'd just like to get some advice or speculation from anyone in here. If I were to sell my 3770K in a year or two through, say, ebay or any enthusiast sites, how might delidding affect it? I'm a bit torn on whether to go through with delidding it or not for this reason. Thanks.


I delid my Haswell chip because Im keeping for at least 3+ years. So with that in mind (IMO) I wouldn't touch it for skylake if you're planning on getting a chip as soon as it's released. If you're planning on holding on to your 3770k for two more years, then I think it would be worth it. FYI 3770k is currenty being sold on EBay at about $100 under retail value. In a year, it will be a bit more. It really depends on how much you are trying to get from the sale of your chip. If $$ ain't the issue then I'd say go for it. Delid it. Keep in mind that before selling it you may want to reapply some adhesive (like the one you scrape off) so the chip literally isn't in pieces.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Which paste you using?
> Looks like Arctic Silver 5.
> Some paste need some time to spread out.
> AS5 could take up to a month for example.
> 
> Edit: And for the speed those temps aint bad at all!! Considering you are using air cooling you are doing very well! You are getting close to AIO watercooler temps!


Using HT-H1, going for Liquid Ultra when i get it next month or so. And it's a D15, it beats all the AIO watercoolers in all tests. (And don't even get me started on the ambient temps. It's 15C in my room.







)

And for the person that said it's not worth if not going CLU, before the delid i could not get past stockclocks without hitting the 100C. Now i can without any problems, only my volt is stopping me from getting past 4.6!


----------



## moccor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> u mean direct die mounting?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> The IHS goes back on. It looks exactly like before the delidding when you look at the CPU in the socket.
> 
> That black glue getting cleaned off after delidding makes the IHS sit directly on the die. That's a lot of where the temperature improvement comes from. Some more improvement comes from using that "Liquid Ultra" metal stuff instead of normal paste on the die (under the IHS).


Ohhh I see. Didn't know that, thanks for the info.


----------



## bern43

How are people positioning haswell chips in the vice? On the one hand if you hit the vrm side you've got more clearance for he IHS once it breaks free. But then you're hitting the vrm side, which doesn't seem like the greatest idea.


----------



## fateswarm

There was a theory on a dedicated thread about it, that the capacitors or resistors have to be closer to the hammer. I suspect it may be a complex analysis work to find what is true (the angle of hitting might play a big role for example and alter everything).

I find the vice-only method the best and I bet it has different dynamics too.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> in my opinion it pointless to delid if you're not going to use CLP / CLU.


Not pointless. I used Gelid Extreme and only suffer a few deg temp loss compared to CLU/CLP. I dropped 12C. Hardly pointless. Might be pointless to use CLU/CLP though in some cases. Especially when you consider I don't have to worry about the Gelid Extreme drying out over 6 to 8mos. Point is.... its all personal preference. Gelid Extreme is my personal preference and I don't see the point in using CLU/CLP. But I could be wrong. Others here certainly seem to love it.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Not pointless. I used Gelid Extreme and only suffer a few deg temp loss compared to CLU/CLP. I dropped 12C. Hardly pointless. Might be pointless to use CLU/CLP though in some cases. Especially when you consider I don't have to worry about the Gelid Extreme drying out over 6 to 8mos. Point is.... its all personal preference. Gelid Extreme is my personal preference and I don't see the point in using CLU/CLP. But I could be wrong. Others here certainly seem to love it.


You get better temperatures with CLU/CLP, as you mentioned you use the Geild stuff and that's ok too. We're all part of one common cause, that is to lower temps.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *battleaxe*
> 
> Not pointless. I used Gelid Extreme and only suffer a few deg temp loss compared to CLU/CLP. I dropped 12C. Hardly pointless. Might be pointless to use CLU/CLP though in some cases. Especially when you consider I don't have to worry about the Gelid Extreme drying out over 6 to 8mos. Point is.... its all personal preference. Gelid Extreme is my personal preference and I don't see the point in using CLU/CLP. But I could be wrong. Others here certainly seem to love it.


thats why i said in my opinion.....









but deliding devils canyon and putting GC extreme is really pointless







, intel uses very good TIM you wont see much of a drop in temps.


----------



## JackCY

I have not delided but from all the methods people came up with the vice only method looks the most sensible.
Get a good vice, position correctly, I don't know right now what the best position is, heat it up with a hairdryer or something from the IHS side, tighten the vice, off it goes.

Quote:


> but deliding devils canyon and putting GC extreme is really pointless tongue.gif , intel uses very good TIM you wont see much of a drop in temps.


How much?

And with what TIM do I have to worry about it drying up or flowing away? I forgot the specific term it's called when the TIM gets pushed out due to heat cycling and pressure.


----------



## lolapaloza

I think, that is the best method to remove ihs.






I'll try it soon.


----------



## JackCY

That's more like how not to do it. You should have the vice fixed, screwed down to a stable bench. He hits it and the whole vice moves, hits hits hits many times.
If you want a loose vice then just tighten the CPU in it instead of hammering like a mad man







Much simpler.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> That's more like how not to do it. You should have the vice fixed, screwed down to a stable bench. He hits it and the whole vice moves, hits hits hits many times.
> If you want a loose vice then just tighten the CPU in it instead of hammering like a mad man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Much simpler.


Same way like I always do it, but jeez this vice ain't mounted propperly to the table.
Funny thing is, with this kind of force the adhesive never sticks to the IHS, always to the PCB. Very easily to remove with a bank card.
Always used this and will keep on using this method =)

Edit: Have to admit, fooked up the last time cuz this 4790K was holding on strong. Ended up with some bitemarks of the vice on the IHS. First time happening after 6+ Haswell delids.


----------



## RickRockerr

Hi all! I have been "off the grid" ~5 months now. Whats new? Is there new cpu's that are soldered? If someone could give me summary about what's new I would really appreciate
that


----------



## lolapaloza

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> That's more like how not to do it. You should have the vice fixed, screwed down to a stable bench. He hits it and the whole vice moves, hits hits hits many times.
> If you want a loose vice then just tighten the CPU in it instead of hammering like a mad man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Much simpler.


My english isn't good, and i did't understand anything what you write.
Could you paste the link to best method?
I have a vice fixed mounted on the table.


----------



## JackCY

This is a couple of the vice only, but none heat it up to make the glue softer. It should works better when heated up with any method.











Hammer is more of an impact force to snap it off and it can fly away if not taped down once it breaks loose.
Vice only might flex and the pressure is increased until it releases, also one side of the vice grip is on the PCB so you have to have good grips on the vice that won't damage it. And when you use wood with the hammer method that the wood is nice and flat and hard because that side is banging on the PCB.
That's why one uses those metal rulers in the video, which I'm surprised hold in there, because the grips on his vice are rough and make bite marks.

Both work well if done right. There is no best, it depends on what tools do you have.

I would avoid the razor method, takes forever and it's easy to scratch the PCB.

There are some videos with heating up the IHS prior but are not so easy to find.

*Vice only:*
vice, doesn't need to be bolted down, that's it

*Vice + hammer:*
vice, needs to be bolted down
good block of inch thick hard wood with at least two straight edges
hammer

Obviously the vice + hammer is more demanding on tools.

+ hair dryer or something to heat up the IHS never hurts


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> thats why i said in my opinion.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but deliding devils canyon and putting GC extreme is really pointless
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , intel uses very good TIM you wont see much of a drop in temps.


There was a 2c to 5c delta going from gelid to clp. I ran a comparison back post #24090. http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24090_10#post_21822222

Using an i7 would yeild a larger delta due to it being so much hotter than the 4670k I used in that test.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> There was a 2c to 5c delta going from gelid to clp. I ran a comparison back post #24090. http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/24090_10#post_21822222
> 
> Using an i7 would yeild a larger delta due to it being so much hotter than the 4670k I used in that test.


yeah thats just a haswell chip not a devils canyon chip that has a new and improved TIM that is just as good as GC extreme.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yeah thats just a haswell chip not a devils canyon chip that has a new and improved TIM that is just as good as GC extreme.


Anyone ever attempted to reapply the Intel cooling paste after a delid? Curious what it does against CLP / GC Extreme.
Will try it for the next processor of friends / family who needs delid.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> I've gathered pictures. And i hope i did something right, atleast.
> 
> The pictures are taken from the bottom and up.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Seriously. my temps are off the charts again.. What did i do wrong?


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Seriously. my temps are off the charts again.. What did i do wrong?


Check the cooling paste distribution on the die.
Remove it completly when necessary.
Also, the layer needs to be as thin as a newspaper page.
Because the IHS is allready directly on the die.
Just a very very very tiny layer is needed to dissepate heat.
The thicker the layer the more difficult the die loses the heat.

Edit: Same goes for the cooling paste between the cooling block and the IHS. First try the size of a rice. If it gets pushed to the outer sides of the IHS you can go to the size of a raindrop.
When it gets pushed to the outside your IHS is pretty nice straight and less is needed to fill the gap. Due to the pressure it's mounted the not needed paste gets pushed to the outer sides.


----------



## zalbard

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Seriously. my temps are off the charts again.. What did i do wrong?


Could be that your IHS is messed up and it doesn't make good contact with the die. If you were to sand its base a bit (to reduce its height), you could improve the temps quite a bit. Have you also thoroughly checked the heatsink? Maybe the base is very concave, or something...


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zalbard*
> 
> Could be that your IHS is messed up and it doesn't make good contact with the die. If you were to sand its base a bit (to reduce its height), you could improve the temps quite a bit. Have you also thoroughly checked the heatsink? Maybe the base is very concave, or something...


The temps are ok untill 1 - 2 days after applying the paste. How should i apply the paste properly? What can i use for that?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> yeah thats just a haswell chip not a devils canyon chip that has a new and improved TIM that is just as good as GC extreme.


I compared gelid to clp. it really does not matter if the stock tim is removed if its haswell or DC. gelid VS clp is still gelid vs clp.









I would like to see DC stock vs Gelid though.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> The temps are ok untill 1 - 2 days after applying the paste. How should i apply the paste properly? What can i use for that?


I guess you might need to try a different paste. The one you are currently using apparently slowly moves away, gets squeezed out from between die and IHS with temperature changes and pressure.

If you want to look up discussion and explanations about this idea, google for "pump-out effect".


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I would like to see DC stock vs Gelid though.


+1 please


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I guess you might need to try a different paste. The one you are currently using apparently slowly moves away, gets squeezed out from between die and IHS with temperature changes and pressure.
> 
> If you want to look up discussion and explanations about this idea, google for "pump-out effect".


I've ordered some Liquid Ultra, i guess that will work better than the siliconbased NT-H1?


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> I've ordered some Liquid Ultra, i guess that will work better than the siliconbased NT-H1?


Is your air cooler base made out of copper?
If so; make shure to reapply the CLP / CLU every 8 months.
It tends to dry out and merge with the copper surfaces.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Is your air cooler base made out of copper?
> If so; make shure to reapply the CLP / CLU every 8 months.
> It tends to dry out and merge with the copper surfaces.


I will only use the Liquid Ultra under the IHS. Still using NT-H1 between cooler and IHS.

Isn't the Liquid Ultra highly conductive? I know you all here use it, but it sounds dangerous for the CPU.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> I will only use the Liquid Ultra under the IHS. Still using NT-H1 between cooler and IHS.
> 
> Isn't the Liquid Ultra highly conductive? I know you all here use it, but it sounds dangerous for the CPU.


both clp/clu are conductive.


----------



## chumanga

Worth delid for use some normal tim like gelid or mx4 between die-IHS, i dont want/have the metal one. I got 4.2ghz 1.24v and temps are around 70-74° under encoding software like handbrake.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> I will only use the Liquid Ultra under the IHS. Still using NT-H1 between cooler and IHS.
> 
> Isn't the Liquid Ultra highly conductive? I know you all here use it, but it sounds dangerous for the CPU.


I use it on a 3570k, so there's no resistors on the PCB like on your CPU. I've seen people write about various stuff they do to try to feel safe with regards to those resistors on Haswell and CLU being conductive.

Some smear paste that's guaranteed to be non-conductive on those (Arctic MX4 for example). Some coat them with liquid electrical tape. Clear nail polish seems to be popular. I don't know how many people simply don't do anything.

If you don't know how CLU works, please look at the instructional video that's somewhere on Youtube. You'll have to paint it on with a brush and distribute it. The way it behaves, it seems it really will stay exactly where you've put it and won't move away. If it moves by itself, it will get attracted to the rest of the CLU and clump up with that, but never separate and move somewhere else, so the resistors might be totally safe.


----------



## 0verpowered

Well, just made a $300 keychain out of a 4790k. Overestimated the strength of the PCB and didn't do enough reading. Used a putty/retractable knife and knicked the PCB a couple times, also warped it a little when trying to pry off the IHS. Stupid mistake, not a good feeling. Just wanted those that are thinking about it -- extreme caution should be taken.



Surprised nobody has come up with a kit to make it easier, or offer a delid service. I live in a city apartment, so hard to come by a vise around here. I could see paying a $50 premium for a pre-delidded chip.

One method I was thinking of trying, if there is a next time, is to get 2 visegrips/pliers and twist the PCB and IHS in opposite directions. Might be a bit more gentler than using the hammer/vise.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0verpowered*
> 
> Well, just made a $300 keychain out of a 4790k. Overestimated the strength of the PCB and didn't do enough reading. Used a putty/retractable knife and knicked the PCB a couple times, also warped it a little when trying to pry off the IHS. Stupid mistake, not a good feeling. Just wanted those that are thinking about it -- extreme caution should be taken.
> 
> 
> 
> Surprised nobody has come up with a kit to make it easier, or offer a delid service. I live in a city apartment, so hard to come by a vise around here. I could see paying a $50 premium for a pre-delidded chip.
> 
> One method I was thinking of trying, if there is a next time, is to get 2 visegrips/pliers and twist the PCB and IHS in opposite directions. Might be a bit more gentler than using the hammer/vise.


I was selling delidded 4790k's and 4770k's in the marketplace for a while, and it seems that no one is willing to pay more than normal. so i stopped doing it. was taking a risk for no reason XD Although, i would be willing to buy and delid a chip and ship it for $50+ total cost if someone wanted it.

most people that buy them seem more intent on just having the CPU, rather than the Delid, only a handful of us have the special need for better cooling :3

half the people that bought the delidded CPU's from me, didn't even know what a delid was until they saw my posts ;;


----------



## 0verpowered

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> I was selling delidded 4790k's and 4770k's in the marketplace for a while, and it seems that no one is willing to pay more than normal. so i stopped doing it. was taking a risk for no reason XD Although, i would be willing to buy and delid a chip and ship it for $50+ total cost if someone wanted it.
> 
> most people that buy them seem more intent on just having the CPU, rather than the Delid, only a handful of us have the special need for better cooling :3
> 
> half the people that bought the delidded CPU's from me, didn't even know what a delid was until they saw my posts ;;


Probably people just don't know. If they knew how much improvement there was, theyd probably bite. I think I could've hit maybe 4.9-5 ghz with my now dead chip, with the delid. you could have the best custom loop, but that IHS/TIM that intel slaps on will be the bottleneck...Hopefully intel listens for real next time and has a better solution. They should have an option to go bare-die like the old days.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I compared gelid to clp. it really does not matter if the stock tim is removed if its haswell or DC. gelid VS clp is still gelid vs clp.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would like to see DC stock vs Gelid though.


i got the results of the stock TIM with default bios settings im just too lazy to remove the clp and put GC extreme to test








http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/25550_50#post_22561341


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0verpowered*
> 
> Well, just made a $300 keychain out of a 4790k. Overestimated the strength of the PCB and didn't do enough reading. Used a putty/retractable knife and knicked the PCB a couple times, also warped it a little when trying to pry off the IHS. Stupid mistake, not a good feeling. Just wanted those that are thinking about it -- extreme caution should be taken.
> 
> 
> 
> Surprised nobody has come up with a kit to make it easier, or offer a delid service. I live in a city apartment, so hard to come by a vise around here. I could see paying a $50 premium for a pre-delidded chip.
> 
> One method I was thinking of trying, if there is a next time, is to get 2 visegrips/pliers and twist the PCB and IHS in opposite directions. Might be a bit more gentler than using the hammer/vise.


Looks like you might have just gotten impatient and rushed the process. I did the razor method with me 3770K, I took my time with it and didn't have any issues at all. It's really easy if you take your time.


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0verpowered*
> 
> Well, just made a $300 keychain out of a 4790k. Overestimated the strength of the PCB and didn't do enough reading. Used a putty/retractable knife and knicked the PCB a couple times, also warped it a little when trying to pry off the IHS. Stupid mistake, not a good feeling. Just wanted those that are thinking about it -- extreme caution should be taken.
> 
> 
> 
> Surprised nobody has come up with a kit to make it easier, or offer a delid service. I live in a city apartment, so hard to come by a vise around here. I could see paying a $50 premium for a pre-delidded chip.
> 
> One method I was thinking of trying, if there is a next time, is to get 2 visegrips/pliers and twist the PCB and IHS in opposite directions. Might be a bit more gentler than using the hammer/vise.


Order this:
Clamp it to a table or a chair
http://www.amazon.com/IRWIN-226303-3-Inch-Clamp-on-Vise/dp/B0001LQY44/
http://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-3179-35mm-Double-Face-Mallet/dp/B000NPR2U8/
Now you just need a small block of wood.
maybe this
http://www.amazon.com/Nucasa-M1X4-S-Unfinished-75-Inch-3-5-Inch/dp/B002FU5HL0/


----------



## Jeronbernal

Durp


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> Order this:
> Clamp it to a table or a chair
> http://www.amazon.com/IRWIN-226303-3-Inch-Clamp-on-Vise/dp/B0001LQY44/
> http://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-3179-35mm-Double-Face-Mallet/dp/B000NPR2U8/
> Now you just need a small block of wood.
> maybe this
> http://www.amazon.com/Nucasa-M1X4-S-Unfinished-75-Inch-3-5-Inch/dp/B002FU5HL0/


Amazon sells wood? What doesn't amazon sell wow.


----------



## nX3NTY

OCN name: nX3NTY
CPU: i5 4670k
On die-TIM: AS5
IHS-TIM: AS5
MHz gained: Not tested yet
OC after delid: Not tested yet
Temp drops: So far, around 5-8C drop on 4.3GHz 1.24V



I just delidded using vice only method. It's SUPER EASY and it won't spoil the PCB whatsoever. Highly recommended method for anyone wanted to do it







Thing is I wanted to run direct die but I pretty sure that the pressure of my CM Seidon 240M isn't enough on the CPU because it can't detect my graphics card when I plugged it to the primary PCI-e slot, on the second PCI-e slot it boots up. When I removed the cooler I can see it doesn't exert enough force on the CPU die because the TIM don't spread evenly on the die. Bah...I was so disappointed....


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> Order this:
> Clamp it to a table or a chair
> http://www.amazon.com/IRWIN-226303-3-Inch-Clamp-on-Vise/dp/B0001LQY44/
> http://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-3179-35mm-Double-Face-Mallet/dp/B000NPR2U8/
> Now you just need a small block of wood.
> maybe this
> http://www.amazon.com/Nucasa-M1X4-S-Unfinished-75-Inch-3-5-Inch/dp/B002FU5HL0/
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon sells wood? What doesn't amazon sell wow.
Click to expand...

I know they sell just about everything, do you think they sell sperm?


----------



## SmOgER

In case someone is wondering how the soldered DIEs look like...





Intel did a pretty neat job on this particular chip, can't imagine any kind of TIM doing any better, the temps were pretty good as well, but it was SLANP (c0) stepping, so it still needed way more voltage than SLBBA (which paradoxically runs hotter volt-for-volt)...


----------



## kpssandhu1

Delidding will void warranty and risk in damage, i can risk with old chip but not with my new haswell refresh.


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kpssandhu1*
> 
> Delidding will void warranty and risk in damage, i can risk with old chip but not with my new haswell refresh.


not necessarily just glue the ihs back on and send it back


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> not necessarily just glue the ihs back on and send it back


this is true. I have rma one myself. Also the op shows a chat log of Intel rep accepting a delid rma.


----------



## kpssandhu1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> this is true. I have rma one myself. Also the op shows a chat log of Intel rep accepting a delid rma.


Lucky, well intel have 5 years warranty, why takes the risk with new $500US chip? takes wrench plier blade to delid but million of dollars worth of technology and sophisticated tools hundred thousands man hours to make one chip actually.


----------



## GaMbi2004

probably course Intel has spent all those millions of dollars on the chip itself and not the application of glue / TIM / IHS.. if you read the OP, the 15-20 degree drop in temperature should be a fairly good reason to risk it








At least it was for me.

Also, if you do your research and know how to use different tools, the risk is minimal.

If you cut into your chip or drop it or anything else that may damage it, the warranty is lost.. if you delid successfully (like 95% of us) and the CPU dies later on, the warranty still applies.


----------



## kpssandhu1

there are benefits of doing it all depends upon what you really want out of chip.
in other case
there are side effects of all drugs but doctor prescribe them looking at positive effect over weight side effect to improve patient condition from illness.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nX3NTY*
> 
> OCN name: nX3NTY
> CPU: i5 4670k
> On die-TIM: AS5
> IHS-TIM: AS5
> MHz gained: Not tested yet
> OC after delid: Not tested yet
> Temp drops: So far, around 5-8C drop on 4.3GHz 1.24V
> 
> 
> 
> I just delidded using vice only method. It's SUPER EASY and it won't spoil the PCB whatsoever. Highly recommended method for anyone wanted to do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thing is I wanted to run direct die but I pretty sure that the pressure of my CM Seidon 240M isn't enough on the CPU because it can't detect my graphics card when I plugged it to the primary PCI-e slot, on the second PCI-e slot it boots up. When I removed the cooler I can see it doesn't exert enough force on the CPU die because the TIM don't spread evenly on the die. Bah...I was so disappointed....


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## fateswarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmOgER*
> 
> In case someone is wondering how the soldered DIEs look like...


...when broken.


----------



## SmOgER

Yes, exactly. There is no other way to see how it actually looks soldered and how thick the solder is / how far is the die from IHS when soldered.









Plus, I wouldn't be able to see the cores and caches if I would delid it correctly by heating the IHS.


----------



## nX3NTY

Just wanted to update mine. Although I quite disappointed that I can't do direct die, removing the epoxy completely to make better contact with the core did give me better temps. I just amazed the temps don't go over 70C when running x264 benchmark where it hovers more than ~75C previously.

OCN name: nX3NTY
CPU: i5 4670k
On die-TIM: AS5
IHS-TIM: AS5
MHz gained: 200MHz
OC after delid: 4.4GHz 3.5GHz uncore (previously 4.2GHz 3.4GHz uncore)
Temp drops: around 5-8C


----------



## lilchronic

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nX3NTY*
> 
> Just wanted to update mine. Although I quite disappointed that I can't do direct die, removing the epoxy completely to make better contact with the core did give me better temps. I just amazed the temps don't go over 70C when running x264 benchmark where it hovers more than ~75C previously.
> 
> OCN name: nX3NTY
> CPU: i5 4670k
> On die-TIM: AS5
> IHS-TIM: AS5
> MHz gained: 200MHz
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz 3.5GHz uncore (previously 4.2GHz 3.4GHz uncore)
> Temp drops: around 5-8C


the tim intel uses is really good so anything else other than clp/clu and you wont have a very good tempp drop


----------



## Cozmo85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> the tim intel uses is really good so anything else other than clp/clu and you wont have a very good tempp drop


I used gelid extreme and had a great temp drop. ~15c


----------



## spagnacious

Hi All! This is a pretty savvy informative crowd.

Hope I am not doing the "asked and answered" flub.

Has anyone done a AIO liquid coolers list of which ones might work with delidded Haswells with block to die directly mounting in mind?

Or has anyone found someone offering a thingamajig that makes standard mounts work?

Thanks in advance or maybe we should get a list going.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spagnacious*
> 
> Hi All! This is a pretty savvy informative crowd.
> 
> Hope I am not doing the "asked and answered" flub.
> 
> Has anyone done a AIO liquid coolers list of which ones might work with delidded Haswells with block to die directly mounting in mind?
> 
> Or has anyone found someone offering a thingamajig that makes standard mounts work?
> 
> Thanks in advance or maybe we should get a list going.


I don't believe any AIO out of the box will work direct die, just due to the latch mechanism being the same height as the heatspreader, the die will sit too low to touch any cooler.

To go bare die you have to remove the latching mechanism and get new hardware or adjust the hardware you're currently using to lower the waterblock a mm or two


----------



## spagnacious

THANK YOU, Jeronbernal. That makes perfect sense and is informative. Having good, smart people around you is like skiing in Powder snow.....it's real hard to fall down.


----------



## cstkl1

Done by a friend of mine Acecombat from lyn for me.
  


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## maynard14

OCN name: maynard14
CPU: i5 4770k
On die-TIM: CLP
IHS-TIM: Thermaltake T2
Razor blade method








OC after delid: 4.5 ghz
Temp drops:Around 5-8C drop on 4.5GHz 1.35V max load 67c, idle 34c





pls add me :0


----------



## SmOgER

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> Temp drops:Around 5-8C drop on 4.5GHz 1.35V max load 67c, idle 34c


If that 67C is really under full load (prime95 small fft at least) then you've got quite a lot of thermal headroom left. Really impressive.









At 1.35v it's hard for me to get such temps even with soldered X5460.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nX3NTY*
> 
> Just wanted to update mine. Although I quite disappointed that I can't do direct die, removing the epoxy completely to make better contact with the core did give me better temps. I just amazed the temps don't go over 70C when running x264 benchmark where it hovers more than ~75C previously.
> 
> OCN name: nX3NTY
> CPU: i5 4670k
> On die-TIM: AS5
> IHS-TIM: AS5
> MHz gained: 200MHz
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz 3.5GHz uncore (previously 4.2GHz 3.4GHz uncore)
> Temp drops: around 5-8C










Updated!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> OCN name: maynard14
> CPU: i5 4770k
> On die-TIM: CLP
> IHS-TIM: Thermaltake T2
> Razor blade method
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OC after delid: 4.5 ghz
> Temp drops:Around 5-8C drop on 4.5GHz 1.35V max load 67c, idle 34c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pls add me :0


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmOgER*
> 
> If that 67C is really under full load (prime95 small fft at least) then you've got quite a lot of thermal headroom left. Really impressive.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At 1.35v it's hard for me to get such temps even with soldered X5460.


no sir that full load on 1.35v im using x264 stress test







not prime sir


----------



## SmOgER

oh, so that isn't the full load then.


----------



## maynard14

Hmm they say if i use prime 95 its pushes the cpu to its limit.. Where as x264 will give you full load closest to the real world full load


----------



## deepor

Yes, both will use the new AVX2 instructions that make the CPU run super hot. That x264 video encoder does something useful with it and the AVX2 it uses is embedded in a lot of normal code. That "normal" code has to manage stuff about the video encoding that's not math and does not run hot. So it will test the parts of the CPU that run hottest and want the most power just like prime95 does, but the temperatures will average out because it's a mix of work for the CPU and not a pure math problem like prime95.

The only problem I see is that x264 is a normal program and probably does not check the results of all its calculations. You wait to see if you get a BSOD. Prime95 on the other hand uses a math problem with a lot of steps, where every step depends on the one before it. It only has to check if the end result is right and then knows that everything it worked on for several minutes was done completely correctly by the CPU. So you can say it double-checks every single thing it does, does not depend on the whole machine to BSOD to see if things are unstable.

But that's just theory... a lot of people say that x264 does detect problems faster for them. I don't know what's going on there.


----------



## maynard14

I see. Yup for me sir x264 is enough for me for stress testing the cpu. Till this day im havent bsod or freeze or hang my pc. Cross fingers haha


----------



## ShadowRSA

OCN name: ShadowRSA
CPU: i7 4770k
on die-TIM: coollaboratory liquid pro
ihs-TIM: arctic mx-4
Mhz gained: none
OC after delid: none
Temp drops: 15-20 °C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: none. No OC yet.

Please add me







Im waiting on my water cooling components to ship, but decided to delid while i'm waiting in agony. When my rig is under water i will send the updated temps later if that's fine









Borrowed a few tools from the fiancées stash lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShadowRSA*
> 
> Please add me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im waiting on my water cooling components to ship, but decided to delid while i'm waiting in agony. When my rig is under water i will send the updated temps later if that's fine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Borrowed a few tools from the fiancées stash lol
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I need some info that is required as depicted from the front page


----------



## outlaw8505

As usual, I'm late to all these parties.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Information Required for Membership! (Click to hide)
> Now for the requirements to join the club are as follows. Post a picture of you delidded chip and write your OCN name on a piece or something of the like. For those already running delidded chips and don't feel like taking them out and re-installing I understand so take a picture that you most likely took when you delidded it and use what every program you'd like to put your name somewhere on the picture.
> 
> For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> 
> OCN name:
> CPU:
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!
> Temperature Format (Click to hide)
> For the submitting process of your temps use the following rules.
> 
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz (if you are having issues let us know on here and we will help you achieve this!)
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program)
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started)
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp from your four cores.
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> What is Lapping? Click the link! (Click to show)
> Courtesy of VonDutch
> 
> Thanks again! This may be a ridiculous amount of info to be provided to join, but this is for research to see what we can show Intel eventually and how badly they messed up. (Yes I'm serious abort this part)
> 
> This is also for people looking into Delidding and seeing just how crazy their temps can decrease by Delidding.
> 
> Thanks yet again!






i would like to join BUT had a dilidded CPU on purchase. I don't know the TIM used before I decided to run with no lid. I can provide current info (currently stock). is it still possible to participate?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outlaw8505*
> 
> As usual, I'm late to all these parties.
> 
> i would like to join BUT had a dilidded CPU on purchase. I don't know the TIM used before I decided to run with no lid. I can provide current info (currently stock). is it still possible to participate?


yes just give as much info as possible


----------



## scorpscarx

I can't decide whether to rma or delid my 4790K that obviously has some quality control issues. It's hot as hell in synthetic tests, but normal when gaming. Hot like 95c, but normal 55c when heavy gaming.

I delidded my 3570K with razor so I'm not scared really, I just had planned to resell it immediately once broadwell hits.

Anyone else have a 4790K that acts like that?

Also, dh-14 to custom water cooling only improved about 5c on this chip, so maybe it isn't the tim application on the die or glue issues, but a flaw in the chip itself?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> I can't decide whether to rma or delid my 4790K that obviously has some quality control issues. It's hot as hell in synthetic tests, but normal when gaming. Hot like 95c, but normal 55c when heavy gaming.
> 
> I delidded my 3570K with razor so I'm not scared really, I just had planned to resell it immediately once broadwell hits.
> 
> Anyone else have a 4790K that acts like that?
> 
> Also, dh-14 to custom water cooling only improved about 5c on this chip, so maybe it isn't the tim application on the die or glue issues, but a flaw in the chip itself?


Do the following to make yourself feel better about the new CPU:

Get IBT or Linx or just plain Linpack. Linpack is the Intel benchmark used in the background by IBT and Linx and will run in a command prompt window. You can update Linpack in some sub-folder of IBT/Linx manually. Then look at the GFlops benchmark results you get. That's the explanation for what you see.

The newest version of Linpack can use all new features of Haswell. Using as much of the new AVX2 instructions as possible, the benchmark results are through the roof compared to older CPUs. Where an older CPU gets 120 GFlops or something, Haswell manages something like 200 GFlops. That improvement is absolutely massive and it simply does not come for free. You have to pay for it and that's where the temperatures come from in synthetic tests.

Everything's fine in normal programs that also use AVX2 like the newest video encoders. Because it's not synthetic what they do, they can only use as much AVX2 as what makes sense for the problem they work on. There's a healthy mix between normal instructions and that AVX2 stuff and the temperatures average out.


----------



## scorpscarx

Thank you, I figured it was something related to avx2, but I didn't realize I would still push 95C in prime95 with a 6 fan 360 radiator at stock clocks! I'll try out linpack.

Update: Just ran linpack for 30 minutes, max core 85, so delidded it would be around 75, I guess everything is right as rain then.

That's stock at 1.248 volts, there really isn't much thermal headroom here for overclocking even under water.


----------



## maynard14

ahaha yeah prime95 has no mercy haha, so im sticking with good old aida64 or rog stress test and some crysis 3 haha


----------



## cstkl1

OCN name: cstkl1
CPU: i7 4790k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory liquid Ultra Bare Die mount
Mhz gained: [email protected]
OC after delid: [email protected] Linpack Command line Test ( More than linx and prime small fft)
Temp drops: 25 °C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: none. No OC yet.




Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShadowRSA*
> 
> OCN name: ShadowRSA
> CPU: i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: coollaboratory liquid pro
> ihs-TIM: arctic mx-4
> Mhz gained: none
> OC after delid: none
> Temp drops: 15-20 °C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: none. No OC yet.
> 
> Please add me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im waiting on my water cooling components to ship, but decided to delid while i'm waiting in agony. When my rig is under water i will send the updated temps later if that's fine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Borrowed a few tools from the fiancées stash lol
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> OCN name: cstkl1
> CPU: i7 4790k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory liquid Ultra Bare Die mount
> Mhz gained: [email protected]
> OC after delid: [email protected] Linpack Command line Test ( More than linx and prime small fft)
> Temp drops: 25 °C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: none. No OC yet.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat SIg On


----------



## wes1099

Is there a reason that I haven't seen much of anything about the hammer + vise method of delidding on this thread?


----------



## Jeronbernal

I stopped doing it that way after I failed a couple times with that method. I guess in part because of shoddy vice and my haste


----------



## Serandur

Alright, so I'm actually buying everything I need to delid my 3770K (finally) and this is going to sound stupid, but could someone please recommend an ideal sized/wood type wood board for the vice and hammer method? I'm ordering off of Amazon.


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> I stopped doing it that way after I failed a couple times with that method. I guess in part because of shoddy vice and my haste


I just tried with a vice and it didn't work due to my crappy vice. I ended up doing it with a razor blade and It worked. I had to use Thermalright Chill factor III on both the die and IHS because it was either that or IC diamond, and I didn't want to use IC diamond and scratch up/stain things. My current temps are lower on average by about 2 degrees Celsius, but chill factor is not nearly as good as CLU/CLP. I will jain the club later when my CLP gets here.


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Alright, so I'm actually buying everything I need to delid my 3770K (finally) and this is going to sound stupid, but could someone please recommend an ideal sized/wood type wood board for the vice and hammer method? I'm ordering off of Amazon.


something like 2 inch by 2 inch x 4 inch should be fine.


----------



## outlaw8505

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yes just give as much info as possible


OCN name: *outlaw8505*
CPU: *4770K*
on die-TIM: *AS Ceramique 2*
ihs-TIM: *NA (delid)*
Mhz gained: *700Mhz*
OC after delid: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
Temp drops: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
CPU-Z validation of max OC:*http://valid.x86.fr/p6xrfx*

1. Get to 4.5 Ghz (if you are having issues let us know on here and we will help you achieve this!) *Only hit 4.2Ghz I'm a noob when it comes to OC. On this setup, I've only played with the multiplier on the motherboards OC software.*
2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program) *complete*
3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started) *complete*
4. Report your HIGHEST temp from your four cores. *64C*
5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
What is Lapping? Click the link! (Click to show) *I lapped the die (JK!)*
Courtesy of VonDutch

Delid-

__
https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz


__
https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz
 by outlaw8505

IBT complete 10 runs at 4.2Ghz

__
https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG


__
https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG
 by outlaw8505,


----------



## Dry Bonez

hey whats up everyone? im going to be delidding my 4670k today. But i have some questions before starting my journey.i been researching and looked at the 1t page for more info but didnt really see my questions answered.
1nce i remove the cover(will be using vice method),do i need to remove that black gooey stuff? or just remove the paste? now speaking of paste,to remove the paste,i dont have actual alcohol,i have alcohol pads i took from my job to do this but they are 70%. or will i need some special liquid to clean?
2:What is IHS and TIM(or something like that),i have to put paste in 2 different locations or just one?
3:Can i or should i use Arctic MX 4 or Coolaboratory?
4:what will i need to clean and take out that black gooey thing?


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outlaw8505*
> 
> OCN name: *outlaw8505*
> CPU: *4770K*
> on die-TIM: *AS Ceramique 2*
> ihs-TIM: *NA (delid)*
> Mhz gained: *700Mhz*
> OC after delid: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
> Temp drops: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:*http://valid.x86.fr/p6xrfx*
> 
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz (if you are having issues let us know on here and we will help you achieve this!) *Only hit 4.2Ghz I'm a noob when it comes to OC. On this setup, I've only played with the multiplier on the motherboards OC software.*
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program) *complete*
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started) *complete*
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp from your four cores. *64C*
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> What is Lapping? Click the link! (Click to show) *I lapped the die (JK!)*
> Courtesy of VonDutch
> 
> Delid-
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz
> by outlaw8505
> 
> IBT complete 10 runs at 4.2Ghz
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG
> by outlaw8505,


You might wanna clear the unnecessary cooling paste.


----------



## FrostyAMD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> hey whats up everyone? im going to be delidding my 4670k today. But i have some questions before starting my journey.i been researching and looked at the 1t page for more info but didnt really see my questions answered.
> 1nce i remove the cover(will be using vice method),do i need to remove that black gooey stuff? or just remove the paste? now speaking of paste,to remove the paste,i dont have actual alcohol,i have alcohol pads i took from my job to do this but they are 70%. or will i need some special liquid to clean?
> 2:What is IHS and TIM(or something like that),i have to put paste in 2 different locations or just one?
> 3:Can i or should i use Arctic MX 4 or Coolaboratory?
> 4:what will i need to clean and take out that black gooey thing?


1. Black stuff/adhesive needs to be removed use a old credit casrd or simiular tool to remove it from green pcb (some use their finger nails. be careful you don't want to scratch pcb)!
2 Yes you'll have 2 locations to apply paste. First to the die (rectangular square on pcb) Be sure to clean it thoroughly using alcohol pads before applying new paste.
3 Clean IHS of black stuuff and old paste use any tool for black stuff especiall around the edges you want it sit flat on green pcb.
4. Finally you will sit IHS back in it's orginal location and apply paste between it and your hsh or waterblock.
Ask any more questions if you are still mot clear


----------



## outlaw8505

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> You might wanna clear the unnecessary cooling paste.


That was under the ihs when I found out it had already been delidded. It was cleaned off and I used the ceramique 2 and direct die cooling.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outlaw8505*
> 
> OCN name: *outlaw8505*
> CPU: *4770K*
> on die-TIM: *AS Ceramique 2*
> ihs-TIM: *NA (delid)*
> Mhz gained: *700Mhz*
> OC after delid: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
> Temp drops: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:*http://valid.x86.fr/p6xrfx*
> 
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz (if you are having issues let us know on here and we will help you achieve this!) *Only hit 4.2Ghz I'm a noob when it comes to OC. On this setup, I've only played with the multiplier on the motherboards OC software.*
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program) *complete*
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started) *complete*
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp from your four cores. *64C*
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> What is Lapping? Click the link! (Click to show) *I lapped the die (JK!)*
> Courtesy of VonDutch
> 
> Delid-
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz
> by outlaw8505
> 
> IBT complete 10 runs at 4.2Ghz
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG
> by outlaw8505,


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outlaw8505*
> 
> That was under the ihs when I found out it had already been delidded. It was cleaned off and I used the ceramique 2 and direct die cooling.


Lol did you knew it was delidded allready or did that came as surprise?
The previous owner made a mess of that cooling paste .. dang!


----------



## outlaw8505

It was definitely a happy surprise. I couldn't pass up the deal and dint know it was a delidded until I went to mess with the retention mount, wiped the goo off the cpu and the ihs slid a around.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outlaw8505*
> 
> It was definitely a happy surprise. I couldn't pass up the deal and dint know it was a delidded until I went to mess with the retention mount, wiped the goo off the cpu and the ihs slid a around.


Ghehe that was awesome!

Now pump it up to 4.5Ghz.
Set Vcore to 1.25V manually, set multiplier at 45 and give it a go!


----------



## outlaw8505

Gotta do that. Auto volt seems to only set up to 1.174v and it bsods immediately


----------



## Dry Bonez

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FrostyAMD*
> 
> 1. Black stuff/adhesive needs to be removed use a old credit casrd or simiular tool to remove it from green pcb (some use their finger nails. be careful you don't want to scratch pcb)!
> 2 Yes you'll have 2 locations to apply paste. First to the die (rectangular square on pcb) Be sure to clean it thoroughly using alcohol pads before applying new paste.
> 3 Clean IHS of black stuuff and old paste use any tool for black stuff especiall around the edges you want it sit flat on green pcb.
> 4. Finally you will sit IHS back in it's orginal location and apply paste between it and your hsh or waterblock.
> Ask any more questions if you are still mot clear


thanks for the help,i wasnt able to delid today because my TIM didnt arrive.i ordered the coolaboratory liquid pro....so more questions i have.ok,i remove the black gooey thing
1:but do i have to replace that? if so,what do i need to buy to put some more black stuff?
2:do i just pour some coolaboratory TIm on it and spread it or do i leave it there as i would with a cpu mount?
3:will 70% alcohol be enough to clean EVERYTHING off?


----------



## FrostyAMD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> thanks for the help,i wasnt able to delid today because my TIM didnt arrive.i ordered the coolaboratory liquid pro....so more questions i have.ok,i remove the black gooey thing
> 1:but do i have to replace that? if so,what do i need to buy to put some more black stuff?
> 2:do i just pour some coolaboratory TIm on it and spread it or do i leave it there as i would with a cpu mount?
> 3:will 70% alcohol be enough to clean EVERYTHING off?


1 do not replace it's part of the problem
2 youll have to spread it on very thin layer on the die would not use it on ihs tho if your hsf or waterblock is copper at the very least it will stain the hsf or block
3 yes rhe pads should clean the paste you find under the ihs and use the to clean the die


----------



## Serandur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vario*
> 
> something like 2 inch by 2 inch x 4 inch should be fine.


Alright, thanks. Is any wood type okay as well or might one be most preferable (such as balsa, oak, etc.)?


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Alright, thanks. Is any wood type okay as well or might one be most preferable (such as balsa, oak, etc.)?


You want your wood to be hard bro. Pun intended.

If it's not a hard wood it will imprint into the wood rather than transfer the force, possibly chipping the pcb in the process.


----------



## FrostyAMD

Hello
Been sorta following this thread and I was wondering what criteria do you guys use to determine wheter a chip needs to be de-lidded. Ive beentesting a 4790 that needs 1.27 for 4.6 and temps under aida64 system stability getting in the low 90's 93C 94C 91C 93C


----------



## Jeronbernal

To me that sounds like a temp bottleneck.

WHat cooling solution?


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Alright, thanks. Is any wood type okay as well or might one be most preferable (such as balsa, oak, etc.)?


Tiger wood, skyn3t posted a wood density chart in his 3770k Lapped and delidded guide, Google 3770k Lapped, and look for the title that looks like it has been typed by a 5 year old =p "3770k LaPpED & DeLlIDdeD" lol

Skyn3t's a genius, with a sense of humor =p


----------



## FrostyAMD

false
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jeronbernal*
> 
> To me that sounds like a temp bottleneck.
> 
> WHat cooling solution?


Water CustomLoop 2 Swiftech 320 's 3 Fans each pulling and apogee GTZ . Shop I got it from has offered to exchange it. Owner is a good friend of mine. So delid or exchange ???


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FrostyAMD*
> 
> false
> Water CustomLoop 2 Swiftech 320 's 3 Fans each pulling and apogee GTZ . Shop I got it from has offered to exchange it. Owner is a good friend of mine. So delid or exchange ???


Mine is the same, under water and 85-95 highest depending on the test, at 1.248 volts, devil's canyon is just hot. A replacement will be similar, delid, improve your loop, or wait for broadwell.


----------



## SmOgER

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FrostyAMD*
> 
> 1 do not replace it's part of the problem


Wait, you are suggesting for him to use the same silicone OR to clean it off and use none?

First case is probably not the best idea since it may prevent IHS from properly touching the die. Now not using the silicone at all isn't the worst idea I guess but you will need to be extra careful with CPU not to excessively move or rotate it's IHS after it's on. It's OK if you want highest possible thermal conductivity without any compromises (excluding direct die). Now I don't know what the trend in this thread/club generally is, but replacing the silione is probably the safest bet. Granted, you will need to apply quite a big amount of pressure and leave it like that overnight tho.


----------



## deepor

He meant to say, you should not replace the black glue. Any glue being there is part of the problem. This is because it raises the IHS and creates a gap making it so the die and IHS do not touch and only exchange heat through the thermal paste.

It's also annoying because you'll have to delid a second time if you want (or have to) work on the insides again.


----------



## SmOgER

Well yeah, but it should be ok if you use small amount of silicone just to secure it in place and like I said, quite a bit of pressure to squeeze it to the point of IHS touching the die.
I wanted to suggest the casual non-conductive glue which theoretically you could apply after the IHS is already in place, but it's probably not the best idea since with extremely high temps it could be smelly/toxic...


----------



## FrostyAMD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> He meant to say, you should not replace the black glue. Any glue being there is part of the problem. This is because it raises the IHS and creates a gap making it so the die and IHS do not touch and only exchange heat through the thermal paste.
> 
> It's also annoying because you'll have to delid a second time if you want (or have to) work on the insides again.


This why I put my statement as quoted


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Alright, thanks. Is any wood type okay as well or might one be most preferable (such as balsa, oak, etc.)?


I used a hard wood, cocobolo, which I was using to make handles and I had a chunk lying around. You don't need to use a premium wood like that though, I am sure oak would be fine.


----------



## inedenimadam

So what is the word on the Anniversary Pentiums?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> So what is the word on the Anniversary Pentiums?


they can be cooled without delid.


----------



## koekwau5

Edit: Whoops was meant for the Devils Canyon thread but doesn't matter. Will post same there.

Hi guys,

found some interesting settings in my BIOS yesterday evening. Don't know if its posted allready, if so, pl0x forgive me









People here want their CPU overclocked, but also want it to clock down in speed and voltage when it is idle.
It does all of this when BIOS settings are reverted to stock.

You may have noticed once you start entering voltage values the voltage will stay the same and only the speed will decrease.
Changing all the power saving features don't seem to do much, voltage stays the same only speed drops.

I found this on my Asus Maximus VI Extreme motherboard. Probably all other high-end Asus motherboard will have the same feature.
And it is very very easy without trying out hundreds of settings these motherboard have to offer.
So how to overclock your CPU and still make it drop in volts and speed when idle?

1) Go to your BIOS and reset to default settings. Save settings and reboot.
2) Go back to your BIOS.
3) Go to the Extreme Tweaker page.
4) Go to: "Overclock Presets"
5) Load the Gamer OC Profile.

Now go back to the Extreme Tweakers page. You will notice a whole bunch of settings have been configured automatically. But of course there is more to be adjusted!

This is how to configure the Gamer OC BIOS profile without some settings getting adjusted automatically causing the power saving settings to be reverted.

1) Set your AI Tuner to Manual or XMP.
2) In XMP, select your memory profile.
3) In Manual; set your memory speed and timings.
4) Set "CPU Core Ratio" back to "Per Core" and dial in the core speeds. (Changing memory speed makes it hop back to "Sync All Cores" causing the power saving to fail. So revert this to "Per Core"!)
5) Leave all other settings like "PLL Overvoltage" untouched. VRM's are allready set to Extreme, LLC is set to level 8.
6) Set the needed "CPU Voltage" and "Cache Voltage". It will be on override; so typ in the voltage it is stable at. Like mine does 4.7Ghz @ 1.350V, so I set it to 1.350V.
7) Set needed Eventual Input.
8) Set needed Memory voltage.

Save BIOS and have a look at CPU-Z!



You will notice the voltages drop even to a 0.3V cuz the Asus board reduces the Vcore even more on idle than Intel does!
Once the CPU gains some load you will notice the speed increasing and the override voltage kicking in.

Any questions? Ask em here or send me a PM!


----------



## SmOgER

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> So what is the word on the Anniversary Pentiums?


It's not very bad if you are going for extreme overclocking but you better off with an used lga1366 Xeon X5660 for that price.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SmOgER*
> 
> It's not very bad if you are going for extreme overclocking but you better off with an used lga1366 Xeon X5660 for that price.


Here is Holland I can get a brand new one for €40.
Ordered it, will whoop it's ass once it arrives =)


----------



## outlaw8505

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outlaw8505*
> 
> OCN name: *outlaw8505*
> CPU: *4770K*
> on die-TIM: *AS Ceramique 2*
> ihs-TIM: *NA (delid)*
> Mhz gained: *700Mhz*
> OC after delid: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
> Temp drops: *NA (unable to test, CPU was already delidded)*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:*http://valid.x86.fr/p6xrfx*
> 
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz (if you are having issues let us know on here and we will help you achieve this!) *Only hit 4.2Ghz I'm a noob when it comes to OC. On this setup, I've only played with the multiplier on the motherboards OC software.*
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program) *complete*
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started) *complete*
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp from your four cores. *64C*
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> What is Lapping? Click the link! (Click to show) *I lapped the die (JK!)*
> Courtesy of VonDutch
> 
> Delid-
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2rUz
> by outlaw8505
> 
> IBT complete 10 runs at 4.2Ghz
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/oJ2DkG
> by outlaw8505,






Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


I found the thermal paste I used. It was actually Arctic Silver's Arctic Alumina

Sorry for the confusion.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> So what is the word on the Anniversary Pentiums?
> 
> 
> 
> they can be cooled without delid.
Click to expand...

Is it part of the DC TIM improvement? I put it under a 212 and hits 70C at 1.3v, seems a bit high considering that same 212 nails down other stuff I have with higher tdp to the same or better temps for the volts.

I am not afraid of popping the top on it, just want to know if I will benefit at all, and hopefully open up some thermal headroom to take it higher. If I can get 10C I would be happy as a pig in poo. I keep CLU on hand, so it is essentially more free overclocking.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Is it part of the DC TIM improvement? I put it under a 212 and hits 70C at 1.3v, seems a bit high considering that same 212 nails down other stuff I have with higher tdp to the same or better temps for the volts.
> 
> I am not afraid of popping the top on it, just want to know if I will benefit at all, and hopefully open up some thermal headroom to take it higher. If I can get 10C I would be happy as a pig in poo. I keep CLU on hand, so it is essentially more free overclocking.


You can de-lid it and temps will benefit. It's just that it's got less heat then a unlocked i5 or i7 as it's got half the cores and stuff. You'll get 10c easily I reckon.


----------



## Wirerat

Well I think you possibly have a hot pentium that needs delid. Some of those can push 1.3v on the stock cooler just fine.

I am certain if you had a better cooler you could skip deliding but I think its a good option to spending money on a better cooler since the risk of loss is not as bad deliding a $69 cpu.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Well I think you possibly have a hot pentium that needs delid. Some of those can push 1.3v on the stock cooler just fine.
> 
> I am certain if you had a better cooler you could skip deliding but I think its a good option to spending money on a better cooler since the risk of loss is not as bad deliding a $69 cpu.


There is little chance at messing up a de-lid right now. Especially if you have some older CPU's to test on. I agree that Haswell de-lids are harder/more likely to not work it's still relatively easy,


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> There is little chance at messing up a de-lid right now. Especially if you have some older CPU's to test on. I agree that Haswell de-lids are harder/more likely to not work it's still relatively easy,


on a cpu as cheap as the pentium the risk doesnt matter as much is my point.

I have delided several haswells now. My newest 4790k has decent temps running at 1.3v. I honestly think I will skip deliding this time. I dont want to push anymore volts so its pointless. My non synthetic temps are in the 60s already. Anyways thats a $350 cpu. On a pentium I would feed that thing 1.45v and not care much if it only lasts 18months or so.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> on a cpu as cheap as the pentium the risk doesnt matter as much is my point.
> 
> I have delided several haswells now. My newest 4790k has decent temps running at 1.3v. I honestly think I will skip deliding this time. I dont want to push anymore volts so its pointless. My non synthetic temps are in the 60s already. Anyways thats a $350 cpu. On a pentium I would feed that thing 1.45v and not care much if it only lasts 18months or so.


Yeah that's true, I kind of want to get one just to have one in the box. I don't even own a socket 1150 board haha. My housemate does have a Z87OC board with no on board sound that I could probably have for like $10 haha.


----------



## PantoffelKnager

Quick recomedations on which thermal paste to use on the die and which one on the IHS?


----------



## Wirerat

Clp on die gelid extreme on ihs.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Clp


Coolabatory Liquid Pro that is, or Ultra it doesn't really matter a lot. Pro is better I think however.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Coolabatory Liquid Pro that is, or Ultra it doesn't really matter a lot. Pro is better I think however.


yup with gelid extreme on the ihs.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> There is little chance at messing up a de-lid right now.
> 
> 
> 
> on a cpu as cheap as the pentium the risk doesnt matter as much is my point.
> 
> On a pentium I would feed that thing 1.45v and not care much if it only lasts 18months or so.
Click to expand...

You both are validating my desire to cut its head off. I have already had success with previous CPUs, and I essentially got the CPU for free considering the mobo+cpu combo I got at microcenter was cheaper than most places charge for any Z97 board. And 1.45 sounds about like what I would like to feed it honestly, just dont have the thermal headroom....so....

I will run some preliminary thermal tests to get a good idea how much it drops.

Now then...I did razor with the 3570k because the vice method was not discovered when I did the delid and I thought it was fairly easy, but hurt my fingers to push that hard on a blade. Has any one done both methods and found one easier than the other?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You both are validating my desire to cut its head off. I have already had success with previous CPUs, and I essentially got the CPU for free considering the mobo+cpu combo I got at microcenter was cheaper than most places charge for any Z97 board. And 1.45 sounds about like what I would like to feed it honestly, just dont have the thermal headroom....so....
> 
> I will run some preliminary thermal tests to get a good idea how much it drops.
> 
> Now then...I did razor with the 3570k because the vice method was not discovered when I did the delid and I thought it was fairly easy, but hurt my fingers to push that hard on a blade. Has any one done both methods and found one easier than the other?


I did razor on mine too, I'm in the same boat as what you were. My fingers were better after 2 days or so and I think it was worth it haha.

1.45 is a bit much, I degraded my 3570k with that personally. I find that 1.4 is more reasonable and 1.38 is even better.


----------



## inedenimadam

false
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You both are validating my desire to cut its head off. I have already had success with previous CPUs, and I essentially got the CPU for free considering the mobo+cpu combo I got at microcenter was cheaper than most places charge for any Z97 board. And 1.45 sounds about like what I would like to feed it honestly, just dont have the thermal headroom....so....
> 
> I will run some preliminary thermal tests to get a good idea how much it drops.
> 
> Now then...I did razor with the 3570k because the vice method was not discovered when I did the delid and I thought it was fairly easy, but hurt my fingers to push that hard on a blade. Has any one done both methods and found one easier than the other?
> 
> 
> 
> I did razor on mine too, I'm in the same boat as what you were. My fingers were better after 2 days or so and I think it was worth it haha.
> 
> 1.45 is a bit much, I degraded my 3570k with that personally. I find that 1.4 is more reasonable and 1.38 is even better.
Click to expand...

That is odd, I have been running 1.45ish for my daily overclock on a 3570k for about two years, and the voltage requirements are still within .004 of what they were when I first stabilized it.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> false
> That is odd, I have been running 1.45ish for my daily overclock on a 3570k for about two years, and the voltage requirements are still within .004 of what they were when I first stabilized it.


Well nice, mine was one of the first batches so maybe that was something to do with it? Mine was also running on a Silver Arrow SB-E with ~1.46v for 4.6GHz (terrible, terrible chip I know). Right now I need 1.34v for 4.4Ghz and it's staying like that.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> false
> That is odd, I have been running 1.45ish for my daily overclock on a 3570k for about two years, and the voltage requirements are still within .004 of what they were when I first stabilized it.
> 
> 
> 
> Well nice, mine was one of the first batches so maybe that was something to do with it? Mine was also running on a Silver Arrow SB-E with ~1.46v for 4.6GHz (terrible, terrible chip I know). Right now I need 1.34v for 4.4Ghz and it's staying like that.
Click to expand...

Yowzers...that does suck. 1.45 got me 5.0, but I am also under a full loop and direct die that keeps it under 60C for everything I ask of it other than P95.

I dont expect 5.0 out of the 3258k, but the difference between 3.2 and 4.5 has been pretty noticeable in a few things, so I want to squeeze it for all its worth, and I am going to dellid it to make that happen.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Yowzers...that does suck. 1.45 got me 5.0, but I am also under a full loop and direct die that keeps it under 60C for everything I ask of it other than P95.
> 
> I dont expect 5.0 out of the 3258k, but the difference between 3.2 and 4.5 has been pretty noticeable in a few things, so I want to squeeze it for all its worth, and I am going to dellid it to make that happen.


I am under water too, I have been for almost a year now haha. I'm also de-lidded with CLP/CLU and it's been there so long I can't get it off haha.
Going from 3.4 to 4.4 for me makes BF3 more playable and a few things just a bit faster. My max temps with the fans on 5v is 60c with intel burn test and that's fully silent because the fans are under 1,000 RPM


----------



## RickRockerr

I'm waiting for 4790K And I was thinking that how big is the benefit if I delid it?

E: Just looked from the list


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I'm waiting for 4790K And I was thinking that how big is the benefit if I delid it?
> 
> E: Just looked from the list


Around 20c should be expected with CLU/CLP and around 10c is possible if you use traditional paste and apply it properly.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Around 20c should be expected with CLU/CLP and around 10c is possible if you use traditional paste and apply it properly.


So intel's new better thermal paste isn't that good


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> So intel's new better thermal paste isn't that good


It wasn't ever really the thermal paste that was the problem, it's the space between the IHS and the core. When you de-lid you remove the black seal which makes the IHS contact the core properly (actually touching it) and better contact therefore better temps.

EDIT: I missed this
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> yup with gelid extreme on the ihs.


I used CLP on the IHS and my overall temp drop was around 26-27c at the same speed on a Silver Arrow, I'm sure it'd be greater on a water cooling loop or with a better application.


----------



## lilchronic

DC has better TIM than haswell and ivy bridge so you wont see as much of a drop with DC compared to haswell / ivy bridge


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lilchronic*
> 
> DC has better TIM than haswell and ivy bridge so you wont see as much of a drop with DC compared to haswell / ivy bridge


this,

Unless you are running more than 1.35v most 4790k can get by without delid.

My 4790k at 1.296v vs my 4770k (delid clp) at 1.281v. Both with h110. They
Both idle at 28c. The 4790k is only 3c hotter under non synthetic load and its getting more voltage.

I can get a 10c delta favoring the 4770k delided w/clp running linpack but thats no big deal.

There is prolly some Dc that are not as cool but This one has surpassed my expectations on temperatures.


----------



## RickRockerr

Well let's see what kind of 4790K I get







May take a while before I have the courage to delid it


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Around 20c should be expected with CLU/CLP and around 10c is possible if you use traditional paste and apply it properly.


You seem to know what you are talking about, so what is the proper way to apply CLP/CLU? Also, how do you recommend applying paste to the IHS?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> You seem to know what you are talking about, so what is the proper way to apply CLP/CLU? Also, how do you recommend applying paste to the IHS?


If you look in the sheets in OP, you can find those numbers








CLU should be applied in a VERY thin layer! Put a TINY drop from the syringe on the die, use the brush that comes with the CLU to spread it around.. it may seam like it is all moving around as a hole, but just keep going, and it will spread out nicely.
After you've spread it on the die, you apply the CLU left on the brush to the underside of the IHS.
Clamp it down in the mobo and apply your favorite TIM to the top side of the IHS as you normally would.. Many suggestions on how to do this. I normally put a rice grain size amount on the center of the IHS, maybe in DIE orientation, or just a dot in the center.. then I put down the cooler and push it down while rotating it a few degrees in each direction a few times before screwing it down.
Also, remember to remove ALL the glue that held the IHS to the CPU PCB together.. this glue is the main culprit to the high temps, since it leaves a gap between IHS and DIE

I forget witch CPU you are having.. Haswell (4670/4770) has some surface mounted thingies that may not like the CLU inbetween them, so you will need to protect those with liquid tape, clear nail polish or even a non conductive TIM like MX4 will do.. Ivy (3570/3770) does not have those.. so no problems here.

Hope this helps?


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> If you look in the sheets in OP, you can find those numbers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU should be applied in a VERY thin layer! Put a TINY drop from the syringe on the die, use the brush that comes with the CLU to spread it around.. it may seam like it is all moving around as a hole, but just keep going, and it will spread out nicely.
> After you've spread it on the die, you apply the CLU left on the brush to the underside of the IHS.
> Clamp it down in the mobo and apply your favorite TIM to the top side of the IHS as you normally would.. Many suggestions on how to do this. I normally put a rice grain size amount on the center of the IHS, maybe in DIE orientation, or just a dot in the center.. then I put down the cooler and push it down while rotating it a few degrees in each direction a few times before screwing it down.
> Also, remember to remove ALL the glue that held the IHS to the CPU PCB together.. this glue is the main culprit to the high temps, since it leaves a gap between IHS and DIE
> 
> I forget witch CPU you are having.. Haswell (4670/4770) has some surface mounted thingies that may not like the CLU inbetween them, so you will need to protect those with liquid tape, clear nail polish or even a non conductive TIM like MX4 will do.. Ivy (3570/3770) does not have those.. so no problems here.
> 
> Hope this helps?


I don't have liquid tape, but my mom might have clear nail polish. Would hot glue or epoxy work?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> I don't have liquid tape, but my mom might have clear nail polish. Would hot glue or epoxy work?


I dont think I would trust hot glue not to get hot enough to melt all over again and become a bigger pain than help.


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I dont think I would trust hot glue not to get hot enough to melt all over again and become a bigger pain than help.


Do you know if epoxy would be okay?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> You seem to know what you are talking about, so what is the proper way to apply CLP/CLU? Also, how do you recommend applying paste to the IHS?


Haha thanks,

I used about half a grain of rice of CLP/CLU and then I used a cotton bud to spread it on. One of them actually comes with some to apply which won't contaminate the liquid. The cotton bud application works well with both CLU/CLP.





 - The brush isn't as good as the cotton tips




 - The better option for application at least.

You want to use about half as much as what they used in the liquid pro application, because you do lose a bit on the cotton tip too.

You pretty much want it to look like the top of that IHS in the video. Silver/shining and with no excess drops on it. Personally I struggled to get mine that good because you're handling a $300 processor and you have to be pretty careful haha. It won't make too much difference but that is the proper way.

The same application goes to the IHS if you didn't get that from the video too. It will however stain the IHS which isn't the biggest issue if you're de-lidded as you know your CPU, Batch Number and likely won't be RMA'ing. You'll also stain your waterblock/CPU cooler, but it will only help other pastes that are used. If you're really hysteric you can sand it back off anyway.


----------



## FrostyAMD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Edit: Whoops was meant for the Devils Canyon thread but doesn't matter. Will post same there.
> 
> Hi guys,
> 
> found some interesting settings in my BIOS yesterday evening. Don't know if its posted allready, if so, pl0x forgive me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People here want their CPU overclocked, but also want it to clock down in speed and voltage when it is idle.
> It does all of this when BIOS settings are reverted to stock.
> 
> You may have noticed once you start entering voltage values the voltage will stay the same and only the speed will decrease.
> Changing all the power saving features don't seem to do much, voltage stays the same only speed drops.
> 
> I found this on my Asus Maximus VI Extreme motherboard. Probably all other high-end Asus motherboard will have the same feature.
> And it is very very easy without trying out hundreds of settings these motherboard have to offer.
> So how to overclock your CPU and still make it drop in volts and speed when idle?
> 
> 1) Go to your BIOS and reset to default settings. Save settings and reboot.
> 2) Go back to your BIOS.
> 3) Go to the Extreme Tweaker page.
> 4) Go to: "Overclock Presets"
> 5) Load the Gamer OC Profile.
> 
> Now go back to the Extreme Tweakers page. You will notice a whole bunch of settings have been configured automatically. But of course there is more to be adjusted!
> 
> This is how to configure the Gamer OC BIOS profile without some settings getting adjusted automatically causing the power saving settings to be reverted.
> 
> 1) Set your AI Tuner to Manual or XMP.
> 2) In XMP, select your memory profile.
> 3) In Manual; set your memory speed and timings.
> 4) Set "CPU Core Ratio" back to "Per Core" and dial in the core speeds. (Changing memory speed makes it hop back to "Sync All Cores" causing the power saving to fail. So revert this to "Per Core"!)
> 5) Leave all other settings like "PLL Overvoltage" untouched. VRM's are allready set to Extreme, LLC is set to level 8.
> 6) Set the needed "CPU Voltage" and "Cache Voltage". It will be on override; so typ in the voltage it is stable at. Like mine does 4.7Ghz @ 1.350V, so I set it to 1.350V.
> 7) Set needed Eventual Input.
> 8) Set needed Memory voltage.
> 
> Save BIOS and have a look at CPU-Z!
> 
> 
> 
> You will notice the voltages drop even to a 0.3V cuz the Asus board reduces the Vcore even more on idle than Intel does!
> Once the CPU gains some load you will notice the speed increasing and the override voltage kicking in.
> 
> Any questions? Ask em here or send me a PM!


Where did you find gamer oc profile on z97 I have hero but saw no presets


----------



## wes1099

So I have CLP coming to put on the die, and for IHS I can either use Thermalright Chill Factor 3 or IC diamond. Which one do you guys think is better?


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> So I have CLP coming to put on the die, and for IHS I can either use Thermalright Chill Factor 3 or IC diamond. Which one do you guys think is better?


I would go with IC diamond, it's good stuff.


----------



## lilchronic

^^ this


----------



## dan147

Hi guys! I am now part of the delid club









I have some advice for everyone who is thinking about delidding. *Use the Vice-ONLY method*. No hammer, no wood block. Just a vice. It's safer.

What you do is you put the voltage regulator side of the chip against the vice. On the opposite side, you put only the heat spreader against the corner of the vice. You slowly apply pressure, until you see the heat spreader begin to separate. Then you just peel it off with your fingers. 



 It's so, so, so much safer. It worked flawlessly.

Onto my results. I have a *TERRIBLE* overclocker, but decided to do this just for lower temps. I didn't gain any MHz, my 4770k will only go upto 4.4 GHz, even if I push it to 1.5 volts it will still crash at anything past 4.4.

Here is a temperature comparison. I kept voltage and all settings the same so you can see the difference it has.



CPU: 4770K 4.4 GHz
MHz gained: 0
TIM: Liquid Ultra
External TIM: Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U14s running at full speed
Temp change: -20C

I highly recommend the vice only method. Worked very well for me. Also liquid ultra is amazing. I can have this thing running prime 95 at *1.5 volts* and still be under 90 C.









Thanks for reading.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hi guys! I am now part of the delid club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have some advice for everyone who is thinking about delidding. *Use the Vice-ONLY method*. No hammer, no wood block. Just a vice. It's safer.
> 
> What you do is you put the voltage regulator side of the chip against the vice. On the opposite side, you put only the heat spreader against the corner of the vice. You slowly apply pressure, until you see the heat spreader begin to separate. Then you just peel it off with your fingers.
> 
> 
> 
> It's so, so, so much safer. It worked flawlessly.
> 
> Onto my results. I have a *TERRIBLE* overclocker, but decided to do this just for lower temps. I didn't gain any MHz, my 4770k will only go upto 4.4 GHz, even if I push it to 1.5 volts it will still crash at anything past 4.4.
> 
> Here is a temperature comparison. I kept voltage and all settings the same so you can see the difference it has.
> 
> 
> 
> CPU: 4770K 4.4 GHz
> MHz gained: 0
> TIM: Liquid Ultra
> External TIM: Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste
> CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U14s running at full speed
> Temp change: -20C
> 
> I highly recommend the vice only method. Worked very well for me. Also liquid ultra is amazing. I can have this thing running prime 95 at *1.5 volts* and still be under 90 C.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for reading.


Whoops, my email didn't show the original link you posted.

Here is the video I made for this thread a few months back:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> Hi guys! I am now part of the delid club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have some advice for everyone who is thinking about delidding. *Use the Vice-ONLY method*. No hammer, no wood block. Just a vice. It's safer.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> What you do is you put the voltage regulator side of the chip against the vice. On the opposite side, you put only the heat spreader against the corner of the vice. You slowly apply pressure, until you see the heat spreader begin to separate. Then you just peel it off with your fingers.
> 
> 
> 
> It's so, so, so much safer. It worked flawlessly.
> 
> Onto my results. I have a *TERRIBLE* overclocker, but decided to do this just for lower temps. I didn't gain any MHz, my 4770k will only go upto 4.4 GHz, even if I push it to 1.5 volts it will still crash at anything past 4.4.
> 
> Here is a temperature comparison. I kept voltage and all settings the same so you can see the difference it has.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU: 4770K 4.4 GHz
> MHz gained: 0
> TIM: Liquid Ultra
> External TIM: Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste
> CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U14s running at full speed
> Temp change: -20C
> 
> I highly recommend the vice only method. Worked very well for me. Also liquid ultra is amazing. I can have this thing running prime 95 at *1.5 volts* and still be under 90 C.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for reading.


I would appreciate the full amount of info in the format provided from the OP







then I'll add you


----------



## dan147

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would appreciate the full amount of info in the format provided from the OP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> then I'll add you


OCN Name: Dan147

CPU: 4770k

On-Die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra

IHS TIM: Noctua NT-H1

MHz gained: none

Max OC: 4400 MHz

Temp drop: 20C

Proof: http://valid.x86.fr/x385gi


----------



## rayweil

So, I finally decided to delid my 3570K. Using Gigabyte Z77X UD3H and H80i cooler.
Delidded with razor since I don't have access to a vice.
Stressing with OCCT with temp cut-off at 80C.

Defore delidding and using AS Ceramique 2, stable at 4.3GHz but couldn't get below 80C when overclocking to 4.5GHz. Didn't go beyond vCore 1.25V.

After delidding, used the Ceramique 2 for both die/IHS and IHS/Cooler and still couldn't get below 80C with OC 4.5.

Then tried Noctua NT-H1 for die/IHS and IHS/Cooler and was stable at 4.4GHz and vCore of 1.25V. Temp hovers just below 80C.

Decided to buy CLU and am using it for both die/IHS and IHS/Cooler.
OCCT at 4.5 and 1.30V for 33minutes showed temps:
core0 (46C), core2 (55C).





OCCT at same OCand vCore but with AVX Capable Linpack checked results in these:
core0 (54C), core2 (62C).





Is vCore 1.30V safe for the CPU?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> Hi guys! I am now part of the delid club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have some advice for everyone who is thinking about delidding. *Use the Vice-ONLY method*. No hammer, no wood block. Just a vice. It's safer.
> 
> What you do is you put the voltage regulator side of the chip against the vice. On the opposite side, you put only the heat spreader against the corner of the vice. You slowly apply pressure, until you see the heat spreader begin to separate. Then you just peel it off with your fingers.
> 
> 
> 
> It's so, so, so much safer. It worked flawlessly.
> 
> Onto my results. I have a *TERRIBLE* overclocker, but decided to do this just for lower temps. I didn't gain any MHz, my 4770k will only go upto 4.4 GHz, even if I push it to 1.5 volts it will still crash at anything past 4.4.
> 
> Here is a temperature comparison. I kept voltage and all settings the same so you can see the difference it has.
> 
> 
> 
> CPU: 4770K 4.4 GHz
> MHz gained: 0
> TIM: Liquid Ultra
> External TIM: Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste
> CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U14s running at full speed
> Temp change: -20C
> 
> I highly recommend the vice only method. Worked very well for me. Also liquid ultra is amazing. I can have this thing running prime 95 at *1.5 volts* and still be under 90 C.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for reading.


Wow, amazing. Someone with a worse chip then me! That's a first haha. 4.6Ghz needs 1.46v to be IBT/P95 Stable. 4.7 isn't possible at all even on 1.52v.
What do you need for 4.4GHz? haha, i need like 1.34v


----------



## dan147

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Wow, amazing. Someone with a worse chip then me! That's a first haha. 4.6Ghz needs 1.46v to be IBT/P95 Stable. 4.7 isn't possible at all even on 1.52v.
> What do you need for 4.4GHz? haha, i need like 1.34v


I am rock solid on 1.37 volts adaptive, 4.4 GHz. After that it hits a voltage wall. I'm considering trying 1.55 volts to see if it will go to 4.5 GHz. Then again, maybe I should get some OC insurance first


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> I am rock solid on 1.37 volts adaptive, 4.4 GHz. After that it hits a voltage wall. I'm considering trying 1.55 volts to see if it will go to 4.5 GHz. Then again, maybe I should get some OC insurance first


Haha, nah. Have you tried going to 4.6 or 4.7 with a 46/47x multi? I know that my 45x multi is dead on my processor, as the voltage needed for 4.6 and it still crashes. You will need considerably more voltage for 46 or 47 though. Up in the higher 1.4's most likely.


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Haha, nah. Have you tried going to 4.6 or 4.7 with a 46/47x multi? I know that my 45x multi is dead on my processor, as the voltage needed for 4.6 and it still crashes. You will need considerably more voltage for 46 or 47 though. Up in the higher 1.4's most likely.


Hint increase ioa/iod n decrease ure ram multi.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Hint increase ioa/iod n decrease ure ram multi.


Input/Output A and decrease the RAM multi and what's IOD?

Cheers btw,


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> If you look in the sheets in OP, you can find those numbers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU should be applied in a VERY thin layer! Put a TINY drop from the syringe on the die, use the brush that comes with the CLU to spread it around.. it may seam like it is all moving around as a hole, but just keep going, and it will spread out nicely.
> After you've spread it on the die, you apply the CLU left on the brush to the underside of the IHS.
> Clamp it down in the mobo and apply your favorite TIM to the top side of the IHS as you normally would.. Many suggestions on how to do this. I normally put a rice grain size amount on the center of the IHS, maybe in DIE orientation, or just a dot in the center.. then I put down the cooler and push it down while rotating it a few degrees in each direction a few times before screwing it down.
> Also, remember to remove ALL the glue that held the IHS to the CPU PCB together.. this glue is the main culprit to the high temps, since it leaves a gap between IHS and DIE
> 
> I forget witch CPU you are having.. Haswell (4670/4770) has some surface mounted thingies that may not like the CLU inbetween them, so you will need to protect those with liquid tape, clear nail polish or even a non conductive TIM like MX4 will do.. Ivy (3570/3770) does not have those.. so no problems here.
> 
> Hope this helps?


Ok, so would either of these be safe?
http://www.amazon.com/OPI-Nail-Polish-Coat-0-5-Ounce/dp/B00178VX50/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1410013615&sr=8-7&keywords=opi+base+coat
http://www.amazon.com/Revlon-Nail-Enamel-Clear-771/dp/B002UL7ITI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1410013704&sr=8-1&keywords=revlon+clear+nail+polish


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Input/Output A and decrease the RAM multi and what's IOD?
> 
> Cheers btw,


Its cpu analogue and digital i/o voltage.


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> Ok, so would either of these be safe?
> http://www.amazon.com/OPI-Nail-Polish-Coat-0-5-Ounce/dp/B00178VX50/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1410013615&sr=8-7&keywords=opi+base+coat
> http://www.amazon.com/Revlon-Nail-Enamel-Clear-771/dp/B002UL7ITI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1410013704&sr=8-1&keywords=revlon+clear+nail+polish


Nevermind. I just tested it on some other pcbs and made sure it wasn't conductive. CLP just got here, gonna go shower then add my CLP.


----------



## wes1099

OCN name: wes1099
CPU: 4670k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
Mhz gained: None yet
OC after delid: 4.5Ghz @ 1.34v max voltage
Temp drops: ~10c
Proof: http://valid.x86.fr/4c6r8c


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> OCN Name: Dan147
> 
> CPU: 4770k
> 
> On-Die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> 
> IHS TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> 
> MHz gained: none
> 
> Max OC: 4400 MHz
> 
> Temp drop: 20C
> 
> Proof: http://valid.x86.fr/x385gi


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> OCN name: wes1099
> CPU: 4670k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
> Mhz gained: None yet
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz @ 1.34v max voltage
> Temp drops: ~10c
> Proof: http://valid.x86.fr/4c6r8c


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## dan147

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Haha, nah. Have you tried going to 4.6 or 4.7 with a 46/47x multi? I know that my 45x multi is dead on my processor, as the voltage needed for 4.6 and it still crashes. You will need considerably more voltage for 46 or 47 though. Up in the higher 1.4's most likely.


Wait, really? You mean certain multipliers can be dead? And by skipping one I could get it stable? Are you messing with me?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Hint increase ioa/iod n decrease ure ram multi.


By ram multi, do you mean MHz? Because when I originally did my stability testing, I made sure that XMP was OFF and that it was running at 1600 MHz (advertised frequency for these sticks). *Are you saying I should drop it to 1333?*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Its cpu analogue and digital i/o voltage.


Could you explain what you mean here? I currently have my VIN set to 2.0 volts, Vcore 1.365 volts for 4.4 GHz.

Thanks all!


----------



## chronicfx

I can confirm that. 4.9 never worked with my 3570k but 5.0 worked very well.


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> Wait, really? You mean certain multipliers can be dead? And by skipping one I could get it stable? Are you messing with me?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By ram multi, do you mean MHz? Because when I originally did my stability testing, I made sure that XMP was OFF and that it was running at 1600 MHz (advertised frequency for these sticks). *Are you saying I should drop it to 1333?*
> Could you explain what you mean here? I currently have my VIN set to 2.0 volts, Vcore 1.365 volts for 4.4 GHz.
> 
> Thanks all!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I can confirm that. 4.9 never worked with my 3570k but 5.0 worked very well.


Not for haswell. The issue is the vcore n ioa/iod needs to have a certain fix difference. Thats y u see higher u go more issue. The 2nd issue is most ram settings are auto with general skews setting. So this will interfere certain ioa/iod voltage hence y i said drop the ram speed with the assumption ure lowering vdimm which will result in lower vddrt voltage.
Adjusting ure ram skews to suit ure config will help alot.
Btw the cooler ure cpu the less likely the above will happen but on 24/7 we are talking phase cooling at this point.

Theres no dead multiplier in haswell. Just vcore issue with the other voltages.
Hence on ln2 u get the low vid clocking worse than the higher vid cpu.


----------



## dan147

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Not for haswell. The issue is the vcore n ioa/iod needs to have a certain fix difference. Thats y u see higher u go more issue. The 2nd issue is most ram settings are auto with general skews setting. So this will interfere certain ioa/iod voltage hence y i said drop the ram speed with the assumption ure lowering vdimm which will result in lower vddrt voltage.
> Adjusting ure ram skews to suit ure config will help alot.
> Btw the cooler ure cpu the less likely the above will happen but on 24/7 we are talking phase cooling at this point.
> 
> Theres no dead multiplier in haswell. Just vcore issue with the other voltages.
> Hence on ln2 u get the low vid clocking worse than the higher vid cpu.


What would you recommend for IOA and IOD offsets to stabilize this, running at 1.47 Vcore?

I'm not sure what to put for this. The board lets the offset for both of these range from -1.0 to 1.0 volts.

Thanks


----------



## chronicfx

Just got a 4790k last week. How have the haswells over 1.4v been holding up?


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> What would you recommend for IOA and IOD offsets to stabilize this, running at 1.47 Vcore?
> 
> I'm not sure what to put for this. The board lets the offset for both of these range from -1.0 to 1.0 volts.
> 
> Thanks


No idea. Each cpu, ram n mobo bios all are different. Heck i am still testing 1.36v with vccin 1.65v on m6e.

I am just telling u the issue with haswell. Thats y sometimes low vid cpu 4790k that does [email protected] but to get the next 4.8 he needs 1.35v. So far with ram skew adjustment i am pretty dead linear up to 4.8 atm.

Just as i said skews etc also depends on bios presets hence y if u notice there is more 5ghz 4790k on non asus/asrock motherboards. But when u look at sp32m of those boards its way slower n abt the same as 4.8 speed on asus.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dan147*
> 
> Wait, really? You mean certain multipliers can be dead? And by skipping one I could get it stable? Are you messing with me?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By ram multi, do you mean MHz? Because when I originally did my stability testing, I made sure that XMP was OFF and that it was running at 1600 MHz (advertised frequency for these sticks). *Are you saying I should drop it to 1333?*
> Could you explain what you mean here? I currently have my VIN set to 2.0 volts, Vcore 1.365 volts for 4.4 GHz.
> 
> Thanks all!


Yes I believe so, it was the case for Sandy and Ivy. I know someone who can't do 4.6 on his 2700k but can do 4.7 fine. It's the same for me with 4.5 and 4.6 and many other people out there also have "dead" multis. I've never heard of anyone with a Haswell with a dead multi, but everyone I know with Haswell runs stock because "It's good enough".. You may as well give it a shot, try a couple above too.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> OCN name: wes1099
> CPU: 4670k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
> Mhz gained: None yet
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz @ 1.34v max voltage
> Temp drops: ~10c
> Proof: http://valid.x86.fr/4c6r8c


Congrats on the successful de-lid, it does look like you used a bit too much CLP on the die. You still got 10c which is great!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I can confirm that. 4.9 never worked with my 3570k but 5.0 worked very well.


5.0 on a 3570k? You lucky sod!


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yes I believe so, it was the case for Sandy and Ivy. I know someone who can't do 4.6 on his 2700k but can do 4.7 fine. It's the same for me with 4.5 and 4.6 and many other people out there also have "dead" multis. I've never heard of anyone with a Haswell with a dead multi, but everyone I know with Haswell runs stock because "It's good enough".. You may as well give it a shot, try a couple above too.
> Congrats on the successful de-lid, it does look like you used a bit too much CLP on the die. You still got 10c which is great!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.0 on a 3570k? You lucky sod!


Sandy n ivy was because of the pll overvoltage thingy. Haswell this doesnt do a thing.


----------



## Xtreme21

OCN name: Xtreme21
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: Antec Formula 7
ihs-TIM: Antec Formula 7
Mhz gained: None yet
OC after delid: still testing
Temp drops: still testing
Proof: soon

While I was replacing my motherboard yesterday I decided to go ahead and delid. I did the razor method and just took my time. I'm still getting everything back to normal so when I have time to test my OC i'll post my results.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xtreme21*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Xtreme21
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: Antec Formula 7
> ihs-TIM: Antec Formula 7
> Mhz gained: None yet
> OC after delid: still testing
> Temp drops: still testing
> Proof: soon
> 
> While I was replacing my motherboard yesterday I decided to go ahead and delid. I did the razor method and just took my time. I'm still getting everything back to normal so when I have time to test my OC i'll post my results.


You're in!







Let me know when you update! Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## wes1099

Update on my 4670k.

http://valid.canardpc.com/cutqke


----------



## rayweil

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I can confirm that. 4.9 never worked with my 3570k but 5.0 worked very well.


What vCore did you use with the 3570K 5.0GHz overclock?

How high can I push the vCore with my IvyBridge i5 3570K?


----------



## chronicfx

It was 1.48v for 5.0ghz and i am very sad to have retired it to my shelf still in the motherboard socket. At least I can keep them paired up. I had no degradation or whea errors and ran it that way for a year at least without a bluescreen, freeze or a crash. I think personally ivy are tough chips. You will be fine if you want to push 1.45v.


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> It was 1.48v for 5.0ghz and i am very sad to have retired it to my shelf still in the motherboard socket. At least I can keep them paired up. I had no degradation or whea errors and ran it that way for a year at least without a bluescreen, freeze or a crash. I think personally ivy are tough chips. You will be fine if you want to push 1.45v.


Just wondering, but how far do you think I could push my 4670k in terms of voltage on a high end air cooler?


----------



## chronicfx

I did the 5ghz the on a Noctua D14 and only went water after I bought a 7990 several months after. If you delid and use coolabs you should have nice temps. I think haswells are a bit hotter and I am finding that out with my 4790k (not delidded) which I am not willing to go over 1.4v until I see some other persons with some period of stability.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> It was 1.48v for 5.0ghz and i am very sad to have retired it to my shelf still in the motherboard socket. At least I can keep them paired up. I had no degradation or whea errors and ran it that way for a year at least without a bluescreen, freeze or a crash. I think personally ivy are tough chips. You will be fine if you want to push 1.45v.


I concur. Ivy seems pretty resilient. I have been using 5.0/1.45ish for around 1 1/2 years and have seen no problems thus far.


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I did the 5ghz the on a Noctua D14 and only went water after I bought a 7990 several months after. If you delid and use coolabs you should have nice temps. I think haswells are a bit hotter and I am finding that out with my 4790k (not delidded) which I am not willing to go over 1.4v until I see some other persons with some period of stability.


Yeah, I think I will just live with my stable 4.5Ghz @ 1.34v. I did get to 4.7Ghz on 1.36v, but that wasn't stable at all, and idle temps were too high for comfort. Maybe I will push it to the max If I ever get a water loop and I have $ to get a new chip. I need to be super careful with my 4670k right now seeing that I am next to broke and I can't afford to fry my chip.


----------



## chronicfx

4.5ghz is a good clock. Beyond this the gains are slim.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> Update on my 4670k.
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/cutqke


Updated!


----------



## chumanga

Delided my i7 4770k a bad chip 4.2 1.24v at bios 1.26v at windows. I was hitting about 75c encoding before, i used mx-4 inside die/IHS and fusion extreme x1 between IHS/Air Cooler, only 6c drop. I think i will need a good AIO water cooler and liquid compound to better results.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chumanga*
> 
> Delided my i7 4770k a bad chip 4.2 1.24v at bios 1.26v at windows. I was hitting about 75c encoding before, i used mx-4 inside die/IHS and fusion extreme x1 between IHS/Air Cooler, only 6c drop. I think i will need a good AIO water cooler and liquid compound to better results.


encoding wont show the big improvement like prime95 or ibt would. Plus you really need clp or a minimum of gelid extreme on die to see the big temp drops.

What clocks can you reach at 1.32v? I bet it does 4.4 or 4.5. If you get the right tim (clp) you could run 1.3v plus now that you popped the top off.


----------



## cyborgo09

I just delidded my 4790K.

Ambient 23.5C
4790K 4.7GHz at 1.204V
Water cooling System:XSPC Raystorm 750 EX420
Cinebench R11.5
Max CPU core temp:45C
On-die TIM:Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM:Coollaboratory Liquid Pro

I used the method with Vice and Hair Dryer.


----------



## chumanga

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> encoding wont show the big improvement like prime95 or ibt would. Plus you really need clp or a minimum of gelid extreme on die to see the big temp drops.
> 
> What clocks can you reach at 1.32v? I bet it does 4.4 or 4.5. If you get the right tim (clp) you could run 1.3v plus now that you popped the top off.


I dont made any test close before delid to compare, but i used to hit like 71/75c while running crysis 3 at physics grass level, and now it hit 71c again so no improvement after delliding. Encoding i was having 74/75c and now 69/70.

Prime95 28.5 dont work for me i have Bsod at any voltage i try, but aida64 FPU only test hit 85c now, i dont tested it before. But i think this is yet higher temps after a delid for 1.26v and 4.2ghz, in this scenario i dont see space to increase voltage to 1.3v+.

I dont know if i made a bad application of compound on die and cooler, maybe will need to reapply all to see if things change.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chumanga*
> 
> I dont made any test close before delid to compare, but i used to hit like 71/75c while running crysis 3 at physics grass level, and now it hit 71c again so no improvement after delliding. Encoding i was having 74/75c and now 69/70.
> 
> Prime95 28.5 dont work for me i have Bsod at any voltage i try, but aida64 FPU only test hit 85c now, i dont tested it before. But i think this is yet higher temps after a delid for 1.26v and 4.2ghz, in this scenario i dont see space to increase voltage to 1.3v+.
> 
> I dont know if i made a bad application of compound on die and cooler, maybe will need to reapply all to see if things change.


the tim intel used is very high quality. The practice of deliding mainly removes the black glue that intel used too much of.

It is important to use a very high quality tim like gelid extreme or clp on the die or the gains will be negligible.


----------



## akhilv1

Remember that old i5-2310 that I had found with a broken die? Well, I put in a couple of hours into it and made it into a keychain.



That soldered IHS project never panned out anyway, the die refused to be wetted from hot solder without a bit of work, which would kill the CPU. the whole top of the chip has been lapped with a scotch pad and the IHS has been reglued with silicone caulk. it makes a much better keychain than something other people have been doing with drilling holes into the cpus.


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> Remember that old i5-2310 that I had found with a broken die? Well, I put in a couple of hours into it and made it into a keychain.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That soldered IHS project never panned out anyway, the die refused to be wetted from hot solder without a bit of work, which would kill the CPU. the whole top of the chip has been lapped with a scotch pad and the IHS has been reglued with silicone caulk. it makes a much better keychain than something other people have been doing with drilling holes into the cpus.


I should do this with my dead E2140!


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> Remember that old i5-2310 that I had found with a broken die? Well, I put in a couple of hours into it and made it into a keychain.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That soldered IHS project never panned out anyway, the die refused to be wetted from hot solder without a bit of work, which would kill the CPU. the whole top of the chip has been lapped with a scotch pad and the IHS has been reglued with silicone caulk. it makes a much better keychain than something other people have been doing with drilling holes into the cpus.


How did you attach the chip to the keychain?


----------



## akhilv1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> How did you attach the chip to the keychain?


with a tin coated copper braid that i flattened and stuck under the IHS with metal roofing tape.


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> with a tin coated copper braid that i flattened and stuck under the IHS with metal roofing tape.


Interesting. Thanks!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> Remember that old i5-2310 that I had found with a broken die? Well, I put in a couple of hours into it and made it into a keychain.
> 
> 
> 
> That soldered IHS project never panned out anyway, the die refused to be wetted from hot solder without a bit of work, which would kill the CPU. the whole top of the chip has been lapped with a scotch pad and the IHS has been reglued with silicone caulk. it makes a much better keychain than something other people have been doing with drilling holes into the cpus.


You mean like my lucky P4 lid?




It's been on my keyring for over 2 years now, it was the first de-lid I did and it was successful. It's a bit worse for wear though..
I've got a few other De-lidded P4's and E21xx's laying around, might do similar to you and have a full processor next!


----------



## RickRockerr

Time to delid?







Got my 4790K and when I start IBT cores reach 98°C pretty fast and then... BOOM, bsod.
Everything running stock.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Time to delid?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got my 4790K and when I start IBT cores reach 98°C pretty fast and then... BOOM, bsod.
> Everything running stock.


Download CPU-Z and give us the Vcore reading under load.
It could be your motherboard giving to much Vcore than needed @ auto settings.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Download CPU-Z and give us the Vcore reading under load.
> It could be your motherboard giving to much Vcore than needed @ auto settings.


Already checked bios. CPU was trying to run @4.6Ghz. V-core is 1.23V @ full load. No more bsod on IBT but temps still hovering on ~98°C and cpu is throtling.


----------



## koekwau5

Running on the H80i from your signature?
Try reseat the cooler cuz it shouldn't reach such high temperatures at that voltage.

Mines not delidded yet and being cooled by a H105.
Top temp with XTU with cpu @ 4.8Ghz with 1.3V = 90 degrees.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Running on the H80i from your signature?
> Try reseat the cooler cuz it shouldn't reach such high temperatures at that voltage.
> 
> Mines not delidded yet and being cooled by a H105.
> Top temp with XTU with cpu @ 4.8Ghz with 1.3V = 90 degrees.


Yep. Have you hyper threading enabled? Im going to delid it anyway but I try to reseat the cooler before that.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Yep. Have you hyper threading enabled? Im going to delid it anyway but I try to reseat the cooler before that.


Yup I do got HT enabled.
I'll also delid if I'm satisfied with the overclock it can runs game stable at max.
Hopeing for 4.8 / 4.9 this time and with just a lil' bit of luck 5Ghz =)


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Yup I do got HT enabled.
> I'll also delid if I'm satisfied with the overclock it can runs game stable at max.
> Hopeing for 4.8 / 4.9 this time and with just a lil' bit of luck 5Ghz =)


Remounted and noticed that I forgot 1 washer from back plate







Now hitting ~81°C In IBT. Time to delid!


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Remounted and noticed that I forgot 1 washer from back plate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now hitting ~81°C In IBT. Time to delid!


Ahh good you found the cause!
Quite a temperature drop ghehe.

And with a delid it's gonna drop even more wh00t =)
More overclocking headroom


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Ahh good you found the cause!
> Quite a temperature drop ghehe.
> 
> And with a delid it's gonna drop even more wh00t =)
> More overclocking headroom


Going to delid tomorrow







I planned to delid today but friend called and I got "accidentally" drunk







But anyway, delidding tomorrow.


----------



## RickRockerr

Aaand it's done







have to wait that my friend bring me CLP because I cannot find my own







I used fiancees nail polish to cover the capasitors. 
And those are not scratch on the die


----------



## RickRockerr

OCN name: RickRockerr
CPU: 4790K
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: None yet
OC after delid: still testing
Temp drops: ~20°C
http://valid.x86.fr/ad4a6i


----------



## fleetfeather

I trust you lads have all seen the "vice and hairdryer" method, yeah? absolute cowboys imo; had no idea the PCB was that strong


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I trust you lads have all seen the "vice and hairdryer" method, yeah? absolute cowboys imo; had no idea the PCB was that strong


What a waste of Electricity. LOL. I also have a very very small (almost the size of a 2011 PCB) Vice now, so that will be easier next time.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> What a waste of Electricity. LOL. I also have a very very small (almost the size of a 2011 PCB) Vice now, so that will be easier next time.


Should've recorded my expression watching that haha.... Sitting here with the biggest smirk/grin on my face.

Had any trouble with PCB's splitting due to the angle of the chip?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Should've recorded my expression watching that haha.... Sitting here with the biggest smirk/grin on my face.
> 
> Had any trouble with PCB's splitting due to the angle of the chip?


No problems at all, and she is in my little computer chugging away right now. Still not even getting past the "warm" temps.

I also used a ruler to make it as level as possible. The ruler was meant to allow the IHS to sit flush and I had a light socket cover for the pcb... Yeah, it worked, so don't judge me, lol.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> No problems at all, and she is in my little computer chugging away right now. Still not even getting past the "warm" temps.
> 
> I also used a ruler to make it as level as possible. The ruler was meant to allow the IHS to sit flush and I had a light socket cover for the pcb... Yeah, it worked, so don't judge me, lol.


You reckon this is the way to go about it correctly?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> You reckon this is the way to go about it correctly?


That is a good start. If you have something flat, that you could use to brace the pcb and raise it up a little higher, it wouldn't be a bad idea.

I like that you have padding around it as well.


----------



## fleetfeather

Hmmm, something flat to raise the PCB higher? Would you mind breaking out MSPaint and illustrating what you mean for me?

The bubblewrap is my ghetto solution for a towel


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> You reckon this is the way to go about it correctly?


Sounds terrible, but a good flat surface that won't flex, if you decide to use it, would be an old hard drive. It will also give you a way to brace the hard drive so it doesn't shift while you are tightening.


----------



## fleetfeather

YOLO too ez.

mini hobby vice got the job done without any fuss. I agree, you'll probably find a smaller vice easier to work with; mine didn't go thump at the end (which is lucky, because I had it inserted the wrong way, and the IHS would have made hard contact against the VRMs)


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> YOLO too ez.
> 
> mini hobby vice got the job done without any fuss. I agree, you'll probably find a smaller vice easier to work with; mine didn't go thump at the end (which is lucky, because I had it inserted the wrong way, and the IHS would have made hard contact against the VRMs)


I have no idea WHY anyone would go any other way. I did Hammer and Vice the first time, and marked my CPU (4770k) pretty good. Not the second one though. Still not sure why this isn't in the first post.

It is the safest by far. It takes the exact same amount of pressure to break the epoxy, no matter the method. Why not use one that can be controlled with very minute, precise movements? Anyway, if no one is willing to do the research, they will never know.

:-D Glad to see another shiny die exposed.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> I have no idea WHY anyone would go any other way. I did Hammer and Vice the first time, and marked my CPU (4770k) pretty good. Not the second one though. Still not sure why this isn't in the first post.
> 
> It is the safest by far. It takes the exact same amount of pressure to break the epoxy, no matter the method. Why not use one that can be controlled with very minute, precise movements? Anyway, if no one is willing to do the research, they will never know.
> 
> :-D Glad to see another shiny die exposed.


I must say, now that I've seen the strength of the PCB first-hand, it is hard to imagine going another route. Thank you for the heads-up on your own method.

Looking forward to normalising the temps between my cores


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> OCN name: RickRockerr
> CPU: 4790K
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: None yet
> OC after delid: still testing
> Temp drops: ~20°C
> http://valid.x86.fr/ad4a6i


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Matt-Matt

I'm still wary about damaging the PCB using that method..

I'm still 100% happy with the razor blade method personally, I think out of about 10 CPU's I broke 1 and that was due to negligence/messing around with it. (It was a P4)


----------



## fleetfeather

I did razor for my 4770k. Should be an entry for it if you search back. Was pretty easy, but only due to the thickness of the glue. For the 4790k, the glue thickness was not thick enough for me to get a blade between the IHS and PCB


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I'm still wary about damaging the PCB using that method..
> 
> I'm still 100% happy with the razor blade method personally, I think out of about 10 CPU's I broke 1 and that was due to negligence/messing around with it. (It was a P4)


I was happy with all my delids and I choose the razor method. I even have a large vice too.

I did nick a pcb but that cpu never had an issue still. I just covered the tiny nick with clear polish and it never missed a beat. It was my first one though. The next 4 I done were perfect.

I am also happy that my current 4790k doesnt need deliding. It needs more voltage than I wanna give it for 4.8 and at 4.7 my temps are fine. Only 8c hotter than my 4770k delid w/clp at the same vcore 1.312.


----------



## Dave65

Hey guys, was wondering if it is safe to use CLU between the heat spreader and the CPU cooler?
I know it is conductive, has anyone done it along with delidding?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dave65*
> 
> Hey guys, was wondering if it is safe to use CLU between the heat spreader and the CPU cooler?
> I know it is conductive, has anyone done it along with delidding?


Yes its okay to use between the block and heat spreader just be careful of the materials on your CPU block as CLU will eat some metals. Also do not over saturate the IHS as you said it is conductive and you really don't want it to spill somewhere else. I have used it on a couple of machines for some of my friends and it works well, just take your time and make sure the block has no aluminum that will come in contact with the CLU.


----------



## DarthBaggins

Been debating on going through and delidding me 4790k just to drop my temps further, even though my readding Shin Etsu TiM and rotating my raystorm 90deg has dropped my temps at full load tremendously, but I want even better temps like I had w/ my 8350 when it was under water in Frankenstein


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarthBaggins*
> 
> Been debating on going through and delidding me 4790k just to drop my temps further.... *and rotating my raystorm 90deg has dropped my temps at full load tremendously*


That's interesting, I'll try that next time I drain my loop, so the in flow hits more directly on the die since it's basically more left justified. Thanks for the idea.


----------



## fleetfeather

any Naked Ivy users lurking?


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> any Naked Ivy users lurking?


Yes, any particular questions?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Yes, any particular questions?


Lovely








Just 2:

- TIM of choice? I have CLU, CLP and MX-4 "in stock", but I'm not against grabbing something else if there's a better option.
- Is there any benefit from 90* mounting? (Supremacy EVO, 4790k)

Thanks


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Lovely
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just 2:
> 
> - TIM of choice? I have CLU, CLP and MX-4 "in stock", but I'm not against grabbing something else if there's a better option.
> - Is there any benefit from 90* mounting? (Supremacy EVO, 4790k)
> 
> Thanks


Tim of choice CLU paired with a nickel block. If you have non nickel be aware that CLU will stain copper.

As far as orientation, the goofy orientation will net slightly better results but if you are going for direct die might as well go all out and get the max so yes the rotation of the block helps a little bit. The improvement is more marked with the IHS but on direct die still has a bit of improvement due to the way fluid flows through the block.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *defiler2k*
> 
> Tim of choice CLU paired with a nickel block. If you have non nickel be aware that CLU will stain copper.
> 
> As far as orientation, the goofy orientation will net slightly better results but if you are going for direct die might as well go all out and get the max so yes the rotation of the block helps a little bit. The improvement is more marked with the IHS but on direct die still has a bit of improvement due to the way fluid flows through the block.


Great. Thank you


----------



## Serandur

Alright, I'm finally buying the tools I need for my 3770K delid. Will this vise work fine? I mean specifically the 3 1/2" model with the rubber clamps. Thanks.


----------



## DarthBaggins

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> That's interesting, I'll try that next time I drain my loop, so the in flow hits more directly on the die since it's basically more left justified. Thanks for the idea.


Originally I had the inlet/outlets horizontal and luckily had just enough slack in the tubing to rotate without draining the loop







turns out the mating surface of the raystorm's tend not to be very flat(evenly flat ) so the rotation allowed for a better contact. Plus I was using the xspc TiM to start and was skeptical to using it in the first place but I was out of my other TiM


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Alright, I'm finally buying the tools I need for my 3770K delid. Will this vise work fine? I mean specifically the 3 1/2" model with the rubber clamps. Thanks.


That's exactly a vise that won't work, at least for hammering. That ball joint thingy it has won't be able to keep things still for the hits. For that vise-only stuff, I'd imagine the rubber is bad to have.

Mine was a bit like the "4pc" one in your link.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dave65*
> 
> Hey guys, was wondering if it is safe to use CLU between the heat spreader and the CPU cooler?
> I know it is conductive, has anyone done it along with delidding?


CLP/CLU will eat aluminum heatsinks so make sure the bottom of your heatsink is solid copper


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Serandur*
> 
> Alright, I'm finally buying the tools I need for my 3770K delid. Will this vise work fine? I mean specifically the 3 1/2" model with the rubber clamps. Thanks.


Use the vice only method, and this will be fine. Hitting it takes a much higher risk of slipping, missing of offsetting the pressure, and breaking the pcb. The vice only method is very controllable and easy to use.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> any Naked Ivy users lurking?


Used my 4770k naked, with CLLP on the die with an Ek block. I also have the IHS on the 3770k. I noticed that the 3770k give steady temps and the 4770k will bounce around.

My theory, which could be wrong, is the same though as LN2 cooling. They use thicker copper, because once it is cooled, it gives much more steady reading all the time. Going with a naked mount, it reduces the amount of copper by half, approximately, reducing the area the head can be displaced. I want to test the 4770k with the IHS on and off, to see how well it performs, and if removing it actually hurts rather than helps with ambient water cooling (non chilled at least).

P. S. I could be completely wrong as well.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Used my 4770k naked, with CLLP on the die with an Ek block. I also have the IHS on the 3770k. I noticed that the 3770k give steady temps and the 4770k will bounce around.
> 
> My theory, which could be wrong, is the same though as LN2 cooling. They use thicker copper, because once it is cooled, it gives much more steady reading all the time. Going with a naked mount, it reduces the amount of copper by half, approximately, reducing the area the head can be displaced. I want to test the 4770k with the IHS on and off, to see how well it performs, and if removing it actually hurts rather than helps with ambient water cooling (non chilled at least).
> 
> P. S. I could be completely wrong as well.


with LN2 cooling there is a massive difference int he amount of copper being cooled, so you may be right in terms of temp gains on a delidded chip. The IHS is so thin with not as much material where it might not make a difference in temps compared to naked but it "should" be lower with no IHS on the die since the delta in heat change can go directly to the cooling platform.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> with LN2 cooling there is a massive difference int he amount of copper being cooled, so you may be right in terms of temp gains on a delidded chip. The IHS is so thin with not as much material where it might not make a difference in temps compared to naked but it "should" be lower with no IHS on the die since the delta in heat change can go directly to the cooling platform.


That would make sense that it could pull it down a little. The only part I would be concerned about, and what I want to see: will it normalize the Temps rather than bounce around.


----------



## fleetfeather

Hmmmm some interesting ideas in here. I have nothing of value to add really, since I don't know anything about thermodynamics, but surely EK did some testing beforehand to validate the relevance of the Naked Ivy kit, right?

Would they really release a product that offered worse RW performance than the alternative?

I suppose the only way to figure it out is to run a couple of trials with the same chip and same workloads


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> That would make sense that it could pull it down a little. The only part I would be concerned about, and what I want to see: will it normalize the Temps rather than bounce around.


Do you mean the idle temps just moving on their own? or the higher temps or the in between area where the temps change with load?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Hmmmm some interesting ideas in here. I have nothing of value to add really, since I don't know anything about thermodynamics, but surely EK did some testing beforehand to validate the relevance of the Naked Ivy kit, right?
> 
> Would they really release a product that offered worse RW performance than the alternative?
> 
> I suppose the only way to figure it out is to run a couple of trials with the same chip and same workloads


They made that kit so one can easily mount their water cooling fixtures without taking a ton of time to make sure everything is tight but not to where it will ruin the die. It's meant for a stopper to protect your chip more than anything, plus makes mounting easier.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Do you mean the idle temps just moving on their own? or the higher temps or the in between area where the temps change with load?


Very slight movement at idle, but under full load it moves a good bit. I understand transitions from each part of it doing it's calculations and implementing things, but it seems odd at 100% load, and steady voltage, that it would jump around 10 degrees or so on all cores.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Do you mean the idle temps just moving on their own? or the higher temps or the in between area where the temps change with load?
> They made that kit so one can easily mount their water cooling fixtures without taking a ton of time to make sure everything is tight but not to where it will ruin the die. It's meant for a stopper to protect your chip more than anything, plus makes mounting easier.


Ah, gotcha. Thanks for the clarification mate


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Very slight movement at idle, but under full load it moves a good bit. I understand transitions from each part of it doing it's calculations and implementing things, but it seems odd at 100% load, and steady voltage, that it would jump around 10 degrees or so on all cores.


It could be how some of the cooling solutions work. For example a standard heatpipe system has a liquid inside those pipes that exchanges the heat, but that heat can be carried to one pipe to much soe and then change to others and vice versa. This could be making hot spots against the IHS and thus the die's representative cores, then suddenly decrease in temps as the pipes do their job. Now for the liquid cooling systems it could be a different thing in how the water flows the best, as the area of least resistance, so a core might not have the best cooling compared to others and then suddenly get a new pass of cooler water making those temps change as they do. Which makes sense as a waterblock is made to have the best "flow" rate but not necessarily the best flow pattern to reach the middle section of the IHS.

Just some thoughts is all








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Ah, gotcha. Thanks for the clarification mate


No problem what I lurk around here for









Also.... I might be in the works of a delid method that doesnt involve a vice but a custom system close to a vice, but with much more reliability, especially considering the concerns of bending the PCB with vice only and jarring the chip if vice hammer method as well. I'm thinking about making and producing this device, but curious on what you guys/gals might think about it....


----------



## matthew3041230

Greetings to all;

I know this isn;t the proper forum exactly to be asking this... but since it's Haswell OC'ing, SURELY someone has what I am after, or can direct me towards where I can find what I am looking for.. I promise I will not bloat the forum with my messages, outside formal thanks... I am looking for JUST a i7-4770k LID ONLY..... Long story short, I lost mine and I am in sincere need of another lid.. doesnt' matter, the batch number, I don't care.. going back ole' naturale' so I need it.

If any one has any information please PM me directly and I can respond that way rather than fill this awesome forum up... You guys are the best, and have helped so much...

Thanks,

Not Yet Signed


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I was happy with all my delids and I choose the razor method. I even have a large vice too.
> 
> I did nick a pcb but that cpu never had an issue still. I just covered the tiny nick with clear polish and it never missed a beat. It was my first one though. The next 4 I done were perfect.
> 
> I am also happy that my current 4790k doesnt need deliding. It needs more voltage than I wanna give it for 4.8 and at 4.7 my temps are fine. Only 8c hotter than my 4770k delid w/clp at the same vcore 1.312.


That's a good clocking chip to start with!
It's interesting that some 4790k's are really good with temps and some aren't. I've seen a mixed bag of both.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I did razor for my 4770k. Should be an entry for it if you search back. Was pretty easy, but only due to the thickness of the glue. For the 4790k, the glue thickness was not thick enough for me to get a blade between the IHS and PCB


Really? That's interesting? Did you use the 4790k before you de-lidded? I used my i5 for almost 6 months and it was hard to get under but once I'd started cutting it was ez.


----------



## Jeronbernal

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *matthew3041230*
> 
> Greetings to all;
> 
> I know this isn;t the proper forum exactly to be asking this... but since it's Haswell OC'ing, SURELY someone has what I am after, or can direct me towards where I can find what I am looking for.. I promise I will not bloat the forum with my messages, outside formal thanks... I am looking for JUST a i7-4770k LID ONLY..... Long story short, I lost mine and I am in sincere need of another lid.. doesnt' matter, the batch number, I don't care.. going back ole' naturale' so I need it.
> 
> If any one has any information please PM me directly and I can respond that way rather than fill this awesome forum up... You guys are the best, and have helped so much...
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Not Yet Signed


if you end up not being able to find anyone selling a lid, you can always just buy the cheapest 1150 proc or broken proc online, i think you can get celerons for the $40`50 range or something, just use that lid, and lap it while your at it









id give you my extra one, but i already drilled a hole to make it into a keychain :/


----------



## matthew3041230

Well shoot..lol. no, I truly need the 4770k lid...I did think of that but I'm too much of a man of principle, and it would just eat me up.... I certainly appreciate the thougt..


----------



## Matt-Matt

I have a couple of de-lidded 775 processors here, you're welcome to have a lid if you pay for shipping from Australia? It would likely be minimal cost wise.

How'd you manage to lose it anyway?


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *matthew3041230*
> 
> Greetings to all;
> 
> I know this isn;t the proper forum exactly to be asking this... but since it's Haswell OC'ing, SURELY someone has what I am after, or can direct me towards where I can find what I am looking for.. I promise I will not bloat the forum with my messages, outside formal thanks... I am looking for JUST a i7-4770k LID ONLY..... Long story short, I lost mine and I am in sincere need of another lid.. doesnt' matter, the batch number, I don't care.. going back ole' naturale' so I need it.
> 
> If any one has any information please PM me directly and I can respond that way rather than fill this awesome forum up... You guys are the best, and have helped so much...
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Not Yet Signed


One thing you could do is buy a dead lga1150 processor off of ebay and take it's IHS. Or if you can deal with I slightly differently shaped IHS, you might be able to use one from an old 775 cpu.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> One thing you could do is buy a dead lga1150 processor off of ebay and take it's IHS. Or if you can deal with I slightly differently shaped IHS, you might be able to use one from an old 775 cpu.


i like the earlier idea of using a Haswell celeron or pentium. He can lap the info off and no one will know the difference.


----------



## curly haired boy

so uh

my 4770k is running an OC of about 4.2 with 1.15 v

idling mid-to-upper 30s, and running games usually takes it to around 60, never breaking 65. prime small FFTs creeps above 85 if i let it go longer than around a minute.

cooled by an h100i and 2 really beefy (150 cfm, 14 mm sp) delta fans. at load, rad air is barely warmer than ambient.

using Gelid GC extreme, have remounted half a dozen times.

delid? and if so, which method? the heat's just not making it to the rad....


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> so uh
> 
> my 4770k is running an OC of about 4.2 with 1.15 v
> 
> idling mid-to-upper 30s, and running games usually takes it to around 60, never breaking 65. prime small FFTs creeps above 85 if i let it go longer than around a minute.
> 
> cooled by an h100i and 2 really beefy (150 cfm, 14 mm sp) delta fans. at load, rad air is barely warmer than ambient.
> 
> using Gelid GC extreme, have remounted half a dozen times.
> 
> delid? and if so, which method? the heat's just not making it to the rad....


I've found that you won't really feel the heat coming out of the rad because the airflow makes your hand feel cold.
But you're definitely right in the fact that it's not really getting the heat away from the die effectively, as 1.15v is literally a tad above stock.

I would advise a de-lid if you feel comfortable doing so, whichever method you prefer. I suggest to try it on an older CPU too however.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> i like the earlier idea of using a Haswell celeron or pentium. He can lap the info off and no one will know the difference.


True, make sure it's a Ivy/Haswell chip then. I tried to use a P4 lid which I'd lapped and it didn't go well at all. I'd hit 100c in BF3 pretty fast as it was too big/too tall on the sides from what I remember. I re-applied it with the i5 lid and it went down to like 50-60c at the same settings.

The P4 lids are a LOT different to the 775 lids, hence why I've said I think one may work.

Left is the 2.8GHz P4 lid, right is an E2140 lid. You can see that the E2140 looks very similar to the Ivy/Haswell lids, whereas the P4 looks like a metal chunk.


----------



## curly haired boy

i'm pretty familiar with technical stuff as an engineer, and i have a micro center close enough that a replacement isn't gonna be too much of a hit to the wallet (might replace with a 4790k if i mess up). MC's CPU prices can't be beat









i feel okay with the vice method. do i need to coat the surface mounted components next to the die with something? reading up, i saw that some people do that. also i mainly use 99% isopropyl to clean off TIM, will that work for cleaning the die and IHS?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Awesome, When I did mine I had no backup processor or any money for one I just went for it haha.

You don't need to coat them.. But I'd advise it, I've seen a lot of people use clear nail polish. I've never de-lidded anything post Ivy so everything has no capacitors on the top side.
If you're using a TIM that's not metal based I'd suggest to not waste your time coating them, but if you are using something such as Liquid Metal or Artic Silver I would.

99% isopropyl should be fine, I just used methylated spirits on all of my de-lids, it is essentially just like a laptop processor once you take the lid off. I used cotton buds and a tissue to wipe it all off too, haven't had any issues with it since I did it back at Christmas time 2012. Well apart from the IHS being stuck on due to the CLU drying up haha.

I could probably heat it up and get it off, but it works and there isn't much point in wasting my time to fix something that works and potentially break it.

Some pictures of my procrastination at it's finest.. lol


----------



## curly haired boy

so would something like the GC extreme i'm already using work well?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> so would something like the GC extreme i'm already using work well?


For on die TIM? I'd suggest something metal, like the Coolabs Liquid Metal or Pro, as it's a bit more effective. I've never dealth with GC Extreme but by looking at reviews it's up there with the metals that I mentioned. I'd give it a go if you have some on hand, be very careful to get the thinnest layer possible as the thicker it is the worse it gets for the on-die TIM.


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> For on die TIM? I'd suggest something metal, like the Coolabs Liquid Metal or Pro, as it's a bit more effective. I've never dealth with GC Extreme but by looking at reviews it's up there with the metals that I mentioned. I'd give it a go if you have some on hand, be very careful to get the thinnest layer possible as the thicker it is the worse it gets for the on-die TIM.


i'm leaning towards the GC extreme for a number of reasons - it's nonconductive, it doesn't seem to have the drying out issues mentioned by some when dealing with CLP/CLU, and it's maybe 2 degrees difference







i will take your advice for going as thin as possible....that's the problem in the first place


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> i'm leaning towards the GC extreme for a number of reasons - it's nonconductive, it doesn't seem to have the drying out issues mentioned by some when dealing with CLP/CLU, and it's maybe 2 degrees difference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i will take your advice for going as thin as possible....that's the problem in the first place


In my experience I tried the same thing using what I used pre delid. Temps dropped some but not has desired. I ended up buying CLU and had a little more drop in temps. Been on for a few months now and haven't had any issues thus far. I have no arguments but for the sake of science when you are finished with your procedure lets find a overclock that both our units can process and be stable and run the same stress test and monitoring programs and see the temp difference. I think this will be useful for future delid members.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnownDragon*
> 
> In my experience I tried the same thing using what I used pre delid. Temps dropped some but not has desired. I ended up buying CLU and had a little more drop in temps. Been on for a few months now and haven't had any issues thus far. I have no arguments but for the sake of science when you are finished with your procedure lets find a overclock that both our units can process and be stable and run the same stress test and monitoring programs and see the temp difference. I think this will be useful for future delid members.


That would be a really good idea, but you have different processors :/


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> That would be a really good idea, but you have different processors :/


I am sure someone should have the same one has you. For science might be willing to try. What processor do you have?


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnownDragon*
> 
> In my experience I tried the same thing using what I used pre delid. Temps dropped some but not has desired. I ended up buying CLU and had a little more drop in temps. Been on for a few months now and haven't had any issues thus far. I have no arguments but for the sake of science when you are finished with your procedure lets find a overclock that both our units can process and be stable and run the same stress test and monitoring programs and see the temp difference. I think this will be useful for future delid members.


i think i just have really thick glue on mine. expecting a good 10-15 drop in temps.


----------



## Dave65

Great, thanks guys for the info, I believe the bottom of h100i is copper so I should be good..thanks again:thumb:


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I've found that you won't really feel the heat coming out of the rad because the airflow makes your hand feel cold.
> But you're definitely right in the fact that it's not really getting the heat away from the die effectively, as 1.15v is literally a tad above stock.
> 
> I would advise a de-lid if you feel comfortable doing so, whichever method you prefer. I suggest to try it on an older CPU too however.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> True, make sure it's a Ivy/Haswell chip then. I tried to use a P4 lid which I'd lapped and it didn't go well at all. I'd hit 100c in BF3 pretty fast as it was too big/too tall on the sides from what I remember. I re-applied it with the i5 lid and it went down to like 50-60c at the same settings.
> 
> The P4 lids are a LOT different to the 775 lids, hence why I've said I think one may work.
> 
> Left is the 2.8GHz P4 lid, right is an E2140 lid. You can see that the E2140 looks very similar to the Ivy/Haswell lids, whereas the P4 looks like a metal chunk.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Speaking of the E2140, I have a dead one right here next to me. Well, I am assuming it is dead since there was a slight slip up in the delidding process and I took a tiny chunk of PCB out of the edge. It was of no use to me anyway, I have no working LGA775 motherboard for it. I was going to take a picture of the spot where I chipped it, but the only camera I own is on my 4 year old iPhone 4 which can not focus on things that get that close to it. I think I will make the dead CPU into a keychain or something of that sort.


----------



## curly haired boy

welp, delidded and back to my 4.2 overclock. chopped a lot off my load temps, even without the CLU/CLP! before, small FFTs would take me into the upper 80s. now? mid-70s









without the OC, my load temps dropped roughly....20 C.

also i haven't had a chance to properly test with a consistent ambient, it's pretty warm in here right now. overall, it was a very easy - although meticulous - process. very glad i did it! air coming out of the h100i actually seems WARM!







and, as i suspected, the epoxy holding the IHS on was ridiculously thick.


----------



## fleetfeather

Weighing up the options of Naked mount vs lapped mount.

Leaning towards lapped mount due to the discussion the other day regarding the purpose of Naked mount kits, but still open to suggestions and recommendations


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> [/SPOILER] Speaking of the E2140, I have a dead one right here next to me. Well, I am assuming it is dead since there was a slight slip up in the delidding process and I took a tiny chunk of PCB out of the edge. It was of no use to me anyway, I have no working LGA775 motherboard for it. I was going to take a picture of the spot where I chipped it, but the only camera I own is on my 4 year old iPhone 4 which can not focus on things that get that close to it. I think I will make the dead CPU into a keychain or something of that sort.


Nice, if you saw my photo before you'd see that my keychain has a P4 lid on it, it's been there for almost two years now. The hole fitted it perfectly, I've now got a few E2140's and Pentiums that are de-lidded and have no use. I've ruined the Pentium by sanding it back because I was bored but the E2140's still work from what I can tell. Probably going to use the E2140 as a keychain too.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Weighing up the options of Naked mount vs lapped mount.
> 
> Leaning towards lapped mount due to the discussion the other day regarding the purpose of Naked mount kits, but still open to suggestions and recommendations


If you've got a waterblock go naked mount if you feel comfortable doing so.. If you don't have waterblock it's too much risk really because of the weight of the cooler on the naked die.


----------



## delgon

I delidded my first CPU yesterday







Pentium G3258, i decided to do it because my delta core1 to core2 was 14C so something went pretty bad







now i'm running on dice with CLP and my temps dropped by 15C and my cores have the same temp







(1-2C diff). I was soooo scared when my computer wouldn't boot







my water block wasn't close enough to dice. I mounted it with 1 more twist to screws an it booted so i instantly went to bios to check temp and.... 88C







just turned of my PSU instantly xDDD then i rotated screws by 2 turns and it booted with 34C. In windows while doing Prime95 i was continuing to rotate 1/4 each 3 minutes and my temperatures are now stable at 70C with small







thanks to that i could OC my pentium from 4.7 to 4.9 so i's satisfied







My delidding was scary because in the middle of cutting (i used razor method) my razor broke  and little piece stuck inside between PCB and IHS







but fortunately everything went good and now I'm soooo happy xD
(Sorry for my english







)


----------



## Lantian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *delgon*
> 
> I delidded my first CPU yesterday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pentium G3258, i decided to do it because my delta core1 to core2 was 14C so something went pretty bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now i'm running on dice with CLP and my temps dropped by 15C and my cores have the same temp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (1-2C diff). I was soooo scared when my computer wouldn't boot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my water block wasn't close enough to dice. I mounted it with 1 more twist to screws an it booted so i instantly went to bios to check temp and.... 88C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just turned of my PSU instantly xDDD then i rotated screws by 2 turns and it booted with 34C. In windows while doing Prime95 i was continuing to rotate 1/4 each 3 minutes and my temperatures are now stable at 70C with small
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks to that i could OC my pentium from 4.7 to 4.9 so i's satisfied
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My delidding was scary because in the middle of cutting (i used razor method) my razor broke  and little piece stuck inside between PCB and IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but fortunately everything went good and now I'm soooo happy xD
> (Sorry for my english
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Dice usually means dry ice, how can you run that with clp together, not to mention temps are way to high for dice?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *delgon*
> 
> I delidded my first CPU yesterday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pentium G3258, i decided to do it because my delta core1 to core2 was 14C so something went pretty bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now i'm running on dice with CLP and my temps dropped by 15C and my cores have the same temp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (1-2C diff). I was soooo scared when my computer wouldn't boot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my water block wasn't close enough to dice. I mounted it with 1 more twist to screws an it booted so i instantly went to bios to check temp and.... 88C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just turned of my PSU instantly xDDD then i rotated screws by 2 turns and it booted with 34C. In windows while doing Prime95 i was continuing to rotate 1/4 each 3 minutes and my temperatures are now stable at 70C with small
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks to that i could OC my pentium from 4.7 to 4.9 so i's satisfied
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My delidding was scary because in the middle of cutting (i used razor method) my razor broke  and little piece stuck inside between PCB and IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but fortunately everything went good and now I'm soooo happy xD
> (Sorry for my english
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lantian*
> 
> Dice usually means dry ice, how can you run that with clp together, not to mention temps are way to high for dice?


Exactly what I thought when I read the message.


----------



## delgon

sorry







thats my fauilt







i run i on bare cpu







heres my inexperiense


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *delgon*
> 
> I delidded my first CPU yesterday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pentium G3258, i decided to do it because my delta core1 to core2 was 14C so something went pretty bad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now i'm running on dice with CLP and my temps dropped by 15C and my cores have the same temp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (1-2C diff). I was soooo scared when my computer wouldn't boot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my water block wasn't close enough to dice. I mounted it with 1 more twist to screws an it booted so i instantly went to bios to check temp and.... 88C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just turned of my PSU instantly xDDD then i rotated screws by 2 turns and it booted with 34C. In windows while doing Prime95 i was continuing to rotate 1/4 each 3 minutes and my temperatures are now stable at 70C with small
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks to that i could OC my pentium from 4.7 to 4.9 so i's satisfied
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My delidding was scary because in the middle of cutting (i used razor method) my razor broke  and little piece stuck inside between PCB and IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but fortunately everything went good and now I'm soooo happy xD
> (Sorry for my english
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


very nicely done!

if you'd like to have the Sig on your account just give me some of the info I need that's stated from the first page and I'll add you


----------



## delgon

OCN name: Delgon
CPU: Intel Pentium G3258
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: No IHS
Mhz gained: 200
OC after delid: Core 4900 with 1.48v & Uncore 4500 with 1.305v
Temp drops: Prime95 87 -> 55 // x264 74 -> 50 (thats improvement xD)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: valid.x86.fr/m462ql

Temps @ 4.9GHz 1.48v / Prime95 1core 69C (avr. 61.6C) 2core 66C (avr. 62.4) // x264 63C (avr. 56) (1&2 almost the same)
More: I lapped my Water Block up to 2500 grid.
Cooling: Rad EK CoolStream XTC 280 + D5 + Supreme HF
Voltages:
Vccin: 2.08v
vCore: 1.48v
vCache: 1.305v
Vccsa: +0.225 offset
CPU Digital I/O (VTT): +0.125 offset
CPU Analog I/O: +0.125 offset
PCH Core: 1.08

You will have to add 3-4C to each if u want to know my silent (600rpm for each fan) temps.

Honestly speaking i had big problem with my ram. Stable at 1066 but not with my stock 1600







but now everything is ok. It can pass 30 runs of x264 stress test so its nice and reduced timings from ram (9-9-9-27 -> 9-9-7-18 pass 10h of laps in memtest so its pretty stable.

I Decided to delidd my CPU because in prime95 core1 ran like 87C!! but core2 only 75 (LOL) there was something wrong with those temps certainly.
Unfortunately i can't post picture of my miserable work but i can try to watch what i made with my laptop camera







8th second and 28th!!!! are so faking scary, especially this 28th. This razor was took thick







so i had to change and sorry for those CPU below table but i had to add some force to make it







I hope this will suffice xD (its in crapy quality







and i forgot that its on)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1262lcryfpjz5iu/Delidding.mp4?dl=0


Now i run at these voltages with 63 spike in x264 and average of 56 so it's cool







.
I had hard time with installing this deluded chip too







my mounting for WB was too high so i had to come up with something. this is what i have done XD



these little silver screws should be in he back and these gold one mounter to them in the front. So i mounted these gold in front (to make it able to mount on die) But i couldn't install my springs and capes too so i mounter these little caps (i hope u can see them







)



I know that Maximus VII Hero is Overkill for this chip but i bought it because it support the newest DC and future 14nm processors







With these clocks my GTX 670 is slowing me down now xD Now I'm trying to reduce vccin a little bit from this 2.08v. In CB R15 i get 362 and 188







53% OC sounds nice too


----------



## Matt-Matt

Not sure if it's a moot point, but someone gave me a E6300 as a keychain and according to the list it was glued..
Mine wasn't at least, got lots of tiny shards of the glass in my hand too; ouch.

My idea was to make an E6300 lid keychain, as my P4 one is getting old now but eh. I can't use it as I'll get shards of glass everywhere.


----------



## fleetfeather

That's hype! 4.9ghz with 1.48Vcore on a g3258









BL matt haha


----------



## incog

Isn't 1.48V going to kill the chip?


----------



## delgon

Its only 2 core processor and cost only 70$ ;D i need it only for max 1 year anyway


----------



## fleetfeather

over time, sure


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *delgon*
> 
> Its only 2 core processor and cost only 70$ ;D i need it only for max 1 year anyway


the pursuit of performance!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *delgon*
> 
> OCN name: Delgon
> CPU: Intel Pentium G3258
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: No IHS
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: Core 4900 with 1.48v & Uncore 4500 with 1.305v
> Temp drops: Prime95 87 -> 55 // x264 74 -> 50 (thats improvement xD)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: valid.x86.fr/m462ql
> 
> Temps @ 4.9GHz 1.48v / Prime95 1core 69C (avr. 61.6C) 2core 66C (avr. 62.4) // x264 63C (avr. 56) (1&2 almost the same)
> More: I lapped my Water Block up to 2500 grid.
> Cooling: Rad EK CoolStream XTC 280 + D5 + Supreme HF
> Voltages:
> Vccin: 2.08v
> vCore: 1.48v
> vCache: 1.305v
> Vccsa: +0.225 offset
> CPU Digital I/O (VTT): +0.125 offset
> CPU Analog I/O: +0.125 offset
> PCH Core: 1.08
> 
> You will have to add 3-4C to each if u want to know my silent (600rpm for each fan) temps.
> 
> Honestly speaking i had big problem with my ram. Stable at 1066 but not with my stock 1600
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but now everything is ok. It can pass 30 runs of x264 stress test so its nice and reduced timings from ram (9-9-9-27 -> 9-9-7-18 pass 10h of laps in memtest so its pretty stable.
> 
> I Decided to delidd my CPU because in prime95 core1 ran like 87C!! but core2 only 75 (LOL) there was something wrong with those temps certainly.
> Unfortunately i can't post picture of my miserable work but i can try to watch what i made with my laptop camera
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 8th second and 28th!!!! are so faking scary, especially this 28th. This razor was took thick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so i had to change and sorry for those CPU below table but i had to add some force to make it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope this will suffice xD (its in crapy quality
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and i forgot that its on)
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/1262lcryfpjz5iu/Delidding.mp4?dl=0
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now i run at these voltages with 63 spike in x264 and average of 56 so it's cool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> I had hard time with installing this deluded chip too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my mounting for WB was too high so i had to come up with something. this is what i have done XD
> 
> 
> 
> these little silver screws should be in he back and these gold one mounter to them in the front. So i mounted these gold in front (to make it able to mount on die) But i couldn't install my springs and capes too so i mounter these little caps (i hope u can see them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know that Maximus VII Hero is Overkill for this chip but i bought it because it support the newest DC and future 14nm processors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With these clocks my GTX 670 is slowing me down now xD Now I'm trying to reduce vccin a little bit from this 2.08v. In CB R15 i get 362 and 188
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 53% OC sounds nice too


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Not sure if it's a moot point, but someone gave me a E6300 as a keychain and according to the list it was glued..
> Mine wasn't at least, got lots of tiny shards of the glass in my hand too; ouch.
> 
> My idea was to make an E6300 lid keychain, as my P4 one is getting old now but eh. I can't use it as I'll get shards of glass everywhere.


hmmmm weird I'll have to check some of mine then


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> That's hype! 4.9ghz with 1.48Vcore on a g3258
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BL matt haha


Haha it's cool, it was already key-chained and pretty useless anyway as I don't have a socket 775 board nor do I have any DDR2 or anything haha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> hmmmm weird I'll have to check some of mine then


Maybe it's just certain batches or something? I got lots of glass in my hand when this came off because I didn't expect it and it hurt like a female dog!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Haha it's cool, it was already key-chained and pretty useless anyway as I don't have a socket 775 board nor do I have any DDR2 or anything haha.
> Maybe it's just certain batches or something? I got lots of glass in my hand when this came off because I didn't expect it and it hurt like a female dog!


most likely but if not I'll take it off the list


----------



## fleetfeather

Any advice for easing the cleaning process? The black gunk is more stubborn than I remembered...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Any advice for easing the cleaning process? The black gunk is more stubborn than I remembered...


Use a credit card or a small blade to remove it. A light dremel can also work but is risky.


----------



## fleetfeather

Yeah got the credit card out atm, but progress is super slow haha... Probably because the chip has been sitting around uncleaned with the IHS resting on top for the past 2 weeks









edit:


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Yeah got the credit card out atm, but progress is super slow haha... Probably because the chip has been sitting around uncleaned with the IHS resting on top for the past 2 weeks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> edit:


Haha true, true.

I found that the blade that I cut it with got rid of the large chunks well if you're careful but it's extra risk that you don't need to take.

Why have you had it out so long anyway?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Haha true, true.
> 
> I found that the blade that I cut it with got rid of the large chunks well if you're careful but it's extra risk that you don't need to take.
> 
> Why have you had it out so long anyway?


Yeah I picked up one of my blades, held it close to the pcb, then put the blade back down again haha....









It's been out because I've been slack / busy / PC-less for a few weeks. No excuse really, just hadn't been enthused enough to get it done until tonight (I have to get it cleaned up so I can test out this new GTX 970 that arrived)


----------



## aviationfrk

+1 delid with the vice method.

OCN name: aviationfrk
CPU: i7-4770k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 400 MHz
OC after delid: 4.6 GHz
Temp drops: ~15 C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/s3aq00

Currently running with a CM Hyper 212+ evo. Corsair H80i ordered yesterday on the way and hoping for a higher clock once that arrives!!

Edited to add that the IHS was also lapped using 400, 1000, and finally 1500 grit sandpaper. Shows only copper now!


----------



## TheCautiousOne

Alright.... I made it here. Just put together a custom loop to battle the H100i... Getting temps in the higher 80's range after stress test of Realbench 2.2. 89c after 30min using 4770k at 4.5ghz with 1.275v (boost to 1.296 at max) all 16gb of 1866mhz ram used in stress test. I think the time has come to delid. Reapplied TIM 3 times by two different companies. My rig.


Getting a razor at work today... I have waited a long time to do this and have coolabratory liquid ultra at the crib already.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Just be careful and take your time.. alternatively, throw it in a vice and wack it with a hammer








But since you are getting the blade from work, im assuming you know how to use it.. should be good.


----------



## TheCautiousOne

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> But since you are getting the blade from work, im assuming you know how to use it.. should be good.


I know how to use a blade my friend. Il slap some pics up for yall. I am super excited to see some real temps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> +1 delid with the vice method.
> 
> OCN name: aviationfrk
> CPU: i7-4770k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 400 MHz
> OC after delid: 4.6 GHz
> Temp drops: ~15 C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/s3aq00
> 
> Currently running with a CM Hyper 212+ evo. Corsair H80i ordered yesterday on the way and hoping for a higher clock once that arrives!!
> 
> Edited to add that the IHS was also lapped using 400, 1000, and finally 1500 grit sandpaper. Shows only copper now!


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheCautiousOne*
> 
> Alright.... I made it here. Just put together a custom loop to battle the H100i... Getting temps in the higher 80's range after stress test of Realbench 2.2. 89c after 30min using 4770k at 4.5ghz with 1.275v (boost to 1.296 at max) all 16gb of 1866mhz ram used in stress test. I think the time has come to delid. Reapplied TIM 3 times by two different companies. My rig.
> 
> 
> Getting a razor at work today... I have waited a long time to do this and have coolabratory liquid ultra at the crib already.


Good luck and read material just in case! Hope to see you soon!


----------



## TheCautiousOne

Quick question.. Do I need nail polish?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheCautiousOne*
> 
> Quick question.. Do I need nail polish?


You dont NEED it.. but CLU is conductive and therefore it is able to short-out those small surface mounted things next to the die.. so we tend to cover those with something to prevent this from happening.. nail polish, none conductive tim like MX4, liquid electrical tape.. its all good









And yes, your 4770k has those surface mounted thingys! so it is advisable for you to get some clear nail polish.


----------



## delgon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> You dont NEED it.. but CLU is conductive and therefore it is able to shorten out those small surface mounted things next to the die.. so we tend to cover those with something to prevent this from happening.. nail polish, none conductive tim like MX4, liquid electrical tape.. its all good


Upss. I didnt







but its alive after a few days so i can asume its ok







)


----------



## TheCautiousOne

Ok got some off of the girls at work. We are ready to rock. I got a neutral color. Does it have to be clear????


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Add one for the Razor method
Ocn name: FastEddieNYC
Cpu-I7 4790k
On Die-CLU
IHS-Tim Mate 2(Swiftech)
MHz gained- 200
OC after delid- [email protected]
Temp drop 21c
Validation- still testing stability



It was easier than I expected. I used the thinnest blade I could buy. Before Delid I was at [email protected] 85~89c prime. Now 4.8 same vcore 64~68c. I want to thank everyone here at OCN for sharing their experiences and knowledge. It made doing the delid a success.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *delgon*
> 
> Upss. I didnt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but its alive after a few days so i can asume its ok
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Im sure the CPU can survive without.. but if you get just a bit too much CLP/CLU on the die, and it is pumped out, you risk to short-cricketing some of them.

This is just my opinion, but unless you are 100% sure that your CLP/CLU cant land on those things, I revisit the chip and add some protection








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheCautiousOne*
> 
> Ok got some off of the girls at work. We are ready to rock. I got a neutral color. Does it have to be clear????


It doesnt HAVE to be clear.. it just cant have any conductive material in it, like metal flakes and what not.. not the big expert on nail polish







thats why we encourage clear, it rarely has any conductive components in it.


----------



## TheCautiousOne

Its happening









Edit: Complete and checking temps now.

YOu can add me Captain.








Processor: 4770k
Used Coolabratory Ultra
Overclock before De-Lid: 4.5Ghz , 1.275 Core V, Cache ratio/volatage: Set to auto/auto, 16gb ram set at 1866mhz. Temps at 100% Load for 30 min using Realbench 2.2 = 89C
Working on Temps Now

EDIT and UDATE:
Temp decrease = 10C

Ran Realbench again for 15 min with same settings.
78C Max


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Before I removed the cpu to Delid I checked my contact area on IHS/water block and saw that the best contact was on the sides and not the middle.

I'm surprised how concave it was. My Q9400 and 2500k were great compared to the 4790k. Got to love Intel's quality control


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheCautiousOne*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its happening
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Complete and checking temps now.
> 
> YOu can add me Captain.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Processor: 4770k
> Used Coolabratory Ultra
> Overclock before De-Lid: 4.5Ghz , 1.275 Core V, Cache ratio/volatage: Set to auto/auto, 16gb ram set at 1866mhz. Temps at 100% Load for 30 min using Realbench 2.2 = 89C
> Working on Temps Now
> 
> EDIT and UDATE:
> Temp decrease = 10C
> 
> Ran Realbench again for 15 min with same settings.
> 78C Max


Congrats body!








Looks like a good delid!
Do I see a tiny PCB scrape in one of the corners?







looks like you covered it in nail polish too.. good lad.
10C wasn't a major drop though :S we usually see closer to 15 and above.. maybe a bit too much CLU? it is always hard to tell









All in all, looks good! and thanks for all the pictures!


----------



## DarthBaggins

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FastEddieNYC*
> 
> Before I removed the cpu to Delid I checked my contact area on IHS/water block and saw that the best contact was on the sides and not the middle.
> 
> I'm surprised how concave it was. My Q9400 and 2500k were great compared to the 4790k. Got to love Intel's quality control


yeah I've noticed that about the lids on the DC chips, and I'd love to see a 10c+ drop in my temps at 4.6 (linux)/4.7 (windows) (both OS's sit at 68-73c under full folding load)


----------



## TheCautiousOne

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Congrats body!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like a good delid!
> Do I see a tiny PCB scrape in one of the corners?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> looks like you covered it in nail polish too.. good lad.
> 10C wasn't a major drop though :S we usually see closer to 15 and above.. maybe a bit too much CLU? it is always hard to tell
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All in all, looks good! and thanks for all the pictures!


How can I easily Reapply the CLU? Will Alcohol Remove it?


----------



## curly haired boy

i figure when i have time i'll do a proper lapping job for my h100i and IHS. mo' flatter, mo' better









still want to hear more about CLU durability. not that i care about warranties after a delid, but these things are tricky for temp optimizations...


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheCautiousOne*
> 
> How can I easily Reapply the CLU? Will Alcohol Remove it?


You don't really have to reapply it completely from scratch. You can add to or remove from what's already there, then use the brush again to distribute it.

If you want to completely remove it, alcohol doesn't really help. You remove it mechanically, wipe it away with a paper towel for example. On metal, it will leave some residue that doesn't want to go away (you can wipe and wipe and your finger won't stop getting dirty), but that residue is not harmful for the temperatures, is still just CLU.


----------



## koekwau5

Delidded 4790K number 4.
And again this CPU was holding on tight very well. Very very bad adhesive application =(
Even with the help of a towel still bitemark from the vice.
This is where the small sanding thingy from the CLP comes in handy =)

My Sony EXPERIA Z2 battery was drained when I wanted to shoot photo of the poor adhesive application. Got it on whatsapp, need to find a way to get it here.
Will show that one later =)









Edit: found a way to save it and send it via email =) poor quality from my backup Nokia but the stupid thick layer is visible:



Edit 2: Notice the photo above was straight after the IHS came loose from the PCB. Look at the die how clean it is!
Due to the thick layer it hardly made contact.

Currently running 4.6Ghz @ 1.15V and 65 degrees max with XTU benchmark / stress test =)


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Update my delid results
FastEddienyc
4790K batch L419B535
aida64 8 Hr stable. x264 12 hr stable (52C load)[email protected]
Validation http://valid.canardpc.com/nvjagm

My last chip (3770) was a poor overclocker so it looks like I got lucky this time.
Now testing [email protected]


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Delidded 4790K number 4.
> And again this CPU was holding on tight very well. Very very bad adhesive application =(
> Even with the help of a towel still bitemark from the vice.
> This is where the small sanding thingy from the CLP comes in handy =)
> 
> My Sony EXPERIA Z2 battery was drained when I wanted to shoot photo of the poor adhesive application. Got it on whatsapp, need to find a way to get it here.
> Will show that one later =)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: found a way to save it and send it via email =) poor quality from my backup Nokia but the stupid thick layer is visible:
> 
> 
> 
> Edit 2: Notice the photo above was straight after the IHS came loose from the PCB. Look at the die how clean it is!
> Due to the thick layer it hardly made contact.
> 
> Currently running 4.6Ghz @ 1.15V and 65 degrees max with XTU benchmark / stress test =)


Noticed temps didn't differ that much. Only 5 degrees or so.
Removed the H105 heatsink and noticed the IHS wasn't sitting straight and being clamped down harder on the right than on th left.
Reseated the IHS and H105 heatsink and now 4.7Ghz @ 1.2V with only 60 degrees.

Edit: 4.8Ghz @ 1.275V max temp 69 degrees with X264 stress test.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FastEddieNYC*
> 
> Add one for the Razor method
> Ocn name: FastEddieNYC
> Cpu-I7 4790k
> On Die-CLU
> IHS-Tim Mate 2(Swiftech)
> MHz gained- 200
> OC after delid- [email protected]
> Temp drop 21c
> Validation- still testing stability
> 
> 
> 
> It was easier than I expected. I used the thinnest blade I could buy. Before Delid I was at [email protected] 85~89c prime. Now 4.8 same vcore 64~68c. I want to thank everyone here at OCN for sharing their experiences and knowledge. It made doing the delid a success.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheCautiousOne*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its happening
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Complete and checking temps now.
> 
> YOu can add me Captain.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Processor: 4770k
> Used Coolabratory Ultra
> Overclock before De-Lid: 4.5Ghz , 1.275 Core V, Cache ratio/volatage: Set to auto/auto, 16gb ram set at 1866mhz. Temps at 100% Load for 30 min using Realbench 2.2 = 89C
> Working on Temps Now
> 
> EDIT and UDATE:
> Temp decrease = 10C
> 
> Ran Realbench again for 15 min with same settings.
> 78C Max


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## TheCautiousOne

YES!!! Thanks Cap!!!


----------



## aviationfrk

Whelp here is a semi successful delid of a G3258 I did today. Unfortunately, this was a rather good G3258 as it was running [email protected] and maintaining 60c. (thats with CLP between the CPU/IHS and AS5 between the IHS and stock cpu cooler) After the delid, i had it folding in a spare MSI motherboard i had laying around (B85M Gaming) and about 30 mins into the fold it shut off and one of the VRMs below the heat spreader started smoking. Unfortunately, i think this is the end of the CPU as I am afraid to put it in my gigabyte Z87X for obvious reasons. Just a reminder that not all delids come risk free. Unfortunately, i can't tell if a faulty mobo or a mistake with the delid.

Here are some pictures of the since deceased mobo / CPU:


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> Whelp here is a semi successful delid of a G3258 I did today. Unfortunately, this was a rather good G3258 as it was running [email protected] and maintaining 60c. (thats with CLP between the CPU/IHS and AS5 between the IHS and stock cpu cooler) After the delid, i had it folding in a spare MSI motherboard i had laying around (B85M Gaming) and about 30 mins into the fold it shut off and one of the VRMs below the heat spreader started smoking. Unfortunately, i think this is the end of the CPU as I am afraid to put it in my gigabyte Z87X for obvious reasons. Just a reminder that not all delids come risk free. Unfortunately, i can't tell if a faulty mobo or a mistake with the delid.
> 
> Here are some pictures of the since deceased mobo / CPU:


Did you cover those small things next to die with nail polish or something else?


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Did you cover those small things next to die with nail polish or something else?


Don't think he did.
Think the CLU / CLP came in contact with the small VRM's and shortened the CPU =(


----------



## GaMbi2004

So sad







is this the first reported "death" from CLP/CLU on VRMs?
:S too many forget about the vrm's lately.. Is this info not in the OP? just had a quick look, and couldn't find it.. I think it should say that in bold red letters somewhere


----------



## TheCautiousOne

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> So sad
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is this the first reported "death" from CLP/CLU on VRMs?
> :S too many forget about the vrm's lately.. Is this info not in the OP? just had a quick look, and couldn't find it.. I think it should say that in bold red letters somewhere


Glad some girls at work had some nail polish for my 1st Delid!!









And I was thinking I might not need any (wipes forehead of sweat)


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheCautiousOne*
> 
> Glad some girls at work had some nail polish for my 1st Delid!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I was thinking I might not need any (wipes forehead of sweat)


Probably too much CLP / CLU applied and got pushed away from the die.
I never covered the small VRM's with nail polish and all of my delids are still up and running.
Just a very very very very tiny drop of CLP is enough to spread it all across the die.


----------



## RickRockerr

Well there is no need to cover the VRM's with nail polish or something if you are careful enough but I can imagine the situation when they are not covered and lets say that you accidentally drop small amount of clp/clu on them


----------



## FastEddieNYC

I didn't cover the VRM's either. I used what I thought was a small dot and it was more than enough to cover the core and IHS and still had a good bit on the brush. I think some users apply CLP/CLU like regular TIM which can unfortunately cause problems on unprotected VRM's.


----------



## Valgaur

Checking the OP for it









Added!

Thank you guys for the info! sorry I missed that


----------



## NIK1

I put Prolimatech PK-3 on top of the IHS. Has anyone ever put the Liquid Ultra between the CPU cooler and IHS.Would the ultra get better temps up top too.Just a thought.I have a H110 and I think its all copper so it would be safe but if is not worth the wile I will leave the pk3 there. Any input greatly appreciated...


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I put Prolimatech PK-3 on top of the IHS. Has anyone ever put the Liquid Ultra between the CPU cooler and IHS.Would the ultra get better temps up top too.Just a thought.I have a H110 and I think its all copper so it would be safe but if is not worth the wile I will leave the pk3 there. Any input greatly appreciated...


Using CLU might improve your temps by a small amount . Because of how thin liquid metal is when applied you need to be sure your contact between the IHS and block is perfect. If not than regular TIM will produce better results because fills the gaps.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I put Prolimatech PK-3 on top of the IHS. Has anyone ever put the Liquid Ultra between the CPU cooler and IHS.Would the ultra get better temps up top too.Just a thought.I have a H110 and I think its all copper so it would be safe but if is not worth the wile I will leave the pk3 there. Any input greatly appreciated...


I have used CLP and mx-4 between IHS and cooler. I got about 2°C better temps with CLP than MX-4 but if you use CLP on IHS it WILL destroy all the text on IHS. I'm not 100% sure but I think that delidded chips still have warranty if IHS is untouched and everything on it is readable. Someone can correct me on this if I'm wrong.


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I have used CLP and mx-4 between IHS and cooler. I got about 2°C better temps with CLP than MX-4 but if you use CLP on IHS it WILL destroy all the text on IHS. I'm not 100% sure but I think that delidded chips still have warranty if IHS is untouched and everything on it is readable. Someone can correct me on this if I'm wrong.


I don't think they are. A lot of people are gluing them back on with rtv gasket sealer. Especially if they damage the chip, pcb, or caps in the process. Don't think intel will give you a refund on that. Overclock protection states a setting gone wrong. If you overvolt, burn it up or something to that scale. The pcb have identifying marks if you look hard enough.

Also if you apply the CLU/CLP and have a good water cooling setup. This is what it looks like after two hours of stress testing. This is with Baseclock and 1.25 gear. Going to move on to the next one for now. Going to shoot for 4950 I think is what the next multi will be. Using clp on die and his.


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> Don't think he did.
> Think the CLU / CLP came in contact with the small VRM's and shortened the CPU =(


That's why I put liquid electrical tape. High temperature range of 204°C.


----------



## NIK1

Originally Posted by RickRockerr--Quote;
I have used CLP and mx-4 between IHS and cooler. I got about 2°C better temps with CLP than MX-4 but if you use CLP on IHS it WILL destroy all the text on IHS.... Did you mix together CLP and MX-4.or CLP underneath and MX4 on top of the IHS.Is that what you mean.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> Originally Posted by RickRockerr--Quote;
> I have used CLP and mx-4 between IHS and cooler. I got about 2°C better temps with CLP than MX-4 but if you use CLP on IHS it WILL destroy all the text on IHS.... Did you mix together CLP and MX-4.or CLP underneath and MX4 on top of the IHS.Is that what you mean.


Oh sorry







I always use CLP on die. No I didn't mix CLP and MX-4







There was 2°C difference between CLP and MX-4 on IHS.


----------



## NIK1

Right on.Thats what I thought.


----------



## NIK1

Did you hear of the new stuff coollabs has.Coollaboratory Liquid Copper .Check it out. Tell me what you think of this stuff. http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-copper/ .


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> Did you hear of the new stuff coollabs has.Coollaboratory Liquid Copper .Check it out. Tell me what you think of this stuff. http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-copper/ .


I'd imagine that the Galium based stuff (I.E Pro/Ultra) is better, but the copper would be easier to get off and it'd also work on aluminum blocks without problem.


----------



## fleetfeather

lel, also put a super-fine layer of MX-4 on my die temporarily as I accidentally crushed my syringe of CLU. performs like a champ really...

Definitely down to try some of that CLC stuff! Looks beastly


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> lel, also put a super-fine layer of MX-4 on my die temporarily as I accidentally crushed my syringe of CLU. performs like a champ really...
> 
> Definitely down to try some of that CLC stuff! Looks beastly


Really? That sucks, it's not that cheap either really. :/
I somehow managed to shoot the majority of my first tube down the sink as I was cleaning the tip of it and accidentally pressed the top of the syringe..


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*
> 
> That's why I put liquid electrical tape. High temperature range of 204°C.


Good thing you did.. that is WAAAY too much CLP/U


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Good thing you did.. that is WAAAY too much CLP/U


From going to none deaths reported we almost got 2 in one week haha.
Dang this dude is so lucky haha.


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Good thing you did.. that is WAAAY too much CLP/U


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> From going to none deaths reported we almost got 2 in one week haha.
> Dang this dude is so lucky haha.


I know right. I've been running this cpu for since delided for 3 months now and it's still performing well. Will clean up and re apply CLP again after one year


----------



## Syceo

Hi everyone . Id like to go bare-die on my 4770K with MSI Z97 Xpower Ac mobo as it has a delid guard. Am I ok to just use CLP direct on the die and in contact with a XSPC cpu block? Will it degrade the block or solidify? . And suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syceo*
> 
> Hi everyone . Id like to go bare-die on my 4770K with MSI Z97 Xpower Ac mobo as it has a delid guard. Am I ok to just use CLP direct on the die and in contact with a XSPC cpu block? Will it degrade the block or solidify? . And suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Cheers


I use clp on my block. It stains it but nothing major. I had some major scratches from as5 so the pad came in handy. I would suggest get the naked die mount instead of using the raystorm mounting system. If you do go naked die be careful and take your time tightening your mount down. If you get code for ram or etc try tightening the nut adjust on the standoffs a little more. Have done it myself.


----------



## Syceo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnownDragon*
> 
> I use clp on my block. It stains it but nothing major. I had some major scratches from as5 so the pad came in handy. I would suggest get the naked die mount instead of using the raystorm mounting system. If you do go naked die be careful and take your time tightening your mount down. If you get code for ram or etc try tightening the nut adjust on the standoffs a little more. Have done it myself.


Thanks. The MSI board i have just ordered comes with the die guard



My only concern right now is whether or not the CLU will corrode the block and weld itself to the die ?


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syceo*
> 
> Thanks. The MSI board i have just ordered comes with the die guard
> 
> 
> 
> My only concern right now is whether or not the CLU will corrode the block and weld itself to the die ?


CLP/CLU will not corrode copper, only aluminum. When applied correctly it can bond the surfaces together but only requires a small amount of force to separate.


----------



## Syceo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FastEddieNYC*
> 
> CLP/CLU will not corrode copper, only aluminum. When applied correctly it can bond the surfaces together but only requires a small amount of force to separate.


Great , thats what i needed to clarify, thanks for that


----------



## euf0ria

Hi crazy club ;-) I'm about to join next week and have EK precisemount naked ivy screws prepared at home. But, I have a concern about running naked/whiteout IHS and that is the fact that some people have had problems with the computer not getting through post and report error code 55. Apparently this is because all pressure is applied to die / center of cpu causing the edges to rise from socket pins.

Is there any of you that have a macgyver solution to this? Or maybe can comment this and tell me if my worries are unnecessary?

I saw one guy putting thermal pads in the corners of the cpu to get these pressed down with the water/cooling block, maybe this is all that needs to be done?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *euf0ria*
> 
> Hi crazy club ;-) I'm about to join next week and have EK precisemount naked ivy screws prepared at home. But, I have a concern about running naked/whiteout IHS and that is the fact that some people have had problems with the computer not getting through post and report error code 55. Apparently this is because all pressure is applied to die / center of cpu causing the edges to rise from socket pins.
> 
> Is there any of you that have a macgyver solution to this? Or maybe can comment this and tell me if my worries are unnecessary?
> 
> I saw one guy putting thermal pads in the corners of the cpu to get these pressed down with the water/cooling block, maybe this is all that needs to be done?


As far as I know if it doesn't post due to too much pressure use less, ideally you should go the other way.
That is use too little and then apply more if it doesn't post. You'll get it eventually.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *euf0ria*
> 
> Hi crazy club ;-) I'm about to join next week and have EK precisemount naked ivy screws prepared at home. But, I have a concern about running naked/whiteout IHS and that is the fact that some people have had problems with the computer not getting through post and report error code 55. Apparently this is because all pressure is applied to die / center of cpu causing the edges to rise from socket pins.
> 
> Is there any of you that have a macgyver solution to this? Or maybe can comment this and tell me if my worries are unnecessary?
> 
> I saw one guy putting thermal pads in the corners of the cpu to get these pressed down with the water/cooling block, maybe this is all that needs to be done?


If I remember correctly the precise mount kit has a height restriction on it where it only allows so much force to be placed onto the die so just utilize that and slowly apply pressure in a X configuration while tightening the nuts down for example / these two half turn \ then these two half to to complete one half turn on a X basis, rinse and repeat until you feel a bit of pressure while turning them, it wont be much









Hope to see ya soon!


----------



## euf0ria

Thank you guys for the fast reply and making the problem appear less dangerous
I will report back as soon as i have the rig up and running with bare die and show you my comparison of temps before and after....and perhaps even a real OC and not just the 4.4Ghz im running now (3570K)


----------



## RickRockerr

I "destroyed" my 3570K by running with naked ivy set. PCB warped and damaged PCI-E lane so no more pci-e gpu with that cpu. But could be just bad luck, or because I disassembled that build all the time.


----------



## RickRockerr

Double


----------



## defiler2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> If I remember correctly the precise mount kit has a height restriction on it where it only allows so much force to be placed onto the die so just utilize that and slowly apply pressure in a X configuration while tightening the nuts down for example / these two half turn \ then these two half to to complete one half turn on a X basis, rinse and repeat until you feel a bit of pressure while turning them, it wont be much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope to see ya soon!


As long as the posts are not over tightened to the motherboard the chance of applying too much pressure is nill. I have had bowing issues with CPU's in the past but it was because I had over tightened the posts to the mobo. Just make sure the posts are finger tight and the same goes for the nuts.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Syceo*
> 
> Thanks. The MSI board i have just ordered comes with the die guard
> 
> 
> 
> My only concern right now is whether or not the CLU will corrode the block and weld itself to the die ?


I dint think the delid guard can work with devils canyon. Looks like it would hit the 2nd row or caps (or whatever they are).


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I dint think the delid guard can work with devils canyon. Looks like it would hit the 2nd row or caps (or whatever they are).


Your correct it will cover the surface Caps. I read on another forum(trying to remember where) that to have it work they used a dremel to notch out the guard.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FastEddieNYC*
> 
> Your correct it will cover the surface Caps. I read on another forum(trying to remember where) that to have it work they used a dremel to notch out the guard.


msi most likely assumed the DC would not need delid. Since intel announced it as "fixed thermals".


----------



## aviationfrk

Sorry for the long delay in response to the dead G3258.

I have a successful 4770k delid here without covered VRMs. On my first delid (4770k) i used about as much CLP as the video on the coollaboratory website and only put it on top of the CPU core. Nothing on the IHS. The way my motherboard is mounted if it drips it will do so downward. On this dead G3258 I put some CLP on the core and also on the bottom of the IHS where the core would meet the IHS. I presume what happened is too much CLP spilled over onto the VRM, shorted, and fried the motherboard. (which included some smoke and burning electrical smell)
















On the flip side I am extremely happy with how my 4770k delid turned out. i have attached photo of my computer folding all 8 cores for voltage and temperature reference. I get in the range of 30k ppd while it folds.

i7-4770k delid with CLP
top of IHS lapped all copper
Corsair H80i cooler (stock thermal compound that came on block and set to quiet mode)
Ambient temperature inside 76.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> Sorry for the long delay in response to the dead G3258.
> 
> I have a successful 4770k delid here without covered VRMs. On my first delid (4770k) i used about as much CLP as the video on the coollaboratory website and only put it on top of the CPU core. Nothing on the IHS. The way my motherboard is mounted if it drips it will do so downward. On this dead G3258 I put some CLP on the core and also on the bottom of the IHS where the core would meet the IHS. I presume what happened is too much CLP spilled over onto the VRM, shorted, and fried the motherboard. (which included some smoke and burning electrical smell)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On the flip side I am extremely happy with how my 4770k delid turned out. i have attached photo of my computer folding all 8 cores for voltage and temperature reference. I get in the range of 30k ppd while it folds.
> 
> i7-4770k delid with CLP
> top of IHS lapped all copper
> Corsair H80i cooler (stock thermal compound that came on block and set to quiet mode)
> Ambient temperature inside 76.


Could you post some pictures of the fried CPU including die shot and LGA socket?
I'd like to see what happened and see what damage it does.


----------



## aviationfrk

The CPU itself is in tact 100% on the exterior. The short must be on the inside of the CPU because i put it in a cheap socket 1150 board i have and it turns on for 1 second and shuts off. Putting a good CPU in the board and it posts. (i dont think a g3258 creates enough heat to really justify delidding, i just did it for practice)

As far as the motherboard, the only damage was one of the VRM under a heat sync started hissing and smoking significantly. I was able to shut of the board before it really "fried" anything. However, other than a damaged VRM the socket on the motherboard is in tact also. (the board has since been RMA'd)

For reference, here is the cpu in its "failed" state:


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> The CPU itself is in tact 100% on the exterior. The short must be on the inside of the CPU because i put it in a cheap socket 1150 board i have and it turns on for 1 second and shuts off. Putting a good CPU in the board and it posts. (i dont think a g3258 creates enough heat to really justify delidding, i just did it for practice)
> 
> As far as the motherboard, the only damage was one of the VRM under a heat sync started hissing and smoking significantly. I was able to shut of the board before it really "fried" anything. However, other than a damaged VRM the socket on the motherboard is in tact also. (the board has since been RMA'd)
> 
> For reference, here is the cpu in its "failed" state:


Why did you practice on a G3258? There are lots of older chips you could have practiced on, albeit without the on chip capacitors.
You now have an awesome keychain though!


----------



## aviationfrk

I am going to make a key chain out of it! I have a 4770k and a g3258 so the choice was obvious which one to practice on!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> I am going to make a key chain out of it! I have a 4770k and a g3258 so the choice was obvious which one to practice on!


Haha, true true.

I always forget that some people aren't as lucky as me to have their school/work throwing away/giving away de-liddable working PC's. Heh

I've got a few keychains, but they're all too heavy for me. Pretty sure a processor killed the ignition barrel in my last car because of the weight pulling on the barrel.


----------



## blurp

Thanks for this awesome thread. It gave me courage to proceed with this crazy experiment and risk destroying an expensive CPU! For me, the vice only method was safer and smoother than the blade or vice & hammer. Took my time. Success!

CPU : 4790K
On die-TIM : CLU
Ihs-TIM : Gelid EC Extreme
Ghz : 4.6 Ghz @ 1.212v = Vcore HWinfo) Did not try yet 4.7 yet.
Temp drop : 19C




Custom water cooling : 2 x 240 rad, Gentle Typhoons 1850 rpm x6.

Few bench tests. Most of them are only after delid. Ambient temp : 23C

Intel Burn Test 2.54. After delid : 67C
Prime 28.5 Small fft Before delid (> 10 min): 94C After delid : 75C
X264 After delid (5 runs) : 56C
Realbench After delid (30 min) : 62C

I was bugged by the up to 11C temp difference between Cores on load: Reapplied CLU / Gelid. Reseated 3 times now. Contact is good on CPU and IHS. I know this can happen. I'll live with it!


----------



## curly haired boy

what's the average temp difference from lapping?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> what's the average temp difference from lapping?


Lapping and not de-lidding?

Lapping can see around 2-3c in the worst of cases, and I've seen around 5c max. Keeping in mind there is a small percentage of error, you won't notice it a lot unless you have a really bad heatsink or a really non-flat CPU IHS.

You've also got to factor in stuff like better thermal paste and do a perfect application of the paste that you use.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Lapping and not de-lidding?
> 
> Lapping can see around 2-3c in the worst of cases, and I've seen around 5c max. Keeping in mind there is a small percentage of error, you won't notice it a lot unless you have a really bad heatsink or a really non-flat CPU IHS.
> 
> You've also got to factor in stuff like better thermal paste and do a perfect application of the paste that you use.


sometime the cpu is concave instead of flat. Those cpu gain the most whenever Lapped.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> sometime the cpu is concave instead of flat. Those cpu gain the most whenever Lapped.


Yeah I know, I'm just saying that generally it's not too bad and the amount of gain isn't much unless you know it's a terrible lid.
I've personally never had a CPU that was bad enough to lap, I've played around with the idea of lapping my i5 but I really can't be bothered because my temps are already good enough/it's just more risk seeing as I'm already de-lidded.


----------



## curly haired boy

yeah, my IHS is pretty concave. last i checked for TIM application i could see it all squished into the center away from the contact points on the edges. my chip's a decent overclocker, it just has horrible default thermal properties









i think the h100i block should be fine, but the IHS is deffo problematic. I'll probably lap both just to be sure.

i've got a sheet of glass. what grits do i need?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> yeah, my IHS is pretty concave. last i checked for TIM application i could see it all squished into the center away from the contact points on the edges. my chip's a decent overclocker, it just has horrible default thermal properties
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i think the h100i block should be fine, but the IHS is deffo problematic. I'll probably lap both just to be sure.
> 
> i've got a sheet of glass. what grits do i need?


I've heard 3000+ is where you want to go. I've done 2000 personally and it's a bit off, maybe even more then 3000 grit.

Basically start off at say 400 or maybe 800. Do you have an old CPU to practice on?
You may also want to try drawing an X on the IHS so you can actually see how concave it was/the problem spot. It will fade as you progress through in the bad spots and once it's fully gone you've got a lapped processor assuming you didn't mess it up.









If you want the brass look, you'll want some copper cleaning/wax or similar. Personally it just effects your temps as it's another layer on top of the copper.


----------



## FastEddieNYC

When I lapped my IHS I used 600, 1000, 1500 and 2000. The 2000 gave my a nice finish. It was well worth the time to lap. My 4790 was very concave.


----------



## koekwau5

I bought this lap kit once and it worked wonderfull to get a very smooth surface and shiny finish:
http://www.highflow.nl/toebehoren/overige-nl-2-3/lap-schuurpapier-set-7-vellen-van-400-t-m-2500-grit.html

Translation:

1x Wet and Dry 400 Grit
1x Wet and Dry 600 Grit
1x Wet and Dry 800 Grit
1x Wet and Dry 1000 Grit
1x Wet and Dry 1500 Grit
1x Wet and Dry 2000 Grit
1x Wet and Dry 2500 Grit

Handy for ppl buying them all seperate.
Now you know wich grits to get =)


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FastEddieNYC*
> 
> When I lapped my IHS I used 600, 1000, 1500 and 2000. The 2000 gave my a nice finish. It was well worth the time to lap. My 4790 was very concave.


yeah, see that's what i think my issue is. the default intel HS is this circle made of copper that lands right in the center of the IHS. better contact for intel's solution if the IHS is concave..... sucks for us aftermarket users


----------



## incog

The biggest problem with lapping is that it does void your warranty afaik


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> The biggest problem with lapping is that it does void your warranty afaik


deliding does too even though ppl have been able to glue em back together and pass em off to intel.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> deliding does too even though ppl have been able to glue em back together and pass em off to intel.


Yup, and a good addition to this: buy a G3258 for some carrots and pennys and lap that IHS.
Keep your 4790K's intact and use it for RMA when needed


----------



## curly haired boy

far too late on the warranty voiding









but as long as i'm careful, i should be fine.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> deliding does too even though ppl have been able to glue em back together and pass em off to intel.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> The biggest problem with lapping is that it does void your warranty afaik


De-lidding actually doesn't if you can put the lid back on. All that Intel care about is the ID/numbers on top of the processor, which by removing the IHS it means that you can change the processors ID/etc and change it around.

That's why lapping DOES void your warranty, because you're removing the ID of the processor from the lid essentially. It's like filing the serial number off a gun I suppose haha except nowhere near illegal.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> De-lidding actually doesn't if you can put the lid back on. All that Intel care about is the ID/numbers on top of the processor, which by removing the IHS it means that you can change the processors ID/etc and change it around.
> 
> That's why lapping DOES void your warranty, because you're removing the ID of the processor from the lid essentially. It's like filing the serial number off a gun I suppose haha except nowhere near illegal.


they actually would deny the rma if you explained carefully enough.

The thing is they do not check the cpu close enough. My friend did an rma and they didnt test the cpu. I know they didnt test it or even look at it because the die was cracked.

It had a corner of the die knocked all the way off and the die had several visable cracks.

The lid was glued on nice and straight though. He got a replacement in three days.


----------



## curly haired boy

yeesh, that's pretty dishonest.

i might pick up a cheap G3258 simply because it'd be fun to mess around with, though....


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> The thing is they do not check the cpu close enough. My friend did an rma and they didnt test the cpu. I know they didnt test it or even look at it because the die was cracked.
> 
> It had a corner of the die knocked all the way off and the die had several visable cracks.
> 
> The lid was glued on nice and straight though. He got a replacement in three days.


You should kick your friend in the shin. Companies have to raise prices when they have a higher failure rate, and intel already isnt cheap. Not to mention, like curly haired boy mentioned, its just dishonest.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You should kick your friend in the shin. Companies have to raise prices when they have a higher failure rate, and intel already isnt cheap. Not to mention, like curly haired boy mentioned, its just dishonest.


yea well its difficult to impose your own values into someone else.

If many ppl did that it then eventually it becomes harder to get an rma thats deserving. I explained it to him but he doesnt see it that way.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> they actually would deny the rma if you explained carefully enough.
> 
> The thing is they do not check the cpu close enough. My friend did an rma and they didnt test the cpu. I know they didnt test it or even look at it because the die was cracked.
> 
> It had a corner of the die knocked all the way off and the die had several visable cracks.
> 
> The lid was glued on nice and straight though. He got a replacement in three days.


That's what I meant, I never said it was the right thing to do I'm just saying that they'll do it.

I do in no way impose that anyone should do it at all, I'm just saying that it can be done.
Unfortunately almost everyone would do it if they could, even now I'm saying that I wouldn't do it but I know in reality when I'm up for $200 for a new processor or get one for free (especially with my money situation now) I know that I'd probably do it too.

Just think about it if it happened to you,


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> That's what I meant, I never said it was the right thing to do I'm just saying that they'll do it.
> 
> I do in no way impose that anyone should do it at all, I'm just saying that it can be done.
> Unfortunately almost everyone would do it if they could, even now I'm saying that I wouldn't do it but I know in reality when I'm up for $200 for a new processor or get one for free (especially with my money situation now) I know that I'd probably do it too.
> 
> Just think about it if it happened to you,


yea its a tough call. But if your in bad money situation do not delid.

There is no reason to take that risk If you cannot afford the possible loss.

a lot of ppl that say one thing but would do another.


----------



## Ovrclck

I've read on this thread that people were able to use the tuning plan with delidded procs. Does anyone know if they glued the lids back on?

Edit: I don't condone this practice. If I were to send it back, I would state that it has been delidded.


----------



## curly haired boy

yeah i don't think intel really minds delidding. sure, they say it voids the warranty because anyone can pop off a lid and swap it on a G3258.

but concealing a cracked die? that's beyond the pale even if intel DID honor delidded warranties...


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> yeah i don't think intel really minds delidding. sure, they say it voids the warranty because anyone can pop off a lid and swap it on a G3258.
> 
> but concealing a cracked die? that's beyond the pale even if intel DID honor delidded warranties...


well storey I told the guy didnt really concel it. He just did not mention it.

He said he thought they would see it but tried anyway. I couldn't believe it when he showed me the box with that big rma label on it his new cpu came in.

I was not condoning his actions just pointing out intel rma is very easy.

The op of this thread States if u rma a delided cpu to intel it is rma fruad.


----------



## Ovrclck

My chip is still running fine delidded. Just not up to par with the clocks I'm trying to achieve hence why I purchased the tuning plan. Does Intel care if it's not glued back?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> Thanks for this awesome thread. It gave me courage to proceed with this crazy experiment and risk destroying an expensive CPU! For me, the vice only method was safer and smoother than the blade or vice & hammer. Took my time. Success!
> 
> CPU : 4790K
> On die-TIM : CLU
> Ihs-TIM : Gelid EC Extreme
> Ghz : 4.6 Ghz @ 1.212v = Vcore HWinfo) Did not try yet 4.7 yet.
> Temp drop : 19C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Custom water cooling : 2 x 240 rad, Gentle Typhoons 1850 rpm x6.
> 
> Few bench tests. Most of them are only after delid. Ambient temp : 23C
> 
> Intel Burn Test 2.54. After delid : 67C
> Prime 28.5 Small fft Before delid (> 10 min): 94C After delid : 75C
> X264 After delid (5 runs) : 56C
> Realbench After delid (30 min) : 62C
> 
> I was bugged by the up to 11C temp difference between Cores on load: Reapplied CLU / Gelid. Reseated 3 times now. Contact is good on CPU and IHS. I know this can happen. I'll live with it!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









Sorry it took me a while was a busy weekend and Monday for me


----------



## DarthBaggins

Ok the lids gotta come off after reading that temp drop of 19c







if I had that I would shoot for 5.0 or at least 4.9, my 4.7 is at 68-72c at full load without delidding


----------



## Curleyyy

Keen for delidding, I'll be ordering a few things tomorrow, just wondering though;

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the CPU die.
What about between the CPU top plate and my Corsair H100i block?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> Keen for delidding, I'll be ordering a few things tomorrow, just wondering though;
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the CPU die.
> What about between the CPU top plate and my Corsair H100i block?


Liquid Ultra will suffice, but any high performance paste is good.


----------



## Tapsa

I delidded my i5-3570K and now I have boot loop going on. No smoke, sparks or smell. Checked CLU applying too.
However, while doing the razor blade method, some millimeter size scratches happened to the PCB, exposing shiny metal.
I think the processor malfunctioned, but could it be something else too? And btw, it was really hard to cut the IHS off. Never gonna do it again. Not even vice only method.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> I delidded my i5-3570K and now I have boot loop going on. No smoke, sparks or smell. Checked CLU applying too.
> However, while doing the razor blade method, some millimeter size scratches happened to the PCB, exposing shiny metal.
> I think the processor malfunctioned, but could it be something else too? And btw, it was really hard to cut the IHS off. Never gonna do it again. Not even vice only method.


It shouldn't have been hard, it depends how long you'd been using it for though the longer you leave it the harder it will be to cut because the heat/tension will make the glue bond better.

You could try a single RAM stick? Seems to be a common problem when de-lidding to kill a channel on the CPU's IMC


----------



## Tapsa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> It shouldn't have been hard, it depends how long you'd been using it for though the longer you leave it the harder it will be to cut because the heat/tension will make the glue bond better.
> 
> You could try a single RAM stick? Seems to be a common problem when de-lidding to kill a channel on the CPU's IMC


I did have tight mount on it for 2 years.
Shouldn't the mobo beep if RAM cannot be used? Though I'm not sure it even has beeps.
I'll try messing around with the RAM sticks next.

One more thing!
When I put the IHS back on the CPU and lock it to the mobo, there is some horrifying screeching noise when I lock the IHS/CPU to the board.
What could it be? Bent mobo pins are the last thing I want.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> I did have tight mount on it for 2 years.
> Shouldn't the mobo beep if RAM cannot be used? Though I'm not sure it even has beeps.
> I'll try messing around with the RAM sticks next.


For that beep, you need to connect a "PC speaker" to the board in the area where you also connect the case's front panel LEDs and buttons. At its smallest, a speaker can look like this:



You might have gotten one of those with your case.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> For that beep, you need to connect a "PC speaker" to the board in the area where you also connect the case's front panel LEDs and buttons. At its smallest, a speaker can look like this:
> 
> 
> 
> You might have gotten one of those with your case.


They always come with the case, I don't even connect them anymore unless I have problems personally as most newer boards have LED displays.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> I did have tight mount on it for 2 years.
> Shouldn't the mobo beep if RAM cannot be used? Though I'm not sure it even has beeps.
> I'll try messing around with the RAM sticks next.
> 
> One more thing!
> When I put the IHS back on the CPU and lock it to the mobo, there is some horrifying screeching noise when I lock the IHS/CPU to the board.
> What could it be? Bent mobo pins are the last thing I want.


The best way to check for bent pins is to get a light (phone torch app works great) and put it above the pins and any that are bent will stand out clearly compared to the ones that aren't (you'll see what I mean)

Just try a single known working stick in the first slot (closest to the CPU) and see what happens from there.

As for the crunching.. I really have no idea. Can you post some photos of your CPU for reference?


----------



## Tapsa

Thanks for the tips guys. My mobo accessories are 200 km away so I will not plug any beeper on it.
I'll check for bent pins etc first and then try the ram slots. I can show some pics as well.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> Thanks for the tips guys. My mobo accessories are 200 km away so I will not plug any beeper on it.
> I'll check for bent pins etc first and then try the ram slots. I can show some pics as well.


I'd check the RAM first incase it's just that, it saves you having to re-mount the cooler.

You can probably buy a beeper off a local PC store for $1 or something, I need to get a couple personally as I lost mine a long time ago.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> Thanks for the tips guys. My mobo accessories are 200 km away so I will not plug any beeper on it.
> I'll check for bent pins etc first and then try the ram slots. I can show some pics as well.


reset the cpu and give it wiggle before installing the ihs and locking it down. I have had bad seats after delid scare the crap outta me before.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> Keen for delidding, I'll be ordering a few things tomorrow, just wondering though;
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the CPU die.
> What about between the CPU top plate and my Corsair H100i block?


I wouldn't use clu or clp between ihs and cooler. Any other TIM like mx-4 works great.


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> reset the cpu and give it wiggle before installing the ihs and locking it down. I have had bad seats after delid scare the crap outta me before.


I agree Try reseating the cpu. When I reinstalled the cpu after deliding it would not boot and gave me code 55(I have onboard LED)I thought I killed my processor so I took it back out and reseated the cpu. Booted up fine and I've had no problems.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FastEddieNYC*
> 
> I agree Try reseating the cpu. When I reinstalled the cpu after deliding it would not boot and gave me code 55(I have onboard LED)I thought I killed my processor so I took it back out and reseated the cpu. Booted up fine and I've had no problems.


yup I seen this multiple times. I have suggested it here and ppl had success several time too.


----------



## Tapsa

OMG it works now! Max temp @ 4.2 GHz dropped from around 72 °C to 62 °C.
However, I am a bit puzzled now as there is almost 10 °C difference in constant core temps between cores.
1st core floats around 51 °C
2nd and 3rd cores float around 56 °C
4th core floats around 58 °C
Those are with AIDA64 FPU stress test. Prime95 won't heat CPU as much.
Do you guys think that applying more CLU would get the core temps more close to each other?
Anyway, those are some fantastic temperatures at 4.2 GHz so I might as well leave them be.
I wonder where exactly is the thermometer on the cores. Is it possible that a corner of a core is, say 10 °C hotter than the thermometer on it?

Dual channel usage does not work with either RAM slot pairs.
Single channel works on 1st and 2nd slot. I have not tested single channel on 3rd or 4th slot.










































Time to try IntelBurnTest


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> OMG it works now! Max temp @ 4.2 GHz dropped from around 72 °C to 62 °C.
> However, I am a bit puzzled now as there is almost 10 °C difference in constant core temps between cores.
> 
> Do you guys think that applying more CLU would get the core temps more close to each other?


Do not add more CLU. Less is more. It's pretty common to have one core hotter than the other.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> OMG it works now! Max temp @ 4.2 GHz dropped from around 72 °C to 62 °C.
> However, I am a bit puzzled now as there is almost 10 °C difference in constant core temps between cores.
> 1st core floats around 51 °C
> 2nd and 3rd cores float around 56 °C
> 4th core floats around 58 °C
> Those are with AIDA64 FPU stress test. Prime95 won't heat CPU as much.
> Do you guys think that applying more CLU would get the core temps more close to each other?
> Anyway, those are some fantastic temperatures at 4.2 GHz so I might as well leave them be.
> I wonder where exactly is the thermometer on the cores. Is it possible that a corner of a core is, say 10 °C hotter than the thermometer on it?
> 
> Dual channel usage does not work with either RAM slot pairs.
> Single channel works on 1st and 2nd slot. I have not tested single channel on 3rd or 4th slot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time to try IntelBurnTest


The four cores are arranged in a line. So you could argue that it makes sense that the first and the last core should be lower temperature than the two in the middle, because the two in the middle have hot neighbors on both sides.

Another idea where I don't know at all if it might be true is... you have an i5, right. Whenever Windows has to deal with something, for example you move your mouse around and it has to deal with that USB device, it might more often interrupt the stress test running on the first core. The other cores run hotter because they are 100% stress test, while core number one has to also do boring stuff and is colder. So when you look at other people's screenshots and their four cores are all same heat, maybe that's because they are using i7, and i7 has hyper-threading and can run both stress test and boring stuff in parallel on that first core.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BGKris*
> 
> Do not add more CLU. Less is more. It's pretty common to have one core hotter than the other.


Mine are the same really, my lowest core @ 4.4GHz 1.32v is 51c and the highest is 60c in IBT. Just leave it, you still got your 10c drop and successfully.

I used CLP or CLU (I can't remember) between the IHS and the Cooler, it really has no problem at all.

My problem is getting the CLU/CLP off the die after 2 years..


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> My problem is getting the CLU/CLP off the die after 2 years..


not even kidding.

takes a solid day to get CLP off a die


----------



## Tapsa

TY guys.
Btw, IntelBurnTest standard heats less than AIDA64 FPU stress.
It seems that 1st core should be much cooler than the rest.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tapsa*
> 
> TY guys.
> Btw, IntelBurnTest standard heats less than AIDA64 FPU stress.
> It seems that 1st core should be much cooler than the rest.


Not always, it just depends..
I'll check mine now, playing GT4 on a PS2 emulator right now so I can't test with IBT haha.

Right now my "Core 1" which is the second core runs around 6c lower then the rest.


----------



## JacquesYeoh

Question. Big one

Im using 4770k with h105 (previously V6GT, has better results than h105 ), 4.4GHZ at 1.25 vCore gives me 100 degree celcius with prime95
Do you experts think that this crazy high temperature is cause by the notorious intel black paste?

Anyway, I decided to delid my cpu
Screw it, if i managed to destroy my 4770k, i will get the 4790k
However. Im living in malaysia, and its very hard to get the paste that you all recommended
For now , i have only xigmatek freezing point on hand
Is it okay to use normal thermal paste rather than liquid one like coolaboratory?
Thanks!


----------



## Tapsa

Take a look at these comparison charts:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34297433&postcount=67

I think that basic paste in delidded CPU will do no better than the Intel paste.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Question. Big one
> 
> Im using 4770k with h105 (previously V6GT, has better results than h105 ), 4.4GHZ at 1.25 vCore gives me 100 degree celcius with prime95
> Do you experts think that this crazy high temperature is cause by the notorious intel black paste?
> 
> Anyway, I decided to delid my cpu
> Screw it, if i managed to destroy my 4770k, i will get the 4790k
> However. Im living in malaysia, and its very hard to get the paste that you all recommended
> For now , i have only xigmatek freezing point on hand
> Is it okay to use normal thermal paste rather than liquid one like coolaboratory?
> Thanks!


Yes that's fine to use other pastes, you just won't see as much of a benefit. You should order some Collaboratory from their site, they should ship it to you.
It's worth it, unless you've already de-lidded it's worth the wait.

Link to their store,

The V6GT getting better temps shouldn't happen, it could be your thermal paste application being not so great, or the fact that you don't have enough pressure on the H105.


----------



## curly haired boy

or you have a really concave IHS, like i do....


----------



## aviationfrk

So here we have last weeks G3258 casualty repurposed:


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> So here we have last weeks G3258 casualty repurposed:


What went wrong?
Anyway nice keychain! Nice clean hole drilled in the CPU.
How did ya do that?

I'm currently having fun with my delid G3258.
Runs Core 4Ghz @ 1.1V / Cache 4Ghz @ 1.1V and gets idle 32 / 30 and under load 42 / 40 haha.


----------



## aviationfrk

It must have shorted out somewhere because the motherboard VRM started smoking. None the less after that i tested it in another motherboard and it would not post.

The 3258 hardly puts out any heat so i dont think a delid is necessary unless your going for some crazy ghz / voltage. I had this one 4.4 @ 1.2 folding 24/7 and it ran 63 degrees prior to delid.

Those temps are really low though!!


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> It must have shorted out somewhere because the motherboard VRM started smoking. None the less after that i tested it in another motherboard and it would not post.
> 
> The 3258 hardly puts out any heat so i dont think a delid is necessary unless your going for some crazy ghz / voltage. I had this one 4.4 @ 1.2 folding 24/7 and it ran 63 degrees prior to delid.
> 
> Those temps are really low though!!


4.4 @ 1.2v..... That's a crazy low voltage for that chip considering I run my G3258 at 4.5 @1.3v with stress temps in the 60's.


----------



## JacquesYeoh

May i know your 63'c is running which stress test?


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> May i know your 63'c is running which stress test?


For me, AIDA64 mixed stress test will put me in the 60's while running only FPU stress test will hike my temps up into the 70's.


----------



## aviationfrk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> 4.4 @ 1.2v..... That's a crazy low voltage for that chip considering I run my G3258 at 4.5 @1.3v with stress temps in the 60's.


I've come to find that FAH doesn't stress the CPU as much as some other purposely stress testing software. The 1.2v @ 4.4GHz probably wouldn't be stable with Prime95 or Aida. However, considering those software are not "real life" expectations of computer use I found that 1.2v sufficed on that CPU for that purpose.

Unfortunately, it was a really good clocker!


----------



## stickg1

I have an i3-4360 that was really hot, would get into the 90s pretty quick. So I took care of it! Still warmer than I'd like but down to 65C max. No pictures, not my first delid but was my first i3.


----------



## curly haired boy

ran some small FFTs as a lark and i'm back into the mid 80s. glad i bought lapping supplies....


----------



## mopperx2

I started with the razor method but lost my patience after a few minutes and took a trip to home depot to use their vice.
OCN name: mopperx2
CPU: 4770k
on die-TIM: ic damond 7
ihs-TIM: ic diamond 7
Mhz gained:1ghz @ 4.5ghz
Temp drops: ~15c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/n9ijr6


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mopperx2*
> 
> I started with the razor method but lost my patience after a few minutes and took a trip to home depot to use their vice.
> OCN name: mopperx2
> CPU: 4770k
> on die-TIM: ic damond 7
> ihs-TIM: ic diamond 7
> Mhz gained:1ghz @ 4.5ghz
> Temp drops: ~15c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/n9ijr6
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## wes1099

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Your avatar GIF never gets old


----------



## DotBeta

*OCN name: DotBeta
CPU: G3258
on die-TIM: AS5
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 1.5ghz
OC after delid: 4.7ghz
Temp drops: -20c
*



















_*right click images and open in new window to view 1680x1050 size.*_
Before:









After:


----------



## stickg1

I'm interested in seeing more info on overclocking and temps. I have a Z87 board in a waterloop I would like to give one of those Pentiums a run.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> Your avatar GIF never gets old


Thanks bud!

I'm trying to work on a new one but its taking time and I'm not good at it


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stickg1*
> 
> I'm interested in seeing more info on overclocking and temps. I have a Z87 board in a waterloop I would like to give one of those Pentiums a run.


Well, I can tell you the before temps as of now.

Stock voltages are 1.017v @ 3.2ghz with a VCCIN of 1.744v and a vRing of 1.050v. Ambient temps of 23c it has an idle temp of 29c, under load via x264 I see a solid temp of 37c.

Overclocked to 4.7Ghz _"47% performance increase"_ with @1.375v Vcore, VCCIN of 1.900 and vring of 1.150 @x42 multiplier, it has an idle temp of 35-36c, under load via x264 I see a solid temp of 66c using a Corsair H60 Hydro cooler.

Running it on IBT will definitely hike up temps, I will see a solid 80c running IBT on standard, however IBT is meant to stress CPUs with AVX but my pentium doesn't have it so it's meaningless stress test. x264 stress test doesn't have this problem.

_*Right click and open image in new window to see 1680x1050 size*_


In this pic I was not running AIDA64 stress test, merely using it's graph to keep track of the IBT run. I'm using HWInfo to show my OC specs as CPUZ shows a screwy vcore of 0.144 due to the MSI H81M-P33 board I'm using which is common on this board, HWInfo VID gives me an accurate voltage display. This was done on a day where ambient temps were a little hotter than usual, so my idle was 39c. Judging from the x264 real world temps I don't really see a need to even delid it, but I did just to say I did, so any temp drops while positive wasn't my main goal here, just a successful delid.

This chip has a temp threshold of max 100c, it won't begin to throttle until then, so floating at 80c isn't really a dangerzone, although I'd never see that temp in real world applications anyways.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Well, I can tell you the before temps as of now.
> 
> Stock voltages are 1.017v @ 3.2ghz with a VCCIN of 1.744v and a vRing of 1.050v. Ambient temps of 23c it has an idle temp of 29c, under load via x264 I see a solid temp of 37c.
> 
> Overclocked to 4.7Ghz _"47% performance increase"_ with @1.375v Vcore, VCCIN of 1.900 and vring of 1.150 @x42 multiplier, it has an idle temp of 35-36c, under load via x264 I see a solid temp of 66c using a Corsair H60 Hydro cooler.
> 
> Running it on IBT will definitely hike up temps, I will see a solid 80c running IBT on standard, however IBT is meant to stress CPUs with AVX but my pentium doesn't have it so it's meaningless stress test. x264 stress test doesn't have this problem.
> 
> _*Right click and open image in new window to see 1680x1050 size*_
> 
> 
> In this pic I was not running AIDA64 stress test, merely using it's graph to keep track of the IBT run. I'm using HWInfo to show my OC specs as CPUZ shows a screwy vcore of 0.144 due to the MSI H81M-P33 board I'm using which is common on this board, HWInfo VID gives me an accurate voltage display. This was done on a day where ambient temps were a little hotter than usual, so my idle was 39c. Judging from the x264 real world temps I don't really see a need to even delid it, but I did just to say I did, so any temp drops while positive wasn't my main goal here, just a successful delid.
> 
> This chip has a temp threshold of max 100c, it won't begin to throttle until then, so floating at 80c isn't really a dangerzone, although I'd never see that temp in real world applications anyways.


You don't want to see 80c everyday though, you are right in saying that 100c is the max though. You'd never see that in everyday use, you could probbaly get away with 1.45v for everyday on that chip with a higher clock once you've de-lidded too, again not that you really need to it's still going to be slow for usage other then basic tasks compared to even a lower end i3.

EDIT: keen to see the results too!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aviationfrk*
> 
> So here we have last weeks G3258 casualty repurposed:


Wow the cpu, the star trek symbol acura key.. It is coming out day so might as well shout "I am a nerd!" Hahaha i am a nerd at heart too I just try not to broadcast it


----------



## JacquesYeoh

Good news and bad news for me

Bad news. Destroyed 4770k in the process

Good news. Directly purchase 4790k in the same day and delidded it with CLU & h105

Temps: 74 (Prime95 small fft) Maximum at room ambient of 24-25 degree

Cool? or not cool?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Good news and bad news for me
> 
> Bad news. Destroyed 4770k in the process
> 
> Good news. Directly purchase 4790k in the same day and delidded it with CLU & h105
> 
> Temps: 74 (Prime95 small fft) Maximum at room ambient of 24-25 degree
> 
> Cool? or not cool?


What voltage/freq.? Seems hot for stock


----------



## JacquesYeoh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> What voltage/freq.? Seems hot for stock


4790k stock 4.2 ghz @ 1.15V


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> 4790k stock 4.2 ghz @ 1.15V


Did you use just a razor thin layer of clu? I normally don't even put it directly on the cpu I touch the tip of the clu tube with the brush and it has to be such that it doesn't even seem like enough tim but if you keep on working it with the brush you eventually get it to the edges of the die.Do the same with the underside of the ihs. You can use whatever you like under the cooler.


----------



## JacquesYeoh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Did you use just a razor thin layer of clu? I normally don't even put it directly on the cpu I touch the tip with the brush and it has to be such that it doesn't even seem like enough but if you keep on working it with the brush you eventually get it to the edges. Do the same with the underside of the ihs. You can use whatever you like under the cooler.


yeap i just use a very thin layer of clu on the die
put it back into my motherboard, carefully install back the clean IHS (without glue/clu) and clamp it back
I guess i will have to take it out again, clean everything and put a thin layer of CLU at both cpu die and IHS









Just to be sure. Its correct to apply a paper thin layer right?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Just to be sure. Its correct to apply a paper thin layer right?


From first page (op)

http://www.overclock.net/content/type/61/id/1291521/


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Good news and bad news for me
> 
> Bad news. Destroyed 4770k in the process
> 
> Good news. Directly purchase 4790k in the same day and delidded it with CLU & h105
> 
> Temps: 74 (Prime95 small fft) Maximum at room ambient of 24-25 degree
> 
> Cool? or not cool?


Those temps a definitely not right for that voltage/ frequency. Try a remount of the water block.


----------



## curly haired boy

also, even with the delid, you might just have a really concave IHS.

I delidded a while ago and saw ~13C improvement that later got worse as the TIM thickened in the middle.

tonight I lapped both my IHS and my h100i to near-mirror finish

85 C prime small FFTs before...

61 C max prime small FFTs after

and this with a 4.2 overclock at 1.15v.

lapping literally did more to improve my temps than delidding!


----------



## brandotip

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Good news and bad news for me
> 
> Bad news. Destroyed 4770k in the process
> 
> Good news. Directly purchase 4790k in the same day and delidded it with CLU & h105
> 
> Temps: 74 (Prime95 small fft) Maximum at room ambient of 24-25 degree
> 
> Cool? or not cool?


Mind me asking how you destroyed the 4770k?

Would like to avoid if possible


----------



## Curleyyy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> tonight I lapped both my IHS and my h100i to near-mirror finish


What was your process for the H100i, as I'm looking into doing mine too.


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> What was your process for the H100i, as I'm looking into doing mine too.


hello fellow curly individual









basically i kept the rad in one hand suspended above the glass plate/sandpaper, while with the other hand i moved the block in a figure 8 pattern. used a variety of grits, but i think i ended around 2500. wet/dry sandpaper. it got tiring pretty fast


----------



## Curleyyy

Curly master race.









I've read that the figure 8 pattern is recommended over back and forth.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> also, even with the delid, you might just have a really concave IHS.
> 
> I delidded a while ago and saw ~13C improvement that later got worse as the TIM thickened in the middle.
> 
> tonight I lapped both my IHS and my h100i to near-mirror finish
> 
> 85 C prime small FFTs before...
> 
> 61 C max prime small FFTs after
> 
> and this with a 4.2 overclock at 1.15v.
> 
> lapping literally did more to improve my temps than delidding!


I guess we both had the same things in mind today







.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1518463/properly-lapped-my-g3258-ihs-pics-inside

I did a proper lap on my ihs while I'm waiting for my CLU to arrive, I plan on lapping my H60 in the next couple of dayss to match and then I'll be ready for install







. What TIM did you use between the IHS and Waterblock?


----------



## curly haired boy

I used GC extreme. also, i skipped the polishing step at the end, figured 2500 would be smooth enough and i didn't know if normal metal polish or silver polish would add a layer of chemicals to the finished product.


----------



## Curleyyy

These are the TIM's that I'm able to purchase, unfortunately CLU isn't in stock for either stores. Should I wait till I can find CLU for the die, or pick something else up?

http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=207_163
http://umart.com.au/umart1/pro/Products_list.phtml?id=10&bid=4&id2=188


----------



## curly haired boy

you might get away with GC extreme in between the IHS and die. but the real issue is how concave the IHS is. delidding solves most of the heat transfer issue to the IHS, but the lapping is what gets the heat into your cooler.


----------



## JacquesYeoh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brandotip*
> 
> Mind me asking how you destroyed the 4770k?
> 
> Would like to avoid if possible


Sorry for the late reply.
Im using the hammer and vice method
When im hitting the block of wood, the grip between the wood and pcb is not solid enough
Therefore, the block of wood hits the backside of 4770k, destroying the tiny pieces of metal conductor of its backside

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/attachments/q3fe-bak-jpg.50711/


----------



## sakae48

^
i can't see anything bad there


----------



## JacquesYeoh

Is lapping the copper water block recommended? Im using h105
i've seen articles of its very hard to lap it into a completely flat surface


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Is lapping the copper water block recommended? Im using h105
> i've seen articles of its very hard to lap it into a completely flat surface


it'll take some time lol


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Is lapping the copper water block recommended? Im using h105
> i've seen articles of its very hard to lap it into a completely flat surface


It's recommended, but since it's already relatively flat you want to only sand it as little as possible mainly to get the machine scratches out and the minor irregularities.


----------



## Wirerat

I just cannot see the point of lapping.

I mean deliding is a no brainer as it offers 15c to 30C improvement.

All that sanding for another 1-3c seams like a waste to me.

Delided with clp is going to get you to max clocks already.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I just cannot see the point of lapping.
> 
> I mean deliding is a no brainer as it offers 15c to 30C improvement.
> 
> All that sanding for another 1-3c seams like a waste to me.
> 
> Delided with clp is going to get you to max clocks already.


It depends on the scenario, 1-3c is the worst case really. It's still worth it if you're temperature limited or just want a fun project.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I just cannot see the point of lapping.
> 
> I mean deliding is a no brainer as it offers 15c to 30C improvement.
> 
> All that sanding for another 1-3c seams like a waste to me.


It seems to be more dependent on the individual heat spreader. The way to check is with a razor blade perpendicular to the IHS. If it rocks band and forth, or if you can see a gap under the blade, then you will see benefits above 1-3C from lapping.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> It seems to be more dependent on the individual heat spreader. The way to check is with a razor blade perpendicular to the IHS. If it rocks band and forth, or if you can see a gap under the blade, then you will see benefits above 1-3C from lapping.


but getting 3c cooler wont allow room for more voltage or mhz.

That was my point.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> but getting 3c cooler wont allow room for more voltage or mhz.
> 
> That was my point.


It can if you are pushing it to the absolute limit.
As the above poster said it's more if you have a really bad IHS which can be tested with a razor blade, personally I see it as more of a fun project or something fun to do and it gives it a better finish too.

I'll probably lap mine over summer if I can't get any work just for the sake of it. I've also got a lot of old CPU's to test on which will be nice.


----------



## inedenimadam

personally, I just said the hell with it, and left the IHS out.


----------



## curly haired boy

delidding helps temps because it decreases the distance between IHS and die.

lapping helps temps because it decreases the distance between the center of the IHS and the center of your cooler/waterblock.

if the distances involved are about the same, then both will have about the same effect on temps. lapping was a MASSIVE (20 C) improvement for me.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> delidding helps temps because it decreases the distance between IHS and die.
> 
> lapping helps temps because it decreases the distance between the center of the IHS and the center of your cooler/waterblock.
> 
> if the distances involved are about the same, then both will have about the same effect on temps. lapping was a MASSIVE (20 C) improvement for me.


Then your IHS was pretty whacked out. I lapped mine (which was actually pretty flat) to a mirror finish with 2000 girt and then polished, and only saw ~2C improvements.

I am not saying I dont believe you saw that much of a decrease, but I would attribute it to the shape more so than distance to die. Your results are on the extreme end of gains from lapping to say the least.


----------



## curly haired boy

oh yeah, it's the shape that causes the distance, after all. my IHS-cooler interface was like a plate on top of a bowl


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Then your IHS was pretty whacked out. I lapped mine (which was actually pretty flat) to a mirror finish with 2000 girt and then polished, and only saw ~2C improvements.
> 
> I am not saying I dont believe you saw that much of a decrease, but I would attribute it to the shape more so than distance to die. Your results are on the extreme end of gains from lapping to say the least.


20c makes me think it that reseating and reappling the paste probably done more than lapping.


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> 20c makes me think it that reseating and reappling the paste probably done more than lapping.


well, i'd done plenty of that without solving my temps issue


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> well, i'd done plenty of that without solving my temps issue


prolly was *not* a flat spot on it anywhere.

Still I think I would just get a cheap 3258 lap it and use the ihs. That way the expensive one keeps the info on it.


----------



## Curleyyy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Still I think I would just get a cheap 3258 lap it and use the ihs. That way the expensive one keeps the info on it.


You literally just blew my mind. WHY DIDN'T I THINK OF THIS EARLIER? Good thing I haven't started yet. Though that means delidding my older CPU and I'm not sure that it can be.


----------



## Jayjr1105

Hey all, Delidded my 3770K a while ago with the vice method and I'm wanting to go back in and possibly re-do the Cool Lab liquid pro job. I have a 10-15c difference between hottest core and coolest. Just bugs me a little bit and I'm almost certain it was my inexperience with Liquid metal TIM. Do you have to clean and re-apply or can I just squeeze another tiny dot on there and work it around again?

Also, I see that Devils Canyon chips used a newer TIM, is it still crap and do people still de-lid?


----------



## Curleyyy

Always clean and re-apply.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> You literally just blew my mind. WHY DIDN'T I THINK OF THIS EARLIER? Good thing I haven't started yet. Though that means delidding my older CPU and I'm not sure that it can be.


glad I can help.


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Question...has anyone lapped the underside of the IHS? I lapped the top and it was extremely concave. Is it possible If the underside isn't flat the contact pressure on the core will vary which could account for temp differences between cores?


----------



## DotBeta

UPDATE:

Well I got tired of waiting for my CLU to come in the mail so I laquered up my vrms and dabbed a little bit of AS5 in between the dye and ihs, then another dab of AS5 in betweent he IHS and waterblock. Everything booted up just fine and I ran the puny G3258 under IBT stress test.



Same overclock settings as before I saw a 20c drop in temps.So a max temp of 60c under IBT... Whoever says AS5 is crap can stuff it lol, obviously better than the garbage intel is putting on their dyes. I'll most likely replace the AS5 on the dye with the CLU anyways, I'll probably see even lower temps after that!


----------



## Curleyyy

Where are you ordering the CLU from? I literally cannot find it anywhere. I can't find it anywhere in Australia, and I can't find it anywhere that ships to Australia /:


----------



## Vario

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JacquesYeoh*
> 
> Sorry for the late reply.
> Im using the hammer and vice method
> When im hitting the block of wood, the grip between the wood and pcb is not solid enough
> Therefore, the block of wood hits the backside of 4770k, destroying the tiny pieces of metal conductor of its backside
> 
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/attachments/q3fe-bak-jpg.50711/


When I did my old i5, I cut a piece of cardboard and taped it to the backside with a lot of electrical tape and also taped the leading edge with a lot of electrical tape to avoid damaging it in this manner.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> *OCN name: DotBeta
> CPU: G3258
> on die-TIM: AS5
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 1.5ghz
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz
> Temp drops: -20c
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _*right click images and open in new window to view 1680x1050 size.*_
> Before:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After:


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig on!


----------



## KnownDragon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> UPDATE:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Well I got tired of waiting for my CLU to come in the mail so I laquered up my vrms and dabbed a little bit of AS5 in between the dye and ihs, then another dab of AS5 in betweent he IHS and waterblock. Everything booted up just fine and I ran the puny G3258 under IBT stress test.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same overclock settings as before I saw a 20c drop in temps.So a max temp of 60c under IBT... Whoever says AS5 is crap can stuff it lol, obviously better than the garbage intel is putting on their dyes. I'll most likely replace the AS5 on the dye with the CLU anyways, I'll probably see even lower temps after that!


You will. It might take a few tries to get it right. It took me a couple of tries. I put on the thinnest layer possible which I thought would work great and well I was cussing CLU. Then after a second application I went with the brush method and I am thinking I have it perfect.

Ignore my windows 8 alien theme but this is after 4 hours and with some gaming and normal every day heavy loads.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig on!


It's a privledge and a pleasure







, thanks. I'm amazed by the temp differences and I went into it expecting to see no changes at all, -20c of max temp under IBT load is amazing even for this little G3258, now to push for 5ghz







.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> Where are you ordering the CLU from? I literally cannot find it anywhere. I can't find it anywhere in Australia, and I can't find it anywhere that ships to Australia /:


Coollaboratory themselves ship worldwide.


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Coollaboratory themselves ship worldwide.


Ordered from them lately on a Monday and and received the package 10 days later on Wenesday with regular mail to Canada.


----------



## Pikaru

Looking to delid soon. Have any of you purchased wood from Lowe's or home Depot? Which did you buy?


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pikaru*
> 
> Looking to delid soon. Have any of you purchased wood from Lowe's or home Depot? Which did you buy?


Just a simple 1x4 piece maybe 8" to 10" long would be fine. Get something firm, not pressure treated. The pressure treated woods can be spongy on the outside sometimes and that will absorb the blow. The softer the wood the more hits it's gonna take to delid.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pikaru*
> 
> Looking to delid soon. Have any of you purchased wood from Lowe's or home Depot? Which did you buy?


It's better to use a hard piece of rubber over wood to use because it's easier on the pcb, but in the event you cant get you hands on it then wood will do, I suppose a little softer wood would be better than a harder wood to help soften the blow as well. I delidded both of my chips with a razorblade so I couldn't give anymore info on the vise method than what I've heard. One thing I would definitely mention that I also used myself with the razorblade method is to use a blow dryer to heat up the ihs glue ad soften it up, it will make it so much easier.


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pikaru*
> 
> Looking to delid soon. Have any of you purchased wood from Lowe's or home Depot? Which did you buy?


I' suggest to try the v*ice only* method since it is much smooth on the CPU. You turn the vice slowly until the cap slides off.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> I' suggest to try the v*ice only* method since it is much smooth on the CPU. You turn the vice slowly until the cap slides off.


If you go vise only it's imperative you use a blow dryer as well, or you risk bending the pcb.

As a matter of fact, just use a blow dryer no matter which method you go with







.


----------



## Jayjr1105

What is the Vice Only method? I'm unfamiliar with that one, I did my 3770K the week after the hammer/vice method surfaced. In hindsight, warming up the processor before hand with a blow-dryer may have helped de-lid in one or two less swings. My vote is still for the vice/wood/hammer method. If your vice has clean jaws and is securely mounted it's a piece of cake. Those are big "if's" though


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> What is the Vice Only method? I'm unfamiliar with that one, I did my 3770K the week after the hammer/vice method surfaced. In hindsight, warming up the processor before hand with a blow-dryer may have helped de-lid in one or two less swings. My vote is still for the vice/wood/hammer method. If your vice has clean jaws and is securely mounted it's a piece of cake. Those are big "if's" though


Instead of wedging the IHS to the vise and tapping the pcb with the wood block and hammer, you wedge one end of the IHS to one side of the vise and the other end against the pcb, then you slowly begin to close the vise and it pushed on the ihs and pcb and separates them. I dont like that method because it looks like it would bend the pcb.






Im amazed no one uses blow dryers to warm up the ihs glue.


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Instead of wedging the IHS to the vise and tapping the pcb with the wood block and hammer, you wedge one end of the IHS to one side of the vise and the other end against the pcb, then you slowly begin to close the vise and it pushed on the ihs and pcb and separates them. I dont like that method because it looks like it would bend the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im amazed no one uses blow dryers to warm up the ihs glue.


Just reading that method made me cringe.


----------



## Pikaru

That vise only method looks too easy to be true. Would I just nudge on the thing till it separates? I'm sure a blow dryer would make it a lot easier by warming up the glue.

What could go wrong aside from over tightening and cracking the pcb?


----------



## Vario

I used a heat gun on the processors I have delidded, seems to help.


----------



## Pikaru

What method did you use?

I'm still debating doing just the wood method posted by skyn3t but i can't get any wood harder than pine locally. I'd have to order through home Depot and it'd come at the end of the month...

Looking to see if anyone's done just the vice method


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pikaru*
> 
> What method did you use?
> 
> I'm still debating doing just the wood method posted by skyn3t but i can't get any wood harder than pine locally. I'd have to order through home Depot and it'd come at the end of the month...
> 
> Looking to see if anyone's done just the vice method


Order wood??? Dude, you don't have a 6" piece of 2x4 lying around your house somewhere? Just go to a lumberyard and ask them for a small scrap piece of 2x4 or 1x4. They probably won't even charge you.


----------



## Pikaru

Don't live in a house and have random pieces of wood lying around.


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pikaru*
> 
> Don't live in a house and have random pieces of wood lying around.


maybe there's a broken pallet somewhere?


----------



## RKDxpress

Vise only method works fine. Just be sure you have clean jaws on it not some nicked up rough edge. I've used both methods I prefere vise only. RKD.


----------



## StoryofJob

Guys I have a 4770k with a H110 WC.

I am thinking to delid and leave the lid off, Can I apply this H110 directly to the bare CPU?

Perhaps I need some type of brace? Also what Cooling liquid would be best suited for this?


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StoryofJob*
> 
> Guys I have a 4770k with a H110 WC.
> 
> I am thinking to delid and leave the lid off, Can I apply this H110 directly to the bare CPU?
> 
> Perhaps I need some type of brace? Also what Cooling liquid would be best suited for this?


You need a CPU shim like this one

http://www.hardcoreware.net/msi-z97-xpower-ac-delid-die-guard/


----------



## melterx12

Quick question, if I delid my 4790k do I need to re install the IHS or can I install my heat sink directly on top of the die?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *melterx12*
> 
> Quick question, if I delid my 4790k do I need to re install the IHS or can I install my heat sink directly on top of the die?


Pick your poison. If you mount directly, will you be using an AIO?

If you are using a custom loop, then consider getting the naked mount (if available) to save yourself some time. If you are not, then get some washers and measure it to make sure you are getting good contact, but so you can not crush your die/chip.


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *melterx12*
> 
> Quick question, if I delid my 4790k do I need to re install the IHS or can I install my heat sink directly on top of the die?


If you would have read 2 post behind yours you would have gotten your answer.


----------



## StoryofJob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> You need a CPU shim like this one
> 
> http://www.hardcoreware.net/msi-z97-xpower-ac-delid-die-guard/


Thanks, I have a asus maximus extreme VI, I dont believe one came with it like the mobo you linked above.

Do you know any compatible third party ones from the top of your head?


----------



## electro2u

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StoryofJob*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Jayjr1105 View Post
> 
> You need a CPU shim like this one
> 
> http://www.hardcoreware.net/msi-z97-xpower-ac-delid-die-guard/
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks, I have a asus maximus extreme VI, I dont believe one came with it like the mobo you linked above.
> 
> Do you know any compatible third party ones from the top of your head?
Click to expand...

That thing doesn't even fit Devil's Canyon... such BS. MSI had their heads up their you know what on that one.

DC has an extra row of VRMs or whatever those little things are next to the die. They even include them with X99 Xpower board... and Haswell-E is soldered to the IHS LOL









You don't need one of those to go baredie.

Remove the latch mechanism from the motherboard with a hex wrench. Bye bye backplate!
Electrical tape the CPU in place. Not over the die ><
Install block.
Remove tape.

The tricky part is getting a good mount with the block since the contact point the block makes with the die will be at a lower position than it would be with the IHS.

All this nonsense and trouble will net you maybe 5c

My advice: don't bother.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StoryofJob*
> 
> Thanks, I have a asus maximus extreme VI, I dont believe one came with it like the mobo you linked above.
> 
> Do you know any compatible third party ones from the top of your head?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *electro2u*
> 
> That thing doesn't even fit Devil's Canyon... such BS. MSI had their heads up their you know what on that one.
> 
> DC has an extra row of VRMs or whatever those little things are next to the die. They even include them with X99 Xpower board... and Haswell-E is soldered to the IHS LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You don't need one of those to go baredie.
> 
> Remove the latch mechanism from the motherboard with a hex wrench. Bye bye backplate!
> Electrical tape the CPU in place. Not over the die ><
> Install block.
> Remove tape.
> 
> The tricky part is getting a good mount with the block since the contact point the block makes with the die will be at a lower position than it would be with the IHS.
> 
> All this nonsense and trouble will net you maybe 5c
> 
> My advice: don't bother.


If you had an EK Block, I would send you the Naked Mount kit. I used it for 6 months, and it really didn't help with the temps unfortunately. It did get them down a tiny bit more, but only a minute amount.


----------



## electro2u

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> If you had an EK Block, I would send you the Naked Mount kit. I used it for 6 months, and it really didn't help with the temps unfortunately. It did get them down a tiny bit more, but only a minute amount.


That's super nice of you








I had an accident while learning how to direct mount an H55 and damaged the CPU socket pins of a z87 ASUS Hero, so I'm a little bitter about bare-die.

Compared to delidding, which can easily get temps down 20-30C(!) bare-die is really insignificant (just my two cents).


----------



## StoryofJob

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> If you would have read 2 post behind yours you would have gotten your answer.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *electro2u*
> 
> That's super nice of you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had an accident while learning how to direct mount an H55 and damaged the CPU socket pins of a z87 ASUS Hero, so I'm a little bitter about bare-die.
> 
> Compared to delidding, which can easily get temps down 20-30C(!) bare-die is really insignificant (just my two cents).


So delidding and keeping the lid off is worse than delidding and keeping it on?

I thought it would be the opposite?

If keeping the lid off really is going to only get me temp gains of -5, theres no point...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StoryofJob*
> 
> So delidding and keeping the lid off is worse than delidding and keeping it on?
> 
> I thought it would be the opposite?
> 
> If keeping the lid off really is going to only get me temp gains of -5, theres no point...


Theoretically direct die is better because it eliminates a transfer layer but it takes a good amount of planning and skill to do it right. Sonda5 knows alot about it.


----------



## chronicfx

Btw, i have done a clu retim and built a rig for my 4 year old around my delidded 3570k. He now has a 5ghz 3570k and 7970 xfire to play nick jr. And abc mouse before bedtime. I thought about giving him the hd4000 chip graphics and selling the 7970's as it is all he needed but then I would have to voluntarily close my username on overclock.net for purposely limiting his performance.


----------



## melterx12

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Theoretically direct die is better because it eliminates a transfer layer but it takes a good amount of planning and skill to do it right. Sonda5 knows alot about it.


Ok now I'm confused, I thought the point of delidding was because Intel no longer solders the IHS it causes poor performance because there is only thermal paste between the die and the IHS, but you're saying you can achieve a 20 degree improvement by simply replacing the stock thermal paste with another one?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *melterx12*
> 
> Ok now I'm confused, I thought the point of delidding was because Intel no longer solders the IHS it causes poor performance because there is only thermal paste between the die and the IHS, but you're saying you can achieve a 20 degree improvement by simply replacing the stock thermal paste with another one?


The stock thermal paste compares well to other 'regular' pastes.

The 20C drop you get by emulating the solder, i.e. use a liquid metal like CLU/CLP.


----------



## Phobos223

Hey All,

I delidded my 3770K 2 years ago, and used Coollabratory Liquid Ultra between the die and the IHS, as well as the IHS and my waterblock. Been running great for the past 2 years now, but I have noticed the temps have been slowing increasing. Nothing to severe but, worth noting. Anyway, I am going to break this system down and wanted to swap the water block out.

I have a few quesitons for you guys before I proceed:

1.) I have heard that this TIM is a pain to remove... is that true?
2.) If #1 is true, do I have to take any special consideration when removing the waterblock as not to damage the core?
3.) Has anyone noticed the performance of LM TIMs degrading over time?

Any help/ideas from your past experience would be very helpful!

Thanks!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *melterx12*
> 
> Ok now I'm confused, I thought the point of delidding was because Intel no longer solders the IHS it causes poor performance because there is only thermal paste between the die and the IHS, but you're saying you can achieve a 20 degree improvement by simply replacing the stock thermal paste with another one?


Yes solder is better than the tim intel used but there is also a black polymer used to hold the ihs in place, this can actually cause a gap and reduce contact between the die and ihs. Removing this substance is important to reduce temps. Also read that post above from wisk, it is accurate.


----------



## electro2u

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Phobos223*
> 
> Hey All,
> 
> I delidded my 3770K 2 years ago, and used Coollabratory Liquid Ultra between the die and the IHS, as well as the IHS and my waterblock. Been running great for the past 2 years now, but I have noticed the temps have been slowing increasing. Nothing to severe but, worth noting. Anyway, I am going to break this system down and wanted to swap the water block out.
> 
> I have a few quesitons for you guys before I proceed:
> 
> 1.) I have heard that this TIM is a pain to remove... is that true?
> 2.) If #1 is true, do I have to take any special consideration when removing the waterblock as not to damage the core?
> 3.) Has anyone noticed the performance of LM TIMs degrading over time?
> 
> Any help/ideas from your past experience would be very helpful!
> 
> Thanks!


Your block probably just needs a cleaning. I've seen reports of CLP/CLU being exactly the same for years.

It will be liquid still when removing the block so no special care needed except to say it will easily spatter.

As for removing the LM itself, it's not necessary but it can be done with minimal scratching by literally soaking the die with a citrus based cleaver like Arcticlean Thermal material remover. I do that and then just dump it off repeat til most is gone then wipe with cotton swab soaked in the Arcticlean.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hey what's up guys!

Thought to share something (potentially rare) with you.
The looks of CLU after it has been applied for over a year and used solidly at 4.5ghz:

The top of the die seemed to have dried the CLU a little. So I reapplied it.


Spoiler: 1 year old CLU on die pics













Spoiler: CLU reapplied










Video demonstrating it:


----------



## curly haired boy

thanks for the pictures!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> thanks for the pictures!


pleasure!
Thanks for repping


----------



## Shikaka

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> Just reading that method made me cringe.


Thats how i did mine.... i did leave the cpu on a radiator for a bit to warm it up, it came off so easy using this method.


----------



## feznz

Just wanted to share a "Bleed out" experience I been having I been having to replace the TIM every couple of months or even less sometimes.
The CPU temps were pretty bad like hitting Thermal throttle just playing BF4









Checking how concave the heat spreader is I discovered that certain planes were not as bad as others


A quick initial lap sshows the High spot ridges




I have always had a lower temp on core one than all the other cores.
best idle temps I have ever had, I would have completed the IBT but I have had this OC for over a year I know it is rock solid stable.
Just this chip hits a wall I can get 5Ghz out of it just takes over 1.5v not worth the extra 200mhz IMO


----------



## incog

4.8 Ghz is really nice though isn't it? I'm pretty sure it's above average, or does Ivy Bridge over clock higher than Haswell?

My own idle temps are also quite good in my opinion, though this chip is an i5 4670 at stock clocks (20°C ambient):

http://i.imgur.com/3Helmzi.png

It does have a delid on it though. The delid I did was more for fun than anything else, I think my post is in this thread somewhere. I might have lowered load temperatures by about 5-7 °C, which isn't spectacular but it was a fun experience.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> 4.8 Ghz is really nice though isn't it? I'm pretty sure it's above average, or does Ivy Bridge over clock higher than Haswell?
> 
> My own idle temps are also quite good in my opinion, though this chip is an i5 4670 at stock clocks (20°C ambient):
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/3Helmzi.png
> 
> It does have a delid on it though. The delid I did was more for fun than anything else, I think my post is in this thread somewhere. I might have lowered load temperatures by about 5-7 °C, which isn't spectacular but it was a fun experience.


4.8 is pretty decent for Ivy Bridge, it's good at that voltage that's for sure unless a heavy LLC is being used or something.
4.8 Was average/goodish for Sandy, as it's progressed it's gotten worse basically.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Just wanted to share a "Bleed out" experience I been having I been having to replace the TIM every couple of months or even less sometimes.
> The CPU temps were pretty bad like hitting Thermal throttle just playing BF4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Checking how concave the heat spreader is I discovered that certain planes were not as bad as others
> *snip*
> I have always had a lower temp on core one than all the other cores.
> best idle temps I have ever had, I would have completed the IBT but I have had this OC for over a year I know it is rock solid stable.
> Just this chip hits a wall I can get 5Ghz out of it just takes over 1.5v not worth the extra 200mhz IMO


What grit sandpaper did you use??? Those grooves in the ihs are pretty deep, you should use 2000 grit as the last grit at least.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1518463/properly-lapped-my-g3258-ihs-pics-inside


----------



## NIK1

I have my I5 3570k delided for about a year now and wonder if I should lap the IHS.Also,can a jewelers buffing machine do the same to levil out the ihs.Any thoughts on this,the do's and dont's,and the best way to do it if I decide to, much appreciated.


----------



## skmanu

Well, just delided my 4790K, did like 10 different mounts and got... ZERO drop in temps.

Ok, Ok, I has only MX4 handy for the die/IHS TIM, as I ran out of it liquid pro.

Just ordered some and will check again next week...


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> Well, just delided my 4790K, did like 10 different mounts and got... ZERO drop in temps.
> 
> Ok, Ok, I has only MX4 handy for the die/IHS TIM, as I ran out of it liquid pro.
> 
> Just ordered some and will check again next week...


I'm using MX-4 between the dye and ihs and was using AS5 before that, I'm also still waiting for my clu to arrive in the mail. you'll still see temp drops but you will suffer from "pump out" effect so if you notice your temps rising then re apply mx-4, you will notice it will appear as though the tim has pushed itself away from the dye.

I noticed this using AS5 after only a week but didn't take pics.

How in the world did you run out of liquid pro? it takes the tiniest amount of clp/clu for an application lol.


----------



## skmanu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> How in the world did you run out of liquid pro? it takes the tiniest amount of clp/clu for an application lol.


Because the tube was more than one year old, lol! And I used it already on a few CPU's...


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> What grit sandpaper did you use??? Those grooves in the ihs are pretty deep, you should use 2000 grit as the last grit at least.


I've found no real difference in temps when lapping above 600 grit. The performance gain is having both sides flat, not from having two mirrors








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> can a jewelers buffing machine do the same to levil out the ihs.Any thoughts on this,the do's and dont's,and the best way to do it if I decide to, much appreciated.


Buffing machine won't make it flat. Use a piece of glass and wet sand in figure eight. Don't apply any pressure. I use 3M Wetordry 280 grit to get it flat then 600 grit to make it smooth. Wash the sandpaper often to remove metal particles. When it's done, polish with Brasso.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I've found no real difference in temps when lapping above 600 grit. The performance gain is having both sides flat, not from having two mirrors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buffing machine won't make it flat.


Right, I know that, but all those deep scratches fill up with tim and makes heat spots, a smooth surface is better for heat transfer than a rough one even if it's flat.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> 4.8 Ghz is really nice though isn't it? I'm pretty sure it's above average, or does Ivy Bridge over clock higher than Haswell?
> 
> My own idle temps are also quite good in my opinion, though this chip is an i5 4670 at stock clocks (20°C ambient):
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/3Helmzi.png
> 
> It does have a delid on it though. The delid I did was more for fun than anything else, I think my post is in this thread somewhere. I might have lowered load temperatures by about 5-7 °C, which isn't spectacular but it was a fun experience.


I was anticipating the replies "that chip could do 5Ghz with a little more voltage" sadly no, for sure I am happy with this chip then again I did buy 3 silicone lotto tickets this was the best the other 2 were very similar [email protected]
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> 4.8 is pretty decent for Ivy Bridge, it's good at that voltage that's for sure unless a heavy LLC is being used or something.
> 4.8 Was average/goodish for Sandy, as it's progressed it's gotten worse basically.


I am using off set voltage with "high LLC" if I use manual voltage I can reduce the voltage even further, about [email protected]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> What grit sandpaper did you use??? Those grooves in the ihs are pretty deep, you should use 2000 grit as the last grit at least.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1518463/properly-lapped-my-g3258-ihs-pics-inside


Actually I started with 600grit and finished with 2000grit I couldn't be bothered to put any more effort into it as I would have had to do the cooler base as well, the objective was achieved flat heat spreader I will let the TIM do it's job
Remembering the concaveness of the heat spreader to begin with the TIM was working over time.
Also IBT is about the most extreme test IMO prime 95 will run the chip about 7-10°C cooler


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Actually I started with 600grit and finished with 2000grit I couldn't be bothered to put any more effort into it as I would have had to do the cooler base as well, the objective was achieved flat heat spreader I will let the TIM do it's job
> Remembering the concaveness of the heat spreader to begin with the TIM was working over time.
> Also IBT is about the most extreme test IMO prime 95 will run the chip about 7-10°C cooler


For me AIDA64 FPU stress test will give me the hottest temps, it really gets the cpu cooking.

right on with the grits, I used 2000 the entire lapping process and it took me less than an hour to achieve my results. the scratches just look deeper on yours but maybe its the lighting.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Right, I know that, but all those deep scratches fill up with tim and makes heat spots, a smooth surface is better for heat transfer than a rough one even if it's flat.


You'd think that, but really trust me, I've lapped two chips like this up to 600 grit, a Q9400 and an i7-960. Then about a year later I ordered automotive paper up to 2500 grit and got them both like glass. After three separate mounts on the '960 no more than 1C benefit at load, nor did I get it any higher than ~4GHz which I already had before the second time lapping. Q9400 first mount, can't remember temps but I remember it seemed better o/c but then started crashing and had to dial it down again.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> For me AIDA64 FPU stress test will give me the hottest temps, it really gets the cpu cooking.
> 
> right on with the grits, I used 2000 the entire lapping process and it took me less than an hour to achieve my results. the scratches just look deeper on yours but maybe its the lighting.


I just gave AIDA64 a go not even close to IBT not even the v droop is near the same
there is stress level options in IBT I set it to "extreme" it is set to "standard" by default
I know I didn't run the test long but one thing stress testing has taught me it is that a consistent load like prime 95 is okay but I find the BSOD/WHEA errors happen with varied loads/voltages, so every day computing is how I test the OC


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I just gave AIDA64 a go not even close to IBT not even the v droop is near the same
> there is stress level options in IBT I set it to "extreme" it is set to "standard" by default
> I know I didn't run the test long but one thing stress testing has taught me it is that a consistent load like prime 95 is okay but I find the BSOD/WHEA errors happen with varied loads/voltages, so every day computing is how I test the OC


You're not doing it right, uncheck all of the stress test except FPU test, only run stress FPU. Trust me it'll get hot but be careful.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> You're not doing it right, uncheck all of the stress test except FPU test, only run stress FPU. Trust me it'll get hot but be careful.


Ok I will give you +1 strange I thought if you wanted to stress cpu you would leave stress CPU checkbox checked
in saying that we are talking 1-3°C across cores


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## skmanu

DotBeta's right: if you run only the FPU test, it gets darn hot!


----------



## DotBeta

Quoted from Fiery who is a developer for AIDA64:
Quote:


> The FPU test puts a very heavy stress on the processor, both load-wise and thermal-wise. It is a very unique test in a sense that not many other stress tests or applications are capable of pushing your processor that far -- using AVX, AVX2 and FMA instructions indeed helps AIDA64 to achieve that level of stressing. Whether you deem it is useful for your particular usage scenario or not is completely up to you to decide
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you use AIDA64 to measure your temperatures while running applications or games, and you can see much lower temperatures than what you did while running the AIDA64 FPU stress test, then you may have some headroom in upping the CPU clock and/or voltage.
> 
> BTW, since only a handful of applications and benchmark software currently utilize AVX2 and FMA instructions, it is not easy to compare the amount of stress AIDA64 puts on your Haswell processor at this time. But as soon as the new instruction sets become more popular, and software vendors keep pushing their optimization efforts even further, you will be able to see very heavy load being put on your processor while e.g. encoding a video stream. So in our opinion AIDA64 FPU stress test is very much relevant, since it faces your CPU with the worst case scenario imaginable. If it can stand that, then it's a good configuration (ie. both hardware and software settings are proper).


This was posted Dec. of 2013 but it gets the point across on how the FPU stress test works.

http://forums.aida64.com/topic/1629-real-world-benefit-of-fpu-test/


----------



## maynard14

hi guys im planning on buying h80i for my delided 4770k, will the h80i be enough for it? because i have raven 01 so i dont have enough space for aio cooler... thanks

also im planning to use my h105 for my 290x when corsair release the hg10

heres my current set up


----------



## skmanu

A high end air CPU will do a better job than the H80.


----------



## curly haired boy

keep the h105 on the CPU, put the h80 on the 290x.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Quoted from Fiery who is a developer for AIDA64:
> This was posted Dec. of 2013 but it gets the point across on how the FPU stress test works.
> 
> http://forums.aida64.com/topic/1629-real-world-benefit-of-fpu-test/


Any way back to my original problem I should have RMA before I delidded as when I first got my Cpu it is about the same temperatures but I kept getting "bleed out of TIM'
Cause a severely concave heat spreader (yet to confirm this as I will see after a month or so)
at what point will Intel accept a RMA because of a faulty heat spreader?
I Probably wouldn't have RMA this particular chip as it is not golden but I would class it as a silver chip, BUT my bronze chips I would have RMAed because of a faulty heat spreader before I delidded them in the hope that I got a better sample.
to be Honest I would have never bothered to lap for even a 5°C improvement just I don't mind blowing the dust out of my PC every 6 months maybe I will get round to changing the coolant one day it has been 2½ years since last change, but to replace TIM every month or so is unacceptable.


----------



## DotBeta

You won't have to replace
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Any way back to my original problem I should have RMA before I delidded as when I first got my Cpu it is about the same temperatures but I kept getting "bleed out of TIM'
> Cause a severely concave heat spreader (yet to confirm this as I will see after a month or so)
> at what point will Intel accept a RMA because of a faulty heat spreader?
> I Probably wouldn't have RMA this particular chip as it is not golden but I would class it as a silver chip, BUT my bronze chips I would have RMAed because of a faulty heat spreader before I delidded them in the hope that I got a better sample.
> to be Honest I would have never bothered to lap for even a 5°C improvement just I don't mind blowing the dust out of my PC every 6 months maybe I will get round to changing the coolant one day it has been 2½ years since last change, but to replace TIM every month or so is unacceptable.


normally people who delid use CLU/CLP between the dye and ihs not paste, as clu/clp does not suffer from bleed out like tims do and would only need to be replaced/checked once a year or until temps begin to rise. I'd suggest ordering clu/clp for between the dye/ihs and using MX-4 between ihs and waterblock. Also indigo extreme would work between the dye and ihs but I wouldn't recommend it as it's solder and needs to be heated to turn into liquid, it's just a pain.

So order some clu/clp and use paste in the mean time, it's what I'm doing. Lapping isn't the point of delidding, its to replace the crappy intel tim with clu/clp. Lapping is the optional part and only nets 2-3c gain.

I have no idea about RMA'ing a cpu because its heatspreader is too concave, I don't even know if intel would accept it, doubt it though.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> You won't have to replace
> normally people who delid use CLU/CLP between the dye and ihs not paste, as clu/clp does not suffer from bleed out like tims do and would only need to be replaced/checked once a year or until temps begin to rise. I'd suggest ordering clu/clp for between the dye/ihs and using MX-4 between ihs and waterblock. Also indigo extreme would work between the dye and ihs but I wouldn't recommend it as it's solder and needs to be heated to turn into liquid, it's just a pain.
> 
> So order some clu/clp and use paste in the mean time, it's what I'm doing. Lapping isn't the point of delidding, its to replace the crappy intel tim with clu/clp. Lapping is the optional part and only nets 2-3c gain.
> 
> I have no idea about RMA'ing a cpu because its heatspreader is too concave, I don't even know if intel would accept it, doubt it though.


if it is trottling at stock clocks with the stock intel cooler due to temperatures caused from the concave ihs then you would be able to get an rma.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> if it is trottling at stock clocks with the stock intel cooler due to temperatures caused from the concave ihs then you would be able to get an rma.


mmm that's for 100% sure but lets say like in my case a fresh application on TIM in the heat spreader and cooler interface fixed the problem for a month or so, but bleed out consistently would make it faulty IMO. as I was hitting thermal throttle just playing BF4
I would estimate I had a .25mm concave heat spreader surface put it this way I would certainly tried for RMA if this were a dud OCer, and hadn't delidded it
It might have made it a difficult RMA because that a fresh application of TIM always fixed the problem.

Just how many people have delidded instead of RMA.
Has anyone actually successfully RMAed one for this reason

I been chasing my tail on this one I drained and inspected my water block good as new so being the frugal type I put the original coolant back in.
I had assumed it was the TIM in between the heat spreader and CPU die so delidded it
every time I reapplied the TIM improved it back to normal I actually tried PK1, original XSPC, IC diamond and NT-H1 believing it was the TIM.

anyway fingers crossed
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> You won't have to replace
> normally people who delid use CLU/CLP between the dye and ihs not paste, as clu/clp does not suffer from bleed out like tims do and would only need to be replaced/checked
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> once a year or until temps begin to rise. I'd suggest ordering clu/clp for between the dye/ihs and using MX-4 between ihs and waterblock. Also indigo extreme would work between the dye and ihs but I wouldn't recommend it as it's solder and needs to be heated to turn into liquid, it's just a pain.
> 
> So order some clu/clp and use paste in the mean time, it's what I'm doing. Lapping isn't the point of delidding, its to replace the crappy intel tim with clu/clp. Lapping is the optional part and only nets 2-3c gain.
> 
> I have no idea about RMA'ing a cpu because its heatspreader is too concave, I don't even know if intel would accept it, doubt it though.


you lost me the "Bleed out" I was suffering from was between cooler and heat spreader in my case

seems I have a very isolated case the only other report I can find is here
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261219


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> mmm that's for 100% sure but lets say like in my case a fresh application on TIM in the heat spreader and cooler interface fixed the problem for a month or so, but bleed out consistently would make it faulty IMO. as I was hitting thermal throttle just playing BF4
> I would estimate I had a .25mm concave heat spreader surface put it this way I would certainly tried for RMA if this were a dud OCer, and hadn't delidded it
> It might have made it a difficult RMA because that a fresh application of TIM always fixed the problem.
> 
> Just how many people have delidded instead of RMA.
> Has anyone actually successfully RMAed one for this reason
> 
> I been chasing my tail on this one I drained and inspected my water block good as new so being the frugal type I put the original coolant back in.
> I had assumed it was the TIM in between the heat spreader and CPU die so delidded it
> every time I reapplied the TIM improved it back to normal I actually tried PK1, original XSPC, IC diamond and NT-H1 believing it was the TIM.
> 
> anyway fingers crossed
> [/SPOILER]
> 
> you lost me the "Bleed out" I was suffering from was between cooler and heat spreader in my case
> 
> seems I have a very isolated case the only other report I can find is here
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261219


The rma is decided 100% based on the info you tell the rep. They do not test the cpu you turn in. Not at all. They only look at the info on the ihs and pcb.

I had that verified by intel via chat when I rma'ed a 4670k.

Just something to keep in mind when considering rma.

I am not suggesting you do anything dishonest. Its just good info.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> you lost me the "Bleed out" I was suffering from was between cooler and heat spreader in my case
> 
> seems I have a very isolated case the only other report I can find is here
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261219


I was assuming you had bleed out between the dye and ihs, not the heat spreader and cooler. I don't have that problem so can't help you there.


----------



## ottoore

*die


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ottoore*
> 
> *die


I've seen so many people use dye instead of die I don't even care anymore, I just type the first one that pops into my head and go about my day. They both get the point across but I understand one is correct and the other isn't.


----------



## skmanu

Dye is the tainting stuff you put in your waterloop (which is absolutely wrong!), lol


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> Dye is the tainting stuff you put in your waterloop (which is absolutely wrong!), lol


I know what dye is lol, but as I said I've seen TONS of people call their cpu die a dye, so I use both now but if it pleases the grammar police I'll say cpu DIE from here on out lol.


----------



## skmanu

^:rofl:


----------



## GaMbi2004

Hmmm.. did the lapping fix the problem then? sorry if I missed this info..
I hope it did, course after you lapped it, you wont be able to RMA, thats for sure..

Even a delidded CPU can still be RMAed if it did not suffer any damage from the process, but it requires that the printing on the IHS and the PCB is intact :/ so I guess there is no way back now.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hmmm.. did the lapping fix the problem then? sorry if I missed this info..
> I hope it did, course after you lapped it, you wont be able to RMA, thats for sure..
> 
> Even a delidded CPU can still be RMAed if it did not suffer any damage from the process, but it requires that the printing on the IHS and the PCB is intact :/ so I guess there is no way back now.


I'm wondering this as well, that's why I assumed he was talking about his cpu DIE







bleeding out and not the actual heatspreader/cooler. I mainly lapped because I had a spare lid, I still have the original lid in the event I have to RMA.


----------



## skmanu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Even a delidded CPU can still be RMAed if it did not suffer any damage from the process, but it requires that the printing on the IHS and the PCB is intact :/ so I guess there is no way back now.


Wow man, is that true?

Didn't know that...


----------



## curly haired boy

i experienced the 'squeeze out' effect with my 4770k until i lapped it.


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I've found no real difference in temps when lapping above 600 grit. The performance gain is having both sides flat, not from having two mirrors
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buffing machine won't make it flat. Use a piece of glass and wet sand in figure eight. Don't apply any pressure. I use 3M Wetordry 280 grit to get it flat then 600 grit to make it smooth. Wash the sandpaper often to remove metal particles. When it's done, polish with Brasso.


This.

I remember doing a heatsink because it was concave. After 800 it was crazy smooth. I brought back the 1000 and 1200 grit I bought from autozone


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> The rma is decided 100% based on the info you tell the rep. They do not test the cpu you turn in. Not at all. They only look at the info on the ihs and pcb.
> 
> I had that verified by intel via chat when I rma'ed a 4670k.
> 
> Just something to keep in mind when considering rma.
> 
> I am not suggesting you do anything dishonest. Its just good info.


LOL I do have a 2 other heat spreaders thinking back I should have lapped my 3570k head spreader not suggesting anything fraudulent









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> I was assuming you had bleed out between the dye and ihs, not the heat spreader and cooler. I don't have that problem so can't help you there.


you did help with Aida in how to get the most toasty CPU was going to start a thread but I wanted some traffic and opinions so I posted here.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> Hmmm.. did the lapping fix the problem then? sorry if I missed this info..
> I hope it did, course after you lapped it, you wont be able to RMA, thats for sure..
> 
> Even a delidded CPU can still be RMAed if it did not suffer any damage from the process, but it requires that the printing on the IHS and the PCB is intact :/ so I guess there is no way back now.


I sure hope it does fix my "bleed out problem"
Actually the there has been a MOD edit at the beginning of the thread
Quote:


> MOD NOTE: Delidding your CPU does void its warranty. If you RMA the chip it is classed as RMA fraud, please do not discuss such actions in this thread or anywhere on OCN.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> i experienced the 'squeeze out' effect with my 4770k until i lapped it.


AH thank you I thought I was imagining it at first but after the last reapplication of TIM between die and cooler only to have temps back to normal pretty much confirmed my hunch. +1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> This.
> 
> I remember doing a heatsink because it was concave. After 800 it was crazy smooth. I brought back the 1000 and 1200 grit I bought from autozone


I might start a thread later with my finding I got to test for a month to confirm my experience


----------



## Matt-Matt

So I found this earlier today, I know it's not just an Ivy Bridge club but it's definitely relevant!


----------



## skmanu

^Lol!


----------



## Valgaur

I'm back









Sorry I've been swamped in business papers lately and im finally starting to see the top of the pile T.T

I'll be on here more regularly now thanks to this weekend


----------



## GaMbi2004

Uff.. @Valgaur is back.. Quick! look busy!


----------



## Benjiw

When delidding, why don't you guys stick back down the IHS? One of the first videos I saw of the delidding process shows the end result being glued back down?


----------



## skmanu

Because, if you use stuff like "super glue", and the TIM is not well spread on the die for whatever reason, deliding again to change the TIM is a PITA.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> Because, if you use stuff like "super glue", and the TIM is not well spread on the die for whatever reason, deliding again to change the TIM is a PITA.


He seemed to manage ok though? No?


----------



## skmanu

I did it on my 3770k, and I struggled when wanted to take IHS off again. I almost ruined the PCB...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> I did it on my 3770k, and I struggled when wanted to take IHS off again. I almost ruined the PCB...


What did you use lol? By the looks of it, they just use some silicone?


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> When delidding, why don't you guys stick back down the IHS? One of the first videos I saw of the delidding process shows the end result being glued back down?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> What did you use lol? By the looks of it, they just use some silicone?


I didnt reattach the ihs because its not necessary. The only reason to reattach is so it looks stock or you dont want to deal with the ihs sliding a bit when mounting it on the bracket. But with a little know how its very easily to deal with that. Also by regluing it you run the risk of doing a bad application amd having to delid again or even having a gap between the die and ihs.

Also black rtv is what to use when reattaching, never heard of using superglue.


----------



## incog

gluing back the IHS serves no purpose, so there's little reason to do it. even if the IHS is slightly off the center when you put it back on the motherboard, it doesn't matter.

if you glue back the ihs on, you're making it more difficult to reapply TIM if needed; much more difficult.

i would actually recommend NOT gluing it back on: there are too man cons and no pros.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> When delidding, why don't you guys stick back down the IHS? One of the first videos I saw of the delidding process shows the end result being glued back down?


You may need to reapply your paste sometime. The holder in the socket will be more than secure.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> gluing back the IHS serves no purpose, so there's little reason to do it. even if the IHS is slightly off the center when you put it back on the motherboard, it doesn't matter.
> 
> if you glue back the ihs on, you're making it more difficult to reapply TIM if needed; much more difficult.
> 
> i would actually recommend NOT gluing it back on: there are too man cons and no pros.


^this,
Clp/clu needs to be re applied about 1 time a year.


----------



## DotBeta

Also one thing that isn't mentioned in that vise tutorial is that you have to orient the chip so the side with the vrms are on the wooden block side, having it the opposite way will probably lead to you smacking your vrms on the side of the ihs and damaging them.


----------



## Benjiw

How come you need to keep reapplying the CLU/CLP so often?


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How come you need to keep reapplying the CLU/CLP so often?


You don't? Once a year isn't very often, and it usually doesn't degrade over time so you could go even longer without reapplying so long as you don't notice your temps creeping up.

It's just easier to reapply if you need to, there is no need to reglue the ihs if you don't plan on RMA'ing it, and considering if you delid that basically throws the warranty out of the window anyways, so what's the point?


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How come you need to keep reapplying the CLU/CLP so often?


you don't have to unless you notice a change in performance.


----------



## Benjiw

I'm just doing research on the subject, I forgot about the CPU clamp on intel boards, if I don't ask questions how will I learn? Also when your telling me don't glue it back down because...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> ^this,
> Clp/clu needs to be re applied about 1 time a year.


Once annually is a short time in my books as there is 52 weeks in a year (on average excluding leap years)








I'm just asking...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How come you need to keep reapplying the CLU/CLP so often?


I only reapply if I feel I have physically shifted the ihs. Like when I remove and clean my waterblock and remount, i would redo the tim. Does not need to be done for "time" reasons. It is supposed to last forever. You will know when is necessary by your temps.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I'm just doing research on the subject, I forgot about the CPU clamp on intel boards, if I don't ask questions how will I learn? Also when your telling me don't glue it back down because...
> Once annually is a short time in my books as there is 52 weeks in a year (on average excluding leap years)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just asking...


No one's giving you a hard time for asking questions







, and ask away that's what we're here for. Once a year is a short time for you? Might be 52 weeks, but it's 365 days and 8,765.81 hours if you want to go there







.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> No one's giving you a hard time for asking questions
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , and ask away that's what we're here for. Once a year is a short time for you? Might be 52 weeks, but it's 365 days and 8,765.81 hours if you want to go there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


In the grand scheme of things, a year could possibly be about 1% of your life or 100%.







I'm here for a good time not a long time!


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How come you need to keep reapplying the CLU/CLP so often?


sonetimes the clp will solidify. If that happens it is very difficult to separate the ihs and pcb.

Thats the main thing reapplying will keep from happening.


----------



## Benjiw

So what is the difference between CLP and CLU? What are the pro's and con's of both?


----------



## skmanu

Not much:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2297140


----------



## Benjiw

Amazing! Does anyone use this stuff simply for the IHS and a heatsink too? Does it help cool things further? Tempted to get some for my 8350 and waterblock just to see.


----------



## incog

by the looks of it, clu is easier to work with


----------



## skmanu

IHS/Die only. The gain with HSF/IHS is marhinal, and it's a mess to clean after a while. I had to re-lap my NH-D14/HIS after 1 year with this stuff... Such a PITA to clean it off, lol!


----------



## DotBeta

Yep clp/clu will stain copper, but won't really hurt anything. Aluminum on the other hand will have negative effects, do not use it on aluminum, ever.


----------



## Jayjr1105

When I get some spare time I think I'm going to lap my IHS and clean/re-do the CLP. Not really having heat issues other than a wide margin from hottest to coolest core. Warranty is clearly voided since the de-lid so I figure why not lap too.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> IHS/Die only. The gain with HSF/IHS is marhinal, and it's a mess to clean after a while. I had to re-lap my NH-D14/HIS after 1 year with this stuff... Such a PITA to clean it off, lol!


But you can just use some metal polish and clean it off? Also when you say marhinal what do you mean?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Yep clp/clu will stain copper, but won't really hurt anything. Aluminum on the other hand will have negative effects, do not use it on aluminum, ever.


I have a nickel plated waterblock, so I should be ok? I am thinking about buying some CLU and trying it on my GPU and my FX 8350, any reasons I shouldn't?


----------



## skmanu

I mean "marginal"... typo.


----------



## skmanu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> But you can just use some metal polish and clean it off? Also when you say marhinal what do you mean?
> I have a nickel plated waterblock, so I should be ok? I am thinking about buying some CLU and trying it on my GPU and my FX 8350, any reasons I shouldn't?


No reason to use it on your CPU/GPU.

CLU/CLP is extremely efficient when there is a direct die contact. If there is a IHS in place, i won't lower the temps more than a couple of degrees (max) compared to MX4.


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> When I get some spare time I think I'm going to lap my IHS and clean/re-do the CLP. Not really having heat issues other than a wide margin from hottest to coolest core. Warranty is clearly voided since the de-lid so I figure why not lap too.


you don't void your warranty if all you do is delid without damaging anything (processor or IHS). your warranty should not be voided if you just delidded (see OP).

on the other hand, lapping the IHS means that you lose the stuff that's printed on the IHS and that actually does void your warranty since you lose batch numbers and stuff.

wide margin from hottest to coolest core seems to be something that pops up with almost every processor that gets a delid however I don't believe that the difference is due to the IHS being uneven. I imagine it has more to do with the application of TIM between the die and the IHS, though i'm not entirely sure

either way, I don't think lapping is really worth it if you still have your warranty. you might gain a few °C? idk. i don't think it's worth it, since your warranty isn't actually voided. there have been successful RMAs in the past with delidded processors.


----------



## Benjiw

What if the raised outer is to keep in TIM and is made that way on purpose and by making it as flat as possible you're just undoing a design feature?


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> What if the raised outer is to keep in TIM and is made that way on purpose and by making it as flat as possible you're just undoing a design feature?


Nope, if that was the case then someone would have figured it out years ago. the further apart the lid is from coming in direct contact with the heatsink the more room for heat to not properly be transfered, you want the heatsink to be in as close/flush contact with the lid as possible, this uses less tim in between and in turn produces better heat transfer.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Nope, if that was the case then someone would have figured it out years ago. the further apart the lid is from coming in direct contact with the heatsink the more room for heat to not properly be transfered, you want the heatsink to be in as close/flush contact with the lid as possible, this uses less tim in between and in turn produces better heat transfer.


Fair enough, was just a thought I had lol.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> you don't void your warranty if all you do is delid without damaging anything (processor or IHS). your warranty should not be voided if you just delidded (see OP).
> 
> on the other hand, lapping the IHS means that you lose the stuff that's printed on the IHS and that actually does void your warranty since you lose batch numbers and stuff.
> 
> wide margin from hottest to coolest core seems to be something that pops up with almost every processor that gets a delid however I don't believe that the difference is due to the IHS being uneven. I imagine it has more to do with the application of TIM between the die and the IHS, though i'm not entirely sure
> 
> either way, I don't think lapping is really worth it if you still have your warranty. you might gain a few °C? idk. i don't think it's worth it, since your warranty isn't actually voided. there have been successful RMAs in the past with delidded processors.


you should read op again. It specifically says deliding voids warranty now.


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> you should read op again. It specifically says deliding voids warranty now.


Yeah I didn't feel like starting an argument over that but I'm pretty sure if you whack your IHS off with a hammer or cut it off with a razor your warranty goes poof.


----------



## incog

oops, my bad posting information ~1 year old


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> IHS/Die only. The gain with HSF/IHS is marhinal, and it's a mess to clean after a while. I had to re-lap my NH-D14/HIS after 1 year with this stuff... Such a PITA to clean it off, lol!


It's not that bad to clean off, depends how much you used and the heatsink in question. It does have a benefit from using it over regular pastes if you apply it properly, I saw a good 5-10c drop on a 7950 from some MX-2 to this.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Yep clp/clu will stain copper, but won't really hurt anything. Aluminum on the other hand will have negative effects, do not use it on aluminum, ever.


Yes. this is good advice! If you use it on aluminumum you're going to have a bad time.
That being said anyone that can afford $15 for 1.5G of thermal paste shouldn't be using aluminium heatsinks in the first place.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> oops, my bad posting information ~1 year old


you were correct though.

The op used to show a chat log were the intel rep accepts that rma.

Now it says we are not aloud to discuss ways to get them to accept a delided cpu on ocn.


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> oops, my bad posting information ~1 year old
> 
> 
> 
> you were correct though.
> 
> The op used to show a chat log were the intel rep accepts that rma.
> 
> Now it says we are not aloud to discuss ways to get them to accept a delided cpu on ocn.
Click to expand...

yeah i figured

i forgot to get with the times !

well that should be an incentive for people not to delid unfortunately. not sure though, maybe devil's canyon TIM solution is better than Haswell's original solution.


----------



## mchenhouse

Just curious, wouldn't it decrease temps even more to flat out not even put the IHS back on and just connect the die to the heat sink? Is it just too easy to scratch so we don't do it?


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> What if the raised outer is to keep in TIM and is made that way on purpose and by making it as flat as possible you're just undoing a design feature?


for stock intel round core heatsinks....maybe? regardless, intel has to know that people will put aftermarket stuff on.


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mchenhouse*
> 
> Just curious, wouldn't it decrease temps even more to flat out not even put the IHS back on and just connect the die to the heat sink? Is it just too easy to scratch so we don't do it?


It is done quite frequently in here







its called "naked die mount" or "bare die mount".

It requires some spacers to get the heat sink (cooler) closer to the die since the thickness of the IHS is missing.
The cooler also needs to be tightened down carefully! or you risk cracking the die.. for example if you tighten down one corner more than the others.. you put a lot of stress to the sharp fragile edge of the die, and ultimately crack it.
The CPU requires a precise amount of pressure.. too little and it wont boot. too much and you risk cracking the die.

If done right, your temps will typically drop 3-5 degrees IIRC..


----------



## DotBeta

Running bare die over using the lid is too much work and too much risk for too little gain imo.


----------



## Benjiw

I say go bare die, 3-5ºc is a decent drop in temp to be honest, if I used CLU on my 8350 and then got a 3ºc drop I'd be pretty happy!


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I say go bare die, 3-5ºc is a decent drop in temp to be honest, if I used CLU on my 8350 and then got a 3ºc drop I'd be pretty happy!


http://www.overclock.net/t/1318995/official-fx-8320-fx-8350-vishera-owners-club/10600#post_19631355

8350 Vishera used fluxless solder and already ran cool. I don't know, I mean risking cracking the die on my 300+ dollar 4770k for 3-5c when I already gained -20c just from delidding and using CLU, and another 3-5c from lapping, it's just not worth it.

But that's my opinion, knock yourself out







.


----------



## Benjiw

I already know the IHS or whatever on the FX chips is soldered on.







I wanted to put it on my heat spreader and waterblock is all.








If you want to spend a while lapping rather than buying a kit to remove the IHS then fair play but I'd rather try it and learn from it than not.


----------



## Jimbags

Delidded my 3570k last night, using Ultra. Went from max 77C to hanging around the 69-70C mark @1.02v 3.8Ghz.
Seems warm but thats in a low profile case 70mm height for cpu mobo and cooler So using a Noctua NH-L9i which is only rated for 65W Akso case has only 2x 60mm fans haha so shes doing ok. Tempted to swap my gaming rig 2500k with my htpc but its in an ATX mobo :-/ dammit. Curious to see the temps my Swiftech H220 would get?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Delidded my 3570k last night, using Ultra. Went from max 77C to hanging around the 69-70C mark @1.02v 3.8Ghz.
> Seems warm but thats in a low profile case 70mm height for cpu mobo and cooler So using a Noctua NH-L9i which is only rated for 65W Akso case has only 2x 60mm fans haha so shes doing ok. Tempted to swap my gaming rig 2500k with my htpc but its in an ATX mobo :-/ dammit. Curious to see the temps my Swiftech H220 would get?


3570k and 2500k are the same socket. Just make sure you are on the latest bios on both and you can swap just the cpu's.


----------



## CrazyElf

A few questions - noob at de-lidding here and about to help a buddy.

We are going to be using Gelid GC Extreme, as the non-conductivity gives some margin of error, even if it does run 2-3C hotter than the Liquid Pro and Ultra. This is a 4790K.

How much thermal paste to use? I presume that it's as little as possible like with the core to heatsink mounts? Or is a bit more better this time?
Will the caps beside the CPU need to be covered up with nail polish if Gelid GC Extreme seeing that it is not electrically conductive?
Actually seeing that it is non-conductive of electricity, would it make sense to put a bit of paste on the caps so that they make contact with the core?
Is the pump-out effect of thermal compound a problem? How often will it have to be replaced?
Thanks in advance.

Judging by other people's results here, it is looking like a 15C reduction is possible even with Devil's Canyon.


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CrazyElf*
> 
> 
> Will the caps beside the CPU need to be covered up with nail polish if Gelid GC Extreme seeing that it is not electrically conductive?
> Actually seeing that it is non-conductive of electricity, would it make sense to put a bit of paste on the caps so that they make contact with the core?
> Noob or no noob, outstanding questions
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Look forward to hearing back from the community on this. I've delid two 3570K's, and I'm interested in delidding my new 4670K as well. So these questions certainly apply.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> 3570k and 2500k are the same socket. Just make sure you are on the latest bios on both and you can swap just the cpu's.


My sandybridge is on a p8p67 mobo will that take the ivy? Also Id lose pcie 3.0 which doesnt really matter but also Some usb 3.0 slots. Another reason I want to swap is the ivy mobo is sli capable the sandy mobo isnt :-/ Im thinking of buying a mATX mobo for the sandy? Aah decisions decisions...


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> My sandybridge is on a p8p67 mobo will that take the ivy? Also Id lose pcie 3.0 which doesnt really matter but also Some usb 3.0 slots. Another reason I want to swap is the ivy mobo is sli capable the sandy mobo isnt :-/ Im thinking of buying a mATX mobo for the sandy? Aah decisions decisions...


http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/P8P67_LE/HelpDesk_CPU/


----------



## UZ7

http://imgur.com/hKJRw

 4770K + Maximus VI Gene

Here is my delid done Wednesday night (CPU got here Tuesday lol), this is the 2nd one we've done. First one was back in December with my bro's 4770K and his is a pretty good chip (hits 50x) (@42x 1.15V) but mine is mediocre ://, I could do 4.5 but I'll probably be pushing 1.35v+. Anyway before the delid I was seeing 30C~ idle which is normal, but upon hitting any stress test it would go insta 100C, non avx would get like 80-95C. After delidding I went for low voltage, slight overclock so I went with 4.2GHz @1.23V~ and ended up doing offset rather than adaptive for regular use, so I'm seeing a good 30C, gaming 50C and streaming while gaming on twitch I see a max of 60C on the H80i at low fan rpms. But stress testing, the ones that got 80-95C are 80C> now, the avx that were 100C are down to 84C~ considering they automatically go to 1.3V (+0.1V?) with avx is activated.

Im still doing some testing whether to see if the idle will crash or not with -0.020 offset, which gets me 1.235V/4.2GHz at stress test AIDA FPU and around 0.688V on idle 800MHz. AIDA FPU gave me a max of 83C in one core while the rest were 81/79/76 etc...

Our first time doing it we did Vice, used wood and came right off. This time we didn't have readily available block of wood so we used this piece of metal we found, used hammer (as seen in the picture) after 3-4 good hits came right off







, just make sure you tape up or cover the vice as it tends to scratch the IHS when tightened. Looking at the black glue, it was definitely the culprit of the 30->100->30 temps I was getting.

I may be tweaking a bit more for better voltages and temps but so far not so bad.

[email protected] offset -0.020 // 0.688 idle
AIDA FPU/prime 95 = 80-83 max (vs insta 100C)
x264 50 pass = 70ish
Gaming = 50C max
Gaming + Twitch = 60C
Idle = 30C
H80i // 2x NF-P12
Ambient = Florida, hot as balls, rainy and max humid









Edit: Switched back to Adaptive mode lol


----------



## mchenhouse

I just delidded my i7 3770 K and temps only dropped 5-7 degrees...did I do something wrong? I thought that delidding usually decreases temps usually from 15-25 degrees...
I used CLP and spread only a thin layer of it..My temps went from around 40-42 to 35-36 at idle


----------



## UZ7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mchenhouse*
> 
> I just delidded my i7 3770 K and temps only dropped 5-7 degrees...did I do something wrong? I thought that delidding usually decreases temps usually from 15-25 degrees...
> I used CLP and spread only a thin layer of it..My temps went from around 40-42 to 35-36 at idle


The temp results will depend on how "bad" or how much gap there was in the first place, for example mine non-delid idled around 30s but at stress went 90-100C, the moment I stopped the stress goes back to 30s... so right there you can tell the cooler isnt being effectively used or theres not much contact between the IHS and the die itself, after delid if I get to 80s and stop stressing it will ramp down slowly back to 30s and i can feel hot air coming out of the cooler.

You wont necessarily see 25C+ difference unless the contact was that bad to begin with, some may have gotten better contact in the beginning therefore delidding will give little difference.

Other factors that will help temps, your cooler, your paste, the fans, as well as idle voltages and most importantly ambient temperature. 35-36 seems normal to me unless your ambient is far less.


----------



## mchenhouse

Ok I'm really confused. I overclocked my cpu to 4.4 GHZ and then I delidded it. When I put the cpu back into the mother board and booted up the computer, it recognized it as a new cpu and now its on stock settings...Do I have to OC it again?


----------



## UZ7

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mchenhouse*
> 
> Ok I'm really confused. I overclocked my cpu to 4.4 GHZ and then I delidded it. When I put the cpu back into the mother board and booted up the computer, it recognized it as a new cpu and now its on stock settings...Do I have to OC it again?


Most of the time if you take the pop the cpu out and back in it will see it as a new cpu, most of the time the settings are still there and you can just 'save' it but if your motherboard loaded defaults and you never saved a profile you may have to do it all again


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mchenhouse*
> 
> Ok I'm really confused. I overclocked my cpu to 4.4 GHZ and then I delidded it. When I put the cpu back into the mother board and booted up the computer, it recognized it as a new cpu and now its on stock settings...Do I have to OC it again?


It really helps people to answer your questions if you put your rig in your sig. I'm only sure about Asus mobos, where you need to save your OC profile in case you ever need to reapply it.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1258253/how-to-put-your-rig-in-your-sig

Just doing rigbuilder is not enough. Further down in that thread post it tells you how to add the rigbuilder list to your sig.


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mchenhouse*
> 
> I just delidded my i7 3770 K and temps only dropped 5-7 degrees...did I do something wrong? I thought that delidding usually decreases temps usually from 15-25 degrees...
> I used CLP and spread only a thin layer of it..My temps went from around 40-42 to 35-36 at idle


It's the load temps that will show the largest improvement. My idle temps only dropped 4C but my load temps saw a 21C drop with Prime95. Results will vary as stated in previous post.


----------



## skmanu

^Exactly.

At idle, temps remain roughly the same, delided or not (which is normal, as there is zero stress on the cpu).

Check your temps on load (Prime95/OCCT/Aida64...), that's where you will see the difference.


----------



## incog

That's mostly explained due to how thermal transfer, or the transfer of heat, is greater if the difference in temperature between the CPU and the ambient air it's in is great. So under load, that difference is big and the transfer of heat will be higher, leading to a lower temperature under load. At idle temperatures, the difference between the CPU and the ambient air is much lower, so the amount of heat dissipated is lower.

By delidding, you improve the amount of heat which can be transferred for a certain delta T, or difference in temperature. If your ambient is 20°C and your CPU cores are at 60°C, then you have a 40°C difference. If you're using a stock processor like mine, which is at 84 TDP max, then the processor might be producing something like 50W of heat. A Scythe Katana 4 is enough to dissipate the heat being produced fast enough so that the heat doesn't accumulate. It's the accumulation of heat that make temperatures rise.

I'm using random numbers: a 4770k at 4.8 Ghz and 1.3V on VID at 60°C will be dissipating something more like 100W of heat. At this point, the Scythe Katana 4 can't keep up and we'll need something more like a Noctua NH-D15 to be able to dissipate enough heat to keep temperatures down.

The bigger the difference between the ambient air around the heatsink and the CPU core, the more heat is transferred easily. This is why case ventilation is important: you want the temperature of the air in the case to be as low as possible so as to maximize that difference. I don't know much about case ventilation, the idea though is to lower those ambient temperatures, the best way to do that is (afaik), to change the air in the case as often as possible thanks to case fans.

With those kind of idle temperatures though, you must have high ambient temperatures. I'd say 25°C+ as a rough estimate, not that I know anything.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Have anyone did a direct to die on air cooling?

My i5 4670K ES gets to 87C in x264 using 1.17V 4.0Ghz. Paste is Ceramique 2 under and on IHS. Spreaded well with lots of pressure. Cooler is Venomous X with lapped base.

The coolest core is around 12C to 22C cooler than the first core depending on the benchmark.

The IHS is from a Celeron G3220. I dont have an i5 IHS. The paste under lid is barely noticible in the middle and thin layer on both ends. I suspect the paste on the two ends are trapping too much heat.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Have anyone did a direct to die on air cooling?
> 
> My i5 4670K ES gets to 87C in x264 using 1.17V 4.0Ghz. Paste is Ceramique 2 under and on IHS. Spreaded well with lots of pressure. Cooler is Venomous X with lapped base.
> 
> The coolest core is around 12C to 22C cooler than the first core depending on the benchmark.
> 
> The IHS is from a Celeron G3220. I dont have an i5 IHS. The paste under lid is barely noticible in the middle and thin layer on both ends. I suspect the paste on the two ends are trapping too much heat.


I am thinking that intel should etch please use coollaboratory product here on their die for now on. Use CLU or CLP, not anything else if temp is a concern. Cover your capacitors with nail polish or whatever they recommend nowadays. Have not heard of air coolers direct die although i have heard discussions about whether the tightening and weight would damage the die. I recommend you read the op about which tims to use and how to apply.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

The thing is the CLP is 40 dollars on amazon in Canada. I'm broke right now and I probably won't spend that kind of money on 5 grams of tim.

Ill try CLP once I get more money.

Meanwhile, will D2D on air cooler be fine as long as I'm careful with the mounting pressure?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> The thing is the CLP is 40 dollars on amazon in Canada. I'm broke right now and I probably won't spend that kind of money on 5 grams of tim.
> 
> Ill try CLP once I get more money.
> 
> Meanwhile, will D2D on air cooler be fine as long as I'm careful with the mounting pressure?


Newegg takes btc


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Have anyone did a direct to die on air cooling?
> 
> My i5 4670K ES gets to 87C in x264 using 1.17V 4.0Ghz. Paste is Ceramique 2 under and on IHS. Spreaded well with lots of pressure. Cooler is Venomous X with lapped base.
> 
> The coolest core is around 12C to 22C cooler than the first core depending on the benchmark.
> 
> The IHS is from a Celeron G3220. I dont have an i5 IHS. The paste under lid is barely noticible in the middle and thin layer on both ends. I suspect the paste on the two ends are trapping too much heat.


pm me an address, and I will send you some CLLU that I have spare. No shipping charges or anything.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> The thing is the CLP is 40 dollars on amazon in Canada. I'm broke right now and I probably won't spend that kind of money on 5 grams of tim.
> 
> Ill try CLP once I get more money.
> 
> Meanwhile, will D2D on air cooler be fine as long as I'm careful with the mounting pressure?


....... Order the CLU directly from Coolaboratories, non DHS shipping just plain table rate. I paid 15 bucks U.S. for 1.5g which is more than enough for multiple applications and arrives in around 10-14 days.

40 bucks lmao.


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> The thing is the CLP is 40 dollars on amazon in Canada. I'm broke right now and I probably won't spend that kind of money on 5 grams of tim.
> 
> Ill try CLP once I get more money.
> 
> Meanwhile, will D2D on air cooler be fine as long as I'm careful with the mounting pressure?


I live in Canada too. Did the same as DotBeta ordering direct. All went flawlessly. Got my shipment 10 days later. No duty fee.


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Have anyone did a direct to die on air cooling?
> 
> My i5 4670K ES gets to 87C in x264 using 1.17V 4.0Ghz. Paste is Ceramique 2 under and on IHS. Spreaded well with lots of pressure. Cooler is Venomous X with lapped base.
> 
> The coolest core is around 12C to 22C cooler than the first core depending on the benchmark.
> 
> The IHS is from a Celeron G3220. I dont have an i5 IHS. The paste under lid is barely noticible in the middle and thin layer on both ends. I suspect the paste on the two ends are trapping too much heat.


There is definitely a problem with your cooling setup. Even with using Ceramique you should not be seeing temps like that. Usually the mounting pressure is the reason for that. I had a 212 EVO last year and had a 10C core temp difference. I added washers under the springs to increase the pressure and my temps dropped overall and the core difference dropped to 5C.

I really don't understand why people go to the trouble Delidding and then use a normal paste after it's been discussed extensively and proven that using CLP/CLU is the only TIM that produces good results. Reminds me of the saying "If you want to play be prepared to pay". If you want to OC and have good temps you need the buy whats needed to give you the results you expect to achieve.


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

I don't have any BTC left.

I'll try to order some from Coolaboratories.

Mounting pressure is not a problem. I put a big dot of TIM on lid and when I take off the heatsink there barely any TIM left in the middle, so there's a lot of mounting pressure.


----------



## sweenytodd

@TheLAWNOOB , I bought my CLP from this seller. Fast shipment from Germany to Winnipeg. http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Pro-/161141156776?pt=US_Thermal_Compounds_Supplies&hash=item2584c2eba8


----------



## Valgaur

Remember people you can't do direct die with an aircooler, the weight of the cooler itself will cause problems and could possibly crack the die, just use the IHS and take the better temps.

Direct die is for Watercooling as the cooling size and weight of those blocks is far less than aircoolers.


----------



## HITTI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Remember people you can't do direct die with an aircooler, the weight of the cooler itself will cause problems and could possibly crack the die, just use the IHS and take the better temps.
> 
> Direct die is for Watercooling as the cooling size and weight of those blocks is far less than aircoolers.


If direct die water cooling were to be utilized, what tim is recommended? Still coollabortories ultra?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HITTI*
> 
> If direct die water cooling were to be utilized, what tim is recommended? Still coollabortories ultra?


yes


----------



## HITTI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> yes


Ok, kewl.

One other question if you maybe able to answer or anyone else.

If direct die water cooling was to be utilized with spring loaded thumb screws to hold the water cooling block down, about how many turns "its hard to ask this question trying to phrase it best as possible" should the thumb screws be turned to prevent cracking of the cpu die?


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Thanks guys I ordered from their official site a few hours ago.

If my mobo lays flat all the time is Direct to Die for air coolers still not recommended?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> Thanks guys I ordered from their official site a few hours ago.
> 
> If my mobo lays flat all the time is Direct to Die for air coolers still not recommended?


http://www.overclock.net/t/1520338/cpu-starting-to-show-signs-of-wear-what-do/0_100#post_23053662

Sorry for the link but the picture is not on my phone. Here are my old temps with a d14. You should not have to direct die. Clu should solve the issue completely.


----------



## Jayjr1105

I feel like I'm nursing this chip a bit. Need to take it up a notch. You guys think my 10c difference is poor CLP job?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> I feel like I'm nursing this chip a bit. Need to take it up a notch. You guys think my 10c difference is poor CLP job?


Why run IBT for stressing? you will have more headroom and stability from x264.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> I feel like I'm nursing this chip a bit. Need to take it up a notch. You guys think my 10c difference is poor CLP job?


Have you tried a higher clock/vcore? You may not go up in temp as much as you think. You can probably do 4.7 or 4.8 and be good. Only way to know is to try.


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Why run IBT for stressing? you will have more headroom and stability from x264.


I've always used IBT for quick and dirty stability testing.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> I've always used IBT for quick and dirty stability testing.


me too but now I only run a cycle or too. Haswell with avx2 is just too hot. x264 is 20c cooler and will find the instabilites better.

I can pass IBT and be prettty far off on my vcore being stable.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*
> 
> I feel like I'm nursing this chip a bit. Need to take it up a notch. You guys think my 10c difference is poor CLP job?


4.7ghz 1.36v llc turbo and pll overvoltage off. Show me ibt


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> 4.7ghz 1.36v llc turbo and pll overvoltage off. Show me ibt


See sig rig. I've been at 4.7 before on 1.32v. I felt for what I did, 4.4 on stock voltage was pretty darn good.


----------



## DotBeta

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> I don't have any BTC left.
> 
> I'll try to order some from Coolaboratories.
> 
> Mounting pressure is not a problem. I put a big dot of TIM on lid and when I take off the heatsink there barely any TIM left in the middle, so there's a lot of mounting pressure.


isnt that a good thing? You want as much contact as possible the less tim between the better heat transfer, or am i wrong?


----------



## Jayjr1105

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> 4.7ghz 1.36v llc turbo and pll overvoltage off. Show me ibt


----------



## TheLAWNOOB

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1520338/cpu-starting-to-show-signs-of-wear-what-do/0_100#post_23053662
> 
> Sorry for the link but the picture is not on my phone. Here are my old temps with a d14. You should not have to direct die. Clu should solve the issue completely.


Thanks for the link. I used to have another i5 4670K that ran a lot cooler and faster.

Not sure if there's a problem with the Pentium G3220 IHS I'm using or not.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DotBeta*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *TheLAWNOOB*
> 
> I don't have any BTC left.
> 
> I'll try to order some from Coolaboratories.
> 
> Mounting pressure is not a problem. I put a big dot of TIM on lid and when I take off the heatsink there barely any TIM left in the middle, so there's a lot of mounting pressure.
> 
> 
> 
> isnt that a good thing? You want as much contact as possible the less tim between the better heat transfer, or am i wrong?
Click to expand...

It is a good thing, but I've used the exact same paste and heatsink with another i5 4670K before and it was a lot cooler. That i5 at 1.3V 4.7Ghz running IBT was cooler than this piece of trash running at 4.0Ghz 1.17V under x264.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jayjr1105*


I kind of thought that would work







You can tweak the voltage some to make sure its stable but it's a start.

Edit: Ah just saw that was an old setting. Nice chip you have there. Have you gone for 5 yet? Looks capable to me.


----------



## brandotip

Also posted in Raystorm club: Anyone here using a Raystorm block AND an EK-Naked Ivy kit?? I've only seen 1 or 2 threads about this and they are all a little dated now.


----------



## skmanu

FInally got the Liquid Ultra, and the new MoBo (Z97 extreme4) and got pretty decent temperature:
OCCT AVX, from 78°C to 83°C through all the cores at 4.8GHz/1.33v.

Will check IBT now.


----------



## skmanu

IBT 10 pass, high 80°C to 85°C. Still good.


----------



## HITTI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HITTI*
> 
> Ok, kewl.
> 
> One other question if you maybe able to answer or anyone else.
> 
> If direct die water cooling was to be utilized with spring loaded thumb screws to hold the water cooling block down, about how many turns "its hard to ask this question trying to phrase it best as possible" should the thumb screws be turned to prevent cracking of the cpu die?


I just now found this.

Wow. Just crazy.

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/19464/ex-blc-1437/EK_Supremacy_Precise_Mount_Add-On_Naked_Ivy_CPU_Block_Adapter_Hardare_EK-Supremacy_PreciseMount_Add-on_Naked_Ivy.html#blank

Only thing is, Out of Stock.


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Morning Everyone,

Any chance someone has experience or knows if the EK-FB ASUS M6I (full block for Asus Impact VI) works with a bare die? I'm just curious if I should be concerned whether the block makes complete contact?

Thanks!
Benjamin


----------



## HITTI

Ok, I delidded my 3770k.

I am just coming down from adrenaline high.

First off, if anyone didn't know, go out and buy a new vice if you do this. I beveled the edges where the jaws met on my IHS







in a vice that has no teeth but has miniature grooves in the jaw bars from excessive use, well you know, a vice gets well used. But the good news is I dropped 25c-20c in degrees so I am guessing it is alright, but in the near future ima pick up a supremacy ek block and a naked die screw kit and that should drop me even further







. I am still very nervous doing this as it is my first time doing this on a $329 processor.

Originally I reached high of 84c oced at 4.6 with v1.22 well u cans ee in the screenshot, dunno if coretemp or cpuz is right with the voltages.

Screen shot.


Second screenshot


----------



## euf0ria

Yeeeha! Add me to the list Successfully delidded 3570K now running bare without IHS under my EK supremacy block with the "EK naked mount screws". I saw someone asking about how many turns you should turn the thumbscrews without risk of cracking the dye and i think I have a short answer:
What worked fine for me at first attempt was: Start with 2-3 turns (360°x3) tightened in a cross pattern, If you feel a bit of resistance in turning it is a good thing. After this i thightened the screws a tiny bit more each by each to get the feeling of ewual pressure on all four. Last step was to take something to meassure with and meassure the distance from top of thumbscrew to top of mounting bracket and then set this distance equal to all four. This way you make sure the block is flat/horizontal.

The goal was to get a tiny pressure on the dye so that the CPU get in contact with all pins. Then if the distance is meassured on all four screws the block is flat any you will have a nice connection with the dye. Worked perfect for me! I think that if you tighten the screws to much there is a risk in pushing the CPU-PCB concave making the outer connector pads loose the contact with their respective pins.
To simplify: The dye must be in flat contact with block and CPU must get connection with all pads to pins. IMO not much pressure at all is needed.



I used the Vice only method and prepped the old vice with sharp plates of aluminium covered in silvertape to keep PCB from slipping away, could not have been easier!


Before


After


----------



## Imprezzion

That's a solid 20c drop.. Yours must've been almost as bad as my 3770K in terms of paste / black stuff application







. Mine dropped 18c average on stock speed between cores back in the day when I did mine.. Mine had a very uneven ''black stuff'' application and the IHS was only partially covered / contacted with TIM. ~25% of it didn't even contact the IHS properly.

Still surprised it's not degrading and that after 1 year + the CLU is still performing exactly like it did when I applied it.. I thought it was kind of normal te replace CLU every year orso.

I mean, I still run 4.95Ghz @ 1.432v load on my 3770K and Prime95 temps with a 12 hour run are hovering around 75c hottest and 70c coldest core.
My normal usage temps have been 55-65c depending on the application / game but have never changed since I delidded and applied CLU.

I also double applied it btw. Die - IHS is CLU. IHS is lapped top and bottom btw. Then my IHS - Waterblock is also CLU and both lapped.


----------



## HITTI

@Imprezzion, nice. I wonder how you got to 5Ghz, mine keeps clocking down in middle of IBT from 5Ghz to 3.5Ghz making it unstable :S.


----------



## blurp

Hi all, since I delidded, I increase the OC on my 4790k to 4700 mHz on a daily basis. It's been rock stable so far with long x264 tests and a few shorter Prime, AIDAetc. Here is a bench of IBT. Max temp is 72C with a Vcore of 1.26v. I'm satisfied by the temps.







Edited for ambient temps : 22-23 C


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> Hi all, since I delidded, I increase the OC on my 4790k to 4700 mHz on a daily basis. It's been rock stable so far with long x264 tests and a few shorter Prime, AIDAetc. Here is a bench of IBT. Max temp is 72C with a Vcore of 1.26v. I'm satisfied by the temps.


Nice stuff! Can you tell us what CPU cooler and motherboard you're using?


----------



## blurp

It's mostly in the signature.







Custom watercool : dual 240Rads + CPU & GPU Blocks with a D5 PWM pump. Of course delidded with CLU with a Gigabyte Z97X-SOC motherboard.


----------



## Imprezzion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HITTI*
> 
> @Imprezzion, nice. I wonder how you got to 5Ghz, mine keeps clocking down in middle of IBT from 5Ghz to 3.5Ghz making it unstable :S.


Your using a Z75 board with power phases barely enough to run a i7 on stock.. It;s a miracle you even got to 4.6Ghz lol.

Ofcourse it's throttling. If it wouldn't the boards VRM's would turn into a molten heap in 60 minutes.

I run 4.95 cause it boosts my RAM freq. a bit and needs less volts then full on 5Ghz. This runs 100% stable on 1.432v, but for 5Ghz (either multi x50 or x49 + bclk) it needs at least 1.456v to be stable. I can't be bothered to run that much extra volts for 52Mhz..


----------



## HITTI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Your using a Z75 board with power phases barely enough to run a i7 on stock.. It;s a miracle you even got to 4.6Ghz lol.
> 
> Ofcourse it's throttling. If it wouldn't the boards VRM's would turn into a molten heap in 60 minutes.
> 
> I run 4.95 cause it boosts my RAM freq. a bit and needs less volts then full on 5Ghz. This runs 100% stable on 1.432v, but for 5Ghz (either multi x50 or x49 + bclk) it needs at least 1.456v to be stable. I can't be bothered to run that much extra volts for 52Mhz..


Yup, I just found out it is the vrm's. In the asrock thread.

Ima make a new thread about a ASUS Z77-A see if it would be ok to oc at 5Ghz with it. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131965 by the looks of it, it has two heatsinks for vrm's. Meaning more chips less heat i think.


----------



## Imprezzion

It's decent but nothing more then that. Should be able to handle a bit of a OC tho.


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> It's mostly in the signature.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Custom watercool : dual 240Rads + CPU & GPU Blocks with a D5 PWM pump. Of course delidded with CLU with a Gigabyte Z97X-SOC motherboard.


my bad, should have read !









then again at least people who will read this in a few years when you have another rig will know what we're talking about

gotta ask: what core temperature / vrm temperatures do you get on that 780?


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Delidded my new i5-4670K, which is now my second chip! I had an i5-3570K delidded as well earlier this year. Unfortunately I can't seem to find my pre-delid screenshot, but I'll do my best to dig around and find it this evening. For now, here are my results:

*Membership Information:*
OCN name: BenjaminBenj
CPU: i5-4670K (Haswell)
on die-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
Mhz gained: +100MHz (temporarily)
OC after delid: 4.7GHz (will test further levels after folding competition)
Temp drops: Avg. temp drop across all four cores (17C). Hottest core dropped 25C.
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

Additional info:
*IntelBurnTest 2.54 (max temps):*
*Core 4.5GHz @ 1.20V*

*Before delidding:*
0: 89c
1: 90c
2: 87c
3: 85c

*After delidding:*
0: 74c
1: 65c
2: 70c
3: 74c

Pretty AWESOME temp difference as you can see, and this is with the IHS









Also, for those using EK's *EK-FB ASUS M6I*, the IHS needs to remain unless you have thinner plastic mounting washers on the motherboard side. I tried going without the IHS, but there was a decent gap between block and CPU die. Regardless, the temp differences are HUGE and I'm 100% satisfied with the outcome. Plus, I feel a bit safer having the IHS on considering my motherboard lays flat.


----------



## EMENCII

How to muont the cooler without the HIS?


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EMENCII*
> 
> How to muont the cooler without the HIS?


If you have to ask, I suggest not to mount without the IHS.. just clean off all the "glue" and change the original TIM with CLP/CLU and put the IHS back on..


----------



## HITTI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EMENCII*
> 
> How to muont the cooler without the HIS?


What processor do you have?

I could only find 2 addons.

EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on

1st- (Llano), 2nd- (Richland / Trinity) and 3rd (Kaveri) generation AMD
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-apu.html

IvyBridge.
http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> If you have to ask, I suggest not to mount without the IHS.. just clean off all the "glue" and change the original TIM with CLP/CLU and put the IHS back on..


Spot on for sure Gambi. I just posted my results a few posts up, and the temp differences were quite substantial with the IHS. Very satisfied with the results!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenjaminBenj*
> 
> Spot on for sure Gambi. I just posted my results a few posts up, and the temp differences were quite substantial with the IHS. Very satisfied with the results!


I'm glad your happy with the results!

BUT could you do the submission information as requested on the OP of the front page


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm glad your happy with the results!
> 
> BUT could you do the submission information as requested on the OP of the front page


Absolutely! I'll edit my post this evening for you


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenjaminBenj*
> 
> Absolutely! I'll edit my post this evening for you


Spanks


----------



## chas1723

Can i join with my 3770K?


----------



## chas1723

Here is my newly delidded 3770K.


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chas1723*
> 
> Can i join with my 3770K?


I'm pretty sure any Intel cpu that is delidded is eligible.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chas1723*
> 
> Can i join with my 3770K?


if you have any information that is required for membership in the first post of the OP then give me what you can or else I can add you id its a fresh chip.


----------



## WiSK

Just checked my delidded i7-3770K after a year(?) and CLU is still fluid and doesn't seem to need any attention.


----------



## chas1723

chas1723
Ivy 3770K
currently Arctic MX2 on the die and IHS. I plan on running naked once my pump comes in for my loop.
I am running 4.5 ghz as I was before delidding. I will work more with this once my loop is complete.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Just checked my delidded i7-3770K after a year(?) and CLU is still fluid and doesn't seem to need any attention.


Nice! cool looking build


----------



## Systemlord

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Just checked my delidded i7-3770K after a year(?) and CLU is still fluid and doesn't seem to need any attention.


Your computer looks like your liquid nitrogen canister blew-up or Winter came early for you this year. In either case I have never seen anything like it before!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nice! cool looking build


Thank you








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Systemlord*
> 
> Your computer looks like your liquid nitrogen canister blew-up or Winter came early for you this year. In either case I have never seen anything like it before!


It was a can of plastidip white, but thanks


----------



## HITTI

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chas1723*
> 
> chas1723
> Ivy 3770K
> I plan on running naked once my pump comes in for my loop.


Same here, my naked ivy kit arrived yesterday. Just waiting on to purchase a new board, a supremacy evo waterblock then I will be set. My goals are long way ahead of me. $166 for the board, $100 or less for the block, I am completely redoing my loop once my dust filters, wash squeeze bottle comes in. Long road ahead of me. Have to buy parts in increments.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenjaminBenj*
> 
> Delidded my new i5-4670K, which is now my second chip! I had an i5-3570K delidded as well earlier this year. Unfortunately I can't seem to find my pre-delid screenshot, but I'll do my best to dig around and find it this evening. For now, here are my results:
> 
> *Membership Information:*
> OCN name: BenjaminBenj
> CPU: i5-4670K (Haswell)
> on die-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: +100MHz (temporarily)
> OC after delid: 4.7GHz (will test further levels after folding competition)
> Temp drops: Avg. temp drop across all four cores (17C). Hottest core dropped 25C.
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Additional info:
> *IntelBurnTest 2.54 (max temps):*
> *Core 4.5GHz @ 1.20V*
> 
> *Before delidding:*
> 0: 89c
> 1: 90c
> 2: 87c
> 3: 85c
> 
> *After delidding:*
> 0: 74c
> 1: 65c
> 2: 70c
> 3: 74c
> 
> Pretty AWESOME temp difference as you can see, and this is with the IHS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, for those using EK's *EK-FB ASUS M6I*, the IHS needs to remain unless you have thinner plastic mounting washers on the motherboard side. I tried going without the IHS, but there was a decent gap between block and CPU die. Regardless, the temp differences are HUGE and I'm 100% satisfied with the outcome. Plus, I feel a bit safer having the IHS on considering my motherboard lays flat.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


















Thanks Val!


----------



## feznz

Just wanted to share again !!! my bleed out again even with a heat spreader lap







I can only explain why I got good temps after replacing TIM just between Heat spreader and water block only was when I released the mounting pressure it "sucked" the TIM back in between the die and heat spreader. I also have reduced the mounting pressure after using the kitchen scales to estimate mounting pressure I was mounting probably about 12kg enough to flex the die I believe.
So I got some CLU I should have taken the OP advice LOL but the differecences in temps with similar ambient temperature comparing,
Noctua NT-H1

CLU on die, Noctua NT-H1 between Heat spreader and water block

A solid 3°C drop @ same 4.8Ghz/vcore settings


----------



## Curleyyy

Could I save myself the trouble of leaving the house, and take the blade out of a shaver to delid?


----------



## electro2u

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> Could I save myself the trouble of leaving the house, and take the blade out of a shaver to delid?


you could... but the chances are much higher it will end in tears (or just manly disappointment)

I would never ever ever use the razor method.

Vice+block of hard wood (hickory is the way to go)+hammer

Very very safe.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> Could I save myself the trouble of leaving the house, and take the blade out of a shaver to delid?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *electro2u*
> 
> you could... but the chances are much higher it will end in tears (or just manly disappointment)
> 
> I would never ever ever use the razor method.
> 
> Vice+block of hard wood (hickory is the way to go)+hammer
> 
> Very very safe.


no no no no no shaver blades. I've seen some try that and it does not turn out very well, the blades are to flexible and destroy the pcb under the IHS, take the time and get the necessary stuff to have a cpu thats worth something to continue working.


----------



## BenjaminBenj

*Nods*, I would imagine those small replaceable blades are ridiculously hard to work with! I used a box cutter blade myself (one-sided), and it worked beautifully across two different CPUs (Ivy and Haswell). It's funny, usually people are either far to the right with the razor method or far to the left with the vice method *laughs*. I couldn't get myself to do the vice method personally, and found with patience and slow progression, the razor method worked great! Regardless of your chosen method, take your time


----------



## Ramstone

Yeah it sucks having neither an old school blade or vice in your inventory. I opted for the cheaper outlay. $6 for 10 blades at CVS, 9 of which I'll never use. Maybe I'll take up old school shaving assuming I can find a handle.


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ramstone*
> 
> Yeah it sucks having neither an old school blade or vice in your inventory. I opted for the cheaper outlay. $6 for 10 blades at CVS, 9 of which I'll never use. Maybe I'll take up old school shaving assuming I can find a handle.


Any Home Depots or Lowes in your area? I grabbed two blades at HD, worked like a charm.


----------



## electro2u

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenjaminBenj*
> 
> *Nods*, I would imagine those small replaceable blades are ridiculously hard to work with! I used a box cutter blade myself (one-sided), and it worked beautifully across two different CPUs (Ivy and Haswell). It's funny, usually people are either far to the right with the razor method or far to the left with the vice method *laughs*. I couldn't get myself to do the vice method personally, and found with *patience and slow progression*, the razor method worked great! Regardless of your chosen method, take your time


I know you are right. This entire post is basically gospel truth and it made me chuckle. The thing is the patience and going slow. I like fast and simple. I've heard one sad vice story (didn't use a hammer but instead forced the PCB off by tightening the vice) while I've heard literally about a dozen razor fails.


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *electro2u*
> 
> I know you are right. This entire post is basically gospel truth and it made me chuckle. The thing is the patience and going slow. I like fast and simple. I've heard one sad vice story (didn't use a hammer but instead forced the PCB off by tightening the vice) while I've heard literally about a dozen razor fails.


Haha







right on. And really, to be quite candid and real here, I spent days if not weeks considering BOTH options for delidding my two CPUs. They both carry similar and unique risks, and I guess it really comes down to how one associates those risks with their ability, etc. I have fairly steady hands and actually shave with a single blade lol, so the shaving experience left me somewhat biased haha. I'd never argue one being better than the other though, but I would argue success ultimately comes down to patience for both!


----------



## jcm27

For me, I decided using what I can get my hands on.
Being a university student living in an apartment in a city meant I didn't have blades,wooden blocks or vice laying around.
So using my gf's amazon prime, I got myself a £17 vice, delidded the CPU and arranged a return.
Win win








In the process of leak testing my loop so I'll get in the club once it's up and running fully.


----------



## euf0ria

My vote goes to vice only, could not be more simple and controlled. If school has a workshop they probably have a vice there and if you are a working man/woman I'm sure you could find a vice somewhere at your own work or at a friends work.


----------



## jcm27

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jcm27*
> 
> For me, I decided using what I can get my hands on.
> Being a university student living in an apartment in a city meant I didn't have blades,wooden blocks or vice laying around.
> So using my gf's amazon prime, I got myself a £17 vice, delidded the CPU and arranged a return.
> Win win
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In the process of leak testing my loop so I'll get in the club once it's up and running fully.


Welp, I done goof.
Temps were OK the first day, idle temps stayed the same but load temps went down by 10-15 depending on core.
The big problem was core temps variation, 10-15 from coolest to hottest








Now idle temps have gone up to high 30s/mid 40s and I can't be bother to take down my watercooling loop as Im out of DI water









Hopefully it'll be ok till next year when I do a maintenance


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jcm27*
> 
> Welp, I done goof.
> Temps were OK the first day, idle temps stayed the same but load temps went down by 10-15 depending on core.
> The big problem was core temps variation, 10-15 from coolest to hottest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now idle temps have gone up to high 30s/mid 40s and I can't be bother to take down my watercooling loop as Im out of DI water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully it'll be ok till next year when I do a maintenance


For $2-$5 per gallon of water, it would be worth tearing down the loop. You are risking your cpu by not tearing it down.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jcm27*
> 
> Welp, I done goof.
> Temps were OK the first day, idle temps stayed the same but load temps went down by 10-15 depending on core.
> The big problem was core temps variation, 10-15 from coolest to hottest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now idle temps have gone up to high 30s/mid 40s and I can't be bother to take down my watercooling loop as Im out of DI water
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully it'll be ok till next year when I do a maintenance
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For $2-$5 per gallon of water, it would be worth tearing down the loop. You are risking your cpu by not tearing it down.
Click to expand...

$.97 at publix. I agree here. Tear that sucker down. Water for a loop is cheap and readily available.

Edit to add: couple troubleshooting things to do first though: shake the case...could be an air bubble. Check the TIM without a total breakdown if you are using soft tubing.


----------



## Feyris

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> $.97 at publix. I agree here. Tear that sucker down. Water for a loop is cheap and readily available.
> 
> Edit to add: couple troubleshooting things to do first though: shake the case...could be an air bubble. Check the TIM without a total breakdown if you are using soft tubing.


I want your publix. Ours never has their own brand, just zephryhills which is bit more expensive.


----------



## brandotip

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Feyris*
> 
> I want your publix. Ours never has their own brand, just zephryhills which is bit more expensive.


how does your Publix not have their own brand?? Weird. (Their iced teas by the deli are THE BEST) I actually go to walmart where the DI water is .68c a gallon


----------



## Hanshin

For people concerned with not having a vice or razor, you might consider the "card" method.
It is by far the safest method and with some practice, you could delid in less than 5 minutes.

All you need is a plastified/rigid paper card (like parking ticket). You might have to open one corner with a razer/cutter if you dont manage to open the first corner with the card but except for my first time, I never had too.
Once done, the card will cut the adhesive like butter with no risk of scratching or bending!

9 cpu delidded for me with that method so far, it is very easy!


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Interesting







never heard of this method Hanshin! Awesome stuff. Hmm, would a playing card work? Our local parking tickets are super duper thin and flexible. Might have to try this out on my 3rd CPU.


----------



## Hanshin

A playing card would work!
The only difficult part is to find where you will insert the card first. If it is not rigid enough, it might be difficult. That's where the cutter will be great, to fopen one corner. After, no need anymore!


----------



## Valgaur

I've seen some people think this before and I'm nearly positive the card has to be laminated, or else the constant movement wears the paper down to much, which can also put paper fibers in places it shouldn't, information to be careful with


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> 9 cpu delidded for me with that method so far, it is very easy!


Wow 9! I've only done the one like this and posted in the thread earlier, but it seemed like the idea won't get popular without a video or something showing how easy it is.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I'm done with blades and with vices to be honest. I've found a thin but strong plastic store card that can take off an IHS with no chance of scratches. Just use a heatgun a little beforehand to soften the glue


----------



## Hanshin

Yes 9! 3 for me, and 6 for people who asked me to do it for them.

I posted too nearly 9 monthes before about this method, but it seems people prefer the vice method. But nice to have a card buddy!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> A little tip for those who want to delid with razor or do not have access to a vice: open one corner with the razor, and use a plastified card (I used a member card of some store here in Japan) to cut all the other sides.
> Here some example by someone on Youtube:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I delidded myself 2 CPUs like that, and delidding my 4770k took me 45 seconds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just be careful on the SMD capacitators side of the 4770k, but there are a lot less risks than the razor alone.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> I posted too nearly 9 monthes before about this method,


Yes, I remember now - I think that video is where I learned the idea


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> Yes 9! 3 for me, and 6 for people who asked me to do it for them.
> 
> I posted too nearly 9 monthes before about this method, but it seems people prefer the vice method. But nice to have a card buddy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Hanshin*
> 
> A little tip for those who want to delid with razor or do not have access to a vice: open one corner with the razor, and use a plastified card (I used a member card of some store here in Japan) to cut all the other sides.
> Here some example by someone on Youtube:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I delidded myself 2 CPUs like that, and delidding my 4770k took me 45 seconds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just be careful on the SMD capacitators side of the 4770k, but there are a lot less risks than the razor alone.
Click to expand...

+Rep!

I've just found out my second (new) delid method, lol








Have to do it in a couple of days or so, just before I'll setup my first full custom liquid cooling and wanted to try the razor this time (my former 3770K was delidded with the hammer and vice)
Or the vice only method
Or (as one of my friends told me) a combo of a razor (first) and the vice only
However, it seems that I'm willing to try your way this time









Btw:
Can I use a hair dryer to heat up the ihs in order to soften the glue a bit?


----------



## Valgaur

This really doesn't soften the glue but you can try


----------



## arrow0309

I imagined that too
So I'll try the classic, cold delid


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

I thing I can now vouch for the card method...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







Used a razor to get the corner started then used a laminated card to get the rest of it. though finding a thin but sturdy card was difficult, something like a plastic business card should work perfectly fine.
I wasn't nearly as fast as in video, but it was much faster than Razor-only, but with less risk of Damaging VRMs. \
Would do it again.

Although, this chip seems to have poor thermals when overclocked, despite the use of CLU under the IHS, re mounted and re applied twice with 0 difference in temps. Only 1 core ran at the temperatures I was expecting for an H80i.

System specs:
i7 4770K
Gigabyte Z87 UD3H
G.Skill Ares 2400
EVGA GTX 780ti
Corsair H80i
Corsair 850W psu
Corsair 750D
Samsung 840Evo SSD


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



*Before*:
Stock clocks @1.03V OCCT+AVX ran around 80C after 10 minutes
4.4OC OCCT+AVX failed within 5 seconds. hit 92C

*After*:
Stock clocks @1.03V OCCT+AVX ran 60C with 1 core around 55C after 10 minutes

OC 4.4GHz @1.235V OCCT (NO AVX) around 80C with one core at 72C
OC 4.4GHz @1.235V OCCT+AVX failed within 5 seconds hit 90C+



As I said before, 3 cores run hot, even after re-mounting and re applying pastes, so I'm not sure if it's me, or the cpu, or even the H80i itself leading to poor temps when overclocked, despite the difference in temps at stock speeds.


----------



## skynet2k8

http://valid.x86.fr/hmp1ah


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I thing I can now vouch for the card method...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Used a razor to get the corner started then used a laminated card to get the rest of it. though finding a thin but sturdy card was difficult, something like a plastic business card should work perfectly fine.
> I wasn't nearly as fast as in video, but it was much faster than Razor-only, but with less risk of Damaging VRMs. \
> Would do it again.
> 
> Although, this chip seems to have poor thermals when overclocked, despite the use of CLU under the IHS, re mounted and re applied twice with 0 difference in temps. Only 1 core ran at the temperatures I was expecting for an H80i.
> 
> System specs:
> i7 4770K
> Gigabyte Z87 UD3H
> G.Skill Ares 2400
> EVGA GTX 780ti
> Corsair H80i
> Corsair 850W psu
> Corsair 750D
> Samsung 840Evo SSD
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> *Before*:
> Stock clocks @1.03V OCCT+AVX ran around 80C after 10 minutes
> 4.4OC OCCT+AVX failed within 5 seconds. hit 92C
> 
> *After*:
> Stock clocks @1.03V OCCT+AVX ran 60C with 1 core around 55C after 10 minutes
> 
> OC 4.4GHz @1.235V OCCT (NO AVX) around 80C with one core at 72C
> OC 4.4GHz @1.235V OCCT+AVX failed within 5 seconds hit 90C+
> 
> 
> 
> As I said before, 3 cores run hot, even after re-mounting and re applying pastes, so I'm not sure if it's me, or the cpu, or even the H80i itself leading to poor temps when overclocked, despite the difference in temps at stock speeds.


I have 1 core that runs cooler I think its getting that CLU perfect even after you have clamped down the IHS if it slides it might drag a small amount of the past leaving more at one end than the other.Even if only 1/4 of a mm or something. Just a theory is all
Are you using the iGPU?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> I have 1 core that runs cooler I think its getting that CLU perfect even after you have clamped down the IHS if it slides it might drag a small amount of the past leaving more at one end than the other.Even if only 1/4 of a mm or something. Just a theory is all
> Are you using the iGPU?


It might be, when I demounted the CPU after the initial tests, it looked as though the CLU in the center had rubbed away from the center of the die and towards the top and bottom. and keeping the IHS still when mounting was pretty difficult. so that could be the culprit.

yes, actually it drives the secondary monitor.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> It might be, when I demounted the CPU after the initial tests, it looked as though the CLU in the center had rubbed away from the center of the die and towards the top and bottom. and keeping the IHS still when mounting was pretty difficult. so that could be the culprit.
> 
> yes, actually it drives the secondary monitor.


could be then. If you take it apart again check if your IHS is flat, what you have described sounds like pushing from centre out or sliding up and down hmmmm...
Im not 100% sure as I havent check benchmarks but surely the iGPU would effect temps voltage even performance. On a small scale at the least??
Anyone checked this?


----------



## gwertyu

Just delided my 4670k, used vice method, the thing required like 8 hard hits to release the ihs(had tons of glue) , the problem i have now is the ihs have some bents on the edges, how can i remove them? The cpu is working fine -5c on idle, and on load the same as before, so i am thinking the bents on the ihs are preventing a good contact with the cooler. What sandpaper is needed to make it flat again?


----------



## Arxontas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skynet2k8*
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/hmp1ah


Hi there,

Since you spam this jpg all over the forum, let me inform you that many of the ppl who post here are really, really knowledgeable about overclocking.

Consequently, the crap you post will not fly around here because what you are posting is a screenie of a system which is termed "pseudo-stable". This is not a real overclock, this is pseudo stability.


----------



## stickg1

IMO there's still value in stable enough to post or bench overclocking. It's not always about rock solid stability.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arxontas*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *skynet2k8*
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/hmp1ah
> 
> 
> 
> Hi there,
> 
> Since you spam this jpg all over the forum, let me inform you that many of the ppl who post here are really, really knowledgeable about overclocking.
> 
> Consequently, the crap you post will not fly around here because what you are posting is a screenie of a system which is termed "pseudo-stable". This is not a real overclock, this is pseudo stability.
Click to expand...

Stability is subjective, and dependent on intended use. I would venture a guess that 50% or more on OC.net do not run 24 hour P95, myself included. This, for instance, was stable enough to boot and open CPUZ


----------



## skynet2k8

it's a real overclock and it's done without a delidded chip 
stable 247


----------



## Arxontas

Quote:


> it's a real overclock and it's done without a delidded chip stable 247


That's a cool story. Where is your 24 hours Prime 95 Torture Test?

P.S.: No photoshop.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skynet2k8*
> 
> 
> it's a real overclock and it's done without a delidded chip
> stable 247


LOL, then why did you post it here? you should be able t hit 50x under 1.4 with that chip. looks like a decent one.


----------



## skynet2k8

a friend of mine has a delidded processor his temperatures is much higher than mine I was just posting my results on your page to get information about delidded chips and temperatures I gave my friend the information to subscribe to your site he has a delidded chip maybe you can help him find out why is temperatures are so high this is his rig

oh and by the way I have hit 5 gigahertz at 1.285 volts


----------



## Valgaur

Okay, okay, okay. Before the whole stability and OC warfare starts lets tone it a bit and just appreciate the OC's that are being posted.

An Overclock is just that, AN OVERCLOCK. No need for crazy stability, no nothin. This is Overclock.net remember any and all OC's are welcome anywhere and always will be, criticism is great and all if its helpful.

Stability runs are cool to, not my cup of tea but I respect them, especially considering the time and effort put into them. However a good stability run isn't really something to span banners and shoot fireworks off of, yeah its cool to have a 36 hour long run at a certain clock, but in reality its purely just cooling effectively while managing the chips volties.

Stability takes time and effort to show how efficient ones pc can be and at what speeds.

Oc's can show when someone has a golden chip even if its just a windows boot and screenshot.

So to each there own.


----------



## fleetfeather

If the overclock works for whatever you use your PC for, it counts.

I have the unfortunate luck of playing MMO's, so stability over many hours is something I require.

My loop should be constructed in a few weeks, and I'll be able to show you a delidded 4790k at 4.9 @ 1.3v


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> If the overclock works for whatever you use your PC for, it counts.
> 
> I have the unfortunate luck of playing MMO's, so stability over many hours is something I require.
> 
> My loop should be constructed in a few weeks, and I'll be able to show you a delidded 4790k at 4.9 @ 1.3v


noice whats all in the loop?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> noice whats all in the loop?


Just a mITX build. I think the best way to squeeze as much surface area is possible is to throw a H240-X in with a Monsta 140mm. Together, they'll be cooling a 4790k and a reference (short PCB) GTX 970.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Just a mITX build. I think the best way to squeeze as much surface area is possible is to throw a H240-X in with a Monsta 140mm. Together, they'll be cooling a 4790k and a reference (short PCB) GTX 970.


I think a 40mm thick 240 rad would be some better cooling but can you fit that in the case though. and the 60mm or the 80mm monsta?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think a 40mm thick 240 rad would be some better cooling but can you fit that in the case though. and the 60mm or the 80mm monsta?


I could run with a XT45 rad on the roof, however it requires a much more costly tubing run, and would also mean that I would need to source a separate pump/res combo - which coincidently eats into the space where the 140mm monsta would sit and also add some serious airflow restriction.

I have MSpaint prototypes of "XT45 280 + XT45 140 + d5 pump and xspc tank res" as well as "H240-X + 80mm Monsta"

I'm not too fussed about whether the rad is 80mm or 60mm deep. I have push-pull clearance for either option, but my understanding is that the temp difference is nonexistent with 1300rpm fans, yet might be worth it at 1500rpm. This build has silence as a key build consideration


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I could run with a XT45 rad on the roof, however it requires a much more costly tubing run, and would also mean that I would need to source a separate pump/res combo - which coincidently eats into the space where the 140mm monsta would sit and also add some serious airflow restriction.
> 
> I have MSpaint prototypes of "XT45 280 + XT45 140 + d5 pump and xspc tank res" as well as "H240-X + 80mm Monsta"
> 
> I'm not too fussed about whether the rad is 80mm or 60mm deep. I have push-pull clearance for either option, but my understanding is that the temp difference is nonexistent with 1300rpm fans, yet might be worth it at 1500rpm. This build has silence as a key build consideration


keep to the 1300 rpm fans then, they are still quieter longer even after long usage, as in months, with dust on them







sounds cool bud


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Hello again delidding fans!









Now when i've run my 4770k for some time delidded, i thought about getting watercooling. I'm thinking about putting it naked without IHS, do i need special mounts for the waterblock when i do this? Someone that knows?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Hello again delidding fans!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now when i've run my 4770k for some time delidded, i thought about getting watercooling. I'm thinking about putting it naked without IHS, do i need special mounts for the waterblock when i do this? Someone that knows?


What block are you using?

You can get special mounts from Ek. I would just run it with the IHS. I didn't find it to be entirely beneficial to use it naked, and it ends up costing a little bit more for the new equipment while risking the cpu a little more. It is all up to you in the end, but I vote, after running mine naked, to just use the IHS.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Hello again delidding fans!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now when i've run my 4770k for some time delidded, i thought about getting watercooling. I'm thinking about putting it naked without IHS, do i need special mounts for the waterblock when i do this? Someone that knows?


The only kit I know of is EK's "Naked IVY" mounting screws for their supremacy line.

Though from my personal experience, it isn't worth it. after a month, my temps were getting warmer, more then before de-lidding. Even after re-applying paste, the same pattern continued.

The best option is to get Coollaboratory's Liquid Ultra and put it on both your CPU die, and on the under side of the IHS and place back into the clamp with EKs Gelid extreme for your cooler.. ive had mine set up with CLU for 3 months. Since doing so, the temps are just as good as when i first set it up, be sure to coat the VRMs with a thin layer of clear nail polish to prevent accidental shorting.

I run my 4770k at 4.4GHz with 1.25V and temps sit in the mid 60's when running OCCT with AVX turned on, gaming rarely breaks 55C


----------



## YOUDFDO

Anybody got any MSI delid guards I will buy all I can find.


----------



## YOUDFDO

MSI has delid guards pretty neat better than what I had made.


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> What block are you using?
> 
> You can get special mounts from Ek. I would just run it with the IHS. I didn't find it to be entirely beneficial to use it naked, and it ends up costing a little bit more for the new equipment while risking the cpu a little more. It is all up to you in the end, but I vote, after running mine naked, to just use the IHS.


Havent picked a Block yet. Just wondered if it's possible because i think my IHS loosens contact with my CPU after a while. That or the NT-H1 that i put on is not enough.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> The only kit I know of is EK's "Naked IVY" mounting screws for their supremacy line.
> 
> Though from my personal experience, it isn't worth it. after a month, my temps were getting warmer, more then before de-lidding. Even after re-applying paste, the same pattern continued.
> 
> The best option is to get Coollaboratory's Liquid Ultra and put it on both your CPU die, and on the under side of the IHS and place back into the clamp with EKs Gelid extreme for your cooler.. ive had mine set up with CLU for 3 months. Since doing so, the temps are just as good as when i first set it up, be sure to coat the VRMs with a thin layer of clear nail polish to prevent accidental shorting.
> 
> I run my 4770k at 4.4GHz with 1.25V and temps sit in the mid 60's when running OCCT with AVX turned on, gaming rarely breaks 55C


Hmm, you've both convinced me. I'll do it with the IHS on, i just hope that it doesn't lose contact with the CPU like it does with my D15 from Noctua. Heats tend to rise reaaaally high after 2-3 days.


----------



## opt33

I delidded ~6 months ago, used clp between die and ihs, I just painted die only, temps lowered by 22C and still get exactly same temps as 6 months ago. As long as you use liquid metal (clp/clu) between die and ihs temps should not worsen over time, some have been delidded over a year with liquid metal and no worsening of temps over time. If you use paste between die and ihs, many of those suffer from pump out and temps worsen over time.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LifeDisturbens*
> 
> Havent picked a Block yet. Just wondered if it's possible because i think my IHS loosens contact with my CPU after a while. That or the NT-H1 that i put on is not enough.
> Hmm, you've both convinced me. I'll do it with the IHS on, i just hope that it doesn't lose contact with the CPU like it does with my D15 from Noctua. Heats tend to rise reaaaally high after 2-3 days.


Did you delid your CPU using the vice/hammer method? It could be that your IHS is slightly bent causing poor contact. Also make sure that the rubber glue on both the IHS and the CPU is cleaned off.
how are you applying the paste, just a small line down the die, or smoothing it out before sitting the IHS?


----------



## LifeDisturbens

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Did you delid your CPU using the vice/hammer method? It could be that your IHS is slightly bent causing poor contact. Also make sure that the rubber glue on both the IHS and the CPU is cleaned off.
> how are you applying the paste, just a small line down the die, or smoothing it out before sitting the IHS?


I did the small line method, im going to even it out with lesser paste next time. (Prolly just getting CLU instead).
And yes, we used a hammer and a wooden block to hit it off the CPU. Guess it's bent.


----------



## Ceadderman

mg: why would anyone do such a thing? I wud never use a hammer near/let alone on a CPU. And a block of wood instead of a wood chisel? Crazy.









~Ceadder


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> mg: why would anyone do such a thing? I wud never use a hammer near/let alone on a CPU. And a block of wood instead of a wood chisel? Crazy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


should have seen this thread back when i started it, was even more sketch


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> mg: why would anyone do such a thing? I wud never use a hammer near/let alone on a CPU. And a block of wood instead of a wood chisel? Crazy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> should have seen this thread back when i started it, was even more sketch
Click to expand...

None of the methods are really not sketch...each is its own variety of torture.

You either:
Bash it with a hammer
Squeeze it with a vice
Cut it with a knife.

I propose a twist off method:

Start with two large blocks of some hard and non conductive matierial (plexi or hardwood?)
CNC/router/chisel out a square the same shape and depth of the PCB.
CNC/router/chisel out a square the same shape and depth of the IHS.
Insert CPU
Sandwich blocks
Twist

WIN?

My son it out of town and he has a Anniversary Pentium I could "try" this on, and have time to replace if I twist it in half.


----------



## Ceadderman

A soft face mallot with a well sharpened wood chisel would do the job just fine with the CPU fitted snuggly in a silicon padded vice. Miss that block of wood with a metal hammer and the jig is up.









~Ceadder


----------



## WiSK

Haha, I'd like to see you try to take off an IHS with a chisel! Make a video, please


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> A soft face mallot with a well sharpened wood chisel would do the job just fine with the CPU fitted snuggly in a silicon padded vice. Miss that block of wood with a metal hammer and the jig is up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Miss the block of wood? How hard do you think people are swinging? We're not talking about knocking down a wall with a 20 pound sledge here.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> A soft face mallot with a well sharpened wood chisel would do the job just fine with the CPU fitted snuggly in a silicon padded vice. Miss that block of wood with a metal hammer and the jig is up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Better yet just grab the cpu and attack the black glue between the PCB and IHS with the bandsaw, right?

(I second WiSK's comment; wtb video of chisel method)


----------



## GHADthc

I really don't see why people freak out over the hammer & vice delid method, its so damn simple, the last chip I dellided, a G3258, took two mild hits from the hammer, against a rather large block of wood (pretty impossible to miss, or stuff up in any way), and off she went, literally took me about 2 minutes to accomplish...so long as the vice is secure, and doesn't move at all, I really don't see how it could go wrong, things like cleaning the die and pcb after the delidding process worry me more, and especially mounting a waterblock on a naked die, that sort of thing is alittle more hair raising, and cause for concern in my opinion.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

I don't think anyone is actually getting worked up over vice and hammer method, just a lot of poking fun.

I only use the razor method because I don't have a vice or block to knock the die off, and after having success using the razor and card method, I'm more than happy enough with that.

Cleaning off the glue hasn't been difficult or worrisome so long as you use a dull enough object, like a plastic card or finger nail. Although I see and understand the concern of direct-to-die mounting without a proper kit.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I propose a twist off method:
> 
> Start with two large blocks of some hard and non conductive matierial (plexi or hardwood?)
> CNC/router/chisel out a square the same shape and depth of the PCB.
> CNC/router/chisel out a square the same shape and depth of the IHS.
> Insert CPU
> Sandwich blocks
> Twist
> 
> WIN?
> 
> My son it out of town and he has a Anniversary Pentium I could "try" this on, and have time to replace if I twist it in half.


Sorry for quoting myself here, but does anybody have any thoughts on this?

I have some spare time today, and might get around to trying it, but if you guys could be a "think tank" and help me determine if there are any critical flaws to this method design, or caveats that might need to be addressed, I would be grateful.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Sorry for quoting myself here, but does anybody have any thoughts on this?
> 
> I have some spare time today, and might get around to trying it, but if you guys could be a "think tank" and help me determine if there are any critical flaws to this method design, or caveats that might need to be addressed, I would be grateful.


That sounds like a lot of work to be honest, and there's no guarantee that it will work. Not everyone is going to have the tools necessary to be able to try it themselves.
The biggest worry is damaging the VRMs beneath the IHS as the act of twisting might cause the VRMs to knock up against the side of the IHS.

I think it would be better to pick up a cheap older CPU from ebay, as listed on the front page, before testing on a modern CPU.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Sorry for quoting myself here, but does anybody have any thoughts on this?
> 
> I have some spare time today, and might get around to trying it, but if you guys could be a "think tank" and help me determine if there are any critical flaws to this method design, or caveats that might need to be addressed, I would be grateful.


It took me less than a minute to use the vice only method and just turn til it gave a little...incredibly easy and safe (for me anyways). It sounds like what you are proposing would work, because you only have to slightly twist until it gives, just like vice barely slides ihs until it gives. But yeah like mentioned, a lot more work and my guess getting the exact dimensions you will need will take a lot of time. Although if you plan on doing ten of them, and your "tools" make it easier, then who knows until you try.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Sorry for quoting myself here, but does anybody have any thoughts on this?
> 
> I have some spare time today, and might get around to trying it, but if you guys could be a "think tank" and help me determine if there are any critical flaws to this method design, or caveats that might need to be addressed, I would be grateful.
> 
> 
> 
> It took me less than a minute to use the vice only method and just turn til it gave a little...incredibly easy and safe (for me anyways). It sounds like what you are proposing would work, because you only have to slightly twist until it gives, just like vice barely slides ihs until it gives. But yeah like mentioned, a lot more work and my guess getting the exact dimensions you will need will take a lot of time. Although if you plan on doing ten of them, and your "tools" make it easier, then who knows until you try.
Click to expand...

I have not abandoned the idea yet, but am going to modify it. I honestly dont have any use for this right now myself, although I would try it first on my sons Anniversary Pentium. I would donate this device to the forums to be passed around from member to member, like I have seen various calibration tools passed around some display forums.

New idea, same force applied as the hammer/vice methods.

2 copper blocks (I have these) have their centeres milled out to the exact dimensions of the IHS and pcb. With the IHS block being slightly offset center by 2-5mm. The pcb will be milled deep enough to place a thin rubber matt underneath to prevent possible shorts. The two blocks sandwich a CPU with the no-vrm side up. This sandwich is inserted into a tight fitting wooden block that will leave the top ~1" exposed.

With the copper blocks inserted, the offset mentioned earlier will cause the copper block with the IHS to sit higher by that 2-5mm (to be determined at some point). It can then be hit with a hammer, causing the IHS to slide that exact distance of the offset, stopping when the bottom of the copper block bottoms out inside the wood block.

Edit to add some pictures to clarify intent.

IHS actually is upside down.


----------



## Ceadderman

Sorry if my sense of humor wasn't clearer.

The idea of a chisel however is straight up. It would be quicker than the knife way to separate the IHS from the PCB. Flat side to PCB angled side pushes the IHS as the chisel makes its way down the seam. Simple no?










~Ceadder


----------



## mxthunder

Got a wild hair up my butt tonight and decided to delid my 3770k after I spotted a sweet vice at my dads house.
I used the vice only method and it was very easy and pretty stress free. I am uploading a video to youtube now.
So far, only seeing temp drops of about 6*C under load and 3-4 at idle, so kinda dissapointed, but maybe I will try to re-seat my water block and see if I can improve it anymore.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

what paste are you using between your die and IHS? and whats your overclock?


----------



## mxthunder

using arctic cooling mx-4 between ihs and die as well as between block and ihs.
running 4.8ghz at 1.27V


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> using arctic cooling mx-4 between ihs and die as well as between block and ihs.
> running 4.8ghz at 1.27V


That's why. You only get the big drops if you use liquid metal. Normal pastes don't make such a big difference.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> what paste are you using between your die and IHS? and whats your overclock?


Trust the OP use CLU or CLP
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> using arctic cooling mx-4 between ihs and die as well as between block and ihs.
> running 4.8ghz at 1.27V


Nice OC I need 4.8Ghz @ 1.31V
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> That's why. You only get the big drops if you use liquid metal. Normal pastes don't make such a big difference.


Problem with normal pastes they "bleed out" I was at one stage replacing the TIM between Die and IHS every month or so
I used CLU between die and IHS it is a solid 3°C lower temps than using Noctua NT-H1, NT-H1 is actually a really good TIM


----------



## mxthunder

Intresting. does AS5 count as a metal paste?

here is the vid for what its worth.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> Intresting. does AS5 count as a metal paste?
> 
> here is the vid for what its worth.


Its just so easy, isn't it!  if you can get CLLU or CLLP, use that under the IHS. it is MUCH better and provides 100x better contact. If you use AS5, just cover the capacitors with clear fingernail polish. It is too easy  enjoy it.


----------



## mxthunder

There are no capacitors on the top side of the substrate from what I saw, but I will keep that in mind.

In the OP, on the chart, it only shows the CLU as having 3* better temps than MX-4. Not sure if its worth it or not.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> There are no capacitors on the top side of the substrate from what I saw, but I will keep that in mind.
> 
> In the OP, on the chart, it only shows the CLU as having 3* better temps than MX-4. Not sure if its worth it or not.


OK, I was thinking the 4770k, which had a few small capacitors next to the cores.

CLLP and CLLU are worth it, because they will make a clean bond with the IHS (there may be better wording) and won't have the pump out effect like normal TIM could.


----------



## Valgaur

Normal TIM "works" and I mean works as in it fills the roll until you get some real TIM like CLP/U it really is no joke, the stuff is amazing.


----------



## mxthunder

Ill pick some up from frozencpu.
is there a reason to get ultra over pro or vs versa?
this stuff is "painted" on rather than the normal drop method?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> Ill pick some up from frozencpu.
> is there a reason to get ultra over pro or vs versa?
> this stuff is "painted" on rather than the normal drop method?


I'm not really certain of the differences, mostly in formulation and the ease of application, I believe, but they both perform about the same, just be sure to keep both of them away from aluminium-based products.

Yes, you can paint it with the included brush or use a q-tip.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> Ill pick some up from frozencpu.
> is there a reason to get ultra over pro or vs versa?
> this stuff is "painted" on rather than the normal drop method?


I'd say the ultra is preferred - easier to apply and doesn't have the drying out problems that some people have reported with the pro.


----------



## arrow0309

I've had my second 3770K delidded a couple of days ago, build up a new compact liquid cooling inside my CM690 III and cooling my naked Ivy with the EK Supremacy + EK precise mount + EK Gelid GC Extreme

Got a nice, 25°C temp. drop on the core max (Linx 0.6.5, v.11.1.3) over my Eisberg 240L full rpm undelidded









http://s12.postimg.org/qsesao017/Eisberg_Last.jpg

http://s12.postimg.org/biex3h4iz/First_LC_Linx_11_1_3.jpg

And some pics with my new rig:










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!











http://www.overclock.net/t/294838/the-cooler-master-690-club/19550#post_23250478

Forgot to mention, the delid was done with a single sided blade + plastic thin card, pretty nice and way safer method than all of the others IMHO


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> I've had my second 3770K delidded a couple of days ago, build up a new compact liquid cooling inside my CM690 III and cooling my naked Ivy with the EK Supremacy + EK precise mount + EK Gelid GC Extreme
> 
> Got a nice, 25°C temp. drop on the core max (Linx 0.6.5, v.11.1.3) over my Eisberg 240L full rpm undelidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/294838/the-cooler-master-690-club/19550#post_23250478
> 
> Forgot to mention, the delid was done with a single sided blade + plastic thin card, pretty nice and way safer method than all of the others IMHO


Nice! i really like the card method, a lot less scary to work with over just razor alone. especially for those of us with Haswell chips

I did the same as you, but you might notice after a month or so your temps slowly go back up.. and if they do, pick up some CLU and reinstall the socket mount and use the CLU under the die with the IHS., with EK paste on top.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> I've had my second 3770K delidded a couple of days ago, build up a new compact liquid cooling inside my CM690 III and cooling my naked Ivy with the EK Supremacy + EK precise mount + EK Gelid GC Extreme
> 
> Got a nice, 25°C temp. drop on the core max (Linx 0.6.5, v.11.1.3) over my Eisberg 240L full rpm undelidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/294838/the-cooler-master-690-club/19550#post_23250478
> 
> Forgot to mention, the delid was done with a single sided blade + plastic thin card, pretty nice and way safer method than all of the others IMHO
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice! i really like the card method, a lot less scary to work with over just razor alone. especially for those of us with Haswell chips
> 
> I did the same as you, but *you might notice after a month or so your temps slowly go back up*.. and if they do, pick up some CLU and reinstall the socket mount and use the CLU under the die with the IHS., with EK paste on top.
Click to expand...

OK, so why would that happen?


----------



## lever2stacks

I just did my first delid on a 4790k using the vice and hammer method it all went very smooth. I practiced on 2 e4400's first, It made going in on my 4790k a lot less nerve racking. I'm so glad I put clear nail polish on the VRM's cause when I went to put a small drop of CLP on my die it flew off the tip and fell right on the vrm







I almost had a heart attack. It cleaned off fine and did not hurt anything but if i hadn't had the nail polish on there it would have been disastrous.

I really didn't check my temps before hand, well I did but that was like a moth ago. They were high I couldn't even run aida stress test with out the cpu overheating. I think it was idling at around 35-40 I am running the stock cooler ATM waiting to get all my watercooling parts then the real fun begins. It's idling around 26-30c and hitting 70-75 with load on adia stress test on the stock cooler with stock clocks. I'll update temps and overclock after I get this thing under water and put her through her paces

Thank you to everybody that has contributed to this thread it has been a wealth of knowledge and a huge help thanks












OCN: Lever2stacks
CPU: intel 4790k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: Gelid extreme
Mhz gained: unknown
OC after delid: uknown
Temp drops: unknown
CPU-Z validation of max OC: undetermined

L


----------



## koekwau5

Looks nice and clean! Job well done.
I also did spill CLU on unprotected VRM due to the crappy hairs from the brush provided in the package.
Remove it with care and nothing to worry about =]


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lever2stacks*
> 
> I just did my first delid on a 4790k using the vice and hammer method it all went very smooth. I practiced on 2 e4400's first, It made going in on my 4790k a lot less nerve racking. I'm so glad I put clear nail polish on the VRM's cause when I went to put a small drop of CLP on my die it flew off the tip and fell right on the vrm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I almost had a heart attack. It cleaned off fine and did not hurt anything but if i hadn't had the nail polish on there it would have been disastrous.
> 
> I really didn't check my temps before hand, well I did but that was like a moth ago. They were high I couldn't even run aida stress test with out the cpu overheating. I think it was idling at around 35-40 I am running the stock cooler ATM waiting to get all my watercooling parts then the real fun begins. It's idling around 26-30c and hitting 70-75 with load on adia stress test on the stock cooler with stock clocks. I'll update temps and overclock after I get this thing under water and put her through her paces
> 
> Thank you to everybody that has contributed to this thread it has been a wealth of knowledge and a huge help thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN: Lever2stacks
> CPU: intel 4790k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: Gelid extreme
> Mhz gained: unknown
> OC after delid: uknown
> Temp drops: unknown
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: undetermined
> 
> L


Nice! Lucky little you with that nail polish bit as well









You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> OK, so why would that happen?


To be3 honest, I have no idea. but it happened twice. When I originally delidded and installed direct to die, temps were great at first, then after the first 2 week, they progressively got worse, i eventually had to kill my overclock and later undervolt to keep temps normalized till my order of CLU came in. Stressing at stock clocks w/ 1.015V produced temps in the mid to high 60's, overclocking immediately failed after hitting 90C.

After I applied CLU and reinstalled the clamp and the IHS my stress temps for the overclock were in the mid 60's and they've been solid for roughly 4 months now.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> OK, so why would that happen?
> 
> 
> 
> To be3 honest, I have no idea. but it happened twice. When I originally delidded and installed direct to die, temps were great at first, then after the first 2 week, they progressively got worse, i eventually had to kill my overclock and later undervolt to keep temps normalized till my order of CLU came in. Stressing at stock clocks w/ 1.015V produced temps in the mid to high 60's, overclocking immediately failed after hitting 90C.
> 
> After I applied CLU and reinstalled the clamp and the IHS my stress temps for the overclock were in the mid 60's and they've been solid for roughly 4 months now.
Click to expand...

Weird, never heard of such a thing
What oc and cpu?
Are you sure you did all correctly and with the proper EK Kit for the Supremacy?

Can't even imagine it could happen to me, I have to re-build my whole liquid cooling and even remove my mainboard in order to re-install the cpu cage


----------



## Darkcon

Thats ballsy going direct to die, I couldn't do it, I went with delidding, change the paste with that liquid metal TI, and put the lid back on with Permatex ultra black gasket sealer, then lapped the lid

great temps ever since(year and a half now)

used the wooden blocks/vice and hammer


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Weird, never heard of such a thing
> What oc and cpu?
> Are you sure you did all correctly and with the proper EK Kit for the Supremacy?
> 
> Can't even imagine it could happen to me, I have to re-build my whole liquid cooling and even remove my mainboard in order to re-install the cpu cage


I can maybe suggest it is something to do with thermal coefficency it will happen "Bleed out"
The only way to stop it is use CLU and use a nickel plated block to direct die mount or put the IHS back on for CLU compatibility
I am not sure but the only other block could be the solid silver water block I am not sure if CLU is compatible with silver (it is compatible with Nickel)
One thing for sure it is not compatible with aluminium and it leaches into copper.


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> A soft face mallot with a well sharpened wood chisel would do the job just fine with the CPU fitted snuggly in a silicon padded vice. Miss that block of wood with a metal hammer and the jig is up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


or you know, just common sense









you're using a hammer, vice and block of wood on a micro-processor, you hit as lightly and as precisely as possible and ramp it slowly and careful up until you get it just right. you have to be very patient.

then again banking on common sense doesn't always pay dividends in this cruel world

^^

i delidded my processor this way, no problem.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Weird, never heard of such a thing
> What oc and cpu?
> Are you sure you did all correctly and with the proper EK Kit for the Supremacy?
> 
> Can't even imagine it could happen to me, I have to re-build my whole liquid cooling and even remove my mainboard in order to re-install the cpu cage


I hadn't either until I experienced it twice.

I have a 4770K @4.4 with 1.25V. and yeah, I followed the instructions using the proper screws and EK paste. but twice it began over heating after a few weeks.

I made the great call on leaving the mounting screws for the CPU bracket in place so re-instalation was super easy, i just had to lift the water block out of place long enough to screw it back in.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> The only way to stop it is use CLU and use a nickel plated block to direct die mount or put the IHS back on for CLU compatibility


I would have done that, but i wasn't willing to deal with cleaning the CLU when it came time to upgrade in the next couple years.


----------



## T0B5T3R

i removed the ihs today

temps are pretty nice, but i had temp dif between core 2 and core4 (~20°C)
thats normal?

the next days results follow


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *T0B5T3R*
> 
> i removed the ihs today
> 
> temps are pretty nice, but i had temp dif between core 2 and core4 (~20°C)
> thats normal?
> 
> the next days results follow


20C is not normal. 8-10 is about where you need to start looking at your mount or your block.


----------



## T0B5T3R

without ihs that's probably a gimmick









€dit:
After three attempts, it now looks like

Core1: 44°C
Core2: 56°C
Core3: 57°c
Core4: 50°C

better but not satisfactory


----------



## mxthunder

Got my CLU in today. Tonight I will take it back apart and clean off the MX-4 and apply the CLU. I dont need to use that scratch pad they gave me to I?
While im at it, before I start, I will be blowing all the dust ouf of the rads and fans. These two tasks should give me a better baseline to test against my temps before delidding.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> Got my CLU in today. Tonight I will take it back apart and clean off the MX-4 and apply the CLU. I dont need to use that scratch pad they gave me to I?
> While im at it, before I start, I will be blowing all the dust ouf of the rads and fans. These two tasks should give me a better baseline to test against my temps before delidding.


The scratch pad it only really needed to remove CLU, i believe, i never used it for application


----------



## InCoGnIt0

I put CLU on my 3770K and after a year I checked it and it was still perfect. No drying out or need to reapply it. CLU is awesome stuff just keep away from aluminum.


----------



## T0B5T3R

CLU = Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra ??


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *T0B5T3R*
> 
> CLU = Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra ??


Yup


----------



## T0B5T3R

I also use


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> Got my CLU in today. Tonight I will take it back apart and clean off the MX-4 and apply the CLU. I dont need to use that scratch pad they gave me to I?
> While im at it, before I start, I will be blowing all the dust ouf of the rads and fans. These two tasks should give me a better baseline to test against my temps before delidding.


It takes a lot less than you'd think to cover the die. Not even a whole drop - I just kind of rubbed the brush against the end of the tube and it was plenty. Wipe any excess onto the underside of the IHS where it'll sit on the die, kind of like you are painting it.


----------



## mxthunder

here is a pic of what I ended up with. It was almost nothing at all - the stuff spreads really well.

I am now facing a ~20*C temp drop! Well worth it!


----------



## T0B5T3R

so much CLU ??


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> here is a pic of what I ended up with. It was almost nothing at all - the stuff spreads really well.
> 
> I am now facing a ~20*C temp drop! Well worth it!


Wait, you mean 20° lower still undelidded?
Or you've just delidded and applied the CLU on the both inside and over the IHS?
I think it's the second one, you've gained 2-3° with the upper IHS spread of the CLU


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *T0B5T3R*
> 
> without ihs that's probably a gimmick
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> €dit:
> After three attempts, it now looks like
> 
> Core1: 44°C
> Core2: 56°C
> Core3: 57°c
> Core4: 50°C
> 
> better but not satisfactory


Could be excessive mounting pressure flexing the die Slightly I did consider there could be a benefit in gluing the IHS back on to prevent this. But I got lazy and just reduced the mounting pressure. it evened out my temperatures between cores closer to the lowest temp core.


----------



## arrow0309

Hmm, wanted to take advantage of this chilly morning testing the stability with Linx 0.6.5 of my cpu at 4.7 in offset (+ turbo) and with a lower vcore (used to keep it in fixed & LLC Extreme) and I sadly discover that my temps are going to increase too, getting a 68°max with this reduced vcore (and only 17° room temp):

http://s10.postimg.org/ri4k0rws7/Clipboard01.jpg

And here's what I got on the very first install, just 4 days before:

http://s12.postimg.org/biex3h4iz/First_LC_Linx_11_1_3.jpg

Already 5-6° of degradation and maybe even more with the previous room temp and vcore








I think I'll have to order the CLP or CLU and reapply the tim still in bare die mount and with the pure copper wb (I should carefully manage to do it without draining my loop)
Some folks already confirmed me that's gonna be OK even without a nickel plated wb

And I think I'll try to reduce the mounting pressure too, thanks


----------



## mxthunder

That is after delidding. Hottest core went from ~82*C to ~63*C.
There really is not much CLU on top of the IHS, it just looks that way from the pic.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> That is after delidding. Hottest core went from ~82*C to ~63*C.
> There really is not much CLU on top of the IHS, it just looks that way from the pic.


nice drops, and I agree CLU always shows a lot more than whats on there, stuffs tricky but well worth it for the gains


----------



## Obyboby

Hey everyone. Just noticed this thread..

Today I've delidded my 4790k and all the job should be OK. I still get high temps in my opinion...

I'm cooling my CPU with a Corsair H110. Overclocked to 4.8 GHz on 1.34v.
After reading about a user with an overclock similar to mine that was able to run Prime95 on "small FFT" for a couple of minutes keeping the temps below 75, I tried with mine and got a terrible surprise, the temps jumped up to 96-98 degrees and I had to stop the test immediately. Idle temps are about 30 degrees, low load games like CS:GO get the CPU at about 50 degrees..
Should I be opening the CPU again to check the situation? I've done the job three times now and I'm pretty sure this time I applied the CLU properly.

Any input would be appreciated









EDIT: for the record, temps during AIDA seem to have dropped by 12-19 degrees.. I'm so confused


----------



## Willi

just one question, guys
I just delided a 3770k and I'm thinking about going with direct-die contact. The waterblock I'm using is an Enzotech Luna and it's base seems perfectly flat. The TIM I'll be using would be CoolLaboratory Liquid Metal Ultra.
Already tried the mounting (I've never been so careful while assembling something in my life as I was today) and I was wondering if it's really worth it. The contact seemed good as the CLU was nicely spreaded under the block.
The loop is currently leak-testing (I plan on leaving it running for 24h before turning everything on). If you guys think I should just use the IHS and CLU on both the die and the IHS-Block contact, tell me now XD


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> Hey everyone. Just noticed this thread..
> 
> Today I've delidded my 4790k and all the job should be OK. I still get high temps in my opinion...
> 
> I'm cooling my CPU with a Corsair H110. Overclocked to 4.8 GHz on 1.34v.
> After reading about a user with an overclock similar to mine that was able to run Prime95 on "small FFT" for a couple of minutes keeping the temps below 75, I tried with mine and got a terrible surprise, the temps jumped up to 96-98 degrees and I had to stop the test immediately. Idle temps are about 30 degrees, low load games like CS:GO get the CPU at about 50 degrees..
> Should I be opening the CPU again to check the situation? I've done the job three times now and I'm pretty sure this time I applied the CLU properly.
> 
> Any input would be appreciated
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: for the record, temps during AIDA seem to have dropped by 12-19 degrees.. I'm so confused


I have a similar issue with a 4770k i recently de-lidded. At 4.4 w/ 1.24V temps are in high 70's low 80's with non-AVX stressing, using an H80i
I think it might be related to the connection between the CPU die and IHS. I moved it around alot trying to get it "centered" and it only produced the same results, even using CLU.
So I need to go back and try again to re-spread the paste out then put the IHS in an leave it as it sits.

My own 4770k is delidded and runs full-AVX stressing in the mid-high 60's 4.4GHZ @ 1.25V.

Only other possibility could be not properly removing all of the rubber from the PCB and IHS.. or its just an issue with the IHS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Willi*
> 
> just one question, guys
> I just delided a 3770k and I'm thinking about going with direct-die contact. The waterblock I'm using is an Enzotech Luna and it's base seems perfectly flat. The TIM I'll be using would be CoolLaboratory Liquid Metal Ultra.
> Already tried the mounting (I've never been so careful while assembling something in my life as I was today) and I was wondering if it's really worth it. The contact seemed good as the CLU was nicely spreaded under the block.
> The loop is currently leak-testing (I plan on leaving it running for 24h before turning everything on). If you guys think I should just use the IHS and CLU on both the die and the IHS-Block contact, tell me now XD


I'd be too worried about cracking the die using anything other than EK's Supremacy with Naked-Ivy kit, since it's harder to measure the proper mounting pressure for other blocks.
So it's generally not recommended. Though directly mounting using CLU is better than a paste.

It's much easier to just apply CLU to the die and IHS, Than to your paste of choice for the IHS and cooler, not to mention safer, and performance is still fantastic compared to stock pastes.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I have a similar issue with a 4770k i recently de-lidded. At 4.4 w/ 1.24V temps are in high 70's low 80's with non-AVX stressing, using an H80i
> I think it might be related to the connection between the CPU die and IHS. I moved it around alot trying to get it "centered" and it only produced the same results, even using CLU.
> So I need to go back and try again to re-spread the paste out then put the IHS in an leave it as it sits.
> 
> My own 4770k is delidded and runs full-AVX stressing in the mid-high 60's 4.4GHZ @ 1.25V.
> 
> Only other possibility could be not properly removing all of the rubber from the PCB and IHS.. or its just an issue with the IHS
> I'd be too worried about cracking the die using anything other than EK's Supremacy with Naked-Ivy kit, since it's harder to measure the proper mounting pressure for other blocks.
> So it's generally not recommended. Though directly mounting using CLU is better than a paste.
> 
> It's much easier to just apply CLU to the die and IHS, Than to your paste of choice for the IHS and cooler, not to mention safer, and performance is still fantastic compared to stock pastes.


^this. There is only 3-4c delta going naked and the risk is very high.


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Willi*
> 
> just one question, guys
> I just delided a 3770k and I'm thinking about going with direct-die contact. The waterblock I'm using is an Enzotech Luna and it's base seems perfectly flat. The TIM I'll be using would be CoolLaboratory Liquid Metal Ultra.
> Already tried the mounting (I've never been so careful while assembling something in my life as I was today) and I was wondering if it's really worth it. The contact seemed good as the CLU was nicely spreaded under the block.
> The loop is currently leak-testing (I plan on leaving it running for 24h before turning everything on). If you guys think I should just use the IHS and CLU on both the die and the IHS-Block contact, tell me now XD


How did you manage to install the Luna since it's only having an Intel 775 socket retention backplate as I remember well?

http://www.nexthardware.com/img/content/oo_27368_export_html_430b0da0.jpg

Unless you're not using it on an AsRock mainboard right now
However if you somehow succeeded to mount the wb simply leave it for now, installing it is not such a big deal imho
Try not to tighten the springs harder and better if possible to have the same pressure on the four bolts (nuts)









Let us know of the results









I've too recently (one week ago) mounted my 3770K naked under my Supremacy with the EK's proprietary precise mount kit but using the GC Extreme
Since I've heard here, on this very 3d that some thermal degradation (with a siliconic paste) may very probably occur, I'm keepin' an eye on the core temps








And, btw, just ordered a new syringe of the Coolaboratory Liquid Pro, just in case


----------



## Willi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> How did you manage to install the Luna since it's only having an Intel 775 socket retention backplate as I remember well?
> 
> http://www.nexthardware.com/img/content/oo_27368_export_html_430b0da0.jpg
> 
> Unless you're not using it on an AsRock mainboard right now
> However if you somehow succeeded to mount the wb simply leave it for now, installing it is not such a big deal imho
> Try not to tighten the springs harder and better if possible to have the same pressure on the four bolts (nuts)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let us know of the results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've too recently (one week ago) mounted my 3770K naked under my Supremacy with the EK's proprietary precise mount kit but using the GC Extreme
> Since I've heard here, on this very 3d that some thermal degradation (with a siliconic paste) may very probably occur, I'm keepin' an eye on the core temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And, btw, just ordered a new syringe of the Coolaboratory Liquid Pro, just in case


There is an adapter for the 1156/1155/1150 bracket with backplate. I found one for sale on PerformancePCs and it serves me well to this day. I turned the LED's off and removed the PCB inside the block, the light didn't fit with the red on my mobo.
I am also using a Rampage V Formula, just waiting on a 240mm rad to arrive so I can start bending the piping and finish the build, then it's testing time. The system looks like this so far:


I really want one of those Delid Die Guard from MSI but its impossible to find except if bundled with a mobo. I don't want to have to upgrade only because of that item.


----------



## Obyboby

Need some advice! Is this a good or bad application? I'm about to re-apply both the CLU and PK-3 so I hope to get a quick reply from someone to advise me









I re-applied the whole thing and tried to put less, as to me it looks like that was too much (both CLU and PK-3). Please please someone reply









EDIT: I'M SO F........................... TIRED OF THIS.



What am I doing wrong?!?!"?!?!?! It's like the 4th time I try to put this bloody CLU and things just keep getting worse!!!!!!!!!!!! Those temps are for IBT ran on very high settings for less than one test (I stopped it), CPU at 4.8 GHz with 1.35v Vcore set in BIOS. What the heck is going on?!?!?!?! Can anyone help me fix this??!?!?!?
Since I delidded temps have become a nightmare!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Forceman

Too much PK-3 between the IHS and cooler. You just want a thin layer after it spreads out, there shouldn't be enough to peak up like that after you remove the cooler. Put a short, thin line in the center of the IHS and then let the cooler force it to spread out.


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Too much PK-3 between the IHS and cooler. You just want a thin layer after it spreads out, there shouldn't be enough to peak up like that after you remove the cooler. Put a short, thin line in the center of the IHS and then let the cooler force it to spread out.


Thanks, do you think the CLU is fine? Because I keep opening and closing the CPU and it doesn't feel so safe to do it so many times.. I'll try with a tin line in the center now, instead of a drop in the middle, and see how we go.

Again, do you think my temps should drop after I apply the PK-3 correctly? Does the inside of the CPU look ok?


----------



## Valgaur

if not I'd put a little more clu on the die and see if that doesnt help, if temps are still wonky try looking at the pump and waterblock issue might be there possibly which I hope there isnt.


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> if not I'd put a little more clu on the die and see if that doesnt help, if temps are still wonky try looking at the pump and waterblock issue might be there possibly which I hope there isnt.


Temps have started being high after the delid process, so there is something wrong with that, 99% the pumps/wb are fine. Will see what I can do during the weekend..

(Played GTA IV for a while, max temp on one core: 73 °C







)


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> Temps have started being high after the delid process, so there is something wrong with that, 99% the pumps/wb are fine. Will see what I can do during the weekend..
> 
> (Played GTA IV for a while, max temp on one core: 73 °C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Try a different cooler on it to eliminate that from the equation, if the temps are still really high then yes the delid is the issue and you can iron that out.


----------



## curly haired boy

might be bad contact between the block/IHS. make sure it's even.


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Try a different cooler on it to eliminate that from the equation, if the temps are still really high then yes the delid is the issue and you can iron that out.


I only have Intel's stock cooler to try. Would that be ok? I might go back to stock clocks with the H110, take note of the temps, then try the stock cooler and check?









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> might be bad contact between the block/IHS. make sure it's even.


You mean between the heatsink and the CPU's IHS? Pretty hard to check that, I would have to take the motherboard off the case and place it on a flat table to see if it's all good..


----------



## Ceadderman

Don't apply TIM with a paint brush is my advice. Try something like the edge of a Bicycle playing card or a flat Library card. That brush leaves and uneven spread imho.









~Ceadder


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> What am I doing wrong?!?!"?!?!?! It's like the 4th time I try to put this bloody CLU and things just keep getting worse!!!!!!!!!!!! Those temps are for IBT ran on very high settings for less than one test (I stopped it), CPU at 4.8 GHz with 1.35v Vcore set in BIOS. What the heck is going on?!?!?!?! Can anyone help me fix this??!?!?!?
> Since I delidded temps have become a nightmare!!!!!!!!!!!


- Too much paste between the AIO block and IHS
- Too little CLU between the die and the IHS
- Possible bad sanding on your IHS


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> - Too much paste between the AIO block and IHS
> - Too little CLU between the die and the IHS
> - Possible bad sanding on your IHS


Bad sanding? Should I repeat the process? maybe spend mre time sanding with the P1200 Paper??


----------



## skmanu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Need some advice! Is this a good or bad application? I'm about to re-apply both the CLU and PK-3 so I hope to get a quick reply from someone to advise me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I re-applied the whole thing and tried to put less, as to me it looks like that was too much (both CLU and PK-3). Please please someone reply
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: I'M SO F........................... TIRED OF THIS.
> 
> 
> 
> What am I doing wrong?!?!"?!?!?! It's like the 4th time I try to put this bloody CLU and things just keep getting worse!!!!!!!!!!!! Those temps are for IBT ran on very high settings for less than one test (I stopped it), CPU at 4.8 GHz with 1.35v Vcore set in BIOS. What the heck is going on?!?!?!?! Can anyone help me fix this??!?!?!?
> Since I delidded temps have become a nightmare!!!!!!!!!!!


Are you sure the H110 pump is working properly?

Even, with too much or not enough CLU/TIM, your CPU should not reach such a high temp, unless your mount is totally wrong...

As an example, on air, at 4.8GHz/1.33v, temps barely go above 80°C with IBT.

I'd double check the Corsair pump.


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> Are you sure the H110 pump is working properly?
> 
> Even, with too much or not enough CLU/TIM, your CPU should not reach such a high temp, unless your mount is totally wrong...
> 
> As an example, on air, at 4.8GHz/1.33v, temps barely go above 80°C with IBT.
> 
> I'd double check the Corsair pump.


So my pump is making some weird sound sometimes (like a cycling noise every like 15 to 30 secs) that seems to be coming from the radiator. I know the radiator is passive and can't make any noise, but that's what is happening after I upgraded my CPU and motherboard.

Last night I switched fan header for the pump, moving from CPU_FAN to CPU_OPT. The first one used to keep my pump at max speed (1500 RPM) all the time. I noticed CPU_OPT will adjust the speed based on the load, with a maximum of 1500 RPM like the older fan header did. (it drops to about 7-800 RPM in idle).
Other than the noise (which is not the noise the pump makes, I know that is normal, it's just another noise that added up and SOUNDS like it's coming from the radiator), I think the pump is working fine. How do I check it anyway?

Temps were "normal" before delidding, but after the procedure, they didn't drop that much/started rising after I re-applied CLU and PK-3 a few times to try and fix the issue.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> Bad sanding? Should I repeat the process? maybe spend mre time sanding with the P1200 Paper??


I'm more worried that your existing sanding is not even, causing uneven pressure on the ihs when the aio block is screwed down


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I'm more worried that your existing sanding is not even, causing uneven pressure on the ihs when the aio block is screwed down


Weird, I used a flat surface during the job (a mirror) so the surface should be even. How do I check this?

I might take off the AIO and CPU, then place them on a table "upside down" and place the CPU, and try to see how the contact is?

Or maybe take the IHS, put one drop of oil on it, then take a small glass and apply a little pressure on it and see how the oil spreads? That should tell me straight away how the surface is.. shouldn't it?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> Weird, I used a flat surface during the job (a mirror) so the surface should be even. How do I check this?
> 
> I might take off the AIO and CPU, then place them on a table "upside down" and place the CPU, and try to see how the contact is?
> 
> Or maybe take the IHS, put one drop of oil on it, then take a small glass and apply a little pressure on it and see how the oil spreads? That should tell me straight away how the surface is.. shouldn't it?


one thing that might be the case, its pretty rare but sometimes the actual height from the footings on the IHS those little outboards on all the sides is a little bit to tall. if you do sand your IHS some more flip it over and sand the lips a bit to possibly make a better contact if thats the case.


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> one thing that might be the case, its pretty rare but sometimes the actual height from the footings on the IHS those little outboards on all the sides is a little bit to tall. if you do sand your IHS some more flip it over and sand the lips a bit to possibly make a better contact if thats the case.


Will check that too, thanks!


----------



## arrow0309

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> one thing that might be the case, its pretty rare but sometimes the actual height from the footings on the IHS those little outboards on all the sides is a little bit to tall. if you do sand your IHS some more flip it over and sand the lips a bit to possibly make a better contact if thats the case.
> 
> 
> 
> Will check that too, thanks!
Click to expand...

Can't you try a bare die mount (naked)?
You'll be surprised of the results I can assure you!









However without the EK precise mount kit you'll need to improve, possibly this guide can help you:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595

Consider that I'm using the EK kit and I reapplied the tim yesterday (CLP this time, I had the GC Extreme before) and loose the tight a bit of the four nuts, you don't have to use too much pressure


----------



## arrow0309

So, as I just said before yes, in the end I also changed the siliconic tim (GC Extreme) of my naked Ivy and switched to the premium CLP
The thermal degradation right before the intervention was not so high but still enough, I've had a Linx 0.6.5 full 12°C increase on the core max (63°C on the first install vs 75°C after 7-8 days):

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/26640#post_23253861

http://s1.postimg.org/tiylmrf6l/Clipboard01.jpg

Now, with the CLP I went down by 18° instantly and if I consider the first result is still a nice 6°C gain, I'm really happy











So, returning to my previous post (right after the delid) we could say now that I've gained a solid 31°C








That's a nice update!


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Can't you try a bare die mount (naked)?
> You'll be surprised of the results I can assure you!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> However without the EK precise mount kit you'll need to improve, possibly this guide can help you:
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2285595
> 
> Consider that I'm using the EK kit and I reapplied the tim yesterday (CLP this time, I had the GC Extreme before) and loose the tight a bit of the four nuts, you don't have to use too much pressure


Can you point me to the EK product you mentioned? I will have a look at that tutorial too when I got some time, thanks


----------



## arrow0309

Here you go:









http://www.ekwb.com/news/324/19/EK-first-to-support-cooling-of-delided-Ivy-Bridge-CPUs/

http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


----------



## Obyboby

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *arrow0309*
> 
> Here you go:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/news/324/19/EK-first-to-support-cooling-of-delided-Ivy-Bridge-CPUs/
> 
> http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy.html


Thanks, rep+! These are for Ivy though, I'm on Haswell. Will check compatiblity/Haswell version availability when I'm free.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Obyboby*
> 
> Thanks, rep+! These are for Ivy though, I'm on Haswell. Will check compatiblity/Haswell version availability when I'm free.


the "naked Ivy" kit is compatible with Haswell, just don't use a silicon based paste, CLU will save a lot of headaches.


----------



## elonmusk

I delided my 4790k and used Liquid Pro. I put liquid electrical tape on the VRM caps and I re-applied the black RTV silicone to hold it together if I decide to get a new motherboard in the future.

My max core temp after 20 mins with Prime95 was 60C.

Played Far Cry 4 for an hour and it never went over 40C.









My idle is 23C. Huge difference. Almost 20C drop. And this is under a Corsair H50.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Don't apply TIM with a paint brush is my advice. Try something like the edge of a Bicycle playing card or a flat Library card. That brush leaves and uneven spread imho.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


You know that "paintbrush" comes in the package with CLU and is the manufacturer recommended method to spread the liquid metal. The spread looks uneven because at room temperature CLU is not entirely fluid, it has flakes of solid. When the CPU heats up, the CLU will flow evenly between the plates.


----------



## Ceadderman

i did not know this. Still wudn't recommend it though.









~Ceadder


----------



## skmanu

Pff... I got a Cooler Master Nepton 280L yesterday.

I read a lot of positive reviews: best AIO, blah blah blah...

First thing: the block base is rough as hell, you can even feel the irregularities with your finger.

I mounted it on my de-lidded 4790k and started an OCCT test: 5°C higher than my Raijintek aircooler... Mmmm... bad mount I thought.

I remounted three times with the same result.

So, either the Raijintek Nemesis is better than all the AIO's on the market (as the Nepton is said to be the best, or in a couple of degrees of the bests), or reviewers lie.

I don't kniw what to believe!

ANyway, the 280L is already mailed back to the shop with a refund, lol!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> I mounted it on my de-lidded 4790k and started an OCCT test: 5°C higher than my Raijintek aircooler...


High end air and CLCs are pretty similar in performance. For the price of one of the CLCs, you are almost at the jumping in point for a custom loop anyway. Take a look at XSPC's sub$200 offerings. Its a slippery slope though, and gets expensive quick.


----------



## skmanu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> High end air and CLCs are pretty similar in performance. For the price of one of the CLCs, you are almost at the jumping in point for a custom loop anyway. Take a look at XSPC's sub$200 offerings. Its a slippery slope though, and gets expensive quick.


I paid €80 for it, which is pretty cheap.

I built a few custom loops already, and I thought these new AIO would do a decent job. Actually, they don't!

Might build a custom cpu/gpu loop when the 980 classy arrives though... Depending on how well the Gpu clocks with stock ACX cooler.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> Pff... I got a Cooler Master Nepton 280L yesterday.
> 
> I read a lot of positive reviews: best AIO, blah blah blah...


lolol good joke

If it was Swiftech H240-X or H220-X, I wouldn't laugh.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> ANyway, the 280L is already mailed back to the shop with a refund, lol!


Well done.


----------



## josephimports




----------



## fa5terba11

Hey group I have the 3570k delidded and the ek naked ivy bridge mount for direct die cooling and it appears to be working great. I was wondering if I could squeeze out a little more cooling potential by lapping my EK block. Would you guys recommend this? If so what the technique? Thanks!


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fa5terba11*
> 
> Hey group I have the 3570k delidded and the ek naked ivy bridge mount for direct die cooling and it appears to be working great. I was wondering if I could squeeze out a little more cooling potential by lapping my EK block. Would you guys recommend this? If so what the technique? Thanks!


Nope. Imo, your best option is going to want to use the jet plate that offers the least amount of bow to the block. (the 2011 plate I believe) also if you aren't already, use CLU or CLP rather than a paste.


----------



## s74r1

4970k delidded running direct die (lapped kraken x60 AIO 280mm) with spring mounting and a foam/rubber die shim from an old GPU cooler, with ICD.

is it normal for core 0 to be 4-10 degrees hotter than core 3? Does anyone even know what physical location of the die each core is located? it kinda goes on a downward slope in hottest to lowest core0>core1>core2>core3. I remounted block but I got the same results. Using IC Diamond on die. I tried to match Idontcare's "optimal" ICD picture on his bare-die TIM testing thread on anandtech.

Batch #: X439B444
So far 4.6GHz core, 4.3GHz cache, 2133MHz DDR3 stable @ 1.232v, currently testing 4.7GHz with lower cache/ring ratio and lower mem, 4.8 seems possible around 1.325 with VCCIN better tweaked. Not sure if this chip is "broken in" yet, may want more voltage in a few more days.
Edit: 4.7GHz 9hrs IBT+Valley stable 47x core, 40x cache. adaptive set to 1.296v. Cache seems stable at 42x with 1.25v. Default VCCIN, VSSAA, VCCIO, etc. Chip did not like 2200MHz DDR3 even though it passed memtest86+, rock solid at 2133MHz. Some power savings enabled, EIST/C3/C6/C7 enabled, C1E disabled (drops to 0.8v idle instead of 0.1v without C1E, less latency to ramp up I think)

Prime95 temps [email protected] manual, 1.95v VCCIN: custom 2688 run FFT's in place, cold ambient temps, radiator fans sounding like a car in neutral with gas pedal floored. fans blowing on front and rear of CPU socket. extreme phases, max VRM frequencies.


Old GPU die shim from x800XT era of GPU coolers. Shim is barely higher than the die, so it should hold some weight off the die while still allowing good contact. CPU socket bolts have enough clearance to not block waterblock.


Waterblock was lapped flat. Tip: ICD is great for lapping when applied to the higher grit sand papers.


Spring loaded mounting bolts from an old custom loop waterblock.


Amount of TIM used (slightly too much seems optimal for ICD). ICD was allowed to "air out" for 10+ mins without dust. Yes it puts very light scratches in the die but it's never been an issue. Never had writing wear off IHS's either.


Also off topic a bit here... I don't know why all the overclocking guides recommend going up little by little. My method is backwards, I start at the top, make it reliably BSOD then tweak voltages/clocks until BSOD behavior changes or goes away. Key to figuring out what sub-voltages effect your chip is to get vcore or something down to a rate it will BSOD rather fast in so you can observe how the other voltages affect it. After tweaking sub-voltages, usually one vcore step above the last medium duration prime95 voltage will be rock solid for 10+ hours. seems more efficient to me and less time consuming, I've been doing this way for years.

P.S. Not sure if this is still true for Haswell, but for Sandy FFT lengths 1344, 1792, and 2688 were always quickest to fail.

P.P.S. When testing AVX with adaptive/auto volts, have to keep in mind the voltage will increase. So if it's stable at that voltage in AVX it may not be stable in lower volts with other loads, recommend testing on manual first, and when going for adaptive testing both non-AVX and AVX. - my $0.02


----------



## Roboyto

@s74r1

One core does run hot, it's the same I've seen on every 35/37/46/47XX chip I have worked with. I've delidded a dozen chips at this point.

That looks like a lot of TIM for a bare die mount. ICD isn't conductive I presume, because I bet some is very close, if not contacting, the caps. Best to invest in some nail polish or liquid electrical tape for safety's sake.

I like starting from the bottom with an overclock because I record every list of settings for each increase in core speed. This allows me to find my opinion of an optimal overclock. Optimal to me is where the voltage is still at a mediocre level so I don't need excessive amounts of cooling..I truly believe silence is Golden.

For example my 4770k in my main rig makes 4.5 @ 1.259V, running 2400mhz RAM, I forget VRIN presently and I'm on my phone so I can't check. The chip will make 4.6-4.8 but the voltage required to do so starts increasing dramatically for every 100 MHz. 4.5Ghz was a solid number to hit and keeps temps in check within my small dual, standard thickness, 240mm radiator loop which handles my CPU and a highly overclocked R9 290; as high as 1300/1700. My loop keeps temps at bay and my computer is literally inaudible aside from a little gurgle when it powers on or needs to be topped off.

My HTPC runs @ 4.3 with core at ~1.24 with VRIN ~1.812; I'm running 1.5V 2133 here to help keep heat down as well. It is only cooled by an Antec 620 with a single SilenX Effizio 120mm. This rig is also dead silent even when maxing the CPU for ~45min BD rips, or gaming with a 290 cooled by a Kraken G10 that is utilizing a few tweaks to handle VRM temps.

I don't test with prime, I use IBT with extreme load for a few passes; 16GB makes for fairly long passes. If it's stable for a few of these I continue increasing speed because a few stable runs, from my experience, gets your settings pretty darn close to 24/7 stability. I have done endurance(8+ hours) stability before, but it typically isn't a real world scenario so I just use IBT. Worst case I have to make a very minor adjustment at a later date and time.

I believe starting from the bottom is best for 2 reasons. First, for ignorant, not in a bad sense, users who don't know any better. Randomly choosing values and running extreme tests can be very bad. Secondly because you just don't know what a chips limits are. What is good for most could end up doing damage to another. I know this is an unlikely scenario, but it can happen.

You have obviously been around the proverbial block a few times, and haven't encountered any serious issues.. So if it works then run with it.

Adaptive voltage is tricky, it just takes a little bit of recording values to see what exactly the particular board is doing; each I have worked with has been a little different. I have both my 4770k PCs running with speedstep and Adaptive voltage. If you get it set just right you can hit your voltage target for a given overclock, wițh rock solid stability, and enjoy lower load volts and temps.

I made a guide for Adaptive voltage in one of my build logs. I also had HWINFO data to show the difference in load volts and temps, it was quite pleased with the improvement.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> @s74r1
> One core does run hot, it's the same I've seen on every 35/37/46/47XX chip I have worked with. I've delidded a dozen chips at this point.


Thanks, I was worried my mounting was bad. Usually it's the middle cores that are always hottest (at least with an IHS on anyways), I found it strange that core 0 was hottest.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> That looks like a lot of TIM for a bare die mount. ICD isn't conductive I presume, because I bet some is very close, if not contacting, the caps. Best to invest in some nail polish or liquid electrical tape for safety's sake.


Not conductive, and yeah I think when doing direct die it's better to have too much than too little. Bare die testing done here with this TIM showed more was better than the typical optimal amount.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I like starting from the bottom with an overclock because I record every list of settings for each increase in core speed. This allows me to find my opinion of an optimal overclock. Optimal to me is where the voltage is still at a mediocre level so I don't need excessive amounts of cooling..I truly believe silence is Golden.


Yeah I love silence too, I'm totally with you on that. I'm thinking 4.6GHz @ 1.23v is the sweet spot 24/7 for this chip but I also want a 4.7 profile for situations where I might be CPU bottlenecked. Or perhaps 4.6-4.7 turbo.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I believe starting from the bottom is best for 2 reasons. First, for ignorant, not in a bad sense, users who don't know any better. Randomly choosing values and running extreme tests can be very bad. Secondly because you just don't know what a chips limits are. What is good for most could end up doing damage to another. I know this is an unlikely scenario, but it can happen.
> 
> You have obviously been around the proverbial block a few times, and haven't encountered any serious issues.. So if it works then run with it.


True, my rule of thumb usually is not to go past safe voltages and >85c core temps.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Adaptive voltage is tricky, it just takes a little bit of recording values to see what exactly the particular board is doing; each I have worked with has been a little different. I have both my 4770k PCs running with speedstep and Adaptive voltage. If you get it set just right you can hit your voltage target for a given overclock, wițh rock solid stability, and enjoy lower load volts and temps.


Yeah I love the new adaptive voltage but I wish setting a negative value didn't affect the entire voltage slope, because the chip may not be stable at the lower clocks but the CPU seems to want more than it needs for 4.5+. It seems to me that setting a positive value will increase the turbo voltage slope but not the rest of the slope, however negative offset affects all of it.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:
Originally Posted by *s74r1* 

Not conductive, and yeah I think when doing direct die it's better to have too much than too little. Bare die testing done here with this TIM showed more was better than the typical optimal amount.
Yeah I love silence too, I'm totally with you on that. I'm thinking 4.6GHz @ 1.23v is the sweet spot 24/7 for this chip but I also want a 4.7 profile for situations where I might be CPU bottlenecked. Or perhaps 4.6-4.7 turbo.


> Yeah I love the new adaptive voltage but I wish setting a negative value didn't affect the entire voltage slope, because the chip may not be stable at the lower clocks but the CPU seems to want more than it needs for 4.5+. It seems to me that setting a positive value will increase the turbo voltage slope but not the rest of the slope, however negative offset affects all of it.


I've never worked with ICD before, that is good information to have.

I have a 4790k that I still need to delid which should give me fantastic results. I can't recall the voltage exactly, but it is a swell performer. It is holding within threshold temps @ 4.7GHz, without delid, on only a Corsair H100 radiator that is using an H55 pump with mismatched stock corsair fans. I can't wait to see where I get with a delid and some CLU







If temps drop as well as they have in the past, I should see ~25C drop on all cores at full load; possibly a little more.

I also wish the negative didn't effect the entire voltage range. I could get my HTPC to run at an even lower voltage if it worked in a different manner.


----------



## mAnBrEaTh

On my way, hopefully build will be finished by this weekend! Here's the 4790K


----------



## MR-e

guys, i might purchase a used 3770k that's been previously delidded. how would you suggest cleaning the previous application of CLP that has been used? i currently have some arctic cleaner 1 + 2. Do you have some suggestions on what product to use if arctic cleaner is not advised?

also, EK naked mount worth it? or just use the ihs?

Thank you!


----------



## Pikaru

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sexpot*
> 
> guys, i might purchase a used 3770k that's been previously delidded. how would you suggest cleaning the previous application of CLP that has been used? i currently have some arctic cleaner 1 + 2. Do you have some suggestions on what product to use if arctic cleaner is not advised?
> 
> also, EK naked mount worth it? or just use the ihs?
> 
> Thank you!


I used arctic cleaner and 90+ alcohol. Just used a quick tip and dabbed at it so I didn't get the CLU onto the chip


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sexpot*
> 
> guys, i might purchase a used 3770k that's been previously delidded. how would you suggest cleaning the previous application of CLP that has been used? i currently have some arctic cleaner 1 + 2. Do you have some suggestions on what product to use if arctic cleaner is not advised?
> 
> also, EK naked mount worth it? or just use the ihs?
> 
> Thank you!


I used the Naked Ivy kit previously for about 3 months, but was also using Gelid Extreme rather than CLU, and performance got worse over time, I never tried Naked Ivy with CLU, I just added CLU to the die and IHS and re-attached the socket, haven't looked back in 4 months, temps are solid.


----------



## MR-e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I used the Naked Ivy kit previously for about 3 months, but was also using Gelid Extreme rather than CLU, and performance got worse over time, I never tried Naked Ivy with CLU, I just added CLU to the die and IHS and re-attached the socket, haven't looked back in 4 months, temps are solid.


That's interesting, I wonder what affected the performance to weaken over time?? I'll be going with the IHS + CLP then thanks!


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sexpot*
> 
> guys, i might purchase a used 3770k that's been previously delidded. how would you suggest cleaning the previous application of CLP that has been used? i currently have some arctic cleaner 1 + 2. Do you have some suggestions on what product to use if arctic cleaner is not advised?
> 
> also, EK naked mount worth it? or just use the ihs?
> 
> Thank you!


use a hair drier to heat it up first, it should scoop right off fairly easily


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Not sure, but it made for horrible temps, even after a 2nd application..
By the time my CLU arrived, I not only had to kill my overclock, but also undervolt the CPU, just to keep temps manageable. After applying CLU, and remounting the bracket and IHS, my temps WITH the overclock were 1-3C lower than the temps when undervolting...

Also note the differences in time between when i took the screen shot.


Spoiler: Before [email protected] 1.05V









Spoiler: After [email protected] 2.24


----------



## Willi

I got worse temps using a naked ivy mount on a Corsair H60 and I5 3570K.
I used the 2011 mount kit with bolts that fit on the "2011" end of the mounting nuts, then attached the H60 very carefully with a cross-pattern tightening.
I used CLU on the die. Temps were great at first but after a couple of day of use I got temp warnings. The performance degraded quite fast.

With my i7 3770, It happened the same thing. I used a naked ivy mount on a very well lapped Enzotech Luna. The temps were great at first but instability hit after two days of constant use. Also used CLU.
I went back to Die-CLU-Lapped IHS-CLU-Luna and temps went back to normal.

I think the pressure the bracket makes on the corners of the processor, ensuring an even contact on the die, makes all the difference.

In my experience, going naked-die mount might seem like a great idea, but using the IHS/mounting bracket is the way to go


----------



## MR-e

you get a rep, you get a rep, everyone gets a rep! thanks everyone for your reassurance


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sexpot*
> 
> you get a rep, you get a rep, everyone gets a rep! thanks everyone for your reassurance


Lets me know of your success, and if you have any questions ask away


----------



## Mbbx

Hi
I delided my cpu. Applied liquid metal.

Without delid I could only get to 4.7ghz at 1.27v around 75c with prime 95, with delid have lower temp around 60c with prime 95.

Now can get
4.8ghz at 1.36v around 70C with prime95
4.9ghz at 1.46v around 80c with prime95
5.0ghz at 1.49v but unstable, not confident to go to higher volt.

Using multiplier overclocking with auto settings on Asus sabertooth motherboard and full watercooling setup.

Is a 2014 week42 i7 4790k, others seem to get some speeds with lower volts. Will it last if I run at 4.9ghz?


----------



## t3h0th3r

Apparently i only took pictures but never got to submit them



OCN name: t3h0th3r
CPU: i7 4790K
on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme
NO IHS
Mhz gained: 100
OC after delid: 4700MHz
Temp drops: more than 4 C (never did the burn test @4,5 can only compare linX at 4,6 vs 4,7)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/f4mggh


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mbbx*
> 
> Hi
> I delided my cpu. Applied liquid metal.
> 
> Without delid I could only get to 4.7ghz at 1.27v around 75c with prime 95, with delid have lower temp around 60c with prime 95.
> 
> Now can get
> 4.8ghz at 1.36v around 70C with prime95
> 4.9ghz at 1.46v around 80c with prime95
> 5.0ghz at 1.49v but unstable, not confident to go to higher volt.
> 
> Using multiplier overclocking with auto settings on Asus sabertooth motherboard and full watercooling setup.
> 
> Is a 2014 week42 i7 4790k, others seem to get some speeds with lower volts. Will it last if I run at 4.9ghz?


do the 4.8 you wont see any gains really with the 4.9 or the 5.0, plus the voltage jumps aren't worth it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *t3h0th3r*
> 
> Apparently i only took pictures but never got to submit them
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: t3h0th3r
> CPU: i7 4790K
> on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme
> NO IHS
> Mhz gained: 100
> OC after delid: 4700MHz
> Temp drops: more than 4 C (never did the burn test @4,5 can only compare linX at 4,6 vs 4,7)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/f4mggh


You're In!







Slappa Dat SIg On


----------



## neuroxia

So i got my 3570k about 2 weeks ago and i'm running it at 4.7 with a maximum voltage of 1.224, temps max 75 in prime, 55-57 in games; Before getting it i was planning on delidding, but upon receiving it i noticed it has absolutely no gap between the PCB and IHS whereas on my old i3 2105 i could easily fit my fingernail inside the gap;

Do you think i should still try to delid it or it's not worth the risk? Note that i have no intention of going higher than 4.7ghz and i'm also going to add 3 more fans to my case and another one to my cpu cooler (deepcool gamer storm lucifer) for a push/pull config, so temps should improve;


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *neuroxia*
> 
> So i got my 3570k about 2 weeks ago and i'm running it at 4.7 with a maximum voltage of 1.224, temps max 75 in prime, 55-57 in games; Before getting it i was planning on delidding, but upon receiving it i noticed it has absolutely no gap between the PCB and IHS whereas on my old i3 2105 i could easily fit my fingernail inside the gap;
> 
> Do you think i should still try to delid it or it's not worth the risk? Note that i have no intention of going higher than 4.7ghz and i'm also going to add 3 more fans to my case and another one to my cpu cooler (deepcool gamer storm lucifer) for a push/pull config, so temps should improve;


the tightness of the CPU is pretty common and both of the 4770K's i de-lided were that way, it's just the way their made now compared to 2nd gen.

*quick opinion:* Nah, there's no need to delid, you've got a good chip and decent temps.
I'd only recommend de-lidding your CPU if you're planning on doing folding or going for higher overclocks.


----------



## MayhemFighter

*forgot to get a piece of paper so paint will do

OCN name: Mayhemfighter
CPU: i5 4670K
on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme
Ihs TIM: Gelid extreme
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 3800MHz
Temp drop: 21C

No OC yet waiting for my water cooling to come.

http://valid.x86.fr/zclx7y


----------



## lzf995

Hey guys dont laugh to hard at me but can pentium g3258k be delided as i get very bad temps 4.8ghz 1.4v going to 85+ on watercooling the same set up kept amd fx 5ghz 1.55v under 70?


----------



## lzf995

Delided g3258k with a vice


----------



## fleetfeather

Lol sounds like bad TIM or bad cooler mount, but yes I don't see why you couldn't delid a Panni


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MayhemFighter*
> 
> 
> *forgot to get a piece of paper so paint will do
> 
> OCN name: Mayhemfighter
> CPU: i5 4670K
> on die-TIM: Gelid Extreme
> Ihs TIM: Gelid extreme
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 3800MHz
> Temp drop: 21C
> 
> No OC yet waiting for my water cooling to come.
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/zclx7y


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## MayhemFighter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Cheers


----------



## s74r1

I guess add me if this is sufficient enough. wasn't planning on joining when I did these.

OCN name: s74r1
CPU: 4790k (Devil's Canyon)
On-die TIM: IC Diamond
IHS TIM: Bare die like a baws
Mhz gained: N/A delidded out of the box
Max OC: 4.7GHz (didn't want to go above 1.3v)
Temp Gains: N/A didn't test before delid.
Proof: http://valid.canardpc.com/8kzqnw (shows 1.312 VID but it's really 1.29ish)

4.7 is stable at this but my 24/7 OC is 4.6GHz on adaptive (around 1.26v) but she's stable at 1.232v 4.6GHz. probably could get 4.7 on lower volts if I had a Z97 board, or played around with cache/VCCSA/VCCIO/VRRIN some more. been working on GPU's lately.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I guess add me if this is sufficient enough. wasn't planning on joining when I did these.
> 
> OCN name: s74r1
> CPU: 4790k (Devil's Canyon)
> On-die TIM: IC Diamond
> IHS TIM: Bare die like a baws
> Mhz gained: N/A delidded out of the box
> Max OC: 4.7GHz (didn't want to go above 1.3v)
> Temp Gains: N/A didn't test before delid.
> Proof: http://valid.canardpc.com/8kzqnw (shows 1.312 VID but it's really 1.29ish)
> 
> 4.7 is stable at this but my 24/7 OC is 4.6GHz on adaptive (around 1.26v) but she's stable at 1.232v 4.6GHz. probably could get 4.7 on lower volts if I had a Z97 board, or played around with cache/VCCSA/VCCIO/VRRIN some more. been working on GPU's lately.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## aka13

Add me to the club, please - I have not tested the results yet, but have already delidded




I was too lazy to add my sig on the pics, but you can check google images for pics - they are original. Also, you could check the exifs.


----------



## fleetfeather

what are the conductive properties of that jizz you've used?


----------



## aka13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> what are the conductive properties of that jizz you've used?


That's some slightly nontransparent nailpolish. I did not really want to buy "clear" only for a one-time usage. Was too lazy. It does not conduct electricity at all.


----------



## fleetfeather

I see. Fair enough then


----------



## Radmanhs

just wondering, what is the failure rate of the vice method?


----------



## aka13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> just wondering, what is the failure rate of the vice method?


I dont see how it could fail, unless you are hitting it directly with a metal hammer. Just be careful and don't overtighten the vice.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Vastly lower than Razor or Razor+Card, not to say it isn't possible to brick a cpu. It can happen if you hit too hard, with wrong tools, etc.
Its still considered the safest method by far however..


----------



## WiSK

IIRC we've seen only 2 fails from the vice method in this thread but one of them was hitting directly with hammer, one was wrong side of CPU in the vice (trying to hit the IHS off instead of the PCB).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aka13*
> 
> Add me to the club, please - I have not tested the results yet, but have already delidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was too lazy to add my sig on the pics, but you can check google images for pics - they are original. Also, you could check the exifs.


what cpu is it? i need at least the basic stuff in the form filled.


----------



## aka13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what cpu is it? i need at least the basic stuff in the form filled.


It's a 4770k, I ran it for a few months with stock clock before, can not remember the temps though. I changed the TIM to phobya lm under the heatspreader, and to phobya lm on the spreader. As soon as I get the loop running I will post OC/temperature results.


----------



## fa5terba11

Forgive the noob question but what is the proper way to add the sig? I believe I was given the green light almost a year ago to "slappa dat sig on" but I not sure how to do it?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aka13*
> 
> It's a 4770k, I ran it for a few months with stock clock before, can not remember the temps though. I changed the TIM to phobya lm under the heatspreader, and to phobya lm on the spreader. As soon as I get the loop running I will post OC/temperature results.


You're in!








Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fa5terba11*
> 
> Forgive the noob question but what is the proper way to add the sig? I believe I was given the green light almost a year ago to "slappa dat sig on" but I not sure how to do it?


Code:



Code:


[CENTER]:skull: [URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][B][Official] Delidded Crewman[/B][/URL] :skull:[/CENTER]

if you go to your profile, scroll down a ways and it will say your signature above your rigs. hit edit signature, and paste that code line into it


----------



## Xoriam

Guys I'm thinking about Deliding my 3570k tomorrow. Temps are a bit too higher for my liking beyond 4,2ghz and I want to try to ramp it up way higher than that since I'm only at 1.1V atm.

I've got some Gelid GC Extreme on the way.
I was wondering, how does the lid stay on and not slide around runing TIM appliance while placing inside the socket since we're removing the glue holding it together?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Guys I'm thinking about Deliding my 3570k tomorrow. Temps are a bit too higher for my liking beyond 4,2ghz and I want to try to ramp it up way higher than that since I'm only at 1.1V atm.
> 
> I've got some Gelid GC Extreme on the way.
> I was wondering, how does the lid stay on and not slide around runing TIM appliance while placing inside the socket since we're removing the glue holding it together?


the best way to do this is to put the cpu in the socket without the lid, then apply the TIM, then place the lid back on and slowly clamp it back down, pushing ever so lightly against the brackets helps it stay in place. in short put the lid on and move it slightly to give the lid to move or hold it tightly at the bottom while the bracket tightens.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the best way to do this is to put the cpu in the socket without the lid, then apply the TIM, then place the lid back on and slowly clamp it back down, pushing ever so lightly against the brackets helps it stay in place. in short put the lid on and move it slightly to give the lid to move or hold it tightly at the bottom while the bracket tightens.


Would you mind showing me an image or video on application of TIM to the DIE?
I Don't want to be excesive with the application.


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Would you mind showing me an image or video on application of TIM to the DIE?
> I Don't want to be excesive with the application.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Guys I'm thinking about Deliding my 3570k tomorrow. Temps are a bit too higher for my liking beyond 4,2ghz and I want to try to ramp it up way higher than that since I'm only at 1.1V atm.
> 
> I've got some Gelid GC Extreme on the way.
> I was wondering, how does the lid stay on and not slide around runing TIM appliance while placing inside the socket since we're removing the glue holding it together?


new hardware NICE !!!!

after a lot of trial and error CLU is the way to go with TIM between die and IHS temps will slowly climb

Gelid GC Extreme is awesome TIM but will be prone to bleed out a month or so but will be great for between IHS and cooler


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sweenytodd*


Nice thanks!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> new hardware NICE !!!!
> 
> after a lot of trial and error CLU is the way to go with TIM between die and IHS temps will slowly climb
> 
> Gelid GC Extreme is awesome TIM but will be prone to bleed out a month or so but will be great for between IHS and cooler


Ok I just ordered 2x 0.15ml tubes of it. Gonna have to wait a week or so now to get it though


----------



## vividshock

So I'm planning to delid a g3258 and I was wondering instead of reattaching the IHS; I attach a hsf with a copper-base to the bare die. Is this feasible without crushing the cores because I don't want to use a closed loop water cooler.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vividshock*
> 
> So I'm planning to delid a g3258 and I was wondering instead of reattaching the IHS; I attach a hsf with a copper-base to the bare die. Is this feasible without crushing the cores because I don't want to use a closed loop water cooler.


It's feasible, but you'd need a bare die mounting kit, or mod your heatsink so it makes good contact with the die.


----------



## wes1099

I think I may have gotten a little too much CLP on my die when I delidded, so I think I might re-do it sometime later. And a question, have any of you guys tried CLP/CLU on the IHS as well? If so, how did it work?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vividshock*
> 
> So I'm planning to delid a g3258 and I was wondering instead of reattaching the IHS; I attach a hsf with a copper-base to the bare die. Is this feasible without crushing the cores because I don't want to use a closed loop water cooler.


This is a tricky one, I think it might, big might here, be feasible in terms of cooling, but with the way aircooling is mounted and the die size comparison to the pipes and somewhat differences in flatness. I really don't recommend aircoolers as when you have nearly 3 lbs at an angle and being pressed downward, it can still put uneven pressure on the die. the bare die mounting kit doesn't really work with aircoolers either, they all have different mounting heights and differences. I would just use the IHS as your temp drops will still be far more than you'll need anyways, take safety over performance.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wes1099*
> 
> I think I may have gotten a little too much CLP on my die when I delidded, so I think I might re-do it sometime later. And a question, have any of you guys tried CLP/CLU on the IHS as well? If so, how did it work?


I have and it works well but you need to be careful when pulling the heatsink off as the CLU/P can become a little hard and hold onto it, then you'll need to do some good cleaning. Normal TIM is usually the best for on top of the IHS, also I only saw a 3C temp difference between normal TIM and CLU/P on the IHS top, CLU/P is meant for the die to have maximum temp delta transfer rates.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vividshock*
> 
> So I'm planning to delid a g3258 and I was wondering instead of reattaching the IHS; I attach a hsf with a copper-base to the bare die. Is this feasible without crushing the cores because I don't want to use a closed loop water cooler.


I would not put anything with any real weight on the core, especially a heatsink that will innevitably have uneven weight distribution, massive risk of crushing core. i currently have a waterblock spring-mounted for even pressure


----------



## aka13

I could go with a spring-mounted alphacool nexxxos sp3, should I go for it, or keep the IHS on?


----------



## vividshock

Ahh. I completely forgot about uneven pressure. Thanks for your input guys/gals.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aka13*
> 
> I could go with a spring-mounted alphacool nexxxos sp3, should I go for it, or keep the IHS on?


I say IHS first then if you want a bit more out of it then go for the big guns.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vividshock*
> 
> Ahh. I completely forgot about uneven pressure. Thanks for your input guys/gals.


No problem thats what this thread is here for


----------



## inedenimadam

for you guys considering naked:
1-3C is about all you will get, and that is almost within margin of error.
if you do go naked, make sure you have a plated block, as over time the CLU absorbs into copper blocks and temps creep back up.

3570k naked for ~2 years @5.0 with zero issues outside of the occasional TIM replacement, so it is doable, and is only a couple bucks more in hardware over a 'with lid' set up.


----------



## Xoriam

What sort of voltage am I looking at for 24/7 5ghz 3570k?
I'm currently running it at 4,2ghz with 1.168 vcore.


----------



## Freaxy

Allright, I need some advice to delid or not.
I'm currently running my 4790k on 4.8 GHz with 1.332 V and the temp on the hottest core (core 2) while folding on CPU and both GPU's is 77-80 C.
This setup is running with a 480mm x 80mm rad and a 480mm x 60mm rad. CPU and both GPU's are in the same loop.

Now would I be able to shave some degrees of by delidding and using CLU, or is it not worth it?


----------



## Xoriam

My CPUTIN is 40c colder than my cores, I'm guessin thats a huge sign of me needing to delid.


----------



## Freaxy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> My CPUTIN is 40c colder than my cores, I'm guessin thats a huge sign of me needing to delid.


If that's a reason to delid, I might need to as well.
Mine's 30 degrees cooler.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Freaxy*
> 
> If that's a reason to delid, I might need to as well.
> Mine's 30 degrees cooler.


on all my other chips it's always been the tin that was warmer than the cores by a few C so I'm really thinking it's a sign.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> What sort of voltage am I looking at for 24/7 5ghz 3570k?
> I'm currently running it at 4,2ghz with 1.168 vcore.


this is a bit goofy int he "guessing" of vcore per OC, however my usual solid rule is this, don't guess and hope it's stable, take steps. %gigglehertz is tough for some chips as the architecture is different due to the way silicon works in these cpu's some are better at using the power better an dgoing to higher frequencies, some aren't. I say aim for 4.5 gigglez first and find a solid vcore I bet 1.28 should do it if you get a crash during testing stability, Intel Burn Test is a good quick way to tell, then up your vcore by i usually go .02 vcore







good luck and ask anything that comes up








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Freaxy*
> 
> Allright, I need some advice to delid or not.
> I'm currently running my 4790k on 4.8 GHz with 1.332 V and the temp on the hottest core (core 2) while folding on CPU and both GPU's is 77-80 C.
> This setup is running with a 480mm x 80mm rad and a 480mm x 60mm rad. CPU and both GPU's are in the same loop.
> 
> Now would I be able to shave some degrees of by delidding and using CLU, or is it not worth it?


Now you're using a water cooling loop, this is the setup that delidding really shows it's stuff on, you will gain a huge temp drop from your cpu through delidding. For example, I was folding a while back when my 3770K arrived, I realized very quickly that at 4.3 gigglez 85C was really not very good for my longevity. I then decided to see what TIM was on the die as I knew it wasn't solder which started this whole thread giving many people huge temp drops. I was eventually able to run daily 4.9 gigglez at 1.45 vcore (yeah my chip was poopoo I know) but the temps very rarely hit over 65C for me during full load folding which is mind blowing to myself still.

Delidding is the end all for performance and temp gains on these chips, if your worried about them in the slightest don't hesitate and just go towards the awesome temp drops.


----------



## Freaxy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Now you're using a water cooling loop, this is the setup that delidding really shows it's stuff on, you will gain a huge temp drop from your cpu through delidding. For example, I was folding a while back when my 3770K arrived, I realized very quickly that at 4.3 gigglez 85C was really not very good for my longevity. I then decided to see what TIM was on the die as I knew it wasn't solder which started this whole thread giving many people huge temp drops. I was eventually able to run daily 4.9 gigglez at 1.45 vcore (yeah my chip was poopoo I know) but the temps very rarely hit over 65C for me during full load folding which is mind blowing to myself still.
> 
> Delidding is the end all for performance and temp gains on these chips, if your worried about them in the slightest don't hesitate and just go towards the awesome temp drops.


Thanks for the reply!
Good to know! As you said I imagine it being quite a difference, but I wasn't sure yet.
At the moment I feel like my cooling is being held back by the terrible heat exchange of the die and the IHS.
even at stock I can't seem to get lower then 60 degrees even if I only stress my CPU. That simply doesn't seem right for the amount of cooling I got.

So I guess my next task is to drain the loop and delid that thing as soon as possible


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> this is a bit goofy int he "guessing" of vcore per OC, however my usual solid rule is this, don't guess and hope it's stable, take steps. %gigglehertz is tough for some chips as the architecture is different due to the way silicon works in these cpu's some are better at using the power better an dgoing to higher frequencies, some aren't. I say aim for 4.5 gigglez first and find a solid vcore I bet 1.28 should do it if you get a crash during testing stability, Intel Burn Test is a good quick way to tell, then up your vcore by i usually go .02 vcore
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> good luck and ask anything that comes up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now you're using a water cooling loop, this is the setup that delidding really shows it's stuff on, you will gain a huge temp drop from your cpu through delidding. For example, I was folding a while back when my 3770K arrived, I realized very quickly that at 4.3 gigglez 85C was really not very good for my longevity. I then decided to see what TIM was on the die as I knew it wasn't solder which started this whole thread giving many people huge temp drops. I was eventually able to run daily 4.9 gigglez at 1.45 vcore (yeah my chip was poopoo I know) but the temps very rarely hit over 65C for me during full load folding which is mind blowing to myself still.
> 
> Delidding is the end all for performance and temp gains on these chips, if your worried about them in the slightest don't hesitate and just go towards the awesome temp drops.


lol I wasn't asking for a "guess" I was asking for an average of OCN user results


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Freaxy*
> 
> Thanks for the reply!
> Good to know! As you said I imagine it being quite a difference, but I wasn't sure yet.
> At the moment I feel like my cooling is being held back by the terrible heat exchange of the die and the IHS.
> even at stock I can't seem to get lower then 60 degrees even if I only stress my CPU. That simply doesn't seem right for the amount of cooling I got.
> 
> So I guess my next task is to drain the loop and delid that thing as soon as possible


no need to disassemble loop, if your using rigid tubing then yeah you'll have to but normal tubes let you move things around without re plumbing your rig
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> lol I wasn't asking for a "guess" I was asking for an average of OCN user results


I say around 1.44-1.53 vcore is the ball park area, but around 1.45 is somewhat dangerous sometime it hurts the chips yet sometimes it oesn't


----------



## Freaxy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> no need to disassemble loop, if your using rigid tubing then yeah you'll have to but normal tubes let you move things around without re plumbing your rig


Yeah, I'm gonna try it without draining first. but if the tension on the tubes is too much I might drain it anyway.
First I need to buy some CLU TIM to get on the die.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Freaxy*
> 
> Yeah, I'm gonna try it without draining first. but if the tension on the tubes is too much I might drain it anyway.
> First I need to buy some CLU TIM to get on the die.


exactly, always take the most prepared and tested route







let me know how it goes or if you have any issues


----------



## aliak11

I have a 4770k and I need 1.268v and 1.92 vccin to get a stable overclock at 4.3 using a h100i. Will deliding it help at all, or should I just switch it out?


----------



## Cyro999

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aliak11*
> 
> I have a 4770k and I need 1.68v and 1.92 vccin to get a stable overclock at 4.3 using a h100i. Will deliding it help at all, or should I just switch it out?


..1.68vcore?

If you mean 1.168v for 4.3ghz, that's a normal overclock; even slightly above average for a 4770k. There's no reason to buy another one to switch it out unless you want to try your luck at getting a 1 in 10 quality chip, but yknow that does take 10 tries on average.


----------



## aliak11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cyro999*
> 
> ..1.68vcore?
> 
> If you mean 1.168v for 4.3ghz, that's a normal overclock; even slightly above average for a 4770k. There's no reason to buy another one to switch it out unless you want to try your luck at getting a 1 in 10 quality chip, but yknow that does take 10 tries on average.


Oops, I meant 1.268v, and my temp is about 82c.


----------



## feznz

Just been playing round never been able to get this chip over 4.8Ghz
But after replacing the TIm from Noctua NT-H1 between Die and IHS with CLU I managed this


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aliak11*
> 
> Oops, I meant 1.268v, and my temp is about 82c.


that sounds pretty close to how my 4770k was before I delidded. I think I could push 4.4 before mine would get too hot, but I think I used slightly more volts.
I've been running 4.7 at 1.32v for just under a year and haven't seen any problems from it yet. My cpu tops out in the mid 50s when gaming with a lesser cooler than yours and with those volt modded 780tis dimming the lights in my room and heating the case.
I think it would hit low 60s on stability testing, but the last I checked was a while ago. The big difference I've seen is that the thermal limitation on my 4770k was essentially removed by delidding and the new limitation was how it eventually peaked in speed with increasing voltage. Just over 5g at 1.54v. I also was creeped out by consistently pulling over 150w under load with the volts needed for over 4.7g, so that is what I settled with.
Also when I delidded, I noticed the volts I needed for a given speed dropped a bit.
Since your chip sounds like mine, I'd expect the improvement to be similar.
I used a new razor on the kitchen counter, and noticed it took like 20 -30lbs of consistent, highly controlled force (angled slightly towards the heat spreader) to cut through the adhesive, and took a lot longer than I thought. But, other than that, it went exactly as expected.


----------



## Freaxy

My CLU will arrive tomorrow, so tomorrow is the day my CPU loses it's head


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Just been playing round never been able to get this chip over 4.8Ghz
> But after replacing the TIm from Noctua NT-H1 between Die and IHS with CLU I managed this


those temps seem a little spread a apart, one at 70 the others at 80? might need to redo your clu application


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> those temps seem a little spread a apart, one at 70 the others at 80? might need to redo your clu application


I have never been able to get a good even temp across the cores I probably on my 10th+ application with the bleed out issue I had.
I agree I like to see temps closer but I have got to the stage where I think it may be a bad temp sensor I am not sure but I think the closest I have ever got the cores is 8°C difference always no.1 core coolest the other 3 near identical.
Still I am happy at these hideous temps


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I have never been able to get a good even temp across the cores I probably on my 10th+ application with the bleed out issue I had.
> I think the closest I have ever got the cores is 8°C difference always no.1 core coolest the other 3 near identical.


I have always gotten a 6-12C spread across cores and then I had a







when I was delidding my new 4790K.

The VRMs under the lid are part of the problem with higher temps on Haswell, so why not try to cool does down too?

Small strip of JunPus thermal tape. It has low thermal conductance compared to good pads/TIM, but excellent for thermal tape @ 1.8 W/mK.

This also has the benefits of keeping the lid in place so it doesn't slide around on you and covering the VRMs so the CLU doesn't get on them.



This *may be coincidence* since I need to test this with another 4770k I have, but the core temps on this 4790K are within 3C of each other. I have delidded near a dozen chips at this point, and none of them have ever been this close.

4790K @ 4.7GHz 1.250V // 1.800V VRIN

Corsair Dominator 2x4GB 1.5V 2133MHz

Gigabyte Z97-N Wi-Fi Mini-ITX

I am only using an Antec 620 with a single SilenX Effizio Thermistor fan. It is whisper quiet and still able to cool the chip at this speed, granted it is definitely the thermal threshold for the current setup...but I'm very pleased with it's performance. The last pic has the best temps due to ongoing tweaks. Chip has more potential, just need to get a bigger cooler in my 250D.


----------



## Xoriam

Those temps though O-o


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I have always gotten a 6-12C spread across cores and then I had a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when I was delidding my new 4790K.
> 
> The VRMs under the lid are part of the problem with higher temps on Haswell, so why not try to cool does down too?
> 
> Small strip of JunPus thermal tape. It has low thermal conductance compared to good pads/TIM, but excellent for thermal tape @ 1.8 W/mK.
> 
> This also has the benefits of keeping the lid in place so it doesn't slide around on you and covering the VRMs so the CLU doesn't get on them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This _*may be coincidence*_ since I need to test this with another 4770k I have, but the core temps on this 4790K are within 3C of each other. I have delidded near a dozen chips at this point, and none of them have ever been this close.
> 
> 4790K @ 4.7GHz 1.250V // 1.800V VRIN
> Corsair Dominator 2x4GB 1.5V 2133MHz
> Gigabyte Z97-N Wi-Fi Mini-ITX
> 
> I am only using an Antec 620 with a single SilenX Effizio Thermistor fan. It is whisper quiet and still able to cool the chip at this speed, granted it is definitely the thermal threshold for the current setup...but I'm very pleased with it's performance. The last pic has the best temps due to ongoing tweaks. Chip has more potential, just need to get a bigger cooler in my 250D.


this is an EXCELLENT idea, +Rep. I had thought of adding some thermal pads or something around the chip package (like cutting a rectangle out of one) but this makes total sense. for me my core1 is always like 7-10 degrees higher than core4 (on 4790k). I'm definitely gonna try some of that tape. Is there sufficient clearance? Do you use the 0.4mm stuff like THIS? I'm thikning possibly a thin thermal pad like they use under RAM might work better if this is too thin.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> this is an EXCELLENT idea, +Rep. I had thought of adding some thermal pads or something around the chip package but this makes total sense. for me my core1 is always like 7-10 degrees higher than core4 (on 4790k). I'm definitely gonna try some of that tape. Is there sufficient clearance? Do you use the 0.4mm stuff like THIS? I'm thikning possibly a thin thermal pad like they use under RAM might work better if this is too thin.


I bought the tape over a year ago so I will have to double check for you.

Next on my agenda was using some Fujipoly Ultra Extreme which has a thermal conductance nearly 10X this tape; 17 W/mK

I'll post results once I get to it.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Those temps though O-o


This is my HTPC so the CPU never sees loads like IBT. IBT is just to, practically, guarantee stability under any under circumstances.

I like doing a lot with a little. And 4.7GHz on a 4790K with a single 120mm radiator, with a single 120mm fan, that is INAUDIBLE is pretty impressive...not to toot my own horn or anything, but it's pretty sweet right?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> this is an EXCELLENT idea, +Rep. I had thought of adding some thermal pads or something around the chip package (like cutting a rectangle out of one) but this makes total sense. for me my core1 is always like 7-10 degrees higher than core4 (on 4790k). I'm definitely gonna try some of that tape. Is there sufficient clearance? Do you use the 0.4mm stuff like THIS? I'm thikning possibly a thin thermal pad like they use under RAM might work better if this is too thin.


Just logged into Performance-PCs to check my history and I bought the 0.5mm tape.

The lid will sit a tad bit high on that side of the chip, but the tape is pliable enough to be compressed once the latch is secured.

Please let me know if you see an improvement, as I probably won't be able to play around with my other chip or thermals pads on this one for a few days.


----------



## s74r1

Yeah I just checked another thread, the estimated height between package and die is 0.53mm (not accounting for VRM height) so 0.5mm should do, thanks!

Edit: does anyone know if EK Thermal pads are electrically conductive? I'm still thinking of just making a square all around the core, since I mount bare-die. And performance-pcs is out of stock of 0.5mm tape unless I use some 3m stuff

Edit2: speaking of, while I'm ordering, does anyone know if EK GPU fullcover waterblocks come with thermal pads already?

Edit3: if this actually works, this tape/pad thing should be added to the OP for better temps!

Edit4: Okay I'm thinking maybe some 0.4mm stuff with 0.2mm for a total of 0.6mm, as long as it can compress enough it should hold up the die with a tight waterblock mount (without IHS),

Edit5: ended up buying some 0.2mm, 0.375mm, and 0.5mm thermal tapes. have to experiment with what works best on bare die.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I have always gotten a 6-12C spread across cores and then I had a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when I was delidding my new 4790K.
> 
> The VRMs under the lid are part of the problem with higher temps on Haswell, so why not try to cool does down too?
> 
> Small strip of JunPus thermal tape. It has low thermal conductance compared to good pads/TIM, but excellent for thermal tape @ 1.8 W/mK.
> 
> This also has the benefits of keeping the lid in place so it doesn't slide around on you and covering the VRMs so the CLU doesn't get on them.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This _*may be coincidence*_ since I need to test this with another 4770k I have, but the core temps on this 4790K are within 3C of each other. I have delidded near a dozen chips at this point, and none of them have ever been this close.
> 
> 4790K @ 4.7GHz 1.250V // 1.800V VRIN
> Corsair Dominator 2x4GB 1.5V 2133MHz
> Gigabyte Z97-N Wi-Fi Mini-ITX
> 
> I am only using an Antec 620 with a single SilenX Effizio Thermistor fan. It is whisper quiet and still able to cool the chip at this speed, granted it is definitely the thermal threshold for the current setup...but I'm very pleased with it's performance. The last pic has the best temps due to ongoing tweaks. Chip has more potential, just need to get a bigger cooler in my 250D.


That's a cool idea Get it lol

I have a IB so no chip thingies to cool for me but I also looked here and it seems quite normal to have a large temp difference
http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet/0_20

Still in testing but I am just happy to finally running 5Ghz 24/7 to brag to my LAN buddies because of their futile attempts and constant BSOD etc
though I still try help them just they know better even swapped one of the guys my 3770k for his 2500k straight swap he complained so we swapped back
his loss complaining bad chip too hot it will only do 4.7Ghz my sandy does the same but runs a lot cooler the IHS is fallen off blah blah blah


----------



## aliak11

I have Gelid GC-Extreme right now, could I use that while I wait for clu to arrive?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aliak11*
> 
> I have Gelid GC-Extreme right now, could I use that while I wait for clu to arrive?


yes


----------



## aka13

Hmmm, you think adding the thermal pad over the nail polish already applied will make sense?


----------



## Freaxy

Alright I delidded my 4790K and wow what a difference. It's running 4.8 GHz at 1.352 V (not the best chip) and after delidding my temps dropped 9 to 11 degrees








Here's a screenshot with IBT (although I don't like running IBT or any AVX stresstest because it increases voltage to a non realistic level as you can see on the screenshots)
*Before:*


*After:*


Here are some results with folding (a more realistic stress)
*Before:*


*After:*


OCN name: Freaxy
CPU: i7-4790K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
Mhz gained: -
OC after delid: 4.8 GHz
Temp drops: 9-11°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/xx3vj1


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Yeah I just checked another thread, the estimated height between package and die is 0.53mm (not accounting for VRM height) so 0.5mm should do, thanks!
> 
> Edit: does anyone know if EK Thermal pads are electrically conductive? I'm still thinking of just making a square all around the core, since I mount bare-die. And performance-pcs is out of stock of 0.5mm tape unless I use some 3m stuff
> 
> Edit2: speaking of, while I'm ordering, does anyone know if EK GPU fullcover waterblocks come with thermal pads already?
> 
> Edit3: if this actually works, this tape/pad thing should be added to the OP for better temps!
> 
> Edit4: Okay I'm thinking maybe some 0.4mm stuff with 0.2mm for a total of 0.6mm, as long as it can compress enough it should hold up the die with a tight waterblock mount (without IHS),
> 
> Edit5: ended up buying some 0.2mm, 0.375mm, and 0.5mm thermal tapes. have to experiment with what works best on bare die.


The .5mm seemed to be perfect. The lid was ever so slightly raised on the one side of the CPU. When you do place the lid, make sure it is aligned properly. At first I didn't have it centered and the latch wasn't contacting the lid on one side.

AFAIK all thermal pads are NOT electrically conductive.

Nearly all GPU blocks come with thermal pads. However, they usually don't include very good thermal pads. See the link in my sig for thermal pad upgrade on AMD 290(X). If you want the best performance, then Fujipoly Extreme or Ultra Extreme are where it's at; They are pricey, but they are the best.

Let me know what happens









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> That's a cool idea Get it lol
> 
> I have a IB so no chip thingies to cool for me but I also looked here and it seems quite normal to have a large temp difference
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1247869/official-the-ivy-bridge-stable-suicide-club-guides-voltages-temps-bios-templates-inc-spreadsheet/0_20
> 
> Still in testing but I am just happy to finally running 5Ghz 24/7 to brag to my LAN buddies because of their futile attempts and constant BSOD etc
> though I still try help them just they know better even swapped one of the guys my 3770k for his 2500k straight swap he complained so we swapped back
> his loss complaining bad chip too hot it will only do 4.7Ghz my sandy does the same but runs a lot cooler the IHS is fallen off blah blah blah


Thank you.

I had the temperature difference with my 3570K and 3770K as well, however it wasn't as large as what I have seen with anything Haswell.

5GHz has eluded me for a long time, but I think it may be possible with this 4790K that I have now. It's making 4.7GHz with 1.25V being cooled only by a single 120mm radiator.

It's not like there is a huge performance jump from 4.7-4.8, but that 5GHz mark is like a mystical unicorn that so few are able to obtain









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aka13*
> 
> Hmmm, you think adding the thermal pad over the nail polish already applied will make sense?


I don't think it could hurt anything. The VRMs are still getting hot, so the nail polish is getting hot and the pad's job is to transfer the heat elsewhere...so I'd say go for it. May want to run it for a short while and check it just to be sure nothing strange happens under the lid.


----------



## Freaxy

In addition to my delid I'm now downvolting my OC a bit and seems to be performing better too.
Currently running 4.8 GHz on 1.328 V, if it passes folding for an hour I might lower it more and leave it overnight.
Or I might go for 4.9 GHz.

I have to say I really didn't expect this!


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> The .5mm seemed to be perfect. The lid was ever so slightly raised on the one side of the CPU. When you do place the lid, make sure it is aligned properly. At first I didn't have it centered and the latch wasn't contacting the lid on one side.
> 
> AFAIK all thermal pads are NOT electrically conductive.
> 
> Nearly all GPU blocks come with thermal pads. However, they usually don't include very good thermal pads. See the link in my sig for thermal pad upgrade on AMD 290(X). If you want the best performance, then Fujipoly Extreme or Ultra Extreme are where it's at; They are pricey, but they are the best.
> 
> Let me know what happens


Thanks for the info.

Well I'm running lid-less with waterblock spring mounted right now with some foam pads around the die from a really old GPU aftermarket cooler. seems to do the job but I'm afraid of tightening it too much. I'm thinking the thermal pads would help support the core more, though I just ordered a MSI Delid die guard, since I've got an Apogee XL on the way which is probably much heavier than my current CLC. Still concerned with die cracking though but the die guard should help.



[

most waterblocks nowadays aren't optimized for direct die though, I was thinking of getting some pure copper heatspreader/shims to put between the die and waterblock but i guess that would just add one more layer for heat to transfer through unless I used really good TIM like CLU.



Wonder if someone makes tiny vapor chambers? that would be even better to spread the heat around to a waterblock.

Really don't want to lap my IHS since it has OC warranty and intel has been known to warranty even delidded CPU's, also heard really bad cleanup concerns about CLU - and if the waterblock moves a tiny but that could cause some major issues so I'm sticking with my old trusty ICD.

Edit: So what's your guys' thoughts on using one of those copper shims instead of IHS? maybe CLU under it and ICD or something else on top. that way the IHS need not be damaged for lapping. The IHS thickness from core to top) is 2.58mm, so I could probably sand down something close if I can find one around 2.75mm-3mm and be able to use stock mounting for waterblocks (or not tighten all the way).

Edit2: Interesting article on Silver-Diamond matrix heatspreader research here. Probably only available for bulk purchase if it's even in mass production yet. http://www.frostytech.com/permalink.cfm?NewsID=112755

Edit3: Turns out a haswell die is slightly longer than 20mm, and 25mm shims come in limited thickness. Ordered some 25mm x 25mm x 1.5mm shims so I'll see how it goes, along with thermal pad for VRM's. I might have to mount with springs or double up on the shims but that sounds like it would perform poorly with 3 mating surfaces (CLU+CLU+ICD). Unless I can find some kind of shop to melt/solder them together. Hmm.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Thanks for the info.
> 
> most waterblocks nowadays aren't optimized for direct die though, I was thinking of getting some pure copper heatspreader/shims to put between the die and waterblock but i guess that would just add one more layer for heat to transfer through unless I used really good TIM like CLU.
> 
> Really don't want to lap my IHS since it has OC warranty and intel has been known to warranty even delidded CPU's, also heard really bad cleanup concerns about CLU - and if the waterblock moves a tiny but that could cause some major issues so I'm sticking with my old trusty ICD.
> 
> Edit: So what's your guys' thoughts on using one of those copper shims instead of IHS? maybe CLU under it and ICD or something else on top. that way the IHS need not be damaged for lapping. The IHS thickness from core to top) is 2.58mm, so I could probably sand down something close if I can find one around 2.75mm-3mm and be able to use stock mounting for waterblocks (or not tighten all the way).
> 
> Edit2: Interesting article on Silver-Diamond matrix heatspreader research here. Probably only available for bulk purchase if it's even in mass production yet. http://www.frostytech.com/permalink.cfm?NewsID=112755


I'm running direct die with my XSPC Raystorm in my main rig. You could very well experience better temps with some CLU under the lid and your ICD on the outside. I was very hesitant to use CLU, I literally waited and read forums for over 2 years before making the switch and I won't be going back now. As long as you cover the VRMs on the chip you have nothing to worry about under there. As far as cleaning is concerned, as long as your lid still has the nickel plating on it, it is very easy to clean up. CLU has the worst reactions with aluminum, which are disastrous. You can have issues with bare copper as well, but it is much less forgiving than aluminum.

Lapping doesn't give that much of a performance benefit for the amount of effort involved IMO.

Copper shim = bad idea. The IHS is copper that is nickel plated. The nickel plating makes it very easy to clean. Plus, with a shim you have to do all this experimentation to make it work right, and you still run the risk of destroying the chip if you over tighten.

Get the CLU to put under the lid and cover the VRMs with nail polish, liquid electrical tape, or thermal tape/pads as I have done...it is the easiest method to reduce temperatures.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I'm running direct die with my XSPC Raystorm in my main rig. You could very well experience better temps with some CLU under the lid and your ICD on the outside. I was very hesitant to use CLU, I literally waited and read forums for over 2 years before making the switch and I won't be going back now. As long as you cover the VRMs on the chip you have nothing to worry about under there. As far as cleaning is concerned, as long as your lid still has the nickel plating on it, it is very easy to clean up. CLU has the worst reactions with aluminum, which are disastrous. You can have issues with bare copper as well, but it is much less forgiving than aluminum.
> 
> Lapping doesn't give that much of a performance benefit for the amount of effort involved IMO.
> 
> Copper shim = bad idea. The IHS is copper that is nickel plated. The nickel plating makes it very easy to clean. Plus, with a shim you have to do all this experimentation to make it work right, and you still run the risk of destroying the chip if you over tighten.
> 
> Get the CLU to put under the lid and cover the VRMs with nail polish, liquid electrical tape, or thermal tape/pads as I have done...it is the easiest method to reduce temperatures.


I just really hate that the heatspreader is convex... I think using non-lapped heatspreader would perform worse than direct-die, but perhaps a lapped heatspreader would perform equal or better with a waterblock, if good TIM is used.

too bad those old water jet blocks don't fit anymore, they were optimized for shooting water right above the CPU die. swiftech storm seems to come to mind.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I just really hate that the heatspreader is convex... I think using non-lapped heatspreader would perform worse than direct-die, but perhaps a lapped heatspreader would perform equal or better with a waterblock, if good TIM is used.
> 
> too bad those old water jet blocks don't fit anymore, they were optimized for shooting water right above the CPU die. swiftech storm seems to come to mind.


The thermal conductance of CLU is vastly superior to any paste though. Even with the lid I bet it will outperform your current setup.

What do you have to lose aside from the price of CLU by trying it?

Not many people run their chips bare die because the risks outweigh the performance gain. I have been meaning to put my lid back on with CLU for a while...just haven't gotten around to it. Might have to do that today or tomorrow to see the difference









Blocks aren't designed like that anymore for a reason though. The micro fin arrays in modern blocks are likely superior.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Freaxy*
> 
> Alright I delidded my 4790K and wow what a difference. It's running 4.8 GHz at 1.352 V (not the best chip) and after delidding my temps dropped 9 to 11 degrees
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a screenshot with IBT (although I don't like running IBT or any AVX stresstest because it increases voltage to a non realistic level as you can see on the screenshots)
> *Before:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *After:*
> 
> 
> Here are some results with folding (a more realistic stress)
> *Before:*
> 
> 
> *After:*
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Freaxy
> CPU: i7-4790K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: 4.8 GHz
> Temp drops: 9-11°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/xx3vj1


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Thanks for the info.
> 
> Well I'm running lid-less with waterblock spring mounted right now with some foam pads around the die from a really old GPU aftermarket cooler. seems to do the job but I'm afraid of tightening it too much. I'm thinking the thermal pads would help support the core more, though I just ordered a MSI Delid die guard, since I've got an Apogee XL on the way which is probably much heavier than my current CLC. Still concerned with die cracking though but the die guard should help.
> 
> 
> 
> [
> 
> most waterblocks nowadays aren't optimized for direct die though, I was thinking of getting some pure copper heatspreader/shims to put between the die and waterblock but i guess that would just add one more layer for heat to transfer through unless I used really good TIM like CLU.
> 
> 
> 
> Wonder if someone makes tiny vapor chambers? that would be even better to spread the heat around to a waterblock.
> 
> Really don't want to lap my IHS since it has OC warranty and intel has been known to warranty even delidded CPU's, also heard really bad cleanup concerns about CLU - and if the waterblock moves a tiny but that could cause some major issues so I'm sticking with my old trusty ICD.
> 
> Edit: So what's your guys' thoughts on using one of those copper shims instead of IHS? maybe CLU under it and ICD or something else on top. that way the IHS need not be damaged for lapping. The IHS thickness from core to top) is 2.58mm, so I could probably sand down something close if I can find one around 2.75mm-3mm and be able to use stock mounting for waterblocks (or not tighten all the way).
> 
> Edit2: Interesting article on Silver-Diamond matrix heatspreader research here. Probably only available for bulk purchase if it's even in mass production yet. http://www.frostytech.com/permalink.cfm?NewsID=112755
> 
> Edit3: Turns out a haswell die is slightly longer than 20mm, and 25mm shims come in limited thickness. Ordered some 25mm x 25mm x 1.5mm shims so I'll see how it goes, along with thermal pad for VRM's. I might have to mount with springs or double up on the shims but that sounds like it would perform poorly with 3 mating surfaces (CLU+CLU+ICD). Unless I can find some kind of shop to melt/solder them together. Hmm.


if you go with a shim route, use pure copper as pure as you can get copper has the highest temperature delta of any material







people use shims on GPU's for LN2 so maybe you could make that work for direct die, buuuuut its going to be a lot of testing to get the pressure applied correctly and keep that shim mounted right


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you go with a shim route, use pure copper as pure as you can get copper has the highest temperature delta of any material
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> people use shims on GPU's for LN2 so maybe you could make that work for direct die, buuuuut its going to be a lot of testing to get the pressure applied correctly and keep that shim mounted right


+REP if I could, thanks for the info. So the shim idea DOES have some merit to it! This eBay seller claims it's pure copper but you never know coming from Hong Kong.

I'm afraid of bumping the waterblock though if I use CLU, that stuff sticks pretty solidly right? ICD is usually fine if heatsink/block moves since it's got a pretty durable consistency - and using more than average "optimal" amount usually nets larger gains so it has more to work with as far as user error bumping it.(my GPU's are notorious for heatsink moving slightly when handling or plugging in cables). I've also had ICD mounts for 2+ years with no temp drops and no signs of TIM degredation (just have to be careful wiping it off because it can scratch core/IHS).

So is double shim a bad idea? CLU inbetween? Or is there a better option to combine two pieces of copper? Could I heat the shims, drop a large bead of solder on one and sandwhich them for better thermal contact? 1.5mm is about 1mm short of what I need to reach normal IHS height, but that's all I could find in 25mm x 25mm size.

spreading ICD over the top shim sounds difficult though with their recommended pea method, I might have to use line or modified X method. Noctua paste would probably be easier but that stuff has poor longevity I hear.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Just wanted to share a "Bleed out" experience I been having I been having to replace the TIM every couple of months or even less sometimes.
> The CPU temps were pretty bad like hitting Thermal throttle just playing BF4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Checking how concave the heat spreader is I discovered that certain planes were not as bad as others
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A quick initial lap sshows the High spot ridges
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have always had a lower temp on core one than all the other cores.
> best idle temps I have ever had, I would have completed the IBT but I have had this OC for over a year I know it is rock solid stable.
> Just this chip hits a wall I can get 5Ghz out of it just takes over 1.5v not worth the extra 200mhz IMO


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I just really hate that the heatspreader is convex... I think using non-lapped heatspreader would perform worse than direct-die, but perhaps a lapped heatspreader would perform equal or better with a waterblock, if good TIM is used.
> 
> too bad those old water jet blocks don't fit anymore, they were optimized for shooting water right above the CPU die. swiftech storm seems to come to mind.


I went though this a while back when 5Ghz was eluding me and not using CLU between IHS and die

IMO direct die sounds awesome in theory but looking though it seems most members agree that have done direct die mount is not worth the effort

For me My findings were almost no gain in lapping maybe 2-3°C at the most !

just try a good TIM for block and IHS and CLU for between Die and IHS
this combo for some reason even let me drop the voltage to get to 5Ghz couldn't even hold windows with no load with 1.5v+ without CLU
with CLU got to 5Ghz with 1.448v and most importantly no "bleedout" between die and IHS


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> *...if you do go naked, make sure you have a plated block, as over time the CLU absorbs into copper blocks and temps creep back up.*










How is this? Copper may be soft but it's not porous as far as I am aware; and if it does how?

~Ceadder


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> +REP if I could, thanks for the info. So the shim idea DOES have some merit to it! This eBay seller claims it's pure copper but you never know coming from Hong Kong.
> 
> I'm afraid of bumping the waterblock though if I use CLU, that stuff sticks pretty solidly right? ICD is usually fine if heatsink/block moves since it's got a pretty durable consistency - and using more than average "optimal" amount usually nets larger gains so it has more to work with as far as user error bumping it.(my GPU's are notorious for heatsink moving slightly when handling or plugging in cables). I've also had ICD mounts for 2+ years with no temp drops and no signs of TIM degredation (just have to be careful wiping it off because it can scratch core/IHS).
> 
> So is double shim a bad idea? CLU inbetween? Or is there a better option to combine two pieces of copper? Could I heat the shims, drop a large bead of solder on one and sandwhich them for better thermal contact? 1.5mm is about 1mm short of what I need to reach normal IHS height, but that's all I could find in 25mm x 25mm size.
> 
> spreading ICD over the top shim sounds difficult though with their recommended pea method, I might have to use line or modified X method. Noctua paste would probably be easier but that stuff has poor longevity I hear.


the normal process for shims, in the terms of cooling is as little material as possible because more material to go through makes more temperature build up between the deltas of materials, its just a hassle, plus getting them to stay in position while mounting would be almost impossible
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How is this? Copper may be soft but it's not porous as far as I am aware; and if it does how?
> 
> ~Ceadder


Technically it isn't possible as copper is so pure and very limited in the amount of pores, however I have seen some tinting (which means poo poo to me) and some think it's a material change of composition, bu the main ingredient of CLU/P is gallium which doesn't do anything to copper. So it might leave some silvery colors but other that that it doesn't do anything its just making the copper block actually smoother as it fills microscopic pores.


----------



## Ceadderman

That would be a good thing if it is filling those microscopic ridges, I would think. But I would suggest prefilling tthem with a minor amount of CLU prior to the Burn-In process.

Basically applying a thin coat and polishing it in using a microfiber cloth or old soft Tshirt. That should minimize having to reseat later on imho. Think of it like waxing your car.









~Ceadder


----------



## Xoriam

UGHHHHH they shipped my CLU to the wrong part of the country...
looks like it will be a few more days before i can post my results


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Technically it isn't possible as copper is so pure and very limited in the amount of pores, however I have seen some tinting (which means poo poo to me) and some think it's a material change of composition, bu the main ingredient of CLU/P is gallium which doesn't do anything to copper. So it might leave some silvery colors but other that that it doesn't do anything its just making the copper block actually smoother as it fills microscopic pores.


I'm not a chemist, but google shows there are copper-gallium alloys, and since the gallium-indium in CLU is a liquid at room temperature, it could actually flow into the copper on the surface where the lattice is broken.
Found this interesting article about gallium-copper-nickel alloy http://electroiq.com/blog/2000/09/gallium-alloy-breakthrough-for-via-filling-application/
We've seen that nickel surfaces are less prone to the "absorbtion" for example with the IHS (my first delid, the IHS still spins freely on the die after almost two years).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Basically applying a thin coat and polishing it in using a microfiber cloth or old soft Tshirt. That should minimize having to reseat later on imho. Think of it like waxing your car.


Sounds like a nice idea, but unlike wax that sticks in a painted surface, the CLU sticks better to the cloth that it does to the copper/nickel metal. It will wipe off and end up mostly on the t-shirt.

That's why the applicator included in the CLU pack has nylon bristles, like a toothbrush. The CLU doesn't stick to the nylon very well and stays on the die / IHS / heatsink / waterblock.

Just try it one day


----------



## aka13

Phobya LM says that it should not be used with aluminum, does it mean I dun goofed and can not put it under the IHS?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aka13*
> 
> Phobya LM says that it should not be used with aluminum, does it mean I dun goofed and can not put it under the IHS?


No problem. The IHS is nickel plated copper.

(If it had been aluminium, you would notice immediately, see here 



)


----------



## Xoriam

you know something I'm super worried about that I see in pretty much all the delid guides?
The chip is going flying across the room.... What do you guys do to prevent that?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> you know something I'm super worried about that I see in pretty much all the delid guides?
> The chip is going flying across the room.... What do you guys do to prevent that?


You don't need to hit it that hard, but a strip of electrical tape will stop the PCB falling on the floor.


----------



## Freaxy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> you know something I'm super worried about that I see in pretty much all the delid guides?
> The chip is going flying across the room.... What do you guys do to prevent that?


Don't hit it hard.. some people wack it like it's their mother in law.
Just some gentle hits, better 10 gentle hits then smashing it through the room.
I could lift mine eventually.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> you know something I'm super worried about that I see in pretty much all the delid guides?
> The chip is going flying across the room.... What do you guys do to prevent that?


I know, eh? I laughed myself silly seeing that. Absolutely nonsense!

...and for a while I had decided on the razor method just because of that.

However, when I did mine, I held the wood (small in my case) in such a way that I could also touch the CPU while tapping.

Like Feaxy said, a few light taps...well, my first 3 taps were too light. I gradually increased the force, about 1/3 that (maybe less) of what would drive a nail.

The glue is somewhat elastic, so it lets go in "stages". As a result, if you watch closely while you're tapping, you'll see the CPU package move very slightly...at which point I lowered the tapping force and felt the CPU move.

At first it moved perhaps 1/2 mm, just enough I could tell it had moved visually, and I could feel it move under my fingers (I had the package between index and middle, thumb on the wood).

At this point I refer to my own memory of the images I studied with care as to the distance of the edge of the IHS to the CPU die. Tapping force was reduced to 1/10th as before, and I stopped when the CPU had moved about 2 mm. At that point the CPU lifted off without effort.

I didn't bother with tape to hold the CPU. I understand the concept, but if you proceed gently and deliberately, you're not going to fully separate the IHS from the CPU anyway. You just want to break the glue's bond.

At this point I can see why the razor approach is not advisable, and any of the video's showing a CPU flying in the air is absurd.

Once you get that open and peel some of the glue off, you'll notice it's a little like a rubber O ring, not as flexible as silicon, but certainly not hard.


----------



## aka13

On a scale from "major mess" to "very nice", how well did I do?


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aka13*
> 
> On a scale from "major mess" to "very nice", how well did I do?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


dun good jim


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aka13*
> 
> On a scale from "major mess" to "very nice", how well did I do?


I would have put some on the underside of the IHS as well, and perhaps thinner, but hard to judge quantity from your photos. But overall, it looks fine


----------



## Radmanhs

well, just got my clu, time to give myself a heart attack


----------



## kc5vdj

"Nickel/gallium undergoes significant volumetric expansion when the system is cured at temperatures of approximately 120° C, which may disrupt the interfacial bonding."

THIS IS INTERESTING!!!

The people talking about the Pro or Ultra solidifying and then creating a bad, intermittent interface that sees high temps could actually be taking things beyond the limit, which could account for why so few seem to say it happens to them, and why the ones who do (please excuse if some of you don't fit this profile) seem to be idiots to begin with, as evidenced by their posts and videos.

I could be wrong about the type of people this happens to, and I apologize to any educated/experienced people this has happened to, but based on my own web research, all the ones I have seen so far actually seem to be the type to actually take it beyond the safe limits just to see how fast they can get.

Could this be what's going on with that???


Note, that all cases described would be at the far right edge of the phase diagram where the L phase drops in temp radically, into the range someone so impressed with Pro or Ultra might actually push things to see how far things can go.

One other detail, once you hit the temp, the entire coating would undergo the transformation without so much as a delay, as the layer is so thin. The Ga-Ni interface would only have to hit the temp ever so briefly... microseconds? milliseconds?

For those who lap the underside of the IHS:


----------



## feznz

yoctosecond









Have got the source to that graph to looks confusing to me I don't get what you are trying to say.
The way I understand it is the gallium can leech into copper separating the nickel that causes the bonding to occur


----------



## kc5vdj

There are some threads around, asking if there is any issue with Silicon, but as far as I can tell, there is no bonding at all to Silicon, indeed, there is no alloy listed for it by ASM in Volume Three of the Handbook (Alloy Phase Diagrams).


----------



## feznz

what do they use to solder on sandy bridge IHS


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> yoctosecond
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have got the source to that graph to looks confusing to me I don't get what you are trying to say.
> The way I understand it is the gallium can leech into copper separating the nickel that causes the bonding to occur


The Source is the "ASM Handbook: Volume 3, Alloy Phase Diagrams" (10th Edition, 1998).

I don't think "leaching" is the correct word for it. It appears that at the interface, it actually alloys with either the Nickel or Copper. This would also explain why you just can't get it off the copper no matter what you do, short of sanding, even when it doesn't do what the alleged idiots are doing...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I'm not a chemist, but google shows there are copper-gallium alloys, and since the gallium-indium in CLU is a liquid at room temperature, it could actually flow into the copper on the surface where the lattice is broken.
> Found this interesting article about gallium-copper-nickel alloy http://electroiq.com/blog/2000/09/gallium-alloy-breakthrough-for-via-filling-application/
> We've seen that nickel surfaces are less prone to the "absorbtion" for example with the IHS (my first delid, the IHS still spins freely on the die after almost two years).
> Sounds like a nice idea, but unlike wax that sticks in a painted surface, the CLU sticks better to the cloth that it does to the copper/nickel metal. It will wipe off and end up mostly on the t-shirt.
> 
> That's why the applicator included in the CLU pack has nylon bristles, like a toothbrush. The CLU doesn't stick to the nylon very well and stays on the die / IHS / heatsink / waterblock.
> 
> Just try it one day


If the Ga-Ni and Ga-Cu phase diagrams indicate things right, this explains why the Ga-based TIMs are just so good. They create an alloy with, rather than just touching the Ni or Cu, it's like conformally coating the top of the die with the IHS itself.

Thanks for the link! It got me thinking, and connected the dots for me, on not only why everyone gets such great numbers, but firmly convinced me that's what I'll use, and why moving safely up an overclock is preferable to the idiot method of starting insanely high, and working down. Indeed, that last bit may be the cause to the weird some people have reported with CLP and CLU.

I'm DEFINITELY delidding my wife's 4770K. It's already out of warranty anyway, because I lapped it progressively to a 5000-grit. It'll be a couple of weeks, because I have to RMA this RMA replacement Z87E-ITX that is faulty this coming week. The original MB warped, causing memory socket issues, the replacement had other issues, that were only confirmed to be an ASRock problem AFTER buying a new i7-4790K and a new G.SKILL RipjawsX DDR3-2400 16GB (8GBx2) kit, leaving only the replaced motherboard as the culprit. The good news is that my wife's CPU and memory are just fine, except the CPU is definitely a delidding candidate based on everything I've read (80C+ at stock doing [email protected]).

That whole bit about the transformation at 120C with Nickel is interesting...

From Table 40 of the Haswell Datasheet Volume 1, section 6.9:

"Thermal Trip: The processor protects itself from catastrophic
overheating by use of an internal thermal sensor. This sensor
is set well above the normal operating temperature to ensure
that there are no false trips. The processor will stop all
execution when the junction temperature exceeds
approximately 130 °C. This is signaled to the system by the
THERMTRIP# pin."

If they have had a THERMTRIP#, it's likely that they have had that metallurgical transformation with the Nickel (on-die DTS tolerance is +- 5C, meaning that the lowest THERMTRIP can be asserted is 125C).


----------



## curly haired boy

aw yiss, materials engineering









thanks for the analysis, kc5!


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *curly haired boy*
> 
> aw yiss, materials engineering
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks for the analysis, kc5!


Thanks!

My knowledge is amateur, I have done work for a steel mill, but my knowledge is about at the level of some undergrad courses in both materials and metallurgy, with possibly some graduate level knowledge in the processing of the metals used in electron tubes. I am not a metallurgist, and it would be interesting to see a professional analysis of this. I draw my conclusion from the statement of the transformation in the mentioned article I was replying about. It makes sense.

Oh, and how is that Corsair H100i working out for you on that delidded 4770K? Since we had the problem with the ASRock Z87E-ITX, and now have a new 4790K and 16GB kit, we are about to do up a couple of systems properly and retire the Z87 board for future use in something else. The Lian Li PC-Q18 case that we have is a nice case, but it's so space constrained, that I don't think I can make it work for a long-term setup for either chip without doing a water mod to it, and doing that will probably lose the drive bays. What we are now looking at is the ASRock Fatal1ty boards, and Corsair 750D for the 4790K for me, and the 350D for the 4770K for my wife, and put the drives in the 750D. We are having to do this a piece at a time (tight budget), and are going to hold out for distribution on the Corsair H110i GT, but I am wondering about the H100i, and how well it's holding up for you.


----------



## s74r1

so I've decided to put my lid back on with CLU after running dieless for awhile. doesn't seem like waterblocks/heatsinks can get proper contact required to take full advantage of it...

I plan on lapping the top of it. bought some emery cloth to get it started (really the best type for metals), and some 800 grit wet/dry stuff to finish it off. any higher seems like a waste.

Question is, how are you guys lapping the inside of the IHS to be perfectly flat? I hear it's not quite flat. I can't see a finger+sandpaper or some kind of object with sandpaper on it being able to get it perfectly flat.

Also, regarding CLU absorbing a bit into copper - definitely sounds like a good idea to coat the inside with a VERY thin coat prior.


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> My knowledge is amateur, I have done work for a steel mill, but my knowledge is about at the level of some undergrad courses in both materials and metallurgy, with possibly some graduate level knowledge in the processing of the metals used in electron tubes. I am not a metallurgist, and it would be interesting to see a professional analysis of this. I draw my conclusion from the statement of the transformation in the mentioned article I was replying about. It makes sense.
> 
> Oh, and how is that Corsair H100i working out for you on that delidded 4770K? Since we had the problem with the ASRock Z87E-ITX, and now have a new 4790K and 16GB kit, we are about to do up a couple of systems properly and retire the Z87 board for future use in something else. The Lian Li PC-Q18 case that we have is a nice case, but it's so space constrained, that I don't think I can make it work for a long-term setup for either chip without doing a water mod to it, and doing that will probably lose the drive bays. What we are now looking at is the ASRock Fatal1ty boards, and Corsair 750D for the 4790K for me, and the 350D for the 4770K for my wife, and put the drives in the 750D. We are having to do this a piece at a time (tight budget), and are going to hold out for distribution on the Corsair H110i GT, but I am wondering about the H100i, and how well it's holding up for you.


the h100i is doing real well for me. i have a pretty restrictive case, plus the high fins per inch on the h100i radiator made me switch to twin delta fans. no complaints since delidding, the cooler does its job well!


----------



## Ceadderman

Boy those must be loud.









~Ceadder


----------



## Radmanhs

finally done, dont have any pics since i was sweating so much, it kinda sucks, there were a few nicks in the dye when i looked at it, not sure if that was from me for some reason or if it was like that, maybe it was from manufacturing


----------



## curly haired boy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Boy those must be loud.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


at startup, they run at full tilt and it sounds like a vacuum cleaner for 5 seconds.

but under heavy load they're whisper silent cause they move a LOT of air even at lower RPMs


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> finally done, dont have any pics since i was sweating so much, it kinda sucks, there were a few nicks in the dye when i looked at it, not sure if that was from me for some reason or if it was like that, maybe it was from manufacturing


Is it alive?


----------



## Radmanhs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> finally done, dont have any pics since i was sweating so much, it kinda sucks, there were a few nicks in the dye when i looked at it, not sure if that was from me for some reason or if it was like that, maybe it was from manufacturing
> 
> 
> 
> Is it alive?
Click to expand...

it's living, i only set it as an "underclock" so far at a flat 3.5 ghz, since I didn't want to start it off with an overclock, it runs a few degrees cooler at .05V higher than what it was before, but that it as a -.040 offset. even the idles on the highest core dropped 6 or so degrees. Once I get home today it will be time to start the OC's


----------



## NASzi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> thanks for the compliments guys, too lazy to do everything required but here's what I have
> 
> OCN name: NASzi
> CPU: Intel i7 3770K
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
> Mhz gained: Didn't OC further yet
> OC after delid: 4.6 Will be pushing further
> Temp drops: 24C at 4.6 OC
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Just wanted to give a long term update on my delid. It's been about a year and a half now since I delidded. I've swapped my chip into a new Mobo and I'm still running the original CLU with no issues and no noticeable heat dissipation loss.


----------



## s74r1

so is it best to leave the inside of the IHS alone, or lap the inside? it's bowed a bit isn't it? (not talking the outside of it, I know that definitely is)


----------



## NASzi

don't mess with the inside of the heat sink, if you do you will start messing around with how the heat sink contacts the die.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NASzi*
> 
> don't mess with the inside of the heat sink, if you do you will start messing around with how the heat sink contacts the die.


I'm with NASzi on this one.

If you had a CNC mill, or contracted with a high precision machine shop, maybe. It appears, and I admit this to be conjecture, that the "shape" on the inside may be optimal anyway, that is, contact is good where it's needed.

I have one of those 4790K's with really lopsided temperatures, as in core 1 was 12C hotter than core 4, the the others graduated between. This just said to me I had a cockeyed IHS mount. After delid, core 1 and 4 are almost exactly the same, 2 and 3 are maybe 1C or so hotter at full load.

If trying to "true" the underside ended up making it worse, then you'd have more trouble than you're otherwise able to fix.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> I'm with NASzi on this one.
> 
> If you had a CNC mill, or contracted with a high precision machine shop, maybe. It appears, and I admit this to be conjecture, that the "shape" on the inside may be optimal anyway, that is, contact is good where it's needed.
> 
> I have one of those 4790K's with really lopsided temperatures, as in core 1 was 12C hotter than core 4, the the others graduated between. This just said to me I had a cockeyed IHS mount. After delid, core 1 and 4 are almost exactly the same, 2 and 3 are maybe 1C or so hotter at full load.
> 
> If trying to "true" the underside ended up making it worse, then you'd have more trouble than you're otherwise able to fix.


Thanks,

I too have core1 being extremely hot, but currently running bare die. Could be because of VRMs, someone suggested using thermal tape over them to make contact with IHS - I'll post results when mine arrive.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> I too have core1 being extremely hot, but currently running bare die. Could be because of VRMs, someone suggested using thermal tape over them to make contact with IHS - I'll post results when mine arrive.


Bare die and uneven cores...most interesting. Is it over 10C difference?

I'm not sure how VRM's could do that, what's the power treatment on your board? Or is that VRM theory based on FIVR?

Of course, I'd propose the HSF surface to be in doubt in a bare die configuration, but I assume you've thought of that.

Which thermal tape are you trying?

I'm most curious now!


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Bare die and uneven cores...most interesting. Is it over 10C difference?
> 
> I'm not sure how VRM's could do that, what's the power treatment on your board? Or is that VRM theory based on FIVR?
> 
> Of course, I'd propose the HSF surface to be in doubt in a bare die configuration, but I assume you've thought of that.
> 
> Which thermal tape are you trying?
> 
> I'm most curious now!


I was referring to FIVR.

I remounted the waterblock twice and got the same results, core 1 is always about 5-10 degrees higher than core 4. kinda goes up in a slope from core4 to core 1 (lowest to highest). waterblock is lapped and springs are presumably giving equal pressure.

someone a few pages back reported temps within 3c when using some 0.5mm thermal tape. he said he was using some JunPus Thermal Tape from performance-pcs.com, unfortunately they only have 0.2mm and 0.4mm in stock. he mentioned it pushed the IHS up quite a bit before compression so perhaps 0.4mm would work. I bought a few to test height and possible cut a square all around the die and see if that helps. these are the ones I ordered:
3M-467 Thermally Conductive Adhesive Transfer Tapes - 0.5mm Thickness
3M 8815 Thermally Conductive AdhesiveTape - 1" x 1" (0.375mm, but they also carry the 8820 - 0.5mm)
JunPus Thermal Tape T180 - 0.2mm (they also carry 0.4mm)

There's better performing tapes/pads of course but I don't think it will make a big difference. some of them looked too sticky/permanent or might be conductive (thin lining of aluminum). The height between package and die is 0.53mm, height of VRM's is unknown so I was planning on trying the 0.4mm or combining the 0.2mm with 0.375mm (0.575mm total) If I combine, I wonder if putting a piece of aluminum foil between would help transfer between pads better than just glue+glue. I should be able to report results by this weekend.

On another unrelated note, I think I discovered another way to test IMC and cache ratio stability - stress test the iGPU for errors with OCCT. currently in RMA replacing my 3.5GB* 970's so I'm stuck on HD 4600. does okay on 900p lowest settings in a lot of games, but once it drops under 30fps ugh lag city - which 1080p was doing. Also, HD 4600 stable @ 1500 1.0156V here, 4.6GHz core 1.246v (adaptive, -16.6mV in XTU or -0.017 in BIOS), 4.2GHz cache (adaptive, offset +0.001 in BIOS)

*3.5GB-224bit + 0.5GB-32bit, enhanced stutter edition!


----------



## Xoriam

My CLU arrived today, however my Gelid GC Extreme has not yet.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> My CLU arrived today, however my Gelid GC Extreme has not yet.


grats, mine's arriving friday, if weather permits. that Gelid stuff seems to be popular, how's it compare to ICD? I'm usually worried about pump-out like the low durability noctua stuff, ICD has yet to fail me.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I was referring to FIVR.
> 
> I remounted the waterblock twice and got the same results, core 1 is always about 5-10 degrees higher than core 4. kinda goes up in a slope from core4 to core 1 (lowest to highest). waterblock is lapped and springs are presumably giving equal pressure.


I've not encounter discussions of FIVR as a potential source of temperature differences over cores, and I wasn't certain which chip you're working on (mine is 4790K), until I just checked your signature (I have to fix mine).

I have difficulty forming a theory by which an onboard VRM could induce enough heat into the die to account for 5C. I've also tried to determine what is facing the VRM row; I can't find documentation that shows the physical orientation of the die. They CPU's could be on the other side of the VRM row if the GPU section is up top.

I'm not brave enough, or outfitted, to try bare die. My HSF de jure has direct heatpipes which isn't so suitable. However, as I suspected a potential asymmetry in the IHS, I rotated it 180 when I mounted. I haven't been back in there to try it in original orientation. My own 12-15C spread is now within 1 or 2C, and the pattern is no longer core4 to core1 (it was like yours), mine is now core1 & core4 cooler, core2 & core3 warmer, but all very close.

Since I'm using Tuniq TX-2, and have enough for maybe 24 tries from one tube, and I have Phanteks on the way (this weekend), I'm going to try the 180 orientation on my IHS for comparison.

Is there any option to try a rotated orientation on your waterblock? It might be revealing.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> grats, mine's arriving friday, if weather permits. that Gelid stuff seems to be popular, how's it compare to ICD? I'm usually worried about pump-out like the low durability noctua stuff, ICD has yet to fail me.


I use Gelid GC Extreme on everything now.
Previously I was using Thermaltake TG but this stuff seems way better.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> I've not encounter discussions of FIVR as a potential source of temperature differences over cores, and I wasn't certain which chip you're working on (mine is 4790K), until I just checked your signature (I have to fix mine).
> 
> I have difficulty forming a theory by which an onboard VRM could induce enough heat into the die to account for 5C. I've also tried to determine what is facing the VRM row; I can't find documentation that shows the physical orientation of the die. They CPU's could be on the other side of the VRM row if the GPU section is up top.
> 
> I'm not brave enough, or outfitted, to try bare die. My HSF de jure has direct heatpipes which isn't so suitable. However, as I suspected a potential asymmetry in the IHS, I rotated it 180 when I mounted. I haven't been back in there to try it in original orientation. My own 12-15C spread is now within 1 or 2C, and the pattern is no longer core4 to core1 (it was like yours), mine is now core1 & core4 cooler, core2 & core3 warmer, but all very close.
> 
> Since I'm using Tuniq TX-2, and have enough for maybe 24 tries from one tube, and I have Phanteks on the way (this weekend), I'm going to try the 180 orientation on my IHS for comparison.
> 
> Is there any option to try a rotated orientation on your waterblock? It might be revealing.


hmm i should try that but I'm in the midst of a motherboard and waterblock upgrade. I've also got a delid die guard coming too, so I'm interested in comparing the differences between a proper bare die mount and heatspreader.

also, 4790k i'm referring to but all haswell have FIVR, devil's canyon just have more of them. I figure more heat coming off the chip package can't hurt, right?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I was referring to FIVR.
> 
> I remounted the waterblock twice and got the same results, core 1 is always about 5-10 degrees higher than core 4. kinda goes up in a slope from core4 to core 1 (lowest to highest). waterblock is lapped and springs are presumably giving equal pressure.
> 
> someone a few pages back reported temps within 3c when using some 0.5mm thermal tape. he said he was using some JunPus Thermal Tape from performance-pcs.com, unfortunately they only have 0.2mm and 0.4mm in stock. he mentioned it pushed the IHS up quite a bit before compression so perhaps 0.4mm would work. I bought a few to test height and possible cut a square all around the die and see if that helps. these are the ones I ordered:
> 3M-467 Thermally Conductive Adhesive Transfer Tapes - 0.5mm Thickness
> 3M 8815 Thermally Conductive AdhesiveTape - 1" x 1" (0.375mm, but they also carry the 8820 - 0.5mm)
> JunPus Thermal Tape T180 - 0.2mm (they also carry 0.4mm)
> 
> There's better performing tapes/pads of course but I don't think it will make a big difference. some of them looked too sticky/permanent or might be conductive (thin lining of aluminum). The height between package and die is 0.53mm, height of VRM's is unknown so I was planning on trying the 0.4mm or combining the 0.2mm with 0.375mm (0.575mm total) If I combine, I wonder if putting a piece of aluminum foil between would help transfer between pads better than just glue+glue. I should be able to report results by this weekend.
> 
> On another unrelated note, I think I discovered another way to test IMC and cache ratio stability - stress test the iGPU for errors with OCCT. currently in RMA replacing my 3.5GB* 970's so I'm stuck on HD 4600. does okay on 900p lowest settings in a lot of games, but once it drops under 30fps ugh lag city - which 1080p was doing. Also, HD 4600 stable @ 1500 1.0156V here, 4.6GHz core 1.246v (adaptive, -16.6mV in XTU or -0.017 in BIOS), 4.2GHz cache (adaptive, offset +0.001 in BIOS)
> 
> *3.5GB-224bit + 0.5GB-32bit, enhanced stutter edition!


I'd like to hear how the thermal tape works out for you if you do it. I've been considering the same posts. I've also noticed the spread seems to go hot on one side, and cooler by core the father away from the hot end. That's got to be caused by more than the +-5C tolerance on the DTSs with so many people reporting that. If it was just the tolerances, it would be more random, instead of the usual hot end and cool end of the die with the other cores in between scaling down in temp in a gradient fashion. I've been under the impression that the graphics or 3rd level cache is the cause.

When I delid ours in a few weeks, I don't want to be messing with it constantly, I want to do it and be done with it.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> I'd like to hear how the thermal tape works out for you if you do it. I've been considering the same posts. I've also noticed the spread seems to go hot on one side, and cooler by core the father away from the hot end. That's got to be caused by more than the +-5C tolerance on the DTSs with so many people reporting that. If it was just the tolerances, it would be more random, instead of the usual hot end and cool end of the die with the other cores in between scaling down in temp in a gradient fashion. I've been under the impression that the graphics or 3rd level cache is the cause.
> 
> When I delid ours in a few weeks, I don't want to be messing with it constantly, I want to do it and be done with it.


regarding that ±5° don't forget they do become more accurate at higher temperatures.

I'd also like to know what physical location each core is on the chip, but I don't think that information is available. wonder if emailing Intel would get me anywhere, they'd probably have to forward it to the engineering department or whatever.


----------



## mxthunder

delidded my G3258 tonight. saw a ~18*C drop. Used CLU under and over the IHS.
I have to say, now that this is my second delid I have a very strong opinion towards the vice-only method. It is SUPER easy, SUPER safe, and takes a matter of seconds.


----------



## BoatOnGoat

I saw too many horror stories with blades and even though the vice method seems more "shocking" at first, it really does make more sense.

Some of the people using blades actually dug into the PCB and killed their chip...









I am going to be doing the vice method on my 4770k and I have decided it is a good candidate. This will be my first attempt and will be ordering the parts and the process will be completed within a month! Wish me luck!


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> regarding that ±5° don't forget they do become more accurate at higher temperatures.
> 
> I'd also like to know what physical location each core is on the chip, but I don't think that information is available. wonder if emailing Intel would get me anywhere, they'd probably have to forward it to the engineering department or whatever.


If it's Haswell, here's a couple of pictures.




This next one might be an Ivy Bridge:


I think I may have that first pic superimposed over an actual flip chip substrate for actual position of the units, but for some reason I can't find it. I know I have it somewhere.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> If it's Haswell, here's a couple of pictures.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This next one might be an Ivy Bridge:
> 
> 
> I think I may have that first pic superimposed over an actual flip chip substrate for actual position of the units, but for some reason I can't find it. I know I have it somewhere.


Yeah I've looked up images but none of them specify which is core 1-4 etc. the last picture is likely a socket 2011 die. Would be nice to know which of our cores is getting hottest. Could very well be the one at the very end since it has less die around it to help dissipate heat, or it could be the exact opposite. Who knows...

I'll try Live Chat when they open, otherwise I'll email them. doubtful I'll get any useful answers though until it's escalated. I might even have to call.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> I saw too many horror stories with blades and even though the vice method seems more "shocking" at first, it really does make more sense.
> 
> Some of the people using blades actually dug into the PCB and killed their chip...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am going to be doing the vice method on my 4770k and I have decided it is a good candidate. This will be my first attempt and will be ordering the parts and the process will be completed within a month! Wish me luck!


Taking a hammer to a CPU didn't seem like a very good idea to me, even though many have posted successful results - I was still afraid of micro-fractures in the chip package. If you have a steady hand and a lot of patience, razor blade works fine. I did mine with a razor.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Taking a hammer to a CPU didn't seem like a very good idea to me, even though many have posted successful results - I was still afraid of micro-fractures in the chip package. If you have a steady hand and a lot of patience, razor blade works fine. I did mine with a razor.


Vice method only requires a vice.

Put chip in vice, as if using hammer method.. Tighten vice until lid pops off. Magic.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Vice method only requires a vice.
> 
> Put chip in vice, as if using hammer method.. Tighten vice until lid pops off. Magic.


Yeah, if don't you plan on using the IHS afterwards, it has to be deformed.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Yeah, if don't you plan on using the IHS afterwards, it has to be deformed.


No, it should be flat still, you would never want it deformed.

Also, this is how I did mine, and epoxy is not as strong as copper. As long as you have the vice set up correct, there will be no deformation.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> No, it should be flat still, you would never want it deformed.
> 
> Also, this is how I did mine, and epoxy is not as strong as copper. As long as you have the vice set up correct, there will be no deformation.


How did you verify that?

I mean, what moved in order to release the glue?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> How did you verify that?
> 
> I mean, what moved in order to release the glue?


the chip isnt just in the vice, its at an angle, one edge of the IHS is on the vice edge and on the other it is the pcb so it moves the materials against the epoxy. Nothing is damaged and bent


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> delidded my G3258 tonight. saw a ~18*C drop. Used CLU under and over the IHS.
> I have to say, now that this is my second delid I have a very strong opinion towards the vice-only method. It is SUPER easy, SUPER safe, and takes a matter of seconds.


guide for vice only method, no hammer?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> guide for vice only method, no hammer?


1. stick a cpu upside down in a vice (see below)
2. twist vice arm til glue lets go



<-- vice is closing from right to left <--


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> 1. stick a cpu upside down in a vice (see below)
> 2. twist vice arm til glue lets go
> 
> 
> 
> <-- vice is closing from right to left <--


Thanks m8









Any specific direction I should put the chip in the vice?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Thanks m8
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any specific direction I should put the chip in the vice?


Rotate it 180* from this pic of my chip. In my attempt, the 4790k resistors are on the more dangerous side (the left side). All in all, as long as you turn the vice slowly, there's minimal danger regardless


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Rotate it 180* from this pic of my chip. In my attempt, the 4790k resistors are on the more dangerous side (the left side). All in all, as long as you turn the vice slowly, there's minimal danger regardless


So pretty much as long as i put the voltage controllers on the side thats not inside the vide it should be ok, right?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> So pretty much as long as i put the voltage controllers on the side thats not inside the vide it should be ok, right?


well yeah... in my attempt, the volt controllers were where you see the light blue dots (below), which meant i had a small risk of slamming them against the edge of the IHS if my chip PCB launched to the left side as the glue released. Fortunately, I was turning my vice slowly, and the PCB didn't end up going flying to the left anyway. For future attempts, I'll make sure the volt controllers are on the right-hand side so that I don't have that risk.


----------



## s74r1

ugh, lapping job sort of done... i'm never using emery cloth again. figured since it's meant for metal it would work better. apparently can't use it wet, it falls apart, and using it dry puts huge gouges and scratches in it. it's probably better for high speed sanding but not for something like a IHS. it took forever to get it out using standard wet/dry stuff. still needs a final pass higher than 800grit though. maybe have to do 600-800-1000/1200 just to make sure the scratches are out.



also, dropped IHS on tile floor corner first... /facepalm had to sand out the dent (though the bottom doesn't even tough the chip package). hope it didn't warp the entire thing.

Edit: higher res version... looks really bad. must redo this.


----------



## BoatOnGoat

Does anyone do anything to the circuits directly next to the die on their 4770k-90k? Such as nail polish or liquid electrical tape?


----------



## sweenytodd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> Does anyone do anything to the circuits directly next to the die on their 4770k-90k? Such as nail polish or liquid electrical tape?


Yes, I did liquid electrical tape even though I have nail polish around.


----------



## bfedorov11

I use the razer method.. I've done probably around 15 with zero problems.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> Does anyone do anything to the circuits directly next to the die on their 4770k-90k? Such as nail polish or liquid electrical tape?


Yes, I use several coats of clear nail polish if using CLU.


----------



## sharkforce

My delid can now officially be called a success! it took a lot of pain and suffering to get this far though!

last weekend i had to contend with a saga of problems that I created for myself by delidding my 3570k.

The delid went fine, I used the vice and wood block method, that took maybe 5 minutes.









What did not go fine was all the ancillary steps to get a water cooled machine ready for use.

after getting the cooling circuit how I wanted I tried testing for leaks by flipping on the power supply, with none of the other components in the case to play it safe. WRONG, coolant had spilled into my power supply some how. i see a puff of white smoke and smell burnt electronics. I void the warranty on the PSU and take it apart and get all the water out, its a miracle but it still works. not sure if lucky or EVGA 850 G2 power supply is amazing. I set the test system up again to test for leaks and it appears to not be leaking.

I'm really happy at this point so I decide to soldier on to get the waterblock and cpu installed on my motherboard
where I then proceeded to royally damage my motherboard by accidentally touching and bending a socket pin while installing the naked mount for my EK waterblock







.
so I get the pins unbent (presumably) on the socket and install the rest of the components
what happens the moment I turn on the computer? I see green fluid dripping down my motherboard! from the outlet of my EK waterblock























i fiddle with the connectors and power on again, no more leaks at this point, and I get 15, 51 error code perma boootloop cycle on my motherboard LCD.
I end up taking apart the system 3 more times, fiddling with the bent pins trying to straighten them out more.
the last time I try it posts.

and here I am now, as a 'successful' delid club member


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sharkforce*
> 
> My delid can now officially be called a success! it took a lot of pain and suffering to get this far though!
> 
> last weekend i had to contend with a saga of problems that I created for myself by delidding my 3570k.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> The delid went fine, I used the vice and wood block method, that took maybe 5 minutes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did not go fine was all the ancillary steps to get a water cooled machine ready for use.
> 
> after getting the cooling circuit how I wanted I tried testing for leaks by flipping on the power supply, with none of the other components in the case to play it safe. WRONG, coolant had spilled into my power supply some how. i see a puff of white smoke and smell burnt electronics. I void the warranty on the PSU and take it apart and get all the water out, its a miracle but it still works. not sure if lucky or EVGA 850 G2 power supply is amazing. I set the test system up again to test for leaks and it appears to not be leaking.
> 
> I'm really happy at this point so I decide to soldier on to get the waterblock and cpu installed on my motherboard
> where I then proceeded to royally **** my motherboard by accidentally touching and bending a socket pin while installing the naked mount for my EK waterblock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> so I get the pins unbent (presumably) on the socket and install the rest of the components
> what happens the moment I turn on the computer? I see green fluid dripping down my motherboard! from the outlet of my EK waterblock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i fiddle with the connectors and power on again, no more leaks at this point, and I get 15, 51 error code perma boootloop cycle on my motherboard LCD.
> I end up taking apart the system 3 more times, fiddling with the bent pins trying to straighten them out more.
> the last time I try it posts.
> 
> 
> 
> and here I am now, as a 'successful' delid club member


wow that's an adventurous build looks like you managed to void warranty on almost everything








congrats so.... any temp numbers OC gain?

new Coollaboratory Liquid Copper product ? I have just noticed it
http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-copper/


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sharkforce*
> 
> and here I am now, as a 'successful' delid club member


Done the hard way!

Congrats, and I know the feeling.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the chip isnt just in the vice, its at an angle, one edge of the IHS is on the vice edge and on the other it is the pcb so it moves the materials against the epoxy. Nothing is damaged and bent


Ah...hadn't encountered that version...good one!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> new Coollaboratory Liquid Copper product ? I have just noticed it
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/en/products/liquid-copper/


I bought some of this Liquid Copper a few months ago. Tried on an i5-2400S with an H60 and it didn't seem especially wonderful, but not bad either (same 40-45C at full load as with my usual MX4 paste). But it's not a proper test because the chip is not very powerful. I will test it on my delidded i7 soon with Swiftech water block.


----------



## s74r1

Interesitng... but why not silver or diamond particles, they both have superior heat conductivity.

btw, is it worth using CLU on a lapped IHS with lapped waterblock? or would paste still be a better choice?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> btw, is it worth using CLU on a lapped IHS with lapped waterblock? or would paste still be a better choice?


The CLU can cause the copper surfaces to fuse together. For this reason it is usually best to use a traditional paste between the IHS and block.

Edit:

@s74r1 If you want to go down this road anyhow, you can heat the heatsink up so the CLU is in more of a liquid state so it's easier to separate them. I believe I have read in this thread about people using a hair dryer. The other option is to run a stress test to get the temperature high, shut down and immediately get to work on removing the heatsink.

If you buy a nickel plated block then you should be able to use the CLU without any issues.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sharkforce*
> 
> My delid can now officially be called a success! it took a lot of pain and suffering to get this far though!
> 
> last weekend i had to contend with a saga of problems that I created for myself by delidding my 3570k.
> 
> The delid went fine, I used the vice and wood block method, that took maybe 5 minutes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did not go fine was all the ancillary steps to get a water cooled machine ready for use.
> 
> after getting the cooling circuit how I wanted I tried testing for leaks by flipping on the power supply, with none of the other components in the case to play it safe. WRONG, coolant had spilled into my power supply some how. i see a puff of white smoke and smell burnt electronics. I void the warranty on the PSU and take it apart and get all the water out, its a miracle but it still works. not sure if lucky or EVGA 850 G2 power supply is amazing. I set the test system up again to test for leaks and it appears to not be leaking.
> 
> I'm really happy at this point so I decide to soldier on to get the waterblock and cpu installed on my motherboard
> where I then proceeded to royally damage my motherboard by accidentally touching and bending a socket pin while installing the naked mount for my EK waterblock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> so I get the pins unbent (presumably) on the socket and install the rest of the components
> what happens the moment I turn on the computer? I see green fluid dripping down my motherboard! from the outlet of my EK waterblock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i fiddle with the connectors and power on again, no more leaks at this point, and I get 15, 51 error code perma boootloop cycle on my motherboard LCD.
> I end up taking apart the system 3 more times, fiddling with the bent pins trying to straighten them out more.
> the last time I try it posts.
> 
> and here I am now, as a 'successful' delid club member


sooo ya wanna gib me the info and I'll add you in?


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Interesitng... but why not silver or diamond particles, they both have superior heat conductivity.
> 
> btw, is it worth using CLU on a lapped IHS with lapped waterblock? or would paste still be a better choice?


If neither are aluminum, absolutely. That's exactly what I did when I delidded. No paste can come close to the performance of CLU.


----------



## mxthunder

Here is my weapon of choice for delidding. Nice crisp smooth jaws and the perfect size.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> Does anyone do anything to the circuits directly next to the die on their 4770k-90k? Such as nail polish or liquid electrical tape?


nehhh, never had a short


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I bought some of this Liquid Copper a few months ago. Tried on an i5-2400S with an H60 and it didn't seem especially wonderful, but not bad either (same 40-45C at full load as with my usual MX4 paste). But it's not a proper test because the chip is not very powerful. I will test it on my delidded i7 soon with Swiftech water block.


Thanks I was thinking it would be similar to a silver based paste as they are almost the same the thermal conductivity
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Interesitng... but why not silver or diamond particles, they both have superior heat conductivity.
> 
> btw, is it worth using CLU on a lapped IHS with lapped waterblock? or would paste still be a better choice?


IC Diamond is 92% (synthetic diamond?) diamond by weight it has a tendency to put micro scratches on the surfaces and is really the most difficult past I have ever used to get a good even spread over the whole chip is impossible without preheating paste and probably chip as well. The margin over a silver base paste is negotiable

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> The CLU can cause the copper surfaces to fuse together. For this reason it is usually best to use a traditional paste between the IHS and block.
> 
> Edit:
> 
> @s74r1
> If you want to go down this road anyhow, you can heat the heatsink up so the CLU is in more of a liquid state so it's easier to separate them. I believe I have read in this thread about people using a hair dryer. The other option is to run a stress test to get the temperature high, shut down and immediately get to work on removing the heatsink.
> 
> If you buy a nickel plated block then you should be able to use the CLU without any issues.


I am up on this debate I am going to replace my TIM on GPUs and I am probably going to use NT-H1 but I am weighing if to use CLU
I can't remember if I used XSPC K2 I am pretty sure I did and it has bleed out in small areas causing micro hotspots.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> Does anyone do anything to the circuits directly next to the die on their 4770k-90k? Such as nail polish or liquid electrical tape?


Better safe than sorry IMO. I have been using thermal tape to cover them and it gives a few benefits:


 
Covers the VRMs so you don't short them
Holds the lid in place so it doesn't move around
Small temperature drop on 3/4 cores
Reduces temperature variance between cores

Just used the thermal tape again, this time on my 4770k. Temp on cores 1-3 are down 2-3C, and the variance between the highest and lowest core was reduced 2C. No other settings or anything was changed aside from putting the thermal tape on the VRMs. I ran 3 passes of IBT on maximum memory load several times consecutively to make sure the highest temps were recorded and it was the same results every time.

This was done using a Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO w/ stock fan on performance mode in the ASRock BIOS.

*Before*

*72 | 80 | 79 | 75*





*After*

*72 | 78 | 76 | 73*





My 4790k has only 3C variance between all the cores, but I don't have before values to compare them to. I'm going to remove the tape and check the temps to see how it effects the temps. After that I'm going to use some Fujipoly Ultra Extreme thermal pad to see if the significantly higher thermal conductance helps even more. I would test this on the 4770k as well, but it has been sold to a friend of mine and I'm dropping the computer off at his house after I write this post.


----------



## fleetfeather

Hah, covering vrms isn't going to influence core temps at all. More than likely your ambient has changed between trials (entirely reasonable considering the before and after screenies above are on different days) producing the temp difference. Could also be a difference in your TIM application too, or even your cooler mount (which again is reasonable, given my own prior experience with CM's mounting mechanism for their Hyper EVO coolers)

Vrm's will never short if you apply the right amount of CLU/CLP to begin with. Safety is relative to your ability to control the TIM application.


----------



## sharkforce

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> sooo ya wanna gib me the info and I'll add you in?


I'll get the info to you later.
I'm getting around 25C idle and 60C under load from intelburntest @ 4.9GHz 1.3v vcore


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Hah, covering vrms isn't going to influence core temps at all. More than likely your ambient has changed between trials (entirely reasonable considering the before and after screenies above are on different days) producing the temp difference. Could also be a difference in your TIM application too, or even your cooler mount (which again is reasonable, given my own prior experience with CM's mounting mechanism for their Hyper EVO coolers)
> 
> Vrm's will never short if you apply the right amount of CLU/CLP to begin with. Safety is relative to your ability to control the TIM application.


Ambient wasn't any different; I even tested at nearly the exact same time of day. I didn't change anything with the TIM application. The mount being different is plausible, but there is no variance in how tight the mount is going to be due to the mounting mechanism.

For a first time user of CLP/CLU this isn't a bad idea because mistakes and accidents happen...so the extra 30 seconds it takes to cover the VRMs is extremely cheap/easy insurance.

For example someone puts too much CLU on the die, and the lid slides around a bit when handling the chip...but they don't lift the lid to see that the CLU has smeared across the top of the lid above the VRMs. They install the CPU thinking everything is fine. Fire up a CPU stress test, the CLU heats up returning to a more liquid state and falls on the VRMs, BOOM! Fried CPU and who knows what else...

I don't have any problem with my safety or ability to control my TIM application; better safe than a blown CPU/board sorry. However, not everyone is a pro with these types of things...which is why this site exists, so people can share knowledge.

As I said above I did not have time to continue testing with the 4770k because I sold it and needed to deliver the computer. I am going to continue experimenting with this *theory* with my 4790k. If the VRMs are cooled by making contact with the IHS, this can theoretically increase their efficiency and that could in turn effect load temperatures.


----------



## sharkforce

I think i need to get a new motherboard, I just realized I am running my memory in single channel mode.
Dual channel wont work as I get 15 and 51 error codes whether the memory sticks are in bank A or bank B .
Probably killed something on my motherboard from my bent socket pins that I had to manually straighten out during my delid.
:[ should I buy an ASROCK? seems to be the only Z77 mobo left for sale


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> ugh, lapping job sort of done... i'm never using emery cloth again. figured since it's meant for metal it would work better. apparently can't use it wet, it falls apart, and using it dry puts huge gouges and scratches in it. it's probably better for high speed sanding but not for something like a IHS. it took forever to get it out using standard wet/dry stuff. still needs a final pass higher than 800grit though. maybe have to do 600-800-1000/1200 just to make sure the scratches are out.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also, dropped IHS on tile floor corner first... /facepalm had to sand out the dent (though the bottom doesn't even tough the chip package). hope it didn't warp the entire thing.
> 
> Edit: higher res version... looks really bad. must redo this.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I just ordered the CLU, thermal tape, arctic clean, and these:

These... 30u, 15u, 9u, 3u, 2u, and 1u

I had previously taken it down to 5000 grit, but still was getting scratches, and that's wet. This stuff is supposed to take it to perfect mirror. We'll see. This set of polishing papers should get your ihs where it needs to be, well, I'll see if it does next week...assuming it arrives next week.

I'm kinda afraid to do the inside, as others have reported socket retention issues with the IHS ears when it's lapped down when they lap the underside. I just don't want it floating should I ever remove the cold plate from the CPU.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I bought some of this Liquid Copper a few months ago. Tried on an i5-2400S with an H60 and it didn't seem especially wonderful, but not bad either (same 40-45C at full load as with my usual MX4 paste). But it's not a proper test because the chip is not very powerful. I will test it on my delidded i7 soon with Swiftech water block.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks I was thinking it would be similar to a silver based paste as they are almost the same the thermal conductivity
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Interesitng... but why not silver or diamond particles, they both have superior heat conductivity.
> 
> btw, is it worth using CLU on a lapped IHS with lapped waterblock? or would paste still be a better choice?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> IC Diamond is 92% (synthetic diamond?) diamond by weight it has a tendency to put micro scratches on the surfaces and is really the most difficult past I have ever used to get a good even spread over the whole chip is impossible without preheating paste and probably chip as well. The margin over a silver based paste is negligable.
Click to expand...

ICD is real diamond dust. Reasoanbly sure that is similar grade to that of what is applied to diamond coated drills but I am not entirely sure about that. Definitely sure that it is NOT dust from synthetic diamonds.









~Ceadder


----------



## curly haired boy

diamond is diamond, man-made or found in nature. it's simply our name for a particular lattice structure of carbon.


----------



## s74r1

I've actually not noticed much scratching from ICD over the years, it's mostly how you remove it - Arcticlean or acetone and an alcohol pad or soft rag in one swift motion gets the bulk of it off. Of course if you're grinding heatsinks together (or moving PC a lot with a heavy cooler) or scrubbing it with some still left on it, it'll scratch though. It's certainly one of the more durable pastes, but I'm thinking it's not best for lapped surfaces due to the way it spreads (or lack thereof), as someone else pointed out the thick viscosity of it. The thinner pastes seem to suffer from pump-out though. Ideally I'd like my mount to last a year or more.

with regards to lapping, I think >1000grit is kinda overkill but i got some 600, 800, and 1500 from clearance rack to redo my IHS. TIP: ICD also works well for lapping









also just finished a blowhole in bottom of case to hopefully eliminate the GPU hot spots (p.s. hole saws are a PITA)

Anyways, back on topic - got my CLU ready, gonna try it both under IHS and between lapped IHS and waterblock after i finish the IHS lapping, along with thermal tape/pads over the FIVR.


----------



## skmanu

Well, got the Nepton 280L back.

The shop refused it for whatever reason.

After lapping, results are much better. Topping 86-89-90-85 degrees through the 4 cores after 10 passes of IBT on Very HIgh @4.9GHz/1.415v.

Wondering if it's safe enough to keep the CPU for a year or so (waiting for Broadwell).

Any clue someone?


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skmanu*
> 
> Well, got the Nepton 280L back.
> 
> The shop refused it for whatever reason.
> 
> After lapping, results are much better. Topping 86-89-90-85 degrees through the 4 cores after 10 passes of IBT on Very HIgh @4.9GHz/1.415v.
> 
> Wondering if it's safe enough to keep the CPU for a year or so (waiting for Broadwell).
> 
> Any clue someone?


I would say it's not worth the voltage bump from 1.32v 4.8 to 1.415v for 4.9, but that's me. I usually look for the sweet spot. those are good temps though for that much volts, linpack/avx2 would probably result in relaly bad things though lol. I can't really say what's safe but I hear >1.3v isn't good for 24/7 usage. extremely subjective though. Intel says +10% is safe on voltage but that's probably really conservative.


----------



## skmanu

Thanks.

I ran OCCT Linpack AVX and reach a little bit lower temps (82 to 88°C).


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> ICD is real diamond dust. Reasoanbly sure that is similar grade to that of what is applied to diamond coated drills but I am not entirely sure about that. Definitely sure that it is NOT dust from synthetic diamonds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Quote:


> IC Diamond 7 Carat Thermal Compound maximizes thermal heat transfer between the CPU core and heatsink by taking advantage of diamond's superior thermal conductivity.
> 
> Purified synthetic diamond has a thermal conductivity of 2,000-2,500 W/mK compared to 406-429 W/mK for pure silver.
> 
> Diamond's five times better thermal conductivity compared to silver makes it a superior heat transfer material for cooling high performance CPUs and is electrically non-conductive and non-capacitive.


http://www.innovationcooling.com/data_sheet.html

It doesn't actually say but from that abstract I would assume it is synthetic diamond

Still I wouldn't use it again after the troubles I had using it and no wonder recommended 50psi clamping force to get it to spread









I chickened out on using CLU on bare copper but I did get a massive 15°C+ using NT-H1 on my GPUS


----------



## BoatOnGoat

What thickness thermal tape did you guys use under the IHS for the circuits to the left of the die?


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Still I wouldn't use it again after the troubles I had using it and no wonder recommended 50psi clamping force to get it to spread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I chickened out on using CLU on bare copper but I did get a massive 15°C+ using NT-H1 on my GPUS


hmm, this could explain some of my bad spreads and why some people report better temps using more than the usual recommended amount of ICD. Wasn't NT-H1 shown to have pump-out effect and reliability issues? at least on bare die anyways.


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> What thickness thermal tape did you guys use under the IHS for the circuits to the left of the die?


Those are capacitors, don't put anything on them, unless you wind up going with liquid tape to insulate them. Only the CPU die produces heat.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> What thickness thermal tape did you guys use under the IHS for the circuits to the left of the die?


we have a theory that thermal tape over those might decrease some core temps or even out the temps, I'm installing mine today with some to find out. the distance between chip package and die top is 0.53mm. distance between top of FIVR's and die top is unknown, so something around 0.5mm or slightly taller might work. I'll be combining 0.2mm with 0.375mm but some 0.5mm or 0.6mm compressible pads/tape could work too (if you can find it)


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Those are capacitors, don't put anything on them, unless you wind up going with liquid tape to insulate them. Only the CPU die produces heat.


So the cause for higher heat on Haswell chips is due to what then exactly?

They are capacitors to help regulate voltage. Voltage regulator modules do generate heat.

Anyone, feel free to correct me if I am wrong here.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> So the cause for higher heat on Haswell chips is due to what then exactly?


22nm process, and poor IHS contact due to thick adhesive glue


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> hmm, this could explain some of my bad spreads and why some people report better temps using more than the usual recommended amount of ICD. Wasn't NT-H1 shown to have pump-out effect and reliability issues? at least on bare die anyways.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I really don't know I figured if My GPUs are topping out @ 45°C but normally about the 40°C mark then thermal coefficient causing bleed out probably wont be effect like cpus that are getting up to the 70°C+ mark.
Guess I will find out I was using the K2 TIM compound on the GPUs that was the problem with bleed out but time will tell.


----------



## sinnedone

Anyone using CLU on naked 3770k and nickel plated block long term?

Thinking about trying CLU on my naked 3770k and ek nickel supremacy block.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> 22nm process, and poor IHS contact due to thick adhesive glue


Yes, the 22nm process and adhesive contribute to the heat. But, this is the delidded thread so the glue is not a contributing factor...


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Yes, the 22nm process and adhesive contribute to the heat. But, this is the delidded thread so the glue is not a contributing factor...


Once the glue is gone, the temp differences between cores of different architectures are easily accounted for by any differences in manufacturing process and IPC performance.

If you had a IB and HW chip on hand (both 22nm), you'd note that they both operate at similar temps when delidded and all other factors remain constant. No one is really complaining about unusually high temps between either of these architectures and prior SB architecture once delidding and CLU-CLP are applied


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Once the glue is gone, the temp differences between cores of different architectures are easily accounted for by any differences in manufacturing process and IPC performance.
> 
> If you had a IB and HW chip on hand (both 22nm), you'd note that they both operate at similar temps when delidded and all other factors remain constant. No one is really complaining about unusually high temps between either of these architectures and prior SB architecture once delidding and CLU-CLP are applied


I'm not complaining, and I never said anyone was complaining.

I have 3770k, 4770k, and 4790k on hand; also just sold my other 4770k. The 3770k and 4790k are delidded with CLU applied. The 4770k is delidded running naked under an XSPC Raystorm with Xigmatek PTI-G4512 TIM; no thermal tape.

The 3770k has a spread of 9C from hottest and coolest core. The naked 4770k also had a 9C spready from hottest and coolest core.

The 4790k has only a 3C spread between hottest and coolest core with some thermal tape.

The 4770k I just sold had the temperature spread reduced from 8C between hottest/coolest to 6C after adding thermal tape.

Is this 100% undeniable proof? No, I never said it was. But I am going to continue tinkering to see if there is something worthwhile. Cooling VRMs on a GPU help them run more efficiently, that same principle could apply here.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I'm not complaining, and I never said anyone was complaining.
> 
> I have 3770k, 4770k, and 4790k on hand; also just sold my other 4770k. The 3770k and 4790k are delidded with CLU applied. The 4770k is delidded running naked under an XSPC Raystorm with Xigmatek PTI-G4512 TIM; no thermal tape.
> 
> The 3770k has a spread of 9C from hottest and coolest core. The naked 4770k also had a 9C spready from hottest and coolest core.
> 
> The 4790k has only a 3C spread between hottest and coolest core with some thermal tape.
> 
> The 4770k I just sold had the temperature spread reduced from 8C between hottest/coolest to 6C after adding thermal tape.
> 
> Is this 100% undeniable proof? No, I never said it was. But I am going to continue tinkering to see if there is something worthwhile. Cooling VRMs on a GPU help them run more efficiently, that same principle could apply here.


You made a few claims and asked a few questions. All I did was dispute the probable cause of what you're seeing and provide a few alternate factors that seem much more likely based on the myriad of past entries/comments/replies we've seen in the past. I didn't say that you were complaining lol, so... umm yep









Have fun


----------



## skupples

Cl
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Anyone using CLU on naked 3770k and nickel plated block long term?
> 
> Thinking about trying CLU on my naked 3770k and ek nickel supremacy block.


CLU is best used on nickel plating.

It doesn't get along with copper so well. Aka it will eat/pit the copper, eventually, but this does not happen with nickel plate.


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> Cl
> CLU is best used on nickel plating.
> 
> It doesn't get along with copper so well. Aka it will eat/pit the copper, eventually, but this does not happen with nickel plate.


Thanks for the response skupples.









I think I'll definitely try it next time to see how well it works.


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> Thanks for the response skupples.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think I'll definitely try it next time to see how well it works.


It works wonders, just messy, and painting it on is time consuming. Also a little goes a long way. You do not want it to leak. One needle can easily do 4 CPU.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> You made a few claims and asked a few questions. All I did was dispute the probable cause of what you're seeing and provide a few alternate factors that seem much more likely based on the myriad of past entries/comments/replies we've seen in the past. I didn't say that you were complaining lol, so... umm yep
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have fun


I made one claim, and asked one question.

You could have said something besides the 2 most obvious facts that really don't add up to much.

Ivy Bridge and Haswell both use 22nm manufacturing process. According to you, the 22nm and IHS glue are the only 2 contributing factors to Haswell running hotter than IB.

Since the 22nm is the same, and we are removing the glue...what is causing Haswell to run hotter?

So...?

2 other actual possibilities are:

The increased transistor count compared to die size. Haswell has ~16% more transistors but only increased the die size 10%. http://www.anandtech.com/show/7003/the-haswell-review-intel-core-i74770k-i54560k-tested/5

The 3D transistors in Haswell could also be effecting the temperatures.

I will have fun


----------



## skupples

Haswell has internal VRM that probably contributes. Not positive, but seems likely.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> According to you, the 22nm and IHS glue are the *only* 2 contributing factors to Haswell running hotter than IB.


Newp


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Newp


A word that doesn't exist with no actual rebuttal to follow...Good job


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> A word that doesn't exist with no actual rebuttal to follow...Good job


too hot to bother explaining. best of luck with your thermal pad tinkering


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> So the cause for higher heat on Haswell chips is due to what then exactly?
> 
> They are capacitors to help regulate voltage. Voltage regulator modules do generate heat.
> 
> Anyone, feel free to correct me if I am wrong here.


Consensus seems to be that it involves poor attachment of the IHS that leaves a gap between the bottom of the IHS and the die itself. This might explain why in every picture and video I have seen Intel just GOBS their TIM material on the die, apparently, to fill in the huge gap of non-contact.

This gap seems to persist into the Haswell-reboot chips (4790K, etc).

The gap was apparently first discovered on the Ivy Bridge chips, and from what I'm seeing it's attributed to the black glue used to attach the IHS (surface tension after pick and place placement making it rise a little???). Maybe intel needs a faster setting glue?


----------



## JVene

I've read through about 4 or 5 pages from this point backwards.

I'm joining in a bit with those participating in the discussion regarding Roboyto's experiment and hypothesis (friendly and otherwise).

The discussion seems to have the property of individuals talking about slightly different things, as if the parties aren't actually communicating all that well with each other - that's just an observation, not a criticism. I've done that many times myself. I'm a 50+ old fart with lots of experience, an aged engineering degree, and a 4790K interested in Roboyto's theory. One I did not believe in earlier.

Here's where I think this ended up among the participants, focusing more on Roboyto's experiment and idea:

All aware of the IHS gap (that's loosely directed to kc5vdj), and generally all in this discussion relative to Roboyto's experiment assume that heat issues have been observed after the IHS has been removed.

Roboyto's hypothesis is that FIVR components are contributing to heat observed in the cores, and possibly contributing to uneven temperatures among the cores.

I'll be following that hypothesis with interest, as I see at least one other is experimenting, and I have a delidded 4790K which I could easily try it on myself.

The hypothesis actually has two parts. The first is the general contribution of heat transfer to the CPU, and the second is the contribution to certain cores.

Personally I have only the 4790K, and Roboyto's doesn't show the wide difference among core temperatures as the 3770K tested. It was my understanding that FIVR on the 4790K is more robust, so one could infer that generates more heat, and without full knowledge of the layout, it may well be that VRM's are more evenly distributed than on the 3770K.

That last possibility makes direct comparison of the 4790K experiments inapplicable to the others, where the core temperature variations are in question.

Like Roboyto, my 4790K shows very little core variation, perhaps 2 or 3 C on average. Prior to delidding it, though, there was 12 to 15C variation, consistently hotter from core 1, graduating to a much cooler core 4.

If a 2C drop can be verified through these experiments, that's as much of a tool against heat as, say, CLU vs common non-conductive thermal pastes.

I would (and I think I may have) posited that the VRM's were too far away to impart sufficient heat to affect the CPU section, but then I'm not sure how much heat the could generate.

Either way, both for and against the notion, this represents a hypothesis. It's worthy of the investigation, and I'll have to grab some thermal product applicable to the FIVR section to join in should the two already reporting on this provide interesting, corroborative results.

Anyone else with a free IHS should consider joining in.

It could be a significant point of data and knowledge to contribute to the cause of controlling that last 2C or so in our targets.

I personally have less interest in the 3770K, for the selfish reason I don't have one and likely won't get one, but if it can be shown that the core difference is consistently reduced by thermal control over the FIVR, it is at least supportive of the underlying theory that FIVR heat transfers to the core.

I wouldn't have believed that possible, but I am an engineer, a consumer of science, and a useful fact will not go unappreciated.

Oh, and there's little doubt, from IB to Haswell, there is a larger number of transistors in a smaller space, and that should make Haswell hotter. Not because there's more heat energy, but because there's less physical area available to draw that heat away. It's been known for a while that cooling 45nm chips was easier, largely because the transistor density is lower. Even cooling 32nm chips was easier, and while we did usually see drops in overall heat per die area in the older node reductions, between 32 and 22 we lost that. These transistors are different than their elder cousins, generating more heat for their size than previous pre-FinFet designs, and I think I've read that DC or Haswell, I don't recall which, are using a "FinFet version 2", making the comparison even worse.


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> So the cause for higher heat on Haswell chips is due to what then exactly?
> 
> They are capacitors to help regulate voltage. Voltage regulator modules do generate heat.
> 
> Anyone, feel free to correct me if I am wrong here.


Was there a thermal pad on them to begin with?


----------



## s74r1

Relid sucessful with CLU on die and on lapped IHS! Using 3M 467MP (0.5mm) thermal tape/pads. specs say the glue is 0.06mm so that should clear the 0.53mm height between package and die, and squish between the VRM's nicely.

Temps with thermal pads incoming after I activate _Maximum Ass Hero_ mode!

P.S. sorry for huge images.

1500grit lap


My first CLU job, don't judge







actually do judge! I'm curious if i put too much. 3M thermal pads wedged between core. (and no that's not CLU on the edges of IHS, I lapped it a little.)


CLU on top of IHS


residue wiped off on waterblock (maybe unnecessary?)


Swiftech H240-X installed. Later upgrading to another 280mm rad in front of case, and probably another pump and GPU blocks. This damn thing was such a pain in the butt to mount in this mid tower, had to rip off the retention clamp on EPS12V wire to make the board fit. (Blow hole on bottom I drilled recently too, I think it came out pretty nice especially once a fan goes over it.)


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Temps with thermal pads incoming after I activate _Maximum Ass Hero_ mode!


----------



## skupples

that's a ton of CLU


----------



## sinnedone

I thought the CLU and copper didn't go well together because of fusing together after time?


----------



## s74r1

maybe too much CLU on top of IHS now that I think about it, but I'm not worried about fusing. bit of heat and it comes right off if it gets stuck.

Edit: hmm, thinking of redoing waterblock mount... it does look like quite a lot. i'll see how it goes once i get everything back together.

Edit2: high res shot here (clickable), y'all think this is too much for lapped IHS? was also some wiped off on waterblock. I know not many people advise doing IHS/heatsink CLU and I'm aware of the risks. I'm hoping maybe since copper seems to absorb some of it that more might be better? too much came out and it didn't feel like a thick coat while i was doing it but looks thicker in photos than I intended.



http://imgur.com/DNoFfjG


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sinnedone*
> 
> I thought the CLU and copper didn't go well together because of fusing together after time?


I've never seen them fuse together, but I have seen CLU slowly pit & eat copper. Effect on temps? none that I've seen, yet.

still, he used an *excessive* amount on his CPU. I truly hope it doesn't leak out & short his mobo.

like... You should be able to cover an IHS, even on a big chip, with a tiny dot. Remember, it's conductive.


----------



## JVene

s74r1,

What's the canned catfood for?


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> I've never seen them fuse together, but I have seen CLU slowly pit & eat copper. Effect on temps? none that I've seen, yet.
> 
> still, he used an *excessive* amount on his CPU. I truly hope it doesn't leak out & short his mobo.
> 
> like... You should be able to cover an IHS, even on a big chip, with a tiny dot. Remember, it's conductive.


Thanks, redoing it after i clear the dust out of here. CPU die looked thin enough though so i don't think i need to redo that.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> s74r1,
> 
> What's the canned catfood for?


I got hungry... lol, to keep hairy cat away when i'm doing delicate TIM jobs.


----------



## maynard14

hi guys, its been a while since i post here









in my current build im using h80i and raven 01 case, with my delided 4770k using clp on the die and also in between the h80i cooler and the ihs,

im curious if my temps are normal while just using google chrome with usually 5 tabs, temps on my room is about 24c


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Thanks, redoing it after i clear the dust out of here. CPU die looked thin enough though so i don't think i need to redo that.
> I got hungry... lol, to keep hairy cat away when i'm doing delicate TIM jobs.


inside the CPU looked find, the IHS job however looked excessive.

CLU has a good video on their website that shows their recommended dosage.com


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> hi guys, its been a while since i post here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> in my current build im using h80i and raven 01 case, with my delided 4770k using clp on the die and also in between the h80i cooler and the ihs,
> 
> im curious if my temps are normal while just using google chrome with usually 5 tabs, temps on my room is about 24c


Those look fine, what really matters is the load temps though - several reasons, among them the fact that the sensors are more accurate at higher temperatures than lower ones, and several thermal solutions function on curves, not linearly, so idle and minimally active temps aren't really important unless they're above the 60-70C range.


----------



## s74r1

@skupples think it's alright to leave the copper discolored? I scrubbed both for a long time until no more gray was coming off. really don't want to have to relap again. I'm thinking the discoloration is just the CLU that filled in some of the imperfections, so I might need even less.


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> @skupples think it's alright to leave the copper discolored? I scrubbed both for a long time until no more gray was coming off. really don't want to have to relap again. I'm thinking the discoloration is just the CLU that filled in some of the imperfections, so I might need even less.


notta big deal at all. It's the nature of the copper beast. It WILL discolor again, it's just patina.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Those look fine, what really matters is the load temps though - several reasons, among them the fact that the sensors are more accurate at higher temperatures than lower ones, and several thermal solutions function on curves, not linearly, so idle and minimally active temps aren't really important unless they're above the 60-70C range.


thanks bro, i found my problem, i set my minimum uncore from auto to manual 35 clock speed, and also in windows 8.1 power settings i set to power saving mode and now my 4770k is now down clocking while just browsing , my temps are now at 30c, 35c and 37c

i think it is much better now

while gaming my load temps at max is 70c so i think it is still at normal range, 4770k at 4.3 ghz 1.26 volts


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> notta big deal at all. It's the nature of the copper beast. It WILL discolor again, it's just patina.


Thanks for the help/advice. +Rep.

better? (clickable for even larger res)



nothing on waterblock this time.


----------



## skupples

looks much better!

can actually see the brush strokes









I killed a MVExtreme from CLU running down the board.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> looks much better!
> 
> can actually see the brush strokes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I killed a MVExtreme from CLU running down the board.


Wow, sorry to hear that. thanks for saving me from a potential similar disaster lol


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> Wow, sorry to hear that. thanks for saving me from a potential similar disaster lol


That's why I don't want to use CLU or CLP, but the stuff sure is interesting.

I get it, it's quite logical the stuff should be superior, but the risk is not within my comfort zone.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> That's why I don't want to use CLU or CLP, but the stuff sure is interesting.
> 
> I get it, it's quite logical the stuff should be superior, but the risk is not within my comfort zone.


you only live once. if it ain't broke, fix it 'till it's broke







I've been overclocking since my first computer, among other things (back when it wasn't idiot-proof).

nah I get it though, some risks aren't worth taking. but luckily we have such great resources such as OC.net here to share our experiences and help each other (hopefully) not blow ourselves up xD


----------



## s74r1

hmm, relid with thermal pads between core failed I think... getting terrible temps. probably squished over the core. either that or my double CLU mount was bad. or warped IHS after it fell on tile floor during lapping. so many variables. need to tear it down tomorrow and investigate. also have delid die guard on the way, so I might just go bare die again if I can mount an Apogee XL properly. (Edit: guess I could put 2mm of washers under the springs for more tension)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> hmm, relid with thermal pads between core failed I think... getting terrible temps. probably squished over the core. either that or my double CLU mount was bad. or warped IHS after it fell on tile floor during lapping. so many variables. need to tear it down tomorrow and investigate. also have delid die guard on the way, so I might just go bare die again if I can mount an Apogee XL properly. (Edit: guess I could put 2mm of washers under the springs for more tension)


In my opinion... Those pads are pointless, delidding solves the issue of height clearance and better delta material for thermodynamics. putting more material in there isn't the solution, just cover the resistors with a nonconducting material and your good


----------



## skupples

yeah idk enough about the height difference between the VRMs and the die to make a call.

though, if you are hell bent on testing it, I would go with FujiPoly, as it's basically clay. They will smush into place, if they're slightly too thick. I believe they go down to .5mm.(don't waste your time w/ fujipoly extreme, the middle of the road stuff works wonders. Also, PPC tends to have better pricing than FCPU when it comes to FujiPoly, as PPC will actually sell yuo giant sheets of it, while FCPU meters it out into little squares)


----------



## Xoriam

On question that was brought up in another thread, and probably here as well previously.
When I had an I7 950 I lapped it. and it dropped a few C off of my temps.

My question on your delids, how much of a difference are you guys noticing in temps when lapping?
not asking for delid + lap temp decrease, but temp decrease of lap post Delid.

Interior versus exterior lapping as well.
Mostly interested in the interior lap results, as I've never lapped the interior of an IHS before.
thanks.


----------



## skupples

lapping the interior seems like a good way to really screw things up really quickly O.O! props to anyone that's actually done it & rendered good results.

in completely off topic news..

I really hate certificate training, but boss man will pay for it, if I follow proper steps


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> On question that was brought up in another thread, and probably here as well previously.
> When I had an I7 950 I lapped it. and it dropped a few C off of my temps.
> 
> My question on your delids, how much of a difference are you guys noticing in temps when lapping?
> not asking for delid + lap temp decrease, but temp decrease of lap post Delid.
> 
> Interior versus exterior lapping as well.
> Mostly interested in the interior lap results, as I've never lapped the interior of an IHS before.
> thanks.


Interior lapping is nearly impossible, the only thing you can do it lap the very bottom of the IHS so it would be the lip around the antire base of the IHS, however this has some issues where if you lap to much the outer side tabs used to hold the IHS down become to thin and bend. My opinion, don't mess with interior focus on exterior, I dropped 2-4C when I lapped mine
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skupples*
> 
> lapping the interior seems like a good way to really screw things up really quickly O.O! props to anyone that's actually done it & rendered good results.
> 
> in completely off topic news..
> 
> I really hate certificate training, but boss man will pay for it, if I follow proper steps


hmmmm interesting how much is this, just curious


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Interior lapping is nearly impossible, the only thing you can do it lap the very bottom of the IHS so it would be the lip around the antire base of the IHS, however this has some issues where if you lap to much the outer side tabs used to hold the IHS down become to thin and bend. My opinion, don't mess with interior focus on exterior, I dropped 2-4C when I lapped mine
> hmmmm interesting how much is this, just curious


Yeah... I'm going to stay away from that then.


----------



## JVene

One of my clients is a sheet metal/machining manufacturing facility. The only way I'd consider lapping the inside is on a CNC milling machine.


----------



## skupples

still sounds like a failure waiting to happen, though w/ access to CNC you could account for the internal loss by taking down the lip as well.


----------



## fleetfeather

If you have access to serious gear, why not investigate soldering the chip?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> If you have access to serious gear, why not investigate soldering the chip?


for some reason with solder the die can't handle the process and often cracks, which is why intel used TIM instead of fluxless solder this time


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> for some reason with solder the die can't handle the process and often cracks, which is why intel used TIM instead of fluxless solder this time


Hrmmm, so 1155 and 1150 chips crack, but the 2011 and 2011-3 chips don't?

That's..... Strange :/


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> In my opinion... Those pads are pointless, delidding solves the issue of height clearance and better delta material for thermodynamics. putting more material in there isn't the solution, just cover the resistors with a nonconducting material and your good


doesn't quite solve the curious issue of one core running hotter than others. someone reported even temps after putting a pad over the VRM's so I had to try it. perhaps I overdid it and it got too gooey, smushed all over the cores or something.

changed on-IHS TIM to a regular paste just to be sure, no difference. so it's defiintely something with the relid. time to redo that with thinner pads or no pads. (maybe i'll try the 0.375mm stuff)

also LOL @skupples where'd you find that image? that's an old pentium4 Willamette IIRC, haven't seen one of those in years. I think the pentium3's were faster than those early netburst pieces of junk.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Hrmmm, so 1155 and 1150 chips crack, but the 2011 and 2011-3 chips don't?
> 
> That's..... Strange :/


Yea.... >.> I don't know man








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> doesn't quite solve the curious issue of one core running hotter than others. someone reported even temps after putting a pad over the VRM's so I had to try it. perhaps I overdid it and it got too gooey, smushed all over the cores or something.
> 
> changed on-IHS TIM to a regular paste just to be sure, no difference. so it's defiintely something with the relid. time to redo that with thinner pads or no pads. (maybe i'll try the 0.375mm stuff)


I would use the thinnest pads if your committed to it.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> doesn't quite solve the curious issue of one core running hotter than others. someone reported even temps after putting a pad over the VRM's so I had to try it. perhaps I overdid it and it got too gooey, smushed all over the cores or something.
> 
> changed on-IHS TIM to a regular paste just to be sure, no difference. so it's defiintely something with the relid. time to redo that with thinner pads or no pads. (maybe i'll try the 0.375mm stuff)
> 
> also LOL @skupples where'd you find that image? that's an old pentium4 Willamette IIRC, haven't seen one of those in years. I think the pentium3's were faster than those early netburst pieces of junk.


One core running hotter could be due to your motherboard's power delivery, the way your specific chip handles the power being fed to it, or the load situations the chip is running under.

The guy who believes thermal tape reduces per core differences saw an decrease in variance of 2 degrees when using the same CPU, which could be explained by a host of other factors other than thermal tape placed on resistors. 2 degrees of variance could be explained by his CPU block (assuming he used the raystorm block in his avatar pic, which Martin already notes a 2C variance between mounts is possible), his Hyper EVO cooler mount mechanism (in case he isn't watercooling during this trial), his thermal paste application, movement between IHS and chip during reinsertion, ambient temperature...... plenty of variables.


----------



## skmanu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> doesn't quite solve the curious issue of one core running hotter than others. someone reported even temps after putting a pad over the VRM's so I had to try it. perhaps I overdid it and it got too gooey, smushed all over the cores or something.
> 
> changed on-IHS TIM to a regular paste just to be sure, no difference. so it's defiintely something with the relid. time to redo that with thinner pads or no pads. (maybe i'll try the 0.375mm stuff)
> .


My 4790K used to have core 0,1,2 in a 2°°C range while core 3 was always 7 to9°C hotter.

This with several mounts, CLU change and with two different coolers.

I solved the issue by "over-tightening" the block. I have now a 5°C differnce at max between the 4 cores.


----------



## s74r1

MUCH better temps after getting rid of those junk 0.5mm pads (0.56 with the glue)... i don't think the core was getting much contact, too close to core and too tall to squish properly. was getting 70c idle temps in max stock boost 4.4ghz, now 25c.



new mount using 0.375mm pad on VRM, didn't quite clear the height difference so i used a line of ICD to bridge the gap (ICD is really thick and known to bridge gaps well, like running shimless in a laptop). actually pushed the line a tiny bit further away from core after taking this so it wouldn't spread to the die. there's less CLU than it appears to be, i just over-brushed it and the ICD line is flatter than it looks. bad picture is bad.



and well,uneven core temps still... by 3c-10c margin at it's max, but I have nothing to compare it to but my bare die previous mount which had core1 hottest, going down to core4 as coldest. now it's core3>core2>core1=core4. maybe after i burn it in with some prime95 it'll even out some (can already hear my VRM's squealing under certain FFT's).


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> and well,uneven core temps still... by 3c-10c margin at it's max, but I have nothing to compare it to but my bare die previous mount which had core1 hottest, going down to core4 as coldest. now it's core3>core2>core1=core4. maybe after i burn it in with some prime95 it'll even out some (can already hear my VRM's squealing under certain FFT's).


Mine vary about 10 C as well, but they are so much lower I really don't care. Anyone else see a greater core variance after delidding?


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> doesn't quite solve the curious issue of one core running hotter than others. someone reported even temps after putting a pad over the VRM's so I had to try it. perhaps I overdid it and it got too gooey, smushed all over the cores or something.
> 
> changed on-IHS TIM to a regular paste just to be sure, no difference. so it's defiintely something with the relid. time to redo that with thinner pads or no pads. (maybe i'll try the 0.375mm stuff)
> 
> also LOL @skupples where'd you find that image? that's an old pentium4 Willamette IIRC, haven't seen one of those in years. I think the pentium3's were faster than those early netburst pieces of junk.


I thought the hotter core was from being next to the IGPU, which is why said core tends to run cooler on i5s than i7s...

picture is from LabSim, for CompTIA nonsense.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Mine vary about 10 C as well, but they are so much lower I really don't care. Anyone else see a greater core variance after delidding?


Yes, it's just the nature of the beast.
It's been attributed to proximity to IGPU, VRMs, & also just how programs load the CPU.

A program loading down a single core = that core will be hotter than the rest.


----------



## JVene

Think upon these theories, with the one data point I can offer from my own 4790K:

Before delid, my 4790K had 12 to 15C variation from core 1 to core 4, graduated. It was consistent over all tests.
After delid the same CPU shows only 2C variation, core1 and 4 being the coolest.

Uneven temperature is due to proximity to the IGPU:

Yet, only if the IGPU is actively doing something. This would be highly software dependent. If AIDA64 or OCCT or Prime95 test runs are showing uneven temperature, what is the IGPU doing to generate said heat? In order to generate any significant heat, the IGPU would have to be running code taxing the unit to at least some degree, and the heat generated would be dependent on what code is running.

Is there any such pattern identifiable in the uneven temperatures which would track IGPU duty?

It's the VRM's:

This has been an interesting hypothesis, but there's a problem. There is at least 1 4790K showing only 2C variation after delid, with others showing 10C. A difference in power delivery configuration (12 phase vs 6 phase, etc) or in power configuration (higher Vrin) could cause VRM's to generate more or less heat, but do we see a pattern as to which cores are affected for each model?

Obviously the layout of VRM's will differ from each model, but for 4790K's, as an example, is it alway's core  that's hotter than the others? On my chip I've seen 2c variation across speeds from 4.0 to 4.6 Ghz, Vrin ranging from a low of 1.7 to a high of 2.0 with Vcore ranging from 1.1 to 1.35. Cores 2 & 3 are consistently 2c warmer than 1 & 4 (which I consider too close to call).

It's how programs load the CPU:

Certainly possible, but code must request affinity, or it must be assigned, for code to STAY in a particular core. On tests like AIDA64 and OCCT, the code deliberately loads the cores evenly.

The OS switches tasks, depending on your installation, around 150,000 times per second. Unless affinity is assigned, the OS chooses the most available core for work, and generally spreads that somewhat randomly over the cores.

While I can certainly understand how software can differ on each core (I've developed software for decades), there would be a strong association with a particular test, and a pattern on similar hardware would emerge for all of us.

Not everyone is experiencing a 10C load difference. Most are, it seems, reporting core 1 as the most commonly hottest core, but I'm no longer one of them after delid.

It's the motherboard's power delivery:

I don't see the mechanism here. Maybe I missed something. There are a wide variety of power designs, but they all flow to the same power input pins on the CPU for any given socket. Heat comes from an old fashioned source, a basic energy concept. I can certainly understand how a design that's less stable than another would generate a different amount of heat, but with the possible exception of an asymmetrical distribution of heat from FIVR, I can't see how 10C differences among cores would be caused. More or less heat I can understand, but uneven heat from the motherboard's power delivery, I'm not able to find the mechanism for that.

The way your specific chip handles the power being fed to it:

This is the most logical of all. It's hard to accept the manufacturing variance could be so bad as to create chips that exhibit minimal variation, like mine, and others of the same model with 10C variation, but it's the only theory I've read thus far I must accept as plausible.

Generally on heat from other sources, IGP/VRM, whatever:

In order to generate a 10C difference in the core, the source of the heat MUST be higher than the 10C difference. Is it really possible to imagine FIVR or the IGPU core so much hotter than the adjacent target that it would be possible?

For example, if Core 1 is 80C and others are 70C, whatever is nearby generating the additional heat has to be hotter than 80C.

I don't have data on heat expected from FIVR, but I can monitor heat from the IGPU. Since I'm not seeing a difference in temps, I can't supply a point of data here, but has anyone noticed an IGPU higher than the core 1 of the example (or similar) I show above?

VRM's (FIVR included) are really quite efficient compared to the power handling behavior of the CPU. Have you ever known as much heat to come from the motherboard's VRM's as that observed in the CPU? No. The reason is the nature of switched power systems. Digital VS Analog, or even hybrid, do have differing characteristics, but not by double. I can't see how FIVR components could generate sufficient heat, and in such wide variation, to account for 10C differences among cores. One of the reasons FIVR is physically separated from the core is so that the core's heat doesn't easily transfer into FIVR components. It would stand to reason the reverse is a side effect.

Also, about heat...it's not just temperature, it's mass. FIVR is made of very small components compared to the die. It's unlikely there is enough heat generated by FIVR components to account for that much heat transfer, but there could be enough heat generated in the IGPU to cause it. It's just that such heat isn't going to come from nowhere, we'd see it in the IGPU monitor. We don't have a monitor for FIVR, but the mass is so much smaller that the heat would have to be very high...too high, I'm fairly sure, to allow the FIVR components to survive.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Think upon these theories, with the one data point I can offer from my own 4790K:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Before delid, my 4790K had 12 to 15C variation from core 1 to core 4, graduated. It was consistent over all tests.
> After delid the same CPU shows only 2C variation, core1 and 4 being the coolest.
> 
> Uneven temperature is due to proximity to the IGPU:
> 
> Yet, only if the IGPU is actively doing something. This would be highly software dependent. If AIDA64 or OCCT or Prime95 test runs are showing uneven temperature, what is the IGPU doing to generate said heat? In order to generate any significant heat, the IGPU would have to be running code taxing the unit to at least some degree, and the heat generated would be dependent on what code is running.
> 
> Is there any such pattern identifiable in the uneven temperatures which would track IGPU duty?
> 
> It's the VRM's:
> 
> This has been an interesting hypothesis, but there's a problem. There is at least 1 4790K showing only 2C variation after delid, with others showing 10C. A difference in power delivery configuration (12 phase vs 6 phase, etc) or in power configuration (higher Vrin) which would cause VRM's to generate more or less heat, but do we see a pattern as to which cores are affected?
> 
> Obviously the layout of VRM's will differ from each model, but for 4790K's, as an example, is it alway's core  that's hotter than the others? On my chip I've seen 2c variation across speeds from 4.0 to 4.6 Ghz, Vrin ranging from a low of 1.7 to a high of 2.0 with Vcore ranging from 1.1 to 1.35. Cores 2 & 3 are consistently 2c warmer than 1 & 4 (which I consider too close to call).
> 
> It's how programs load the CPU:
> 
> Certainly possible, but code must request affinity, or it must be assigned, for code to STAY in a particular core. On tests like AIDA64 and OCCT, the code deliberately loads the cores evenly.
> 
> The OS switches tasks, depending on your installation, around 150,000 times per second. Unless affinity is assigned, the OS chooses the most available core for work, and generally spreads that somewhat randomly over the cores.
> 
> While I can certainly understand how software can differ on each core (I've developed software for decades), there would be a strong association with a particular test, and a pattern on similar hardware would emerge for all of us.
> 
> Not everyone is experiencing a 10C load difference. Most are, it seems, reporting core 1 as the most commonly hottest core, but I'm no longer one of them after delid.
> 
> It's the motherboard's power delivery:
> 
> I don't see the mechanism here. Maybe I missed something. There are a wide variety of power designs, but they all flow to the same power input pins on the CPU for any given socket. Heat comes from an old fashioned source, a basic energy concept. I can certainly understand how a design that's less stable than another would generate a different amount of heat, but with the possible exception of an asymmetrical distribution of heat from FIVR, I can't see how 10C differences among cores would be caused. More or less heat I can understand, but uneven heat from the motherboard's power delivery, I'm not able to find the mechanism for that.
> 
> The way your specific chip handles the power being fed to it:
> 
> This is the most logical of all. It's hard to accept the manufacturing variance could be so bad as to create chips that exhibit minimal variation, like mine, and others of the same model with 10C variation, but it's the only theory I've read thus far I must accept as plausible.
> 
> Generally on heat from other sources, IGP/VRM, whatever:
> 
> In order to generate a 10C difference in the core, the source of the heat MUST be higher than the 10C difference. Is it really possible to imagine FIVR or the IGPU core so much hotter than the adjacent target that it would be possible?
> 
> For example, if Core 1 is 80C and others are 70C, whatever is nearby generating the additional heat has to be hotter than 80C.
> 
> I don't have data on heat expected from FIVR, but I can monitor heat from the IGPU. Since I'm not seeing a difference in temps, I can't supply a point of data here, but has anyone noticed an IGPU higher than the core 1 of the example (or similar) I show above?
> 
> Also, about heat...it's not just temperature, it's mass. FIVR is made of very small components compared to the die. It's unlikely there is enough heat generated by FIVR components to account for that much heat transfer, but there could be enough heat generated in the IGPU to cause it. It's just that such heat isn't going to come from nowhere, we'd see it in the IGPU monitor. We don't have a monitor for FIVR, but the mass is so much smaller that the heat would have to be very high...too high, I'm fairly sure, to allow the FIVR components to survive.


interesting theory, though I do have my iGPU fully loaded/overvolted at 1.5GHz right now under prime95/AVX2 and still seeing core3>core2>core1=core4. when I was bare die it was core1>core2>core3>core4. this 3>2>1=4 temp pattern matches my old soldered-die sandy too. has to be something with the IHS. no discernible temp pattern with iGPU loaded and not loaded. curious... I'll investigate bare die again once I can get a proper mount using MSI delid die guard.

4hrs of prime95 + OCCT (iGPU):


also, those highs were recorded 3 hours ago. so... either prime95 is doing less stressing FFT's (custom blend 3mins for each) or the CLU is curing more. I notice much less temp variance in the 60's than the upper end of 80's and 90's, which it hasn't reached since then.

Edit: hmm still varrying quite a bit unless the sensors update at different intervals or the FFT's have slowly drifted apart from one another due to other CPU load, need to test same FFT on all cores.


----------



## Xoriam

And so it begins....

I'll be back with results later, wish me luck!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> And so it begins....
> 
> I'll be back with results later, wish me luck!


Good luck!


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Think upon these theories, with the one data point I can offer from my own 4790K:
> 
> Before delid, my 4790K had 12 to 15C variation from core 1 to core 4, graduated. It was consistent over all tests.
> After delid the same CPU shows only 2C variation, core1 and 4 being the coolest.
> 
> Uneven temperature is due to proximity to the IGPU:
> 
> Yet, only if the IGPU is actively doing something. This would be highly software dependent. If AIDA64 or OCCT or Prime95 test runs are showing uneven temperature, what is the IGPU doing to generate said heat? In order to generate any significant heat, the IGPU would have to be running code taxing the unit to at least some degree, and the heat generated would be dependent on what code is running.
> 
> Is there any such pattern identifiable in the uneven temperatures which would track IGPU duty?
> 
> It's the VRM's:
> 
> This has been an interesting hypothesis, but there's a problem. There is at least 1 4790K showing only 2C variation after delid, with others showing 10C. A difference in power delivery configuration (12 phase vs 6 phase, etc) or in power configuration (higher Vrin) could cause VRM's to generate more or less heat, but do we see a pattern as to which cores are affected for each model?
> 
> Obviously the layout of VRM's will differ from each model, but for 4790K's, as an example, is it alway's core  that's hotter than the others? On my chip I've seen 2c variation across speeds from 4.0 to 4.6 Ghz, Vrin ranging from a low of 1.7 to a high of 2.0 with Vcore ranging from 1.1 to 1.35. Cores 2 & 3 are consistently 2c warmer than 1 & 4 (which I consider too close to call).
> 
> It's how programs load the CPU:
> 
> Certainly possible, but code must request affinity, or it must be assigned, for code to STAY in a particular core. On tests like AIDA64 and OCCT, the code deliberately loads the cores evenly.
> 
> The OS switches tasks, depending on your installation, around 150,000 times per second. Unless affinity is assigned, the OS chooses the most available core for work, and generally spreads that somewhat randomly over the cores.
> 
> While I can certainly understand how software can differ on each core (I've developed software for decades), there would be a strong association with a particular test, and a pattern on similar hardware would emerge for all of us.
> 
> Not everyone is experiencing a 10C load difference. Most are, it seems, reporting core 1 as the most commonly hottest core, but I'm no longer one of them after delid.
> 
> It's the motherboard's power delivery:
> 
> I don't see the mechanism here. Maybe I missed something. There are a wide variety of power designs, but they all flow to the same power input pins on the CPU for any given socket. Heat comes from an old fashioned source, a basic energy concept. I can certainly understand how a design that's less stable than another would generate a different amount of heat, but with the possible exception of an asymmetrical distribution of heat from FIVR, I can't see how 10C differences among cores would be caused. More or less heat I can understand, but uneven heat from the motherboard's power delivery, I'm not able to find the mechanism for that.
> 
> The way your specific chip handles the power being fed to it:
> 
> This is the most logical of all. It's hard to accept the manufacturing variance could be so bad as to create chips that exhibit minimal variation, like mine, and others of the same model with 10C variation, but it's the only theory I've read thus far I must accept as plausible.
> 
> Generally on heat from other sources, IGP/VRM, whatever:
> 
> In order to generate a 10C difference in the core, the source of the heat MUST be higher than the 10C difference. Is it really possible to imagine FIVR or the IGPU core so much hotter than the adjacent target that it would be possible?
> 
> For example, if Core 1 is 80C and others are 70C, whatever is nearby generating the additional heat has to be hotter than 80C.
> 
> I don't have data on heat expected from FIVR, but I can monitor heat from the IGPU. Since I'm not seeing a difference in temps, I can't supply a point of data here, but has anyone noticed an IGPU higher than the core 1 of the example (or similar) I show above?
> 
> VRM's (FIVR included) are really quite efficient compared to the power handling behavior of the CPU. Have you ever known as much heat to come from the motherboard's VRM's as that observed in the CPU? No. The reason is the nature of switched power systems. Digital VS Analog, or even hybrid, do have differing characteristics, but not by double. I can't see how FIVR components could generate sufficient heat, and in such wide variation, to account for 10C differences among cores. One of the reasons FIVR is physically separated from the core is so that the core's heat doesn't easily transfer into FIVR components. It would stand to reason the reverse is a side effect.
> 
> Also, about heat...it's not just temperature, it's mass. FIVR is made of very small components compared to the die. It's unlikely there is enough heat generated by FIVR components to account for that much heat transfer, but there could be enough heat generated in the IGPU to cause it. It's just that such heat isn't going to come from nowhere, we'd see it in the IGPU monitor. We don't have a monitor for FIVR, but the mass is so much smaller that the heat would have to be very high...too high, I'm fairly sure, to allow the FIVR components to survive.


I'm guessing iGPU activity could be tested by having the iGPU driver installed or not.

Another point that I don't think you brought up is that different cores can also request or require different vcore, which I've often found to be higher for Core#1 on HA chips I've owned (that is, the second core - Core0, Core1, Core2, Core3)

It will be near impossible to prove that thermal pads are the true cause of this minor improvement in core temp differences; too many variables in play, and not enough ability to control them all


----------



## Xoriam

Ok so I'm having a bit of an annoying issue going on atm. 3570k

Core 0 and 3 are running 10c colder than core 1, and core 2 is running 5c colder than core 1.
my igpu is deactivated in windows, and the driver is uninstalled.
my clu application seems practically flawless.
the spread wasn't so big pre delid.

please help as quickly as possible guys.
If I can fix that it is 40c, yeah thats right 40c off my max load temps across the board.

i'll be posting pics when i get this figured out.
i'm currently doing it, so please respond asap.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Ok so I'm having a bit of an annoying issue going on atm. 3570k
> 
> Core 0 and 3 are running 10c colder than core 1, and core 2 is running 5c colder than core 1.
> my igpu is deactivated in windows, and the driver is uninstalled.
> my clu application seems practically flawless.
> the spread wasn't so big pre delid.
> 
> please help as quickly as possible guys.
> If I can fix that it is 40c, yeah thats right 40c off my max load temps across the board.
> 
> i'll be posting pics when i get this figured out.
> i'm currently doing it, so please respond asap.


Check mount lol


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Check mount lol


----------



## Xoriam

grrrr 2 more mounts same results, I might have to lap at a later time......
be back with results soon enough.


----------



## s74r1

I'm really starting to think the inside of these IHS's aren't perfectly flat, contributing to the uneven temps. the ±5° margin of error the sensors are rated for doesn't quite explain this, especially considering they become more accurate the hotter the chip is. I'm thinking the IHS inside doesn't need to be that flat out of the factory because there's a gap of TIM by default anyways... starting to consider a shim method if i can find a pure copper one 2mm thick. or lower my mounting a bit with a 1mm shim and 1mm washers under waterblock mounting springs.

I should have my delid die guard arriving soon too, so that should prove interesting to test.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I'm really starting to think the inside of these IHS's aren't perfectly flat, contributing to the uneven temps. the ±5° margin of error the sensors are rated for doesn't quite explain this, especially considering they become more accurate the hotter the chip is. I'm thinking the IHS inside doesn't need to be that flat out of the factory because there's a gap of TIM by default anyways... starting to consider a shim method if i can find a pure copper one 2mm thick. or lower my mounting a bit with a 1mm shim and 1mm washers under waterblock mounting springs.


I have uneven temps on my 3570k direct die. It happens. Several remounts, several different TIMs, even lapped. Same ~10C difference, with one colder than the rest and ~3C delta between the rest.

Could be so many things, I just take the hottest core, and if it is within my comfort zone, call it good. I mean, we are generally keeping these things below 80C, which is still 35C from critical, where the sensors are most accurate, and intel says dont bother with reading sensors below 50C because they can be wildly inaccurate (mine can read upwards of 10C below ambient...whaaaaa?) 80C is middle of the field between on point and sloppy, so how accurate are they really to begin with?


----------



## s74r1

hmm good point @inedenimadam

I'm still curious which core numbers are located where, can't find any info on that. might help shed some light on this. If the hot core is near the iGPU, this could either make it hotter or colder since it has more die space to dissipate heat, especially if iGPU is disabled or render standby with voltage shut off. Or if the core numbers are even hardcoded or just chosen at random from first CPU install? (if you disable a core in BIOS it chooses at random. and somehow the motherboards know when you remove a CPU and put the same one back in, my Asus boards show "New CPU detected" at bootup.)


----------



## skupples

almost positive cores hold physical locations, as to how they report? Not positive, asking a local brainiac, he should be able to give me a definitive answer.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> hmm good point @inedenimadam
> 
> I'm still curious which core numbers are located where, can't find any info on that. might help shed some light on this. If the hot core is near the iGPU, this could either make it hotter or colder since it has more die space to dissipate heat, especially if iGPU is disabled or render standby with voltage shut off. Or if the core numbers are even hardcoded or just chosen at random from first CPU install? (if you disable a core in BIOS it chooses at random. and somehow the motherboards know when you remove a CPU and put the same one back in, my Asus boards show "New CPU detected" at bootup.)


IEasked that same question quite a while ago in this thread, and got my answer. On Ivy, SA sits up top, then 0, then 1, then 2, then 3, then iGPU on the bottom closest to the pcie. It has been a while, but that is what I remember.

I will see if I can track down the post.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Ok so I'm having a bit of an annoying issue going on atm. 3570k
> 
> Core 0 and 3 are running 10c colder than core 1, and core 2 is running 5c colder than core 1.
> my igpu is deactivated in windows, and the driver is uninstalled.
> my clu application seems practically flawless.
> the spread wasn't so big pre delid.
> 
> please help as quickly as possible guys.
> If I can fix that it is 40c, yeah thats right 40c off my max load temps across the board.
> 
> i'll be posting pics when i get this figured out.
> i'm currently doing it, so please respond asap.


Honestly it might just be your chip, I'd already take your awesome temp drops and just leave it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I'm really starting to think the inside of these IHS's aren't perfectly flat, contributing to the uneven temps. the ±5° margin of error the sensors are rated for doesn't quite explain this, especially considering they become more accurate the hotter the chip is. I'm thinking the IHS inside doesn't need to be that flat out of the factory because there's a gap of TIM by default anyways... starting to consider a shim method if i can find a pure copper one 2mm thick. or lower my mounting a bit with a 1mm shim and 1mm washers under waterblock mounting springs.
> 
> I should have my delid die guard arriving soon too, so that should prove interesting to test.


where did you get the guard from?


----------



## naved777

Any one replaced the CLU after 1 year ?
I haven't changed mine for 1 year now and have no idea what i will find








Will i be even able to lift the lid up ?


----------



## skupples

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *naved777*
> 
> Any one replaced the CLU after 1 year ?
> I haven't changed mine for 1 year now and have no idea what i will find
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will i be even able to lift the lid up ?


some people claim it turns to dust, but that's never been my experience. It definitely drys out a bit, but nothing like people have reported w/o proof.

expect your IHS to be pitted & stuff, but nothing a quick scotch bright or fine sandpaper can't resolve.


----------



## Xoriam

Any tips to get 3570k stable at 5ghz?
Can't seem to get her to do it, pumping volts into it does not seem to stablize.
I'm probably missing something else.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Any tips to get 3570k stable at 5ghz?
> Can't seem to get her to do it, pumping volts into it does not seem to stablize.
> I'm probably missing something else.


Get some air pointed directly at the VRM sinks on the ext4m.
Try lowering PLL
Higher LLC


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Any tips to get 3570k stable at 5ghz?
> Can't seem to get her to do it, pumping volts into it does not seem to stablize.
> I'm probably missing something else.


These CPUs have huge walls. No matter what i do i cant get 4.7GHz with my CPU. Voltage does nothing after 1.35v.


----------



## Valgaur

The key part of Overclocks is temps, not normal operating temps those won't do you anything, you need serious cooling in the negatives to make the CPU utilize the transistors more efficiently. However PLL and LLC does help manage stability and can result in better OC opportunities.


----------



## Xoriam

What sort of adjustment should I make to the PLL

And LLC i typically go with 50% the one that just slightly droops.
Which do you guys suggest?

This is the first chip I'm actually having difficulty getting to OC "really high"


----------



## Xoriam

Pretty sure core 0 sensor is faulty.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Any tips to get 3570k stable at 5ghz?
> Can't seem to get her to do it, pumping volts into it does not seem to stablize.
> I'm probably missing something else.


not all chips are going to do 5Ghz best way to find the wall is use manual voltage and see what it takes to get to 5Ghz
I can do 5Ghz with 1.32v manual voltage with offset I have to use 1.47v load volts idles about 1.12v

So binning helps on 3rd ivy the other 2 were average in aspects of OC they both took 1.45v to get 4.7Ghz
I have had my CPU @ 5Ghz for 10days no BSOD or WHEA errors


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> hmm good point @inedenimadam
> 
> I'm still curious which core numbers are located where, can't find any info on that. might help shed some light on this. If the hot core is near the iGPU, this could either make it hotter or colder since it has more die space to dissipate heat, especially if iGPU is disabled or render standby with voltage shut off. Or if the core numbers are even hardcoded or just chosen at random from first CPU install? (if you disable a core in BIOS it chooses at random. and somehow the motherboards know when you remove a CPU and put the same one back in, my Asus boards show "New CPU detected" at bootup.)


The fact that the core temp variation is always the same by core (so core 0 always the coldest and 1 and 2 the hottest) would suggest that they have a fixed number. Presumably 0 and 3 are on the ends, so it would make sense that they are cooler, since 1 and 2 and picking up heat from active cores on both sides, while 0 and 3 only have a hot core to one side.

The other theory I have heard (and tend to belive) is that the cold core is the one next to the iGPU, and it is cooler because the turned off iGPU (assuming it is off) acts like a heatsink and pulls heat away from that core. That theory should be testable though, by testing it with the iGPU disabled and then again with it active.


----------



## Xoriam

Ok here we go with the pics.
Sorry for the quality.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


















and

30c drop at 4,4ghz Trying to work towards 5ghz.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> The fact that the core temp variation is always the same by core (so core 0 always the coldest and 1 and 2 the hottest) would suggest that they have a fixed number. Presumably 0 and 3 are on the ends, so it would make sense that they are cooler, since 1 and 2 and picking up heat from active cores on both sides, while 0 and 3 only have a hot core to one side.
> 
> The other theory I have heard (and tend to belive) is that the cold core is the one next to the iGPU, and it is cooler because the turned off iGPU (assuming it is off) acts like a heatsink and pulls heat away from that core. That theory should be testable though, by testing it with the iGPU disabled and then again with it active.


That is the theory that I tend to follow as well. You could also overvolt the SA to check if it warms 0.

Fire tends to be hotter the closer you get to the middle.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> The fact that the core temp variation is always the same by core (so core 0 always the coldest and 1 and 2 the hottest) would suggest that they have a fixed number. Presumably 0 and 3 are on the ends, so it would make sense that they are cooler, since 1 and 2 and picking up heat from active cores on both sides, while 0 and 3 only have a hot core to one side.
> 
> The other theory I have heard (and tend to belive) is that the cold core is the one next to the iGPU, and it is cooler because the turned off iGPU (assuming it is off) acts like a heatsink and pulls heat away from that core. That theory should be testable though, by testing it with the iGPU disabled and then again with it active.


I guess that would be a good explanation for my core 0 temps.
however when i pushed it so i hit 85c on other cores, core 0 was running in the 60s, Pretty sure in my case it's just faulty.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> where did you get the guard from?


emailed MSI about a Z97 Power AC open box missing delid die guard, they referred me to their spare parts guy that sold me one pretty cheap.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> The fact that the core temp variation is always the same by core (so core 0 always the coldest and 1 and 2 the hottest) would suggest that they have a fixed number. Presumably 0 and 3 are on the ends, so it would make sense that they are cooler, since 1 and 2 and picking up heat from active cores on both sides, while 0 and 3 only have a hot core to one side.
> 
> The other theory I have heard (and tend to belive) is that the cold core is the one next to the iGPU, and it is cooler because the turned off iGPU (assuming it is off) acts like a heatsink and pulls heat away from that core. That theory should be testable though, by testing it with the iGPU disabled and then again with it active.


that does make sense, but some people report core0 or core3 as their hottest. perhaps poor mounts. like my old direct-die mount had core0 hottest, going down a slope to core3. whats strange though is iGPU heat doesn't seem to contribute any core temp heat, I had mine OC'd to 1550MHz/1.056v running OCCT GPU stress WHILE under prime95 FMA3 blend @ 4.6GHz. also my SSA is at offset +0.199 and I notice no temp differences. I would assume the sign of a good mount would be the middle cores being hottest like the old soldered IHS ones were. If only Intel made these dies square... (rectangle probably cheaper to fab)

also, thanks @inedenimadam for the core info. I assume haswell's layout hasn't changed.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is the theory that I tend to follow as well. You could also overvolt the SA to check if it warms 0.
> 
> Fire tends to be hotter the closer you get to the middle.


whats your LLC setting for that 24/7 5ghz OC you're running? 100% 50% or 0%?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> I guess that would be a good explanation for my core 0 temps.
> however when i pushed it so i hit 85c on other cores, core 0 was running in the 60s, Pretty sure in my case it's just faulty.


In your one screenshot, it showed 15 °C minimum temperature. That just isn't possible as your room temperature probably is 20 °C or so? It really could be a faulty sensor on that core?


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> In your one screenshot, it showed 15 °C minimum temperature. That just isn't possible as your room temperature probably is 20 °C or so? It really could be a faulty sensor on that core?


No my ambient is more like 13-16c 50-60f.
My xeon also has that idle temp also, however I do think that sensor on core 0 is faulty.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is the theory that I tend to follow as well. You could also overvolt the SA to check if it warms 0.
> 
> Fire tends to be hotter the closer you get to the middle.
> 
> 
> 
> whats your LLC setting for that 24/7 5ghz OC you're running? 100% 50% or 0%?
Click to expand...

On my Asus board its called extreme or something along those lines, on my ASRock it was level 1, and you seem to have percentages...Whichever gives the most compensation for vdroop is what you want. Get rid of vdroop when trying to hit high clocks.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> On my Asus board its called extreme or something along those lines, on my ASRock it was level 1, and you seem to have percentages...Whichever gives the most compensation for vdroop is what you want. Get rid of vdroop when trying to hit high clocks.


you know you might have just cured my problem m8.








working on 5ghz right now, things looking good. I've got a feeling thats all I needed to adjust.

Really like LLC at lower clocks, but I always get confused about it when I'm making my big clocks.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> not all chips are going to do 5Ghz best way to find the wall is use manual voltage and see what it takes to get to 5Ghz
> I can do 5Ghz with 1.32v manual voltage with offset I have to use 1.47v load volts idles about 1.12v
> 
> So binning helps on 3rd ivy the other 2 were average in aspects of OC they both took 1.45v to get 4.7Ghz
> I have had my CPU @ 5Ghz for 10days no BSOD or WHEA errors


Manual voltage is better? I have been using offset since day one. Should try manual?


----------



## mAnBrEaTh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I'm really starting to think the inside of these IHS's aren't perfectly flat, contributing to the uneven temps. the ±5° margin of error the sensors are rated for doesn't quite explain this, especially considering they become more accurate the hotter the chip is. I'm thinking the IHS inside doesn't need to be that flat out of the factory because there's a gap of TIM by default anyways... starting to consider a shim method if i can find a pure copper one 2mm thick. or lower my mounting a bit with a 1mm shim and 1mm washers under waterblock mounting springs.
> 
> I should have my delid die guard arriving soon too, so that should prove interesting to test.


FYI, I had to notch out a section of my MSI delid guard to clear the transistors on the PCB. I believe i read the delid guard is officially for the 4770K's not the 4790K's.


----------



## Xoriam

Ok I think there is something else I need to adjust to hit 5ghz, need to figure out what it is.

I'm running into a strange issue where after a period of time during the stress test my cpu and vcore start to fluctuate from stock speed to my overclock speed.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Ok I think there is something else I need to adjust to hit 5ghz, need to figure out what it is.
> 
> I'm running into a strange issue where after a period of time during the stress test my cpu and vcore start to fluctuate from stock speed to my overclock speed.


This can happen if the VRM area of your motherboard gets too hot. It did exactly what you describe on an ASRock Z77 board I had. It can apparently throttle the CPU speed to try to keep temperatures down.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> This can happen if the VRM area of your motherboard gets too hot. It did exactly what you describe on an ASRock Z77 board I had. It can apparently throttle the CPU speed to try to keep temperatures down.


yeah thats what inedenimadam was just telling me in the 5GHZ thread.
They are not hot to the touch and I've got a really nice fan blowing on them.

What do you suggest I do?


----------



## Valgaur

Also if your trying for overclocks and your frequency and volts are moving set your computer to performance mode it will sit at full throttle when under load instead of caring about watching for low points. This is in power options in windows


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> This can happen if the VRM area of your motherboard gets too hot. It did exactly what you describe on an ASRock Z77 board I had. It can apparently throttle the CPU speed to try to keep temperatures down.
> 
> 
> 
> yeah thats what inedenimadam was just telling me in the 5GHZ thread.
> They are not hot to the touch and I've got a really nice fan blowing on them.
> 
> What do you suggest I do?
Click to expand...

Get a new board, you have the headroom on that chip if you are at 1.29 and 4.8 stable.

Stay away from ASRock for higher overclocks. Not that the higher end are not capable, just that the voltage can be wildly inaccurate, as much as .1 off in my experience.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Also if your trying for overclocks and your frequency and volts are moving set your computer to performance mode it will sit at full throttle when under load instead of caring about watching for low points. This is in power options in windows


Yeah I've had it on performance mode from the start


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Get a new board, you have the headroom on that chip if you are at 1.29 and 4.8 stable.
> 
> Stay away from ASRock for higher overclocks. Not that the higher end are not capable, just that the voltage can be wildly inaccurate, as much as .1 off in my experience.


I was looking around for a new one about 2 weeks back, was undecided.

Any suggestions on a board for hitting 5ghz and i'm running SLI 970s so a bit of space would be perfered.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Get a new board, you have the headroom on that chip if you are at 1.29 and 4.8 stable.
> 
> Stay away from ASRock for higher overclocks. Not that the higher end are not capable, just that the voltage can be wildly inaccurate, as much as .1 off in my experience.
> 
> 
> 
> I was looking around for a new one about 2 weeks back, was undecided.
> 
> Any suggestions on a board for hitting 5ghz and i'm running SLI 970s so a bit of space would be perfered.
Click to expand...

I found the Asus boards to be a better board. I piock one up from flea bay that had a CPU pin broken for $45, the pin killed dual channel RAM, but still runs like a scalded dog.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> yeah thats what inedenimadam was just telling me in the 5GHZ thread.
> They are not hot to the touch and I've got a really nice fan blowing on them.
> 
> What do you suggest I do?


I personally gave up at that point. I was also overclocking in the winter, and when I thought about possible workarounds for the problem, I decided I just don't like to do something that's so close to the limit that it will not work in the summer in a hot room.

I was thinking about trying "Thermalright HR-09" (type that into a Google image search). Those kind of heat-sinks are sadly not produced anymore, and I couldn't find them anywhere.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I personally gave up at that point. I was also overclocking in the winter, and when I thought about possible workarounds for the problem, I decided I just don't like to do something that's so close to the limit that it will not work in the summer in a hot room.
> 
> I was thinking about trying "Thermalright HR-09" (type that into a Google image search). Those kind of heat-sinks are sadly not produced anymore, and I couldn't find them anywhere.


omg lol those things are MASSIVE


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> I guess that would be a good explanation for my core 0 temps.
> however when i pushed it so i hit 85c on other cores, core 0 was running in the 60s, Pretty sure in my case it's just faulty.


keep in mind the sensors can be wildly inaccurate <50c as someone else pointed out, but that does look a bit odd, unless your other cores are abnormally hot in comparison it could be a bad mount.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> you know you might have just cured my problem m8.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> working on 5ghz right now, things looking good. I've got a feeling thats all I needed to adjust.
> 
> Really like LLC at lower clocks, but I always get confused about it when I'm making my big clocks.


LLC is now part of Intel's required spec, so every motherboard should be using at least level 1 if following Intel's guidelines. higher LLC can be useful when trying to get a stable adaptive/offset OC or when pushing extreme currents, though with the introduction of separate turbo voltage this may change things. I'm not entirely sure if the VID reported by CPU accounts for any LLC it's receiving or not... my guess is no, so you'd need special software or a DMM to see how much voltage your CPU is actually getting. too high of a LLC level can cause overshoot (voltage spike) when high CPU load is removed, though haswell's FIVR should be much more responsive to any VCCIN spikes.

Someone else mentioned Asus here, can't find the post but Asus' "Extreme" setting is just for phase control, LLC is a different thing. personally I'm on Auto until I figure it out more (why did they remove percentages? ugh), and using power phase response with "Ultra Fast" so it still shuts down some phases while idle but runs full phase under load. T. Probe disabled (Extreme), I'm not so convinced this is very reliable at predicting enough load required to spread uneven current amounts to different MOSFET's for thermal reasons.

Also, regarding VRM temp power throttling CPU - thermal feedback can be disabled, though potentially dangerous if your VRM's are in fact overheating. your VRM's may be rated for higher temps than the CPU is aware of though.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Manual voltage is better? I have been using offset since day one. Should try manual?


General rule of thumb: manual when trying to find your max OC and required voltages, then test/stabilize it with adaptive or offset if going for 24/7 OC. usually adaptive/offset needs a bit more voltage though.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAnBrEaTh*
> 
> FYI, I had to notch out a section of my MSI delid guard to clear the transistors on the PCB. I believe i read the delid guard is officially for the 4770K's not the 4790K's.


the pictures from the Z97 version seem to show haswell with enough clearance for FIVR, perhaps they didn't account for devil's canyon. Either way, thanks for the info - I may have to dremel it down a bit, though I'm concerned it may bend a little when using a power tool on it. thanks for the pictures though! +REP

Edit: how's the core clearance with the die guard? is it perfectly flat with the core? slightly lower than the core? or slightly higher than the core? my guess is it's slightly higher for safety reasons which might be bad for a CLU mount. also curious how waterblocks might react to one tiny spot being hot instead of a heatspreader.


----------



## Xoriam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> keep in mind the sensors can be wildly inaccurate <50c as someone else pointed out, but that does look a bit odd, unless your other cores are abnormally hot in comparison it could be a bad mount.
> .


I made one final remount last night, and reapplication of CLU. I also cleaned the whole chip with alcohol even the underside.
It appears the sensor is not faulty in the end, it just takes ALOT longer for that core to heat up. I'm guessing the proximity of the IGPU as others were talking about previously.
Whatever is going on with that one I wish the others would run so cold as well.

I tested today with a 22c ambient, and core 0 is reading correctly on that as well.


----------



## mAnBrEaTh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> the pictures from the Z97 version seem to show haswell with enough clearance for FIVR, perhaps they didn't account for devil's canyon. Either way, thanks for the info - I may have to dremel it down a bit, though I'm concerned it may bend a little when using a power tool on it. thanks for the pictures though! +REP
> 
> Edit: how's the core clearance with the die guard? is it perfectly flat with the core? slightly lower than the core? or slightly higher than the core? my guess is it's slightly higher for safety reasons which might be bad for a CLU mount. also curious how waterblocks might react to one tiny spot being hot instead of a heatspreader.


I remember the die guard being level (flat) to slightly lower than the core. It was very hard to tell the difference when i was examining. I've been running my EK Evo waterblock with CLU and naked CPU for over a month now no issues and I know a lot of OCN members who have done so since 3770K.


----------



## ZealotKi11er

So how much better is direct die?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> So how much better is direct die?


3C is all I got out of it.


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 3C is all I got out of it.


Significant IMO


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 3C is all I got out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> Significant IMO
Click to expand...

Certainly, considering the mounting hardware is only 3.99 over what I had already spent on the rest of the loop. If I could spend 3.99 for every 3C, I could have a mighty frosty CPU!


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xoriam*
> 
> I made one final remount last night, and reapplication of CLU. I also cleaned the whole chip with alcohol even the underside.
> It appears the sensor is not faulty in the end, it just takes ALOT longer for that core to heat up. I'm guessing the proximity of the IGPU as others were talking about previously.
> Whatever is going on with that one I wish the others would run so cold as well.
> 
> I tested today with a 22c ambient, and core 0 is reading correctly on that as well.


supposedly core0 is supposed to be near the system agent not near the iGPU. I've noticed no heat difference from iGPU fully loaded/stressed.


----------



## $ilent

Folks, just a quick heads up.

I am looking at doing an Intel section overclocking competition very soon. This is a good chance for you all to put your nicely overclocked & delidded chips to the test!

I have created a discussion thread and would really appreciate your input.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1539659/official-ocn-intel-overclocking-competition-discussion-thread-we-need-your-thoughts/0_100

Thanks!


----------



## mAnBrEaTh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> So how much better is direct die?


I cannot provide this information as I never used the IHS and went straight to direct die contact. Some results can be found here at XS switching to the EK precisionmount and direct die contact.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?285753-CPU-water-blocks-roundup&p=5203054&viewfull=1#post5203054

So far I am very satisfied with the results I have achieved. Running OCCT CPU 3+ hours on large data set room temp about 22c 4790K 4.9 Ghz with 1.344v max core temp 70c.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZealotKi11er*
> 
> Manual voltage is better? I have been using offset since day one. Should try manual?


I use offset too, Just with manual it removes a lot of the voltage fluctuations so you can get an idea on what your chip is capable of it terms of maximum frequency before setting offset voltage I don't want a chip idling @ 1.45v


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I'm really starting to think the inside of these IHS's aren't perfectly flat, contributing to the uneven temps. the ±5° margin of error the sensors are rated for doesn't quite explain this, especially considering they become more accurate the hotter the chip is. I'm thinking the IHS inside doesn't need to be that flat out of the factory because there's a gap of TIM by default anyways... starting to consider a shim method if i can find a pure copper one 2mm thick. or lower my mounting a bit with a 1mm shim and 1mm washers under waterblock mounting springs.
> 
> I should have my delid die guard arriving soon too, so that should prove interesting to test.


Where do you buy the delid die guard without buying that MSI motherboard at the same time? I've looked, and all I can find is that one motherboard, but not the die guard being sold separately.


----------



## kc5vdj

Okay, the RMA motherboard from ASRock should be arriving tomorrow. They had better not have messed up the 4770K and the memory (this is a freaking 2nd RMA for the Z87E-ITX). If this board is faulty, I am switching my recommendation on ASRock to "do not buy". This time, they wanted my parts to test with (yes, they are good, and just to be sure, we waited until now to do the RMA having to rule out our parts by buying the 4790K and 16GB 2400 kit from G.SKILL, and that took time to do on our budget).

Anyhow, today, I got the thermal pads, and pack of 3M 30u, 15u, 9u, 3u, 2u, 1u polishing paper (hey, if I'm going to re-lap it, this time I want it as a perfect mirror) today, and the CLU and ArcticClean should arrive Monday or Tuesday.

The Lian Li PC-Q18B is now stripped and back in it's box, and everything but the motherboard is now in the new Corsair Obsidian 750D. I will run initially using the same low-profile heatsink I had in the Lian Li (Scythe Big Shuriken 2 Rev B), except with an aftermarket one inch dual-BB 107cfm fan attached instead of the Scythe 12mm 47cfm fan. The Corsair gives the room for this. We will be going to water in March or April with this box. Being on a budget sucks.

The bottom line here is that I will be testing and getting baselines on the 4770K this weekend into Monday. Delid on that CPU will be next week, after the CLU arrives. Assuming ASRock didn't RMA me a faulty board FREAKING AGAIN! (I'm also concerned as the S/N on the board on the way begins with 35 instead of 43 as with the original and the first RMA, they had better not be sending one with the Z87 stepping earlier than what I bought, if they did that, they go on instant DO NOT BUY recommendation.

I will be posting our results as they come in, starting with the baselines.

P.S. The Corsair drive trays have a few mm of play (forward/reverse) in the drive cages. I had to bend the contact point at the back of the cages with needlenose pliers to eliminate the drive tray play. At that much money, it's sad I have to do this. I expect that kind of crap in a $30-50 chassis, not a $150 chassis.

Reading the latest from the past week here, I'm skipping on the thermal pads, and will simply borrow some of my wife's nail polish.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *$ilent*
> 
> Folks, just a quick heads up.
> 
> I am looking at doing an Intel section overclocking competition very soon. This is a good chance for you all to put your nicely overclocked & delidded chips to the test!
> 
> I have created a discussion thread and would really appreciate your input.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1539659/official-ocn-intel-overclocking-competition-discussion-thread-we-need-your-thoughts/0_100
> 
> Thanks!


I would be more than happy to help you in this if you need any


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Okay, the RMA motherboard from ASRock should be arriving tomorrow. They had better not have messed up the 4770K and the memory (this is a freaking 2nd RMA for the Z87E-ITX). If this board is faulty, I am switching my recommendation on ASRock to "do not buy". This time, they wanted my parts to test with (yes, they are good, and just to be sure, we waited until now to do the RMA having to rule out our parts by buying the 4790K and 16GB 2400 kit from G.SKILL, and that took time to do on our budget).


I have sworn off ASRock due to declining RMA support and continually receiving boards with the same problems.

890FX Delux3 - PCIe slot failure - 1 RMA - 1 year - Still working in mother-in-law PC

Z77 Extreme6 - PCIe slot Failure - 1st RMA - 6 months

Z77 Extreme6 - RAM slots failure - 2nd RMA - 6 months - Board that I received from RMA wouldn't clock 2133 or 2400 RAM over 1866 speed.

Z77E-ITX - PCIe slot failure - 1st RMA - 4 months

Z77E-ITX - RAM slots failure - 2nd RMA - 6 months

Z77E-ITX - PCIe slot failure - 3rd RMA - 3 months - The 4th board has been up and running for the last 4 months in a friends computer without issue thus far..fingers crossed...

The 1st two RMAs with them were outstanding, and were spaced about 2 years apart. I didn't mind the computer being down because the turnaround time wasn't much.

The last 4 became increasingly more of a PITA each time. I was just getting lead around in circles by being asked the same questions numerous times, asking for invoices or photos numerous times...when they were all part of the same e-mail log. It was extremely frustrating. The last RMA took over 2 months by time everything was said and done with the average time between e-mail responses being 3-4 days as opposed to the hours I knew they were once capable of...with the longest taking 3 weeks.

They also asked me to send my 3770k and Dominator Platinum RAM to them at one point...I told them they were out of their minds. I asked them if they were going to cover the loss/damage of my $500 worth of CPU/RAM if something unfortunate happened...they accepted the RMA with just the board









Due to the horrible luck I have had with them, I now avoid ASRock and purchase my CPUs and Motherboards from MicroCenter with their walk-in warranty. If I have a problem, I simply bring the board back, they give me exactly what I paid on a gift card, and I buy something new.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I have sworn off ASRock due to declining RMA support and continually receiving boards with the same problems.
> 
> 890FX Delux3 - PCIe slot failure - 1 RMA - 1 year - Still working in mother-in-law PC
> Z77 Extreme6 - PCIe slot Failure - 1st RMA - 6 months
> Z77 Extreme6 - RAM slots failure - 2nd RMA - 6 months - Board that I received from RMA wouldn't clock 2133 or 2400 RAM over 1866 speed.
> Z77E-ITX - PCIe slot failure - 1st RMA - 4 months
> Z77E-ITX - RAM slots failure - 2nd RMA - 6 months
> Z77E-ITX - PCIe slot failure - 3rd RMA - 3 months - The 4th board has been up and running for the last 4 months in a friends computer without issue thus far..fingers crossed...
> 
> The 1st two RMAs with them were outstanding, and were spaced about 2 years apart. I didn't mind the computer being down because the turnaround time wasn't much.
> 
> The last 4 became increasingly more of a PITA each time. I was just getting lead around in circles by being asked the same questions numerous times, asking for invoices or photos numerous times...when they were all part of the same e-mail log. It was extremely frustrating. The last RMA took over 2 months by time everything was said and done with the average time between e-mail responses being 3-4 days as opposed to the hours I knew they were once capable of...with the longest taking 3 weeks.
> 
> They also asked me to send my 3770k and Dominator Platinum RAM to them at one point...I told them they were out of their minds. I asked them if they were going to cover the loss/damage of my $500 worth of CPU/RAM if something unfortunate happened...they accepted the RMA with just the board
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Due to the horrible luck I have had with them, I now avoid ASRock and purchase my CPUs and Motherboards from MicroCenter with their walk-in warranty. If I have a problem, I simply bring the board back, they give me exactly what I paid on a gift card, and I buy something new.


I've heard nothing but good stories about MicroCenter. Too bad we live in BF rural Texas. The best we have is mail-order on just about everything.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> I've heard nothing but good stories about MicroCenter. Too bad we live in BF rural Texas. The best we have is mail-order on just about everything.


There is a chance that my ASRock experience is an isolated one, but to have the same exact issues like that consecutively makes me feel that it isn't. I typically have spare CPU/GPU/RAM/PSU lying around, and I make damn sure something is busted before I RMA...my other hardware wasn't the cause for the boards failing.

MicroCenter really does go out of their way to make you happy with your purchase. The people working there are actually knowledgeable and don't swarm around you like vultures that have just spotted a fresh carcass. Returns/exhchanges/warranty replacement are absolutely painless. They are also my favorite place to shop open box items. My wife's ultrabook and my ultrabook covertible I snatched both for 40% off MSRP...every few weeks they will drop the price a little further; IIRC both had 4-5 clearance mark down stickers on them.

If they happen to not have something in stock that they say they do, you can expect the royal treatment. This happened to me and a friend who were looking for a OCZ power supply about a year ago. They didn't have the 750W despite their stock showing like 5 of them...so they price matched NewEgg on the 850W, which was ~$20 less than their price, and took another 10% off.


----------



## Xoriam

I bought a Gigabyte G1 Sniper 3 Rev 1.0 Full ATX motherboard to swap with my Asrock z77 extreme 4m


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> There is a chance that my ASRock experience is an isolated one, but to have the same exact issues like that consecutively makes me feel that it isn't. I typically have spare CPU/GPU/RAM/PSU lying around, and I make damn sure something is busted before I RMA...my other hardware wasn't the cause for the boards failing.
> 
> MicroCenter really does go out of their way to make you happy with your purchase. The people working there are actually knowledgeable and don't swarm around you like vultures that have just spotted a fresh carcass. Returns/exhchanges/warranty replacement are absolutely painless. They are also my favorite place to shop open box items. My wife's ultrabook and my ultrabook covertible I snatched both for 40% off MSRP...every few weeks they will drop the price a little further; IIRC both had 4-5 clearance mark down stickers on them.
> 
> If they happen to not have something in stock that they say they do, you can expect the royal treatment. This happened to me and a friend who were looking for a OCZ power supply about a year ago. They didn't have the 750W despite their stock showing like 5 of them...so they price matched NewEgg on the 850W, which was ~$20 less than their price, and took another 10% off.


Wow! That's seriously good service.

As far as having the extras laying around, we've been on laptops for some time, and although I have spares hanging about for these (out of warranty anyway) after upgrades and all, these are the first PCs I've done since my Core2 box some years back. I had this one tested out in the Lian Li PC-Q18B chassis with the 4770K for about five weeks or so before the motherboard apparently warped on the outer edge near the power connector and outside RAM slot, and from then on failed to recognize the outer RAM stick, regardless of which. Then, it started not wanting to power up. That was the first RMA. The second one was faulty inside of the first twelve hours, and ASRock claimed it was new, but it was showing a really shoddy repair job in the region of the chokes, they were not in line, there was one solder ball on one, and signs they had scraped a solder ball off another next to the one with the solder ball. I still think that board had a contact on one or two of the chokes that was only partially soldered to the pad because of the angle. After several calls to ASRock's RMA guy, they still insisted it tested fine, and was new. So we had to then buy parts. Since by then the 4790K was cheaper, we bought that, and this time around bought the 16GB G.SKILL RipjawsX 2400, instead of the Team Vulcan 8GB 2400. Both had the same symptoms, which in a way was a relief, as I was half suspecting the 4770K or the Team Vulcan memory, because of the issue with the first board, thinking that it was possible they were damaged. The good news, is that the timeline for rotating the 4770K and Team Vulcan out to my wife is accelerated, the bad news is that expenses planned for later were accelerated. She'll have a kickin machine (it seems unnatural to not be able to use common colloquialisms here, but rules are rules). Anyhow, they must have verified my results, and they INSISTED that I send the 4770K and Team Vulcan RAM. They had better be returned undamaged today on the board arriving later today.

Anyhow, Since I had tested the original board with the 4770K for a month (250k in SETI to get me over a million), I know this one is a definite candidate for delidding. I'll be testing out the 4790K too, but we'll see on that, as it has never really been tested, other than for the few minutes it took for the motherboard fault to show.

Here's a pic of the chokes I suspect as the problem on the board I sent back to ASRock last week (if we weren't on a budget, it would have been sent back last year).


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Wow! That's seriously good service.
> 
> As far as having the extras laying around, we've been on laptops for some time, and although I have spares hanging about for these (out of warranty anyway) after upgrades and all, these are the first PCs I've done since my Core2 box some years back. I had this one tested out in the Lian Li PC-Q18B chassis with the 4770K for about five weeks or so before the motherboard apparently warped on the outer edge near the power connector and outside RAM slot, and from then on failed to recognize the outer RAM stick, regardless of which. Then, it started not wanting to power up. That was the first RMA. The second one was faulty inside of the first twelve hours, and ASRock claimed it was new, but it was showing a really shoddy repair job in the region of the chokes, they were not in line, there was one solder ball on one, and signs they had scraped a solder ball off another next to the one with the solder ball. I still think that board had a contact on one or two of the chokes that was only partially soldered to the pad because of the angle. After several calls to ASRock's RMA guy, they still insisted it tested fine, and was new. So we had to then buy parts. Since by then the 4790K was cheaper, we bought that, and this time around bought the 16GB G.SKILL RipjawsX 2400, instead of the Team Vulcan 8GB 2400. Both had the same symptoms, which in a way was a relief, as I was half suspecting the 4770K or the Team Vulcan memory, because of the issue with the first board, thinking that it was possible they were damaged. The good news, is that the timeline for rotating the 4770K and Team Vulcan out to my wife is accelerated, the bad news is that expenses planned for later were accelerated. She'll have a kickin machine (it seems unnatural to not be able to use common colloquialisms here, but rules are rules). Anyhow, they must have verified my results, and they INSISTED that I send the 4770K and Team Vulcan RAM. They had better be returned undamaged today on the board arriving later today.
> 
> Anyhow, Since I had tested the original board with the 4770K for a month (250k in SETI to get me over a million), I know this one is a definite candidate for delidding. I'll be testing out the 4790K too, but we'll see on that, as it has never really been tested, other than for the few minutes it took for the motherboard fault to show.
> 
> Here's a pic of the chokes I suspect as the problem on the board I sent back to ASRock last week (if we weren't on a budget, it would have been sent back last year).
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I never called, but it sounds like the same old song and dance.

That certainly doesn't look correct, and it does look like a bit of solder on the top of the choke...no good.

I do hope your hardware returns in the same condition that you sent it.

The 4790k's new thermal material definitely works better than the 4770k. I was able to get my 4790k to 4.7GHz, before delid, with only an H100 240mm radiator, with an H55 pump, and some crappy 1st gen Corsair radiator fans. This was absolutely the thermal limit for 100% load, but the older chips definitely were not capable of doing this.

Once I delidded the 4790k with CLU, it makes the same 4.7GHz with a 120mm radiator with a single 'weak' SilenX Effizio fan. Once again it is the thermal threshold for 100% load in IBT, but the processor won't be seeing those loads. I am pleased with how it acts with the small AIO setup for gaming and other normal activities.


----------



## Ceadderman

Chokes indeed look to be Fail (Genuflects in direction of ASUStek HQ), I am so glad that RoG boards typically do not suffer such haphazard build qualities. Yeah my Formula IV had issues right out of the factory,but they were solvable without having to ship it back to the mfr.









~Ceadder


----------



## kc5vdj

Well, ASRock sent another dud.

This evening, one (or more) of the MOSFETs on the motherboard FREAKING SMOKED.

The CPU fan, of course, made it to where it could be smelt at the desk, after the machine powered itself off, then refused to come on.

I checked all connections and cables. No messed up insulation, no short circuits. All connections were straight in, and seated.

I then pulled the motherboard, removed the heatsink, and examined the board. There were no obvious vaporized components. I then sniffed around. I found the source of the electronic smoke smell emanating from under the MOSFET heatsink on the motherboard. Out of fear of voiding the warranty, I will not remove this heatsink (four screws on the bottom of the motherboard) to determine which one(s) smoked. It should be obvious to find if I did, as the smell is strong.

I tested it on a secondary power supply. It attempted to power up, a fraction of a second later turned itself off, and refused to turn on again. This is the same symptom it had mounted and on the Corsair power supply.

Just to see if it made any difference, I hit the "Clear CMOS" button, then just for good measure, removed the battery for a few seconds, then put it back in.

This changed one thing. It no longer refuses to try to come on, but still powers off after a fraction of a second. Instead of refusing to try if the power button pins are shorted, it will try again with each "power switch press". I also notice that if you short the pins twice quickly, it will attempt again as soon as it gives up. Doing it more than twice doesn't matter. I guess this is some kind of debounce thing going on?

I've had it with ASRock. I will RMA this piece of junk, just like the previous two. We paid good money for the motherboard last year, and we want a freaking working one!!! I refuse to take this as a loss. As far as future purchases though, we will never buy ASRock again.

MY RECOMMENDATION IS DO NOT BUY ASROCK!

What sucks is that the CLU and ArcticClean came in, and I was going to delid the 4770K today or Monday. That's back on hold until we have a working freaking motherboard.

I did all of our laptops with the CLU, and the Dell E5500's are showing good results. I'd say 8-10C below MX-4. Having an issue with it on the E6400 though. The GPU section ont the E6400 with the copper shim is working nice, but that one has the usual issue of the CPU cold plate being askew again, meaning I have to bend it yet again.


----------



## fleetfeather

Lol unlucky experience = condemn the brand

Component failures happen. You'd hope someone with older E6400 chips would understand...


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Well, ASRock sent another dud.
> 
> This evening, one (or more) of the MOSFETs on the motherboard FREAKING SMOKED.
> 
> The CPU fan, of course, made it to where it could be smelt at the desk, after the machine powered itself off, then refused to come on.
> 
> I checked all connections and cables. No messed up insulation, no short circuits. All connections were straight in, and seated.
> 
> I then pulled the motherboard, removed the heatsink, and examined the board. There were no obvious vaporized components. I then sniffed around. I found the source of the electronic smoke smell emanating from under the MOSFET heatsink on the motherboard. Out of fear of voiding the warranty, I will not remove this heatsink (four screws on the bottom of the motherboard) to determine which one(s) smoked. It should be obvious to find if I did, as the smell is strong.
> 
> I tested it on a secondary power supply. It attempted to power up, a fraction of a second later turned itself off, and refused to turn on again. This is the same symptom it had mounted and on the Corsair power supply.
> 
> Just to see if it made any difference, I hit the "Clear CMOS" button, then just for good measure, removed the battery for a few seconds, then put it back in.
> 
> This changed one thing. It no longer refuses to try to come on, but still powers off after a fraction of a second. Instead of refusing to try if the power button pins are shorted, it will try again with each "power switch press". I also notice that if you short the pins twice quickly, it will attempt again as soon as it gives up. Doing it more than twice doesn't matter. I guess this is some kind of debounce thing going on?
> 
> I've had it with ASRock. I will RMA this piece of junk, just like the previous two. We paid good money for the motherboard last year, and we want a freaking working one!!! I refuse to take this as a loss. As far as future purchases though, we will never buy ASRock again.
> 
> MY RECOMMENDATION IS DO NOT BUY ASROCK!
> 
> What sucks is that the CLU and ArcticClean came in, and I was going to delid the 4770K today or Monday. That's back on hold until we have a working freaking motherboard.
> 
> I did all of our laptops with the CLU, and the Dell E5500's are showing good results. I'd say 8-10C below MX-4. Having an issue with it on the E6400 though. The GPU section ont the E6400 with the copper shim is working nice, but that one has the usual issue of the CPU cold plate being askew again, meaning I have to bend it yet again.


I understand that you're angry, but it's time to cut your losses and buy something else.

After ASRock did themselves in, I was recommending ASUS or Gigabyte only. I've never personally been fond of MSI motherboards; GPUs are a different story.

But, ASUS *really* ground my gears last March and I absolutely refuse to ever purchase ASUS products again. They got me so angry I literally sold everything ASUS I owned; except for the motherboard in my main rig. I sold my laptop, netbook, router, USB bluetooth unit, monitors, HD 7870 & GT 640 GPUs, external CD/DVD burners, and a Z77 Pro board. All of these items were in perfect working order too...

So now I'm down to Gigabyte as my recommendation for motherboards. I may even give MSI a shot at some point simply to avoid ASUS. I recently did an RMA with Gigabyte and it was perfect...hopefully if I run into anymore issues with their products it will continue to be this way.


----------



## JVene

I'd like to see a write in campaign about kc5vdj's motherboard problem.

It sounds like a typical scenario where a large company, focused on getting products through production and on the shelf, has let the repair and service department fall apart.

Lots of members here have ASRock boards, and for years they've been good price point / feature set propositions. How about we band together and complain in unison to ASRock about kc5vdj's problem, if only to see if we can protect our own investments in ASRock based systems?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Lol unlucky experience = condemn the brand
> 
> Component failures happen. You'd hope someone with older E6400 chips would understand...


I don't normally do that. After three boards (two of which RMA replacements for the first), I start blaming the brand, especially after hearing about other people having similar issues.

Oh, and I was referring to the Dell E6400. A laptop well-known to have heat issues, that has a heatsink the requires manual bending to even get seated flat on the cpu, while remaining flat on the GPU, which requires a copper shim.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Lots of members here have ASRock boards, and for years they've been good price point / feature set propositions.


This is the precise reason I chose them to begin with. I was also planning to rotate this one out to my wife, and buy the Fatal1ty Z97 Pro next month, because I can't find another board out there with it's feature set, one other comes close, but lacks the second ethernet, and is about $100 more.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> This is the precise reason I chose them to begin with. I was also planning to rotate this one out to my wife, and buy the Fatal1ty Z97 Pro next month, because I can't find another board out there with it's feature set, one other comes close, but lacks the second ethernet, and is about $100 more.


Similar to why I got the Extreme6 6 weeks ago, and the fact I had two really long lasting boards. When the products come out working, they're quite a good deal. Their designs and feature combinations are really tough to match. I was sold on 12 phase power and 10 sata ports (with other interesting options), along with nice, clean audio.

I think management needs to learn that the public has become aware of RMA / repair nightmares. I would assume those involved in returning bad boards to you have kept that quiet to avoid ticking off their boss, but at this point the boss (and bosses going upwards) need to be ticked off.

Frankly, I've not had an RMA with ASRock, and I'll bet it's not that common.


----------



## D33G33

Boop

Decided to delid and lap my 4790k





and temp difference before and after.


4.9ghz @ 1.3vcore adaptive mode, cooled by a H100i with Quiet Edition fans in push.


----------



## skupples

Very nice!


----------



## sharkforce

How much better performance will I get switching to CLP from Gelid Extreme? I ordered a tube of CLP just to try it out but I wont be able to use it until my motherboard comes back from Gigabyte....


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> Boop
> 
> Decided to delid and lap my 4790k
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and temp difference before and after.
> 
> 
> 4.9ghz @ 1.3vcore adaptive mode, cooled by a H100i with Quiet Edition fans in push.[/quote
> 
> Nice. Your before temps weren't too bad, but after actually takes it into spec at full load.


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Nice. Your before temps weren't too bad, but after actually takes it into spec at full load.


Yeah personally in a synthetic benchmark im comfortable with 80, maybe 85 peak because real world is closer to 15-20degree less with the exception of rendering.

The issue with this build is it will be in the NCASE M1 and heat could be a serious issue.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sharkforce*
> 
> How much better performance will I get switching to CLP from Gelid Extreme? I ordered a tube of CLP just to try it out but I wont be able to use it until my motherboard comes back from Gigabyte....


potentially 5-10C ish but i've seen numbers move around so but it should be a noticeable decrease


----------



## kc5vdj

Well, this time, ASRock was cool enough to send me a prepaid shipping label. Looks like I have to arrange a FedEx pickup.


----------



## Ceadderman

Thatms awesome.

I realize this is a bit late, but I feel that it needs to be pointed out that MB's like any component have an expected failure rate and that it affects every manufacturer across the standard. Sadly this cannot be helped beforehand because WE are at the first line because we as Enthusiasts typically get our hands on newer tech only after aftermarket manufacturers like EK, Mips, Corsair etc. I think that the EFR for MBs' is something like 3 of every 25. So if 2500 boards are produced, we should expect a differential of 300/350. Since we know that the number for that particular board is exponentially higher than my posted rate, there is always a good chance of catching a Bum from the getgo. This does not excuse ASRock for poor followthrough in the RMA process, since they SHOULD test their replacements before shipping them out. I only mention this because being the first in line we should learn to temper our expectations.

I will be the first to admit that I sometimes fail to do so, because like anyone that buys a product, I am quite disappointed when my new hardware is Fail.









~Ceadder


----------



## drop24

Is there any point to going to water cooling once delidded or are you running into diminishing returns and air coolers are adequate?


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drop24*
> 
> Is there any point to going to water cooling once delidded or are you running into diminishing returns and air coolers are adequate?


Is there any point NOT to? Quieter, easily maintained(AiO) and better results than MOST Air setups, w/o the added weight of even the best Air Coolers. So yes I would say there are benefits to water over air. The issue is more what you're willing to spend.

I started out slow with an H50. Got great temps from it and decided after a year and went Custom. Now whenever I upgrade I don't have to spend a Mint replacing coolers. Just change the tubing and sell whatever I don't need because WC'ing parts hold their resale value better than Air coolers. Of course I only use distilled w/no dyes.









~Ceadder


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drop24*
> 
> Is there any point to going to water cooling once delidded or are you running into diminishing returns and air coolers are adequate?


I'm among those that avoid water. Leaks and problems are rare, but if it happened in my rig I'd be mad at myself for it.

Noctua D15 and Phanteks TCP14PE are widely known to exceed most of the low end AIO, matching some of the best regarded like H100 within 1 or 2C.

That said, nothing from the AIO or high end air can match a good custom loop.


----------



## drop24

Thanks for the varying opinions. Now if you want to do direct die mounting what coolers have a mount that can do that? I know EK makes a special kit for it so I'd imagine most can't do it out if the box?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drop24*
> 
> Thanks for the varying opinions. Now if you want to do direct die mounting what coolers have a mount that can do that? I know EK makes a special kit for it so I'd imagine most can't do it out if the box?


EK makes a $4 upgrade kit, but could be accomplished with spacers between the backplate and mobo


----------



## FragZero

I removed the IHS of my 4690K last saterday. Really easy with a thin knife! Removing an Athlon 64 IHS was a lot harder, there is so much room between the IHS and the cpu.


----------



## JVene

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FragZero*
> 
> I removed the IHS of my 4690K last saterday. Really easy with a thin knife! Removing an Athlon 64 IHS was a lot harder, there is so much room between the IHS and the cpu.


Isn't the Athlon 64 soldered?

What? A KNIFE! Commando!

Did you skin your own dinner, too?


----------



## levalencia

I cant find the translation of delidding, I am spanish speaker, what is the meaning of delidding?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *levalencia*
> 
> I cant find the translation of delidding, I am spanish speaker, what is the meaning of delidding?


The thought process goes through these steps:

"lid" -> "lidding" -> "delidding"

A "lid" is a cover. The dictionary says it's "tapa" in Spanish.

In English, when you add "-ing" to a word describing an object, that turns it into an action you do with that object. This means "lidding", even if it's a weird word for this, means something similar to "to cover". The dictionary says that's "cubrir" or "tapar" in Spanish.

In English, when you add "de-" to something describing an action, this means reversing that action. In this case this means "delidding" is supposed to mean removing the "lid" from the CPU.

Perhaps the meanings compare like this, English to Spanish:

lid -> lidding -> delidding
tapa -> tapar -> destapar

?

*EDIT:* Note, this is only an explanation why people know the meaning of the word when they read it. The word "lidding" (or "delidding") is definitely strange. You don't use it in normal English.


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *levalencia*
> 
> I cant find the translation of delidding, I am spanish speaker, what is the meaning of delidding?


removing the ihs from an ivy bridge processor.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> removing the ihs from an ivy bridge processor.


or haswell? Devils canyon


----------



## sinnedone

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *levalencia*
> 
> I cant find the translation of delidding, I am spanish speaker, what is the meaning of delidding?


Quitando la tapa de metal encima de el procesador.(cpu)

Se hace para cambiar la pasta thermal y bajar temperaturas.


----------



## FragZero

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JVene*
> 
> Isn't the Athlon 64 soldered?
> 
> What? A KNIFE! Commando!
> 
> Did you skin your own dinner, too?


The S939 Athlons were not, i think they did solder the AM2 ones.

And yes with a knife, i had one of those suggested tools (which i also used on the Athlon i did) but then i realised we had a thinner knife which i could make just as sharp (using an automatic knife sharpener).


----------



## DirektEffekt

Hi guys, I just wanted to hear some experience of people using GC extreme in their delidded CPU since it's all I can get my hands on immediately and would like to Do it to my 4790K.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Hi guys, I just wanted to hear some experience of people using GC extreme in their delidded CPU since it's all I can get my hands on immediately and would like to Do it to my 4790K.


it works pretty well, but temps will be better with CLU/P but accessibility is your thing so extreme will do the job well for you.


----------



## sharkforce

I Got a new case and my motherboard back from Gigabyte. Gigabyte fixed my misaligned pins, 2.5 weeks later! but I cant complain because it works again! am running on Coolaboratory Liquid Pro and I am impressed by this stuff







. it went on real easily onto the die and was easy to spread. Running EK supremacy + Naked mount. I unfortunately did not receive much gains over the Gelid extreme at idle, both are pretty much room temperature anyways so cant go much lower. but it appears with the CLP all 4 cores minimum temperatures are closer together/less gradient.




I still need to overclock it again and stress test it to see what the max temps are.
4.5GHz: 1.25V

not bad considering my old temps were:


edit: for fairness I realized when i Had done that burn test i was using auto voltage.
here is my temps with auto voltage now on CLP: Still a very nice 5 to 9C improvement with CLP.


overall just glad to have a computer again.


----------



## mxthunder

Just delidded my 4790K. Saw a 25*C drop in temps.

Again, I must say, vice only method FTW.


----------



## Ceadderman

That is a nice Vice. Gotta get me one o those.









~Ceadder


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> Just delidded my 4790K. Saw a 25*C drop in temps.
> 
> Again, I must say, vice only method FTW.


Good clean job. Totally agree with the vice only method.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> it works pretty well, but temps will be better with CLU/P but accessibility is your thing so extreme will do the job well for you.


Thanks, I shall be doing this as soon as my new case gets here! Vice-only FTW!


----------



## trevorludgate

OCN name: trevorludgate
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Indigo XS
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: 4.7GHz (reached 4.9GHz in the past but never validated - I will if I get the time)
Temp drops: ~10 degrees C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jvn4nn

I was running 4.9GHz before delidding and temperature wasen't a limiting factor for OCing. So no MHz gained (running a bit lower actually for long-term stability) but temps dropped 10 degrees

Plenty of pics in my build log for another system. Delid count is at 3 right now









BLOODY OBSIDIAN - A Budget-less Mini-ITX Build & Mods

started on 02/22/15
•

last post 03/06/15 at 7:45pm
•

18 replies
•

2277 views

Cheers


----------



## mxthunder

Learned a lesson today. Read on here that you should not use CLU on aluminum or copper. Realized I had used it on my 3770k/hyper 212+. I went to remove it -it was fine when I initially pulled the unit off, but as I started to rub it off, the following happened!!!!!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mxthunder*
> 
> Learned a lesson today. Read on here that you should not use CLU on aluminum or copper. Realized I had used it on my 3770k/hyper 212+. I went to remove it -it was fine when I initially pulled the unit off, but as I started to rub it off, the following happened!!!!!


Wow! I thought those other videos on Youtube where they dissolve Coke cans etc. with a lot of gallium, those would not quite apply because there's such a tiny amount of CLU between the CPU and cooler, so it's excellent that you produced your video.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

The copper is fine, the issue is that Gallium reacts with Aluminum to form an amalgam, which is very brittle.
Nickel and Copper are both safe to use.

But yeah, sad to see such accidental gore


----------



## drop24

Has anyone mounted a delidded CPU with Swiftech's H220-X liquid cooler? I'm wondering what I'll need to do to account for the missing IHS. Could it be as simple as adding some thick washers under the back plate?


----------



## boogerlad

No change necessary, as long as you removed the lga mounting bracket on the motherboard as well.


----------



## s74r1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drop24*
> 
> Has anyone mounted a delidded CPU with Swiftech's H220-X liquid cooler? I'm wondering what I'll need to do to account for the missing IHS. Could it be as simple as adding some thick washers under the back plate?


it's spring mounted, so it should work fine but with a little less tension. you could always put an extra washer or two under every spring if you want the same pressure. be careful about core cracking though

Edit: putting washers under the backplate would make them not line up right in the holes i think


----------



## Ceadderman

That's a deal breaker right there if there ever was one.

Sucks man.

On a positive note...

WARRANTY BUSTED!









Okay now that I made you cry/laugh, I hope that you have a stock cooler laying around to get you back up until you get a replacement.









~Ceadder


----------



## drop24

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> it's spring mounted, so it should work fine but with a little less tension. you could always put an extra washer or two under every spring if you want the same pressure. be careful about core cracking though
> 
> Edit: putting washers under the backplate would make them not line up right in the holes i think


The way I see it you have to get the block closer to the PCB due to the lack of IHS in there. Moving the backplate away from the PCB with washers makes sense to me but maybe I'm not visualizing it right. I don't know what washers under the spring would accomplish.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *drop24*
> 
> The way I see it you have to get the block closer to the PCB due to the lack of IHS in there. Moving the backplate away from the PCB with washers makes sense to me but maybe I'm not visualizing it right. I don't know what washers under the spring would accomplish.


Actually, because it is spring loaded, it likely wouldn't even need the mounting mechanism adjusted at all. But what you will need to do is remove the bracket that normally holds the CPU in the socket. This bracket will prevent the waterblock from touching the die if it's left in place. Washers under the springs accomplishes the same as moving the backplate back, since it moves the block closer to the board. You will find either of those options difficult on the Swiftech, however, as their mounting hardware is not as easily customised, spacing the backplate would make it difficult to align the holes and you would need to tamper with the nuts to add washers under the springs.


----------



## drop24

Thanks for the reply. I see what you're saying about aligning the washers. I'll give a shot unaltered.


----------



## BoatOnGoat

Delidding my 4770k this weekend! I'll be posting all the "scientific data" this Saturday!

Plan to use hammer-vice method. Perhaps vice only method if I feed more comfortable once seeing it in the vice.

I ordered some CLU for the Die to IHS contact.

Then, some AS5 for the IHS to EK-Waterblock (nickel plated).

Everything here sound good to go? Any recommendations?


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> Delidding my 4770k this weekend! I'll be posting all the "scientific data" this Saturday!
> 
> Plan to use hammer-vice method. Perhaps vice only method if I feed more comfortable once seeing it in the vice.
> 
> I ordered some CLU for the Die to IHS contact.
> 
> Then, some AS5 for the IHS to EK-Waterblock (nickel plated).
> 
> Everything here sound good to go? Any recommendations?


Sounds good same CLU and AS5 on my 3570k with H220 COOLER


----------



## mxthunder

If you have the right kind of vice I would strongly suggest vice only.


----------



## fleetfeather

AS5 = mission abort.

Would grab some Phobya HeGrease Extreme instead if you're ballin' on a budget. It's rebranded Gelid GC-Extreme, which is considered one of the better non-conductive TIMs around


----------



## junkerde

as5 used to be the go back in the day, now there are better options, i think the mx-4 has taken its place


----------



## Ceadderman

Check my Sig for the 80way TIM comparison. It's an old comparison, but such a solid one that there is NOTHING as relevant since as far as I know. Yes there are new TIM options that didn't make the list('09) but it's hard to beat AS5. Only one is rated the same and that's because it is a ~8hr cure time compared to AS5's insane cure time. That is G751.

Now I won't knock anyone for using something different, but I think MX4 is hanging round the top of the list because it like G751 has a shorter cure time and produces similar results. I seriously doubt that it's "better". TIM is subjective imho.










~Ceadder


----------



## Jimbags

As long as the one you use to replace the Intel crap is something like CLU and the stuff for the ihs to cpu cooler isnt cheap trash, then should be all good.


----------



## BoatOnGoat

I'm not too worried about the AS5... I was thinking Gelid Extreme but I'm not sure yet. (I also have a tube of that from the EK waterblock installs). I was more concerned about the process directly involving the Die.


----------



## Ceadderman

use CLU. :thumb.

~Ceadder


----------



## BoatOnGoat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> use CLU. :thumb.
> 
> ~Ceadder


2 questions. When you orient the processor in the vice, which way is it?

I have the nickel plated supremacy evo. Should I really be using the CLU between the IHS and the water block in addition to the original (Die and IHS).


----------



## drop24

CLU is said to be great with Nickel blocks.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

I cant answer #1, but with the heatspreader/waterblock it doesn't matter too much, i just used Gelid Extreme and its worked great.
CLU is safe for use with Copper and Nickle tho it may cause slight pitting, which can usually be buffed out
But i think for best results with CLU you'd want to lap the IHS to bare copper.


----------



## fleetfeather

I have nickel blocks. I use CLU between die and IHS, and MX4 or HeGrease (whichever tube I pick up first) between IHS and block


----------



## BoatOnGoat

Success with the Delid! Cleaned up and taking a lunch break...

Next: CLU on die, AS5 on IHS. Pictures tonight (with immediate results).


----------



## jagdtigger

Greetings







.

I just done with my i5 and its worth the trouble. This is a pic before delidding:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1201829/msi_forum/screenshot01.png

And now after 15 min p95(in-place large fft's):
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1201829/OCN/delid.png

Bare chip with the old "paste":
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1201829/OCN/i5_4670k_delidded/20150226_164446.jpg

OCN name: jagdtigger
CPU: i5 4670k
on die-TIM: AC MX4
ihs-TIM: AC MX4
Mhz gained: 0 (dont have time to start OC-ing again)
OC after delid: 4,5 GHz (same as before)
Temp drops: ~10 °C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/snbp2p


----------



## BoatOnGoat

Finished!



I actually cut a piece of electrical tape to put over the circuits next to the die...

Vice and hammer method worked for me! Tried the vice only but I felt like the PCB was flexing...

OCN name: BoatOnGoat
CPU: i7 4770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.2GHz @ 1.175v
Temp drops: ~15C @ load
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/5w4q1l


----------



## GaMbi2004

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> Finished!
> 
> 
> 
> I actually cut a piece of electrical tape to put over the circuits next to the die...
> 
> Vice and hammer method worked for me! Tried the vice only but I felt like the PCB was flexing...
> 
> OCN name: BoatOnGoat
> CPU: i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.2GHz @ 1.175v
> Temp drops: ~15C @ load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/5w4q1l


Looks like a good delid!
Good job m8! congrats!

Temp drop aint too bad ether..


----------



## bbbbburton

Probably not a good thing i came across this thread... Can see myself ripping the IHS off of my 4670k sometime soon
















Currently @ 4.1GHz, 1.105v Intel Burn Test takes it to 70C. Isnt too bad considering the overclock I guess. Always want to push it further though


----------



## NIK1

Just wondering if I should redo my application of liquid ultra on my delided 3570k I did over a year ago. I am getting a Swiftech H240x water cooler soon and since I am taking off the h100,should I redo the ultra or just leave it.Someone here said it dries out overtime.My idle temps are 29-30 cel and when priming its at 60-63 cel. The cpu is oc to 4.6 at 1.25 volts.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Your temps are still good, there's no need to replace the CLU,
Ive also heard that CLP is more likely to dry out than CLU, so you should be fine either way.
Personally, I'd keep it as-is.


----------



## NIK1

Thanks,I will leave it as is....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jagdtigger*
> 
> Greetings
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> I just done with my i5 and its worth the trouble. This is a pic before delidding:
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1201829/msi_forum/screenshot01.png
> 
> And now after 15 min p95(in-place large fft's):
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1201829/OCN/delid.png
> 
> Bare chip with the old "paste":
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1201829/OCN/i5_4670k_delidded/20150226_164446.jpg
> 
> OCN name: jagdtigger
> CPU: i5 4670k
> on die-TIM: AC MX4
> ihs-TIM: AC MX4
> Mhz gained: 0 (dont have time to start OC-ing again)
> OC after delid: 4,5 GHz (same as before)
> Temp drops: ~10 °C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/snbp2p


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









<.< should use other stuff besides MX4.... buuuuuuuuut up to you i suppose








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BoatOnGoat*
> 
> Finished!
> 
> 
> 
> I actually cut a piece of electrical tape to put over the circuits next to the die...
> 
> Vice and hammer method worked for me! Tried the vice only but I felt like the PCB was flexing...
> 
> OCN name: BoatOnGoat
> CPU: i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.2GHz @ 1.175v
> Temp drops: ~15C @ load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/5w4q1l


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Tamuro

I have run into a problem. I delidded my 3770k and when I put everything back together I do not get any signal to my monitors if I use more that one stick of my RAM. I currently am using 2x4g of Corsair Vengeance memory and both sticks work in any DIMM slot as long as I use just one stick. If I use both sticks in any configuration I will not get any signal on my monitor.

Any suggestions?


----------



## scorpscarx

Sorry that happened to you, but throughout the thread there are stories of people losing dual channel mode after delidding. Could be dust in the ram seats, but is probably just a bad delid, what method did you use?


----------



## Tamuro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> Sorry that happened to you, but throughout the thread there are stories of people losing dual channel mode after delidding. Could be dust in the ram seats, but is probably just a bad delid, what method did you use?


Yeah I was afraid of that. I used the vice method and I did chip the PCB on the edge.


----------



## scorpscarx

Thanks for the pictures, that's a real shame.

I'd try flattening that out or pushing it down somehow and maybe putting some electrical tape cutout to try and seal it.

I had some pcb chip off similiar to that but on the corner and it did'nt go in and produce that bulging effect.


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamuro*
> 
> I have run into a problem. I delidded my 3770k and when I put everything back together I do not get any signal to my monitors if I use more that one stick of my RAM. I currently am using 2x4g of Corsair Vengeance memory and both sticks work in any DIMM slot as long as I use just one stick. If I use both sticks in any configuration I will not get any signal on my monitor.
> 
> Any suggestions?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> A RAM FIX
> 
> I did have a problem with my ASUS Z87 deluxe mobo. Since the cpu assembly was slightly thinner, not all of the pins were touching and B1, B2 ram slots were not working, leaving me with single channel ram. I put paper shims (just 1 thick) on the heat spreader tabs and that fixed the problem. After I did this I noticed the likely adjustable screw on the front of the clamp, but why fix what aint broke?
> 
> following not part of my quote from like a year ago:
> 
> I had a similar problem and the fix is cheap to try. The "sheet" was actually laminated so it was twice? as thick as regular paper. The fix still works. I did have to reapply the clp a couple of weeks ago as I went through another round of overclocking after picking up a much more precise power supply and dried it by running the cpu 1.5v+ and - all morning and my sli got buggy (the reapply worked).
> If you're careful with the liquid metal (and don't mess up the mobo with too much shimming) the most you have to lose is time.


----------



## Tamuro

Ok after further testing it appears that the first two DIMM slots are what stopped working. So I can still use 2 DIMM but it will be in single channel, not dual.

Might have to reapply either the CLU on the die or the AS5 in between the IHS and cooler because I only dropped between 5c and 10c. Still good temps however, but I was expecting a little more drop.

4.6mhz @1.344v Prime95:

-After delid
Core 0 - 74c
Core 1 - 78c
Core 2 - 77c
Core 3 - 74c

-Before delid
Core 0 - 82c
Core 1 - 88c
Core 2 - 86c
Core 3 - 79c


----------



## Dry Bonez

why is everyone delidding? just curious to know even though i delidded. but i would like to know what is the real true purpose.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> why is everyone delidding? just curious to know even though i delidded. but i would like to know what is the real true purpose.


To replace the poorly performing thermal paste of Ivy, Haswell and Devils Canyon CPUs to get better temps to allow for higher overclocks.

Even though i haven't pushed my 4770K past it's 4.4GHz overclock, even after delid, I was able to drop load temps from the mid 80's down to the mid 60's. That's also going from an H100i to a custom loop.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> why is everyone delidding? just curious to know even though i delidded. but i would like to know what is the real true purpose.


I flipped out when summer came around last year. There were suspicious program crashes, and I noticed "WHEA-Logger" warnings had started showing up in the Windows Event Viewer. Where I'm living no one has AC, so summer meant that room temperatures went up by 10 C or so compared to normal. That was apparently enough for the overclock settings to not work right anymore.

It was fixed by adding about 0.01V to Vcore (I don't remember), but I didn't like the thought that the temperatures were influencing stability and that's what pushed me to delid.

It's fun to be able to play with higher voltages now, so I don't regret it, but I guess things are objectively still a bit pointless. I think it's only about 0.1 or 0.2 GHz added speeds that are reasonably possible? That shouldn't be anything that can be felt in practice.


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> why is everyone delidding? just curious to know even though i delidded. but i would like to know what is the real true purpose.


I could barely hold 4.5(1,2) 4.4(3rd & 4th cores) due to thermals with a next to bottom 120mm closed loop water cooling. I ran it at 4.3 and 4.2. Now I hold 4.7(1,2,3,4) at 1.32v and can't hit 70c unless I turn off the fans on that same cooler. I'd do more, but +150watts for everyday makes me apprehensive. My chip hits a wall at 5.0 but it's not a thermal one. A couple of posts ago I stated I was running it at 1.5v - that was to get a good 4.9ghz and the temps didn't throttle. but the clp dried.
So I did it to make my chip faster and it seemed like a bold way to customize my computer. (I was dazzled at the idea of liquid metal for heat transfer too). I also like that my 4770k holds even with typical 4790k's, at least from what I've heard. And it made my hobby more fun.


----------



## Dry Bonez

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> I could barely hold 4.5(1,2) 4.4(3rd & 4th cores) due to thermals with a next to bottom 120mm closed loop water cooling. I ran it at 4.3 and 4.2. Now I hold 4.7(1,2,3,4) at 1.32v and can't hit 70c unless I turn off the fans on that same cooler. I'd do more, but +150watts for everyday makes me apprehensive. My chip hits a wall at 5.0 but it's not a thermal one. A couple of posts ago I stated I was running it at 1.5v - that was to get a good 4.9ghz and the temps didn't throttle. but the clp dried.
> So I did it to make my chip faster and it seemed like a bold way to customize my computer. (I was dazzled at the idea of liquid metal for heat transfer too). I also like that my 4770k holds even with typical 4790k's, at least from what I've heard. And it made my hobby more fun.


ok, this is what bothers me...how do people say they dont reach a certain degree and i cant say that... for example, i have a 4670k, an paired with a Swiftech H220X. beore delidding i was in the 70-90 full load, now im at 60 wont get to 70 depending on the program. When i use prime 95, it always says a thread cant start as if one of my cores are damaged if thats possible. Another thing i noticed is my mobo,i have an ASUS Z87 deluxe and on an old BIOS firmware because it is lierally the only one where i get good temps. IF i dare upgrade my bios firmware to any of the many, i get really high temps so i literally have to almost stay at stock firmware. At firt i thought it was my H220X but i delidded to try and find the cause. but i guess the only way would be new mobo and cpu, right?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> To replace the poorly performing thermal paste of Ivy, Haswell and Devils Canyon CPUs to get better temps to allow for higher overclocks.
> 
> Even though i haven't pushed my 4770K past it's 4.4GHz overclock, even after delid, I was able to drop load temps from the mid 80's down to the mid 60's. That's also going from an H100i to a custom loop.


hmmmm, so wait,you still got those high temps even with a H100i?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I flipped out when summer came around last year. There were suspicious program crashes, and I noticed "WHEA-Logger" warnings had started showing up in the Windows Event Viewer. Where I'm living no one has AC, so summer meant that room temperatures went up by 10 C or so compared to normal. That was apparently enough for the overclock settings to not work right anymore.
> 
> It was fixed by adding about 0.01V to Vcore (I don't remember), but I didn't like the thought that the temperatures were influencing stability and that's what pushed me to delid.
> 
> It's fun to be able to play with higher voltages now, so I don't regret it, but I guess things are objectively still a bit pointless. I think it's only about 0.1 or 0.2 GHz added speeds that are reasonably possible? That shouldn't be anything that can be felt in practice.


i can get to 4.6 with my 4670k but at 1.310V but i noticed i kinda need to raise the cache voltage which i always leave stock which is 1.050. So when i OC to 4.6, all i do is 1.310V and multiplier 46 without touchin cache...... do i need to touch that too?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> hmmmm, so wait,you still got those high temps even with a H100i?


Yup, my chip has always been on the warm side. I can run stable with OCCT+AVX 1.25V, and the H100i kept my CPU cool enough under gaming, usually 58-62C, something my old H60 failed to do (70s in game, 90+ in stress) at the same clocks, while I was in the middle of swapping/upgrading parts and waiting on water cooling parts to arrive.

Funnily enough, the same H60 was able to hold my 2600K at 4.4GHZ no problem, and in the same temperature ranges of my 4.4Ghz 4770K on the H100i.
I never tested the 4770K on the H100i after delidding, as I sold it as part of a system with the 2600k and R7970 that I used to pay for the watercooling.


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> ok, this is what bothers me...how do people say they dont reach a certain degree and i cant say that... for example, i have a 4670k, an paired with a Swiftech H220X. beore delidding i was in the 70-90 full load, now im at 60 wont get to 70 depending on the program. When i use prime 95, it always says a thread cant start as if one of my cores are damaged if thats possible. Another thing i noticed is my mobo,i have an ASUS Z87 deluxe and on an old BIOS firmware because it is lierally the only one where i get good temps. IF i dare upgrade my bios firmware to any of the many, i get really high temps so i literally have to almost stay at stock firmware. At firt i thought it was my H220X but i delidded to try and find the cause. but i guess the only way would be new mobo and cpu, right?
> hmmmm, so wait,you still got those high temps even with a H100i?
> i can get to 4.6 with my 4670k but at 1.310V but i noticed i kinda need to raise the cache voltage which i always leave stock which is 1.050. So when i OC to 4.6, all i do is 1.310V and multiplier 46 without touchin cache...... do i need to touch that too?


I use Aisuite, P95 and firestrike for cpu temps. I've never had a thread issue or noticed anything with ASUS Z87 deluxe bios updates which per ASUS were "to improve overclocking stability". I never saw any difference in performance from these updates, just an option or two rearranged in the bios, but maybe they actually fiddled with power delivery or something. The combination of those seems like a core issue since your cooler is better than mine (in sig). I've read in this thread that some people with hot single haswell cores are trying putting thin thermal tape in those little bits under the heat spreader to some degree of success. I also use the stepping, EPU and "optimize options in bios" settings on my board so my chip just goes 4.7 when it has to. Although I didn't notice too much difference in P95 temps when I was playing with these.
I speed up my cache just because I can. I saw a chart somewhere that showed that cache oc on haswells gave about the same benefit from +1ghz cache as about +0.1ghz core. So I think it is actually a little counterproductive since you can't get that much cache without giving back core due to temps and/or stability. But it irrationally makes me feel like my chip is faster so I oc mine 0.3ghz with +.2v offset - just giving details since we've got the same mobo.


----------



## Dry Bonez

wait a minute,you have the same mobo as me? the asus z87 deluxe??? dude! we need to talk. i havent found anyone with this mobo. Which firmware are you on? i am on 1405, it is almost stock. Any other firmware i get really high temps. I am not happy with that but maybe it is some settings. I heard it can be c states but idk what that is.


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> wait a minute,you have the same mobo as me? the asus z87 deluxe??? dude! we need to talk. i havent found anyone with this mobo. Which firmware are you on? i am on 1405, it is almost stock. Any other firmware i get really high temps. I am not happy with that but maybe it is some settings. I heard it can be c states but idk what that is.


ugh you bastard! I hadn't done stress testing in a long time and look at this can of worms you tempted me to open!

Screenshot14.jpg 3117k .jpg file


And I hadn't had any problems either. Why is my core voltage .11v higher than set? What could it have been when I had it set to 1.52v?







At least you've already given me the solution. Guess I'm going back to 1405. Maybe devils canyon compatibility messed it up.


----------



## rluker5

maybe I'll be the one getting thermal tape


----------



## jagdtigger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> ugh you bastard! I hadn't done stress testing in a long time and look at this can of worms you tempted me to open!
> 
> Screenshot14.jpg 3117k .jpg file
> 
> 
> And I hadn't had any problems either. Why is my core voltage .11v higher than set? What could it have been when I had it set to 1.52v?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least you've already given me the solution. Guess I'm going back to 1405. Maybe devils canyon compatibility messed it up.


Nice temps, mine would overheat in a matter of seconds at that voltage







.


----------



## rluker5

tried old bios. same results, but less stable. went back to new. dialed my cache back to stock. disappointing to learn that aisuite is in disagreement with other monitoring programs by 10c. but hey, why fix what ain't broke. I think I'll play games instead of worrying anymore.


----------



## Dry Bonez

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> tried old bios. same results, but less stable. went back to new. dialed my cache back to stock. disappointing to learn that aisuite is in disagreement with other monitoring programs by 10c. but hey, why fix what ain't broke. I think I'll play games instead of worrying anymore.


I have no choice but to be on old firmware. but im going to break night trying to get to the bottom of it.i am off the next 2 days and am determined to get it working.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jagdtigger*
> 
> Nice temps, mine would overheat in a matter of seconds at that voltage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


YES, yes indeed, those temps are way too sweet for that voltage. I just wonder if its delidded.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> ugh you bastard! I hadn't done stress testing in a long time and look at this can of worms you tempted me to open!
> 
> Screenshot14.jpg 3117k .jpg file
> 
> 
> And I hadn't had any problems either. Why is my core voltage .11v higher than set? What could it have been when I had it set to 1.52v?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least you've already given me the solution. Guess I'm going back to 1405. Maybe devils canyon compatibility messed it up.


do you have our chip delidded? I have mine delidded and honestly its a shame i still get crazy temps. What do you have your cashe voltage to?


----------



## rluker5

yes, delidded. clp inside, as5 outside, had cache at +.2v offset and my set voltage for the screenshot was 1.31 and aisuite said it was putting in 1.42v. that 1.52v was running firestrike which must be easier on my chip than p95. after I did that round, I noticed that I could turn off the demo and I wouldn't have to stress out so long maybe my chip is lucky. I'm still disappointed about the aisuite giving me false optimism about my cpu temp though. it ran cooler last year too.


----------



## Dry Bonez

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> yes, delidded. clp inside, as5 outside, had cache at +.2v offset and my set voltage for the screenshot was 1.31 and aisuite said it was putting in 1.42v. that 1.52v was running firestrike which must be easier on my chip than p95. after I did that round, I noticed that I could turn off the demo and I wouldn't have to stress out so long maybe my chip is lucky. I'm still disappointed about the aisuite giving me false optimism about my cpu temp though. it ran cooler last year too.


im similar to you. i have 4670k and delidded with CLP but with MX4... but when you say +.2v i dont understand that terminology. I am looking at my AISUITE and i know my voltage and thats all i raise but when going for 4.6 i need it at 1.3v but i know i need to up my cache voltage but idk whats good or not... that is why i kind of need your help since you have the same mobo. ESPECIALLY since you are on a new firmware. which firmware are you on? im on 11405 and i just downloaded the latest one which is 2103 and will be trying to upgrade it. i kno i will get really really high temps in doing so which i dont understand why.


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> I have no choice but to be on old firmware. but im going to break night trying to get to the bottom of it.i am off the next 2 days and am determined to get it working.
> YES, yes indeed, those temps are way too sweet for that voltage. I just wonder if its delidded.
> do you have our chip delidded? I have mine delidded and honestly its a shame i still get crazy temps. What do you have your cashe voltage to?


You know if it works fine, the old bios only changes the bios and its not that big a deal. it might not be worth trying to make something pretty good better than it might be able to be. like for example, I could push right up to 19k in firestrike, but not break it. I really wanted it but my rig just wouldn't give it up. eventually I got tired and accepted that I wouldn't be able to max out every game at 4k and maybe I should settle for useability. it turns out that my 780tis can be tuned to run most games basically max without a ton of power and heat and noise. even the metro series, if I settle for high instead of very high, isn't that bad.

spoiler.jpg 2168k .jpg file


my bios was set to 300w and the cards barely touched 60% of that, although they can't handle very high, my computer can stay civilized. And I can thank making the best of what I've got for that. (okay, I have to thank Skyn3t too, it was one of his bioses I tweaked just a little)

Don't force it too hard, that cpu is still good for a 390x (in the summer!). If anything try that thermal tape on the vrms or whatever they found works best.


----------



## Dry Bonez

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rluker5*
> 
> You know if it works fine, the old bios only changes the bios and its not that big a deal. it might not be worth trying to make something pretty good better than it might be able to be. like for example, I could push right up to 19k in firestrike, but not break it. I really wanted it but my rig just wouldn't give it up. eventually I got tired and accepted that I wouldn't be able to max out every game at 4k and maybe I should settle for useability. it turns out that my 780tis can be tuned to run most games basically max without a ton of power and heat and noise. even the metro series, if I settle for high instead of very high, isn't that bad.
> 
> spoiler.jpg 2168k .jpg file
> 
> 
> my bios was set to 300w and the cards barely touched 60% of that, although they can't handle very high, my computer can stay civilized. And I can thank making the best of what I've got for that. (okay, I have to thank Skyn3t too, it was one of his bioses I tweaked just a little)
> 
> Don't force it too hard, that cpu is still good for a 390x (in the summer!). If anything try that thermal tape on the vrms or whatever they found works best.


i actually do plan on gettinga 390X or 980Ti if they decide to bring that out. But what do you mean put tape on the vrms? i know what vrms are but i never heard of that.


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> im similar to you. i have 4670k and delidded with CLP but with MX4... but when you say +.2v i dont understand that terminology. I am looking at my AISUITE and i know my voltage and thats all i raise but when going for 4.6 i need it at 1.3v but i know i need to up my cache voltage but idk whats good or not... that is why i kind of need your help since you have the same mobo. ESPECIALLY since you are on a new firmware. which firmware are you on? im on 11405 and i just downloaded the latest one which is 2103 and will be trying to upgrade it. i kno i will get really really high temps in doing so which i dont understand why.


In the bios, just under the core voltage is the cache voltage and you can select cache voltage from auto to offset, and since I don't know what to set for cache with adaptive, I just add +.2v offset. I took that away (along with the +300mhz cache) earlier today though since it adds more to temps than performance. maybe I'll put it back, maybe not. the biggest way it mattered is that it gave me troubles when I first was overclocking.
The core is most important. This guy at work just built a rig with a 4690k and a 970 strix. that strix sounds like it is pretty awesome, but his 4690k is set at 4.6 with stock cache. his voltage is less than 1.3, but if your chip doesn't get too hot except when stress testing, 1.3 should be ok too. I've had more than 1.3v for a year.
Also I'm on 2103. hopefully your temps stay about the same, but if they don't you can always go back.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> i actually do plan on gettinga 390X or 980Ti if they decide to bring that out. But what do you mean put tape on the vrms? i know what vrms are but i never heard of that.


Haswell chips have a line of VRMs running down the left side of the CPU die, Devil's Canyon is the same, but with 2 solid lines running down the left side.
With Ivy Bridge, the VRM's are located on the motherboard, rather than the CPU.



Placing electrical tape or nail polish over them is a means to protect them from potential shorts if a conductive thermal paste used on the CPU die comes into contact with the VRMs directly


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dry Bonez*
> 
> i actually do plan on gettinga 390X or 980Ti if they decide to bring that out. But what do you mean put tape on the vrms? i know what vrms are but i never heard of that.


that thermal tape on the vrms was something some guy was trying on this thread and after following up, he was getting results that were a little mixed and he tried something else. so maybe it isn't that good. I was hopeful.


----------



## Tamuro

So now that after my delid dual channel memory no longer works, is that a hint at something else also being wrong. I did test my OC to see if it was still stable(which) it was but, it isn't like I ran it for hours upon hours.

Is there something else I should be testing for to see if there is any hidden issue other than the lack of dual channel function?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamuro*
> 
> So now that after my delid dual channel memory no longer works, is that a hint at something else also being wrong. I did test my OC to see if it was still stable(which) it was but, it isn't like I ran it for hours upon hours.
> 
> Is there something else I should be testing for to see if there is any hidden issue other than the lack of dual channel function?


Did you try what rluker5 mentioned in his post here: post #27096 ?


----------



## Tamuro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Did you try what rluker5 mentioned in his post here: post #27096 ?


Yeah I did. Still no luck. I can deal with not having dual channel I just wanna know if there are any other underlying issues. Will most likely just buy a new 3770k for piece of mind haha.


----------



## rluker5

drat!


----------



## stin0

Can anyone confirm that the Celeron 430 can indeed be used to practice delidding?








I've only found out about delidding a CPU yesterday but I'm already excited.

I wanna try delidding the Celeron 430 this sunday and if all goes well I'll delid my i5 4690K right after that and apply some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Can anyone confirm that the Celeron 430 can indeed be used to practice delidding?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've only found out about delidding a CPU yesterday but I'm already excited.
> 
> I wanna try delidding the Celeron 430 this sunday and if all goes well I'll delid my i5 4690K right after that and apply some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra.


I'll say this, is that celeron needed? or is it a junker? if its a junker then just attempt it anyways. The 430 is in the list on the OP so it should be good.







but remember always be careful!


----------



## illitirit

hey guys dont know where I should ask this but Ill go ahead and fire away here.

I recently delidded my 3770k and have not been seeing good temps. Granted I did not use CLU or CLP on the die, i was hoping for some better temps.

I am using a noctua nh d15 cooler so I am a bit disheartened by the results I have.

Currently cpu is @ 4.9ghz 1.330v

Load temps on prime 95 , the hottest core barely touches 90c.

I have reseated and reapplied TIM / HSF more than 10 times with same results.

Is it just the chip producing an absurd amount of heat at what im running it at?

If i were to use CLP / CLU on both die and IHS would that radically drop my temps?

I used noctua NT-H1 on both die and IHS. Maybe its not cutting it?

Also if i do buy CLP or CLU, which one is the best and which one should I buy?


----------



## deepor

Did you remove all of the black glue from the IHS and PCB?


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'll say this, is that celeron needed? or is it a junker? if its a junker then just attempt it anyways. The 430 is in the list on the OP so it should be good.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but remember always be careful!


Bought it for 2 bucks to practice with, so to me it's a junker








I also ordered my Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra, stuff costs like €10 for 1 gram. I'm expecting miracles!


----------



## illitirit

yes everything and cleaned with 99% iso alcohol


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *illitirit*
> 
> I used noctua NT-H1 on both die and IHS. Maybe its not cutting it?


It's a popular misunderstanding that people delid because the stock Intel TIM is poor quality and needs replacing. Certainly I can't imagine that NT-H1 (released in 2007) is any better.

The reason Ivy/Haswell chips run hot is because they are not soldered, so we recommend to use liquid metal because it's the closest thing you can get to a soldered chip.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

What would you guys use for removing clear nail polish from the caps on a 4790K? I'm going to be direct die cooling with an EK Supremacy EVO and the Naked Ivy kit, should I even bother with removal or leave the nail polish in place?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> What would you guys use for removing clear nail polish from the caps on a 4790K? I'm going to be direct die cooling with an EK Supremacy EVO and the Naked Ivy kit, should I even bother with removal or leave the nail polish in place?


leave it.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> leave it.


Good enough for me.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Well, this time, ASRock was cool enough to send me a prepaid shipping label. Looks like I have to arrange a FedEx pickup.


Just a heads-up, I'm probably going to be doing this with my i7-4790K fairly soon. After the third RMA with ASRock, we pretty much decided that we should just hold off on doing anything with that replacement board, and go with something a bit more reliable, so we got something nice for my box (See the rig I added to my sig). So much for ASRock saying it's our components causing their boards to fail. The LBBoA has lasted longer than the last two ASRock boards combined, and in the next few days, longer than all of the RMA replacement boards from ASRock combined.

Anyhow, I'm back on track, as long as Corsair is next month with shipping the H110i GT coolers.... If I can find someone with a smooth-jawed vise, I'll probably try the vise-only method.


----------



## kc5vdj

Does the rig show up this time?


----------



## LandonAaron

A few questions about this whole process:

Which side should I place away from me, if using the Vice + hit with wood method. If I understand correctly I should place end with the copper dots away from me and hit the side opposite that.



Also should the vice clamp onto the IHS on both sides?

What is better to use for protecting the VRM/ capacitors next to the CPU die: liquid electrical tape or clear nail polish?

I read somewhere that you should paint both the CPU die and the IHS where the CPU die will be contacting it with liquid metal. Is this correct? Seems in most videos I have watched they just did the die itself.

Do you immediately put the IHS back on after applying liquid metal, or do you need to let it dry a little first?

Finally what do yall think of this vice only method:



I like the idea of not having to hit my chip with something. Which side of the processor should be touching the vice with this method?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> A few questions about this whole process:
> 
> Which side should I place away from me, if using the Vice + hit with wood method. If I understand correctly I should place end with the copper dots away from me and hit the side opposite that.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also should the vice clamp onto the IHS on both sides?
> 
> What is better to use for protecting the VRM/ capacitors next to the CPU die: liquid electrical tape or clear nail polish?
> 
> I read somewhere that you should paint both the CPU die and the IHS where the CPU die will be contacting it with liquid metal. Is this correct? Seems in most videos I have watched they just did the die itself.
> 
> Do you immediately put the IHS back on after applying liquid metal, or do you need to let it dry a little first?
> 
> Finally what do yall think of this vice only method:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the idea of not having to hit my chip with something. Which side of the processor should be touching the vice with this method?


I am not going to tell you which side to hit, but I am fairly certain that you can figure it out if you know your intended goal completely and have an image of the final result (not my imgae)



Think about which direction the lid is going to be moving in relation to PCB and orient it in such a way that you have the most clearance when it starts moving. You can use the guide notches for orientation reference.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> A few questions about this whole process:
> 
> Which side should I place away from me, if using the Vice + hit with wood method. If I understand correctly I should place end with the copper dots away from me and hit the side opposite that.
> 
> 
> 
> Also should the vice clamp onto the IHS on both sides?
> 
> What is better to use for protecting the VRM/ capacitors next to the CPU die: liquid electrical tape or clear nail polish?
> 
> I read somewhere that you should paint both the CPU die and the IHS where the CPU die will be contacting it with liquid metal. Is this correct? Seems in most videos I have watched they just did the die itself.
> 
> Do you immediately put the IHS back on after applying liquid metal, or do you need to let it dry a little first?
> 
> Finally what do yall think of this vice only method:
> 
> 
> 
> I like the idea of not having to hit my chip with something. Which side of the processor should be touching the vice with this method?


On your picture hit the left side. You want the IHS to slide to the left so it doesn't hit the caps that are running down the left side of the die (in your picture). If you use th vice only method, clamp it so that the left side of the PCB is being pushed, with the right side of the IHS stationary. Again, making the IHS slide to the left in your picture. Although with the vice only method it probably won't move very much.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I am not going to tell you which side to hit, but I am fairly certain that you can figure it out if you know your intended goal completely and have an image of the final result (not my imgae)
> 
> 
> 
> Think about which direction the lid is going to be moving in relation to PCB and orient it in such a way that you have the most clearance when it starts moving. You can use the guide notches for orientation reference.


Thanks. Obviously I don't have X-ray vision, so the picture helps.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Thanks. Obviously I don't have X-ray vision, so the picture helps.


Yes.


----------



## LandonAaron

Thanks for clearing that up for me guys. I feel like I am pretty prepared for this knowledge wise. Now I just need my thermal pastes to arrive. Going to put Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra on the die, and IC Diamond between the IHS and heatsink. Still haven't decided what to use on the caps. I am leaning towards clear nail polish as that seems to be the most tried and tested.


----------



## rluker5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> A few questions about this whole process:
> 
> Which side should I place away from me, if using the Vice + hit with wood method. If I understand correctly I should place end with the copper dots away from me and hit the side opposite that.
> 
> 
> 
> Also should the vice clamp onto the IHS on both sides?
> 
> What is better to use for protecting the VRM/ capacitors next to the CPU die: liquid electrical tape or clear nail polish?
> 
> I read somewhere that you should paint both the CPU die and the IHS where the CPU die will be contacting it with liquid metal. Is this correct? Seems in most videos I have watched they just did the die itself.
> 
> Do you immediately put the IHS back on after applying liquid metal, or do you need to let it dry a little first?
> 
> Finally what do yall think of this vice only method:
> 
> 
> 
> I like the idea of not having to hit my chip with something. Which side of the processor should be touching the vice with this method?


Boy that looks a lot easier than my struggles with a razor!


----------



## wermad

Just did mine. It wasn't that bad loading under 70°C at stock. Block and vise method, icd7 on the die, mx3 on the block, dropped a good 10-12°C. Idle is in the high 20s vs the mid 30s.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Finally what do yall think of this vice only method:
> 
> 
> 
> I like the idea of not having to hit my chip with something. Which side of the processor should be touching the vice with this method?


The only method I ever liked for deliding. Problem is you need a vise with flat jaws otherwise it will put marks on the PCB side.
Both sides are touching the vise obviously. One sits on the metal HS the other on the PCB and you might have to turn it around to losen it more, which is what he does in the video too. Obviously one side is easy and carries minimum risk to damage the components on PCB, the other side is more tricky.

Although I still don't see a reason to delid especially when keeping the HS and only replacing the paste.


----------



## Tamuro

Well, I ended up just buying a new 3770k because I just didn't trust the last one after my bad delid. Boy did I get a nice chip this time around. I forgot to take a SS of temps before delidding but all 4 cores were in the upper 90's with the quick 4.9mhz I tried. After the delid I dropped to well below 70's. here are my results so far after about 12hours of Prime95 @5k

I was able to push it to 5.4 before I decided to hold off on finding the ceiling and just get a 24/7 OC to run.



http://imgur.com/SC1f0Mm


Not sure how to make linked image bigger.


----------



## feznz

jeez if no one else is going to say it I am jealous








I got a 5Ghz chip too but it takes 1.46v to get there if I had your chip I would be looking at 5.2Ghz for a daily OC


----------



## stin0

I got a free Celeron 430 to test a delid on.
I must say it went pretty smooth! Once you get all four corners the HIS comes off pretty easily; took me about 5 minutes.

I did scratch the HIS slightly which left some scratch marks, but when delidding my 4690K i'll probably be a lot more careful and take double or triple the time.



Now I have to ask myself wether I really want to delid my 4690K


----------



## Tamuro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> jeez if no one else is going to say it I am jealous
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got a 5Ghz chip too but it takes 1.46v to get there if I had your chip I would be looking at 5.2Ghz for a daily OC


Haha. I still need to play around with it some more to see what I can get out of it without voltage getting out of hand. When I ran it at 1.45v it was still pretty low on temps but I'm a little nervous about running the voltage that high for 24/7 use regardless of temps being within' reason.


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Now I have to ask myself wether I really want to delid my 4690K


If you do, don't use that blade, that is the wrong kind of razor.

I recommend either a thin matt cutter blade, or a thick double edged shaving blade.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> If you do, don't use that blade, that is the wrong kind of razor.
> 
> I recommend either a thin matt cutter blade, or a thick double edged shaving blade.


I agree with what he said, i picked up a 5 pack of thin razor blades and the holder for like 99c at the hardware store they're thin enough to prevent damage to the pcb from warping,
take a look at the razor and card method as well, using a razor on a single corner then using a thin laminated/ platic card to get beneath the IHS, it will hlelp prevent damage to the PCB and the VRMs on the side. its definitely safer than razor only.


----------



## incog

Didn't a hair dryer method make its appearance as well? That looked safer than both vice and razor, if memory serves.


----------



## GoLDii3

Anyone knows how much does Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra lasts? How muchtime before i have to reapply it again?


----------



## LandonAaron

Can you delid a first gen I7-920 or i7-965?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Can you delid a first gen I7-920 or i7-965?


Nope.

1st and 2nd Gen CPUs were both Soldered to the die, attempting to remove the IHS will most likely end up in death of the CPU.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Anyone knows how much does Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra lasts? How muchtime before i have to reapply it again?


I know the original CLP would dry out after a year, but i haven't heard any word about the lifespan of CLU


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Anyone knows how much does Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra lasts? How muchtime before i have to reapply it again?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I know the original CLP would dry out after a year, but i haven't heard any word about the lifespan of CLU


It's not technically 'drying', CLP absorbs metal from one of the surfaces and starts to become solid. It also happens with CLU if one of the surfaces is copper.

CLU between chip die and nickel (e.g. IHS underside) lasts a very long time. My i7-3770K was delidded like 2 years ago now; CLU is still liquid and the IHS is spinning freely.


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> It's not technically 'drying', CLP absorbs metal from one of the surfaces and starts to become solid. It also happens with CLU if one of the surfaces is copper.
> 
> CLU between chip die and nickel (e.g. IHS underside) lasts a very long time. My i7-3770K was delidded like 2 years ago now; CLU is still liquid and the IHS is spinning freely.


Yeah im asking this because i have it between die and IHS. Do you think temperatures would raise once the CLU needs to be replaced?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> Yeah im asking this because i have it between die and IHS. Do you think temperatures would raise once the CLU needs to be replaced?


Yes, you will certainly notice a temperature rise if the CLU starts to solidify.


----------



## Namkab

I need help I have no idea whats going on. I delidded my 4670k which is being cooled with an H75 and my prime95 temps are still 80C at stock clocks. I have no idea what is going on, I have re-applied thermal paste multiple times and every application is good and results are the same. The only thing I can think of is maybe its the thermal paste, I am using Arctic Alumina. I would never of thought thermal paste can be that horrible thats why I am not sure if its that or not. I really need a second opinion.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Namkab*
> 
> I need help I have no idea whats going on. I delidded my 4670k which is being cooled with an H75 and my prime95 temps are still 80C at stock clocks. I have no idea what is going on, I have re-applied thermal paste multiple times and every application is good and results are the same. The only thing I can think of is maybe its the thermal paste, I am using Arctic Alumina. I would never of thought thermal paste can be that horrible thats why I am not sure if its that or not. I really need a second opinion.


You really should look into using CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra between the IHS and CPU die. Ive found that pastes are hit and miss, even some of the best pastes don't hold up over time. (I eventually had to under-volt my CPU just to keep temps in check until my package of CLU arrived after only a month with Gelid Extreme...)

Definitely get CLU a shot.

Also what CPU voltages are you running?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Namkab*
> 
> I need help I have no idea whats going on. I delidded my 4670k which is being cooled with an H75 and my prime95 temps are still 80C at stock clocks. I have no idea what is going on, I have re-applied thermal paste multiple times and every application is good and results are the same. The only thing I can think of is maybe its the thermal paste, I am using Arctic Alumina. I would never of thought thermal paste can be that horrible thats why I am not sure if its that or not. I really need a second opinion.


h80 pump sensor cable connected to the CPU_Fan header? H80 pump power cable connected to your power supply (via SATA connection, IIRC)? Checked your cooler mount?


----------



## Namkab

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> h80 pump sensor cable connected to the CPU_Fan header? H80 pump power cable connected to your power supply (via SATA connection, IIRC)? Checked your cooler mount?


My pump power cable is connected directly to PSU, it is mounted properly I am getting even thermal compound spread every time. I can feel my radiator getting heatsoaked but thats all relative I dont actually know how warm it should feel, its probably not enough. My GPU radiator gets very warm, hot almost to the touch and its only at 75C. Yeah I bet its not transfering enough heat into the rad.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> You really should look into using CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra between the IHS and CPU die. Ive found that pastes are hit and miss, even some of the best pastes don't hold up over time. (I eventually had to under-volt my CPU just to keep temps in check until my package of CLU arrived after only a month with Gelid Extreme...)
> 
> Definitely get CLU a shot.
> 
> Also what CPU voltages are you running?


I might have to give that compound a try. I am running stock voltage, kinda sad having to under volt a stock chip with an aftermarket cooler. This is all very disappointing I have never had this much trouble with cooling.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Namkab*
> 
> [...] This is all very disappointing I have never had this much trouble with cooling.


You should also look around on the forum and find out what other people think and argue about with regards to Haswell overclocking. People seem to check temperatures and stability through x264 video encoding and suggest to completely ignore prime95 because temperatures unrealistically explode there.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Namkab*
> 
> My pump power cable is connected directly to PSU, it is mounted properly I am getting even thermal compound spread every time. I can feel my radiator getting heatsoaked but thats all relative I dont actually know how warm it should feel, its probably not enough. My GPU radiator gets very warm, hot almost to the touch and its only at 75C. Yeah I bet its not transfering enough heat into the rad.
> I might have to give that compound a try. I am running stock voltage, kinda sad having to under volt a stock chip with an aftermarket cooler. This is all very disappointing I have never had this much trouble with cooling.


You say you're @ stock voltage, but what is the VCore being reported as when you're at load? 1.20V?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Namkab*
> 
> The only thing I can think of is maybe its the thermal paste, I am using Arctic Alumina. I would never of thought thermal paste can be that horrible thats why I am not sure if its that or not. I really need a second opinion.


I have to echo what others have said. You need to switch to CLU

Ivy and Haswell chips are not soldered, that's why they run hot. Replacing Intel's paste with another paste doesn't solve any problem. CLU is liquid metal, so functionally equivalent to solder.


----------



## LandonAaron

I just got my IC Diamond 7 and CLU in today. The IC diamond 7 only has 0.5 ML in the tube and didn't come in any packaging. Just the tube/syringe in an envelope is this normal? Also the CLU didnt have the metal needle syringe tip on the end of the tube?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I just got my IC Diamond 7 and CLU in today. The IC diamond 7 only has 0.5 ML in the tube and didn't come in any packaging. Just the tube/syringe in an envelope is this normal? Also the CLU didnt have the metal needle syringe tip on the end of the tube?


I don't know about the IC diamond.

The CLU should be in a polyethylene syringe. A metal needle tip would not be a good idea unless it were made of pure nickel. A normal stainless steel needle tip would just be dissolved by the gallium in CLU.


----------



## LandonAaron

Pretty sure I just killed my chip with vice only method. Felt the adhesive break loose took the chip out 5he vice to o inspect amd there is a crack down the side of circuit board I kjnd of between the layers of the chip and some of the green top layer fell off on the edge.


----------



## fleetfeather

pics?


----------



## LandonAaron

Too upset to document it. I'm goin test it and if it doesn't work I'll post pics when I pull it. Got some other stuff I have to finish on my water loop before I can try booting up first.


----------



## LandonAaron

Well I decided to just stick the stock cooler on there, pull the video cards (on water blocks) and give it a whirl just so I could know if it is working or not. By a miracle of god, the hammer of Thor, I don't know, but it actually booted. I did get a "New CPU installed press F1 to enter setup" message though when first turning on. I was pretty sure when I saw that the chip was dead, but I went into BIOS set everything to stock and was able to boot into Windows. I am typing this on it right now. Temps are crap, cause I am using the stock cooler, so nothing to report there. I am just so glad its working.







I will never take pics, sorry, this thing isn't come out of the socket probably ever again. That was just way to scary. The freaking corner of the chip chipped of! Just the top green layer but still.

Not sure what I did wrong. The vice I purchases wasn't completely even, so I guess it was uneven pressure across the processor which lead to the crack. But I guess it was so close to the edge of the chip that nothing really got damage, though it is probably too early to know for sure. Will have to put it under some stress tests first. I mean these things have a couple billion circuits right? I figured no matter how small the crack it would have to disconnect a few thousand when your talking about circuits and transistors this small.

Anyways I will report back once I get my water running and let yall know how my temps are and how the chip stands up. Just so happy it isn't dead right now.

On an unrelated matter, did you know you can buy a 4.8GHZ i7-4790k from Silicon Lottery for $10 less than newegg sells the i7-4790k for? And they will de-lid for $50. Think I will go that rout next time


----------



## jagdtigger

Or use a razor blade, i did that and it take more or less 3 minutes (you can do it faster, but its better to be safe than sorry







...) to take off that damn IHS.

A little update on my case, i just ordered some CLU to use it between the chip and the IHS. And a question, can i use it between the IHS and the cooler or thats a bad idea?


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Well I decided to just stick the stock cooler on there, pull the video cards (on water blocks) and give it a whirl just so I could know if it is working or not. By a miracle of god, the hammer of Thor, I don't know, but it actually booted. I did get a "New CPU installed press F1 to enter setup" message though when first turning on.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I was pretty sure when I saw that the chip was dead, but I went into BIOS set everything to stock and was able to boot into Windows. I am typing this on it right now. Temps are crap, cause I am using the stock cooler, so nothing to report there. I am just so glad its working.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will never take pics, sorry, this thing isn't come out of the socket probably ever again. That was just way to scary. The freaking corner of the chip chipped of! Just the top green layer but still.
> 
> Not sure what I did wrong. The vice I purchases wasn't completely even, so I guess it was uneven pressure across the processor which lead to the crack. But I guess it was so close to the edge of the chip that nothing really got damage, though it is probably too early to know for sure. Will have to put it under some stress tests first. I mean these things have a couple billion circuits right? I figured no matter how small the crack it would have to disconnect a few thousand when your talking about circuits and transistors this small.
> 
> Anyways I will report back once I get my water running and let yall know how my temps are and how the chip stands up. Just so happy it isn't dead right now.
> 
> On an unrelated matter, did you know you can buy a 4.8GHZ i7-4790k from Silicon Lottery for $10 less than newegg sells the i7-4790k for? And they will de-lid for $50. Think I will go that rout next time :rolleyes
> 
> 
> :


That's normal for an Asus board it has happened every time I taken the CPU out, I just enter bios f10 save and exit all the settings are same prior to CPU removal


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jagdtigger*
> 
> A little update on my case, i just ordered some CLU to use it between the chip and the IHS. And a question, can i use it between the IHS and the cooler or thats a bad idea?


Depends what cooler. A nickel plated waterblock, yes. Anything copper, preferably no. Anything with aluminium would be destroyed.


----------



## jagdtigger

So thats a bad idea, my block is copper. I order some mx4 too...


----------



## LandonAaron

My chip is dead. It will boot butt the screen goes black after a couple of minutes. Sucks.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jagdtigger*
> 
> So thats a bad idea, my block is copper. I order some mx4 too...


CLU isn't really a problem with copper, it can just be a pain to clean if it's not nickel plated. It shouldn't really be a problem even if you can't clean it entirely though, since it is metal itself and only the most minute amounts would remain.

EDIT: That said, it would only net you a couple of degrees or so between the IHS and waterblock, MX4 is a better option in terms of cleaning and remounting.


----------



## LandonAaron

If you look closely you can see the small crack on the side of the pcb. Going to microcenter to get a new chip today. Can someone upload a picture of the type of razor blade that works best for delidding?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> 
> 
> If you look closely you can see the small crack on the side of the pcb. Going to microcenter to get a new chip today. Can someone upload a picture of the type of razor blade that works best for delidding?


One of these:


They're the slimmest, cheapest and are least likely to bend the PCB, surprisingly hard to find... most places only carry safety/utility blades which are a lot thicker.

The biggest issue is avoiding the VRMs so its best to start on the opposing corner from the gold triangle.

Also, don't try to force it, just wriggle it back and forth starting at a corner of the IHS and it should go in slowly, but steadily. Try not to warp the blade.

Once you have the blade a good way into the first corner/side, I recommend using a slim laminated/plastic card for the rest then sliding the card around the IHS or even sliding it over the die from the bottom corner and working your way around, using the die as a buffer to keep the card over the VRMs.

If you cant use a card, just be really careful about moving your blade around to the VRM side of the chip, and any nicks can ruin/damage the VRMs


----------



## EuEra

Hi guys i tried the vice technique on this practice processor Intel Celeron 420. I hit the thing no joke about 18 times and it still didn't come off as i increasingly got more and more frustrated and hit it harder and harder. After the 18th blow i gave up and found i could at least shove a razor into the corner easily then i used a credit card to do the rest in about 5 seconds. Now i'm guessing if this was my 4790k it would be busted after 18 hits lol, what did i do wrong?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Hi guys i tried the vice technique on this practice processor Intel Celeron 420. I hit the thing no joke about 18 times and it still didn't come off as i increasingly got more and more frustrated and hit it harder and harder. After the 18th blow i gave up and found i could at least shove a razor into the corner easily then i used a credit card to do the rest in about 5 seconds. Now i'm guessing if this was my 4790k it would be busted after 18 hits lol, what did i do wrong?


Something you used was soft. The wood was too soft for example, or you used a rubber hammer.


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Something you used was soft. The wood was too soft for example, or you used a rubber hammer.


i used a rubber hammer, one i bought specially for it hahaha. Thanks man so use a normal hammer and i'm good? Also is pinewood still recommended like on the front page because that is a softwood?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> i used a rubber hammer, one i bought specially for it hahaha. Thanks man so use a normal hammer and i'm good? Also is pinewood still recommended like on the front page because that is a softwood?


It worked fine for me with pine. What does not work is spruce. That will deform a lot while hammering.

About the wood, you have to be super careful about how the surface that's touching the CPU looks like. It has to be a nice, flat cut there. The lines of the grain can also be super dangerous to the PCB. The light parts are softer and the dark parts harder. If the softer parts deform but the harder parts do not, those can then chip the PCB. This wasn't a problem with the piece of pine wood that I had, but I don't know if all pine is like that.


----------



## NomNomNom

What's the vice only method? Do i need a specific type of vice for it


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NomNomNom*
> 
> What's the vice only method? Do i need a specific type of vice for it


Vice only uses the pressure from the vice to dislodge the PCB from the IHS. the IHS sits on one side of the vice, while the PCB is on the other, and as you tighten the vice, the pressure causes the PCB to dislodge from the IHS

you're going to want one that wont give uneven pressure across the CPU. you can cover the corners of the vice with electrical tape to help prevent slipping or damage.

For visual references, take a gander on youtube.


----------



## EuEra

Could you work the corners with a blade then use the vice?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Could you work the corners with a blade then use the vice?


If you are confident about doing a first cut with a blade, perhaps see if you can find some sort of thin plastic card for the rest of the work instead of going to the vice.


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> If you are confident about doing a first cut with a blade, perhaps see if you can find some sort of thin plastic card for the rest of the work instead of going to the vice.


Hmmm ok it seems like the vice is a safer option than the blade do you agree?


----------



## LagunaX

This has been discussed many times over and all 3 methods have their advantages and disadvantages. Personally I prefer the hammerless vice method - just pad the PCB side with a thick rubber band, no need to pad the metal IHS, and slow twists until u feel it loosen. Yeah it will bend the PCB but don't tell me that the hammer method doesn't bend the PCB either - you just can't see it. And you can't knock off the resistors either this way.


----------



## LandonAaron

I am Murphey's law embodied.


----------



## Gofspar

What are your guys results after some prime95, I hit around 75c with a Kraken x61 AIO @ 4.7 at 1.215v. do you think I mounted it all correctly?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gofspar*
> 
> What are your guys results after some prime95, I hit around 75c with a Kraken x61 AIO @ 4.7 at 1.215v. do you think I mounted it all correctly?


what TIM and such. also seems pretty good to me honestly, especially on a tough test like that or intel burn, most tough stresses wont show those numbers so looks good to me.


----------



## Gofspar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> what TIM and such. also seems pretty good to me honestly, especially on a tough test like that or intel burn, most tough stresses wont show those numbers so looks good to me.


Colab ultra on die and NTH1 on IHS


----------



## LandonAaron

Well maybe I didn't kill my cpu. Just made 6 hour round trip to microcenter to pick up another 4790k and I am getting the same problem. Computer boots to bios and windows fine then after a couple of minutes the screen goes black tomorrow I am going pull every component one by one till I figure out what's going on. Good and bad news I guess. Have to miss another day of work (work from home on this computer) but my cpu isn't dead, but something else probably is, and I have to keep working on this thing.... I may have two 4790k's for sale in near future btw. I bought two at microcenter, and apparatus I probably do need either, and I'm not driving another 6 hours to return.


----------



## fragamemnon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Well maybe I didn't kill my cpu. Just made 6 hour round trip to microcenter to pick up another 4790k and I am getting the same problem. Computer boots to bios and windows fine then after a couple of minutes the screen goes black tomorrow I am going pull every component one by one till I figure out what's going on. Good and bad news I guess. Have to miss another day of work (work from home on this computer) but my cpu isn't dead, but something else probably is, and I have to keep working on this thing.... I may have two 4790k's for sale in near future btw. I bought two at microcenter, and apparatus I probably do need either, and I'm not driving another 6 hours to return.


Check for bent socket pins; check your PSU, etc.







You know the drill.

Good luck! Hopefully it's something under warranty/easy to replace!


----------



## EuEra

With the corsair h100 will i see much difference in temp if i remove the pre applied paste and add CLU instead?


----------



## JackCY

Yeah like MOBO. Or you are screwing the heatsink too hard, bending the MOBO or something, shows up only after it heats up after a few minutes.


----------



## LandonAaron

I just added second r9 290 so I thought it may be that, not enough powwer. But that doesn't make sense as I have 1000w evga g2 psu and this is happening when not even under load.I saw what may have been two bent pins on the socket last night, but after looking for a while I just couldn't tell if they were actually bent or not as they were on the very edge of socket right next to the notches without alot of other pins next to them. But either way they aren't very bent.

The one time this worked thhough since the delid was when I ran without the video cards so I think the problem is there somewhere.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Yeah like MOBO. Or you are screwing the heatsink too hard, bending the MOBO or something, shows up only after it heats up after a few minutes.


I do have a bad habit of screwing everything down too hard. Have stripped and cracked countless things in my life from ove tightening. I have the xspc raystorm waterblock, which has these screws that have a tightening nut. I always screw the bolt all the way in but leave the tightening nut all the way out. I feel like that is a tight but not too tight way of doing it but who knows.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> With the corsair h100 will i see much difference in temp if i remove the pre applied paste and add CLU instead?


Yep, even with decent air coolers, replacing the stock paste with CLU will lead to better temps. The H100/ H100i will definitely perform better to some degree.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Could you work the corners with a blade then use the vice?


I think that is how I will do it it next time if I try another delid. I think just too much pressure is required to do the vice only or vice plus wood block method right from the start. I think you need to at least start the separation with a small cut.


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I think that is how I will do it it next time if I try another delid. I think just too much pressure is required to do the vice only or vice plus wood block method right from the start. I think you need to at least start the separation with a small cut.


Yeah thats what was thinking and slicing just the corners doesn't have much risk of doing any harm. Saying that though once i got the blade in 1 corner and slid my credit card in i litterally had the ihs off in 5 seconds im thinking maybe that is the best method by far. Also don't know if anyone has thought of this with the vice and wood method but i put a sandwich on the vice to catch the cpu and not damage it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gofspar*
> 
> Colab ultra on die and NTH1 on IHS


hmmmmm yeah those should be about right maybe a little high for that voltage but for the amount of processes going on it seems about right.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Well maybe I didn't kill my cpu. Just made 6 hour round trip to microcenter to pick up another 4790k and I am getting the same problem. Computer boots to bios and windows fine then after a couple of minutes the screen goes black tomorrow I am going pull every component one by one till I figure out what's going on. Good and bad news I guess. Have to miss another day of work (work from home on this computer) but my cpu isn't dead, but something else probably is, and I have to keep working on this thing.... I may have two 4790k's for sale in near future btw. I bought two at microcenter, and apparatus I probably do need either, and I'm not driving another 6 hours to return.


how long has it sat on that black screen, I had it once where i would make it past the windows flower, and then blackness for 3 minutes and then the desktop would load. sometimes validating windows fixes this. just my quick thoughts.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> With the corsair h100 will i see much difference in temp if i remove the pre applied paste and add CLU instead?


I would guess anywhere from 6-9C is possible , but more like 5-7C which is still a big drop


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> how long has it sat on that black screen, I had it once where i would make it past the windows flower, and then blackness for 3 minutes and then the desktop would load. sometimes validating windows fixes this. just my quick thoughts.


Not very long. Maybe a minute or so. I always turn off the computer pretty soon after it happens as I worry leaving it like that may damage something. It happens even if I am in the BIOS though so I don't think it is a Windows issue.

I narrowed down the problem to the video cards. If I remove both my video cards and use the iGPU instead, the problem doesn't occur. I have used both cards separately without issue but having them both installed causes the problem. Next step is to install them each one at a time to see if I can narrow down the problem to specific card. Thinking maybe I damaged one when I installed water blocks on them.


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valguar*
> I would guess anywhere from 6-9C is possible , but more like 5-7C which is still a big drop


Cool i was just going to use stock, i'm going to use use CLU then is that a good choice or is there a lot better


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Not very long. Maybe a minute or so. I always turn off the computer pretty soon after it happens as I worry leaving it like that may damage something. It happens even if I am in the BIOS though so I don't think it is a Windows issue.
> 
> I narrowed down the problem to the video cards. If I remove both my video cards and use the iGPU instead, the problem doesn't occur. I have used both cards separately without issue but having them both installed causes the problem. Next step is to install them each one at a time to see if I can narrow down the problem to specific card. Thinking maybe I damaged one when I installed water blocks on them.


hmmm that may be a possibility, there could also be a heat transfer problem where the blocks aren't actually getting the heat off the GPU and its turning off due to heat, so I would check that even if they have stock coolers back on them. what gpu's if you don't mind and how old are they and stressed or new and yada yada.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Cool i was just going to use stock, i'm going to use use CLU then is that a good choice or is there a lot better


CLU pretty much is the best, just don't get that stuff on aluminum


----------



## mercs213

So my CPUs IMC (integrated memory controller) took a poop.







Put in a new i5-3570k and bam, BIOS would POST, no more DRAM red LED! I got an RMA number from intel and mailing it tomorrow.

The CPU was delidded and had CLP on the die. No physical damage either. I have no clue if the delid caused it as it has been running great for 1.5 years.

The IHS does have vice grip marks. I also put some TIM on the die and re-glued the IHS back to the PCB with some black silicon.

I will be including some candy and a friendly appreciation note that describes the issue (won't mention delidding lol).

Anyways, I'm sure they will send a new CPU but I will let everyone know how it turns out!


----------



## Ceadderman

That sucks. Itso likely that the lanes for PCI were damaged. I suggest taking one card and checking each PCI slot to weed out the affected lanes.

It could also mean that you won't be able to get more than one card running on that chip.









~Ceadder :drink


----------



## LandonAaron

Well I figured out my issue was with my video card overheating not with my CPU. I installed a water block on my R9 290x, but it wasn't making good contact with the die because there was some black spacer things on the PCB causing the block to sit too high off the card. This weekend I am going to put the delided CPU back in the system and update yall with my temps pre and post roof gone.

Oh yeah, from now on I am referring to deliding as "roof gone". Cause you know I pull up to the scene with my roof gone, they call me two chains but I got a few on...


----------



## fragamemnon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> With the corsair h100 will i see much difference in temp if i remove the pre applied paste and add CLU instead?
> 
> 
> 
> I would guess anywhere from 6-9C is possible , but more like 5-7C which is still a big drop
Click to expand...

I dropped from TjMax to 82-85oC on a Hyper 212+ @ 5GHz.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Well I figured out my issue was with my video card overheating not with my CPU. I installed a water block on my R9 290x, but it wasn't making good contact with the die because there was some black spacer things on the PCB causing the block to sit too high off the card. This weekend I am going to put the delided CPU back in the system and update yall with my temps pre and post roof gone.
> 
> Oh yeah, from now on I am referring to deliding as "roof gone". Cause you know I pull up to the scene with my roof gone, they call me two chains but I got a few on...


top part: called it, who is teh boss hoss tis guy









bottom part: y u sneaky devil you


----------



## NirvashEnd

Been Snooping for a while, Decided to eat the bullet, Used the Hammer/Vice Method, 3 or 4 taps and pop, Didn't read the temp thing before hand, but at the same OC I used I see ~ 20C drop.
before I pop it back in, is the Nail Polish Necessary?

OCN name: NirvashEnd
CPU: 4790k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 200
OC after delid: 4900
Temp drops: ~Didn't Test official,
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/kxhhsp


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NirvashEnd*
> 
> Been Snooping for a while, Decided to eat the bullet, Used the Hammer/Vice Method, 3 or 4 taps and pop, Didn't read the temp thing before hand, but at the same OC I used I see ~ 20C drop.
> before I pop it back in, is the Nail Polish Necessary?


It's not completely necessary, but definitely a highly-recommended precaution to prevent shorts from any of the exposed VRMs.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *NirvashEnd*
> 
> Been Snooping for a while, Decided to eat the bullet, Used the Hammer/Vice Method, 3 or 4 taps and pop, Didn't read the temp thing before hand, but at the same OC I used I see ~ 20C drop.
> before I pop it back in, is the Nail Polish Necessary?
> 
> 
> 
> It's not completely necessary, but definitely a highly-recommended precaution to prevent shorts from any of the exposed VRMs.
Click to expand...

This ^ Its not completely necessary. But highly recommended if you are going to be spreading a metal based TIM. LET is another good option.


----------



## NirvashEnd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> This ^ Its not completely necessary. But highly recommended if you are going to be spreading a metal based TIM. LET is another good option.


Just put a layer on, Fired right up, >.>, phew, now to stess


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NirvashEnd*
> 
> Been Snooping for a while, Decided to eat the bullet, Used the Hammer/Vice Method, 3 or 4 taps and pop, Didn't read the temp thing before hand, but at the same OC I used I see ~ 20C drop.
> before I pop it back in, is the Nail Polish Necessary?
> 
> OCN name: NirvashEnd
> CPU: 4790k
> on die-TIM: CLP
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4900
> Temp drops: ~Didn't Test official,
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/kxhhsp


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NirvashEnd*
> 
> Just put a layer on, Fired right up, >.>, phew, now to stess


the sweet sigh of relief right?


----------



## EuEra

Eh whats this about nail polish i didn't see it on the main page. Is it not corrosive?


----------



## NirvashEnd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the sweet sigh of relief right?


Yes it was, I was so nervous about it, I forgot to put the ram back in...... and then I forgot that asus boards like to "double Check" before posting so when it didn't post
right away, I was not a calm camper.


----------



## SgtRotty

hello! i have to RMA my 4770k, i was wondering what to use to re-glue the IHS with?


----------



## deepor

black-colored silicone glue


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SgtRotty*
> 
> hello! i have to RMA my 4770k, i was wondering what to use to re-glue the IHS with?


From the OP first page
Quote:


> MOD NOTE: Delidding your CPU does void its warranty. If you RMA the chip it is classed as RMA fraud, please do not discuss such actions in this thread or anywhere on OCN.


But if I were to re-glue the IHS back on for my own perposes then black urethane like this

I have used urethane for gluing car spoilers and bumpers on a panel beater best friend


----------



## LandonAaron

Well I finally got my cracked delidded 4790k installed in my system this weekend, and its pretty amazing. About 20 degrees cooler than before. Was running at 4.7Ghz @ 1.32v with temps of about 75 in OCCT. Now at the same settings I was only getting 50-55 degrees. Also I was able to max out my overclock at 4.9 Ghz with 1.5v Vcore and 2.1 VCCIN. I didn't do alot of testing to get to this speed so I may be able to dial the voltages back a little, though really I may just return to 4.7 or 4.8 ..

Unfortunately I didn't remember to take a picture with the top off. By the time I remembered I had already glued the top back on using some liquid black rubber sealant stuff I had purchased to fix a leak on my GPU block. It seemed to work pretty good for this purpose, and I think it will be easy to remove if I ever need to get back under there. By yeah, I didn't feel like taking the top back off and re-gluing just to get the picture.

I still have the two chips I got from microcenter though, and the one I tested is a little better than the chip I delid. It will hit 4.8 Ghz at 1.34v so I am pretty sure I could get it to 5.0Ghz if I delid it. So I am probably going to delid it this weekend and try to remember to get a pic this time so I can join the club. Also I just really want to hit that magical 5.0Ghz number, as I just know that 5.0 Ghz has to be like ten times faster than 4.9 Ghz.


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> as I just know that 5.0 Ghz has to be like ten times faster than 4.9 Ghz



If you stick the Devil's Canyon sticker that came with your retail 4790k on the side of your case it will be even faster!


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> 
> If you stick the Devil's Canyon sticker that came with your retail 4790k on the side of your case it will be even faster!


Yeah that can be a pretty nerve wracking upgrade too. I don't know its kind of a toss up between deliding and placing that sticker as to which is the scarier upgrade.

But in all seriousness, mine didn't come with a sticker. I am feeling gypped. I love stickers!


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Well I finally got my cracked delidded 4790k installed in my system this weekend, and its pretty amazing. About 20 degrees cooler than before. Was running at 4.7Ghz @ 1.32v with temps of about 75 in OCCT. Now at the same settings I was only getting 50-55 degrees. Also I was able to max out my overclock at 4.9 Ghz with 1.5v Vcore and 2.1 VCCIN. I didn't do alot of testing to get to this speed so I may be able to dial the voltages back a little, though really I may just return to 4.7 or 4.8 ..
> 
> Unfortunately I didn't remember to take a picture with the top off. By the time I remembered I had already glued the top back on using some liquid black rubber sealant stuff I had purchased to fix a leak on my GPU block. It seemed to work pretty good for this purpose, and I think it will be easy to remove if I ever need to get back under there. By yeah, I didn't feel like taking the top back off and re-gluing just to get the picture.
> 
> 
> I still have the two chips I got from microcenter though, and the one I tested is a little better than the chip I delid. It will hit 4.8 Ghz at 1.34v so I am pretty sure I could get it to 5.0Ghz if I delid it. So I am probably going to delid it this weekend and try to remember to get a pic this time so I can join the club. Also I just really want to hit that magical 5.0Ghz number, as I just know that 5.0 Ghz has to be like ten times faster than 4.9 Ghz.


That sounds a lot like my chip except it is a 3770k I use 1.46v to get 5Ghz
I thought 1.35 for a Haswell was the maximum upper limit but it's your chip
All I can say would you like ketchup on that


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> That sounds a lot like my chip except it is a 3770k I use 1.46v to get 5Ghz
> I thought 1.35 for a Haswell was the maximum upper limit but it's your chip
> All I can say would you like ketchup on that


I think 1.35 is what the guy in the Haswell Overclocking guide recommends to stay under, but if you read his guide he is basically saying that you will want to stay under that because of temperatures. Once you delid though you open up a lot of headroom on the temperatures side of things. I think 1.7v is where things start to get dicey regardless of temps.


----------



## LandonAaron

When doing the vice only delid method what part of the IHS should I clamp to. Last time I did it I clamped onto the the wing part since its closer to the PCB. I felt being closer to the PCB would keep the pressure more in a plane parallel to the PCB and less into the PCB so to speak. However I also feel like maybe this isn't the best place to clamp onto since the wing doesn't run the full lengtch of the PCB all the pressure is applied to the middle instead of being more evenly distributed. Thoughts?


----------



## LagunaX

See the last post on this page:
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/intel-haswell-overclocking-clubhouse.185344/page-51#post-3148314


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> See the last post on this page:
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/intel-haswell-overclocking-clubhouse.185344/page-51#post-3148314


Thanks for the link but his wording is a little ambiguous and you can't tell from the video because all the tissue is in the way. He says to clamp onto the "top shelf" of the IHS. Right side up that would be the small square portion without wings, but when upside down in the vice that could also mean the part with wings closest to the "top" in that orientation.

I think I am going to go with the smaller square portion further away from the PCB, since it is taller with more space for the vice to sit against and longer allowing the pressure to be more evenly distributed. And also because I didn't get the best results clamping onto the wings last time.

Finally, I do have one other option, in that I could turn the processor 90 degrees in the vice and place the portion of the IHS closest to the PCB on one side of the vice (no wings on these sides) and the PCB on the other. It's usually not recommended to delid from this side because of the risk of the IHS hitting the capacitors, but doing the vice only method the IHS hardly moves so there shouldn't be much risk of hitting those regardless of orientation.


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> See the last post on this page:
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/intel-haswell-overclocking-clubhouse.185344/page-51#post-3148314


I just did a practice run of this on a 5 dollar chip it worked great but is there a chance of bending the pcb this way and if so would it be enough to matter


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> I just did a practice run of this on a 5 dollar chip it worked great but is there a chance of bending the pcb this way and if so would it be enough to matter


Take confident and be patient Eu! You'll do great on your production chip







I did two in a row perfectly, and trust me, them hands be shaking a bit.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BenjaminBenj*
> 
> Take confident and be patient Eu! You'll do great on your production chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did two in a row perfectly, and trust me, them hands be shaking a bit.


So which part of the IHS did you clamp onto with the vice? The upper smaller square part, or the lower part with the lock down tabs/wings closer to the PCB?


----------



## LagunaX

Just don't let your chip go flying in the air








I used a fat rubber band against the green pcb since my cheap $20 vice has all metal edges.
I used the upper smaller part of the ihs.

Selling my current delidded 4790k (4.7ghz 1.26v or 4.8ghz 1.31v) cuz I have a better one on hand that I am gonna delid in the very near future


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just don't let your chip go flying in the air
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a fat rubber band against the green pcb since my cheap $20 vice has all metal edges.
> I used the upper smaller part of the ihs.
> 
> Selling my current delidded 4790k (4.7ghz 1.26v or 4.8ghz 1.31v) cuz I have a better one on hand that I am gonna delid in the very near future


Yeah I am in the same boat. I actually ended up with three chips, lol. Thought I killed the first one when I delid, and bought two more, and then it turned out to be okay. At least one of the new ones I bought is better than my original though, so I guess I am going to delid it too.


----------



## LagunaX

Good luck


----------



## LandonAaron

Alright sign me up:



Where can I pick up my signature? Should I expect it in the mail?


----------



## NIK1

I am getting a I7-4790k 4.0 this week teemed up with a MCI MPower Max AC mb.Are the i7 4790k chips worth deliding.Its my first Z97 just wondering if its worth doing.When I delidded my i5 3570k a year and a half ago I used the hammer-vice and wood method and my temps dropped 10 or more cell. Is this still the best way to delid a 4790k if I decide to do it..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Alright sign me up:
> 
> 
> 
> Where can I pick up my signature? Should I expect it in the mail?


Check the OP







if you want to gib me your info on it that the OP states that would be coo and the sig code block is there as well


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just don't let your chip go flying in the air
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a fat rubber band against the green pcb since my cheap $20 vice has all metal edges.
> I used the upper smaller part of the ihs.
> 
> Selling my current delidded 4790k (4.7ghz 1.26v or 4.8ghz 1.31v) cuz I have a better one on hand that I am gonna delid in the very near future


Lol that video and your comment gave me a good laugh, hes not bothered he just picks up the pieces and flashes it to the cam. His came off so easy


----------



## alancsalt

If your sig is in "Rich Text" you'll need something like:

*Official Delidded Crewman*

Code:



Code:


[CENTER][URL=showthread.php?s=bd8d1313c09af4210eda3f9b5ad8a046&t=1313179][B][IMG alt=""]https://www.overclock.net/images/smilies/skull.gif[/IMG]Official Delidded Crewman[IMG alt=""]https://www.overclock.net/images/smilies/skull.gif[/IMG][/B][/URL][/CENTER]


----------



## BenjaminBenj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> So which part of the IHS did you clamp onto with the vice? The upper smaller square part, or the lower part with the lock down tabs/wings closer to the PCB?


Actually did the razor method for both, and not a single scratch. I couldn't handle the vice method (personal choice).


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I think 1.35 is what the guy in the Haswell Overclocking guide recommends to stay under, but if you read his guide he is basically saying that you will want to stay under that because of temperatures. Once you delid though you open up a lot of headroom on the temperatures side of things. I think 1.7v is where things start to get dicey regardless of temps.


Good luck on the 5Ghz I know it is a magic round number that we all strive for
I ran 5Ghz for about 2 months on 1.46 Vcore but backed off to 4.8 @1.34v because I didn't notice any difference just seemed too much extra voltage for too little gain
I hardly even noticed any difference in bench marks, My opinion, 10% more voltage for 4% more clock and about 1% real world performance gain

But for sure I will crank it up to 5Ghz only when I have friends around


----------



## EuEra

Is 1.35 volts considered super safe on a delidded 4790k


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I am getting a I7-4790k 4.0 this week teemed up with a MCI MPower Max AC mb.Are the i7 4790k chips worth deliding.Its my first Z97 just wondering if its worth doing.When I delidded my i5 3570k a year and a half ago I used the hammer-vice and wood method and my temps dropped 10 or more cell. Is this still the best way to delid a 4790k if I decide to do it..


I think the vice only method is the easiest/safest. Opinions vary though.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Is 1.35 volts considered super safe on a delidded 4790k


Yes, that should be safe for long-term use.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> If your sig is in "Rich Text" you'll need something like:
> 
> *Official Delidded Crewman*
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> [CENTER][URL=showthread.php?s=bd8d1313c09af4210eda3f9b5ad8a046&t=1313179][B][IMG alt=""]https://www.overclock.net/images/smilies/skull.gif[/IMG]Official Delidded Crewman[IMG alt=""]https://www.overclock.net/images/smilies/skull.gif[/IMG][/B][/URL][/CENTER]


Thanks Mr. Salt


----------



## NIK1

I think the MSI Z97 MPower Max AC motherboard that I ordered
comes with a Delid Die Guard. Wonder if its worth it to put the water block right on with the IHS off.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

It should work just fine so long as you have a 4670k or 4770k.

If you have the 4690k or 4790k you'll likely need to do a little modding to the bracket to make room for the extra VRMs.

It should be worth it so long as you stick with CLU on the die. Normal pastes are a bit fickle in my trials with direct-to-die cooling.


----------



## Brohem0th

Thank you, whoever rep'ed this post.


89c, 91c, 89c, 78c. Yeah, I'm fixing to delid this bad boy. But first, BRB, gonna see if I can boot 5GHZ!
Update - Couldn't get it to boot 5Ghz with the lid still on, even at 1.385v Vcore, 2.000v Input, 1.215v Ring and 45 Ring Multi. Not going to push it any further. Idling at 65c in the BIOS is a sign that you should stop while you're ahead. On the plus side, I managed to dial in 4.9Ghz/1.360v Vcore/45 Ring Multi and it's been stable so far.

This is on a CoolerMaster Hyper 212+ with dual Phanteks PH-F140HP's running at full speed. I'm just trying to see what I can do with the lid still on this chip. I don't plan on running a 5Ghz Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT's max temp test after seeing my chip hit the 90's already. But holy crap, this thing is going to be a beast when I get it fixed up! If I can drop my temps to the 75-80c range across all my cores at 1.35v Vcore on a Hyper 212+ then I'll just **** right here where I'm sitting.

Hello!

So I have a 4690k. And it's a pretty damn nice 4690k; 4.8Ghz at 1.325v, max temps 74c-86c running Far Cry 4 and streaming it using the H.264 encoder in OBS (since that previously proved that I wasn't actually totally stable at 1.3v). Anyway, I did some reading, and it seems like the main issue with Devil's Canyon and Haswell (regarding the IHS and delidding) isn't completely the fault of the TIM, but the over-application of the epoxy that holds the IHS to the PCB of the CPU which causes the IHS to flex when not mounted in a socket, which leads to air pockets and pockets of TIM that are just unnecessarily thick.

That said, it seems like the de-facto replacement TIM that gets recommended is CLP or CLU; don't get me wrong, they're fine compounds, and if you want the best possible heat transfer between the Core, IHS, and Heatsink those two are the way to go. But...

I have an unopened tube of Antec Formula 6. Back when everyone and their mom was delidding the 3770k, Antec 6 was a popular choice of TIM to use between the die and IHS. Personally, I would rather use Antec Formula 6 because it's non-conductive (so I don't have to worry about covering the VRM's and other circuitry on the PCB with clear nail polish and have to worry about possibly shorting out my 200$ CPU) and because despite the fact that it came out several years ago it's still a good compound, comparable to IC Diamond in terms of performance.

I just figured I'd run it by the guys at overclock.net before I got started; I know I won't get the absolute best possible thermal performance out of my CPU using Antec Formula 6 instead of one of the Cool Laboratory TIM solutions, but I'm not trying to get my rig setup to break records. I'd be happy if I just stabilized my core temps with one another and possibly got enough headroom to hit 5Ghz. I've validated my chip at 4.9Ghz/1.35v (although it wasn't stable by any common definition of the word, and I was amazed it even booted into Windows) so I know that it still has at least another multi's worth of viable headroom still available if I can get the max load temps stable across all cores and reduce the amount of electrical resistance as well.

So, yeah. TL;DR Having acknowledged that Antec Formula 6 isn't as good as CLU or CLP but is clearly still good enough to be an improvement over what the chip comes with stock, I'm going to delid my chip using that TIM and try to hit 5Ghz. The biggest issue is the over-application of epoxy on the PCB; this has been scientifically proven. I'm delidding the chip to tackle that issue first and foremost. To my understanding, any TIM could fit the bill given what it seems the root cause really is although there are definitely better compounds than others to use.

So. This'll work, right?

EDIT - Proof of concept video, doing exactly what I'm planning to do. The only difference is it's a 4770k instead of a 4690k - 




18c drop in load temps using Antec Formula 7 which is just a slightly improved version of 6; difference between the two is 2c. I'm pretty sure this will work just fine, but maybe I'm a dumbass. That's why I'm here to get some advice.


----------



## kc5vdj

Well, I may be testing my wife's i7-4770K, which was running way hot at stock on air, and given the temps involved, I decided to give it one more go, before deciding to order a vise tomorrow.

Previously, I was using a thin safety blade, and it was just difficult, and also creeping me out as far as safety went, both to me, and the LGA substrate, but I found a thicker utility knife razor, and that seems to be the trick. I guess the angle of the bevel, and the thickness of the blade is what it takes to do this safely. It took three to four minutes to do the job.

Man, that TIM was like some kind of hard rubber. That can't be a good thing, and also, it is clear that at no point was the die even touching the metal of the IHS, although it did compress the hard rubbery TIM material somewhat.

Is this good enough for a .sig? I can't test it for a couple of weeks, need a new PSU, and because of Corsair taking their time, we are getting the H100i GTX instead of the originally planned H110i GT. Got tired of waiting. Be ordering that in about an hour and a half, once the money hits the bank.

So, for the .sig:

i7-4770K

Before


After


----------



## Ceadderman

@brohem0th...

Well if you can get 4.9 under Hyper 212, imagine that you could get past 5.0 of you are considering water cooling.

~Ceadder


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Yeah that can be a pretty nerve wracking upgrade too. I don't know its kind of a toss up between deliding and placing that sticker as to which is the scarier upgrade.
> 
> But in all seriousness, mine didn't come with a sticker. I am feeling gypped. I love stickers!


Yeah! Mine didn't come with that sticker either!


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Yeah! Mine didn't come with that sticker either!


I found it. It is on the back page of the instruction manual. I just didn't realize it was a sticker. Now my computer will go super fast!


----------



## Brohem0th

http://valid.canardpc.com/u6i3x5









Delidded it last night, got it validated within about 10 minutes of tinkering. It's not stable though. The TIM I used has a pretty long cure time and when it finally sets I might be able to bring the voltage down with the temps. If it turns out like I think it will I might actually be able to run 5Ghz for longer than it takes to open CPUZ.


----------



## cephelix

What have I done?!!
Used the vice and hairdryer method
no blade, no hammer.....
so, can i join now??


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What have I done?!!
> Used the vice and hairdryer method
> no blade, no hammer.....
> so, can i join now??


Looking good. May want to put some liquid electrical tape or clear nair polish on those resistors next to the die, just to be safe.

Also be sure to paint a layer on the under side of the IHS above the die too. If your not putting something over the resistors you may not wan to though.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Looking good. May want to put some liquid electrical tape or clear nair polish on those resistors next to the die, just to be safe.
> 
> Also be sure to paint a layer on the under side of the IHS above the die too. If your not putting something over the resistors you may not wan to though.


Already painted a thin layer them..is that not sufficient? or should i paint a thicker layer on??will try out the system without painting the underside of the ihs first since it's already in.....then i will try it with....


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Already painted a thin layer them..is that not sufficient? or should i paint a thicker layer on??will try out the system without painting the underside of the ihs first since it's already in.....then i will try it with....


I don't think adding more will make a difference, but i don't think he realized you coated the VRMs in nail polish, its hard to tell from the pictures.
As long as you have CLU on the die, adding a coat to the IHS only helps ensure a better contact between the surfaces.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I don't think adding more will make a difference, but i don't think he realized you coated the VRMs in nail polish, its hard to tell from the pictures.
> As long as you have CLU on the die, adding a coat to the IHS only helps ensure a better contact between the surfaces.


Yeah I just didn't see it in the pictures. I don't think you have to have huge globs on there as long as they are covered you should be protected. I do think it is a good idea to paint the underside of the IHS though. But yeah in you situation I would probably just test with how you have it first since like you said its already in there.

I have done two delids so far and the first time I got much better temps then the second. I followed the same procedure both times, only difference with the second time was that I ran out of CLU and wasn't able to put quite as much as I would have liked though both the die and the IHS had a good even coat on them it seems like you need just enough for it to kind of puddle. Its kind of hard determining the correct amount of CLU to use. My temps are still good, they just aren't as fantastic as I would like. The other thing I kind of messed up on was I put some rubber sealant down on the PCB to glue the IHS on with and then I decided to try and quickly spread the CLU one more time to make sure it was even. This proved to be a mistake because in the short time it took to do that the rubber sealant already started to dry and when I went to place the IHS the sealant wouldn't spread very well, so I think it is kind of keeping the IHS from sitting all the way down on the PCB. If your not gluing the IHS down then this won't be a problem for you and a smaller amount of CLU should be okay.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I don't think adding more will make a difference, but i don't think he realized you coated the VRMs in nail polish, its hard to tell from the pictures.
> As long as you have CLU on the die, adding a coat to the IHS only helps ensure a better contact between the surfaces.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Yeah I just didn't see it in the pictures. I don't think you have to have huge globs on there as long as they are covered you should be protected. I do think it is a good idea to paint the underside of the IHS though. But yeah in you situation I would probably just test with how you have it first since like you said its already in there.
> 
> I have done two delids so far and the first time I got much better temps then the second. I followed the same procedure both times, only difference with the second time was that I ran out of CLU and wasn't able to put quite as much as I would have liked though both the die and the IHS had a good even coat on them it seems like you need just enough for it to kind of puddle. Its kind of hard determining the correct amount of CLU to use. My temps are still good, they just aren't as fantastic as I would like. The other thing I kind of messed up on was I put some rubber sealant down on the PCB to glue the IHS on with and then I decided to try and quickly spread the CLU one more time to make sure it was even. This proved to be a mistake because in the short time it took to do that the rubber sealant already started to dry and when I went to place the IHS the sealant wouldn't spread very well, so I think it is kind of keeping the IHS from sitting all the way down on the PCB. If your not gluing the IHS down then this won't be a problem for you and a smaller amount of CLU should be okay.


thanks for the advice guys.First time i've done anything this drastic to any of my parts......bought a vice specifically for this...hopefully all goes well when i boot it up tomorrow?wonder what kind of temp difference i'd get? maybe i should fire up prime and see...when i first tested, i got 95 deg but didnt run the test for more than a few seconds when i saw those temps


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

temp difference will depend on your cooler, going from an H100i to de-lid with custom loop with EK supremacy offered a 20-25C drop. (high 80s to mid 60's)
I've also de-lidded a i7 3770 running on an H100i and it saw a 10-15C difference in temps. (it was idling in the low 40's before delid, 70's under load).
another 4770k i de-lidded was running on an H80i and saw about a 10C drop in temps which allowed for overclocking to 4.5GHz while staying in the low 80s.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What have I done?!!
> Used the vice and hairdryer method
> no blade, no hammer.....
> so, can i join now??


can haz info as stated from the OP?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> can haz info as stated from the OP?


lol
OCN name: cephelix
CPU: i7 4790K
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Ultra
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC extreme
Mhz gained:TBA
OC after delid:TBA
Temp drops:TBA
CPU-Z validation of max OC:TBA

for the OC stuff I won't be able to state yet as my system would be down this weekend for maintenance and OC-ing wouldn't be done at least till next week


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> lol
> OCN name: cephelix
> CPU: i7 4790K
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC extreme
> Mhz gained:TBA
> OC after delid:TBA
> Temp drops:TBA
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:TBA
> 
> for the OC stuff I won't be able to state yet as my system would be down this weekend for maintenance and OC-ing wouldn't be done at least till next week


You're in!







Slappa dat sig on!


----------



## cephelix

WOOHOO!!!THANKS!


----------



## mercs213

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mercs213*
> 
> So my CPUs IMC (integrated memory controller) took a poop.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Put in a new i5-3570k and bam, BIOS would POST, no more DRAM red LED! I got an RMA number from intel and mailing it tomorrow.
> 
> The CPU was delidded and had CLP on the die. No physical damage either. I have no clue if the delid caused it as it has been running great for 1.5 years.
> 
> The IHS does have vice grip marks. I also put some TIM on the die and re-glued the IHS back to the PCB with some black silicon.
> 
> I will be including some candy and a friendly appreciation note that describes the issue (won't mention delidding lol).
> 
> Anyways, I'm sure they will send a new CPU but I will let everyone know how it turns out!


Update: Intel approved my RMA of the CPU I delidded, no I didn't break it, memory controller died, no clue how. Got UPS tracking wooohoo


----------



## kc5vdj

New power supply, brand new H100i GTX, performance mode on pump, manual fans to 100%.

i7-4790K, 4.4 GHz, 1.175V, Prime95 blend.... MX-4 on IHS, non-delidded.

The spread is strange, up to 15C or so, so, I'm going to reseat, but I'm convinced I need to do the deed on mine... I'll try to test my wife's 4770K this weekend as well.

Oh, and the reviews are right, this thing can get loud at 100%, but performance mode is actually quite bearable on the fans, but doesn't ratchet them up to 100% like I did manually here.

Second opinions? If these temps persist, was I right even when on air that the temps seem too high? BBIAF. Going to reseat in a just a little bit, and test again.



*****************************

Update

*****************************

Reseating it got a few C, no more. Delidding is in the morning or early afternoon on the 4790K.


----------



## cephelix

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> New power supply, brand new H100i GTX, performance mode on pump, manual fans to 100%.
> 
> i7-4790K, 4.4 GHz, 1.175V, Prime95 blend.... MX-4 on IHS, non-delidded.
> 
> The spread is strange, up to 15C or so, so, I'm going to reseat, but I'm convinced I need to do the deed on mine... I'll try to test my wife's 4770K this weekend as well.
> 
> Oh, and the reviews are right, this thing can get loud at 100%, but performance mode is actually quite bearable on the fans, but doesn't ratchet them up to 100% like I did manually here.
> 
> Second opinions? If these temps persist, was I right even when on air that the temps seem too high? BBIAF. Going to reseat in a just a little bit, and test again.
> 
> 
> 
> *****************************
> 
> Update
> 
> *****************************
> 
> Reseating it got a few C, no more. Delidding is in the morning or early afternoon on the 4790K.






that spread...i really do think you'd need to delid...but 80 is not bad.what are your ambients like? i get 95 deg with an ambitent of 30 on prime...looking for other stressors if possible


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 
> that spread...i really do think you'd need to delid...but 80 is not bad.what are your ambients like? i get 95 deg with an ambitent of 30 on prime...looking for other stressors if possible


My ambient last night was about 72F / 22.22C. I was already in bed when I realized I hadn't put that in the post.

The thing is that these numbers also don't seem to change between balanced mode on the fans to ten minutes or so of 100% fans (the coolant temp drops though.

I have verified with a cigarette that I have positive pressure in the chassis, the power supply fan is mounted down, but the power supply gets a little warm, but that seems to be exiting now via the PCI slot blank vents. The exhaust fan (standard 750D AF140) actually seems to be very close to ambient room temp, and the only hot motherboard temp seems to be the Z97 which seems to be hanging at a peak of 57Cish, but go figure, with the decorative fascia (that eye kinda grows on ya after a while, and doesn't look that bad, and the photos all seem to make the nice anodized red look like red plastic in the marketing pics) probably blocking some of the dissipation from the black fins that it covers. There is a heat pipe connecting the two VRM heatsinks, the PLX heatsink, and the Z97 heatsink, so that could be just a combined thing that would reduce with a custom loop, and water going through the VRM heatsinks. Also, I expected the chipset temp to actually increase as a result of getting the H100i GTX, as the Scythe Big Shuroiken 2 Rev B low-profile heatsink I had on before had an aftermarket 100+cfm SP fan on it blowing a load of air directly down on the VRM and PLX heatsinks.

Oh, and you can freak out Corsair Link to the point of thinking things are defective, simply by changing your motherboard settings for CPU fan from 100% to "Normal". It seems that a full powerdown (soft first, then once off, flip the AC switch at the back of the PSU, then hold the soft-on button in for a few to discharge caps) seems to clear up the confusion from the controller in the block/pump assembly.

Also, other first impressions of CorsairLink... "Groups" seems to me to be pretty freaking useless. It fails to list all of the disk drives and all of the fans. Indeed, it seems to stop at twos. Two motherboard fans. Two drives on each controller, maximum. It only reads package temperature from the CPU, without breakdown, and without TDPs (I would think that including the on-chip TDP measurements would be kinda fitting, but it's just not here). The graph function and logging function seem that they can be useful, limited by the omissions of key sensor data that even freeware picks up, yet not CorsairLink.

So, other than logging some high-level basics in addition to the details of pump speed, radiator fan speed, and changing those two settings along with the LED color, that CorsairLink is quite useless. These are just first impressions, and are limited to mainly initial testing.

Oh, and another thing... The CorsairLink fails to include a case shot of the 750D for it's main screen, and I tried putting my own picture in.... No image scaling, and no documentation on size constraints. That has to be done by trial and error... I wonder what is up with the failure to include the 750D in the supplied case interior shots for the program? In a thread I have been in over at Corsair, George himself says that the 750D is the best selling chassis his company has ever sold.

On the freakout when I changed the BIOS settings for CPU fan from the 100% that I had for the Scythe heatsink to "Normal", it's like the whole thing reset, the LED turned white again, the fans went down to either balanced mode or quiet mode (sounds the same), and CorsairLink refused to read it's sensors, or change anything. THE FIX SEEMS TO BE A HARD POWERDOWN TO RESET THE CONTROLLER. (Gigabyte leaves USB power on for charging devices while in soft-off).

A quick note on the HX650 power supply as well. The PSU (possibly intermittently faulty under load) it replaced, the HX650W (earlier version, I guess), had right-sized SATA cables, with better, but annoying distance between SATA plugs. The current HX650 only supplies two such cables, and they have close spacing suited for use in a stack of drives, but not suited for devices any distance away from the previous connector (SSDs, DVD/BR, Motherboard PCI assist).... Fortunately, the older cables with the single row connector are wired the same as the newer double row connector ones. I'm going to have to do some soldering today and extend the molex cables with the suspect PSU's SATA cables. I really didn't want to be cutting/soldering/heat-shrinking stuff today... Got all the basic drives hooked up, but, one of my FBSD 2.5 inchers and, the DVD, and the motherboard PCI assist require this cable mod...

As far as the CPU, other testing seems to indicate that my original assessment that this thing needs delidded is seeming to be confirmed. So much for the warranty....

ANOTHER UPDATE:

Apparently, the CorsairLink "fixed percentage" mode for the fans will not let you drop below 40% / 1300 RPM. This is strange, as "Quiet Mode" is 800 RPM, and "Balanced mode" is 1100 RPM.

On a cosmetic side note, the ability to change the LED color is kinda cool, BUT, it's done by three sliders. They could at least get into the 1990's and do a colorspace color picker, with sliders off to the side. Indeed, isn't that a MFC class????


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 
> that spread...i really do think you'd need to delid...but 80 is not bad.what are your ambients like? i get 95 deg with an ambitent of 30 on prime...looking for other stressors if possible


Intel burn test, be warned it ups temps by nearly 10 or more from prime.

Seriously, be careful with intel burn


----------



## Brohem0th

So I recently delidded my chip. It runs cooler than it did previously, and I was able to validate 5Ghz after I delidded it so I know there was some improvement. But there's still a 10c difference between my warmest core and my coolest core, three of my cores run a full 10c hotter than the other one just like it did before the delid, and I really haven't seen a very large drop in temps.

I think I may need to open it back up again and reapply the TIM. The first time around, I only applied TIM to the actual core of the chip, and not to the bottom of the IHS, and I think there might not be enough there to get full contact.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> So I recently delidded my chip. It runs cooler than it did previously, and I was able to validate 5Ghz after I delidded it so I know there was some improvement. But there's still a 10c difference between my warmest core and my coolest core, three of my cores run a full 10c hotter than the other one just like it did before the delid, and I really haven't seen a very large drop in temps.
> 
> I think I may need to open it back up again and reapply the TIM. The first time around, I only applied TIM to the actual core of the chip, and not to the bottom of the IHS, and I think there might not be enough there to get full contact.


The 10C variance is actually pretty common. 2 out of the 3 chips Ive delidded are the same way as yours, my personal chip rarely varies more then 5-6C even under load, but Im also on a custom loop, and the other 2 are running H80i and H100i. I even reseated the IHS a couple times, and applied more CLU to the die but it never made a difference in performance or a change in core variance.

So I'm not really sure what causes the issue.


----------



## kc5vdj

Can I slap the .sig on now???

Prime95 Blend... See my previous post for comparison. I'm calling 14-16C drop on average. SETI is now actually in the 40's!!!!

On a side note, this did have fat better contact under the IHS, and the amount of glue was far less, than my wife's 4770K that I delidded several days ago (see picture in this thread). I haven't tested the 4770K yet, and probably won't until we get her board, as it may be toast, as it was the one that was in when the ASRock board SMOKED it's MOSFET (for real, SMOKE).

Anyhow, my 4790K is now delidded, and showing 14-16C improvement!




Oh, and idle seems to be 1-2C above room temperature!!!!!

OCN name: KC5VDJ
CPU: i7 4790K
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
Mhz gained:TBA
OC after delid:TBA
Temp drops:14-16C
CPU-Z validation of max OC:TBA

I might add that putting the IHS TIM on is a bit more difficult. I'm used to doing it before it's in the socket, not after. I normally do the spread method, not the dot or line.


----------



## kc5vdj

Testing at 4.8 GHz @1.35V, where I had it booting into winblowz before on air. Running [email protected] and it's mid to upper 60's C.


----------



## kc5vdj

I don't think I'm going to do any long Prime95 sessions at 4.8GHz @1.35V, but it stays at nice temps in SETI... I'm betting it's stable, but I won't do a long burn on it on this cooler. This is why I wanted the H110i GT, not the H100i GTX. Freaking recall delays... I won't get the H110i GT until I'm building my wife's PC in a couple or few months.

Long testing at or above 90C on any core for any length of time is my cutoff. I will test lower temp though...

I'm also wondering if I seated that waterblock flat or not..

CPU-Z Validation: http://valid.x86.fr/y8ri6u


----------



## cephelix

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> My ambient last night was about 72F / 22.22C. I was already in bed when I realized I hadn't put that in the post.
> 
> The thing is that these numbers also don't seem to change between balanced mode on the fans to ten minutes or so of 100% fans (the coolant temp drops though.
> 
> I have verified with a cigarette that I have positive pressure in the chassis, the power supply fan is mounted down, but the power supply gets a little warm, but that seems to be exiting now via the PCI slot blank vents. The exhaust fan (standard 750D AF140) actually seems to be very close to ambient room temp, and the only hot motherboard temp seems to be the Z97 which seems to be hanging at a peak of 57Cish, but go figure, with the decorative fascia (that eye kinda grows on ya after a while, and doesn't look that bad, and the photos all seem to make the nice anodized red look like red plastic in the marketing pics) probably blocking some of the dissipation from the black fins that it covers. There is a heat pipe connecting the two VRM heatsinks, the PLX heatsink, and the Z97 heatsink, so that could be just a combined thing that would reduce with a custom loop, and water going through the VRM heatsinks. Also, I expected the chipset temp to actually increase as a result of getting the H100i GTX, as the Scythe Big Shuroiken 2 Rev B low-profile heatsink I had on before had an aftermarket 100+cfm SP fan on it blowing a load of air directly down on the VRM and PLX heatsinks.
> 
> Oh, and you can freak out Corsair Link to the point of thinking things are defective, simply by changing your motherboard settings for CPU fan from 100% to "Normal". It seems that a full powerdown (soft first, then once off, flip the AC switch at the back of the PSU, then hold the soft-on button in for a few to discharge caps) seems to clear up the confusion from the controller in the block/pump assembly.
> 
> Also, other first impressions of CorsairLink... "Groups" seems to me to be pretty freaking useless. It fails to list all of the disk drives and all of the fans. Indeed, it seems to stop at twos. Two motherboard fans. Two drives on each controller, maximum. It only reads package temperature from the CPU, without breakdown, and without TDPs (I would think that including the on-chip TDP measurements would be kinda fitting, but it's just not here). The graph function and logging function seem that they can be useful, limited by the omissions of key sensor data that even freeware picks up, yet not CorsairLink.
> 
> So, other than logging some high-level basics in addition to the details of pump speed, radiator fan speed, and changing those two settings along with the LED color, that CorsairLink is quite useless. These are just first impressions, and are limited to mainly initial testing.
> 
> Oh, and another thing... The CorsairLink fails to include a case shot of the 750D for it's main screen, and I tried putting my own picture in.... No image scaling, and no documentation on size constraints. That has to be done by trial and error... I wonder what is up with the failure to include the 750D in the supplied case interior shots for the program? In a thread I have been in over at Corsair, George himself says that the 750D is the best selling chassis his company has ever sold.
> 
> On the freakout when I changed the BIOS settings for CPU fan from the 100% that I had for the Scythe heatsink to "Normal", it's like the whole thing reset, the LED turned white again, the fans went down to either balanced mode or quiet mode (sounds the same), and CorsairLink refused to read it's sensors, or change anything. THE FIX SEEMS TO BE A HARD POWERDOWN TO RESET THE CONTROLLER. (Gigabyte leaves USB power on for charging devices while in soft-off).
> 
> A quick note on the HX650 power supply as well. The PSU (possibly intermittently faulty under load) it replaced, the HX650W (earlier version, I guess), had right-sized SATA cables, with better, but annoying distance between SATA plugs. The current HX650 only supplies two such cables, and they have close spacing suited for use in a stack of drives, but not suited for devices any distance away from the previous connector (SSDs, DVD/BR, Motherboard PCI assist).... Fortunately, the older cables with the single row connector are wired the same as the newer double row connector ones. I'm going to have to do some soldering today and extend the molex cables with the suspect PSU's SATA cables. I really didn't want to be cutting/soldering/heat-shrinking stuff today... Got all the basic drives hooked up, but, one of my FBSD 2.5 inchers and, the DVD, and the motherboard PCI assist require this cable mod...
> 
> As far as the CPU, other testing seems to indicate that my original assessment that this thing needs delidded is seeming to be confirmed. So much for the warranty....
> 
> ANOTHER UPDATE:
> 
> Apparently, the CorsairLink "fixed percentage" mode for the fans will not let you drop below 40% / 1300 RPM. This is strange, as "Quiet Mode" is 800 RPM, and "Balanced mode" is 1100 RPM.
> 
> On a cosmetic side note, the ability to change the LED color is kinda cool, BUT, it's done by three sliders. They could at least get into the 1990's and do a colorspace color picker, with sliders off to the side. Indeed, isn't that a MFC class????






That is a very comprehensive note on Corsair Link..... I've heard there's always been issues with it though I would've thought they've ironed things out by now. Congrats on the delid! your temps look amazing! And not even a custom loop. Hopefully I get similar results, though knowing my luck, I wouldn't hold my breath. Still haven't booted my comp yet. Hopefully I didn't kill the chip.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Intel burn test, be warned it ups temps by nearly 10 or more from prime.
> 
> Seriously, be careful with intel burn


Thanks for that. Is there something that doesn't cause such high temps? kinda limited by tropical weather here. Currently looking at x264 or even AIDA64.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> The 10C variance is actually pretty common. 2 out of the 3 chips Ive delidded are the same way as yours, my personal chip rarely varies more then 5-6C even under load, but Im also on a custom loop, and the other 2 are running H80i and H100i. I even reseated the IHS a couple times, and applied more CLU to the die but it never made a difference in performance or a change in core variance.
> 
> So I'm not really sure what causes the issue.


I didn't know that. I remember reading somewhere that there shouldn't be anything more than 5 deg C variance between cores...Anything more than that means an incorrect application of thermal paste between die and IHS(though that would be before delid)


----------



## Brohem0th

I think it might be the heatsink I'm using. It's a Hyper 212+, which was an earlier revision. The base plate that makes contact with the IHS doesn't have the heatpipes all immediately touching one another and it's not a solid copper plate like the newer models.

At any rate I'm going to get something like an NZXT x61 and order some CLU and give the whole thing another shot. Even though I didn't see quite the drop in temps as I wanted, I can run 4.8Ghz/1.325v and not even hit 80c. If I could gain another 10-20c thermal headroom I could do 5Ghz at 1.4v and keep the temps sane, and I don't have the best OC'ing board of all time either.

I am torn between getting an x61 vs something like an NH-D15. Every review I've seen for both was using stock fans or low noise fans on either of them, and I haven't seen a review of the NH-D15 with three fans anywhere. I personally think the x61 with some high-performance fans would outperform an NH-D15 even if it did have three good fans on it, but I've seen people do crazy stuff like wrap their fans and heatsink/radiator with tape to form a perfect seal for airflow. It looks ghetto but the performance gain is real and there's really no way to do it and it not look dumb.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> I didn't know that. I remember reading somewhere that there shouldn't be anything more than 5 deg C variance between cores...Anything more than that means an incorrect application of thermal paste between die and IHS(though that would be before delid)


Actually, the published tolerance for EACH DTS is +-5C. The spread can be 10C and still be in Intel spec. See the datasheet.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Can I slap the .sig on now???
> 
> Prime95 Blend... See my previous post for comparison. I'm calling 14-16C drop on average. SETI is now actually in the 40's!!!!
> 
> On a side note, this did have fat better contact under the IHS, and the amount of glue was far less, than my wife's 4770K that I delidded several days ago (see picture in this thread). I haven't tested the 4770K yet, and probably won't until we get her board, as it may be toast, as it was the one that was in when the ASRock board SMOKED it's MOSFET (for real, SMOKE).
> 
> Anyhow, my 4790K is now delidded, and showing 14-16C improvement!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and idle seems to be 1-2C above room temperature!!!!!
> 
> OCN name: KC5VDJ
> CPU: i7 4790K
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
> Mhz gained:TBA
> OC after delid:TBA
> Temp drops:14-16C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:TBA
> 
> I might add that putting the IHS TIM on is a bit more difficult. I'm used to doing it before it's in the socket, not after. I normally do the spread method, not the dot or line.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 
> That is a very comprehensive note on Corsair Link..... I've heard there's always been issues with it though I would've thought they've ironed things out by now. Congrats on the delid! your temps look amazing! And not even a custom loop. Hopefully I get similar results, though knowing my luck, I wouldn't hold my breath. Still haven't booted my comp yet. Hopefully I didn't kill the chip.
> Thanks for that. Is there something that doesn't cause such high temps? kinda limited by tropical weather here. Currently looking at x264 or even AIDA64.
> I didn't know that. I remember reading somewhere that there shouldn't be anything more than 5 deg C variance between cores...Anything more than that means an incorrect application of thermal paste between die and IHS(though that would be before delid)


from hottest down its usually intel burn, prime, then aida and others


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Aye, Aye, Cap'n!

Thanks!


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Actually, the published tolerance for EACH DTS is +-5C. The spread can be 10C and still be in Intel spec. See the datasheet.


And that's assuming the cores are all at the same temp, which they aren't necessarily.

I think the leading theory on the temp split is that the cold core is the one next to the iGPU, which acts like a pseudo-heatsink for that core.


----------



## Tamuro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamuro*
> 
> Well, I ended up just buying a new 3770k because I just didn't trust the last one after my bad delid. Boy did I get a nice chip this time around. I forgot to take a SS of temps before delidding but all 4 cores were in the upper 90's with the quick 4.9mhz I tried. After the delid I dropped to well below 70's. here are my results so far after about 12hours of Prime95 @5k
> 
> I was able to push it to 5.4 before I decided to hold off on finding the ceiling and just get a 24/7 OC to run.
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/SC1f0Mm
> 
> 
> Not sure how to make linked image bigger.


Put me in the club coach. Above is from like 20 pages back.

OCN, Tamuro
CPU, Core i7 IB 3770k
TIM on die, CLU
Tim on IHS, IC Diamond
Temp Drop, 31c
OC, 5G 24/7 overclock
1.34v


----------



## cephelix

now it's my turn to experience huge variation in temps between cores when I did not before the delid...
oh well, will try reapplying clu again later..... will need to rearrange my fans to see if i can improve airflow


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tamuro*
> 
> Put me in the club coach. Above is from like 20 pages back.
> 
> OCN, Tamuro
> CPU, Core i7 IB 3770k
> TIM on die, CLU
> Tim on IHS, IC Diamond
> Temp Drop, 31c
> OC, 5G 24/7 overclock
> 1.34v


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> now it's my turn to experience huge variation in temps between cores when I did not before the delid...
> oh well, will try reapplying clu again later..... will need to rearrange my fans to see if i can improve airflow


Check the voltage on each core. I have one core that always runs about 5 degrees warmer than the others when idle and nearly 10 degrees warmer under load. I have VCore set to 1.375 in BIOS and all the cores show 1.376 except for one which always fluctuates between 1.392 and 1.376. It seems it is always just pulling a little more voltage than the other cores. Also reapplying CLU is a good idea. My temps weren't quite what I would have liked, and I took the top back off and found all the CLU had shifted to one side. I re spread it and was more careful reattaching the IHS this time and now my temps are about 10 degrees lower. If you are using anything to glue the IHS down, be sure you apply as thin a layer as you can so that there is nothing preventing the IHS from sitting all the way down on the PCB. Good luck!


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Check the voltage on each core. I have one core that always runs about 5 degrees warmer than the others when idle and nearly 10 degrees warmer under load. I have VCore set to 1.375 in BIOS and all the cores show 1.376 except for one which always fluctuates between 1.392 and 1.376. It seems it is always just pulling a little more voltage than the other cores. Also reapplying CLU is a good idea. My temps weren't quite what I would have liked, and I took the top back off and found all the CLU had shifted to one side. I re spread it and was more careful reattaching the IHS this time and now my temps are about 10 degrees lower. If you are using anything to glue the IHS down, be sure you apply as thin a layer as you can so that there is nothing preventing the IHS from sitting all the way down on the PCB. Good luck!


Well,this is at stock turbo boost sppeds.and at that point for some reason my cores were not downxloxcking immediately. But i think you're right.i would probably have to reapply CLU since i shiftred the IHS abit while locking down the socket mechanism.


----------



## kc5vdj

OH YES!!! 5 GHz!!!!! RIGHT NOW!!!!

It is still running. Doing the PrintScrn and Photoshop hasn't crashed it.

I wonder if it could handle SETI temperatures?



CPU-Z Validation

The question is if it can crunch without bluescreening, and if it can, how low a Vcore I can do it at.

Oh, and this is with DDR3-2400 XMP profile active!

I'm STILL at this speed!!!!


----------



## cephelix

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> OH YES!!! 5 GHz!!!!! RIGHT NOW!!!!
> 
> It is still running. Doing the PrintScrn and Photoshop hasn't crashed it.
> 
> I wonder if it could handle SETI temperatures?
> 
> 
> 
> CPU-Z Validation
> 
> The question is if it can crunch without bluescreening, and if it can, how low a Vcore I can do it at.
> 
> Oh, and this is with DDR3-2400 XMP profile active!
> 
> I'm STILL at this speed!!!!






Nice work man!!








and great temps!if it's stable at 5GHz, are you planning to keep it as a 24/7 OC? or is this just for numbers? i know it doesn't mean much but your idle temps look good.....


----------



## kc5vdj

Anyone know how to get around a blue screen 0x101? "Clock Interrupt not received on secondary processor within allotted time interval"

I got this shortly after starting [email protected]

PLL? Anyone got any good advice for current Gigabyte UEFI settings on Z97?

Blue Screen Error=0x101 (0x19, 0x0, 0xFFFFF880033E6180, 0x4)


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 
> Nice work man!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and great temps!if it's stable at 5GHz, are you planning to keep it as a 24/7 OC? or is this just for numbers? i know it doesn't mean much but your idle temps look good.....


Not at 1.425Vcore... But I will save it for the bag of tricks, if I can get around this clock interrupt blue screen... Then, I'll try to tweak down the voltage. I get the same error at both 4.8 and 4.9 too. I don't think Vcore is the fix.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Not at 1.425Vcore... But I will save it for the bag of tricks, if I can get around this clock interrupt blue screen... Then, I'll try to tweak down the voltage. I get the same error at both 4.8 and 4.9 too. I don't think Vcore is the fix.


noob qn, what's a clock interrupt blue screen? is there an event ID?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> noob qn, what's a clock interrupt blue screen? is there an event ID?


I gave all of the info it gave. Including the hex codes. I'm reading it could be a Vcore too low, or a PLL thing...

"Clock Interrupt not received on secondary processor within allotted time interval"

Blue Screen Error=0x101 (0x19, 0x0, 0xFFFFF880033E6180, 0x4)

I'm going to try playing with the PLL...


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> I gave all of the info it gave. Including the hex codes. I'm reading it could be a Vcore too low, or a PLL thing...
> 
> "Clock Interrupt not received on secondary processor within allotted time interval"
> 
> Blue Screen Error=0x101 (0x19, 0x0, 0xFFFFF880033E6180, 0x4)
> 
> I'm going to try playing with the PLL...


thanks!! will look it up later.
Been getting bluescreens at stock for a while....really random but happens when I use skype...very weird


----------



## LandonAaron

Sound
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Anyone know how to get around a blue screen 0x101? "Clock Interrupt not received on secondary processor within allotted time interval"
> 
> I got this shortly after starting [email protected]
> 
> PLL? Anyone got any good advice for current Gigabyte UEFI settings on Z97?
> 
> Blue Screen Error=0x101 (0x19, 0x0, 0xFFFFF880033E6180, 0x4)


This is basically where I am stuck at. At anything lower than 4.8Ghz I get BSOD 124, and I can up the Vcore to get it stable. But at 4.9 and 5.0 Ghz I start getting BSOD 101. At 4.9 I was eventually able to get it stable by adding Vcore and VCCIN, but at 5.0 GHZ I just keep getting BSOD 101 even with 1.5v Vcore and 2.15 VCCIN. I am going to try upping the cache voltage a little bit too to see if there is anything there. But yeah I get the feeling that something more than Vcore is required at this speed.

Also temps are still good, (less than 80), but I haven't been able to find anything authoritative on what voltages are safe for Haswell. The number I see quoted the most is to not go over 1.35. Actually seen alot of people claim its not safe to go over 1.35 regardless of temps, but I just don't buy it. But until I find something otherwise I am just going to keep my 4.8 Ghz @ 1.35 OC. I couldn't get stable at 5 Ghz anyway, and 4.9Ghz requires 1.425 for stability so it probably isn't worth it anyway.

Instead I'm taking my time to figure out this adaptive voltage setting, and do some real stress testing for a change. I usually just do 20 minutes of OCCT and call it a day, but I want to make sure its truly stable this time.


----------



## Tamuro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Right on!


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Well,this is at stock turbo boost sppeds.and at that point for some reason my cores were not downxloxcking immediately. But i think you're right.i would probably have to reapply CLU since i shiftred the IHS abit while locking down the socket mechanism.


Yeah, that is why I started gluing mine down. I use Permatex Black Rubber Sealant to glue the IHS down. It comes in a orange tube and is only like $3 at a parts store. It dries almost instantly, peels off cleanly, and holds firmly. The only bad thing about it is that it dries so fast it only stays as a liquid for a few minutes before it starts to dry into a soft rubber. Once its dried into a rubber it could block the IHS from sitting all the way down on to the PCB, so you have to be pretty quick about setting it. Otherwise I think its pretty great. I was also able to seal some leaks I had in my loop with it, which is why I purchased it in the first place.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Yeah, that is why I started gluing mine down. I use Permatex Black Rubber Sealant to glue the IHS down. It comes in a orange tube and is only like $3 at a parts store. It dries almost instantly, peels off cleanly, and holds firmly. The only bad thing about it is that it dries so fast it only stays as a liquid for a few minutes before it starts to dry into a soft rubber. Once its dried into a rubber it could block the IHS from sitting all the way down on to the PCB, so you have to be pretty quick about setting it. Otherwise I think its pretty great. I was also able to seal some leaks I had in my loop with it, which is why I purchased it in the first place.


i have 2 part epoxy, would that work?







lol
i think i'll leave it unglued for now since i'll be messing with it quite a bit.
I gave up on watercooling.....and went back to air....now i need to figure out why my cpu temps increase when i put my fans at full tilt (1850rpm) but i get like 5-7 degrees lower when they're only running at 1200rpm...


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Sound
> This is basically where I am stuck at. At anything lower than 4.8Ghz I get BSOD 124, and I can up the Vcore to get it stable. But at 4.9 and 5.0 Ghz I start getting BSOD 101. At 4.9 I was eventually able to get it stable by adding Vcore and VCCIN, but at 5.0 GHZ I just keep getting BSOD 101 even with 1.5v Vcore and 2.15 VCCIN. I am going to try upping the cache voltage a little bit too to see if there is anything there. But yeah I get the feeling that something more than Vcore is required at this speed.
> 
> Also temps are still good, (less than 80), but I haven't been able to find anything authoritative on what voltages are safe for Haswell. The number I see quoted the most is to not go over 1.35. Actually seen alot of people claim its not safe to go over 1.35 regardless of temps, but I just don't buy it. But until I find something otherwise I am just going to keep my 4.8 Ghz @ 1.35 OC. I couldn't get stable at 5 Ghz anyway, and 4.9Ghz requires 1.425 for stability so it probably isn't worth it anyway.
> 
> Instead I'm taking my time to figure out this adaptive voltage setting, and do some real stress testing for a change. I usually just do 20 minutes of OCCT and call it a day, but I want to make sure its truly stable this time.


Well, setting it to SBPLL and Low Filter didn't do anything to solve it. I just upped to 1.44 Vcore, and that's where I am as I type this. It even recovered from a crash, although it didn't detect the WiFi, but that is an issue that happens anyway, and merely requires a powerdown at the AC switch after a soft-off to clear whatever condition prevented it from being detected. That happens at my conservative 24/7 OC of 4.4 GHz.

The funny thing is that it is only when put under any serious load. SETI, or any of the synthetics. Makes me wonder if there is something involved with AVX in this? It is an AVX optimized SETI, but then, maybe only if hardcore, as I have some stuff I compiled myself... NASA PITEST, FLOPS-2.0....Both AVX2 optimized.

D:\src\flops-2.0>flops-avx2.exe

FLOPS C Program (Double Precision), V2.0 18 Dec 1992

Module Error RunTime MFLOPS
(usec)
1 1.8119e-013 0.0014 9997.2106
2 -1.4166e-013 0.0020 3531.0345
3 3.1904e-010 0.0004 43089.1089
4 9.0594e-014 0.0004 40851.0638
5 -6.2172e-014 0.0014 20708.5077
6 3.3640e-014 0.0007 43288.6297
7 1.8019e-011 0.0042 2832.6418
8 3.7637e-014 0.0007 42785.5153

Iterations = 512000000
NullTime (usec) = 0.0000
MFLOPS(1) = 5045.2909
MFLOPS(2) = 7177.3494
MFLOPS(3) = 15921.6187
MFLOPS(4) = 42666.6667

D:\src\flops-2.0>

D:\src\pitest>pitest-avx2-mx.14.exe
PI4 COMPUTATION TEST -- DP COMPLEX FFT MP VERSION

MW = 14 NW = 4096 ND = 24570

ITERATION 1 7
ITERATION 2 7
ITERATION 3 7
ITERATION 4 7
ITERATION 5 7
ITERATION 6 7
ITERATION 7 7

CPU TIME = 0.0781 SECONDS.

D:\src\pitest>pitest-avx2-mx.23.exe
PI4 COMPUTATION TEST -- DP COMPLEX FFT MP VERSION

MW = 23 NW = 2097152 ND = 12582906

ITERATION 1 12
ITERATION 2 12
ITERATION 3 12
ITERATION 4 12
ITERATION 5 12
ITERATION 6 12
ITERATION 7 12
ITERATION 8 12
ITERATION 9 12
ITERATION 10 12
ITERATION 11 12
ITERATION 12 12

CPU TIME = 234.6797 SECONDS.

D:\src\pitest>

Granted, these are threaded, but they aren't heavily threaded, and PITEST is quite RAM intensive, and you'd figure if it was the RAM, the DDR3-2400 setting would show up. As for threading, the Intel versions of the Cray directives in PITEST are being used, and all of the vector optimizations enabled and scalar commented out in the source code. The granularity on the timer I'm using in ifort needs to be switched to something better though. As far as the old FLOPS benchmark, icl was set for automatic vectorization, and it shows, as AVX2 is twice as fast as AVX with that.

All of the above was just run at 5 GHz @1.44 Vcore.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i have 2 part epoxy, would that work?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> i think i'll leave it unglued for now since i'll be messing with it quite a bit.
> I gave up on watercooling.....and went back to air....now i need to figure out why my cpu temps increase when i put my fans at full tilt (1850rpm) but i get like 5-7 degrees lower when they're only running at 1200rpm...


Static pressure drops at high RPM maybe?

Well, here goes... Gonna try SETI again.... Be back after the windows crash recovery settles down (I'm not expecting this to work)...


----------



## kc5vdj

Oh this is great. That last crash lost all of my [email protected] settings and about 100 work units... It's asking if I want to join a project as soon as I start BOINC now.

#$%%!#$%%%!#$%[email protected]!#$Q#[email protected][email protected]$%#[email protected]@!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Oh this is great. That last crash lost all of my [email protected] settings and about 100 work units... It's asking if I want to join a project as soon as I start BOINC now.
> 
> #$%%!#$%%%!#$%[email protected]!#$Q#[email protected][email protected]$%#[email protected]@!!!!!!!!!!


usch......that's not want you wanted to see.....
my intakes are gentle typhoons though...


----------



## kc5vdj

Oh this is great. That last crash lost all of my [email protected] settings and about 100 work units... It's asking if I want to join a project as soon as I start BOINC now.

#$%%!#$%%%!#$%[email protected]!#$Q#[email protected][email protected]$%#[email protected]@!!!!!!!!!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> usch......that's not want you wanted to see.....
> my intakes are gentle typhoons though...


Oh well, my bad. I should have backed up the data directory. I will next time though.









Gentle Typhoons? I dunno man, I like that nice computer room sound. You should hear these SP120L's at 100%...


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Oh this is great. That last crash lost all of my [email protected] settings and about 100 work units... It's asking if I want to join a project as soon as I start BOINC now.
> 
> #$%%!#$%%%!#$%[email protected]!#$Q#[email protected][email protected]$%#[email protected]@!!!!!!!!!!
> Oh well, my bad. I should have backed up the data directory. I will next time though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gentle Typhoons? I dunno man, I like that nice computer room sound. You should hear these SP120L's at 100%...


Yeah..the ap-15. they work great..i think..never really tested them but i had one that all of a sudden stop working and i have no idea why. I hear the sp120 is loud...one of the reasons i didnt purchase them.how are they at moving air with restrictions though?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Yeah..the ap-15. they work great..i think..never really tested them but i had one that all of a sudden stop working and i have no idea why. I hear the sp120 is loud...one of the reasons i didnt purchase them.how are they at moving air with restrictions though?


I can feel the air all the way to the bottom of the chassis on top of the middle drive sled (750D). I have the fans mounted above the rad in intake for positive pressure. The water temp has yet to exceed 36C in the low fan settings, so it's not going to be a chassis temp issue. Also I can feel that it's positive pressure at the PCI slots, and it blows cig smoke away.

At 100%, they certainly remind me of some computer rooms I've worked in. Same sound. For high overclock experiments, I don't mess around, I have them at 100%, just in case... Otherwise it's in balanced or performance mode. For watching movies, I find balanced mode is really no more audible than quiet mode.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i have 2 part epoxy, would that work?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> i think i'll leave it unglued for now since i'll be messing with it quite a bit.
> I gave up on watercooling.....and went back to air....now i need to figure out why my cpu temps increase when i put my fans at full tilt (1850rpm) but i get like 5-7 degrees lower when they're only running at 1200rpm...


You case fans or your CPU cooler fan?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> You case fans or your CPU cooler fan?


case fans......cooler fans are the stock ones that came with the NH-D15.
I'm thinking i may need a better exhaust fan... or at least shift one of the top ap-15 to the rear exhaust to replace the bitfenix spectre pro led that's currently there


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> You case fans or your CPU cooler fan?


Nah, it's blowing down from the top. I can't feel the case fans generally unless I have the front off.

Gawd, I can't read, you were responding to him. My bad.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> case fans......cooler fans are the stock ones that came with the NH-D15.
> I'm thinking i may need a better exhaust fan... or at least shift one of the top ap-15 to the rear exhaust to replace the bitfenix spectre pro led that's currently there


Are you sure you don't wanna do water? That thing is a freaking monster. I held one once, you must have a pretty stout motherboard to hang that sideways off the thing. how much does it weigh? Almost a kilo?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Are you sure you don't wanna do water? That thing is a freaking monster. I held one once, you must have a pretty stout motherboard to hang that sideways off the thing. how much does it weigh? Almost a kilo?


i already did water..but when i calculated the cost of needing to change certain parts, the cost was too much.so i just decided to go back to air...
yeah, the heatsink itself weights about a kilo...with fans i think it's 1320g


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Oh this is great. That last crash lost all of my [email protected] settings and about 100 work units... It's asking if I want to join a project as soon as I start BOINC now.
> 
> #$%%!#$%%%!#$%[email protected]!#$Q#[email protected][email protected]$%#[email protected]@!!!!!!!!!!
> ..


http://valid.canardpc.com/stubnn


It is frustrating but I knew I was on to a 5Ghz chip when I could boot to windows @ 5Ghz with 1.35v
I know different series of chip but this chip still takes 1.46v to be rock stable @ 5Ghz
Stability tested over 2 months with no WHEA errors logged in the windows Event viewer.
BSOD is just Highly unstable WHEA errors are slightly unstable ie self correct errors
probably you will see a dozen WHEA errors way before a BSOD


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i already did water..but when i calculated the cost of needing to change certain parts, the cost was too much.so i just decided to go back to air...
> yeah, the heatsink itself weights about a kilo...with fans i think it's 1320g


How do you like the NH-D15? I've already got two Phanteks F140HP's that I'm running on my Hyper 212+, I could throw a third fan on an NH-D15 and maybe get some more thermal headroom? What kind of fan speed profile do you run on your CPU fans? How many are there? What kind of temps do you get with 1.4ish Vcore?

I'm torn between getting an NH-D15 or an NZXT Kraken x61. I personally prefer air (and much prefer it over a CLC) but the sheer size of the Noctua means that my already cramped case is going to be even more packed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i already did water..but when i calculated the cost of needing to change certain parts, the cost was too much.so i just decided to go back to air...
> yeah, the heatsink itself weights about a kilo...with fans i think it's 1320g


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> How do you like the NH-D15? I've already got two Phanteks F140HP's that I'm running on my Hyper 212+, I could throw a third fan on an NH-D15 and maybe get some more thermal headroom? What kind of fan speed profile do you run on your CPU fans? How many are there? What kind of temps do you get with 1.4ish Vcore?
> 
> I'm torn between getting an NH-D15 or an NZXT Kraken x61. I personally prefer air (and much prefer it over a CLC) but the sheer size of the Noctua means that my already cramped case is going to be even more packed.


Wow,that's a long list of questions!haha. I'll try to answer what I can. Hopefully it'll be of use to you. First of all,i'll,try to paint a word picture of my system.

Case is the Corsair 750D.Ambient temps range from 25-30deg C, cooler intake temps, from 28-30deg C. I have 7 gentle typhoons ap-15(3 top, 2 front, 2 bottom) as intake running at about 1200rpm which gives me the best temps so far. Running them higher causes an increase in cpu temps(i don't know the reason for this). I have 1 rear exhaust(bitfenix spectre pro led) running at 1200rpm. NH-D15 cooler uses stock fans running at 1200rpm as well in a push-pull setup(means ram slots are blocked). I run all my fans flat out at a particular speed rather that following a fan curve. Granted this current system has just been rebuilt yesterday and I haven't had the chance to tweak the system.

For rams,make sure if you don't want to offset the fan too much in the stock configuration that you have extreme low profile rams. I'm using Kingston valueram and i still have to offset the front fan. If you run the fan in a push-pull config,max height of ram is 32mm or thereabouts before you have to offset the fan. In pull-pull, that clearance is doubled

So far, i have no complaints about the NH-D15. It's big and heavy but the mounting is simple so there isn't much of a worry or hassle about it. I've read through a fair bit of @doyll's threads and it seems that the cooler is one of the top though he suggests that there are cheaper alternatives that perform just as well though unfortunately I cannot find them locally. He also suggests that replacing the stock fans with thermalright's ty-143 would yield better temps. But adding a third fan wouldn't be enough of a tradeoff between temps vs noise. Also, noctua doesn't supply/sell or otherwise provide a third set of fan clips as their testing also proves the abovementioned point of temps vs noise.
If you still insist on adding a third fan, you'll have to ghetto rig it to the cooler somehow but that means that there wouldn't be space for a proper rear exhaust fan, at least in my case.

As stated, I haven't had the chance to test my system yet. But at 1.2V, turbo boost speed with all fans at full bore, i get core temps of 40-50 deg.

Take my values with a large grain of salt since I'll need to check if my CLU and gelid gc extreme application is correct since this is the first time I'm using both as well as trying to optimise my case's airflow plus not having overclocked or stressed my system whatsoever.

Do let me know if you have any other questions. I'll read through this again when I get home and try to fill in any gaps I find


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Wow,that's a long list of questions!haha. I'll try to answer what I can. Hopefully it'll be of use to you. First of all,i'll,try to paint a word picture of my system.
> 
> Case is the Corsair 750D.Ambient temps range from 25-30deg C, cooler intake temps, from 28-30deg C. I have 7 gentle typhoons ap-15(3 top, 2 front, 2 bottom) as intake running at about 1200rpm which gives me the best temps so far. Running them higher causes an increase in cpu temps(i don't know the reason for this). I have 1 rear exhaust(bitfenix spectre pro led) running at 1200rpm. NH-D15 cooler uses stock fans running at 1200rpm as well in a push-pull setup(means ram slots are blocked). I run all my fans flat out at a particular speed rather that following a fan curve. Granted this current system has just been rebuilt yesterday and I haven't had the chance to tweak the system.
> 
> For rams,make sure if you don't want to offset the fan too much in the stock configuration that you have extreme low profile rams. I'm using Kingston valueram and i still have to offset the front fan. If you run the fan in a push-pull config,max height of ram is 32mm or thereabouts before you have to offset the fan. In pull-pull, that clearance is doubled
> 
> So far, i have no complaints about the NH-D15. It's big and heavy but the mounting is simple so there isn't much of a worry or hassle about it. I've read through a fair bit of @doyll's threads and it seems that the cooler is one of the top though he suggests that there are cheaper alternatives that perform just as well though unfortunately I cannot find them locally. He also suggests that replacing the stock fans with thermalright's ty-143 would yield better temps. But adding a third fan wouldn't be enough of a tradeoff between temps vs noise. Also, noctua doesn't supply/sell or otherwise provide a third set of fan clips as their testing also proves the abovementioned point of temps vs noise.
> If you still insist on adding a third fan, you'll have to ghetto rig it to the cooler somehow but that means that there wouldn't be space for a proper rear exhaust fan, at least in my case.
> 
> As stated, I haven't had the chance to test my system yet. But at 1.2V, turbo boost speed with all fans at full bore, i get core temps of 40-50 deg.
> 
> Take my values with a large grain of salt since I'll need to check if my CLU and gelid gc extreme application is correct since this is the first time I'm using both as well as trying to optimise my case's airflow plus not having overclocked or stressed my system whatsoever.
> 
> Do let me know if you have any other questions. I'll read through this again when I get home and try to fill in any gaps I find


Interesting. I like the noctua fan ratings, but I hate the poop color fans... The funny thing here is that the D15 in particular is why I went with the CLC, the lightness of the radiator itself kinda freaked me out even when it was finally here. do you use some kind of back of motherboard brace to prevent the stress of having that thing sticking out sideways? My wife and I are on a tight budget, and after spending $330 on this motherboard, I just couldn't do the D15, despite it's amazing ratings. The idea of all of that weight just hanging out from a few mm of support....


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/stubnn
> 
> 
> It is frustrating but I knew I was on to a 5Ghz chip when I could boot to windows @ 5Ghz with 1.35v
> I know different series of chip but this chip still takes 1.46v to be rock stable @ 5Ghz
> Stability tested over 2 months with no WHEA errors logged in the windows Event viewer.
> BSOD is just Highly unstable WHEA errors are slightly unstable ie self correct errors
> probably you will see a dozen WHEA errors way before a BSOD


Yeah I have been found that certain errors in the Event Viewer are a sign of instability, especially anything relating L2 Cache, but what are WHEA errors, and is there a way to filter to them. Because 90% of the stuff in my event viewer is stuff that I am pretty sure can be safely ignored.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Yeah I have been found that certain errors in the Event Viewer are a sign of instability, especially anything relating L2 Cache, but what are WHEA errors, and is there a way to filter to them. Because 90% of the stuff in my event viewer is stuff that I am pretty sure can be safely ignored.


FWIW, I can boot 5Ghz at 1.38v, but it'll eventually get so hot under any kind of load that it will lose stability. Same for 4.9Ghz at 1.37v; eventually it'll hit 90c+ core temps and the extra heat and resistance makes it destabilise. I'm fairly certain that's what's happening in this circumstance, especially if it's on air.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Wow,that's a long list of questions!haha. I'll try to answer what I can. Hopefully it'll be of use to you. First of all,i'll,try to paint a word picture of my system.
> 
> Case is the Corsair 750D.Ambient temps range from 25-30deg C, cooler intake temps, from 28-30deg C. I have 7 gentle typhoons ap-15(3 top, 2 front, 2 bottom) as intake running at about 1200rpm which gives me the best temps so far. Running them higher causes an increase in cpu temps(i don't know the reason for this). I have 1 rear exhaust(bitfenix spectre pro led) running at 1200rpm. NH-D15 cooler uses stock fans running at 1200rpm as well in a push-pull setup(means ram slots are blocked). I run all my fans flat out at a particular speed rather that following a fan curve. Granted this current system has just been rebuilt yesterday and I haven't had the chance to tweak the system.
> 
> For rams,make sure if you don't want to offset the fan too much in the stock configuration that you have extreme low profile rams. I'm using Kingston valueram and i still have to offset the front fan. If you run the fan in a push-pull config,max height of ram is 32mm or thereabouts before you have to offset the fan. In pull-pull, that clearance is doubled
> 
> So far, i have no complaints about the NH-D15. It's big and heavy but the mounting is simple so there isn't much of a worry or hassle about it. I've read through a fair bit of @doyll's threads and it seems that the cooler is one of the top though he suggests that there are cheaper alternatives that perform just as well though unfortunately I cannot find them locally. He also suggests that replacing the stock fans with thermalright's ty-143 would yield better temps. But adding a third fan wouldn't be enough of a tradeoff between temps vs noise. Also, noctua doesn't supply/sell or otherwise provide a third set of fan clips as their testing also proves the abovementioned point of temps vs noise.
> If you still insist on adding a third fan, you'll have to ghetto rig it to the cooler somehow but that means that there wouldn't be space for a proper rear exhaust fan, at least in my case.
> 
> As stated, I haven't had the chance to test my system yet. But at 1.2V, turbo boost speed with all fans at full bore, i get core temps of 40-50 deg.
> 
> Take my values with a large grain of salt since I'll need to check if my CLU and gelid gc extreme application is correct since this is the first time I'm using both as well as trying to optimise my case's airflow plus not having overclocked or stressed my system whatsoever.
> 
> Do let me know if you have any other questions. I'll read through this again when I get home and try to fill in any gaps I find


I don't mind ordering another pair of fan mounts for the cooler, and I've already got low profile RAM, so it's NBD. I'm mostly just worried about performance, although I still think I'd be better off with a 280mm CLC in a push-pull config with some decent fans. The NH-D15 and D-14 both have really, really nice mounting brackets. Leaps and bounds better than the mounting bracket that comes with a Hyper 212.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> FWIW, I can boot 5Ghz at 1.38v, but it'll eventually get so hot under any kind of load that it will lose stability. Same for 4.9Ghz at 1.37v; eventually it'll hit 90c+ core temps and the extra heat and resistance makes it destabilize. I'm fairly certain that's what's happening in this circumstance, especially if it's on air.
> 
> I don't mind ordering another pair of fan mounts for the cooler, and I've already got low profile RAM, so it's NBD. I'm mostly just worried about performance, although I still think I'd be better off with a 280mm CLC in a push-pull config with some decent fans. The NH-D15 and D-14 both have really, really nice mounting brackets. Leaps and bounds better than the mounting bracket that comes with a Hyper 212.


instead of going the CLC route, why not go with an AIO such as the Swiftech X series? Since I don't have experience with CLCs, I can only comment on AIOs, especialy the Swiftech one....

To me, I kind of like the ability to expand the loop just in case you need to...
Even if you try to order from Noctua, they won't entertain you. Someone has tried before.

@kc5vdj No brace or whatever. I just use whatever was given. I'm just careful when I start shifting my case for rewiring or whatever. Then again, I've always been very careful. I have to be when it's a box containing items that cost a lot of money. The CLC was cheaper than the noctua? that's weird. Over here, CLCs never go lower in price than air coolers. And by that I mean the 240mm CLCs.....


----------



## LandonAaron

In my opinion CLC/AIO is the way to go if you don't want to do a custom loop. All in ones are no maintenance required items. I still have a corsair H50 that nearly 5 years old installed in my fiances computer. Its only a 120mm thin style 35mm thick rad, but it does a good job with the temps on a i7-965. Move up to a 240mm thick style 45mm rad and you will have some pretty good cooling. Air coolers are too large and bulky, too loud, and have a hard time competing with AIO's thermally.

Really though, if you are going to spend more than $100 dollars on a cooler I suggest getting an XSPC starter kit to get yourself a custom loop. You can get an XSPC starter kit with a 240m radiator, CPU block, reservoir/pump, hose, and fittings for just $150. It comes with everything you need to get started and is an excellent way to to get into custom loops.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> In my opinion CLC/AIO is the way to go if you don't want to do a custom loop. All in ones are no maintenance required items. I still have a corsair H50 that nearly 5 years old installed in my fiances computer. Its only a 120mm thin style 35mm thick rad, but it does a good job with the temps on a i7-965. Move up to a 240mm thick style 45mm rad and you will have some pretty good cooling. Air coolers are too large and bulky, too loud, and have a hard time competing with AIO's thermally.
> 
> Really though, if you are going to spend more than $100 dollars on a cooler I suggest getting an XSPC starter kit to get yourself a custom loop. You can get an XSPC starter kit with a 240m radiator, CPU block, reservoir/pump, hose, and fittings for just $150. It comes with everything you need to get started and is an excellent way to to get into custom loops.


Actually, I am impressed with the numbers I'm getting from the new H100i GTX. The expandability would be nice though, but we already have this, and it was like only $119.. I wanted to get the H110i GT, but it's like still at the latter part of the recall issue (supposedly they are shipping to the distributors now). Anyhow, this will work fine in my wife's build once I get it going, and get the H110i GT for me.

We want to go higher-end on the custom loop next year, so we are just going to start collecting parts. I'm still stuck on if I want to start the loop with the Nexxxos XT45 420 (which will fit into the top of this Corsair 750D with just the bending of the "ears" on the top 5.25" mount, or just going full external with the king, the Watercool MO-RA3 420 Pro Black (I can't see in paying that much more for the full stainless), and case-modding a back of computer hard-mount. The only way I will do external is if it is hard mounted, and the tubing protected. With this pricing, it's like buying two 420x140's and getting one free. The benefit of the MO-RA3 is quite simply that I can keep the drives in the box, and still do a really nice interior tubing / res thing. Going to use the PETG, and later get some of the black nickel, once I finalize on how I want that done, but the end result will probably be hybrid black nickel and clear PETG tubing. The fittings are the same for both (13/10).

Flexible tubing reminds me of the air conditioner in Lowrey's aparement in the movie Brazil... I want a nice clean look with the PETG. Gonna be buying some to practice bending with in the meantime so I have that down pat before it's time to do the loop.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> In my opinion CLC/AIO is the way to go if you don't want to do a custom loop. All in ones are no maintenance required items. I still have a corsair H50 that nearly 5 years old installed in my fiances computer. Its only a 120mm thin style 35mm thick rad, but it does a good job with the temps on a i7-965. Move up to a 240mm thick style 45mm rad and you will have some pretty good cooling. Air coolers are too large and bulky, too loud, and have a hard time competing with AIO's thermally.
> 
> Really though, if you are going to spend more than $100 dollars on a cooler I suggest getting an XSPC starter kit to get yourself a custom loop. You can get an XSPC starter kit with a 240m radiator, CPU block, reservoir/pump, hose, and fittings for just $150. It comes with everything you need to get started and is an excellent way to to get into custom loops.


150 isn't bad but the xspc kit i had my eye on when i tried water costs sgd400 minimum here while the swiftech was half of that.too steep a price imo so i went with the h220, which of course after about a year, even with the impeller revision and expanding and rebuilding the loop, gave me horrible rattling noises and no peace of mind. So instead of having to spend another S$600 minimum on purchasing replacement parts, i decided to speand S$139 and get myself the biggest air cooler out there








going there and back i realize that I actually don't mind the look of a large air cooler for some reason. Maybe i'm the weird one


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 150 isn't bad but the xspc kit i had my eye on when i tried water costs sgd400 minimum here while the swiftech was half of that.too steep a price imo so i went with the h220, which of course after about a year, even with the impeller revision and expanding and rebuilding the loop, gave me horrible rattling noises and no peace of mind. So instead of having to spend another S$600 minimum on purchasing replacement parts, i decided to speand S$139 and get myself the biggest air cooler out there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> going there and back i realize that I actually don't mind the look of a large air cooler for some reason. Maybe i'm the weird one


I can hear that. I've been wondering what the capacity of the Corsair pump/block units are. My wife and I saw a video the other day where some kid recently found a $50 deal on new old-model H80i units and he cut it open and made a custom loop in the video. It worked fine, but my question is how robust are the pumps themselves?

For our plans for custom next year, we are looking at the Alphacool pumps, they seem highly recommended. The cost difference between AIO and custom is why we are doing that next year, and just going to collect parts along the way...

It'll be nice once it's done though..

Res: http://www.performance-pcs.com/frozenq-lf-reaction-250mm-reservoir-purple-helix.html or http://www.performance-pcs.com/reservoirs/bitspower-water-tank-z-multi-250-limited-brass-edition-true-brass.html

Rad: http://www.performance-pcs.com/alphacool-nexxxos-xt45-full-copper-420mm.html or http://shop.watercool.de/epages/WatercooleK.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/WatercooleK/Products/25120

Fittings: http://www.performance-pcs.com/rigid-revolver-compression-fitting-3-8-x-1-2-diamond-knurled-10-pack-nickel-plated-brass-black.html

Pump: http://www.performance-pcs.com/alphacool-vpp655-pwm-g1-4-ig-inkl-plexi-top.html

CPU: Either http://www.performance-pcs.com/heatkillerr-iv-basic-intel-processor-acryl-clean.html or http://www.performance-pcs.com/ek-supremacy-evo-cpu-water-block-original-csq-copper-plexi.html in plexi-top,
or http://www.performance-pcs.com/heatkillerr-iv-pro-intel-processor-pure-copper.html or http://www.performance-pcs.com/ek-supremacy-evo-cpu-water-block-original-csq-full-copper.html

All of that with transparent clear PETG tubing initially, and later with some elbows and Primochill black nickel tubing (to match the existing fittings) for some long runs. I want to work out a layout first with the PETG, and the PETG will save some money on fittings.


----------



## cephelix

I would say the brass res would go well with the heatkiller blocks and the helix ones with ek.
I always seem to lean towards ek blocks though.guess i'm a sucker for straight lines and right angles


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Yeah I have been found that certain errors in the Event Viewer are a sign of instability, especially anything relating L2 Cache, but what are WHEA errors, and is there a way to filter to them. Because 90% of the stuff in my event viewer is stuff that I am pretty sure can be safely ignored.


here is a more comprehensive guide
It is possible to have no Windows Hardware Error Alerts with BSOD and also WHEA errors that are nothing to do with stability but that's something I personally haven't encountered except on Windows Vista.
as for the event logs you are right 99.99% can be safely ignored I have been though most of mine and when you find the actual cause or the actually error I put it to Why? even bother logging it, for example one error is internet protocol cannot communicate on v6 so reconnect on v4 communication successful I never notice it took a split second longer to connect to a website.

one annoying error log I have is; Disk 153 and is a know windows issue that has a hot fix update but we will get around to investigating it more later the hot fix basically stops windows logging that particular error.

Edit here is a bat file you run as administrator and it will clear the event logs I been told it is not a good idea but when I see 2500+ errors I can't bear to see them









deleteeventlog.zip 0k .zip file


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> here is a more comprehensive guide
> It is possible to have no Windows Hardware Error Alerts with BSOD and also WHEA errors that are nothing to do with stability but that's something I personally haven't encountered except on Windows Vista.
> as for the event logs you are right 99.99% can be safely ignored I have been though most of mine and when you find the actual cause or the actually error I put it to Why? even bother logging it, for example one error is internet protocol cannot communicate on v6 so reconnect on v4 communication successful I never notice it took a split second longer to connect to a website.
> 
> one annoying error log I have is; Disk 153 and is a know windows issue that has a hot fix update but we will get around to investigating it more later the hot fix basically stops windows logging that particular error.
> 
> Edit here is a bat file you run as administrator and it will clear the event logs I been told it is not a good idea but when I see 2500+ errors I can't bear to see them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deleteeventlog.zip 0k .zip file


Okay I see, "Hardware Events" in the event viewer. I was just looking under "Administrator Events" which is full of all sorts of stuff. I tried once to go through each event and find a solution, but one could drive one's self mad trying to sort through that mess. I get like 10 events just from turning on my computer. Under Hardware Events though, I have "0 Events" so I guess I'm good.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> I can hear that. I've been wondering what the capacity of the Corsair pump/block units are. My wife and I saw a video the other day where some kid recently found a $50 deal on new old-model H80i units and he cut it open and made a custom loop in the video. It worked fine, but my question is how robust are the pumps themselves?
> 
> For our plans for custom next year, we are looking at the Alphacool pumps, they seem highly recommended. The cost difference between AIO and custom is why we are doing that next year, and just going to collect parts along the way...
> 
> It'll be nice once it's done though..
> 
> Res: http://www.performance-pcs.com/frozenq-lf-reaction-250mm-reservoir-purple-helix.html or http://www.performance-pcs.com/reservoirs/bitspower-water-tank-z-multi-250-limited-brass-edition-true-brass.html
> 
> Rad: http://www.performance-pcs.com/alphacool-nexxxos-xt45-full-copper-420mm.html or http://shop.watercool.de/epages/WatercooleK.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/WatercooleK/Products/25120
> 
> Fittings: http://www.performance-pcs.com/rigid-revolver-compression-fitting-3-8-x-1-2-diamond-knurled-10-pack-nickel-plated-brass-black.html
> 
> Pump: http://www.performance-pcs.com/alphacool-vpp655-pwm-g1-4-ig-inkl-plexi-top.html
> 
> CPU: Either http://www.performance-pcs.com/heatkillerr-iv-basic-intel-processor-acryl-clean.html or http://www.performance-pcs.com/ek-supremacy-evo-cpu-water-block-original-csq-copper-plexi.html in plexi-top,
> or http://www.performance-pcs.com/heatkillerr-iv-pro-intel-processor-pure-copper.html or http://www.performance-pcs.com/ek-supremacy-evo-cpu-water-block-original-csq-full-copper.html
> 
> All of that with transparent clear PETG tubing initially, and later with some elbows and Primochill black nickel tubing (to match the existing fittings) for some long runs. I want to work out a layout first with the PETG, and the PETG will save some money on fittings.


Good luck on the hard line tubing. I want to go that route eventually myself, but it seems difficult. I work from home and and need my computer for work, so its hard to find the time to a hardline conversion. I would need a new case before I went that route too. I am one of those weird people who doesn't mind an external rad. To me it looks like a set of afterburners or something. I call it my second stage turbine blade.


----------



## NIK1

Just got my i7 4790k delidded,cleaned her up and put clear finger nail polish on the resistors next to the die. How long should I let the nail polish dry before I put the clu on and finish my install.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> Just got my i7 4790k delidded,cleaned her up and put clear finger nail polish on the resistors next to the die. How long should I let the nail polish dry before I put the clu on and finish my install.


it shouldn't take long to dry, 10 minutes at the most.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Good luck on the hard line tubing. I want to go that route eventually myself, but it seems difficult. I work from home and and need my computer for work, so its hard to find the time to a hardline conversion. I would need a new case before I went that route too. I am one of those weird people who doesn't mind an external rad. To me it looks like a set of afterburners or something. I call it my second stage turbine blade.


Liking your build!hard tubing would make it perfect but even then,as it is your tube runs are already nice. One question though, wouldn't the rad be taking in from your rear exhaust and heating up whatever other stuff? or is it a non issue since you have so much rad space and it's mounted quite a distance away from the case?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> Just got my i7 4790k delidded,cleaned her up and put clear finger nail polish on the resistors next to the die. How long should I let the nail polish dry before I put the clu on and finish my install.


Depends on how think you glob it on.either way shouldn't be more than half an hr.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Good luck on the hard line tubing. I want to go that route eventually myself, but it seems difficult. I work from home and and need my computer for work, so its hard to find the time to a hardline conversion. I would need a new case before I went that route too. I am one of those weird people who doesn't mind an external rad. To me it looks like a set of afterburners or something. I call it my second stage turbine blade.


THIS IS THE EXACT KIND OF MOUNT I HAVE BEEN DESCRIBING!!! It's the only place I can figure to put it, other than over the top, and on the back would just look better, and judging from yours, it does.

Thanks for the pictures, as I've been trying to sell my wife on the idea too. Is that a 360 or 420 by 9?

What's youir distance from the back? I've been thinking about doing one six to eight inches from the back panel (for the sake of access).

Also, can you post pictures of your mounting? I'm thinking of using thick aluminum angle stock.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Good luck on the hard line tubing. I want to go that route eventually myself, but it seems difficult. I work from home and and need my computer for work, so its hard to find the time to a hardline conversion. I would need a new case before I went that route too. I am one of those weird people who doesn't mind an external rad. To me it looks like a set of afterburners or something. I call it my second stage turbine blade.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Liking your build!hard tubing would make it perfect but even then,as it is your tube runs are already nice. One question though, wouldn't the rad be taking in from your rear exhaust and heating up whatever other stuff? or is it a non issue since you have so much rad space and it's mounted quite a distance away from the case?
Click to expand...

Actually that external Rad is Intaking toward the case. You can see the back of the fans. So it isn't In taking anything but coolant from the Case.









~Ceadder


----------



## kc5vdj

Trying this again.... Don't wanna stay in this for too long like this, but I want to see if it can do more than just run windows, and most all programs...and not crash as soon as i hit something hard...

BCLK: 100
Ratio: 50:1
Vrin: 1.90V
Vcore: 1.451V
VRing: 1.200V
Uncore: 4.4 GHz

Ambient Temp: 28.1C

Validation


----------



## cephelix

ouch...1.45V......can any load tests be done? your idle temps are only a few degrees off mine and mine is at stock.....


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> ouch...1.45V......can any load tests be done? your idle temps are only a few degrees off mine and mine is at stock.....



Source
I was thinking I had seen quite a few K series CPU failures but then again maybe not a complete picture as this is a total tally of failures.
Which is actually surprisingly Great for both camps.
or perhaps majority of people that have a failed delidded CPU don't claim warrantee


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> 
> Source
> I was thinking I had seen quite a few K series CPU failures but then again maybe not a complete picture as this is a total tally of failures.
> Which is actually surprisingly Great for both camps.
> or perhaps majority of people that have a failed delidded CPU don't claim warrantee


interesting.those are very low numbers.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> ouch...1.45V......can any load tests be done? your idle temps are only a few degrees off mine and mine is at stock.....


It got through the first two CPU tests in AIDA64, the Queens, and the graphics one, but bluescreened on the zlib one.

Strange. It was doing fine right up until that.

I'm not going to up the voltage beyond that, even for testing. I saved the profile, in case something else needs tweaked. The symptom seems the same, and the voltage doesn't seem to be fixing it. Of course, that's across all four cores, with HT on, and RAM at 2400.

I'll bump down to 4.9 to see if that can be made stable. I'm certain 4.8 can be, and is nearly there.

Back at 4.4 GHz (my 24/7 overclock @ 1.180 Vcore (a day and a half of SETI just over a week ago bluescreened, so I bumped it up another 5 mils, and haven't had any problems since) just passed the Intel Processor Diagnostic Tool...


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Liking your build!hard tubing would make it perfect but even then,as it is your tube runs are already nice. One question though, wouldn't the rad be taking in from your rear exhaust and heating up whatever other stuff? or is it a non issue since you have so much rad space and it's mounted quite a distance away from the case?
> Depends on how think you glob it on.either way shouldn't be more than half an hr.


Theoretically yes the rad may be sucking in some air that is being pushed out the case, but most the components in the case are water cooled any way so the air coming out the case is only a few degrees higher than ambient anyway. Also there is a 4 inch gap between the case and the rad so I think it pulls more fresh air from the room than it does warm air from the case. And besides this only in regards to the very top fan the other two are only pulling fresh air.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> THIS IS THE EXACT KIND OF MOUNT I HAVE BEEN DESCRIBING!!! It's the only place I can figure to put it, other than over the top, and on the back would just look better, and judging from yours, it does.
> 
> Thanks for the pictures, as I've been trying to sell my wife on the idea too. Is that a 360 or 420 by 9?
> 
> What's youir distance from the back? I've been thinking about doing one six to eight inches from the back panel (for the sake of access).
> 
> Also, can you post pictures of your mounting? I'm thinking of using thick aluminum angle stock.


It is a Koolance Radiator Mounting Bracket.



It is kind of expensive at $45 but its really nice. It is adjustable so you can mount the radiator between 3-5 inches away. And it comes with a quick release mechanism. So part of it is attached to the radiator, and part to the case. Hold down a tab to disconnect, and then just press back on to lock in place. Its useful for bleeding the loop, to be able to just disconnect the rad, turn it upside down and let all the air out, then snap it back in place.

If you are doing hardline tubing though, I think you would be better off just bolting the radiator to the back of the case as you don't want the radiator to shift at all with hardline tubing. I would use long screws and spacers like this:



Would probably need longer screws and spacers but you get the idea.

Its a 420mm (3 x 140mm) radiator. If you want to use a 140mm based rad with the mount you also have to buy an adapter plate they sell for the mounting bracket for 140mm size rads for $11. That allows you to connect either a case with 120mm mount to a 140mm rad, or 120mm rad to 140mm case. If both your case and rad are 140mm, I don't think it will work, unless maybe you buy two adapter plates, but I'm not sure.


----------



## cephelix

@LandonAarontrue....the fan should be intaking more cool air than warm air.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Theoretically yes the rad may be sucking in some air that is being pushed out the case, but most the components in the case are water cooled any way so the air coming out the case is only a few degrees higher than ambient anyway. Also there is a 4 inch gap between the case and the rad so I think it pulls more fresh air from the room than it does warm air from the case. And besides this only in regards to the very top fan the other two are only pulling fresh air.
> It is a Koolance Radiator Mounting Bracket.
> 
> 
> 
> It is kind of expensive at $45 but its really nice. It is adjustable so you can mount the radiator between 3-5 inches away. And it comes with a quick release mechanism. So part of it is attached to the radiator, and part to the case. Hold down a tab to disconnect, and then just press back on to lock in place. Its useful for bleeding the loop, to be able to just disconnect the rad, turn it upside down and let all the air out, then snap it back in place.
> 
> If you are doing hardline tubing though, I think you would be better off just bolting the radiator to the back of the case as you don't want the radiator to shift at all with hardline tubing. I would use long screws and spacers like this:
> 
> 
> 
> Would probably need longer screws and spacers but you get the idea.
> 
> Its a 420mm (3 x 140mm) radiator. If you want to use a 140mm based rad with the mount you also have to buy an adapter plate they sell for the mounting bracket for 140mm size rads for $11. That allows you to connect either a case with 120mm mount to a 140mm rad, or 120mm rad to 140mm case. If both your case and rad are 140mm, I don't think it will work, unless maybe you buy two adapter plates, but I'm not sure.


I find these extremely underwhelming with any radiator over a 240mm. that is a lot of weight for not a whole lot of threading to handle and I would use a standing radiator system instead of a off mounting hold system.

my 2 cents


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Theoretically yes the rad may be sucking in some air that is being pushed out the case, but most the components in the case are water cooled any way so the air coming out the case is only a few degrees higher than ambient anyway. Also there is a 4 inch gap between the case and the rad so I think it pulls more fresh air from the room than it does warm air from the case. And besides this only in regards to the very top fan the other two are only pulling fresh air.
> It is a Koolance Radiator Mounting Bracket.
> 
> 
> 
> It is kind of expensive at $45 but its really nice. It is adjustable so you can mount the radiator between 3-5 inches away. And it comes with a quick release mechanism. So part of it is attached to the radiator, and part to the case. Hold down a tab to disconnect, and then just press back on to lock in place. Its useful for bleeding the loop, to be able to just disconnect the rad, turn it upside down and let all the air out, then snap it back in place.
> 
> If you are doing hardline tubing though, I think you would be better off just bolting the radiator to the back of the case as you don't want the radiator to shift at all with hardline tubing. I would use long screws and spacers like this:
> 
> 
> 
> Would probably need longer screws and spacers but you get the idea.
> 
> Its a 420mm (3 x 140mm) radiator. If you want to use a 140mm based rad with the mount you also have to buy an adapter plate they sell for the mounting bracket for 140mm size rads for $11. That allows you to connect either a case with 120mm mount to a 140mm rad, or 120mm rad to 140mm case. If both your case and rad are 140mm, I don't think it will work, unless maybe you buy two adapter plates, but I'm not sure.


I think I'm going to stick to thick/wide aluminum angle stock for a MO-RA3....


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> I think I'm going to stick to thick/wide aluminum angle stock for a MO-RA3....


Lol, I have been looking at the MO-RA3 myself. I was planning on mounting it to the back panel with screws and spacers and probably just selling my 420 and koolance bracket. I want to put a hinge or something on the back panel though to make it easier to open and close the panel with the radiator attached. Will probably also need some feet to put under the rad, as once filled with water I worry it may be heavy enough to tip over the computer.

Anyway, what is this thick/wide almuinum angle stock you speak of? I may want to look into it myself.


----------



## Pawelr98

Anyone used this method ?




Well I only have couple of Celeron D dpu's (non soldered) but just in case AMD Zen is failure then I may buy Ivy/haswell so it's good to know that.

This method seems to be safer than Vice/hammer method.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

That's the "vice-only" method, just with a hair dryer added in to soften the glue a little.
vice-only works well enough on its own without adding heat to the mix, just take it steady while tightening the vice.


----------



## majnu

Upgraded my 3570k to an i7 3770k. Also delidded it on the Bank Holiday.

Before:
Ambient 17.5 degrees c
4.7ghz
1.150v bios
Passed 1hr IBT
IBT Temps 70, 84, 85, 76
Gaming Temps 57, 60, 62, 54
**STABLE**

After (Delid CLP applied):
Ambient 21.5 degrees c
4.7ghz
1.150v bios
Passed 1hr IBT
IBT Temps 49, 54, 60, 54
Gaming Temps 42, 47, 51, 43
**STABLE**

Difference IBT
-21, -30, -25, -22
Difference Gaming
-15, -13, -11, -11

These temps are fantastic and much better than my 3570K which was running at 4.7Ghz @1.380mv (59, 72, 63, 61 IBT).

As for the differences going from an i5 to i7. The FCAT results are lower in BF4 (From 7 to 4). SLI gaming is smoother, less stutter, higher GPU usage, so it did reduce my bottleneck.

For delidding this time around I used some IPA on a cotton bud to soften the glue, which helped speed up the process. Learnt this tip from OCUK where someone used Dental Floss to remove the IHS lol. The stock Intel TIM just flaked off; was very dry and as you can see there was hardly any on the dye therefore wasn't making good thermal transfer to the IHS.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pawelr98*
> 
> Anyone used this method ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well I only have couple of Celeron D dpu's (non soldered) but just in case AMD Zen is failure then I may buy Ivy/haswell so it's good to know that.
> 
> This method seems to be safer than Vice/hammer method.


I used this exact method when i delidded my 4790k last week.


----------



## kc5vdj

Well, I was playing around the last couple of days...

i7-4790K

4.4 GHz = 1.181V unconditionally stable - my 24/7 OC
4.5 GHz = 1.200V two hours stable Prime95 Blend
4.6 GHz = 1.235V two hours stable Prime95 Blend
4.7 GHz = 1.290V Prime95 Blend manually aborted due to brief temp peaks over 90C, probably stable (bluescreen after an hour of 1.285V), but unconfirmed. Awaiting better cooling for further testing.

4.8-5.0 GHz will boot into a rather loaded power user config of winblowz 7 and run light tasks at higher voltages that have not been stress tested due to high thermals at anything other than light tasks.

Corsair H100i GTX cooler, 100% fans, max pump (default).


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pawelr98*
> 
> Anyone used this method ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well I only have couple of Celeron D dpu's (non soldered) but just in case AMD Zen is failure then I may buy Ivy/haswell so it's good to know that.
> 
> This method seems to be safer than Vice/hammer method.


I did the vice only method once, and went a little too fast and cracked the PCB. It was a very small hairline crack that didn't affect anything, just scared the crap out of me. The second time I delidded I hit the processor a few times with a block of wood to kind of loosen up the adhesive, and then I put it in the vice. It came of pretty easy and the PCB was in perfect shape. I tapped pretty lightly with the block of wood. Not strong enough to to knock the IHS off just enough to maybe loosen it a bit.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *majnu*
> 
> Upgraded my 3570k to an i7 3770k. Also delidded it on the Bank Holiday.
> 
> Before:
> Ambient 17.5 degrees c
> 4.7ghz
> 1.150v bios
> Passed 1hr IBT
> IBT Temps 70, 84, 85, 76
> Gaming Temps 57, 60, 62, 54
> **STABLE**
> 
> After (Delid CLP applied):
> Ambient 21.5 degrees c
> 4.7ghz
> 1.150v bios
> Passed 1hr IBT
> IBT Temps 49, 54, 60, 54
> Gaming Temps 42, 47, 51, 43
> **STABLE**
> 
> Difference IBT
> -21, -30, -25, -22
> Difference Gaming
> -15, -13, -11, -11
> 
> These temps are fantastic and much better than my 3570K which was running at 4.7Ghz @1.380mv (59, 72, 63, 61 IBT).
> 
> As for the differences going from an i5 to i7. The FCAT results are lower in BF4 (From 7 to 4). SLI gaming is smoother, less stutter, higher GPU usage, so it did reduce my bottleneck.
> 
> For delidding this time around I used some IPA on a cotton bud to soften the glue, which helped speed up the process. Learnt this tip from OCUK where someone used Dental Floss to remove the IHS lol. The stock Intel TIM just flaked off; was very dry and as you can see there was hardly any on the dye therefore wasn't making good thermal transfer to the IHS.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Nice. I've only done two of these so far, one 4770K and this 4790K, but I'm noticing a pattern here. I think that TIM is actually a pad at the factory, and not glopped on like I had previously thought. The triangles and line are seemingly on all of them. It's like the stuff is folded uniformly into a pad, and then put on the die before lidding, and melts in actual operation, kinda like that Indigo pad....


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Lol, I have been looking at the MO-RA3 myself. I was planning on mounting it to the back panel with screws and spacers and probably just selling my 420 and koolance bracket. I want to put a hinge or something on the back panel though to make it easier to open and close the panel with the radiator attached. Will probably also need some feet to put under the rad, as once filled with water I worry it may be heavy enough to tip over the computer.
> 
> Anyway, what is this thick/wide almuinum angle stock you speak of? I may want to look into it myself.


That Koolance Exos hinge thing was a great idea, but I want at LEAST six inches, of space, that's why I am thinking of using at least 3mm aluminum angle stock, and cut sheet connecting them.... I want it sticking out from the back a bit for access, but also stout enough to handle the stress of being that far off hanging like that.

I'm figuring that rod would have to go from the front to the back of the chassis to get enough strength to support a MO-RA3 420 Pro, in order to prevent deformation of the chassis and resultant vibration issues. I am figuring that using thick and wide angle-stock on both the chassis and the radiator, and sandwiching it between about equal thickness plates on either side and boting that in would result in a nice stress free mount, and possibly with some kinda extensions on the bottom of the rad to act as feet to offload some of the weight. Ideally, I want the rad top even with the top of the chassis, not just for appearance, but also for dust/lint reduction, as I'm going to have to come up with a removable dust filter design of my own. I've had experience with the old style aluminum screen type of screw-in dust filter, and that is a pain, and eventually will cause thread damage.

I've seen where people will put them on the side panel, but that is really messed up how they have to jump through hoops to get the side panel off to get inside. Side panels should be removable very quickly and without concern for cables or hoses. If there is an emergency where I have to take them off quick, I don't want to have to spend time unhooking hoses and cables before it's off completely.

I'm thinking there are only two possible places, above or behind, and behind would look better, IMHO, although horizontally, and above might work (and make mounting easier). I WILL NOT have it freestanding. Kids, Cats, Drunk idiots...Freestanding is a disaster waiting to happen. If I go external, it MUST be physically hard-mounted to the chassis, with the tubes/hoses secured as well. (Seriously, we spent over $250 earlier this year to have our cat opened up for eating heavy rubber foam, and we still can't break him of his foam eating, and he once puked up about an inch of one of those rubber cord wraps (the kind that snaps) from a dell laptop power supply, and that has about the consistency of watercooling tubing....I think he likes how certain things feel against his teeth.

No exposed soft plastic hoses....


----------



## kc5vdj

Anyone got one of those Gigabyte Sentinel things that looks like a Matrix Sentinel is sucking out the inside of the computer? (that 3x GTX 980 kit)....


----------



## LandonAaron

Lol I had a cat that would eat tencil off the xmas tree then walk around with it hanging out his butt.

Yeah I'm definitely getting either the Mo-ra 3 420 or the phobta extreme 1260. I am going to mount it to the side panel though. I too am concerned about the difficulty of opening the panel. I want to try and make a hinge and latch for the panel so that both the rad and panel can open on the hinge. That may be too difficult though so I will probably just put quick disconnects on the lines. I think with feet on the rad it won't be too hard to take the panel on and off with the rad mounted to it. Other thing I am trying to figure out of I want to go with 9 x 140 or 4 x 200mm fans, and what I will use to control fan speeds. May just hook up to a toggle switch I already made for the fans on my current external rad, which allows me to turn the power to them on and off. Just use medium RPM fans and be able to turn then off and run it passively unless I'm doing something intensive.

Anyway, back on topic another processor lost its head today.



Everything I will use for delid included in image. I refuse to officially join club until I can do so at 5 GHZ which I think Wil be very soon. Preliminary testing on this chip looks good...

I should not that I basically did the vice only method. I only give it a few lighr taps with the hammer and would to losses it up a bit.


----------



## kc5vdj

Has anyone to date figured out why the remaining CLU will harden in the syringe once it's been used? Does exposure to air cause some kind of oxidation?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Lol I had a cat that would eat tencil off the xmas tree then walk around with it hanging out his butt.
> 
> Yeah I'm definitely getting either the Mo-ra 3 420 or the phobta extreme 1260. I am going to mount it to the side panel though. I too am concerned about the difficulty of opening the panel. I want to try and make a hinge and latch for the panel so that both the rad and panel can open on the hinge. That may be too difficult though so I will probably just put quick disconnects on the lines. I think with feet on the rad it won't be too hard to take the panel on and off with the rad mounted to it. Other thing I am trying to figure out of I want to go with 9 x 140 or 4 x 200mm fans, and what I will use to control fan speeds. May just hook up to a toggle switch I already made for the fans on my current external rad, which allows me to turn the power to them on and off. Just use medium RPM fans and be able to turn then off and run it passively unless I'm doing something intensive.
> 
> Anyway, back on topic another processor lost its head today.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Everything I will use for delid included in image. I refuse to officially join club until I can do so at 5 GHZ which I think Wil be very soon. Preliminary testing on this chip looks good...
> 
> I should not that I basically did the vice only method. I only give it a few lighr taps with the hammer and would to losses it up a bit.


Have you looked at the Aqua Computer Aquaero products? I am SERIOUSLY considering using them in my system when I do the custom loop next year... It seems to be the most complete range of controllers and sensors for watercooling out there. Most everything else seems to be kludged up basic fan controllers and such, so far as I can tell Aqua has quite a niche with their watercooling oriented controllers.

My other option involves a touchscreen panel made from a phone screen, into a raspberry pi in maybe a double-high 5.25" bay, and doing my own thing.

http://shop.aquacomputer.de/index.php?cPath=62_63&XTCsid=dvdde1jgmbed5buhbbknsr21adf8n2vt


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Has anyone to date figured out why the remaining CLU will harden in the syringe once it's been used? Does exposure to air cause some kind of oxidation?


it does? does soaking it in cup of warm water help?


----------



## LandonAaron

Yeah I noticed my clu turned kind of dark colored in the tube. But once spread it looked bright again.


----------



## majnu

Thermal Grizzly Kryonout is meant to be better than CLU/CLP. You can read about it here:

http://www.overclocking-tv.com/content/news/23576/hands-on-thermal-grizzlys-kryonaut-thermal-grease/

Since Overclockers UK is owned by CaseKing.de I've asked the forum member who runs extensive testing on thermal pastes to get this in. Hopefully it will be better and a "safer" alternative. ]

Will keep you updated, otherwise you can check the progress here:
http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18416534&page=5


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *majnu*
> 
> Thermal Grizzly Kryonout is meant to be better than CLU/CLP. You can read about it here:
> 
> http://www.overclocking-tv.com/content/news/23576/hands-on-thermal-grizzlys-kryonaut-thermal-grease/
> 
> Since Overclockers UK is owned by CaseKing.de I've asked the forum member who runs extensive testing on thermal pastes to get this in. Hopefully it will be better and a "safer" alternative. ]
> 
> Will keep you updated, otherwise you can check the progress here:
> http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18416534&page=5


I seriously doubt that it will do better in die-to-IHS applications. It may offer similar performance between the IHS and the waterblock/cooler, but I doubt it will beat it. It does seem to be aimed towards sub-zero cooling, in which case it may well outperform CLU/CLP, but that's because the sub-zero temperatures cause the CLU/CLP to freeze and can interrupt it's contact. For the uses seen in this thread, I would bet money that it will not be able to replace CLU for the die-to-IHS application, because you just can't really beat the thermal conductivity of metal.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> it does? does soaking it in cup of warm water help?


I haven't tried that, but I have tried several times to put them in front of a space heater until they got warm to the touch, but it still didn't want to come out. Interestingly, sticking a straight pin into the end pulls out liquid.

I've had to toss two syringes of CLU that were like 25% to 33% full, one of which because the plunger literally broke trying to get it out.

At the time I had used it, the copper and silicon that it would have touched was not warm enough for the alloying effect to happen, I would think, but I don't have a zoom-in of the Cu-Ga binary phase diagram, and it's really hard to tell what the temperatures and percentages are at the far right hand side of the phase diagram. The only phase diagram I have shows that it happens at a really low temperature (warm room), the closer you get to 100% Ga.. Does anyone have a better phase diagram than the one in the ASM Handbook?


----------



## kc5vdj




----------



## sharkforce

So my computer would not post again after making no changes, gigabyte error code 51 out of the blue. so the funny thing about this error is you can run the memory in single channel and it will post. So while running in single channel memory mode I do some digging around for fixes and it turns out that by loosening up the waterblock on by 4 or 5 turns it was able to boot again with dual channel memory! supposedly if the pins are being pressed too tight you can have this issue just fyi for those that are running naked.

kind of sucks because I already ordered an asrock extreme4 to replace it, it hasnt shipped yet but newegg wont let me make changes to the order since its in 'packaging'.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sharkforce*
> 
> So my computer would not post again after making no changes, gigabyte error code 51 out of the blue. so the funny thing about this error is you can run the memory in single channel and it will post. So while running in single channel memory mode I do some digging around for fixes and it turns out that by loosening up the waterblock on by 4 or 5 turns it was able to boot again with dual channel memory! supposedly if the pins are being pressed too tight you can have this issue just fyi for those that are running naked.
> 
> kind of sucks because I already ordered an asrock extreme4 to replace it, it hasnt shipped yet but newegg wont let me make changes to the order since its in 'packaging'.


Good luck. Treat that ASRock with kid gloves. They are made from cracker crust boards. If you had this problem with a Gigabyte....you might crack the ASRock board.


----------



## sharkforce

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Good luck. Treat that ASRock with kid gloves. They are made from cracker crust boards. If you had this problem with a Gigabyte....you might crack the ASRock board.


I plan on just shipping the asrock board back as soon as it comes in provided i dont have any more problems. I ran the system overnight with prime 95 running, was fully stable for 8 hours.


----------



## LandonAaron

I am curious how much CLU others are putting between the die and IHS. Do yall paint a very thin layer or do you put down enough for it to form kind of a small puddle? Also I am considering getting the Naked Ivy Precise Mount kit for my EK Supremacy block. How much better should the temps be with a direct mount vs. using the IHS?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I am curious how much CLU others are putting between the die and IHS. Do yall paint a very thin layer or do you put down enough for it to form kind of a small puddle? Also I am considering getting the Naked Ivy Precise Mount kit for my EK Supremacy block. How much better should the temps be with a direct mount vs. using the IHS?


Not that i have alot of experience with it but i just put enough to paint,maybe a very slight puddle but nothing in excess. applied CLU to my 290 yest and brought temps down 10C on load.
I've heard bare die mounts shave off another 2-3C maybe?but dont quote me on that. i've heard chatter on OCN saying that it's not particularly worth it unless you are trying to really squeeze every last bit out of your chip


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Not that i have alot of experience with it but i just put enough to paint,maybe a very slight puddle but nothing in excess. applied CLU to my 290 yest and brought temps down 10C on load.
> I've heard bare die mounts shave off another 2-3C maybe?but dont quote me on that. i've heard chatter on OCN saying that it's not particularly worth it unless you are trying to really squeeze every last bit out of your chip


I have done three (long story on how I ended up with 3 processors), and on the first one I got amazing temps. Like 20-25 degrees lower than where I was at originally. But on these last two the difference is much closer to 10 maybe 15. I can't figure out whats different from that first time, and getting a little frustrated that I can't get back to those temps. I want to get to 5 Ghz, but I need 1.4V+ to get there, and I am already at 80 degrees at 1.38, so I don't want to go any higher on the voltage. I know its probably silly trying to squeeze out that last 100 mhz, but I want to regardless. On that first chip I took it all the way up to 1.5V and the temps maxed out at 85 degrees in OCCT, but that chip still couldn't go past 4.8 Ghz so it was the first to get sold. These clock better but are getting hotter so theres no way I can put that type of voltage on them, unless I can get their temps in line with that first chip.

I think I will try putting CLU between the IHS and waterblock next.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I have done three (long story on how I ended up with 3 processors), and on the first one I got amazing temps. Like 20-25 degrees lower than where I was at originally. But on these last two the difference is much closer to 10 maybe 15. I can't figure out whats different from that first time, and getting a little frustrated that I can't get back to those temps. I want to get to 5 Ghz, but I need 1.4V+ to get there, and I am already at 80 degrees at 1.38, so I don't want to go any higher on the voltage. I know its probably silly trying to squeeze out that last 100 mhz, but I want to regardless. On that first chip I took it all the way up to 1.5V and the temps maxed out at 85 degrees in OCCT, but that chip still couldn't go past 4.8 Ghz so it was the first to get sold. These clock better but are getting hotter so theres no way I can put that type of voltage on them, unless I can get their temps in line with that first chip.
> 
> I think I will try putting CLU between the IHS and waterblock next.


someone mentioned that it is possible to use too little CLU. Have you tried putting on more and seeing if it improves temps? Those are some nice clocking chips you have. With my setup and ambients i'll be thermally limited way before i hit a voltage wall. And I do understand you wanting to get every last MHz out of your chip. If you don't mind spending the money, I say go get the precise mount. I know i would. I'm sure you know this already but CLU would stain your block. Again, I would do it but that's cos I just want to give my chips the best fighting chance i possibly can


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I am curious how much CLU others are putting between the die and IHS. Do yall paint a very thin layer or do you put down enough for it to form kind of a small puddle? Also I am considering getting the Naked Ivy Precise Mount kit for my EK Supremacy block. How much better should the temps be with a direct mount vs. using the IHS?


From what I have gathered is the limit on too much is where you start getting worried about excessive squeeze-out. You CAN use too small an amount. What I have done is paint it thin, then add a dab or two to make it look a little rough with roughly evenly distributed bits. Don't puddle it. Watch their videos and the videos of others. Experiment a little until you get it nice, with a minimum of squeeze-out.

Oh, and the way to keep it from marking the die is to not rub it off with something, but to dip a paper towel into a capful of 91% or better alcohol. Don't use the 70% rubbing alcohol pads they supply, it will leave a nasty residue. Too bad for the ozone hole and the chlorine catalyst reaction, I miss Freon TF (used to be a computer room staple).


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> From what I have gathered is the limit on too much is where you start getting worried about excessive squeeze-out. You CAN use too small an amount. What I have done is paint it thin, then add a dab or two to make it look a little rough with roughly evenly distributed bits. Don't puddle it. Watch their videos and the videos of others. Experiment a little until you get it nice, with a minimum of squeeze-out.
> 
> Oh, and the way to keep it from marking the die is to not rub it off with something, but to dip a paper towel into a capful of 91% or better alcohol. Don't use the 70% rubbing alcohol pads they supply, it will leave a nasty residue. Too bad for the ozone hole and the chlorine catalyst reaction, I miss Freon TF (used to be a computer room staple).


Nice tip.....i realised that's what I did with my 290 yesterday as well. As for the residue, I'm using the Coollabs 3-stage cleaning kit but still leaves a rougher surface than original....


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Nice tip.....i realised that's what I did with my 290 yesterday as well. As for the residue, I'm using the Coollabs 3-stage cleaning kit but still leaves a rougher surface than original....


I've played with the CLU on laptops too (seriously! use it in laptops!!!!), and found that using the alcohol first suspends and wipes off most of it, then use the arctic cleaning stuff, followed by a drop or two of pure alcohol again wiped clean using unscented toilet paper. Back to mirror finish in silicon grey.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> I've played with the CLU on laptops too (seriously! use it in laptops!!!!), and found that using the alcohol first suspends and wipes off most of it, then use the arctic cleaning stuff, followed by a drop or two of pure alcohol again wiped clean using unscented toilet paper. Back to mirror finish in silicon grey.


\

Thanks for that... Am contemplating on using it on my laptop but testing it on my desktop first since my laptop is used mainly for work and i cannot afford the down time from mis-applying it.......laptop currently idles around 45-50C


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> \
> 
> Thanks for that... Am contemplating on using it on my laptop but testing it on my desktop first since my laptop is used mainly for work and i cannot afford the down time from mis-applying it.......laptop currently idles around 45-50C


Yeah, that's about where I was, and it dropped massively down to low 30's idle, and the high end is under 80 now no matter what i do with it (Core2 T9600).

Just be as thin as you can get it without getting it too thin. It might take more than one application, and make sure your cold-plate is flat. I had to manually bend the ones in our Dell laptops, and even then have NEVER gotten the E6400 to where it will stay flat, and it will pop at random out of line and jack up the temps (usually after my cat sits on it, we just can't break him of wanting to sit on open or closed laptops). One of the little screw things in the motherboard is messed up, I think. I did find that on the nVidia nv160 model, it is the only way (with a copper shim) to keep temps cool.

You NEVER want to put too much into a portable device, as the risk is so much greater of a tiny ball coming off and going somewhere nasty. I found a perfect point where you have just enough for contact, and not enough for strays, assuming normal spinning disk usage profile. If you have one with a SSD that you tend to bash around and toss around, things could be different.


----------



## kc5vdj

Four and a half hours stable 4.7 GHz / 1.285V, Highest seen temperature of 81C. Prime95 Blend. I was asleep when my wife came in to tell me it bluescreened, and I told her to turn it off. She failed to get the code, but I'm assuming it was a 0x124, and not a 0x101 (which I only get when trying higher voltages / multipliers). It's been running a medium load of SETI for about a couple of hours now without issue, but I think I'm going to bump it up five mils to 1.290 and call it stable.


----------



## jeanspaulo

Hello guys I hope you can help me.
I'm about to delid my I7 4770k and I'm thinking to use some liquid electrical tape to isulating the vrm to protect it from the CLU. Do you think its a better Idea to do it?


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jeanspaulo*
> 
> Hello guys I hope you can help me.
> I'm about to delid my I7 4770k and I'm thinking to use some liquid electrical tape to isulating the vrm to protect it from the CLU. Do you think its a better Idea to do it?


I think that is an excellent idea. You can use liquid electrical tape or clear nail polish. I like liquid electrical tape myself as it goes on super easy, and can be taken off super easy if you screw up and get it where it doesn't need to be.


----------



## jeanspaulo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I think that is an excellent idea. You can use liquid electrical tape or clear nail polish. I like liquid electrical tape myself as it goes on super easy, and can be taken off super easy if you screw up and get it where it doesn't need to be.


Thanks LandonAaron I thought about clear nail polish but I'm a little bit afraid of the composition of the nail polish here in Brazil so I found the liquid electrical tape.
Another question, after delid and apply the CLU when I put the ihs back to place I take off the liquid electrical tape or I can let it on the place, let it on the place affect the temps?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jeanspaulo*
> 
> Thanks LandonAaron I thought about clear nail polish but I'm a little bit afraid of the composition of the nail polish here in Brazil so I found the liquid electrical tape.
> Another question, after delid and apply the CLU when I put the ihs back to place I take off the liquid electrical tape or I can let it on the place, let it on the place affect the temps?


Definitely leave it in place.just a tiny strip.in case u applied too much clu and it squeezes out when u tighted the screws on your cooler


----------



## jeanspaulo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Definitely leave it in place.just a tiny strip.in case u applied too much clu and it squeezes out when u tighted the screws on your cooler










nice, now making some stock testing before delid kkkk


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jeanspaulo*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nice, now making some stock testing before delid kkkk


Dont forget to post your before and after results!!and all the best of luck


----------



## Jimbags

Going to delid and oc an old E2140 I have sitting around, Actually I have 2.Each a different stepping. Stock speed is 1.6Ghz







I bet I can double it. (I know dellid is pointless. but this is Overclock.net). probably use my spare coolermaster 212 evo. Even thats prob overkill though


----------



## v1ral

What warrants a delid? Is just temps?
I have my 4790k at 4.7 with 1.227 in bios, but temps reach close to 89c, should I attempt a delid, or be happy. I honestly think its just my cooler, I have a corsair h70 with fans at 7volts case fans at 5volts on a fan hub, when I want to stress test again I change it up to higher volts on the fans.
I'm really shocked on how people get good temps with out delid and with air coolers, I seem to have a stinker at temps.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> What warrants a delid? Is just temps?
> I have my 4790k at 4.7 with 1.227 in bios, but temps reach close to 89c, should I attempt a delid, or be happy. I honestly think its just my cooler, I have a corsair h70 with fans at 7volts case fans at 5volts on a fan hub, when I want to stress test again I change it up to higher volts on the fans.
> I'm really shocked on how people get good temps with out delid and with air coolers, I seem to have a stinker at temps.


a 240mm or 280mm cooler will get your temps much closer to 70c load in x264 at that voltage.

I would definitely upgrade from a single fan rad cooler prior to delid.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> What warrants a delid? Is just temps?
> I have my 4790k at 4.7 with 1.227 in bios, but temps reach close to 89c, should I attempt a delid, or be happy. I honestly think its just my cooler, I have a corsair h70 with fans at 7volts case fans at 5volts on a fan hub, when I want to stress test again I change it up to higher volts on the fans.
> I'm really shocked on how people get good temps with out delid and with air coolers, I seem to have a stinker at temps.


I've been running 4.7 GHz @ 1.290V on my 4790K for two days straight. Crunching SETI, my maximum, temperatures have been right at 60C. This is with a H100i GTX cooler and about 20C or so in the room.

If you are hitting 89 at that low a voltage, I highly suggest deidding. Delidding is exclusively about temperatures. You don't do it if you don't have a need, and 89 at that clock / voltage is hot.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> I've been running 4.7 GHz @ 1.290V on my 4790K for two days straight. Crunching SETI, my maximum, temperatures have been right at 60C. This is with a H100i GTX cooler and about 20C or so in the room.
> 
> If you are hitting 89 at that low a voltage, I highly suggest deidding. Delidding is exclusively about temperatures. You don't do it if you don't have a need, and 89 at that clock / voltage is hot.


you would delid on low end cooler? Single fan 120mm rads are out performanced by high end air coolers even.


----------



## v1ral

Thanks guys/gals.
I figured as the reviews for the h70 performance isn't so great for what it is.
Should I hold out on getting a proper water cooling solution or switch coolers entirely while waiting for a proper WC cooler?
What I have in mind is grab a swiftech H220x then expand, I should get better temps with that cooler perhaps?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Thanks guys/gals.
> I figured as the reviews for the h70 performance isn't so great for what it is.
> Should I hold out on getting a proper water cooling solution or switch coolers entirely while waiting for a proper WC cooler?
> What I have in mind is grab a swiftech H220x then expand, I should get better temps with that cooler perhaps?


yes, any dual 120mm/140mm rad will perform much better.

The h220x is a fine choice.


----------



## jeanspaulo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Dont forget to post your before and after results!!and all the best of luck


For now I only could get to 4.3 with my 4770k on vCore 1.2 I'm using the stock cooler. On 4.3 it get stable.
Now i'm finishing the plan of the WC to delid and build all. To test again.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## LandonAaron

A delid will help with any cooler. Stock or even high end water coolers. Heck you may delid then find that you don't need as big of cooler as you thought you did, so I suggest delid first check your temps then decide what cooler you want to get.

I did a delid, and now I am getting one of these:



But just because I can, not because I really need it. I want to run at 1.5v all day. I think these chips can take it.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> A delid will help with any cooler. Stock or even high end water coolers. Heck you may delid then find that you don't need as big of cooler as you thought you did, so I suggest delid first check your temps then decide what cooler you want to get.
> 
> I did a delid, and now I am getting one of these:
> 
> But just because I can, not because I really need it. I want to run at 1.5v all day. I think these chips can take it.


so u would suggest a delid to someone using a hyper212?

Doesnt make sense to me. I dnt want to risk a $340 cpu just trying to save $ 30-50 on proper cooling.

If proper cooling removes the need to delid then thats beter scenerio.

A high end air or dual fan aio is where you need to be before deliding.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> so u would suggest a delid to someone using a hyper212?
> 
> Doesnt make sense to me. I dont want to risk a $340 cpu just trying to save $ 30-50 on proper cooling.
> 
> If proper cooling removes the need to delid then thats beter scenerio.
> 
> A high end air or dual fan aio is where you need to be before deliding.


If you don't feel the reward of lower temps are worth the risk of losing your CPU or some functionality, and overclocking isn't in your future, then there really is no need for delidding.
If temps are insane at stock, even after re-seating the cooler, or after getting a better cooler, then it's going to be safer to RMA and get another chip.

It's definitely not a recommended practice for the vast majority of users, especially those with tight budgets..


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> so u would suggest a delid to someone using a hyper212?
> 
> Doesnt make sense to me. I dnt want to risk a $340 cpu just trying to save $ 30-50 on proper cooling.
> 
> If proper cooling removes the need to delid then thats beter scenerio.
> 
> *A high end air or dual fan aio is where you need to be before deliding*.


I disagree. A delid is almost a guaranteed 15C drop (10C for sure), and a good cooler isn't going to make anything like that kind of difference. The limiting factor is the transfer between the die and IHS, not getting the heat off the IHS. A 120mm rad can cool a 295x2, so why would it not be able to cool a 125W CPU.


----------



## jeanspaulo

Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Dont forget to post your before and after results!!and all the best of luck
> 
> 
> 
> For now I only could get to 4.3 with my 4770k on vCore 1.2 I'm using the stock cooler. On 4.3 it get stable.
> Now i'm finishing the plan of the WC to delid and build all. To test again.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> A delid will help with any cooler. Stock or even high end water coolers. Heck you may delid then find that you don't need as big of cooler as you thought you did, so I suggest delid first check your temps then decide what cooler you want to get.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did a delid, and now I am getting one of these:
> 
> 
> 
> But just because I can, not because I really need it. I want to run at 1.5v all day. I think these chips can take it.
Click to expand...

I Agree with you, It's my first time on both doing a Delid and Build a Full WC Rig but just because I love it. My PC runs 24/7 its also my server, developing and gaming machine (But lately more Server and Developing than Gaming kkkkk ) .


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I disagree. A delid is almost a guaranteed 15C drop (10C for sure), and a good cooler isn't going to make anything like that kind of difference. The limiting factor is the transfer between the die and IHS, not getting the heat off the IHS. A 120mm rad can cool a 295x2, so why would it not be able to cool a 125W CPU.


TRUTH!


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I disagree. A delid is almost a guaranteed 15C drop (10C for sure), and a good cooler isn't going to make anything like that kind of difference. The limiting factor is the transfer between the die and IHS, not getting the heat off the IHS. A 120mm rad can cool a 295x2, so why would it not be able to cool a 125W CPU.


My 4770k gained 25c. That was a massive gain. I am much closer to agreement on original hw.

I have seen ppl delid a 4790k and use any other tim besides clp and temps only be 3c better or the same even.

Some 4790ks just dont need it imo.

For example mine does 4.7 1.325v 71c x264. I prefer to run 4.6 1.265v 64c x264 as my 24/7.

I even lost a couple of degrees adding my gpu to my loop but i cant seem to find a gain worth deliding my 4790k. Im not going to run voltage higher and 65c to 55c is not going gain me anything.

Im leary to suggest it prior to getting good cooling. I guess i just read too many stories of single channel ram and cpu light no post and no warranty.


----------



## cephelix

Delidding is definitely a plus for those who are thermally limited or are experiencing large variations in temperatures between cores. Those like me. Who reach a thermal wall before a voltage one. This usually happens when you have high ambients. That would give you more headroom to push your chip further. but even if that isn't the case, if you are confident in your abilities, i'd say go for it. Really cant go wrong with a vice only method. No more hitting or cutting. Just be sure to read up properly in any method you choose to perform and the main thing is to go slow...


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> My 4770k gained 25c. That was a massive gain. I am much closer to agreement on original hw.
> 
> I have seen ppl delid a 4790k and use any other tim besides clp and temps only be 3c better or the same even.
> 
> Some 4790ks just dont need it imo.
> 
> For example mine does 4.7 1.325v 71c x264. I prefer to run 4.6 1.265v 64c x264 as my 24/7.
> 
> I even lost a couple of degrees adding my gpu to my loop but i cant seem to find a gain worth deliding my 4790k. Im not going to run voltage higher and 65c to 55c is not going gain me anything.
> 
> Im leary to suggest it prior to getting good cooling. I guess i just read too many stories of single channel ram and cpu light no post and no warranty.


Well, delidding and not using a liquid metal TIM kind of defeats the purpose (at least to some extent), but I do agree that it is somewhat chip-dependent. Some DC chips seem to be better than others, while the Haswell's were almost uniformly bad. I don't recall off the top of my head, but I managed to get about 15C on my 4790K even though my pre-delid temps weren't all that bad (low voltage though). I know that on my 4770K, going from a Thermalright Venemous-X, to a Kraken X60, and then to a full custom loop only changed my temps by about 5C - then delidding dropped them almost 20C.

Edit: Nope, it was 20C on my 4790K also. From low 70s to low 50s.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Well, delidding and not using a liquid metal TIM kind of defeats the purpose (at least to some extent), but I do agree that it is somewhat chip-dependent. Some DC chips seem to be better than others, while the Haswell's were almost uniformly bad. I don't recall off the top of my head, but I managed to get about 15C on my 4790K even though my pre-delid temps weren't all that bad (low voltage though). I know that on my 4770K, going from a Thermalright Venemous-X, to a Kraken X60, and then to a full custom loop only changed my temps by about 5C - then delidding dropped them almost 20C.
> 
> Edit: Nope, it was 20C on my 4790K also. From low 70s to low 50s.


that means that ol thermalright was pretty good prolly lol. I have an old thermalright 120mm cooler that is much better than a hyper212.

Biggest suprise for me was my h110 actually had better temps than my full loop 360mm rad + 140mm ran. Only on certain gaming loads by a few degrees but still not expected.

Gpu in the loop is kinda meh for cpu temps and i have so much more rad space than a 970 and 4790k need my fans speed dont even affect temps 5v same as 12v. But quite is good.

About edit : Low 50s heh? What vcore? And how about under x264 load?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> About edit : Low 50s heh? What vcore? And how about under x264 load?


4.8 @ 1.24V, that was x264 testing. Drifts up a little bit if you run it long-term as the water warms up, hits mid-50s with the fans at my "gaming" speed. Haven't tested it in a while though.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jeanspaulo*
> 
> I Agree with you, It's my first time on both doing a Delid and Build a Full WC Rig but just because I love it. My PC runs 24/7 its also my server, developing and gaming machine (But lately more Server and Developing than Gaming kkkkk ) .
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Lol you must be single. I would never hear the end of it if my significant other saw all my components in their boxes spread out on a table like that. Though I have found a good way of calming her whenever I get a new part in the mail, I just remind her that I could buy three PC'S with what I paid for her ring. That's usually the end of that conversation.

An old timer on extreme systems summed it perfectly: "my greatest fear is that when I die my wife sells all my stuff for what I told her I paid for it".


----------



## Jimbags

Just quickly back to why people dellid on low end cooling. Well it wasnt really lowend quality wise, but when I had the 3570k in my low profile htpc using a very low profile cooler(NHL9i). It helped alot. That was the only decent cooler that would fit 37mm high I think? WC was out of the question as it was a very tight case with bad airflow.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Just quickly back to why people dellid on low end cooling. Well it wasnt really lowend quality wise, but when I had the 3570k in my low profile htpc using a very low profile cooler(NHL9i). It helped alot. That was the only decent cooler that would fit 37mm high I think? WC was out of the question as it was a very tight case with bad airflow.


special situation and ivy bridge.
Ivy and haswell gain more from delid (20c+).

I was talking devils canyon specifically. I veiw deliding as a last resort.

In this situation you already had exhausted the only cooling options you had. Deliding was the only next step you had to improve cooling.


----------



## jeanspaulo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Lol you must be single. I would never hear the end of it if my significant other saw all my components in their boxes spread out on a table like that. Though I have found a good way of calming her whenever I get a new part in the mail, I just remind her that I could buy three PC'S with what I paid for her ring. That's usually the end of that conversation.
> 
> An old timer on extreme systems summed it perfectly: "my greatest fear is that when I die my wife sells all my stuff for what I told her I paid for it".


You are right I'm single but my Girlfriend always get crazy with it kkkkkkkkkkk.


----------



## EuEra

I feel like I'm doing something wrong because I am running prime 95 and aida 64 (only for 15 mis each while I increase clock speed) and I'm at 4.9ghz (confirmed in cpu z) at 1.3v and I passed aida 64 with temp averaging 70 degrees. Doing prime 95 now. Am I doing something wrong?
Edit: prime 95 failed in the first minute.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> I feel like I'm doing something wrong because I am running prime 95 and aida 64 (only for 15 mis each while I increase clock speed) and I'm at 4.9ghz (confirmed in cpu z) at 1.3v and I passed aida 64 with temp averaging 70 degrees. Doing prime 95 now. Am I doing something wrong?
> *Edit: prime 95 failed in the first minute.*


Answered your own question there.


----------



## reb00t-please

Failed!


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> special situation and ivy bridge.
> Ivy and haswell gain more from delid (20c+).
> 
> I was talking devils canyon specifically. I veiw deliding as a last resort.
> 
> In this situation you already had exhausted the only cooling options you had. Deliding was the only next step you had to improve cooling.


I got around 10c cooler temps. Even on the stock cooler it was within limits though. Its a htpc so wanted it quiet :-D Devils canyon is sort of haswell and can suffer just the same heat issues btw. They have much better TIM (and silicon) but still remain un-soldered so something like CLU can make a difference in the upper end of overclo king. And hey this is Overclock.net if you can dellid why not


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> so u would suggest a delid to someone using a hyper212?
> 
> Doesnt make sense to me. I dnt want to risk a $340 cpu just trying to save $ 30-50 on proper cooling.
> 
> If proper cooling removes the need to delid then thats beter scenerio.
> 
> A high end air or dual fan aio is where you need to be before deliding.


If the gap is a nasty one, no amount of cooling will be decent.

On the other hand, if the gap is nasty, anyone can see temperature improvement even with small air coolers, simply by delidding.

Water cooling is handy for OC, but not required for more conservative overclocks.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reb00t-please*
> 
> 
> 
> Failed!


that might be salvageable.... maybe. have you tried it yet?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> A delid will help with any cooler. Stock or even high end water coolers. Heck you may delid then find that you don't need as big of cooler as you thought you did, so I suggest delid first check your temps then decide what cooler you want to get.
> 
> I did a delid, and now I am getting one of these:
> 
> 
> 
> But just because I can, not because I really need it. I want to run at 1.5v all day. I think these chips can take it.


I am so stuck on this. Either the Nexxxos XT45 420 in the roof, or a hardmounted MO-RA3 420 Pro Black on the back of the 750D.... My thing is I need the drives internal. I'm still leaning towards the MO-RA3, even though it will require some case-modding to the back of the chassis (I REFUSE TO SIDE MOUNT ONE). I'm too afraid of someone tripping over it or the hoses, or cats chewing on the hoses to have it freestanding. Still the price isn't too bad, and is actually competitive with much smaller solutions.

Oh, and unless you have the cash to just throw around, or just want the stainless, consider the black version. It still has a stainless central fan-mount/logo thing going on, but is much cheaper. Of course, get what you like, I'm just saying that I personally cannot justify their price difference between the black and stainless version.

The rubber feet things are way too expensive too...probably much cheaper to make your own feet.


----------



## reb00t-please

The system turns on then off right away. Celeron already ordered. I'm a noob. 3570k toast.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reb00t-please*
> 
> The system turns on then off right away. Celeron already ordered. I'm a noob. 3570k toast.


How did you delid???


----------



## reb00t-please

With a razor. Check out the lower right corner. I think the PCB is compromised.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reb00t-please*
> 
> With a razor. Check out the lower right corner. I think the PCB is compromised.


Ouch....one of the reasons i decided not to go down that route.too clumsy to pull off that much precision. if u plan to get another haswell, give the vice only method a go


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reb00t-please*
> 
> With a razor. Check out the lower right corner. I think the PCB is compromised.


what kind of razor?



this kind really kind of prevents nicking.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> what kind of razor?
> 
> 
> 
> this kind really kind of prevents nicking.


Stupid question but how so?is it because the blade doesn't flex??


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Stupid question but how so?is it because the blade doesn't flex??


Yeah, it does not flex as easily, but someone also explained that with the thicker one it's easier to keep the cutting edge away from the PCB. That idea seemed like it made sense to me. I drew a picture that perhaps helps to see it:


----------



## reb00t-please

One like thishttp://vanson.lissdev.com/product_images/v/589/Razor-Blades__74514_zoom.jpg


----------



## cephelix

@deepor does seem to make sense....you'd need a steeper angle before the cutting edge touches the pcb


----------



## Brohem0th

I used a thick razor blade like the one y'all are talking about to delid my 4690k. The thinner ones get inbetween the IHS and PCB much easier, whereas with the thicker ones you have work all the corners until you manage to pry one up enough to get a piece of thick cardstock inbetween the IHS and PCB. I used an old credit card that I shaved the edge down with the same razor I used to delid.

One important note of caution, however; you can more easily flex and warp the PCB using this method, because it requires a fair bit of force. I actually warped my PCB fairly noticeably and it was still fine, but I imagine I was one of the lucky ones. The thinner razor blades are quicker to use (using a thick one took my about an hour, but I was being extremely careful and monitoring the amount of force I was using intensely, and I also cut myself and got blood everywhere and had to clean it up) but are more prone to scratching or nicking the PCB because of how thin and sharp they are.

I did bleed all over my CPU though. The core, the PCB, the pins, just soaked in blood. Cleans up easily enough with some iso (I literally dunked my CPU in a small bowl full of the stuff because it was so thoroughly coated) and I like to think my blood sacrifice pleased the gods of delidding. I was able to validate 5Ghz afterwards at 1.38v on a Hyper 212+, and I run 4.8Ghz at 1.33v all day long and my temps never hit 80c even in stress testing.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I used a thick razor blade like the one y'all are talking about to delid my 4690k. The thinner ones get inbetween the IHS and PCB much easier, whereas with the thicker ones you have work all the corners until you manage to pry one up enough to get a piece of thick cardstock inbetween the IHS and PCB. I used an old credit card that I shaved the edge down with the same razor I used to delid.
> 
> One important note of caution, however; you can more easily flex and warp the PCB using this method, because it requires a fair bit of force. I actually warped my PCB fairly noticeably and it was still fine, but I imagine I was one of the lucky ones. The thinner razor blades are quicker to use (using a thick one took my about an hour, but I was being extremely careful and monitoring the amount of force I was using intensely, and I also cut myself and got blood everywhere and had to clean it up) but are more prone to scratching or nicking the PCB because of how thin and sharp they are.
> 
> I did bleed all over my CPU though. The core, the PCB, the pins, just soaked in blood. Cleans up easily enough with some iso (I literally dunked my CPU in a small bowl full of the stuff because it was so thoroughly coated) and I like to think my blood sacrifice pleased the gods of delidding. I was able to validate 5Ghz afterwards at 1.38v on a Hyper 212+, and I run 4.8Ghz at 1.33v all day long and my temps never hit 80c even in stress testing.


Your blood sacrifice to the dark lords of overclocking and silicon lotteries did work afterall....
Must have been a really bad cut to have bled all over the processor


----------



## EuEra

Guys im at 4.8 @ 1.325v on my 4790k, is this voltage ok for everyday use or shall i scale it back and run at 4.7?

I ran oct (not the linpack tab) for 2 hours and passed with temps at around 70, exact same with prime95. Intel burn test however i had to turn off straight away as temps where at 95-100, is that to be expected or do i need to delid. Im using a h105 in push pull as an intake with 4 sp120 quiet edition fans.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reb00t-please*
> 
> With a razor. Check out the lower right corner. I think the PCB is compromised.


what kind of razor?



this kind really kind of prevents nicking.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Stupid question but how so?is it because the blade doesn't flex??


Pretty much that, plus the thickness of the blade lifts the cutting surface up out of danger's way, as long as you keep the blade flat against the board as you cut/wedge. Oh, and remember basic high school physics, the wedge. With this type of blade it's more of a wedge action in addition to a cutting action.

I tried with a thinner blade initially, and it was freaking me out. Not only did I think I was going to cut the board, I thought I'd need my wife on standby for calling an ambulance.

I was three hours away from placing an order for a vise, which was money better spent elsewhere, and remembered I saw one video where some guy used one of these, so I got one out of the toolbox, sanded the rust off, and sharpened it on sandpaper, and sure enough it was thick enough and stiff enough that I did the 4770K that I had spent almost 40 minutes getting nowhere on with the thin blade, and did it in like three or four minutes, and I was being careful and deliberate with it.

A week or so later, after finding unacceptable stock temperatures on this 4790K, I did it I think in under two minutes, also being very careful.

The caveat is to keep the blade flat against the board, and to use it also as a wedge. Cutting is more of a pushing action once in.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reb00t-please*
> 
> One like thishttp://vanson.lissdev.com/product_images/v/589/Razor-Blades__74514_zoom.jpg


Hell no! That's what I started with. I wasn't going anywhere with it, and it was getting me nervous about safety.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Hell no! That's what I started with. I wasn't going anywhere with it, and it was getting me nervous about safety.


All my delids were using those slim razors, my first delid started with a thicker blade, but was never able to get under the IHS, and after switchign to a slimmer blade took nearly 20 minutes because I was actually digging into the IHS and didn't know it, but once I got the first corner going, it was pretty smooth from there.
I apparently managed to nick off the top 2 VRMs and still have the CPU fire up and perform fine.
The following 2 delids were much faster totaling 5 minutes each.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Guys im at 4.8 @ 1.325v on my 4790k, is this voltage ok for everyday use or shall i scale it back and run at 4.7?
> 
> I ran oct (not the linpack tab) for 2 hours and passed with temps at around 70, exact same with prime95. Intel burn test however i had to turn off straight away as temps where at 95-100, is that to be expected or do i need to delid. Im using a h105 in push pull as an intake with 4 sp120 quiet edition fans.


I've run my 4690k at nearly the exact same voltage and speed for 10 months now and it's still going strong. As long as you've got the cooling for it, it should be absolutely fine, and any reduction in lifespan will be minuscule. And with that cooler and those fans, you'll be fine.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Your blood sacrifice to the dark lords of overclocking and silicon lotteries did work afterall....
> Must have been a really bad cut to have bled all over the processor


It really wasn't, more of a glancing blow. The issue was that I didn't see it or feel it until I finally saw red, and by that time it'd managed to get nearly everywhere. I was talking to someone in the other room and hadn't looked down in a while and when I finally did I nearly fainted. Razors are no joke and extremely sharp, sharp to the point where I didn't even feel the cut or any pain until I looked at it and my brain went OH SNAP U HURT CUZ SEEK MEDICAL ATTENTION OH LAWD SO MUCH BLOOD IT'S ON THE CPU DO YOU CLEAN IT FIRST OR STOP THE BLEEDING FIRST?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> It really wasn't, more of a glancing blow. The issue was that I didn't see it or feel it until I finally saw red, and by that time it'd managed to get nearly everywhere. I was talking to someone in the other room and hadn't looked down in a while and when I finally did I nearly fainted. Razors are no joke and extremely sharp, sharp to the point where I didn't even feel the cut or any pain until I looked at it and my brain went OH SNAP U HURT CUZ SEEK MEDICAL ATTENTION OH LAWD SO MUCH BLOOD IT'S ON THE CPU DO YOU CLEAN IT FIRST OR STOP THE BLEEDING FIRST?


Lucky for you it wasn't that serious of an injury. But any blood spilled in the name of the computer gods is fine.they don't require such a huge sacrifice. Totally understand your dilemma...for the record i'd clean the cpu first before attending to myself


----------



## majnu

I always work with the center of the razer blade when delidding. If I use the end bits then when trying to cut into the glue there is potential for the blade to flex and for the tip to scratch and nick the pcb.

I also use a cotton bud or Q-tip as you guys call it and soak it in IPA and apply it to the edges of the IHS to get it to soak into the glue. It makes it so much easier.


----------



## EuEra

Ok so i have delidded my 4790k. im running 4.7 @ 1.250v, my idle temps are 25 degrees.

During OCCT my temps have dropped 10 degrees from 65 to 55.
During Prime95 small FFTs temps have dropped 20 degrees from 85 to 65.

I'm using a h105 and CLU on the die and ihs. How are these resutls?

Note on the delidding process, i used vice only and i can't imagine why anyone would do it any other way it took 30 seconds, i didnt slice through my hand or the pcb, the pcb didnt go flying into a wall, the whole thing was a lot lot easier and safer than i anticipated.


----------



## trodas

Quote:


> Note on the delidding process, i used vice only and i can't imagine why anyone would do it any other way it took 30 seconds


And could you please link and video from youtube, that best describe what you did to the poor CPU? The vice sounds to me as too harsh treatment for poor CPU...


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trodas*
> 
> And could you please link and video from youtube, that best describe what you did to the poor CPU? The vice sounds to me as too harsh treatment for poor CPU...







Its by far the gentlest method it hardly gives any resistance before gently nudging free.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Ok so i have delidded my 4790k. im running 4.7 @ 1.250v, my idle temps are 25 degrees.
> 
> During OCCT my temps have dropped 10 degrees from 65 to 55.
> During Prime95 small FFTs temps have dropped 20 degrees from 85 to 65.
> 
> I'm using a h105 and CLU on the die and ihs. How are these resutls?
> 
> Note on the delidding process, i used vice only and i can't imagine why anyone would do it any other way it took 30 seconds, i didnt slice through my hand or the pcb, the pcb didnt go flying into a wall, the whole thing was a lot lot easier and safer than i anticipated.


Good result, 20C is about the upper end of temp drops.


----------



## trodas

*EuEra* -
Quote:


> Its by far the gentlest method it hardly gives any resistance before gently nudging free.


True, thanks for the link. W/O the hammer hitting the CPU (thru the piece of wood, but still...) and by just applying the pressure I think I can do it. Looks fairly simple... and not too drastically.

Thank you very much!

And congratulations for your new low temps! Just if the heatsinks can be applied directly on the die... that would be IMHO awesome


----------



## EuEra

Latest testing post delid, really happy:


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its by far the gentlest method it hardly gives any resistance before gently nudging free.


Agreed! I used the vice only method as well. Just make sure you align the chip properly in the vice so pressure is evenly applied. I didnt and now one side of my ihs is slightly dented but the chip itself is otherwise unharmed.


----------



## LandonAaron

Lapped my IHS, and reduced amount of CLU between die and IHS, and reduced the amount of thermal paste between die and block and managed to get those same fantastic temps I got from my first delid:



5Ghz coming soon...


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Lapped my IHS, and reduced amount of CLU between die and IHS, and reduced the amount of thermal paste between die and block and managed to get those same fantastic temps I got from my first delid:
> 
> 
> 
> 5Ghz coming soon...


those are good temps indeed....did it take long to lap?


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> those are good temps indeed....did it take long to lap?


Not too long. About 2 or 3 hours but I didn't get a perfect mirror finish but I got pretty close. Got it perfectly flat a with a good reflection in it. Should have taken pictures. I'll snap a pic next weekend.

Longest part was getting though the nickel to the copper beneath. I just used 400 grit wet or dry and dragged it across. Turning 90 degrees every 100 drags. Once I got through the to the copper I went to 1000, 1500, 2000, and 3000 grit. I think I went a little fast through these grades but the copper was softer than the nickle and I didn't want to grind away too much. I also polished with never dull at the end.


----------



## LandonAaron

I would like to officially join the club:

OCN Name: LandonAaron
CPU: i7-4790k
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
MHZ Gained: 200mhz
OC After delid: 5.0 Ghz
Temp Drops: > 16 degrees; 84 max to 68 max
CPU-Z Validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/rr3765

Delid:


Pre Delid Temps:


Delid Temps:


Max OC:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I would like to officially join the club:
> 
> OCN Name: LandonAaron
> CPU: i7-4790k
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: IC Diamond
> MHZ Gained: 200mhz
> OC After delid: 5.0 Ghz
> Temp Drops: > 16 degrees; 84 max to 68 max
> CPU-Z Validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/rr3765
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Delid:
> 
> 
> Pre Delid Temps:
> 
> 
> Delid Temps:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Max OC:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## spectre023

Hello everyone,
Before I finalize this delidding process I thought I'd ask the biggest amalgamation of liberated CPU die owners on the internet for some advice!

I delidded my 3570k yesterday. No real reason other than sheer boredom really. I used generic white paste TIM as that is the only paste I have available. (CLU, and indigo extreme on the way)

I thought it might be interesting to see whether simply improving the IHS to CPU die interface with a bad TIM would still yield improvement. My chip is a bad overclocker (4.5ghz @ 1.35v), is out of warranty, and was bought secondhand anyway, so at the very worst I would be looking at trying my luck at another 3570k that hopefully does better.

First application saw temp drops of about 5c cores 1-3 and 15c on core 4. After reseating about 10 times using various methods/TIM amounts I always have core 4 running at least 10c lower than the others. Before delidding all were within 3-4c of one another. I've tried holding the IHS steady while lowering the retention bracket and placing it a tad high and allowing the bracket to slide the IHS down center. I also realize that it is pointless to try for perfect contact with bad TIM that will only be on there 3-4 days anyway, but I view this as practice. I dont want to be cleaning up CLU several times once that arrives.

Anyone else have an issue with one core running at a very different temperature from the rest of the package after delidding? What did you do to solve the issue?

I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere. My work computer is severely restricted and it makes doing anything on the internet other than loading straight text rather difficult.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Hello everyone,
> Before I finalize this delidding process I thought I'd ask the biggest amalgamation of liberated CPU die owners on the internet for some advice!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I delidded my 3570k yesterday. No real reason other than sheer boredom really. I used generic white paste TIM as that is the only paste I have available. (CLU, and indigo extreme on the way)
> 
> I thought it might be interesting to see whether simply improving the IHS to CPU die interface with a bad TIM would still yield improvement. My chip is a bad overclocker (4.5ghz @ 1.35v), is out of warranty, and was bought secondhand anyway, so at the very worst I would be looking at trying my luck at another 3570k that hopefully does better.
> 
> First application saw temp drops of about 5c cores 1-3 and 15c on core 4. After reseating about 10 times using various methods/TIM amounts I always have core 4 running at least 10c lower than the others. Before delidding all were within 3-4c of one another. I've tried holding the IHS steady while lowering the retention bracket and placing it a tad high and allowing the bracket to slide the IHS down center. I also realize that it is pointless to try for perfect contact with bad TIM that will only be on there 3-4 days anyway, but I view this as practice. I dont want to be cleaning up CLU several times once that arrives.
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone else have an issue with one core running at a very different temperature from the rest of the package after delidding? What did you do to solve the issue?
> 
> I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere. My work computer is severely restricted and it makes doing anything on the internet other than loading straight text rather difficult.


Thanks for the words on the biggest knowledge base! Thats what I was going for initially









The temp differentiation between some cores happens pretty often especially the core next to the igpu on the die. This can sometimes cause lower temps or higher temps, its random sometimes. A better paste may be able to even out the temp differences, try that out first and see what happens.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Hello everyone,
> Before I finalize this delidding process I thought I'd ask the biggest amalgamation of liberated CPU die owners on the internet for some advice!
> 
> I delidded my 3570k yesterday. No real reason other than sheer boredom really. I used generic white paste TIM as that is the only paste I have available. (CLU, and indigo extreme on the way)
> 
> I thought it might be interesting to see whether simply improving the IHS to CPU die interface with a bad TIM would still yield improvement. My chip is a bad overclocker (4.5ghz @ 1.35v), is out of warranty, and was bought secondhand anyway, so at the very worst I would be looking at trying my luck at another 3570k that hopefully does better.
> 
> First application saw temp drops of about 5c cores 1-3 and 15c on core 4. After reseating about 10 times using various methods/TIM amounts I always have core 4 running at least 10c lower than the others. Before delidding all were within 3-4c of one another. I've tried holding the IHS steady while lowering the retention bracket and placing it a tad high and allowing the bracket to slide the IHS down center. I also realize that it is pointless to try for perfect contact with bad TIM that will only be on there 3-4 days anyway, but I view this as practice. I dont want to be cleaning up CLU several times once that arrives.
> 
> Anyone else have an issue with one core running at a very different temperature from the rest of the package after delidding? What did you do to solve the issue?
> 
> I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere. My work computer is severely restricted and it makes doing anything on the internet other than loading straight text rather difficult.


you need real tim. Clp/clu or maybe gelid extreme are the only tims worth using on the die.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Hello everyone,
> Before I finalize this delidding process I thought I'd ask the biggest amalgamation of liberated CPU die owners on the internet for some advice!
> 
> I delidded my 3570k yesterday. No real reason other than sheer boredom really. I used generic white paste TIM as that is the only paste I have available. (CLU, and indigo extreme on the way)
> 
> I thought it might be interesting to see whether simply improving the IHS to CPU die interface with a bad TIM would still yield improvement. My chip is a bad overclocker (4.5ghz @ 1.35v), is out of warranty, and was bought secondhand anyway, so at the very worst I would be looking at trying my luck at another 3570k that hopefully does better.
> 
> First application saw temp drops of about 5c cores 1-3 and 15c on core 4. After reseating about 10 times using various methods/TIM amounts I always have core 4 running at least 10c lower than the others. Before delidding all were within 3-4c of one another. I've tried holding the IHS steady while lowering the retention bracket and placing it a tad high and allowing the bracket to slide the IHS down center. I also realize that it is pointless to try for perfect contact with bad TIM that will only be on there 3-4 days anyway, but I view this as practice. I dont want to be cleaning up CLU several times once that arrives.
> 
> Anyone else have an issue with one core running at a very different temperature from the rest of the package after delidding? What did you do to solve the issue?
> 
> I apologize if this has been answered elsewhere. My work computer is severely restricted and it makes doing anything on the internet other than loading straight text rather difficult.


Of the three 4790k's I have delidded, on all three core 4 has run about 10 degrees cooler than the other cores. I don't know why but it just seems core 4 is usually a cold core.


----------



## spectre023

Ah, I see.
I re-applied the IHS and waterblock so many times that I am pretty confident that its not an issue of poor contact or a bad mount, but I had to ask just in case. That little bit of doubt that hides in the back of your mind can drive you insane, especially at work where you've still got all the questions in mind, but no way to test them lol.

Hopefully I'll see some improvement when the proper thermal material arrives, but if not I'll likely just attribute it to manufacturing variance or what have you. (feels strange to use such a phrase to describe such a precisely designed product







)


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Ah, I see.
> I re-applied the IHS and waterblock so many times that I am pretty confident that its not an issue of poor contact or a bad mount, but I had to ask just in case. That little bit of doubt that hides in the back of your mind can drive you insane, especially at work where you've still got all the questions in mind, but no way to test them lol.
> 
> Hopefully I'll see some improvement when the proper thermal material arrives, but if not I'll likely just attribute it to manufacturing variance or what have you. (feels strange to use such a phrase to describe such a precisely designed product
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


There is room for a lot of variance when applying CLU and mounting and the IHS. Every time I do it my temps change. I don't want you to drive yourself crazy with it, but if you don't get the temps you want its definitely worth trying again. After some experimenting it seems what worked best for me was painting a thin layer on the die, and a thin layer on the IHS. No puddles on either one. I also gave up on gluing the IHS down, and now I just set the chip in the socket then set the IHS on the chip and lock down.


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> you need real tim. Clp/clu or maybe gelid extreme are the only tims worth using on the die.


Ha, yeah I know. I know I used to have some ceramique and mx4 from the last build, but that stuff is MIA. I have no intention of leaving the bad TIM on any more than a couple of days.
I was curious about how differently bad TIM would perform with a better mount than the stock intel TIM with a *most likely* poor mount.

I will replace with CLU on die and indigo extreme on IHS/waterblock on wednesday or thursday.

Valgaur - I had not considered that the location of the iGPU could play a part in influencing the temperature of the adjacent core. Thats some useful insight, and something I'll likely try to test in the future!


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Ha, yeah I know. I know I used to have some ceramique and mx4 from the last build, but that stuff is MIA. I have no intention of leaving the bad TIM on any more than a couple of days.
> I was curious about how differently bad TIM would perform with a better mount than the stock intel TIM with a *most likely* poor mount.
> 
> I will replace with CLU on die and indigo extreme on IHS/waterblock on wednesday or thursday.
> 
> Valgaur - I had not considered that the location of the iGPU could play a part in influencing the temperature of the adjacent core. Thats some useful insight, and something I'll likely try to test in the future!


Have you used indigo extreme before? I was interested in trying it, but it looks like a real pain to apply. I think I will try just putting CLU between block and IHS, first.


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Have you used indigo extreme before? I was interested in trying it, but it looks like a real pain to apply. I think I will try just putting CLU between block and IHS, first.


I have!
Many times too, though the application is far different. I work for the State of Texas in a Laboratory that uses many different types of "thermo-equipment"- thermocyclers, vacuum ultracentrifuges, etc.
We use indigo extreme and other types of liquid metal materials when servicing and replacing electronics in these machines. Often the heatsink is incorporated into the frame of the equipment to save space or provide additional efficiency. It works quite well in these situations at least so i'm going to give it a shot in my personal endeavors haha

Edit: Come to think of it, I have several types of dow corning and VWR thermal pastes and metals around the lab that might be fun to try. They aren't really commercially available in such small amounts though so verification of my results would be hard to do.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> I have!
> Many times too, though the application is far different. I work for the State of Texas in a Laboratory that uses many different types of "thermo-equipment"- thermocyclers, vacuum ultracentrifuges, etc.
> We use indigo extreme and other types of liquid metal materials when servicing and replacing electronics in these machines. Often the heatsink is incorporated into the frame of the equipment to save space or provide additional efficiency. It works quite well in these situations at least so i'm going to give it a shot in my personal endeavors haha
> 
> Edit: Come to think of it, I have several types of dow corning and VWR thermal pastes and metals around the lab that might be fun to try. They aren't really commercially available in such small amounts though so verification of my results would be hard to do.


Just noticed your location. I live in San Antonio. I'm right down the road from you.


----------



## spectre023

So you are! Howdy neighbor. Check your PM's.
If some of these so called scientific future pastes give me half decent results maybe I'll hand some off to you if you ever come through.

You know.. just so i'm not the only one on the internet making crazy claims about the new CPU superfood that has Dr. Oz's panties in a bunch.


----------



## spectre023

Update:

Reapplied IHS and waterblock using ceramique 2 yesterday. Temps are still settling, but I am now maxing out at 64c @4.5ghz with an awful voltage of 1.34v. Any lower and it crashes prime 95 within the first 3 hours. Core temperatures have stabilized to 3-4c between cores.

Even with the r9 290 (OC to 1100 core 1350 mem) in the same loop running valley benchmark the cpu never passes 60c and the r9 stays between 35-38c. That swiftech komodo block is no joke. Running on 5x140 rad space.

I will still wait for the CLU and indigo extreme before submitting results for the club. Looks like valgaur and the rest of you had a point in saying that even though you tried it 10 times, it might take 10 more to get it right.

In the mean time, here's my 3570 getting a sponge bath!


----------



## tdbone1

I have a delidded Haswell 4770K with an H100i on an Asus Z97I-Plus
I think my cpu isn't that good this time or my mboard but it takes over 1.4v to get 4.5 stable but I really not happy with it
I really am more stable around 4.3ghz
I forget my exact numbers and I think I have them wrote down but I think my as5 that I applied between cpu and ihs and also between ihd and h100i isn't done right or what

I will see 92C for sure if I run ITXU.
I really been liking the ITXU as a quick test to get into ball park

anyhow I been thinking about going with no IHS and also using a different TIM
I might stick with the IHS and a different TIM but maybe this cpu is a good one and I just haven't got the TIM applied right with the h100i-ihs-cpu

anyhow long story short
I need to order some TIM and figure out once and for all if this chip is a descent one or not (at least with this motherboard I have)

right now I have the stock intel cooler back on

btw I just have a crappy mid tower case right now and most of the time the side panel is off but the h100i does bring air IN from the front
only the stock 2 fans

most are probably gonna say liquid pro and im interested but I worry about those little chips or circuits on the side of the cpu that the metal could come in contact with

bored and want to do something








need to place an order for some TIM


----------



## LandonAaron

I am going to use this:



to cool this:



and use this:



to cool this:



A little perspective is always nice







.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> I have a delidded Haswell 4770K with an H100i on an Asus Z97I-Plus
> I think my cpu isn't that good this time or my mboard but it takes over 1.4v to get 4.5 stable but I really not happy with it
> I really am more stable around 4.3ghz
> I forget my exact numbers and I think I have them wrote down but I think my as5 that I applied between cpu and ihs and also between ihd and h100i isn't done right or what
> 
> I will see 92C for sure if I run ITXU.
> I really been liking the ITXU as a quick test to get into ball park
> 
> anyhow I been thinking about going with no IHS and also using a different TIM
> I might stick with the IHS and a different TIM but maybe this cpu is a good one and I just haven't got the TIM applied right with the h100i-ihs-cpu
> 
> anyhow long story short
> I need to order some TIM and figure out once and for all if this chip is a descent one or not (at least with this motherboard I have)
> 
> right now I have the stock intel cooler back on
> 
> btw I just have a crappy mid tower case right now and most of the time the side panel is off but the h100i does bring air IN from the front
> only the stock 2 fans
> 
> most are probably gonna say liquid pro and im interested but I worry about those little chips or circuits on the side of the cpu that the metal could come in contact with
> 
> bored and want to do something
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> need to place an order for some TIM


Liquid Ultra easier to work with. Use some LET(liquid electrical tape) or clear nail polish to cover the VRMs on the CPU and there will be no worries.

http://www.grainger.com/product/BLUE-MAGIC-Brush-On-Electrical-Tape-1MPX8

That is the LET I grabbed to use CLU on a GTX 970. Picked it up at local Ace Hardware for like ~$8.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> I have a delidded Haswell 4770K with an H100i on an Asus Z97I-Plus
> I think my cpu isn't that good this time or my mboard but it takes over 1.4v to get 4.5 stable but I really not happy with it
> I really am more stable around 4.3ghz
> I forget my exact numbers and I think I have them wrote down but I think my as5 that I applied between cpu and ihs and also between ihd and h100i isn't done right or what
> 
> I will see 92C for sure if I run ITXU.
> I really been liking the ITXU as a quick test to get into ball park
> 
> anyhow I been thinking about going with no IHS and also using a different TIM
> I might stick with the IHS and a different TIM but maybe this cpu is a good one and I just haven't got the TIM applied right with the h100i-ihs-cpu
> 
> anyhow long story short
> I need to order some TIM and figure out once and for all if this chip is a descent one or not (at least with this motherboard I have)
> 
> right now I have the stock intel cooler back on
> 
> btw I just have a crappy mid tower case right now and most of the time the side panel is off but the h100i does bring air IN from the front
> only the stock 2 fans
> 
> most are probably gonna say liquid pro and im interested but I worry about those little chips or circuits on the side of the cpu that the metal could come in contact with
> 
> bored and want to do something
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> need to place an order for some TIM


Dont need to go ihs-less.it'll gain you at most a few degrees. Just use liquid ultra. Cannot say about the application since i havent used the pro version but definitely easy to clean off.easier than thermal paste i find.especially using the coollabs cleaning kit. And as roboyto has mentioned, LET or in my case, clear nail polish over the vrms. Do cover the vrms before applying the CLU just in case. Also try changing the fans if at all possible.


----------



## tdbone1

good info there guys

I believe I applied as5 under the ihs and I also believe I didn't do anything with the vrms as far as shielding them

im pretty worried about them as I have had this thing easily 95C quite a few times and sometimes for quite some time

I wonder if it has squeezed out and onto the circuit board and how close it has got to those vrm's

I have changed as5 and did the stock paste that came with the h100i and I am now currently using the stock tim that comes on the stock intel cooler for the 4770k

so I thinking about switching back to my h100i and will most likely keep the ihs but maybe lap it on the bottom and top or just the top?
maybe I lap the die too?

if this is a real doggy chip I prob not gonna lap anything.

right now with this stock intel fan and F5 bios defaults should I be able to run some app to see if I am at least getting temps I should be getting right now so it can tell me if something is wrong as far as the as5 under the ihs and the stock tim under the stock intel cooler?

I think all my cores are pretty much even now and they were not before I removed the ihs

I cant tell if this is a bad chip because of the chip, mb, tim under ihs or tim under cooler.

lol

I do need to get some nail polish and more tim.
looking like CLU as "im all about that clean"....









I wonder if I can open up the tube of as5 and get enough out to apply under the ihs one more time and maybe use the left over from the intel cooler and move it to the h100i until I get the new paste


----------



## Forceman

Normal thermal pastes will pump out over time, and you end up with nothing between the die and IHS, so you probably need to crack it open and check.

I wouldn't bother lapping, it really doesn't provide that much benefit, especially compared to delidding. And most assuredly don't try to lap the die.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> good info there guys
> 
> I believe I applied as5 under the ihs and I also believe I didn't do anything with the vrms as far as shielding them
> 
> im pretty worried about them as I have had this thing easily 95C quite a few times and sometimes for quite some time
> 
> I wonder if it has squeezed out and onto the circuit board and how close it has got to those vrm's
> 
> I have changed as5 and did the stock paste that came with the h100i and I am now currently using the stock tim that comes on the stock intel cooler for the 4770k
> 
> so I thinking about switching back to my h100i and will most likely keep the ihs but maybe lap it on the bottom and top or just the top?
> maybe I lap the die too?
> 
> if this is a real doggy chip I prob not gonna lap anything.
> 
> right now with this stock intel fan and F5 bios defaults should I be able to run some app to see if I am at least getting temps I should be getting right now so it can tell me if something is wrong as far as the as5 under the ihs and the stock tim under the stock intel cooler?
> 
> I think all my cores are pretty much even now and they were not before I removed the ihs
> 
> I cant tell if this is a bad chip because of the chip, mb, tim under ihs or tim under cooler.
> 
> lol
> 
> I do need to get some nail polish and more tim.
> looking like CLU as "im all about that clean"....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if I can open up the tube of as5 and get enough out to apply under the ihs one more time and maybe use the left over from the intel cooler and move it to the h100i until I get the new paste


Doesnt as5 have a 200hr curing time or am i mistaken here??try to get new time if possible. Gelid gc extreme, noctua nt-h1 or mx-4 are what i would recommend since i don't have experience with others. Oh, the swiftech tim that comes with the h220(x) is also good


----------



## tdbone1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Normal thermal pastes will pump out over time, and you end up with nothing between the die and IHS, so you probably need to crack it open and check.
> 
> I wouldn't bother lapping, it really doesn't provide that much benefit, especially compared to delidding. And most assuredly don't try to lap the die.


ok I think I might open it up and take a look but maybe ill do some more stock bios settings.....just to compare to others to see if my temps look correct with a stock cooler
need to find some stock 4770k temps running a stress test I can reproduce to check my results against


----------



## tdbone1

ambient room temp 74F
Asus Z97I-Plus latest bios as of this writing (2603) I believe
F5 Defaults and using the onboard gpu as video output through the vga connector
I7 4770K Delidded
AS5 under his
Intel Stock TIM that comes with the fan when new (already applied)

here are my stock temps just as a reference with intel xtreme tuning utility (help about) just says it is the latest as of 04-21-2015



ok here is XMP = enabled with manual 35x multies for cpu and cache


here is XMP = enabled and 37x multies for cpu and cache


only thing I did was raise the multies from 35x to 37x and do you see the temps change?
that shouldn't happen should it?

no wonder I been having so much problems overclocking (yea I set manual voltage for cpu and cache and VIN also but when set to auto voltage or llc is set by the multipliers?

I think the above is normal when running avx apps like ixtu
I forgot some apps add volts but I never knew they adjust how much that add by the multiplier setting.


----------



## Jimbags

Why do people use normal thermal paste under the ihs? Just use CLU and be done with it. Much more effective.Always seeing people get bad outcome using normal thermal pastes is all


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Why do people use normal thermal paste under the ihs? Just use CLU and be done with it. Much more effective.Always seeing people get bad outcome using normal thermal pastes is all


cheapskates


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Why do people use normal thermal paste under the ihs? Just use CLU and be done with it. Much more effective.Always seeing people get bad outcome using normal thermal pastes is all


Truth ^^

Why? Because popular wisdom says that it's Intel's stock thermal paste that is the problem, and therefore replacing it with an after-market paste must therefore improve temps.

Actually, Intel's paste isn't so bad... the problem is using an polymer-based emulsion to thermally connect the glass of the chip-die and the metal of the IHS or cooling block.

Firstly, polymers cannot "wet" glass, so there is always some air trapped at the surface of the chip.

Secondly, comparing the rate of heat transfer between paste and solder or liquid metal is maybe underestimated.

Tin alloy (solder) 50-80 W/m/°C
Gallium (liquid metal) 40 W/m/°C
Prolimatech PK-1 (polymer-based) 10 W/m/°C
Arctic MX-4 (polymer-based) 8 W/m/°C


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Truth ^^
> 
> Why? Because popular wisdom says that it's Intel's stock thermal paste that is the problem, and therefore replacing it with an after-market paste must therefore improve temps.
> 
> Actually, Intel's paste isn't so bad... the problem is using an polymer-based emulsion to thermally connect the glass of the chip-die and the metal of the IHS or cooling block.
> 
> Firstly, polymers cannot "wet" glass, so there is always some air trapped at the surface of the chip.
> 
> Secondly, comparing the rate of heat transfer between paste and solder or liquid metal is maybe underestimated.
> 
> Tin alloy (solder) 50-80 W/m/°C
> Gallium (liquid metal) 40 W/m/°C
> Prolimatech PK-1 (polymer-based) 10 W/m/°C
> Arctic MX-4 (polymer-based) 8 W/m/°C


That was sort of my theory.You just confirmed it. So advice.. Skip trial and error with normal pastes. Go with something as close to solder as possible. Eg CLU is liquid metal. Much better conduction.
Does anyone know the actual method to solder? I have quite a bit to do with metals, welding etc. Just curious


----------



## tdbone1

you gonna love this
I took off my intel tock hsf today
I reused the grease that was left on the his and off the stock alum intel hsf and smeared it across the h100i and also on the his and I did an F5 restore defaults on bios (so this is gonna be apples to apples with my 1st pic above as it is still 74F in the house


that is a 30F drop across all cores

now I did not take the ish off and reapply any new grease at all
this is with that old as5 and only the h100i with the used intel stock cooler grease

I gonna repeat the other tests above also

XMP = enabled 35x for multi and cache


xmp enable 37x multi for cache and cpu


xmp enabled 39x multi for cpu and cache


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> That was sort of my theory.You just confirmed it. So advice.. Skip trial and error with normal pastes. Go with something as close to solder as possible. Eg CLU is liquid metal. Much better conduction.
> Does anyone know the actual method to solder? I have quite a bit to do with metals, welding etc. Just curious


I believe the reason Intel stopped soldering the die to IHS was cracking of the die with thermal co-efficiency

but you could try suggest looking here for low temp solder I would assume the actual soldering process would be done in a precise thermally controlled oven

http://www.indium.com/solders/ribbon-and-foil/


----------



## tdbone1

here is the "Bios EZ Tuning Wizard" where I select non gaming and stock cooler and it puts me at 4.3GHz by Asus for the Z97I-Plus with bios 2603.
if I try to "manually" enter cpu volts of 1.32 (where it shows it in this screen max volts of 1.32) I enter that and then it changes the IA Core from 1.25 max in pic to 1.35

how do I NOT change the IA Cores after only changing CPU Volts to 1.32 after running the ez tuning wizard from the bios?

I pretty much like the ez tuning wizard settings as a template to start tweaking from

the occt in this 1hr run was not using the linpack/avx/avx2 extension correct?

I think I can get my temps down if I can manually set some of those settings but changing the cpu volts is making other volts go higher which is weird and I don't want it to do that as I want to manually set those also


----------



## EuEra

Someone mentioned a x264 stress test earlier, is it any better than the one built into occt or will that do the job?


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Someone mentioned a x264 stress test earlier, is it any better than the one built into occt or will that do the job?


OCCT will show instability faster than x264, but x264 will run 10-15 degrees cooler than OCCT. So if you are right up against your thermal limit and want to push higher, you can use x264 for stress testing purposes without worrying about cooking your chip. There is a special modified version which has been made to work better as a stress test utility. You can find more info about it on the fist post of the Haswell thread. Here is the download location: https://mega.co.nz/#!3tAGnAqZ!QbCz2r1fG0WjM8DgGYeExngGypaHftAzPUgTSn2kAdk


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> OCCT will show instability faster than x264, but x264 will run 10-15 degrees cooler than OCCT. So if you are right up against your thermal limit and want to push higher, you can use x264 for stress testing purposes without worrying about cooking your chip. There is a special modified version which has been made to work better as a stress test utility. You can find more info about it on the fist post of the Haswell thread. Here is the download location: https://mega.co.nz/#!3tAGnAqZ!QbCz2r1fG0WjM8DgGYeExngGypaHftAzPUgTSn2kAdk


Ahhh ok thats cool then my chip runs super cool any way (50 degrees in occt).

What is the linpack tab useful for in occt.


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> I am going to use this:
> 
> 
> 
> to cool this: (pic removed)
> 
> and use this: (pic removed)
> 
> to cool this: (pic removed)
> 
> A little perspective is always nice
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Im very curious to see the temps when that radiator is hooked up and flowing.

As far as the size of the radiators.. it actually makes sense, seeing as the chip is more powerful than that VW.
haha.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Im very curious to see the temps when that radiator is hooked up and flowing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As far as the size of the radiators.. it actually makes sense, seeing as the chip is more powerful than that VW.
> haha.


Hey that VW has 2.5 liter 5 cylinder engine. Lol, no I want to upgrade that part as well, but that's a very expensive upgrade.









I may get the radiator installed this weekend. I don't know my girlfriend is getting frustrated with me spending every weekend working on my computer, and I am ready to get a GTA V marathon in, so I may take this weekend off. But I will definitely post back once its installed.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EuEra*
> 
> Ahhh ok thats cool then my chip runs super cool any way (50 degrees in occt).
> 
> What is the linpack tab useful for in occt.


Trying to catch your chip on fire. Linpack is the hottest of all stress tests. 50 degrees is darn good. Is that your Max core temp, or just like the average? What speed/voltages are you using?


----------



## Pawelr98

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I believe the reason Intel stopped soldering the die to IHS was cracking of the die with thermal co-efficiency


The 775 P4s had similar die size and were soldered.
So there's no real reason behind this other than to limit the overclocks.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pawelr98*
> 
> The 775 P4s had similar die size and were soldered.
> So there's no real reason behind this other than to limit the overclocks.


It's cheaper and fine for their normal, locked CPUs. They then just used that same method for the unlocked K models as those probably come out of exactly the same assembly lines as the locked ones. The reason would then be because it saves them a bit of money.

There was something about a problem they supposedly had starting with Ivy Bridge. That might have just been an excuse, or it might have been true. If it was true, they obviously solved it for the LGA2011 Ivy Bridge stuff as they had more time, but by then they didn't go back and change anything for the LGA1155/1150 and kept using paste there.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I used a thick razor blade like the one y'all are talking about to delid my 4690k. The thinner ones get inbetween the IHS and PCB much easier, whereas with the thicker ones you have work all the corners until you manage to pry one up enough to get a piece of thick cardstock inbetween the IHS and PCB. I used an old credit card that I shaved the edge down with the same razor I used to delid.
> 
> One important note of caution, however; you can more easily flex and warp the PCB using this method, because it requires a fair bit of force. I actually warped my PCB fairly noticeably and it was still fine, but I imagine I was one of the lucky ones. The thinner razor blades are quicker to use (using a thick one took my about an hour, but I was being extremely careful and monitoring the amount of force I was using intensely, and I also cut myself and got blood everywhere and had to clean it up) but are more prone to scratching or nicking the PCB because of how thin and sharp they are.
> 
> I did bleed all over my CPU though. The core, the PCB, the pins, just soaked in blood. Cleans up easily enough with some iso (I literally dunked my CPU in a small bowl full of the stuff because it was so thoroughly coated) and I like to think my blood sacrifice pleased the gods of delidding. I was able to validate 5Ghz afterwards at 1.38v on a Hyper 212+, and I run 4.8Ghz at 1.33v all day long and my temps never hit 80c even in stress testing.


MOAR BL00D! Sacrifice requires MOAR bl00d to the dark gods of overclocking so that all future delids are successful from here on out.









That way my new Haswell(when I upgrade Board, CPU and RAM) is safe from BADOOM!


















~Ceadder


----------



## vividshock

My razors and new pc case comes in 1 week. Please spill as much blood as possible tyvm.

Edit: On a side note are these blades thin enough?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BPNP7O/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

those are the kind i used as the thicker utility blades were too thick to get under my IHS.

the biggest thing to look out for is trying not to flex the blade as you can dig into the PCB, then also you have to worry about the VRMs next to the die.
Using a thin plastic or laminated card is definitely the best way to go once you've gotten under the first corner.

I wonder if it's possible to use thin fishing line (braided preferably) to remove the IHS? Might prove to be even safer than Razor or Razor+card...
tho really, using a vice is the safest route.


----------



## vividshock

Yea I agree a vice would be easier, but for me it'd be a waste to buy a vice and not use after also I wouldn't buy 1 then return it after usage. Though the fishing line idea seems great, I might try it out.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vividshock*
> 
> Yea I agree a vice would be easier, but for me it'd be a waste to buy a vice and not use after also I wouldn't buy 1 then return it after usage. Though the fishing line idea seems great, I might try it out.


No possibility of borrowing one even??


----------



## EuEra

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Trying to catch your chip on fire. Linpack is the hottest of all stress tests. 50 degrees is darn good. Is that your Max core temp, or just like the average? What speed/voltages are you using?


Its my average, max is 4.8 @ 1.255. I did 2 hours of OCCT 20 passes of x264 and an hour of real bench stress test.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Trying to catch your chip on fire. Linpack is the hottest of all stress tests. 50 degrees is darn good. Is that your Max core temp, or just like the average? What speed/voltages are you using?


Its the weirdest thing i ran occt again and crashed instantly the only thing ive changed is enable all the power saving options


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vividshock*
> 
> Yea I agree a vice would be easier, but for me it'd be a waste to buy a vice and not use after also I wouldn't buy 1 then return it after usage. Though the fishing line idea seems great, I might try it out.


fishing line doesn't seem to work, line usually breaks.


----------



## Brohem0th

I would like to point out that using a thicker razor blade as a first-class lever to literally raise the IHS off the PCB using the PCB as a fulcrum will almost certainly warp the PCB of your CPU to some degree, and if you're not careful you can crack the die of the processor itself.

I've worked in construction and other trades for about 11 years now, and I know my way around a razor blade. My father, who I was lucky enough to be staying with on the weekend away from college, has done it for more than 40 years. It's entirely possible to do, and a fair bit of warp is actually fine, but you do have to be extremely careful.

And as funny as it was that I was able to validate 5Ghz after bleeding all over it, you can slice yourself open with a razor blade if you're not careful. I cut myself about a 1/4" deep and nicked the bone in my thumb, and I didn't even feel it until I saw the blood a few seconds later. If I can find the video I took after delidding it, I would really be able to show the degree of warp my CPU was bent to.

And for the record, you don't have to use CLU or CLP to get good temp reductions. I used Antec Formula 6 Nano Diamond Compound, and I got a 13-7c drop in temps across my cores. The most important part is removing the black sealant as best as you can without damaging the PCB or Die or VRM's. Once you get a corner started, use a credit card to work the rest of the way around. You can shave one side of it down with the razor so it will fit, and just work it around the IHS with a kind of sawing motion, only going as deep as you need to. Look up a picture of your CPU delidded to see where the VRM's are and get an idea of how deep you can safely cut with a razor or separate with a credit card. You can still knock a VRM off using a credit card, although it's much more difficult. That said, people have knocked two or more of the VRM's off and still been able to use their CPU, with no or minimal after effects.

The Vice is the safest method by far, and you really don't even need the block of wood if you're using a rubber mallet. You don't have to worry about it flying off if you hold the sides of the PCB while you strike it with the mallet, and remember that the vice is holding the IHS, NOT the PCB.

Overall, the difference from before and after is nice, but not as great as I was hoping for. I went from being able to run 1.33v and staying under 90c at 4.8Ghz, to being able to do the same clockspeed at 1.30v, and my max safe thermal temp voltage went up from 1.30v to 1.35v. Not enough to run 4.9Ghz 24/7, but it's stable in most games even while streaming. I was able to validate 5Ghz at 1.38v where before I couldn't even boot 5Ghz at any voltage. I'd still have to upgrade my cooling solution (A Hyper 212+ with two Phanteks F140HP's mounted to it) to push it harder and be absolutely stable, but the drop in temps was nice from a longevity and noise standpoint. Not to mention now I can run it at 4.2Ghz at 1.050v and if I turn every fan off in the case and run Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT's for two hours it never even breaks 65c.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pawelr98*
> 
> The 775 P4s had similar die size and were soldered.
> So there's no real reason behind this other than to limit the overclocks.


that is true with the 775 but they also ran a whole lot cooler where max max temps were considered in the 60°C range
that was the excuse given by Intel dies cracking but then if it were a oversight then I can't explain devils canyon with improved TIM instead of soldering.


----------



## tdbone1

how does the cpugpu work without making the cheap any hotter?

I mean say I do the intel xtreme tuning utility and I see max cpu core temps of 90C while im using the gpu as my primary display

then say I run furmark or something to try and get the cpu/cpugpu hot

the themps never go higher then the original itxu and that app isn't really using the gpu

the cpugpu is all on the cpu die itself and not in any other chip on the motherboard correct?

shouldn't my temps get hotter if using the cpu and gpu together at same time vs just the cpu running itxu?
if so im not seeing this


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> how does the cpugpu work without making the cheap any hotter?
> 
> I mean say I do the intel xtreme tuning utility and I see max cpu core temps of 90C while im using the gpu as my primary display
> 
> then say I run furmark or something to try and get the cpu/cpugpu hot
> 
> the themps never go higher then the original itxu and that app isn't really using the gpu
> 
> the cpugpu is all on the cpu die itself and not in any other chip on the motherboard correct?
> 
> shouldn't my temps get hotter if using the cpu and gpu together at same time vs just the cpu running itxu?
> if so im not seeing this


The gpu is permanently running if your using it instead of discrete graphics. It doent turn off when not stressed. Prob doesnt downclock and boost up as much as a discrete gpu either.
Also the chip can only use set watts?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Hey that VW has 2.5 liter 5 cylinder engine. Lol, no I want to upgrade that part as well, but that's a very expensive upgrade.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may get the radiator installed this weekend. I don't know my girlfriend is getting frustrated with me spending every weekend working on my computer, and I am ready to get a GTA V marathon in, so I may take this weekend off. But I will definitely post back once its installed.


Did someone say a 5 Cylinder VW/Audi engine?









Just checking back here, seeing if any of the older first-generation De-Lidders are still around.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Did someone say a 5 Cylinder VW/Audi engine?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just checking back here, seeing if any of the older first-generation De-Lidders are still around.










Im running an i5 3570K 4.7Ghz 1.27V, used CLU under IHS and AS5 between block and IHS, cooled by Swiftech H220 with 4x120mm push pull config. CPU is the only thing in the loop at the moment








Oh hey Im also Aussie


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im running an i5 3570K 4.7Ghz 1.27V, used CLU under IHS and AS5 between block and IHS, cooled by Swiftech H220 with 4x120mm push pull config. CPU is the only thing in the loop at the moment
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh hey Im also Aussie


That's good for a 3570k!

I can't do 4.7 realistically..

I've been de-lidded since a bit before Christmas 2012 and I'm still going strong! I've changed boards there and back a few times.

I've been running 4.4 @ 1.34v or something I think all these years, I'm at stock right now because this AsRock board doesn't overclock the same as the Gigabyte one.

My IHS doesn't sit straight, I do have photos somewhere but it doesn't effect temps too much, I get a max of 62c on Intel Burn Test still.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> That's good for a 3570k!
> 
> I can't do 4.7 realistically..
> 
> I've been de-lidded since a bit before Christmas 2012 and I'm still going strong! I've changed boards there and back a few times.
> 
> I've been running 4.4 @ 1.34v or something I think all these years, I'm at stock right now because this AsRock board doesn't overclock the same as the Gigabyte one.
> 
> My IHS doesn't sit straight, I do have photos somewhere but it doesn't effect temps too much, I get a max of 62c on Intel Burn Test still.


Yeah mines in a gigabyte board. They always seem to clock well. Got an awesome deal for mine too. Guy was selling it in a htpc with the GA-Z77MX-D3H 8gb of ram nice aluminium htpc case and a seasonic 250W sff psu. Got the whole lot for about $350ish AUD. Good price for Australian parts. Espescially here in Darwin. So my 2500k and old mobo went into my htpc with a 750ti. I dellided the 3570k and put in my main rig with the gigabyte mobo and a gtx 770 :-D
Which cooler you using?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Yeah mines in a gigabyte board. They always seem to clock well. Got an awesome deal for mine too. Guy was selling it in a htpc with the GA-Z77MX-D3H 8gb of ram nice aluminium htpc case and a seasonic 250W sff psu. Got the whole lot for about $350ish AUD. Good price for Australian parts. Espescially here in Darwin. So my 2500k and old mobo went into my htpc with a 750ti. I dellided the 3570k and put in my main rig with the gigabyte mobo and a gtx 770 :-D
> Which cooler you using?


Nice score!

I'm using custom water, got a XSPC D5 with a RX360 Radiator and a 290 w/block in the loop.

Gets a little warm at times on the CPU side, but the GPU never passes 45c on the core and never passes 52c on the VRM's.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Nice score!
> 
> I'm using custom water, got a XSPC D5 with a RX360 Radiator and a 290 w/block in the loop.
> 
> Gets a little warm at times on the CPU side, but the GPU never passes 45c on the core and never passes 52c on the VRM's.


Nice temps for the 290! I should really add the gpu to my loop  That score also included the 3570k btw  pBasically got all that stuff for the price of the cpu at the time :-D

Hey you sa8d first gen delidders? Some Old 775 socket cpu's can be delidded too  I have 2 intel E2140's im thinking of playing around with. Stock speed 1.6Ghz but could get 3.00ghz I think


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Nice score!
> 
> I'm using custom water, got a XSPC D5 with a RX360 Radiator and a 290 w/block in the loop.
> 
> Gets a little warm at times on the CPU side, but the GPU never passes 45c on the core and never passes 52c on the VRM's.


is the 290 overclocked?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Nice temps for the 290! I should really add the gpu to my loop  That score also included the 3570k btw  pBasically got all that stuff for the price of the cpu at the time :-D
> 
> Hey you sa8d first gen delidders? Some Old 775 socket cpu's can be delidded too  I have 2 intel E2140's im thinking of playing around with. Stock speed 1.6Ghz but could get 3.00ghz I think


I meant as in the first people who de-lidded, I did it back in 2012 when it was new for people to De-Lid Ivy, at least on here haha.

I've de-lidded several Pentium 4's, a couple of Celeron 440's, a few E21xx chips (they're good bang for buck if you can clock them - low FSB stock) and a E4300 which was supposedly pasted but mine wasn't.

I think I broke the first 440 I did, the rest all worked fine afterwards haha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> is the 290 overclocked?


It is, I've been playing around with it with GTA V but I'm having trouble getting it past 1125MHz without insane amounts of voltage. I did have it valley stable at ~1210 with +100mv and 1500MHz RAM. Unforutnately the RAM isn't stable at anything above the stock 1250 with a real load on it (I don't think).

Right now I'm at 1125/1250 with +13mv on the core, gotta tweak more when I have time. Will probably do it once the Gigabyte board is back in.


----------



## spectre023

Finally had time for the liquid ultra application. I never took any screen shots of temps before the delid and I've run several TIM's since, but I do remember what my original temps @ 4.5ghz were.
Package temp before delid was 80-82C.
Add me!

OCN name: Spectre023
CPU: 3570K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid: 4.5 ghz
Temp drops: 23C





Edit: I realize that the desktop pic is a little blurry, not sure how to clear it up other than just clicking view original


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Finally had time for the liquid ultra application. I never took any screen shots of temps before the delid and I've run several TIM's since, but I do remember what my original temps @ 4.5ghz were.
> Package temp before delid was 80-82C.
> Add me!
> 
> OCN name: Spectre023
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4.5 ghz
> Temp drops: 23C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I realize that the desktop pic is a little blurry, not sure how to clear it up other than just clicking view original


Those are impressive temps!! What are your ambients like??


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Those are impressive temps!! What are your ambients like??


Ambient is 24C.
Its on a loop with the R9 290 too. I haven't had time to test it with both cpu and gpu stressed yet, but ive never seen the r9 go over 39c regardless of cpu temp. I expect I'll probably end up with the cpu package temp around 63c with the r9 at 100%, based on info from before the liquid ultra application. I was running ceramique 2 on both die and ihs/block prior to this and was maxing at 72c across all four cores, so this is a significant improvement even from a good application of high quality tim. A win in my book!


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Ambient is 24C.
> Its on a loop with the R9 290 too. I haven't had time to test it with both cpu and gpu stressed yet, but ive never seen the r9 go over 39c regardless of cpu temp. I expect I'll probably end up with the cpu package temp around 63c with the r9 at 100%, based on info from before the liquid ultra application. I was running ceramique 2 on both die and ihs/block prior to this and was maxing at 72c across all four cores, so this is a significant improvement even from a good application of high quality tim. A win in my book!


Whoa!great job dude. And for the space between die and ihs, i do agree with using CLU.between ihs and cooler, meh,almost any paste would do


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Whoa!great job dude. And for the space between die and ihs, i do agree with using CLU.between ihs and cooler, meh,almost any paste would do


Thanks!
I did pick up some indigo extreme for the ihs/block, but decided to save it for the possibility of finding a better oc'ing chip in the future.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Thanks!
> I did pick up some indigo extreme for the ihs/block, but decided to save it for the possibility of finding a better oc'ing chip in the future.


Wow..still shopping around eh?why not just purchase from silicon lottery?i've read good things about them here on ocn.
On a similar topic, my 4790K wont stabilise at 4.7Ghz, 1.327V on OCCT. Wondering if it's just my chip that requires more volts or the test itself. Of course leaning towards the former but that means i'll have to run it at 4.6 if that's the case. Haswell is safe running at 1.35V for daily use right?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Finally had time for the liquid ultra application. I never took any screen shots of temps before the delid and I've run several TIM's since, but I do remember what my original temps @ 4.5ghz were.
> Package temp before delid was 80-82C.
> Add me!
> 
> OCN name: Spectre023
> CPU: 3570K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 4.5 ghz
> Temp drops: 23C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I realize that the desktop pic is a little blurry, not sure how to clear it up other than just clicking view original


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Jimbags

Is it worth putting CLU brtween ihs and block? Will it be hard to remove? Thanks


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Is it worth putting CLU brtween ihs and block? Will it be hard to remove? Thanks


just use gelid extreme there.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> just use gelid extreme there.


Im using AS5  Thought that was pretty equal to The gelid or am I mistaken?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Im using AS5  Thought that was pretty equal to The gelid or am I mistaken?


No gelid is much better.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> No gelid is much better.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


wow didnt realise the noctua was so good  I think I have some mx-4 and noctua paste lying around. But then again I also have some CLU :-D


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> wow didnt realise the noctua was so good  I think I have some mx-4 and noctua paste lying around. But then again I also have some CLU :-D


Safest would of course be the other thermal pastes.but if u feel like living on the edge, clu can be used


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Safest would of course be the other thermal pastes.but if u feel like living on the edge, clu can be used


Would it ruin the copper block of the swiftech H220?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Would it ruin the copper block of the swiftech H220?


Might be stained u suppose but it's more unsightly than anything. I think the main issue would be use on aluminium parts.take a look at the msds for CLU. I cant remember offhand. Though i do know that it stains the underside of my ihs


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Might be stained u suppose but it's more unsightly than anything. I think the main issue would be use on aluminium parts.take a look at the msds for CLU. I cant remember offhand. Though i do know that it stains the underside of my ihs


Yeah read up a bit with mixed results. Some people claimed damage but like you say just looked stained. Aluminium is a no no of course.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Personally I've used Liquid metal between my Thermalright cooler and my waterblock, as well as on my 7950 + Artic cooler and had no issues as long as you use Liquid Ultra (that's the less bonding one? - I get confused) you'll be fine.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Personally I've used Liquid metal between my Thermalright cooler and my waterblock, as well as on my 7950 + Artic cooler and had no issues as long as you use Liquid Ultra (that's the less bonding one? - I get confused) you'll be fine.


what were the temps like compared to normal pastes?anything to rave about?


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> what were the temps like compared to normal pastes?anything to rave about?


Now that I recall it was the HIS IceQ Turbo 7950 cooler or the Sapphire 2L (DualX) 7950 - not sure which but if I recall it was a 6-7c drop from stock paste.

It's obviously a very dangerous thing to try, so try it at your own risk!

Also I just found some of the de-lidded processors I did a while back.. Haha, E2140's and Celey's.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Now that I recall it was the HIS IceQ Turbo 7950 cooler or the Sapphire 2L (DualX) 7950 - not sure which but if I recall it was a 6-7c drop from stock paste.
> 
> It's obviously a very dangerous thing to try, so try it at your own risk!


i already have it between the die and cooler on my 290..dropped temps 10C. just curious to know if there'll be roughly as large a drop in temps for the cpu as well


----------



## Jimbags

Hmmm so tempting... happy with temps for now though. 3570k @ 4.7Ghz using intel burn test, hit max temp of 72c on one core but stayed around 63c max most of the time. Bare in mind ambient temp was around 28-30c. I live in Darwin Australia very hot. Ill cool the room and retry though.Im guessing low 60c's max with better ambient


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> wow didnt realise the noctua was so good  I think I have some mx-4 and noctua paste lying around. But then again I also have some CLU :-D


mx-4 or noctua will get the job done. If I had ether of those on hand I wouldnt buy more.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i already have it between the die and cooler on my 290..dropped temps 10C. just curious to know if there'll be roughly as large a drop in temps for the cpu as well


Oh nice! Just on the stock cooler?

I'm tempted to use some of my 290's waterblock when I rebuild my loop (when that happens..) and to replace the thermal pads with better ones too. Not that I get bad temps by any means. might even put some liquid pro on the block - pad side of the VRM's.. I've seen that done before successfully.

I'd say you'll probably see a similar drop if your de-lid + re-fit was done well. I.E did you see over a 20c drop?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Hmmm so tempting... happy with temps for now though. 3570k @ 4.7Ghz using intel burn test, hit max temp of 72c on one core but stayed around 63c max most of the time. Bare in mind ambient temp was around 28-30c. I live in Darwin Australia very hot. Ill cool the room and retry though.Im guessing low 60c's max with better ambient


I'd give it a go if you have the paste, just remember to be careful to not get any CLP anywhere apart from the top of the IHS, that goes for both of you.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Oh nice! Just on the stock cooler?
> 
> I'm tempted to use some of my 290's waterblock when I rebuild my loop (when that happens..) and to replace the thermal pads with better ones too. Not that I get bad temps by any means. might even put some liquid pro on the block - pad side of the VRM's.. I've seen that done before successfully.
> 
> I'd say you'll probably see a similar drop if your de-lid + re-fit was done well. I.E did you see over a 20c drop?
> I'd give it a go if you have the paste, just remember to be careful to not get any CLP anywhere apart from the top of the IHS, that goes for both of you.


well,if by stock you mean the original cooler from my msi r9 290 Gaming 4G then yes. If you mean the blower style cooler found on reference cards, then no. I also changed thermal pads on vrm 1 to the fujipoly ultra extreme, so in 26C ambients, with a clock of 1100/1500, vrm1 is only at 60-ish degrees. And finally, the ziptied ap-15 to the unused pcie slots acting as an exhaust helped me with the final drop in temps.

Was tempted to try CLU between my noctua and ihs, but i'm not thermally limited now. but i am limited by voltage. 4.7GHz at 1.317V totally sucks. I was hoping for a 4.8 at least. Even then in OCCT I get about 60ish and about 70-ish in prime95 v26 small fft. looking to fiddle around with other settings more when i get back from my short holiday next week


----------



## cephelix

delete


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> well,if by stock you mean the original cooler from my msi r9 290 Gaming 4G then yes. If you mean the blower style cooler found on reference cards, then no. I also changed thermal pads on vrm 1 to the fujipoly ultra extreme, so in 26C ambients, with a clock of 1100/1500, vrm1 is only at 60-ish degrees. And finally, the ziptied ap-15 to the unused pcie slots acting as an exhaust helped me with the final drop in temps.
> 
> Was tempted to try CLU between my noctua and ihs, but i'm not thermally limited now. but i am limited by voltage. 4.7GHz at 1.317V totally sucks. I was hoping for a 4.8 at least. Even then in OCCT I get about 60ish and about 70-ish in prime95 v26 small fft. looking to fiddle around with other settings more when i get back from my short holiday next week


I meant the stock cooler that came with your card yeah.







Nice!

I reckon I'll get some of those pads, I may even have some Phoyba 11w pads which will no doubt be better then what came with my waterblock.

You could probably just crank the voltage up a bit more to get 4.8 or 4.9 even, 70c in OCCT is good! Because you'll never see that temp in real world usage. These chips are also good up to around 75 in my opinion, it shouldn't be getting to that daily though.

I'm not thermally limited, but voltage.. I've got the worst 3570k I've ever seen.. 1.36v for 4.4GHz and 1.44 for 4.6GHz, 4.8.. Don't even ask.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I meant the stock cooler that came with your card yeah.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice!
> 
> I reckon I'll get some of those pads, I may even have some Phoyba 11w pads which will no doubt be better then what came with my waterblock.
> 
> You could probably just crank the voltage up a bit more to get 4.8 or 4.9 even, 70c in OCCT is good! Because you'll never see that temp in real world usage. These chips are also good up to around 75 in my opinion, it shouldn't be getting to that daily though.
> 
> I'm not thermally limited, but voltage.. I've got the worst 3570k I've ever seen.. 1.36v for 4.4GHz and 1.44 for 4.6GHz, 4.8.. Don't even ask.


i've gone all the way up to 1.36 for 4.8 and it's still not stable. as i said, will have to test out tweaking other voltages before i try again. For right now though, i'll try to stabilise 4.7 first, then I'll see what is required for 4.8


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i've gone all the way up to 1.36 for 4.8 and it's still not stable. as i said, will have to test out tweaking other voltages before i try again. For right now though, i'll try to stabilise 4.7 first, then I'll see what is required for 4.8


My 4790k needs a big jump in voltages to go 4.8Ghz. I hope I can get past this after I delid/upgrade coolers.
Question: Who uses the naked die mount from EK? I plan on expanding an H220X and if I delid I may just go this route. Is CLP still the recommended TIM for this type of application, I read that gelid extreme is pretty decent stuff. I wanna be able to easily remove and clean it, so CLP not on my mind.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> My 4790k needs a big jump in voltages to go 4.8Ghz. I hope I can get past this after I delid/upgrade coolers.
> Question: Who uses the naked die mount from EK? I plan on expanding an H220X and if I Felix I may just go this route. Is CLP still the recommended TIM for this type of application, I read that gelid extreme is pretty decent stuff. I wanna be able to easily remove and clean it, so CLP not on my mind.


Try CLU instead. I havent had any problems in application or removal of the stuff.how much will temps be lowered with a naked die mount compared to just delidding??how many volts do you need for 4.8?


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Try CLU instead. I havent had any problems in application or removal of the stuff.how much will temps be lowered with a naked die mount compared to just delidding??how many volts do you need for 4.8?


Well I tried testing with x264 for one loop each going from 1.25-1.35 it passed a loop at 1.28 but fails OCCT within like 10 minutes.
Temps are decent enough to raise vcore*MAX temps for me is 95℃* while stress testing, I get 90℃ flat.
Edit: CPU is currently at.
Core x47
Uncore x40
VID 1.215
Uncore 1.15
Memory at XMP 1600 9-9-9-24
VDROOP 100%.....
What could I try to go higher than 4.7Ghz?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Well I tried testing with x264 for one loop each going from 1.25-1.35 it passed a loop at 1.28 but fails OCCT within like 10 minutes.
> Temps are decent enough to raise vcore*MAX temps for me is 95℃* while stress testing, I get 90℃ flat.


Occt seems very difficult to pass.will have to try prime and see how things go i suppose


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Well I tried testing with x264 for one loop each going from 1.25-1.35 it passed a loop at 1.28 but fails OCCT within like 10 minutes.
> Temps are decent enough to raise vcore*MAX temps for me is 95℃* while stress testing, I get 90℃ flat.
> Edit: CPU is currently at.
> Core x47
> Uncore x40
> VID 1.215
> Uncore 1.15
> Memory at XMP 1600 9-9-9-24
> VDROOP 100%.....
> What could I try to go higher than 4.7Ghz?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Occt seems very difficult to pass.will have to try prime and see how things go i suppose


I feel like neither of you are really in tune with what stability testing is all about.....

You don't bail on a stress test in favour of another one simply because you can't pass it; you raise voltages or lower multipliers so that you CAN pass it.

Furthermore, a successful session of x264 encoding does not constitute a mere single loop of x264

You should be aiming to stress your system for a period of time roughly equivalent to the length of time you plan on keeping your system at load for during your work/gaming session. The harder the stress test you've used, the more confident you can be of stability


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> I feel like neither of you are really in tune with what stability testing is all about.....
> 
> You don't bail on a stress test in favour of another one simply because you can't pass it; you raise voltages or lower multipliers so that you CAN pass it.
> 
> Furthermore, a successful session of x264 encoding does not constitute a mere single loop of x264
> 
> You should be aiming to stress your system for a period of time roughly equivalent to the length of time you plan on keeping your system at load for during your work/gaming session. The harder the stress test you've used, the more confident you can be of stability


Lol.. let me reiterate.. I've stress tested my 4.7ghz overclocks and that's my final settings, FINAL meaning I've done with y power used various testing software to reach those settings.
However my question is, how should I go about on going above 4.7ghz, I've been told that I at have hit a wall with my chip.


----------



## fleetfeather

You find the software that you used to establish your "FINAL" profile, and keep raising voltage until you hit a voltage limit or a thermal limit


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Done! Muchas Gracias!
I plan on doing some more experimenting with the mount when I have the time. Next week maybe.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> My 4790k needs a big jump in voltages to go 4.8Ghz. I hope I can get past this after I delid/upgrade coolers.
> Question: Who uses the naked die mount from EK? I plan on expanding an H220X and if I delid I may just go this route. Is CLP still the recommended TIM for this type of application, I read that gelid extreme is pretty decent stuff. I wanna be able to easily remove and clean it, so CLP not on my mind.


Hmm, now you've got me thinking about direct-die mounting! It's a big risk for me at least, my Coolabatory paste has fused the die and IHS together!

Also de-lidding will not let you overclock more voltage wise, if you have a voltage wall you have a voltage wall. 4.7 isn't a bad effort though.


----------



## cephelix

@fleetfeather i do agree about the stability testing. As mentioned, there are tons of settings that i have yet to tweak and the current 4.7 i have is by no means stable or my final setting.it's my first time with OCCT so do pardon me if i switch it for something i'm more familiar with. That being said, i will still stress with the full complement of tests i have on hand, namely prime,occt,realbench and x264.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Well I tried testing with x264 for one loop each going from 1.25-1.35 it passed a loop at 1.28 but fails OCCT within like 10 minutes.
> Temps are decent enough to raise vcore*MAX temps for me is 95℃* while stress testing, I get 90℃ flat.
> Edit: CPU is currently at.
> Core x47
> Uncore x40
> VID 1.215
> Uncore 1.15
> Memory at XMP 1600 9-9-9-24
> VDROOP 100%.....
> What could I try to go higher than 4.7Ghz?


No need for higher than 4.5 Gigglehertz honestly, nothing really gains after that. Keep your gear alive longer 4.5 is plenty


----------



## Jimbags

Stress tested my [email protected] 1.27V last night maximum setting on intel burn test.Didnt miss a beat  Ambient was 26c hottest core hit 71c but mostly hung around high 60c. Im pretty happy with that :-D


----------



## Pawelr98

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I meant the stock cooler that came with your card yeah.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice!
> 
> I reckon I'll get some of those pads, I may even have some Phoyba 11w pads which will no doubt be better then what came with my waterblock.
> 
> You could probably just crank the voltage up a bit more to get 4.8 or 4.9 even, 70c in OCCT is good! Because you'll never see that temp in real world usage. These chips are also good up to around 75 in my opinion, it shouldn't be getting to that daily though.
> 
> I'm not thermally limited, but voltage.. I've got the worst 3570k I've ever seen.. 1.36v for 4.4GHz and 1.44 for 4.6GHz, 4.8.. Don't even ask.
> 
> 
> 
> i've gone all the way up to 1.36 for 4.8 and it's still not stable. as i said, will have to test out tweaking other voltages before i try again. For right now though, i'll try to stabilise 4.7 first, then I'll see what is required for 4.8
Click to expand...

Maybe try raising input voltage a bit.


----------



## spectre023

Those voltages look very similar to my chip.
1.364v @ 4.5
1.444v @ 4.6
1.515v @ 4.7
4.8 is plain unattainable.

I'm afraid you may just be stuck there as I am with mine. Even at 1.5 volts it runs well under 70c after the delid; it's just as if there's no limit to the voltage it takes to get there.


----------



## Jimbags

1.5v for 4.7 thats insane!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> 1.5v for 4.7 thats insane!


Yep, welcome to @spectre023 and @Matt-Matt's world.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Those voltages look very similar to my chip.
> 1.364v @ 4.5
> 1.444v @ 4.6
> 1.515v @ 4.7
> 4.8 is plain unattainable.
> 
> I'm afraid you may just be stuck there as I am with mine. Even at 1.5 volts it runs well under 70c after the delid; it's just as if there's no limit to the voltage it takes to get there.


We should make a club! Haha, I had thoughts that I just had a bad board - The main one I use is a Z77x-D3H, however I'm getting around the same on this Z68 Extreme 3 Gen 3.

I've had a friend offer to "lend" me a 2700k, so I may give that a go for a while. I reckon if I used CLP and got better fans I could run around 1.5v daily but I want my chip to last especially considering that desktop processors have essentially stopped getting large performance gains. At this rate it'll be another 3 years at least before it's worth upgrading.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yep, welcome to @spectre023 and @Matt-Matt's world.
> We should make a club! Haha, I had thoughts that I just had a bad board - The main one I use is a Z77x-D3H, however I'm getting around the same on this Z68 Extreme 3 Gen 3.
> 
> I've had a friend offer to "lend" me a 2700k, so I may give that a go for a while. I reckon if I used CLP and got better fans I could run around 1.5v daily but I want my chip to last especially considering that desktop processors have essentially stopped getting large performance gains. At this rate it'll be another 3 years at least before it's worth upgrading.


That sucks. Unlucky in the silicon lottery for sure... To think this chip I have was in a computer shop built htpc. Stock clocks and using iGPU.. Almost wasted unknown to the world, its overclocking capabilities. Had the chance to buy more of the same setup but didnt have the cash :-/


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> That sucks. Unlucky in the silicon lottery for sure... To think this chip I have was in a computer shop built htpc. Stock clocks and using iGPU.. Almost wasted unknown to the world, its overclocking capabilities. Had the chance to buy more of the same setup but didnt have the cash :-/


3570k in a HTPC? Holy..

Why didn't they use a 3570s, or even an i3?

I've never been overly lucky with the silicon lottery, lets just hope that next time I am!


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> 3570k in a HTPC? Holy..
> 
> Why didn't they use a 3570s, or even an i3?
> 
> I've never been overly lucky with the silicon lottery, lets just hope that next time I am!


No idea, he was selling like 5 of them all prebuilt/ Even a weird choice of motherboard GA-Z77MX-D3H. Im not complaing though















Oh and good luck next time!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> No idea, he was selling like 5 of them all prebuilt/ Even a weird choice of motherboard GA-Z77MX-D3H. Im not complaing though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh and good luck next time!


Probably overclocked them himself! That's not too odd then, I was assuming that he had them in locked boards!









Haha cheers!


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> 1.5v for 4.7 thats insane!


Yes I know, my voltages are crazy.
I think I messed up by not having any kids to offer up to the silicon lottery.

Just kidding.. I'm only 26. I don't have any kids to offer *YET*.









On that note, why not put a 3570k in an Htpc? Youd be able to cook eggs right on your desk!


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> Yes I know, my voltages are crazy.
> I think I messed up by not having any kids to offer up to the silicon lottery.
> 
> Just kidding.. I'm only 26. I don't have any kids to offer *YET*.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On that note, why not put a 3570k in an Htpc? Youd be able to cook eggs right on your desk!


Hey Im 27 with second on the way! Haha My old 2500k is in my htpc so its imho still over powered


----------



## MoGTy

I did another delid on an i5 3570K.

I have a thermaltake frio (2010 edition, I think) with one Corsair SP120 quiet edition pushing air. I used AS5 in between the IHS - die, and IHS - heatsink.

I can't be arsed with proof right now, maybe in a few months when I do some maintenance on my rig. So this is just a headsup.

The max temps were achieved with IBT.

Pre lap/delid


Post lap/delid


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Hey Im 27 with second on the way! Haha My old 2500k is in my htpc so its imho still over powered


What kind of cooling do you run on the 2500? Im curious to see how you fit a decent cooler in there.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MoGTy*
> 
> I did another delid on an i5 3570K.
> 
> I have a thermaltake frio (2010 edition, I think) with one Corsair SP120 quiet edition pushing air. I used AS5 in between the IHS - die, and IHS - heatsink.
> 
> I can't be arsed with proof right now, maybe in a few months when I do some maintenance on my rig. So this is just a headsup.
> 
> The max temps were achieved with IBT.


Those are some good temps.
Was the cpu under full load or only loaded on one core? Thats a considerable deviation from the rest on the first core, and I've never seen one run much hotter than the rest while maintaining a max that is quite a bit lower than the rest. Interesting stuff.


----------



## MoGTy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> What kind of cooling do you run on the 2500? Im curious to see how you fit a decent cooler in there.
> Those are some good temps.
> Was the cpu under full load or only loaded on one core? Thats a considerable deviation from the rest on the first core, and I've never seen one run much hotter than the rest while maintaining a max that is quite a bit lower than the rest. Interesting stuff.


It was under full load on 4 cores. The first core has always been like that. It gets even worse as temps increase. I'm guessing it's just a bad sensor. Although lapping/delidding seems to have fixed it slightly.


----------



## NIK1

I have a 4790k delided with CoolLab-Liquid Ultra on the die and under the IHS.My waterblock is a Watercool Heatkiller IV Pro Nickel.I want to try some liquid ultra between the IHS and the nickel waterblock.Would you spread the ultra on both sides, the top of ihs and on the waterblock or just on the IHS and mount..My r290 video card waterblock is nickel also and I might try some ultra on there too instead of normal paste.Any reccomendations appreciated..


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> What kind of cooling do you run on the 2500? Im curious to see how you fit a decent cooler in there.
> Those are some good temps.
> Was the cpu under full load or only loaded on one core? Thats a considerable deviation from the rest on the first core, and I've never seen one run much hotter than the rest while maintaining a max that is quite a bit lower than the rest. Interesting stuff.


Using the noctua NH-L9i its a great little cooler. Very low profile. Its very dense though, feels "weighty" to hold for its size. Says its only rated for 65W, I tried it on my 3570k before the 2500k. At stock clock the 3570k never went over 75c. Bare in mind in a very confined case. The [email protected] 4.0Ghz cant remember exact voltage right now, Stays well below 70c Full load usually hangs around 50c general use. Downloads while browsing while playing music or a movie. Idles about 40c. Oh my ambient temps are higher than normal hovering around 28-30c . Very hot where I live..


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I have a 4790k delided with CoolLab-Liquid Ultra on the die and under the IHS.My waterblock is a Watercool Heatkiller IV Pro Nickel.I want to try some liquid ultra between the IHS and the nickel waterblock.Would you spread the ultra on both sides, the top of ihs and on the waterblock or just on the IHS and mount..My r290 video card waterblock is nickel also and I might try some ultra on there too instead of normal paste.Any reccomendations appreciated..


I think between the IHS and block you just need to put CLU on the IHS, as there is no gap like between the IHS and DIE so no reason to paint both sides.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I have a 4790k delided with CoolLab-Liquid Ultra on the die and under the IHS.My waterblock is a Watercool Heatkiller IV Pro Nickel.I want to try some liquid ultra between the IHS and the nickel waterblock.Would you spread the ultra on both sides, the top of ihs and on the waterblock or just on the IHS and mount..My r290 video card waterblock is nickel also and I might try some ultra on there too instead of normal paste.Any reccomendations appreciated..


You can put CLU on gpu dies but just be careful there are live capacitors right next to them so I personally would use gelid extreme, bit safer. CLU on the die and then the top of the IHS and your good.


----------



## NIK1

If I do the vid card should I put some clear nail polish on the capacitors,would that help so I dont fry something.


----------



## spectre023

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Using the noctua NH-L9i its a great little cooler. Very low profile. Its very dense though, feels "weighty" to hold for its size. Says its only rated for 65W, I tried it on my 3570k before the 2500k. At stock clock the 3570k never went over 75c. Bare in mind in a very confined case. The [email protected] 4.0Ghz cant remember exact voltage right now, Stays well below 70c Full load usually hangs around 50c general use. Downloads while browsing while playing music or a movie. Idles about 40c. Oh my ambient temps are higher than normal hovering around 28-30c . Very hot where I live..


You know what?
This is the first time Ive actually ever seen that cooler.
You sir, have just inadvertently provided me with a solution to my hot-as-lava cable box problem.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> You know what?
> This is the first time Ive actually ever seen that cooler.
> You sir, have just inadvertently provided me with a solution to my hot-as-lava cable box problem.


Glad I could help. Super impressed with the cooler. For the size its awesome. Super low profile too. If I remember right its 37mm tall including fan.Also comes in an AMD version. Its called
NH-L9a as opposed to the intel NH-L9i


----------



## DirektEffekt

I finally switched the TIM under my IHS to CLP from Gelid, and my temps plummeted by 25C. I went from 85-90C at 1.212V 4.6GHz to around 60 max. Now I am looking at 4.8GHz with 1.29v and plenty of room left temp wise. That was just a rough overclock and I can probably get the voltage down. But it's stable and low enough for me.

Also, to the people wondering about putting CLU/CLP between the IHS and cooler. I would say it's not worth it. It doesn't damage anything, although it will stain, but at most you'll see a couple of degrees difference and, when you need to tear it down, instead of spending 5 minutes cleaning up it will be closer to 50. Just stick with something good like Gelid GC extreme for that duty.


----------



## darkip

I'm considering delidding my 4770K at the moment, but I thought I'd quiz the minds here for the most up-to-date answers to a few questions I have:


Out of the "Vice + Hammer" or "Vice Only" method, which is regarded as safest now?
Does the CLP between the die and IHS actually "dry up"/need replacing after a period of time? If so, how regularly would it need changing?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I finally *switched the TIM under my IHS to CLP from Gelid, and my temps plummeted by 25C.* I went from 85-90C at 1.212V 4.6GHz to around 60 max. Now I am looking at 4.8GHz with 1.29v and plenty of room left temp wise. That was just a rough overclock and I can probably get the voltage down. But it's stable and low enough for me.


Thats the biggest problem with gelid on the die. It will "pump" out from the pressure leaving no tim in that area. Sounds like that is what happened in this situation.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> I'm considering delidding my 4770K at the moment, but I thought I'd quiz the minds here for the most up-to-date answers to a few questions I have:
> 
> 
> Out of the "Vice + Hammer" or "Vice Only" method, which is regarded as safest now?
> Does the CLP between the die and IHS actually "dry up"/need replacing after a period of time? If so, how regularly would it need changing?


Vice only is the safest.
CLP has been reported by some to dry up, but CLU is fine. If it does dry up, it takes a while (like a year) and it may not make any difference to temps, just in difficulty cleaning it off.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Vice only is the safest.
> CLP has been reported by some to dry up, but CLU is fine. If it does dry up, it takes a while (like a year) and it may not make any difference to temps, just in difficulty cleaning it off.


Funny you mention vice only being the safest.. I just made a brand new video, lol.. Will be uploaded asap with the exact instructions and how hard it is to do.

Of all of my videos, my 3770k delid has 400 more views than any other video I have ever created. This was a spur of the moment thing.. no temp testing or anything, just a test to see how delidding is with my new vice 

Here we go: Brand new video online now.




Just so Darkip can see:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> I'm considering delidding my 4770K at the moment, but I thought I'd quiz the minds here for the most up-to-date answers to a few questions I have:
> 
> 
> Out of the "Vice + Hammer" or "Vice Only" method, which is regarded as safest now?
> Does the CLP between the die and IHS actually "dry up"/need replacing after a period of time? If so, how regularly would it need changing?


Also, I apologize for being MIA for so long.. i moved from Korea and I am back in the US, and currently working on finishing my x99 rebuild.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spectre023*
> 
> You know what?
> This is the first time Ive actually ever seen that cooler.
> You sir, have just inadvertently provided me with a solution to my hot-as-lava cable box problem.


Me too! I'd been saving my Scythe Big Shuriken 2 Rev. B for a HTPC since switching to the H100i GTX, but that might work even better and open up some new chassis opportunities, especially with an S or T.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I finally switched the TIM under my IHS to CLP from Gelid, and my temps plummeted by 25C. I went from 85-90C at 1.212V 4.6GHz to around 60 max. Now I am looking at 4.8GHz with 1.29v and plenty of room left temp wise. That was just a rough overclock and I can probably get the voltage down. But it's stable and low enough for me.
> 
> Also, to the people wondering about putting CLU/CLP between the IHS and cooler. I would say it's not worth it. It doesn't damage anything, although it will stain, but at most you'll see a couple of degrees difference and, when you need to tear it down, instead of spending 5 minutes cleaning up it will be closer to 50. Just stick with something good like Gelid GC extreme for that duty.


I dunno about the CLP, but CLU is actually easy to clean. Don't try to rub it off. Gently wipe it with a cloth wipe or paper towel soaked in at least 91% (preferably higher) alcohol (DO NOT USE THOSE 70% wipes that come with it!!!). The first big wipe should get most of it, then use new cloths for each successive wipe. The alcohol puts it into suspension. Just don't get any of the liquid anywhere on the board, as that suspension will have LOTS of microscopic balls in suspension.

This also solves the silicon marking issue as well. I did a straight dry wipe on one chip just to see what happens, and it left an indelible mark. Doing it with alcohol leaves the original mirror grey finish.

Five minutes tops, even for careful work, chip or IHS..


----------



## Levelog

I'm trying to decide if I want to delid my 4670k. I can hit 4.5ghz at 1.24v, 4.6 at under 1.3v, but I can't get 4.7 stable past boot even up to 1.325. I'm pretty comfortable with delidding though, I've done vice only with around 8 socket 775 pentium dual cores with no failures.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> I'm trying to decide if I want to delid my 4670k. I can hit 4.5ghz at 1.24v, 4.6 at under 1.3v, but I can't get 4.7 stable past boot even up to 1.325. I'm pretty comfortable with delidding though, I've done vice only with around 8 socket 775 pentium dual cores with no failures.


Are your temperatures high? You really don't want to void that warranty unless you have a hot-running chip. If so, then go for it. A hot chip will last longer if you deal with the heat issue. It really is a kind of tradeoff, low heat = longer life, and most of these will see a temperature decrease.


----------



## Levelog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Are your temperatures high? You really don't want to void that warranty unless you have a hot-running chip. If so, then go for it. A hot chip will last longer if you deal with the heat issue.


Nah, temps aren't a problem. 55 max under my loop.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> I'm trying to decide if I want to delid my 4670k. I can hit 4.5ghz at 1.24v, 4.6 at under 1.3v, but I can't get 4.7 stable past boot even up to 1.325. I'm pretty comfortable with delidding though, I've done vice only with around 8 socket 775 pentium dual cores with no failures.


If it was a 1.24V to 1.3V jump you've seen for 4.5 to 4.6, then better expect 1.36V at the lowest needed for 4.7?


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Me too! I'd been saving my Scythe Big Shuriken 2 Rev. B for a HTPC since switching to the H100i GTX, but that might work even better and open up some new chassis opportunities, especially with an S or T.


It kept my 3570k (before delliding) cool enough. Very tight case only 1x60mm intakes for fresh air, in a confined TV unit. When I say cool enough, I mean it hit 82c max while doing some heavy lifting @ 4.0Ghz. Not ideal but in those conditions its great haha. Dont think S or T spec cpu would be necessary, The fan that comes with this is so quiet, I leave mine at 80% min fan speed dont even hear it.Just make sure you get the NH-L9i for intel and the NH-L9a for AMD


----------



## darkip

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> Vice only is the safest.
> CLP has been reported by some to dry up, but CLU is fine. If it does dry up, it takes a while (like a year) and it may not make any difference to temps, just in difficulty cleaning it off.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Funny you mention vice only being the safest.. I just made a brand new video, lol.. Will be uploaded asap with the exact instructions and how hard it is to do.


Thanks guys!

I've been playing around with my chip seeing how far I can push it before I delid. Unfortunately it doesn't look like a great performer at the moment. It needs 1.27 vid (1.29 vcore) to get it stable at 4.3 Ghz and that's getting pretty hot under linpack. I'm hoping post delid that I can push it a little further with the new thermal headroom.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> It kept my 3570k (before delliding) cool enough. Very tight case only 1x60mm intakes for fresh air, in a confined TV unit. When I say cool enough, I mean it hit 82c max while doing some heavy lifting @ 4.0Ghz. Not ideal but in those conditions its great haha. Dont think S or T spec cpu would be necessary, The fan that comes with this is so quiet, I leave mine at 80% min fan speed dont even hear it.Just make sure you get the NH-L9i for intel and the NH-L9a for AMD


We are looking at the S and T specs for the HTPC due to the sheer low power, and the fact that I haven't decided exactly what kind of chassis to put it in (ITX). I could go like set-top with a S or T.


----------



## Levelog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> We are looking at the S and T specs for the HTPC due to the sheer low power, and the fact that I haven't decided exactly what kind of chassis to put it in (ITX). I could go like set-top with a S or T.


I've always liked the idea of a K chip for undervolting for an HTPC, but I guess an S or T is cheaper.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> I've always liked the idea of a K chip for undervolting for an HTPC, but I guess an S or T is cheaper.


That apparently depends on which one. Some are insanely high priced, and make the K look cheap.

Oh, and I have to ask, have you ever NOT had a "Neverending build"? I can't say I have. I call BS on anyone saying they are finished upgrading/modding their gear









I do wonder if even those would have a thermal improvement by delidding... I guess they would, and it might actually be even more important than pushing 5 GHz on a K, as most HTPCs are kind of constrained environments with low airflow.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> That apparently depends on which one. Some are insanely high priced, and make the K look cheap.
> 
> Oh, and I have to ask, have you ever NOT had a "Neverending build"? I can't say I have. I call BS on anyone saying they are finished upgrading/modding their gear


I have just had one build, since I started with an x58 i7-920. I haven't ever gotten myself a new rig, but I think the only components left from what I originally started with are two 120mm fans, the 5V motherboard speaker, and optical drive. Everything else has been upgraded over the years even the case. I basically consider when I upgraded the motherboard and CPU to be the end of the previous rig and the beginning of the 2nd though.


----------



## Levelog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> That apparently depends on which one. Some are insanely high priced, and make the K look cheap.
> 
> Oh, and I have to ask, have you ever NOT had a "Neverending build"? I can't say I have. I call BS on anyone saying they are finished upgrading/modding their gear
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do wonder if even those would have a thermal improvement by delidding... I guess they would, and it might actually be even more important than pushing 5 GHz on a K, as most HTPCs are kind of constrained environments with low airflow.


I've had builds that I've completely thrown out or sold and started from scratch over the years. Also times I've moved around and switched to only laptop. So does that count?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Levelog*
> 
> I've had builds that I've completely thrown out or sold and started from scratch over the years. Also times I've moved around and switched to only laptop. So does that count?


Well, I think I was referring mainly to the keepers.


----------



## darkip

Was looking at 4770K's on eBay and saw this









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> Was looking at 4770K's on eBay and saw this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


one if not the worst I've seen. Ouch


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Very much faulty... Yes Sherlock, very much indeed.


----------



## cephelix

What the heck happened to that chip?!


----------



## LandonAaron

He tried the other Vice Only Method. You clamp on to both ends of the PCB with the vice and you just keep tightening until the middle of the chip is bowed out about 20 degrees and then the IHS pops right off. Then you take you moms rolling pin and straighten that sucker out as much as you can. Then to get out any stubborn bends you take it to the sidewalk and pound on it with a rubber mallet till you get that good pancake flatness. Then your ready to rock. Super low temps! May even get a cold bug on boot. Heck it may not even boot at all! Awesome!


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> He tried the other Vice Only Method. You clamp on to both ends of the PCB with the vice and you just keep tightening until the middle of the chip is bowed out about 20 degrees and then the IHS pops right off. Then you take you mom rolling iron straighten that sucker out as much as you can. Then to get out any stubborn bends you take it to the sidewalk and pound on it with a rubber mallet till you get that good pancake flatness. Then your ready to rock. Super low temps! May even get a cold bug on boot. Heck it may not even boot at all! Awesome!


Lol.sounds about right. I think he may have gotten lucky and found an unattended steamroller as well.still,he bothered selling it on ebay.that chip would've gone straight into the trash if it were me


----------



## spectre023

Looks like he put it under far too much table vise tension and smashed the pcb.
How tragic


----------



## SgtRotty

Hilarious ebay ad!!!

Quick question for myself, if CLU is used between ihs and a H55 AIO cooler, over time does the serial and batch numbers get erased or damaged on the IHS while cleaning and reapplying the CLU ??


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SgtRotty*
> 
> Hilarious ebay ad!!!
> 
> Quick question for myself, if CLU is used between ihs and a H55 AIO cooler, over time does the serial and batch numbers get erased or damaged on the IHS while cleaning and reapplying the CLU ??


Yup...so if you don't mind it,you could use CLU


----------



## spectre023

Is your chip delidded? [on mobile and can't see sigs]
If so it doesn't matter much anyway lol. I would just write it down for your records and paint that thing in CLU all day long


----------



## SgtRotty

yes im delidded! on a 4790k now. i had my 4770k delidded as well and was excepted in a RMA. i didnt melt it with extreme volts, i used XTU benchmark with 167 bclk straps with a msi z87g45 mb. as soon as i clicked start, POOF! i was curious about the lettering on the IHS just in case i ever lost the original box. its getting hotter outside, looking to get a few degrees less. THX!


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> Was looking at 4770K's on eBay and saw this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I had a friend who scraped two caps off the bottom of his, too bad he moved on, he was looking for a sale like this. His still works, but he's always been worried about the effect of the missing caps.

That's one thing that this one could be useful for.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SgtRotty*
> 
> Hilarious ebay ad!!!
> 
> Quick question for myself, if CLU is used between ihs and a H55 AIO cooler, over time does the serial and batch numbers get erased or damaged on the IHS while cleaning and reapplying the CLU ??


The last time I opened and cleaned things up, the writing was still visible, but it was grey instead of black. It was hard to read. To decipher it fully, I had to tilt it around to change how light reflected off the IHS.


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> Was looking at 4770K's on eBay and saw this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I am going to guess that he put the chip in the vice instead of the heat spreader.


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SgtRotty*
> 
> Hilarious ebay ad!!!
> 
> Quick question for myself, if CLU is used between ihs and a H55 AIO cooler, over time does the serial and batch numbers get erased or damaged on the IHS while cleaning and reapplying the CLU ??


Yes, and IC Diamond will do the same thing. IC diamond will start to stain the IHS a dark color overtime and you can whipe and whipe and whipe that sucker down and it will keep pulling up dark stuff on your cloth, and the writting gets fainter and fainter, but its pretty great stuff thermally so I don't worry about it.


----------



## bootleg4bandit

Delidded my 4790k today after weeks of reading and watching videos. To my surprise, it went smoothly, but the tension grew when I applied the Liguid Pro. I decided to go with the pressure on the lid with a vise, and about 3/4 into a turn, the lid popped free. Sure enough, the thermal paste Intel applied looked squished off to the side and couldn't of been performing very well. I wiped the die and lid clean and proceeded to add the Liquid Pro. I went to apply a rice size amount cause I wasn't sure of how viscous, or how it would spread and whatnot. I push a little...I pushed alittle harder...before I could blink, a pea sized amount blobbed onto the die. A pie size!..like the size of a green pea out of the nasty precooked can you used to hate eating as a kid. From this point I figured now I would try and take some of it off and be left with half of what I had..a perfect amount. Liquid Pro is JUST LIKE LIQUID MERCURY. This stuff would roll across the die as I tried to spread it. Roll one way..then roll the other. Meanwhile, always staying together as this pea sized, liquid gob of metal. This material is not easy to work with. Let me say that again...This stuff is very intense, and I could see how things could go terribly wrong, quickly. I ended up spreading out what was there, (forget about trying to wipe this stuff off after its on the die), made it as even as possible and dropped the lid back on and gingerly clamped it down with the motherboard pressure plate. Maybe I have a bad memory, or I just wasn't paying enough attention, but I hadn't gotten the idea from anywhere, that Liquid Pro was such a difficult thermal paste to work with.
All in all, after a few tense moments, I did see a 10-15 degree temp decrease. But I cant tell anyone to not do this cause I did it...but..be careful with this Liquid Pro cause things can go south quickly. Good luck to whomever is next...good luck..


----------



## cephelix

@bootleg4bandit glad your delid went well And you didn't fry your chip. I have no personal experience with CLP, only with CLU. It is indeed abit of a challenge to get it out of the tube but cleaning and spreading are a breeze. You just have to be a bit more cautious since it is conductive when compared to traditional thermal pastes but nothing uber difficult. Just have to pay closer attention when spreading as you definitely don't want to flick beads of it onto the PCB or worse still, the VRMs


----------



## 101m4n

OCN name: 101m4n
CPU: i7 4790k
on die-TIM: CLP
ihs-TIM: EK Ectotherm (all I had to hand)
Mhz gained: 100Mhz
OC after delid: 4800Mhz
Temp drops: NA (installed new cooling right after delid)
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


edit*
Oh yes, almost forgot:


Spoiler: Proof







Reinstalled IHS rotated 180 degrees the first time around. (incorrectly) assuming that the orientation wouldn't matter... Don't do this


----------



## WiSK

New Broadwell i7-5775C: got a build planned for this chip when it comes out.

However, leaked picture shows lots of stuff very close to the die. Not sure if nail polish will be safe enough.


----------



## 101m4n

What's the word on performance?
A quick search didn't yield much information.


----------



## FloofyFox

I had an old Celeron E1200 lying around doing nothing. I'm modding a beige case into something new over in the Case Mod Build Logs and decided to make a little competition between me and my colleague. I decided to lap to processor, but realized it could also be delidded, so why not?














It will be fun to see how far I can push this Celeron once I finish the build! The information in this thread really helped in making it successful. Thanks guys!


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bootleg4bandit*
> 
> Delidded my 4790k today after weeks of reading and watching videos. To my surprise, it went smoothly, but the tension grew when I applied the Liguid Pro. I decided to go with the pressure on the lid with a vise, and about 3/4 into a turn, the lid popped free. Sure enough, the thermal paste Intel applied looked squished off to the side and couldn't of been performing very well. I wiped the die and lid clean and proceeded to add the Liquid Pro. I went to apply a rice size amount cause I wasn't sure of how viscous, or how it would spread and whatnot. I push a little...I pushed alittle harder...before I could blink, a pea sized amount blobbed onto the die. A pie size!..like the size of a green pea out of the nasty precooked can you used to hate eating as a kid. From this point I figured now I would try and take some of it off and be left with half of what I had..a perfect amount. Liquid Pro is JUST LIKE LIQUID MERCURY. This stuff would roll across the die as I tried to spread it. Roll one way..then roll the other. Meanwhile, always staying together as this pea sized, liquid gob of metal. This material is not easy to work with. Let me say that again...This stuff is very intense, and I could see how things could go terribly wrong, quickly. I ended up spreading out what was there, (forget about trying to wipe this stuff off after its on the die), made it as even as possible and dropped the lid back on and gingerly clamped it down with the motherboard pressure plate. Maybe I have a bad memory, or I just wasn't paying enough attention, but I hadn't gotten the idea from anywhere, that Liquid Pro was such a difficult thermal paste to work with.
> All in all, after a few tense moments, I did see a 10-15 degree temp decrease. But I cant tell anyone to not do this cause I did it...but..be careful with this Liquid Pro cause things can go south quickly. Good luck to whomever is next...good luck..


I have only ever used CLU, but from what I understand CLP is more difficult to work with and harder to clean. But it sounds like you got it. CLU actually cleans off pretty easily. I just dampen a paper towel with Arctic Clean part 1 and most of it will stick to the paper towel. Some of it will spread out a little, but it seems Artic Clean Part 1 works as an effective solvent for it, and you can just continue to wipe it down with that till sparkling clean.


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *101m4n*
> 
> What's the word on performance?
> A quick search didn't yield much information.


http://wccftech.com/intel-broadwell-cpus-i5-5675c-i7-5775c-oem-listed/

I'm keeping my i7 4790k.


----------



## bootleg4bandit

From my experience CLP has the same look, feel, and movement as liquid mercury. I've tried other thermal pastes but the CLP is a waay different compound and I guess I wasn't expecting it (Christ, they put the stuff in a hypodermic needle..I was hoping I wouldnt have to touch one of those again).. ANYWAYS.. Its been 24 hours and no crashes, glitches, and whatnot, so I agree with the fact that everything is ok. Overall, I have received a 10-15 degree decrease in temps, so the stuff does work..and works quite well.

Now I do have a question... Using AIDA64..Am I supposed to be focused specifically on the CPU temp(?), cause the core temps fluctuate (about 7-8 degrees) but the CPU doesn't. It might go up or down only about 1-3 degree. I guess what I'm saying..Is the CPU temp the most important temp to watch??


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bootleg4bandit*
> 
> From my experience CLP has the same look, feel, and movement as liquid mercury. I've tried other thermal pastes but the CLP is a waay different compound and I guess I wasn't expecting it (Christ, they put the stuff in a hypodermic needle..I was hoping I wouldnt have to touch one of those again).. ANYWAYS.. Its been 24 hours and no crashes, glitches, and whatnot, so I agree with the fact that everything is ok. Overall, I have received a 10-15 degree decrease in temps, so the stuff does work..and works quite well.
> 
> Now I do have a question... Using AIDA64..Am I supposed to be focused specifically on the CPU temp(?), cause the core temps fluctuate (about 7-8 degrees) but the CPU doesn't. It might go up or down only about 1-3 degree. I guess what I'm saying..Is the CPU temp the most important temp to watch??


No the core temps is what you want to be paying attention to. It is normal for them to fluctuate a lot so its best to just keep an eye on the max temp of each core.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FloofyFox*
> 
> I had an old Celeron E1200 lying around doing nothing. I'm modding a beige case into something new over in the Case Mod Build Logs and decided to make a little competition between me and my colleague. I decided to lap to processor, but realized it could also be delidded, so why not?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It will be fun to see how far I can push this Celeron once I finish the build! The information in this thread really helped in making it successful. Thanks guys!


Why not Lapp the IHS as well? Unless you plan on direct contact with the die?

Lapping should net you a few degree drop in temp.









~Ceadder


----------



## darkip

Just delidded my 4770k using the "Vice-only" method











http://imgur.com/vMFhDNn


I'm seeing just over a 12C drop in temperatures at load.

After reading posts in this thread I was very careful not to overapply the CLP but I am wondering whether I might not have applied enough as I was expecting a bit more of a dip in temperatures. IHS to cooler is MX-4 paste.


----------



## FloofyFox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Why not Lapp the IHS as well? Unless you plan on direct contact with the die?
> 
> Lapping should net you a few degree drop in temp.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Lapp away!











Spoiler: Warning: 22 Pictures!


----------



## LandonAaron

Don't you know lapping will destroy your processor? http://hallicino.hubpages.com/hub/How-to-destroy-your-CPU-by-lapping-it Plenty Lolz to go around.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Don't you know lapping will destroy your processor? http://hallicino.hubpages.com/hub/How-to-destroy-your-CPU-by-lapping-it Plenty Lolz to go around.


look at the date of that article it is pre- ivy bridge so I guess they are talking about lapping ivy's predecessors so lapping a un-de-lidded processor would be a bad idea, not to mention even sandy ran a whole lot cooler.
But hind sight I have lapped my IHS was it worth it ? Probably not, I netted a 2-3°C loss of temps







my IHS was very concaved as @FloofyFox can be seen in the initial lapping process so I would say it could help with long term stability of the TIM as it will no be as susceptible to drying/pumping out.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *101m4n*
> 
> What's the word on performance?
> A quick search didn't yield much information.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> http://wccftech.com/intel-broadwell-cpus-i5-5675c-i7-5775c-oem-listed/
> 
> I'm keeping my i7 4790k.


Yeah, unless it's a crazy overclocker, the top Devil's Canyon might still be better. I'm keeping the i7-3770K in my main rig as well.

But for a SFF gaming machine with very little space for rads and fans, I'm hoping the i7-5775C will run a lot cooler. Otherwise I'll just get another G3258


----------



## 101m4n

Who knows, they could even start soldering the IHS to the die again...
That would certainly tempt some people.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> look at the date of that article it is pre- ivy bridge so I guess they are talking about lapping ivy's predecessors so lapping a un-de-lidded processor would be a bad idea, not to mention even sandy ran a whole lot cooler.
> But hind sight I have lapped my IHS was it worth it ? Probably not, I netted a 2-3°C loss of temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my IHS was very concaved as @FloofyFox can be seen in the initial lapping process so I would say it could help with long term stability of the TIM as it will no be as susceptible to drying/pumping out.


un-de-lidded? is that a double negative? Not a grammar nazi just sounds weird


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> look at the date of that article it is pre- ivy bridge so I guess they are talking about lapping ivy's predecessors so lapping a un-de-lidded processor would be a bad idea, not to mention even sandy ran a whole lot cooler.
> But hind sight I have lapped my IHS was it worth it ? Probably not, I netted a 2-3°C loss of temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my IHS was very concaved as @FloofyFox can be seen in the initial lapping process so I would say it could help with long term stability of the TIM as it will no be as susceptible to drying/pumping out.


Lapping any processor is probably a good idea. The guy who wrote that article is a moron. He got into a big thing with OCN tried claiming to the police that his life was threatened by OCN members. He had a whole blog about it, but I can't find it.


----------



## Ceadderman

OCN fo life!









I keed I keed.









~Ceadder


----------



## FloofyFox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Lapping any processor is probably a good idea. The guy who wrote that article is a moron. He got into a big thing with OCN tried claiming to the police that his life was threatened by OCN members. He had a whole blog about it, but I can't find it.


I found it!







Mistrust Massive Moronic Mythical Misrepresentations!

And in case you missed the article he's referring to (the comments are gold) How to destroy your CPU by lapping it

Yeah, I didn't really need to lapp or delid this processor at all. I half expected it to be a paperweight after completing the mod, but it was a great learning experience and at no real risk to expensive hardware, so why not? If I were to do it on any CPU for a first try, it would be on the E1200 Celeron.

But Hal's claims are completely absurd and over the top, and he makes out anyone performing lapping to be completely incompetent.

A few years back, my friend bought a Core2Quad Q9550. It turned out to be overheating on _stock clocks_. While gaming, he would get frame rate and crashing issues because the CPU would be throttling itself to keep under the threshold temperature. Since he built his PC himself, by the time he realized he was out of the return policy. The store he bought it from tested it and claimed it to be 'within heat tolerances' and refused the exchange.

Stuck with no other options, he turned to lapping. Running a straight edge across the CPU die, it was very clear it was concave. I've never seen a CPU as severely concave as that before or since that Q9550. He lapped the thing flat and paired it with a Noctua NH-U12P. After putting it all back together, he was able to overclock that chip from 2.83 to 4.0GHz on air! And with good temperatures. Would you call that a success?

I know Hal would have something to say ... "All lappers are morons!"


----------



## LandonAaron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> Just delidded my 4770k using the "Vice-only" method
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/vMFhDNn
> 
> 
> I'm seeing just over a 12C drop in temperatures at load.
> 
> After reading posts in this thread I was very careful not to overapply the CLP but I am wondering whether I might not have applied enough as I was expecting a bit more of a dip in temperatures. IHS to cooler is MX-4 paste.


If you go bare die you should get something like EK's precise mount unless you have a motherboard that comes with a die guard feature. Usually the die doesn't sit up high enough above the surrounding hold down bracket to make contact with block/heat sink if not using the IHS, so the hold down bracket has to be removed and different screw lengths used for the block/heatsink.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> un-de-lidded? is that a double negative? Not a grammar nazi just sounds weird


mmm late night maybe I could have said non de-lidded








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LandonAaron*
> 
> Lapping any processor is probably a good idea. The guy who wrote that article is a moron. He got into a big thing with OCN tried claiming to the police that his life was threatened by OCN members. He had a whole blog about it, but I can't find it.


I didn't get the sarcasm









still there are margins for lapping just very miniscule gains


----------



## 101m4n

One could argue that the loss of the (nickel?) plating on the IHS might reduce it's resistance to corrosion...
Not a big deal for normal thermal interfaces, but weird gallium alloys (CLP & CLU) can do nasty stuff to other metals. It's the only reason I haven't put CLP on the outside of my IHS too.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *101m4n*
> 
> One could argue that the loss of the (nickel?) plating on the IHS might reduce it's resistance to corrosion...
> Not a big deal for normal thermal interfaces, but weird gallium alloys (CLP & CLU) can do nasty stuff to other metals. It's the only reason I haven't put CLP on the outside of my IHS too.


I believe people have mentioned that copper can become slightly pitted after use with CLU/CLP and sometimes needs to be re-lapped after cleaning it off, but I doubt that will even be necessary for most unless you plan to change coolers, or reapply CLP/CLU after an extended period if dries out, loosing its conductivity.

But metals like Aluminium are highly reactive with Gallium, and take little to no time in causing complete structural failure of some unfortunate components...


----------



## 101m4n

Technically it's not a reaction, but yes, gallium does nasty stuff to aluminium. As I'm sure has been mentioned umpteen times already in this thread


----------



## darkip

I just re-did the MX-4 between the IHS and my NH-D14 using the line method rather than the "pea" method and this dropped my temperatures another 10C! Must have spreading badly before...


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> I just re-did the MX-4 between the IHS and my NH-D14 using the line method rather than the "pea" method and this dropped my temperatures another 10C! Must have spreading badly before...


10C is alot for just reapplying thermal paste.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

That's how my temps dropped when I reapplied Gelid to the die and IHS after the first month or so. They later started rising again, and within 2 months had to kill my 4.4Ghz overclock and then proceed to under-volt it until my CLU arrived.
After the CLU, my temps dropped an extra 5C average and have been rock solid for about 8-9 months now, (not to mention a 4C variance in temps between all cores)


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> That's how my temps dropped when I reapplied Gelid to the die and IHS after the first month or so. They later started rising again, and within 2 months had to kill my 4.4Ghz overclock and then proceed to under-volt it until my CLU arrived.
> After the CLU, my temps dropped an extra 5C average and have been rock solid for about 8-9 months now, (not to mention a 4C variance in temps between all cores)


weird,is there any reason for that??


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> weird,is there any reason for that??


There's a "pump-out effect" with most thermal paste. It will move and will get squeezed out over time, I think because of it expanding and contracting with temperature changes. It does not happen if it is used on a larger area like between IHS and cooler, but it does happen on the smaller area between die and IHS.


----------



## bootleg4bandit

For those who haven't delidded yet and are looking for last minute advice...consider the "vise-only" method. I just cant help but cringe watching these videos of people hitting their processors with hammers, and squeezing a razorblade in and out for minutes upon minutes trying to free up the lid. Both these methods can potentially damage you processor and from my experience, once in the vise, 3/4 turn of moderate pressure and "voila"..Delidded.
Do it however way you want...but, and Im sure others will agree with me...The vise only method is the easiest way to delid.


----------



## 101m4n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bootleg4bandit*
> 
> For those who haven't de-lidded yet and are looking for last minute advice...consider the "vise-only" method.


This.

It's much safer than either of the other methods & should really be part of the guide.


----------



## darkip

After delidding should I be looking at almost perfectly even core temperatures? I'm still seeing a difference of about 5/6 degrees celsius between my hottest and coolest cores (under load).

Temperature deltas from hottest core under prime95 small FFT are:
1: -2C
2: -1C
3: 0C (Hottest)
4: -6C


----------



## 101m4n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *darkip*
> 
> After delidding should I be looking at almost perfectly even core temperatures? I'm still seeing a difference of about 5/6 degrees celsius between my hottest and coolest cores (under load).
> 
> Temperature deltas from hottest core under prime95 small FFT are:
> 1: -2C
> 2: -1C
> 3: 0C (Hottest)
> 4: -6C


Bear in mind, prime small FFT's represent an extreme case on haswell. No real-world application is going to be capable of saturating all the FPU resources in a core like that.

It makes an excellent temp test, but for stability testing I would use something that puts a little more load on the memory subsystem (Aida64, Prime on blend mode, intel XTU, etc).

Also, mine has roughly the same temp deltas.

I wouldn't worry too much about it.


----------



## darkip

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *101m4n*
> 
> Bear in mind, prime small FFT's represent an extreme case on haswell. No real-world application is going to be capable of saturating all the FPU resources in a core like that.
> 
> It makes an excellent temp test, but for stability testing I would use something that puts a little more load on the memory subsystem (Aida64, Prime on blend mode, intel XTU, etc).
> 
> Also, mine has roughly the same temp deltas.
> 
> I wouldn't worry too much about it.


Thanks









I'm guessing the temperature deltas are due to the location of the cores on the die.

From what I've seen online, the integrated GPU is located at the bottom of the die and the memory controller (+ other stuff) at the top, with the cores in between. This _could_ explain why the two cores in the middle are the hottest, the next being the one next to the memory controller nearest the top of the die and finally the coolest at the bottom next to the (inactive) GPU.

Die layout:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






http://imgur.com/2tIyHuK




http://imgur.com/5GsOFjc


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> There's a "pump-out effect" with most thermal paste. It will move and will get squeezed out over time, I think because of it expanding and contracting with temperature changes. It does not happen if it is used on a larger area like between IHS and cooler, but it does happen on the smaller area between die and IHS.


Even when ihs and cooler base are lapped??


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Even when ihs and cooler base are lapped??


It's only a problem between die and IHS. It works fine between IHS and cooler.


----------



## vicyo

if you void the warranty, might as well do it properly


----------



## Ceadderman

That looks sharp!

Lapped both sides of the IHS though? I see no benefit to that. But it looks good.









~Ceadder


----------



## DMatthewStewart

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SonDa5*
> 
> I have water cooled system and I just sold a 360mm radiator that I normaly run with this loop which also has a HD7950 in it. I am only running a slim HWLaBS black ice stealth 120mm radiator which doesn't work very well for a video card and cpu in same loop. I think my temps will come down when I get my radiator replaced with a proper sized one for the job.


Just curious, after delidding, does a regualr waterblock still cool this effectively? Or do you have to mod it? In other words, is there a difference in height when lid is removed?


----------



## vicyo

There is no benefit aside from aesthetics. The bottom part had some light scratches from when i was removing the silicon, so [Eh. Why not?] kicked in yo!


----------



## orndorf77

I delided my i7 4790k about 10 months ago at first I used gelid gc extreme in between the die and the lid and my temperatures only went down 5 Celsius, then I opened the chip back up and used cool laboratory liquid pro in between the die and the lid and my temps went down another 8 Celsius, all together my temps went down 13 Celsius, at the time I did my delid I was using a corsair h100i cpu cooler , I later on replaced my cooling with a ek supremacy evo cpu block and x2 ek fc780 water blocks and back plates and a 360mm radiator and a 240mm radiator and my temps went down another 5 Celsius for a total of 18 Celsius, are these results good ?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orndorf77*
> 
> I delided my i7 4790k about 10 months ago at first I used gelid gc extreme in between the die and the lid and my temperatures only went down 5 Celsius, then I opened the chip back up and used cool laboratory liquid pro in between the die and the lid and my temps went down another 8 Celsius, all together my temps went down 13 Celsius, at the time I did my delid I was using a corsair h100i cpu cooler , I later on replaced my cooling with a ek supremacy evo cpu block and x2 ek fc780 water blocks and back plates and a 360mm radiator and a 240mm radiator and my temps went down another 5 Celsius for a total of 18 Celsius, are these results good ?


Definitely good....18C is a huge drop.have you gained anything more in terms of the overclockability of your chip??


----------



## orndorf77

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Definitely good....18C is a huge drop.have you gained anything more in terms of the overclockability of your chip??


well I overclocked my chip to 4.7ghz before I delided it using 1.255v typed in my bios and 1.280v under full load in cpu-z , my temps were reaching 80 Celsius when running occt stress test before I delided it, now my max temp reaches 62 Celsius post deliding and with the cooling set up have now, I am sure I could get my chip to run stable @ 4.8ghz with excellent temperatures but I am afraid of my chip degrading so I just left it @ 4.7ghz


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orndorf77*
> 
> well I overclocked my chip to 4.7ghz before I delided it using 1.255v typed in my bios and 1.280v under full load in cpu-z , my temps were reaching 80 Celsius when running occt stress test before I delided it, now my max temp reaches 62 Celsius post deliding and with the cooling set up have now, I am sure I could get my chip to run stable @ 4.8ghz with excellent temperatures but I am afraid of my chip degrading so I just left it @ 4.7ghz


If only i could have your chip.mine wont stabilise at 4.7 yet.still having too much fun playing DAI to bother with stressing as yet


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> New Broadwell i7-5775C: got a build planned for this chip when it comes out.
> 
> However, leaked picture shows lots of stuff very close to the die. Not sure if nail polish will be safe enough.


Nail polish shouldn't be an issue, just looks like more will be needed.

As far as the specs... It would make a nice HTPC, but I think I'll wait for Skylake for my next major personal build.

From what I'm seeing with this release, I'm guessing everyone is correct, Broadwell is going to be for AIO PCs and HTPCs.

I can see a lot of these being used in ITX builds.... The 4790K will apparently remain the Z97 King though. I would have considered a Broadwell UPGRADE to terminal-gen the WIFI-BK, but not a downgrade.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vicyo*
> 
> if you void the warranty, might as well do it properly


Well done!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> As far as the specs... It would make a nice HTPC, but I think I'll wait for Skylake for my next major personal build.
> 
> From what I'm seeing with this release, I'm guessing everyone is correct, Broadwell is going to be for AIO PCs and HTPCs.
> 
> I can see a lot of these being used in ITX builds.... The 4790K will apparently remain the Z97 King though. I would have considered a Broadwell UPGRADE to terminal-gen the WIFI-BK, but not a downgrade.


I wouldn't put a $300 unlocked i7 in an HTPC; something like a G3258 is fine for Netflix and playing DVDs at a fraction of the price









For those like me who already have a spare Z97 motherboard waiting, then Skylake isn't an option, and the choice is between Devil's Canyon and these Broadwell-C chips. I will wait for proper reviews (with overclocking!) before judging _how much_ of a downgrade it will be. Maybe it will surprise, maybe not. Anyway, even if the i7-4790K remains the top chip on the 1150 platform, the i7-5775C won't be a slouch given some extra voltage.

I think the reason they put a lower base clock on it, is indeed because otherwise it would be a direct competitor to whatever Skylake-K will be their flagship in the fall.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> *I wouldn't put a $300 unlocked i7 in an HTPC; something like a G3258 is fine for Netflix and playing DVDs at a fraction of the price
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> For those like me who already have a spare Z97 motherboard waiting, then Skylake isn't an option, and the choice is between Devil's Canyon and these Broadwell-C chips. I will wait for proper reviews (with overclocking!) before judging _how much_ of a downgrade it will be. Maybe it will surprise, maybe not. Anyway, even if the i7-4790K remains the top chip on the 1150 platform, the i7-5775C won't be a slouch given some extra voltage.
> 
> I think the reason they put a lower base clock on it, is indeed because otherwise it would be a direct competitor to whatever Skylake-K will be their flagship in the fall.


A lot of people use a thier htpc for transcoding though. There is never too much cpu for multiple simultaneous transcodes.

I built a dedicated media browser server/htpc with using an un locked i5 but next upgrade its definitely getting one of my i7s.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> A lot of people use a thier htpc for transcoding though. There is never too much cpu for multiple simultaneous transcodes.
> 
> I built a dedicated media browser server/htpc with using an un locked i5 but next upgrade its definitely getting one of my i7s.


Point take, transcoding is a reason to put an i7 in an HTPC









But would it make the i7-5775C the best or primary choice for such a machine? I mean regarding kc5vdj's assertion that "Broadwell is going to be for AIO PCs and HTPCs".


----------



## FloofyFox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vicyo*
> 
> if you void the warranty, might as well do it properly


That looks fantastic. How did you get such a mirror shine? I go down to 2000 grit, but there's usually still some scratches to be seen. Not that it matters too much, the thing's going to be sandwiched by a heatsink anyway but I'm curious. Are you using polishing compound?


----------



## Valgaur

Just to let everyone know, We made it to the front carousel of OCN!







Thanks for all the information and communication through this thread everyone!

- Val


----------



## vicyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FloofyFox*
> 
> That looks fantastic. How did you get such a mirror shine? I go down to 2000 grit, but there's usually still some scratches to be seen. Not that it matters too much, the thing's going to be sandwiched by a heatsink anyway but I'm curious. Are you using polishing compound?


after 2000 grit I use brasso and then a nail polisher stick I found at home.

Not that it makes much of a difference after 2000 grit, but i like to see a mirror finish copper


----------



## Ceadderman

Female of the house is gonna be miffed.









~Ceadder


----------



## Wanou

yeah !

http://www.overclock.net/t/1487000/build-log-milk-sff-bare-die-cpu-modular-psu-gtx-780-custom-waterloop/100_20#post_22657975


----------



## Valgaur

Looks good! Nice clean up as well


----------



## Fantasy

You guys are insane. I didn't know people did that to their CPU's....

Now I want to delid my 3930k









What you guys are doing is really freaking awesome. I really enjoyed reading this thread.


----------



## Forceman

I wouldn't try to delid that 3930K - pretty sure all the -E chips are soldered.


----------



## Fantasy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I wouldn't try to delid that 3930K - pretty sure all the -E chips are soldered.


Yeah, I was just reading which CPUs can be delidded and which can't. Too bad 3930K IHS is soldered. ooh well. But still, It is really interesting.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I wouldn't try to delid that 3930K - pretty sure all the -E chips are soldered.


^^THIS 100%^^
It is a really bad idea to attempt to delid a 2011 or 2011-v3 (or most any AMD processors) based processor, as they are soldered directly to the die.
Even if you _could_ successfully manage to do so, you'd see no gains from it

Delidding is only intended for LGA 115X processors, namely Ivy Bridge and Haswell CPUs.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Point take, transcoding is a reason to put an i7 in an HTPC
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But would it make the i7-5775C the best or primary choice for such a machine? I mean regarding kc5vdj's assertion that "Broadwell is going to be for AIO PCs and HTPCs".


Well, the end use next year for our Lian Li PC-Q18B for instance is probably going to be as an HTPC / Family file server / Ripper-Transcoder. My wife will have temporary use of it because she backed out of having a nice box like mine in exchange for a sewing machine this year, and I just feel bad having this while she uses a Core2 laptop... I've been considering the 2 GHz T-model i7 (the board in it is a Z87).

As far as the assertion, it actually seems to be a consensus on the trade sites. Two unlocked LGA-1150's, and three BGAs, all with rather mediocre specs, and 65W TDP. That's pretty much the favored SFF TDP right there, and the BGAs are OBVIOUSLY targeted at higher-end AIO PCs.

Still, speculated here, it might still surprise people. Kinda like the G3258 did.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wanou*
> 
> yeah !


Hey Wanou, glad to see you keep working on that build








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> As far as the assertion, it actually seems to be a consensus on the trade sites. Two unlocked LGA-1150's, and three BGAs, all with rather mediocre specs, and 65W TDP. That's pretty much the favored SFF TDP right there, and the BGAs are OBVIOUSLY targeted at higher-end AIO PCs.


Ah, I understand now what you mean about the AIO. I was thinking you meant those tablet-style things: all-in-one meaning the motherboard and screen are together. But those would use the mobile BGAs, like Haswell-H and Broadwell-U. The three desktop BGAs coming out will be slim-mITX which is too big to fit in a tablet. So you must mean NUC boxes or ultra-SFF boxes like the M350 and Streacom FC# boxes, that fit on the back of the monitor with VESA screws. Or you have some other definition?

About SFF. I happen to have built a few small machines and I'm quite involved with the SFF community. SFF seems at first like it might have trouble cooling -K chips, but it doesn't. When I first started building SFF rigs, I also made the mistake of using a low TDP chip. It was a Silverstone SG05 with i5-2400S. I can say even in one of the smallest SFF boxes, I really didn't need to go low power: with just an H60 cooling, I couldn't make the chip hotter than 45C. I discovered it's a kind of myth about SFF having trouble cooling CPUs. Ultra-SFF maybe, when you can't use a big heatsink, but in SFF there are plenty of low profile heatsinks that can cool modern chips, even overclocked. You should check the NCase M1 thread on [H]. It's a 12 litre case, just a little bigger than the SG05, everyone is using -K chips in their builds. If people ask in "I'm thinking of building in this case" and they ask about -S or -T chips, the main advice is no point, you can easily cool any top of the range i7. It's the graphics cards that need more attention in SFF. Or check what SFF boutique builders are offering. For example, in the Falcon Northwest Tiki they don't even offer any -S chip in their configurator. They even will build an mITX X99 for you. And that's a 4 inch wide, 11.5 litre case.

So then about the unlocked i5 and i7. I don't read any trade sites, so I can't really speculate why there is such a consensus. But I'll try. Maybe people are not able to see past the 3.3GHz stock clocks, and ignoring the +5% IPC. Indeed kinda like with the G3258 as well?

Yesterday I was doubting maybe the i7-4790K will still be the strongest for 1150, as I said. Since then I've read this article and I'm 90% sure about the situation. In the article they echo the common opinion that one should wait for Skylake-K if you want the most powerful computer. However, if you are restricted to 1150 and if you don't overclock, and you want the best 1150 out of the box, then yes pick the 4790K. It will still be king at stock. But I'm more and more convinced, if you want the fastest chip and aren't afraid to watercool it, maybe delid - since we are in this thread - and aren't afraid to crank up the multiplier then you can choose the 5775C instead.

I hope we will discover more about this soon


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Yesterday I was doubting maybe the i7-4790K will still be the strongest for 1150, as I said. Since then I've read this article and I'm 90% sure about the situation. In the article they echo the common opinion that one should wait for Skylake-K if you want the most powerful computer. However, if you are restricted to 1150 and if you don't overclock, and you want the best 1150 out of the box, then yes pick the 4790K. It will still be king at stock. But I'm more and more convinced, if you want the fastest chip and aren't afraid to watercool it, maybe delid - since we are in this thread - and aren't afraid to crank up the multiplier then you can choose the 5775C instead.
> 
> I hope we will discover more about this soon


Just remember that i7-5775C on the link you mentioned is an engineering sample.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just to let everyone know, We made it to the front carousel of OCN!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for all the information and communication through this thread everyone!
> 
> - Val


I guess we should thank intel for slapping on all the crap tim.


----------



## cdnGhost

Just wondering I want to delid 2 XEON X5675s is this even possible or is it just a dream?? Would make my Mac pro upgrade a bit less nerve wracking lol


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Just wondering I want to delid 2 XEON X5675s is this even possible or is it just a dream?? Would make my Mac pro upgrade a bit less nerve wracking lol


aren't Xeons soldered? I think I remeber 95W+ getting the solder treatment, but would need someone to confirm this.


----------



## cdnGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> aren't Xeons soldered? I think I remeber 95W+ getting the solder treatment, but would need someone to confirm this.


Thats what I am thinking as well, just have seen a few on eBay that are de lided so was hoping it was possible as the stock ones are half the price.....


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Just to let everyone know, We made it to the front carousel of OCN!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for all the information and communication through this thread everyone!
> 
> - Val
> 
> 
> 
> I guess we should thank intel for slapping on all the crap tim.
Click to expand...

Cud be worse. Cud be AMD and have the IHS soldered to the PCB afterward.









~Ceadder


----------



## ianthegreater

Just finished delidding my 4670K (mostly for giggles) and seeing a 13°C drop in temps (also running it naked). Now... to re-overclock this thing...

That being said, I don't think I will be doing this with my next processor.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Hey Wanou, glad to see you keep working on that build
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ah, I understand now what you mean about the AIO. I was thinking you meant those tablet-style things: all-in-one meaning the motherboard and screen are together. But those would use the mobile BGAs, like Haswell-H and Broadwell-U. The three desktop BGAs coming out will be slim-mITX which is too big to fit in a tablet. So you must mean NUC boxes or ultra-SFF boxes like the M350 and Streacom FC# boxes, that fit on the back of the monitor with VESA screws. Or you have some other definition?
> 
> About SFF. I happen to have built a few small machines and I'm quite involved with the SFF community. SFF seems at first like it might have trouble cooling -K chips, but it doesn't. When I first started building SFF rigs, I also made the mistake of using a low TDP chip. It was a Silverstone SG05 with i5-2400S. I can say even in one of the smallest SFF boxes, I really didn't need to go low power: with just an H60 cooling, I couldn't make the chip hotter than 45C. I discovered it's a kind of myth about SFF having trouble cooling CPUs. Ultra-SFF maybe, when you can't use a big heatsink, but in SFF there are plenty of low profile heatsinks that can cool modern chips, even overclocked. You should check the NCase M1 thread on [H]. It's a 12 litre case, just a little bigger than the SG05, everyone is using -K chips in their builds. If people ask in "I'm thinking of building in this case" and they ask about -S or -T chips, the main advice is no point, you can easily cool any top of the range i7. It's the graphics cards that need more attention in SFF. Or check what SFF boutique builders are offering. For example, in the Falcon Northwest Tiki they don't even offer any -S chip in their configurator. They even will build an mITX X99 for you. And that's a 4 inch wide, 11.5 litre case.
> 
> So then about the unlocked i5 and i7. I don't read any trade sites, so I can't really speculate why there is such a consensus. But I'll try. Maybe people are not able to see past the 3.3GHz stock clocks, and ignoring the +5% IPC. Indeed kinda like with the G3258 as well?
> 
> Yesterday I was doubting maybe the i7-4790K will still be the strongest for 1150, as I said. Since then I've read this article and I'm 90% sure about the situation. In the article they echo the common opinion that one should wait for Skylake-K if you want the most powerful computer. However, if you are restricted to 1150 and if you don't overclock, and you want the best 1150 out of the box, then yes pick the 4790K. It will still be king at stock. But I'm more and more convinced, if you want the fastest chip and aren't afraid to watercool it, maybe delid - since we are in this thread - and aren't afraid to crank up the multiplier then you can choose the 5775C instead.
> 
> I hope we will discover more about this soon


Well, I was thinking that the BGAs will end up in like you said the ITX boards, but also in those AIOs that are about the size and shape of a large monitor. Same concept as a VESA-mount box, except it's all internal (kinda like the Apples, etc)...

As far as the cooling goes, last year I was running what became my wife's i7-4770K in a Lian Li PC-Q18B, and I was able to crunch SETI 24/7 in that thing using the Scythe Big Shuriken 2 Rev B heatsink, albeit, on HOT days (over 95F indoors) it was in the 80's C. I'm trying to figure out how to mod that Lian Li to put a rad in without removing the hot-swap bays... The best thing I can figure is to mod it to take a SFX PSU, and it might give me enough room for a 25mm rad up top. By default the ATX PSU is mounted directly above the motherboard, with only 80mm of clearance from the top of the IHS to the bottom of the PSU. I love that chassis, just trying to figure out how to make it better.

My next ITX build is probably going to be in the Corsair 280T, as I just like the look, the portability, and the fact that it's actually made to take this H100i GTX in it, as I'm planing to step through the H110i GT before I do the custom loop in this 750D.

That article seems intriguing, but if 1.4V is bad on 22nm, how does that translate to 14nm? Is 1.35 or even 1.3 going to be the "safe" high end? Also note that the article cites someone doing 5.5 GHz on air cooling with an i7-4790K ES last year. Seriously, how many here or in the Devil's Canyon thread have achieved even 5.0 GHz on air??? less than can be counted on one hand, no doubt, at least with anything resembling safe temps.

Well, we'll see. I just bought this over the course of the past six months, and really only have to get the second Ripjaws X 16GB kit to round out the basics, and I'm doing my wife's ITX next (she was going to get something akin to mine, but opted for a sewing machine and serger instead, and I just feel bad being on this and letting her remain on a T9600 Core2 Duo laptop), and then video cards, then a custom loop in mine. That takes me through next Summer anyway money-wise.... So, all told, for me Skylake, or even Skylake 2011 may be my next upgrade.. I mean The Legendary Black Beast of Aaargh! won't even be finished until next summer at the current rate (at least the initial goal of operational status has been achieved)


----------



## kill

OCN name: *Kill*
CPU: *4690K*
on die-TIM: *Arctic Silver Ceramique 2*
ihs-TIM: *Arctic Silver Ceramique 2*
Mhz gained: Not tested.
OC after delid: 4.5ghz
Temp drops: 8c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Havent gone for max yet. will do so when I get CLP




Sorry about the crappy lighting and camera phone. To be honest I thought I killed the chip while I was delidding. Was Copper(color) on the PCB where I had the razer at the time. Turned out it was piece of the IHS


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> That article seems intriguing, but if 1.4V is bad on 22nm, how does that translate to 14nm? Is 1.35 or even 1.3 going to be the "safe" high end? Also note that the article cites someone doing 5.5 GHz on air cooling with an i7-4790K ES last year. Seriously, how many here or in the Devil's Canyon thread have achieved even 5.0 GHz on air??? less than can be counted on one hand, no doubt, at least with anything resembling safe temps.


Wasn't the 5.5 achieved using LN2 vapour or something??


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Wasn't the 5.5 achieved using LN2 vapour or something??


The article links to an article from last year pre-release using an ES on an air-cooler.

http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/anton-shilov/intel-core-i7-4790k-overclocked-to-5-5ghz-on-air-to-6-3ghz-with-ln2/

I'd have to check the spreadsheets on the other threads, but I think he may be the only one to get that high on air. Hell, I need to upgrade my radiator to what I originally had planned to even think about 4.8 GHz, hitting max of 92C on this cooler, whereas I'm in the upper 70's at 4.7 GHz with a brief max of 82C on one core, Prime95 Blend.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> The article links to an article from last year pre-release using an ES on an air-cooler.
> 
> http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/anton-shilov/intel-core-i7-4790k-overclocked-to-5-5ghz-on-air-to-6-3ghz-with-ln2/
> 
> I'd have to check the spreadsheets on the other threads, but I think he may be the only one to get that high on air. Hell, I need to upgrade my radiator to what I originally had planned to even think about 4.8 GHz, hitting max of 92C on this cooler, whereas I'm in the upper 70's at 4.7 GHz with a brief max of 82C on one core, Prime95 Blend.


Yeah, my bad it seems. The LN2 vapour thing got around 6GHz. Gave me high hopes initially before I managed my expectations.








That is high. I get around mid 70s on air. Go max out all the radiator space you have... Drown that SOB


----------



## kc5vdj

Anyone care to help educate people?

Wikipedia talk page proposal for a subsection after the section on Devil's Canyon having an improved TIM that Wikipedia seems to want people to think solves the issue.

Five bucks says that Intel's marketing people police the page to keep this out.


----------



## alancsalt

Under the Wikipedia system of verifiable citations published material that can be referenced (generally printed on paper in a book or cataloged document) is accepted while "unverifiable" opinions or "original research" are not. What you need there is a reference point for that Intel Engineer that explained why TIM was being used - something better than a URL if the information is to remain, because once a web source goes down the information becomes "unverifiable" by Wikipedia standards. I think you need to quote press releases or technical papers.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Under the Wikipedia system of verifiable citations published material that can be referenced (generally printed on paper in a book or cataloged document) is accepted while "unverifiable" opinions or "original research" are not. What you need there is a reference point for that Intel Engineer that explained why TIM was being used - something better than a URL if the information is to remain, because once a web source goes down the information becomes "unverifiable" by Wikipedia standards. I think you need to quote press releases or technical papers.


I'm pretty sure I bookmarked it... The problem is about 10,000 unsorted bookmarks...


----------



## Ceadderman

Time to hear out the old bookmarks I think.









I hate when that happens.









~Ceadder


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kill*
> 
> OCN name: *Kill*
> CPU: *4690K*
> on die-TIM: *Arctic Silver Ceramique 2*
> ihs-TIM: *Arctic Silver Ceramique 2*
> Mhz gained: Not tested.
> OC after delid: 4.5ghz
> Temp drops: 8c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Havent gone for max yet. will do so when I get CLP
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry about the crappy lighting and camera phone. To be honest I thought I killed the chip while I was delidding. Was Copper(color) on the PCB where I had the razer at the time. Turned out it was piece of the IHS


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kill*
> 
> OCN name: *Kill*
> CPU: *4690K*
> on die-TIM: *Arctic Silver Ceramique 2*
> ihs-TIM: *Arctic Silver Ceramique 2*
> Mhz gained: Not tested.
> OC after delid: 4.5ghz
> Temp drops: 8c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Havent gone for max yet. will do so when I get CLP
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry about the crappy lighting and camera phone. To be honest I thought I killed the chip while I was delidding. Was Copper(color) on the PCB where I had the razer at the time. Turned out it was piece of the IHS


At your earliest convenience, get a liquid metal TIM for the die. That Ceramique has severe pump-out on silicon.


----------



## saldtch

OCN name: saldtch
CPU: 4670K
On-die TIM: Noctua N1-H1
IHS TIM: Noctua N1-H1
Mhz gained: not tested
OC after delid: already at 4.4ghz before delid
Temp drops: ~20C, the third core has weird high temperature spikes, will reapply on-die TIM tonight

I tried the razor method which was unnecessarily dangerous, then tried hammer and vice, and finally after one whole week of attempts, I tried the vice only method, I had to exert a very large force on the cpu with the vice to delid it, luckily it didn't snap it s crazy how firm the IHS and the cpu were stuck together.

Also...my stupid new nepton 120xl is making annoying clicking sound after I have flipped the radiator to try to install at the bottom of the case (but failed)


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saldtch*
> 
> OCN name: saldtch
> CPU: 4670K
> On-die TIM: Noctua N1-H1
> IHS TIM: Noctua N1-H1
> Mhz gained: not tested
> OC after delid: already at 4.4ghz before delid
> Temp drops: ~20C, the third core has weird high temperature spikes, will reapply on-die TIM tonight
> 
> I tried the razor method which was unnecessarily dangerous, then tried hammer and vice, and finally after one whole week of attempts, I tried the vice only method, I had to exert a very large force on the cpu with the vice to delid it, luckily it didn't snap it s crazy how firm the IHS and the cpu were stuck together.
> 
> Also...my stupid new nepton 120xl is making annoying clicking sound after I have flipped the radiator to try to install at the bottom of the case (but failed)


Wow..you went for the trifecta there. For the vice method just make sure the ihs and pcb are square with the "mouth" of the vice. Turn slowly and you're golden. As others have said here, traditional TIMs on die will have a pump-out effect and temps will degrade in a few months. CLP/CLU is preferable but I suppose you already knew that.


----------



## saldtch

Haha that was quite a joy and relief you gotta believe me...i already made some dents on the IHS with the vice with the vice and hammer method
I actually wasn't aware of the pump-out effect and I thought the noctua should be just second to CLP/CLU ... but I am gonna get some CLU anyway...i read that you need to sand the surface a bit to allow the liquid metal not to form a bulk or sth but I never seen anyone sanding the die, I guess it s ok to leave it that way if I apply CLP/CLU to the die? Thanks for the info anyway


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saldtch*
> 
> OCN name: saldtch
> CPU: 4670K
> On-die TIM: Noctua N1-H1
> IHS TIM: Noctua N1-H1
> Mhz gained: not tested
> OC after delid: already at 4.4ghz before delid
> Temp drops: ~20C, the third core has weird high temperature spikes, will reapply on-die TIM tonight
> 
> I tried the razor method which was unnecessarily dangerous, then tried hammer and vice, and finally after one whole week of attempts, I tried the vice only method, I had to exert a very large force on the cpu with the vice to delid it, luckily it didn't snap it s crazy how firm the IHS and the cpu were stuck together.
> 
> Also...my stupid new nepton 120xl is making annoying clicking sound after I have flipped the radiator to try to install at the bottom of the case (but failed)


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









In regards to the nepton, could you move it back to top mount? I think some air may have moved into the block possibly


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saldtch*
> 
> Haha that was quite a joy and relief you gotta believe me...i already made some dents on the IHS with the vice with the vice and hammer method
> I actually wasn't aware of the pump-out effect and I thought the noctua should be just second to CLP/CLU ... but I am gonna get some CLU anyway...i read that you need to sand the surface a bit to allow the liquid metal not to form a bulk or sth but I never seen anyone sanding the die, I guess it s ok to leave it that way if I apply CLP/CLU to the die? Thanks for the info anyway


Never heard of sanding the die. Just use the included brush and make sure you insulate the vrms on the pcb(nail polish/liquid electrical tape and what have you) do the insulation before applying the CLU just in case. I have a slight dent on mine as well. Doesn't affect temps but it does scratch the corresponding area on the base of my heatsink.


----------



## llythrus

Finally got sick of those temps.
OCN name: llythrus
CPU: i5-3570k
on die-TIM: arctic silver 5
ihs-TIM: arctic silver 5
Mhz gained: 200Mhz
OC after delid: 4.5ghz
Temp drops: (I couldn't get to 4.5ghz before, at 4.3 ghz I had a 11C drop) The ihs is not lapped.
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/ppb6dg


----------



## Jimbags

Is the IHS often convex or concave? Just wondering if its worth doing to my 3570k?


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Is the IHS often convex or concave? Just wondering if its worth doing to my 3570k?


My personal experience, concave. The top of the visible part (where the etchings are) is depressed in the middle.

If you're going to delid, might as well sand it. The warranty is gone so do it properly.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My personal experience, concave. The top of the visible part (where the etchings are) is depressed in the middle.
> 
> If you're going to delid, might as well sand it. The warranty is gone so do it properly.


Already dellided and used CLU :-D Just core 3 is always cooler. Damn wish I had sanded it before putting cpu block on. Oh well I want to
-Re-do tubing on swiftech H220
-Need to bleed air from rad
-Clean fans etc
So may as well lap this bad boy too. When I do Ill check with a straight edge and take pics. Will the CLU hold it together? Dont want to slip and ruin it :-/


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My personal experience, concave. The top of the visible part (where the etchings are) is depressed in the middle.
> 
> If you're going to delid, might as well sand it. The warranty is gone so do it properly.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Already dellided and used CLU :-D Just core 3 is always cooler. Damn wish I had sanded it before putting cpu block on. Oh well I want to
> -Re-do tubing on swiftech H220
> -Need to bleed air from rad
> -Clean fans etc
> So may as well lap this bad boy too. When I do Ill check with a straight edge and take pics. Will the CLU hold it together? Dont want to slip and ruin it :-/
Click to expand...

Normally, the 'middle' cores will run hotter, but it can run cooler depending on the application of TIM and basic conductivity. Basically, think of each core as separate system. Each releases a certain amount of heat. In close proximity, the other systems (cores) will absorb that energy into their system and run hotter. While the other systems are running as well, they release heat to the other systems and back to each other.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My personal experience, concave. The top of the visible part (where the etchings are) is depressed in the middle.
> 
> If you're going to delid, might as well sand it. The warranty is gone so do it properly.


The base of the coolers are often intentionally convex to combat this, so I guess just lapping without looking what's going on with the contact area might backfire.


----------



## saldtch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In regards to the nepton, could you move it back to top mount? I think some air may have moved into the block possibly


Yup that actually worked I gave the tubes some hits with my finger while it's running and then I heard some liquid passing through, the clicking sound can only be heard on full load now


----------



## saldtch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Never heard of sanding the die. Just use the included brush and make sure you insulate the vrms on the pcb(nail polish/liquid electrical tape and what have you) do the insulation before applying the CLU just in case. I have a slight dent on mine as well. Doesn't affect temps but it does scratch the corresponding area on the base of my heatsink.


arrrrrr, I really don't think I have the steady hands to apply the CLU (I have read that CLP is better?) ...I just reapplied some more Noctua NT-H1, seems the spike is gone, temperature is about the same, perhaps I should get the CLP/CLU first but let the Noctua run for some time and whenever I notice the decrease in heat dissipation I will get myself to apply the CLU (what's good now is Noctua is non-conductive so I don't have to worry at all)


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *saldtch*
> 
> arrrrrr, I really don't think I have the steady hands to apply the CLU (I have read that CLP is better?) ...I just reapplied some more Noctua NT-H1, seems the spike is gone, temperature is about the same, perhaps I should get the CLP/CLU first but let the Noctua run for some time and whenever I notice the decrease in heat dissipation I will get myself to apply the CLU (what's good now is Noctua is non-conductive so I don't have to worry at all)


There was something about CLP getting hard over time in situations where CLU will stay fluid. Both should work between die and IHS, but CLU might be a better idea if you want to maybe use it somewhere else in the future.

You don't need to worry about needing steady hands because you can take your time and work on it as long as you want to. The way CLU/CLP works, you can do something like open the CPU again and work on it some more without having to clean the old application off. You can brush it around again, you can add some to what's already there, you can try to remove some of it with the brush.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *llythrus*
> 
> 
> Finally got sick of those temps.
> OCN name: llythrus
> CPU: i5-3570k
> on die-TIM: arctic silver 5
> ihs-TIM: arctic silver 5
> Mhz gained: 200Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.5ghz
> Temp drops: (I couldn't get to 4.5ghz before, at 4.3 ghz I had a 11C drop) The ihs is not lapped.
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/ppb6dg


Haven't seen an Ivy in a long while! You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> My personal experience, concave. The top of the visible part (where the etchings are) is depressed in the middle.
> 
> If you're going to delid, might as well sand it. The warranty is gone so do it properly.


Haven't seen you in a while either! Hows it been going?


----------



## asm99

Thermal Paste Comparison 2015 - Which is The Best Thermal Paste?

http://www.play3r.net/reviews/cooling/thermal-paste-comparison-2015-best-thermal-paste/2/


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> Thermal Paste Comparison 2015 - Which is The Best Thermal Paste?
> 
> http://www.play3r.net/reviews/cooling/thermal-paste-comparison-2015-best-thermal-paste/2/


I'm using CLU under my IHS and Liquid Copper on top. Good to finally see a comparative test of CLC.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> I'm using CLU under my IHS and Liquid Copper on top. Good to finally see a comparative test of CLC.


You're the first person I've read that uses CLC...how is application and removal? the same as CLU/CLP?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> You're the first person I've read that uses CLC...how is application and removal? the same as CLU/CLP?


No, it's more like MX4, not too viscous. I did the rice-dot method to test and got a perfect spread first time.


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> No, it's more like MX4, not too viscous. I did the rice-dot method to test and got a perfect spread first time.


How long have you been using it? Improvements on temps? Does it leave stains on the cooling block?


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> How long have you been using it? Improvements on temps? Does it leave stains on the cooling block?


Six months.
Unfortunately I can't tell improvements that are only due to CLC. On the CPU I also made some changes to the mounting of the block (Apogee Drive II), and the GPU was entirely new so no comparison.
Next time I undo the loop I can check for stains, but since it's a normal emulsion-type paste I don't expect it will stain anything.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> No, it's more like MX4, not too viscous. I did the rice-dot method to test and got a perfect spread first time.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> How long have you been using it? Improvements on temps? Does it leave stains on the cooling block?


Link to a thread here on OCN where a guy was asking the same thing. Someone replied that since the filler was still silicone with suspended copper particles that is won't be as good as CLU/CLP but should be better then the other thermal pastes. Which is in line with the results given from the link on the previous page. The staining is something I'm interested in though it wouldn't matter much since my warranty has already been voided be delidding. Maybe I'll order it the next time I order more CLU.


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Six months.
> Unfortunately I can't tell improvements that are only due to CLC. On the CPU I also made some changes to the mounting of the block (Apogee Drive II), and the GPU was entirely new so no comparison.
> Next time I undo the loop I can check for stains, but since it's a normal emulsion-type paste I don't expect it will stain anything.


I was thinking to do on my GPU but unsure what to use...ultra or the copper. What do you suggest? Any vrms cooling blocks or you left it as per original?

A quick search on 'amazons' for CLC:
UK: £8.95
SPAIN: EUR 13,89
US: $56.88!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> I was thinking to do on my GPU but unsure what to use...ultra or the copper. What do you suggest? Any vrms cooling blocks or you left it as per original?
> 
> A quick search on 'amazons' for CLC:
> UK: £8.95
> SPAIN: EUR 13,89
> US: $56.88!!!!!!!!!!


I just used CLU on my msi r9 290 Gaming. Dropped temps 10C just from that.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> I was thinking to do on my GPU but unsure what to use...ultra or the copper. What do you suggest? Any vrms cooling blocks or you left it as per original?
> 
> A quick search on 'amazons' for CLC:
> UK: £8.95
> SPAIN: EUR 13,89
> US: $56.88!!!!!!!!!!


If your GPU cooler contains any aluminium then you should not use CLU or CLP. So Liquid Copper would be the best.

I don't know where it's available in the US, but you can try ordering directly from Coollabs http://coollaboratory.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/40

My GPU has a full water block, for the VRMs there are thermal pads, so only the chip itself got the CLC.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> ^^THIS 100%^^
> It is a really bad idea to attempt to delid a 2011 or 2011-v3 (or most any AMD processors) based processor, as they are soldered directly to the die.
> Even if you _could_ successfully manage to do so, you'd see no gains from it
> 
> Delidding is only intended for LGA 115X processors, namely Ivy Bridge and Haswell CPUs.


It's not for all 1155 CPU's, Sandy was the last soldered hence why it runs so cool.

Ivy Bridge (3rd Gen)
Haswel (4th Gen)
Broadwell (5th Gen) - Seems to be pasted

speculation says that it will regardless as it's a lower wattage chip again


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> Thermal Paste Comparison 2015 - Which is The Best Thermal Paste?
> 
> http://www.play3r.net/reviews/cooling/thermal-paste-comparison-2015-best-thermal-paste/2/


Phah! :yawn: Pee poor excuse of a comparison really.

They included Arctic Cool Ceraminque 2 which is ancient as bantha poodoo. But don't include KNOWN performers like Shin Etsu G751.

Ridiculously failsauce.

I doubt that G751 is better than CLU for delidding but cmon...
Did the owner of the company sleep with somebody's married mother or someone's wife?









I have seen 3 so called comparatives now since the 80way TIM comparison and they've all been lacking.

Compare for yourself using the link in my Sig. No the testing rig ain't the same but the results are translatable due to the broader coverage of the subject.

~Ceadder


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> It's not for all 1155 CPU's, Sandy was the last soldered hence why it runs so cool.


That's why I said 115*X* and listed Ivy Bridge and Haswell as the only Generations where it's currently possible.

Though I'm pretty sure Broadwell and Skylake CPUs to be pasted on as well, but from images i've seen of the Broadwell die there's going to be a monstrous amount of VRMs to deal with...


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> That's why I said 115*X* and listed Ivy Bridge and Haswell as the only Generations where it's currently possible.
> 
> Though I'm pretty sure Broadwell and Skylake CPUs to be pasted on as well, but from images i've seen of the Broadwell die there's going to be a monstrous amount of VRMs to deal with...


that wont be that bad, they are all on the power side so as long as you put the chip in the vice right it'll come off without a problem, then just cover them and poof! instant temps for ages. Maybe Intel will redesign their TIM again though


----------



## sakundes

subbed


----------



## vicyo

So, after lapping the IHS and using phobya liquid metal on the G3258 die and using a zombified/guetto custom first gen Antec 620 with a magicool 240mm radiator, my friend managed 4830MHz @ 1.523V 65C on cinebench










and 5098MHz @ 1.568V on CPU-Z
http://hwbot.org/submission/2866411_noms_cpu_frequency_pentium_g3258_5098.81_mhz


Now i just have to wait for the DICE results


----------



## Ceadderman

Looks like I will indeed build tha womenz systems with G3260s.









~Ceadder


----------



## knoober

Nothing ground breaking here, I just wanted to get patted on the back for completing my first delid. I was practicing on some old P4s using a variation of the bench vise method in the OP. I took a sponge and folded it around the edge of the cpu and pushed it against a wall, then tapped it off with a small piece of pine 2x2







like I said, just wanted to say thanks for the awesome method!

Last one in line for practice was a chip I actually use, a C2D E6700. Now I just wait for the liquid metal tim. The real test will be with my sig cpu, the phenom ii x4. I'm confident but nervous


----------



## Ceadderman

I don't believe you can delid AMD. But I will be paying attention to the horizon to see if a nuclear cloud erupts from your direction.









~Ceadder


----------



## knoober

Yeah I went back to the precious page and saw a comment to to that effect and have been looking into it. It seems that there are methods. One I read was a Seco do hand account of hearing it out the stove / adding a drop of as5 and using that hest desolder it..... I'll still try...maybe









I am getting Conflicting reports about it. I'd really love to know for sure. It's a while till the liquid tim comes in anyway so I have time for research


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Yeah I went back to the precious page and saw a comment to to that effect and have been looking into it. It seems that there are methods. One I read was a Seco do hand account of hearing it out the stove / adding a drop of as5 and using that hest desolder it..... I'll still try...maybe
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am getting Conflicting reports about it. I'd really love to know for sure. It's a while till the liquid tim comes in anyway so I have time for research


If it's soldered there is no point in delidding.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vicyo*
> 
> So, after lapping the IHS and using phobya liquid metal on the G3258 die and using a zombified/guetto custom first gen Antec 620 with a magicool 240mm radiator, my friend managed 4830MHz @ 1.523V 65C on cinebench
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and 5098MHz @ 1.568V on CPU-Z
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now i just have to wait for the DICE results


That voltage is gonna kill that, but that's a damn fine speed.







For $70, you can't cry too much when it dies though.

For $330 spent on this 4790K, I have limits on how far I am willing to push...I'm just po white trash, building on a budget.


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> that wont be that bad, they are all on the power side so as long as you put the chip in the vice right it'll come off without a problem, then just cover them and poof! instant temps for ages. Maybe Intel will redesign their TIM again though


This might almost rule out the razor method for Broadwell. Those things are really close to the edge.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Phah! :yawn: Pee poor excuse of a comparison really.
> 
> They included Arctic Cool Ceraminque 2 which is ancient as bantha poodoo. But don't include KNOWN performers like Shin Etsu G751.
> 
> Ridiculously failsauce.
> 
> I doubt that G751 is better than CLU for delidding but cmon...
> Did the owner of the company sleep with somebody's married mother or someone's wife?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen 3 so called comparatives now since the 80way TIM comparison and they've all been lacking.
> 
> Compare for yourself using the link in my Sig. No the testing rig ain't the same but the results are translatable due to the broader coverage of the subject.
> 
> ~Ceadder


Your signature seems truncated on my end.

And where is MX-4? It is by far more popular than MX-2. I use MX-4 for general purpose use.

Also, it seems interesting that in his comparison the CLU/CLP results are reversed from the normal case where CLP ranks better than CLU. I use CLU myself, but just saying. Maybe he was swabbing the CLP too thin?

I notice personally with CLU in my own use, that there is such a thing as too little. I had to add to it twice after the initial, just to get the right amount on (I was trying not to overdo it).

Also, most "scientific" comparisons also tend to do multiple seatings to rule out any invalid results from bad mating.

And nothing irks me more than idiots who do professional writing and don't know the difference between "bear in mind" and "bare in mind" (he used the latter).... I was going to make a comparison naming in this sentence a radical segment of the American population with similar spelling issues....


----------



## vicyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> That voltage is gonna kill that, but that's a damn fine speed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For $70, you can't cry too much when it dies though.
> 
> For $330 spent on this 4790K, I have limits on how far I am willing to push...I'm just po white trash, building on a budget.


I sold that pentium to my friend, so no worries from me








He'll worry about that when the pentium dies, but until then, he is going to punish the hell out of it


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vicyo*
> 
> I sold that pentium to my friend, so no worries from me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He'll worry about that when the pentium dies, but until then, he is going to punish the hell out of it


That's cool though. In a couple of months, I'm going to be putting one of those pentiums in my wife's ITX build. I just showed her your results, with the caveat, that her voltage will be a bit lower, but that on a per-core basis, she might actually outdo mine (4.7 GHz @ 1.295Vcore with 4.4 GHz @ 1.240Vuncore (24/7)).


----------



## vicyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> That's cool though. In a couple of months, I'm going to be putting one of those pentiums in my wife's ITX build. I just showed her your results, with the caveat, that her voltage will be a bit lower, but that on a per-core basis, she might actually outdo mine (4.7 GHz @ 1.295Vcore with 4.4 GHz @ 1.240Vuncore (24/7)).


Before I voided the warranty i used to run it at 4.3~4.4Ghz with 1.255 vcore at 55c max using a semi-passive H55 with upgraded radiator. I doubt that she'll need more that 1.325v to run @ 4.5GHz


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I don't believe you can delid AMD. But I will be paying attention to the horizon to see if a nuclear cloud erupts from your direction.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


There are a few AMD chips you can de-lid, namely the Athlon 64's (most of them if not all?) Not certain but there are definetly de-liddable AMD chips.

You also have a big list in the first post and it specifically says that these certain chips can be done.


Athlon 64 3200+
Athlon 64 3700+
Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice Core)
AMD x2 5000+ BE - You'd think that the Black Edition would be soldered? lol
Of course all current AMD chips are soldered however, now that I've written my response that's _probably_ what you meant.

Anyway just leaving it there for the internet incase anyone is interested.

Nope, apparently APU's are pasted too and can be de-lidded...

Source


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> that wont be that bad, they are all on the power side so as long as you put the chip in the vice right it'll come off without a problem, then just cover them and poof! instant temps for ages. Maybe Intel will redesign their TIM again though
> 
> 
> 
> This might almost rule out the razor method for Broadwell. Those things are really close to the edge.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Phah! :yawn: Pee poor excuse of a comparison really.
> 
> They included Arctic Cool Ceraminque 2 which is ancient as bantha poodoo. But don't include KNOWN performers like Shin Etsu G751.
> 
> Ridiculously failsauce.
> 
> I doubt that G751 is better than CLU for delidding but cmon...
> Did the owner of the company sleep with somebody's married mother or someone's wife?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen 3 so called comparatives now since the 80way TIM comparison and they've all been lacking.
> 
> Compare for yourself using the link in my Sig. No the testing rig ain't the same but the results are translatable due to the broader coverage of the subject.
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your signature seems truncated on my end.
> 
> And where is MX-4? It is by far more popular than MX-2. I use MX-4 for general purpose use.
> 
> Also, it seems interesting that in his comparison the CLU/CLP results are reversed from the normal case where CLP ranks better than CLU. I use CLU myself, but just saying. Maybe he was swabbing the CLP too thin?
> 
> I notice personally with CLU in my own use, that there is such a thing as too little. I had to add to it twice after the initial, just to get the right amount on (I was trying not to overdo it).
> 
> Also, most "scientific" comparisons also tend to do multiple seatings to rule out any invalid results from bad mating.
> 
> And nothing irks me more than idiots who do professional writing and don't know the difference between "bear in mind" and "bare in mind" (he used the latter).... I was going to make a comparison naming in this sentence a radical segment of the American population with similar spelling issues....
Click to expand...

I cudnt tell you why it's truncated ATM. I am on my phone so sigs don't show. Nor do Sig rigs an the like that we get in Desktop.

As far as MX4 the study was done in 09. Which is why MX4 isn't listed. It was not available then. So that's why I suggest comparing studies and differences in rankings.

Dunno what he did to get a different result between CLU/CLP. I've been curious about that myself but since I haven't used them I won't try to speculate other than agree that it could be in application.

I write so BIM doesn't phase me the way Pleaded does. Nobody who goes to court "pleaded" their case. They either plead or pled. That offends me so much when I pick up a Paper or read the news on the web and I see that simple mistake committed by "professional" writers and allowed to go to print by the Editorial staff.









Compared to that, "Bare in mind" seems silly.









~Ceadder


----------



## asm99

EDIT: Sorry guys. After all this is about delidding, not undelidded.


----------



## Ceadderman

Sorry for the DP, but I had a thought that maybe you're referring to my in post Sig?

I shorten that intentionally. As to invite familiarity.









~Ceadder


----------



## alancsalt

I believe it's if your sig is too big for the allowed space it gets truncated.

The limit for signature length is 8 lines measured by the Fixed View.

http://www.overclock.net/t/617838/physical-limit-on-signature-lines


----------



## Ceadderman

Ah okay. I think I will be cleaning my Sig at some point soon but ATM the wife is expecting and we're on the road more since this is the last month so I live on my phone more and the desktop is down for modification. Probably will get on it when I take the laptop to our next appointment. My bro has it ATM.







lol

~Ceadder


----------



## asm99

Sanding CPU for better cooling performance

http://uk.hardware.info/reviews/5995/workshop-sanding-cpu-for-better-cooling-performance


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Ah okay. I think I will be cleaning my Sig at some point soon but ATM the wife is expecting and we're on the road more since this is the last month so I live on my phone more and the desktop is down for modification. Probably will get on it when I take the laptop to our next appointment. My bro has it ATM.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> ~Ceadder


Good luck with that!!

As for the sig, here's what I see:


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> Sanding CPU for better cooling performance
> 
> http://uk.hardware.info/reviews/5995/workshop-sanding-cpu-for-better-cooling-performance


Remember, lapping (the name I've always heard it referred to by) the IHS voids the warranty. It's one of the things listed in the booklet that comes in the box. The IHS lettering must be legible.

If you choose to lap it, you may as well delid as well. A voided warranty is a voided warranty.

You may also want to verify the flatness of the cold plate on your cooler. Some are convex to better fit the natural concaveness of the IHS.


----------



## knoober

Are you saying there's no point because it can't be done or because solder has the best w/mk value? Everything I've read (and I'm still looking) says that liquid metal tim beats solder by a fair margin, but I'm not a real expert, just kind of doing some light reading


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Are you saying there's no point because it can't be done or because solder has the best w/mk value? Everything I've read (and I'm still looking) says that liquid metal tim beats solder by a fair margin, but I'm not a real expert, just kind of doing some light reading


It must have been very _light_ reading









CLU is 38.4 W/mK whereas the solder used in CPUs is between 60-80 W/mK depending on the ratio of tin / silver / etc.


----------



## Jimbags

Can anyone confirm if the e5200 is soldered or not. The list in this thread says its soldered but unconfirmed.. Googled it and about 75% say its not soldered:-/ Anyone know?
TIA


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Can anyone confirm if the e5200 is soldered or not. The list in this thread says its soldered but unconfirmed.. Googled it and about 75% say its not soldered:-/ Anyone know?
> TIA


75% say it's soldered? So which one link out of four said it wasn't?

AFAIK all of the previous "Core" Intel CPUs that weren't soldered are from the 65nm architecture. The E5200 is from the 45nm Penryn generation, which I'm sure were soldered. They were good overclocking chips after all.


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Can anyone confirm if the e5200 is soldered or not. The list in this thread says its soldered but unconfirmed.. Googled it and about 75% say its not soldered:-/ Anyone know?
> TIA


Well the Intel spec sheet doesn't call it a C2D or a Dual Core but I can only assume that it is a predecessor of the C2D e6700 that I did last night, and that one was unsoldered. Did it with the bench vice method
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Can anyone confirm if the e5200 is soldered or not. The list in this thread says its soldered but unconfirmed.. Googled it and about 75% say its not soldered:-/ Anyone know?
> TIA


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> It must have been very _light_ reading
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CLU is 38.4 W/mK whereas the solder used in CPUs is between 60-80 W/mK depending on the ratio of tin / silver / etc.


clu = coollaboratory ultimate or whatever the non pro was called? When I read (and to be certain I usually believe the first thing Google tells me







) I found that the best w/mk for solder was 50 if it was a good tin / lead mix and usually somewhere between 17 - 38. As for the coollaboratory pro... I read it at 82 at 2 different sources, although only one actually labeled the units, the other just had 80 listed in a table next to "thermal blah blah blah" ( as you can see I am very exact with my quotes!) I can give urls if it helps. I did find one post on OCN that compared the two coollaboratory formulas and listed them in the high 30s range though....


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> 75% say it's soldered? So which one link out of four said it wasn't?
> 
> AFAIK all of the previous "Core" Intel CPUs that weren't soldered are from the 65nm architecture. The E5200 is from the 45nm Penryn generation, which I'm sure were soldered. They were good overclocking chips after all.


75% say its *not* soldered. Well not exactly 75% haha.Damn it wish I could be sure :-/ Op on this thread lists it as soldered but not physically confirmed. Few googles say its not soldered hmmmmm


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> As for the coollaboratory pro... I read it at 82 at 2 different sources,


That 82W/mK for CLP must be a typo, since gallium from which it's made is only 50 W/mK. There is a little bit of indium in it (81.8 W/mK) but it's not the primary ingredient. Maybe the confusion comes from the indium value.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> 75% say its *not* soldered. Well not exactly 75% haha.Damn it wish I could be sure :-/ Op on this thread lists it as soldered but not physically confirmed. Few googles say its not soldered hmmmmm


Why are you asking specifically about the E5200? if you have one spare, just try to delid it, see what happens. Then you can add knowledge to the first post. If it's not spare, don't delid it


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> That 82W/mK for CLP must be a typo, since gallium from which it's made is only 50 W/mK. There is a little bit of indium in it (81.8 W/mK) but it's not the primary ingredient. Maybe the confusion comes from the indium value.


The safety data sheet lists gallium along with iridium and rhodium, sliver and stannous

I (once again) didn't dig too far, but silver has a w/mK value of over 400. Even if there is only a bit in there that would raise the average quite a bit. I found more places that list @ 82 w/mK as well. I Really want it to be true









So until I find a way to test it for myself ( haven't found a procedure yet and I don't have the product yet.... It's on the way) I will just have to keep the hope alive! It's gotta be 82 cuz so many places say sooooooo!


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Well the Intel spec sheet doesn't call it a C2D or a Dual Core but I can only assume that it is a predecessor of the C2D e6700 that I did last night, and that one was unsoldered. Did it with the bench vice method
> 
> clu = coollaboratory ultimate or whatever the non pro was called? When I read (and to be certain I usually believe the first thing Google tells me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) I found that the best w/mk for solder was 50 if it was a good tin / lead mix and usually somewhere between 17 - 38. As for the coollaboratory pro... I read it at 82 at 2 different sources, although only one actually labeled the units, the other just had 80 listed in a table next to "thermal blah blah blah" ( as you can see I am very exact with my quotes!) I can give urls if it helps. I did find one post on OCN that compared the two coollaboratory formulas and listed them in the high 30s range though....


First off, you won't find any lead in the solder used. Mainly it's a silver/tin alloy. Lead would preclude RoHS certification, and effect sales to cultures more advanced than here in America.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> First off, you won't find any lead in the solder used. Mainly it's a silver/tin alloy. Lead would preclude RoHS certification, and effect sales to cultures more advanced than here in America.


I think the Intel solder is actually antimony based. Can't remember where I read that, but it was used for the low melting temp (if I remember correctly). There is a white paper that kind of discussed it, but my quick Google search couldn't find it right now.

Edit: well, it wasn't for the melting point at least, so maybe I'm misremembering the whole thing. Antimony melts at something over 1100C.

Edit2: found it. It's pure Indium, not antimony. Here's the quote and reference:
Quote:


> The thermal conductivity and the mechanical compliance requirements resulted in the development and qualification of low melting
> temperatures (157oC Tm), low mechanical yield strength (4-6 MPa), and relatively high thermal conductivity (~87 W/moK) pure Indium (In) metal for STIM applications.


http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/research/2008-vol12-iss-1-intel-technology-journal.pdf


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Forceman*
> 
> I think the Intel solder is actually antimony based. Can't remember where I read that, but it was used for the low melting temp (if I remember correctly). There is a white paper that kind of discussed it, but my quick Google search couldn't find it right now.
> 
> Edit: well, it wasn't for the melting point at least, so maybe I'm misremembering the whole thing. Antimony melts at something over 1100C.
> 
> Edit2: found it. It's pure Indium, not antimony. Here's the quote and reference:
> 
> http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/research/2008-vol12-iss-1-intel-technology-journal.pdf


Well, there you go. The solder will definitely outperform any liquid metal on the market today.

I'm sure AMD probably is doing something similar with their soldered IHS. You generally can't have one doing something obvious without the other reverse engineering it and doing it too.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> That 82W/mK for CLP must be a typo, since gallium from which it's made is only 50 W/mK. There is a little bit of indium in it (81.8 W/mK) but it's not the primary ingredient. Maybe the confusion comes from the indium value.
> Why are you asking specifically about the E5200? if you have one spare, just try to delid it, see what happens. Then you can add knowledge to the first post. If it's not spare, don't delid it


I only have one for my shed computer :-D next one down is an e2200 so would rather not ruin the E5200







I guess ill give it a whirl, like you said at least then we can add it to the OP and know for sure ;-)


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> I only have one for my shed computer :-D next one down is an e2200 so would rather not ruin the E5200
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess ill give it a whirl, like you said at least then we can add it to the OP and know for sure ;-)


You can grab an E5200 or similar on ebay for well under $10, I'd say I'd give you my E7200 but that's in my sisters machine now.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> You can grab an E5200 or similar on ebay for well under $10, I'd say I'd give you my E7200 but that's in my sisters machine now.


Haha thanks mate. Ill stop being a cheapskate and give it a go for the greater good of this thread  I can always use yhe e2200 in my shed rig haha Its just for music/google/file transfers/acces between odd hardrives from broken rigs etc just a work pig really. Doesnt matter if it gets viruses etc Not connected to main network permanently


----------



## knoober

Just remember to heat the solder up as much as toy can. I've seen YouTube videos and read where it kids right off if you heat it... Well not right off, but you get the drift. Heat melts the solder and saves your chip. I don't knowhhow hot yours runs, but mine will almost melt the solder on its own just by running, depending on exactly what temp the solder melts at!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Haha thanks mate. Ill stop being a cheapskate and give it a go for the greater good of this thread  I can always use yhe e2200 in my shed rig haha Its just for music/google/file transfers/acces between odd hardrives from broken rigs etc just a work pig really. Doesnt matter if it gets viruses etc Not connected to main network permanently


Yeah fair enough then. If it was me I'd have something nicer in there because I know I can get it cheap but that's just me








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Just remember to heat the solder up as much as toy can. I've seen YouTube videos and read where it kids right off if you heat it... Well not right off, but you get the drift. Heat melts the solder and saves your chip. I don't knowhhow hot yours runs, but mine will almost melt the solder on its own just by running, depending on exactly what temp the solder melts at!


The solder melts at ~157c according to Intel spec, they use it because it's a low temp melting so it allows to not damage the CPU's.

I've seen a de-lidded Q6600 before, as well as many other chips done. The easiest way (not the safest?) is to get a cigarette lighter and burn the top of it. till it pops off.

Not sure if the black rubber stuff is underneath on non paste'd chips however.


----------



## inedenimadam

Here is someone doing a solder delid

http://www.overclock.net/t/1285917/can-i-remove-my-i7-860-ihs-like-the-3770k-ivy-bridge#post_17790592


----------



## LandonAaron

Soldered delidding. Thats hardcore.


----------



## Malinkadink

Going to be delidding my 4670k soon, its at 4.2ghz 1.2v, just doing it for the temps, going to be using GELID Solutions GC-Extreme Thermal Compound for on die and on the IHS itself, would there really be any difference using CLU for the on die or no?


----------



## knoober

The OP has a good explanation of why liquid metal is good, it's in the spoiler headings. While Iam still waiting on my liquid metal, iI am confident that it will make a difference


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Going to be delidding my 4670k soon, its at 4.2ghz 1.2v, just doing it for the temps, going to be using GELID Solutions GC-Extreme Thermal Compound for on die and on the IHS itself, would there really be any difference using CLU for the on die or no?


There definitely would be a difference between using traditional pastes vs CLU on the die. For one, CLU has a higher thermal conductivity compared to TIMs and for two, CLU would not have a pump out effect over time like TIMs would. As other users have noted here, when using traditional TIMs, initial temperatures would be good, but would increase over months as the TIM gets squeezed out from the die area.


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> There definitely would be a difference between using traditional pastes vs CLU on the die. For one, CLU has a higher thermal conductivity compared to TIMs and for two, CLU would not have a pump out effect over time like TIMs would. As other users have noted here, when using traditional TIMs, initial temperatures would be good, but would increase over months as the TIM gets squeezed out from the die area.


So would it just be better to use CLU for the die and IHS too? As for spreading it, normally on the IHS i just let the heatsink spread it to avoid any air bubbles forming, would it be best to do the same for the die and let the IHS spread it, or is using the brush to apply a thin layer the more ideal thing to do?


----------



## Forceman

It's generally not worth using CLU between the IHS and heatsink, it doesn't make nearly as much difference there.


----------



## thymedtd

So today I decided to see how far I could get my 3570k chip in Aurora. Bumped my volts to 1.425 and started going up from my old 44 multiplier. Prime95 ran fine for some quick runs to get me to 4.8 (48 x 100 mhz blck) Testing seemed to be ok with temps ranging from 80c-90c hotter than I'd like but expected with an H80. Then in the last minute of my planned 10 minute run temps went from high 80's low 90's up to 103. I quickly shut off prime and rebooted to old setting. Dropped volts to 1.4 and 48 muti and ran with temps holding in 70c-80c for longer 15 minute run, much better. I go for a 49 muti and blue screen on prime starting workers. I come to this club because it seems you would all have the best experience with a few questions I have. I believe my quick temp jump is due to the low quality paste used between die and IHS and it hitting the point of not keeping up. My first question is do you agree with this assumption or do you have another explanation? Secondly would you recommend I go for a full water cooling setup or delid. I feel I am capable of deliding as i know the process can be destructive to my chip and have looked into the differing procedures quite a bit. I guess I'd like to know if my chip seems worth it to delid or if my cooling setup just needs to be updated and any other suggestions you guys may have. I'm confident you guys will steer me in the right direction, whatever it happens to be









Edit: Now that i've come so close to 5 ghz I'm hoping this chip is capable of getting me there, and if I join your club in the process well that's just another great achievement.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> So would it just be better to use CLU for the die and IHS too? As for spreading it, normally on the IHS i just let the heatsink spread it to avoid any air bubbles forming, would it be best to do the same for the die and let the IHS spread it, or is using the brush to apply a thin layer the more ideal thing to do?


As what @Forceman has said. If you're looking at it purely on terms of temperature, then yes, CLU on die and IHS would be the best. But when you factor in other things like ease of application(CLU still needs to be spread out), cost and compatibility between cooler base and CLU for the extra few degrees, it becomes much less worth it


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

When it comes to temps on Ivy Bridge and Haswell the IHS paste is definitely a limiting factor in the process for overclocking.
and if your looking for 5GHz, De-lidding and an application of CLU should definitely be in your future.

When it comes to cooling, it really depends on your budget.
Even a jump to a dual rad AIO cooler will make a nice difference, whether you go with the H105, H110i GT, SwiftTech H220x, etc.
But you can get some affordable kits from EK and others that would be great for cooling just the CPU, which can be expanded down the road if you wish.

I definitely recommend de-lidding in your case at minimum. But definitely take a look at your options for water-cooling, you easily have the ability to drop as much as 20-30C with the combination.


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> As what @Forceman has said. If you're looking at it purely on terms of temperature, then yes, CLU on die and IHS would be the best. But when you factor in other things like ease of application(CLU still needs to be spread out), cost and compatibility between cooler base and CLU for the extra few degrees, it becomes much less worth it


Okay got it, will use CLU on die, and normal paste on IHS. One last thing, im planning on buying a ps3 fat model and was going to do some maintenance on it, including changing the paste on the IHS and the die, would the same thing apply with using CLU on the die and normal paste on the IHS?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> The OP has a good explanation of why liquid metal is good, it's in the spoiler headings. While Iam still waiting on my liquid metal, iI am confident that it will make a difference


^ man has smarts








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Okay got it, will use CLU on die, and normal paste on IHS. One last thing, im planning on buying a ps3 fat model and was going to do some maintenance on it, including changing the paste on the IHS and the die, would the same thing apply with using CLU on the die and normal paste on the IHS?


I'm not so sure on that application. If the heat sink is aluminum then a big nono. However in terms of temps and normal operations it should work.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Okay got it, will use CLU on die, and normal paste on IHS. One last thing, im planning on buying a ps3 fat model and was going to do some maintenance on it, including changing the paste on the IHS and the die, would the same thing apply with using CLU on the die and normal paste on the IHS?


No experience with consoles so I cannot help you. Maybe you could read up on it. Main thing to take note of is CLU and aluminium is a big no no


----------



## knoober

I didn't realize I was in the Intel section! I got here by searching and never thought that check. Please excuse all my AMD based questions then guys!

Since you all have read this many of my posts though I'll key you know the end result. I still haven't gotten my CLP but I will be deliding. Even if amd has switched to pure indium as Intel has I stand to be sure if I delid. Here's my logic: I don't know for sure what's under the lid and can only assume what kind of thermal Conductivity it has, whereas I'd I move to the CLP then I know what is there a difference that I've used the best Ican find. Ev njust if it's pure indium I'm still breaking even and if it's something not quite as good, then I make a gain









Sorry again. I really didn't know I was in the Intel side!


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ^ man has smarts


Finally a little recognition!









Also in the liquid metal tim section you said to pm you with questions? Well can instead ask ya out here? What's the correct w/mK value for the CLU and CLP? And if you happen to know the values and what kind of solder is used on a soldered chip ( your best guess anyway, we have one page from Intel that says pure indium already, but if you have anything to add I'd be grayeful) ?

Thanks!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Finally a little recognition!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also in the liquid metal tim section you said to pm you with questions? Well can instead ask ya out here? What's the correct w/mK value for the CLU and CLP? And if you happen to know the values and what kind of solder is used on a soldered chip ( your best guess anyway, we have one page from Intel that says pure indium already, but if you have anything to add I'd be grayeful) ?
> 
> Thanks!


I used to know the w/mK for most thermal pastes, brain has started to slowly forget things. I think truthfully normal fluxless solder such as Sandy Bridge TIM will be the be all end all of TIM's.

Regarding your chip. I think nearly all AMD's are soldered, if you want to risk your chip then I wont hold you back to discover things for the rest of us







Just be careful and do it slowly.


----------



## knoober

You better believe it'll be slow! That's my best chip!







I'm confident though.... Kinda. How about a whole new category in the member section Phenom II x4!

There is a list of pastes in the OP so don't sweat it. I'd like to see a list and graph of the different solders though, that would settle this once and for all. For instance a tin/lead 50/50 shows a w/mK value of 50 (it has been pointed out though that this isn't tin/lead being used and is most likely pure indium for Intel and amd likely has comparable solder) while indium according to Intel is around 87 (Google shows 81.1). The thought here of course is that if it is a poor solder than I gain with the delid and Tim change and if it is indium then I "won't lose much" . I apologize if I'm repeating myself, I just thought I got have been unclear as to what I was asking

Long story short. I will tell about the results here if anyone cares to hear (this is the Intel section after all!) and I will make my own post about it in the Amd section as well. *looks for the mailman and hums jeopardy theme* just waiting for my liquid metal. ....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> You better believe it'll be slow! That's my best chip!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm confident though.... Kinda. How about a whole new category in the member section Phenom II x4!
> 
> There is a list of pastes in the OP so don't sweat it. I'd like to see a list and graph of the different solders though, that would settle this once and for all. For instance a tin/lead 50/50 shows a w/mK value of 50 (it has been pointed out though that this isn't tin/lead being used and is most likely pure indium for Intel and amd likely has comparable solder) while indium according to Intel is around 87 (Google shows 81.1). The thought here of course is that if it is a poor solder than I gain with the delid and Tim change and if it is indium then I "won't lose much" . I apologize if I'm repeating myself, I just thought I got have been unclear as to what I was asking
> 
> Long story short. I will tell about the results here if anyone cares to hear (this is the Intel section after all!) and I will make my own post about it in the Amd section as well. *looks for the mailman and hums jeopardy theme* just waiting for my liquid metal. ....


I'd like to know, maybe we can expand the group to AMD as well


----------



## JonnyMark

That first video of delidding and how fast it was.

I have not seen much cpu lapping going on, and how is that compared to delidding?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JonnyMark*
> 
> That first video of delidding and how fast it was.
> 
> I have not seen much cpu lapping going on, and how is that compared to delidding?


lapping nets you another few degrees difference.most don't bother with it


----------



## thymedtd

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> When it comes to temps on Ivy Bridge and Haswell the IHS paste is definitely a limiting factor in the process for overclocking.
> and if your looking for 5GHz, De-lidding and an application of CLU should definitely be in your future.
> 
> When it comes to cooling, it really depends on your budget.
> Even a jump to a dual rad AIO cooler will make a nice difference, whether you go with the H105, H110i GT, SwiftTech H220x, etc.
> But you can get some affordable kits from EK and others that would be great for cooling just the CPU, which can be expanded down the road if you wish.
> 
> I definitely recommend de-lidding in your case at minimum. But definitely take a look at your options for water-cooling, you easily have the ability to drop as much as 20-30C with the combination.


Well I figured it would be in my future, I'm also judging from that lack out others responses that most agree. I felt delidding would be my most beneficial/cheapest option however with the possibility of damage i figured I'd make sure others agree. It will be a short time until i perform the task so I'll wait for other responses/support before he operation. With pictures of the process and the start of a build log (rebuild?) of Aurora in a either new or heavily modified case soon to follow. Thanks meerkat


----------



## LandonAaron

I lapped mine just cause.b I am going to go bare die next just cause. An improvement of 3 degrees would make it worth it to me. Naked mount kit is only like $7.50.


----------



## vicyo

A few days ago I posted my former G3258 that i delidded and lapped. 65C on cinebench @ 4830MHz and 1.523V vcore with a custom AIO.

Lapping is as far as you can go before going naked, just like borderline pornography


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thymedtd*
> 
> Well I figured it would be in my future, I'm also judging from that lack out others responses that most agree. I felt delidding would be my most beneficial/cheapest option however with the possibility of damage i figured I'd make sure others agree. It will be a short time until i perform the task so I'll wait for other responses/support before he operation. With pictures of the process and the start of a build log (rebuild?) of Aurora in a either new or heavily modified case soon to follow. Thanks meerkat


As always, try better cooling first. At least then you can confirm that delidding is in order, as well as get some baselines that are not thermally bottlenecked by the cooler to compare to.


----------



## Brohem0th

I would like to state that Tcase for the 4690k/4790k is 72c and that any temperature over that can be considered an overtemp situation. I would also like to state that the sensor that typically reports core temp in programs like HWiNFO64 is actually they Tjunction sensor, which reads 5c over Tcase temp, so the actual, factual, keep it running as long as it would be at stock voltage and speed temperature is 77c as reported in HWiNFO64.

I've noticed some slight degradation of my chip, having run it over that temperature when validating 5Ghz and trying to get 4.9Ghz stable at 1.38v and 1.33v respectively; it will no longer do 4.8Ghz at 1.330v and now requires 1.335v to maintain that clockspeed across all programs, games, and possible scenarios.

So the TL;DR is that running your chips over 77c as reported by the coretemp sensors will degrade your chips, although if it's a momentary spike during a stress test it's not going to INSTAKILL your CPU. Just do everything you can to keep it under that temperature. I've only ran this 4690k over 77c for maybe an hour at most over its entire lifetime, and while the degradation is very minimal it is quantifiable.

Voltage really doesn't matter until you start climbing up above 1.45-1.55v, since even a very nice waterloop will have a hard time keeping it below 77c at max load at those voltages.

Just some food for thought. Cheers!

(It is worth noting that this CPU was literally drenched in my blood when I slipped and stabbed myself with the razor I was using to delid it, and was also warped to a noticeable degree. Whether that has had any effect on it, I cannot say, because it ran just fine for two months post-delid before presenting any degradation at all and I can only reasonably certainly tie it to the validation attempt I made at 5Ghz, as well as trying to get 4.9Ghz stable, since both of those things took place after delidding it but before it presented any degradation).

I knew I shouldn't have tried to run Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT's at 1.38v/5Ghz with a Hyper 212+ and two Phanteks F140HP's, even if it was delidded. I remember temps hitting ~95c during that test before causing the machine to automatically shutdown, although that being the only time I've even come near the 100c "max" operating temp of my CPU is certainly going to make me a lot more cautious when overclocking and stress testing in the future.


----------



## deepor

I was hoping that kind of degradation you describe would just be a one-time thing. I was imagining something like a line conducting electricity in the CPU getting its weaker fringe burned away from the 1.4V voltage and the heat, but when that's done and only the stronger areas of the line are left, while you need some more voltage than before, that's now stable and hopefully won't degrade as easily anymore.


----------



## Valgaur

I think that minuscule Vcore gain is negligible. Most likely some updates rolled through and stability changed a bit


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think that minuscule Vcore gain is negligible. Most likely some updates rolled through and stability changed a bit


I've spent the better part of this entire afternoon looking a bit more closely at my OC. Setting FIVR to Negative 6.0% has dropped my max load temps by 2-3c. Doing everything I can to get it under 80c max temps.

It is worth noting that I've gotten it stable at 4.8Ghz/1.300v again, but only for quick five-and-ten minute sessions of Prime95 v26.6. I'll hopefully have it a bit more dialed in here in the next hour or so.

Haven't had to pull the CMOS or clear the jumper yet, so I must be doing something right.


----------



## blaze2210

Here are a couple questions to anyone with a good amount of experience with CLP and delidding:

1) What can be used to remove CLP from the CPU die without messing it up? I'm not sure how tough that die is, and obviously prefer not to mar the surface of my $200+ CPU just to reapply the CLP layer.









2) Can anyone vouch for what CLP looks like under the IHS after about a year or so? Would it even need to be reapplied?

3) If it does need to be reapplied, how often? I've never found any sort of definitive answer on this.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Here are a couple questions to anyone with a good amount of experience with CLP and delidding:
> 
> 1) What can be used to remove CLP from the CPU die without messing it up? I'm not sure how tough that die is, and obviously prefer not to mar the surface of my $200+ CPU just to reapply the CLP layer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2) Can anyone vouch for what CLP looks like under the IHS after about a year or so? Would it even need to be reapplied?
> 
> 3) If it does need to be reapplied, how often? I've never found any sort of definitive answer on this.


I hear it's more difficult to remove CLP over CLU and I only have experience with CLU if that is of any relevance. I just use alcohol swabs to wipe as much as i can off until it's clean then use the coollabs cleaning kit to make doubly sure there isn't any residue left. Can't answer 2 or 3 since I've only just applied


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> I hear it's more difficult to remove CLP over CLU and I only have experience with CLU if that is of any relevance. I just use alcohol swabs to wipe as much as i can off until it's clean then use the coollabs cleaning kit to make doubly sure there isn't any residue left. Can't answer 2 or 3 since I've only just applied


I've seen that same thing mentioned also, that CLU comes off easier than CLP, but haven't come across any details on what can be used on the die itself. I know that alcohol can be used on there, since I used my 91% to get the stock TIM off when I first delidded. My concern is that if the CLP is as difficult to remove as people seem to make it out to be, then I might need something better than a Q-tip or alcohol pad to get it off. There's a scrub pad that came with the CLP, but unless I'm wrong, it's way too abrasive to use on the die itself.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I've seen that same thing mentioned also, that CLU comes off easier than CLP, but haven't come across any details on what can be used on the die itself. I know that alcohol can be used on there, since I used my 91% to get the stock TIM off when I first delidded. My concern is that if the CLP is as difficult to remove as people seem to make it out to be, then I might need something better than a Q-tip or alcohol pad to get it off. There's a scrub pad that came with the CLP, but unless I'm wrong, it's way too abrasive to use on the die itself.


Yeah, i didnt use the pad as well. maybe you could try putting a few drop of alcohol on the die, let it soak into the CLP for a few minutes, then use a q-tip or alcohol swab and gently wipe. i definitely didn't apply pressure.just folded and alcohol swab in half and gently wiped away the CLU. No scratches so far


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Yeah, i didnt use the pad as well. maybe you could try putting a few drop of alcohol on the die, let it soak into the CLP for a few minutes, then use a q-tip or alcohol swab and gently wipe. i definitely didn't apply pressure.just folded and alcohol swab in half and gently wiped away the CLU. No scratches so far


That's good info to have, thanks! I'm really not looking forward to changing it out, but I'm way too curious at this point. I just really want to have more info before I get into it. When I do pull it apart, I'll make sure to take pics along the way. That way, the information will finally be available. I know that it's been close to a year since I delidded my CPU, so that should be a good example of what happens to it over time.


----------



## Valgaur

In regards to cleaning the physical die, it's a layer of glass that protects the silicon, which cleans up pretty nicely usually. Normal means of cleaning have always worked for myself, others use alcohol and such, most ways work, just be careful is all.









I would say and recommend about every 6 months, but I've seen upwards of a year and its still perfectly fine. Don't worry about it until your temps noticeably move, like 5-10C area.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> In regards to cleaning the physical die, it's a layer of glass that protects the silicon, which cleans up pretty nicely usually. Normal means of cleaning have always worked for myself, others use alcohol and such, most ways work, just be careful is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would say and recommend about every 6 months, but I've seen upwards of a year and its still perfectly fine. Don't worry about it until your temps noticeably move, like 5-10C area.


So that glass layer on the die should do a decent job of keeping itself from getting too dirty/messed up?


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Here are a couple questions to anyone with a good amount of experience with CLP and delidding:
> 
> 1) What can be used to remove CLP from the CPU die without messing it up? I'm not sure how tough that die is, and obviously prefer not to mar the surface of my $200+ CPU just to reapply the CLP layer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2) Can anyone vouch for what CLP looks like under the IHS after about a year or so? Would it even need to be reapplied?
> 
> 3) If it does need to be reapplied, how often? I've never found any sort of definitive answer on this.


Not sure about CLP, I use the CLU, but Isopropyl alcohol, either 91%+ or better yet anhydrous, will put the stuff into suspension (turns kinda black too), and just lifts that stuff off. I haven't examined it, but I can see it in there, kinda like micro-balls, so just make sure you control your wipes, and don't get the black silt-like stuff in suspension on anything. Also, make sure you start out with alcohol, as I tried on one of the laptops to wipe the bulk of it off first, and actually marred the silicon in a way that won't come off. On the others, I just did it with the alcohol, and no marks were left at all.

DO NOT USE THE ALCOHOL WIPE THAT COMES WITH THE CLU! *IT'S 70%*, AND WILL LEAVE HEAVY RESIDUE! (That wipe is better suited to just toss in your first-aid kit).


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Not sure about CLP, I use the CLU, but Isopropyl alcohol, either 91%+ or better yet anhydrous, will put the stuff into suspension (turns kinda black too), and just lifts that stuff off. I haven't examined it, but I can see it in there, kinda like micro-balls, so just make sure you control your wipes, and don't get the black silt-like stuff in suspension on anything. Also, make sure you start out with alcohol, as I tried on one of the laptops to wipe the bulk of it off first, and actually marred the silicon in a way that won't come off. On the others, I just did it with the alcohol, and no marks were left at all.
> 
> DO NOT USE THE ALCOHOL WIPE THAT COMES WITH THE CLU! *IT'S 70%*, AND WILL LEAVE HEAVY RESIDUE! (That wipe is better suited to just toss in your first-aid kit).


Yeah, I only use 91% for my PC purposes. Since it's so cheap, why not go with the higher one?







That's all awesome information, especially making sure to not try wiping it off first, I appreciate that heads-up. I figured there was some reason why I didn't use that alcohol pad that came with the CLP, but didn't realize it was only 70% - also good to know.









How long had you been using the CLU before you replaced it, and was it noticeably deteriorated at all?


----------



## Tracti

Is it worth delidding a CPU if you only use a close circuit cooler? I have a nepton 280 and I have thought about delidding my processor to see how much I could push it. As is I can push my 4930k to 4.7G on a cool night without getting it above 60, it seems the mos gets hotter. Any advice would be great


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tracti*
> 
> Is it worth delidding a CPU if you only use a close circuit cooler? I have a nepton 280 and I have thought about delidding my processor to see how much I could push it. As is I can push my 4930k to 4.7G on a cool night without getting it above 60, it seems the mos gets hotter. Any advice would be great


You can't delid a 4930k. The IHS is soldered onto the top of the chip and there is nothing to improve there. This thread is about the later LGA1155 socket CPUs and the LGA1150 socket CPUs. Those use paste instead of solder.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tracti*
> 
> Is it worth delidding a CPU if you only use a close circuit cooler? I have a nepton 280 and I have thought about delidding my processor to see how much I could push it. As is I can push my 4930k to 4.7G on a cool night without getting it above 60, it seems the mos gets hotter. Any advice would be great


Yep, definitely. I'm running an H100i with my delidded 4670K.









EDIT: If your CPU _can_ be delidded, that is.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> I hear it's more difficult to remove CLP over CLU and I only have experience with CLU if that is of any relevance. I just use alcohol swabs to wipe as much as i can off until it's clean then use the coollabs cleaning kit to make doubly sure there isn't any residue left. Can't answer 2 or 3 since I've only just applied


This, it's the sort of thing that you apply and leave AFAIK.

Mines been CLP'd under the die for exactly 2 and a half years now, don't think it's ever coming off..

CLU is easy to remove, shouldn't stick at all and you just wipe it off with the provided cloths, or 99% isopropyl alcohol, or metho if that's all you can get (used Metho for years on CPU's and GPU's now).

But even CLU should just stay on.









And yes I will get photos of it next time it's out, it's set so hard the IHS can't be moved anymore and it's actually set one way a bit too far but it still lines up and works so if it ain't broke don't fix it.


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> This, it's the sort of thing that you apply and leave AFAIK.
> 
> Mines been CLP'd under the die for exactly 2 and a half years now, don't think it's ever coming off..
> 
> CLU is easy to remove, shouldn't stick at all and you just wipe it off with the provided cloths, or 99% isopropyl alcohol, or metho if that's all you can get (used Metho for years on CPU's and GPU's now).
> 
> But even CLU should just stay on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And yes I will get photos of it next time it's out, it's set so hard the IHS can't be moved anymore and it's actually set one way a bit too far but it still lines up and works so if it ain't broke don't fix it.


Will someone help me clear up the difference between die and IHS please? I've seen the terms used almost interchangeably before and here is another example of why I'm not sure. I thought the die was under the IHS, but up here he says he's had "CLU under the die " or something close. I've ever read posts suggesting lapping the die. Just for extra smart guys like me can anyone field this one? Thanks?

BTW Matt-Matt I'm not trying to nitpick what you said, I know what you mean. It's just a good example of why I'm confused


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Will someone help me clear up the difference between die and IHS please? I've seen the terms used almost interchangeably before and here is another example of why I'm not sure. I thought the die was under the IHS, but up here he says he's had "CLU under the die " or something close. I've ever read posts suggesting lapping the die. Just for extra smart guys like me can anyone field this one? Thanks?
> 
> BTW Matt-Matt I'm not trying to nitpick what you said, I know what you mean. It's just a good example of why I'm confused


You understood things right. The IHS is that metal cap that's glued onto the CPU and is covering the die. What you quoted was a mistake and should have been "under the IHS".

The thing you describe about lapping a die, that has to be a super stupid idea. The thing is flat and looks perfectly polished by itself, so lapping makes no sense.

*EDIT:* another thing: IHS = "Integrated Heat-Spreader"


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> In regards to cleaning the physical die, it's a layer of glass that protects the silicon, which cleans up pretty nicely usually. Normal means of cleaning have always worked for myself, others use alcohol and such, most ways work, just be careful is all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would say and recommend about every 6 months, but I've seen upwards of a year and its still perfectly fine. Don't worry about it until your temps noticeably move, like 5-10C area.


I have a 3570K delidded with CLU and then I gave it to a friend, haven't touched in 2+ years and temps are still under 55 ish for daily use, idles around 30. So I'm hoping to never do that chip again, what about the lifespan of it, think it will REQUIRE a redo ever?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> So that glass layer on the die should do a decent job of keeping itself from getting too dirty/messed up?


Nah that should be all good








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> I have a 3570K delidded with CLU and then I gave it to a friend, haven't touched in 2+ years and temps are still under 55 ish for daily use, idles around 30. So I'm hoping to never do that chip again, what about the lifespan of it, think it will REQUIRE a redo ever?


Ummmm, its hard to say exactly as we haven't had CLU/P on any chips longer than 3 years really. I would think it should be fine though, only chnage if you notice temps really moving around.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> *Will someone help me clear up the difference between die and IHS please?* I've seen the terms used almost interchangeably before and here is another example of why I'm not sure. I thought the die was under the IHS, but up here he says he's had "CLU under the die " or something close. I've ever read posts suggesting lapping the die. Just for extra smart guys like me can anyone field this one? Thanks?
> 
> BTW Matt-Matt I'm not trying to nitpick what you said, I know what you mean. It's just a good example of why I'm confused


This should clear that up for you:


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> So that glass layer on the die should do a decent job of keeping itself from getting too dirty/messed up?
> 
> 
> 
> Nah that should be all good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> I have a 3570K delidded with CLU and then I gave it to a friend, haven't touched in 2+ years and temps are still under 55 ish for daily use, idles around 30. So I'm hoping to never do that chip again, what about the lifespan of it, think it will REQUIRE a redo ever?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ummmm, its hard to say exactly as we haven't had CLU/P on any chips longer than 3 years really. I would think it should be fine though, only chnage if you notice temps really moving around.
Click to expand...

Long time not posting here but:

I have had my 3570k delidded basically since I got it. In addition to another 3570k. Both have had CLP on it since they were delidded and I have not changed the first one's CLP since then. I did change the second one about 2 weeks ago and honestly, the CLP still looked fine. The places where it wasn't heated by the cores kind of hardened, but the parts where it was heated still had some fluidity to it. I wouldn't recommend changing it unless temps changes as Valgaur has mentioned.

Just remember that CLU is a bit thicker and will be physically different than CLP. If you do try to fix it, probably take another step and sand that baby down to a mirror finish. Just remember if you haven't done it in a while to not spill some on the capacitors.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Long time not posting here but:
> 
> I have had my 3570k delidded basically since I got it. In addition to another 3570k. Both have had CLP on it since they were delidded and I have not changed the first one's CLP since then. I did change the second one about 2 weeks ago and honestly, the CLP still looked fine. The places where it wasn't heated by the cores kind of hardened, but the parts where it was heated still had some fluidity to it. I wouldn't recommend changing it unless temps changes as Valgaur has mentioned.
> 
> Just remember that CLU is a bit thicker and will be physically different than CLP. If you do try to fix it, probably take another step and sand that baby down to a mirror finish. Just remember if you haven't done it in a while to not spill some on the capacitors.


Exactly the type of info I was looking for!! Thanks for making a reappearance for that!









My temps haven't risen like that, so it would seem that I don't need to swap out the CLP then. Very good to know, I wasn't really looking forward to doing that again.


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> This should clear that up for you:


Definitely clears it up. The posts I read (and oddly enough there were more than 1) said "lap the die" which I figured I'd ask before messing around with the innards. Delidding is adventurous enough for me! Thanks for the help


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Definitely clears it up. The posts I read (and oddly enough there were more than 1) said "lap the die" which I figured I'd ask before messing around with the innards. Delidding is adventurous enough for me! Thanks for the help


Yeah, people that don't bother to find/use the proper terms for things get on my nerves. Using the proper terms helps other people understand what you're talking about. Glad I could help!


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Long time not posting here but:
> 
> I have had my 3570k delidded basically since I got it. In addition to another 3570k. Both have had CLP on it since they were delidded and I have not changed the first one's CLP since then. I did change the second one about 2 weeks ago and honestly, the CLP still looked fine. The places where it wasn't heated by the cores kind of hardened, but the parts where it was heated still had some fluidity to it. I wouldn't recommend changing it unless temps changes as Valgaur has mentioned.
> 
> Just remember that CLU is a bit thicker and will be physically different than CLP. If you do try to fix it, probably take another step and sand that baby down to a mirror finish. Just remember if you haven't done it in a while to not spill some on the capacitors.
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly the type of info I was looking for!! Thanks for making a reappearance for that!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My temps haven't risen like that, so it would seem that I don't need to swap out the CLP then. Very good to know, I wasn't really looking forward to doing that again.
Click to expand...

You're very welcome. I would only change it by the way in the case if it reaches about a 10%-15% increase in temperature. This way you have a higher chance of assuming it is the seating of the CPU rather than some external measure like hotter ambient.

In addition to that "lapping the die", how can you lap a die? I'm just wondering because if you lap the die, you're effectively hurting the actual processor. I mean, you can try to get a more mirror finish of the clear coat, but how does this work?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> You're very welcome. I would only change it by the way in the case if it reaches about a 10%-15% increase in temperature. This way you have a higher chance of assuming it is the seating of the CPU rather than some external measure like hotter ambient.
> 
> In addition to that "lapping the die", how can you lap a die? I'm just wondering because if you lap the die, you're effectively hurting the actual processor. I mean, you can try to get a more mirror finish of the clear coat, but how does this work?


Makes sense. One the "die lapping", I'm not too sure on how that would work out either. I wouldn't be able to take sandpaper to that part of the CPU, it's entirely too shiny for me to want to mess up.


----------



## Brohem0th

So I've been playing around with FIVR Switching Frequency on my AsRock H87 Fatal1ty Edition motherboard, and I've noticed that adding 5.0% to it (maximum is 6.0%) has gotten me stable at (slightly) lower voltages than what it would normally take otherwise.

Anyone have any more feedback on what that actually does and whether or not I should be playing around with it? I will note that raising it does have an effect on temperatures, lowering it does the opposite, although it's a relatively small (1-3c) change.

I haven't been able to find any information on it on the internet, anywhere. At least not to my standards.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> So I've been playing around with FIVR Switching Frequency on my AsRock H87 Fatal1ty Edition motherboard, and I've noticed that adding 5.0% to it (maximum is 6.0%) has gotten me stable at (slightly) lower voltages than what it would normally take otherwise.
> 
> Anyone have any more feedback on what that actually does and whether or not I should be playing around with it? I will note that raising it does have an effect on temperatures, lowering it does the opposite, although it's a relatively small (1-3c) change.
> 
> I haven't been able to find any information on it on the internet, anywhere. At least not to my standards.


The FIVR (Fully Integrated Voltage Regulator) is what is in charge of the CPU switching in and out of idle. I don't have anything phrased like that on my board, but I think it's similar to the VRM Switching Frequency option that I do have. On my board, that Switching Frequency is supposed to deliver cleaner power, and help to reduce vdroop (according to a couple people here on OCN). Unfortunately, I haven't had an AsRock board, so I don't really know for sure if these are the same thing.

Thread where I found some info on VRM Switching Frequency: http://www.overclock.net/t/1390384/vrm-frequency-making-a-cpu-faster/0_20


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> The FIVR (Fully Integrated Voltage Regulator) is what is in charge of the CPU switching in and out of idle. I don't have anything phrased like that on my board, but I think it's similar to the VRM Switching Frequency option that I do have. On my board, that Switching Frequency is supposed to deliver cleaner power, and help to reduce vdroop (according to a couple people here on OCN). Unfortunately, I haven't had an AsRock board, so I don't really know for sure if these are the same thing.
> 
> Thread where I found some info on VRM Switching Frequency: http://www.overclock.net/t/1390384/vrm-frequency-making-a-cpu-faster/0_20


Ah, thanks. Looks like it just cleans the power up a bit more at the expense of a bit more heat.

At any rate, this board has reached the limit of its effectiveness for me. It's got a fair bit of Vdroop, especially for the VCCIN, and I'll need to get a new board soon if I want to take my chip (more likely another one) any further.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Ah, thanks. Looks like it just cleans the power up a bit more at the expense of a bit more heat.
> 
> At any rate, this board has reached the limit of its effectiveness for me. It's got a fair bit of Vdroop, especially for the VCCIN, and I'll need to get a new board soon if I want to take my chip (more likely another one) any further.


Yep, no worries.







That's exactly what I got out of all the explanations as well - slightly cleaner power delivery, less vdroop, slightly more heat. I've basically reached the limits of what my components can do also. So really, until I get new stuff, there isn't really much more I can do. That is, unless I can find some good information on secondary and tertiary memory timings, specifically pertaining to overclocking/optimizing.


----------



## Brohem0th

My chip is driving me insane. It was stable at 4.8Ghz/1.300v for literally months, then all of a sudden it wasn't anymore. Started BSOD'ing when I would stream and play a resource-intensive game. So I bumped it up to 1.325v, and it was stable about 95% of the time. But to get it absolutely stable at that speed I have to run it at 1.36v, which (even delidded) is starting to get into the insane category for a Hyper 212+ with a pair of 140mm HP Phanteks mounted to it.

Running the Handbrake benchmarking utility I got from overclock.net, it'll pass a couple runs at 1.35v, but sometimes it'll crash on the first run, sometimes it'll crash on the tenth run.... It's infuriating. My temps aren't even breaking 80c, it's stable in-game, but I can't get it to pass a full night of Handbrake encodes to save my life. I even tried dumping VCCIN into it, a whole 2.1v, but the Vdroop on my board was insane, nearly a full .1v. It's not my Uncore multi either, I have that set to 34 and I'm still giving it a full 1.000v, so I know that it's stable....


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> My chip is driving me insane. It was stable at 4.8Ghz/1.300v for literally months, then all of a sudden it wasn't anymore. Started BSOD'ing when I would stream and play a resource-intensive game. So I bumped it up to 1.325v, and it was stable about 95% of the time. But to get it absolutely stable at that speed I have to run it at 1.36v, which (even delidded) is starting to get into the insane category for a Hyper 212+ with a pair of 140mm HP Phanteks mounted to it.
> 
> Running the Handbrake benchmarking utility I got from overclock.net, it'll pass a couple runs at 1.35v, but sometimes it'll crash on the first run, sometimes it'll crash on the tenth run.... It's infuriating. My temps aren't even breaking 80c, it's stable in-game, but I can't get it to pass a full night of Handbrake encodes to save my life. I even tried dumping VCCIN into it, a whole 2.1v, but the Vdroop on my board was insane, nearly a full .1v. It's not my Uncore multi either, I have that set to 34 and I'm still giving it a full 1.000v, so I know that it's stable....


What was the BSOD code? If it was 0x101, then you need Input/VCCIN voltage; if it's a 0x124 BSOD, then you need vcore.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> What was the BSOD code? If it was 0x101, then you need Input/VCCIN voltage; if it's a 0x124 BSOD, then you need vcore.


It's been a 0x101 Every.Single.Friggin.Time.

What's the highest I should run it at? I've gone as high as 2.1, not sure if it would be safe to go much further.

I guess I could try 2.2v, any recommendations? I really don't want to keep feeding my chip more Vcore if it doesn't need it. My temps have been stellar in real-world scenarios (55-65c in games, 75-80c in non-synthetic benchmarks, 80-85c in synthetics) so if it's still a VCCIN thing I'm really going to be pissed.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> It's been a 0x101 Every.Single.Friggin.Time.
> 
> What's the highest I should run it at? I've gone as high as 2.1, not sure if it would be safe to go much further.
> 
> I guess I could try 2.2v, any recommendations? I really don't want to keep feeding my chip more Vcore if it doesn't need it. My temps have been stellar in real-world scenarios (55-65c in games, 75-80c in non-synthetic benchmarks, 80-85c in synthetics) so if it's still a VCCIN thing I'm really going to be pissed.


What are your current settings?

Input/VCCIN:
Core Multi:
VID (what you set in BIOS):
Cache Multi:
Cache voltage:


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> What are your current settings?
> 
> Input/VCCIN:
> Core Multi:
> VID (what you set in BIOS):
> Cache Multi:
> Cache voltage:


2.100v
48
1.350v
34
1.000v


----------



## Brohem0th

It's gotta be my board. Even at 2.15v for my VCCIN it's still throwing 0x101 BSOD and won't even pass one loop of Handbrake, even though my temps were within sane benchmarking limits (highest core temp was 81c).

There's still Vdroop (drops to 2.112v VCCIN, posts at 2.208v) no matter what settings I change, and 0.05v of Vdroop on VCCIN is, to put it mildly, freakin' ridiculous. Oh well. I'll stick with 4.7Ghz/1.300v (which is stable all day long at 1.950v VCCIN, which doesn't dip below 1.928v) until I can get a new board and an NH-D15 as well. Still quite the bummer though, after everything I'd heard about how fragile Haswell is, my board is the component that's beginning to fail first.

Don't think I'll be buying AsRock again - I know I have a budget board, but this is unacceptable.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> It's gotta be my board. Even at 2.15v for my VCCIN it's still throwing 0x101 BSOD and won't even pass one loop of Handbrake, even though my temps were within sane benchmarking limits (highest core temp was 81c).
> 
> There's still Vdroop (drops to 2.112v VCCIN, posts at 2.208v) no matter what settings I change, and 0.05v of Vdroop on VCCIN is, to put it mildly, freakin' ridiculous. Oh well. I'll stick with 4.7Ghz/1.300v (which is stable all day long at 1.950v VCCIN, which doesn't dip below 1.928v) until I can get a new board and an NH-D15 as well. Still quite the bummer though, after everything I'd heard about how fragile Haswell is, my board is the component that's beginning to fail first.
> 
> Don't think I'll be buying AsRock again - I know I have a budget board, but this is unacceptable.


Try backing the VCCIN down to ~1.98 - 1.99. I have experienced a few BSODs that were caused by me going a bit crazy with the VCCIN, and backing it off a bit helped me out. Do you have any LLC settings on that board? Also, you might try bumping that cache voltage to like 1.15v.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Try backing the VCCIN down to ~1.98 - 1.99. I have experienced a few BSODs that were caused by me going a bit crazy with the VCCIN, and backing it off a bit helped me out. Do you have any LLC settings on that board? Also, you might try bumping that cache voltage to like 1.15v.


I'll try that, but I doubt it would help. I've played around with all the different LLC settings, nothing seems to help. I'm going to bed, I'll update this tomorrow. Thanks for all your help though.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I'll try that, but I doubt it would help. I've played around with all the different LLC settings, nothing seems to help. I'm going to bed, I'll update this tomorrow. Thanks for all your help though.


Did you make sure things still run fine if you go down with the multiplier? Maybe a crash destroyed the contents of some important file and that's where your current crashes come from.

There's a tool in Windows 7 and 8 that can check files belonging to Windows and replace them from a copy of the originals. It's run from an Admin command prompt window with this command:

sfc /scannow

You should also first run the normal error checking on drive C:. Also, doing this on a completely stable system would be a good idea.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Did you make sure things still run fine if you go down with the multiplier? Maybe a crash destroyed the contents of some important file and that's where your current crashes come from.
> 
> There's a tool in Windows 7 and 8 that can check files belonging to Windows and replace them from a copy of the originals. It's run from an Admin command prompt window with this command:
> 
> sfc /scannow
> 
> You should also first run the normal error checking on drive C:. Also, doing this on a completely stable system would be a good idea.


I've got Tweaking installed on my computer and about two years of paid IT experience - yes, I know what the sfc command is. My load is fine.

If I knock it back down to 4.7Ghz/1.300v/1.950v VCCIN it runs like a dream. It'll pass Handbrake encodes at those settings for 12 hours straight, won't even break 72c on my hottest core doing it, and the Vdroop on my VCCIN is practically negligible; the lowest it will hit is 1.928v, and that's with CPU LLC enabled (My motherboard is the AsRock H87 Fatal1ty Edition, it's a budget board, there are no multiple LLC settings, it's either on or off).

I bought a budget board and found out the hard way that it'll limit your OC's once you start getting into the really high end. 4.8Ghz is stable in-game at 1.34v Vcore/2.050v VCCIN but I can't stream at those settings even if I use the Nvidia codec in OBS, and it won't even think about passing a Handbrake loop until I start pushing 1.36v Vcore/2.150v VCCIN and even then it might only pass one loop since the Vdroop on that high of a VCCIN on this board is just stupidly high. It drops below 2.1v. That's completely unacceptable, but I got what I paid 110$ for.

I'm just going to accept the fact that my board sucks for anything beyond modest overclocking (I say modest, but in reality I'm pushing this chip pretty far beyond stock and should be, and admittedly am, happy with what I have) and leave it at 4.7Ghz until I can afford a Gigabyte Z97X SOC and an NH-D15/NZXT x61. Even a small jump from 100Mhz to 103Mhz on my BCLK would put me at nearly 4.85Ghz, and if I could manage 105Mhz I would be within spitting distance of the 5Ghz club, on air, with a Hyper 212+.

Now if only I could find a way to software volt-mod an Asus DirectCUII GTX 780 B1 revision.... stupid Asus, making awesome GPU's that you can't voltmod without doing hardware modifications to them. I've spent better than 100 hours tuning and researching and benchmarking my 4690k. I've easily spent double that amount of time trying to find a way to do that with my 780 that didn't involve me setting my system clock back nearly two full years. At this point I'm ready to just pick up the soldering iron and get my hands dirty.

I digress. Than you for the suggestion, really, but that's not the issue here. Me being a cheapskate is.


----------



## Ceadderman

I try to avoid hardware named after gamers. I mean these guys are gamers not overclockers.









Oh they might dabble a bit. Probably have a system at home with a pretty nice clock running, but manufacturers have a bad habit of taking the top hardware from the middle tier of their catalog and slapping a gamer's tag on it.

I get friends all the the who rifle through my issues of PCGamer an go "Wow really want that new XLR8 ..." just cause it has Lete in the name an they've identified Lete to gaming. CoolerMaster used to be a BIG offender of this practice with their PSU line. PNY an ASRock are IMHO middle of the road hardware providers who have to compete or lose money. So I get it, but it doesn't make it right.

Didn't ASUS parent/own ASRock? Wonder if they still do.

~Ceadder


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I try to avoid hardware named after gamers. I mean these guys are gamers not overclockers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh they might dabble a bit. Probably have a system at home with a pretty nice clock running, but manufacturers have a bad habit of taking the top hardware from the middle tier of their catalog and slapping a gamer's tag on it.
> 
> I get friends all the the who rifle through my issues of PCGamer an go "Wow really want that new XLR8 ..." just cause it has Lete in the name an they've identified Lete to gaming. CoolerMaster used to be a BIG offender of this practice with their PSU line. PNY an ASRock are IMHO middle of the road hardware providers who have to compete or lose money. So I get it, but it doesn't make it right.
> 
> Didn't ASUS parent/own ASRock? Wonder if they still do.
> 
> ~Ceadder


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASRock

Asus used to own ASRock but a company called Pegatron bought them and owns them since 2010.


----------



## FloofyFox

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASRock
> 
> Asus used to own ASRock but a company called Pegatron bought them and owns them since 2010.


Quote:


> In January 2008, ASUS began a major restructuring of its operations, splitting into three independent companies: ASUS (focused on applied first-party branded computers and electronics); Pegatron (focused on OEM manufacturing of motherboards and components); and Unihan Corporation (focused on non-PC manufacturing such as cases and molding). [Wikipedia: Asus]


http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/hardware/151590/asus-splits-into-three

So it looks like Asus still owns ASRock in some sort of form or another, just under a different name.


----------



## Ceadderman

Well that question was put to bed pretty quickly. +Rep gais!









~Ceadder


----------



## alancsalt

Big arguments over that, and what constitutes "related".

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/asrock-and-asus-mythbust.151469/


----------



## El Media Vida

Hi guys, it's possible do delid a Architecture-E CPUs?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Hi guys, it's possible do delid a Architecture-E CPUs?


I have no idea what you are asking.

If it has anything to do with deliding a lga 2011 cpu then Dont do it. They are soldered already.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Hi guys, it's possible do delid a Architecture-E CPUs?


Yes, and no. They are soldered on, so the process is much riskier, and nowhere near as beneficial as with the mainstream processors. You will likely get the same or worse temps unless you go completely naked, which might not net you any gains either.

You have to break the rubber glue with a blade, then super heat the spreader, then remove the rest of the solder. The juice is not worth the squeeze.


----------



## Swag

Actually, delidding a soldered CPU is not very difficult.

The main methods would be to stick 2 pieces of blade as well as you can through the solder on opposite sides and use a heat gun to heat the top of it. The bending caused by the blades will cause the IHS to fling upwards as the solder melts and thus releasing the connection from the CPU.

Or you can use gravity and a heat gun. Turn it upside down and run the heat gun around the IHS until the solder starts melting and it will fall down.

The temperature drops, I am not familiar with the results of those types. So if you want to try, you definitely can.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> Actually, delidding a soldered CPU is not very difficult.
> 
> The main methods would be to stick 2 pieces of blade as well as you can through the solder on opposite sides and use a heat gun to heat the top of it. The bending caused by the blades will cause the IHS to fling upwards as the solder melts and thus releasing the connection from the CPU.
> 
> Or you can use gravity and a heat gun. Turn it upside down and run the heat gun around the IHS until the solder starts melting and it will fall down.
> 
> The temperature drops, I am not familiar with the results of those types. So if you want to try, you definitely can.


My understanding is that if you're going to be delidding a soldered CPU, then you'd be better off running bare die, as no TIM is going to compare to that solder.


----------



## madmeatballs

I get 43c idle on 20-21c ambient with my 4790k on xmp profile for 2400mhz ram 4.4GHz on 1.198v. Is this a delid candidate? I already ordered CLU. Whats worst is my ambient goes up to 30c and I get 53-58c idle lol


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> I get 43c idle on 20-21c ambient with my 4790k on xmp profile for 2400mhz ram 4.4GHz on 1.198v. Is this a delid candidate? I already ordered CLU. Whats worst is my ambient goes up to 30c and I get 53-58c idle lol


Delidding will definitely drop those temps for you.


----------



## madmeatballs

What do you guys use to bond the ihs again? I meant replacement for the silicone thingy.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> What do you guys use to bond the ihs again? I meant replacement for the silicone thingy.


Nothing! Just that normal bracket with the lever that's around the socket of the motherboard. That will hold the IHS firmly in place.

The only "problem" is that closing the bracket might shift the IHS around a little, but being careful and pushing against the IHS with a finger, it's possible to close it without it moving.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> What do you guys use to bond the ihs again? I meant replacement for the silicone thingy.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Nothing! Just that normal bracket with the lever that's around the socket of the motherboard. That will hold the IHS firmly in place.
> 
> The only "problem" is that closing the bracket might shift the IHS around a little, but being careful and pushing against the IHS with a finger, it's possible to close it without it moving.


As deepor has said, nothing.
Another things i've read is to put the IHS slightly higher than normal since it will slide down when tightening the retention bracket


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> As deepor has said, nothing.
> Another things i've read is to put the IHS slightly higher than normal since it will slide down when tightening the retention bracket


Yep, else you get what I've got.

Also to note that CLU will make the IHS bond to the core over time.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yep, else you get what I've got.
> 
> Also to note that CLU will make the IHS bond to the core over time.


Really?I thought that was only for CLP? and even then it was for areas that aren't heated up enough


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Really?I thought that was only for CLP? and even then it was for areas that aren't heated up enough


My bad, CLP is what I used. I haven't tried heating it, but I'm not sure how effective that would be anyway.


----------



## knoober

Is it a problem for the core to bond with the ihs over time though? Does the tim "wear out"? I understand reapplication of other tims due to drying out is necessary, but clu and clp mare a different breed right? Basically the only info I have on it though is from a few days back in this thread where there was discussion about how long the tim would last. It seems to me that by the the you really need to reapply, better procs will have been invented







UT I didn't read all that close.

BTW, real cliffhanger here, I'll be testing my rebuilt system in a few days here... Then testing again after I delid *drumroll please* my phenom ii! Then I'll tell you for sure if I see any differences in temp) (using CLP) . And I'll keep my fingers crossed to not handicap my chip. I have delided a soldered Intel before, (but I never used it.... Was just practicing on old procs I had laying around) but I'm still nervous about bending the pins on my chip (if you don't know what I'm talking about, amd has the contact pins on the CPU, not in the mobo)


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yep, else you get what I've got.
> 
> Also to note that CLU will make the IHS bond to the core over time.


Over what amount of time does this bonding happen with CLP? I had CLP on my CPU die for the last year, and just opened it up a couple days ago, and it wasn't bonded at all - still liquid. Are you speaking from personal experience here?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Is it a problem for the core to bond with the ihs over time though? Does the tim "wear out"? I understand reapplication of other tims due to drying out is necessary, but clu and clp mare a different breed right? Basically the only info I have on it though is from a few days back in this thread where there was discussion about how long the tim would last. It seems to me that by the the you really need to reapply, better procs will have been invented
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> UT I didn't read all that close.
> 
> BTW, real cliffhanger here, I'll be testing my rebuilt system in a few days here... Then testing again after I delid *drumroll please* my phenom ii! Then I'll tell you for sure if I see any differences in temp) (using CLP) . And I'll keep my fingers crossed to not handicap my chip. I have delided a soldered Intel before, (but I never used it.... Was just practicing on old procs I had laying around) but I'm still nervous about bending the pins on my chip (if you don't know what I'm talking about, amd has the contact pins on the CPU, not in the mobo)


In my personal experience so far, when I removed the IHS after delidding about a year ago, it was still liquid. Make sure you don't just try wiping it up, make sure the q-tip (or whatever you're using to clean it) is wet with 91% Alcohol. Otherwise, it just smears around and becomes a pain.


----------



## akhilv1

OCN name: akhilv1
CPU: i5-4690k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: 300 mhZ
OC after delid: 5000 mhZ
Temp drops: 20C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/xcncjr


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *akhilv1*
> 
> OCN name: akhilv1
> CPU: i5-4690k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: 300 mhZ
> OC after delid: 5000 mhZ
> Temp drops: 20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/xcncjr


*Updated and Accepted!*

Welcome to the club roster officially! Hope you have a great experience with this club and hope you truly had a great time doing this incredible modification!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Over what amount of time does this bonding happen with CLP? I had CLP on my CPU die for the last year, and just opened it up a couple days ago, and it wasn't bonded at all - still liquid. Are you speaking from personal experience here?
> In my personal experience so far, when I removed the IHS after delidding about a year ago, it was still liquid. Make sure you don't just try wiping it up, make sure the q-tip (or whatever you're using to clean it) is wet with 91% Alcohol. Otherwise, it just smears around and becomes a pain.


Yeah I am speaking from personal experience, I've been "lidded" for 2 and a half years now. It was around 1 and a half years when I first noticed it being bonded, I'd try and take it off but i don't want to risk killing a perfectly good i5. Pro is the one that bonds yes? I'm certain that I used pro on the core and ultra on the IHS. Pro being the one that bonds?

I've replaced the Ultra a few times over now, you need to use metho or something else it will smear around yes. Do also note it'll ruin the IHS and stain it along with any coolers too if you use it on top.


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah I am speaking from personal experience, I've been "lidded" for 2 and a half years now. It was around 1 and a half years when I first noticed it being bonded, I'd try and take it off but i don't want to risk killing a perfectly good i5. Pro is the one that bonds yes? I'm certain that I used pro on the core and ultra on the IHS. Pro being the one that bonds?
> 
> I've replaced the Ultra a few times over now, you need to use metho or something else it will smear around yes. Do also note it'll ruin the IHS and stain it along with any coolers too if you use it on top.


But what about your temps ( if you don't mind my asking) ? Have you maintained your drop in temp from original application or are they creeping up? Racing up more than a couple degrees? As I was trying to say before I see no problem with bonding as long as performance holds up.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

From what Ive read, the nonconductive goop is the best for the IHS-heatsink bridge, but conductive TIM like CLU and CLP is best for the die-IHS bridge. In any case, I posted a video on youtube for what I consider the best way to delid. Enjoy and let me know if it helps you out!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> But what about your temps ( if you don't mind my asking) ? Have you maintained your drop in temp from original application or are they creeping up? Racing up more than a couple degrees? As I was trying to say before I see no problem with bonding as long as performance holds up.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> But what about your temps ( if you don't mind my asking) ? Have you maintained your drop in temp from original application or are they creeping up? Racing up more than a couple degrees? As I was trying to say before I see no problem with bonding as long as performance holds up.


I had some trouble with that, but i noticed that there were some imperfections on the die when i added it the first time, and then i put the waterblock on it, and it was running weird temps, like high 80's, but when i went to look, there was an incomplete seal because of these blemishes. After wiping it down, my 4790k runs at 4.6 @1.28V now and sits at 23C at idle and doesnt climb past 70 under full load.

The CLU is the stuff to use though...I even use it for GPU's since it's so easy to clean up if you make any mistakes. You know its working right when your temps plummet as soon as you remove the load. Then again, I'm delidded so its a lil different for me. This is the best method ive found...


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> But what about your temps ( if you don't mind my asking) ? Have you maintained your drop in temp from original application or are they creeping up? Racing up more than a couple degrees? As I was trying to say before I see no problem with bonding as long as performance holds up.


I haven't really noticed, the ambient change here a lot and I've also had a lot of cooling configurations over that time too.

I'd say if they've changed it's enough to still be managable? I can't really tell you as I was originally on a SB-E Silver Arrow and then I moved to a custom water cooled setup after a year or more of that.


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> I haven't really noticed, the ambient change here a lot and I've also had a lot of cooling configurations over that time too.
> 
> I'd say if they've changed it's enough to still be managable? I can't really tell you as I was originally on a SB-E Silver Arrow and then I moved to a custom water cooled setup after a year or more of that.


Well as long as you're not shifting up in a significant degree I'd have to say that you probably don't need to reapply. It can't last forever though, otherwise they wouldn't give you so much for so little


----------



## rsturtle

Maybe someone can help out a delid noob. I tried deliding my 4690k today, and failed. I tried using the vice method, but was unable to get the chip seated into the vice tightly enough that I could dislodge the heatspreader. The heatspreader is all marred up, so I put it back in to see if it was still working... which it is... sort of. The chip overheats and throttles as soon as it has to do any work, but it does boot the computer.

I was unable to get it apart, and I suspect that I bent the IHS just enough that it isn't making contact with the die anymore.

Should I try the razor method?
Would I be able to get it flush again after a successful delid?
Could I use an AIO liquid cooler on the bare die?

Any suggestions would be great... I don't know what to do from here.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Maybe someone can help out a delid noob. I tried deliding my 4690k today, and failed. I tried using the vice method, but was unable to get the chip seated into the vice tightly enough that I could dislodge the heatspreader. The heatspreader is all marred up, so I put it back in to see if it was still working... which it is... sort of. The chip overheats and throttles as soon as it has to do any work, but it does boot the computer.
> 
> I was unable to get it apart, and I suspect that I bent the IHS just enough that it isn't making contact with the die anymore.
> 
> Should I try the razor method?
> Would I be able to get it flush again after a successful delid?
> Could I use an AIO liquid cooler on the bare die?
> 
> Any suggestions would be great... I don't know what to do from here.


I misread that as "4960x" and got really worried.
With vice method it should be really easy, how are you mounting the CPU in the Vice? and have you tried using electrical tape to help keep the CPU in place and prevent damage to the IHS and PCB?

Ive done the Razor method twice and the razor+card once. and while Razor method does work, there's also a much greater risk for injury to you and the chip. Razor+card (use a razor to start in a corner then use a slim, sturdy, plastic card the rest of the way around) is a bit safer for the CPU and its VRMs, but takes longer and there's still a risk of damage from the razor.
And if you're willing to take that risk, I'll leave that up to you..

As far as the IHS goes, it shouldn't have gotten bent/ damaged from the delidding process unless you mounted it incorrectly.. (my reason for asking how you mounted it to the vice.)

While you _might_ be able to run some AIO on the bare die, most coolers and their mounting hardware, aren't meant for that, you risk damaging the die or damaging pins
Its safest to run with the IHS, even after delidding.


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I misread that as "4960x" and got really worried.
> With vice method it should be really easy, how are you mounting the CPU in the Vice? and have you tried using electrical tape to help keep the CPU in place and prevent damage to the IHS and PCB?
> 
> Ive done the Razor method twice and the razor+card once. and while Razor method does work, there's also a much greater risk for injury to you and the chip. Razor+card (use a razor to start in a corner then use a slim, sturdy, plastic card the rest of the way around) is a bit safer for the CPU and its VRMs, but takes longer and there's still a risk of damage from the razor.
> And if you're willing to take that risk, I'll leave that up to you..
> 
> As far as the IHS goes, it shouldn't have gotten bent/ damaged from the delidding process unless you mounted it incorrectly.. (my reason for asking how you mounted it to the vice.)
> 
> While you _might_ be able to run some AIO on the bare die, most coolers and their mounting hardware, aren't meant for that, you risk damaging the die or damaging pins
> Its safest to run with the IHS, even after delidding.


Thanks for the reply. I went out to give it another go on my vice, (I had been working on a friends sets), and still couldn't get it off. I used electrical tape on the vice every time, just could never get it to stay put. Tried the razor/card method just now. Spent about 40 minutes on it being very patient. Got it off without a hitch, or so I thought. Popped it into the motherboard to see if it was still working and am failing to post. Drat.

Upon further inspection it looks like I nicked one of the capacitors, although the rest of the PCB/Die looks fine. Pins on the motherboard are fine, too. You were correct, the IHS was not at all bent, it must have lost contact with it, or it was on its way out to begin with which is more likely.


----------



## murrayjhart

Ordered my CLU yesterday, Will join the club over the weekend with my i5 4670K.

Will video the mod from start to finish including benchmarking before and after.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Thanks for the reply. I went out to give it another go on my vice, (I had been working on a friends sets), and still couldn't get it off. I used electrical tape on the vice every time, just could never get it to stay put. Tried the razor/card method just now. Spent about 40 minutes on it being very patient. Got it off without a hitch, or so I thought. Popped it into the motherboard to see if it was still working and am failing to post. Drat.
> 
> Upon further inspection it looks like I nicked one of the capacitors, although the rest of the PCB/Die looks fine. Pins on the motherboard are fine, too. You were correct, the IHS was not at all bent, it must have lost contact with it, or it was on its way out to begin with which is more likely.


Ouch.. sorry to hear that. My 4770K lost the top 2 VRMs during its delid, but it magically wasn't bricked, despite my initial fears.. (unless they were never there i the first place..)
It also didn't loose any functionality, but im not sure why that is the case... tho knowing how many more VRMs are on the Devil's Canyon Chips, there's just that much more to go wrong...
I hope it wasn't too much of a setback for you.


----------



## Brohem0th

https://click.intel.com/tuningplan/

^That is your friend. You have to wait 30 days after getting a protection plan to get a replacement chip, but it's stupid cheap. Like ~30$. You might get lucky and they might send you a Vietnam chip. Some people have gotten engineering samples through it.

It is tied to the serial number of the chip though, and you can only get one replacement. So make sure you don't mess up next time! But this way you won't have to pay full retail for a replacement.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> https://click.intel.com/tuningplan/
> 
> ^That is your friend. You have to wait 30 days after getting a protection plan to get a replacement chip, but it's stupid cheap. Like ~30$. You might get lucky and they might send you a Vietnam chip. Some people have gotten engineering samples through it.
> 
> It is tied to the serial number of the chip though, and you can only get one replacement. So make sure you don't mess up next time! But this way you won't have to pay full retail for a replacement.


best 30 dollars any OC person could ever have, I've used it 3 times. Thanks LN2


----------



## Swag

Well, I'll tell y'all this.

If you're OCing, you should definitely get that plan as it is priceless. $30 for peace of mine vs $200+ replacing the dead CPU.

If you're delidding, make sure you try to talk to Intel first before making the decision to scrap it and buy a new one. I actually got a CPU replaced after it died due to a short circuit in my breaker. This CPU was delidded and they still accepted it. The representative said "It is fine as we have to remove the IHS when examining the CPU".


----------



## knoober

Well folks I redid a lot on my sig rig and tested everything out and was pleased. WAS pleased, but more on that later







I took my initial readings @ stock to check Temps @ idle and load. Then I bumped up the power for a mild OC and checked idle and load again.... Then it was time to attempt to delid and see how low those Temps would go. This is where the "was" comes in. I'd watched videos and read everything there was to read ( I think) and set about with a little trepidation, but also a fair expectation of success. That's where it all went wrong. First I tried a clamp and a torch, but soon realized I'd have to cut through the Silicon that bonds the it's to the pub. I pulled out my handy x-acto knife and went to work, slowly and carefully working my way around the edge. By the time I was done I had decapitated about 1/4 of the chips around the edge (vrm?) who wanted thos there anyway?! Isn't the center acceptable!?

Long story short, I ruined my chip. I won't even set it in the board to try it cut my luck is not in today. Perhaps on a spare board someday I will give it a shot. I would like to say though that the whole time I heard and felt only a slight indication of a scratch and was very surprised to see how much damage I had done. I believe if I had a few more chips to practice on I'd be fine, but I won't be trying again until they hit a much better price point. Don't be discouraged by my results, just be more careful. And definitely find a pic of your chip without the ihs so you know where the vrm is! Thanks for all the help guys!


----------



## Brohem0th

I delidded my 4690k with a drywall utility blade and used some Antec Formula 6 Nano-Diamond compound between both the die/IHS and IHS/heatsink. It worked just fine.

You would THINK that using a thinner blade would be better, and you would be wrong as you so expensively found out. A thicker blade is more difficult to use, but safer, because it won't flex into the PCB when you're trying to pry the IHS up enough to fit a credit-card between the IHS and PCB to cut through the goop all the way around the IHS. You definitely shouldn't use a blade to go all the way around the IHS, you just need to get it started enough to where you can do the rest with a sturdy piece of cardstock or a credit card.

Hell, I baptized the entire chip in blood and cleaned it with 91% ISO and it still runs like a charm. My motherboard is a turd and won't comfortably do over 1.300v Vcore or 2.000v VCCIN without some serious Vdroop, and that limits my OC pretty heavily, but I can do 4.7Ghz/1.285v Vcore and 1.970v VCCIN all dang day long and not break 76c at 70-74F ambient temps.

But yeah. TL;DR A thicker blade has more tensile strength and won't dig into the PCB when you're prying the IHS off. Even if you don't actively try to pry it off and just try to cut all the way around (which I seriously recommend against) a thin blade like an exacto knife or a razor blade will flex down into the PCB from the pressure.

Also, apparently blood sacrifices get you higher clockspeeds, since I validated 5Ghz on my chip after I delidded it and cleansed it with blood, where before it wouldn't do better than 4.8Ghz, and couldn't do 4.8Ghz stable under 85c. Heck, I can even do 4.9Ghz at 1.365v (while staying under 90c on a Hyper 212+ with a pair of Phanteks F-140HP's) and pass a few loops of Handbrake before it BSOD's, and that's solely from Vdroop.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I delidded my 4690k with a drywall utility blade and used some Antec Formula 6 Nano-Diamond compound between both the die/IHS and IHS/heatsink. It worked just fine.
> 
> You would THINK that using a thinner blade would be better, and you would be wrong as you so expensively found out. A thicker blade is more difficult to use, but safer, because it won't flex into the PCB when you're trying to pry the IHS up enough to fit a credit-card between the IHS and PCB to cut through the goop all the way around the IHS. You definitely shouldn't use a blade to go all the way around the IHS, you just need to get it started enough to where you can do the rest with a sturdy piece of cardstock or a credit card.
> 
> Hell, I baptized the entire chip in blood and cleaned it with 91% ISO and it still runs like a charm. My motherboard is a turd and won't comfortably do over 1.300v Vcore or 2.000v VCCIN without some serious Vdroop, and that limits my OC pretty heavily, but I can do 4.7Ghz/1.285v Vcore and 1.970v VCCIN all dang day long and not break 76c at 70-74F ambient temps.
> 
> But yeah. TL;DR A thicker blade has more tensile strength and won't dig into the PCB when you're prying the IHS off. Even if you don't actively try to pry it off and just try to cut all the way around (which I seriously recommend against) a thin blade like an exacto knife or a razor blade will flex down into the PCB from the pressure.
> 
> Also, apparently blood sacrifices get you higher clockspeeds, since I validated 5Ghz on my chip after I delidded it and cleansed it with blood, where before it wouldn't do better than 4.8Ghz, and couldn't do 4.8Ghz stable under 85c. Heck, I can even do 4.9Ghz at 1.365v (while staying under 90c on a Hyper 212+ with a pair of Phanteks F-140HP's) and pass a few loops of Handbrake before it BSOD's, and that's solely from Vdroop.


In the time you spent with the blade and trying to weasel it around without nicking anything, a simple vice could have probably done 5 of them with nothing else nearby and very low risk of damaging anything.

Here is my version of a tldr: 




Notice, 3 minutes long, beginning to end, and most of it was talking.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> In the time you spent with the blade and trying to weasel it around without nicking anything, a simple vice could have probably done 5 of them with nothing else nearby and very low risk of damaging anything.
> 
> Here is my version of a tldr:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Notice, 3 minutes long, beginning to end, and most of it was talking.


Hey! Not so hostile! Jk /s

I know the vice method is far superior, but I didn't have one, and I didn't have the money to procure one, and I didn't know anybody that had one. Just saying, it is possible to delid with a razor, safely, and I've seen people do it in less than a minute. Both methods can be done safely and quickly with practice.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Hey! Not so hostile! Jk /s
> 
> I know the vice method is far superior, but I didn't have one, and I didn't have the money to procure one, and I didn't know anybody that had one. Just saying, it is possible to delid with a razor, safely, and I've seen people do it in less than a minute. Both methods can be done safely and quickly with practice.


not hostile 

They are going fairly cheap now, if you ever get one. Also, razor, vice and hammer, and all other forms have been used safely by many, but many have also destroyed their cpus as well. I have only see people misalign the cpu on the vice or put the whole pcb in the vice, and cause damage with strictly the vice. So far, I have had 1 friend Crack his pcb and he showed that the cpu was crooked in the video causing it.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I delidded my 4690k with a drywall utility blade and used some Antec Formula 6 Nano-Diamond compound between both the die/IHS and IHS/heatsink. It worked just fine.
> 
> You would THINK that using a thinner blade would be better, and you would be wrong as you so expensively found out. A thicker blade is more difficult to use, but safer, because it won't flex into the PCB when you're trying to pry the IHS up enough to fit a credit-card between the IHS and PCB to cut through the goop all the way around the IHS. You definitely shouldn't use a blade to go all the way around the IHS, you just need to get it started enough to where you can do the rest with a sturdy piece of cardstock or a credit card.
> 
> Hell, I baptized the entire chip in blood and cleaned it with 91% ISO and it still runs like a charm. My motherboard is a turd and won't comfortably do over 1.300v Vcore or 2.000v VCCIN without some serious Vdroop, and that limits my OC pretty heavily, but I can do 4.7Ghz/1.285v Vcore and 1.970v VCCIN all dang day long and not break 76c at 70-74F ambient temps.
> 
> But yeah. TL;DR A thicker blade has more tensile strength and won't dig into the PCB when you're prying the IHS off. Even if you don't actively try to pry it off and just try to cut all the way around (which I seriously recommend against) a thin blade like an exacto knife or a razor blade will flex down into the PCB from the pressure.
> 
> Also, apparently blood sacrifices get you higher clockspeeds, since I validated 5Ghz on my chip after I delidded it and cleansed it with blood, where before it wouldn't do better than 4.8Ghz, and couldn't do 4.8Ghz stable under 85c. Heck, I can even do 4.9Ghz at 1.365v (while staying under 90c on a Hyper 212+ with a pair of Phanteks F-140HP's) and pass a few loops of Handbrake before it BSOD's, and that's solely from Vdroop.


Try Folding. Prime has *nothing* on the abuse Folding will put a chip thru. If your Clock survives that it'll survive the apocolypse. Not sure about Handbrake but even if you never Fold on a test system again, one module still helps.









~Ceadder


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Try Folding. Prime has *nothing* on the abuse Folding will put a chip thru. If your Clock survives that it'll survive the apocolypse. Not sure about Handbrake but even if you never Fold on a test system again, one module still helps.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I like to use Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT's to figure out worst case scenario, absolute maximum, 110% load max temps for a given OC. Especially because it gets it hot in a hurry, which means less time spent above Tcase, which means my chip is going to last longer. Handbrake is an absolute motherlover in terms of stability, if an OC is stable in Handbrake for 8-12 hours then it's as stable as it can get, and the temps are really low for a stress test, only about 5-10ish Celsius hotter than real-world gaming loads.


----------



## SynchronicBoost

I'm sure that this has been covered, but what material is the IHS made from?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SynchronicBoost*
> 
> I'm sure that this has been covered, but what material is the IHS made from?


Nickel plated copper.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Try Folding. Prime has *nothing* on the abuse Folding will put a chip thru.


Depends. Prime95 uses AVX2 instruction set which is pipelined through a part of the chip that Folding doesn't touch.

In terms of a temperature check, Prime95>Folding.

However, in terms of stability checking, Folding>Prime95.


----------



## SynchronicBoost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Nickel plated copper.


Has anyone in here tried annealing the copper so that it is soft to conform to the die and you can use less TIM?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SynchronicBoost*
> 
> Has anyone in here tried annealing the copper so that it is soft to conform to the die and you can use less TIM?


Unless you can achieve very precise tolerences, i would think that using tim would be better. But i would like to be proven wrong though...


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

my worry would be that that could mean a change in height of the IHS which could cause poor contact for some coolers and blocks that have mounts that sit at a the specific height of the IHS, leading to poor cooler contact, or the inability to properly clamp down on the CPU without excessive force.

At that point, you might as well just consider going direct-to-die, and save the time and process of trying to make adjustments to the IHS...


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Ouch.. sorry to hear that. My 4770K lost the top 2 VRMs during its delid, but it magically wasn't bricked, despite my initial fears.. (unless they were never there i the first place..)
> It also didn't loose any functionality, but im not sure why that is the case... tho knowing how many more VRMs are on the Devil's Canyon Chips, there's just that much more to go wrong...
> I hope it wasn't too much of a setback for you.


I have outstanding news! Yesterday night I gave the chip another shot. I cleared CMOS and but on the heat spreader and locked it in, and it started to boot. I don't know why the last time I tried it wouldn't boot, is the IHS required to put enough pressure on the connections? Anyway, ecstatic I ran down to microcenter and picked up some Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste since it's supposed to be one of the best non-conductive TIM's. I also figured out why when I tried using a cooler on it to check if it was working why it was hitting TJ max and throttling right away, the IHS had a tiny bur where the metal had been bent up, and it was preventing contact of the cooler. I sanded down the outside of the IHS, put on the new TIM, and sanded the cooler while I was at it. Popped it in and it seems to be working. I guess nicking that capacitor didn't kill it after all! I've been stressing the chip and it seems as stable as it was before, and I shaved off 7-9*C on all cores + package and socket temps. Very excited!


----------



## SynchronicBoost

I'm not saying to stop using TIM. I would still use it. But if the interface is better because the copper is super soft and ductile, then more TIM would get squeezed out.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> I have outstanding news! Yesterday night I gave the chip another shot. I cleared CMOS and but on the heat spreader and locked it in, and it started to boot. I don't know why the last time I tried it wouldn't boot, is the IHS required to put enough pressure on the connections? Anyway, ecstatic I ran down to microcenter and picked up some Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste since it's supposed to be one of the best non-conductive TIM's. I also figured out why when I tried using a cooler on it to check if it was working why it was hitting TJ max and throttling right away, the IHS had a tiny bur where the metal had been bent up, and it was preventing contact of the cooler. I sanded down the outside of the IHS, put on the new TIM, and sanded the cooler while I was at it. Popped it in and it seems to be working. I guess nicking that capacitor didn't kill it after all! I've been stressing the chip and it seems as stable as it was before, and I shaved off 7-9*C on all cores + package and socket temps. Very excited!


Thats good to hear!
There does need to be a bit of pressure on the cpu to make sure it gets proper contact with the pins, whether its from the socket clamp or from a Waterblock. (direct-to-die)
Be aware that using pastes between the die and IHS rarely results in stable temps over time. They'll go up after about a month to the point where you'll have to remove your overclock or re-apply the paste. Basically the TIM is squeezed/pumped out resulting in poor contact and thermal transfer. It's happened to me twice and by the time my CLU arrived I was sunning my 4770k at stock with a 1.015v undervolt, just to keep the temps manageable while gaming. (after switching to CLU, my OC temps were marginally better than my undervolt tests)

For best long-term cooling, be sure to use CLU for the die+IHS and pretty much anything else for the cooler. Just make sure it doesn't come into contact with any Aluminium coolers, or any of the VRMs.
It dropped my load temps by 20-25C between the delid and upgrading to a custom loop at the same 4.4GHz OC.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SynchronicBoost*
> 
> I'm not saying to stop using TIM. I would still use it. But if the interface is better because the copper is super soft and ductile, then more TIM would get squeezed out.


As stated above, the TIM getting squeezed out is part of the problem with using pastes between the die and IHS, on 2 different applications ive seen my temps rise significantly, even worse than before delidding.
And i know i'm not the only person to experience the issue.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Try Folding. Prime has *nothing* on the abuse Folding will put a chip thru.
> 
> 
> 
> Depends. Prime95 uses AVX2 instruction set which is pipelined through a part of the chip that Folding doesn't touch.
> 
> In terms of a temperature check, Prime95>Folding.
> 
> However, in terms of stability checking, Folding>Prime95.
Click to expand...

I *always* approach it from a stability direction.









~Ceadder


----------



## Captivate

So I just delidded with the vice method. Got the EK precisemount kit so my waterblock is directly on the die. At 4.3ghz and 1.3v I am getting temps of 65C in prime (small fft) with a water temp of 25C. Is that good or bad, I have no idea... I think my Haswell chip is pretty bad.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> So I just delidded with the vice method. Got the EK precisemount kit so my waterblock is directly on the die. At 4.3ghz and 1.3v I am getting temps of 65C in prime (small fft) with a water temp of 25C. Is that good or bad, I have no idea... I think my Haswell chip is pretty bad.


Go and look for the thread that's named something like "Haswell overclocking club with statistics", and see what the suggested method to deal with Haswell is.

People seem to completely ignore prime95 small fft on Haswell, also prime95 in general. On Haswell, it shows completely unrealistic temperatures compared to all other, normal programs.

People like to use something called "x264 benchmark" to test worst temperatures. It is using a video encoder tool for testing. This will show you the highest temperatures you'll ever see on your CPU in normal programs.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> So I just delidded with the vice method. Got the EK precisemount kit so my waterblock is directly on the die. At 4.3ghz and 1.3v I am getting temps of 65C in prime (small fft) with a water temp of 25C. Is that good or bad, I have no idea... I think my Haswell chip is pretty bad.


Why does virtually everyone seem to say the same thing? You most likely don't have a bad chip, it's more likely that you just haven't put the time into learning how to properly OC with your particular components. I've been tinkering with my 4670K for about a year now, and there are still new bits of information or new techniques that I pick up. Just something I've been wondering about. Check out the Haswell OC guide in my sig, and either read through the pages there or use the "Search this thread" function there, as I'm positive that every question/concern you have has already been asked and answered/addressed multiple times in there. Also, I recommend finding an Owner's Club for your motherboard, since that thread is likely to be a gold mine of relevant information.









_(Sorry if any of that sounds rude, but it is true. Sadly, people don't seem to read threads before asking questions anymore, so the same questions are asked over and over.)_

Anyways, I digressed. Regarding your temps, they sound decent. Sounds like they should be better though - since you're running direct-die. How are your ambient temps there?


----------



## Captivate

Well, this thread has, as of writing, 27849 posts, so it is very hard to search for specific information. Reason why I think my Haswell is poor because I saw the temp spike to 100C once (with watercooling) in a prime test, at 4.4ghz and 1.3v, or something of the sorts. That is just absurd, and I had already re-seated the block so I don't think that was the issue. Maybe it has to do with the EK Supremacy block not being great for Haswell? Who knows.
Anyway, ambient is about 23-25C. But it's mostly about the water temp. I can control that by allowing all my fans to be stopped or blow at full speed.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> Well, this thread has, as of writing, 27849 posts, so it is very hard to search for specific information. Reason why I think my Haswell is poor because I saw the temp spike to 100C once (with watercooling) in a prime test, at 4.4ghz and 1.3v, or something of the sorts. That is just absurd, and I had already re-seated the block so I don't think that was the issue. Maybe it has to do with the EK Supremacy block not being great for Haswell? Who knows.
> Anyway, ambient is about 23-25C. But it's mostly about the water temp. I can control that by allowing all my fans to be stopped or blow at full speed.


There's a search function, and it's actually pretty effective. No one's asking you to manually look through all of the pages. Though, if you wanted to fully understand what you're doing, it's not a bad idea to read through the posts without searching.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> Well, this thread has, as of writing, 27849 posts, so it is very hard to search for specific information. Reason why I think my Haswell is poor because I saw the temp spike to 100C once (with watercooling) in a prime test, at 4.4ghz and 1.3v, or something of the sorts. That is just absurd, and I had already re-seated the block so I don't think that was the issue. Maybe it has to do with the EK Supremacy block not being great for Haswell? Who knows.
> Anyway, ambient is about 23-25C. But it's mostly about the water temp. I can control that by allowing all my fans to be stopped or blow at full speed.


This thread is really just about delidding, not about Haswell. That's why you should check out that Haswell overclocking thread! You are wasting your time a bit over here.









What's going on is this:

If you look at the benchmark results in IntelBurnTest with the newest linpack libraries, you'll get a hint about what's happening and where the absurd temperatures come from. You'll see that Haswell manages a ridiculous amount of GFlops compared to previous generations. This is done with the "AVX2" instructions.

You'll see for example something like 120 GFlops on an Ivy Bridge CPU, but 200 GFlops on a Haswell CPU, so it's really a massive increase in performance. Those extra GFlops do not come free. You have to pay for it with ridiculous power use, and that's where the ridiculous temperatures come from.

That's why you cannot use dumb tests that just cycle through a continuous stream of AVX2 instructions. The tests you are trying to use do not do anything useful. If you test with x264, that also uses AVX2, so will also test everything about the CPU. But because x264 is a useful program, a video encoder, it does use AVX2 only where it's useful for its job, and that won't result in the same 100% AVX2 instructions as in prime95 small FFT.

If you want to compare with what you know from Ivy Bridge CPUs, you can search for an older version of prime95 (I think you should look for version 27.9). The versions from before Haswell came out don't know about AVX2 and don't use it. They will behave the same as on an Ivy Bridge CPU, and you should then see the same temperatures as an Ivy Bridge CPU would produce. That's what you could use to prove to yourself that everything's alright.


----------



## murrayjhart

1.3v is high for a 4.3OC there is a chance that if you use occt or something else other then prime you will be able to lower that voltage down and still be stable.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> Well, this thread has, as of writing, 27849 posts, so it is very hard to search for specific information. Reason why I think my Haswell is poor because I saw the temp spike to 100C once (with watercooling) in a prime test, at 4.4ghz and 1.3v, or something of the sorts. That is just absurd, and I had already re-seated the block so I don't think that was the issue. Maybe it has to do with the EK Supremacy block not being great for Haswell? Who knows.
> Anyway, ambient is about 23-25C. But it's mostly about the water temp. I can control that by allowing all my fans to be stopped or blow at full speed.


I would highly recommend reading through the Haswell OC'ing thread for tips and tricks type of stuff. I've owned my Ivy for nearly 3 years and I always keep finding little ways to chip at the Vcore numbers, even under LN2 stuff all the way to air, practice makes perfect.

In regards to your temps, there's an issue here, that 65 isn't terrible, however shouldn't exists unless during peak full crazy testing like intelburn. I wonder what TIM you air using between the die and block? also you have the naked mount for your block I assume? is not then your not seated right, bare die without the correct measuring and time is quite difficult. BUT that's what we are here for is to help clear that up and help you along your way!


----------



## NIK1

I use Aida64 to stress test my OC.When picking the tests to run should I pick stress cpu only or both cpu and fpu when checking if oc is stable.I have noticed when fpu is selected with cpu the max temp is around 10 cel higher.Just curious what others use when stressing with aida64.


----------



## lever2stacks

What's up my fellow delidders. I delidded my 4790k sometime ago and just now got my loop finished and could really put this thing through its paces. I was a little worried about the silicon lottery but this chip clocks quite well. I got 4.9ghz @1.389v super stable max temp 69c.

I was trying to get to 5 but just couldn't break that wall crashed every time right as I booted into windows. I'm going to keep trying once I learn this board better I think I'll be able to squeeze that last little bit out. Thanks for all the knowledge dropped in this thread it has helped so much.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lever2stacks*
> 
> What's up my fellow delidders. I delidded my 4790k sometime ago and just now got my loop finished and could really put this thing through its paces. I was a little worried about the silicon lottery but this chip clocks quite well. I got 4.9ghz @1.389v super stable max temp 69c.
> 
> I was trying to get to 5 but just couldn't break that wall crashed every time right as I booted into windows. I'm going to keep trying once I learn this board better I think I'll be able to squeeze that last little bit out. Thanks for all the knowledge dropped in this thread it has helped so much.


change your power settings in windows to performance, helps show max clocks on submissions







and doesn't change power consumption much at all. Let your computer ignore power saving mode, the motherboard will do it anyway.


----------



## DirectDieWC

Can I delid my 5820k? Anyone has the answer?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirectDieWC*
> 
> Can I delid my 5820k? Anyone has the answer?


No absolutely not! The IHS is soldered onto the die for Haswell E chips, and i think pretty much all 2011 socket chips


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirectDieWC*
> 
> Can I delid my 5820k? Anyone has the answer?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> No absolutely not! The IHS is soldered onto the die for Haswell E chips, and i think pretty much all 2011 socket chips


Pretty much all enthusiast chips are soldered..

If it isn't a small socket, don't delid it. This is what you get when you delid enthusiast chips:


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Pretty much all enthusiast chips are soldered..
> 
> If it isn't a small socket, don't delid it. This is what you get when you delid enthusiast chips:


Ouch!!!


----------



## Brohem0th

Quick question for you guys;

I currently have a Cooler Master Hyper 212+ with a pair of Phanteks F-140HP's mounted to it. I have about another 5-10mm of clearance before it hits the side-panel of my case where the fans themselves are concerned, and about another 10-15mm of space before contact as far as the heatsink itself is concerned (with the closed ends of the heatpipes being the highest point).

Best information I could find was that the Hyper 212+ with 120mm fans mounted to it requires 150mm of clearance, where the NH-D15 requires 165mm of clearance with fans. Do you think an NH-D15 would fit in my case?

My case was manufactured by Broadway Case Company and I have not been able to find any information on it anywhere. It's a steel case with 140mm fan mounts everywhere except the rear exhaust fan. I have measured the width of the case to be 9.25", and the Fractal Design R4 has a width of 9.13" and is compatible with the NH-D15.

So, in theory, this should work right? Just thought I'd do a sanity check before ordering. I already have the CLU and CLP here, and the shop I work at has Amazon Prime so I'd be able to get free two-day shipping on it (not to mention it's a tax-free business account and this IS a computer part, so there shouldn't be an issue there).

It's retailing for roughly 96$ on Amazon right now and I'm ready to pull the trigger. Just thought I'd run it by you guys first as a sanity check. My motherboard is limiting my OC's somewhat but the improved cooling performance would definitely be welcomed as-is.

Worst case scenario I can always return it. I would go with an NH-D14 to make absolutely sure it would be compatible, but the base of that cooler isn't compatible with either CLU or CLP.

Thanks in advance. I've got a 100$ bill burning a hole in my pocket and a delidded 4690k burning up my bedroom. I'd like to get this done.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Quick question for you guys;
> 
> I currently have a Cooler Master Hyper 212+ with a pair of Phanteks F-140HP's mounted to it. I have about another 5-10mm of clearance before it hits the side-panel of my case where the fans themselves are concerned, and about another 10-15mm of space before contact as far as the heatsink itself is concerned (with the closed ends of the heatpipes being the highest point).
> 
> Best information I could find was that the Hyper 212+ with 120mm fans mounted to it requires 150mm of clearance, where the NH-D15 requires 165mm of clearance with fans. Do you think an NH-D15 would fit in my case?
> 
> My case was manufactured by Broadway Case Company and I have not been able to find any information on it anywhere. It's a steel case with 140mm fan mounts everywhere except the rear exhaust fan. I have measured the width of the case to be 9.25", and the Fractal Design R4 has a width of 9.13" and is compatible with the NH-D15.
> 
> So, in theory, this should work right? Just thought I'd do a sanity check before ordering. I already have the CLU and CLP here, and the shop I work at has Amazon Prime so I'd be able to get free two-day shipping on it (not to mention it's a tax-free business account and this IS a computer part, so there shouldn't be an issue there).
> 
> It's retailing for roughly 96$ on Amazon right now and I'm ready to pull the trigger. Just thought I'd run it by you guys first as a sanity check. My motherboard is limiting my OC's somewhat but the improved cooling performance would definitely be welcomed as-is.
> 
> Worst case scenario I can always return it. I would go with an NH-D14 to make absolutely sure it would be compatible, but the base of that cooler isn't compatible with either CLU or CLP.
> 
> Thanks in advance. I've got a 100$ bill burning a hole in my pocket and a delidded 4690k burning up my bedroom. I'd like to get this done.


Yea so it's not the case as much as the board that would be incompatible. But the nhd15 is tall vertically so as long as you have at least a mid tower I think you're ok on that front. However the motherboard ram modules might be a problem. Look online for anybody with your mobo and the cooler. Or else just buy and try. Amazon is great about returns.


----------



## Brohem0th

Looked it up, Noctua has a friggin GIGANTIC list of compatible motherboards for the NH-D15, specifically lists my motherboard so all is good. Thanks for the idea, ordering now.

Thanks for the quick response too, we close at 2PM today!


----------



## knoober

MUAHAHAHAHAHA! I got it right this time!




Let me walk you through these pics to explain whats going on real quick.

1) I posted a while ago about deliding my Phenom II x4 810.... but I wrecked it like the guys a couple postes back. I ended up chopping off some of the tasty bits on the inside with my blade when I was cutting the adhesive, but the result was the same.... no more chip









2) I swore off trying to delid before my new chip came (phenom II x4 965BE) but I did it anyway. This time instead of a blade I used a discount club card (like a credit card but a little skinnier)
and it worked!

3) I also got my new cooler today and I had to pill the whole damn mobo out of the case to install it and while I was looking at the installation instructions I decided I only wanted to seat this bad boy once. So I delided , lapped and applied CLP without a basline on what (if anything ) was bringing the frigid temps of the future (sorry guys)

4) Then I thought about this thread and pics and all the rest (for the life of me I couldnt get a clear pic of the IHS that was legible) So what we have in the pic with two IHS in it is the one that I lapped (after writing down the stepping info) without thinking to get a pic and the one from the previously ruined chip. The next pic is of the finished product, still driping with CLP. I wasnt sure how much to put on and that *&$#! spreads. It was amazing! A drop the size of a bb covered the die, the IHS over the die, the top of the IHS AND some of the sink! Amazing.

So in conclusion, I wont know until tommorow what kind of success I had because I got all tuckered out after fitting the rig back together. Ill fire it up tommorow and if anyone wants Ill throw up a pic of HwMonitor at stock and with whatever OC I can get. With stock cooling I couldnt stabilize at 3800mhz (but I am a novice after all, stock speed of the chip is 3.4 and I hear all kinds of ugliness about how much voltage it takes to get to 4000mhz) And yeah I do know its an Intel thread, sorry to budge in like this


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirectDieWC*
> 
> Can I delid my 5820k? Anyone has the answer?


Technically yes, but they are soldered, so the process is much riskier for much less reward. Being soldered to the die, the 5820k does not suffer from the thermal issues that delidding solves. In order to remove the IHS, you will need to cut the rubber sealant around the edge, and then super heat the IHS until you melt the solder. Then you have to clean (scrape) the solder off of the die. If you are not planning on going direct die, you will likely see WORSE temps than you did before delidding, and with direct die, you may see very minimal gains. You wont get the 10-25C drop that users experience with delidding the mainstream processors. It has been done, and I am sure someone else will end up doing it again, but the juice is just not worth the squeeze.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DirectDieWC*
> 
> Can I delid my 5820k? Anyone has the answer?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> No absolutely not! The IHS is soldered onto the die for Haswell E chips, and i think pretty much all 2011 socket chips
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Pretty much all enthusiast chips are soldered..
> 
> If it isn't a small socket, don't delid it. This is what you get when you delid enthusiast chips:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...









**Ack!**

@knoober... Is all good. It doesn't matter if it's Intel or not. If you de-lid it and it works, it is welcome.









~Ceadder


----------



## Brohem0th

Went ahead and measured my case and the Hyper 212+ to double check clearance, everything looked good, NH-D15 is on the way and I've got the CLP and CLU ready to go on my desk.

Would I see any improvement if I put CLU between the DIE and IHS AND between the IHS and NH-D15, or would I be better off using CLP? I've heard CLP is easier to remove which is the main reason most people use it between the IHS and Heatsink instead of CLP.


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Went ahead and measured my case and the Hyper 212+ to double check clearance, everything looked good, NH-D15 is on the way and I've got the CLP and CLU ready to go on my desk.
> 
> Would I see any improvement if I put CLU between the DIE and IHS AND between the IHS and NH-D15, or would I be better off using CLP? I've heard CLP is easier to remove which is the main reason most people use it between the IHS and Heatsink instead of CLP.


I cant speak for where you should apply what , but I am reasonably sure from what I have read CLU is the easier to remove , and (while it seems contrary to the popular opinion) I have read in a few places that CLP outdoes CLU in the w/mk arena. Sorry Ive got no hard data for you.

Also, celebration may have been premature. I may have killed my chip after all. It was known working before the delid and while I didnt saw anything off like the last time with the 810 , I cant get it to post. Im going to try adjusting the mounting pressure because my gut says if there is a fix it is there, but it looks like Im back to the drawing board and going to be wating for yet another chip. I'll come back and say something philisophical for the funeral of my chip when it finally flatlines .


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Went ahead and measured my case and the Hyper 212+ to double check clearance, everything looked good, NH-D15 is on the way and I've got the CLP and CLU ready to go on my desk.
> 
> Would I see any improvement if I put CLU between the DIE and IHS AND between the IHS and NH-D15, or would I be better off using CLP? I've heard CLP is easier to remove which is the main reason most people use it between the IHS and Heatsink instead of CLP.


Anytime the die is involved use a conductive TIM like clu. IHS contact with Heat sink and cooler use non conductive because typically there is some aluminum. Gelid and ic diamond are the best. I would stay away from anything else. The IHS is copper. I can say that for a fact (it just has some protective covering on it)

Also I would use clu over clp. I've heard horror stories about clp but they both perform very well. Clu was created to address the problems with clp


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Anytime the die is involved use a conductive TIM like clu. IHS contact with Heat sink and cooler use non conductive because typically there is some aluminum. Gelid and ic diamond are the best. I would stay away from anything else. The IHS is copper. I can say that for a fact (it just has some protective covering on it)
> 
> Also I would use clu over clp. I've heard horror stories about clp but they both perform very well. Clu was created to address the problems with clp


I can personally vouch for the fact that CLP doesn't necessarily solidify after usage. My application was on for a little over a year, and cleaned off with no issues, and didn't bond the IHS to the die.


----------



## IMI4tth3w

Well after my unsuccessful attempt at delidding my 3570k via razor method, i have now attempted delidding again via the vice method on my 4790K... and GREAT SUCCESS

seriously, vice method is so dang easy there is ZERO reason to take a razor to your cpu. you can get a decent suction mount vice on amazon for $15.

i did attempt at using the non hammer vice method, but it wasn't having it and i was getting nervous. the precise strikes from the hammer are MUCH better at separation unless you've heated up the glue prior.

So some before and after info:

Specs:
4790K @ 4.7GHz 1.325Vcore 1.92 Input Voltage (only settings i have changed)
H110i GT w/ Noctua A14 PWM in Pull
Air 540 Case

Temps:
Before: hottest core 78C
After: Hottest core 65C

Test: Intel Burn Test for 15min

i used a SUPER thin layer of the CLU and thought it might even be too thin. Also used some black RTV to seal the capacitors as CLU is conductive. Was debating on sealing up the chip again but i'll just leave it as is.

would be nice to get 4.8 @ same voltages but it just won't stay stable. I might throw a little more voltage at it and see what happens. Might even try 5GHz and see what i can get.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Went ahead and measured my case and the Hyper 212+ to double check clearance, everything looked good, NH-D15 is on the way and I've got the CLP and CLU ready to go on my desk.
> 
> Would I see any improvement if I put CLU between the DIE and IHS AND between the IHS and NH-D15, or would I be better off using CLP? I've heard CLP is easier to remove which is the main reason most people use it between the IHS and Heatsink instead of CLP.


CLU can be used between IHS and heatsink. How much of a chore it would be would depend on you. As others have noted, for that particular application, you'll typically see only a few degrees difference between CLU and traditional TIM.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMI4tth3w*
> 
> Well after my unsuccessful attempt at delidding my 3570k via razor method, i have now attempted delidding again via the vice method on my 4790K... and GREAT SUCCESS
> 
> seriously, vice method is so dang easy there is ZERO reason to take a razor to your cpu. you can get a decent suction mount vice on amazon for $15.
> 
> i did attempt at using the non hammer vice method, but it wasn't having it and i was getting nervous. the precise strikes from the hammer are MUCH better at separation unless you've heated up the glue prior.
> 
> So some before and after info:
> 
> Specs:
> 4790K @ 4.7GHz 1.325Vcore 1.92 Input Voltage (only settings i have changed)
> H110i GT w/ Noctua A14 PWM in Pull
> Air 540 Case
> 
> Temps:
> Before: hottest core 78C
> After: Hottest core 65C
> 
> Test: Intel Burn Test for 15min
> 
> i used a SUPER thin layer of the CLU and thought it might even be too thin. Also used some black RTV to seal the capacitors as CLU is conductive. Was debating on sealing up the chip again but i'll just leave it as is.
> 
> would be nice to get 4.8 @ same voltages but it just won't stay stable. I might throw a little more voltage at it and see what happens. Might even try 5GHz and see what i can get.


Nice temps. I know you've already done it, but for the vice only method, it's all about applying even pressure, turning the handle slowly. It does seem like it takes a ridiculous amount of pressure but so long as you're careful, the glue should separate


----------



## JackCY

Broadwell uses what stuff under IHS? I suppose only E series is going to be soldered or even that is not anymore?


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Broadwell uses what stuff under IHS? I suppose only E series is going to be soldered or even that is not anymore?


Has Broadway been released? I thought it was only available in laptops?

If it hasn't been released, we will have to wait and see.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Broadwell uses what stuff under IHS? I suppose only E series is going to be soldered or even that is not anymore?


We don't know for certain yet. Until Broadwell chips start shipping and someone gives it a shot we're only capable of guessing,.
But till then we can only assume so that it's a paste.
Same goes for Skylake, we just don't know till they start shipping.

All E-series chips on socket 2011 and 2011v3 will still continue to be soldered, I don't see that changing..


----------



## WiSK

@JackCY @Scarlet-Tech @Hobbsmeerkat

Double die would be tricky to solder. Pretty sure it's TIM under there again.



They are in stock at a shop local to me, so could check, but I'm waiting for prices to drop a little. I'll post pics once I've delidded unless someone else beats me to it.


----------



## Scarlet-Tech

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> @JackCY @Scarlet-Tech @Hobbsmeerkat
> 
> Double die would be tricky to solder. Pretty sure it's TIM under there again.
> 
> 
> 
> They are in stock at a shop local to me, so could check, but I'm waiting for prices to drop a little. I'll post pics once I've delidded unless someone else beats me to it.


I didn't even realize they were out yet.

What are the prices on them? I can't find a local shop that carries CPU's, much less anything I want to delid, lol.

Oh, just glanced at the link.. That's expensive!


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Scarlet-Tech*
> 
> Oh, just glanced at the link.. That's expensive!


Well, the Euro crashed last year from a recent high of $1.38 to like $1.12 now, and of course we pay 21% sales tax here in the Netherlands. So ignore those prices.

Still, the i7-5775C will be more expensive than other desktop Core chips because of the Iris Pro graphics and the 128MB built-in level 4 cache memory.


----------



## JackCY

They are in shops but do not ship yet it seems. Probably making their way down the supply chain. It should be some paste again, it's even hotter than DC, smaller node so it's expected there isn't going to be any improvement in cooling.


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> @JackCY @Scarlet-Tech @Hobbsmeerkat
> 
> Double die would be tricky to solder. Pretty sure it's TIM under there again.
> 
> 
> 
> They are in stock at a shop local to me, so could check, but I'm waiting for prices to drop a little. I'll post pics once I've delidded unless someone else beats me to it.


I dont understand how they dolder a single die, but I imagine it is backwards of the way to delid a soldered chip. Measure a wad of solder onto the die/slap on the IHS and heat until desired temp is reached (alternate would be to have it molten on a heated IHS, slap it down and cool it I guess). I cant imagine it would be any harder to do that with a double die (man I gotta look into what a double die is before commenting !)


----------



## Imprezzion

Well, that didn't go as planned..

I went and replaced my CLU under my die and waterblock as it was 2 years old and was showing signs of increased temps..

The new CLU I got was a bad batch somehow cause there were a lot of metal flakes in it and it was very thick and hard to spread..
So, I was forced to use regular Prolimatech PK-1 paste for the die-ihs and ihs-block application.

Now, I ran into 2 problems.

1. Direct die cooling with my block, a Swiftech H320 block, is prefectly possible. The mounting hardware has plenty of room to go low enough and all it takes is a extra washer between the screws (springs) and the mounting plate.
Problem is, even with almost perfect pressure, my CPU will not boot. It just hangs on the DRAM LED and won't POST. Rarely it POSTs but it will either BSOD or hang in the BIOS instantly with a DRAM error..
Using the IHS and stock mount works just fine and the PC is stable as a rock.

2. PK-1 cools quite a lot worse, especially if you use it with the IHS on. My CPU is already quite a hothead for it's low voltage but it got... well, unmanagable on my normal clocks.
I used to run 4.95Ghz @ 1.44v 24/7 with CLU and that runs at about 60-65c in every day usage and 75-80c in 24h of Prime AVX Blend or LinX with AVX.
Now, with the PK-1 this results in 95c stressed and 80-85c in games so that's a no-go.
I clocked back to my ''safe'' clocks and it handles that pretty well. That's 4.6Ghz @ 1.256v. Runs at about the same 60-65c in-game and 75-80c stressed.

Now, my question is, what can the 3770K handle in normal usage heat.. I mean, a slight bit more volts like, 1.320v, gets me 4.75Ghz which allows me to use my normal RAM clocks and such (I use 101.1 baseclock because of my RAM) but it gets a lot hotter.. It usually runs high 70's in normal usage and stresses at high 80's to maybe low 90's.

So, it won't be permanent, i will get new CLU but it's out of stock for now, but what can I run on this ''old'' beast in terms of temps that won't be all TOO much of a danger to it. I mean, the CPU is almost 3 years old and ran it's entire life delidded and heavily overclocked at well over 1.4v.. Point is it never got hot. lol.

All I basically do is play Battlefield 4 / Hardline, GTA V and such. They get it up to high 70's on 4.75 and high 60's on 4.6.. That's all I wanna know. What is semi-safe to run in games in terms of temps.


----------



## JackCY

It should be safe until a temperature at which materials will start to degrade is reached. But it should throttle before that happens.
If it's stable up to 90C, then I wouldn't worry about reaching up to 90C. Although you gain nothing but heat pushing a CPU to the top for every bit of speed. The performance difference is minimal. 4.6 -> 4.95 = +7.6%, 4.6 -> 4.75 = +3.2%, will you notice? No. 3.5 -> 4.95 = 41.4%, will you notice? Yes if you do heavy tasks. Games are not CPU heavy tasks, at least not for anything up from stock Intel i5 SB/IB/HW.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Captivate*
> 
> So I just delidded with the vice method. Got the EK precisemount kit so my waterblock is directly on the die. At 4.3ghz and 1.3v I am getting temps of 65C in prime (small fft) with a water temp of 25C. Is that good or bad, I have no idea... I think my Haswell chip is pretty bad.


Dude I'm pretty sure you can push way further than this. Stock turbo is 4.4. You should be able to get at least 4.6 at 1.3 V


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Broadwell uses what stuff under IHS? I suppose only E series is going to be soldered or even that is not anymore?


That's what I'm assuming. In the past only 2011 sockets have been soldered. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Intel doesn't want you to delid so the fact that they void the warranty means they're not interested in fixing the issue


----------



## Skullzaflare

i do have a dead Q19D here, (8c/16ht 1.6ghz) it was soldered
not sure what it was suppose to be, as i dont see any xeons that line up with the specs


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Well, that didn't go as planned..
> 
> I went and replaced my CLU under my die and waterblock as it was 2 years old and was showing signs of increased temps..
> 
> The new CLU I got was a bad batch somehow cause there were a lot of metal flakes in it and it was very thick and hard to spread..
> So, I was forced to use regular Prolimatech PK-1 paste for the die-ihs and ihs-block application.
> 
> Now, I ran into 2 problems.
> 
> 1. Direct die cooling with my block, a Swiftech H320 block, is prefectly possible. The mounting hardware has plenty of room to go low enough and all it takes is a extra washer between the screws (springs) and the mounting plate.
> Problem is, even with almost perfect pressure, my CPU will not boot. It just hangs on the DRAM LED and won't POST. Rarely it POSTs but it will either BSOD or hang in the BIOS instantly with a DRAM error..
> Using the IHS and stock mount works just fine and the PC is stable as a rock.
> 
> 2. PK-1 cools quite a lot worse, especially if you use it with the IHS on. My CPU is already quite a hothead for it's low voltage but it got... well, unmanagable on my normal clocks.
> I used to run 4.95Ghz @ 1.44v 24/7 with CLU and that runs at about 60-65c in every day usage and 75-80c in 24h of Prime AVX Blend or LinX with AVX.
> Now, with the PK-1 this results in 95c stressed and 80-85c in games so that's a no-go.
> I clocked back to my ''safe'' clocks and it handles that pretty well. That's 4.6Ghz @ 1.256v. Runs at about the same 60-65c in-game and 75-80c stressed.
> 
> Now, my question is, what can the 3770K handle in normal usage heat.. I mean, a slight bit more volts like, 1.320v, gets me 4.75Ghz which allows me to use my normal RAM clocks and such (I use 101.1 baseclock because of my RAM) but it gets a lot hotter.. It usually runs high 70's in normal usage and stresses at high 80's to maybe low 90's.
> 
> So, it won't be permanent, i will get new CLU but it's out of stock for now, but what can I run on this ''old'' beast in terms of temps that won't be all TOO much of a danger to it. I mean, the CPU is almost 3 years old and ran it's entire life delidded and heavily overclocked at well over 1.4v.. Point is it never got hot. lol.
> 
> All I basically do is play Battlefield 4 / Hardline, GTA V and such. They get it up to high 70's on 4.75 and high 60's on 4.6.. That's all I wanna know. What is semi-safe to run in games in terms of temps.


You can get cheap clu on Amazon or sidewinder computers.

Check the CPU pins at arms reach. If you notice any spots that's a burned CPU. If so its toast.

More likely though it's poor contact with the block. The board or CPU or both is shutting down prematurely to prevent damage. Get the clu and then try again. There's also nothing wrong with running delidded with the ihs. Just remember clu under and non conductive over.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> i do have a dead Q19D here, (8c/16ht 1.6ghz) it was soldered
> not sure what it was suppose to be, as i dont see any xeons that line up with the specs


I can't see the pic clearly. Is there any sort of a rain bowing or prism sheen on the ship or is it a mirror like coating? If it's a rainbow look, it was soldered and delidding destroyed it. I could be wrong though cuz the white stuff looks like really bad thermal paste


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> That's what I'm assuming. In the past only 2011 sockets have been soldered. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Intel doesn't want you to delid so the fact that they void the warranty means they're not interested in fixing the issue


Sandy Bridge on LGA1155 socket was soldered. The temperature issues only started with Ivy Bridge LGA1155, and this is when this thread here was created.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Sandy Bridge on LGA1155 socket was soldered. The temperature issues only started with Ivy Bridge LGA1155, and this is when this thread here was created.


Ah ok. Right I thought that sandy bridge was 2011. So ivy bridge must've been when they started getting cheap on us. Watch them solder and then charge an arm and leg for 'improved cooling and efficiency'


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I can't see the pic clearly. Is there any sort of a rain bowing or prism sheen on the ship or is it a mirror like coating? If it's a rainbow look, it was soldered and delidding destroyed it. I could be wrong though cuz the white stuff looks like really bad thermal paste


the chip was dead, it was solder, the "white" is the flash reflection off the solder, i didnt get it all off the die


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

H
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> the chip was dead, it was solder, the "white" is the flash reflection off the solder, i didnt get it all off the die


How did you get the lid off without destroying the chip? And how did the chip die. Hope in not being nosy. Just curious lol


----------



## Skullzaflare

was DOA when i got it. have 2 X79 sabors here, im running a e5-1620 now, on bios 1203. i tried every bios and the q19 wouldnt do anything

i did the 775 delid style, 4 razor blades, and applied heat to the IHS


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> @JackCY @Scarlet-Tech @Hobbsmeerkat
> 
> Double die would be tricky to solder. Pretty sure it's TIM under there again.
> 
> 
> 
> They are in stock at a shop local to me, so could check, but I'm waiting for prices to drop a little. I'll post pics once I've delidded unless someone else beats me to it.
> 
> 
> 
> I dont understand how they dolder a single die, but I imagine it is backwards of the way to delid a soldered chip. Measure a wad of solder onto the die/slap on the IHS and heat until desired temp is reached (alternate would be to have it molten on a heated IHS, slap it down and cool it I guess). I cant imagine it would be any harder to do that with a double die (man I gotta look into what a double die is before commenting !)
Click to expand...

They likely apply molten solder to the die before placing the IHS to the pcb. Heat is the enemy so heating the IHS to thermally cook solder to the die could be disasterous.









~Ceadder


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> H
> How did you get the lid off without destroying the chip? And how did the chip die. Hope in not being nosy. Just curious lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> was DOA when i got it. have 2 X79 sabors here, im running a e5-1620 now, on bios 1203. i tried every bios and the q19 wouldnt do anything
> 
> i did the 775 delid style, 4 razor blades, and applied heat to the IHS


not sure if you can see it, the die is cracked across, could be why it was DOA, or i may have done it during removal


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> was DOA when i got it. have 2 X79 sabors here, im running a e5-1620 now, on bios 1203. i tried every bios and the q19 wouldnt do anything
> 
> i did the 775 delid style, 4 razor blades, and applied heat to the IHS


Ah ok. Well if it was already doa...my courage stops short beyond a standard delid and setting up a hardline tubing. I don't dare go beyond that threshold. Not brave enough to attempt a soldered ihs removal.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Ah ok. Well if it was already doa...my courage stops short beyond a standard delid and setting up a hardline tubing. I don't dare go beyond that threshold. Not brave enough to attempt a soldered ihs removal.


i may have pics of when i delidded that x3220(correction) it was soldered, i ran it at 4ghz delidded. but 775 didnt have resisters and caps on top under the IHS like this q19d


----------



## GTMoraes

pretty much why it was DOA? You might have broken it while delidding, or it was a failed mount anyway.

I'm thinking about delidding my 4690k and using a DeepCool Z5 (the Coollaboratory one costs 100 bucks around here). Couldn't find anything who done it before, so idk
Would it be worth the hassle, or is the new TIM just as good as it?


----------



## inedenimadam

Thinkin about doing my 5820k and going direct die. Seems stupid, but all this talk about it makes me itch to try.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> @JackCY @Scarlet-Tech @Hobbsmeerkat
> 
> Double die would be tricky to solder. Pretty sure it's TIM under there again.
> 
> 
> 
> They are in stock at a shop local to me, so could check, but I'm waiting for prices to drop a little. I'll post pics once I've delidded unless someone else beats me to it.


Those double-die CPUs are the mobile chips, i think even the mobile Haswell and Ivy chips were double die.
the Broadwell desktop CPUs are most likely single die, but we'll find out once they hit the market and someone delids them.

we also haven't seen multi-die chips on desktop since the Core2 days I don't think, but many of those were soldered.

Even so, i think a lot of people are planning on skipping Broadwell and waiting for Skylake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Thinkin about doing my 5820k and going direct die. Seems stupid, but all this talk about it makes me itch to try.


I really wouldn't Recommend that at all. there's a lot more risk than there is reward...


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pretty much why it was DOA? You might have broken it while delidding, or it was a failed mount anyway.
> 
> I'm thinking about delidding my 4690k and using a DeepCool Z5 (the Coollaboratory one costs 100 bucks around here). Couldn't find anything who done it before, so idk
> Would it be worth the hassle, or is the new TIM just as good as it?


Deep cool z5 appears to be a nonconductive paste when I looked it up. Is there no way you can get it? It's sold on a lotta websites. Amazon, eBay, performance pcs, sidewinder...are you not stateside?

I have a video on YouTube that discusses how to do it. You're welcome to watch 



 the delidding method I describe works for all haswell and the g3258. 4690k and 4790k are the same afaik. I would double check but I'm fairly certain.


----------



## GTMoraes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Deep cool z5 appears to be a nonconductive paste when I looked it up. Is there no way you can get it? It's sold on a lotta websites. Amazon, eBay, performance pcs, sidewinder...are you not stateside?
> 
> I have a video on YouTube that discusses how to do it. You're welcome to watch
> 
> 
> 
> the delidding method I describe works for all haswell and the g3258. 4690k and 4790k are the same afaik. I would double check but I'm fairly certain.


Sorry, perhaps I wasn't very clear. I purchased a Deep cool z5, as it was affordable enough for me (while the Coolaboratory one isn't), and I'm wondering if it's a good enough paste to "risk" delidding the CPU, or the gains would be too marginal to even bother with it.

I'm outside U.S., residing in Brazil.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I really wouldn't Recommend that at all. there's a lot more risk than there is reward...


I know its a horribly bad decision based on difficulty-reward. I dont know if that is going to stop me though







Probably wont get more than 2-3C drop even with direct die and CLU


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

I
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I know its a horribly bad decision based on difficulty-reward. I dont know if that is going to stop me though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Probably wont get more than 2-3C drop even with direct die and CLU


It's not dangerous if you do it right. This is the right way. Never use a razor or hammer


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I know its a horribly bad decision based on difficulty-reward. I dont know if that is going to stop me though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Probably wont get more than 2-3C drop even with direct die and CLU
> 
> 
> 
> It's not dangerous if you do it right. This is the right way. Never use a razor or hammer
Click to expand...

That is not how you delidd a 5820k


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> Sorry, perhaps I wasn't very clear. I purchased a Deep cool z5, as it was affordable enough for me (while the Coolaboratory one isn't), and I'm wondering if it's a good enough paste to "risk" delidding the CPU, or the gains would be too marginal to even bother with it.
> 
> I'm outside U.S., residing in Brazil.


Oh ok. I just thought maybe it was sold cheaper somewhere you might not have looked. No need to get upset.

It's definitely doable. Don't use IC diamond as the diamond will scratch the die. Anything else is good though.

Oh actually if you ever bought a block from EK the paste they give you works great. I think it's gelid gc extreme. Goes on real thin. Just spread a real thin layer on the die and a little on the ihs and you'll be fine.

Let me know what you think of the video. It's my first attempt at premiere pro after a long hiatus. I'm going to put one up with a voiceover soon.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is not how you delidd a 5820k


??!
1) I never said it would work on 2011 sockets or haswell-E.
2)Why on earth would you delid a 5820k? It's soldered on.

This method is only guaranteed to work on lga 1150 sockets. And it's by far the safest of all three known methods. For some reason the hammer method caught on and this one is widely unknown.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pretty much why it was DOA? You might have broken it while delidding, or it was a failed mount anyway.
> 
> I'm thinking about delidding my 4690k and using a DeepCool Z5 (the Coollaboratory one costs 100 bucks around here). Couldn't find anything who done it before, so idk
> Would it be worth the hassle, or is the new TIM just as good as it?


apparently you dont understand what DOA is
was Dead on arrival, AKA didnt work when it showed up
for giggles, i delidded it, i wasnt careful as i had no need to be, a dead chip is dead whether you're careful or not lol


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> Sorry, perhaps I wasn't very clear. I purchased a Deep cool z5, as it was affordable enough for me (while the Coolaboratory one isn't), and I'm wondering if it's a good enough paste to "risk" delidding the CPU, or the gains would be too marginal to even bother with it.
> 
> I'm outside U.S., residing in Brazil.


You need to find a paste where someone says that it won't "pump out" when used on the die. Normal paste can go bad within a few days when used on the die. If you can't find anyone confirming 100% that a certain paste works, you should not delid.

That "pump-out effect" is when the paste is moving away because of the combination of pressure from the cooler and the temperature changes that make it expand and contract.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> apparently you dont understand what DOA is
> was Dead on arrival, AKA didnt work when it showed up
> for giggles, i delidded it, i wasnt careful as i had no need to be, a dead chip is dead whether you're careful or not lol


well at least you tried. I think THIS is where the line of risk and reward is drawn as I doubt there is a safe way to delid a soldered ihs.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You need to find a paste where someone says that it won't "pump out" when used on the die. Normal paste can go bad within a few days when used on the die. If you can't find anyone confirming 100% that a certain paste works, you should not delid.
> 
> That "pump-out effect" is when the paste is moving away because of the combination of pressure from the cooler and the temperature changes that make it expand and contract.


also to be careful some can cause a chemical reaction on the die, and eat at it

i ran AS5 on my x3220 die, never had any issues


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You need to find a paste where someone says that it won't "pump out" when used on the die. Normal paste can go bad within a few days when used on the die. If you can't find anyone confirming 100% that a certain paste works, you should not delid.
> 
> That "pump-out effect" is when the paste is moving away because of the combination of pressure from the cooler and the temperature changes that make it expand and contract.


That is a good point and I didn't consider that. I think NTH1 is one known to have that happen. On the other hand the stuff EK sends with their blocks should work considering it's meant for direct die gpu mounts right?


----------



## GTMoraes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Oh ok. I just thought maybe it was sold cheaper somewhere you might not have looked. No need to get upset.
> 
> It's definitely doable. Don't use IC diamond as the diamond will scratch the die. Anything else is good though.
> 
> Oh actually if you ever bought a block from EK the paste they give you works great. I think it's gelid gc extreme. Goes on real thin. Just spread a real thin layer on the die and a little on the ihs and you'll be fine.
> 
> Let me know what you think of the video. It's my first attempt at premiere pro after a long hiatus. I'm going to put one up with a voiceover soon.


Not upset at all! Maybe, again, I wasn't very clear lol
What's EK?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> apparently you dont understand what DOA is
> was Dead on arrival, AKA didnt work when it showed up
> for giggles, i delidded it, i wasnt careful as i had no need to be, a dead chip is dead whether you're careful or not lol


Yep, just pointing out a broken cap there. Perhaps that's why it was DOA, or you've broken it while delidding
Oh, and I know pretty well that "dead chip handling delicacy" lol

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You need to find a paste where someone says that it won't "pump out" when used on the die. Normal paste can go bad within a few days when used on the die. If you can't find anyone confirming 100% that a certain paste works, you should not delid.
> 
> That "pump-out effect" is when the paste is moving away because of the combination of pressure from the cooler and the temperature changes that make it expand and contract.


Good point. Sadly it seems that not many people tried out the Z5 (on the first post, only one dude tried the Z5, but didn't report any difference in the temps).
The Z5 seems to be pretty solid... But I'm still waiting for the H90 to come in. If the temps are reasonable, I might not even bother delidding.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> Not upset at all! Maybe, again, I wasn't very clear lol
> What's EK?
> Yep, just pointing out a broken cap there. Perhaps that's why it was DOA, or you've broken it while delidding
> Oh, and I know pretty well that "dead chip handling delicacy" lol
> 
> Good point. Sadly it seems that not many people tried out the Z5 (on the first post, only one dude tried the Z5, but didn't report any difference in the temps).
> The Z5 seems to be pretty solid... But I'm still waiting for the H90 to come in. If the temps are reasonable, I might not even bother delidding.


EK is a company that exclusively deals with water and ln2 cooling. And for enthusiasts there's no such thing as reasonable lol. If you find the right paste or by some miracle you can get clu at a somewhat reasonable price I would highly recommend looking into delidding.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> That is a good point and I didn't consider that. I think NTH1 is one known to have that happen. On the other hand the stuff EK sends with their blocks should work considering it's meant for direct die gpu mounts right?


EK's Gelid Extreme that come with their waterblocks does NOT work with direct-to-die. that was how my CPU was set up after delid. and within a couple weeks, temps rose quickly and i had to kill my overclocks.

CLU and CLP are the only recommended paste for anything related to the Die and the underside of the IHS. then i used the Gelid Extreme between the IHS and waterblock and my temps have been solid


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> EK's Gelid Extreme that come with their waterblocks does NOT work with direct-to-die. that was how my CPU was set up after delid. and within a couple weeks, temps rose quickly and i had to kill my overclocks.
> 
> CLU and CLP are the only recommended paste for anything related to the Die and the underside of the IHS. then i used the Gelid Extreme between the IHS and waterblock and my temps have been solid


Ok good to know. So I guess don't delis unless you have conductive TIM. It makes sense and maybe that's another reason why the stock Tim is solid, to prevent the pump out. Even though it's terrible.


----------



## Awsan

People is this normal???? CLU! its still new and untouched.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People is this normal???? CLU! its still new and untouched.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> EK's Gelid Extreme that come with their waterblocks does NOT work with direct-to-die. that was how my CPU was set up after delid. and within a couple weeks, temps rose quickly and i had to kill my overclocks.
> 
> CLU and CLP are the only recommended paste for anything related to the Die and the underside of the IHS. then i used the Gelid Extreme between the IHS and waterblock and my temps have been solid


Yea it is. Take the brush and scoop it out of the syringe tip rather than dropping some onto the die. These molecules stick to each other real tight so if you scoop it out you'll save a lot more than if you did that. Also the plunger locks and pushes too much through.


----------



## Awsan

But the TIM inside looks cluttered and full of dark stuff


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> But the TIM inside looks cluttered and full of dark stuff


That should disappear once u spread it out.if it doesnt you could always wipe it off


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> But the TIM inside looks cluttered and full of dark stuff


Yea but I'm pretty sure it's ok. It's a good company so I really don't think there's anything to worry about. It might be air pockets. Pretty sure the quality is fine but you might've gotten skimped a lil


----------



## Awsan

I would like to ask some stupid questions about the topic so bare with me:

1-Is it safe to use the brush that came with CLU on the bare-die directly?
2-Is there a difference in temp between having the IHS or Direct die/cooler contact?
3-Which is better Lapping the IHS before Deliding or after[Lapping it when its separated from the CPU] ?
4-Which is better, Lapped IHS + Lapped Cooler or Bare-Die + Lapped Cooler?
5-Can i get guides on using CLU on the Die or on the IHS?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> I would like to ask some stupid questions about the topic so bare with me:
> 
> 1-Is it safe to use the brush that came with CLU on the bare-die directly?
> 2-Is there a difference in temp between having the IHS or Direct die/cooler contact?
> 3-Which is better Lapping the IHS before Deliding or after[Lapping it when its separated from the CPU] ?
> 4-Which is better, Lapped IHS + Lapped Cooler or Bare-Die + Lapped Cooler?
> 5-Can i get guides on using CLU on the Die or on the IHS?


1. Yes
2. Yes but only a few degrees in favour of direct die which you'd need to get specific mounting hardware for or risk cracking your die.
3. I would say before as it's seems easier to handle the chip but no experience in this. Someone else would probably chime in
4. If you are lapping either one then you should actually lap both ihs and cooler.
5. Go to coollaboratory website. They have a video tutorial on how to apply CLU.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> I would like to ask some stupid questions about the topic so bare with me:
> 
> 1-Is it safe to use the brush that came with CLU on the bare-die directly?
> 2-Is there a difference in temp between having the IHS or Direct die/cooler contact?
> 3-Which is better Lapping the IHS before Deliding or after[Lapping it when its separated from the CPU] ?
> 4-Which is better, Lapped IHS + Lapped Cooler or Bare-Die + Lapped Cooler?
> 5-Can i get guides on using CLU on the Die or on the IHS?


1. Yes, but if your worried about getting it on the PCB or VRMs, you can use something like coffee filter paper as well to spread it out, just fold it over a few times so you don't get it on you.
2. maybe just a couple degrees, it's just safer to run the CPU with the IHS since the socket stays covered by the clamp and the CPU wont fall out or get stuck to the Cooler.
3. Lapping after the delid is a much better option since you wont be handling the PCB, and none of the metal dust will come into contact with the CPB and Die.
4. I dont know if there there are really any full guides to applying CLU, just take your time and spread it out slowly using the included brush or a dense paper. a little CLU goes a long way, and so long as it appears reflective you should do just fine. but I'd also recommend covering the VRMs with nailpolish or electrical tape just to be safe

Also check the first post back on page 1 since it shows what and where CLU needs to be applied.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

1 Yes but keep some q tips and rubbing alcohol handy. It cleans up real easy.
2 it's marginal. If you go direct die you'll need a modified mount like EK naked ivy. The stock mounts for most heat sinks take the IHS height and the socket retention cover into account.
3 definitely after
4 just the IHS. The cooler/heat sink should already be fine.
5 it's easy. It's like painting. Dab a little on the brush, not onto the die. And paint the die until it's covered using as little as necessary to cover it. If you make a mess just clean it until you don't see any metallic residue.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> 1-Is it safe to use the brush that came with CLU on the bare-die directly?
> 2-Is there a difference in temp between having the IHS or Direct die/cooler contact?
> 3-Which is better Lapping the IHS before Deliding or after[Lapping it when its separated from the CPU] ?
> 4-Which is better, Lapped IHS + Lapped Cooler or Bare-Die + Lapped Cooler?
> 5-Can i get guides on using CLU on the Die or on the IHS?


----------



## Skullzaflare

ok im the one that cracked it lol, was sitting here last night looking at it, twisted it a little, and the die started cracking lol


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> 1 Yes but keep some q tips and rubbing alcohol handy. It cleans up real easy.
> 2 it's marginal. If you go direct die you'll need a modified mount like EK naked ivy. The stock mounts for most heat sinks take the IHS height and the socket retention cover into account.
> 3 definitely after
> 4 just the IHS. The cooler/heat sink should already be fine.
> 5 it's easy. It's like painting. Dab a little on the brush, not onto the die. And paint the die until it's covered using as little as necessary to cover it. If you make a mess just clean it until you don't see any metallic residue.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> ok im the one that cracked it lol, was sitting here last night looking at it, twisted it a little, and the die started cracking lol


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> ok im the one that cracked it lol, was sitting here last night looking at it, twisted it a little, and the die started cracking lol


Yea of course lol. soldered joints are welds in the electrical world. You probably twisted it and glass is easy to break so the weakest part broke first


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea of course lol. soldered joints are welds in the electrical world. You probably twisted it and glass is easy to break so the weakest part broke first


yea i think it cracked in half when i was getting the IHS loose, the rest was me lol

also i added 2 more pics to that post


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> ok im the one that cracked it lol, was sitting here last night looking at it, twisted it a little, and the die started cracking lol


You should post a video on what the inside of a Xeon chip looks like.

Actually I can make a video and post it on my YouTube channel if you give me permissions to use your pics. I'll give you credit lol. Lots of ppl wonder about this stuff.

Haha it would actually work out perfectly cuz someone commented on my delid video I posted earlier saying how that's not how you delid a 5820k. I can show what happens.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You should post a video on what the inside of a Xeon chip looks like.
> 
> Actually I can make a video and post it on my YouTube channel if you give me permissions to use your pics. I'll give you credit lol. Lots of ppl wonder about this stuff.
> 
> Haha it would actually work out perfectly cuz someone commented on my delid video I posted earlier saying how that's not how you delid a 5820k. I can show what happens.


can if you want lol. i dont care if you mention me or not honestly up to you lol. my names out there in alot of places already lol

Q19D 8c/16ht 1.6ghz


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> can if you want lol. i dont care if you mention me or not honestly up to you lol. my names out there in alot of places already lol
> 
> Q19D 8c/16ht 1.6ghz


Ok cool. I'll mention your name as a thanks. Still don't have a timeframe. Can you send me the pics [email protected]


----------



## Awsan

Thanks everyone ++REP!


----------



## Lefik

Quick question; is it possible to delid a G1630?

I've got a spare one, and I want something to try out the vice method on before I delid my daily driver.

edit: rephrased


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lefik*
> 
> Quick question; is it possible to delid a G1630?
> I've got a spare one, and I want something to try out the vice method on before I stick in my daily driver.


Not sure. That's an 1155 CPU. It won't fit in the same socket As Haswell.

Afaik Intel stopped soldering at ivy bridge so I think all predecessors to Haswell including non enthusiasts grade were soldered IHS


----------



## Lefik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Not sure. That's an 1155 CPU. It won't fit in the same socket As Haswell.
> 
> Afaik Intel stopped soldering at ivy bridge so I think all predecessors to Haswell including non enthusiasts grade were soldered IHS


I know it won't fit; my daily driver is my Ivy bridge rig. The ivy rig has a 3570k that overclocks really well, while my Haswell rig has a really poor clocking 4670k.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lefik*
> 
> I know it won't fit; my daily driver is my Ivy bridge rig. The ivy rig has a 3570k that overclocks really well, while my Haswell rig has a really poor clocking 4670k.


Have you deluded your Haswell?


----------



## Lefik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Have you deluded your Haswell?


Nope, haven't delided anything ever.

Just realized I didn't write out part of my original question very well. I want to try to delid the G1630 for practice before I delid my daily driver.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Well, according to Intel's page, the G1630 runs on the 22nm architecture on LGA1150, which puts it in Ivy-Bridge territory, which should mean that is its not soldered, and should be safe to delid for practice purposes..


----------



## Lefik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Well, according to Intel's page, the G1630 runs on the 22nm architecture on LGA1150, which puts it in Ivy-Bridge territory, which should mean that is its not soldered, and should be safe to delid for practice purposes..


That's what I was thinking, except the G1630 is 1155









Thanks all.


----------



## Brohem0th

Tomorrow I get my NH-D15. I have brand-new tubes of CLU and CLP ready to go. I'll try to snap some pictures and post some benchmarks for everyone here, expecting a pretty huge headroom boost from my current Hyper 212+ (although I must admit, it being safe up to 1.325v in Prime95 v26.6 is really, really impressive for a budget cooler that's three iterations old).

CLU is the superior paste. Is it safe to use between the IHS and Heatsink heat-plate? Both are nickel-plated copper, and thus they should both be safe, but I just wanted to be sure before I went ahead with this.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lefik*
> 
> That's what I was thinking, except the G1630 is 1155
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks all.


It will be pasted, as the Sandy Bridge based Celerons/Pentiums are Gxxx not G1xxx as you have.

Literally anything except Sandy bridge based on 1155/1150 is pasted and not soldered.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Tomorrow I get my NH-D15. I have brand-new tubes of CLU and CLP ready to go. I'll try to snap some pictures and post some benchmarks for everyone here, expecting a pretty huge headroom boost from my current Hyper 212+ (although I must admit, it being safe up to 1.325v in Prime95 v26.6 is really, really impressive for a budget cooler that's three iterations old).
> 
> CLU is the superior paste. Is it safe to use between the IHS and Heatsink heat-plate? Both are nickel-plated copper, and thus they should both be safe, but I just wanted to be sure before I went ahead with this.


As long as there isn't any aluminum in the base of the cooler, CLU and CLP will be great. I've seen a few unfortunate heatsinks fail and collapse due to CLU bonding with the aluminum base.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> As long as there isn't any aluminum in the base of the cooler, CLU and CLP will be great. I've seen a few unfortunate heatsinks fail and collapse due to CLU bonding with the aluminum base.


dont the aluminum base usually have a nickel plating?
my nh-d14 appears to have a nickel coating on the base


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> dont the aluminum base usually have a nickel plating?
> my nh-d14 appears to have a nickel coating on the base


NH-D14 is copper base. The only thing that's aluminium on that cooler are the fins.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Copper base with nickel coating? Bottom is almost a silver mirror


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> Copper base with nickel coating? Bottom is almost a silver mirror


Yup! If you would scratch up the base, you would see that it's copper underneath. The heat-pipes are also nickel plated and are really copper. It's only the fins that are aluminium.


----------



## v1ral

Has anyone Delid and used the H220X?
I am on the verge of delidding to get past my thermal/vcore limit, does delidding get past vcore limit.

With my overclock on an h70 I feel that I have more headroom at 1.2 @ 4.7Ghz...


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Yup! If you would scratch up the base, you would see that it's copper underneath. The heat-pipes are also nickel plated and are really copper. It's only the fins that are aluminium.


I would scour the heatsink plate and IHS if I had the time, but I'll actually be doing this at work on my lunch break (I work at a PC shop) so I just don't have the time today. I know it can make a 1-2c difference in temps, but I'm not even hitting 80c in Handbrake with my currently delidded 4690k with some Antec Nano-Diamond Formula 6 thermal paste at 1.330v Vcore/4.7Ghz, so I don't think it should be necessary









Friggin UPS man better get here quick, I'm the only one in the shop today and I've got three onsite calls to make this afternoon.

(I know you're not really supposed to use nano-diamond compounds on the die on a delid, but it was the best I had at the time. If you remove it carefully it shouldn't scratch the surface of the die, I'm well prepared. Got some clear nail polish to cover the caps and VRM's on the chip as well)

Thanks for the sanity check. I know it seems dumb but I just wanted to make 110% sure everything would be copacetic.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Has anyone Delid and used the H220X?
> I am on the verge of delidding to get past my thermal/vcore limit, does delidding get past vcore limit.
> 
> With my overclock on an h70 I feel that I have more headroom at 1.2 @ 4.7Ghz...


very rarely does Vcore change through delidding, only thing that will change that is the silicon lottery and sometimes LN2 benching







. Thermals will move nicely though!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lefik*
> 
> That's what I was thinking, except the G1630 is 1155
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks all.


Well it's a difference of 5 pins so it may work but I'm not sure.


----------



## GTMoraes

So I've just installed my H90. Should've checked that it's a 140km rad and fan. Had to mod my XPredator X1 case so it could fit lol

Well, I'm getting around 60ish during games, 70ish during stress tests and 90ish during Prime95 Small FFT. Are those Temps alright or kinda high? I've been contemplating a delid, but the only paste I got available here is the DeepCool Z5, and Idk if it would be worth the delidding risk, or even worth at all.

I'm also using the stock pre-applied thermal paste that came on the H90 CPU block. Is it good or should I replace it with my Z5?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> So I've just installed my H90. Should've checked that it's a 140km rad and fan. Had to mod my XPredator X1 case so it could fit lol
> 
> Well, I'm getting around 60ish during games, 70ish during stress tests and 90ish during Prime95 Small FFT. Are those Temps alright or kinda high? I've been contemplating a delid, but the only paste I got available here is the DeepCool Z5, and Idk if it would be worth the delidding risk, or even worth at all.
> 
> I'm also using the stock pre-applied thermal paste that came on the H90 CPU block. Is it good or should I replace it with my Z5?


That's a safe voltage you're at if you're getting those temps. You shouldn't increase the voltage beyond that unless you have a custom loop and clu. Whatever clocks you are getting now, you should attempt OC without further voltage modification. Also be sure to activate c states once you dial in your OC. Also set it up for adaptive voltage once you dial it in.


----------



## Lefik

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Well it's a difference of 5 pins so it may work but I'm not sure.


There is no compatibility issue, and I don't see how this misunderstanding came up.

I have an 1155 G1630, which I put into my 1155 motherboard.


----------



## GTMoraes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> That's a safe voltage you're at if you're getting those temps. You shouldn't increase the voltage beyond that unless you have a custom loop and clu. Whatever clocks you are getting now, you should attempt OC without further voltage modification. Also be sure to activate c states once you dial in your OC. Also set it up for adaptive voltage once you dial it in.


Sorry, I didn't understand. Voltage? I'm running at [email protected] I'm OK with my frequency as I like round numbers lol

I'm just wondering if the temperatures are fine (60ish for games, 70ish in stress test, 90ish in Prime95 small FFT using AVX2)


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> Sorry, I didn't understand. Voltage? I'm running at [email protected] I'm OK with my frequency as I like round numbers lol
> 
> I'm just wondering if the temperatures are fine (60ish for games, 70ish in stress test, 90ish in Prime95 small FFT using AVX2)


Well, my 1620 on 4.5ghz 1.31v, ambient 22c, I idle at 32-35, games and low load 40-42, prime95 max heat 58-60
On my nocta in my sig


----------



## jagdtigger

I just replaced the mx4 under the IHS with CLU but my 4670k still throttles from p95(yes, i set voltage control to static)... My cpu currently running at 4,7 [email protected],440V(tested wit x264).


----------



## GTMoraes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> Well, my 1620 on 4.5ghz 1.31v, ambient 22c, I idle at 32-35, games and low load 40-42, prime95 max heat 58-60
> On my nocta in my sig


Delidded? Which paste
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jagdtigger*
> 
> I just replaced the mx4 under the IHS with CLU but my 4670k still throttles from p95(yes, i set voltage control to static)... My cpu currently running at 4,7 [email protected],440V(tested wit x264).


How long have you been using the Mx4? Did it work fine between the IHS and the proc die? How many degrees have you managed to lose with Mx4?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jagdtigger*
> 
> I just replaced the mx4 under the IHS with CLU but my 4670k still throttles from p95(yes, i set voltage control to static)... My cpu currently running at 4,7 [email protected],440V(tested wit x264).


That's just the way it is. The newest version of p95 uses those new AVX2 instruction that were introduced with Haswell. Those can have a lot better performance than the older AVX instructions, but that added performance does not come free: you have to pay for it with ridiculous power use and temperatures.

Video encoding with x264 also uses AVX2, but it does only use as much as makes sense for a real-world problem (the video encoding). Prime95 instead plays around with a math problem and uses a lot more AVX2 and the temperatures then go through the roof.

What you can try for fun is download the older version of prime95 that only uses features of Ivy Bridge at most (so no AVX2). I think this version should be it:

http://www.mersenne.org/ftp_root/gimps/p95v279.win64.zip

Overall, you should ignore prime95, and also Intel's "linpack" stress test (that's what's used by IntelBurnTest).

Check out the thread in this sub-forum that's named "haswell overclocking thread (with statistics)", and see what other Haswell owners think.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> Delidded? Which paste
> How long have you been using the Mx4? Did it work fine between the IHS and the proc die? How many degrees have you managed to lose with Mx4?


I currently have not delidded my 1620, as5, though I like mx4 and nouctas paste better


----------



## jagdtigger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTMoraes*
> 
> How long have you been using the Mx4? Did it work fine between the IHS and the proc die? How many degrees have you managed to lose with Mx4?


I use it for several years and its working like a charm. It worked fine between the IHS and die when i pushed the cpu at 4,5 GHz. Here is my old post:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/27080#post_23605265

@ deepor
Ok, thanks for the info. I will use p95 from now on only for testing new CPUs at stock speed...


----------



## Brohem0th

Installed a NH-D15 onto my delidded 4690k, applied CLU between the die and IHS and also between the IHS and heatsink. 4.9Ghz/1.4v is Handbrake stable for 12 loops/two hours, 4.8Ghz/1.365v is also Handbrake 12 loop stable, and 5Ghz at a whopping 1.44v is Handbrake 12 loop stable.

4.8/1.365v is 64c/64c/64c/56c, 4.9Ghz/1.4v is 70c/70c/70c/63c, and 5Ghz/1.44v is 79c/79c/79c/72c on Handbrake 12 loop stability test. Prime95 v26.6 Small FFT's adds about 6-8c to each coretemp at their respective clockspeeds and voltages. Literally could not be happier. I normally run it at 4.8Ghz for the majority of my games, haven't had a reason to run it harder just yet.

This is at max fan speed on both fans in a midtower with three 140mm case fans and three 120mm case fans so there's plenty of airflow. NH-D15 is a beast, CLU is the truth, just make sure you use clear nail polish (also referred to as topcoat) on the strip of VRMs/Capacitors to the left of the die.


----------



## murrayjhart

Firstly i must say that this tread is amazing and gave me all the confidence to try delidding my own CPU.

I was very sceptical of people results and was adamant that it was people exaggerating thier results. I am now a believer!

Delidded Intel i5 4670K using the vise method. Took a few solid hits to get it off. Hands were trembling while doing it but off she came. Before delid i was running a 4.5Ghz Overclock with 1.24V with temps of 82 degrees. The same settings after delid and applying CLU to both the die and the ihs has dropped the temps to an amazing 58 degrees.

Will be trying to up the clock speed over the next few days but at the moment I'm just please with the huge temp drop.

OCN name: murrayjhart
CPU: Intel i5 4670K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: 4.5
Temp drops: 24
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *murrayjhart*
> 
> Firstly i must say that this tread is amazing and gave me all the confidence to try delidding my own CPU.
> 
> I was very sceptical of people results and was adamant that it was people exaggerating thier results. I am now a believer!
> 
> Delidded Intel i5 4670K using the vise method. Took a few solid hits to get it off. Hands were trembling while doing it but off she came. Before delid i was running a 4.5Ghz Overclock with 1.24V with temps of 82 degrees. The same settings after delid and applying CLU to both the die and the ihs has dropped the temps to an amazing 58 degrees.
> 
> Will be trying to up the clock speed over the next few days but at the moment I'm just please with the huge temp drop.
> 
> OCN name: murrayjhart
> CPU: Intel i5 4670K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 24
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That's a nice drop in temps. You have quite a bit of CLU on there though, seems pretty dangerous if it decides to flow anywhere. "A little bit goes a long way" should basically be the motto for CLP/CLU.


----------



## cephelix

@murrayjhart From your pics I don't see you insulating your FIVR with either Liquid Electrical Tape or clear nail polish. If you didn't, you might want to if/when you can be bothered to dismantle your loop


----------



## murrayjhart

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> @murrayjhart From your pics I don't see you insulating your FIVR with either Liquid Electrical Tape or clear nail polish. If you didn't, you might want to if/when you can be bothered to dismantle your loop


I did use clear nail polish before I placed the ihs back on. Should have really taken a photo of this but thanks for the message.

How do i go about getting the delidded sig for my account then?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *murrayjhart*
> 
> I did use clear nail polish before I placed the ihs back on. Should have really taken a photo of this but thanks for the message.
> 
> How do i go about getting the delidded sig for my account then?


Good to know. Don't want you or anyone for that matter to waste their hard earned cash just because of an oversight. As for membership, the first post in this thread has info. Once mod has confirmed your membership, you can slappa dat sig on.lol


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *murrayjhart*
> 
> Firstly i must say that this tread is amazing and gave me all the confidence to try delidding my own CPU.
> 
> I was very sceptical of people results and was adamant that it was people exaggerating thier results. I am now a believer!
> 
> Delidded Intel i5 4670K using the vise method. Took a few solid hits to get it off. Hands were trembling while doing it but off she came. Before delid i was running a 4.5Ghz Overclock with 1.24V with temps of 82 degrees. The same settings after delid and applying CLU to both the die and the ihs has dropped the temps to an amazing 58 degrees.
> 
> Will be trying to up the clock speed over the next few days but at the moment I'm just please with the huge temp drop.
> 
> OCN name: murrayjhart
> CPU: Intel i5 4670K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: 4.5
> Temp drops: 24
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## asm99

Received this gem 2 days ago and I'm going to delidd it.
However I have a question: What kind of epoxy shall I use to glue the IHS back to the PCB? Any recommendations/links? Thanks.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> Received this gem 2 days ago and I'm going to delidd it.
> However I have a question: What kind of epoxy shall I use to glue the IHS back to the PCB? Any recommendations/links? Thanks.


No epoxy. Removing the stock adhesive and reducing the amount of space between the die and the IHS is part of the reason for delidding.


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> No epoxy. Removing the stock adhesive and reducing the amount of space between the die and the IHS is part of the reason for delidding.


Yes, I understand that. BUT how do I glue the IHS back to the PCB?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> Yes, I understand that. BUT how do I glue the IHS back to the PCB?


There's no need to glue it back on. You can if you really and absolutely feel you need to, but it's not necessary and could end up being counter-productive.

The first post of this thread has tips on installing the CPU after delidding.


----------



## leo5111

from pictures i see the 3770k sees easy to De-lid? looks like their are no caps or anything on top with the cpu die is that stuff on em hard to cut through? thanks


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *leo5111*
> 
> from pictures i see the 3770k sees easy to De-lid? looks like their are no caps or anything on top with the cpu die is that stuff on em hard to cut through? thanks


The ivybridges are easier to cut in that respect. There aren't any caps next to the die unlike haswells. Though, you still have to becareful not to nick the pcb(when using razor method) or prevent chip from flying away(hammer and vice) or pcb/die breaking(vice only)


----------



## jamtin

I recently delidded a socket 1150 processor and was happy with results. I did a quick rummage and found a few processors that were also very easy to delid. They were socket 478 & socket 775 processors. I didn't have a razor like commonly seen in the delidded pictures but I did have a simple plastic work knife. I opened it all the way up and carefully used the base of the blade on the corners of IHS in one hand and gripped the processor on the opposing corner between a wad of paper towel with the other hand. Repeated this process on all corners then ran the top of the blade somewhat tentatively along the sides to break the seal.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamtin*
> 
> I recently delidded a socket 1150 processor and was happy with results. I did a quick rummage and found a few processors that were also very easy to delid. They were socket 478 & socket 775 processors. I didn't have a razor like commonly seen in the delidded pictures but I did have a simple plastic work knife. I opened it all the way up and carefully used the base of the blade on the corners of IHS in one hand and gripped the processor on the opposing corner between a wad of paper towel with the other hand. Repeated this process on all corners then ran the top of the blade somewhat tentatively along the sides to break the seal.


Was it a non-k chip that you de-lidded? I can't be bothered checking right now but has anyone de-lidded a non-k chip at all?


----------



## jamtin

I did 2 socket 1150 G3258 (SR1V0), 1 socket 775 E2220 (SLA8W) and 1 socket 478 P4 (SL6PF) processors.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Was it a non-k chip that you de-lidded? I can't be bothered checking right now but has anyone de-lidded a non-k chip at all?


I've delidded a Non-K 3770 due to poor stock thermals. By bro was noticing 80C+ Temps while gaming with his H100i
and after delidding the average dropped about 10-15C, tho one core idles a little high which is also the coolest core under load... Go figure.


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamtin*
> 
> I did 2 socket 1150 G3258 (SR1V0), 1 socket 775 E2220 (SLA8W) and 1 socket 478 P4 (SL6PF) processors.


I've done quite a few 478 chips as practice and even a few E2xxx chips and a single E7xxx chip for an OEM PC as I was bored/wanted to lower the noise for my sisters PC.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I've delidded a Non-K 3770 due to poor stock thermals. By bro was noticing 80C+ Temps while gaming with his H100i
> and after delidding the average dropped about 10-15C, tho one core idles a little high which is also the coolest core under load... Go figure.


Yeah, most chips have one hotter core overall. It's either due to thermal spread, the location on the chip or just a general thing who knows really? As long as it's under temperature it's fine though.

80c would have been fine, but that's in a H100i which should be getting a lot better at stock, I'm amazed that it was so high. I'm betting that the H100i got a lot hotter after a de-lid?


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Matt-Matt*
> 
> Yeah, most chips have one hotter core overall. It's either due to thermal spread, the location on the chip or just a general thing who knows really? As long as it's under temperature it's fine though.
> 
> 80c would have been fine, but that's in a H100i which should be getting a lot better at stock, I'm amazed that it was so high. I'm betting that the H100i got a lot hotter after a de-lid?


yeah, all CPUs I've delidded have the usual 10C variance (except for mine with 4C variance) but the odd part is that its only hot when idle, and the coolest under load.

my 4770K on an H100i played Games around 65C and Stressed around 80C with a full overclock of 4.4GHz, so having a Non-K running hotter at stock than that wasn't really acceptable..

But we have noticed times after the delid where during idle the H100i will just be pouring out hot air, but when gaming and the fans on high, the temps are pretty normal. But it hasn't done that in a long time, so idk


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> yeah, all CPUs I've delidded have the usual 10C variance (except for mine with 4C variance) but the odd part is that its only hot when idle, and the coolest under load.
> 
> my 4770K on an H100i played Games around 65C and Stressed around 80C with a full overclock of 4.4GHz, so having a Non-K running hotter at stock than that wasn't really acceptable..
> 
> But we have noticed times after the delid where during idle the H100i will just be pouring out hot air, but when gaming and the fans on high, the temps are pretty normal. But it hasn't done that in a long time, so idk


Hmm, I didn't really check the discepancies between cores pre/post de-lid, I did my de-lid over 2 years ago now lol.

I did notice that my Silver Arrow SB-E at the time was almost room temperature under Intel Burn Test pre -de-lid and it was warmer/hot post. I noticed at least a 25c drop on all cores.


----------



## Bigm

Is it necessary to use nail polish or liquid electrical tape on the caps or am I safe running without it? I currently have my 4790k running without anything on the caps using NT-H1 on the die because I ran out of CL. I'm going to order more CL and need to know if I need to order liquid electrical tape or not.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigm*
> 
> Is it necessary to use nail polish or liquid electrical tape on the caps or am I safe running without it? I currently have my 4790k running without anything on the caps using NT-H1 on the die because I ran out of CL. I'm going to order more CL and need to know if I need to order liquid electrical tape or not.


Well, the TIM you're using is non-conductive so you wouldn't have to insulate the caps. But if you're going to use CLU, then as a precaution, it is always preferable to insulate them with nail polish or LET. you wouldn't wan't a stray microbead of CLU to take out your chip now..


----------



## Bigm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Well, the TIM you're using is non-conductive so you wouldn't have to insulate the caps. But if you're going to use CLU, then as a precaution, it is always preferable to insulate them with nail polish or LET. you wouldn't wan't a stray microbead of CLU to take out your chip now..


That's what I thought. I'll just order some clear nail polish with my CLU. +rep


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bigm*
> 
> That's what I thought. I'll just order some clear nail polish with my CLU. +rep


Thanks man.....I just apply a few thin layers, so drying time is minimised. You don't want to glob it on there.


----------



## Ceadderman

Order some clear nail polish? Say what?









Have you a significant other? Mother? Sister? Female of any ties in your life? Save yourself some cash and hit them up. I guarantee one of them Women's got some. Tell Em you're working on your computer if they ask and stand back. I asked my daughter for some an she was like...


















~Ceadder


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Order some clear nail polish? Say what?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have you a significant other? Mother? Sister? Female of any ties in your life? Save yourself some cash and hit them up. I guarantee one of them Women's got some. Tell Em you're working on your computer if they ask and stand back. I asked my daughter for some an she was like...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Lol. To be fair, I had to buy some as well since nobody at home or work had clear nail polish. Many other colours, but none were clear


----------



## Ceadderman

Dollar Tree local to you? .98cent store?









Gotta be a better way.







lulz

~Ceadder


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Lol. To be fair, I had to buy some as well since nobody at home or work had clear nail polish. Many other colours, but none were clear


Pink would work too.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Pink would work too.


But that would like so clash with the base colour *hair flick*


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Pink would work too.
> 
> 
> 
> But that would like so clash with the base colour *hair flick*
Click to expand...

unless you are going to be running around topless, nobody cares what color you got on under your top.

Need pics if you go topless.


----------



## Ceadderman

Please Lord let that *not* happen.









~Ceadder


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> unless you are going to be running around topless, nobody cares what color you got on under your top.
> 
> Need pics if you go topless.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Please Lord let that *not* happen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


lol.....too busy playing arkham city to go topless


----------



## white owl

Should I delid my i5?



Are temps supposed to be that far apart?
And if I do do it, would Antec Formula 7 work better than factory TIM?
It seems like getting the thick black goo off would help alot.

Also, I have an E7500. Could I practice on it?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Should I delid my i5?
> 
> 
> 
> Are temps supposed to be that far apart?
> And if I do do it, would Antec Formula 7 work better than factory TIM?
> It seems like getting the thick black goo off would help alot.
> 
> Also, I have an E7500. Could I practice on it?


Whether or not you delid depends on whether you want to get an extra couple of points out of it. You might be able to do 5GHz since those seem like pretty good temps. What voltage are you running?

That kind of temperature variation can happen with the chips. But unless you have some kind of liquid metal paste I wouldn't bother. I did mine with Gelid GC extreme before going to CLP and the Gelid was just rubbish, either go all out or don't waste your time, at least that is my advice.

As for the E7500. I believe that is a soldered chip, so no good practicing on that one.


----------



## white owl

I can't get 4.8 stable @ 1.35v
Some can get 5.0 out if that =(
I don't know what else I can change other than the voltage and the multiplier.

It's not getting too hot, I just wanted them to all be the same. 10 degrees seems like a big difference.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> I can't get 4.8 stable @ 1.35v
> Some can get 5.0 out if that =(
> I don't know what else I can change other than the voltage and the multiplier.
> 
> It's not getting too hot, I just wanted them to all be the same. 10 degrees seems like a big difference.


That "some" might be 1 processor out of 50.000 capable of running 5Ghz 24/7 1.35V.
And the people running 5Ghz @ 1.35V isn't stable for everyday use.

Don't get fooled by the magic 5Ghz. Chased it for a long time and ended up with 4.9Ghz @ 1.35V at best (not gaming stable, so useless).


----------



## cephelix

Yeah, everyone here me included want that magical five-o. But alas, only a few actually get to that point. I cant even get mine stable at 4.7/1.32V. For now I've put oc-ing on the backburner and enjoying my games.


----------



## Hambone07si

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *koekwau5*
> 
> That "some" might be 1 processor out of 50.000 capable of running 5Ghz 24/7 1.35V.
> And the people running 5Ghz @ 1.35V isn't stable for everyday use.
> 
> Don't get fooled by the magic 5Ghz. Chased it for a long time and ended up with 4.9Ghz @ 1.35V at best (not gaming stable, so useless).


I beg to differ buddy. I run my 4790K at 5ghz ALL DAY LONG. My cpu does 5ghz with 1.300v with HT off max temps of 66c during stress. For running 5ghz with HT on it takes 1.350v and max temps are 78c, and this is with ambient temps at 70f in my place. This is also the way the cpu came and I haven't de lid it yet. I don't think I need to but I am thinking about it.

My old 4790K would only do 4.8ghz with 1.375v. No where near as good as this one is.

Click on my build log and the 3rd page is where you will see all my bios settings posted for 5ghz


----------



## Valgaur

Come on! push that vcore!!!

this was on cold ice water cooling!

http://valid.canardpc.com/2558184

RIP Franky


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Come on! push that vcore!!!
> 
> this was on cold ice water cooling!
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2558184
> 
> RIP Franky


hoiy voltage batman! i never even took a conroe or anything that high! lol


----------



## knoober

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Come on! push that vcore!!!
> 
> this was on cold ice water cooling!
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/2558184
> 
> RIP Franky


Living proof that when they say to call it quits @ 1.5v or under, they are just dead crazy wrong!


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> Living proof that when they say to call it quits @ 1.5v or under, they are just dead crazy wrong!


i dont know if i would say all chips could survive a start that high lol
would be like having a box of 10a fuses, a few might hold 11, but some might die at 9


----------



## Valgaur

That chip could really pound away the vcore, I've got a few at max vcore usage on LN2, so kind of saves the chips thanks to -250F temps


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> That chip could really pound away the vcore, I've got a few at max vcore usage on LN2, so kind of saves the chips thanks to -250F temps


think my board says i can go to 2.1v in the bios, no way lol


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hambone07si*
> 
> I beg to differ buddy. I run my 4790K at 5ghz ALL DAY LONG. My cpu does 5ghz with 1.300v with HT off max temps of 66c during stress. For running 5ghz with HT on it takes 1.350v and max temps are 78c, and this is with ambient temps at 70f in my place. This is also the way the cpu came and I haven't de lid it yet. I don't think I need to but I am thinking about it.
> 
> My old 4790K would only do 4.8ghz with 1.375v. No where near as good as this one is.
> 
> Click on my build log and the 3rd page is where you will see all my bios settings posted for 5ghz


5Ghz with HT off is a whole other story than HT on








Mine is capable of doing that as well but I don't see the point of disabling it, I would've bought the i5 instead.


----------



## JackCY

But then with i5 you get the worse chips. Where as 4790K is a pick of the litter and clocks on average higher.

I would rather run 4.5 with HT ON than 5.0 with HT off.


----------



## v1ral

Would delidding help me overcome the wall im experiencing?
I'm stuck at 4.7Ghz anything above will need more that 1.25 vcore.
Or perhaps adding more radiator space help cool it down?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Would delidding help me overcome the wall im experiencing?
> I'm stuck at 4.7Ghz anything above will need more that 1.25 vcore.
> Or perhaps adding more radiator space help cool it down?


It will help if you're hitting a temp ceiling. If youre not limited by temp (CPU avg core under 95 at load) and you're stuck at that freq regardless of how much voltage you put in you're not gaining from delidding. That's called silicon lottery.


----------



## white owl

Feel lucky to have 4.7.
1.35 is what it takes for me to get 4.8.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Feel lucky to have 4.7.
> 1.35 is what it takes for me to get 4.8.


You should feel fortunate. If your temps are reasonable you can go for 4.8 but you're reaching the point of diminishing returns. Watercooling and delidding will help but like I said, diminishing returns. This is coming from a relatively inexperienced water cooler. I think I've done alright for myself though lol


----------



## v1ral

Well, 4.7Ghz at 1.213 vcore isn't bad with my CPU.
I suppose no need for a delid....
I would definitely be delidding if im heating temp limits , but um not. Just a wall...
Thanks for the reassurance


----------



## white owl

4.6 = 1.25
4.8 = 1.35

I stuck with 4.6. I'll keep 4.8 when i get a better cooler.


----------



## JackCY

Encoding x264/x265 stable?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Well I would run [email protected] just in case it's not 100% stable. It stresses stability so you'll know pretty quick if it's not stable. Just my 2cents


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Yea those can be delidded....I would venture to say you would be doing yourself a disservice if you didnt delid those considering they are unlocked and have garbage TIM.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jamtin*
> 
> I did 2 socket 1150 G3258 (SR1V0), 1 socket 775 E2220 (SLA8W) and 1 socket 478 P4 (SL6PF) processors.


Yea those can be delidded....I would venture to say you would be doing yourself a disservice if you didnt delid those considering they are unlocked and have garbage TIM.


----------



## Ceadderman

~Ceadder


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> The ivybridges are easier to cut in that respect. There aren't any caps next to the die unlike haswells. Though, you still have to becareful not to nick the pcb(when using razor method) or prevent chip from flying away(hammer and vice) or pcb/die breaking(vice only)


This is precisely why i strongly advocate using this method: Best Ive seen so far...used it on three chips so far! Im planning on making a much more detailed video, but honestly i think this video does the job.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> This is precisely why i strongly advocate using this method: Best Ive seen so far...used it on three chips so far! Im planning on making a much more detailed video, but honestly i think this video does the job.


Nice vid. That's the method I used as well, the vice-only method. You could also cover the jaws with masking tape though with these things it's a matter of eyeballing it. The tape has to be thick enough so the teeth don't bite into the chip but yet thin enough to still hold the chip in place. I find applying about 2-3 layers of masking tape works. Also got to make sure that the chip sits square between the jaws and not at an angle or more pressure is going to be applied to one side of the ihs and pcb.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Nice vid. That's the method I used as well, the vice-only method. You could also cover the jaws with masking tape though with these things it's a matter of eyeballing it. The tape has to be thick enough so the teeth don't bite into the chip but yet thin enough to still hold the chip in place. I find applying about 2-3 layers of masking tape works. Also got to make sure that the chip sits square between the jaws and not at an angle or more pressure is going to be applied to one side of the ihs and pcb.


Thanks. I'm really surprised more ppl don't use it. As long as you line up the PCb flush with the vise jaw on one side and put the other side just under the top of the jaw you can get the right angle you are supposed to have a slight angle because each jaw is supposed to grasp something different. One the PCb and the other the ihs


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Thanks. I'm really surprised more ppl don't use it. As long as you line up the PCb flush with the vise jaw on one side and put the other side just under the top of the jaw you can get the right angle you are supposed to have a slight angle because each jaw is supposed to grasp something different. One the PCb and the other the ihs


Yup..that's how it works. I applied heat to the ihs as well by using a hair dryer. Don't rightly know if it actually helped or not, just something I did


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Yup..that's how it works. I applied heat to the ihs as well by using a hair dryer. Don't rightly know if it actually helped or not, just something I did


Not sure. It probably did but it's unnecessary. The vise puts enough shearing force into the CPU that the ihs is removed really easily. And the fact that it doesn't fly is even better. Totally controlled.


----------



## Brohem0th

Whoever said you get the worse chips with the i5's? They might take some more voltage to run but they're not all bad. I run a 4690k at 4.9/1.41v, and not only is it handbrake stable, it's stable running OBS and playing games/running 3DMark11 at the same time. This is with an NH-D15 and CLU applied to the die and IHS.

Also, what's the protocol for selling delidded CPU's? I'm getting a 4790k (Vietnam chip, which all seem to be really good chips) and I'd like to sell my old i5 to make back some of the money.

Is it worth less if it's been run overclocked? It's been over 80c for about half an hour of its life, and that was all stress testing with Prime95. It's never been over 90c, and when it was that hot it wasn't even at 1.41v since I had a Hyper 212+ and it could only handle 1.325v comfortably. Running Handbrake for eight hours it topped out at 71c. It's already been delidded so technically that should make it worth more but idk.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Whoever said you get the worse chips with the i5's? They might take some more voltage to run but they're not all bad. I run a 4690k at 4.9/1.41v, and not only is it handbrake stable, it's stable running OBS and playing games/running 3DMark11 at the same time. This is with an NH-D15 and CLU applied to the die and IHS.
> 
> Also, what's the protocol for selling delidded CPU's? I'm getting a 4790k (Vietnam chip, which all seem to be really good chips) and I'd like to sell my old i5 to make back some of the money.
> 
> Is it worth less if it's been run overclocked? It's been over 80c for about half an hour of its life, and that was all stress testing with Prime95. It's never been over 90c, and when it was that hot it wasn't even at 1.41v since I had a Hyper 212+ and it could only handle 1.325v comfortably. Running Handbrake for eight hours it topped out at 71c. It's already been delidded so technically that should make it worth more but idk.


If you overclock or delid youre limiting your resale options - reason being youre modifying from its stock setup. Plus high risk stuff like that, people like to do that themselves so they can make sure they do it right. Thats not to imply that you did or didnt do a good job, but that's my rationale anyway...

I wouldnt mention the thing about temps, because it doesnt mean anything, and you're detrimenting your claim at a higher price.

Apart from that, you can show benchmarks and pictures to assure the potential buyer that it's a good investment. I wouldnt charge extra for the fact that it's delidded but you should get a decent fetch for that cpu. I'd go for it


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 
> 
> First off is this:
> 
> *Disclaimer delidding is a very dangerous process! Only delid if you truly believe you are ready after reading and watching and viewing all the necessary materials that apply to delidding and getting all necessary equipment ready as well!*
> 
> MOD NOTE: Delidding your CPU does void its warranty. If you RMA the chip it is classed as RMA fraud, please do not discuss such actions in this thread or anywhere on OCN.
> 
> Second off is this!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *There is a new way to delid! so go share some love at these guys's home and come join the Official Club here!*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Here is some great tips and helpful information on the Vice method! (courtesy of ucantescape1992)
> 
> 
> 
> Hey guys! Two days ago I posted saying "YOLO, going in the vice now". Within 5 minutes of posting that I was done.
> 
> I have some tips for and info on the vice method for people who have never done it, or are still afraid of this method. For the record, I successfully delided my 3770K with a THICK box cutting razor. There was not a scratch on the PCB, and it took me all of 5 minutes. I'll admit I was careless, but I'm damn good with my hands.
> 
> Onto the vice method!
> 
> For those that don't want to buy a Vice, or think that the razor method is cheaper and safer, THINK AGAIN! Two days ago I bought a 4" Drill Press Vice from Lowe's for $19. The Part number is BV-DP40. This is probably the best vice for the job. And for all you people who don't want to drop $20 on a vice just to delid, Lowe's has a 90 day return policy! I don't feel guilty about returning the vice because: 1. The box is in perfect condition, 2. The vice jaws were covered in blue painters tape to protect both the jaws, and my IHS, and 3. The vice has not a scratch on it, and was never bolted to a bench/ table. So after you're done, return it! That's a free delid folks.
> 
> Here's the vice I used. It's 30 on amazon, but only $19 at Lowe's! And at Lowe's you have 90 days to return it.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Bessey-BV-DP40-Drill-Press-Vise/dp/B0057PUDLY
> 
> Onward. Here's how I positioned the vice. The operation was completed on my kitchen counter. I have a board underneath the vice to protect my counter, and a board held vertically behind the vice that serves two purposes. 1: To protect my kitchen counter molding, and 2: To give the vice a solid backing, since all of the force will be directed that way.
> 
> With this setup, the vice will not move, and will be just as secure as if it were bolted to a work bench.
> 
> Now for the positioning of the IHS in the vice. I haven't seen this discussed much so I'll add my suggestion for how it should be placed. For Haswell, secure the IHS in the vice so that the VRM side is facing you, meaning you will be hitting the VRM side with your block.
> 
> Why? Because this minimizes the risk of both the VRM's and the Die itself from hitting anything after it is free of the IHS. Take a look in my pictures at the layout of the 4770k after I crack it open. You'll see that the side of the chip which has the most clearance between the die and the edge of the PCB or IHS is the side opposite that of the VRM side. You want to hit the VRM side because once your chip is free it will move forward, and when oriented this way your VRM's and die are furthest from the threats they are approaching. For Ivy, just make sure your vice is clamping the flanged sides of the IHS, this will allow the most safety clearance for the die. Phew that was a lengthy explanation for such a simple concept. Here's an example of how a 4770K/4670K should be clamped.
> 
> Now for what material your hitting block should be made of. PINE. That's it, no other woods, don't even think about it. Pine is soft enough to not damage the PCB, yet strong enough to break the seal easily. Use a section of 2x4 (Two by Four) with nice square edges. I'd recommend a length no shorter than 8", and no longer than 14". The shorter the block, the less force it can absorb meaning the PCB will take more brute force. Too long, and it may become difficult to hold and control.
> 
> Now hold the block, with its clean flat and square side, directly parallel to the PCB. Apply pressure towards the PCB with your hand, this eliminates the chance of the block slipping off, or a slapping effect on the PCB which we DO NOT WANT.
> 
> Hit the thing, hard. However technique is also involved in this stage. When you're hitting a nail, you swing hard and follow through; the point being to drive the nail with the follow through of your hammer's blow. This isn't the type of swing you want. We want concise yet powerful taps, no follow through. If you hit the PCB with a full blown nail driving follow through, you'll send it flying. Bad. So to reiterate: Strong, yet controlled and concise hits. Your PCB should be free in a few hits, and it shouldn't even go flying if you follow this technique. When I did mine, the PCB broke free and rested right on top on the IHS, no drama whatsoever.
> 
> After the PCB was free I inspected the edge that was hit. It was immaculate, not even a micro-scratch or dent to be seen. My block of wood (2x4 cut in half laying in my garage, PINE) took all the force. You can see here how the block fared afterwards. This proves that the PCB is much stronger than pine.
> 
> As for cleaning off the glue, I've heard some people complain saying it's hard to get off. >_> Get real. Use the corner of a credit card and scrape it off. Scrape as hard as you want, I promise you the plastic your card is made of WILL NOT scratch the PCB, even if you tried.
> 
> In conclusion, I've done both methods. Use a vice. It's safer, its faster, and it can even be cheaper if you have no qualms about returning your $20 vice.
> 
> Hope this post wan't too long, and that it helps some of you out. Happy deliding. I'll post my results and validation here in a few minutes.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1376206/how-to-delid-your-ivy-bridge-cpu-with-out-a-razor-blade
> 
> *YOUR HASWELL CAN BE DELIDDED AS WELL!!*
> So the main reason for this is that there is a certain way to delid with a blade on this one.. with the caps under the IHS now... *Make sure to cover the caps with either LET (Liquid Eletrical Tape) or clear nail polish*
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see the caps are on the same side as the line of gold pads... so you NEED to start the cut on the opposite corner to keep those caps safe for the initial cut.
> 
> *Also read this as well* To get a good idea of how good of a cpu you have try a low over clock like 4.5GHZand see how low of voltage you can get it stable at. 1.2v and below without delidding for 4.5GHZ
> is usually a decent chip and when you delid the performance increases.4.5ghz @ 1.2V vcore or lower is prolly a good chip,but the oc needs to be stable, not a quick run, like for a validation, then it could do 1.2V vcore or less mostly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There will be a few things first off that I need to get out of the way for this. I want this club to not only show what we have done through our time and effort but to be a helpful club to others and direct them to the right people on how to properly delid and get the information out their now so no one makes any mistakes!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Delidding information and guides!
> 
> 
> 
> *First off here are a few guides that we have been looking at on how to delid our Ivy Bridge processor, these will hopefully help you in this decision!:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1309867/short-and-direct-delid-guide-ivy-bridge
> 
> 
> 
> *Here are two other good info threads for those thinking of delidding (Courtesy of PCWargamer):*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?s=3b5070269ec23691280dbf97f0c942c0&t=2261855
> 
> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?280892-3770k-IHS-Removals-CPU-temp-dropped-from-79C-to-71C&s=92acd5bf013f081e6f7b86ae7abfe762
> 
> 
> 
> *If you are curious about doing this just ask us in this thread and if you really want to see some real number results go to my other thread here:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1312362/before-and-after-delidding-results
> 
> 
> 
> *Now, I hate to say this but we have had chips die in the past and this is what can happen if you aren't ready and fully prepared!*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1309536/did-i-kill-my-3770k-trying-to-delid-it
> 
> 
> 
> *However He was very lucky and fortunate to have that chip still work. Ivy Bridge's are tough, but not invincible!*
> 
> *Now for the real reason your Ivy Bridge runs hot.*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Very interesting results from a very good delid test of deliding and TIMs on an anandtech forum thread where the OP Idontcare found that the IB temp problem was not from the intell TIM at all, but from the gap between the die and IHS.
> 
> - if interested, see post #570 on link below:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=23
> _________________________________
> And the results?
> .....
> And if we remove the paper shim and drop that IHS down onto the CPU (not perfectly zero of course, there is still some NT-H1 CPU TIM there after all) reducing the gap to as close to zero as possible then we get the "c" cases...and the temperatures show the expected fantastic drops we have all come to expect from delidding our Ivy Bridge chips.
> 
> Conclusion: The Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason Ivy Bridge's run hot, and replacing the Intel stock CPU TIM is not the reason a delidded Ivy Bridge runs so much cooler - the benefits of delidding are entirely due to the resultant reduction in gap height between the CPU silicon die and the underside of the IHS
> _________________________________
> 
> This is also noted, and first discovered, on post # 496
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=20
> 
> >>>>> Surprising also was his finding that direct die to HFS did not help to reduce temps as much as he had thought they would.
> 
> see #583:
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2261855&page=24
> _________________________________
> ....
> The take home message there is replacing the CPU TIM doesn't really provide any benefit. Reducing the gap between the CPU and the IHS does. And removing the IHS entirely doesn't really provide much benefit either. Unless you have a custom loop and everything is set up just right then your results can really shine. but it takes time and practice for more information ask SonDa5.
> 
> And that stands to reason. The heat is going to flow through the copper of the IHS the same as it does through the copper of the H100 waterblock.
> 
> But if there is a thick pad of thermal paste in the way, as was the case with my 3770k at time of purchase, then it doesn't really matter how good the TIM itself is (unless it too is made of metal) because the mere presence of that thick pad of thermal paste becomes the weakest link in the thermal conductivity equation.
> 
> Once you eliminate the bottleneck that is the gap between the IHS and the CPU, or if you happen to end up with an Ivy Bridge CPU which doesn't have much of a gap to begin with (Yuriman ), then you have pretty much optimized the system at that point regardless which CPU TIM of choice you employ and regardless whether or not you leave the IHS in place.
> 
> Now the choice of CPU TIM still plays a role in terms of the robustness in maintaining those nice low temperatures. If the so-called "pump out" effect is real then we can expect it to bite us unless we choose a substitute CPU TIM that is designed to avoid such thermo-mechanical effects.
> 
> I haven't really got into testing that part out yet, but I expect IC Diamond and the metal TIMs like Liquid Ultra to be key there.
> 
> 
> Courtesy of PCWargamer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Tools to be used!
> 
> 
> 
> These blades and knifes have been specifically chosen by us the Delidded Crew to help you guys have the best chance at successfully delidding your chips.
> 
> *WE TAKE NO RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE MISUSE OF THESE BLADES AND PERSONAL HARM OR DAMAGE TO YOUR CHIPS.*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18590943
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-ivy-bridge-club/2930#post_18591057
> 
> Most of these can be gotten from a hardware store.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: What to practice on
> 
> 
> 
> Here is a list of CPU's that should be able to be delidded and some are very cheap so great for saving your chips.
> 
> IHS Not Soldered To Die
> 
> Hyperthreading/Single Cores
> 
> -(S-478) Pentium 4 HT (Northwood "A" and "B" Core)*
> -(S-478) Celeron
> -(S-775) Celeron
> -Celeron 420
> -Celeron 430
> -Celeron 440
> -AMD Athlon 64 3200+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3700+*
> -AMD Athlon 64 3800+ (Venice core)
> 
> Dual Cores
> 
> -AMD X2 5000+ BE (Brisbane core)
> -Celeron Dual Core E1200
> -Celeron Dual Core E1400
> -Pentium Dual Core E2140
> -Pentium Dual Core E2160
> -Pentium Dual Core E2180
> -Pentium Dual Core E2200
> -Pentium Dual Core E2210
> -Pentium Dual Core E2220
> -Pentium Dual Core E6300
> -Core 2 Duo E4300
> -Core 2 Duo E4400
> -Core 2 Duo E4500
> -Core 2 Duo E4600
> -Core 2 Duo E6300 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E6400 (L2 stepping)*
> -Core 2 Duo E7200
> -Core 2 Duo E7300
> -Core 2 Duo E7400
> -Core 2 Duo E7500
> -Core 2 Duo E7600
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Why We Use Coolaboratory Pro and Ultra and other Liquid Metals
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I'll explain what this means quick as well. what that W/mk means is this. It's the absorbance and moving of heat that the TIM or Thermal Interface Material can move from place to place. As you see Liquid Pro is at 82 and AS5 is at basically 9. So this means that you get 9 times the heat movement by using Liquid Pro over AS5.
> 
> Example pictures of Liquid Pro/Ultra applications:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you need a better explanation of this just PM myself.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Information Required for Membership!
> 
> 
> 
> Now for the requirements to join the club are as follows. Post a picture of you delidded chip and write your OCN name on a piece or something of the like. For those already running delidded chips and don't feel like taking them out and re-installing I understand so take a picture that you most likely took when you delidded it and use what every program you'd like to put your name somewhere on the picture.
> 
> *For the layout of the chart and what I want for submissions to be accepted.
> 
> OCN name:
> CPU:
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:*
> 
> *You must submit your temp drop by following this format for research!*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Temperature Format
> 
> 
> 
> For the submitting process of your temps use the following rules.
> 
> 1. Get to 4.5 Ghz (if you are having issues let us know on here and we will help you achieve this!)
> 2. Run Intel Burn Test in standard setup (this will always appear as is when you double click or start the program)
> 3. Run for 10 times (Also set as the default when program is started)
> 4. Report your HIGHEST temp from your four cores.
> 5. You can also show your temp drops but ONLY from the HOTTEST core to the HOTTEST core. (if not available refer to #4)
> 6. Ohh! If you have Lapped (sanded) your IHS please provide this information also. (Even what grains you used will be very welcomed)
> 
> 
> Spoiler: What is Lapping? Click the link!
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club/1320#post_18421749
> 
> 
> Courtesy of VonDutch
> 
> Thanks again! This may be a ridiculous amount of info to be provided to join, but this is for research to see what we can show Intel eventually and how badly they messed up. (Yes I'm serious abort this part)
> 
> This is also for people looking into Delidding and seeing just how crazy their temps can decrease by Delidding.
> 
> Thanks yet again!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Helpful tips about putting your Delided CPU back in the socket!(Courtesy of VonDutch)
> 
> 
> 
> one tip after you done delidding and putting your processor back,
> we noticed, that if you put down the bracket again, the IHS will slide a bit forward,
> 
> it will do so whatever tim you use,
> except if you use a new/other adhesive/glue also
> 
> The trick is to start a bit more to the back when placing the IHS back, i think about 0.5- 1mm will do..
> lower the load plate until it sits loosely on the top of the CPU package, check if its all good
> Now lower it careful until you can snap it under
> the stub holder on the side of the socket.
> Lowering the lever takes a bit of force because you are compressing the load plate,
> which in turn forces the CPU down tightly on the landing pins.
> 
> i held it with my finger in the middle if the IHS, but dont forget to clean it again
> after youre done(fingerprints)
> 
> really, i tried to move it with a screwdriver afterwards, but could not move it,
> so you have to get it right, before the lever is under the stub..
> 
> 
> 
> Delidded Crewman Sig!
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> [CENTER]:skull: [URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][B][Official] Delidded Crewman[/B][/URL] :skull:[/CENTER]
> 
> Enjoy guys and gals!
> 
> *MEMBERS LIST*


I wanted to share another method that I sorta discovered/
I noticed that this method here is a bit safer and allows you to maintain more control. No flying pcb with this method! Anyway, check it out and please feel free to let me know what you think.


----------



## Ceadderman

Well new it's going for $240. But since it's been delidded and overclocked, it's worth up to 3/4 the value depending upon the length of ownership and how long it's been delidded. Which is more than a fair recompense for a used CPU.

I had this issue pop up when I was selling my lapped 955 BE. Just be aware that some people won't see your hard work as positively as it truly is and there will be low ball offers. I sat on my chip til I got a reasonably sound offer.









~Ceadder


----------



## Brohem0th

An FX-8350, new, is 175$ over at newegg right now. I think 150$ should be a fair asking price.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> An FX-8350, new, is 175$ over at newegg right now. I think 150$ should be a fair asking price.


Wait...I thought you were talking about a 4690.k


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Wait...I thought you were talking about a 4690.k


I just found out theres a lower limit on the amount of rep you can have before selling anything on here...AARG!


----------



## Matt-Matt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Whoever said you get the worse chips with the i5's? They might take some more voltage to run but they're not all bad. I run a 4690k at 4.9/1.41v, and not only is it handbrake stable, it's stable running OBS and playing games/running 3DMark11 at the same time. This is with an NH-D15 and CLU applied to the die and IHS.
> 
> Also, what's the protocol for selling delidded CPU's? I'm getting a 4790k (Vietnam chip, which all seem to be really good chips) and I'd like to sell my old i5 to make back some of the money.
> 
> Is it worth less if it's been run overclocked? It's been over 80c for about half an hour of its life, and that was all stress testing with Prime95. It's never been over 90c, and when it was that hot it wasn't even at 1.41v since I had a Hyper 212+ and it could only handle 1.325v comfortably. Running Handbrake for eight hours it topped out at 71c. It's already been delidded so technically that should make it worth more but idk.


You don't always but generally it is known that i7's are better clockers.. You lucked out by the sounds of it!


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Wait...I thought you were talking about a 4690.k


Well I figured 150$ was okay, it's 50$ less than purchase price, and the chip still runs fine. It would make my i7 upgrade only cost me 140$.


----------



## JackCY

lol that official razor ruin method. It's been so many years, _vise only_ works the best and is almost effortless, no flying no scratching no hammering.


----------



## WiSK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I wanted to share another method that I sorta discovered/
> I noticed that this method here is a bit safer and allows you to maintain more control. No flying pcb with this method! Anyway, check it out and please feel free to let me know what you think.


Is that your video? I have 1 suggestion.

At 1:47 in the video it says to use a razor blade to clean off the "nastiness". It's easier and safer to use the corner a _credit card_ to scrape the glue away. The PCB is sprayed with a hard protective layer, which can be damaged by a razor but won't be damaged by a credit card.


----------



## white owl

Maybe I have thick nails, but my thumb nail made quick work of my Core 2 Duo.
Credit card didn't work for me.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> lol that official razor ruin method. It's been so many years, _vise only_ works the best and is almost effortless, no flying no scratching no hammering.


I delidded mine with a razor, specifically a sheetrock utility blade. No nicks, no scratches, runs 5Ghz at 1.46v and stays under 80c.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Wait...I thought you were talking about a 4690.k
> 
> 
> 
> Well I figured 150$ was okay, it's 50$ less than purchase price, and the chip still runs fine. It would make my i7 upgrade only cost me 140$.
Click to expand...

Shoot. If I had a board I would be all over that.









~Ceadder


----------



## dennis97519

My delidding experience:

Practiced with a E7200(it is 72CNY on taobao, so I took it from my family's old branded desktop that no one is using). Used a double edged razor, accidentally cut my fingernail, almost sliced away the whole layer of fingernail. The board came out nicked at two locations as I wasn't really taking care when cutting.

Then I took my 3770K and attempted to make a mold with InstaMorph plastic so i can kinda turn it and break it free. But it didnt work. I tried hammering the plastic mold but it still didn't work.

So I began cutting it with a razor. When the gap was large enough I used a plastic opening wand from iFixit to pry it up. Th PCB bent quite a lot, so I worked it around the edge and the IHS came off the PCB without any nicks on the PCB.

Put it in my computer applied CLU and didn't boot. Reseated and cleaned pads. Still didn't boot. So went to play around with the E7200. Bent the PCB. The silicon die cracked.

So I think that failure might have came from the bending. I ordered a cheap LGA1155 CPU (some celeron or something) from taobao and installed it in my computer and it boots. So confirmed CPU failure.

Contacted intel, they said cannot RMA this one. I asked about the plan, they said I have to wait for one month. So I purchased it, waited for 1 month and RMAed the failed 3770K.

While waiting, there is an old PGA chip lying on a old motherboard with all the capacitors plucked out forcefully in my school's computer club. I took it home and began cutting the IHS with an iSesamo opening tool from iFixit, sharpened at the tip. Surprisingly the board came out without any nicks.

Received the 3770K after a while. Began cutting carefully with the iSesamo thinggy and it came out perfectly as well, just some scratches on the black epoxy marking the batch number and stuff.

Put in computer and it's working.

So, I think
1. do not bend the PCB too much or the die may crack, or the connection between the die and the board may be broken. Also get ESD protection when doing the work, the first 3770K might have failed from ESD as well.
2. Thicker cutting blades kinda gives more tolerances to the angle you are making when cutting. As long as you lay it flat, the sharp edge isn't going to make contact with the PCB. (Tested that on the PGA CPU after delidding) Just have to be careful on the staring cut. Then it feels more like prying than cutting, as the sharp tip isn't really digging into the adhesive when you push the blade around the perimeter. Also make sure that the blade isn't warped by the IHS, as warped blade will have sharp edges in unexpected direction and may scratch the PCB when pulling it back.

You can look for picture of the delidded PGA CPU and the first failed delidded 3770K in my instagram account which have the same name.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> My delidding experience:
> 
> Practiced with a E7200(it is 72CNY on taobao, so I took it from my family's old branded desktop that no one is using). Used a double edged razor, accidentally cut my fingernail, almost sliced away the whole layer of fingernail. The board came out nicked at two locations as I wasn't really taking care when cutting.
> 
> Then I took my 3770K and attempted to make a mold with InstaMorph plastic so i can kinda turn it and break it free. But it didnt work. I tried hammering the plastic mold but it still didn't work.
> 
> So I began cutting it with a razor. When the gap was large enough I used a plastic opening wand from iFixit to pry it up. Th PCB bent quite a lot, so I worked it around the edge and the IHS came off the PCB without any nicks on the PCB.
> 
> Put it in my computer applied CLU and didn't boot. Reseated and cleaned pads. Still didn't boot. So went to play around with the E7200. Bent the PCB. The silicon die cracked.
> 
> So I think that failure might have came from the bending. I ordered a cheap LGA1155 CPU (some celeron or something) from taobao and installed it in my computer and it boots. So confirmed CPU failure.
> 
> Contacted intel, they said cannot RMA this one. I asked about the plan, they said I have to wait for one month. So I purchased it, waited for 1 month and RMAed the failed 3770K.
> 
> While waiting, there is an old PGA chip lying on a old motherboard with all the capacitors plucked out forcefully in my school's computer club. I took it home and began cutting the IHS with an iSesamo opening tool from iFixit, sharpened at the tip. Surprisingly the board came out without any nicks.
> 
> Received the 3770K after a while. Began cutting carefully with the iSesamo thinggy and it came out perfectly as well, just some scratches on the black epoxy marking the batch number and stuff.
> 
> Put in computer and it's working.
> 
> So, I think
> 1. do not bend the PCB too much or the die may crack, or the connection between the die and the board may be broken. Also get ESD protection when doing the work, the first 3770K might have failed from ESD as well.
> 2. Thicker cutting blades kinda gives more tolerances to the angle you are making when cutting. As long as you lay it flat, the sharp edge isn't going to make contact with the PCB. (Tested that on the PGA CPU after delidding) Just have to be careful on the staring cut. Then it feels more like prying than cutting, as the sharp tip isn't really digging into the adhesive when you push the blade around the perimeter. Also make sure that the blade isn't warped by the IHS, as warped blade will have sharp edges in unexpected direction and may scratch the PCB when pulling it back.
> 
> You can look for picture of the delidded PGA CPU and the first failed delidded 3770K in my instagram account which have the same name.


If you use a thicker razor blade, you can't just pry as hard as possible in one corner. You're guaranteed to crack the die. If you go around the edge of it, prying each corner a little bit at a time until you eventually get one off, then going around the edge with a credit card or some folded cardstock, then you won't crack the die. I bent the PCB on my 4690k quite a bit and it still runs like a champ.

Also, you have to cover the VRM's with clear nail polish before applying the CLU, or you can short one of the VRM's.


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> My delidding experience:
> 
> Practiced with a E7200(it is 72CNY on taobao, so I took it from my family's old branded desktop that no one is using). Used a double edged razor, accidentally cut my fingernail, almost sliced away the whole layer of fingernail. The board came out nicked at two locations as I wasn't really taking care when cutting.
> 
> Then I took my 3770K and attempted to make a mold with InstaMorph plastic so i can kinda turn it and break it free. But it didnt work. I tried hammering the plastic mold but it still didn't work.
> 
> So I began cutting it with a razor. When the gap was large enough I used a plastic opening wand from iFixit to pry it up. Th PCB bent quite a lot, so I worked it around the edge and the IHS came off the PCB without any nicks on the PCB.
> 
> Put it in my computer applied CLU and didn't boot. Reseated and cleaned pads. Still didn't boot. So went to play around with the E7200. Bent the PCB. The silicon die cracked.
> 
> So I think that failure might have came from the bending. I ordered a cheap LGA1155 CPU (some celeron or something) from taobao and installed it in my computer and it boots. So confirmed CPU failure.
> 
> Contacted intel, they said cannot RMA this one. I asked about the plan, they said I have to wait for one month. So I purchased it, waited for 1 month and RMAed the failed 3770K.
> 
> While waiting, there is an old PGA chip lying on a old motherboard with all the capacitors plucked out forcefully in my school's computer club. I took it home and began cutting the IHS with an iSesamo opening tool from iFixit, sharpened at the tip. Surprisingly the board came out without any nicks.
> 
> Received the 3770K after a while. Began cutting carefully with the iSesamo thinggy and it came out perfectly as well, just some scratches on the black epoxy marking the batch number and stuff.
> 
> Put in computer and it's working.
> 
> So, I think
> 1. do not bend the PCB too much or the die may crack, or the connection between the die and the board may be broken. Also get ESD protection when doing the work, the first 3770K might have failed from ESD as well.
> 2. Thicker cutting blades kinda gives more tolerances to the angle you are making when cutting. As long as you lay it flat, the sharp edge isn't going to make contact with the PCB. (Tested that on the PGA CPU after delidding) Just have to be careful on the staring cut. Then it feels more like prying than cutting, as the sharp tip isn't really digging into the adhesive when you push the blade around the perimeter. Also make sure that the blade isn't warped by the IHS, as warped blade will have sharp edges in unexpected direction and may scratch the PCB when pulling it back.
> 
> You can look for picture of the delidded PGA CPU and the first failed delidded 3770K in my instagram account which have the same name.
> 
> 
> 
> If you use a thicker razor blade, you can't just pry as hard as possible in one corner. You're guaranteed to crack the die. If you go around the edge of it, prying each corner a little bit at a time until you eventually get one off, then going around the edge with a credit card or some folded cardstock, then you won't crack the die. I bent the PCB on my 4690k quite a bit and it still runs like a champ.
> 
> Also, you have to cover the VRM's with clear nail polish before applying the CLU, or you can short one of the VRM's.
Click to expand...

Yup, the iSesamo stuff isn't that thick(thinner than a credit card), so I can just wiggle it in from the corner of IHS and then work it around the edge.
3770K doesn't have any caps on the top so I'm safe


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> lol that official razor ruin method. It's been so many years, _vise only_ works the best and is almost effortless, no flying no scratching no hammering.


Yea I wasn't sure if it was an established method so I wanted to make a video and put it up.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WiSK*
> 
> Is that your video? I have 1 suggestion.
> 
> At 1:47 in the video it says to use a razor blade to clean off the "nastiness". It's easier and safer to use the corner a _credit card_ to scrape the glue away. The PCB is sprayed with a hard protective layer, which can be damaged by a razor but won't be damaged by a credit card.


Good point. I'll keep that in mind.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Maybe I have thick nails, but my thumb nail made quick work of my Core 2 Duo.
> Credit card didn't work for me.


That and holding the blade nearly flush with the PCb should keep you from scratching if


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I delidded mine with a razor, specifically a sheetrock utility blade. No nicks, no scratches, runs 5Ghz at 1.46v and stays under 80c.


Yea it's not that the razor blade method doesn't work but I got a really uneasy feeling the first time I tried, and almost scratched it.

You assume a lot more risk with the razor method.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> My delidding experience:
> 
> Practiced with a E7200(it is 72CNY on taobao, so I took it from my family's old branded desktop that no one is using). Used a double edged razor, accidentally cut my fingernail, almost sliced away the whole layer of fingernail. The board came out nicked at two locations as I wasn't really taking care when cutting.
> 
> Then I took my 3770K and attempted to make a mold with InstaMorph plastic so i can kinda turn it and break it free. But it didnt work. I tried hammering the plastic mold but it still didn't work.
> 
> So I began cutting it with a razor. When the gap was large enough I used a plastic opening wand from iFixit to pry it up. Th PCB bent quite a lot, so I worked it around the edge and the IHS came off the PCB without any nicks on the PCB.
> 
> Put it in my computer applied CLU and didn't boot. Reseated and cleaned pads. Still didn't boot. So went to play around with the E7200. Bent the PCB. The silicon die cracked.
> 
> So I think that failure might have came from the bending. I ordered a cheap LGA1155 CPU (some celeron or something) from taobao and installed it in my computer and it boots. So confirmed CPU failure.
> 
> Contacted intel, they said cannot RMA this one. I asked about the plan, they said I have to wait for one month. So I purchased it, waited for 1 month and RMAed the failed 3770K.
> 
> While waiting, there is an old PGA chip lying on a old motherboard with all the capacitors plucked out forcefully in my school's computer club. I took it home and began cutting the IHS with an iSesamo opening tool from iFixit, sharpened at the tip. Surprisingly the board came out without any nicks.
> 
> Received the 3770K after a while. Began cutting carefully with the iSesamo thinggy and it came out perfectly as well, just some scratches on the black epoxy marking the batch number and stuff.
> 
> Put in computer and it's working.
> 
> So, I think
> 1. do not bend the PCB too much or the die may crack, or the connection between the die and the board may be broken. Also get ESD protection when doing the work, the first 3770K might have failed from ESD as well.
> 2. Thicker cutting blades kinda gives more tolerances to the angle you are making when cutting. As long as you lay it flat, the sharp edge isn't going to make contact with the PCB. (Tested that on the PGA CPU after delidding) Just have to be careful on the staring cut. Then it feels more like prying than cutting, as the sharp tip isn't really digging into the adhesive when you push the blade around the perimeter. Also make sure that the blade isn't warped by the IHS, as warped blade will have sharp edges in unexpected direction and may scratch the PCB when pulling it back.
> 
> You can look for picture of the delidded PGA CPU and the first failed delidded 3770K in my instagram account which have the same name.


This wouldn't have happened with the vise method. It's exactly what I was referring to in terms of the dangers of the razor method.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> This wouldn't have happened with the vise method. It's exactly what I was referring to in terms of the dangers of the razor method.


I remember there was also someone that managed to murder a CPU with the vise method.


----------



## IMI4tth3w

been running my delided 4790K for a couple months now and i've been extremely happy so far!

Method used: Vice/hammer
Thermal Paste: CLU on die AS5 on heat spreader
Frequency: 4.7GHz @ 1.31Vcore 1.89Vin
CPU Cooler: H110i GT w/ Noctua A14 in pull
Max Temps during synthetic bench: 69C w/system in slient mode. 59C in full speed mode
Delta Temps: ~10C after the delid
Validation Link: http://valid.x86.fr/4m4hac


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I remember there was also someone that managed to murder a CPU with the vise method.


It's not impossible to kill a CPU via deluding using any method but it's much much less likely using the vise only method (not the vise and hammer method) as long as all precautions are followed.


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I remember there was also someone that managed to murder a CPU with the vise method.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not impossible to kill a CPU via deluding using any method but it's much much less likely using the vise only method (not the vise and hammer method) as long as all precautions are followed.
Click to expand...

What is the vise only method?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> What is the vise only method?


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I remember there was also someone that managed to murder a CPU with the vise method.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not impossible to kill a CPU via deluding using any method but it's much much less likely using the vise only method (not the vise and hammer method) as long as all precautions are followed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is the vise only method?
Click to expand...

Put the chip in a vice and squoosh it







...









Actually the flat side of the IHS on one side and the PCB on the other and slowly close the jaws together. The IHS slips off after a little effort.

That's the Vice method. Though some employ a hammer as well.









~Ceadder


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I remember there was also someone that managed to murder a CPU with the vise method.
> 
> 
> 
> It's not impossible to kill a CPU via deluding using any method but it's much much less likely using the vise only method (not the vise and hammer method) as long as all precautions are followed.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> What is the vise only method?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Put the chip in a vice and squoosh it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually the flat side of the IHS on one side and the PCB on the other and slowly close the jaws together. The IHS slips off after a little effort.
> 
> That's the Vice method. Though some employ a hammer as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
Click to expand...

Thought you need some special jigs for that haha... I tried to make something with InstaMorph to lock the PCB and IHS separately at first, with a handle so I can turn it and break the seal, but the PCB is a bit too thin for that.


----------



## Wirerat

Delided using the vice only method this time. Much less stressfull. I used a small $15 vice from amazon.

I linked a cpuz validation of a higher OC than listed as my current as it asked for max OC. I hope thats correct.

Wirerat
4790k
CLP
Gelid Extreme
0mhz gained
4.8ghz 1.245v
8c drop on the hotest core
http://valid.canardpc.com/du7pnr


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Delided using the vice only method this time. Much less stressfull. I used a small $15 vice from amazon.
> 
> I linked a cpuz validation of a higher OC than listed as my current as it asked for max OC. I hope thats correct.
> 
> Wirerat
> 4790k
> CLP
> Gelid Extreme
> 0mhz gained
> 4.8ghz 1.245v
> 8c drop on the hotest core
> http://valid.canardpc.com/du7pnr
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


thats awesome dude. Can you do me a favor and post this in the YouTube comments for that video?

Glad it worked out for you. Definitely trying to get the word out about the vise only method. It's really a huge shame that so many people have ruined their chips using the razor method or think that the razor or vise and hammer method are the only ways to get it done.

Vise only requires nothing but a vise and I discovered it once and after having delidded two other chips using the vise and hammer, I used the vise only method and found it to be so much safer because the PCb didn't fly across the room!

here's the video again:




If you liked this video def share it...I'm actually trying to build my YouTube channel anyway even though I only have one video out. Haven't had much time since I'm looking for a new job lol.

By the way cool laboratory sells a copper suspension TIM called coollaboratory liquid copper (CLC) now which is nonconductive apparently. So they have the entire spectrum. This copper Tim is supposed to be the third best, with clu being #1 and clp being #2. I picked some up off ppc. I'll post a pic of it. Pictures aren't great but it shows that it's actually a copper suspension.





This site offers a review but it's in German. There's a results pic though that shows its efficacy. It's a beast of a TIM.

http://www.technic3d.com/review/kuehler/1722-coollaboratory-liquid-copper-waermeleitpaste-im-test/3.htm


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> thats awesome dude. Glad it worked out for you. Definitely trying to get the word out about the vise only method. It's really a huge shame that so many people have ruined their chips using the razor method or think that the razor or vise and hammer method are the only ways to get it done.
> 
> Vise only requires nothing but a vise and I discovered it once and after having delidded two other chips using the vise and hammer, I used the vise only method and found it to be so much safer because the PCb didn't fly across the room!
> 
> If you liked this video def share it...I'm actually trying to build my YouTube channel anyway even though I only have one video out. Haven't had much time since I'm looking for a new job lol.
> 
> By the way cool laboratory sells a copper suspension TIM now which is nonconductive apparently. So they have the entire spectrum. This copper Tim is supposed to be the third best, with clu being #1 and clp being #2. I picked some up off ppc. I'll post a pic of it later
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> here's the video again:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ]


Here is the Vice I used. very small.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002RTKFWU?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00


----------



## cephelix

@Pinnacle Fit i've read a bit about the copper thermal paste. It is below CLP but above normal paste in terms of thermal conductivity. That is of course attributed to the sillicon filler used instead of the more conductive ones in CLU/CLP


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> @Pinnacle Fit i've read a bit about the copper thermal paste. It is below CLP but above normal paste in terms of thermal conductivity. That is of course attributed to the sillicon filler used instead of the more conductive ones in CLU/CLP


Ah ok. I felt that since it had silicone with copper, the silicone would block conductivity, but not heat transfer. The real question is: does it have enough conductivity that it could still be classified as conductive, and is this enough to potentially cause a short?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Here is the Vice I used. very small.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002RTKFWU?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00


Yea it really doesnt take much. Try using that same vise with the hammer method...I guarantee you're not going to have a good time. Lol


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Ah ok. I felt that since it had silicone with copper, the silicone would block conductivity, but not heat transfer. The real question is: does it have enough conductivity that it could still be classified as conductive, and is this enough to potentially cause a short?
> Yea it really doesnt take much. Try using that same vise with the hammer method...I guarantee you're not going to have a good time. Lol


I used some masking tape as the edge was kinda rough.

I only tightened it unill I seen the IHS slide just a touch. its was not broken loose yet. Then I spun the cpu around to opposite side a repeated it. After that I clamped the vice snugly onto the ihs only and the pcb peeled right off. No force at all.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I used some masking tape as the edge was kinda rough.
> 
> I only tightened it unill I seen the IHS slide just a touch. its was not broken loose yet. Then I spun the cpu around to opposite side a repeated it. After that I clamped the vice snugly onto the ihs only and the pcb peeled right off. No force at all.


Precisely.


----------



## cephelix

@Pinnacle Fit i am with you on this
Vice only method is the way of the future. Lol
As for the CLC, that one I cannot remember. I've ben meaning to purchase one and test it out actually but steam games keep getting in my way


----------



## Ceadderman

As they do for everyone.









~Ceadder


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> @Pinnacle Fit i am with you on this
> Vice only method is the way of the future. Lol
> As for the CLC, that one I cannot remember. I've ben meaning to purchase one and test it out actually but steam games keep getting in my way


You should check out the watercooling thread. There's a heated debate about whether or not deluding causes bent pcb. You know what side yours truly is on.

http://www.overclock.net/t/584302/ocn-water-cooling-club-and-picture-gallery/88050#post_24155460
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> @Pinnacle Fit i am with you on this
> Vice only method is the way of the future. Lol
> As for the CLC, that one I cannot remember. I've ben meaning to purchase one and test it out actually but steam games keep getting in my way


I love that coollaboratory knows what their products are but doesn't charge an arm and leg for it.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> As they do for everyone.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


nuh uh....my friend doesn't let steam crap get in her way:thumb:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You should check out the watercooling thread. There's a heated debate about whether or not deluding causes bent pcb. You know what side yours truly is on.


will check that out. but i don't see any physical bending of the pcb after delidding


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> nuh uh....my friend doesn't let steam crap get in her way:thumb:
> will check that out. but i don't see any physical bending of the pcb after delidding


Well according to this person it happens. Personally I think it's a one in a million case. That too with someone who had no clue what was going on. But they did recommend getting a delid guard. For that money you might as well get it from micro centers protection plan


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Well according to this person it happens. Personally I think it's a one in a million case. That too with someone who had no clue what was going on. But they did recommend getting a delid guard. For that money you might as well get it from micro centers protection plan


Yeah, so far i haven't heard anything about pcb bending. And i saw a vid of a guy delidding using a vice grip


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Well according to this person it happens. Personally I think it's a one in a million case. That too with someone who had no clue what was going on. But they did recommend getting a delid guard. For that money you might as well get it from micro centers protection plan


Did they pry the lid off with a crow bar?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Did they pry the lid off with a crow bar?


It would appear that way. I recall reading his post talking about that. I was starting to sound crazy because I kept saying that doesn't happen. Here was the last quote.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> Its not fused to the socket in any way,because its not fixed (a la BGA) its considered a floating part,its clamped down by the ihs with even pressure around the _perimeter_ of the PCB,removing the IHS and swapping out for clamping pressure from the cooler from the _center_ leads to warping. Since the PCB has no pins it is very sensitive to warping and too much (or uneven) pressure results in no contact with pads. Subsequently you risk pad burnout.
> 
> This is not opinion,this happens.
> 
> Now,while your example has not,you must be aware that everyone is not you and you should always err on the side of caution when delivering information for others,especially on such a costly part. Im not saying the EK mount doesnt work,Im saying there is strength in depth when it comes to precautions.


This is an isolated incident from basically putting extreme force on the PCb. I can assure you that this did not happen because of a 'floating' PCb it happened from prying on the IHS, which is a huge huge no no. Deluding wasn't established before. Now there are tutorials, websites, and tons of videos like mine.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I delidded mine with a razor, specifically a sheetrock utility blade. No nicks, no scratches, runs 5Ghz at 1.46v and stays under 80c.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> My delidding experience:
> 
> Practiced with a E7200(it is 72CNY on taobao, so I took it from my family's old branded desktop that no one is using). Used a double edged razor, accidentally cut my fingernail, almost sliced away the whole layer of fingernail. The board came out nicked at two locations as I wasn't really taking care when cutting.
> 
> Then I took my 3770K and attempted to make a mold with InstaMorph plastic so i can kinda turn it and break it free. But it didnt work. I tried hammering the plastic mold but it still didn't work.
> 
> So I began cutting it with a razor. When the gap was large enough I used a plastic opening wand from iFixit to pry it up. Th PCB bent quite a lot, so I worked it around the edge and the IHS came off the PCB without any nicks on the PCB.
> 
> Put it in my computer applied CLU and didn't boot. Reseated and cleaned pads. Still didn't boot. So went to play around with the E7200. Bent the PCB. The silicon die cracked.
> 
> So I think that failure might have came from the bending. I ordered a cheap LGA1155 CPU (some celeron or something) from taobao and installed it in my computer and it boots. So confirmed CPU failure.
> 
> Contacted intel, they said cannot RMA this one. I asked about the plan, they said I have to wait for one month. So I purchased it, waited for 1 month and RMAed the failed 3770K.
> 
> While waiting, there is an old PGA chip lying on a old motherboard with all the capacitors plucked out forcefully in my school's computer club. I took it home and began cutting the IHS with an iSesamo opening tool from iFixit, sharpened at the tip. Surprisingly the board came out without any nicks.
> 
> Received the 3770K after a while. Began cutting carefully with the iSesamo thinggy and it came out perfectly as well, just some scratches on the black epoxy marking the batch number and stuff.
> 
> Put in computer and it's working.
> 
> So, I think
> 1. do not bend the PCB too much or the die may crack, or the connection between the die and the board may be broken. Also get ESD protection when doing the work, the first 3770K might have failed from ESD as well.
> 2. Thicker cutting blades kinda gives more tolerances to the angle you are making when cutting. As long as you lay it flat, the sharp edge isn't going to make contact with the PCB. (Tested that on the PGA CPU after delidding) Just have to be careful on the staring cut. Then it feels more like prying than cutting, as the sharp tip isn't really digging into the adhesive when you push the blade around the perimeter. Also make sure that the blade isn't warped by the IHS, as warped blade will have sharp edges in unexpected direction and may scratch the PCB when pulling it back.
> 
> You can look for picture of the delidded PGA CPU and the first failed delidded 3770K in my instagram account which have the same name.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> If you use a thicker razor blade, you can't just pry as hard as possible in one corner. You're guaranteed to crack the die. If you go around the edge of it, prying each corner a little bit at a time until you eventually get one off, then going around the edge with a credit card or some folded cardstock, then you won't crack the die. I bent the PCB on my 4690k quite a bit and it still runs like a champ.
> 
> Also, you have to cover the VRM's with clear nail polish before applying the CLU, or you can short one of the VRM's.


And you're welcome for me finding you the exact example fueling your argument.this person probably didn't follow the tutorials or did it when there weren't too many out there.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> It would appear that way. I recall reading his post talking about that. I was starting to sound crazy because I kept saying that doesn't happen. Here was the last quote.
> This is an isolated incident from basically putting extreme force on the PCb. I can assure you that this did not happen because of a 'floating' PCb it happened from prying on the IHS, which is a huge huge no no. Deluding wasn't established before. Now there are tutorials, websites, and tons of videos like mine.
> 
> And you're welcome for me finding you the exact example fueling your argument.this person probably didn't follow the tutorials or did it when there weren't too many out there.


I took mine off with a plasma cutter and now it doesn't work. What did I do wrong? Should I have worn gloves?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> I took mine off with a plasma cutter and now it doesn't work. What did I do wrong? Should I have worn gloves?


You know the first thing is to wear safety goggles


----------



## Wirerat

bnegative says that the pcb will bend if you go direct to die. I brought up using a naked ivy kit on my ek Supremacy.

That is not the same threat when using the ihs.

It was never advised to use large air cooler without the ihs. But if I remember correctly the pcb dont warp using appropriate pressure water block or even aio.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> You know the first thing is to wear safety goggles


I closed my eyes...I'm fine


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> bnegative says that the pcb will bend if you go direct to die. I brought up using a naked ivy kit on my ek Supremacy.
> 
> That is not the same threat when using the ihs.
> 
> It was never advised to use large air cooler without the ihs. But if I remember correctly the pcb dont warp using appropriate pressure water block or even aio.


Wasn't that known already?that the naked die mount was only meant for the appropriate waterblock? I mean I'm already kinda worried about hanging a 1.5kg heatsink from my board let alone a naked die.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> I closed my eyes...I'm fine




Why didn't I think of that. Next time I work with formaldehyde, I'll just hold my breath instead of using the uncomfortable respirator...


----------



## white owl

lol. I'm saving that one.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> *Wasn't that known already?that the naked die mount was only meant for the appropriate waterblock? I mean I'm already kinda worried about hanging a 1.5kg heatsink from my board let alone a naked die.*
> .


yea. I dont see a big risk with one of the ek naked kits.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> yea. I dont see a big risk with one of the ek naked kits.


yeah,and just remember to screw the block down in a cross pattern


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Delided using the vice only method this time. Much less stressfull. I used a small $15 vice from amazon.
> 
> I linked a cpuz validation of a higher OC than listed as my current as it asked for max OC. I hope thats correct.
> 
> Wirerat
> 4790k
> CLP
> Gelid Extreme
> 0mhz gained
> 4.8ghz 1.245v
> 8c drop on the hotest core
> http://valid.canardpc.com/du7pnr
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In! Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> It would appear that way. I recall reading his post talking about that. I was starting to sound crazy because I kept saying that doesn't happen. Here was the last quote.
> This is an isolated incident from basically putting extreme force on the PCb. I can assure you that this did not happen because of a 'floating' PCb it happened from prying on the IHS, which is a huge huge no no. Deluding wasn't established before. Now there are tutorials, websites, and tons of videos like mine.
> 
> And you're welcome for me finding you the exact example fueling your argument.this person probably didn't follow the tutorials or did it when there weren't too many out there.


HEY! I resent that statement! I watched more than a dozen guides on delidding, and I still bent the PCB of my 4690k by several millimetres on each corner of the chip. It doesn't matter, because it runs just fine and I'm typing this very post on it, but I wasn't a fool going into this endeavor completely unknowing of all of the risks.

The PCB is designed to bend before it will break, anyway. You really have to warp the crap out of it to crack the die at all, these chips are far more resilient than most give them credit for. I mean, I'll be delidding my 4790k with a vice instead of a razor blade this time, but razor method is still a completely safe and viable method of delidding these chips. It just takes more time and is potentially more dangerous.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> HEY! I resent that statement! I watched more than a dozen guides on delidding, and I still bent the PCB of my 4690k by several millimetres on each corner of the chip. It doesn't matter, because it runs just fine and I'm typing this very post on it, but I wasn't a fool going into this endeavor completely unknowing of all of the risks.
> 
> The PCB is designed to bend before it will break, anyway. You really have to warp the crap out of it to crack the die at all, these chips are far more resilient than most give them credit for. I mean, I'll be delidding my 4790k with a vice instead of a razor blade this time, but *razor method is still a completely safe and viable method* of delidding these chips. It just takes more time *and is potentially more dangerous.*


The 2 parts in bold completely contradict each other - there's no way to be "completely safe" and "potentially more dangerous" simultaneously. None of the delidding methods are "completely safe", but there are methods that drastically reduce the risks. Taking a razor to a CPU means that you're always one good muscle spasm away from a dead CPU, though if you have rock-solid hands like a neural surgeon then I guess this isn't a concern.







The vice method (with or without hammer and wood block) eliminates the possibility of killing your chip by simply twitching.


----------



## white owl

The fingers are an important part of the equation as well. Wouldn't want to flay one would we?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> HEY! I resent that statement! I watched more than a dozen guides on delidding, and I still bent the PCB of my 4690k by several millimetres on each corner of the chip. It doesn't matter, because it runs just fine and I'm typing this very post on it, but I wasn't a fool going into this endeavor completely unknowing of all of the risks.
> 
> The PCB is designed to bend before it will break, anyway. You really have to warp the crap out of it to crack the die at all, these chips are far more resilient than most give them credit for. I mean, I'll be delidding my 4790k with a vice instead of a razor blade this time, but razor method is still a completely safe and viable method of delidding these chips. It just takes more time and is potentially more dangerous.


Lol my bad if it seems I was knocking you. That wasn't my intention at all. We were arguing two separate topics. You didn't screw up your chip because it still runs

That's not the issue I was debating. It's flexible and it can bend. That much is known. BUT b negative was saying that the PCb floats in the socket and gets pressures in odd configuration so it suffers from vending and that you need a delid guard for that. Moreover he was implying that people who delid don't reuse their IHS. I invited him to check out the delid thread several times but he wasn't really interested.

Long story short he said it can and does bend over time due to stress. That's not possible unless the mobo bend and even then it's unlikely because the socket is like its own island in terms of tensile strength.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> The fingers are an important part of the equation as well. Wouldn't want to flay one would we?


By the way I'm thinking about making videos again. Anybody have ideas on what to people would be interested in learning / or need to know in terms of modding or watercooling?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

@valgaur

OCN name: Pinnacle Fit
CPU: 4790K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS Naked Ivy
Mhz gained: +600
OC after delid: I'm at 4.6GHz
Temp drops: ~30C

Much appreciated


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

-


----------



## iRev_olution

man this thread makes me want to de-lid my 4790k!

You think I can get gains from 4.8ghz 1.220v? I want reach 5ghz and run it 24/7 but I cant seem to get it atm


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> man this thread makes me want to de-lid my 4790k!
> 
> You think I can get gains from 4.8ghz 1.220v? I want reach 5ghz and run it 24/7 but I cant seem to get it atm


I think that's silicon lottery beyond 4.7.

By the way scroll up and look for my delid video and tell me if you think I should redo it with VoiceOver and more detail...

Never mind here it is.


----------



## Ceadderman

I would never put an unprotected electronic component on a bed let alone a delidded CPU. Just begging for static to ruin it.









Ju got cajones grandes amigo.









~Ceadder


----------



## iRev_olution

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I think that's silicon lottery beyond 4.7.
> 
> By the way scroll up and look for my delid video and tell me if you think I should redo it with VoiceOver and more detail...
> 
> Never mind here it is.


Nice video! Voice over will be great too! Good tutorial on a vice removal.

Did you get huge gains?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> Nice video! Voice over will be great too! Good tutorial on a vice removal.
> 
> Did you get huge gains?


Thanks. I think I will do it again just to try explaining it through.
The words seem to fly by too fast.

I've delidded every chip before I even put it in so I don't even know anymore lol. Most ppl get the biggest effects on this when they're air cooling because water drops the temps so much that the chip is no longer temp limited for OC. I never really pushed mine beyond 4.7 though.

You should get about a 5 degree drop on average.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> man this thread makes me want to de-lid my 4790k!
> 
> You think I can get gains from 4.8ghz 1.220v? I want reach 5ghz and run it 24/7 but I cant seem to get it atm


It really depends. Yours could do great, or it could just hit a wall. My chip isn't great, it takes about 1.3v for 4.8GHz, but it WILL do 5.0GHz at 1.41v happily, which I think is rather odd given that other chips need huge voltage.steps by that point.


----------



## koekwau5

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> man this thread makes me want to de-lid my 4790k!
> 
> You think I can get gains from 4.8ghz 1.220v? I want reach 5ghz and run it 24/7 but I cant seem to get it atm


Try setting your multiplier @ 50 and give your CPU around 1.25V up to 1.30V just to see if it is able to boot on 5Ghz.
If it boots @ 1.3V or below its definitly worth to delid your CPU.

If it doesn't want to boot at any given voltage then just leave your CPU as is.


----------



## iRev_olution

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It really depends. Yours could do great, or it could just hit a wall. My chip isn't great, it takes about 1.3v for 4.8GHz, but it WILL do 5.0GHz at 1.41v happily, which I think is rather odd given that other chips need huge voltage.steps by that point.


I think I hit a wall because I tried increasing voltage above 1.4v and it just won't go! Funny reaction was at 1.35v @5ghz windows would start up and and freeze a minute into the Intel burntest. Anything after that will just get BSOD. Weird behavior!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Thanks. I think I will do it again just to try explaining it through.
> The words seem to fly by too fast.
> 
> I've delidded every chip before I even put it in so I don't even know anymore lol. Most ppl get the biggest effects on this when they're air cooling because water drops the temps so much that the chip is no longer temp limited for OC. I never really pushed mine beyond 4.7 though.
> 
> You should get about a 5 degree drop on average.


I see... I'm currently running a custom water cooling loop so I'm not sure if I will benefit in terms of temps.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> I think I hit a wall because I tried increasing voltage above 1.4v and it just won't go! Funny reaction was at 1.35v @5ghz windows would start up and and freeze a minute into the Intel burntest. Anything after that will just get BSOD. Weird behavior!
> I see... I'm currently running a custom water cooling loop so I'm not sure if I will benefit in terms of temps.


I have little doubt that you won't benefit. I saw more than 20c difference on water with coolaboratory liquid pro on the die1


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I would never put an unprotected electronic component on a bed let alone a delidded CPU. Just begging for static to ruin it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ju got cajones grandes amigo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I did that? I don't remember.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> I think I hit a wall because I tried increasing voltage above 1.4v and it just won't go! Funny reaction was at 1.35v @5ghz windows would start up and and freeze a minute into the Intel burntest. Anything after that will just get BSOD. Weird behavior!
> I see... I'm currently running a custom water cooling loop so I'm not sure if I will benefit in terms of temps.


Don't really think that's weird. Just instability.


----------



## justafatboy

Hey guys, I've been considering quite awhile whether I should delid and right now I've made my mind.

http://m.ebay.com.sg/itm/251946165721

would this vice be able to perform a proper delid?


----------



## Brohem0th

Just got a 4790k, boots 5Ghz at 1.3v, passed two straight hours of 4.8Ghz/1.25v Handbrake runs. Gonna see what it can do. Haven't delidded it, will soon though.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justafatboy*
> 
> Hey guys, I've been considering quite awhile whether I should delid and right now I've made my mind.
> 
> http://m.ebay.com.sg/itm/251946165721
> 
> would this vice be able to perform a proper delid?


Get the cheapest IRWIN vise from Home Depot. It's $15. Use vise only method. I posted a video on here that you can use.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Just got a 4790k, boots 5Ghz at 1.3v, passed two straight hours of 4.8Ghz/1.25v Handbrake runs. Gonna see what it can do. Haven't delidded it, will soon though.


I'm on the jelly train right now


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Just got a 4790k, boots 5Ghz at 1.3v, passed two straight hours of 4.8Ghz/1.25v Handbrake runs. Gonna see what it can do. Haven't delidded it, will soon though.


It might boot but I'll be impressed if it passes a 4 hour prime 95 test at 5 ghz. If it does go get that 5ghz sig.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm on the jelly train right now


----------



## Wirerat

My newest 4790k does 4.8 1.245v prime stable.

Its x264 stable 4.9 at 1.312v and 5ghz comes in at 1.365v x264 stable.

Even though temps are fine delided on custom loop I wont prime95 it on the 1.3v+ profiles.


----------



## ivanlabrie

You crazy delidders...


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> It might boot but I'll be impressed if it passes a 4 hour prime 95 test at 5 ghz. If it does go get that 5ghz sig.


I don't like running Prime95 v26.6 for more than 10-15 minutes at a time, Handbrake always has been and always will be my go-to stability test.

Final Boss Mode is running Far Cry 4 while encoding it at 4k bitrate in OBS with the x.264 codec, followed by the same run through Far Cry 4 while encoding it with OpenSync. If an OC passes that, then it's officially a man.

Literally the first time I booted it was at 5Ghz/1.3v. As soon as I get it delidded Ima see what it can do. I've just been running it under my NH-D15 with the NT-H1 compound Noctua send with their heatsink.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm on the jelly train right now


I paid my dues with a 4690k that took 1.46v to hit 5Ghz. If it helps at all, the newest batch of 4790k's, the ones with an X in the serial number at the beginning, that come out of Vietnam? They've all been BEAST overclockers. I got this specific chip off of /r/hardwareswap for 290$.


----------



## Ceadderman

[email protected] is *my* stressor of choice not only does it get all cores working, it's for a good cause churning out at least one client to assure that a new system is stable and under the temp cieling.









~Ceadder


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> [email protected] is *my* stressor of choice not only does it get all cores working, it's for a good cause churning out at least one client to assure that a new system is stable and under the temp cieling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I like folding at home too. I just discovered it recently and heard it was a good stress test.


----------



## Ceadderman

It is. If you're gonna have temp issues, [email protected] will expose it quickly. I started using it to test client systems in 2011.









~Ceadder


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> My newest 4790k does 4.8 1.245v prime stable.
> 
> Its x264 stable 4.9 at 1.312v and 5ghz comes in at 1.365v x264 stable.
> 
> Even though temps are fine delided on custom loop I wont prime95 it on the 1.3v+ profiles.


Wirerat do you have the same feeling about testing OCCT above 1.3 as Prime?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> It is. If you're gonna have temp issues, [email protected] will expose it quickly. I started using it to test client systems in 2011.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Not just temp issues, but with mine, it exposed stability issues like Prime 95 does but without the 'overvolting'...Like with my rig I cannot run small FFTs at all because my cores jump to 100...On blend they sit at 70C max. Im running 4.6 at around 1.275V last I checked. Folding at home runs perfectly stable just like p95 blend does but I like that you can combine CPU and GPU stress in one test like Aida64 does.


----------



## Ceadderman

Yup.









~Ceadder


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Yup.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Are the cores jumping to 100 normal under small fft? I think so bc of overvolting right?


----------



## Ceadderman

Not sure if that's why. I understand Folding but I'm still pretty green compared to other Folders. I've put together ~8.3million points since I started though. Will probably hit 10mil by next Summer. I just know that Folding and nothing else stresses all cores. I doubt that it's voltage related, but since I don't fully know this it's just my opinion.

Seems to me that it wouldn't be prudent to increase the voltage given how many people Overclock to get better PPD results. Increasing the voltage via software on top of a Voltage over clock could be fatal for a system that is in Stanfords stable of research.









~Ceadder


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Not sure if that's why. I understand Folding but I'm still pretty green compared to other Folders. I've put together ~8.3million points since I started though. Will probably hit 10mil by next Summer. I just know that Folding and nothing else stresses all cores. I doubt that it's voltage related, but since I don't fully know this it's just my opinion.
> 
> Seems to me that it wouldn't be prudent to increase the voltage given how many people Overclock to get better PPD results. Increasing the voltage via software on top of a Voltage over clock could be fatal for a system that is in Stanfords stable of research.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


No I'm talking about p95 small fft that causes this issue. I have no problems with [email protected] You just run it at night before you go to sleep?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Wirerat do you have the same feeling about testing OCCT above 1.3 as Prime?


occt on the non linpack test is used by a lot of ppl. I would keep the runs short though.

I do not run any stress test more than 1 hour at that voltage except x264.

I can find stability without running tests for hours and hours though.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> occt on the non linpack test is used by a lot of ppl. I would keep the runs short though.
> 
> I do not run any stress test more than 1 hour at that voltage except x264.
> 
> I can find stability without running tests for hours and hours though.


i find that occt(non-linpack) shows instability in my system faster than x264 though. I could run an inital 5 loop test on x264 and be stable but in 20mins in occt i get a bsod. Thoughts?am i doing anything wrong??


----------



## asm99

I have been here a few times but never asked to join the club.
Today I would like to ask permission to join.
I have delidded my chip (vice) and it was the easiest thing to do.


My sweet spot is @ 4.8MHz on 1.281v, stress tested.
At this speed, stress tested, the temps don't go over 61°C.


It requires 1.325v for 4.9MHz, and 1.5v for 5.0MHz.
This was done just by changing the core multiplier and manual core voltage. Everything else on auto.

I have done 5.1MHz at 1.502v, but with Bios tweaked and with ram pushed to 2666, 1.75v. This before delidding.
http://valid.canardpc.com/icdyb5

I don't think there was a need to delid it, as it runs fine a 4.8MHz. But I wanted to do it anyway, and I intend to dice with it under cold water.

Now I need some suggestions...Do I run it naked or with IHS on? If I go naked, is there a chance to buy a bracket for my mobo?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> I have been here a few times but never asked to join the club.
> Today I would like to ask permission to join.
> I have delidded my chip (vice) and it was the easiest thing to do.
> 
> 
> My sweet spot is @ 4.8MHz on 1.281v, stress tested.
> At this speed, stress tested, the temps don't go over 61°C.
> 
> 
> It requires 1.325v for 4.9MHz, and 1.5v for 5.0MHz.
> This was done just by changing the core multiplier and manual core voltage. Everything else on auto.
> 
> I have done 5.1MHz at 1.502v, but with Bios tweaked and with ram pushed to 2666, 1.75v. This before delidding.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/icdyb5
> 
> I don't think there was a need to delid it, as it runs fine a 4.8MHz. But I wanted to do it anyway, and I intend to dice with it under cold water.
> 
> *Now I need some suggestions...Do I run it naked or with IHS on? If I go naked, is there a chance to buy a bracket for my mobo?*


Running it naked is not worth it. It will gain 2c at best. You probably get more of a gain expanding your loop/ adding a Rad than going naked.

Your chip is very close to mine. it does 4.8/1.265v load, 4.9/1.328v load. Mine is different at 5.0/1.38v load.

The 4.8 being the only profile I prime95 on. the others are x264, bench and game stable though.

I still run the 4.8 and my temps are almost just like yours.


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Running it naked is not worth it. It will gain 2c at best. You probably get more of a gain expanding your loop/ adding a Rad than going naked.
> 
> Your chip is very close to mine. it does 4.8/1.265v load, 4.9/1.328v load. Mine is different at 5.0/1.38v load.
> 
> The 4.8 being the only profile I prime95 on. the others are x264, bench and game stable though.
> 
> I still run the 4.8 and my temps are almost just like yours.


Yeah, I know what you mean. But for 24/7 I will use my H105 @ 4.8MHz. For dicing, icy water bucket, pump, cpu. Easy as that.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ivanlabrie*
> 
> You crazy delidders...


Its a bird! Its a plane! It's... It's a crazy crow!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> I have been here a few times but never asked to join the club.
> Today I would like to ask permission to join.
> I have delidded my chip (vice) and it was the easiest thing to do.
> 
> 
> My sweet spot is @ 4.8MHz on 1.281v, stress tested.
> At this speed, stress tested, the temps don't go over 61°C.
> 
> 
> It requires 1.325v for 4.9MHz, and 1.5v for 5.0MHz.
> This was done just by changing the core multiplier and manual core voltage. Everything else on auto.
> 
> I have done 5.1MHz at 1.502v, but with Bios tweaked and with ram pushed to 2666, 1.75v. This before delidding.
> http://valid.canardpc.com/icdyb5
> 
> I don't think there was a need to delid it, as it runs fine a 4.8MHz. But I wanted to do it anyway, and I intend to dice with it under cold water.
> 
> Now I need some suggestions...Do I run it naked or with IHS on? If I go naked, is there a chance to buy a bracket for my mobo?


I need you to use the submission format from the OP please







then I'll throw you right in


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need you to use the submission format from the OP please
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> then I'll throw you right in


I don't get it.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *asm99*
> 
> I don't get it.


fill this out to join the club. Its in the Op.

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## asm99

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> fill this out to join the club. Its in the Op.
> 
> OCN name:
> CPU:
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Still early...I have delidded today and not yet assembled nor Oc'ed. Still waiting for my CLU.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> occt on the non linpack test is used by a lot of ppl. I would keep the runs short though.
> 
> I do not run any stress test more than 1 hour at that voltage except x264.
> 
> I can find stability without running tests for hours and hours though.


Yep only used prime 26.6 and occt 4.4.1 so far for max 1hr. Not worth slow cooking this chip








Used to go prime 27.9 1344 for a least 4hrs on my last chip, though i wouldn't run that unattended.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i find that occt(non-linpack) shows instability in my system faster than x264 though. I could run an inital 5 loop test on x264 and be stable but in 20mins in occt i get a bsod. Thoughts?am i doing anything wrong??


Your chip will always require more volts under a harder stress test than h264. See this post http://www.overclock.net/t/1490324/the-intel-devils-canyon-owners-club/17370#post_24161228


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Yep only used prime 26.6 and occt 4.4.1 so far for max 1hr. Not worth slow cooking this chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Used to go prime 27.9 1344 for a least 4hrs on my last chip, though i wouldn't run that unattended.
> Your chip will always require more volts under a harder stress test than h264. See this post http://www.overclock.net/t/1490324/the-intel-devils-canyon-owners-club/17370#post_24161228


Thanks!completely forgot about that. Will have to go back and check my voltages again. Also realised that I've been looking at the VID header in hwinfo instead of vcore.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> i find that occt(non-linpack) shows instability in my system faster than x264 though. I could run an inital 5 loop test on x264 and be stable but in 20mins in occt i get a bsod. Thoughts?am i doing anything wrong??


run the occt first then. Thats would I would do.

I like to run p95 for 2-3 minutes. You would be suprised how close I can get to stable with very short prime runs.

When your way off it bsod in 30 secs or less.

after it passes a short run I move to a longer test.

intel xtu Bench (not stress) is also very good for quik dirty short test. it based on p95.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> run the occt first then. Thats would I would do.
> 
> I like to run p95 for 2-3 minutes. You would be suprised how close I can get to stable with very short prime runs.
> 
> When your way off it bsod in 30 secs or less.
> 
> after it passes a short run I move to a longer test.


So far i've been running occt for 0.5hrs between each multiplier step up and adjusting voltages accordingly. Then do a 50 loop x264 test to ensure that it is stable. Will have to fiddle around with my voltages again. Man, DC sure is much more complicated..


----------



## Brohem0th

Went and bought my vice for 20$ at home depot, gonna delid my 4790k and see what it can do.

It's already doing 4.8/1.255 eight hours stable in Handbrake, but it's running in the mid to high 70's which is a bit warm for my liking. At the very least, I'll end up getting a pretty nice temperature drop.

I ran my 4690k really, really hard (1.41v/4.9 24/7 constant voltage for months at a time) and I don't think I'll be taking my 4790k over 1.325v as a daily-driver type of OC. Honestly, if it can do 5Ghz at or under 1.35v, then I'll be a happy man. As long as I can keep it under 77c, preferably no higher than 72c, I'll be happy. Just not sure if even an NH-D15 can handle 1.4v on an i7


----------



## Gofspar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Just got a 4790k, boots 5Ghz at 1.3v, passed two straight hours of 4.8Ghz/1.25v Handbrake runs. Gonna see what it can do. Haven't delidded it, will soon though.


Get a nice custom loop and see if you can get 5/5.1 @ 1.4v


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gofspar*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Just got a 4790k, boots 5Ghz at 1.3v, passed two straight hours of 4.8Ghz/1.25v Handbrake runs. Gonna see what it can do. Haven't delidded it, will soon though.
> 
> 
> 
> Get a nice custom loop and see if you can get 5/5.1 @ 1.4v
Click to expand...

This^ If you want to tame that beast and keep it cool, water is the way to go...naked...


----------



## iRev_olution

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gofspar*
> 
> Get a nice custom loop and see if you can get 5/5.1 @ 1.4v


is 1.4v safe for 24/7?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Gofspar*
> 
> Get a nice custom loop and see if you can get 5/5.1 @ 1.4v
> 
> 
> 
> is 1.4v safe for 24/7?
Click to expand...

It is if you keep it cool enough!


----------



## Wirerat

I disagree.

Above 1.35v has been known to degrade haswell. I would not run much more than 1.3v for 24/7. Even if temps are great.


----------



## iRev_olution

well i just hit 4.9ghz @1.35v running stable. thinking of running it 24/7... thoughts?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I disagree.
> 
> Above 1.35v has been known to degrade haswell. I would not run much more than 1.3v for 24/7. Even if temps are great.


May I ask what evidence there is of this? My 4670k has been over 1.4v for about a year, and there's been no degradation to speak of. As a matter of fact, I actually did some more tinkering about 2 months ago, and managed to lower my voltages slightly. The lower voltages enabled me to increase my core clock a little more, to 4.7ghz.









Could you describe the behavior that a CPU will show while degrading? I'm not trying to be combative, I'm genuinely asking....


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> May I ask what evidence there is of this? My 4670k has been over 1.4v for about a year, and there's been no degradation to speak of. As a matter of fact, I actually did some more tinkering about 2 months ago, and managed to lower my voltages slightly. The lower voltages enabled me to increase my core clock a little more, to 4.7ghz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Could you describe the behavior that a CPU will show while degrading? I'm not trying to be combative, I'm genuinely asking....


What type of load do you run? If u just game it probably wont matter.

The cpu will loose its stability/require more voltage to achieve same oc or require droping frequency to get stable.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> What type of load do you run? If u just game it probably wont matter.
> 
> The cpu will loose its stability/require more voltage to achieve same oc or require droping frequency to get stable.


I run all sorts of tasks on my PC, but there are always multiple things going on. Normally, I'm gaming with a movie or show playing in my 2nd monitor, but I also occasionally mess with encoding some videos. Also, my PC is essentially the media hub for the house, as I have several terabytes of videos.

If anything, my CPU has started to require _less_ voltage than it previously did.







No one ever adds "depending on what you're doing with your PC", everyone just says that anything over 1.3v is dangerous.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I run all sorts of tasks on my PC, but there are always multiple things going on. Normally, I'm gaming with a movie or show playing in my 2nd monitor, but I also occasionally mess with some videos. Also, my PC is essentially the media hub for the house, as I have several terabytes of videos.
> 
> If anything, my CPU has started to require _less_ voltage than it previously did.


nice.

I started with my main rig supporting my home media and server duties. I eventually got a 4670k/h87 rig for the transcoding duties of emby server.

If you are comfortable running those high vcores then by all means go ahead.

too many reviews say things like:
Quote:


> In the end, our maximum Prime95-stable overclock was 4.7GHz (47x100MHz). This required a BIOS-set VCore of 1.375V (although 1.35V was largely stable), which peaked at 1.408V under load.
> 
> While the maximum temperature remained under 85°C when running Prime95, we would not be happy to put such high voltage levels through our own processor for anything other than a handful of benchmark


For me to be comfortable much above 1.3v if I can avoid it.

the quote is from. http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/luke-hill/intel-core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon-review-inc-overclocking/3/


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> nice.
> 
> I started with my main rig supporting my home media and server duties. I eventually got a 4670k/h87 rig for the transcoding duties of emby server.
> 
> If you are comfortable running those high vcores then by all means go ahead.
> 
> too many reviews say things like:
> For me to be comfortable much above 1.3v if I can avoid it.
> 
> the quote is from. http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/luke-hill/intel-core-i7-4790k-devils-canyon-review-inc-overclocking/3/


I've seen loads of posts where people have said not to go above 1.3v, but it _seems_ more like one person said it and a bunch of people just repeated it. As long as my temps are good, then I'm ok with the voltage. Since I'm also de-lidded, I don't see any temps in the 70's unless I'm purposely trying to get to those temps. Normally, my load temps are more like 55*C and idle temps can be as low as 20*C - depending on time of day.









Here's a shot of RealTemp, my PC has been running for the last 3 days straight. I just re-upgraded to Windows 10, so the uptime would normally be longer.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> well i just hit 4.9ghz @1.35v running stable. thinking of running it 24/7... thoughts?


depends on what it takes to do 4.8Mhz ie if it were 1.25v then I would be running 4.8 the extra 100Mhz will never be noticed in day to day use. But it is good for bragging.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> depends on what it takes to do 4.8Mhz ie if it were 1.25v then I would be running 4.8 the extra 100Mhz will never be noticed in day to day use. But it is good for bragging.


Agreed.
Also, C-states (if used) will scale the voltage according to to the load. So there's that.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> *I've seen loads of posts where people have said not to go above 1.3v, but it seems more like one person said it and a bunch of people just repeated it.* As long as my temps are good, then I'm ok with the voltage. Since I'm also de-lidded, I don't see any temps in the 70's unless I'm purposely trying to get to those temps. Normally, my load temps are more like 55*C and idle temps can be as low as 20*C - depending on time of day.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a shot of RealTemp, my PC has been running for the last 3 days straight. I just re-upgraded to Windows 10, so the uptime would normally be longer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


There is more too it than that I believe. This thread has a good bit of reports. http://www.overclock.net/t/1409797/the-haswell-death-degradation-thread

I am sure some of them started off simply not stable and thought thet they were however that is too much coincidence for them all to be that way. It does depend on the load and also the Quality of the CPU. Some degrade and some dont. If it happens it is not reversible though.

@Darkwizzie The creator of the Haswell OC guide himself lost his 4.5ghz 1.4v profile on his 4670k after less than 1 year use with temps under 70c. There is no way he was not stable to begin with. He did push his cpu hard often running something called chess. His report is accurate though.


----------



## JackCY

From electronics point of view, it doesn't need to smoke to get damaged. Higher voltage can break it down even if you cool it down. It just takes a longer time, which is easy to get with CPUs as they run a lot.
What is safe and what is not, that's up to everyone to decide for themselves.

My experience with CPU (22nm) and GPU(28nm) voltage is that beyond 1.15V the power consumption shoots up while performance barely raises.


----------



## white owl

I often wonder how voltage kills CPS. You can run any amount of voltage across a wire with out killing it but amperage is what causes it to heat up and fail.
Knowing how a CPU works would probably help.


----------



## DirektEffekt

I am not sure about the reports of degradation, to be honest. Most reports seem to be like "It was fine then suddenly I needed way more voltage for stability". Real degradation would need a small bump of voltage every now and again or a drop of 100MHz occasionally. A lot of reports seem to be more indicative of more complete failures, which tend only to happen if you push voltage way too far. And often in reports people are light with the details and there is no telling what else they may have done, like too much VCCIN etc.

It's probably pretty safe to go to 1.35v and up to around 1.45v is probably pretty safe, given how well Ivy did at those levels. I don't think there are enough reports of actual confirmed degradation, given how many chips are out there, to be confirmed, or even worried.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> There is more too it than that I believe. This thread has a good bit of reports. http://www.overclock.net/t/1409797/the-haswell-death-degradation-thread
> 
> I am sure some of them started off simply not stable and thought thet they were however that is too much coincidence for them all to be that way. It does depend on the load and also the Quality of the CPU. Some degrade and some dont. If it happens it is not reversible though.
> 
> @Darkwizzie The creator of the Haswell OC guide himself lost his 4.5ghz 1.4v profile on his 4670k after less than 1 year use with temps under 70c. There is no way he was not stable to begin with. He did push his cpu hard often running something called chess. His report is accurate though.


According to Darkwizzie's posts in the thread you linked to, it sounds like the downclock was a choice, rather than a necessity. "I'm thinking of going 4.6 to 4.5ghz... because that's 1.36v to 1.27v







". Darkwizzie and I have the same CPU and similar boards (though I have the GD65 and he has the G45), our chips are rather similar as well - requiring very similar voltages. Though, with the types of chess loads he's running, along with the frequency that he makes those chess runs, there is quite a bit more consistent strain that the CPU is going through. My rig gets a break most nights, and is able to go idle for the night.









Did you actually read the posts in that Degradation thread? Is there anyone who actually experienced this with their own chip? I just read all 10 pages, and there hasn't been a single degradation case yet.... As messed up as it may sound, I was looking forward to seeing one, as I'm very curious about what the exact circumstances would be. One person said their CPU died, but that was with 4.8ghz @ 1.52v, and another killed theirs after being sloppy with some CLU. The closest to death/degradation from 1.4v+, comes from a person who admits that they were running high voltages along with Adaptive - which is universally known for it's tendency to add entirely too much voltage under load. The issue with that particular account is that they were just re-posting what a review stated about one of their CPUs dying.

Haswell certainly has a break-in period, which I think virtually every Haswell owner has experienced. I know that when I updated my BIOS, I've had to re-do my overclocks. My board has had 9 updates since I got it, and I installed each new one as it came out. With some of the updates, I could run with lower volts, and some with higher volts. This could also account for people needing to change their voltages, but I haven't seen an actual degradation case online yet.


----------



## feznz

Just feed it the Juice by the time you kill it there will be another CPU series out perfect excuse to upgrade to a more energy efficient CPU.
My personal experience I ran 5Ghz @ 1.46v on my 3770k for 2-3 months in the end I dropped back to 4.8Mhz @ 1.32v not because of stability but for longevity an extra .14v is too much for a measly 200Mhz
I am probably going to keep this System until a 6Ghz capable CPU comes out so it will be quite a few more years.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I am not sure about the reports of degradation, to be honest. Most reports seem to be like "It was fine then suddenly I needed way more voltage for stability". Real degradation would need a small bump of voltage every now and again or a drop of 100MHz occasionally. A lot of reports seem to be more indicative of more complete failures, which tend only to happen if you push voltage way too far. And often in reports people are light with the details and there is no telling what else they may have done, like too much VCCIN etc.
> 
> It's probably pretty safe to go to 1.35v and up to around 1.45v is probably pretty safe, given how well Ivy did at those levels. I don't think there are enough reports of actual confirmed degradation, given how many chips are out there, to be confirmed, or even worried.


You make good points and I felt exactly the same way When I got my first 4670k.

But when overclocking the less voltage the better. There is a sweet spot with these chips.

For example My 4790k is prime stable at 4.8 1.245v 65c max.

The next multiple is 4.9 @ 1.323 73c max. That is a big step. There wont be any difference in real world performance +or- 100mhz so I choose the safer 4.8ghz for my 24/7.

I do the same in my 4770k build. It is a much worse chip at 4.4 1.265v. 4.5 needs 1.312v. I just don't see enough difference to run 1.3v+ for that 100mhz.

Now on both my above i7s I will bench at the higher profiles on occasion.

I might be overly cautious but when my cpu are older and need the extra 1-200mhz and 1.3v+ I want it to still be there.

We are talking about cpus that do not bottleneck 99% of gpu setups at stock even. That gives me little motivation to run it near max safe voltage 24/7.


----------



## Cozmo85

not allowed


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> What adhesive to reglue for warranty?


since regluing the lid and doing an RMA is considered rma fraud we cannot discuss that.

But if you want to glue it back down 2 part grey epoxy (like jb weld) is a permanent solution.

Silicon is a easily removable solution.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cozmo85*
> 
> What adhesive to reglue for warranty?


None, warranty is void after delid


----------



## Cozmo85

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Skullzaflare*
> 
> None, warranty is void after delid


Sorry


----------



## Brohem0th

Killed my 4790k delidding it. The vice chipped part of the PCB. It looks like it's not even damaged but you can tell that it happened.

Super sad. Gotta wait a month to get a new one through the performance tuning protection plan. It was such a good chip, too. Only got to use it for like three days.

Never delidding with a vice again. Razor method is best method. Add another confirmed kill to the vice method.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Killed my 4790k delidding it. The vice chipped part of the PCB. It looks like it's not even damaged but you can tell that it happened.
> 
> Super sad. Gotta wait a month to get a new one through the performance tuning protection plan. It was such a good chip, too. Only got to use it for like three days.
> 
> Never delidding with a vice again. Razor method is best method. Add another confirmed kill to the vice method.


how? did u put tape on the vice?


----------



## Ceadderman

Did you vice the flat side of the CPU too?

Vice method is not foolproof, but it's the safest by all accounts that I have seen.









~Ceadder


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Did you vice the flat side of the CPU too?
> 
> Vice method is not foolproof, but it's the safest by all accounts that I have seen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


he must have had pcb in The vice on both sides trying to do vice only. Its the only way this could happen.

I went really slow on mine. it was super safe.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> how? did u put tape on the vice?


Put a bunch of tape on the vice. The pressure still caused the edge of the PCB to delaminate itself a bit. Tested system with an i7 4790, still booted, so it's definitely the CPU.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Put a bunch of tape on the vice. The pressure still caused the edge of the PCB to delaminate itself a bit. Tested system with an i7 4790, still booted, so it's definitely the CPU.


Why didn't you put the IHS in the vise, instead of the PCB? I de-lidded mine by clamping the IHS in the vise, placing a block of wood against the side of the PCB, then tapping on the block with a hammer.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> how? did u put tape on the vice?
> 
> 
> 
> Put a bunch of tape on the vice. The pressure still caused the edge of the PCB to delaminate itself a bit. Tested system with an i7 4790, still booted, so it's definitely the CPU.
Click to expand...

Hold up...

i put up a video on here several times Did you do it the way it described?
Correct me if im wrong but you gripped the pcb with both jaws of the vise??
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Put a bunch of tape on the vice. The pressure still caused the edge of the PCB to delaminate itself a bit. Tested system with an i7 4790, still booted, so it's definitely the CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> Why didn't you put the IHS in the vise, instead of the PCB? I de-lidded mine by clamping the IHS in the vise, placing a block of wood against the side of the PCB, then tapping on the block with a hammer.
Click to expand...

You could definitely use the vise-hammer method, but the vise only method is still the most controlled, so Im having trouble understanding what happened exactly.

Here is the video again.




That was my video, but here is another person's for perspective...


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Hold up...
> 
> i put up a video on here several times Did you do it the way it described?
> Correct me if im wrong but you gripped the pcb with both jaws of the vise??
> You could definitely use the vise-hammer method, but the vise only method is still the most controlled, so Im having trouble understanding what happened exactly.


I am honestly not trying to mean or anything. I just dont see how it is possible to mess it up. That is some really bad luck.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Killed my 4790k delidding it. The vice chipped part of the PCB. It looks like it's not even damaged but you can tell that it happened.
> 
> Super sad. Gotta wait a month to get a new one through the performance tuning protection plan. It was such a good chip, too. Only got to use it for like three days.
> 
> Never delidding with a vice again. Razor method is best method. Add another confirmed kill to the vice method.


i reallly dont think thr ptpp is going to cover physical damage, though i could be wrong, as i havent read alot into it


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Hold up...
> 
> i put up a video on here several times Did you do it the way it described?
> Correct me if im wrong but you gripped the pcb with both jaws of the vise??
> You could definitely use the vise-hammer method, but the vise only method is still the most controlled, so Im having trouble understanding what happened exactly.
> 
> Here is the video again.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That was my video, but here is another person's for perspective...


The only way that the vise and hammer method is uncontrolled is if you are just bashing the crap out of your CPU. If you're tapping the block of wood (that's placed against the side of the PCB) the way that you're supposed to, then there's no chance of it flying off since you'll feel the glue start to break. Once I felt the glue break on mine, I pulled the IHS off the rest of the way by hand. So little risk and effort that it made me wonder why I ever even gave the razor method any serious thought.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Hold up...
> 
> i put up a video on here several times Did you do it the way it described?
> Correct me if im wrong but you gripped the pcb with both jaws of the vise??
> You could definitely use the vise-hammer method, but the vise only method is still the most controlled, so Im having trouble understanding what happened exactly.
> 
> Here is the video again.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That was my video, but here is another person's for perspective...
> 
> 
> 
> The only way that the vise and hammer method is uncontrolled is if you are just bashing the crap out of your CPU. If you're tapping the block of wood (that's placed against the side of the PCB) the way that you're supposed to, then there's no chance of it flying off since you'll feel the glue start to break. Once I felt the glue break on mine, I pulled the IHS off the rest of the way by hand. So little risk and effort that it made me wonder why I ever even gave the razor method any serious thought.
Click to expand...

I mean there'es nothing wrong with the hammer and vise method at all. But as someone who has done it both this way, and the vise only method, I can honestly say that the vise only method is far more preferable. For me, because there were a couple of times i did it where the pcb flew across the room. *Most importantly though.* you need a much stronger and reliable vise to grip the ihs while banging away, than you would if you just used the vise only method.

But I digress...I dont understand how he screwed the pooch on this one unless he clamped the PCB and basically compressed it till it broke...youre supposed to grip the IHS on one side and the pcb on the other so it shears the ihs from the pcb. It's reallly really easy.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Killed my 4790k delidding it. The vice chipped part of the PCB. It looks like it's not even damaged but you can tell that it happened.
> 
> Super sad. Gotta wait a month to get a new one through the performance tuning protection plan. It was such a good chip, too. Only got to use it for like three days.
> 
> Never delidding with a vice again. Razor method is best method. Add another confirmed kill to the vice method.


Correct me if im wrong here but didnt you say that you killed a chip earlier delidding using the razor method?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Why didn't you put the IHS in the vise, instead of the PCB? I de-lidded mine by clamping the IHS in the vise, placing a block of wood against the side of the PCB, then tapping on the block with a hammer.


He used the vise-only method where you use the vise to push things apart. You clamp onto the IHS on one side, and onto the PCB on the other side, then increase pressure until things give way.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> He used the vise-only method where you use the vise to push things apart. You clamp onto the IHS on one side, and onto the PCB on the other side, then increase pressure until things give way.


I bought a 2 1/2 inch $15 vice from amazon and it was a breeze. I am totally comfortable performing that method for others risk free even. I mean just take your time and no issues.

I tightened it very slow and when i seen the ihs slide just a tiny a bit i spun it 180 and done it again. Then I clamped tightly to the ihs only and it peelled right off.

I feel bad for the guy but he had to have mad some kind of mistake. It was too easy otherwise.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I mean there'es nothing wrong with the hammer and vise method at all. But as someone who has done it both this way, and the vise only method, I can honestly say that the vise only method is far more preferable. For me, because there were a couple of times i did it where the pcb flew across the room. *Most importantly though.* you need a much stronger and reliable vise to grip the ihs while banging away, than you would if you just used the vise only method.
> 
> But I digress...I dont understand how he screwed the pooch on this one unless he clamped the PCB and basically compressed it till it broke...youre supposed to grip the IHS on one side and the pcb on the other so it shears the ihs from the pcb. It's reallly really easy.
> Correct me if im wrong here but didnt you say that you killed a chip earlier delidding using the razor method?


"For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction." This means that the CPU can only travel as far as you've given it the energy to travel. As I've said a few times, you shouldn't be hitting the CPU hard enough for it to go flying. That tells me that entirely too much force was being applied through that hammer. Clamping anything metal onto the PCB (even a portion of it) seems like you run the very possible risk of messing up the PCB - since ANY vise is going to be stronger than that PCB.

BUT....De-lidding period is running a risk. So I think we should all be able to agree that the level of risk in the method being used (with the exception of the razor method) is subjective - meaning that some methods seem to jive better than others with certain people.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> He used the vise-only method where you use the vise to push things apart. You clamp onto the IHS on one side, and onto the PCB on the other side, then increase pressure until things give way.


Yep, I'm aware of that. I even watched the video. Clamping anything on the PCB is too risky for me to be personally doing or even recommending.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Why didn't you put the IHS in the vise, instead of the PCB? I de-lidded mine by clamping the IHS in the vise, placing a block of wood against the side of the PCB, then tapping on the block with a hammer.
> 
> 
> 
> He used the vise-only method where you use the vise to push things apart. You clamp onto the IHS on one side, and onto the PCB on the other side, then increase pressure until things give way.
Click to expand...

You are implying that the razor method is the most dangerous method right? if so, spot on. But at the same time, I dont feel it's right for him to 'chalk up another killed chip to the vise method' because if he did it right, then it wouldnt have been an issue. That's like me doing a shoddy job on my watercooling loop and then blaming watercooling in general when my system gets fried.

Right, I get that's what he was supposed to do using the vise only method, lol. But it seems like that wasnt exactly what was done, because there's no way that damage would result if the method was followed properly. That's what im getting at.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I mean there'es nothing wrong with the hammer and vise method at all. But as someone who has done it both this way, and the vise only method, I can honestly say that the vise only method is far more preferable. For me, because there were a couple of times i did it where the pcb flew across the room. *Most importantly though.* you need a much stronger and reliable vise to grip the ihs while banging away, than you would if you just used the vise only method.
> 
> But I digress...I dont understand how he screwed the pooch on this one unless he clamped the PCB and basically compressed it till it broke...youre supposed to grip the IHS on one side and the pcb on the other so it shears the ihs from the pcb. It's reallly really easy.
> Correct me if im wrong here but didnt you say that you killed a chip earlier delidding using the razor method?
> 
> 
> 
> "For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction." This means that the CPU can only travel as far as you've given it the energy to travel. As I've said a few times, you shouldn't be hitting the CPU hard enough for it to go flying. That tells me that entirely too much force was being applied through that hammer. Clamping anything metal onto the PCB (even a portion of it) seems like you run the very possible risk of messing up the PCB - since ANY vise is going to be stronger than that PCB.
> 
> BUT....De-lidding period is running a risk. So I think we should all be able to agree that the level of risk in the method being used (with the exception of the razor method) is subjective - meaning that some methods seem to jive better than others with certain people.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> He used the vise-only method where you use the vise to push things apart. You clamp onto the IHS on one side, and onto the PCB on the other side, then increase pressure until things give way.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yep, I'm aware of that. I even watched the video. Clamping anything on the PCB is too risky for me to be personally doing or even recommending.
Click to expand...

Of course the vise is stronger than the pcb. Im not arguing that. But if you hit a block against an object being held by the vise, the weakest object is going to give way. Now with the vise only method, you can use a clamp vise that uses a c-clamp to grip the edge of a table, and this is a temporary vise. To use the hammer and vise method, its gonna be difficult to use this same vise because the clamp will give way. You would need a bench vise that's permanently affixed to the desk.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> He used the vise-only method where you use the vise to push things apart. You clamp onto the IHS on one side, and onto the PCB on the other side, then increase pressure until things give way.
> 
> 
> 
> I bought a 2 1/2 inch $15 vice from amazon and it was a breeze. I am totally comfortable performing that method for others risk free even. I mean just take your time and no issues.
> 
> I tightened it very slow and when i seen the ihs slide just a tiny a bit i spun it 180 and done it again. Then I clamped tightly to the ihs only and it peelled right off.
> 
> I feel bad for the guy but he had to have mad some kind of mistake. It was too easy otherwise.
Click to expand...

It IS supposed to be incredibly easy... I get what the other guy was saying regarding putting pressure on the PCB, but you have to realize that whatever force youre putting on the PCB is negated by the equal and opposite force being appplied to the IHS. This results in a much faster delid as well becuase the weakest bond will give way and in this case the epoxy is the weakest link in the chain.


----------



## DirektEffekt

You say it is too risky, but you are putting far less force into the pcb with the vice method than with a hammer. With the hammer you have a instantaneous transfer of energy which means that you have a large force for a very short time.

The actual amount of force, if you could measure it, would be less using the vice only method, granted, for longer periods of time. Either way you need a certain amount of force for a period of time for the glue to break. With the hammer method, you are applying an impulse force repeatedly,accumulating damage to the glue layer, going far above the minimum force required to break the glue, no matter how well you control it. On the other hand, vice only provides exactly the amount required and no more, unless you mess it up.


----------



## deepor

I drew a picture:



The green is supposed to be the PCB of the CPU, and the gray is supposed to be the clamp of the vise on one side.

I'm thinking because the side of the PCB isn't flat on the clamp, increasing the pressure might start to separate the layers of the material inside the PCB. Perhaps you can then get a CPU where the PCB still looks alright to the eye, but there's still something severed inside, and the CPU gets no contact to the board on some of the pins.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> You say it is too risky, but you are putting far less force into the pcb with the vice method than with a hammer. With the hammer you have a instantaneous transfer of energy which means that you have a large force for a very short time.
> 
> The actual amount of force, if you could measure it, would be less using the vice only method, granted, for longer periods of time. Either way you need a certain amount of force for a period of time for the glue to break. With the hammer method, you are applying an impulse force repeatedly,accumulating damage to the glue layer, going far above the minimum force required to break the glue, no matter how well you control it. On the other hand, vice only provides exactly the amount required and no more, unless you mess it up.


You keep ignoring the block of wood that goes between the PCB and the hammer - which effectively distributes the impact across the entire edge of the PCB, instead of just where the hammer hit. I agree with you, hitting the side of the PCB directly with a hammer would be really dangerous. I took my sweet time with it (no sense in rushing), and just tapped on the block. There was so little force used, that I feel completely safe doing it that way all day.


----------



## Wirerat

both the vice methods are tried a true. I did not have a piece of wood that i could use.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I drew a picture:
> 
> 
> 
> The green is supposed to be the PCB of the CPU, and the gray is supposed to be the clamp of the vise on one side.
> 
> I'm thinking because the side of the PCB isn't flat on the clamp, increasing the pressure might start to separate the layers of the material inside the PCB. Perhaps you can then get a CPU where the PCB still looks alright to the eye, but there's still something severed inside, and the CPU gets no contact to the board on some of the pins.


Um...no Thats not how it plays out. You would need a tremendous amount of force to do that. Whatever force is transfered to the PCB is immediately transferred to the IHS in the equal and opposite direction. This is why using the vise only method results in a quicker, cleaner, and safer delid. There's something he didn't do right. That's why i'd like to hear his side of it because it's important to ensure that the mistake isnt repeated with anyone else. Like @DirektEffekt discussed, the Hammer and Vise method causes an impulse force to be applied to the PCB, which is actually far more dangerous, but even that isnt terrrible because the pcb is stronger than the wood. In addition wiht the hammer and vise method, there is no force to counteract the impulse, so you end up with a shockwave that transfers force back to the hand. I can understand if he screwed this up using the hammer and vise method but not with the vise only. It's not possible if you follow the directions.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> You say it is too risky, but you are putting far less force into the pcb with the vice method than with a hammer. With the hammer you have a instantaneous transfer of energy which means that you have a large force for a very short time.
> 
> The actual amount of force, if you could measure it, would be less using the vice only method, granted, for longer periods of time. Either way you need a certain amount of force for a period of time for the glue to break. With the hammer method, you are applying an impulse force repeatedly,accumulating damage to the glue layer, going far above the minimum force required to break the glue, no matter how well you control it. On the other hand, vice only provides exactly the amount required and no more, unless you mess it up.


RIght the reason why it doenst instantly break the bond is because force is applied over time to generate an impulse. The fact that impact lasts less than a fraction of a second means that a humongous force is being generated and it gets kicked back to the person swinging the hammer until the weakest link in the chain breaks, and depending on how fast that link breaks, you might get a projectile motion similar to a rock falling off a cliff, or a missile being launched








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> You say it is too risky, but you are putting far less force into the pcb with the vice method than with a hammer. With the hammer you have a instantaneous transfer of energy which means that you have a large force for a very short time.
> 
> The actual amount of force, if you could measure it, would be less using the vice only method, granted, for longer periods of time. Either way you need a certain amount of force for a period of time for the glue to break. With the hammer method, you are applying an impulse force repeatedly,accumulating damage to the glue layer, going far above the minimum force required to break the glue, no matter how well you control it. On the other hand, vice only provides exactly the amount required and no more, unless you mess it up.
> 
> 
> 
> You keep ignoring the block of wood that goes between the PCB and the hammer - which effectively distributes the impact across the entire edge of the PCB, instead of just where the hammer hit. I agree with you, hitting the side of the PCB directly with a hammer would be really dangerous. I took my sweet time with it (no sense in rushing), and just tapped on the block. There was so little force used, that I feel completely safe doing it that way all day.
Click to expand...

You are equalizing the area of impact, but that just reduces the pressure generated (P=F/A). It;s still a tremendous force, To delid, the best way is constant applicaition of force, not successive repetitive impacts. Think about it this way: if you have a really heavy box you need to slide across the floor is it better to a) punch it or b) push it?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> both the vice methods are tried a true. I did bot have a piece of wood that icould use.


Wow! thats risky.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You are equalizing the area of impact, but that just reduces the pressure generated (P=F/A). It;s still a tremendous force, To delid, the best way is constant applicaition of force, not successive repetitive impacts. Think about it this way: if you have a really heavy box you need to slide across the floor is it better to a) punch it or b) push it?


You'd only need to put a bunch of force into swinging the hammer if you're trying to get it done quickly - which doesn't really make sense, considering the cost of the part that's being modified. You should really only be tapping on the wood with the hammer. By "tapping", I mean pulling the hammer less than a couple of inches away from the CPU, not going full-arm swinging at it. Also, making sure to NOT employ the 1-inch nail drive method from The Karate Kid movies.













People should work with the method that they feel the most comfortable with. Some people seem to have hands like surgeons, so the razor method works out best for them. Most people seem to have the best success with the various vise methods. At the end of the day, you use the method that you think you can personally pull off, you take care during the process, and hope it all works out.

I'm not personally comfortable with having a vise pressed against the side of the PCB at a weird angle, where if it slips, it has the potential to remove a chunk of the PCB. I prefer to have the vise grip onto the IHS - it's a fairly thick chunk of metal and can take whatever abuse I decide to throw at it (or not).


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You are equalizing the area of impact, but that just reduces the pressure generated (P=F/A). It;s still a tremendous force, To delid, the best way is constant applicaition of force, not successive repetitive impacts. Think about it this way: if you have a really heavy box you need to slide across the floor is it better to a) punch it or b) push it?
> 
> 
> 
> You'd only need to put a bunch of force into swinging the hammer if you're trying to get it done quickly - which doesn't really make sense, considering the cost of the part that's being modified. You should really only be tapping on the wood with the hammer. By "tapping", I mean pulling the hammer less than a couple of inches away from the CPU, not going full-arm swinging at it. Also, making sure to NOT employ the 1-inch nail drive method from The Karate Kid movies.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People should work with the method that they feel the most comfortable with. Some people seem to have hands like surgeons, so the razor method works out best for them. Most people seem to have the best success with the various vise methods. At the end of the day, you use the method that you think you can personally pull off, you take care during the process, and hope it all works out.
> 
> I'm not personally comfortable with having a vise pressed against the side of the PCB at a weird angle, where if it slips, it has the potential to remove a chunk of the PCB. I prefer to have the vise grip onto the IHS - it's a fairly thick chunk of metal and can take whatever abuse I decide to throw at it (or not).
Click to expand...

Yea I mean whatever method is most comfortable


----------



## feznz

I am just Glad Intel used a mild glue imagine it they used a 2 pot epoxy..... maybe on the next generation


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I am just Glad Intel used a mild glue imagine it they used a 2 pot epoxy..... maybe on the next generation


Well you have to take into account that if they needed to rma the CPU they'd need to take the ihs off so it wouldn't make sense to use a super tight bond.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Wow! thats risky.


no idea what you think I was saying.

There are a lot of videos of successful vice, hammer and wood delids. While I agree that the vice only method is easier/requires less finesse.

There are people that have the hammer, wood thing figured out and watching them delid looks super easy.

If you pick up the hammer and your hands are shaking its probably best to go vice only though.









Thats the only method (vice only) I will use going forward.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Wow! thats risky.
> 
> 
> 
> no idea what you think I was saying.
> 
> There are a lot of videos of successful vice, hammer and wood delids. While I agree that the vice only method is easier/requires less finesse.
> 
> There are people that have the hammer, wood thing figured out and watching them delid looks super easy.
> 
> If you pick up the hammer and your hands are shaking its probably best to go vice only though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats the only method (vice only) I will use going forward.
Click to expand...

Yea I thought you were talking about taking a hammer directly to the pcb without the wood.


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I drew a picture:
> 
> 
> 
> The green is supposed to be the PCB of the CPU, and the gray is supposed to be the clamp of the vise on one side.
> 
> I'm thinking because the side of the PCB isn't flat on the clamp, increasing the pressure might start to separate the layers of the material inside the PCB. Perhaps you can then get a CPU where the PCB still looks alright to the eye, but there's still something severed inside, and the CPU gets no contact to the board on some of the pins.


probably try again with the PCB side clamp taped thicker? I don't see how tape can be tough enough to delaminate the PCB, and that method sounds perfectly safe to me.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I drew a picture:
> 
> 
> 
> The green is supposed to be the PCB of the CPU, and the gray is supposed to be the clamp of the vise on one side.
> 
> I'm thinking because the side of the PCB isn't flat on the clamp, increasing the pressure might start to separate the layers of the material inside the PCB. Perhaps you can then get a CPU where the PCB still looks alright to the eye, but there's still something severed inside, and the CPU gets no contact to the board on some of the pins.
> 
> 
> 
> probably try again with the PCB side clamp taped thicker? I don't see how tape can be tough enough to delaminate the PCB, and that method sounds perfectly safe to me.
Click to expand...

Nor do I. And yea you want to tape it up as thick as possible


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I am just Glad Intel used a mild glue imagine it they used a 2 pot epoxy..... maybe on the next generation


If they decide to use something stronger, then they'd better solder that die to the IHS.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> *If you pick up the hammer and your hands are shaking its probably best to go vice only though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *


I couldn't agree with you more!


----------



## white owl

TBH, if we pay more for an unlocked CPU why is the heat spreader not soldered down already? They know what we are doing with them.
There is no difference between a locked and unlocked CPU. So where does the money go?
If not solder, at least use better TIM...
We are just an after thought to Intel. I hope Zen puts some enthusiasm back into the enthusiast market.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I am just Glad Intel used a mild glue imagine it they used a 2 pot epoxy..... maybe on the next generation
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well you have to take into account that if they needed to rma the CPU they'd need to take the ihs off so it wouldn't make sense to use a super tight bond.
Click to expand...

Who says they delid them at all in the RMA test?

I mean really, how do they delid a soldered IHS for RMA? I am sure they have their ways but it is significantly harder to do and if they screw it up?









Of course I have only RMA'd AMD chips so what do I know. Never had to with an Intel.









~Ceadder


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Who says they delid them at all in the RMA test?
> 
> I mean really, how do they delid a soldered IHS for RMA? I am sure they have their ways but it is significantly harder to do and if they screw it up?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course I have only RMA'd AMD chips so what do I know. Never had to with an Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


How do they solder it down in the first place? I've thought about buying a few cheap, dellidable cpus and trying to solder one down. Like grinding out a little recessed rectangle the size of the die and filling it up with solder. Or soldering down a custom heat spreader.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Who says they delid them at all in the RMA test?
> 
> I mean really, how do they delid a soldered IHS for RMA? I am sure they have their ways but it is significantly harder to do and if they screw it up?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course I have only RMA'd AMD chips so what do I know. Never had to with an Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How do they solder it down in the first place? I've thought about buying a few cheap, dellidable cpus and trying to solder one down. Like grinding out a little recessed rectangle the size of the die and filling it up with solder. Or soldering down a custom heat spreader.
Click to expand...

I could be mistaken but i'd think that theyd place the ihs in a heated receptacle and apply solder while hot and press the die into the ihs while it's still hot. I would think this process is readily reversible.

This is just my speculation though


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I could be mistaken but i'd think that theyd place the ihs in a heated receptacle and apply solder while hot and press the die into the ihs while it's still hot. I would think this process is readily reversible.
> 
> This is just my speculation though


Exactly what I was thinking.
Questions to consider:
Should I tin the heat spreader?
What solder should I use? (I'm assuming any thing solid core would work)
Should I cool let it cool down naturally, or set the freshly soldered CPU on a wet towel or on a room temperature piece of thick copper? (heat spreader down of course)

Wouldn't the heat spreader scorch the pcb at that temperature?


----------



## Ceadderman

Well if you're serious about soldering an IHS then I would say that soldering it on while sitting on a heat sink would be the way to go. Just apply the solder on the rim and apply the chip before the solder cools.

At least that's how I would think it's done best. Never attempted such a thing so I am certainly no expert.









~Ceadder


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I could be mistaken but i'd think that theyd place the ihs in a heated receptacle and apply solder while hot and press the die into the ihs while it's still hot. I would think this process is readily reversible.
> 
> This is just my speculation though
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly what I was thinking.
> Questions to consider:
> Should I tin the heat spreader?
> What solder should I use? (I'm assuming any thing solid core would work)
> Should I cool let it cool down naturally, or set the freshly soldered CPU on a wet towel or on a room temperature piece of thick copper? (heat spreader down of course)
> 
> Wouldn't the heat spreader scorch the pcb at that temperature?
Click to expand...

Honestly i think thats what the epoxy might help with-heat isolation...

I would not DIY this at all!

They have specialized apparatuses to handle this, and im not sure itll work out too well. I mean think about it - as soon as the heat source is removed solder becomes solid again. So you'd need some sort of high heat receptacle, or at the very least a crucible sitting above a burner to achieve this.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Well if you're serious about soldering an IHS then I would say that soldering it on while sitting on a heat sink would be the way to go. Just apply the solder on the rim and apply the chip before the solder cools.
> 
> At least that's how I would think it's done best. Never attempted such a thing so I am certainly no expert.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Hmmm....

Here's a thought:

Sacrifice my 212 EVO and 2 fans in push pull.

Use MAPP gas as a heat source

Put the heat sink in a vice, upside down

Sit the heat spreader on the flat surface of the 212, apply as little solder as possible and apply heat from the underside where the "X" shaped bracket _should_ be.

Remove heat.

Now, what solder to use? High silver content perhaps? Lowest melting point? Maybe there is a scale for thermal conductivity for solder, but the worst solder is probably better than the best TIM.

I bet I could find an LN2 or DICE nut with several rejected or abused Pentiums.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Honestly i think thats what the epoxy might help with-heat isolation...
> 
> I would not DIY this at all!
> 
> They have specialized apparatuses to handle this, and im not sure itll work out too well. I mean think about it - as soon as the heat source is removed solder becomes solid again. So you'd need some sort of high heat receptacle, or at the very least a crucible sitting above a burner to achieve this.


Soldering, brazing and welding is my job.
Solder actually takes quite a while to solidify with out quenching it. I have a hard time soldering thin copper because it takes the heat fast and holds on to it for a good while unless you quench it.
Adversely, if the copper is on the thick steel table, the steel pulls the heat out of it really fast so you have to apply constant heat.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Well if you're serious about soldering an IHS then I would say that soldering it on while sitting on a heat sink would be the way to go. Just apply the solder on the rim and apply the chip before the solder cools.
> 
> At least that's how I would think it's done best. Never attempted such a thing so I am certainly no expert.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmmm....
> 
> Here's a thought:
> 
> Sacrifice my 212 EVO and 2 fans in push pull.
> 
> Use MAPP gas as a heat source
> 
> Put the heat sink in a vice, upside down
> 
> Sit the heat spreader on the flat surface of the 212, apply as little solder as possible and apply heat from the underside where the "X" shaped bracket _should_ be.
> 
> Remove heat.
> 
> Now, what solder to use? High silver content perhaps? Lowest melting point? Maybe there is a scale for thermal conductivity for solder, but the worst solder is probably better than the best TIM.
> 
> I bet I could find an LN2 or DICE nut with several rejected or abused Pentiums.
Click to expand...

Well you got a crazy idea lol, but if it works more power to you. Yea that idea works in theory. Would it be rosin core solder. Thats the standard for wires

Somebody did it with an ivy bridge http://forum.hwbot.org/showthread.php?t=75350

Now that i think about it it doesnt seem entirely farfetched. I think it can be done with a butane torch as long as its done on the underside. Slow steady heat after the solder melts.

but i think the guy who did the article had some success so id follow his method.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Well you got a crazy idea lol, but if it works more power to you. Yea that idea works in theory. Make sure you use plenty of flux cleaner and use rosin core solder. Thats the standard for wires
> 
> Somebody did it with an ivy bridge http://forum.hwbot.org/showthread.php?t=75350


Thanks for the link.
I had the same idea for using a sacrificial dell with a 775 socket, and stealing the mount to use as a jig.

There are deals like this all over ebay:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-Core-2-Duo-CPU-E8500-3-16Ghz-6M-1333-SLB9K-SLAPK-/131348231092?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e94f6f3b4


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Well you got a crazy idea lol, but if it works more power to you. Yea that idea works in theory. Make sure you use plenty of flux cleaner and use rosin core solder. Thats the standard for wires
> 
> Somebody did it with an ivy bridge http://forum.hwbot.org/showthread.php?t=75350
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the link.
> I had the same idea for using a sacrificial dell with a 775 socket, and stealing the mount to use as a jig.
> 
> There are deals like this all over ebay:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-Core-2-Duo-CPU-E8500-3-16Ghz-6M-1333-SLB9K-SLAPK-/131348231092?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e94f6f3b4
Click to expand...

No prob. Hope i didnt come off as a know-it-all, especially to someone who does this for a living









Let me know how it goes.

Oh one other thing. You might not have to sacrifice the socket. You can find foxconn sockets for mad cheap on ebay. Only thing is theyre not soldered onto a pcb, but if you take a piece of acrylicor something and superglue it down, drill a few holes for the socket cover, you have an apparatus.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Foxconn-CPU-Socket-base-LGA-1150-with-Balls-/291255413314?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43d02cea42 This one has balls instead of pins


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Who says they delid them at all in the RMA test?
> 
> I mean really, how do they delid a soldered IHS for RMA? I am sure they have their ways but it is significantly harder to do and if they screw it up?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course I have only RMA'd AMD chips so what do I know. Never had to with an Intel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> How do they solder it down in the first place? I've thought about buying a few cheap, dellidable cpus and trying to solder one down. Like grinding out a little recessed rectangle the size of the die and filling it up with solder. Or soldering down a custom heat spreader.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I could be mistaken but i'd think that theyd place the ihs in a heated receptacle and apply solder while hot and press the die into the ihs while it's still hot. I would think this process is readily reversible.
> 
> This is just my speculation though


All intel cpus of the 115x series since after sandy have been using TIM, this entails some information about what exactly Intel does with the RMA'ed chips. I have sent back quite a few chips in the Ivy family (Go figure, RIP Franky) I have conformation from them in discussion with myself where I ask them what they do during their RMA process including a delidded chip. They said it's not a huge issue as they take the IHS off anyway to inspect for any physical damage to the die itself. No clue why, but they do do it.

Solder time, Intel uses a solder called Fluxless solder. I can assume the way they set this system up is where an early amount of fluxless solder is applied to the IHS before assembly and the family, etching/numbering. From this process they put the silicon around the die and heat both the IHS and the PCB of the chip simultaneously. When both are heated they are pressed together and the solder seal is made, also a small secondary heat seal is made on the silicon rubber seal, which would explain the remnant outline on a pcb after removing the excess after one delids their cpu.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> No prob. Hope i didnt come off as a know-it-all, especially to someone who does this for a living


How so?
I'm lost in this process too.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> All intel cpus of the 115x series since after sandy have been using TIM, this entails some information about what exactly Intel does with the RMA'ed chips. I have sent back quite a few chips in the Ivy family (Go figure, RIP Franky) I have conformation from them in discussion with myself where I ask them what they do during their RMA process including a delidded chip. They said it's not a huge issue as they take the IHS off anyway to inspect for any physical damage to the die itself. No clue why, but they do do it.
> 
> Solder time, Intel uses a solder called Fluxless solder. I can assume the way they set this system up is where an early amount of fluxless solder is applied to the IHS before assembly and the family, etching/numbering. From this process they put the silicon around the die and heat both the IHS and the PCB of the chip simultaneously. When both are heated they are pressed together and the solder seal is made, also a small secondary heat seal is made on the silicon rubber seal, which would explain the remnant outline on a pcb after removing the excess after one delids their cpu.


Thanks. I was worried about the PCB getting scorched. I can get some solder locally that is $15/lb with a high silver content that runs well on clean copper whereas the other stuff requires the copper to be tinned first.

If they can heat the PCB up in the soldering process I don't see how my method would ruin it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> How so?
> I'm lost in this process too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I was worried about the PCB getting scorched. I can get some solder locally that is $15/lb with a high silver content that runs well on clean copper whereas the other stuff requires the copper to be tinned first.
> 
> If they can heat the PCB up in the soldering process I don't see how my method would ruin it.


you HAVE to check you're solders melting point, where it turns into a fluid base. If it says anywhere above 100C dont even attempt it, you could literally cook your pcb and chip. I won't stop you but I will try to give you as much info as possible


----------



## tconroy135

For the lowest temps is it best just to leave the IHS off?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> No prob. Hope i didnt come off as a know-it-all, especially to someone who does this for a living
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How so?
> I'm lost in this process too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> All intel cpus of the 115x series since after sandy have been using TIM, this entails some information about what exactly Intel does with the RMA'ed chips. I have sent back quite a few chips in the Ivy family (Go figure, RIP Franky) I have conformation from them in discussion with myself where I ask them what they do during their RMA process including a delidded chip. They said it's not a huge issue as they take the IHS off anyway to inspect for any physical damage to the die itself. No clue why, but they do do it.
> 
> Solder time, Intel uses a solder called Fluxless solder. I can assume the way they set this system up is where an early amount of fluxless solder is applied to the IHS before assembly and the family, etching/numbering. From this process they put the silicon around the die and heat both the IHS and the PCB of the chip simultaneously. When both are heated they are pressed together and the solder seal is made, also a small secondary heat seal is made on the silicon rubber seal, which would explain the remnant outline on a pcb after removing the excess after one delids their cpu.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks. I was worried about the PCB getting scorched. I can get some solder locally that is $15/lb with a high silver content that runs well on clean copper whereas the other stuff requires the copper to be tinned first.
> 
> If they can heat the PCB up in the soldering process I don't see how my method would ruin it.
Click to expand...

I still dont understand how solder gets transferred to the die when it has to remain cool.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> How so?
> I'm lost in this process too.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I was worried about the PCB getting scorched. I can get some solder locally that is $15/lb with a high silver content that runs well on clean copper whereas the other stuff requires the copper to be tinned first.
> 
> If they can heat the PCB up in the soldering process I don't see how my method would ruin it.
> 
> 
> 
> you HAVE to check you're solders melting point, where it turns into a fluid base. If it says anywhere above 100C dont even attempt it, you could literally cook your pcb and chip. I won't stop you but I will try to give you as much info as possible
Click to expand...

Ah ok That makes sense then. I didnt know those exist, but then again the only solder i know is rosin core and regular leaded solder
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tconroy135*
> 
> For the lowest temps is it best just to leave the IHS off?


Doesnt make that much of a difference, and you have to realize that if you're using a tower, youre taking a risk every time you remove the cpu block because the cpu will come with it. I speak from experience on this. Ive been running fully delidded on a naked ivy mount for about six months now


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I still dont understand how solder gets transferred to the die when it has to remain cool.


it wouldn't if it stayed cool. The die gets heated too, but not to the point of damaging the silicon. Without electricity running through the die, it can take a higher temperature and remain unharmed.


----------



## white owl

This kid melded regular solder on the heat spreader using the heat of the CPU.
I'm no longer worried about heat. I don't know what will bond to silicon though as it is non-metal.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> This kid melded regular solder on the heat spreader using the heat of the CPU.
> I'm no longer worried about heat. I don't know what will bond to silicon though as it is non-metal.
> [...]


What you see after delidding the CPU is not the silicon of the die. There is a cover of some sort of glass on top of the actual die, and what you are looking at is that glass cover.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> What you see after delidding the CPU is not the silicon of the die. There is a cover of some sort of glass on top of the actual die, and what you are looking at is that glass cover.


If I called Intel, do you think they would be able to give any advice? AMD would know too.

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/75566-update-amd-selling-leadfree-processors
So it can be solder with lead in it. They stopped doing it for environmental reasons.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> If I called Intel, do you think they would be able to give any advice? AMD would know too.
> 
> http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/75566-update-amd-selling-leadfree-processors
> So it can be solder with lead in it. They stopped doing it for environmental reasons.


No intel is not going to help u with that.

You could save your self a lot of trouble and just delid and use clu/clp like the rest of us.

Even if you dont destroy your chip (most likley result). The chances of having better temps than clu/clp are very slim.

Look at the temps in a 5820k. They are soldered and a h100/h110 can barely tame them at 4.2ghz+.

I suggest you create a new thread. We can help you get the top off. There may be someone who can help more with the rest.


----------



## white owl

The heat spreader is easy to pop off. I messed up the first time (teeth in vice cut into the heat spreader) but it posted. That was a Core 2 Duo.
I cut the teeth off the vice and duct taped it.








I agree, the temps will probably be the same or really close.
I'm getting interested in chill boxes and this seemed like fun. I don't care to spend $150 on 10 cpus to experiment on them. People spend more than that at a bar. This is for fun...


----------



## Asus11

just delided my 4790k, applied CLU and some nail polish etc

do I have to put CLU on the underside of the intel heatspreader? or is it ok without?

want my PC back on asap so please fast reply







will rep


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> just delided my 4790k, applied CLU and some nail polish etc
> 
> do I have to put CLU on the underside of the intel heatspreader? or is it ok without?
> 
> want my PC back on asap so please fast reply
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will rep


both sides, so die and IHS


----------



## Brohem0th

Bought a G3258 for the interim until I can get my 4790k replaced. I've now owned every devils canyon chip released, the G3258, 4690k, and 4790k.

I would be more mad, but I've owned all three for 350$, so I made it off pretty easily.


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> both sides, so die and IHS


im on my PC now im so impatient.. I put the thinnest layer on the underside of the IHS, time to play some games and see what the difference is!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> both sides, so die and IHS
> 
> 
> 
> im on my PC now im so impatient.. I put the thinnest layer on the underside of the IHS, time to play some games and see what the difference is!
Click to expand...

Very clean. looks good!

Hope you were careful not to get any on the VRs, or you can paint them with nail polish


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Very clean. looks good!
> 
> Hope you were careful not to get any on the VRs, or you can paint them with nail polish


not a spec on the circuit board, also already did nail polish on them just incase,

so far im seeing a 10c drop, which is great, does it take time to set in etc? maybe I might see better results ?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Very clean. looks good!
> 
> Hope you were careful not to get any on the VRs, or you can paint them with nail polish
> 
> 
> 
> not a spec on the circuit board, also already did nail polish on them just incase,
> 
> so far im seeing a 10c drop, which is great, does it take time to set in etc? maybe I might see better results ?
Click to expand...

No burn in time, 10C is totally worth it IMO.


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> No burn in time, 10C is totally worth it IMO.


yeah thats with stock intel cooler too, wait until I finally get this WB on it .. hoping to see good results









plus took 2 seconds to delid using vice only method lol


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> not a spec on the circuit board, also already did nail polish on them just incase,
> 
> so far im seeing a 10c drop, which is great, does it take time to set in etc? maybe I might see better results ?


10c is excellent for Devils canyon. I only got 7c using clp on die and gelid on ihs.

The original haswell and ivy bridge seena lot bigger gains. My 4770k was a mess prior to delid it was nearly 30c gained from delid.

Intel "fixed" the tim and glue application on DC.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> No burn in time, 10C is totally worth it IMO.
> 
> 
> 
> yeah thats with stock intel cooler too, wait until I finally get this WB on it .. hoping to see good results
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> plus took 2 seconds to delid using vice only method lol
Click to expand...

Glad to see we have another believer. Vise only is definitely the way to go!


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Glad to see we have another believer. Vise only is definitely the way to go!


is it common to have first 2 cores hotter than the rest?

casuse im thinking I might need to add abit more CLU to the underside of the IHS


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> is it common to have first 2 cores hotter than the rest?
> 
> casuse im thinking I might need to add abit more CLU to the underside of the IHS


To a slight degree, yes.
You have the hard part done, so your free to experiment now. Let us know.


----------



## Wirerat

You will never get all the cores exactly the same. The one closest to the gpu portion of the die always tends to run cooler.


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> You will never get all the cores exactly the same. The one closest to the gpu portion of the die always tends to run cooler.


in games so far max temps

core 1 77c
core 2 78c
core 3 74c
core 4 75c

bare in mind this is with stock intel cooler, as im waiting to get fitments for Waterblock etc lol


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> in games so far max temps
> 
> core 1 77c
> core 2 78c
> core 3 74c
> core 4 75c
> 
> bare in mind this is with stock intel cooler, as im waiting to get fitments for Waterblock etc lol


run x264 and report temps. gaming doesnt push the cpu to 100%.

Temps are even at 60% load. Not sure if you have a good example under the stock cooler too.

What we all experience in one core being considerably cooler is on aftermarket cooling.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Glad to see we have another believer. Vise only is definitely the way to go!
> 
> 
> 
> is it common to have first 2 cores hotter than the rest?
> 
> casuse im thinking I might need to add abit more CLU to the underside of the IHS
Click to expand...

Trust me if you didnt put enough CLU there, your overheating problems would be much worse than a few degrees lol. My IHS was improperly seated - TIM-wise and temps started at 50 degrees and kept climbing despite my pump and everything running. I realized that it was because i didnt clean the old CLU before adding new CLU. So yea, this is important. If you ever take it out and add more CLU, dont layer it on top or you're gonna have a bad time. It's just like any other TIM.


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You're gonna have a bad time.



Sorry, I could't resist









Anyway. Just delidded my new 4790K! I don't know what the temp drop is because I just tested the cpu by entering bios before delid.
At the moment running 4.8Ghz @ 1.288V









http://valid.x86.fr/cmettq

No need to submit this because I already have one 4790K on the list


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry, I could't resist
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway. Just delidded my new 4790K! I don't know what the temp drop is because I just tested the cpu by entering bios before delid.
> At the moment running 4.8Ghz @ 1.288V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/cmettq
> 
> No need to submit this because I already have one 4790K on the list


Mind sharing batch # on the new chip ? Thats a good clocker and I got a sneaking suspicion that a lot of the newest ones do 4.8 below 1.3v

My new one is L445B333 and it does 4.8 1.245v


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Mind sharing batch # on the new chip ? Thats a good clocker and I got a sneaking suspicion that a lot of the newest ones do 4.8 below 1.3v
> 
> My new one is L445B333 and it does 4.8 1.245v


Your chip is pretty impressing! Mine is X446A639. Chip from vietnam. I was surprised because I have read that vietnam chips are generally weakest clockers.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Your chip is pretty impressing! Mine is X446A639. Chip from vietnam. I was surprised because I have read that vietnam chips are generally weakest clockers.


pretty much the first "good clocker" I ever had. I mean I have a G3258 here that does 4.7 @ 1.312v which is high for one of those but i couldnt get too excited considering its limitations.

Edit : fixed the vcore boo-boo


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I have a G3258 here that does 4.7 @ 3.12v


Thats some serious volts there LOL, x2.5 your recommended


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Thats some serious volts there LOL, x2.5 your recommended


HAHA 4.7 @ *1*.312V


----------



## RickRockerr

I wish that someday I could get my hands on real golden chip







5Ghz @~1.25V or something like that


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I wish that someday I could get my hands on real golden chip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5Ghz @~1.25V or something like that


This one will bench at 5ghz 1.365v. I am happy with that. I dont need it for 24/7.

over 1k cinebench


----------



## RickRockerr

I tried 5Ghz for 3dmark. I need 1.39V to get it stable enough for testing.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> I tried 5Ghz for 3dmark. I need 1.39V to get it stable enough for testing.


I can run valley/cinbench/realbench. its very close to stable but I wont run extended stability testing, Im gonna baby it for now.


----------



## Sovereignty

Add me to the club!! Used the vice only method. Even with 2 layers of electrical tape on the jaws of the vice, the knurling managed to chew through it a little on the right side. I thought I was going to have to lap the IHS but I tested it out anyways and its been making good contact. I think it may be in part to the NH-D15's slightly convex base. Either way I am pleased with the results. I used CLU between the die and IHS and NT-H1 on the cooler. I got a drop of 10-12c.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sovereignty*
> 
> 
> 
> Add me to the club!! Used the vice only method. Even with 2 layers of electrical tape on the jaws of the vice, the knurling managed to chew through it a little on the right side. I thought I was going to have to lap the IHS but I tested it out anyways and its been making good contact. I think it may be in part to the NH-D15's slightly convex base. Either way I am pleased with the results. I used CLU between the die and IHS and NT-H1 on the cooler. I got a drop of 10-12c.


He needs this format. From the OP.

OCN name:
CPU:
on die-TIM:
ihs-TIM:
Mhz gained:
OC after delid:
Temp drops:
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## jh30uk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Your chip is pretty impressing! Mine is X446A639. Chip from vietnam. I was surprised because I have read that vietnam chips are generally weakest clockers.


Not sure where you read that as I read they are better clockers.

I had a launch day 4790k and it was 9month old going by entering the serial number on the Intel site and it ran hot and MAX OC was 4.6GHZ (cannot remember voltage).

My 4770k cannot OC its a total POS but runs cool.

So I now have a 2nd hand Vietnam X4 Batch and in 1 day of testing its 4.6GHZ 1.20v, still gets hot in IBT/Prime95 (not latest build as a no go for Haswell).

I think I will try for 4.7/4.8GHZ to see temps/volts then decide on Deliding, I would do the Cool Pro on *both* Die and Heatsink as its the only way to go if you go that far as some get up to 20C drop.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sovereignty*
> 
> 
> 
> Add me to the club!! Used the vice only method. Even with 2 layers of electrical tape on the jaws of the vice, the knurling managed to chew through it a little on the right side. I thought I was going to have to lap the IHS but I tested it out anyways and its been making good contact. I think it may be in part to the NH-D15's slightly convex base. Either way I am pleased with the results. I used CLU between the die and IHS and NT-H1 on the cooler. I got a drop of 10-12c.


Not bad dude. Yea it tends to dig in a little sometimes.


----------



## Sovereignty

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> He needs this format. From the OP.
> 
> OCN name:
> CPU:
> on die-TIM:
> ihs-TIM:
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid:
> Temp drops:
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


OCN name: Sovereignty
CPU: 4790k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: NT-H1
Mhz gained: NA
OC after delid: 4700 MHz
Temp drops: 11c on hottest core
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/0zfd7e



Couple of 15 minute runs of OCCT at 4.8. 4.7 runs beyond stable at 1.232v on the core and 4.8 is as pictured above. I dont bother running that for 24/7 since 100MHz isn't a huge deal.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Not bad dude. Yea it tends to dig in a little sometimes.


Thanks


----------



## asm99

Regarding my post: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/28100#post_24167331 still waiting for my CLU to arrive.
Meanwhile I can throw a temporary report on temps using Arctic MX-4





These are the temps BD (Before Delidding): ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
Minimum:
19°C/19°C/21°C/20°C
Maximum:
61°C/61°C/59°C/53°C


These are the temps AD (After Delidding): on die-TIM: Arctic MX-4/ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
Minimum:
15°C/15°C/20°C/18°C
Maximum:
54°C/56°C/54°C/50°C


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Trust me if you didnt put enough CLU there, your overheating problems would be much worse than a few degrees lol. My IHS was improperly seated - TIM-wise and temps started at 50 degrees and kept climbing despite my pump and everything running. I realized that it was because i didnt clean the old CLU before adding new CLU. So yea, this is important. If you ever take it out and add more CLU, dont layer it on top or you're gonna have a bad time. It's just like any other TIM.


if I do take it out will only add the smallest to the IHS so it has a bigger area covered, btw I idle @ 55c-60c due to the intel stock cooler + mitx no fans, will have my fittings ready to go on this weekend, so hoping for great temps


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sovereignty*
> 
> OCN name: Sovereignty
> CPU: 4790k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: NT-H1
> Mhz gained: NA
> OC after delid: 4700 MHz
> Temp drops: 11c on hottest core
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.canardpc.com/0zfd7e
> 
> 
> 
> Couple of 15 minute runs of OCCT at 4.8. 4.7 runs beyond stable at 1.232v on the core and 4.8 is as pictured above. I dont bother running that for 24/7 since 100MHz isn't a huge deal.
> Thanks


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Just posted up a new video...let me know what you guys think...

Before you watch, keep in mind i might do things a little different than you...


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!











There's a little surprise since we're talking about CLU...


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Just posted up a new video...let me know what you guys think...


Nice Video









Found one of my old Athlons to practice on. Did the vice only method with ease. Tell you what the crack it made when it IHS let go







priceless. That spreader is super thick and heavy


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Just posted up a new video...let me know what you guys think...
> 
> 
> 
> Nice Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Found one of my old Athlons to practice on. Did the vice only method with ease. Tell you what the crack it made when it IHS let go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> priceless. That spreader is super thick and heavy
Click to expand...

Lol that wasn't the video I put up...that's my other video but I'm glad it worked out for you man.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Just posted up a new video...let me know what you guys think...
> 
> 
> 
> Nice Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Found one of my old Athlons to practice on. Did the vice only method with ease. Tell you what the crack it made when it IHS let go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> priceless. That spreader is super thick and heavy
Click to expand...

Hmmmmm may just try this with an old Athlon II that I have on a AM2 board on my wall.

Old hardware ain't just for shelves.









~Ceadder


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Hmmmmm may just try this with an old Athlon II that I have on a AM2 board on my wall.
> 
> Old hardware ain't just for shelves.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Highly recommended! 30 seconds of fun


----------



## JackCY

I would try an Athlon too, got two around here somewhere, but the thing is they are old and bare







Because why the hell do you need an IHS on CPU







These modern inventions *shakes head* only make things worse.


----------



## dennis97519

Ahh somehow I can't quote.
I was LOLing at,some of the replys here.
First you can't scorch relative higher quality PCB made of fiberglass and stuff at soldering temps of 300 to 400 degC.

Secondly the only metals that stays liquid at room temperature are gallium and mercury. The CPU silicon can withstand a certain soldering tenperature for a short period of time, maybe a few tens of seconds or so. But you can't power the CPU above 105. I don't think you will find any solder that melts below 100 anyway. Indigo Xtreme doesn't really solder the IHS to the base of the cooler anyway. So there is no need for solder that melts below 100C, and you cannot find any of that also.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> Ahh somehow I can't quote.
> I was LOLing at,some of the replys here.
> Fist you can't scorch relative higher quality PCB made of fiberglass and stuff at soldering temps of 300 to 400 degC.
> 
> Secondly the only metals that stays liquid at room temperature are gallium and mercury. The CPU silicon can withstand a certain soldering tenperature for a short period of time, maybe a few tens of seconds or so. But you can't power the CPU above *105. I don't think you will find any solder that melts below 100 anyway.* Indigo Xtreme doesn't really solder the IHS to the base of the cooler anyway.


Agreed.
The only way I can figure to do it is to melt the solder on the heat spreader and let it harden. Then place the CPU on the now hardened solder and apply heat again.
I'm pretty sure putting the cool CPU down on hot solder would crack the die.
I can't find a cheap solder that will stick to a non-metal. What ever AMD and Intel uses can't be terribly expensive or they wouldn't bother with it.


----------



## dennis97519

http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/login.jsp?tp=&arnumber=1432041&url=http%3A%2F%2Fieeexplore.ieee.org%2Fiel5%2F9795%2F30881%2F01432041
Fluxless soldering


----------



## JackCY

Probably some fancier solder paste. Why? Want to solder it at home? There is mostly likely a preprocessing applied to the silicon chip first so it can be soldered to.
I don't think the process is that expensive considering the CPU prices and them also going up and up due to lack of any competition. Sure a crappy paste TIM is mere cents and the process is simple too. While I understand them wanting to cut down cost on lower end products, it would really be nice of them to treat exclusive products like the unlocked K series to a higher standard, solder the IHS on K series.
First unlocked CPUs were almost gone and you have to pay an extra for it, now they keep using crappy TIM to hinder any remaining OC.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> *Probably some fancier solder paste. Why? Want to solder it at home? There is mostly likely a preprocessing applied to the silicon chip first so it can be soldered to.*
> I don't think the process is that expensive considering the CPU prices and them also going up and up due to lack of any competition. Sure a crappy paste TIM is mere cents and the process is simple too. While I understand them wanting to cut down cost on lower end products, it would really be nice of them to treat exclusive products like the unlocked K series to a higher standard, solder the IHS on K series.
> First unlocked CPUs were almost gone and you have to pay an extra for it, now they keep using crappy TIM to hinder any remaining OC.


There is nothing but solder...no paste or tinning.

From what I've gathered, solder is actually going to hinder sub zero temps.
Delidding it at all may hurt my goal.

Does any one know why a locked Intel chip can't be unlocked?

Also, I think they should be deliddable but they need to use good TIM and less glue.
The black glue makes a nice gap for a thick blob of regular old toothpaste.

My core 2 duo's TIM was crusty, hard and thick. Pure dung butter.


----------



## JackCY

Paste means it's not a solid bar of solder but the solder is ground fine into very tiny pellets. Print it, lay parts, heat, clean, done. So CPU makers probably just spread this fancier solder paste on the chip that has been prepped for soldering so the solder even sticks to it, slam the heat spreader on and heat it. Or they just cook the whole thing at once, would be more sensible in a way.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Paste means it's not a solid bar of solder but the solder is ground fine into very tiny pellets. Print it, lay parts, heat, clean, done. So CPU makers probably just spread this fancier solder paste on the chip that has been prepped for soldering so the solder even sticks to it, slam the heat spreader on and heat it. Or they just cook the whole thing at once, would be more sensible in a way.


Ah. That's doable. Smart cookie you are.


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GaMbi2004*
> 
> The raystorm has copper base right?
> you are gonna have a hard time getting it off the die with CLP/CLU and even risk cracking the die in the process.
> CLP/CLU is still highly recommended for delidders between die and IHS, but not as effective on naked mounts and can have problems as mentioned above.
> gelid extreme is better / more safe for naked mounts.
> You CAN use CLP/CLU for naked, but this club hates to see a good chip be damaged.. thats why we are advising against it.
> 
> If you dont mind me asking, why do you even want to go naked? more risky and the gain is small.. like 1-3 degree over the normal IHS / CLU solution. (some reports 5degree and above, but I think that is just be course the IHS solution was not applied properly)


I disagree. The gain is significant and the risk is very minimal. Many people forget that it's easier to have better contact on a small surface area such as a die which is practically quarter of the size. Better contact, better heat dissipation. Plus anyone who is willing to go naked is an extreme overclocker any gain is worth it.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> I disagree. The gain is significant and the risk is very minimal. Many people forget that it's easier to have better contact on a small surface area such as a die which is practically quarter of the size. Better contact, better heat dissipation. Plus anyone who is willing to go naked is an extreme overclocker any gain is worth it.


Going naked only gains 2-3c. It will provide slightly faster heat transfer but still stabilizes around 2c delta.

Not saying its not worth it. The naked ivy kit is cheap. $10 for 2-3c is not a bad return.


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> if You succeed I will impressed to even see 5c delta improvement vs clp/clu.
> 
> Going naked only gains 2-3c.
> 
> How do you figure soldering a die to ihs will be better than naked direct mount to the die?


I meant naked direct mount is the way to go. Sorry for the misinterpretation. Hell no to the soldering g


----------



## ByeByeFive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Going naked only gains 2-3c. It will provide slightly faster heat transfer but still stabilizes around 2c delta.
> 
> Not saying its not worth it. The naked ivy kit is cheap. $10 for 2-3c is not a bad return.


It's easier to have that perfect contact when you work with a smaller die area. This is where I feel that minimal layer of thermal paste will really shine


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ByeByeFive*
> 
> It's easier to have that perfect contact when you work with a smaller die area. This is where I feel that minimal layer of thermal paste will really shine


Thing is though, people have tried it and it only really gains you an extra 2-3c vs running with the IHS on and using even regular TIM on the IHS. I personally don't think that the extra 2-3c is worth the risk of cracking the die every time you remount. I mean, even with the naked ivy kit, you still have to be 10 times more careful mounting because it only takes a small mistake to accidentally missmount something and cause damage.

EDIT: And you have to remember, with an IHS, since you have a larger surface area the perfect contact matters less and, in my experience, if you use CLU or CLP under the IHS you can get away with plenty of remounts without removing the IHS, even if you remove the CPU from the socket entirely, just so long as you keep the IHS on.


----------



## knoober

I did a small bit of reading on this a while back and found that pure gallium has a melting point around 150 degress F while the cpu will run up to near 200 on any given day. Conceivably if the solder has a gallium back (which I have read that it might) it goes full liquid just by running the chip. I imagine there is a pretty high degree of precision at work in getting the proper amount of solder that will maintain enough surface tension to avoid spill overs, whille still bridging the gap between IHS and die. However if a gallium based solder is used, they could just slap a chunk under the IHS, seal it with the black glue and ship it out because the solder would melt on the first use right?

I dont think thats what they do however.... I picture a conveytor style oven that finished chips are run through to get the initial melt.

As of now do we have any definative numbers on the difference in W/mk between solder and CLU/CLP ? Most of the reading I have done lists CLU/CLP at higher than pure gallium, but I have seen more than one post that challenges that concept. What I have read suggests that solder would be somewhere around 50-60 W/mk while the CLU/CLP would be 80 + (with pure gallium coming in @ 82 -86 w/mk depending on the source). Anyone know the truth? All I can say for sure is that I killed two Phenom II's trying to delid (even though I think I could manage it with the third try, but cant afford the risk) ! Delid succesful. Boot afterwards, not so much. I think I killed it with heat the second time. Someday Ill try again, but maybe on a chip that isnt soldered


----------



## n00bftw

just delidded my it 4790k and load temps dropped by as much as 10c-15c whic is awesome, only downside was that i chipped the board right at the edge so i think im safe as its working perfectly, should not of had to to it really but it is totally worth it, i think it was a bring your kid to work day when my chip got pasted haha, what a joke


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *knoober*
> 
> I did a small bit of reading on this a while back and found that pure gallium has a melting point around 150 degress F while the cpu will run up to near 200 on any given day. Conceivably if the solder has a gallium back (which I have read that it might) it goes full liquid just by running the chip. I imagine there is a pretty high degree of precision at work in getting the proper amount of solder that will maintain enough surface tension to avoid spill overs, whille still bridging the gap between IHS and die. However if a gallium based solder is used, they could just slap a chunk under the IHS, seal it with the black glue and ship it out because the solder would melt on the first use right?
> 
> I dont think thats what they do however.... I picture a conveytor style oven that finished chips are run through to get the initial melt.
> 
> As of now do we have any definative numbers on the difference in W/mk between solder and CLU/CLP ? Most of the reading I have done lists CLU/CLP at higher than pure gallium, but I have seen more than one post that challenges that concept. What I have read suggests that solder would be somewhere around 50-60 W/mk while the CLU/CLP would be 80 + (with pure gallium coming in @ 82 -86 w/mk depending on the source). Anyone know the truth? All I can say for sure is that I killed two Phenom II's trying to delid (even though I think I could manage it with the third try, but cant afford the risk) ! Delid succesful. Boot afterwards, not so much. I think I killed it with heat the second time. Someday Ill try again, but maybe on a chip that isnt soldered


You might be referring to the boiling point. Gallium is a liquid at room temp, hence CLP/CLU, but if CLU is an alloy there's a good chance that the boiling point would actually increase beyond 150.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You might be referring to the boiling point. Gallium is a liquid at room temp, hence CLP/CLU, but if CLU is an alloy there's a good chance that the boiling point would actually increase beyond 150.


That number is wrong for both temperatures. Pure gallium melts at 30c (86f), which is essentially a warm room. The compound in CLP is an alloy known as Gallistan which melts at around -10c apparently, although unlike pure gallium its Hardee to known for sure. Gallium itself boils at around 2000c.

CLU is a bit different. I am not sure what it is made of exactly, as it is not really a liquid, its more like a gel. It certainly contains gallium but I am not sure if it is an alloy or a mixture of an alloy and other compounds to make it behave as it does.


----------



## knoober

It's a strong based of gallium with silver and some other things. If you guys want to know for certain I'll dig up the sheet. Has anyone got a reading on the w/mk for solder on the die though?

edit: now that I think of it I believe indium not gallium. whoops! hope no one bet the farm on that one!


----------



## stoker

Woke up this morning, and said stuff it i'm going to delid. Damaged the ihs slightly but the chip is ok.
Will post back with some results soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Woke up this morning, and said stuff it i'm going to delid. Damaged the ihs slightly but the chip is ok.
> Will post back with some results soon.


Nice! looks pretty clean to me!


----------



## Ceadderman

This Athlon 64 x2 is a real bish of a delid. Been sitting at my desk with the vice and the lid doesn't look to be budging at all. But the IHS is *sloooooooowly* gapping away from the PCB. The troubling thing is that the PCB is not much larger than the IHS.









But I will continue this tomorrow when I can see better. The IHS doesn't appear to be soldered to the pcb though.









Great practice however. My bad thinking it was an Athlon II.









~Ceadder


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> This Athlon 64 x2 is a real bish of a delid. Been sitting at my desk with the vice and the lid doesn't look to be budging at all. But the IHS is *sloooooooowly* gapping away from the PCB. The troubling thing is that the PCB is not much larger than the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But I will continue this tomorrow when I can see better. The IHS doesn't appear to be soldered to the pcb though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great practice however. My bad thinking it was an Athlon II.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I found it needed quite abit of force to crack the seal. I just went hard on this one though, as i didn't care if it broke.
It was also alot easier to do too since the ihs is a lot thicker and not stepped like the haswell one.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nice! looks pretty clean to me!


Thanks


----------



## n00bftw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Woke up this morning, and said stuff it i'm going to delid. Damaged the ihs slightly but the chip is ok.
> Will post back with some results soon.


i also chipped the pcb very slightly on my chip while deliding but it runs fine as it got chipped right on the edge of the board thankfully


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *n00bftw*
> 
> i also chipped the pcb very slightly on my chip while deliding but it runs fine as it got chipped right on the edge of the board thankfully


That is unfortunate, lucky it still works. I used alot of masking tape on both sides yet still damaged the ihs. But its very minor and due to using an old vice at work.

Very happy i did go through with the delid as it has helped me pass x30 h264 runs without my dreaded bsod 101's, before i'd be lucky to make 15-18 runs and crash.

Only used gelid extreme on both, may just go naked as the price is cheaper for the kit instead of clu.

Add me boyz!

OCN name: stoker
CPU: 4790k
on die-TIM: gelid gc extreme
ihs-TIM: gelid gc extreme
Mhz gained: 100 lol (more to come -maybe)
OC after delid: 4800
Temp drops: 8-10C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e7rref


----------



## n00bftw

What cooling system you using ?


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *n00bftw*
> 
> What cooling system you using ?


Its in my sig







The only thing which is not shown is my pump which is an old thermaltake p500, have had it for years and only running at about 1700rpm (70%) modded to 3pin fan connector (running off motherboard header).

Was thinking of adding another 2x 240 rads, maybe then would i need a new pump









I'll post some pics up soon


----------



## stoker

This is a before and after playing a full round 1500tik on BF4 metro

BEFORE


AFTER


FPS is the same as have it locked @122 but the higher i go the more responsive it feels. Placebo effect? Maybe.


----------



## n00bftw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Its in my sig
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The only thing which is not shown is my pump which is an old thermaltake p500, have had it for years and only running at about 1700rpm (70%) modded to 3pin fan connector (running off motherboard header).
> 
> Was thinking of adding another 2x 240 rads, maybe then would i need a new pump
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll post some pics up soon


im defo going to go the water cooling route, especially for my 980ti which is disgustingly noisy


----------



## bonami2

well gonna delid the vice only method my 4790k is hot like crap

4.7 1.3v 80-90c h75 with 30c water cinebench


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> well gonna delid the vice only method my 4790k is hot like crap
> 
> 4.7 1.3v 80-90c h75 with 30c water cinebench


1.3v on H75 is why its so hot. delid will help but you really should look twards a better cooler for 1.3v.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> 1.3v on H75 is why its so hot. delid will help but you really should look twards a better cooler for 1.3v.


well just asked a guy with a hyper 212 evo that has a 20c drop on a 4790k

and my water temp of 30celsius show bad thermal transfer cant make magic with better loop my room is at 20c bigger loop will mean 20-25c water is just science


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> well gonna delid the vice only method my 4790k is hot like crap
> 
> 4.7 1.3v 80-90c h75 with 30c water cinebench


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> 1.3v on H75 is why its so hot. delid will help but you really should look twards a better cooler for 1.3v.


Delid will help with the temps, but by a few degrees. It wont bring it down to mid 60s or low 70s under load. You need a better cooler for that. The AIO coolers are better than a lot of air coolers but you have to realize their rads and pumps arent great. If you have the money for it, I would go with a watercooling setup. Even a 240 rad and good static pressure would drop temps quite a bit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> well just asked a guy with a hyper 212 evo that has a 20c drop on a 4790k
> 
> and my water temp of 30celsius show bad thermal transfer cant make magic with better loop my room is at 20c bigger loop will mean 20-25c water is just science


water temp being 30 has nothing to do with it. For instance, while,im looking at precision X, I can turn my pump off and watch my GPU temps rise 3 degrees C per second even though my water temp sits at 27C. Its not a matter of heat transfer. Water is very difficult to heat up and its most certainly not a 1:1

You have to understand that overvolting a CPU without a solid cooling setup is like putting NOS into a Civic. It's not going to work as well as if you had a custom setup


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Delid will help with the temps, but by a few degrees. It wont bring it down to mid 60s or low 70s under load. You need a better cooler for that. The AIO coolers are better than a lot of air coolers but you have to realize their rads and pumps arent great. If you have the money for it, I would go with a watercooling setup. Even a 240 rad and good static pressure would drop temps quite a bit.
> water temp being 30 has nothing to do with it. For instance, while,im looking at precision X, I can turn my pump off and watch my GPU temps rise 3 degrees C per second even though my water temp sits at 27C. Its not a matter of heat transfer. Water is very difficult to heat up and its most certainly not a 1:1


bad thermal transfer..... if you stop your pump and use an infrared thermometer the water over the cpu will raise temp.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> bad thermal transfer..... if you stop your pump and use an infrared thermometer the water over the cpu will raise temp.


Not really...and not by that much. The heating water is still immersed in a bath of cooler water, the heat will diffuse out to equalize it, but that wouldnt be enough. But we're getting off topic. The fact is that if youre ov the cpu, you need better cooling than an H70. Delidding might help a little but its not going to provide the drastic improvements youre looking for. You can lower the voltage and clocks or get a better cooling system. Those are the only options im seeing.

I was looking at it the same way as you, so Ive been there.

But after all it's your setup...and your choice


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Not really...and not by that much. The heating water is still immersed in a bath of cooler water, the heat will diffuse out to equalize it, but that wouldnt be enough. But we're getting off topic. The fact is that if youre ov the cpu, you need better cooling than an H70. Delidding might help a little but its not going to provide the drastic improvements youre looking for. You can lower the voltage and clocks or get a better cooling system. Those are the only options im seeing.
> 
> I was looking at it the same way as you, so Ive been there.
> 
> But after all it's your setup...and your choice


well im gonna delid and get a loop later it seem.

but it do make sense of bad stransfer because the fury x is using equivalent pump rad. but the die is bigggg

thank you for your knowledge


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> well im gonna delid and get a loop later it seem.
> 
> but it do make sense of bad stransfer because the fury x is using equivalent pump rad. but the die is bigggg
> 
> thank you for your knowledge


It most likely is a bad transfer, Im not denying that. However, you cant attribute that as the sole cause, its partial at best. Another thing you have to consider is the fact that you dont know whats necessarily above the copper plate. There might be some impeding substance ( I dont know because ive never taken a corsair block apart) These AIO coolers were never meant to be practical soluions for serious OCing. Thats what custom loops are for. The AIOs are more for small OCs without any major ramping of voltages.

If you do decide to go with a custom loop in the future, youre welcome to check out the watercooling thread. Theres a lot you can learn there.

In terms of the Fury X, i believe it is more purpose built to handle GPU temps, so it would probably fare better, but I dont feel that the Corsair AIO and the Fury X setup are on the same level performance wise


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> It most likely is a bad transfer, Im not denying that. However, you cant attribute that as the sole cause, its partial at best. Another thing you have to consider is the fact that you dont know whats necessarily above the copper plate. There might be some impeding substance ( I dont know because ive never taken a corsair block apart) These AIO coolers were never meant to be practical soluions for serious OCing. Thats what custom loops are for. The AIOs are more for small OCs without any major ramping of voltages.
> 
> If you do decide to go with a custom loop in the future, youre welcome to check out the watercooling thread. Theres a lot you can learn there.
> 
> In terms of the Fury X, i believe it is more purpose built to handle GPU temps, so it would probably fare better, but I dont feel that the Corsair AIO and the Fury X setup are on the same level performance wise


lot of people run h60 on gpu like 7950 7970

but the die is big so it the core and all so it seem they have less problem to transfer heat + they are bare die


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> lot of people run h60 on gpu like 7950 7970
> 
> but the die is big so it the core and all so it seem they have less problem to transfer heat + they are bare die


Thats a good point. Try delidding, it couldnt hurt. Please report temps when you're done benchmarking


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Thats a good point. Try delidding, it couldnt hurt. Please report temps when you're done benchmarking


I will well i need to order it and it seem the cheapest is from ebay thailand crap 23$ cad so im gonna wait a long time before receiving it ahahh

The clu


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> I will well i need to order it and it seem the cheapest is from ebay thailand crap 23$ cad so im gonna wait a long time before receiving it ahahh
> 
> The clu


?? They sell CLU on amazon. Well, sidewinder computers sells via amazon


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> That is unfortunate, lucky it still works. I used alot of masking tape on both sides yet still damaged the ihs. But its very minor and due to using an old vice at work.
> 
> Very happy i did go through with the delid as it has helped me pass x30 h264 runs without my dreaded bsod 101's, before i'd be lucky to make 15-18 runs and crash.
> 
> Only used gelid extreme on both, may just go naked as the price is cheaper for the kit instead of clu.
> 
> Add me boyz!
> 
> OCN name: stoker
> CPU: 4790k
> on die-TIM: gelid gc extreme
> ihs-TIM: gelid gc extreme
> Mhz gained: 100 lol (more to come -maybe)
> OC after delid: 4800
> Temp drops: 8-10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e7rref


You're In! Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> lot of people run h60 on gpu like 7950 7970
> 
> but the die is big so it the core and all so it seem they have less problem to transfer heat + they are bare die


Honestly, I'd be surprised if you didn't get a good 10-15c from dellidding even on a h75. You're still be partly removing the largest point of thermal resistance in the system. And even at 1.3v you're still only looking at a total of around 100-125w of load unless you are running AVX stuff.

In fact, I would be surprised if you got better temperature drops going to custom water than delidding. Even if you went full custom after delidding I'd be very surprised if the temperature difference wasbetter than you got from delidding on the h75.


----------



## Ceadderman

Shoot I got a 15c drop in temps when I lapped my 955BE and put my cooling plate lapped h50 on it. I'd be shocked if people don't get bigger drops going nekkid with a h75 on their CPU.









Still working on this Athlon. It's proving to be more stubborn than I thought it would be.









~Ceadder


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Shoot I got a 15c drop in temps when I lapped my 955BE and put my cooling plate lapped h50 on it. I'd be shocked if people don't get bigger drops going nekkid with a h75 on their CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still working on this Athlon. It's proving to be more stubborn than I thought it would be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Are you still trying to do it with the vice? Or have you moved on to more... Persuasive... Measures?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Honestly, I'd be surprised if you didn't get a good 10-15c from dellidding even on a h75. You're still be partly removing the largest point of thermal resistance in the system. And even at 1.3v you're still only looking at a total of around 100-125w of load unless you are running AVX stuff.
> 
> In fact, I would be surprised if you got better temperature drops going to custom water than delidding. Even if you went full custom after delidding I'd be very surprised if the temperature difference wasbetter than you got from delidding on the h75.


Hmm... well I guess I stand corrected. I delidded this time around while on a custom loop but before that I was doing it on air


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Shoot I got a 15c drop in temps when I lapped my 955BE and put my cooling plate lapped h50 on it. I'd be shocked if people don't get bigger drops going nekkid with a h75 on their CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still working on this Athlon. It's proving to be more stubborn than I thought it would be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Are you still trying to do it with the vice? Or have you moved on to more... Persuasive... Measures?
Click to expand...

Bout to hit it with a MiniNuke.









~Ceadder


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Bout to hit it with a MiniNuke.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Hit it with the D


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Hit it with the D


Let's keep this kid friendly lolol

And look what i found


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Let's keep this kid friendly lolol
> 
> And look what i found


Well, I guess the solder is what was making it so difficult to remove!


----------



## Ceadderman

Guess that answers that. I'ma stop before I kill it.









~Ceadder


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Guess that answers that. I'ma stop before I kill it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


If the IHS was moving side to side, I hate to say it, but I suspect it may be too late for that.


----------



## Ceadderman

Never moved and no pins were harmed in the attempt at this process. Don't mean it's not booked but I did it carefully and it fits the socket with no wiggle to it.









~Ceadder


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Never moved and no pins were harmed in the attempt at this process. Don't mean it's not booked but I did it carefully and it fits the socket with no wiggle to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Could well be OK then. I guess you'll find out eventually.


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Hit it with the D
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let's keep this kid friendly lolol
> 
> And look what i found
Click to expand...

Nice removal of the die lol. Just that some part of it is damaged.


----------



## Brohem0th

>Make a post about 10 pages back about killing my 4790k with the vice method
>Get ridiculed
>Apply for Intel Tuning Protection Plan and order a G3258 as a cheap stopgap until the month waiting period for the ITPP is up
>Windows load won't boot
>Try everything known to man to fix the issue without reinstalling, booted SSD on another (much older Core 2 Quad) machine and deleted all drivers, ran sysprep, used Paragon Disk Manager to P2P adjust Win 7 load, cleared CMOS with jumpers, reloaded latest BIOS revision for my motherboard, literally spent two whole days in an attempt to not have to reinstall
>Eventually give up and reinstall Win 7
>Run Windows Update, get all 224 available updates
>Computer won't start again









So on top of killing an absolutely amazing 4790k with the vice method because the knurling on the vice damaged the PCB even through several layers of electrical tape, and having to wait a full month to get a replacement, I got to completely reinstall windows because Intel sent a microcode update to microsoft that renders the G3258 inoperable. I'd had that windows load for two full years, it was beautiful, had it setup exactly like I wanted it.

Literally the only way you can get a rig with a G3258 to boot after installing that update is to disable one of the cores completely. On a dual core CPU with no hyperthreading. The update in question is KB3064209, and it will break your Windows load and throw your machine into an infinite boot loop whether you're on 7, 8/8.1, or Windows 10. Matter of fact you can't even install Windows 10 on a machine with a G3258 after version 10130 because the microcode update is included in all releases after that.

I am unbelievably pissed off and sad because I had to reinstall Windows and completely reconfigure it from the top down after chasing rabbits for a solid week to figure out why it couldn't even boot. I've reinstalled Windows 7 at least six times in the last two days before I finally narrowed the problem down to windows update, and some research on the internet finally revealed the exact culprit.

All this after killing a 4790k that could do 4.8Ghz at 1.255v Handbrake stable for two hours, and 3DMark11 stable for ten runs including the demo at the beginning. Oh, and I lost my job because my old boss was a jackanape and mismanaged company funds.

To add further insult to injury, the vice method didn't even work for me (the amount of force I was applying was, in my mind, completely insane and dangerous and wasn't budging the IHS at all) and I delidded the chip with a razor blade in about a full minute with no scratches or nicks to the PCB at all.

Live and learn I guess. Hopefully I don't end up having to sell my rig to pay rent, which, by the way former employer, thanks for firing me after I had just purchased a 290$ CPU and without even a days notice. Me and the other two employees you laid off are just super thrilled and definitely won't be filing for unemployment because of your absolute and devastating idiocy.

Delidded my G3258 with a razor in less than a minute, had CLP applied and clear nail polish drying in 20 minutes, and had it in the socket and booting half an hour later, so that's nice, I guess. Haven't even had time to overclock it yet I've been so busy looking for a new job.

If even one person manages to read this post and it saves them from several hours of work reinstalling windows and redownloading updates, then I'll be a happy man.

Also, on a closing note, Intel has really improved the way they attach the IHS to the PCB. Especially on the newer Devils Canyon batches, those things are stuck on there tight as all get out. If my 4790k had been an earlier batch, maybe it wouldn't have gotten chipped from the force of the vice. But then again, maybe it would have been a dud overclocker that took 1.4v to even do 4.8Ghz. I digress.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Wow dude I'm sorry to hear that. That's some terrible luck.









We're in the same boat because my company decided to lay off 50 contractors about a month ago. I'm still looking for a job...

Why would you not get unemployment?


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Wow dude I'm sorry to hear that. That's some terrible luck.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We're in the same boat because my company decided to lay off 50 contractors about a month ago. I'm still looking for a job...
> 
> Why would you not get unemployment?


Oh, I will and I am going to get unemployment. I was being facetious when I said me and my other coworkers wouldn't apply for it. I'm just really bummed about losing my job, I worked at a small local PC repair shop which I absolutely loved doing, but my boss had ridiculously low prices for all of our services (not counting all the free work we did for elderly customers and other people in dire financial straights) and it eventually caught up to him. He charged literally less than half what the previous shop I worked at charged. You just can't do that and expect to stay financially sound as a business. That, and he decided to get a company car we could use for on site calls and the contract work we had with a nearby hospital and several local businesses. He just couldn't afford to keep all of us around anymore.

Right now it's just him and his office manager/secretary. I went in to get my last check today and he was working like a madman, servicing 40 computers all at once while he was on his way out the door to take care of an onsite call.

Really doesn't help that I relocated to a new town for this job because he told me he needed someone full time in a permanent position. Too much stress for just one week man! Oh well. I'll find a way. Best of luck to you in your job search as well, I hope you find something awesome.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Yea I know how you feel though. You could always try learning web dev while you look for a new job. If you're halfway decent you can get into freelance work. Try getting some certs too. Are you A+ certified?


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I'd probably take that out if I were you before a mod sees that.
> 
> Yea I know how you feel though. You could always try learning web dev while you look for a new job. If you're halfway decent you can get into freelance work. Try getting some certs too. Are you A+ certified?


No certs at all, just skills that are no longer paying the bills. Honestly I'm probably gonna end up working for the post office, they're on a huge hiring run in my area.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In! Slappa Dat Sig On!


Thank you! but u made a little typo with my name, i have been called worse though








Going to pull the trigger too and get the naked kit


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> No certs at all, just skills that are no longer paying the bills. Honestly I'm probably gonna end up working for the post office, they're on a huge hiring run in my area.


I advise you get the A+ once you get the job, or you can go one step up and get the Net+, especially if you have experience.as a repair tech. You could use this experience and the Net+ to get a help desk job


----------



## B NEGATIVE

Delid and lapjob....





4770k.


----------



## bonami2

Nail varnish vs liquid tape?

I have the liquid tape but i think the varnish may be more heat conductive.. Dont want those little part to overheat


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Nail varnish vs liquid tape?
> 
> I have the liquid tape but i think the varnish may be more heat conductive.. Dont want those little part to overheat


Personally, I didn't use anything on mine. I just made sure to not go crazy with the CLP. My CPU was fine for the first year or so, then still fine after I re-applied CLP about a month ago. I got curious about whether it needed to be changed, turns out it was still fine (still completely liquid also). "Less is more" is very true for CLP/CLU, same with "a little bit goes a long way".


----------



## cephelix

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> Delid and lapjob....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4770k.






How much of a temp drop did you get with the lapping and delid vs just delidding?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Nail varnish vs liquid tape?
> 
> I have the liquid tape but i think the varnish may be more heat conductive.. Dont want those little part to overheat


Used nail polish here since I don't trust myself to not screw up the CLU application. Better be safe than sorry. Plus I had nail polish at work already


----------



## Wirerat

I used blue anti static tape over my 4790k caps.

I was not skillful enough to get it very straight. I was happy it finally covered them all after the 3rd attempt.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 
> How much of a temp drop did you get with the lapping and delid vs just delidding?
> Used nail polish here since I don't trust myself to not screw up the CLU application. Better be safe than sorry. Plus I had nail polish at work already


Ok cool i may use that too









Im gonna use the Vice only method i do pray not to kill my cpu

That damn piece of crap is 420 cad currently If it die im selling everything and getting a 6-8core


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I used blue anti static tape over my 4790k caps.
> 
> I was not skillful enough to get it very straight. I was happy it finally covered them all after the 3rd attempt.


Now this is a method I might actually do myself. I like how it's not necessarily "sealing up" those components, but effectively just covering them.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Thank you! but u made a little typo with my name, i have been called worse though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Going to pull the trigger too and get the naked kit


Fixed!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> Delid and lapjob....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4770k.


Wow even Neg has joined in on the fun


----------



## B NEGATIVE

That 4770k really needed it...


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> Delid and lapjob....
> 
> 
> 
> 4770k.


So shiny








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Fixed!


Thanks


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> That 4770k really needed it...


what were your temp drops?


----------



## EvilWiffles

Hmm. Delidded my i7-4790k clocked at 4.7GHz 1.23v with AS5 on both die and block. No difference in temps with H100i.
Sad day, granted it's only 71c on max load.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Hmm. Delidded my i7-4790k clocked at 4.7GHz 1.23v with AS5 on both die and block. No difference in temps with H100i.
> Sad day, granted it's only 71c on max load.


There's no point in delidding if you're going to use AS5 on the die, that's just switching one TIM for another. You get the best results when you use CLP or CLU.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Hmm. Delidded my i7-4790k clocked at 4.7GHz 1.23v with AS5 on both die and block. No difference in temps with H100i.
> Sad day, granted it's only 71c on max load.


Most guys here will recommend using CLU between the die and ihs otherwise as you have found the difference is minimal.
I myself used gelid gc extreme on both and got a 2C drop at my 1.28v 4700 setting and 8C on 1.33 4800 setting.
Try using a smaller amount of AS5 and remember it can take 200hrs before u notice a temp drop


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Most guys here will recommend using CLU between the die and ihs otherwise as you have found the difference is minimal.
> I myself used gelid gc extreme on both and got a 2C drop at my 1.28v 4700 setting and 8C on 1.33 4800 setting.
> Try using a smaller amount of AS5 and remember it can take 200hrs before u notice a temp drop


2C with GC Extreme on-die vs. 10C+ with CLU/CLP. 'Nuff said....


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> 2C with GC Extreme on-die vs. 10C+ with CLU/CLP. 'Nuff said....


Don't worry already a believer... Going to try the naked route first then when time change to CLU


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> 2C with GC Extreme on-die vs. 10C+ with CLU/CLP. 'Nuff said....


+1

paste= 10w thing

ClU is 38w

clp is 32 i think

The measeurement for heat transfer stuff


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Hmm. Delidded my i7-4790k clocked at 4.7GHz 1.23v with AS5 on both die and block. No difference in temps with H100i.
> Sad day, granted it's only 71c on max load.
> 
> 
> 
> There's no point in delidding if you're going to use AS5 on the die, that's just switching one TIM for another. You get the best results when you use CLP or CLU.
Click to expand...

+1. & +Rep.









If you're going to use a standard heatsink TIM, go with MX4 or G751. At least the burn in time is substantially less than AS5. ~8hrs v. 8days.









~Ceadder


----------



## EvilWiffles

Gonna have to make the switch to CLU then. Do I really need to lap though?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Gonna have to make the switch to CLU then. Do I really need to lap though?


lapping is optional, the biggest change in temps would be seen from delidding and application of CLU on the die


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Gonna have to make the switch to CLU then. Do I really need to lap though?


Why not if you already have the IHS free from the chip? DO EEEEEET!









~Ceadder


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Why not if you already have the IHS free from the chip? DO EEEEEET!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


lol. Well, if he has the time and willing to put in the effort to squeeze every last bit of performance, then yeah.


----------



## bonami2

+ do it........ Im too chicken to delid currently


----------



## stoker

EK naked kit arrived, still using Gelid so don't crucify me but gained another 6C.
Did 3 mounts to ensure i wasn't using too much or too little and happy with the results.


----------



## cephelix

6C is quite a hefty amount. And here i thought it'd be more along the lines of 2-3C


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 6C is quite a hefty amount. And here i thought it'd be more along the lines of 2-3C


It probably would be if he were using CLU or CLP between the die and IHS and the die and WB.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> 6C is quite a hefty amount. And here i thought it'd be more along the lines of 2-3C


Its 4-6C
Here a before and after. The top pic was run when i got home from work 2 days ago.

Here is today, been home all day so had to wait 2 hours with the system off to get closer ambient and water colder for the run

I'm sure CLU will give me slightly more


----------



## cephelix

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Its 4-6C
> Here a before and after. The top pic was run when i got home from work 2 days ago.
> 
> Here is today, been home all day so had to wait 2 hours with the system off to get closer ambient and water colder for the run
> 
> I'm sure CLU will give me slightly more





with CLU you'll go into sub zero temps!








great temps btw. I'm getting 10C more than you on air miminum....


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Dude why do I get freaked out every time I see your profile pic??

Yea I've been running naked almost 6 or so months now. Can't go back since my temps are never higher than 60-70


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> with CLU you'll go into sub zero temps!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> great temps btw. I'm getting 10C more than you on air miminum....


LOL heres hoping. BTW I'm jealous an extra 10C better on air


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> LOL heres hoping. BTW I'm jealous an extra 10C better on air


lol..i'm jealous you're on water man.....and my chip can't go past 4.7...what a drag


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> lol..i'm jealous you're on water man.....and my chip can't go past 4.7...what a drag


Water is only a upgrade away. you know u want to







and don't worry i have to push mine to get 4.8, was hoping for more but not likely


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Water is only a upgrade away. you know u want to
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and don't worry i have to push mine to get 4.8, was hoping for more but not likely


I did go water but went back to air since i was unhappy with the aesthetics of it and i'd probably have to sell my right lung to make it acceptable.now i'm only temp limited on my r9 290 but my cpu isn't. So there's less reason for me to switch.maybe if i get a ref gtx1080ti or r9 fury triple x or something i may feel the itch again


----------



## JackCY

If they shipped those CPUs and GPUs with waterblocks, it would be much more affordable. This way, everyone throws away that stupid Intel box cooler and wastes tons by having to buy the massive stock GPU aircooler on most cards. Or just sell not only CPUs without a heatsink, which are hard to get and sometimes cost more than those with a heatsink, weird I know, but also GPUs without a heatsink. Kind of cool it yourself, don't RMA it if you burn it!


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Dude why do I get freaked out every time I see your profile pic??
> 
> Yea I've been running naked almost 6 or so months now. Can't go back since my temps are never higher than 60-70


me? wont you get tweaked nuts or something running naked?


----------



## EvilWiffles

Do I need to lap my IHS for CLU or anything?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Do I need to lap my IHS for CLU or anything?


No


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Do I need to lap my IHS for CLU or anything?


Copper will be permanently changed by contact with the gallium in CLU. I know first hard because I use a copper block without a IHS. With that said, there is not any negative thermal performance that comes along with the staining after ~2 years running it like that...just an ugly block. Don't lap unless you have a really warped IHS. You can check it with a razorblade and a flashlight: Put the razor blade 90 degrees to the IHS, then shine the light. If you see light from the razor coming through, your IHS is not flat. Only lap a severe gap out, as pressure from a solid mount will even out minor concave irregularities.


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Do I need to lap my IHS for CLU or anything?
> 
> 
> 
> Copper will be permanently changed by contact with the gallium in CLU. I know first hard because I use a copper block without a IHS. With that said, there is not any negative thermal performance that comes along with the staining after ~2 years running it like that...just an ugly block. Don't lap unless you have a really warped IHS. You can check it with a razorblade and a flashlight: Put the razor blade 90 degrees to the IHS, then shine the light. If you see light from the razor coming through, your IHS is not flat. Only lap a severe gap out, as pressure from a solid mount will even out minor concave irregularities.
Click to expand...

Coul you draw a picture about using the razor blade? Did you mean lay the razor flat or something?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> Coul you draw a picture about using the razor blade? Did you mean lay the razor flat or something?


No, upright. He just suggested a razor as that's what people might have. He really meant anything that you know has a completely straight edge and is machined well.

Tried looking for an example with google's image search:



This is a picture of someone seeing how flat the base of some air cooler is.


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> Coul you draw a picture about using the razor blade? Did you mean lay the razor flat or something?
> 
> 
> 
> No, upright. He just suggested a razor as that's what people might have. He really meant anything that you know has a completely straight edge and is machined well.
> 
> Tried looking for an example with google's image search:
> 
> 
> 
> This is a picture of someone seeing how flat the base of some air cooler is.
Click to expand...

I see


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> Coul you draw a picture about using the razor blade? Did you mean lay the razor flat or something?
> 
> 
> 
> No, upright. He just suggested a razor as that's what people might have. He really meant anything that you know has a completely straight edge and is machined well.
> 
> Tried looking for an example with google's image search:
> 
> 
> 
> This is a picture of someone seeing how flat the base of some air cooler is.
Click to expand...

^ this. Exactly what I was referring to. I would lap that one in the picture.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> ^ this. Exactly what I was referring to. I would lap that one in the picture.


But perhaps also check what's going on with the cooler's base before deciding. It might be not completely flat, and instead convex, and might then fit perfectly with a concave IHS. I was only ever interested in air coolers, and for those I know for example the Thermalright and the Prolimatech air coolers are all intentionally convex shaped on their base to get better results on Intel's typical CPU. There might be some more manufacturers out there that do that.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> But perhaps also check what's going on with the cooler's base before deciding. It might be not completely flat, and instead convex, and might then fit perfectly with a concave IHS. I was only ever interested in air coolers, and for those I know for example the Thermalright and the Prolimatech air coolers are all intentionally convex shaped on their base to get better results on Intel's typical CPU. There might be some more manufacturers out there that do that.


From what i've read in the past, if you were to lap the ihs, you'd also lap the cooler base to make sure both are completely flat. Lapping only one surface might result in worse temps due to improper mating of the surfaces


----------



## DirektEffekt

If anything, I would say you would want the IHS to be slightly convex since the edges are pushed down with considerable force by the CPU bracket it will probably cause the edges to become slightly compressed.


----------



## bonami2

Hey guy im going paranoid about my temp so what you think it the SAFEST delid method considering a 4790k would cost me 500$ cad

Well im lucky with warantly so getting the Tuning plan and regluing it would probably work...










I have a vice with teeth but i have duct tape so im good and it a big old school vice so i have as much stability as i want


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Hey guy im going paranoid about my temp so what you think it the SAFEST delid method considering a 4790k would cost me 500$ cad
> 
> Well im lucky with warantly so getting the Tuning plan and regluing it would probably work...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a vice with teeth but i have duct tape so im good and it a big old school vice so i have as much stability as i want


Either the vice-only method, or the vice/wood/hammer method - basically the ones involving a vice are your best bets.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Either the vice-only method, or the vice/wood/hammer method - basically the ones involving a vice are your best bets.


Thank you









Well first im gonna order that clu


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Thank you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well first im gonna order that clu


Just keep in mind that the Intel Tuning Protection Plan does not cover delidding.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Just keep in mind that the Intel Tuning Protection Plan does not cover delidding.


well in my case knowing how many special rma i did... Their is a high chance that just gluing it back on would work. They are going to test the chip = wont boot = overvolted = rma good

Anyways their employee dont even know what deliding is when i asked them... I needed to explain them....


----------



## DirektEffekt

You should edit your comment. For obvious reasons we can't discuss RMA fraud here. Since Intel's warranty excludes any physical damage, trying to RMA a delidded chip consists RMA fraud.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> You should edit your comment. For obvious reasons we can't discuss RMA fraud here. Since Intel's warranty excludes any physical damage, trying to RMA a delidded chip consists RMA fraud.


well i did not think it was fraud sorry. I can put 300v in it and rma it without problem i dont see why i could not remove the lid. Ln2 overclocker push their chip to extreme and those chip are stilll covered i think.

I even seen intel themself rma a guy delid chip on ocn the other days if i remember well. They just said they needed the ihs. to match the pcb and ihs


----------



## bonami2

Here it is i think

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/21300_100


----------



## cephelix

well, quite a few of us really do like the vice only method for delidding. @Pinnacle Fit has even gone so far as to make vids of the process which I think you should look at before you start. He'll chime in soon enough








Besides CLU I also ordered the 3 step cleaning kit from Cool Laboratory. Surprised at the amount of residue that still came off even after cleaning with IPA.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> well, quite a few of us really do like the vice only method for delidding. @Pinnacle Fit has even gone so far as to make vids of the process which I think you should look at before you start. He'll chime in soon enough
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Besides CLU I also ordered the 3 step cleaning kit from Cool Laboratory. Surprised at the amount of residue that still came off even after cleaning with IPA.


Thanks for the intro @cephelix lol.

Yea look through earlier posts if you want to see it. It is vastly superior to all the other methods, because it is the quickest, safest, and least time consuming method. It also offers the greatest amount of control of all [three] known methods.

The video should be self explanatory but if anybody wants I can do a detailed writeup.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Thanks for the intro @cephelix lol.
> 
> Yea look through earlier posts if you want to see it. It is vastly superior to all the other methods, because it is the quickest, safest, and least time consuming method. It also offers the greatest amount of control of all [three] known methods.
> 
> The video should be self explanatory but if anybody wants I can do a detailed writeup.


I'm going to be a pain and say DETAILED WRITEUP!








Before your vids though, I had a hard time finding anything on the vice only method. Had to watch a bunch of not as detailed vids online and prayed to god I didn't screw it up. Lucky for me my $16 vice did the job perfectly.


----------



## deepor

I still feel uncomfortable about the vise-only method. I worry about things happening at an angle, about something getting ripped apart because of forces not getting distributed over flat, larger surfaces. If someone has all parts required for a solid try with the hammer+vise method, meaning a well machined vise and piece of some sort of hard wood with one side being perfectly cut, then I'd definitely use that method over the vise-only method.

The vise-only method actually seems suspicious enough to me that I'd personally try the razor method over it, though I'd have to go on a very long search for a blade tool that makes me feel confident enough about trying that kind of operation.


----------



## bonami2

Well a guy just killed his chip with the vice only method

So i think im gonna use the hammer one









Where is that video?


----------



## cephelix

@deepor @bonami2 well, as with every method, there is a risk of failure. No doubt about it. But seeing as how much of a klutz I am to begin with, having successfully pulled off a delid with the vice only method, I'm quite sure most everyone else could pull it off without a hitch. Of course, the bottom line is to go with a method that you are most comfortable with.
I was thinking of doing the razor method initially, but with the reasons mentioned above, i'd likely cut myself and the chip during the process


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> @deepor @bonami2 well, as with every method, there is a risk of failure. No doubt about it. But seeing as how much of a klutz I am to begin with, having successfully pulled off a delid with the vice only method, I'm quite sure most everyone else could pull it off without a hitch. Of course, the bottom line is to go with a method that you are most comfortable with.
> I was thinking of doing the razor method initially, but with the reasons mentioned above, i'd likely cut myself and the chip during the process


Different strokes. Each has a risk but the other two methods have a statistically greater risk as there are more points of failure. For instance with the razor blade you could easily cut one of the thousand or so paths, a $330 mistake. With the hammer method your pcb could go flying across the room and land face down on the floor. With the vise only ethos there is a much lower backlash in the event anything were to go wrong because it's under a very high degree of control. You just keep cranking until you feel slack. Not to mention with the hammer method it all depends on the block used. I used a black that did nothing. Upon using a different more solid block it came off but I was relatively scared the entire time. I even did it on the carpet just in case, which is a huge no no with electronics.

You can take all the precautions you want but all else being equal the vise only method offers the least risk.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> I'm going to be a pain and say DETAILED WRITEUP!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before your vids though, I had a hard time finding anything on the vice only method. Had to watch a bunch of not as detailed vids online and prayed to god I didn't screw it up. Lucky for me my $16 vice did the job perfectly.


Yea I should but I'm pretty busy atm so it might be awhile. Had to put the videos on the back burner as it is.


----------



## EvilWiffles

Ordered CLU for my i7 4790k. Question, what do I use to cover the SMD capacitors so CLU doesn't contact them?


----------



## bonami2

Oh well thank you wish me goodluck ahah


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Ordered CLU for my i7 4790k. Question, what do I use to cover the SMD capacitors so CLU doesn't contact them?


A thin coat of clear nail polish or Liquid Electrical Tape would be fine


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> A thin coat of clear nail polish or Liquid Electrical Tape would be fine


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Oh well thank you wish me goodluck ahah


Personally I don't use anything but yea the clear nail polish I've heard good things about. To me it's pretty hard to actually get any on there but I run fully deluded on a naked ivy setup so it might be a bit different for me.


----------



## EvilWiffles

I've done the vice method. It was a bit difficult at first because the amount of force needed to break the seal but once I pushed it far enough, it popped off... Sort of. The CPU fell to the ground with the IHS still on but it was half off. Perty good.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> A thin coat of clear nail polish or Liquid Electrical Tape would be fine


Does it have to be clear nail polish? Can it be hot pink nail polish?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Love this thread. I started one for AMD here.

Huge fan of de-lidding, I've de-lidded Intel i5 3570K and i7 3770K Works wonders for temps


----------



## dennis97519

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Thank you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well first im gonna order that clu
> 
> 
> 
> Just keep in mind that the Intel Tuning Protection Plan does not cover delidding.
Click to expand...

It does cover.I told the support that I removed the IHS from the PCB. They said they will accept it as long as it is a cpu that can be identified as the one you registered. Did the rule change or something?


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dennis97519*
> 
> It does cover.I told the support that I removed the IHS from the PSB. They said they will accept it as long as it is a cpu that can be identified as the one you registered. Did the rule change or something?


Thank you


----------



## DirektEffekt

It has been discussed many times on here and established that, yes, people have been able to return delidded processors, but the tuning plan only covers processors which fail due to running outside their specifications (I.e. overclocking). Any other failures, such as those due to damage to the CPU, are supposed to be assessed against the standard warranty, which expressly excludes physical damage.

Intel CAN deny a return due to delidding. Often they allow it. It could be that their CS staff don't really understand the technical details or it could be that they let it slide. Just be aware that dellidding is not actually covered by the tuning plan and there is always a possibility that they can deny the return and it IS RMA fraud to glue the IHS on and then fail to disclose that the delidding was the cause of the failure.

It has always been this way and, unfortunately, the word of CS reps is not necessarily law and if, under examination of the returned processor, it is deemed ineligible for return Intel has the right to refuse your RMA even if it was stated that by CS reps that it would be replaced as the damage incurred does not fall under any of their warranties.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It has been discussed many times on here and established that, yes, people have been able to return delidded processors, but the tuning plan only covers processors which fail due to running outside their specifications (I.e. overclocking). Any other failures, such as those due to damage to the CPU, are supposed to be assessed against the standard warranty, which expressly excludes physical damage.
> 
> Intel CAN deny a return due to delidding. Often they allow it. It could be that their CS staff don't really understand the technical details or it could be that they let it slide. Just be aware that dellidding is not actually covered by the tuning plan and there is always a possibility that they can deny the return and it IS RMA fraud to glue the IHS on and then fail to disclose that the delidding was the cause of the failure.
> 
> It has always been this way and, unfortunately, the word of CS reps is not necessarily law and if, under examination of the returned processor, it is deemed ineligible for return Intel has the right to refuse your RMA even if it was stated that by CS reps that it would be replaced as the damage incurred does not fall under any of their warranties.


This is true but let's face it. If you follow the instructions carefully it's pretty hard to screw up a delid. I'm sure that can be said of anything else though. On the other hand if you're watercooling and happen to get a drop onto your power connector that's another story entirely. That's just horrible luck.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> This is true but let's face it. If you follow the instructions carefully it's pretty hard to screw up a delid. I'm sure that can be said of anything else though. On the other hand if you're watercooling and happen to get a drop onto your power connector that's another story entirely. That's just horrible luck.


I agree, I was mostly posting because people were talking like Intel guaranteed them a replacement if they messed up a delid, which is a bit of dangerous misinformation, since it's a lot easier to be careless when you feel like the risk of doing it has been effectively mitigated.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It has been discussed many times on here and established that, yes, people have been able to return delidded processors, but the tuning plan only covers processors which fail due to running outside their specifications (I.e. overclocking). Any other failures, such as those due to damage to the CPU, are supposed to be assessed against the standard warranty, which expressly excludes physical damage.
> 
> Intel CAN deny a return due to delidding. Often they allow it. It could be that their CS staff don't really understand the technical details or it could be that they let it slide. Just be aware that dellidding is not actually covered by the tuning plan and there is always a possibility that they can deny the return and it IS RMA fraud to glue the IHS on and then fail to disclose that the delidding was the cause of the failure.
> 
> It has always been this way and, unfortunately, the word of CS reps is not necessarily law and if, under examination of the returned processor, it is deemed ineligible for return Intel has the right to refuse your RMA even if it was stated that by CS reps that it would be replaced as the damage incurred does not fall under any of their warranties.


It fraud to rma your gpu when you dissasembled the heatsink.... Just saying Even dissasembling your phone and or your laptop

But at the end i rmaed repasted gpu

I was almost able to rma a phone that i opened to reach the battery a sealed unit ( the battery was bulged and broke the motherboard ) ( the phone was no more produced and worth nothing so.... And out of warantly

Some people have massive failure with water and they still accept rma.

The problem with rma is 95% of people with pc hardware dont even know how to rma and or have the receipt. So they end with broken hardware and update and throw the stuff out


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> It fraud to rma your gpu when you dissasembled the heatsink.... Just saying Even dissasembling your phone and or your laptop
> 
> But at the end i rmaed repasted gpu
> 
> I was almost able to rma a phone that i opened to reach the battery a sealed unit ( the battery was bulged and broke the motherboard ) ( the phone was no more produced and worth nothing so.... And out of warantly
> 
> Some people have massive failure with water and they still accept rma.
> 
> The problem with rma is 95% of people with pc hardware dont even know how to rma and or have the receipt. So they end with broken hardware and update and throw the stuff out


It depends on the terms of the RMA. Removing something such as an IHS which is not designed to be removed ever is definitely in violation of the terms of the warranty. For most GPU manufacturers they will allow removal of the heatsink within their warranty. As for the phone which you opened, yes, that would have almost certainly been RMA fraud had you returned it.

I think most people do know how to return products, but most people WON'T return products when they damage it because they know that it is not covered by warranty and to return something that they have damaged themselves is somewhat unethical. Most people are willing to accept the consequences of what they break.

The whole point of my post was that because you can does not mean it is actually covered by RMA and that there is every chance that when they get the product they could reject the return when they decide it's been tampered with.

EDIT: For clarification, RMA fraud refers to returning an item to the manufacturer where the product has been returned to the manufacturer due to a failure where the terms of the warranty have been violated and this fact has not been fully disclosed. If you explain to the manufacturer what happened exactly then it is not fraud, but at the same time they are within their rights to deny your return.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It depends on the terms of the RMA. Removing something such as an IHS which is not designed to be removed ever is definitely in violation of the terms of the warranty. For most GPU manufacturers they will allow removal of the heatsink within their warranty. As for the phone which you opened, yes, that would have almost certainly been RMA fraud had you returned it.
> 
> I think most people do know how to return products, but most people WON'T return products when they damage it because they know that it is not covered by warranty and to return something that they have damaged themselves is somewhat unethical. Most people are willing to accept the consequences of what they break.
> 
> The whole point of my post was that because you can does not mean it is actually covered by RMA and that there is every chance that when they get the product they could reject the return when they decide it's been tampered with.
> 
> EDIT: For clarification, RMA fraud refers to returning an item to the manufacturer where the product has been returned to the manufacturer due to a failure where the terms of the warranty have been violated and this fact has not been fully disclosed. If you explain to the manufacturer what happened exactly then it is not fraud, but at the same time they are within their rights to deny your return.


The phone was accepted if it was not of the fact that is was worth 60$ And the nexus was accepted too

Msi notebook have sticker ( Warantly void if removed ) ask msi, if you know what your doing and cause no damage we will rma.

I even killed my mobo and they said if their is no visual damage it will be accepted.

( My thermaltake gpu screw where strip and the gpu shorted when i pluggued the screen uh ( why im now with a 750D at least i can dissasemble the gpu each month to clean it without problem) Well i dont need to because of the good filter

0.1mm Screw hole in thermaltake was worse than my 20$ brand new case i bough some year ago

Intel just need to stop screwing us with those paste and solder them.









But yea it all about luck they can deny it but i dont think they would because it a overclocking warantly out of spec and blabla would just be stupids. I put 3000v in it and it smoked and exploded in half...

The only rma not accepted with saying everything i had was water on a phone but even then their water tag are not able to prove legally that it has water. So at the end i could but i wont do an rma for water damage the phone is defective since days one so i will rma it one days and they are gonna do it since im gonna show them the lawsuit against apple................

Bit it aint damaged by water.... It still working fine 3 month after just the same bug since days 1 random reboot


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Personally I don't use anything but yea the clear nail polish I've heard good things about. To me it's pretty hard to actually get any on there but I run fully deluded on a naked ivy setup so it might be a bit different for me.


So if your careful enough you don't need to, nice. I ordered my CLU a couple of days ago, but was going to put off doing it until a had enough time to do apply the nail polish.
REP









Whats the best amount to apply before spreading?


----------



## bonami2

I seen a test that showed that Liquid metal as no real problem putting too much because it just slide out

So you can put a lot and it just going to move out and be perfect ( temp wise )

But it conductive so we need to take care

I think im going to use liquid tape or maybe the varnish. I have both. To be safe

I too ordered my clu and waiting it to ship from amazon


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> So if your careful enough you don't need to, nice. I ordered my CLU a couple of days ago, but was going to put off doing it until a had enough time to do apply the nail polish.
> REP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whats the best amount to apply before spreading?


I won't claim to know about nail polish but my guess would be just enough to make sure it's covered. That's definitely the case with clu. You don't want to leave a glob in the middle like you would with nonconductive paste.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I won't claim to know about nail polish but my guess would be just enough to make sure it's covered. That's definitely the case with clu. You don't want to leave a glob in the middle like you would with nonconductive paste.


Cool, yes i was asking about the CLU application.
Thank you.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Cool, yes i was asking about the CLU application.
> Thank you.


As many people here have stated in the past, less really is more when referring to CLU or CLP, or really any conductive TIM. You want to put just enough that you can spread it across the entire die but not so much that you have excess.

The method i like to use to apply it is to hold it carefully in one hand, as if it's an artists palette and use the brush to scoop a little at a time, rather than dumping a glob onto the die.

You can check this video out, and notice how the CLU is applied little at a time to cover the entire die



Of course this is with a GPU die (which is relatively controversial for some people, although i really can't understand why...) but the same concept applies to the CPU die.

This is around how much you should be putting on: 

This looks like a bit much, but trust me it's the camera flash...actually i take that back, i remember having to wipe a little excess off the edge. CLU cleans extremely easy with alcohol and a cotton patch. If you own guns you should have plenty. Otherwise q tips work well too. You know you have clu somewhere if you get a gray residue when you clean up.


And if you're feeling risqué then the GPU die should look like this. Im being facetious...there's really nothing wrong with putting CLU on the GPU die...Ive done it for nearly a year and theres nothing wrong with mine. Frankly i think its a little cleaner than the nasty gray goop. Plus i guess you can do the clear nail polish thing on the gnu as well.



One thing i do want to add is that with the GPU, personally, i try to collect any excess towards the center using a sweeping motion, so that if it does compress it doesn't leak out beyond the die.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> As many people here have stated in the past, less really is more when referring to CLU or CLP, or really any conductive TIM. You want to put just enough that you can spread it across the entire die but not so much that you have excess.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> The method i like to use to apply it is to hold it carefully in one hand, as if it's an artists palette and use the brush to scoop a little at a time, rather than dumping a glob onto the die.
> 
> You can check this video out, and notice how the CLU is applied little at a time to cover the entire die
> 
> 
> 
> Of course this is with a GPU die (which is relatively controversial for some people, although i really can't understand why...) but the same concept applies to the CPU die.
> 
> This is around how much you should be putting on:
> 
> This looks like a bit much, but trust me it's the camera flash...actually i take that back, i remember having to wipe a little excess off the edge. CLU cleans extremely easy with alcohol and a cotton patch. If you own guns you should have plenty. Otherwise q tips work well too. You know you have clu somewhere if you get a gray residue when you clean up.
> 
> 
> And if you're feeling risqué then the GPU die should look like this. Im being facetious...there's really nothing wrong with putting CLU on the GPU die...Ive done it for nearly a year and theres nothing wrong with mine. Frankly i think its a little cleaner than the nasty gray goop. Plus i guess you can do the clear nail polish thing on the gnu as well.
> 
> 
> 
> One thing i do want to add is that with the GPU, personally, i try to collect any excess towards the center using a sweeping motion, so that if it does compress it doesn't leak out beyond the die.


Amazing guide







. I had seen your GPU vid before, great work there








I'll take some more pictures once i get it done


----------



## EvilWiffles

Anyone know if it's safe to use CLU on a G1 GTX 970? I don't know if it's aluminum near the copper heat pipes.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Anyone know if it's safe to use CLU on a G1 GTX 970? I don't know if it's aluminum near the copper heat pipes.


I've had CLP on mine for about the last month or so, and it's running just fine.









Like usual, apply the minimum amount (to prevent leakage/bleeding) and you should be good to go.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Anyone know if it's safe to use CLU on a G1 GTX 970? I don't know if it's aluminum near the copper heat pipes.
> [...]


Do not do it. Check out a youtube videos about "gallium aluminium" and see what happens when it gets into contact with aluminium/aluminum. If you never looked at this, I'm sure you probably can't really appreciate that this "don't use CLU for aluminum" thing isn't just a recommendation, but instead something that you really cannot ever do.

Try normal paste first, and see what happens. You can have very good results using normal paste on a graphics card. Simply replacing the original application done by the manufacturer of the GPU can improve things a lot. On the GTX 680 I currently use, temperatures are around 20 °C lower after I did things myself. I used "Thermalright Chill Factor 3" as the paste, which is nothing special and just some random, normal paste.


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Do not do it. Check out a youtube videos about "gallium aluminium" and see what happens when it gets into contact with aluminium/aluminum. If you never looked at this, I'm sure you probably can't really appreciate that this "don't use CLU for aluminum" thing isn't just a recommendation, but instead something that you really cannot ever do.
> 
> Try normal paste first, and see what happens. You can have very good results using normal paste on a graphics card. Simply replacing the original application done by the manufacturer of the GPU can improve things a lot. On the GTX 680 I currently use, temperatures are around 20 °C lower after I did things myself. I used "Thermalright Chill Factor 3" as the paste, which is nothing special and just some random, normal paste.


I was thinking of using nail polish on the outside of the copper pipes so it doesn't touch it at all. I'm still not sure if it's actually aluminum or not though.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> I was thinking of using nail polish on the outside of the copper pipes so it doesn't touch it at all. I'm still not sure if it's actually aluminum or not though.


Great minds think alike!!i think the surrounding area is aluminium.well, it looks like it anyway


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Great minds think alike!!i think the surrounding area is aluminium.well, it looks like it anyway


Yeah, gonna try it when I get my CLU. I'm not sure how the nail polish will handle the temps though.


----------



## bonami2

hey guy any idea if covering the 4790 cap with liquidtape could make them overheat?


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> hey guy any idea if covering the 4790 cap with liquidtape could make them overheat?


They don't produce heat, so I've been told.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Yeah, gonna try it when I get my CLU. I'm not sure how the nail polish will handle the temps though.


That's true actually. I forgot that GPU temps plus proximity to the heat source. A quick google search says that the melting temp of nail polish is 120C. Just have to make sure you apply several thin layers and that the layer properly dries before adding more on. As with the FIVR on the CPU, i find it easier and more aesthetically pleasing to not glob the nail polish on
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> hey guy any idea if covering the 4790 cap with liquidtape could make them overheat?


So far, I haven't read any posts about the caps overheating. I may be mistaken, as usual


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> That's true actually. I forgot that GPU temps plus proximity to the heat source. A quick google search says that the melting temp of nail polish is 120C. Just have to make sure you apply several thin layers and that the layer properly dries before adding more on. As with the FIVR on the CPU, i find it easier and more aesthetically pleasing to not glob the nail polish on
> So far, I haven't read any posts about the caps overheating. I may be mistaken, as usual


Heh, I looked that up too. I just dabbed a bit of nail polish on a piece of metal and took a lighter to it lol.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Heh, I looked that up too. I just dabbed a bit of nail polish on a piece of metal and took a lighter to it lol.


lol...i would think a better representation would be a heatgun or hairdryer, if you have one laying around


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> lol...i would think a better representation would be a heatgun or hairdryer, if you have one laying around


Yeah, well, I don't have any of those on me lol.


----------



## bonami2

Propane torch ftw. Ahah


----------



## JackCY

When nail polish starts dripping out of your CPU socket you know that something is wrong.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Anyone know if it's safe to use CLU on a G1 GTX 970? I don't know if it's aluminum near the copper heat pipes.
> [...]


I just remembered there was someone where the GPU's die ripped when trying to remove the cooler. I think that was using CLP. It hardened over time like it does when it's in contact with copper. This then seems to have glued things together so well that the die was shattered when taking off the cooler after a few years.

I don't know where the pictures are. I think it was posted in this thread, but this was a long time ago, so no idea how to find them.

*EDIT:*

Google found the pictures I was thinking about:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1433302/toms-thermal-paste-comparison-part-1/100#post_20977358

It was a copper water block and CLP.


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I just remembered there was someone where the GPU's die ripped when trying to remove the cooler. I think that was using CLP. It hardened over time like it does when it's in contact with copper. This then seems to have glued things together so well that the die was shattered when taking off the cooler after a few years.
> 
> I don't know where the pictures are. I think it was posted in this thread, but this was a long time ago, so no idea how to find them.
> 
> *EDIT:*
> 
> Google found the pictures I was thinking about:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1433302/toms-thermal-paste-comparison-part-1/100#post_20977358
> 
> It was a copper water block and CLP.


Well, for a few years that isn't bad. I'd prefer to actually try it on my GPU to see if the temps are worth it or not then go back to regular TIM.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> I was thinking of using nail polish on the outside of the copper pipes so it doesn't touch it at all. I'm still not sure if it's actually aluminum or not though.
> 
> 
> 
> Great minds think alike!!i think the surrounding area is aluminium.well, it looks like it anyway
Click to expand...

Guys, hate to be the bearer of bad news but applying anything to the cooling surface will hinder performance. That entire surface is meant to direct heat to the copper cooling pipes. It won't do so with any coating that doesn't transfer heat.

That said I am not sure if you can wipe a thin film of non conducive Thermal paste on the Aluminum surfaces. It may not react well with CLU. So my advice is just don't and chalk that theory up to use only on a cheap shelved system that you just don't care what happens to it as a test run for possible future application.









~Ceadder


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Guys, hate to be the bearer of bad news but applying anything to the cooling surface will hinder performance. That entire surface is meant to direct heat to the copper cooling pipes. It won't do so with any coating that doesn't transfer heat.
> 
> That said I am not sure if you can wipe a thin film of non conducive Thermal paste on the Aluminum surfaces. It may not react well with them CLU. So my advice is just don't and chalk that theory up to useful only on a cheap shelved system that you just don't care what happens to it as a test run for possible future application.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


The nail polish isn't going on the copper where the die makes contact with the heatsink. It's going alongside the copper and aluminum and it won't actually cover the aluminum fully, just enough so no CLU makes contact with the aluminum.

Besides, the copper pipes make perfect contact with the aluminum already.


----------



## iRev_olution

I know I mentioned this before but i would like to delid my 4790k what's the best terminal solution to apply on and where do you buy it? I want to push 5ghz damn it! Lol


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> I know I mentioned this before but i would like to delid my 4790k what's the best terminal solution to apply on and where do you buy it? I want to push 5ghz damn it! Lol


Coolabratory Liquid Ultra

http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Thermal-Interface-Material/dp/B0039RY3MM


----------



## iRev_olution

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Coolabratory Liquid Ultra
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Thermal-Interface-Material/dp/B0039RY3MM


Thanks man! Do you apply this onto the IHS as well? Or do you just go with standard thermal paste?

Also what about the Paste for the IHS to stick it back? Sorry for the questions! Just keen on doing this! Going to be sweet under my custom loop


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Coolabratory Liquid Ultra
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Thermal-Interface-Material/dp/B0039RY3MM
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks man! Do you apply this onto the IHS as well? Or do you just go with standard thermal paste?
> 
> Also what about the Paste for the IHS to stick it back? Sorry for the questions! Just keen on doing this! Going to be sweet under my custom loop
Click to expand...

Paint it on the die with the included brush, then paint it on the IHS where it will make contact with the die. No need to reseal/reglue the IHS back down, the socket clip will hold it plenty tight. Also, if you are doing a CPU that has caps next to the die, take some clear fingernail polish, varnish, or liquid electrical tape, and use it to paint over the little caps to prevent the Coolabratory Liquid Ultra (CLU for short) from making direct contact with the caps. CLU is highly electrically conductive, and can be fatal if it bridges a cap.


----------



## Darkz0r

Hey guys,

I've received my H220X and I'm getting ready to delid my 4770k. It's not a great chip but I don't think it's horrible either, it does 4.4 @ 1.2v with a few other tweaks. Currently its @ 4.2 1.175v without any other changes (sys agent and etc), uncore is also low so its stable.

I'm gonna use vise only method since it's seems the safest. I can just go slow and keep trying slowly until it comes off...so I doubt I'll damage my chip by going slow and with rubber protecting the vise metal parts.

So, is there anything I'm missing?
1-Using vise with a towel to catch the chip;
2-Clean the glue with credit card;
3-Clean the paste with alcohol or w/e, don't have isopropil but will use Q tips with regular alcohol so shouldn't have problems;
4-Liquid electric tape on the contacts near the die;
5-CLU on the die, REALLY SMALL DROP, and spread with the brush;
6-Attach the i7 back on while holding the IHS so when the cage moves it doesn't take the IHS out of place;
7-Regular thermal paste for IHS + H220X contact *(I wanted to use CLU but it removes the intel markings right?)*;
8-Be happy...or not!

I really don't want to go over 1.20v for 24/7 use, so maybe I'll stay in 4.4 or 4.5ghz depending on how much stability I get.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Paint it on the die with the included brush, then paint it on the IHS where it will make contact with the die. No need to reseal/reglue the IHS back down, the socket clip will hold it plenty tight. Also, if you are doing a CPU that has caps next to the die, take some clear fingernail polish, varnish, or liquid electrical tape, and use it to paint over the little caps to prevent the Coolabratory Liquid Ultra (CLU for short) from making direct contact with the caps. CLU is highly electrically conductive, and can be fatal if it bridges a cap.


Do I need to use CLU on the die *AND* on the back of the IHS (which makes die contact)?


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I've received my H220X and I'm getting ready to delid my 4770k. It's not a great chip but I don't think it's horrible either, it does 4.4 @ 1.2v with a few other tweaks. Currently its @ 4.2 1.175v without any other changes (sys agent and etc), uncore is also low so its stable.
> 
> I'm gonna use vise only method since it's seems the safest. I can just go slow and keep trying slowly until it comes off...so I doubt I'll damage my chip by going slow and with rubber protecting the vise metal parts.
> 
> So, is there anything I'm missing?
> 1-Using vise with a towel to catch the chip;
> 2-Clean the glue with credit card;
> 3-Clean the paste with alcohol or w/e, don't have isopropil but will use Q tips with regular alcohol so shouldn't have problems;
> 4-Liquid electric tape on the contacts near the die;
> 5-CLU on the die, REALLY SMALL DROP, and spread with the brush;
> 6-Attach the i7 back on while holding the IHS so when the cage moves it doesn't take the IHS out of place;
> 7-Regular thermal paste for IHS + H220X contact *(I wanted to use CLU but it removes the intel markings right?)*;
> 8-Be happy...or not!
> 
> I really don't want to go over 1.20v for 24/7 use, so maybe I'll stay in 4.4 or 4.5ghz depending on how much stability I get.
> Do I need to use CLU on the die *AND* on the back of the IHS (which makes die contact)?


Exactly









Can go safely up to 1.3v if your not folding 24/7 and even then i think it safe My mobo stay green until 1.3v and turn red there. ( the voltage color )

Report back how it go with the h220x


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Guys, hate to be the bearer of bad news but applying anything to the cooling surface will hinder performance. That entire surface is meant to direct heat to the copper cooling pipes. It won't do so with any coating that doesn't transfer heat.
> 
> That said I am not sure if you can wipe a thin film of non conducive Thermal paste on the Aluminum surfaces. It may not react well with them CLU. So my advice is just don't and chalk that theory up to useful only on a cheap shelved system that you just don't care what happens to it as a test run for possible future application.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The nail polish isn't going on the copper where the die makes contact with the heatsink. It's going alongside the copper and aluminum and it won't actually cover the aluminum fully, just enough so no CLU makes contact with the aluminum.
> 
> Besides, the copper pipes make perfect contact with the aluminum already.
Click to expand...

Am reasonably sure that the copper heatpipes don't fully cover any chip. So I don't see how you can cover the aluminium and not affect their performance of your cooler. My Hyper 212 for dang sure wouldn't be able to.









~Ceadder


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Am reasonably sure that the copper heatpipes don't fully cover any chip. So I don't see how you can cover the aluminium and not affect their performance of your cooler. My Hyper 212 for dang sure wouldn't be able to.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


That just depends on which Hyper 212 you're using. The Evo would be perfectly fine, since it's only copper that contacts the IHS. The "+" model is the one that would have issues, due to the aluminum between the pipes.









The Plus model:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065

The Evo Model:
http://www.coolermaster.com/cooling/cpu-air-cooler/hyper-212-evo/


----------



## Ceadderman

Okay; I have +. Hence my concern.









~Ceadder


----------



## LukeJoseph

So I feel kind of bad. Guy on our local gaming Facebook group decided he wanted to delid his 4690k after he saw me do it (I have done like 6 CPU's prior, all razor blade).

So I gave him a bunch of advice based on my experience. Use a heat gun or at least a hair dryer to heat up the glue a fair amount. Use a thin razor. Start at the corners, slightly bend (not to the point of a crease of course) the razor into a U shape so less of the razor is actually touching the PCB. Use good lighting like a head lamp etc etc.

Well I spoke with him today (gave him a tube of CLU) and he said the delid was a success, no scratches etc....

Get a message from him a couple hours ago saying the CPU is not working. Said there is a TINY nick on the die. And then he sends me pictures.... Didn't use a heat gun/hairdryer. A large nick out of the DIE, and tons of scratches on the PCB. Not quite sure what he was thinking, and really don't understand how he thought it was successful considering how bad the CPU looked. I am curious if he even used a razor and not a freaking Rambo knife lol.

Regardless still feel bad for him, and even a little responsible. As I am sure if he didn't see me do it, he wouldn't have.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> So I feel kind of bad. Guy on our local gaming Facebook group decided he wanted to delid his 4690k after he saw me do it (I have done like 6 CPU's prior, all razor blade).
> 
> So I gave him a bunch of advice based on my experience. Use a heat gun or at least a hair dryer to heat up the glue a fair amount. Use a thin razor. Start at the corners, slightly bend (not to the point of a crease of course) the razor into a U shape so less of the razor is actually touching the PCB. Use good lighting like a head lamp etc etc.
> 
> Well I spoke with him today (gave him a tube of CLU) and he said the delid was a success, no scratches etc....
> 
> Get a message from him a couple hours ago saying the CPU is not working. Said there is a TINY nick on the die. And then he sends me pictures.... Didn't use a heat gun/hairdryer. A large nick out of the DIE, and tons of scratches on the PCB. Not quite sure what he was thinking, and really don't understand how he thought it was successful considering how bad the CPU looked. I am curious if he even used a razor and not a freaking Rambo knife lol.
> 
> Regardless still feel bad for him, and even a little responsible. As I am sure if he didn't see me do it, he wouldn't have.


it aint your fault.

Not because you put nos on your car that your friend need to do it...


----------



## Ceadderman

"Thin razorblade"?!?









~Ceadder


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> So I feel kind of bad. Guy on our local gaming Facebook group decided he wanted to delid his 4690k after he saw me do it (I have done like 6 CPU's prior, all razor blade).
> 
> So I gave him a bunch of advice based on my experience. Use a heat gun or at least a hair dryer to heat up the glue a fair amount. Use a thin razor. Start at the corners, slightly bend (not to the point of a crease of course) the razor into a U shape so less of the razor is actually touching the PCB. Use good lighting like a head lamp etc etc.
> 
> Well I spoke with him today (gave him a tube of CLU) and he said the delid was a success, no scratches etc....
> 
> Get a message from him a couple hours ago saying the CPU is not working. Said there is a TINY nick on the die. And then he sends me pictures.... Didn't use a heat gun/hairdryer. A large nick out of the DIE, and tons of scratches on the PCB. Not quite sure what he was thinking, and really don't understand how he thought it was successful considering how bad the CPU looked. I am curious if he even used a razor and not a freaking Rambo knife lol.
> 
> Regardless still feel bad for him, and even a little responsible. As I am sure if he didn't see me do it, he wouldn't have.


Pics or didn't happen


----------



## Swag

It isn't your fault at all. It's a person's own responsibility to know what they're getting into and it was his choice to continue with it himself. You don't have to feel guilt or anything, he knew the risks, he took them and lost. Too bad, too sad. Although, I am interested in how it looks as well. A tiny nick can't possible be a large nick all of a sudden. In addition to no scratches and having a million scratches on it.


----------



## LukeJoseph

Yes a thin and flexible razor blade. Just like one you can get out of a box cutter. Once the glue is warm with a heat gun,
It take a little effort to start, but once the initial cut is made, the blade will glide like butter.

And I know it's not my fault. But the guy was super nice,
JUST got his new motherboard today (went crazy and for the Asus formula) and now he is dead in the water. He really should have taken every bit of my advice, or got a vice and went that route.

I will ask him to send me the pic he showed me. It was bad, like really bad. And again just go back to, how the heck he thought he did a good job is beyond me.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> And then he sends me pictures....


Where are the pics? We're all big on pics. If you mention that you have them, we're certainly going to want to see them....


----------



## bonami2

Hey guy i have some stuff for phone dissasembly

Pry bar in plastic

and kind of Guitar pin in plastic super sharp

Any idea if it would be possible to pry the cpu out of the glue and or cut it with plastic?

Anyways im going to use the vice hammer one


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Hey guy i have some stuff for phone dissasembly
> 
> Pry bar in plastic
> 
> and kind of Guitar pin in plastic super sharp
> 
> Any idea if it would be possible to pry the cpu out of the glue and or cut it with plastic?
> 
> Anyways im going to use the vice hammer one


Someone reported that they could remove the IHS on their CPU with a very thin plastic card they had. This had not been possible on my 3570k as there was no gap to get anything like that in, I'm pretty sure, but you might want to check what's up with your CPU.

Another idea is maybe just making the first cuts with a razor, and then continuing with a plastic tool. That this was possible was reported by more than one person.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Hey guy i have some stuff for phone dissasembly
> 
> Pry bar in plastic
> 
> and kind of Guitar pin in plastic super sharp
> 
> Any idea if it would be possible to pry the cpu out of the glue and or cut it with plastic?
> 
> Anyways im going to use the vice hammer one


I wouldn't try it myself. You'd be using the PCB as the pressure point for prying the IHS off, which doesn't seem like a good idea. For me, I'll be sticking with the wood/hammer/vice method - it's the method I used for my CPU, and it's the one that I'll be using in the future (if necessary).









Cutting the glue could work, since that's basically what the razor method does. However, this method was terrifying since basically I'm not qualified to be a neural surgeon.


----------



## Ceadderman

You want a stiff blade razor. They kind that goes in a razor knife. Not a flexible one. Otherwise you've got a good chance of wiping out there capacitors under their IHS.

There are plenty of bad delidding stories in this thread about their use of flexible blades.









~Ceadder


----------



## bonami2

Hum what happen if we glue the top of the ihs and pull from the vice could work maybe









Well i says that but the pcb is flexible... Just tested my old pentium m 730 that has the die exploded in half from being a key chain for 2 years ahah

Put it in the vice and we see clearly that it flex to easily so the hammer method is the best


----------



## LukeJoseph

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> You want a stiff blade razor. They kind that goes in a razor knife. Not a flexible one. Otherwise you've got a good chance of wiping out there capacitors under their IHS.
> 
> There are plenty of bad delidding stories in this thread about their use of flexible blades.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I am going to have to disagree. A thin razor makes it much much easier to get underneath the IHS. How on earth would having a thicker stiff razor be safer or help prevent hitting anything important? I have done 7 now, all worked great. First one I did, I did Nick the PCB a little but still worked great.

I can not stress enough how important a heat gun is to the process. Seriously once you get it pretty warm the glue just turns soft. A sharp thin razor will just glide through like butter. And when I say thin. I am not talking exacto like thin, like what comes out of a box cutter is perfect.

Here is the pic.


----------



## LukeJoseph

Looks like he was using way to much force (which you would have to if the glue isn't softend up).


----------



## Buska103

Anyone using an EK waterblock with the direct-die mount?

Is it possible to crack the die, or do the standoffs prevent this from happening? I can't tell if you're supposed to tighten until the threads stop or finger-tight with the mount. Can anyone who has the direct-die mount shine some light on this for me?

Also - Gelid GC Extreme would probably be preferable to CLU in this scenario, correct (between die and waterblock)?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> I am going to have to disagree. A thin razor makes it much much easier to get underneath the IHS. How on earth would having a thicker stiff razor be safer or help prevent hitting anything important? I have done 7 now, all worked great. First one I did, I did Nick the PCB a little but still worked great.
> 
> [...]


I drew a picture about the idea that a thicker razor makes it easier to not make a mistake and cut into the PCB:



green = thick razor for things like cutting carpets etc.
orange = thin razor for shaving


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buska103*
> 
> Anyone using an EK waterblock with the direct-die mount?
> 
> Is it possible to crack the die, or do the standoffs prevent this from happening? I can't tell if you're supposed to tighten until the threads stop or finger-tight with the mount. Can anyone who has the direct-die mount shine some light on this for me?
> 
> Also - Gelid GC Extreme would probably be preferable to CLU in this scenario, correct (between die and waterblock)?


The naked ivy kit is made to the correct height of the die.
I'm running this setting currently with Gelid, though upgrading to CLU when it arrives.
I'm 99% sure damage could only occur if uneven pressure was applied during mounting the block.
When I mounted mine i only applied enough pressure to keep the block flat and central to the cpu.
Fit the springs and nuts, tighten down enough for the spring tension to hold the block down.
Then in a criss-cross alternating pattern do up the nuts until finger tight.
Hope this helps


----------



## Ceadderman

Vice method with Heatgun would be much better.









~Ceadder


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Vice method with Heatgun would be much better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Uh so i should preheat my cpu in the mobo before smashing it ?

Take care with heatgun some are pretty damn hot... I melted a pcb in 5 sec a bout a years ago trying to dry stuff........................


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Vice method with Heatgun would be much better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Or vice and hammer method







.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> The nail polish isn't going on the copper where the die makes contact with the heatsink. It's going alongside the copper and aluminum and it won't actually cover the aluminum fully, just enough so no CLU makes contact with the aluminum.
> 
> Besides, the copper pipes make perfect contact with the aluminum already.


Im pretty sure the stock gpu heatsinks dont have aluminum...the ones used in EVGA are usually copper with some form of coating on them.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buska103*
> 
> Anyone using an EK waterblock with the direct-die mount?
> 
> Is it possible to crack the die, or do the standoffs prevent this from happening? I can't tell if you're supposed to tighten until the threads stop or finger-tight with the mount. Can anyone who has the direct-die mount shine some light on this for me?
> 
> Also - Gelid GC Extreme would probably be preferable to CLU in this scenario, correct (between die and waterblock)?


Yea i do direct die cooling. You want to get the naked ivy kit...I got mine from performancepcs.com and its like 5 or 6 bucks.

The normal standoffs take the ihs into consideration, so it wouldnt allow the block to make contact with the die. Youd need the naked ivy kit because it uses shorter standoffs to bring the block into contact with the die.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Vice method with Heatgun would be much better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Personally i wouldnt be comfortable heating the cpu with a heatgun...but that's just me. with the vice only method you can do it cold. However im sure if you use a hammer and vice and apply heat it would only take one or two taps. On that note, why not use a more focused source of heat like a butane lighter with a really sharp flame? That way you could focus the heat on the IHS alone without hurting the pcb at all...


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Im pretty sure the stock gpu heatsinks dont have aluminum...the ones used in EVGA are usually copper with some form of coating on them.


It seems like aluminum. Don't know.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> It seems like aluminum. Don't know.


I dont think any reputable gpu manufacturer makes aluminum heatsinks...

@ceadderman care to weigh in?


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I dont think any reputable gpu manufacturer makes aluminum heatsinks...
> 
> @ceadderman care to weigh in?


A lot do. Aluminum fins are everywhere last time I checked.


----------



## DirektEffekt

A lot of GPU heatsinks will have aluminium near the base, especially direct contact heat pipe coolers which have aluminium surrounding them, although I would have thought that most, if not all the actual contact area would be copper. But if, as in the above picture, you can see bare copper and a silver metal, it is almost certainly aluminium since if it were nickel plated, as is often the case for CPU coolers but not so much GPU, it would all be plated.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Im pretty sure the stock gpu heatsinks dont have aluminum...the ones used in EVGA are usually copper with some form of coating on them.


This is about a different design of heat-sink without a base-plate. The pictures he showed was a cooler with "direct-touch", exposed heat-pipes. This is done to not have to solder a base-plate onto the heat-pipes. If a choice like that is made, you can be sure that every piece of metal you see on the cooler is aluminium, other than the heat-pipes.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> This is about a different design of heat-sink without a base-plate. The pictures he showed was a cooler with "direct-touch", exposed heat-pipes. This is done to not have to solder a base-plate onto the heat-pipes. If a choice like that is made, you can be sure that every piece of metal you see on the cooler is aluminium, other than the heat-pipes.


Ah I didnt see the picture/


----------



## fleetfeather

All these dudes with their LET and nail polish..... And here I am, 4th CPU in, still 0 stress about shorting out the FIVR due to overzealous CLU application.

I think the main problem is that people keep trying to put such a large amount of CLU on the underside of the IHS; you really don't need a full die-sized streak of CLU on it. You're just trying to supplement the CLU on the die itself so there's no chance of a lack of contact due to poor PCB glue removal


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I dont think any reputable gpu manufacturer makes aluminum heatsinks...
> 
> @ceadderman care to weigh in?


The silver plate you see on GPU heatsinks is generally nickel-plated copper.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> A lot of GPU heatsinks will have aluminium near the base, especially direct contact heat pipe coolers which have aluminium surrounding them, although I would have thought that most, if not all the actual contact area would be copper. But if, as in the above picture, you can see bare copper and a silver metal, it is almost certainly aluminium since if it were nickel plated, as is often the case for CPU coolers but not so much GPU, it would all be plated.


QFT.

Any time you see silver, good bet the heatsink is Aluminum, as nickel plated copper AFAIK doesn't exist on heatsinks. It's a costly process that manufacturers tend to avoid.









~Ceadder


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> All these dudes with their LET and nail polish..... And here I am, 4th CPU in, still 0 stress about shorting out the FIVR due to overzealous CLU application.
> 
> I think the main problem is that people keep trying to put such a large amount of CLU on the underside of the IHS; you really don't need a full die-sized streak of CLU on it. You're just trying to supplement the CLU on the die itself so there's no chance of a lack of contact due to poor PCB glue removal


It's not really about going overboard on CLU. I typically spread my TIM on the die in a thin layer but overtime, I end up replacing it and moving the IHS even the slightest pushes the TIM onto the capacitors. This is the reason why I'm going to but nail polish on the aluminum heatsink, because although it's not directly under the die, even the slightest movement can push CLU towards the aluminum.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Just use liquid copper. It's just as good. Problem solved.


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Just use liquid copper. It's just as good. Problem solved.


Already ordered some CLU







.


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Paint it on the die with the included brush, then paint it on the IHS where it will make contact with the die. No need to reseal/reglue the IHS back down, the socket clip will hold it plenty tight. Also, if you are doing a CPU that has caps next to the die, take some clear fingernail polish, varnish, or liquid electrical tape, and use it to paint over the little caps to prevent the Coolabratory Liquid Ultra (CLU for short) from making direct contact with the caps. CLU is highly electrically conductive, and can be fatal if it bridges a cap.


So does CLU also removes the intel markings on top of the IHS? Or just CLP does that?
Really wanted to use CLU for everything (die + IHS + H220X) since I don't have a good thermal paste to use (only got the one included with the h220x.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> So does CLU also removes the intel markings on top of the IHS? Or just CLP does that?
> Really wanted to use CLU for everything (die + IHS + H220X) since I don't have a good thermal paste to use (only got the one included with the h220x.


it will remove the markings. and the included tim, the one that comes with the h220x is very good.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> So does CLU also removes the intel markings on top of the IHS? Or just CLP does that?
> Really wanted to use CLU for everything (die + IHS + H220X) since I don't have a good thermal paste to use (only got the one included with the h220x.


The last time I checked on my CPU was after half a year of use (using CLU). At that point, you could still see the markings, but it was only barely visible. I had to turn the CPU around in the light to make the writing out.

Make sure to never use the sponge thingy that comes in the CLU package for cleaning. It is some sort of metal wire and will scratch everything up and definitely remove the writing.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> The last time I checked on my CPU was after half a year of use (using CLU). At that point, you could still see the markings, but it was only barely visible. I had to turn the CPU around in the light to make the writing out.
> 
> Make sure to never use the sponge thingy that comes in the CLU package for cleaning. It is some sort of metal wire and will scratch everything up and definitely remove the writing.


Yea it;s a light steel wool. The clu is only meant for application to the die and the underside of the IHS. Topside, you want to use a nonconductive paste.


----------



## Darkz0r

Thanks! Will use the paste that came with the h220x then









IF my delid succeeds lol!


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Thanks! Will use the paste that came with the h220x then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IF my delid succeeds lol!


I wish you the best of luck







.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LukeJoseph*
> 
> I am going to have to disagree. A thin razor makes it much much easier to get underneath the IHS. How on earth would having a thicker stiff razor be safer or help prevent hitting anything important? I have done 7 now, all worked great. First one I did, I did Nick the PCB a little but still worked great.
> 
> I can not stress enough how important a heat gun is to the process. Seriously once you get it pretty warm the glue just turns soft. A sharp thin razor will just glide through like butter. And when I say thin. I am not talking exacto like thin, like what comes out of a box cutter is perfect.
> 
> Here is the pic.


To me, or just the picture itself, looks like it is just quite dirty.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> It seems like aluminum. Don't know.


This depends per gpu sadly, some are nickle plated copper, but some are all aluminum, thats a tough call without calling the manufacturer, which i would recommend.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I dont think any reputable gpu manufacturer makes aluminum heatsinks...
> 
> @ceadderman care to weigh in?


same as above, it depends.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> All these dudes with their LET and nail polish..... And here I am, 4th CPU in, still 0 stress about shorting out the FIVR due to overzealous CLU application.
> 
> I think the main problem is that people keep trying to put such a large amount of CLU on the underside of the IHS; you really don't need a full die-sized streak of CLU on it. You're just trying to supplement the CLU on the die itself so there's no chance of a lack of contact due to poor PCB glue removal


Same here buddy








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Thanks! Will use the paste that came with the h220x then
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IF my delid succeeds lol!


Good luck!


----------



## overclckng-game

Did I kill my chip? Here are some pictures of what I think would be the damages. When I try to boot I get a 00 Boot code, I have a MSI MPower max and an intel I5-4670K.
*Images*:
CPU


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> Did I kill my chip? Here are some pictures of what I think would be the damages. When I try to boot I get a 00 Boot code, I have a MSI MPower max and an intel I5-4670K.
> *Images*:
> CPU


Let me guess u did the razor method. Unfortunately you cut into the PCB.


----------



## overclckng-game

Yes and yes. Im guessing that means my chip is dead.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> Did I kill my chip? Here are some pictures of what I think would be the damages. When I try to boot I get a 00 Boot code, I have a MSI MPower max and an intel I5-4670K.
> *Images*:
> CPU


Like above, your over some critical lanes for the cpu there, my guess is it's dead Jim. Always try all the hardware tricks for boots just to make sure though


----------



## overclckng-game

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Like above, your over some critical lanes for the cpu there, my guess is it's dead Jim. Always try all the hardware tricks for boots just to make sure though


Can you give me a few hardware tricks to try?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> Can you give me a few hardware tricks to try?


pretty much out of case on cardboard and slowly add gear to it and then try testing with the Cmos battery and try everything you can think of. Some people get lucky


----------



## overclckng-game

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> pretty much out of case on cardboard and slowly add gear to it and then try testing with the Cmos battery and try everything you can think of. Some people get lucky


Thanks


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> Thanks


Goodluck.

I just hate hearing that chip are dead


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> Did I kill my chip? Here are some pictures of what I think would be the damages. When I try to boot I get a 00 Boot code, I have a MSI MPower max and an intel I5-4670K.
> *Images*:
> CPU


Just curious what your tool of choice was for that? Its beat up pretty bad in several places.


----------



## overclckng-game

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Just curious what your tool of choice was for that? Its beat up pretty bad in several places.


I used a carpet knife. looking back, I wish I would have gone slower and took my time.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> I used a carpet knife. looking back, I wish I would have gone slower and took my time.


Slow and steady wins the rac. Don't worry though, it's all a part of the learning experience, and you could never exchange that


----------



## overclckng-game

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Slow and steady wins the rac. Don't worry though, it's all a part of the learning experience, and you could never exchange that


For the time being I'm probably going to pick up a pentium anniversary edition. Thanks for the encouragement and knowledge


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> For the time being I'm probably going to pick up a pentium anniversary edition. Thanks for the encouragement and knowledge


Delid it!


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> It's not really about going overboard on CLU. I typically spread my TIM on the die in a thin layer but overtime, I end up replacing it and moving the IHS even the slightest pushes the TIM onto the capacitors. This is the reason why I'm going to but nail polish on the aluminum heatsink, because although it's not directly under the die, even the slightest movement can push CLU towards the aluminum.


Oh, but I disagree; it's definitely about going overboard with CLU haha...

Moving the IHS towards the FIVR should never happen, since the FIVR is always to the side of the socket, rather than towards the bottom of the socket. The only notable IHS movement that should occur is when it slides _downwards_ slightly as you attempt to clamp the CPU into the socket.

Furthermore, your CLU application should never be so thick as to cause a risk of CLU shifting off the die and onto the FIVR section anyway; as you would know from trying to spread the CLU over the die, the stuff isn't exactly easy to spread around if you're using the appropriate amount of CLU. _If your CLU application is easy to spread, you've got too much CLU_ haha

Your third sentence makes very little sense to me. Can you try explain again?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Just curious what your tool of choice was for that? Its beat up pretty bad in several places.
> 
> 
> 
> I used a carpet knife. looking back, I wish I would have gone slower and took my time.
Click to expand...

box cutter blade or thinner
never go in with the point
always angle the sharp of the blade up

sorry for your loss.


----------



## Ceadderman

*@fleetfeather*

..."This is the reason why I'm going to put nail polish on the aluminum heatsink, because although it's not directly under the die, even the slightest movement can push CLU towards the aluminum."

He is saying that although he places a thin amount on, then cooler can push it out from between the IHS and cooler when the latter is seated.









~Ceadder


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> *@fleetfeather*
> 
> ..."This is the reason why I'm going to put nail polish on the aluminum heatsink, because although it's not directly under the die, even the slightest movement can push CLU towards the aluminum."
> 
> He is saying that although he places a thin amount on, then cooler can push it out from between the IHS and cooler when the latter is seated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


That's definitely true for regular TIM, but it should definitely not happen with CLU I think... Well... Provided a correct thin film is applied.


----------



## B NEGATIVE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Vice method with Heatgun would be much better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


This is what I did,Tensioned the chip in the vice and heatgunned from underneath. Then I just added a turn of pressure and waited for movement.

It didnt take long and the chip was never under real stress.

For those with knurled jaws on their vices,layers of paper or masking tape is better than gaffer tape...or just buy a couple of bits of Alu 90 profile and cover the jaws with that....


----------



## dilster97

Successful delid with a Wilkinson Sword razor blade.

MX4 on die and IHS with a 7-10C drop.

Going to source CLU and use it instead.

Razor method is best method









CPU was a Core i5 3570K


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> This is what I did,Tensioned the chip in the vice and heatgunned from underneath. Then I just added a turn of pressure and waited for movement.
> 
> It didnt take long and the chip was never under real stress.
> 
> For those with knurled jaws on their vices,layers of paper or masking tape is better than gaffer tape...or just buy a couple of bits of Alu 90 profile and cover the jaws with that....


What about hammer and heat?

I tested my old cpu in the vice and it pretty easy to bend the pcb... Ok it a 10 years old mobile cpu but except that ahah


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dilster97*
> 
> Successful delid with a Wilkinson Sword razor blade.
> 
> MX4 on die and IHS with a 7-10C drop.
> 
> Going to source CLU and use it instead.
> 
> Razor method is best method
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU was a Core i5 3570K


If you have steady hands, then it's a _decent_ method. "Best" method is quite a stretch, considering you're only a muscle-spasm away from a dead CPU with the razor method.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you have steady hands, then it's a _decent_ method. "Best" method is quite a stretch, considering you're only a muscle-spasm away from a dead CPU with the razor method.


yea that like my friend im aint affraid of 110v and or 220v it safe...

Well that not what i guy i heard of said.. When his arm blow up from 220v









Hammer method may seem brutal but i just smashed my old pentium m from every side with a wood block and it aint even marked the pcb. and it did not flex at all either.. So that the safest ways


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> yea that like my friend im aint affraid of 110v and or 220v it safe...
> 
> Well that not what i guy i heard of said.. When his arm blow up from 220v
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hammer method may seem brutal but i just smashed my old pentium m from every side with a wood block and it aint even marked the pcb. and it did not flex at all either.. So that the safest ways


I started with trying the razor method, but then realized just how easy it would be to brick my CPU if that razor slips. Then I bought a table vice, and used a small block of wood and a hammer to delid. Super simple and infinitely safer than the razor method, as long as you're not just bashing the crap out of the block of wood with that hammer....


----------



## bonami2

even if you smash on it like a ****** it wont break the pcb i just tried..

The only ways to break it is to smash it with something that is not large enough to make contact and it bend it like smashing plastic would


----------



## dilster97

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you have steady hands, then it's a _decent_ method. "Best" method is quite a stretch, considering you're only a muscle-spasm away from a dead CPU with the razor method.


Not really. Taking your time and not being an on edge crack addict means you focus on not screwing up.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dilster97*
> 
> Not really. Taking your time and not being an on edge crack addict means you focus on not screwing up.


If you nick that PCB, you can kill your CPU - plain and simple. If a cat bumps your arm while you're carefully cutting the glue, guess what, potentially dead CPU. Your kid tries to get your attention by shaking your arm, possibly dead chip. Variables, my friend, variables. You might have hands like a neural surgeon, but life happens sometimes. It's better to plan ahead for that and avoid issues beforehand.









The point is, using a razor on a CPU is significantly more dangerous than any reasonable method that involves a vice.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dilster97*
> 
> Not really. Taking your time and not being an on edge crack addict means you focus on not screwing up.


Why would you need to take your time when you can use the vise method and knock it out in 5 seconds? I've delidded multiple chips and its gotten to the point where if and when I'm building a new PC, i just go ahead and delid.

Please...tell me that this isn't easier than the razor method:


----------



## dilster97

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you nick that PCB, you can kill your CPU - plain and simple. If a cat bumps your arm while you're carefully cutting the glue, guess what, potentially dead CPU. Your kid tries to get your attention by shaking your arm, possibly dead chip. Variables, my friend, variables. You might have hands like a neural surgeon, but life happens sometimes. It's better to plan ahead for that and avoid issues beforehand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The point is, using a razor on a CPU is significantly more dangerous than any reasonable method that involves a vice.


It's the danger element that i like about the razor method though. There's more important things than buying new processor. so better make sure i don't mess it up.

If i was doing someone else's processor then i'd go vice method. I have little regard for me own components until they die of course.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Why would you need to take your time when you can use the vise method and knock it out in 5 seconds? I've delidded multiple chips and its gotten to the point where if and when I'm building a new PC, i just go ahead and delid.
> Please...tell me that this isn't easier than the razor method:


For me the razor method was a cheaper alternative since i pack of five blades is like £2. A small hobbyist vice is £6.

That's a £4 saving to go towards some Liquid Metal. Or some Haribos.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dilster97*
> 
> It's the danger element that i like about the razor method though. There's more important things than buying new processor. so better make sure i don't mess it up.
> 
> If i was doing someone else's processor then i'd go vice method. I have little regard for me own components until they die of course.
> For me the razor method was a cheaper alternative since i pack of five blades is like £2. A small hobbyist vice is £6.
> 
> That's a £4 saving to go towards some Liquid Metal. Or some Haribos.


I can think of more fun things to do than potentially throwing away hundreds of dollars.









Actually, unless you plan on keeping the vice, you could return it and get your money back. A pack of razors is yours once you open it.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dilster97*
> 
> It's the danger element that i like about the razor method though. There's more important things than buying new processor. so better make sure i don't mess it up.
> 
> If i was doing someone else's processor then i'd go vice method. I have little regard for me own components until they die of course.
> For me the razor method was a cheaper alternative since i pack of five blades is like £2. A small hobbyist vice is £6.
> 
> That's a £4 saving to go towards some Liquid Metal. Or some Haribos.


Your argument is that you're saving 4 pounds? So take a huge risk and spend a crapload of time making sure you don't do something wrong using the razor method vs taking 5 seconds using the vise method and exponentially less risk? Seriously?

Most people who haven't delidded in the past use the vise method because it's easy. If you want to use the razor method That's all you but it's not safe.


----------



## overclckng-game

If my CPU is heating up but still getting the 00 boot code, is there hope?


----------



## bonami2

Well no. Except if you killed the mobo but thay would be impossiblr except if you bent a pin installing it


----------



## B NEGATIVE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> This is what I did,Tensioned the chip in the vice and heatgunned from underneath. Then I just added a turn of pressure and waited for movement.
> 
> It didnt take long and the chip was never under real stress.
> 
> For those with knurled jaws on their vices,layers of paper or masking tape is better than gaffer tape...or just buy a couple of bits of Alu 90 profile and cover the jaws with that....
> 
> 
> 
> What about hammer and heat?
> 
> I tested my old cpu in the vice and it pretty easy to bend the pcb... Ok it a 10 years old mobile cpu but except that ahah
Click to expand...

You dont need a hammer,you just need enough heat to make the sealant pliable,the pressure from the vice does the rest. The IHS moves less than a mm and can be just plucked off.

I have done the hammer method,I dont like the fact im subjecting nanometer scaled parts with impact forces as found in hammer strikes.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> You dont need a hammer,you just need enough heat to make the sealant pliable,the pressure from the vice does the rest. The IHS moves less than a mm and can be just plucked off.
> 
> I have done the hammer method,I dont like the fact im subjecting nanometer scaled parts with impact forces as found in hammer strikes.


How much force are you putting into the swing of the hammer against a block of wood (which distributes the force of the impact across the entire side of the PCB), where the "hammer strikes" become a concern? Basically put: if you're concerned about the force of the swing, then you're using too much force. You only need to tap the block to pop the IHS off....


----------



## B NEGATIVE

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> You dont need a hammer,you just need enough heat to make the sealant pliable,the pressure from the vice does the rest. The IHS moves less than a mm and can be just plucked off.
> 
> I have done the hammer method,I dont like the fact im subjecting nanometer scaled parts with impact forces as found in hammer strikes.
> 
> 
> 
> How much force are you putting into the swing of the hammer against a block of wood (which distributes the force of the impact across the entire side of the PCB), where the "hammer strikes" become a concern? Basically put: if you're concerned about the force of the swing, then you're using too much force. You only need to tap the block to pop the IHS off....
Click to expand...

Versus NO impact force at all.........You shouldnt be subjecting any die to any kind of impact.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> Versus NO impact force at all.........You shouldnt be subjecting any die to any kind of impact.


Glad to see we agree on this. I used the hammer and vise method on 2 chips and delidded using the vise only on the last 3. It's so much better and quicker.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Glad to see we agree on this. I used the hammer and vise method on 2 chips and delidded using the vise only on the last 3. It's so much better and quicker.


You two do realize that I'm an advocate for the vice methods, and that I'm not arguing about the effectiveness of vice methods, right? Both vice methods (should) end up putting similar stress on the PCB unless, like I've been saying, you go crazy with the hammer. If you don't go crazy with the hammer, then you don't have anything to worry about, and it ends up being just as safe as the vice-only method.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> Versus NO impact force at all.........You shouldnt be subjecting any die to any kind of impact.


I agree, absolutely. I don't think people realise how much shock force goes through the PCB when you strike it with a hammer, even lightly. I would guess that it hits no less than 20Gs... I wouldn't be surprised if it was significantly more. Obviously that's just a guess, but it's the kind of thing that happens when you are talking about an momentary pulse of force.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You two do realize that I'm an advocate for the vice methods, and that I'm not arguing about the effectiveness of vice methods, right? Both vice methods (should) end up putting similar stress on the PCB unless, like I've been saying, you go crazy with the hammer. If you don't go crazy with the hammer, then you don't have anything to worry about, and it ends up being just as safe as the vice-only method.


Yea I know. I wasn't implying you weren't. There's one more though. If you grip the ihs with both jaws and wonder why it's not separating lolol. That's another way that the vise method wouldn't work lol.

But yea there's only a hamdful of ppl here who don't like the vise method. Maybe they don't get it.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> I agree, absolutely. I don't think people realise how much shock force goes through the PCB when you strike it with a hammer, even lightly. I would guess that it hits no less than 20Gs... I wouldn't be surprised if it was significantly more. Obviously that's just a guess, but it's the kind of thing that happens when you are talking about an momentary pulse of force.


I'm worried about the impact and impulse because its literally a wave of force that's immediately kicked from hammer to block to pcb and in reverse with 0 impulsive give at all. Impulse is like your head hitting an airbag. Only in this case the airbag never deployed and your head is hitting the steering wheel and bounces back due to the reactive force. That's what's happening to the pcb I'm a hammer vise delid.


----------



## deepor

Whatever force it is with the hits, does it really have to be more than what you do with vise-only method? With the hammer, you ramp up the force over several hits until it's getting more than the glue can take.

When I delidded my CPU with the hammer+vise method, the PCB didn't fly away and there was still part of the glue keeping it stuck to the IHS. The last bit of glue came off when pulling the PCB and IHS apart by hand.

In a situation like that, shouldn't this mean that the force I put into stuff with the hammer was comparable to what the vise-only method would have done?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Whatever force it is with the hits, does it really have to be more than what you do with vise-only method? With the hammer, you ramp up the force over several hits until it's getting more than the glue can take.
> 
> When I delidded my CPU with the hammer+vise method, the PCB didn't fly away and there was still part of the glue keeping it stuck to the IHS. The last bit of glue came off when pulling the PCB and IHS apart by hand.
> 
> In a situation like that, shouldn't this mean that the force I put into stuff with the hammer was comparable to what the vise-only method would have done?


Nope, it has to be far more with the hammer method. With the hammer, you are damaging the glue one small bit at a time. Every time you do it the force spikes above what you would ever apply with the vice-only method, weakening the glue a bit at a time. Whereas with the vice only method you are applying a constant force, using the absolute minimum force required. If you use the vice method, you can watch as the glue slowly breaks over a few seconds of it giving way. With the hammer method, this happens over a few periods of milliseconds, so in order for the same damage to be done the force applied in each burst with the hammer must be much greater. That is not even considering the vibrational strain that you see using the hammer method. On each hit the entire chip will jolt abruptly from side to side, not on a scale that you can see with the naked eye, but it is definitely happening.

EDIT: If you were to only hit with the same force as the vice is constantly applying, which would be very hard, you would likely have to hit it dozens, maybe a hundred individual times for it to give way gently.


----------



## fleetfeather

Even as someone who uses the vice-only method, people in this thread are underestimating the stress placed on the PCB by using the vice-only method (especially with respect to the angled placement of the CPU package).

That said, the PCB appears to survive warping from using thicker blades via the razor method, so the considerable stress i'm referencing above appears to be handled quite well.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Nope, it has to be far more with the hammer method. With the hammer, you are damaging the glue one small bit at a time. Every time you do it the force spikes above what you would ever apply with the vice-only method, weakening the glue a bit at a time. Whereas with the vice only method you are applying a constant force, using the absolute minimum force required. If you use the vice method, you can watch as the glue slowly breaks over a few seconds of it giving way. With the hammer method, this happens over a few periods of milliseconds, so in order for the same damage to be done the force applied in each burst with the hammer must be much greater. That is not even considering the vibrational strain that you see using the hammer method. On each hit the entire chip will jolt abruptly from side to side, not on a scale that you can see with the naked eye, but it is definitely happening.
> 
> EDIT: If you were to only hit with the same force as the vice is constantly applying, which would be very hard, you would likely have to hit it dozens, maybe a hundred individual times for it to give way gently.


I feel what you argue makes sense intuitively to me, but I don't really understand what's going on because I don't know enough about physics. I'm wondering if things could be misunderstood going by intuition.

Like what about when you want to put a nail into wood. When you use a hammer, the nail seems to take less effort to put into the wood compared to slowly pushing. Slowly pushing to get the nail in seems to need a lot of power of your whole body put into the task, while the hammer is just a tiny swing. There's some sort of trick happening there with the shock causing things to overall need less force applied to get the nail in?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I feel what you argue makes sense intuitively to me, but I don't really understand what's going on because I don't know enough about physics. I'm wondering if things could be misunderstood going by intuition.
> 
> Like what about when you want to put a nail into wood. When you use a hammer, the nail seems to take less effort to put into the wood compared to slowly pushing. Slowly pushing to get the nail in seems to need a lot of power of your whole body put into the task, while the hammer is just a tiny swing. There's some sort of trick happening there with the shock causing things to overall need less force applied to get the nail in?


That's because of a confusion between energy and force. The body can't differentiate between the two, because the muscles of the human body require energy to maintain constant force. It's a different story entirely when you are looking at a hydraulic cylinder. Now if you used hydraulics to both hammer and to push, you would use roughly the same amount of energy either way, the difference being that the amount of force sustained by the nail is much greater when it is being hammered than if it is simply pushed. Now, in all these examples there are of course other factors, like the change in energy required to penetrate depending on the rate of penetration and the force applied etc., but I think you get the picture.

As for my comment about human muscles, try holding a weight out in front of you. Now, doing this is extremely difficult for us to do, however, the act of doing so requires, in a mechanical sense, no energy. But because our muscles aren't like machines where they are capable of locking in this position in order to maintain the stance while exerting zero energy, they exert energy to maintain their posture.


----------



## B NEGATIVE

It requires less energy to keep something in momentum once the initial movement is started. The hammer delivers this in one go using more force than is required,the vice only method uses the minimum of force ramped to achieve effect.

The choice is yours,I know what I do.


----------



## fleetfeather

the fact remains that most CPU's die due to chipping the edge of the PCB than anything else. Guess which delidding method involves the most trauma to the edge of the PCB?


----------



## dilster97

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Your argument is that you're saving 4 pounds? So take a huge risk and spend a crapload of time making sure you don't do something wrong using the razor method vs taking 5 seconds using the vise method and exponentially less risk? Seriously?
> Most people who haven't delidded in the past use the vise method because it's easy. If you want to use the razor method That's all you but it's not safe.


You're not very good when it comes to jokes are you? If i was concerned i'd go vice and lose out on the pack of Haribo's.

I'm sticking by the razor method. _If_ I were to do a friends CPU, then i'd take more caution.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I can think of more fun things to do than potentially throwing away hundreds of dollars.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, unless you plan on keeping the vice, you could return it and get your money back. A pack of razors is yours once you open it.


Never thought about that.


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *overclckng-game*
> 
> If my CPU is heating up but still getting the 00 boot code, is there hope?


Dude u cut into your cpus pcb, its dead. Make into a nice keyring and learn from the experience.
I used the vice method and didn't damage my chip but did mark my ihs because the jaw were worn.
Can't complain though as its still alive and running CLU now


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> It requires less energy to keep something in momentum once the initial movement is started. The hammer delivers this in one go using more force than is required,the vice only method uses the minimum of force ramped to achieve effect.
> 
> The choice is yours,I know what I do.


Vice is by far the safest method in terms of sheer shock and raw damage/net force that could damage it
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> the fact remains that most CPU's die due to chipping the edge of the PCB than anything else. Guess which delidding method involves the most trauma to the edge of the PCB?


This sounds like you agree with B Neg..... (Vagur might be silly and didn't read the full context >.>







)

The hammer method works, it really does, but the correct vice is miles better than the hammer. The raw amount of shock a hammer has on the thin amount of PCB is quite staggering. I'm curious how many Jules it puts on one of those poor things.

The right vice which is one without any teeth or rough edges is the key for the vice methods safety, take it slow and you save the pcb and the die without any issues.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dilster97*
> 
> You're not very good when it comes to jokes are you? If i was concerned i'd go vice and lose out on the pack of Haribo's.
> 
> I'm sticking by the razor method. _If_ I were to do a friends CPU, then i'd take more caution.
> Never thought about that.


I love the razor method, I've delidded nearly 20 cpu's all by razor method, yeah it takes a bit longer, but I know whats happening to it as I can feel it is I go.







Razor method FTW
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> Dude u cut into your cpus pcb, its dead. Make into a nice keyring and learn from the experience.
> I used the vice method and didn't damage my chip but did mark my ihs because the jaw were worn.
> Can't complain though as its still alive and running CLU now


Slow and steady is the key yet again, also a steady hand and a good sense of what blades will work. All this info is in the OP.


----------



## fleetfeather

(I am agreeing with BNeg)

A $10 mini hobby vice from ebay has got me through 3 delids thus far (my first delid was via razor blade). The turning bar on my mini vice is quite small, which increases the resistance a lot more. IMO, high resistance helps me from getting too harsh with my vice rotations.

My vice cost less than the pack of razor blades that I bought lols


----------



## Exilon

I used the vice method with a heat gun. It's pretty much fool proof and barely any force has to be used. It's like the regular vice method except with less force and more heat







. Since the thermal interface is so bad, the only the IHS gets really hot and weakens the silicone glue. No marks or marring on the IHS or PCB because no real force was needed.

I don't see how anyone can screw it up except if they leave the heat gun running and burn down their place.



Prime95 Large FFT load. Could be lower with CLU, but I used NT-H1 because I wanted to verify if this pump out thing is real or an urban legend. I'll report back in a month.



Small FFT shoots my TDP up to 250W and it still throttles


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dilster97*
> 
> You're not very good when it comes to jokes are you? If i was concerned i'd go vice and lose out on the pack of Haribo's.
> 
> I'm sticking by the razor method. _If_ I were to do a friends CPU, then i'd take more caution.
> Never thought about that.


Some things get lost in text. However I do want to add something to everyone else's assertion to the vise method. It doesn't even require a stable surface. You can do it on a wobbly chair. Try saying that about the vise method. You need a strong bench vise to do the hammer method because if it's not mounted right then it ends up taking the shock. And the CPU will shift as a result. With the vise there's no shock forces.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I used the vice method with a heat gun. It's pretty much fool proof and barely any force has to be used. It's like the regular vice method except with less force and more heat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Since the thermal interface is so bad, the only the IHS gets really hot and weakens the silicone glue. No marks or marring on the IHS or PCB because no real force was needed.
> 
> I don't see how anyone can screw it up except if they leave the heat gun running and burn down their place.
> 
> 
> 
> Prime95 Large FFT load. Could be lower with CLU, but I used NT-H1 because I wanted to verify if this pump out thing is real or an urban legend. I'll report back in a month.
> 
> 
> 
> Small FFT shoots my TDP up to 250W and it still throttles


Small fft throttles everyone.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Small fft throttles everyone.


Not me... I can run SmallFFTs in p95 28.8 and it hits about 75-80c and just keeps chugging along! ^_^ That may be related to my excessive watercooling loop though...

EDIT: Exilon, did you notice that core 0 is running 100MHz slower than the other 3?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Not me... I can run SmallFFTs in p95 28.8 and it hits about 75-80c and just keeps chugging along! ^_^ That may be related to my excessive watercooling loop though...
> 
> EDIT: Exilon, did you notice that core 0 is running 100MHz slower than the other 3?


It bounces between 4.7 and 4.6, I don't really know why but I don't really care that much.

What's your package power in HWInfo when running SmallFFT?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> It bounces between 4.7 and 4.6, I don't really know why but I don't really care that much.
> 
> What's your package power in HWInfo when running SmallFFT?


On my MB HWInfo reports it incorrectly. It reads it as 1W! On the software that came with my board, however, it comes in at 220W I think. I suspect the HWInfo doesn't read correctly because I have the power limit set to 4000W in my BIOS.


----------



## OCNinja

Just wonder if anyone had experience of cutting the capacitors near 4790K Die area during deliding, but chip is still alive? Any strange thing observed afterwards? For example, one specific core need more vlot. than rest three?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OCNinja*
> 
> Just wonder if anyone had experience of cutting the capacitors near 4790K Die area during deliding, but chip is still alive? Any strange thing observed afterwards? For example, one specific core need more vlot. than rest three?


Hmm thats a good question. I'm not necessarily sure, most people do Vice delid lately as it's so much safer. I've never seen a cut capacitor on any chip as far as I know


----------



## OCNinja

For cut capacitors, do you think it is repairable by hand (instead of sophisticated soldering machine)? Missing capacitors become faulty after deliding. But I assume the specs of these should be identical (or at least similar) to nearby capacitors, which implies we should get proper replacement capacitors by measuring nearby capacitors and solder back on?

Any ideas?


----------



## blaze2210

Looks like Skylake can be delidded as well. Though, you'd want to be even more careful, since the PCB is thinner: http://www.overclock3d.net/articles/cpu_mainboard/skylake_delidding_does_it_improve_thermals/1


----------



## bonami2

I heard people used the Nail stuff on the capacitor to glue it back on ******* kind of repair but it worked


----------



## OCNinja

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> I heard people used the Nail stuff on the capacitor to glue it back on ******* kind of repair but it worked


lol, if the capacitors just come off, maybe it is possible to glue back. In my case, I need to first find some replacement capacitor with correct specs as original one disappeared after delidling


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OCNinja*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> I heard people used the Nail stuff on the capacitor to glue it back on ******* kind of repair but it worked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol, if the capacitors just come off, maybe it is possible to glue back. In my case, I need to first find some replacement capacitor with correct specs as original one disappeared after delidling
Click to expand...

With all due respect, that wasn't very Ninja-like.









~Ceadder


----------



## OCNinja

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *OCNinja*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> I heard people used the Nail stuff on the capacitor to glue it back on ******* kind of repair but it worked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol, if the capacitors just come off, maybe it is possible to glue back. In my case, I need to first find some replacement capacitor with correct specs as original one disappeared after delidling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> With all due respect, that wasn't very Ninja-like.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
Click to expand...

Well, it is very easy to cut the capacitors if deliding with big toy, like my Hattori Hanzo Sword.


----------



## Valgaur

The Skylake PCB looks thinner, but I bet it's a lot denser and stronger actually. Previous PCB wasn't the greatest on density really.


----------



## ssateneth

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> On my MB HWInfo reports it incorrectly. It reads it as 1W! On the software that came with my board, however, it comes in at 220W I think. I suspect the HWInfo doesn't read correctly because I have the power limit set to 4000W in my BIOS.


If you disable SVID (there isnt a reason to IMO since you can still set input voltage to whatever you please) then reported watts will be very low / wrong. I've always set my SVID to enabled and my input voltage has always been correct.


----------



## iRev_olution

Does anyone use CLU on top of the IHS as a TIM? Or does that remove the labels on the top of the IHS? In this case, use regular TIM?


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> Does anyone use CLU on top of the IHS as a TIM? Or does that remove the labels on the top of the IHS? In this case, use regular TIM?


There is much larger surface area between IHS and cooling block, so just use quality non-conducive paste tim. You can use liquid metal on top of the IHS, but it will stain copper cooling block (may require lapping to clean), it is conductive so if not careful can kill mobo, and you only gain ~2C or 3C better temps vs best non-conductive pastes.

Between the small surface area hot spots on the die and heat spreader where the tim specs are crucial.


----------



## iRev_olution

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> There is much larger surface area between IHS and cooling block, so just use quality non-conducive paste tim. You can use liquid metal on top of the IHS, but it will stain copper cooling block (may require lapping to clean), it is conductive so if not careful can kill mobo, and you only gain ~2C or 3C better temps vs best non-conductive pastes.
> 
> Between the small surface area hot spots on the die and heat spreader where the tim specs are crucial.


Thank you for that. Makes perfect sense. I wouldn't want my EK water block to be stained









Ok as long as i have CLU, TIM, liquid electric tape and my trusty vice, I should be fine, in theory.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> Thank you for that. Makes perfect sense. I wouldn't want my EK water block to be stained
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ok as long as i have CLU, TIM, liquid electric tape and my trusty vice, I should be fine, in theory.


Report back i have the same thing im gonna do in about a week

liquid tape + clu and vice only method


----------



## EvilWiffles

Just installed CLU on both die and IHS.
Lowered temps quite a bit. Running 59c on second core during Cinebench test. Normally I'd get 71c on two cores.


----------



## iRev_olution

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Report back i have the same thing im gonna do in about a week
> 
> liquid tape + clu and vice only method


Will do sir!

I want 24/7 5GHZ damn it! lol


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iRev_olution*
> 
> Will do sir!
> 
> I want 24/7 5GHZ damn it! lol


i want me too but im aint sure i will be able voltage wise but at least it aint gonna be cooking at 80-90c


----------



## Exilon

Well, time to apply some CLU







NT-H1 does not cut it at all for bare die.

I ran a script to load the CPU for 3 minutes (converting video) and idle for 5 minutes to simulate thermal cycles and let it run for a day. TIM failure is noticeable after merely ~50 cycles.


----------



## Ceadderman

Try some ShinEtsu G751. Should hold up just fine imho. If nothing else pick that up with your CLU and give it a try first. Then try this again and see if it's worth using. .5g tunes are relatively cheapexpemsibe.









~Ceadder


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Try some ShinEtsu G751. Should hold up just fine imho. If nothing else pick that up with your CLU and give it a try first. Then try this again and see if it's worth using. .5g tunes are relatively cheapexpemsibe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I tried looking for a decent listing w/cheap shipping, but the only place was Amazon that wanted me to order another $20 of stuff I don't need. Oh well, it's going to remain a mystery.

I'm going to hit the current application of NT-H1 again with another 8 hours of load cycles and see how it goes. The flogging will continue until thermal conductivity improves (or the CLU arrives).


----------



## Exilon

But wait there's more!

I found a seller of Dow Corning TC-5026! This one actually might be better than NT-H1 and long term stable without being conductive or being a PITA to clean. I'll give it a spin and report back on the results.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The Skylake PCB looks thinner, but I bet it's a lot denser and stronger actually. Previous PCB wasn't the greatest on density really.


I sure hope it stronger/denser I seen some other hype that there was some good performance gains in benchmarks too


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> But wait there's more!
> 
> I found a seller of Dow Corning TC-5026! This one actually might be better than NT-H1 and long term stable without being conductive or being a PITA to clean. I'll give it a spin and report back on the results.


If you are going to try any paste for between IHS and die, you wont get much better temps. There are 3 factors that govern tim performance. Bulk thermal conductance (heat conductivity through the tim), surface contact resistance (gradient from tim to ihs + gradient from tim to die), and bondline thickness (how thin/thick tim application is).

Intel polymer tim is at least 3.5 w/m (measured) which will perform as well as the best pastes. The bondline is thick from the adhesive but also from design to avoid pump out (loss of tim over time from thermal cycling). And paste has high/poor contact resistance ie paste to metal (ihs).

If you use paste tim for between IHS and die, you might get 5-8C better temps if you do a great job, no better if you apply to thick. And as everyone saw on 4770k/4790k, many paste tims will suffer from pump out, temps will worsen over time and tim will have to be reapplied after a few months. Again this is tim1 (die and ihs). For tim2 (ihs to cooling block), do use paste.

With liquid metal as tim1, with has 10x thermal conductance, many times lower contact resistance, and capable of much thinner bondline than paste, you can get 20+C temp drops, depending on wattage tested. And there is no pump out. My 4790k measure 22C temp drops at first, and ~ a year later, temps measure 23C drop....basically same within testing error.

My 4790k tested at 185W load, temps drops 22C with liquid metal for tim1, but only 5C temp drop when tested with paste for tim1 (which was from removing the adhesive hence getting a thinner bondline, which will also cause pumpout issues for paste tim).
testing at 150W load, temp drop was 15C for liquid metal, and only few C for paste.

If you are planning on using that paste for tim2 (ihs to cooling block) then it is fine.


----------



## Ceadderman

I believe that he's going Naked, so TIM2 application is pointless in that context.

Performance has g571 for around $8. The trick is to set the whole tube in a cup of hot water which will allow a thinner application but not so thin that push out would clear the die. It's non conductive as well should any get on transistors. I've used it on NB/SB applications with zero issue resultive of too thick an application. Stuff is on my current board under EK mb block.









~Ceadder


----------



## OCNinja

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I believe that he's going Naked, so TIM2 application is pointless in that context.
> 
> Performance has g571 for around $8. The trick is to set the whole tube in a cup of hot water which will allow a thinner application but not so thin that push out would clear the die. It's non conductive as well should any get on transistors. I've used it on NB/SB applications with zero issue resultive of too thick an application. Stuff is on my current board under EK mb block.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Speaking of mounting cooler on top of Naked CPU, is there any guide for rookie user?
I assume some modification is necessary for aftermarket cooler.


----------



## Ceadderman

Yeahup, you need naked bracket.









~Ceadder


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I believe that he's going Naked, so TIM2 application is pointless in that context.
> 
> Performance has g571 for around $8. The trick is to set the whole tube in a cup of hot water which will allow a thinner application but not so thin that push out would clear the die. It's non conductive as well should any get on transistors. I've used it on NB/SB applications with zero issue resultive of too thick an application. Stuff is on my current board under EK mb block.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Well, while I was looking for a supplier of G571, I found this:

http://www.dowcorning.com/content/publishedlit/11-1712-01.pdf





High performance silicone TIM claims to be easy to spread, contract pressure independent, and pump out resistant? Testing is needed 

In NT-H1 land:
It's getting a bit better? Hard to tell at this point. I set a 90 C cut out that'll stop the load cycles and I'm going to let it run until it reaches that point or the DC paste arrives.


----------



## bonami2

I think i got my clu







well now i need to have courage


----------



## Darkz0r

Finally managed to find liquid electrical tape to initiate my delid process. Should be done this week.

Should I bother waiting 24hours for the liquid tape to cure before using my PC? Or just a few minutes/hour is enough for regular low temp use?

Don't really wanna do it and wait full day to turn on again and etc...hehe.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Finally managed to find liquid electrical tape to initiate my delid process. Should be done this week.
> 
> Should I bother waiting 24hours for the liquid tape to cure before using my PC? Or just a few minutes/hour is enough for regular low temp use?
> 
> Don't really wanna do it and wait full day to turn on again and etc...hehe.


Wait a full days to be sure im gonna do it next week i think


----------



## Ceadderman

Just dropped some Thermal Grizzly in my cart. $17 for the hydro version. Gonna check that out an compare it to G751.









It has a nifty screw on applicator tip that helps spread the TIM evenly across the IHS.









~Ceadder


----------



## Exilon

LOL. The flogging worked!



I locked the CPU cooler at fixed RPM so the results can't be compared to yesterday's but it's definitely improving.

Shortened the cycle to 3min load/3min idle.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> This is a before and after playing a full round 1500tik on BF4 metro
> 
> BEFORE
> 
> 
> AFTER
> 
> 
> FPS is the same as have it locked @122 but the higher i go the more responsive it feels. Placebo effect? Maybe.


Report the same thing on a 60hz monitor 120+ fps feel smoother


----------



## LagunaX




----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The Skylake PCB looks thinner, but I bet it's a lot denser and stronger actually. Previous PCB wasn't the greatest on density really.


Have you checked out this thread? http://www.overclock.net/t/1568357/skylake-delidded/0_20


----------



## tatmMRKIV

delidded a g3240 and 3258 to see if I could delid something without killing it in prep for SK. 2/2 successes

yeah that SK pcb looks freaking thin, even if it is more dense thats alot thinner


----------



## JbstormburstADV

As someone who is thinking about delidding my 6700K when i get the money to upgrade from my stock-cooled i7-920 Bloomfield, has someone ever tried using some kind of solvent to get rid of the silicone seal instead of the razor and vice methods? III-V was commenting in the Skylake Delidded thread about it, and after doing some research, I found a research article here about it. Is any of the stuff mentioned on this page available on a small scale, especially the likes of PMA? And how would it be applied?


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> delidded a g3240 and 3258 to see if I could delid something without killing it in prep for SK. 2/2 successes
> 
> yeah that SK pcb looks freaking thin, even if it is more dense thats alot thinner


What method did you use ?

I have my clu in front of me but im too scared gonna wait for the tuning plan to be working and have some extra money in case


----------



## fleetfeather

so stoked on those thin SL PCBs; keen to see the return of the hardcore razor method. The vice-only method has made delidding too _easy_. I for one want to see more carnage in this thread


----------



## tatmMRKIV

I did the razor and it bent the corners, but I tested the cpus and they did what they were supposed to so they worked still...

definitely gonna use a heatgun next time and 2 razors to come in from both sides.

the corners on the g3258 were ******ed difficult though

I dunno if I will have to yet though, I might get a delidded one from someone


----------



## Norlig

Made this with laminate plastic.

Gonna sharpen the edges and try to delid my 3770k with it.

If it does not work that good, gonna visit my grandpa and use his Vice


----------



## Darkz0r

I probably killed my 4770k yesterday. But I'm not 100% sure since I also changed coolers (installed H220X) and re-organized all my cabling/etc.

Used vice only, very slowly, removed the CPU from the vice 3 times when I thought the PCB was chipping/somehow went out of place.

I chipped the PCB on 2 parts, on a corner (very minor chip) and a larger chip on the "C" cut that makes the CPU fit the socket. Though the larger chip on the "C" didn't reach the dark green zone of the chip, AFAIK the light green zone is the chip safety zone and there's nothing running there...
But I could be wrong.

First time I tried to power it on and didn't work I opened the CPU up again, had some CLU on the liquid thermal tape on the VRMs but it seemed to be protected by the tape...but maybe VRMs died and CLU got through. Though seemed very unlikely.

What I'm getting is: power goes on and off, MB turns on for 3 secs and turns off. Fans keep spinning if I use the GB Z87X OC onboard switch for fan testing, all fans are running ok.

I've been testing this with the CPU on the socket (without the CPU cooler mounted, *just for the test*, if it posts I'll cut the power) + CPU fan connected to the mb + 12v connected + main power.
Tried with and without memory (no changes);

I did drop some thermal paste on the MB but cleaned with isopropyl and it was not connected to power the entire time.

Not sure what else to test, the socket seems perfect, no bent pints. Reseted CMOS...I guess I'll just buy another CPU and try lol.
But it does seem strange I get no beeps, no LED message errors, just power on and off (even without the CPU connected!). Seems like something is shorting but again, I never tested the motherboard behavior without any CPU connected..


----------



## LagunaX

Sorry to hear, but I've done vice only for 4-5 chips without problems, the only caveat is that you have to pad the green pcb edge with a fat rubber band or folded paper towel/etc. so the plastic is not against bare metal.

On the flip side, now you have an excuse to get a Devil's Canyon!


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> I probably killed my 4770k yesterday. But I'm not 100% sure since I also changed coolers (installed H220X) and re-organized all my cabling/etc.
> 
> Used vice only, very slowly, removed the CPU from the vice 3 times when I thought the PCB was chipping/somehow went out of place.
> 
> I chipped the PCB on 2 parts, on a corner (very minor chip) and a larger chip on the "C" cut that makes the CPU fit the socket. Though the larger chip on the "C" didn't reach the dark green zone of the chip, AFAIK the light green zone is the chip safety zone and there's nothing running there...
> But I could be wrong.
> 
> First time I tried to power it on and didn't work I opened the CPU up again, had some CLU on the liquid thermal tape on the VRMs but it seemed to be protected by the tape...but maybe VRMs died and CLU got through. Though seemed very unlikely.
> 
> What I'm getting is: power goes on and off, MB turns on for 3 secs and turns off. Fans keep spinning if I use the GB Z87X OC onboard switch for fan testing, all fans are running ok.
> 
> I've been testing this with the CPU on the socket (without the CPU cooler mounted, *just for the test*, if it posts I'll cut the power) + CPU fan connected to the mb + 12v connected + main power.
> Tried with and without memory (no changes);
> 
> I did drop some thermal paste on the MB but cleaned with isopropyl and it was not connected to power the entire time.
> 
> Not sure what else to test, the socket seems perfect, no bent pints. Reseted CMOS...I guess I'll just buy another CPU and try lol.
> But it does seem strange I get no beeps, no LED message errors, just power on and off (even without the CPU connected!). Seems like something is shorting but again, I never tested the motherboard behavior without any CPU connected..


When I first did my delid, I thought I killed my chip too. Turns out I was doing what you sound like you are doing. Kept getting 00 error code. The chip has to be locked into the socket, not just sitting on the socket. The arm that pushes on the IHS must be clamping it in. If you have not been doing this, try again.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

try loosening screws before clamping with lid on and then line up lid, and tighten screws to finish the job


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> When I first did my delid, I thought I killed my chip too. Turns out I was doing what you sound like you are doing. Kept getting 00 error code. The chip has to be locked into the socket, not just sitting on the socket. The arm that pushes on the IHS must be clamping it in. If you have not been doing this, try again.


I did close the cage but only tried once with the cooler installed (and thus making pressure on the chip). Maybe its not making proper contact? I was using a NH D14 before and it was uber tight (no bent pins though, haswell socket pins are already sideways and everything seems lined up!)

Even with the cage closed I noticed it's not really super tight though, since there's no cooler pressure.

You have a good idea, I'll try cleaning everything again when I get home, re-applying the liquid electrical tape (since I thought it could be messing things up I took it off, but since it has 0 conductivity makes no sense right...), re-attaching the H220X and let's see what happens!

If the CPU is really dead or something, will I get the same behavior (turning on and off) or will I get beeps/led codes? I read threads all over on people with the same symptoms, some of them ****ed up the VRMs (not my case I'm sure), some of them had bad RAM slots and others just failed the delid it seemed.


----------



## bonami2

About 10 layer of electric tape

Do you think it safe with that world war 2 vice


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> About 10 layer of electric tape
> 
> Do you think it safe with that world war 2 vice


I started doing it with tape but noticed it was actually worse for a good grip and damaged a bit my CPU with the tape. After I took the tape off, managed to do it faster and without damage.

Don't take my word for it since I'm not expert but tape was actually worse for me, since it wrinkles and the grip isn't that good.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> About 10 layer of electric tape
> 
> Do you think it safe with that world war 2 vice
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


10 layers sounds a bit excessive, 1-2 layers sounds more reasonable. The idea behind the tape is to minimize/eliminate the metal-to-PCB contact.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> About 10 layer of electric tape
> 
> Do you think it safe with that world war 2 vice
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Wow either that vice is REALLY Methusela ancient or somebody isn't wiping it down with 3n1 oil to protect it. I would be scurred to delid a chip in that.
















Sorry but that was the first thing that my OCD focused on.









~Ceadder


----------



## LagunaX

Went for [email protected] stress testing on air - 74c max, not bad after a delid!


----------



## Jimbags

1.28V for 4.9Ghz is awesome!


----------



## Darkz0r

Did some more testing, I think I killed it indeed. New CPU will be here in a few days ;(

Cleaned everything, even the CPU socket with a soft brush and isopropyl...still the same, turns on and off, no POST, no beeps, nothing, just a click and power on and off. =/

Tried some liquid electrical tape on the CPU PCB that was chipped on the vice but didn't help. I've seen some pretty bad PCBs that worked on other threads, I guess I just got really unlucky and hit something important.

I'll post some pics later on the state of the PCB for discussion's sake









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Went for [email protected] stress testing on air - 74c max, not bad after a delid!


Congrats!! Pretty nice! I would be happy with 4.7-8 with good low volts even!


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Wow either that vice is REALLY Methusela ancient or somebody isn't wiping it down with 3n1 oil to protect it. I would be scurred to delid a chip in that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry but that was the first thing that my OCD focused on.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


your right it pretty old and it full of grease oil or idk my old uncle put on it.... Rest in peace uncle i have no idea what you did with that thing ahah.

Well i got a free vice so im happy

I did clean it with soap it aint greesy to the touch and wont take on the cpu

I expected to put the cpu tight in the Electric tape to prevent it from Breaking appart while smashing it or prying it..

You know to not chip it in piece like the 2 last guy did and kill them


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Apparently skylake is deliddable


----------



## LagunaX

Right, Splave has a thread here called Skylake Delidded.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Apparently skylake is deliddable


Yep, I posted this (along with a link to the thread) a couple of days ago....


----------



## fleetfeather

apparently Devils Canyon is delidable


----------



## bonami2

So i smash or i pry..... This is the hardest question in my entire life the 4790k is now 430$ in canada..........................................................


----------



## EvilWiffles

Thought I posted this but here


http://imgur.com/wP98C


Dropped temps normally at 71c max to 60-63c, that is with rendering a 13minute video in Handbrake.

GPU temps didn't do anything though but it's whatever. Used nail polish on the sides, didn't want to risk CLU touching the aluminum.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Apparently skylake is deliddable


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> apparently Devils Canyon is delidable


You don't say.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> so stoked on those thin SL PCBs; keen to see the return of the hardcore razor method. The vice-only method has made delidding too _easy_. I for one want to see more carnage in this thread


Thinner but denser, or so they say.
With good vice grips it doesn't change anything. You don't want to use the crosshatch grips but grips with horizontal grooves instead, that way the cpu doesn't move vertically and is not damaged by any vertical grooves. Of course lots of new vices have the crosshatch type. Some have flat, you could make a slot into flat ones. People seem to cover the crosshatched ones with paper, towels, tape, what ever comes into their hands with varying success or destruction.
Except that the SL TIM seems to be awful just like on HW. A step back from DC again? Or what is your experience?


----------



## stoker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Report the same thing on a 60hz monitor 120+ fps feel smoother
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stoker*
> 
> This is a before and after playing a full round 1500tik on BF4 metro
> 
> BEFORE
> 
> 
> AFTER
> 
> 
> FPS is the same as have it locked @122 but the higher i go the more responsive it feels. Placebo effect? Maybe.
Click to expand...

Its hard to give an actuate result since its coming into spring and the ambient temp was not measured but i think the CLU has given me maybe another 1-2C.

BTW i'm mainly using the 4.7 1.28v profile now


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> You don't say.
> Thinner but denser, or so they say.
> With good vice grips it doesn't change anything. You don't want to use the crosshatch grips but grips with horizontal grooves instead, that way the cpu doesn't move vertically and is not damaged by any vertical grooves. Of course lots of new vices have the crosshatch type. Some have flat, you could make a slot into flat ones. People seem to cover the crosshatched ones with paper, towels, tape, what ever comes into their hands with varying success or destruction.
> Except that the SL TIM seems to be awful just like on HW. A step back from DC again? Or what is your experience?


I haven't seen anything that indicates that Skylake's PCB is any more dense than Haswell's. The only thing was someone in this thread saying something to the effect of "It's thinner but _probably_ more dense".

I have, however, seen pics of a chipped Skylake PCB from the vice method. So I wouldn't put too much stock into believing it's more dense, personally.









http://www.overclock.net/t/1568357/skylake-delidded/0_20 - check out the 3rd pic down.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> You don't say.
> Thinner but denser, or so they say.
> With good vice grips it doesn't change anything. You don't want to use the crosshatch grips but grips with horizontal grooves instead, that way the cpu doesn't move vertically and is not damaged by any vertical grooves. Of course lots of new vices have the crosshatch type. Some have flat, you could make a slot into flat ones. People seem to cover the crosshatched ones with paper, towels, tape, what ever comes into their hands with varying success or destruction.
> Except that the SL TIM seems to be awful just like on HW. A step back from DC again? Or what is your experience?


The ihs is denser. It's the same size but about 4g heavier. I doubt they'd make the pcb denser. Honestly they probably did it to discourage delidding


----------



## JackCY

The IHS is bigger = taller because the PCB is thinner due to lack of features on the CPU, that's why it's heavier by a tiny bit to, this way it keeps the same cooling mount specs. Denser I don't know, don't care it's still a PCB not a piece of hardened steel. Treat it as such.
There are all sorts of vices and grips for them, just because someone messes it up with the vice and grip they had doesn't mean suddenly vice is dangerous








Still far better than cutting around with a razor and hope you don't scratch it.

All in all, I would rather get a Haswell-E than Skylake when the prices has gotten even more close between 4 and 6 core.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> The IHS is bigger = taller because the PCB is thinner due to lack of features on the CPU, that's why it's heavier by a tiny bit to, this way it keeps the same cooling mount specs. Denser I don't know, don't care it's still a PCB not a piece of hardened steel. Treat it as such.
> There are all sorts of vices and grips for them, just because someone messes it up with the vice and grip they had doesn't mean suddenly vice is dangerous
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still far better than cutting around with a razor and hope you don't scratch it.
> 
> All in all, I would rather get a Haswell-E than Skylake when the prices has gotten even more close between 4 and 6 core.


Yes I agree...I didnt know that the ihs was taller. That would make sense.


----------



## Anusha

Want to know one thing. Delidding won't make my case internals run cooler, right? The amount of heat that gets dumped into the case from the AIO water cooler with fan as intake *is still pretty much the same*, right? (Of course there would be less heat due to lower resistance from lower operating temps, but how much delta would that be? 10W?)

I'm running the 4790K @ 1.24V without delid at the moment.


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anusha*
> 
> Want to know one thing. Delidding won't make my case internals run cooler, right? The amount of heat that gets dumped into the case from the AIO water cooler with fan as intake *is still pretty much the same*, right? (Of course there would be less heat due to lower resistance from lower operating temps, but how much delta would that be? 10W?)
> 
> I'm running the 4790K @ 1.24V without delid at the moment.


If anything you should see more heat leaving the cooler. If you're running the same overclock, you're still cooling the same load. Since the heat transfer from the cores is more efficient after a delid, more heat can be dissipated through the cooling system.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

your airflow, bud... Improve exhaust


----------



## incog

By the way, isn't the new best method supposed to use a hair dryer?

you heat up the chip with a hair dryer, the epoxy glue gets hot and you can slowly but surely wiggle off the IHS?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> By the way, isn't the new best method supposed to use a hair dryer?
> 
> you heat up the chip with a hair dryer, the epoxy glue gets hot and you can slowly but surely wiggle off the IHS?


I never heard of anyone saying that this is possible.

When I delidded my 3570k, the glue did not look like epoxy. It seemed a bit like rubber and I thought it was some sort of silicone glue.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> By the way, isn't the new best method supposed to use a hair dryer?
> 
> you heat up the chip with a hair dryer, the epoxy glue gets hot and you can slowly but surely wiggle off the IHS?


Heatgun = Hair drier on less more heat. Get your heat gun out use lowest setting and vice that sucka.









~Ceadder


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I never heard of anyone saying that this is possible.
> 
> When I delidded my 3570k, the glue did not look like epoxy. It seemed a bit like rubber and I thought it was some sort of silicone glue.


Wiggling it off might be hard, but the glue gets fairly weak under a heat gun and easily shears under the vise method. Hair dryer won't get hot enough.


----------



## incog

Ah so you need an actual heat gun

I don't have one

this is what i'm talking about btw : 




not sure about bending though

i delidded my 4670 for kicks using vice and hammer personally but since skylake has a thinner pcb


----------



## Exilon

I don't think the hair dryer was doing all that much there. Commercial hair dryers are designed to not set humans on fire and they move a lot of air over the heating elements, so the temperature is about 60C.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anusha*
> 
> Want to know one thing. Delidding won't make my case internals run cooler, right? The amount of heat that gets dumped into the case from the AIO water cooler with fan as intake *is still pretty much the same*, right? (Of course there would be less heat due to lower resistance from lower operating temps, but how much delta would that be? 10W?)
> 
> I'm running the 4790K @ 1.24V without delid at the moment.


It might be a little cooler but mostly negligible. Delidding is all about improving the heat transfer to copper vs letting the heat leak as it would in an inefficient situation. Overall heat generated by the CPU is the same. The transfer to copper is more efficient so the aio will take more heat out. Your room might get a little hotter.


----------



## Anusha

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> It might be a little cooler but mostly negligible.


Cooler for the CPU or system?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Delidding is all about improving the heat transfer to copper vs letting the heat leak as it would in an inefficient situation. Overall heat generated by the CPU is the same. The transfer to copper is more efficient so the aio will take more heat out. Your room might get a little hotter.


But heat is still dumped into the case. Either through leakage or through the rad. So in my case, I will see absolutely no difference in case internal temps, right?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anusha*
> 
> Cooler for the CPU or system?
> But heat is still dumped into the case. Either through leakage or through the rad. So in my case, I will see absolutely no difference in case internal temps, right?


If anything the internals of the case would be Coker due to more efficient heat transfer. The room should get hotter if everything is configured right. Unless your rad fans are setup to push air in vs out.


----------



## Anusha

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> If anything the internals of the case would be Coker due to more efficient heat transfer. The room should get hotter if everything is configured right. Unless your rad fans are setup to push air in vs out.


Currently the fan on the rad is pulling cool air in from the front.

I still don't understand how it can get any warmer if the generated heat is still pretty much the same.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anusha*
> 
> Currently the fan on the rad is pulling cool air in from the front.
> 
> I still don't understand how it can get any warmer if the generated heat is still pretty much the same.


Heat generated would be the same. Heat dissipated would be greater due to the greater efficiency gained from delidding.

If you're pulling air from outside in, then your case would get warmer slightly.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Heat generated would be the same. Heat dissipated would be greater due to the greater efficiency gained from delidding.
> 
> If you're pulling air from outside in, then your case would get warmer slightly.


That's not how it works. When the system reaches equilibrium, the heat being dissipated to the air is EXACTLY the same as the heat produced at the CPU. With delidding the equilibrium is reached sooner, but when that equilibrium is reached, the effect it has on the room's air is exactly the same.

Think of it like this: You have a container into which you are pouring water at a certain rate (this represents the rate you are using energy, i.e. power). At the bottom of that container is a hole, in the case of a regular chip there is a smaller hole, while the delidded chip has a larger hole. This water flows out of the container at a certain rate and is at equilibrium when the amount going in is the same as that coming out, meaning the inside of the container stays at the same level. With the larger hole, the container only needs to be, say, half full to provide enough pressure to acheive this flow. When you change to the container with the smaller hole, the water will need to reach a higher level, with a higher pressure, to reach the same outflow as the inflow. At the end of the day you get out exactly what goes in, but in one case you are storing less energy internally because it can escape more easily.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> That's not how it works. When the system reaches equilibrium, the heat being dissipated to the air is EXACTLY the same as the heat produced at the CPU. With delidding the equilibrium is reached sooner, but when that equilibrium is reached, the effect it has on the room's air is exactly the same.
> 
> Think of it like this: You have a container into which you are pouring water at a certain rate (this represents the rate you are using energy, i.e. power). At the bottom of that container is a hole, in the case of a regular chip there is a smaller hole, while the delidded chip has a larger hole. This water flows out of the container at a certain rate and is at equilibrium when the amount going in is the same as that coming out, meaning the inside of the container stays at the same level. With the larger hole, the container only needs to be, say, half full to provide enough pressure to acheive this flow. When you change to the container with the smaller hole, the water will need to reach a higher level, with a higher pressure, to reach the same outflow as the inflow. At the end of the day you get out exactly what goes in, but in one case you are storing less energy internally because it can escape more easily.


I get what you're saying but I think he's talking about the heat that's being dumped into the case by the rads thrmselces. In that case it really depends on his ventilation. I guess if he had good ventilation then yea everything should remain equal. I really don't think there's any issue of equilibrium here. A greater amount of heat will be dumped into the water as opposed to without delidding due to greater heat transfer. The water will get hotter all else being equal. More heat is dumped. Therefore the internals of the case will get hotter unless he has fans to blow hot case air out. Which I'm assuming he does. So in that case overall there should be a negligible increase if any.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I get what you're saying but I think he's talking about the heat that's being dumped into the case by the rads thrmselces. In that case it really depends on his ventilation. I guess if he had good ventilation then yea everything should remain equal. I really don't think there's any issue of equilibrium here. *A greater amount of heat will be dumped into the water as opposed to without delidding due to greater heat transfer. The water will get hotter all else being equal. More heat is dumped.* Therefore the internals of the case will get hotter unless he has fans to blow hot case air out. Which I'm assuming he does. So in that case overall there should be a negligible increase if any.


This is untrue. Heat transfer rate does not change when you decrease the thermal resistance at the die and IHS. It still removes the same amount of heat as before, just at a lower temperature.


----------



## blaze2210

Delidding does nothing to change the amount of heat being generated, you're just streamlining the transfer of that heat. Since the heat is being moved away quicker, the temps don't build up and rise.


----------



## OCNinja

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Yeahup, you need naked bracket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


could you give some examples of naked bracket? what do them look like?


----------



## Anusha

Ok, I won't really benefit from delidding as I won't OC any higher. the heat that is generated with the CPU @ 4.5GHz with 1.24V is already pretty high for the SG13.

But running the CPU at a lower temp means less resistance in internal connections and less heat generation. How much power would I save by delidding the CPU, if the Vcore and clock speed are same before and after the delid? Has anyone done tests on this regard?


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anusha*
> 
> Ok, I won't really benefit from delidding as I won't OC any higher. the heat that is generated with the CPU @ 4.5GHz with 1.24V is already pretty high for the SG13.
> 
> But running the CPU at a lower temp means less resistance in internal connections and less heat generation. How much power would I save by delidding the CPU, if the Vcore and clock speed are same before and after the delid? Has anyone done tests on this regard?


When benching outside and dropping ambient hence load temps 20C, the cpu power package consistently drops a few watts at max high load, seen that many times, simply less leakage at colder temps.

That few watts, only at high load, wouldnt add up to any significant savings with normal use.

The reason to delid is if temps are inhibiting your ocing. On 4790k, that occured at 1.28v range/4.7ish.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OCNinja*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Yeahup, you need naked bracket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> could you give some examples of naked bracket? what do them look like?
Click to expand...

Sure...



















~Ceadder


----------



## Anusha

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> When benching outside and dropping ambient hence load temps 20C, the cpu power package consistently drops a few watts at max high load, seen that many times, simply less leakage at colder temps.
> 
> That few watts, only at high load, wouldnt add up to any significant savings with normal use.
> 
> The reason to delid is if temps are inhibiting your ocing. On 4790k, that occured at 1.28v range/4.7ish.


How much is 'few watts'? Like 10W? 20W? 20W can be significant in a case as tiny as the SG13 with no exhaust fans.


----------



## crun

I am leaning toward the idea of deliding my i5-4670k. Hopefuly it would get me to x46 (x44 currently as temperatures to get x45 stable were too high), but - obviously - I am a little terrified that I'll break my CPU.

Hopefuly someone experienced could answer the five questions below:

- Rougly, how many people have destroyed their CPU using the vice method?

- Regarding the liquid metal (Collabatory Liquid TIM) which everybody seem to be using - it absolutely CANNOT drop outside the chip itself (>>PICTURE HERE<< - Ivy Bridge seems to be missing the yellow dot thingies next to die) or I can expect the processor to pretty much die?

- According to >>THIS<<, NT-H1 is almost as effective as liquid metal. How durable are both TIMs? Will they last a year or two, or after few months I will have to clean and reapply the thermal paste on the die?

- Any issues with deliding on the long run? After a year or two?

- I've read some posts that the temperatures didn't drop for some people, that they had to lap the IHS first to see the effects. FOR REAL?!

Btw. no point replacing my Mugen 2 I assume?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> This is untrue. Heat transfer rate does not change when you decrease the thermal resistance at the die and IHS. It still removes the same amount of heat as before, just at a lower temperature.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> That's not how it works. When the system reaches equilibrium, the heat being dissipated to the air is EXACTLY the same as the heat produced at the CPU. With delidding the equilibrium is reached sooner, but when that equilibrium is reached, the effect it has on the room's air is exactly the same.
> 
> Think of it like this: You have a container into which you are pouring water at a certain rate (this represents the rate you are using energy, i.e. power). At the bottom of that container is a hole, in the case of a regular chip there is a smaller hole, while the delidded chip has a larger hole. This water flows out of the container at a certain rate and is at equilibrium when the amount going in is the same as that coming out, meaning the inside of the container stays at the same level. With the larger hole, the container only needs to be, say, half full to provide enough pressure to acheive this flow. When you change to the container with the smaller hole, the water will need to reach a higher level, with a higher pressure, to reach the same outflow as the inflow. At the end of the day you get out exactly what goes in, but in one case you are storing less energy internally because it can escape more easily.


Ok I think you guys are misunderstanding what I'm saying. The overall heat generated by the CPU is the same no doubt. But the heat dissipated has to be greater. How else would the temps be lower? The leakage of heat to surroundings is lower due to a more efficient transfer between die and IHS to the block. Therefore. MORE HEAT WILL BE DUMPED INTO THE CASE SINCE MORE HEAT IS BEING DISSIPATED.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crun*
> 
> I am leaning toward the idea of deliding my i5-4670k. Hopefuly it would get me to x46 (x44 currently as temperatures to get x45 stable were too high), but - obviously - I am a little terrified that I'll break my CPU.
> 
> Hopefuly someone experienced could answer the five questions below:
> 
> - Rougly, how many people have destroyed their CPU using the vice method?
> 
> - Regarding the liquid metal (Collabatory Liquid TIM) which everybody seem to be using - it absolutely CANNOT drop outside the chip itself (>>PICTURE HERE<< - Ivy Bridge seems to be missing the yellow dot thingies next to die) or I can expect the processor to pretty much die?
> 
> - According to >>THIS<<, NT-H1 is almost as effective as liquid metal. How durable are both TIMs? Will they last a year or two, or after few months I will have to clean and reapply the thermal paste on the die?
> 
> - Any issues with deliding on the long run? After a year or two?
> 
> - I've read some posts that the temperatures didn't drop for some people, that they had to lap the IHS first to see the effects. FOR REAL?!
> 
> Btw. no point replacing my Mugen 2 I assume?


You should read or watch every delidding guide you can find before attempting. There's no sense in waiting around for someone to gather that info for you. You found the right thread, and there's a lot of info in here.









NOTE: NT-H1 is nowhere close to the performance of CLU/CLP - unless we're talking about applying it between the IHS and the cooler. In that case, CLU/CLP still generally outperforms other TIMs by at least a couple degrees. Between the IHS and the CPU die is where CLU/CLP really shines. CLP is definitely still good after a year, as I learned myself after pulling my 4670K to check on it.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anusha*
> 
> How much is 'few watts'? Like 10W? 20W? 20W can be significant in a case as tiny as the SG13 with no exhaust fans.


Less than 10W if I recall correctly and it varies some per cpu, but I said a few b/c dont remember exactly as it was ~7-8 years ago when first measured it on Xtremesystems site when discussing with unclewebb (author realtemp). But basically just have to run steady state load like prime same ffts and watch the cpu package power (say like 180-185W range) then lift computer and set it outside with 20C cooler ambient hence water temps, and watch the wattage range drop, bring back inside, watch it climb back to same range.

If I could find that post could give exact numbers, but Im rge there, and too many posts to look through, and not even 100% sure it was on that site.

If it were winter here, I could tell you in a very short time for my current cpu.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Ok I think you guys are misunderstanding what I'm saying. *The overall heat generated by the CPU is the same no doubt. But the heat dissipated has to be greater. How else would the temps be lower?* The leakage of heat to surroundings is lower due to a more efficient transfer between die and IHS to the block. Therefore. MORE HEAT WILL BE DUMPED INTO THE CASE SINCE MORE HEAT IS BEING DISSIPATED.


That part is wrong and it's leading you to bad conclusions.

Temperatures are lower because the same amount of heat can be transferred over the die-IHS interface at a lower die temperature. The IHS still gets as hot as before because the IHS to cold plate thermal resistance hasn't changed. The rest of the water cooling system still sees the same load at the IHS junction.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> NOTE: NT-H1 is nowhere close to the performance of CLU/CLP - unless we're talking about applying it between the IHS and the cooler. In that case, CLU/CLP still generally outperforms other TIMs by at least a couple degrees. Between the IHS and the CPU die is where CLU/CLP really shines. CLP is definitely still good after a year, as I learned myself after pulling my 4670K to check on it.


Yeah, don't use NT-H1. It'll pump out and you'll have pre-delid temperatures within 6 months of normal usage.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> That part is wrong and it's leading you to bad conclusions.
> 
> *Temperatures are lower because the same amount of heat can be transferred over the die-IHS interface at a lower die temperature.* The IHS still gets as hot as before because the IHS to cold plate thermal resistance hasn't changed. The rest of the water cooling system still sees the same load at the IHS junction.
> Yeah, don't use NT-H1. It'll pump out and you'll have pre-delid temperatures within 6 months of normal usage.


Theres a few things that are well established. 1. When you improve conduction, more heat flows from hot to cold. 2. The stock TIM is more insulating than CLU/CLP, so it retains more heat than CLU/CLP 3. When you have a water-cooling loop more efficient heat transfer would dump more heat into the loop.

So based on your comment, the CPU would just operate at a lower wattage due to the delid? Thats not how it works. You're not going in and changing the behavior of the CPU, you're just pulling more heat from it. By that logic if I'm working all day outside and dripping sweat, then go inside, my body begins operating at a lower temperature and thats why i stop sweating. It has nothing to do with the fact that I'm now in a colder environment and the heat is being convected away, right?

How does the conduction of heat work? heat flows from a hotter surface to a colder surface. The better the conductor, the more easily it can wick heat away right? CLU/CLP are far better than the stock TIM so it wicks more heat into the IHS from the CPU. That is why the CPU operates at a lower temperature. LOWER TEMPS MEANS MORE HEAT IS BEING PULLED I.E. CONDUCTED AWAY FROM THE CPU. This is thermodynamics 101. I would advise you look into the mechanism of the carnot engine, which explains efficiency in relationship to heat in vs. heat out.

The CPU is operating at the same wattage, which means its pumping the same amount of heat out at the die. The cooling system is made more efficient after the delid process.

Use gelid gc extreme. Its free with EK kits.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Use gelid gc extreme. Its free with EK kits.


Between the die and the IHS, it's a waste of time to use anything besides CLU/CLP - this has been repeatedly established. Between the IHS and the cooler, I definitely support GC Extreme. It spreads like thick peanut butter on a cold day, but it's great stuff.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Between the die and the IHS, it's a waste of time to use anything besides CLU/CLP - this has been repeatedly established. Between the IHS and the cooler, I definitely support GC Extreme. It spreads like thick peanut butter on a cold day, but it's great stuff.


Yea thats what i was implying. I run the naked ivy kit but if you're using the IHS, i would recommend using the CLU between die-IHS and use gelid GC extreme between the cooler-IHS


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Theres a few things that are well established. 1. When you improve conduction, more heat flows from hot to cold. 2. The stock TIM is more insulating than CLU/CLP, so it retains more heat than CLU/CLP 3. When you have a water-cooling loop more efficient heat transfer would dump more heat into the loop.
> 
> So based on your comment, the CPU would just operate at a lower wattage due to the delid? Thats not how it works. You're not going in and changing the behavior of the CPU, you're just pulling more heat from it. By that logic if I'm working all day outside and dripping sweat, then go inside, my body begins operating at a lower temperature and thats why i stop sweating. It has nothing to do with the fact that I'm now in a colder environment and the heat is being convected away, right?
> 
> How does the conduction of heat work? heat flows from a hotter surface to a colder surface. The better the conductor, the more easily it can wick heat away right? CLU/CLP are far better than the stock TIM so it wicks more heat into the IHS from the CPU. That is why the CPU operates at a lower temperature. LOWER TEMPS MEANS MORE HEAT IS BEING PULLED I.E. CONDUCTED AWAY FROM THE CPU. This is thermodynamics 101. I would advise you look into the mechanism of the carnot engine, which explains efficiency in relationship to heat in vs. heat out.
> 
> The CPU is operating at the same wattage, which means its pumping the same amount of heat out at the die. The cooling system is made more efficient after the delid process.


No, CPU operates at same wattage. Your analogy involves a change in heat output, so I don't know what point you're trying to make there. A real comparison is like taking a coat off outside. There's just a lower temperature gradient because the same amount of heat can be moved.

Your confusion here is that you think heat flow is constant. It's not. It scales with temperature. The better the conductor, lower the temperature gradient it needs to move the same amount heat. Therefore the CPU operates at a lower temperature at the same wattage when delidded. No, this is not thermodynamics 101, or you wouldn't have such a hard time understand it.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> No, CPU operates at same wattage. Your analogy involves a change in heat output, so I don't know what point you're trying to make there. A real comparison is like taking a coat off outside. There's just a lower temperature gradient because the same amount of heat can be moved.
> 
> *Your confusion here is that you think heat flow is constant. It's not. It scales with temperature. The better the conductor, lower the temperature gradient it needs to move the same amount heat. Therefore the CPU operates at a lower temperature at the same wattage when delidded. No, this is not thermodynamics 101* , or you wouldn't have such a hard time understand it.


Dude im not having a hard time understanding it. You're failing to comprehend the logic here. HOW ON EARTH IS THIS NOT THERMODYNAMICS 101???
At a specific wattage, a specific amount of heat is produced. The role of the conductor is to pull that heat off. Heat flow is constant at a specific wattage. Wattage fluctuates so in that sense yea i guess it scales, but not with temperature. Temp is a function of how much heat is being pulled off vs how much is being generated. Ask yourself then how it's colder inside an air conditioned room. Answer: heat is being stripped away from the hot room. The same heat is being generated, but heat is also being stripped away. In the same sense, the heat generated by the cpu is being pulled off by the cooler, and more efficiently by the delidded IHS than the stock IHS. All delidding does is improve the heat conduction interface. THERMODYNAMICS 101!

As the heat is being stripped away, it gives a chance for a lower temperature since the stock tim is insulating relative to the CLU, which is nearly 100% conducting. That means more heat is being put into the system, though only by a marginal amount.

im not sure how much clearer i can be about this. This is pretty basic thermodynamics.


----------



## deepor

@Pinnacle Fit:

You are wrong. The physics and math involved, I don't know the details. There is an integral involved there, and it's scary. I'd like to take a step back and ignore those and just play some logic games instead: if the heat-sink dumps more heat into its surroundings, this just can't be right as it would mean there is more energy added to the room compared to before the delid. Laws of thermodynamics says this can't happen if the CPU still uses the same amount of power.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> @Pinnacle Fit:
> 
> You are wrong. The physics and math involved, I don't know the details. There is an integral involved there, and it's scary. I'd like to take a step back and ignore those and just play some logic games instead: if the heat-sink dumps more heat into its surroundings, this just can't be right as it would mean there is more energy added to the room compared to before the delid. Laws of thermodynamics says this can't happen if the CPU still uses the same amount of power.


What? When did i say that? I said that there was a heat leakage due to the insulating nature of the stock tim. There is a more efficient conduction due to the CLU.

You didnt follow the entire argument. His rads are set up to dump hot air into the case, rather than push it out, so yea more hot air would be dumped into the case.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> What? When did i say that? I said that there was a heat leakage due to the insulating nature of the stock tim. There is a more efficient conduction due to the CLU.
> 
> You didnt follow the entire argument. His rads are set up to dump hot air into the case, rather than push it out, so yea more hot air would be dumped into the case.


No it wouldn't. Where's the extra heat coming from? The radiator is dissipating 150W before and 150W after.

The only thing that changes is the temperature gradient at the die and IHS.

Okay, let's go step and step and figure out where you're getting confused.
Quote:


> At a specific wattage, a specific amount of heat is produced.


True
Quote:


> The role of the conductor is to pull that heat off.


Okay.
Quote:


> Heat flow is constant at a specific wattage. Wattage fluctuates so in that sense yea i guess it scales, but not with temperature.


False. Heat flow is characterized by temperature.

dQ/dt is heat flow over time, in other words, wattage.
Area A is constant.

So therefore if k (thermal conductivity) or x (distance) decreases, temperate at that junction to transfer Q watts decreases.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

-


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> No it wouldn't. Where's the extra heat coming from? The radiator is dissipating 150W before and 150W after.
> 
> The only thing that changes is the temperature gradient at the die and IHS.
> 
> Okay, let's go step and step and figure out where you're getting confused.
> True
> Okay.
> False. Heat flow is characterized by temperature.
> 
> dQ/dt is heat flow over time, in other words, wattage.
> Area A is constant.
> 
> So therefore if k (thermal conductivity) or x (distance) decreases, temperate at that junction to transfer Q watts decreases.


Yea i mispoke q=(T2-T1)

Where did you get the 150W before and after? is that based on math? Lets assume A and delta x are both constant. In this case the distance would be delta y, but thats splitting hairs. I can prove my point based on thermal coefficient alone.

This comparison is just based on the thermal conductivity alone. Ive set the distances to be constant, and the Areas are constant between both samples.

In the no delid case, Th is 100, and Tl is 40, and the conductivity is 0.5.
In the delid case, Th is 80, Tl is 35, and conducitvity is full (1.0)

These are just estimates meant to illustrate my point, they are not fact.

Here is my math. At the end, you can see that more Watts are dissipated in the delid case based on thermal conductivity alone.

The formula is actually rate of heat flow = -kA(dT)/x. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rate_of_heat_flow

I didn't realize this so I did the equation taking the thickness out of consideration. But after accounting for it here, it proves my point even more.



Youre welcome to do the math on your own using your own numbers.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Where did you get the 150W before and after?


150W is to give you a solid number so you can work with it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> is that based on math? Lets assume A and delta x are both constant. In this case the distance would be delta y, but thats splitting hairs. I can prove my point based on thermal coefficient alone.


That's because you're using the equation wrong. You solved for "how much heat can we dissipate given dT and k" instead of "given constant Q, what's the dT". Q is a constant in this discussion. You can't just pull T1 and T2 out of thin air and assign an arbitrary k to it to prove your point. T1 is dependent on T2 and k.



If you follow this thermal circuit diagram and solve it like you would an eletrical circuit, you should be able to see that modifying Rjc at constant Q and Tamb only changes Tj. Tc and Th are independent of Rjc.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> 150W is to give you a solid number so you can work with it.
> That's because you're using the equation wrong. Q is a constant in this discussion. You can't just pull T1 and T2 out of thin air and assign an arbitrary k to it to prove your point. T1 is dependent on T2 and k.
> 
> 
> 
> If you follow this thermal circuit diagram and solve it like you would an eletrical circuit, you should be able to see that modifying Rjc at constant Q and Tamb only changes Tj. Tc and Th are independent of Rjc.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> 150W is to give you a solid number so you can work with it.
> That's because you're using the equation wrong. Q is a constant in this discussion. You can't just pull T1 and T2 out of thin air and assign an arbitrary k to it to prove your point. T1 is dependent on T2 and k.
> 
> 
> 
> If you follow this thermal circuit diagram and solve it like you would an eletrical circuit, you should be able to see that modifying Rjc at constant Q and Tamb only changes Tj. Tc and Th are independent of Rjc.


so 150 was a solid number but my numbers were arbitrary huh?
omg this is getting ridiculous. they weren't arbitrary numbers. The T values were in line with what they would be in real life. Even the k values fall in line. We can both agree that K would be higher for CLU vs the stock TIM. Solve based on this and you'll see my point.

How on earth is Q a constant in this equation? Q is the variable we're solving for. Why would you put an electrical circuit diagram on a thermal conduction problem? you're leaving out the two chief variables here. K and X

Im not using the equation wrong. Have you attempted to use the equation? Even if you used constant T1 and T2 values, if the thermal coefficient is different (which it absolutely would be between CLU and the stock TIM), you'd end up with a different overall delta Q/T aka Watts dissipated.

I don't think you can use this diagram to illustrate your point. It doesn't take everything into account. Before you comment further, i want to see your math on the previous equation since you insist I used it wrong. I can assure you my math is right.

You;re wrong on this, my math proves it using YOUR equation. You haven't shown me your math so Ill assume you haven't actually used it.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> What? When did i say that? I said that there was a heat leakage due to the insulating nature of the stock tim. There is a more efficient conduction due to the CLU.
> 
> You didnt follow the entire argument. His rads are set up to dump hot air into the case, rather than push it out, so yea more hot air would be dumped into the case.


You are again saying it right here... when you say that more hot air gets dumped into the environment, this means there's more energy added to the room, which can't be right: the place where energy is added into the space is at the CPU, and its power use stays the same.

I don't dare to try my hand at the physics/math involved. I'm sure I will make mistakes because of misunderstanding what the formulas are about exactly. I did that a lot whenever I had to do physics, so I'd like to only talk about this stuff like an idiot:

The zeroth law of thermodynamics supposedly can mean "all diathermal walls are equivalent." This means if you for example put a thermometer in the fridge but package it up in a glove or something, it will still work as if it's naked and show the same temperature (after some waiting).

I have no idea what to do with the formulas to make this "all diathermal walls are equivalent" show up through the math.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> You are again saying it right here... when you say that more hot air gets dumped into the environment, this means there's more energy added to the room, which can't be right: the place where energy is added into the space is at the CPU, and its power use stays the same.
> 
> I don't dare to try my hand at the physics/math involved. I'm sure I will make mistakes because of misunderstanding what the formulas are about exactly. I did that a lot whenever I had to do physics, so I'd like to only talk about this stuff like an idiot:
> 
> The zeroth law of thermodynamics supposedly can mean "all diathermal walls are equivalent." This means if you for example put a thermometer in the fridge but package it up in a glove or something, it will still work as if it's naked and show the same temperature (after some waiting).
> 
> I have no idea what to do with the formulas to make this "all diathermal walls are equivalent" show up through the math.


In a perfect world the diathermal walls tenet would be true. Like if you held a thermometer in a gloved hand.

Its because you're not considering the fact that the water is a heat dump. There is a more efficient heat transfer due to a. the thermal interface material and b. the reduced distance between the ihs and die. Both play a critical factor. In the equation i used the thermal coefficient value of 1.0 for CLU vs 0.5 for the stock TIM, but lets say its much closer like 1.0 vs 0.9. The margins are much closer than this, but the CLU will be a higher coefficient. I just did that for simplicity. This was the case for the x values too...i used 0.004 and 0.002 for the Stock and CLU values, respectively. Even if you did it with 0.001 and 0.0005

The distance would be reduced as well, so its heat flow = -k(delta T)/x. For CLU it would be ((1.0)(80-35))/0.0005, =90000J. For the stock TIM it would be ((0.9)(100-40))/0.001=54000. So you can see that no matter what, there's gonna be more heat dissipated with the delid with CLU than there would be with the stock cpu.

All the math is there, i didn't actually think id need to have math since its so glaringly obvious a concept, but I guess not...


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> so 150 was a solid number but my numbers were arbitrary huh?
> omg this is getting ridiculous. they weren't arbitrary numbers. The T values were in line with what they would be in real life. Even the k values fall in line. We can both agree that K would be higher for CLU vs the stock TIM. Solve based on this and you'll see my point.
> 
> How on earth is Q a constant in this equation? Q is the variable we're solving for. Why would you put an electrical circuit diagram on a thermal conduction problem? you're leaving out the two chief variables here. K and X


Thermal equations are analogous to electrical equations and so circuits with current sources can be used to solve thermal circuits. K and X is represented by R, which is thermal resistance.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Im not using the equation wrong. Have you attempted to use the equation? Even if you used constant T1 and T2 values, if the thermal coefficient is different (which it absolutely would be between CLU and the stock TIM), you'd end up with a different overall delta Q/T aka Watts dissipated.


If your watts dissipated is less than the CPU power consumption, then T1 must go up. If watts dissipiated is greater than CPU power consumption, T1 must go down.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I don't think you can use this diagram to illustrate your point. It doesn't take everything into account. Before you comment further, i want to see your math on the previous equation since you insist I used it wrong. I can assure you my math is right.
> 
> You;re wrong on this, my math proves it using YOUR equation. You haven't shown me your math so Ill assume you haven't actually used it.


Q is not a variable in this equation. Q is the power of the CPU. Your math is nonsense because you don't understand that Q at each junction in the circuit must be the same. Q in = Q out. Energy conservation. Thermo 101.

Your claim was that the same CPU heat dissipation but lower Rjc will cause a higher Th (radiator temperature). I gave you a diagram of the thermal circuit. You should see that Th is only dependent on the thermal resistance of the radiator to the air, and the wattage at the heat source (CPU). If you know Q (and we do), then Rjc (what we change) doesn't even appear in the equation for Th.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Thermal equations are analogous to electrical equations and so circuits with current sources can be used to solve thermal circuits. K and X is represented by R, which is thermal resistance.


Whats the equation taking those into account? You cant just say 'oh well, yea they're lumped into R' Those two are actually anti-resistive factors, that improve conduction so i dont even think this is true. You cannot use that diagram in this situation.

Quote:


> If your watts dissipated is less than the CPU power consumption, then T1 must go up. If watts dissipiated is greater than CPU power consumption, T1 must go down.
> Q is not a variable in this equation. *Q is the power of the CPU.* Your math is nonsense because you don't understand that Q at each junction in the circuit must be the same. Q in = Q out. Energy conservation. Thermo 101.


Yes Qin = Qout. Heat is being conserved. You cant use that diagram here. It doesnt take all the factors into account, and frankly you're overcomplicating a relatively simple concept. The Q value in your diagram IS NOT POWER. Q cannot be power. Q/t is power. In the equation, Q/t refers to heat dissipated over time, so please tell me HOW WOULD THAT BE POWER INPUT???? Do you even know what youre talking about????????

Oh so my math is nonsense. lol ok, but i dont see yours here. I dont think you know what youre talking about. How on earth is Q the CPU power? Q is heat produced...Q/t is Power, and CPU power isnt even a factor here. What on earth are you even talking about??? Do you even know how to use your own equation? The equation is talking about heat dissipation over time, not energy input. Thats a different equation altogether. Please Please Please get your physics on point because you're seriously trolling right now.

I have yet to see any of your math at all. My math is nonsense to you because you either a. fail to follow it or b. know that it negates your argument.

Why does q have to be the same? No it wouldnt...im not even using that diagram. Lets go back to the first equation you put up that you clearly dont know how to use.
Quote:


> Your claim was that the same CPU heat dissipation but lower Rjc will cause a higher Th (radiator temperature). I gave you a diagram of the thermal circuit. You should see that Th is only dependent on the thermal resistance of the radiator to the air, and the wattage at the heat source (CPU). If you know Q (and we do), then Rjc doesn't even appear in the equation for Th.


OMG you cannot use Power input as the value of Q. you can in the diagram but not in the equation. Dude im done with this argument.

Are you sure you didnt just pull these equations off the internet with no earthly idea how to actually use them? I think you did...

I was in biomechanics in a past life, and have an intimate understanding of physics. I know my math is on point, and you dont need math for this. Its common sense.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Whats the equation taking those into account? You cant just say 'oh well, yea they're lumped into R' Those two are actually anti-resistive factors, that improve conduction so i dont even think this is true. You cannot use that diagram in this situation.


Uh, that's just wrong. Thermal resistance is calculated from thermal conductivity (k), area, and cross section. You are way off base here.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yes Qin = Qout. Heat is being conserved. You cant use that diagram here. It doesnt take all the factors into account, and frankly you're overcomplicating a relatively simple concept. The Q value in your diagram IS NOT POWER. Q cannot be power. Q/t is power. In the equation, Q/t refers to heat dissipated over time, so please tell me HOW WOULD THAT BE POWER INPUT???? Do you even know what youre talking about????????.


I'm using Q here because I don't want to type unicode dot Q over and over again. Q is power dissipated by the device in this diagram.

God, you are so out of your depth here it's sad.

Please read this page and then look at the diagrams again.

http://web.mit.edu/16.unified/www/FALL/thermodynamics/notes/node118.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_resistance#Equivalent_thermal_circuits


----------



## blaze2210

The short version of this discussion is: delidding and using CLU/CLP = better heat transfer.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Uh, that's just wrong. Thermal resistance is calculated from thermal conductivity (k), area, and cross section. You are way off base here.
> *I'm using Q here because I don't want to type unicode dot Q over and over again. Q is power dissipated by the device in this diagram.*
> 
> God, you are so out of your depth here it's sad.
> 
> Please read this page and then look at the diagrams again.
> 
> http://web.mit.edu/16.unified/www/FALL/thermodynamics/notes/node118.html
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_resistance#Equivalent_thermal_circuits


you just said earlier that this Q value was the power input. Power input does not equal power dissipated. You just said here that Q is power dissipated. What on earth are you talking about?

Your incredibly hypocritical insults aside,

R=k^-1 because all else is constant. so based on the equation, 


the math for the other equation i put up would still apply here. Q= -k(delta T)

per the article the resistance decreases as k increases right? ok so then by that logic Q is greater since R would be lower. You were saying?

By the way genius, your very first equation discussed heat transfer in W, this one is discussing watts per area. I think youve made enough mistakes...better to quit while youre behind.

Do you even know what youre talking about or are you just finding random articles online. Can you even math dude?

Speaking of which, WHERE ARE YOUR CALCULATIONS?????? I HAVE YET TO SEE A SINGLE ONE, and all youre doing is just pulling files off the internet. I have not seen anything in terms of actual calculations yet. If you perform these calculations that you conveniently keep posting up using a delidded and non delidded chip youll end up with more wattage in the delidded chip


----------



## opt33

I think any easy analogy to understand what Exilon is correctly saying is....

Assume you have a river flowing from A to B, and the flow from A is constant (like watts consumed in cpu in this example). Then put a dam in the middle of the river, the water swells to make a small reservoir. But if flow from point A is constant, and the water has no place to go after reservoir fills, then water goes over the dam at the exact rate that water reaches the dam, ie steady state is reached where input = output, only a reservoir has formed.

In the argument where 150W is consumed before and after delidding....same logic applies. Only for a millisecond does the paste tim (dam) cause a backlog of heat (temp gradient from core to ihs = reservoir of water) then instantly reaches steady state where watts consumed over time must = watts dissipated over time to obey the laws of physics. If you turn off the cpu, then that gradient is lost so that last bit of heat to make the gradient is dissipated (obeying conservation laws). Removing paste and replacing with liquid metal, makes a smaller gradient (like smaller lake caused by smaller dam) but output = input once the gradient is "filled" in those first milliseconds. 150 watts dissipated = 150 watts dissipated, the heat will be same at same rate, only the gradient (reservoir) changes.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> I think any easy analogy to understand what Exilon is correctly saying is....
> 
> Assume you have a river flowing from A to B, and the flow from A is constant (like watts consumed in cpu in this example). Then put a dam in the middle of the river, the water swells to make a small reservoir. But if flow from point A is constant, and the water has no place to go after reservoir fills, then water goes over the dam at the exact rate that water reaches the dam, ie steady state is reached where input = output, only a reservoir has formed.
> 
> In the argument where 150W is consumed before and after delidding....same logic applies. Only for a millisecond does the paste tim (dam) cause a backlog of heat (temp gradient from core to ihs = reservoir of water) then instantly reaches steady state where watts consumed over time must = watts dissipated over time to obey the laws of physics. If you turn off the cpu, then that gradient is lost so that last bit of heat to make the gradient is dissipated (obeying conservation laws). Removing paste and replacing with liquid metal, makes a smaller gradient (like smaller lake caused by smaller dam) but output = input once the gradient is "filled" in those first milliseconds.


im not arguing that the watts consumed by the cpu arent the same. That would be asinine. the input wattage of the cpu is not the same thing as the heat being output by the die. Totally different. Theres a lot of resistance and complex circuitry there that im not delving into.

Im arguing that the improved conduction provides a marginally better heat conduction, and slightly more heat output (a couple more watts) output into the water. More efficient heat transfer means that more heat is output from source to sink, resulting in lower temperatures from the minimized insulation effects of the better TIM.

Basically at stock not all watts of heat output by the cpu are put out into the cooler. Theres a marginal amount thats retained by the TIM at stock. My argument is simply that CLU prevents this insulation from occuring, so very slightly more heat will get dumped into the cooler at the IHS-Cooler junction.


----------



## inedenimadam

Dead Cpus from vise? Less than with razor, but still quite a few.

CLU is significantly better than anything else.

The FIVR is on the top of the PCB for Haswell, if you use CLU, plan on covering the little yellow things with nail polish.

NO long term IL effects here. Running a 3570k naked for a couple years now @ 5.0 with CLU as the paste.

People with really bad lids might not see any improvement, but that is a prettyness scenario. almost always a temp drop is significant after delliding.

Ditch the Mugen.... go to the water.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Dead Cpus from vise? Less than with razor, but still quite a few.
> 
> CLU is significantly better than anything else.
> 
> The FIVR is on the top of the PCB for Haswell, if you use CLU, plan on covering the little yellow things with nail polish.
> 
> NO long term IL effects here. Running a 3570k naked for a couple years now @ 5.0 with CLU as the paste.
> 
> People with really bad lids might not see any improvement, but that is a prettyness scenario. almost always a temp drop is significant after delliding.
> 
> Ditch the Mugen.... go to the water.


Yea if you're using CLU between die and IHS and a solid NC paste on the IHS, id be really surprised if uou didnt get a decent thermal improvement both at idle and at load. That goes for air and water both.

As long as we're talking about haswell the vise only is the best method, followed by the vise and hammer method. I havent put nail polish on any of my delids and they're still running strong.

I advocate the naked method too if youre gonna do a custom loop. As it is the new discount EK blocks require you to remove the cpu brace, so if youre doing that you might as well run naked.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> im not arguing that the watts consumed by the cpu arent the same. That would be asinine. the input wattage of the cpu is not the same thing as the heat being output by the die. Totally different. Theres a lot of resistance and complex circuitry there that im not delving into.
> 
> Im arguing that the improved conduction provides a marginally better heat conduction, and slightly more heat output (a couple more watts) output into the water. More efficient heat transfer means that more heat is output from source to sink, resulting in lower temperatures from the minimized insulation effects of the better TIM.
> 
> Basically at stock not all watts of heat output by the cpu are put out into the cooler. Theres a marginal amount thats retained by the TIM at stock. My argument is simply that CLU prevents this insulation from occuring, so very slightly more heat will get dumped into the cooler at the IHS-Cooler junction.


You are completely ignoring what happens at steady state. Yes, the TIM will store some ENERGY. It does not store power. Power is a rate of energy. The TIM might prevent a couple of Joules from reaching the environment, but it does not reduce the overall amount of energy that will find it's way into the air. If the TIM meant that for 150W in there was only 148W out, then the CPU would increase in temperature FOREVER. The energy is all going somewhere. The dam analogy is PERFECTLY accurate. We are talking about steady state and at steady state Pin = Pout! I haven't reviewed all the maths here, but any maths which shows that there is less power out must be wrong. It means you are taking the wrong values as constant.

EDIT: Just consider conservation of energy. If there were, say 2W stored in TIM over an hour. That's 120J. That is a lot of energy to store in the TIM and die alone.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> im not arguing that the watts consumed by the cpu arent the same. That would be asinine. the input wattage of the cpu is not the same thing as the heat being output by the die. Totally different. Theres a lot of resistance and complex circuitry there that im not delving into.
> 
> Im arguing that the improved conduction provides a marginally better heat conduction, and slightly more heat output (a couple more watts) output into the water. More efficient heat transfer means that more heat is output from source to sink, resulting in lower temperatures from the minimized insulation effects of the better TIM.
> 
> Basically at stock not all watts of heat output by the cpu are put out into the cooler. Theres a marginal amount thats retained by the TIM at stock. My argument is simply that CLU prevents this insulation from occuring, so very slightly more heat will get dumped into the cooler at the IHS-Cooler junction.


For the first second you turn on cpu, yes more heat would get transferred via liquid metal or less heat transferred via paste, that is required to form the higher temp gradient with paste. However at steady state, ie the other 99.9% of the time, the wattage dissipated = exactly the same with either tim. Then when you turn off the computer that last bit of retained heat in paste example is dissipated to close the circle. But that last bit of heat is a pool that formed in the first second, does not change over time, hence does not factor into the equation except the first second, and when you turn the computer off, not the 99.9% steady state time.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> You are completely ignoring what happens at steady state. Yes, the TIM will store some ENERGY. It does not store power. Power is a rate of energy. The TIM might prevent a couple of Joules from reaching the environment, but it does not reduce the overall amount of energy that will find it's way into the air. If the TIM meant that for 150W in there was only 148W out, then the CPU would increase in temperature FOREVER. The energy is all going somewhere. The dam analogy is PERFECTLY accurate. We are talking about steady state and at steady state Pin = Pout! I haven't reviewed all the maths here, but any maths which shows that there is less power out must be wrong. It means you are taking the wrong values as constant.


the tim prevents the effective conduction of 100% of the heat (measured as energy = joules). Per second this energy = power in the form of P=(Q/t) = (E/t). Right but we're not at steady state. The laws of physics are still being obeyed because in terms of power in, thats the power going to the CPU from the mobo. Power out refers to the heat being generated at the die. Nobody is disputing that the same aount of heat is being generated AT THE DIE. WWhat im arguing about is what happens after that.

In terms of the dam analogy, its as if all the water is flowing through the dam, but a marginal amount overflows into the grass or surrounding environment.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> For the first second you turn on cpu, yes more heat would get transferred via liquid metal or less heat transferred via paste, that is required to form the higher temp gradient with paste. However at steady state, ie the other 99.9% of the time, the wattage dissipated = exactly the same with either tim. Then when you turn off the computer that last bit of retained heat in paste example is dissipated to close the circle.


I dont think thats how it works. Its not as if it holds on to it and never lets it go until the power is off. Think of it this way. If you had a leaky faucet that had a split stream...Most of it goes into your glass, but just a few drops hit the sink. It's just the same way. Again, heat generated AT THE DIE is the same. I never argued that. But efficiency of transfer is facilitated by the CLU whereas the stock TIM has insulating properties that result in heat leakage.

Again though, this is marginal, and definitely not more than a few Watts that are leaked. Power in is the same as power out, Qin = Qout. Im only arguing about what happens at the IHS.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> the tim prevents the effective conduction of 100% of the heat (measured as energy = joules). Per second this energy = power in the form of P=(Q/t) = (E/t). Right but we're not at steady state. The laws of physics are still being obeyed because in terms of power in, thats the power going to the CPU from the mobo. Power out refers to the heat being generated at the die. Nobody is disputing that the same aount of heat is being generated AT THE DIE. WWhat im arguing about is what happens after that.
> 
> In terms of the dam analogy, its as if all the water is flowing through the dam, but a marginal amount overflows into the grass or surrounding environment.


OK, please tell me then, where does it go? Because unless there is some magic heat portal being created, all of the energy still ends up in the air. The same amount of heat is dissipated somewhere. Please, tell me where it goes. And how are we not at steady state? It takes milliseconds to reach steady system once the CPU temp hits a stable temperature we are at steady state.

I am not disagreeing that for a fraction of a second the energy making its way to the water is lower. But it still has the same effect on the temperature of the room in the long run. Any energybgoing into the PC makes its way to the air in the end. Or are you disputing the conservation of energy?

Edit: yes, you may have some extra dissipation through the back of the motherboard etc. As well, but likely a miniscule amount and it certainly has the same heating effect on the air in the room, where it all makes it's way eventually anyway!


----------



## jdorje

Regarding the discussion on the last couple of pages. After you delid, heat will be transferred more quickly from your chip to your cooler. This means that the temperature of the chip and all its surroundings are a little lower. This means a bit higher percentage of the heat generated will be going into the cooler, and a bit less will be radiated (or conducted through motherboard) away from the chip itself. So yes that means your cooler will be transferring a bit more heat per second. However that doesn't mean that a radiator on intake is going to make your case hotter with a delidded chip, since the extra heat that escapes will certainly still be in the case and will actually be in a place you really don't want heat. Further, a radiator on exhaust will result in less heat in your case, since a larger portion of the heat generated by your CPU will be removed from the case entirely. Finally though, this effect has to be completely insignificant, right?

Now, I want to delid (a g3258 and then a 4690k if all goes well).

1. Should I get CLP or CLU, or something else?

2. What's the hammerless vice method?

3. What is lapping?

4. Should I cover the FIVR voltage modules with something permanent? If so, what?

5. If you don't reseal the IHC to the PCB, will it just fall off if you pick it up? Or does the TIM (CLU) hold it in place decently?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> OK, please tell me then, where does it go? Because unless there is some magic heat portal being created, all of the energy still ends up in the air. The same amount of heat is dissipated somewhere. Please, tell me where it goes. And how are we not at steady state? It takes milliseconds to reach steady system once the CPU temp hits a stable temperature we are at steady state.
> 
> I am not disagreeing that for a fraction of a second the energy making its way to the water is lower. But it still has the same effect on the temperature of the room in the long run. Any energybgoing into the PC makes its way to the air in the end. Or are you disputing the conservation of energy?


Where does the water from the tap analogy go? into the sink, It all finds its way into the air eventually, but its not a matter of a split second or whatever.

Ok here just think about it conceptually. Lets assume I have three slabs of steel. One of them is connected thermally to a furnace, and is conducting heat. If all three are in perfect thermal contact, they should all be the same temperature, and the heat from steel slab 1 should be transferred 100% to steel slab 2 and so on to steel slab 3. We can agree on this right?

Now lets imagine I put something insulating between slab 1 and 2. Like a wet towel. It's a.) no longer metal to metal and b) the towel is going to be retaining some heat. The towel will dump the heat into the air, but it wont be through steel slab 3. And it will retain heat for at least a little bit. This is the property of an insulator. All materials have both insulating and conducting properties. The stock tim has more insulating properties than the CLU, whereas the CLU is far more conductive than the stock TIM. All physics is being conserved here, but the heat is just not all going through the same conducting channel here. Seriously if you open a book on thermodynamics this will be one of the first lessons. Its the law of conduction.

As far as the watts. lets say the heat produced was 100J per second = 100W. In a perfect steady state heat transfer, 100W would be transferrred into the radiator. We both know that even with CLU its never 100% because this is life. There is always some leakage. Efficiency is never 100%. With delidding it's just a little bit more efficient.


----------



## blaze2210

At this point, you guys should consider relocating this discussion to a new thread, since you're all discussing the science of thermal transfer, as opposed to delidding. Just my








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Now, I want to delid (a g3258 and then a 4690k if all goes well).
> 
> 1. Should I get CLP or CLU, or something else?
> 
> 2. What's the hammerless vice method?
> 
> 3. What is lapping?
> 
> 4. Should I cover the FIVR voltage modules with something permanent? If so, what?
> 
> 5. If you don't reseal the IHC to the PCB, will it just fall off if you pick it up? Or does the TIM (CLU) hold it in place decently?


1. CLU or CLP are the only things worth applying to the die after a delid

2. There's a good video in here about 10-20 pages back or so.









3. Lapping is when you use increasing grits of sandpaper (800, 1000, 2000, 3000, etc) to remove the plating on the IHS and expose the copper part. Also, lapping levels the surface of the IHS, since the edges normally stick up above the center of the IHS.

4. You can apply clear nail polish or liquid electrical tape to them, but it's a personal choice. The idea is to protect those modules from the CLU/CLP coming into contact with them. Personally, I didn't apply either of these to mine - I just made sure to be careful with the application of the CLP.









5. This kinda depends on how long the CLP/CLU has been on there. After a fresh application, the IHS can move around fairly freely. After a while, it will tend to stay in place a bit better.


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> the tim prevents the effective conduction of 100% of the heat (measured as energy = joules).
> I dont think thats how it works. Its not as if it holds on to it and never lets it go until the power is off. Think of it this way. If you had a leaky faucet that had a split stream...Most of it goes into your glass, but just a few drops hit the sink. It's just the same way. Again, heat generated AT THE DIE is the same. I never argued that. But efficiency of transfer is facilitated by the CLU whereas the stock TIM has insulating properties that result in heat leakage.
> 
> Again though, this is marginal, and definitely not more than a few Watts that are leaked. Power in is the same as power out, Qin = Qout. Im only arguing about what happens at the IHS.


If 150 Watts heat is consumed, then 150W is dissipated, Ill assume we agree on that, just like we agree the earth is round..

If you are arguing (numbers just for example) that 99.5% heat is dissipated via IHS junction and 0.5% via socket contact/air with liquid metal tim....and that 99.2% heat is dissipated at IHS junction and .8% via socket contact/air in paste tim example, the first problem with that argument is that heat dissipated into socket/surrounding air is still dumping heat into his computer case.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Where does the water from the tap analogy go? into the sink, It all finds its way into the air eventually, but its not a matter of a split second or whatever.
> 
> Ok here just think about it conceptually. Lets assume I have three slabs of steel. One of them is connected thermally to a furnace, and is conducting heat. If all three are in perfect thermal contact, they should all be the same temperature, and the heat from steel slab 1 should be transferred 100% to steel slab 2 and so on to steel slab 3. We can agree on this right?
> 
> Now lets imagine I put something insulating between slab 1 and 2. Like a wet towel. It's a.) no longer metal to metal and b) the towel is going to be retaining some heat. The towel will dump the heat into the air, but it wont be through steel slab 3. And it will retain heat for at least a little bit. This is the property of an insulator. All materials have both insulating and conducting properties. The stock tim has more insulating properties than the CLU, whereas the CLU is far more conductive than the stock TIM. All physics is being conserved here, but the heat is just not all going through the same conducting channel here. Seriously if you open a book on thermodynamics this will be one of the first lessons. Its the law of conduction.
> 
> As far as the watts. lets say the heat produced was 100J per second = 100W. In a perfect steady state heat transfer, 100W would be transferrred into the radiator. We both know that even with CLU its never 100% because this is life. There is always some leakage. Efficiency is never 100%. With delidding it's just a little bit more efficient.


To be frank, I think you have lost sight of the original argument, rather choosing to go to extreme lengths to argue over miniscule amounts of power being leaked at different points of the process. In the end, if you are pushing hot rad air through your case, then all the energy of the CPU will end up in the case in the end. It will not affect the temperatures of the internal air in the case because that is where all the energy is. As I asked you, where does your leakage go? Because it needs to go somewhere. Leakage does not magically disappear. Energy does not magically disappear.

If you have 300W of energy going into a case it is going to end up as heat inside the case. Whether it goes through the waterblock into the radiator or whether it leaks through the motherboard into the air or through the IHS directly into the air, IT ALL ENDS UP IN THE AIR. PERIOD. You keep talking about leakage like it magically vanishes the energy, but it does not. It is all dissipated into the air. If it wasn't then it would be getting stored somewhere, and if it were that somewhere would continuously heat forever. But it doesn't. The energy all ends up in the air as waste heat, regardless of whether it goes through the rad or through the back of the MB. It still heats the case and it still heats the air. Period. The end.

Edit: you're talking about efficient, but this is not efficiency, this is conservation and it is always 100%.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Regarding the discussion on the last couple of pages. After you delid, heat will be transferred more quickly from your chip to your cooler. This means that the temperature of the chip and all its surroundings are a little lower. This means a bit higher percentage of the heat generated will be going into the cooler, and a bit less will be radiated (or conducted through motherboard) away from the chip itself. So yes that means your cooler will be transferring a bit more heat per second. However that doesn't mean that a radiator on intake is going to make your case hotter with a delidded chip, since the extra heat that escapes will certainly still be in the case and will actually be in a place you really don't want heat. Further, a radiator on exhaust will result in less heat in your case, since a larger portion of the heat generated by your CPU will be removed from the case entirely. Finally though, this effect has to be completely insignificant, right?
> 
> Now, I want to delid (a g3258 and then a 4690k if all goes well).
> 
> 1. Should I get CLP or CLU, or something else?
> 
> 2. What's the hammerless vice method?
> 
> 3. What is lapping?
> 
> 4. Should I cover the FIVR voltage modules with something permanent? If so, what?
> 
> 5. If you don't reseal the IHC to the PCB, will it just fall off if you pick it up? Or does the TIM (CLU) hold it in place decently?


Thank God, someone finally gets what ive been trying to say. Yes this effect is very small. but its a more efficient transfer of heat, so slightly more heat is being transferred. But the case that has good ventilation shouldnt have any issues.

1. CLU. Its better, much better not in terms of performance but cleanup.

2. Video i made to show it.



3. Lapping is taking a sander to the top of the IHS and making it smooth and shiny for better heat transfer to the cooler.

4. Up to you. I dont, but thats a topic of personal preference. You're safer if you do though. However, Im running naked (without IHS) so im not the best person to ask on this. But i did delid a G3258 and a 4790k earlier and set it up using the IHS without the nail polish both are running fine.

5. The CLU wont hold it in place. But your mounting bracket will. You dont need to glue it back on, and i wouldnt advise you do.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> To be frank, I think you have lost sight of the original argument, rather choosing to go to extreme lengths to argue over miniscule amounts of power being leaked at different points of the process. In the end, if you are pushing hot rad air through your case, then all the energy of the CPU will end up in the case in the end. It will not affect the temperatures of the internal air in the case because that is where all the energy is. As I asked you, where does your leakage go? Because it needs to go somewhere. Leakage does not magically disappear. Energy does not magically disappear.
> 
> If you have 300W of energy going into a case it is going to end up as heat inside the case. Whether it goes through the waterblock into the radiator or whether it leaks through the motherboard into the air or through the IHS directly into the air, IT ALL ENDS UP IN THE AIR. PERIOD. You keep talking about leakage like it magically vanishes the energy, but it does not. It is all dissipated into the air. If it wasn't then it would be getting stored somewhere, and if it were that somewhere would continuously heat forever. But it doesn't. The energy all ends up in the air as waste heat, regardless of whether it goes through the rad or through the back of the MB. It still heats the case and it still heats the air. Period. The end.
> 
> Edit: you're talking about efficient, but this is not efficiency, this is conservation and it is always 100%.


Yea i completely agree that this has gotten out of hand. But honestly, I was arguing the same poiint as what you just made. All i said at the beginning was that there is slightly more heat being dissipated after delid, and a bunch of people started saying no youre wrong youre wrong. What was i supposed to do?

What I was arguing was common sense, and I couldnt see why people didnt pick up on it. And then you have this other genius with all his equations, all of which proved my point.

In the end im glad this is over, Yes i agree heat is all being dumped into the air, Its by a different channel, but its marginal at best and its all going to the same place, and not some magical fairytale land of unicorns and rainbows. This was never my assertion

My God, i feel like a crazy person


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea i completely agree that this has gotten out of hand. But honestly, I was arguing the same poiint as what you just made. All i said at the beginning was that there is slightly more heat being dissipated after delid, and a bunch of people started saying no youre wrong youre wrong. What was i supposed to do?
> 
> What I was arguing was common sense, and I couldnt see why people didnt pick up on it. And then you have this other genius with all his equations, all of which proved my point.
> 
> In the end im glad this is over, Yes i agree heat is all being dumped into the air, Its by a different channel, but its marginal at best and its all going to the same place, and not some magical fairytale land of unicorns and rainbows. This was never my assertion
> 
> My God, i feel like a crazy person


Sorry to say it, but that sounded like your assertion. Especially when it came to arguing that the air in the case or in a room would be cooler. Ultimately nothing changes, when it comes to internal temperature because it has to end up there anyway and I think the reason it went so long is because you mentioned leakage like it was magical and that energy somehow wasn't heating the room/case. Had you said it leaks into the air it would have been much shorter, I imagine.


----------



## blaze2210

The discussion was sooo close to ending.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Sorry to say it, but that sounded like your assertion. Especially when it came to arguing that the air in the case or in a room would be cooler. Ultimately nothing changes, when it comes to internal temperature because it has to end up there anyway and I think the reason it went so long is because you mentioned leakage like it was magical and that energy somehow wasn't heating the room/case.


Yea leakage in the same manner of how a leaky faucet gets a few drops in the sink rather than in your glass. I was starting to think everyone else lost their minds because how would you get more efficient heat dissipation if more heat wanst being pushed into the heat sink? It just means if 100w were generated at the source 95 watts were going to the heat sink, rather than 75w. The rest is always dissipated into the surroundings.


----------



## Ceadderman

Owwww. My brain hurts.









~Ceadder


----------



## blaze2210

So how about that delidding? Crazy process, right?


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> So how about that delidding? Crazy process, right?


yep, lol... I thought all were on same page for a sec, but its a lost cause, time to just move on....


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Owwww. My brain hurts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I really wish you chimed in earlier. Everyone thought i was on crazy pills


----------



## Ceadderman

I started to think I was. Came in here to clear the subscriptions and bam! thought I landed in the Thermo Dynamics thread... brain started throbbing about halfway through the discussion.









~Ceadder


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> just like we agree the earth is round..


Lets not get ahead of ourselves. The earth is not round; it's a geoidal shape somewhat approximating an ellipsoid.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I started to think I was. Came in here to clear the subscriptions and bam! thought I landed in the Thermo Dynamics thread... brain started throbbing about halfway through the discussion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I know how you feel there. I kept having to scroll up and make sure I was actually still in the delidding thread.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I know how you feel there. I kept having to scroll up and make sure I was actually still in the delidding thread.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I started to think I was. Came in here to clear the subscriptions and bam! thought I landed in the Thermo Dynamics thread... brain started throbbing about halfway through the discussion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


My argument was simple...it was only because a few people started saying I was wrong that i really went into detail. Then one dude started throwing out equations that he didnt know how to use so i had to go into even more depth. Science is my background...i know my stuff


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> My argument was simple...it was only because a few people started saying I was wrong that i really went into detail. Then one dude started throwing out equations that he didnt know how to use so i had to go into even more depth. Science is my background...i know my stuff


You don't need to justify anything to me, I don't really care about the issue. I'll just be glad when it's actually and finally over.









In the future, this will probably solve issues sooner:


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You don't need to justify anything to me, I don't really care about the issue. I'll just be glad when it's actually and finally over.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In the future, this will probably solve issues sooner:


i mean it's pretty much done.


----------



## jdorje

Reading about CLU and I was wondering...is it reusable? Could you bead it up off of one installation and just reapply it to another?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0AJ3433408&cm_re=Coollaboratory_Liquid_Ultra-_-9SIA0AJ3433408-_-Product

Only CLU newegg has is this, the full kit for $40. They do have CLP syringe-only for $20.

Amazon has the CLU full kit for $22. Ebay has a 2-pack from a moderately well-reviewed seller for $32.

This stuff ain't cheap! I should get 2 uses out of one syringe?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Reading about CLU and I was wondering...is it reusable? Could you bead it up off of one installation and just reapply it to another?
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0AJ3433408&cm_re=Coollaboratory_Liquid_Ultra-_-9SIA0AJ3433408-_-Product
> 
> Only CLU newegg has is this, the full kit for $40. They do have CLP syringe-only for $20.
> 
> Amazon has the CLU full kit for $22. Ebay has a 2-pack from a moderately well-reviewed seller for $32.
> 
> This stuff ain't cheap! I should get 2 uses out of one syringe?


It is cheap, just not at those places

its a specialty product so you need to get it from a specialty shop
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/coliul.html

Gary's on point. He'll ship it right out

Its sad though becasue he used to sell through amazon for the same price.

Dont reuse it. its not made for that.

Look at the way i put it on the CPU and GPU, and do the same thing with yours. Remember that less is more with CLU




To be honest i used a little too much on the cpu here. but its easy to clean up with rubbing alcohol and a qtip. Just make sure you clean it all up


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Reading about CLU and I was wondering...is it reusable? Could you bead it up off of one installation and just reapply it to another?
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0AJ3433408&cm_re=Coollaboratory_Liquid_Ultra-_-9SIA0AJ3433408-_-Product
> 
> Only CLU newegg has is this, the full kit for $40. They do have CLP syringe-only for $20.
> 
> Amazon has the CLU full kit for $22. Ebay has a 2-pack from a moderately well-reviewed seller for $32.
> 
> This stuff ain't cheap! I should get 2 uses out of one syringe?


You get what you pay for with CLP/CLU, it's worth it. You get a lot more than 2 applications out of a syringe. Like Pinnacle Fit said, less is more with the liquid metals. Same with "a dab will do ya", and "a little goes a long way" - they're all completely true for CLU/CLP.


----------



## jdorje

I watched one video where the author placed a separate dab of CLU onto a piece of plastic, then used the brush to just paint a tiny amount onto the chip and IHS - surely some was wasted though. In most videos people put a small but uncontrollable dab onto the chip then spread it around, then sometimes complain that there's too much.

Any controversy between these two methods?'

What happens if you get a dab on the VRMs? Can it be removed? Surely not.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I watched one video where the author placed a separate dab of CLU onto a piece of plastic, then used the brush to just paint a tiny amount onto the chip and IHS - surely some was wasted though. In most videos people put a small but uncontrollable dab onto the chip then spread it around, then sometimes complain that there's too much.
> 
> Any controversy between these two methods?'
> 
> What happens if you get a dab on the VRMs? Can it be removed? Surely not.


That method sounds like a complete waste of an expensive product. All you need is a tiny amount, like significantly smaller than a BB. I've been using a Q-tip for my CLP applications, and it's been pretty easy to work with so far. My advice if you're using a Q-tip, is to minimize the amount of fibers that are sticking out from the swabs before spreading the CLP.

If you get some on those modules, you can just clean it off - just make absolutely sure that you're thorough with the cleaning.


----------



## Ceadderman

~Ceadder


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I watched one video where the author placed a separate dab of CLU onto a piece of plastic, then used the brush to just paint a tiny amount onto the chip and IHS - surely some was wasted though. In most videos people put a small but uncontrollable dab onto the chip then spread it around, then sometimes complain that there's too much.
> 
> Any controversy between these two methods?'
> 
> What happens if you get a dab on the VRMs? Can it be removed? Surely not.


It can be removed but not reused. If you look at the GPU block video i posted, I take the CLU off the the syringe using the brush itslef, rather than putting it onto the die from the syringe. This works much better in my opinion.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> My argument was simple...it was only because a few people started saying I was wrong that i really went into detail. Then one dude started throwing out equations that he didnt know how to use so i had to go into even more depth. Science is my background...i know my stuff


Hey... I was also at uni and had to take two years of introductory physics courses, though I admit I really don't know my stuff in that regard.

You are still wrong here. There's some misconception somewhere.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Hey... I was also at uni and had to take two years of introductory physics courses, though I admit I really don't know my stuff in that regard.
> 
> You are still wrong here. There's some misconception somewhere.


dude what are you talking about? you misunderstood. its simple thermodynamics

You know they told Einstein and Newton they were both wrong because they misunderstood or failed to understand.


----------



## jdorje

I watched one video where the author
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Hey... I was also at uni and had to take two years of introductory physics courses, though I admit I really don't know my stuff in that regard.
> 
> You are still wrong here. There's some misconception somewhere.


It continues!

If the CPU was completely insulated, there would be no difference. All the heat would transfer to the heat sink, at a rate proportional to the temperature difference divided by the heat-carrying-resistance of the transfer area.

Since it's not, some heat expands into your motherboard, also at a rate proportional to the temperature difference between your CPU and motherboard. From an overclockers point of view, this is a bad thing.

With the delidded CPU, heat transfers faster to your heat sink (at least we hope), and the temperature of your CPU is lower, thus the temp difference is lower, thus less heat is moving into your motherboard. This is a good thing.

However if you have a CPU cooler rad on intake then it all just goes back into your case anyway - though at least it's not right on your motherboard. With a CPU cooler rad on exhaust, way better. Radiators on intake never make sense to me, but I guess rads on exhaust don't make much either. The most efficient rad would be completely external. There has to be a case design waiting to be made based on this, right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> That method sounds like a complete waste of an expensive product.


I guess the issue is that if you apply directly to the chip, you end up spreading however much you place, which could be too much. If you collect it separately before brushing it on, you shouldn't get too much on the chip, but any "extra" you pour is then just wasted. Looks like squeezing a tiny amount at a time is key to not wasting much, regardless.

Is this logic correct?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> It can be removed but not reused. If you look at the GPU block video i posted, I take the CLU off the the syringe using the brush itslef, rather than putting it onto the die from the syringe. This works much better in my opinion.


Looks like a good compromise.

Next question: I see you suggest removing the IHS glue with a razor blade. Does that not risk cutting into the PCB? Elsewhere I've seen a credit card recommended.

Disclaimer: once I'm done I will write up the whole thing in detail and try to repay all this information sharing.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I watched one video where the author
> It continues!
> 
> If the CPU was completely insulated, there would be no difference. All the heat would transfer to the heat sink, at a rate proportional to the temperature difference divided by the heat-carrying-resistance of the transfer area.
> 
> Since it's not, some heat expands into your motherboard, also at a rate proportional to the temperature difference between your CPU and motherboard. From an overclockers point of view, this is a bad thing.
> 
> With the delidded CPU, heat transfers faster to your heat sink (at least we hope), and the temperature of your CPU is lower, thus the temp difference is lower, thus less heat is moving into your motherboard. This is a good thing.
> 
> However if you have a CPU cooler rad on intake then it all just goes back into your case anyway - though at least it's not right on your motherboard. With a CPU cooler rad on exhaust, way better. Radiators on intake never make sense to me, but I guess rads on exhaust don't make much either. The most efficient rad would be completely external. There has to be a case design waiting to be made based on this, right?
> I guess the issue is that if you apply directly to the chip, you end up spreading however much you place, which could be too much. If you collect it separately before brushing it on, you shouldn't get too much on the chip, but any "extra" you pour is then just wasted. Looks like squeezing a tiny amount at a time is key to not wasting much, regardless.
> 
> Is this logic correct?
> Looks like a good compromise.


This needs to end. Its thermodynamics 101. If anybody disagrees that improved conductivity increases heat transfer then they need only question their intelligence. All heat leaks into the environment.

i do have to disagree on one thing though. you said insulted, but i think you meant 100% conductive to the heatsink. If it was insulated it would retain all the heat like a jacket.

i seriously dont want to continue this conversation about heat transfer. If anybody doesnt understand it or disagrees with what im saying, please read a physics book. You;; find all your answers there. This has wasted my day. .


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> This needs to end. Its thermodynamics 101. If anybody disagrees that improved conductivity increases heat transfer then they need only question their intelligence. All heat leaks into the environment.
> 
> i do have to disagree on one thing though. you said insulted, but i think you meant 100% conductive to the heatsink. If it was insulated it would retain all the heat like a jacket.
> 
> i seriously dont want to continue this conversation about heat transfer. If anybody doesnt understand it or disagrees with what im saying, please read a physics book. You;; find all your answers there. This has wasted my day. .


Well firstly I do thank you for your actual advice relevant to delidding!

While talking Science may be completely off topic, I don't think learning is ever a waste of time. I am sorry though for reviving what was apparently an unwanted debate; I won't derail again.

To explain my last post, heat transfer from CPU to heatsink increases with improved conductivity, but it also increases with greater temperature difference. That's the point of delidding! By raising the conductivity we can lower the temperature difference and still get the same (or slightly higher) heat transfer. Meanwhile the conductivity between CPU and motherboard remains the same, but by dropping CPU temps we lower the rate of heat transfer from CPU to motherboard.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Well firstly I do thank you for your actual advice relevant to delidding!
> 
> While talking Science may be completely off topic, I don't think learning is ever a waste of time. I am sorry though for reviving what was apparently an unwanted debate; I won't derail again.
> 
> To explain my last post, heat transfer from CPU to heatsink increases with improved conductivity, but it also increases with greater temperature difference. That's the point of delidding! By raising the conductivity we can lower the temperature difference and still get the same (or slightly higher) heat transfer. Meanwhile the conductivity between CPU and motherboard remains the same, but by dropping CPU temps we lower the rate of heat transfer from CPU to motherboard.


LOL its not a big deal. I wasnt speaking on your post when i said that.

yes in that context it is "insulated" but it is not an insulator. But i get what you're saying.

And you're welcome. I hope the videos help others on here.


----------



## blaze2210

Why don't you guys go start a thermodynamics thread, then carry on your argument there? Then, you can have an ENTIRE thread devoted to this argument. Doesn't that sound attractive? Then other people can come in the thread, and they can argue with you, doesn't that sound like fun?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Why don't you guys go start a thermodynamics thread, then carry on your argument there? Then, you can have an ENTIRE thread devoted to this argument. Doesn't that sound attractive? Then other people can come in the thread, and they can argue with you, doesn't that sound like fun?


LOL they can if they want. I was only defending myself. I think ill stick around here lol


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> LOL they can if they want. I was only defending myself. I think ill stick around here lol













That poor dead horse....


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> This needs to end. Its thermodynamics 101. If anybody disagrees that improved conductivity increases heat transfer then they need only question their intelligence. All heat leaks into the environment.
> 
> i do have to disagree on one thing though. you said insulted, but i think you meant 100% conductive to the heatsink. If it was insulated it would retain all the heat like a jacket.
> 
> i seriously dont want to continue this conversation about heat transfer. If anybody doesnt understand it or disagrees with what im saying, please read a physics book. You;; find all your answers there. This has wasted my day. .


People just quit arguing with you, because it is a lost cause as your understanding is flawed to the point of absurdity. And dont worry my last post on the subject, Im not going to continue to argue with people that say the earth is flat either.

Intel and other chip manufacturers ignore socket heat transfer in their TDP calcs. Fact is 99+% heat is always going to be transferred via ihs, the resistance is so much higher via socket. Does a minuscule more heat go via socket when less resistance occurs at ihs, sure....but that has nothing to do with lowered temps, and can be disregarded as slight measurement error if one had the capability to measure to that accuracy.

Point 1 is, *If no heat was transferred via socket, you would see the exact same temp decrease with liquid metal* (maybe 0.1C difference via socket regarded as "measurement error"). Only the gradient from core to cooling is altered by lowering the resistance, the heat transfer at steady state over time will be measured the same within the ability to measure, hence the minuscule socket heat transfer can be ignored and is ignored in TDP Calc equations.

Point 2, *by lowering the resistance, it is possible to dissipate heat faster. However, since you are stuck with* *power consumed at a constant rate at cpu**, then heat is never dissipated faster*, *what changes instead is the gradient, ie heat instantly backs up via paste for milliseconds, then heat is transferred at same rate at steady state, just with larger potential driving heat exchange at the same rate (minus your 0.1% socket error).* *That is where your logic is flawed, the cpu is* *not* free flowing potential of energy that increases during less resistance, it is constrained by constant production. Minuscule socket heat leakage is so small it doesnt affect anything, and can be disregarded as measurement error. If the theory was socket heat leakage making up the difference, at 20C, that is some impressive heat dissipation at the socket


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> People just quit arguing with you, because it is a lost cause as your understanding is flawed to the point of absurdity. And dont worry my last post on the subject, Im not going to continue to argue with people that say the earth is flat either.
> 
> Intel and other chip manufacturers ignore socket heat transfer in their TDP calcs. Fact is 99+% heat is always going to be transferred via ihs, the resistance is so much higher via socket. Does a minuscule more heat go via socket when less resistance occurs at ihs, sure....but that has nothing to do with lowered temps, and can be disregarded as slight measurement error if one had the capability to measure to that accuracy.
> 
> Point 1 is, *If no heat was transferred via socket, you would see the exact same temp decrease with liquid metal* (maybe 0.1C difference via socket regarded as "measurement error"). Only the gradient from core to cooling is altered by lowering the resistance, the heat transfer will be measured the same within the ability to measure, hence socket transfer can be ignored and is ignored in TDP Calc equations.
> 
> Point 2, by lowering the resistance, it is *possible* to dissipate heat faster. HOWEVER, since you are stuck with *power consumed at a constant rate at cpu**, then heat is never dissipated faster*, what only changes is the gradient. That is where your logic is flawed, the cpu is *not* free flowing potential of energy that increases during less resistance, it is constrained by constant production. Socket leakage hasnt squat to do with temp decrease one sees.


Dude you still don't get it.

All energy is still passing through the socket and all energy is conserved. The die gets hot. Power into cpu = power to cpu + heat. The heat produced at the die is constant. NOBODY IS ARGUING THAT. All I'm saying is that heat is lost to its surroundings along the way to the cooler, and even then the movement of heat isn't 100% efficient. With the decreased distance between the die and IHS and the CLU, its pretty easy to see that its now more efficient, and there is less heat lost to the surroundings.

All delidding does is close the gap between inneficiency and efficiency. And even it doesn't bring it to 100%.

Again, I don't get why this is so difficult for you to understand, but it really is thermo 101.
Thats all I'm going to say on this.


----------



## Swag

I would much rather have avoided entering this discussion, but I do not want to see a thread I have been with to the start dwindle in members and support due to constant argument against each other.

Please accept your own opinion right now, if you want to continue this discussion, continue it via private message.

I believe that in everyone's best interest, we would not like to be talked about in different forums as a thread that "constantly bickers to one another" and does not provide a "friendly environment for veterans and novice alike".


----------



## opt33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Dude you still don't get it.
> 
> All energy is still passing through the socket and all energy is conserved. The die gets hot. Power into cpu = power to cpu + heat. The heat produced at the die is constant. NOBODY IS ARGUING THAT. All I'm saying is that heat is lost to its surroundings along the way to the cooler, and even then the movement of heat isn't 100% efficient. With the decreased distance between the die and IHS and the CLU, its pretty easy to see that its now more efficient, and there is less heat lost to the surroundings.
> 
> All delidding does is close the gap between inneficiency and efficiency. And even it doesn't bring it to 100%.
> 
> Again, I don't get why this is so difficult for you to understand, but it really is thermo 101.
> Thats all I'm going to say on this.


20C temp difference from "heat lost to the surroundings"







Um, no. 0.1C temp difference maybe.

The other 19.9C temp difference occurs with heat transfer via IHS at same rate with clu or paste. The only difference is with clu, less potential heat/energy is backed up/stored so smaller heat gradient occurs. Paste, heat exchange occurs at same rates as liquid metal, just in the first second a potential heat/energy storage occurs (higher temp gradient) necessary to then transfer heat at same rate via higher resistance, which is observed as higher temps.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *opt33*
> 
> 20C temp difference from "heat lost to the surroundings"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Um, no. 0.1C temp difference maybe.
> 
> The other 19.9C temp difference occurs with heat transfer via IHS at same rate with clu or paste. The only difference is with clu, less potential heat/energy is backed up/stored so smaller heat gradient occurs. Paste, heat exchange occurs at same rates as liquid metal, just in the first second a potential heat/energy storage occurs (higher temp gradient) necessary to then transfer heat at same rate via higher resistance, which is observed as higher temps.


Yes I never alleged it would be a huge heat loss. Just a couple of watts of heat at most. We were arguing about things that don't even conflict the entire time. Clu increases the heat flow and minimizes the heat lost to the surroundings, regardless how small it already is. At stock the TiM is mildly insulating similar to someone putting a towel between two hot pieces of metal. The rate of heat flow in this would be like a leaky faucet getting a couple of drops of water in the sink rather than your glass.

I do see the confusion though. I really need to start proofreading my posts more carefully. It looked as though I was saying the heat dissipated had to be greater than the heat produced. That would be ridiculous. The heat dissipated by the CPU into the block is more efficient and I suppose more rapid due to the metal-metal sealed junction.

That's all I'm gonna say. If you want to talk further pm me.


----------



## Norlig

Gonna delid my 3770k today, gonna use some hard plastic "card" , or vice if the card does not do the trick. will let you know the results.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Norlig*
> 
> Gonna delid my 3770k today, gonna use some hard plastic "card" , or vice if the card does not do the trick. will let you know the results.


I posted a delid video earlier. I would take a look at that to see if it would be easier.


----------



## peter2k

I'm planning on building and delidding a Skylake System when I can get my hands on at least one Samsung M2 with NVME
And there's a wealth of information here, which is quite cool

Question that runs actually through my head is this:
I get it that putting the lid back on protects the silicon, but I used to have CPU's without a lid back in the day and those didn't brake for me (AMD Athlon era)
Sooo
Why would the Silicon break these days?

Planning on a AIO watercooler until I get a custom loop way later


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I'm planning on building and delidding a Skylake System when I can get my hands on at least one Samsung M2 with NVME
> And there's a wealth of information here, which is quite cool
> 
> Question that runs actually through my head is this:
> I get it that putting the lid back on protects the silicon, but I used to have CPU's without a lid back in the day and those didn't brake for me (AMD Athlon era)
> Sooo
> Why would the Silicon break these days?
> 
> Planning on a AIO watercooler until I get a custom loop way later


well there were plenty die's that did crack back in the day, often due to carelessness, it's still considered unsafe, especially with the constant reduction in surface area, and the shape of Ivy/Haswell chips

and while you can run them bare die, its not recommended without dedicated adapters.

However, with Skylake's smaller PCB and taller IHS, i wonder if the old "Naked Ivy" kits would even be compatible with Skylake at this point?
tho I suspect that they wont, so the best way to run them will definitely be to run them with the IHS back on.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I'm planning on building and delidding a Skylake System when I can get my hands on at least one Samsung M2 with NVME
> And there's a wealth of information here, which is quite cool
> 
> Question that runs actually through my head is this:
> I get it that putting the lid back on protects the silicon, but I used to have CPU's without a lid back in the day and those didn't brake for me (AMD Athlon era)
> Sooo
> Why would the Silicon break these days?
> 
> Planning on a AIO watercooler until I get a custom loop way later


The reason why most people put the IHS back on isn't necessarily due to the safety aspect. It's because a) the mobo's CPU latch requires the IHS to push the CPU against the pins with enough force. B) because most coolers only go low enough to make contact with the IHS. The naked ivy being an exception.


----------



## Norlig

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I posted a delid video earlier. I would take a look at that to see if it would be easier.


Yeah, saw that video. identical, but worse than others i've seen /honest .

Not sure how people get a knife between this small gap:


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Norlig*
> 
> Yeah, saw that video. identical, but worse than others i've seen /honest .
> 
> Not sure how people get a knife between this small gap:


Yep, never said it was the holy grail of delidding videos, just thought it would help.

Glad you enjoyed it.

And the razor method is the most dangerous method fyi


----------



## orndorf77

I have a delidid i7 4790k @ 4.7ghz @ 1.28v under full load in cpu-z , my chip has been stable for over a year, when I monitor my temperatures these are my results when idling


core 1, 3 and 4 are normal but core 2 is extremely hot, my temperatures were normal on all 4 cores until 3 days ago , what is wrong with my chip and how do I fix it ?


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orndorf77*
> 
> I have a delidid i7 4790k @ 4.7ghz @ 1.28v under full load in cpu-z , my chip has been stable for over a year, when I monitor my temperatures these are my results when idling
> 
> 
> core 1, 3 and 4 are normal but core 2 is extremely hot, my temperatures were normal on all 4 cores until 3 days ago , what is wrong with my chip and how do I fix it ?


Maybe an air bubble or area without thermal paste developed over time with the heating/hardening/shrinking/spreading of the paste over the die?
I'd redo the on die thermal material.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orndorf77*
> 
> I have a delidid i7 4790k @ 4.7ghz @ 1.28v under full load in cpu-z , my chip has been stable for over a year, when I monitor my temperatures these are my results when idling
> 
> 
> core 1, 3 and 4 are normal but core 2 is extremely hot, my temperatures were normal on all 4 cores until 3 days ago , what is wrong with my chip and how do I fix it ?


Sounds like it's time to switch out that TIM. If you still have the same issue after re-applying the thermal compound, then your CPU has an issue.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Yea id venture to guess that the cpu has a problem. If all the other cores are running normal like that, then i dont think it's the paste. I could be wrong on this.

In any case doesnt hurt to change out the paste. But before you do, have you tried resetting your OC to factory? See if this helps?

Core 2 tends to get hot, but yea, thats just ridiculously hot. Good luck and please let us know what solves the issue, if anything.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Maybe an air bubble or area without thermal paste developed over time with the heating/hardening/shrinking/spreading of the paste over the die?
> I'd redo the on die thermal material.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea id venture to guess that the cpu has a problem. If all the other cores are running normal like that, then i dont think it's the paste. I could be wrong on this.
> 
> In any case doesnt hurt to change out the paste. But before you do, have you tried resetting your OC to factory? See if this helps?
> 
> Core 2 tends to get hot, but yea, thats just ridiculously hot. Good luck and please let us know what solves the issue, if anything.


It's either a bad mount (uneven pressure), or TIM needs to be replaced. If it's neither of these, then the CPU is malfunctioning.


----------



## jdorje

90c on idle? Sounds like a bad sensor.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> 90c on idle? Sounds like a bad sensor.


Bad sensor is definitely a possibility. So, might as well check the TIM and mounting before declaring that.


----------



## Darkz0r

So I thought I had killed my 4770k due to some PCB nicks, today my new CPU arrived and I'm still getting the same symptoms...powers on and off. If I dont plug the 12V ATX it powers on for longer, lol. No beeps, no post, no anything...

Just to recap, it should post with just:
1 ram stick (anywhere??)
1 HDD or SDD
anything connected to the CPU fan slot
CPU

I'm not actually installing the fan to make it easier for testing..since I duobt the CPU gets to 80C in 2 seconds without any heatsink, or does it? Ill kill the power instantly when I hear the beep.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> So I thought I had killed my 4770k due to some PCB nicks, today my new CPU arrived and I'm still getting the same symptoms...powers on and off. If I dont plug the 12V ATX it powers on for longer, lol. No beeps, no post, no anything...
> 
> Just to recap, it should post with just:
> 1 ram stick (anywhere??)
> 1 HDD or SDD
> anything connected to the CPU fan slot
> CPU
> 
> I'm not actually installing the fan to make it easier for testing..since I duobt the CPU gets to 80C in 2 seconds without any heatsink, or does it? Ill kill the power instantly when I hear the beep.


Can you try a different PSU in there to test?


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Can you try a different PSU in there to test?


I don't have another PSU, but I guess I can borrow a very cheap one from a friend just to check if it posts.

But the PSU was workin fine before the delid, thats why I'm a bit skeptic

Edit: if I check all connectors with a multimeter can I diagnose a possible problem with a PSU rail?


----------



## InCoGnIt0

Has anyone used those hard plastic cell phone pry tools to delid ?? I think that would be better (safer) than a razor since it's not metal and it will not scratch the CPU.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2Pcs-Opening-Plastic-Pick-Pry-Tool-Kit-Set-for-All-Cell-Phone-USA-SELLER-/261693632031?hash=item3cee27ee1f


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> I don't have another PSU, but I guess I can borrow a very cheap one from a friend just to check if it posts.
> 
> But the PSU was workin fine before the delid, thats why I'm a bit skeptic
> 
> Edit: if I check all connectors with a multimeter can I diagnose a possible problem with a PSU rail?


Mainly it would help rule out a potential culprit. If you can borrow one from a friend, that would be perfect. For testing the PSU, unfortunately I'm not a good resource on the how-to. This guide seems to have some good info in it though: http://pcsupport.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/ht/power-supply-test-multimeter.htm


----------



## LagunaX

Easy enuf to redo the die TIM.
I would:
1) quick temp sensor check with freeware Realtemp first, then
2) redo the TIM


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Easy enuf to redo the die TIM.
> I would:
> 1) quick temp sensor check with freeware Realtemp first, then
> 2) redo the TIM


Sounds like a good plan - work your way down the line.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *InCoGnIt0*
> 
> Has anyone used those hard plastic cell phone pry tools to delid ?? I think that would be better (safer) than a razor since it's not metal and it will not scratch the CPU.
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/2Pcs-Opening-Plastic-Pick-Pry-Tool-Kit-Set-for-All-Cell-Phone-USA-SELLER-/261693632031?hash=item3cee27ee1f


Just use the vise method. There's a video I posted earlier.

The razor method is incredibly dangerous and you're liable to nick a trace esp if its your first time.


----------



## LagunaX

Yes, slow twists of the hammerless vice method with Ivy and Haswell. Make sure you pad the plastic pcb side of the metal vice with a thick rubber band or something. Extremely safe for Ivy and Haswell, but the pcb on Skylake might flex or bend too much. Just slow twists until you feel a little give, then you can pry off with your fingers. I've done 3-4 chips just fine this way, killed one by a razor and did ok with another by razor.


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Mainly it would help rule out a potential culprit. If you can borrow one from a friend, that would be perfect. For testing the PSU, unfortunately I'm not a good resource on the how-to. This guide seems to have some good info in it though: http://pcsupport.about.com/od/toolsofthetrade/ht/power-supply-test-multimeter.htm


thanks! Great link.

ill try my friends psu and testing my psu rails in the next 2 days.

its so hard to troubleshoot no post issues. Ive spent countless hours today reading threads all over...if i only connect the main atx cable things power up and fans spin but no beep or post. I cant even get the cpu to do the long ram beep. Someone suggested its a north or south bridge problem..since it seems the cpu does not get power.
i did a major visual inspection of the mb and found a tiny drop of liquid electrical tape over a circuit..already removed. Also when i took off the noctua 14d it seems i scratched the mb near a south bridge circuit that goes to the cpu. There's a tiny bit of copper exposed...could that be it? Lol such a tiny scratch..


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> thanks! Great link.
> 
> ill try my friends psu and testing my psu rails in the next 2 days.
> 
> its so hard to troubleshoot no post issues. Ive spent countless hours today reading threads all over...if i only connect the main atx cable things power up and fans spin but no beep or post. I cant even get the cpu to do the long ram beep. Someone suggested its a north or south bridge problem..since it seems the cpu does not get power.
> i did a major visual inspection of the mb and found a tiny drop of liquid electrical tape over a circuit..already removed. Also when i took off the noctua 14d it seems i scratched the mb near a south bridge circuit that goes to the cpu. There's a tiny bit of copper exposed...could that be it? Lol such a tiny scratch..


That scratch might be an issue, can you get a pic of it? Little nicks in the PCB can kill a CPU, not quite sure about mobos though.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> I would much rather have avoided entering this discussion, but I do not want to see a thread I have been with to the start dwindle in members and support due to constant argument against each other.
> 
> Please accept your own opinion right now, if you want to continue this discussion, continue it via private message.
> 
> I believe that in everyone's best interest, we would not like to be talked about in different forums as a thread that "constantly bickers to one another" and does not provide a "friendly environment for veterans and novice alike".


Agreed, sorry i wasnt here to control this. Been on vacation.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> That scratch might be an issue, can you get a pic of it? Little nicks in the PCB can kill a CPU, not quite sure about mobos though.


I would also check your motherboard cpu pins, take a pic if you can.


----------



## Norlig

How much does it help if I heat up the IHS with a hairdryer before/while using the Vice to delid it?

How warm should I get the IHS? whats the maximum I would want it to get?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Norlig*
> 
> How much does it help if I heat up the IHS with a hairdryer before/while using the Vice to delid it?
> 
> How warm should I get the IHS? whats the maximum I would want it to get?


A hair dryer can't damage the CPU because they're meant to blow ~60 C air so whatever it's heating can't get hotter than 60 C. You could pretty much point it at the CPU all day and it won't hurt anything. That said, I don't know if 60C will actually help with the vice. I used a heat gun and it made it super easy, but that thing blew at 400 C so hold it for too long it'll ruin the CPU.


----------



## Ceadderman

Just to point out how much better a heat gun is over a hair drier...

Maybe this will make some sense...

Intel CPUs do upwards of 60-80c under load conditions with a stock cooler.

What do you think you will accomplish by heating an IHS that Intel designed to withstand that and the glue that they use to secure it?









You'd do better to give the little Dutch Boy a break holding your finger in the dam for him. Certainly would do better with just the Vice.

But you use a generator of 1100w for even a minute and turn the lever of the vice slowly, that glue will get tacky and let the IHS off with so much as a warning. It would take longer with the hair drier. 1100w heat guns are cheap enough to come by.









I could care less about the thermo dynamics of it all. Gimme good old fashoned common sense. If you understand what you're dealing with common sense will out.









~Ceadder


----------



## Norlig

Found a heatgun at work, will use that.

I also got a optical temperature reader, how warm is the maximum I should get the IHS before starting with the vice?


----------



## Exilon

Start with it in the vice and point the heat gun at the IHS side. Put pressure on the lever and turn off heatgun when the IHS moves. Be firm with the lever or you'll melt the soldering


----------



## OCNinja

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *OCNinja*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Yeahup, you need naked bracket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> could you give some examples of naked bracket? what do them look like?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Sure...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
Click to expand...

So with this delid guard, I can mount aftermarket cpu cooler on naked ide without risking crushing it?


----------



## Swag

@Valgaur

Haha! Welcome back from your vacation!







Hopefully it was relaxing instead of stressful. When I visited Hawaii in June, I ended up getting really stressed out when I realized I lost somethings while I was there.







We lost our DSLR over there and it had cost us quite a bit of saving.

Just dropping by, the community is getting bigger and bigger! With a lot of people from all around OCN and new members joining the club, looks like it's as successful as we had hoped to be.

On a delidding side-note, I delidded more CPUs with razor method (I've grown fond of because it was the first method I had used) and a few using the newer methods discussed here. It's been nice. I've had to get replaced a few CPUs by Intel (KIA not from delid, but extreme overclocking). I really want to find out if there is some benefit to delidding a CPU when it comes to LN2 cooling. I can't say it helps because honestly, I can't tell, but I do hope I can gather enough information whether the benefit is minuscule or noteworthy. And in addition, I've revamped my PC/desk as well.

Pictures below are pictures of my old Dell U2713HM and new Dell U2715H monitor side-by-side comparison. I have 3 of the newer ones to complete a nice triple 1440p setup. I couldn't go with 4k because I felt like the technology is inferior to the 1440p and my GPUs will probably not be able to run it. I'm still running on my SLI 680s.







I should have those upgraded soon. I also ordered a case from Caselabs which will arrive soon, hopefully. Depends on Canadian customs though, they take some time with packages (since I had it delivered under my company's name). Hopefully I can get my goal of full custom watercooling this year.










Spoiler: Dell Monitors


----------



## jason4207

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> So I thought I had killed my 4770k due to some PCB nicks, today my new CPU arrived and I'm still getting the same symptoms...powers on and off. If I dont plug the 12V ATX it powers on for longer, lol. No beeps, no post, no anything...
> 
> Just to recap, it should post with just:
> 1 ram stick (anywhere??)
> 1 HDD or SDD
> anything connected to the CPU fan slot
> CPU
> 
> I'm not actually installing the fan to make it easier for testing..since I duobt the CPU gets to 80C in 2 seconds without any heatsink, or does it? Ill kill the power instantly when I hear the beep.


You're not installing the HSF? The CPU can heat up very quickly without a HS installed! I'd put the HS on there before giving up.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Just to point out how much better a heat gun is over a hair drier...
> 
> Maybe this will make some sense...
> 
> Intel CPUs do upwards of 60-80c under load conditions with a stock cooler.
> 
> What do you think you will accomplish by heating an IHS that Intel designed to withstand that and the glue that they use to secure it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I think a hairdryer might actually help a LITTLE, if you hold it on it for long enough. Remember, it's not ruining the adhesive, it's just softening it and as long as it can heat to 80c, soften, then cool and harden, it doesn't matter to Intel, because they are only designed to be heated while they are securely fastened in the socket. While I am certain it will not melt it, I would be surprised if it didn't soften it up a little, based on the feel of the adhesive after a delid. It would just take a lot longer to have any effect than a heat gun.


----------



## incog

The only thing with the hairdryer method is that I'm afraid of bending the pcb, actually

Maybe i should go hammer and vice again.


----------



## jdorje

A hairdryer doesn't give risk of damage from static?


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jason4207*
> 
> You're not installing the HSF? The CPU can heat up very quickly without a HS installed! I'd put the HS on there before giving up.


I tried with the hsf now and no deal. =(
Though the behavior changed a bit but that was before I installed the HSF, if i power on with JUST the atx 24 pin and NOT 4 pin 12v or 8pin 12v, it powers on, fans spin and it keeps powered on (but no post). If I plug any of the 12v's (4 or 8) I get the power on off cycle.

I'm gonna test the PSU but I think my MB somehow died. I'm starting to believe my delid DIDN'T fail since I'm getting the same symptoms with the new CPU...

I did drop some thermal paste on the MB after delid but I cleaned it with isopropyl so I don't think thats the issue...and its been like 4-5 days.

So the only explanation I can come up is: the tiny scratch the noctua d14 did on one of the south bridge traces on the MB killed it...how likely is that?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> I tried with the hsf now and no deal. =(
> Though the behavior changed a bit but that was before I installed the HSF, if i power on with JUST the atx 24 pin and NOT 4 pin 12v or 8pin 12v, it powers on, fans spin and it keeps powered on (but no post). If I plug any of the 12v's (4 or 8) I get the power on off cycle.
> 
> I'm gonna test the PSU but I think my MB somehow died. I'm starting to believe my delid DIDN'T fail since I'm getting the same symptoms with the new CPU...
> 
> I did drop some thermal paste on the MB after delid but I cleaned it with isopropyl so I don't think thats the issue...and its been like 4-5 days.
> 
> So the only explanation I can come up is: the tiny scratch the noctua d14 did on one of the south bridge traces on the MB killed it...how likely is that?


A pic of the damage would be helpful in determining whether that scratch is the cause. Are you able to snap a pic of it?


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> A pic of the damage would be helpful in determining whether that scratch is the cause. Are you able to snap a pic of it?


I'll post pics later today of the scratches showing the copper on the MB and pics of the CPU socket (which to me seems fine, but I might be wrong ofc). I'll also get a magnifying glass to take a better look at it.

Let me know if I'm derailing the thread with my troubleshooting, I can make a new topic somewhere since it might be a MB issue...


----------



## tatmMRKIV

if you got copper traces showing on your mobo...99% sure thats your problem


----------



## Norlig

Done delid-ing and managed to get a bump on the edge of the CPU when I used the vice...

This is the result:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!













Stock cooler though, will mount my watercooling kit later on

Fooled ya, didnt I


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> if you got copper traces showing on your mobo...99% sure thats your problem


Let's hope so, it mean's my delid probably worked, lol!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> A pic of the damage would be helpful in determining whether that scratch is the cause. Are you able to snap a pic of it?


Here's some pics, I've made an album on imgur to make it easier to view:


http://imgur.com/Rj1cm


Got close ups of the scratches as well CPU socket pics, close ups on where I think the traces are messed up and some damage caused by screws (which I think are insulated considering where its located, but what do I know..).

Thanks for all the help, is the issue IS the MB I'll take to a repair shop tomorrow to fix that trace and then I'll check if the delid worked. If it didn't, I have the replacement CPU already, which I'm tempted to delid too if the previous worked lol.

Edit: I've checking my PSU with multimeter and all rails seem fine, specially the 12v which is perfect 12.2v...


----------



## orndorf77

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orndorf77*
> 
> I have a delidid i7 4790k @ 4.7ghz @ 1.28v under full load in cpu-z , my chip has been stable for over a year, when I monitor my temperatures these are my results when idling
> 
> 
> core 1, 3 and 4 are normal but core 2 is extremely hot, my temperatures were normal on all 4 cores until 3 days ago , what is wrong with my chip and how do I fix it ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> 90c on idle? Sounds like a bad sensor.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Bad sensor is definitely a possibility. So, might as well check the TIM and mounting before declaring that.


I came to the conclusion that its a bad sensor because I ran 3dmark11 benchmark and I did hours of gaming yesterday and my pc did not crash, also my cpu temperature in my bios reads 92c and that is before my computer boots up, I don't think it is possible for a cpu to be 92c before the computer even starts, the highest temperature a cpu could be before booting up is ambient temperature.

new question, is a temperature sensor in the cpu or is it part of the motherboard ?


----------



## psyshack

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Let's hope so, it mean's my delid probably worked, lol!
> 
> Here's some pics, I've made an album on imgur to make it easier to view:
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/Rj1cm
> 
> 
> Got close ups of the scratches as well CPU socket pics, close ups on where I think the traces are messed up and some damage caused by screws (which I think are insulated considering where its located, but what do I know..).
> 
> Thanks for all the help, is the issue IS the MB I'll take to a repair shop tomorrow to fix that trace and then I'll check if the delid worked. If it didn't, I have the replacement CPU already, which I'm tempted to delid too if the previous worked lol.
> 
> Edit: I've checking my PSU with multimeter and all rails seem fine, specially the 12v which is perfect 12.2v...


You could do the old pencil mod trick to the traces and see if that helps. Or try the replacement cpu. You have the ability to trouble shoot this your self.


----------



## LagunaX

Well what did realtemp say?
Sensors are stuck or bad if they don't move on the sensor test on realtemp.


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *psyshack*
> 
> You could do the old pencil mod trick to the traces and see if that helps. Or try the replacement cpu. You have the ability to trouble shoot this your self.


I already tried the new CPU! Same thing, on/off cycle. That's why I'm thinking the delid might have succeed but I killed the MB.

I was looking for pen (circuit writer precision pen or something) to draw on the trace but it'll take a few days for it to get there...will try the pencil mod, good idea.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> I already tried the new CPU! Same thing, on/off cycle. That's why I'm thinking the delid might have succeed but I killed the MB.
> 
> I was looking for pen (circuit writer precision pen or something) to draw on the trace but it'll take a few days for it to get there...will try the pencil mod, good idea.


So you tried the new non delidded CPU using the same mobo and got the same temp results?

Have you tried clearing the cmos?


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> So you tried the new non delidded CPU using the same mobo and got the same temp results?
> 
> Have you tried clearing the cmos?


yup, brand new cpu same results. Powers on for 1 sec and off...
tried clearing cmos in every possible way (jumper, switch, battery removal...) the only thing i didnt try was 24 hour cmos bat removal, but i tried with it out after 10hours.

tried pencil mod just now and it didnt work as well...
psu rails are fine...unless i cant see something broken in the cpu socket im out of ideas.


----------



## psyshack

Have you tried the ram? Early on my 5930K had the memory controller go fubar. With all four sticks of ram on the board it would start and stop. Power on and go through boot loops at 3 to 5 sec. On off, on off. I did not know at the time it was the cpu. I pulled all the ram and it booted on every stick except for on dimm slot. I at that point was sure the board had chucked the dimm slot. Once I gave up on MSI support through email and made a phone call they replaced the board pronto. It did the same thing with the new replacement board. I felt horrible. I called MSI and told them. I offered to pay for the new replacement board they had just sent to me. They refused my offer and wished me good luck with Intel. Intel was really cool about the whole mess and agreed to a one time warranty exchange even after I told them I oc'ed the heck out of it. They suggested I buy the insurance for the replacement cpu. Which I did. I was looking forward to deliding the 5930K so much. So now I have my razor, torch and heat absorbing putty put back up.









Sorry for the story.

Bottom Line: The 5930K would boot with any combo of three ram sticks as long as nothing was in dimm 3. It ran fine, oc and all.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Let's hope so, it mean's my delid probably worked, lol!
> Here's some pics, I've made an album on imgur to make it easier to view:
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/Rj1cm
> 
> 
> Got close ups of the scratches as well CPU socket pics, close ups on where I think the traces are messed up and some damage caused by screws (which I think are insulated considering where its located, but what do I know..).
> 
> Thanks for all the help, is the issue IS the MB I'll take to a repair shop tomorrow to fix that trace and then I'll check if the delid worked. If it didn't, I have the replacement CPU already, which I'm tempted to delid too if the previous worked lol.
> 
> Edit: I've checking my PSU with multimeter and all rails seem fine, specially the 12v which is perfect 12.2v...


It looks like you're right, that scratch on the front of the board goes right over one of those traces - maybe one of the assorted OCN "Mobo Gurus" can lend some expertise on the matter. The other scratches don't look like they're over anything important. This one, however, looks like it severed the trace. All of the pins in the socket look good, none of them look bent. If I was in your shoes, I'd check out that repair place and see what they'd charge to fix that. Also, sounds like you were able to rule out the PSU as the culprit. It's looking more and more like the board is the cause.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> It looks like you're right, that scratch on the front of the board goes right over one of those traces - maybe one of the assorted OCN "Mobo Gurus" can lend some expertise on the matter. The other scratches don't look like they're over anything important. This one, however, looks like it severed the trace. All of the pins in the socket look good, none of them look bent. If I was in your shoes, I'd check out that repair place and see what they'd charge to fix that. Also, sounds like you were able to rule out the PSU as the culprit. It's looking more and more like the board is the cause.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


As much as I can't stand Linus, he had a video on using a silver pen for trace repair. Try it out and see if it helps. Also it might be possible to try a cold solder pen. I think they have something along those lines.





Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Why not reply to the person with the scratched mobo? It's not me....


Lol thought i was.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> yup, brand new cpu same results. Powers on for 1 sec and off...
> tried clearing cmos in every possible way (jumper, switch, battery removal...) the only thing i didnt try was 24 hour cmos bat removal, but i tried with it out after 10hours.
> 
> tried pencil mod just now and it didnt work as well...
> psu rails are fine...unless i cant see something broken in the cpu socket im out of ideas.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> As much as I can't stand Linus, he had a video on using a silver pen for trace repair. Try it out and see if it helps. Also it might be possible to try a cold solder pen. I think they have something along those lines.


Why not reply to the person with the scratched mobo? It's not me....


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orndorf77*
> 
> I came to the conclusion that its a bad sensor because I ran 3dmark11 benchmark and I did hours of gaming yesterday and my pc did not crash, also my cpu temperature in my bios reads 92c and that is before my computer boots up, I don't think it is possible for a cpu to be 92c before the computer even starts, the highest temperature a cpu could be before booting up is ambient temperature.
> 
> new question, is a temperature sensor in the cpu or is it part of the motherboard ?


It's part of the CPU, embedded within the die.


----------



## Exilon

TC 5026 arrived!

NT-H1 after >500 thermal cycles. Voids are clearly visible.


Super sketchy and unlabeled tube shipped from Hong Kong. I hope it doesn't catch on fire or give me cancer.


This thing is seriously runny, but fairly effective. 37 C rise over liquid temp for 135W load for an initial R of 0.27 K/W. Time to hit with a bunch of thermal cycles and see what happens.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> TC 5026 arrived!
> 
> NT-H1 after >500 thermal cycles. Voids are clearly visible.
> 
> 
> Super sketchy and unlabeled tube shipped from Hong Kong. I hope it doesn't catch on fire or give me cancer.
> 
> 
> This thing is seriously runny, but fairly effective. 37 C rise over liquid temp for 135W load for an initial R of 0.27 K/W. Time to hit with a bunch of thermal cycles and see what happens.


Let us know how the paste performs. The TC-5026 is quite interesting according to DOW. It's strange that it's "not available" in the US...that kind of leads me to believe it's made of something not so good (whale tusks)...hehe


----------



## tatmMRKIV

USA has to deal with copyright formulas maybe?
Otherwise its made of lead and mercury xD


----------



## rsturtle

Here's my poor battered 4690k. Haven't used clu on it. Waiting for it to come in. Using noctua paste in the mean time. I tried using the vice only method and chewed it up really bad. Tried the vice plus wood/hammer and still couldn't get it off. Got tired of playing around and just used a blade. The knick is from failing with the vice... Razor method is better for me apparently.










Close up, sorry for the bad quality.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Here's my poor battered 4690k. Haven't used clu on it. Waiting for it to come in. Using noctua paste in the mean time. I tried using the vice only method and chewed it up really bad. Tried the vice plus wood/hammer and still couldn't get it off. Got tired of playing around and just used a blade. The knick is from failing with the vice... Razor method is better for me apparently.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Close up, sorry for the bad quality.


Little chip in the PCB won't likely hurt anything. I mucked up my 3770k much worse than that during my first delid endeavor and it still works fine.

Damaged chip can be seen in the initial post here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1478544/the-build-formerly-known-as-the-devil-inside-a-gaming-htpc-for-my-wife-4770k-corsair-250d-powercolor-r9-290/0_20


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Little chip in the PCB won't likely hurt anything. I mucked up my 3770k much worse than that during my first delid endeavor and it still works fine.
> 
> Damaged chip can be seen in the initial post here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1478544/the-build-formerly-known-as-the-devil-inside-a-gaming-htpc-for-my-wife-4770k-corsair-250d-powercolor-r9-290/0_20


Holy cow! That chip indeed had a worse experience than mine. Luckily that was a good clocker. Mine needs nearly 1.2 volt to hit 4.3. Took the lid off because temperature was limiting me. May be able to get 4.6 with 1.3v but will require a cooler upgrade to a 240 rad.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Here's my poor battered 4690k. Haven't used clu on it. Waiting for it to come in. Using noctua paste in the mean time. I tried using the vice only method and chewed it up really bad. Tried the vice plus wood/hammer and still couldn't get it off. Got tired of playing around and just used a blade. The knick is from failing with the vice... Razor method is better for me apparently.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Close up, sorry for the bad quality.


Yea, you gotta use protection.









No seriously, you have to make sure to mask up the jaws really really well.

but it doesnt look like the jaws screwed it up much. Is it not working?


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea, you gotta use protection.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No seriously, you have to make sure to mask up the jaws really really well.
> 
> but it doesnt look like the jaws screwed it up much. Is it not working?


I taped up with a few layers of electrical tape. The only thing that got junked up is the ihs, you can see where I had to sand it to make better contact. Planning on lapping it at this point. It works fine!


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> It looks like you're right, that scratch on the front of the board goes right over one of those traces - maybe one of the assorted OCN "Mobo Gurus" can lend some expertise on the matter. The other scratches don't look like they're over anything important. This one, however, looks like it severed the trace. All of the pins in the socket look good, none of them look bent. If I was in your shoes, I'd check out that repair place and see what they'd charge to fix that. Also, sounds like you were able to rule out the PSU as the culprit. It's looking more and more like the board is the cause.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> As much as I can't stand Linus, he had a video on using a silver pen for trace repair. Try it out and see if it helps. Also it might be possible to try a cold solder pen. I think they have something along those lines.


Thanks for the help guys! Good video as well..I'm taking the mb to a shop in a few hours and they can test it on the spot since i don't have much at home except a multimeter. If i was on my hometown everything would be easier since i have friends with similar hardware, trouble shooting of everything would take one night hehehe.
In a bit we'll know what is happening!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *psyshack*
> 
> Have you tried the ram? Early on my 5930K had the memory controller go fubar. With all four sticks of ram on the board it would start and stop. Power on and go through boot loops at 3 to 5 sec. On off, on off. I did not know at the time it was the cpu. I pulled all the ram and it booted on every stick except for on dimm slot. I at that point was sure the board had chucked the dimm slot. Once I gave up on MSI support through email and made a phone call they replaced the board pronto. It did the same thing with the new replacement board. I felt horrible. I called MSI and told them. I offered to pay for the new replacement board they had just sent to me. They refused my offer and wished me good luck with Intel. Intel was really cool about the whole mess and agreed to a one time warranty exchange even after I told them I oc'ed the heck out of it. They suggested I buy the insurance for the replacement cpu. Which I did. I was looking forward to deliding the 5930K so much. So now I have my razor, torch and heat absorbing putty put back up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry for the story.
> 
> Bottom Line: The 5930K would boot with any combo of three ram sticks as long as nothing was in dimm 3. It ran fine, oc and all.


These power on off errors are such a mess to figure out..everything cau cause it lol. I did try ram in every possible combination but afaik if mb and cpu were fine and i had no ram, i would get the long beep right? Im not even getting that!


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Let us know how the paste performs. The TC-5026 is quite interesting according to DOW. It's strange that it's "not available" in the US...that kind of leads me to believe it's made of something not so good (whale tusks)...hehe


I think it's just old. MSDS was approved in 1999.

TC 5026 seems to work well, certainly better than NT-H1 after cooking. It's also not conductive; I know because I accidentally squirted it all over the socket.







Seriously runny stuff... However it doesn't seem to run from nickel or silicon nitride.

No degradation:



As you can see my equipment isn't all that accurate, but large # of samples still concur on the real value.

No throttling at >200W load under smallFFT (close though). This Dow Corning "paste" puts many enthusiast pastes to shame.


tl;dr: oh boy you thought CPU performance stagnated...

TC 5688 is more interesting:
Quote:


> Dow Corning®TC-5688 Thermally Conductive Compound was developed exclusively for Intel microprocessors in collaboration with the Intel Mobile Platforms Group. TC-5688 was developed and optimized for multi-chip packages and employs a proprietary formula of advanced silicone polymers that interacts with thermally conductive filler particles to form a matrix that is highly resistant to pump-out and other common failure mechanisms. The result is a thermal compound that delivers extreme performance and exceptional reliability for the thermal interface needs.


But I can only find it sold in the US in 1KG jars for $650. Apparently sellers in China have diverted several jars and are selling them in 3.5g tubes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> USA has to deal with copyright formulas maybe?
> Otherwise its made of lead and mercury xD


Are we talking about TC 5026 or CLU?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Thanks for the help guys! Good video as well..I'm taking the mb to a shop in a few hours and they can test it on the spot since i don't have much at home except a multimeter. If i was on my hometown everything would be easier since i have friends with similar hardware, trouble shooting of everything would take one night hehehe.
> In a bit we'll know what is happening!
> These power on off errors are such a mess to figure out..everything cau cause it lol. I did try ram in every possible combination but afaik if mb and cpu were fine and i had no ram, i would get the long beep right? Im not even getting that!


Yea I hope it pans out. If you have to get a new mobo may I advise you get one with a code display so at least you have an idea


----------



## orndorf77

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> It's part of the CPU, embedded within the die.


I guess the problem with my sensor is fixed, I booted up my computer and opened realtemp 3.70 today and my idle temps were normal on all 4 cores,


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Holy cow! That chip indeed had a worse experience than mine. Luckily that was a good clocker. Mine needs nearly 1.2 volt to hit 4.3. Took the lid off because temperature was limiting me. May be able to get 4.6 with 1.3v but will require a cooler upgrade to a 240 rad.


I assumed it was dead, until months later when I tested the chip. Sold to a friend and still chugging along.

With the delid and CLU you should be able to cool an i7 with a bit more voltage than 1.2V and only 4.3GHz

4790k in my HTPC is nearly 1.3V @ 4.7GHz. My trusty old Antec 620 with a single inaudible SilenX Effizio Thermistor fan tames the heat there. A 30+ min BD rip with the CPU pegged at 95%, or more, and the temps only hit maybe very low 80's if it's a longer rip. Could the temp be better? Sure, but it's possible with a single thin 120mm rad. During normal use and gaming the temps are more than acceptable.

The chip has more headroom, but the 4.7 was the highest clock I achieved with the 120mm rad in Intel Burn Test. The linpack stress will have it at max around 100C..but will pass a few max stress runs with 8GB RAM. Never tried to push it past 4.7 as I didn't really see a point due to diminishing returns.


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea I hope it pans out. If you have to get a new mobo may I advise you get one with a code display so at least you have an idea


The MB is a GB Z87X OC Force, it does have the dual digit led display but since the power on/off cycle is so fast and apparently the CPU doesn't even get initialized, the leds do not display any error code.









I took it to the shop, they are taking a look at it. They already inspected the trace (with magnifiers) which I posted pics and said the scratch is very superficial and its very unlikely its the culprit. I'll know in a few hours I guess..

Maybe static fried the MB, even though I was wearing anti static wristband, I must have messed up somewhere...


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Are we talking about TC 5026 or CLU?


http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_pro_englisch.pdf

Was curious so I looked it up just now.
Quote:


> TOXICOLOGICAL INFORMATION
> 
> 11.1
> Toxicological examinations
> 
> 11.1
> Acute toxicity
> 
> The metal alloy has not been tested, the single components of the alloy are below the limits of acute toxicity even if a full resorption is assumed.
> 
> 11.2
> Effects at humans
> 
> So far as the generally applicable regulations of industrial hygiene were adhered to, any harmful effect on the health has not become known.
> 
> After swallowing: Leaves the body on natural way.
> 
> After skin contact: With frequent skin contact skin defatting is possible
> 
> Afterinhalation: Due to the very low steam pressure not applicably
> 
> After eye contact: Splashes in the eyes may cause irritations.


Terrible translation and inability to count to three aside, that pretty clearly says it's safe to drink. And yeah that's liquid pro; google doesn't find the liquid ultra safety sheet but toggling some URLS gives...

http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/safetydatasheet_liquid_ultra_englisch.pdf

Which has similar information.


----------



## Valgaur

Herro my peoples!

I iz baks from my vacations!


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Herro my peoples!
> 
> I iz baks from my vacations!


Welcome back! Where'd ya go?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Herro my peoples!
> 
> I iz baks from my vacations!


Ohhhh Herrrrooooo! Howrou doin? >.>


----------



## Valgaur

I went home for a week, been running the business like a mad dog lately









Thanks for the welcome backs!


----------



## beginner1

Righto I'm in, delidded 3770K


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beginner1*
> 
> Righto I'm in, delidded 3770K


Congrats! Hows the OC going?


----------



## Sheyster

Wow, almost 2900 pages in this thread.









So, about to de-lid this 4790K using the "gentle vice only" method. What is the latest consensus on the best liquid metal to use between the die and IHS?

- Phobya LM
- CLU
- CLP

Please advise.


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Wow, almost 2900 pages in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, about to de-lid this 4790K using the "gentle vice only" method. What is the latest consensus on the best liquid metal to use between the die and IHS?
> 
> - Phobya LM
> - CLU
> - CLP
> 
> Please advise.


You have the correct order in the lowest temps, though they all are pretty close.
Just remember to:
1) pad the plastic green pcb side with a thick rubber band or something similar so it's not pcb against bare metal,
2) finger nail polish protect the resistors to the side of the die prior to the liquid metal to prevent shorts,
3) don't use too much, you actually need very little - just a very thin film spread out over the bare die,
4) remember you 15 day return policy from Microcenter, LOL!


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> You have the correct order in the lowest temps, though they all are pretty close.
> Just remember to:
> 1) pad the plastic green pcb side with a thick rubber band or something similar so it's not pcb against bare metal,
> 2) finger nail polish protect the resistors to the side of the die prior to the liquid metal to prevent shorts,
> 3) don't use too much, you actually need very little - just a very thin film spread out over the bare die,
> 4) remember you 15 day return policy from Microcenter, LOL!


Thanks! +rep! I watched a video and will pad the vice well.







BTW, having the TIM's in order was purely coincidence.


----------



## beginner1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Congrats! Hows the OC going?


Seems ok, but temps a little higher than I was expecting, might need to tinker with the liquid metal and block mounting see if I can get a better contact. Fresh CPU so hard to tell


----------



## Darkz0r

I can't believe what I'm going to write but my delid SUCCEEDED.

I did nick the CPU PCB on two sides but as I said, they were minor nicks and didn't invade the dark green area (circuitry).
One of the nicks even raised the upper part of the PCB a little (like, disconnected the top layer of the PCB from the layer below, but I patched both nicks with liquid electric tape.

Turns out my )$(*@(*$( MB was the cause indeed, but the scratch I posted was not the culprit. Repair shop told me the issue was THE POWER CONNECTOR (***?). When I powered on with the 24 pin ATX everything was fine (I mean, MB stayed on but obviously no POST), when I plugged the 12v ATX (any of them, 8pin or 4 pin) I got the power cycle issue.

So much for being rational. You decide to delid for the first time, scratch the MB + awful delid = hey I must have killed them both. But somehow the power connector broke in the process. How? No ******* clue. Only thing I can think of is that I could have given the 12v atx a static charge with my hand, but very unlikely...

Anyways, back to my i7 4770k now delided, idle temp with H220X = 30C in a 25-27C room. Prime 95 Small FFT`s for an hour and max temp is 50C, this @ stock though.
The liquid electrical tape inside the CPU should dry 100% in 24 hours then I`ll try OC`ing and see how it goes, for now I`m running it cold to avoid ******* up the tape and leaking CLU into the VRMs = death.


----------



## 0ldChicken

has anyone tried/gotten good results from using kryonaut between the die and IHS? I've already got some kryo (tomorrow hopefully) and would love to not use conductive/corrosives as well as save 20$+ not buying CLU

I'm looking to delid my 4790k and will probably practice on my g3258.

I'll probably do it either way and post what I find


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> has anyone tried/gotten good results from using kryonaut between the die and IHS? I've already got some kryo (tomorrow hopefully) and would love to not use conductive/corrosives as well as save 20$+ not buying CLU
> 
> I'm looking to delid my 4790k and will probably practice on my g3258.
> 
> I'll probably do it either way and post what I find


I tried NT-H1, PK-3, TC 5026, and Kryonaut.

PK-3 performed worse than TC 5026, so that's out. Wasn't nearly as hard to spread as some people were saying but performance as TIM1 was disappointing ( +40C @ 135W ).

Kyronaut is giving me a 135W load dT of +33C over liquid, and +52 C in smallFFT (215W). Fairly easy to spread, almost as easy as TC 5026. Now running 60 second load-idle cycles to see how long it takes to pump out, but so far no sign of degradation almost 200 cycles in.

Kryonaut (~0.24 C/W):


Can someone calculate their thermal resistance with CLU as tim1? It's easy if you have liquid temp diodes or an Corsair Link AIO/NZXT Kraken. It's (package temperature - liquid temp)/package power.

The other two pastes results (you can see I'm getting better at collecting and filtering)

TC 5026 (~0.27 C/W):


NT-H1 (lol I dunno):


NT-H1 separated and pumped out:


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I tried NT-H1, PK-3, TC 5026, and Kryonaut.
> snip


Thanks! your the second positive results i've seen so far out of 2! i hope to be adding to that in a few days. post updates if anything changes with the kryo pumpout?


----------



## jdorje

Is there a way in hwinfo to make a custom field that is (h80i_temp - package_temp) / package_power? Cuz that'd be awesome. Or are you just taking the spreadsheet of the data export and then calculating it yourself?

And uh...lower is better for this value, right?











Disclaimer: I'm pretty sure my motherboard's sensors are crap, especially for CPU package power.

I used here the fields "temperature 1" from the h80i (this sensor is inside the waterblock heat sink itself, I believe), "CPU Package" from the CPU section, and "CPU Package Power" right below it. Logging done from hwinfo during a regular stress test, then loaded into google sheets from which I made the graph (which was a pain in the ass).

Does this graph mean that I'll get worse temperatures by delidding? Or are these values not comparable across chips or maybe across motherboards or CPU coolers?



Kinda strange! In this one I'm running a GPU stress test simultaneously, resulting in rather high CPU temps (radiator is on exhaust). Or maybe it's only a GPU stress test for part of it (the middle third), not sure.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> has anyone tried/gotten good results from using kryonaut between the die and IHS? I've already got some kryo (tomorrow hopefully) and would love to not use conductive/corrosives as well as save 20$+ not buying CLU
> 
> I'm looking to delid my 4790k and will probably practice on my g3258.
> 
> I'll probably do it either way and post what I find


You can use other TIMs between the IHS and the die, but you're not going to get the same type of temperature drop that you'd get with CLP or CLU.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Is there a way in hwinfo to make a custom field that is (h80i_temp - package_temp) / package_power? Cuz that'd be awesome. Or are you just taking the spreadsheet of the data export and then calculating it yourself?
> 
> And uh...lower is better for this value, right?


Dump it into a spread sheet, filter out idle power, calculate. Too much noise otherwise. Did you mean package temp - h80i temp? The h80i should always be cooler than the CPU package. Do these two sections match up or come close to it?



As for TG Kryonaut... 12 hours of thermal cycling later:



Looks like Kryonaut will last quite a while under normal usage. In fact temperatures are getting better.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Looks like Kryonaut will last quite a while under normal usage. In fact temperatures are getting better.


Good to know, I just ordered some before reading your post. Time to shelve that old tube of PK-3.


----------



## LagunaX

So is there any pump out effect with Kryonaut?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> So is there any pump out effect with Kryonaut?


Kyronaut seems resistant to pump out from thermal cycling. It remains to be seen whether it'll suffer from bake out (i.e. it has solvents or oils that degrade/evapoarte over time).


----------



## kc5vdj

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> yup, brand new cpu same results. Powers on for 1 sec and off...
> tried clearing cmos in every possible way (jumper, switch, battery removal...) the only thing i didnt try was 24 hour cmos bat removal, but i tried with it out after 10hours.
> 
> tried pencil mod just now and it didnt work as well...
> psu rails are fine...unless i cant see something broken in the cpu socket im out of ideas.


Just on a hunch. remove the power cord, and cmos battery for several minutes. before reinstalling them, push all power buttons and the clear cmos switch (discharge any capacitors). and then try again. i have had a similar situation on two boards where this cured that.

late edit: sorry, it seems you have tried that. it helps if i read the whole post...


----------



## Wirerat

I never even applied any heat. Just the vice. I use tape on the pcb side and simply crank the vice very slowly.

I am 5 for 5 flawless delids with this method using a $15 vice. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002RTKFWU/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_Fmo2vbDSADW30


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kc5vdj*
> 
> Just on a hunch. remove the power cord, and cmos battery for several minutes. before reinstalling them, push all power buttons and the clear cmos switch (discharge any capacitors). and then try again. i have had a similar situation on two boards where this cured that.
> 
> late edit: sorry, it seems you have tried that. it helps if i read the whole post...


Hehe, thanks for trying to help anyway. Somehow my MB died during the delid, that's what happened (yeah, what?). It's under repair atm and I'm using a new one.

I thought that my delid succeeded but I can't boot with more than 1 RAM stick, so I messed up something. My new CPU is working fine with all RAM sticks.

Upon checking the die again it seems a tiny amount of CLU dropped to the side where the VRMs are (or w/e they are called), *though they are 100% protected by liquid electrical tape*, I think that could explain with not all RAMs are working.
I lack patience to troubleshoot it atm, will be using the new CPU for a while lol.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Hehe, thanks for trying to help anyway. Somehow my MB died during the delid, that's what happened (yeah, what?). It's under repair atm and I'm using a new one.
> 
> I thought that my delid succeeded but I can't boot with more than 1 RAM stick, so I messed up something. My new CPU is working fine with all RAM sticks.
> 
> Upon checking the die again it seems a tiny amount of CLU dropped to the side where the VRMs are (or w/e they are called), *though they are 100% protected by liquid electrical tape*, I think that could explain with not all RAMs are working.
> I lack patience to troubleshoot it atm, will be using the new CPU for a while lol.


That shouldn't be it. The capacitors that you can see next to the die, were they to be shorted, would cause massive failure, they supply voltage to entire areas of the CPU after all, it wouldn't just knock out one channel of RAM.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> That shouldn't be it. The capacitors that you can see next to the die, were they to be shorted, would cause massive failure, they supply voltage to entire areas of the CPU after all, it wouldn't just knock out one channel of RAM.


Agreed. It would be no video + cpu light/error code if the caps were shorted.

Darkz0r,
I would reseat the cpu again. Pull it all the way out and start the install over. Redo the ihs to cooler paste. The die to ihs tim can stay.

Give the pcb a wiggle in the slot before locking the latch down.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Agreed. It would be no video + cpu light/error code if the caps were shorted.
> 
> Darkz0r,
> I would reseat the cpu again. Pull it all the way out and start the install over. Redo the ihs to cooler paste. The die to ihs tim can stay.
> 
> Give the pcb a wiggle in the slot before locking the latch down.


Also, not sure if you've done this, but check for any smudges or dirty contact pads on the bottom of the CPU. I have heard of people with issues which were resolved by cleaning the pads.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> Hehe, thanks for trying to help anyway. Somehow my MB died during the delid, that's what happened (yeah, what?). It's under repair atm and I'm using a new one.
> 
> I thought that my delid succeeded but I can't boot with more than 1 RAM stick, so I messed up something. My new CPU is working fine with all RAM sticks.
> 
> Upon checking the die again it seems a tiny amount of CLU dropped to the side where the VRMs are (or w/e they are called), *though they are 100% protected by liquid electrical tape*, I think that could explain with not all RAMs are working.
> I lack patience to troubleshoot it atm, will be using the new CPU for a while lol.


Just curious but was the mobo around fluids at all? Stupid question because if the eps connector got fried from water damage the CPU almost def would too. I just ask because that happened to me twice when I power cycled because my rad leaked. I've had bad luck with watercoolibg.


----------



## Darkz0r

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> That shouldn't be it. The capacitors that you can see next to the die, were they to be shorted, would cause massive failure, they supply voltage to entire areas of the CPU after all, it wouldn't just knock out one channel of RAM.


At least the liquid tape worked then! I did apply two layers, it was quite a big blob of tape.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Agreed. It would be no video + cpu light/error code if the caps were shorted.
> 
> Darkz0r,
> I would reseat the cpu again. Pull it all the way out and start the install over. Redo the ihs to cooler paste. The die to ihs tim can stay.
> 
> Give the pcb a wiggle in the slot before locking the latch down.


Wiggling the PCB seems like a good idea, I noticed that my new z97 extreme6 MB has a misaligned CPU socket pin. Not sure if when I installed the H220X I put too much pressure on the screws and somehow a lone pin @ the middle left part kinda got bent or I got it that way. I kinda fixed the alignment with a pencil and the new CPU works, but the delided still had the RAM issues. Maybe that pin can have something to do with it.

I'm not 100% sure if the pin is fixed since sometimes I get SATA errors (on the MB led) while booting for the first time after a few hours of power off, but after resetting from this 1st failed boot it boots normally. I have 3 SSDs and 2 HDDs installed, if I remove one HDD it boots fine always. Go figure...already checked disk and everything, the every disk is fine and was working before







I`m kinda going crazy lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Also, not sure if you've done this, but check for any smudges or dirty contact pads on the bottom of the CPU. I have heard of people with issues which were resolved by cleaning the pads.


I'll clean with isopropyl the pads again, you never know right. Last time I installed maybe I dirtied with my fingers








At this point you never know, lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Just curious but was the mobo around fluids at all? Stupid question because if the eps connector got fried from water damage the CPU almost def would too. I just ask because that happened to me twice when I power cycled because my rad leaked. I've had bad luck with watercoolibg.


Damn, that's some bad luck, but at least you CPU didn't die too right? ;/ I plan to build a custom loop eventually but experiences like that have been holding me back hehe.
After the delid I installed the H220X outside the case (on top of some cardboard box lol) just to test, unless water leaked from the end of the tubes (near the CPU) I didn't notice rad leakage. Let's hope it won't happen!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkz0r*
> 
> At least the liquid tape worked then! I did apply two layers, it was quite a big blob of tape.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wiggling the PCB seems like a good idea, I noticed that my new z97 extreme6 MB has a misaligned CPU socket pin. Not sure if when I installed the H220X I put too much pressure on the screws and somehow a lone pin @ the middle left part kinda got bent or I got it that way. I kinda fixed the alignment with a pencil and the new CPU works, but the delided still had the RAM issues. Maybe that pin can have something to do with it.
> 
> I'm not 100% sure if the pin is fixed since sometimes I get SATA errors (on the MB led) while booting for the first time after a few hours of power off, but after resetting from this 1st failed boot it boots normally. I have 3 SSDs and 2 HDDs installed, if I remove one HDD it boots fine always. Go figure...already checked disk and everything, the every disk is fine and was working before
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I`m kinda going crazy lol
> I'll clean with isopropyl the pads again, you never know right. Last time I installed maybe I dirtied with my fingers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At this point you never know, lol.
> Damn, that's some bad luck, but at least you CPU didn't die too right? ;/ I plan to build a custom loop eventually but experiences like that have been holding me back hehe.
> After the delid I installed the H220X outside the case (on top of some cardboard box lol) just to test, unless water leaked from the end of the tubes (near the CPU) I didn't notice rad leakage. Let's hope it won't happen!


Unfortunately it did fry both the mobo and the cpu. Both times it was due to stupid mistakes. The AIOs are pretty solid from what i understand so its all good. i just wanted a combined cpu and gpu loop. if and when you do yours, make sure you build a drain valve in, as well as a way to bleed the air


----------



## PapaSmurf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> Wiggling the PCB seems like a good idea, I noticed that my new z97 extreme6 MB has a misaligned CPU socket pin. Not sure if when I installed the H220X I put too much pressure on the screws and somehow a lone pin @ the middle left part kinda got bent or I got it that way. I kinda fixed the alignment with a pencil and the new CPU works, but the delided still had the RAM issues. Maybe that pin can have something to do with it.
> 
> I'm not 100% sure if the pin is fixed since sometimes I get SATA errors (on the MB led) while booting for the first time after a few hours of power off, but after resetting from this 1st failed boot it boots normally. I have 3 SSDs and 2 HDDs installed, if I remove one HDD it boots fine always. Go figure...already checked disk and everything, the every disk is fine and was working before
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I`m kinda going crazy lol


That is often times indicative of drives not fully initializing, although nothing it actually wrong with them. You might want to look in your bios for a setting to delay the hard drives. Set it for 1 to 5 seconds to allow all of the drivers to initialize before booting. I used run into that quite a lot on servers and systems with a lot of hard drives in them. Once the drives were warmed up there wasn't a problem, but when they were cold (like when the system had been turned off overnight) one or more of them would drop out on the first try, similar to what you are describing.

On a side note, how can you tell if delidding is going to allow for a better overclock? I know that nothing is foolproof, but is their any indicators of the likelihood of success? My i7-3770k seems to hit a wall around 4.3GHz for a 24/7 OC without running into cooling issues. Using a Hyper 212 Plus at the moment, but am considering getting a higher end cooling solution in the near future.

Any ides would be appreciated.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> On a side note, how can you tell if delidding is going to allow for a better overclock? I know that nothing is foolproof, but is their any indicators of the likelihood of success? My i7-3770k seems to hit a wall around 4.3GHz for a 24/7 OC without running into cooling issues. Using a Hyper 212 Plus at the moment, but am considering getting a higher end cooling solution in the near future.
> 
> Any ides would be appreciated.


If you hit a wall a 4.3GHz, de-lidding won't help you get a better OC, unless the issue is heat, and *not* stability or voltages. (which you say it's not)

You're pretty much stuck due to the silicon lottery.


----------



## PapaSmurf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> On a side note, how can you tell if delidding is going to allow for a better overclock? I know that nothing is foolproof, but is their any indicators of the likelihood of success? My i7-3770k seems to hit a wall around 4.3GHz for a 24/7 OC without running into cooling issues. Using a Hyper 212 Plus at the moment, but am considering getting a higher end cooling solution in the near future.
> 
> Any ides would be appreciated.
> 
> 
> 
> If you hit a wall a 4.3GHz, de-lidding won't help you get a better OC, unless the issue is heat, and *not* stability or voltages. (which you say it's not)
> 
> You're pretty much stuck due to the silicon lottery.
Click to expand...

Here are a couple of CPU-Zs from when I tried 4.4 / 4.5GHz. I never spent a lot of time trying to stabilize it as when I upped the voltage temps started getting too high for my comfort. I wasn't using that system that much so I didn't work with it a lot (been running my 2700k as my everyday rig as it runs considerably cooler). I think the vcore in the second one is way off though.

http://valid.canardpc.com/4vh5uv

http://valid.canardpc.com/b36h3y


----------



## HMRMike

Greetings!
It's hot where I live. My poor 4670K could barely hit 4.3GHz with an Antec 920 without jumping into the high 80s. The dual fans screamed and begged me to stop the torture.
So I delidded the miserable device. With an old Soviet razor blade (better than fat American razor blade).


It survived!


Used Noctua NT-H1 on both sides. Worked great, at least kept the fans silent which was my biggest issue. it was 28 degrees air sucked into the radiator.


But the darn stuff keeps pumping out and failing. It doesn't fail at the water block, only at the core.
I read about the guy who used some Indium alloys. But that costs more than I'm willing to pay for some TIM.
So I did what any angry person would do. I took Bolton 136 alloy, AKA Chip Quik Removal Alloy (I use it to remove SMD stuff, it melts at 60 degrees), applied it on both sides of a constantly heated IHS in a thin layer, exactly like Liquid Pro/Ultra, and seated the still hot (about 90 degrees) on the CPU before installing the thing back in it's place on the motherboard.
Boot to UEFI, wait for the CPU to heat up with the water pump off and reflow the stuff exactly like Indigo Xtreme.
It did this. 69 degrees at the hottest core. Well at least it did something!


This alloy has 49% Bismuth in it, so the thermal conductivity kind of sucks for a metal.
I also couldn't get it to fill the whole area, it kept flowing to form bubble at some single area, even though I reflowed it with the case horizontal.


It did look rather fine at the core (note the metal doesn't stick to the die, so no danger of harming it when removing the IHS again. At worst, a light tap will free it):


Next step was to use a 2:1 mixture of 63/37 solder and the fusible alloy. It raised the melting range to 80-90 degrees and reduced the Bismuth content, which improves thermal conductivity, and removes the stupid expansion of the material when COOLING, Bismuth sucks like that.
At the water block I reverted to the NT-H1.
Final test with a Corsair H100i set to silent mode, 30 mind numbing degrees in my room.


No more stupid noise, no more stupid heat!


----------



## beginner1

Anyone running the EK precisemount? I'm finding it a little glitchy, what is stable for me at the moment is tighten all the way down and back off one side a full turn, otherwise cant POST with memory error, I guess due to uneven seating pressure. I don't think this method is getting me the best possible contact though, I'd had it up previously and noted better temps, just wondering how you guys with it went about the install.

BTW I am using liquid ultra, applied / spread using the brush, is it easy to under/overdo this stuff? Maybe I put too much on?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *beginner1*
> 
> Anyone running the EK precisemount? I'm finding it a little glitchy, what is stable for me at the moment is tighten all the way down and back off one side a full turn, otherwise cant POST with memory error, I guess due to uneven seating pressure. I don't think this method is getting me the best possible contact though, I'd had it up previously and noted better temps, just wondering how you guys with it went about the install.
> 
> BTW I am using liquid ultra, applied / spread using the brush, is it easy to under/overdo this stuff? Maybe I put too much on?


With the naked mount, that is exactly what happens. If you put on too much pressure, the CPU PCB bows into the middle and the edges don't make proper contact. This is because the IHS normally serves to spread the pressure around the edges. This happens even with even mount pressure. You just need to find a sweet spot. With the CLU, you should have an extremely thin coat, with no visible bubbles of the liquid. I find it works best if you have a similar thin coat on both the die and the other surface.


----------



## beginner1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> With the naked mount, that is exactly what happens. If you put on too much pressure, the CPU PCB bows into the middle and the edges don't make proper contact. This is because the IHS normally serves to spread the pressure around the edges. This happens even with even mount pressure. You just need to find a sweet spot. With the CLU, you should have an extremely thin coat, with no visible bubbles of the liquid. I find it works best if you have a similar thin coat on both the die and the other surface.


Thanks mate very helpful, I reckon I've got too much CLU on there for a start and from there can work on the pressure


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> With the CLU, you should have an extremely thin coat, with no visible bubbles of the liquid. I find it works best if you have a similar thin coat on both the die and the other surface.


Good to know. I'm delidding my 4790K tonight using Phobya LM and will use this technique you suggest.

I picked up one of these for the job:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/BESSEY-4-in-Drill-Press-Vise-BV-DP40/205023096

I plan to use clear liquid nail polish to insulate the resistors on the PCB since I had some on hand from my wife.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> Here are a couple of CPU-Zs from when I tried 4.4 / 4.5GHz. I never spent a lot of time trying to stabilize it as when I upped the voltage temps started getting too high for my comfort. I wasn't using that system that much so I didn't work with it a lot (been running my 2700k as my everyday rig as it runs considerably cooler). I think the vcore in the second one is way off though.


That V-core is pretty normal for 4.4/4.5Ghz. (the 2nd is reporting idle voltage)
My 4770K runs 4.4Ghz on 1.25V, which initially ran 80-85C on an H100i, (under stress) then after delid its now around 60-65C (~30C ambient) (Tho I have also upgraded to a custom loop.)

But if you want a faster OC then you'll need to look at delidding, and slowly bumping up the voltage til you're happy, or hit your chip's limit.


----------



## psyshack

Hello

I have a 4790k Delid. But it's running with it's hat on right now on a H100i. I had it originally cooled on a loop with a EK Block and the naked kit. It did real well. 5ghz+ no problem. Went X99 and the EK block had to move on to a new job.

So how are people getting along with H100i's running them on naked cpu's? With the hat on it's folding 24/7 at 4.7 with 1.360v running low 70c temps. I can drop the cpu voltage when it's not folding and stay stable at anything else you wish to throw at it. If the H100i's are doing a good job whats a good way to make the mount?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *psyshack*
> 
> Hello
> 
> I have a 4790k Delid. But it's running with it's hat on right now on a H100i. I had it originally cooled on a loop with a EK Block and the naked kit. It did real well. 5ghz+ no problem. Went X99 and the EK block had to move on to a new job.
> 
> So how are people getting along with H100i's running them on naked cpu's? With the hat on it's folding 24/7 at 4.7 with 1.360v running low 70c temps. I can drop the cpu voltage when it's not folding and stay stable at anything else you wish to throw at it. If the H100i's are doing a good job whats a good way to make the mount?


to create a naked mount simply get rid of the backplate and the plastic inserts and use long blots/studs with plastic washers where it meets the mobos like this:




You just remove the locking mechanism that is still in the photos above and it works for naked. It will take a bit of trial and error to get the pressure right. Too much will bow the cpu pcb and through errors and too little wont recognize the cpu.

Its a lot of work for 1-2c imo.


----------



## fleetfeather

It's also a lot of work for potentially worse temperatures, depending on how quickly and harshly you load your CPU; when running naked, I witnessed harsher temperature spikes running delidded when quickly moving from an idle to 100% load state.

Some have suspected the cause of this phenomenon to be due to more limited 'heat conductive surface area' offered by direct die-to-waterblock contact, as opposed to die-to-IHS-to-waterblock contact. In lay terms, some suggest that more copper/nickel content aids in the quick transfer of heat away from the CPU die prior to water removing and distributing the heat through a water loop; the IHS serves as a quick 'heat sponge' before the water block surface and water/coolant absorb CPU heat.

(Physics and thermodynamics are pretty yuck IMO, and as such, I have 0 clues as to the validity of this explanation. I can only comment on my own observations when running naked)


----------



## Ceadderman

Makes a little sense imho.









Personally I would avoid removing the backplate. The PCB isn't meant to take the weight distribution. That's one of the reasons back plates exist on a stock board. And those stock plates are made for stock coolers which aren't that heavy to begin with.









~Ceadder


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Makes a little sense imho.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Personally I would avoid removing the backplate. The PCB isn't meant to take the weight distribution. That's one of the reasons back plates exist on a stock board. And those stock plates are made for stock coolers which aren't that heavy to begin with.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


You could leave the plastic back plate and just push studs through it like this:


I dont think it really needs the backplate though. I mean the aio block doesn't really weigh much. /shrug

Those pics are from my old setup. I hated the fact that the included h110 mount had slop in. So I switched to some hardware I brought home from work. I never did go naked but it would have worked removing the socket clamp.


----------



## psyshack

My H100i also had the slop issue. I used some none conductive washers to get rid of it. I've had this cpu hat off under a EK block with great results on a good loop. No overshoot temp spikes. Only 15 to 20c cooler temps depending on ambient.

The only reason a IHS is used is to protect the core from ham fisted idiot's. Like who came up with the vise method? That is a ham fisted idea. I've been delidding since the darn IHS's came out. I'm a scalpel kind of cutter. And will take heat to a soldered on lid. Haven't lost a cpu yet. May delid my 5930k yet.

I work with heat transfer everyday at work. I'm actually getting very sick of it. The IHS is a stupid insulator. There are iron laws of physics and thermal dynamics you cant cheat or bend the rules on. The college boys keep trying in a effort to justify there paychecks in my industry. And keep failing. If it wasn't work and millions of dollars were not at stake it would be funny. Any layer of material between a heat source and whats going to carry it away is a insulator. Even a tim is a insulator. Just not as bad of one as air.









Thanks for your input on the H100i. I'm not trusting Corsair anymore with there explosion of China made products. It seems about 50% of what I buy from them I have to RMA or just throw away. I'm working with them right now on a K65 keyboard. There ram has worked so poorly for me since the core2 duo's I switched to G. Skills and haven't had a issue one. And the one time I thought I had a issue they did offer to rma it without question. Turned out my first 5930k had a issue.


----------



## Ceadderman

But not everybody has steady hands and the vice method works.

All men are not equal. The Vice Method made them equal.









~Ceadder


----------



## fleetfeather

to play devils advocate for a minute,

given that copper has a higher heat conductivity than water, would it not be reasonable to suggest that running naked allows for less heat dissipation due to the coolant being less efficient at removing heat from a heat source, whereas the use of a highly thermally conductive copper IHS can more easily remove some heat output from a CPU die in a very limited time period until the copper IHS is _saturated_ with heat?

(if the extended response to this is too time consuming, feel free to respond with "nope")


----------



## Ceadderman

Copper block >>>>>>> IHS any day. Thermal paste sits between cpu and IHS so no different than running with IHS except two layers of TIM. imho.









~Ceadder


----------



## rsturtle

Looks like I killed my 4690k. After all of the super high voltage overclocking, hot temperatures, delidding, and lapping, I finally might have killed it. My CLU came in the mail today, so I went to go swap the Noctua paste that was on the die. I was extremely careful, taking over an hour to get the application just right. Put it back in, 00 post code. Tried 1 ram stick, clear cmos etc, no dice. Ergh. I took the cooler off to check and see if I had any extra CLU anywhere on the pcb, and couldn't find any. I did find a tiny, tiny sting of the stuff on one of the pin connectors on the bottom of the chip and wiped it off. Still wont post.


----------



## jdorje

The IHS is designed to spread the heat around some, while most heat sinks are designed to take in heat spread across the IHS. Remove the IHS and not only do you lose that very slight thermal buffer, you also now are relying on your heat sink to accept heat concentrated in a very small area.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Looks like I killed my 4690k. After all of the super high voltage overclocking, hot temperatures, delidding, and lapping, I finally might have killed it. My CLU came in the mail today, so I went to go swap the Noctua paste that was on the die. I was extremely careful, taking over an hour to get the application just right. Put it back in, 00 post code. Tried 1 ram stick, clear cmos etc, no dice. Ergh. I took the cooler off to check and see if I had any extra CLU anywhere on the pcb, and couldn't find any. I did find a tiny, tiny sting of the stuff on one of the pin connectors on the bottom of the chip and wiped it off. Still wont post.


Damn. I guess the stuff on the pins caused a short. I wouldn't write it off just yet though.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> The IHS is designed to spread the heat around some, while most heat sinks are designed to take in heat spread across the IHS. Remove the IHS and not only do you lose that very slight thermal buffer, you also now are relying on your heat sink to accept heat concentrated in a very small area.
> Damn. I guess the stuff on the pins caused a short. I wouldn't write it off just yet though.


Me ether. I think it may just be the mobo in this situation. The only completely dead delids I seen were all caused by nicking the pcb or cracking the die.

If the cpu has no physical damage it most likely will post in another mobo.

I would pull the mobo out and inspect everything paying close attention to the cpu pins. Clean and inspect the cpu with a qtip/isopropyl.

Then try to get the cpu to post with everything put together outside the case. You can jumper the pins of the mobo dont have a "start" button.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Wow, almost 2900 pages in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So, about to de-lid this 4790K using the "gentle vice only" method. What is the latest consensus on the best liquid metal to use between the die and IHS?
> 
> - Phobya LM
> - CLU
> - CLP
> 
> Please advise.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> You have the correct order in the lowest temps, though they all are pretty close.
> Just remember to:
> 1) pad the plastic green pcb side with a thick rubber band or something similar so it's not pcb against bare metal,
> 2) finger nail polish protect the resistors to the side of the die prior to the liquid metal to prevent shorts,
> 3) don't use too much, you actually need very little - just a very thin film spread out over the bare die,
> 4) remember you 15 day return policy from Microcenter, LOL!


Just a quick follow up:

- The de-lidding went very smoothly overall.







I used the following nail polish that my wife had in the medicine cabinet:

http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=413708&catid=323694&cmbProdBrandFilter=12654&aid=338666&aparam=413708&kpid=413708&CAWELAID=120142990000013723&CAGPSPN=pla&kpid=413708

- I applied 1 coat, let it dry for 30 minutes, then applied a second coat.

- I used the $19.99 Home Depot Drill Press Vise; it worked flawlessly.

- The Phobya LM was not hard at all to spread. I used as little as possible.

- I used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut between the IHS and the block.

- End result: Temps are now about 12 deg C lower when playing BF4.









I honestly didn't expect that big of a drop as I thought I had a great 4790K with decent temps. I was able to boot into Windows at 5 GHz using 1.32v after the upgrade. Pretty sure I can get it stable at 5, but I would not want to run at that speed with this budget cooler I'm running right now.


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Me ether. I think it may just be the mobo in this situation. The only completely dead delids I seen were all caused by nicking the pcb or cracking the die.
> 
> If the cpu has no physical damage it most likely will post in another mobo.
> 
> I would pull the mobo out and inspect everything paying close attention to the cpu pins. Clean and inspect the cpu with a qtip/isopropyl.
> 
> Then try to get the cpu to post with everything put together outside the case. You can jumper the pins of the mobo dont have a "start" button.


Come to think of it, my motherboard has pulled this trick before, before I was even delidded. Last time I had tried everything and gave up. Tried to boot it every morning and one day it just worked out of the blue. I'll start tearing down my build. I wish I had a friend with a z97 but all my local buddies have 990 fx platform. Haven't been impressed with this mainboard at all. Had an MSI z97 and 990 fx and both were junk.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Come to think of it, my motherboard has pulled this trick before, before I was even delidded. Last time I had tried everything and gave up. Tried to boot it every morning and one day it just worked out of the blue. I'll start tearing down my build. I wish I had a friend with a z97 but all my local buddies have 990 fx platform. Haven't been impressed with this mainboard at all. Had an MSI z97 and 990 fx and both were junk.


where are you located?

you could purchase something cheap like https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00F8AFMDC/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_iBZ3vb49XJ2W4 to test the cpu or even send it right back after.


----------



## LagunaX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Just a quick follow up:
> 
> - The de-lidding went very smoothly overall.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used the following nail polish that my wife had in the medicine cabinet:
> 
> http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=413708&catid=323694&cmbProdBrandFilter=12654&aid=338666&aparam=413708&kpid=413708&CAWELAID=120142990000013723&CAGPSPN=pla&kpid=413708
> 
> - I applied 1 coat, let it dry for 30 minutes, then applied a second coat.
> 
> - I used the $19.99 Home Depot Drill Press Vise; it worked flawlessly.
> 
> - The Phobya LM was not hard at all to spread. I used as little as possible.
> 
> - I used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut between the IHS and the block.
> 
> - End result: Temps are now about 12 deg C lower when playing BF4.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I honestly didn't expect that big of a drop as I thought I had a great 4790K with decent temps. I was able to boot into Windows at 5 GHz using 1.32v after the upgrade. Pretty sure I can get it stable at 5, but I would not want to run at that speed with this budget cooler I'm running right now.


Excellent! Yeah 4.8ghz is plenty fast for everyday, that is what I use. Occ. I might do 4.9ghz at 1.28v but 4.8ghz at 1.24v can run for years and years.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Excellent! Yeah 4.8ghz is plenty fast for everyday, that is what I use. Occ. I might do 4.9ghz at 1.28v but 4.8ghz at 1.24v can run for years and years.


Probably not worth it for just 100 MHz.







The more I think about it, the less I want to run 5 GHz, even though I know I can.







The added vcore is just too much of a price to pay for +200 MHz, IMHO. For gaming there is just no point.


----------



## CrazyElf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> to play devils advocate for a minute,
> 
> given that copper has a higher heat conductivity than water, would it not be reasonable to suggest that running naked allows for less heat dissipation due to the coolant being less efficient at removing heat from a heat source, whereas the use of a highly thermally conductive copper IHS can more easily remove some heat output from a CPU die in a very limited time period until the copper IHS is _saturated_ with heat?
> 
> (if the extended response to this is too time consuming, feel free to respond with "nope")


Short answer, no because you are still having to conduct from one source to another with a copper core. Even though copper has a good conductivity there's going to be some loss. Running bare die exposes your heat dissipation source directly.

Anyways, in the real world, you'll get about 3-5C cooler with bare die.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Looks like I killed my 4690k. After all of the super high voltage overclocking, hot temperatures, delidding, and lapping, I finally might have killed it. My CLU came in the mail today, so I went to go swap the Noctua paste that was on the die. I was extremely careful, taking over an hour to get the application just right. Put it back in, 00 post code. Tried 1 ram stick, clear cmos etc, no dice. Ergh. I took the cooler off to check and see if I had any extra CLU anywhere on the pcb, and couldn't find any. I did find a tiny, tiny sting of the stuff on one of the pin connectors on the bottom of the chip and wiped it off. Still wont post.


Check to see if it is the motherboard that is dead, the CPU, or perhaps both. I think that the pins may have caused an electrical short, as CLU is conductive. I'd check the pins closely to see if any got on the motherboard too.

Most likely it's the CPU that died, and not the board considering the motherboard is posting. Maybe go to a PC store and see.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Probably not worth it for just 100 MHz.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The more I think about it, the less I want to run 5 GHz, even though I know I can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The added vcore is just too much of a price to pay for +200 MHz, IMHO. For gaming there is just no point.


Once you reach a certain point, it does take more and more voltage to get that last couple of hundred MHz. Then you reach a point where more voltage just doesn't help - at which point the only way is sub zero.

I'd agree that for day to day stuff, it isn't worth it. Maybe only use it if you find yourself CPU bottlenecked. There are a handful of games that do benefit - MMOs, BF4 in particular comes to mind, and certain simulators, but that's it. RTS and strategy games may also benefit. But yeah, in most cases it isn't worth it. Actually, for many of those games that are CPU bottlenecked, a 5820K is a far better buy at this point.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LagunaX*
> 
> Excellent! Yeah 4.8ghz is plenty fast for everyday, that is what I use. Occ. I might do 4.9ghz at 1.28v but 4.8ghz at 1.24v can run for years and years.


4.8 GHz at 1.24V is a golden chip as is.








There are some that cannot run 4.8 GHz at 1.30 or even 1.35V.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CrazyElf*
> 
> I'd agree that for day to day stuff, it isn't worth it. Maybe only use it if you find yourself CPU bottlenecked. There are a handful of games that do benefit - MMOs, BF4 in particular comes to mind, and certain simulators, but that's it. RTS and strategy games may also benefit. But yeah, in most cases it isn't worth it. Actually, for many of those games that are CPU bottlenecked, a 5820K is a far better buy at this point.
> 
> 4.8 GHz at 1.24V is a golden chip as is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are some that cannot run 4.8 GHz at 1.30 or even 1.35V.


His is the 1.24v chip, mine is 1.25v.







I'm pretty happy with mine, and I got it cheap to boot (Microcenter sale + $40 off with a mobo).

Regarding the type of game, you're certainly right about that. RTS with a lot of units deployed; CPU OC will help a lot. I'm a BF gamer mostly, and I've observed about 65% max utilization with my CPU clocked at 4.6 GHz (1.18v). I don't feel I have gained anything running at 4.8 TBH.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CrazyElf*
> 
> Short answer, no because you are still having to conduct from one source to another with a copper core. Even though copper has a good conductivity there's going to be some loss. Running bare die exposes your heat dissipation source
> I'd agree that for day to day stuff, it isn't worth it. Maybe only use it if you find yourself CPU bottlenecked. There are a handful of games that do benefit - MMOs, BF4 in particular comes to mind, and certain simulators, but that's it. RTS and strategy games may also benefit. But yeah, in most cases it isn't worth it. Actually, for many of those games that are CPU bottlenecked, a 5820K is a far better buy at this point.
> *4.8 GHz at 1.24V is a golden chip as is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are some that cannot run 4.8 GHz at 1.30 or even 1.35V*.


Exactly how I feel. My other 4790k couldnt get 4.8 1.4v stable.


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Exactly how I feel. My other 4790k couldnt get 4.8 1.4v stable.


Mine can reach 4.8GHz at 1.32v lol.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

I haven't bothered to push my 4770K past 4.4GHz since its comfortable at 1.26v.
tho due to summer heat,-also some instability that ended up being unrelated- I'm running it at stock with a 1.015v under-volt.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Mine can reach 4.8GHz at 1.32v lol.


Silicon lottery... although that is far from a golden chip. Mine can do it at 1.25v, and I don't personally consider it golden; just very good.


----------



## scorpscarx

I'm always light hearted about, but I think people lie about their voltages on this forum all the time lol. 1.24 4.8 devils canyon, 1.2 4.7 haswell e, etc etc etc, I guess the vast majority of the chips people have out there they are too ashamed to post. Those kinds of volts are so golden it's not even funny.

Maybe only the golden chips are worth posting about in the first place or something, but this is basically stealth bragging, the site







.

"Mine can do 4.9 at 1.25, I consider that ok, blah blah blah"


----------



## EvilWiffles

Yeah, I'm just happy to have 4.7GHz @ 1.23v.


----------



## jdorje

Seems like the last few months all the 4790ks are good. From what I've read [email protected] is the average now (bronze). A golden chip would be at least 2 multipliers higher. That makes your [email protected] only silver.

Of course maybe there is just a rash of people making up numbers.

(Still rocking a 4690k, [email protected] here. I did drop to [email protected] for summer but bumped it back up today.)


----------



## scorpscarx

I overclocked 3 4790k's, my old one and 2 friends(in their computers), and they all required 1.35+ for 4.7 with realbench.

Above two posts just further my observations, good for you though.

My new 5820k, from silicon lottery even, requires 1.320*1.335 measured peak, for 4.6.

Too many variables, too many ways to define stable. You can't make huge blanket statements like that, not unless you're some engineer who buys hundreds of these things in his spare time, or a service like silicon lottery, or a factory worker hand inspecting them as they come rolling down the assembly line









Tin foil hat, secured.


----------



## outlaw8505

I haven't played too much with it. But so far it's my 4770K delid 4.2Ghz stable is 1.199v under gaming or stress per HWinfo VID. I think I was able to get 1.174v at idle or light duty like web browsing.


----------



## trustn01

OCN name: trust01
CPU: 4690k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: +300Hz
OC after delid: 4.5Ghz 24/7 (4.9 Cinebench-stable)
Temp drops: 22C - From 92C (ambient 27) to 66C (ambient 24)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: 4.9Ghz http://valid.x86.fr/zt53r0




Also, with Prime95 with FFT =1K and all my fans turned off I got this:


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trustn01*
> 
> OCN name: trust01
> Mhz gained: +300Hz
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz 24/7 (4.9 Cinebench-stable)
> Temp drops: 22C - From 92C (ambient 27) to 66C (ambient 24)


Nice one. Which cooler do u use?

I delidded my 4770K yesterday using the vice only method (apart from needeing more strength than expected it was pretty straightforward). Using CLU on-die and Grizzly for the heatsink. I gained about 30C @ 1.4v @ 4.6Ghz. Before delidding, I couldn't use 1.4v because at 1.37v temperatures would be close to 100C during stress test. Now they are at around 70C @ 1.4v.

I must say that a vice is really handy not only for the delidding but alos for holding the CPU afterwards when cleaning it and applying CLU. CLU was much easier to apply than expected since it's not really liquid but a bit sticky when used very sparingly.

The CPU is a below average overclocker but with the delid I can at least run 4.5Ghz with very very quiet cooling. Before, with 4.3Ghz @ 1.26v the cooling wasn't super quiet anymore.

I use the CM Seidon 240M AIO with Scythe fans (the CM fans were waaaaay too noisy) and I am really happy with that combination also because the pump is really quiet and can be controlled by PWM.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> CLU was much easier to apply than expected since it's not really liquid but a bit sticky when used very sparingly.


My recent de-lidding experience was the same with Phobya LM. I expected it to be hard to spread, but it really was quite simple.


----------



## fleetfeather

If your CLU is easy to spread, you've used too much CLU. The appropriate amount of CLU for your CPU die is a PITA to spread


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> If your CLU is easy to spread, you've used too much CLU.


When I said 'easy', I primarily meant that there was no danger of it spilling over to the transistors, which was my main concern before using it. From a number of pictures I had the impression that it behaves much more like a liquid but as u say, when using just very little of it, it doesn't move around easy by itself but it behaves more like a traditional thermal paste. I also found the supplied brushes (which I shortened a bit) easier to work with than q tips which I also tried.

Oh well, all in all, it was easier than expected. Now I wonder how CLU will behave over time, whether it will form some connection to the die or the heat spreader?


----------



## fleetfeather

Oh, well yes... that makes sense then

CLU doesn't really bond to many surfaces at all. The only danger it has is corroding aluminium. CLP on the other hand has a habit of staining the surface of the IHS, whilst also inheriting the aluminium corrosion properties.

Neither CLU or CLP will 'require' replacing over the regular course of a CPUs life; as long as AMD sticks around, your system will likely be redundant by the time you need to re-apply any of the CoolLab's thermal compounds.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *trustn01*
> 
> OCN name: trust01
> CPU: 4690k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: +300Hz
> OC after delid: 4.5Ghz 24/7 (4.9 Cinebench-stable)
> Temp drops: 22C - From 92C (ambient 27) to 66C (ambient 24)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: 4.9Ghz http://valid.x86.fr/zt53r0
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, with Prime95 with FFT =1K and all my fans turned off I got this:


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## trustn01

I use Corsair H80i GT. I have actually used a mix of razor and vice-only methods. I've used the razor at the edges and then removed the rest with the vice. I had to use a surprisingly low amount of pressure on the vice after I had taken care of the edges with the razor. I was wary of using only the vice method after seeing some cracked dies that might have resulted from micro-fractures caused by the vice that expanded after several thermal cycles.

I heard CLU is a bit easier to spread, but honestly even CLP wasn't hard. It's only "hard" when compared with how extremely easy it is to apply regular thermal paste. I applied CLU on die, inner IHS surface, IHS and cooler surface. I used only a tiny bit of it.

I've used liquid electrical tape on the capacitors and a thin layer of silicone glue when replacing the IHS. I decided to apply the glue because, as said, I was concerned with anything that could cause micro-factures on the die.

I am pretty happy with my 22C temp drops but disappointed with my chip that cannot reach 5GHz even though temps never go beyond 80C at 4.8GHz(1.46V) no matter which torture test I run (e.g. Prime95 with max FFT of 1K). At 4.9GHz(1.52V) it does not go beyond 80C with Cinebench but it freezes with Prime95. I've tried [email protected] once and it froze seconds after Windows logon screen. Don't think I will be going over 1.5V again in the near-future. At 4.5Ghz it is stable with 1.3V, and I'm leaving at it 24/7.

Overall, even though I got a decent temp drop, the required voltage for going above 4.5GHz still seems dangerous, and I did not actually gained any 24/7 clock-speed (only max OC went up). However, I now can completely turn off all my fans at 4.5GHz. Without a single fan on, it does not go beyond 80C ever, sitting at ~66C under regular heavy load (ambient 24C). Pretty amazing noise-wise, but disappointing clock-wise.


----------



## rsturtle

For anyone following my drama, I have good news. It's definitely the motherboard. I tried booting today, same procedure as always, and I got a boot loop instead of 00!!! After about 150 tries (not kidding) I had it run through, but my cooler wasn't on and had to turn it off. I hastily slapped some noctua paste on the lid am booted it through the onboard hdmi. I can only boot with one ram stick but this is a start.

Edit: I can get the furthest two dimm slots to boot. Populating either of the first two sends the computer into a boot loop.


----------



## PapaSmurf

Just delidded my 3770k and am quite please with the results so far. Don't have any CLU or CLP so I used my Gelid GC Extreme for now. I didn't get it quite right yet as core 0 is 10c cooler than the other 3 (but I was also getting that last night before the delidding). Overall temps are down at least 15C (maybe more as I'm not sure what my room temps were last night when I ran my original test, but I'm pretty sure they were a good 5c cooler than they are this evening). I hit a peak of 88c on core 2 yesterday with the rest at 75, 83, and 82. That was with 1.32 vcore in bios (1.28 in CPU-Z) at 4.4GHz. In IBT it seems to have thermal throttled down to 4.0 according to my Real Temp Screen Shots. This is using a Hyper 212 Plus with Push/Pull Yate Loon High Speed fans.

Today I'm getting a peak of 73C on cores 1, 2, and 3 and 60 on core 0 at 4.4GHz with the same vcore and no apparent thermal throttling running IBT in an 80F (27C) room . Haven't tried to clock it higher yet as I just got of work a little bit ago, but I'll definitely giving it a go this weekend as I have time.

Now I just need to decide if I should order CLU or CLP.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> Just delidded my 3770k and am quite please with the results so far. Don't have any CLU or CLP so I used my Gelid GC Extreme for now. I didn't get it quite right yet as core 0 is 10c cooler than the other 3 (but I was also getting that last night before the delidding). Overall temps are down at least 15C (maybe more as I'm not sure what my room temps were last night when I ran my original test, but I'm pretty sure they were a good 5c cooler than they are this evening). I hit a peak of 88c on core 2 yesterday with the rest at 75, 83, and 82. That was with 1.32 vcore in bios (1.28 in CPU-Z) at 4.4GHz. In IBT it seems to have thermal throttled down to 4.0 according to my Real Temp Screen Shots. This is using a Hyper 212 Plus with Push/Pull Yate Loon High Speed fans.
> 
> Today I'm getting a peak of 73C on cores 1, 2, and 3 and 60 on core 0 at 4.4GHz with the same vcore and no apparent thermal throttling running IBT in an 80F (27C) room . Haven't tried to clock it higher yet as I just got of work a little bit ago, but I'll definitely giving it a go this weekend as I have time.
> 
> Now I just need to decide if I should order CLU or CLP.


Everyone says that CLU performs better (by 1 or 2 degrees), and spreads easier. I've been using CLP and haven't had any issues with spreading it, cleaning it off (even after being on a CPU for over a year), or it's performance. So in my mind, it's a personal choice.


----------



## PapaSmurf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> Just delidded my 3770k and am quite please with the results so far. Don't have any CLU or CLP so I used my Gelid GC Extreme for now. I didn't get it quite right yet as core 0 is 10c cooler than the other 3 (but I was also getting that last night before the delidding). Overall temps are down at least 15C (maybe more as I'm not sure what my room temps were last night when I ran my original test, but I'm pretty sure they were a good 5c cooler than they are this evening). I hit a peak of 88c on core 2 yesterday with the rest at 75, 83, and 82. That was with 1.32 vcore in bios (1.28 in CPU-Z) at 4.4GHz. In IBT it seems to have thermal throttled down to 4.0 according to my Real Temp Screen Shots. This is using a Hyper 212 Plus with Push/Pull Yate Loon High Speed fans.
> 
> Today I'm getting a peak of 73C on cores 1, 2, and 3 and 60 on core 0 at 4.4GHz with the same vcore and no apparent thermal throttling running IBT in an 80F (27C) room . Haven't tried to clock it higher yet as I just got of work a little bit ago, but I'll definitely giving it a go this weekend as I have time.
> 
> Now I just need to decide if I should order CLU or CLP.
> 
> 
> 
> Everyone says that CLU performs better (by 1 or 2 degrees), and spreads easier. I've been using CLP and haven't had any issues with spreading it, cleaning it off (even after being on a CPU for over a year), or it's performance. So in my mind, it's a personal choice.
Click to expand...

Thanks.

Do you think there will be enough of a difference over the Gelid Extreme to warrant going to the expense and trouble of getting either of those?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> Just delidded my 3770k and am quite please with the results so far. Don't have any CLU or CLP so I used my Gelid GC Extreme for now. I didn't get it quite right yet as core 0 is 10c cooler than the other 3 (but I was also getting that last night before the delidding). Overall temps are down at least 15C (maybe more as I'm not sure what my room temps were last night when I ran my original test, but I'm pretty sure they were a good 5c cooler than they are this evening). I hit a peak of 88c on core 2 yesterday with the rest at 75, 83, and 82. That was with 1.32 vcore in bios (1.28 in CPU-Z) at 4.4GHz. In IBT it seems to have thermal throttled down to 4.0 according to my Real Temp Screen Shots. This is using a Hyper 212 Plus with Push/Pull Yate Loon High Speed fans.
> 
> Today I'm getting a peak of 73C on cores 1, 2, and 3 and 60 on core 0 at 4.4GHz with the same vcore and no apparent thermal throttling running IBT in an 80F (27C) room . Haven't tried to clock it higher yet as I just got of work a little bit ago, but I'll definitely giving it a go this weekend as I have time.
> 
> Now I just need to decide if I should order CLU or CLP.


CLU.
Easier to work with and argument is up for slightly better performance. Even if it performed worse it would be worth it due to ease of application and removal. Arctic cleaner takes it off just fine and I have also heard baby wipes of all things.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Do you think there will be enough of a difference over the Gelid Extreme to warrant going to the expense and trouble of getting either of those?


Definitely. Really the major point of delidding is to get that thermal compound out of there, the secondary point is removing the glue to decrease the distance between the die and the IHS. Swapping out the thermal paste for another thermal paste only gets small results, but going with CLP or CLU will get you the big numbers.









For the record, 91% Isopropyl Alcohol and a Q-tip removes CLP just fine - no need for a specialty cleaner.









An OCN user tested them against each other, and performance is very close.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/0_20


----------



## psyshack

Thought I would share a semi old delid and poverty level AMD junk at that.

This is a old New Castle 2800+ PR <<<<<< PR ratings are straight up ******.

Default it was 1.8ghz. It spent most of it's life at 4.8ghz on water. But no matter how fast you made it go. It was always slower than a Intel cpu.




This cpu like all of mine are cut off IHS. And in the raw thats how it's done. No reason what so ever to use the the stupid ham fisted idiot vice! Done right with 3 brain cells and a 3rd grade education you will not fubar the pcb oe top level components.

Right there is a tad of old school done right with a tad of craft.


----------



## Sheyster

Here's a screenshot after 15 minutes of RealBench 2.41:



My max gaming temp in BF4 after an hour is 54 deg C on the hottest core. Delidding FTW!

Above results are on an H75 with stock fans.

It appears that I am one of the few who opted to use Phobya LM instead of CLU under the IHS. I'm using TG Kryonaut between the IHS and the block.

Here is the most recent review I could find for LM TIMs:

http://overclocking.guide/thermal-paste-roundup-2015-47-products-tested-with-air-cooling-and-liquid-nitrogen-ln2/6/

I know tw3ak will probably disagree with the results above. If I had better cooling I'd probably do my own testing of the LM TIMs, but I'm not gonna bother.







My experience with Phobya LM has been very positive and I recommend it highly.

EDIT- Just want to add that I'm down about -13 deg C in RealBench. From what I recall my max temp was 80 before.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Do you think there will be enough of a difference over the Gelid Extreme to warrant going to the expense and trouble of getting either of those?


the main problem with geild is not performance. but it "pumps out" over time. the temps will get worse and worse and all the tim will be pumped out of the die area from the pessure. CLP/CLU dot no pump out.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Definitely. Really the major point of delidding is to get that thermal compound out of there, the secondary *point is removing the glue to decrease the distance between the die and the IHS*. Swapping out the thermal paste for another thermal paste only gets small results, but going with CLP or CLU will get you the big numbers.


http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570

The stock intel paste isn't nearly as terrible as everyone thinks it is; The IHS adhesive is the problem. The link compares stock Intel paste to NT-H1.

Liquid metal paste obviously takes it to the next level for cooling performance.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570
> 
> The stock intel paste isn't nearly as terrible as everyone thinks it is; The IHS adhesive is the problem. The link compares stock Intel paste to NT-H1.
> 
> Liquid metal paste obviously takes it to the next level for cooling performance.


Ok....If you're going to take the risk of delidding, why go for marginal gains (switching out TIM for TIM)? So as I said, the *major* point of delidding is to replace the TIM with a liquid metal (Phobya LM, CLU, or CLP) to decrease temps. Then, since you've removed the IHS, get the adhesive off to decrease the gap between die and IHS and to further improve temps.









Realize that we're in agreement here....


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Ok....If you're going to take the risk of delidding, why go for marginal gains (switching out TIM for TIM)? So as I said, the *major* point of delidding is to replace the TIM with a liquid metal (Phobya LM, CLU, or CLP) to decrease temps. Then, since you've removed the IHS, get the adhesive off to decrease the gap between die and IHS and to further improve temps.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Realize that we're in agreement here....


+1

FWIW, I had A LOT of adhesive on my chip. It took a while to scrape it all off with an old credit card, but I succeeded in getting it all after about 15 minutes.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> +1
> 
> FWIW, I had A LOT of adhesive on my chip. It took a while to scrape it all off with an old credit card, but I succeeded in getting it all after about 15 minutes.


My 4670K had quite a bit of adhesive also, taking pretty much the same amount of time for me to remove it.

Go ahead and slather the adhesive on there if you want, Intel, just solder the die to the IHS first....


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Ok....If you're going to take the risk of delidding, why go for marginal gains (switching out TIM for TIM)? So as I said, the *major* point of delidding is to replace the TIM with a liquid metal (Phobya LM, CLU, or CLP) to decrease temps. Then, since you've removed the IHS, get the adhesive off to decrease the gap between die and IHS and to further improve temps.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Realize that we're in agreement here....


We do agree collectively, but you have it reversed. Removing the adhesive doesn't "further improve temps" after changing the TIM, that is the common misconception.

Primary gains from delidding are from reducing the gap caused by the adhesive*.*

Additional gains are from TIM.

Going by the link, NT-H1 is inferior to Intel paste. So by not using a liquid metal TIM you aren't experiencing full potential of the delid. And, as someone else mentioned, traditional pastes can suffer from pump out. So to sustain the great temperatures achieved you should use a liquid metal TIM.

The pump out concept really makes sense now that I think about it. The stock Intel TIM is more like a clay material than a gel/paste that we are accustomed to, so it doesn't pump out due to this fact. And, Intel paste has the same consistency whether the chip has been run for 10 minutes or 10 months from my experience. This likely explains why the user on AnandTech found that stock Intel paste outperformed the NT-H1 when the IHS gap was present. The Intel paste was probably designed specifically to bridge the gap caused by the adhesive.

On another note, I tested a stock Intel cooler with a delid and traditional paste(xigmatek PTI-G4512). Why would someone do this you're probably wondering? I chipped the PCB of my 3770k during my first delid attempt. I presumed the chip was garbage, bought a 4770k, and packed the 3770k in the box as I couldn't bring myself to throw it in the garbage.



Months later I had an issue with my ASRock Z77E-ITX board. It was going back for RMA so I figured, what can it hurt? I dropped the 3770k in the board with the stock cooler and fired up Prime95. I fell asleep on my couch after doing so. To my surprise the next morning it was still chugging along. After a delid, the stock cooler is capable of adequately cooling a 3770k, at stock settings, for 12+ hours of Prime95 large FFTs. Temps were in the low 80's IIRC, as the temps weren't fantastic, or alarming, for that matter; don't have any photos unfortunately.

That 3770k is still running in a friends PC BTW.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> We do agree collectively, but you have it reversed. Removing the adhesive doesn't "further improve temps" after changing the TIM, that is the common misconception.
> 
> Primary gains from delidding are from reducing the gap caused by the adhesive*.*
> 
> Additional gains are from TIM.
> 
> Going by the link, NT-H1 is inferior to Intel paste. So by not using a liquid metal TIM you aren't experiencing full potential of the delid. And, as someone else mentioned, traditional pastes can suffer from pump out. So to sustain the great temperatures achieved you should use a liquid metal TIM.
> 
> The pump out concept really makes sense now that I think about it. The stock Intel TIM is more like a clay material than a gel/paste that we are accustomed to, so it doesn't pump out due to this fact. And, Intel paste has the same consistency whether the chip has been run for 10 minutes or 10 months from my experience. This likely explains why the user on AnandTech found that stock Intel paste outperformed the NT-H1 when the IHS gap was present. The Intel paste was probably designed specifically to bridge the gap caused by the adhesive.
> 
> On another note, I tested a stock Intel cooler with a delid and traditional paste(xigmatek PTI-G4512). Why would someone do this you're probably wondering? I chipped the PCB of my 3770k during my first delid attempt. I presumed the chip was garbage, bought a 4770k, and packed the 3770k in the box as I couldn't bring myself to throw it in the garbage.
> 
> 
> Months later I had an issue with my ASRock Z77E-ITX board. It was going back for RMA so I figured, what can it hurt? I dropped the 3770k in the board with the stock cooler and fired up Prime95. I fell asleep on my couch after doing so. To my surprise the next morning it was still chugging along. After a delid, the stock cooler is capable of adequately cooling a 3770k, at stock settings, for 12+ hours of Prime95 large FFTs. Temps were in the low 80's IIRC, as the temps weren't fantastic, or alarming, for that matter; don't have any photos unfortunately.
> 
> That 3770k is still running in a friends PC BTW.


So you're saying that CLP/CLU/LM doesn't lower your temps (versus using regular TIM) through allowing better heat transfer? Are you seriously trying to argue about the order in which the improvements happen? What's the point in that?

To summarize what I've been saying: If you want the best benefits from delidding, then you'll need to switch out the stock TIM for a liquid metal (such as CLU/CLP/LM), and remove the adhesive from the PCB and the IHS. Without doing BOTH of these steps, you will not see the same drastic drops in temperatures. There's really no point in doing one of the steps without doing the other.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> So you're saying that CLP/CLU/LM doesn't lower your temps (versus using regular TIM) through allowing better heat transfer? Are you seriously trying to argue about the order in which the improvements happen? What's the point in that?
> 
> To summarize what I've been saying: If you want the best benefits from delidding, then you'll need to switch out the stock TIM for a liquid metal (such as CLU/CLP/LM), and remove the adhesive from the PCB and the IHS. Without doing BOTH of these steps, you will not see the same drastic drops in temperatures. There's really no point in doing one of the steps without doing the other.


You either read too quickly, or get offended too quickly that someone corrected you...or both.

I made no mention of liquid metal not giving additional gains. In fact I specifically said, "Additional gains are from TIM." And, "So by not using a liquid metal TIM you aren't experiencing full potential of the delid." Why do you insist on twisting words, or in this case text, around? What's the point in that?

I'm well aware of how much more CLU gives compared to traditional paste. It was good for a 16C-19C drop in core temperatures as seen here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1478544/the-build-formerly-known-as-the-devil-inside-a-gaming-htpc-for-my-wife-4770k-corsair-250d-powercolor-r9-290/40_20#post_22522081

I am not arguing the order of improvements. However, if someone isn't comfortable with using a liquid metal TIM, then delidding to remove the adhesive will still give good performance gains.


----------



## blaze2210

That was a question, intended to gain clarification on what you were saying. It wasn't a statement, or an argument, or a defensive statement. Notice how it's formed like a question.... Speaking of being in a rush to get offended....









Anyways.... If one isn't going to use a liquid metal TIM, then they can only expect a drop of a few degrees. Which, in my opinion, isn't worth potentially killing a $200+ CPU. "To each, their own" definitely applies here.


----------



## v1ral

Best way to reglue heat spreader?..
GO!!!


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Best way to reglue heat spreader?..
> GO!!!


Don't bother.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Best way to reglue heat spreader?..
> GO!!!


No point in putting adhesive again on it, but if you really need to, the best way would be rubber epoxy for electronics. Something similar to this:



Non-conductive and holds well. In addition, they use a rubber epoxy for most electronics to prevent it from shock in a casing.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> to create a naked mount simply get rid of the backplate and the plastic inserts and use long blots/studs with plastic washers where it meets the mobos like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You just remove the locking mechanism that is still in the photos above and it works for naked. It will take a bit of trial and error to get the pressure right. Too much will bow the cpu pcb and through errors and too little wont recognize the cpu.
> 
> Its a lot of work for 1-2c imo.


I think in most cases yes it does make little sense to make a naked mount.

However I got a bit more than 1-2c from using the naked Ivy mount for the ek supremacy evo.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Swag*
> 
> No point in putting adhesive again on it, but if you really need to, the best way would be rubber epoxy for electronics. Something similar to this:
> 
> 
> 
> Non-conductive and holds well. In addition, they use a rubber epoxy for most electronics to prevent it from shock in a casing.


You could do this, and it seems like the same epoxy as what was used in the first place but keep in mind that in addition to changing crappy stock Tim, deluding also helps to bring the die into closer proximity with the ihs, and resealing using this may make heat transfer worse when using clu or clp. When you think about it no matter how thin you lay the epoxy on it will add distance between the ihs and die.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Best way to reglue heat spreader?..
> GO!!!


I think you really don't want to reglue it. First, that risks adding material between the IHS and the PCB, which is bad since half the purpose of the delid is to get the IHS flush against the chip. Second, you'd then have to delid it again from scratch if you wanted to remount the IHS.

Now my question. Surely the FIVR modules produce heat. Wouldn't putting nail polish to protect them also insulate them? Alternately, how could one go about adding a heat sink for the FIVR?


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Now my question. Surely the FIVR modules produce heat. Wouldn't putting nail polish to protect them also insulate them? Alternately, how could one go about adding a heat sink for the FIVR?


Those aren't the FIVR, they are just surface mount capacitors. Someone tried the heatsink them, but I don't recall it making much difference. They probably don't generate much heat on their own.


----------



## v1ral

So it's best not to try and re-glue the heat spreader on huh?
I was actually trying get people's ideas on it, best substance to use to keep the least amount of "distance" between it and the Die, I guess it's just not a good idea.


----------



## Swag

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> So it's best not to try and re-glue the heat spreader on huh?
> I was actually trying get people's ideas on it, best substance to use to keep the least amount of "distance" between it and the Die, I guess it's just not a good idea.


Best substance is the TIM and a little pressure. The pressure gained from the motherboard socket latch paired with the TIM is perfect to minimize the distance between the die and the IHS and maximize performance of the modification.


----------



## v1ral

Thanks!


----------



## logan-beckstrom

I am just getting ready to install my 3570K, and was wondering, is it possible to just mount the cooler block directly to the IC of the processor? I was messing with an older processor, and found that if I remove the latch system, I am able to retain the processor in socket with just the water block (I used a LGA socket to check not a pin system.)


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *logan-beckstrom*
> 
> I am just getting ready to install my 3570K, and was wondering, is it possible to just mount the cooler block directly to the IC of the processor? I was messing with an older processor, and found that if I remove the latch system, I am able to retain the processor in socket with just the water block (I used a LGA socket to check not a pin system.)


It's possible to do a naked mount, but it's trickier than the old-style sockets because pressure on the socket has to be just right to engage the pins the properly. Do some research and decide if you want to do it or not.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *logan-beckstrom*
> 
> I am just getting ready to install my 3570K, and was wondering, is it possible to just mount the cooler block directly to the IC of the processor? I was messing with an older processor, and found that if I remove the latch system, I am able to retain the processor in socket with just the water block (I used a LGA socket to check not a pin system.)


With a water block it is possible, but take a lot of time and patience. I wouldn't recommend doing this with an air cooler at all. Bad things will happen.


----------



## CuriousNapper

If people tell you delid is not worthwhile unless you used metal TIM, they are wrong.

I delidded and used Noctua NT-H1, relidded and sealed.

10-12C drop in temperature

EDIT: Apparently there is some issues with this TIM on core.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Noctua doesnt mount well and leaks is the issue.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CuriousNapper*
> 
> If people tell you delid is not worthwhile unless you used metal TIM, they are wrong.
> 
> I delidded and used Noctua NT-H1, relidded and sealed.
> 
> 10-12C drop in temperature


Wait a few weeks (maybe more, maybe less) for when you have to replace the Noctua TIM because of the pump-out effect that regular TIMs tend to have - liquid metals don't do this. Also, that Noctua compound is more likely to dry out on the die than the liquid metals are.
Quote:


> NT-H1 may produce a superior mount when bare silicon is involved but the pumping-out effect is a deal-killer for any serious consideration of using this TIM long-term with a bare silicon cpu application


Sources (pick any you like, the consensus is the same): https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&es_th=1&ie=UTF-8#q=nt-h1+pump-out+delid


----------



## CuriousNapper

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra costs as much as the cpu I am using (used G3258)

Thanks for telling me, I will consider other options or just refresh it once I see it get hotter.

I have some arctic alumina thermal adhesive around, what do you think about that?

Surely a test no one with devils canyon has done lol


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CuriousNapper*
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra costs as much as the cpu I am using (used G3258)
> 
> Thanks for telling me, I will consider other options or just refresh it once I see it get hotter.
> 
> I have some arctic alumina thermal adhesive around, what do you think about that?
> 
> Surely a test no one with devils canyon has done lol


Why would you delid a g3258 other than for practice though?

CLU is $10 at sidewinder but with $6 shipping.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CuriousNapper*
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra costs as much as the cpu I am using (used G3258)
> 
> Thanks for telling me, I will consider other options or just refresh it once I see it get hotter.
> 
> I have some arctic alumina thermal adhesive around, what do you think about that?
> 
> Surely a test no one with devils canyon has done lol


The cost of the CLU/CLP is well justified. The tiny amount that you have to use in order to cover the CPU die, means that you get many many applications out of a syringe of it. So far, I've applied CLP to my CPU die twice (plus the first time when I applied too much, so 3 times), my bro's GPU die, my GPU die, and a couple of resistors for a hard mod. I still have plenty of CLP left. Remember that when using a liquid metal, "less is more".

Don't use thermal adhesive on a CPU....If you need to break that seal, you're a lot more likely to mess up your CPU die. There's really no need to try to "re-invent the wheel" here, CLP/CLU/Phobya Liquid Metal are all perfectly excellent performers.


----------



## CuriousNapper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Why would you delid a g3258 other than for practice though?


To get the most out of what I have. That is the fun of OC.

I like to see how far I can push cheap things.


----------



## CuriousNapper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> The cost of the CLU/CLP is well justified. The tiny amount that you have to use in order to cover the CPU die, means that you get many many applications out of a syringe of it. So far, I've applied CLP to my CPU die twice (plus the first time when I applied too much, so 3 times), my bro's GPU die, my GPU die, and a couple of resistors for a hard mod. I still have plenty of CLP left. Remember that when using a liquid metal, "less is more".
> 
> Don't use thermal adhesive on a CPU....If you need to break that seal, you're a lot more likely to mess up your CPU die. There's really no need to try to "re-invent the wheel" here, CLP/CLU/Phobya Liquid Metal are all perfectly excellent performers.


If this was my main rig I would probably go for it. Ever see any conductivity issues with it?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CuriousNapper*
> 
> If this was my main rig I would probably go for it. Ever see any conductivity issues with it?


Electrical or thermal conductivity? I've had no issues with either. To be honest, the thermal conductivity is awesome. I always make sure that I have a really thin layer of CLP on the surface, and I remove any excess. As far as the electrical conductivity is concerned: before installing the component, I always make sure that there isn't any CLP where there isn't supposed to be - an LED flashlight helps find the shiny bits.









Really, if you're going to delid and you *don't* want to have to open up your CPU periodically to change out the thermal compound, then use a liquid metal. After over a year of being on my CPU's die, the CLP was still in as good of condition as it was when I first applied it.

On my 970:


On my i5-4670K (actually ended up being a little too much CLP, had to remove a little after spreading):


----------



## bonami2

Well
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Electrical or thermal conductivity? I've had no issues with either. To be honest, the thermal conductivity is awesome. I always make sure that I have a really thin layer of CLP on the surface, and I remove any excess. As far as the electrical conductivity is concerned: before installing the component, I always make sure that there isn't any CLP where there isn't supposed to be - an LED flashlight helps find the shiny bits.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Really, if you're going to delid and you *don't* want to have to open up your CPU periodically to change out the thermal compound, then use a liquid metal. After over a year of being on my CPU's die, the CLP was still in as good of condition as it was when I first applied it.
> 
> On my 970:
> 
> 
> On my i5-4670K (actually ended up being a little too much CLP, had to remove a little after spreading):


Do gpu temp drop with clu?

Could change mine from mx4 to clu...... [email protected] with 2 gpu at about top = 65c 70% fan speed bottom 57c 41% fan speed.


----------



## EvilWiffles

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Electrical or thermal conductivity? I've had no issues with either. To be honest, the thermal conductivity is awesome. I always make sure that I have a really thin layer of CLP on the surface, and I remove any excess. As far as the electrical conductivity is concerned: before installing the component, I always make sure that there isn't any CLP where there isn't supposed to be - an LED flashlight helps find the shiny bits.


I've applied CLU on my GTX 970 too. Didn't do much for me though.


----------



## Ceadderman

There is one way to apply non CLU/CLP Thermal Paste to get around push out iirc.

Put a small pot of water on the stove on high. Let it boil. While you're waiting for it to boil take your paste and insert the closed tube into a foil packet to keep it dry.

When water is thoroughly heated to a boil take it off the burner and place the packet in the water and set a timer for about 5 minutes. The heat should allow the TIM to reach it's thinnest point. Apply as you would at room temp and spread it over the die or put a slightly smaller amount on and use your IHS to spread it. Allow to cool to room temp and that should allow the usage of NH1 or any low viscosity TIM without pushout. I use this method to get a clean spread on my CPUs and it works really well. It also helps conserve TIM by allowing a thinner application.









~Ceadder


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Well
> Do gpu temp drop with clu?
> 
> Could change mine from mx4 to clu...... [email protected] with 2 gpu at about top = 65c 70% fan speed bottom 57c 41% fan speed.


It's not as drastic of a temp drop as you get from applying it to the CPU, but it's good enough that I'll certainly apply CLP to my GPUs in the future. I have the EVGA 970 SSC, which turns my fans on at 60*C, so most of the time, my fans don't even have to turn on. My 970 hasn't passed 64*C under load, even with my modded BIOS running at 1506/8000 - and I only see that high of temps while running benchmarks. Then, the fans turn on, and it goes back below 60. The main benefit I've seen is that my card cools down quicker, due to the higher thermal conductivity of the liquid metal. So I'm happy with it.









Note: I'm using CL*P*, not CL*U* - Pro, not Ultra.


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> It's not as drastic of a temp drop as you get from applying it to the CPU, but it's good enough that I'll certainly apply CLP to my GPUs in the future. I have the EVGA 970 SSC, which turns my fans on at 60*C, so most of the time, my fans don't even have to turn on. My 970 hasn't passed 64*C under load, even with my modded BIOS running at 1506/8000 - and I only see that high of temps while running benchmarks. Then, the fans turn on, and it goes back below 60. The main benefit I've seen is that my card cools down quicker, due to the higher thermal conductivity of the liquid metal. So I'm happy with it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Note: I'm using CL*P*, not CL*U* - Pro, not Ultra.


I may do this to my 970. My rig is so quiet that I can hear the fans spin up when I'm doing light gaming workloads and then immediately turn off. I would rather they just stay on but I think it looks awesome when they aren't having to spin. Might put my CLP on my old 7870 and see how good that is on it before voluntarily voiding my warranty on my 970.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> I may do this to my 970. My rig is so quiet that I can hear the fans spin up when I'm doing light gaming workloads and then immediately turn off. I would rather they just stay on but I think it looks awesome when they aren't having to spin. Might put my CLP on my old 7870 and see how good that is on it before voluntarily voiding my warranty on my 970.


You can always set a custom fan curve in Afterburner. With my custom curve, the fans turn on at ~40*C. Just make sure that if you get any CLP on those parts near the die, that it gets cleaned off completely.









So with the MSI 970, did they put the "Void if Removed" sticker over one of the screws again? That's what they did with the Gaming Edition 760s that I had.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> There is one way to apply non CLU/CLP Thermal Paste to get around push out iirc.
> 
> Put a small pot of water on the stove on high. Let it boil. While you're waiting for it to boil take your paste and insert the closed tube into a foil packet to keep it dry.
> 
> When water is thoroughly heated to a boil take it off the burner and place the packet in the water and set a timer for about 5 minutes. The heat should allow the TIM to reach it's thinnest point. Apply as you would at room temp and spread it over the die or put a slightly smaller amount on and use your IHS to spread it. Allow to cool to room temp and that should allow the usage of NH1 or any low viscosity TIM without pushout. I use this method to get a clean spread on my CPUs and it works really well. It also helps conserve TIM by allowing a thinner application.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


NT-H1 separates after a bunch of thermal cycles. After >500 thermal cycles, I saw some dark residue on the die and the rest had pumped out. It seems to be a problem with the composition.

Still no problems with Kryonaut though.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> NT-H1 separates after a bunch of thermal cycles. After >500 thermal cycles, I saw some dark residue on the die and the rest had pumped out. It seems to be a problem with the composition.
> 
> Still no problems with Kryonaut though.


Did you use the method the Ceadderman suggested, or were you using a different application method?


----------



## Ceadderman

"the Ceadderman"...









I like the sound of that.


















~The Ceadder


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> "the Ceadderman"...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like the sound of that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~The Ceadder


Much like Batman, the word "The" eventually gets added....













And because I saw it in my pic folder, it involves Batman, and is funny....









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You can always set a custom fan curve in Afterburner. With my custom curve, the fans turn on at ~40*C. Just make sure that if you get any CLP on those parts near the die, that it gets cleaned off completely.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So with the MSI 970, did they put the "Void if Removed" sticker over one of the screws again? That's what they did with the Gaming Edition 760s that I had.


Msi will probably still rma it.. Ask them im sure they will. there laptop as the same sticker


----------



## v1ral

Kryonaut is a good alternative for CLU/CLP?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Kryonaut is a good alternative??


I'd wait and see what the longer-term results for Kryonaut end up being. I've seen lots of posts from people saying "I used (insert thermal compound name here) on my CPU die, and it works great". Then, after a while, it changes to "Well after X weeks, my temps started getting worse." After that, they generally ask for advice on what to use, or post that they've ordered a liquid metal solution. I think that once a compound can be on the die for a matter of years without drying out or pumping out, it might be considered as a replacement or competitor for the liquid metals.

I'd love to see a regular TIM compete with a liquid metal for the on-die applications, since it would be cheaper and easier to get - local B&M shop vs. ordering online.


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You can always set a custom fan curve in Afterburner. With my custom curve, the fans turn on at ~40*C. Just make sure that if you get any CLP on those parts near the die, that it gets cleaned off completely.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So with the MSI 970, did they put the "Void if Removed" sticker over one of the screws again? That's what they did with the Gaming Edition 760s that I had.


Yeah, same shenanigans. I hear they don't enforce it but, its never given me trouble. (Unlike the two MSI motherboards I have out for RMA right now







) My fan curve is bios flashed, so when I change afterburner profiles sometimes the fan utility gives me hell haha.

I'm almost surprised that intel doesn't do something similar to their IHS. I guess it must be really obvious if its been swapped to CLU/CLP and reglued.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Yeah, same shenanigans. I hear they don't enforce it but, its never given me trouble. (Unlike the two MSI motherboards I have out for RMA right now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) My fan curve is bios flashed, so when I change afterburner profiles sometimes the fan utility gives me hell haha.
> 
> I'm almost surprised that intel doesn't do something similar to their IHS. I guess it must be really obvious if its been swapped to CLU/CLP and reglued.


I couldn't find any configuration of fan settings in the BIOS that worked for me. So either, I leave Afterburner closed and let the stock settings go, or I can open Afterburner and have my custom profile take over.

I didn't end up having any issues with my 760s, so I never had to deal with an RMA. I did swap out the TIM on those, just not with CLP (didn't have any at the time).


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Did you use the method the Ceadderman suggested, or were you using a different application method?


Why would you even want to when Kryonaut, GC Extreme and PK-3 are far superior?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> I'm almost surprised that intel doesn't do something similar to their IHS. I guess it must be really obvious if its been swapped to CLU/CLP and reglued.


Yeah definitely. A big "warranty void if removed" sticker right on top of the ihs. It couldn't make temps any worse right?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Why would you even want to when Kryonaut, GC Extreme and PK-3 are far superior?


What are you referring to? I've made zero suggestions regarding thermal compounds, though I am well aware of the top performers.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Did you use the method the Ceadderman suggested, or were you using a different application method?
> 
> 
> 
> Why would you even want to when Kryonaut, GC Extreme and PK-3 are far superior?
Click to expand...

Now I don't know about Kryonaut because I've got a tube(OoStock) in my performance cart and because it hasn't been compared in a comprehensive review.

But the others? "Far Superior" is a rather subjective term when the +/- runout is mere C away from NH1. I traditionally use G751 which to me was best since 2009. I've yet to use CLP/CLU but a metallic TIM should be better than G751. So to me those are better in this endeavor. But there are hazards involved with using with bare copper/aluminum cooling plates afaik, so I won't use it with my Blocks. Might give it a rip with my MB block once I've upgraded Board/CPU and RAM components just to put it through its paces with the flame thrower NB chip on my CIVF. That thing can get extremely hot extremely quick.

I'm actually getting HydroNaut. Because in my mind KryoNaut is for potential LN2 usage and Hydronaut is for Water Cooling. I could be wrong about that.

My method however of thinning out TIM works with most TIMs that are considered Enthusiast TIM. Ceramique not withstanding. Only reason I have an 80 application tube is purely for securing watercooling standoffs during the mount process. Stuff is like Marshmallow imho. And probably as thermally conductive.







lulz

~Ceadder


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Now I don't know about Kryonaut because I've got a tube(OoStock) in my performance cart and because it hasn't been compared in a comprehensive review.
> 
> But the others? "Far Superior" is a rather subjective term when the +/- runout is mere C away from *NH1*. I traditionally use *G751* which to me was best since 2009. I've yet to use CLP/CLU but a metallic TIM should be better than G751. So to me those are better in this endeavor. But there are hazards involved with using with bare copper/aluminum cooling plates afaik, so I won't use it with my Blocks. Might give it a rip with my MB block once I've upgraded Board/CPU and RAM components just to put it through its paces with the flame thrower NB chip on my CIVF. That thing can get extremely hot extremely quick.
> 
> I'm actually getting HydroNaut. Because in my mind KryoNaut is for potential LN2 usage and Hydronaut is for Water Cooling. I could be wrong about that.
> 
> My method however of thinning out TIM works with most TIMs that are considered Enthusiast TIM. Ceramique not withstanding. Only reason I have an 80 application tube is purely for securing watercooling standoffs during the mount process. Stuff is like Marshmallow imho. And probably as thermally conductive.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lulz
> 
> ~Ceadder


TL;DR

This reminds me of the folks who hung on to AS5 5 years too long!







Get a new TIM circa 2015 please. Noctua's TIM is archaic at this point. Just sayin'...









Nice to see you're going with TG!


----------



## jdorje

Slightly off topic, but I just got a newegg notification of clu coming back into stock.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Now I don't know about Kryonaut because I've got a tube(OoStock) in my performance cart and because it hasn't been compared in a comprehensive review.
> 
> But the others? "Far Superior" is a rather subjective term when the +/- runout is mere C away from *NH1*. I traditionally use *G751* which to me was best since 2009. I've yet to use CLP/CLU but a metallic TIM should be better than G751. So to me those are better in this endeavor. But there are hazards involved with using with bare copper/aluminum cooling plates afaik, so I won't use it with my Blocks. Might give it a rip with my MB block once I've upgraded Board/CPU and RAM components just to put it through its paces with the flame thrower NB chip on my CIVF. That thing can get extremely hot extremely quick.
> 
> I'm actually getting HydroNaut. Because in my mind KryoNaut is for potential LN2 usage and Hydronaut is for Water Cooling. I could be wrong about that.
> 
> My method however of thinning out TIM works with most TIMs that are considered Enthusiast TIM. Ceramique not withstanding. Only reason I have an 80 application tube is purely for securing watercooling standoffs during the mount process. Stuff is like Marshmallow imho. And probably as thermally conductive.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lulz
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TL;DR
> 
> This reminds me of the folks who hung on to AS5 5 years too long!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Get a new TIM circa 2015 please. Noctua's TIM is archaic at this point. Just sayin'...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice to see you're going with TG!
Click to expand...

haha that's funny. Considering that AS5 is still a solid performer. It's archaic only in the Burn In method. An 8 day burn in is 7 days too long imho. I don't believe that anyone should have to wait that long to find out whether they need to perform a reseat or find out whether their CPU temps are indicative of a bad chip. G751 is still amongst the forefront of TIMs. Can't help that there hasn't been much in the way of new TIMs entering the market and that there hasn't been a comparative review against the old guard. That's just how TIM is tbh. It's not like there has been much call for something new or much in the way of formulaic advancement.









I will still buy G751 for client builds because it's good and I get fast results with it. And I won't subject my clients to something I would never in a million years use myself. I build budget systems, so the added expense of maintenance is something I tend to avoid unless it's hardware related.









~Ceadder


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> TL;DR
> 
> This reminds me of the folks who hung on to AS5 5 years too long!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Get a new TIM circa 2015 please. Noctua's TIM is archaic at this point. Just sayin'...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nice to see you're going with TG!












It really helps to read the post you're replying to. What TIMs do you think are "circa 2015"? All of the top performers have been around for years....


----------



## alancsalt

I assume Sheyster means a tim that rates highly in recent comparisons.


----------



## Ceadderman

How many TIMs have been introduced over the last six years? Honestly? Six at most. EK came out with their own Cool Labratories have 2 and the nauts. That's a conservative guesstimate.









~Ceadder


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Yeah definitely. A big "warranty void if removed" sticker right on top of the ihs. It couldn't make temps any worse right?


I was thinking more of something that made contact with the pcb, near the edge of the heat spreader, Dr. Sardonic.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> How many TIMs have been introduced over the last six years? Honestly? Six at most. EK came out with their own Cool Labratories have 2 and the nauts. That's a conservative guesstimate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I have never been into thermal paste until recently, I was always a "trusty AS5 is good enough for everything", kind of person. That being said, since I've been working on computers (say seven years?) I've seen a lot of names that I haven't seen before in the last four or so. Maybe that's because I used to be ignorant, or maybe there have just been a lot of new releases after all.


----------



## Ceadderman

Well if you look up 80 way TIM comparison I bet you'll see a lot of the ones listed that you know of. There are A LOT of pastes out there.

I forgot one. IC Diamond I believe came out in the time frame so that would be one of the others.









~Ceadder


----------



## trustn01

Made a video of my recent delidding using both vise and razor: 




Any feedback or questions are welcomed.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Why would you even want to when Kryonaut, GC Extreme and PK-3 are far superior?


I tried a bunch of pastes on the die, tested with several hundred thermal cycles to accelerate pump out:

NT-H1 = pump out, filler separation. High performance at initial application.

TC 5026 = no pump out, but lower performing than fresh NT-H1.

PK-3 = lower performing compared to TC 5026... poor bond to passivization?

Kryonaut = no pump out, higher performance than NT-H1.

Kryonaut is my tim1 of choice so far. I still need to see if it has solvents that bake out, but pump out shouldn't be a problem.


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I tried a bunch of pastes on the die, tested with several hundred thermal cycles to accelerate pump out:
> 
> NT-H1 = pump out, filler separation. High performance at initial application.
> 
> TC 5026 = no pump out, but lower performing than fresh NT-H1.
> 
> PK-3 = lower performing compared to TC 5026... poor bond to passivization?
> 
> Kryonaut = no pump out, higher performance than NT-H1.
> 
> Kryonaut is my tim1 of choice so far. I still need to see if it has solvents that bake out, but pump out shouldn't be a problem.


While it will take a long time to test, I am excited to see how Kryonaut stands up over an extended period of time. I would love to see something else that can compete with CLP/CLU on longevity and thermal performance.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> haha that's funny. Considering that AS5 is still a solid performer


Some people still say the same thing about WinXP. Doesn't mean they're right.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I tried a bunch of pastes on the die, tested with several hundred thermal cycles to accelerate pump out:
> 
> NT-H1 = pump out, filler separation. High performance at initial application.
> 
> TC 5026 = no pump out, but lower performing than fresh NT-H1.
> 
> PK-3 = lower performing compared to TC 5026... poor bond to passivization?
> 
> *Kryonaut* = no pump out, higher performance than NT-H1.
> 
> *Kryonaut* is my tim1 of choice so far. I still need to see if it has solvents that bake out, but pump out shouldn't be a problem.


GTK about Kryo... It's what I'm using now.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I assume Sheyster means a tim that rates highly in recent comparisons.


http://overclocking.guide/thermal-paste-roundup-2015-47-products-tested-with-air-cooling-and-liquid-nitrogen-ln2/


----------



## Ceadderman

I cannot take the review very seriously when Shin Etsu doesn't have a presence in the review. No 7783 no G751. Two well known TIMs.

Also this review is air and LN2 only. Air I get. LN2 is not an everyday cooling option except for phase cooling solutions and phase while solid for cooling isn't that common in usage.









~Ceadder


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Roman is super credible...

IE hwbot moderator, thermal grizzly, caseking.de, http://der8auer.com/
as in creator of The BEAST pot.

anyways he does ln2 testing because he's freaking der8auer


----------



## Ceadderman

I realize the gent is a credible source.

Point is half his review doesn't apply to the typical enthusiast. And he left out the segment(water cooling) that it would normally apply to.









~Ceadder


----------



## tatmMRKIV

water isn't magic. shouldn't change the pecking order so to speak


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I realize the gent is a credible source.
> 
> Point is half his review doesn't apply to the typical enthusiast. And he left out the segment(water cooling) that it would normally apply to.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


He never actually got around to writing the cold test it seems.

The ambient test should apply (or not) to any room temperature cooler. I'm not actually sure what the purpose of the cooler in the test is. He's not even using a cpu for the test, which is rather more of a complaint I'd think.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> water isn't magic. shouldn't change the pecking order so to speak


Never said it was. Just pointing out that LN2 isn't as prevalent in the enthusiast market, so skipping water cooling (which is relevant) is rather short sighted.

I do agree that ambient temp should have bearing in the review however.









~Ceadder


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I cannot take the review very seriously when Shin Etsu doesn't have a presence in the review. No 7783 no G751. Two well known TIMs.


Shin Etsu is just as archaic as Arctic Silver. Their *BEST* TIM's thermal conductivity is ~4 W/m-°C, which is less than *HALF* of GC Extreme, and about *ONE THIRD* of Kryonaut's conductivity.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> He's not even using a cpu for the test, which is rather more of a complaint I'd think.


He's taking the variable of the mount quality out of the equation, making it a better test overall. It's rather brilliant actually. It's a more standardized test, which is a good thing.


----------



## agung79

Only using pk3... 10-12cdeg cooler





First time delided ..... easy than I thought. ... but still make me exhausted. ....


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I cannot take the review very seriously when Shin Etsu doesn't have a presence in the review. No 7783 no G751. Two well known TIMs.
> 
> 
> 
> Shin Etsu is just as archaic as Arctic Silver. Their *BEST* TIM's thermal conductivity is ~4 W/m-°C, which is less than *HALF* of GC Extreme, and about *ONE THIRD* of Kryonaut's conductivity.
Click to expand...

And yet it performs *really* well. Even when handcuffed by their own specs. Unless you've used it you wouldn't understand. Call it "archaic", antiquated or any number of terms you can think of regarding its age, it's the top of the list from previous offerings and should merit some consideration in a review of Thermal Interface Materials as such. If for no other reason. Did you see the other "archaic" pastes that *were* included in the review?









Arctic Silver Ceramique 2?!?









I still have a *hugemongous* tube of that stuff sitting in my desk. I don't even use it for thermal applications anymore. It's well over 2 decades old and doesn't hold up against its stable mate "AS5" which is also in the review.









~Ceadder


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> And yet it performs *really* well. Even when handcuffed by their own specs. Unless you've used it you wouldn't understand. Call it "archaic", antiquated or any number of terms you can think of regarding its age, it's the top of the list from previous offerings and should merit some consideration in a review of Thermal Interface Materials as such. If for no other reason. Did you see the other "archaic" pastes that *were* included in the review?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Tell ya what; let's agree to disagree.

My parting shot is this: Some folks are willing to settle for less than the best. I'm not one of them.

Cheers!
















EDIT - For the record, I've personally used 2 types of Shin/MicroSI, years ago.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *agung79*
> 
> Only using pk3... 10-12cdeg cooler
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First time delided ..... easy than I thought. ... but still make me exhausted. ....


damn them some nice voltages

Chaeddar, why does it matter if its not the best?
I have an industrial tube of tim I dont use, that I may be tempted to dig out

As of SK though delidding and extreme cooling are partners so data is relevant in thread...
All the water guys already know nothing beats CLU anyways. I mean all other testing is relatively pointless, unless someone already bought poor quality paste and want to compare.

If you are delidding though is seems to me you dont want to skimp costs on TIM1

Still a comparison of just air and ln2 is more than enough, properties arent going to magically change under water.

The performance of the tim doesnt change, so its not necessary, how is that short sighted? It saves a bunch of time that I know roman doesnt have much of... takes days for him to respond to product queries.
he does so much... hwbot, caseking builds, r&d and manufacture for his pots, thermal grizzly, pretty sure he is still a student.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> My parting shot is this: Some folks are willing to settle for less than the best. I'm not one of them.
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT - For the record, I've personally used 2 types of Shin/MicroSI, years ago.


2nded


----------



## Ceadderman

It matters because it *was* the best. It also is plenty available and if you include Ceramique in the review then Shin Etsu should have at least one TIM(g751) in the running.

When I don't see the best on the market in a review, I wonder why that is.

Ceramique is Marshmallow sauce and just as sticky. This is my point.

And I will certainly agree to disagree. But let's be honest shall we? The only time anyone says this phrase anymore is when they've convinced themselves they are right so much that they cannot bear to consider the validity of the other person's concerns.

I'm not wanting this conversation to devolve into pablum throwing deathmatch.

I'm simply saying that I'm not of the mind that G751 isn't relevant to a review.


















~Ceadder


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> All the water guys already know nothing beats CLU anyways.


Apparently Phobya LM does, and is cheaper to boot.







As always, YMMV.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

once a product has been beat its obsolete. This is computers LOL

@sheyster then they can have their little head to head LM death matches.

Anyways there are plenty of tests that compare TIM on water.. go find one of those. De8auser is an LN2-LHe god. And some people need to know how pastes perform on LN2. because that actually is different, pk-3 cracks at -50c for instance. alot just doesn't work. on water or air it will almost always work.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> once a product has been beat its obsolete. This is computers LOL
> 
> @sheyster then they can have their little head to head LM death matches.
> 
> Anyways there are plenty of tests that compare TIM on water.. go find one of those. De8auser is an LN2-LHe god. And some people need to know how pastes perform on LN2. because that actually is different, pk-3 cracks at -50c for instance. alot just doesn't work. on water or air it will almost always work.


+rep

It's a bit funny that he came up with a BETTER way to test, and he's being criticized for it.


----------



## jdorje

The only thing I don't understand is why he needed a cooler at all for the ambient test. But air vs water indeed shouldn't matter...the only point of the first test is that it's done at room temp.

I guess you could question if some tims worked better with aluminum than others. Other than the liquid metals of course. His test was copper-copper.

I wish he had completed the ln2 test...


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> +rep
> 
> It's a bit funny that he came up with a BETTER way to test, and he's being criticized for it.


Can you detail what makes it "BETTER"? I'll certainly agree with it being a "different" test....


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> once a product has been beat its obsolete. This is computers LOL
> 
> @sheyster then they can have their little head to head LM death matches.
> 
> Anyways there are plenty of tests that compare TIM on water.. go find one of those. De8auser is an LN2-LHe god. And some people need to know how pastes perform on LN2. because that actually is different, pk-3 cracks at -50c for instance. alot just doesn't work. on water or air it will almost always work.
> 
> 
> 
> +rep
> 
> It's a bit funny that he came up with a BETTER way to test, and he's being criticized for it.
Click to expand...

Okay look, am not criticizing him for his testing methodology. Yeah I think that water should have been included as well. But you're mistaking my opinion as criticism of the methodology.

My one criticism is if you're going to do a comprehensive test then do one. He paid for the testing out of his own pocket for all the TIM. But I bet I can find reasonable trash in that review that COULD have been left out to include Shin Etsu. I dunno maybe he's like me and has a tube of Ceramique laying around and it was thrown in. Can't really say, and neither does he. But if not, it was a wasted purchase to compare it to much higher grades of TIM.

I am getting HydroNaut so it's not like I am married(ala "Til Death Do Us Part") to G751. I generally try something else once for my build purposes to see if it works better than my fallback G751. I'm sorry if that wrinkles some noses, but being that it was the best and beat AS5(ALSO INCLUDED IN THE REVIEW) by a narrow margin due to the short Burn In time of G751 over AS5 then sorry, but imho the test lacked in that regard. Why you are so Hades bent to minimize my thoughts on the issue is beyond me. Shoot I will send the guy a tube of G751 to put it through its paces to add it to the comparison. I'm not being in the least bit unreasonable in my thoughts but apparently I am rubbing some people the wrong way.









~Ceadder


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Can you detail what makes it "BETTER"? I'll certainly agree with it being a "different" test....


The list is long and distinguished, like my... oh wait..









Just some notes:

- Look at his thermometers... other testers use software and rely on inaccurate onboard sensors.

- His method is more standardized. The CPU socket itself is no longer a variable, mount pressure is not an issue, IHS imperfections, among other things.

- To further explain, the point is to test the quality of the TIM itself, and that can be done better when isolating it from all the other conditions that can introduce variance. I think he's done a pretty good job of that.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CuriousNapper*
> 
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra costs as much as the cpu I am using (used G3258)
> 
> Thanks for telling me, I will consider other options or just refresh it once I see it get hotter.
> 
> I have some arctic alumina thermal adhesive around, what do you think about that?
> 
> Surely a test no one with devils canyon has done lol


Everyone here is right in saying that you should use clu. If you have to use a nonconductive tim, youre best off going with gelid gc extreme because its a great tim that most people with ek kits have lying around anyway...


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Kryonaut is better than gc-extreme


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> Kryonaut is better than gc-extreme


Im not familiar with kryonaut, and it might be better, but EK blocks are pretty pervasive on OCN, and they all ship with GC extreme, so its pretty common. Thats why i was suggesting it. There are better pastes than GC extreme though.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Im not familiar with kryonaut, and it might be better, but EK blocks are pretty pervasive on OCN, and they all ship with GC extreme, so its pretty common. Thats why i was suggesting it. *There are better pastes than GC extreme though.*


True, but not many....The majority of the lists are below GC Extreme.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

it is a very short list. Kryonaut and liquid metal based TIMs, basically. there might be one other thing.


----------



## 0ldChicken

i replaced my TIM 1 (kryonaut) with phobia lm yesterday on my 4790k and think i might have done something wrong? I'm coming up with about the same exact temps as kryonaut. With maybe 1-2c difference. Are they this close in performance as TIM 1? I kinda figured Id drop at least a few degrees more. I'm thinking maybe i did not put enough on, it was literally a droplet spread out extremely thin but it did cover the die and i spread a tiny layer on the bottom of the ihs too. I'm staying at/below about 74c80c during intelburn. Should i try reapplying or does this seem about right?
Edit: running 4790k @ 1.35v under custom loop, about 80c intel burn
Edit V2.0: both XTU and OCCT seem to be running about 6-8c cooler than the kryonaut as TIM1 which ran about 6-8c cooler than stock so overall I've gained (lost) about 15c via delidding, with kryonaut getting me about half the results of Phobia LM.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> True, but not many....The majority of the lists are below GC Extreme.


The elite pastes are Kryonaut, GC Extreme and PK-3. Hydronaut is in the mix too.


----------



## fleetfeather

Why so much talk about which TIMs truly rank amongst the second tier of TIMs?

You want a good TIM? Get CLU, apply it with care, and move on.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Clu dont work with cold though.


----------



## fleetfeather

Uhhhh, so? It's cold. Literally the exact scenario where temperatures are of little consequence.

The most important metric for cold testing isn't even being discussed; whether the TIM freezes during cold sessions.

Furthermore, referencing temperature benchmarks of TIMs applying somehow to sub-zero overclocks, in such a long-winded discussion, in the delidding thread? Let's be real.... This is just a pissing contest


----------



## 0ldChicken

OCN name: 0ldChicken
CPU: i7 4790k
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: 100 MHz
OC after delid: 5.0 GHz
Temp drops: 7c (83c before-77c after, 24c ambient)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/kg6hb6


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> Clu dont work with cold though.


CLU is the gold standard, and by and large it has replaced CLP as the TIM of choice between the die and IHS. Reason being, it performs as well as CLP or better, but it is also easier to clean up either immediately after removal, or a year down the road, also it doesnt seem to corrode when used in the proper, non-aluminum setting. However, you also dont want to use it directly with exposed copper, because ive heard it reacts. Nickel plated copper works really well with CLU.

That being said I run my cpu naked (die to cooler with no IHS) but you would do well with a conductive (metal) TIM between die and IHS and a nonconductive between the IHS and cooler.NT-H1 is still good for this, despite its problems but I like GC extreme, because i buy mostly EK products because im too lazy to switch and want to maintain aesthetics







. EK ships a small syringe of GC extreme with each kit, and since i use CLU on my GPU as well as my CPU, i got a bunch laying around anyway in case i need it for client builds.

From what ive read though, unless you can be sure that your stock cooler for your CPU/GPU is a form of plated copper, I would steer clear of metal TIM. If you have the option to get a nickel plated copper for your aftermarket cooler, you would have more options without having to worry about corrosion.


----------



## HiTechPixel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> CLU is the gold standard, and by and large it has replaced CLP as the TIM of choice between the die and IHS. Reason being, it performs as well as CLP or better, but it is also easier to clean up either immediately after removal, or a year down the road, also it doesnt seem to corrode when used in the proper, non-aluminum setting. However, you also dont want to use it directly with exposed copper, because ive heard it reacts. Nickel plated copper works really well with CLU.
> 
> That being said I run my cpu naked (die to cooler with no IHS) but you would do well with a conductive (metal) TIM between die and IHS and a nonconductive between the IHS and cooler.NT-H1 is still good for this, despite its problems but I like GC extreme, because i buy mostly EK products because im too lazy to switch and want to maintain aesthetics
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . EK ships a small syringe of GC extreme with each kit, and since i use CLU on my GPU as well as my CPU, i got a bunch laying around anyway in case i need it for client builds.
> 
> From what ive read though, unless you can be sure that your stock cooler for your CPU/GPU is a form of plated copper, I would steer clear of metal TIM. If you have the option to get a nickel plated copper for your aftermarket cooler, you would have more options without having to worry about corrosion.


CLU is better performer but messier than CLP. CLU can permanently stain your CPU die, CLP doens't do it.

Personally Kryonaut is good for me. It works with air, it works with water and it works with LN2.


----------



## maynard14

guys, quick question,, is it good idea to swap my 4770k max oc to 4.3 ghz swap to 4690k max oc to 4.6 ghz,. im only gaming and im tempted to the 4690k just because it oc much better than my 4770k


----------



## Ceadderman

Only you can know for sure if it's worth it.

In my mind no. But then I am like that. Although I have changed chips on my signature rig 4 times for minor upgrades related to [email protected] Soooooo...









~Ceadder


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> guys, quick question,, is it good idea to swap my 4770k max oc to 4.3 ghz swap to 4690k max oc to 4.6 ghz,. im only gaming and im tempted to the 4690k just because it oc much better than my 4770k


300mhz alone will not overcome the loss of ht in some games.

That being said I can turn off ht (4.8ghz 4790k) and I cannot even tell any difference in my games unless I run a benchmark/fraps.


----------



## rsturtle

Regardless of what you use, if you aren't using the best paste, you're missing out. Delidding is potentially ruining an up to $300 CPU... if you don't go with CLU/CLP,you're letting the best part get away from you in my opinion.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> guys, quick question,, is it good idea to swap my 4770k max oc to 4.3 ghz swap to 4690k max oc to 4.6 ghz,. im only gaming and im tempted to the 4690k just because it oc much better than my 4770k


You would have to look at benchmarks for the games you're playing. A lot of the games I play actually will perform exactly the same with or without HT, in that case the 300mhz could make quite a few frames difference. Some games I have seen where HT makes up that difference. Since you have a 980ti, I would test it out yourself and see which one is better for you. Personally I would take the higher speed 4690k, one of the reasons being better temps because HT adds a few more degrees under load potentially... totally depends on your experience.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Regardless of what you use, if you aren't using the best paste, you're missing out. Delidding is potentially ruining an up to $300 CPU... if you don't go with CLU/CLP,you're letting the best part get away from you in my opinion.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> guys, quick question,, is it good idea to swap my 4770k max oc to 4.3 ghz swap to 4690k max oc to 4.6 ghz,. im only gaming and im tempted to the 4690k just because it oc much better than my 4770k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You would have to look at benchmarks for the games you're playing. A lot of the games I play actually will perform exactly the same with or without HT, in that case the 300mhz could make quite a few frames difference. Some games I have seen where HT makes up that difference. Since you have a 980ti, I would test it out yourself and see which one is better for you. Personally I would take the higher speed 4690k, one of the reasons being better temps because HT adds a few more degrees under load potentially... totally depends on your experience.
Click to expand...

All well and good if he was talking about Paste and not Chip.









~Ceadder


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Uhhhh, so? It's cold. Literally the exact scenario where temperatures are of little consequence.
> 
> The most important metric for cold testing isn't even being discussed; whether the TIM freezes during cold sessions.
> 
> Furthermore, referencing temperature benchmarks of TIMs applying somehow to sub-zero overclocks, in such a long-winded discussion, in the delidding thread? Let's be real.... This is just a pissing contest


There's more to it than that. Most don't like to use CLU/CLP between the IHS and their block/heatsink. This is where the premium pastes such as TG Kryonaut and GC Extreme are relevant to the discussion. This is nothing new to anyone in this thread.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> OCN name: 0ldChicken
> CPU: i7 4790k
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: 100 MHz
> OC after delid: 5.0 GHz
> Temp drops: 7c (83c before-77c after, 24c ambient)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/kg6hb6


you're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Regardless of what you use, if you aren't using the best paste, you're missing out. Delidding is potentially ruining an up to $300 CPU... if you don't go with CLU/CLP,you're letting the best part get away from you in my opinion.
> You would have to look at benchmarks for the games you're playing. A lot of the games I play actually will perform exactly the same with or without HT, in that case the 300mhz could make quite a few frames difference. Some games I have seen where HT makes up that difference. Since you have a 980ti, I would test it out yourself and see which one is better for you. Personally I would take the higher speed 4690k, one of the reasons being better temps because HT adds a few more degrees under load potentially... totally depends on your experience.


thanks sir, but my 4770k is delided already so temps is not an issue max temps while gaming is only 61c with ht on, but this chip is boring to oc at 1.3 volts it is still not stable at 4.4 ghz, i dont want to push the oc above 1.3 voltz thats why i stop to 4.3 ghz, while the 4690k can oc to 4.6 ghz @ 1.29 voltz still good max temp at 80c while stress testing even it is not delided









but will test some games later and compare benchmark and ill check if theres a diff


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> There's more to it than that. Most don't like to use CLU/CLP between the IHS and their block/heatsink. This is where the premium pastes such as TG Kryonaut and GC Extreme are relevant to the discussion. This is nothing new to anyone in this thread.


Haha, even if your claim about "most people" is right, the temperature differences you're talking about between second tier pastes and third tier pastes is a small matter of degrees. It will not impact the frequency or voltage you run at, because no one is pushing their chip to run at a level when 2-4C will matter. Also, the comfort level of some people using CLU between IHS and block is simply due to their lack of knowledge about the product; it's not due to the product, but due to the person. Aside from using aluminium heatsinks, there's actually 0 reason why someone wouldn't use CLU on their CPU block if they were trying to achieve the best results.

If you're into _the pursuit of performance_, you use CLU. If you're not going to do that, why would 2-4C matter?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Haha, even if your claim about "most people" is right, the temperature differences you're talking about between second tier pastes and third tier pastes is a small matter of degrees. It will not impact the frequency or voltage you run at, because no one is pushing their chip to run at a level when 2-4C will matter. Also, the comfort level of some people using CLU between IHS and block is simply due to their lack of knowledge about the product; it's not due to the product, but due to the person. Aside from using aluminium heatsinks, there's actually 0 reason why someone wouldn't use CLU on their CPU block if they were trying to achieve the best results.
> 
> If you're into _the pursuit of performance_, you use CLU. If you're not going to do that, why would 2-4C matter?


I've heard of the issue with copper from several sources though. What happens if you use clu between your ihs and a copper heat sink?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Haha, even if your claim about "most people" is right, the temperature differences you're talking about between second tier pastes and third tier pastes is a small matter of degrees. It will not impact the frequency or voltage you run at, because no one is pushing their chip to run at a level when 2-4C will matter. Also, the comfort level of some people using CLU between IHS and block is simply due to their lack of knowledge about the product; it's not due to the product, but due to the person. Aside from using aluminium heatsinks, there's actually 0 reason why someone wouldn't use CLU on their CPU block if they were trying to achieve the best results.
> 
> If you're into _the pursuit of performance_, you use CLU. If you're not going to do that, why would 2-4C matter?


Its not about the pursuit of performance. CLU is known to cause degradation and corrosion of aluminum, and there are plenty of aluminum based heatsinks still on the market. I know for a fact the stock cooler that intel ships out is made of aluminum. If it makes contact it will cause corrosion. If left unchecked it could be bad. To my knowledge non conductive TIMs dont cause this. And as far as pursuit of performance is concerned, non conducitve pastes are cheaper than CLU, by a lot. Theres a far greater surface area on the IHS than the die itself, so why would you waste CLU on the IHS-Cooler interface for a marginal improvement? Let alone the fact that it would cause damage to the cooler.

To my knowledge the only surface that doesnt corrode eventually in the presence of CLU is nickel, and even copper corrodes slightly, but not enough to really impact performance.

EDIT: I didnt see that you had already mentioned the part about aluminum heatsinks, BUT it's easier to just use a NC paste rather than have to research whether or not a heatsink is Al. For instance, I just found out recently that some GPU heatsinks are sometimes made of aluminum. This was news to me!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I've heard of the issue with copper from several sources though. What happens if you use clu between your ihs and a copper heat sink?


 Question about Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra thermel paste

started on 02/24/13
•

last post 04/09/17 at 4:39pm
•

36 replies
•

14002 views

@RavageTheEarth, props for this photo


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Haha, even if your claim about "most people" is right, the temperature differences you're talking about between second tier pastes and third tier pastes is a small matter of degrees. It will not impact the frequency or voltage you run at, because no one is pushing their chip to run at a level when 2-4C will matter. Also, the comfort level of some people using CLU between IHS and block is simply due to their lack of knowledge about the product; it's not due to the product, but due to the person. Aside from using aluminium heatsinks, there's actually 0 reason why someone wouldn't use CLU on their CPU block if they were trying to achieve the best results.
> 
> If you're into _the pursuit of performance_, you use CLU. If you're not going to do that, why would 2-4C matter?


I agree that anyone who wants the absolute best possible temps should use CLU. I use CLP die/IHS and CLU IHS/water block and gained 3C over Gelid Xtreme. Not huge but I invested in a custom loop so why not use the best? The top 10 regular TIM's are all within 1~3 C of each other and how you apply it has a larger influence on temps than what brand.
I've used CLU for over 3 years And NEVER had a problem with my copper water blocks. If a person is using a aluminum heat sink with no copper base... why even bother with using a premium TIM?


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> snip


So you mentioned:

- CLU/CLP effect on aluminium heatsinks
- Price-performance of different types of TIMs
- Marginal improvements of performance between CLU and pastes used on heatsinks/blocks
- Evidence of corrosion on cooper

I'll discuss each of these points in-turn;

As you noted, I have already referenced CLU and CLP's effect on aluminium. It's not really hard to tell if your heatsink is made from aluminium or nickel (eg: look at the price you paid for your cooler...), and as you mentioned, the purchase of CLU for an aluminium heatsink is a gross misuse of your component budget.

As for the temperature gain from CLU/CLP between the IHS and Heatsink/block, the temperature difference between coollab's products and the second tier pastes _might_ be argued as not being worthwhile, but at the same time, neither is the difference in performance between any of the second and third tier pastes either; if it's not worth gaining a few degrees by using CLU or CLP on your heatsink, why would it be worth gaining a few degrees using some compound benchmarked as being 2C better than another. _If_ you want to consider what is worthwhile and what is not, you're best argument would be in favour of the compound which has the biggest performance gains.

Price-to-performance, if you're delidding (and i will assume you are because you're typing in the delidded club), you should already ideally own CLU or CLP. So, any additionally-bought TIM used for the heatsink/block is another cost to you. Your price-to-performance will always be higher if you use the one (highest-performing) substance instead of two different substances lol

As for the photo above, I'm looking to evidence of CLU damaging a H100 block, because that photo does not look like a H100 block at all. The author notes that CLU 'may corrode' or 'may weld' to a copper block after 'an extended period'... but really that tells me very little about what has happened. Sure, I've seen CLP (not CLU) stain the top of my IHS before, but that's hardly something worthy of concern.


----------



## RazingArrow

I Just delid my cpu and gained 27 degrees on skylake i6600k. I Used the razor blade method and this was my first go. I was so nervous but still went on and did it. I dont regret it at all. My question is. I used CLU on the die and noctua paste on the IHS. I read somewhere that using CLU on the IHS is not good cause its very hard to clean off. But my first attemt on the die was alitle messy so i wiped it again and reapplied it. It it was not hard at all to remove it fro the die. I have a Aircooled cpu Noctua u14s. Is it worth using CLU on the IHS?

Thanks for a good thread this iks officially my first post.


----------



## Forceman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RazingArrow*
> 
> I Just delid my cpu and gained 27 degrees on skylake i6600k. I Used the razor blade method and this was my first go. I was so nervous but still went on and did it. I dont regret it at all. My question is. I used CLU on the die and noctua paste on the IHS. I read somewhere that using CLU on the IHS is not good cause its very hard to clean off. But my first attemt on the die was alitle messy so i wiped it again and reapplied it. It it was not hard at all to remove it fro the die. I have a Aircooled cpu Noctua u14s. Is it worth using CLU on the IHS?
> 
> Thanks for a good thread this iks officially my first post.


Generally speaking, it's not worth it to use CLU/CLP between the IHS and heatsink. The slightly lower temps aren't worth the hassle. It's easy to remove from the die because the die is essentially glass.


----------



## RazingArrow

Yeah.Thats what i thought to. So i eventually made a better choice then. But damn 27 degrees drop is insane. Now i run 4.7GHZ @ 1.385V with 72 degrees in intel burn test. Thats major boost in difference to 4.5GHZ @ 1.3 with 86 degrees that i had before delidding. Never going back







This was awesome. Only thing it cost was alitle more time to do it slow and steady. Was quite easy. Didnt wat to go for the vice method. Cause the PCB is so thin. didnt want to crack it.


----------



## maynard14

hi guys, done deliding my 3rd delid, from 3570k to 4770k, and then this 4690k







will see my tems later after i clean it









razor method all the way


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fleetfeather*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> snip
> 
> 
> 
> So you mentioned:
> 
> - CLU/CLP effect on aluminium heatsinks
> - Price-performance of different types of TIMs
> - Marginal improvements of performance between CLU and pastes used on heatsinks/blocks
> - Evidence of corrosion on cooper
> 
> I'll discuss each of these points in-turn;
> 
> As you noted, I have already referenced CLU and CLP's effect on aluminium. It's not really hard to tell if your heatsink is made from aluminium or nickel (eg: look at the price you paid for your cooler...), and as you mentioned, the purchase of CLU for an aluminium heatsink is a gross misuse of your component budget.
> 
> As for the temperature gain from CLU/CLP between the IHS and Heatsink/block, the temperature difference between coollab's products and the second tier pastes _might_ be argued as not being worthwhile, but at the same time, neither is the difference in performance between any of the second and third tier pastes either; if it's not worth gaining a few degrees by using CLU or CLP on your heatsink, why would it be worth gaining a few degrees using some compound benchmarked as being 2C better than another. _If_ you want to consider what is worthwhile and what is not, you're best argument would be in favour of the compound which has the biggest performance gains.
> 
> Price-to-performance, if you're delidding (and i will assume you are because you're typing in the delidded club), you should already ideally own CLU or CLP. So, any additionally-bought TIM used for the heatsink/block is another cost to you. Your price-to-performance will always be higher if you use the one (highest-performing) substance instead of two different substances lol
> 
> As for the photo above, I'm looking to evidence of CLU damaging a H100 block, because that photo does not look like a H100 block at all. The author notes that CLU 'may corrode' or 'may weld' to a copper block after 'an extended period'... but really that tells me very little about what has happened. Sure, I've seen CLP (not CLU) stain the top of my IHS before, but that's hardly something worthy of concern.
Click to expand...

That "h100" is not an h100 at all. It looks like a ThermalFake cooler if anything.

And of note, people will find Aluminum will become more and more prevalent in the air cooling market. It's far cheaper than Copper and companies will use the cheaper material to remain cost efficient.

One thing to remember is that the IHS is nickel plated Copper. So any negative issue regarding copper should be taken into account. Murphys law 101 applies here. Anything that can go wrong will go wrong. There is nothing wrong with using a high grade TIM between the die and the IHS. Sure it's counter to the performance at all cost mantra but that's how a lot of people approach things.









~Ceadder


----------



## jdorje

So it seems to me that the razor method has a higher chance of failure first time around, but also gives room for practice to reduce that failure rate. Whereas the vice/hammer has a lower failure rate and the vice/vice still lower...except on skylake where it returns to a higher rate of failure due to the delicate pcb.

Does this mean learning the razor method is the way to go again?

What about the razor/vice method, where you use razor around the edges to reduce the pressure needed then use vice to pop it the rest of the way off? Is this safe with the skylake pcb?


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Does this mean learning the razor method is the way to go again?
> 
> What about the razor/vice method, where you use razor around the edges to reduce the pressure needed then use vice to pop it the rest of the way off? Is this safe with the skylake pcb?


Skylake is probably safer than DC/Haswell as there is very little on the PCB that might get snagged on the blade.


----------



## FastEddieNYC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Skylake is probably safer than DC/Haswell as there is very little on the PCB that might get snagged on the blade.


The thinner substrate on Skylake plus the lack of surface components makes the razor method safer then the vice method.


----------



## Wirerat

That is some really thick looking black glue. Looks like it will take some force to delid a skylake with a razor.


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Does this mean learning the razor method is the way to go again?
> 
> What about the razor/vice method, where you use razor around the edges to reduce the pressure needed then use vice to pop it the rest of the way off? Is this safe with the skylake pcb?
> 
> 
> 
> Skylake is probably safer than DC/Haswell as there is very little on the PCB that might get snagged on the blade.
Click to expand...

Ah thanks for this.

I don't feel like I need to delid my 6600k but the novelty of doing so will probably get me to do it anyway within the year.

Gotta keep up to date with the safest way to do that. ^^


----------



## psyshack

Use a scalpel. Don't waste your time with a razor blade of any type.


----------



## Ceadderman

Scalpel are razor blades with plastic/nylon handles.









~Ceadder


----------



## tatmMRKIV

just use one like this


I think its thinner
easy to controll
you can grab like 100 for a few bucks at harbourfreight that way you can use a fresh one every time the edge deforms


----------



## PapaSmurf

I'm beginning to think I killed my 3770k during the delid. Didn't use if for a week or so while I was working on customers computers and when I tried to fire it up Thursday all it does is cycle the fans on and off every couple of seconds. Tried reseating it but that didn't help. Tried it in a different motherboard and that didn't help either. Did the good old DFI Long Bios Clear and even that didn't help. Unless someone has any ideas, it looks like I'll be moving to a 4790k sooner than I planned, but I will NOT be delidding it.

3770k
Ga-Z68XP-UD3
2 x 8gig G.Skill Ares 2133


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> I'm beginning to think I killed my 3770k during the delid. Didn't use if for a week or so while I was working on customers computers and when I tried to fire it up Thursday all it does is cycle the fans on and off every couple of seconds. Tried reseating it but that didn't help. Tried it in a different motherboard and that didn't help either. Did the good old DFI Long Bios Clear and even that didn't help. Unless someone has any ideas, it looks like I'll be moving to a 4790k sooner than I planned, but I will NOT be delidding it.
> 
> 3770k
> Ga-Z68XP-UD3
> 2 x 8gig G.Skill Ares 2133


I would not move to 4790k now. Skylake is out. Unless you already have a mobo or cannot get a skylake in your area.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

If he doesnt want to delid skylake isnt an option.

I would suggest a 5820k... soldered hex core goodness and u can get a 2nd hand mobo really low


----------



## hotrod717

Was getting ready for LN2 action on a 4770k i bought used and something didnt seem right when i went to delid. Usually a quick tap or two and it comes loose. ( I've delidded a few chips







)
However, nothing moved. Upon closer inspection, it seems this chip has already been delidded and resealed. I'm glad i didnt destroy chip, but not knowing whats under there or what was used to reseal, don't think I can risk freezing.

Here are some photos. Tell me what you think. Zero black and looks to have lid already removed-


----------



## Valgaur

Do you normally delid when freezing? I wouldn't recommend it


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Do you normally delid when freezing? I wouldn't recommend it


I've done so with every Haswell I've owned, about a dozen, and will be doing so with Skylake.
I'm not sure where you get your info, but if the #1 ranked US pro recommends it, I am not going to argue and have gotten nothing but good results doing it this way.








You can hit the robot to see my profile.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> I've done so with every Haswell I've owned, about a dozen, and will be doing so with Skylake.
> I'm not sure where you get your info, but if the #1 ranked US pro recommends it, I am not going to argue and have gotten nothing but good results doing it this way.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can hit the robot to see my profile.


The reason I said that is from my experience from Ivy, I knew the newer chips liked it but was just being cautious is all


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The reason I said that is from my experience from Ivy, I knew the newer chips liked it but was just being cautious is all


I had it make a good bit of difference. Your on the brink at 57 and then being able hit 59 after makes a believer if you.
It helps control holding temps at load a lot better. Less swing.

Confirmed the seller Delidded. What really pmo is they were dishonest and tried to bs me about it.
Quick test , -50c at 4.5 ghz. Jumped to +30c under load in xtu.
Definetely metallic tim or botched in some way. What a waste of time.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> the main problem with geild is not performance. but it "pumps out" over time. the temps will get worse and worse and all the tim will be pumped out of the die area from the pessure. CLP/CLU dot no pump out.


My mx4 seem to pump out With the lid on....

Anyone have an idea of better paste?

Just started gta v and hit 95-98celsius  i was hitting max 80c when loading before


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> My mx4 seem to pump out With the lid on....
> 
> Anyone have an idea of better paste?
> 
> Just started gta v and hit 95-98celsius  i was hitting max 80c when loading before


coolabortory liquid pro/ultra will not suffer from pump out.

This is what I have used for a couple of years now Coollaboratory Liquid PRO Thermal Interface Material https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001PE5XAC/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_lcG9vbC2HCHP8


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> coolabortory liquid pro/ultra will not suffer from pump out.
> 
> This is what I have used for a couple of years now Coollaboratory Liquid PRO Thermal Interface Material https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001PE5XAC/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_lcG9vbC2HCHP8


i do have that but i have not delidded yet.

This is pretty strange


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> i do have that but i have not delidded yet.
> 
> This is pretty strange


then use gelid extreme.


----------



## cutty1998

Finally got my CLU. Now ,Im maybe having second thoughts about this Z5. Anyone have good results with it?


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> then use gelid extreme.


I will thank you


----------



## bonami2

Hey guy did deliding lowered your gta V map loading temp?


----------



## justafatboy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Hey guy did deliding lowered your gta V map loading temp?


Delidding and replacing the thermal paste with CLU will reduce the temperature across all loads and on idle.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *justafatboy*
> 
> Delidding and replacing the thermal paste with CLU will reduce the temperature across all loads and on idle.


Yea im just too affraid to smash my cpu ahah


----------



## jdorje

Strange question: anyone have a recommendation for a laser thermometer?

www.amazon.com/Nubee-Temperature-Non-contact-Infrared-Thermometer/dp/B00CVHIJDK

This one is $10. Is there a reason to spend more?

Half the people who pay attention to this thread must have one of these, right?


----------



## PapaSmurf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *PapaSmurf*
> 
> I'm beginning to think I killed my 3770k during the delid. Didn't use if for a week or so while I was working on customers computers and when I tried to fire it up Thursday all it does is cycle the fans on and off every couple of seconds. Tried reseating it but that didn't help. Tried it in a different motherboard and that didn't help either. Did the good old DFI Long Bios Clear and even that didn't help. Unless someone has any ideas, it looks like I'll be moving to a 4790k sooner than I planned, but I will NOT be delidding it.
> 
> 3770k
> Ga-Z68XP-UD3
> 2 x 8gig G.Skill Ares 2133
> 
> 
> 
> I would not move to 4790k now. Skylake is out. Unless you already have a mobo or cannot get a skylake in your area.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> If he doesnt want to delid skylake isnt an option.
> 
> I would suggest a 5820k... soldered hex core goodness and u can get a 2nd hand mobo really low


As much as I would love to go to an X99 system, it simply isn't within my budget. I might revisit that option later. Skylake isn't much better cost wise to me due to not having any DDR4 ram to work with so that is also out at this point. The main reason for switching to the 4790K was to be able to use my existing ram, gain additional Intel SATA 3 ports, as well as better USB 3.0 support than the Z68 chipset I currently have.

I pulled the i3-2130 out of my media server and it runs just fine in the Z68 board while the 3770k does the same on/off cycling on the MSI Z67 board the 2130 came out of. Since the 3770k is doing the exact same thing in 3 different boards and the board works with a different cpu it's pretty much down to my borking the cpu. I can't see any obvious damage to the cpu, but there is obvious something wrong with it now. Gonna pick up a cheap 3570k (or similar) just to be able to get the rig up and running as I need to be able to use it and will look into a new system later.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Strange question: anyone have a recommendation for a laser thermometer?
> 
> www.amazon.com/Nubee-Temperature-Non-contact-Infrared-Thermometer/dp/B00CVHIJDK
> 
> This one is $10. Is there a reason to spend more?
> 
> Half the people who pay attention to this thread must have one of these, right?


I got a cheap one similar to that but I dont remember the brand. it still works fine but I wouldn't swear by it. I was also surprised to learn that you have to get pretty close to whatever you are wanting the temp of if you want it to be accurate. Worth the 10$ I'd say, but I can't speak for the more expensive ones


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Strange question: anyone have a recommendation for a laser thermometer?
> 
> www.amazon.com/Nubee-Temperature-Non-contact-Infrared-Thermometer/dp/B00CVHIJDK
> 
> This one is $10. Is there a reason to spend more?
> 
> Half the people who pay attention to this thread must have one of these, right?


I have 2 model and no most people dont have these and just think they know it all without one ahah

Very usefull stuff i got mine from amazon.ca and cost me 30$ but the 15-20$ one are mostly the same just i have 2 laser and a better precision from farther aways.

I would says get one in the 20-30$ range to be safe

And they are dead accurate ( tested with gpu temp sensor and cpu from 2 mobo including the socket from my amd. and it was 1c difference at worst


----------



## Ceadderman

The Ryobi temp gun works pretty well. I cannot tell you what the +/- readout is from testing it in Home Depot but it gave solid readings over 16' sraight line. I aimed it at the ventilation unit which has got to be near 20 feet +/- x' but it returned a temp in the mid sixties iirc. I was pretty impressed with it at the time. I probably would've purchased it had I had the room to do so that day.









~Ceadder


----------



## v1ral

So guys what is the consensus on using Thermal Grizzly Kryo?


----------



## sav4

Hi guys I'm looking to delid my 4770k as I have a large difference between my lowest and highest core . My question and I'm sure it's been asked already but is there any negative effect of using gelid extreme on the die and ihs? I know clp is the best but not confident using liquid metal pastes if it's only a couple degrees I can live with that if it brings all my temps into line.
Thanks in advance


----------



## Ceadderman

Poo pooing to occur in 3...

2...

1...










~Ceadder


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Hi guys I'm looking to delid my 4770k as I have a large difference between my lowest and highest core . My question and I'm sure it's been asked already but is there any negative effect of using gelid extreme on the die and ihs? I know clp is the best but not confident using liquid metal pastes if it's only a couple degrees I can live with that if it brings all my temps into line.
> Thanks in advance


Negative is you wont achieve as good a temps as you would with CLU/CLP.

Where in Perth are you? I have some CLU spare and have delidded my 3770 and 4790k, if you wanted to make a day of it. I'm in Success...

Just PM me or whatev's if you wanted to do it that way.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Hi guys I'm looking to delid my 4770k as I have a large difference between my lowest and highest core . My question and I'm sure it's been asked already but is there any negative effect of using gelid extreme on the die and ihs? I know clp is the best but not confident using liquid metal pastes if it's only a couple degrees I can live with that if it brings all my temps into line.
> Thanks in advance


Gelid extreme is very close in performance to clu at first (with in 5c). The 2nd reason to use clu/clp is more important actually.

I said "at first" because gelid will suffer from pump out used between the die/ihs. It slowly pushes out all the tim over time leaving much worse temps.

For best temps use clu/clp on die/ihs then use gelid between ihs and cooler.

If you want to delid and use gelid while the clu/clp is on order it will likely not pump out that before your clu/p arives.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> Negative is you wont achieve as good a temps as you would with CLU/CLP.
> 
> Where in Perth are you? I have some CLU spare and have delidded my 3770 and 4790k, if you wanted to make a day of it. I'm in Success...
> 
> Just PM me or whatev's if you wanted to do it that way.


I'm 4 hours North of Perth but was down in success last week. That sounds good I'll see when I'm next due to come down much appreciated ?


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Gelid extreme is very close in performance to clu at first (with in 5c). The 2nd reason to use clu/clp is more important actually.
> 
> I said "at first" because gelid will suffer from pump out used between the die/ihs. It slowly pushes out all the tim over time leaving much worse temps.
> 
> For best temps use clu/clp on die/ihs then use gelid between ihs and cooler.
> 
> If you want to delid and use gelid while the clu/clp is on order it will likely not pump out that before your clu/p arives.


I did read that it can suffer from pump out . That's a bugger


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> So guys what is the consensus on using Thermal Grizzly Kryo?


Working well for me so far.


----------



## HiTechPixel

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> So guys what is the consensus on using Thermal Grizzly Kryo?


Objectively the best traditional thermal paste for air, water and colder than zero.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> So guys what is the consensus on using Thermal Grizzly Kryo?


Things seem to be positive from what I have read thus far. Mine just arrived today and am looking forward to tinkering with it. $20 for 3g is really quite reasonable.

I'm not going to be replacing my CLU but the Xigmatek paste I've been using between IHS and heatsinks. If it works as well as its thermal conductance rating would suggest, then it will easily become my new go to for GPU TIM upgrades and for use with copper waterblocks.


----------



## Valgaur

well peeps, it's finally happened!

1,000,000 views!

This couldn't have happened without you fellow crazy people to take a chance and whack your cpu for better temps!

Can't believe it has turned into this big of a thing!









-Val


----------



## v1ral

Quick question!!
In the phote does my temps warrant a delid or am i just at the mercy of the lottery.



Settings:
x47 1.225 VID
x40 1.2 *I'm trying to lower this with more testing*
vCCIN 1.85
9-9-9-24 2T XMP
Vdroop 100%
Power saving disable for testing.
These settings are just to get vcore down while I work on the other stuff.

I just ordered a tube of kryonaut and I'll be using that initially if/when I delid.
Thoughts?


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Quick question!!
> In the phote does my temps warrant a delid or am i just at the mercy of the lottery.
> 
> 
> 
> Settings:
> x47 1.225 VID
> x40 1.2 *I'm trying to lower this with more testing*
> vCCIN 1.85
> 9-9-9-24 2T XMP
> Vdroop 100%
> Power saving disable for testing.
> These settings are just to get vcore down while I work on the other stuff.
> 
> I just ordered a tube of kryonaut and I'll be using that initially if/when I delid.
> Thoughts?


Thats a pretty good chip. I need 1.3+ volts to even get 4.5, which is where I run it at. (Well when my motherboard is back from RMA). 80c is a little warn under load but stress testing is usually ~20C hotter than gaming or workloads in my experience. A delid would help you get into the 70s under stress test which would be awesome for your speed but you can leave it where it is. Unless you're pushing for a clock and temperature is limiting you it won't get you more speed. Running cooler is always good though!


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Quick question!!
> In the phote does my temps warrant a delid or am i just at the mercy of the lottery.
> 
> 
> 
> Settings:
> x47 1.225 VID
> x40 1.2 *I'm trying to lower this with more testing*
> vCCIN 1.85
> 9-9-9-24 2T XMP
> Vdroop 100%
> Power saving disable for testing.
> These settings are just to get vcore down while I work on the other stuff.
> 
> I just ordered a tube of kryonaut and I'll be using that initially if/when I delid.
> Thoughts?


8c difference between cores is pretty high. It's likely you could get them all down to what the lowest core now is.

What stress test are you using? 87c is pretty hot but it looks like you have a lot of voltage headroom still...if you can get temps down. Are you sure the H220X is mounted well?


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> 8c difference between cores is pretty high. It's likely you could get them all down to what the lowest core now is.
> 
> What stress test are you using? 87c is pretty hot but it looks like you have a lot of voltage headroom still...if you can get temps down. Are you sure the H220X is mounted well?


Even after delid I have one core that runs hotter than the others and one that runs cooler, each by about 5C. So while its not guarented that will help ususually it does. Even if it doesnt even out temps will drop anyway.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Quick question!!
> In the phote does my temps warrant a delid or am i just at the mercy of the lottery.
> 
> 
> 
> Settings:
> x47 1.225 VID
> x40 1.2 *I'm trying to lower this with more testing*
> vCCIN 1.85
> 9-9-9-24 2T XMP
> Vdroop 100%
> Power saving disable for testing.
> These settings are just to get vcore down while I work on the other stuff.
> 
> I just ordered a tube of kryonaut and I'll be using that initially if/when I delid.
> Thoughts?


delid it, those temps could be astounding once it is.

Why does everyone but me get good chips >.>


----------



## bonami2

I need 1.3v ( 1.32v ) for that clock ahah


----------



## SylentVyper

Took the plunge and delidded my 4690k, temp drops are amazing. Running at 4.8GHz with 1.275v would see temps in the mid 70s, now that I'm delidded with CLP with Noctua paste between the IHS and HSF, same test and ambient sees my hottest core hit 60, with the others in the mid 50s. Wow.

Can OC stable to 5.0 at 1.46v, with temps hitting 82 at the hottest, but not going to stay there 24/7. But the fact I can keep 1.46v cool(ish) on air is amazing. I will be delidding everything! Lol


----------



## DR4G00N

Any of you guys delid a first gen i7 / 32nm Xeon?

This is after just 30 secs of prime 95 on my moderately oc'ed X5670,
(The difference between core 0 & core 4 is a whopping 24c!)


I suspect a poor solder application so I want to pull it apart and put some CLU on it instead, or at the very least reflow the solder. The IHS has already been lapped (which dropped temps by 10c across the board) and I've remounted the waterblock twice but core 0 still gets stupidly hot.

If you have any tips or can link to a tutorial you have my thanks.









Note: I don't really care too much about the chip, of course I'd like it to work afterward and if it doesn't I wouldn't be too surprised (I'll just buy another one







).


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Any of you guys delid a first gen i7 / 32nm Xeon?
> 
> This is after just 30 secs of prime 95 on my moderately oc'ed X5670,
> (The difference between core 0 & core 4 is a whopping 24c!)
> 
> 
> I suspect a poor solder application so I want to pull it apart and put some CLU on it instead, or at the very least reflow the solder. The IHS has already been lapped (which dropped temps by 10c across the board) and I've remounted the waterblock twice but core 0 still gets stupidly hot.
> 
> If you have any tips or can link to a tutorial you have my thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Note: I don't really care too much about the chip, of course I'd like it to work afterward and if it doesn't I wouldn't be too surprised (I'll just buy another one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ).


Not saying it cannot be done as I Have been proven wrong. However, I would not attempt to delid a working soldered cpu.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> Not saying it cannot be done as I Have been proven wrong. However, I would not attempt to delid a working soldered cpu.


I wouldn't normally consider it either but as it stands it's almost useless to me as it is now.

With my H110 it hit's 66c max at stock 3.2GHz 1.225v. If I used an air cooler (Ex. Hyper 212) it would probably hit the mid 80's under load which is too hot IMO.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> I wouldn't normally consider it either but as it stands it's almost useless to me as it is now.
> 
> With my H110 it hit's 66c max at stock 3.2GHz 1.225v. If I used an air cooler (Ex. Hyper 212) it would probably hit the mid 80's under load which is too hot IMO.


I see. Good luck then.







Try to find some non working cpus from the same architecture to practice on.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I see. Good luck then.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Try to find some non working cpus from the same architecture to practice on.


Wouldn't it be better to practice on working chips as you can see weather it surived or not?
Regardless, working L5520's are a dime a dozen so I'll buy a few of them.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Wouldn't it be better to practice on working chips as you can see weather it surived or not?
> Regardless, working L5520's are a dime a dozen so I'll buy a few of them.


if you can find em cheap sure. you can tell if the die is whole or it came apart when you separate. even a broke one would show you that much.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

I'm not 100% but i feel that some cores on server chips are built to be able to handle a specific load better than other cores. Ie they may not be created equal. Therefore they may output different levels of heat due to varying power dist. That said I wouldn't delis a soldered CPU. You're asking for trouble.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I'm not 100% but i feel that some cores on server chips are built to be able to handle a specific load better than other cores. Ie they may not be created equal. Therefore they may output different levels of heat due to varying power dist. That said I wouldn't delis a soldered CPU. You're asking for trouble.


Im 100% sure that Intel Xeon are the same crap than normal cpu

lga 775 and other socket after and even current 1150 xeon are exactly the same processor with just some feature enabled.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Im 100% sure that Intel Xeon are the same crap than normal cpu
> 
> lga 775 and other socket after and even current 1150 xeon are exactly the same processor with just some feature enabled.


Yea perhaps but I would look at core power variances before deluding. Just to make sure. Xeon is a server grade CPU so it might handle load differently amongst its cores via power balancing schemes and different frequencies amongst its cores. That would result in temp variances. I find it had to see any other reason why the temps would be so different but that might just be me. I would look into it.


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea perhaps but I would look at core power variances before deluding. Just to make sure. Xeon is a server grade CPU so it might handle load differently amongst its cores via power balancing schemes and different frequencies amongst its cores. That would result in temp variances. I find it had to see any other reason why the temps would be so different but that might just be me. I would look into it.


The Xeons don't behave any differently than normal CPUs in terms of power balancing etc. Full load is full load. The only thing I could think of that would cause what you are seeing there is, as you have suspected, poor solder spread on the core. I actually have one of those 1366 6 core Xeons myself and, running under an old Swiftech block, with core voltage at 1.55v and some other voltages way higher than they should be, at load I see a very even spread of temperatures and, believe it or not, nothing over 75c. Xeon chips are not BUILT any differently to desktop chips. They come from the exact same wafers, but they are binned better, which meant lower voltage, lower temps and lower power. There is no special power balancing or frequency variations, they have the same turbo stuff and power saving states that any desktop CPU would have.

The only things that Xeons do that desktop CPUs don't is to do with some virtualisation and other features and, of course, the ability to go multi-socket. None of this will change how the chip behaves temperature wise under a 100% artificial load when it comes to core to core temperature variations. The only thing that will do that is poor thermal contact in the system.

What I would suggest is, instead of delidding it, try and reflow the solder without dissasembly. Place it upside down, nice and level, and apply a blowtorch or lighter or something to the IHS. It may be possible to delid without destroying it, but I suspect that it would likely die. Might as well try something with a lower chance of destruction, especially since you need to apply heat to delid a soldered chip anyway.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> The Xeons don't behave any differently than normal CPUs in terms of power balancing etc. Full load is full load. The only thing I could think of that would cause what you are seeing there is, as you have suspected, poor solder spread on the core. I actually have one of those 1366 6 core Xeons myself and, running under an old Swiftech block, with core voltage at 1.55v and some other voltages way higher than they should be, at load I see a very even spread of temperatures and, believe it or not, nothing over 75c. Xeon chips are not BUILT any differently to desktop chips. They come from the exact same wafers, but they are binned better, which meant lower voltage, lower temps and lower power. There is no special power balancing or frequency variations, they have the same turbo stuff and power saving states that any desktop CPU would have.
> 
> The only things that Xeons do that desktop CPUs don't is to do with some virtualisation and other features and, of course, the ability to go multi-socket. None of this will change how the chip behaves temperature wise under a 100% artificial load when it comes to core to core temperature variations. The only thing that will do that is poor thermal contact in the system.
> 
> What I would suggest is, instead of delidding it, try and reflow the solder without dissasembly. Place it upside down, nice and level, and apply a blowtorch or lighter or something to the IHS. It may be possible to delid without destroying it, but I suspect that it would likely die. Might as well try something with a lower chance of destruction, especially since you need to apply heat to delid a soldered chip anyway.


Yeah, reflowing is what I was thinking of trying first. Temps are most definitely not right, my x5650 for comparison only has a 3c difference between the hottest and coolest cores.
By upside down do you mean having the IHS facing up or down?


----------



## jdorje

Would it be possible to solder an already delidded (ivy/haswell/skylake) chip back together? Any advantage over just using liquid metal? There must be, right...soldered chips like haswell e cool better than delidded chips...how can that be copied?


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Would it be possible to solder an already delidded (ivy/haswell/skylake) chip back together? Any advantage over just using liquid metal? There must be, right...soldered chips like haswell e cool better than delidded chips...how can that be copied?


This sounds like a disaster in the making to me. Just don't do it.







Liquid metal works great.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

http://forum.hwbot.org/showthread.php?t=145035
didn't work out too well

Still revising method though I believe.


----------



## incog

Just for the sake of arguing, couldn't you take the IHS and place it on top of a very hot surface and lay your nickel solder on the inside? Then the heat from the hot surface would melt the nickel and you would place the PCB back onto the heated IHS while the soldering metal is still hot?

Doesn't seem overly complicated.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Doesn't seem overly complicated.


Famous last words.

I'll step down from the soap box now.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Just for the sake of arguing, couldn't you take the IHS and place it on top of a very hot surface and lay your nickel solder on the inside? Then the heat from the hot surface would melt the nickel and you would place the PCB back onto the heated IHS while the soldering metal is still hot?
> 
> Doesn't seem overly complicated.


well if you can place the cpu perfectly centered to fit in the socket


----------



## jdorje

Hm I had assumed soldering would risk destroying the CPU with heat. But in the link he soldered at "well above" 157C. Not sure how he soldered...sounds like heat through the IHS onto the IHS-die soldering material? But in fact he had no problem with the chip and temps at all...it just didn't cool very well.

With DC you'd have a big risk of shorting out the VRM caps. And you probably couldn't thwart this by insulating them unless you were sure your insulator wouldn't melt.

Could you pull the solder material out of old soldered CPUs and reuse that?


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Yeah and like he said, he may have very well not used enough solder so he didnt exactly fail but it wasnt quite right. So it very well might work with more solder


----------



## jdorje

Well it seems like there are a lot of ways to screw it up.

Getting too much solder...Probably the biggest risk. It could flow all out over the pcb which would be pretty terrible for heating, and would surely destroy haswell by shorting the fivr caps.

Getting too little solder...given how little lm is needed this should not be much danger.

Not heating it up enough...could lead to some portions just having the unmelted solder material sitting there.

Heating it too much...could destroy the cpu?

Picking the wrong solder...seems like a near certainty. Most solder materials aren't designed to be extremely heat conductive.


----------



## DR4G00N

Alright folks! As per classic OCN style I said "Screw it, if I'm gonna' do it I'm going all the way!"







.

And well... Success!!











I cut all the silicone around the perimeter, wedged a razor blade between the IHS and PCB on all sides. Took the blowtorch (very low flame) and put it to the IHS, 10 seconds later it just fell right off.









The PCB has a few nicks from when I was removing the silicone but they're just superficial.

Total time 20 mins. 5 min to set up and delid and 15 mins to remove the solder









Now I just need to wait until my CLU and MX-4 get here...


----------



## agung79

Replace pk3 with clu


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Just for the sake of arguing, couldn't you take the IHS and place it on top of a very hot surface and lay your nickel solder on the inside? Then the heat from the hot surface would melt the nickel and you would place the PCB back onto the heated IHS while the soldering metal is still hot?
> 
> Doesn't seem overly complicated.


the temps for solder can easily kill silicon, it's a crazy risk, not even close to worth the benefits of actual solder


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Alright folks! As per classic OCN style I said "Screw it, if I'm gonna' do it I'm going all the way!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> And well... Success!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cut all the silicone around the perimeter, wedged a razor blade between the IHS and PCB on all sides. Took the blowtorch (very low flame) and put it to the IHS, 10 seconds later it just fell right off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The PCB has a few nicks from when I was removing the silicone but they're just superficial.
> 
> Total time 20 mins. 5 min to set up and delid and 15 mins to remove the solder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I just need to wait until my CLU and MX-4 get here...


Looks like it worked out well, and cleaner-looking than I was expecting. Though at this point, why not just go with running it bare-die? That way, you don't even need to bother with the IHS or re-soldering....


----------



## svipul

Is it okay to use clear base coat to cover the caps on the pcb? I don't have nail polish itself handy. Just want to make sure before I put it on.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Looks like it worked out well, and cleaner-looking than I was expecting. Though at this point, why not just go with running it bare-die? That way, you don't even need to bother with the IHS or re-soldering....


I thought of that too, but I figured it would be too much work to redesign my H110's mounting mechanism to compensate for the lack of a IHS for just a few degree drop.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> I thought of that too, but I figured it would be too much work to redesign my H110's mounting mechanism to compensate for the lack of a IHS for just a few degree drop.


Shouldn't be too difficult, but I do get what you're saying. It'd be more work than just connecting the AIO kit. But it's probably a lot less work than trying to re-solder the IHS on.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Shouldn't be too difficult, but I do get what you're saying. It'd be more work than just connecting the AIO kit. *But it's probably a lot less work than trying to re-solder the IHS on.*


But that's what CLU is for.









Regardless the H110 does a good enough job even with the IHS still on the proc.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> But that's what CLU is for.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Regardless the H110 does a good enough job even with the IHS still on the proc.


True, I use CLP myself, but they get basically the same results.


----------



## paskowitz

Does anyone know where to get the glue used (or equivalent) to attached the IHS to the silicon? I have already gone through the delid process. Is there an off the shelf glue and adhesive that would work as a substitute?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Does anyone know where to get the glue used (or equivalent) to attached the IHS to the silicon? I have already gone through the delid process. Is there an off the shelf glue and adhesive that would work as a substitute?


There's no need to re-glue the IHS back on, removing the glue is actually a major reason for delidding - to reduce the gap between the IHS and the die.


----------



## paskowitz

Any risk of the IHS scratching or cracking the die as a result of the smaller distance?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Any risk of the IHS scratching or cracking the die as a result of the smaller distance?


No, there's still enough space in there, it's just _too much_ space with the glue there. It adds an unnecessary amount of extra space, which just gets filled in with a little extra TIM. So reducing that gap, means that you're closer to a surface-to-surface contact than you would be with the glue there.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> the temps for solder can easily kill silicon, it's a crazy risk, not even close to worth the benefits of actual solder


Exactly why I said earlier:

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> This sounds like a disaster in the making to me. Just don't do it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Liquid metal works great.


----------



## paskowitz

That feeling when you thought you killed your CPU by deliding and then realized it was just your motherboard...


----------



## incog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *incog*
> 
> Just for the sake of arguing, couldn't you take the IHS and place it on top of a very hot surface and lay your nickel solder on the inside? Then the heat from the hot surface would melt the nickel and you would place the PCB back onto the heated IHS while the soldering metal is still hot?
> 
> Doesn't seem overly complicated.
> 
> 
> 
> the temps for solder can easily kill silicon, it's a crazy risk, not even close to worth the benefits of actual solder
Click to expand...

Well I say solder but i'm saying it offhand without knowing what the technically best choice is.

What does Intel use with soldered CPUs? There's bound to be some sort of solder (could even be lead? nah..) that melts at a very low temperature; enough to not damage silicon. Not 100% sure yet but It's fun to think about.

I wouldn't try this with an i5 but for example maybe the theory for me is just too appealing.


----------



## cutty1998

Has anyone used this method on an Ivy Bridge CPU ? Never seen it done this way. Safe? Looks safer than hammer to me.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cutty1998*
> 
> Has anyone used this method on an Ivy Bridge CPU ? Never seen it done this way. Safe? Looks safer than hammer to me.


Yes, this method is common for Ivy, Haswell and DC.

I used this vise: http://www.homedepot.com/p/BESSEY-4-in-Drill-Press-Vise-BV-DP40/205023096

When I was done, I returned it.







Next build will be Skylake-E which should be a soldered proc.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cutty1998*
> 
> Has anyone used this method on an Ivy Bridge CPU ? Never seen it done this way. Safe? Looks safer than hammer to me.


that is the way to go if you ask me, its what I did for my 4790k and its super easy!


----------



## cutty1998

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> that is the way to go if you ask me, its what I did for my 4790k and its super easy!


Ok ,cool . Thanks! I couldn't find a suitable vice at Home Depot for less than like $50,but I just located one at Lowes for $19.99 am picking up this afternoon. All of the cheap ones at Home depot had gnarly teeth ,and that scared me. If I mess this CPU up ,I will not be able to buy a new GTX980Ti for my Son for his Birthday in 2 weeks. I will have to use the money for a 6700K, and a Z170 Sabertooth board.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cutty1998*
> 
> Ok ,cool . Thanks! I couldn't find a suitable vice at Home Depot for less than like $50,but I just located one at Lowes for $19.99 am picking up this afternoon. All of the cheap ones at Home depot had gnarly teeth ,and that scared me. If I mess this CPU up ,I will not be able to buy a new GTX980Ti for my Son for his Birthday in 2 weeks. I will have to use the money for a 6700K, and a Z170 Sabertooth board.


http://www.lowes.com/pd_552529-281-226340___?productId=50168511&pl=1&Ntt=vice is what I used. I used several layers of duct tape on both sets of teeth to keep things from sliding and getting chewed up. It didn't take much pressure for me at all, I tightened til it got firm and then rotated the cpu in the vice 90 degrees. I probably did this 5 times and then it was free


----------



## cutty1998

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> http://www.lowes.com/pd_552529-281-226340___?productId=50168511&pl=1&Ntt=vice is what I used. I used several layers of duct tape on both sets of teeth to keep things from sliding and getting chewed up. It didn't take much pressure for me at all, I tightened til it got firm and then rotated the cpu in the vice 90 degrees. I probably did this 5 times and then it was free


Yes the tape thing did cross my mind,that makes sense to tape the metal of the vice.When you say you rotated the cpu in the vice 90* each time, you mean there is no set direction to vice it? I was still going to try to get 100% positive instructions as to which way to place the chip in the vice. In my case a 3770K.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cutty1998*
> 
> Yes the tape thing did cross my mind,that makes sense to tape the metal of the vice.When you say you rotated the cpu in the vice 90* each time, you mean there is no set direction to vice it? I was still going to try to get 100% positive instructions as to which way to place the chip in the vice. In my case a 3770K.


since my 4790k has the regulators on it i made sure that side was on the side i pushed the ihs towards. I felt if it was the other way the ihs may hit them when it slides. I've only delidded a few times but haven't had any failure yet. Haven't done any ivy's yet


----------



## v1ral

I just received my Kryonaut temps have dropped from 87 to 76 max *no delid yet*, this is at x47 1.217 VID. Should I go ahead and Delid ?
I will use the Kryonaut on DIE for the time being if anything.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> I just received my Kryonaut temps have dropped from 87 to 76 max *no delid yet*, this is at x47 1.217 VID. Should I go ahead and Delid ?
> I will use the Kryonaut on DIE for the time being if anything.


imo if you gained 9c from tim you likley had a seating issue or the first tim wasn't applied correctly.

76c temps would definitely benifit from delid.


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> imo if you gained 9c from tim you likley had a seating issue or the first tim wasn't applied correctly.


This is what I was thinking all applications was a pea dot size blob method, the stock h220x paste was more thin/watery than Kryonaut. Used the applicator to spread the Kryonaut feels like I used more than a pea size blob, but it was the only way to have it spread.

Delid or not to Delid?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> This is what I was thinking all applications was a pea dot size blob method, the stock h220x paste was more thin/watery than Kryonaut. Used the applicator to spread the Kryonaut feels like I used more than a pea size blob, but it was the only way to have it spread.
> 
> *Delid or not to Delid?*


76c max temps I would delid.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> 76c max temps I would delid.


Max temps with what? Gaming, AIDA64, Prime95, x264 ?


----------



## bonami2

Most custom laptop seller put ic diamond on die just saying


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Most custom laptop seller put ic diamond on die just saying


That TIM is no longer viable IMHO. Much better stuff is available now.


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Max temps with what? Gaming, AIDA64, Prime95, x264 ?


X
X264 20 runs


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> That TIM is no longer viable IMHO. Much better stuff is available now.


Yea i agree with you that why i have clu. Just need the courage to delid ahah







After my coffee gonna see the cooling if i can improve it before delid and test temp


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Just need the courage to delid ahah
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After my coffee gonna see the cooling if i can improve it before delid and test temp


The vise-only method really is quite easy. I had the lid off my DC in just a few minutes.







Cleaning off the black adhesive took a while.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Max temps with what? Gaming, AIDA64, Prime95, x264 ?


if it reaches 76c during x264 stress thats a bit high imo. I always try for 65c. That way I have a few degrees incase ambient is a little higher.

80c is fine in synthetic stress tests but x264 is an actual real world encoder. Those temps represent actual use type temps.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> The vise-only method really is quite easy. I had the lid off my DC in just a few minutes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cleaning off the black adhesive took a while.


Yea but with my current Test i did with a old laptop gpu die shooting with a air carbine into it and not cracking the die. And smashing my pentium m 730 cpu with a woodblock and not causing any damage to the pcb it seem they are stronger than we think.

But yea im gonna try hammer and if it aint working i will do the vice only.









On my second coffee now ahah


----------



## MiserJJ

I've been reading and planning on delidding my CPU but wanted to experiment with an old CPU first. Tried some radical stuff that didn't work (ignore pre-existing damage) but then I went with a machinist version of the standard vise/hammer/wood block method.

Started by clamping the CPU in the vise of a vertical mill:



Chucked up a hole cutter without the hole cutting parts. This is basically a round shaft with a flat surface on one side. Nothing special about it but makes a handy way of converting the round spindle to a flat surface for pushing on the lid. Sorry for bad lighting. Staple included for size comparison 



Adjusted the height and centering to hit the lid and started cranking the cross feed:



That lid was really on there. It gave a solid thump when it broke loose. But very little movement of the lid. In fact, it was still attached and had to be pulled off the rest of the way by hand:



This felt a little safer than the wood block and hammer method because it uses only the minimum required force to break the lid loose, uses less shock (less chance of cracks), and reduces the chances of parts becoming projectiles. Probably similar to the vise only method, but with less bending forces on the CPU board.


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> 76c max temps I would delid.


So with these temps I should definately Delid then?
What is a rough estimate temps drop I might get?


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> So with these temps I should definately Delid then?
> What is a rough estimate temps drop I might get?


if you use clp on the die and gelid extreme or beter on the ihs you can expect a full 10c drop.

My 4790k went from 75c max to 65c max at 4.8ghz 1.26v.


----------



## bonami2

Well gonna order a vice...

Mine is too big tried with woodblock but they are too big.. Tried with tape but the chip was sliding.. Uh









Anyone in canada near laval that have a vice?


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> So with these temps I should definately Delid then?


If u are happy with the speed at 76 celsius then there is no need to delid. Since that temperature is still 24 degree away from throttling and perfectly fine for x264 load test.

Only if u want to go higher in speed (and voltage ofc) or u want a quieter CPU fan then I would delid.

Above 1.3v it's almost a must to delid in my experience. By delidding I was able to raise maximum voltage from about 1.3v to 1.45v with my AIO with temperatures < 90. Temperatures improved by about 30 degrees at the peek. Before the CPU was hitting 100C and started to throttle and afterwards it stayed in the 70-80 range, lol.


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> If u are happy with the speed at 76 celsius then there is no need to delid. Since that temperature is still 24 degree away from throttling and perfectly fine for x264 load test.
> 
> Only if u want to go higher in speed (and voltage ofc) or u want a quieter CPU fan then I would delid.
> 
> Above 1.3v it's almost a must to delid in my experience. By delidding I was able to raise maximum voltage from about 1.3v to 1.45v with my AIO with temperatures < 90. Temperatures improved by about 30 degrees at the peek. Before the CPU was hitting 100C and started to throttle and afterwards it stayed in the 70-80 range, lol.


So my temps look decent then?

When I try for x48 I was thinking that it's impossible, I'm delidding in hopes of getting a few more multi's and maybe lower temps.*still think for x48 something is off in my settings*


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> So my temps look decent then?
> 
> When I try for x48 I was thinking that it's impossible, I'm delidding in hopes of getting a few more multi's and maybe lower temps.*still think for x48 something is off in my settings*


Your temps are normal for that voltage. Wirerat said he likes to run his CPU @ 65C. But that's simply personal choice. There is no indication that the CPU will last longer if it gets only 65C instead of 75C hot. Since I never had a single CPU fail on me in 20 years I tend to let CPUs run hotter but with lower fan speed, so it's quieter. But again, that's personal preference.

Did u try sth like 1.28v and 1.85VCIN for x48? If that works you can try lower voltages. If it doesn't, try 1.3v+1.9v VCIN max. If temparatures get close to 90C then u probably want to delid. But the question is always whether u actually need x48 or x49 instead of x47


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> Your temps are normal for that voltage. Wirerat said he likes to run his CPU @ 65C. But that's simply personal choice. There is no indication that the CPU will last longer if it gets only 65C instead of 75C hot. Since I never had a single CPU fail on me in 20 years I tend to let CPUs run hotter but with lower fan speed, so it's quieter. But again, that's personal preference.
> 
> Did u try sth like 1.28v and 1.85VCIN for x48? If that works you can try lower voltages. If it doesn't, try 1.3v+1.9v VCIN max. If temparatures get close to 90C then u probably want to delid. But the question is always whether u actually need x48 or x49 instead of x47


My temps for x47 are 76℃, what I want are the next few multis's.
I've tried 1.285 and VCCIN 1.85 I BSOD after the 4th pass of x264 nD temps is 82.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> Your temps are normal for that voltage. Wirerat said he likes to run his CPU @ 65C. But that's simply personal choice. There is no indication that the CPU will last longer if it gets only 65C instead of 75C hot. Since I never had a single CPU fail on me in 20 years I tend to let CPUs run hotter but with lower fan speed, so it's quieter. But again, that's personal preference.
> 
> Did u try sth like 1.28v and 1.85VCIN for x48? If that works you can try lower voltages. If it doesn't, try 1.3v+1.9v VCIN max. If temparatures get close to 90C then u probably want to delid. But the question is always whether u actually need x48 or x49 instead of x47


Voltage and temp are linked.

Higher temp = Higher current = Lower lifespan.

It proved that a cpu comsumption drop the cooler it run at the same clock. = Better stability


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Higher temp = Higher current = Lower lifespan.
> It proved that a cpu comsumption drop the cooler it run at the same clock. = Better stability


Both true.

But if lower lifespan means 10 instead of 12 years for example, then it's probably not relevant for most users. I rather have less noise a couple of years rather than an extended theoretical (because I will stop using that CPU before it quits anyway) lifetime.

And yes, if u come close to the maximum frequency of what the CPU can achieve, then every bits like lower temperature helps to keep it stable. That's why for benchmarking at maximum frequency even I might turn the fans to 100%







. But if u lower the frequency one notch (100 Mhz) then u are usually already out of the area where the temperature impacts stability a lot.

If u want to run your CPU very close to it's maximum speed for most of the time, then yes, you should keep temperatures as low as possible and you will want to delid it


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> Both true.
> 
> But if lower lifespan means 10 instead of 12 years for example, then it's probably not relevant for most users. I rather have less noise a couple of years rather than an extended theoretical (because I will stop using that CPU before it quits anyway) lifetime.
> 
> And yes, if u come close to the maximum frequency of what the CPU can achieve, then every bits like lower temperature helps to keep it stable. That's why for benchmarking at maximum frequency even I might turn the fans to 100%
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . But if u lower the frequency one notch (100 Mhz) then u are usually already out of the area where the temperature impacts stability a lot.
> 
> If u want to run your CPU very close to it's maximum speed for most of the time, then yes, you should keep temperatures as low as possible and you will want to delid it


I already delidded
Vise only method using Kryonaut I'm testing for temps as of now.. Temps are really close to each other.. 62-67 as the last time I checked for x47.settings.

Update:
Max temps 75℃... Delid didn't work? Maybe because of the Kryonaut?


----------



## blaze2210

What are you running to get those temps? Not all tests generate the same levels of heat. So 75*C in one test could be good, while 75*C in another could be totally horrible.


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> What are you running to get those temps? Not all tests generate the same levels of heat. So 75*C in one test could be good, while 75*C in another could be totally horrible.


Sorry, this was with x264 v2.06 20 runs aircon was off most of the day...outside was 85℉....


----------



## WheelZ0713

Alright, so i'm purchasing a EK predator 360 and have decided it's about time i sack up and Delid my 4770K.

Overall the process seems pretty straight forward, although i have some questions:

- Once delidded what's the best surface to sit the chip on while cleaning of the glue and old TIM? It looks like a fair bit of pressure is needed and i wouldnt want to damage the undersside for obvisous reasons.

- In terms of cleaning up the PCB and TIM will i need anything other than the arcticlean pair?

- What is the best stuff to use to cover the pins next to the die and to reattach the IHS?

Please and Thank you!


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> Alright, so i'm purchasing a EK predator 360 and have decided it's about time i sack up and Delid my 4770K.
> 
> Overall the process seems pretty straight forward, although i have some questions:
> 
> - Once delidded what's the best surface to sit the chip on while cleaning of the glue and old TIM? It looks like a fair bit of pressure is needed and i wouldnt want to damage the undersside for obvisous reasons.
> 
> - In terms of cleaning up the PCB and TIM will i need anything other than the arcticlean pair?
> 
> - What is the best stuff to use to cover the pins next to the die and to reattach the IHS?
> 
> Please and Thank you!


- I just held my 4670k in my hand when removing the glue, it doesn't require all that much pressure, and you can use the edge of a credit card for this. Or you could always use the little plastic CPU holder that new CPUs come in to hold it while you scrape the glue off. The old TIM will come off perfectly fine with 91% Isopropyl Alcohol.

- Arcticlean should work fine, though I've never used it myself - 91% Alcohol is cheaper. I use 91% for anything I need to clean on a PCB.

- The most popular ones seem to be clear nail polish, or liquid electrical tape for protecting the components next to the die. There is no need to re-attach the IHS to the PCB, just follow the tips in the first post for re-installing the CPU in the socket and you'll be good-to-go.


----------



## WheelZ0713

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> - I just held my 4670k in my hand when removing the glue, it doesn't require all that much pressure, and you can use the edge of a credit card for this. Or you could always use the little plastic CPU holder that new CPUs come in to hold it while you scrape the glue off. The old TIM will come off perfectly fine with 91% Isopropyl Alcohol.
> 
> - Arcticlean should work fine, though I've never used it myself - 91% Alcohol is cheaper. I use 91% for anything I need to clean on a PCB.
> 
> - The most popular ones seem to be clear nail polish, or liquid electrical tape for protecting the components next to the die. There is no need to re-attach the IHS to the PCB, just follow the tips in the first post for re-installing the CPU in the socket and you'll be good-to-go.


Awesome. Thanks for that.

Given that i will be putting an EK block on it and it's the first time i have used one, i was thinking that reattaching the IHS might not be a terrible idea.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> Awesome. Thanks for that.
> 
> Given that i will be putting an EK block on it and it's the first time i have used one, i was thinking that reattaching the IHS might not be a terrible idea.


Yep, no worries! Once you lock that lid down in the socket, the IHS will not move. There's no need to re-glue the IHS.


----------



## bonami2

Just delided with the hammer. Was pretty easy 3-4 hit

Now im waiting 2 hour for the electric tape to dry and i plug my psu and press power.... Will see how it go.


----------



## bonami2

4.0 ghz 1volt drop of 10celsius under cinebench r15









Gonna try my clock next days of 4.7 and report back


----------



## bonami2

25c drop

4.7 1.3v 1.312v Load H75 cooling as intake on top in a 750D case.

Case was prewarmed with both gpu at full load and cpu at 50-70%

Normally Cinebench would hit 95-100c While before it would have being 80-85c when the cpu was new.

Now with clu on die 73-75c average. 929 score


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Update: Max temps 75℃... Delid didn't work? Maybe because of the Kryonaut?


Delid should still work because most of the gain comes from reducing the gap between die and IHS. Maybe too much paste on the die?

Also, do u have the same fan speed as before? If u have fan control enabled maybe they spin slower now?


----------



## DirektEffekt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> Delid should still work because most of the gain comes from reducing the gap between die and IHS. Maybe too much paste on the die?
> 
> Also, do u have the same fan speed as before? If u have fan control enabled maybe they spin slower now?


It could be the Kryonaut. It's basically impossible to have too much paste on the die, since it is all pressed out the sides when the clamp is applied. There have been examples of some CPUs which have had better thermal applications stock than others, so it could just be that the CPU was lucky with that to begin with and, if you want to get better, you will have to go for liquid metal TIMs. I have used conventional TIMs before under a delid, and they just don't stack up. Honestly, unless you are going to go for liquid metal, it is almost not worth delidding.


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DirektEffekt*
> 
> It could be the Kryonaut.


Not sure. I haven't seen a single report where temperatures didn't improve even when using 'just' conventional TIM under the IHS. Liquid metal is definitely better than Kryonaut, but Kryonaut is still the best conventional paste.

So everything else being the same (voltage, speed, air temps, load, fan speed, ...), delidding and proper application of Kryonaut should give at least 5-10C improvement for that speed + voltage, i think.


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> Not sure. I haven't seen a single report where temperatures didn't improve even when using 'just' conventional TIM under the IHS. Liquid metal is definitely better than Kryonaut, but Kryonaut is still the best conventional paste.
> 
> So everything else being the same (voltage, speed, air temps, load, fan speed, ...), delidding and proper application of Kryonaut should give at least 5-10C improvement for that speed + voltage, i think.


With that said, Kryonaut did lower temps a bit 5-8 degrees, but again margin of error kicks in with applications.

I am testing on x48 multi and max temps are 82℃ on the highest, so Delid did improve temps a considerable amount, I would reach 90+.

I am gonna reapply the Kryonaut and order up some Coolabs, which has got me wondering, is CLU that better than CLP?


----------



## MiserJJ

I will be using Kryonaut soon, after my new power supply shows up. But I planned to go direct to die. I figure I would try it and if it wasn't good enough I would go with the PITA liquid metal.

Every time I've read of no thermal gains the person has taken things apart and reapplied the TIM and gotten good results. Sometimes the TIM didn't have good coverage and sometimes they have found that the IHS was sitting on leftover adhesive. Also check flatness of the heatsink surface. Mine was horribly convex and required a lot of sanding.

Remember that all thermal pastes are actually insulators... just not as good an insulator as air. The best thermal paste is really just the worst insulator. So the thinner the layer the better, but if it's not complete coverage and there is air (usually at corners), it will be far worse. My method is to make it square so it will squeeze out to the corners and I use a little more thermal paste than usually recommended. A thin paste won't matter because it will squeeze out until it is very thin but if the paste is thick it may not thin out properly. This can be overcome by pressing the heat sink down and moving is back and forth slightly to press out any excess, but risks creating air gaps. I haven't worked with the Kryonaut yet to see how thick it is, but it looks thick in the instructions and says to actually spread out a thin layer over the entire surface, like you would do with liquid metal, so application method could be a factor.


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> is CLU that better than CLP?


I think the primary difference is that it is easier to work with but supposedly the additive to make it more user friendly makes it more susceptible to drying out. CLU at least was much easier to work with than I feared. Small quantities of it are in no danger to 'just flow away'. A thin layer sticks very well to the die surface. So I didn't cover the transistors with anything.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiserJJ*
> 
> I haven't worked with the Kryonaut yet to see how thick it is, but it looks thick in the instructions


It is quite thick, yes. There comes a small tool with it for spreading it out which worked pretty good for me.


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> Not sure. I haven't seen a single report where temperatures didn't improve even when using 'just' conventional TIM under the IHS. Liquid metal is definitely better than Kryonaut, but Kryonaut is still the best conventional paste.


This is no surprise once you properly remove the adhesive and narrow the gap between the IHS and the die. Just use a good TIM like Kryonaut if at all possible. I used Phobya LM, which is cheaper than CLU and seems to work just as well if not better.


----------



## bonami2

Well my stock intel paste looked like rubber.


----------



## MiserJJ

Woohoo! Officially joined the delidded club!

http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.48.28_zpscf0528tm.jpg.html

I created a custom delidding vise. Yeah, it's over-engineering... but I'm an engineer... it's what I do. No risk of damage from clamping in vise and no projectile CPU.

http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.45.39_zpsiimszrnw.jpg.html

http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.47.36_zpswwzdqfef.jpg.html


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiserJJ*
> 
> Woohoo! Officially joined the delidded club!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.48.28_zpscf0528tm.jpg.html
> 
> 
> I created a custom delidding vise. Yeah, it's over-engineering... but I'm an engineer... it's what I do. No risk of damage from clamping in vise and no projectile CPU.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.45.39_zpsiimszrnw.jpg.html
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.47.36_zpswwzdqfef.jpg.html


That's a pretty nice tool there!


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiserJJ*
> 
> Woohoo! Officially joined the delidded club!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.48.28_zpscf0528tm.jpg.html
> 
> I created a custom delidding vise. Yeah, it's over-engineering... but I'm an engineer... it's what I do. No risk of damage from clamping in vise and no projectile CPU.
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.45.39_zpsiimszrnw.jpg.html
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.47.36_zpswwzdqfef.jpg.html


Nice, I just used the $20 Home Depot drill press vise (and returned it when I was done). I didn't use tape and it didn't leave a mark on the PCB or the IHS. Being gentle is the key.


----------



## bonami2

Hey guy just saying. Intel confirmed that if you delid and overclock like mad after they will still cover it with the tuning plan.

Anyways mine is doing 4.9ghz 1.375v (1.4 load) 1.975 volt input (2.0 load) currently and was even able to boot at 5ghz and run cinebench singlethread. But crashed in the multi one

At about 88-92c under xtu Run gta v for 2 hour now and seem good. Probably crash in p95 i have no idea

Need a better cooler and maybe a repaste put a bit too much i think.








deliding is awesome


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Hey guy just saying. Intel confirmed that if you delid and overclock like mad after they will still cover it with the tuning plan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> deliding is awesome


what is this tuning plan? I Don't think I've heard of it.
Edit: forgot how to Google for a second lol


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> what is this tuning plan? I Don't think I've heard of it.
> Edit: forgot how to Google for a second lol


You pay like 25$ and it give you a free exchange if you kill you cpu. Well like putting 1.6volt throught it and boom


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sheyster*
> 
> Nice, I just used the $20 Home Depot drill press vise (and returned it when I was done). I didn't use tape and it didn't leave a mark on the PCB or the IHS. Being gentle is the key.


I did this as well a few days ago, slapped on some Kryonaut and I was off to the races. Dropped temps a mere 5-7℃, Im hoping It'll drop more when my CLU arrives.

Talking about Kryonaut I am starting to hate the applicator, it's too soft to get an even spread and using it you'd have to use two blobs from it to cover the entire IHS. Am I doing something wrong or what. Stuff works well nonetheless but it's just application isn't as good as just a pea sized method. Heck even trying to spread it with a homemade spatula/applicator wasn't enough to get good spread.
I will reapply when I have time my last ditch efforts before CLU comes, I am not complaining at the results of the Delid, I was just expecting more of a temp drop, considering this was the end all with temps problems
I may grab an EKWB MX and go direct die with the naked mount if CLU doesn't drop temps even more.
*I know my mileage will vary*
But now I guess I'm part of the club, woot!!


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> I did this as well a few days ago, slapped on some Kryonaut and I was off to the races. Dropped temps a mere 5-7℃, Im hoping It'll drop more when my CLU arrives.
> 
> Talking about Kryonaut I am starting to hate the applicator, it's too soft to get an even spread and using it you'd have to use two blobs from it to cover the entire IHS. Am I doing something wrong or what. Stuff works well nonetheless but it's just application isn't as good as just a pea sized method. Heck even trying to spread it with a homemade spatula/applicator wasn't enough to get good spread.
> I will reapply when I have time my last ditch efforts before CLU comes, I am not complaining at the results of the Delid, I was just expecting more of a temp drop, considering this was the end all with temps problems
> I may grab an EKWB MX and go direct die with the naked mount if CLU doesn't drop temps even more.
> *I know my mileage will vary*
> But now I guess I'm part of the club, woot!!


I was not a fan of the applicator either for a while either but as I learned to go slow with it I am now able to get pretty good coatings if I am patient with it and have not been able to beat my temps by blobing it like I normally do. I think the softness makes it a little more forgiving as it does not require a extremely even pressure to get a pretty even coat. I used kryonaut as my die>IHS TIM at first and got about the same ~7°c drop that you did on my 4790k. Phobya LM got me another 5-7°c so a liquid metal paste is definitely worth it! (in the sense that any of this is







)


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I was not a fan of the applicator either for a while either but as I learned to go slow with it I am now able to get pretty good coatings if I am patient with it and have not been able to beat my temps by blobing it like I normally do. I think the softness makes it a little more forgiving as it does not require a extremely even pressure to get a pretty even coat. I used kryonaut as my die>IHS TIM at first and got about the same ~7°c drop that you did on my 4790k. Phobya LM got me another 5-7°c so a liquid metal paste is definitely worth it! (in the sense that any of this is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


This is what I am hoping for as well.
How much did you have to use to coat the IHS?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> This is what I am hoping for as well.
> How much did you have to use to coat the IHS?


I am still using kryo on the IHS since I've heard it does not make as big of a difference and for some reason I'm more afraid of putting LM on my ihs than on my die. but if how much I put on the die is any indication then I would say it would not take much, I was shocked at how little it took to cover the die. I've applied 3 times now and can't tell any difference in the level left in my syringe.
edit: if you were talking about kryo then I felt like it took about the same pea sized blob all spread out


----------



## v1ral

I have a question for the high overclockers..
What would you guys say is the max vcore to push through the chip?
Can I be added to the club.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a question for the high overclockers..
> What would you guys say is the max vcore to push through the chip?
> Can I be added to the club.


I have no idea and looking to know myself. I suspect it depend on usage. Gamer can go high why Encoder and recorder and heavy user lower.

Would says 1.3v is the safest voltage. Im currently at 1.375v


----------



## MiserJJ

Results are in for my i5-4690k:

Stock fan, no overclock (for reference)
90C @ 2 minutes. Stopped test.

Sythe Grand Kama Cross 2 fan with TIM that came with fan.
64C @ 5 minutes.

Overclocked to 4.3Ghz.
94C @ 5 minutes.

Delidded, Direct to Die with Kryonaut, 4.3Ghz overclock.
77C @ 5 minutes.

So we'll call that a 17C temp drop, even though it was a bit warmer in the room during the delidded test.

Overclocked to maximum automatic setting of 4.8Ghz and system was stable. Temps rose quickly during testing so I stopped it. I could probably lower voltages and find a stable maximum but I have no desire to find the exact limits of the system. I think I'll be good with a 4.5Ghz automatic overclock, which hit 84C after 5 minutes.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiserJJ*
> 
> Results are in for my i5-4690k:
> 
> Stock fan, no overclock (for reference)
> 90C @ 2 minutes. Stopped test.
> 
> Sythe Grand Kama Cross 2 fan with TIM that came with fan.
> 64C @ 5 minutes.
> 
> Overclocked to 4.3Ghz.
> 94C @ 5 minutes.
> 
> Delidded, Direct to Die with Kryonaut, 4.3Ghz overclock.
> 77C @ 5 minutes.
> 
> So we'll call that a 17C temp drop, even though it was a bit warmer in the room during the delidded test.
> 
> Overclocked to maximum automatic setting of 4.8Ghz and system was stable. Temps rose quickly during testing so I stopped it. I could probably lower voltages and find a stable maximum but I have no desire to find the exact limits of the system. I think I'll be good with a 4.5Ghz automatic overclock, which hit 84C after 5 minutes.


Thank you for sharing result rep +


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> I have no idea and looking to know myself. I suspect it depend on usage. Gamer can go high why Encoder and recorder and heavy user lower.
> 
> Would says 1.3v is the safest voltage. Im currently at 1.375v


I just passed x48 at 1.305 from 1.310/1.312 VID, I am gonna keep lower it till I fail..


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> I just passed x48 at 1.305 from 1.310/1.312 VID, I am gonna keep lower it till I fail..


Great good luck


----------



## paskowitz

4790K [email protected] mid 60C OCCT all core/64bit. CLU on the die and MX4 on the IHS/AIO (H100i). I haven't tried to go for 5.0 yet, but since I got there before delid on 1.36V, I see no reason why things should be different (just lower temps... 84C is not ok). Cores 3 and 4 are in the low 60's. I also think I applied too much MX4 (or maybe not a good application). When I took the IHS off the Intel TIM was very even and well applied. I guess they got better latter in the production cycle. Overall I am only getting a 10C drop. Not too bad but not great. I'll wait to put CLU on the IHS until I get a custom loop running.


----------



## iludez

Hey guys would you suggest i delid my 4670k?


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iludez*
> 
> Hey guys would you suggest i delid my 4670k?


My experience would have been relatively painless had my motherboard not died the second I started the delid process leading me to believe I killed my CPU through deliding. What is your clock, voltage, temps and cooling solution?


----------



## iludez

Ive had a delidded 4670k from a friend before and it was a great chip.
Im just thinking with this it would be nice if i ever wanted to push hard for 3dmark etc i could
Currently at 4.6ghz at 1.25v 50-60 max aida64 and h100i in pull pull


----------



## bonami2

The problem with the intel paste is it seemed to go worse with time with my 4790k. At the end in no ways i could get it under 95c

With clu now i stay at 90c but with .1v more and 200mhz more


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *iludez*
> 
> Hey guys would you suggest i delid my 4670k?


yes. My emby media server (in sig) is using a delided 4670k with a old thermalright ultra 120 and clu/gelid.

Temps are fantastic at 4.4ghz 1.29v during x264 it peaks at 58c. I run 4.2 at 1.20v 24/7 as that is all my server needs and it never exceeds 54c.

Not having Hyperthreading really lowers the temps. It can easily stay below 80c all the way up to 1.45v.


----------



## DunePilot

I have a 2009 Mac Pro, they come from the factory with delidded CPUs. Would MX-4 or Liquid Ultra be better on the die. I know that MX-4 is said to last up to 8 years. I would like something that at least last 2-3 years before I need to reapply, I cannot find any info anywhere that shows how long Liquid Ultra usually last before it needs to be reapplied. Since you can't really overclock a Mac I am not too worried all that much about 3-5 degree variance in temps between the thermal paste as the temps shouldn't be that high to begin with even under load. I have a tube of MX-4 already and have used it in multiple builds, no experience with Liquid Ultra though. I am leaning towards MX-4 since I already have it and know it works, also for the safety of being non-conductive.


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> I have a 2009 Mac Pro, they come from the factory with delidded CPUs. Would MX-4 or Liquid Ultra be better on the die. I know that MX-4 is said to last up to 8 years. I would like something that at least last 2-3 years before I need to reapply, I cannot find any info anywhere that shows how long Liquid Ultra usually last before it needs to be reapplied. Since you can't really overclock a Mac I am not too worried all that much about 3-5 degree variance in temps between the thermal paste as the temps shouldn't be that high to begin with even under load. I have a tube of MX-4 already and have used it in multiple builds, no experience with Liquid Ultra though. I am leaning towards MX-4 since I already have it and know it works, also for the safety of being non-conductive.


Search function "pump out" in this thread. Using any non liquid metal will eventually lead to a drop off in performance after a numher of thermal cycles. That means that reapplication is needed more frequently than every three years. The only real solution in my mind is for you to use CLP or CLU.


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Search function "pump out" in this thread. Using any non liquid metal will eventually lead to a drop off in performance after a numher of thermal cycles. That means that reapplication is needed more frequently than every three years. The only real solution in my mind is for you to use CLP or CLU.


Thanks, I actually just came across an article on anandtech showing a shootout between 3-4 thermal paste and it concluded what you are saying. I guess I will be picking up some CLU off Amazon.

I did a trial run last night on an i7 960, I will test it in the next day or two. If she survived then it will be on to delidding my two X5690s.

Any preference of CLP or CLU over the other?

I was also going to just use clear enamel fingernail polish for the caps. I guess that will suffice or is there better alternatives to coat it with.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Thanks, I actually just came across an article on anandtech showing a shootout between 3-4 thermal paste and it concluded what you are saying. I guess I will be picking up some CLU off Amazon.
> 
> I did a trial run last night on an i7 960, I will test it in the next day or two. If she survived then it will be on to delidding my two X5690s.
> 
> Any preference of CLP or CLU over the other?
> 
> I was also going to just use clear enamel fingernail polish for the caps. I guess that will suffice or is there better alternatives to coat it with.


Clu is the best


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Clu is the best


I'm using CLP and CLU are rather similar. Though CLU is supposedly easier to spread, and CLP cleans up easier.


----------



## GoLDii3

I sold my CPU. I need to remove the CLU on the die.

Two questions:

1) How do i remove it without ruining something?¿
2) Should i expect any resistance while trying to remove the IHS after 2 years of use without touching the CLU on the die? Don't want to break the die.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoLDii3*
> 
> I sold my CPU. I need to remove the CLU on the die.
> 
> Two questions:
> 
> 1) How do i remove it without ruining something?¿
> 2) Should i expect any resistance while trying to remove the IHS after 2 years of use without touching the CLU on the die? Don't want to break the die.


Clean with 91% Isopropyl Alcohol, and be thorough. I use an LED light to check for any tiny drops of the liquid metal that may have wandered off.

The CLU should still be soft, so I wouldn't expect much resistance when pulling the IHS off.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiserJJ*
> 
> Woohoo! Officially joined the delidded club!
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.48.28_zpscf0528tm.jpg.html
> 
> I created a custom delidding vise. Yeah, it's over-engineering... but I'm an engineer... it's what I do. No risk of damage from clamping in vise and no projectile CPU.
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.45.39_zpsiimszrnw.jpg.html
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.47.36_zpswwzdqfef.jpg.html


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a question for the high overclockers..
> What would you guys say is the max vcore to push through the chip?
> Can I be added to the club.


I need the info required from the OP. that way I can enter you in!


----------



## GoLDii3

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MiserJJ*
> 
> Woohoo! Officially joined the delidded club!
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.48.28_zpscf0528tm.jpg.html
> 
> I created a custom delidding vise. Yeah, it's over-engineering... but I'm an engineer... it's what I do. No risk of damage from clamping in vise and no projectile CPU.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.45.39_zpsiimszrnw.jpg.html
> 
> http://s23.photobucket.com/user/misterjj1/media/2015-09-252010.47.36_zpswwzdqfef.jpg.html


That looks awesome.


----------



## v1ral

OCN name: v1ral
CPU: 4790k
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: Unknown ~200mhz
OC after delid: 4.8 Ghz
Temp drops: 5-7c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


This is a rushed submission

I will be retesting when I get my CLU in the mail, hopefully dropping temps even more.


----------



## blaze2210

For *BEST* results, use a liquid metal between the die and the IHS. So basically, Liquid Pro, Liquid Ultra, or Phobya Liquid Metal - anything else gets you minor temperature drops.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I'm using CLP and CLU are rather similar. Though CLU is supposedly easier to spread, and CLP cleans up easier.


Clu as higher thermal conductivity









I googled


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Clu as higher thermal conductivity
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I googled


Hence why I said "similar", instead of "the same".









Even with the slightly higher thermal conductivity, they still perform _similarly_. I did a bit of quick googling myself. Liquid Pro _normally_ comes out on top, but to be honest, they're so close that it doesn't really matter. CLU is easier to apply, but CLP is easier to clean up - that's where the major differences are.









Here are a few results. Granted, 3 of them are from the same source, but they show the results with different cooling solutions.



The only time Ultra performed better, it was by 0.3*C. So the extra ~5.8w/mk doesn't seem to boost the performance very much. My take is this: the choice between the 2 really comes down to the clean-up and application - basically, which one you want to have an easier time with.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> OCN name: v1ral
> CPU: 4790k
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: Unknown ~200mhz
> OC after delid: 4.8 Ghz
> Temp drops: 5-7c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> This is a rushed submission
> 
> I will be retesting when I get my CLU in the mail, hopefully dropping temps even more.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## v1ral

Going direct die worth it??


----------



## rsturtle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Going direct die worth it??


Most will say no. The mount is more tricky and potentially dangerous. If you over tighten you can crack the die. You will see a 2-4 degree drop most of time if I'm not mistaken. Though this is OC.net... if you're go hard or go home any improvement may be worth it.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rsturtle*
> 
> Most will say no. The mount is more tricky and potentially dangerous. If you over tighten you can crack the die. You will see a 2-4 degree drop most of time if I'm not mistaken. Though this is OC.net... if you're go hard or go home any improvement may be worth it.


4c on the high side most see 2c.

The cpu pcb flexing is the biggest issue. A shim of the correct thickness resolves that issue or msi delid guard.

I always been able to get satisfactory temps with just a delid + clp on die.

Its not like 2-4c is gonna gain any oc headroom.


----------



## v1ral

I suppose I'll cancel in getting a whole new block set up, I've read it was so worth even with lapping for most.

Thanks guys, saving money is always a good thing...
Now waiting for my CLU... Does it come with a brush or anything??
What are people using to cover the caps? Nail polish?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> I suppose I'll cancel in getting a whole new block set up, I've read it was so worth even with lapping for most.
> 
> Thanks guys, saving money is always a good thing...
> Now waiting for my CLU... Does it come with a brush or anything??
> *What are people using to cover the caps? Nail polish?*


Post # 29045 for the part in bold. This gets covered every couple of pages or so....









For the other part:


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Now waiting for my CLU... Does it come with a brush or anything??
> What are people using to cover the caps? Nail polish?


It comes with a brush and some people suggested to cut it shorter. I did that too and seems to be a good idea. Putting little bits of CLU onto the brush seemed also a good way. When u always use very little CLU as recommended I don't see a need for covering the caps because CLU will actually be pretty sticky and not liquid at all.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

I haven't used CLU on a laptop or GPU core, but my only suggestion in those applications would be to cover any closely located VRMs with nail polish, much like Haswell or Devil's Canyon on desktop.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Thanks, I actually just came across an article on anandtech showing a shootout between 3-4 thermal paste and it concluded what you are saying. I guess I will be picking up some CLU off Amazon.
> 
> I did a trial run last night on an i7 960, I will test it in the next day or two. If she survived then it will be on to delidding my two X5690s.
> 
> Any preference of CLP or CLU over the other?
> 
> I was also going to just use clear enamel fingernail polish for the caps. I guess that will suffice or is there better alternatives to coat it with.


Since no one else seems to have caught this:
*DO NOT ATTEMPT TO DELID 5960Xs*

Or any LGA2011 based chips.
Doing so will gain you nothing, and you're far more likely to crack the die and kill the chip.
They are already directly soldered to the IHS, and Delidding them is needlessly dangerous


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hobbsmeerkat*
> 
> I haven't used CLU on a laptop or GPU core, but my only suggestion in those applications would be to cover any closely located VRMs with nail polish, much like Haswell or Devil's Canyon on desktop.
> Since no one else seems to have caught this:
> *DO NOT ATTEMPT TO DELID 5960Xs*
> 
> Or any LGA2011 based chips.
> Doing so will gain you nothing, and you're far more likely to crack the die and kill the chip.
> They are already directly soldered to the IHS, and Delidding them is needlessly dangerous


The IHS being soldered hasn't stopped people from delidding before, why should it now?


----------



## DunePilot

Well the soldered i7 960 survived.
Here is the first OC attempt. Now onto delidding my soldered X5690s in the next few days.

Here is info you need so I can join I think, maybe I forgot something.
DunePilot - i7 960 - MX-4 - MX-4 - Unknown - 4008 Mhz - Unkown


----------



## white owl

I got bored today....



4.8 on a 212 with stock fan. The mount on this thing is terrible. I'd try to lap it but even if both surfaces are perfect the mount wouldn't be true.

If you install 3 times you can get 3 wildly different results.

What's a cheapish cooler with a good mount? I want to do 5Ghz but not like this... =(


----------



## v1ral

So my CLU is in and I'm wondering if the brushes are good applicators...

Also, so any nail polish will do? I am definately gonna paint over the caps.

On another note, I ordered my CLU from Amazon through sidewinders and they sent me two packages of the stuff.
I got enough for days now..
Thanks sidewinders and Amazon!!


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Also, so any nail polish will do? I am definately gonna paint over the caps.


I used this: http://www.cvs.com/shop/beauty/makeup/nails/sally-hansen-hard-as-nails-nail-polish-clear-skuid-101618

It just happened to be in the medicine cabinet.







It is now MINE!


----------



## paskowitz

What is the use for putting nail polish on the caps?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> What is the use for putting nail polish on the caps?


It keeps the liquid metal from shorting them out.


----------



## paskowitz

Isn't CLU non conductive? (CLP is though, right?)


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Isn't CLU non conductive? (CLP is though, right?)


No, they're both very conductive.


----------



## bonami2

Congrat on the delid and do temp are good with the 212 evo?

Aint sure upgrading to the h220x or h110i gt would be worth it from my h75

I can play game safely under 80c with 4.9ghz

But stressing is 80-86celsius


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Congrat on the delid and do temp are good with the 212 evo?
> 
> Aint sure upgrading to the h220x or h110i gt would be worth it from my h75
> 
> I can play game safely under 80c with 4.9ghz
> 
> But stressing is 80-86celsius


Temps at 1.3XX @4.8Ghz are the same as they were at 1.2XX @ 4.5Ghz
I didn't have CLU so I used Nano Diamond. I expect CLU will help.

I haven't fine tuned it at all.

Delid > POST> BIOS > set to 4.8Ghz and 1.3XXv for the core and 1.9v for my input. I have alot of tuning to do.

With the 212 fan running 100%, I top out at 72c on the hottest but usually hovers in the mid 60s.

I plan on replacing my CPU in 2016 so I'm not going to worry about temps any more.
This is my first rig and my first CPU. Now my first delid.
Once I do 5Ghz on this cooler I'll be happy. I've learned alot.

BTW: I'd be willing to bet that a good tower cooler would be better than the h75.

Any one use Aida? I can't seem to find and info on how long it should run. It's a pretty cool test so overnight would be no problem.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Temps at 1.3XX @4.8Ghz are the same as they were at 1.2XX @ 4.5Ghz
> I didn't have CLU so I used Nano Diamond. I expect CLU will help.
> 
> I haven't fine tuned it at all.
> 
> Delid > POST> BIOS > set to 4.8Ghz and 1.3XXv for the core and 1.9v for my input. I have alot of tuning to do.
> 
> With the 212 fan running 100%, I top out at 72c on the hottest but usually hovers in the mid 60s.
> 
> I plan on replacing my CPU in 2016 so I'm not going to worry about temps any more.
> This is my first rig and my first CPU. Now my first delid.
> Once I do 5Ghz on this cooler I'll be happy. I've learned alot.
> 
> BTW: I'd be willing to bet that a good tower cooler would be better than the h75.
> 
> Any one use Aida? I can't seem to find and info on how long it should run. It's a pretty cool test so overnight would be no problem.


Well my h75 idled at 21-23 celsius last nigh with the ac on full blast

I dont think an air cooler is better i cant be sure but most of the review are on open test bench.

i have 2 7950 cooking the case


----------



## white owl

Makes sense. I have 4 140mm intake fans (top and front) with the bottom of my case sealed off and the PCI-e slots removed.
Air rushes out the back around the GPU.

With dual GPU I can see why an AIO might be a better choice though.

I'm going to add another fan to my cooler...the stock fan moves alot of air but has no static pressure.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Makes sense. I have 4 140mm intake fans (top and front) with the bottom of my case sealed off and the PCI-e slots removed.
> Air rushes out the back around the GPU.
> 
> With dual GPU I can see why an AIO might be a better choice though.
> 
> I'm going to add another fan to my cooler...the stock fan moves alot of air but has no static pressure.


Idk im going crazy with cooling so i put more fan as intake and temp are good even if it make no sense ahah

Top first front is intake. middle h75 intake push pull

2 bottom 120mm intake

2 140mm front intake

I think the air is going to the back


----------



## white owl

I thought I was over the top on intake.








More impressive than the delid temps are my mobo temps. At 4.8Ghz nothing on my mobo goes above 40c or so in HWinfo.

You redo the TIM on the VGA?


----------



## v1ral

I can I use ShooGoo to cover the caps under the Die instead of nail polish?


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> I thought I was over the top on intake.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More impressive than the delid temps are my mobo temps. At 4.8Ghz nothing on my mobo goes above 40c or so in HWinfo.
> 
> You redo the TIM on the VGA?


one have mx4 but the other one no idea got it used and it cool so.

But im gonna put clu on these probably if i can safely do aways from aluminium and short circuit


----------



## Sheyster

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> I can I use ShooGoo to cover the caps under the Die instead of nail polish?


No idea, but you can get clear nail polish for $1 at any 99 cent store. Why risk it?


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> No, they're both very conductive.


Good to know. I am assuming it is worth applying the nail polish even though I already have my delided CPU set? After I take the IHS off, can I just redistribute the CLU or should I do a fresh application?


----------



## v1ral

Just applied CLU and off the bat I am getting low temps, from high 80s before to high 60s at 4.7Ghz in XTU benchmark. I'm redoing my x264 run to see what I get, max temps for that I belive was 87℃ or something.
I got nail polish from the dollar store*thanks for the suggestion* I put a goat of it on the caps then painted around the border of the die.
Mounting my block makes things sketch with the IHS part, bu things are looking good.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Good to know. I am assuming it is worth applying the nail polish even though I already have my delided CPU set? After I take the IHS off, can I just redistribute the CLU or should I do a fresh application?


If you already have the ihs remounted successfully there would be no point to insulating the fivr. The only reason to do so is to avoid getting liquid metal on them and shorting them out. Seems like experienced delidders mostly don't do this, but it seems like a good move for beginners. There could be downside to insulating the fivr as it will impede cooling, but nobody has ever determined this to be a problem. I've been told those modules are just caps for the fivr and shouldn't get hot.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> If you already have the ihs remounted successfully there would be no point to insulating the fivr. The only reason to do so is to avoid getting liquid metal on them and shorting them out. Seems like experienced delidders mostly don't do this, but it seems like a good move for beginners. There could be downside to insulating the fivr as it will impede cooling, but nobody has ever determined this to be a problem. I've been told those modules are just caps for the fivr and shouldn't get hot.


Got it. I was very careful applying my CLU. I looked up images for how much to put on and used very light brush strokes. I was more worried about the CLU seeping over when I applied the IHS and CPU clamp. Maybe saran wrap with a cutout would be a good alternative (obviously to be removed).


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Got it. I was very careful applying my CLU. I looked up images for how much to put on and used very light brush strokes. I was more worried about the CLU seeping over when I applied the IHS and CPU clamp. Maybe saran wrap with a cutout would be a good alternative.


Or do what I did, paint with nail polish around the die.. putting an extra coat on the FIVR.


----------



## DunePilot

I knocked the top part off a cap beside the core... is this thing going to pretty much be dead or might it be ok?

I heard once that some of the caps only regulate "noise" and sometimes you are ok. I have no idea what they do and if I am screwed or not...


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> I knocked the top part off a cap beside the core... is this thing going to pretty much be dead or might it be ok?
> 
> I heard once that some of the caps only regulate "noise" and sometimes you are ok. I have no idea what they do and if I am screwed or not...


There's only one way to find out....Best of luck to you!


----------



## DunePilot

I got the i7 960 test dummy just fine. Then I did the first X5690 ok, then on the second X5690 my hands were kind of cramping and slipped and took out the top part of two of them. Hopefully it will be ok. The cpu's won't be overclocked they will be going into a dual cpu mac pro.


----------



## Ceadderman

Ouch that sux.

It's why I don't recommend the razor method. You simply never know and you're one good hand cramp away from a dead CPU.









Hoping I am wrong about your plight. Sometimes the greatest feeling in the world can come just from being wrong. So good luck and good fortune from Washington State (where I reside).









~Ceadder


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Ouch that sux.
> 
> It's why I don't recommend the razor method. You simply never know and you're one good hand cramp away from a dead CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hoping I am wrong about your plight. Sometimes the greatest feeling in the world can come just from being wrong. So good luck and good fortune from Washington State (where I reside).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Have to in this case, these CPUs are all soldered. I had to razor the solder off the die as well. That is actually how it happened, on my final pass making sure it was smooth as butter it slid off the end and took out two of the three just south of the die. One top of one came off and top of the one beside it flipped up, and broken off folding it back down.

Thanks, yeah hopefully its still good. Crossing my finger they are just there to filter frequency noise and that everything is still smooth as butter stability wise. Waiting on the CLU to get in so I can swap them both out.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> I got the i7 960 test dummy just fine. Then I did the first X5690 ok, then on the second X5690 my hands were kind of cramping and slipped and took out the top part of two of them. Hopefully it will be ok. The cpu's won't be overclocked they will be going into a dual cpu mac pro.


Hope it's okay. Got a picture?


----------



## DunePilot

Bottom of the left one right below the die... tops of those two are missing. Those scratches are barely visible in person. Picture makes them really show up as if they're really bad though, they shouldn't be an issue.

These are soldered X5690 Xeons if anyone is wondering.


----------



## DR4G00N

The delid of my (Soldered) X5670 was a massive success.

(Stock 3.2GHz @ 1.175V running Prime95)
Before Delid: 66c peak with my Corsair H110 AIO with 2x Fractal R2 140mm fans in pull.
After Delid: 51c peak with a CM Hyper T4 w/ 2x YL D12SM-12's in push/ pull.
(15c Drop!)

(OC'ed to 3.5GHz @ 1.25V)
Before: 78c peak with my Corsair H110 AIO with 2x Fractal R2 140mm fans in pull.
After: 61c peak with a CM Hyper T4 w/ 2x YL D12SM-12's in push/ pull.
(17c Drop!)

Keep in mind that the Hyper T4 is not the greatest compared to my H110. Just to give you an indication of how much it dropped by.

I'm using the included paste with the Hyper T4 between the die and ihs.

Temps with CLU on the die and with my H110 on it are going to be absolutely outstanding I bet.


----------



## Origondoo

Hi all,

I'm also considering to delid the cpu (4790K), but still have some questions to thermal setup.

I will run the CPU on M7I with the EK monoblock, so I have to use the IHS. Between the IHS and the die I will use CLU.

But now I'm evaluating if it also makes sense to attach thermal pad between the IHC and CPU PCB around the die in order to keep the socket cooler. Did someone already evaluated the benefit or disadvantage of it?
Especially on 4790K there are VRM sitting directly on PCB.


----------



## v1ral

Has anyone tried to modify the mounting mechanism of the Apogee XL to be able to go Direct Die?
Or perhaps "jerry rig" rig the EK mounts to fit the Apogee Xl block?


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I'm also considering to delid the cpu (4790K), but still have some questions to thermal setup.
> 
> I will run the CPU on M7I with the EK monoblock, so I have to use the IHS. Between the IHS and the die I will use CLU.
> 
> But now I'm evaluating if it also makes sense to attach thermal pad between the IHC and CPU PCB around the die in order to keep the socket cooler. Did someone already evaluated the benefit or disadvantage of it?
> Especially on 4790K there are VRM sitting directly on PCB.


Vrm are pretty cold even at 4.9ghz on my msi.. So i think your mobo is probably even colder







I dont think temp is an issue


----------



## DR4G00N

Got my CLU today,


Club application,
OCN name: DR4G00N
CPU: Xeon X5670
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: ~600MHz
OC after delid: 4.416GHz
Temp drops: About 20-30c on Core 0
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/3wz1ut


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Got my CLU today,
> 
> 
> Club application,
> OCN name: DR4G00N
> CPU: Xeon X5670
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: ~600MHz
> OC after delid: 4.416GHz
> Temp drops: About 20-30c on Core 0
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/3wz1ut


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## DunePilot

Mac Pro upgrade appears to be a huge success. 1600+ Cinebench scores. The soldered CPUs survived the delidding process. ;D

Valgaur am I in the club? I posted all the required info for a I7 960 a few pages back and I have this as well. Unfortunately on a mac I can't meet all criteria with this one.


----------



## Origondoo

Let me join the club











I used the vice only method. Never thought it would be that easy... very easy.

The results: temp improvement of 10~15°C.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



this is the result with EKL Alpenföhn Himalaya 2


and here with EK monoblock but NO rads at all. Just 5 liters water 22°C starting and 36°C as the shot was done.




Some more pics:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> 
> 
> Mac Pro upgrade appears to be a huge success. 1600+ Cinebench scores. The soldered CPUs survived the delidding process. ;D
> 
> Valgaur am I in the club? I posted all the required info for a I7 960 a few pages back and I have this as well. Unfortunately on a mac I can't meet all criteria with this one.


What they do in singlethread? Can you overclock them?


----------



## Afineday2die

Guys I want to sell my Cpu. Its running direct to die method with CLU on Corsair H100i since a year and I have never removed to CPU. So can I safely clean the CLU from Cpu and H100i block.


----------



## Origondoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Afineday2die*
> 
> Guys I want to sell my Cpu. Its running direct to die method with CLU on Corsair H100i since a year and I have never removed to CPU. So can I safely clean the CLU from Cpu and H100i block.


Shoulg not be an issue. Except your H100i plate jas some optical issue since CLU / CLP diffuses into the copper


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Afineday2die*
> 
> Guys I want to sell my Cpu. Its running direct to die method with CLU on Corsair H100i since a year and I have never removed to CPU. So can I safely clean the CLU from Cpu and H100i block.


You should be able to clean it off just fine, just be aware that there will likely be some discoloration on the copper.


----------



## jdorje

It's possible to sell a delidded cpu?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> It's possible to sell a delidded cpu?


It's possible to sell anything, you just need to find the buyer....


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> It's possible to sell a delidded cpu?


You can sell anything you want......









Dead cpu are sold on ebay


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> What they do in singlethread? Can you overclock them?


Never even ran single thread, wouldn't be much special about it. It would just be a single thread at 3.46GHz. You can't overclock because its a Mac. The only option is to get creative and Bootcamp into Windows and use SetFSB and bump up the FSB to whatever it would do on stock voltage just do a bench. Much more hassle than it's worth and not sure how well that would work anyways.


----------



## DunePilot

Under normal use without being overclocked how long should CLU last, think I can get at least 3 years out of it?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Under normal use without being overclocked how long should CLU last, think I can get at least 3 years out of it?


There are so many variables involved in that, any answer you get would be purely subjective. I know that CL*P* lasted on my CPU for over a year, and was still perfectly fine when I cleaned it off and reapplied.

Basically, you just leave it on until you see your temps getting progressively worse. Then you remove the old and reapply.


----------



## DunePilot

Yeah, it won't be overclocked. I guess I will just have to see what its doing under load now and use that as my baseline for degradation.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Yeah, it won't be overclocked. I guess I will just have to see what its doing under load now and use that as my baseline for degradation.


You shouldn't have any issue with getting a couple of years out of an application. Like I said, when I checked on mine (out of sheer curiosity, not bad temps), the CLP still looked the same as when I applied it - nice and shiny still after about 15 months.









This is on my 4670K, running 4.5ghz-4.7ghz over the course of that time and cooled by an H100i.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You shouldn't have any issue with getting a couple of years out of an application. Like I said, when I checked on mine (out of sheer curiosity, not bad temps), the CLP still looked the same as when I applied it - nice and shiny still after about 15 months.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is on my 4670K, running 4.5ghz-4.7ghz over the course of that time and cooled by an H100i.


Did you use it between the block and IHS?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Did you use it between the block and IHS?


Nope, there isn't enough of a benefit to running CLP on top of the IHS. CLP's place is between the die and the IHS.









I guess for my original response, I could have clarified which one DunePilot was talking about. I just kind of assumed....


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Nope, there isn't enough of a benefit to running CLP on top of the IHS. CLP's place is between the die and the IHS.


Glad to hear. That stuff is pricy.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Glad to hear. That stuff is pricy.


Its kinda fun to apply though, and it amazes me how far a little bit spreads. I've actually been thinking about opening up the old Xbox 360 and seeing about swapping out the janky stock TIM for CLP.
















Though I guess that depends on what type of metal makes contact there, I don't remember off-hand.


----------



## 1508AD

I'm assuming due to the lowered temps involved after delidding that you could expect an overall lower temperature inside the case. Has anybody found this to be the true?


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1508AD*
> 
> I'm assuming due to the lowered temps involved after delidding that you could expect an overall lower temperature inside the case. Has anybody found this to be the true?


No, the case should get warmer because the CPU has an easier time putting the heat into the heatsink.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1508AD*
> 
> I'm assuming due to the lowered temps involved after delidding that you could expect an overall lower temperature inside the case. Has anybody found this to be the true?


I would think that the cpu would put out the same amount of heat before and after which would put the same amount in the case. you are really just making it easier to transfer the heat not really lessening the amount of heat created


----------



## DunePilot

Another one of those "too many variables" things. You essentially aren't generating anymore heat its just where it being dispersed (into the heatsink) or where it is being retained (at the CPU) you add onto the fact that once from the heatsink you have the option of it being carried from water to a rad and out of a system or being dispersed off the fins with fans in an air cooled system we are back at square one which is.... who knows. Lol.


----------



## Wirerat

The total amount of heat being generated is directly proportional to the wattage being used by the cpu.

The actual cpu temp has very little impact on total wattage used / heat being generated. It just means the heat is pasing through the cpu faster at lower cpu temps.


----------



## bonami2

Higher temp = higher resistance = higher current and it was tested that it do make a difference of like 10+ watt from 50c to 70c + Depending on cpu.

And cpu have major problem with heat transfer.

Amd Fx die are big like 5820k and 5960x die.

So they arent really harder to cool than 4790k

A 120mm rad is more than enough if the heat transfer was as good as gpu


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bonami2*
> 
> Higher temp = higher resistance = higher current and it was tested that it do make a difference of like 10+ watt from 50c to 70c + Depending on cpu.
> 
> And cpu have major problem with heat transfer.
> 
> Amd Fx die are big like 5820k and 5960x die.
> 
> So they arent really harder to cool than 4790k
> 
> A 120mm rad is more than enough if the heat transfer was as good as gpu


You are mentioning a condition known as thermal runaway. On the scale of a cpu it is a very small wattage difference though.

10w delta vs a total 160-200w+ (w/oc on intel quads or more).

Thats only 5% ish more heat.


----------



## bonami2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> You are mentioning a condition known as thermal runaway. On the scale of a cpu it is a very small wattage difference though.
> 
> 10w delta vs a total 160-200w+ (w/oc on intel quads or more).
> 
> Thats only 5% ish more heat.


Yea it small but still there


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> 
> 
> Mac Pro upgrade appears to be a huge success. 1600+ Cinebench scores. The soldered CPUs survived the delidding process. ;D
> 
> Valgaur am I in the club? I posted all the required info for a I7 960 a few pages back and I have this as well. Unfortunately on a mac I can't meet all criteria with this one.


Can you linky Vagur this, he has been crazy busy the last few days, Sorry if I missed it








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> Let me join the club
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used the vice only method. Never thought it would be that easy... very easy.
> 
> The results: temp improvement of 10~15°C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> this is the result with EKL Alpenföhn Himalaya 2
> 
> 
> and here with EK monoblock but NO rads at all. Just 5 liters water 22°C starting and 36°C as the shot was done.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some more pics:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I need the info required from the front page


----------



## jdorje

To expand on what Wirerat said: If you have a 100w cpu, heat is being produced at 100 joules per second. Heat is also being moved off of the cpu at the rate of 100w or 100 joules per second, regardless of how good your cooling is or whether you're delidded.

Heat moves from the cpu to the cooler (or the cooler to the air) at a rate proportional to the temperature difference. Better cooling simply means you achieve that 100w with a lower temperature difference.

A few pages back it was pointed out that with heat moving more efficiently into the cooler, a smaller proportion of the heat will be conducted out the sides and back of the cpu into the socket. This is no doubt true - if you lower the cpu temp by 15c, ultimately you should be lowering the socket temp be 15c - but the wattage itself must be very small.

The idea that the cpu itself would run more efficiently at cooler temps is also an interesting one. Again it sounds like the effect is small though.

Common wisdom is that you can lower voltage a bit if your temps are lower, allowing less power and heat (or potentially a higher multiplier) as a result. The number I've heard is .03v per 10c, although this sounds high.


----------



## scorpscarx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Under normal use without being overclocked how long should CLU last, think I can get at least 3 years out of it?


I put the clu on my 3570k about 3 years ago, long since gave it to my mom who runs the cpu at stock, I check the temps occasionally, still fine.

:knocks on wood:


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scorpscarx*
> 
> I put the clu on my 3570k about 3 years ago, long since gave it to my mom who runs the cpu at stock, I check the temps occasionally, still fine.
> 
> :knocks on wood:


You're using CLP or CLU?


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Can you linky Vagur this, he has been crazy busy the last few days, Sorry if I missed it


http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/29100#post_24455686

Sorry it isn't of much value from OC and temp perspective, it was only in the system about 10 hours, it was just a test of delidding a soldered CPU before I moved on to the much more expensive X5690's that I delidded and put in the Mac Pro mounted direct die. Posted here http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/29130#post_24472245.

Unfortunately those being in a Mac Pro I lack the info and screenies to submit them, can only post a Screenie of Cinebench for entertainment. They are using CLU, direct die, stock clocks of 3.46, no idea on temp differences, it was a swap from the stock 2.26 Xeons the system came with.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/29100#post_24455686
> 
> Sorry it isn't of much value from OC and temp perspective, it was only in the system about 10 hours, it was just a test of delidding a soldered CPU before I moved on to the much more expensive X5690's that I delidded and put in the Mac Pro mounted direct die. Posted here http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/29130#post_24472245.
> 
> Unfortunately those being in a Mac Pro I lack the info and screenies to submit them, can only post a Screenie of Cinebench for entertainment. They are using CLU, direct die, stock clocks of 3.46, no idea on temp differences, it was a swap from the stock 2.26 Xeons the system came with.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!







Good luck with those X xeons...... >.> I sure as heck wouldn't do that


----------



## Origondoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I need the info required from the front page


Sorry missed that point









*OCN name:* Origondoo
*CPU:* i7 -4970K
*on die-TIM:* CLP
*ihs-TIM:* Phobya NanoGrease Extreme
*Mhz gained:* 200 MHz (higher 24/7 OC due to lower temps)
*OC after delid:* 4.6 GHz
*Temp drops:* ~12°C (77°C before and 65°C after delidding based on AIDA64 stress testing)
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:*


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







For the temp drop I will rerun the intel burn in test.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> Sorry missed that point
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *OCN name:* Origondoo
> *CPU:* i7 -4970K
> *on die-TIM:* CLP
> *ihs-TIM:* Phobya NanoGrease Extreme
> *Mhz gained:* 200 MHz (higher 24/7 OC due to lower temps)
> *OC after delid:* 4.6 GHz
> *Temp drops:* ~12°C (77°C before and 65°C after delidding based on AIDA64 stress testing)
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the temp drop I will rerun the intel burn in test.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On


----------



## DR4G00N

I just noticed my submission is in the LGA 2011 list, the Xeon X5670 is LGA 1366


----------



## tdbone1

i have a delidded 4770k that isnt a really good overclocker.
with as5 in between die and ihs and as5 inbetween ihs and h100i i run 1.275v and stable at 4.2GHz while running p95 small fft
it does hit 90c quite a bit.

i ordered some CLU for between die and ihs and also ordered more as5 for between ihs and h100i.

01 im mainly wondering how long does the clu last before it needs re-applied?
i was thinking about selling it if i cant get what i want in GHz therefore i was going to seal it up with black rtv just so the next person dont accidently drop the chip on the pins if it comes apart when they lift it from socket.

of course i will tell them it has been delidded.

i tried to do the h100i direct die by following a couple guides (one for the 3770 combined with one for the 4770) but i think computer wouldnt boot because not good contact between pins and cpu.

everything is fine and i have the ihs back on and same performance as i was getting before i tried it so all is well.

just waiting for my CLU and AS5 to come so i can make this permanent.

02 should i mess around anymore with the direct die and as5 or skip staight to using the clu in between die and ihs?

one more thing
i bought some clear nail polish
should i put it on the caps next to the die?
if it gets hot in that area i not sure what will happen with the nail polish


----------



## sav4

Hi all I want too do a trial run on a old CPU I had lying around anyone know if it is soldered or Tim ?


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Hi all I want too do a trial run on a old CPU I had lying around anyone know if it is soldered or Tim ?


The Celeron D 336 is soldered, but you can still delid it with a bit of heat and a few razor blades. Otherwise you can just go through the process of the vice method with it for practice but it'll break.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> The Celeron D 336 is soldered, but you can still delid it with a bit of heat and a few razor blades. Otherwise you can just go through the process of the vice method with it for practice but it'll break.


Thanks for the info I'll give it a go with the razor then reglue it and try the vise method to .


----------



## WheelZ0713

Quick question. Gonna Delid my 4770 shortly and will obviously be using some CLU between the die and the IHS. Though i'm thinking i may as well use it between the IHS and the cooler itself.

I'm familiar with the many and varied ways to apply thermal past on a cooler, but given the different consistency of CLU i am wondering what your recommendations are?

Pea sized ball or spread that out?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> Quick question. Gonna Delid my 4770 shortly and will obviously be using some CLU between the die and the IHS. Though i'm thinking i may as well use it between the IHS and the cooler itself.
> 
> I'm familiar with the many and varied ways to apply thermal past on a cooler, but given the different consistency of CLU i am wondering what your recommendations are?
> 
> Pea sized ball or spread that out?


It's really not worth it to use CLU on top of the IHS. If you're going to do it though, spread out the CLU, don't rely on the mounting pressure to spread it out for you. The last thing you want is CLU floating around where it's not supposed to be.


----------



## WheelZ0713

Fair call.

Maybe just stick with what i know and use the arctic.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> Fair call.
> 
> Maybe just stick with what i know and use the arctic.


Sounds like a good plan.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> I just noticed my submission is in the LGA 2011 list, the Xeon X5670 is LGA 1366


Edited, thank you kindly!


----------



## tdbone1

still would like answers to my post before this one if anyone has time.


----------



## sav4

Does anyone know where I can buy clu in Australia or a decent substitute ?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> i have a delidded 4770k that isnt a really good overclocker.
> with as5 in between die and ihs and as5 inbetween ihs and h100i i run 1.275v and stable at 4.2GHz while running p95 small fft
> it does hit 90c quite a bit.
> 
> i ordered some CLU for between die and ihs and also ordered more as5 for between ihs and h100i.
> 
> 01 im mainly wondering how long does the clu last before it needs re-applied?
> i was thinking about selling it if i cant get what i want in GHz therefore i was going to seal it up with black rtv just so the next person dont accidently drop the chip on the pins if it comes apart when they lift it from socket.
> 
> of course i will tell them it has been delidded.
> 
> i tried to do the h100i direct die by following a couple guides (one for the 3770 combined with one for the 4770) but i think computer wouldnt boot because not good contact between pins and cpu.
> 
> everything is fine and i have the ihs back on and same performance as i was getting before i tried it so all is well.
> 
> just waiting for my CLU and AS5 to come so i can make this permanent.
> 
> 02 should i mess around anymore with the direct die and as5 or skip staight to using the clu in between die and ihs?
> 
> one more thing
> i bought some clear nail polish
> should i put it on the caps next to the die?
> if it gets hot in that area i not sure what will happen with the nail polish


Use the clu,you don't really have anything to lose but to gain better temps. With your voltage with your chip sounds like a dud to me. Might just be worth hunting for a better chip. My question is, why do you need the extra mhz? A few hundred Mhz isn't worth the extra work, unless your benchmarking, then it will. Just my thoughts.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> i have a delidded 4770k that isnt a really good overclocker.
> with as5 in between die and ihs and as5 inbetween ihs and h100i i run 1.275v and stable at 4.2GHz while running p95 small fft
> it does hit 90c quite a bit.
> 
> i ordered some CLU for between die and ihs and also ordered more as5 for between ihs and h100i.
> 
> 01 im mainly wondering how long does the clu last before it needs re-applied?
> i was thinking about selling it if i cant get what i want in GHz therefore i was going to seal it up with black rtv just so the next person dont accidently drop the chip on the pins if it comes apart when they lift it from socket.
> 
> of course i will tell them it has been delidded.
> 
> i tried to do the h100i direct die by following a couple guides (one for the 3770 combined with one for the 4770) but i think computer wouldnt boot because not good contact between pins and cpu.
> 
> everything is fine and i have the ihs back on and same performance as i was getting before i tried it so all is well.
> 
> just waiting for my CLU and AS5 to come so i can make this permanent.
> 
> 02 should i mess around anymore with the direct die and as5 or skip staight to using the clu in between die and ihs?
> 
> one more thing
> i bought some clear nail polish
> should i put it on the caps next to the die?
> if it gets hot in that area i not sure what will happen with the nail polish


Don't run p95 if it's pushing you up to 90C.

Clu lasts ~forever.

Supposedly delidded chips are harder to sell. Doesn't make sense to me - the danger is in the delidding itself; once that is successful the chip is better than a non-delidded one.

Direct to die can save you a couple of degrees, but...most consider it not worth it. There's also the danger of too little or too much pressure from the heat sink. CLU and other liquid metals will destroy or damage some heat sinks, whether the h100i copper sink is one of them is a matter of debate it seems.

The clear nail polish you would put on before the CLU. If you get any CLU on the caps you can short out and destroy the chip; nail polish prevents this. If you're comfortable with your CLU-spreading skills then this isn't needed. People say temps on the caps are not an issue though I also have wondered if insulating them is bad.


----------



## tdbone1

good info from both replies

yea i think im gonna put some clu on die then some black rtv and then put the ihs back on.

i will sell it as delidded to apply CLU and then put back together and take some SS while its running something cpu intensive

i might keep it if that clu works better then my current as5 setup which is as5 between die and ihs and as5 between ihs and h100i

the nail polish....not sure if im gonna use it on the caps or not.


----------



## WheelZ0713

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Does anyone know where I can buy clu in Australia or a decent substitute ?


I got mine off the electronic bay. Should still be there.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> I got mine off the electronic bay. Should still be there.


Yer I had a look on eBay there is none listed atm .


----------



## WheelZ0713

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Yer I had a look on eBay there is none listed atm .


I respectfully disagree...

http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.XCoollaboratory+Liquid+Ultra.TRS0&_nkw=Coollaboratory+Liquid+Ultra&_sacat=0


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> I respectfully disagree...
> 
> http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.XCoollaboratory+Liquid+Ultra.TRS0&_nkw=Coollaboratory+Liquid+Ultra&_sacat=0


I searched that in the mobile app and nothing came up wierd . Thankyou for that


----------



## WheelZ0713

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> I searched that in the mobile app and nothing came up wierd . Thankyou for that


Yeah, the mobile app seems to have a mind of it's own. "Oh, you'd like to purchase some CLU? Are you sure you wouldn't prefer a Camel?"


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WheelZ0713*
> 
> Yeah, the mobile app seems to have a mind of it's own. "Oh, you'd like to purchase some CLU? Are you sure you wouldn't prefer a Camel?"


Lol yer pretty much eh


----------



## blaze2210

"No app, the camel was LAST week! Try to keep up here...."


----------



## TDEUS

Sorry for my laziness. (I'm on mobile and it's hard to search the forum)
Just got into watercooling, http://www.overclock.net/t/1575508/build-log-first-water-loop#post_24488463(check out my build log)
And now I was qondering how I could optimize my system even more.
So the deliding option came to my mind.
Now my question. Ould it be possible/advisable to run an EK supremacy evo directly off the DIE, or would you recommend to do the CLP method with the IHS on?

Cheers
TDeus


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TDEUS*
> 
> Sorry for my laziness. (I'm on mobile and it's hard to search the forum)
> Just got into watercooling, http://www.overclock.net/t/1575508/build-log-first-water-loop#post_24488463(check out my build log)
> And now I was qondering how I could optimize my system even more.
> So the deliding option came to my mind.
> Now my question. Ould it be possible/advisable to run an EK supremacy evo directly off the DIE, or would you recommend to do the CLP method with the IHS on?
> 
> Cheers
> TDeus


You'd need a naked kit. Not advisable because:
The socket latch has to come off. Exposed pins and the cpu can just fall out.
It is possible to crack the die.
Temps don't drop drastically.

CLU+IHS+latch+mx4+block/cooler=moar clocks









Here:
https://shop.ekwb.com/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy


----------



## tdbone1

just wanted to say i cant wait to try out the CLU.
will be my first time i used a liquid metal TIM.

1 more thing thats really bugging me.

i already did the delid and unsuccessful direct to die with my h100i
i probably wont have to many chances of doing delid tests so i really want to do it so it works.

is there an h100i adapter legs in a shorter size that we can just order to replace the 4 that are there for use with a lidded processor?

those legs just have to be the thickness of the lid shorter and boom we can use our brackets (for the h100i ppl) that i know of.

anyhow i think mine failed because chip didnt make good contact with cpu socket pins.

the computer wouldnt power on.

no damage to anything though.

would like to use clu direct to die with the h100i copper base.
hmmm

my pastes get her saturday but i following tracking numbers and maybe tomorrow...

anyhow bored and excited and was just re-thinking my failed direct die attempt.

any thoughts?


----------



## TDEUS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> You'd need a naked kit. Not advisable because:
> The socket latch has to come off. Exposed pins and the cpu can just fall out.
> It is possible to crack the die.
> Temps don't drop drastically.
> 
> CLU+IHS+latch+mx4+block/cooler=moar clocks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here:
> https://shop.ekwb.com/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy


Thanks for the reply, I kinda like the EK precisemount option. But I'm probably going to start with the "CLU+IHS+latch+mx4+block/cooler=moar clocks







" option. _(better save then sorry)_
BTW: Like your signature, I love Rick&Morty


----------



## white owl

If your comfortable doing it, do it. There's a few tutorials on it.
It's just a computer.









@tdbone1
Will it post with the lid on it?
Do you still have the latch on?
Did you clear over the caps and contacts alongside the die?


----------



## tdbone1

yea i had removed the latch and put down two nylon #6 washers with the original latch screws.

the 3rd screw to latch cleared the razor blade on top of die check.

as far as caps.
didnt check.

my 1st guess would be the processor pads werent touching the socket pins somewhere.

when mounting the pump to the board with the 4 10mm long spacers and screwing it down...it just didnt feel right for sure.

i mean yea they all 4 screwed down to the lock position but the long screws are so skinny they move around alot in the motherboards holes.

idk just didnt feel like good setup.

maybe the guide with the 10 washers on each screw would feel better when locking down....

btw i just checked my tracking numbers to the as5 and clu and i think im getting them today.
probably about noon so cant wait.


----------



## white owl

Hopefully your block didn't hit the caps.


----------



## tdbone1

i dont think h100i block was resting on the caps but i think your correct that there wasnt even pressure on the die maybe making it not make a good connection with pins.

im gonna look real good when i take ship out when CLU and AS5 get here.

should be within next 2hrs

im not sure i gonna try direct die again as i have to take my mboard out which isnt to bad and then remount the mod.

why dont they just have some shorter legs we can buy from corsair?

those double threaded stand offs should come in a shorter size. (minus the lid thickness) so simple then it dont have to be taken off each time you want to do die or lid
only the standoffs switched out.

there has to be something out there.

this is a pic of my mb
http://images.tweaktown.com/content/6/3/6398_07_asus_z97i_plus_mini_itx_intel_z97_motherboard_review_full.jpg

i think i had where the hoses where at bottom of socket by the 3rd cpu socket screw all alone.
BUT i have moved my radiator location from front face to top so the position might not have been that but i think no matter the position it cant hit anything but i will look when TIM's get here and might give it one more try.
i really think its in the homemade legs (small dia. screws with not very thick 10mm spacer/standoffs)
the legs will pull to one side easily

corsair sure should sell these with lid thickness removed.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> i dont think h100i block was resting on the caps but i think your correct that there wasnt even pressure on the die maybe making it not make a good connection with pins.
> 
> im gonna look real good when i take ship out when CLU and AS5 get here.
> 
> should be within next 2hrs
> 
> im not sure i gonna try direct die again as i have to take my mboard out which isnt to bad and then remount the mod.
> 
> why dont they just have some shorter legs we can buy from corsair?
> 
> those double threaded stand offs should come in a shorter size. (minus the lid thickness) so simple then it dont have to be taken off each time you want to do die or lid
> only the standoffs switched out.
> 
> there has to be something out there.


The H100i wasn't designed with direct-die mounting in mind, so there was no need for it to have standoffs to support that. There are solutions, you just have to get a little creative with it.

You could always contact Corsair about getting a 2nd set of the mounting hardware, then measure out the thickness of the IHS, and remove the necessary amount of metal from the standoffs. Then you would, in fact, have the setup you're describing.


----------



## tdbone1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> The H100i wasn't designed with direct-die mounting in mind, so there was no need for it to have standoffs to support that. There are solutions, you just have to get a little creative with it.
> 
> You could always contact Corsair about getting a 2nd set of the mounting hardware, then measure out the thickness of the IHS, and remove the necessary amount of metal from the standoffs. Then you would, in fact, have the setup you're describing.


corsair should sell these in a 4 leg set that comes in a bag for $5.00 delivered!
i vote yes on that.

ok i decided im skipping direct die mount.

im gonna try and make this perm in one shot so im gonna use rtv black silicon like factory did it.
the thing is i never applied liquid before so what are the chances of closing the lock with chip and chiip lid seated perfectly and not moving liquid to one side.

anyhow i should be able to tell right away with core temp app and i would be able to tell if temps per core are out more then 2C as that is what i get right now with as5

im chickening out with the 10mm setup







it just didnt feel right when turning down the screws to lock bracket in place.
if there was a corsair kit you could believe i would be on it right now well as soon as tim gets here.

i gonna play it safe and take chip out remove lid
clean with q-tip and aclohol
scuff die and bottom side of lid up if it comes with brillo (like i seen on youtube videos) ebay pic dont show know brillo or paint brush.

anyhow clean it up put thin layer on lid and die then put die in cpu socket and try to put lid on top of die as perfect as i can so when i goto close the bracket it (the lid) dont have to be readjusted during the locking.

it usually always does need readjusting.
maybe i leave silicon off this time. my first time isnt gonna be the best im sure

if anyone wants me to do any specific tests with as5 on die and on lid with h100i before i use the CLU let me know and i will try to get it done.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> corsair should sell these in a 4 leg set that comes in a bag for $5.00 delivered!
> i vote yes on that.
> 
> ok i decided im skipping direct die mount.
> 
> im gonna try and make this perm in one shot so im gonna use rtv black silicon like factory did it.
> the thing is i never applied liquid before so what are the chances of closing the lock with chip and chiip lid seated perfectly and not moving liquid to one side.
> 
> anyhow i should be able to tell right away with core temp app and i would be able to tell if temps per core are out more then 2C as that is what i get right now with as5
> 
> im chickening out with the 10mm setup
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it just didnt feel right when turning down the screws to lock bracket in place.
> if there was a corsair kit you could believe i would be on it right now well as soon as tim gets here.
> 
> i gonna play it safe and take chip out remove lid
> clean with q-tip and aclohol
> scuff die and bottom side of lid up if it comes with brillo (like i seen on youtube videos) ebay pic dont show know brillo or paint brush.
> 
> anyhow clean it up put thin layer on lid and die then put die in cpu socket and try to put lid on top of die as perfect as i can so when i goto close the bracket it (the lid) dont have to be readjusted during the locking.
> 
> it usually always does need readjusting.
> maybe i leave silicon off this time. my first time isnt gonna be the best im sure
> 
> if anyone wants me to do any specific tests with as5 on die and on lid with h100i before i use the CLU let me know and i will try to get it done.


One of the main reasons for delidding is to remove the extra height that the glue adds, since that just makes for a larger gap between the IHS and the die. DON'T SCUFF THE CPU DIE!! You can scuff up the inside of the IHS all you want to, just not the CPU die. Apply the thin layer of CLU to the die, not the IHS. AS5 is going to pump-out when used on the die, which is why regular TIMs are not recommended for that area.


----------



## jdorje

I've always read to apply the super thin layer of clu to both the top of the die and the bottom of the ihs.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I've always read to apply the super thin layer of clu to both the top of the die and the bottom of the ihs.


You can, but if you're doing both sides, you really need to make sure that you're applying a super thin layer. The last thing you want is a rogue drop of CLU wandering around. So just keep in mind when working with the liquid metals, "a little bit goes a long way".


----------



## tdbone1

oh i have an update:

did clu between die and ihs (only put it on the die)...no nailpolish either but i did lay down some black tape on the cpu c/b while working with the clu.

pus as5 between ihs and h100i

here is what i get with the overclock i had right before i did the clu and just had as5 there instead but same setup and same speeds

note:
with p95 it would instantly spike over 90C and i couldnt even run it.
here is what i get now with clu and as5



http://imgur.com/5QYgk3P


heres an apples to apples
before = as5 + as5
now = clu +as5

before


after


would like to try clu + clu or just clu direct die

can anyone suggest where to proceed next if i want to try to get some cpu frequency?
its been so long since i messed with any OC settings in bios i really forget where to go.

run p95 to max out my vcore as far as heat goes then try to up the freq?

here is more before and after but with bf4 @ 1080P and at various low, med, high and custom settings.
just trying to find which ones made the cpu work the hardest of course

before


after


boy clu really does make a big difference.
maybe i should make it clu + clu
clu between die and ihs and clu betweeh h100i pump and ihs.
will it eat my copper or just stain it a bit?

1 last set of before and afer with link at "bios defaults" except the 2 bitfex fans i keep at 1k rpm in both before and afters

before


after


----------



## paskowitz

Could dielectric grease be used as a substitute for nail polish for the caps?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Could dielectric grease be used as a substitute for nail polish for the caps?


I'd imagine so.

I've put down a little strip of thermal tape on a couple I've done. Dual purpose since it helps the lid from sliding around when you go to latch it.


----------



## tdbone1

can someone give me some manual settings to get to 4.4 or 4.5gthz (for a bad overclocker) normally 4.2 @ 1.275v?

i just tried upping vcore to 1.32 @ 44x multi for 4.4GHz and still a nogo

i dont think i need more vcore it must be imc or mch or w/e its called thats being used when programs like linx are used

something to do with the memory controller i bet.

in the bios there is a feature called ez-tuning and if i use the wizard and let it auto pick my settings for (non-gaming) system with the worst cooler you select it puts me at 4.3ghz stable so far but why cant i do it manually

i cant get stable at all above 4.2ghz and now that i have the cooler im not really worried about overheating it and killing it like i was worried before.

asus z97i-plus and 4770k bad overclocker


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> can someone give me some manual settings to get to 4.4 or 4.5gthz (for a bad overclocker) normally 4.2 @ 1.275v?
> 
> i just tried upping vcore to 1.32 @ 44x multi for 4.4GHz and still a nogo
> 
> i dont think i need more vcore it must be imc or mch or w/e its called thats being used when programs like linx are used
> 
> something to do with the memory controller i bet.
> 
> in the bios there is a feature called ez-tuning and if i use the wizard and let it auto pick my settings for (non-gaming) system with the worst cooler you select it puts me at 4.3ghz stable so far but why cant i do it manually
> 
> i cant get stable at all above 4.2ghz and now that i have the cooler im not really worried about overheating it and killing it like i was worried before.
> 
> asus z97i-plus and 4770k bad overclocker


Read the first post in the Haswell Overclocking thread here on OCN, there's a link in my signature. There's a little more to overclocking Haswell besides just changing the vcore and multiplier.


----------



## tdbone1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Read the first post in the Haswell Overclocking thread here on OCN, there's a link in my signature. There's a little more to overclocking Haswell besides just changing the vcore and multiplier.


that is why i provided my findings and settings.

i already did the guide before and many more.

i have a "bad overclocker" but now that i have my temps under control what can i do to make more frequency ghz.
increasing vcore did not make me stable

going from my stable 1.275v @ 4.2ghz (42x multi) to 4.3GHz (43x multi) would not be stable even while increasing volts to 1.32v

ok so its probably the memory controller right?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> that is why i provided my findings and settings.
> 
> i already did the guide before and many more.
> 
> i have a "bad overclocker" but now that i have my temps under control what can i do to make more frequency ghz.
> increasing vcore did not make me stable
> 
> going from my stable 1.275v @ 4.2ghz (42x multi) to 4.3GHz (43x multi) would not be stable even while increasing volts to 1.32v
> 
> ok so its probably the memory controller right?


You've made absolutely no mention of your Input voltage or your cache settings, which is why I referred to to the Haswell thread. If you're only messing with the multiplier and the vcore, then that would be part of your problem right there. There aren't any "cookie-cutter" settings that will work on everyone's system, since everyone's chips are different.


----------



## tdbone1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You've made absolutely no mention of your Input voltage or your cache settings, which is why I referred to to the Haswell thread. If you're only messing with the multiplier and the vcore, then that would be part of your problem right there. There aren't any "cookie-cutter" settings that will work on everyone's system, since everyone's chips are different.


did you look at my pics in my previous post?
they all there
vin


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> did you look at my pics in my previous post?
> they all there
> vin


No, those pics most certainly don't show what you have set for the Input voltage or the cache speed and cache voltage. Both of the areas that would show that are closed. On top of that, it looks like that program is fairly limited in what it shows. I recommend you try out HWInfo64, its free (no paid version) and it should give you more information.









These are the parts that would need to be open, but after taking a closer look at the screens above, the info you get in the voltage section is limited.


This is some of what HWInfo64 shows, and what parts I'm referring to:


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> did you look at my pics in my previous post?
> they all there
> vin


Increase VRin input voltage. Typically a forced voltage a bit over 1.8xx will help things stabilize.

Keep in mind higher clocked RAM will complicate things. 2133 is a pretty decent spot to be for RAM clock so if you're past that you could try to reduce it to help a little. I always OC CPU separately from RAM even if there is an XMP available and it is on the QVL for my MoBo.


----------



## tdbone1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Increase VRin input voltage. Typically a forced voltage a bit over 1.8xx will help things stabilize.
> 
> Keep in mind higher clocked RAM will complicate things. 2133 is a pretty decent spot to be for RAM clock so if you're past that you could try to reduce it to help a little. I always OC CPU separately from RAM even if there is an XMP available and it is on the QVL for my MoBo.


im at 1.9v in

i think it has something to do with power limiting maybe

my ram is at stock 1600 2T


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> im at 1.9v in
> 
> i think it has something to do with power limiting maybe
> 
> my ram is at stock 1600 2T


Could try taking it higher. Do you have the option for LLC, Load Line Calibration, on VRin and 'standard' core voltage. I typically set them to max, this has helped with stability.

I've had 2 haswell i7 chips that were stuck in that vicinity. One wouldn't exceed 4.3 and the other 4.4 no matter what I did to them...could just be a lousy chip.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> im at 1.9v in
> 
> i think it has something to do with power limiting maybe
> 
> my ram is at stock 1600 2T


What do you have the uncore/cache multiplier and voltage set to? Also, are you using Adaptive or Manual voltages?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> im at 1.9v in
> 
> i think it has something to do with power limiting maybe
> 
> my ram is at stock 1600 2T


Edit:

Could try taking it higher, but I have had motherboards start automatically increasing core voltage when you start pushing VRin higher. Do you have the option for LLC, Load Line Calibration, on VRin and 'standard' core voltage. I typically set them to max, this has helped with stability.

Just read you tried E-Z Tuning, and I would really suggest to stay away from that. Any brand motherboard uses WAY too much voltage with those auto settings. That could very well be the reason you got 4.3Ghz with auto and not manually. It could be 'safe' if your temperatures are still within reason, but every Z77, Z87 and Z97 board I have used and tried the 'auto tune', it has given significantly more voltage than was necessary for a given overclock.

If you want some step-by-step for adaptive voltage you can read my build log post here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1456279/honey-i-shrunk-the-ultra-tower-beast-my-journey-to-creating-a-more-compact-pc-with-an-r9-290/40_20#post_21876051

This was the guide I used to help me along: http://www.overclockers.com/3step-guide-to-overclock-intel-haswell/


----------



## tdbone1

99 out of 100 i use manual settings even with it set to auto.

i really hardly ever and i mean probably like 5x in my life use ez tuner








i also do not install asus overclock stuff
i strictly work within the bios and usually manual settings.

in the pics in my previous post....prob a page or 2 back it shows my llc and vrin.

i think im hitting some kind of wall at 4.2 @ 1.275 manual voltage with vrin 1.9
my uncore = 1.2v @ 39x multi

its too stable at 4.2ghz not to be able to take it higher.

im really starting to think im being limited by a power setting that i havent messed with in digi (something) its where i can see some power settings but mostly all is set to auto.

i think i can go higher if i can get some help in those special settings.

note this bios acts funny with hwinfo 64

sometimes its showing my total TDP goto 150 watts and other times its under 80 watts

from a bios defaults with "asus" what settings would one normally have to set to achieve to get to 4.4GHz with a bad overclocker?
wish someone would make a video of them hitting F5 for bios defaults and then F10 save and quit then go back into bios and manually adjust there settings.

there are so many options that no one ever talks about on these motherboards that i dont even know why asus puts them there.

in every guide i read (almost) none of these settings are talked about.

anyhow i got to be missing something small here because when i go from 42x multi with 1.275v and 1.9vrin and run 24/7 stable that i cant bump it up to 43x or 44x especially when i give it 1.36v like i did earlier.
i can boot into desktop np. as soon as i start linx bam. i freeze and have to do hard shutdown.
sometimes reset button works

alot of those options i mentioned above have level 0 to 9 selections and 100% to 140% (140% = red) i think that one is for power
i see "extreme" in a couple options too.

when i do F5 bios defaults save and quit and boot back into bios
i set xmp profile to enabled (this sets sync to all cores) i then just change freq multi to 43x and cache to 39x
i can pass linx
if i try to reboot to bios and change cpu freq multi to 44x it wont pass linx

i gonna try and play bf4 and see if it crashes at 43x


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> 99 out of 100 i use manual settings even with it set to auto.
> 
> i really hardly ever and i mean probably like 5x in my life use ez tuner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i also do not install asus overclock stuff
> i strictly work within the bios and usually manual settings.
> 
> in the pics in my previous post....prob a page or 2 back it shows my llc and vrin.
> 
> i think im hitting some kind of wall at 4.2 @ 1.275 manual voltage with vrin 1.9
> my uncore = 1.2v @ 39x multi
> 
> its too stable at 4.2ghz not to be able to take it higher.
> 
> im really starting to think im being limited by a power setting that i havent messed with in digi (something) its where i can see some power settings but mostly all is set to auto.
> 
> i think i can go higher if i can get some help in those special settings.
> 
> note this bios acts funny with hwinfo 64
> 
> sometimes its showing my total TDP goto 150 watts and other times its under 80 watts
> 
> from a bios defaults with "asus" what settings would one normally have to set to achieve to get to 4.4GHz with a bad overclocker?
> wish someone would make a video of them hitting F5 for bios defaults and then F10 save and quit then go back into bios and manually adjust there settings.
> 
> there are so many options that no one ever talks about on these motherboards that i dont even know why asus puts them there.
> 
> in every guide i read (almost) none of these settings are talked about.
> 
> anyhow i got to be missing something small here because when i go from 42x multi with 1.275v and 1.9vrin and run 24/7 stable that i cant bump it up to 43x or 44x especially when i give it 1.36v like i did earlier.
> i can boot into desktop np. as soon as i start linx bam. i freeze and have to do hard shutdown.
> sometimes reset button works
> 
> alot of those options i mentioned above have level 0 to 9 selections and 100% to 140% (140% = red) i think that one is for power
> i see "extreme" in a couple options too.


When I did a quick OC on my mates maximus hero I ran real bench and x264 to get voltages at stock then selected the 4.4 OC preset and manually set those previous voltages in to the 44 multi . I then slowly raised the vcore to get it stable then when it's stable add a little bit of voltage and go for the next multi .
Remember change one setting at a time , some say a lower input voltage at higher OC helps with stability .
I recommend posting in the haswell OC that darkwizz started guys are very helpful


----------



## tdbone1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> When I did a quick OC on my mates maximus hero I ran real bench and x264 to get voltages at stock then selected the 4.4 OC preset and manually set those previous voltages in to the 44 multi . I then slowly raised the vcore to get it stable then when it's stable add a little bit of voltage and go for the next multi .
> Remember change one setting at a time , some say a lower input voltage at higher OC helps with stability .
> I recommend posting in the haswell OC that darkwizz started guys are very helpful


yea your probably right about posting in the haswell thread.
i do appreciate the help about getting a better OC then my stable 4.2ghz i get now.

ok back on topic.

since i have clu between die and lid and i have as5 between lid and h100i pump....im just wondering what kind of temp reduction i could expect if i replaced the as5 with clu








anyone have any real experience with this that they might want to share?
thanks


----------



## rogergamer

no skylakes in the first post?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tdbone1*
> 
> yea your probably right about posting in the haswell thread.
> i do appreciate the help about getting a better OC then my stable 4.2ghz i get now.
> 
> ok back on topic.
> 
> since i have clu between die and lid and i have as5 between lid and h100i pump....im just wondering what kind of temp reduction i could expect if i replaced the as5 with clu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> anyone have any real experience with this that they might want to share?
> thanks


That question has been covered a number of times in this thread. The short version is this: it's not worth the risk to use CLU/CLP on top of the IHS. The major gains come from using them (liquid metal TIMs) between the die and the IHS. It would do you well to replace that AS5 for a top performer, especially one without a 200 hour curing time. Kryonaut, PK-3, GC Extreme, or Shin-Etsu would all be good choices.


----------



## Wihglah

Quick question,

I am tearing down my loop in a few weeks.

I have noticed my temps are a little higher than when I first applied my CLP under the IHS over a year ago.

If I remove the IHS, what condition am I likely to find the CLP, will it be difficult to remove and will it be worth it?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wihglah*
> 
> Quick question,
> 
> I am tearing down my loop in a few weeks.
> 
> I have noticed my temps are a little higher than when I first applied my CLP under the IHS over a year ago.
> 
> If I remove the IHS, what condition am I likely to find the CLP, will it be difficult to remove and will it be worth it?


If you had a good application of CLP, then it should still be fine. After over a year of having it on my CPU, I got curious. The CLP was still a shiny liquid when I pulled off the IHS, and I regretted opening it up, since that means cleaning off and re-applying. So you should still be good.


----------



## mAs81

Hey guys,I need your help..I delided my 4790K today , and after i put everything together,I get no post,and after 5 sec a boot loop..I dont get any beeps cause i have no speaker on my mb,but here are some pics so that you can tell me if you see something wrong




any input will be highly appreciated...


----------



## jagdtigger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> Hey guys,I need your help..I delided my 4790K today , and after i put everything together,I get no post,and after 5 sec a boot loop..I dont get any beeps cause i have no speaker on my mb,but here are some pics so that you can tell me if you see something wrong
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any input will be highly appreciated...


Hm, maybe its just the pic but it seems there is a missing part of the PCB:


----------



## mAs81

You could be right,but it was that way from the start I think..

Could it be the m/b? I get no light in my optical mouse so I think that there is no power in the usb ports..


----------



## jagdtigger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> You could be right,but it was that way from the start I think..
> 
> Could it be the m/b? I get no light in my optical mouse so I think that there is no power in the usb ports..


I dont think so, here is an unharmed 4670k:
http://images.bit-tech.net/content_images/2013/06/intel-core-i5-4670k-haswell-cpu-review/4670k-2-1280x1024.jpg

There is only one way to found out which one is dead, try the CPU out with a known good motherboard...


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> Hey guys,I need your help..I delided my 4790K today , and after i put everything together,I get no post,and after 5 sec a boot loop..I dont get any beeps cause i have no speaker on my mb,but here are some pics so that you can tell me if you see something wrong
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> any input will be highly appreciated...


1) As @jagdtigger said it looks like you chipped the edge of the PCB. From personal experience with my 3770k, this may or may not cause any issues. My 3770k had a pretty nasty chunk taken out of it and still worked/is working fine after a couple years. Could be a different story for you though.

2) Ensure there isn't any CLU on the transistors on the PCB; that is very important. Clear nail polish, liquid electrical tape, a thermal pad/tape...something covering them to prevent an unfortunate scenario is a worthwhile precaution.

3) How are the pins in your CPU socket looking? It is very easy to bend them when handling and setting the delidded CPU..I've done it and consequently ruined the motherboard. Using a flashlight of some sort shine it on the pins. At the right angle you will get a reflection off of all of the pins. You will have to look at it the socket from more than one direction because of how the pins are oriented. The reflection should be uniform...it will be pretty easy to tell if any are bent/broken.


----------



## mAs81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jagdtigger*
> 
> I dont think so, here is an unharmed 4670k:
> http://images.bit-tech.net/content_images/2013/06/intel-core-i5-4670k-haswell-cpu-review/4670k-2-1280x1024.jpg


I believe you might be right...Damn..I was extra careful when using the vice
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 1) As @jagdtigger
> said it looks like you chipped the edge of the PCB. From personal experience with my 3770k, this may or may not cause any issues. My 3770k had a pretty nasty chunk taken out of it and still worked/is working fine after a couple years. Could be a different story for you though.
> 2) Ensure there isn't any CLU on the transistors on the PCB; that is very important. Clear nail polish, liquid electrical tape, a thermal pad/tape...something covering them to prevent an unfortunate scenario is a worthwhile precaution.
> 3) How are the pins in your CPU socket looking? It is very easy to bend them when handling and setting the delidded CPU..I've done it and consequently ruined the motherboard. Using a flashlight of some sort shine it on the pins. At the right angle you will get a reflection off of all of the pins. You will have to look at it the socket from more than one direction because of how the pins are oriented. The reflection should be uniform...it will be pretty easy to tell if any are bent/broken.


1)Unfortunately it seems that in my case there are issues
2)I remounted the cpu several times and checked that out-there weren't any problems,as I said,I was extra careful..
3)The pins were the first thing I checked with a flashlight and magnifying glass - all is well..

Unfortunately,I have no other system that I can test it on,so I'll take it to a shop tomorrow where they'll check it out themselves and if it comes down to it I'll get a new cpu..If I'm extremely unlucky I'll have to get a new m/b too because the whole no power on the usb ports kinda baffles/scares me..

Damn it - I'm extremely unlucky,but on the other hand I just had to try because my temps were terrible..
I'd get 58-60c when running Malwarebytes & Microsoft Security and having OCN on the browser..That was really ridiculous , so I had to give it a go..

Thanks for your input guys,if something new occurs I'll post it here..


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> I believe you might be right...Damn..I was extra careful when using the vice
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 1)Unfortunately it seems that in my case there are issues
> 2)I remounted the cpu several times and checked that out-there weren't any problems,as I said,I was extra careful..
> 3)The pins were the first thing I checked with a flashlight and magnifying glass - all is well..
> 
> Unfortunately,I have no other system that I can test it on,so I'll take it to a shop tomorrow where they'll check it out themselves and if it comes down to it I'll get a new cpu..If I'm extremely unlucky I'll have to get a new m/b too because the whole no power on the usb ports kinda baffles/scares me..
> 
> Damn it - I'm extremely unlucky,but on the other hand I just had to try because my temps were terrible..
> I'd get 58-60c when running Malwarebytes & Microsoft Security and having OCN on the browser..That was really ridiculous , so I had to give it a go..
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for your input guys,if something new occurs I'll post it here..


Here's what my 3770k looked like. It's still chugging along currently...solid it to a friend and all is well AFAIK


----------



## mAs81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Here's what my 3770k looked like. It's still chugging along currently...solid it to a friend and all is well AFAIK


Well,it is similar to what I did..I hope that I can get it to work without having to get a new chip..This chips certainly sucks the big one,but having to buy a new one sucks even more









I mean look at how horrible it was when I opened it


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






The TIM was all over the place-no wonder my temps sucked


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> Well it is similar to what I did..I hope that I can get it to work without having to get a new chip..This chips certainly sucks the big one,but having to buy a new one sucks even more


I initially presumed the chip was junk...I threw it in the box, 'cuz I couldn't throw $300 in the garbage can...and went and bought a 4770k and motherboard.

Wasn't until like 6 months later when I was going to RMA a Z77 motherboard(PCIe issue) that I took the damaged 3770k and dropped it in just to see what would happen. To my surprise it fired right up without any issues whatsoever. I left the stock cooler on it, ran it at stock settings, and let it run Prime95 overnight. The temps weren't the best(peaked low 80s IIRC), but it didn't overheat and didn't shut off after nearly 10 hours with the stock cooler. Delid is a wonderful thing when it all goes smoothly.

Best of luck to you


----------



## mAs81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Delid is a wonderful thing when it all goes smoothly.


I wouldn't know







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Best of luck to you


Thank you - I really hope that it is salvageable..I guess I'll know for sure by the end of this week


----------



## rogergamer

I have a delidded 6600k here, but my motherboard died so I had to take it out and RMA the MB. I did not seal the IHS so when I removed the CPU, it came off. Do I need to reapply CLU? and is there a guide for sealing back the IHS? (with silicone glue?)

thanks


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rogergamer*
> 
> I have a delidded 6600k here, but my motherboard died so I had to take it out and RMA the MB. I did not seal the IHS so when I removed the CPU, it came off. Do I need to reapply CLU? and is there a guide for sealing back the IHS? (with silicone glue?)
> 
> thanks


As long as the application to the CPU die is still uniform you should be OK; If not just touch it up as necessary.

I've never glued one back on, but have been using thermal tape to hold the lid in place. This is considerably easier than trying to fiddle around with some sort of glue.


----------



## mAs81

I have some good news..
Apparently my delid was successful and the reason I got no post,was indeed the m/b








The guy at the shop I took it to said that he put the CPU on another m/b and it posted,but putting a different CPU in my m/b did not..

So I ordered from them a new m/b(Asus Gryphon Armored Edition) and now I only have to wait..

To tell you the truth I'm not entirely sure that I'm out of the woods yet,because just posting doesn't mean that the delid was successful-I'll still have to see how it'll perform under load,but things are looking good atm


----------



## Brohem0th

Fantastic news, gentlemen;

I damaged my 4790k delidding it using the vise method. Had tape on the vise, taped the chip in place, used a rubber mallet, yadda yadda yadda, it chipped the PCB. So I bought a G3258, and set my 300$ paperweight off to the side.

Purchased the tuning plan for it, waited a month, went out and bought some Permatex Gasket Maker (8$ USD for a gigantic tube of the stuff) and re-affixed the IHS to the PCB. Sent it in fully expecting it to get denied.

THEY APPROVED IT

THEY
APPROVED
IT

I wish I had taken more pictures, but the chip in the PCB was extremely noticeable, and there was extra gasket maker coming out of the sides of the IHS, and THEY APPROVED IT.

Even better, the replacement I'm getting is a BX806 batch, whereas my old one was a BX508 batch, so hopefully I might even be able to push it further.

Sadly, I have no current plans to delid this replacement, at least not until I've gotten in several playthroughs of Fallout 4.

Todd is Good, I am happy, fuark year


----------



## tatmMRKIV

delids throough sili lotto is always an option


----------



## Brohem0th

I had previously delidded a 4690k safely using the razor method, and did the same with the G3258 I got to replace my dead 4790k.

My mistake was using the vise method, an extremely dangerous method comparatively speaking, when I had already successfully done it once before with a razor blade.

If I ever do/need to delid my replacement, I will make sure and do it with either a razor blade or a plastic razor blade, such as these http://www.amazon.com/Plastic-Double-Edged-Blades-Scraper/dp/B004623NU2

My post was more about how insanely lucky I had gotten in getting a replacement issued and/or how Intel simply just doesn't give a damn anymore.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

yeah that is insanely lucky.

I dont think those plastic razors will work. I used the double sided shaving razors for my delids. I got a trace and its still perfect luckily though.
Personally I don't think I have theballs to do razor method again.

the stanleyrazors are too thick and the others are too thin and get deformed along the edge


----------



## Brohem0th

Both times I've done it with the razor method I've used the thicker drywall razors; the trick is, you're not cutting back and forth with it, you just push the razor in between the PCB and IHS through the adhesive. It requires a ton of force and also very fine motor control, because as soon as you feel it going in you have to back off the force.

My 4690k, I sliced my thumb open and bled all over the entire chip, and deformed the crap out of it. Still hit 5Ghz at 1.4v. Did the vise method as carefully as possible and chipped the PCB, insta-killed a 300$ CPU.

Razor method forever and always. But, if I can do 5Ghz at a low enough voltage and temp, I might not even delid the new one.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Both times I've done it with the razor method I've used the thicker drywall razors; the trick is, you're not cutting back and forth with it, you just push the razor in between the PCB and IHS through the adhesive. It requires a ton of force and also very fine motor control, because as soon as you feel it going in you have to back off the force.
> 
> My 4690k, I sliced my thumb open and bled all over the entire chip, and deformed the crap out of it. Still hit 5Ghz at 1.4v. Did the vise method as carefully as possible and chipped the PCB, insta-killed a 300$ CPU.
> 
> Razor method forever and always. But, if I can do 5Ghz at a low enough voltage and temp, I might not even delid the new one.


The razor method is the way to go imo.







When you get used to delidding that way you can sucessfully delid pretty much any chip regardless of whether it's soldered or pasted.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> I had previously delidded a 4690k safely using the razor method, and did the same with the G3258 I got to replace my dead 4790k.
> 
> My mistake was using the vise method, an extremely dangerous method comparatively speaking, when I had already successfully done it once before with a razor blade.
> 
> If I ever do/need to delid my replacement, I will make sure and do it with either a razor blade or a plastic razor blade, such as these http://www.amazon.com/Plastic-Double-Edged-Blades-Scraper/dp/B004623NU2
> 
> My post was more about how insanely lucky I had gotten in getting a replacement issued and/or how Intel simply just doesn't give a damn anymore.


Did you hit it with a hammer?


----------



## Brohem0th

I literally shed a tear when I found out I was getting a replacement chip in spite of the physical damage, and one that was one of the newest ones produced at that. Misty-eyed than a mug.

Should be here by the 12th, so in the event Fallout 4 won't run on my Pentium, I shouldn't have to wait too long. Life is good.


----------



## Brohem0th

Rubber mallet, lightly tapped it in a succession of quick taps. Not a *********.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Rubber mallet, lightly tapped it in a succession of quick taps. Not a *********.


I delidded a Core 2 Duo that way.

1. The CPU slipped out of the vice 2x
2. My wood broke before the CPU gave
3. I had to knock the hell out of it.

Just using the vice on my i5 worked great. 5 minutes tops and I was 100% sure it would post. (well, 99% sure)

I do find it ironic that use a hammer to improve a CPU though.


----------



## baii

Delidded my 3258 and 4770k these 2 day, a nick on th 4770k that see gold but luckily still works, the problem us the the ihs on the 3258 make the razor not longer straight and have place that was blunt.
anyways discover a great tool for razor method, a metro card. I only need to use the razor on one corner and the metro card is able to do the rest .

So any thin plastic card will work, no, not a credit card that won't work...


----------



## josephimports

New delidding tool developed by der8auer.


----------



## sav4

Good find now to see what it will cost .


----------



## Tim Drake

What should I use for my 4670k if I delid? Liquid Metal?

How would I apply the Liquid Metal and on average, how much can I expect temps to drop?


----------



## majnu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> New delidding tool developed by der8auer.


Der8auer has been answering questions on their child website Overclockers UK

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18701659


----------



## JbstormburstADV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *majnu*
> 
> Der8auer has been answering questions on their child website Overclockers UK
> 
> http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18701659


If this thing ends up in the US at about $10 a pop (the original price according to Der8auer will likely be 80 EUR per 20 units), this will definitely be something I'll be popping on rather than let Silicon Lottery take care of it.


----------



## IronAge

3D printable delidding tool for vice - probably a hammer would do as well.

looks like a pretty safe way too.

public domain or let sb print it for you via 3Dhubs.com

https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool


----------



## tatmMRKIV

if only I had a 3d printer. Roman's looks safer though.

I seriously want one.


----------



## IronAge

not sure how many CPU you want to delid ... but they ask about 90€ for the8aurs Delid Die Mate

way too much for my needs.

i would rather spend like 20€ inkl. shipping for SB to print that public domain tool.


----------



## alancsalt

der8auer Delid Die Mate

http://forum.hwbot.org/showthread.php?t=148622

word is spreading.


----------



## sav4

First part 3D printed going to give it a try as I'm in Australia ,so the metal one would take to long to get here if they even ship here .


----------



## IronAge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> First part 3D printed going to give it a try as I'm in Australia ,so the metal one would take to long to get here if they even ship here .


nice ... which material / additive you have been using ?

good luck fo the delid.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Anyone know if Phobya LM is better/worse than CLU? And is this good to use to cover the four contact pins on a 6700K: http://www.amazon.com/Gardner-Bender-LTB-400-4-Ounce-Electrical/dp/B000FPAN2K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1447448819&sr=8-1&keywords=liquid+electrical+tape


----------



## jdorje

http://overclocking.guide/thermal-paste-roundup-2015-47-products-tested-with-air-cooling-and-liquid-nitrogen-ln2/6/

In his numbers phobya lm is .13C better than clu.


----------



## majnu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JbstormburstADV*
> 
> If this thing ends up in the US at about $10 a pop (the original price according to Der8auer will likely be 80 EUR per 20 units), this will definitely be something I'll be popping on rather than let Silicon Lottery take care of it.


I can't see it being $10. Like he said 80euros was calculated based on 20 pieces. He is waiting for a price based on a decent quantity which should be in the thousands to bring it down to a justifiable price.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> First part 3D printed going to give it a try as I'm in Australia ,so the metal one would take to long to get here if they even ship here .


I can ask on overclockers uk if he will supply to Australia, since I am registered there.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Anyone know if Phobya LM is better/worse than CLU? And is this good to use to cover the four contact pins on a 6700K: http://www.amazon.com/Gardner-Bender-LTB-400-4-Ounce-Electrical/dp/B000FPAN2K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1447448819&sr=8-1&keywords=liquid+electrical+tape


Don't know if it's any better, but CLU is very easy to work with and gives amazing results.

Liquid electrical tape is just fine.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Don't know if it's any better, but CLU is very easy to work with and gives amazing results.
> 
> Liquid electrical tape is just fine.


Thanks, I'll just get CLU since someone had some bad luck with Phobya here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/100_20#post_20492214


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Thanks, I'll just get CLU since someone had some bad luck with Phobya here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/100_20#post_20492214


It is hard to beat honestly. Just remember you are working with liquid metal and can cause damage to other components if you get it where it's not supposed to be. Put the LET down first and apply your CLU to the CPU out of the motherboard.

Less is more with CLU. Get just a tiny bit on the application brush and spread it as far as you can and as thinly as possible; you only need a very small coat. Take a look at the pic of my 4770k in my build log post here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1478544/the-build-formerly-known-as-the-devil-inside-a-gaming-htpc-for-my-wife-4770k-corsair-250d-powercolor-r9-290/40_20#post_22522081

If you have some thermal tape lying around you can also use that to cover the transistors on the CPU. This serves dual purpose of covering them from harm and holding the CPU lid in place when latching the CPU down.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Anyone know if Phobya LM is better/worse than CLU? And is this good to use to cover the four contact pins on a 6700K: http://www.amazon.com/Gardner-Bender-LTB-400-4-Ounce-Electrical/dp/B000FPAN2K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1447448819&sr=8-1&keywords=liquid+electrical+tape


That ELT is exactly what I used and it's some pretty good stuff!


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronAge*
> 
> nice ... which material / additive you have been using ?
> 
> good luck fo the delid.


Pla . I am waiting on some clu then it's all go


----------



## MarcusFoX

I have a couple of i7 920's sitting around and I was wonder if anyone has any tips on Delidding these guys.

I have heard they may be soldiered is this true?? any tips from someone who has done this before would be helpful.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MarcusFoX*
> 
> I have a couple of i7 920's sitting around and I was wonder if anyone has any tips on Delidding these guys.
> 
> I have heard they may be soldiered is this true?? any tips from someone who has done this before would be helpful.


Has to be melted off.
The only way to gain anything by removing a soldered IHS is to water cool the die directly.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MarcusFoX*
> 
> I have a couple of i7 920's sitting around and I was wonder if anyone has any tips on Delidding these guys.
> 
> I have heard they may be soldiered is this true?? any tips from someone who has done this before would be helpful.


They are indeed soldered.

This is the process I used to delid my X5670 (also soldered);
#1 Use a sharp razor blade to cut the silicone that holds the IHS on, keep in mind where the resistors are on the PCB so you don't hit any.
#2 Carefully wedge a thin razor blade between the PCB and IHS on all four sides.
#3 Construct some sort of support to suspend the chip IHS side down by the razor blades. Ex. A square cut into some card board is what I used for my X5670.
#4 Take a blowtorch (on low flame) or a good lighter and slowly move it around in a circular motion on the IHS until it pops off.
#5 Grab a fresh razor and use it to scrape all the solder off of the die and IHS.
#6 Use an insulator (Ex. LET, or what I used, Enamel model paint) to cover the resistors on the PCB.
#7 Apply CLU or your thermal compound of choice on the die, making sure the entire surface is covered evenly.

That's all there is to it. Pretty simple actually.


----------



## MarcusFoX

Hi guys,

Thanks for the quick responses here. Dragoon this is the exact process I thought I would have to do to delid one of these puppys. There is a video out on you tube that shows the exact process to remove the IHS from a I7 960 and the IHS just popped off.

When I was sitting here brain storming what to do this is the exactly process I thought up before I decided to ask for help:

- Removing all the silicon glue from around the outside of the IHS with razors or a exacto knife.

- Put rubber wedges on either side of the cpu in a vice and clamp it down tight enough just to hold to cpu without damaging it.

- then take a BBQ lighter and heat the IHS up doing circle as dragoon has suggested and the IHS should pop off as I understand correct??.

- clean cpu glue off with finger nail and rubbing alcohol, possibly a dremel to buff chip surfaces.

I never though about the resistors under neither I'm glad I asked " so thank you Dragoon" I would hae never thought to insulate them or even thought they were even under the IHS so ill have to be careful about those not to stick the razor in to far.

You say model paint is the best for this right??, I got some acrylic clear coat sitting around I wonder if that would be any good for this??.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MarcusFoX*
> 
> Hi guys,
> 
> Thanks for the quick responses here. Dragoon this is the exact process I thought I would have to do to delid one of these puppys. There is a video out on you tube that shows the exact process to remove the IHS from a I7 960 and the IHS just popped off.
> 
> When I was sitting here brain storming what to do this is the exactly process I thought up before I decided to ask for help:
> 
> - Removing all the silicon glue from around the outside of the IHS with razors or a exacto knife.
> 
> - Put rubber wedges on either side of the cpu in a vice and clamp it down tight enough just to hold to cpu without damaging it.
> 
> - then take a BBQ lighter and heat the IHS up doing circle as dragoon has suggested and the IHS should pop off as I understand correct??.
> 
> - clean cpu glue off with finger nail and rubbing alcohol, possibly a dremel to buff chip surfaces.
> 
> I never though about the resistors under neither I'm glad I asked " so thank you Dragoon" I would hae never thought to insulate them or even thought they were even under the IHS so ill have to be careful about those not to stick the razor in to far.
> 
> You say model paint is the best for this right??, I got some acrylic clear coat sitting around I wonder if that would be any good for this??.


That acrylic clear coat would work great, I just used enamel paint because I don't have much use for the stuff. Nail polish is good as well.

Here's a pic of mine just after it was delidded so you can see where the resistors are,


Honestly though, if your chip already get's good temps it's not worth it at all. I only did it on my X5670 because it had a very bad solder application from the factory which made one core run 20-30c hotter than the rest.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xxdarkreap3rxx*
> 
> Thanks, I'll just get CLU since someone had some bad luck with Phobya here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/100_20#post_20492214


CLU wasn't easy to find with fast shipping so I went with Phobya. Did find some more tests here: http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f136/grosser-wlp-test-inkl-fluessigmetall-761920.html


----------



## Tim Drake

What should I use for my 4670k if I delid? Liquid Metal?

How would I apply the Liquid Metal and on average, how much can I expect temps to drop?


----------



## white owl

You should read the OP more thoroughly.
I'm not being an ass, but the answer is best explained in the OP.


----------



## Tim Drake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> You should read the OP more thoroughly.
> I'm not being an ass, but the answer is best explained in the OP.


I have always preferred a more personalized answer as to just reading something that was intended for me at all.

I read OP already but it does not help me MUCH.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tim Drake*
> 
> I have always preferred a more personalized answer as to just reading something that was intended for me at all.
> 
> I read OP already but it does not help me MUCH.


As it's been asked and answered multiple times in this thread, liquid metal is the best type of TIM to use between the die and the IHS. The application for liquid metal TIMs will be the same for your chip as it is for everyone else's - use a small amount and spread...."Less is more" is the thing to keep in mind....


----------



## Tim Drake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> As it's been asked and answered multiple times in this thread, liquid metal is the best type of TIM to use between the die and the IHS. The application for liquid metal TIMs will be the same for your chip as it is for everyone else's - use a small amount and spread...."Less is more" is the thing to keep in mind....


Is it fine for 24/7?


----------



## blaze2210

I'm not sure what you're asking there....The liquid metal is going to be on your CPU 24/7 unless you obsessively clean it off - which there's absolutely no good reason to do, since it doesn't really dry out if applied correctly. It would be a good idea to go looking through, or searching through (using the "Search this thread" function), the posts in this thread. There is a bunch of info in here, it would be a waste to ignore it.


----------



## Tim Drake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I'm not sure what you're asking there....The liquid metal is going to be on your CPU 24/7 unless you obsessively clean it off - which there's absolutely no good reason to do, since it doesn't really dry out if applied correctly. It would be a good idea to go looking through, or searching through (using the "Search this thread" function), the posts in this thread. There is a bunch of info in here, it would be a waste to ignore it.


Wow! I only just found out that this existed..

I saw some posts from 2-3 pages back talking about it causing problems after a year or something.

Maybe I misread.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tim Drake*
> 
> Wow! I only just found out that this existed..
> 
> I saw some posts from 2-3 pages back talking about it causing problems after a year or something.
> 
> Maybe I misread.


If you're new to this and are considering delidding, then it's really in your best interest to educate yourself a little on the different delidding processes, potential dangers, and items that would be used for the process. All of that info is here....Trust me, I have a 4670K that I delidded, and the posts in this thread are where I got the vast majority of my info on delidding.









The liquid metal that dried out was likely a bad batch, or an improper application. After over a year of being on my delidded 4670K's die, the CLP was still a nice and shiny liquid when I pulled off the IHS out of sheer curiosity. I wasn't getting bad temps, I was just curious....


----------



## Tim Drake

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you're new to this and are considering delidding, then it's really in your best interest to educate yourself a little on the different delidding processes, potential dangers, and items that would be used for the process. All of that info is here....Trust me, I have a 4670K that I delidded, and the posts in this thread are where I got the vast majority of my info on delidding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The liquid metal that dried out was likely a bad batch, or an improper application. After over a year of being on my delidded 4670K's die, the CLP was still a nice and shiny liquid when I pulled off the IHS out of sheer curiosity. I wasn't getting bad temps, I was just curious....


I was just thinking of buying the Die Mate but it seems quite expensive..

I could offer a delidding service to pay for those costs but I live in Northern Ireland and i'm not comfortable with possibly breaking someones CPU


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tim Drake*
> 
> I was just thinking of buying the Die Mate but it seems quite expensive..
> 
> I could offer a delidding service to pay for those costs but I live in Northern Ireland and i'm not comfortable with possibly breaking someones CPU


I agree. This actually leads into why I never made a product to delid a cpu, I have the ability but never did for worry that someone uses it and breaks their chip.

No matter how safe or bullet proof it is, something will happen, always does.

The OP (aka, dis guy writing) is meant to be fairly low key and give you tons of info, yes it's long and it's boring but it answers almost everything that's needed. We aren't trying to ignore you or anything, but it's there and the options for you as well.

If you want it to be personal response thats fine, just read up a bit and we'll eb more than happy to get you further with your questions


----------



## CiASpook

Hi,

so I decided to delid my i7-4790S. I might have FUBARed it.

Seems like I managed to cut of one or two of the capacitors on the top.

Anyone know if it will still work or should I just order a new one straight away?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tim Drake*
> 
> What should I use for my 4670k if I delid? Liquid Metal?
> 
> How would I apply the Liquid Metal and on average, how much can I expect temps to drop?


Clu would be the #1 choice, followed by clp or plm.


----------



## Hobbsmeerkat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CiASpook*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> so I decided to delid my i7-4790S. I might have FUBARed it.
> 
> Seems like I managed to cut of one or two of the capacitors on the top.
> 
> Anyone know if it will still work or should I just order a new one straight away?


I lost the top 2 capacitors on my 4770K when I delidded around 20 months ago, and I've been fine. Even w/ a 4.4Ghz OC

So it's definitely worth testing before buying a new one.


----------



## chronicfx

@Tim Drake I just delidded my 6700k and gained 25°c, using CLU on the die and XSPC K1 on the IHS. You should use a very very small amount of CLU, I do not even apply it from the syringe to the DIE directly, just get the Liquid metal to peek out of the syringe and just touch it with the brush to get just a small dab on there. That should be plenty, you have to just keep brushing and brushing but the liquid metal will stretch further than you think. A thin application is best. Do the same to the bottom of the IHS in the area that will contact the DIE if you wish. You may then use regular paste for the IHS, Good luck!


----------



## maynard14

hi guys, i recently downgraded my h105 to h80i cooler , my 4770k is delided, with h105 while playing gta v my max tempos are 65c and with h80 gta v max temp is 75c ,.. is this normal?


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IronAge*
> 
> 3D printable delidding tool for vice - probably a hammer would do as well.
> 
> looks like a pretty safe way too.
> 
> public domain or let sb print it for you via 3Dhubs.com
> 
> https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool


Looks good to me, could anyone comment on what options I should pick on 3DHubs to get a working print?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> First part 3D printed going to give it a try as I'm in Australia ,so the metal one would take to long to get here if they even ship here .


Let us know how you get on!


----------



## Tim Drake

Does delidding help your overclocking chances by a lot or is it a silicon lottery kind of thing?

As I want to start benching when I get the H220 for my CPU


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tim Drake*
> 
> Does delidding help your overclocking chances by a lot or is it a silicon lottery kind of thing?
> 
> As I want to start benching when I get the H220 for my CPU


Lottery mostly although with delidding you may be able to achieve lower temperatures + lower voltages which could assist in increasing your OC but it won't be by "a lot".


----------



## Mech0z

Anyone know how much OC headroom it can give to do delid on Air / Water with Skylake?


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Looks good to me, could anyone comment on what options I should pick on 3DHubs to get a working print?
> Let us know how you get on!


Not sure dude we use the blender program and the supplied file don't think we had to change anything.
What options are you concerned about ?


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Not sure dude we use the blender program and the supplied file don't think we had to change anything.
> What options are you concerned about ?


Thanks for the reply. The original poster of the files states the tolerances need to be tight in order to work correctly - so what 3d printers are able to handle that? All of them? Certain models?

Also some of the 3dHubs seem to list different materials and ask you to pick the size of _something_ in microns.

So yeah not quite so straightforward to someone who has never been near a 3d printer, but I am seeing some very reasonable quotes so that's promising.

What printer / material / micron thingy did you guys use and was it successful?


----------



## sav4

I used my mates printer that he made , all of the setup was done prior and he doesn't adj it unless something is off .
Most printers should handle it , the 2 pieces are very snug so no twisting or bending can occur
For reference it cost $1 in materials , I'm waiting on some clu then will give it a go


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> hi guys, i recently downgraded my h105 to h80i cooler , my 4770k is delided, with h105 while playing gta v my max tempos are 65c and with h80 gta v max temp is 75c ,.. is this normal?


That would make sense, going from a dual 120 or dual 140 to a single thicker 120 is a big thermal output change. Compare it to this, you are driving down the road and it's 100F in your car, you roll one window down and it doesn't put much wind into your car. You open two windows and it moves air around pretty quickly dropping the temp fast. Might be a bad analogy but makes sense to my crazy brain








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mech0z*
> 
> Anyone know how much OC headroom it can give to do delid on Air / Water with Skylake?


I've seen people go up by 500 Mhz for an overclock thanks to the temp drops for the temp overhead they had originally. When delidding the voltage needed for anything will almost always never change, but it might "might" move just a smidge.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> I used my mates printer that he made , all of the setup was done prior and he doesn't adj it unless something is off .
> Most printers should handle it , the 2 pieces are very snug so no twisting or bending can occur
> For reference it cost $1 in materials , I'm waiting on some clu then will give it a go


What exact 3D printer question is everyone having?

I have a 3D printer and own a 3D printing business, I can also help make a design if people would like one. I have some software that will be far better than the normal free stuff. PM me or what not to grab my attention


----------



## zootielolo

I just recieved mine today. Should note that i used makexyz for mine and went with ABS, as i read that it is stronger than PLA. Cost 25 shipped. The designs have VERY tight tolerances. I had to sand the edges of the white piece for a while so that they would fit together. I sanded them on a cast iron table saw table to ensure they would remain flat. After they would fit together snugly but not get caught, I decided to try them out with my 6700k. I used a small piece of packing foam inside the pink piece. Again, getting the 6700k into the white tray took a bit of finessing, and i had to apply a bit of pressure to get it to "click in" I then used a small vice and started the process. After feeling the lid slip, I backed the vice off, took the cpu out, and everything looked great. Pics Below.


----------



## sav4

Cool well done ?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> hi guys, i recently downgraded my h105 to h80i cooler , my 4770k is delided, with h105 while playing gta v my max tempos are 65c and with h80 gta v max temp is 75c ,.. is this normal?


May be hard to test but, if you go from idle to just a few seconds of load is the temp higher with the h80i? Radiator shouldn't affect that; it's all on the cpu block. I don't think h80i should have a worse block than h105.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> May be hard to test but, if you go from idle to just a few seconds of load is the temp higher with the h80i? Radiator shouldn't affect that; it's all on the cpu block. I don't think h80i should have a worse block than h105.


They all have the same block and pump, the only difference is the amount of heat delta the radiator can handle, which depends on the size.


----------



## zootielolo

Thought I would follow up with my results. Prior to delid, I was getting temperatures around 82 average and up to 84 when running prime 95 small fft @ 1.37 volts. New numbers are about 16-20 C c
ooler. As a note, I currently am waiting for coollaboratory liquid ultra, so I used gelid extreme for ihs and for water cooling block. I did not glue the IHS back on; just used the socket clamp to hold in place. Pic below is for running for approx 5-10 min, should be in picture.


----------



## aayman_farzand

Big noob here but I managed to join the club now. I used the Vice-only method. My Vice had jaws so I got some indents on the IHS.

3770K @4.4ghz 1.2v
Kuhler 620 with MX-2

Original setup:
Temps: 88-90 eventually BSOD in P95 Small FFT test

New setup:
Delidded with Noctua NT-H1
Temps 78-81 in P95 Small FFT test and stable.

I didn't have any alcohol to clean it with, maybe it will drop lower if I did. I removed what I could using a microfiber cloth, the die is shiny but the IHS was not completely clean.

Waiting on Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and ArcticClean to apply between IHS and die and then attempt for 4.8-5.0ghz.

Quick question, should I use CLU in between IHS and the cooler? I read in various places that CLU needs to solidify and form a bond for it to maintain its effectiveness.

I moved around my desktop sometimes, so thinking about using NT-H1 for the cooler-IHS instead. I want a apply-and-forget setup, which one is going to be the best option?


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zootielolo*
> 
> I just recieved mine today. Should note that i used makexyz for mine and went with ABS, as i read that it is stronger than PLA. Cost 25 shipped. The designs have VERY tight tolerances. I had to sand the edges of the white piece for a while so that they would fit together. I sanded them on a cast iron table saw table to ensure they would remain flat. After they would fit together snugly but not get caught, I decided to try them out with my 6700k. I used a small piece of packing foam inside the pink piece. Again, getting the 6700k into the white tray took a bit of finessing, and i had to apply a bit of pressure to get it to "click in" I then used a small vice and started the process. After feeling the lid slip, I backed the vice off, took the cpu out, and everything looked great. Pics Below.


Great stuff, can I ask - do you know what "infill rate" they printed it with?

I forgot to ask, is it sturdy enough to do multiple delids? It would be great to have a few constantly being passed around between members.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> I forgot to ask, is it sturdy enough to do multiple delids? It would be great to have a few constantly being passed around between members.


It better be. People were 3d printing firearms that could get through 30 rounds before breaking. Would be a shame if these only lasted one or two delids.


----------



## zootielolo

I am not sure about the infill rate, makexyz does not have that as a standard option for editing, but I am sure you could specify it in the request box. The unit is definitely sturdy enough to do multiple lids; the only sign of use is from me using lineman pliers to grip and remove the white tray several times when i was adjust the fit. As i mentioned previously, the pieces as printed are too tight/dont fit and the first 5 times or so putting together I had to put the lid (pink piece) in a vice and pull on the tray with linemans pliers to get it to come out. Even with that rough treatment, the tray has almost no noticeable marks from the pliers, and absolutely no markings from actually using it.


----------



## Ized

That sounds promising









Hopefully my delid tool arrives next week.


----------



## $ilent

Evening all

Im lookng to trade my 4.7Ghz @ 1.300 v delidded 4790k for a 4670k or 4690k. I have a listing up here on OCN for a few days before Ill put it up on ebay. Please PM me if interested or check out the listing here - http://www.overclock.net/t/1581074/uk-f-t-my-delidded-4790k-for-your-4670k-cash/0_100

Thanks


----------



## Sin0822

I 3D printed mine (I have a printer), you paid $25? wow

Printed the delider linked from another thread


----------



## zootielolo

Ya I printed the same one, the problem is I dont have a printer nor do I know someone who can print so I had to order it through makexyz. Since the design is two parts, and the minimum charge on makexyz is 12 per piece, it was about 25. Not too concerned, as it will work for several cpu's, and I still ended up saving money after printing the part. What printer do you have? I am thinking about buying one. Did you have to sand it to make it fit?


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zootielolo*
> 
> Ya I printed the same one, the problem is I dont have a printer nor do I know someone who can print so I had to order it through makexyz. Since the design is two parts, and the minimum charge on makexyz is 12 per piece, it was about 25. Not too concerned, as it will work for several cpu's, and I still ended up saving money after printing the part. What printer do you have? I am thinking about buying one. Did you have to sand it to make it fit?


yea totally understandable, just interesting, never knew how much those places charge.

I have a davinici 1.0, it prints high quality, but it costs $500 b/c you have to use it's proprietary filament (like the HP Ink model). I don't mind it since I don't print that many things, and I don't mind paying a little extra every-time as it's kind of cool having the filament digitally logged (you know how much is left). It was definitely the best value I could find, and now they have one that is unlocked but costs $700.

I did have to sand a tiny bit, the piece would go in, but it wouldn't come out! lol so I had to use a wired size screw driver to leverage the hole and pull it out. After sanding a little bit it works perfectly.


----------



## chronicfx

Kind of glad I did not see this de-lid tool first. Saved a few $ doing it the old fashioned way.


----------



## Sin0822

haha well it didn't cost me that much haha


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> haha well it didn't cost me that much haha


I would like to buy a 3d printed delidding tool, the specific model you used, to delid a 4790k. Can you get me one, what would you charge, and where would it ship from? I'm in Texas and it doesn't have to be here any time soon.

Please and thank you


----------



## sav4

Yer mine cost me $1 in material to print .
You can get most stuff to build a printer for about 150-200 dollars that will do most stuff 250mmx250x250 in size.
One thing that would come in handy to use with this is a mould for gluing the lid back on in the correct position.


----------



## Ized

My 3dprinted tool cost just a touch under £10 delivered from 3dhubs.com, excited to see how it turns out.


----------



## gopanthersgo1

Question, has anyone made/would anyone make the 3D printable delidding tool available for Ivy Bridge?


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gopanthersgo1*
> 
> Question, has anyone made/would anyone make the 3D printable delidding tool available for Ivy Bridge?


I am designing one now for skylake (one of my own design, but similar in function to the one in this thread), I can see if I can change the fittings to also fit ivy bridge


----------



## Ized

Sorry misread









Anyhow my ABS print arrived in the post but it was warped/all bent up


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Sorry misread
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyhow my ABS print arrived in the post but it was warped/all bent up


ABS is to squishy in my usage of it with my clients. PLA is far more rigid and seems to hold far better.

However, I bet that during shipping the package got warm and caused the print to flex more than was planned making it do that. PLA will do this as well, shipping prints is hard to tackle.


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> ABS is to squishy in my usage of it with my clients. PLA is far more rigid and seems to hold far better.
> 
> However, I bet that during shipping the package got warm and caused the print to flex more than was planned making it do that. PLA will do this as well, shipping prints is hard to tackle.


ABS is the same materials they use in legos. It's not supposed to be squishy, and it's less flexible than PLA.


----------



## sav4

i did mine in pla and its stiff as no flex whatsoever


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> They all have the same block and pump, the only difference is the amount of heat delta the radiator can handle, which depends on the size.


i think your right sir, its about the rad size, i recently move my pc to s340 and delided my 4790k @1.24 volts 4.6 ghz and using clp on the die with h80i max temp at playing gta v is 79c! its annoying and im not satisfied with the result, already tried to triple check my mounting brackets of the h80i, the stand off and the screws, they all look normal and there is no gap, but the pump is 2300 plus rpm but still giving me 79c load whil e playing

dont know what to do next haha maybe ill just dump the h80i and buy a h110i gt


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> i think your right sir, its about the rad size, i recently move my pc to s340 and delided my 4790k @1.24 volts 4.6 ghz and using clp on the die with h80i max temp at playing gta v is 79c! its annoying and im not satisfied with the result, already tried to triple check my mounting brackets of the h80i, the stand off and the screws, they all look normal and there is no gap, but the pump is 2300 plus rpm but still giving me 79c load whil e playing
> 
> dont know what to do next haha maybe ill just dump the h80i and buy a h110i gt


I would do that


----------



## feznz

some interesting reading here

http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> some interesting reading here
> 
> http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/


Dang, you beat me to it....I was just about to post this....


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Dang, you beat me to it....I was just about to post this....


Here I will give you guys gold: http://iweb.tms.org/PbF/JOM-0606-67.pdf

That link is the paper where he gets a lot of the pics, and it has more info if you are interested.


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> ABS is the same materials they use in legos. It's not supposed to be squishy, and it's less flexible than PLA.


Having now held both a (unusable / warped) ABS print and PLA print they each _feel_ up to the job. Very stiff feeling, no flex etc. Would you agree either materials should be suitable?

I would rather not rip my system apart only to find PLA wasn't up to the job.


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Having now held both a (unusable / warped) ABS print and PLA print they each _feel_ up to the job. Very stiff feeling, no flex etc. Would you agree either materials should be suitable?
> 
> I would rather not rip my system apart only to find PLA wasn't up to the job.


I would think both could do the job, I have only worked with the ABS version and I know it does the job. I thought you already printed one?


----------



## Ized

Not yet tested the one I bought.

What do you think about a trying to clone this "Die Guard" by MSI:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Not yet tested the one I bought.
> 
> What do you think about a trying to clone this "Die Guard" by MSI:


this would be very easy to make, the only issue would be how thick do we keep it to maintain some sort of strength to the print, a print that thin will also be quite hard to ship.


----------



## DR4G00N

How well does CLU react with the cold (Ex. -70c)?


----------



## der8auer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> How well does CLU react with the cold (Ex. -70c)?


It solidifies at around 10 °C and the contact will be quite bad. Performance sucks subzero.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *der8auer*
> 
> It solidifies at around 10 °C and the contact will be quite bad. Performance sucks subzero.


Ah, that's unfortunate.







But kind of expected because of the gallium. Oh well, I guess that gives me a reason to buy an X5687 and try for 5.5GHz.


----------



## xxdarkreap3rxx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Not yet tested the one I bought.
> 
> What do you think about a trying to clone this "Die Guard" by MSI:


Would have to be very precise as people here have complained that direct die sucks with skylake since the PCB bends and loses some contact with the pins.


----------



## Ized

Hurrah. A quick and dirty mount suggests that I didn't kill my CPU and reminds me to shoot whoever designed the mounting system on my cooler.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *der8auer*
> 
> It solidifies at around 10 °C and the contact will be quite bad. Performance sucks subzero.


Any idea what the per unit price would be for the delid tool you designed? I've got a couple of the 3d printed models, but I'd like one of yours to use at the shop I work at, I trust the printed ones but for work and professional purposes I'd rather have something made of metal.


----------



## jdorje

Yeah seriously, how much to ship one of these (either printed or metal)?


----------



## Ized

Having some problems since I tore down my sucessful test build and remounted into my case.

Using the onboard intel GPU, Windows device manager says code 34 hardware reported error. It will only provide video over VGA. Dvi/hdmi are dead.

Meanwhile my actual graphics card doesn't even show up in device manager, never mind providing video out. Oddly there is traces of the card inside aida64

Sounds vaguely familiar.. But for whatever reason the overclock.net search button wont work on my phone!

What do you guys reckon? Im hoping perhaps the IHS moved during my rebuild causing some short or something. I used the 3dprint delid tool so no twitchy razor blade cuts on the cpu.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Having some problems since I tore down my sucessful test build and remounted into my case.
> 
> Using the onboard intel GPU, Windows device manager says code 34 hardware reported error. It will only provide video over VGA. Dvi/hdmi are dead.
> 
> Meanwhile my actual graphics card doesn't even show up in device manager, never mind providing video out. Oddly there is traces of the card inside aida64
> 
> Sounds vaguely familiar.. But for whatever reason the overclock.net search button wont work on my phone!
> 
> What do you guys reckon? Im hoping perhaps the IHS moved during my rebuild causing some short or something. I used the 3dprint delid tool so no twitchy razor blade cuts on the cpu.


What socket are you using?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Having some problems since I tore down my sucessful test build and remounted into my case.
> 
> Using the onboard intel GPU, Windows device manager says code 34 hardware reported error. It will only provide video over VGA. Dvi/hdmi are dead.
> 
> Meanwhile my actual graphics card doesn't even show up in device manager, never mind providing video out. Oddly there is traces of the card inside aida64
> 
> Sounds vaguely familiar.. But for whatever reason the overclock.net search button wont work on my phone!
> 
> What do you guys reckon? Im hoping perhaps the IHS moved during my rebuild causing some short or something. I used the 3dprint delid tool so no twitchy razor blade cuts on the cpu.


Double check all the basics...especially everything you disconnected/reconnected when you moved it.

Something had to change when the motherboard was moved.


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> What socket are you using?


It is a 4790k, socket 1150.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Double check all the basics...especially everything you disconnected/reconnected when you moved it.
> 
> Something had to change when the motherboard was moved.


Yes of course I will. Just asking for peoples thoughts.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> It is a 4790k, socket 1150.
> Yes of course I will. Just asking for peoples thoughts.


Go get a g3258. It's the same socket and its $50. If you have the same issues it's not the cpu and its possible the mobo was damaged somehow. If you don't get those issues anymore then it's the cpu. Simple test.

You can go back and return the g3258 if you want after you test the socket.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> It is a 4790k, socket 1150.
> Yes of course I will. Just asking for peoples thoughts.


Did you remove the heatsink and IHS and re-seat the CPU when you moved it? If this is the case, only thing I can think of is potentially bent pins in the socket.

Otherwise, it is likely something simple. Try re-seating the GPU and RAM, and make sure the slots are clear of any dust/hair/debris. I've had this fix some very strange issues for me on several occasions.


----------



## Ized

I had moved/reseated everything but memory during my test build. My test build just used regular thermal paste under the IHS. Everything was fine.

I then moved to CLU and started the rebuild inside my case. Reseated everything but the CPU 400times (it feels like trying) to resolve the issue.

Fingers crossed reseating the CPU cures the issue then, I have put it off because I don't have a clue how the CLU will react.

Should I reapply the CLU? How does one clean it off..

Thanks for the input guys.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> I had moved/reseated everything but memory during my test build. My test build just used regular thermal paste under the IHS. Everything was fine.
> 
> I then moved to CLU and started the rebuild inside my case. Reseated everything but the CPU 400times (it feels like trying) to resolve the issue.
> 
> Fingers crossed reseating the CPU cures the issue then, I have put it off because I don't have a clue how the CLU will react.
> 
> Should I reapply the CLU? How does one clean it off..
> 
> Thanks for the input guys.


if your application is fresh, dont redo it, just leave the IHS on it and carefully remove it. Check pins and then re seat and hope!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> I had moved/reseated everything but memory during my test build. My test build just used regular thermal paste under the IHS. Everything was fine.
> 
> I then moved to CLU and started the rebuild inside my case. Reseated everything but the CPU 400times (it feels like trying) to resolve the issue.
> 
> Fingers crossed reseating the CPU cures the issue then, I have put it off because I don't have a clue how the CLU will react.
> 
> Should I reapply the CLU? How does one clean it off..
> 
> Thanks for the input guys.


Dude just get another cpu to test it out. If everything is restored that's your answer. Otherwise it's something else and you can return the cpu.

You can clean the clu using alcohol.


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Dude just get another cpu to test it out. If everything is restored that's your answer. Otherwise it's something else and you can return the cpu.
> 
> You can clean the clu using alcohol.


Dude..

Just forgive me for making casual conversation and gaining insight into the situation until I get the chance to work on it again.

Relax









If I threw money at spare parts everytime I had a computer problem i'd end up with a few dozen computers..per week. Or as many returns.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

I apologize if I came off impatient. It was lost in text translation lol

What have you tried doing so far? Reseating the cpu/gpu I imagine?

If it's not one of the socket pins it could be a path on the mobo that got damaged. Any chance you have a spare motherboard? Otherwise it could be Windows.

Also I was recommending the g3258 because it's a simple and relatively cheap way to rule out the cpu as the cause of error.

Just my 2c


----------



## Ized

Well I too am sorry for being grumpy, group hug?









So it would seem that pin PEG_RXP11 (g4) in the CPU socket is every so slightly damaged. Its so minor I can barely see it and I cant capture it on camera.

The PEG seems to stand for PCI Express Graphics according to google (someone correct me). If thats true then it matches up with my problems.

How this happened I don't know, I guess It didn't happen on its own so that leaves me.


----------



## Ized

Best picture I could get. The pin is peeking forward ever so slightly.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Well in that case you have a choice. Get a new mobo or try to fix. Most manufacturers won't rma socket damage.

Ideally you want to get something very small and thin. Do it in a very well lit area with a small sewing needle being extremely careful not up touch the other pins.

From personal exp I can tell you that if it's just one or two you're good but if it ends up being more it's problematic. Also I wouldn't continue trying to run the cpu in that socket until you fix it bc there are some people that say that it can burn your cpu.


----------



## Ized

I cant establish what is actually wrong with the pin for sure.

From a distance it just looks "different", up close it just blends in.

Perhaps it was crushed downwards.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> I cant establish what is actually wrong with the pin for sure.
> 
> From a distance it just looks "different", up close it just blends in.
> 
> Perhaps it was crushed downwards.


If that's the case you can just tease the one pin with a needle until it comes back up like the rest. Just be careful not to touch any other pins.


----------



## Ized

I thankyou for the help but its still unclear what state the pin is in. It looks perfect one moment then slightly off the next. Im even using a magnifying glass and it is still total guess work.

I put a tiny bit of ink on the end of the pin and some masking tape on the CPU, the ink transfered to the correct spot on the masking tape yet my problems remain.

I guess I need a better way to check if its lined up correctly or not. Otherwise the pin is just going to snap off with all of my adjustments.

Rapidly approaching spare parts time!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> I thankyou for the help but its still unclear what state the pin is in. It looks perfect one moment then slightly off the next. Im even using a magnifying glass and it is still total guess work.
> 
> I put a tiny bit of ink on the end of the pin and some masking tape on the CPU, the ink transfered to the correct spot on the masking tape yet my problems remain.
> 
> I guess I need a better way to check if its lined up correctly or not. Otherwise the pin is just going to snap off with all of my adjustments.
> 
> Rapidly approaching spare parts time!


Is there any chance you might've scratched the board during the move?
Usually you'd be able to notice a bent pin. It would look different. Yea def don't touch it too much or it could snap.


----------



## Ized

..it does look different, thats what I have been saying. It was just very hard to figure out why it is different and in what way to adjust it to fix things.

Ive got square eyes after hours of poking the thing with a pin.

But finally some success. Onboard graphics now works again! A old retired PCIe graphics card also now works.

My main graphics card also finally shows up in device manager but GPU-Z reads all its stats as gibberish - bios corruption it says. Atiflash also says the card contains no Bios..

Pretty interesting if the pin situation somehow damaged the graphics card / *both* of its bioses.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> ..it does look different, thats what I have been saying. It was just very hard to figure out why it is different and in what way to adjust it to fix things.
> 
> Ive got square eyes after hours of poking the thing with a pin.
> 
> But finally some success. Onboard graphics now works again! A old retired PCIe graphics card also now works.
> 
> My main graphics card also finally shows up in device manager but GPU-Z reads all its stats as gibberish - bios corruption it says. Atiflash also says the card contains no Bios..
> 
> Pretty interesting if the pin situation somehow damaged the graphics card / *both* of its bioses.


That would make sense that it would be a critical pin perhaps causing a screwd up pic lane config.


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> ..it does look different, thats what I have been saying. It was just very hard to figure out why it is different and in what way to adjust it to fix things.
> 
> Ive got square eyes after hours of poking the thing with a pin.
> 
> But finally some success. Onboard graphics now works again! A old retired PCIe graphics card also now works.
> 
> My main graphics card also finally shows up in device manager but GPU-Z reads all its stats as gibberish - bios corruption it says. Atiflash also says the card contains no Bios..
> 
> Pretty interesting if the pin situation somehow damaged the graphics card / *both* of its bioses.


Flash a new bios to the card and see if it starts working properly again. I've mounted and removed cpu's on the same board about twelve times now and I haven't had any issues but I know it can happen.

My money was on a scratched board that damaged a lane fwiw


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Well I too am sorry for being grumpy, group hug?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So it would seem that pin PEG_RXP11 (g4) in the CPU socket is every so slightly damaged. Its so minor I can barely see it and I cant capture it on camera.
> 
> The PEG seems to stand for PCI Express Graphics according to google (someone correct me). If thats true then it matches up with my problems.
> 
> How this happened I don't know, I guess It didn't happen on its own so that leaves me.


Hahaha, group hug... I am glad you have it working again. I can just picture you with the "Honey, I shrunk the kids" magnifying glass headband trying to align it....


----------



## RichardNixon

Is it safe to lap the top of my IHS? I know it's bad to lap the CPU cooler block as it's build for the concave top of the IHS, but is it okay to lap down the IHS to copper?

For that matter, should I lap the inner part of the IHS that will make contact with the die?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RichardNixon*
> 
> Is it safe to lap the top of my IHS? I know it's bad to lap the CPU cooler block as it's build for the concave top of the IHS, but is it okay to lap down the IHS to copper?
> 
> For that matter, should I lap the inner part of the IHS that will make contact with the die?


If you lap it..polish it. Check the match between IHS and cooler with a razor blade to both surfaces to check first.

And no, you will create a gap that will have to be filled with TIM if you lap the interior.

Just go naked and save your arm strength for other tasks.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> If you lap it..polish it. Check the match between IHS and cooler with a razor blade to both surfaces to check first.
> 
> And no, you will create a gap that will have to be filled with TIM if you lap the interior.
> 
> Just go naked and save your arm strength for other tasks.


I have my naked mounts coming for my i5, not sure on what TIM to use with my EK nickel block though, suggestions?


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I have my naked mounts coming for my i5, not sure on what TIM to use with my EK nickel block though, suggestions?


CLU. I use it direct die on my GPU. Dropped 15c or more with the same clocks and fan profile. (temps were good to start with)

If you want regular grease, Kryonaut is the way to go.
Local Best Buy sells Antec Nano. It's cheap, local, and better than AS5 by a long shot.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> CLU. I use it direct die on my GPU. Dropped 15c or more with the same clocks and fan profile. (temps were good to start with)
> 
> If you want regular grease, Kryonaut is the way to go.
> Local Best Buy sells Antec Nano. It's cheap, local, and better than AS5 by a long shot.


is the clp safe for gigabyte g1 980 ti? sorry for the interruption sir


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> is the clp safe for gigabyte g1 980 ti? sorry for the interruption sir


I use clu on my gpu. Clp might be difficult to clean if you need to rma. Make sure you're using a nickel block though. I've heard stories of clu degrading even copper.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I have my naked mounts coming for my i5, not sure on what TIM to use with my EK nickel block though, suggestions?


Youll be fine with clu. Make sure you don't get any on the voltage regulators.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I use clu on my gpu. Clp might be difficult to clean if you need to rma. Make sure you're using a nickel block though. I've heard stories of clu degrading even copper.


Right. G1s have nickel plating.
Be sure to CAREFULLY clear coat inside the white lines:


You don't want any clear on the die or the outer square. It is very hard to remove.

*CLU will dissolve aluminum!* You have been warned.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Right. G1s have nickel plating.
> Be sure to CAREFULLY clear coat inside the white lines:
> 
> 
> You don't want any clear on the die or the outer square. It is very hard to remove.
> 
> *CLU will dissolve aluminum!* You have been warned.


Ohh I thought he referred to using it on the waterblock. If it has nickel plating it should be fine. Gpu die is relatively raised off the pcb so it should be ok. Do not get them on the voltage regulators though on the perimeter of the die.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Ohh I thought he referred to using it on the waterblock. If it has nickel plating it should be fine. Gpu die is relatively raised off the pcb so it should be ok. Do not get them on the voltage regulators though on the perimeter of the die.


thanks for the warning and replies guys,.. im planning to use the clp and the stock cooler of my g1, the windforce cooler,, i think the stock cooler is using cooper for the die, but if clp effects copper, i think w would not risking it









yeah i have delided my 4790k so i know what im doing but this is a gpu hahaha,, so they are diff right? so im scared


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> thanks for the warning and replies guys,.. im planning to use the clp and the stock cooler of my g1, the windforce cooler,, i think the stock cooler is using cooper for the die, but if clp effects copper, i think w would not risking it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yeah i have delided my 4790k so i know what im doing but this is a gpu hahaha,, so they are diff right? so im scared


Its copper but its nickel plated.
The GPU is easier because you don't have to delid them. Make sure that the led, fan and any other wires are disconnected from the PCB before you separate the cooler and GPU.


----------



## 1Scotty1

Hello, OCN

I want to join the "delidded club" with my 4790K and would like one question answered - is using a snap-off blade a good idea? I am talking about something like this - http://www.olfa.co.uk/ds_16-ABS.jpg
Of course I will not start with the tip of the blade, as it can easily scratch the PCB, but just asking, is using this kind of blade safe?

Thanks


----------



## white owl

I wouldn't. Not when butterfly razors are so cheap.
Pushing the lid off with a vice takes 60 seconds. Razor seems like alot of work and I'd cut my finger off.


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> I wouldn't. Not when butterfly razors are so cheap.
> Pushing the lid off with a vice takes 60 seconds. Razor seems like alot of work and I'd cut my finger off.


I am not confident with using a vice, I am afraid I might break the CPU somehow...


----------



## white owl

And a razor blade is more comfortable?


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> And a razor blade is more comfortable?


I have steady hands, so I am more comfortable with that







I understand a vice is a fast way, but truth be told, a 4790K is not that cheap and if I screw up... then what


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> thanks for the warning and replies guys,.. im planning to use the clp and the stock cooler of my g1, the windforce cooler,, i think the stock cooler is using cooper for the die, but if clp effects copper, i think w would not risking it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yeah i have delided my 4790k so i know what im doing but this is a gpu hahaha,, so they are diff right? so im scared


CLP is only marginally better than CLU, if even, but CLU is easy to clean up, whereas CLP is not.
If you ever have to RMA it might be an issue, or it might not, it all depends. If you ever decide to watercool or sell the card, or need to take the cooler off for any reason it might be a problem. If the CLP dries out, it might be a problem as well.

Id advise going with CLU not CLP.

And it's no different between gpu and cpu.


----------



## white owl

Do what I did...drill a hole in the corner and enjoy the key chain.

When you get a blade under the lid, don't pry on it until you have all the corners cut. Some one cracked the die doing it a while back.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1Scotty1*
> 
> I have steady hands, so I am more comfortable with that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I understand a vice is a fast way, but truth be told, a 4790K is not that cheap and if I screw up... then what


This is your best bet




That being said, razor blade is by far the slowest AND most dangerous. All you have to do is cut one path to be screwed.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Do what I did...drill a hole in the corner and enjoy the key chain.
> 
> When you get a blade under the lid, don't pry on it until you have all the corners cut. Some one cracked the die doing it a while back.


Said nobody ever who used the vise-only method...


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> That being said, razor blade is by far the slowest AND most dangerous. All you have to do is cut one path to be screwed.


Hmm, might think about this a bit more. Maybe the vice is safer after all







Thanks for the help


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1Scotty1*
> 
> Hmm, might think about this a bit more. Maybe the vice is safer after all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the help


Dont mention it. Just get the word out when you find that it works for you.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> This is your best bet
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That being said, razor blade is by far the slowest AND most dangerous. All you have to do is cut one path to be screwed.
> Said nobody ever who used the vise-only method...


You have to spent 20 minutes with a razor blade against the PCB which is covering traces and all manner of things. And you can hit the caps.
Vice method is like ripping off a bandaid.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> You have to spent 20 minutes with a razor blade against the PCB which is covering traces and all manner of things. And you can hit the caps.
> Vice method is like ripping off a bandaid.


Agreed that the hammer and vice method seems somewhat violent, even though it works if youre careful. However the vise only method in the video is much more tame, and faster since it doesnt rely on the hammer.


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> You have to spent 20 minutes with a razor blade against the PCB which is covering traces and all manner of things. And you can hit the caps.
> Vice method is like ripping off a bandaid.


I know the vice is quickest, but I am just scared it will break my CPU in half or whatever







but yeah, might as well try it like that anyway


----------



## givmedew

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jsx821*
> 
> One question - do you guys keep your cpu fan speed at max speed during stability testing? What about your chassis fans during stability testing?
> Lastly, what do you guys keep it after stability testing during everyday use @ your particular overclock.


Depending on the rig I usually take a ~12" Honeywell round house fan on high and point it directly at the board. The CPU fan should be running at max already since you should have it set to do 100% at anything over ~70C. The computer is under a lot more stress than normal... especially the VRMs so you need to make sure they are getting plenty of air.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1Scotty1*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> That being said, razor blade is by far the slowest AND most dangerous. All you have to do is cut one path to be screwed.
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm, might think about this a bit more. Maybe the vice is safer after all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the help
Click to expand...

I'm not saying either is truly 100% safe. That said I have done it many many many times with a razor blade and I have seen the process of doing it with a vise. The vise method has its obvious risks and I have seen what a failed vise job can do.

What I would say just in my opinion is this... If you have never done it with a razor and your first CPU will be an 1150 sock and not 1155 then I would say to go with the vise method. If you are doing an 1155 socket cpu then go with the razer blade. The reason why is that if you do not know what your doing and how little room for error you have when cutting the VRM side then you can quickly mess it up.

That said... if you are going to do the razor method just stay away from the VRM side until you have thoroughly worked the other side. That should make the VRM side easier. Look for pictures showing what the safe blade depth is... it isn't much and the reason why the razor blade method is dangerous at all is that if you slide the blade in too far on the side with the VRMs you will scratch and destroy one or many of them.


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> -snip-


Yeah, I know about those pesky tiny VRMs, so yeah, the vice only method should be more safer. Thanks for your input


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *givmedew*
> 
> -snip-


Also, theoretically, I can use a service from a local shop, that can delid my CPU for 25€ and they have "insurance?" that if they screw up, they provide a new CPU free of charge... but I would be without a CPU for a better part of a week... so I don't know


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> CLP is only marginally better than CLU, if even, but CLU is easy to clean up, whereas CLP is not.
> If you ever have to RMA it might be an issue, or it might not, it all depends. If you ever decide to watercool or sell the card, or need to take the cooler off for any reason it might be a problem. If the CLP dries out, it might be a problem as well.
> 
> Id advise going with CLU not CLP.
> 
> And it's no different between gpu and cpu.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> CLP is only marginally better than CLU, if even, but CLU is easy to clean up, whereas CLP is not.
> If you ever have to RMA it might be an issue, or it might not, it all depends. If you ever decide to watercool or sell the card, or need to take the cooler off for any reason it might be a problem. If the CLP dries out, it might be a problem as well.
> 
> Id advise going with CLU not CLP.
> 
> And it's no different between gpu and cpu.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Its copper but its nickel plated.
> The GPU is easier because you don't have to delid them. Make sure that the led, fan and any other wires are disconnected from the PCB before you separate the cooler and GPU.


i only have clp unfortunately









i just want to improve its stock cooling even though the stock cooling is good, but if theres a free way to drop more temps why not but there is a risk

i plan to stick with the stock cooler and i kinda knew that the gpu die will be scratch using clp on the die coz my previous 4770k have scratch mark when i tried to clean out the clp before i sold it,, maybe ill try another paste,, or maybe ill just leave it as is,,, kinda afraid of the effects if ever i rma it if they found out the scratches on die


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> i only have clp unfortunately
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i just want to improve its stock cooling even though the stock cooling is good, but if theres a free way to drop more temps why not but there is a risk
> 
> i plan to stick with the stock cooler and i kinda knew that the gpu die will be scratch using clp on the die coz my previous 4770k have scratch mark when i tried to clean out the clp before i sold it,, maybe ill try another paste,, or maybe ill just leave it as is,,, kinda afraid of the effects if ever i rma it if they found out the scratches on die


CLP should be fine for you then. i believe that CoolLaboratory has come up with a cleaning kit specifically for people who have used CLP and want to get it off.

http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-3-in-1-Cleaning-Set/dp/B0058688KA


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1Scotty1*
> 
> Also, theoretically, I can use a service from a local shop, that can delid my CPU for 25€ and they have "insurance?" that if they screw up, they provide a new CPU free of charge... but I would be without a CPU for a better part of a week... so I don't know


I would look closer into this "warranty" thats not a bad option honestly, I would probably take that


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would look closer into this "warranty" thats not a bad option honestly, I would probably take that


AFAIK, there are also people on this forum who will be willing to do the service for you. But yes I agree with @Valgaur that you should look into the warranty option, as sometimes they arent exactly what they seem.

Make sure that the warranty stipulates a full replacement cpu of equal value, as sometimes, they may just refund the price you paid for the service (not good)


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would look closer into this "warranty" thats not a bad option honestly, I would probably take that


I messaged them and probably do it this week 

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> AFAIK, there are also people on this forum who will be willing to do the service for you. But yes I agree with @Valgaur that you should look into the warranty option, as sometimes they arent exactly what they seem.
> 
> Make sure that the warranty stipulates a full replacement cpu of equal value, as sometimes, they may just refund the price you paid for the service (not good)


Yes,they have it right on their website that they provide a new CPU if they screw it up and I pay after it is done,not before. I have been a customer of theirs for quite a while,it is not a shady establishment ;-)


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1Scotty1*
> 
> I messaged them and probably do it this week
> Yes,they have it right on their website that they provide a new CPU if they screw it up and I pay after it is done,not before. I have been a customer of theirs for quite a while,it is not a shady establishment ;-)


That's good. I would go for it then


----------



## 1Scotty1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> That's good. I would go for it then


I am going for it,already picked CLU to be used under the IHS


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *1Scotty1*
> 
> I am going for it,already picked CLU to be used under the IHS


Sounds good man. Let us know how it goes.


----------



## josephimports

3D printed delid tool demonstrated by Sin0822/Steven B.


----------



## Benjiw

Doesn't CLU or CLP harden over time? Sorry if this is incorrect but I've never used these TIMs before so I don't know what's what.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Doesn't CLU or CLP harden over time? Sorry if this is incorrect but I've never used these TIMs before so I don't know what's what.


I can personally attest to the fact that CLP doesn't solidify after about a year and a half of being applied to the die of my 4670K. It was still a nice and shiny liquid when I pulled off the IHS.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I can personally attest to the fact that CLP doesn't solidify after about a year and a half of being applied to the die of my 4670K. It was still a nice and shiny liquid when I pulled off the IHS.


I've had my lid off 2-3 times with the same application of CLU (ran out).
After re-applying the same CLU over and over, the temps stayed the same and it still looks the same.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> 3D printed delid tool demonstrated by Sin0822/Steven B.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Pitiful.
Nothing safe is extreme. Now any tard can join.
We should make a Vice/Razor club.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> I've had my lid off 2-3 times with the same application of CLU (ran out).
> After re-applying the same CLU over and over, the temps stayed the same and it still looks the same.


Do you not need to re-apply like normal TIM?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *josephimports*
> 
> 3D printed delid tool demonstrated by Sin0822/Steven B.


This is LITERALLY the same thing as the vise only method in both form and function.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Do you not need to re-apply like normal TIM?


No. I've heard things about clp hardening over time and bring more difficult to apply but CLU has no issues like that.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Do you not need to re-apply like normal TIM?


No. I ran out.

You brush it on the die and a little on the IHS (just to make it shiny)

As long as you don't make a mess of it you can take the lid off and put it back down over the same TIM.
You can even take the brush and smooth it back out but it didn't change my temps.


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> CLP should be fine for you then. i believe that CoolLaboratory has come up with a cleaning kit specifically for people who have used CLP and want to get it off.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-3-in-1-Cleaning-Set/dp/B0058688KA


thank you so much







now im comfident to put clp on my 980 ti g1







thanks so much sir


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> thank you so much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now im comfident to put clp on my 980 ti g1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks so much sir


Don't mention it. I'm glad I could help. Also I forgot to Share a video showing how to properly apply clu onto your gpu. It uses a block for this but there's no reason you couldn't use the same method for the stock air cooler.


----------



## lordtyrion

Hey fellas,

So I'm taking the plunge tomorrow and de-lidding my first CPU, a 4790K.

I'm going vice method as I know I'll lose a finger with razor method and also kill a transistor







....

I'm planning to use Liquid Ultra on the die and Indigo Extreme XS on the IHS. I'm cooling CPU/GPU with an EKWB 360 Predator AIO.

I just needed some last minute advice:

1) Is it it worth lapping the IHS?

2) As this is my first time with CLU and the transistors are pretty close to the die, should i cover the transistors with clear nail varnish? (as I've seen others mention) or something else? to prevent short circuits. I know i'm going to smudge it about..









3) Should I apply CLU to the underside of the IHS as well?

Any advice from you chaps most welcomed..


----------



## Darkcon

lordtyrion, answers in order

Yes

Yes, use some form of non-conductive clearcoat

Yes, act like CLU is solder, wet/tin both surfaces you want to contact

additional advice: use permatex ultra black gasket maker to reseal the IHS after using CLU, I delidded(hammer n vice meth), CLU'd, resealed with permatex ultra black, and lapped my 3570k 2-3 years ago

it sits at around 34-45c idle(my temp sensors are buggered below 44c so im not sure what its true idle is), and during load testing with occt/prime it never goes past 56c, thats with a modest and easy overclock to 4.1

stock it used to sit at 55c idle, and 76-89c load, 90c+ occt


----------



## lordtyrion

Darkcon,

thanks pal for the super quick response..

Lapping & de-lidding certainly worked for your Ceepuu - that's a huge reduction in temps.

Great tip on the gasket maker as well..

Much more comfortable with the process now - thanks...

Off to get sanding sheets, varnish and the gasket maker.. oh and a mini vice









Cheers...


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkcon*
> 
> lordtyrion, answers in order
> 
> Yes
> 
> Yes, use some form of non-conductive clearcoat
> 
> Yes, act like CLU is solder, wet/tin both surfaces you want to contact
> 
> additional advice: use permatex ultra black gasket maker to reseal the IHS after using CLU, I delidded(hammer n vice meth), CLU'd, resealed with permatex ultra black, and lapped my 3570k 2-3 years ago
> 
> it sits at around 34-45c idle(my temp sensors are buggered below 44c so im not sure what its true idle is), and during load testing with occt/prime it never goes past 56c, thats with a modest and easy overclock to 4.1
> 
> stock it used to sit at 55c idle, and 76-89c load, 90c+ occt


This is good advice, and since @lordtyrion is relatively new to it I would tend to agree with everythingm except for one thing. I have the permatex rubber gasket maker, and yet I only used it once. Its messy...and i dont feel its entirely necessary, since the retention pin seems to keep everything locket up pretty tight. The nail varnish thing, I would agree with for people new to delidding, although ive never used it myself in my many delids and never ended up with a short.

Also @lordtyrion if you need a tutorial video, this is the one that Ive been chucking around on this thread.


----------



## Darkcon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> This is good advice, and since @lordtyrion is relatively new to it I would tend to agree with everythingm except for one thing. I have the permatex rubber gasket maker, and yet I only used it once. Its messy...and i dont feel its entirely necessary, since the retention pin seems to keep everything locket up pretty tight. The nail varnish thing, I would agree with for people new to delidding, although ive never used it myself in my many delids and never ended up with a short.
> 
> Also @lordtyrion if you need a tutorial video, this is the one that Ive been chucking around on this thread.


I agree its not a requirement its personal pref, but if done right, resealing the lid keeps it nice n tidy, the permatex should be applied in a very very light coating around the rim, same as the original black crud
I only did it because I wanted a perma job done, and so that I wouldn't forget, have the IHS slide off sideways and make a mess/chip the die while I was pulling the cpu some day in the future, half assed in my lap on angle lol


----------



## tatmMRKIV

resealing is bad news... maybe if you use liquid metal its fine. but regular TIM and pumpout on 6700K are no joke. I have a resealled chip that sucks on air(temps in the 70s+ on air with kryonaut). but still does 5.6ghs xtu on LN2 in the hands of a complete novice

needs a delid bad but I have been lazy


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Darkcon*
> 
> I agree its not a requirement its personal pref, but if done right, resealing the lid keeps it nice n tidy, the permatex should be applied in a very very light coating around the rim, same as the original black crud
> I only did it because I wanted a perma job done, and so that I wouldn't forget, have the IHS slide off sideways and make a mess/chip the die while I was pulling the cpu some day in the future, half assed in my lap on angle lol


-


----------



## Darkcon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea. i do get what you're saying. The only reason why I would not advocate doing the permatex is because you ARE actually adding distance between the pcb and IHS, which ipso facto would add distance between the die and IHS.
> 
> I wouldnt necessarily advocate against, but given how thin the CLU is being applied, it could end up being a very marginal contact between IHS and die, dependent upon how thick the permatex was applied.
> 
> This is just my two cents. If it works for you then great! Ive seen things done all kinds of ways, and thats how we learn so if something works for you i'd like to get more details and specs from your setup... I might start doing it that way too if temps dont take a hit.


aye, tis why I use an extremely thin layer, much like the original, and use the socket clamp to hold it down while its setting


----------



## lordtyrion

Hey guys,

Appreciate all the great answers & feedback.

will report back when done - was meant to be yesterday but office drinks on Friday - so everything on hold until hangover resolved









cheers


----------



## Brohem0th

I've delidded two cpu's, soon to be three when I get some more CLU. Razor-delidded a 4690k that ended up doing 5Ghz handbrake stable at 1.425v and staying under 77c coretemp on air. Ran it at that speed for almost a year because my motherboard will only reliably overclock with manual voltage set.

Most of the time though I just downclocked it to 4.8Ghz/1.355v and it generally stayed in the high 60's. Uptime of several months at both of these clocks listed.

I broke a 4790k doing vice method (and wept, because it was doing 4.8Ghz stable at 1.255v without being delidded, and was a really good chip). Got a replacement through the ITPP, it does 4.8Ghz stable at 1.325v. I'd like to see if I could still run it at 1.4v+ on air or if the hyperthreading would make it break 80c.

If you have a steady hand and you are very patient, you can razor delid a chip. It took me three hours with a drywall razor, but the same thing that made it take so long also made it safe. Drywall razors are thicker but still more than sharp enough to get between the IHS and PCB. It takes a lot longer because you don't want to scratch the chip. It also takes this long because you stab yourself in the thumb and then literally bleed all over the entire PCB, die, caps, vrm's of the chip. I really only stabbed my thumb about a 1'4", but it still hurt like hell and took quite a long time to heal.

I recently got one of the delid tools and that's what I'll be using this time. Got one printed for me, pretty easy, sent the design to a local printer and they did it and I went and picked it up.


----------



## fyzzz

Gah, im so tempted to delid my 4690k now. It is already under a custom loop and is running pretty cold. But the cooler it runs, the more happy it seems. It does 4.7 ghz at 1.25v and 4.8 ghz at 1.335v at the moment. It refuses to run 4.9 stable, but i can run some benchmarks with 4.9 and 5.0.


----------



## white owl

Check my signature bro.








You may be current limited. It's hard to get high clocks stable with just voltage.
Cache and ram can throw it off too.

When you go over 4.5Ghz, more and more things need to be set manually.
VCCIN, Analog/Digital I/O, etcetera.


----------



## fyzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Check my signature bro.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You may be current limited. It's hard to get high clocks stable with just voltage.
> Cache and ram can throw it off too.


Yeah, i've looked in the 5ghz club before and your posts there. Yes it doesn't matter with the vcore at 4.9, it doesn't want to be stable. But i can run it through cinebench and some benchmarks at 5 ghz IF i run it cold, otherwise it bluescreens. Runs beautifully at 4.7 ghz at 1.25v and temps are hovering around 50c at load and then it gets harder, but it runs 4.8 at 1.335v, which is not too bad, but it is quite the jump. Will tinker with it some more just for fun, i know it becomes more stable with low input voltage.


----------



## white owl

What board do you have?
My chip is about average. Takes 1.26v to get 4.5 P95 stable.
IMO, a good board is key to stability.

To get 5Ghz stable almost every thing had to come off of auto. But I didn't have a job so I had plenty of time to change one thing at a time.


----------



## fyzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> What board do you have?


Asus Maximus VII Hero


----------



## white owl

Sett all your current to 130%, power phase to extreme, LLC to 9. All the I/O to 0.20, enable PLL overvoltage, disable the communication to the voltage regulator.
After that the VCCIN should be around 2.1v and vcore around 1.45v. The last bit is obviously dependent on you chip. You have the cooling power AND power delivery I don't have. I don't even have a good PSU.








Ram should be at 1333 and cache at 3.9. That comes later.

http://rog.asus.com/254052013/maximus-motherboards/recommended-settings-for-overclocking-maximus-vi-motherboards/
That helped alot.


----------



## Brohem0th

It really only took me a long weekend to pretty much dial in 90% of what I needed to do to run 5Ghz, after that it was just running handbrake 0.001v higher than the last time to see if it would pass.

I did experience some chip degradation, but I'm unsure if it's because I had run 1.4v+ while it wasn't delidded and I had gone to 95c stress testing it once or twice. At any rate, it wasn't much degradation, and it went from 1.425v 5Ghz stable to needing 1.45v at the same speed.

Once I had it delidded it never went over 80c at the very most. If you really want to you can OC on air and run some pretty ridiculous voltages, you don't really want to run much more than 1.4v on haswell/dc so realistically speaking it's all I'll ever need.


----------



## white owl

Mine hasn't degraded yet but all I do is game and burn DVDs. Neither gets above 70c or so at 5Ghz.
GTA5 is in the low 60s with no vsync an +95% use on every core. But I've been delidded since 4.5Ghz.


----------



## fyzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Sett all your current to 130%, power phase to extreme, LLC to 9. All the I/O to 0.20, enable PLL overvoltage, disable the communication to the voltage regulator.
> After that the VCCIN should be around 2.1v and vcore around 1.45v. The last bit is obviously dependent on you chip. You have the cooling power AND power delivery I don't have. I don't even have a good PSU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ram should be at 1333 and cache at 3.9. That comes later.
> 
> http://rog.asus.com/254052013/maximus-motherboards/recommended-settings-for-overclocking-maximus-vi-motherboards/
> That helped alot.


Ok thanks i will try it today.


----------



## Brohem0th

I had my VCCIN at 1.985v, why were you running 2.1v? This was even with a 0.1v boost to cache voltage with the cache set to 35 to prevent any instability, and higher imc voltages, ram voltages, and igpu voltages since I used opensync to encode for streaming and had it overclocked and wanted it stable too.

2.1v seems like, crazy high.


----------



## white owl

That's what it took to get my ram to run at 2200Mhz, cache 4.5Ghz and core 5Ghz. And BCLK was 100.1 which threw things off. (had to do that to get into the club and I was chucking voltage to do that...I'd suggest dialing all these back like I did.)


----------



## Brohem0th

Raising cache clock speed does figuratively nothing for performance. There's no sense in doing it, and it's not necessary for running higher ram clocks, hasn't worked at all for me either.


----------



## fyzzz

I did all those tweaks, lowered the ram, cache etc, while it did help somewhat (could boot into windows 5ghz with 1.4v), but as usual no stability whatsoever and increasing vcore did nothing once again, same with 4.9. Guess i just have to stick with 4.7-4.8, which not too bad, those last mhz aren't going to do a world of difference, but it is always nice to have them.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Raising cache clock speed does figuratively nothing for performance. There's no sense in doing it, and it's not necessary for running higher ram clocks, hasn't worked at all for me either.


It lowers ram latency. Alot.
Ram speed matters in games. Especially GTA5. Stock cache and ram would only give me 60fps minimums in the city. 2200 with 45 on the cache jacked it up to 90fps. Gained a few hundred in firestrike too. Does nothing/little for maximum framerate though.
Either way, I don't just OC for performance. I do it because I like to push what is possible. I don't care if I kill my core, board, ram, IMC, etc because I am an overclocker.
I can run any game just fine with stock CPU and GPU bios.

@fyzzz...you may have to delid to get these clocks stable. I couldn't do much more than 4.5 before hand even though my temps were good. No idea why that is.


----------



## fyzzz

Yep i think i will order Coollaboratory Liquid Pro and try out delid. Feels like my chip could benefit from it, even though it runs cold now. I can afford a new i5 if mess up







. A shop were i usually order my parts here have some Liquid Pro in stock, so it will only take a couple of days. 10€...kinda expensive for a paste, but hey if it helps i would say it's totally worth it


----------



## white owl

It's not a paste really. It's like playing with molten solder.
If possible, get Liquid Ultra. It spreads like solder on hot copper.









And I don't have alot of money but I have a similar mind set....if I break it, I'll get another. I'll overclock it too.


----------



## fyzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> It's not a paste really. It's like playing with molten solder.
> If possible, get Liquid Ultra. It spreads like solder on hot copper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I don't have alot of money but I have a similar mind set....if I break it, I'll get another. I'll overclock it too.


Okay, i will try to get the ultra instead, i think it should be in stock soon. I'm not to worried if i'm going to break it, i feel pretty confident after seeing a few videos of several methods.


----------



## fyzzz

It will be interesting to delid, think i will use vice method. Something is blocking me for going over 4.8. Testing 4.6 at 1.18v right now and it passed H.264 Video Encoding test, i will of course test for a longer time, but it passed which is good news.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## vieuxchnock

Is a Hyper 212 will work on a CPU without the IHS, directly on die? Will it be tight enough on the die?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vieuxchnock*
> 
> Is a Hyper 212 will work on a CPU without the IHS, directly on die? Will it be tight enough on the die?


Don't use air coolers on a direct contact cooling system. The weight distribution messes with the pins and can damage it. watercoolers are highly recommended.


----------



## white owl

Tried it....won't work. I used the AMD standoffs to lower the cooler. You can't use CLU/CLP on aluminum either. It will fall apart.
It's possible to make it work but if you have to ask...


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vieuxchnock*
> 
> Is a Hyper 212 will work on a CPU without the IHS, directly on die? Will it be tight enough on the die?


I third the recommendation to not use air coolers as a direct die method. Use the IHS unless you specifically have a naked CPU mount. For instance, if you have the EK Supremacy EVO cpu waterblock, and had the Naked IVY mounting kit, as I do.

Otherwise, use the mounting mechanism that comes stock as this was intended. you're not going to see that much of a difference on air anyway between IHS-less and delidded and CLU'd IHS mounted using the stock retention bracket.

Keep in mind that if you delid and you dont use the IHS, you're going to be relying on the CPU cooler to restrain the CPU to the socket itself. This also means that whenever you remove your CPU cooler, the cpu will come with it, and you're leaving yourself open to socket damage. I would never recommend that anybody new to hardware, or modding more specifically do a delid with a complete removal of the IHS...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> Tried it....won't work. I used the AMD standoffs to lower the cooler. You can't use CLU/CLP on aluminum either. It will fall apart.
> It's possible to make it work but if you have to ask...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Don't use air coolers on a direct contact cooling system. The weight distribution messes with the pins and can damage it. watercoolers are highly recommended.


----------



## jdorje

Liquid Ultra showed up on amazon for only (?) $11: http://www.amazon.com/Coollaboratory-Liquid-Thermal-Interface-Material/dp/B0039RY3MM

Looks identical to the package I have that was a fair bit more (and took me actually months to get hold of in the US...).


----------



## fyzzz

I have now orderd some clu, it wasn't in stock so i have to wait a while. Doing some testing meanwhile. Managed finally pass realbenchs H.264 video encoding at 4.9, at a stupid vcore 1.44v. I basically threw a lot of voltage at it, put fans to 100% and it passed, now i will try to scale it down and see if i can get it to pass again. Vccin at 1.65v helped alot too, with 2v Vccin it crashed.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fyzzz*
> 
> I have now orderd some clu, it wasn't in stock so i have to wait a while. Doing some testing meanwhile. Managed finally pass realbenchs H.264 video encoding at 4.9, at a stupid vcore 1.44v. I basically threw a lot of voltage at it, put fans to 100% and it passed, now i will try to scale it down and see if i can get it to pass again. Vccin at 1.65v helped alot too, with 2v Vccin it crashed.


What temps did you get from achieving that feat?


----------



## fyzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> What temps did you get from achieving that feat?


I can keep it around 60c in realbench with that voltage (max i saw was 65c i think), had fans at full speed and it is cooled by a custom loop with ambient about 18-19c. Got it stable down to around 1.4v, but i think i will mess with it later when delidded, i know now that it is somewhat doable.


----------



## Benjiw

So can people tell me what i should and shouldn't do while naked mounting a waterblock to the die? Never done it before so would really appreciate some knowledge being imparted my way.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> So can people tell me what i should and shouldn't do while naked mounting a waterblock to the die? Never done it before so would really appreciate some knowledge being imparted my way.


Do buy a naked ivy mount. Don't try to mount any other block other than the Ek supremacy on a ihs-less cpu. I don't think any other blocks other than EK offer naked mounting options.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> So can people tell me what i should and shouldn't do while naked mounting a waterblock to the die? Never done it before so would really appreciate some knowledge being imparted my way.


Turn pegs evenly at opposite corners, you are balancing the block on a lot less real estate.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fyzzz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> What temps did you get from achieving that feat?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I can keep it around 60c in realbench with that voltage (max i saw was 65c i think), had fans at full speed and it is cooled by a custom loop with ambient about 18-19c. Got it stable down to around 1.4v, but i think i will mess with it later when delidded, i know now that it is somewhat doable.
Click to expand...

I got my 4790K (not de-lidded) to run Firestrike @ 4.9GHz... I'll be sending it to Silicon Lottery, to be De-lidded...

http://www.3dmark.com/fs/6703166

It also took 1 hour of RealBench Stress using 16GB RAM...






My RIG is in my SIG...


----------



## fyzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> I got my 4790K (not de-lidded) to run Firestrike @ 4.9GHz... I'll be sending it to Silicon Lottery, to be De-lidded...
> 
> http://www.3dmark.com/fs/6703166
> 
> It also took 1 hour of RealBench Stress using 16GB RAM...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My RIG is in my SIG...


Firestrike physics test isn't too stressful, but making it through realbench is nice. I've got my i5 to run 5ghz through cinebench and firestrike, http://www.3dmark.com/fs/6777365. But i could probably benchmark 5 with much lower voltage now (used to run it at 1.48v and open window).


----------



## Jimbags

Re-did my Raystorm CPU block, on an i5 3570k dellided with CLU. Gelid GC extreme in between block and ihs. Running 4.7Ghz 1.27V. Running intel burn test very high settings, Hottest core hit 62C, mainly sat around 58c though. Thats with Ambient of around 27c (not ideal but, Australia).
Loop is PMP-450 (D5 Vario), 2 x 240mm rads, 3/8th tubing, GTX 770 1320Mhz, all 4 120mm rad fans in push.
I'm pretty happy with it. I'd love to test in in cooler ambient though


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Re-did my Raystorm CPU block, on an i5 3570k dellided with CLU. Gelid GC extreme in between block and ihs. Running 4.7Ghz 1.27V. Running intel burn test very high settings, Hottest core hit 62C, mainly sat around 58c though. Thats with Ambient of around 27c (not ideal but, Australia).
> Loop is PMP-450 (D5 Vario), 2 x 240mm rads, 3/8th tubing, GTX 770 1320Mhz, all 4 120mm rad fans in push.
> I'm pretty happy with it. I'd love to test in in cooler ambient though


Nice result mate, just waiting on some bits and I can test my temps with my 3570k


----------



## Benjiw

Hi again,

Sorry to be a pain but I have my naked mounts here, they don't look like the ones on the EK web shop also I don't have the 3x M4 0.7mm polyamid washers but I'm confused as to why EK only send 3? I have the 0.5mm washers from the EK supremacy evo kit but I don't feel comfortable using those with the naked mounts as I feel like they need to be 0.7mm for a reason. I'll contact EK but can someone tell me why you only receive 3 0.7mm washers as apposed to 4?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Hi again,
> 
> Sorry to be a pain but I have my naked mounts here, they don't look like the ones on the EK web shop also I don't have the 3x M4 0.7mm polyamid washers but I'm confused as to why EK only send 3? I have the 0.5mm washers from the EK supremacy evo kit but I don't feel comfortable using those with the naked mounts as I feel like they need to be 0.7mm for a reason. I'll contact EK but can someone tell me why you only receive 3 0.7mm washers as apposed to 4?


The three washers are for the socket screws, the 4 washers are for the posts.


----------



## stin0

I just delid my 4690K, first delid ever!
Got my clear nail polish + cool lab UItra ready for on the IHS. Sadly the only 'normal' thermal paste I have is Arctic Silver 5.. will use this between waterblock and heatspreader.
I'll probably get some MX4 , GC Extreme or better stuff next week.

 


Curious about the results


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Hi again,
> 
> Sorry to be a pain but I have my naked mounts here, they don't look like the ones on the EK web shop also I don't have the 3x M4 0.7mm polyamid washers but I'm confused as to why EK only send 3? I have the 0.5mm washers from the EK supremacy evo kit but I don't feel comfortable using those with the naked mounts as I feel like they need to be 0.7mm for a reason. I'll contact EK but can someone tell me why you only receive 3 0.7mm washers as apposed to 4?


You sure those are naked mounts? They look different than my naked ivy mounts.

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cooling/2013/06/08/ek-supremacy-precisemount-review/1

If you're relatively new to this id skip direct to die mounting. It only shaved off 1 or 2 deg for me.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You sure those are naked mounts? They look different than my naked ivy mounts.
> 
> http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cooling/2013/06/08/ek-supremacy-precisemount-review/1
> 
> If you're relatively new to this id skip direct to die mounting. It only shaved off 1 or 2 deg for me.


I got fed up of running round in circles and bought a naked kit from my local watercooling shop with some fittings, I don't think they're naked mounts either, they look like 2011 mounts.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I got fed up of running round in circles and bought a naked kit from my local watercooling shop with some fittings, I don't think they're naked mounts either, they look like 2011 mounts.


Yea I thought they looked like 2011 mounts too. I was afraid to say lol.

I wouldn't use it for direct to die because the margin is pretty thin here. If you're in the states just go to performance-pcs.com and look for naked ivy mount. It's like $5


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea I thought they looked like 2011 mounts too. I was afraid to say lol.
> 
> I wouldn't use it for direct to die because the margin is pretty thin here. If you're in the states just go to performance-pcs.com and look for naked ivy mount. It's like $5


Like I said I've ordered a naked kit with my fittings, I have a very annoying bend from my cpu to my VRM block because of the waterblock on my 970 needing the 90's I had there in the first place. Can't wait to get my hardline tubing!


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Like I said I've ordered a naked kit with my fittings, I have a very annoying bend from my cpu to my VRM block because of the waterblock on my 970 needing the 90's I had there in the first place. Can't wait to get my hardline tubing!


Ok I must've missed that. Please let us know how it goes.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You sure those are naked mounts? They look different than my naked ivy mounts.
> 
> http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cooling/2013/06/08/ek-supremacy-precisemount-review/1
> 
> If you're relatively new to this id skip direct to die mounting. It only shaved off 1 or 2 deg for me.


You're only at 4.7. Unless you went higher than that.








More heat will make that gap grow.

My heat spreader is dish shaped.
At 4.6Ghz there is a 1-2c difference from the coolest and hottest cores. At 5Ghz it grows to 10c.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Ok I must've missed that. Please let us know how it goes.


Will do! I'll do a before and after, well... I think I will I might just naked mount it and not bother lol.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *white owl*
> 
> You're only at 4.7. Unless you went higher than that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More heat will make that gap grow.
> 
> My heat spreader is dish shaped.
> At 4.6Ghz there is a 1-2c difference from the coolest and hottest cores. At 5Ghz it grows to 10c.


I wouldn't know I just want it naked, I can't be bothered faffing about with the IHS and TIMs blerrghhh.


----------



## white owl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Will do! I'll do a before and after, well... I think I will I might just naked mount it and not bother lol.
> I wouldn't know I just want it naked, I can't be bothered faffing about with the IHS and TIMs blerrghhh.


Same here.
Die to CLU to copper.
I want to know how long an i5 will take 1.5v in non-synthetics. When I have an i7 already.


----------



## juan197

Hi everyone
i see this in youtube



But i see few people adding Liquid in IHS too.
My 4790k is delidded but im waiting mi CLU (in shipping) to apply tomorrow
Is this step reliable and needed for more contact and better temps?
I think is a bit dangerous than only apply in die,because 4790k has resistors/transistors next to die and this is going blind
In my town i dont find black silicon and electrical liquid tape to cover transistors,,failing that is a good idea apply my sisters nail varnish ¿no?or yes?
Sorry for my english


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *juan197*
> 
> Hi everyone
> i see this in youtube
> 
> 
> 
> But i see few people adding Liquid in IHS too.
> My 4790k is delidded but im waiting mi CLU (in shipping) to apply tomorrow
> Is this step reliable and needed for more contact and better temps?
> I think is a bit dangerous than only apply in die,because 4790k has resistors/transistors next to die and this is going blind
> In my town i dont find black silicon and electrical liquid tape to cover transistors,,failing that is a good idea apply my sisters nail varnish ¿no?or yes?
> Sorry for my english


clear nail polish works as a way to protect those components. My brain is fried today so wait for someone to confirm me before doing so please. like 99.5% sure, but i'd rather double check


----------



## Sea Monkey

Practice delidding, TIM and adhesive removal, and application of liquid electrical tape on a Pentium 4.



I'm hoping the adhesive and TIM on my 4690K will be a little easier to remove. I'm concerned as I've seen people stress not scratching the die and posting pictures of a smooth, shiny, mirrored surface afterwards. I really had to dig in with my fingernail to get the stuff off, and my die looks scratched to ****.


----------



## jdorje

Working with clu is a little dangerous, but less so than the delid itself.

That guy using tape is doing it wrong though. That's like 4x more clu than should be used.

The recommended precaution these days is a little nail polish on top of the exposed vrm caps (haswell only).


----------



## Benjiw

If I'm not using the IHS and using a naked mount kit can I use any TIM rather than CLU or CLP? Or is it still recommended to use CLU/P on the bottom of waterblocks when bare/naked mounting?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If I'm not using the IHS and using a naked mount kit can I use any TIM rather than CLU or CLP? Or is it still recommended to use CLU/P on the bottom of waterblocks when bare/naked mounting?


I wouldn't use anything other than clu. Maybe clp or liquid copper. All made by the same company. Higher temps and risk of the pump out effect results with nonconductive tim.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If I'm not using the IHS and using a naked mount kit can I use any TIM rather than CLU or CLP? Or is it still recommended to use CLU/P on the bottom of waterblocks when bare/naked mounting?


Almost pointless delidding if you dont use some form of liquid metal/solder. CLU is just so much more conductive compared to traditional pastes. Just dont put CLU (Gallium) on aluminium. Will destroy in seconds..


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Almost pointless delidding if you dont use some form of liquid metal/solder. CLU is just so much more conductive compared to traditional pastes. Just dont put CLU (Gallium) on aluminium. Will destroy in seconds..


Ah I just thought that because I'm removing the IHS there wouldn't be much difference between the liquid metal or a conventional TIM. I'll grab some CLU, I'm just paranoid about the stuff going weird with my nickel block on the die of the i5, but CLU doesn't go hard does it?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Almost pointless delidding if you dont use some form of liquid metal/solder. CLU is just so much more conductive compared to traditional pastes. Just dont put CLU (Gallium) on aluminium. Will destroy in seconds..
> 
> 
> 
> Ah I just thought that because I'm removing the IHS there wouldn't be much difference between the liquid metal or a conventional TIM. I'll grab some CLU, I'm just paranoid about the stuff going weird with my nickel block on the die of the i5, but CLU doesn't go hard does it?
Click to expand...

CLU will have permanent effects on copper, but plated nickel doesnt seem to suffer the same fate. Replace yearly to avoid drying out, but with the nickel block, there is no chemical reaction, so no interference or drying out from the block (same stuff the IHS is). Cover the VRMs with nail polish.


----------



## Delta6326

Anyone purchase a chip from siliconlottery.com? And have it delidded? Waiting for the 6700k to come it.


----------



## fyzzz

Picked up the clu today.. now i just need to figure out how i'm going to do this and hope i don't mess it up.


----------



## fyzzz

Cpu is now delidded and seems to have lost about 5-6c, which I'm happy with since it already ran so cold. The tim application was pretty good actually. I did vice only method and it popped off with like no force at all, the glue was really weak. Seems like 4.9 won't be still doable, which i expected, but i hoped. Maybe i need to put in some more time and test. Tried a quick run at 5.1 through firestrike's physics test and it passed and it could barely boot at 5.1 before.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fyzzz*
> 
> Cpu is now delidded and seems to have lost about 5-6c, which I'm happy with since it already ran so cold. The tim application was pretty good actually. I did vice only method and it popped off with like no force at all, the glue was really weak. Seems like 4.9 won't be still doable, which i expected, but i hoped. Maybe i need to put in some more time and test. Tried a quick run at 5.1 through firestrike's physics test and it passed and it could barely boot at 5.1 before.


nice result. I delidded mine last Sunday but still haven't tested it yet as I'm waiting on coolant grrrrr


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> CLU will have permanent effects on copper, but plated nickel doesnt seem to suffer the same fate. Replace yearly to avoid drying out, but with the nickel block, there is no chemical reaction, so no interference or drying out from the block (same stuff the IHS is). Cover the VRMs with nail polish.


This is exactly what I've been saying too, but people seem to think there is no rxn between copper and clu. There's pictures out there. That's why if you're buying blocks it's worth the $5 extra for the nickel plated options.


----------



## fyzzz

I am more and more happy with that i delidded. 4.9 seems to work now and at much lower vcore. I could even run 4.8 at a bit lower vcore, the 5-6c less seems to have helped.
4.9 at 1.39v, not the lowest vcore i've seen, but i'm more than happy with this







. Could run it a bit lower vcore, but i want some room to play with and i need to test a bit longer, but i'm pretty sure it's stable.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> CLU will have permanent effects on copper, but plated nickel doesnt seem to suffer the same fate. Replace yearly to avoid drying out, but with the nickel block, there is no chemical reaction, so no interference or drying out from the block (same stuff the IHS is). Cover the VRMs with nail polish.
> 
> 
> 
> This is exactly what I've been saying too, but people seem to think there is no rxn between copper and clu. There's pictures out there. That's why if you're buying blocks it's worth the $5 extra for the nickel plated options.
Click to expand...

Maybe because its not completely destructive like aluminum. I actually am using a copper block with CLU, and it performs just fine, and has been running like that for about 2 years now. The block is stained though, and even a sanding/polishing wont get the stain out, some part of the CLU got absorbed further than just the surface. Still performs just fine running at 5.0 24/7. But yeah, the few extra dollars to get a nickel block is the way to go, and certainly what I would have done if I had the knowledge about it that I do now.

Edit to add: What I saved on going copper instead of nickel, I have more than made up for reapplying CLU every few months.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Maybe because its not completely destructive like aluminum. I actually am using a copper block with CLU, and it performs just fine, and has been running like that for about 2 years now. The block is stained though, and even a sanding/polishing wont get the stain out, some part of the CLU got absorbed further than just the surface. Still performs just fine running at 5.0 24/7. But yeah, the few extra dollars to get a nickel block is the way to go, and certainly what I would have done if I had the knowledge about it that I do now.
> 
> Edit to add: What I saved on going copper instead of nickel, I have more than made up for reapplying CLU every few months.


Why does copper make you reapply?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Maybe because its not completely destructive like aluminum. I actually am using a copper block with CLU, and it performs just fine, and has been running like that for about 2 years now. The block is stained though, and even a sanding/polishing wont get the stain out, some part of the CLU got absorbed further than just the surface. Still performs just fine running at 5.0 24/7. But yeah, the few extra dollars to get a nickel block is the way to go, and certainly what I would have done if I had the knowledge about it that I do now.
> 
> Edit to add: What I saved on going copper instead of nickel, I have more than made up for reapplying CLU every few months.
> 
> 
> 
> Why does copper make you reapply?
Click to expand...

Because some part of the CLU gets absorbed by the copper, hence the staining and drying out.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Because some part of the CLU gets absorbed by the copper, hence the staining and drying out.


So when you reopen it there's less in there?

Is your water block becoming fatter? Is clu reappearing inside the loop? Lol.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Because some part of the CLU gets absorbed by the copper, hence the staining and drying out.
> 
> 
> 
> So when you reopen it there's less in there?
> 
> Is your water block becoming fatter? Is clu reappearing inside the loop? Lol.
Click to expand...

When I take the block apart, it has not made it through to the inside, but it stains wider than just the contact with the die, and cant be polished off or sanded off. I have had to reapply 4 or 5 times in the last couple years because temps would rise, and it would be dried out.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Maybe because its not completely destructive like aluminum. I actually am using a copper block with CLU, and it performs just fine, and has been running like that for about 2 years now. The block is stained though, and even a sanding/polishing wont get the stain out, some part of the CLU got absorbed further than just the surface. Still performs just fine running at 5.0 24/7. But yeah, the few extra dollars to get a nickel block is the way to go, and certainly what I would have done if I had the knowledge about it that I do now.
> 
> Edit to add: What I saved on going copper instead of nickel, I have more than made up for reapplying CLU every few months.


Yea you're right that it's not completely destructive. But it is better to go nickel plated copper, lest you want deposition and scarring on your blocks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> So when you reopen it there's less in there?
> 
> Is your water block becoming fatter? Is clu reappearing inside the loop? Lol.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> When I take the block apart, it has not made it through to the inside, but it stains wider than just the contact with the die, and cant be polished off or sanded off. I have had to reapply 4 or 5 times in the last couple years because temps would rise, and it would be dried out.


----------



## Sea Monkey

I don't want to submit results yet because something strange happened. After the initial delid, max core temp in OCCT dropped 14°C (from 83°C to 69°C), but the next day, max core temp is right back up to 83°C. My initial application of CLU was a conservative line spread along the center of the die, but not brushed flat, as I read that's more likely to introduce air pockets vs. letting the IHS do the spreading for you. I peeked underneath and there was still a small portion of the die that the CLU didn't spread to, so I put a little more there and put the IHS back on. I didn't apply any CLU to the bottom of the IHS, as most of what I've read stresses that not very much is needed at all. Should I go back and brush some on the bottom of the IHS? Should I wipe it clean and start all over?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sea Monkey*
> 
> I don't want to submit results yet because something strange happened. After the initial delid, max core temp in OCCT dropped 14°C (from 83°C to 69°C), but the next day, max core temp is right back up to 83°C. My initial application of CLU was a conservative line spread along the center of the die, but not brushed flat, as I read that's more likely to introduce air pockets vs. letting the IHS do the spreading for you. I peeked underneath and there was still a small portion of the die that the CLU didn't spread to, so I put a little more there and put the IHS back on. I didn't apply any CLU to the bottom of the IHS, as most of what I've read stresses that not very much is needed at all. Should I go back and brush some on the bottom of the IHS? Should I wipe it clean and start all over?


You have to spread CLU, it doesn't act the same as normal TIM.


----------



## Sea Monkey

Okay, opened it back up, added a little more CLU to the IHS and die, spread everything out evenly, and my max core temp in OCCT went back to 71°C.

OCN name: Sea Monkey
CPU: 4690K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratories Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: 12°C (max core in OCCT 83°C to 71°C) - Max core temp in IBT is 78°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/ku8dbr


----------



## Shoggy

Our solution for people with a 3D printer:

 

Can be download for free here: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1209396


----------



## madmanmarz

Wait you guys aren't having to replace CLU inside the IHS are you?

If so what other TIM could be used that will perform well over time.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> Wait you guys aren't having to replace CLU inside the IHS are you?
> 
> If so what other TIM could be used that will perform well over time.


You shouldn't have to replace clu. I've used the same clu even despite several rebuilds. And I use a naked mount direct to waterblock so there's a lot more potential to have to reapply...

Regardless of what you choose always use a conductive TIM inside die to IHS interface and a nonconductive inside IHS to cooler interface.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> Our solution for people with a 3D printer:
> 
> 
> 
> Can be download for free here: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1209396


Brilliant idea, defo printing this soon


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> Our solution for people with a 3D printer:
> 
> 
> 
> Can be download for free here: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1209396


Is this actually strong enough to delid the CPU if printed in plastic?? It looks like those grips for the IHS would easily let out as the CPU IHS is very strong and the glue they use is also quite strong.

I would think that those little notches would also quickly break off. Your design looks like it would work with metal, but not plastic. Maybe I will print it and see if it works better than the other.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> Is this actually strong enough to delid the CPU if printed in plastic?? It looks like those grips for the IHS would easily let out as the CPU IHS is very strong and the glue they use is also quite strong.
> 
> I would think that those little notches would also quickly break off. Your design looks like it would work with metal, but not plastic. Maybe I will print it and see if it works better than the other.


can't u get a stronger grade plastic tho? Or possibly make the pins slightly thicker so there stronger as it looks like there is room.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> You shouldn't have to replace clu. I've used the same clu even despite several rebuilds. And I use a naked mount direct to waterblock so there's a lot more potential to have to reapply...
> 
> Regardless of what you choose always use a conductive TIM inside die to IHS interface and a nonconductive inside IHS to cooler interface.


Thanks, that sounds good. So I guess it's just copper heatsink base that causes the CLU to dry out?

Does anyone sell these printable plastic de-liders? I'm not really all that afraid to use the razor blade method but if this is safer...


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> Is this actually strong enough to delid the CPU if printed in plastic?? It looks like those grips for the IHS would easily let out as the CPU IHS is very strong and the glue they use is also quite strong.
> 
> I would think that those little notches would also quickly break off. Your design looks like it would work with metal, but not plastic. Maybe I will print it and see if it works better than the other.


Given the length of each handle from the axis of rotation, yes it would be strong enough to overcome the epoxy bond. Torque = Fdsin0. but I'm afraid that (with the 4790k at least) it would damage the voltage regulators at the top of the pcb.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> Thanks, that sounds good. So I guess it's just copper heatsink base that causes the CLU to dry out?
> 
> Does anyone sell these printable plastic de-liders? I'm not really all that afraid to use the razor blade method but if this is safer...


Honestly dude you don't need any special gadgets. All you need is a lot of tape to prevent marring and a vise and you're good to go. I have a video on YouTube if you want to use it as a basic guide. There's more comprehensive guides out there but I would stay far away from the razor method.

This definitely works on haswell. I think vise only method should work on skylake as well but I'm not 100% since the pcb is reported to be slightly thinner.

Copper doesn't really cause it to dry out. It's the same as nickel in thermal properties except nickel is inert and doesn't cause any scarring of the copper. You can also look into liquid copper made by coollaboratory that's supposed to have similar properties of CLU.

Anyway here's the video. I have it floating around in a few other posts on this thread too.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> Our solution for people with a 3D printer:
> 
> 
> 
> Can be download for free here: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1209396


Is this safe for older chips? Ivy Bridge, Haswell, etc?


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Honestly dude you don't need any special gadgets. All you need is a lot of tape to prevent marring and a vise and you're good to go. I have a video on YouTube if you want to use it as a basic guide. There's more comprehensive guides out there but I would stay far away from the razor method.
> 
> This definitely works on haswell. I think vise only method should work on skylake as well but I'm not 100% since the pcb is reported to be slightly thinner.
> 
> Copper doesn't really cause it to dry out. It's the same as nickel in thermal properties except nickel is inert and doesn't cause any scarring of the copper. You can also look into liquid copper made by coollaboratory that's supposed to have similar properties of CLU.
> 
> Anyway here's the video. I have it floating around in a few other posts on this thread too.


A lot of people have said not to use the vice method on Skylake which is why I'm not gonna go that route, unless there is some sort of technique that works.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> A lot of people have said not to use the vice method on Skylake which is why I'm not gonna go that route, unless there is some sort of technique that works.


Yea that's what I was saying but they may have been talking about the hammer and vise method. I'm referring to the vise only method, which puts far less strain on the Pcb. It's worth at least looking into.

Any way you skin it, the razor method is gonna be the most dangerous.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Yea that's what I was saying but they may have been talking about the hammer and vise method. I'm referring to the vise only method, which puts far less strain on the Pcb. It's worth at least looking into.
> 
> Any way you skin it, the razor method is gonna be the most dangerous.


Thanks I'll look into it! the vice only method to me makes the most sense but i'll do a little research.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> Thanks I'll look into it! the vice only method to me makes the most sense but i'll do a little research.


Hope the video helps...it might not be for you as skylake is tricky. I feel like Intel caught on and made the pcb thinner on purpose. Which is pretty vindictive on their part.


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Given the length of each handle from the axis of rotation, yes it would be strong enough to overcome the epoxy bond. Torque = Fdsin0. but I'm afraid that (with the 4790k at least) it would damage the voltage regulators at the top of the pcb.


I am not talking about having enough force to delid the CPU, I am referring to the device holding up internally at the points highlighted in the image below and the notches that stick out.


I might as well print it and find out, if it works that would be awesome.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> I am not talking about having enough force to delid the CPU, I am referring to the device holding up internally at the points highlighted in the image below and the notches that stick out.
> 
> 
> I might as well print it and find out, if it works that would be awesome.


Could try just using a razor just a tiny bit to get a start in the glue then finish with this as not to go to far with the blade.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> I am not talking about having enough force to delid the CPU, I am referring to the device holding up internally at the points highlighted in the image below and the notches that stick out.
> 
> 
> I might as well print it and find out, if it works that would be awesome.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tuckers*
> 
> Could try just using a razor just a tiny bit to get a start in the glue then finish with this as not to go to far with the blade.


Ah ok. I didn't see this diagram. Ok so if the well is deep enough it should be able to grab hold of it and keep in place during the torsion. In any case it should be a really good deal so I don't think there would be any concern there but I still worry about the vregs


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> Any way you skin it, the razor method is gonna be the most dangerous.


I disagree whole heartedly. I've got at least a dozen de-lids under my belt, all of which were done with a standard razor. 2 Ivy and the rest of them have been Haswell with the VRMs under there. At this point I have the lids off in <2 minutes. If I were to heat up the razor blade, or the IHS, slightly I bet it would be even faster.



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tuckers*
> 
> Could try just using a razor just a tiny bit to get a start in the glue then finish with this as not to go to far with the blade.


I like this idea. I FWD that link for the 3D print to a friend of mine and I hope he can print it so we can test it out.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I disagree whole heartedly. I've got at least a dozen de-lids under my belt, all of which were done with a standard razor. 2 Ivy and the rest of them have been Haswell with the VRMs under there. At this point I have the lids off in <2 minutes. If I were to heat up the razor blade, or the IHS, slightly I bet it would be even faster.
> 
> 
> 
> I like this idea. I FWD that link for the 3D print to a friend of mine and I hope he can print it so we can test it out.


Let me know if it works, my friend is going to print me one in a week or so. I've recently done mine with a crafting knife and it's been under a block for around 2 years and it was still pretty easy to do but having this will just remove some of the risk. I'm surprised they released the plans tho and didn't just sell them, I'm sure there's a lot of people that was too scared to de lid but would gladly use this.
No doubt Intel will start soldering all the ihs to stop people


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I disagree whole heartedly. I've got at least a dozen de-lids under my belt, all of which were done with a standard razor. 2 Ivy and the rest of them have been Haswell with the VRMs under there. At this point I have the lids off in <2 minutes. If I were to heat up the razor blade, or the IHS, slightly I bet it would be even faster.
> 
> 
> 
> I like this idea. I FWD that link for the 3D print to a friend of mine and I hope he can print it so we can test it out.


I mean I get what you're saying and I meant comparatively it's the most dangerous for haswell chips. I haven't tried skylake but I have a suspicuion that vise only or razor is the way to go. That being said I think for anyone that hasn't done it before should use vise only for haswell at least... Just a difference of opinion


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tuckers*
> 
> Let me know if it works, my friend is going to print me one in a week or so. I've recently done mine with a crafting knife and it's been under a block for around 2 years and it was still pretty easy to do but having this will just remove some of the risk. I'm surprised they released the plans tho and didn't just sell them, I'm sure there's a lot of people that was too scared to de lid but would gladly use this.
> No doubt Intel will start soldering all the ihs to stop people


I don't doubt he'll want to print it, so I'll probably be posting regarding it at some point. Holidays will likely slow things down a bit.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pinnacle Fit*
> 
> I mean I get what you're saying and I meant comparatively it's the most dangerous for haswell chips. I haven't tried skylake but I have a suspicuion that vise only or razor is the way to go. That being said I think for anyone that hasn't done it before should use vise only for haswell at least... Just a difference of opinion


They're all dangerous really if they are carried out incorrectly. I chipped my 3770k while I was attempting the vice method...after that happened, caution was thrown out and I got the lid off quickly with a razor blade. Haven't looked back since that happened.

I don't have any experience with Skylake yet, and I don't know if I will since I don't foresee myself purchasing one.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I don't doubt he'll want to print it, so I'll probably be posting regarding it at some point. Holidays will likely slow things down a bit.
> 
> They're all dangerous really if they are carried out incorrectly. I chipped my 3770k while I was attempting the vice method...after that happened, caution was thrown out and I got the lid off quickly with a razor blade. Haven't looked back since that happened.
> 
> I don't have any experience with Skylake yet, and I don't know if I will since I don't foresee myself purchasing one.


Yea I'm waiting till skylake e. But if we're discussing the hammer and vise method I'm prone to agree with you. Vise only method is a simple shear with zero pcb strain. That's what I was trying to emphasize. There's a difference. I'd give it another look. But if razor works well for you that's awesome just seems way too easy to nick a path or transistor.


----------



## jdorje

Thing about the razor method is there's a higher skill cap. With practice you can probably do it safely and quickly. But that doesn't make it the right choice for a first-timer.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Thing about the razor method is there's a higher skill cap. With practice you can probably do it safely and quickly. But that doesn't make it the right choice for a first-timer.


Thank you. That was my point exactly.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> I am not talking about having enough force to delid the CPU, I am referring to the device holding up internally at the points highlighted in the image below and the notches that stick out.
> 
> 
> I might as well print it and find out, if it works that would be awesome.


Knowing my printer and the materials I print in the most, ABS i would say no, to much material give. PLA "maybe" but could snap that edge as it's such a small lip.


----------



## Shoggy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sin0822*
> 
> Is this actually strong enough to delid the CPU if printed in plastic?? It looks like those grips for the IHS would easily let out as the CPU IHS is very strong and the glue they use is also quite strong.
> 
> I would think that those little notches would also quickly break off. Your design looks like it would work with metal, but not plastic. Maybe I will print it and see if it works better than the other.


The tool is not some kind of concept. We have used it here and it works. I guess you will not be able to remove a bunch of heat spreaders with it because every time the material will suffer a bit.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Is this safe for older chips? Ivy Bridge, Haswell, etc?


It is only compatible for Skylake CPUs.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> It is only compatible for Skylake CPUs.


Could you elaborate a little on why it is only compatible with Skylake?

Is it a slight difference in dimensions of the PCB/IHS? Concern of damaging Haswell transistors under the lid from twisting the IHS off?


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> The tool is not some kind of concept. We have used it here and it works. I guess you will not be able to remove a bunch of heat spreaders with it because every time the material will suffer a bit.
> It is only compatible for Skylake CPUs.


Happened to see aquacomputer's skylake shim/spacer mentioned elsewhere today:

http://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?language=en&products_id=3378

Any plans for a Haswell / Devils Canyon version?


----------



## madmanmarz

So is a liquid metal compound always recommended on the die? I see a lot of people using mx-4 and such.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Happened to see aquacomputer's skylake shim/spacer mentioned elsewhere today:
> 
> http://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?language=en&products_id=3378
> 
> Any plans for a Haswell / Devils Canyon version?


I was confused at first, wow that looks like a great idea! I am so so going to try this thing out.



ETA: Ouch, shipping to the US is brutal


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> So is a liquid metal compound always recommended on the die? I see a lot of people using mx-4 and such.


Using a traditional paste isn't going to get you much of a temperature drop because the primary reason for high temperatures on Ivy Bridge and newer chips is the gap caused by the glue that Intel uses to secure the IHS. The proof can be seen in the post below where Noctua NT-H1 performs worse than the included Intel thermal paste, on average ~2C, once the CPU is delidded.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570

For optimal results you will want to use CLU on the die. This is typically good for somewhere in the vicinity of another 10C, or more, on top of the CPU delid benefits.

Between the top of the IHS and your heatsink, it is typically best to use a traditional paste as CLU can be problematic with bare copper over extended periods of time; It will destroy a bare aluminum heatsink just as a heads up. Plus there is a higher chance of getting the CLU somewhere that can cause irreparable damage if you're working with it once the IHS is locked down into the board.

If you have a nickel plated heatsink/waterblock than feel free to apply on top as well...just be careful.


----------



## Sin0822

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> The tool is not some kind of concept. We have used it here and it works. I guess you will not be able to remove a bunch of heat spreaders with it because every time the material will suffer a bit.
> It is only compatible for Skylake CPUs.


Ah okay cool!

I like the shim you guys designed.


----------



## Shoggy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Any plans for a Haswell / Devils Canyon version?


No.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> ETA: Ouch, shipping to the US is brutal


Read the article description







Can be shipped for 5.00 Euro with a padded envelope.


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> No.


Thats a shame. May I ask how come? Lack of demand? Seems like a no brainer to me


----------



## Shoggy

The current tool is used for our own purpose and we just shared it - that's it









We do not need any other tools here so we will not invest the time since it also has no advantage for us.


----------



## Ized

Thanks - to clarify I was talking about the spacer which you are selling.. not the free delid tool.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ized*
> 
> Thats a shame. May I ask how come? Lack of demand? Seems like a no brainer to me


Haswell and DC have thicker PCBs, so they don't need the extra reinforcement.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shoggy*
> 
> No.
> Read the article description
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can be shipped for 5.00 Euro with a padded envelope.


Yes! I emailed them and they confirmed that. Totally going this route.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

What is that spacer made out of? I wonder if we can use it with subzero


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Haswell and DC have thicker PCBs, so they don't need the extra reinforcement.


It would still protect the Die with non IHS mounts.


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> What is that spacer made out of? I wonder if we can use it with subzero


"Spring steel".


----------



## madmanmarz

Just to confirm, with this spacer I should be able to mount my water block direct to the die, correct?


----------



## jackalopeater

Well, I finally jumped in with the vice only method......almost gave up until it calmly let go and separated


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jackalopeater*
> 
> Well, I finally jumped in with the vice only method......almost gave up until it calmly let go and separated


Nice job dude. Welcome to the club


----------



## mandrix

My 3rd delid...I loosened the corners with a single edge razor, then used my little vice to pop it loose.
I cleaned up all the old adhesive and added a tiny drop of CLP (all I had left) and a few dabs of black silicone adhesive around the IHS including a little on the 4 little gold circlets closest to the chip.


----------



## Danzle

Don't know if anyone has posted this but you guys may like the "Delid-die-Mate":



http://www.computerbase.de/2015-12/intel-skylake-heatspreader-delid-die-mate-test/

Basically a closed vice specifically made to safely delid cpu.


----------



## BURGER4life

Delidded my chip back in 2013, but still found a pic











OCN name: BURGER4life
CPU: Core i7 4770k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
Mhz gained: 300MHz
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: -17°C max Temp IBT 10 runs: 72°C @ 1.31V/4.5GHz
CPU-Z validation of max OC: validation down atm, will edit when functioning.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BURGER4life*
> 
> Delidded my chip back in 2013, but still found a pic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: BURGER4life
> CPU: Core i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
> Mhz gained: 300MHz
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: -17°C max Temp IBT 10 runs: 72°C @ 1.31V/4.5GHz
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: validation down atm, will edit when functioning.


Is 4.5 all u can get from 1.3v.?
If so that kinda sucks


----------



## BURGER4life

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tuckers*
> 
> Is 4.5 all u can get from 1.3v.?
> If so that kinda sucks


Yea it's a pretty bad chip, but i've seen worse.
I run it daily at [email protected], max temps then is in the low 60s.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BURGER4life*
> 
> Yea it's a pretty bad chip, but i've seen worse.
> I run it daily at [email protected], max temps then is in the low 60s.


I used to think mine was bad with 4.6 at 1.3v but now I have de lidded I get 4.8 at 1.3v and I haven't even tried to lower Volts yet.


----------



## BURGER4life

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tuckers*
> 
> I used to think mine was bad with 4.6 at 1.3v but now I have de lidded I get 4.8 at 1.3v and I haven't even tried to lower Volts yet.


Never heard that a chip needs same/less voltage for higher clocks after delidding.
Not that i don't believe you, but in my opinion this seems very strange. Maybe your chip just needed 1.3V for 4.8GHz in the first place and delidding just lowered the temps


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BURGER4life*
> 
> Never heard that a chip needs same/less voltage for higher clocks after delidding.
> Not that i don't believe you, but in my opinion this seems very strange. Maybe your chip just needed 1.3V for 4.8GHz in the first place and delidding just lowered the temps


I've heard enough people say it that I believe some chips will see voltage improvement. Maybe some chips don't have their imc cooled as well and once those temps drop drastically there's less vcore needed all around.

Just lowering temps certainly makes a difference in voltage, though how much is hard to know. .01v per 10C might be possible.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BURGER4life*
> 
> Never heard that a chip needs same/less voltage for higher clocks after delidding.
> Not that i don't believe you, but in my opinion this seems very strange. Maybe your chip just needed 1.3V for 4.8GHz in the first place and delidding just lowered the temps


yeah I thought it was strange too but 1 of my cores always ran around 18c hotter than the rest so I think this must have had an impact on the volts. Before it was reaching 88c on 1.3 now it hits 61c max on prime 95. And that core is only about 4c hotter than the rest.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BURGER4life*
> 
> Delidded my chip back in 2013, but still found a pic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: BURGER4life
> CPU: Core i7 4770k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
> Mhz gained: 300MHz
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: -17°C max Temp IBT 10 runs: 72°C @ 1.31V/4.5GHz
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: validation down atm, will edit when functioning.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Zetsu

Hi all guys, this is a great thread, congrats!!!
aqua computer Creates open source 3D printable 'skylake Twister' for CPU delid purposes, i thinks i will love "aqua computer" and i will try to do my first delid with this stuff.
I hope to get this stuff in a few days and poste some photos.


----------



## Zetsu

anyone of you has already managed it and already tested?


----------



## madmanmarz

By the way if anyone prints a delid tool and wouldn't mind lending/renting selling theirs for cheap hit me up.

I got the Skylake spacer on the way from Germany, I'll report back with a before and after =)


----------



## Brohem0th

Off-topic, but what would be the best Z97 motherboard to pick up? Been strongly considering the AsRock Z97 Extreme6, nearly pulled the trigger on it but wanted a second opinion.

Currently running an AsRock H87 Fatal1ty that has completely outdone my expectations, so the brand loyalty is strong, but any other recommendations are also welcome.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Off-topic, but what would be the best Z97 motherboard to pick up? Been strongly considering the AsRock Z97 Extreme6, nearly pulled the trigger on it but wanted a second opinion.
> 
> Currently running an AsRock H87 Fatal1ty that has completely outdone my expectations, so the brand loyalty is strong, but any other recommendations are also welcome.


It depends on what you are willing to spend, just remember "Budget Components = Budget Performance" that's a quote from Mega Man...

If you want the best, I know of anyway, Asus Maximus VII Formula!!!!







It's a hard board to find though. I just happen to have two of them...

Or, are you stuck on AsRock?


----------



## ryan92084

Have any of the 3d printed delid tool plans been adapted to ivy bridge yet? I need to do a loop tear down soon and figured I'd pop the top while I was at it.


----------



## Bitemarks and bloodstains

Gonna join the club tonight








I've got my CLU and kryonaught ready just need to pop to the shops and pick up a vice.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryan92084*
> 
> Have any of the 3d printed delid tool plans been adapted to ivy bridge yet? I need to do a loop tear down soon and figured I'd pop the top while I was at it.


that's what I did waited till I stripped down the case to clean my loop. Well worth the de lid!!! I used a razor tho and that was really easy


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

Going to get a printing quote on Aqua Computer's model, this should work and for cheaper than that metal de-lidder. Looking at about $85 on mold if the printer approves - considerably cheaper than importing a metal single-use separator.

Edit; 3D print model was approved, so will have that on the 6th.
I'll have that way before both 6700K and metal PCB support bracket get here.


----------



## Ized

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeviceP0tat0*
> 
> Going to get a printing quote on Aqua Computer's model, this should work and for cheaper than that metal de-lidder. Looking at about $85 on mold if the printer approves - considerably cheaper than importing a metal single-use separator.
> 
> Edit; 3D print model was approved, so will have that on the 6th.
> I'll have that way before both 6700K and metal PCB support bracket get here.


The "older" version should be much cheaper to print since it is so simple: https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool

Cost me something like £10 including delivery from 3dhubs.com

With your $85 version plus your thermal pastes/liquid metal costs you'd be spending something like $100 to delid.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeviceP0tat0*
> 
> Going to get a printing quote on Aqua Computer's model, this should work and for cheaper than that metal de-lidder. Looking at about $85 on mold if the printer approves - considerably cheaper than importing a metal single-use separator.
> 
> Edit; 3D print model was approved, so will have that on the 6th.
> I'll have that way before both 6700K and metal PCB support bracket get here.


Instead of spending ~$100 for a delid tool, why not just spend about $20 on a table vise? It's basically between a part that costs a lot and has a single purpose versus a cheaper product that has all sorts of uses.


----------



## gwertyu

I did my delid with just 2 pieces of wood and a hammer on a flat surface, total cost: 0$


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gwertyu*
> 
> I did my delid with just 2 pieces of wood and a hammer on a flat surface, total cost: 0$


If you return the vise when you're done, then the cost drops back down to $0 also.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you return the vise when you're done, then the cost drops back down to $0 also.


Come on dude...they are so cheap. No need to be shady.

Home depot sells a vice for 8 bucks after taxes



Harbor freight has one for $16



Lowes has one for $17



Heck, Ace even sells a craftman high quality for only $22.



Amazon has a couple for under $10 including shipping


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Come on dude...they are so cheap. No need to be shady.


I bought mine and gave it to my bro-in-law when I was done. I just offer solutions.


----------



## Brohem0th

Craftsman is not high-quality at all, it's cheap pot metal from China. The only good thing is they'll replace it if it breaks.

Secondly, you can damage a chip using either the vice or razor method, and fairly easily.

Thirdly, you can have a delid tool printed for you for about 20-30$, and it's worth every cent. You can also resell it, although you will still need a vise to use it, but you can return that as well. And there's nothing shady about returning a product you used once and didn't damage so long as you don't destroy the packaging.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> Craftsman is not high-quality at all, it's cheap pot metal from China. The only good thing is they'll replace it if it breaks.
> 
> Secondly, you can damage a chip using either the vice or razor method, and fairly easily.
> 
> Thirdly, you can have a delid tool printed for you for about 20-30$, and it's worth every cent. You can also resell it, although you will still need a vise to use it, but you can return that as well. And there's nothing shady about returning a product you used once and didn't damage so long as you don't destroy the packaging.


Let's be honest here, delidding period (regardless of the method) has the potential to damage a chip.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> there's nothing shady about returning a product you used once and didn't damage so long as you don't destroy the packaging.


Yeah, that is kind of dishonest. How about you go in there and ask the manager if you can borrow a vice for a few days, see what they have to say about it. I don't think its a crime or anything, just not exactly honest.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Yeah, that is kind of dishonest. How about you go in there and ask the manager if you can borrow a vice for a few days, see what they have to say about it. I don't think its a crime or anything, just not exactly honest.


If you basically put down a deposit for the full amount of the item prior to leaving the store with it (a.k.a. purchasing the item and keeping the receipt), and are denied a return if the item is returned damaged, what's the scam? That actually sounds fairly reasonable, especially when its a metal table vise that we're talking about and it's being used to delid a single CPU. I'd just tell the person that the PC project I'm working on doesn't require a vise anymore. There isn't any dishonesty there.

Side note: If anyone damages a vise while delidding (no whacking the vise on purpose), I would love to see pics.


----------



## Brohem0th

Yeah, you're not gonna damage a vise delidding a chip unless you're literally mentally deficient. And yes, delidding is inherently risky, although there are much safer methods than others. I personally think the razor method is safer than the vise method, but that's an obvious bias because I killed a 4790k using the vise method whereas I delidded a G3258 and 4690k with a razor and didn't even nick the PCB.

The 3d printed delid tools are practically foolproof unless you have one made of absolute garbage material. When I delid my current 4790k I'll be doing it with a delid tool and I'll be sure to post pics.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Yeah, that is kind of dishonest. How about you go in there and ask the manager if you can borrow a vice for a few days, see what they have to say about it. I don't think its a crime or anything, just not exactly honest.
> 
> 
> 
> If you basically put down a deposit for the full amount of the item prior to leaving the store with it (a.k.a. purchasing the item and keeping the receipt), and are denied a return if the item is returned damaged, what's the scam? That actually sounds fairly reasonable, especially when its a metal table vise that we're talking about and it's being used to delid a single CPU. I'd just tell the person that the PC project I'm working on doesn't require a vise anymore. There isn't any dishonesty there.
> 
> Side note: If anyone damages a vise while delidding (no whacking the vise on purpose), I would love to see pics.
Click to expand...

Lying by omission.

"I dont need it" ≠ "I already used it for what I needed it for and now I dont want it"


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you basically put down a deposit for the full amount of the item prior to leaving the store with it (a.k.a. purchasing the item and keeping the receipt), and are denied a return if the item is returned damaged, what's the scam? That actually sounds fairly reasonable, especially when its a metal table vise that we're talking about and it's being used to delid a single CPU. I'd just tell the person that the PC project I'm working on doesn't require a vise anymore. There isn't any dishonesty there.
> 
> Side note: If anyone damages a vise while delidding (no whacking the vise on purpose), I would love to see pics.


Because it's dishonest? Would you like it if someone came to buy your car, used it then returned it? You're messing with people's livelyhoods aka how they feed their families. I recently broke a £200 motherboard, should I RMA it because I broke it? The answer is no, I messed up it was my fault even if it was a pure accident.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Because it's dishonest? Would you like it if someone came to buy your car, used it then returned it? You're messing with people's livelyhoods aka how they feed their families. I recently broke a £200 motherboard, should I RMA it because I broke it? The answer is no, I messed up it was my fault even if it was a pure accident.


A car loses quite a bit of its value just by driving it off the lot. A vise doesn't lose any of its value when it leaves the store. You people are seriously overreacting. Returning a vise to Home Depot is not going to suddenly keep someone from being able to feed their family. Jeez....


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> A car loses quite a bit of its value just by driving it off the lot. A vise doesn't lose any of its value when it leaves the store. You people are seriously overreacting. Returning a vise to Home Depot is not going to suddenly keep someone from being able to feed their family. Jeez....


Are you saying the car goes less fast or handles any differently the moment it drives off the lot? Is that your argument on the vice? The label of Used is what actually causes the loss of value in both cases.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> A car loses quite a bit of its value just by driving it off the lot. A vise doesn't lose any of its value when it leaves the store. You people are seriously overreacting. Returning a vise to Home Depot is not going to suddenly keep someone from being able to feed their family. Jeez....


On this forum (and others) I've seen a lot of suggestive recommendations along the same lines. It's not an overreaction, the car example might be more expensive but still remains true, it's the same thing, the only difference is the item, though if you sold a car and they used it and put loads of miles on it (say 100-200?) you would be happy to give them their cash back upon returning it?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> On this forum (and others) I've seen a lot of suggestive recommendations along the same lines. It's not an overreaction, the car example might be more expensive but still remains true, it's the same thing, the only difference is the item, though if you sold a car and they used it and put loads of miles on it (say 100-200?) you would be happy to give them their cash back upon returning it?


The thing you're not realizing is that a car breaks down over time. A vise will not break down after delidding a single CPU. It is most certainly an overreaction. I get the points that you're trying to make, but you're acting as though the vise is not in PERFECT condition when it's returned. It's not like you're breaking it, putting it back together with glue, then trying to return it - which would most definitely be a shady and wrong thing to do.

Not sure why you seem to be taking this so personally....If the return of a $10-20 vise hurts a business' income, then they should really reconsider their business model.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> The thing you're not realizing is that a car breaks down over time. A vise will not break down after delidding a single CPU. It is most certainly an overreaction. I get the points that you're trying to make, but you're acting as though the vise is not in PERFECT condition when it's returned. It's not like you're breaking it, putting it back together with glue, then trying to return it - which would most definitely be a shady and wrong thing to do.
> 
> Not sure why you seem to be taking this so personally....If the return of a $10-20 vise hurts a business' income, then they should really reconsider their business model.


I'm not taking it personal, you're just failing to see dishonesty is wrong. I blame my good up bringing for being an honest person.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I'm not taking it personal, you're just failing to see dishonesty is wrong. I blame my good up bringing for being an honest person.


"My PC project no longer requires this vise". That's actually very accurate, if that's what's said. In my case, I bought my vise, and gave it to my bro-in-law when I was done. You shouldn't take hypothetical situations so seriously.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Are you saying the car goes less fast or handles any differently the moment it drives off the lot? Is that your argument on the vice? The label of Used is what actually causes the loss of value in both cases.


I'm saying that once a car is driven off the lot, it is classified as "used", and is no longer entitled to the "new" car pricing. Yes, driving a car off of a lot actually causes some wear (granted, it's a small amount, but still there). Unlike a vise, which is worth the same amount once it leaves the store. Also, in the example of a car, you sign contracts in order to take possession of the car. Retail stores have return policies.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> "My PC project no longer requires this vise". That's actually very accurate, if that's what's said. In my case, I bought my vise, and gave it to my bro-in-law when I was done. You shouldn't take hypothetical situations so seriously.


I'm not.


----------



## madmanmarz

A vice has so much use that there should be one in every home. I think it's a little - not necessarily dishonest, but slightly shady to use something and return it. My x used to do it with dresses. I hated it. She'd wear it for the night for a fancy event and then return it.

To each their own but I wouldn't like it if customers did it to me.


----------



## blaze2210

In general, I actually agree with you guys. However, in this particular situation, there is basically no way that you are going to possibly degrade that vise in any sort of way during the course of delidding a single CPU. It's not like the next person to get the vise is going to open the box and think to themselves "Dammit, someone used this one before". Clothing and cars are things where you can tell when someone else has used it before you.


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

Update: The printer finished printing way ahead of schedule (today). Walking distance from my person, why would I want to have something shipped (+everyone almost always uses UPS)? Didn't see any links (initially) to that smaller 3D printed model, which would have been ~$40 printed. Things are more expensive here, bad dollar. Such is life, this is a little experiment - so guess will have to post a video, once that 6700k gets in - for science!
It'll be recycled (either resold locally or reclaimed material) after.

Roommate has a vice grip, but it has ... contaminates... on it >_>


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> A vice has so much use that there should be one in every home. I think it's a little - not necessarily dishonest, but slightly shady to use something and return it. My x used to do it with dresses. I hated it. She'd wear it for the night for a fancy event and then return it.
> 
> To each their own but I wouldn't like it if customers did it to me.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> In general, I actually agree with you guys. However, in this particular situation, there is basically no way that you are going to possibly degrade that vise in any sort of way during the course of delidding a single CPU. It's not like the next person to get the vise is going to open the box and think to themselves "Dammit, someone used this one before". Clothing and cars are things where you can tell when someone else has used it before you.


Hey Guys, what you propose is BS! It lacks integrity, honesty, and all kinds of other nasty things, that I can think of...









Either buy the thing, rent, or borrow from a friend... Get a grip! You should be ashamed of yourselves









Just my









Mike


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> Hey Guys, what you propose is BS! It lacks integrity, honesty, and all kinds of other nasty things, that I can think of...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Either buy the thing, rent, or borrow from a friend... Get a grip! You should be ashamed of yourselves
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just my
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mike


Wait! I'm on your side!


----------



## Valgaur

Okay peoples.

I get the thoughts and everything behind this topic currently. Lets just drop it. There are always two sides of a coin and we have to just accept it. As a business owner I hate seeing products being brought back in after a very short time of use. However I understand certain scenarios where you simply don't want to own one, both are understandable, just accept them.

People are people let them do what they do.

Alrighty so. Let us know how the 3D printed delidder works I'm interested in it


----------



## tatmMRKIV

lmao you guys would really be mad if I told you how the pros bin mem..


----------



## Brohem0th

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> lmao you guys would really be mad if I told you how the pros bin mem..


This. Exactly. Binning is a necessary part of overclocking and is literally just buying and returning products until you get one that is a standard deviation or three better than average, and nobody says anything about that now do they?


----------



## j-s-w

My CLU arrived today so just need the nerve to take the razor to my 6700k lol


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> This. Exactly. Binning is a necessary part of overclocking and is literally just buying and returning products until you get one that is a standard deviation or three better than average, and nobody says anything about that now do they?


Personally I would just sell the used CPU...


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Personally I would just sell the used CPU...


You're right, Benji...


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> lmao you guys would really be mad if I told you how the pros bin mem..


ha good point


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> lmao you guys would really be mad if I told you how the pros bin mem..


Seriously! If they wag their finger at me for talking about returning a $10-20 vise, imagine how they'd feel about the pros returning their $800+ kits of RAM.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Seriously! If they wag their finger at me for talking about returning a $10-20 vise, imagine how they'd feel about the pros returning their $800+ kits of RAM.


exactly the same.


----------



## Danzle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Brohem0th*
> 
> This. Exactly. Binning is a necessary part of overclocking and is literally just buying and returning products until you get one that is a standard deviation or three better than average, and nobody says anything about that now do they?


It's easyer to go to caseking.de and buy a pretestet CPU. They sell the 6700K with up to 4.8GHz stable tested. 50€ extra for the 4.7GHz tested one doesn't sound to bad.


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Danzle*
> 
> It's easyer to go to caseking.de and buy a pretestet CPU. They sell the 6700K with up to 4.8GHz stable tested. 50€ extra for the 4.7GHz tested one doesn't sound to bad.


Source link please?

Edit: Curious on testing methodology and what not. How do they determine this?
2: I'm starting to believe people when they say they got a "new" computer component 'open box' and this has been happening more lately (likely people also "pro" resealing used components); now we see why ಠ_ಠ


----------



## jdorje

Quite the off topic conversation.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeviceP0tat0*
> 
> Source link please?
> 
> Edit: Curious on testing methodology and what not. How do they determine this?
> 2: I'm starting to believe people when they say they got a "new" computer component 'open box' and this has been happening more lately (likely people also "pro" resealing used components); now we see why ಠ_ಠ


http://siliconlottery.com/collections/frontpage/products/4790k48g
Quote:


> Passed the ROG RealBench stress test for one hour with these settings:
> 
> 48x CPU Multiplier
> 1.328V CPU VCORE (Or less)
> 1.90V CPU INPUT VOLTAGE (Or less)


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Seriously! If they wag their finger at me for talking about returning a $10-20 vise, imagine how they'd feel about the pros returning their $800+ kits of RAM.


I have done it, rt has done it, loud has done it, splave has done it.

not our fault QC is a joke these days and you can pay 600$+ for a ram kit that is identical in performance to a 200$ kit or lol no joke a 50$ kit... just did that...

newegg has a premier service so theyknow full well what they are getting themselves into when they say 20$ a year and we will pay shipping and pretty much ask no questions on any return...

processors are a different story sometimes but. I know of a few people over in europe that do due to their laws about online sales and not being able to see it before you buy it.

I dunno intel has been churning out really poor numbers and has chips that require delidding even for basic OC. I mean come on. they asked for it...

but yeah I buy pre-binned cpus and I bought one that wasn't cuz I got sick of waiting but it was good and flipped it for 550 anyhow so... win for me

but ram manufacturers right now.. especially g.skill and corsair are a joke

I got so many DOA g.skill sticks.... that were e-die

I "delidded" the heatsinks on my mem to check IC once or twice so its not completely OT


----------



## Danzle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeviceP0tat0*
> 
> Source link please?
> 
> Edit: Curious on testing methodology and what not. How do they determine this?
> 2: I'm starting to believe people when they say they got a "new" computer component 'open box' and this has been happening more lately (likely people also "pro" resealing used components); now we see why ಠ_ಠ


They say "tray" so i wouldn't assume that they open boxed cpu for this. According to they site you get 2 year warranty from them (not intel) and you get all informations to voltage 1/- 30 mV and MAX 1.4V overall. For stability the do Prime95 AVX with 1344K for an hour.

https://www.caseking.de/en/intel-core-i7-6700k-4-0-ghz-skylake-pretested-4-7-ghz-tray-hpit-261.html


----------



## Danzle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Danzle*
> 
> They say "tray" so i wouldn't assume that they open boxed cpu for this. According to they site you get 2 year warranty from them (not intel) and you get all informations to voltage 1/- 30 mV and MAX 1.4V overall. For stability the do Prime95 AVX with 1344K for an hour. Whats funny, the 4.8GHz offer coasts 615€! somewhat funny how much mor you pay for that 0.1Ghz, almost like intel made the prices!
> 
> https://www.caseking.de/en/intel-core-i7-6700k-4-0-ghz-skylake-pretested-4-7-ghz-tray-hpit-261.html


Didn't mean do double post <.< wanted to edit my post. My bad!


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Danzle*
> 
> They say "tray" so i wouldn't assume that they open boxed cpu for this. According to they site you get 2 year warranty from them (not intel) and you get all informations to voltage 1/- 30 mV and MAX 1.4V overall. For stability the do Prime95 AVX with 1344K for an hour.
> 
> https://www.caseking.de/en/intel-core-i7-6700k-4-0-ghz-skylake-pretested-4-7-ghz-tray-hpit-261.html


Agreed, what I was suggesting was with sealed boxed items wherein there is an organized methodological order of getting to said item and repacking it, undetected). Or, in the same way that people reseal (circumvent tamper labels) and return "unused" consoles to a store, only it isn't a "console" inside but a potato or two.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> I mean come on. they asked for it...


That is a horrible defense of action.


----------



## Zetsu

Working in progress guys...


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is a horrible defense of action.


as if your opinion maters...


----------



## Danzle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zetsu*
> 
> Working in progress guys...


So a twist-delider? Simple but yet so clever!


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zetsu*
> 
> Working in progress guys...


It's strange seeing those hollow parts. Got mine today (exact same thing) - is not hollow all the way through like yours (all plastic with slotted bits). Did you do this through a maker site or you make this yourself?

Also, turns out I know the guy (he used to rent office space at my current job) could have saved $20 buying directly rather than 3Dhubs (they take a cut) though, so now at least I have a local go-to source should my person need more printed.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> as if your opinion maters...


If his doesn't matter, then neither does yours.


----------



## blaze2210

How about everyone leaves their high horses elsewhere, that way this thread can get back to delidding. No one gets bonus points from their respective higher powers through being righteous on a forum.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> How about everyone leaves their high horses elsewhere, that way this thread can get back to delidding. No one gets bonus points from their respective higher powers through being righteous on a forum.


Hear hear.

So my CLU came in a couple weeks ago. My vice came in 2 days ago (I live in the absolute middle of nowhere, no way to get it local). Is tomorrow the day?

And a secondary question: can/should i put CLU on my GPU cooler? It's pure copper. What about on my IHS-h80i interface? That's pure copper too.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Hear hear.
> 
> So my CLU came in a couple weeks ago. My vice came in 2 days ago (I live in the absolute middle of nowhere, no way to get it local). Is tomorrow the day?
> 
> And a secondary question: can/should i put CLU on my GPU cooler? It's pure copper. What about on my IHS-h80i interface? That's pure copper too.


Tomorrow should definitely be the day!! Take pics!!









You could apply the CLU to your GPU. In my experience with applying CLP to my GTX 970, it didn't really drop my temps all that much (maybe a couple of degrees C), but my card definitely transferred the heat quite a bit faster. Once the card went back to idle (no game or full load), the temperature dropped back to idle temps within a second or two. In my opinion, it's worth it. As long as the CLU will not be making any contact AT ALL with any aluminum, you're good.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> How about everyone leaves their high horses elsewhere, that way this thread can get back to delidding. No one gets bonus points from their respective higher powers through being righteous on a forum.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hear hear.
> 
> So my CLU came in a couple weeks ago. My vice came in 2 days ago (I live in the absolute middle of nowhere, no way to get it local). Is tomorrow the day?
> 
> And a secondary question: can/should i put CLU on my GPU cooler? It's pure copper. What about on my IHS-h80i interface? That's pure copper too.
Click to expand...

I have done it on GPUs, the effect of the CLU was underwhelming after delliding and seeing the results on my 3570k. I imagine it would have the same underwhelming effect in between the IHS and your h80i, but dont let that stop you! Just remember, it does stain copper and will permanently alter your h80 and GPU coolers, however, as far as I can tell, it is just cosmetic damage, and will still see better results using CLU than anything else.

In other words, dont do it just because you can...do it if you are squeezing every drop of out your hardware.

^ what he said about aluminum


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Hear hear.
> 
> So my CLU came in a couple weeks ago. My vice came in 2 days ago (I live in the absolute middle of nowhere, no way to get it local). Is tomorrow the day?
> 
> And a secondary question: can/should i put CLU on my GPU cooler? It's pure copper. What about on my IHS-h80i interface? That's pure copper too.


I had a different experience to @blaze2210 but maybe it's cos my 290 runs hotter than a 970. It dropped my load temps by 10C, allowing an oc to 1100/1450 core/mem in 30C ambients

As for the cpu, you could as well, but do note that the letterings on top of the ihs would disappear if you do so..nothing major if you don't plan on rma-ing the chip


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> I had a different experience to @blaze2210 but maybe it's cos my 290 runs hotter than a 970. It dropped my load temps by 10C, allowing an oc to 1100/1450 core/mem in 30C ambients
> 
> As for the cpu, you could as well, but do note that the letterings on top of the ihs would disappear if you do so..nothing major if you don't plan on rma-ing the chip


I'm gonna go block straight to die on my 6600k and I doubt there will be much of a temp difference using regular thermal paste. But if reapplying the heatspreader then for sure some sort of metal paste is appropriate. I'd just rather have the easier cleanup/non staining, etc.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> I'm gonna go block straight to die on my 6600k and I doubt there will be much of a temp difference using regular thermal paste. But if reapplying the heatspreader then for sure some sort of metal paste is appropriate. I'd just rather have the easier cleanup/non staining, etc.


Yeah, if that's the case then normal thermal paste would definitely be enough...i'm more worried about cracking the die but tht's just me


----------



## khemist

My delid die mate should be here tomorrow, cost £63 but i'll be selling it on for about £55 so no big loss.

The reason i went for this is i killed my 4770k doing the razor method!.


----------



## madmanmarz

itshere
tsherei
shereit
hereits
ereitsh
reitshe
eitsher
!!!!!!!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> My delid die mate should be here tomorrow, cost £63 but i'll be selling it on for about £55 so no big loss.
> 
> The reason i went for this is i killed my 4770k doing the razor method!.


Is it compatible with the 4xxx range and the new 6xxx range?


----------



## khemist

Yeah.


----------



## khemist

Arrived today.


----------



## khemist

Got it done, force required was obscene, also some shaving from the unit came out from the bit you tighten and there is a kind of dent left on the unit above the delid screw bit.

Also the screw hole you tighten to delid is bulging out now.

I had no problems with my temps before on my 4790k before but i was curious to try it anyway.



Only had time for 15 min runs - this is before delid after 15 mins of realbench.

Cpu @ 4.8 1.32v.



And after.


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

Printed delidder. The text on the bottom is cosmetic only, the rest of the device appears accurate.


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeviceP0tat0*
> 
> Printed delidder. The text on the bottom is cosmetic only, the rest of the device appears accurate.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Looks pretty good. Make a vid of u doing it I'd like to see just how quick these are to use


----------



## DR4G00N

Cut the head... oops, I mean IHS off my A8-3870K for something to do. I figured after 3 years the on-die tim had dried up so I wanted to clean it up and put some MX-4 there instead (might do CLU later though).
Temps dropped by a staggering 23c under P95!

Haven't tried oc'ing after the delid, but the chip isn't very good, only did 3.5GHz @ 1.5V previously.


----------



## jdorje

Need a fast answer: can/should I use alcohol to help clear the glue off? Is getting iso on the caps bad?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Need a fast answer: can/should I use alcohol to help clear the glue off? Is getting iso on the caps bad?


You can definitely use alcohol, just make sure that it's upwards of 90% - for best results.


----------



## jdorje

Thanks.

The ihs is stained, but in a big blob. How to know where to put clu on it? Going over risks clu spreading everywhere. Which I guess means the caps should be insulated. Or is it viable only to put clu on the die?

I have colored nail polish but only "miracle nail hardener" clear stuff. Which to use? Why do people always say "clear" nail polish?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> The ihs is stained, but in a big blob. How to know where to put clu on it? Going over risks clu spreading everywhere. Which I guess means the caps should be insulated. Or is it viable only to put clu on the die?
> 
> I have colored nail polish but only "miracle nail hardener" clear stuff. Which to use? Why do people always say "clear" nail polish?


You'll be better off putting the CLU on the die, instead of the IHS. Once you have a proper application of CLU, it shouldn't pump-out or leak anywhere, so covering those other components is more of a precautionary measure. I didn't put anything on the caps of my 4670K when I delidded, just take your time with the application and make sure that there is no CLU anywhere besides the die before you reinstall it - same thing with my GPU. I use an LED flashlight to check the rest of the PCB and surrounding areas for little super-shiny specs, and I clean them up with a Q-tip and alcohol.


----------



## jdorje

So just clu on the die, not on the ihs?


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Need a fast answer: can/should I use alcohol to help clear the glue off? Is getting iso on the caps bad?


U can pick the glue of with your nail pretty easy the pcb is very robust


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> So just clu on the die, not on the ihs?


Yep, you only need to apply to one side. Applying to both sides will most likely end up being too much CLU there, which might cause it to leak out.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tuckers*
> 
> U can pick the glue of with your nail pretty easy the pcb is very robust


^This too. I picked the larger chunks off of my CPU with my thumbnail, then cleaned up the rest with 91% alcohol.


----------



## jdorje

It's all over but the testing.

I just realized I left this thing on a massive dangerous overclock. Should I reset cmos? Not sure this board has an easy set of pins for that...


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> It's all over but the testing.
> 
> I just realized I left this thing on a massive dangerous overclock. Should I reset cmos? Not sure this board has an easy set of pins for that...


Well, that might serve as a good means of testing the CLU application.









I feel like I'd test it to see what the temps are first, then re-do the settings if necessary.


----------



## jdorje

Yeah it does have cmos reset pins, just not well labeled.

25c at stock in the bios (18c ambient). Seems promising. Will run some tests and report back with pictures.

Thanks for the quick answers the last hour and all the answers to questions I've asked over the last who-knows-how-long while working up to it.

Edit: preliminary results promising. Temps on insane overclock dropped from 60C above ambient (79-19) to 45c (63-18) above ambient.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Yeah it does have cmos reset pins, just not well labeled.
> 
> 25c at stock in the bios (18c ambient). Seems promising. Will run some tests and report back with pictures.
> 
> Thanks for the quick answers the last hour and all the answers to questions I've asked over the last who-knows-how-long while working up to it.
> 
> Edit: preliminary results promising. Temps on insane overclock dropped from 60C above ambient (79-19) to 45c (63-18) above ambient.


Nice! 15*C is a good drop.


----------



## jdorje

Sorry for all the posts. This is my last one on the delidding of this chip - though I have another one yet to come.





I spent a bit of time today upping the overclock on my g3258 in preparation for the delid. Before delid, average temp (under p95 load) on core 1 was 79.2 and on core 2 75.2 with 19 +- 0.5C ambients. Core 1 therefore was +60.2C from ambient. After delid average temp is 65.6 - 17 = 48.6 on core 0 and 64.3-17=47.3 on core 1. That's a 11.6C / 19% drop on core 0 and 8.9C / 16% on core 1. (My original impression was that it was more, but I didn't realize ambient had dropped.) I was also able to drop voltage by (rather insignificant) .01V on the max overclock, from 1.42V to 1.41V.

Now to take the story in order:

First step was to heat the sucker up. In hindsight I'm not sure this did much if anything; it just loses all that heat so quickly. But I wanted the glue warm when I did the delid, so I kept it at ~80C for 25 minutes before taking it right out and delidding.

I used the vice-only method. Hooked one end of the vice under the IHS and the other end against the pcb, with a coffee filter in between the metal and pcb for minimal buffering. I had to turn the vice quite a bit even after it was locked in place, but the distinctive pop when it came loose was...uh...distinctive. Removing the IHS from PCB was still some work, and I might have messed up here a bit as I dropped the pcb onto the ihs in doing so. I've seen some videos where it comes right off, but if it doesn't it's probably best to lock the ihs back into the vice and twist off the pcb carefully.

Removing the glue from the pbc took a lot of time. It wasn't hard/required force, just...it was so damn sticky. Eventually it all came loose as you can see in the second picture. Used a credit card for this and just kept scrubbing. I over-cleaned the ihs, breaking the credit card in half and using the sharp edges to pull glue out of the corners. Scrubbed both heat-conductive surfaces with iso alcohol (I only have 91%), and did a brief cleaning of all the rest of it with the same alcohol. Coffee filters were used in abundance.

Finally came the CLU. I've seen a video where the guy puts a drop of CLU on another surface and then dabs that to cover the die. I was planning to do that, but in the event I just put a tiny dab right on the die. And by tiny, I mean absurdly small. It was the smallest amount I could get out of the needle - actually smaller than the smallest amount, as after I dabbed it to the die a lot was still just sticking out of the needle. Wasn't certain what to do with that so I just covered the needle as it was. If I had to guess I could get 100 applications out of the needle with that amount applied.

The CLU came with a little brush with which I very, very, very carefully spread it all over the die. CLU basically spreads indefinitely so I feel even less would have worked. Used some more coffee filters to brush off everything around the die and inspect for droplets (there might have been one tiny one on the pcb but it came up easily...it was so small I'm not even sure it was CLU).

Then I dropped the IHS in place on top and pressed down. This part has to be done extremely carefully as you don't want it sliding out of place and carrying CLU with it. Once the IHS was on it went right into the CPU socket which I closed up.

In reapplying thermal paste (some old ceramique I've been trying to get rid of for who-the-hell-knows-how-long) I did a thin line right down where I knew the die was. Absolute amount of thermal paste was lower than any previous application I've done, I think. Remounting the 212 evo was easy.

Any further information will be edited back into this post. Like I said I still have a second delid to do; this was only the preparation for my 4690k. The g3258 didn't at all need delidding temperature-wise, but the cooler tends to be a bit noisy when it ramps up when the thing goes under load in its everyday overclock. Lower temps in this case probably just means less noise, but I imagine I'll raise the everyday OC a bit as well.


----------



## jdorje

The g3258 delid went so well, I couldn't wait any longer on the 4690k.



Right from the beginning though things went wrong. As I was putting the CPU in the vise the lights dimmed. I thought for a moment it might be a sign, but I went ahead. The IHS and PCB came loose a lot easier this time.

The glue came off a lot easier too. This glue was a lot stringier, and less crumbly; it came off in big swaths. I took the credit card to it with little trouble. The die was a lot larger and the vrm cap's far more numerous on the i5.

All the time though I was rushing. I wasn't in the right frame of mind. I wasn't panicking or hurrying, but I wasn't centered and focused. I was excitable. I cought the CC on the caps a couple times as I was pulling the glue off.

Brushing on the CLU went straightforward, but I got a miniscule dot on the pcb. It was the opposite side of the caps, but in trying to brush it off it just spread everywhere. I should have read up beforehand on how to clean CLU. I feel like I put on too much CLU this time; the dab that came out of the syringe was a fair bit bigger than my first attempt.

Putting on the IHS didn't go as well. The intial placement was off by maybe a millimeter, and I'm sure the adjustment dragged clu a bit - thought it was in the opposite direction of the caps. When I finally got it mounted the ihs was a little crooked.

Then came the worst part. Somehow I lost a screw, and in looking for it I lost two more screws. It actually took around an hour to find them all. I'm not particularly religious, but I couldn't help but feel I was being given a sign. Don't boot up this chip!

FInally got everything put together again and my h80i remounted. I think the mounting was probably crap since I got 3 screws on then moved the case around a lot before I could find the 4th. So I might redo that.

But it booted just fine. Temps only dropped ~2C on cores 0 and 1, 3C on core 3, and 5C on core 2 (which was previously the hottest). As a percentage it's a 4%/4%/9%/6% drop. Disappointing, though I guess I'll hold out on judgement until I remount my cooler. It might be enough difference to stress test at 1 multiplier higher.

A somewhat strange thing happened: the temps on the h80i sensor dropped by about 1.5 degrees. This sensor is quite accurate and I think this measurement is significant. But I have no idea what it means. The water temperature shouldn't have changed, and the sensor which is in the metal of the waterblock (I think)...seems like it also shouldn't have changed. But instead it dropped. It might be indicative of a bad mount if the sensor is in a place that isn't transferring heat.

Edit: I remounted the h80i and improved temps significantly. However I realized my method of comparing temps isn't accurate, since I have a fan curve instead of fixed speed so lower temps = lower fan curve = not as much lower temps as it could be. So the delid (both 4690k and probably even more so the g3258) is actually a bit bettter than the numbers show. One thing I can compare is different settings at the same temperature; I can run overclocked at 4.5 ghz/1.22V and it's about the same temperature it was pre-delid at stock. So yeah, temps are indeed an insane improvement.

4690k data. All data taken by running p95 (1344-1344 in place 27.9) until h80i temperatures maxed out, then waiting a couple minutes, then resetting hwinfo stats and taking 15 minutes of data. [email protected] profile. Ambient measured with a low-tech thermometer placed near the case front intake - should be accurate to about 0.5C.


Pre delid ambient delta per core: +53, +56, +57, +51
Post delid ambient delta per core: +43 +46 +45 +42
Delid delta per core: -10 -10 -12 -9
Delid delta percentages: -19% -18% -21% -18%
Comparing the delta to the h80i temp might be more accurate since it shouldn't depend on the fan curve. However it's more dependent on the h80i mount since the sensor is somewhere in the metal of the waterblock heatsink - in particular the post-delid test had about a 2.5C hotter h80i temp. The percentages here might be more in line with what I'd see on an uber overclock with a custom loop, if you keep your water temp very near ambient. However the h80i temp isn't the water temp, it's somewhere in the block.


Pre delid h80i delta per core: +28 +31 +32 +26
Post delid h80i delta per core: +19.5 +22.5 +21.5 +18.5
Delid delta per core: -8.5 -8.5 -10.5 -7.5
Delid delta percentages: -30% -27% -33% -29%
Point of mild interest: core 2 saw the biggest improvement, both absolute and as a percentage. It went from the hottest core (barely edging out core 1) to, well, getting edged out by core 1. Core 3 saw the smallest absolute improvement as it had the lowest original temps (supposedly it's adjacent to the igpu which acts as a minor heat sink), but the percentage improvement was still of the same order.


----------



## fat4l

Did you apply the paste(CLU) to both sided ? You should otherwise there will be air bubles and it will spread unevenly ->higher temps


----------



## Rayce185

Is there a delid die guard for 2011's to be bought anywhere?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rayce185*
> 
> Is there a delid die guard for 2011's to be bought anywhere?


No, as the 2011s are soldered, delliding them like their mainstream brethren will be a bad day. The two people that have done it are not exactly a large enough target audience to launch such a product.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fat4l*
> 
> Did you apply the paste(CLU) to both sided ? You should otherwise there will be air bubles and it will spread unevenly ->higher temps


Discussed in the last page. Rather than cover the vrm caps and clu both die and ihs, I only did clu on the die. Worked great for the g3258 but not the 4690k.

I don't understand why putting clu on both would reduce air bubbles. With normal tim you only apply to one side. But I don't understand how air bubbles don't form anyway. How does the air get out?

If I made mistakes mounting the 4690k ihs it was in my lack of precision in dropping the ihs on top. And I feel I used too much clu.

But most likely I think it's a bad mount of my h80i, which I can easily redo. It sat there with three screws in half-mounted while I shook the case out and moved it around for an hour searching. Not my finest moment.


----------



## fat4l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Discussed in the last page. Rather than cover the vrm caps and clu both die and ihs, I only did clu on the die. Worked great for the g3258 but not the 4690k.
> 
> I don't understand why putting clu on both would reduce air bubbles. With normal tim you only apply to one side. But I don't understand how air bubbles don't form anyway. How does the air get out?
> 
> If I made mistakes mounting the 4690k ihs it was in my lack of precision in dropping the ihs on top. And I feel I used too much clu.
> 
> But most likely I think it's a bad mount of my h80i, which I can easily redo. It sat there with three screws in half-mounted while I shook the case out and moved it around for an hour searching. Not my finest moment.


Well the problem is CLU is not a normal paste. Keep this in mind. It doesnt spread "just like that" thats why you will have air bubles there. Once it is applied to the material then it spreads much easier. Otherwise it will try to "find the easier way out" and not spread evenly.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fat4l*
> 
> Did you apply the paste(CLU) to both sided ? You should otherwise there will be air bubles and it will spread unevenly ->higher temps


You are incorrect there, this applies to regular compounds - not the liquid metals. Applying liquid metal to both sides increases your risk of having entirely too much metal there, which would bleed out and run.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You are incorrect there, this applies to regular compounds - not the liquid metals. Applying liquid metal to both sides increases your risk of having entirely too much metal there, which would bleed out and run.


Not true either about the bleeding out unless you have used too much, which would be "mis-applying". But he is also incorrect about the bubbles whom you quoted with this type of material. I fully recommend doing both the underside of the ihs and the die. It will only run if you use too much. The way I usually apply it is to make a small drop of clu peek out at the end of the syringe and just touch the end of your brush to it. I would not put it directly onto the die, you risk putting to much that way. Paint both the die and the underside of the IHS using what you would think is not enough, always use the same side of the brush turning the chip around if you need to change directions, if you keep brushing and brushing it will spread and spread, finally do a nice single wide one directional brush from bottom to top as the last stroke to smooth it, duplicate the area on the underside ihs which is often stained from the old stock paste and that faint box can be used as your guide.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> The g3258 delid went so well, I couldn't wait any longer on the 4690k.


To me this is perfect example of too much CLU, it should be like glass when you are done. Also do you see the faint staining on the underside of the ihs. That is your guide to that area. @fat4l @blaze2210

Even though he missed the corners below, I give this a B+ for how thin it should look as well as uniform after application


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Not true either about the bleeding out unless you have used too much, which would be "mis-applying". But he is also incorrect about the bubbles whom you quoted with this type of material. I fully recommend doing both the underside of the ihs and the die. It will only run if you use too much. The way I usually apply it is to make a small drop of clu peek out at the end of the syringe and just touch the end of your brush to it. I would not put it directly onto the die, you risk putting to much that way. Paint both the die and the underside of the IHS using what you would think is not enough, always use the same side of the brush turning the chip around if you need to change directions, if you keep brushing and brushing it will spread and spread, finally do a nice single wide one directional brush from bottom to top as the last stroke to smooth it, duplicate the area on the underside ihs which is often stained from the old stock paste and that faint box can be used as your guide.


Please re-read my post, "*increases your risk of having entirely too much liquid metal there, which would bleed out and run*". Portion control is easier when the focus is on one side. Also, you really only need a thin layer to get the nice temp drops, so you can actually conserve the CLU/CLP and still get the same results. Whatever floats your boat though, I won't sink it....








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> To me this is perfect example of too much CLU, it should be like glass when you are done. Also do you see the faint staining on the underside of the ihs. That is your guide to that area. @fat4l @blaze2210


So those little mounds on the die is considered to be too much, but then you recommend adding a whole separate coating to the underside of the IHS? That seems a bit contradictory to me.


----------



## fat4l

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You are incorrect there, this applies to regular compounds - not the liquid metals. Applying liquid metal to both sides increases your risk of having entirely too much metal there, which would bleed out and run.


Well I have been using CL pro for years now so ....I think I know what I'm talking about








You have to spread the paste so it makes a perfect contact with the material othwerwise it will spread unevenly even tho it is applied evenly on one of the touching surfaces.

Watch this:





From the CL Ultra manual:
You can apply the Liquid Ultra on one *or both surfaces,* but the whole applied amount should not be too big.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fat4l*
> 
> Well I have been using CL pro for years now so ....I think I know what I'm talking about
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Watch this:


Same here, on both CPUs and GPUs. Just because someone prefers to use more than is necessary, doesn't mean that it will persuade me to. I get the same awesome results as everyone else, while using about half of the CLP that the "both sides method" uses. I'm perfectly fine with that.


----------



## chronicfx

Ok, you guys are the pro's... standing down


----------



## blaze2210

Basically, if you're doing a proper application, you should probably end up with about the same amount of liquid metal on there. It's just up to you whether you want to apply all of that amount to one side, or split it between two sides.









Similar to the delidding methods: go with whatever method you feel the most comfortable with.


----------



## fat4l

you dont need to use a ton of paste.
I only use a small drop that can barely spread to the whole area.
By doing this one CLpro lasts for 5+ double applications easy. I've also never had any problems with "too much paste".

And the vid shows what happens if you apply it only to one surface.
You do what you do. I will do what I consider better


----------



## DR4G00N

OCN name: DR4G00N
CPU: AMD A8-3870K
on die-TIM: MX-4
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 0MHz
OC after delid: 3.57GHz @ 1.5V
Temp drops: 23c Load
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/2lru9c

The validation is a few days old from when I was benching it last time, but it still has my username so I figured it was fine.

//////

For applying CLU I just give the die an even coat, it always works great for me. Did my X5670 & two HD 4850's that way.


----------



## jdorje

I've only done the two delids posted above, but here's my feeling.

I knew when I spread it on the 4690k it was too much. I wish I'd taken a picture of the g3258 because it really felt perfect. The layer was so incredibly thin but it just kept spreading and spreading. I really doubt that its possible to use too little paste. The die and IHS are supposed to be pressed right up against each other so the LM is just filling the gaps between the two pieces of flat metal.

I really like the idea of using the brush to just grab a tiny bit of LM from the syringe. Wish I'd done that.

All that said I doubt there's a significant thermal penalty from having your LM being 0.3 mm thick instead of 0.1 mm.

I don't see how there can be an advantage from applying it to both sides. Sure you can probably make it just as thin if you take the metal from the die and just move it over to the ihs. But then you have to worry about placement. And even if you have a stain to show where the ihs and die should line up (my 4690k had one but the g325 didn't- it just had a huge blob of a stain), there's no guarantee that's where you'll line it up again when you remount.

As for my 4690k, I'm going to remount the h80i tonight. The thermal sensor can only be explained by a bad mount. It's much cooler than before under load, but when I end the load it stays warmer than my hottest cores for over a minute (think 35-40c on the cores at idle with the h80i thermal sensor at 42C).

Edit: remounted my h80i. Temps dropped 7-10C from it. Will test and edit the final numbers back in at the top. I've got quite good data on this, with records of min/max/average running prime95 and a precise ambient measurement. But it looks like a ~12C drop in max temps from the pre-delid, from 80C down to 68; with ambient of 18C on both that's a 20% reduction.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I've only done the two delids posted above, but here's my feeling.
> 
> I knew when I spread it on the 4690k it was too much. I wish I'd taken a picture of the g3258 because it really felt perfect. The layer was so incredibly thin but it just kept spreading and spreading. I really doubt that its possible to use too little paste. The die and IHS are supposed to be pressed right up against each other so the LM is just filling the gaps between the two pieces of flat metal.
> 
> I really like the idea of using the brush to just grab a tiny bit of LM from the syringe. Wish I'd done that.
> 
> All that said I doubt there's a significant thermal penalty from having your LM being 0.3 mm thick instead of 0.1 mm.
> 
> I don't see how there can be an advantage from applying it to both sides. Sure you can probably make it just as thin if you take the metal from the die and just move it over to the ihs. But then you have to worry about placement. And even if you have a stain to show where the ihs and die should line up (my 4690k had one but the g325 didn't- it just had a huge blob of a stain), there's no guarantee that's where you'll line it up again when you remount.
> 
> As for my 4690k, I'm going to remount the h80i tonight. The thermal sensor can only be explained by a bad mount. It's much cooler than before under load, but when I end the load it stays warmer than my hottest cores for over a minute (think 35-40c on the cores at idle with the h80i thermal sensor at 42C).
> 
> Edit: remounted my h80i. Temps dropped 7-10C from it. Will test and edit the final numbers back in at the top. I've got quite good data on this, with records of min/max/average running prime95 and a precise ambient measurement. But it looks like a ~12C drop in max temps from the pre-delid, from 80C down to 68; with ambient of 18C on both that's a 20% reduction.


The idea behind brushing both surfaces is that you are filling in crevices on both surfaces with the TIM and then mating the together, there is no guarantee just doing one of the sides would achieve filling in the other surfaces crevices, liquid metal is not as free flowing as you run of the mill TIM. This is not a proven thing but when I visualize it, it made sense to me to do it this way. I have only de-lidded two chips but have upgraded several motherboards and heat sinks/water blocks for performance or cleaning reasons with them and probably have brushed on the CLU 10+ times over the life of the two chips. I have always had good results matching the original application. So that is my own method and reasoning. Of course we are here to share information and findings not to demand others to do what we say


----------



## Tuckers

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> The idea behind brushing both surfaces is that you are filling in crevices on both surfaces with the TIM and then mating the together, there is no guarantee just doing one of the sides would achieve filling in the other surfaces crevices, liquid metal is not as free flowing as you run of the mill TIM. This is not a proven thing but when I visualize it, it made sense to me to do it this way. I have only de-lidded two chips but have upgraded several motherboards and heat sinks/water blocks for performance or cleaning reasons with them and probably have brushed on the CLU 10+ times over the life of the two chips. I have always had good results matching the original application. So that is my own method and reasoning. Of course we are here to share information and findings not to demand others to do what we say


do u run that i5 3570k at 5.1mhz on 1.5v all the time or was that just for benching?


----------



## Rayce185

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> No, as the 2011s are soldered, delliding them like their mainstream brethren will be a bad day. The two people that have done it are not exactly a large enough target audience to launch such a product.


Not that I haven't delidded soldered CPU's before, but I guess the temperature advantage will not be worth it on phase change.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rayce185*
> 
> Not that I haven't delidded soldered CPU's before, but I guess the temperature advantage will not be worth it on phase change.


Nope, unless your temps differ horrendously across cores, delidding would yield nothing but worse temps. Especially on SS since you'd have to use paste on the die.


----------



## Zetsu

Delid Tools!! let me know what do u thinks about ...


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

I think It doesn't matter what anyone thinks, you got it done.

This is too much work ;D


----------



## Zetsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeviceP0tat0*
> 
> I think It doesn't matter what anyone thinks, you got it done.
> 
> This is too much work ;D


Thanks really mate!!!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tuckers*
> 
> do u run that i5 3570k at 5.1mhz on 1.5v all the time or was that just for benching?


5.1 was just validation. I ran it at 5.0ghz and 1.5v for a longtime. It is not overclocked anymore because I gave it to my older brother out of state this summer and he wouldn't know where to begin if it ever became unstable.


----------



## Benjiw

That overclocker knows his stuff, but I've never had a dot method not cover the entire IHS on any of my heatsink installs so I'm not entirely sure why his failed to cover the entire thing? I'll stick the to the dot method, it works for me anyway, as for the CLU debate, it doesn't matter, do what's best in your eyes, if you've tested other methods and your way of doing it yields the best results then great.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> OCN name: DR4G00N
> CPU: AMD A8-3870K
> on die-TIM: MX-4
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 0MHz
> OC after delid: 3.57GHz @ 1.5V
> Temp drops: 23c Load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/2lru9c
> 
> The validation is a few days old from when I was benching it last time, but it still has my username so I figured it was fine.
> 
> //////
> 
> For applying CLU I just give the die an even coat, it always works great for me. Did my X5670 & two HD 4850's that way.


You're In! Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## jdorje

Dot method never covers anwyhere near the whole heatsink. You'd need to spread it with a credit card (I use a piece of paper) for that. It covers the die area though without any possibility for bubbles which is probably better for CPU.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Dot method never covers anwyhere near the whole heatsink. You'd need to spread it with a credit card (I use a piece of paper) for that. It covers the die area though without any possibility for bubbles which is probably better for CPU.


I've always got good coverage from the dot, cpu and heatsink are always corner to corner with TIM.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I've always got good coverage from the dot, cpu and heatsink are always corner to corner with TIM.


Sounds like way too much tim to me.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Sounds like way too much tim to me.


Nope, not leaking off the sides either. Must be witchcraft.


----------



## jdorje

Looks like I lost .01V off my 4690k overclock (1.3->1.29V with other settings identical) and .01V off my g3258 oc (1.42->1.41). That's with a 9C decrease in max temp on the 4690k and about a 13C decrease on the g3258 at those settings.


----------



## madmanmarz

I had been absolutely losing my mind after not being able to post with my Skylake delid. I was using the aqua computer skylake spacer to be used without the cap. I could not get the computer to post no matter what. I ordered a new motherboard thinking I damaged the old one and tried again with no avail. Finally I removed the spacer and setup everything back the way it was and just put the cap on and it booted.

It must be an issue with getting everything to go down evenly and or mounting pressure.

I think I'm just gonna leave the cap on. Also you gotta be super careful because without the cap the CPU can move in the socket and bend the pins. Ask me how I know.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> I had been absolutely losing my mind after not being able to post with my Skylake delid. I was using the aqua computer skylake spacer to be used without the cap. I could not get the computer to post no matter what. I ordered a new motherboard thinking I damaged the old one and tried again with no avail. Finally I removed the spacer and setup everything back the way it was and just put the cap on and it booted.
> 
> It must be an issue with getting everything to go down evenly and or mounting pressure.
> 
> I think I'm just gonna leave the cap on. Also you gotta be super careful because without the cap the CPU can move in the socket and bend the pins. Ask me how I know.


Were you the post a while back that wanted to use an air cooler on the die?


----------



## der8auer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> I had been absolutely losing my mind after not being able to post with my Skylake delid. I was using the aqua computer skylake spacer to be used without the cap. I could not get the computer to post no matter what. I ordered a new motherboard thinking I damaged the old one and tried again with no avail. Finally I removed the spacer and setup everything back the way it was and just put the cap on and it booted.
> 
> It must be an issue with getting everything to go down evenly and or mounting pressure.
> 
> I think I'm just gonna leave the cap on. Also you gotta be super careful because without the cap the CPU can move in the socket and bend the pins. Ask me how I know.


Skylake PCB is thinner which means the whole CPU is lower in the socket compared to haswell/ivy

As a result, the surrounding plastic socket is higher than the chip in the middle by about 0.4 mm

Unless you modify your cooler to have a contact surface of about 33x33mm or cut the edges of the socket it won't work direct die.


----------



## Sweetcheeba

Just made this video earlier:




https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool


----------



## johnd0e

does anybody sell those 3d printed delid tools? cuase id buy one in a heartbeat.


----------



## jdorje

I don't see why the haswell/ivy vice-only delid tools would be safer. Force is being applied in exactly the same way, and I've never actually heard of a vice-caused chip destruction (surely it's happened though right?).

Skylake is a completely different story apparently with its breakable PCB. But still if you just use the vice-only delid...force is still being applied the same way, and I don't see why it would protect the PCB.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I don't see why the haswell/ivy vice-only delid tools would be safer. Force is being applied in exactly the same way, and I've never actually heard of a vice-caused chip destruction (surely it's happened though right?).
> 
> Skylake is a completely different story apparently with its breakable PCB. But still if you just use the vice-only delid...force is still being applied the same way, and I don't see why it would protect the PCB.


The way I see it the plastic supports the chip on the outer edges stopping the pcb from bending and breaking .


----------



## Sweetcheeba

Unfortunately the IHS design on Ivy is slightly different to Haswell and Skylake so the above tool won't work on Ivy in it's current form.

It's a real tight fit as you can see in the video, there is no way for the PCB to bend or for it to jump out the tool. Works perfectly - no danger involved.

And to think I took a hammer and block of wood to my 3770k


----------



## tonarilla

3570k delidded and Ihs lapped


----------



## Danzle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sweetcheeba*
> 
> Just made this video earlier:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool


Love hove people come up with different ideas! Could yours be used with a hammer?


----------



## Sweetcheeba

Yeah it's a great idea, many thanks to Chri for sharing.

It's printed using PLA plastic with an infill - while it's strong I wouldn't hit it with a hammer. If you don't have a vice you could use a g clamp instead or maybe tap it with a rubber mallet. Feels wrong saying that though!


----------



## DeviceP0tat0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Were you the post a while back that wanted to use an air cooler on the die?


I'm in this same camp - though would be offloading the mod work to a local pro if going bare die, since tools or suite space to acquire said mechanisms are not available to my person. Still debating it.

Throwing a NH-L9x65 (with proper 25mm height fan; either a Delta or Noctua's 92mm) on a Asus VII impact -- if air (and likely just do a delid/relid myself since I don't know if Noctua's system would bottom out - or inability to be modified to begin with); Raijintek Pallas would have been next choice, but those coolers are nowhere to be found (in Canada), since cooling appeared better than Noctua's LP coolers.

Case: DeepCool Tristellar
Has support for a single 120mm rad, but wc loops have had, in two different systems - both failed around the same time - so I have a "thing" against it.

___________
Doing some reading in other places, even this thread... I don't know why people are trying to chastise others because it's not "extreme" enough for them, or for whatever weird reason think that temperature being high (and thus fans running higher) should be the norm for today's processors (remember Intel saying they'd run cooler?). I, for one, want quieter fan profiles for the in-today's processor and would rather a stable clock not be dictated by how poorly the TIM dissipates heat. When I decide to overclock in the future - once it starts showing its age, it means that I had the tools prepared today so I don't have to go looking online for obsoleted/discontinued hardware two-three years down the road (secondhand is a gamble, and having to deal with Chinesium is another issue).


----------



## Loladinas

So I finally delidded my 4790k last night. Used the vice method, it was really simple. Since it's going to take about a week for my CLP to arrive I tried using it with MX-4 and noticed no difference in temps at all. What I haven't done is, I haven't cleaned off the adhesive off the PCB. I'm guessing that's why I'm not seeing any decrease in temps? Any tips on how to get that gunk off without doing any damage to what's under it? I tried using a cotton pad and some isopropyl alcohol, but the damn thing just won't budge.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> So I finally delidded my 4790k last night. Used the vice method, it was really simple. Since it's going to take about a week for my CLP to arrive I tried using it with MX-4 and noticed no difference in temps at all. What I haven't done is, I haven't cleaned off the adhesive off the PCB. I'm guessing that's why I'm not seeing any decrease in temps? Any tips on how to get that gunk off without doing any damage to what's under it? I tried using a cotton pad and some isopropyl alcohol, but the damn thing just won't budge.


soak the glue in alcohol, and use a plastic card or your nail. It should come right out


----------



## jdorje

Confusing thing.

9 days since delid now. I'm not sure at what point in there things changed but my temps are a lot lower now. x264 at 4.7 ghz, 1.35V I have recorded from pre-delid as at least 83C. I say at least, because I didn't do high stressing at that level once temps started passing 80, and it likely went higher.

On the same settings my highest temp now is 66.

I'm assuming my cooler remount took a few days for the paste to spread out.

Edit: just remembered I also removed the front cover of my s340, which drops h80i temps by a few additional degrees. However I don't know if it's temp related but I dropped my overclock from 1.36V - already at least .02V lower than I could stabilize pre-delid - down now to 1.34V. On the other hand, maybe I'm just better at tweaking tertiary voltages now. (Aka christ why do I need 1.66V ram just to run it at 1600...)


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> So I finally delidded my 4790k last night. Used the vice method, it was really simple. Since it's going to take about a week for my CLP to arrive I tried using it with MX-4 and noticed no difference in temps at all. What I haven't done is, I haven't cleaned off the adhesive off the PCB. I'm guessing that's why I'm not seeing any decrease in temps? Any tips on how to get that gunk off without doing any damage to what's under it? I tried using a cotton pad and some isopropyl alcohol, but the damn thing just won't budge.


You're not seeing a difference in temps because you're doing the same thing that quite a few people do: you're trying to use something other than a liquid metal TIM to try to get the same results as everyone else (those who are using a liquid metal). Let me save you some time and tell you that no other TIM will come close to the results that a liquid metal TIM will get you, and that you'll be wasting your time trying. If you haven't cleaned the glue off of the PCB, then you've been gyping yourself out of better results. This is because the glue adds distance between the IHS and the CPU die.

So, ultimately, I recommend that you do some research as to why people actually delid their CPUs, then apply those concepts to your own ventures. For removing the glue, just use your thumb nail, then some alcohol to remove the remaining traces,


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> I've read IDC's research into the matter, I just thought that maybe they've fixed the adhesive thickness with DC. Anyway, I already have ordered CLP, it'll just take a week or so to get here, and MX-4 was the only thing I had on hand. That's what I get for living in Bum**** Nowhere.
> I've cleaned the gunk off of the heatspreader, but a fair bit of it is left on the PCB. Like I said, tried rubbing it off, wouldn't come off, decided to ask for advice before I damaged anything. Guess I'll just wait until I get my TIM in mail, cleaning it now would mean I have to remount it again without much of an improvement anyway. Ugh, the suspense is killing me.


Well, to be fair, upon complete removal of the adhesive, most ppl see a 3-5C drop in temps, which don't last due to the tim pumping out. Just use ethanol and your nail to remove the adhesive. Make sure to be extra careful around the fivr area.. Once clu is applied, then the temp drops off a cliff


----------



## jdorje

You shouldn't use the term gyping. It's a racial slur against a race that was genocided. (An old girlfriend pointed that out and after reflection I realized she was right. )

But on topic, yes, what he said. Use lm and scrape off the adhesive with a credit card. One guy many pages back did report okay results with kryonaut. But removing the adhesive to reduce the gap is ~equally important.


----------



## Vario

Biggest thing is reducing that black adhesive so that the gap is less. TIM isn't as big a deal. The thinner stuff that gives you better temperatures can slide out from thermal changes anyway. I did a few delids with Celeron 420s and a 3570k, the black RTV will come off with a finger nail and a lot of dedication. Getting that stuff off is really important to get the lid closer to the die.

I did about 6 chips total, the black RTV was sometimes very solid and hard to get off, other times it crumbled right off.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Were you the post a while back that wanted to use an air cooler on the die?


No I'm on a water block.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *der8auer*
> 
> Skylake PCB is thinner which means the whole CPU is lower in the socket compared to haswell/ivy
> 
> As a result, the surrounding plastic socket is higher than the chip in the middle by about 0.4 mm
> 
> Unless you modify your cooler to have a contact surface of about 33x33mm or cut the edges of the socket it won't work direct die.


Well dang how about that. Oddly enough I removed and remounted the block many different times trying different ways to space it out and each time the block had made good contact with the CPU, and the paste spread out evenly on both sides. The CPU would always be stuck to the water block on removal. I finally was able to figure out that you have to tighten everything up perfectly even and if you don't put enough pressure, it won't post, and if you put too much pressure - it still won't post.

Still it's just wayy too dangerous working around those open pins unless you pull your motherboard out, drain your water cooling (unless you have long hoses)...even though I managed to get it working with the delid and spacer I would say that if someone wanted to go direct-die, you want to have a water block that has a built in shim for direct-die applications, or go on ebay and buy a copper shim for your block so you can use the original retention bracket. There is just so much risk of the CPU moving around in the socket without it unless the system is totally disassembled and being built from scratch.

I ended up putting the cap back on with ceramique 2 on die and on the cap and my temps are looking good and it looks like 4.7 is gonna be stable.

I hope this post saves someone a lot of frustration!


----------



## der8auer

You should move to a better paste. You can gain 10°C with a proper paste and probably 15°C with liquid metal.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *der8auer*
> 
> You should move to a better paste. You can gain 10°C with a proper paste and probably 15°C with liquid metal.


What do you consider to be good other than clu and clp?


----------



## jdorje

Only liquid metal is good under the ihs. Clu is the easiest to work with.


----------



## cephelix

Agree with jdorje. CLU is the preferred one for under the ihs. Anything else and the temp drop won't be as drastic and temps will creep back up after a few months


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *der8auer*
> 
> You should move to a better paste. You can gain 10°C with a proper paste and probably 15°C with liquid metal.


I'll get around to the liquid metal thing eventually but I did get lower temps and I'm now at 4.7 instead of 4.6 on a very cheap motherboard. Also I have found Ceramique to be among the best non metal thermal pastes and it's non conductive. It always does really well in reviews and no one ever talks about it. I have used many of them, mx-2, mx-4, as5, thermalright, and ceramique is just as good if not better.

But yeah eventually there needs to be some proper metal paste under the cap, this was just not what I was expecting to do since I originally meant to run direct die.


----------



## bbragg

Noob question probably but here goes ...

Someone mentioned to me that the Haswell-E IHS is soldered like Sandy Bridge used to be ... is this true? Or have I just not read long enough to run into a delidded Haswell-E yet? There's more than a few pages in this thread.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bbragg*
> 
> Noob question probably but here goes ...
> 
> Someone mentioned to me that the Haswell-E IHS is soldered like Sandy Bridge used to be ... is this true? Or have I just not read long enough to run into a delidded Haswell-E yet? There's more than a few pages in this thread.


Yes it is, all the "-E" chips are soldered.


----------



## vicyo

As I miss my previous Lapped G3258, I got a cheap G530, delided and lapped the IHS so I don't have to lap the IHS from my 4690K


----------



## Loladinas

So today being Friday I kind of expected to get my CLP and Kryonaut TIM in mail today. Last night, in anticipation of my package, I took my 4970k out again and cleaned all the gunk off of it. The adhesive was still very elastic, took me nearly two hours to get it off using my fingernails and a whole lot of 99% ispropyl soaked q-tips. A complete pain in the ass. Sadly no package today. Best case scenario it's only going to get here on Monday. I kind of expected to OC a bit and run some tests during the weekend. Put the CPU back in again with the same MX-4, albeit spread very thinly. Too lazy to assemble the whole thing again so now it's running semi-passive, with AP181 for an intake. Considering it has no fans temps seem... better? I've got Netflix in the background, tweaked a picture in Lightroom, Pale Moon open. Max recorded temp is 39, but it's hovering around 24C most of the time, with room temp being 18C. Speaking of pictures;


----------



## Benjiw

Ok so I've delidded my 4670k, I don't have alcohol to get the black crap off can I just use a credit card? Also am I correct in assuming I 100% need to cover the chips/vrm down the side of the die?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Ok so I've delidded my 4670k, I don't have alcohol to get the black crap off can I just use a credit card? Also am I correct in assuming I 100% need to cover the chips/vrm down the side of the die?


You've gotta have alcohol to clean the die.

Use a credit card for the glue.

I don't think you should cover the VRM caps. Just use a tiny amount of LM on the die and throw the IHS right back on and lock it down.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I don't think you should cover the VRM caps. Just use a tiny amount of LM on the die and throw the IHS right back on and lock it down.


Well, I've got clear nail polish on the SMDs and so far it's running fine.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> You've gotta have alcohol to clean the die.
> 
> Use a credit card for the glue.
> 
> I don't think you should cover the VRM caps. Just use a tiny amount of LM on the die and throw the IHS right back on and lock it down.


How come only alcohol for the die? I've been using surgical spirit which is pretty good for IHS and heatsinks.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How come only alcohol for the die? I've been using surgical spirit which is pretty good for IHS and heatsinks.


isn't it the same thing except for the concentration?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> isn't it the same thing except for the concentration?


That's what I thought lol but dunno.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Of course I just placed my *third* order on Performance-pcs.com in a week...... dont ask...







, and now I go to check my order status (neurotic I know) and I see this!!! I thought about getting more kyronaut and thermal pads for my GPU so I looked through Thermal Grizzly's entire line... it wasn't there yesterday


http://www.performance-pcs.com/thermal-grizzly-conductonaut-high-performance-thermal-grease-1g.html#Features

looks like a liquid metal TIM from Thermal grizzly! What the crap, thinking about making a fourth order..... dat shipping though

I NEED to know how this does between the die/spreader!

A link to a oc.net user's post about it
http://www.overclock.net/t/1588116/thermal-grizzly-conductonaut-73-w-mk


----------



## Benjiw

So I've been rubbing the pcb for some time now, there are faint marks on the PCB from the IHS glue but I'm not sure if I should carry on because I'm worried I'll damage the PCB with the alcohol. Just how clean can you get the PCB?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> So I've been rubbing the pcb for some time now, there are faint marks on the PCB from the IHS glue but I'm not sure if I should carry on because I'm worried I'll damage the PCB with the alcohol. Just how clean can you get the PCB?


there will be faint marks/stains from the glue. So long as the glue itself is gone, it would be fine


----------



## Benjiw

can liquid metal touch the pcb at all? just not the SDM things? I've covered them with nail polish anyway.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> can liquid metal touch the pcb at all? just not the SDM things? I've covered them with nail polish anyway.


Technically it could i think but you would want to clean it up regardless...don't want a stray bead finding its way to exposed bits and shorting everything


----------



## jdorje

Lm won't move from where you put it. Just be very patient in brushing with the smallest amount possible. One suggestion was not to put a drop on the die - that'd be too much - but just use the brush to pick up a little from the end of the needle.


----------



## Benjiw

How does this look?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How does this look?


looks good... i usually just give the whole pcb a wipe down afterwards in case i missed any stray beads of CLU


----------



## DR4G00N

Experimented with some direct-die cooling on my A8-3870K and the results were amazing.








Prime 95 Small FFT @ 3.5GHz 1.5V = 26c on the cores with an ambient of 16c.









I was using a H110 with CLU on the die.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Experimented with some direct-die cooling on my A8-3870K and the results were amazing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prime 95 Small FFT @ 3.5GHz 1.5V = 26c on the cores with an ambient of 16c.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was using a H110 with CLU on the die.


AMD APU? Kind of want one of those to delid and overclock to make a HTPC, do you read the temps with amd overdrive? I read that other software can't read the temps properly? Please correct me if I'm incorrect. I don't know much about them and would appreciate the knowledge.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> AMD APU? Kind of want one of those to delid and overclock to make a HTPC, do you read the temps with amd overdrive? I read that other software can't read the temps properly? Please correct me if I'm incorrect. I don't know much about them and would appreciate the knowledge.


I used HWmonitor to read temps but I didn't set an offset so the actual core temps are probably 40-45c.







The temp reporting bug only applies to every generation of apu's after Llano.

My chip sucks though, 3.83GHz @ 1.67V was the best I could do.


----------



## Benjiw

Ok guys, I've got my water block on and tried to level it out as much as possible but havent tightened the thumb nuts all the way down, in the EK instructions it says to tighten them down fully. Anyone here with naked mounts? Did you tighten them fully or nah?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Ok guys, I've got my water block on and tried to level it out as much as possible but havent tightened the thumb nuts all the way down, in the EK instructions it says to tighten them down fully. Anyone here with naked mounts? Did you tighten them fully or nah?


----------



## yamaharacer19

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*


I couldn't quite understand what you are saying???


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *yamaharacer19*
> 
> I couldn't quite understand what you are saying???


Something about all and ways? Always? I'm right... right?


----------



## johnd0e

Think he is saying to tighten them down "all the way".


----------



## yamaharacer19

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Something about all and ways? Always? I'm right... right?


It was the word "The" I didn't understand.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> Think he is saying to tighten them down "all the way".


You Win!!!! You guessed it!

That wasn't to hard now, was it!


----------



## jdorje

My core 1 temps seem higher than the others.

Average temps in p95 (and I've done some work to lower ambient to keep these low): 67-73-70-66. So core 1 is average 3C above the next highest.

Max temps: 72-77-74-69. 3C difference there also. Though in both cases core 2 is fairly hot also.

Should I remove the IHS again and reapply CLU? Or is this normal?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> My core 1 temps seem higher than the others.
> 
> Average temps in p95 (and I've done some work to lower ambient to keep these low): 67-73-70-66. So core 1 is average 3C above the next highest.
> 
> Max temps: 72-77-74-69. 3C difference there also. Though in both cases core 2 is fairly hot also.
> 
> Should I remove the IHS again and reapply CLU? Or is this normal?


2-3C difference is pretty normal.. Unless there's a 5-10C difference between cores I wouldn't worry about it


----------



## DeathAngel74

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






























Will post load/gaming temps once I get Windows up and running again.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Will post load/gaming temps once I get Windows up and running again.


Idle temps are not worth salt tbh, I've noticed my gf's 6600k idle is 24c but literally as soon as she opens something just like my AMD rig the temp flys up. I don't count idle temps anymore. Looking forward to the load temps though! I ditched the IHS and mounted my EK block straight to the die.


----------



## jdorje

If your cpu temp is lower than the cooler temp, something is very wrong. Even if it's at idle.

Edit on that...

When I got a bad mount with my h80i I would see that, where the hottest core would be lower than the link-reported temp right after I cut load. After fixing the mount, it *never* happens. The hottest core is never reported less than 1-2C above the sensor value. The sensor itself I believe is in the metal of the water block and is a bit higher than the water temp.

However, if you just remounted the cooler, then maybe the TIM just isn't set yet.

Also, you should disable the link software, and use hwinfo instead. It can read the data and is "way better". Unfortunately two pieces of software can't access it at the same time.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Of course I just placed my *third* order on Performance-pcs.com in a week...... dont ask...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , and now I go to check my order status (neurotic I know) and I see this!!! I thought about getting more kyronaut and thermal pads for my GPU so I looked through Thermal Grizzly's entire line... it wasn't there yesterday
> 
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/thermal-grizzly-conductonaut-high-performance-thermal-grease-1g.html#Features
> 
> looks like a liquid metal TIM from Thermal grizzly! What the crap, thinking about making a fourth order..... dat shipping though
> 
> I NEED to know how this does between the die/spreader!
> 
> A link to a oc.net user's post about it
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1588116/thermal-grizzly-conductonaut-73-w-mk


Good find. Let is know how that performs. 73 therm.cond. is higher than CLP and CLU..


----------



## sWaY20

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Good find. Let is know how that performs. 73 therm.cond. is higher than CLP and CLU..


I just ordered 2 myself, gonna redo my 3770k. See if I can drop it a few more Celsius, I'll use it on both die and ihs though.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Good find. Let is know how that performs. 73 therm.cond. is higher than CLP and CLU..


Also should be getting mine this week


----------



## DeathAngel74

Is this a good thing or a bad thing?


----------



## Loladinas

If it's actually stable at 1.2v I'd say it's pretty good. The difference between core temperatures is definitely a bad thing. Check your TIM application and your block mount for unevenness.


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> Is this a good thing or a bad thing?


I think you should try reseating the cooler/block. I would double check the spread between die/ihs too. Delided those temps should not still be 18c from hotest to coolest core.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Hows CLU holding up on bare dye's? I'm picking some up for my b-day in the next few weeks. Going to be doing my laptop CPU and GPU with some CLU. Definitely going to paint the surfaces around the copper heatsink with nail polish and also the caps on the chips. I'm hoping this will reduce my laptop temps at least 5C, who knows, maybe even 8-10C...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Hows CLU holding up on bare dye's? I'm picking some up for my b-day in the next few weeks. Going to be doing my laptop CPU and GPU with some CLU. Definitely going to paint the surfaces around the copper heatsink with nail polish and also the caps on the chips. I'm hoping this will reduce my laptop temps at least 5C, who knows, maybe even 8-10C...


Not sure, I'm still waiting for my VRM waterblock and tubing so I can see how my bare die mount on my 4670k performs, then I want to grab some of that grizzly liquid metal to try.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Hows CLU holding up on bare dye's? I'm picking some up for my b-day in the next few weeks. Going to be doing my laptop CPU and GPU with some CLU. Definitely going to paint the surfaces around the copper heatsink with nail polish and also the caps on the chips. I'm hoping this will reduce my laptop temps at least 5C, who knows, maybe even 8-10C...


I applied CLU on my laptop's die before and while it worked for some people, it didn't for me. Got a 7-10C increase in idle temps. Removed it and replaced with GC extreme and temps were back to norml


----------



## v1ral

Would a badly seated CPU cause motherboard weirdness??


----------



## DeathAngel74

yeah, if the pins are bent or the chip is misaligned.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Hows CLU holding up on bare dye's? I'm picking some up for my b-day in the next few weeks. Going to be doing my laptop CPU and GPU with some CLU. Definitely going to paint the surfaces around the copper heatsink with nail polish and also the caps on the chips. I'm hoping this will reduce my laptop temps at least 5C, who knows, maybe even 8-10C...
> 
> 
> 
> I applied CLU on my laptop's die before and while it worked for some people, it didn't for me. Got a 7-10C increase in idle temps. Removed it and replaced with GC extreme and temps were back to norml
Click to expand...

How's that even possible? Every single test I've seen has CLU or CLP vastly beating out any other thermal paste. I'm still thinking CLU will easily beat out PK-2...


----------



## jdorje

Are mobo coolers copper?

Lm will outperform any other tim, unless there isn't good enough contact between chip and cooler.


----------



## DeathAngel74

Aye, most of them are


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> How's that even possible? Every single test I've seen has CLU or CLP vastly beating out any other thermal paste. I'm still thinking CLU will easily beat out PK-2...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Are mobo coolers copper?
> 
> Lm will outperform any other tim, unless there isn't good enough contact between chip and cooler.


I think it's as jdorje stated. The lm is just too thin than that therer wasn't enough proper contact between cooler and die... Just to be clear I'm not saying lm is bad and initially i was perplexed at the operating temps as well. But i suppose it is what it is


----------



## DeathAngel74

I used Arctic Silver 5 between the die and IHS...mistake #1, but it was all I had at the time. Mistake #2 was using it between the H100i mount and the IHS. When I removed the H100i block, all the thermal paste was on it, and very little on the IHS. If you imagine where the die is under the IHS, it was not covered.
I cleaned of the old thermal paste with an old t-shirt and Q-tips with 91% rubbing alcohol.
Should I reset the bios back to stock to allow time for the paste to cure? Or can I leave at 4.7GHz and be ok?
I don't want to take my computer apart anymore, lol! Thanks in advance







.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> I used Arctic Silver 5 between the die and IHS...mistake #1, but it was all I had at the time. Mistake #2 was using it between the H100i mount and the IHS. When I removed the H100i block, all the thermal paste was on it, and very little on the IHS. If you imagine where the die is under the IHS, it was not covered.
> I cleaned of the old thermal paste with an old t-shirt and Q-tips with 91% rubbing alcohol.
> Should I reset the bios back to stock to allow time for the paste to cure? Or can I leave at 4.7GHz and be ok?
> I don't want to take my computer apart anymore, lol! Thanks in advance
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


If your temps are in check then i'd just leave it oc-ed. But at the next opportunity just swap out the thermal paste to something better. I shipped a 10g tub of gc extreme from HK since i can't find it locally and it's served me well so far. The only thing i don't like is the application since it's not in syringe form


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Would a badly seated CPU cause motherboard weirdness??


And in my experience even from too little or too much pressure (or uneven), especially on a naked die.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> If your temps are in check then i'd just leave it oc-ed. But at the next opportunity just swap out the thermal paste to something better. I shipped a 10g tub of gc extreme from HK since i can't find it locally and it's served me well so far. The only thing i don't like is the application since it's not in syringe form


Yeah I remember you told me last week the temps would go up and they already did so I'll be trying out that new Thermal Grizzly in a few days. I just wonder why? I use ceramique on the die of my GPU how different is that really from a cpu die and water block?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> Yeah I remember you told me last week the temps would go up and they already did so I'll be trying out that new Thermal Grizzly in a few days. I just wonder why? I use ceramique on the die of my GPU how different is that really from a cpu die and water block?


Well, normal thermal paste has the side effect of pumping out with repeated heating and cooling of the paste. That leads to insufficient proper contact with die and block. That is why the guys here recommend CLU/CLP for applications between die and ihs since liquid metal doesn't suffer from pump out. Then normal tim between ihs and block.


----------



## jdorje

Why is there no pump out above the ihs?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Why is there no pump out above the ihs?


There may be but not as significant since more contact area?microscopic gaps?unicorn dust?


----------



## DeathAngel74

http://valid.x86.fr/vxjdtj


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.x86.fr/vxjdtj


What did you test stability with?


----------



## DeathAngel74

AIDA64, Intel Burn test thingy. ran the test in the background while alternating between google chrome, SW:BF and youtube for 2 hours.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> AIDA64, Intel Burn test thingy. ran the test in the background while alternating between google chrome, SW:BF and youtube for 2 hours.


Did you test with IBT AVX on maximum or very high? You might have a golden chip. Also when using IBT AVX you need to close all other programs etc so the CPU is only being used by IBT AVX, I've noticed in the past if I have other things running I can pass IBT easily but it won't actually be stable.


----------



## DeathAngel74

very high? I'm going to do more testing tomorrow. no sleep in 1.5 days..it only crashed once to BSOD at 1.174v. should i try raising the uncore? or just leave it be.


----------



## 386DX40

A quick note to show off my creation.

The ultimate in safe delidding. Works on Haswell and Skylake.



Check it out in my Overclock.net thread over HERE

Indiegogo to come soon.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

thats nice but I think you may run into copyright issues with der8auers tool. I'd definitely message him and ask first. He said the principle of holding the chip down and having another piece move in to delid was copyrighted last I heard about anyone trying to make something similar


----------



## der8auer

Nice copy of my delid die mate. Pretty funny when you call it "your creation". And tatmMRKIV is right that I have a patent for my way of delidding.


----------



## Valgaur

Hmmmmm. I won't stop this discussion but if it moves to much, take it to PM guys


----------



## 386DX40

I did not copy your design. If you look, mine is completely different from yours.
I did not even see your design until just a few weeks ago.
I've been working on mine since October/November as you can see by the posts in my thread where I document my progress with making the CPU cooler.
I seldom come to the forums as I am a machinist first, computer nerd second.

The design is too general. Anyone with a little design sense would make something similar to yours or mine. It's like saying. I patented the door knob, a device you turn to open the door, you can't make one.

The US a free market society, if you produce a patent I will honor it but until then I will continue.

That is the last word I will say about it. PM if you want to discuss.

James


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *der8auer*
> 
> Nice copy of my delid die mate. Pretty funny when you call it "your creation". And tatmMRKIV is right that I have a patent for my way of delidding.


So wait, does this mean people using a vice are going to breach your copyright, I own a copy of your tool and it's neat and everything but from what I can see his version improves on the weaknesses of your design.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

his copyright has to do with the chip being secured from top to bottom and then having the push thing come in IIRC
so since theres no "vertical" support in standard vice it doesnt apply and it just doesnt apply...

I agree with 386 that anyone with an ounce of brain would come up with something similar though. ( I wouldn't want the chip loose in any way shape or form, and equal force across the thing is a must. vertical support is just commonsense with the thin ass skylake pcb)
I was thinking about it before I saw delid die mate after failing to delid my 6700k with a vice(it just kept slipping so I was thinking if only there was vertical support and something held the chip so forc could be applied evenly and precisely, I have no tools to make it but I had the idea at one point). But fact is Roman did it, and copyrighted it first.
done and done..


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> his copyright has to do with the chip being secured from top to bottom and then having the push thing come in IIRC
> so since theres no "vertical" support in standard vice it doesnt apply and it just doesnt apply...
> 
> I agree with 386 that anyone with an ounce of brain would come up with something similar though. ( I wouldn't want the chip loose in any way shape or form, and equal force across the thing is a must. vertical support is just commonsense with the thin ass skylake pcb)
> I was thinking about it before I saw delid die mate after failing to delid my 6700k with a vice(it just kept slipping so I was thinking if only there was vertical support and something held the chip so forc could be applied evenly and precisely, I have no tools to make it but I had the idea at one point). But fact is Roman did it, and copyrighted it first.
> done and done..


Okay I see, so Roman is basically going to take down anyone who makes anything remotely similar? Regardless of if it improves on a product with flaws? Like the slide falling out, the thread chewing up the slide when it falls out and people put it back in the wrong way? The ease of 3 thumb screws vs 6 allen key bolts?

Both are similar I get that but in all honesty I prefer 386's version and would love to get my hands on that for ease and possibly longevity.


----------



## der8auer

The patent includes these facts:
- have one part as a CPU socket
- have one part on top
- have a slider in between
- have a window in the top

So in fact it's exactly the same.
It's always easy to say "everybody with common sense can come up with the idea" afterwards.

I wouldn't even care so much it's just when you claim it's your own idea lol. And you don't even bother to ask via PM first. Not the gentleman's way.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *der8auer*
> 
> The patent includes these facts:
> - have one part as a CPU socket
> - have one part on top
> - have a slider in between
> - have a window in the top
> 
> So in fact it's exactly the same.
> It's always easy to say "everybody with common sense can come up with the idea" afterwards.


Can I see your patent word for word in english? Does it apply worldwide or just in europe?


----------



## johnd0e

Oh the world we live in.....


----------



## Splave

So the differences are round edges and different screws?

looks like a 1:1 copy to me


----------



## Wirerat

The market of people who delid is already small. It is even less than the people who custom water cool.

So out of an already small demographic there is an even smaller amount of people who will need the tool delid as instead of an older method.

Not choosing sides in this debate. Im just pointing out that it is unlikely to be worth hiring an attorney to ensure patents are enforced.

I do admire the creativity of whomever thought it up.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> The market of people who delid is already small. It is even less than the people who custom water cool.
> 
> So out of an already small demographic there is an even smaller amount of people who will need the tool delid as instead of an older method.
> 
> Not choosing sides in this debate. Im just pointing out that it is unlikely to be worth hiring an attorney to ensure patents are enforced.
> 
> I do admire the creativity of whomever thought it up.


From what I hear he's already shot down someone else though I don't know the full story. It's not a 1:1 copy either, I've highlighted the design flaws of Roman's box with a slide in it which I own and I'm really not that impressed with it for the price I was expecting some tough plastic for longevity also...

That's all I'll say on the matter from now on. £60 for a delid mate of Roman's is too much and any competition that can improve on the flaws and sell it for cheaper is well welcomed by me.


----------



## rt123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> The market of people who delid is already small. It is even less than the people who custom water cool.
> 
> So out of an already small demographic there is an even smaller amount of people who will need the tool delid as instead of an older method.
> 
> Not choosing sides in this debate. Im just pointing out that it is unlikely to be worth hiring an attorney to ensure patents are enforced.
> 
> I do admire the creativity of whomever thought it up.


Roman works for Caseking & I don't think hiring an attorney is gonna be any issue for them.

And I am gonna go with copy on the other one.......


----------



## DeathAngel74

Can I ask a stupid question again?
I have delidded my 4790k and use a Corsair H100i GTX Hydro. I've overclocked the CPU to 4.5GHz at 1.117v and max temp of 65C-66C under 95%-100% load whlle gaming. Are those temps safe and decent considering I used Arctic Silver 5?
I will delid again once I can get some CLP or CLU. But for now just wondering since I've never run the chip over stock. The CPU idles between 16-24C. I know tcase=74.04C +5C, so I'm well within the limit. Thanks.


----------



## Xboxmember1978

Those temps seem quite high for just 1.117v and water cooling. What games are you using that uses 95%-100% CPU?


----------



## DeathAngel74

SW:BF


----------



## Xboxmember1978

Under those voltages and water I'd expect lower temps for sure. I have never heard of anyone getting 4.5Ghz and only 1.117v. You run Realbench to verify if it's stable?


----------



## DeathAngel74

i ran AIDA64 for an hour and played games for 3 hours last night. Never went higher than 65-66C


----------



## Xboxmember1978

Have you checked while AIDA was stressing to what the voltages were reading then? I ask because in HWINFO you can't always go by the CPU VID voltage. If your under 1.2v and delidded and water I'd expect lower temps


----------



## DeathAngel74

No, I didn't check. I will tomorrow. Its probably because I used AS5 and not CLU or CLP.


----------



## DeathAngel74

Thanks for the reply. At stock voltages 1.209+, temps were 72-79C. The combination of h100i and AS5 are to blame, I believe. I should have waited for CLU or CLP, bottom line


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> No, I didn't check. I will tomorrow. Its probably because I used AS5 and not CLU or CLP.


Lol yes that's definitely it.

Your temps are higher than what I have at 1.36V with a weaker cooler.


----------



## DeathAngel74

Meh! at 4.4ghz i get 56-60C


----------



## jdorje

I only now realize how godly my temps are after I downclocked.

4.5 ghz/1.23V (a bit overvolted on this setting) and I don't break 50C in gaming. x264 and p95 get into mid-50s. It's cooler than I was on stock settings before the delid - no exaggeration. Which should mean with a delid and the stock cooler you could OC to 4.5 ghz (presumably not on an i7 though).

Thanks again to everyone in this thread.


----------



## Loladinas

Has anyone gotten/tested Conductonaut TIM yet? My package still hasn't showed up yet, two weeks after ordering, and I'll be filing a claim tomorrow. I was thinking if it's worth buying Conductonaut instead of CLP, since they both cost nearly the same.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Has anyone gotten/tested Conductonaut TIM yet? *My package still hasn't showed up yet, two weeks after ordering, and I'll be filing a claim tomorrow.* I was thinking if it's worth buying Conductonaut instead of CLP, since they both cost nearly the same.


Where'd you get it from?


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> Where'd you get it from?


One of the sellers on Amazon. Today is the last day it could be delivered within the time frame they specified. I've had packages from Japan and United States arrive faster, and those needed to go through customs, which makes me believe that the package was lost somewhere along the way.

Also, found a review on Hardwareluxx forum, comparing Conductonaut to Phobya liquid metal, it's only a 1c difference.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> Where'd you get it from?
> 
> 
> 
> One of the sellers on Amazon. Today is the last day it could be delivered within the time frame they specified. I've had packages from Japan and United States arrive faster, and those needed to go through customs, which makes me believe that the package was lost somewhere along the way.
> 
> Also, found a review on Hardwareluxx forum, comparing Conductonaut to Phobya liquid metal, it's only a 1c difference.
Click to expand...

Sometimes, if it not supplied through Amazon, there's no guaranty as to when you may get it... Hope you get it today!!!

Yeah, I know about getting stuff through China, Germany, and Africa... You know, many times, it's actually cheaper / faster, than getting it domestically!!


----------



## Loladinas

Came back from work, nothing in my mailbox. Checked with my postal office - nothing. Going by experience it's either here in a week or not at all, excluding that one time when I got a LED strip I ordered from China two months late. Bummer. Oh well, at least it gave me time to mess with my RAM. Got it running at 2400 12-12-12-36 1T on 1.5V. Not sure if fully stable yet, but it looks like it.


----------



## madmanmarz

WOWOWOWOWOWOWOW absolutely massive temperature drop using the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut. Initial tests showed a 20c difference. I'm talking high 30's in prime on average with spikes not even hitting 50c after 3 or 4 minutes of blend and or small fft. Right now back at 4700mhz and 1.4v I'm only spiking just into 50c. Temps are way way way more even. I think I'm going to get away with using a much lower voltage to stabilize this time. Who knows maybe even a higher OC.

The stuff is kinda hard to apply and it shoots out the nozzle like a rocket so be careful. I've never used liquid paste before and it's crazy, this stuff looks like mercury and rolls around like mercury. Just wants to stay in a ball. I still used ceramique 2 between the ihs and water block. And the ceramique 2 between the die and cap I previously used definitely did pump out.

I AM AMAZED RIGHT NOW


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> WOWOWOWOWOWOWOW absolutely massive temperature drop using the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut. Initial tests showed a 20c difference. I'm talking high 30's in prime on average with spikes not even hitting 50c after 3 or 4 minutes of blend and or small fft. Right now back at 4700mhz and 1.4v I'm only spiking just into 50c. Temps are way way way more even. I think I'm going to get away with using a much lower voltage to stabilize this time. Who knows maybe even a higher OC.
> 
> The stuff is kinda hard to apply and it shoots out the nozzle like a rocket so be careful. I've never used liquid paste before and it's crazy, this stuff looks like mercury and rolls around like mercury. Just wants to stay in a ball. I still used ceramique 2 between the ihs and water block. And the ceramique 2 between the die and cap I previously used definitely did pump out.
> 
> I AM AMAZED RIGHT NOW


20c?






















































































































































Do you have any proof of this? Screen Shots... Before / After?

4.7GHz @ 1.4v? That's a lot of volts for that OC...


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> WOWOWOWOWOWOWOW absolutely massive temperature drop using the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut. Initial tests showed a 20c difference. I'm talking high 30's in prime on average with spikes not even hitting 50c after 3 or 4 minutes of blend and or small fft. Right now back at 4700mhz and 1.4v I'm only spiking just into 50c. Temps are way way way more even. I think I'm going to get away with using a much lower voltage to stabilize this time. Who knows maybe even a higher OC.
> 
> The stuff is kinda hard to apply and it shoots out the nozzle like a rocket so be careful. I've never used liquid paste before and it's crazy, this stuff looks like mercury and rolls around like mercury. Just wants to stay in a ball. I still used ceramique 2 between the ihs and water block. And the ceramique 2 between the die and cap I previously used definitely did pump out.
> 
> I AM AMAZED RIGHT NOW


Compared to what? Ceramique on the die? 20c sounds like what I'd expect.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Compared to what? Ceramique on the die? 20c sounds like what I'd expect.


Yes. I have not tried CLP or CLU but I understand the results will probably be similar.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> 20c?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
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> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have any proof of this? Screen Shots... Before / After?
> 
> 4.7GHz @ 1.4v? That's a lot of volts for that OC...


Yah gimme a few minutes. Once again this is compared to ceramique 2 on die, which by the way got much worse after about a week, when temps were spiking close to 100c. Yes I know my voltage is pretty high, and actually I was running 1.44v previously, and it seems to still be the case. Reminder I'm on a budget motherboard and this CPU has not been binned or anything.





VS



Mind you prime has only been running 15 minutes but that's more than enough time to give temp spikes. I'll give a new screenshot after a full test tomorrow.

Edit - previous prime run was 1344 for 30 minutes. Running blend at 6000MB/8000 the temps are already a little higher. Spiking into the low 60s. But the amazing thing is how even the numbers are now. I would still say <15c improvement no problem, although ambient is slightly higher. At 4.7 I previously had some cores spiking into the 80s (and 100 after a week after ceramique pumped out).

Update ~4 1/2 hours of prime blend 6000mb


----------



## g0tsl33p14

What reason explains why Phobya LM is listed as best in Wert however nobody is recommending or seem to utilize it?

Will it be worth a delid on a i5 4690k the maintains even core temperatures (within six degrees Celsius of each other)?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> What reason explains why Phobya LM is listed as best in Wert however nobody is recommending or seem to utilize it?
> 
> Will it be worth a delid on a i5 4690k the maintains even core temperatures (within six degrees Celsius of each other)?


I have no experience with Phobya LM, but my guess would be ease of use. CLU is quite easy to work with and a little goes a LONG way.

Any chip is worth delidding if you want lower/more consistent temps between cores...even if you were to leave the stock paste. Just removing the glue can easily nab you 10C from closing that gap.

While you're in there though, you might as well brush some CLU on and really make the most of it.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> What reason explains why Phobya LM is listed as best in Wert however nobody is recommending or seem to utilize it?
> 
> Will it be worth a delid on a i5 4690k the maintains even core temperatures (within six degrees Celsius of each other)?
> 
> 
> 
> I have no experience with Phobya LM, but my guess would be ease of use. CLU is quite easy to work with and a little goes a LONG way.
> 
> Any chip is worth delidding if you want lower/more consistent temps between cores...even if you were to leave the stock paste. Just removing the glue can easily nab you 10C from closing that gap.
> 
> While you're in there though, you might as well brush some CLU on and really make the most of it.
Click to expand...

Thank you, I forgot about the height drop of the IHS at the moment.

Do you have any experience using CLU between the IHS and the block? My memory says it is a bad idea, but could be hit or miss.

How would you advise re securing the IHS to the die/board? I think I read high temp silicone, and my idea would be just to dab some at the four corners.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Thank you, I forgot about the height drop of the IHS at the moment.
> 
> Do you have any experience using CLU between the IHS and the block? My memory says it is a bad idea, but could be hit or miss.
> 
> How would you advise re securing the IHS to the die/board? I think I read high temp silicone, and my idea would be just to dab some at the four corners.


It doesn't make that large of an improvement over traditional paste. It stains and can burn into copper...can really be a pain to clean. Less chance of getting it where you don't want it as well...Best to just use something like GC extreme, NT-H1, Thermal Grizzly, etc.

I use thermal tape under the lid. It's enough to secure the lid from moving around and allows easy removal if you need to get the lid off again. This is also nice for Haswell because you can protect the VRMs under there from getting any LM on them.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> It doesn't make that large of an improvement over traditional paste. It stains and can burn into copper...can really be a pain to clean. Less chance of getting it where you don't want it as well...Best to just use something like GC extreme, NT-H1, Thermal Grizzly, etc.
> 
> I use thermal tape under the lid. It's enough to secure the lid from moving around and allows easy removal if you need to get the lid off again. This is also nice for Haswell because you can protect the VRMs under there from getting any LM on them.


I used high temp rtv last week, although you would probably be fine with regular silicone. I was able to take the cap back off again with a thin plastic card, not even having to use a razor. It cleaned up easy and I used rtv again and clear nail polish around the cpu and on any metal contacts. I just used a tiny amount of rtv around the edge of the cap, slapped it on, stuck it in the socket, closed it, and mounted the block quickly so it would apply pressure onto everything. Seems to have worked well!

The IHS is nickel plated copper, so I would imagine if you use a nickel plated copper block, that would be fine. On copper there seems to be discoloration and the cpu might get stuck to it pretty good.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> It doesn't make that large of an improvement over traditional paste. It stains and can burn into copper...can really be a pain to clean. Less chance of getting it where you don't want it as well...Best to just use something like GC extreme, NT-H1, Thermal Grizzly, etc.
> 
> I use thermal tape under the lid. It's enough to secure the lid from moving around and allows easy removal if you need to get the lid off again. This is also nice for Haswell because you can protect the VRMs under there from getting any LM on them.


Do you have any photos of the tape on there ?
Did you use the .5mm stuff?


----------



## jdorje

I was wondering if some thermal padding between VRMs and IHS would help anything under there.

As for securing the IHS to the PCB, the cpu socket does that for you. No need to glue it on.


----------



## sav4

I would rather secure it to safeguard any movement in transport and install.
Just me being paranoid


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> I would rather secure it to safeguard any movement in transport and install.
> Just me being paranoid


Yeah there is that. If you had to remove it from the mobo I'd probably re-lid it. Which would be really easy.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Do you have any photos of the tape on there ?
> Did you use the .5mm stuff?




PPCs has 0.2mm and 0.4mm

I believe what I have is the 0.4mm

Thermal Tape, not pad.

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=junpus


----------



## Benjiw

Go naked or go home!


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PPCs has 0.2mm and 0.4mm
> 
> I believe what I have is the 0.4mm
> 
> Thermal Tape, not pad.
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=junpus


Nice, I used some transparant nail polish myself.. Some really quick drying stuff, CPU was up and running in 10 minutes.
Im not a fan of tape because it's less 'permanent' and doesn't cover the small chips 100%.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Im not a fan of tape because it's less 'permanent' and doesn't cover the small chips 100%.


Makes you wonder, though, if it would fill in the gap between the VRMs and the IHS, making them run slightly cooler/better?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PPCs has 0.2mm and 0.4mm
> 
> I believe what I have is the 0.4mm
> 
> Thermal Tape, not pad.
> 
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=junpus
> 
> 
> 
> Nice, I used some transparant nail polish myself.. Some really quick drying stuff, CPU was up and running in 10 minutes.
> Im not a fan of tape because it's less 'permanent' and doesn't cover the small chips 100%.
Click to expand...

I understand that yourself and @madmanmars are very clear with your statement of using a clear nail polish to protect the VRM. However,

Are you talking about any clear nail polish I can walk down the cosmetic aisle of the pharmacy and give to my girlfriend when I exhaust the two drops of coat?

Will you give me a slight approach in guide about how to apply the polish, since the results seem agreed upon, with possible downfalls, what component is the nail polish? (non conductive, etc, why is my question?)


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Im not a fan of tape because it's less 'permanent' and doesn't cover the small chips 100%.
> 
> 
> 
> Makes you wonder, though, if it would fill in the gap between the VRMs and the IHS, making them run slightly cooler/better?
Click to expand...

I might go this route and use both (like that kid on the Old El Paso Stand and Stuff Taco Shell TV advertisement instead of putting nails in my desktop..)


----------



## jdorje

You don't need nail polish or any other insulator on the vrms. Just don't go spilling your clu everywhere and it'll be fine.

The only real problem I have with nail polish though is that it's too permanent.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> You don't need nail polish or any other insulator on the vrms. Just don't go spilling your clu everywhere and it'll be fine.
> 
> The only real problem I have with nail polish though is that it's too permanent.


Better safe than a fried CPU sorry. If the lid shifts while mounting and moves some CLU around...you never know what could happen.

Nail polish is too permanent for my taste as well, which is exactly why I opted for thermal tape and it's convenient dual purpose functionality.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

all you people using nail polish.. just buy some liquid electrical tape. @ amazon or home depot. it will peel off.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> all you people using nail polish.. just buy some liquid electrical tape. @ amazon or home depot. it will peel off.


I used that stuff and it kept wanting to peel back and shrink after the cpu heated up. Using nothing atm


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> all you people using nail polish.. just buy some liquid electrical tape. @ amazon or home depot. it will peel off.





> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> *I used that stuff and it kept wanting to peel back and shrink after the cpu heated up.* Using nothing atm


I experience this same issue when using around a GPU die. It shrank and became VERY difficult to remove even with a couple coats of it on there.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

for sure. sorry then. Sl used the silicon sealant they use for resealing or let to cover the contacts on top of the one cpu I had done by them


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> for sure. sorry then. Sl used the silicon sealant they use for resealing or let to cover the contacts on top of the one cpu I had done by them


No need to be sorry. It does have it's uses for sub-zero cooling, but it did not hold up well for me around the GPU die. It almost killed the GTX 970 actually. The electrical tape heated up, boiled (I'm assuming) and eventually shrank, causing it to come in contact with the CLU on the die. This caused the CLU to run off the die and then come into contact with the electrical components around the die; I don't know what they are called exactly. The card stopped giving video at all...I thought it was done for. Cleaned up all the CLU and as much of the LET as I could and to my surprise the card was fine! A close call and a lesson learned!


----------



## tatmMRKIV

good to know for future reference.
that actually answers a question for me. saved me time and possibly money.

Jeez I wonder if theres anything else that could be used personally I dislike the idea of using nailpolish on pc

probably can use the silicon for resealing IHS


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Better safe than a fried CPU sorry. If the lid shifts while mounting and moves some CLU around...you never know what could happen.
> 
> Nail polish is too permanent for my taste as well, which is exactly why I opted for thermal tape and it's convenient dual purpose functionality.


Nail polish isn't permanent, Isopropyl or acetone will remove it instantly.

So can I literally go to my local car place and pick up some black instant gasket/sealant to glue the IHS back on top of a delidded CPU? Someone is asking me if I can delid their chip then put the IHS back on.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> good to know for future reference.
> that actually answers a question for me. saved me time and possibly money.
> 
> Jeez I wonder if theres anything else that could be used personally I dislike the idea of using nailpolish on pc
> 
> probably can use the silicon for resealing IHS


I don't see why using nail polish is a big deal, we are already voiding our warranties by removing the cap. You're just brushing on a little extra protective coating. If you don't wanna use that or tape, then just check your application by mounting everything, then taking everything back off to see if any liquid metal ran off the die, then reapply as necessary.

Personally I have less to worry about on Skylake since I don't have those VRMs, but this entire thing is a game of risk and ultimately the choice is yours.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

forsure.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Nail polish isn't permanent, Isopropyl or acetone will remove it instantly.
> 
> So can I literally go to my local car place and pick up some black instant gasket/sealant to glue the IHS back on top of a delidded CPU? Someone is asking me if I can delid their chip then put the IHS back on.


Never thought about removing it like that. But the tape is also removable instantly and it holds the lid in place so you don't have to glue it back down.

You need to alter the application method of the glue otherwise there is no point in delidding the chip. Remember the primary reason for delidding is removing the glue so the IHS makes contact with the die. If you were to delid, put down CLU, and then glue it back on like Intel does...your temps would probably be worse because the CLU is much thinner and wouldn't be making much, if any, contact with the IHS.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Never thought about removing it like that. But the tape is also removable instantly and it holds the lid in place so you don't have to glue it back down.
> 
> You need to alter the application method of the glue otherwise there is no point in delidding the chip. Remember the primary reason for delidding is removing the glue so the IHS makes contact with the die. If you were to delid, put down CLU, and then glue it back on like Intel does...your temps would probably be worse because the CLU is much thinner and wouldn't be making much, if any, contact with the IHS.
> 
> I wouldn't say they can't tell the difference, because they can very likely tell the difference..this is Intel we're talking about here. At the most they would have to remove the lid themselves and see that the application of glue is not factory...if it wasn't already apparent that the chip had been tampered with in the first place. However, there are people who have delidded the chips and Intel has honored the warranty anyway.


if you damage pcb during delid or cut it OFC they would be able to tell but you can buy the same silicone adhesive they use and as long as you only apply a little around the edge of where the ihs contacts it should come out just like factory

I dont think they delid at factory to do warranty though do they?

I know a ton of OCers are cashing in on their warranties wlike it isnt an issue


----------



## inedenimadam

Intel has honored people who have told them they took the top off. I know I am going to be called the moral police or whatever, but I dont care. Don't commit fraud because you took a chance with an expensive piece of electronics. It just ends up increasing the price of CPUs because they have to allot a larger warranty budget. It is just plain dishonest.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

its called an OC warranty...

the people I know who are sending in dead chips didn't kill them delidding them...









no fraud IMO.

if they can't tell it was delidded... in otherwords free of physical damage...

and boohoo if you dont agree with it dont do it.. no one is going to stop..

and intel cpus are always the same price. it only fluctuates with availability because they can.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tatmMRKIV*
> 
> its called an OC warranty...
> 
> the people I know who are sending in dead chips didn't kill them delidding them...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no fraud IMO.
> 
> if they can't tell it was delidded... in otherwords free of physical damage...
> 
> and boohoo if you dont agree with it dont do it.. no one is going to stop..
> 
> and intel cpus are always the same price. it only fluctuates with availability because they can.


It's called the Performance Tuning Plan, and does not cover physical damage to the chip. Doing as you have suggested, and gluing the lid back onto the pcb is fraud. I know people are doing it, but that doesn't mean it needs to be the norm or a suggestion on these forums.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

and thats your opinion on the matter.


----------



## stin0

I've got a delid 4690K at the moment with CLU on the die and Grizzly Kryonaut on the heatspreader.
As I love low temps I'm thinking about going for a bare die mount now; I got a custom loop and EKWB sells special delid screws for my waterblock.

Never did a bare die mount before so any suggestions on the paste I should use on the die?
I'm thinking about just using the Grizzly Kryonaut as it's fairly easy to apply with the appliance tools they provide. Also the dot/pea method wouldn't work, given the shape of the die.
I am not really a big fan of having CLU in direct contact with my waterblock as it's fairly aggressive stuff.

CLU is also an option though, still got some left of it and the caps next to the DIE are covered in a thin layer of nail polish


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I've got a delid 4690K at the moment with CLU on the die and Grizzly Kryonaut on the heatspreader.
> As I love low temps I'm thinking about going for a bare die mount now; I got a custom loop and EKWB sells special delid screws for my waterblock.
> 
> Never did a bare die mount before so any suggestions on the paste I should use on the die?
> I'm thinking about just using the Grizzly Kryonaut as it's fairly easy to apply with the appliance tools they provide. Also the dot/pea method wouldn't work, given the shape of the die.
> I am not really a big fan of having CLU in direct contact with my waterblock as it's fairly aggressive stuff.
> 
> CLU is also an option though, still got some left of it and the caps next to the DIE are covered in a thin layer of nail polish


Direct die with CLU! It will stain a copper block, but not a nickel plated one. I have been running naked for 2 years or more and have seen no negative side effects other than an ugly spot on my block. Ivy Bridge 5.0 24/7


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Direct die with CLU! It will stain a copper block, but not a nickel plated one. I have been running naked for 2 years or more and have seen no negative side effects other than an ugly spot on my block. Ivy Bridge 5.0 24/7


Thanks for the fast response








I have this waterblock from EKWB.

Right now I have the waterblock mounted with the outlet on the top and inlet on the bottom - it works easier for me in terms of tubing.
However I believe when going bare die mount I should mount the waterblock the normal, not 90-degrees turned, way for optimal performance.

How important is the way the block is mounted?
I figure that with the normal outer heatspreader it doesnt matter and it's still on the whole surface, but with a bare die mount it should be mounted 'normally' so that the internal jet plate is aligned with the die.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> So can I literally go to my local car place and pick up some black instant gasket/sealant to glue the IHS back on top of a delidded CPU? Someone is asking me if I can delid their chip then put the IHS back on.


I just used a tiny dab of regular silicone on each corner and it holds on pretty well and is super thin. You have to try to get the lid off but it is still way easier than the initial delid.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I've got a delid 4690K at the moment with CLU on the die and Grizzly Kryonaut on the heatspreader.
> As I love low temps I'm thinking about going for a bare die mount now; I got a custom loop and EKWB sells special delid screws for my waterblock.
> 
> Never did a bare die mount before so any suggestions on the paste I should use on the die?
> I'm thinking about just using the Grizzly Kryonaut as it's fairly easy to apply with the appliance tools they provide. Also the dot/pea method wouldn't work, given the shape of the die.
> I am not really a big fan of having CLU in direct contact with my waterblock as it's fairly aggressive stuff.
> 
> CLU is also an option though, still got some left of it and the caps next to the DIE are covered in a thin layer of nail polish





> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Direct die with CLU! It will stain a copper block, but not a nickel plated one. I have been running naked for 2 years or more and have seen no negative side effects other than an ugly spot on my block. Ivy Bridge 5.0 24/7


My 4770k has been naked for about 2 years as well with traditional paste. I'm running a XSPC Raystorm CPU block. There wasn't any additional hardware, just a little trial fitment and simple calculations for how tight the screws needed to be.

The CLU will definitely mark the copper, but that should be about it.

Just did a comparison of Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut to CLU. I will have some results and screenshots up in a little while.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Direct die with CLU! It will stain a copper block, but not a nickel plated one. I have been running naked for 2 years or more and have seen no negative side effects other than an ugly spot on my block. Ivy Bridge 5.0 24/7
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the fast response
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have this waterblock from EKWB.
> 
> Right now I have the waterblock mounted with the outlet on the top and inlet on the bottom - it works easier for me in terms of tubing.
> However I believe when going bare die mount I should mount the waterblock the normal, not 90-degrees turned, way for optimal performance.
> 
> How important is the way the block is mounted?
> I figure that with the normal outer heatspreader it doesnt matter and it's still on the whole surface, but with a bare die mount it should be mounted 'normally' so that the internal jet plate is aligned with the die.
Click to expand...

I have not done testing on Goofy vs. Normal for a dellided CPU. Much like you I just assumed that having the water block in the normal mount made much more sense considering the shape of the naked die, with the channel flow perpendicular to the length of the die.

That block will not show the same staining that a copper block will. My SupremacyEVO is nickel and has shown no signs of staining compared to my OG Supremacy with the copper base. Both have pretty much been CLU all the way. Now that I think about it, the copper block does seem to dry the CLU out over time compared to the nickel block, but that isn't a concern because you have the nickel block.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Just did a comparison of Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut to CLU. I will have some results and screenshots up in a little while.


Interested in these results, both of my blocks have been mounted since before the bear snot was available.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Never thought about removing it like that. But the tape is also removable instantly and it holds the lid in place so you don't have to glue it back down.
> 
> You need to alter the application method of the glue otherwise there is no point in delidding the chip. Remember the primary reason for delidding is removing the glue so the IHS makes contact with the die. If you were to delid, put down CLU, and then glue it back on like Intel does...your temps would probably be worse because the CLU is much thinner and wouldn't be making much, if any, contact with the IHS.


I'm gonna disagree. I reglued my IHS back on with high temp RTV and the temps were a drastic improvement and much more even than before. I think the trick was using very little and then putting it in the socket/holder and mounting the block right away so it could compress the RTV as much as possible. To say there was a drastic improvement over stock is an understatement. This was with TG Conductonaut.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Thanks for the fast response
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have this waterblock from EKWB.
> 
> Right now I have the waterblock mounted with the outlet on the top and inlet on the bottom - it works easier for me in terms of tubing.
> However I believe when going bare die mount I should mount the waterblock the normal, not 90-degrees turned, way for optimal performance.
> 
> How important is the way the block is mounted?
> I figure that with the normal outer heatspreader it doesnt matter and it's still on the whole surface, but with a bare die mount it should be mounted 'normally' so that the internal jet plate is aligned with the die.


Be aware what processor you're going direct die on, as a regular flat block will not work well on Skylake/1151 because the socket sticks up higher than the die, blocking good contact. Copper shim or something would be needed.


----------



## Roboyto

*Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut - Is it better than CLU?*

I recently installed a new AIO into my HTPC. It is currently running the DeepCool Captain 240 AIO which I wrote a review about: http://www.overclock.net/products/deepcool-captain-240-computer-cpu-water-cooler-silent-liquid-cooling/reviews/7272

For $80 it's a bargain if you don't need extreme/cutting edge performance and want something that looks pretty sweet compared to most other AIO's out there.

I did a lot of benching to see how well the Captain worked with a fresh application of CLU utilizing the supplied fans in push and pull configuration, as well as with three different fans speed for push and pull. I then tested Kryonaut against the pre-applied DeepCool paste. Spoiler: There wasn't much difference even though Kryonaut has 3X the advertised thermal conductance as the pre-applied paste.

All this means is that I had a great idea of how well this thing performed. I could have just pulled data from early December, but I figured I would run IBT to see where the temperatures were at right now. All CPU, voltage, and OC settings are identical to what they were in December. The most notable difference is that ambient temp is up about 2C in my condo to 23C.

*My HTPC:*


Intel i7 4790k - Delidded
Gigabyte G1 Gaming 5 Z97 mATX motherboard
G.Skill Ripjaws-X 16GB (2 x 8) 2133MHz @ 1.5V (XMP: 11-13-13-31-t2)
PowerColor AMD R9 290 Reference Edition - XSPC Razor water block w/ backplate
EVGA Super Nova 850G2 850W Gold PSU
Toshiba Q Series 120GB SSD - Seagate Barracuda 2TB (The 'BatDrive') - Panasonic UJ-265 Slim Blu-Ray
Fractal Design Node 804

*GPU is cooled by a compact 240 loop consisting of**:*


(1) XSPC EX240
XSPC H2O 420 pump/res
Bitspower fittings and ¼" barbs
Tygon R3400 black 3/8" OD tubing
(2) SilenX Effizio Thermistor fans (pull)

*Pertinent CPU Overclock Settings:*


4.6 GHz - 46 x 100
Offset Core Voltage - 1.100V + .070V Offset
This made for 1.260V 'standard' loads and 1.270V IBT load

VRIN - 1.860V
VRIN LLC - High
Ring Voltage - Auto
RAM Voltage: 1.5V

*Screenshot to verify clocks and load voltage*



Spoiler: Clocks/Volts







My first bar chart is a comparison of what temperatures were like in December to what they are today. I blew all the dust out of the case/radiator to make sure it would be working as good as when it was installed new. I don't know why, but my HTPC would not complete IBT with the fans in silent mode...tried 4 times...wouldn't work. Didn't want to alter any OC settings so they are omitted.

Performance has degraded by about 2C since December...could be chalked up to ambient though.



Spoiler: Chart & Screens





*IBT for 10 passes at Very High RAM load 4096MB*







*Now that we have a baseline for CLU we can swap in the Conductonaut!*

Here's what the CLU and Kryonaut look like after 2 months:



Spoiler: 2 Months of Use















*Meet Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut!*

It comes in a tube just like their other grease but has a 'pin point' applicator tip to dispense the LM goodness. Instructions, a warning, some alcohol pads, and special Q-tips.



Spoiler: Conductonaut Contents















The Q-tips have something done to the cotton swab to give them a ridged look; I'm assuming so they don't unravel.



Spoiler: Cotton Swabs















I did not use the pin point applicator tip as I feel that is ultimately a fair amount of wasted product; I simply squirted a small dab onto the die.



Spoiler: A Dab Will Do















At first I tried to use the CLU brush since I didn't like the idea of the cotton swab. It didn't work at all, just smeared it around and caused it to ball up.



Spoiler: Brush Won't Spread It















I switched to the cotton swab and as instructed used more pressure to spread it around...but it didn't work that well.



Spoiler: More Effort Than CLU To Spread















I kept swirling it around and trying to smash the balls of LM...after a little effort it started to spread. *Considerably* more finagling than CLU.



Spoiler: Here We Go...Starting To Spread















And we have good pretty good coverage.



Spoiler: The Full Spread











*Now the two liquid metals can duke it out







*

For the sake of making a somewhat quick comparison I decided to only run the fans at full speed.

*1st comparison of CLU and TGCN I did not alter the application of Kryonaut between the IHS and AIO.*

The CN temps are higher by: +6, +1, +4, +1 degrees respectively per core.



Spoiler: CLU ~ VS ~ TGCN









*I figured I should give the Conductonaut a shot at fresh Kryonaut as well. *

Applying fresh Kryonaut actually increased temperatures: +1, +2, +2, 0 respectively per core.



Spoiler: Fresh Kryonaut on Top of IHS









*Maybe the application of Conductonaut wasn't that great...Let's open her up and see how it looks after a few benches.*



Spoiler: Check The Conductonaut



*Very strange...There's a large bald spot and it looks like the LM started to pool towards the bottom of the die...gravity dragging it down?*







*I decided to add just a pinch more Conductonaut to make sure I got good coverage:*







*Now a comparison of the 1st CN application to the 2nd*

Mostly an improvement in temperatures here: -5, -2, -3, +1



Spoiler: Re-apply Conductonaut









*Now let's see how it fairs against the CLU results from today*

Looks like the CLU is still in the lead: -2, -1, -3, -2 respectively per core.



*Current Conclusion*

You would think since Conductonaut (73 W/mk) is boasting a thermal conductance rating that is nearly double CLU (38.4 W/mk) that it would have the leg up...apparently not. I initially thought that maybe it's better for cooling means other than basic water, and it could excel with dry ice or LN2...but TG states it's best suited for temps above 8C.

Obviously a delta of 1-3C across the cores can be attributed to a margin of error and imperfect testing conditions/methodologies. Take it as you will, but it can essentially be considered a tie in my eyes currently. If it was going to being a vastly superior product, I feel my tests would have shown it.

The only thing Conductonaut has going for it is a lower price tag of $9 compared to $16. Thermal Grizzly tells you you get 1g of Conductonaut, but I can't find the included weight/volume of CLU.

We will need to see comparisons from other users before passing final judgement. However, CLU is my *current* suggestion due to ease of use as Conductonaut shows no major performance benefits.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> I'm gonna disagree. I reglued my IHS back on with high temp RTV and the temps were a drastic improvement and much more even than before. I think the trick was using very little and then putting it in the socket/holder and mounting the block right away so it could compress the RTV as much as possible. To say there was a drastic improvement over stock is an understatement. This was with TG Conductonaut.


Since you used the sealant sparingly and then utilized the socket to compress the sealant as much as possible, you installed it differently than Intel I would imagine. Or your chip had particularly poor performance with the stock TIM to begin with.

Yes, liquid metal thermal compound gives a big improvement. But not everyone wants to use, or is comfortable with using, liquid metal TIM. So it doesn't alter the fact that increasing contact of the die to IHS is the primary reason temperatures improve.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Since you used the sealant sparingly and then utilized the socket to compress the sealant as much as possible, you installed it differently than Intel I would imagine. Or your chip had particularly poor performance with the stock TIM to begin with.
> 
> Yes, liquid metal thermal compound gives a big improvement. But not everyone wants to use, or is comfortable with using, liquid metal TIM. So it doesn't alter the fact that increasing contact of the die to IHS is the primary reason temperatures improve.


Absolutely, although mind you the first time around I did relid with a replacement paste with the stock intel stuff removed and the same procedure with RTV so the ihs would have been making better contact. It wasnt for a few days that the temps started increasing (worse than stock) from pump out, and my results are compared to the temps I got before it pumped out.

With my overclock:
Stock intel cap - max load ~90c and uneven across cores
Replace with Ceramique 2 on die ~80c and uneven across cores, temps went up to close to 100c after a week with pump out
Replace Ceramique 2 with Conductonaut ~65c and actually 60c when uxing x264, very even temps across cores.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> *Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut - Is it better than CLU?*
> 
> At first I tried to use the CLU brush since I didn't like the idea of the cotton swab. It didn't work at all, just smeared it around and caused it to ball up.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Brush Won't Spread It
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I switched to the cotton swab and as instructed used more pressure to spread it around...but it didn't work that well.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: More Effort Than CLU To Spread


I agree, the application is very difficult as the stuff just wants to stay balled up. I found that dabbing at the ball, and using a little too much, worked best. I also brushed a very quick thinnn layer on the underside of the cap. This is also why I played it safe and used nailpolish around the die, although not much to make contact with on Skylake to begin with. I did use the pinpoint applicator but it shoots the stuff out like a rocket and got all over my cpu and had to clean it all off. fortunately it all balls right back up with just a little residue.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmanmarz*
> 
> I agree, the application is very difficult as the stuff just wants to stay balled up. I found that dabbing at the ball, and using a little too much, worked best. I also brushed a very quick thinnn layer on the underside of the cap. This is also why I played it safe and used nailpolish around the die, although not much to make contact with on Skylake to begin with. I did use the pinpoint applicator but it shoots the stuff out like a rocket and got all over my cpu and had to clean it all off. fortunately it all balls right back up with just a little residue.


I would definitely use the included brush. I am lucky enough to know someone who works for a cosmetics company so I have been given a bag of small nail polish brushes. Just keep brushing it, it will roll around a bit but eventually spread. One little bead is more than enough for the entire CPU, you may even be dabbing up extra at the end if it is not mirror flat. I cannot recommend a q-tip since you may leave fibers, I may even denounce q-tip method for that reason. Just stay steady with your strokes and brace your wrist on something for finer detail.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Does conductonaut benefit from applying the TIM to the brush, instead of the die, like clu/clp?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would definitely use the included brush. I am lucky enough to know someone who works for a cosmetics company so I have been given a bag of small nail polish brushes. Just keep brushing it, it will roll around a bit but eventually spread. One little bead is more than enough for the entire CPU, you may even be dabbing up extra at the end if it is not mirror flat. I cannot recommend a q-tip since you may leave fibers, I may even denounce q-tip method for that reason. Just stay steady with your strokes and brace your wrist on something for finer detail.


Conductonaut comes with some special Q-Tips though. The cotton on the end isn't all soft, squishy, and loose; it is wrapped or pressed tightly around the stick. I did not experience any loose fibers with the included swabs...I however, would not recommend a traditional white Q-Tip.



Do you have a pic of what the brushes you are using look like? The little brush included with the CLU is too soft to get the Conductonaut to do anything it seems.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Does conductonaut benefit from applying the TIM to the brush, instead of the die, like clu/clp?


It doesn't stick initially, and wants to cling to itself and form a ball, so you have to put a small dab on the die first and work it for a little bit. I have never used CLP, but the way Conductonaut acts it sounds similar to what I have read about CLP.

CLU is definitely easier to apply. With my CLU, I never used the syringe to dispense onto the die. I would just squirt the tiniest bit into the syringe cap, and then dip the brush inside the cap. This has allowed me to put the thinnest layer possible down.

The Conductonaut didn't go so well for me on the first application where I tried to leave it thin. After a couple IBT runs I wasn't satisfied with temperatures so I took the IHS back off to find it didn't stay in place for some reason.



Spoiler: Conductonaut Shifted







After applying a little extra and spreading it back around, temps got slightly better.

*Currently,* I am of the opinion they are essentially equivocal in the performance department, with the CLU possibly working ever so slightly better.

Unless someone else gets different results from what I did, *my present stance for a purchase would be CLU* because it requires much less effort to spread/paint it onto the die.


----------



## sWaY20

Your supposed to spread it on the inside of the lid to. That's how I did my 3770k with clu. I just got a 5820k and had conductonaut, so I used that for the tim, put it on the lid and cpu block. That's also what the directions say.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sWaY20*
> 
> Your supposed to spread it on the inside of the lid to. That's how I did my 3770k with clu. I just got a 5820k and had conductonaut, so I used that for the tim, put it on the lid and cpu block. That's also what the directions say.


I've never applied the CLU to the inside of the IHS and have always gotten the desired results.

I do not use LM on top of the IHS due to the minimal performance gain, and the difficulty in removing it from bare copper. If I had nickel plated components, it may be a different story.

This needed to be a direct comparison of how the CLU was implemented in my scenario. Using Conductonaut on top of the IHS would probably have yielded better results, but that wouldn't have been a fair comparison.


----------



## johnd0e

would using the nail polish method of protection also work on a GPU? thinking about putting some conductonaut on mine since im switching over to water and have a tube of it waiting to be used on my cpu whenever i get around to my skylake delid.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> would using the nail polish method of protection also work on a GPU? thinking about putting some conductonaut on mine since im switching over to water and have a tube of it waiting to be used on my cpu whenever i get around to my skylake delid.


I don't see why it wouldn't. Generally speaking GPUs cores run quite cool once under water, so not as many people run it for GPU.

From the looks of your sig you have GTX 970's which already run cool on air.

I used a Kraken and 120 AIO on a GTX 970 and the temperatures were quite outstanding. It was the reference board Zotac with the mini two fan cooler. With an Antec 620 AIO at stock settings the core ran in the low 40's. Because the core temp was so low it boosted to 1367 with all stock settings even though the advertised boost clock is 1216.

Even with a BIOS edit to allow 25% power, 6% was stock, and overclocked boosting to 1500+, the core temps were in the low 50's for games and high 50's for Valley benchmarking.

You can see the performance in screenshots form my 290/970 comparison: http://www.overclock.net/t/1436497/official-amd-r9-290x-290-owners-club/34380_20#post_23458320

One thing I did learn from running the AIO on the 970 is that the VRMs still get VERY hot even though the core runs cool. If you were going to strive to cool something better with a waterblock it would be the VRMs. Get yourself some Fujipoly Ultra Extreme 17 W/mk rated, AKA Sarcon XR-M, thermal pads and use those for the VRMs. I experienced a 20% drop in VRM temps on my 290's.


----------



## johnd0e

@Roboyto

Thanks for the info, ill just stick with the MX-4 for now and if temps seem to high still ill try the LM. And yea, i've become all to familiar with the temperamental VRM on Maxwell cards, they do not like to play nice once they get toasty. im hoping my alphacool block at least does a little bit to cool them off but its for the most part just acting as a "pass-through"(couldn't think of a better word) heat sink for the VRM since the waterblock doesn't really touch them but it touches the Fins/body that touch the VRM. ill definitely pick up some of those thermal pads though so thanks for suggesting that.


----------



## madmanmarz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I would definitely use the included brush. I am lucky enough to know someone who works for a cosmetics company so I have been given a bag of small nail polish brushes. Just keep brushing it, it will roll around a bit but eventually spread. One little bead is more than enough for the entire CPU, you may even be dabbing up extra at the end if it is not mirror flat. I cannot recommend a q-tip since you may leave fibers, I may even denounce q-tip method for that reason. Just stay steady with your strokes and brace your wrist on something for finer detail.


I did use the included rubbery black swabs, they work fine but I found you have to dab at the balls a whole bunch to start to get it to spread. It spread fine after a little effort.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> would using the nail polish method of protection also work on a GPU? thinking about putting some conductonaut on mine since im switching over to water and have a tube of it waiting to be used on my cpu whenever i get around to my skylake delid.


Don't see why not but as was stated usually regular paste works more than good enough on a GPU die.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> @Roboyto
> 
> Thanks for the info, ill just stick with the MX-4 for now and if temps seem to high still ill try the LM. And yea, i've become all to familiar with the temperamental VRM on Maxwell cards, they do not like to play nice once they get toasty. im hoping my alphacool block at least does a little bit to cool them off but its for the most part just acting as a "pass-through"(couldn't think of a better word) heat sink for the VRM since the waterblock doesn't really touch them but it touches the Fins/body that touch the VRM. ill definitely pick up some of those thermal pads though so thanks for suggesting that.


MX-4 will do.

If it is the Nexxos 970 block you should be just fine with some good pads. Even though the VRMs are cooled passively, it is a massive heatsink to dissipate the heat. If they are still giving you problems, you can always buy a backplate and use some pads to utilize the backplate as a 2nd passive heatsink.

I measured 132C on the VRMs of that Zotac with the stock heatisnk overclocked/volted before there was a driver crash and the card reset to stock settings.



Spoiler: Nexxos 970















Anyway...back to delidding shenanigans before we stray too far


----------



## johnd0e

@Roboyto
@madmanmarz

thanks guys.







sorry, for slightly de railing, didnt think my question would get that in depth haha.

anyways back to the regularly scheduled delid thread. if anyone else wants to respond to my post just pm it to me.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I broke this tool trying a delid of my 4690K.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> 
> 
> I broke this tool trying a delid of my 4690K.


Is there a warranty on the tool?


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> 
> 
> I broke this tool trying a delid of my 4690K.


How's the chip ?
Did you print it ? Pla or abs?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

No warranty, it is a free 3dblue print.

The chip seems okay, I don't think it even endured a dent, nor did the glue give any.

I think my next task it to have the tool printed again with a much higher infill or strength or something. I am not the one printing it, I use a public 3d printing service.


----------



## jdorje

Why not just use a vice???


----------



## orvils

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> 
> 
> I broke this tool trying a delid of my 4690K.


Actually same thing happened to me. But the issue for me was that I had it printed with not enough infill.
After that I just sanded down an old credit card and delided my 4790k this morning.
It literally took less then a minute to get the lid off using the card. I did not want to use razor on the chip as the gap was so narrow I was afraid to scratch the PCB.
Anyway now I am delided and happy. Used MX-4 on the die since CLU is still in mail. Should be here this week.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Why not just use a vice???


My life changes constantly. I do not have a vice, shop, garage, I had a c clamp though. I am searching for those things.

I do not have any CLU or other LM on hand at the moment. I was going on the advice of @Roboyto and planned on removing the stock glue, keeping the stock TIM. It was part of my new custom loop install. The custom loop went in okay, the delidding, a stubborn mule.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orvils*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> 
> 
> I broke this tool trying a delid of my 4690K.
> 
> 
> 
> Actually same thing happened to me. But the issue for me was that I had it printed with not enough infill.
> After that I just sanded down an old credit card and delided my 4790k this morning.
> It literally took less then a minute to get the lid off using the card. I did not want to use razor on the chip as the gap was so narrow I was afraid to scratch the PCB.
> Anyway now I am delided and happy. Used MX-4 on the die since CLU is still in mail. Should be here this week.
Click to expand...

I bet you knew things were going bad when hearing the mold begin to crack. I soaked the cpu in hot water (covered), tried the razor without confidence then finished off the tool with a wooden board and hammer.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> My life changes constantly. I do not have a vice, shop, garage


All you need to delid is something like this. Got mine in the local hardware store for like 2€.


----------



## stin0

I used this, worked like a charm


----------



## orvils

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I bet you knew things were going bad when hearing the mold begin to crack. I soaked the cpu in hot water (covered), tried the razor without confidence then finished off the tool with a wooden board and hammer.


Well your tool actually look good enough for it to work. Mine was way way less dense.
The issue you had is that you used c-clamp. I used same thing since I did not have a vice, not could I get a hold of one that easily.
C-clamp adds uneven pressure. It presses against the center only. And caused unit to deform.

I would actually advise on getting a razor and just slicing it through. That is if you can't get a vice somewhere. If you can then vice will be safer.
Or do as I did and use a sanded down credit card(or guitar pick) instead of razor.
Don't waste your time and money on these fancy 3d printed things.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> My life changes constantly. I do not have a vice, shop, garage, I had a c clamp though. I am searching for those things.
> If you are advertising I will try it out. I do not have any CLU or other LM on hand at the moment. I was going on the advice of @Roboyto and planned on removing the stock glue, keeping the stock TIM. It was part of my new custom loop install. The custom loop went in okay, the delidding, a stubborn mule.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You should still see an improvement in temperatures even if you don't swap the paste out. Intel did specify the 4690/4790 received upgraded thermal paste, so that could be something. The Intel paste is also kinda thick so it may not suffer from pump out like traditional pastes.

IHS Gap Performance Gains:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570

I have used a razor on all of my delids up to this point. My first attempt with a razor knife was also a failure as I was anxious/nervous/scared. However I found that a standard razor blade is best. You could probably benefit from heating the IHS, or razor blade, a little bit to get through the glue a little easier, though I haven't tried this yet myself.



The hardest part of the razor method is getting it started. I've found the best strategy is to use the center of the razor to get under a corner of the IHS. By using the razor at a slight angle you can usually get under the corner pretty easily as the glue doesn't go all the way to the edge. Once the razor is under the corner you can slowly push the rest of the blade under the edge of the IHS.



Generally speaking the glue is thickest on the 'wings' where the socket latch pushes down to secure the CPU.

A thought I just had was the use of some fishing line or possibly dental floss. I say this because it is how I have removed emblems from cars before...use a hairdryer to heat up the glue holding it on and then slide the line behind it to remove them without damaging anything. If you can get a corner started with the razor first this may work...use a small heat gun or hair dryer to heat up the IHS and then see what happens.

If you do decide to cut it off, just be sure to keep in mind where the VRMs are under the lid! Use the gold arrow and/or dots on the PCB to know where to be the most careful.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> A thought I just had was the use of some fishing line or possibly dental floss. I say this because it is how I have removed emblems from cars before...use a hairdryer to heat up the glue holding it on and then slide the line behind it to remove them without damaging anything. If you can get a corner started with the razor first this may work...use a small heat gun or hair dryer to heat up the IHS and then see what happens.


This does read quite logical to me.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> This does read quite logical to me.










It's worth a shot...can't hurt anything with line/floss.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> This does read quite logical to me.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's worth a shot...can't hurt anything with line/floss.
Click to expand...

For the sake of an extra post about it; your idea reminded me of those denied dental floss in jail due to its use as a cutting tool for shivs, escape attempts, etc. In that case I may need an abrasive liquid to rub with it, and I am hesitant to search "dental floss prison breaks" or something of the sort over google.


----------



## Ottawamaritimer

Hey everyone, I've done some searches of this forum and I'm looking for some help on a couple of things.


How can I be sure my cpu is operating properly after delidding and that I have not damaged anything. I've read that PCIe lanes can be damaged? How will I know?
I am looking at the heat gun method, it seems very simple. I won't ask what method is best safest etc. but I will ask what are the risks of this method.
Is there any concerns about operating a delidded cpu where the IHS has slid just a smidge on install of the cpu into the socket
Thanks so much for your help. I will continue to read the thousands of posts. This forum is very well contributed to.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Yes


----------



## Valgaur

Vagur is making plans


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ottawamaritimer*
> 
> Hey everyone, I've done some searches of this forum and I'm looking for some help on a couple of things.
> 
> 
> How can I be sure my cpu is operating properly after delidding and that I have not damaged anything. I've read that PCIe lanes can be damaged? How will I know?
> I am looking at the heat gun method, it seems very simple. I won't ask what method is best safest etc. but I will ask what are the risks of this method.
> Is there any concerns about operating a delidded cpu where the IHS has slid just a smidge on install of the cpu into the socket
> Thanks so much for your help. I will continue to read the thousands of posts. This forum is very well contributed to.


You can use GPU-Z render test to see if your GPU is still operating at 3.0 x16( if you have a reasonably modern card). Another common thing to die is RAM Channels, which is easy enough to diagnose by populating each of the slots and seeing if the DIMMs show up in bios or in cpu-Z. I cant speak for the dangers of the heatgun method from personal experience, but as I understand it, you are still putting the cpu in a vice, so take proper care not to damage the PCB when you are tightening it down. I have only done razor method, so maybe someone else can chime in on heatgun+vice. The lid on the CPU does not have to be perfectly square and perfectly centered, but try not to don't let it touch the array of gold dots that intel leaves on the top of the pcb, and that both wings are in fact under the latch and you should be fine...
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Vagur is making plans


Whoa...before you go making plans..
can I buy an "L"?


----------



## Pyr0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's worth a shot...can't hurt anything with line/floss.


I used floss to start delidding then once I'd managed to get under a corner, I used a small piece of stiff plastic from some packaging to break the rest of the seal.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pyr0*
> 
> I used floss to start delidding then once I'd managed to get under a corner, I used a small piece of stiff plastic from some packaging to break the rest of the seal.


I thought about doing this until I got a delid mate of another member. Used that and pop, clean off.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have only done razor method, so maybe someone else can chime in on heatgun+vice.


I did a combination of razor + heatgun.
It was rather hard to get the razer under the heatspreader, so I just a super cheap heatgun (like 16 euros) which basically had 2 settings: hot and extremely hot.

I used the hot setting on the external heatspreader, just to soften the internal glue and by heating the heatspreader it will also 'shrink' the material (not sure how to explain this in english).
Basically it makes it easier to get the razor under the heatspreader. But be careful that the heatspreader gets hot rather fast; also be careful with the heatgun that you don't cook your CPU









I also used the vice method once but did it without heating it.

Both methods work fine and both have their pros and cons. But I'd say the razor method requires some more finesse.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> heating the heatspreader it will also 'shrink'


Maybe I need therapy, a 'shrink'; though heat makes things expand, cold makes them contract. That is what happens to me in the pool anyways.


----------



## jdorje

These methods all sound way more dangerous than just using a vice (at least for ivy/haswell).

I ran my g3258 at 85C for an hour before delidding. But by the time I had it out of the socket and into the vice all the heat seemed gone.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> You can use GPU-Z render test to see if your GPU is still operating at 3.0 x16( if you have a reasonably modern card). Another common thing to die is RAM Channels, which is easy enough to diagnose by populating each of the slots and seeing if the DIMMs show up in bios or in cpu-Z. I cant speak for the dangers of the heatgun method from personal experience, but as I understand it, you are still putting the cpu in a vice, so take proper care not to damage the PCB when you are tightening it down. I have only done razor method, so maybe someone else can chime in on heatgun+vice. The lid on the CPU does not have to be perfectly square and perfectly centered, but try not to don't let it touch the array of gold dots that intel leaves on the top of the pcb, and that both wings are in fact under the latch and you should be fine...
> Whoa...before you go making plans..
> can I buy an "L"?


But Vagur likes it without the l sometimes


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ottawamaritimer*
> 
> Hey everyone, I've done some searches of this forum and I'm looking for some help on a couple of things.
> 
> 
> How can I be sure my cpu is operating properly after delidding and that I have not damaged anything. I've read that PCIe lanes can be damaged? How will I know?
> I am looking at the heat gun method, it seems very simple. I won't ask what method is best safest etc. but I will ask what are the risks of this method.
> Is there any concerns about operating a delidded cpu where the IHS has slid just a smidge on install of the cpu into the socket
> Thanks so much for your help. I will continue to read the thousands of posts. This forum is very well contributed to.


The thing to be most careful with is installing the CPU into the socket with a loose lid; if you won't be gluing/taping it back down obviously. If you won't be securing the IHS with anything I would suggest dropping the chip into the socket first so you know it is level and seated properly. I made a fatal error when installing my 3770k with the lid loose and ended up bending several pins and breaking 2 of them.

Shouldn't be any major issues with heating up the IHS to soften the adhesive. If you're using a vice just be careful you don't chip the PCB, make sure to apply pressure slowly and keep an eye on the PCB to make sure it's not bending.

The lid will most likely slide a little bit when you secure the latch. Just be certain that it is centered so the latch puts pressure on both the 'wings' evenly. If one side doesn't have enough 'meat' to apply even pressure bad things can happen. In my 3770k instance, it caused the lid to spring up and in the split second where pressure was lopsided it put awkward/forceful pressure on one side/corner and broke/bent pins.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> heating the heatspreader it will also 'shrink'
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe I need therapy, a 'shrink'; though heat makes things expand, cold makes them contract. That is what happens to me in the pool anyways.
Click to expand...

go put an unopened water bottle in the freezer for a few days. #science


----------



## NotATroll

Hey everyone, I recently delidded my 4670K using an extremely strange method. I thought I'd share my story:

I initially tried the blade method (probably a year ago) only to chicken out moments later (from being scared I'll either slit my wrists or just plain wreck the chip).

In my most recent attempt which was similar to the vice method, just without a vice; I was successfully able to do it quite easily.

Image of my chip:



Will be able to link my CPU Z validation and other details tomorrow. Considering I am at work now and I have no internet at home.









EDIT: What's the deal with sanding down the IHS? Is it mainly due to them not manufacturing 100% flush?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

lol, so.. what the hell, did I miss the story? lawl./


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> What's the deal with sanding down the IHS? Is it mainly due to them not manufacturing 100% flush?


Extreme cases of machining irregularities. For the most part there is no need. Actually, I still don't see the point of putting the lid back on myself. Running without it is a whole lot less risky than any of the other these discussed in this thread!


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Extreme cases of machining irregularities. For the most part there is no need. Actually, I still don't see the point of putting the lid back on myself. Running without it is a whole lot less risky than any of the other these discussed in this thread!


Thanks for clearing that up. Does keeping it off net any further temperature decreases and better heat dissipation/transfer?

is there any other steps that need to be taken should I decide to keep the IHS off, to make sure I have optimal contact without damaging the actual chip?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Extreme cases of machining irregularities. For the most part there is no need. Actually, I still don't see the point of putting the lid back on myself. Running without it is a whole lot less risky than any of the other these discussed in this thread!
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for clearing that up. Does keeping it off net any further temperature decreases and better heat dissipation/transfer?
> 
> is there any other steps that need to be taken should I decide to keep the IHS off, to make sure I have optimal contact without damaging the actual chip?
Click to expand...

Mostly just have to account for the height difference. EK makes an add-on naked kit for their supremacy block for less than $5. Depending on your cooling solution it could be as simple as replacing the post screws, or adding washers/spacers to the mount. If you are on air, leaving the lid off is considerably more difficult, and probably inadvisable.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:
Originally Posted by *NotATroll* 

Thanks for clearing that up. Does keeping it off net any further temperature decreases and better heat dissipation/transfer?

is there any other steps that need to be taken should I decide to keep the IHS off, to make sure I have optimal contact without damaging the actual chip?
Originally Posted by *inedenimadam* 

Extreme cases of machining irregularities. For the most part there is no need. Actually, I still don't see the point of putting the lid back on myself. Running without it is a whole lot less risky than any of the other these discussed in this thread.
I have never sanded/lapped an IHS myself, but I don't think they are perfectly flat by design from images I have seen others post. I'm fairly certain the IHS are concave by design and some heatsinks/blocks are convex to achieve optimal contact/results. I have read of others lapping their heatsink/block at the same time as the IHS to make sure both are flat and making the best contact possible. If you were going to be sanding/lapping one, it's probably best to do both.

There is a risk of crushing/damaging the CPU die if you tighten the heatsink/block too much since nearly all of them are designed with the IHS in mind. EK has a bare die mount for their blocks, but I'm not certain of many other products available.

I have my 4770k naked with an XSPC Raystorm. I did so just by taking some simple measurements and making sure the block wasn't too tight. http://www.overclock.net/t/1468701/xspc-raystorm-naked-ivy-haswell-mounting-no-additional-hardware/0_20

I believe the temperature results of bare die, compared to delidded with LM, can vary pending on what TIM you will be using. I have a thought that if you are going to run bare die that it could suffer from pump out just like using a traditional TIM under the IHS. This theory probably explains why the temperatures for my bare die mount have slowly gotten worse over ~2 years. If you are going to be running bare die, liquid metal is likely the best choice.

Another thought...Because liquid metal under the lid causes such a great drop in temperatures, running with a lid and liquid metal may perform better than bare die with a traditional paste. Can anyone comment?


----------



## Ottawamaritimer

Thanks for the help. I have watched some youtube videos where the IHS is removed and they put something over the dots that are beside the die. They then put the TIM on the die. What is the purpose of covering the metal dots?


----------



## jdorje

You put lm on the die. It's conductive so on haswell (only) you can't let it touch the caps of the fivr sticking out of the pcb. People put an insulator (usually nail polish) on those caps.

I was advised and had good results to just ignore that. Just keep your lm under control and don't worry about our.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> You put lm on the die. It's conductive so on haswell (only) you can't let it touch the caps of the fivr sticking out of the pcb. People put an insulator (usually nail polish) on those caps.
> 
> I was advised and had good results to just ignore that. Just keep your lm under control and don't worry about our.


I actually got some IM on one or two of the little dots when I applied it to the chip. Although it stated my IM was not electrically conductive, I gave the little dots a few wipes and so far no issues.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Hey everyone, I recently delidded my 4670K using an extremely strange method. I thought I'd share my story:
> 
> I initially tried the blade method (probably a year ago) only to chicken out moments later (from being scared I'll either slit my wrists or just plain wreck the chip).
> 
> In my most recent attempt which was similar to the vice method, just without a vice; I was successfully able to do it quite easily.
> 
> Image of my chip:
> 
> 
> 
> Will be able to link my CPU Z validation and other details tomorrow. Considering I am at work now and I have no internet at home.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: What's the deal with sanding down the IHS? Is it mainly due to them not manufacturing 100% flush?


Anyway, here goes.

OCN Name: notatroll
CPU: 4670K
on die-TIM: Coolermaster Thermal Fusion 400
ihs-TIM: Coolermaster Thermal Fusion 400
Mhz gained: NA
Max OC: 4800 Mhz Stable
Temp Gains: NA
CPU-Z Validation: http://valid.x86.fr/9gsjfe


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Anyway, here goes.
> 
> OCN Name: notatroll
> CPU: 4670K
> on die-TIM: Coolermaster Thermal Fusion 400
> ihs-TIM: Coolermaster Thermal Fusion 400
> Mhz gained: NA
> Max OC: 4800 Mhz Stable
> Temp Gains: NA
> CPU-Z Validation: http://valid.x86.fr/9gsjfe


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> I actually got some IM on one or two of the little dots when I applied it to the chip. Although it stated my IM was not electrically conductive, I gave the little dots a few wipes and so far no issues.


LM is liquid metal. Anything else will be significantly worse to put on your die. Most other tims aren't conductive, which is good because I'm pretty sure shorting the fivr caps will kill the cpu.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Anyway, here goes.
> 
> OCN Name: notatroll
> CPU: 4670K
> on die-TIM: Coolermaster Thermal Fusion 400
> ihs-TIM: Coolermaster Thermal Fusion 400
> Mhz gained: NA
> Max OC: 4800 Mhz Stable
> Temp Gains: NA
> CPU-Z Validation: http://valid.x86.fr/9gsjfe


4.8ghz stable? May I ask what your used to test? I also have a 4670k and would love to hit 4.8ghz stable if not higher, what voltage are you using too?

Also for other users, can people give me more info on the 4670k, how far can I likely (at a guess) push it? I was thinking 1.4v would be the absolute max for the chip or I'd end up frying it, am I correct? My chip is naked and is watercooled with 2x 360 rads on is a xflow and the other is a monsta 80mm thick also I have a 120mm which is 45mm thick (black Ice SR1 I think) so heat won't really be an issue I'd at least assume with all that rad space. My VRM on my Asus ranger are also watercooled.


----------



## jdorje

4670k has extremely high variation. The best ones are better than 4690ks but the median is significantly worse that the median 4690k. 4.8 would be a golden 4670k I believe.

If you're using 1.4-1.45V vid for everyday I'd keep temps under 75C. Not really worth it on most chips.

Overclocking is off topic for this thread. Ask here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1411077/haswell-overclocking-guide-with-statistics


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Hey everyone, I recently delidded my 4670K using an extremely strange method. I thought I'd share my story:
> 
> I initially tried the blade method (probably a year ago) only to chicken out moments later (from being scared I'll either slit my wrists or just plain wreck the chip).
> 
> In my most recent attempt which was similar to the vice method, just without a vice; I was successfully able to do it quite easily.
> ?


What exactly did you do? I'm always curious


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's worth a shot...can't hurt anything with line/floss.


Gonna have to call you on infringement if it is successful haha... This was a drawing from a few years back.. Damn may even be buried in this thread somewhere.. probably is.



If you wanna be fancy maybe you could even use a vice in reverse as the bar for more control


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> 4.8ghz stable? May I ask what your used to test? I also have a 4670k and would love to hit 4.8ghz stable if not higher, what voltage are you using too?
> 
> Also for other users, can people give me more info on the 4670k, how far can I likely (at a guess) push it? I was thinking 1.4v would be the absolute max for the chip or I'd end up frying it, am I correct? My chip is naked and is watercooled with 2x 360 rads on is a xflow and the other is a monsta 80mm thick also I have a 120mm which is 45mm thick (black Ice SR1 I think) so heat won't really be an issue I'd at least assume with all that rad space. My VRM on my Asus ranger are also watercooled.


I'll PM you happily with more in depth details.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> What exactly did you do? I'm always curious


So here's a really lame and hacky storyboard of me delidding my CPU:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Gonna have to call you on infringement if it is successful haha... This was a drawing from a few years back.. Damn may even be buried in this thread somewhere.. probably is.
> 
> 
> 
> If you wanna be fancy maybe you could even use a vice in reverse as the bar for more control


I think this may require a ton of pull force to actually work. You will never have enough force in the area of the chip for it to really work well. Can just as well use a similar method to mine. Where force is applied directly on the IHS as appose to on the bars you pull on.

Just doesn't make sciency sense.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> What exactly did you do? I'm always curious


Here you go:



Edit: Image Reuploaded.

Aaaand explanation. Instead of a piece of wood I used the CPU backplate to evenly disribute the force applied to the chip. A clean wooden floor, gravity and my leg substituted the vice.


----------



## MaFi0s0

I have an Ivy Bridge Delidded
http://www.overclock.net/t/1256686/another-ivy-bridge-die-tim-removal


----------



## yamaharacer19

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> I'll PM you happily with more in depth details.


I'm curious in this as well. You must have a really good chip to run 1.35v at 4.8GHz.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> I'll PM you happily with more in depth details.


No harm in typing it out here so a few of us can learn.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I copied @NotATroll style

OCN Name: G0TSL33P14
CPU: i5 4690K
On die-TIM: Gelid Extreme (EKWB)
IHS-TIM: Gelid Extreme (EKWB)
Mhz gained: Flat
Max OC: 4400 Mhz
Temp Gains: -5+ degrees (more consistently even temperatures over the cores, much higher fluctuation, same overall max temperature)
CPU-Z Validation:


delid completed using the following tool:

http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rocket-88?variant=11782045953






After delidding the i5 4690k I do not think I would try this again with the specific processor or possibly specific aftermarket TIM. Thermals can be improved now, however the stock setup was more stable if asking me.

My idle temps do not get cold anymore. At start up I am at twenty two Celsius, five below benchmark, however thirty minutes later idle is thirty one to three, five above benchmark.

The next step is to find out how to go naked mount and what TIM to use for that, plus maybe I should try CLU plus the lid if it doesn't become a mess, what do you think?

Experience is gained, so the conclusion is good.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I copied @NotATroll style
> 
> OCN Name: G0TSL33P14
> CPU: i5 4690K
> On die-TIM: Gelid Extreme (EKWB)
> IHS-TIM: Gelid Extreme (EKWB)
> Mhz gained: Flat
> Max OC: 4400 Mhz
> Temp Gains: -5+ degrees (more consistently even temperatures over the cores, much higher fluctuation, same overall max temperature)
> CPU-Z Validation:
> 
> 
> delid completed using the following tool:
> 
> http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rocket-88?variant=11782045953
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After delidding the i5 4690k I do not think I would try this again with the specific processor or possibly specific aftermarket TIM. Thermals can be improved now, however the stock setup was more stable if asking me.
> 
> 
> 
> My idle temps do not get cold anymore. At start up I am at twenty two Celsius, five below benchmark, however thirty minutes later idle is thirty one to three, five above benchmark.
> 
> The next step is to find out how to go naked mount and what TIM to use for that, plus maybe I should try CLU plus the lid if it doesn't become a mess, what do you think?
> 
> Experience is gained, so the conclusion is good.


You can use this directly from EK for naked mount: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy

If you don't go with naked, I would highly suggest using the CLU on the die. Putting any kind of normal paste causes the paste to pump off the die giving worse results than stock.

If you have the nickel plated block there is no worry with CLU. If you have the copper block, CLU will stain and could get burned into the copper. Just be sure to do something to protect the VRMs if you will be moving to CLU.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> You can use this directly from EK for naked mount: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy
> 
> If you don't go with naked, I would highly suggest using the CLU on the die. Putting any kind of normal paste causes the paste to pump off the die giving worse results than stock.
> 
> If you have the nickel plated block there is no worry with CLU. If you have the copper block, CLU will stain and could get burned into the copper. Just be sure to do something to protect the VRMs if you will be moving to CLU.


----------



## lowfat

Used the vice only method w/ my i5-6400.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lowfat*
> 
> Used the vice only method w/ my i5-6400.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Looks like way too much CLU on there, everytime I see people saying how to apply CLU the less you use the better and the evenly spread out the better.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *lowfat*
> 
> Used the vice only method w/ my i5-6400.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like way too much CLU on there, everytime I see people saying how to apply CLU the less you use the better and the evenly spread out the better.
Click to expand...

I agree. That is enough for several applications. Cool photos though!


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lowfat*
> 
> Used the vice only method w/ my i5-6400.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Sweet photos, but as others have mentioned that is a bit much for just the CPU die. Also make sure you get that glue residue off of there.

Less is more with CLU especially considering how easily it spreads. I have never even squeezed any out onto the die. I either dispense a bit into the cap, or a little onto the brush they supply. After you spread it, it should look like crinkled aluminum foil.


----------



## lowfat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Looks like way too much CLU on there, everytime I see people saying how to apply CLU the less you use the better and the evenly spread out the better.


I ended up wiping some off. That big ball shot out all at once. I hadn't use the CLP since I did my last delid on a 4770K over 2 years ago. I guess it got clogged a bit.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> If you don't go with naked, I would highly suggest using the CLU on the die. Putting any kind of normal paste causes the paste to pump off the die giving worse results than stock.
> 
> If you have the nickel plated block there is no worry with CLU. If you have the copper block, CLU will stain and could get burned into the copper. Just be sure to do something to protect the VRMs if you will be moving to CLU.


Even the stock paste had pumped off the die.
Originally what I did was pick up the pumped out stock paste with a tooth pick and lay it back on the die for burn in, however I chickened out when the first time firing up the processor temperatures were fluctuating from twenty degrees Celsius all the way to seventy six degrees Celsius then back down again over four second periods give or take. The stock paste having not become liquid, and needing time to re distribute.

For the block, I have the copper block. What paste do you recommend for naked with the copper block, any recommendations?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I copied @NotATroll style
> 
> OCN Name: G0TSL33P14
> CPU: i5 4690K
> On die-TIM: Gelid Extreme (EKWB)
> IHS-TIM: Gelid Extreme (EKWB)
> Mhz gained: Flat
> Max OC: 4400 Mhz
> Temp Gains: -5+ degrees (more consistently even temperatures over the cores, much higher fluctuation, same overall max temperature)
> CPU-Z Validation:
> 
> 
> delid completed using the following tool:
> 
> http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rocket-88?variant=11782045953
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After delidding the i5 4690k I do not think I would try this again with the specific processor or possibly specific aftermarket TIM. Thermals can be improved now, however the stock setup was more stable if asking me.
> 
> My idle temps do not get cold anymore. At start up I am at twenty two Celsius, five below benchmark, however thirty minutes later idle is thirty one to three, five above benchmark.
> 
> The next step is to find out how to go naked mount and what TIM to use for that, plus maybe I should try CLU plus the lid if it doesn't become a mess, what do you think?
> 
> Experience is gained, so the conclusion is good.


You're In!







Slappa DatSig On!


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> So here's a really lame and hacky storyboard of me delidding my CPU:
> I think this may require a ton of pull force to actually work. You will never have enough force in the area of the chip for it to really work well. Can just as well use a similar method to mine. Where force is applied directly on the IHS as appose to on the bars you pull on.
> 
> Just doesn't make sciency sense.


As mentioned you could use a vice to provide more pull to the ends, the rubber sealant is not hard to cut through, I would think a higher test line could do that easily with a few cranks. I am not in the business of selling or trying to make money on an idea I was just kidding around and letting you know it wasn't the first anyone thought about it. You sound like a great scientist, if things I say don't make sciency sense. You should apply for my chemist position, I heard from HR over 50,000 people already did last year. Maybe you will get lucky.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Even the stock paste had pumped off the die.
> Originally what I did was pick up the pumped out stock paste with a tooth pick and lay it back on the die for burn in, however I chickened out when the first time firing up the processor temperatures were fluctuating from twenty degrees Celsius all the way to seventy six degrees Celsius then back down again over four second periods give or take. The stock paste having not become liquid, and needing time to re distribute.
> 
> For the block, I have the copper block. What paste do you recommend for naked with the copper block, any recommendations?


I don't think the stock paste pumps off rather than it being an excessive amount that is applied from the factory. The consistency of the stock paste is more like that of a partially dried up thermal pad as it has a bit of thickness to it. That is high fluctuation, but as long as you're not holding maximum temperature, for extended periods, there is little chance of any damage that is going to be done.

If you're OK with staining your block, then CLU is the way to go. No traditional paste comes close to it in performance, so why not get the most out of your efforts?

I think I'm going to pull off my heatsink today and scope out that situation due to rising temps after 2 years running naked with traditional paste; Xigmatek PTI-G4512. I'll post some pics so you and everyone can see what the long term effects are. Pending this information you may make a different decision.


----------



## stin0

I'm hungover and bored so decided to go for a naked 4690K mount








Already delidded it a while ago but decided the heatspreader should be removed aswell.

The previous Grizzly paste was applied really poorly as you can see, it didnt even cover all of the surface and shows some clear air bubble after-effects.
I have no clue how that happened..

I used CLU between the IHS and the waterblock








No results yet as I have to do some proper testing and im still busy removing air bubbles from my custom loop.


No clue how this happenend, this has to be the worst thermal paste application ever.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I'm hungover and bored so decided to go for a naked 4690K mount
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Already delidded it a while ago but decided the heatspreader should be removed aswell.
> 
> The previous Grizzly paste was applied really poorly as you can see, it didnt even cover all of the surface and shows some clear air bubble after-effects.
> I have no clue how that happened..
> 
> I used CLU between the IHS and the waterblock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No results yet as I have to do some proper testing and im still busy removing air bubbles from my custom loop.
> 
> 
> No clue how this happenend, this has to be the worst thermal paste application ever.


Do you have a delid guard? You're mounting right on the die with just the heatsink pressure on the chip? Wow, sounds risky applying that much pressure right on the chip...


----------



## paskowitz

I didn't take pictures but be advised... I put CLU on my die and IHS and a layer of CLU definitely mechanically bonded (IE soaked into the metal) to my IHS and Swiftech copper block. And this is only after 3-4 months. I got it off the IHS, but could not completely clean the CPU block. Can't comment on temps since I introduced other variables into my loop.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Do you have a delid guard? You're mounting right on the die with just the heatsink pressure on the chip? Wow, sounds risky applying that much pressure right on the chip...


He will be fine with the EK naked mount kit


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> I didn't take pictures but be advised... I put CLU on my die and IHS and a layer of CLU definitely mechanically bonded (IE soaked into the metal) to my IHS and Swiftech copper block. And this is only after 3-4 months. I got it off the IHS, but could not completely clean the CPU block. Can't comment on temps since I introduced other variables into my loop.


Yup, this is what happens unless you have a nickel plated block/heatsink.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> I didn't take pictures but be advised... I put CLU on my die and IHS and a layer of CLU definitely mechanically bonded (IE soaked into the metal) to my IHS and Swiftech copper block. And this is only after 3-4 months. I got it off the IHS, but could not completely clean the CPU block. Can't comment on temps since I introduced other variables into my loop.


Hmm Yeah my previous block was also slightly effected by CLU. Should i change it to grizzly or mx4 paste just to be safe?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Hmm Yeah my previous block was also slightly effected by CLU. Should i change it to grizzly or mx4 paste just to be safe?


Covering the entire IHS would be a worse scenario than just the die with a naked mount. You can do whichever you prefer, but as mentioned the copper will be effected by the CLU. The largest safety precaution should be taken with the VRMs on your CPU. Ensure they won't come in contact with the CLU and you will be fine.


----------



## paskowitz

Just out of curiosity, is a 9-12c delta between my water temp and CPU temp (at idle) average for a delided, water cooled 4790k? The delta for my GPU to water temp at idle is about 2-3c. Water temp ATM is about 25c with an ambient of around 17-20c.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Covering the entire IHS would be a worse scenario than just the die with a naked mount. You can do whichever you prefer, but as mentioned the copper will be effected by the CLU. The largest safety precaution should be taken with the VRMs on your CPU. Ensure they won't come in contact with the CLU and you will be fine.


The vrms next to the IHS are covered in a very thin layer of clear nail polish so I should be fine. Thanks for the tips


----------



## johnd0e

hey guys, dont really feel like digging through all these pages to find my answer so hopefully someone can just tell me.

what are you guys using to re seal the IHS onto the chip? automotive silicon? what kind? high heat obviously.


----------



## D33G33

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> hey guys, dont really feel like digging through all these pages to find my answer so hopefully someone can just tell me.
> 
> what are you guys using to re seal the IHS onto the chip? automotive silicon? what kind? high heat obviously.


Well that's abut lazy.

But generally nothing. The socket clamp holds the IHS in place.


----------



## johnd0e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *D33G33*
> 
> Well that's abut lazy.
> 
> But generally nothing. The socket clamp holds the IHS in place.


mehh its valentines day and im multitasking between cooking dinner for the girl and doing computer stuff for myself hahaha. i feel that qualifies for some form of laziness







but your correct, lazy indeed. on any other day id search through the pages myself.

But thank you for responding. i appreciate it.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> As mentioned you could use a vice to provide more pull to the ends, the rubber sealant is not hard to cut through, I would think a higher test line could do that easily with a few cranks. I am not in the business of selling or trying to make money on an idea I was just kidding around and letting you know it wasn't the first anyone thought about it. You sound like a great scientist, if things I say don't make sciency sense. You should apply for my chemist position, I heard from HR over 50,000 people already did last year. Maybe you will get lucky.


Send me the job specification with the relevant details and I'll get right on it!


----------



## Aytac

hi,

i got my gear







going to give it a try this evening.
i dont have glue. going to without it.

any advice welcome.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aytac*
> 
> hi,
> 
> i got my gear
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> going to give it a try this evening.
> i dont have glue. going to without it.
> 
> any advice welcome.


Start with a corner and just be careful. Make sure you know where the small vrm chips are located on the DIE.
You'll want to be extra careful with the razor around those parts, if you slip or accidentally press the razor in too hard you could damaged them.

The hardest part is the initial 'cut' where the razor goes under the heatsink. Once you get one corner, the rest will be easy.
Good luck, take your time and post the results


----------



## Aytac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Start with a corner and just be careful. Make sure you know where the small vrm chips are located on the DIE.
> You'll want to be extra careful with the razor around those parts, if you slip or accidentally press the razor in too hard you could damaged them.
> 
> The hardest part is the initial 'cut' where the razor goes under the heatsink. Once you get one corner, the rest will be easy.
> Good luck, take your time and post the results


thanks man i guess skylake dont have vrm chips near die, i am lucky about that.
i will post results. my cpu is 6700k 4.6ghz current.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aytac*
> 
> thanks man i guess skylake dont have vrm chips near die, i am lucky about that.
> i will post results. my cpu is 6700k 4.6ghz current.


If you can, try keep the blade as flush as possible against the IHS - and not against the chip itself. You don't want to scratch the chip.Take it slow and steady.

I never liked the idea of using a blade, but don't let that discourage you.

All the best!


----------



## Aytac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> If you can, try keep the blade as flush as possible against the IHS - and not against the chip itself. You don't want to scratch the chip.Take it slow and steady.
> 
> I never liked the idea of using a blade, but don't let that discourage you.
> 
> All the best!


too late man lol, already did what you said, have 2 small scratch but its SUCCESS!!









loading screens


----------



## Aytac

lets say total 17c gain at load








here some pictures:








before idle


before load


after idle


after load


----------



## stin0

So you used CLU on the internal heatspreader and also the outer heatspreader?
If your cooling block is made of copper its going go get stained a lot, so I hope you dont mind that. Its real aggressive stuff.

Also you used WAY too much CLU on the outer heatspreader there.. It should be spread out evenly with a very, VERY thin layer.. this is like 4 times too much

Good job on the delid though


----------



## Aytac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> So you used CLU on the internal heatspreader and also the outer heatspreader?
> If your cooling block is made of copper its going go get stained a lot, so I hope you dont mind that. Its real aggressive stuff.
> 
> Also you used WAY too much CLU on the outer heatspreader there.. It should be spread out evenly with a very, VERY thin layer.. this is like 4 times too much
> 
> Good job on the delid though


yea i used clu internal and external, just i forgat die picture :d
this is my first experience with clu. next time i will carefull i guess after 5 years









thanks alot


----------



## Benjiw

With delid tools a plenty it bothers me what people are still using blades to delid when I've need far too many damaged chips when doing the razor method over any other method combined during my time looking at how to do it spanning several years. I can't be alone on this or am I just dumb for working smarter not harder?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I can't be alone on this or am I just dumb for working smarter not harder?


You might be spoiled. The user lists they are from Turkey, pretty sure there is big time war going on right next door. Could be hard to get things imported that are less than medically classified. What can I say?

Use a combination of razor, vice, and every method you can to make one no more brutal than the next. The objective is to remove the lid nice and easy.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> If you can, try keep the blade as flush as possible against the IHS - and not against the chip itself. You don't want to scratch the chip.Take it slow and steady.
> 
> I never liked the idea of using a blade, but don't let that discourage you.
> 
> All the best!


I always tilt upwards when I wiggle. Anyone found this to be bad? I have only de-lidded twice but succesfully. I figure any wiggling should be applied in the direction of the IHS since it is just a hunk of metal as opposed to the chip.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I always tilt upwards when I wiggle. Anyone found this to be bad? I have only de-lidded twice but succesfully. I figure any wiggling should be applied in the direction of the IHS since it is just a hunk of metal as opposed to the chip.


Nope, this definitely makes sense. You're in good hands it seems. I never used the blade on mine because the adhesive seemed extremely tough. Not sure whether the same adhesive is used on all chips or whether I was just being a big sissy.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aytac*
> 
> too late man lol, already did what you said, have 2 small scratch but its SUCCESS!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> loading screens


Those maximum heat temps were insane by the way. I'm really jelly.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> With delid tools a plenty it bothers me what people are still using blades to delid when I've need far too many damaged chips when doing the razor method over any other method combined during my time looking at how to do it spanning several years. I can't be alone on this or am I just dumb for working smarter not harder?


It's all about preference. I've delid about 20 processors now, a few using the vice method and the majority with a razor.
With a razor it takes me about one minute to delid a cpu without leaving any scratches or damage.

In general I would advice the vice method as it's probably the safest method, I just prefer the razor method


----------



## Aytac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Those maximum heat temps were insane by the way. I'm really jelly.


yea great temps







overclocked 200mhz more, currently 4.8ghz. max core temps still under 70 on prime small fft. delid is big risk but great gain.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aytac*
> 
> yea great temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> overclocked 200mhz more, currently 4.8ghz. max core temps still under 70 on prime small fft. delid is big risk but great gain.


I'm only seeing around 10 degree differences - but that's with my crummy thermal paste. Wish we could get CLU here in South Africa. Plus, Having a CM V8 aint really that great. What are you using to keep everything so cool?


----------



## Aytac

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> I'm only seeing around 10 degree differences - but that's with my crummy thermal paste. Wish we could get CLU here in South Africa. Plus, Having a CM V8 aint really that great. What are you using to keep everything so cool?


case: corsair 780t

front: 3x 120mm intake
bottom: 2x 120mm intake
back: 1x 140mm exhaust
top: 3x120mm rad, both side filled total 6x 120mm exhaust
cpu cooler: thermaltake water 3.0 ultimate

all fans controls on mainboard, asus z170 deluxe qfan control.

its realy silent and cool when idle. loud and cool when need









i bought CLU from this link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0039RY3MM?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00
i am sure they sending to s.aftica too.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aytac*
> 
> case: corsair 780t
> 
> front: 3x 120mm intake
> bottom: 2x 120mm intake
> back: 1x 140mm exhaust
> top: 3x120mm rad, both side filled total 6x 120mm exhaust
> cpu cooler: thermaltake water 3.0 ultimate
> 
> all fans controls on mainboard, asus z170 deluxe qfan control.
> 
> its realy silent and cool when idle. loud and cool when need
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i bought CLU from this link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0039RY3MM?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00
> i am sure they sending to s.aftica too.


I'm definitely lacking in the fan department. Will give Amazon a shot nearing end of the month. Thanks so much for poking around for me!


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> I'm only seeing around 10 degree differences - but that's with my crummy thermal paste. Wish we could get CLU here in South Africa. Plus, Having a CM V8 aint really that great. What are you using to keep everything so cool?


is it not possible to bring it in? Pardon my ignorance, I don't really know much about SA. I ordered my CLU direct from Germany and it arrived in less than a week


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> is it not possible to bring it in? Pardon my ignorance, I don't really know much about SA. I ordered my CLU direct from Germany and it arrived in less than a week


Seems like it's definitely possible. But paying R500 is pretty much out of the question for something we used to get for around R250 before our President went on a firing spree.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Seems like it's definitely possible. But paying R500 is pretty much out of the question for something we used to get for around R250 before our President went on a firing spree.


Whoa,double the price. My condolences to you...what about the thermal grizzly kryonaut/cosmonaut? One of them is LM as well and performs on par with CLU


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Whoa,double the price. My condolences to you...what about the thermal grizzly kryonaut/cosmonaut? One of them is LM as well and performs on par with CLU


Considering Grizzly is only like a R50 saving I'm probably just better off getting CLU?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Considering Grizzly is only like a R50 saving I'm probably just better off getting CLU?


Depends on how much R50 means to you i guess. I would say CLU still since it's more well known. Just googled rand to singapore dollar exchange rate, it is pricey to ship to s.a


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Depends on how much R50 means to you i guess. I would say CLU still since it's more well known. Just googled rand to singapore dollar exchange rate, it is pricey to ship to s.a


Yeah definitely! I guess I'll still have to get it. Considering CLU only requires a small amount, so getting it at the price it currently goes for would be something I can afford as an annual expense.


----------



## Tekgnome

well i thought i would give my g3258 a shot.

I dropped it on the concrete floor and nicked it with the razer.

Im pretty sure its dead







I dont suppose there is a service i could have my 4790k done through?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tekgnome*
> 
> well i thought i would give my g3258 a shot.
> 
> I dropped it on the concrete floor and nicked it with the razer.
> 
> Im pretty sure its dead
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I dont suppose there is a service i could have my 4790k done through?


I took a nice chunk out of my 3770k and it was fine...Couldn't hurt to test it.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tekgnome*
> 
> I dont suppose there is a service i could have my 4790k done through?


https://siliconlottery.com/products/delid


----------



## Tekgnome

wow, i didn't realize silicon lottery allowed you to mail them in, and at $50 that is a steal considering the risks.

I'll definitely test it but i gouged the crap out of the bus lines connecting to what i assume is the memory controller. (gold dots)


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tekgnome*
> 
> wow, i didn't realize silicon lottery allowed you to mail them in, and at $50 that is a steal considering the risks.
> 
> I'll definitely test it but i gouged the crap out of the bus lines connecting to what i assume is the memory controller. (gold dots)


I saw that.


----------



## jdorje

While silicon lottery is great, $50 for a haswell/ivy delid is crazy considering the vice only method has basically no cost and no risk.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> While silicon lottery is great, $50 for a haswell/ivy delid is crazy considering the vice only method has basically no cost and no risk.


I have to agree with this, although I am against people buying stuff and returning it. Get yourself a good vice... and keep it. You will need it one day.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have to agree with this, although I am against people buying stuff and returning it. Get yourself a good vice... and keep it. You will need it one day.


WORD


----------



## BaK2BaK

Hi Captain, guys

It has been a long time since I last came here, just delidded (vice only) my Broadwell chip (5675C) and need your advice.

I would like to isolate the capacitors from any CLP drops, and I am about to get this:
mibenco liquid rubber PURE


Will it do or do I better have buying something that is especially designed for electrical isolation, such as:


----------



## stin0

Liquid tape is the best I guess, although I used some 2 euro supercheap clear nail polish which does the trick just as good


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Do it right and you do it once..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Do it right and you do it once..


agreed, LET is so much easier


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Do it right and you do it once..


Yeah, that's what I try to do most of the time.
But LET here is almost 40$ while the mibenco, which looks like the same product, is half that price.
Will see and let you know how it turns out!
Thx for your inputs!


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> agreed, LET is so much easier


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Yeah, that's what I try to do most of the time.
> But LET here is almost 40$ while the mibenco, which looks like the same product, is half that price.
> Will see and let you know how it turns out!
> Thx for your inputs!


Clear nail polish from a local store works just fine.
I've used it on about 20 chips, from 4690k's to 4790k's and so on.

Works perfectly fine and is cheap


----------



## BaK2BaK

I guess with so many chips you would have indeed noticed if there was a problem with nail polish.
Would be the easiest and cheapest solution for sure, but a part of me still wishes to see how that liquid dip looks like...


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> I guess with so many chips you would have indeed noticed if there was a problem with nail polish.
> Would be the easiest and cheapest solution for sure, but a part of me still wishes to see how that liquid dip looks like...


Haha, I still have some other cheap CPUs here that I delid as practice.
I could smear some CLU on the nail polish covered VRMs of the cpu and see if it fries the chip and/or motherboard?

Would be a nice test to see if the nail polish is actually safe


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> I guess with so many chips you would have indeed noticed if there was a problem with nail polish.
> Would be the easiest and cheapest solution for sure, but a part of me still wishes to see how that liquid dip looks like...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha, I still have some other cheap CPUs here that I delid as practice.
> I could smear some CLU on the nail polish covered VRMs of the cpu and see if it fries the chip and/or motherboard?
> 
> Would be a nice test to see if the nail polish is actually safe
Click to expand...

Know thy self, good idea. I would be interested in the results documented. "Do whatever you can to kill a cpu by testing your nail polish process." If it does not die, we've got a winner, mentality.


----------



## Loladinas

So I finally got my package with CLP and Kryonaut. Three weeks in and no package, I contacted the seller and said I didn't get it, he apologized and sent out a new one, no questions asked. A week later here it is. I haven't done any extensive testing, just booted the PC and ran OCCT. This is just a short 10 minute run on stock settings, but look at them temps. 46C on the hottest core? What manner of sorcery is this? Alright, I cheated a bit and opened the window, the intake was at only 13C...


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> So I finally got my package with CLP and Kryonaut. Three weeks in and no package, I contacted the seller and said I didn't get it, he apologized and sent out a new one, no questions asked. A week later here it is. I haven't done any extensive testing, just booted the PC and ran OCCT. This is just a short 10 minute run on stock settings, but look at them temps. 46C on the hottest core? What manner of sorcery is this? Alright, I cheated a bit and opened the window, the intake was at only 13C...


Which paste are you using in the pic?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> So I finally got my package with CLP and Kryonaut. Three weeks in and no package, I contacted the seller and said I didn't get it, he apologized and sent out a new one, no questions asked. A week later here it is. I haven't done any extensive testing, just booted the PC and ran OCCT. This is just a short 10 minute run on stock settings, but look at them temps. 46C on the hottest core? What manner of sorcery is this? Alright, I cheated a bit and opened the window, the intake was at only 13C...


yes feel the magic wizardy socery!


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Which paste are you using in the pic?


CLP on the die and Kryonaut on the heatspreader. I wouldn't use my PC like that, I've got some 3000RPM screamers on, I just wanted to see how low it would go.


----------



## tatmMRKIV

taste der8auer's magish


----------



## Loladinas

Honestly, I'm quite impressed. This is what I was getting with MX-4 on the heatspreader, pre-delid, same setup. Well, roughly same setup. Intake might've been a couple degrees off.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Hi Captain, guys
> 
> It has been a long time since I last came here, just delidded (vice only) my Broadwell chip (5675C) and need your advice.
> 
> I would like to isolate the capacitors from any CLP drops, and I am about to get this:
> mibenco liquid rubber PURE
> 
> 
> Will it do or do I better have buying something that is especially designed for electrical isolation, such as:


I and at least one other here had issues with the liquid electrical tape. Mine kept shrinking and peeling back, exposing the regulator's after just a short while. I made sure to let it fully dry before i relidded and used the cpu. I'm currently using nothing at all and I feel like as long as you are careful and don't use too much clu you will be fine. I'm a little iffy on sealing them in with nail polish, even though it seems like everyone does it without issue. I have no reason to be, just doesn't sit right with me.

I'm sure id feel differently if I ruined a chip due to wandering clu though


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I and at least one other here had issues with the liquid electrical tape. Mine kept shrinking and peeling back, exposing the regulator's after just a short while. I made sure to let it fully dry before i relidded and used the cpu. I'm currently using nothing at all and I feel like as long as you are careful and don't use too much clu you will be fine. I'm a little iffy on sealing them in with nail polish, even though it seems like everyone does it without issue. I have no reason to be, just doesn't sit right with me.
> 
> I'm sure id feel differently if I ruined a chip due to wandering clu though


Makes me think that if one was to place a thin line of non conductive material in between the die and vrm(s) to act as a levee; sealing that to the pcb with nail polish it might be the best of both worlds. It is probably possible to build the dam out of plain nail polish by itself if enough attention to detail is paid.

Roboyto and their thermal tape still gets my vote as the overall convenient winner. Now all I need is some CLU to find out.


----------



## Ximplicite

hello im planning to delid my 3570k what is the best thermal paste? thanks im new to this since my 3570k is already 3 yrs old


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> hello im planning to delid my 3570k what is the best thermal paste? thanks im new to this since my 3570k is already 3 yrs old


Not trying to be mean, but did you read any post in this topic?

The best thermal paste on the IHS is a metal one, like cool laboratory ultra. It does conduct electricity though so be careful. On the outer heatspreader it barely marters imo, something like mx4 is fine, cheap and risk free.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> hello im planning to delid my 3570k what is the best thermal paste? thanks im new to this since my 3570k is already 3 yrs old


I'm assuming you're asking for stuff to use between die and IHS, which would be CLU.
If you actually are asking about TIM for use between IHS and cooler base, then any number of them would do the job, gelid gc extreme, mx-4,nh-t1

Edit
Ninja-ed by @stin0


----------



## sav4

What about di electric grease on the caps anyone tried that ?


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> What about di electric grease on the caps anyone tried that ?


might work but wouldn't it be quite messy to remove?


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> might work but wouldn't it be quite messy to remove?


Not really wipe then some contact cleaner to remove the residue .


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Not really wipe then some contact cleaner to remove the residue .


Possibly....you could always give it a try and report back your findings


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I and at least one other here had issues with the liquid electrical tape. Mine kept shrinking and peeling back, exposing the regulator's after just a short while.


Oh really, bad news.

According to the genuine Plasti Dip liquid tape brochure:
Quote:


> [...]LIQUID TAPE will not crack, peel or harden, and remains flexible - even under extreme conditions[...]
> Temperature use range: -30°F to *200°F* (-34°C to *93°C*)


0ldChicken>
What liquid tape did you use exactly?
Do you think your chip get hotter than 200°F/93°C?

EDIT: almost same temp range for the mibenco liquid tape:
-40°C to 95°C


----------



## BaK2BaK

So maybe liquid tape don't like being in a hot environment close to its limit temperature.

Here is a gum version of liquid tape: Sugru mouldable glue


The spec sheet says:
Quote:


> Service Temperature Range: - 50 to 180 °C


Might be a good alternative, even cheaper!


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Oh really, bad news.
> 
> 0ldChicken>
> What liquid tape did you use exactly?
> Do you think your chip get hotter than 200°F/93°C?
> 
> EDIT: almost same temp range for the mibenco liquid tape:
> -40°C to 95°C


I used http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/ltw-400
93°c according to manufacturer's site.

I do think that I was still using my nh-d14 at that point but I am certain I was never over 90°c. Probably never over 85°c for more than a few seconds. It may work a lot better now that I am using a custom loop and never see anything over 65°c
edit: changed link to manufacturer's from retailer's


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I used http://www.gardnerbender.com/en/ltw-400
> 93°c according to manufacturer's site.
> 
> I do think that I was still using my nh-d14 at that point but I am certain I was never over 90°c. Probably never over 85°c for more than a few seconds. It may work a lot better now that I am using a custom loop and never see anything over 65°c
> edit: changed link to manufacturer's from retailer's


Thx for the info, looks like they have all the same T° specs.
Hard to tell though if liquid tape peels back when heated for a long time at 60-70° or if a peak at higher temp makes that...


----------



## stin0

Nail polish has a melting point at ~120 degrees celcius.
It seems my sweet sweet nail polish is still winning as a solution


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Know thy self, good idea. I would be interested in the results documented. "Do whatever you can to kill a cpu by testing your nail polish process." If it does not die, we've got a winner, mentality.


I checked at home what CPUs I still have and it's mostly cheap, old Celeron stuff.
They all don't have any vrms around the IHS sadly.

I'm also not thát convinced that im willing to test it on my 4690K


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Nail polish has a melting point at ~120 degrees celcius.
> It seems my sweet sweet nail polish is still winning as a solution


Heh nice!
Did you happen to have a check at your nail polish after some time of use?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I'm also not thát convinced that im willing to test it on my 4690K


C'mon!


----------



## Loladinas

How about you just coat some copper wire with nail polish, run current through it and test the outside of it with a multimeter? That'd be a hell of a lot cheaper. Hell, you could even heat up the wire to whatever temperature you want.

EDIT:
Quote:


> Did you happen to have a check at your nail polish after some time of use?


I ran my 4790k with MX-4 under the lid and "varnished" VRMs for a month, while waiting for CLP to come. The nail polish looked the same as the day I applied it. I didn't push more than 1,256V through them during that time and temps didn't go over 70C, most of the time running below 60C.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Heh nice!
> Did you happen to have a check at your nail polish after some time of use?


I've checked it a few times and the VRMs still look nice and shiny, eventhough its really cheap 'quick dry' nail polish (2 euros).
I did a normal mount but also a bare-die 'naked' mount and the polish is still unharmed. I think I put like 2 layers over the VRMs.

With my watercooling setup the CPU gets like 47 degree celcius under full load (Prime95) @ stock boost so to increase the temperature I put my pump RPM on 0 so the temps would rise to ~80 degrees celcius.
So conclusion: after 1,5 months the nail polish is still untouched/undamaged







I will of course post something here if anything changes.










This was the naked mount, you can see the nail polish layer over the VRMs cause of the reflection from my phone camera-light.


----------



## Wirerat

I prefer using regular tape. Here I used some anti-static scotch tape from work just because it sticks better than black electric tape.

I just cut a small piece with scissors or a blade. Then I used a tweezer to line up the tape. Fingers are kinda big to start such a small piece.



I have used nail Polish in the past without issue but I like the way the tape turned out. Heck, my first couple of delids I used no protection on vrms at all but I dont advise doing so since it is so easy.


----------



## stin0

I forgot that I never 'officially' joined the Delid Club of Awesome People ! @Valgaur

OCN name: stin0
CPU: 4690K
on die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Ultra
ihs-TIM: MX4 / Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: 100 Mhz
OC after delid: 4.8 Ghz @ 1.371 (4.7 @ 1.292..)
Temp drops: ~18 degrees celcius

CPU-Z Validation will be added later


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I forgot that I never 'officially' joined the Delid Club Of Awesome People (DCOAP)! @Valgaur
> 
> OCN name: stin0
> CPU: 4690K
> on die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Ultra
> ihs-TIM: MX4 / Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: 100 Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.8 Ghz
> Temp drops: ~14 degrees celcius
> 
> CPU-Z Validation will be added later
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Delid chip: http://cdn.overclock.net/2/29/29ebfb08_IMG_20160213_164707.jpeg


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Benjiw

Everyone said nail polish would be fine now everyone is saying no. Will not bother next time and leave the vrm exposed like I originally planned lol.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Everyone said nail polish would be fine now everyone is saying no. Will not bother next time and leave the vrm exposed like I originally planned lol.


Who is saying that nail polish isn't fine?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Everyone said nail polish would be fine now everyone is saying no. Will not bother next time and leave the vrm exposed like I originally planned lol.


I have not heard any issues with using nail polish. I personally don't use it because:

#1. something tells me that sealing them from air will inhibit heat dissipation, just by common sense, although I am not sure what temps they ever hit. But you never know, people may just not be able to get a certain overclock and call it a day, perhaps without nail polish they would have gotten it stable..

#2. I am coordinated... Therefore I confident I will not screw up..

Unfortunately noone has ever tested with and without nail polish nor a good way to measure temps of the VRM's when the IHS and cooler are on to see temperature differences and if a cpu was on the edge of stability between multipliers it would help. Just my input.


----------



## Unnatural

It's probably a stupid idea, but what about self adhesive thermal pad on vrm? Could it provide both electrical insulation, and at the same time some heat transfer by filling the gap between the cpu PCB and the heatsink/waterblock?


----------



## jdorje

I was thinking of using thermal padding too. Got some Fuji poly lying around. But I think there's no reason to re-delid my cpu at this time.

The main issue is that the thickness of the padding has to be perfect. You need to make contact without hurting the spacing between die and ihs.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I forgot that I never 'officially' joined the Delid Club Of Awesome People (DCOAP)! @Valgaur
> 
> OCN name: stin0
> CPU: 4690K
> on die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Ultra
> ihs-TIM: MX4 / Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: 100 Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.8 Ghz
> Temp drops: ~14 degrees celcius
> 
> CPU-Z Validation will be added later
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Love seeing some CLU on the die! Wait till I get my xps 15 9550 and I'll be adding CLU on either the i5-6300HQ version or 6700HQ....!


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Done, thanks for adding me Valgaur!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Love seeing some CLU on the die! Wait till I get my xps 15 9550 and I'll be adding CLU on either the i5-6300HQ version or 6700HQ....!


Of course CLU was used, what else?


----------



## Loladinas

Another quick test at stock. A short Prime95 run. including all the AVX stuff. Intake is at a comfortable 20C. Before delid I would actually hit a thermal wall,100C. This is with Scythe Slipstream fans at 800RPM. Even running at max. speed they're quiet enough for me to be barely audible. This actually makes using them a viable option. I wonder if using a heatsink with low FPI (something like Le Grand Macho), instead of NH-D14 would make it even better at cooling while being so quiet.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Unnatural*
> 
> It's probably a stupid idea, but what about self adhesive thermal pad on vrm? Could it provide both electrical insulation, and at the same time some heat transfer by filling the gap between the cpu PCB and the heatsink/waterblock?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I was thinking of using thermal padding too. Got some Fuji poly lying around. But I think there's no reason to re-delid my cpu at this time.
> 
> The main issue is that the thickness of the padding has to be perfect. You need to make contact without hurting the spacing between die and ihs.




That is JunPus thermal tape. 0.5mm thickness. Anything more would interfere with contact to the die. Even the 0.5mm is a smidge tall, but the tape compresses and it still makes perfect contact with the die. Can't say if it helps with VRM temps or not; though I've pondered this theory before.

The tape is nicer than a pad because it also holds the lid in place without have to fiddle around with trying to reseal it. You do have to cut it to just the right size otherwise it will interfere with the lid seating properly.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is JunPus thermal tape. 0.5mm thickness. Anything more would interfere with contact to the die. Even the 0.5mm is a smidge tall, but the tape compresses and it still makes perfect contact with the die. Can't say if it helps with VRM temps or not; though I've pondered this theory before.
> 
> The tape is nicer than a pad because it also holds the lid in place without have to fiddle around with trying to reseal it. You do have to cut it to just the right size otherwise it will interfere with the lid seating properly.


Smart, I would do the same thing, this is exactly what they do with motherboards and the cooler/loop is now cooling the cpu and vrms simultaneously. It would be nice to try that high quality fuji-poly, but the lack of compressibility of those pads could be an issue if the thickness was not exact.


----------



## cnckane

One question: Can I use NT-H1 or GC extreme instead of CLU ?
My 4790k is around 80°C in BF4 with a Dark Rock 3 even only at [email protected] but I'm afraid to put a conductive material next to the FIVR or whatever that is.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cnckane*
> 
> One question: Can I use NT-H1 or GC extreme instead of CLU ?
> My 4790k is around 80°C in BF4 with a Dark Rock 3 even only at [email protected] but I'm afraid to put a conductive material next to the FIVR or whatever that is.


Sure, you can use any paste but it will be less effective. The shape of the IHS is also quite annoying for normal paste, the usual little dot will not cover the whole IHS. You'll have to somehow cover the IHS with a really, really thin layer of normal thermal paste i guess.

I would just buy CLU and some $2 clear mail polish.. But Yeah


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Placed my order for some CLU... I'll give it a go on my i5-2500k first before I get my laptop so I know its good to go...


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I use Gelid Extreme for on the die and IHS thermal paste and there is no difference noticed. That is my experience.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cnckane*
> 
> One question: Can I use NT-H1 or GC extreme instead of CLU ?
> My 4790k is around 80°C in BF4 with a Dark Rock 3 even only at [email protected] but I'm afraid to put a conductive material next to the FIVR or whatever that is.


Yes you can use a different paste, but there are 2 downsides:

1) Less effective

2) The paste will likely 'pump out' over time and temperatures will get worse.

Keep an eye on the temps and you may have to do some maintenance by reapplying your TIM. Or just get something to like nail polish or thermal pads/tape to protect the VRMs if you're that concerned with harming the CPU.


----------



## jdorje

The short answer is that you have to use lm under the ihs.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> The short answer is that you have to use lm under the ihs.


The longer answer is that you have to use CLU under the IHS as well


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Placed my order for some CLU... I'll give it a go on my i5-2500k first before I get my laptop so I know its good to go...


Uh maybe I misunderstand, but that sounds bad. You can't delid a 2500k. And I'm pretty sure every laptop cooler is aluminum/copper which you wouldn't want lm for.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> And I'm pretty sure every laptop cooler is aluminum/copper which you wouldn't want lm for.


It wouldn't do much of anything to a copper heatsink. Stain it a bit. Aluminium tho... Gallium does bad things to aluminium. The issue with using liquid metal on a laptop is that, in my experience, heatsinks in laptops aren't a very tight fit to the die. There's usually a slight gap. And liquid metal doesn't work with large gaps too well.

Seems like my chip is a bit of a dud, needs nearly 1.3V for 4.7GHz. Scaling falls off of a cliff after 4.7GHz, needs nearly 1.4V for 4.8GHz. Temps are fine tho. Doesn't spike past 70C @4.7, with very, *VERY* slow fans. A few more days of fiddling and I think I might be ready to properly join the club.


----------



## BaK2BaK

New ideas, cool!







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wirerat*
> 
> I prefer using regular tape. Here I used some anti-static scotch tape from work just because it sticks better than black electric tape.
> 
> I just cut a small piece with scissors or a blade. Then I used a tweezer to line up the tape. Fingers are kinda big to start such a small piece.
> 
> 
> 
> I have used nail Polish in the past without issue but I like the way the tape turned out. Heck, my first couple of delids I used no protection on vrms at all but I dont advise doing so since it is so easy.


Nice, anti-static tape sounds even easier than nail polish!

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is JunPus thermal tape. 0.5mm thickness. Anything more would interfere with contact to the die. Even the 0.5mm is a smidge tall, but the tape compresses and it still makes perfect contact with the die. Can't say if it helps with VRM temps or not; though I've pondered this theory before.
> 
> The tape is nicer than a pad because it also holds the lid in place without have to fiddle around with trying to reseal it. You do have to cut it to just the right size otherwise it will interfere with the lid seating properly.


Looks like the best method as it protects the VRMs from CLU while improving the cooling and keeping the IHS in place!

I just took a quick measurements of my 5675C: the dies are 0.4mm high above the PCB and the bigger VRMs 0.3mm.
Will see if I can find 0.1mm thick thermal tape to give it a try.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> It wouldn't do much of anything to a copper heatsink. Stain it a bit. Aluminium tho... Gallium does bad things to aluminium. The issue with using liquid metal on a laptop is that, in my experience, heatsinks in laptops aren't a very tight fit to the die. There's usually a slight gap. And liquid metal doesn't work with large gaps too well.
> 
> Seems like my chip is a bit of a dud, needs nearly 1.3V for 4.7GHz. Scaling falls off of a cliff after 4.7GHz, needs nearly 1.4V for 4.8GHz. Temps are fine tho. Doesn't spike past 70C @4.7, with very, *VERY* slow fans. A few more days of fiddling and I think I might be ready to properly join the club.


What CPU are you using?


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> What CPU are you using?


4790k. It's the "Roided Midgit" rig in the signature, with different fans on. At the moment it seems like it's stable-ish (10 or so hours of OCCT w/o errors) at [email protected], 40x uncore. Ideally I'd like to be under 1.3, including the overvolt, so I'm still playing around with uncore, system agent voltages etc.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> 4790k. It's the "Roided Midgit" rig in the signature, with different fans on. At the moment it seems like it's stable-ish (10 or so hours of OCCT w/o errors) at [email protected], 40x uncore. Ideally I'd like to be under 1.3, including the overvolt, so I'm still playing around with uncore, system agent voltages etc.


Seems like a pretty mediocre overclocker indeed, no luck in the silicon lottery!
My 4690K can run 4.7 Ghz at about 1.292 vcore which is also considered mediocre I guess.

The idle temp increases from about ~31 degrees celcius to ~36 degrees celcius, while the prime95 stresstest temp goes from 47 to about 55








I have to do some more testing as I only increased the vcore, multiplier (x47) and ram voltage slightly (+0.2), but 4.8 seems really hard to achieve.
I need like 1.37 for 4.8 Ghz which is a far too big cliff in terms of performance/wattage.

I am however 'shocked' about the temperatures im getting. Around 55 degrees at 4.7 Ghz is awesome, gotta love custom loops + a delid


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Seems like a pretty mediocre overclocker indeed, no luck in the silicon lottery!
> My 4690K can run 4.7 Ghz at about 1.292 vcore which is also considered mediocre I guess.
> 
> The idle temp increases from about ~31 degrees celcius to ~36 degrees celcius, while the prime95 stresstest temp goes from 47 to about 55
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have to do some more testing as I only increased the vcore, multiplier (x47) and ram voltage slightly (+0.2), but 4.8 seems really hard to achieve.
> I need like 1.37 for 4.8 Ghz which is a far too big cliff in terms of performance/wattage.
> 
> I am however 'shocked' about the temperatures im getting. Around 55 degrees at 4.7 Ghz is awesome, gotta love custom loops + a delid


Do you run manual or adaptive? At this point I'm testing adaptive, with +0.044. It gives me a VID of 1.296 and an actual Vcore of 1.312 under stress. 4.8GHz would give me 1.408V under stress. That's way more than I'm comfortable with. I guess the fact that I'm using 4x8GB sticks of RAM doesn't do my OC any favors either. That and HT being on.

EDIT: What bothers me that despite the delid and CLP on-die I still get temperature discrepancies between cores. Cores #0 and #3 max out at the same temperature, and are both 6C cooler than cores #1 and #2. I wouldn't mind if these would just be some random spikes, but the temperatures are very consistent. Makes me think there's something wrong with my NH-D14

dem temps tho, dat silence, for that alone it was worth it, nevermind the extra 300Mhz


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Do you run manual or adaptive?
> 
> EDIT: What bothers me that despite the delid and CLP on-die I still get temperature discrepancies between cores. Cores #0 and #3 max out at the same temperature, and are both 6C cooler than cores #1 and #2. I wouldn't mind if these would just be some random spikes, but the temperatures are very consistent. Makes me think there's something wrong with my NH-D14
> 
> dem temps tho, dat silence, for that alone it was worth it, nevermind the extra 300Mhz


I ran full manual for testing purposes. When I get a stable overclock (5+ hours in prime95) ill set it back to adaptive for energy/power saving during idle.

A friend of mine has a 4790K delid as well with CLU on the die and he has a freaking 12 degrees celcius difference between the hottest and coolest core.
He also saw a major temperature drop but still has the strange difference between cores.. Intel really messed up Haswell good









He's going to remove 0.1 to 0.2mm from his IHS to see if that has any improvements.
I'll let you know when I see the results









I also love the temp drops, my Noctua NF-a14 radiator fans run at like ~500 rpm which is dead silent


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> At the moment it seems like it's stable-ish (10 or so hours of OCCT w/o errors)


"Stable-ish"


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> "Stable-ish"


Well it's only OCCT








I'm not calling it stable until I'm done with it. Still trying to lower the Vcore a bit, up the uncore, overclock RAM... Maybe test it with AIDA64 and Prime95 for a bit. Still a whole lot to do.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> EDIT: What bothers me that despite the delid and CLP on-die I still get temperature discrepancies between cores. Cores #0 and #3 max out at the same temperature, and are both 6C cooler than cores #1 and #2. I wouldn't mind if these would just be some random spikes, but the temperatures are very consistent. Makes me think there's something wrong with my NH-D14


So I just spoke that friend of mine and he still has a 12C difference between cores, despite the delid + removing 0.1mm from the IHS.
He tried everything from different mounting to different paste, but nothing seems to help.

Both his 4790K and 6700K have the exact same problem.. He thinks it's CPU related aka poor silicon lottery.
He can reduce the core difference from 12C to 3C when running both Prime95 and LinX at the same time.
I believe he used Prime95 vs 27.9 but I'm not entirely sure.

Bottom line: Intel screwed up


----------



## alancsalt

I thought unequal temps were normal. i can't remember owning a processor with particularly equal temps. Are multi core CPUs even meant to have equal temps?


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I thought unequal temps were normal. i can't remember owning a processor with particularly equal temps. Are multi core CPUs even meant to have equal temps?


My 2500k cores are within 2-3C of eachother in Prime95. I find that to be very even temperatures as I'm sure there's a slight difference in power draw per core. Some CLU should really let me know if there's an actual difference in core temp as the CLU should eliminate any issues with thermal paste spread and heatsink contact...


----------



## Wirerat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> I thought unequal temps were normal. i can't remember owning a processor with particularly equal temps. Are multi core CPUs even meant to have equal temps?


The core closest to the inactive igpu runs cooler. My 4790k is - /+ 7c usually. I have delided 6 haswells and that's normal in my experience.

That 12c split mentioned above can likley be reduced a few degrees with another clp/tim application or worst case a little lapping.


----------



## NotATroll

Excuse me for the off-topic nonsense post - but that 30000th post feels oddly satisfying.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Excuse me for the off-topic nonsense post - but that 30000th post feels oddly satisfying.


Nooooooooooooooooooooooo I missed it.


----------



## Loladinas

Oh why does it have to be so frustrating... It passes hours and hours of OCCT/Prime95 at 1.312V, but when I try RealBench, of course it poops the bed within 10 minutes, because voltage only goes up to 1.280V in RealBench.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Oh why does it have to be so frustrating... It passes hours and hours of OCCT/Prime95 at 1.312V, but when I try RealBench, of course it poops the bed within 10 minutes, because *voltage only goes up to 1.280V in RealBench*.


Not understanding what you're talking about... Could you splain in more detail?

Are you OC'ing with BIOS or a software program that runs in windows?

Please enlighten us...


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> Not understanding what you're talking about... Could you splain in more detail?
> 
> Are you OC'ing with BIOS or a software program that runs in windows?
> 
> Please enlighten us...


BIOS, adaptive voltage. "Synthetic' tests overvolt a bit beyond whatever you set in BIOS, RealBench does as well, but not by as much.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> BIOS, adaptive voltage. "Synthetic' tests overvolt a bit beyond whatever you set in BIOS, RealBench does as well, but not by as much.


Why are you overclocking with adaptive voltage? You should really put it on manual when benchmarking and when its 100% stable put it back to adaptive. Of course when its back to adaptive you shouldnt run any more benchmarks or it will 'overvolt'. But stresstesting and overclocking with adaptive is a big no.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Why are you overclocking with adaptive voltage?


Because that's how I'll be using it. With manual all you're doing is testing for stability at the high end, not through the entire range. Of course there's always the possibility that I'm wrong.


----------



## jdorje

Why will you be using it on adaptive? There's zero reason for that.

And why are we so off topic? Go post in the haswell thread (or wherever) and they'll guide you.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Because that's how I'll be using it. With manual all you're doing is testing for stability at the high end, not through the entire range. Of course *there's always the possibility that I'm wrong*.


Well, the whole thing is, that if you set static voltage manually, you would be able to run RealBench...









I use Realbench, benchmark and the stress test, among many other tests for different reasons...

Go ahead and set your vCore higher in BIOS...


----------



## cephelix

12C difference between cores is quite a large amount. I think I read that the max should be about 5-7C difference. Any more than that indicates improper tim application.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Nooooooooooooooooooooooo I missed it.


You are a legend in my book Valguar. You couldn't have seen this success back when you were pushing the indigo extreme pads as the preferred tim







VonDutch would be proud!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> You are a legend in my book Valguar. You couldn't have seen this success back when you were pushing the indigo extreme pads as the preferred tim
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VonDutch would be proud!


Yeah no kidding, I never thought this crazy delidding process would become what it has. Every now and then I wonder where VonDutch disappear.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> You are a legend in my book Valguar. You couldn't have seen this success back when you were pushing the indigo extreme pads as the preferred tim
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VonDutch would be proud!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah no kidding, I never thought this crazy delidding process would become what it has. Every now and then I wonder where VonDutch disappear.
Click to expand...

(Valgaur) I get stuck watching your avatar cycle for fifteen seconds in the least each time I'm in this thread. I love it.

A side note about my story. CLU arrived Tuesday, coated the die and block IHS thinly Wednesday. Temperatures under load dropped tweleve degreas Celsius. The i5 4690k now runs 4.7 - 4.8 ghz at under eighty degrees Celsius during Linpack stress. 207gflops average.

(I am still trying to get my motherboard settings under control, right now it does whatever it wants. When I manually set the multiplier at x47, it would not go over 4600mhz. Then I renabled turbo and set every multiplier I could to x47, and that with an auto base clock of 100 the speed shot up to plus 4.8ghz. Then I disabled turbo after reverting their numbers to x46, set my cpu multiplier on x46, thermal throttling off, and still the processor reads that it runs x8-x47 and can jump to 4811mhz "safely/tested".)

The EKWB naked Ivy mounting hardware shows up for me soon, probably today or tomorrow.

I will throw a question out, how many degrees can I expect the naked kit to help me with?

Plus please if you have any questions or opinion with how to get my motherboard and BIOS settings under control allowing me to know for sure what speed and stability I am running at, fire away.


----------



## stin0

I had some serious trouble with my naked ivy EKWB kit.. I did everything exactly as stated in the manual, but my temps in IDLE were rising from 30C to 50C








Pay attention to where the 2 washers should be installed, as one of the three motherboard socket bolts is bigger than the other two.

I am unsure what I did wrong as I mounted it correctly.. But it must've been making poor contact somehow.
Curious to your results, please let me know man @g0tsl33p14


----------



## NotATroll

Uh, guys. I have a question. When lapping the IHS with a maximum of 1K grit wet/dry sandpaper - it doesn't shine at all. It's a dull copper colour. If I happen to polish the IHS perse with a dremel polishing bit, would this make any difference? I'm sure the polishing would clear out the minute scratching from the mediocre grit sandpaper used.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Uh, guys. I have a question. When lapping the IHS with a maximum of 1K grit wet/dry sandpaper - it doesn't shine at all. It's a dull copper colour. If I happen to polish the IHS perse with a dremel polishing bit, would this make any difference? I'm sure the polishing would clear out the minute scratching from the mediocre grit sandpaper used.


I used 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1500, 2000 grit on the normal heatspreader to make it shine.
So you might need to use something >1000 grit. I noticed that the 1500 & 2000 grit made the difference from dull copper to an extremely shiny & mirror finish.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I used 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1500, 2000 grit on the normal heatspreader to make it shine.
> So you might need to use something >1000 grit. I noticed that the 1500 & 2000 grit made the difference from dull copper to an extremely shiny & mirror finish.


Thanks, the hardware store down the road only had 400 600 800 and 1K. Which is all I used. i'll go do some gallivanting this weekend - hopefully I can find some 1500 and 2K grit!









Edit: I'll post temp comparisons and whether it actually made a difference to lap with a grit higher than 1K.


----------



## Jidonsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Thanks, the hardware store down the road only had 400 600 800 and 1K. Which is all I used. i'll go do some gallivanting this weekend - hopefully I can find some 1500 and 2K grit!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I'll post temp comparisons and whether it actually made a difference to lap with a grit higher than 1K.


Higher grit can usually be found in automotive parts stores.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Thanks, the hardware store down the road only had 400 600 800 and 1K. Which is all I used. i'll go do some gallivanting this weekend - hopefully I can find some 1500 and 2K grit!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I'll post temp comparisons and whether it actually made a difference to lap with a grit higher than 1K.


Every hardware and paint store here sells up to 1k grit..
I had to order mine from a webstore that only sells watercooling parts.

But like Jidonsu said: most automotive shops/stores/garages use really fine grits to make cars/wheels shine like a diamond.
You'll have the best chance to find some there


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I had some serious trouble with my naked ivy EKWB kit.. I did everything exactly as stated in the manual, but my temps in IDLE were rising from 30C to 50C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pay attention to where the 2 washers should be installed, as one of the three motherboard socket bolts is bigger than the other two.
> 
> I am unsure what I did wrong as I mounted it correctly.. But it must've been making poor contact somehow.
> Curious to your results, please let me know man @g0tsl33p14


Thank you and "can do." Plus thank you for the nail polish technique. I used this to cover the vrms on the pcb as well. It might get me a job too and think big or go home, maybe a date with an attractive pharmacy clerk. Time will tell. Thanks again.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Uh, guys. I have a question. When lapping the IHS with a maximum of 1K grit wet/dry sandpaper - it doesn't shine at all. It's a dull copper colour. If I happen to polish the IHS perse with a dremel polishing bit, would this make any difference? I'm sure the polishing would clear out the minute scratching from the mediocre grit sandpaper used.


My opinion is remember the goal is to reduce temperature, and this could have nothing to do with removing material from your IHS. I read that you get the idea is even contact between the IHS and the block, but you can also play the game of how much temperature the IHS material holds in and on itself.

(to a kids song rhythm) "The electrified heat coming from the die goes to the thermal paste _direct contact_, the heated thermal paste temps pass to the IHS... the IHS heats up and gives the temperature to the block, and can it get.. any.. better.. than.. this." If only thermal fill didn't need to be a thing.

Heat moves hot to cold, always, in my world.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Thanks, the hardware store down the road only had 400 600 800 and 1K. Which is all I used. i'll go do some gallivanting this weekend - hopefully I can find some 1500 and 2K grit!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I'll post temp comparisons and whether it actually made a difference to lap with a grit higher than 1K.


2k grit is the key and circular passes are what really helps the shine, st least for me it did.


----------



## outlaw8505

Can try your local auto parts store too. They usually sell the higher grit. It's nice too they have the sandpaper for wet sanding. I got some nice shine using it.


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 2k grit is the key and circular passes are what really helps the shine, at least for me it did.


I went to 3000 on my IHS...

I could shave in it, if only it were a little bit larger!


----------



## s74r1

I don't see the point in going much over 1K grit, your TIM application and Heatsink/waterblock mounting will play a MUCH larger part in temps


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> I went to 3000 on my IHS...
> 
> I could shave in it, if only it were a little bit larger!


Small square patch at a time.


----------



## Pyr0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 2k grit is the key and circular passes are what really helps the shine, st least for me it did.


many (many lol) moons ago I lapped a CPU down to shiny copper using just plain 80gsm paper, a mirror and some brasso metal polish


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *s74r1*
> 
> I don't see the point in going much over 1K grit, your TIM application and Heatsink/waterblock mounting will play a MUCH larger part in temps


I was bored? To each, his own...


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pyr0*
> 
> many (many lol) moons ago I lapped a CPU down to shiny copper using just plain 80gsm paper, a mirror and some brasso metal polish


----------



## usoldier

Ive delided my 3770k and all seams right after mounting i get tops 71cº but after 2 to 3 weeks temps starts rising like mad up to 100cº ive remounted my heatsink like a million times now


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *usoldier*
> 
> Ive delided my 3770k and all seams right after mounting i get tops 71cº but after 2 to 3 weeks temps starts rising like mad up to 100cº ive remounted my heatsink like a million times now


Interesting, could you possibly show us what the spread looks like after reapplying the TIM/LM? Did you lap your IHS or not?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Wow that sucks.

Acquire better thermal paste and fix your mount procedure with perhaps a different mount.


----------



## Imprezzion

I had the same happening to my CPU when I used regular paste between the IHS and die. (Prolimatech PK-1).
Temps would start out fine but would rise quickly after a few days.

Spread looked fine but it gave the same results every single time.

Using a liquid metal paste(CLU in my case) fixed everything.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> I had the same happening to my CPU when I used regular paste between the IHS and die. (Prolimatech PK-1).
> Temps would start out fine but would rise quickly after a few days.
> 
> Spread looked fine but it gave the same results every single time.
> 
> Using a liquid metal paste(CLU in my case) fixed everything.


Y'know what's strange about that? Intel used regular paste between the IHS and chip.


----------



## Imprezzion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Y'know what's strange about that? Intel used regular paste between the IHS and chip.


True, but i read in some topic that that's differently optimized paste and that regular paste doesn't work well so close to the die.

I have no clue WHY it doesn't work, but i've seen this issue multiple times and had it myself as well..

I was out of CLU and had to run the CPU like, 2 weeks with normal paste. Had to re do it every 3-4 days..

With CLU i didn't pull it off for over a year and temps stayed the same all that time, then remounted it becauseI had to clean the waterblock, and temps have been the same again for months..


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> True, but i read in some topic that that's differently optimized paste and that regular paste doesn't work well so close to the die.
> 
> I have no clue WHY it doesn't work, but i've seen this issue multiple times and had it myself as well..
> 
> I was out of CLU and had to run the CPU like, 2 weeks with normal paste. Had to re do it every 3-4 days..
> 
> With CLU i didn't pull it off for over a year and temps stayed the same all that time, then remounted it becauseI had to clean the waterblock, and temps have been the same again for months..


Luckily I haven't had the need to replace the TIM on my chip just yet.


----------



## benjamen50

How much CLU needs to be put on the CPU die?


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> How much CLU needs to be put on the CPU die?


Almost nothing, like the smallest amount possible. I'd say about 20% of what you normally put on a cpu heatspreader, no, make that 10%.
With the brush and some patience you can smear it out a lot and cover the whole IHS. This layer has to be as thin as possible.


----------



## Imprezzion

Indeed. As little as is necessary to coat the entire surface of whatever your trying to cool.

I noticed, especially with die to IHS connections, it can pay off to coat both surfaces in the thinnest layer possible if the surface isn't making perfect contact due to like, a concave shape or whatever..


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Imprezzion*
> 
> Indeed. As little as is necessary to coat the entire surface of whatever your trying to cool.
> 
> I noticed, especially with die to IHS connections, it can pay off to coat both surfaces in the thinnest layer possible if the surface isn't making perfect contact due to like, a concave shape or whatever..


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Almost nothing, like the smallest amount possible. I'd say about 20% of what you normally put on a cpu heatspreader, no, make that 10%.
> With the brush and some patience you can smear it out a lot and cover the whole IHS. This layer has to be as thin as possible.


Thanks for the info. One more question.

How should I go about removing the left over glue after delid on CPU? I'm going to use delid die mate to delid cpu. Also I'm doing this on a 4790K. What tape do I use to cover the capacitors? Masking tape? Scotch tape? Note that I will stick this to pcb but only slightly sticking or floating above capacitors.


----------



## EMINENT1

I have my 50" 4k tv about 4.5 " from the wall and my air cooled mini itx case 1 inch from the wall from the side with the intake fan between the tv and wall. This is the only place I have for it because I don't want to run wires to the floor.

With ambient temps at 25c, I have temps at idle of 45-50c on a 4.6 overclock on balanced power profile. It'll reach 60-70 at load if i'm transcoding a video with Plex. Probably higher if I get a dedicated gpu later like a 980ti. I'm assuming this is normal being in such a cramped space next to a hot tv back. My question is, will delidding help reduce temps at idle and load? Or, would you just leave it as is and it'll be fine at those temps?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

In my experience the thermal paste used on a Haswell die does effect the idle and load temperatures. The only way to change TIM of a die is to delid.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> How should I go about removing the left over glue after delid on CPU? I'm going to use delid die mate to delid cpu. Also I'm doing this on a 4790K. What tape do I use to cover the capacitors? Masking tape? Scotch tape? Note that I will stick this to pcb but only slightly sticking or floating above capacitors.


I used a credit card, my fingernails, and a plastic safety razor blade insert to scrape left behind glue free. The stain from original manufacturing glue remains however the lid and pcb sit flush.

Stin0 recommends clear nail polish bought in the pharmacy for sealing up the vrm (I assume you are talking about capacitors in the same way). I used this technique per his advice and have not been disappointed. Roboyto recommends .4mm thermal tape and I bought some too however was quick to try nail polish and I might remove that with nail polish remover in the future, I don't know yet.


----------



## benjamen50

Edit: NVM just realised that the tape definitely has to be taken off after.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EMINENT1*
> 
> I have my 50" 4k tv about 4.5 " from the wall and my air cooled mini itx case 1 inch from the wall from the side with the intake fan between the tv and wall. This is the only place I have for it because I don't want to run wires to the floor.
> 
> With ambient temps at 25c, I have temps at idle of 45-50c on a 4.6 overclock on balanced power profile. It'll reach 60-70 at load if i'm transcoding a video with Plex. Probably higher if I get a dedicated gpu later like a 980ti. I'm assuming this is normal being in such a cramped space next to a hot tv back. My question is, will delidding help reduce temps at idle and load? Or, would you just leave it as is and it'll be fine at those temps?


Delliding will likely reduce temps at load and at idle. However, only hitting 70C in an HTPC while breathing warm air at full load makes me question if temps are really an issue. Are you planning on increasing the overclock? Are you trying to reduce the fan noise?

I mean, yes, do it if you can justify the risk vs. reward.


----------



## EMINENT1

First, thanks for responding.

I don't plan on overclocking more. Temps are actually down to 40-50 idle now as I was able to pull out the tv a bit more and I tweaked the fan a little higher while still being tolerable. Maybe adding a gpu later when Pascal comes out was the concern. Maybe delid then.

So temps are fine as they are?


----------



## Curleyyy

Just a quick question: Thinking about delidding a 3770k this weekend using the vice grip method. I'm wondering if Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is still the king of thermal solutions to use? I've currently got a bit of AS5 left over though I'd like to purchase some more as it's quite old.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Curleyyy*
> 
> Just a quick question: Thinking about delidding a 3770k this weekend using the vice grip method. I'm wondering if Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra is still the king of thermal solutions to use? I've currently got a bit of AS5 left over though I'd like to purchase some more as it's quite old.


I would personally not use AS5 anymore. It used to be the 'go to' thermal paste, but with its 50-200 hours cure time and performance it is no longer the king of thermal pastes.
Between your air/waterblock and the outer heatspreader I would use something like MX-4 or Gelid Extreme.

On the IHS I would indeed use Cool Lab. Ultra as it is still the best liquid metal thermal paste.
An alternative is Grizzly Conductonaut but its harder to get and more expensive. CLU is still king


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> I had some serious trouble with my naked ivy EKWB kit.. I did everything exactly as stated in the manual, but my temps in IDLE were rising from 30C to 50C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pay attention to where the 2 washers should be installed, as one of the three motherboard socket bolts is bigger than the other two.
> 
> I am unsure what I did wrong as I mounted it correctly.. But it must've been making poor contact somehow.
> Curious to your results, please let me know man @g0tsl33p14


It seems the EKWB kit netted nearly six degrees from my stress run using Linpack and gained an average of four Gflops there. Low seventies Celsius temperature wise.

During idle it likes to dance between twenty-five and twenty-eight degrees Celsius.

I looked at what you said and took it as a sign that I should go without washers, so that is what I did. No washers, and I marked a line on each thumb screw for my block so I could tell how many turns each one received easiest.

This die likes to heat up core one and two six degrees more than core zero and three during stress, however at idle they are all close to even.

i5 4960k 4.7ghz vcore 4.6ghz uncore

I had one crash earlier today before going naked though, during Counter-Strike:GO of all things. I have yet to test if it was my videocards overclocked and overheating, the northbridge gets very warm, and boosts temps on my top card again nearly six degrees above its partner.


----------



## Benjiw

Oh dear...


----------



## Loladinas

Stabbing a CPU with a woodworking knife. That TIM application, both on die and on IHS. Using stock cooler. Is this supposed to be some sort of an early april fools video?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Stabbing a CPU with a woodworking knife. That TIM application, both on die and on IHS. Using stock cooler. Is this supposed to be some sort of an early april fools video?


Nope, just another Tech-tuber with no clue what he's talking about. Unfortunately he has a lot of followers who now have very poor information.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Nope, just another Tech-tuber with no clue what he's talking about. Unfortunately he has a lot of followers who now have very poor information.


The difference in temperatures are obviously going to net better improvements the better the cooling. What he seemed to lack was the understanding that while the stock cooler only netted him a few degree difference, using a decent aftermarket cooler on both pre and post delid could net 10+ degree improvements after the delid.

Sigh, and that fail TIM replacement on the chip. *facepalm*


----------



## jdorje

Holy hell that's a terrible video.

And yet even with horrific tim application that I kinda assumed would not contact every core and would immediately melt his chip, he still got a 3-5c improvement in temps. And on the stock cooler with what must be an 80w cpu...

In other news I have my 4690k at 4.7 ghz down to 1.335V vid now. By raising the uncore to 44x/1.26V and finagling the input voltage a bit, I was able to drop vid by .025V. Normal usage maxes out around 60C and stresses around 70 with my h80i. Pre delid I always considered 4.7 outside my thermal limit but now I'm wondering about 4.8. Cinebench score 724.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Hard to tell though if liquid tape peels back when heated for a long time at 60-70° or if a peak at higher temp makes that...


More info about the Liquid Tape.

I was about to buy this product at swiss-composite.ch, the only place I've found in Switzerland where it is possible to buy Liquid tape.
Then @0ldChicken reported:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> I and at least one other here had issues with the liquid electrical tape. Mine kept shrinking and peeling back, exposing the regulator's after just a short while.


So I've contacted swiss-composite about it and they kindly made the following experiment:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *swiss-composite.ch*
> I took the time to make a small test. We had a small metall part, covered in the liquid tape in a oven for 6h at 100°C. It is still in perfect condition, no cracking, no peeling back or anything. Admittedly that is not a long time test with several cycles, but still.


I am very thankful to them for having conducted such a test, which shows that even with 10°C above its max temp, the liquid tape is not altered.

Hard to tell what happened to 0ldchicken, swiss-composite suggests that the problem of peeling back may come from the surface not being clean. There could indeed have been some residue of the Intel thermal paste near the VRMs.
That would explain why only a few people had reported this issue with liquid electrical tape, which must still be good to use for our purpose.

Hope that helps!


----------



## NotATroll

Interesting. Thank you for letting us in on your findings.

6 hours at 100 still seems a little short for a thermal benchmark of the tape. For all we know the tape from the other user started peeling after a week or two of constantly heating and cooling - something the test from the supplier did not include.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Holy hell that's a terrible video.
> 
> And yet even with horrific tim application that I kinda assumed would not contact every core and would immediately melt his chip, he still got a 3-5c improvement in temps. And on the stock cooler with what must be an 80w cpu...
> 
> In other news I have my 4690k at 4.7 ghz down to 1.335V vid now. By raising the uncore to 44x/1.26V and finagling the input voltage a bit, I was able to drop vid by .025V. Normal usage maxes out around 60C and stresses around 70 with my h80i. Pre delid I always considered 4.7 outside my thermal limit but now I'm wondering about 4.8. Cinebench score 724.


I could only pull 694 with similar settings. I am going to move to the Intel Devils Canyon thread.


----------



## Ximplicite

what thermal paste did linus use on video?


----------



## JourneymanMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> what thermal paste did linus use on video?


Who cares? It was just Linus, coming to a quick conclusion, as he has so many times...


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> what thermal paste did linus use on video?
> 
> 
> 
> Who cares? It was just Linus, coming to a quick conclusion, as he has so many times...
Click to expand...

Yep, he had a pre conceived notion of what the outcome would be, and did everything he could to prove himself right.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> what thermal paste did linus use on video?


Dunno, he squeezes the syringe like he's about to stab the CPU like a thug.


----------



## Ximplicite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JourneymanMike*
> 
> Who cares? It was just Linus, coming to a quick conclusion, as he has so many times...


just curious


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Oh dear...


I just skipped through this. Ahahahaha. This has to be a joke?

Didn't use a clean work place, used stock cooler not AIO setup, didn't scrape adhesive lowering IHS to die gap, didn't use liquid metal TIM on die, didn't lap IHS, and that is only the 30 seconds I watched...

Is there any YouTube-r who is technically competent with a decent following?


----------



## Valgaur

wow guys, don't hit on Linus on this. Delidding is something that shouldn't be endorsed I don't blame him. I'm considering contacting him to go over this in more detail if he would like to, showing the gains that can be had.

So take it easy.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> I just skipped through this. Ahahahaha. This has to be a joke?
> 
> Didn't use a clean work place, used stock cooler not AIO setup, didn't scrape adhesive lowering IHS to die gap, didn't use liquid metal TIM on die, didn't lap IHS, and that is only the 30 seconds I watched...
> 
> Is there any YouTube-r who is technically competent with a decent following?


I used to like him... Now I think he is an idiot


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> take it easy.


don't be so easy on the guy...he clearly had it in his mind before he even started that it would not be worth it, and he damn sure didn't want to do any thing that might prove his agenda wrong. Did he even bother reading anything about the topic first? I mean _*ANYTHING*_ at all? No! He just went in reckless, uninformed, and biased.

Linus does some cool stuff on occasion, but this one is straight garbage.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

A note about the Linus Tech video about delidding. I gave this thread link out in the Vessel Video comments when they released their video there, along with my opinion that they should support delidding safely and also commented that the thermal paste application was plain lazy.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> don't be so easy on the guy...he clearly had it in his mind before he even started that it would not be worth it, and he damn sure didn't want to do any thing that might prove his agenda wrong. Did he even bother reading anything about the topic first? I mean _*ANYTHING*_ at all? No! He just went in reckless, uninformed, and biased.
> 
> Linus does some cool stuff on occasion, but this one is straight garbage.


*Slow clap*
Ah, perfection in a sentence, pure brilliance.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Oh dear...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just skipped through this. Ahahahaha. This has to be a joke?
> 
> Didn't use a clean work place, used stock cooler not AIO setup, *didn't scrape adhesive lowering IHS to die gap*, didn't use liquid metal TIM on die, didn't lap IHS, and that is only the 30 seconds I watched...
> 
> Is there any YouTube-r who is technically competent with a decent following?
Click to expand...

Actually...

And the stock cooler he correctly pointed out why he used it.









~Ceadder


----------



## chronicfx

My opinion: If you didn't read page 1 of the overclock.net delidding thread then you did not de-lid! He did something else... How many guys walked in here and said.. "I am going to use Arctic Silver 5 on the die.... " What did we say to them?









My confidence in "Linus tech" dips


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I gotta say something to the haters ragging on Linus here. While I agree he failed at delidding the i7 6700k, he is not stupid, certainly not as dumb as what he is seemingly made out to be.

I am watching the recap of his WAN show posted every week, and he is throwing out a new idea, for free. He is using a syringe from the pharmacy to apply nail polish.

Had I had this technique when delidding, my Haswell VRM(s) would be much more professionally and properly covered. As of now they are okay, however no where near as accurately protected as what I think I could have done using a more precision drip. g0tsl33p14 fail in my honest opinion.

Now I might have to get some nail polish remover, hope I do not hurt anything removing the nail polish, and re set my protective coating for the vrm(s).

Job well done Linus.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Job well done Linus.


Uh....no...

I wouldn't call him stupid, clearly he is a pretty smart guy, he just failed hard with this video because of his preconceived notion and ignorance of the process. Ignorance ≠ stupid. Ignorance is not having enough information to make a wise decision. Stupid is having the information presented to you and still making a bad choice.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Uh....no...
> 
> I wouldn't call him stupid, clearly he is a pretty smart guy, he just failed hard with this video because of his preconceived notion and ignorance of the process. Ignorance ≠ stupid. Ignorance is not having enough information to make a wise decision. Stupid is having the information presented to you and still making a bad choice.


The way he delids it and applies the thermal paste etc = Ignorant.
Uploading it on YouTube to your giantic kiddy audiance = plain stupid.

So yeah, I would actually call him stupid, as I'm sure some people are going to use the Linus method and destroy some nice i7's.


----------



## Ceadderman

Or they will agree with him and save those nice i7s' from delid Fail.









~Ceadder


----------



## Duke976

Finally gave in and delidded my spare rig with 3570k. Since i did not have any CLU, i opted and used AS5 ( just kidding ), i used my spare Gelid Extreme for the die and the heatsink. Temp dropped as much as 18c and was able to dropped my voltage to as low as 1.225v coming from 1.245v @4.5ghz. But since i am having Event 19, i decided to up the voltage to 1.235v for that event 19 to disappear.

The voltage dropped netted me with a decent 13c dropped. http://valid.x86.fr/gauqmi


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Duke976*
> 
> Finally gave in and delidded my spare rig with 3570k. Since i did not have any CLU, i opted and used AS5 ( just kidding ), i used my spare Gelid Extreme for the die and the heatsink. Temp dropped as much as 18c and was able to dropped my voltage to as low as 1.25v coming from 1.45v @4.5ghz. But since i am having Event 19, i decided to up the voltage to 1.35v for that event 19 to disappear.
> 
> The voltage dropped netted me with a decent 13c dropped. http://valid.x86.fr/gauqmi


Now I feel like using my nt-h1 instead of CLU.


----------



## Asus11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> The way he delids it and applies the thermal paste etc = Ignorant.
> Uploading it on YouTube to your giantic kiddy audiance = plain stupid.
> 
> So yeah, I would actually call him stupid, as I'm sure some people are going to use the Linus method and destroy some nice i7's.


Correct

what ive found out about Linus tech tips recently

they make videos just to make videos they have no real purpose or educational value or anything like that anymore, I was just watching luke did a video on different ways to apply thermal paste and it was the biggest waste of time

1. do not use a stock intel cooler they are not very good to gauge temp and there actual contact to the CPU is questionable
2. you can easily see the PCB bending in the video, very dangerous stupid method
3. actually use liquid metal in the review & its pretty much useless not using it
4. I wonder how much Intel paid linus to do this video


----------



## Punjab

Regardless of what anyone thinks of Linus, that video contained zero useful information. I guess you have to keep producing something if you want those Google checks to continue coming in.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I gotta say something to the haters ragging on Linus here. While I agree he failed at delidding the i7 6700k, he is not stupid, certainly not as dumb as what he is seemingly made out to be.
> 
> I am watching the recap of his WAN show posted every week, and he is throwing out a new idea, for free. He is using a syringe from the pharmacy to apply nail polish.
> 
> Had I had this technique when delidding, my Haswell VRM(s) would be much more professionally and properly covered. As of now they are okay, however no where near as accurately protected as what I think I could have done using a more precision drip. g0tsl33p14 fail in my honest opinion.
> 
> Now I might have to get some nail polish remover, hope I do not hurt anything removing the nail polish, and re set my protective coating for the vrm(s).
> 
> Job well done Linus.


That is not a new idea... We do that as analytical chemists all the time. It is how we draw and weigh the samples for years and years. and a 5mL would not be a good choice, a 1mL would be better.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I gotta say something to the haters ragging on Linus here. While I agree he failed at delidding the i7 6700k, he is not stupid, certainly not as dumb as what he is seemingly made out to be.
> 
> I am watching the recap of his WAN show posted every week, and he is throwing out a new idea, for free. He is using a syringe from the pharmacy to apply nail polish.
> 
> Had I had this technique when delidding, my Haswell VRM(s) would be much more professionally and properly covered. As of now they are okay, however no where near as accurately protected as what I think I could have done using a more precision drip. g0tsl33p14 fail in my honest opinion.
> 
> Now I might have to get some nail polish remover, hope I do not hurt anything removing the nail polish, and re set my protective coating for the vrm(s).
> 
> Job well done Linus.
> 
> 
> 
> That is not a new idea... We do that as analytical chemists all the time. It is how we draw and weigh the samples for years and years. and a 5mL would not be a good choice, a 1mL would be better.
Click to expand...

Oh, so you are effectively calling me stupid then because I think he had a good idea and it was new for me to see. Well you are a dick. That idea was good, and to all the haters, especially those who display seals of the states yet can put together proper sentence structure, this is a delidding thread, not a beat the crap out of some internet celebrity thread. These past three pages were quite worthless in my opinion and Valguar needs his thread returned in proper order.

Forgive me Valguar for initiating another page to this thread that will more than likely blow up into a hate fight because some immature people refuse to take consideration that they are not the kings of the world.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Oh, so you are effectively calling me stupid then because I think he had a good idea and it was new for me to see. Well you are a dick. That idea was good, and to all the haters, especially those who display seals of the states yet can put together proper sentence structure, this is a delidding thread, not a beat the crap out of some internet celebrity thread. These past three pages were quite worthless in my opinion and Valguar needs his thread returned in proper order.
> 
> Forgive me Valguar for initiating another page to this thread that will more than likely blow up into a hate fight because some immature people refuse to take consideration that they are not the kings of the world.


"and he is throwing out a new idea, for free." That is what you said right?

Think what you like. It is absolutely true that foreigners in many cases write/speak better English than us born Americans. I am a chemist so I CAN DO THIS AND NOONE WILL CARE BECAUSE IT IS NOT REALLY MY FUNCTION TO HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT COMMAS AND COLONS AND SPELLING AND GRAMMAR BECAUSE I AM A CHEMIST AND I DO A GREAT JOB AT IT WHAT GOES HERE AGAIN OH YEAH A PERIOD.


----------



## Valgaur

I will admit, kinda nuts in here lately, but those last few posts were pretty funny.

Lets all be humans and put down the torches and pitchforks.


----------



## chronicfx

I will say that Linus is "entertaining" and energetic", it is fun to watch his videos. But to make a comparison here.. I could post a video review on the titan x gpu running it off a 1.0 pcie x1 riser and a core2duo processor and compare it to the performance of a GTX580 and say "there you have it, there is no need to upgrade"

That is what happened.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I will say that Linus is "entertaining" and energetic", it is fun to watch his videos. But to make a comparison here.. I could post a video review on the titan x gpu running it off a 1.0 pcie x1 riser and a core2duo processor and compare it to the performance of a GTX580 and say "there you have it, there is no need to upgrade"
> 
> That is what happened.


Hahaha, see, you should have said this first, and only. This is funny.


----------



## benjamen50

This image really explains a lot about how much TIM or CLU / CLP you should put on the CPU die for 3rd gen and 4th gen.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> This image really explains a lot about how much TIM or CLU / CLP you should put on the CPU die for 3rd gen and 4th gen.


But that's just a picture.. Nothing validates it. Putting a little bit more than the extremely thin layer you see in the image isn't wrong. Having too little however (which is most likely the cause of a person *trying* to have a super thin layer like in picture) won't be good for the CPU.

I'd take the above image with a pinch of salt. It is nice though to explain the concept though.


----------



## benjamen50

I guess we need an x-ray to see the gap between the IHS and the CPU die. I thought there was a significantly larger gap between ihs and die.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> I guess we need an x-ray to see the gap between the IHS and the CPU die. I thought there was a significantly larger gap between ihs and die.


The gap is far smaller than you think. Something we can actually only see by microscope. This still does not mean aim for as little TIM/LM to the point where you're actually not filling those minuscule gaps.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> This image really explains a lot about how much TIM or CLU / CLP you should put on the CPU die for 3rd gen and 4th gen.


http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183&postcount=570

The glue for the IHS in this particular scenario was .09mm thick. This thickness obviously varies because people have better/worse performing chips out of the box; it's good for the science behind this though.

Once the glue is gone, the IHS rests on the die; this is where the initial cooling improvement comes from. With the IHS resting on the die, the retainer is applying some force to the die where it wasn't previously. This is likely the cause of pump out with traditional TIMs...that's my theory at least.

For a proper CLU/CLP application you need just enough to cover up the mirror finish of the die. Once you have a "rough/textured" looking layer of CLU/CLP you should be good.


----------



## benjamen50

@Roboyto Thanks for the tip, will keep this in mind after I delid my CPU.


----------



## Benjiw

Just ran a test at stock clocks and 1.2v with IBT AVX and my temps where horrible. Maybe I used to little CLU or something, my CPU is bare die to waterblock.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Just ran a test at stock clocks and 1.2v with IBT AVX and my temps where horrible. Maybe I used to little CLU or something, my CPU is bare die to waterblock.


That is a bummer. Maybe your mount was fouled when you were telling us to go naked or go home. I went naked, netted six degrees from LinX6.5

CLU is so easy to work I recommend doing a repaste. Using it all up could be an issue though, you get what you pay for.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> That is a bummer. Maybe your mount was fouled when you were telling us to go naked or go home. I went naked, netted six degrees from LinX6.5
> 
> CLU is so easy to work I recommend doing a repaste. Using it all up could be an issue though, you get what you pay for.


Looking back at my application of CLU it seems like I used too little in comparison to others on here, mine is uber smooth and has no bumps etc and the few others I have seen have more CLU applied so I think you're right with your recommendation. There shouldn't be any additional degrees when removing the IHS from the equation as there is less to absorb the heat etc.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Just ran a test at stock clocks and 1.2v with IBT AVX and my temps where horrible. Maybe I used to little CLU or something, my CPU is bare die to waterblock.


Not sure about the EK you have but some waterblocks have a convex curvature to them, such as the raystorm, meant to flatten out when you screw them down. You could be having a contact area issue, this may be an instance where you are better off with the IHS on.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Not sure about the EK you have but some waterblocks have a convex curvature to them, such as the raystorm, meant to flatten out when you screw them down. You could be having a contact area issue, this may be an instance where you are better off with the IHS on.


I'll try adding more CLU as my application looked like this. Like I said above, others have a much more lumpy texture to theirs. If it is the waterblock then I have a full copper block I can lap but I really don't want to do that.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Just ran a test at stock clocks and 1.2v with IBT AVX and my temps where horrible. Maybe I used to little CLU or something, my CPU is bare die to waterblock.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Double check your mount with some normal paste so see if it spreads.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Looking back at my application of CLU it seems like I used too little in comparison to others on here, mine is uber smooth and has no bumps etc and the few others I have seen have more CLU applied so I think you're right with your recommendation. There shouldn't be any additional degrees when removing the IHS from the equation as there is less to absorb the heat etc.


Your application looks like it would be OK honestly. Once you've covered the reflection of the die you should be good to go.



Spoiler: My CLU Application















Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Not sure about the EK you have but some waterblocks have a convex curvature to them, such as the raystorm, meant to flatten out when you screw them down. You could be having a contact area issue, this may be an instance where you are better off with the IHS on.


I was going to mention this, but @chronicfx beat me to it. In some cases people will lap the IHS and then block to ensure they're both perfectly flat.

On the topic of the Raystorm I am using one naked mounted with some Kryonaut; it has not been lapped.

i7 4770k @ 4.5GHz with 1.259 Adaptive Vcore (max 1.298), ~1.860 VRIN, and 1.65V 2400 RAM.

Dual EX240 Rads w/ MCP 655. Front rad has 4 Corsair SP120 HPs push/pull. Top radiator with Yate Loon Thin (20mm) Mediums; 1 fan inop currently. Fans set to Silent in Thermal Radar software.

10 Passes IBT High Load

69 - 74 - 76 - 74



Spoiler: IBT















Temps are fair for Linpack I think?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Double check your mount with some normal paste so see if it spreads.
> 
> Your application looks like it would be OK honestly. Once you've covered the reflection of the die you should be good to go.


Yours looks more bumpy than mine, I got mine super shiny and flat, I still have the IHS but I really don't want to use it. Could my block orientation make a massive difference?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Yours looks more bumpy than mine, I got mine super shiny and flat, I still have the IHS but I really don't want to use it. Could my block orientation make a massive difference?


All you can do is start eliminating possibilities.

Make sure it's good contact.

Reapply CLU if you think there's not enough.

If you have flow through the block wrong your temperatures can suffer. I made this mistake once with my Swiftech Apogee block.

If the instructions say mount a certain way, there's probably a reason for it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> All you can do is start eliminating possibilities.
> 
> Make sure it's good contact.
> 
> Reapply CLU if you think there's not enough.
> 
> If you have flow through the block wrong your temperatures can suffer. I made this mistake once with my Swiftech Apogee block.
> 
> If the instructions say mount a certain way, there's probably a reason for it.


Flow is correct through the block so atleast we can rule that out. I'll try a touch more clu, not much just a touch and I'll try ruling things out.


----------



## jdorje

There's no way you used too little clu. That isn't even possible with full coverage.

Far more likely the block isn't firm against the die. That's a small window to hit between bad contact and crushed die.


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> There's no way you used too little clu. That isn't even possible with full coverage.
> 
> Far more likely the block isn't firm against the die. That's a small window to hit between bad contact and crushed die.


Aren't there like die guards to stop this from happening?


----------



## jdorje

Surely. But then there's that same tiny window on the thickness of the die guard...


----------



## stin0

You shouldn't use a thicker layer of CLU - it will give you equal to worse temperatures.
I've already tested this on my 4690K and more CLU (very, very thin layer vs slightly bigger layer) cause an increase of a few degrees celcius under full load.
In IDLE the temps were about equal though. When I'm at home I'll check if i still have my benchmarks with temperature differences (as well as measured ambient temp and delta temp).

When delidding a chip you remove the layer of glue that holds the chip and heatspreader together.
This will cause your IHS to make direct contact with outer heatspreader - therefore the thinest possible layer of CLU should be applied on the IHS.
Of course Intel uses a crapload of special thermalpaste on the IHS because it is done by machines and it has to be 'foul-prove' because sane people don't delid their 300 bucks chips









@Benjiw How did you mount your block on the naked chip? Did you remove the socket bracket and placed washers?
I tried using the special EKWB Ivy Naked mount screw set but I had no luck with it - my temps were rising steadily to 50+ idle








This was with normal waterblock orientation - not the goofy sideways mount.

I think it didn't make proper contact somehow but fastening the bolts even tighter gave my ram POST issues because I mounted it too tight.
Let me know if you find any solutions cause I am of course curious


----------



## ronaldoz

Just delid my 4790K with vice only method. Clean results! It's tested with air cooling, because my watercooling is back for RMA. I just used a very little amount of Liquid Ultra. It lowered temps around 20C and core 4 is scaling better now as well.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> You shouldn't use a thicker layer of CLU - it will give you equal to worse temperatures.
> I've already tested this on my 4690K and more CLU (very, very thin layer vs slightly bigger layer) cause an increase of a few degrees celcius under full load.
> In IDLE the temps were about equal though. When I'm at home I'll check if i still have my benchmarks with temperature differences (as well as measured ambient temp and delta temp).
> 
> When delidding a chip you remove the layer of glue that holds the chip and heatspreader together.
> This will cause your IHS to make direct contact with outer heatspreader - therefore the thinest possible layer of CLU should be applied on the IHS.
> Of course Intel uses a crapload of special thermalpaste on the IHS because it is done by machines and it has to be 'foul-prove' because sane people don't delid their 300 bucks chips
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Benjiw How did you mount your block on the naked chip? Did you remove the socket bracket and placed washers?
> I tried using the special EKWB Ivy Naked mount screw set but I had no luck with it - my temps were rising steadily to 50+ idle
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This was with normal waterblock orientation - not the goofy sideways mount.
> 
> I think it didn't make proper contact somehow but fastening the bolts even tighter gave my ram POST issues because I mounted it too tight.
> Let me know if you find any solutions cause I am of course curious


My ram etc is fine, but I can't even go near 1.3v without IBT AVX throttling the chip, I've spoken to a member here who uses IBT AVX and his temps on bare mount don't exceed 70c at 5ghz it is an ivy but still. I'm going to inspect my block and see what is going on.


----------



## Benjiw

Here's a pic of my waterblock looks like it's making contact fine but there are gaps in the LM imprint. Anyone give me a bit of knowledge here as I'm kinda blind here. Thanks in advance! (Sorry for being newbie at this)


----------



## jdorje

Can you lower the block a fraction of a millimeter?

If you remount do you need to replace the clu? Seems like you wouldn't...it's still sitting there just like when it was first painted on.

Use the brush to spread the clu on the block as well as the die.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Can you lower the block a fraction of a millimeter?
> 
> If you remount do you need to replace the clu? Seems like you wouldn't...it's still sitting there just like when it was first painted on.
> 
> Use the brush to spread the clu on the block as well as the die.


I can overtighten the studs and wrench on the thumb screws but tbh it might crack the die, when I lower the block on to the die without pressure it makes contact so not sure why tightening it down more would help?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Can you lower the block a fraction of a millimeter?
> 
> If you remount do you need to replace the clu? Seems like you wouldn't...it's still sitting there just like when it was first painted on.
> 
> Use the brush to spread the clu on the block as well as the die.
> 
> 
> 
> I can overtighten the studs and wrench on the thumb screws but tbh it might crack the die, when I lower the block on to the die without pressure it makes contact so not sure why tightening it down more would help?
Click to expand...

That paste and block looks normal to me.

My suggestions would be, remove the washers from between your studs and motherboard if you have spring loaded block mounts. Also marking the mount thumb screws to resemble radio dials can help with tightening the threads evenly and easy to keep track of the turns applied.

Maybe your core is damaged though. I haven't any experience with a problematic die yet.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> That paste and block looks normal to me.
> 
> My suggestions would be, remove the washers from between your studs and motherboard if you have spring loaded block mounts. Also marking the mount thumb screws to resemble radio dials can help with tightening the threads evenly and easy to keep track of the turns applied.
> 
> Maybe your core is damaged though. I haven't any experience with a problematic die yet.


I don't think bolting down the block more will help in this situation, it makes contact with the die perfectly well when bolting it down. I'm going to try more CLU because I don't want to add more pressure to my die if it isn't needed.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Here's a pic of my waterblock looks like it's making contact fine but there are gaps in the LM imprint. Anyone give me a bit of knowledge here as I'm kinda blind here. Thanks in advance! (Sorry for being newbie at this)


That looks like pretty good contact to me honestly. That is a better impression of LM than I have ever gotten on the inside of the IHS.

If you still have high temps once you reapply the CLU, then it may be worth a shot at trying it with the lid on.

A thought which anyone can comment or shoot down. True there is one less object for heat to be transferred through, but without the IHS the heat is concentrated in a much smaller area of the block. Maybe it is not taking advantage of all the surface area and heat dissipation potential available. With the IHS the heat is more evenly displaced and easier for the water to cool the larger area?

I'm contemplating installing my lid to see if my temperatures would improve or not.


----------



## Benjiw

Ok guys, There is such thing as not enough CLU I added more to the die and the block and got this result.


----------



## inedenimadam

Temps don't improve with the lid with all else equal, quite the opposite because the extra layer or TIM and metal act as a insulator. The closer you can get the die to the water, the lower your temps will be. I went from air-dellid-water-naked. From water to naked was the smallest gain, but totally worth the $6 for the kit.

That looks light years better Benjiw. Only Δ 6C between cores, and 30C from previous results.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Temps don't improve with the lid with all else equal, quite the opposite because the extra layer or TIM and metal act as a insulator. The closer you can get the die to the water, the lower your temps will be. I went from air-dellid-water-naked. From water to naked was the smallest gain, but totally worth the $6 for the kit.
> 
> That looks light years better Benjiw. Only Δ 6C between cores, and 30C from previous results.


Yes dropped 40c at 1.3v lol idle also dropped to 21c in the bios from 33c so I should of known the application didn't have enough LM to bridge the gap between the block and die


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Here's a pic of my waterblock looks like it's making contact fine but there are gaps in the LM imprint. Anyone give me a bit of knowledge here as I'm kinda blind here. Thanks in advance! (Sorry for being newbie at this)


There is contact throughout but you can see a difference in the appearance where the greatest contact with the block is in the center and the CLU diminishes towards the edges, this indicated you have some degree of curvature. Are you sure you don't want throw the IHS and retention bracket back on and compare temps since you have the block off? That may separate the application vs. water restriction question. I couldn't imagine your temps being outside 60c with the IHS on under full load and working water cooling.

If you can put up with my crappy mouse handwriting...


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> There is contact throughout but you can see a difference in the appearance where the greatest contact with the block is in the center and the CLU diminishes towards the edges, this indicated you have some degree of curvature. Are you sure you don't want throw the IHS and retention bracket back on and compare temps since you have the block off? That may separate the application vs. water restriction question. I couldn't imagine your temps being outside 60c with the IHS on under full load and working water cooling.
> 
> If you can put up with my crappy mouse handwriting...


I will summon the gods of direct-die for help for you although I never see him on anymore. @SonDa5

His original post is #30092


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I will summon the gods of direct-die for help for you although I never see him on anymore. @SonDa5
> 
> His original post is #30092


Already fixed the issue, I needed more CLU
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Ok guys, There is such thing as not enough CLU I added more to the die and the block and got this result.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Just ran a test at stock clocks and 1.2v with IBT AVX and my temps where horrible. Maybe I used to little CLU or something, my CPU is bare die to waterblock.


@SonDa5


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Already fixed the issue, I needed more CLU


Awesome! Glad it worked out! Great temps!


----------



## BaK2BaK

Did anyone already try to apply CLU to the Dark Rock TF cooler from BeQuiet?
The specs sheet says:

_Base material_
Copper

_Surface treatment_
*Aluminum* / Dark nickle-plated

Is it a non go?


----------



## Origondoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> Did anyone already try to apply CLU to the Dark Rock TF cooler from BeQuiet?
> The specs sheet says:
> 
> _Base material_
> Copper
> 
> _Surface treatment_
> *Aluminum* / Dark nickle-plated
> 
> Is it a non go?


It shouldn't be an issue, since the contact plate is nickle plated



If it would be a bare copper like this



then it would be a no go, because CLU would diffuse directly into the bare copper. Nickle plated surface prevents this process


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> It shouldn't be an issue, since the contact plate is nickle plated


That's what I hope, still wondering though why they do specify 'Aluminium'...


----------



## Origondoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> That's what I hope, still wondering though why they do specify 'Aluminium'...


Aluminium is valid for fins material.


----------



## CastleBravo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Ok guys, There is such thing as not enough CLU I added more to the die and the block and got this result.


I finally did a delid with CLU between die and ihs on my 3570k, and I think I may have used too little as well. I plan on doing a few heatsink remounts before I peel the IHS off again to make sure it isn't the IHS/HSF interface (with Gelid GC Extreme) that is the problem. The spread between Core-1 and the rest is rather large. The heatsink is a Thermalright 140 Spirit Power.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> Aluminium is valid for fins material.


You are right! +rep
Had to get confirmation from Be Quiet! support, the base is indeed copper nickel-plated.


----------



## inedenimadam

The CLU does diffuse into the copper over time and discolor it. However, I have been using the naked kit with a copper waterblock for close to two years, and have had zero negative thermal effects due to the moderate staining. I imagine it does dry out to some degree, but I usually tear down and rebuild at least once a year, so your mileage may vary. The base of the waterblock looks horrible, but is still perfectly flat and performs just as well as the day I first installed it.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> The CLU does diffuse into the copper over time and discolor it. However, I have been using the naked kit with a copper waterblock for close to two years, and have had zero negative thermal effects due to the moderate staining. I imagine it does dry out to some degree, but I usually tear down and rebuild at least once a year, so your mileage may vary. The base of the waterblock looks horrible, but is still perfectly flat and performs just as well as the day I first installed it.


Same here, my copper waterblock with nickle plating also shows mild stains and is less shiny as it used to be. It does still perform like it always used to. This is after about 7 months of use with CLU.
CLU should just never be used on light metals (i.e. aluminum, magnesium, titanium) with really low density as it will corrode really badly over time.
Aluminum has a density of about 2.7 g/cm3 while the more heavier metals like copper and nickel are at 8.9 g/cm3 density.
These numbers are at about ~20 degrees celcius by the way, when you heat copper/nickle the density will slightly reduce of course.

But without getting too technical/in-depth: CLU is safe to use with both copper and nickle, although the mirror-finish-shinyness will alter negatively over time.


----------



## obikenobi27

Not sure if this is the best place to ask, but has anybody tried to replace the lid with a copper one? I'm not sure if it would make a difference, and I don't have a spare CNC to make a lid to test with.

Also, how hard is it to reseal the lid back to the CPU. I'm new to this and am not sure whether its for me.


----------



## BaK2BaK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *obikenobi27*
> 
> Not sure if this is the best place to ask, but has anybody tried to replace the lid with a copper one? I'm not sure if it would make a difference, and I don't have a spare CNC to make a lid to test with.


The lid is copper inside (or it looks a lot like it), see my avatar, this is how it looks after having been sanded down.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *obikenobi27*
> 
> Also, how hard is it to reseal the lid back to the CPU. I'm new to this and am not sure whether its for me.


If you want to glue back the IHS, which most of us don't, you need a very thin layer of glue in order to have the IHS still sitting on the die.
You could use a double sided tape of 0.1mm thickness instead of glue.


----------



## obikenobi27

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> The lid is copper inside (or it looks a lot like it), see my avatar, this is how it looks after having been sanded down.
> If you want to glue back the IHS, which most of us don't, you need a very thin layer of glue in order to have the IHS still sitting on the die.
> You could use a double sided tape of 0.1mm thickness instead of glue.


So is that why sanding down (lapping is what I think that is called) the lid increases performance? It exposes a more conductive surface?


----------



## Origondoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *obikenobi27*
> 
> So is that why sanding down (lapping is what I think that is called) the lid increases performance? It exposes a more conductive surface?


Lapping is mainly done to remove any kind of concavity of the IHS (Intel heat spreader (?) ) Additionally you give the surface a mirroring finish, so there is the optimal contact between IHS and your cooler base plate, for best heat dissipation / transfer.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *obikenobi27*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> The lid is copper inside (or it looks a lot like it), see my avatar, this is how it looks after having been sanded down.
> If you want to glue back the IHS, which most of us don't, you need a very thin layer of glue in order to have the IHS still sitting on the die.
> You could use a double sided tape of 0.1mm thickness instead of glue.
> 
> 
> 
> So is that why sanding down (lapping is what I think that is called) the lid increases performance? It exposes a more conductive surface?
Click to expand...

Removing it completely does even better.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Removing it completely does even better.


Does or doesn't?


----------



## BaK2BaK

It is supposed to, the closer to the die the heatsink is, the better.
But without the Intel Heat Spreader (IHS), there is a risk crushing the die when attaching the heatsink to it.

However depending on the surface of the heatsink (concave or convexe), there may be a better contact with an IHS than with the die (totally flat).

So I recommend to have pressure contact paper at hand to check how the different surfaces are in contact with each other, and so be able to correct them (lapping them) accordingly.
EDIT: example of pressure contact papers: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/110#post_20514250


----------



## obikenobi27

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BaK2BaK*
> 
> It is supposed to, the closer to the die the heatsink is, the better.
> But without the Intel Heat Spreader (IHS), there is a risk crushing the die when attaching the heatsink to it.
> 
> However depending on the surface of the heatsink (concave or convexe), there may be a better contact with an IHS than with the die (totally flat).
> 
> So I recommend to have pressure contact paper at hand to check how the different surfaces are in contact with each other, and so be able to correct them (lapping them) accordingly.
> EDIT: example of pressure contact papers: http://www.overclock.net/t/1351984/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra-vs-liquid-pro-vs-phobya-liquid-metal/110#post_20514250


I would probably reseal the IHS. I don't trust myself with mounting a cooler to an exposed die.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NotATroll*
> 
> Does or doesn't?


See for yourself.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Hoodcom

I have to say, I was nervous about delidding since KyadCK told me about the process, for my 4770K processor. Which I was able to hit 86C on Prime95 Blend within the first ten minutes on stock clock/stock turbo boost. (Before it was above 90C until I re-applied thermal paste between the CPU and the D14.)

So I've had one of these delidding tools 3D printed, I didn't have to use a razor blade or hammer. https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool

Worked pretty well, I used Phobya LM between the die and IHS of my CPU, then IC Diamond between my D14 and IHS. Within an hours run, the hottest peak has been 68C, and 69C on one core.

So thankyou @KyadCK for having told me about this, and thank you guys for this awesome thread, still had some really helpful information!


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hoodcom*
> 
> I have to say, I was nervous about delidding since KyadCK told me about the process, for my 4770K processor. Which I was able to hit 86C on Prime95 Blend within the first ten minutes on stock clock/stock turbo boost. (Before it was above 90C until I re-applied thermal paste between the CPU and the D14.)
> 
> So I've had one of these delidding tools 3D printed, I didn't have to use a razor blade or hammer. https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool
> 
> Worked pretty well, I used Phobya LM between the die and IHS of my CPU, then IC Diamond between my D14 and IHS. Within an hours run, the hottest peak has been 68C, and 69C on one core.
> 
> So thankyou @KyadCK for having told me about this, and thank you guys for this awesome thread, still had some really helpful information!


Get some CLU thermal Liquid Metal, plus read up the thread on that, it does not disappoint.

Did your skylake-delid-tool print work without problem? Mine exploded which is why I ask. Pics?


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Get some CLU thermal Liquid Metal, plus read up the thread on that, it does not disappoint.
> 
> Did your skylake-delid-tool print work without problem? Mine exploded which is why I ask. Pics?


Well I've already used some pretty solid liquid metal already, which I've read about in this thread. The Phobya LM.









Also, wasn't the CLU difficult or impossible to clean up, or am I thinking another compound?

Yeah, my cpu went in just fine, and I put it into the bench vice, heard the little pop and backed off the vice. Lid was loose. I have a picture of my tool, but I never got to taking pictures of the CPU (yet) because I was both nervous and excited to seeing how well it'd work.









But here's my tool:


Was printed with 35% infill, at 200 micron layer height, and ABS material. I hired someone local to get the job done.









I may end up upgrading my CPU cooler later, to one of the Corsair all in ones or get an EK kit. Which I can then take more pictures of the CPU itself. Especially since I do consider possibly lapping it too.


----------



## jdorje

Supposedly phobya lm is a few tenths of a degree better then clu.

Clu is preferred because it's by far the easiest to apply and clean. But certainly not worth swapping out for it.

When delidding haswell or ivy there's no need for any 3d tool. The vice only method is mature and extremely safe.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hoodcom*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Get some CLU thermal Liquid Metal, plus read up the thread on that, it does not disappoint.
> 
> Did your skylake-delid-tool print work without problem? Mine exploded which is why I ask. Pics?
> 
> 
> 
> Well I've already used some pretty solid liquid metal already, which I've read about in this thread. The Phobya LM.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, wasn't the CLU difficult or impossible to clean up, or am I thinking another compound?
> 
> Yeah, my cpu went in just fine, and I put it into the bench vice, heard the little pop and backed off the vice. Lid was loose. I have a picture of my tool, but I never got to taking pictures of the CPU (yet) because I was both nervous and excited to seeing how well it'd work.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But here's my tool:
> 
> 
> Was printed with 35% infill, at 200 micron layer height, and ABS material. I hired someone local to get the job done.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I may end up upgrading my CPU cooler later, to one of the Corsair all in ones or get an EK kit. Which I can then take more pictures of the CPU itself. Especially since I do consider possibly lapping it too.
Click to expand...

Sure, bad post by me. Right in there you clearly note Phobya Liquid Metal, and I scanned right over it as standard thermal paste. It is probably the name Phobya, if there is more information that than brand only it seems hard to remember Phobya, for me in the least.

To keep this going though, if you post some thermal temperatures and your observations I would certainly be curious as I was contemplating Phobya Liquid Metal too.

Glad to have seen.

You know, I have to see that your temperatures are there as well, my brain just doesn't accept your post for reasons unexplained.


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Sure, bad post by me. Right in there you clearly note Phobya Liquid Metal, and I scanned right over it as standard thermal paste. It is probably the name Phobya, if there is more information that than brand only it seems hard to remember Phobya, for me in the least.
> 
> To keep this going though, if you post some thermal temperatures and your observations I would certainly be curious as I was contemplating Phobya Liquid Metal too.
> 
> Glad to have seen.
> 
> You know, I have to see that your temperatures are there as well, my brain just doesn't accept your post for reasons unexplained.


I can only provide a screenshot of what it's at now, I never took one before the delid. Wished I had.










Anyway, I think I could benefit from re-working with the compound between the die and IHS, especially the difference with the one core being hotter.


----------



## ronaldoz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hoodcom*
> 
> I can only provide a screenshot of what it's at now, I never took one before the delid. Wished I had.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, I think I could benefit from re-working with the compound between the die and IHS, especially the difference with the one core being hotter.


What Prime version are you using and are you using air or watercooling? You ran the test very short, the temperatures may raise more I guess. What makes you think your liquid metal was not good? If not thinking about the core temperatures. Did you put too much on it? A tiny little drop should be fine, so it just cover the die. You probably see some 'dots' on the surface / liquid metal. Means you just have applied a bit.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Sure, bad post by me. Right in there you clearly note Phobya Liquid Metal, and I scanned right over it as standard thermal paste. It is probably the name Phobya, if there is more information that than brand only it seems hard to remember Phobya, for me in the least.
> 
> To keep this going though, if you post some thermal temperatures and your observations I would certainly be curious as I was contemplating Phobya Liquid Metal too.
> 
> Glad to have seen.
> 
> You know, I have to see that your temperatures are there as well, my brain just doesn't accept your post for reasons unexplained.
> 
> 
> 
> I can only provide a screenshot of what it's at now, I never took one before the delid. Wished I had.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyway, I think I could benefit from re-working with the compound between the die and IHS, especially the difference with the one core being hotter.
Click to expand...

To be honest, I do not need a screenshot. I am scanning for the relative temperature change.

Currently you have reported your temperatures at seventy range with stock clock stock boost on 4770K.

With no comparison, my search continues.


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ronaldoz*
> 
> What Prime version are you using and are you using air or watercooling? You ran the test very short, the temperatures may raise more I guess. What makes you think your liquid metal was not good? If not thinking about the core temperatures. Did you put too much on it? A tiny little drop should be fine, so it just cover the die. You probably see some 'dots' on the surface / liquid metal. Means you just have applied a bit.


Prime Version 28.7, build 1. Air cooling, which is a Noctua D14. Those temps were with the stock fans that come with it. I guess 6 hours is too short for getting an idea on temps? I did end up changing fans that I had on hand, which are a couple of these: http://noctua.at/en/nf-f12-industrialppc-2000-pwm Which seemed to have dropped the temps by 4C on standard Prime95 blend test. Which is all I had done. I've read where I need to give it most of my RAM so I went for that overnight. No reports since the time frame I got up early this morning, to shortly before noon, it froze (Unless I just had it hog too much RAM?). Time to tweak settings and try again!









Not that I feel there's anything wrong with the Phobya LM itself, I'm just worried I may not have applied it as well as I could have on the CPU die and IHS. From what I've read you need to spread it with a small paint brush. (for any liquid metal?). I know I managed to apply enough IC Diamond between the IHS and cooler for it to work out well. It's just the liquid metal I am not 100% sure on especially since this was the absolute first delid job I've ever done.

I really should get to adding my new build into my sig rig, and update my sig too, now I'm thinking about it.


----------



## ronaldoz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hoodcom*
> 
> Prime Version 28.7, build 1. Air cooling, which is a Noctua D14. Those temps were with the stock fans that come with it. I guess 6 hours is too short for getting an idea on temps? I did end up changing fans that I had on hand, which are a couple of these: http://noctua.at/en/nf-f12-industrialppc-2000-pwm Which seemed to have dropped the temps by 4C on standard Prime95 blend test. Which is all I had done. I've read where I need to give it most of my RAM so I went for that overnight. No reports since the time frame I got up early this morning, to shortly before noon, it froze (Unless I just had it hog too much RAM?). Time to tweak settings and try again!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not that I feel there's anything wrong with the Phobya LM itself, I'm just worried I may not have applied it as well as I could have on the CPU die and IHS. From what I've read you need to spread it with a small paint brush. (for any liquid metal?). I know I managed to apply enough IC Diamond between the IHS and cooler for it to work out well. It's just the liquid metal I am not 100% sure on especially since this was the absolute first delid job I've ever done.
> 
> I really should get to adding my new build into my sig rig, and update my sig too, now I'm thinking about it.


Oh well, 6 hours is great to check temperatures. I thought you ran 4 minutes, haha. But I guess the blend test is made for testing memory especially. (for that you could also use HCI Memtest). For testing a overclock, the Small FFT test is great. I think your temps will be higher with the Small FFT test tho. And I'm not sure how much difference there is with Prime v27.7 and Prime v28.7. I'm around the same voltage (1.31V) and would have a slightly higher temperature in Prime v27.7 as you have in your test, but that's with the Small FFT test. That temperature is really great for this voltage and aircooling.

But after checking your temps again, that just looks really good. It's normal to have differences, especially in core 4, because of the internal GPU chip. These were my results (non-delid vs. delid & also on air). Check the temp differences for each core.


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ronaldoz*
> 
> Oh well, 6 hours is great to check temperatures. I thought you ran 4 minutes, haha. But I guess the blend test is made for testing memory especially. (for that you could also use HCI Memtest). For testing a overclock, the Small FFT test is great. I think your temps will be higher with the Small FFT test tho. And I'm not sure how much difference there is with Prime v27.7 and Prime v28.7. I'm around the same voltage (1.31V) and would have a slightly higher temperature in Prime v27.7 as you have in your test, but that's with the Small FFT test. That temperature is really great for this voltage and aircooling.
> 
> But after checking your temps again, that just looks really good. It's normal to have differences, especially in core 4, because of the internal GPU chip. These were my results (non-delid vs. delid & also on air). Check the temp differences for each core.


Oh okay, I guess I didn't realize you thought that! I pretty well begin the HWinfo64 timer when I begin Prime95, especially to see where all the temps hang out at.

Now that you mention it, I'm beginning to recall that as well with the Small FFT. Which I guess it doesn't hurt to test everything either at some point. I'll run that test now and see how things go. I'm still reading up on what voltages/settings to fiddle with on my board to get things right. I just know when I did try 4.5GHz at 1.280 volts, Prime95 Blend test would cause windows to BSoD. But at that time I've only tweaked the vcore.

But man, looking at your screenshot, I wish mine would run at those speeds at that voltage!









Hmm, so I guess I may be worrying about the core temperature differences too much then. Though man, did that delid job make a big difference anyway.


----------



## jdorje

You can't compare temps with p95 blend. They vary randomly by a very large amount.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

This thread is for delidding, you already said you don't have previous temperatures, wrong thread.


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> This thread is for delidding, you already said you don't have previous temperatures, wrong thread.


Just because I don't have a screenshot of the previous temperatures, doesn't mean I can't post in this thread especially because my CPU has been delidded. Which the thermal paste application at hand was in question. I really don't have to prove anything other than the sole fact the chip has been delidded and what temperatures I get now since that's what's relevant now.

It's not like I could join the actual membership of the club side since there was no way I could run this at 4.5GHz to test, as per first post instructions due the dangers of heat. I said already, stock turbo boost already had hit 86C, and now just to get 4.4GHz, after the delide, I'm seeing above those temps. So I'm sorry I've inconvenienced you for not taking pre-delid screenshots still.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> You can't compare temps with p95 blend. They vary randomly by a very large amount.


How big of impact does the version differences make, out of curiosity?

Also, after the delid, how much you think lapping the CPU could help, temperature wise? Is it any more difficult to do a proper lap with it delidded?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hoodcom*
> 
> How big of impact does the version differences make, out of curiosity?
> 
> Also, after the delid, how much you think lapping the CPU could help, temperature wise? Is it any more difficult to do a proper lap with it delidded?


Prime version matter allot. AVX instructions were absent from earlier versions of P95, and will not stress the CPU to anywhere near the same level Prime with AVX.

before you lap, check your lid for flat. rest a razorblade perpendicular to the IHS, if you see a gap under the blade, you stand to benefit from lapping.

Alternatively, you could just leave the IHS out completely. EKs naked upgrade kit is $6 if you already have on of their blocks. I always wondered why everybody takes the dang thing off just to put it back on again.


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Prime version matter allot. AVX instructions were absent from earlier versions of P95, and will not stress the CPU to anywhere near the same level Prime with AVX.
> 
> before you lap, check your lid for flat. rest a razorblade perpendicular to the IHS, if you see a gap under the blade, you stand to benefit from lapping.
> 
> Alternatively, you could just leave the IHS out completely. EKs naked upgrade kit is $6 if you already have on of their blocks. I always wondered why everybody takes the dang thing off just to put it back on again.


Ah, gotcha, makes perfect sense. Thanks!









Okay, that I could do actually sometime!

Oh really now? EK makes an upgrade kit? I've been considering their product or corsair's all in one solution. https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy

Now you've definitely got my attention, thank you kindly for pointing this out!


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hoodcom*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Prime version matter allot. AVX instructions were absent from earlier versions of P95, and will not stress the CPU to anywhere near the same level Prime with AVX.
> 
> before you lap, check your lid for flat. rest a razorblade perpendicular to the IHS, if you see a gap under the blade, you stand to benefit from lapping.
> 
> Alternatively, you could just leave the IHS out completely. EKs naked upgrade kit is $6 if you already have on of their blocks. I always wondered why everybody takes the dang thing off just to put it back on again.
> 
> 
> 
> Ah, gotcha, makes perfect sense. Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, that I could do actually sometime!
> 
> Oh really now? EK makes an upgrade kit? I've been considering their product or corsair's all in one solution. https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy
> 
> Now you've definitely got my attention, thank you kindly for pointing this out!
Click to expand...

If you live in the United States the import taxes and tariffs quadruple the price (direct from EKWB).

As for lapping, the only thing lapping can do to effectively reduce temperature is ensure a better connection between the IHS and the block. If you lap your block and go naked the only thing that it can do is improve the connection between the block and the die.

The problem asking for numbers that I see, and I think most people see is that we cannot tell you what your chip can do, and it is seemingly what you are asking for.


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> If you live in the United States the import taxes and tariffs quadruple the price (direct from EKWB).
> 
> As for lapping, the only thing lapping can do to effectively reduce temperature is ensure a better connection between the IHS and the block. If you lap your block and go naked the only thing that it can do is improve the connection between the block and the die.
> 
> The problem asking for numbers that I see, and I think most people see is that we cannot tell you what your chip can do, and it is seemingly what you are asking for.


Ah, guess I can check to see if Performance-PCs carries it then, but may not be too big of a deal for me.

Mostly what my curiosity is for, on getting the most out of it, plus I've always wanted to try lapping something.









Mostly what I'm asking for is just general info on what I can do to help reduce the temperature more, or if the hottest core vs coolest core has something to do with improper application of the compound. I honestly was just excited to actually delid the thing and see the improvement already.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Hoodcom*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> If you live in the United States the import taxes and tariffs quadruple the price (direct from EKWB).
> 
> As for lapping, the only thing lapping can do to effectively reduce temperature is ensure a better connection between the IHS and the block. If you lap your block and go naked the only thing that it can do is improve the connection between the block and the die.
> 
> The problem asking for numbers that I see, and I think most people see is that we cannot tell you what your chip can do, and it is seemingly what you are asking for.
> 
> 
> 
> Ah, guess I can check to see if Performance-PCs carries it then, but may not be too big of a deal for me.
> 
> Mostly what my curiosity is for, on getting the most out of it, plus I've always wanted to try lapping something.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mostly what I'm asking for is just general info on what I can do to help reduce the temperature more, or if the hottest core vs coolest core has something to do with improper application of the compound. I honestly was just excited to actually delid the thing and see the improvement already.
Click to expand...

That is neat, and I am sure if that I knew more about 4770k communication would go more smoothly as I would have stronger background there.

If delidding things is now your fancy, maybe grab your favorite six pack and enjoy victory.


----------



## inedenimadam

I got my naked kit from PPCS a few years ago, cant speak for current stock though.

Stay away from the corsair style AIO watercoolers if you think you might one day try your hand at a custom loop. The sealed AIOs cant really be salvaged for any meaningful parts, and end up expensive paper weights down the road. air to custom water is a big leap of faith, but once you do there is no turning back.

I love EKs stuff, and have used their stuff in several builds. There are plenty of reviews of their new AIO/expandable set ups out there. You could probably put together a full custom for the same price, but with those new EK AIOs, the cliff you have to jump off of doesn't seem as high.


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I got my naked kit from PPCS a few years ago, cant speak for current stock though.
> 
> Stay away from the corsair style AIO watercoolers if you think you might one day try your hand at a custom loop. The sealed AIOs cant really be salvaged for any meaningful parts, and end up expensive paper weights down the road. air to custom water is a big leap of faith, but once you do there is no turning back.
> 
> I love EKs stuff, and have used their stuff in several builds. There are plenty of reviews of their new AIO/expandable set ups out there. You could probably put together a full custom for the same price, but with those new EK AIOs, the cliff you have to jump off of doesn't seem as high.


I've always had this idea that although going custom loop may be expensive and a massive jump from air, it's one of those investments that could look after your computer for a solid few years. Most of the parts are reusable when looked after well too. AIO is definitely a waste of money and is aimed at the end user/consumers. Which technically isn't what I would call someone who's gone as far as to delid their CPU to find those next level temps.


----------



## jdorje

Is a 6-8C (a bit over 10% in delta from ambient, or nominally over 20% in delta from my retorted h80i temp) worth a redelid?

Average temps on this run by core: 72 75 72 68


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Is a 6-8C (a bit over 10% in delta from ambient, or nominally over 20% in delta from my retorted h80i temp) worth a redelid?
> 
> Average temps on this run by core: 72 75 72 68


Define 'redelid', what do you exactly mean with that?
Do you delid your 4690K but glued it back together again?


----------



## benjamen50

My Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra came in today, so excited to delid but nervous. Will post pictures tomorrow if I do it. In fact going to delid two CPUs. i5 4690K and i7 4790K.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> My Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra came in today, so excited to delid but nervous. Will post pictures tomorrow if I do it. In fact going to delid two CPUs. i5 4690K and i7 4790K.


If you're using a vice, it will be over in seconds, easy. God speed!


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you're using a vice, it will be over in seconds, easy. God speed!


Yeah, using vice with 3d printed skylake tool, it'll be a breeze to take off. Going to use some tape that isn't strong to cover up the capacitors next to the die when I apply CLU. Definitely going to put thin layer of CLU on the die and make sure there's no traces of drip and a reflective-ish finish. Going to also put a bit of CLU on under ihs part. Then going to use Phobya Thermal Adhesive by putting about a few drops on the IHS to seal it back on.

Edit: And yeah going to take tape off too probably. Credit card or something equivalent to scrape off the grey / black glue thing they have on the intel CPU and the IHS.

Is phobya thermal glue good enough to glue the IHS back to cpu and cover capacitors next to die?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Define 'redelid', what do you exactly mean with that?
> Do you delid your 4690K but glued it back together again?


No, it's completely barebones. Neither glued nor are the caps covered. I believe I put a bit more CLU on than necessary but temps are good - yet there is this difference in cores which seems higher than it should be.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you're using a vice, it will be over in seconds, easy. God speed!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, using vice with 3d printed skylake tool, it'll be a breeze to take off. Going to use some tape that isn't strong to cover up the capacitors next to the die when I apply CLU. Definitely going to put thin layer of CLU on the die and make sure there's no traces of drip and a reflective-ish finish. Going to also put a bit of CLU on under ihs part. Then going to use Phobya Thermal Adhesive by putting about a few drops on the IHS to seal it back on.
> 
> Edit: And yeah going to take tape off too probably. Credit card or something equivalent to scrape off the grey / black glue thing they have on the intel CPU and the IHS.
> 
> Is phobya thermal glue good enough to glue the IHS back to cpu and cover capacitors next to die?
Click to expand...

Do make your 3d printed skylake tool more durable than recommended (I crushed one around my chip). Do take it easy with the CLU, really not to much as it is expensive, and really not to little as the die is more expensive. Do use judgement with covering the capacitors, because even naked capacitors have benefits in some ways I am sure.

You can use the motherboard bracket for locking your lid in place. A strong thumb







, being something nicer of a person than me, and confidence will prevent the lid from moving ever so slightly more than one millimeter during lockdown and that can be compensated for with an offset.

Also if you have the patience, though it does not seem you do, PM me and we could work out a way for me to send you the 386DX40 Delidder Tool, if you really can wait, but I wont want to pay shipping. I want to share it, but shipping is going to always grab me.


----------



## benjamen50

OCN name: benjamen50
CPU: 4790K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: NT-H1
Mhz gained: 100 MHz
OC after delid: 4800 Mhz
Temp drops: ~10C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/m78mlh

Thanks again @g0tsl33p14

Delid was successful (Used 3D Printed Skylake Delid tool) but the CPU temps on the core seem to have a bad discrepancy. I already redid the CLU again but that didn't help.

Used to get around 95C now I get around 86°C, so a 9°C drop from the hottest core, though there is a further 16°C drop on the 4th core.
Posting screenshots in a bit.



I did clean the black gunk thoroughly so there is only residue left (the markings from the black thing. also did a thin layer of CLU on the CPU DIE and under the IHS. I'm thinking of putting CLU between the NH-D14 heatsink and the IHS.



Edit: Which overclock should I use? 4.7 GHz @ 1.29v or 4.8 GHz @ 1.34v?


----------



## NotATroll

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> OCN name: benjamen50
> CPU: 4790K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: NT-H1
> Mhz gained: NA
> OC after delid: 4700 Mhz
> Temp drops: ~10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/lvlidd
> 
> Thanks again @g0tsl33p14
> 
> Delid was successful (Used 3D Printed Skylake Delid tool) but the CPU temps on the core seem to have a bad discrepancy. I already redid the CLU again but that didn't help.
> 
> Used to get around 95C now I get around 86°C, so a 9°C drop from the hottest core, though there is a further 16°C drop on the 4th core.
> Posting screenshots in a bit.
> 
> 
> 
> I did clean the black gunk thoroughly so there is only residue left (the markings from the black thing. also did a thin layer of CLU on the CPU DIE and under the IHS. I'm thinking of putting CLU between the NH-D14 heatsink and the IHS.


The temps between your cores look perfectly fine.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> OCN name: benjamen50
> CPU: 4790K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 100 MHz
> OC after delid: 4800 Mhz
> Temp drops: ~10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/m78mlh
> 
> Thanks again @g0tsl33p14
> 
> Delid was successful (Used 3D Printed Skylake Delid tool) but the CPU temps on the core seem to have a bad discrepancy. I already redid the CLU again but that didn't help.
> 
> Used to get around 95C now I get around 86°C, so a 9°C drop from the hottest core, though there is a further 16°C drop on the 4th core.
> Posting screenshots in a bit.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I did clean the black gunk thoroughly so there is only residue left (the markings from the black thing. also did a thin layer of CLU on the CPU DIE and under the IHS. I'm thinking of putting CLU between the NH-D14 heatsink and the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Which overclock should I use? 4.7 GHz @ 1.29v or 4.8 GHz @ 1.34v?


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## ryan92084

Tag me in coach.

OCN name: ryan92084
CPU: 3570k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Gelid extreme
Mhz gained: n/a
OC after delid: none atm (dealing with gpu strangeness)
Temp drops: ~10C

Kind of hard to get an exact temp drop due to time passage/ambient shifts but looks like I've dropped a minimum of 10C after letting the water temps stabilize.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ryan92084*
> 
> Tag me in coach.
> 
> OCN name: ryan92084
> CPU: 3570k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Gelid extreme
> Mhz gained: n/a
> OC after delid: none atm (dealing with gpu strangeness)
> Temp drops: ~10C
> 
> Kind of hard to get an exact temp drop due to time passage/ambient shifts but looks like I've dropped a minimum of 10C after letting the water temps stabilize.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## benjamen50

I didn't cover the haswell refresh / devil's canyon capacitors at all. So as long as my application of CLU on the die is fine. I shouldn't worry right?


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> I didn't cover the haswell refresh / devil's canyon capacitors at all. So as long as my application of CLU on the die is fine. I shouldn't worry right?


Yeah you should be fine indeed as long as no CLU hits the caps.

If you ever decide te reseat/remove your CPU from your socket I do advice to use either elec tape or clear nail polish to cover them up.
It can take only 1 little drop of CLU to fry your CPU


----------



## Asus11

hey guys did anyone benefit from using thermal tape or thermal pad on the vrms on the PCB?

im thinking of doing it? also which product do you guys use?

is 0.5mm thermal pad ok to use? I cant seem to find where to buy the tape from

Thanks


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Asus11*
> 
> hey guys did anyone benefit from using thermal tape or thermal pad on the vrms on the PCB?
> 
> im thinking of doing it? also which product do you guys use?
> 
> is 0.5mm thermal pad ok to use? I cant seem to find where to buy the tape from
> 
> Thanks


I just used nail polish personally as it was easier at the time, if I was to redo the whole thing I wouldn't even bother and just leave them bare. Personally I think covering them is just a precaution as we don't use enough CLU to worry about it slipping on to them... Well actually I retract my statement, most of you re-use the IHS where as I'm directly on the waterblock.


----------



## jdorje

Nobody's ever benefited from doing so.

Thermal pad? What thickness?


----------



## 0xzz

hey im thinking about delidding my 6700k and putting some liquid metal tim on, but i have a few questions...








why is CL Ultra recommended over Phobya LM? looks like the phobya performs better.
i want to put some silicone back on the IHS before putting it back on the pcb but i never used silicone before, so how do i best apply it to the IHS so that its not too thick??

Regards


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0xzz*
> 
> hey im thinking about delidding my 6700k and putting some liquid metal tim on, but i have a few questions...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> why is CL Ultra recommended over Phobya LM? looks like the phobya performs better.
> i want to put some silicone back on the IHS before putting it back on the pcb but i never used silicone before, so how do i best apply it to the IHS so that its not too thick??
> 
> Regards


Squeeze some silicone on a piece of paper and use a wooden toothpick to pick up a bit of sealant and transfer it unto the IHS.


----------



## hotrod717

So, if it hasn't been posted already, please head this -

Skylid Delid Rules-

Use a delid tool or razor
Do Not scrape the glue off
Do Not flex or twist the pcb
Re-glue ihs back on

Follow these to avoid killing your cpu.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Do Not scrape the glue off


The rest I understand, but what's the reasoning behind leaving the glue on? Is the height of die and depth of IHS on the inside mismatched now?


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> The rest I understand, but what's the reasoning behind leaving the glue on? Is the height of die and depth of IHS on the inside mismatched now?


Yes,The ihs will scrape and touch die without. It will push all the tim right out. Not only that, but the trace are so close to the top, the scraping may also be causing damage. I' ve lost 3 skylake chips in past 3 weeks. I've delided dozens of haswells without issue, but skylake is a bit different. The pcb is so thin and die is very fragile.

This chip has a crack right in the middle of the die and the abrasion can easily be seen.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Yes,The ihs will scrape and touch die without. It will push all the tim right out. Not only that, but the trace are so close to the top, the scraping may also be causing damage. I' ve lost 3 skylake chips in past 3 weeks. I've delided dozens of haswells without issue, but skylake is a bit different. The pcb is so thin and die is very fragile.
> 
> This chip has a crack right in the middle of the die and the abrasion can easily be seen.


Have you tried measuring the difference and using a paper shim? Assuming you have access to disposable Skylake chips. You could even test mount pressure with something like http://www.sensorprod.com/pressurex_micro.phplike


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Have you tried measuring the difference and using a paper shim? Assuming you have access to disposable Skylake chips. You could even test mount pressure with something like http://www.sensorprod.com/pressurex_micro.phplike


Don't need to. Already been proven and shown. Multiple fixes and work arounds being developed.

http://forum.hwbot.org/showthread.php?t=153578

Read back through the thread. It get more interesting and the cracking concept expands and other info is presented.


----------



## 0xzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hotrod717*
> 
> Do Not scrape the glue off
> Re-glue ihs back on


so just put some new silicone on the old black glue and put it back together??
does cracking only happen with LN2 or also on normal air/water??


----------



## hotrod717

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0xzz*
> 
> so just put some new silicone on the old black glue and put it back together??
> does cracking only happen with LN2 or also on normal air/water??


As i said, read through thread. Initially it talks about cracking tim during ln2 benching, but the discussion changes later. Seems like people are reporting cracking dies more and more. Don't know if this isolated to newer manufacture chips, but it is happening. Just passing along info so someone else doesn't lose a chip.

Yes the spacing between ihs and die is already tight.


----------



## jdorje

Seems like new skylake chips (non delidded) cool way better then old ones. Related?


----------



## inedenimadam

I have a couple tubes of Phyobia LM on the way to test against CLU. I have been using CLU for a couple years on a naked die with a copper block, and every 6+ months the CLU seems to dry out (absorb into the block ?) and temps start creeping up. Also going to try it on 4 of my GPU blocks, none of which have the staining, nor the temperature rise over time.


----------



## Benjiw

I'm still waiting for someone to come up with a way to directly mount waterblocks directly to skylake die's.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I'm still waiting for someone to come up with a way to directly mount waterblocks directly to skylake die's.


is the issue the more flexible PCB? I don't see any other reason the current naked ivy kit cant be used on yet another generation, but I don't have any skylake plans for mainstream-k processors.

Edit to add: If that is the case, you could grind down your IHS from the top until the center falls out, and you are just left with a square and wings.


----------



## johnd0e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> is the issue the more flexible PCB? I don't see any other reason the current naked ivy kit cant be used on yet another generation, but I don't have any skylake plans for mainstream-k processors.


the hieght of the CPU is different, current blocks wont touch it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> the hieght of the CPU is different, current blocks wont touch it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> is the issue the more flexible PCB? I don't see any other reason the current naked ivy kit cant be used on yet another generation, but I don't have any skylake plans for mainstream-k processors.


The issue is that the die sits up to 0.4mm under the socket so the block hits the socket before even coming into contact with the die.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> the hieght of the CPU is different, current blocks wont touch it.
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> is the issue the more flexible PCB? I don't see any other reason the current naked ivy kit cant be used on yet another generation, but I don't have any skylake plans for mainstream-k processors.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The issue is that the die sits up to 0.4mm under the socket so the block hits the socket before even coming into contact with the die.
Click to expand...

Under the socket or the mounting bracket?

My suggestion I edited in up there might work according to a quick search for the issues here on OCN. It is a two part problem, the first being the flexing PCB the second being the height difference. you would need to add .04 (or whatever the actual difference is) spacers to the backside under the mount plate, and then grind down the IHS to the same height as the pcb-die height (stop grinding as soon as the middle falls out. )

I might have to pick up an i3 and mobo just to try this out.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Under the socket or the mounting bracket?


Socket my good sir.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Under the socket or the mounting bracket?
> 
> 
> 
> Socket my good sir.
Click to expand...

dang...that is rough.


----------



## jdorje

Just needs a special water block that's 0.4 mm thicker in the center.

And some luck that neither delid nor the mounting cracks the die or damages the pcb...

Delidding skylake sounds awful.


----------



## johnd0e

it really wouldnt be to hard to make a block that touches the die, heck i can machine down one of my MX blocks to fit at work and it would take barely 30 minutes to set up and machine. hard part imho is getting all the numbers right so you dont crush the die.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Just needs a special water block that's 0.4 mm thicker in the center.


Actually, I happen to have one of those already modded up for the old AMD GPUs that required a shim. It could stand to be polished up though.


----------



## jdorje

You said 0.4mm; how accurate is that? And how precise does the mod need to be? Will .35mm lead to bad contact and .45mm crush the die? Or is there more leeway?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> You said 0.4mm; how accurate is that? And how precise does the mod need to be? Will .35mm lead to bad contact and .45mm crush the die? Or is there more leeway?


I did not do that measurement, but without measuring, I think you would need to use a little common sense with pressure, and go 1/4 turn until it boots.

Edit: a skylake naked kit retail kit is going to be expensive if one does ever come out!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> You said 0.4mm; how accurate is that? And how precise does the mod need to be? Will .35mm lead to bad contact and .45mm crush the die? Or is there more leeway?


That image is by Der8auer so I'd say it's pretty accurate knowing him, also don't forget you also need to put pressure on the CPU so it makes firm contact with all the pins in the socket so .45mm might not be enough.


----------



## johnd0e

Like I said the hardest part is getting the right numbers.


----------



## Benjiw

One of my cores seems to be getting very toasty, does CLU harden with heat or something? When I've been trying to find the right voltage for my 4.9ghz overclock on my 4670k temps hit 90c and I'm wondering if I'll need to clean off my last application and put some fresh stuff on there instead?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> You shouldn't use a thicker layer of CLU - it will give you equal to worse temperatures.
> I've already tested this on my 4690K and more CLU (very, very thin layer vs slightly bigger layer) cause an increase of a few degrees celcius under full load.
> In IDLE the temps were about equal though. When I'm at home I'll check if i still have my benchmarks with temperature differences (as well as measured ambient temp and delta temp).
> 
> When delidding a chip you remove the layer of glue that holds the chip and heatspreader together.
> This will cause your IHS to make direct contact with outer heatspreader - therefore the thinest possible layer of CLU should be applied on the IHS.
> Of course Intel uses a crapload of special thermalpaste on the IHS because it is done by machines and it has to be 'foul-prove' because sane people don't delid their 300 bucks chips
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Benjiw How did you mount your block on the naked chip? Did you remove the socket bracket and placed washers?
> I tried using the special EKWB Ivy Naked mount screw set but I had no luck with it - my temps were rising steadily to 50+ idle
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This was with normal waterblock orientation - not the goofy sideways mount.
> 
> I think it didn't make proper contact somehow but fastening the bolts even tighter gave my ram POST issues because I mounted it too tight.
> Let me know if you find any solutions cause I am of course curious
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> My ram etc is fine, but I can't even go near 1.3v without IBT AVX throttling the chip, I've spoken to a member here who uses IBT AVX and his temps on bare mount don't exceed 70c at 5ghz it is an ivy but still. I'm going to inspect my block and see what is going on.
Click to expand...

You already asked that question (post # 30201). It was shared that you are not supposed to use more liquid metal. One 4670K hot core could be many results from bad application, slipping block, air bubble, or physical die damage. Try again is my opinion.

What is the difference in temperatures between cores comparatively? Sixes? Sevens?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> You already asked that question (post # 30201). It was shared that you are not supposed to use more liquid metal. One 4670K hot core could be many results from bad application, slipping block, air bubble, or physical die damage. Try again is my opinion.
> 
> What is the difference in temperatures between cores comparatively? Sixes? Sevens?


9c between the hottest core and the coolest, and the temp has been getting worse since I last asked that hence me asking again, once I reapplied a touch more CLU and remounted my temps where fine, again and please ask me to repeat myself if you're not following... Since then my temps have been getting worse as I've been stressing my chip to find the correct voltages for my overclock @ 90c+ but never over 95c on the hottest core. This is a completely different question to the one I asked prior.

My last question was is it possible to use too little CLU which the answer was yes, it is.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> My last question was is it possible to use too little CLU which the answer was yes, it is.


No it is not possible to apply a too thin layer of CLU.

I've reapplied CLU to my delid 4690K with the thinnest layer I could possible get.
It took me about 5 to 10 minutes to smear the CLU out as thin as humanly possible with that horrible brush.
I grabbed a pair of scissors and cut off about 75% of the brush so as little as possible CLU was lost in the process.

My temperatures are really great with my custom loop, I can crank up the Vcore to 1.4 for a 4.8 / 4.9 Ghz overclock and get a max temp of 66 in prime95 27.7









With the bigger layer of CLU my temps were about 3C higher in full load and about equal in IDLE.
This was however really close to my margin of error so I'll have to test it again some time.. I need better/more equipment to measure it more precise.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> No it is not possible to apply a too thin layer of CLU.
> 
> I've reapplied CLU to my delid 4690K with the thinnest layer I could possible get.
> It took me about 5 to 10 minutes to smear the CLU out as thin as humanly possible with that horrible brush.
> I grabbed a pair of scissors and cut off about 75% of the brush so as little as possible CLU was lost in the process.
> 
> My temperatures are really great with my custom loop, I can crank up the Vcore to 1.4 for a 4.8 / 4.9 Ghz overclock and get a max temp of 66 in prime95 27.7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> With the bigger layer of CLU my temps were about 3C higher in full load and about equal in IDLE.
> This was however really close to my margin of error so I'll have to test it again some time.. I need better/more equipment to measure it more precise.


It is because I've already proved it is. Sorry but on my first attempt at using CLU I didn't use enough, I added the smallest amount more to my application and it fixed the issue I originally had. I also did the same to my brushes.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It is because I've already proved it is. Sorry but on my first attempt at using CLU I didn't use enough, I added the smallest amount more to my application and it fixed the issue I originally had. I also did the same to my brushes.


Hmm alright, strange. I guess no chip is the same








What CPU are you using?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I am going to stop answering questions a minute because sometimes I feel like Tier 1 support just throwing some automated garbage out there. But he is using a 4670k, that is having problems.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I am going to stop answering questions a minute because sometimes I feel like Tier 1 support just throwing some automated garbage out there. But he is using a 4670k, that is having problems.


There is no damage to the die, I'm using the EK naked mount kit, I'm an ex mechanic, I know how to tighten things down correctly and evenly lol. Yes it is a 4670k currently sat at 4.9ghz I read very carefully on using CLU before using it and applied the thinest layer of TIM I've ever used in my life until the application was smooth and even with no bumps or beading and one of my cores hit the thermal limit (100c) until I used more CLU it dropped right down as we all saw in the results I posted when I asked if it was possible to use too little CLU.

All I asked was is it possible since that my temps are getting worse since I fixed my original issue, that repeated heating and cooling of the chip could dry out some of the CLU so I can just pull the block off and reapply, I don't see what the issue is?


----------



## 0ldChicken

@Benjiw I'm using phyobia lm so it may be different but I too saw an increase in temps after a while. I popped my top again and found most of the liquid to be quite dry. I applied a very slightly thicker layer and saw even better temps than originally. That was about a month ago and I haven't seen an increase since then


----------



## inedenimadam

Needing a reapplication of LM is not unheard of. I have been doing it two or three times a year for a couple years now on my naked 3570k. It does seem odd that you are seeing temps rising this soon after your initial application though...it hasn't even been more than a month. You are running awfully hot.

On a side note, I just switched from CLU to PLM (PLM is $6 a tube instead of $15), the application was a bit more difficult, but the temps seem to be practically identical. I did however see HUGE gains switching from EKs provided TIM (GC eXtreme I think?) on my GPU blocks...the dang things stay within 3C of H2O temps now...love this stuff.


----------



## chronicfx

You should reapply whenever you shift or remove your heatsink or water-block as you probably disturbed the application. But no, it does not expire or wear out. It is a metal and will last 100's of years.


----------



## Bitemarks and bloodstains

Finally got around to delidding my 4790K.




Got a 24c drop on the hottest core
Before

After


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bitemarks and bloodstains*
> 
> Finally got around to delidding my 4790K.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a 24c drop on the hottest core
> Before
> 
> After


One of us! One of us!


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Socket my good sir.


I had the same problem I cut the socket down







made very hard to mount the block


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I had the same problem I cut the socket down
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> made very hard to mount the block


One of the CPU socket pins look slightly bent lower at the bottom right of the image if you haven't noticed.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> One of the CPU socket pins look slightly bent lower at the bottom right of the image if you haven't noticed.


you're right I didn't cause any issues when I last had it up and running could have been the one of the ones I straighten when I slipped with the razor cutting the socket down
also it is an ivy socket.


----------



## Gruelius

Man this was worthwhile.. Delidded my 3570k. Have been able to add so far 500mhz and .2V and my load is still ~20 deg under what it used to be.. Not sure how stable it is yet though haha

Did it using a vice and 3 bits of wood, no hammer.

Are intel going to address this in the near future? cant believe the difference it made.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gruelius*
> 
> Man this was worthwhile.. Delidded my 3570k. Have been able to add so far 500mhz and .2V and my load is still ~20 deg under what it used to be.. Not sure how stable it is yet though haha
> 
> Did it using a vice and 3 bits of wood, no hammer.
> 
> Are intel going to address this in the near future? cant believe the difference it made.


I think recent skylake chips are much better. They seem to have made the IHS a little less elevated so that the contact with the die is higher (but if you delid now you risk cracking the die, without the glue to hold it apart). And of course haswell-e is still soldered and cools even better than a delid chip.


----------



## bluej511

So i was totally bored and thought id try this (yes i have too much time to kill haha). My test is using AC Syndicate as it taxes both gpu/cpu and gets the water temp the hottest it could be. Just doing intel burn test ive dropped 7°C or so, while gaming I've dropped 5°C. Now this is using Noctua TIM on both the die and IHS. Went from around 50-51°C to around 45-46°C. Seeing all these crazy temp drops i was hoping for more but it seems like the i5s run cool enough already. This was at 4.2ghz and 1.088v, not a crazy overclock i know. I will be getting the EKWB Naked Ivy mounting screws next and will be able to direct mount it to the die, then will see what the temps drop from that as well. For the sake of accuracy i will keep using the Noctua TIM.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> So i was totally bored and thought id try this (yes i have too much time to kill haha). My test is using AC Syndicate as it taxes both gpu/cpu and gets the water temp the hottest it could be. Just doing intel burn test ive dropped 7°C or so, while gaming I've dropped 5°C. Now this is using Noctua TIM on both the die and IHS. Went from around 50-51°C to around 45-46°C. Seeing all these crazy temp drops i was hoping for more but it seems like the i5s run cool enough already. This was at 4.2ghz and 1.088v, not a crazy overclock i know. I will be getting the EKWB Naked Ivy mounting screws next and will be able to direct mount it to the die, then will see what the temps drop from that as well. For the sake of accuracy i will keep using the Noctua TIM.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Looking good.
Really personally I do recommend using liquid metal if your heatsync will not be degenerated by their chemical bonds.
This comment from when and if you decide to add GPU's on your cooling loop, I also anticipate loving the temperature headroom when that increases the water temperature.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Looking good.
> Really personally I do recommend using liquid metal if your heatsync will not be degenerated by their chemical bonds.
> This comment from when and if you decide to add GPU's on your cooling loop, I also anticipate loving the temperature headroom when that increases the water temperature.


GPU already stays below 45C so no worries there. I didn't lose much deliding it but from what ive seen the 4690k doesnt heat up that much to improve anyways. I did order the ek screws so going to run it bare die this week or next week. Ive heard that liquid pro eats the water block though so i might just stay with a TIM, a few degrees dif wont matter. Might give thermal grizzly a try.


----------



## Hoodcom

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bitemarks and bloodstains*
> 
> Finally got around to delidding my 4790K.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a 24c drop on the hottest core
> Before
> 
> After


Wow, quite a nice drop there!









What thermal compound of choice did you use here?


----------



## Bitemarks and bloodstains

CLU on the die and kryonaught on the IHS.


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bitemarks and bloodstains*
> 
> CLU on the die and kryonaught on the IHS.


Same here, CLU and Grizzly Kryonaut.. Lovely combination


----------



## bluej511

I ordered EKs naked ivy screws, will see if i get a better temp drop then 5-8degrees haha.


----------



## sav4

Those of you that have delided soldered CPUs with the vice style how warm did you get the ihs ?


----------



## stin0

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Those of you that have delided soldered CPUs with the vice style how warm did you get the ihs ?


Delidding a soldered CPU is quite brave/stupid, lets hope this doesn't happen


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stin0*
> 
> Delidding a soldered CPU is quite brave/stupid, lets hope this doesn't happen


It's a old cpu I'm playing around with ?


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Those of you that have delided soldered CPUs with the vice style how warm did you get the ihs ?


Here is my video guide for soldered CPUs.
There isn't much of a need to delid soldered CPUs other than for the sake of "science" or for 2009 Mac Pro upgrades.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Here is my video guide for soldered CPUs.
> There isn't much of a need to delid soldered CPUs other than for the sake of "science" or for 2009 Mac Pro upgrades.


Thanks dune pilot ?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Here is my video guide for soldered CPUs.
> There isn't much of a need to delid soldered CPUs other than for the sake of "science" or for 2009 Mac Pro upgrades.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks dune pilot ?
Click to expand...

Cool video, I like it. Looked like red in the glove, heal well if I am not mistaken, plus more videos of neat ideas.


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Cool video, I like it. Looked like red in the glove, heal well if I am not mistaken, plus more videos of neat ideas.


Thanks. Yeah, I nicked myself a little bit while filming it lol.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Cool video, I like it. Looked like red in the glove, heal well if I am not mistaken, plus more videos of neat ideas.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. Yeah, I nicked myself a little bit while filming it lol.
Click to expand...

I guess since this was a 'required' mod, you probably dont have any temperature comparisons?

I have toyed with the idea a few times to run naked, but keep talking myself down because I have high doubts if I will even see even a single degree of difference.


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I guess since this was a 'required' mod, you probably dont have any temperature comparisons?
> 
> I have toyed with the idea a few times to run naked, but keep talking myself down because I have high doubts if I will even see even a single degree of difference.


Yeah, there's pretty much zero reason to delid a soldered cpu for temps. I didn't test before and after but it would probably be within margin of error and pointless. There wasn't much info at all about doing it so I figured someone needed to make some videos showing it done. In my case it was strictly for a Mac Pro build. I have a build log on LTT, it's the same one down in my sig.

https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/509850-build-log-logix-logicworx-dual-x5690-mac-pro-audio-workstation/


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> within margin of error and pointless.


My hopes and dreams:
http://gifsoup.com/view/1898990/balloon-deflate.html


----------



## jdorje

There was a guy many pages back with an old soldered xeon on which one core was basically not cooled. A rma discard or something I'd guess. But he did get better temps with delid.


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> My hopes and dreams:
> http://gifsoup.com/view/1898990/balloon-deflate.html


I did test with an i7 960, since I could care less if I ruined it... it was the test dummy before I tore into the high priced Xeons. I didn't bother to log the info down, I still have the chip but unfortunately I'm about to sell my X58 system so I doubt I test it thorough enough to actually log the info down for a worthwhile video/post/thread about the benefits. If I remember right @DR4G00N has one, maybe he could comment on temp difference.


----------



## RabbitRu

I delided my old e4300 and it doesn't boot then IHS is off (with IHS on everything is ok) any ideas how to fix this?
My mb is Asrock G31M-GS R2.0 and I dont know model of my cooler its just a piece of copper







(I'm going to underclock and undervolt this cpu so it will run passive) and I do not use a case.


----------



## RickRockerr

Submitting my brand new skylake.








OCN name: RickRockerr
CPU: 6700K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: +400Hz (for now)
OC after delid: 4.6GHz http://valid.x86.fr/gg77ju
Temp drops: Have no idea. Delidded this straight from the box.


----------



## Awsan

As this is the only place i can get some answers about pointless scary stuff







, after delidding i went and tried to lapp my CPU IHS and CPU cooler and Used liquid ultra under the IHS and above the IHS and after two days i wanted to re-paste so i cleaned it and noticed that some of the metal TIM infused with my IHS and Cooler does that mean that there were big holes that the TIM filled? will it make it better if i apply another TIM with out sanding the metal TIM residue?

And how can i test if my lapping was done in the right way?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> As this is the only place i can get some answers about pointless scary stuff
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> , after delidding i went and tried to lapp my CPU IHS and CPU cooler and Used liquid ultra under the IHS and above the IHS and after two days i wanted to re-paste so i cleaned it and noticed that some of the metal TIM infused with my IHS and Cooler does that mean that there were big holes that the TIM filled? will it make it better if i apply another TIM with out sanding the metal TIM residue?
> 
> And how can i test if my lapping was done in the right way?


Copper will absorb some of the liquid metal, its mostly surface stuff, dont bother sanding it off, just clean it real good and reapply. It doesn't mean you had big holes, just that copper doesn't play as nice as nickel with gallium.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RickRockerr*
> 
> Submitting my brand new skylake.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: RickRockerr
> CPU: 6700K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: MX4
> Mhz gained: +400Hz (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.6GHz http://valid.x86.fr/gg77ju
> Temp drops: Have no idea. Delidded this straight from the box.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









Also the First Skylake, unless I missed one... >.> which might have happened....


----------



## RickRockerr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also the First Skylake, unless I missed one... >.> which might have happened....


Finally first!







I was #8 with my 4790K.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RabbitRu*
> 
> I delided my old e4300 and it doesn't boot then IHS is off (with IHS on everything is ok) any ideas how to fix this?
> My mb is Asrock G31M-GS R2.0 and I dont know model of my cooler its just a piece of copper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (I'm going to underclock and undervolt this cpu so it will run passive) and I do not use a case.


Mounting pressure. You need to measure how tall the heatspreader is and adjust for that.


----------



## HMRMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> So i was totally bored and thought id try this (yes i have too much time to kill haha). My test is using AC Syndicate as it taxes both gpu/cpu and gets the water temp the hottest it could be. Just doing intel burn test ive dropped 7°C or so, while gaming I've dropped 5°C. Now this is using Noctua TIM on both the die and IHS. Went from around 50-51°C to around 45-46°C. Seeing all these crazy temp drops i was hoping for more but it seems like the i5s run cool enough already. This was at 4.2ghz and 1.088v, not a crazy overclock i know. I will be getting the EKWB Naked Ivy mounting screws next and will be able to direct mount it to the die, then will see what the temps drop from that as well. For the sake of accuracy i will keep using the Noctua TIM.


If you keep this setup for a while, could you try to see if the Noctua on the die is failing in some way? Mine kept pumping away within a couple of weeks, leaving shiny clean areas on the die and IHS, and ruining an otherwise awesome drop of up to 20 degrees C under load. No issues with the paste at the water block though.
It annoyed me enough to mix some fusible alloy with regular leaded solder to form some sort of DIY Indigo Xtreme. 8 months of cool running as of now.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HMRMike*
> 
> If you keep this setup for a while, could you try to see if the Noctua on the die is failing in some way? Mine kept pumping away within a couple of weeks, leaving shiny clean areas on the die and IHS, and ruining an otherwise awesome drop of up to 20 degrees C under load.
> It annoyed me enough to mix some fusible alloy with regular leaded solder to form some sort of DIY Indigo Xtreme. 8 months of cool running as of now.


Was that 20C bare die or with the IHS on? Right now i have it with the IHS on and waiting for my screws to get here so i can go bare die, i didnt drop 20C i only dropped 5C but im at 1.088v only. Its now gone up from 45C to 55C so yea its pumping away. Gonna do it bare die then replace it with Kyronaut when my store has it back in stock. So yes Noctua bare die=bad idea haha


----------



## HMRMike

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Was that 20C bare die or with the IHS on? Right now i have it with the IHS on and waiting for my screws to get here so i can go bare die, i didnt drop 20C i only dropped 5C but im at 1.088v only. Its now gone up from 45C to 55C so yea its pumping away. Gonna do it bare die then replace it with Kyronaut when my store has it back in stock. So yes Noctua bare die=bad idea haha


IHS on. "Lidded" 4670K was hitting 80 degrees under intel's test. Well, it's also hot as hell where I live.
I just came here to see if anyone else did anything moronic as I did since my first post, still didn't find anyone but it does work








http://cdn.overclock.net/2/2e/2e217dd5_ibahwvKdzRs3IJ.jpeg


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HMRMike*
> 
> IHS on. "Lidded" 4670K was hitting 80 degrees under intel's test. Well, it's also hot as hell where I live.
> I just came here to see if anyone else did anything moronic as I did since my first post, still didn't find anyone but it does work
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://cdn.overclock.net/2/2e/2e217dd5_ibahwvKdzRs3IJ.jpeg


Someone did an extensive test of TIMs on bare die. Noctua had amazing results BUT durability was poor. I only dropped 5°C deliding it and putting noctua on it, wasn't expecting huge drops as my voltage is crazy low. I am hoping however that going bare die ill drop a few more. Im gonna test it with Noctua for the sake of testing purposes, the variable only being the IHS. Then ill be replacing with Kryonaut or something thicker then noctua. Id go clu/clp but honestly it def isn't as copper friendly as people seem to think. If i was keeping the IHS on id def put it in between. My screws are coming from the UK to France, its been 2 weeks and haven't gotten em yet. If i knew it would take 2 weeks i would have ordered clu and put it between the die and ihs but im liking the bare die idea, one less material and tim to go thru.


----------



## scgeek12

add me







not sure if I am doing this right? but-

OCN name: scgeek12
CPU: 6700K
On-die TIM: Cool laboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
Mhz gained: +200Hz (for now)
OC after delid: 4.7Ghz
Temp drop- 23C on the hottest core while running prime95 maximum heat test, also I had a 20+C temp split between my hottest core and coolest before and its down to 7C now




Edit- the +200 is with my water chiller off, I gained nothing with it on lol! I guess chilled is chilled :/ (Hailea HC500-A water chiller)


----------



## benjamen50

So I decided my cpu weeks and ago and it went fine no issues. Now my computer keeps turning off and on after it got too hot and the thermal protection tripped. How do I stop this from happening? CPU temps were fine during stress test? Did the CLU somehow suddenly have bad contact now?

Edit: Never mind. BIOS panicked.

Got it working.


----------



## bluej511

So my EKWB Naked Ivy screws finally arrived after about a 2 week wait. The seller on ebay refunded me 3 days ago as after 2 weeks its deemed lost. They arrived today, stupid me didnt wait and ordered another set from EK as i thought they were lost so looks like ill be getting a free set of Naked Ivy mounting screws. Might sell em or give em away who knows.

Temps after delid went from 50°C to 45°C on NH-T1, after a couple weeks seems like it pressed out and went to around 53-54°C tested this morning at 4.2ghz/1.088v. Now running it bare die with the same tim (for consistency of testing) it peaks out at 43°C with an ambient a few degrees warmer, if we take that into account same testing temps as the other other ones would probably be 40-41°C.

So someone said going from delided to bare die made no difference but i dropped 4-5°C going from delided to bare die so yes it does make a difference AND this is at quite a low voltage, would prob be even more so at higher voltages. Core 1-3 have identical temps with core 4 running at 39°C instead of 42-43°C. Installation was super easy as all i had to do was replace 4 screws and removed the IHS bracket. star key included. Heres some pics. Seems like for whoever wants to run bare die you need to drop the block/cooler about 2mm. The ihs is about 2.5mm thick seems like the cpu presses down .5mm into the socket which is very very small.

Factory EK thickness (the .7mm plastic washers are still used of course)


Naked ivy thickness.


Installed bare die.


Block installed. (was cleaned this morning as it had gunked up from my last radiator switching around setup)


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> So my EKWB Naked Ivy screws finally arrived after about a 2 week wait. The seller on ebay refunded me 3 days ago as after 2 weeks its deemed lost. They arrived today, stupid me didnt wait and ordered another set from EK as i thought they were lost so looks like ill be getting a free set of Naked Ivy mounting screws. Might sell em or give em away who knows.
> 
> Temps after delid went from 50°C to 45°C on NH-T1, after a couple weeks seems like it pressed out and went to around 53-54°C tested this morning at 4.2ghz/1.088v. Now running it bare die with the same tim (for consistency of testing) it peaks out at 43°C with an ambient a few degrees warmer, if we take that into account same testing temps as the other other ones would probably be 40-41°C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> So someone said going from delided to bare die made no difference but i dropped 4-5°C going from delided to bare die so yes it does make a difference AND this is at quite a low voltage, would prob be even more so at higher voltages. Core 1-3 have identical temps with core 4 running at 39°C instead of 42-43°C. Installation was super easy as all i had to do was replace 4 screws and removed the IHS bracket. star key included. Heres some pics. Seems like for whoever wants to run bare die you need to drop the block/cooler about 2mm. The ihs is about 2.5mm thick seems like the cpu presses down .5mm into the socket which is very very small.
> 
> Factory EK thickness (the .7mm plastic washers are still used of course)
> 
> 
> Naked ivy thickness.
> 
> 
> Installed bare die.
> 
> 
> Block installed. (was cleaned this morning as it had gunked up from my last radiator switching around setup)


I can pump 1.5v into my 4670k and still have thermal headroom lol, I love the low temps on my chip, going naked was the best decision I made with my haswell chip. Still waiting on a cheap 4790k.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I can pump 1.5v into my 4670k and still have thermal headroom lol, I love the low temps on my chip, going naked was the best decision I made with my haswell chip. Still waiting on a cheap 4790k.


Ive got 2 rads on mine but also have an r9 390 to cool, if i was just doing a cpu loop without my restrictive alphacool block my temps would prob be even lower. Right now at 1.155v (what i have it set in bios) doing a 15min intel burn test it reaches 49°C and its stable. At 1.14v it would blue screen.

I went from 54°C on my nh-u14s at 1.088v to 49°C watercooled at 1.155v, the ambient was quite a bit lower when i ran that Noctua as summer has already hit southern France a week ago. Could prob take off 3-4°C off my temps now to compare to the Noctua. So id be 10°C cooler with more voltage.

I might contact a few TIM manufacturers see if i can get some samples and see whats best for bare die. I had nh-t1 tim on my delid and it didnt last long before pressing out and running hotter then before. I might try Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. Id love try CLP or CLU but don't feel like lapping my waterblock to clean it up.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ive got 2 rads on mine but also have an r9 390 to cool, if i was just doing a cpu loop without my restrictive alphacool block my temps would prob be even lower. Right now at 1.155v (what i have it set in bios) doing a 15min intel burn test it reaches 49°C and its stable. At 1.14v it would blue screen.
> 
> I went from 54°C on my nh-u14s at 1.088v to 49°C watercooled at 1.155v, the ambient was quite a bit lower when i ran that Noctua as summer has already hit southern France a week ago. Could prob take off 3-4°C off my temps now to compare to the Noctua. So id be 10°C cooler with more voltage.
> 
> I might contact a few TIM manufacturers see if i can get some samples and see whats best for bare die. I had nh-t1 tim on my delid and it didnt last long before pressing out and running hotter then before. I might try Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. Id love try CLP or CLU but don't feel like lapping my waterblock to clean it up.


I have CLU on the bottom of my nickel block and it hasn't dried up or stained yet, time will tell but people in here have said a liquid metal tim is the best choice when using TIM on the die, I thought CLU was going to be a nightmare but It's actually been a pleasure to use compared to normal TIM, maybe I'm just weird lol.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I have CLU on the bottom of my nickel block and it hasn't dried up or stained yet, time will tell but people in here have said a liquid metal tim is the best choice when using TIM on the die, I thought CLU was going to be a nightmare but It's actually been a pleasure to use compared to normal TIM, maybe I'm just weird lol.


Could be because its nickel. ive seen a few instances where it didn't fare too well against copper. Then again the block is pure copper no plating or anything could be why.


----------



## scgeek12

@Valgaur
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scgeek12*
> 
> add me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not sure if I am doing this right? but-
> 
> OCN name: scgeek12
> CPU: 6700K
> On-die TIM: Cool laboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: +200Hz (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.7Ghz
> Temp drop- 23C on the hottest core while running prime95 maximum heat test, also I had a 20+C temp split between my hottest core and coolest before and its down to 7C now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit- the +200 is with my water chiller off, I gained nothing with it on lol! I guess chilled is chilled :/ (Hailea HC500-A water chiller)


Bump


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scgeek12*
> 
> add me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not sure if I am doing this right? but-
> 
> OCN name: scgeek12
> CPU: 6700K
> On-die TIM: Cool laboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
> Mhz gained: +200Hz (for now)
> OC after delid: 4.7Ghz
> Temp drop- 23C on the hottest core while running prime95 maximum heat test, also I had a 20+C temp split between my hottest core and coolest before and its down to 7C now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit- the +200 is with my water chiller off, I gained nothing with it on lol! I guess chilled is chilled :/ (Hailea HC500-A water chiller)


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scgeek12*
> 
> @Valgaur
> Bump


My bad, I've been swamped at work and school lately. Only so many hours in a day


----------



## scgeek12

haha all good sorry for being impatient







, woohoo


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ive got 2 rads on mine but also have an r9 390 to cool, if i was just doing a cpu loop without my restrictive alphacool block my temps would prob be even lower. Right now at 1.155v (what i have it set in bios) doing a 15min intel burn test it reaches 49°C and its stable. At 1.14v it would blue screen.
> 
> I went from 54°C on my nh-u14s at 1.088v to 49°C watercooled at 1.155v, the ambient was quite a bit lower when i ran that Noctua as summer has already hit southern France a week ago. Could prob take off 3-4°C off my temps now to compare to the Noctua. So id be 10°C cooler with more voltage.
> 
> I might contact a few TIM manufacturers see if i can get some samples and see whats best for bare die. I had nh-t1 tim on my delid and it didnt last long before pressing out and running hotter then before. I might try Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. Id love try CLP or CLU but don't feel like lapping my waterblock to clean it up.


Your temps are high but your GPU block is not the problem here, it's the TIM you are using, you are supposed to use CLU over the DIE and nothing else for best temperatures.
I have the same GPU block you do, and my temps are almost the same as yours even though I'm at 1.46V.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Your temps are high but your GPU block is not the problem here, it's the TIM you are using, you are supposed to use CLU over the DIE and nothing else for best temperatures.
> I have the same GPU block you do, and my temps are almost the same as yours even though I'm at 1.46V.


Since this man follows me around and fails to read or understand basic English here we go.

"It can be seen that all but two of the blocks have similarly low restriction. Alphacool's block has the worst restriction by far. At 1GPM it has over 4.5PSI of back pressure. This is really really high. In other words adding this block in your loop *will* effect your flow rate negatively. The cooling performance of your radiators might suffer and the cooling performance of your CPU block may also suffer. The money you might save buying this may be necessary to apply towards a second pump in order to run it at a decent flow rate."

http://www.xtremerigs.net/2015/04/03/alphacool-nexxxos-gpx-gtx-980-m02-with-backplate-review/2/

Now again, write back and tell me how wrong i am. Then go write an extensive stalkish email to extremerigs and tell them that they are also wrong.

AND YES I KNOW THATS FOR THE 980, THE R9 390 AND R9 390 BLOCKS AND ALL GPX BLOCKS USE THE SAME IDENTICAL GPU COOLER. THE R9 390 BLOCK IS JUST AS RESTRICTIVE SO YES IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE. CONSIDERING OUR SETUPS ARE VASTLY DIFFERENT PLEASE STOP TALKING. LOADS OF PEOPLE HAVE SAID USING CLU/CLP ON A BARE COPPER BLOCK ENDS UP BEING A PITA. NOBODY CARES WHAT YOUR TEMPS ARE RUNNING AT 1.46V


----------



## Stige

I think you missed the part where I said I got the same GPU block myself? But my temps are way better even with IHS on? And you got more radiator space too than I do as far as I'm aware? I only got one 360.

Should always use CLU between the DIE and IHS or block if you are naked.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> Your temps are high but your GPU block is not the problem here, it's the TIM you are using, you are supposed to use CLU over the DIE and nothing else for best temperatures.
> I have the same GPU block you do, and my temps are almost the same as yours even though I'm at 1.46V.
> 
> 
> 
> Since this man follows me around and fails to read or understand basic English here we go.
> 
> "It can be seen that all but two of the blocks have similarly low restriction. Alphacool's block has the worst restriction by far. At 1GPM it has over 4.5PSI of back pressure. This is really really high. In other words adding this block in your loop *will* effect your flow rate negatively. The cooling performance of your radiators might suffer and the cooling performance of your CPU block may also suffer. The money you might save buying this may be necessary to apply towards a second pump in order to run it at a decent flow rate."
> 
> http://www.xtremerigs.net/2015/04/03/alphacool-nexxxos-gpx-gtx-980-m02-with-backplate-review/2/
> 
> Now again, write back and tell me how wrong i am. Then go write an extensive stalkish email to extremerigs and tell them that they are also wrong.
> 
> AND YES I KNOW THATS FOR THE 980, THE R9 390 AND R9 390 BLOCKS AND ALL GPX BLOCKS USE THE SAME IDENTICAL GPU COOLER. THE R9 390 BLOCK IS JUST AS RESTRICTIVE SO YES IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE. CONSIDERING OUR SETUPS ARE VASTLY DIFFERENT PLEASE STOP TALKING.
> 
> 
> LOADS OF PEOPLE HAVE SAID USING CLU/CLP ON A BARE COPPER BLOCK ENDS UP BEING A PITA.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> NOBODY CARES WHAT YOUR TEMPS ARE RUNNING AT 1.46V
Click to expand...

Why is staining a copper block such an issue if cooling ability remains the same, vanity? This is spillover from another thread?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Why is staining a copper block such an issue if cooling ability remains the same, vanity? This is spillover from another thread?


Kinda to the second part haha.

From what ive seen on bare copper (which is what my ek block is) it ends up being uneven afterwords it leaves small crevices and what not. And only way to get a smooth flat surface would be to lap the block.

I might eventually give it a shot but honestly if its just a few degrees difference between a LM and a paste its not worth it for me anyways.

He also compares his temps to mine which we have 2 completely different cpus. Compared to ivy bridge and sandy devils canyon just doesnt run that hot, the temp differences aren't as huge between delided and factory tim.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Why is staining a copper block such an issue if cooling ability remains the same, vanity? This is spillover from another thread?
> 
> 
> 
> Kinda to the second part haha.
> 
> From what ive seen on bare copper (which is what my ek block is) it ends up being uneven afterwords it leaves small crevices and what not. And only way to get a smooth flat surface would be to lap the block.
> 
> I might eventually give it a shot but honestly if its just a few degrees difference between a LM and a paste its not worth it for me anyways.
> 
> He also compares his temps to mine which we have 2 completely different cpus. Compared to ivy bridge and sandy devils canyon just doesnt run that hot, the temp differences aren't as huge between delided and factory tim.
Click to expand...

From what I see I might have the same EK Supremacy Evo Copper block as you. It does certainly stain when used with clu and a naked mount. I am not sure it has lost any smoothness. I try to remove the mount while the clu is warm.

Understandably your stress is expressed though.


----------



## Stige

It takes about 3 minutes to lap the block to be flat again...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> From what I see I might have the same EK Supremacy Evo Copper block as you. It does certainly stain when used with clu and a naked mount. I am not sure it has lost any smoothness. I try to remove the mount while the clu is warm.
> 
> Understandably your stress is expressed though.


The naked screws were cheap enough so i thought hey lets try it. For consistency im using the same TIM. At 1.155v i went from 52°C delided to 47°C naked die. Ambient temp is a few degrees hotter then when i tested it delided so it def dropped a few degrees. CLU or Conductonaut might drop it a few more. The devils canyon dont seem to benefit much from a delid unless running high voltages, thats what i can see from the list anyways.


----------



## usoldier

Just wanted to say that aplying CLU to my delided 3770k fixed all that termalpumping issue i was having now after 4 weeks the temperature remains stable


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *usoldier*
> 
> Just wanted to say that aplying CLU to my delided 3770k fixed all that termalpumping issue i was having now after 4 weeks the temperature remains stable


That is how it's done







Real men use CLU!


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> From what I see I might have the same EK Supremacy Evo Copper block as you. It does certainly stain when used with clu and a naked mount. I am not sure it has lost any smoothness. I try to remove the mount while the clu is warm.
> 
> Understandably your stress is expressed though.
> 
> 
> 
> The naked screws were cheap enough so i thought hey lets try it. For consistency im using the same TIM. At 1.155v i went from 52°C delided to 47°C naked die. Ambient temp is a few degrees hotter then when i tested it delided so it def dropped a few degrees. CLU or Conductonaut might drop it a few more. The devils canyon dont seem to benefit much from a delid unless running high voltages, thats what i can see from the list anyways.
Click to expand...

Sure as I do also conclude the I5 4690k does not stray temperature wise from idle depending on what TIM is used.

The issue in your statement I find incorrect is that their benefit does rely on low and also quite high voltages. My processor can spike from 800mhz to 4.8plus gigahertz including voltages to maintain stability, and saying that the processor does not benefit from a delid plus a certain liquid metal is false, from my tests.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Sure as I do also conclude the I5 4690k does not stray temperature wise from idle depending on what TIM is used.
> 
> The issue in your statement I find incorrect is that their benefit does rely on low and also quite high voltages. My processor can spike from 800mhz to 4.8plus gigahertz including voltages to maintain stability, and saying that the processor does not benefit from a delid plus a certain liquid metal is false, from my tests.


Never said it didnt benefit its just no where near ivy or sandy bridge. The 4790 seems to get way better results then the 4690. Skylake is even better as the vrms arent on the chip anymore so they run even cooler. I looked at mine carefully and with a straight edge my ihs was perfectly flat. There wasnt much glue either. The tim intel uses isnt the issue either as its better then most other tims. There was a thread about that before. Seems like intel did a better job with the 4690 then the 4790 from what ive gathered in the delid list. Not many 4690ks are delided seems to be way more 4790s.

Im running cooler bare die with more voltages then i was before without the delid so its a win win. Runs cooler then my nh-u14s did at factory speeds as well so im happy.


----------



## inedenimadam

Devils canyon is better, intel specifically addressed the issue of heat and thermal paste. However, it is still a far cry from any liquid metal thermal paste, they would of had to solder the chips down to meet or beat liquid metal. If I had devils canyon, I absolutely would take its head off and run it naked with liquid metal. The temp difference between liquid metal and any traditional or even high grade thermal paste is just too large to leave on the table. But I moved to the HEDT where they are soldered. Still using LM on both GPUs and the 5820k! Next build I will be back mainstream and naked, this capping out at 4.5 with high temps and high voltage is for the birds.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Devils canyon is better, intel specifically addressed the issue of heat and thermal paste. However, it is still a far cry from any liquid metal thermal paste, they would of had to solder the chips down to meet or beat liquid metal. If I had devils canyon, I absolutely would take its head off and run it naked with liquid metal. The temp difference between liquid metal and any traditional or even high grade thermal paste is just too large to leave on the table. But I moved to the HEDT where they are soldered. Still using LM on both GPUs and the 5820k! Next build I will be back mainstream and naked, this capping out at 4.5 with high temps and high voltage is for the birds.


Yea using anything liquid metal is effectively like using solder. I just don't see my temps dropping another 10°C if i switched to LM haha. Maybe 5°C tops. I might eventually give it a shot but honestly it runs cool enough. My gpu hover around 40°C at full load, even using LM on that wouldn't net me much. There's no way the GPU would run at 35°C with a water temp of 32°C i just don't see it.

Most people dont understand how w/mk even works. There number difference is so massive because the measurement is in Kelvin. If you convert it to C Kryonaut ends up being 0.12w/mC compared to a liquid metal which would be 0.36w/mC it doesnt seem that significant. The issue i have is even a LM by thermal grizzly which is rated at 86w/mK compared to CLU or CLP the results were only within a margin of error.


----------



## MK-Professor

why intel don't use better thermal paste between the die and the IHS?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MK-Professor*
> 
> why intel don't use better thermal paste between the die and the IHS?


Issue isnt the thermal paste its the glue they use, effectively its lifting the IHS off the die and making poor contact. Its why deliding helps so much.


----------



## MK-Professor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Issue isnt the thermal paste its the glue they use, effectively its lifting the IHS off the die and making poor contact. Its why deliding helps so much.


but the glue is not between the die and the IHS but on the edges of the IHS right?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MK-Professor*
> 
> but the glue is not between the die and the IHS but on the edges of the IHS right?


The glue is between IHS and PCB. It effectively lifts the IHS a fraction of a millimeter higher than it should be.

Some people here have claimed that on skylake this is "fixed" by having a lower lift to the PCB. So with the glue in place it makes good contact, but if you remove the glue you risk crushing the die just with the IHS as it doesn't have enough lift.

Regardless, on DC, they say removing the glue (and therefore the lift to the IHS) has as much or more effect as swapping out the TIM for good stuff. Though obviously you would always want to use LM under the IHS as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Why is staining a copper block such an issue if cooling ability remains the same, vanity? This is spillover from another thread?


Haven't done it yet, but the LM is actually dissolving into the copper. Give it enough time and it'll be completely gone and your temps will start rising again until you reapply. So while it might be worthwhile it does have drawbacks. Since using LM between IHS and cooler is a fairly limited benefit you can make an easy argument it's better to have 2C higher temps than to have to reapply CLU every 6 months.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> The glue is between IHS and PCB. It effectively lifts the IHS a fraction of a millimeter higher than it should be.
> 
> Some people here have claimed that on skylake this is "fixed" by having a lower lift to the PCB. So with the glue in place it makes good contact, but if you remove the glue you risk crushing the die just with the IHS as it doesn't have enough lift.
> 
> Regardless, on DC, they say removing the glue (and therefore the lift to the IHS) has as much or more effect as swapping out the TIM for good stuff. Though obviously you would always want to use LM under the IHS as well.
> Haven't done it yet, but the LM is actually dissolving into the copper. Give it enough time and it'll be completely gone and your temps will start rising again until you reapply. So while it might be worthwhile it does have drawbacks. Since using LM between IHS and cooler is a fairly limited benefit you can make an easy argument it's better to have 2C higher temps than to have to reapply CLU every 6 months.


Thank you. Now dont let stige hear you he will say he has no issues. Even though ive seen his block and its etched as well. I might contact CL get a sample for testing since they are in germany. Maybe even contact thermal grizzly get some kryonaut and conductonaut. Its ratef at 86w/mk but performs worse the clu from the lil thats online. Thermal efficiency in the flesh. After a certain amount of heat wont perform any better.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> The glue is between IHS and PCB. It effectively lifts the IHS a fraction of a millimeter higher than it should be.
> 
> Some people here have claimed that on skylake this is "fixed" by having a lower lift to the PCB. So with the glue in place it makes good contact, but if you remove the glue you risk crushing the die just with the IHS as it doesn't have enough lift.
> 
> Regardless, on DC, they say removing the glue (and therefore the lift to the IHS) has as much or more effect as swapping out the TIM for good stuff. Though obviously you would always want to use LM under the IHS as well.
> Haven't done it yet, but the LM is actually dissolving into the copper. Give it enough time and it'll be completely gone and your temps will start rising again until you reapply. So while it might be worthwhile it does have drawbacks. Since using LM between IHS and cooler is a fairly limited benefit you can make an easy argument it's better to have 2C higher temps than to have to reapply CLU every 6 months.


Hmm seems like good theory but can you post some more details and links to evidence to back this up as I'd love to read up on it because skylake is my next step. I use CLU on my die, I have no IHS I threw it in my parts bin and put my nickel block on top, been good ever since tbh.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Haven't done it yet, but the LM is actually dissolving into the copper. Give it enough time and it'll be completely gone and your temps will start rising again until you reapply. So while it might be worthwhile it does have drawbacks. Since using LM between IHS and cooler is a fairly limited benefit you can make an easy argument it's better to have 2C higher temps than to have to reapply CLU every 6 months.


A strong argument, you are telling me there is a reaction going on changing the elemental structure? I monitor my temperatures hourly, and have yet to see the difference coming up on two months now. Good to know there is always an option for relidding. Safe than sorry is smart.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Hmm seems like good theory but can you post some more details and links to evidence to back this up as I'd love to read up on it because skylake is my next step. I use CLU on my die, I have no IHS I threw it in my parts bin and put my nickel block on top, been good ever since tbh.


http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> A strong argument, you are telling me there is a reaction going on changing the elemental structure? I monitor my temperatures hourly, and have yet to see the difference coming up on two months now. Good to know there is always an option for relidding. Safe than sorry is smart.


This happened to me. It isn't fun. I had to scrub my CPU block for like 15 minutes to get a semi clean surface. That being said, I would say there is a noticeable temp difference, at least 5c in my case (CLU to NT-H1). I am definitely going to replace my CPU block in the future. Maybe a HKIV or the upcoming Swiftech SKF.

This effect is pretty interesting and it would be nice to see some tests. Do things like scuffing the cold plate or IHS exacerbate the issue? Are nickle plated blocks less susceptible? etc etc.


----------



## inedenimadam

It is fine to runnaked, using LM with copper, I have been doing it for a couple years now. Yes, some of it absorbs into the block, staining the surface, but since I stopped caring about the color of the underside of my block, and just put it back dirty, the drying out has stopped, and temps dont rise. Its like the copper needs a good primer coat of LM and it will suck that first coat up over a few months, but as long as you dont lap it back off it doesnt matter. I dont have any scientific reason for it, but the last couple times I broke the loop down, the LM was still as juicy as the day I installed it.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Hmm seems like good theory but can you post some more details and links to evidence to back this up as I'd love to read up on it because skylake is my next step. I use CLU on my die, I have no IHS I threw it in my parts bin and put my nickel block on top, been good ever since tbh.


Basically everything i know is straight out of this thread.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> A strong argument, you are telling me there is a reaction going on changing the elemental structure? I monitor my temperatures hourly, and have yet to see the difference coming up on two months now. Good to know there is always an option for relidding. Safe than sorry is smart.


Not a reaction. Metal isn't exactly a solid! The liquid metal is dissolving into copper the same way water might dissolve into rice.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=34053183


Of course using noctua paste on the die will give terrible temps. If someone compared clu to intel paste that would actually be helpful.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Basically everything i know is straight out of this thread.
> Not a reaction. Metal isn't exactly a solid! The liquid metal is dissolving into copper the same way water might dissolve into rice.
> Of course using noctua paste on the die will give terrible temps. If someone compared clu to intel paste that would actually be helpful.


You read that wrong. Intel paste did better with the intel glue meaning the intel tim is thick in consistancy and noctuas isnt. With the gap gone and noctua tim he ended dropping 20C in temps at higher voltages. Once i get my new psu i might try some clu at higher voltages to see if it makes any difference on bare die. Might get 1g of Kryonaut for the sake of it. Thats quite a thick tim as well.


----------



## jdorje

Yes i read the article. The conclusion is the noctua tim is worse than the intel stuff. But this conclusion isn't useful because nobody uses either one.


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Yes i read the article. The conclusion is the noctua tim is worse than the intel stuff. But this conclusion isn't useful because nobody uses either one.


Yeah haha, I was thinking of using Noctua NT-H1 but realised that it's probably bad for long run and better to use CLU instead for long run for CPU die.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Yeah haha, I was thinking of using Noctua NT-H1 but realised that it's probably bad for long run and better to use CLU instead for long run for CPU die.


Its actually one of the best TIMs if used on the IHS. Seems like for anything on die you need something thick or a liquid metal. Im using it right now on my bare die and have no issues, i used it delided and it pressed out like crazy, looking to see if that happens again bare die.


----------



## bluej511

So what ive noticed yesterday putting laquer on the cpu transistors, using the ek naked ivy screws the block sits directly onto the cpu socket, precisely on all 4 corners. So its not even sitting on the actual mounting screws. Seems like theres absolutely no way it could crush anything.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I am happy assuming I can crush something.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I am happy assuming I can crush something.


Can or cant? I got some Hydronaut and clu on order to test. Noctua is def a no no on die. Does fantastic on gpus though but cpu die just doesnt last more then a couple days. Either that or the block is putting too much pressure on the die (first one is more likely as i used it between the die and ihs before) so def NOT recommended.


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Can or cant? I got some Hydronaut and clu on order to test. Noctua is def a no no on die. Does fantastic on gpus though but cpu die just doesnt last more then a couple days. Either that or the block is putting too much pressure on the die (first one is more likely as i used it between the die and ihs before) so def NOT recommended.


That's pretty much the deal with using anything other than liquid metal on the die, for one it won't work as well but it also won't last very long. I want something I can do once and don't have to worry about for a year or two. I don't want to replace it every few days or weeks. I stick with CLU and MX-4. I've heard good things about Gelid GC-Extreme but haven't seen a single comment on how well it held up after a few months. I know MX-4 holds up well. It's been my go to TIM for awhile now for the IHS with CLU for the die.


----------



## bluej511

.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> That's pretty much the deal with using anything other than liquid metal on the die, for one it won't work as well but it also won't last very long. I want something I can do once and don't have to worry about for a year or two. I don't want to replace it every few days or weeks. I stick with CLU and MX-4. I've heard good things about Gelid GC-Extreme but haven't seen a single comment on how well it held up after a few months. I know MX-4 holds up well. It's been my go to TIM for awhile now for the IHS with CLU for the die.


Well im using it bare die so just testing a few ones for the sake of testing. My supremacy evo came with 1g of gc extreme. I used it on my gpu as well and thats holding up perfect, i think using a tim on bare die works great depending on the tim. The pressure seems to be greater on the die then on top of the ihs, unlapped of course. My ihs seems to be extremely flat, my block is convex just a hair. Its why i ordered clu as well to test it against the tims i tried. Ill try Hydronaut and see how it does temps wise and longevity. Ambient temps are rising here already so will take that into account as well.


----------



## bluej511

So my CLU came in this morning, applied it right away. Made absolutely no difference in package temps. Noctua and CLU both gave me 47°C in intel stress test. CLU might def last a lot longer though ill keep my eye out on temps. The noctua just degrades after a couple days, for high pressure its just way too thin.


----------



## jdorje

Why are you running a delidded chip at 47C and why are you doing tests with an overclock that won't show anything significant?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Why are you running a delidded chip at 47C and why are you doing tests with an overclock that won't show anything significant?


What do you mean at 47C what should it run at 75C haha? Everyone makes a big deal about clu so i tested. At 1.2v between that and a tim on bare die it made zero difference. And yes i applied it right. Of course this is only in my case and everyones setup and loop is different.


----------



## jdorje

I simply mean any difference you see in temps will be a proportion of the delta. So yes if you want to compare temps you should be running it at 75C. That will give a lot more precision in the percentage difference. If you do that and still see no difference in temps then that is very interesting. But saying you see no difference at 47C doesn't mean much because that's not a temp anyone would delid to run.

There isn't a whole lot of data on this, I admit. Everyone "knows" lm is far better so nobody bothers testing. But if you're going to test at least do it right.

You're saying you got pump-out on the nh1 within a few days? That's crazy fast!

Many, many pages back someone claimed he was using kyronaut and it hadn't pumped out after a month or so. But I didn't notice if he reported again later.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I simply mean any difference you see in temps will be a proportion of the delta. So yes if you want to compare temps you should be running it at 75C. That will give a lot more precision in the percentage difference. If you do that and still see no difference in temps then that is very interesting. But saying you see no difference at 47C doesn't mean much because that's not a temp anyone would delid to run.
> 
> There isn't a whole lot of data on this, I admit. Everyone "knows" lm is far better so nobody bothers testing. But if you're going to test at least do it right.
> 
> You're saying you got pump-out on the nh1 within a few days? That's crazy fast!
> 
> Many, many pages back someone claimed he was using kyronaut and it hadn't pumped out after a month or so. But I didn't notice if he reported again later.


Id have to run 1.5v at least to get it to that high a temp haha. Even if i turned off my fans. The whole point of deliding or bare die is to run cooler temps. I also delided and put noctua between the die and ihs and then on top as well for the water block. It ran at around 46°C where it was at about 50°C before (yes i know not much temp drop) then after a week or so it went up to 54°C. Someone else had the same issue. It seems that under high pressures it does not do well at least.

From the pics ive seen of people using pressure paper, bare die has BEAUTIFUL contact while the IHS does not. My guess is Noctua does a lot better on an IHS then on die. I also tried Hydronaut this morning and temps were identical so i went to CLU, dropped a couple degrees but thats about it. The thing is im also running 2 rads so my temps wouldnt likely ever reach anywhere near 75°C.

Yes i can see how running an AIO or custom loop with a single rad, high voltage and high temps it would make a difference. Only reason i wanted to test it is because so many people raved and raved and said clu was the best. In my case at 1.2v/4/5ghz it made no difference, BUT the biggest difference here might be in reliability. This might keep my temps the same for 6months if not longer while a TIM degrades quickly.

Just surfing on the desktop doing basic programs it does keep the temp a bit lower then it did with the Noctua, that went from 46-47°C to about 40°C doing the same thing.

This was just done honestly out of sheer boredom and i wanted to see the results. In my case with my loop and gpu block thats what i came up with. Now if the cpu was the only thing in the loop i could see temps dropping even more.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> From what I see I might have the same EK Supremacy Evo Copper block as you. It does certainly stain when used with clu and a naked mount. I am not sure it has lost any smoothness. I try to remove the mount while the clu is warm.
> 
> Understandably your stress is expressed though.
> 
> 
> 
> The naked screws were cheap enough so i thought hey lets try it. For consistency im using the same TIM. At 1.155v i went from 52°C delided to 47°C naked die. Ambient temp is a few degrees hotter then when i tested it delided so it def dropped a few degrees. CLU or Conductonaut might drop it a few more. The devils canyon dont seem to benefit much from a delid unless running high voltages, thats what i can see from the list anyways.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Sure as I do also conclude the I5 4690k does not stray temperature wise from idle depending on what TIM is used.
> 
> The issue in your statement I find incorrect is that their benefit does rely on low and also quite high voltages. My processor can spike from 800mhz to 4.8plus gigahertz including voltages to maintain stability, and saying that the processor does not benefit from a delid plus a certain liquid metal is false, from my tests.
Click to expand...

CLU is needed to run 4.7 ghz @ 1.32 volts for this chip. 79 degrees Celsius in stress testing. Wont get any better than this.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> CLU is needed to run 4.7 ghz @ 1.32 volts for this chip. 79 degrees Celsius in stress testing. Wont get any better than this.


Im at 48-50°C now at 1.200, i can't see it for the life of me getting up anywhere near 70 with only another 100mv. I could be wrong though i just don't see it. Going from 1.088v to 1.1v only increased my temps like 5-6°C.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> CLU is needed to run 4.7 ghz @ 1.32 volts for this chip. 79 degrees Celsius in stress testing. Wont get any better than this.
> 
> 
> 
> Im at 48-50°C now at 1.200, i can't see it for the life of me getting up anywhere near 70 with only another 100mv. I could be wrong though i just don't see it. Going from 1.088v to 1.1v only increased my temps like 5-6°C.
Click to expand...

That sounds about right for naked with LM

3570k naked with PhyobiaLM running linpack at 5.0Ghz 1.360 and I dont break 60...

I actually did a 10x IBT runs last night for another club...1.520 5.26Ghz and still didn't hit 70 on a single core with a 20C ambient.

Naked+LM is the shiz


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That sounds about right for naked with LM
> 
> 3570k naked with PhyobiaLM running linpack at 5.0Ghz 1.360 and I dont break 60...
> 
> I actually did a 10x IBT runs last night for another club...1.520 5.26Ghz and still didn't hit 70 on a single core with a 20C ambient.
> 
> Naked+LM is the shiz


Sounds about right. Whats crazy though is Noctua and Hydronaut gave me relatively close temps to each other and lm. This to me means the ihs is the weak link. Also my ambient is prob about 23-25C right now with no ac so warm air just sits around. Might try one tomorrow with window open colder ambient. Should be about 45C with 21-22C ambient or so.


----------



## inedenimadam

TIM matters less at closer to ambient temps, when you start to really bake it, the thermal conductivity of the LM becomes more tangible. But you are running 1.2 naked, you could probably put tooth paste in there are do allright.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> TIM matters less at closer to ambient temps, when you start to really bake it, the thermal conductivity of the LM becomes more tangible. But you are running 1.2 naked, you could probably put tooth paste in there are do allright.


Haha could try it for the hell of it. Even if i ran 1.3 wont matter much. Ive been told by tons of people not to exceed 1.35 on the 4690k 24/7 clock.

People just dont understand the w/mk rating, the fact that its a K measurement and we use mostly C for computer temps is baffling. Lm ends up being 0.36w/mC and Kryonaut ends up being 0.12w/mC its not a huge difference.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> TIM matters less at closer to ambient temps, when you start to really bake it, the thermal conductivity of the LM becomes more tangible. But you are running 1.2 naked, you could probably put tooth paste in there are do allright.
> 
> 
> 
> Haha could try it for the hell of it. Even if i ran 1.3 wont matter much. Ive been told by tons of people not to exceed 1.35 on the 4690k 24/7 clock.
> 
> People just dont understand the w/mk rating, the fact that its a K measurement and we use mostly C for computer temps is baffling. Lm ends up being 0.36w/mC and Kryonaut ends up being 0.12w/mC its not a huge difference.
Click to expand...

That is HUGE, like 300% huge.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> That is HUGE, like 300% huge.


True but it just doesnt scale. For example Condoctunaut is rated at 86w/mK yet performs EXACTLY the same as CLU and CLP which are rated at 36 and 32 respectively. At least in my testing at 1.2v TIM and LM performed identically. Now the 4690k isnt a wattage pushed like the old ivy and sandy bridge (where we see ridiculous temp drops)


----------



## fyzzz

Not a single problem here, running my 4690k at 4.9/1.4v. Still clocks the same as it did over a 1 year ago, even benchmarked it upto 1.6v. Max temperature is about 65c after 1h of realbench. It's delidded with clu and under a custom loop with 2x 30mm 240 radiators and 2x 290's. It dropped about 5c after i delidded it (ihs on),but it made my 4.9 clock more stable.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fyzzz*
> 
> Not a single problem here, running my 4690k at 4.9/1.4v. Still clocks the same as it did over a 1 year ago, even benchmarked it upto 1.6v. Max temperature is about 65c after 1h of realbench. It's delidded with clu and under a custom loop with 2x 30mm 240 radiators and 2x 290's. It dropped about 5c after i delidded it (ihs on),but it made my 4.9 clock more stable.


Yea seems to be the consensus, the 4690k doesnt gain much from a delid, i think Intel learned from sandy/ivy haha. Skylake is about the same unless you use CLU with a huge oc.

P.S. You need some bigger rads man, should i even ask what the 290s are running at? Ive got a 360 and 240 and only have a single 390, although it stays ridiculously cool its shocked people that it never ever goes past 43°C even with an extra 100mv OC.


----------



## fyzzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea seems to be the consensus, the 4690k doesnt gain much from a delid, i think Intel learned from sandy/ivy haha. Skylake is about the same unless you use CLU with a huge oc.
> 
> P.S. You need some bigger rads man, should i even ask what the 290s are running at? Ive got a 360 and 240 and only have a single 390, although it stays ridiculously cool its shocked people that it never ever goes past 43°C even with an extra 100mv OC.


The stock tim was actually applied very well. Yeah, I'm saving money for two new rads, until then I mostly use one 290. The 290's doesn't even reach 50c during crysis 3, even overclocked and custom bios, but there is a lot of heat coming out of the radiators.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *fyzzz*
> 
> The stock tim was actually applied very well. Yeah, I'm saving money for two new rads, until then I mostly use one 290. The 290's doesn't even reach 50c during crysis 3, even overclocked and custom bios, but there is a lot of heat coming out of the radiators.


Yea i would say so. Everyone blames the intel TIM but the issue isnt the TIM at all but the gap the glue creates. You want the IHS to pretty much touch the die with a microscopic layer of tim in between.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> True but it just doesnt scale. For example Condoctunaut is rated at 86w/mK yet performs EXACTLY the same as CLU and CLP which are rated at 36 and 32 respectively. At least in my testing at 1.2v TIM and LM performed identically. Now the 4690k isnt a wattage pushed like the old ivy and sandy bridge (where we see ridiculous temp drops)


You need to consider that while being a naked kit with a full loop already on it the heat transfer isn't being limited by your LM but the loop itself. Many loops get set into a standard temperature range and it's hard to change that when you're pumping so much water around becoming fairly consistent. if your mid 40's are at full load thats pretty good and I wouldn't complain at all.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You need to consider that while being a naked kit with a full loop already on it the heat transfer isn't being limited by your LM but the loop itself. Many loops get set into a standard temperature range and it's hard to change that when you're pumping so much water around becoming fairly consistent. if your mid 40's are at full load thats pretty good and I wouldn't complain at all.


I have the alphacool gpx gpu block which according to extremerigs is VERY restrictive, case in point. If i do an intel stress test ill get up to about 47°C or so. If i play ac syndicate which is very cpu heavy, even though the water temp has gone up 7-8°C my cpu will still only reach 47°C and thats will all cores hitting 100%. So its def being limited by the gpu block unfortunately.

My water temps seem to stay at about 32-33°C with an ambien of 23-24°C. My gpu on the other hand has never reached 45°C even with an extra 100mv OC.


----------



## GtiJason

*How to Re-Lid to avoid pcb flex*


----------



## Awsan

So hello everyone i would like to report that i killed my Skylake CPU as my clumsy hands chipped a small piece of the core it self and now i own a dead CPU as a souvenir (Even though my motherboard is 90% dead in the first place because of my magnificent AX860 ~THANK YOU CORSAIR~ ) So wanted to share my experience with everyone.

The irony is i delidded "5" haswells with a razor and everything went fine but when it came to the easiest one it died, oh well fair well my new friend

(Fun fact it was new out of the box didnt even boot it once







)


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> So hello everyone i would like to report that i killed my Skylake CPU as my clumsy hands chipped a small piece of the core it self and now i own a dead CPU as a souvenir (Even though my motherboard is 90% dead in the first place because of my magnificent AX860 ~THANK YOU CORSAIR~ ) So wanted to share my experience with everyone.
> 
> The irony is i delidded "5" haswells with a razor and everything went fine but when it came to the easiest one it died, oh well fair well my new friend
> 
> (Fun fact it was new out of the box didnt even boot it once
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


That sucks man. What happened with the AX860 kinda curious.


----------



## Awsan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> So hello everyone i would like to report that i killed my Skylake CPU as my clumsy hands chipped a small piece of the core it self and now i own a dead CPU as a souvenir (Even though my motherboard is 90% dead in the first place because of my magnificent AX860 ~THANK YOU CORSAIR~ ) So wanted to share my experience with everyone.
> 
> The irony is i delidded "5" haswells with a razor and everything went fine but when it came to the easiest one it died, oh well fair well my new friend
> 
> (Fun fact it was new out of the box didnt even boot it once
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> 
> 
> That sucks man. What happened with the AX860 kinda curious.
Click to expand...

.

I will not act like i understand what happened but one day suddenly my z87 mobo died so i tried to rma but it was not possible so i upgraded to z170 and sold my old cpu and ram and when the new parts arrived i was just testing everything before installastion and my motherboard shocked me when i touched it , so i removed all the power cables and made sure nothing is wrong or anything is touching the power supply or the mobo then i repluged the power supply to the outlet and when i touched tge power supply i got shocked and now my new mobo wont even boot on other power supplies so i am not sure what went wrong but looks like the ax860 has atleast a finger in it.


----------



## Awsan

Is it possible for me to cover the components that are next to the core[i7 4770k] with something even when its running, because i will give the cpu to my cousin and i am afraid that he will fiddle around with it and drop some CLU on them and burn it.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> 
> 
> Is it possible for me to cover the components that are next to the core[i7 4770k] with something even when its running, because i will give the cpu to my cousin and i am afraid that he will fiddle around with it and drop some CLU on them and burn it.


Yes lots of us have done so. Use clear nail polish, lacquer, anything NON conductive. I used automotive paint lacquer.


----------



## Awsan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> 
> 
> Is it possible for me to cover the components that are next to the core[i7 4770k] with something even when its running, because i will give the cpu to my cousin and i am afraid that he will fiddle around with it and drop some CLU on them and burn it.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes lots of us have done so. Use clear nail polish, lacquer, anything NON conductive. I used automotive paint lacquer.
Click to expand...

So any clear nail polish will do?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> So any clear nail polish will do?


Yes sir


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> So any clear nail polish will do?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes sir
Click to expand...

Also, it doesn't have to be clear... Clear just looks neater. You could do hot pink (personal favorite)...jkjk


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Also, it doesn't have to be clear... Clear just looks neater. You could do hot pink (personal favorite)...jkjk


As someone living in magic kingdom i dont doubt it haha jp. Personally id love to find some nice matching green high temp paint or nail polish.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Also, it doesn't have to be clear... Clear just looks neater. You could do hot pink (personal favorite)...jkjk
> 
> 
> 
> As someone living in magic kingdom i dont doubt it haha jp. Personally id love to find some nice matching green high temp paint or nail polish.
Click to expand...

haha actually its my dream place to live...well at least it always is the best place for a vacation. Heck, I dream of eating at the Kona Cafe every morning for breakfast...








Maybe silver color nail polish would get alot of looks as it'd look like your putting on a conductive paste or something on the transistors. lol


----------



## elyx

Hi and sorry for bad english.

i delid my i7 4790k with razor blade and accidentally made some very bad scratches on the pcb:

https://i.imgur.com/MPd4jPY.jpg

I thought my processor was dead but it still works(and im very happy). I tried IBT and it is stable, also memory works fine.

Just wondering how it is possible? Can there still be something broken in my cpu and do you think it will die soon?


----------



## emexci

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elyx*
> 
> Hi and sorry for bad english.
> 
> i delid my i7 4790k with razor blade and accidentally made some very bad scratches on the pcb:
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/MPd4jPY.jpg
> 
> I thought my processor was dead but it still works(and im very happy). I tried IBT and it is stable, also memory works fine.
> 
> Just wondering how it is possible? Can there still be something broken in my cpu and do you think it will die soon?


its a miracle that cpu still alive.









you may consider cover this scratches with high thermal silicon or something. i dont know.

as i delid mine 6700k i didnt clear the pcb because that part scares me mostly. i bought uhu high thermal silicon for seal heatspreader back.


----------



## SmOgER

If that big deep scratch was 1-2 milimeters to the right it would probably be toast.
But yeah, cover them up with something non-conductive. There are probably some traces exposed.
High quality eletrical tape?


----------



## Awsan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> So any clear nail polish will do?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes sir
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Also, it doesn't have to be clear... Clear just looks neater. You could do hot pink (personal favorite)...jkjk
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Also, it doesn't have to be clear... Clear just looks neater. You could do hot pink (personal favorite)...jkjk
> 
> 
> 
> As someone living in magic kingdom i dont doubt it haha jp. Personally id love to find some nice matching green high temp paint or nail polish.
Click to expand...

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Also, it doesn't have to be clear... Clear just looks neater. You could do hot pink (personal favorite)...jkjk
> 
> 
> 
> As someone living in magic kingdom i dont doubt it haha jp. Personally id love to find some nice matching green high temp paint or nail polish.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> haha actually its my dream place to live...well at least it always is the best place for a vacation. Heck, I dream of eating at the Kona Cafe every morning for breakfast...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe silver color nail polish would get alot of looks as it'd look like your putting on a conductive paste or something on the transistors. lol
Click to expand...

As i am giving it to my cousin hot pink doesnt sound like a bad upgrade







and it might shock him, hahahahahahaha


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elyx*
> 
> Hi and sorry for bad english.
> 
> i delid my i7 4790k with razor blade and accidentally made some very bad scratches on the pcb:
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/MPd4jPY.jpg
> 
> I thought my processor was dead but it still works(and im very happy). I tried IBT and it is stable, also memory works fine.
> 
> Just wondering how it is possible? Can there still be something broken in my cpu and do you think it will die soon?


Wow thats insane im shocked it didnt scrap off the traces.

So back on topic in a few days or maybe a week ill be getting my hands on an actual deliding tool that i havent seen before. Figured id give it a try for the forum. It looks totally fail proof so we shall see.


----------



## abctoz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *elyx*
> 
> Hi and sorry for bad english.
> 
> i delid my i7 4790k with razor blade and accidentally made some very bad scratches on the pcb:
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/MPd4jPY.jpg
> 
> I thought my processor was dead but it still works(and im very happy). I tried IBT and it is stable, also memory works fine.
> 
> Just wondering how it is possible? Can there still be something broken in my cpu and do you think it will die soon?


That looks mightily lucky to me, I remember watching this video showing a failed delid:


----------



## bluej511

It might have nicked some pcie lanes so not too sure.


----------



## bluej511

Ok so for anyone interested in easier deliding, or someone who doesnt want to buy a vice or risk using razor blades. I found this gem online by searching youtube videos, as a fan of engineering and easier life i decided to give it a try. I had already delided my 4690k but do have a 3350p on a spare computer. Heres a video of how it works.






I ordered it a week or so ago but contacted the manufacturer as to why ivy bridge wasn't available. The IHS is a bit different but he said he would include an ivy top for me to use, a prototype if you will. As he responded very quickly and promptly i decided to order one. Yes it might seem like a waste for deliding one chip but like i said, if i can bring useful tools (and safer) to the forum ill gladly take the bait.

Came very quickly and was packaged in a bubble envelope, one down side was it def needs better packaging. No damage but it seems like my postal service had to add a plastic envelope on top of it as the letter somehow was open (unless they opened it themselves for safety issues and scanning, no idea). Came with all the pieces intact so no issues.

The tool looks EXTREMELY well built. The bottom seems to be made of maybe aluminum as its quiet light but feels very solid. The bottom of the tool can also be used to relid (with very thin glue if you deem necessary, maybe for warranty or for whatever reason). After putting the chip in the jig and placing the top and screwing it down, i used a 5mm hex and it literally took 30secs to work. No hammering, no wood, no razor blades. Here are some pictures, if anymore question just ask. I am shocked at how incredibly well it worked. Theres literally no chance of damage. Youll feel/hear the IHS pop free of the glue, then you can continue turning the hex to twist it off fully or pry it off with your fingers/fingernails. It just came right off.

Here is the bottom, and the 2 lids. Left one does haswell/skylake/devilscanyon midle one does ivy only.


How it looks in the jig.


Close up of how flush the pcb sits in the rig, no risk of chipping or anything.


Heres a close up of the IHS sitting in the top piece. Again very flush and stable.


And here she is delided in 30secs.


So there you go an affordable and safe free tool for deliding. Any questions or if someone wants more pictures let me know. I didn't take a picture of the screws holding the top on, theres 4 plastic screws that just hold the top down. No need to go crazy tight as it will make it harder to turn the hex. Hand snug will do.


----------



## Benjiw

I don't understand why people still use razors to delid... it's far too risky to even contemplate anymore with all the delid tools we have etc.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I don't understand why people still use razors to delid... it's far too risky to even contemplate anymore with all the delid tools we have etc.


Other tool ive seen was way more expensive and from the video ive seen looked a bit harder to use. Honestly this was a breeze, it prob took me longer to remove the fan and cpu then it took me to break apart the bond. I did find out that a cut in half credit card works the best to get the glue completely out of the ihs underneath with all the corners.

I was shocked how well this worked i wont lie? kinda wish i had it to delid mine instead of using the edge of a marble table haha.


----------



## scgeek12

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I don't understand why people still use razors to delid... it's far too risky to even contemplate anymore with all the delid tools we have etc.
> 
> Delidded my skylake with a razor in about 2 minutes, 0 problems took me longer to apply the CLU then to do the delid lol, pretty easy to do with a razor


----------



## Awsan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *scgeek12*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I don't understand why people still use razors to delid... it's far too risky to even contemplate anymore with all the delid tools we have etc.
> 
> 
> 
> Delidded my skylake with a razor in about 2 minutes, 0 problems took me longer to apply the CLU then to do the delid lol, pretty easy to do with a razor
Click to expand...

Trust me mate you will not be as happy as you are right now when you make a mistake with that razor







, like i mentions i delidded several Haswell CPUs and all of them survived, but when it came to the easiest i failed so becareful


----------



## Benjiw

I got a delid tool but you can get 3d printed tools for a lot less. $25 for a rockitcool delid tool isn't bad either.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I got a delid tool but you can get 3d printed tools for a lot less. $25 for a rockitcool delid tool isn't bad either.


The 3d ones ive seen unfortunately you STILL need a vice, if you got one you wouldnt need the tool unless your using skylake. Mine does everything for 35€ no need for a vice and i can store it pretty much anywhere its quite small. The think i like is it also has a re-liding guide for whatever reason if you need one. Its made out of a delrin type of plastic its very cool.


----------



## Awsan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I got a delid tool but you can get 3d printed tools for a lot less. $25 for a rockitcool delid tool isn't bad either.
> 
> 
> 
> The 3d ones ive seen unfortunately you STILL need a vice, if you got one you wouldnt need the tool unless your using skylake. Mine does everything for 35€ no need for a vice and i can store it pretty much anywhere its quite small. The think i like is it also has a re-liding guide for whatever reason if you need one. Its made out of a delrin type of plastic its very cool.
Click to expand...

Differently gonna order one next weekend thanks for the heads up







+REP


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I got a delid tool but you can get 3d printed tools for a lot less. $25 for a rockitcool delid tool isn't bad either.


I have a rockitool and it's awesome great quality and easy to use definitely recommend one of these if you delid a lot


----------



## Conditioned

Can I just put the backplate down so it covers the ihs in the same fashion as before delid delid or do I need to glue it back on before mounting it?


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Can I just put the backplate down so it covers the ihs in the same fashion as before delid delid or do I need to glue it back on before mounting it?


Are you talking about the metal silver IHS that is put on top of the CPU? I didn't glue my one after delidding and relidding.

I basically align it in place with the CPU motherboard socket retention plate.

You have to offset the ihs higher a bit from the center as the retention lock will push the metal ihs down a bit before it fully locks.


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Are you talking about the metal silver IHS that is put on top of the CPU? I didn't glue my one after delidding and relidding.
> 
> I basically align it in place with the CPU motherboard socket retention plate.
> 
> You have to offset the ihs higher a bit from the center as the retention lock will push the metal ihs down a bit before it fully locks.


Yea, thanks!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The 3d ones ive seen unfortunately you STILL need a vice, if you got one you wouldnt need the tool unless your using skylake. Mine does everything for 35€ no need for a vice and i can store it pretty much anywhere its quite small. The think i like is it also has a re-liding guide for whatever reason if you need one. Its made out of a delrin type of plastic its very cool.


I have the Delid mate by that German dude who gave the Rocketcool guy loads of hassle for having a design similar but improves leaps and bounds over his. Wish I hadn't bought it now after the things I've heard through the grape vine. Overpriced soft plastic easily breakable. Might throw it in the bin and buy a Rocketcool delid tool.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> Differently gonna order one next weekend thanks for the heads up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +REP


On the rocketcool or delid mate? I'd avoid the delid mate, it will get the job done but you have to make sure you've got everything dead set in place or it will literally destroy itself.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I have the Delid mate by that German dude who gave the Rocketcool guy loads of hassle for having a design similar but improves leaps and bounds over his. Wish I hadn't bought it now after the things I've heard through the grape vine. Overpriced soft plastic easily breakable. Might throw it in the bin and buy a Rocketcool delid tool.
> On the rocketcool or delid mate? I'd avoid the delid mate, it will get the job done but you have to make sure you've got everything dead set in place or it will literally destroy itself.


I just saw that rocketcool one looks interesting. Issue i see is the screw wearing out the tool as its pretty much just plastic. What i love about the one i got is its got a metal sleeve so no issues there. Im more favorable of the twisting from the tool i got then the pushing of the rocketcool and other tools, seems like more force is needed. One i got honestly was so easy. Wish i knew someone with a skylake to try out on.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

You can give your money to delid enthusiast designers or razor blade manufacturers, the choice is yours.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I have the Delid mate by that German dude who gave the Rocketcool guy loads of hassle for having a design similar but improves leaps and bounds over his. Wish I hadn't bought it now after the things I've heard through the grape vine. Overpriced soft plastic easily breakable. Might throw it in the bin and buy a Rocketcool delid tool.
> On the rocketcool or delid mate? I'd avoid the delid mate, it will get the job done but you have to make sure you've got everything dead set in place or it will literally destroy itself.
> 
> 
> 
> I just saw that rocketcool one looks interesting. Issue i see is the screw wearing out the tool as its pretty much just plastic. What i love about the one i got is its got a metal sleeve so no issues there. Im more favorable of the twisting from the tool i got then the pushing of the rocketcool and other tools, seems like more force is needed. One i got honestly was so easy. Wish i knew someone with a skylake to try out on.
Click to expand...

My wonder being which pressure during delid, rotational or horizontal, is more likely to cause die damage? The answer is probably both are negligible.

I can testify the Rocket COOL Delidder does not use plastic hardware (only their _Relid Spider_ cap); it also is seemingly more durable than an ipod. I could probably use it as a jack stand under my car for some moments, it rings that durable to me.


----------



## xGeNeSisx

Have an i5 6400 (non-K) processor clocked to 4.4ghz using 1.32 Vcore and BCLK modification on Z170 board. I have pushed the chip higher and reached 4.8 before, however concerns about temperature and voltage caused me to scale back to 4.4ghz. My idle temps are ~22-23C and depending on ambient temperature and various stress testing utilities I hit ~45-55C. I use a Corsair H110 AIO loop for cooling.

It would be nice to shave off 5-10C from my load temperatures if possible with summer coming up. I only require some CLU paste, but I am still trying to decide on the best means to delid. Obviously razor method is a huge risk of scratching PCB. I can get a vice for ~$15 or a dedicated tool to delid for ~$40. Is it worth getting the tool for added safety and also future usage? Thanks!

Edit: same tool you have bluej511


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xGeNeSisx*
> 
> Have an i5 6400 (non-K) processor clocked to 4.4ghz using 1.32 Vcore and BCLK modification on Z170 board. I have pushed the chip higher and reached 4.8 before, however concerns about temperature and voltage caused me to scale back to 4.4ghz. My idle temps are ~22-23C and depending on ambient temperature and various stress testing utilities I hit ~45-55C. I use a Corsair H110 AIO loop for cooling.
> 
> It would be nice to shave off 5-10C from my load temperatures if possible with summer coming up. I only require some CLU paste, but I am still trying to decide on the best means to delid. Obviously razor method is a huge risk of scratching PCB. I can get a vice for ~$15 or a dedicated tool to delid for ~$40. Is it worth getting the tool for added safety and also future usage? Thanks!
> 
> Edit: same tool you have bluej511


For skylake i absolutely recommend a tool.You can try the 3d printed ones but they seem to be a pain and not last long from what ive read. You still need a vice though.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> You can give your money to delid enthusiast designers or razor blade manufacturers, the choice is yours.
> My wonder being which pressure during delid, rotational or horizontal, is more likely to cause die damage? The answer is probably both are negligible.
> 
> I can testify the Rocket COOL Delidder does not use plastic hardware (only their _Relid Spider_ cap); it also is seemingly more durable than an ipod. I could probably use it as a jack stand under my car for some moments, it rings that durable to me.


I do believe theyre BOTH made from Delrin plastic (same plastic used on motorcycle parts for bar ends and frame sliders its VERY tough plastic).


----------



## Conditioned

Wow. From 85c on the hottest core I went to 66c. 4790k/Asus maximus VII Hero. Intel burn test standard. "Standard" fan profile with a noctuca dh15.


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Wow. From 85c on the hottest core I went to 66c. 4790k/Asus maximus VII Hero. Intel burn test standard. "Standard" fan profile with a noctuca dh15.










mine goes up to 90C. I also delidded mine and put CLU on it. 4790K/Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD5H-BK. Intel burn test standard 10 passes. "Standard" fan profile with Noctua NH-D14. Did I not put enough CLU or something? I put a thin layer to cover the die.


----------



## boot318

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mine goes up to 90C. I also delidded mine and put CLU on it. 4790K/Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD5H-BK. Intel burn test standard 10 passes. "Standard" fan profile with Noctua NH-D14. Did I not put enough CLU or something? I put a thin layer to cover the die.


Did you put a thin layer on the ihs also?


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boot318*
> 
> Did you put a thin layer on the ihs also?


Yeah I did that too.. Is it fine if I like add more CLU on top over the existing one? It's been like a month. I suppose it's a good idea I take pictures of the CLU on it.

Edit: 4.7 GHz @ 1.308 VCore.


----------



## Conditioned

and 70c on hottest core with case closed. I only run mine at [email protected]


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> and 70c on hottest core with case closed. I only run mine at [email protected]


I need 1.4v for that kind of heat, I run bare die though so probably why, did you remove all the glue and lap your IHS?


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I need 1.4v for that kind of heat, I run bare die though so probably why, did you remove all the glue and lap your IHS?


Yea. Not the best cpu.

Edit: Err.. "Lap"?


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Yeah I did that too.. Is it fine if I like add more CLU on top over the existing one? It's been like a month. I suppose it's a good idea I take pictures of the CLU on it.
> 
> Edit: 4.7 GHz @ 1.308 VCore.


That's normal. I get somewhere around 90C if I run in-place FFT with 1.328V as well.


----------



## Conditioned

Sigh guess I was cheering to early. Now when I do ibt I go up to 86c. I used prolimatech p3 (pk3?) on the die, the inside of the ihs and on the outside of the ihs. Wth happened, did it move around? I didn't touch anything from my first ibt tests where I got 68c.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Yeah I did that too.. Is it fine if I like add more CLU on top over the existing one? It's been like a month. I suppose it's a good idea I take pictures of the CLU on it.
> 
> Edit: 4.7 GHz @ 1.308 VCore.


I would add some more.


----------



## 0ldChicken

I added a tiny bit after my first application due to slightly high temps. Helped out quite a bit, just be sure not to over do it


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I added a tiny bit after my first application due to slightly high temps. Helped out quite a bit, just be sure not to over do it


Over doing it isnt a problem, the IHS wil just squeeze down on whatever else there is, most of it will spill out and the layer thats needed will still be there. Seems like the die to ihs contact needs way more thermal paste then ihs to cooler contact. My guess is even removing the glue doesnt sit well enough on the die.

I used Noctua first time around and within days my temps went up, you need something thick it seems like. I feel like the die gets quite hot and needs either clu or thick tim.


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would add some more.


Added more. Unfortunately I'm still getting 86°C on Intel Burn Test standard. Well I get 80°C AIDA64. I guess it's okay and there's nothing else I can do then.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Over doing it isnt a problem, the IHS wil just squeeze down on whatever else there is, most of it will spill out and the layer thats needed will still be there. Seems like the die to ihs contact needs way more thermal paste then ihs to cooler contact. My guess is even removing the glue doesnt sit well enough on the die.
> 
> I used Noctua first time around and within days my temps went up, you need something thick it seems like. I feel like the die gets quite hot and needs either clu or thick tim.


well when you over do it it'll spill conductive liquid on the surface of the CPU, even if the resistors are covered that seems dangerous at best. The noctua or any regular paste (except MAYBE kryonaut) will "pump out" and leave almost no Tim in contact with the ihs/cpu, liquid metal will not.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Added more. Unfortunately I'm still getting 86°C on Intel Burn Test standard. Well I get 80°C AIDA64. I guess it's okay and there's nothing else I can do then.


can you tighten the block down any more to get better contact? And did you remove the black glue layer under the ihs?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Sigh guess I was cheering to early. Now when I do ibt I go up to 86c. I used prolimatech p3 (pk3?) on the die, the inside of the ihs and on the outside of the ihs. Wth happened, did it move around? I didn't touch anything from my first ibt tests where I got 68c.


I believe you are pumping out like I described above, tend to happen with regular pastes.


----------



## benjamen50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> can you tighten the block down any more to get better contact? And did you remove the black glue layer under the ihs?


Already tightened it by hand and tool. Both doesn't seem to have an effect on temperatures. Definitely removed the black glue under the IHS. I made PCB level with no bumps from the glue. Also removed the black glue layer under the IHS.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> well when you over do it it'll spill conductive liquid on the surface of the CPU, even if the resistors are covered that seems dangerous at best. The noctua or any regular paste (except MAYBE kryonaut) will "pump out" and leave almost no Tim in contact with the ihs/cpu, liquid metal will not.
> can you tighten the block down any more to get better contact? And did you remove the black glue layer under the ihs?
> I believe you are pumping out like I described above, tend to happen with regular pastes.


Agreed but considering most TIMs arent conductive its not an issue. Mine with clu doesnt even spill over (i did paint my transistors with car lacquer though so its safe).

Seems like most TIMs either can't handle the extreme direct heat, or the pressure from the IHS onto the die. I did put some Hydronaut on the spare computer my mom uses when testing my delid tool, ill see how it holds up after a few weeks. Its only a 3350p and rated at 45w so def wont be as bad as mine.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Agreed but considering most TIMs arent conductive its not an issue. Mine with clu doesnt even spill over (i did paint my transistors with car lacquer though so its safe).
> 
> Seems like most TIMs either can't handle the extreme direct heat, or the pressure from the IHS onto the die. I did put some Hydronaut on the spare computer my mom uses when testing my delid tool, ill see how it holds up after a few weeks. Its only a 3350p and rated at 45w so def wont be as bad as mine.


the guy I was talking to (Benjamen50) is using clu thou which is highly conductive, so spill over could be catastrophic. I've never had it spill over either, but he was talking about adding more to what he's already got on there, which is fine and sometimes necessary, but a word of caution is advised and far from wrong.









I tried using kryonaut when I first delidded (overclocked 4790k) and I had some temp increase after a couple weeks. I've seen others say that they haven't though, so I try not to say either way with that.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Already tightened it by hand and tool. Both doesn't seem to have an effect on temperatures. Definitely removed the black glue under the IHS. I made PCB level with no bumps from the glue. Also removed the black glue layer under the IHS.


hmmmm... I'll try and think of something, but actually I think that is pretty close to what I'm hitting with my custom loop at a similar voltage. I'll have to check when I get home in 5 hours or so, been a while since I've ran IBT


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> the guy I was talking to (Benjamen50) is using clu thou which is highly conductive, so spill over could be catastrophic. I've never had it spill over either, but he was talking about adding more to what he's already got on there, which is fine and sometimes necessary, but a word of caution is advised and far from wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tried using kryonaut when I first delidded (overclocked 4790k) and I had some temp increase after a couple weeks. I've seen others say that they haven't though, so I try not to say either way with that.
> hmmmm... I'll try and think of something, but actually I think that is pretty close to what I'm hitting with my custom loop at a similar voltage. I'll have to check when I get home in 5 hours or so, been a while since I've ran IBT


You mean like coollabs stuff? Liquid ultra/Liquid pro? That stuff's conductive isn't it?


----------



## Awsan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The 3d ones ive seen unfortunately you STILL need a vice, if you got one you wouldnt need the tool unless your using skylake. Mine does everything for 35€ no need for a vice and i can store it pretty much anywhere its quite small. The think i like is it also has a re-liding guide for whatever reason if you need one. Its made out of a delrin type of plastic its very cool.
> 
> 
> 
> I have the Delid mate by that German dude who gave the Rocketcool guy loads of hassle for having a design similar but improves leaps and bounds over his. Wish I hadn't bought it now after the things I've heard through the grape vine. Overpriced soft plastic easily breakable. Might throw it in the bin and buy a Rocketcool delid tool.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> Differently gonna order one next weekend thanks for the heads up
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +REP
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> On the rocketcool or delid mate? I'd avoid the delid mate, it will get the job done but you have to make sure you've got everything dead set in place or it will literally destroy itself.
Click to expand...

Was talking about the one on post #30330 from entersetup


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> Was talking about the one on post #30330 from entersetup


Yea its fantastic. If i was still in the US id def have people send me there skylake to delid and try out haha. Worked perfectly.

On another note, i got some pressure paper to try out. I put it on and it seems to have very poor pressure going bare die with the ekwb screws. Now im not sure if i was supposed to leave it on longer or if my block needs lapping but i went back to bare die anyways since i changed the screws over.

SOO yesterday i was on CLU with IHS on and Hydronaut thermal paste (which had a very very good spread once removed). Tested it in Intel stress test and that way got around 50-51°C if not higher, during forza 6 got up to 53°C in package temps.

Today i reapplied the clu, stress tested 5mins and got up to 50°C. Took it apart reapplied a very very thin layer over the other thin layer and went down to about 47°C. NOW the biggest difference was playing Forza 6 (which pins 2 cores at 100% pretty much the entire time), that went down to an impressive 45°C during a couple races where before with the IHS it was 53°C. So the IHS is def hindering some performance. Could have been my application of clu under the IHS was poor but when i took it apart contact looked real good.

Looks to me like because of pretty poor pressure (i think the block hits the actual cpu socket and doesnt press down enough, although im ok with that as you cant damage anything), you have to use slightly more CLU. But the temp drops are indeed noticeable and this is backed up by my original testing couple weeks ago.

i5 4690k @ 1.2v 4.5ghz stable.


----------



## Conditioned

Ok I see now I will need to get something metal on the die. Hopefully someone is kind enough to answer these questions.

What's best to go with? Liquid pro?

Do I have to reapply it? If yes, how often?

I have put naillaquerstuff (name?) on the strop of metal points just by the die itself, anything else I need to be careful about or think about other than making sure not to spread it around?


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Ok I see now I will need to get something metal on the die. Hopefully someone is kind enough to answer these questions.
> 
> What's best to go with? Liquid pro?
> 
> Do I have to reapply it? If yes, how often?
> 
> I have put naillaquerstuff (name?) on the strop of metal points just by the die itself, anything else I need to be careful about or think about other than making sure not to spread it around?


All liquid metal TIMs are pretty much the same. It reacts with aluminum and corrodes it, do not use in contact with aluminum. It reacts with copper and "dries out" stains it, but there's no adverse effects on performance. Doesn't seem to react with nickel.


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> All liquid metal TIMs are pretty much the same. It reacts with aluminum and corrodes it, do not use in contact with aluminum. It reacts with copper and "dries out" stains it, but there's no adverse effects on performance. Doesn't seem to react with nickel.


Yup, my nh d15 has a copper base. Do I need to reapply it? If so how often? And do I only need to use it between the die and the ihs?

This states Liquid ultra is easier to work with. http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2297140


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Yup, my nh d15 has a copper base. Do I need to reapply it? If so how often? And do I only need to use it between the die and the ihs?
> 
> This states Liquid ultra is easier to work with. http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2297140


Liquid Ultra seems easier to clean. When it stains the copper its actually the copper absorbing the liquid metal (which is perfectly fine and might even make TIM work better if you go back). From my understanding doesnt need reapplying. Only if you ever notice temps going up you might want to. Its perfectly fine on copper. It stained my ihs in a couple days and thats nickel plated copper so it stains either way haha.


----------



## Loladinas

Eh, I didn't have any troubles applying it, and I used CLP. Took a thin makeup brush, cut off the bristles short, squirted a bit of CLP into the bristles, painted the die and IHS with it. Done.


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Liquid Ultra seems easier to clean. When it stains the copper its actually the copper absorbing the liquid metal (which is perfectly fine and might even make TIM work better if you go back). From my understanding doesnt need reapplying. Only if you ever notice temps going up you might want to. Its perfectly fine on copper. It stained my ihs in a couple days and thats nickel plated copper so it stains either way haha.


Thanks. Yea if it stains idc, its mostly if I need to reapply it all the time, even if it's every few years or so its a pita. Then you have to check your temps etc.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Thanks. Yea if it stains idc, its mostly if I need to reapply it all the time, even if it's every few years or so its a pita. Then you have to check your temps etc.


Well honestly you gotta check your temps even when using TIMs to make sure its got a good spread. Liquid metal is pretty much set it and forget it. Its like soldering your IHS to the die.


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Well honestly you gotta check your temps even when using TIMs to make sure its got a good spread. Liquid metal is pretty much set it and forget it. Its like soldering your IHS to the die.


Yes, ofc I will check my temps, I meant checking them continously. I prefer to set and forget.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Yes, ofc I will check my temps, I meant checking them continously.


Set up a program to show your temp in the tray. Speedfan, OpenHardwareMonitor, HWInfo64 any will do.


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Set up a program to show your temp in the tray. Speedfan, OpenHardwareMonitor, HWInfo64 any will do.


Yea I just generally have a very minimalistic approach to using programs but I guess I can add cpu temps in ab, since that's one of the few programs that's costantly running on my machine thanks. I just imagined having to start realtemp every so often.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Yea I just generally have a very minimalistic approach to using programs but I guess I can add cpu temps in ab, since that's one of the few programs that's costantly running on my machine thanks. I just imagined having to start realtemp every so often.


Make a scheduled task to run it on user logon. I have Speedfan always running to regulate my fans, it only takes like 2mb of memory and no cpu time.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> You mean like coollabs stuff? Liquid ultra/Liquid pro? That stuff's conductive isn't it?


yes, very much so! Some people use it to short out resistors since it is so conductive


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Thanks. Yea if it stains idc, its mostly if I need to reapply it all the time, even if it's every few years or so its a pita. Then you have to check your temps etc.
> 
> 
> 
> Well honestly you gotta check your temps even when using TIMs to make sure its got a good spread. Liquid metal is pretty much set it and forget it. Its like soldering your IHS to the die.
Click to expand...

Like soldering your IHS to the die is false. The only way to solder it is to solder it. I understand if you think liquid metal is the same thing as soldering, but it isn't in the context I understand.

Have you taken into consideration your three degree temperature fluctuations is from the daily rotation of the earth and ambient temperature ( dew point ) change through the day? You may be re applying thermal paste without any need to.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *benjamen50*
> 
> Added more. Unfortunately I'm still getting 86°C on Intel Burn Test standard. Well I get 80°C AIDA64. I guess it's okay and there's nothing else I can do then.


I lied, I hit 63°c max at 1.308v 4.7ghz. But that is with a dope custom loop and 21°c ambient. I used to use a nh-d14 when I first delidded, I'll look back in my benchmarks and see if I can find something around that voltage

edit:@benjamen50 1.376v @ 4.8ghz with NH-D14 was hitting 89°c after delidding, probably running max fans on the cpu cooler. I believe a couple FD venturi SP but its been a while


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Make a scheduled task to run it on user logon. I have Speedfan always running to regulate my fans, it only takes like 2mb of memory and no cpu time.


I don't really like speedfan, I had some massive performance issues with it, dpc wise. Also used to be a bit tricky to set up. One of the reasons I got the asus max VII hero was due to good options to set up fans if needed. I never felt the need for it since the profiles that come with the bios are fine. Your mobo should have similar options to set up profiles in the bios if I'm not mistaken.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Like soldering your IHS to the die is false. The only way to solder it is to solder it. I understand if you think liquid metal is the same thing as soldering, but it isn't in the context I understand.
> 
> Have you taken into consideration your three degree temperature fluctuations is from the daily rotation of the earth and ambient temperature ( dew point ) change through the day? You may be re applying thermal paste without any need to.


Solder is pretty much metal thats then melted and because of flux ends up drying hard. I didnt reapply paste i did add another thin layer of clu. And from 53C to 46C isnt 2-3 degrees but 7 degrees from removing the ihs and going bare die, even though i dont think its making optimal contact thats still quite a temp drop. Next up will be what 1.3v will get me. Hoping for 4.8-4.9ghz. Ambient and water temp from yesterday to today hasnt changed.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> I don't really like speedfan, I had some massive performance issues with it, dpc wise. Also used to be a bit tricky to set up. One of the reasons I got the asus max VII hero was due to good options to set up fans if needed. I never felt the need for it since the profiles that come with the bios are fine. Your mobo should have similar options to set up profiles in the bios if I'm not mistaken.


Speedfan is from the gods! Used it on my first repurposed office PC a few years ago and have used it everytime I start all of my computers since then. Sucks you had issues with it, I've had a couple fights with it but nothing that reinstalling it hasn't fixed. The set up isn't user friendly, but once you learn what it can do there is no replacement.

Asus boards do have WONDERFUL fan control compared to any other board I've used (gig, msi, asrock, evga) but it still just isn't enough for some people (like me!). I'm actually replacing my EVGA classified with a cheaper ASUS for no really good reason other than that I miss all the good times we had, controlling fan speeds and temperatures together








oh and the temperature probe headers!!!! dont get me started


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Speedfan is from the gods! Used it on my first repurposed office PC a few years ago and have used it everytime I start all of my computers since then. Sucks you had issues with it, I've had a couple fights with it but nothing that reinstalling it hasn't fixed. The set up isn't user friendly, but once you learn what it can do there is no replacement.
> 
> Asus boards do have WONDERFUL fan control compared to any other board I've used (gig, msi, asrock, evga) but it still just isn't enough for some people (like me!). I'm actually replacing my EVGA classified with a cheaper ASUS for no really good reason other than that I miss all the good times we had, controlling fan speeds and temperatures together


Pft speedfan lol. I got a dozen fans had to use a fan controller.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Pft speedfan lol. I got a dozen fans had to use a fan controller.


as long as they aren't 12 different fans, a few splitters makes it easy peasy


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> as long as they aren't 12 different fans, a few splitters makes it easy peasy


Yea they are haha. 3 NF12s, 2 thermaltakes, 3 NF14s, 2 enermax clusters. Ive got 4 channels controlling at least 2 fans and one doing 3.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea they are haha. 3 NF12s, 2 thermaltakes, 3 NF14s, 2 enermax clusters. Ive got 4 channels controlling at least 2 fans and one doing 3.


ha sounds like me, I've always had a lot of fans and never more than a few of the same type. What controller are you using? I've been thinking about picking one up for an external rad box idea I might attempt?

On delidding>>> I'm going to be rebuilding my pc in a new case in a couple of weeks, kinda thinking about going naked this time








is your 5-7°c drop considered average compared to delidded with IHS on?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> ha sounds like me, I've always had a lot of fans and never more than a few of the same type. What controller are you using? I've been thinking about picking one up for an external rad box idea I might attempt?
> 
> On delidding>>> I'm going to be rebuilding my pc in a new case in a couple of weeks, kinda thinking about going naked this time
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is your 5-7°c drop considered average compared to delidded with IHS on?


Using a thermaltake F6 RGB got it cuz it controls using voltage which i love.

As far as temp drops honestly you cant compare no 2 cpus or IHS or waterblocks are the same.My supremacy evo is very convex from checking with a straight edge. The pressure paper shows that it makes more pressure on the cpu socket then the die itself. The edges of the die are nice and pressured the rest isnt so lapping the block might drop the temps even more but who knows (next time i flush the system i might lap it but for now no need)


----------



## Conditioned

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Speedfan is from the gods! Used it on my first repurposed office PC a few years ago and have used it everytime I start all of my computers since then. Sucks you had issues with it, I've had a couple fights with it but nothing that reinstalling it hasn't fixed. The set up isn't user friendly, but once you learn what it can do there is no replacement.
> 
> Asus boards do have WONDERFUL fan control compared to any other board I've used (gig, msi, asrock, evga) but it still just isn't enough for some people (like me!). I'm actually replacing my EVGA classified with a cheaper ASUS for no really good reason other than that I miss all the good times we had, controlling fan speeds and temperatures together
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh and the temperature probe headers!!!! dont get me started


I'm a bit curious what you do with the fans that you cant do with an asus board.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Like soldering your IHS to the die is false. The only way to solder it is to solder it. I understand if you think liquid metal is the same thing as soldering, but it isn't in the context I understand.
> 
> Have you taken into consideration your three degree temperature fluctuations is from the daily rotation of the earth and ambient temperature ( dew point ) change through the day? You may be re applying thermal paste without any need to.
> 
> 
> 
> Solder is pretty much metal thats then melted and because of flux ends up drying hard. I didnt reapply paste i did add another thin layer of clu. And from 53C to 46C isnt 2-3 degrees but 7 degrees from removing the ihs and going bare die, even though i dont think its making optimal contact thats still quite a temp drop. Next up will be what 1.3v will get me. Hoping for 4.8-4.9ghz. Ambient and water temp from yesterday to today hasnt changed.
Click to expand...

My mistake regarding the temperature, I read 50 - 47, that means I was mistaken.

Soldered IHS & die combinations do never liquefy under correct temperature load. True both use metal for conductivity however what comes across to me is that your observation was act similar, which is not true.

Liquid metal stays liquid in my experience, and CU cannot absorb another element, the chemistry would be altered.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> My mistake regarding the temperature, I read 50 - 47, that means I was mistaken.
> 
> Soldered IHS & die combinations do never liquefy under correct temperature load. True both use metal for conductivity however what comes across to me is that your observation was act similar, which is not true.
> 
> Liquid metal stays liquid in my experience, and CU cannot absorb another element, the chemistry would be altered.


I dont mind my copper block absorbing clu just fills in all the microscopic gaps and works even better. Yea i was shocked that forza went from 53 to 46 couldnt believe it. AC Syndicate same temps.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Speedfan is from the gods! Used it on my first repurposed office PC a few years ago and have used it everytime I start all of my computers since then. Sucks you had issues with it, I've had a couple fights with it but nothing that reinstalling it hasn't fixed. The set up isn't user friendly, but once you learn what it can do there is no replacement.
> 
> Asus boards do have WONDERFUL fan control compared to any other board I've used (gig, msi, asrock, evga) but it still just isn't enough for some people (like me!). I'm actually replacing my EVGA classified with a cheaper ASUS for no really good reason other than that I miss all the good times we had, controlling fan speeds and temperatures together
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh and the temperature probe headers!!!! dont get me started
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a bit curious what you do with the fans that you cant do with an asus board.
Click to expand...

Forgive my quoting you as my board uses Gigabyte BIOs, it is a Gigabyte board, however your question looks interesting to me while my other topic boarders ugly.

Within Gigabyte BIOS I am given terrible options for fan control, Full Speed, Normal, Silent, Manual ( but no settings are easily scale able such as 1-100% )

Speedfan does allow easily understood curves with simple refresh,
Click up and down : zero to one hundred percent power controlled.
Given the compatibility of your fan engine sure.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> I'm a bit curious what you do with the fans that you cant do with an asus board.


I assume you mean why speedfan over bios control? cause I did say that I just bought an asus board specifically for its control abilities (selling my z97 classified to replace it)

last time I used asus (ai suite or bios) you couldn't control fan speeds via gpu temps, hopefully they've changed this but that was a deal breaker for me when I had my z97-a
the range of control is crazy with speedfan, there have only ever been a couple of things I've desired out of it and I can't think of them off the top of my head because you can basically do anything
SF has alarms and alerts that can be set when conditions are reached,
SF will set fan speeds with as many different temps as you want, not just one
SF is lightweight on the desktop and works well (unlike ai suite). Handy if you need to adjust speeds manually for some reason (benching comes to mind for me)
S.M.A.R.T scans, temperature graphing, data logging (haven't used these much but the smart scans occasionally

And since I'm currently using an EVGA z97 classified that has pretty disappointing fan control options, speedfan is a lifesaver that has made it livable for me. I still only get 1 PWM header, 2 adjustable dc headers in speedfan and 2 bios adjustable (but constant speed) 3pin only headers. without speedfan I think I had a couple presets to choose from on the 3 headers but no options what so ever

Coming from a z97-a with i think 5 pwm/dc headers, I was really disappointed. I just ordered a z97 gryphon m-atx though, should be here wed and am super excited about it


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> I'm a bit curious what you do with the fans that you cant do with an asus board.


Getting a bit off topic here, but I control GPU fans with it. And the intake fan spins up according to either CPU temp or GPU temp, whichever is higher. It also gives me a wider range of RPM with the fans I use, for example, the TY-143 I use would only godown to 650RPM or so, Speedfan brings them down all the way to 300 RPM or slightly below. Running them that low allows me to have a completely inaudible computer without stopping any fans. There are other features as well, but I don't use them on daily basis (data logging, temp alerts etc.).


----------



## bluej511

Excuse the quality, but heres pressure paper bare die with ekwb naked ivy screws. You can see that its putting quite the pressure on the cpu socket by the corners. (I did it twice as you can see the bottom one is what got the good result).

Decent pressure on the die, the edges seem to get the most, and the one edge on the bottom seems to get ridiculous pressure. Im guessing lapping the cpu block would probably fit everything but the temps are good with CLU so no worries.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Getting a bit off topic here, but I control GPU fans with it.


you can control gpu fans with it? Like connected to the GPU? I don't have any gpu fans but that's cool


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> you can control gpu fans with it? Like connected to the GPU? I don't have any gpu fans but that's cool


No, it's connected to one of the motherboard headers, but it's controlled by GPU temps. I've replaced stock cooling on my GPU. It was too noisy.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> No, it's connected to one of the motherboard headers, but it's controlled by GPU temps. I've replaced stock cooling on my GPU. It was too noisy.


ah that is kinda what I figured. Nice though!


----------



## paladdinsane

I wanted to throw out a THANK YOU to this Guide.









This is the best resource on the topic, hands down. I was able to delid my 4670K in under an hour and experienced an immediate drop of 22 degrees C under load, about 6C in idle, averaging around 16C across during use. This in combination with a new heatsink and some case fans allowed me to throw some serious voltage at the CPU, getting a 5100MHz validation in CPU-Z and running at 4894MHz daily use stable (temps stay under 80C! /w core voltage 1.46) This was a lot of fun for me!

Used the razor blade method and CLU on the die.

Not a single issue with the process.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Excuse the quality, but heres pressure paper bare die with ekwb naked ivy screws. You can see that its putting quite the pressure on the cpu socket by the corners. (I did it twice as you can see the bottom one is what got the good result).
> 
> Decent pressure on the die, the edges seem to get the most, and the one edge on the bottom seems to get ridiculous pressure. Im guessing lapping the cpu block would probably fit everything but the temps are good with CLU so no worries.


Just cut the plastic on the socket down a little bit? Way less time consuming.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Just cut the plastic on the socket down a little bit? Way less time consuming.


Yea i thought about that but then wasnt sure if it would put too much pressure on the actual die and pins themselves. The temps are great and staying under 50°C at 1.2v, so plenty of headroom even if i go to 1.3v.

Pretty sure i might have used the paper wrong, heard that youre supposed to leave it on a while but i left it on for like 2mins. Took it off and there wasnt nothing there, after a day the paper got way more purple so who knows.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i thought about that but then wasnt sure if it would put too much pressure on the actual die and pins themselves. The temps are great and staying under 50°C at 1.2v, so plenty of headroom even if i go to 1.3v.
> 
> Pretty sure i might have used the paper wrong, heard that youre supposed to leave it on a while but i left it on for like 2mins. Took it off and there wasnt nothing there, after a day the paper got way more purple so who knows.


Just be careful lol and I've had 1.5v on my 4670k and it hit 96c while using IBT AVX. Bare die is great.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paladdinsane*
> 
> I wanted to throw out a THANK YOU to this Guide.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the best resource on the topic, hands down. I was able to delid my 4670K in under an hour and experienced an immediate drop of 22 degrees C under load, about 6C in idle, averaging around 16C across during use. This in combination with a new heatsink and some case fans allowed me to throw some serious voltage at the CPU, getting a 5100MHz validation in CPU-Z and running at 4894MHz daily use stable (temps stay under 80C! /w core voltage 1.46) This was a lot of fun for me!
> 
> Used the razor blade method and CLU on the die.
> 
> Not a single issue with the process.


Glad it helped you out!


----------



## Conditioned

So I got clu a couple of days ago and applied it. Hit 81c then with clu, previously 88c delided with regular thermal paste, think I was hitting just above 90 undelided. However I had hit 68c the first time I put regular thermal paste on it, so I figured the clu was a little too little. So i redid it and now hitting 65c on the hottest core, in 50 runs of ibt standard. Now I think it was worth all the work.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Conditioned*
> 
> So I got clu a couple of days ago and applied it. Hit 81c then with clu, previously 88c delided with regular thermal paste, think I was hitting just above 90 undelided. However I had hit 68c the first time I put regular thermal paste on it, so I figured the clu was a little too little. So i redid it and now hitting 65c on the hottest core, in 50 runs of ibt standard. Now I think it was worth all the work.


CLU seems to be very sensitive to application. Depending on the pressure, flatness of the ihs and flatness of the die. It can end up being the same as a crappy TIM or much much better if done correctly.


----------



## Conditioned

I spoke too soon. I supposed the issue was between the die and the ihs. Now I believe the issue is pump between the dh15 and the ihs. Temps went up to 82-83 after 30 mins. WIll try something new there, but don't know what yet. Probably not clu, cause I want to be able to reuse it.


----------



## paladdinsane

@Conditioned dh15 is nickel plated and I was informed that CLU won't do any significant damage to nickel plated copper, believe that Coollaboratory even says in documentation that any residue that sticks from CLU should, if anything, improve the thermal abilities of the surface. Anyways, I applied it to my dh15 with the intention that it would only get removed somewhere waaay down the line (semi permanent) but correct me if I am wrong, I believe you can use CLU on nickel plated copper with zero problems for reusability.

It is CL Pro that people have had problems with.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paladdinsane*
> 
> @Conditioned dh15 is nickel plated and I was informed that CLU won't do any significant damage to nickel plated copper, believe that Coollaboratory even says in documentation that any residue that sticks from CLU should, if anything, improve the thermal abilities of the surface. Anyways, I applied it to my dh15 with the intention that it would only get removed somewhere waaay down the line (semi permanent) but correct me if I am wrong, I believe you can use CLU on nickel plated copper with zero problems for reusability.
> 
> It is CL Pro that people have had problems with.


Correct, issue is if its hardens its a pita, nothing a quick stress test with the fan off cant fix haha.

Once you take the cooler off you can take off the IHS again and take a look see if the clu has good contact with the IHS. A nice good thick thermal paste works best in high heat. I stopped using the Noctua paste on bare die as it pumps out ridiculously fast. Try gc extreme or kryonaut or hydronaut both super thick.


----------



## paladdinsane

Noooooooooo I broke my CPU!!!



This is what happens when you try to delid a Pentium 4 that is soldered to the IHS. The IHS takes the die with it as it pops off the silicon. Did a nice little flight across my room.
Rest in peace sweet SL7AA, you never made it to HWBOT(was the intent for playing around with the delid,) but you served me well anyways.

dont mess with solder


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paladdinsane*
> 
> Noooooooooo I broke my CPU!!!
> 
> 
> 
> This is what happens when you try to delid a Pentium 4 that is soldered to the IHS. The IHS takes the die with it as it pops off the silicon. Did a nice little flight across my room.
> Rest in peace sweet SL7AA, you never made it to HWBOT(was the intent for playing around with the delid,) but you served me well anyways.
> 
> dont mess with solder


You should've used a blowtorch/lighter on the ihs while holding it upside down by the pcb after all the silicone was cut. It would've fell right off.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *paladdinsane*
> 
> Noooooooooo I broke my CPU!!!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is what happens when you try to delid a Pentium 4 that is soldered to the IHS. The IHS takes the die with it as it pops off the silicon. Did a nice little flight across my room.
> Rest in peace sweet SL7AA, you never made it to HWBOT(was the intent for playing around with the delid,) but you served me well anyways.
> 
> dont mess with solder
> 
> 
> 
> You should've used a blowtorch/lighter on the ihs while holding it upside down by the pcb after all the silicone was cut. It would've fell right off.
Click to expand...

What is the easiest way to remove silicone glue for soldered die?


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> What is the easiest way to remove silicone glue for soldered die?


A thin razor blade, steady hands and patience.


----------



## CAxVIPER

I was a bit worried about throwing my CPU in a vise and beating on it with something but once it popped free it was definitely worth it. Saw my temps on a 4690k 4.5GHz/1.25v drop from 80c at the high to about 60c. Still running prime 95 to see how high it will go after a few hours. I may have not put enough CLU on as my temps at idle(1-2% load) are around 30c when my room is only 23c or maybe this is normal I've never really paid attention. Regardless I have a decent amount of headroom now for OCing hopefully up to at least 4.8


----------



## DR4G00N

Delidded my G3258 with a razor blade.







Didn't really need to since it was only at 67c/58c @ 4.7GHz 1.45V (it oc's like crud, I'll probably get a 4790K to replace it) but I'm hoping I can squeeze out another 100MHz from it.
The factory tim was hard as rock so this will definitely help once I replace it with clu if I have any left.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I love delids.


----------



## malaki

watching this video





the guy uses silicone at 4:33 not only to glue the ihs back on, but he also puts silicone on some of the contacts in the middle

is this recommended?

i haven't seen anyone else doing this


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malaki*
> 
> watching this video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the guy uses silicone at 4:33 not only to glue the ihs back on, but he also puts silicone on some of the contacts in the middle
> 
> is this recommended?
> 
> i haven't seen anyone else doing this


Yes people often use clear nail polish or like myself use LET (Liquid electrical tape) It keeps the capacitors safe from the conductive CLU/P just incase you have some go over the edge and make contact with them.

In short, it's a safety measure


----------



## malaki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Yes people often use clear nail polish or like myself use LET (Liquid electrical tape) It keeps the capacitors safe from the conductive CLU/P just incase you have some go over the edge and make contact with them.
> 
> In short, it's a safety measure


thanks,
i'm going to use his guide today as a reference
if I don't answer tomorrow my cpu is dead


----------



## bluej511

I used lacquer over mine worked great. Just dont use too much that it ends up sitting above the die haha.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *malaki*
> 
> if I don't answer tomorrow my cpu is dead


I like this character. My kind of style.


----------



## dmfree88

Hello everyone. I have been here a few times to poke around considering delidding an old intel CPU I had but never got the guts to try. Well I decided to take a risk and buy a pre-delidded CPU off someone here on Overclock with a good rep in selling delidded CPU. My question is do I have anything to worry about as far as long term use? Assuming he did a good job on the process isn't a delidded CPU actually better for both longevity and cooling capability?

Ignore this post I am just a newb. Finally learned a few things







.


----------



## DR4G00N

New temps after delidding my G3258:

4.8GHz core @ 1.5V & 4.4GHz Cache @ 1.3V VCCIO, +0.200V VCCSA, 1.95V VRIN - Did I mention that this thing is crud?







(It's a benching cpu so don't worry about the volts).









P95 Small FFT's 6mins 54c/49c. 14c ambient.
Cooler is an H110.



Will grab a cpu-z valid later.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> New temps after delidding my G3258:
> 
> 4.8GHz core @ 1.5V & 4.4GHz Cache @ 1.3V VCCIO, +0.200V VCCSA, 1.95V VRIN - Did I mention that this thing is crud?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (It's a benching cpu so don't worry about the volts).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P95 Small FFT's 6mins 54c/49c. 14c ambient.
> Cooler is an H110.
> 
> 
> 
> Will grab a cpu-z valid later.


Damn Nova Scotia is cold lol. Its 23°C ambien here already. I miss my winter temps haha.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Damn Nova Scotia is cold lol. Its 23°C ambien here already. I miss my winter temps haha.


It's not too bad you just have to wear a sweater all the time. Winter is nice though, you can just open a window and bam! <-10c ambient room temp.


----------



## jonathan13

Is it possible to use this MSI die guard on Skylake? I know the EK Naked Ivy will not work on Skylake due to the differences in die height, but I am not sure if this applies to this MSI die guard as well.



Also, I stumbled upon this while searching for an answer. I emailed MSI and I am waiting for a response. Anyone know if this ever actually happened or if the idea was scrapped?

https://www.msi.com/news/detail/dXl3iPsya7YgAF-m94pNaLJmVly0G9x1K-LCdLlwZFPBsXUx7Id1E6Sk1sjFUR4goepg8SDEJrJ8WIDba8gRxQ~~

Any insight for either would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys!


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ok so for anyone interested in easier deliding, or someone who doesnt want to buy a vice or risk using razor blades. I found this gem online by searching youtube videos, as a fan of engineering and easier life i decided to give it a try. I had already delided my 4690k but do have a 3350p on a spare computer. Heres a video of how it works.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I ordered it a week or so ago but contacted the manufacturer as to why ivy bridge wasn't available. The IHS is a bit different but he said he would include an ivy top for me to use, a prototype if you will. As he responded very quickly and promptly i decided to order one. Yes it might seem like a waste for deliding one chip but like i said, if i can bring useful tools (and safer) to the forum ill gladly take the bait.
> 
> Came very quickly and was packaged in a bubble envelope, one down side was it def needs better packaging. No damage but it seems like my postal service had to add a plastic envelope on top of it as the letter somehow was open (unless they opened it themselves for safety issues and scanning, no idea). Came with all the pieces intact so no issues.
> 
> The tool looks EXTREMELY well built. The bottom seems to be made of maybe aluminum as its quiet light but feels very solid. The bottom of the tool can also be used to relid (with very thin glue if you deem necessary, maybe for warranty or for whatever reason). After putting the chip in the jig and placing the top and screwing it down, i used a 5mm hex and it literally took 30secs to work. No hammering, no wood, no razor blades. Here are some pictures, if anymore question just ask. I am shocked at how incredibly well it worked. Theres literally no chance of damage. Youll feel/hear the IHS pop free of the glue, then you can continue turning the hex to twist it off fully or pry it off with your fingers/fingernails. It just came right off.
> 
> Here is the bottom, and the 2 lids. Left one does haswell/skylake/devilscanyon midle one does ivy only.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How it looks in the jig.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Close up of how flush the pcb sits in the rig, no risk of chipping or anything.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heres a close up of the IHS sitting in the top piece. Again very flush and stable.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And here she is delided in 30secs.
> 
> 
> So there you go an affordable and safe free tool for deliding. Any questions or if someone wants more pictures let me know. I didn't take a picture of the screws holding the top on, theres 4 plastic screws that just hold the top down. No need to go crazy tight as it will make it harder to turn the hex. Hand snug will do.


Just pressed the order button.
Thanks for the excellent post on this delidding tool.
It's a no brainer for me, no razor blades or vise needed, and it looks like it works very well.

Rep+


----------



## xGeNeSisx

I received my order of the BreakFree cpu delid tool and plan to test it out tomorrow


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> Is it possible to use this MSI die guard on Skylake? I know the EK Naked Ivy will not work on Skylake due to the differences in die height, but I am not sure if this applies to this MSI die guard as well.
> 
> 
> 
> Also, I stumbled upon this while searching for an answer. I emailed MSI and I am waiting for a response. Anyone know if this ever actually happened or if the idea was scrapped?
> 
> https://www.msi.com/news/detail/dXl3iPsya7YgAF-m94pNaLJmVly0G9x1K-LCdLlwZFPBsXUx7Id1E6Sk1sjFUR4goepg8SDEJrJ8WIDba8gRxQ~~
> 
> Any insight for either would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys!


Only issue i see with this is that most waterblocks already sit on the actual cpu socket and put minimal pressure on the die itself. I tested this with pressure paper a few posts up, so i dont even see what that die guard does to be honest id have to look into it.

Honestly i dont think it would make any difference for skylake i think thats a bust running bare die.

NIce, congrats to both of you with that tool. Honestly its fantastic, im kinda sad mine just sits now i wanna go around and delid cpus for free haha. If anyone in France or Europe has a skylake to send id love to try it, no assurances though stuff can happen haha.


----------



## jonathan13

Appreciate the info bluej.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Just pressed the order button.
> Thanks for the excellent post on this delidding tool.
> It's a no brainer for me, no razor blades or vise needed, and it looks like it works very well.
> 
> Rep+


Yea i actually like trying out stuff no one has before, i dont mind being a guinea pig when its something i know looks and works well so gave it a shot. Send me a pm or post up once you get it would love to know what you think.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Just pressed the order button.
> Thanks for the excellent post on this delidding tool.
> It's a no brainer for me, no razor blades or vise needed, and it looks like it works very well.
> 
> Rep+
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yea i actually like trying out stuff no one has before, i dont mind being a guinea pig when its something i know looks and works well so gave it a shot. Send me a pm or post up once you get it would love to know what you think.
Click to expand...

I'll be sure to let you know.
I specified priority shipping, it'll likely take a week or so to get here.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> I'll be sure to let you know.
> I specified priority shipping, it'll likely take a week or so to get here.


Yea i think it comes out of Finland, thats what mine said anyways and took i believe 5 days to get here. Its crazy how i can order something from Japan or the US and get it faster then if i order from the UK.


----------



## xGeNeSisx

Ok so I successfully delidded my i5 6400! Took me a while and II was nervous as hell. I eventually ended up remounting the IHS as I didn't think I got it right at first. My temperatures at idle seem to be slightly lower 3-4 °C, but my load temperatures are around 8-10 °C cooler. I'll have to watch ambient temperature and run more stress tests to get an exact figure. Temps might be even cooler after AS5 break in period


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> Appreciate the info bluej.


You can't run a skylake chip bare die, they sit too low in the socket, you would need to use a copper shim on the die but not sure how thick.


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> You can't run a skylake chip bare die, they sit too low in the socket, you would need to use a copper shim on the die but not sure how thick.


And thank you as well








I will probably just pop the lid and swap out the TIM and reseal it. Seems like the better solution, for myself anyway.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> And thank you as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will probably just pop the lid and swap out the TIM and reseal it. Seems like the better solution, for myself anyway.


Honestly since its skylake i would really consider a liquid metal. TIMs dont seem to last very long on bare die. Idk if its the pressure of the IHS or what but temps will go up within days or weeks depending on the TIM


----------



## dmfree88

Instead of leaving the lid loose on my delidded CPU I was considering tacking it down in just one or two corners with something to make it easy to remove later but also keep it in place to prevent moving during installation. What type of glue do people use on CPU? If I only do a small amount do you guys think it will it be easy to remove?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Instead of leaving the lid loose on my delidded CPU I was considering tacking it down in just one or two corners with something to make it easy to remove later but also keep it in place to prevent moving during installation. What type of glue do people use on CPU? If I only do a small amount do you guys think it will it be easy to remove?


I dont see why it wouldnt be? issue id have though is if you did a corner or 2 corners it might raise it back up even a slight amount. Might even do it unevenly. Tons of people are going around saying the intel TIM is the issue but its really not, the TIM they use is actually VERY good and has silver in it from what ive read.The issue is the gap the glue leaves which raises the IHS a very tiny amount but its enough that the TIM then becomes inefficient.

The best way would be to hold it down while pushing down then clamp he down. I tried it on ivy bridge and got it to not even move.


----------



## dmfree88

Good point. I was aware of that after some long research the other day but I didn't really think it would be as much as stock if you just used a little but I really dont want it to be uneven at the very least. What if you tacked it down from the outside edge? Like tack welding but with glue? Could that be a solution that avoids the problem of adding height? I guess I do not plan to take it out of its hole very often by any means but I figure its easier in the long run if I am able to handle it to a certain extent without worry of shifting thermal material.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Good point. I was aware of that after some long research the other day but I didn't really think it would be as much as stock if you just used a little but I really dont want it to be uneven at the very least. What if you tacked it down from the outside edge? Like tack welding but with glue? Could that be a solution that avoids the problem of adding height? I guess I do not plan to take it out of its hole very often by any means but I figure its easier in the long run if I am able to handle it to a certain extent without worry of shifting thermal material.


Could maybe if you use rtv against the edges along the pcb kinda of like doing grout i could see that working. youd have to have it perfectly still though cuz if it moves while sealing youd have to unseal it all over again haha.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Instead of leaving the lid loose on my delidded CPU I was considering tacking it down in just one or two corners with something to make it easy to remove later but also keep it in place to prevent moving during installation. What type of glue do people use on CPU? If I only do a small amount do you guys think it will it be easy to remove?
> 
> 
> 
> I dont see why it wouldnt be? issue id have though is if you did a corner or 2 corners it might raise it back up even a slight amount. Might even do it unevenly. Tons of people are going around saying the intel TIM is the issue but its really not, the TIM they use is actually VERY good and has silver in it from what ive read.The issue is the gap the glue leaves which raises the IHS a very tiny amount but its enough that the TIM then becomes inefficient.
> 
> The best way would be to hold it down while pushing down then clamp he down. I tried it on ivy bridge and got it to not even move.
Click to expand...

So true about the claim that it is the TIM Intel uses, which is propaganda from Intel.
They refuse to acknowledge the real issue, which is the over-application of the glue on the IHS during manufacturing, which creates too much of a gap between the IHS and the cpu die.

It doesn't help that those who are mislead by the TIM story, tend to repeat this false information like parrots, lol.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Good point. I was aware of that after some long research the other day but I didn't really think it would be as much as stock if you just used a little but I really dont want it to be uneven at the very least. What if you tacked it down from the outside edge? Like tack welding but with glue? Could that be a solution that avoids the problem of adding height? I guess I do not plan to take it out of its hole very often by any means but I figure its easier in the long run if I am able to handle it to a certain extent without worry of shifting thermal material.


I used a TINY bit of silicone on the edges of the ihs when I initially delidded. It does make install/uninstall easier and I still got a good temp drop. I have noticed any temp difference since I stopped resealing it either. I feel like I still get a tiny amount of slide when I'm holding it down and latching it in but it hasn't caused issues yet. I'd say try it out but use an extremely small amount and preferably apply pressure while it dries to keep good contact


----------



## g0tsl33p14

@0ldChicken Off topic though how many hours would you think you have into the hardline cooling of your rig? Do I see correctly you've cpu and gpu runs separate from each other, green is gpu "ooze" and blue "ooze" for the cpu 240 rad plus 120 rad?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> @0ldChicken Off topic though how many hours would you think you have into the hardline cooling of your rig? Do I see correctly you've cpu and gpu runs separate from each other, green is gpu "ooze" and blue "ooze" for the cpu 240 rad plus 120 rad?


yeah that's correct. I probably spent 6 hours bending all the petg and another 20 or so fitting everything in the case and whatnot


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> yeah that's correct. I probably spent 6 hours bending all the petg and another 20 or so fitting everything in the case and whatnot


I've been bending my acrylic for several days now because my bends are over complicated lmao then I had to buy 90 degree fittings to make my life easier but I bought some tubing as I had run out that turned out to be a few mm too big, nothing short of a nightmare, but I'm sure it will look cool once done.


----------



## Benjiw

Has anyone had issues with their FIVR causing instability due to heat? I'm still trying to get my 4670k stable at 4.8ghz+ but I get full on hard locks randomly while gaming. Not sure if it's heat related or voltage settings maybe, I did get it to pass a few stress tests at 4.9 but it crashed repeatedly while gaming, my Hyperx RAM might be to fault as they will not run with their XMP settings.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Has anyone had issues with their FIVR causing instability due to heat? I'm still trying to get my 4670k stable at 4.8ghz+ but I get full on hard locks randomly while gaming. Not sure if it's heat related or voltage settings maybe, I did get it to pass a few stress tests at 4.9 but it crashed repeatedly while gaming, my Hyperx RAM might be to fault as they will not run with their XMP settings.


are you getting crashes while running stock? could be like GTA5 it was a real killer for any major OC I had to down clock majorly on my GPUs to run stable still slightly OC but nothing like the clocks I could run in Battlefield 4


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> are you getting crashes while running stock? could be like GTA5 it was a real killer for any major OC I had to down clock majorly on my GPUs to run stable still slightly OC but nothing like the clocks I could run in Battlefield 4


I can get 4.7ghz stable with 1.3v but anything over that just won't stabilize, so I think heat due to too much voltage it becoming an issue. I need to get my loop finished and see if my oc will become more stable with the new ram I have.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I can get 4.7ghz stable with 1.3v but anything over that just won't stabilize, so I think heat due to too much voltage it becoming an issue. I need to get my loop finished and see if my oc will become more stable with the new ram I have.


you missed the point is it the OC on GPUs?


----------



## dmfree88

Ordered Phobya Liquid metal thermal compound. Is there anything I need to be aware of with it? Was planning to paint it on like many suggest for Cool Laboratory's liquid metal compounds. I assume Phobya's is the same or similar? Anyone have any experience with it and want to share how it worked for you? I would appreciate it, thanks







.


----------



## Madmaxneo

I am now seriously thinking of delidding my 4930k.
It seems I have lost the silicon lottery with this chip because the best I can do is 4.3ghz @ 1.37vcore. If I try 4.4ghz at any vcore I get a BSOD in less than 2 mins. Right now I am running the Intel burn test at Very High settings and my highest spiked temps are about 74 deg with averages in the high 60's.
If I delid my CPU is it possible I could hit better OC numbers?

FYI, if anyone knows how to interpret the results numbers on the Intel Burn test I am getting 3.393207e-002.

The test just completed at 765.52 seconds.
If I run the test at normal my high temps are around 64 deg with averages in the mid 50's.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Ordered Phobya Liquid metal thermal compound. Is there anything I need to be aware of with it? Was planning to paint it on like many suggest for Cool Laboratory's liquid metal compounds. I assume Phobya's is the same or similar? Anyone have any experience with it and want to share how it worked for you? I would appreciate it, thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


My only experience is having a syringe in my backup supply, it has seen no use.
Initial tests show Phobya being pretty good though, it is odd how rare follow up regarding this specific liquid metal is.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Madmaxneo*
> 
> I am now seriously thinking of delidding my 4930k.
> It seems I have lost the silicon lottery with this chip because the best I can do is 4.3ghz @ 1.37vcore. If I try 4.4ghz at any vcore I get a BSOD in less than 2 mins. Right now I am running the Intel burn test at Very High settings and my highest spiked temps are about 74 deg with averages in the high 60's.
> If I delid my CPU is it possible I could hit better OC numbers?
> 
> FYI, if anyone knows how to interpret the results numbers on the Intel Burn test I am getting 3.393207e-002.
> 
> The test just completed at 765.52 seconds.
> If I run the test at normal my high temps are around 64 deg with averages in the mid 50's.


That is a difficult question to answer (for me in the least) because the answer is yes however not because of the delid yet. I would have to guess that your motherboard, ram, and power supply would need to be considered before the delid helps. Make sure your mobo is not shutting things down with overvoltage protections, make sure your power supply can handle it enough, and ram is also sensitive from what I read when maintaining high overclocks. vrms

Thus yes, it will help *after* things are under control, is my answer.


----------



## dmfree88

well the mobo I got ended up being damaged so I sent it back.


The Phobya LM arrived today I haven't been able to try it for the above reason. Phobya was actually cheaper and from the like 3 tests I could find it seems to be better than CLLP/CLLU performance-wise. Hope it is easy to play with. New mobo should arrive in a few days and I will post results although I have no before results unfortunately. I also have no previous experience to compare it to for me to know if its easier or worse than CLLP/CLLU either. I am a poor test dummy lol. Regardless will post how it goes


----------



## dmfree88

Hopefully my last question for you guys before I do this in a couple days. Is it safe to use the thermal paste removal and purify stuff (the 2 stage prep stuff provided with AS5 kit) on the CPU die? I always use it on my heatsink/IHS to make sure the surface is clean but is it safe on the die itself? If not what should be used that is safe?


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Madmaxneo*
> 
> I am now seriously thinking of delidding my 4930k.
> It seems I have lost the silicon lottery with this chip because the best I can do is 4.3ghz @ 1.37vcore. If I try 4.4ghz at any vcore I get a BSOD in less than 2 mins. Right now I am running the Intel burn test at Very High settings and my highest spiked temps are about 74 deg with averages in the high 60's.
> If I delid my CPU is it possible I could hit better OC numbers?
> 
> FYI, if anyone knows how to interpret the results numbers on the Intel Burn test I am getting 3.393207e-002.
> 
> The test just completed at 765.52 seconds.
> If I run the test at normal my high temps are around 64 deg with averages in the mid 50's.


remembering it is a soldered chip so no TIM whole different ballgame
I would either settle for 4.3Ghz or sell and buy another lottery chip in my personal experience 74°C will not be the limiting factor of your OC


----------



## Madmaxneo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> My only experience is having a syringe in my backup supply, it has seen no use.
> Initial tests show Phobya being pretty good though, it is odd how rare follow up regarding this specific liquid metal is.
> That is a difficult question to answer (for me in the least) because the answer is yes however not because of the delid yet. I would have to guess that your motherboard, ram, and power supply would need to be considered before the delid helps. Make sure your mobo is not shutting things down with overvoltage protections, make sure your power supply can handle it enough, and ram is also sensitive from what I read when maintaining high overclocks. vrms
> 
> Thus yes, it will help *after* things are under control, is my answer.


My system can more than handle it. Check my rig in my sig.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> remembering it is a soldered chip so no TIM whole different ballgame
> I would either settle for 4.3Ghz or sell and buy another lottery chip in my personal experience 74°C will not be the limiting factor of your OC


I have heard about the soldered chips and that they are the most difficult to deal with when it comes to delidding.
I currently have a 240mm rad cooling my cpu and will be upgrading to the Swiftech H320-x2 soon so it should provide lower max temps.
I also have aXeon 2670 that I purchased for the sole purpose of being a temporary replacement chip while I send this 4930k in for the Intel tuning plan (already approved). I believe I have a good chance of getting a better chip .

Thanks for the advice all......


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Madmaxneo*
> 
> My system can more than handle it. Check my rig in my sig.
> I have heard about the soldered chips and that they are the most difficult to deal with when it comes to delidding.
> I currently have a 240mm rad cooling my cpu and will be upgrading to the Swiftech H320-x2 soon so it should provide lower max temps.
> I also have aXeon 2670 that I purchased for the sole purpose of being a temporary replacement chip while I send this 4930k in for the Intel tuning plan (already approved). I believe I have a good chance of getting a better chip .
> 
> Thanks for the advice all......


Deliding on a soldered chip is pointless, then again so is a 240mm rad for a cpu haha. Its going to BARELY give you lower temps over an air cooler. Mine has gone from 49°C at stock speeds/voltage on a Noctua NH-U14S to around the same temps at 4.2/1.2v on a custom loop with a 240 and a 360. CPUs dont benefit much from going water and thats from someone whose had both and is now running bare die.

Now GPU thats a different story, from 71°C to 41°C going to water haha. Yea im happy about that one.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> you missed the point is it the OC on GPUs?


No it does it on stock clocks with the GPU so it can't be the card.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> And thank you as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will probably just pop the lid and swap out the TIM and reseal it. Seems like the better solution, for myself anyway.


Honestly a 0.75mm thick bit of copper should surfice at a guess, use LM TIM on both sides of the copper shim and you're naked.


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Honestly a 0.75mm thick bit of copper should surfice at a guess, use LM TIM on both sides of the copper shim and you're naked.


How confident are you of the 0.75mm thickness? I would love to do it this if someone could confirm the thickness for Skylake. I can just see me tightening away and hearing a God awful "snap", only to discover I have annihilated my 6700K. I am one of those guys that worked on cars long before computers, and unfortunately have a habit of over-tightening things.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> How confident are you of the 0.75mm thickness? I would love to do it this if someone could confirm the thickness for Skylake. I can just see me tightening away and hearing a God awful "snap", only to discover I have annihilated my 6700K. I am one of those guys that worked on cars long before computers, and unfortunately have a habit of over-tightening things.


If your using a water block (because there absolutely huge) youll bottom out onto the cpu socket before you bend the wafer, but if your concerned aquacomputer does make a solid metal shim to put over your chip so it doesnt bend. Google aquacomputer shim


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> If your using a water block (because there absolutely huge) youll bottom out onto the cpu socket before you bend the wafer, but if your concerned aquacomputer does make a solid metal shim to put over your chip so it doesnt bend. Google aquacomputer shim


Fantastic. Thank you for the information!


----------



## DR4G00N

OCN name: DR4G00N
CPU: Pentium G3258
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: 100MHz
OC after delid: 4.8GHz
Temp drops: ~20c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/i86w6t


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> OCN name: DR4G00N
> CPU: Pentium G3258
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: 100MHz
> OC after delid: 4.8GHz
> Temp drops: ~20c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/i86w6t


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## davidcapi

Hello. I'm just joining the (Devil's Canyon) delid club. I used the vise/no hammer method and have to say, all the process is really easy. I had a hard time finding liquid electrical tape and instead found this Scotch Glass Cloth Electrical Tape with thermosetable rubber resin, it's class B (0-150c operating range) and it's meant for sealing ovens and such. Before using it I put it to the test on a small oven at 150c for several times in the course of 2 days and the tape remained unchanged, so yeah... we will have to see how that goes.

Here's the pics of my results of a not great, not bad 4690k on a ITX Asus h170 motherboard, 240mm watercool loop, 22c ambient temps. In my particular case, I was motivated by the fact this chip was hitting 80c at 4.6/1.28v in AIDA64 and felt like something was wrong with it (yes, I tried reapplying paste between IHS and waterblock).

I used CLU on die, IHS glued back on with GE Silicone II Black (acid-free when curing) and GELID extreme on waterblock. I wish my cpu was one of those hitting 5ghz at 1.4v or less, real gems.

I decided to put the IHS back on for "security" and reselling reasons.

I used AIDA64 because almost every stress test out there will give you varying results, be it prime95 v26.6, prime95 v28.7, wPrime, IBT or AIDA64. AIDA64 gave me a nice average between all of these.

All test last for 25min+/-. I would love to do 8hrs+ tests but I simply don't have the time for that so take it as it is.

Please notice the huge voltage jump my particular chip needed for moving up from 4.4 to 4.6Ghz.

I settled for 4.8Ghz/1.35v with 1200rpm fans which brought cpu temps 3c higher.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davidcapi*
> 
> Hello. I'm just joining the (Devil's Canyon) delid club. I used the vise/no hammer method and have to say, all the process is really easy. I had a hard time finding liquid electrical tape and instead found this Scotch Glass Cloth Electrical Tape with thermosetable rubber resin, it's class B (0-150c operating range) and it's meant for sealing ovens and such. Before using it I put it to the test on a small oven at 150c for several times in the course of 2 days and the tape remained unchanged, so yeah... we will have to see how that goes.
> 
> Here's the pics of my results of a not great, not bad 4690k on a ITX Asus h170 motherboard, 240mm watercool loop, 22c ambient temps. In my particular case, I was motivated by the fact this chip was hitting 80c at 4.6/1.28v in AIDA64 and felt like something was wrong with it (yes, I tried reapplying paste between IHS and waterblock).
> 
> I used CLU on die, IHS glued back on with GE Silicone II Black (acid-free when curing) and GELID extreme on waterblock. I wish my cpu was one of those hitting 5ghz at 1.4v or less, real gems.
> 
> I decided to put the IHS back on for "security" and reselling reasons.
> 
> I used AIDA64 because almost every stress test out there will give you varying results, be it prime95 v26.6, prime95 v28.7, wPrime, IBT or AIDA64. AIDA64 gave me a nice average between all of these.
> 
> All test last for 25min+/-. I would love to do 8hrs+ tests but I simply don't have the time for that so take it as it is.
> 
> Please notice the huge voltage jump my particular chip needed for moving up from 4.4 to 4.6Ghz.
> 
> I settled for 4.8Ghz/1.35v with 1200rpm fans which brought cpu temps 3c higher.


Nice you dropped some good temps. Mine bare die at 1.2 is about 46-47°C and about 56°C at 1.3 and 4.8ghz. Its the same temps in some games as well but i have a 240 and a 360 as i have a gpu in there as well.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> How confident are you of the 0.75mm thickness? I would love to do it this if someone could confirm the thickness for Skylake. I can just see me tightening away and hearing a God awful "snap", only to discover I have annihilated my 6700K. I am one of those guys that worked on cars long before computers, and unfortunately have a habit of over-tightening things.


The die sits 0.4mm under the "posts" on the socket so depending on how much the pins give when under the tension of the block I'd say 0.75mm is a good start.


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The die sits 0.4mm under the "posts" on the socket so depending on how much the pins give when under the tension of the block I'd say 0.75mm is a good start.


Appreciate the info! I have a shim ordered from AquaComputer and I will take a look at how everything sits once it arrives and see what needs to be done to fill the gap.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> Appreciate the info! I have a shim ordered from AquaComputer and I will take a look at how everything sits once it arrives and see what needs to be done to fill the gap.


Good luck, just take it easy tightening down with the shim in place, the PCB on skylake chips is thin and weak compared to DC etc, just like with overclocking, slowly does it.


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Good luck, just take it easy tightening down with the shim in place, the PCB on skylake chips is thin and weak compared to DC etc, just like with overclocking, slowly does it.


So I've heard. I'm probably going to end up leaving it to loose. lol


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> So I've heard. I'm probably going to end up leaving it to loose. lol


I wonder if someone has measured how far the cpu goes down into the socket under compression? Saying that, you could measure the thickness of the IHS from both an haswell or DC and skylake and do some simple math to get your shim height instead of my guess-timate


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I wonder if someone has measured how far the cpu goes down into the socket under compression? Saying that, you could measure the thickness of the IHS from both an haswell or DC and skylake and do some simple math to get your shim height instead of my guess-timate


That would be incredibly helpful if such information exists. I sure would like to avoid crushing my $350 chip. lol. Gotta pay to play, I suppose.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> That would be incredibly helpful if such information exists. I sure would like to avoid crushing my $350 chip. lol. Gotta pay to play, I suppose.


I have a loose haswell IHS in my box of parts, if you wait till saturday/sunday I can measure that with a vernier gauge? I think the PCB thickness numbers are floating around because of the skylake bendgate media fiasco.


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I have a loose haswell IHS in my box of parts, if you wait till saturday/sunday I can measure that with a vernier gauge? I think the PCB thickness numbers are floating around because of the skylake bendgate media fiasco.


I certainly do not mind waiting. Like I said, the shim is on it's way, but I have not ordered my delid tool yet. There is still probably a month before this fiasco happens.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *davidcapi*
> 
> Hello. I'm just joining the (Devil's Canyon) delid club. I used the vise/no hammer method and have to say, all the process is really easy. I had a hard time finding liquid electrical tape and instead found this Scotch Glass Cloth Electrical Tape with thermosetable rubber resin, it's class B (0-150c operating range) and it's meant for sealing ovens and such. Before using it I put it to the test on a small oven at 150c for several times in the course of 2 days and the tape remained unchanged, so yeah... we will have to see how that goes.
> 
> Here's the pics of my results of a not great, not bad 4690k on a ITX Asus h170 motherboard, 240mm watercool loop, 22c ambient temps. In my particular case, I was motivated by the fact this chip was hitting 80c at 4.6/1.28v in AIDA64 and felt like something was wrong with it (yes, I tried reapplying paste between IHS and waterblock).
> 
> I used CLU on die, IHS glued back on with GE Silicone II Black (acid-free when curing) and GELID extreme on waterblock. I wish my cpu was one of those hitting 5ghz at 1.4v or less, real gems.
> 
> I decided to put the IHS back on for "security" and reselling reasons.
> 
> I used AIDA64 because almost every stress test out there will give you varying results, be it prime95 v26.6, prime95 v28.7, wPrime, IBT or AIDA64. AIDA64 gave me a nice average between all of these.
> 
> All test last for 25min+/-. I would love to do 8hrs+ tests but I simply don't have the time for that so take it as it is.
> 
> Please notice the huge voltage jump my particular chip needed for moving up from 4.4 to 4.6Ghz.
> 
> I settled for 4.8Ghz/1.35v with 1200rpm fans which brought cpu temps 3c higher.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I need your information requested in the Original Post, OP to add you to the list!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I wonder if someone has measured how far the cpu goes down into the socket under compression? Saying that, you could measure the thickness of the IHS from both an haswell or DC and skylake and do some simple math to get your shim height instead of my guess-timate


Very easy to do. Straight edge on the ihs then measure with a digital caliper height of the entire thing to the mobo then subtract the thickness of the ihs. In my case the IHS was 2.5mm i believe.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> I certainly do not mind waiting. Like I said, the shim is on it's way, but I have not ordered my delid tool yet. There is still probably a month before this fiasco happens.


Ah okay, I have a 6600k at my disposal too so I'll give that a measure, I already have a delid tool.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Very easy to do. Straight edge on the ihs then measure with a digital caliper height of the entire thing to the mobo then subtract the thickness of the ihs. In my case the IHS was 2.5mm i believe.


What we're measuring here is IHS height because we need to work out how thick a shim needs to be to stop a waterblock hitting the socket posts, I already know the die is 0.4mm under the socket posts because de8auer already worked that out for us.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Ah okay, I have a 6600k at my disposal too so I'll give that a measure, I already have a delid tool.
> What we're measuring here is IHS height because we need to work out how thick a shim needs to be to stop a waterblock hitting the socket posts, I already know the die is 0.4mm under the socket posts because de8auer already worked that out for us.


Yup thats what im saying haha. If you measure the height from mobo to the top of the ihs it would give you the distance pushed down because its latched down. All you need to do is remove the IHS thickness and that would tell you how much you need to push down on the die to get it to post/connect.

Lets say rough example from ihs top to mobo you get 10mm, then removing the ihs of 2.5mm youd need to have a distance of 7.5mm between waterblock and mobo. If you tighten it down and get 8.0mm it might not post.


----------



## El Media Vida

Do you think it was for the quality of material?


----------



## Vi0lence

Heres my Hwbot submission for my 3770k. liquid pro inside and out. on water. one 240 rad custom loop just for cpu. This was for cpu frequency validation. ive run this chip through a bunch of different benchmarks. running 4.8ghz now stable as can be folding.

http://hwbot.org/submission/2347924_


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Do you think it was for the quality of material?


Did that crack?


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Did that crack?


Yes








Hopefully, the CPU doesn't it's damaged


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Yes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, the CPU doesn't it's damaged


I dont think its the material idk cuz it looks quite thick. I think skylake needs more force then haswell or ivy so it cracked it.


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I dont think its the material idk cuz it looks quite thick. I think skylake needs more force then haswell or ivy so it cracked it.


But it's haswell, it's a 4770K.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> But it's haswell, it's a 4770K.


Ah then you dont even need the 3d printed tool for haswell just put the ihs in a vise and hammer on the pcb with a block of wood. Or do what i did and hold it up again a hard table or desk with a sharp edge. Tape a small block of wood to the hammer then just hammer gently or have someone hold the wood onto the pcb and you hammer. You really dont need a vice just makes it a little simpler.


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ah then you dont even need the 3d printed tool for haswell just put the ihs in a vise and hammer on the pcb with a block of wood. Or do what i did and hold it up again a hard table or desk with a sharp edge. Tape a small block of wood to the hammer then just hammer gently or have someone hold the wood onto the pcb and you hammer. You really dont need a vice just makes it a little simpler.


Ah. Well i think i'll use the razor method, for me, it's more easier. Actually, that's the same way i delidded my 4670K.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> Ah. Well i think i'll use the razor method, for me, it's more easier. Actually, that's the same way i delidded my 4670K.


Haswell you just put int in a vice after heating it up slightly to soften the glue. I just bought a delid mate tool because I couldn't be bothered with all the hassle and using a razor is just a fool's game imo.

In under a minute I had this.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> Heres my Hwbot submission for my 3770k. liquid pro inside and out. on water. one 240 rad custom loop just for cpu. This was for cpu frequency validation. ive run this chip through a bunch of different benchmarks. running 4.8ghz now stable as can be folding.
> 
> http://hwbot.org/submission/2347924_


Chilled water I take it?


----------



## El Media Vida

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Haswell you just put int in a vice after heating it up slightly to soften the glue. I just bought a delid mate tool because I couldn't be bothered with all the hassle and using a razor is just a fool's game imo.
> 
> In under a minute I had this.


The problem it's where i live it's difficult bought this tools, and the 3D printed model it was the easier way...


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Chilled water I take it?


nope


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *El Media Vida*
> 
> The problem it's where i live it's difficult bought this tools, and the 3D printed model it was the easier way...


Like I said, heat up the IHS with a hair dryer or heat gun then put it in the vice, one side of the chip on one jaw then the IHS on the other jaw, tighten and the lid will pop off, same thing a delid tool does.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> nope


so... 1.7v with a 240mm rad with no chilled water running 5.5ghz and it didn't instantly die? How? The guys running 5ghz+ in the 5ghz 24/7 club are using TEC cooling to keep it from killing their chips?


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Like I said, heat up the IHS with a hair dryer or heat gun then put it in the vice, one side of the chip on one jaw then the IHS on the other jaw, tighten and the lid will pop off, same thing a delid tool does.


Don't even need to heat it up. Use a couple layers of ttape on the edges of the vise to protect the PCB from scratching. Keep holding the CPU with your hand while it's in the vise and slowly tighten it. After a few turns you'll hear a pop and the IHS will move. That's it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> so... 1.7v with a 240mm rad with no chilled water running 5.5ghz and it didn't instantly die? *How?*


Balls of steel.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Don't even need to heat it up. Use a couple layers of ttape on the edges of the vise to protect the PCB from scratching. Keep holding the CPU with your hand while it's in the vise and slowly tighten it. After a few turns you'll hear a pop and the IHS will move. That's it.
> Balls of steel.


Agreed.


----------



## davidcapi

I recommend the vise/no hammer method.



You can see how one side of the vise makes contact with the pcb and the other side with the IHS, when you tighten the vise this will push each part in opposite directions making it come loose. I didn't heat it up but I do think it's a good idea to do so. It comes out easily and without any risk of damage. If the cpu has sensitive parts under the IHS like a 4690k just make sure to position the CPU in a way that the IHS won't do any damage when being pushed. This vise was $35 (costa rica), might have been to much for a delid but now I own a vise







, extremely useful tool.


----------



## Vi0lence

Im running the chip as im typing right now @4.8ghz. It was for a validation. almost no load on it. set the clock, got it there, took the pic, restarted computer. chip is fine. still runs like a champ.

and its a dual 240 rad, one pump on a Ek full nickel block.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> Im running the chip as im typing right now @4.8ghz. It was for a validation. almost no load on it. set the clock, got it there, took the pic, restarted computer. chip is fine. still runs like a champ.
> 
> and its a dual 240 rad, one pump on a Ek full nickel block.


I can't get mine to load windows for long at 5ghz.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I can't get mine to load windows for long at 5ghz.


what board are you using?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> what board are you using?





Spoiler: Warning: ASUS Maximus VII Ranger


----------



## Vi0lence

are you using the extra 8 pin connector up top for more power to the socket? i know i need over 1.5v to load in with 5ghz plus.

im currently running a Gigabyte Z77x-UP7 board right now for reference.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> are you using the extra 8 pin connector up top for more power to the socket? i know i need over 1.5v to load in with 5ghz plus.
> 
> im currently running a Gigabyte Z77x-UP7 board right now for reference.


I went up to 1.55v but it would still crash on loading windows, not sure why I think it's an issue with my settings in the bios, I can get 4.7ghz stable with my 4670k with around 1.3v I dunno maybe I lost the lottery. The Asus Maximus VII Ranger only has one 4+4 CPU plug and I'm using them yes.


----------



## Vi0lence

Board might not allow you to go any higher. Either that or you got a really bad clocking chip.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> Board might not allow you to go any higher. Either that or you got a really bad clocking chip.


Not sure, it has plenty of VRM etc, and I watercool those, I still think it's a setting in my bios fluffing my overclocks, I got 4.9ghz to pass stress tests etc but I changed things and never got to that clock speed again.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*


Wicked


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Wicked


I've changed it quite a bit since with hardline tubing and a 420mm rad in the top and a 360 rad on the front mounted externally behind the bezel\front facia .


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> Board might not allow you to go any higher. Either that or you got a really bad clocking chip.


I started my build with a Gigabyte Z170 Gaming 7 board and had horrible OC results to the point I thought I had a dog of a chip. I purchased the MSI Z170 XPower Titanium, and it yielded MUCH better results. Sometimes the motherboard can make a huge difference.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> I started my build with a Gigabyte Z170 Gaming 7 board and had horrible OC results to the point I thought I had a dog of a chip. I purchased the MSI Z170 XPower Titanium, and it yielded MUCH better results. Sometimes the motherboard can make a huge difference.


True, not sure if my board is holding me back, it's an old platform now so I can't be bothered to source overpriced replacements.


----------



## El Media Vida

Well, everything went well.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan13*
> 
> I started my build with a Gigabyte Z170 Gaming 7 board and had horrible OC results to the point I thought I had a dog of a chip. I purchased the MSI Z170 XPower Titanium, and it yielded MUCH better results. Sometimes the motherboard can make a huge difference.


MSI does make some sick boards for OC. I think the main difference is skylake has VRMs on board compared to haswell and so on. Cheap vrm or poor cooling could def affect the OC thats for sure.


----------



## jonathan13

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> MSI does make some sick boards for OC. I think the main difference is skylake has VRMs on board compared to haswell and so on. Cheap vrm or poor cooling could def affect the OC thats for sure.


I have to admit that I wasn't sure the MSI board was going to make a difference, but it looked so damn cool, I figured I would give it a try. Worked out well. Also, I have to add, this OC "dashboard" that comes included is such a gimmick but it looks super sweet sitting on top of my 980's backplate.


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I went up to 1.55v but it would still crash on loading windows, not sure why I think it's an issue with my settings in the bios, I can get 4.7ghz stable with my 4670k with around 1.3v I dunno maybe I lost the lottery. The Asus Maximus VII Ranger only has one 4+4 CPU plug and I'm using them yes.


i can say this. Cooler temps help greatly. If you were to make a seperate loop for the cpu by itself it would help. run one for the board then the gpu, seperate loop for the cpu.

i never used a waterblock on board. never saw the need to. just cards and processor


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I can't get mine to load windows for long at 5ghz.


have you tried upping your cpu input voltage?
I've been having issues getting 5ghz and it was either my cache ratio or my input voltage that was betraying me (I broke the carnal rule and changed both at once). I was trying up to 1.5v with instant bsod, dropped my cache ratio to 35 and raised input voltage to 2v and I hit it at 1.41v stable running IBT and Aida (haven't through tested yet)


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vi0lence*
> 
> i can say this. Cooler temps help greatly. If you were to make a seperate loop for the cpu by itself it would help. run one for the board then the gpu, seperate loop for the cpu.
> 
> i never used a waterblock on board. never saw the need to. just cards and processor


My 970 only gets hot when gaming so I'll try putting the clocks and volts down on that and see if it makes a difference.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> have you tried upping your cpu input voltage?
> I've been having issues getting 5ghz and it was either my cache ratio or my input voltage that was betraying me (I broke the carnal rule and changed both at once). I was trying up to 1.5v with instant bsod, dropped my cache ratio to 35 and raised input voltage to 2v and I hit it at 1.41v stable running IBT and Aida (haven't through tested yet)


This is the voltages I was talking about before, I had things pretty well set then... I changed them because I thought I could lower things reduce heat etc. My rig is currently in bits, I need to dremel my Define S slightly and finish the hardline tubing bending fiasco I've been under going.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> My 970 only gets hot when gaming so I'll try putting the clocks and volts down on that and see if it makes a difference.
> This is the voltages I was talking about before, I had things pretty well set then... I changed them because I thought I could lower things reduce heat etc. My rig is currently in bits, I need to dremel my Define S slightly and finish the hardline tubing bending fiasco I've been under going.


ah right on, I JUST got mine back together and filled up after a couple weeks of downtime and it feels amazing to be back







already tinkering with my OC's and feeling pretty good about things


----------



## TheXes

Hello Guys,

I had enough of my my heat spikes in my core 1 so I ordered a delid kit.

I'd like some advise about what TIM shall I use between the IHS and the die. Heard that Coollaboratory Liquid Pro - Liquid Pro Liquid Metal Thermal Paste is a very effective, but I also heard it could cause issues with aluminium and damage the CPU.
Will I have any issues with my 6700k if I'm going to use that one?
What would you recommend to use to reseal the CPU?
I think I will use Arctic MX 5 or something between the CPU and the Corsair GTX110i.

Can I clean the die with alcohol based cleaner, like glasses cleaner?

If you have any input on this could you share with me?
Cheers


----------



## Vi0lence

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheXes*
> 
> Hello Guys,
> 
> I had enough of my my heat spikes in my core 1 so I ordered a delid kit.
> 
> I'd like some advise about what TIM shall I use between the IHS and the die. Heard that Coollaboratory Liquid Pro - Liquid Pro Liquid Metal Thermal Paste is a very effective, but I also heard it could cause issues with aluminium and damage the CPU.
> Will I have any issues with my 6700k if I'm going to use that one?
> What would you recommend to use to reseal the CPU?
> I think I will use Arctic MX 5 or something between the CPU and the Corsair GTX110i.
> 
> Can I clean the die with alcohol based cleaner, like glasses cleaner?
> 
> If you have any input on this could you share with me?
> Cheers


ive been running liquid pro for a couple years not overclocked on my delid 3770k with zero issues. did not reseal the cpu and used the liquid pro inside and out. just be careful with it. use only the amount you need and thats it. should be good to go.

also clean the die with isopropyl alcohol with the highest alc content you can get. 97% plus.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheXes*
> 
> Hello Guys,
> 
> I had enough of my my heat spikes in my core 1 so I ordered a delid kit.
> 
> I'd like some advise about what TIM shall I use between the IHS and the die. Heard that Coollaboratory Liquid Pro - Liquid Pro Liquid Metal Thermal Paste is a very effective, but I also heard it could cause issues with aluminium and damage the CPU.
> Will I have any issues with my 6700k if I'm going to use that one?
> What would you recommend to use to reseal the CPU?
> I think I will use Arctic MX 5 or something between the CPU and the Corsair GTX110i.
> 
> Can I clean the die with alcohol based cleaner, like glasses cleaner?
> 
> If you have any input on this could you share with me?
> Cheers


You can clean it with anything really wtv gets the TIM off, the die is more important to get clean then the IHS. I wouldnt personally reseal because thats the issue with bad temps and NOT the actual thermal paste. Intels thermal paste is top notch, proof is that it actually lasts a long time. Ive tried Noctua and Hydronaut and they didnt last long on bare die theyre not made for it its why everyone uses CLU/CLP or any liquid metal made for it. And nothing is aluminum so dont worry. Use CLU under the IHS then use a good TIM on the IHS.


----------



## TheXes

Thank you and for Vi0lence as well.

Why would it make more heat when I reseal it? I'm not brave enough to use a bare die to cool. TBH I would be more confident to reseal









Do you have any recommendation what compound should I use?


----------



## Vi0lence

just put the IHS back on but dont glue it. thats what i did. works fine. just make sure its centered when you clamp down the cpu. which is easy


----------



## TheXes

I see, thanks for the suggestion









Could you explain why is better not to seal it?
I'm a curious man I like to know the whys.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheXes*
> 
> I see, thanks for the suggestion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Could you explain why is better not to seal it?
> I'm a curious man I like to know the whys.


Because the thickness of the glue raises the IHS off the die enough so that it doesnt compress the TIM/Liquid metal and gives high temps. Between two surfaces you want almost a microscopic layer of TIM the less you have the better. If both surfaces were completely flat and matched you wouldnt even need TIM but theres tolerances so you have to use some.


----------



## TheXes

Make sense.
Thank you guys, I think I will do it as soon as I've got my kit.
(Ye, too afraid to use razor blade







)


----------



## Vi0lence

reseal is just another step you dont need to take. plus if it goes on to thick you get the problems mentioned above.


----------



## JackCY

Why not just pressure down the IHS and put silicon into the space between IHS and PCB while the IHS is held down firmly, let it cure while it's held down. Shouldn't lift the IHS me thinks.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Why not just pressure down the IHS and put silicon into the space between IHS and PCB while the IHS is held down firmly, let it cure while it's held down. Shouldn't lift the IHS me thinks.


I did this the first time I delidded since I had issues with it sliding around. I don't seal it anymore and I haven't noticed a difference in temps


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Why not just pressure down the IHS and put silicon into the space between IHS and PCB while the IHS is held down firmly, let it cure while it's held down. Shouldn't lift the IHS me thinks.


Why not just...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Why not just...


Bare die crew. Is that how clu is supposed to look barely spread or did you end up adding more? Its how it looked first time around for me and my temps were so so, i added a bit more and got way better temps.


----------



## dmfree88

I haven't had time to play with the overclock yet but I got my PC together. Stock VID 1.037v (is that good? I am a newb). The phobya LM worked great and spreads pretty decently. I ended up putting too much on the first time so when I pulled it off I had to clean a little off the PCB and it was pretty easy to cleanup. I am very glad I decided to open it back up though otherwise I may have had issues. Amazed at the temps already and excited to get some overclocking done when I have some time later this week.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Why not just...


Because the thought of mounting something that weighs over 1.3kg on that tiny die makes me wet my pants a little







Back in Athlon XP days that's how they'd come, bare die, but the heatsinks I used were nowhere near as large as I do now. If I were into watercooling I'd totally do it tho.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Because the thought of mounting something that weighs over 1.3kg on that tiny die makes me wet my pants a little
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Back in Athlon XP days that's how they'd come, bare die, but the heatsinks I used were nowhere near as large as I do now. If I were into watercooling I'd totally do it tho.


Yea no WAY its 1.3kg haha that would make it a hair under 3lbs, and on haswell most of the weight is supported by the cpu socket anyways. Same for skylake actually.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea no WAY its 1.3kg haha that would make it a hair under 3lbs, and on haswell most of the weight is supported by the cpu socket anyways. Same for skylake actually.


NH-D14 - 900g (w/o fans)
2xTY-143 - 340g
I guessed the 1.3kg, but it looks like I was pretty close.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> NH-D14 - 900g (w/o fans)
> 2xTY-143 - 340g
> I guessed the 1.3kg, but it looks like I was pretty close.


Ah thought you meant the waterblock lol. If the heatsink plate is big enough would still sit on the socket id have to check my noctua but i dont think they do. If you spaced it just right thought would barely touch the die.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ah thought you meant the waterblock lol. If the heatsink plate is big enough would still sit on the socket id have to check my noctua but i dont think they do. If you spaced it just right thought would barely touch the die.


Yeah, like I said, I'd go bare die if I were watercooling, but I just can't get into it. It's a combination of cost and having to depend on moving parts. What's funny is that I've got dozens of water pumps running at work, pumping away at 50C to 70C degrees, for the better part of the decade, with very minimal maintenance. I guess my fears aren't rational, but I can't get my head around it.

Mounting something like an NH-D14 seems to be a bit more complicated tho. To get proper mounting pressure I'd need to shorten the plastic standoffs, but I think then the socket would interfere with the mounting bracket. Maybe use a rubber gasket along the top side of the package to even the pressure like an IHS would. I'm sure there's some guy who's already done something like this and who'd be shaking his head and facepalming reading this post.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Yeah, like I said, I'd go bare die if I were watercooling, but I just can't get into it. It's a combination of cost and having to depend on moving parts. What's funny is that I've got dozens of water pumps running at work, pumping away at 50C to 70C degrees, for the better part of the decade, with very minimal maintenance. I guess my fears aren't rational, but I can't get my head around it.
> 
> Mounting something like an NH-D14 seems to be a bit more complicated tho. To get proper mounting pressure I'd need to shorten the plastic standoffs, but I think then the socket would interfere with the mounting bracket. Maybe use a rubber gasket along the top side of the package to even the pressure like an IHS would. I'm sure there's some guy who's already done something like this and who'd be shaking his head and facepalming reading this post.


I should have tried it on mine. I dont think the socket would touch becacuse it has those 4 divets for grabbing the cpu out of the socket. Youd probably have to shrink the standoffs 2.5mm or so should put enough pressure on the die and plenty to post. I just wouldnt do it on skylake haha.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Why not just...


That's what I would do, but with aircoolers I wouldn't risk it as the weight likes to shift to one side of the socket and getting the aircooler down enough can be an issue for some coolers too. Intel is just lazy and doesn't solder the IHS beside the E and higher series to cut corners and raise profit.


----------



## paskowitz

Welp, looks like Broadwell-E is delidable...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Welp, looks like Broadwell-E is delidable...


Anything can be delided its just totally pointless. Only a 6C drop all he did was change the solder to liquid metal haha. I wonder what would happen running that bare die though thats what id wanna see under water.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Anything can be delided its just totally pointless. Only a 6C drop all he did was change the solder to liquid metal haha. I wonder what would happen running that bare die though thats what id wanna see under water.


Much like running our chips delidded, the removal of metal means less heat gets soaked into the heat sink/IHS so temps will drop, same thing is seen in the vid by removing the solder.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> That's what I would do, but with aircoolers I wouldn't risk it as the weight likes to shift to one side of the socket and getting the aircooler down enough can be an issue for some coolers too. Intel is just lazy and doesn't solder the IHS beside the E and higher series to cut corners and raise profit.


To stop that you can use felt circles like they used to back in the day to help balance the heatsink, my waterblock had to be held still initially when balancing on the die.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Bare die crew. Is that how clu is supposed to look barely spread or did you end up adding more? Its how it looked first time around for me and my temps were so so, i added a bit more and got way better temps.


Same thing happened to me blue, everyone said adding more CLU would make my temps worse but they actually improved... A LOT. There is such thing as too little CLU regardless of popular opinion.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Much like running our chips delidded, the removal of metal means less heat gets soaked into the heat sink/IHS so temps will drop, same thing is seen in the vid by removing the solder.


I gotta quote u twice haha. I do agree but then he adds liquid metal back on (looks like quite a bit too), im guessing that 86w/mk is whats making the difference in this case. I bet the temps would drop massively going bare die on that as the die is quite large.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Same thing happened to me blue, everyone said adding more CLU would make my temps worse but they actually improved... A LOT. There is such thing as too little CLU regardless of popular opinion.


Seems like its the case with bare die it needs a bit more as the waterblock doesnt put as much pressure on it as the ihs would. I did test it with pressure paper and it was decent at best. I could grind down the socket a bit and probably get even better pressure but then id worry about the pressure of the cpu into the pins. Its fine for me, i even tested at 1.3v and didnt even hit 60°C.

Oh btw add a single 4mm washer under the spring of the ekwb it keeps the edge of the spring from going into the mounting bracket, gave me a cleaner look, doesnt make the stupid noise easier and it looks clean.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I gotta quote u twice haha. I do agree but then he adds liquid metal back on (looks like quite a bit too), im guessing that 86w/mk is whats making the difference in this case. I bet the temps would drop massively going bare die on that as the die is quite large.
> Seems like its the case with bare die it needs a bit more as the waterblock doesnt put as much pressure on it as the ihs would. I did test it with pressure paper and it was decent at best. I could grind down the socket a bit and probably get even better pressure but then id worry about the pressure of the cpu into the pins. Its fine for me, i even tested at 1.3v and didnt even hit 60°C.
> 
> Oh btw add a single 4mm washer under the spring of the ekwb it keeps the edge of the spring from going into the mounting bracket, gave me a cleaner look, doesnt make the stupid noise easier and it looks clean.


4mm washer under the spring? and the stupid noise when tightening? lol that doesn't bother me much but do you have pics of your block looking cleaner, might do it, might not.

I'm not sure on the pressure on the die with the waterblock theory, my block puts quite a lot of pressure on my die so much so that my chip came out the socket last time I removed the block and it was stuck on there nice and firm thankfully lol.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> 4mm washer under the spring? and the stupid noise when tightening? lol that doesn't bother me much but do you have pics of your block looking cleaner, might do it, might not.
> 
> I'm not sure on the pressure on the die with the waterblock theory, my block puts quite a lot of pressure on my die so much so that my chip came out the socket last time I removed the block and it was stuck on there nice and firm thankfully lol.


BENJI!!!!! Listen to me man haha. Here ill show you my proof, and yea mine comes out of the socket as well even if i use clu or tim comes out with the block.

See the difference between the cpu socket (the lil tab at the bottom right) seems like its all over the place as well as its only one corner for me doing so, meaning the block is either not flat at all (which it isnt i checked with a straight edge) or it ends up being too tight on one side from tightening. But like i said temps are awesome so idc lol.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Intel is just lazy and doesn't solder the IHS beside the E and higher series to cut corners and raise profit.


http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/

It's not about cutting costs or cutting corners, it's easy to belive that's the reason when you dont know anything about why it's done.

Would you preffer CLU or CLP to delid 6700K?
I used to have CLP and it was fine, but it ran out, thinkin wich one should I go for, I hear CLU is easier to apply?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> BENJI!!!!! Listen to me man haha. Here ill show you my proof, and yea mine comes out of the socket as well even if i use clu or tim comes out with the block.
> 
> See the difference between the cpu socket (the lil tab at the bottom right) seems like its all over the place as well as its only one corner for me doing so, meaning the block is either not flat at all (which it isnt i checked with a straight edge) or it ends up being too tight on one side from tightening. But like i said temps are awesome so idc lol.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I dunno what proof I'm supposed to be looking at lol, I wasn't calling you out about anything I just wanted to see the 4mm washers.









I now want one of those sexy 6950X chips to delid then run naked because I can.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I dunno what proof I'm supposed to be looking at lol, I wasn't calling you out about anything I just wanted to see the 4mm washers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I now want one of those sexy 6950X chips to delid then run naked because I can.


I know was just messing with you haha. That just shows the pressure is higher on the socket then the actual die. That lil tab thing is actually the corner of the cpu socket which is probably why bare die needs a bit more clu as the pressure is no where near if the ihs and retention bracket put on the die itself.

Ill take my panel off tomorrow and take a pic idk if its going to be visible much but ill try. I also think it might put better pressure on the spring as the edge of the spring isnt caught in the actual bracket which is where that squeaky sound comes from when tightening it down.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I know was just messing with you haha. That just shows the pressure is higher on the socket then the actual die. That lil tab thing is actually the corner of the cpu socket which is probably why bare die needs a bit more clu as the pressure is no where near if the ihs and retention bracket put on the die itself.
> 
> Ill take my panel off tomorrow and take a pic idk if its going to be visible much but ill try. I also think it might put better pressure on the spring as the edge of the spring isnt caught in the actual bracket which is where that squeaky sound comes from when tightening it down.


Can you link me to like an amazon page that sells that pressure paper so I can stock on some for when I switch to X99 and a naked 6950X? Also check my current setup in Kraken.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Can you link me to like an amazon page that sells that pressure paper so I can stock on some for when I switch to X99 and a naked 6950X? Also check my current setup in Kraken.


I didnt buy it i just requested a free sample to try out. If there was enough interest in Europe id buy a roll and sell off pieces but i doubt there is; thats even more niche then going bare die haha.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I know was just messing with you haha. That just shows the pressure is higher on the socket then the actual die. That lil tab thing is actually the corner of the cpu socket which is probably why bare die needs a bit more clu as the pressure is no where near if the ihs and retention bracket put on the die itself.
> 
> Ill take my panel off tomorrow and take a pic idk if its going to be visible much but ill try. I also think it might put better pressure on the spring as the edge of the spring isnt caught in the actual bracket which is where that squeaky sound comes from when tightening it down.
> 
> 
> 
> Can you link me to like an amazon page that sells that pressure paper so I can stock on some for when I switch to X99 and a naked 6950X? Also check my current setup in Kraken.
Click to expand...

Pending pressure you could possibly get some from your local butcher or auto repair receipt.


----------



## keeepcool

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I didnt buy it i just requested a free sample to try out. If there was enough interest in Europe id buy a roll and sell off pieces but i doubt there is; thats even more niche then going bare die haha.


What is the manufacturer of the paper?
Could you reveal?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *keeepcool*
> 
> What is the manufacturer of the paper?
> Could you reveal?


Just google pressure paper pretty sure there all the same, mine was from a place in nj.


----------



## keeepcool

Yup, they all seem to be from PrecisionX.


----------



## Loladinas

Summer started and ambient temp crept up. Way up. My midget started to get a bit hot. 40-45C during desktop use, 62C with small FFT. Just finished delidding it. Took me maybe 45-60 minutes from unplugging the PC to turning it on again. I guess after doing it once it's not quite as scary anymore. 12C temp drop across the board.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Nice, I just ran to the gym, got in my work, delidded and ran home too.


----------



## DunePilot

Pressure paper is primarily used in heavy industry to check the pressure and alignment of pressure rolls in automotive coating lines for example. You put it in between the bridle roll and the pressure roll and if one side or the middle is less than you know you have poor alignment from gaps on one side and less of an imprint on the paper or you if in the middle then your rubber pressure roll is worn out bad in the middle.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DunePilot*
> 
> Pressure paper is primarily used in heavy industry to check the pressure and alignment of pressure rolls in automotive coating lines for example. You put it in between the bridle roll and the pressure roll and if one side or the middle is less than you know you have poor alignment from gaps on one side and less of an imprint on the paper or you if in the middle then your rubber pressure roll is worn out bad in the middle.


Well its used in a lot of things depends on the pressure of the crystals on the paper. Michelin uses a high speed camera and a thick piece of acrylic to test pressure on tires under load on a car. For PCs its like 8psi paper. It was very cool to use, surprisingly it took a little bit for the paper to react to the crystals and give a clear result.


----------



## DunePilot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Well its used in a lot of things depends on the pressure of the crystals on the paper. Michelin uses a high speed camera and a thick piece of acrylic to test pressure on tires under load on a car. For PCs its like 8psi paper. It was very cool to use, surprisingly it took a little bit for the paper to react to the crystals and give a clear result.


Indeed, I thought some folks might find that interesting. Gosh, I just noticed how many typos I had... I need to slow down and proof read lol.


----------



## NIK1

I have a delidded my 4790k done with coolabs liquid ultra about 1 year ago and wonder how long the liquid ultra lasts before it should be redone again. Does this stuff ever dry out. Just curious, my temps are still darn good at 4.8 oc-1.275 core volts,27 cel idle and 60 cel max while stressing with x264.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

You might be the test pilot here. My TIM is the same on a naked 4690k, no change and it has been three or four months for me.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I have a delidded my 4790k done with coolabs liquid ultra about 1 year ago and wonder how long the liquid ultra lasts before it should be redone again. Does this stuff ever dry out. Just curious, my temps are still darn good at 4.8 oc-1.275 core volts,27 cel idle and 60 cel max while stressing with x264.


What I've experienced is there isn't really a need to replace the material, until you see some temperature differences of around 5C excluding ambient air temperature changes. Should be all good!


----------



## chronicfx

I will back Valguar on this. You have no worries about the TIM degrading or drying out, the only time I personally would re-apply would be if somehow I had shifted the IHS, for instance changing cooler, releasing the retention bracket, or putting the chip into a new motherboard. You could physically mess up your application of TIM and at that point you should redo, but if you leave it alone, there are no worries.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/
> 
> It's not about cutting costs or cutting corners, it's easy to belive that's the reason when you dont know anything about why it's done.


Yet the Xeons that are made to last longer etc. are all soldered aren't they and then the cheapest consumer CPUs have crappy paste which after numerous complains from everyone they changed to a different paste which is OKish but still far from a top notch TIM. Sure soldering CPU isn't easy but the fact remains Intel is soldering the more expensive CPUs even those meant for constant use and many cycles yet the cheaper ones use paste.

Said article shows DIY home soldering of a CPU die and no reason why Intel is not soldering the consumer CPUs. I know the issues that exists from soldering and heat changes. Fact remains Intel is cutting corners and doesn't change it until enough reviewers and users complain about the poor TIM performance. They may have good engineers but they screwed up the Haswell TIM nonetheless.


----------



## jdorje

Would be nice if intel would sell non-lidded processors.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Would be nice if intel would sell non-lidded processors.


Email them and get it going, I seriously can't be bothered with the IHS soaking up all that heat. 1.55v and still didn't hit the thermal limit on my 4670k.


----------



## JackCY

I guess if you do a bulk order in a million pieces range quantity spread over 1-2 years they will sell you some








But truth be told, even tray versions without cooler are often more expensive than boxed versions with cooler lol
So go figure really with Intel, the less you get the more you pay


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> I guess if you do a bulk order in a million pieces range quantity spread over 1-2 years they will sell you some
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But truth be told, even tray versions without cooler are often more expensive than boxed versions with cooler lol
> So go figure really with Intel, the less you get the more you pay


Lol pretty much, still waiting for my FX 9590 to turn up so I can crank it up. The gf won't let me delid her 6600k and shim it lol so I might keep this Z170 sabertooth board I have spare and get one of my own. Then delid, naked mount with a shim.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I have a delidded my 4790k done with coolabs liquid ultra about 1 year ago and wonder how long the liquid ultra lasts before it should be redone again. Does this stuff ever dry out. Just curious, my temps are still darn good at 4.8 oc-1.275 core volts,27 cel idle and 60 cel max while stressing with x264.


Just keep an eye on your temperatures. If they are still holding strong, then you shouldn't have anything to worry about.

People run into issues when they use traditional pastes on the die. I however have experienced that Xigmatek PTI-G4512 does *NOT *pump out even over the course of ~2 years. I am running it on my naked 4770k with great results.

I briefly tested Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut in its place and found that despite there being a *large difference* in thermal conductance ratings, 2.5w/mk ~vs~ 12.5w/mk, the Xigmatek performed just as well as the Kryonaut...that was until the Kryonaut pumped out after ~1 week and my temperatures went WAY up; leaving the Xigmatek as the superior thermal paste in this scenario.


----------



## NIK1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Just keep an eye on your temperatures. If they are still holding strong, then you shouldn't have anything to worry about.
> 
> People run into issues when they use traditional pastes on the die. I however have experienced that Xigmatek PTI-G4512 does *NOT *pump out even over the course of ~2 years. I am running it on my naked 4770k with great results.
> 
> I briefly tested Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut in its place and found that despite there being a *large difference* in thermal conductance ratings, 2.5w/mk ~vs~ 12.5w/mk, the Xigmatek performed just as well as the Kryonaut...that was until the Kryonaut pumped out after ~1 week and my temperatures went WAY up; leaving the Xigmatek as the superior thermal paste in this scenario.


Right on.Thanks everyone for the info.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Just keep an eye on your temperatures. If they are still holding strong, then you shouldn't have anything to worry about.
> 
> People run into issues when they use traditional pastes on the die. I however have experienced that Xigmatek PTI-G4512 does *NOT *pump out even over the course of ~2 years. I am running it on my naked 4770k with great results.
> 
> I briefly tested Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut in its place and found that despite there being a *large difference* in thermal conductance ratings, 2.5w/mk ~vs~ 12.5w/mk, the Xigmatek performed just as well as the Kryonaut...that was until the Kryonaut pumped out after ~1 week and my temperatures went WAY up; leaving the Xigmatek as the superior thermal paste in this scenario.


Ive tested a couple TIMs and they pump out quite quick, however on a low powered chip its perfectly fine. Im using hydronaut on a 3350p and temps are cooler and it does not pump out. On my 4690k it didnt seem to last long about a week or so. Noctua TIM pumped out and temps changed within a day. This was also bare die though without an ihs.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ive tested a couple TIMs and they pump out quite quick, however on a low powered chip its perfectly fine. Im using hydronaut on a 3350p and temps are cooler and it does not pump out. On my 4690k it didnt seem to last long about a week or so. Noctua TIM pumped out and temps changed within a day. This was also bare die though without an ihs.


My experience is with a naked chip as well. I don't know about other pastes, but the Xigmatek is the only one I have seen that advertises it is "pump-out resistant".


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> My experience is with a naked chip as well. I don't know about other pastes, but the Xigmatek is the only one I have seen that advertises it is "pump-out resistant".


I think its the fact that bare die gets hotters way hotter then the top of the IHS. Even though the temp sensor measures core temp it doesnt measure die or IHS temp and i think thats where the main issue is. Just an educated guess from using pressure paper because on bare die with an ekwb the pressure isnt much so its not pump out by pressure but i think pump out by actual heat.


----------



## santanag23

Quick question. I just delid my 3770k and was wondering do I just set the IHS on top or do I glue it back on?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *santanag23*
> 
> Quick question. I just delid my 3770k and was wondering do I just set the IHS on top or do I glue it back on?


Set it on top and clamp it down. Hopefully you used a liquid metal on the die. Set it down try not to move it at all then clamp it down and thats it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *santanag23*
> 
> Quick question. I just delid my 3770k and was wondering do I just set the IHS on top or do I glue it back on?


Put the cpu in the socket and hold down the IHS as you close the retention bracket thingy ma bob, or get a naked waterblock mount from ek and go naked? but I'm biased lol.


----------



## santanag23

OK and thank you for the quick response. I used coollabratory ultra, is that good stuff? I've seen the name thrown around here a lot.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *santanag23*
> 
> OK and thank you for the quick response. I used coollabratory ultra, is that good stuff? I've seen the name thrown around here a lot.


It's so good that the only way it could be made better is to make it illegal so you get a buzz from using it.


----------



## santanag23

sweetness! yall are awesome! thanks again


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It's so good that the only way it could be made better is to make it illegal so you get a buzz from using it.


Only thing that sucks about it (idk if its just a bad batch or sat too long) a bit of it i got left over is completely dry and hard cant even use it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Only thing that sucks about it (idk if its just a bad batch or sat too long) a bit of it i got left over is completely dry and hard cant even use it.


I had some hardened in my tube that I got from amazon but it didn't really bother me, I applied twice to make sure there were no hard bits on my final application. Not had the motivation to finish my loop so haven't booted the system since my last attempt at 4.8ghz on my 4670k, 60c at 1.4v though! Pretty damn good if you ask me.


----------



## xGeNeSisx

My Corsair H105 pump failed on me so I had to RMA. The replacement just arrived today so I decided to reapply CLU and try Gelid GC-extreme thermal paste instead of AS5. Using OCCT I have not seen CPU temp rise above 37C at 4.4ghz, almost a 20C improvement over the previous setup!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xGeNeSisx*
> 
> My Corsair H105 pump failed on me so I had to RMA. The replacement just arrived today so I decided to reapply CLU and try Gelid GC-extreme thermal paste instead of AS5. Using OCCT I have not seen CPU temp rise above 37C at 4.4ghz, almost a 20C improvement over the previous setup!


Damn what CPU are you using haha.


----------



## xGeNeSisx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Damn what CPU are you using haha.


i5-6400 @ 4.4ghz via BCLK overclock using an Asrock Z170 K4. I'll have to see if I can push past 170 on the BCLK. The huge drop in temps is due to correcting poor CLU application, ceasing use of outdated Arctic Silver 5 paste, and replacing the defective pump.

The pump failed when I started up the PC. I heard the pump initialize and begin to circulate. Then I heard a *clank* in the case. Immediately pulled the PSU power and discharged any power remaining in the system. I took off the side panel and saw liquid all over the motherboard. Luckily it was an ethylene glycol + water mix which I cleaned up as best as possible. I let it sit for 3 days under a fan to ensure everything evaporated. Everything runs great now though


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xGeNeSisx*
> 
> i5-6400 @ 4.4ghz via BCLK overclock using an Asrock Z170 K4. I'll have to see if I can push past 170 on the BCLK. The huge drop in temps is due to correcting poor CLU application, ceasing use of outdated Arctic Silver 5 paste, and replacing the defective pump.
> 
> The pump failed when I started up the PC. I heard the pump initialize and begin to circulate. Then I heard a *clank* in the case. Immediately pulled the PSU power and discharged any power remaining in the system. I took off the side panel and saw liquid all over the motherboard. Luckily it was an ethylene glycol + water mix which I cleaned up as best as possible. I let it sit for 3 days under a fan to ensure everything evaporated. Everything runs great now though










Corsair quality AIO. Sorry couldn't help myself.

I know why I'm not buying water cooling especially CLC/AIOs.

Nice temp drop.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xGeNeSisx*
> 
> i5-6400 @ 4.4ghz via BCLK overclock using an Asrock Z170 K4. I'll have to see if I can push past 170 on the BCLK. The huge drop in temps is due to correcting poor CLU application, ceasing use of outdated Arctic Silver 5 paste, and replacing the defective pump.
> 
> The pump failed when I started up the PC. I heard the pump initialize and begin to circulate. Then I heard a *clank* in the case. Immediately pulled the PSU power and discharged any power remaining in the system. I took off the side panel and saw liquid all over the motherboard. Luckily it was an ethylene glycol + water mix which I cleaned up as best as possible. I let it sit for 3 days under a fan to ensure everything evaporated. Everything runs great now though


That thing must use no power haha. Its like my spare 3350p that doesnt ever reach 45°C on the stock cooler lol. I delided that one just for fun, lost a couple degrees.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corsair quality AIO. Sorry couldn't help myself.
> 
> I know why I'm not buying water cooling especially CLC/AIOs.
> 
> Nice temp drop.


Honestly i wouldnt do an AIO however CLCs are def much better quality especially the swiftech and ekwb ones. The ek had a recall for wtv it was but it seems to be quite spectacular in temps and build quality.


----------



## xGeNeSisx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corsair quality AIO. Sorry couldn't help myself.
> 
> I know why I'm not buying water cooling especially CLC/AIOs.
> 
> Nice temp drop.


I hate having to rely on AIO water cooling, but I just don't have the cash to invest in a custom loop up front


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xGeNeSisx*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corsair quality AIO. Sorry couldn't help myself.
> 
> I know why I'm not buying water cooling especially CLC/AIOs.
> 
> Nice temp drop.
> 
> 
> 
> I hate having to rely on AIO water cooling, but I just don't have the cash to invest in a custom loop up front
Click to expand...

Regrets about the pump, grats about the water glycol syrup (did it turn all electric blue?).

I looked at your rig build, you have the closet space, you could part pick a few radiators and get the hardware from the local hardware store, build a frankemonster of a custom water loop.

I speak encouragement as I wait to dye my water with black as night liquid mix, going for that oil look.


----------



## vb10

Ordered that CLU stuff because I don't want to have to keep re-applying the noctua thermal paste between the die and the ihs. After a few months, the consistency of it becomes like mud, its watery with solid chunks. bizarre.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vb10*
> 
> Ordered that CLU stuff because I don't want to have to keep re-applying the noctua thermal paste between the die and the ihs. After a few months, the consistency of it becomes like mud, its watery with solid chunks. bizarre.


Few months? Your cpu must be very low tdp lol. Mine starts getting higher in temps after a few days haha.


----------



## paskowitz

Quick question. Is CLU "safe" on nickle plated copper? By safe I mean it won't bond (like normal straight copper... like on my Apogee XL...).


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Quick question. Is CLU "safe" on nickle plated copper? By safe I mean it won't bond (like normal straight copper... like on my Apogee XL...).


Should be fine, i have it on straight copper and it doesnt bond. All copper does is, because its porous the copper absorbs some of the CLU and fills in all the tiny pores and gaps (which is fine with me haha)

Ive cleaned it off after a couple weeks and it wiped right off so now easy. Giving it a stress test then shutting off the pc and wiping it right up when hot works great.

On nickel its even better should wipe right off, might stain the nickel a bit depending on the quality but no biggie.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Quick question. Is CLU "safe" on nickle plated copper? By safe I mean it won't bond (like normal straight copper... like on my Apogee XL...).


I'm 90% sure that CLU/P doesn't stick to nickle plating at all like it does copper. BUT I haven't used it on any nickle plating other than my IHS and it is decently stained from Phobya LM. Hopefully someone with more confidence in their answer will chime in


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I'm 90% sure that CLU/P doesn't stick to nickle plating at all like it does copper. BUT I haven't used it on any nickle plating other than my IHS and it is decently stained from Phobya LM. Hopefully someone with more confidence in their answer will chime in


It stained my IHS as well pretty sure thats nickel plated copper as well. Its not an issue though unless you have the bottom of your heatsink on show (not possible btw haha).

Theres not much temp difference between TIM and LM BUT the big issue is that TIMs for wtv reason on a bare die tend to push/press out. I think thats why the intel tim is so awesome because it doesnt push out at all.


----------



## vb10

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Few months? Your cpu must be very low tdp lol. Mine starts getting higher in temps after a few days haha.


I have a 4770k that struggles to do 4.3ghz, so I just end up running it at 4ghz when the paste turns to soggy mud haha.


----------



## Castaile

Say should I use CLU or stick with my NTH1 if I were go naked delidding? Since I'm using EK supremacy block + precisemount


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> Say should I use CLU or stick with my NTH1 if I were go naked delidding? Since I'm using EK supremacy block + precisemount


CLU all the way, not because the temps will be magically lower but because it doesnt pump/press/push out like TIMs do. I tried Noctua on mine and it didnt last a couple days before temps went up.

Because the pressure of the waterblock on the bare die is so low thats its better to use CLU. If you were to shave down the socket just a little bit might work even better but bare die is pretty good as is. I dropped at least 3-4°C going bare die.


----------



## Castaile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> CLU all the way, not because the temps will be magically lower but because it doesnt pump/press/push out like TIMs do. I tried Noctua on mine and it didnt last a couple days before temps went up.
> 
> Because the pressure of the waterblock on the bare die is so low thats its better to use CLU. If you were to shave down the socket just a little bit might work even better but bare die is pretty good as is. I dropped at least 3-4°C going bare die.


Thanks bluej

How was your experience applying CLU onto the waterblock?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> Thanks bluej
> How was your experience applying CLU onto the waterblock?


I applied it direct on the die, a couple times actually as i was doing some testing. I would recommend however that you put some nail polish or clearcoat or anything that will harden over the transistors on the pcb just because its better to be safe then sorry.

It was easy to apply, super easy. I trimmed the brush so it didnt absorb as much and you can always add a tiny bit more if you notice your temps aren't where they should be. I did test it with some pressure paper and it tends to sit more on the cpu socket then on the die but my temps are still awesome so idc lol. Now that temps have warmed up my 4690k at 1.2v reaches around 50-51°C after an hr of Rainbow Six Siege. I get the same temps in Intel Tuning Stress Test so its def cpu heavy in multiplayer.

I don't regret it, all i had to do was change 4 screws. I will however say i was hoping it would put a tiny bit more pressure on the die would prob get even better temps but no biggie. I stay under 60°C at 1.3v if i choose to go to 4.8ghz so can't complain. Dont have ac either so results will vary.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> It stained my IHS as well pretty sure thats nickel plated copper as well. Its not an issue though unless you have the bottom of your heatsink on show (not possible btw haha).
> 
> Theres not much temp difference between TIM and LM BUT the big issue is that TIMs for wtv reason on a bare die tend to push/press out. I think thats why the intel tim is so awesome because it doesnt push out at all.


I know have NT-H1 on my IH/block. One difference I have noticed with CLU is that it cools off very quickly, or doesn't retain heat as much, compared to normal TIMs.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> I know have NT-H1 on my IH/block. One difference I have noticed with CLU is that it cools off very quickly, or doesn't retain heat as much, compared to normal TIMs.


That's because CLU and CLP have a very high level of thermal conductivity. That's why they're awesome!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> That's because CLU and CLP have a very high level of thermal conductivity. That's why they're awesome!


Ill get hate for this but it really doesnt matter. With NH-T1 and Kryonaut my temps on bare die were IDENTICAL, within a margin of error. You can even use condoctonaut which is rated at 73w/mK and temps will be the same as well. Reason to use it, it just doesnt run like a TIM does on bare die for wtv reason. Theyre just not made for it like Intel TIM is.


----------



## vb10

Almost in disbelief right now over what a large difference CLU made instead of noctua's thermal paste between the die and IHS. Running same/similar temps now at 300mhz faster and 180mv vocre higher. I just hope it stays like this.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vb10*
> 
> Almost in disbelief right now over what a large difference CLU made instead of noctua's thermal paste between the die and IHS. Running same/similar temps now at 300mhz faster and 180mv vocre higher. I just hope it stays like this.


It does, it's good stuff. enjoy!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It does, it's good stuff. enjoy!


Noctuas paste is awesome except where theres high heat lol. On bare die it was a nightmare for me lasted a day before i went from 46°C to 54°C and beyond lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vb10*
> 
> Almost in disbelief right now over what a large difference CLU made instead of noctua's thermal paste between the die and IHS. Running same/similar temps now at 300mhz faster and 180mv vocre higher. I just hope it stays like this.


Yiiiiiiiis join the dark side. Become one with the Sith


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Noctuas paste is awesome except where theres high heat lol. On bare die it was a nightmare for me lasted a day before i went from 46°C to 54°C and beyond lol.


Hence why I didn't respond to you.....Hehehe.....This happens every few pages or so.....


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Hence why I didn't respond to you.....Hehehe.....This happens every few pages or so.....


Haha, i think mine pumped out within like a day no joke. Hydronaut lasted a bit longer, didn't have any Kryonaut to test unfortunately would have loved too.

However on a 3350p (its rated at like 35w or something lol), ive got Hydronaut on the die and Noctua on the IHS and its perfectly fine.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Haha, i think mine pumped out within like a day no joke. Hydronaut lasted a bit longer, didn't have any Kryonaut to test unfortunately would have loved too.
> 
> However on a 3350p (its rated at like 35w or something lol), ive got Hydronaut on the die and Noctua on the IHS and its perfectly fine.


CLU/CLP pumped out? I don't think so....Good luck on that though.... That's specifically what I would be talking about on the die..... Anything else is a waste of time and effort....









Keep in mind that we're generally talking about higher powered CPUs.....


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> CLU/CLP pumped out? I don't think so....Good luck on that though.... That's specifically what I would be talking about on the die..... Anything else is a waste of time and effort....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Keep in mind that we're generally talking about higher powered CPUs.....


Well considering i wrote Hyrdonaut right afterwords i was referring to the Noctua paste lol. Ill forgive you for that









Id love to see if Condoctunaut LM makes ANY difference on a bare die setup. Maybe ill contact em for a sample.,


----------



## wizardbro

I've ordered a 3d printed delid tool and ek naked mounts for my 4690k. Wanted to make it as easy and painless as possible.
Just wanted to know if it's possible to crush the die with the naked mounts if finger tightened? I'll probably have to remove the socket bracket off the mobo as well?


----------



## jdorje

Just use a vice. Easy and completely safe.

Naked mount can certainly crush the die with uneven pressure. Neither easy nor completely safe. Nor is it necessary at all for an i5; even with my h80i and relidded 4690k i hit thermal and voltage limit at the same time. With a custom loop you'll be voltage limited, not thermally.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

^ very true (pending the loop size)


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Just use a vice. Easy and completely safe.
> 
> Naked mount can certainly crush the die with uneven pressure. Neither easy nor completely safe. Nor is it necessary at all for an i5; even with my h80i and relidded 4690k i hit thermal and voltage limit at the same time. With a custom loop you'll be voltage limited, not thermally.


I was on 1.55v and didn't hit thermal limits.









EDIT: Hmm can't find the correct image on here to back that statement up.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I was on 1.55v and didn't hit thermal limits.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Hmm can't find the correct image on here to back that statement up.


how long is that sustainable though? I'm genuinely asking because I'd love to run over 1.4v 24/7 but I'm a little worried I'll start wearing down my 4790k.
edit: temps are no problem


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> how long is that sustainable though? I'm genuinely asking because I'd love to run over 1.4v 24/7 but I'm a little worried I'll start wearing down my 4790k.
> edit: temps are no problem


Not sure, I don't really care much for degradation because by the time I know about it we'll all be overclocking 8700k's. If anyone can show me some testing to show how fast a chip degrades after 1.3v I'd love to give it a read.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Not sure, I don't really care much for degradation because by the time I know about it we'll all be overclocking 8700k's. If anyone can show me some testing to show how fast a chip degrades after 1.3v I'd love to give it a read.


I just went through 20 pages of the Haswell Death thread and didn't come up with much. Most there said 1.4 should be fine, but overall there wasn't really any good reports of degradation or death. If you find anything, let me know!


----------



## jdorje

There was a guy on reddit who claimed slight degredation (less than 100 mhz) after running 1.4V for 6 months with 80C everyday temps. He believed if he'd kept it under 75C he would have been fine.

People on g3258s love to run up to 1.45V.

If you set 1.45V as the absolute voltage limit, and stay under 70C with it, a custom loop on a delidded 4690k is more than you need.


----------



## wizardbro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Just use a vice. Easy and completely safe.
> 
> Naked mount can certainly crush the die with uneven pressure. Neither easy nor completely safe. Nor is it necessary at all for an i5; even with my h80i and relidded 4690k i hit thermal and voltage limit at the same time. With a custom loop you'll be voltage limited, not thermally.


Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. So, the way to go about naked mounting would be to mount it with low pressure from the block. If it doesn't boot, tighten and keep applying more pressure till it does?
Just so I don't end up crushing it outright. I think I've read somewhere that there needs to be a certain mount of pressure applied to the cpu for it to work/make contact with pins.

I'm delidding for fun more than anything. Not expecting too much.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. So, the way to go about naked mounting would be to mount it with low pressure from the block. If it doesn't boot, tighten and keep applying more pressure till it does?
> Just so I don't end up crushing it outright. I think I've read somewhere that there needs to be a certain mount of pressure applied to the cpu for it to work/make contact with pins.
> 
> I'm delidding for fun more than anything. Not expecting too much.


If you have an EK block then buy the EK naked mount kit and you won't need to worry, just don't be a silly sausage and tighten one side down fully, do it equally. It's really easy to do and you tighten it all the way down.


----------



## jdorje

"Tighten all four screws down a quarter turn at a time until it posts."

Pretty sure that is from this thread. Many pages back.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> "Tighten all four screws down a quarter turn at a time until it posts."
> 
> Pretty sure that is from this thread. Many pages back.


Maybe if its not with the EK kit or parts, but i was told by another guy running naked to tighten it all the way down, I did and my temps are perfect up to 1.5v so yeah... Could you find me the post where it says not to tighten it all the way down?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Maybe if its not with the EK kit or parts, but i was told by another guy running naked to tighten it all the way down, I did and my temps are perfect up to 1.5v so yeah... Could you find me the post where it says not to tighten it all the way down?


I coulda sworn it was you that posted that.

But no it was you with the post after!

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/30190#post_25006542

Not actually very definitive.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Maybe if its not with the EK kit or parts, but i was told by another guy running naked to tighten it all the way down, I did and my temps are perfect up to 1.5v so yeah... Could you find me the post where it says not to tighten it all the way down?


EKWB themselves say to follow regular instructions and thats to tighten it down tight. As my pressure paper indicated anyways the waterblock will put more pressure on the cpu socket anyways so cant really damage anything. I could see it being an issue if using a heatsink that fits INSIDE the cpu socket.

I think all waterblocks can use the ekwb screws with no issues or even just standoffs that are shaved down. On skylake however it doesnt even post the IHS is thicker; the cpu socket is the same but the pcb sits a bit lower into the socket because of the thin wafer.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I coulda sworn it was you that posted that.
> 
> But no it was you with the post after!
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/30190#post_25006542
> 
> Not actually very definitive.


That's for a skylake chip which sits lower than the 4xxx gen chips because the die is smaller and the PCB is thinner. As stated for anyone modding the block itself you will need to do some testing as it's not designed to be used that way. EK however did design the naked kit to be used on 4xxx chips naked so it's been measured out etc.


----------



## Castaile

For naked delidding, ss it recommended to apply CLU on the copper wateblock as well? or will it suffice to apply it on the die only


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> For naked delidding, ss it recommended to apply CLU on the copper wateblock as well? or will it suffice to apply it on the die only


Depends, I put it on the die only but once I was mounted my temps where poor so I added more CLU to the block (only a little bit) and remounted, my temps have been a lot better since. Only way to know is to try it but I'm not really a fan of reusing the IHS so I'll always go naked if I can.

I plan on doing it to a 6950x.


----------



## wywywywy

Any recommended seller of a 3D printed delid tool with Ivybridge compatibility in the UK?


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wywywywy*
> 
> Any recommended seller of a 3D printed delid tool with Ivybridge compatibility in the UK?


This
http://rockitcool.myshopify.com
I think he ships to the uk
Edit sorry didn't see the 3D printed bit but these are good quality.


----------



## wywywywy

Rockit's shipping is really high and then there's taxes/duty on top, plus sterling is rubbish since last week, so it's not really economical ordering from them


----------



## bluej511

try entersetup.com ships from finland i believe took a couple days to get to France pretty sure its faster to the UK. The 3d printed tools are a joke, a few people have broken em, bent em what have you haha.


----------



## dmfree88

CPU: 4790k
on die-TIM: Phobya LM
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: (Unknown, purchased delidded)
OC after delid: 4.8ghz (limited by air cooling thermal limit)
Temp drops: (unknown, purchased delidded) 80c Max stress testing at 1.232v 4.8ghz high ambient with PH-TC14PE 20-30c idle 60c peak gaming (also partially lapped IHS)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/9qmcdm (5.0ghz)



Think I am finally done with this pig







. Seems like a good CPU but unfortunately I don't have pre-delid specs


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wywywywy*
> 
> Any recommended seller of a 3D printed delid tool with Ivybridge compatibility in the UK?


I can delid it for you if you PM me.


----------



## wywywywy

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> try entersetup.com ships from finland i believe took a couple days to get to France pretty sure its faster to the UK. The 3d printed tools are a joke, a few people have broken em, bent em what have you haha.


Yes that seems like a good option, around £35 including everything. Are the 3D printed ones really bad? I've only watched a few videos on youtube it seems fine but that's all I've seen about them.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I can delid it for you if you PM me.


Yea i would too but id be more worried about it getting damaged in shipping especially if sent in a padded envelope.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wywywywy*
> 
> Yes that seems like a good option, around £35 including everything. Are the 3D printed ones really bad? I've only watched a few videos on youtube it seems fine but that's all I've seen about them.


The 3d ones are good if its made well and then it becomes costly, plus you still need a vice. The 3d printed ones are way more useful for skylake. Before the tool i pretty much stuck the IHS on the edge of a marble table, used a piece of wood and smacked it on the wafer and popped it off haha. The tool makes life so much easier and pretty much impossible to damage. That includes gouging it with a blade or bending the wafer.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i would too but id be more worried about it getting damaged in shipping especially if sent in a padded envelope.
> The 3d ones are good if its made well and then it becomes costly, plus you still need a vice. The 3d printed ones are way more useful for skylake. Before the tool i pretty much stuck the IHS on the edge of a marble table, used a piece of wood and smacked it on the wafer and popped it off haha. The tool makes life so much easier and pretty much impossible to damage. That includes gouging it with a blade or bending the wafer.


I'd be sending it in cardboard and boxed, I'm not a person who skimps on packaging because damaging someones CPU is not worth the hassle to save a few pence, postage expenses will be covered by pricing and I'll likely be returning it insured signed for.


----------



## HITTI

Hey delidders. How we doing tonight?

I have a question that been sitting in the back of my head for a year now.

I am using Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material for my ivy bridge delidded 3770k.

When should it be cleaned replaced between the IHS and CPU die?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Every time you remove the IHS, also likely every time you move your block if disturbing the IHS, then I would take temperatures into consideration to say and every time when it doesn't work anymore, when it doesn't work, replace it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HITTI*
> 
> Hey delidders. How we doing tonight?
> 
> I have a question that been sitting in the back of my head for a year now.
> 
> I am using Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material for my ivy bridge delidded 3770k.
> 
> When should it be cleaned replaced between the IHS and CPU die?


No one has reported it drying up to my knowledge so unless your temps are climbing it should be fine.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I found out why Phobya Liquid Metal is annoying to me, there is no way to use it sparingly as upon application the consistency is that of pushing around mercury balls. There was nothing I could do to keep it from beading at first attempt, one really must paint and paint and paint to get the thing to spread.

Warning to Phobya LM users, make sure you get the metal painted and spread out. I did not, so much so that a bead of it fell to my wood floor (splat), and if it would have hit the motherboard anywhere, I would be in so much trouble.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I found out why Phobya Liquid Metal is annoying to me, there is no way to use it sparingly as upon application the consistency is that of pushing around mercury balls. There was nothing I could do to keep it from beading at first attempt, one really must paint and paint and paint to get the thing to spread.
> 
> Warning to Phobya LM users, make sure you get the metal painted and spread out. I did not, so much so that a bead of it fell to my wood floor (splat), and if it would have hit the motherboard anywhere, I would be in so much trouble.


I notice this too since I use phobya LM. You've really got to smash that stuff down to get it to stick instead of rolling around. I haven't tried clu/clp since the bit of LM has lasted forever


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I notice this too since I use phobya LM. You've really got to smash that stuff down to get it to stick instead of rolling around. I haven't tried clu/clp since the bit of LM has lasted forever


Same for me. Never tried anything else. Phobya is rated better and was cheaper. For me it wasn't too bad. Definitely rolls around easily if left in ball form. After initial "break" of the ball it spread out fairly easily for me. I even had to reapply from dropping the IHS and accidently got some on the silicon around the die, it cleaned off pretty easily and so far hasn't seemed to cause damage or anything.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I found out why Phobya Liquid Metal is annoying to me, there is no way to use it sparingly as upon application the consistency is that of pushing around mercury balls. There was nothing I could do to keep it from beading at first attempt, one really must paint and paint and paint to get the thing to spread.
> 
> Warning to Phobya LM users, make sure you get the metal painted and spread out. I did not, so much so that a bead of it fell to my wood floor (splat), and if it would have hit the motherboard anywhere, I would be in so much trouble.
> 
> 
> 
> I notice this too since I use phobya LM. You've really got to smash that stuff down to get it to stick instead of rolling around. I haven't tried clu/clp since the bit of LM has lasted forever
Click to expand...

Blot it, blotting it, to blot, good to know, I used P LM with my gpu, and as a temporary cpu IHS to block TIM. Side note is my EK pump kicked after six months and I am back to air for the hiatus.


----------



## Benjiw

Hello guys I'm almost done bending all my tubing and stuff but I took the block off my cpu to change it from goofy to regular orientation and noticed my cpu pcb has started to bow.

I'm not too worried it's nothing excessive and my chip worked fine at 4.7ghz but wondered if anyone else had a similar situation? My chip is naked and the bow is following the length of the die so the bottom and top are bowed if that makes sense haha. It's a 4670k too in a z97 asus ranger ROG board.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Hello guys I'm almost done bending all my tubing and stuff but I took the block off my cpu to change it from goofy to regular orientation and noticed my cpu pcb has started to bow.
> 
> I'm not too worried it's nothing excessive and my chip worked fine at 4.7ghz but wondered if anyone else had a similar situation? My chip is naked and the bow is following the length of the die so the bottom and top are bowed if that makes sense haha. It's a 4670k too in a z97 asus ranger ROG board.


My assumption would be from to much cpu block pressure, so try to keep the tightness a bit lower to help counter that


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Hello guys I'm almost done bending all my tubing and stuff but I took the block off my cpu to change it from goofy to regular orientation and noticed my cpu pcb has started to bow.
> 
> I'm not too worried it's nothing excessive and my chip worked fine at 4.7ghz but wondered if anyone else had a similar situation? My chip is naked and the bow is following the length of the die so the bottom and top are bowed if that makes sense haha. It's a 4670k too in a z97 asus ranger ROG board.


How ironic. i woke up and my pc would cycle, worked fine yesterday and today nada. tried the usual ram thing and found 2 slots not working with a single ram stick. I thought well one slot ok, two slots then something is up. Took my cpu out (bare die as well) and it was bowed pretty well as well. So in my effort to be a total idiot, i tried to bow it back flat and heard it crack. I thought ok a little crack cant be bad and its nothing just a little crunch like when heard installing it brand new. Well turns out it now boots up for a split second then shuts off completely. Without the cpu in the socket it boots up with error 00 (no cpu in place) so guess its junked. I ordered a new one hoping i get it tomorrow to see what happens.

I really hope it was the bowing causing the ram slots not to function but weùll see tomorrow if not then mobo has to go in for RMA and i ruined a perfectly awesome 4.5ghz at 1.2v 4690k


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> How ironic. i woke up and my pc would cycle, worked fine yesterday and today nada. tried the usual ram thing and found 2 slots not working with a single ram stick. I thought well one slot ok, two slots then something is up. Took my cpu out (bare die as well) and it was bowed pretty well as well. So in my effort to be a total idiot, i tried to bow it back flat and heard it crack. I thought ok a little crack cant be bad and its nothing just a little crunch like when heard installing it brand new. Well turns out it now boots up for a split second then shuts off completely. Without the cpu in the socket it boots up with error 00 (no cpu in place) so guess its junked. I ordered a new one hoping i get it tomorrow to see what happens.
> 
> I really hope it was the bowing causing the ram slots not to function but weùll see tomorrow if not then mobo has to go in for RMA and i ruined a perfectly awesome 4.5ghz at 1.2v 4690k


Ouch that's really unlucky so I guess I best just leave it then. Its only bowed by a very slight amount but im guessing it's normal and I have nothing to worry about.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> My assumption would be from to much cpu block pressure, so try to keep the tightness a bit lower to help counter that


Seems I'm not the only one having bowing of the pcb but if it's normal I'll just continue with it the only problem now is if it has bowed then some pins might be pressed in slightly.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Hello guys I'm almost done bending all my tubing and stuff but I took the block off my cpu to change it from goofy to regular orientation and noticed my cpu pcb has started to bow.
> 
> I'm not too worried it's nothing excessive and my chip worked fine at 4.7ghz but wondered if anyone else had a similar situation? My chip is naked and the bow is following the length of the die so the bottom and top are bowed if that makes sense haha. It's a 4670k too in a z97 asus ranger ROG board.
> 
> 
> 
> How ironic. i woke up and my pc would cycle, worked fine yesterday and today nada. tried the usual ram thing and found 2 slots not working with a single ram stick. I thought well one slot ok, two slots then something is up. Took my cpu out (bare die as well) and it was bowed pretty well as well. So in my effort to be a total idiot, i tried to bow it back flat and heard it crack. I thought ok a little crack cant be bad and its nothing just a little crunch like when heard installing it brand new. Well turns out it now boots up for a split second then shuts off completely. Without the cpu in the socket it boots up with error 00 (no cpu in place) so guess its junked. I ordered a new one hoping i get it tomorrow to see what happens.
> 
> I really hope it was the bowing causing the ram slots not to function but weùll see tomorrow if not then mobo has to go in for RMA and i ruined a perfectly awesome 4.5ghz at 1.2v 4690k
Click to expand...

Yikes!

Do you think that the cause of the bowing was all related to running the cpu bare die?
I was planning on doing that as well, I have the EK naked mount kit, and a Supremacy, but haven't installed it yet.

The idea seemed appealing to me, but for the few degrees difference, it may not be worth taking the chance on the cpu bowing from doing a naked mount.
As well as the hassle of getting the cpu fitted properly in the socket, without the cpu socket latch.

I may just delid, remove all the "glue" thoroughly of course, re-fit the IHS with CLU on the die, Gelid on top of the IHS, and then call it a day.

Sorry to hear about the cpu, and it was a good one too.
I figured Skylake would be more likely to do that, with its thinner pcb, but I guess Haswell can be delicate as well.

What would be wrong with the mobo, if anything?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Yikes!
> 
> Do you think that the cause of the bowing was all related to running the cpu bare die?
> I was planning on doing that as well, I have the EK naked mount kit, and a Supremacy, but haven't installed it yet.
> 
> The idea seemed appealing to me, but for the few degrees difference, it may not be worth taking the chance on the cpu bowing from doing a naked mount.
> As well as the hassle of getting the cpu fitted properly in the socket, without the cpu socket latch.
> 
> I may just delid, remove all the "glue" thoroughly of course, re-fit the IHS with CLU on the die, Gelid on top of the IHS, and then call it a day.
> 
> Sorry to hear about the cpu, and it was a good one too.
> I figured Skylake would be more likely to do that, with its thinner pcb, but I guess Haswell can be delicate as well.
> 
> What would be wrong with the mobo, if anything?


It will be due to too much pressure on the chip but in all honesty I think his board bit the dust before the chip did, im talking less than half a mm of bowing on my chip so there is no chance a pin isn't going to make good contact.

Going bare die keeps these chips chilled out to impressive levels I'll never use an IHS unless soldered and even then I'll find a way to remove it.

Also removing the latch, I just put my pc on its side and pop the chip in, you can tape it down if you like but I've never had an issue, the chip sticks to the block when I remove it so it's never been an issue.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It will be due to too much pressure on the chip but in all honesty I think his board bit the dust before the chip did, im talking less than half a mm of bowing on my chip so there is no chance a pin isn't going to make good contact.
> 
> Going bare die keeps these chips chilled out to impressive levels I'll never use an IHS unless soldered and even then I'll find a way to remove it.
> 
> Also removing the latch, I just put my pc on its side and pop the chip in, you can tape it down if you like but I've never had an issue, the chip sticks to the block when I remove it so it's never been an issue.


Yeah, imo you will be fine, and it's working well for you.









Perhaps his board went bad then, he will soon find out.

I still really like the idea of a bare die mount, bought EK's lovely kit for it too.
And a nickel-plated Supremacy, and some CLU from Germany, lol.
Back in the day, they were all bare die, before the IHS was invented!

A few years ago, I delidded my 480 gpus, and ran them naked. Huge drop in temps., although that was a gpu, so kind of an apples and oranges comparison, lol.
Idk why Nvidia decided to put an IHS on those, they went back to naked die with the 580's.

Interesting method of putting the pc on its side, I hadn't heard of doing that first.
I guess it helps to keep the cpu aligned properly during installation.

Well, I have a while to decide on going bare die or not yet, but will have to make a decision on it once the upgrade and loop is finished.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Yeah, imo you will be fine, and it's working well for you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps his board went bad then, he will soon find out.
> 
> I still really like the idea of a bare die mount, bought EK's lovely kit for it too.
> And a nickel-plated Supremacy, and some CLU from Germany, lol.
> Back in the day, they were all bare die, before the IHS was invented!
> 
> A few years ago, I delidded my 480 gpus, and ran them naked. Huge drop in temps., although that was a gpu, so kind of an apples and oranges comparison, lol.
> Idk why Nvidia decided to put an IHS on those, they went back to naked die with the 580's.
> 
> Interesting method of putting the pc on its side, I hadn't heard of doing that first.
> I guess it helps to keep the cpu aligned properly during installation.
> 
> Well, I have a while to decide on going bare die or not yet, but will have to make a decision on it once the upgrade and loop is finished.


Well if the motherboard is flat then the cpu will just sit in the socket resting on the pins as per normal then you put your block on top and tighten down slowly like you used to back in the day of old bare die chips.

The cpu can only really go in one way so the process is still the same minus the latch to hold it in.


----------



## bluej511

Yea i mean its really bowed i put the ihs back on and theres a bit of a gap between the wafer and the IHS so its definitely bowed. Im not sure whats causing the RAM issue but if the contact between the cpu and pins is poor then i could possibly see it happening.

I think its bowing because of the pressure its putting on the die, then since theres nothing under it in the socket under the die its resting on the socket and bending. Im kinda pissed it happened but even more pissed that i tried to bend it back and destroyed it. If its not the cpu and the board needs to be RMAed ill be really pissed haha.

Had a quick power outage yesterday but my PC is on a surge protector, plus it worked fine for hours yesterday. I got one overnighted will try it tomorrow and see what happens. If the ram still doesnt work in 3-4 or will all the sticks in then RMA time.

For me it dropped from 53°C to 46°C going to bare die. If its not the cpu causing the RAM slot issue though not sure if ill go bare die again. Ill definitely delid and CLU it but not sure about bare die. I think the IHS def adds some good rigidity to the wafer so who knows.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i mean its really bowed i put the ihs back on and theres a bit of a gap between the wafer and the IHS so its definitely bowed. Im not sure whats causing the RAM issue but if the contact between the cpu and pins is poor then i could possibly see it happening.
> 
> I think its bowing because of the pressure its putting on the die, then since theres nothing under it in the socket under the die its resting on the socket and bending. Im kinda pissed it happened but even more pissed that i tried to bend it back and destroyed it. If its not the cpu and the board needs to be RMAed ill be really pissed haha.
> 
> Had a quick power outage yesterday but my PC is on a surge protector, plus it worked fine for hours yesterday. I got one overnighted will try it tomorrow and see what happens. If the ram still doesnt work in 3-4 or will all the sticks in then RMA time.
> 
> For me it dropped from 53°C to 46°C going to bare die. If its not the cpu causing the RAM slot issue though not sure if ill go bare die again. Ill definitely delid and CLU it but not sure about bare die. I think the IHS def adds some good rigidity to the wafer so who knows.


Got a pic of the pcb we can see? Maybe next time you go bare don't tighten down so much? If I remember correctly didn't you say you had issues with the socket hitting the block that could of caused you to overtighten on that board maybe? Also you did tell me you put washers onto the posts so you might of added more pressure than originally designed for.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Got a pic of the pcb we can see? Maybe next time you go bare don't tighten down so much? If I remember correctly didn't you say you had issues with the socket hitting the block that could of caused you to overtighten on that board maybe? Also you did tell me you put washers onto the posts so you might of added more pressure than originally designed for.


Will take one tomorrow i left it in place with the IHS so i dont get dust and wtv else in there. I have washers under the mounting springs so that the spring dont get stuck in hte mounting slots so i dont think that made much difference. Not sure why it happened but it is what it is.

If the new cpu still has ram issues and boot loops then ill know the bent pcb wasnt an issue and it was still making contact and i could eventually go back to bare die again, a 7°C difference is pretty significant. I def need to order more CLU but no sure yet.

Was definitely unexpected just not sure if it was the quick power surge that did it or the cpu or the mobo itself. Find out tomorrow morning. Thank god the place i order from isnt far so i could get it in one day; especially on a friday;


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Will take one tomorrow i left it in place with the IHS so i dont get dust and wtv else in there. I have washers under the mounting springs so that the spring dont get stuck in hte mounting slots so i dont think that made much difference. Not sure why it happened but it is what it is.
> 
> If the new cpu still has ram issues and boot loops then ill know the bent pcb wasnt an issue and it was still making contact and i could eventually go back to bare die again, a 7°C difference is pretty significant. I def need to order more CLU but no sure yet.
> 
> Was definitely unexpected just not sure if it was the quick power surge that did it or the cpu or the mobo itself. Find out tomorrow morning. Thank god the place i order from isnt far so i could get it in one day; especially on a friday;


It would make a difference if you tightening the posts screws all the way down because the springs are a certain height, so are the posts etc so if you're adding 4mm washers that's a lot of extra pressure.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Is it normal for a delidded 6700k temps to be all around the place 50 and 60 the next second, mine keeps jumping around alot and not making any sense, perhaps I should remount.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It would make a difference if you tightening the posts screws all the way down because the springs are a certain height, so are the posts etc so if you're adding 4mm washers that's a lot of extra pressure.


No no there def not that thick, there 'mm in diameter maybe 1mm if that. Ill have to take pics of how i have it setup tomorrow with the new cpu.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Pump died one week ago, new pump in today allowed me to rearrange the black box for future cramming whatever I can in there.
Maybe some gpu(s), another 240 top rad, hmm, time.
Also found out another reason why I wont use Phobya LM near my motherboard or processor again, pumped off the IHS and sat on the PCB.
Probably only safe with the isolation of gpu die(s).
Marble Madness..


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> Is it normal for a delidded 6700k temps to be all around the place 50 and 60 the next second, mine keeps jumping around alot and not making any sense, perhaps I should remount.


Plenty of possible reasons for this ranging from die mount, to ihs mount, to block mount, to cooling type, to activity. I do not know about 6700K specifically, only common sense, try again, maybe re apply thermal paste.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Pump died one week ago, new pump in today allowed me to rearrange the black box for future cramming whatever I can in there.
> Maybe some gpu(s), another 240 top rad, hmm, time.
> Also found out another reason why I wont use Phobya LM near my motherboard or processor again, pumped off the IHS and sat on the PCB.
> Probably only safe with the isolation of gpu die(s).
> Marble Madness..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


That looks like far too much LM to me, I don't use anywhere near that amount on my die and block.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

For those that use nail polish for covering the transistors on the CPU... how many layers do you guys use? Any specific brand? Now that I'm getting my GTX970 back I think I'll use some CLU again on it, but this time ditch the tape for something more protective...
I'm sure my SO wouldn't mind a trip to Ulta...with ulterior motives involved...


----------



## g0tsl33p14

oops


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> That looks like far too much LM to me, I don't use anywhere near that amount on my die and block.


Oh woops, wrong picture in my brain.

That was the amount I used between the die and IHS. I actually did not add any from re applying the IHS during my under air hiatus, and that is what it looked like just before going back naked.

The reason I am perturbed is the Phobya pumping out from between the IHS and block, sitting there waiting for me.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> For those that use nail polish for covering the transistors on the CPU... how many layers do you guys use? Any specific brand? Now that I'm getting my GTX970 back I think I'll use some CLU again on it, but this time ditch the tape for something more protective...
> I'm sure my SO wouldn't mind a trip to Ulta...with ulterior motives involved...


I just did one even stroke, seems to have worked fine.


----------



## 0ldChicken

@g0tsl33p14
I'm not sure i understand what's going on here. I see a picture with LOTS of LM though (for any application). I've been using it for almost a year now and haven't had any running off anywhere but if you're having issues with it I'd love to know. I'm not running naked but still using phoyba lm on die-ihs.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> For those that use nail polish for covering the transistors on the CPU... how many layers do you guys use? Any specific brand? Now that I'm getting my GTX970 back I think I'll use some CLU again on it, but this time ditch the tape for something more protective...
> I'm sure my SO wouldn't mind a trip to Ulta...with ulterior motives involved...
> 
> 
> 
> I just did one even stroke, seems to have worked fine.
Click to expand...

Interesting... I tried on my GPU and it seemed way too thin... I think the more layers the better... I don't think I'll encounter a heat issue...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Interesting... I tried on my GPU and it seemed way too thin... I think the more layers the better... I don't think I'll encounter a heat issue...


You're asking about covering the conductive parts of the pcb yes? Then one coating on the brush then over the VRM on the chip or whatever they are?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> @g0tsl33p14
> I'm not sure i understand what's going on here. I see a picture with LOTS of LM though (for any application). I've been using it for almost a year now and haven't had any running off anywhere but if you're having issues with it I'd love to know. I'm not running naked but still using phoyba lm on die-ihs.



This is the aftermath of the following scenario.

Water pump dies.
I remove naked water block.
I add CLU to die where CLU was missing.
I relid the die
I apply Phobya LM on IHS
I seat stock cooling block.

I remove stock cooling block.
Phobya LM squeezed from between stock cooling block and IHS clumping in a ball.
I breath a sigh of relief as the liquid metal ball does not drop into the socket during removal.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> This is the aftermath of the following scenario.
> 
> Water pump dies.
> I remove naked water block.
> I add CLU to die where CLU was missing.
> I relid the die
> I apply Phobya LM on IHS
> I seat stock cooling block.
> 
> I remove stock cooling block.
> Phobya LM squeezed from between stock cooling block and IHS clumping in a ball.
> I breath a sigh of relief as the liquid metal ball does not drop into the socket during removal.


ah i understand now. Id have to agree with benji though. The ball that has run off is large enough to cover a few ihs. Blotting is really key with phoyba lm, it really needs to be smashed into a VERY thin layer. Even the amount that is on your die looks like too much as it is also running over, thankfully your fivr are covered. You could wipe a decent amount off the die and set the ihs back on. Take a few q-tips to the bits that have rolled off though.
I've never had any run off anywhere. I started too thin and then reapplied and added more but i never got it as thick as yours


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*


Don't know personally, but I ran out of PLM and I am out of CLU, so while the previous is noted, I can't do anything about anything now.

In my opinion I may have over done the Phobya for a temporary solution, however I think the die with CLU might just be the camera, because I have never had a problem.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Does this seem like a bit to much ?








Temps are all over the place, I quess I know what I`m doing tomorrow, draining the loop and reapplying


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Well if the motherboard is flat then the cpu will just sit in the socket resting on the pins as per normal then you put your block on top and tighten down slowly like you used to back in the day of old bare die chips.
> 
> The cpu can only really go in one way so the process is still the same minus the latch to hold it in.


Right.

Just realized that since my case is an S8, the mobo is already horizontal, lol.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i mean its really bowed i put the ihs back on and theres a bit of a gap between the wafer and the IHS so its definitely bowed. Im not sure whats causing the RAM issue but if the contact between the cpu and pins is poor then i could possibly see it happening.
> 
> I think its bowing because of the pressure its putting on the die, then since theres nothing under it in the socket under the die its resting on the socket and bending. Im kinda pissed it happened but even more pissed that i tried to bend it back and destroyed it. If its not the cpu and the board needs to be RMAed ill be really pissed haha.
> 
> Had a quick power outage yesterday but my PC is on a surge protector, plus it worked fine for hours yesterday. I got one overnighted will try it tomorrow and see what happens. If the ram still doesnt work in 3-4 or will all the sticks in then RMA time.
> 
> For me it dropped from 53°C to 46°C going to bare die. If its not the cpu causing the RAM slot issue though not sure if ill go bare die again. Ill definitely delid and CLU it but not sure about bare die. I think the IHS def adds some good rigidity to the wafer so who knows.


Well, don't feel bad about trying to straighten the cpu pcb a bit, I'm sure I would have done the same.

Actually, I have done lots of foolish things like that in the past.








Hopefully, the board is ok.

That's a pretty good temp. drop from going bare die, 7C is certainly tempting.
As they say, ymmv though.
Certainly delidding, and still using the IHS, with CLU on the die, will provide a decent drop for me.
My 4970K is waiting to be installed, so I'm going to do some brief testing with it un-delidded first, so I'll have something to compare to.
I don't want to, I'd like to use that lovely delidding tool now, but I must be patient, lol.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Right.
> 
> Just realized that since my case is an S8, the mobo is already horizontal, lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, don't feel bad about trying to straighten the cpu pcb a bit, I'm sure I would have done the same.
> 
> Actually, I have done lots of foolish things like that in the past.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, the board is ok.
> 
> That's a pretty good temp. drop from going bare die, 7C is certainly tempting.
> As they say, ymmv though.
> Certainly delidding, and still using the IHS, with CLU on the die, will provide a decent drop for me.
> My 4970K is waiting to be installed, so I'm going to do some brief testing with it un-delidded first, so I'll have something to compare to.
> I don't want to, I'd like to use that lovely delidding tool now, but I must be patient, lol.


My gf used my i5 rig for months before I touched it but as soon as I had it I delidded it so don't have a comparison. 1.5v nets me a few degrees under thermal throttle due to bare die.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Don't know personally, but I ran out of PLM and I am out of CLU, so while the previous is noted, I can't do anything about anything now.
> 
> In my opinion I may have over done the Phobya for a temporary solution, however I think the die with CLU might just be the camera, because I have never had a problem.


I've never used LM on the IHS since I've heard it doesn't make a large difference (2-3C from kryonaut or similar TIM) but I push a pinhead sized bead (~1mm) onto whatever I'm using to spread it and start working it in. Seems like it takes a few strokes to get it to stick and start smearing. Then I'll add another bead until I get this below. I used to do it a bit thinner (no "lumps") but I gained a few degrees by adding a tiny bit.



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Does this seem like a bit to much ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps are all over the place, I quess I know what I`m doing tomorrow, draining the loop and reapplying


Maybe a tiny bit too much, but I've never used it on the ihs since I've always been too worried about having rollout issues with such a large surface to deal with. I went back a page and saw your post, I don't think that going from 50-60 is too crazy depending on what you are doing at that time. Some things have more stable temps than others but most things don't stay very constant.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Right.
> 
> Just realized that since my case is an S8, the mobo is already horizontal, lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, don't feel bad about trying to straighten the cpu pcb a bit, I'm sure I would have done the same.
> 
> Actually, I have done lots of foolish things like that in the past.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, the board is ok.
> 
> That's a pretty good temp. drop from going bare die, 7C is certainly tempting.
> As they say, ymmv though.
> Certainly delidding, and still using the IHS, with CLU on the die, will provide a decent drop for me.
> My 4970K is waiting to be installed, so I'm going to do some brief testing with it un-delidded first, so I'll have something to compare to.
> I don't want to, I'd like to use that lovely delidding tool now, but I must be patient, lol.


Sad face. Got my chip put it in, turns out the RAM slot isnt dead but one of my memory sticks might be. I was at 1.2 45x before, tried to boot and bios just gives me error A2. Reset and tried 1.2 43x and running stress test now. I was around 53-54°C in the same temps couple days ago same voltage, now factory chip is at 60°C. So between deliding and adding CLU i lost 6-7°C. Not sure if this one is worth deliding although 60°C is a bit warm but ambient here is about 28°C with no AC so doesnt help.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Sad face. Got my chip put it in, turns out the RAM slot isnt dead but one of my memory sticks might be. I was at 1.2 45x before, tried to boot and bios just gives me error A2. Reset and tried 1.2 43x and running stress test now. I was around 53-54°C in the same temps couple days ago same voltage, now factory chip is at 60°C. So between deliding and adding CLU i lost 6-7°C. Not sure if this one is worth deliding although 60°C is a bit warm but ambient here is about 28°C with no AC so doesnt help.


Go naked again, I would lol but then again I'm probably going to keep mine pinned at the highest OC I can with 1.4v+.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Go naked again, I would lol but then again I'm probably going to keep mine pinned at the highest OC I can with 1.4v+.


I just might, i also forgot to turn my pump back up since its pwm, dropped 9°C off my gpu and 3°C off my cpu just doing that haha. Back to normal temps. Kinda sad i lost 200mhz for the same voltage but what are you gonna do lesson learned. I have 2 sets of naked screws so might as well knowing its not the issue. I just need to order more clu, stuff wiped right off the block too so not an issue, stained it pretty good but thats about it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I just might, i also forgot to turn my pump back up since its pwm, dropped 9°C off my gpu and 3°C off my cpu just doing that haha. Back to normal temps. Kinda sad i lost 200mhz for the same voltage but what are you gonna do lesson learned. I have 2 sets of naked screws so might as well knowing its not the issue. I just need to order more clu, stuff wiped right off the block too so not an issue, stained it pretty good but thats about it.


I need some Isopropyl Alcohol to clean CLU off, my block is scuffed from trying to rub it off with 70% alcohol. I'm not worried about it bowing anymore I'm pretty sure that it will be fine as long as I just stick to not bending it back, I'm sorry about your loss but I guess hindsight is a beautiful thing? Check the simple stuff first next time, but still, I probably would of done the same.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I need some Isopropyl Alcohol to clean CLU off, my block is scuffed from trying to rub it off with 70% alcohol. I'm not worried about it bowing anymore I'm pretty sure that it will be fine as long as I just stick to not bending it back, I'm sorry about your loss but I guess hindsight is a beautiful thing? Check the simple stuff first next time, but still, I probably would of done the same.


It happens. I used one ram stick in all the slots and the last two wouldnt boot up. Figured those 2 didnt work, might have been that you need one in slot 2 to make it work for dual channel. Its the same stick that gave me issues couple months ago with it boot looping. I cleaned it in the first place put it back in and it worked fine. It might end up giving me issues in the long run i think.

I can finally try out my delid too on haswell though, worked awesome on ivy bridge. Now i can use it on the new chip without having to worry about anything. Maybe even film it and put it up here.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> For those that use nail polish for covering the transistors on the CPU... how many layers do you guys use? Any specific brand? Now that I'm getting my GTX970 back I think I'll use some CLU again on it, but this time ditch the tape for something more protective...
> I'm sure my SO wouldn't mind a trip to Ulta...with ulterior motives involved...


I think it depends on the brand. The one I used I had to do quite a few layers and it still felt like I could have done more. Probably depends how much you put on but the stuff I had was pretty thin. From the pics I see of others it seems there is better and thicker stuff out there. Just be careful you don't want it to get taller than the die.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> It happens. I used one ram stick in all the slots and the last two wouldnt boot up. Figured those 2 didnt work, might have been that you need one in slot 2 to make it work for dual channel. Its the same stick that gave me issues couple months ago with it boot looping. I cleaned it in the first place put it back in and it worked fine. It might end up giving me issues in the long run i think.
> 
> I can finally try out my delid too on haswell though, worked awesome on ivy bridge. Now i can use it on the new chip without having to worry about anything. Maybe even film it and put it up here.


Nearly time to boot up my 4670k again, just one more hardline tube to bend and then use the UV glue on the caps and get to overclocking and work again.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Nearly time to boot up my 4670k again, just one more hardline tube to bend and then use the UV glue on the caps and get to overclocking and work again.


Nice, at least im glad i found the limit right off the bat. The new chip 45x wouldnt even boot into the bios a couple times, then when it did blue screened right away, 44x booted crashed in stress test right away.

Other one was rock solid 1.2 45x, i didnt even try 46x but wouldnt be shocked if it could do it. Oh well as my people say c'est la vie. Prob going to go bare die again, just need to order more CLU the stuff i have is dried up.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Nice, at least im glad i found the limit right off the bat. The new chip 45x wouldnt even boot into the bios a couple times, then when it did blue screened right away, 44x booted crashed in stress test right away.
> 
> Other one was rock solid 1.2 45x, i didnt even try 46x but wouldnt be shocked if it could do it. Oh well as my people say c'est la vie. Prob going to go bare die again, just need to order more CLU the stuff i have is dried up.


Do intel chips have a multiplier blind spot? where they refuse to boot? but if you go a bit higher they'll work? AMD chips can be like that.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Do intel chips have a multiplier blind spot? where they refuse to boot? but if you go a bit higher they'll work? AMD chips can be like that.


Idk all i know is 44x failed testing it and 45x BSODed on me. Id love to try 46x but i know the outcome haha.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Idk all i know is 44x failed testing it and 45x BSODed on me. Id love to try 46x but i know the outcome haha.


No harm in trying! my 4670k boots at 50x but i need to pump some serious voltage into it like 1.5v.











Screenshot says 40x but I did get 50x to boot a few times haha.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> No harm in trying! my 4670k boots at 50x but i need to pump some serious voltage into it like 1.5v.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Screenshot says 40x but I did get 50x to boot a few times haha.


Prob makes even more sense to go bare die then.


----------



## Ceadderman

Just inherited my Uncle's Dell XPC...

really wasn't expecting much. It sports a cheap mATX mainboard as well as a low end NVidia(GT720). And of course the obligatory cheap Dell 400w PSU.









Since I haven't been able to crack his PW(he passed away end of June), I had little idea as to the little gem of a CPU that resides in this system. I knew it was an i7 so I figured that since it has Win7 Home Edition, that it had to be the lowest 9** series which if memory serves is a i7 920(?)

Well I just got the shock of my life when I got into the BIOS. This thing has a full blooded i7 4790 under the hood.









So now I'm just gonna get my grubby paws on a HE disc and reinstall the OS. Then I'm gonna format the drive and Install the OS to day zero.

So not only do I have a sweet Intel chip to OC(If it's not locked. It's a straight 4790, not a K nor an S), I got one that I may be delidding as well.









Now I just need a socket 1150 RoG board, an SSD and a capable PSU and the Dell can be a sleeper.









I'm going to miss my Uncle for sure, but I wish he'dve had me build him a system around this CPU.









:Edit: Dropped my XFX 5770 HD Radeon in the build last night. Should serve just fine as a DX11 Gaming platform once I get this PW sorted out and updated the Drivers and Screen Ratio. At least it's better than the 720 that was in it.









~Ceadder


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Just inherited my Uncle's Dell XPC...
> 
> really wasn't expecting much. It sports a cheap mATX mainboard as well as a low end AMD/ATi card. And of course the obligatory cheap Dell 400w PSU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since I haven't been able to crack his PW(he passed away end of June), I had little idea as to the little gem of a CPU that resides in this system. I knew it was an i7 so I figured that since it has Win7 Home Edition, that it had to be the lowest 9** series which if memory serves is a i7 920(?)
> 
> Well I just got the shock of my life when I got into the BIOS. This thing has a full blooded i7 4790 under the hood.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So now I'm just gonna get my grubby paws on a HE disc and reinstall the OS. Then I'm gonna format the drive and Install the OS to day zero.
> 
> So not only do I have a sweet Intel chip to OC(If it's not locked. It's a straight 4790, not a K nor an S), I got one that I may be delidding as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I just need a socket 1150 RoG board, an SSD and a capable PSU and the Dell can be a sleeper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to miss my Uncle for sure, but I wish he'dve had me build him a system around this CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Getting around a login password on Win7 isn't very difficult. Get yourself a Hiren's Boot CD ISO and use the password remover on it.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Getting around a login password on Win7 isn't very difficult. Get yourself a Hiren's Boot CD ISO and use the password remover on it.


can't you still use the full login (where you type username and password) and use the username admin with the default password (can't remember it's been a while) to change all user passwords? I choose to do it with a few office desktops I got a few years back and worked like a charm. Don't remember what os it was though... probably vista


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Getting around a login password on Win7 isn't very difficult. Get yourself a Hiren's Boot CD ISO and use the password remover on it.


Is that the "Password Renew 1.1" program? My stepdad just passed away and left me his laptop but I can not get into it without his password. I was going to just delete it all and reinstall but I really want to see what all he had put on there, especially in his final days of fighting cancer he may have written something down. I would like to see before I reinstall windows. Just curious if you knew which specific program works? Seems like there is 3 or 4 of them on the list of programs


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> can't you still use the full login (where you type username and password) and use the username admin with the default password (can't remember it's been a while) to change all user passwords? I choose to do it with a few office desktops I got a few years back and worked like a charm. Don't remember what os it was though... probably vista


I'm not sure. Hiren's is my go to for password removal. The program in Hiren's to use is a DOS based program, just need to follow the prompts. Can look kinda scary if you're not familiar with the giant wall of text that comes careening down the screen..But it's not too terrible to get it done.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Is that the "Password Renew 1.1" program? My stepdad just passed away and left me his laptop but I can not get into it without his password. I was going to just delete it all and reinstall but I really want to see what all he had put on there, especially in his final days of fighting cancer he may have written something down. I would like to see before I reinstall windows. Just curious if you knew which specific program works? Seems like there is 3 or 4 of them on the list of programs


I don't think it's password renew. I can load up Hiren's either when I get home from work, or it might be later this evening, and tell you exactly which one I always use.

There is also a registry edit you can do while booting into repair/recovery mode using a boot disc/USB. I had printed out the instructions many moons ago...I'll see if I can find that too.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Just inherited my Uncle's Dell XPC...
> 
> I'm going to miss my Uncle for sure, but I wish he'dve had me build him a system around this CPU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> can't you still use the full login (where you type username and password) and use the username admin with the default password (can't remember it's been a while) to change all user passwords? I choose to do it with a few office desktops I got a few years back and worked like a charm. Don't remember what os it was though... probably vista


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Is that the "Password Renew 1.1" program? My stepdad just passed away and left me his laptop but I can not get into it without his password. I was going to just delete it all and reinstall but I really want to see what all he had put on there, especially in his final days of fighting cancer he may have written something down. I would like to see before I reinstall windows. Just curious if you knew which specific program works? Seems like there is 3 or 4 of them on the list of programs




I always use the first one in the list. Offline NT/2000/etc Password Changer. This will be my last







post in the delidded thread. If anyone has questions/trouble getting it to work you are more than welcome to shoot me a PM.

My condolences to both of your losses. I will pour a little out when I have my Friday evening cocktail :cheers:


----------



## Ceadderman

Took a bit but I finally found a workable link. Thanks for the assist Roboyto. +Rep(2) for the pointer.









~Ceadder


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I always use the first one in the list. Offline NT/2000/etc Password Changer. This will be my last
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> post in the delidded thread. If anyone has questions/trouble getting it to work you are more than welcome to shoot me a PM.
> 
> My condolences to both of your losses. I will pour a little out when I have my Friday evening cocktail


I am very grateful for this thank you. I will message you if I come across any issues. Thanks as well for the condolences he will certainly be missed.









Back on topic does anyone have any long term experience with Phobya LM? Would like to see what it looks like after long term use.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I am using it with my stock GPU heat sync.


----------



## rhkcommander959

Do the delidded CPUs have to be newer Intel? I have a crapton of delidded AMD CPUs


----------



## Ceadderman

Nope. Any working CPU that you've delidded can apply.

Follow the application process in the OP.









~Ceadder


----------



## Ceadderman

Apologies for the double post. Just posting an update on my Haswell system.

I got into the system relatively quickly when I used Hiren's 15.1.1 Offline NT/2000/etc Password Changer and simply read each question thoroughly and guessed at what I needed to do to get in. Took a bit though. Now I'm just avoiding a restart until I figure out what I need to do to turn off the PW login. Been so long since I've run Win7 with purpose.









Installed my 5770 to get some idea what the crappy GT720 is capable of by comparison. If I were to believe Windows Experience the 720 is better. But that was without the AMD Catalyst downloaded and installed. WE for the 720 was a 6. WE for driverless 5770 is a 1.









Once I get things better sorted out is it worth delidding the 4790?









~Ceadder


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Apologies for the double post. Just posting an update on my Haswell system.
> 
> I got into the system relatively quickly when I used Hiren's 15.1.1 Offline NT/2000/etc Password Changer and simply read each question thoroughly and guessed at what I needed to do to get in. Took a bit though. Now I'm just avoiding a restart until I figure out what I need to do to turn off the PW login. Been so long since I've run Win7 with purpose.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Installed my 5770 to get some idea what the crappy GT720 is capable of by comparison. If I were to believe Windows Experience the 720 is better. But that was without the AMD Catalyst downloaded and installed. WE for the 720 was a 6. WE for driverless 5770 is a 1.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Once I get things better sorted out is it worth delidding the 4790?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


If you didn't need a password and you are in windows then the password has been removed and you don't need to do anything else. If you want to add a password then you need to go to user accounts.


----------



## cyan

just delidded my 4770k using delid tool from youmagine, 6C (1core drop 9C) drop max temperature using NT-H1
(still waiting CLU from overseas, no local shops have it







)
is idle suppose to be the same ? my friend said I suppose to get lower idle.
or I need CLU for lower idle ?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> just delidded my 4770k using delid tool from youmagine, 6C (1core drop 9C) drop max temperature using NT-H1
> (still waiting CLU from overseas, no local shops have it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> is idle suppose to be the same ? my friend said I suppose to get lower idle.
> or I need CLU for lower idle ?


Unless youre using full voltage and full sped without c-states and turbo enabled idle isnt going to change much if at all. Even with CLU. The load is so minuscule at idle wont make any difference.


----------



## GtiJason

I've been very curious to know what happens when running delidded cpu with CLU between die and ihs instead of Kryonaut at sub zero temperatures. I've asked a lot of guys at HWBot and been told by all it's a bad idea, even at -45Cish under Single Stage. I took a blob of CLU and sprayed a bit of ln2 vapour/air and immediatly the gallium turned white and hard as steel so this made me nervous. After reading old research studies on Gallium from the late 30's I also learned that it will expand with cold, may be only 3% but that's still something that can crack the die while under pressure. Recently came accross a review that state CLP will remain fully functional at temperatures between -273C and +1200C so this got me interested again.



I decided to give it a try on a silicon lotto loser i3 6300 since I don't really care if it dies and results were very promising. I used XTU as my load test and right around 1.5v using Kryonaut I would begin seeing positive temps regularly, under 10C but they were there. After applying a thin layer of CLU to the die and underside of the ihs and Kryo above I was able to push load volts as high as 1.675v before I saw any positive numbers a voltage that would spike to the low-mid 30's pre clu. This gave me confidence to try a better/hotter cpu, my 6700k and here are those results at 5g




I can actually set up to 1.5 load volts and stay just under 0C, and can now use lower volts for 5g low clock challenge since the cpu scales a bit with the cooler temps. It's still early in my testing but after testing 2 Skylake cpu's on SS Phase I'm seeing close to a 30C temp swing, roughly the same results I saw from delidding with CLU on water


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Apologies for the double post. Just posting an update on my Haswell system.
> 
> I got into the system relatively quickly when I used Hiren's 15.1.1 Offline NT/2000/etc Password Changer and simply read each question thoroughly and guessed at what I needed to do to get in. Took a bit though. Now I'm just avoiding a restart until I figure out what I need to do to turn off the PW login. Been so long since I've run Win7 with purpose.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Installed my 5770 to get some idea what the crappy GT720 is capable of by comparison. If I were to believe Windows Experience the 720 is better. But that was without the AMD Catalyst downloaded and installed. WE for the 720 was a 6. WE for driverless 5770 is a 1.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Once I get things better sorted out is it worth delidding the 4790?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you didn't need a password and you are in windows then the password has been removed and you don't need to do anything else. If you want to add a password then you need to go to user accounts.
Click to expand...

Yup, PW was indeed removed. Won't be applying one to the system either. Never know of or when I'd see a bug shut me out of my system. I've had friends whose laptops were borked to the point where access was impossible without a new drive and OS. And I've no pr0n on my system and nothing to hide anyway.









So now back to the question of whether it's worth delidding the 4790 or even if I can. I'm a Folder and could certainly use the points from this chip. It's got the stock cooler on it so I'm thinking that it would indeed help if it's that poo Intel put under the lids or if this is one of the later non poo chips. I can't stuff one of the Hyper coolers I have inside the stock case and nothing else in this system is worth water cooling and I'm not sure I really want to mod this XPS case for larger fan openings. Although the front could be modded to fit a 120.









So yeah...?









~Ceadder


----------



## blueballs

Hey guys,

I delidded my new 6700k yesterday, I thought I've done a perfect job until I get the 55 post code which is related to the memory... I have 2 ram slot and only the second one work.

Unfortunately there's a small scratch on the PCB, I heard people putting small piece of paper,nail polish or conductive grade silicon to fix this problem.

Any recommendations?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blueballs*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I delidded my new 6700k yesterday, I thought I've done a perfect job until I get the 55 post code which is related to the memory... I have 2 ram slot and only the second one work.
> 
> Unfortunately there's a small scratch on the PCB, I heard people putting small piece of paper,nail polish or conductive grade silicon to fix this problem.
> 
> Any recommendations?


Hopefully you didn't scratch the tracers, if you did and it went thru then could be why its not working.

Otherwise i would check your ram make sure it doesnt have anything on it that could also cause a problem.


----------



## blueballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Hopefully you didn't scratch the tracers, if you did and it went thru then could be why its not working.
> 
> Otherwise i would check your ram make sure it doesnt have anything on it that could also cause a problem.


I've done hours of stress test and everything run fine... except for the first ram slot


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Yup, PW was indeed removed. Won't be applying one to the system either. Never know of or when I'd see a bug shut me out of my system. I've had friends whose laptops were borked to the point where access was impossible without a new drive and OS. And I've no pr0n on my system and nothing to hide anyway.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So now back to the question of whether it's worth delidding the 4790 or even if I can. I'm a Folder and could certainly use the points from this chip. It's got the stock cooler on it so I'm thinking that it would indeed help if it's that poo Intel put under the lids or if this is one of the later non poo chips. I can't stuff one of the Hyper coolers I have inside the stock case and nothing else in this system is worth water cooling and I'm not sure I really want to mod this XPS case for larger fan openings. Although the front could be modded to fit a 120.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So yeah...?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I know for certain the 4790k chips had improved thermal compound, it was how they reached 4GHz factory; I would assume that the standard 4790 would receive the same treatment?

Either way, it is absolutely worth delidding the chip regardless of what cooler you will be using. If you're going to chop the top, you may as well get the most out of it however and use liquid metal paste under there.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blueballs*
> 
> I've done hours of stress test and everything run fine... except for the first ram slot


Could be that you scratched the part that connects the RAM to the CPU?

I thought i had the same issue and ended up ruining my CPU, turns out my ram that was corroded from my previous water install was still causing intermittent issues. Everything is a possibility. Depends how deep its scratched/gouged.


----------



## blueballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Could be that you scratched the part that connects the RAM to the CPU?
> 
> I thought i had the same issue and ended up ruining my CPU, turns out my ram that was corroded from my previous water install was still causing intermittent issues. Everything is a possibility. Depends how deep its scratched/gouged.


every parts are 1 day old and everything worked fine before i delid... I could probably return the mb and take another one that has 4 ram slot or buy another CPU but I wonder if there's anything I can try before doing so?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blueballs*
> 
> every parts are 1 day old and everything worked fine before i delid... I could probably return the mb and take another one that has 4 ram slot or buy another CPU but I wonder if there's anything I can try before doing so?


Try both sticks in the ram slot that works, that should rull out the ram sticks. Besides that theres really not much to test.


----------



## blueballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Try both sticks in the ram slot that works, that should rull out the ram sticks. Besides that theres really not much to test.


already done that, so I'm sure the lil scratch is causing this problem... some people are putting liquid electronic tape to cover the scratches but will it fix the problem or just prevent any more damages?


----------



## blueballs




----------



## Benjiw

Sorry blue but it'll the parts where working before the delid then you've damaged your cpu and cut a memory trace on the actual cpu unless you damaged a pin in the socket. I really wish people would stop using sharp blades on their chips.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Sorry blue but it'll the parts where working before the delid then you've damaged your cpu and cut a memory trace on the actual cpu unless you damaged a pin in the socket. I really wish people would stop using sharp blades on their chips.


Right?! Research please people! Use a vice or pay for one of the new tools! MUCH safer. Clean off the factory silicon with plastic card if you cut it in half with a knife the cut edge will be sharper but much safer than a razor.


----------



## blueballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Sorry blue but it'll the parts where working before the delid then you've damaged your cpu and cut a memory trace on the actual cpu unless you damaged a pin in the socket. I really wish people would stop using sharp blades on their chips.


no bent pin, and the PCB is soo tin on skylake that I didn't want to mess with the vice+hammer

I heard people soldering their scratched motherboard
... should I try that on the CPU? B-)


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blueballs*
> 
> no bent pin, and the PCB is soo tin on skylake that I didn't want to mess with the vice+hammer
> 
> I heard people soldering their scratched motherboard
> ... should I try that on the CPU? B-)


If you want to kill your cpu completely then sure go for it then you can turn it into some art or maybe a coaster?

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Right?! Research please people! Use a vice or pay for one of the new tools! MUCH safer. Clean off the factory silicon with plastic card if you cut it in half with a knife the cut edge will be sharper but much safer than a razor.


I have the delid mate amd it takes seconds to remove the IHS without destroying a chip.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Hmm... I haven't been able to find it...



So nobody makes any products like the MSI delid die guard? I've been looking all over for one that would support skylake as I want to run direct die SFF air cooler on a 6700k but I'm not finding much... I need the absolute best efficiency and I'm not really hot on running the IHS then the heatsink...if I can just the heatsink alone would be great but I also don't want to put that much pressure on the die from just the CPU cooler. I wonder if its possible to cut away the middle section of the IHS and just leave the sides and use that for the normal intel bracket and have it open in the center for the direct die mount... Just dremel out the center piece of copper...hmm now if I can get my hands on some skylake IHS's that people don't want...


----------



## Unnatural

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Hmm... I haven't been able to find it...
> 
> So nobody makes any products like the MSI delid die guard? I've been looking all over for one that would support skylake as I want to run direct die SFF air cooler on a 6700k but I'm not finding much... I need the absolute best efficiency and I'm not really hot on running the IHS then the heatsink...if I can just the heatsink alone would be great but I also don't want to put that much pressure on the die from just the CPU cooler. I wonder if its possible to cut away the middle section of the IHS and just leave the sides and use that for the normal intel bracket and have it open in the center for the direct die mount... Just dremel out the center piece of copper...hmm now if I can get my hands on some skylake IHS's that people don't want...


There is a spacer for Skylake made by Aquacomputer, but I don't know how well it works. I think there's some feedback on the Skylake Delid Thread


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Hmm... I haven't been able to find it...
> 
> So nobody makes any products like the MSI delid die guard? I've been looking all over for one that would support skylake as I want to run direct die SFF air cooler on a 6700k but I'm not finding much... I need the absolute best efficiency and I'm not really hot on running the IHS then the heatsink...if I can just the heatsink alone would be great but I also don't want to put that much pressure on the die from just the CPU cooler. I wonder if its possible to cut away the middle section of the IHS and just leave the sides and use that for the normal intel bracket and have it open in the center for the direct die mount... Just dremel out the center piece of copper...hmm now if I can get my hands on some skylake IHS's that people don't want...


It is a lot of additional work for a potentially small gain in performance. If you run some liquid metal under the IHS the results are quite good and could be better than running bare die with traditional paste...unless you plan on using some LM with the bare die.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> It is a lot of additional work for a potentially small gain in performance. If you run some liquid metal under the IHS the results are quite good and could be better than running bare die with traditional paste...unless you plan on using some LM with the bare die.


Pastes dont seem to work AT ALL on bare die either running naked or with the IHS on it just doesnt last. It must either be the pressure or the direct high heat that causes it to pump out and fail within days or weeks.

From my testing i went from 53°C with IHS on and CLU to around 46-47°C bare die with CLU and that was tested with intel utility stress test, firestrike and high cpu demanding games. I may run it bare die again and see if my CPU made in a totally different plant drops the temps just as much. My first chip was from malaysia this one is from vietnam and overclocks 200mhz less with the same voltage.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Pastes dont seem to work AT ALL on bare die either running naked or with the IHS on it just doesnt last. It must either be the pressure or the direct high heat that causes it to pump out and fail within days or weeks.
> 
> From my testing i went from 53°C with IHS on and CLU to around 46-47°C bare die with CLU and that was tested with intel utility stress test, firestrike and high cpu demanding games. I may run it bare die again and see if my CPU made in a totally different plant drops the temps just as much. My first chip was from malaysia this one is from vietnam and overclocks 200mhz less with the same voltage.


Xigmatek PTI-G4512 - Advertised as 'Pump Out Resistant' and I will atest that as I went nearly 2 years without issues. Regardless of it's seemingly low thermal conductance rating, it performed as well as Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut in my own testing...until the TG pumped out after a couple of days.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Xigmatek PTI-G4512 - Advertised as 'Pump Out Resistant' and I will atest that as I went nearly 2 years without issues. Regardless of it's seemingly low thermal conductance rating, it performed as well as Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut in my own testing...until the TG pumped out after a couple of days.


Seems to be the only one, i tried hydronaut (as kryonaut was out of stock) and nh-t1 and both pumped out rapidly. Oddly enough the hydronaut on a 3350p ivy bridge is doing just fine after a couple months, temps are identical. My guess is the high TDP of i5s and i7s just destroys TIMs.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> It is a lot of additional work for a potentially small gain in performance. If you run some liquid metal under the IHS the results are quite good and could be better than running bare die with traditional paste...unless you plan on using some LM with the bare die.


Bare die everyday!


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> It is a lot of additional work for a potentially small gain in performance. If you run some liquid metal under the IHS the results are quite good and could be better than running bare die with traditional paste...unless you plan on using some LM with the bare die.
> 
> 
> 
> Bare die everyday!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
Click to expand...

Dat single core... nice!







my 2500k is showing age...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Dat single core... nice!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> my 2500k is showing age...


I don't know if it's any good, someone challenged me on facebook so I pumped loads of volts into it and benched, he had a heart attack at the volts, but I told him I don't care. On resale groups here in the UK you can sell a 2600k (or whatever it is) for more than someone is willing to give me for this i5, so what's the point? Might as well use and abuse it.









Given this intel system is 5fps faster than my 8350 build, I feel ripped off...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Xigmatek PTI-G4512 - Advertised as 'Pump Out Resistant' and I will atest that as I went nearly 2 years without issues. Regardless of it's seemingly low thermal conductance rating, it performed as well as Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut in my own testing...until the TG pumped out after a couple of days.


Seems to be the only one, i tried hydronaut (as kryonaut was out of stock) and nh-t1 and both pumped out rapidly. Oddly enough the hydronaut on a 3350p ivy bridge is doing just fine after a couple months, temps are ide
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I don't know if it's any good, someone challenged me on facebook so I pumped loads of volts into it and benched, he had a heart attack at the volts, but I told him I don't care. On resale groups here in the UK you can sell a 2600k (or whatever it is) for more than someone is willing to give me for this i5, so what's the point? Might as well use and abuse it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Given this intel system is 5fps faster than my 8350 build, I feel ripped off...


My first 4690k did 4.8 at 1.3v kinda pissed i ruined it. New one is at 4.3 and 1.21, first one did 4.5 at 1.200. Oh well huh.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> My first 4690k did 4.8 at 1.3v kinda pissed i ruined it. New one is at 4.3 and 1.21, first one did 4.5 at 1.200. Oh well huh.


How'd you ruin a 4690k?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> How'd you ruin a 4690k?


He noticed the PCB had warped due to too much pressure on the chip and tried to bend it back... turns out the entire reason he though his chip was faulty, was a dead ram stick not even the chips fault.


----------



## paskowitz

One thing I learned the hard way today... be careful when putting the IHS back down on the die. Next time I think I am going to use a dry erase marker or something to mark where the corners of the IHS go.


----------



## Benjiw




----------



## jdorje

1.6 volts eh?

I think I needed about 1.42 to get my highest 4.8 ghz / 736 cinebench score. Never managed to complete cinebench at 4.9...

This is my everday now though:










Them temps!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> 1.6 volts eh?
> 
> I think I needed about 1.42 to get my highest 4.8 ghz / 736 cinebench score. Never managed to complete cinebench at 4.9...
> 
> This is my everday now though:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Them temps!


Highest core was 85c I run nude.









My everyday is 4.7ghz because 4.8 needs well over 1.5v and I don't think it's worth it, this chip isn't a good clocker so it will stay at 4.7 most of it's life.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> He noticed the PCB had warped due to too much pressure on the chip and tried to bend it back... turns out the entire reason he though his chip was faulty, was a dead ram stick not even the chips fault.


Yup benji is correct, and turns out the ram stick wasnt even dead







. When i installed my loop i spilled a drop of water in the ram slot. Turns out it corroded my ram stick just enough to intermittently give me a boot loop every couple months.

So im out another 250€ and lost 200mhz for the same voltage. Lesson learned but at least it wasnt something more serious. I'm kinda pissed at myself for not checking that in the first place.

On the other hand this chip runs about the same temp as the other one, now that temps have cooled i think it peaks at like 54-55°C or something. First day i got it after i reset the CMOS stupid me forgot to set the pump speed back up and bother my CPU and GPU temps were damn high. I lost 10°C on the gpu just by changing pump speed (which since its pwm was probably not even circulating much water), CPU dropped another 3-4°C. I'm waiting to order some CLU again and going to delid and run bare die again i think.

Might post a video of me using the entersetup delid tool and post it up here.


----------



## 0ldChicken

looks like ppcs is renting Skylake Delidding tools. 15$ plus a 20$ "refundable" deposit (they take 10$ a week after 10 days)
http://www.performance-pcs.com/skylake-cpu-de-lidding-tool-rental.html



edit: I'd say buy a vice and be done with it, but I've been known to do things.... unconventionally


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> looks like ppcs is renting Skylake Delidding tools. 15$ plus a 20$ "refundable" deposit (they take 10$ a week after 10 days)
> http://www.performance-pcs.com/skylake-cpu-de-lidding-tool-rental.html
> 
> 
> 
> edit: I'd say buy a vice and be done with it, but I've been known to do things.... unconventionally


Hey man the vise is easy and quick, the way to go I think. The tool is better for sky lake because of how thin it is.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Hey man the vise is easy and quick, the way to go I think. The tool is better for sky lake because of how thin it is.


That is true, I haven't delidded/owned a skylake yet. I'm still blessed with that fat devils canyon pcb


----------



## bluej511

You guys should look into the one i used, works perfectly for skylake and its better priced then most other tools. Ill be deliding my second 4690k with it. Unfortunately i have no one close by to try it on skylake.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> That is true, I haven't delidded/owned a skylake yet. I'm still blessed with that fat devils canyon pcb


Haha yeah I would be scared to delid a skylake by vise. But yeah I hear ya there, fat PCB FTW!!


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> You guys should look into the one i used, works perfectly for skylake and its better priced then most other tools. Ill be deliding my second 4690k with it. Unfortunately i have no one close by to try it on skylake.


Which one are you using?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Haha yeah I would be scared to delid a skylake by vise. But yeah I hear ya there, fat PCB FTW!!


Just heat up the glue, less pressure needed and no bend.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Just heat up the glue, less pressure needed and no bend.


Word! Well I am thinking of upgrading to Kaby Lake if it looks good, so I will keep this in mind!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Which one are you using?


This one. Its actually the cheapest i found online, the one from caseking.de is like 80€ or something and i was like no thanks. At least ill get to use it on haswell now.

https://www.entersetup.com/


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Which one are you using?
> 
> 
> 
> This one. Its actually the cheapest i found online, the one from caseking.de is like 80€ or something and i was like no thanks. At least ill get to use it on haswell now.
> 
> https://www.entersetup.com/
Click to expand...

Really, it's a great kit.

I found out about it from bluej511 as well, the company is in Finland, and ships them out fast, got mine in a few days by mail.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Really, it's a great kit.
> 
> I found out about it from bluej511 as well, the company is in Finland, and ships them out fast, got mine in a few days by mail.


I honestly just wanted to test it, love being a guinea pig as long as its something thats worth it. Owner wrote me an email after the short review i posted and said its picked up like crazy for him in the US just not in Europe, then again European PC market wasn't huge to begin with.

Glad i have it now to delid my new i5 though should make life a lot easier.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Really, it's a great kit.
> 
> I found out about it from bluej511 as well, the company is in Finland, and ships them out fast, got mine in a few days by mail.
> 
> 
> 
> I honestly just wanted to test it, love being a guinea pig as long as its something thats worth it. Owner wrote me an email after the short review i posted and said its picked up like crazy for him in the US just not in Europe, then again European PC market wasn't huge to begin with.
> 
> Glad i have it now to delid my new i5 though should make life a lot easier.
Click to expand...

Yeah, no question about that, it's literally foolproof.

Glad the company is doing well with it, they certainly deserve the business with such a fine product.
I had no qualms about getting one after seeing your review, and the video they did on it.

Too bad you have to use it again so soon though.
But we all live and learn the hard way sometimes, lol.

It's also cool that the kit will work with Skylake for those who will be delidding one.
Even an Ivy Bridge option. It's so well made that it should hold up through many deliddings.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> This one. Its actually the cheapest i found online, the one from caseking.de is like 80€ or something and i was like no thanks. At least ill get to use it on haswell now.
> 
> https://www.entersetup.com/


OMG I WANT!!!!


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> This one. Its actually the cheapest i found online, the one from caseking.de is like 80€ or something and i was like no thanks. At least ill get to use it on haswell now.
> 
> https://www.entersetup.com/


Wow! That is a great price! Way cheaper than case kings. And looks just as good! I'll wait until Kaby lake before I look at getting a tool. I am just happy we have options now instead of old scary methods!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> OMG I WANT!!!!


Pft just ship all your chips to me ill delid those suckers haha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Wow! That is a great price! Way cheaper than case kings. And looks just as good! I'll wait until Kaby lake before I look at getting a tool. I am just happy we have options now instead of old scary methods!


I just hope the IHS and wafer/pcb dont change much so the tool can still be used. Only difference between ivy and the rest was that ivy bridge has bigger "tabs" on the ihs and wouldnt fit in the tool. I was pretty much the first one to get a non 3d printed prototype ivy bridge tool top and it worked fantastic. I pretty much delided a 3350p (your most average chip if there ever was one) just to try the tool out. Glad its picked up and made life easier for PC users who want to delid.

I didn't even use a vice doing mine, i held the wafer and put the IHS at the edge of a square marble counter top, used a wooden paint stirrer that i held on the pcb and whacked it with a hammer. Worked great without the chip flying but was a pita.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I didn't even use a vice doing mine, i held the wafer and put the IHS at the edge of a square marble counter top, used a wooden paint stirrer that i held on the pcb and whacked it with a hammer. Worked great without the chip flying but was a pita.


Fin (banned for trying to speak your language)


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> This one. Its actually the cheapest i found online, the one from caseking.de is like 80€ or something and i was like no thanks. At least ill get to use it on haswell now.
> 
> https://www.entersetup.com/
> 
> 
> 
> OMG I WANT!!!!
Click to expand...

@Benjiw:
But you already have a Delid Mate tool?
How does that seem in comparison?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> @Benjiw:
> But you already have a Delid Mate tool?
> How does that seem in comparison?


The delid mate is a pita, it's soft plastic that can easily destroy itself if the slide is the wrong way around, like the user I bought it from had happen (mine was a brand new replacement never used) It's overpriced and frankly not worth the cash considering it's flaws. I also don't like how he goes after other people creating tools.

I don't think I'll buy another product by them unless forced to like the delid tool for the soldered 6950x but even then I'll try to find something else.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The delid mate is a pita, it's soft plastic that can easily destroy itself if the slide is the wrong way around, like the user I bought it from had happen (mine was a brand new replacement never used) It's overpriced and frankly not worth the cash considering it's flaws. I also don't like how he goes after other people creating tools.
> 
> I don't think I'll buy another product by them unless forced to like the delid tool for the soldered 6950x but even then I'll try to find something else.


This one is made from acetal/delrin type of plastic from what ive been told. Personally it looks pretty solid; only thing that are serious plastic are the thumb screws but ive contacted entersetup about that and he told me it should be pefectly fine. What i like about it though is that the screw uses a metal threaded insert instead of going straight into the plastic. Could degrade over time. 90€ is totally over priced for the delidmate


----------



## Benjiw

Is it worth overclocking using bus speed? If so what should I be wary of? If I set my bus to 100.1mhz it seems to throw blue screens at me and I'm not sure why.


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Is it worth overclocking using bus speed? If so what should I be wary of? If I set my bus to 100.1mhz it seems to throw blue screens at me and I'm not sure why.


If your trying to push every last MHz out of the CPU, Uncore or Mems under ln2 then yes it would be worth doing, but if your not then don't bother with it. I only bump mine up to 100.01 to correct the cpu freq (eg. 4.6GHz @ 4600MHz instead of 4598.9MHz).


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Hey oc.net llll


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Is it worth overclocking using bus speed? If so what should I be wary of? If I set my bus to 100.1mhz it seems to throw blue screens at me and I'm not sure why.


I've limited experience with base clock oc but the few times I tried I had to lower my ram speeds and uncore since they're affected to. Otherwise I'd crash instantly. I think that was higher than 100.1 though..


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I've limited experience with base clock oc but the few times I tried I had to lower my ram speeds and uncore since they're affected to. Otherwise I'd crash instantly. I think that was higher than 100.1 though..


It's just this i5 hates me and it needs nearly 1.5v for 4.7ghz.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> @Benjiw:
> But you already have a Delid Mate tool?
> How does that seem in comparison?
> 
> 
> 
> The delid mate is a pita, it's soft plastic that can easily destroy itself if the slide is the wrong way around, like the user I bought it from had happen (mine was a brand new replacement never used) It's overpriced and frankly not worth the cash considering it's flaws. I also don't like how he goes after other people creating tools.
> 
> I don't think I'll buy another product by them unless forced to like the delid tool for the soldered 6950x but even then I'll try to find something else.
Click to expand...

Right, the one from 8-pack, or 6-pack, or whatever his name is, lol.









I never liked the idea of printing such items from soft plastic. As far as others making them, that's the way it is, like it or not.

Anyhow, as bluej511 has confirmed, the entersetup tool is quite sturdy.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Right, the one from 8-pack, or 6-pack, or whatever his name is, lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I never liked the idea of printing such items from soft plastic. As far as others making them, that's the way it is, like it or not.
> 
> Anyhow, as bluej511 has confirmed, the entersetup tool is quite sturdy.


Der8auer the german guy, knows his stuff, but he's not that nice.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It's just this i5 hates me and it needs nearly 1.5v for 4.7ghz.


whaaaaa? That's skylake right? Still seems crazy but I'm not doubting you. (I'm not very familiar with oc)
Do i5's usually require more voltage to attain the same clocks as their i7 counterparts?


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Pft just ship all your chips to me ill delid those suckers haha.
> I just hope the IHS and wafer/pcb dont change much so the tool can still be used. Only difference between ivy and the rest was that ivy bridge has bigger "tabs" on the ihs and wouldnt fit in the tool. I was pretty much the first one to get a non 3d printed prototype ivy bridge tool top and it worked fantastic. I pretty much delided a 3350p (your most average chip if there ever was one) just to try the tool out. Glad its picked up and made life easier for PC users who want to delid.
> 
> I didn't even use a vice doing mine, i held the wafer and put the IHS at the edge of a square marble counter top, used a wooden paint stirrer that i held on the pcb and whacked it with a hammer. Worked great without the chip flying but was a pita.


I think it will be the same, as it is still an 1151 chipset, and its really just a refresh. But, Intel has proved us wrong before. But there can be hope. That's why I think I'll wait to get the tool that way I know it will work with Kaby. I am glad that it has picked up as well. I think the market for it will only grow, especially with new chips every year. There will always be a new one too coming out, continuing to make them money. Not a bad deal if you ask me!

Yeah, I was going to to the razer blade method, but had a vice available and it was super easy. Haha that does sound like a PITA, but if it works, it works.


----------



## sav4

What about this I have one and am happy with it .
http://rockitcool.myshopify.com


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> whaaaaa? That's skylake right? Still seems crazy but I'm not doubting you. (I'm not very familiar with oc)
> Do i5's usually require more voltage to attain the same clocks as their i7 counterparts?


I have a 4670k, I've been playing with RAM overclocking the last few days and finally got my RAM to play ball at 2400mhz 10-12-12-32.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> I think it will be the same, as it is still an 1151 chipset, and its really just a refresh. But, Intel has proved us wrong before. But there can be hope. That's why I think I'll wait to get the tool that way I know it will work with Kaby. I am glad that it has picked up as well. I think the market for it will only grow, especially with new chips every year. There will always be a new one too coming out, continuing to make them money. Not a bad deal if you ask me!
> 
> Yeah, I was going to to the razer blade method, but had a vice available and it was super easy. Haha that does sound like a PITA, but if it works, it works.


Worked great, now i can delid my i5 with the new tool haha. Honestly though they did such a better job on haswell i haven't seen the crazy high temp drops people with ivy and so on have seen. Then again there can be such a variance between IHS manufacturing that some people might see 20°C some people might see 10°C at the same voltage.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Worked great, now i can delid my i5 with the new tool haha. Honestly though they did such a better job on haswell i haven't seen the crazy high temp drops people with ivy and so on have seen. Then again there can be such a variance between IHS manufacturing that some people might see 20°C some people might see 10°C at the same voltage.


What kind of temps did you see on yours? Yeah Ivy was really bad, I had a 25c drop lol


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> What kind of temps did you see on yours? Yeah Ivy was really bad, I had a 25c drop lol


New chip sees about 58°C with a water temp of 37°C and case ambient of 31°C, no AC in my house and no breeze today hot temps. With it bare die i was around 46°C ish but water temps were a bit lower. 58°C is a bit high on water but thank the ambient for that, i predict bare die should prob run either low 50s or high 40s with the same ambient.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I have a 4670k, I've been playing with RAM overclocking the last few days and finally got my RAM to play ball at 2400mhz 10-12-12-32.


that's what you're putting 1.5v into? That's awesome. I think I've said this before, but let me know if you notice degradation. I'd love to run 1.5v but I'm afraid it would only last a year or something. I could probably get 5.2ghz or something.

I never could get ram overclocking to do much for me. I got a 1600 kit to 2133 but timings were showing their weaknesses. I just buy em fast anymore


----------



## Balozaibar

soooo it was my first *delid* using vice method. i5 3570k, applied CLU between die and ihs, mx4 for my h100i cooler

results: 4.8ghz/1.32v/70c

Too bad i don't own that kit anymore but the new owner is pretty satisfied with my job


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> that's what you're putting 1.5v into? That's awesome. I think I've said this before, but let me know if you notice degradation. I'd love to run 1.5v but I'm afraid it would only last a year or something. I could probably get 5.2ghz or something.
> 
> I never could get ram overclocking to do much for me. I got a 1600 kit to 2133 but timings were showing their weaknesses. I just buy em fast anymore


Yeah this is a 2400mhz kit from Corsair with CL11-13-13-31 timings but the lower the CL I can get the better. I've noticed when stress testing with X264 I went from 3.35fps to 3.52fps and the time it takes is also reduced, just by lowering the timings. Also fps performance in CSGO and The Culling has been effected positively. I'd love to lower it some more but I had a crash randomly last night so I still need to tweak the overclocking features on the RAM side of this motherboard. Forgot what they're called though, something like Sense?


----------



## Valgaur

Hello peoples! I need your help, on a build update. I've been somewhat out of the loop for a bit. Thoughts or ideas on my parts list?

http://pcpartpicker.com/list/dT4KBP

I should mention that I currently have ultra tower (Cosmos 2). I reallly want a mid tower sized case as a max size. I run two 1080p montiors and I have 2 780ti's available in my current rig. I'm not against going down to one and building a shoebox pc. I like the idea o them quite a lot, but I'd like one with a good view of the components, either acrylic or glass. I'm just not sure really....


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hello peoples! I need your help, on a build update. I've been somewhat out of the loop for a bit. Thoughts or ideas on my parts list?
> 
> http://pcpartpicker.com/list/dT4KBP
> 
> I should mention that I currently have ultra tower (Cosmos 2). I reallly want a mid tower sized case as a max size. I run two 1080p montiors and I have 2 780ti's available in my current rig. I'm not against going down to one and building a shoebox pc. I like the idea o them quite a lot, but I'd like one with a good view of the components, either acrylic or glass. I'm just not sure really....


I think you are doing it right. That Phantek case is sharp.

If I may advise. You could attempt to setup your current rig as a server (nuc?) on your current network. This would allow for some savings regarding the hard drive cost. That might get your budget into a GTX ten seventy if not ten eighty. You might only need one of those for awhile. SLI is overrated is usually the call out.

That looks like a gnarly idea though, good good.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hello peoples! I need your help, on a build update. I've been somewhat out of the loop for a bit. Thoughts or ideas on my parts list?
> 
> http://pcpartpicker.com/list/dT4KBP
> 
> I should mention that I currently have ultra tower (Cosmos 2). I reallly want a mid tower sized case as a max size. I run two 1080p montiors and I have 2 780ti's available in my current rig. I'm not against going down to one and building a shoebox pc. I like the idea o them quite a lot, but I'd like one with a good view of the components, either acrylic or glass. I'm just not sure really....


Just my personal preference I would go with an Asus board for the bios features. The X99 strix is a similar price:
https://www.amazon.com/Optimization-ROG-STRIX-X99-GAMING/dp/B01F854U8E

MSI will have better warranty support but I have personally had bad experiences with their quality and overclockability. I always buy MSI GPU but for whatever reason I just cant get a good MSI motherboard. Probably not the case for everyone and much of the problems I had were with AMD mid-range boards but figured I would mention the Asus is usually better in my opinion especially for bios and software quality.

That being said I do recommend looking up power phase design. More power phase usually means stronger. Some of the higher end MSI boards have more power phase and are actually much better. Not sure which boards have what but that is usually the first thing I compare between boards after I find a right price/features. The one you got might be good I have no idea.

Otherwise as mentioned above a bump to one 1080 card would be cool but if you already have the 780ti's you might as well use them for awhile while prices come down. I have a midtower now and I kinda wish I would have gone with a shoebox build but at the same time I get to enjoy customization and expansion. Really up to preference there. I think my next pc will be a shoebox build but I am going to enjoy fully customizing my Phanteks case and having more room for visuals and upgrades.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> I think you are doing it right. That Phantek case is sharp.
> 
> If I may advise. You could attempt to setup your current rig as a server (nuc?) on your current network. This would allow for some savings regarding the hard drive cost. That might get your budget into a GTX ten seventy if not ten eighty. You might only need one of those for awhile. SLI is overrated is usually the call out.
> 
> That looks like a gnarly idea though, good good.


Hmmm, hadnt thought about the nuc, idea with current rig. How would i set that up? Do i need 2 LAN ports?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Just my personal preference I would go with an Asus board for the bios features. The X99 strix is a similar price:
> https://www.amazon.com/Optimization-ROG-STRIX-X99-GAMING/dp/B01F854U8E
> 
> MSI will have better warranty support but I have personally had bad experiences with their quality and overclockability. I always buy MSI GPU but for whatever reason I just cant get a good MSI motherboard. Probably not the case for everyone and much of the problems I had were with AMD mid-range boards but figured I would mention the Asus is usually better in my opinion especially for bios and software quality.
> 
> That being said I do recommend looking up power phase design. More power phase usually means stronger. Some of the higher end MSI boards have more power phase and are actually much better. Not sure which boards have what but that is usually the first thing I compare between boards after I find a right price/features. The one you got might be good I have no idea.
> 
> Otherwise as mentioned above a bump to one 1080 card would be cool but if you already have the 780ti's you might as well use them for awhile while prices come down. I have a midtower now and I kinda wish I would have gone with a shoebox build but at the same time I get to enjoy customization and expansion. Really up to preference there. I think my next pc will be a shoebox build but I am going to enjoy fully customizing my Phanteks case and having more room for visuals and upgrades.


I think I'll still with the dial 780ti's for now. They are still really string and in great shape. The main issue i currently have is since I'm using X58, dual sli is horrible thanks to pcie lanes. I think I'll up the chippy to the 6850k for the pcie lanes. Or, or i could grab a really good crib for the price range of 6850k. More cores, more lanes, less heat a well.

The Strix board looks great! But here is my predicament. I have a sound card currently for my Beyerdynamic dt770's. So i need one slot open, i usually put the gpu's in 3way sli spacing, with sound card in the 3rd slot. The sound card is against the back of the 2nd 780ti. Now, the Strix doesn't have the lane placement for that layout. The MSI does, buuuuuuuut the bottom card might hit that red OC button. The 780 would be in the second bottommost lane. Do i just ignore the sound card and use the on board? I'm not sure on that.

Thanks for the storage help, I'm currently refining this. Is like one dedicated for OS, one for games, launchers, steam etc. Then another for main storage of files and software, then deep storage for both machines and laptop backups.

Once i solidify this I'll look more into cooling, is like a cool quiet build as well.

Thanks again for the help everyone!


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hmmm, hadnt thought about the nuc, idea with current rig. How would i set that up? Do i need 2 LAN ports?
> I think I'll still with the dial 780ti's for now. They are still really string and in great shape. The main issue i currently have is since I'm using X58, dual sli is horrible thanks to pcie lanes. I think I'll up the chippy to the 6850k for the pcie lanes. Or, or i could grab a really good crib for the price range of 6850k. More cores, more lanes, less heat a well.
> 
> The Strix board looks great! But here is my predicament. I have a sound card currently for my Beyerdynamic dt770's. So i need one slot open, i usually put the gpu's in 3way sli spacing, with sound card in the 3rd slot. The sound card is against the back of the 2nd 780ti. Now, the Strix doesn't have the lane placement for that layout. The MSI does, buuuuuuuut the bottom card might hit that red OC button. The 780 would be in the second bottommost lane. Do i just ignore the sound card and use the on board? I'm not sure on that.
> 
> Thanks for the storage help, I'm currently refining this. Is like one dedicated for OS, one for games, launchers, steam etc. Then another for main storage of files and software, then deep storage for both machines and laptop backups.
> 
> Once i solidify this I'll look more into cooling, is like a cool quiet build as well.
> 
> Thanks again for the help everyone!


From my understanding most onboard audio is pretty much the same quality as soundcards nowadays. That being said I absolutely hate Realtek drivers/software myself so depending on your soundcard it might be worth the better driver/software. If you end up with realtek drivers I highly recommend using EqualizerAPO or something similar. For me with EqualizerAPO and PeaceGUI I am very happy with the sound quality of my on-board sound through my simple 5.1 system (nothing too special but not horrible either). After removing the highs from the subwoofer and removing the lows from the speakers through the APO it sounds just as good or better than my old Soundblaster cards fully tweaked (no longer supported of course). Never had any special sound card or special audio equipment to test to full range or anything though. Even my dell studio HTPC puts out decent sound once I discovered the equalizer thing and had more control. Realtek seems to deliver the same sound across all brands (tested on stock Dell Studio motherboard from 5+ years ago, Asus Z97 Pro-Gamer and now my ASRock Z97 Extreme4)

As far as cooling goes it has been my understanding in the past that most closed loop coolers are not worth getting. They may have improved in recent years but almost everyone I talked to when I asked around here recommended getting a custom loop or going with air cooling. Big air coolers can get close to the same overclock as most of the smaller closed loops but they come with the benefit of being more silent and more reliable. If something fails in a closed loop you are basically screwed whereas a custom loop can always be upgraded and separate parts replaced if failures occur. Big air can usually run with fans off for idle and desktop/web browser use. CLC/Custom can do the same but the pump always needs to be running. For sound big air is generally best, for overclockability of course custom loop would be best but some CLC are actually much better than any air cooler when it comes to overclockability. For reference my 4790k gets 4.8ghz daily OC with a Phanteks PH-TC14PE and never exceeds 60c gaming even when the garage is 38c+ (decent chip with low vcore, my body cant physically handle gaming at 38c+ but I did test it for a bit







). Also went up to about 80c stress testing in regular ambients (25c-ish)


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hmmm, hadnt thought about the nuc, idea with current rig. How would i set that up? Do i need 2 LAN ports?


I actually do not know much about it. I don't know much about anything. I quickly skimmed your pcpartpick and saw lots of storage and that is the first thing that came to mind, moving the storage off site.

I am glad dmfree88 mentioned the motherboard, because that instantly reminded me the importance of godlike vrms, and quality.

Any using what you already have first is my recommendation for what you are wanting I think. That lure of more performance anywhere though


----------



## MedRed

do you need special hardware to mount a ek supremacy MX to a delidded 6700k?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MedRed*
> 
> do you need special hardware to mount a ek supremacy MX to a delidded 6700k?


Naked mount? Direct to the die? It's not possible without either a spacer or a modded base plate on the ek block. The die sits 0.4mm below the highest point of the socket.


----------



## MedRed

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Naked mount? Direct to the die? It's not possible without either a spacer or a modded base plate on the ek block. The die sits 0.4mm below the highest point of the socket.


what block to use with skylake then?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MedRed*
> 
> what block to use with skylake then?


Naked? There are no solutions at this time, you would have to modify a block or have a spacer made.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Naked mount? Direct to the die? It's not possible without either a spacer or a modded base plate on the ek block. The die sits 0.4mm below the highest point of the socket.


https://www.amazon.com/Chipset-Thermal-Heatsink-Copper-0-5mm/dp/B00OUJQX8K

Don't know if this would work, it would be +.1mm, which would clear the outside of the socket. I would probably go with a 1mm shim that way you have clearance.

Been seeing a lot of these used on GPUs, but I know skylake is a bit fragile.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Chipset-Thermal-Heatsink-Copper-0-5mm/dp/B00OUJQX8K
> 
> Don't know if this would work, it would be +.1mm, which would clear the outside of the socket. I would probably go with a 1mm shim that way you have clearance.
> 
> Been seeing a lot of these used on GPUs, but I know skylake is a bit fragile.


The problem is the PCB is very thin and me and Blue here have had haswell CPUs start to show signs of bending the PCB with naked mounts so I would want the shim to be exact in use with EKs naked mount kit. Too much pressure and the chip will just die.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The problem is the PCB is very thin and me and Blue here have had haswell CPUs start to show signs of bending the PCB with naked mounts so I would want the shim to be exact in use with EKs naked mount kit. Too much pressure and the chip will just die.


Yeah I figured, bare die is scary, lol. So you are saying you would want it exactly the size of the die? Or exactly the size of the EK kit?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Yeah I figured, bare die is scary, lol. So you are saying you would want it exactly the size of the die? Or exactly the size of the EK kit?


Both, reason being if it was the size of the socket the amount of heat it would absorb and hold would make it pointless going bare die, might as well keep the IHS on. The reason the temps are lower with bare die is the cooling is direct. A good example of this is delidded soldered chips, once you remove the solder temps go down a few degrees even with the IHS still on and LM used between the die and IHS.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Both, reason being if it was the size of the socket the amount of heat it would absorb and hold would make it pointless going bare die, might as well keep the IHS on. The reason the temps are lower with bare die is the cooling is direct. A good example of this is delidded soldered chips, once you remove the solder temps go down a few degrees even with the IHS still on and LM used between the die and IHS.


Yeah I know how it works, but do you think the copper shim would hold more heat as opposed to the IHS? If using a shim were safer but lower temps then I would go for it. Don't know if the temp difference would be worth it, but yeah. Bet you could get one laser cut somewhere.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Yeah I know how it works, but do you think the copper shim would hold more heat as opposed to the IHS? If using a shim were safer but lower temps then I would go for it. Don't know if the temp difference would be worth it, but yeah. Bet you could get one laser cut somewhere.


The difference in thickness of the IHS and a shim wouldn't be anywhere close to similar, 0.6mm vs 6mm or so, no competition.


----------



## johnd0e

that method would defeat the purpose of naked mount. your still going to have Die>paste>copper>paste>waterblock. the reason to go naked is to remover the copper between die and waterblock.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> that method would defeat the purpose of naked mount. your still going to have Die>paste>copper>paste>waterblock. the reason to go naked is to remover the copper between die and waterblock.


Well you're braver than I to have your waterblock CNC machined then take a dremel to your socket... a lot of work, how thick is the IHS btw?


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> that method would defeat the purpose of naked mount. your still going to have Die>paste>copper>paste>waterblock. the reason to go naked is to remover the copper between die and waterblock.


Right, but if no one makes anything that is safe to use then what is the point in the first place? Either way as stated before, .6mm vs 6mm is still going to be less thermal resistance. I think someone should try and compare.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Right, but if no one makes anything that is safe to use then what is the point in the first place? Either way as stated before, .6mm vs 6mm is still going to be less thermal resistance. I think someone should try and compare.


The comparisons surely have been done before? a good example is the fact I can take my CPU up to 1.6v and I still have 10-15c of thermal headroom with bare die, I doubt that a shim less than a mm thick would add 10-15c? Like I said if you want to go true baredie on a skylake then you need to have the block machined then add some spacers to the EK mount kit, plus shave the socket by 1mm.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The comparisons surely have been done before? a good example is the fact I can take my CPU up to 1.6v and I still have 10-15c of thermal headroom with bare die, I doubt that a shim less than a mm thick would add 10-15c? Like I said if you want to go true baredie on a skylake then you need to have the block machined then add some spacers to the EK mount kit, plus shave the socket by 1mm.


I haven't been able to find anything, because since it isn't true bare die I think it's disregarded. I highly doubt it would add 10-15c, but that's just my opinion. But I believe it would be a cheap, and non permanent way to run skylake bare die-ish. Worst case scenario, you just do do the typical LM in between die and IHS, until someone makes something. Or you want to drop the bones and trust someone to machine your block.

I was reading somewhere else on the forum to put thermal pads at each corner of the pcb to help spread the "load" on the Chip. That was for IB, but same concept applies.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Naked mount? Direct to the die? It's not possible without either a spacer or a modded base plate on the ek block. The die sits 0.4mm below the highest point of the socket.


You couldn't sand down the socket? Obviously kills the warranty on the motherboard but theoretically? Just curious.


----------



## johnd0e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Well you're braver than I to have your waterblock CNC machined then take a dremel to your socket... a lot of work, how thick is the IHS btw?


i did no such thing. i was just saying that still having the piece of copper defeats the purpose of bare die.

ihs is about 3mm thick from were it touches die to were your heatsink touches.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> You couldn't sand down the socket? Obviously kills the warranty on the motherboard but theoretically? Just curious.


Not sure I'd want a load of grit in my socket to interfere with the pins as they need to compress into the socket, if there is a bit of crud in there and it damages a pin? no thanks.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> i did no such thing. i was just saying that still having the piece of copper defeats the purpose of bare die.
> 
> ihs is about 3mm thick from were it touches die to were your heatsink touches.


I never said you did, I was implying that you would be brave to dremel the socket of your motherboard, then mod the block, then add spacers of the exact correct measurement so the force is just right not to bend the pcb on the skylake chip. It's still bare die though isn't it? a thin shaving of copper on the die rather than the IHS?

Or are you just being pedantic?


----------



## johnd0e

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Not sure I'd want a load of grit in my socket to interfere with the pins as they need to compress into the socket, if there is a bit of crud in there and it damages a pin? no thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I never said you did, I was implying that you would be brave to dremel the socket of your motherboard, then mod the block, then add spacers of the exact correct measurement so the force is just right not to bend the pcb on the skylake chip. It's still bare die though isn't it? a thin shaving of copper on the die rather than the IHS?
> 
> Or are you just being pedantic?


i would have to do that math to figure it all out 100%, but it would be my thinking that by going from such a large surface area and mass on the IHS to such a small surface area and mass with the copper shim youd risk heating up the copper shim faster then you can remove said heat.

again i could be 100% wrong, i havent looked into it at all.

EDIT:

just to clarify, im using the words small and large in comparison to each other.....i understand the IHS isnt a LARGE surface area and mass at all. but compared to a .6mm copper shim its larger.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> i would have to do that math to figure it all out 100%, but it would be my thinking that by going from such a large surface area and mass on the IHS to such a small surface area and mass with the copper shim youd risk heating up the copper shim faster then you can remove said heat.
> 
> again i could be 100% wrong, i havent looked into it at all.
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> just to clarify, im using the words small and large in comparison to each other.....i understand the IHS isnt a LARGE surface area and mass at all. but compared to a .6mm copper shim its larger.


I can understand what you're saying, with the IHS on my idle temps where around 36c, no matter what I did, fan curves what have you, so without it now idles at 30c on first boot, load depends on what I'm doing, at the moment at 1.52v 4.7ghz 4.6ghz ring, 2400mhz ram CL 11-12-12-28 when gaming hits 65c after like 30mins 2hours with a 970 at 1.3v 1660mhz adding heat fans all low pump speed low 68c.

I highly doubt that if I added a shim I'd see 70c when gaming but I understand what you're getting at. Sometimes however, it's just better to work smarter and not harder. I might be selling my Z97 on ebay in the near future and using the Z170 board I have spare so I'll bare die a 6700k and probably do both methods... you know, for science.


----------



## MedRed

so is delidding a skylake cpu with an ek block a no go?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MedRed*
> 
> so is delidding a skylake cpu with an ek block a no go?


Delliding and reusing the IHS, easy, delidding and going bare die? Not so easy.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hello peoples! I need your help, on a build update. I've been somewhat out of the loop for a bit. Thoughts or ideas on my parts list?
> 
> http://pcpartpicker.com/list/dT4KBP
> 
> I should mention that I currently have ultra tower (Cosmos 2). I reallly want a mid tower sized case as a max size. I run two 1080p montiors and I have 2 780ti's available in my current rig. I'm not against going down to one and building a shoebox pc. I like the idea o them quite a lot, but I'd like one with a good view of the components, either acrylic or glass. I'm just not sure really....


I would go for a swiftech cooler the chip is a z170 and won't go with that m/b or are you changing that to suit the m/b you picked ?
Edit disregard misread the cpu
Other stuff looks good


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *johnd0e*
> 
> i would have to do that math to figure it all out 100%, but it would be my thinking that by going from such a large surface area and mass on the IHS to such a small surface area and mass with the copper shim youd risk heating up the copper shim faster then you can remove said heat.
> 
> again i could be 100% wrong, i havent looked into it at all.
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> just to clarify, im using the words small and large in comparison to each other.....i understand the IHS isnt a LARGE surface area and mass at all. but compared to a .6mm copper shim its larger.


Yeah man all hypothetical, I agree it defeats the purpose and all that. I was just trying to think of a way to run it and not permanently damage the motherboard or chip, yet still receive some of the benefits of it.


----------



## Ceadderman

Anyone know of a good *relaible* temperature app I can use with a Dell MB setup? My CIVF came with PC Probe II but I cannot use it with my Intel platform and MS in their infinite wisdom removed system reporting apps from Win7. So I cannot even see what Temps my inherited system throws off.









~Ceadder


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Anyone know of a good *relaible* temperature app I can use with a Dell MB setup? My CIVF came with PC Probe II but I cannot use it with my Intel platform and MS in their infinite wisdom removed system reporting apps from Win7. So I cannot even see what Temps my inherited system throws off.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


HWInfo, Speed Fan, RealTemp, CoreTemp?

Those are the main 4 I've used over the years...primarily relying on HWInfo these days especially nice pairing it with Afterburner's RTSS for On Screen Display while gaming

CoreTemp did finally get an upgrade to 1.1; this month actually. Wish MS would throw gadgets back into the mix...I miss those from W7


----------



## Ceadderman

Cool thanks roboyto. I will try one of those. Been out of the Intel game for awhile so the knowledge is helpful. +Rep.









~Ceadder


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Cool thanks roboyto. I will try one of those. Been out of the Intel game for awhile so the knowledge is helpful. +Rep.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


At least one of those should work out for you. I typically install CoreTemp on people's PCs I work on simply for its overheat protection option. You have the option to turn the PC off, run an application, or flash on screen IIRC.


----------



## Ceadderman

I went with CoreTemp 1.1 since it seems to be the newest update.











How these temps look? It's about 70F maybe a touch hotter here atm. Had to turn the fan on to get some increased air flow.









~Ceadder


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I went with CoreTemp 1.1 since it seems to be the newest update.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How these temps look? It's about 70F maybe a touch hotter here atm. Had to turn the fan on to get some increased air flow.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Maybe a little high for idle depending on what is cooling it, size of the case and airflow through it.

You could definitely benefit from a delid even if you don't have room for a better cooler. Hell you could even chop the top, clean off the glue and leave the factory paste so you don't run into pump out problems; if you don't want to run liquid metal that is.


----------



## Valgaur

Okay..... its updated!

http://pcpartpicker.com/user/valgaur/saved/ZLFWGX


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I went with CoreTemp 1.1 since it seems to be the newest update.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How these temps look? It's about 70F maybe a touch hotter here atm. Had to turn the fan on to get some increased air flow.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe a little high for idle depending on what is cooling it, size of the case and airflow through it.
> 
> You could definitely benefit from a delid even if you don't have room for a better cooler. Hell you could even chop the top, clean off the glue and leave the factory paste so you don't run into pump out problems; if you don't want to run liquid metal that is.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Played Skyrim for about an hour or so today and I think I am going to remove the stock cooler and replace the TIM with some Gelid Extreme. Damn thing booted me from the game as I defeated the first Dragon outside of Whiterun.









I generally put some G751 on all my chip surfaces, but since I'm out I went to the box and GE is the best that I have.









~Ceadder


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Agreed. Played Skyrim for about an hour or so today and I think I am going to remove the stock cooler and replace the TIM with some Gelid Extreme. Damn thing booted me from the game as I defeated the first Dragon outside of Whiterun.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I generally put some G751 on all my chip surfaces, but since I'm out I went to the box and GE is the best that I have.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


GC Extreme is still pretty good stuff, better than whatever Dell had in there anyway









There are some decent SFF air coolers out there, and I don't know if you're aware of Corsairs new ITX water cooler but you may be able to cram this guy in there









http://www.corsair.com/en-us/hydro-series-h5-sf-low-profile-liquid-cpu-cooler


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Agreed. Played Skyrim for about an hour or so today and I think I am going to remove the stock cooler and replace the TIM with some Gelid Extreme. Damn thing booted me from the game as I defeated the first Dragon outside of Whiterun.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I generally put some G751 on all my chip surfaces, but since I'm out I went to the box and GE is the best that I have.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GC Extreme is still pretty good stuff, better than whatever Dell had in there anyway
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are some decent SFF air coolers out there, and I don't know if you're aware of Corsairs new ITX water cooler but you may be able to cram this guy in there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.corsair.com/en-us/hydro-series-h5-sf-low-profile-liquid-cpu-cooler
Click to expand...

Well if I get water, it's gonna be custom. I'm looking for a RoG board for this atm. Nothing wrong with the performance of this Dell board, but honestly I'd like to get a touch more performance from this CPU. I've changed the GPU and have a 2x4 pair of Ripjaws waiting to go into this, but I want moar.









I've got plently of room for most everything required for a loop, but don't have a spot for a 120 without modding it. That's okay cause once I get a SSD to allow for the mATX swap, I will be taking out the HDD rack and installing a 120 or 140 Rad in the front.









~Ceadder


----------



## v1ral

Anyone know of a good 3d printed designed tool i can have made, i want to delid my 6700k.
Links if any and what i should look for material wise.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Anyone know of a good 3d printed designed tool i can have made, i want to delid my 6700k.
> Links if any and what i should look for material wise.


Probably just better off buying something like this:

http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rockit-88

He sent me one to test and it worked flawlessly...and he has made improvements since then.


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Probably just better off buying something like this:
> 
> http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rockit-88
> 
> He sent me one to test and it worked flawlessly...and he has made improvements since then.


30 bucks for a one time thing is kind of steep.. Its legit though.
Question to you how is the relid part if you have been sent the part?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> 30 bucks for a one time thing is kind of steep.. Its legit though.
> Question to you how is the relid part if you have been sent the part?


If you have Skylake it is cheap insurance since the PCB is much thinner and easier to damage.

Have any friends with Intel CPUs? Moms, dads, brothers, sisters, cousins, etc? Delid them all and get your moneys worth haha.

I received one for testing many months ago before he had the re-lid tool. I would imagine it works very well.

@386DX40 would be able to tell you some more about it though.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Well if I get water, it's gonna be custom. I'm looking for a RoG board for this atm. Nothing wrong with the performance of this Dell board, but honestly I'd like to get a touch more performance from this CPU. I've changed the GPU and have a 2x4 pair of Ripjaws waiting to go into this, but I want moar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've got plently of room for most everything required for a loop, but don't have a spot for a 120 without modding it. That's okay cause once I get a SSD to allow for the mATX swap, I will be taking out the HDD rack and installing a 120 or 140 Rad in the front.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Get a board with a mSATA or m.2 slot and save yourself even more space 

XSPC X20 420 - http://www.xs-pc.com/water-pumps/x2o-420-single-bayrespump

I've got one of those little buggers and it works very well for just my little GPU loop.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Well if I get water, it's gonna be custom. I'm looking for a RoG board for this atm. Nothing wrong with the performance of this Dell board, but honestly I'd like to get a touch more performance from this CPU. I've changed the GPU and have a 2x4 pair of Ripjaws waiting to go into this, but I want moar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've got plently of room for most everything required for a loop, but don't have a spot for a 120 without modding it. That's okay cause once I get a SSD to allow for the mATX swap, I will be taking out the HDD rack and installing a 120 or 140 Rad in the front.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Get a board with a mSATA or m.2 slot and save yourself even more space
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> XSPC X20 420 - http://www.xs-pc.com/water-pumps/x2o-420-single-bayrespump
> 
> I've got one of those little buggers and it works very well for just my little GPU loop.
Click to expand...

I've only 2 bays in this XPS 8700. So I will likely not be adding a Bay Res device of any kind. But I've got some ideas of how I will set up my loop. EK all the way... Well the space opened up by the removal of the HDD cage will likely be filled with a 140 Rad and a Monsoon D5 pump kit. So EK and Monsoon all the way.









~Ceadder


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> 30 bucks for a one time thing is kind of steep.. Its legit though.
> Question to you how is the relid part if you have been sent the part?


$30 vs the delid mate I paid £50 for? Give over you tight sponge...


----------



## v1ral

ok.. 30 bucks isnt too bad to do it the RIGHT way..
now the question... how much would delidding give me for overclocking?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> ok.. 30 bucks isnt too bad to do it the RIGHT way..
> now the question... how much would delidding give me for overclocking?


You tell me...


----------



## v1ral

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> You tell me...


Nice....

Tell you what?


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Probably just better off buying something like this:
> 
> http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rockit-88
> 
> He sent me one to test and it worked flawlessly...and he has made improvements since then.


+1 for these work really well. You can always sell it afterwards.


----------



## Rikuo

Ordered a thing of CLU & the Rockit 88 delid kit.

One question that i had, Which I'm seeming to have a hard time answering using google/etc......

Do you need to re-glue the lid back on to the PCB?

Or can you just run it without glue?

6700k


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rikuo*
> 
> Ordered a thing of CLU & the Rockit 88 delid kit.
> 
> One question that i had, Which I'm seeming to have a hard time answering using google/etc......
> 
> Do you need to re-glue the lid back on to the PCB?
> 
> Or can you just run it without glue?
> 
> 6700k


Without glue!!!!!!!!. The glue is the issue. The larger the gap between two surfaces the lower the thermal efficiency. Theoretically you don't even want to run thermal paste, if that was possible. Less is better for thermal efficiency. The issue with the glue is it raises up the IHS by .06mm and thats enough to give poor thermals on some chips. The issue is that manufacturing standards vary widely between chips that some people will see a higher temp drop then others.

My new i5 is made in vietnam instead of malaysia. Once i take it apart ill see how much the temp drops compared to by malay chip.


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rikuo*
> 
> Ordered a thing of CLU & the Rockit 88 delid kit.
> 
> One question that i had, Which I'm seeming to have a hard time answering using google/etc......
> 
> Do you need to re-glue the lid back on to the PCB?
> 
> Or can you just run it without glue?
> 
> 6700k


Ask in this thread it's the designers thread, he was playing around with superglues. Last report 1-2 deg difference from going bare .


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Ask in this thread it's the designers thread, he was playing around with superglues. Last report 1-2 deg difference from going bare .


Honestly like i said it varies widely. I got 5-6°C going from CLU/IHS to bare die and CLU; Id say thats totally totally worth it, unless were talking skylake which pretty much is a nightmare bare die anyways unless you get the bare die shield/plate. Otherwise its very dependent on how flat the die is and how flat the waterblock/cooler is and how even the cpu socket is as well.


----------



## 386DX40

I was able to get the 1-2c increase over bare by using a special technique to glue the IHS back to the CPU.
I developed a guide and clamp system that holds the IHS firmly and perfectly centered on the CPU while the glue is applied to the outside.
This drastically reduces the gap that is formed when using other methods of glueing while also allowing for it to be delidded and relidded as often as desired.
Simple clean up with acetone and the CPU and IHS are pristine again.

James


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Agreed. Played Skyrim for about an hour or so today and I think I am going to remove the stock cooler and replace the TIM with some Gelid Extreme. Damn thing booted me from the game as I defeated the first Dragon outside of Whiterun.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I generally put some G751 on all my chip surfaces, but since I'm out I went to the box and GE is the best that I have.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GC Extreme is still pretty good stuff, better than whatever Dell had in there anyway
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are some decent SFF air coolers out there, and I don't know if you're aware of Corsairs new ITX water cooler but you may be able to cram this guy in there
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.corsair.com/en-us/hydro-series-h5-sf-low-profile-liquid-cpu-cooler
Click to expand...

Before Gelid Extreme



After


Ambient temps are a touch cooler today since we have some wind blowing but otherwise similar to day of the initial screenshot.


----------



## Rikuo

My Rockit 88 delid tool just came in the mail.





Unfortunately, amazon decided to take their time shipping my Liquid Ultra, So I have to wait until friday to delid my 6700k.


----------



## TainePC

I don't want to sound like a dreamer, an will attach a pic of pc to prove i have a base to go about deliding, but how would one go about running a cpu without the ihs? I have a 4690k that is overclocked to 4.8 @ 1.3 volts, so i feel its a decent base for a delid (and also my overclock is limited by tempratures, not speed) I have seen people on older forums talking about using a shim to run without ihs. Were can i buy one?


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rikuo*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> My Rockit 88 delid tool just came in the mail.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunately, amazon decided to take their time shipping my Liquid Ultra, So I have to wait until friday to delid my 6700k.


Or if you cant wait, like I could not wait, delid and apply standard TIM as practice. Then you will be ready for liquid ultra when it shows. This also is more work however.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TainePC*
> 
> I don't want to sound like a dreamer, an will attach a pic of pc to prove i have a base to go about deliding, but how would one go about running a cpu without the ihs? I have a 4690k that is overclocked to 4.8 @ 1.3 volts, so i feel its a decent base for a delid (and also my overclock is limited by tempratures, not speed) I have seen people on older forums talking about using a shim to run without ihs. Were can i buy one


These are not shims but work for running without the IHS https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy


----------



## Rikuo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Or if you cant wait, like I could not wait, delid and apply standard TIM as practice. Then you will be ready for liquid ultra when it shows. This also is more work however.
> These are not shims but work for running without the IHS https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy


I'll just wait.

Might as well just do it right on the first try









The more i touch it the more likely i'll break it lol


----------



## TainePC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Or if you cant wait, like I could not wait, delid and apply standard TIM as practice. Then you will be ready for liquid ultra when it shows. This also is more work however.
> These are not shims but work for running without the IHS https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy


have seen the precise mount kit. unfortunately it doesn't work with xspc waterblocks..would i be able to cut a piece of metal to make the contact with the die even?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TainePC*
> 
> I don't want to sound like a dreamer, an will attach a pic of pc to prove i have a base to go about deliding, but how would one go about running a cpu without the ihs? I have a 4690k that is overclocked to 4.8 @ 1.3 volts, so i feel its a decent base for a delid (and also my overclock is limited by tempratures, not speed) I have seen people on older forums talking about using a shim to run without ihs. Were can i buy one?


Thats EXACTLY what my first 4690k overclocked too and i miss it haha. I did extensive research and testing and found out that the waterblock will more then likely sit on the cpu socket. You can absolutely use the EKWB naked ivy screws for any other waterblock and should work just fine. Or you can mod your mounting hardware to do as such. Not sure how the xspc works but ive had no issues running bare die for a couple months and will be running my new crapp 4690k at 1.21 4.3x bare die as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TainePC*
> 
> have seen the precise mount kit. unfortunately it doesn't work with xspc waterblocks..would i be able to cut a piece of metal to make the contact with the die even?


Read above lol


----------



## TainePC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Or if you cant wait, like I could not wait, delid and apply standard TIM as practice. Then you will be ready for liquid ultra when it shows. This also is more work however.
> These are not shims but work for running without the IHS https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy


I have seen the ek presise mount kit. the problem is i have an xspc water block. would it be feasible to custom cut a shim to make it fit evenly?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Thats EXACTLY what my first 4690k overclocked too and i miss it haha. I did extensive research and testing and found out that the waterblock will more then likely sit on the cpu socket. You can absolutely use the EKWB naked ivy screws for any other waterblock and should work just fine. Or you can mod your mounting hardware to do as such. Not sure how the xspc works but ive had no issues running bare die for a couple months and will be running my new crapp 4690k at 1.21 4.3x bare die as well.
> Read above lol


haha missed that








i will buy the ek kit and try deliding, probably using CLU.
Thanks


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TainePC*
> 
> I have seen the ek presise mount kit. the problem is i have an xspc water block. would it be feasible to custom cut a shim to make it fit evenly?
> haha missed that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i will buy the ek kit and try deliding, probably using CLU.
> Thanks


Its a crapshoot i believe u need to buy the mounting hardware too if the screws dont screw into your backplate bracket thing. Personally a custom plastic shim or something would work best. It just needs to rest on the cpu socket thats all

Ill check how it mounts and get back to u.

Edit: Ok i took a quick look, looks like its 4 standoffs that mount into the backplate, if the threads are the same the ekwb kit should work. Unfortunately i have no way of checking if the xspc thumb nuts would screw into the ekwb standoffs.

Heres the thread.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1435574/xspc-raystorm-with-ek-naked-ivy-mount-result/0_20


----------



## TainePC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its a crapshoot i believe u need to buy the mounting hardware too if the screws dont screw into your backplate bracket thing. Personally a custom plastic shim or something would work best. It just needs to rest on the cpu socket thats all
> 
> Ill check how it mounts and get back to u.


thanks for your reply
I think it would be a minor miracle if the ek kit used the same thread as the xspc block backplate. if i understand correctly the shims purpose is to keep the pressure on the cpu even, andg stop it been crushed? Right now leaning towards the shim


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TainePC*
> 
> thanks for your reply
> I think it would be a minor miracle if the ek kit used the same thread as the xspc block backplate. if i understand correctly the shims purpose is to keep the pressure on the cpu even, andg stop it been crushed? Right now leaning towards the shim


Plenty run bare die with no shim, the waterblock puts more pressure on teh cpu socket then on the die. I have pressure paper that proves this as i tested it myself. It might bow your cpu an extremely tiny amount but its nothing to worry about. Its a real problem with skylake. Heres another thread.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1468701/xspc-raystorm-naked-ivy-haswell-mounting-no-additional-hardware/0_20


----------



## TainePC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Plenty run bare die with no shim, the waterblock puts more pressure on teh cpu socket then on the die. I have pressure paper that proves this as i tested it myself. It might bow your cpu an extremely tiny amount but its nothing to worry about. Its a real problem with skylake. Heres another thread.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1468701/xspc-raystorm-naked-ivy-haswell-mounting-no-additional-hardware/0_20


thanks heaps







Favorited that thread
would you recommend spreading out the clu with the brush included, or do the quarter grain of rice method?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TainePC*
> 
> thanks heaps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Favorited that thread
> would you recommend spreading out the clu with the brush included, or do the quarter grain of rice method?


Any and all liquid metals have to be spread in a very thin layer. Use the brush but cut like 1/4 to 1/2 of the bristles off so that the whole brush doesnt absorb the clu.


----------



## Arctucas

6700K.

I bought the Rockit 88 tool. Quick and easy.

Replaced the dried out OEM TIM with Conductonaut, tacked the IHS corners back down with black PermaTex.

Before: 4.7 @ 1.355VCore, IBT Maximum - 85°C.

After: 4.83 @ 1.390VCore, IBT Maximum- 71°C.


----------



## Ceadderman

How do you find the delid tools on Amazon? I looked and can't seen to find one. I tried "Delid" and "Delid Tool" of various spellings.









Found my Hyper 212 plus and cleaned it up. It's going in Tha Dell soon as I finish the move.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> How do you find the delid tools on Amazon? I looked and can't seen to find one. I tried "Delid" and "Delid Tool" of various spellings.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Found my Hyper 212 plus and cleaned it up. It's going in Tha Dell soon as I finish the move.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


That one is on gofund or something i think, one i use is entersetup.com. Made from the same material.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> How do you find the delid tools on Amazon? I looked and can't seen to find one. I tried "Delid" and "Delid Tool" of various spellings.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Found my Hyper 212 plus and cleaned it up. It's going in Tha Dell soon as I finish the move.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That one is on gofund or something i think, one i use is entersetup.com. Made from the same material.
Click to expand...

And I heartily recommend the entersetup delid tool, forget Amazon, lol.








https://www.entersetup.com/

Edit:
*bluej511* steered me over to this great delidding tool a while ago, shipping is very fast from entersetup.


----------



## inedenimadam

I just want to bring up how awesome this forum is. You guys amaze me. I bought my 3570k a few years ago, found out it hit 4.5 at really low volts, but would get uncomfortably warm. Then I found this thread when it was like 10 pages deep, and people were just starting to dellid with a blade...It scared the crap out of me, but I nutted up and did it anyway.

Fast forward a couple years and over 1000 pages, and now we have almost fool proof devices you can order off of Amazom or have custom printed!

My 3570k has been a 5.0Ghz 24/7 magnificent chip for going on 3 years now, and it would have never broke 4.5 without the help found in this thread...

Hats off to OCN and the pioneers in this thread. Thanks guys!


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> And I heartily recommend the entersetup delid tool, forget Amazon, lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.entersetup.com/
> 
> Edit:
> *bluej511* steered me over to this great delidding tool a while ago, shipping is very fast from entersetup.


Alternatively; http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/


----------



## TainePC

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I just want to bring up how awesome this forum is. You guys amaze me. I bought my 3570k a few years ago, found out it hit 4.5 at really low volts, but would get uncomfortably warm. Then I found this thread when it was like 10 pages deep, and people were just starting to dellid with a blade...It scared the crap out of me, but I nutted up and did it anyway.
> 
> Fast forward a couple years and over 1000 pages, and now we have almost fool proof devices you can order off of Amazom or have custom printed!
> 
> My 3570k has been a 5.0Ghz 24/7 magnificent chip for going on 3 years now, and it would have never broke 4.5 without the help found in this thread...
> 
> Hats off to OCN and the pioneers in this thread. Thanks guys!


its great to see an i5 hitting 5ghz. i am hopeful that mine will after i delid and run bare because it hits 4.8ghz on water at 1.3 volts. seeing as many people put 1.4/.5 volts through their haswell and dc chips on this thread i reckon i have a decent shot







( I own a 4690k)


----------



## inedenimadam

^ that is how i run mine, naked, under an older EK block with some liquid metal. Its been demoted from my main rig to the BMO build in my sig, but i didnt see any reason to drop the overclock or take out the watercooling. Great little chip. Probably will outlive my Haswell-E (crap overclocker)


----------



## Cakewalk_S

This video got me thinking...



Why can't I go through the exact same process but with 2 of these: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Stanley-MaxSteel-6-in-Adjustable-Wrench-90-947/203710898?keyword=adjustable+wrench+stanley

So basically instead of 4 sided pressure points on the CPU I'll have 3. Looks like the inside groove of the adjustable wrench is quite straight which will add another pressure point when I'm trying to twist off the IHS... So basically I'd have pressure on 3 sides of the chip... The IHS will be no problem getting gripped by the wrench...but just wondering if 3 sides in the wrench will be enough to prevent any damage...


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> This video got me thinking...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why can't I go through the exact same process but with 2 of these: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Stanley-MaxSteel-6-in-Adjustable-Wrench-90-947/203710898?keyword=adjustable+wrench+stanley
> 
> So basically instead of 4 sided pressure points on the CPU I'll have 3. Looks like the inside groove of the adjustable wrench is quite straight which will add another pressure point when I'm trying to twist off the IHS... So basically I'd have pressure on 3 sides of the chip... The IHS will be no problem getting gripped by the wrench...but just wondering if 3 sides in the wrench will be enough to prevent any damage...


That's up to you, but I wouldn't do it, lol.


----------



## Rikuo

The Rockit 88 delid tool worked great!

Makes you a little nervous when it finally breaks free & there's a pretty loud "SNAP"











Interesting that core #2 was the hottest before the delid..

But after, Core #2 is the same temp as the others, And Core #1 is hotter.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rikuo*
> 
> The Rockit 88 delid tool worked great!
> 
> Makes you a little nervous when it finally breaks free & there's a pretty loud "SNAP"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting that core #2 was the hottest before the delid..
> 
> But after, Core #2 is the same temp as the others, And Core #1 is hotter.


Thats just the way it spread. For me with CLU all my cores are within a couple ° of each other. Fantastic.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rikuo*
> 
> The Rockit 88 delid tool worked great!
> 
> Makes you a little nervous when it finally breaks free & there's a pretty loud "SNAP"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting that core #2 was the hottest before the delid..
> 
> But after, Core #2 is the same temp as the others, And Core #1 is hotter.


Could be anything, uneven spread, not enough or too much paste or the IHS moved when clamping messing up your application.
I have a naked mount and my first mount gives the best results where temps are even across the cores but then loosening and tightening my block seems to make them uneven again.


----------



## madmeatballs

I got a question. How long til you replace CLU from a delidded CPU? Haven't touched mine for a year and a few months (sorry lost track since when I did this).


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> I got a question. How long til you replace CLU from a delidded CPU? Haven't touched mine for a year and a few months (sorry lost track since when I did this).


You don't. Unless your temps are way off?


----------



## Ceadderman

I had a thought about the movement of the IHS messing up the spread...

anyone try a touch of clear silicon RTB at the corners of the IHS to "lock" the IHS into place before remounting their CPU and applying the clamp to the chip? Seems like this is a simple fix that could in theory work to avoid such disasters.









Basically apply a small dot on the lower corner and then a dot on the opposite upper corner, place the IHS down on the PCB and wait a few minutes to dry. No it won't hold up under a blast of air, but it should be enough to keep the IHS from moving when the clamp is applied.









~Ceadder


----------



## Castaile

Hey guys

So I've delidded my 3770k by using rockit88, cleaned off the glue and applied CLU onto the die and the EK waterblock. I've also used EK's precisemount naked ivy kit.

Set up everything and powered up but there's no signal to the monitor, the keyboard and mouse led also don't light up...

Are these signs of a dead cpu?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I had a thought about the movement of the IHS messing up the spread...
> 
> anyone try a touch of clear silicon RTB at the corners of the IHS to "lock" the IHS into place before remounting their CPU and applying the clamp to the chip? Seems like this is a simple fix that could in theory work to avoid such disasters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically apply a small dot on the lower corner and then a dot on the opposite upper corner, place the IHS down on the PCB and wait a few minutes to dry. No it won't hold up under a blast of air, but it should be enough to keep the IHS from moving when the clamp is applied.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Some glue the IHS on a little or completely, I just went naked to avoid all the hassle, having the chip stick to the bottom of the waterblock when removing it is way less hassle for me than positioning the IHS just right then having the IHS increase temps. Maybe I'm just a CPU nudist?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> Hey guys
> So I've delidded my 3770k by using rockit88, cleaned off the glue and applied CLU onto the die and the EK waterblock. I've also used EK's precisemount naked ivy kit.
> Set up everything and powered up but there's no signal to the monitor, the keyboard and mouse led also don't light up...
> Are these signs of a dead cpu?


Try checking everything else first, have you tightened the thumb screws all the way down in a criss-cross pattern quarter turn at a time? If you tighten one side down too much you will crack the die and kill the CPU.


----------



## Castaile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Try checking everything else first, have you tightened the thumb screws all the way down in a criss-cross pattern quarter turn at a time? If you tighten one side down too much you will crack the die and kill the CPU.


Yeaa i did tighten the screws in a criss cross pattern. Will the screen show any signal like "no cpu found" if the cpu is dead?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> Yeaa i did tighten the screws in a criss cross pattern. Will the screen show any signal like "no cpu found" if the cpu is dead?


Your mobo will give you error codes, most decent mobos do if its a cpu issue. You gotta make sure you tighten down the waterblock all the way tight dont be afraid, nothing will break. Hopefully you put it back in with the arrows matching lol.


----------



## Castaile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Your mobo will give you error codes, most decent mobos do if its a cpu issue. You gotta make sure you tighten down the waterblock all the way tight dont be afraid, nothing will break. Hopefully you put it back in with the arrows matching lol.


That's affirmative. I've made sure the arrow is pointing to the bottom left 7-8oclock.

Guess I'll have some disassembling and reassembling to do ><


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> That's affirmative. I've made sure the arrow is pointing to the bottom left 7-8oclock.
> Guess I'll have some disassembling and reassembling to do ><


My Sabertooth FX990 told me when my old 8350 was dead so I hope intel do the same. Are you sure your CPU 8pin and 24pin plugs are all in the sockets correctly and your PSU is plugged in, if it's a modular PSU are the cables plugged in to the PSU correctly? You should have a display or things should be lighting up regardless. The only other think I can think of is you have used too much CLU and it's rolled off the cpu die on to the CPU.

Remove the block (be careful that you don't drop the chip it should be stuck to the block if you used enough CLU) and inspect, take loads of pics if you intend to show up/ask for further advice.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I had a thought about the movement of the IHS messing up the spread...
> 
> anyone try a touch of clear silicon RTB at the corners of the IHS to "lock" the IHS into place before remounting their CPU and applying the clamp to the chip? Seems like this is a simple fix that could in theory work to avoid such disasters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically apply a small dot on the lower corner and then a dot on the opposite upper corner, place the IHS down on the PCB and wait a few minutes to dry. No it won't hold up under a blast of air, but it should be enough to keep the IHS from moving when the clamp is applied.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I used a toothpick to apply a pin-head sized dot of black PermaTex to each corner of the IHS when I put it back on.

The Rockit 88 kit has a re-lid tool that makes gluing the IHS back on basically fool-proof.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I had a thought about the movement of the IHS messing up the spread...
> 
> anyone try a touch of clear silicon RTB at the corners of the IHS to "lock" the IHS into place before remounting their CPU
> snip
> ~Ceadder


I did this after my initial delid and it worked great. I actually just used the socket latch to clamp it down but you could use anything as long as some caution is also used. I was really surprised at how well it held once dried and doesn't shift at all when tightening the socket latch. Re-delidding is super easy but I still used my vice and just a TINY bit of pressure to pop it back off. I'm currently using no adhesive under the IHS and I've noticed no temperature difference between the two.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Your mobo will give you error codes, most decent mobos do if its a cpu issue. You gotta make sure you tighten down the waterblock all the way tight dont be afraid, nothing will break. Hopefully you put it back in with the arrows matching lol.
> 
> 
> 
> That's affirmative. I've made sure the arrow is pointing to the bottom left 7-8oclock.
> Guess I'll have some disassembling and reassembling to do ><
Click to expand...

Mine would not boot when I mounted a heatsync overly tight.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Mine would not boot when I mounted a heatsync overly tight.


Depends on the waterblock i guess. With my ekwb tightened all the way don and with pressure paper it makes minimal contact with the die but still provides a temp drop. Either the die isnt perfectly flat or the waterblock isnt. I was getting good pressure at the far edges of the die.


----------



## Castaile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Depends on the waterblock i guess. With my ekwb tightened all the way don and with pressure paper it makes minimal contact with the die but still provides a temp drop. Either the die isnt perfectly flat or the waterblock isnt. I was getting good pressure at the far edges of the die.


Was this with ek!'s naked ivy precise mount kit?

Edit: ah nevermind noticed yours isnt a 3770k


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> Was this with ek!'s naked ivy precise mount kit?
> 
> Edit: ah nevermind noticed yours isnt a 3770k


Yea i have a 4690, well two now haha. But the thickness of the 3770 and 4690 should be identical, pretty sure the pcb and ihs are the same thickness. I could be wrong but the ekwb kit was designed for ivy it just ends up working for haswell lol.

What i did notice is that it ends up sitting more on the cpu socket then on the die,which is both good and bad. But with such a huge manufacturing tolerance no two ekwb cpu blocks are identical so could be why.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Depends on the waterblock i guess. With my ekwb tightened all the way don and with pressure paper it makes minimal contact with the die but still provides a temp drop. Either the die isnt perfectly flat or the waterblock isnt. I was getting good pressure at the far edges of the die.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Depends on the waterblock i guess. With my ekwb tightened all the way don and with pressure paper it makes minimal contact with the die but still provides a temp drop. Either the die isnt perfectly flat or the waterblock isnt. I was getting good pressure at the far edges of the die.


I really think the R&D from ek was enough to get good pressure on the die man, I haven't tested my block's pressure or anything but I don't hit thermal throttling until 1.6v+, you put washers and all sorts on to your kit and I imagine that throws all sorts of issues your way as it wasn't designed for that added pressure and tolerance. The whole point in the TIM is to make the gap non-existent. I do believe that in your case you're over complicating a simple solution.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Mine would not boot when I mounted a heatsync overly tight.


This is correct because it will put too much pressure on some pins and break contact meaning no boot. I have to go HAM on my thumb screws in order to achieve this though, I just leave them very weakly hand tightened.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I really think the R&D from ek was enough to get good pressure on the die man, I haven't tested my block's pressure or anything but I don't hit thermal throttling until 1.6v+, you put washers and all sorts on to your kit and I imagine that throws all sorts of issues your way as it wasn't designed for that added pressure and tolerance. The whole point in the TIM is to make the gap non-existent. I do believe that in your case you're over complicating a simple solution.
> 
> This is correct because it will put too much pressure on some pins and break contact meaning no boot. I have to go HAM on my thumb screws in order to achieve this though, I just leave them very weakly hand tightened.


The washers i have dont change a thing, i put 4 very thin ones under the mounting springs so that the springs dont get caught in the actual waterblock mounting bracket holes and make all sorts of noises and end up leaving tiny metal particles everywhere. They dont change the pressure or anything.

I never said the pressure wasn't good, its decent at best. Problem is the die is perfectly straight and the waterblock is convex quite a bit. The pic is floating around somewhere to show proof of that.

I can crank mine down tight till the mounting screws bottom out, and thats exactly following EKWBs instructions. The springs are what keep the pressure down anyways. The spring pushes down on the bracket and the waterblock pushes back up on the spring. It makes more contact with the cpu socket then the die which is what keeps the die from bending or even breaking so its a good thing.

Theres absolutely no issues with it and i do believe the ekwb kit and mounting hardware can pretty much work on every waterblock available, might need to find nuts or bolts that fit if the waterblock is quite thick but should work.

Here, excuse the mspaint lol. I have all 4 washers right there under each spring. It hasnt changed the pressure or anything as the springs are stil pushing down on the block.


----------



## inedenimadam

^ I have had zero issues out of EK blocks from several generations of their flagship products, but I am certainly not going to tell you that you are not. Have you checked your particular block? Take a metal ruler to the surface and see if its flat. I hope you get your issues worked out.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> ^ I have had zero issues out of EK blocks from several generations of their flagship products, but I am certainly not going to tell you that you are not. Have you checked your particular block? Take a metal ruler to the surface and see if its flat. I hope you get your issues worked out.


If youre referring to me i have no issues lol, i just added washers so that annoying screeching sound stops when tightening the mounting nuts. As far as flat, mine is far from flat. The middle is quite convex as they're pretty much made for an ihs so its understandable. Im going to try to tighten a bit more evenly next delid and see if it helps a bit. Might try a bit less CLU too and see how it does, then add as necessary.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> If youre referring to me i have no issues lol, i just added washers so that annoying screeching sound stops when tightening the mounting nuts. As far as flat, mine is far from flat. The middle is quite convex as they're pretty much made for an ihs so its understandable. Im going to try to tighten a bit more evenly next delid and see if it helps a bit. Might try a bit less CLU too and see how it does, then add as necessary.


When we spoke about the CPU PCB being bent you said your chip was badly bent where as mine was minor. You are changing the pressure on you're very convex cpu block meaning you're bending the pcb more, it will force the pins to break contact eventually.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> When we spoke about the CPU PCB being bent you said your chip was badly bent where as mine was minor. You are changing the pressure on you're very convex cpu block meaning you're bending the pcb more, it will force the pins to break contact eventually.


Yea i thought it was badly bent, then i checked it side by side with the new one and i guess even new ones arent completely flat







so im ok with that. I dont think its changing the pressure because i tried the pressure paper with the washers and it was totally fine. I posted the pic before and the center of the die had very minimal pressure was the 2 small edges of the die had good pressure.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i thought it was badly bent, then i checked it side by side with the new one and i guess even new ones arent completely flat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so im ok with that. I dont think its changing the pressure because i tried the pressure paper with the washers and it was totally fine. I posted the pic before and the center of the die had very minimal pressure was the 2 small edges of the die had good pressure.


Fair enough.


----------



## Castaile

My cpu is alive after all. I've reseated the waterblock and tighten the screws *all the way down*. The computer boots up and business as usual. I shaved off about 16C, now at ~73C on my hottest core with 1.3716Vcore - 4.6ghz.
But I had to resort to thermal paste this time as I've ran out of CLU (I had to reseat the waterblock twice).
Thanks guys.
Also big ups to rockit88 for their delidding tool.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> My cpu is alive after all. I've reseated the waterblock and tighten the screws *all the way down*. The computer boots up and business as usual. I shaved off about 16C, now at ~73C on my hottest core with 1.3716Vcore - 4.6ghz.
> But I had to resort to thermal paste this time as I've ran out of CLU (I had to reseat the waterblock twice).
> Thanks guys.
> Also big ups to rockit88 for their delidding tool.


Those temps will change FAST lol. Glad it works, your temps will start creeping up with TIM, depending on which you use so just watch the temps. Thats the only reason people use CLU is because it lasts, thermal efficiency is about the same as the best TIMs.

For me using Noctua and Hydronaut, my temps were IDENTICAL bare die with both TIMs and CLU. Issue was, the temps with the TIMs changed quite rapidly, within a day or two. I switched to CLU, the temps are the same but they dont creep.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> This video got me thinking...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why can't I go through the exact same process but with 2 of these: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Stanley-MaxSteel-6-in-Adjustable-Wrench-90-947/203710898?keyword=adjustable+wrench+stanley
> 
> So basically instead of 4 sided pressure points on the CPU I'll have 3. Looks like the inside groove of the adjustable wrench is quite straight which will add another pressure point when I'm trying to twist off the IHS... So basically I'd have pressure on 3 sides of the chip... The IHS will be no problem getting gripped by the wrench...but just wondering if 3 sides in the wrench will be enough to prevent any damage...


If you were going down that road then I would use a vice to hold the PCB and the adjustable wrench on the IHS


----------



## Castaile

@bluej511 thanks for the headups! I'll monitor the temps closely. I'll be resisting my tweaking itch for now


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> And I heartily recommend the entersetup delid tool, forget Amazon, lol.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.entersetup.com/...


I would like to see how this tool performs on a broadwell-c.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> I would like to see how this tool performs on a broadwell-c.


He hasn't made one for Broadwell C yet but i do believe he has plans on doing so.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> My cpu is alive after all. I've reseated the waterblock and tighten the screws *all the way down*. The computer boots up and business as usual. I shaved off about 16C, now at ~73C on my hottest core with 1.3716Vcore - 4.6ghz.
> But I had to resort to thermal paste this time as I've ran out of CLU (I had to reseat the waterblock twice).
> Thanks guys.
> Also big ups to rockit88 for their delidding tool.


Like Blue said, watch your temps due to pump out, would highly recommend CLU as your temps at 1.3v ish are just as high as mine at 1.45vish.


----------



## Ceadderman

Too bad the Dell board is proprietary. Love to see if this CPU is over lockable at all without having to purchase a new board right away. Found a MVIIGene for $178 but since I'm putting a 140 loop together first we know where that money is going. :blushsmile

Gonna put hydronaut on the chip to get a better idea if delidding is gonna be worth it. If it was a K chip then I wouldn't question it at all. Since it's not I'd rather not drop too much on this Dell if I don't have to. Have an EVO and a xTop coming as well as a Res. Have a D5 vario as well as some Monsoon fittings laying around. So fan, radiator, tubing and radiator stands is all I need to cool the 4790.









Maybe once I get a Maximus VII Gene, we'll get the delid party started.









~Ceadder


----------



## Castaile

@bluej511 @Benjiw True enough. I shall be ordering more CLU. Do you also spread the clu onto the waterblock large enough to cover the die?


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> @bluej511
> @Benjiw
> True enough. I shall be ordering more CLU. Do you also spread the clu onto the waterblock large enough to cover the die?


What I have done in the past is mount it, then take it off and see how much was actually contacting, since you spread it with a brush, you can just flatten it all back out. If there are spots missing on the block, then add a little CLU to ensure contact. This improved my temps over just putting it on one side, but depends on your surface shape, ect.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> What I have done in the past is mount it, then take it off and see how much was actually contacting, since you spread it with a brush, you can just flatten it all back out. If there are spots missing on the block, then add a little CLU to ensure contact. This improved my temps over just putting it on one side, but depends on your surface shape, ect.


Yea theres so many variables cant ever tell. Plus The cores are only on the side of the die, probably 1/4 of the chip is the graphic section lol.


----------



## Castaile

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> What I have done in the past is mount it, then take it off and see how much was actually contacting, since you spread it with a brush, you can just flatten it all back out. If there are spots missing on the block, then add a little CLU to ensure contact. This improved my temps over just putting it on one side, but depends on your surface shape, ect.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea theres so many variables cant ever tell. Plus The cores are only on the side of the die, probably 1/4 of the chip is the graphic section lol.


I've applied CLU on the die as well as onto the waterblock. This might have led to the scare I had.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Castaile*
> 
> I've applied CLU on the die as well as onto the waterblock. This might have led to the scare I had.


You really only need it on the die, after a couple cycles it ends up sticking to the waterblock/ihs anyways.


----------



## jdorje

Has anyone ever done it both ways and compared?

I only put clu on the die, and i got great temp improvement. But on haswell you have to be a bit more careful about getting lm everywhere. If i remounted i might try putting on both and comparing. But placing the ihs on top of the die isn't that precise either...i imagine if you go with a water block instead you can get it more consistent.

And a real question! If you remount do you need to replace the clu? Logically it is still just liquid sitting there and you shouldn't have to...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Has anyone ever done it both ways and compared?
> 
> I only put clu on the die, and i got great temp improvement. But on haswell you have to be a bit more careful about getting lm everywhere. If i remounted i might try putting on both and comparing. But placing the ihs on top of the die isn't that precise either...i imagine if you go with a water block instead you can get it more consistent.
> 
> And a real question! If you remount do you need to replace the clu? Logically it is still just liquid sitting there and you shouldn't have to...


Ive done both ways but its only going to be a fact on my system. Like ive said before there's so much inconsistencies and manufacturing tolerances that it might vary greatly. Ive done it stock, then bare die/tim then bare die/clu (temps were IDENTICAL btw but it pumped out rapidly at 1.2v.), then i did ihs/clu.

ihs/clu was 53°C and bare die was 46-47°C IN MY CASE. It really depends on the waterblock, the waterblock convex, the die flatness. Some people said it made no difference. I did it the same day, same tests, and i got way better temps bare die.

This time im going straight from stock to delid and bare die with CLU to see what temp drops i get. RIght now at 1.21v im at 59-60°C under water. Yes i know its quite high, its also because my case ambien is 30-31°C with NO AC.

Oh and no need to reapply, and on haswell and ivy, you can just nail polish over the resistors or wtv and youll be fine. A coat or two fully cured is perfect, then even if the clu runs a tiny bit its totally fine.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ive done both ways


Whoops I wasn't clear! I know people have done both bare die and with IHS. What I meant was, has anyone compared putting CLU on both sides (block + die or IHS + die) to just putting it on one side (die) and letting it cover the other through pressure?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Whoops I wasn't clear! I know people have done both bare die and with IHS. What I meant was, has anyone compared putting CLU on both sides (block + die or IHS + die) to just putting it on one side (die) and letting it cover the other through pressure?


Honestly, i could try but to my understanding it would be way too much clu. Its not like TIM, i just find it way easier and safer to put on the die away from all pc parts, make sure the pcb is totally clean then put it in straight and flat into the socket then put the waterblock on. If i dont like the temps, ill totally remove it and reapply or respread then reinstall. Sounds like a pain but better safe then sorry, i wont apply clu directly with the cpu in the socket, and my mobo is also horizontal which makes it easier, but also easier to get drops in nooks and crannys haha.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ive done both ways
> 
> 
> 
> Whoops I wasn't clear! I know people have done both bare die and with IHS. What I meant was, has anyone compared putting CLU on both sides (block + die or IHS + die) to just putting it on one side (die) and letting it cover the other through pressure?
Click to expand...

Anecdotal of course, because I have not done any scientific "testing", but it was easier for me to get good contact with less LM when applied to both sides. I have reapplied several times over several years like this. Its almost like there is some amount of surface tension to LM, and brushing it helps overcome that tension and adhere to the surface, so it just made sense to do both sides. This had been my experience when doing die-ihs, die-copper block, and die-plated block.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Anecdotal of course, because I have not done any scientific "testing", but it was easier for me to get good contact with less LM when applied to both sides. I have reapplied several times over several years like this. Its almost like there is some amount of surface tension to LM, and brushing it helps overcome that tension and adhere to the surface, so it just made sense to do both sides. This had been my experience when doing die-ihs, die-copper block, and die-plated block.


Yea that could totally be true as LM just doesnt like to spread at all pretty much just sits there. 2 very thin coats on each side could mate better and get better temps. Mine is still "etched" from the first round so i could give it a try spreading it on both sides very thinly.

I need to clear coat the transistors again and wait for it to dry though, thats the only downside to deliding and using CLU.


----------



## GTRtank

So, I am thinking about going bare die. Is it alright for long term use? Anything I should know before I pull the trigger? Temp drops of what, 5-8c?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> So, I am thinking about going bare die. Is it alright for long term use? Anything I should know before I pull the trigger? Temp drops of what, 5-8c?


Honestly really depends on the chip and waterblock and voltage. The higher the voltage the bigger drop you'll see. Some people said they saw NO difference and others saw a good increase. I dropped 7°C or so going from CLU/IHS to bare die and since all i had to get was new bolts it was a pretty cheap upgrade so i did it anyways.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Honestly really depends on the chip and waterblock and voltage. The higher the voltage the bigger drop you'll see. Some people said they saw NO difference and others saw a good increase. I dropped 7°C or so going from CLU/IHS to bare die and since all i had to get was new bolts it was a pretty cheap upgrade so i did it anyways.


Word. How long have you had it on? Yeah I mean the bolts are 5$, so I'm thinking why not. Running at 1.4v so I may see a drop... Prime 95 with ambient of 26c I get up to 72c, which isn't bad. But I'm always down to improve it!


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> So, I am thinking about going bare die. Is it alright for long term use? Anything I should know before I pull the trigger? Temp drops of what, 5-8c?


3 years naked here, I have learned a few things.

The naked advantage is non linear. At 1.2V I cant tell any real gains vs replacing the lid. At 1.5V it is 5C better. Dont use a copper block. It doesn't degrade or anything, but it stains the copper DEEP and the LM dries out faster than when mated to a plated block. WATCH THE DAMNED PINS! I destroyed a socket by not having the chip lined up properly and destroyed several pins. It iss much easier to destroy pins without a lid, because every time you go to reapply paste, the chip has to come all the way out, unlike a lidded chip that has the hold down.

I would say if you have an upper tier chip, and are not afraid of voltage, then naked is a great way to squeeze it for all its worth...but if you just have an average chip, and you are going to stay in the safe voltage range for the chip...then no, its not worth the hassle or the risk. Also, some of the newest Intel chips have a thinner PCB, making the potential for complications greater. If your chip is one of these with the thin PCB, ask some of the guys doing more recent dellids about proper mount. EKs naked kit is cheap and easy to install.

All this is my experience, and I have in no fashion done extensive testing, its all anecdotal evidence from running my 3570k naked under a couple different EK blocks. It has been running 5.0 at 1.35 for its whole life, save for the few ventures into the 1.5V bench sessions.

I love running naked...here is an Intel Burn Test run at 1.528, never even broke 70C with a 23C ambient, and its STABLE!


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 3 years naked here, I have learned a few things.
> 
> The naked advantage is non linear. At 1.2V I cant tell any real gains vs replacing the lid. At 1.5V it is 5C better. Dont use a copper block. It doesn't degrade or anything, but it stains the copper DEEP and the LM dries out faster than when mated to a plated block. WATCH THE DAMNED PINS! I destroyed a socket by not having the chip lined up properly and destroyed several pins. It iss much easier to destroy pins without a lid, because every time you go to reapply paste, the chip has to come all the way out, unlike a lidded chip that has the hold down.
> 
> I would say if you have an upper tier chip, and are not afraid of voltage, then naked is a great way to squeeze it for all its worth...but if you just have an average chip, and you are going to stay in the safe voltage range for the chip...then no, its not worth the hassle or the risk. Also, some of the newest Intel chips have a thinner PCB, making the potential for complications greater. If your chip is one of these with the thin PCB, ask some of the guys doing more recent dellids about proper mount. EKs naked kit is cheap and easy to install.
> 
> All this is my experience, and I have in no fashion done extensive testing, its all anecdotal evidence from running my 3570k naked under a couple different EK blocks. It has been running 5.0 at 1.35 for its whole life, save for the few ventures into the 1.5V bench sessions.
> 
> I love running naked...here is an Intel Burn Test run at 1.528, never even broke 70C with a 23C ambient, and its STABLE!


Nice! Yeah, I have a pretty good chip, 5.0 at 1.394, been running it at that 24/7 since January and can bench at 5.1 at 1.424v, havent taken it higher, but I know it will keep going. Yeah I wont be removing the block much so I think if I get good results I will probably just leave it. And yeah, those temps are ridiculous for 1.5 lol damn. I will have to think about it, see how it goes, if I want to pull the trigger or not.. haha. Thanks for the info.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 3 years naked here, I have learned a few things.
> 
> The naked advantage is non linear. At 1.2V I cant tell any real gains vs replacing the lid. At 1.5V it is 5C better. Dont use a copper block. It doesn't degrade or anything, but it stains the copper DEEP and the LM dries out faster than when mated to a plated block. WATCH THE DAMNED PINS! I destroyed a socket by not having the chip lined up properly and destroyed several pins. It iss much easier to destroy pins without a lid, because every time you go to reapply paste, the chip has to come all the way out, unlike a lidded chip that has the hold down.
> 
> I would say if you have an upper tier chip, and are not afraid of voltage, then naked is a great way to squeeze it for all its worth...but if you just have an average chip, and you are going to stay in the safe voltage range for the chip...then no, its not worth the hassle or the risk. Also, some of the newest Intel chips have a thinner PCB, making the potential for complications greater. If your chip is one of these with the thin PCB, ask some of the guys doing more recent dellids about proper mount. EKs naked kit is cheap and easy to install.
> 
> All this is my experience, and I have in no fashion done extensive testing, its all anecdotal evidence from running my 3570k naked under a couple different EK blocks. It has been running 5.0 at 1.35 for its whole life, save for the few ventures into the 1.5V bench sessions.
> 
> I love running naked...here is an Intel Burn Test run at 1.528, never even broke 70C with a 23C ambient, and its STABLE!


This is why its not linear. Everyone will always give you another reason/excuse or have their opinion. Me personally i noticed 7°C going from clu/ihs to bare die. And temps dropped faster, im also running copper and have noticed no issue, if the clu seeps into the copper pores, thats a GOOD thing. Filling it in is exactly the whole point of tim/lm. Ive also removed mine probably a dozen times and have not bent a single pin, cpu only goes in one way and pretty much fits how its supposed to fit. Its totally possible to bent pins but i havent done it.

I plan on doing it with my new chip as well so def not have had any issues.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> 3 years naked here, I have learned a few things.
> 
> The naked advantage is non linear. At 1.2V I cant tell any real gains vs replacing the lid. At 1.5V it is 5C better. Dont use a copper block. It doesn't degrade or anything, but it stains the copper DEEP and the LM dries out faster than when mated to a plated block. WATCH THE DAMNED PINS! I destroyed a socket by not having the chip lined up properly and destroyed several pins. It iss much easier to destroy pins without a lid, because every time you go to reapply paste, the chip has to come all the way out, unlike a lidded chip that has the hold down.
> 
> I would say if you have an upper tier chip, and are not afraid of voltage, then naked is a great way to squeeze it for all its worth...but if you just have an average chip, and you are going to stay in the safe voltage range for the chip...then no, its not worth the hassle or the risk. Also, some of the newest Intel chips have a thinner PCB, making the potential for complications greater. If your chip is one of these with the thin PCB, ask some of the guys doing more recent dellids about proper mount. EKs naked kit is cheap and easy to install.
> 
> All this is my experience, and I have in no fashion done extensive testing, its all anecdotal evidence from running my 3570k naked under a couple different EK blocks. It has been running 5.0 at 1.35 for its whole life, save for the few ventures into the 1.5V bench sessions.
> 
> I love running naked...here is an Intel Burn Test run at 1.528, never even broke 70C with a 23C ambient, and its STABLE!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Sorry to say this, but IBT standard is so easy to pass, I would say that you're not stable. Right click on the run button enable EXTREME mode and then set it to very high. That temp and stability will change.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> So, I am thinking about going bare die. Is it alright for long term use? Anything I should know before I pull the trigger? Temp drops of what, 5-8c?


8c at idle for me with an increase of 0.35v from 1.24v and underload there is no contest, with my IHS I would thermal throttle at 1.3v, I need more than 1.6v for it to thermal throttle.

I'll probably go naked on my skylake build and go for the golden 5ghz 24/7 regardless of voltage.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> 8c at idle for me with an increase of 0.35v from 1.24v and underload there is no contest, with my IHS I would thermal throttle at 1.3v, I need more than 1.6v for it to thermal throttle.
> 
> I'll probably go naked on my skylake build and go for the golden 5ghz 24/7 regardless of voltage.


Sweet thanks. Like I said my temps are fine, 72c P95 @ 5.0, but I love getting lower temps, its addicting!







I will probably go ahead and order the kit, see what kind of drops I get. I'll keep you guys posted!


----------



## bluej511

So heres the video with the delid tool. Excuse the poor quality and garbage video lol.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Sweet thanks. Like I said my temps are fine, 72c P95 @ 5.0, but I love getting lower temps, its addicting!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will probably go ahead and order the kit, see what kind of drops I get. I'll keep you guys posted!


Max temp was 82c at those volts when benching, can guarantee that I won't hit thermal throttle until 1.625v.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Max temp was 82c at those volts when benching, can guarantee that I won't hit thermal throttle until 1.625v.


That is pretty damn awesome. Yeah I haven't pushed this chip all the way.. I could do 5.1 with the NH-d15 and temps weren't unreasonable.. Around 79c. The predator dropped my temps around 5-7c I think, so I will have a bit more headroom when I run without the IHS. Bet I can squeeze 5.3 out of it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> That is pretty damn awesome. Yeah I haven't pushed this chip all the way.. I could do 5.1 with the NH-d15 and temps weren't unreasonable.. Around 79c. The predator dropped my temps around 5-7c I think, so I will have a bit more headroom when I run without the IHS. Bet I can squeeze 5.3 out of it.


Stahp you're making me jealous!!! I might try for 5ghz again, I don't care if I kill the chip.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Stahp you're making me jealous!!! I might try for 5ghz again, I don't care if I kill the chip.


@GTRtank you guys are seriously making me want to get naked







I've been working on stabilizing my 4790k's 5.0Ghz OC, hopefully for 24/7 since I was rather surprised at the performance difference from 4.8 (which only takes 1.285v and will run prime for days)








Using 1.43v right now but stress tests are killing me at 90°c and its still not completely stable. I'm planning on doing a loop cleaning in about a month, I'm thinking I'll try and get it done then if it still seems like a good idea. I can use the ivy precise mount for my haswell DC right?

Someone ought to start a CPU nudist club


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> @GTRtank you guys are seriously making me want to get naked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been working on stabilizing my 4790k's 5.0Ghz OC, hopefully for 24/7 since I was rather surprised at the performance difference from 4.8 (which only takes 1.285v and will run prime for days)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Using 1.43v right now but stress tests are killing me at 90°c and its still not completely stable. I'm planning on doing a loop cleaning in about a month, I'm thinking I'll try and get it done then if it still seems like a good idea. I can use the ivy precise mount for my haswell DC right?
> 
> Someone ought to start a CPU nudist club


Yes the ivy mount works with haswell and DC, you'll find lowering the temp will help reduce your volts slightly. 90c? Dreaded IHS soaking up all that heat, be gone with it you'll never look back... come to think of it, I don't even know where my IHS is... I might of thrown it away.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Yes the ivy mount works with haswell and DC, you'll find lowering the temp will help reduce your volts slightly. 90c? Dreaded IHS soaking up all that heat, be gone with it you'll never look back... come to think of it, I don't even know where my IHS is... I might of thrown it away.


Thanks Benji! yeah, 90°c... kinda what I was thinking too but I am asking quite a bit of it, or so I thought. If there is a possibility of any voltage drop too then I'm sold. Was thinking I may need to reapply LM but I did just over 2 months ago and I actually used a tiny bit more than I have in the past. Since I'm using hard tubing I'm not too keen on remounting if I don't need to. A picture from my build log


----------



## bluej511

So im back to naked haha. Went from about 60-61°C and now at about 49-50°C. Thats a total delid and going bare die with CLU. I might try to take some CLU off tomorrow or something maybe get slightly lower temps but at least it posts and its stable so no worrying here.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> @GTRtank you guys are seriously making me want to get naked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been working on stabilizing my 4790k's 5.0Ghz OC, hopefully for 24/7 since I was rather surprised at the performance difference from 4.8 (which only takes 1.285v and will run prime for days)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Using 1.43v right now but stress tests are killing me at 90°c and its still not completely stable. I'm planning on doing a loop cleaning in about a month, I'm thinking I'll try and get it done then if it still seems like a good idea. I can use the ivy precise mount for my haswell DC right?
> 
> Someone ought to start a CPU nudist club


Yeah man, jump on the 5.0 24/7 train! It is a good ride! Pretty good volts for 4.8, and as @Benjiw said, it will help bring down the volts. You will probably be around where I am, 1.4v. I think my chip will run 4.8 at around 1.28.. can't remember for sure though. I am also adding a rad and pump to my system so that will bring temps down a little, so that plus the naked kit, I should be looking pretty good!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Stahp you're making me jealous!!! I might try for 5ghz again, I don't care if I kill the chip.


Haha I am not trying to man! I just got lucky as all, haha. Probably won't get another good chip for 10 years unless I buy from silicon lottery... haha.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Would it be worth replacing my supremacy's copper base with nickel plated? I know copper isn't ideal for lm application, doesn't it soak it up/dry things out? I like my copper base but if it means more time between reapplication I'll get nickel. Would be my first actually, I'm a total sloot for copper


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Would it be worth replacing my supremacy's copper base with nickel plated? I know copper isn't ideal for lm application, doesn't it soak it up/dry things out? I like my copper base but if it means more time between reapplication I'll get nickel. Would be my first actually, I'm a total sloot for copper


Say what?

You're referring to the TIM correct?

If so, NO it doesn't.

There are more "valleys" between the two with Copper. But that's all. I run Copper blocks and never had a problem with TIM drying out or soaking into Copper. TIM fills the microscopic valleys and that's it. That's what you want for better heat transfer anyway.

You'd just be wasting money on a new base unless you wanted to change aesthetics by going with Nickel over Copper. There is really no performance difference between the two.









~Ceadder


----------



## jdorje

Nickel shouldn't ever need reapplication.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> So im back to naked haha. Went from about 60-61°C and now at about 49-50°C. Thats a total delid and going bare die with CLU. I might try to take some CLU off tomorrow or something maybe get slightly lower temps but at least it posts and its stable so no worrying here.


Sweet, that is quite a gain. I'm over here foaming at the mouth... I love them gains!


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Say what?
> 
> You're referring to the TIM correct?
> 
> If so, NO it doesn't.
> 
> There are more "valleys" between the two with Copper. But that's all. I run Copper blocks and never had a problem with TIM drying out or soaking into Copper. TIM fills the microscopic valleys and that's it. That's what you want for better heat transfer anyway.
> 
> You'd just be wasting money on a new base unless you wanted to change aesthetics by going with Nickel over Copper. There is really no performance difference between the two.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


well liquid metal TIM in particular but yeah.

I've only ever used LM between my die and nickel plated IHS so I have 0 experience with it and copper but I've seen several users that claim they've had some issues with liquid metal and bare copper. I could care less about staining, I just don't want to end up fusing my die to my block is all









Seems like enough people do it that it should be ok. I can't ever seem to make it more than 6 months without tearing everything apart for some reason anyways so I can always just clean and reapply if need be.

Though I did see a couple of nickle 980 kryographics blocks in the classifieds though. Nickel would match my Gryphon mobo perfectly







naaaaa



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/30180#post_25006104
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/29890#post_24889827
http://www.overclock.net/newsearch/?advanced=1&byuser=&containingthread%5B0%5D=1313179&newer=1&output=posts&resultSortingPreference=recency&sdate=0&search=copper+clu&start=50&type=all


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Would it be worth replacing my supremacy's copper base with nickel plated? I know copper isn't ideal for lm application, doesn't it soak it up/dry things out? I like my copper base but if it means more time between reapplication I'll get nickel. Would be my first actually, I'm a total sloot for copper
> 
> 
> 
> Say what?
> 
> You're referring to the TIM correct?
> 
> If so, NO it doesn't.
> 
> There are more "valleys" between the two with Copper. But that's all. I run Copper blocks and never had a problem with TIM drying out or soaking into Copper. TIM fills the microscopic valleys and that's it. That's what you want for better heat transfer anyway.
> 
> You'd just be wasting money on a new base unless you wanted to change aesthetics by going with Nickel over Copper. There is really no performance difference between the two.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
Click to expand...

No performace difference...agreed.

Have you tried to clean CLU off the bottom of a copper block? I lapped my block after a year with CLU, and it still didn't come clean. Stuff really gets in there.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> No performace difference...agreed.
> 
> Have you tried to clean CLU off the bottom of a copper block? I lapped my block after a year with CLU, and it still didn't come clean. Stuff really gets in there.


Guys thats a good thing if it gets in there. You WANT the microscopic pores to fill in. It makes the CLU (and if you ever decide to go back to TIM after, more effective).
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Sweet, that is quite a gain. I'm over here foaming at the mouth... I love them gains!


Was expecting more to be honest but its not bad, ends up peaking at 53°C playing rainbow six siege. I might take it off today and take some CLU off see if it makes any diffference and lowers temps.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> No performace difference...agreed.
> 
> Have you tried to clean CLU off the bottom of a copper block? I lapped my block after a year with CLU, and it still didn't come clean. Stuff really gets in there.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Guys thats a good thing if it gets in there. You WANT the microscopic pores to fill in. It makes the CLU (and if you ever decide to go back to TIM after, more effective).


Well sounds like I'll go naked with my copper block then.







I'll report back if i have any issues


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Well sounds like I'll go naked with my copper block then.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll report back if i have any issues


From everything ive read (and ive been doing research for MONTHS) its not an issue. Copper has microscopic pores, more so then nickel plated. All the clu does if it seeps in is fill it up. You can always sand it to get it all off but after a couple months when i wipe mine off all it has is the etching of the bare die imprint from the clu. Considering no one will ever see it i dont really care about that.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> From everything ive read (and ive been doing research for MONTHS) its not an issue. Copper has microscopic pores, more so then nickel plated. All the clu does if it seeps in is fill it up. You can always sand it to get it all off but after a couple months when i wipe mine off all it has is the etching of the bare die imprint from the clu. Considering no one will ever see it i dont really care about that.


I saw this with a GTX 970 I put CLU on; everything still works fine just stained. Even regular paste can leave a block stained over time. My XSPC Raystorm has an imprint of the CPU die after running naked with regular paste for a couple years now.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I saw this with a GTX 970 I put CLU on; everything still works fine just stained. Even regular paste can leave a block stained over time. My XSPC Raystorm has an imprint of the CPU die after running naked with regular paste for a couple years now.


Notice any drop in temps with CLU on the 970? Been thinking of doing that to mine.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Notice any drop in temps with CLU on the 970? Been thinking of doing that to mine.


I saw about a 5c drop with the same fan profile, on both of them. 970 ssc acx2.0+


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I saw this with a GTX 970 I put CLU on; everything still works fine just stained. Even regular paste can leave a block stained over time. My XSPC Raystorm has an imprint of the CPU die after running naked with regular paste for a couple years now.
> 
> 
> 
> Notice any drop in temps with CLU on the 970? Been thinking of doing that to mine.
Click to expand...

It will get you about ten Celsius and have yet to peak eighty or throttle with a GTX 980 ssc acx2.0


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Notice any drop in temps with CLU on the 970? Been thinking of doing that to mine.


It was the 'mini' Zotac with dual fan cooler on the reference board. Friend of mine has it crammed in a Cooler Master Elite 130, that we modded to accept a water cooler etc. The temperatures weren't great even in a well ventilated case, so I used the CLU in an attempt to offset poor airflow. Which worked good for, can't say exactly, 3-6 months until bad things happened...can't recall and put a finite number on longevity.

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpudb/b3053/zotac-gtx-970

I covered the area around the GPU with a couple layers of LET...what happened eventually was that the LET melted into the CLU and 'dragged' it into the area around the die and caused it to short out.

I scrubbed and picked away as much of the LET as I could, since it hardened like a rock, and cleaned it up as best I could...Miraculously the card still functioned like it was new...didn't effect overclocking or anything and it is still running to this day.

I know that for a fact it's functional because he was just having CPU temp problems that he attributed to poor airflow or TIM...but I told him the AIO was probably failing; which it was. He was also complaining about poor performance of the GPU in newer games; due to thermal throttling. I suggested a new case as the easiest solution, he opted to bust out the dremel and pneumatic whiz-wheel to get to customizing. He got temperatures in check and increased his performance by a good margin keeping temps down.

IF you were to put CLU on a graphics card, I would highly suggest taking the same precautions as the CPUs that have VRMs underneath by covering the sensitive areas with something.

I just picked up a RX 480 a couple weeks ago, that is water-blocked at this point, and I have been tossing around the idea of CLU. Theorizing using some Hondabond high-temp liquid gasket to protect the sensitive area.


----------



## 0ldChicken

A 10c drop would put my 980's exactly at liquid temp at full load... that would be so glorious!

I assume a properly water-cooled card that peaks at 42c would probably drop less than 10c and closer to 5c?

Sounds like a great way to use up some of the relatively huge syringes of LM that I've got sitting around. I bought 2 just in case and a cpu die sure doesn't take much! Maybe I'll try it out during my upcoming loop cleaning


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> A 10c drop would put my 980's exactly at liquid temp at full load... that would be so glorious!
> 
> I assume a properly water-cooled card that peaks at 42c would probably drop less than 10c and closer to 5c?
> 
> Sounds like a great way to use up some of the relatively huge syringes of LM that I've got sitting around. I bought 2 just in case and a cpu die sure doesn't take much! Maybe I'll try it out during my upcoming loop cleaning


Not going to poke the bear, but to tell you: When my GTX980 was underwater with CLU and only the i5 4690k (2 x 240mm Rad [60mm, 30mm]) normal gpu under load temp was near forty, thirty-seven looking at my Source Engine heat, and forty four with bigger loads. This is all from memory, iirc.

Right now it is under air, with Phobya LM, and oddly it idles and runs higher than when stock, but does not peak anywhere near the top anymore.

The fans do not spin as much, I never hear them anymore. My theory is that it could be my ram only is cooled worse, plus and or the LM does not dissipate heat as well, however transfers heat much better.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Not going to poke the bear, but to tell you: When my GTX980 was underwater with CLU and only the i5 4690k (2 x 240mm Rad [60mm, 30mm]) normal gpu under load temp was near forty, thirty-seven looking at my Source Engine heat, and forty four with bigger loads. This is all from memory, iirc.
> 
> Right now it is under air, with Phobya LM, and oddly it idles and runs higher than when stock, but does not peak anywhere near the top anymore.
> 
> The fans do not spin as much, I never hear them anymore. My theory is that it could be my ram only is cooled worse, plus and or the LM does not dissipate heat as well, however transfers heat much better.


From what I have heard, it doesn't work as well with watercooling, which is why I used kryonaut. I get 37c load temps at 22c ambient... great TIM! Watercooling is already very efficient at pulling heat from the GPU, I am not sure if it would make much of a difference in this case. (From what I have seen)


----------



## doabackflip

oh no! So i just delided my CPU, couldn't see any issues on the PCB when I put it back in but now can't post







turns on for about 10 seconds, all fans spinning but just dosen't post. No error messages at all


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *doabackflip*
> 
> oh no! So i just delided my CPU, couldn't see any issues on the PCB when I put it back in but now can't post
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> turns on for about 10 seconds, all fans spinning but just dosen't post. No error messages at all


You didnt use a razer blade did you?


----------



## DavePC

Hey everyone, I've delidded my CPU for a while now, but every time I find one main issue.

Initially the temperatures are fine (however temps across cores are inconsistent), but after 3-4 days, the temperatures on 3 out of 4 cores sky rockets.

I've tried re applying TIM a few times now, and have tried placing both a thin line of paste on top of the die and spreading TIM on the die.

Delid was vice only method. I'm currently running at 4.4Ghz at 1.35V, 3570k. (yeah, my chip is not great) Heatsink is NH-D14, using NT-H1 on both IHS and die.

Temperatures after 5 runs of IBT: (refer to 3rd column)



(Core 0 temperature is reflective of the temps after intital repasting)

Paste Application/Spread of Paste on Die/Spread of Paste on IHS (back):


Anyone have any ideas as to why this is happening? I have not applied any paste on the back side of the IHS. I've only applied paste on the die, and have used the IHS clamping pressure to spread it. IHS paste was applied via pea method, spread by the NH-D14.

CLU is hard to find in Canada, so I'd like to try any other alternatives before having to purchase CLU.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## 0ldChicken

hate to say it @DavePC but most normal TIM will "pump out" like your has been doing. The only solution I know of is to use a liquid metal TIM like CLU/CLP or Phobya LM. I believe some others claim to be "pump out resistant" but I'm not sure.

The liquid metals are your best bet though


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DavePC*
> 
> Hey everyone, I've delidded my CPU for a while now, but every time I find one main issue.
> 
> Initially the temperatures are fine (however temps across cores are inconsistent), but after 3-4 days, the temperatures on 3 out of 4 cores sky rockets.
> 
> I've tried re applying TIM a few times now, and have tried placing both a thin line of paste on top of the die and spreading TIM on the die.
> 
> Delid was vice only method. I'm currently running at 4.4Ghz at 1.35V, 3570k. (yeah, my chip is not great) Heatsink is NH-D14, using NT-H1 on both IHS and die.
> 
> Temperatures after 5 runs of IBT: (refer to 3rd column)
> 
> 
> 
> (Core 0 temperature is reflective of the temps after intital repasting)
> 
> Paste Application/Spread of Paste on Die/Spread of Paste on IHS (back):
> 
> 
> Anyone have any ideas as to why this is happening? I have not applied any paste on the back side of the IHS. I've only applied paste on the die, and have used the IHS clamping pressure to spread it. IHS paste was applied via pea method, spread by the NH-D14.
> 
> CLU is hard to find in Canada, so I'd like to try any other alternatives before having to purchase CLU.
> 
> Any help would be greatly appreciated!


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> hate to say it @DavePC but most normal TIM will "pump out" like your has been doing. The only solution I know of is to use a liquid metal TIM like CLU/CLP or Phobya LM. I believe some others claim to be "pump out resistant" but I'm not sure.
> 
> The liquid metals are your best bet though


He is 100% correct, CLU can't be that hard to find in Canada, its super hard to find in France even though its made in Germany haha. Best bet is to order from the US somewhere near the border if oyu are, theres a certain limit for price where you wont have to pay taxes so should be fine.

Theres maybe a couple at most, of TIMs that will last a while on the die. Everyone keeps rambling that the issue is the intel TIM but intel TIM is AMAZING stuff. How do i know? Because huh it doesnt pump out over YEARS. Its thick stuff, with a bit of silver in it and is amazing thermal paste. The issue is the gap between the IHS and die that are the issues. Thats it. its been proven over and over and theres an entire thread online. You need some real thick thermal paste, since the heat is so direct and in a confined space it tends to get thin real quick and will "pump out". My noctua TIM only lasted a couple days before it changed. CLU/CLP/ or any other liquid metal is the best to use. Look for Conductonaut, CLU/CLP, Phobya. Whatever you can find, there most all made out of the same material so it wont make much difference in the temp department.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DavePC*
> 
> CLU is hard to find in Canada, so I'd like to try any other alternatives before having to purchase CLU.


I purchased my CLU directly from Coolaboratory, the cost worked out lower than buying it from the US, and they mailed it out quickly:
http://www.coollaboratory.com/product/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/


----------



## inedenimadam

^big shout for phyobia LM if you cant get CLU. It was 1/2 the cost of CLU last time i ordered, and was available on amazon.


----------



## DavePC

Thanks for the help everyone, looks like I'll be picking up CLU and trying that out.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> I purchased my CLU directly from Coolaboratory, the cost worked out lower than buying it from the US, and they mailed it out quickly:
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/product/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/


How long did it take for them to ship it, and how long did it take to arrive from the shipping date?


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DavePC*
> 
> Thanks for the help everyone, looks like I'll be picking up CLU and trying that out.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> I purchased my CLU directly from Coolaboratory, the cost worked out lower than buying it from the US, and they mailed it out quickly:
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/product/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/
> 
> 
> 
> How long did it take for them to ship it, and how long did it take to arrive from the shipping date?
Click to expand...

Wasn't too long:

They filled and shipped the order a couple days after I ordered it, and it took about a week to get here from Germany.

Edit:
That was shipped via parcel post.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> hate to say it @DavePC but most normal TIM will "pump out" like your has been doing. The only solution I know of is to use a liquid metal TIM like CLU/CLP or Phobya LM. I believe some others claim to be "pump out resistant" but I'm not sure.
> 
> The liquid metals are your best bet though


I think I finally figured out why the pump out effect happen more often to delidded chips compared to normal heatsinks on the IHS. Lets see if I'm not as crazy as I normally am









So with normal heatsinks and the pressure applied to the IHS, most normal TIM, non liquid or metal type, pump out, but very slowly and over many many months and years. If we apply a hypothesis of pressure to area ratio and use the heatsink on the IHS as the standard we can illustarte that as a 1:1 ratio of surface area to surface area (IHS/heatsink or waterblock). This would be backed up from the IHS and base of many/all heatsinks/waterblocks being the same size or slightly larger than the IHS. So when most people apply their TIM it's either in the middle (pea sized application) or by a means of the X (two lines crossed), little TIM makes it to the far outer edges really. This then would hold true to a minimal amount of "pump out" effect for normal application. Additionally, with so much distance for the TIM to travel to become pumped out the likelihood falls dramatically.

Looking at the other scenario now of a delidded chip, just take into consideration the size of the die compared to the IHS. I'm spitballing here in terms of surface area but lets say its 1/5th the size (die/IHS size difference). So compared to before having a 1:1 ratio for normal non delidded chips, a delidded chip's die would have a 1:5 ratio of surface area to surface area (die/IHS). My thought would then be, having a standard approach to TIM placement wont really fit the bill due to the size difference. The size difference for the TIM to travel for a pump out effect would be so small that it'll easily pump out even after a short amount of time.

Things that haven't even been taken into account are pressures and even heat application for a more viscous TIM.

I think the reason liquid metal holds so well is because it is a liquid, which has a much higher tension ratio compared to other forms of TIM states. Technically normal TIM is a liquid, but it's much more solidified, often referred to as a "paste".

Not trying to sound like a scientist here, but the thought popped into my head and I thought people would find it interesting!







End Vagur sciencey thoguht process!


----------



## 0ldChicken

I just ordered my EK precise mount with some other things from ppcs and I should be naked by next weekend! i love saying that!







It's been really fun pushing my pc closer to it's limits and I can't thank you guys enough for helping to make it possible! I never saw myself doing things like delidding a $300+ cpu and running 5.0ghz 24/7 but the addiction is real and I'm loving it! I can't wait to see whats next... I was eyeballing an old window ac in my basement this afternoon







....

@Valgaur do you think if one could create a plate to make an even surface around the die then perhaps regular TIM could be used? It'd have to be a tight fit and I'm not sure why anyone would go to the trouble but that's an interesting theory you've got going on


----------



## GTRtank

So gents, did some testing over the last few days with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut and CLU. Used firstrike stress test for each. All fans and pumps set to 70% on PWM. (6x EKVardar 120 2200rpm, and 4x EKVarder 140 2000rpm) Here are my findings:

CLU:
Ambient at start of test: 23.88
GPU Idle: 25c
GPU temp when full load is applied: 37c
Ambient Air at end of test: 25.2c
Max load temp: 41-42c (fluctuated between the two.)

Thermal Grizzly:
Ambient at start of test: 24.9
GPU idle: 27c
GPU temp when full load is applied: 39c
Ambient air at end of test: 25.8
Max load temp: 43c

Overall, not a huge difference, 0.5-1c. Both acted the same when load was taken off, temps drop down to around the coolant temp. (32-33c at the end both tests) Both of these TIMs are a PITA to clean up, so really the choice is your preference. In this case, I am going to just use thermal grizzly for my TIM, only because I would like to resell the GPU and block, since CLU leaves a nice impression on both... haha.

Now, as far as air cooling goes, I saw quiet a difference on my 970's, 5c from memory. Since liquid cooling heat transfer is already so good, I don't think using the CLU really helps that much. (IMHO.)


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> So gents, did some testing over the last few days with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut and CLU. Used firstrike stress test for each. All fans and pumps set to 70% on PWM. (6x EKVardar 120 2200rpm, and 4x EKVarder 140 2000rpm) Here are my findings:
> 
> CLU:
> Ambient at start of test: 23.88
> GPU Idle: 25c
> GPU temp when full load is applied: 37c
> Ambient Air at end of test: 25.2c
> Max load temp: 41-42c (fluctuated between the two.)
> 
> Thermal Grizzly:
> Ambient at start of test: 24.9
> GPU idle: 27c
> GPU temp when full load is applied: 39c
> Ambient air at end of test: 25.8
> Max load temp: 43c
> 
> Overall, not a huge difference, 0.5-1c. Both acted the same when load was taken off, temps drop down to around the coolant temp. (32-33c at the end both tests) Both of these TIMs are a PITA to clean up, so really the choice is your preference. In this case, I am going to just use thermal grizzly for my TIM, only because I would like to resell the GPU and block, since CLU leaves a nice impression on both... haha.
> 
> Now, as far as air cooling goes, I saw quiet a difference on my 970's, 5c from memory. Since liquid cooling heat transfer is already so good, I don't think using the CLU really helps that much. (IMHO.)


Now you need to test Phobya LM







. Was on newegg for half price of CLU last I saw


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Now you need to test Phobya LM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Was on newegg for half price of CLU last I saw


Yeah I would, all the reviews I have seen put it a little behind these TIMs, well Grizzly being even with it. I think with the CPU the difference between all of them would be greater, but the GPU watercooled just doesn't put out a lot of heat. Now, on my delidded CPU @ 1.45v I think I would see a difference.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Yeah I would, all the reviews I have seen put it a little behind these TIMs, well Grizzly being even with it. I think with the CPU the difference between all of them would be greater, but the GPU watercooled just doesn't put out a lot of heat. Now, on my delidded CPU @ 1.45v I think I would see a difference.


Everything I have seen shows the Phobya LM performing better as far as heat dissipation but I have not seen many actually tests.

http://overclocking.guide/thermal-paste-roundup-2015-47-products-tested-with-air-cooling-and-liquid-nitrogen-ln2/6/

I did find someone here showing that Phobya is in fact worse then both CLU/CLP but the one post is basically all I could find. I am sure there are others but I haven't looked deeply. So far I am happy with the Phobya LM but I am still wondering if I would do better with CLU.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Everything I have seen shows the Phobya LM performing better as far as heat dissipation but I have not seen many actually tests.
> 
> http://overclocking.guide/thermal-paste-roundup-2015-47-products-tested-with-air-cooling-and-liquid-nitrogen-ln2/6/
> 
> I did find someone here showing that Phobya is in fact worse then both CLU/CLP but the one post is basically all I could find. I am sure there are others but I haven't looked deeply. So far I am happy with the Phobya LM but I am still wondering if I would do better with CLU.


The maybe 1°C difference youll see isnt worth switching.

All the reviews you read are either for LM/TIM used between a heatsink and ihs, theres not many, if any reviews that test it as on die liquid metals. They are pretty much all the same, the w/mk is pretty irrelevant anyways as its temperature in Kelvin and not Celcius like every pc sensor is.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The maybe 1°C difference youll see isnt worth switching.
> 
> All the reviews you read are either for LM/TIM used between a heatsink and ihs, theres not many, if any reviews that test it as on die liquid metals. They are pretty much all the same, the w/mk is pretty irrelevant anyways as its temperature in Kelvin and not Celcius like every pc sensor is.


Haha yeah I was thinking that as I was taking off the CLU, I was like, I just wasted this LM. Oh well, for the sake of science. When I go bare die though I'll test all 3, since I'll use less. The numbers I got were well within the margin of error as well. I mean 1c is nothing.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Haha yeah I was thinking that as I was taking off the CLU, I was like, I just wasted this LM. Oh well, for the sake of science. When I go bare die though I'll test all 3, since I'll use less. The numbers I got were well within the margin of error as well. I mean 1c is nothing.


And heres one that will shock people haha. At 1.2v on my 4690k between NH-T1/Hydronaut/CLU, running bare die my temps were all within a margin of error. I got 48°C with Noctua and i got 48°C with CLU. So it's pretty much identical and both made no difference. Biggest drawback though is the pump out. I kinda wish i had some actual Intel TIM to test though.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And heres one that will shock people haha. At 1.2v on my 4690k between NH-T1/Hydronaut/CLU, running bare die my temps were all within a margin of error. I got 48°C with Noctua and i got 48°C with CLU. So it's pretty much identical and both made no difference. Biggest drawback though is the pump out. I kinda wish i had some actual Intel TIM to test though.


Won't shock me one bit, the 3 best TIMs are those. They are all great, and yeah the pump out sucks, and so does the staining on the die. But I'm super happy with the hydronaut, and NH-T1. Both great non conductive pastes. Really can't get better.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> So gents, did some testing over the last few days with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut and CLU. Used firstrike stress test for each. All fans and pumps set to 70% on PWM. (6x EKVardar 120 2200rpm, and 4x EKVarder 140 2000rpm) Here are my findings:
> 
> CLU:
> Ambient at start of test: 23.88
> GPU Idle: 25c
> GPU temp when full load is applied: 37c
> Ambient Air at end of test: 25.2c
> Max load temp: 41-42c (fluctuated between the two.)
> 
> Thermal Grizzly:
> Ambient at start of test: 24.9
> GPU idle: 27c
> GPU temp when full load is applied: 39c
> Ambient air at end of test: 25.8
> Max load temp: 43c
> 
> Overall, not a huge difference, 0.5-1c. Both acted the same when load was taken off, temps drop down to around the coolant temp. (32-33c at the end both tests) Both of these TIMs are a PITA to clean up, so really the choice is your preference. In this case, I am going to just use thermal grizzly for my TIM, only because I would like to resell the GPU and block, since CLU leaves a nice impression on both... haha.
> 
> Now, as far as air cooling goes, I saw quiet a difference on my 970's, 5c from memory. Since liquid cooling heat transfer is already so good, I don't think using the CLU really helps that much. (IMHO.)


Very close results between the two.

Interesting that you found the Thermal Grizzly doesn't stain the block to the same degree as CLU.

Thanks for doing the testing and posting the results.
Rep+


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think I finally figured out why the pump out effect happen more often to delidded chips compared to normal heatsinks on the IHS. Lets see if I'm not as crazy as I normally am
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So with normal heatsinks and the pressure applied to the IHS, most normal TIM, non liquid or metal type, pump out, but very slowly and over many many months and years. If we apply a hypothesis of pressure to area ratio and use the heatsink on the IHS as the standard we can illustarte that as a 1:1 ratio of surface area to surface area (IHS/heatsink or waterblock). This would be backed up from the IHS and base of many/all heatsinks/waterblocks being the same size or slightly larger than the IHS. So when most people apply their TIM it's either in the middle (pea sized application) or by a means of the X (two lines crossed), little TIM makes it to the far outer edges really. This then would hold true to a minimal amount of "pump out" effect for normal application. Additionally, with so much distance for the TIM to travel to become pumped out the likelihood falls dramatically.
> 
> Looking at the other scenario now of a delidded chip, just take into consideration the size of the die compared to the IHS. I'm spitballing here in terms of surface area but lets say its 1/5th the size (die/IHS size difference). So compared to before having a 1:1 ratio for normal non delidded chips, a delidded chip's die would have a 1:5 ratio of surface area to surface area (die/IHS). My thought would then be, having a standard approach to TIM placement wont really fit the bill due to the size difference. The size difference for the TIM to travel for a pump out effect would be so small that it'll easily pump out even after a short amount of time.
> 
> Things that haven't even been taken into account are pressures and even heat application for a more viscous TIM.
> 
> I think the reason liquid metal holds so well is because it is a liquid, which has a much higher tension ratio compared to other forms of TIM states. Technically normal TIM is a liquid, but it's much more solidified, often referred to as a "paste".
> 
> Not trying to sound like a scientist here, but the thought popped into my head and I thought people would find it interesting!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> End Vagur sciencey thoguht process!


I like the theorizing, and just thought of something else myself.

The IHS is concave as can be seen when people sand/lap them...The concave surface could theoretically aid in reducing pump out...I wonder if people who sand/lap the IHS to be perfectly flat experience pump out at an expedited rate?


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Very close results between the two.
> 
> Interesting that you found the Thermal Grizzly doesn't stain the block to the same degree as CLU.
> 
> Thanks for doing the testing and posting the results.
> Rep+


Yeah very close, if not identical. (within the margin of error) Yeah, actually check this out, I have had the grizzly on for about 2 weeks, no stain. Then I did this test, left the CLU on overnight and while I was cleaning I noticed it had already begun to stain the block. And some of the die print had come off.

Edit: Thanks man.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I think I finally figured out why the pump out effect happen more often to delidded chips compared to normal heatsinks on the IHS. Lets see if I'm not as crazy as I normally am
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So with normal heatsinks and the pressure applied to the IHS, most normal TIM, non liquid or metal type, pump out, but very slowly and over many many months and years. If we apply a hypothesis of pressure to area ratio and use the heatsink on the IHS as the standard we can illustarte that as a 1:1 ratio of surface area to surface area (IHS/heatsink or waterblock). This would be backed up from the IHS and base of many/all heatsinks/waterblocks being the same size or slightly larger than the IHS. So when most people apply their TIM it's either in the middle (pea sized application) or by a means of the X (two lines crossed), little TIM makes it to the far outer edges really. This then would hold true to a minimal amount of "pump out" effect for normal application. Additionally, with so much distance for the TIM to travel to become pumped out the likelihood falls dramatically.
> 
> Looking at the other scenario now of a delidded chip, just take into consideration the size of the die compared to the IHS. I'm spitballing here in terms of surface area but lets say its 1/5th the size (die/IHS size difference). So compared to before having a 1:1 ratio for normal non delidded chips, a delidded chip's die would have a 1:5 ratio of surface area to surface area (die/IHS). My thought would then be, having a standard approach to TIM placement wont really fit the bill due to the size difference. The size difference for the TIM to travel for a pump out effect would be so small that it'll easily pump out even after a short amount of time.
> 
> Things that haven't even been taken into account are pressures and even heat application for a more viscous TIM.
> 
> I think the reason liquid metal holds so well is because it is a liquid, which has a much higher tension ratio compared to other forms of TIM states. Technically normal TIM is a liquid, but it's much more solidified, often referred to as a "paste".
> 
> Not trying to sound like a scientist here, but the thought popped into my head and I thought people would find it interesting!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> End Vagur sciencey thoguht process!


My theory is the thermal coefficient expansion differences between Cu(17pp/C°) and Si(3.1ppm/C°) even at this miniscule amount will allow the IHS expand more than the Die. With thermal cycling will cause "pump out"
Theory to prove this would have a steady load to minimise temp fluctuations and see if "pump out" occurs.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> My theory is the thermal coefficient expansion differences between Cu(17pp/C°) and Si(3.1ppm/C°) even at this miniscule amount will allow the IHS expand more than the Die. With thermal cycling will cause "pump out"
> Theory to prove this would have a steady load to minimise temp fluctuations and see if "pump out" occurs.


Thats an interesting take as well. Hadn't thought about the material expansion differences, although minor, would have an impact


----------



## blasc

hey guys. Been lurking the forums for several years, but this will be my first post (if I remember right).

I'm about to delid my 4790K and I will use the 3D printed piece + Vice method. (https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool)

This delid can be considered an "entry level" one, since I will be reapplying the IHS and I will use Thermal Grizzly instead of CLU.

*Now for the 3 questions that brought me here:*
- Regarding the alcohol to be used, is it REALLY advised to use isopropyl alcohol? or can it be the regular house alcohol normally used for injuries and stuff? I ask this because I can only find 1L selling around, and that is way too much more than I need.
- After all is done, is it necessary to reapply silicone/adhesive between the PCB and IHS? I've read around that all I need to do is put the IHS back into place without any silcone, but wanted to make sure.
- Finally I'm thinking of lapping the IHS. After the lapping is done, what do you advise me to use for cleaning the IHS? (since the lapping will be done with sandpaper + oil)

Sory if some of these questions are kind of noobish, but I was planning on doing all the procedure next weekend (in 3 days time), and I'm getting kind of stressed out.

Finally, and on a side note, if any thermal paste is left unused, I plan on switching the TIM from my GTX 970 (Gigabyte G1). Any advice? worth it, not worth it? The card is 1 year old so..... I just wanted to go for it, just for the "thrills"

Edit: I've been interested in doing this for the last ~5 months, but I've finally decided to go for it. Don't bash me much if anything posted here is "stupid". The stress is kind of killing me...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blasc*
> 
> hey guys. Been lurking the forums for several years, but this will be my first post (if I remember right).
> 
> I'm about to delid my 4790K and I will use the 3D printed piece + Vice method. (https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool)
> 
> This delid can be considered an "entry level" one, since I will be reapplying the IHS and I will use Thermal Grizzly instead of CLU.
> 
> *Now for the 3 questions that brought me here:*
> - Regarding the alcohol to be used, is it REALLY advised to use isopropyl alcohol? or can it be the regular house alcohol normally used for injuries and stuff? I ask this because I can only find 1L selling around, and that is way too much more than I need.
> - After all is done, is it necessary to reapply silicone/adhesive between the PCB and IHS? I've read around that all I need to do is put the IHS back into place without any silcone, but wanted to make sure.
> - Finally I'm thinking of lapping the IHS. After the lapping is done, what do you advise me to use for cleaning the IHS? (since the lapping will be done with sandpaper + oil)
> 
> Sory if some of these questions are kind of noobish, but I was planning on doing all the procedure next weekend (in 3 days time), and I'm getting kind of stressed out.
> 
> Finally, and on a side note, if any thermal paste is left unused, I plan on switching the TIM from my GTX 970 (Gigabyte G1). Any advice? worth it, not worth it? The card is 1 year old so..... I just wanted to go for it, just for the "thrills"
> 
> Edit: I've been interested in doing this for the last ~5 months, but I've finally decided to go for it. Don't bash me much if anything posted here is "stupid". The stress is kind of killing me...


1. This is very personal but also has been noticed by quite a lot of people. That TIM might not last long, and you might see the temps rise up quite fast sometimes within days or weeks. Unless your using thermal grizzly conductonaut then disregard statement haha.

2. You can use any alcohol that removes grease/oil etc. Needs to be super clean so then tim/lm can be applied cleanly.

3. You dont need to reapply silicone, its part of the issue. Some people like to, most of us don't and its not an issue.

4. Lapping the IHS will gain you even better temps depending on the heatsink/waterblock. Personally if i was lapping the IHS id lap the waterblock/heatsink as well. The flatter both are the less TIM will be between em, the greater the thermal efficiency will be. You should clean that up with some alcohol or a degreaser then alcohol. Just something to get all the oil off, you could always sand it with oil, then sand it a couple times very slightly without oil to make sure its super clean.

Hope that helps.


----------



## blasc

thanks for the tips. But now you left me "hanging" with the Grizzly issue... (i ordered Kryonaut).

From all the research and reviews I found, it is supposedly the best nowadays, even better than gelid....


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blasc*
> 
> thanks for the tips. But now you left me "hanging" with the Grizzly issue... (i ordered Kryonaut).
> 
> From all the research and reviews I found, it is supposedly the best nowadays, even better than gelid....


Thats true, but also every test is for TIMs ON the IHS and not on the actual die. Quite a few of us (myself included using 3 different TIMs) have found that TIMs just don't last long on the bare die. Either they pump out or thin out and don't work as well. Its why ive said it time and time again, intel TIM is probably the best of all.

Ive tried Hydronaut, NH-T1 and Gelid extreme on bare die and my temps shot thru the roof after a couple days to a week. The temps were IDENTICAL, in my case, to CLU but CLU does not change viscosity and hence the temps dont change over time.

For the IHS you can pretty much using, all the temps are pretty much identical.


----------



## blasc

That being the case, I'll just have to wait and see how it goes. If it turns out to be as you say (lets hope not







), I guess I'll just order some CLU, cover the capacitors on the PCB, and go liquid.

Thanks for all the help. I'll come around in some days to post how it went


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blasc*
> 
> That being the case, I'll just have to wait and see how it goes. If it turns out to be as you say (lets hope not
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ), I guess I'll just order some CLU, cover the capacitors on the PCB, and go liquid.
> 
> Thanks for all the help. I'll come around in some days to post how it went


Yea i really wish you luck man, i havent tried Kryonaut yet as every place ive looked never has it in stock. It could be that Kryonaut is one of the few that works on die but i wont hold my breath haha.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i really wish you luck man, i havent tried Kryonaut yet as every place ive looked never has it in stock. It could be that Kryonaut is one of the few that works on die but i wont hold my breath haha.


Yeah I was going to do the same thing since I had so much paste laying around but after talking to you and a few others I decided to wait for Phobya LM. Glad I did because it is not fun trying to line up everything and drop it in smoothly, having to do it twice now on a 2nd motherboard I am happy to not have to do it again and cleaning up paste on the die would have been a pain especially if it ran out or gunked up the pins.

I would personally recommend waiting or just ordering the LM and expecting the worst. If your lucky it might work but as far as I know nobody has found any TIM that really works aside from the original Intel TIM. Would be interesting to try some pump-out resistant TIMs not sure if anyone here has tried any but if Kryonaut doesn't say pump-out resistant I would not even use it. Could turn into a mess.


----------



## blasc

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Yeah I was going to do the same thing since I had so much paste laying around but after talking to you and a few others I decided to wait for Phobya LM. Glad I did because it is not fun trying to line up everything and drop it in smoothly, having to do it twice now on a 2nd motherboard I am happy to not have to do it again and cleaning up paste on the die would have been a pain especially if it ran out or gunked up the pins.
> 
> I would personally recommend waiting or just ordering the LM and expecting the worst. If your lucky it might work but as far as I know nobody has found any TIM that really works aside from the original Intel TIM. Would be interesting to try some pump-out resistant TIMs not sure if anyone here has tried any but if Kryonaut doesn't say pump-out resistant I would not even use it. Could turn into a mess.


Soooo... You're saying NOT to use kryonaut and order phobya instead? didn't get your post completely to be honest.

Btw, isnt CLU supposed to be better than phobya? (from the reviews I searched around the net)


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blasc*
> 
> Soooo... You're saying NOT to use kryonaut and order phobya instead? didn't get your post completely to be honest.
> 
> Btw, isnt CLU supposed to be better than phobya? (from the reviews I searched around the net)


Just pick any LM TIM for your die and ihs or die and waterblock, it really won't matter. Once you remove your thermal limits the next thing you'll hit is your voltage walls.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blasc*
> 
> Soooo... You're saying NOT to use kryonaut and order phobya instead? didn't get your post completely to be honest.
> 
> Btw, isnt CLU supposed to be better than phobya? (from the reviews I searched around the net)


Well you need a TIM for ontop of the IHS anyways so you got Kryonaut for that which will be good but CLU would likely be best for underneath the IHS. As far as I know CLU is the better of the LM pastes. I just happened to get Phobya because it was like $8 on newegg vs $20ish for CLU at the time.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Kryonaut will pump out too. I tried on my initial delid and it lasted about 2 weeks. Tried twice before going lm


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Kryonaut will pump out too. I tried on my initial delid and it lasted about 2 weeks. Tried twice before going lm


My Noctua was the fastest, lasted about 2 days haha.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> My Noctua was the fastest, lasted about 2 days haha.


haha I could totally see that! I tried mx4 once and it was about the same, 2 days and my temps were headed for the hills.
Btw: naked mount hardware just arrived at my house! Now to try and ditch work so I can get started on MY long list of things to do! It's gonna be a huge pain to blitz my loop


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> My Noctua was the fastest, lasted about 2 days haha.


Same thing happened with direct die mount for me with Kryonaut and my XSPC Raystorm.

If you can find Xigmatek PTI-G4512 it will NOT pump out. My direct die application lasted ~2 years without any problems. Despite it's very low thermal conductance rating, I've found it works just as well temp wise as the main players in the TIM game.

I recently found an eBay auction for some and bought 2 tubes; they're in route from Taiwan.


----------



## Ceadderman

Gonna be putting together a 4790k Twitch rig for a friend of my brother's.

Kinda sucks that I've gotta wait for Sabertooth to break free in order to get it built, but thems the breaks when you're looking at building a system 2 generations behind the current release.

I have a EK 240 Predator coming for him so am not sure that I will contemplate delidding this chip, but still may get to do it. Sad thing is he's not an OC'er at all, so I talked him down from the RoG boards since it made no sense to spend so much.

Putting a 750 EVO SSD in his build, already has Win7 OS for it. Should be pretty speedy for his needs. Also he's picking up a R9 390 Nitro with this build. So man am I gonna be skippin round the tulips in the coming week.









I will open a build log when I get time, but one that is a rehash of what went down. Not a piecemeal log in the least.









~Ceadder


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Gonna be putting together a 4790k Twitch rig for a friend of my brother's.
> 
> Kinda sucks that I've gotta wait for Sabertooth to break free in order to get it built, but thems the breaks when you're looking at building a system 2 generations behind the current release.
> 
> I have a EK 240 Predator coming for him so am not sure that I will contemplate delidding this chip, but still may get to do it. Sad thing is he's not an OC'er at all, so I talked him down from the RoG boards since it made no sense to spend so much.
> 
> Putting a 750 EVO SSD in his build, already has Win7 OS for it. Should be pretty speedy for his needs. Also he's picking up a R9 390 Nitro with this build. So man am I gonna be skippin round the tulips in the coming week.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will open a build log when I get time, but one that is a rehash of what went down. Not a piecemeal log in the least.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


nice! I'm always trying to get people I know to let me build a pc for them but nothing that fancy, so far









I also probably wouldn't "risk" a delid if he's not an oc'er but I bet he'll ask you do it when you show him dem gains!

are you looking for a sabertooth or re-using one? They're sweet boards! I've got a brand new "armor" kit sitting around, if that opens up your options at all PM me


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Interesting note... Just so you guys know... I can't delid my 2500k... but I'll have a 6700k soon and I'll be delidding that... Check out my CLU application after about 2 months...



I'm pretty sure my application was too thick since after about a month I noticed a 5-7C increase in temps all of a sudden...heck this PK-1 I just put on is doing nearly the same temps...
The CLU was all dried up and there were particles of metal that were completely stuck to both the CPU and cooler. I had to lapp the entire cooler and CPU again just to get the surface back to flat without the fused metals... I'm sure if I had a thinner application I would have had better results.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Interesting note... Just so you guys know... I can't delid my 2500k... but I'll have a 6700k soon and I'll be delidding that... Check out my CLU application after about 2 months...
> 
> 
> 
> I'm pretty sure my application was too thick since after about a month I noticed a 5-7C increase in temps all of a sudden...heck this PK-1 I just put on is doing nearly the same temps...
> The CLU was all dried up and there were particles of metal that were completely stuck to both the CPU and cooler. I had to lapp the entire cooler and CPU again just to get the surface back to flat without the fused metals... I'm sure if I had a thinner application I would have had better results.


Yea that def does look like quite a lot, can tell by the overflow of CLU you have.


----------



## Duality92

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Interesting note... Just so you guys know... I can't delid my 2500k... but I'll have a 6700k soon and I'll be delidding that... Check out my CLU application after about 2 months...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm pretty sure my application was too thick since after about a month I noticed a 5-7C increase in temps all of a sudden...heck this PK-1 I just put on is doing nearly the same temps...
> The CLU was all dried up and there were particles of metal that were completely stuck to both the CPU and cooler. I had to lapp the entire cooler and CPU again just to get the surface back to flat without the fused metals... I'm sure if I had a thinner application I would have had better results.


Sandy bridge is soldered, it never could be delidded.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Interesting note... Just so you guys know... I can't delid my 2500k... but I'll have a 6700k soon and I'll be delidding that... Check out my CLU application after about 2 months...
> 
> [...]
> 
> I'm pretty sure my application was too thick since after about a month I noticed a 5-7C increase in temps all of a sudden...heck this PK-1 I just put on is doing nearly the same temps...
> The CLU was all dried up and there were particles of metal that were completely stuck to both the CPU and cooler. I had to lapp the entire cooler and CPU again just to get the surface back to flat without the fused metals... I'm sure if I had a thinner application I would have had better results.


The reason for this should be the naked copper (without nickel plating) on the base of your cooler. The gallium in the CLU interacts with the copper, and both metals will change. Some gallium atoms move inside the copper and stain the cooler's surface, and some copper atoms move inside the CLU and change it so that it won't be a fluid anymore. I think what a thin application will do is protect you against the rising temperatures you have seen, but it won't protect you against the stain and the CLU hardening. You perhaps might not want to use CLU on lapped coolers and CPUs that don't have their nickel plating anymore.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> The reason for this should be the naked copper (without nickel plating) on the base of your cooler. The gallium in the CLU interacts with the copper, and both metals will change. Some gallium atoms move inside the copper and stain the cooler's surface, and some copper atoms move inside the CLU and change it so that it won't be a fluid anymore. I think what a thin application will do is protect you against the rising temperatures you have seen, but it won't protect you against the stain and the CLU hardening. You perhaps might not want to use CLU on lapped coolers and CPUs that don't have their nickel plating anymore.


Well no offense but thats just all false. We've already established that CLU is perfectly FINE on copper. I had mine on a bare copper block for 2months with CLU and that stuff wiped right off without an issue. Lots of people have also used it on bare die with waterblocks and haven't had it harden. Its a possibility that it was a bad batch of CLU and it hardened, i know the first syringe i got half the CLU was hard in the syringe and the second one i got was more viscous. Its a possibility.

I wouldnt say CLU hardens because its bare copper because his looked like it hardened on the nickel plating of the IHS anyways.


----------



## deepor

I think his IHS is also lapped like the cooler's base, so no nickel plating on it anymore.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I think his IHS is also lapped like the cooler's base, so no nickel plating on it anymore.


Could be i cant really tell. All i can tell from the picture is theres def way too much clu applied. It needs to be applied in an absolutely thin application. Its much less viscous then TIM so it gets where it needs to way easier with less amount needed.

Im not worried about the staining, if clu gets into the copper and fills in the pores and cracks thats a GOOD thing. I took mine off after a couple months and it absolutely came right off. It probably will etch, but as long as your temperatures are fine then i wouldnt worry. Theres tons of people on here who have run it under the IHS and have had no issues, and yes i know the die and IHS are both plated where they mate but lots of people have also run it between the IHS and copper waterblocks without issues.

I have seen a handful of people with issues and im wondering if clu sitting in a syringe for too long ends up breaking down somehow and possibly having humidity/water mixed in. I do know the first syringe of clu i bought and the second i just got last week seemed a bit different.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I think his IHS is also lapped like the cooler's base, so no nickel plating on it anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> Could be i cant really tell. All i can tell from the picture is theres def way too much clu applied. It needs to be applied in an absolutely thin application. Its much less viscous then TIM so it gets where it needs to way easier with less amount needed.
> 
> Im not worried about the staining, if clu gets into the copper and fills in the pores and cracks thats a GOOD thing. I took mine off after a couple months and it absolutely came right off. It probably will etch, but as long as your temperatures are fine then i wouldnt worry. Theres tons of people on here who have run it under the IHS and have had no issues, and yes i know the die and IHS are both plated where they mate but lots of people have also run it between the IHS and copper waterblocks without issues.
> 
> I have seen a handful of people with issues and im wondering if clu sitting in a syringe for too long ends up breaking down somehow and possibly having humidity/water mixed in. I do know the first syringe of clu i bought and the second i just got last week seemed a bit different.
Click to expand...

To clarify a few points from my earlier post...
1. I know there's no negative effects of the CLU absorbing into the copper base. IF anything, there's microscratches filled by the CLU which will only help thermal conductivity.
2. The CPU and cooler are both lapped. Nickel plating removed on both.
3. Yea, I used too much...I know that now after I've seen these temp increases...
4. 2500k is soldered, never intended to delid. Planning on delidding my 6700k that I'll have in the near future.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Gonna be putting together a 4790k Twitch rig for a friend of my brother's.
> 
> Kinda sucks that I've gotta wait for Sabertooth to break free in order to get it built, but thems the breaks when you're looking at building a system 2 generations behind the current release.
> 
> I have a EK 240 Predator coming for him so am not sure that I will contemplate delidding this chip, but still may get to do it. Sad thing is he's not an OC'er at all, so I talked him down from the RoG boards since it made no sense to spend so much.
> 
> Putting a 750 EVO SSD in his build, already has Win7 OS for it. Should be pretty speedy for his needs. Also he's picking up a R9 390 Nitro with this build. So man am I gonna be skippin round the tulips in the coming week.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will open a build log when I get time, but one that is a rehash of what went down. Not a piecemeal log in the least.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nice! I'm always trying to get people I know to let me build a pc for them but nothing that fancy, so far
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also probably wouldn't "risk" a delid if he's not an oc'er but I bet he'll ask you do it when you show him dem gains!
> 
> are you looking for a sabertooth or re-using one? They're sweet boards! I've got a brand new "armor" kit sitting around, if that opens up your options at all PM me
Click to expand...

Actually we changed it up because he doesn't wish to wait for a board and he doesn't want a used board. For that kind of ka-ching, can't say I blame him.









So he settled on an "ASUS Z97-PRO GAMER LGA" board. Still allows minor overclocking but ended up costing less than Sabertooth which admittedly where he was concerned was a bit of overkill for a Twitch system. Still it would've been nice to get him on that board since the CPU cooler won't be blowing across the Mosfets as well as a stock cooler does. There are minor issues that crop up when ditching the stock cooler. Sure a premium cooler does ten times better than the stock cooler. But the problem with a loop is there are penalty hits, like cooling Mosfets and VRMs take a pontential hit when dealing with a high end board. I'll likely fix that with an extra fan blowing across the CPU. With that Nitro in the case, Intake is out since it would simply push the heat down with only one exhaust fan to draw it out. No bueno.









Is a 6700 even deliddable? I thought the IHS was soldered on that puppy?









~Ceadder


----------



## 0ldChicken

That's a shame @Ceadderman, compromises are sad really








I really wanted one so I found a new board with "no armor" for a decent price and found the armor new separatly, still cost too much though not as much. I ended up receiving an armor edition mobo instead by mistake and was out of town so I couldn't return the armor I bought. Someday it'll get used...

skylake is just pasted in, just the PCB is a little thin and has caused a few more problems but nothing too crazy. Mostly people running naked and bending pcb


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> That's a shame @Ceadderman, compromises are sad really
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I really wanted one so I found a new board with "no armor" for a decent price and found the armor new separatly, still cost too much though not as much. I ended up receiving an armor edition mobo instead by mistake and was out of town so I couldn't return the armor I bought. Someday it'll get used...
> 
> skylake is just pasted in, just the PCB is a little thin and has caused a few more problems but nothing too crazy. Mostly people running naked and bending pcb


You got some info on the naked mounts they're doing for skylake? Asking because I want to run naked when I upgrade.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> You got some info on the naked mounts they're doing for skylake? Asking because I want to run naked when I upgrade.


aqua computer seems to be the only one who makes a shim for the skylake pcb. Im not sure how well it works but would be cool to see. Also it does sit lower in the socket so socket modification is probably a must.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I have seen a handful of people with issues and im wondering if clu sitting in a syringe for too long ends up breaking down somehow and possibly having humidity/water mixed in. I do know the first syringe of clu i bought and the second i just got last week seemed a bit different.


This happened to me as well. First CLU I got was fine. Second, was very firm and blasted out more than 50% of it at once (thank God my CPU was out of the socket). It was basically impossible to spread without forming big clumps. Needless to say I asked Amazon for a refund. The replacement they sent was like the first.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> This happened to me as well. First CLU I got was fine. Second, was very firm and blasted out more than 50% of it at once (thank God my CPU was out of the socket). It was basically impossible to spread without forming big clumps. Needless to say I asked Amazon for a refund. The replacement they sent was like the first.


I had this issue too, except I'm use to syringes etc so when I felt the resistence I knew what would happen, about 3 mins later the hard bit of CLU was removed and it's been great since. Didn't wan't to faff about with refunds and replacements, wasn't worth the hassle.


----------



## EvilWiffles

I'm skeptical about what my CLU would look like once I remove the H100i block. Had this application for little over a year, temps have been the same since then. Temp averages 56c on 4790k @ 4.7GHz 1.236v.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> aqua computer seems to be the only one who makes a shim for the skylake pcb. Im not sure how well it works but would be cool to see. Also it does sit lower in the socket so socket modification is probably a must.


It isn't a shim, it's more like a brace to help reduce pcb bending. Looks cool though! If I can find one locally I'll try it out.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It isn't a shim, it's more like a brace to help reduce pcb bending. Looks cool though! If I can find one locally I'll try it out.


Yea they call it a shim idk why haha.

Aquacomputer isnt too hard to find in Europe, a lot easier then in the US.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It isn't a shim, it's more like a brace to help reduce pcb bending. Looks cool though! If I can find one locally I'll try it out.
> 
> 
> 
> Yea they call it a shim idk why haha.
> 
> Aquacomputer isnt too hard to find in Europe, a lot easier then in the US.
Click to expand...

Cause honestly it *is* a shim. If you've ever worked with furniture(specifically antique furniture) there are times you need to put a shim under a leg to level the piece.

Well the manufacturer is likely European in origin and translation considers it a shim for the CPU cooler.









So yes it is a shim, but not in the way that we consider it a shim. It's not leveling anything other than keeping the block a proper distance from the die so as not to break, crack or beat it to death.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Cause honestly it *is* a shim. If you've ever worked with furniture(specifically antique furniture) there are times you need to put a shim under a leg to level the piece.
> 
> Well the manufacturer is likely European in origin and translation considers it a shim for the CPU cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So yes it is a shim, but not in the way that we consider it a shim. It's not leveling anything other than keeping the block a proper distance from the die so as not to break, crack or beat it to death.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Actually sorry to say but you're wrong haha. It doesnt keep the block from doing anything. it pretty much reinforces the skylake wafer. It does NOT come in contact with the block at all. Its pretty much a 1mm solid aluminum. You can see it sits SLIGHTLY below the actual die.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Cause honestly it *is* a shim. If you've ever worked with furniture(specifically antique furniture) there are times you need to put a shim under a leg to level the piece.
> 
> Well the manufacturer is likely European in origin and translation considers it a shim for the CPU cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So yes it is a shim, but not in the way that we consider it a shim. It's not leveling anything other than keeping the block a proper distance from the die so as not to break, crack or beat it to death.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


That's a fair comment, but nothing touches the brace, it's using double sided tape to reinforce the PCB by sticking it to metal. There is no pressure on the brace so it's not stopping the die from getting damaged.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Cause honestly it *is* a shim. If you've ever worked with furniture(specifically antique furniture) there are times you need to put a shim under a leg to level the piece.
> 
> Well the manufacturer is likely European in origin and translation considers it a shim for the CPU cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So yes it is a shim, but not in the way that we consider it a shim. It's not leveling anything other than keeping the block a proper distance from the die so as not to break, crack or beat it to death.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's a fair comment, but nothing touches the brace, it's using double sided tape to reinforce the PCB by sticking it to metal. There is no pressure on the brace so it's not stopping the die from getting damaged.
Click to expand...

Sorry guys, I was thinking of the MSi bare die bracket. Which is indeed a shim. Although that piece would qualify as a shim as well. Though am not sure what it actually does/accomplish. Looks kinda unnecessary if you catch my drift. Oh I get it now. Thin pcb needing thin plate to stiffen the CPU. So if I've got this figured out, it indeed qualifies as a shim.
















~Ceadder


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> I'm skeptical about what my CLU would look like once I remove the H100i block. Had this application for little over a year, temps have been the same since then. Temp averages 56c on 4790k @ 4.7GHz 1.236v.


Had mine on the NH-D15 for a year, just removed it when I went to my current setup. Looks pretty much the same, just a little bit of a PITA to get off. Just keep rubbing till you aren't getting anymore black residue on your paper towel or whatever you are using.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Actually sorry to say but you're wrong haha. It doesnt keep the block from doing anything. it pretty much reinforces the skylake wafer. It does NOT come in contact with the block at all. Its pretty much a 1mm solid aluminum. You can see it sits SLIGHTLY below the actual die.


That thing is BA!!!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Sorry guys, I was thinking of the MSi bare die bracket. Which is indeed a shim. Although that piece would qualify as a shim as well. Though am not sure what it actually does/accomplish. Looks kinda unnecessary if you catch my drift. Oh I get it now. Thin pcb needing thin plate to stiffen the CPU. So if I've got this figured out, it indeed qualifies as a shim.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Which one is that? And A shim fills a gap to mate two surfaces together or at least that's what I have been, taught, read, used?

You even used that definition yourself.
Quote:


> Cause honestly it is a shim. If you've ever worked with furniture(specifically antique furniture) there are times you need to put a shim under a leg to level the piece.


----------



## Jimbags

Anyone know of a good delid tool that works on Ivybridge and is cheaper than the more well known ones? I have done my 3570k with a razor and worked perfect. Just picked ul a 3770k and just dont want to risk it. TIA


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Anyone know of a good delid tool that works on Ivybridge and is cheaper than the more well known ones? I have done my 3570k with a razor and worked perfect. Just picked ul a 3770k and just dont want to risk it. TIA


Vice method would work perfectly if you don't wanna spend, providing you have one, theres a good twisting one a few pages back.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Sorry guys, I was thinking of the MSi bare die bracket. Which is indeed a shim. Although that piece would qualify as a shim as well. Though am not sure what it actually does/accomplish. Looks kinda unnecessary if you catch my drift. Oh I get it now. Thin pcb needing thin plate to stiffen the CPU. So if I've got this figured out, it indeed qualifies as a shim.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which one is that? And A shim fills a gap to mate two surfaces together or at least that's what I have been, taught, read, used?
> 
> You even used that definition yourself.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Cause honestly it is a shim. If you've ever worked with furniture(specifically antique furniture) there are times you need to put a shim under a leg to level the piece.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Shims also *support* so technically speaking it is indeed a shim. But I am anal retentive since I am OCD.









It's not supporting any weight other than the thin ace pcb underneath. Suspension bridges do the same but they don't qualify as shims.







lol

~Ceadder


----------



## 0ldChicken

Wouldn't it be a shim for the pcb and not for the die...? Makes sense to me


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Wouldn't it be a shim for the pcb and not for the die...? Makes sense to me


Exacly.









~Ceadder


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Shims also *support* so technically speaking it is indeed a shim. But I am anal retentive since I am OCD.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not supporting any weight other than the thin ace pcb underneath. Suspension bridges do the same but they don't qualify as shims.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol
> 
> ~Ceadder


....

Let's agree to disagree and leave it there lol.


----------



## Jimbags

A shim is something that fills a gap by a set amount. Ie the shim fills the gap above the pcb/beside the die. Bringing the height of the pcb up to support heatsink/block above transfering weight to a larger surface area. Thus less weight or force on the die, preventing cracking. Its supporting the heatsink/block because thats what is applying the force not the pcb.its transferring force to the pcb around the die. Not sure if what i said is completely relevant but yeah...


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> I'm skeptical about what my CLU would look like once I remove the H100i block. Had this application for little over a year, temps have been the same since then. Temp averages 56c on 4790k @ 4.7GHz 1.236v.


Remount and tell me. Been wondering if i should remount my copper block and use clu.


----------



## EvilWiffles

I would but I don't have any TIM left over to replace.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> A shim is something that fills a gap by a set amount. Ie the shim fills the gap above the pcb/beside the die. Bringing the height of the pcb up to support heatsink/block above transfering weight to a larger surface area. Thus less weight or force on the die, preventing cracking. Its supporting the heatsink/block because thats what is applying the force not the pcb.its transferring force to the pcb around the die. Not sure if what i said is completely relevant but yeah...


It reinforces the PCB to stop it bending, it doesn't actually touch the heatsink as it sits below the die which sits below the socket walls which is why people aren't running skylake chips naked.


----------



## Origondoo

I did it again









6700k with a vice only method. The temp dropped by ~ 20-23°C (average and peak).
CLU between die and IHS. MX4 between IHS and cooler

Here some pics


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!









Here the results for the temps for 4.7GHz @1.328V on air (EKL Alpenföhn Himalaya 2) running AIDA64


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> @GTRtank you guys are seriously making me want to get naked
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've been working on stabilizing my 4790k's 5.0Ghz OC, hopefully for 24/7 since I was rather surprised at the performance difference from 4.8 (which only takes 1.285v and will run prime for days)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Using 1.43v right now but stress tests are killing me at 90°c and its still not completely stable. I'm planning on doing a loop cleaning in about a month, I'm thinking I'll try and get it done then if it still seems like a good idea. I can use the ivy precise mount for my haswell DC right?
> 
> Someone ought to start a CPU nudist club


so I just got done installing my naked mount, among a few other things! At first I had a few issues getting things to boot properly, I had to tighten things down a bit more and then got it to post. I started getting lots of memory issues after that, but it turns out my BIOS decided to take my timings and drop them way lower (11 to 6) so that fixed my issues so far!

Although I feel like I must've been doing something wrong before because I gained way too much! Up until last night I was hitting 90°c during IBT on high (4790k- 1.43v @5.0GHz) and now I'm just above 70°c








ambient temps are about 2°c higher now so I'm conservatively looking at a 15°c drop from delidded to naked. Running lower voltages provides less of a drop but still dropped about 10° running 1.28v @4.8GHz- MAXED at 60°c IBT HIGH

I don't know what I would've/could've been doing wrong before since I had reapplied a few times since delidding and always had consistently good results


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> so I just got done installing my naked mount, among a few other things! At first I had a few issues getting things to boot properly, I had to tighten things down a bit more and then got it to post. I started getting lots of memory issues after that, but it turns out my BIOS decided to take my timings and drop them way lower (11 to 6) so that fixed my issues so far!
> 
> Although I feel like I must've been doing something wrong before because I gained way too much! Up until last night I was hitting 90°c during IBT on high (4790k- 1.43v @5.0GHz) and now I'm just above 70°c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ambient temps are about 2°c higher now so I'm conservatively looking at a 15°c drop from delidded to naked. Running lower voltages provides less of a drop but still dropped about 10° running 1.28v @4.8GHz- MAXED at 60°c IBT HIGH
> 
> I don't know what I would've/could've been doing wrong before since I had reapplied a few times since delidding and always had consistently good results


Needs to be tightened down tight until the screws stop tightening, thats according to EK so no issues.

Thats quite a huge drop, from delided to naked, i might have seen that as well if i had 1.43v. From delid to bare die i lost about 5-7°C but thats only at 1.2v.

Good work.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> so I just got done installing my naked mount, among a few other things! At first I had a few issues getting things to boot properly, I had to tighten things down a bit more and then got it to post. I started getting lots of memory issues after that, but it turns out my BIOS decided to take my timings and drop them way lower (11 to 6) so that fixed my issues so far!
> 
> Although I feel like I must've been doing something wrong before because I gained way too much! Up until last night I was hitting 90°c during IBT on high (4790k- 1.43v @5.0GHz) and now I'm just above 70°c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ambient temps are about 2°c higher now so I'm conservatively looking at a 15°c drop from delidded to naked. Running lower voltages provides less of a drop but still dropped about 10° running 1.28v @4.8GHz- MAXED at 60°c IBT HIGH
> 
> I don't know what I would've/could've been doing wrong before since I had reapplied a few times since delidding and always had consistently good results


IBT produces a lot of heat, I use x264 to confirm stability as it's better at finding issues from my testing with my 4670k plus the less heat the better for haswell, not sure about devils canyon but would imagine it's the same.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> IBT produces a lot of heat, I use x264 to confirm stability as it's better at finding issues from my testing with my 4670k plus the less heat the better for haswell, not sure about devils canyon but would imagine it's the same.


yeah that's why I used it to benchmark my temps before and after delid, I wanted to see what it would do with a butt-load of heat









I tried messing around with x264 a couple times but had issues getting it to run and also had issues with the workarounds for it so I set it aside for a later day when I've got time to look into it. Still I'm very impressed that it can keep 1.43v around 70°c... I seriously had my doubts!

5.0GHz 24/7 is looking to be a reality for me








I'll have to find my way over to that club and see what it's all about


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> yeah that's why I used it to benchmark my temps before and after delid, I wanted to see what it would do with a butt-load of heat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tried messing around with x264 a couple times but had issues getting it to run and also had issues with the workarounds for it so I set it aside for a later day when I've got time to look into it. Still I'm very impressed that it can keep 1.43v around 70°c... I seriously had my doubts!
> 
> 5.0GHz 24/7 is looking to be a reality for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll have to find my way over to that club and see what it's all about


I wish I could run IBT with 1.6v and not hitting thermal throttle.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I wish I could run IBT with 1.6v and not hitting thermal throttle.


Add a 480mm rad and you could haha.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Add a 480mm rad and you could haha.


I doubt it, I'd need to run chilled or exotic cooling.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I wish I could run IBT with 1.6v and not hitting thermal throttle.


what clocks are you trying to run at 1.6v? Thats absurd man


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> what clocks are you trying to run at 1.6v? Thats obsurd man


4.8ghz on a rubbish i5, I'm upgrading to skylake soon gunna run an 6700k naked. I'm going to lower the clock on the i5 to 4.6ghz or so for when it goes to it's new owner.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> 4.8ghz on a rubbish i5, I'm upgrading to skylake soon gunna run an 6700k naked. I'm going to lower the clock on the i5 to 4.6ghz or so for when it goes to it's new owner.


I feel you man. I feel like my new chip would need that to reach 4.8-5.0 haha. I went from 4.5/1.2v 4.8/1.3v to 4.3/1.21v. Make sure your i5 isnt made in Vietnam lol.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Ouch


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I feel you man. I feel like my new chip would need that to reach 4.8-5.0 haha. I went from 4.5/1.2v 4.8/1.3v to 4.3/1.21v. Make sure your i5 isnt made in Vietnam lol.


It's fine, it doesn't bother me, and why is that about the vietnam?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Ouch


I hope my 6700k clocks a lot better, if I get the measurements sorted for running the skylake chips naked I'll be happy.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It's fine, it doesn't bother me, and why is that about the vietnam?
> I hope my 6700k clocks a lot better, if I get the measurements sorted for running the skylake chips naked I'll be happy.


My first i5 was from Malaysia second from Vietnam. They might have switched manufacturing locations later on in life and possibly have poorer silicon?


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It's fine, it doesn't bother me, and why is that about the vietnam?
> I hope my 6700k clocks a lot better, if I get the measurements sorted for running the skylake chips naked I'll be happy.
> 
> 
> 
> My first i5 was from Malaysia second from Vietnam. They might have switched manufacturing locations later on in life and possibly have poorer silicon?
Click to expand...

Back in the stone age, we used to discuss batch numbers, and whether your Intel cpu was from Malaysia or Costa Rica.

Looks like the Vietnam plant is one of the newest fabs:


My yet-to-be-tested 4790K is a Vietnam chip. As for poorer silicon, imo that depends more on luck of the draw, than what fab the wafers were produced at.
But who knows, maybe 'Nam chips are all currently duds, I'll find out if mine is, soon enough, lol.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Back in the stone age, we used to discuss batch numbers, and whether your Intel cpu was from Malaysia or Costa Rica.
> 
> Looks like the Vietnam plant is one of the newest fabs:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My yet-to-be-tested 4790K is a Vietnam chip. As for poorer silicon, imo that depends more on luck of the draw, than what fab the wafers were produced at.
> But who knows, maybe 'Nam chips are all currently duds, I'll find out if mine is, soon enough, lol.


I don't know if that is the case. I just checked my 4790k's IHS and its from Vietnam. Clocks pretty good from what I've seen of other's chips. Its not a "golden" chip or anything but not bad imo-
4.8GHz @ 1.285v.
4.9GHz @ 1.31v
5.0GHz is a little rough at 1.44v but isn't everybody's?









Maybe I got a great Nam chip though, I've seen some garbage 4790k OC's but that could be user error too


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I don't know if that is the case. I just checked my 4790k's IHS and its from Vietnam. Clocks pretty *very* good from what I've seen of other's chips. Its not a "golden" chip or anything but not bad imo-
> 4.8GHz @ 1.285v.
> 4.9GHz @ 1.31v
> 5.0GHz is a little rough at 1.44v but isn't everybody's?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe I got a great Nam chip though, I've seen some garbage 4790k OC's but that could be user error too


Fixed that for you.









This is an example, good chips and dud chips and everything in between, it shouldn't matter what fab they come from, it's just luck of the draw, imo.


----------



## Rei86

4790K at 4.7 was hitting temps as high as 80c and was bothering me a bit.
So finally decide to take the plunge and actually go with the vice method... After doing so my temps shot up to 70~90deg C idle and 100+ under load and I couldn't OC it at all as the chip would save itself by shutting everything down. Found out that my AIO was dying so after replacing the the Corsair H100i with Kraken X61, now the temps are around 25~35 normalish use and the package has never been above 50c underload.

Going to actually OC it now and see if I can hit 4.8Ghz stable and see how far I can back down the voltage to do so.

And because I really didn't like how the vice method left marks on my PCB thinking that's what did my chip in. I went ahead and purchased the Rockit 88 delid and relid kit. Works very smooth and probably end up deliding my G3258 for the fun of it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> 4790K at 4.7 was hitting temps as high as 80c and was bothering me a bit.
> So finally decide to take the plunge and actually go with the vice method... After doing so my temps shot up to 70~90deg C idle and 100+ under load and I couldn't OC it at all as the chip would save itself by shutting everything down. Found out that my AIO was dying so after replacing the the Corsair H100i with Kraken X61, now the temps are around 25~35 normalish use and the package has never been above 50c underload.
> 
> Going to actually OC it now and see if I can hit 4.8Ghz stable and see how far I can back down the voltage to do so.
> 
> And because I really didn't like how the vice method left marks on my PCB thinking that's what did my chip in. I went ahead and purchased the Rockit 88 delid and relid kit. Works very smooth and probably end up deliding my G3258 for the fun of it.


I hate AIO kits because of the reason you stated, I'll stick to my custom loops.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I hate AIO kits because of the reason you stated, I'll stick to my custom loops.


Guess the pump was going out since it would make a grinding noise.

AIO's have been serving me fine, and this H100i been running almost 24/7 for almost two and half years so its done its job as far as I'm concerned









But yeah its time for me to plunge into full custom loop once Skylake E hits. Always been meaning to but after I get done with my build I always feel like its not worthy of a full on custom loop.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Fixed that for you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> This is an example, good chips and dud chips and everything in between, it shouldn't matter what fab they come from, it's just luck of the draw, imo.


oh stop it







you're making me blush. It actually seems to have improved over time but maybe that's just me being less of a noob now. I booted up my old mobo this weekend to sell it and looked at some of my old profiles... i was running much higher voltages than i am now, using a cheaper mobo now too


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> *"...Make sure your i5 isnt made in Vietnam. lol "*


What's wrong with Viet Nam, other than communism?









Reason I ask, is this i7-4790k left on the stoop today is Viet Nam manufacture.









~Ceadder


----------



## paskowitz

What I don't get is I have to go from [email protected] all the way to [email protected] but only have to go 1.43v to get to 5.1Ghz. 5.2 crashes immediately at 1.45v and I'm not feeling like going any further than that, since things get toasty. I could probably get my 5.0 voltage down with some more detailed bios tweaks I guess.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> What I don't get is I have to go from [email protected] all the way to [email protected] but only have to go 1.43v to get to 5.1Ghz. 5.2 crashes immediately at 1.45v and I'm not feeling like going any further than that, since things get toasty. I could probably get my 5.0 voltage down with some more detailed bios tweaks I guess.


Voltage walls, just how it goes on some chips. My fx 8350 needs 1.62v for 5ghz but for 4.9ghz I can sit at something silly like 1.55v and 4.8ghz is 1.48v.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> *"...Make sure your i5 isnt made in Vietnam. lol "*
> 
> 
> 
> What's wrong with Viet Nam, other than communism?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reason I ask, is this i7-4790k left on the stoop today is Viet Nam manufacture.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
Click to expand...

That's just it, it don't matter what fab it's from, all depends on the lottery.
'Nam, Costa Rica, Malaysia, whatever, lol.


----------



## Rei86

Why does the print however from 'Nam look like boot knockoffs from China?


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Just got my Vietnam 6700k....

After taking pictures... I saw this...


Oh boy... I'm almost guaranteed going to have to delid...


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Just got my Vietnam 6700k....
> 
> After taking pictures... I saw this...
> 
> 
> Oh boy... I'm almost guaranteed going to have to delid...


Dang, looks like that one went through the glue machine three times before the lid got dropped on.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Just got my Vietnam 6700k....
> 
> After taking pictures... I saw this...
> 
> 
> Oh boy... I'm almost guaranteed going to have to delid...
> 
> 
> 
> Dang, looks like that one went through the glue machine three times before the lid got dropped on.
Click to expand...

If that's the case...wonder if it went through the paste machine 3x also... Lid is gonna pop off from the amount of thermal paste...


----------



## Arctucas

My Vietnam 6700K had a lot of sealant also, maybe slightly less than that, but still a lot.

Getting all the sealant off the IHS and PCB was the most time-consuming and laborious part of de-lidding. I used my fingernail to scrape off most of it, then I used a pencil eraser and isopropyl alcohol, which got it pretty well cleaned up.

There was also a big glob of TIM on the die, but it was so dried out, it was almost crumbly, which was actually good, because it cleaned right off with a little isopropyl alcohol.


----------



## dmfree88

How do you check where your CPU is made?


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> How do you check where your CPU is made?


The label on the box.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> The label on the box.


That I don't have







. Was hoping there was a way to check through numbers provided in hwinfo or something.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> That I don't have
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Was hoping there was a way to check through numbers provided in hwinfo or something.


on the IHS itself


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Planning the twist method of delidding...only I don't want to pay to buy a tool...

I can pick up 2 of these, and return after 1 use.


There's multiple tools showing the twist method is quite safe... I'm planning to twist the IHS off with the wrenches. Ideas?





edit: fail.. Nevermind. I'll go the blade method...blade 2.0
http://www.overclock.net/t/1575875/skylake-delid-with-a-razor-blade-slices-through-like-butter-safe-like-a-car-seat/20
https://www.walgreens.com/store/c/studio-35-men's-stainless-steel-double-edge-blades/ID=prod6167514-product


----------



## DR4G00N

Using razors is perfectly fine as long as you are not careless, it's my preferred way to delid since it's good for pasted or soldered chips.









Just cut open my S775 Pentium Dual-core E2200 to hopefully squeeze a few hundred more MHz out of it.
Temps dropped from 48c to 37c on both cores @ 1.5V under P95 Small FFT.



OCN name: DR4G00N
CPU: Pentium Dual-core E2200
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: MX-4
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: N/A
Temp drops: 11C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: N/A

Haven't tried pushing it since the delid so no CPU-Z valid or MHz increases for now.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> on the IHS itself


Yeah mine is lapped so I don't have that number either haha. Probably no way to tell was just hoping for something on the software end maybe.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Using razors is perfectly fine as long as you are not careless, it's my preferred way to delid since it's good for pasted or soldered chips.


It might be good for soldered chips (from what I have seen you shouldn't really de-lid soldered chips) but for pasted chips it is much higher success rate to use the vise method. I would presume most people with their $300+ chips that turn them into paperweights were being careful, nobody wants to throw away a chip. It only takes a small scratch to cause it to fail. It is so much faster, safer and easier to use a vise. Now they even have cheap tools for the newer chips, it is much smarter to spend the $25-$50 to assure it will happen with one of those tools.

I haven't been here too long but I have already seen at least 3 posts with people killing their chips via razor-blade. I have never seen a post with someone failing with the vise I have only heard of a couple people bending the PCB (which is why you should rotate and slowly break free).


----------



## alancsalt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> How do you check where your CPU is made?


Either on the box or the IHS -

Batch Codes

The lot code identifier and Intel year and workweek the finished product was manufactured can be viewed by referencing the following FPO# guide:

(x)Test Site, (x)Year, (xx)Workweek, (xx)Lot Code Identifier (xx)Serialisation Code

1st letter or digit = Test Site
0 = San Jose, Costa Rica
1 = Cavite, Philippines
3 = .............., Costa Rica
6 = Chandler, Arizona
7 = .........., Philippines
8 = Leixlip, Ireland
9 = Penang, Malaysia
L = ............, Malaysia
Q = ..........., Malaysia
R = Manila, Philippines
Y = Leixlip, Ireland
X appears to be Vietnam?

2nd digit = Year of production
8 = 2008
9 = 2009
0 = 2010

3rd & 4th digits = Workweek

5th - 6th digits= Lot Code Identifier

7th - 8th digits = Serialisation Code

Source: http://www.intel.com/design/support/...60_general.htm Used since the early 1990's i960 RISC-based microprocessor.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> edit: fail.. Nevermind. I'll go the blade method...blade 2.0
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1575875/skylake-delid-with-a-razor-blade-slices-through-like-butter-safe-like-a-car-seat/20
> https://www.walgreens.com/store/c/studio-35-men's-stainless-steel-double-edge-blades/ID=prod6167514-product


Sorry for the triple post but you people scare me with your razor blade plans







. This is probably one of the better methods via vise (someone feel free to post if you are aware of a better video this one seems to be the best I have found):






You should NOT use a hammer. You should do it basically just like the video shows and it will be far safer just don't over-tighten and take it slow.

If you don't have a vise you could and should just buy a delidding tool.

Or if you buy a vise Harbor freight is usually good for a cheap vise. Also could probably walk into any machine or wood shop they will probably just let you use theirs for free. Cover up the edges with something to protect the chip.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Delid tomorrow morning? Too soon?
Going to get these blades today! Should be a grand time!
http://www.overclock.net/t/1575875/skylake-delid-with-a-razor-blade-slices-through-like-butter-safe-like-a-car-seat










I'll start with CLU and PK-1 but I might switch over to all CLU depending on temps.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Delid tomorrow morning? Too soon?
> Going to get these blades today! Should be a grand time!
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1575875/skylake-delid-with-a-razor-blade-slices-through-like-butter-safe-like-a-car-seat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll start with CLU and PK-1 but I might switch over to all CLU depending on temps.


Just start the corner then use a thin piece of plastic like a thin credit cart etc to do the rest. I hope you don't cut a trace on the pcb...


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Delid tomorrow morning? Too soon?
> Going to get these blades today! Should be a grand time!
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1575875/skylake-delid-with-a-razor-blade-slices-through-like-butter-safe-like-a-car-seat
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll start with CLU and PK-1 but I might switch over to all CLU depending on temps.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just start the corner then use a thin piece of plastic like a thin credit cart etc to do the rest. I hope you don't cut a trace on the pcb...
Click to expand...

Haha I won't! I delided my GTX560 on accident..lol started that modify your IHS club in the Nvidia cooling section...

It looks like all Sky Lake chips have an open spot where there's no adhesive. Perfect place to start with the blade!
Just near the 6 copper leads:
1.

2.

3.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Haha I won't! I delided my GTX560 on accident..lol started that modify your IHS club in the Nvidia cooling section...
> 
> It looks like all Sky Lake chips have an open spot where there's no adhesive. Perfect place to start with the blade!
> Just near the 6 copper leads:


Why risk it?

http://www.harborfreight.com/hand-tools/vises-anvils.html

We are talking 20 bucks at most for a Vise.... Save you hours of effort and prevents damage. I don't get why anyone would use a razor blade. It is chip suicide.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Why risk it?
> 
> http://www.harborfreight.com/hand-tools/vises-anvils.html
> 
> We are talking 20 bucks at most for a Vise.... Save you hours of effort and prevents damage. I don't get why anyone would use a razor blade. It is chip suicide.


Skylake PCB don't like the vice method man.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Wow... these Van Der Hagen double sided blades are SUPER thin... and I thought carpet blades were thin... This should be easy!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Wow... these Van Der Hagen double sided blades are SUPER thin... and I thought carpet blades were thin... This should be easy!


The silicone gap is only .05-.06mm so its RIDICULOUSLY thin. Me personally on skylake i would never use a razor blade, there are plenty of affordable delid tools out there that are completely safe. And yes people will say why spend 30-40$ on something you use one. How much do you pay for car insurance a year and pretty much not use it AT ALL haha.

Better safe then sorry, i got mine from entersetup and i would not go any other way. If Skylake is thin, kabylake and wtv else will probably be as well.


----------



## DerComissar

Ah, he wants to use a razor blade, so be it.

A man must do what he will do.

Years ago, I successfully delidded two gtx 480 gpus with a razor blade, installed two Acceleros on the naked dies, and got a huge temp. reduction on air.

Now I'm older and more cautious, that's why I invested in the entersetup delidding tool that bluej 511 recommended, and damn glad that I did.


----------



## chronicfx

I have done two ivys a devils canyon and my skylake with razor blade method. All were successful and I would use a razorblade again in a heartbeat. The fancy tools are nice but the feeling of accomplishment is very satisfying after a razor delid. Go for it, Val will be extra proud, should have a second sig for razor delidded members. Or maybe one for people that buy the plastic delid tools with a pacifier at the end


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> I have done two ivys a devils canyon and my skylake with razor blade method. All were successful and I would use a razorblade again in a heartbeat. The fancy tools are nice but the feeling of accomplishment is very satisfying after a razor delid. Go for it, Val will be extra proud, should have a second sig for razor delidded members. Or maybe one for people that buy the plastic delid tools with a pacifier at the end


Yeah, but it's a nice pacifier, lol.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Yeah, but it's a nice pacifier, lol.


Touche


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Using razors is perfectly fine as long as you are not careless, it's my preferred way to delid since it's good for pasted or soldered chips.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just cut open my S775 Pentium Dual-core E2200 to hopefully squeeze a few hundred more MHz out of it.
> Temps dropped from 48c to 37c on both cores @ 1.5V under P95 Small FFT.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: DR4G00N
> CPU: Pentium Dual-core E2200
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: MX-4
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: N/A
> Temp drops: 11C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: N/A
> 
> Haven't tried pushing it since the delid so no CPU-Z valid or MHz increases for now.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!







Your in the Misc list now for that CPU.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Either on the box or the IHS -
> 
> Batch Codes
> 
> The lot code identifier and Intel year and workweek the finished product was manufactured can be viewed by referencing the following FPO# guide:
> 
> (x)Test Site, (x)Year, (xx)Workweek, (xx)Lot Code Identifier (xx)Serialisation Code
> 
> 1st letter or digit = Test Site
> 0 = San Jose, Costa Rica
> 1 = Cavite, Philippines
> 3 = .............., Costa Rica
> 6 = Chandler, Arizona
> 7 = .........., Philippines
> 8 = Leixlip, Ireland
> 9 = Penang, Malaysia
> L = ............, Malaysia
> Q = ..........., Malaysia
> R = Manila, Philippines
> Y = Leixlip, Ireland
> X appears to be Vietnam?
> 
> 2nd digit = Year of production
> 8 = 2008
> 9 = 2009
> 0 = 2010
> 
> 3rd & 4th digits = Workweek
> 
> 5th - 6th digits= Lot Code Identifier
> 
> 7th - 8th digits = Serialisation Code
> 
> Source: http://www.intel.com/design/support/...60_general.htm Used since the early 1990's i960 RISC-based microprocessor.


Thank you Sir Fountain of knowledge!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Haha I won't! I delided my GTX560 on accident..lol started that modify your IHS club in the Nvidia cooling section...
> 
> It looks like all Sky Lake chips have an open spot where there's no adhesive. Perfect place to start with the blade!
> Just near the 6 copper leads:
> 1.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2.
> 
> 3.


I need details for your entry, check the OP on what is needed







Looks good though!


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Here it is!!!

Successful razor delid!
It was SUPER nerve racking at first getting the blade into the glue but once it was in, walla, cut it like butter. Anytime it stopped cutting though it felt like I was cutting into the PCB....








Before:


After:


OCN name: Cakewalk_S
CPU: Intel i7-6700k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Silverstone Thermal Grease (came with the NT06-Pro cooler)
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 0
Temp drops: 9-10C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: N/A

Just testing for now! Will increase overclock once I figure out how these Asus bios work...























Very happy camper! I bet I'd drop another 3-5C if I use CLU between the IHS and cooler.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Here it is!!!
> 
> Successful razor delid!
> It was SUPER nerve racking at first getting the blade into the glue but once it was in, walla, cut it like butter. Anytime it stopped cutting though it felt like I was cutting into the PCB....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> OCN name: Cakewalk_S
> CPU: Intel i7-6700k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Silverstone Thermal Grease (came with the NT06-Pro cooler)
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 0
> Temp drops: 9-10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: N/A
> 
> Just testing for now! Will increase overclock once I figure out how these Asus bios work...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very happy camper! I bet I'd drop another 3-5C if I use CLU between the IHS and cooler.


Decent temp drops but no you wont get 3-5°C from clu between the ihs and cooler lol. Id use a better TIM though like kryonaut or gc extreme for sure. Idk if its just me or if its the pictures but it looks like quite a lot of clu on there. The thinner the better, might even drop your temps more.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Decent temp drops but no you wont get 3-5°C from clu between the ihs and cooler lol. Id use a better TIM though like kryonaut or gc extreme for sure. Idk if its just me or if its the pictures but it looks like quite a lot of clu on there. The thinner the better, might even drop your temps more.


Definitely too much CLU. You barely want to cover it. You can check out the bare die results with too much as opposed to too little, substantial difference. You don't want it pooled up at all, just a very thin "dry" looking layer.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Decent temp drops but no you wont get 3-5°C from clu between the ihs and cooler lol. Id use a better TIM though like kryonaut or gc extreme for sure. Idk if its just me or if its the pictures but it looks like quite a lot of clu on there. The thinner the better, might even drop your temps more.
> 
> 
> 
> Definitely too much CLU. You barely want to cover it. You can check out the bare die results with too much as opposed to too little, substantial difference. You don't want it pooled up at all, just a very thin "dry" looking layer.
Click to expand...

I think it might be ok... the CLU worked great on the die but on the IHS it was a little tricky to get it to wet the entire surface. It's kinda hard to tell but part of the area doesn't have any CLU on at all...so some of it balled up. I tried my best to spread it but it was only whisking over the surface. I'll probably reseat it sometime down the road anyway since I plan on using glue on the corners to secure the IHS. But I see your point... I don't have alot of CLU left so I might get 1 more seating left out of my tube... Overall very happy with my results! I ran P95 blend and I noticed my Vcore boosted up 1.262v which is kinda high for 4.2GHz, I'm sure I could get 4.3 with that voltage easily. My time has been limited working on my case. I start grad school on Monday so I'm trying to get my system in order for school online. I was so busy last night I was literally doing dishes with the CPU on the counter with a blade stuck in the side of it.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Here it is!!!
> 
> Successful razor delid!
> It was SUPER nerve racking at first getting the blade into the glue but once it was in, walla, cut it like butter. Anytime it stopped cutting though it felt like I was cutting into the PCB....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> OCN name: Cakewalk_S
> CPU: Intel i7-6700k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Silverstone Thermal Grease (came with the NT06-Pro cooler)
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 0
> Temp drops: 9-10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: N/A
> 
> Just testing for now! Will increase overclock once I figure out how these Asus bios work...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very happy camper! I bet I'd drop another 3-5C if I use CLU between the IHS and cooler.


Congrats cowboy! Proud to see the delid done OG style. If I may comment on the CLU application, the best tip I can give you for application of LM would be to think of it as "painting" rather than "spreading". You would not throw your can of paint at the wall and then spread it around with the paint brush, right? The way that has been successful in my own de-lids (and plenty of re-applications after cleaning blocks, changing motherboards etc.) is to make a half drop at the tip of the syringe and pick it up on the brush rather than putting CLU directly onto the CPU. You would then "paint" it on with the brush, this will ensure a thin layer. As you brush you will think you did not put enough, just keep brushing, the tim will slowly stretch as you keep brushing it. You will be super surprised at how little you will actually need to get a nice thin layer of LM on there. I recommend to do the underside of the IHS as well in the same manner. IMHO it seems you have about 5 times the LM you actually needed. It is possible you have another few degrees coming to you should you decide to re-apply. It would be interesting to see how much.

Here is an example from the internet of a good application although I would have worked harder on those corners than the person pictured.



Good luck. Temps aren't bad as is depending on how high you want to go. If you are thinking 1.45v and going for 4.8+ than I would re-apply, but if you want a nice 4.5 oc you will be fine.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Congrats cowboy! Proud to see the delid done OG style. If I may comment on the CLU application, the best tip I can give you for application of LM would be to think of it as "painting" rather than "spreading". You would not throw your can of paint at the wall and then spread it around with the paint brush, right? The way that has been successful in my own de-lids (and plenty of re-applications after cleaning blocks, changing motherboards etc.) is to make a half drop at the tip of the syringe and pick it up on the brush rather than putting CLU directly onto the CPU. You would then "paint" it on with the brush, this will ensure a thin layer. As you brush you will think you did not put enough, just keep brushing, the tim will slowly stretch as you keep brushing it. You will be super surprised at how little you will actually need to get a nice thin layer of LM on there. I recommend to do the underside of the IHS as well in the same manner. IMHO it seems you have about 5 times the LM you actually needed. It is possible you have another few degrees coming to you should you decide to re-apply. It would be interesting to see how much.
> 
> Here is an example from the internet of a good application although I would have worked harder on those corners than the person pictured.
> 
> 
> 
> Good luck. Temps aren't bad as is depending on how high you want to go. If you are thinking 1.45v and going for 4.8+ than I would re-apply, but if you want a nice 4.5 oc you will be fine.


Thanks man! Yea, sounds like from the pro's here that I need to re-do my application. Don't want to be a hard head know it all and think my application is the best. I was just in a hurry with little sleep and little coffee this AM to get it together!








I'm considering lapping the IHS... I noticed when I took off the cooler, (darn don't have a pic), that the IHS leaves more paste in the center from top to bottom than the edges. I'm sure if I lap the IHS I might get 1-2C cooler. 1-2C for lapping + 2-4C from CLU, maybe another 1C for a better CLU job on the IHS and we're talking 55C max in an ITX build. Then I'll really set my sights on a higher overclock, maybe 4.5GHz.... Seems like this 6700k pulls way less power than my 2500k @ 4.5Ghz so I think my 450w PSU should be just fine.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Thanks man! Yea, sounds like from the pro's here that I need to re-do my application. Don't want to be a hard head know it all and think my application is the best. I was just in a hurry with little sleep and little coffee this AM to get it together!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm considering lapping the IHS... I noticed when I took off the cooler, (darn don't have a pic), that the IHS leaves more paste in the center from top to bottom than the edges. I'm sure if I lap the IHS I might get 1-2C cooler. 1-2C for lapping + 2-4C from CLU, maybe another 1C for a better CLU job on the IHS and we're talking 55C max in an ITX build. Then I'll really set my sights on a higher overclock, maybe 4.5GHz.... Seems like this 6700k pulls way less power than my 2500k @ 4.5Ghz so I think my 450w PSU should be just fine.


Personal preference. Id never put clu between the IHS and cooler. From my testing there is almost no temp differences between using clu and any TIM. And i did my testing bare die so the IHS wasn't even a variable. Lapping will probably make a bigger difference then using clu in between ihs and cooler.

For bare die using a thin layer may/may not work depending on how flat the waterblock is. I used a very thin layer and got poor contact so i used a tiny bit more and got better results. YOu pretty much only want to put it on the die, its totally unecessary to put it on the IHS as well.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Personal preference. Id never put clu between the IHS and cooler. From my testing there is almost no temp differences between using clu and any TIM.


Can confirm. Difference is like 1-2c, or margin of error.


----------



## devsfan1830

Going to delid my 3770K tomorrow and was hoping you guys could give me some advice on how to safely remove all the left over black silicone and how to best reattach the IHS. I got this tool: http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/

That should pop the IHS off pretty safely. Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the replacement IHS TIM, Gelid Solutions GC-Extreme for the waterblock. I have some gel control super glue and was wondering if that would be enough to secure the IHS and where you guys would put it. I would ideally just use a couple dots to keep the IHS firm enough to stay put when I lock the cpu back down to the socket.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devsfan1830*
> 
> Going to delid my 3770K tomorrow and was hoping you guys could give me some advice on how to safely remove all the left over black silicone and how to best reattach the IHS. I got this tool: http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/
> 
> That should pop the IHS off pretty safely. Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the replacement IHS TIM, Gelid Solutions GC-Extreme for the waterblock. I have some gel control super glue and was wondering if that would be enough to secure the IHS and where you guys would put it. I would ideally just use a couple dots to keep the IHS firm enough to stay put when I lock the cpu back down to the socket.


I literally JUST delided my CPU lastnight. I took off the adhesive this morning. You can see my pictures from the previous page. I used a couple of credit cards. I just used the rounded corners and angled it like at 45 degrees and pushed a fair amount. I could see it taking off the adhesive. It'll dull pretty quick so I kept using all 4 edges then switched to a different card.
After that I used some windex to clean it all up then it was good to go! Best of luck! I was super nervous deliding mine last night but total success!


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devsfan1830*
> 
> Going to delid my 3770K tomorrow and was hoping you guys could give me some advice on how to safely remove all the left over black silicone and how to best reattach the IHS. I got this tool: http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/
> 
> That should pop the IHS off pretty safely. Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra for the replacement IHS TIM, Gelid Solutions GC-Extreme for the waterblock. I have some gel control super glue and was wondering if that would be enough to secure the IHS and where you guys would put it. I would ideally just use a couple dots to keep the IHS firm enough to stay put when I lock the cpu back down to the socket.


I have that.

Works like a charm man.

I just used a little bit of alcohol to soak the black silicone and used the tip end of a spudger and got it off the IHS and the PCB.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

So I really don't want to kill the face of the 6700k. At least not right now... and so I'm going to use a normal thermal paste. There's been a few great reviews about the Cooler Master MasterGel Nano thermal paste. Figured I'd give that a go. Supposedly this Silverstone stuff I used has pretty bad thermal properties! So I'm hoping I can get a few C better with this new stuff! Thankfully I've got a Newegg Premier account so I should have the stuff maybe by the weekend or Monday?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Here it is!!!
> 
> Successful razor delid!
> It was SUPER nerve racking at first getting the blade into the glue but once it was in, walla, cut it like butter. Anytime it stopped cutting though it felt like I was cutting into the PCB....
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Cakewalk_S
> CPU: Intel i7-6700k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Silverstone Thermal Grease (came with the NT06-Pro cooler)
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 0
> Temp drops: 9-10C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: N/A
> 
> Just testing for now! Will increase overclock once I figure out how these Asus bios work...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very happy camper! I bet I'd drop another 3-5C if I use CLU between the IHS and cooler.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## devsfan1830

So far a successful delid! Cleanly popped the IHS off with the Rockitcool tool although I think this was a one off. The threads to the pressing screw kinda stripped themselves in the process. The old TIM was totally rock hard and just crumbled away.





Reapplied the Liquidmetal to the die, reattached the IHS with 4 tiny dots of superglue, reattached the water block with GC-Extreme. Forgot to take a shot of the Liquidmetal applied but i had it exactly like others have. Super thin coat applied by putting a drop on the brush and painting it on keeping it on the die only.

CPU-Z validated Intel Core i7 3770K @ 4422.6 MHz (http://valid.x86.fr/jpy6yd)

Before:



After (a near 20C drop!):



Right now at idle its 30C with coolant at 23.7C.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devsfan1830*
> 
> So far a successful delid! Cleanly popped the IHS off with the Rockitcool tool although I think this was a one off. The threads to the pressing screw kinda stripped themselves in the process. The old TIM was totally rock hard and just crumbled away.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reapplied the Liquidmetal to the die, reattached the IHS with 4 tiny dots of superglue, reattached the water block with GC-Extreme. Forgot to take a shot of the Liquidmetal applied but i had it exactly like others have. Super thin coat applied by putting a drop on the brush and painting it on keeping it on the die only.
> 
> CPU-Z validated Intel Core i7 3770K @ 4422.6 MHz (http://valid.x86.fr/jpy6yd)
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> 
> After (a near 20C drop!):
> 
> 
> 
> Right now at idle its 30C with coolant at 23.7C.


This is exactly what the owner of entersetup told me about the rockit tool and why i stayed away from it. Plastic threads. My tool has a metal insert thank god. Glad it worked out and nice temp drops.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> This is exactly what the owner of entersetup told me about the rockit tool and why i stayed away from it. Plastic threads. My tool has a metal insert thank god. Glad it worked out and nice temp drops.


If you mention it to the Rockit owner, he will change the design. Feedback is invaluable. Also not sure how the threads stripped on the rockit, maybe the slide was too tight or loose for that to happen. The reason I say this is because on the de8auer over priced tool, if the slide is in the wrong way it will cause the threads to strip, but there is no indication on the slide as to which the correct orientation is.


----------



## devsfan1830

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you mention it to the Rockit owner, he will change the design. Feedback is invaluable. Also not sure how the threads stripped on the rockit, maybe the slide was too tight or loose for that to happen. The reason I say this is because on the de8auer over priced tool, if the slide is in the wrong way it will cause the threads to strip, but there is no indication on the slide as to which the correct orientation is.


I did email the owner. Thanked him for making the tool and just told him that as contructive feedback. I did notice as I applied pressure the halves did start to flex and separate. But i absolutely thumb tightened the lock down screws hard as the instructions said to do. I just think plain acetal is not string enough to deal with that kind of pressure on thin threads. The slide was freely moving and does not fall out. It was also in the right position as theres no damage to the IHS and it popped off clean so it seems to have cupped the IHS as intended as it pushed.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devsfan1830*
> 
> I did email the owner. Thanked him for making the tool and just told him that as contructive feedback. I did notice as I applied pressure the halves did start to flex and separate. But i absolutely thumb tightened the lock down screws hard as the instructions said to do. I just think plain acetal is not string enough to deal with that kind of pressure on thin threads.


The delid mate tool is the same, the threads are fine honestly, but as I stated before, if the slide hits the bottom half of the IHS then you'll have a lot of extra pressure and it will obviously strip the threads etc.


----------



## devsfan1830

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The delid mate tool is the same, the threads are fine honestly, but as I stated before, if the slide hits the bottom half of the IHS then you'll have a lot of extra pressure and it will obviously strip the threads etc.


Ah gotcha. Its possible that happened. I heard a click before the pop. Opened it, saw nothing then tried again. Heard a click and it advanced further until finally the pop i wanted. So its possible the slide hit and popped over the lower lip but never properly seated over the top ridge of the IHS.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devsfan1830*
> 
> Ah gotcha. Its possible that happened. I heard a click before the pop. Opened it, saw nothing then tried again. Heard a click and it advanced further until finally the pop i wanted. So its possible the slide hit and popped over the lower lip but never properly seated over the top ridge of the IHS.


Sounds very likely, maybe the slide was too loose sadly and caused the pressure to build up on the threads, a metal insert could stop threads stripping but what's to say the insert won't pop out of the plastic? Anyway is it going to be replaced under warranty? My delid mate was, I bought it from a member who had his threads destroyed then they replaced it and I got the brand new one for a bit cheaper.


----------



## devsfan1830

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Sounds very likely, maybe the slide was too loose sadly and caused the pressure to build up on the threads, a metal insert could stop threads stripping but what's to say the insert won't pop out of the plastic? Anyway is it going to be replaced under warranty? My delid mate was, I bought it from a member who had his threads destroyed then they replaced it and I got the brand new one for a bit cheaper.


I'll update if it does. The product page does not list any kind of warranty. This was a kickstarter product initially so I think its just a side business of a CNC shop. Since this was the only de-lid I'll be doing for now I'm not too worried about it. Down the road if I ever need to upgrade my CPU I might need a new tool anyways if the IHS spec changes at all.


----------



## devsfan1830

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Sounds very likely, maybe the slide was too loose sadly and caused the pressure to build up on the threads, a metal insert could stop threads stripping but what's to say the insert won't pop out of the plastic? Anyway is it going to be replaced under warranty? My delid mate was, I bought it from a member who had his threads destroyed then they replaced it and I got the brand new one for a bit cheaper.


He shipped out a new top half this morning! He claims hes tested extensively it himself and others have had over 10 repeated delids without failure. So I'm not sure what the hell happened with mine. Perhaps just a fluke but I'm going to be much more cautious with the new one.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *devsfan1830*
> 
> He shipped out a new top half this morning! He claims hes tested extensively it himself and others have had over 10 repeated delids without failure. So I'm not sure what the hell happened with mine. Perhaps just a fluke but I'm going to be much more cautious with the new one.


Sweet! Nice one!


----------



## NiKiZ

Well, I just delidded my i5 6600K. I don't have Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra yet, so I used some Noctua NT-H1. I was a bit surprised by the 15 degrees Celsius temperature drop!

Just delidded


Cleaned it up a bit


Before delidding:


After delid:


I'll have to see, if I can overclock this a bit more.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Well, I just delidded my i5 6600K. I don't have Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra yet, so I used some Noctua NT-H1. I was a bit surprised by the 15 degrees Celsius temperature drop!
> 
> Just delidded
> 
> 
> Cleaned it up a bit
> 
> 
> Before delidding:
> 
> 
> After delid:
> 
> 
> I'll have to see, if I can overclock this a bit more.


Those are quite some high temps, wahoo man. Id keep an eye out on the temps though, noctua does NOT last long at all on a die so be careful.


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Those are quite some high temps, wahoo man. Id keep an eye out on the temps though, noctua does NOT last long at all on a die so be careful.


They are a bit high, but it won't go much over 60 degrees when gaming. I will replace the NT-H1 with Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra next week.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> They are a bit high, but it won't go much over 60 degrees when gaming. I will replace the NT-H1 with Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra next week.


Just making sure, its what i used first. And although temps were IDENTICAL to CLU, it lasted about a day or two lol. I went from 43°C or so to 48°C in a matter of days. Couldn't figure out why till i searched the forum.


----------



## Rei86

So need to rearrange and redo my wiring.
Already used some RV Silicone to mate the IHS back to the chip but thinking about delid it again replace my CLU with some Thermal Grizzly.

Anyone have experience with that stuff? And obviously the Conductonaut one.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> So need to rearrange and redo my wiring.
> Already used some RV Silicone to mate the IHS back to the chip but thinking about delid it again replace my CLU with some Thermal Grizzly.
> 
> Anyone have experience with that stuff? And obviously the Conductonaut one.


I don't have any personal experience but from my understanding the results are nearly identical with any liquid metal compound assuming the application is correct. I doubt you would see much if any improvement.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> So need to rearrange and redo my wiring.
> Already used some RV Silicone to mate the IHS back to the chip but thinking about delid it again replace my CLU with some Thermal Grizzly.
> 
> Anyone have experience with that stuff? And obviously the Conductonaut one.


Yup don't bother. Ive noticed no difference between Noctua and CLU my temps were identical. Between CLU and Conductonaut youd probably see a tiny bit of difference within the margin of error but would probably be due to a difference in application.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rei86*
> 
> So need to rearrange and redo my wiring.
> Already used some RV Silicone to mate the IHS back to the chip but thinking about delid it again replace my CLU with some Thermal Grizzly.
> 
> Anyone have experience with that stuff? And obviously the Conductonaut one.


CLU and Grizzly perform the same within a margin of error so CLU will be fine.


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Just making sure, its what i used first. And although temps were IDENTICAL to CLU, it lasted about a day or two lol. I went from 43°C or so to 48°C in a matter of days. Couldn't figure out why till i searched the forum.


Damn, you were right. The NT-H1 doesn't last that well on the die. I hit 100 Celsius on one of the cores today.


I get some money on Thursday and I'll order some CLU then. I guess I have to replace the paste daily until then..


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Damn, you were right. The NT-H1 doesn't last that well on the die. I hit 100 Celsius on one of the cores today.
> 
> 
> I get some money on Thursday and I'll order some CLU then. I guess I have to replace the paste daily until then..


Yea whats even crazier is the 17°C variation between that one core and the other cores. Might have run out right there or the pressure is greater then.

I think there is only one TIM that someone mentioned that actually lasts on bare die. I guess its just the direct heat and pressure that destroys thermal pastes. Its why clu/conductonaut/phobya lm that dont press out or degrade over time.

The issue with MOST thermal paste reviews is they test it on the IHS or between two pieces of copper. Ive yet to see one test on bare die, i tried out 2 different TIMs on the die then CLU. All 3 temps were within a margin of error, however it was durability that was different on all 3.

Whats weird is on my 35w i5 3350p, ive got some hydronaut on bare die with the IHS back on top and its perfectly fine. Temps havent changed in 3months.


----------



## Benjiw

I really thought this was over and done with, it was concluded that normal thermal paste is too thick and pumps out from under the IHS and die because that is what it's designed to do when applied to the IHS and then compressed with a cooler for full coverage and closes gaps. LM TIM doesn't do this because of how it is, it's thin and doesn't react to pressure the same way, it will literally sit there for years not giving a single .....

This is why everyone says to use any LM under the IHS and any TIM on top or better yet get rid of the IHS and run naked with LM.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I really thought this was over and done with, it was concluded that normal thermal paste is too thick and pumps out from under the IHS and die because that is what it's designed to do when applied to the IHS and then compressed with a cooler for full coverage and closes gaps. LM TIM doesn't do this because of how it is, it's thin and doesn't react to pressure the same way, it will literally sit there for years not giving a single .....
> 
> This is why everyone says to use any LM under the IHS and any TIM on top or better yet get rid of the IHS and run naked with LM.


Actually i wouldnt say its too thick, if anything its too thin under heat. Case in point? Intel TIM is ridiculously thick and not viscous at all and that stuff lasts for AGES on the die. I wish i could get my hands on some to try bare die see how long it lasts.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

You guys think I'd be able to shave off a few C if I lapp the CPU? I'm determining if its worth it or not...
CPU cooler is lapped extremely well and I'm sure its flat.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> ~
> The issue with MOST thermal paste reviews is they test it on the IHS or between two pieces of copper. Ive yet to see one test on bare die, i tried out 2 different TIMs on the die then CLU. All 3 temps were within a margin of error, however it was durability that was different on all 3.
> ~


Although dated, this should have some worth;

https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/bare-die-testing-a-delidded-3770k-an-h100-and-9-different-tims.2285595/


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> You guys think I'd be able to shave off a few C if I lapp the CPU? I'm determining if its worth it or not...
> CPU cooler is lapped extremely well and I'm sure its flat.


That already looks like a beautiful spread to be honest. Only the middle of the IHS actually gets hot. The reason the lapping helps is because of heat spread. It helps cool the ENTIRE ihs when its lapped.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Although dated, this should have some worth;
> 
> https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/bare-die-testing-a-delidded-3770k-an-h100-and-9-different-tims.2285595/


Yea ive seen this one a few times, i just dont like how he measured everything. The block is going to sit directly on the cpu socket anyways when bare die so no reason to really put spacers under there. His results are pretty much identical to mine, there is ZERO difference between Noctua and CLU temps at initial installation. He even used WAY too much CLU so his results might be skewed. The main problem, no one tests these long term. I wait a month before posting my results, and that was with Noctua being applied TWICE because of the temp rise within a couple days.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I really thought this was over and done with, it was concluded that normal thermal paste is too thick and pumps out from under the IHS and die because that is what it's designed to do when applied to the IHS and then compressed with a cooler for full coverage and closes gaps. LM TIM doesn't do this because of how it is, it's thin and doesn't react to pressure the same way, it will literally sit there for years not giving a single .....
> 
> This is why everyone says to use any LM under the IHS and any TIM on top or better yet get rid of the IHS and run naked with LM.


Quote:


> it will literally sit there for years not giving a single .....


October will make it one year since doing two Skylake delids using CLU. Noticed increasing CPU core temperatures during stress testing as the months went by. My CLU sample has hardened in the syringe/cap and is now unusable.


----------



## Rei86

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Actually i wouldnt say its too thick, if anything its too thin under heat. Case in point? Intel TIM is ridiculously thick and not viscous at all and that stuff lasts for AGES on the die. I wish i could get my hands on some to try bare die see how long it lasts.


https://www.dowcorning.com/content/electronics/electronicsproducts/thermal-management-solutions-overview.aspx

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/232060616950?lpid=82&chn=ps&ul_noapp=true

You can get them in tubs too.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> October will make it one year since doing two Skylake delids using CLU. Noticed increasing CPU core temperatures during stress testing as the months went by. My CLU sample has hardened in the syringe/cap and is now unusable.


Strange as mine came with a blocked nozzle too but temps have never changed and its been months, ambient temps might be your issue not really anything CLU can do to magic that away.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Actually i wouldnt say its too thick, if anything its too thin under heat. Case in point? Intel TIM is ridiculously thick and not viscous at all and that stuff lasts for AGES on the die. I wish i could get my hands on some to try bare die see how long it lasts.


Considering we delid to remove that TIM and the silicone, I'm not sure why you would put that ish back on the die at all.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> October will make it one year since doing two Skylake delids using CLU. Noticed increasing CPU core temperatures during stress testing as the months went by. My CLU sample has hardened in the syringe/cap and is now unusable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Strange as mine came with a blocked nozzle too but temps have never changed and its been months, ambient temps might be your issue not really anything CLU can do to magic that away.
Click to expand...

Mine has the same issue. I just barely had enough non-hardened CLU to get my die covered...the rest, like 0.5g is solidified... Maybe pop it in the microwave for a few seconds to turn it back into a liquid...








 jkjkjk but I do have the hardening issue. And this is my 2nd tube that'd done it...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Strange as mine came with a blocked nozzle too but temps have never changed and its been months, ambient temps might be your issue not really anything CLU can do to magic that away.
> Considering we delid to remove that TIM and the silicone, I'm not sure why you would put that ish back on the die at all.


Youd be quite surprised at how good it actually is. I need to find the thread online somewhere BUT, the thread starter compared the intel TIM to Noctua TIM on the die WITHOUT the silicone and the IHS back on and the Intel TIM did better in every single instance, idle, stock speed and overclocked.

Its a common misconception that intel tim is garbage but its not. It doesnt pump out, it doesnt change temps over a couple years (i know because my spare pc has never had the TIM changed under the die and temps haven't changed one bit). It just keeps getting repeated online and people keep believing it. Its actually quality stuff, the main issue is the .06mm gap that the silicone leaves, thats enough to create a 10°C average temp difference between stock and delided. Its why skylake and haswell havent seen as dramatic a temp change as ivy and sandy as they used even more silicone and had a bigger gap. Just an fyi lol.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Mine has the same issue. I just barely had enough non-hardened CLU to get my die covered...the rest, like 0.5g is solidified... Maybe pop it in the microwave for a few seconds to turn it back into a liquid...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jkjkjk but I do have the hardening issue. And this is my 2nd tube that'd done it...


Btw i think the CLU that has a hardening issue probably has problems harderning over time on the die but im not sure. This application ive put on my die won't be taken off for a while so ill check it in a while to see if it etched my block and hardened.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Strange as mine came with a blocked nozzle too but temps have never changed and its been months, ambient temps might be your issue not really anything CLU can do to magic that away.


Quote:


> Strange as mine came with a blocked nozzle


Check out one and two star CLU reviews at Amazon here;

http://tinyurl.com/zanodf4
Quote:


> ambient temps might be your issue


Ambient temps haven't increased by more than 5F but CPU core max temps have increased by 7-10C during stress testing. I tend to keep fairly good records with screenshots of test results.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Youd be quite surprised at how good it actually is. I need to find the thread online somewhere BUT, the thread starter compared the intel TIM to Noctua TIM on the die WITHOUT the silicone and the IHS back on and the Intel TIM did better in every single instance, idle, stock speed and overclocked.
> 
> Its a common misconception that intel tim is garbage but its not. It doesnt pump out, it doesnt change temps over a couple years (i know because my spare pc has never had the TIM changed under the die and temps haven't changed one bit). It just keeps getting repeated online and people keep believing it. Its actually quality stuff, the main issue is the .06mm gap that the silicone leaves, thats enough to create a 10°C average temp difference between stock and delided. Its why skylake and haswell havent seen as dramatic a temp change as ivy and sandy as they used even more silicone and had a bigger gap. Just an fyi lol.


Quote:


> the main issue is the .06mm gap that the silicone leaves, thats enough to create a 10°C average temp difference between stock and delided


That gap is there after cleaning away old silicone sealant and old TIM and just resting the clean IHS on the clean die. I assume you're referring to the gap that can be seen here;

http://www.pbase.com/eldata/image/161598087/original


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Check out one and two star CLU reviews at Amazon here;
> 
> http://tinyurl.com/zanodf4
> 
> Ambient temps haven't increased by more than 5F but CPU core max temps have increased by 7-10C during stress testing. I tend to keep fairly good records with screenshots of test results.


Not sure then, use what you like but I've had no issues with CLU yet so I'll continue to use it, I've sold my 4670k and z97 board etc so the next chip that's getting the naked treatment is a 6700k which I'm going to use a shim to enable me to completely remove the IHS.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> That gap is there after cleaning away old silicone sealant and old TIM and just resting the clean IHS on the clean die. I assume you're referring to the gap that can be seen here;
> 
> http://www.pbase.com/eldata/image/161598087/original


Well that .06mm im talking about is the gap caused by the silicone increasing the height of the ihs by .06mm off the wafer. That in turn causes the IHS to leave a gap between the TIM the die and the IHS. In a perfect world you want NO thermal material between two surfaces. But we don't live in a perfect world so it must be used. It must be used as microscopic as possible.

Its why running bare die is another advantage. Less copper, less TIM, better temps.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Well that .06mm im talking about is the gap caused by the silicone increasing the height of the ihs by .06mm off the wafer. That in turn causes the IHS to leave a gap between the TIM the die and the IHS. In a perfect world you want NO thermal material between two surfaces. But we don't live in a perfect world so it must be used. It must be used as microscopic as possible.
> 
> Its why running bare die is another advantage. Less copper, less TIM, better temps.


The gap between the base of the IHS and wafer is by design. This ensures that the top inside of the IHS rests on the die instead of the IHS resting on the wafer. Also, it leaves sufficient room for a thin layer of sealant to exist between IHS and wafer for a better bond. *Pressure has to be applied to the top of the IHS, during the sealant drying process, in order to ensure that what you have described doesn't happen*. Unfortunately, there are those who see the gap and sealant, as in the picture linked to above, and assume what you have.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> The gap between the base of the IHS and wafer is by design. This ensures that the top inside of the IHS rests on the die instead of the IHS resting on the wafer. Also, it leaves sufficient room for a thin layer of sealant to exist between IHS and wafer for a better bond. *Pressure has to be applied to the top of the IHS, during the sealant drying process, in order to ensure that what you have described doesn't happen*. Unfortunately, there are those who see the gap and sealant, as in the picture linked to above, and assume what you have.


Its not an assumption, its been proven that the issue is the gap between the ihs and the wafer/die. That .06mm is enough of a gap to raise temperatures. You want the IHS to sit so flush against the die that a microscopic bond of TIM/LM is in between. Your assessment is wrong sorry to say, this has been proven many times by me and many other people.

You WANT zero gap between the IHS and the die, ZERO. Unfortunately because of manufacturing tolerances, and the silicone this does not happen. The temp drops arent just from adding clu or new TIM, the drops are cause because the gap between the IHS and die has been reduced by .06mm, that .06mm is plenty, PLENTY to cause the TIM to do its job poorly.

Btw its easy to check this, just take your IHS off and look at how the TIM is spread. Just look at this picture, the TIM on the die/ihs is too thick, caused by the IHS being elevated .06mm caused by the silicone.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its not an assumption, its been proven that the issue is the gap between the ihs and the wafer/die. That .06mm is enough of a gap to raise temperatures. You want the IHS to sit so flush against the die that a microscopic bond of TIM/LM is in between. Your assessment is wrong sorry to say, this has been proven many times by me and many other people.
> 
> You WANT zero gap between the IHS and the die, ZERO. Unfortunately because of manufacturing tolerances, and the silicone this does not happen. The temp drops arent just from adding clu or new TIM, the drops are cause because the gap between the IHS and die has been reduced by .06mm, that .06mm is plenty, PLENTY to cause the TIM to do its job poorly.
> 
> Btw its easy to check this, just take your IHS off and look at how the TIM is spread. Just look at this picture, the TIM on the die/ihs is too thick, caused by the IHS being elevated .06mm caused by the silicone.


Does the image below help (wafer=substrate);



If not, then nothing will and I have no more time to waste on this.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

If you need more proof... my IHS had a thick coat of sealant between that and the substrate... definite gap. Look at all that TIM!!!! Tim the tool man taylor!


----------



## oparr

Because a gap existed to allow for the sealant. The sealant didn't create the gap.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Clueless!!! Sorry, I have no patience with frigging idiots!!!


The image you posted is the best possible scenario, but in most cases the glue under the IHS causes it to lift and it doesn't make good pressure so cooling isn't as good.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The image you posted is the best possible scenario, but in most cases the glue under the IHS causes it to lift and it doesn't make good pressure so cooling isn't as good.


Not if pressure is applied during the drying process. Why do you think Rockit provides a resealing attachment which does exactly that? I used the Z-axis of my Mill.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Not if pressure is applied during the drying process. Why do you thing Rockit provides a resealing attachment which does exactly that? I used the Z-axis of my Mill.


You don't need to glue the IHS back on in the first place... the clamp holds it in place or you can do what I do and never use the IHS again.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> You don't need to glue the IHS back on in the first place... the clamp holds it in place or you can do what I do and never use the IHS again.


Been there done that. I really came here to find out whether there were any LM TIMs with better longevity than CLU and got side tracked.


----------



## Arctucas

I tacked the corners of my IHS back down with PermaTex just to make it easier to install in the socket without having to loosen the hold-down or otherwise prevent the IHS from sliding when I closed the cover.

I suppose reinstalling the IHS at all is totally unnecessary...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> I tacked the corners of my IHS back down with PermaTex just to make it easier to install in the socket without having to loosen the hold-down or otherwise prevent the IHS from sliding when I closed the cover.
> 
> I suppose reinstalling the IHS at all is totally unnecessary...


Yep, want proof?


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Yep, want proof?


Not at all necessary, but thanks.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Not at all necessary, but thanks.


I was just pimping out my system again because it was relevant but my gf's i5 will probably be delidded and the IHS glued back on.


----------



## Arctucas

I might do bare die if and when I get another motherboard, but at this point, I am not feeling inclined to do the mod.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> I might do bare die if and when I get another motherboard, but at this point, I am not feeling inclined to do the mod.


Hoping I can be the first to do it on a skylake chip using a shim or modding the base plate for the waterblock. Hoping to just shim it with 0.6mm of copper maybe less.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Or when people don't understand FACT its better to just stop talking.
> 
> You do understand that TIM/LM is actually a hindrance right? The thermal conductivity of TIM is anywhere between 5w/mK to 75w/mK. That sounds fantastic right? Wrong. The thermal conductivity of copper is 400w/mK. So in theory you don't want any TIM. You want the copper to sit flush against the DIE, with nothing in between, including air which has a thermal conductivity of .02w/mK.
> 
> Not hard to understand but i guess that eludes you. Finally post, hopefully it helps you understand why you want no gap anywhere in between thermal conductive materials.


Here's your problem....You're yet to figure out how there can be no gap between the IHS and die when there's sealant between the IHS and wafer. And your misunderstanding is providing comic relief for the savvy amongst us in this thread. Keep it up, I like a good laugh every now and then.


----------



## deepor

It just makes sense that there's a gap between IHS and die in the CPU's original state, and that's where the strangely high temperatures come from before delidding. In my mind, everything points to this.

First, just looking at a delidded CPU, it seems it's typical that people find a suspiciously thick amount of TIM stuck on the die (or IHS).

Next, it was shown in experiments that the original TIM that's used by Intel is actually a very good product. If that's the case, that you can get strongly improved temperatures by using (for example) NT-H1 after delidding points to there being a gap in the original state. The gap would explain why the temperatures are worse with Intel's TIM compared to NT-H1 etc.

Then, people often find suspiciously thick amount of silicone glue between IHS edges and PCB. This observation is a bit weak because a gap in that spot is normal as the IHS is supposed to be able to rest on top of the die's surface without touching the PCB, so a certain amount of gap between IHS and PCB that gets filled by glue has to always be there. It's still suspicious that this seems to be a bit thick often.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> [...]


I don't think I can find those experiments with Intel's TIM. I think it was somewhere here on this forum. The way I remember it, the person simply tried to put the IHS back on after cleaning off the glue, but not cleaning off the TIM.

You might be misunderstanding what people here think when they talk about a gap between die and IHS. It seems it's known that when you look at the parts when they are completely clean and without TIM and without glue, the gap you will see is between the IHS edges and the PCB while there's no gap at all between die and the middle of the IHS. At least this was the case a long time ago with 3570K and 3770K. There's was this post here four years ago which shows this in a neat .gif:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/1300#post_18419880



It makes it obvious how the parts are designed. In the design, it seems there's not supposed to be any gap between die and IHS. It's just that, this is not what happens in practice. After a CPU goes through manufacturing, it seems to usually end up with a gap there.

That's perhaps where the misunderstanding here happens? When people talk about there being a gap between die and IHS, they mean there's a gap in practice. They aren't talking about the theoretical design.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I don't think I can find those experiments with Intel's TIM. I think it was somewhere here on this forum. The way I remember it, the person simply tried to put the IHS back on after cleaning off the glue, but not cleaning off the TIM.
> 
> You might be misunderstanding what people here think when they talk about a gap between die and IHS. It seems it's known that when you look at the parts when they are completely clean and without TIM and without glue, the gap you will see is between the IHS edges and the PCB while there's no gap at all between die and the middle of the IHS. At least this was the case a long time ago with 3570K and 3770K. There's was this post here four years ago which shows this in a neat .gif:
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/1300#post_18419880
> 
> 
> 
> It makes it obvious how the parts are designed. In the design, it seems there's not supposed to be any gap between die and IHS. It's just that, this is not what happens in practice. After a CPU goes through manufacturing, it seems to usually end up with a gap there.
> 
> That's perhaps where the misunderstanding here happens? When people talk about there being a gap between die and IHS, they mean there's a gap in practice. They aren't talking about the theoretical design.


There are tools for measuring gaps, example;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feeler_gauge

One can also use a piece of paper in this case. If the wafer is clean like this;

http://www.pbase.com/eldata/image/161511125/original

And the IHS is equally as clean where it counts most (no picture, use imagination), then it stands to reason that there can be *no gap* between IHS and die if when the IHS is placed over the die, there *is a gap* all around between IHS and wafer. The IHS cannot levitate, it has to be resting on the die. The base of the IHS has to be sanded down in the unlikely event that there is no gap between IHS and wafer.

This is what one should ascertain before applying the new TIM and sealant. *Pressure has to be applied while the sealant is curing so that the sealant thickness between IHS and wafer, where it counts most, is no greater than the original gap*. Excess sealant will be forced out of the gap on both sides, while in its liquid state, long before the sealant starts to cure.

Now off to watch something on Netflix.


----------



## deepor

Well... that's simply not what happens in practice in Intel's factories. There seems to be a gap there after manufacturing. I don't know what they are doing. Perhaps they don't use enough pressure when installing the IHS onto the CPU? Or perhaps they use enough pressure but the plunger that installs the IHS plunges down hard for just a split second, and then it pulls away immediately afterwards and there's no time for the excess TIM and glue to get pushed out of the way?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Well... that's simply not what happens in practice in Intel's factories. There seems to be a gap there after manufacturing. I don't know what they are doing. Perhaps they don't use enough pressure when installing the IHS onto the CPU? Or perhaps they use enough pressure but the plunger that installs the IHS plunges down hard for just a split second, and then it pulls away immediately afterwards and there's no time for the excess TIM and glue to get pushed out of the way?


Dunno, there is obviously an issue because once we remove the sealant the issue is gone so.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

What would happen when someone glues the IHS on the PCB from the exterior? Place the lid, and glue around the edge, no material between the IHS and pcb, however still secure?


----------



## 0ldChicken

so Ive been getting instant crashes when using voltages over 1.4v since switching to naked mount. I've been pushing for 5.0GHz but I can't run over 1.4v now, even at known stable clocks. Benji had mentioned that naked MIGHT lower my necessary voltage, but I don't think this is what he was talking about haha.

anybody else had any similar issues? I'm still going through, trying to figure out what it could be. I've reset my bios to default and started over but the "problem" persists. I'm wondering if the "overvoltage" jumper has anything to do with it? I was always under the impression that was more for ln2 and the likes but I don't know. When does it become necessary to move that jumper?

edit: btw, I assumed that since I was using 1.43v for 5.0GHz before that I needed to go higher since it still wasn't stable. I'm currently testing 5.0GHz at 1.399v since that is as high as I can go... so far so good








*maybe* I don't need to go over 1.4v for 5.0GHz after all!! I'm still going to need to figure this out though. Since when is enough ever enough?


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Well... that's simply not what happens in practice in Intel's factories. There seems to be a gap there after manufacturing. I don't know what they are doing. Perhaps they don't use enough pressure when installing the IHS onto the CPU? Or perhaps they use enough pressure but the plunger that installs the IHS plunges down hard for just a split second, and then it pulls away immediately afterwards and there's no time for the excess TIM and glue to get pushed out of the way?


More relevant is the recent bit of information on how to delid and reseal properly. What Intel did or doesn't do is irrelevant. Especially since one may never know.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Dunno, there is obviously an issue because once we remove the sealant the issue is gone so.


*Hear ye, hear ye, lads and lassies....*

For those who have a Rockit 88 delid tool but do not have the Re-lid kit, then get one if resealing is your preferred approach. *Applying pressure while the sealant cures should be a necessary step*. Whether Intel does or doesn't do that is irrelevant. The required pressure here is way less than what the MB's CPU retention mechanism and cooler/block would normally exert. The reason for not just using the retention mechanism, while the sealant cures, is because positioning is likely to shift during CPU installation with uncured sealant. Furthermore, we're only talking an extra $8 for those who're yet to purchase either.

Link to kit;
http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/re-lid-kit


----------



## jdorje

Silicon != silicone


----------



## alancsalt

Different.

http://www.livescience.com/37598-silicon-or-silicone-chips-implants.html


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> so Ive been getting instant crashes when using voltages over 1.4v since switching to naked mount. I've been pushing for 5.0GHz but I can't run over 1.4v now, even at known stable clocks. Benji had mentioned that naked MIGHT lower my necessary voltage, but I don't think this is what he was talking about haha.
> 
> anybody else had any similar issues? I'm still going through, trying to figure out what it could be. I've reset my bios to default and started over but the "problem" persists. I'm wondering if the "overvoltage" jumper has anything to do with it? I was always under the impression that was more for ln2 and the likes but I don't know. When does it become necessary to move that jumper?
> 
> edit: btw, I assumed that since I was using 1.43v for 5.0GHz before that I needed to go higher since it still wasn't stable. I'm currently testing 5.0GHz at 1.399v since that is as high as I can go... so far so good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *maybe* I don't need to go over 1.4v for 5.0GHz after all!! I'm still going to need to figure this out though. Since when is enough ever enough?


Heat makes chips less efficient in using volts is the Tl;Dr of it thats why people using exotic cooling can use the same volts as me for 4.7ghz for 5ghz+ you need to tweak and fine tune other settings to bring down voltages too but the biggest enemy for your chip is heat and more volts is more heat. I've had issues with my loop recently so not been able to do any testing and fine tuning plus tbh I've sold my 4670k to a friend who's giving me the funds for a 6700k next month so this chip will go back to being clothed and run at a respectable voltage for an easy life.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> *Hear ye, hear ye, lads and lassies....*
> 
> For those who have a Rockit 88 delid tool but do not have the Re-lid kit, then get one if resealing is your preferred approach. *Applying pressure while the sealant cures should be a necessary step*. Whether Intel does or doesn't do that is irrelevant. The required pressure here is way less than what the MB's CPU retention mechanism and cooler/block would normally exert. The reason for not just using the retention mechanism, while the sealant cures, is because positioning is likely to shift during CPU installation with uncured sealant. Furthermore, we're only talking an extra $8 for those who're yet to purchase either.
> 
> Link to kit;
> http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/re-lid-kit


Hmm... must have changed, my Rockit 88 came with the re-lid kit. I paid $34.88 plus $8.00 shipping.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Heat makes chips less efficient in using volts is the Tl;Dr of it thats why people using exotic cooling can use the same volts as me for 4.7ghz for 5ghz+ you need to tweak and fine tune other settings to bring down voltages too but the biggest enemy for your chip is heat and more volts is more heat. I've had issues with my loop recently so not been able to do any testing and fine tuning plus tbh I've sold my 4670k to a friend who's giving me the funds for a 6700k next month so this chip will go back to being clothed and run at a respectable voltage for an easy life.


I understand that more V is more heat, but I'm topping out at 65°c with x264v2 when using 4.8ghz and 1.39v. change it to 1.41v, keeping 4.8ghz and the temps rise a few degrees before crashing within seconds. I've spent hours going through my bios and tweaking various settings and combos of settings but I haven't come up with a solution yet. I plan on getting more info together and posting in the haswell or devil's canyon thread when I get the time.

I just find it really strange that I instantly crash with 1.4v+ now. Used to not be an issue other than the heat, which is now less of an issue...

Thanks for the reply Benji


----------



## Jimbags

Just delidded my 2nd cpu. i7 3770k used razor method successfully for the 2nd time too







.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I understand that more V is more heat, but I'm topping out at 65°c with x264v2 when using 4.8ghz and 1.39v. change it to 1.41v, keeping 4.8ghz and the temps rise a few degrees before crashing within seconds. I've spent hours going through my bios and tweaking various settings and combos of settings but I haven't come up with a solution yet. I plan on getting more info together and posting in the haswell or devil's canyon thread when I get the time.
> 
> I just find it really strange that I instantly crash with 1.4v+ now. Used to not be an issue other than the heat, which is now less of an issue...
> 
> Thanks for the reply Benji


Make sure all your thumb screws are tightened all the way down but not with a lot of force, if you go mad with them you can cause issues with there being too much pressure which I learned the hard way lol.

Yes I under stand but keeping it as cool as possible is your main goal in reducing volts as far as possible I'd say you've done that pretty well. Are you adjusting cache and voltage and or input voltages also?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> Just delidded my 2nd cpu. i7 3770k used razor method successfully for the 2nd time too
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Yiiiiis yiiiiiiiiis







Post info and I'll add it!

As for the chats, I'm for discussions, just watch the finger wagging and name calling (I know it never happened per se, but just a forethought)


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alancsalt*
> 
> Different.
> 
> http://www.livescience.com/37598-silicon-or-silicone-chips-implants.html


Yeah, good point to bring up.









I've seen a few members here referring to "silicone" as "silicon" which is not correct.
Or was that "silicone" instead of "silicon"?
Whatever, lol.


----------



## Jimbags

OCN name:Jimbags
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Kryonaut Thermal grizzly
Mhz gained: didnt do before test but @ 4.5 1.3v
OC after delid: as above
Temp drops:Max temp intel burn test on very high is 67c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:Shown in pic
Havent messed with oc or voltage this is just my initial settings but pretty pleased so far


----------



## Jimbags

What are you guys bickering about? Get back to the topic at hand, or youll get the thread locked.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> You obviously don't play chess.


You can't play chess if the other player is throwing the board on the ground and having a fit. You refuse to view any evidence so here I pulled it out for you:



He measured the height of the cpu before and after delidding to get the height of the shim.

What evidence do you have other then your presumptions?


----------



## Benjiw

Can we all ignore him now, it's obvious he doesn't want to listen and he's just going to cause someone to get an infraction and or the thread locked.

Blue, ignore him for goodness sake.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> You can't play chess if the other player is throwing the board on the ground and having a fit. You refuse to view any evidence so here I pulled it out for you:
> 
> 
> 
> He measured the height of the cpu before and after delidding to get the height of the shim.
> 
> What evidence do you have other then your presumptions?


Wow would you just look at that, it literally mirrors everything everyone else in this thread has experienced...


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Is it;
> 
> 1) Every recent Intel consumer grade CPU has an issue because of the design and use of sealant?
> 2) Some recent Intel consumer grade CPUs have an issue?
> 3) In no way is it possible to have a proper thermal interface because of the design and use of sealant?
> 
> Feel free to amend the above or even add other discussion points.


It is not an issue with the design because they chose to do it possibly for multiple reasons.
1) The sealant provides a barrier of protection from moisture
2) They leave a small channel without sealant likely to give it breathing so heat has no way to build up under the IHS
3) The small gap protects from you crushing the die during handling or getting damaged during shipping.
4) The "issue" is easily resolved by using cooling sufficient enough to dissipate it

Really delidding is for the additional cooling. It is not really a design flaw as much as it is designed to easily be stuck together and sealed and protected with more then enough dissipation. They aren't giving you the best possible they are giving you what is efficient. The TIM is still good but they have been known to fail in application (very rare) which is when someone may see a spike in 1-2 cores because one side of the die is not getting sufficient contact which is where delidding would fix the issue (since new TIM is applied). Of course after years of use TIM should be replaced but even MX-4 is rated to last 8 years but pumps out from under the IHS in days so they are using a more of a solid TIM that works and lasts a very long time likely exceed the life of the CPU if it is applied correctly. After 5+ years of use especially with overclocking any TIM would need replacing but that is not the fault of Intel who did all their testing at stock and likely rated the TIM at 10+ years.


----------



## Benjiw

The IHS was invented because people used to put their coolers on wrong and damage the die. I don't use mine, I see no reason to and my cooling is pretty epic as I can go all the way up to 1.6v without hitting thermal limits.


----------



## dmfree88

Yeah the IHS makes contact with the die without sealant. That is probably part of the reason regular paste pumps out because the gap is actually extremely small (even when touching there is still gaps). Liquid metal fills the gaps acting like solder but paste just pushes away and due to not enough metal particles filling the small gaps it doesnt make full contact? That is just my guess but I think people have gone naked and paste pumps out though too right? You would think the gap would vary from mount to mount and would be further away than the IHS would be and they still have that problem so I really am not sure what happens there.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> It is not an issue with the design because they chose to do it possibly for multiple reasons.
> 1) The sealant provides a barrier of protection from moisture
> 2) They leave a small channel without sealant likely to give it breathing so heat has no way to build up under the IHS
> 3) The small gap protects from you crushing the die during handling or getting damaged during shipping.
> 4) The "issue" is easily resolved by using cooling sufficient enough to dissipate it
> 
> Really delidding is for the additional cooling. It is not really a design flaw as much as it is designed to easily be stuck together and sealed and protected with more then enough dissipation. They aren't giving you the best possible they are giving you what is efficient. The TIM is still good but they have been known to fail in application (very rare) which is when someone may see a spike in 1-2 cores because one side of the die is not getting sufficient contact which is where delidding would fix the issue (since new TIM is applied). Of course after years of use TIM should be replaced but even MX-4 is rated to last 8 years but pumps out from under the IHS in days so they are using a more of a solid TIM that works and lasts a very long time likely exceed the life of the CPU if it is applied correctly. After 5+ years of use especially with overclocking any TIM would need replacing but that is not the fault of Intel who did all their testing at stock and likely rated the TIM at 10+ years.


Quote:


> 3) The small gap protects from you crushing the die during handling or getting damaged during shipping.


Are you suggesting that with every recent Intel consumer CPU, a gap must exist even *after* re-lidding? If so, then we can only agree to disagree.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The IHS was invented because people used to put their coolers on wrong and damage the die. I don't use mine, I see no reason to and my cooling is pretty epic as I can go all the way up to 1.6v without hitting thermal limits.


Use of heat spreaders is SOP in certain thermal interface designs. Read all about it;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_spreader
Quote:


> "The use of a heat spreader is an important part of an economically optimal design for transferring heat from high to low heat flux media."


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Use of heat spreaders is SOP in certain thermal interface designs. Read all about it;
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_spreader


Ah thats why my cpu stays a lot more cooler without my "heat spreader"? even cooler than people who have delidded and then reused the IHS? I can go all the way up to 1.6v and I never hit 100c.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Ah thats why my cpu stays a lot more cooler without my "heat spreader"? even cooler than people who have delidded and then reused the IHS? I can go all the way up to 1.6v and I never hit 100c.


Just indicating that you made this up;
Quote:


> The IHS was invented because people used to put their coolers on wrong and damage the die.


Also, let us be the second to know when your die develops cracks or becomes chipped. Quite common with Skylake bare die setups.


----------



## dmfree88

I am stating there is no gap after relidding except the tiny gaps of the surface and the curve of the die/IHS surfaces. Before delidding it appears there is a 0.06mm gap created by the sealant. When people use their own sealent they probably press it down hard enough the gap is not there or small enough that they still see temperature drops. I would guess at the Intel manufacturers they press down the IHS gently to squish the sealant but not hard enough to completely push it out so that a small layer creates the gap and properly seals. The TIM is also fairly thick so that itself may assist in creating the gap when they press down the IHS.

As far as the crushing I meant the gap helps protect you from accidentally crushing it by dropping it or something. If there is an additional 0.06mm of thermal paste it should protect the die from minor impacts on the IHS (like dropping the heatsink onto the CPU while its in the socket for example). The gap doesn't necessarily _need_ to be there but it probably protects it. And as I said before it only raises temps by minor amounts at stock voltages so it is likely a trade off they decided was worth it. Having TIM instead of Solder also gives the user the ability to delid and do direct on die and could reduce failure rate at the factory as they can always re-apply TIM but Solder is much more difficult
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Just indicating that you made this up;
> Also, let us be the second to know when your die develops cracks or becomes chipped. Quite common with Skylake dies.


I am sure he meant the use of a heatspreader on a CPU. But you also made a good point it allows you to switch from high flux to low flux which means you can use thermal paste instead of liquid metal which is also likely a reason they use the heatspreader.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Just indicating that you made this up;
> Also, let us be the second to know when your die develops cracks or becomes chipped. Quite common with Skylake bare die setups.


Any links? You go around saying things with no proof quite a lot and my die is perfectly fine, I've taken the block off about 5 times and temps are still great.





Just a quick note, the last image I didn't have enough LM on the die so a bit more and my temps where great.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Any links? You go around saying things with no proof quite a lot and my die is perfectly fine, I've taken the block off about 5 times and temps are still great.
> 
> Just a quick note, the last image I didn't have enough LM on the die so a bit more and my temps where great.


Quote:


> Any links


Only two...Okay embellishment factor exists but nowhere as large as in the Lochte/Rio incident.









BTW, your Cinebench CPU score is low, mine is over a 1000.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Only two...Okay embellishment factor exists but nowhere as large as in the Lochte/Rio incident.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BTW, your Cinebench CPU score is low, mine is over a 1000.


Can you post the links and can I see the screenshots of your amazing score?


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Can you post the links and can I see the screenshots of your amazing score?




Die links coming up.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> 
> 
> Die links coming up.


That isn't a 4670k Oparr... That's an 6600k.


----------



## Arizonian

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> What are you guys bickering about? Get back to the topic at hand, or youll get the thread locked.


Thank you, not thread locked but members can be thread banned or receive infractions if they cannot discuss topic without negative personal comments made toward each other.

Thread has been cleaned. No further discussion off topic. PM me directly with any questions.

Thank you everyone. Please move forward.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

So I got this from my ASUS Z170i board... wondering if this would help reseat the IHS back onto the chip...


I didn't use it on my first go around but I wonder if this would help in any way?


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> That isn't a 4670k Oparr... That's an 6600k.


It's a 6700K. Didn't say it was an apples to apples comparison, just that the score was low in comparison to mine.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> It's a 6700K. Didn't say it was an apples to apples comparison, just that the score was low in comparison to mine.


A 4/8 cpu against a 4core 4 thread cpu and your score is higher, and much much newer? I would be more surprised if you scored less than me in all honesty but seeing as my chip is in the same score range as other 4670k's then I guess I'm alright. Even a 6600k beats my cpu on cinebench but it is newer yet again.


----------



## Arctucas




----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> A 4/8 cpu against a 4core 4 thread cpu and your score is higher, and much much newer? I would be more surprised if you scored less than me in all honesty but seeing as my chip is in the same score range as other 4670k's then I guess I'm alright. Even a 6600k beats my cpu on cinebench but it is newer yet again.


Would you believe just pimping my "nogap" delid and OC?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Would you believe just pimping my "nogap" delid and OC?


It's pretty low considering you went through all that effort to glue the lid back on the screenshot only shows 4ghz but it's probably on the way down from the max oc where as mine was pinned on max. My gf hasn't delidded her 6600k but it's pinned at 4.4ghz.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> OCN name:Jimbags
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Kryonaut Thermal grizzly
> Mhz gained: didnt do before test but @ 4.5 1.3v
> OC after delid: as above
> Temp drops:Max temp intel burn test on very high is 67c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:Shown in pic
> Havent messed with oc or voltage this is just my initial settings but pretty pleased so far


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arizonian*
> 
> Thank you, not thread locked but members can be thread banned or receive infractions if they cannot discuss topic without negative personal comments made toward each other.
> 
> Thread has been cleaned. No further discussion off topic. PM me directly with any questions.
> 
> Thank you everyone. Please move forward.


Thank you kindly sir!


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It's pretty low considering you went through all that effort to glue the lid back on the screenshot only shows 4ghz but it's probably on the way down from the max oc where as mine was pinned on max. My gf hasn't delidded her 6600k but it's pinned at 4.4ghz.


We both know where it ranks among 6700K CPUs here;

http://www.overclock.net/t/1431032/top-cinebench-r15-cpu-scores

As to re-lidding, I'll always do that. Have my reasons.


----------



## HITTI

So i've been out of the game long time, like two years but been using my delidded I7 3770K for about 2 years now. I haven't touched the IHS TIM since I applied it in the first time.

When should it be changed? Please tell me 5 years! It's a messy hassle imho.

So yea I might being lazy and don't want to replace it yet lol.

Tell me good news buddies.

And! I forget how to apply the tim to my cpu the direction.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HITTI*
> 
> So i've been out of the game long time, like two years but been using my delidded I7 3770K for about 2 years now. I haven't touched the IHS TIM since I applied it in the first time.
> 
> When should it be changed? Please tell me 5 years! It's a messy hassle imho.
> 
> So yea I might being lazy and don't want to replace it yet lol.
> 
> Tell me good news buddies.
> 
> And! I forget how to apply the tim to my cpu the direction.


Supposedly it lasts forever if it is liquid metal. Not sure though myself. I don't think you need to worry about it if you have not seen any temperature changes. Even if you are up a few degrees if you are within safe temps and don't have a huge variance in core temps then you are probably fine. Probably just want to look at your old tests to see what temps you had after Delid then run the same test see what temps you get now (dont forget to account for ambient temp change) if you are within reason it should be good









Post thought: This is assuming you are talking about the TIM under the IHS. If you are talking about the TIM above the IHS on the heatsink it is heavily dependent on brand and level of heat being dissipated regularly but most of the newer brands are rated at 5+ years


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> Supposedly it lasts forever if it is liquid metal. Not sure though myself. I don't think you need to worry about it if you have not seen any temperature changes. Even if you are up a few degrees if you are within safe temps and don't have a huge variance in core temps then you are probably fine. Probably just want to look at your old tests to see what temps you had after Delid then run the same test see what temps you get now (dont forget to account for ambient temp change) if you are within reason it should be good


I've mounted my cpu block several times, not really had to reapply etc but I'll be selling this off for my 6700k then possibly Kabylake. So won't really be able to confirm if it lasts years.


----------



## Jimbags

My 3570k still going strong 2 years of having CLU under the ihs and gelid gc extreme on top







Ive actually gotten better temps with my 3770k so far. Putting it down to better CLU application. Thermal paste between ihs and block is Kryonaut, thermal grizzly this time though. Its actually quite awesome.


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jimbags*
> 
> My 3570k still going strong 2 years of having CLU under the ihs and gelid gc extreme on top
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ive actually gotten better temps with my 3770k so far. Putting it down to better CLU application. Thermal paste between ihs and block is Kryonaut, thermal grizzly this time though. Its actually quite awesome.


Yeah, I have had CLU on mine for a little over a year now, and no issues, which makes me happy! Also just started using Kryonaut as well, and I am very pleased with it. I did a comparison between CLU and Kryo, and they were basically identical.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Yeah, I have had CLU on mine for a little over a year now, and no issues, which makes me happy! Also just started using Kryonaut as well, and I am very pleased with it. I did a comparison between CLU and Kryo, and they were basically identical.


Where did you compare the 2?
My CLU is between die and ihs and kryonaut is between water block and ihs. The only thing with using a tradition paste between die and ihs is it doesnt last as long as CLU from what ive read. But CLU is known for staining copper blocks. Or completely destroys aluminium as its Gallium from memory. Bad reaction. Google it, cool to see though.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Die links coming up.


Still waiting on the links.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GTRtank*
> 
> Yeah, I have had CLU on mine for a little over a year now, and no issues, which makes me happy! Also just started using Kryonaut as well, and I am very pleased with it. I did a comparison between CLU and Kryo, and they were basically identical.


It's easier for me to get grizzly LM so might try some next time around.


----------



## HITTI

Thanks, guys. Good to read.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Still waiting on the links.


http://tinyurl.com/ja45yqa
http://tinyurl.com/hblbppt
http://tinyurl.com/ja6bwwt

AFAIK, Skylake has the smallest die of any recent Intel consumer CPU. IMO, this makes it one of the best candidates for heat spreader use for both mechanical and thermal interface reasons.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Still waiting on the links.
> It's easier for me to get grizzly LM so might try some next time around.


Yea what a waste of links, im even quoted extensively in one lol. How did we go from deliding to skylake bending and cracking (something we already all know) and why we advise people to use this.

http://www.legitreviews.com/aqua-computer-releases-shim-for-intel-skylake-processors_176351
http://www.legitreviews.com/aqua-computer-releases-shim-for-intel-skylake-processors_176351
http://www.legitreviews.com/aqua-computer-releases-shim-for-intel-skylake-processors_176351


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea what a waste of links, im even quoted extensively in one lol. How did we go from deliding to skylake bending and cracking (something we already all know) and why we advise people to use this.
> 
> http://www.legitreviews.com/aqua-computer-releases-shim-for-intel-skylake-processors_176351
> http://www.legitreviews.com/aqua-computer-releases-shim-for-intel-skylake-processors_176351
> http://www.legitreviews.com/aqua-computer-releases-shim-for-intel-skylake-processors_176351


Simpler solution....Reuse the IHS and *re-lid properly* so there are no gaps.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Simpler solution....Reuse the IHS and *re-lid properly* so there are no gaps.


But you just posted a link to someone who did that and managed to crack their die from uneven pressure. But you haven't answered my question, I asked for bare waterblock to die cracking not ambiguous posts on forums where user error was probably mostly to fault.


----------



## oparr

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> But you just posted a link to someone who did that and managed to crack their die from uneven pressure. But you haven't answered my question, I asked for bare waterblock to die cracking not ambiguous posts on forums where user error was probably mostly to fault.


Quote:


> But you just posted a link to someone who did that and managed to crack their die from uneven pressure.


Probably due to IHS shift *if the IHS was indeed being used*. Not resealing, or installing the CPU before the sealant has cured would be the usual suspects. *In other words, they didn't re-lid properly*. Whatever, it further highlights the fragile nature of Skylake.
Quote:


> But you haven't answered my question


If so, then I have bigger fish to fry.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Probably due to IHS shift *if the IHS was indeed being used*. Not resealing, or installing the CPU before the sealant has cured would be the usual suspects. *In other words, they didn't re-lid properly*. Whatever, it further highlights the fragile nature of Skylake.
> If so, then I have bigger fish to fry.


So no cracks from naked mounting?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> So no cracks from naked mounting?


Skylake is so thin it will pretty much be a pain all the time. Skylake and haswell/ivy/sandy have the same exact measurement from pcb bottom to ihs top, the difference is skylake has a much thicker IHS (another reason to go bare die with Skylake), the issue is the thin PCB. He's just too idiot to realize that the sealant has absolutely nothing to do with skylake cracking/bending, just keeps spewing the same nonsense.


----------



## oparr

If the CPU is installed with IHS, but not sealed to the wafer, or the sealant is still in a liquid state, then there will be IHS mobility due to the gap originally intended for the sealant. The die is vulnerable to chipping/cracking in this scenario. Visualize the cured sealant acting as a shim, to fill the gap beneath the base of the IHS, thus preventing this mobility.


----------



## bluej511

And its why i don't reply to his idiotic comments anymore haha.

Pretty sure EVERYONE on this forum remembers how when Skylake just came out they were already bending, without a delid. So skylake is prone to bending and cracking NO MATTER WHAT.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Pretty sure EVERYONE on this forum remembers how when Skylake just came out they were already bending, without a delid. So skylake is prone to bending and cracking NO MATTER WHAT.


I made the decision to "skip" Skylake entirely, when I upgraded from my 2500K to a 4790K, a few months ago.

Of course, delidding and direct die mounting influenced my decision, at that time all I knew was how thin the pcb was on Skylake compared to Devils Canyon.

Thanks for posting the AquaComputer shim link, bluej51, quite an eye-opener for me.

I guess if one wasn't going to delid at all, Skylake would be feasible as an upgrade, but where's the fun in that, lol.

Edit: Of course, the shim kit would certainly help with those issues for a Skylake chip.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> I made the decision to "skip" Skylake entirely, when I upgraded from my 2500K to a 4790K, a few months ago.
> 
> Of course, delidding and direct die mounting influenced my decision, at that time all I knew was how thin the pcb was on Skylake compared to Devils Canyon.
> 
> Thanks for posting the AquaComputer shim link, bluej51, quite an eye-opener for me.
> 
> I guess if one wasn't going to delid at all, Skylake would be feasible as an upgrade, but where's the fun in that, lol.
> 
> Edit: Of course, the shim kit would certainly help with those issues for a Skylake chip.


Not much of an upgrade for haswell users. MSI makes one as well but its totally different.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> I made the decision to "skip" Skylake entirely, when I upgraded from my 2500K to a 4790K, a few months ago.
> 
> Of course, delidding and direct die mounting influenced my decision, at that time all I knew was how thin the pcb was on Skylake compared to Devils Canyon.
> 
> Thanks for posting the AquaComputer shim link, bluej51, quite an eye-opener for me.
> 
> I guess if one wasn't going to delid at all, Skylake would be feasible as an upgrade, but where's the fun in that, lol.
> 
> Edit: Of course, the shim kit would certainly help with those issues for a Skylake chip.


I'm still not convinced it's a shim but I found out that the LN2 guys are still having issues with cracking TIM apparently? Not too sure but they did mention this.
Quote:


> I just started noticing this the past couple days, makes sense but just didnt realize. 2 nights ago I put ihs down but it was really misaligned so I had to adjust it too much and paste cracked pretty fast.
> 
> But last night I put ihs down almost perfectly first shot and not one crack all night, full pot for hours.
> 
> Thanks to dancop guide I use the asus cpu tool now which really helps with alignment.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> So I got this from my ASUS Z170i board... wondering if this would help reseat the IHS back onto the chip...
> 
> 
> I didn't use it on my first go around but I wonder if this would help in any way?


----------



## sav4

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I'm still not convinced it's a shim but I found out that the LN2 guys are still having issues with cracking TIM apparently? Not too sure but they did
> mention this.


Yes I have only read the ln2 guys having cracking issues on bare die also.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *oparr*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I really thought this was over and done with, it was concluded that normal thermal paste is too thick and pumps out from under the IHS and die because that is what it's designed to do when applied to the IHS and then compressed with a cooler for full coverage and closes gaps. LM TIM doesn't do this because of how it is, it's thin and doesn't react to pressure the same way, it will literally sit there for years not giving a single .....
> 
> This is why everyone says to use any LM under the IHS and any TIM on top or better yet get rid of the IHS and run naked with LM.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> it will literally sit there for years not giving a single .....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> October will make it one year since doing two Skylake delids using CLU. Noticed increasing CPU core temperatures during stress testing as the months went by. My CLU sample has hardened in the syringe/cap and is now unusable.
Click to expand...

Any method to fix this? Clu drying/hardening in the tube? Maybe really hot water over the closed syringe will help? I think it'll reliquify under some heat...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sav4*
> 
> Yes I have only read the ln2 guys having cracking issues on bare die also.


I've not seen anyone run bare die LN2 they seem to reuse the IHS.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I've not seen anyone run bare die LN2 they seem to reuse the IHS.


The reason being is the silicone can't handle those levels of temperature change. Even with Delidded you can still have issue as the cpu needs that spacing for a heat barrier to take effect and protect the silicone. Additionally the LN2 pots are so heavy you can easily destroy cpu and mobo pins.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The reason being is the silicone can't handle those levels of temperature change. Even with Delidded you can still have issue as the cpu needs that spacing for a heat barrier to take effect and protect the silicone. Additionally the LN2 pots are so heavy you can easily destroy cpu and mobo pins.


Yeah reading about it now on HWbot, someone did mention doing it naked though but not sure how lol, they seem to post a lot of words and not pics but at a guess that might be due to the urgent attention needed when doing LN2 or DI.

I really wanted to run my 6700k naked on water but the only VRM block I can get is the full mono block from EK so I'm stuck to either getting a custom block made which I can't fund or be bothered doing have a really loud fan running at full speed to cool the cooking vrm or just use the full cover block with the IHS intact. Really not sure.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Yeah reading about it now on HWbot, someone did mention doing it naked though but not sure how lol, they seem to post a lot of words and not pics but at a guess that might be due to the urgent attention needed when doing LN2 or DI.
> 
> I really wanted to run my 6700k naked on water but the only VRM block I can get is the full mono block from EK so I'm stuck to either getting a custom block made which I can't fund or be bothered doing have a really loud fan running at full speed to cool the cooking vrm or just use the full cover block with the IHS intact. Really not sure.


Easy just sand down the IHS a mm or so, lap the IHS and the waterblock should get u closer to bare die temps.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Yeah reading about it now on HWbot, someone did mention doing it naked though but not sure how lol, they seem to post a lot of words and not pics but at a guess that might be due to the urgent attention needed when doing LN2 or DI.
> 
> I really wanted to run my 6700k naked on water but the only VRM block I can get is the full mono block from EK so I'm stuck to either getting a custom block made which I can't fund or be bothered doing have a really loud fan running at full speed to cool the cooking vrm or just use the full cover block with the IHS intact. Really not sure.


Use the IHS and Mono block


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Easy just sand down the IHS a mm or so, lap the IHS and the waterblock should get u closer to bare die temps.


Man I doubt it lol, I dunno yet, from what I'm reading I can see why Oparr glues the lid back on his skylake. The guys with LN2 have been keeping the glue on because it creates a gap which has been shown to help with the cracking issue *in some cases, not all.*
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Use the IHS and Mono block


The mono block has a funky camo pattern on it I'd have to mod but man, I just don't know lol. Kinda deflated right now, I might need to try getting a block made for the VRM and still go naked.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Man I doubt it lol, I dunno yet, from what I'm reading I can see why Oparr glues the lid back on his skylake. The guys with LN2 have been keeping the glue on because it creates a gap which has been shown to help with the cracking issue *in some cases, not all.*
> The mono block has a funky camo pattern on it I'd have to mod but man, I just don't know lol. Kinda deflated right now, I might need to try getting a block made for the VRM and still go naked.


My guess, the skylake pcb is such garbage, when removing the glue the IHS sits right on the wafer. Unfortunately its so thin that the pressure from the IHS cracks it. Bare die would actually be even better. All you have to do is shave down the cpu socket so it sits flush with the die and bam no problems, no cracking, no bending.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> My guess, the skylake pcb is such garbage, when removing the glue the IHS sits right on the wafer. Unfortunately its so thin that the pressure from the IHS cracks it. Bare die would actually be even better. All you have to do is shave down the cpu socket so it sits flush with the die and bam no problems, no cracking, no bending.


The problem is they don't know what's causing it, it might just be that the die is so thin its naturally fragile and anything could damage it. If Oparr would of stated this in his previous posts it would of taken a lot of confussion out of the whole thing.

I'm not sure why they decided a thinner PCB was a better idea but I'm sure they had their reasons, I'm still unsure about the block making contact with the die even with a shaved down socket. Do I really want to shave down the socket? It would void the warranty that's for sure...


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> My guess, the skylake pcb is such garbage, when removing the glue the IHS sits right on the wafer. Unfortunately its so thin that the pressure from the IHS cracks it. Bare die would actually be even better. All you have to do is shave down the cpu socket so it sits flush with the die and bam no problems, no cracking, no bending.
> 
> 
> 
> The problem is they don't know what's causing it, it might just be that the die is so thin its naturally fragile and anything could damage it. If Oparr would of stated this in his previous posts it would of taken a lot of confussion out of the whole thing.
> 
> I'm not sure why they decided a thinner PCB was a better idea but I'm sure they had their reasons, I'm still unsure about the block making contact with the die even with a shaved down socket. Do I really want to shave down the socket? It would void the warranty that's for sure...
Click to expand...

Armchair QB says it might be a more efficient pin layout, requiring less layers in the PCB. more layers=more cost.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> My guess, the skylake pcb is such garbage, when removing the glue the IHS sits right on the wafer. Unfortunately its so thin that the pressure from the IHS cracks it. Bare die would actually be even better. All you have to do is shave down the cpu socket so it sits flush with the die and bam no problems, no cracking, no bending.
> 
> 
> 
> The problem is they don't know what's causing it, it might just be that the die is so thin its naturally fragile and anything could damage it. If Oparr would of stated this in his previous posts it would of taken a lot of confussion out of the whole thing.
> 
> I'm not sure why they decided a thinner PCB was a better idea but I'm sure they had their reasons, I'm still unsure about the block making contact with the die even with a shaved down socket. Do I really want to shave down the socket? It would void the warranty that's for sure...
Click to expand...

Benjiw your mission if you choose to accept it.

acquire a box of straight forward razorblades
in one week timely and meticulously calmly remove a happy amount of your motherboard socket seat.
taken enough consideration into the aspects known of skylake this will be a surmounting task
however the reward can most likely be internal intelligence gained being the first we know who accepts this task.
if the pins match in the end, you will be golden

do remember that if you are caught or do fail all knowledge we have of this will be destroyed and the status left unknown.
this message will self destruct.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Benjiw your mission if you choose to accept it.
> 
> acquire a box of straight forward razorblades
> in one week timely and meticulously calmly remove a happy amount of your motherboard socket seat.
> taken enough consideration into the aspects known of skylake this will be a surmounting task
> however the reward can most likely be internal intelligence gained being the first we know who accepts this task.
> if the pins match in the end, you will be golden
> 
> do remember that if you are caught or do fail all knowledge we have of this will be destroyed and the status left unknown.
> this message will self destruct.


I think it's not as simple as that, when I remove the motherboard I'll have to see if there is anymore travel left for the block or if it's mount is resting on the posts, not sure how to explain it properly, I've been drinking lol.

Basically I'm not sure if simply shaving down the socket will allow good contact and I might still have to use shim but I'll do the testing in a month or so.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Armchair QB says it might be a more efficient pin layout, requiring less layers in the PCB. more layers=more cost.


Maybe but they should of also checked the whole bending thing out, my 4670k is showing slight bending from naked mounting so I'm doing to get the AC "Shim" to help reduce that.


----------



## NiKiZ

1 week of running my delidded 6600K with Noctua NT-H1 on the die and the temperatures instantly goes to 100 degrees Celsius and the computer crashes when running IntelBurnTest at 4.8GHz. Not good. The CLU comes in 2 days, which will solve this problem.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> So I got this from my ASUS Z170i board... wondering if this would help reseat the IHS back onto the chip...
> 
> 
> I didn't use it on my first go around but I wonder if this would help in any way?


It helps keeping the IHS in place, when lowering the socket retention arm. However, it won't prevent it falling off the CPU.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> 1 week of running my delidded 6600K with Noctua NT-H1 on the die and the temperatures instantly goes to 100 degrees Celsius and the computer crashes when running IntelBurnTest at 4.8GHz. Not good. The CLU comes in 2 days, which will solve this problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It helps keeping the IHS in place, when lowering the socket retention arm. However, it won't prevent it falling off the CPU.


What voltage? I don't recommend using IBT after 1.4v as the heat is a bit too much I use x264 instead. Keeps the heat down but is still as fast as IBT at finding instability.


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> What voltage? I don't recommend using IBT after 1.4v as the heat is a bit too much I use x264 instead. Keeps the heat down but is still as fast as IBT at finding instability.


I am running at 1.37V. The temperatures were okay right after delidding, (15 Celsius drop from the stock Intel stuff. 95 C max vs 80 C max) but the NT-H1 goes bad on the die. My CLU order should arrive tomorrow, though.

I won't do any heavy stuff on my PC today, mainly browsing the web, watching Netflix and some light gaming. I should be fine without replacing the paste today.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> I am running at 1.37V. The temperatures were okay right after delidding, (15 Celsius drop from the stock Intel stuff. 95 C max vs 80 C max) but the NT-H1 goes bad on the die. My CLU order should arrive tomorrow, though.
> 
> I won't do any heavy stuff on my PC today, mainly browsing the web, watching Netflix and some light gaming. I should be fine without replacing the paste today.


It's up to you what you use but the added heat is pretty pointless is all I'm saying.


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It's up to you what you use but the added heat is pretty pointless is all I'm saying.


Just too lazy to disassemble the computer and replace the paste, which will go bad in few days anyways.







I will receive the CLU in the mail tomorrow and I will replace it then.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Just too lazy to disassemble the computer and replace the paste, which will go bad in few days anyways.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will receive the CLU in the mail tomorrow and I will replace it then.


Fair enough, I know how it is lol.

Been looking at the z170 socket like I said in the last post and not sure if I want to shave the socket down. I'm not too bothered personally it won't effect the performance of the motherboard but it will void the warranty and that turns people off buying used.

Even if I shaved the socket down I'm still not 100% certain the naked kit will allow good contact without putting the mounting screws in a lathe and removing some of the height on the spacer.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It's up to you what you use but the added heat is pretty pointless is all I'm saying.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just too lazy to disassemble the computer and replace the paste, which will go bad in few days anyways.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will receive the CLU in the mail tomorrow and I will replace it then.
Click to expand...

That's not lazy, that's pragmatic.









~Ceadder


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> That's not lazy, that's pragmatic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Well that too!


----------



## NiKiZ

Right after delidding:

All cleaned up:

CLU applied:


Temperatures before delid:

After (I uninstalled Asus AI Suite and HWMonitor shows more stuff):


5.0 Ghz OC (1.51V, runs a bit too hot to use daily, but stable):


21 degrees Celsius improvement! That's pretty awesome!

OCN name: Nikiz
CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: 200 Mhz
OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
Temp drops: 21 degrees Celsius
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/8ynll0

EDIT: Added proof of 5.0Ghz OC.


----------



## skingun

NICE!


----------



## HITTI

What a mess of stock applied TIM that comes from intel.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Awesome work @NiKiZ, pretty amazing before/after temps! Wish my ITX cooler was beefier...4.4-4.5 is about all I can do for me with my 6700k...


----------



## bluej511

74°C **** that lol. My 4690k used to do 60°C MAX at 1.3v haha. Nah thats a SICK temp drop.

Did you notice any temp difference between clu and noctua first application or temps are identical?


----------



## skingun

Stock cooler?


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Awesome work @NiKiZ, pretty amazing before/after temps! Wish my ITX cooler was beefier...4.4-4.5 is about all I can do for me with my 6700k...


Thanks!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 74°C **** that lol. My 4690k used to do 60°C MAX at 1.3v haha. Nah thats a SICK temp drop.
> 
> Did you notice any temp difference between clu and noctua first application or temps are identical?


CLU was 6 degrees cooler. However, the temps started to rise a lot each day with the Noctua. It started to freeze on heavy loads, as it hit 100 Celsius.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skingun*
> 
> Stock cooler?


Nope, I have a Corsair Hydro H110i. Skylake CPUs don't come with stock coolers.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Awesome work @NiKiZ, pretty amazing before/after temps! Wish my ITX cooler was beefier...4.4-4.5 is about all I can do for me with my 6700k...
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks!
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 74°C **** that lol. My 4690k used to do 60°C MAX at 1.3v haha. Nah thats a SICK temp drop.
> 
> Did you notice any temp difference between clu and noctua first application or temps are identical?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> CLU was 6 degrees cooler. However, the temps started to rise a lot each day with the Noctua. It started to freeze on heavy loads, as it hit 100 Celsius.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *skingun*
> 
> Stock cooler?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nope, I have a Corsair Hydro H110i. Skylake CPUs don't come with stock coolers.
Click to expand...

Which is a good thing, lol.

Beautiful job, and great to see those temp. improvements!


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Do people really see high temps if they use too much CLU on the IHS? I thought if anything there would just be pump out of the CLU if anything...?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Right after delidding:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All cleaned up:
> 
> CLU applied:
> 
> 
> Temperatures before delid:
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5.0 Ghz OC (1.51V, runs a bit too hot to use daily, but stable):
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 21 degrees Celsius improvement! That's pretty awesome!
> 
> OCN name: Nikiz
> CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 200 Mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
> Temp drops: 21 degrees Celsius
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/8ynll0
> 
> EDIT: Added proof of 5.0Ghz OC
> 
> 
> .


It won't be stable IBT standard is the easiest test to pass, you need to use very high and maximum for 20 passes to be semi stable and even then I found that it would pass and still crash.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Do people really see high temps if they use too much CLU on the IHS? I thought if anything there would just be pump out of the CLU if anything...?


My temps where high with not enough CLU on my die I put some more on and it's been fine since.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Do people really see high temps if they use too much CLU on the IHS? I thought if anything there would just be pump out of the CLU if anything...?


Yes, its just like putting too much TIM on anything. Again, the least amount of CLU/TIM possible is the best thermal efficiency. Copper has a rating of 300-400 w/mK, compare that to CLU and TIMs and its not even comparable lol.

CLU is finicky has to be applied just right. Don't think ive ever seen CLU pump out though.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Wondering if I applied too much CLU and if its worth getting a new tube of CLU and starting over...

I'm hitting 71C tops in realbench stress test. 1.344vCore 4.4GHz, CLU between die and IHS, Coolermaster Nano between IHS and cooler. Cooler is a Silverstone NT06-pro with stock fan. I'm considering getting a 2nd slim 140mm fan but not sure its worth it. I've got the silverstone PWM fan from the cooler blowing air up and out through the cooler and not down on my motherboard...Thoughts? I've confirmed my CM Nano paste job is good. Cooler is lapped so that's a plus. Idle's around 27-29C.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Wondering if I applied too much CLU and if its worth getting a new tube of CLU and starting over...
> 
> I'm hitting 71C tops in realbench stress test. 1.344vCore 4.4GHz, CLU between die and IHS, Coolermaster Nano between IHS and cooler. Cooler is a Silverstone NT06-pro with stock fan. I'm considering getting a 2nd slim 140mm fan but not sure its worth it. I've got the silverstone PWM fan from the cooler blowing air up and out through the cooler and not down on my motherboard...Thoughts? I've confirmed my CM Nano paste job is good. Cooler is lapped so that's a plus. Idle's around 27-29C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Doesn't look like you've used too much to me.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Wondering if I applied too much CLU and if its worth getting a new tube of CLU and starting over...
> 
> I'm hitting 71C tops in realbench stress test. 1.344vCore 4.4GHz, CLU between die and IHS, Coolermaster Nano between IHS and cooler. Cooler is a Silverstone NT06-pro with stock fan. I'm considering getting a 2nd slim 140mm fan but not sure its worth it. I've got the silverstone PWM fan from the cooler blowing air up and out through the cooler and not down on my motherboard...Thoughts? I've confirmed my CM Nano paste job is good. Cooler is lapped so that's a plus. Idle's around 27-29C.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Doesn't look like you've used too much to me.
Click to expand...

Thanks! I've been kind of paranoid... I think I've just maxxed out my CPU cooler... Afterall it's only supposed to be for 95w TDP....


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Thanks! I've been kind of paranoid... I think I've just maxxed out my CPU cooler... Afterall it's only supposed to be for 95w TDP....


Looks like the IHS has quite a bit of CLU on it maybe too much. On mine its a ridiculously thin layer pretty much just enough to cover the die and thats it.


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> It won't be stable IBT standard is the easiest test to pass, you need to use very high and maximum for 20 passes to be semi stable and even then I found that it would pass and still crash.


Yeah, it might not be stable. I was in a hurry, so I couldn't test more. Today I might test it more.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

I have an i5 as seen in the sig there. 4.2ghz on air cooling.

Would there be any benefit to delid while using the stock cooler.

Forgive my ignorance, I've mostly de-lidded AMD cpu on liquid cooling or extreme. Have de-lidded Intels but for other people.

Won't be going to liquid at this point, but wonder if there may be an advantage for where I'm at now with the stock cooler.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Right after delidding:
> 
> All cleaned up:
> 
> CLU applied:
> 
> 
> Temperatures before delid:
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> 5.0 Ghz OC (1.51V, runs a bit too hot to use daily, but stable):
> 
> 
> 21 degrees Celsius improvement! That's pretty awesome!
> 
> OCN name: Nikiz
> CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 200 Mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
> Temp drops: 21 degrees Celsius
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/8ynll0
> 
> EDIT: Added proof of 5.0Ghz OC.


Chronicfx.... approved!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Right after delidding:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All cleaned up:
> 
> CLU applied:
> 
> 
> Temperatures before delid:
> 
> After (I uninstalled Asus AI Suite and HWMonitor shows more stuff):
> 
> 
> 5.0 Ghz OC (1.51V, runs a bit too hot to use daily, but stable):
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 21 degrees Celsius improvement! That's pretty awesome!
> 
> OCN name: Nikiz
> CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 200 Mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
> Temp drops: 21 degrees Celsius
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/8ynll0
> 
> EDIT: Added proof of 5.0Ghz OC.


You're In







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Chronicfx.... approved!


You trying to take my job there?


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You trying to take my job there?


? Not this one but I Would gladly take the piloting off your hands if you will let me ✈?


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You trying to take my job there?


Thanks!


----------



## Agavehound

All righty then. Just did my first delid on my i7 6700. Temps before with 1.38v @ 4.7 ghz were at 85c using H115i. After delid, 1.392v @4.7 temps dropped to 68c on h115i.







I'm now a convert.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> All righty then. Just did my first delid on my i7 6700. Temps before with 1.38v @ 4.7 ghz were at 85c using H115i. After delid, 1.392v @4.7 temps dropped to 68c on h115i.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm now a convert.










pics??


----------



## Agavehound

No. I was rather nervous throughout the process (my first attempt) and didn't want the distraction.

It was surprisingly easy with only a couple 'oh crud' moments. I was cutting the second side and my blade sliced through like a hot knife through butter. My blade went in so far I feared that I had hit the die. Fortunately, the blade I used was the type used in scrapers and the thick edge prevented it from going in too far. The worst part was when I got it all back together and hit the power on...it didn't boot right away and I had to power down and try again. I tell ya', my heart sank at that moment but within 20 seconds it was restarted and booting like it should. So far I've hit 1.47v @ 4.84 ghz and only reached 76c, ambient was 22c.

Here is the official info:
OCN name: Agavehound
CPU: i7 6700k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: GC Extreme
Mhz gained: Unknown as of now
OC after delid: 4.84 ghz so far at 1.47v
Temp drops: 22c @ 4.7 ghz with 1.416v
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> No. I was rather nervous throughout the process (my first attempt) and didn't want the distraction.
> 
> It was surprisingly easy with only a couple 'oh crud' moments. I was cutting the second side and my blade sliced through like a hot knife through butter. My blade went in so far I feared that I had hit the die. Fortunately, the blade I used was the type used in scrapers and the thick edge prevented it from going in too far. The worst part was when I got it all back together and hit the power on...it didn't boot right away and I had to power down and try again. I tell ya', my heart sank at that moment but within 20 seconds it was restarted and booting like it should. So far I've hit 1.47v @ 4.84 ghz and only reached 76c, ambient was 22c.
> 
> Here is the official info:
> OCN name: Agavehound
> CPU: i7 6700
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: GC Extreme
> Mhz gained: Unknown as of now
> OC after delid: 4.84 ghz so far at 1.47v
> Temp drops: 22c @ 4.7 ghz with 1.416v
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## skingun

Was this a 6700 or a 6700k?


----------



## Agavehound

K. I've edited my post.


----------



## Arctucas

How about posting a 20 pass run of IBT at maximum with HWiNFO showing VCore and temps?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> K. I've edited my post.


I saw the OC in the submission,







got you covered!


----------



## Agavehound

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> How about posting a 20 pass run of IBT at maximum with HWiNFO showing VCore and temps?


Sure, but why?
I'll run it overnight tonight.


----------



## Arctucas

How about posting a 20 pass run of IBT at Maximum?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> Sure, but why?
> I'll run it overnight tonight.


Just want to see it, to compare to mine.


----------



## Arctucas

OCN name: Arctucas
CPU: i7 6700K
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained:
OC after delid: 4830MHz
Temp drops: 15°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Not Max, just 24/7 http://valid.x86.fr/ca9j4i


----------



## Agavehound

Here ya go Arctucas: 4.7 @ 1.416, 74c in h115i I think I can reduce vcore a bit, but we'll see.

IBT.png 2255k .png file


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> OCN name: Arctucas
> CPU: i7 6700K
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid: 4830MHz
> Temp drops: 15°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Not Max, just 24/7 http://valid.x86.fr/ca9j4i
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


How did you like using Conductonaut??? There's such hype on the forum and hardly anyone has used it... supposedly its way better than CLU based on the thermal properties... any thoughts?


----------



## Valgaur

Hello people!

I'm currently debating a new build and I just need ideas. Here is the link to my post.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1611211/need-some-help-after-a-few-builds#post_25510136

Arctic as, I see your post and submission, I'm away from my desktop but I'll add you when I'm near it! Doing submissions on phones isn't a great experience


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Would you guys know where to find the market for my 4690K? I would like to upgrade into the 4790K for the hyper threading.


----------



## Arctucas

OK, I suppose.

Having never used liquid metal TIM before, I have no comparison to make.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> OCN name: Arctucas
> CPU: i7 6700K
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained:
> OC after delid: 4830MHz
> Temp drops: 15°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Not Max, just 24/7 http://valid.x86.fr/ca9j4i


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









Forgive Vagur for being slow and Forgetting to add you last night when he looked directly at it...... >.>


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> No. I was rather nervous throughout the process (my first attempt) and didn't want the distraction.
> 
> It was surprisingly easy with only a couple 'oh crud' moments. I was cutting the second side and my blade sliced through like a hot knife through butter. My blade went in so far I feared that I had hit the die. Fortunately, the blade I used was the type used in scrapers and the thick edge prevented it from going in too far. The worst part was when I got it all back together and hit the power on...it didn't boot right away and I had to power down and try again. I tell ya', my heart sank at that moment but within 20 seconds it was restarted and booting like it should. So far I've hit 1.47v @ 4.84 ghz and only reached 76c, ambient was 22c.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Here is the official info:
> OCN name: Agavehound
> CPU: i7 6700k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: GC Extreme
> Mhz gained: Unknown as of now
> OC after delid: 4.84 ghz so far at 1.47v
> Temp drops: 22c @ 4.7 ghz with 1.416v
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
Click to expand...

Now try it with x264 because I can pass IBT maximum at 4.8ghz but as soon as I run x264 it instantly crashes.


----------



## Agavehound

I've already hit 4.84 @ 1.47v in x264. Temp got up to ~76c after delidding. Did you want to see a HWiNFO screenie?

I've yet to really push this build but I plan on seeing just what it can do.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> Here ya go Arctucas: 4.7 @ 1.416, 74c in h115i I think I can reduce vcore a bit, but we'll see.
> 
> IBT.png 2255k .png file


Nice temps. What would you estimate your ambient to be?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> I've already hit 4.84 @ 1.47v in x264. Temp got up to ~76c after delidding. Did you want to see a HWiNFO screenie?
> 
> I've yet to really push this build but I plan on seeing just what it can do.


Nah I'm not about proof, its up to the user to stress test properly it's not my rig so I don't care lol but nice clocks.







My 4670k is at 4.7ghz with 1.5v sadly.


----------



## Agavehound

Arctucas: Ambient was about ~19 - 21c. I've removed my hdd cages and I'm running 2x 140mm fans up front, 1x 140mm intake in the bottom, 2x 140mm on my rad up top and one 140mm exhaust. All were running at 100% and fairly noisy so my next move will be to put the 1080 under water...maybe.

Benjiw: Thanks man, I think I got a decent chip. Daaang, 1.5v? What kinda temps you hittin? I hit 4.9 @ ~1.5 or so but I didn't stress it long enough to know if it was stable or not. Whats your daily OC?

My next step will be to see how hot this thing will get running 4.84 @ 1.47v in IBT since it seems to run a bit hotter than x264.

Anyone know the max v a 2600k can take or do I just need to watch out for temps?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> Benjiw: Thanks man, I think I got a decent chip. Daaang, 1.5v? What kinda temps you hittin? I hit 4.9 @ ~1.5 or so but I didn't stress it long enough to know if it was stable or not. Whats your daily OC?


That is my daily overclock and max temp is 82c or so depending on ambient. My chip is naked so the only way I hit thermal walls is at 1.6v or so.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Agavehound*
> 
> Arctucas: Ambient was about ~19 - 21c. I've removed my hdd cages and I'm running 2x 140mm fans up front, 1x 140mm intake in the bottom, 2x 140mm on my rad up top and one 140mm exhaust. All were running at 100% and fairly noisy so my next move will be to put the 1080 under water...maybe.


Thanks.

Good cooler to get that close to ambient at idle.

Is that with adaptive VCore?

I personally use override VCore (constant 1.39V and HT on), and usually see ambient +5°C on the CPU package temp, ambient +2°C to 3°C on individual core temps at idle.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

I'm about to delid a 6900k, I'm going to attach the waterblock strait to the die. For support I want to use thermal pads on the pcb for maximum contact and to equal out force. However, I know this will produce a lot of heat so I was wondering which brand of thermal pad should I go with so that they don't dry out and turn to crust. Does anyone have any experience in this matter?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I'm about to delid a 6900k, I'm going to attach the waterblock strait to the die. For support I want to use thermal pads on the pcb for maximum contact and to equal out force. However, I know this will produce a lot of heat so I was wondering which brand of thermal pad should I go with so that they don't dry out and turn to crust. Does anyone have any experience in this matter?


The less effective the pad is at transferring heat, the longer it will likely hold up and maintain its pliability/elasticity and capability to be reused.

Pads that are excellent at transferring heat are fairly prone to tearing even when they are brand new. The best, and highest rated, pads I know of are Fujipoly Ultra Extremes that have a thermal conductance rating of 17 w/mk. They are expensive but they do work very, very well however. I did a review of them here when I used them on my R9 290: http://www.overclock.net/t/1468593/r9-290-x-thermal-pad-upgrade-vrm-temperatures

Just because the higher performing pads become dry and more brittle over time, doesn't mean they lose their effectiveness, from my experience. The Fuji pads I mentioned above have been on my card for several years at this point, undisturbed, and they still do a marvelous job of keeping the VRMs cool...they actually performed a little better after some burn-in time.

If I were to try and remove them at this point they would probably crumble into an unusable state, but there is no point in removing them as the TIM for the core and the pads are still doing their job.

Amazon is probably the easiest place to find them at this point; search for Fujipoly Extreme and you'll get plenty of results. They have several different size sheets along with 3 thicknesses available, .5/1.0/1.5mm, as well as two different performance levels; Extreme are rated at 11 w/mk and Ultra Extreme at 17 w/mk. The larger the sheet, the thicker the pad, or higher performance increases the cost. I don't think you would need a very large piece for your purposes though.

I am very interested to see what kind of difference this would make on your chip.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I'm about to delid a 6900k, I'm going to attach the waterblock strait to the die. For support I want to use thermal pads on the pcb for maximum contact and to equal out force. However, I know this will produce a lot of heat so I was wondering which brand of thermal pad should I go with so that they don't dry out and turn to crust. Does anyone have any experience in this matter?


Isn't the IHS soldered on the 6900k? I wouldn't use a thermal pad unless you can make one of those Aqua computer shims fit it and even then a thermal pad would be unnecessary.

EDIT:

After a quick google, looks soldered and it's broadwell e so is the PCB as thin as skylake? If not and it's like haswell thickness, I wouldn't worry about it.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Isn't the IHS soldered on the 6900k? I wouldn't use a thermal pad unless you can make one of those Aqua computer shims fit it and even then a thermal pad would be unnecessary.


I would agree, I highly don't recommend delidding X99 platform, mainly due to how expensive they are and I can't remember if they are soldered. Are your temps that bad?


----------



## Cakewalk_S

I thought anything over 95 watt tdp was soldered? I'm almost positive it's soldered.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I am very interested to see what kind of difference this would make on your chip.


Thank you for such an excellent response. This is mostly stuff I knew, but I was hoping there was something that wouldn't turn to dust, which Fuji does as well as others. So, lets hope for longevity. What I notice about thermal transfer is that while some energy transfers to the ihs which is indium solder, gold plated nickle, and then copper. The other heat transfers to the pcb nodes which are solid gold (far more effective at heat transfer and like water and electricity, heat flows in the path of least resistance first) So, in other words, the pcb is becoming saturated with thermal energy before it is being transferred to the waterblock (in theory). It is my assumption that if I maximize thermal conductivity to the waterblock, then the pcb will become less saturated leading to better clocks.

As for the solder question. You may be under the assumption that if you rip a IHS off a soldered cpu the die will break! Well, my friend, this is a false rumor that has been spread by people who don't know what they are talking about. This is a near impossibility unless you try to rip the IHS in a subzero degree environment. I believe OCDrift posted a link of how he broke a 5960x with solder... well the truth is, what he posted was not a 5960x and that die was not broken, it was sliced. The truth of the matter is, the indium solder is a VERY soft metal, removing an IHS with solder is not much more difficult than removing an IHS with thermal compound. It's just the indium takes more time to scrape off. There are a number of videos out there to show you how to correctly remove the indium solder and delid these CPUs. Don't believe ridiculous claims that the die will break, as this is extremely unlikely. It is far more likely of accidentally breaking a cap or resistor by incorrectly cutting the silicon seal.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Thank you for such an excellent response. This is mostly stuff I knew, but I was hoping there was something that wouldn't turn to dust, which Fuji does as well as others. So, lets hope for longevity. What I notice about thermal transfer is that while some energy transfers to the ihs which is indium solder, gold plated nickle, and then copper. The other heat transfers to the pcb nodes which are solid gold (far more effective at heat transfer and like water and electricity, heat flows in the path of least resistance first) So, in other words, the pcb is becoming saturated with thermal energy before it is being transferred to the waterblock (in theory). It is my assumption that if I maximize thermal conductivity to the waterblock, then the pcb will become less saturated leading to better clocks.
> 
> As for the solder question. You may be under the assumption that if you rip a IHS off a soldered cpu the die will break! Well, my friend, this is a false rumor that has been spread by people who don't know what they are talking about. This is a near impossibility unless you try to rip the IHS in a subzero degree environment. I believe OCDrift posted a link of how he broke a 5960x with solder... well the truth is, what he posted was not a 5960x and that die was not broken, it was sliced. The truth of the matter is, the indium solder is a VERY soft metal, removing an IHS with solder is not much more difficult than removing an IHS with thermal compound. It's just the indium takes more time to scrape off. There are a number of videos out there to show you how to correctly remove the indium solder and delid these CPUs. Don't believe ridiculous claims that the die will break, as this is extremely unlikely. It is far more likely of accidentally breaking a cap or resistor by incorrectly cutting the silicon seal.


But the PCB isn't going to heat up that much compared to your CPU die. You're over complicating the situation for no gain and nothing but a potential to cause more issues. You can delid the new Chips from intel but it will cost you a pretty penny and if you plan to run it naked you will need to mod/make your own mounts and possibly a shim for between the die and the waterblock.

The video here shows better thermals with a delidded 6950x and delidding tool.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

( I removed this comment until further testing is done )


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Thank you for such an excellent response. This is mostly stuff I knew, but I was hoping there was something that wouldn't turn to dust, which Fuji does as well as others.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> So, lets hope for longevity. What I notice about thermal transfer is that while some energy transfers to the ihs which is indium solder, gold plated nickle, and then copper. The other heat transfers to the pcb nodes which are solid gold (far more effective at heat transfer and like water and electricity, heat flows in the path of least resistance first) So, in other words, the pcb is becoming saturated with thermal energy before it is being transferred to the waterblock (in theory). It is my assumption that if I maximize thermal conductivity to the waterblock, then the pcb will become less saturated leading to better clocks.
> 
> As for the solder question. You may be under the assumption that if you rip a IHS off a soldered cpu the die will break! Well, my friend, this is a false rumor that has been spread by people who don't know what they are talking about. This is a near impossibility unless you try to rip the IHS in a subzero degree environment. I believe OCDrift posted a link of how he broke a 5960x with solder... well the truth is, what he posted was not a 5960x and that die was not broken, it was sliced. The truth of the matter is, the indium solder is a VERY soft metal, removing an IHS with solder is not much more difficult than removing an IHS with thermal compound. It's just the indium takes more time to scrape off. There are a number of videos out there to show you how to correctly remove the indium solder and delid these CPUs. Don't believe ridiculous claims that the die will break, as this is extremely unlikely. It is far more likely of accidentally breaking a cap or resistor by incorrectly cutting the silicon seal.


You're welcome.

Unless you plan on pulling it apart frequently, then you should be able to use the best pads possible.

Keep me posted on where this goes.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Yes, this is an example but keep in mind he said the IHS was probably not making good contact with the CPU (hence the sanding) secondly, I'm talking about direct contact, removing the nickle/copper/gold from the equation. Thirdly, yes, the die is the source of heat, but that drains into two directions, the IHS and the PCB, hence rerouting the heat that drains into the PCB (and then the motherboard/backplate) back into the waterblock. But thank you for the response, I do appreciate these opinions.


If this is the case then ek needs to make a pcb waterblock...

Its nonsense the IHS doesn't make contact with the pcb you won't gain anything from cooling the pcb because it doesn't generate heat to warrant cooling.


----------



## manhattan222

Can I join with my old 875K? if so...

OCN name: manhattan222
CPU: Core i7 875K
on die-TIM: thermal paste that came with CoolerMaster Seidon 120V, gonna get Liquid Ultra soon.
ihs-TIM: Bare die
Mhz gained: 160mhz T_T
OC after delid: 4160Mhz
Temp drops: 15/20ºC @ 4GHz (that's what I used before delidding)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/ig4jb5
http://valid.x86.fr/ig4jb5

Created a thread showing how I delidded my CPU:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1611368/old-lynnfield-i7-875k-delidded-with-procedure-pics-d

Cheers!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Thank you for such an excellent response. This is mostly stuff I knew, but I was hoping there was something that wouldn't turn to dust, which Fuji does as well as others. So, lets hope for longevity. What I notice about thermal transfer is that while some energy transfers to the ihs which is indium solder, gold plated nickle, and then copper. The other heat transfers to the pcb nodes which are solid gold (far more effective at heat transfer and like water and electricity, heat flows in the path of least resistance first) So, in other words, the pcb is becoming saturated with thermal energy before it is being transferred to the waterblock (in theory). It is my assumption that if I maximize thermal conductivity to the waterblock, then the pcb will become less saturated leading to better clocks.
> 
> As for the solder question. You may be under the assumption that if you rip a IHS off a soldered cpu the die will break! Well, my friend, this is a false rumor that has been spread by people who don't know what they are talking about. This is a near impossibility unless you try to rip the IHS in a subzero degree environment. I believe OCDrift posted a link of how he broke a 5960x with solder... well the truth is, what he posted was not a 5960x and that die was not broken, it was sliced. The truth of the matter is, the indium solder is a VERY soft metal, removing an IHS with solder is not much more difficult than removing an IHS with thermal compound. It's just the indium takes more time to scrape off. There are a number of videos out there to show you how to correctly remove the indium solder and delid these CPUs. Don't believe ridiculous claims that the die will break, as this is extremely unlikely. It is far more likely of accidentally breaking a cap or resistor by incorrectly cutting the silicon seal.


We've seen soldered delidding take place. There is just a large set of risks to doing so. In the past you would have to have a match under the IHS for the solder to become molten and then the IHS could be removed. I'm not sayign don't do it, just make sure it's worth the process and potential processor death.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> Can I join with my old 875K? if so...
> 
> OCN name: manhattan222
> CPU: Core i7 875K
> on die-TIM: thermal paste that came with CoolerMaster Seidon 120V, gonna get Liquid Ultra soon.
> ihs-TIM: Bare die
> Mhz gained: 160mhz T_T
> OC after delid: 4160Mhz
> Temp drops: 15/20ºC @ 4GHz (that's what I used before delidding)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/ig4jb5
> http://valid.x86.fr/ig4jb5
> 
> Created a thread showing how I delidded my CPU:
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1611368/old-lynnfield-i7-875k-delidded-with-procedure-pics-d
> 
> Cheers!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!







Awesome on the delid!


----------



## manhattan222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome on the delid!


Thanks man!

Got one question for ya: is 1.5v "safe" for this CPU? I know that in Intel datasheet they set the maximum to 1.4, but I've seen people running this CPU @ 1.6v on water(suicide, i know). I also been thinking about those 32nm bulldozers that run 1.5v, so I'm really wondering if it'll kill my CPU. I really want a round 4.2 or maybe 4.3. And, off course, I will only raise the voltage once I get my Liquid Ultra.

Cheers!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> Thanks man!
> 
> Got one question for ya: is 1.5v "safe" for this CPU? I know that in Intel datasheet they set the maximum to 1.4, but I've seen people running this CPU @ 1.6v on water(suicide, i know). I also been thinking about those 32nm bulldozers that run 1.5v, so I'm really wondering if it'll kill my CPU. I really want a round 4.2 or maybe 4.3. And, off course, I will only raise the voltage once I get my Liquid Ultra.
> 
> Cheers!


No one has any proof it kills chips, I've been running my 4670k at 1.5v or even 1.6v when benching for over a year now, seems fine?


----------



## manhattan222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> No one has any proof it kills chips, I've been running my 4670k at 1.5v or even 1.6v when benching for over a year now, seems fine?


Awesome! =D what temps? if u don't mind me asking lol


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> Awesome! =D what temps? if u don't mind me asking lol


Intel chips don't really get that hot tbh so unless I'm stress testing then 1.5v sits at 80c or so but my chip is naked and has a waterblock directly on the die with 780mm of rad space.

1.6v gets up to 95c.


----------



## manhattan222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Intel chips don't really get that hot tbh so unless I'm stress testing then 1.5v sits at 80c or so but my chip is naked and has a waterblock directly on the die with 780mm of rad space.
> 
> 1.6v gets up to 95c.


Cool!

Just after you said you were running your 4670k @ 1.5v I manned up and raised the voltage and clocks of my 875K lol

Getting 90º under full load on IBT

OCN name: manhattan222
CPU: Core i7 875K
on die-TIM: thermal paste that came with CoolerMaster Seidon 120V, gonna get Liquid Ultra soon.
ihs-TIM: Bare die
Mhz gained: 318mhz
OC after delid: 4318Mhz @ 1.5v 139x31
Temp drops: 15/20ºC @ 4GHz (that's what I used before delidding)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/z3gwhm

Please update my info when you can and thanks!

Cheers!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> Cool!
> 
> Just after you said you were running your 4670k @ 1.5v I manned up and raised the voltage and clocks of my 875K lol
> 
> Getting 90º under full load on IBT
> 
> OCN name: manhattan222
> CPU: Core i7 875K
> on die-TIM: thermal paste that came with CoolerMaster Seidon 120V, gonna get Liquid Ultra soon.
> ihs-TIM: Bare die
> Mhz gained: 318mhz
> OC after delid: 4318Mhz @ 1.5v 139x31
> Temp drops: 15/20ºC @ 4GHz (that's what I used before delidding)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/z3gwhm
> 
> Please update my info when you can and thanks!
> 
> Cheers!


How are you mounting on the bare die with the seidon? Do you have any pics as I'm curious lol and not bad but 90c is getting there, I wouldn't run it at those temps for long, IBT also adds a lot of heat you don't really need and if you're testing with only standard it won't show instability very well, you would have to use maximum for 20 runs and if you're mega brave the hidden Xtreme mode. Personally I use x264 for stress testing, if it passes like 30 loops or so its generally stable enough for 24/7 use.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> Thanks man!
> 
> Got one question for ya: is 1.5v "safe" for this CPU? I know that in Intel datasheet they set the maximum to 1.4, but I've seen people running this CPU @ 1.6v on water(suicide, i know). I also been thinking about those 32nm bulldozers that run 1.5v, so I'm really wondering if it'll kill my CPU. I really want a round 4.2 or maybe 4.3. And, off course, I will only raise the voltage once I get my Liquid Ultra.
> 
> Cheers!


Oh man, I don't know 1156 socket very much, but you "shouldn't" have any issues? (I don't know honestly







)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> No one has any proof it kills chips, I've been running my 4670k at 1.5v or even 1.6v when benching for over a year now, seems fine?


Agreed, I pushed 1.95V through my Ivy i7, on multiple occasions. It survived for quite some time...... Poor Franky
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> Cool!
> 
> Just after you said you were running your 4670k @ 1.5v I manned up and raised the voltage and clocks of my 875K lol
> 
> Getting 90º under full load on IBT
> 
> OCN name: manhattan222
> CPU: Core i7 875K
> on die-TIM: thermal paste that came with CoolerMaster Seidon 120V, gonna get Liquid Ultra soon.
> ihs-TIM: Bare die
> Mhz gained: 318mhz
> OC after delid: 4318Mhz @ 1.5v 139x31
> Temp drops: 15/20ºC @ 4GHz (that's what I used before delidding)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/z3gwhm
> 
> Please update my info when you can and thanks!
> 
> Cheers!


Updated








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How are you mounting on the bare die with the seidon? Do you have any pics as I'm curious lol and not bad but 90c is getting there, I wouldn't run it at those temps for long, IBT also adds a lot of heat you don't really need and if you're testing with only standard it won't show instability very well, you would have to use maximum for 20 runs and if you're mega brave the hidden Xtreme mode. Personally I use x264 for stress testing, if it passes like 30 loops or so its generally stable enough for 24/7 use.


Same here, I would like to see that mount! Also agree on the temps and IBT, it tortures Intel chips.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Would you guys have any ideas about custom adhesives hurting the pcb when re-lidding?
Do you think Gorilla Glue on all for corners is dangerous, overkill, or a bad idea in anyway?

I am thinking I should pin the IHS, then glue from the outside down the sides, no glue between the IHS and PCB itself. What do you think?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Would you guys have any ideas about custom adhesives hurting the pcb when re-lidding?
> Do you think Gorilla Glue on all for corners is dangerous, overkill, or a bad idea in anyway?
> 
> I am thinking I should pin the IHS, then glue from the outside down the sides, no glue between the IHS and PCB itself. What do you think?


Don't glue or silicon the IHs back on. This can sometimes make that gap appear again. I don't recommend it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Would you guys have any ideas about custom adhesives hurting the pcb when re-lidding?
> Do you think Gorilla Glue on all for corners is dangerous, overkill, or a bad idea in anyway?
> 
> I am thinking I should pin the IHS, then glue from the outside down the sides, no glue between the IHS and PCB itself. What do you think?


Personally I wouldn't use glue or adhesive on the chip unless its skylake as the die is fragile, but not sure on what causes the cracking of the die from everything I've read there's too many variables. If you have to glue the lid back on then very thin bit of instant gasket with pressure on it which a member was in here trying his best to describe to us in a very poor manner and caused a great deal of confusion as to why he was doing it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Don't glue or silicon the IHs back on. This can sometimes make that gap appear again. I don't recommend it.


If it's skylake it will help reduce PCB bending too and as I mentioned above could further reduce the risk of cracking the die.


----------



## manhattan222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> How are you mounting on the bare die with the seidon? Do you have any pics as I'm curious lol and not bad but 90c is getting there, I wouldn't run it at those temps for long, IBT also adds a lot of heat you don't really need and if you're testing with only standard it won't show instability very well, you would have to use maximum for 20 runs and if you're mega brave the hidden Xtreme mode. Personally I use x264 for stress testing, if it passes like 30 loops or so its generally stable enough for 24/7 use.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Same here, I would like to see that mount! Also agree on the temps and IBT, it tortures Intel chips.


Will do some x264 and see what happens. I mounted the Seidon as described here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1611368/old-lynnfield-i7-875k-delidded-with-procedure-pics-d

I unscrewed the CPU retention bracket from the motherboard and then to apply some extra pressure on the CPU I used springs between the Seidon's screws an its mounting bracket, it also made the contact even. I'll try to take some better pictures when I change the thermal paste.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Would you guys have any ideas about custom adhesives hurting the pcb when re-lidding?
> Do you think Gorilla Glue on all for corners is dangerous, overkill, or a bad idea in anyway?
> 
> I am thinking I should pin the IHS, then glue from the outside down the sides, no glue between the IHS and PCB itself. What do you think?


I really wouldn't glue it back, just use the retention bracket from your mobo to hold it in place and you should be fine. Also, glueing it back will "prevent" you from reapplying the thermal paste on the die. It just seems to negate the purpose of delidding in the first place, in my opinion. And there's also the gap thing.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

How would you (relatively) recommend I sell a delidded chip in any other place than the OCN Market (because I don't have rep) without a lid? That is not happening in my eyes.

I need to reapply the lid, and then I need the customer to know it can do 4.8ghz all day @ 1.33V 46x cache, with proper cooling and x264 stability. Linpacks hit eighty Celsius, and I don't care to run Prime95 at that prolonged voltage.

The rig I have and what I use it for needs hyperthreading. What do you guys think, any traders need a gaming 4690k that knows it can do well okay?


----------



## OperatorFoxX

( I removed this comment until further testing is done )


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> How would you (relatively) recommend I sell a delidded chip in any other place than the OCN Market (because I don't have rep) without a lid? That is not happening in my eyes.
> 
> I need to reapply the lid, and then I need the customer to know it can do 4.8ghz all day @ 1.33V 46x cache, with proper cooling and x264 stability. Linpacks hit eighty Celsius, and I don't care to run Prime95 at that prolonged voltage.
> 
> The rig I have and what I use it for needs hyperthreading. What do you guys think, any traders need a gaming 4690k that knows it can do well okay?


In regards to selling, people know about delidding. However for those who don't, I would say it's a modification to better temperature control for you new processor. You could alos direct them to this thread for an explanation of this. If they wont have it, then get some material like LET (liquid electrical tape).

You could do what I have done and simply hoard hardware


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Thank you Valgaur.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I'm sure you are know quite a bit about computers, but it seems you have no knowledge of CPU solder and it is a frustrating issue when knowledgeable people such as yourself spread misinformation.
> 
> You can not turn indium to molten, it's melting point is 160 degrees Celsius, way past anything safe to do to your CPU. There is also no more risk of removing a soldered CPU IHS than there is of a thermal Compound IHS, you simply have to be mindful of not damaging your components and take your time, just as you do with the thermal compound heat spreaders.
> 
> Seeing as this seems to be new territory, I'll post a video of this when I complete my build and can test it. Thank you for all the replies


The fact is unless careful with anything you'll damage it, depending on the cpu also depends on how easy it is to delid. People remove soldered ihs with heat like on AMD FX chips and I've seen Xeon chips delidded too with heat so you yourself are misinformed.


----------



## manhattan222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> How would you (relatively) recommend I sell a delidded chip in any other place than the OCN Market (because I don't have rep) without a lid? That is not happening in my eyes.
> 
> I need to reapply the lid, and then I need the customer to know it can do 4.8ghz all day @ 1.33V 46x cache, with proper cooling and x264 stability. Linpacks hit eighty Celsius, and I don't care to run Prime95 at that prolonged voltage.
> 
> The rig I have and what I use it for needs hyperthreading. What do you guys think, any traders need a gaming 4690k that knows it can do well okay?


If you're selling to someone who knows about computers, just tell them it's delidded and to use the retention bracket as I said. Show them the benefits of an already delidded cpu. I guess what you are trying to say is if the person will trust you about the CPU's working condition, I guess there's nothing you could do about that.

If you put the lid back on, will you tell the person that it was once delidded? You should. So I guess it makes no difference whether it is relidded.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> If you're selling to someone who knows about computers, just tell them it's delidded and to use the retention bracket as I said. Show them the benefits of an already delidded cpu. I guess what you are trying to say is if the person will trust you about the CPU's working condition, I guess there's nothing you could do about that.
> 
> If you put the lid back on, will you tell the person that it was once delidded? You should. So I guess it makes no difference whether it is relidded.


I think he wants to glue the lid back on so the next user has an easier life ie they won't need to hold the IHS in place while lowering the retention bracket etc.


----------



## manhattan222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> I think he wants to glue the lid back on so the next user has an easier life ie they won't need to hold the IHS in place while lowering the retention bracket etc.


Oh I see. Well, what about the gap issue? Will it make the customer life easier if it happens? imagine the temps get worse than they were before delidding, will you delid AGAIN and then relid? You get my point

In my opinion, once it's done leave it that way. But then again, I know my way around computers, I really wouldn't mind buying a delidded CPU, in fact I'd prefer it that way lol

Maybe you should try and sell it to someone that doesn't mind about delidded CPU? I guess it's a trade off all mods come with.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *manhattan222*
> 
> Oh I see. Well, what about the gap issue? Will it make the customer life easier if it happens? imagine the temps get worse than they were before delidding, will you delid AGAIN and then relid? You get my point
> 
> In my opinion, once it's done leave it that way. But then again, I know my way around computers, I really wouldn't mind buying a delidded CPU, in fact I'd prefer it that way lol
> 
> Maybe you should try and sell it to someone that doesn't mind about delidded CPU? I guess it's a trade off all mods come with.


Testing it before selling it would show if there is an issue or not with the gap being increased but I would think there would be a lot less of a gap with the seller putting a mega thin bit of rtv on the pcb than the amount intel uses.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

The purpose of any bit of adhesive is to retain the IHS in place. This means during shipping, during inspection, during install, during the new user delidding it for their first time. If the lid is not in place I cannot send the chip with thermal interface material applied.

The new user will also be unable to use the processor unless they too are set up to run naked, and I can tell you first hand that running naked with the stock intel heatsync is not possible without the chip being off set and refusing to boot, on my motherboard.

Also the user would be then responsible for purchasing their own thermal paste, one reason why I am selling a processor, not thermal paste, so the user has a proper operating processor out of the package.

I too know computers, in my way, and my intention is to make the process as easy as I found it to be if not even easier.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> The purpose of any bit of adhesive is to retain the IHS in place. This means during shipping, during inspection, during install, during the new user delidding it for their first time. If the lid is not in place I cannot send the chip with thermal interface material applied.
> 
> The new user will also be unable to use the processor unless they too are set up to run naked, and I can tell you first hand that running naked with the stock intel heatsync is not possible without the chip being off set and refusing to boot, on my motherboard.
> 
> Also the user would be then responsible for purchasing their own thermal paste, one reason why I am selling a processor, not thermal paste, so the user has a proper operating processor out of the package.
> 
> I too know computers, in my way, and my intention is to make the process as easy as I found it to be if not even easier.


For the longest time I figured de-lidding Intel chips would be to run without the IHS plate. Further reading most people put it back on.

Once inquired a few days ago if it would be worth it on a stock cooler (and re-use IHS plate) but didn't get much reply. Probably because I am using the stock heat sink. However I can install a full loop and get some really nice temps, I would probably replace the IHS plate with a plate that's much larger like I do on my AMD chips.

I feel that 4.2ghz is plenty for my gaming adventures and have not decided yet to delid.

Most times I sell de-lidded soldered processors and pretty much sell as is. Send it out cheap cause it's already beat. That's the draw back selling in a OC PC forum. Most guys put some type of beat down on the chip even if it's not a heavy one. I pushed 4.4ghz on air and was at temperature threshold. So backed it down to 4.2ghz and live with it..... but don't have too haha


----------



## OperatorFoxX

( I removed this comment until further testing is done )


----------



## Arctucas

I am reading the last several comments about re-installing the IHS.

The issue of 'gluing' the IHS back on causing the same problem with the gap between IHS and die would only occur if one were to apply the same excessive amount of sealant as was originally applied.

I 'tacked' mine back on with black PermaTex gasket sealer, using a toothpick to pick up a tiny, pin-head sized drop of PermaTex, and applied it each corner of the IHS before using the Rockit 88 re-lidding tool to apply pressure to the IHS for several hours while the PermaTex cured.

There is virtually no gap between the IHS and PCB. The IHS did not move when the CPU was inserted in the socket and the hold-down engaged.

And, I see ~15°C temp improvement.

That is my experience.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The fact is unless careful with anything you'll damage it, depending on the cpu also depends on how easy it is to delid.
> 
> ]
> 
> 
> 
> Lmao, this video... I have no doubt that you can remove an IHS by lighting your chip on fire. The idea, however, is that you are supposed to be able to reuse it afterwards. Even IF you somehow do not damage your chip by subjecting it to extreme heat (which is very unlikely), why would you do that when you can simply just use a small amount of force to de-lid it?
> 
> Some people seem to think shunting for de-soldering works, but unfortunately that is not the case for gold mounted heat sensitive equipment. This only works for iron or steel with high heat resistance. Normally shunts are used to solder stuff, not to de-solder it.
> 
> Either way, I did not come to debate, I will let people decide for themselves on how to remove their soldered lid or believe in superstitions if they so desire. I will post again when I have a video of evidence and tests, as soon as my parts arrive and I get some time to work on them.
Click to expand...

I make horrible videos. lol. sorry. Here's a slightly better one.





It's a pretty brutal removal process. I've been lucky 12 of 14 times killing only 2 processors.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

I'm abit surprised how high my temps are after deliding still. 4.3Ghz 1.248v on a Silverstone NT06-pro ITX cooler and I'm still hitting 65C max under load... I think I can do better. I just picked up some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro and I'm going to give that a try. I previously had ultra but I think I might have applied slightly too much......we'll see how pro goes. I've heard its harder to work with but carries slightly higher thermal properties. I also plan on gluing down my IHS this time to solidify things...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Lmao, this video... I have no doubt that you can remove an IHS by lighting your chip on fire. The idea, however, is that you are supposed to be able to reuse it afterwards. Even IF you somehow do not damage your chip by subjecting it to extreme heat (which is very unlikely), why would you do that when you can simply just use a small amount of force to de-lid it?
> 
> Some people seem to think shunting for de-soldering works, but unfortunately that is not the case for gold mounted heat sensitive equipment. This only works for iron or steel with high heat resistance. Normally shunts are used to solder stuff, not to de-solder it.
> 
> Either way, I did not come to debate, I will let people decide for themselves on how to remove their soldered lid or believe in superstitions if they so desire. I will post again when I have a video of evidence and tests, as soon as my parts arrive and I get some time to work on them.


If you investigated a little further you would see the chip works, the user who uploaded the video is a member here and can confirm they work perfectly fine, I believe he's only killed 2 or 3 of the chips out of quite a few of them when I asked him about delidding my FX8350. The debate is that you want to delid one way saying the other isn't possible without killing a CPU which I'm sorry to inform you is incorrect and you shunned others for misinformation but spread it yourself.

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> I make horrible videos. lol. sorry. Here's a slightly better one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a pretty brutal removal process. I've been lucky 12 of 14 times killing only 2 processors.


And here he is, Shrimpy himself.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> I'm abit surprised how high my temps are after deliding still. 4.3Ghz 1.248v on a Silverstone NT06-pro ITX cooler and I'm still hitting 65C max under load... I think I can do better. I just picked up some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro and I'm going to give that a try. I previously had ultra but I think I might have applied slightly too much......we'll see how pro goes. I've heard its harder to work with but carries slightly higher thermal properties. I also plan on gluing down my IHS this time to solidify things...


Your temps are high because you're using an air cooler, and a small one at that. Put a bigger cooler on it and see.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

oh sorry ben. I forgot the testing proof









http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2125351


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> I'm abit surprised how high my temps are after deliding still. 4.3Ghz 1.248v on a Silverstone NT06-pro ITX cooler and I'm still hitting 65C max under load... I think I can do better. I just picked up some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro and I'm going to give that a try. I previously had ultra but I think I might have applied slightly too much......we'll see how pro goes. I've heard its harder to work with but carries slightly higher thermal properties. I also plan on gluing down my IHS this time to solidify things...
> 
> 
> 
> Your temps are high because you're using an air cooler, and a small one at that. Put a bigger cooler on it and see.
Click to expand...

Ha, wish I could...unfortunately I cannot... I'm getting a new 140mm slim fan for psh-pull on my air cooler so hopefully that'll get me another 1-3C...


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Ha, wish I could...unfortunately I cannot... I'm getting a new 140mm slim fan for psh-pull on my air cooler so hopefully that'll get me another 1-3C...


I understand that space is limited in your case but that's the downfall of building in a tiny case. If it was me I would watercool the chip naked and have an external radiator on a stand.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Ha, wish I could...unfortunately I cannot... I'm getting a new 140mm slim fan for psh-pull on my air cooler so hopefully that'll get me another 1-3C...
> 
> 
> 
> I understand that space is limited in your case but that's the downfall of building in a tiny case. If it was me I would watercool the chip naked and have an external radiator on a stand.
Click to expand...

Sounds great! Now I'd need a bigger apartment. My whole idea was small small small. Since I'm in grad school I need desk space.... I'm more so going for efficiency than large massive cooling. If I can get the absolute best performance out of the small cooler I'll call it a day... My goal is a 2-3C drop with the 2nd fan. Most I've seen is anywhere from 1-4C difference going from push to push/pull.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Sounds great! Now I'd need a bigger apartment. My whole idea was small small small. Since I'm in grad school I need desk space.... I'm more so going for efficiency than large massive cooling. If I can get the absolute best performance out of the small cooler I'll call it a day... My goal is a 2-3C drop with the 2nd fan. Most I've seen is anywhere from 1-4C difference going from push to push/pull.


I understand what you're saying but you're not really getting decent temps to begin with using a small cooler, you're no where near 90c etc so I would just leave it as is if not improve case airflow.


----------



## EvilWiffles

Anyone tried delidding a soldered CPU using a stove top?
Don't imagine you'd damage it by heat (ya know, how else did they solder the IHS to the die).

Plop some TIM on the stove top, put the CPU IHS down on it and turn it on. Lift the chip off the IHS, profit.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Anyone tried delidding a soldered CPU using a stove top?
> Don't imagine you'd damage it by heat (ya know, how else did they solder the IHS to the die).
> 
> Plop some TIM on the stove top, put the CPU IHS down on it and turn it on. Lift the chip off the IHS, profit.


There is an idea with merit, but the only legitimate reason I have seen someone dellid a solder CPU was when he was upgrading a MacPro and the OEM processors didnt have lids, and the cooling configuration would not allow space for lids. Otherwise, solder is about the best stuff you can have in between IHS and lid.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you investigated a little further you would see the chip works, the user who uploaded the video is a member here and can confirm they work perfectly fine, I believe he's only killed 2 or 3 of the chips out of quite a few of them when I asked him about delidding my FX8350. The debate is that you want to delid one way saying the other isn't possible without killing a CPU which I'm sorry to inform you is incorrect and you shunned others for misinformation but spread it yourself.
> 
> People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
> And here he is, Shrimpy himself.


My side of the argument is to not do something completely unnecessary that is sure to damage your chip. If you have evidence that heating your chip to 160C with a blowtorch doesn't damage it at all, affect its longevity, or overclock voltages, then I will retract my position, as I am not denying that with a good engineering mind that a great many things are possible (including removing a cpu IHS with heat without damaging it). I am not here to throw stones either, as getting to the truth is most important. If someone has found a way to effectively heat the IHS with 100% success rate on a cpu while keeping the cpu at a reasonable temperature, I will feel obligated to delete my posts, and yield to the truth. I do not consider an 85% success rate of not completely destroying your chip and unknown prolonged damage or degradation to CPU voltages to be enough evidence for me to do this, quite yet.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> I make horrible videos. lol. sorry. Here's a slightly better one.
> 
> It's a pretty brutal removal process. I've been lucky 12 of 14 times killing only 2 processors.


Have you tried physically? I'm sitting here with a de-lidded 5960x, in my hand, that the IHS popped off with a couple of rocks and a twist. I might see how one may endeavor to find another method for a xeon core with a much larger surface area soldered but with CPUs like the FX family, I am very curios as to why you wish to use a melting method. I mean, you've touched the solder yourself. You must know how soft it is compared to the extremely rigid die but yet you continue on with the melting process?


----------



## manhattan222

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *EvilWiffles*
> 
> Anyone tried delidding a soldered CPU using a stove top?
> Don't imagine you'd damage it by heat (ya know, how else did they solder the IHS to the die).
> 
> Plop some TIM on the stove top, put the CPU IHS down on it and turn it on. Lift the chip off the IHS, profit.


I have tried on my i7 875K and old Celeron D (for practice) and succeeded: http://www.overclock.net/t/1611368/old-lynnfield-i7-875k-delidded-with-procedure-pics-d

No need to apply any thermal paste to the stove though, just let it heat up before placing the CPU on top of it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> There is an idea with merit, but the only legitimate reason I have seen someone dellid a solder CPU was when he was upgrading a MacPro and the OEM processors didnt have lids, and the cooling configuration would not allow space for lids. Otherwise, solder is about the best stuff you can have in between IHS and lid.


Well, aren't temp drops and more overclock reason enough to delid a soldered CPU? I mean, it's an overclocking forum lol

Just kidding. Seriously, I just couldn't pass 4GHz stably with the lid and a Seidon 120V. I was hitting 95º @ 4Ghz easily in stress tests. After delidding and installing it bare die I got 71c which I think is more than enough reason to delid, if you know what you're doing. Also, my CPU requires more voltage than other i7 8xx i've seen, so without delidding I'd be stuck @ 4GHz.

It's actually quite easy to melt the solder without damaging the CPU. The trickiest part for me was cutting the glue that holds the IHS, it was TIGHT as hell, so it was hard to insert the blade.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you investigated a little further you would see the chip works, the user who uploaded the video is a member here and can confirm they work perfectly fine, I believe he's only killed 2 or 3 of the chips out of quite a few of them when I asked him about delidding my FX8350. The debate is that you want to delid one way saying the other isn't possible without killing a CPU which I'm sorry to inform you is incorrect and you shunned others for misinformation but spread it yourself.
> 
> People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
> And here he is, Shrimpy himself.
> 
> 
> 
> My side of the argument is to not do something completely unnecessary that is sure to damage your chip. If you have evidence that heating your chip to 160C with a blowtorch doesn't damage it at all, affect its longevity, or overclock voltages, then I will retract my position, as I am not denying that with a good engineering mind that a great many things are possible (including removing a cpu IHS with heat without damaging it). I am not here to throw stones either, as getting to the truth is most important. If someone has found a way to effectively heat the IHS with 100% success rate on a cpu while keeping the cpu at a reasonable temperature, I will feel obligated to delete my posts, and yield to the truth. I do not consider an 85% success rate of not completely destroying your chip and unknown prolonged damage or degradation to CPU voltages to be enough evidence for me to do this, quite yet.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> I make horrible videos. lol. sorry. Here's a slightly better one.
> 
> It's a pretty brutal removal process. I've been lucky 12 of 14 times killing only 2 processors.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have you tried physically? I'm sitting here with a de-lidded 5960x, in my hand, that the IHS popped off with a couple of rocks and a twist. I might see how one may endeavor to find another method for a xeon core with a much larger surface area soldered but with CPUs like the FX family, I am very curios as to why you wish to use a melting method. I mean, you've touched the solder yourself. You must know how soft it is compared to the extremely rigid die but yet you continue on with the melting process?
Click to expand...

Tooling availability I suppose.

I'm looking for a video that has a twist and pop method for soldered AMD processors...... I cannot find one ;(


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Tooling availability I suppose.
> 
> I'm looking for a video that has a twist and pop method for soldered AMD processors...... I cannot find one ;(


I imagine the sheer surface area of the die on the amd would be the reason why it wouldn't work tbh...


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Not sure Ben. I remove with heat....

At fox. Cutting the glue and slicing pcb is how I damaged on. The first one was fx 4100 and used too much heat. With the small torch it takes just less than 60 seconds of heating time. Now knowing that I cannot heat much more the most risk becomes removing the glue with a razor.

Longevity? Look for Mr Scott at Warp 9. He has a fx-8320 that was delidded quite some time ago.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Not sure Ben. I remove with heat....
> 
> At fox. Cutting the glue and slicing pcb is how I damaged on. The first one was fx 4100 and used too much heat. With the small torch it takes just less than 60 seconds of heating time. Now knowing that I cannot heat much more the most risk becomes removing the glue with a razor.
> 
> Longevity? Look for Mr Scott at Warp 9. He has a fx-8320 that was delidded quite some time ago.


Hmm, well if I had a number of chips and unlimited money, it'd be interesting to run an experiment. Although, I don't recommend it, if you continue to melt solder on chips, would you mind testing the chip first for typical sweet spot voltage (for the 5960x 1.3V is the sweet spot for a clock of anywhere between 4.4~4.6 ---According to ASUS ofc) and then after deliding it, see if the voltage has improved (as it should), stayed the same, or increased to meet the same speed. I imagine if the voltage acts as it should, the longevity should be relatively unchanged. Perhaps I am wrong. As for the video of deliding with a twist. Give me a few weeks and I'll have a temp test bench set up and do a adequate testing video. Also, I do not think the FX dies are too large to prevent popping off the lid, I don't even think the xeon dies are too large, although if you have a pcb like broadwell, a few steps should be taken to add a support to as much pcb area as possible and I probably would recommend using the corners for prying (more localized force at the solder)


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Well there's a pretty big difference between soldered Intel vs AMD. For starters the AMD chips have pins are not LGA in design. So you are limited to clamping areas. The Die size of FX is larger than Deneb/Thuban for sure.

I've done testing before and after de-lidding FX-9590 (and most of the rest of the chips). End result was a 5.2ghz stable at one click over P-state voltage at a 50F water delta. Top clock was 5.7ghz and holds the record at this speed for liquid cooling.

Pretty sure based on my averages that a 100mhz overclock increase is pretty common. I had de-lidded for a fella at Overclockers forums and he had a wonderful experience and also gained 100mhz and that was on air cooling. (970T was the cpu)

The Admin at Overclockers won the FX-6300 at a contest over at ClassicPlatforms.

Each chip has gone to a new owner besides myself.

Started de-lidding back in 2009 soldered AMD chips. It's now 2016. As far as I am aware, each and every chip I either sold or gave away is still in working order. Besides one 6400+ (did 2 of them) and was killed in an OC session. Both 6400+ chips where subjected to LN2 and 4ghz clock speeds.

You must also keep in mind that I am an extreme enthusiast and have run a variety of different cooling techniques including and not limited to LN2 DIce and even TEC.

Lots of experience with de-lidding and overclocking, and there is no promise a chip cannot be killed with or without a IHS plate.

Have killed more chips and boards overclocking than I have de-lidding, this I can promise you.

Oh about AMD FX processors and sweet spot voltage.........
___ This voltage varies with cooling applied. Since FX processors are not voltage limited, you look for better cooling to keep voltages down. I have demonstrated this with a TEC demonstration at ClassicPlatforms. Links and proofs I can provide at requests, but may be better you'd hear word from people that have my de-lids and use them.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Well there's a pretty big difference between soldered Intel vs AMD. For starters the AMD chips have pins are not LGA in design. So you are limited to clamping areas. The Die size of FX is larger than Deneb/Thuban for sure.
> 
> I've done testing before and after de-lidding FX-9590 (and most of the rest of the chips). End result was a 5.2ghz stable at one click over P-state voltage at a 50F water delta. Top clock was 5.7ghz and holds the record at this speed for liquid cooling.
> 
> Pretty sure based on my averages that a 100mhz overclock increase is pretty common. I had de-lidded for a fella at Overclockers forums and he had a wonderful experience and also gained 100mhz and that was on air cooling. (970T was the cpu)
> 
> The Admin at Overclockers won the FX-6300 at a contest over at ClassicPlatforms.
> 
> Each chip has gone to a new owner besides myself.
> 
> Started de-lidding back in 2009 soldered AMD chips. It's now 2016. As far as I am aware, each and every chip I either sold or gave away is still in working order. Besides one 6400+ (did 2 of them) and was killed in an OC session. Both 6400+ chips where subjected to LN2 and 4ghz clock speeds.
> 
> You must also keep in mind that I am an extreme enthusiast and have run a variety of different cooling techniques including and not limited to LN2 DIce and even TEC.
> 
> Lots of experience with de-lidding and overclocking, and there is no promise a chip cannot be killed with or without a IHS plate.
> 
> Have killed more chips and boards overclocking than I have de-lidding, this I can promise you.
> 
> 
> Oh about AMD FX processors and sweet spot voltage.........
> ___ This voltage varies with cooling applied. Since FX processors are not voltage limited, you look for better cooling to keep voltages down. I have demonstrated this with a TEC demonstration at ClassicPlatforms. Links and proofs I can provide at requests, but may be better you'd hear word from people that have my de-lids and use them.


This, very much this, everyday this.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hello people!
> 
> I'm currently debating a new build and I just need ideas. Here is the link to my post.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1611211/need-some-help-after-a-few-builds#post_25510136
> 
> Arctic as, I see your post and submission, I'm away from my desktop but I'll add you when I'm near it! Doing submissions on phones isn't a great experience


Wish I had some suggestions for the other thread but CAD design isn't my thing! If it is business that makes you $$$ just get the best you can Afforrd! You know how to overclock, you have a good case (I know that enthoo looks dope but hey, $$$$ looks better) and a good power supply with a 10 year warranty which is no doubt still having some years left, Get a CPU cheapest with the #threads you need and you can overclock.. Mr. 1.99volts... Get a good cooler, I suggest a Noctua D-15 if you can fit and a GPU that is awesome for CAD design. You would know best in that department. Valgaur, you opened a thread to ask people, but I think you know what is good by now. I know I do for gaming and leisure. But not for CAD design lol. Trust yourself and your budget and reuse parts when you can. Your case and PSU are good to go! Sell the 780Ti's, yes they aren't worth much probably $150 each by today's standards, and build what you can.







You da man... I remember when you had no flames... Now you are on fire!


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> This voltage varies with cooling applied.


Yes, well I assumed that we all assumed that other variables would remain the same for testing purposes (ASUSs's standard was a triple 120mm radiator). Though interesting results in the Δ category, I'm more interested with degradation aspects, which temps can be indicative of but only to a certain extent.

For example, the test I'm about to perform on the 6900k will include the standard practice of setting cache, ring, dram voltages and clocks to minimum values, turning off boost, and then finding the minimum value for core voltage and VIN. Then run core and VIN specific calculations with prime95 with a set amount of grease and a static fan setting (ambient temps and all that jazz will remain constant to reduce variables). Record the results. After deliding, I will then put grease with just the die and block (after taping the top of the chip -of course) to see what new lows we can achieve. And then I will use the thermal pad method to see, again, the difference. If the graphs behave as they should, it wouldn't be an unsafe gamble to assume that future failure at the same clocks/voltages is or isn't likely based on those results (probably, but without endurance testing, this method is the next best way to make an educated guess -unless someone more educated than me has a better way)

I did totally space that AM3 still used pins, which would prove more difficult to make a de-lidding platform. l wish I still had my 9590, perhaps when my family runs out of use for their 8370e, I'll take a look into delidding that for curiosity purposes.

Anyway, I'll refrain from further antagonizing this method until further testing is performed or said users give their results. At the very least, it seems that it is a standard practice for some to use this method of delidding with better results than I would have originally guessed. Either way, I appreciate you sharing your results.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

I'm going to say you are thinking way too much into this really. let me explain.

I started doing this as a hobby and for fun nothing more.

Did not start de-lidding 7 years ago to have a debate over it now.

9590BE you say? Yea I de-lidded one of those already. B3 stepping + TLB. You won't get more from that chip even with a de-lid.

Glad to help and share results. These results vary for every one.

Quote:


> well I assumed that we all assumed that other variables would remain the same for testing purposes


Can't be done. Just the cooling device clamping procedures differ from being lidded to not. Besides today's ambient temp may be higher than yesterdays, Too many variables, we are not in a lab here.....


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> I make horrible videos. lol. sorry. Here's a slightly better one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a pretty brutal removal process. I've been lucky 12 of 14 times killing only 2 processors.


Video got banned. Must have had something in the background or something.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

I removed the song. The link should be good soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Wish I had some suggestions for the other thread but CAD design isn't my thing! If it is business that makes you $$$ just get the best you can Afforrd! You know how to overclock, you have a good case (I know that enthoo looks dope but hey, $$$$ looks better) and a good power supply with a 10 year warranty which is no doubt still having some years left, Get a CPU cheapest with the #threads you need and you can overclock.. Mr. 1.99volts... Get a good cooler, I suggest a Noctua D-15 if you can fit and a GPU that is awesome for CAD design. You would know best in that department. Valgaur, you opened a thread to ask people, but I think you know what is good by now. I know I do for gaming and leisure. But not for CAD design lol. Trust yourself and your budget and reuse parts when you can. Your case and PSU are good to go! Sell the 780Ti's, yes they aren't worth much probably $150 each by today's standards, and build what you can.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You da man... I remember when you had no flames... Now you are on fire!


Well thank you. I just like confirmation of usage and priorities in builds. I've actually changed







I'm going mitx and watercooled. I want a fresh start, and want a build challenge so WC in mitx will be a hoot! For work and CAD stuff might even get an ultrawide monitor for work loads. Might choose a 32 gig mem kit, but i'll see.









Thank you for all the help with people in this Thread throughout the time. You've been a big help Chronicfx!


----------



## tps3443

Guys, I DELIDED my 6600K and after reinstalling it runs MUCH HOTTER!

4.8Ghz Silicon Lottery 6600K, DELIDED

Polished both sides of LID to Mirror finish

Replaced thermal paste with AS5 on DIE and replaced LID "DID NOT GLUE BACK ON"

Replaced thermal past on CPU, reinstalled a Polished mirror like finish water block

idle temps are around 50C, and will easily LOAD to over 100C if I let it do so in about less than half a second in Intel Burn Test.
______________________________________________________________________________________________________

I have retried, and reapplied everything about (3) times now. And I end up with the same results give or take a 1C hotter, and 1C cooler.

I am really confused as to what is really going on.. My 240MM radiator pump is running full blast, and the 120mm (2) fans are running full speed as well!

I would like to run it without a LID all together, but the DIE is to low to even contact the water block.

"Any ideas?...


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Guys, I DELIDED my 6600K and after reinstalling it runs MUCH HOTTER!
> 
> 4.8Ghz Silicon Lottery 6600K, DELIDED
> 
> Polished both sides of LID to Mirror finish
> 
> Replaced thermal paste with AS5 on DIE and replaced LID "DID NOT GLUE BACK ON"
> 
> Replaced thermal past on CPU, reinstalled a Polished mirror like finish water block
> 
> idle temps are around 50C, and will easily LOAD to over 100C if I let it do so in about less than half a second in Intel Burn Test.
> ______________________________________________________________________________________________________
> 
> I have retried, and reapplied everything about (3) times now. And I end up with the same results give or take a 1C hotter, and 1C cooler.
> 
> I am really confused as to what is really going on.. My 240MM radiator pump is running full blast, and the 120mm (2) fans are running full speed as well!
> 
> I would like to run it without a LID all together, but the DIE is to low to even contact the water block.
> 
> "Any ideas?...


1st thing, you shouldn't be using as5 on the die. It'll pump out quickly and temps will rise. A Liquid Metal TIM is best on the die. The IHS can use normal paste with no issues. Were the temps even better for a few minutes? or did they instantly go up after delidding


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> 1st thing, you shouldn't be using as5 on the die. It'll pump out quickly and temps will rise. A Liquid Metal TIM is best on the die. The IHS can use normal paste with no issues. Were the temps even better for a few minutes? or did they instantly go up after delidding


Ok, so I have retried, and reapplied everything (4) times now. I just tore it down again, cleaned everything up! I applied a standard (white thermal paste on the DIE) Then I used the same on the LID. Booted up in to BIOS, and my IDLE temps are 54C now. Everytime I try to fix it, they just get HOTTER AND HOTTER.

I'm really not sure what is wrong with it.

I'm at stock speeds! Stock voltage! And it will peg up to 100C in less then a quarter of a second running burn test.

I am runined my CPU. It works yes! I was very carful not to damage it. And everything went smooth.. Accept one problem, It runs to hot to use In anything other than light internet browsing.

I cleaned all the GLUE off the CPU PCB, I mean is the LID moving around you think? I don't think it is contacting 100%. it looks like it is though.

I just wish there was a way to fix it.. I'm running out of thermal paste now too. And, there are not PC stores in my state...

If I cannot fix it soon, then I'm gonna have to glue it back together and sell it and buy a 6700K..

This is a SHAME to! Because this is a Silicon Lottery 4.9Ghz chip.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Ok, so I have retried, and reapplied everything (4) times now. I just tore it down again, cleaned everything up! I applied a standard (white thermal paste on the DIE) Then I used the same on the LID. Booted up in to BIOS, and my IDLE temps are 54C now. Everytime I try to fix it, they just get HOTTER AND HOTTER.
> 
> I'm really not sure what is wrong with it.
> 
> I'm at stock speeds! Stock voltage! And it will peg up to 100C in less then a quarter of a second running burn test.
> 
> I am runined my CPU. It works yes! I was very carful not to damage it. And everything went smooth.. Accept one problem, It runs to hot to use In anything other than light internet browsing.
> 
> I cleaned all the GLUE off the CPU PCB, I mean is the LID moving around you think? I don't think it is contacting 100%. it looks like it is though.
> 
> I just wish there was a way to fix it.. I'm running out of thermal paste now too. And, there are not PC stores in my state...
> 
> If I cannot fix it soon, then I'm gonna have to glue it back together and sell it and buy a 6700K..
> 
> This is a SHAME to! Because this is a Silicon Lottery 4.9Ghz chip.


Do you have any pictures of what the die or ihs look like when you take it apart? Looking at the spread that is left when things are removed can tell you a lot about what is going on. Are you tightening the mounting hardware all the way down? does the TIM look like its being spread evenly and very thinly?


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> [...] I applied a standard (white thermal paste on the DIE) [...]


There is a problem when you use normal paste on the die and you should really use one of the "liquid metal" paste alternatives. That said, there's also something different wrong for you from what you've explained. When you use normal paste, things should at first behave well. The temperatures should be very good when you do a fresh application of your paste. I would guess that something does not make good contact. There's a gap somewhere, either between the die and IHS, or between the IHS and the cooler's base plate.

About liquid metal:

The normal paste products will all "pump out" when you use them on the die. They do not stay in place when things get hot and move away. They only stay good for a few days at most. Again: this means what you explain you did, things should at first work. The temperatures should be very good in the first day where you've put things together with a normal paste.

After you've got your current problem in control, you need to try a liquid metal eventually. The products I know of are:

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra (and the older "Liquid Pro")
Phobya Liquid Metal
Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut

You will need to order one of these products in an online shop like Amazon, as they are very likely not available in local shops.


----------



## tps3443

Okay, I see something is definitely wrong then! I went through it all again, for the 4th time now.

I replaced the TIM, and thermal paste with standard white thermal grease. I undervolted my 6600K to 1.150V this is stock voltage, I then reinstalled my H100I, and on full pump speed, and full fan speed, I can mange 95C full load at 3.6Ghz on all 4 cores. With only 1.150V on a closed loop cooler. This is insane! lol.

before I did the DELID, I was running 4.8Ghz - 4.9Ghz and I would top around 90C with 1.428Volts!

And before at default speeds, I don't think it ever broke 45C or maybe 48C.

So STOCK FOR STOCK, DELID BEFORE AND AFTER! My temps have well... You know, lol DOUBLED!

This is all terrible!

I ordered LIQUID METAL just a few moments ago. I am hoping to get this resolved!


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Do you have any pictures of what the die or ihs look like when you take it apart? Looking at the spread that is left when things are removed can tell you a lot about what is going on. Are you tightening the mounting hardware all the way down? does the TIM look like its being spread evenly and very thinly?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Okay, I see something is definitely wrong then! I went through it all again, for the 4th time now.
> 
> I replaced the TIM, and thermal paste with standard white thermal grease. I undervolted my 6600K to 1.150V this is stock voltage, I then reinstalled my H100I, and on full pump speed, and full fan speed, I can mange 95C full load at 3.6Ghz on all 4 cores. With only 1.150V on a closed loop cooler. This is insane! lol.
> 
> before I did the DELID, I was running 4.8Ghz - 4.9Ghz and I would top around 90C with 1.428Volts!
> 
> And before at default speeds, I don't think it ever broke 45C or maybe 48C.
> 
> So STOCK FOR STOCK, DELID BEFORE AND AFTER! My temps have well... You know, lol DOUBLED!
> 
> This is all terrible!
> 
> I ordered LIQUID METAL just a few moments ago. I am hoping to get this resolved!


edit: in addition to my other questions, does you IHS spin like this (when clean, no paste) or is it contacting the PCB? I noticed you said you lapped the inside, did you go too far and remove enough material to create a gap? Looking at the spread from the TIM will probably tell you

also that is not my gif


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Okay, I see something is definitely wrong then! I went through it all again, for the 4th time now.
> 
> I replaced the TIM, and thermal paste with standard white thermal grease. I undervolted my 6600K to 1.150V this is stock voltage, I then reinstalled my H100I, and on full pump speed, and full fan speed, I can mange 95C full load at 3.6Ghz on all 4 cores. With only 1.150V on a closed loop cooler. This is insane! lol.
> 
> before I did the DELID, I was running 4.8Ghz - 4.9Ghz and I would top around 90C with 1.428Volts!
> 
> And before at default speeds, I don't think it ever broke 45C or maybe 48C.
> 
> So STOCK FOR STOCK, DELID BEFORE AND AFTER! My temps have well... You know, lol DOUBLED!
> 
> This is all terrible!
> 
> I ordered LIQUID METAL just a few moments ago. I am hoping to get this resolved!


You gotta be putting the lid on sideways or something. Or something possibly happened to your h100i during the process and its somehow not working correctly? Try using a regular air cooler or something to at least eliminate that as a possibility. Definitely something wrong.


----------



## tps3443

Tim spins freely.. My CPU is dead now lol! I'm upset. I turned on my system, and it power cycled.. Then I turned it on again, and nothing! No power at all. I believe this is a DEAD CPU.what a shame.

I flashed the BIOS, took CPU out, reinstalled. Nada! Nothing. No power, just dead...

I didn't over heat it,


----------



## boot318

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Tim spins freely.. My CPU is dead now lol! I'm upset. I turned on my system, and it power cycled.. Then I turned it on again, and nothing! No power at all. I believe this is a DEAD CPU.what a shame.
> 
> I flashed the BIOS, took CPU out, reinstalled. Nada! Nothing. No power, just dead...
> 
> I didn't over heat it,


What method did you use for the delidding process?

Anyway, if push comes to shove you can bake the CPU @400F for 10 minutes. That bought my dying CPU back to life. I would use that as the last method of all methods.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *boot318*
> 
> What method did you use for the delidding process?
> 
> Anyway, if push comes to shove you can bake the CPU @400F for 10 minutes. That bought my dying CPU back to life. I would use that as the last method of all methods.


Agreed, always take the long shots, sometimes they work. What delidding process was used?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Tim spins freely.. My CPU is dead now lol! I'm upset. I turned on my system, and it power cycled.. Then I turned it on again, and nothing! No power at all. I believe this is a DEAD CPU.what a shame.
> 
> I flashed the BIOS, took CPU out, reinstalled. Nada! Nothing. No power, just dead...
> 
> I didn't over heat it,


you still never responded to questions about the Tim spread. If the mount isn't putting enough pressure on the cpu then it's not going to boot. It may not be your cpu, I think you've got a mount problem. You refuse to acknowledge the question though so I don't know what to tell you bro...


----------



## tps3443

My CPU is dead now lol! I'm upset. I turned on my system, and it power cycled.. Then I turned it on again, and nothing! No power at all. I believe this is a DEAD CPU.what a shame.

I flashed the BIOS, took CPU out, reinstalled. Nada! Nothing. No power, just dead...

I didn't over heat it,


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> My CPU is dead now lol! I'm upset. I turned on my system, and it power cycled.. Then I turned it on again, and nothing! No power at all. I believe this is a DEAD CPU.what a shame.
> 
> I flashed the BIOS, took CPU out, reinstalled. Nada! Nothing. No power, just dead...
> 
> I didn't over heat it,


did you mean to repost almost the exact same thing or was that a mistake?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Okay, I see something is definitely wrong then! I went through it all again, for the 4th time now.
> 
> I replaced the TIM, and thermal paste with standard white thermal grease. I undervolted my 6600K to 1.150V this is stock voltage, *I then reinstalled my H100I*, and on full pump speed, and full fan speed, I can mange 95C full load at 3.6Ghz on all 4 cores. With only 1.150V on a closed loop cooler. This is insane! lol.
> 
> before I did the DELID, I was running 4.8Ghz - 4.9Ghz and I would top around 90C with 1.428Volts!
> 
> And before at default speeds, I don't think it ever broke 45C or maybe 48C.
> 
> So STOCK FOR STOCK, DELID BEFORE AND AFTER! My temps have well... You know, lol DOUBLED!
> 
> This is all terrible!
> 
> I ordered LIQUID METAL just a few moments ago. I am hoping to get this resolved!


There is the issue.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> There is the issue.


is that the one lots of people do the washer mod on?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> is that the one lots of people do the washer mod on?


Not sure, I just know that people who see high temps theres something wrong with that AIO. If he took too much material from the inside of the IHS for some unknown reason, I've never heard of anyone doing that and it could of crushed his die and cracked it considering the pressure. If it was uneven too, well dead CPU right there.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Not sure, I just know that people who see high temps theres something wrong with that AIO. If he took too much material from the inside of the IHS for some unknown reason, I've never heard of anyone doing that and it could of crushed his die and cracked it considering the pressure. If it was uneven too, well dead CPU right there.


if he took to much from the inside of the ihs wouldn't that make the ihs rest on the pcb, lowering the pressure on the die? The die is taking full mounting pressure under normal conditions since the ihs is only resting on the die. I don't think that is his issue though. I do think that might be the/one of the aio's that had poor mounting pressure and required washers behind the mobo to compensate. If he's got a thin pcb mobo, maybe removing that adhesive took the last bit of pressure he had.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> if he took to much from the inside of the ihs wouldn't that make the ihs rest on the pcb, lowering the pressure on the die? The die is taking full mounting pressure under normal conditions since the ihs is only resting on the die. I don't think that is his issue though. I do think that might be the/one of the aio's that had poor mounting pressure and required washers behind the mobo to compensate. If he's got a thin pcb mobo, maybe removing that adhesive took the last bit of pressure he had.


Yeah sorry, my brain isn't with it today, if the IHS is making too much contact with the PCB it will bend it and that will kill the cpu.


----------



## dmfree88

With the temperatures that were happening I doubt it is dead. The thermal paste probably pumped out of the bad mount. He used even worse paste the last time and it has been in there running with the mount being improper. My guess is the h100i is not working correctly whether it be from bad mount or maybe the pump is just giving up. People have had so many problems with those clc just not working correctly and having a hell of a time mounting correctly. I still think the best bet would be to now replace the paste yet again (preferably with liquid metal) then mount a different cooler to the cpu and eliminate the h100i as the possible cause of the problem. If the problem persists after testing with another cooler (preferably air cooler to eliminate possible failures) then there must be an issue with the lid itself. May need a shim to get the cooler to mount properly.

There has to be a problem with the mount. I don't see how the CPU could have just died. Seems more like the thermal paste is no longer making contact so it wont boot because it hits 100 degrees instantly.


----------



## dmfree88

Sorry double post but I had a thought

Another guess at what could be happening is because he has sanded the interior to a mirror finish and we know that the IHS sits directly on the die maybe the pressure of his cooler on the IHS is enough to press all the thermal paste off the die. Since the IHS is so smooth there is nowhere for the paste to "grab" and at least work for a couple days like most people so it just pushes out and doesn't make enough contact.

If this is true that would mean he would NEED liquid metal in order for it to work at all (or possibly very thick paste like the stock from Intel). Of course I could be wrong but this is just a thought and kinda makes sense.


----------



## tps3443

Honestly, before all of this deliding started, my pc just powered down yesterday while playing fallout 4.

And after turning it back on, it just whimpered with the smallest amount of effort trying to turn on.

With no damage done to my CPU. I think I killed my motherboard. The psu powers on after after grounding it outside of the PC , and when I first built this PC a few months ago, without even having my cpu in the mail yet, I powered it on without a cpu installed.

Which, my board will NOT power up with, or without a cpu installed right now.

So, I think a bumped it a little to hard with the phillips head, and broke my main board.

Im thinking the mobo is bad, and it was just happen during all of the deliding, uninstalling, and reinstalling trial and error high temp mess.


----------



## dmfree88

If you played fallout 4 with it delidded with thermal paste on the die and as I mentioned a smooth IHS it seems highly likely that the bad contact simply got worse and the paste pumped out. Most people using paste on the die get pumpout in a day or two especially with any use beyond idle / minor web browsing (gaming for example). If you already had poor contact with idle temps above 40c then it was running even hotter while gaming and probably pumped out the last of the paste. Paste might pump out faster if the IHS is smooth. If not enough contact is made between the die and the IHS the PC will not boot as temps will be too high too fast.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Honestly, before all of this deliding started, my pc just powered down yesterday while playing fallout 4.
> 
> And after turning it back on, it just whimpered with the smallest amount of effort trying to turn on.
> 
> With no damage done to my CPU. I think I killed my motherboard. The psu powers on after after grounding it outside of the PC , and when I first built this PC a few months ago, without even having my cpu in the mail yet, I powered it on without a cpu installed.
> 
> Which, my board will NOT power up with, or without a cpu installed right now.
> 
> So, I think a bumped it a little to hard with the phillips head, and broke my main board.
> 
> Im thinking the mobo is bad, and it was just happen during all of the deliding, uninstalling, and reinstalling trial and error high temp mess.


That would explain a lot tbh. But at the same time all that heat on the CPU is a bit worrying.


----------



## 0ldChicken

@tps3443That does make everything more complicated, possibly having a mobo on the fritz. I don't really see how that would cause the cpu to overheat like it has been though.

Do you have a basic air cooler to try? And did you ever check to make sure every surface had a good spread of TIM? that will almost certainly tell you exactly what is wrong.

I know this sounds crazy, but also try swapping your ram around/try booting with only one stick in various slots, I've seen that fix almost any issue haha I don't think it'd help the heat issues, but maybe will get you booting again


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> @tps3443That does make everything more complicated, possibly having a mobo on the fritz. I don't really see how that would cause the cpu to overheat like it has been though.
> 
> Do you have a basic air cooler to try? And did you ever check to make sure every surface had a good spread of TIM? that will almost certainly tell you exactly what is wrong.
> 
> I know this sounds crazy, but also try swapping your ram around/try booting with only one stick in various slots, I've seen that fix almost any issue haha I don't think it'd help the heat issues, but maybe will get you booting again


Depends, if the bios has gone weird or it was on auto then it might be overvolting for whatever reason so meh?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Depends, if the bios has gone weird or it was on auto then it might be overvolting for whatever reason so meh?


Tru dat, the thought crossed my mind too but I shrugged it off as unlikely


----------



## tps3443

Are small tiny scratches ok on the die? They are very small. I think they occured during cleaning.

No fallout 4 shut down my system before I delided. It was a strange issue.

And I found out why my cpu was running hott. My back plate came out, and was wedged at a slight angle. The slight angle was pressing the lid ever so slightly. It caused poor contact.

I tested to CPU in another board. Its ALIVE!

I some how broke my "Gigabyte Ultra Fragile" though.

Its all good. I filed a warranty RMA ticket on it. And im getting it swapped out immediately

The z170 itx board is just totally DEAD! Everything works accept for it. I read a few reviews of my exact board failing and bricking at the 3-4 month mark. Several of them actually. There are 4 reviwers with my same issue.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Are small tiny scratches ok on the die? They are very small. I think they occured during cleaning.
> 
> No fallout 4 shut down my system before I delided. It was a strange issue.
> 
> And I found out why my cpu was running hott. My back plate came out, and was wedged at a slight angle. The slight angle was pressing the lid ever so slightly. It caused poor contact.
> 
> I tested to CPU in another board. Its ALIVE!
> 
> I some how broke my "Gigabyte Ultra Fragile" though.
> 
> Its all good. I filed a warranty RMA ticket on it. And im getting it swapped out immediately
> 
> The z170 itx board is just totally DEAD! Everything works accept for it. I read a few reviews of my exact board failing and bricking at the 3-4 month mark. Several of them actually. There are 4 reviwers with my same issue.


Glad you got it figured out but I'm sorry to hear about your board


----------



## Cakewalk_S

@Benjiw, you were right about my CPU cooler... I added a 2nd 140mm slim fan lastnight and the temp difference was amazing. Even with the fan spinning at like 30-40% I'm seeing a core temp reduction of 5C under max load... Pretty awesome really! Didn't think I'd get this much of a temp difference. The XT140 fan is pretty cool too. Not only looks good but the airflow in pull mode is really concentrated pulling straight through the blades. Most fans I've seen will tend to blow air out the edges of the blades in like a Y shape. Now it's more like a U than anything...

Here's my before/after pictures along with a shot of my case right now:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1596745/build-log-silverstone-ml07-i7-6700k-gtx970-ddr4-3600-asus-pro-gaming-itx/40#post_25528983


----------



## tps3443

After deliding it was just a strange phenomena that my closed loop back plate came out on reassembly. And the high temps were from incorrect mounting of my water block.

As for the motherboard, mine is revision 1.0, and there was a load of problems I went back on new egg and read a ton of reviews and I felt like the reviewers were talking about my computer over the past 3-4 months.

Gigabyte released rev 1.1 to fix there bad board. I'm just happy my CPU works, and I've been deprived these couple days now with no system! I need some more of that GTX1080 in my system. I just mailed the bad board back today.

Once I get my Liquid metal, and new board. I will report back with temps.

Should I go ahead and apply liquid metal to my TIM and allow it to cure, while waiting on my motherboard?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> After deliding it was just a strange phenomena that my closed loop back plate came out on reassembly. And the high temps were from incorrect mounting of my water block.
> 
> As for the motherboard, mine is revision 1.0, and there was a load of problems I went back on new egg and read a ton of reviews and I felt like the reviewers were talking about my computer over the past 3-4 months.
> 
> Gigabyte released rev 1.1 to fix there bad board. I'm just happy my CPU works, and I've been deprived these couple days now with no system! I need some more of that GTX1080 in my system. I just mailed the bad board back today.
> 
> Once I get my Liquid metal, and new board. I will report back with temps.
> 
> Should I go ahead and apply liquid metal to my TIM and allow it to cure, while waiting on my motherboard?


The liquid metal doesn't "cure" it stays in liquid form so I wouldn't apply it until you have everything ready.


----------



## v1ral

Has anyone tried direct die mount with the Apogee XL?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> After deliding it was just a strange phenomena that my closed loop back plate came out on reassembly. And the high temps were from incorrect mounting of my water block.
> 
> As for the motherboard, mine is revision 1.0, and there was a load of problems I went back on new egg and read a ton of reviews and I felt like the reviewers were talking about my computer over the past 3-4 months.
> 
> Gigabyte released rev 1.1 to fix there bad board. I'm just happy my CPU works, and I've been deprived these couple days now with no system! I need some more of that GTX1080 in my system. I just mailed the bad board back today.
> 
> Once I get my Liquid metal, and new board. I will report back with temps.
> 
> Should I go ahead and apply liquid metal to my TIM and allow it to cure, while waiting on my motherboard?


You need to stop over complicating things, Just wait for all your parts first then apply the TIM etc when need be. You need to look into that mounting system on the CLC because there's no point delidding if your cooler can't do it's job.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Are small tiny scratches ok on the die? They are very small. I think they occured during cleaning.
> 
> No fallout 4 shut down my system before I delided. It was a strange issue.
> 
> And I found out why my cpu was running hott. My back plate came out, and was wedged at a slight angle. The slight angle was pressing the lid ever so slightly. It caused poor contact.
> 
> I tested to CPU in another board. Its ALIVE!
> 
> I some how broke my "Gigabyte Ultra Fragile" though.
> 
> Its all good. I filed a warranty RMA ticket on it. And im getting it swapped out immediately
> 
> The z170 itx board is just totally DEAD! Everything works accept for it. I read a few reviews of my exact board failing and bricking at the 3-4 month mark. Several of them actually. There are 4 reviwers with my same issue.
> 
> 
> 
> Glad you got it figured out but I'm sorry to hear about your board
Click to expand...

I know they've had their issues (caused by another manufacturer's Incompetence...) but I stick with ASUS for good reason. I feel bad that his board failed, though I would say that a handful of fails falls within the 3-5% threshold. That being that the average fail rate is between 3-5% of any one technology offered from a manufacturer. That's acceptible in the industry. Sucks when it happens to you for sure.

My RoG board didn't brick, but it came with the heatsink issue which I fixed and a couple PWM headers crapped out later. Good thing they have their hotswap warranty. I was down for maybe a day after receiving the new board.









~Ceadder


----------



## tps3443

Ive been a PC enthusiast since 2003. Back when I was 13 years old, Athon XP socket A/462 overclocked to 2.4Ghz, this was the FX5200 AGP days, ATI 9800XT, and Geforce 6800 Ultra.

Wow, that really brings back memories.

Anyways, this is the first motherboard to ever fail on me of nearly 14 years of PC overclocking, and gaming lol.


----------



## tps3443

Gigabyte seems to be ok. But, i wish I would have swingged for that really nice Asus ROG mini itx board. It has a real built in sound card, and everything. It was around $250 though. And if I was going to put the extra $100 in a motherboard. I would rather pit the extra $100 in to getting a 67K instead of a 66K

Anyways, Kabylake is almost here. We should be seeing the 7700K in less than 90 days. Are you guys upgrading? Or waiting for cannonlake 10nm?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Gigabyte seems to be ok. But, i wish I would have swingged for that really nice Asus ROG mini itx board. It has a real built in sound card, and everything. It was around $250 though. And if I was going to put the extra $100 in a motherboard. I would rather pit the extra $100 in to getting a 67K instead of a 66K
> 
> Anyways, Kabylake is almost here. We should be seeing the 7700K in less than 90 days. Are you guys upgrading? Or waiting for cannonlake 10nm?


I've been stuck on that decision. I'm looking to upgrade, but I'm not sure if I should wait for the new chips.... Any speculations as of yet? I'm going to be doing an Mitx build, so I hope they introduce one in a timely manner with chip release.


----------



## v1ral

Anyone have experience with those delid guards? Are there any 3d print plans for it?


----------



## OperatorFoxX

So here is something interesting: To make sure I was giving the right information (which may not be entirely correct) I delidded a xeon processor to check if it were possible to delid by force rather than by heat. The interesting thing is, the xeon was insanely hard to delid compared to the Hasewell-E 5960x. Not only did the die break, but the pcb bent inwards as I pried it upwards, creating a crator on the back side: An image to show:

(Left Xeon, Right Haswell E


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







The facinating thing is, the surface area is smaller on the xeon than the Haswell. This could only mean one of two things, either Intel changed their solder compound or there was a defect in the soldering of my Haswell because the haswell came off like dried jelly, much unlike the xeon. Now I'm currious for the 6900k, I know der8auer managed to remove a 6950x by force, but I'm now thinking a more thought out approach is necessary.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> So here is something interesting: To make sure I was giving the right information (which may not be entirely correct) I delidded a xeon processor to check if it were possible to delid by force rather than by heat. The interesting thing is, the xeon was insanely hard to delid compared to the Hasewell-E 5960x. Not only did the die break, but the pcb bent inwards as I pried it upwards, creating a crator on the back side: An image to show:
> 
> (Left Xeon, Right Haswell E
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The facinating thing is, the surface area is smaller on the xeon than the Haswell. This could only mean one of two things, either Intel changed their solder compound or there was a defect in the soldering of my Haswell because the haswell came off like dried jelly, much unlike the xeon. Now I'm currious for the 6900k, I know der8auer managed to remove a 6950x by force, but I'm now thinking a more thought out approach is necessary.


That's a big DIE! I need that 5960X for my GTX1080. I'll trade you my delided 6600K 4.9Ghz for it! Plus $375 cash lol


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I've been stuck on that decision. I'm looking to upgrade, but I'm not sure if I should wait for the new chips.... Any speculations as of yet? I'm going to be doing an Mitx build, so I hope they introduce one in a timely manner with chip release.


As far as I know you can use Z170 motherboards. Although a feature or two will not be available using Kaby Lake, with the current 100 Series chip set. Nothing important though.

MSI already has Z270 boards built.

The 7700K will have a base clock speed of 4.2Ghz with a 4.5Ghz boost clock. And not that it matters to me, but its IGP can play 1080P on high graphics with 60 fps.

It can also send 5K through the onboard igp at 60hz through the motherboard display connections.

Intel is doing away with the tick tock annual life cycle. And there will be (3) NEW processors for each socket life cycle.

For example, Socket LGA1150 Z87/Z97

(1) 4770K Haswell 1150
(2) 4790K Devils Canyon 1150
(3) 5775C Broadwell 1150

This is (3)+ years out of a single motherboard. Fantastic!

The 3rd iterations of the 14nm manufacturing process will be the final, and most advance. And then a new socket.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> That's a big DIE! I need that 5960X for my GTX1080. I'll trade you my delided 6600K 4.9Ghz for it! Plus $375 cash lol


Lol, no you don't want that, that 5960x was mishandled and a few caps were broke off the pin side, so I used it for testing on delidding (although if I had another 5960x, I would delid it, as it wasn't hard at all to delid - PCB is solid, as long as you know where the resistor/caps are it's pretty strait forward) The indium looked good on the haswell and as I check the xeon solder vs the Haswel solder, they appear the same malleability. I'm currently stumped as to why the xeon took several times the force to delid than the haswell.


----------



## v1ral

Anyone have any experience with those Delid Guards? I want to have one 3D printed so I can some how mod my Apogee XL to accept Direct Die mounts if not then I'd have to bite the bullet and get an EK block.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Lol, no you don't want that, that 5960x was mishandled and a few caps were broke off the pin side, so I used it for testing on delidding (although if I had another 5960x, I would delid it, as it wasn't hard at all to delid - PCB is solid, as long as you know where the resistor/caps are it's pretty strait forward) The indium looked good on the haswell and as I check the xeon solder vs the Haswel solder, they appear the same malleability. I'm currently stumped as to why the xeon took several times the force to delid than the haswell.


So you killed both chips? Good work.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Anyone have any experience with those Delid Guards? I want to have one 3D printed so I can some how mod my Apogee XL to accept Direct Die mounts if not then I'd have to bite the bullet and get an EK block.


Delid guards need to be made very accurately to like something silly of 0.1mm tolerance under the die you can buy them premade from Aqua Computer. As for mounting the A XL then you're going to have to make your own custom mount kit and loads of measuring etc to make sure you apply perfect pressure on the die to make sure it runs.

I just bought the EK kit because it was simpler.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> So you killed both chips? Good work.


I killed one chip, intentionally, it's less than 10 dollars. The other was already damaged from moving.

This post you made does not help in the discovery of anything new, nor does it explain the dilemma of why one chip can be forcibly removed and the other can not. If you wish to make further snide comments, may I recommend to you to this forum, as it fits in there much better.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Lol, no you don't want that, that 5960x was mishandled and a few caps were broke off the pin side, so I used it for testing on delidding (although if I had another 5960x, I would delid it, as it wasn't hard at all to delid - PCB is solid, as long as you know where the resistor/caps are it's pretty strait forward) The indium looked good on the haswell and as I check the xeon solder vs the Haswel solder, they appear the same malleability. I'm currently stumped as to why the xeon took several times the force to delid than the haswell.


I think some TIMS are soldered on.

And the 5960X might still work, if not fix it. Solder the caps back on. It's a tiny area, so crazy glue and a solder pin works wonders for stuff like this.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I killed one chip, intentionally, it's less than 10 dollars. The other was already damaged from moving.
> 
> This post you made does not help in the discovery of anything new, nor does it explain the dilemma of why one chip can be forcibly removed and the other can not. If you wish to make further snide comments, may I recommend to you to this forum, as it fits in there much better.


It looks like Silicon Lottery is actually melting the solder to delid Broadwell-E:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silicon Lottery*


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I killed one chip, intentionally, it's less than 10 dollars. The other was already damaged from moving.
> 
> This post you made does not help in the discovery of anything new, nor does it explain the dilemma of why one chip can be forcibly removed and the other can not. If you wish to make further snide comments, may I recommend to you to this forum, as it fits in there much better.
> 
> 
> 
> It looks like Silicon Lottery is actually melting the solder to delid Broadwell-E:
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Silicon Lottery*
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Now that's how I'd be doing them!!

Trick is 60 seconds or less (likely less considering the die size and copper mass) heat that lid should be off with a simple pen torch. I've even used a cig lighter torch you get at the smoke shop


----------



## tps3443

So I assume when there are tiny scratches on a die, it's OK? Because when I delided my 6600K, there are tiny tiny scratches. It looks like film or a finish on the die, not nearly as bad as the pictures above though. Just a couple tiny scratches.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> So I assume when there are tiny scratches on a die, it's OK? Because when I delided my 6600K, there are tiny tiny scratches. It looks like film or a finish on the die, not nearly as bad as the pictures above though. Just a couple tiny scratches.


Yes, it should be fine. There is a good amount of thickness on top before you actually reach the actual CPU die.


----------



## tps3443

Will Liquid metal help my GTX1080 temps drastically? It's a FE model, so with overclocking it's tough to keep it under 80C, while maintaining a quiet fan.

If so, that would be AWESOME!

And is Liquid metal only used for TIM?

Or can i use it for TIM, and thermal gel for water block?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> So I assume when there are tiny scratches on a die, it's OK? Because when I delided my 6600K, there are tiny tiny scratches. It looks like film or a finish on the die, not nearly as bad as the pictures above though. Just a couple tiny scratches.


You can lap that up to 3000 grit and spit shine it with alcohol and tissue.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Will Liquid metal help my GTX1080 temps drastically? It's a FE model, so with overclocking it's tough to keep it under 80C, while maintaining a quiet fan.
> 
> If so, that would be AWESOME!
> 
> And is Liquid metal only used for TIM?
> 
> Or can i use it for TIM, and thermal gel for water block?


Liquid metal creates a permanent bond.You would use it by it'self. Not sure how drastic it would be, but probably shave off a couple deg.

I've always used nano diamond pastes.


----------



## [email protected]

Hello guys,

I delidded my cpu (4790k) one year ago but two days ago it started to overheat. I checked the TIM, install everything again but no luck. I'm using Phobya Liquid Metal, Noctua NT-H1 and H00i v2. What is the problem, any guess?


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *[email protected]*
> 
> Hello guys,
> 
> I delidded my cpu (4790k) one year ago but two days ago it started to overheat. I checked the TIM, install everything again but no luck. I'm using Phobya Liquid Metal, Noctua NT-H1 and H00i v2. What is the problem, any guess?


Pump on the H100i going out?


----------



## [email protected]

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> Pump on the H100i going out?


I was thinking to same that's why i bought H100i v2 yesterday, before i was using H105 and send to RMA. I think something wrong with the CPU, should i re-apply the Liquid Metal?


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Will Liquid metal help my GTX1080 temps drastically? It's a FE model, so with overclocking it's tough to keep it under 80C, while maintaining a quiet fan.
> 
> If so, that would be AWESOME!
> 
> And is Liquid metal only used for TIM?
> 
> Or can i use it for TIM, and thermal gel for water block?


Use Phobya Nano grease, you'll receive the same temps as Thermal Grizzley's liquid metal.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> It looks like Silicon Lottery is actually melting the solder to delid Broadwell-E:


Well, I'm thinking of using der8auer's vice method. In theory, it should pop off like the haswell e, but just in case intel's stringency on solder purity isn't the greatest, I'd like to reduce risk of deforming the PCB.
Good post though, It's nice to know where the caps are on those.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I killed one chip, intentionally, it's less than 10 dollars. The other was already damaged from moving.
> 
> This post you made does not help in the discovery of anything new, nor does it explain the dilemma of why one chip can be forcibly removed and the other can not. If you wish to make further snide comments, may I recommend to you to this forum, as it fits in there much better.


I gave you plenty of info before but you refused to... Yield was it? I also showed you how to delid the E chips with a tool made by De8aur who knows better than you and I put together but you still used force to kill a chip you could of easily delidded with heat I even showed you how to delid the xeon chip with an iron but nope, you knew better.

People use heat because it's better than ripping the die clean off the pcb like you showed us so well in your... experiments.

As for snide comments, well, there wasn't any, I just congratulated you on a job well done.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Well, I'm thinking of using der8auer's vice method. In theory, it should pop off like the haswell e, but just in case intel's stringency on solder purity isn't the greatest, I'd like to reduce risk of deforming the PCB.
> Good post though, It's nice to know where the caps are on those.


his method is a tool which holds the lid and PCB in place then applies force to the side like a vice but all the energy is concentrated due to the tools construction holding those items firmly in place.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Use Phobya Nano grease, you'll receive the same temps as Thermal Grizzley's liquid metal.


Bad advice, 99% of thermal pastes dont last on the die.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Bad advice, 99% of thermal pastes dont last on the die.


Well seeing as that this paste is what I used on my 980ti, which produced more heat than my CPU for a better part of a year and performed at the same temps as the liquid metal I put on it, I would say it is sound advice. (In case you don't want to take my word for it, watch 



) But I'm sure you have evidence as to why this particular paste I recommended shouldn't be used. Care to share?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> his method is a tool which holds the lid and PCB in place then applies force to the side like a vice but all the energy is concentrated due to the tools construction holding those items firmly in place.


Yes, I have been following him for quite some time now. I also knew about shrimp's desolder methods (although, I admit I did not know the effectiveness of it, as I threw out the idea as soon as I saw the video, as I don't wish to subject the die to that kind of heat if there is another way - as demonstrated by der8auer. Also, there isn't a whole lot of data to determine how effective desoldering is as far as degradation, although, perhaps with some time I shall explore this as well with cheaper cpus). My original question was simply to know if there were a thermal pad that did not degrade into dust, but seeing as there is the same superstitions about delidding soldered cpus that were this thread: OCDrift Delid 5960x (this thread is perpetuated by a lie from ocdrift that was encouraged by superstitions that deliding a cpu would break the die, which I have already proved, as well as Der8auer, is also not completely true) I wish to permanently debunk these myths.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> As for snide comments, well, there wasn't any, I just congratulated you on a job well done.


Uhuh, well, let's keep the feedback restricted to positive criticism from now on, shall we?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Well seeing as that this paste is what I used on my 980ti, which produced more heat than my CPU for a better part of a year and performed at the same temps as the liquid metal I put on it, I would say it is sound advice. (In case you don't want to take my word for it, watch
> 
> 
> 
> ) But I'm sure you have evidence as to why this particular paste I recommended shouldn't be used. Care to share?
> Yes, I have been following him for quite some time now. I also knew about shrimp's desolder methods (although, I admit I did not know the effectiveness of it, as I threw out the idea as soon as I saw the video, as I don't wish to subject the die to that kind of heat if there is another way - as demonstrated by der8auer. Also, there isn't a whole lot of data to determine how effective desoldering is as far as degradation, although, perhaps with some time I shall explore this as well with cheaper cpus). My original question was simply to know if there were a thermal pad that did not degrade into dust, but seeing as there is the same superstitions about delidding soldered cpus that were this thread: OCDrift Delid 5960x (this thread is perpetuated by a lie from ocdrift that was encouraged by superstitions that deliding a cpu would break the die, which I have already proved, as well as Der8auer, is also not completely true) I wish to permanently debunk these myths.
> Uhuh, well, let's keep the feedback restricted to positive criticism from now on, shall we?


1. You have absolutely no validity to your statement. I do and so does everyone in this thread whose tried a paste on the die.

2. The mounting pressure between a gpu and cpu are vastly different, and no your gpu does not produce more heat per mm then your cpu does. Try again though, 28nm vs 14nm probably isnt a good argument for you.

3. Ive tried various pastes on bare die and all had identical temps to liquid metal, expect the temps rose up after a week.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 1. You have absolutely no validity to your statement. I do and so does everyone in this thread whose tried a paste on the die.


True, that's why I included a link to someone else who has more weight in what they said.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 2. The mounting pressure between a gpu and cpu are vastly different, and no your gpu does not produce more heat per mm then your cpu does. Try again though, 28nm vs 14nm probably isnt a good argument for you.


You assume that 100% cpu load is being used, when in fact more wattage (potential heat) is used by the GPU for the average daily user. (I.E. One who plays games or surfs the web, not doing video editing or encrypting)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 3. Ive tried various pastes on bare die and all had identical temps to liquid metal, expect the temps rose up after a week.


You realize this is just as invalid as what you posted about my statement. The only difference is, I gave the exact brand and model name of what I used and a reference to it actually being done by someone who a lot of people respect, rather than an arbitrary example with vague references to others. I do not doubt that you have had a bad experience with thermal compounds on dies, but perhaps listing the compounds you used with the results would be beneficiary to others, as they can decide for themselves what is good and what is not.

As for myself, Phyobia nanogrease produced a idle of 23C in a 21~23C room and a load of 43C (frostbyte 3 bench) with a burn of 47C (after 4 hours). The grease lasted until I sold the card. Liquid metal performed at 23C at idle and 44C at load (include a margin of error here for ambient temps).


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> True, that's why I included a link to someone else who has more weight in what they said.
> You assume that 100% cpu load is being used, when in fact more wattage (potential heat) is used by the GPU for the average daily user. (I.E. One who plays games or surfs the web, not doing video editing or encrypting)
> You realize this is just as invalid as what you posted about my statement. The only difference is, I gave the exact brand and model name of what I used and a reference to it actually being done by someone who a lot of people respect, rather than an arbitrary example with vague references to others. I do not doubt that you have had a bad experience with thermal compounds on dies, but perhaps listing the compounds you used with the results would be beneficiary to others, as they can decide for themselves what is good and what is not.
> 
> As for myself, Phyobia nanogrease produced a idle of 23C in a 21~23C room and a load of 43C (frostbyte 3 bench) with a burn of 47C (after 4 hours). The grease lasted until I sold the card. Liquid metal performed at 23C at idle and 44C at load (include a margin of error here for ambient temps).


Heres where you lost my respect. You think jayztwocents is someone who holds weight haha. We'll leave it at that.

And again, gaming will EASILY get your temps as hot as doing a burn test. Mine has on multiple occasions very easily. And again your comparing a 28nm process to one from 14-22nm. Smaller die, more concentrated heat, more pressure, more reason for a paste to pump out.

Jayztwocents tests something ONCE, he doesnt test over a period of months which is what i did before even considering posting my findings. Which btw coincide with absolutely EVERYONE who delids and runs bare die.

Now stop being an idiot and realize that this is a delid thread and not a gpu thread. Gpu dies and cpu dies vary GREATLY.


----------



## Ceadderman

Cmon guys let's get off this track shall we? Someone is bound to get hurt when a mod train hits em.









~Ceadder


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Heres where you lost my respect. You think jayztwocents is someone who holds weight haha. We'll leave it at that.


So, are you are calling everyone who follows jayztwocents ignorant and are also claiming you have more authority than he does? I'm just curious
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And again, gaming will EASILY get your temps as hot as doing a burn test. Mine has on multiple occasions very easily. And again your comparing a 28nm process to one from 14-22nm. Smaller die, more concentrated heat, more pressure, more reason for a paste to pump out.


True, there is a difference in die sizes and concentrated heat but again, do you or anyone else here have numbers to back up your claim that this does INDEED affect a thermal compound's life on a 1080 GPU?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Jayztwocents tests something ONCE, he doesnt test over a period of months which is what i did before even considering posting my findings. Which btw coincide with absolutely EVERYONE who delids and runs bare die.


Probably, but I don't think he'd stay in business if he sold watercooling systems that failed after a week of use, as you claim.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Now stop being an idiot and realize that this is a delid thread and not a gpu thread. Gpu dies and cpu dies vary GREATLY.


The question was:
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Will Liquid metal help my GTX1080 temps drastically? It's a FE model, so with overclocking it's tough to keep it under 80C, while maintaining a quiet fan.


Also, let's try not to resort to name calling. That's petty and childish, we're not in a presidential election here


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> So, are you are calling everyone who follows jayztwocents ignorant and are also claiming you have more authority than he does? I'm just curious
> True, there is a difference in die sizes and concentrated heat but again, do you or anyone else here have numbers to back up your claim that this does INDEED affect a thermal compound's life on a 1080 GPU?
> Probably, but I don't think he'd stay in business if he sold watercooling systems that failed after a week of use, as you claim.
> The question was:
> Also, let's try not to resort to name calling. That's petty and childish, we're not in a presidential election here


Liquid metal in almost all cases ive tested the temps are IDENTICAL. the 38 to 12w/mk rating you see is insignificant, why? We don't measure CPU/GPU temps in Kelvin. If they matter so much, Conductonaut with a rating of 76w/mK or wtv would CRUSH CLU and it doesnt, temps are, again, IDENTICAL.

The reason to use any LM is DURABILITY. On a die its been tested over and over that it does not last and from the pressure of the waterblock or the IHS it will pump out in a matter of days to a couple weeks. You don't need to watch jayz videos to understand that, this thread is full of it. Including someone a week ago i told not to use Noctua paste on bare die as it doesnt last.

You know what happened? He came back 2 days later and said i was right.

Jayz videos might be his source of income but he doesnt sell the stuff, its not a business. Thats like saying linus knows his stuff as well.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> So, are you are calling everyone who follows jayztwocents ignorant and are also claiming you have more authority than he does? I'm just curious


I have called out Jayztwocentz on multiple issues. He's not that smart he simply has expensive video equipment and a following (that being said he does have good information for the most part, not a bad guy just not really an expert). I have used MX-4 on a GPU for over 4 years without issue. It pumps out on direct die in less than a week. So regardless of heat it is clear the CPU needs liquid metal or a very very good paste that is designed for high pressure and minimal contact. As I had mentioned a week or so ago in a previous post it may have something to do with the gap being reduced to literally nothing on a delidded cpu (IHS directly contacts die).


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I will note Jaztwocents and Linus crew can be looked at like the speedrunners of the process. They are in it already assuming there will be something new tomorrow. Their time scale is completely different with most things. This comment of mine is very general.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmfree88*
> 
> I have called out Jayztwocentz on multiple issues.


Well, seeing as I used j2c to make a point that you have just enforced, and that is that you can indeed use thermal grease for GPUs. I think it no longer matters how authoritative j2c is for this matter.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> Well, seeing as I used j2c to make a point that you have just enforced, and that is that you can indeed use thermal grease for GPUs. I think it no longer matters how authoritative j2c is for this matter.


I dont get why youre so repetitive, no one has ever said you couldn't use TIM on a gpu. The difference between TIM and LM is minute when used correctly. The problem here is pump out, which gpus DONT have but CPUs do. Youre also forgetting that a cpu is 2+ cores while a gpu is a SINGLE core.

People think that the temperature measurement you see is an actual temperature. Thats just core temps, the actual DIE could be much much hotter.


----------



## OperatorFoxX

I said to use phyobia grease on his 1080, you said that was a bad idea, now you are making zero sense but if the issue is solved, lets let it be


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I said to use phyobia grease on his 1080, you said that was a bad idea, now you are making zero sense but if the issue is solved, lets let it be


No you actually said its ok to use phobya grease on bare die on a cpu not gpu. Whatever his question was you at some point said nano grease is ok to use on a cpu and thats just not the case.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OperatorFoxX*
> 
> I said to use phyobia grease on his 1080, you said that was a bad idea, now you are making zero sense but if the issue is solved, lets let it be


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> No you actually said its ok to use phobya grease on bare die on a cpu not gpu. Whatever his question was you at some point said nano grease is ok to use on a cpu and thats just not the case.


We need to move beyond this topic. This conversation is over. Move on


----------



## tps3443

I'm about to get this system back together, I Silicond the lid back, and used Liquid metal for my TIM. That stuff is hard to spread! Big daddy snoozing in the bed with all this down time. I just bought another CHEAP Z170 motherboard lol I was to impatient. I'll sell the gigabyte itx when it gets back.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I forgot I bought .5mm thermal tape for my lid to re lid


----------



## fleetfeather

Soon™


----------



## ShrimpBrime

You guys are getting me to want that de-lid on the 4690K.....

Need figures. Who's getting what increases and temp drops on X cooling?!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> You guys are getting me to want that de-lid on the 4690K.....
> 
> Need figures. Who's getting what increases and temp drops on X cooling?!


Check out that google-docs spreadsheet in the first post. It has a tab for "devil's canyon" where you'll find what results people with 4690k reported.


----------



## marik123

Is there any way to relid the processor after delid?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> You guys are getting me to want that de-lid on the 4690K.....
> 
> Need figures. Who's getting what increases and temp drops on X cooling?!
> 
> 
> 
> Check out that google-docs spreadsheet in the first post. It has a tab for "devil's canyon" where you'll find what results people with 4690k reported.
Click to expand...

OK thanks!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *marik123*
> 
> Is there any way to relid the processor after delid?


Yes. Most people without soldered chips de-lid to replace the stock TIM and re-lid it with better. You can use something like permatex ultra black silicon and glue the plate back on.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> OK thanks!
> Yes. Most people without soldered chips de-lid to replace the stock TIM and re-lid it with better. You can use something like permatex ultra black silicon and glue the plate back on.


Actually MOST people don't glue it back on. I hate repeating myself but unfortunately i have to. The issue is not and has not been the TIM. The issue is the gap the silicone creates between the die and IHS. You want zero gap and i mean 0.0000000 not 0.06.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> OK thanks!
> Yes. Most people without soldered chips de-lid to replace the stock TIM and re-lid it with better. You can use something like permatex ultra black silicon and glue the plate back on.
> 
> 
> 
> Actually MOST people don't glue it back on. I hate repeating myself but unfortunately i have to. The issue is not and has not been the TIM. The issue is the gap the silicone creates between the die and IHS. You want zero gap and i mean 0.0000000 not 0.06.
Click to expand...

TIM creates a gap. It's impossible to come up with such a silly figure.

So you don't have to repeat yourself, you don't have to read, quote and reply to anything I have mentioned.

To rephrase my statement, ....... I've glued them back on. Nothing but better temps through the years. Both AMD and Intel, generally I suggest running naked over a re-use of an IHS plate. But since it complicates things, it get's re-used.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> TIM creates a gap. It's impossible to come up with such a silly figure.
> 
> So you don't have to repeat yourself, you don't have to read, quote and reply to anything I have mentioned.
> 
> To rephrase my statement, ....... I've glued them back on. Nothing but better temps through the years. Both AMD and Intel, generally I suggest running naked over a re-use of an IHS plate. But since it complicates things, it get's re-used.


I'm sorry but thats a joke right hahaha. You really think a PASTE is going to create a gap? Are you high? The whole point of the thermal paste is to get rid of the air between the IHS/DIE and/or cooling solution/IHS/DIE.

You don't want a gap, AT ALL. The thermal conductivity of copper is 300-400 w/mK, show me a thermal paste that gets near that then the gap won't matter. You want it to be copper against copper as much as possible you dont want a gap any gap. The thermal paste is there to MICROSCOPICALLY fill in the gap thats between the IHS and DIE because of manufacturing tolerance. Air is the worst thermal conductor around hence why the paste is needed.

It is absolutely idiotic to think that thermal paste creates a gap.


----------



## Arctucas

I believe that bluej511 is correct; the sealant is what causes the gap.

However, expectation of perfect contact with the die is unrealistic. If perfect contact were possible, there would be no need for TIM.

@tsp3443,

I am not trying to be overly critical, but it appears to me you used a bit too much sealant. When I put the IHS back on my 6700K, I used a toothpick to apply a tiny, pinhead sized dot of black PermaTex to each corner of the IHS.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> I believe that bluej511 is correct; the sealant is what causes the gap.
> 
> However, expectation of perfect contact with the die is unrealistic. If perfect contact were possible, there would be no need for TIM.
> 
> @tsp3443,
> 
> I am not trying to be overly critical, but it appears to me you used a bit too much sealant. When I put the IHS back on my 6700K, I used a toothpick to apply a tiny, pinhead sized dot of black PermaTex to each corner of the IHS.


THANK YOU lol. I wouldnt say it if it wasn't true. Intel TIM is already getting a bad rep from all the idiots who think its a crappy TIM, when in fact its actually very good.

Its why people who lap the IHS/heatsink get WAY better temps then just changing the thermal paste. The more copper to copper contact you have the better temps youll have. TIM is as he said, a filler nothing else. If it causes a gap, you have a problem.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> THANK YOU lol. I wouldnt say it if it wasn't true. Intel TIM is already getting a bad rep from all the idiots who think its a crappy TIM, when in fact its actually very good.
> 
> Its why people who lap the IHS/heatsink get WAY better temps then just changing the thermal paste. The more copper to copper contact you have the better temps youll have. TIM is as he said, a filler nothing else. If it causes a gap, you have a problem.


I have posted this here at least a dozen times...back from 2012: https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/delidded-my-i7-3770k-loaded-temperatures-drop-by-20%C2%B0c-at-4-7ghz.2261855/page-23#post-34053183

Great post/proof that the drastic reduction in temps are entirely from removing the gap caused by the glue...Adding liquid metal thermal material further improves performance.

It also shows that the Intel TIM actually performed better than the Noctua.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> I have posted this here at least a dozen times...back from 2012: https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/delidded-my-i7-3770k-loaded-temperatures-drop-by-20%C2%B0c-at-4-7ghz.2261855/page-23#post-34053183
> 
> Great post/proof that the drastic reduction in temps are entirely from removing the gap caused by the glue...Adding liquid metal thermal material further improves performance.
> 
> It also shows that the Intel TIM actually performed better than the Noctua.


+rep for being correct.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

I did a couple of de-lids for Funsoul whom recently put together a LN2 party. He had returned the processors so I could glue the plates back on because without the glue he was habing trouble keeping the IHS plate in one spot while he put his cooling aperatus on. I did not hear of any complaints re-glueing that plate on.

If TIM is between the die and IHS plate. Then it takes up space. So that 0.0000000 figure used is incorrect and false information.

Again, those of you re-using that plate can glue it or not, but perhaps lap the bottom side so it would creat less gap as discussed. Then perhaps the glue wont hold the plate up?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> I did a couple of de-lids for Funsoul whom recently put together a LN2 party. He had returned the processors so I could glue the plates back on because without the glue he was habing trouble keeping the IHS plate in one spot while he put his cooling aperatus on. I did not hear of any complaints re-glueing that plate on.
> 
> If TIM is between the die and IHS plate. Then it takes up space. So that 0.0000000 figure used is incorrect and false information.
> 
> Again, those of you re-using that plate can glue it or not, but perhaps lap the bottom side so it would creat less gap as discussed. Then perhaps the glue wont hold the plate up?


Idc who you delided for it doesnt matter to me. Yes ln2 guys prefer it glued it makes life a lot easier.

You do understand that the whole point of the TIM is to FILL in the gap right? No cause a gap. The layer of TIM between the IHS and die is MICROSCOPIC. You dont want a .04 gap, hell you don't even want a .01 gap. You want NOTHING in between the die and IHS. In a perfect world youd use no TIM at all and have the die contact the IHS nickel plating bare to bare


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Actually MOST people don't glue it back on. I hate repeating myself but unfortunately i have to. The issue is not and has not been the TIM. The issue is the gap the silicone creates between the die and IHS. You want zero gap and i mean 0.0000000 not 0.06.


Blue in a few cases gluing the IHS back on with Skylake chips is fine because if the IHS moves on those it can damage the die. It also strengthens the PCB on them too. The gap created by the factory is bigger than that created by self sealed chips.

Shrimp knows his stuff so don't discount everything he is saying. When he said most people, I think he meant most people who glue the IHS back on use X. You need to relax a bit you go a bit mental in this thread and you'll end up in trouble.


----------



## tps3443

I put about a small raindrop sized amount of Liquid metal on my die.

I tried my best to spread it, but it's very difficult. So I did my best and put the lid back on, and used clear 100% silicon to put my lid back on. I let it sit overnight.

I'm about to run it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> I put about a small raindrop sized amount of Liquid metal on my die.
> 
> I tried my best to spread it, but it's very difficult. So I did my best and put the lid back on, and used clear 100% silicon to put my lid back on. I let it sit overnight.
> 
> I'm about to run it.


How big was the rain drop, it should be painted on like this with the little brush that comes with it or it will bead up and not work correctly. You also used bathroom sealent by the looks of it, if that hasn't expanded to lift the IHS off the die then I don't know what else to think. Did you put something on the IHS to weigh it down? And did you apply it with a hot dog?


----------



## Arctucas

@tps3443,

Benjiw brings up a good point, did you apply pressure to the IHS while the sealant was curing?

If not, from looking at the amount of sealant on your PCB, your IHS may not be making good contact with the die.

I used the Rockit 88 kit when I did my 6700k. Yes, it costs close to $40 for the complete kit, but it is pretty much fool-proof to de-lid and re-lid your processor.


----------



## tps3443

There was just silicone on my hands and it was messy. It looks like this.


----------



## tps3443

No matter what I used, it's still 100% silicone. I applied pressure for 10 hours. I laid a 15x15 ceramic tile on the IHS. It weighed about 6lbs. The bottom portion of the CPU was sitting in the hole cut out in the i5 retail box. So it didn't crush the caps underneath. It sealed it even, and TIM was spread evenly.


----------



## Arctucas

Those pics look considerably better than the first ones you posted.

Sounds like you did it right.

Now, let us see some overclocking/temperature results...


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> There was just silicone on my hands and it was messy. It looks like this.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


WTH is up with the copper ring around the CPU IHS? And why did you marker the IHS? OMG the scratches? What gives? dood... did you run that thing through the dish washer or something?


----------



## Arctucas

Looks to me like it was lapped.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> WTH is up with the copper ring around the CPU IHS? And why did you marker the IHS? OMG the scratches? What gives? dood... did you run that thing through the dish washer or something?


I wet sanded it, and tried to get a mirror finish. It is very smooth! Much better than factory. Any scratches you see are tiny, and you cannot feel them.

It works! And that's all that matters, who cares how pretty it is! When I get home I will post results.

And I marker everything, even my gtx1080 in the pics above has tps3443 in a inconspicuous area. For picture purposes only.

This was my first time deliding, I did not break the CPU. So, I'm good with that!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> I wet sanded it, and tried to get a mirror finish. It is very smooth! Much better than factory. Any scratches you see are tiny, and you cannot feel them.
> 
> It works! And that's all that matters, who cares how pretty it is! When I get home I will post results.


The idea of lapping the IHS it to make sure the entire surface is perfectly flat, it looks like you haven't completed the process fully as we can only see copper to the outside where the IHS was raised.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The idea of lapping the IHS it to make sure the entire surface is perfectly flat, it looks like you haven't completed the process fully as we can only see copper to the outside where the IHS was raised.


It's just a bit hard to do, sanding something without doing a little more to the edges than to the middle area.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> It's just a bit hard to do, sanding something without doing a little more to the edges than to the middle area.


Paper taped down or better yet, Art supplies shop spray mount onto a flat piece of glass and you'll be hard pressed not to get it as close if not perfectly flat. The middle is still nickel plated in his pic and is barely being touched due to the sides still being too high.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> WTH is up with the copper ring around the CPU IHS? And why did you marker the IHS? OMG the scratches? What gives? dood... did you run that thing through the dish washer or something?
> 
> 
> 
> I wet sanded it, and tried to get a mirror finish. It is very smooth! Much better than factory. Any scratches you see are tiny, and you cannot feel them.
> 
> It works! And that's all that matters, who cares how pretty it is! When I get home I will post results.
> 
> And I marker everything, even my gtx1080 in the pics above has tps3443 in a inconspicuous area. For picture purposes only.
> 
> This was my first time deliding, I did not break the CPU. So, I'm good with that!
Click to expand...

This is a properly lapped CPU IHS...


Even if its lapped, it shouldn't have visible scratches in it.. if it does either your sandpaper was dirty or the sandpaper is too coarse... 2000 grit minimum, polish compound if you have it and a cotton buffing wheel...

When you finish it, it should look like this:


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> This is a properly lapped CPU IHS...
> 
> 
> Even if its lapped, it shouldn't have visible scratches in it.. if it does either your sandpaper was dirty or the sandpaper is too coarse... 2000 grit minimum, polish compound if you have it and a cotton buffing wheel...
> 
> When you finish it, it should look like this:


^THIS^

Also, use the 'razor blade check' for flatness.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> This is a properly lapped CPU IHS...
> 
> 
> 
> ^THIS^
> 
> Also, use the 'razor blade check' for flatness.
Click to expand...

No don't! You'll create scratches in the copper...copper is a very soft metal and a razer blade is an extremely hard metal...bad idea. If you lapp it on glass, you know its flat... Hold it like a gold coin with cotton gloves after you lapp it perfectly... I used a regular cotton buffing wheel from McMaster-Carr and polishing compound....


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> No don't! You'll create scratches in the copper...copper is a very soft metal and a razer blade is an extremely hard metal...bad idea. If you lapp it on glass, you know its flat... Hold it like a gold coin with cotton gloves after you lapp it perfectly... I used a regular cotton buffing wheel from McMaster-Carr and polishing compound....


He means using a straight edge to check how flat it is, we do it when checking for warped cylinder heads on motorcycles etc.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> This is a properly lapped CPU IHS...
> 
> 
> Even if its lapped, it shouldn't have visible scratches in it.. if it does either your sandpaper was dirty or the sandpaper is too coarse... 2000 grit minimum, polish compound if you have it and a cotton buffing wheel...
> 
> When you finish it, it should look like this:


^THIS^

I never lapped a processor, but I have done several heatsinks.

I taped a full sheet of sandpaper to a glass table, starting with 400 grit, then 800, 2000, and finally 4000.

Using light pressure (for heatsinks, the weight if the heatsink itself) figure 8 strokes, rotating the piece 1/4 turn every 10 strokes.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> No don't! You'll create scratches in the copper...copper is a very soft metal and a razer blade is an extremely hard metal...bad idea. If you lapp it on glass, you know its flat... Hold it like a gold coin with cotton gloves after you lapp it perfectly... I used a regular cotton buffing wheel from McMaster-Carr and polishing compound....


See Benjiw's comment.

I guess the 'razor blade' is old school...


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> The idea of lapping the IHS it to make sure the entire surface is perfectly flat, it looks like you haven't completed the process fully as we can only see copper to the outside where the IHS was raised.


I did my best with what I had. I do not think there is copper in the center. Or it's very deep! It only shows on the edges, which is more prone to show through easier.

I was going to go 1500 grit, then, 2400 grit, and then 3,000.

But, after buying a replacment motherboard, Liquid metal, etc. Etc. I just couldn't put any more money in this 6600k.

Plus, it's really smooth. It feels like glass!

I want to insure, good contact of the TIM just to be sure, I'm doing it correctly. So, I'm deliding it again.



I used the correct black silicone this timetime!

I'm getting better at this deliding. I've taken the lid off like 3 times now. It's perfect now!

I will delid every CPU I get now, every generation


----------



## Ceadderman

You don't use compound when lapping cooling plates or IHS.

Use 1500, 2000 and 2500 paper and make sure to run the back of the paper over a straight edge like a countertop or tabletop.

Put a pane of glass under your paper too so it ensures a flat lapping surface.

Rubbing compound of any sort is unecessary. Just run 10 to 20 passes per rotation starting with an area marked for navigational purposes. Once you get back to your starting location change to the next grit and so on. You don't have to change the paper much but I suggest changing out as you feel about the look of the paper. I don't sweat changing them unless there is a lot of gummed up surface area. There shouldn't be if you ran the paper diagonally across the surface of your straight edge. It breaks up the grit so that there is less filings collecting on the paper.









~Ceadder


----------



## ShrimpBrime

All you need is a little water. "Wet" sanding paper







Super mirror finish at 2000 grit!


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> [...]


I'm scared that you are using too much liquid metal on the die in the photo you are sharing.

When I had put on CLU on my CPU die, it started out as just a tiny bubble and then I pulled on the edges of that bubble forever until I had the whole die covered. It didn't want to spread and working on it for a long time until you have everything covered is perhaps normal, and is not a sign that there's not enough liquid metal being used.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> All you need is a little water. "Wet" sanding paper
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Super mirror finish at 2000 grit!


Yeah um no. You can do that but it makes a heckuva mess. It's a touch more expensive for three grits, but the roughest grit removes the coating down to the chrome plate and the next grit takes it down to the copper. You get your mirror finish as a result.

I would post pics but am on my Android and at the mercy of mobile tech atm.

~Ceadder


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Oh I do the 3000 grits dry but only go this high on bare naked Die. If just lapping the IHS without removal, up to 2000 is plenty.

Can admit it is a little messy.

BUT

using the water, you wipe the paper clean and it doesn't get clogged with copper.

So this is actually not copper clogging the paper here. That is solder. Because I was lapping the naked die, I did these dry.



This is i5 3570K. No lapping. Just replaced the TIM job. This is stock Intel paste. It's hardened and not so pasty like. Not sure why people think the Intel paste is all that good......


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Oh I do the 3000 grits dry but only go this high on bare naked Die. If just lapping the IHS without removal, up to 2000 is plenty.
> 
> Can admit it is a little messy.
> 
> BUT
> 
> using the water, you wipe the paper clean and it doesn't get clogged with copper.
> 
> So this is actually not copper clogging the paper here. That is solder. Because I was lapping the naked die, I did these dry.
> 
> 
> 
> This is i5 3570K. No lapping. Just replaced the TIM job. This is stock Intel paste. It's hardened and not so pasty like. Not sure why people think the Intel paste is all that good......


No offense but not sure why you continue to discount a thread thats been posted a million times in this thread.

I think you just dislike Intel or the people in this thread. Its really starting to get on my nerves. First of all Intel TIM is far better then other TIMS WHEN ITS NOT DELIDED. Why? Because it actually keeps identical temps over a period of time while other ones clearly do not.

Its the whole point of intel paste not to be pasty, its why it doesnt pump out ever like other pastes do within a day or two.


----------



## doabackflip

So this is my experience with Delidding.

I used the razor method to try save some $$, but after that experience I would rather spend the $40 and save myself stress and near heart attack that comes with taking a razor to a CPU. I also nicked the PCB, not a lot but theres a clear indent that you can see - This caused issue with running ram in Dual Channel, so I swapped out my 4x4gb and moved to 2x8gb and it works a treat.

I also used Deep Cool Z5 between the die and IHS. This pumped out after around a day or 2 and wasn't too good to start with. I'm now using Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra, also between the IHS and Artic Kuhler

The results? Please keep in mind I'm still fine tuning. I can boot into windows at 5ghz / 1.3v but BSOD straight away all the way up to 1.5v

Before:









After


----------



## maynard14

guys, quick question, im planing to replace my clp paste on my delided 4790k and put some fresh clp on the die, my question is, is clp on the tube expires? i have this clp for about 3 years now! i dont know if this paste ever expires,, if ever it expires on the sealed tubing i will replace it temporary with a thermal grizzly kryonaut


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *deepor*
> 
> I'm scared that you are using too much liquid metal on the die in the photo you are sharing.
> 
> When I had put on CLU on my CPU die, it started out as just a tiny bubble and then I pulled on the edges of that bubble forever until I had the whole die covered. It didn't want to spread and working on it for a long time until you have everything covered is perhaps normal, and is not a sign that there's not enough liquid metal being used.


I was worried about that too. It actually came in the mail, in a real syringe. But. I sucked the excess back up. First time I've used it so I didn't realize how far it goes.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maynard14*
> 
> guys, quick question, im planing to replace my clp paste on my delided 4790k and put some fresh clp on the die, my question is, is clp on the tube expires? i have this clp for about 3 years now! i dont know if this paste ever expires,, if ever it expires on the sealed tubing i will replace it temporary with a thermal grizzly kryonaut


There shouldn't be any issues. Give it a try and if it's dried out replace it


----------



## maynard14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> There shouldn't be any issues. Give it a try and if it's dried out replace it


thanks bro, will try later im still at work,,







thanks again


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> No offense but not sure why you continue to discount a thread thats been posted a million times in this thread.
> 
> I think you just dislike Intel or the people in this thread. Its really starting to get on my nerves. First of all Intel TIM is far better then other TIMS WHEN ITS NOT DELIDED. Why? Because it actually keeps identical temps over a period of time while other ones clearly do not.
> 
> Its the whole point of intel paste not to be pasty, its why it doesnt pump out ever like other pastes do within a day or two.


Your post is pretty backhanded. Not sure towards me or whatever...... but none the less.

I like Intel fine!! Have had many Intel rigs throughout the years. Even run one daily. So not sure where you came up with that type of response??

About the Intel TIM. _____________________

It is designed and manufactured to run a processor at a stock speed.

Some Thermal Interface Material is designed to be set and cured with heat. I will admit I know nothing about the properties of the paste under the plate.

However your statement is like saying..... The thermal paste in the packet that came with the cooler is good stuff..... but most overclockers replace this paste with something "better" such as liquid metal, perhaps AS5 and so forth.

My picture above^^ You don't see the air pockets from that Intel stock paste? You can plainly see how the paste was applied. Poorly.

I am not a fan of re-use of IHS plates. It slows thermal conductivity down greatly. You have paste on the bottom and the top of the plate. But with Intel chips, the retention bracket on the board must be removed. So I've done most de-lids on AMD and put the waterblock directly onto the CPU die and have only paste between them. It drops temps drastically.
\

It may be factual that I really like to de-lid processors. I've created my own techniques and have had very good results through the years. I was around and overclocking chips when they did not come with IHS plates such as socket A processors and such.

Have my very own IHS replacement plate as well. It's about twice the mass of any ordinary plate and has the ability to hold a larger amount of heat. I've taken the time to use pure 999% copper bullion for plating and home made LN2 pots with this pure copper base.

I love to share my knowledge of cooling, de-lidding and lapping to anyone whom may want some info in regards to cooling.

So anyways, It's not that I don't like people or Intel processors. It's that the application process Intel uses is sloppy. The paste is bottom barrel because it saves money. Bulk paste perhaps. But to say it's "good" paste maybe ok.... if your not an enthusiast or have no desire to better your temps to get a higher overclock. After all that's why we are all here no??

.

Quote:


> Its the whole point of intel paste not to be pasty, its why it doesnt pump out ever like other pastes do within a day or two.


HUH? your saying it's good then a statement like this?

Yes some pastes are designed with a burn in time. AS5 happens to be one of them. The paste under the IHS plate does not have silver particles. It would conduct not as well. So it gets replaced by de-lidders. I don't think ONE single person has called Intel for a tube of their wonderful paste.
Quote:


> There shouldn't be any issues. Give it a try and if it's dried out replace it


+1 rep


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Your post is pretty backhanded. Not sure towards me or whatever...... but none the less.
> 
> I like Intel fine!! Have had many Intel rigs throughout the years. Even run one daily. So not sure where you came up with that type of response??
> 
> About the Intel TIM. _____________________
> 
> It is designed and manufactured to run a processor at a stock speed.
> 
> Some Thermal Interface Material is designed to be set and cured with heat. I will admit I know nothing about the properties of the paste under the plate.
> 
> However your statement is like saying..... The thermal paste in the packet that came with the cooler is good stuff..... but most overclockers replace this paste with something "better" such as liquid metal, perhaps AS5 and so forth.
> 
> My picture above^^ You don't see the air pockets from that Intel stock paste? You can plainly see how the paste was applied. Poorly.
> 
> I am not a fan of re-use of IHS plates. It slows thermal conductivity down greatly. You have paste on the bottom and the top of the plate. But with Intel chips, the retention bracket on the board must be removed. So I've done most de-lids on AMD and put the waterblock directly onto the CPU die and have only paste between them. It drops temps drastically.
> \
> 
> It may be factual that I really like to de-lid processors. I've created my own techniques and have had very good results through the years. I was around and overclocking chips when they did not come with IHS plates such as socket A processors and such.
> 
> Have my very own IHS replacement plate as well. It's about twice the mass of any ordinary plate and has the ability to hold a larger amount of heat. I've taken the time to use pure 999% copper bullion for plating and home made LN2 pots with this pure copper base.
> 
> I love to share my knowledge of cooling, de-lidding and lapping to anyone whom may want some info in regards to cooling.
> 
> So anyways, It's not that I don't like people or Intel processors. It's that the application process Intel uses is sloppy. The paste is bottom barrel because it saves money. Bulk paste perhaps. But to say it's "good" paste maybe ok.... if your not an enthusiast or have no desire to better your temps to get a higher overclock. After all that's why we are all here no??
> 
> .
> HUH? your saying it's good then a statement like this?
> 
> Yes some pastes are designed with a burn in time. AS5 happens to be one of them. The paste under the IHS plate does not have silver particles. It would conduct not as well. So it gets replaced by de-lidders. I don't think ONE single person has called Intel for a tube of their wonderful paste.
> +1 rep


The air pocket you have could simply be just from removing it. Me personally i run bare-die on my 4690k and have had pump out within a day with most major thermal pastes. Again a gpu die is totally different and has no where near the pressure of the IHS or waterblock directly onto the die. Again read a few pages back and ive shown this with actual pressure paper.

Intel TIM is made to last, period. Whether you disagree or not, we can all agree that most people dont replace the Intel TIM on a stock cpu or even OCed one ever. The intel TIM is made to last and it lasts YEARS before degrading, while others on bare die dont last but a week.

Again this is a delid thread so its what were focusing on, you can't say its ok to put paste on a gpu and then say yea its ok to do it on a cpu as well doesnt work that way.

And P.S. The reason people have not called intel for a tube is because 1, intel doesnt make it, and 2, Dow Corning charges a ridiculous price for the TIM. Me personally i dont think it would pump out on a bare die or under the IHS with silicone removed AT ALL. Its supposed to be non viscous. NH-T1 and Hydronaut/Kryonaut turned into a liquid after a day or 2 running bare die AND running delid with the IHS back on. Again ive tested this over a month and not after a day like j2c or other useless youtube reviewers.


----------



## tps3443

I delided my 6600K, because the lower temps people were getting are huge! And I need more speed for Fallout. Everything has gone smooth, but if I did break it, I could afford to buy another.

I'm not going to put Liquid metal on my GTX1080, it has a copper portion on the heatsink, because it's a FE model. It's just not worth it. It's to expensive to replace. I'm not sure if that copper has aluminum in there to. And, that may cause problems.

I did however perform the shunt mod, it's painting a small resistor cap with liquid metal so it grounds out, and makes the card think it is using less power so the 120% power limit is not such a problem. It was Easy and effective, and fool proof.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> I delided my 6600K, because the lower temps people were getting are huge! And I need more speed for Fallout. Everything has gone smooth, but if I did break it, I could afford to buy another.
> 
> I'm not going to put Liquid metal on my GTX1080, it has a copper portion on the heatsink, because it's a FE model. It's just not worth it. It's to expensive to replace. I'm not sure if that copper has aluminum in there to. And, that may cause problems.
> 
> I did however perform the shunt mod, it's painting a small resistor cap with liquid metal so it grounds out, and makes the card think it is using less power so the 120% power limit is not such a problem. It was Easy and effective, and fool proof.


LM on a gpu is totally pointless. Unless its watercooled, youll probably see a max 2-3°C difference between the best LM and best TIM. Its not worth the hassle.


----------



## g0tsl33p14

I actually see higher baseline temperatures on my GPU with using LM and at the same time lower peak temperatures on my GPU using LM.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> No offense but not sure why you continue to discount a thread thats been posted a million times in this thread.
> 
> I think you just dislike Intel or the people in this thread. Its really starting to get on my nerves. First of all Intel TIM is far better then other TIMS WHEN ITS NOT DELIDED. Why? Because it actually keeps identical temps over a period of time while other ones clearly do not.
> 
> Its the whole point of intel paste not to be pasty, its why it doesnt pump out ever like other pastes do within a day or two.


Shrimp likes both intel and AMD, he just happens to prefer AMD. My intel TIM was rock hard when I delided and my idle temps now bare die at 1.5v are the same temps I had when the chip was lidded, to me, it's crap sorry, you can show me as many threads etc as you want blue but the stuff is crap. You need to stop arguing with people in this thread after a certain point. Make your argument then leave it be, shrimp knows quite a lot of stuff he's even taught me a decent amount so knock it off.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> No offense but not sure why you continue to discount a thread thats been posted a million times in this thread.
> 
> I think you just dislike Intel or the people in this thread. Its really starting to get on my nerves. First of all Intel TIM is far better then other TIMS WHEN ITS NOT DELIDED. Why? Because it actually keeps identical temps over a period of time while other ones clearly do not.
> 
> Its the whole point of intel paste not to be pasty, its why it doesnt pump out ever like other pastes do within a day or two.
> 
> 
> 
> Shrimp likes both intel and AMD, he just happens to prefer AMD. My intel TIM was rock hard when I delided and my idle temps now bare die at 1.5v are the same temps I had when the chip was lidded, to me, it's crap sorry, you can show me as many threads etc as you want blue but the stuff is crap. You need to stop arguing with people in this thread after a certain point. Make your argument then leave it be, shrimp knows quite a lot of stuff he's even taught me a decent amount so knock it off.
Click to expand...

It's ok ben. I can see his point of view, but it doesn't really apply to a de-lid thread. He's saying the Stock Intel TIM under the IHS plate is what we might call (good enough) and to last years. This is true, but the application process is not good. It's over used. There's too much. Has air pockets, I've even displayed the picture of it.

The paste was hardened. So that pocket of air could not have been created while a de-lid. It was set and cured that way.
Quote:


> Again this is a delid thread so its what were focusing on, you can't say its ok to put paste on a gpu and then say yea its ok to do it on a cpu as well doesnt work that way.


I never said ONE single word about a Gpu de-lid.
Quote:


> we can all agree that most people dont replace the Intel TIM on a stock cpu or even OCed one ever.


We are at an OC forum in a de-lid thread. The average user does not apply, so leave them out of it!!








Quote:


> Intel TIM is made to last, period. Whether you disagree or not,


I both agree and disagree with this statement.

Agree. - Was made to last with a stock environment with a stock cooler and power saving features enabled. So generally with the average user we need not mention here at an OC forum. They do not apply. And then why

I disagree - Well because it doesn't last for an overclocker such as you and I. You've abviously de-lidded for a reason. I'd hate to think it was to follow a crowd or to be part of this thread, but somewhere read that people de-lid replace the TIM and get better temps then a better overclock!! (correct me if I'm wrong here). So you de-lidded for the sport, hobby and search for better temps and better overclocking right!??

So in the end discussion assuming you have a good de-lid experience with better temps, yes the Intel TIM is crap for extreme users such as you and I and Ben and perhaps The Stilt as well.

I do know that the difference between most TIMs in reviews of them there's maybe a 5c difference between the middle and top brands and perhaps a 1-2c difference between just the top 5 brands.

So was using AS5 years ago. Had switched over to Nano Diamond and had a decent 5c temp drop. So let's assume there is no silver in the stock Intel paste and AS5 beats it because it is designed to transfer heat better. in comparison the stock Intel paste is crap to AS5 let alone the top 5 pastes.

It's cool I get what's being said. Stock Intel paste is good enough. But that's about it......


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> It's ok ben. I can see his point of view, but it doesn't really apply to a de-lid thread. He's saying the Stock Intel TIM under the IHS plate is what we might call (good enough) and to last years. This is true, but the application process is not good. It's over used. There's too much. Has air pockets, I've even displayed the picture of it.
> 
> The paste was hardened. So that pocket of air could not have been created while a de-lid. It was set and cured that way.
> I never said ONE single word about a Gpu de-lid.
> We are at an OC forum in a de-lid thread. The average user does not apply, so leave them out of it!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I both agree and disagree with this statement.
> 
> Agree. - Was made to last with a stock environment with a stock cooler and power saving features enabled. So generally with the average user we need not mention here at an OC forum. They do not apply. And then why
> 
> I disagree - Well because it doesn't last for an overclocker such as you and I. You've abviously de-lidded for a reason. I'd hate to think it was to follow a crowd or to be part of this thread, but somewhere read that people de-lid replace the TIM and get better temps then a better overclock!! (correct me if I'm wrong here). So you de-lidded for the sport, hobby and search for better temps and better overclocking right!??
> 
> So in the end discussion assuming you have a good de-lid experience with better temps, yes the Intel TIM is crap for extreme users such as you and I and Ben and perhaps The Stilt as well.
> 
> I do know that the difference between most TIMs in reviews of them there's maybe a 5c difference between the middle and top brands and perhaps a 1-2c difference between just the top 5 brands.
> 
> So was using AS5 years ago. Had switched over to Nano Diamond and had a decent 5c temp drop. So let's assume there is no silver in the stock Intel paste and AS5 beats it because it is designed to transfer heat better. in comparison the stock Intel paste is crap to AS5 let alone the top 5 pastes.
> 
> It's cool I get what's being said. Stock Intel paste is good enough. But that's about it......


I thought you told someone to use LM on a gpu as it works better then TIM but could be wrong.

Btw i do believe that the Intel TIM does in fact have silver in it.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I thought you told someone to use LM on a gpu as it works better then TIM but could be wrong.
> 
> Btw i do believe that the Intel TIM does in fact have silver in it.


Well I know Intel has changed the thermal paste through the years. I remember reading on the newer processors it is better.

Any how I'm running the sig rig with stock cooler and paste. 4.2ghz a decent 700mhz OC nice stable 1400mhz mem freq. It's all good.

When this system goes down, I may de-lid and bench the rig with extreme cooling and so forth. For now, it runs pretty cool games very well and satisfied. The board is equipped with a 5ghz OC on air profile. I never need to use it lol.


----------



## maynard14

hi redid paste on my 4790k delided cooled by nzxt x61 at default speed, i live here in the philipines and ambient temps on my room is 33c

im getting this temps while playing crysis 3 (4.7 ghz oced 1.254 volts)


----------



## paskowitz

Question. With liquid metal TIM, if I remove my IHS can I just reapply a little extra TIM to the die and redistribute it or should I always do a fresh application?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Fresh application might be a little more worry free. However experimentation should be done as well.


----------



## dmfree88

I think Intel TIM is designed to harden and bond. Performs similar to AS5 which tends to dry out over time but still works because of the metal particles. I have seen application issues from Intel that have resulted in air pockets that even raise only 1-2 core temps but that is generally very rare. It is entirely possible that when removing the IHS you created the air pockets as the TIM pulled apart from its semi-hardened bond. The distance from IHS to DIE is less in the center so more likely to pull completely out. Looking at the IHS side it appears to have the same shape but cant tell if its an indent or if its sticking out. Could be wrong its entirely possible you had a factory failure.

Stock has been tested against multiple other TIM though and it is decent. Clearly it lasts long because many normal non-delidded users go 5+ years without issues. With a lot of the mainstream pastes it dries and fails within a year or two. Its not perfect and certainly the application process isn't going to be perfect but the paste has proven to be good for the job it is doing.

I am also not 100% sure the paste supplied on stock Intel heatsinks is the same. May be a different formula or may use something to preserve it. It also may have a different application process which could effect quality of outcome (since it usually comes pre-applied).

If no other paste can handle being under the IHS for even a month let alone years then Intel stock paste is good. Especially since it also does decent compared to other pastes. Find me multiple types of pastes that can handle under the IHS for years and outperforms under the same conditions we can start talking about their paste sucking but until then I think its safe to say they did ok. Might need better application process but certainly the TIM is better than many


----------



## ShrimpBrime

The paste in that diagram is intended for use of only 3 years.

Would a 3 year paste be tested against a 5 year paste? Has this 3 year paste been tested for 5 years?

Intel paste is good enough. No one ever said otherwise.

My thought about lapping the ridge along the sides on the under side of the IHS plate was disregarded. Do this to eliminate a "gap" between die and plate.

Also known that most pastes are within 5c of each other. It's the extras such as lapping the cooler and top side of plate to further help temps. Also seen in the depiction above. Those tests should have been done on a non lapped plate imo.

But thanks for that post!! very informative!!


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Question. With liquid metal TIM, if I remove my IHS can I just reapply a little extra TIM to the die and redistribute it or should I always do a fresh application?


My experience is completely clean the IHS or the block if you are running naked, then dab the die with the slightest amount of new liquid metal so that redistributing covers the entire die without holes, like new. It is personally preference I would think.

I find I use so much more liquid metal that it becomes wasted if I completely clean and then reapply.
At the same time there is then more opportunity to miss things going wrong with your chip as you spend less time with it.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> My experience is completely clean the IHS or the block if you are running naked, then dab the die with the slightest amount of new liquid metal so that redistributing covers the entire die without holes, like new. It is personally preference I would think.
> 
> I find I use so much more liquid metal that it becomes wasted if I completely clean and then reapply.
> At the same time there is then more opportunity to miss things going wrong with your chip as you spend less time with it.


Don't forget my experience though, I used as little as possible and my temps where really bad. it needs to be a happy medium.


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> The paste in that diagram is intended for use of only 3 years.
> 
> Would a 3 year paste be tested against a 5 year paste? Has this 3 year paste been tested for 5 years?
> 
> Intel paste is good enough. No one ever said otherwise.
> 
> My thought about lapping the ridge along the sides on the under side of the IHS plate was disregarded. Do this to eliminate a "gap" between die and plate.
> 
> Also known that most pastes are within 5c of each other. It's the extras such as lapping the cooler and top side of plate to further help temps. Also seen in the depiction above. Those tests should have been done on a non lapped plate imo.
> 
> But thanks for that post!! very informative!!


Well what we do know is MX-4 is a 8+ year paste and it pumps out in less than a week. the table above showed that at the same height the intel TIM outperforms regular TIM directly after installation. The Noctua will not last 3 years direct on die it will pump out very quickly. As I had mentioned in a previous post awhile back I think it mostly has to do with the fact that there is no gap between the IHS and the die. It is touching. You are only filling the gaps between two surfaces that are making contact down the center. I think most pastes are too much of a liquid to hold together in the center with pressure applied by both the heatsink and the IHS being pressed down and heated. With a shim you might actually get regular paste to last as long as the intel paste since it would no longer have as much pressure on it. Intel paste might even pump out if you use it without the extra glue/shim that creates the gap. Would be interesting to find out. Which would prove its not really better but the gap itself prevents the pumpout (if the intel paste also pumps out without the gap)


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Yes the gap. very small. But why shim if the argument was the glue creates the gap in the first place?

I assume the shim was in place of the glue? Why shim and not re-glue? Is it possible the glue can be thinner than the shim dependent on clamping force?

Here's AS5 on a bare naked AMD chip.

Looks like a good contact and spreading, a little pump out there, but no hardening. Cannot remember the length of time used, but was likely a couple of months on a daily set up. Ranging from burn in to every day use and benchmarking.

http://s269.photobucket.com/user/ShrimpBrime/media/DSCN4517.jpg.html
http://s269.photobucket.com/user/ShrimpBrime/media/DSCN4516.jpg.html

Full spread technique with a nice thin coat.

http://s269.photobucket.com/user/ShrimpBrime/media/DSC02212.jpg.html


----------



## v1ral

Is it unusual to the the IHS be extremely hard to remove?
I tried the AquaComputer Skylake "twister" the other day I had 3D printed and I broke the tool, I had a hard time.. broke a few drivers etc. Then finally broke the tool.
I am ready to Delid my 6700k and I am wondering how dum-dum proof is using the Razer method? I Delidded my 4790K with a vice, then returned the vice to Home Depot, but I know the vice method isn't the go to method anymore, espesh for Skylake.
Since razer blades are pretty cheap, compared to an actual tool*I spent 10 bucks for the 3D printed one*, I may go this route..
Thoughts?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

That razor you see in the picture above is a double sided shaving razor. Super sharp. It glides through the glue with ease. But the razor bends if not careful besides the two sharp edges. A piece of tape over the one edge so you can hold it.

The pop the top method works ok.

But any way you do it, there's some risks involved.


----------



## DerComissar

And since yer lookin' for cheap, the razor blade is about as cheap as yer gonna get.
Hell, you could probably borrow one from a relative, then it don't cost ya nuthin'.









Edit:
I'm just in a silly mood. But my first two delids were done using a razor blade, one I found lying in my tool box at that, lol.


----------



## Origondoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *v1ral*
> 
> Is it unusual to the the IHS be extremely hard to remove?
> I tried the AquaComputer Skylake "twister" the other day I had 3D printed and I broke the tool, I had a hard time.. broke a few drivers etc. Then finally broke the tool.
> I am ready to Delid my 6700k and I am wondering how dum-dum proof is using the Razer method? I Delidded my 4790K with a vice, then returned the vice to Home Depot, but I know the vice method isn't the go to method anymore, espesh for Skylake.
> Since razer blades are pretty cheap, compared to an actual tool*I spent 10 bucks for the 3D printed one*, I may go this route..
> Thoughts?


I would go for vice only method anyway. It worked out well for me on 6700k. You just have to use a vice with plain jaws. Apply the force and wait a liitle bit so the glue can slowly start to creep


----------



## dmfree88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> I would go for vice only method anyway. It worked out well for me on 6700k. You just have to use a vice with plain jaws. Apply the force and wait a liitle bit so the glue can slowly start to creep


I dont have any experience with skylake to be sure but it seems like it would be safer and easier to do the vise method like hes suggesting. You can rotate it and slowly break it free

If you can 3D print something you can also try the vise 3D tool shown here:






probably a little safer.


----------



## alanflankerBR

Anyone use hair dryer to separate then?


----------



## lexer

At the moment i delided successfully 3 skylake processor using a razor blade and a credit card. With the razor blade i only make the initial cut on one corner, then i sharpen the credit card with a iron file and use it as a blade. With this method you reduce a lot probabilities of damage the pcb or the die.
For my 4690k i used the vice no-hammer method


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lexer*
> 
> At the moment i delided successfully 3 skylake processor using a razor blade and a credit card. With the razor blade i only make the initial cut on one corner, then i sharpen the credit card with a iron file and use it as a blade. With this method you reduce a lot probabilities of damage the pcb or the die.
> For my 4690k i used the vice no-hammer method


That's good stuff right there!


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> I would go for vice only method anyway. It worked out well for me on 6700k. You just have to use a vice with plain jaws. Apply the force and wait a liitle bit so the glue can slowly start to creep


Having seen plenty of damaged Skylake chips I'd recommend against it personally but ah well, same with the razor method...

Personally I'm for working smarter not harder, I use a razor to shave with, not a bowie knife even they they both can do the same thing....


----------



## g0tsl33p14

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> I would go for vice only method anyway. It worked out well for me on 6700k. You just have to use a vice with plain jaws. Apply the force and wait a liitle bit so the glue can slowly start to creep
> 
> 
> 
> Having seen plenty of damaged Skylake chips I'd recommend against it personally but ah well, same with the razor method...
> 
> Personally I'm for working smarter not harder, I use a razor to shave with, not a bowie knife even they they both can do the same thing....
Click to expand...

Lawl, that is actually pretty funny, but wouldn't you feel like a badass with that bowie.

I want to see pictures of this iron file and credit card blade. I want to see a credit card that can go to town on a delid more than my "girlfriend" on Fruit Ninja.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Lawl, that is actually pretty funny, but wouldn't you feel like a badass with that bowie.
> 
> I want to see pictures of this iron file and credit card blade. I want to see a credit card that can go to town on a delid more than my "girlfriend" on Fruit Ninja.


You can use a plastic card so long as it's thin enough and strong enough.

I watched a video of someone doing it, basically you use a blade to start off a corner then you use the card for the rest.


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *g0tsl33p14*
> 
> Lawl, that is actually pretty funny, but wouldn't you feel like a badass with that bowie.
> 
> I want to see pictures of this iron file and credit card blade. I want to see a credit card that can go to town on a delid more than my "girlfriend" on Fruit Ninja.


I don't have any processor at the moment







. Also this type of tools for smartphones does the job


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Yes the gap. very small. But why shim if the argument was the glue creates the gap in the first place?
> 
> I assume the shim was in place of the glue? Why shim and not re-glue? Is it possible the glue can be thinner than the shim dependent on clamping force?
> 
> Here's AS5 on a bare naked AMD chip.
> 
> Looks like a good contact and spreading, a little pump out there, but no hardening. Cannot remember the length of time used, but was likely a couple of months on a daily set up. Ranging from burn in to every day use and benchmarking.
> 
> http://s269.photobucket.com/user/ShrimpBrime/media/DSCN4517.jpg.html
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> http://s269.photobucket.com/user/ShrimpBrime/media/DSCN4516.jpg.html
> 
> Full spread technique with a nice thin coat.
> 
> http://s269.photobucket.com/user/ShrimpBrime/media/DSC02212.jpg.html


Not to bust your chops or anything but...

What were your temps like with that much AS5 between the cooling plate and your CPU?

Forget delidding try less Thermal paste and one with a one day or burn in period.









Don't get me wrong AS5 back in the day, was THE best. But there are so many solid performing pastes out now that give AS5 fits. Hell I am an old skool guy and I swear by G751. Stuff cures in a day and you won't even notice a temp fluctuation after burn in. Maybe a slight one but it's unnoticeable in my experience. Stuff compares well against AS5. Link in my sig. It's old for sure but where AS5 is concerned it's still relevant.









Hopefully I mistook the intent of the pic log you posted?









~Ceadder


----------



## ShrimpBrime

As you can see from the picture, it was not very much at all. A BB size. Thinly spread with a razor..

Temps dropped dramatically. This one was on Agena core in the pictures there. Probably a cool 10c drop in temps.

With most AMD soldered de-lids, a 10c drop is easy to come by.

Now use Antec Formula-7 nano diamond paste. Haven't used AS5 in years now.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> As you can see from the picture, it was not very much at all. A BB size. Thinly spread with a razor..
> 
> Temps dropped dramatically. This one was on Agena core in the pictures there. Probably a cool 10c drop in temps.
> 
> With most AMD soldered de-lids, a 10c drop is easy to come by.
> 
> Now use Antec Formula-7 nano diamond paste. Haven't used AS5 in years now.


Wait, wha?!? Doesn't that contain Diamond dust particles? I don't recommend using that on your die if it does.









~Ceadder


----------



## ShrimpBrime

been using it for quite a while now. No Ill effects that I am aware of....


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> been using it for quite a while now. No Ill effects that I am aware of....


No ill effects until you see scratches on the surface of the die. They use diamond dust coated augers for deep well drilling after all.









~Ceadder


----------



## ShrimpBrime

The FX-5000 I had done an experiment on. It was simply to lap the Die as far down as possible. I took quite a bit off until you could even see tracings down inside that actually looked like cracks. The experiment was purely to see how far down you could lap.

The Avatar you see under my name shows how far down I got.

Since the actual cores are deep pretty much inside at the PCB level, you can lap the die quite a bit.


----------



## paskowitz

I forgot to take pics, but I just learned the lesson of not applying enough CLU to my die and IHS. I was wondering why my temps were consistently ~3c hotter than my last maintenance period. The TIM on my die was spread to one side (I guess I moved the IHS on application). The TIM on my IHS was very very thin with almost none outside of the center. That'll do it.


----------



## Valgaur

So here is a weird scenario....

I'll be running a 4770k for a while as a daily cpu here soon. And in wishy washy if I should delid. I want to, but I'm also lazy...


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> So here is a weird scenario....
> 
> I'll be running a 4770k for a while as a daily cpu here soon. And in wishy washy if I should delid. I want to, but I'm also lazy...


blasphemy?! You'll feel better about yourself if you delid


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> blasphemy?! You'll feel better about yourself if you delid


4770k doesn't have the flimsy pcb correct?

Vagur forgets things...


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 4770k doesn't have the flimsy pcb correct?
> 
> Vagur forgets things...


I don't believe so. Just skylake


----------



## ShortySmalls

Welp killed my month old 6700k with a delid lol. Dropped about 15*c for a couple weeks but today I was playing a game and it blue screened and will not post anymore. I had originally killed 2 memory slots in my delid process but now i guess the whole chip died









Tossed in a 6600k from my step dads computer and she runs perfect, all memory slots work perfect again too so I know its not the motherboard.

Guess ill buy a Pentium g4400 to hold me over until Kaby Lake, the benchmarks I've seen on that look awesome. Anyone know a release date?


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShortySmalls*
> 
> Welp killed my month old 6700k with a delid lol. Dropped about 15*c for a couple weeks but today I was playing a game and it blue screened and will not post anymore. I had originally killed 2 memory slots in my delid process but now i guess the whole chip died
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tossed in a 6600k from my step dads computer and she runs perfect, all memory slots work perfect again too so I know its not the motherboard.
> 
> Guess ill buy a Pentium g4400 to hold me over until Kaby Lake, the benchmarks I've seen on that look awesome. Anyone know a release date?


Pics of the delid???

Sounds like people that damage the CPU have memory slot issues first...interesting.


----------



## ShortySmalls

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Pics of the delid???
> 
> Sounds like people that damage the CPU have memory slot issues first...interesting.


I got a small scratch on my pcb on the top center of the chip but the traces didn't look damaged it looked like a blank area on the pcb. lesson learned will not be trying this again on my new chip lol


----------



## Origondoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShortySmalls*
> 
> I got a small scratch on my pcb on the top center of the chip but the traces didn't look damaged it looked like a blank area on the pcb. lesson learned will not be trying this again on my new chip lol


The same issue I had on my very first delid try with i5 3570k using the rasor mezhod. This resulted in the cutting of 2 RAM banks due to the pcb scratch.
That's the reason why I (successfully) used the vice only method on 4790k and 6700k.


----------



## ShortySmalls

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Origondoo*
> 
> The same issue I had on my very first delid try with i5 3570k using the rasor mezhod. This resulted in the cutting of 2 RAM banks due to the pcb scratch.
> That's the reason why I (successfully) used the vice only method on 4790k and 6700k.


ill just buy the tool if i get brave enough to try om a new chip


----------



## sapphiretech

Delidded my second processor sucessfully using a razor blade. I obtained a 20c improvement with coolaboratory liquid pro betwen the die and ihs.



[email protected], 1.38v, LLC L5, x264 3 hours run using a deepcool lucifer v2
Its was benched in a room with a 23c ambient temperature


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sapphiretech*
> 
> Delidded my second processor sucessfully using a razor blade. I obtained a 20c improvement with coolaboratory liquid pro betwen the die and ihs.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [email protected], 1.38v, LLC L5, x264 3 hours run using a deepcool lucifer v2
> Its was benched in a room with a 23c ambient temperature


Good job on the delid.
That is an excellent temp. reduction.


----------



## Valgaur

Way behind, but it's getting built finally!


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Way behind, but it's getting built finally!


Nice clean delid, no IHS glue to be seen anywhere!

Good to see the build coming along.









Edit:
What method did you use to delid, razor? Vise?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Nice clean delid, no IHS glue to be seen anywhere!
> 
> Good to see the build coming along.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit:
> What method did you use to delid, razor? Vise?


I used my bare hands of course....







nah I used the vise method.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I used my bare hands of course....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nah I used the vise method.


I'll have to remember this post for when the next round of Blade vs Vice debate comes up.
I can now recommend OP personal preference The Vice.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I'll have to remember this post for when the next round of Blade vs Vice debate comes up.
> I can now recommend OP personal preference The Vice.


I used my bare hands and got a delid in like 10secs


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> I'll have to remember this post for when the next round of Blade vs Vice debate comes up.
> I can now recommend OP personal preference The Vice.


Usually I'm for the blade, but I didn't have the time to dedicate to not killing the chip. However, vice method was quick, easy, and painless. 11/10 would recommend!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I used my bare hands and got a delid in like 10secs


Man strength!


----------



## Benjiw

Really can't recommend blades with delidding, I keep seeing people say their chips are dead from slipping with a blade.


----------



## Jimbags

Ive done a 3570k and 3770k both work perfect. Although I do admit the risk is higher.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Hey Valgaur, I'd like to join this club, Is there any specific information needed to join? I have a decent list of Soldered chips we could add to the AMD section of the original post.

Here's a list of the so far completed starting back in 2009.

Soldered AMD processors De-lidded.

FX-6100 De-Lidded Working
FX-9590 De-lidded Killed x1
FX-9590 De-lidded Working x1
FX-8320 De-lidded working
Athon 5000+ unlocker FX-5000 x1
970T De-lidded for a customer Working
1090T De-lidded Working
965BE De-lidded working
940BE De-lidded working
9850BE De-lidded working ______ first de-lid
9950BE De-lidded working
FX-4100 De-lidded NOT Working
6400+ De-lidded working
6400+ de-lidded working

Here's a picture thread in the AMD cpu section. http://www.overclock.net/t/1611862/amd-de-lid-compilation-thread

Average OC gained on most was 100mhz with an average temp drop between 10c-20c.

Pastes used range from Artic Silver 5 to Antec Formula 6 & 7.

No IHS was re-used. Block to Die always.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Here's FX-4300 de-lid. The camera did something strange during the video, but if you watch closely enough, you'll see it. 




The other better video is being edited atm and hopefully can post soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, I'd like to join this club, Is there any specific information needed to join? I have a decent list of Soldered chips we could add to the AMD section of the original post.
> 
> Here's a list of the so far completed starting back in 2009.
> 
> Soldered AMD processors De-lidded.
> 
> FX-6100 De-Lidded Working
> FX-9590 De-lidded Killed x1
> FX-9590 De-lidded Working x1
> FX-8320 De-lidded working
> Athon 5000+ unlocker FX-5000 x1
> 970T De-lidded for a customer Working
> 1090T De-lidded Working
> 965BE De-lidded working
> 940BE De-lidded working
> 9850BE De-lidded working ______ first de-lid
> 9950BE De-lidded working
> FX-4100 De-lidded NOT Working
> 6400+ De-lidded working
> 6400+ de-lidded working
> 
> Here's a picture thread in the AMD cpu section. http://www.overclock.net/t/1611862/amd-de-lid-compilation-thread
> 
> Average OC gained on most was 100mhz with an average temp drop between 10c-20c.
> 
> Pastes used range from Artic Silver 5 to Antec Formula 6 & 7.
> 
> No IHS was re-used. Block to Die always.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Here's FX-4300 de-lid. The camera did something strange during the video, but if you watch closely enough, you'll see it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The other better video is being edited atm and hopefully can post soon.


Holy cow...... Thats.... thats a list there sir. I can add them once I can find time. Awesome job and commitment though! Give me a day and I'll have them in











Temps are around 66C under full load. Haven't gotten to OC yet but am looking into it. Any tips and tricks for over clocking Haswell?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

No hurries no worries brother.

Tips for Haswell?

There's a lot of settings that are not needed (imo) for daily use. You do get small gains from CPU Cache overclocking with high ddr3 speeds. Experienced blue screens at 4.1ghz, so I usually keep it around 3.8-3.9ghz or like right now stock. Can hardly tell the difference unless your really comparing benchmarks. also my opinion.

So I run the stock cooler. 4.2ghz CPU speed on stock air with a Delta fan over the cooler for VRM and additional cpu cooling. I use 1.225 v-core and nothing more. Runs great, nice and stable. I have Adata 2800mhz memory and run it daily this speed. Cas 12-14-14-36 2T-CR 1.650v. (calls for cas 13 fyi) Recommended to me was to stay under 1.4v at all possible and after 4.2ghz it seems to need a jump higher than my cooling can handle.

The board also was sent to me with a 5ghz preset that I cannot cool properly enough without better than stock air. I can post it, but little more than that atm lol. Any how, I'll see about a reboot for you and depict a screen shot here for you.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Here's the 5ghz air profile. Nick and I hold no responsibility for damaged hardware.


----------



## Deceptolon

Hey guys, here's my scalped 4670K. I went for the vice and hammer method and luckily didn't break anyhing. Hardest i pushed was 4.8 under a Corsair H110 but i could quite surely squeeze it past 5GHz with more juice to the core.



http://valid.canardpc.com/8d5bap


----------



## nacho123

Hi guys, I'll be delidding my 4790k soon, a tube of CLU is on its way.
But I wanted to know if any of you has tried to put CLU on your gpu, results could be great


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nacho123*
> 
> Hi guys, I'll be delidding my 4790k soon, a tube of CLU is on its way.
> But I wanted to know if any of you has tried to put CLU on your gpu, results could be great


I've seen people do it, however, one needs to be careful of the capacitors next to the die. One also needs to know what material the heatsink is made of, as CLU/P will eat away aluminum. If you use a new TIM on a gpu, I rather use a non-conductive paste like GC-extreme.

Okay, for the people with delid posts of the last few days, forgive me, but my schedule has been a little crazy as of late, could you link them so I can add them all again









Life is nutso man


----------



## davidcapi

I delidded a 4690k a while back with vise/no hammer. Here's some close up images in case you find them useful. One image shows what I believe is clearly a sign of the issues related to the IHS and a gap between it and the core die. It shows a black residue where thermal compound was supposed to be. Maybe IHS glue evaporating a bit with heat when new?


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nacho123*
> 
> Hi guys, I'll be delidding my 4790k soon, a tube of CLU is on its way.
> But I wanted to know if any of you has tried to put CLU on your gpu, results could be great


@valguar is exactly right. You must protect the transistors next to the die of a GPU. I briefly did this on a GTX 970. The zotac 'mini' with small dual fan cooler. It certainly helped the temperaures but I ran into problems a couple months after applying. I had applied liquid electrical tape on the transistors. The LET melted and essentially drew the CLU away from the die/cooler and it ended up on the transistors. Surprisingly the card survived after the CLU was cleaned off of the transistors. The LET was cooked on it though...couldn't get it all off without damaging the card.

If you were going to do this I think a high temperature silicone might work to protect the transistors. Then it is best on a card with a nickel plated heatsink/block. The CLU will stain/bond to copper which isn't the worst thing, but it destroys aluminum...do not use it on a bare aluminum heatsink.


----------



## nacho123

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Roboyto*
> 
> @valguar is exactly right. You must protect the transistors next to the die of a GPU. I briefly did this on a GTX 970. The zotac 'mini' with small dual fan cooler. It certainly helped the temperaures but I ran into problems a couple months after applying. I had applied liquid electrical tape on the transistors. The LET melted and essentially drew the CLU away from the die/cooler and it ended up on the transistors. Surprisingly the card survived after the CLU was cleaned off of the transistors. The LET was cooked on it though...couldn't get it all off without damaging the card.
> 
> If you were going to do this I think a high temperature silicone might work to protect the transistors. Then it is best on a card with a nickel plated heatsink/block. The CLU will stain/bond to copper which isn't the worst thing, but it destroys aluminum...do not use it on a bare aluminum heatsink.


I have bought high temperature silicone, up to 300 degrees celsius, but is it posible to remove it after applying it? I may do some tests before doing the mod.
The gpu is the 980ti Gaming, the cooler is copper with nickel plating.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nacho123*
> 
> I have bought high temperature silicone, up to 300 degrees celsius, but is it posible to remove it after applying it? I may do some tests before doing the mod.
> The gpu is the 980ti Gaming, the cooler is copper with nickel plating.


I would say it is most likely removable...but I can't say for sure.

My thought has been to use an automotive liquid gasket like HondaBond...just haven't tested it yet.


----------



## jdorje

Most gpu heat sinks are copper. The clu sinks in and has to be replaced 1-2x a year.

Definitely some benefit but i suspect nowhere near what you can get from a cpu. The gpu may be 2-3x higher wattage but the die is 10x bigger at least. The bottleneck is not moving heat from die to heat sink. That's why water cooling is so effective on the gpu.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Most gpu heat sinks are copper. The clu sinks in and has to be replaced 1-2x a year.
> 
> Definitely some benefit but i suspect nowhere near what you can get from a cpu. The gpu may be 2-3x higher wattage but the die is 10x bigger at least. The bottleneck is not moving heat from die to heat sink. That's why water cooling is so effective on the gpu.


You're aware that the H100i has a copper base for the pump, right? My current CLU application hasn't been replaced in over a year and a half - and it was only replaced then because I got curious about what it looked like after having it on for a year already....


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> You're aware that the H100i has a copper base for the pump, right? My current CLU application hasn't been replaced in over a year and a half - and it was only replaced then because I got curious about what it looked like after having it on for a year already....


Exactly lol. Most CPU coolers are copper as well.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Most gpu heat sinks are copper. The clu sinks in and has to be replaced 1-2x a year.
> 
> Definitely some benefit but i suspect nowhere near what you can get from a cpu. The gpu may be 2-3x higher wattage but the die is 10x bigger at least. The bottleneck is not moving heat from die to heat sink. That's why water cooling is so effective on the gpu.


btw jdorje you do know the clu doesnt "sink in" but actually fills in the microscopic pores in the copper (which is a GOOD thing) btw ie, if you decide to stop using clu and go back to thermal paste after cleaning and slightly sanding the copper base, the tim will work better.


----------



## jdorje

Did not know that. Everything I've read says lm will dissolve into copper. Still I've been planning to replace my cpu and gpu with clu, once i have another excuse to remount the cooler. But it has been 6 months and no excuse...

How much clu would it take for the top of an ihs and gpu die? Seems like they are combined at least 20x the size of a cpu die, aka a lot. Is one tube even enough?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Did not know that. Everything I've read says lm will dissolve into copper. Still I've been planning to replace my cpu and gpu with clu, once i have another excuse to remount the cooler. But it has been 6 months and no excuse...
> 
> How much clu would it take for the top of an ihs and gpu die? Seems like they are combined at least 20x the size of a cpu die, aka a lot. Is one tube even enough?


One tube is PLENTY. Don't forget, this is the same as any TIM. The thinner the layer, the better. Especially if the ihs and cooler are lapped even better. In theory and in a perfect world youd use no CLU/TIM.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> One tube is PLENTY. Don't forget, this is the same as any TIM. The thinner the layer, the better. Especially if the ihs and cooler are lapped even better. In theory and in a perfect world youd use no CLU/TIM.


There is such thing as too thin however, please don't forget to mention that.


----------



## rul3s

Ok, here's my question.

I have a Gigabyte Z97X Gaming5 with Intel 4790K, actually with a Noctua NHU12 but it's still very hot, 80-90 degrees on Prime95 and 75º on XTU.

So my plan is getting the cpu Delided, and mounting a Corsair H80i liquid cooling with Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra, but i've got a question.

Is it possible to mount this waterblock directly to the die and use Liquid Ultra between them? Or I MUST use the IHS between them?

Thanks mates!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rul3s*
> 
> Ok, here's my question.
> 
> I have a Gigabyte Z97X Gaming5 with Intel 4790K, actually with a Noctua NHU12 but it's still very hot, 80-90 degrees on Prime95 and 75º on XTU.
> 
> So my plan is getting the cpu Delided, and mounting a Corsair H80i liquid cooling with Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra, but i've got a question.
> 
> Is it possible to mount this waterblock directly to the die and use Liquid Ultra between them? Or I MUST use the IHS between them?
> 
> Thanks mates!


I would first delid and then use the Noctua and see how temps are. The drops might be worth keeping your cooler and saving some $$$

However, for the H80i question, I don't recommend the direct die solution for AIO coolers.


----------



## paskowitz

Everytime I apply CLU I feel like I'm defusing a nuke.


----------



## jdorje

On my fury x the core temp is about 5C above the water temp, under load. Clu could get that down to 4c maybe? Though getting the water temp down would surely be good.

Whereas on my delidded 4690k core temp is about 30C above water temp. Before delid that would have been 40C at least at the same wattage. I do not have clu on the ihs but i could see it helping a little there.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Everytime I apply CLU I feel like I'm defusing a nuke.


Lol!


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Lol!


----------



## rul3s

One more question guys, this afternoon I'm going to delid my 4790K (it reaches almos 90º with 1.18vcore....) and I was going to do vice+wood+hammer method, I've practised with 2 old cpu's and worked fine, but I've just discovered this VICE ONLY method.... do you think it's better or worst thant vice+wood+hammer?






Thanks guys!


----------



## blasc

i used vice only this summer. was trembling and sweating like a pig due to nervous/heat (I live in Portugal, and was doing this while on vacation on Algarve).

as soon as it went "POP" i loosened the strength and all was fine.

I used a bit of "soft plastic" stuff so the CPU wouldn't be in direct contact with the hard metal of the vice.

P.S.:
BTW, from complete start (since i started getting the components out of the case) until all was finished, this took me the entire afternoon. This included:
- taking all components out of case and apart
- cleaning everything
- Delid, new TIM, put CPU back into MOBO.
- final "cleaning" and make sure everything is ok
- All back into case.

And you know what happened 1st time I turned the PC on????
It turned on lights, fans started moving, and 2 secs later everything went OFF!!!!! I stood still looking at the PC like this:









turned it on again, praying to every type of god known to mankind. And it managed to boot!! yey!! -15ºC than before!!


----------



## blasc

lol i ment to put a emoji that looked stressed. only noticed now that one is drooling ahahahha


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rul3s*
> 
> One more question guys, this afternoon I'm going to delid my 4790K (it reaches almos 90º with 1.18vcore....) and I was going to do vice+wood+hammer method, I've practised with 2 old cpu's and worked fine, but I've just discovered this VICE ONLY method.... do you think it's better or worst thant vice+wood+hammer?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks guys!


I'd say the the vice only method is much better/safer. You're applying the same force, only very slowly and you have exact control over when you stop moving the ihs. It's the only method I've done, but both times it was easy breezy. (I did a g3258 as practice for my 4790k)


----------



## rul3s

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blasc*
> 
> i used vice only this summer. was trembling and sweating like a pig due to nervous/heat (I live in Portugal, and was doing this while on vacation on Algarve)....


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I'd say the the vice only method is much better/safer. You're applying the same force, only very slowly and you have exact control over when you stop moving the ihs. It's the only method I've done, but both times it was easy breezy. (I did a g3258 as practice for my 4790k)


Ok guys, I'm back with news.

For a start I've done the vice only mode, it was very very easy, i've removed the IHS, clean all and prepare to mount it again.
What I've done is to give nail polish to the VRM's, wait 1 hour, put the cpu in the socket, aply CLU, speare it with the brush it comes and then put the IHS back again in the same position.
Now booting on default settings I run intel XTU stress test and I see cores temps going up and down like 20º in less than a second, from 70º to 90º and going to 70 again. IDLE temps are about 30º.
Remember it's a 4790K with Noctua NH-U12.

Is that normal? Maybe CLU needs some time to take seat?

Here some pics:





thanks mates!


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rul3s*
> 
> One more question guys, this afternoon I'm going to delid my 4790K (it reaches almos 90º with 1.18vcore....) and I was going to do vice+wood+hammer method, I've practised with 2 old cpu's and worked fine, but I've just discovered this VICE ONLY method.... do you think it's better or worst thant vice+wood+hammer?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks guys!


Vice only method is absolutely the best for haswell/ivy. Hammer method is pretty risky.

Seems like the op guide is pretty outdated on this...

Feel free to ask questions mid delid. I had a couple of them that got answered quickly and made me a lot more confident.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Hey Valgaur, I'd like to join this club, Is there any specific information needed to join? I have a decent list of Soldered chips we could add to the AMD section of the original post.
> 
> Here's a list of the so far completed starting back in 2009.
> 
> Soldered AMD processors De-lidded.
> 
> FX-6100 De-Lidded Working
> FX-9590 De-lidded Killed x1
> FX-9590 De-lidded Working x1
> FX-8320 De-lidded working
> Athon 5000+ unlocker FX-5000 x1
> 970T De-lidded for a customer Working
> 1090T De-lidded Working
> 965BE De-lidded working
> 940BE De-lidded working
> 9850BE De-lidded working ______ first de-lid
> 9950BE De-lidded working
> FX-4100 De-lidded NOT Working
> 6400+ De-lidded working
> 6400+ de-lidded working
> 
> Here's a picture thread in the AMD cpu section. http://www.overclock.net/t/1611862/amd-de-lid-compilation-thread
> 
> Average OC gained on most was 100mhz with an average temp drop between 10c-20c.
> 
> Pastes used range from Artic Silver 5 to Antec Formula 6 & 7.
> 
> No IHS was re-used. Block to Die always.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Deceptolon*
> 
> Hey guys, here's my scalped 4670K. I went for the vice and hammer method and luckily didn't break anyhing. Hardest i pushed was 4.8 under a Corsair H110 but i could quite surely squeeze it past 5GHz with more juice to the core.
> 
> 
> 
> http://valid.canardpc.com/8d5bap


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blasc*
> 
> i used vice only this summer. was trembling and sweating like a pig due to nervous/heat (I live in Portugal, and was doing this while on vacation on Algarve).
> 
> as soon as it went "POP" i loosened the strength and all was fine.
> 
> I used a bit of "soft plastic" stuff so the CPU wouldn't be in direct contact with the hard metal of the vice.
> 
> P.S.:
> BTW, from complete start (since i started getting the components out of the case) until all was finished, this took me the entire afternoon. This included:
> - taking all components out of case and apart
> - cleaning everything
> - Delid, new TIM, put CPU back into MOBO.
> - final "cleaning" and make sure everything is ok
> - All back into case.
> 
> And you know what happened 1st time I turned the PC on????
> It turned on lights, fans started moving, and 2 secs later everything went OFF!!!!! I stood still looking at the PC like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> turned it on again, praying to every type of god known to mankind. And it managed to boot!! yey!! -15ºC than before!!


Yeeeeees, see all the benefits before you. One of us, One of us. You should make a submission








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rul3s*
> 
> Ok guys, I'm back with news.
> 
> For a start I've done the vice only mode, it was very very easy, i've removed the IHS, clean all and prepare to mount it again.
> What I've done is to give nail polish to the VRM's, wait 1 hour, put the cpu in the socket, aply CLU, speare it with the brush it comes and then put the IHS back again in the same position.
> Now booting on default settings I run intel XTU stress test and I see cores temps going up and down like 20º in less than a second, from 70º to 90º and going to 70 again. IDLE temps are about 30º.
> Remember it's a 4790K with Noctua NH-U12.
> 
> Is that normal? Maybe CLU needs some time to take seat?
> 
> Here some pics:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thanks mates!


The CLU doesn't need any time, but it might not be enough on the die, or to much, its always difficult to tell.


----------



## Xgatt

So I'm getting a 6700k later today and decided that I'm going to delid (either by myself or through SL). Basically I need help deciding if I should do it myself or get it done instead. Here's what I've shortlisted so far...

Advantages of doing it myself: Cost (unless I'm forced to buy a $30 tool), time (i can do it myself in one evening).
Advantages of getting it done through SL: Reliability, guarantee

What are the expert opinions here? For a first time delidder, is it worth attempting it myself on a Skylake or is it too risky?


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xgatt*
> 
> So I'm getting a 6700k later today and decided that I'm going to delid (either by myself or through SL). Basically I need help deciding if I should do it myself or get it done instead. Here's what I've shortlisted so far...
> 
> Advantages of doing it myself: Cost (unless I'm forced to buy a $30 tool), time (i can do it myself in one evening).
> Advantages of getting it done through SL: Reliability, guarantee
> 
> What are the expert opinions here? For a first time delidder, is it worth attempting it myself on a Skylake or is it too risky?


If you're on a tight budget, a steady hand and razor blade is very cheap and easy. If you don't have the confidence that you won't scratch the pcb, go with a delid tool or Silicon Lottery.


----------



## Xgatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> If you're on a tight budget, a steady hand and razor blade is very cheap and easy. If you don't have the confidence that you won't scratch the pcb, go with a delid tool or Silicon Lottery.


Thanks for the quick response. Budget isn't "tight" as such, but it's always nice to save money when it's easy to do so. So exactly how steady of a hand are we talking?


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xgatt*
> 
> Thanks for the quick response. Budget isn't "tight" as such, but it's always nice to save money when it's easy to do so. So exactly how steady of a hand are we talking?


I think the people scratching their PCBs just aren't taking their time with it. As long as you keep the razor parallel to the PCB, you shouldn't scratch it.

I've bought cpus delidded from Silicon Lottery in the past, and they do excellent work. But when I buy the chip from somewhere else I personally just end up delidding it myself.


----------



## Xgatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> I think the people scratching their PCBs just aren't taking their time with it. As long as you keep the razor parallel to the PCB, you shouldn't scratch it.
> 
> I've bought cpus delidded from Silicon Lottery in the past, and they do excellent work. But when I buy the chip from somewhere else I personally just end up delidding it myself.


That does make sense. I will take a short while to think it over and update here what I choose to do. Thanks!


----------



## jdorje

People who use razer a few times swear by it. I do believe that with practice you can do it with complete safety - there's a high skill cap. But the first chip certainly has a risk.

On haswell/ivy, the vice only method is completely safe and cheap.

On skylake you can't use vice method. A 3d delid tool is the way, also safe and not too expensive. Surely there should be used ones to be had for barely over the price of shipping.

SL delid at $50+shipping is quite costly by comparison. They also relid which is probably undesirable. However compared to the benefits of a $50 cooler upgrade it's still extremely cost effective.


----------



## Xgatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> People who use razer a few times swear by it. I do believe that with practice you can do it with complete safety - there's a high skill cap. But the first chip certainly has a risk.
> 
> On haswell/ivy, the vice only method is completely safe and cheap.
> 
> On skylake you can't use vice method. A 3d delid tool is the way, also safe and not too expensive. Surely there should be used ones to be had for barely over the price of shipping.
> 
> SL delid at $50+shipping is quite costly by comparison. They also relid which is probably undesirable. However compared to the benefits of a $50 cooler upgrade it's still extremely cost effective.


Thanks for the input. So what I gather from this is that for the first delid, especially with Skylake, it's better to get it done or to get a tool. I'll look into buying a cheaper tool. I think the RockItCool one is the best bang for the buck when bought newly, but let me see what else is available.

Also what do you mean by "relid is probably undesirable"? Does it mean you leave the die naked, or does it simply mean you don't glue the IHS back on?


----------



## jdorje

Sorry, i meant the die is glued back on. Almost everyone actually relids so that wasn't the right term.


----------



## Xgatt

Ah okay. So from what I gather, this is the process?

Remove lid using best method (razor or tool)
Clean old TIM from die, pcb, and IHS using 91% isopropyl alcohol and a microfiber cloth
Clean black glue from both pcb and IHS using fingernail
Apply CLU
Put PCB into the mobo socket
Put IHS back on the PCB WITHOUT applying any glue whatsoever, slightly towards the lever
Clamp the lever back down, and the IHS will slide into position towards the center.
Okay about that last step... without glue, won't the IHS grind across the PCB and damage it? Also, won't the sliding motion displace the CLU and smear it slightly, resulting in suboptimal cooling?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xgatt*
> 
> Thanks for the quick response. Budget isn't "tight" as such, but it's always nice to save money when it's easy to do so. So exactly how steady of a hand are we talking?


I recommend a small vice from a store like Menards, they are around 9 bucks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xgatt*
> 
> Ah okay. So from what I gather, this is the process?
> 
> Remove lid using best method (razor or tool)
> Clean old TIM from die, pcb, and IHS using 91% isopropyl alcohol and a microfiber cloth
> Clean black glue from both pcb and IHS using fingernail
> Apply CLU
> Put PCB into the mobo socket
> Put IHS back on the PCB WITHOUT applying any glue whatsoever, slightly towards the lever
> Clamp the lever back down, and the IHS will slide into position towards the center.
> Okay about that last step... without glue, won't the IHS grind across the PCB and damage it? Also, won't the sliding motion displace the CLU and smear it slightly, resulting in suboptimal cooling?


No damage to the PCB. I prefer to hold the IHS while its moving so I can guide it better, just be careful to not push down you you could damage pins. The CLU doesn't necessarily smear, since its a liquid it wants to stay with the remaining liquid.


----------



## Xgatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I recommend a small vice from a store like Menards, they are around 9 bucks.


This is to hold it down while using the razor, right?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No damage to the PCB. I prefer to hold the IHS while its moving so I can guide it better, just be careful to not push down you you could damage pins. The CLU doesn't necessarily smear, since its a liquid it wants to stay with the remaining liquid.


So naked IHS directly on the PCB will not damage it when it moves around... good to hear.


----------



## jdorje

Without regluing, the socket cover holds the ihs in place. But if you remove the cpu from the socket you'll need to remount it with new clu. Naked mount is also fairly effective though not nearly as big a difference as the original delid.

Gluing it back on may be suboptimal because it's removing the original glue that is the most important part of the delid. But a careful job of it could probably do just fine.

I also would not cover the caps on haswell. If you do make sure you have thermally safe material. One chip was reported dead after a year when the expansion/contraction of the material cracked the caps.

I used a credit card to get the glue off. It was surprisingly rewarding - the chip was rather beautiful at the end. Took forever to be meticulous though. But remember you don't want any of the glue lifting up the ihs.

The vice is for the vice method delid. If you use a razor just do it by hand. Don't consider hammer delid. Vice method will crush the pcb on skylake, also no good.


----------



## Xgatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Without regluing, the socket cover holds the ihs in place. But if you remove the cpu from the socket you'll need to remount it with new clu. Naked mount is also fairly effective though not nearly as big a difference as the original delid.
> 
> Gluing it back on may be suboptimal because it's removing the original glue that is the most important part of the delid. But a careful job of it could probably do just fine.
> 
> I also would not cover the caps on haswell. If you do make sure you have thermally safe material. One chip was reported dead after a year when the expansion/contraction of the material cracked the caps.
> 
> I used a credit card to get the glue off. It was surprisingly rewarding - the chip was rather beautiful at the end. Took forever to be meticulous though. But remember you don't want any of the glue lifting up the ihs.
> 
> The vice is for the vice method delid. If you use a razor just do it by hand. Don't consider hammer delid. Vice method will crush the pcb on skylake, also no good.


All right, thanks for the detailed answer. That clears up my question about the regluing. I'll leave it unglued at the end. Since this is skylake that I'm working with, neither a vice nor a hammer is recommended. I'll just need to decide between a razor and a tool at this point. As a first timer, I'm slightly leaning towards getting the tool. I do have PLENTY of razors sitting around though...


----------



## Xgatt

Decided to go with the Rockit 88 tool for simplicity. Thanks for all the suggestions and clarifications so far.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xgatt*
> 
> This is to hold it down while using the razor, right?
> So naked IHS directly on the PCB will not damage it when it moves around... good to hear.


No, the Vice is to do the delidding. When I made this thread it did it with a razor, I just delidded again with a Vice, so much better, and safer.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xgatt*
> 
> All right, thanks for the detailed answer. That clears up my question about the regluing. I'll leave it unglued at the end. Since this is skylake that I'm working with, neither a vice nor a hammer is recommended. I'll just need to decide between a razor and a tool at this point. As a first timer, I'm slightly leaning towards getting the tool. I do have PLENTY of razors sitting around though...


Gotta be careful which razor you use if you go that route.


----------



## Xgatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> No, the Vice is to do the delidding. When I made this thread it did it with a razor, I just delidded again with a Vice, so much better, and safer.


Since I'm on Skylake, vice only is not recommended. I just ordered the Rockit 88 tool instead of the razor. Figured 30 bucks was worth the peace of mind.


----------



## rul3s

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> The CLU doesn't need any time, but it might not be enough on the die, or to much, its always difficult to tell.


Yes, in fact it was a lack of CLU, I've reopened the cpu, added more CLU and now it working like a charm.
Also, I've made a comparative between H80i and Noctua NHU12, they almost perform the same, but H80i goes noisier than Noctua, so I'll return H80i and I'll mantain noctua for the moment.

Now, temps are about 75º with prime95 and 54º with intel xtu stress test.

Thanks all


----------



## nrpeyton

Hi guys,

I'm quite active on overclocking forums and 1080 overclocking forums but new here.

This is my first post.

Can the AMD FX-8350 be delidded and has anyone delidded a GPU?

Thanks.

Nick Peyton


----------



## jdorje

A gpu has no lid and is extremely easy to keep cool.

An 8350 is also very easy to keep cool. Why do you have a 1080 with an 8350?


----------



## nrpeyton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> A gpu has no lid and is extremely easy to keep cool.
> 
> An 8350 is also very easy to keep cool. Why do you have a 1080 with an 8350?


I have a Corsair H80i GT (120mm) 2 fans in push-pull AIO liquid cooler on my CPU. Currently overclocked to 4.8ghz (1.4875v) (from 4ghz) but prime95 maxes temps out in less than 2 minutes.

Why do I have them together? I bought the CPU along with a GTX 980 two years ago and just upgraded the GPU.

The 1080 has doubled my framerate.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> I have a Corsair H80i GT (120mm) 2 fans in push-pull AIO liquid cooler on my CPU. Currently overclocked to 4.8ghz (1.4875v) (from 4ghz) but prime95 maxes temps out in less than 2 minutes.
> 
> Why do I have them together? I bought the CPU along with a GTX 980 two years ago and just upgraded the GPU.
> 
> The 1080 has doubled my framerate.


With normal gaming and usage do you hit max temps? You shouldn't be, at least I hope not.


----------



## jdorje

@nrpeyton you have the cpu rad on intake?


----------



## nrpeyton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> With normal gaming and usage do you hit max temps? You shouldn't be, at least I hope not.


CPU gets to 55c (translates to 75C if I was on Intel) on 'the Witcher 3' with 4.8ghz O/C.

If I try and 'fold' on it temps race up to 70c (translates to 90c if Intel) in under 2 mins.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> @nrpeyton you have the cpu rad on intake?


Push-pull. Hot air being pushed out the top of my 'Corsair 750d case'.

==============================

Thinking of either going for a 'EK-PE360 Kit' or grabbing something with a bigger radiator but then I'd have to mount it outside the case somehow.

I want to be able to do the most extreme o/c possible without LN2.

Don't care too much if CPU only lasts another 12 months because ZEN is coming out soon anyway and its time for an upgrade. Like most people the custom loop upgrade is just for fun and asthetics.

Also thinking of getting a water-chiller -- again just for fun.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> CPU gets to 55c (translates to 75C if I was on Intel) on 'the Witcher 3' with 4.8ghz O/C.
> 
> If I try and 'fold' on it temps race up to 70c (translates to 90c if Intel) in under 2 mins.
> Push-pull. Hot air being pushed out the top of my 'Corsair 750d case'.
> 
> Thinking of either going for a 'EK-PE360 Kit' or grabbing something with a bigger radiator but then I'd have to mount it outside the case somehow.
> 
> I want to be able to do the most extreme o/c possible without LN2.


I'm not quite sure on that honestly..... is the pump dying? Those temps are kind of scary with an H80 latched on. Have you tried a different TIM? My first recommendation would be to lower your OC, thats a lot of juice there.


----------



## nrpeyton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I'm not quite sure on that honestly..... is the pump dying? Those temps are kind of scary with an H80 latched on. Have you tried a different TIM? My first recommendation would be to lower your OC, thats a lot of juice there.


I can get my watt meter to show nearly 500w on the CPU is i overclock it even a little bit further.. thats unbelievable for a 125w TDP chip lol.... so I'm not surprised temps are soo high. I've tried re-appling tim before and temps are the same. Idle is also fine. If I turn the heating off and leave all the windows open (18c ambient) I can get the CPU temp down to 30c IDLE. at this O/C but obviously it jumps up as soon as I prime95.


----------



## jdorje

If the rad is exhaust you should expect temps 10-20c hotter. No reason to waste time until you switch it.


----------



## nrpeyton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> If the rad is exhaust you should expect temps 10-20c hotter. No reason to waste time until you switch it.


So I should have the fans on the radiator pulling air into the case through the radiator?

That never occured to me.. I always assumed it should be exhausting the hot air outside the case.

I also have 2 140mm fans on the front of the case and a 120mm fan on the bottom pulling cold air into the case.

Also pump RPM is fine.

Makes sense now that I think about it -- since the air isn't actually *that* much hotter on the other side of the radiator. But won't that make my GPU run hotter? unless its also on water?


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> Push-pull. Hot air being pushed out the top of my 'Corsair 750d case'..


You said that already. You need to switch it to (front) intake if you want reasonable temps. Blowing the GPU heat through a 120mm radiator is a nonstarter.

You'll note I also have an h80i.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Thank you Valgaur for adding submissions to the list. Very appreciated!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZmheiN4XOtqyuljGGHg4LR8UOsIW6Nby16QcSmQYCl0/pub?hl=en_GB&hl=en_GB&output=html


----------



## Ovrclck

So I've been delidded for a few years now. Tonight I decided to start over and re-do my overclock and I noticed some of the cores were way out there in terms of consistency.

Full load



Would my temps be more consistent if I were to go bareback? I think my IHS is the issue.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

They will always be off a little bit even bare die. But using bare die will bring the difference a lot closer in most cases.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> They will always be off a little bit even bare die. But using bare die will bring the difference a lot closer in most cases.


OK cool! Is the Noctua NT-H1 paste still the go to for bare die?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Yep that's good stuff. Has a low flash point and no cure/burn in time.

You do want to spread the die with paste. Do not do a line dot or dash x ect. Cover the entire thing.

Also will likely remove the retention bracket from the motherboard and also some sort of custom mounting to have proper pressure.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Yep that's good stuff. Has a low flash point and no cure/burn in time.
> 
> You do want to spread the die with paste. Do not do a line dot or dash x ect. Cover the entire thing.
> 
> Also will likely remove the retention bracket from the motherboard and also some sort of custom mounting to have proper pressure.


Sounds good! I'm planning on obtaining an ek supremacy precisemount. I think that should be it.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> OK cool! Is the Noctua NT-H1 paste still the go to for bare die?


It is not and far from it.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Yep that's good stuff. Has a low flash point and no cure/burn in time.
> 
> You do want to spread the die with paste. Do not do a line dot or dash x ect. Cover the entire thing.
> 
> Also will likely remove the retention bracket from the motherboard and also some sort of custom mounting to have proper pressure.


False for the TIM.

I will repeat this one last time for people who are actually running bare die, any TIM is going to be useless on bare die, PERIOD. This has been tested and proven and please stop arguing with me, ive tested this over a 2month period with at least a dozen TIMs and the problem is the same for MOST of em. They will pump out, your temps will suck and youll need to repaste WEEKLY.

Im running bare die and i have a difference of 5°C between my coolest core and hottest core. I ended up with the same when i delided.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> Sounds good! I'm planning on obtaining an ek supremacy precisemount. I think that should be it.


You can try deliding it, applying CLU on the die the Noctua on the IHS. Will solve your core issue, my guess is either the paste has gone to hell or it was a poor sample to begin with. A 22°C difference between cores is quite huge, either your voltages are off on some cores or needs a good delid and repasting.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> It is not and far from it.
> False for the TIM.
> 
> I will repeat this one last time for people who are actually running bare die, any TIM is going to be useless on bare die, PERIOD. This has been tested and proven and please stop arguing with me, ive tested this over a 2month period with at least a dozen TIMs and the problem is the same for MOST of em. They will pump out, your temps will suck and youll need to repaste WEEKLY.
> 
> Im running bare die and i have a difference of 5°C between my coolest core and hottest core. I ended up with the same when i delided.
> You can try deliding it, applying CLU on the die the Noctua on the IHS. Will solve your core issue, my guess is either the paste has gone to hell or it was a poor sample to begin with. A 22°C difference between cores is quite huge, either your voltages are off on some cores or needs a good delid and repasting.


I'm already delidded with CLU/Noctua combo.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> I'm already delidded with CLU/Noctua combo.


Yea definitely DON'T use Noctua on the die youll regret it. My guess? Bad clu application, its why the cores have such a big difference. The cores actually sit on one side of the die, the rest is the memory controller and igpu.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> OK cool! Is the Noctua NT-H1 paste still the go to for bare die?
> 
> 
> 
> It is not and far from it.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Yep that's good stuff. Has a low flash point and no cure/burn in time.
> 
> You do want to spread the die with paste. Do not do a line dot or dash x ect. Cover the entire thing.
> 
> Also will likely remove the retention bracket from the motherboard and also some sort of custom mounting to have proper pressure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> False for the TIM.
> 
> I will repeat this one last time for people who are actually running bare die, any TIM is going to be useless on bare die, PERIOD. This has been tested and proven and please stop arguing with me, ive tested this over a 2month period with at least a dozen TIMs and the problem is the same for MOST of em. They will pump out, your temps will suck and youll need to repaste WEEKLY.
> 
> Im running bare die and i have a difference of 5°C between my coolest core and hottest core. I ended up with the same when i delided.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> Sounds good! I'm planning on obtaining an ek supremacy precisemount. I think that should be it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can try deliding it, applying CLU on the die the Noctua on the IHS. Will solve your core issue, my guess is either the paste has gone to hell or it was a poor sample to begin with. A 22°C difference between cores is quite huge, either your voltages are off on some cores or needs a good delid and repasting.
Click to expand...

Ok not to argue but get facts.

You tried 12 pastes in 2 months time.

Is there a comparison chart for all the pastes you tried and load temp screen shots.?

Also I dony fully get this post above. You start off by saying dont use the paste then down lower you say to use the paste.

Not trying to argue, but I missed something I think. I missed many of your past posts in regards to the statement to not use paste..... I dunno. Some one help me here.

I guess the statement that TIM is useless on bare die...... Throws me off a little. Thermal Interface Material is all Ive ever used running naked and that does include nano diamond.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Ok not to argue but get facts.
> 
> You tried 12 pastes in 2 months time.
> 
> Is there a comparison chart for all the pastes you tried and load temp screen shots.?
> 
> Also I dony fully get this post above. You start off by saying dont use the paste then down lower you say to use the paste.
> 
> Not trying to argue, but I missed something I think. I missed many of your past posts in regards to the statement to not use paste..... I dunno. Some one help me here.
> 
> I guess the statement that TIM is useless on bare die...... Throws me off a little. Thermal Interface Material is all Ive ever used running naked and that does include nano diamond.


Yea but from what ive read from your posts on here you mostly deal with AMD bare die and haven't done it much on intel. If i'm wrong correct me.

You can ask anyone in this thread whose used TIM on the die how long it lasts, 99% will tell you it doesnt. Someone mentioned i believe only one TIM that actually lasts on bare die and doesn't break down.

I told him to use paste on the IHS if he's not going bare die. For me Hydronaut/Kryonaut/NH-T1 all had IDENTICAL temps to CLU, problem is, as ive stated way too many times before it will break down within days and temps will go from (in my case) 47°C to 54°C within a matter of 2 days.

Lets put it simply, there's a reason everyone who delids uses CLU on the die then a TIM on the IHS, its not because CLU performs better (in most cases you don't gain much if anything) its because it lasts. And yes i know you've delided a lot of AMD cpus but unless youve actually tried TIM on a bare die i5 or i7 i can't help you.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea definitely DON'T use Noctua on the die youll regret it. My guess? Bad clu application, its why the cores have such a big difference. The cores actually sit on one side of the die, the rest is the memory controller and igpu.


What are you current temps bare die with no TIM running full load?

I hate working with CLU. I had a bad experience with that stuff.. Accidentally got some in between the memory slot and had to painstakingly remove it with a toothpick lol

Could be that when I originally clamped the block on, I moved the IHS a bit in the process.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> What are you current temps bare die with no TIM running full load?
> 
> I hate working with CLU. I had a bad experience with that stuff.. Accidentally got some in between the memory slot and had to painstakingly remove it with a toothpick lol
> 
> Could be that when I originally clamped the block on, I moved the IHS a bit in the process.


That could easily be the case. I've found CLU pretty easy but wouldn't ever use it anywhere but between the die and IHS anyway... that being said I've had to do a few reapplications on a couple of CPUs due to sliding when mounting. In most cases (I think at any rate - can't see under the IHS to be 100%) this has more to do with it opening up a void in the CLU. Probably has most to do with the fact that on those CPUs the IHS was a little more 'scuffed' from getting off the residual TIM from Intel... the scratches in the IHS act a little like a 'broom' if it slides sideways or rotates at all during mounting... which pushes the CLU off the die (or to the edges at least).

In every case I didn't actually need to _add_ any more CLU... just wick it up with the brush I use and reapply it to the middle of the die. Once I get a good 'centering' with the IHS so that it doesn't need more than a tiny (~.5mm) adjustment for the bracket to fit properly... the temps are perfect almost indefinitely.

My second 3770K from this thread has gone ~4 years with the same application of CLU on the die. Everytime I move it or break down everything for cleaning I just pull the block and then use solvent to get the TIM off the outside of the IHS and reapply new TIM on it when the block goes on... temps haven't varied at all and the cores are all still within 3-4C of each other under load and 1C at idle.

EDIT: Not scientific at all, but I feel very superstitious about my mount on that CPU... so I'm determined to never open the socket again unless the temps go crazy.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> What are you current temps bare die with no TIM running full load?
> 
> I hate working with CLU. I had a bad experience with that stuff.. Accidentally got some in between the memory slot and had to painstakingly remove it with a toothpick lol
> 
> Could be that when I originally clamped the block on, I moved the IHS a bit in the process.


Oh i run CLU i don't run no TIM/LM haha. Im at 49°C in an ambient of about 24-25°C, and about 46°C ambient of 21°C. This is at 1.21v on a 4690k.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> That could easily be the case. I've found CLU pretty easy but wouldn't ever use it anywhere but between the die and IHS anyway... that being said I've had to do a few reapplications on a couple of CPUs due to sliding when mounting. In most cases (I think at any rate - can't see under the IHS to be 100%) this has more to do with it opening up a void in the CLU. Probably has most to do with the fact that on those CPUs the IHS was a little more 'scuffed' from getting off the residual TIM from Intel... the scratches in the IHS act a little like a 'broom' if it slides sideways or rotates at all during mounting... which pushes the CLU off the die (or to the edges at least).
> 
> In every case I didn't actually need to _add_ any more CLU... just wick it up with the brush I use and reapply it to the middle of the die. Once I get a good 'centering' with the IHS so that it doesn't need more than a tiny (~.5mm) adjustment for the bracket to fit properly... the temps are perfect almost indefinitely.
> 
> My second 3770K from this thread has gone ~4 years with the same application of CLU on the die. Everytime I move it or break down everything for cleaning I just pull the block and then use solvent to get the TIM off the outside of the IHS and reapply new TIM on it when the block goes on... temps haven't varied at all and the cores are all still within 3-4C of each other under load and 1C at idle.
> 
> EDIT: Not scientific at all, but I feel very superstitious about my mount on that CPU... so I'm determined to never open the socket again unless the temps go crazy.


So I understand correctly. I don't necessarily have to clean off the current application of CLU, just wick it up and reapply?

I haven't touched my setup in 2 years, that's the one thing I hate doing is messing with the CPU lol. At the time, if I remember correctly, I was freaking out on how much pressure I was to put on with regards to mounting of the block and redid it a few times (just loosening,tightening). That could have been it also.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Oh i run CLU i don't run no TIM/LM haha. Im at 49°C in an ambient of about 24-25°C, and about 46°C ambient of 21°C. This is at 1.21v on a 4690k.


Oh ok! For some reason, I thought you were not running anything in between the die and block!


----------



## deepor

There's a chance that the CLU you've originally applied is still completely fluid. In that case, you can just use the brush on it to make sure it's spread out nicely before closing things up again. Add something if you think it's not enough CLU anymore after the work as the brush will pick some of it up.

If you find clumps in it, you'll want to clean it all off and renew it completely.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> So I understand correctly. I don't necessarily have to clean off the current application of CLU, just wick it up and reapply?
> 
> I haven't touched my setup in 2 years, that's the one thing I hate doing is messing with the CPU lol. At the time, if I remember correctly, I was freaking out on how much pressure I was to put on with regards to mounting of the block and redid it a few times (just loosening,tightening). That could have been it also.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh ok! For some reason, I thought you were not running anything in between the die and block!


No no im not suicidal haha. I did find that my first application usually gives me bad temps going bare die. The pressure on the die isn't as even as id like (tested it with pressure paper) so i usually have to add another very thin layer and it works beautifully.

I do have a very restrictive GPU block so might add to the 47°C im seeing, on the other hand my gpu is at 40°C in the same ambient temp.


----------



## jdorje

22c difference in cores means something is very, very wrong. If remounting the cooler doesn't help then remounting the ihs should. No need for naked mount to keep cores within 5c.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> 22c difference in cores means something is very, very wrong. If remounting the cooler doesn't help then remounting the ihs should. No need for naked mount to keep cores within 5c.


Looks like I know what I'm doing this weekend then.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Correct me if Im wrong here.

CLU is a Thermal Interface Material right?

What makes it different from other TIM?


----------



## deepor

Yeah, you are technically right. It's just people not using the name super correct. You need to look at the context surrounding its use in a post to guess what's meant exactly.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Correct me if Im wrong here.
> 
> CLU is a Thermal Interface Material right?
> 
> What makes it different from other TIM?


Wait is that a joke question lol?

CLU isn't a TIM, Coollaboratory Ulta/Pro are liquid metals. They don't pump out, they have a thermal rating of 36+ w/mK compared to TIMs that are 12-13w/mK and below and the biggest difference, they last without ever needing to be reapplied.

As i've said before theres a reason for the past 5 years or so anyone who delids uses that on the die. Not because it gives better temps but because its unbelievably durable compared to a paste.


----------



## deepor

No, a "TIM = thermal interface material" can be technically anything you want. It could be mayonnaise. You'd write something like "here in the following graph, I am showing experiments I made using different TIMs". And then in the labeling in your graph you'd have "CLU" and "NT-H1" etc., and the "mayonnaise" experiment, and perhaps having a label "air" might also be technically correct for a test without anything?


----------



## 0ldChicken

I agree, TIM is anything used in that sense. Be it metal or mayo lol.
Also nt-h1 shan't be used on die, unless you like changing TIM every week. I do think that it varies with voltage and die size though


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I agree, TIM is anything used in that sense. Be it metal or mayo lol.


( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Correct me if Im wrong here.
> 
> CLU is a Thermal Interface Material right?
> 
> What makes it different from other TIM?
> 
> 
> 
> Wait is that a joke question lol?
> 
> CLU isn't a TIM, Coollaboratory Ulta/Pro are liquid metals. They don't pump out, they have a thermal rating of 36+ w/mK compared to TIMs that are 12-13w/mK and below and the biggest difference, they last without ever needing to be reapplied.
> 
> As i've said before theres a reason for the past 5 years or so anyone who delids uses that on the die. Not because it gives better temps but because its unbelievably durable compared to a paste.
Click to expand...

No I was asking what makes it different from traditional pastes?

Any how I see you mention pump out. From what I researched this is because a thin even spread across the entire IHS plate is used. Doesn't this type of application prove to be frowned at because of the possibility of trapping air bubbles? So we use normal pastes or TIM as you call it, with a line or pea/dot in the middle to actually produce a pump out for coverage.....

I'm not asking any "joking" questions. I've never used it or had the need to use it.

Yes to answer your question. I've de-lidded many AMD processors and ran direct Die cooling. A little pump out is normal procedure.

Another question is while using this CLU, is there a chance to get this stuff in places where it could do harm? It is metal, so I imagine it carries current. Should there be special care in handling this CLU thermal interface material?

I'm asking all this because I'm extremely curious. I also like the basic pastes that don't have metals so if I'm being careless enough, there's no need for worries.

I just want to have good factual information before using this type of all metal thermal interface material.


----------



## jdorje

Liquid metal is just that: metal. Like mercury.

It's not used more often because it's conductive and requires care. And because it will eat aluminum ("galium induced structural failure").


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Hi!

Currently having a temp issue.

Running 4400 at 1.125V and the temps are in the 60s in a cold room. D5 pump (100% speed) XTX360 p/p and XT240 p. Fans are Eloops running at 1400 RPM. Block is mounted correctly, testet several times with a new remount. If I try 1,300V and instant 85-90'C...

The temps are insane high, right?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> No I was asking what makes it different from traditional pastes?
> 
> Any how I see you mention pump out. From what I researched this is because a thin even spread across the entire IHS plate is used. Doesn't this type of application prove to be frowned at because of the possibility of trapping air bubbles? So we use normal pastes or TIM as you call it, with a line or pea/dot in the middle to actually produce a pump out for coverage.....
> 
> I'm not asking any "joking" questions. I've never used it or had the need to use it.
> 
> Yes to answer your question. I've de-lidded many AMD processors and ran direct Die cooling. A little pump out is normal procedure.
> 
> Another question is while using this CLU, is there a chance to get this stuff in places where it could do harm? It is metal, so I imagine it carries current. Should there be special care in handling this CLU thermal interface material?
> 
> I'm asking all this because I'm extremely curious. I also like the basic pastes that don't have metals so if I'm being careless enough, there's no need for worries.
> 
> I just want to have good factual information before using this type of all metal thermal interface material.


Fair enough and there lies the difference between AMD and intel for direct die cooling.

And everyone who considers liquid metal to be a TIM its technically incorrect. It's a metal, just like any metal it has way better thermal efficiency then a paste. Mayo can be considered a TIM but you're comparing apple to oranges.

You absolutely can get it in wrong places but thats why i apply it far away from my pc then install it and put the block on. Ive not had a drop go anywhere it shouldnt and its been fine and have done it bare die to two CPUs.

Everyone keeps talking about the IHS but we are talking about ON THE DIE. Pump out on the IHS happens but not to a critical point. Possibly because the IHS is WAY bigger and less hot then the bare die itself. Oldchicken is another person who knows and has tried.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I agree, TIM is anything used in that sense. Be it metal or mayo lol.
> Also nt-h1 shan't be used on die, unless you like changing TIM every week. I do think that it varies with voltage and die size though


I'm not sure if its the added pressure on the die that makes it pump out very fast or if its because its the direct heated application that causes it to pump out. Don't forget that the temps we're getting to monitor are CORE temps, we have no idea how hot the actual top of the die is getting.

And btw ive tested it with pressure paper, the middle of the die (in my case and only in my case) had very LOW pressure while the horizontal edges had quite a lot. This would rule out pressure as being the issue of the pump out. My guess is, TIMs just can't handle the direct heat.

Oh and P.S. On my moms spare HP, i delided the 3350p just for the hell of it. I use Hydronaut on the die then NH-T1 on the IHS and have had ZERO pump out, my guess is, definitely has to do with the wattage of the chip. 4690k is 88w tdp the 3350p is around 35w tdp i believe.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Not sure if it really matters in most cases, but I've found the best way to assure a good transfer with the CLU is to always apply it to the die in a decent but still thin amount, and then apply about 1/3 that amount to the area on the underside of the IHS (which is usually discolored by the factory TIM job). In my case I just use whatever is still stuck in the brush and wipe it off on the lid.

Though again, not scientific, as it could easily be coincidence... but my temps have been much better _after the very first mounting_ since I started doing that every time. Maybe I've gotten better at applying the CLU, maybe I've had better luck in the lottery, and maybe the CLU does provides a better bond that way - plus you can tell if there are pits/bubbles on both applications and deal with them prior to mounting the IHS. Obviously the CLU to CLU interface will be perfect with only a tiny amount of pressure as they will simply flow together.

Anyway it's in numerous posts here, but that step is easy to ignore... but at least in my case it seems to be somewhat important to a good application of CLU.









I forget exactly what my delta difference was on my current CPU but I'm thinking it was in the order of 15-20C so far from insignificant.

FOUND IT - but that's not this CPU - that's my 'bad' 3770K and it was still a huge difference. The one in my 5GHz system is much cooler and takes far, far less voltage.


----------



## deepor

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> No I was asking what makes it different from traditional pastes?
> 
> Any how I see you mention pump out. From what I researched this is because a thin even spread across the entire IHS plate is used. Doesn't this type of application prove to be frowned at because of the possibility of trapping air bubbles? So we use normal pastes or TIM as you call it, with a line or pea/dot in the middle to actually produce a pump out for coverage.....
> 
> I'm not asking any "joking" questions. I've never used it or had the need to use it.
> 
> Yes to answer your question. I've de-lidded many AMD processors and ran direct Die cooling. A little pump out is normal procedure.
> 
> Another question is while using this CLU, is there a chance to get this stuff in places where it could do harm? It is metal, so I imagine it carries current. Should there be special care in handling this CLU thermal interface material?
> 
> I'm asking all this because I'm extremely curious. I also like the basic pastes that don't have metals so if I'm being careless enough, there's no need for worries.
> 
> I just want to have good factual information before using this type of all metal thermal interface material.


That thin spread you do with CLU is because you cannot use CLU in any other way. It's not possible to use the pea-method with it. If you leave it in a bubble without spreading it, it will absolutely not behave like a normal paste and will not cover the area fully.

I don't know what happens with regards to air bubbles. What's interesting is that it doesn't look like an even spread on top of a surface after you've spread it with a brush or q-tip. The surface doesn't look like a mirror and has a texture. It will look like it has some sort of bubbles in it, like frothy milk or something. I don't know why it works fine despite that.

If you want to try it, I heard of three products that are on the market that seem to be similar:

Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
Phobya Liquid Metal

The CLU guys also have "CLP" = CL "Pro" which was their first version. It hardens over time and can only be removed by scratching if off with something like sand paper when that happens.

You need to know that those products must not get into contact with aluminium. The LM starts getting absorbed into the aluminium and seems to move around inside it. The aluminium changes and gets brittle, like iron rust. You can take a look at what happens on Youtube searching for "gallium aluminium". It's pretty spectacular.

About it possibly shortening something, I remember I once worked with it and later found a tiny bubble in a random spot on the desk where I could not explain how it got there. This is a bit scary. It could have happened inside the case and I could have gotten unlucky.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Just a bit of a clu/lm safety note, since that seems to be the topic of discussion.

Be careful about what is in the background while squeezing your syringe. I've had it jet out across the room a couple times, due to very small amounts of pressure. It's a pain to clean off the floor... I can't imagine how difficult it is to remove from a mobo/gpu etc


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Just a bit of a clu/lm safety note, since that seems to be the topic of discussion.
> 
> Be careful about what is in the background while squeezing your syringe. I've had it jet out across the room a couple times, due to very small amounts of pressure. It's a pain to clean off the floor... I can't imagine how difficult it is to remove from a mobo/gpu etc


That's why I use a secondary container - pretty much for anything with viscosity low enough to not go _exactly_ where I want it. With the CLU I just used the blister plastic for the syringe. A small amount in there and then scooped it up in the brush to apply. Granted you lose a little that way but better there than all over the desk or motherboard.


----------



## Ovrclck

What's the best way to remove CLU from the die? Paper towel, then a pass with 99% alcohol?

I'm preparing for this weekend just in case I have to redo anything.


----------



## jdorje

Does alcohol do anything with clu? Seems like it'd be useless. Just use the sponge thing that came with the clu, or coffee filters, to get it up. Err then i guess you do want alcohol at the end to pick up grease.

My question is, can clu be reused? IF i remove the ihs i have clu on top and bottom. Do i even need to clean it off at all? Won't it be sitting there just like new?


----------



## deepor

The sponge thing that comes with CLU is metal wire. It will scratch things up, for example destroy the writing on top of the IHS. I think I read somewhere that this metal wire sponge thingy is in the package for when you had earlier used CLP and are now replacing it with CLU. It's there so you can scratch hardened CLP off.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> Does alcohol do anything with clu? Seems like it'd be useless. Just use the sponge thing that came with the clu, or coffee filters, to get it up. Err then i guess you do want alcohol at the end to pick up grease.
> 
> My question is, can clu be reused? IF i remove the ihs i have clu on top and bottom. Do i even need to clean it off at all? Won't it be sitting there just like new?


Depends on age and condition, but yes. I pulled one of my delids recently after about 3 years and it was still exactly as new... however removing the IHS disturbed the coating (obviously) so you will need to resmooth it and possibly add a little bit if necessary.


----------



## Ovrclck

So I searched this thread and found my posts from 13'..

Looks like I used CLP instead of CLU.









What was I thinking? lol
Hopefully it won't be too hard to get all that stuff off.



P.S. can I finally be added to the delidded crew?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> So I searched this thread and found my posts from 13'..
> 
> Looks like I used CLP instead of CLU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What was I thinking? lol
> Hopefully it won't be too hard to get all that stuff off.
> 
> 
> 
> P.S. can I finally be added to the delidded crew?


Can I haz your info requested fro the OP? Can I haz cheezeburger?


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Can I haz your info requested fro the OP? Can I haz cheezeburger?


Soon ™

Give me a week to produce some solid numbers.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> Soon ™
> 
> Give me a week to produce some solid numbers.


Soon TM I know that pain..... Blizz please.... Diablo news.....I'm desperate


----------



## ShrimpBrime

I gotta thank you fellas for the information and experiences with CLU.

So let me cap to be sure.

Intel runs a higher TDP, so most pastes are no good with pump out and boiling point issues. So with my AMD chips, I always goal a minimum running temperature of less than 50c. With these Intel chips we focus on a much higher temperature.

It's really curious that it (CLU) doesn't "flatten" out or get smooth even after use.

Does any one recommend to try CLU on AMD processors? (I suppose this is a dumb question lol)

But again thank you.


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> I gotta thank you fellas for the information and experiences with CLU.
> 
> So let me cap to be sure.
> 
> Intel runs a higher TDP, so most pastes are no good with pump out and boiling point issues. So with my AMD chips, I always goal a minimum running temperature of less than 50c. With these Intel chips we focus on a much higher temperature.
> 
> It's really curious that it (CLU) doesn't "flatten" out or get smooth even after use.
> 
> Does any one recommend to try CLU on AMD processors? (I suppose this is a dumb question lol)
> 
> But again thank you.


You certainly can, but it doesn't produce the same results, since AMD still solders their IHS onto the processor.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> You certainly can, but it doesn't produce the same results, since AMD still solders their IHS onto the processor.


Well no, I mean yes they do.... but I run mine naked. Last one successful de-lid was the FX-9590. But have always used conventional pastes, not the liquid metal CLU paste these guys are using. So I'm learning about it...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Well no, I mean yes they do.... but I run mine naked. Last one successful de-lid was the FX-9590. But have always used conventional pastes, not the liquid metal CLU paste these guys are using. So I'm learning about it...


You could try it to see what happens, i bet theres zero chance of it getting into the cpu socket either since amd uses way better mounting then Intel does.

And i don't think its a TDP issue since AMDs TDP is actually higher then intels haha. Might be more along the lines of idk, AMD still uses 32nm while Intel is at 22-14 already. Same TDP, more compact die, more heat in a concentrated area. Its probably also why skylake runs hotter then haswell.

For example my 4690k at 1.21v on water bare die runs at 47°C in an ambient of 21-22°C, meanwhile on air at 1.088v i was running at 54°C.

Its worth trying but from my experience with my chip, between CLU and top pastes you won't see any difference.


----------



## Benjiw

Anyone running a skylake chip naked yet? I got my 6700k and wanting to know before taking a dremel to things...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Anyone running a skylake chip naked yet? I got my 6700k and wanting to know before taking a dremel to things...


Haven't seen it yet. Do it Benji be the first lol, just make sure to get that shim from aquacomputer. Pretty much just get a straight edge across the cpu corners, measure the gap between the die and straight edge then shave that amount from the cpu socket. Boom done deal.


----------



## ShortySmalls

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Anyone running a skylake chip naked yet? I got my 6700k and wanting to know before taking a dremel to things...


I tried to run die to block on my last 6700k, don't see the need for a Dremel though? I just took the 3 screws out on the retention bracket and put my waterblock on.

It didn't work, but then again it didn't work when i put the IHS back on either my delid attempt killed me chip lol, had to buy another 6700k. RIP 6700k 1 month old


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShortySmalls*
> 
> I tried to run die to block on my last 6700k, don't see the need for a Dremel though? I just took the 3 screws out on the retention bracket and put my waterblock on.
> 
> It didn't work, but then again it didn't work when i put the IHS back on either my delid attempt killed me chip lol, had to buy another 6700k. RIP 6700k 1 month old


Because the waterblock won't touch the die and therefore it won't work to begin with haha. The IHS is thicker on skylake then haswell, the pcb is thinner therefore it sits lower down into the socket. The sockets are the same as the 1150 with just 1 more pin, the waterblock would sit on the socket without making any contact with the die.


----------



## ShortySmalls

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Because the waterblock won't touch the die and therefore it won't work to begin with haha. The IHS is thicker on skylake then haswell, the pcb is thinner therefore it sits lower down into the socket. The sockets are the same as the 1150 with just 1 more pin, the waterblock would sit on the socket without making any contact with the die.


Seemed to of sat on my die just fine, it spread out the thermal paste and everything. Block can be screwed down as far as you want just a screw through the PCB and a nut on the top to tighten. chip was dead either way


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShortySmalls*
> 
> Seemed to of sat on my die just fine, it spread out the thermal paste and everything. Block can be screwed down as far as you want just a screw through the PCB and a nut on the top to tighten. chip was dead either way


Doesnt take much pressure to spread out thermal paste lol. I'm shocked it worked to be honest.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShortySmalls*
> 
> Seemed to of sat on my die just fine, it spread out the thermal paste and everything. Block can be screwed down as far as you want just a screw through the PCB and a nut on the top to tighten. chip was dead either way


There is 0.4mm difference in die height due to the thinner PCB so I highly doubt you put enough pressure on the chip for it to work well enough, some motherboards have high socket walls so you need to reduce the height or use a spacer of 0.4mm thinkness or so.


----------



## Lerog

Hello,
Today I diced to delid I76700K.

My setup:
CPU: I7 6700K Skylake
GPU: ZOTAC 1080 AMP EXTREME
MOBO : ASROCK Z170 Gaming K6+
Ram: 16 GB DDR4
Cooling : Alphacool NexXxoS Cool Answer 360 D5/XT
thermal paste:On DIE CLU, On IHS Gelid GC-Extreme
Test method : stress test in Prime 95 at least 2h, OCCT test 1h.
OC : 4,6GHZ Stable 1,335 Vcore rest setting auto.
temp before delid : Max 81C
temps after delid : Max 71C

Those setting are for 24/7 use. Will check how it looks in Some games. and let you know.
What you think guys? Those temps are ok? I'm sure that I cen go higher OC for sure.


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lerog*
> 
> Hello,
> Today I diced to delid I76700K.
> 
> My setup:
> CPU: I7 6700K Skylake
> GPU: ZOTAC 1080 AMP EXTREME
> MOBO : ASROCK Z170 Gaming K6+
> Ram: 16 GB DDR4
> Cooling : Alphacool NexXxoS Cool Answer 360 D5/XT
> thermal paste:On DIE CLU, On IHS Gelid GC-Extreme
> Test method : stress test in Prime 95 at least 2h, OCCT test 1h.
> OC : 4,6GHZ Stable 1,335 Vcore rest setting auto.
> temp before delid : Max 81C
> temps after delid : Max 71C
> 
> Those setting are for 24/7 use. Will check how it looks in Some games. and let you know.
> What you think guys? Those temps are ok? I'm sure that I cen go higher OC for sure.


Temps look _fantastic_, though I'm not sure what we are considering stable with Skylake. Is the general consensus still 12 hours prime, anyone?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Temps look _fantastic_, though I'm not sure what we are considering stable with Skylake. Is the general consensus still 12 hours prime, anyone?


Stable is when you have your OC set and your computer doesn't BSOD/restart/shutdown after an entire day of being used. I'll never understand the fascination of using prime for 12hrs and degrading your CPU for 12hrs straight at full voltage and full usage.

I use the intel extreme utility stress test for an hr, if its stable and then stable while gaming or all day usage then its stable. And guess what, ive OCed 2 4690ks and both have been stable with the same method.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Stable is when you have your OC set and your computer doesn't BSOD/restart/shutdown after an entire day of being used. I'll never understand the fascination of using prime for 12hrs and degrading your CPU for 12hrs straight at full voltage and full usage.
> 
> I use the intel extreme utility stress test for an hr, if its stable and then stable while gaming or all day usage then its stable. And guess what, ive OCed 2 4690ks and both have been stable with the same method.


You can still run an OC for 24hours and it not be stable. I'd rather it pass a stress test and then I know its 90% of the way there.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lerog*
> 
> Hello,
> Today I diced to delid I76700K.
> 
> My setup:
> CPU: I7 6700K Skylake
> GPU: ZOTAC 1080 AMP EXTREME
> MOBO : ASROCK Z170 Gaming K6+
> Ram: 16 GB DDR4
> Cooling : Alphacool NexXxoS Cool Answer 360 D5/XT
> thermal paste:On DIE CLU, On IHS Gelid GC-Extreme
> Test method : stress test in Prime 95 at least 2h, OCCT test 1h.
> OC : 4,6GHZ Stable 1,335 Vcore rest setting auto.
> temp before delid : Max 81C
> temps after delid : Max 71C
> 
> Those setting are for 24/7 use. Will check how it looks in Some games. and let you know.
> What you think guys? Those temps are ok? I'm sure that I cen go higher OC for sure.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Stable is when you have your OC set and your computer doesn't BSOD/restart/shutdown after an entire day of being used. I'll never understand the fascination of using prime for 12hrs and degrading your CPU for 12hrs straight at full voltage and full usage.
> 
> I use the intel extreme utility stress test for an hr, if its stable and then stable while gaming or all day usage then its stable. And guess what, ive OCed 2 4690ks and both have been stable with the same method.


Sounds like you agree with me that it's overkill.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Sounds like you agree with me that it's overkill.


Totally overkill.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Temps look _fantastic_, though I'm not sure what we are considering stable with Skylake. Is the general consensus still 12 hours prime, anyone?


Prime is good for an indication
Personally I found looking at the Administrator Event Viewer for WHEA errors they self corrected and can be a sign of instability.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1317335/whea-error-alert-guide-or-how-i-got-out-of-wheaville/0_20
I used to get then when I was running [email protected] 24/7 just had the odd instability sign but never any BSOD or black screen hangs but plenty of WHEA errors,
Running 4.8 @ 1.35v now no WHEA errors and no sign of instability the extra 200Mhz was not worth the squeeze only in some benchmarks did I see a slight improvement, but not a full scalable 200Mhz


----------



## Lerog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Well today, I have Oc it on 4,7GHZ wit 1,360 Volts. I just repasted it, and gues what? MAX temp : 69C Taaa Daam!


----------



## anker020

Nice temps,


----------



## jdorje

The general consensus has never been 12 hours prime.

I just do 8 loops of x264 these days. If it passes that it won't ever have problems in gaming.

p95 279 is reasonable temps but never crashes. 287 is not reasonable temps (100C+).


----------



## Arctucas

DELETED.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lerog*
> 
> Well today, I have Oc it on 4,7GHZ wit 1,360 Volts. I just repasted it, and gues what? MAX temp : 69C Taaa Daam!


Please forgive my ignorance, I do not read Polish.

What test are you running in OCCT?

Thanks


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Totally overkill.


Stability is subjective, some people think 10 passes of IBT is enough to confirm stability or it doesn't crash their games etc, its down to the person. If someone is using their pc to create content then stress testing for 12 hours in prime or what have you seems fair to me.


----------



## Lerog

Hi I used first test maxed data, test was runing thru One hour. I know that's maybe to short but if something was wrong it will crash system. Nothing happend test passed with resoult shown on jpg.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lerog*
> 
> Well today, I have Oc it on 4,7GHZ wit 1,360 Volts. I just repasted it, and gues what? MAX temp : 69C Taaa Daam!


Updated


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lerog*
> 
> Hi I used first test maxed data, test was runing thru One hour. I know that's maybe to short but if something was wrong it will crash system. Nothing happend test passed with resoult shown on jpg.


So, Large Data Set?

What was your ambient temperature?

What is your cooling setup?

I am simply trying to evaluate my rig against other users.

I need to do a full hour run, but a quick five minute run gave me 59°C @ ~25°C ambient.


----------



## Lerog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> So, Large Data Set?
> 
> What was your ambient temperature?
> 
> What is your cooling setup?
> 
> I am simply trying to evaluate my rig against other users.
> 
> I need to do a full hour run, but a quick five minute run gave me 59°C @ ~25°C ambient.


Yes large data. My abient temp is arround 24-25C.
My cooling setup is watercooling set alphacool nexxos cool answer 360 D5/Xt.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lerog*
> 
> Yes large data. My abient temp is arround 24-25C.
> My cooling setup is watercooling set alphacool nexxos cool answer 360 D5/Xt.


Nice.

OK, I am going to do an hour run and see what I get.



On my PC, this is a fullscreen (1920x1080) pic. I cannot seem to post it where it is actually readable when I am logged in. If I log out, it zooms properly.

Actually, it appears to be a yahooapis(dot)com script that causes the problem. Disallowing scripts from yahooapis(dot)com allows the zoom function to work.

Moderators: Why?


----------



## Ovrclck

Finally got around to draining my loop. No wonder my temps were high under load.

What's the best method for removing the gunk on the IHS?

CLP was used.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> Finally got around to draining my loop. No wonder my temps were high under load.
> 
> What's the best method for removing the gunk on the IHS?
> 
> CLP was used.


I recommend for IHS cleaning, a hot paper towel and scrub it down to remove it. The heat is what really helps and the fibers from the towel help grab it.


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I recommend for IHS cleaning, a hot paper towel and scrub it down to remove it. The heat is what really helps and the fibers from the towel help grab it.


Thanks man!


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> OK cool! Is the Noctua NT-H1 paste still the go to for bare die?
> 
> 
> 
> It is not and far from it.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> Yep that's good stuff. Has a low flash point and no cure/burn in time.
> 
> You do want to spread the die with paste. Do not do a line dot or dash x ect. Cover the entire thing.
> 
> Also will likely remove the retention bracket from the motherboard and also some sort of custom mounting to have proper pressure.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> False for the TIM.
> 
> I will repeat this one last time for people who are actually running bare die, any TIM is going to be useless on bare die, PERIOD. This has been tested and proven and please stop arguing with me, ive tested this over a 2month period with at least a dozen TIMs and the problem is the same for MOST of em. They will pump out, your temps will suck and youll need to repaste WEEKLY.
> 
> Im running bare die and i have a difference of 5°C between my coolest core and hottest core. I ended up with the same when i delided.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> Sounds good! I'm planning on obtaining an ek supremacy precisemount. I think that should be it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> You can try deliding it, applying CLU on the die the Noctua on the IHS. Will solve your core issue, my guess is either the paste has gone to hell or it was a poor sample to begin with. A 22°C difference between cores is quite huge, either your voltages are off on some cores or needs a good delid and repasting.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Ok not to argue but get facts.
> 
> You tried 12 pastes in 2 months time.
> 
> Is there a comparison chart for all the pastes you tried and load temp screen shots.?
> 
> Also I dony fully get this post above. You start off by saying dont use the paste then down lower you say to use the paste.
> 
> Not trying to argue, but I missed something I think. I missed many of your past posts in regards to the statement to not use paste..... I dunno. Some one help me here.
> 
> I guess the statement that TIM is useless on bare die...... Throws me off a little. Thermal Interface Material is all Ive ever used running naked and that does include nano diamond.
Click to expand...

It's called pushout bro. CLU won't and all conventional TIMs will.

Why even argue this fact?

Personally, why go IHSless? If you've got the lid off and are unhappy with the Temps with it on, why not spring for 3 fine grits of paper and lapp the lid? It's not same as going bare die but it's the next best and safest thing.









~Ceadder


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> It's called pushout bro. CLU won't and all conventional TIMs will.
> 
> Why even argue this fact?
> 
> Personally, why go IHSless? If you've got the lid off and are unhappy with the Temps with it on, why not spring for 3 fine grits of paper and lapp the lid? It's not same as going bare die but it's the next best and safest thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I'd rather go naked, no large lump of nickel plated copper to soak up the heat.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> It's called pushout bro. CLU won't and all conventional TIMs will.
> 
> Why even argue this fact?
> 
> Personally, why go IHSless? If you've got the lid off and are unhappy with the Temps with it on, why not spring for 3 fine grits of paper and lapp the lid? It's not same as going bare die but it's the next best and safest thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Why you gotta bring up old stuff? It's already been resolved and I am in full understanding now!

Because when I'm not happy with temps and remove an IHS plate that is soldered, I just can't slap it back on and just go using it like you would with Intel processors...... But this really wasn't the point, I was curious about CLU and that was it.

Have a nice evening.

ShrimpDelidz~


----------



## Ceadderman

^ I posted from my S4. So it limits my being on top of things. Apologies on the ill timed reply.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> It's called pushout bro. CLU won't and all conventional TIMs will.
> 
> Why even argue this fact?
> 
> Personally, why go IHSless? If you've got the lid off and are unhappy with the Temps with it on, why not spring for 3 fine grits of paper and lapp the lid? It's not same as going bare die but it's the next best and safest thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd rather go naked, no large lump of nickel plated copper to soak up the heat.
Click to expand...

Lapping the IHS takes away the Nickel leaving direct to IHS copper contact with the cooler and flattens the IHS to allow for more surface area for cooling.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> ^ I posted from my S4. So it limits my being on top of things. Apologies on the ill timed reply.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lapping the IHS takes away the Nickel leaving direct to IHS copper contact with the cooler and flattens the IHS to allow for more surface area for cooling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Correct but its still 2.5mm of solid copper for heat to go thru, and yes although copper is rated at 3-400w/mK its still better not having it at all.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Absolutely naked is better. I saw a good drop when I went naked, although I never tried lapping the ihs tbh


----------



## savagebunny

Well, I did my delid tonight. Easy as hell. Already had a super old vise in my garage, but just placed painters tape on it, and did it slowly. So here is some data. Now I wish I didn't use AIDA64. Kept causing surges in temperature fluctuations which threw off my results so bad, plus my fan speed profile reset... but hell they temps were till lower
Quote:


> 4790k @ 4.6Ghz 1.255vcore 1.810vccin - Corsair h80i Push 120x38mm / 120x25 pull
> Ambient - 68F / 20c - 53-55% Humidity
> MX-4 Thermal Paste
> 
> Program used - AIDA64 - CPU/FPU/Cache
> 
> 10 minute test each time
> 
> Before - http://i.imgur.com/U5FHXPL.png
> After - http://i.imgur.com/OHl5XgX.png
> 
> Core Temp Max Before
> Core 0 Core 1 Core 2 Core 3
> 79 83 81 79
> 
> Core Temp Max After
> Core 0 Core 1 Core 2 Core 3
> 70 80 77 71
> 
> Difference
> Core 0 Core 1 Core 2 Core 3
> 9c 3c 4c 8c
> 
> HW Info Max Before
> Core 0 Core 1 Core 2 Core 3
> 78 82 81 78
> 
> HW Info Max After
> Core 0 Core 1 Core 2 Core 3
> 69 79 76 71
> 
> Difference
> Core 0 Core 1 Core 2 Core 3
> 9c 3c 5c 7c
> 
> HW Info Package
> Max
> Before - 84
> After - 77
> 
> With my after test my fans aren't ramping up like they were before, so that may come into affect why my temps didn't adjust that much, but it sure did help it seem.


looks damn well now.


http://imgur.com/8kNcw


So now I've ran x264 and checked the temps, well Core1 is still all jacked up. but sure as hell seems to me from memory, i dropped 13-16c total if I go off memory. Sorry for lack of proof, but ya. I'm happy

Now again, going off memory, I'm inducing the same amount of load as I was before I did this delid while mining via CPU only. Across all cores roughly 17-20c down on load. Nuts


----------



## outofmyheadyo

If a chip is a potato, delidding wont really make it oc better does it? It's a 6700k 4.6 @ 1.3v is good but 4.8 @ 1.45v is a no go, temps are fine not more than 70 under stress tests cooled by air.
I delidded a 4770k and 6700k before but the other 6700k did 4.8, but I delidded it right after buying tho.



Would really like to try this thing out tho, did the previous delidding with a vice and a hammer


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> ^ I posted from my S4. So it limits my being on top of things. Apologies on the ill timed reply.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lapping the IHS takes away the Nickel leaving direct to IHS copper contact with the cooler and flattens the IHS to allow for more surface area for cooling.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Correct but its still 2.5mm of solid copper for heat to go thru, and yes although copper is rated at 3-400w/mK its still better not having it at all.
Click to expand...

No doubt it's better(temps-wise) to run naked. But I'd be too worried of cracking the die with my block to do so. Sooooooo for me a lapped IHS is better. If I could lay my hands on a die shim I might feel otherwise inclined but those MSi shims are few.









~Ceadder


----------



## AccountIsTaken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> No doubt it's better(temps-wise) to run naked. But I'd be too worried of cracking the die with my block to do so. Sooooooo for me a lapped IHS is better. If I could lay my hands on a die shim I might feel otherwise inclined but those MSi shims are few.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


What about getting an aquacomputer shim. It probably won't be as good as the MSI shim as it's not bolted down but at least you can easily get one.



The link is http://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3378


----------



## Ceadderman

I cud do that. I have a rather large tube of Ceramique that I got years ago. I never use the stuff for cooling but it makes great soft epoxy for the installation of backplates and washers. Although I am unsure whether or not it will fit perfectly on the i7-4790 that I own.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> No doubt it's better(temps-wise) to run naked. But I'd be too worried of cracking the die with my block to do so. Sooooooo for me a lapped IHS is better. If I could lay my hands on a die shim I might feel otherwise inclined but those MSi shims are few.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I was worried as well until i used pressure paper to test out the pressure of the block onto the die. Theres more pressure on the cpu socket then on the die so it is TOTALLY safe. Ive even had an issue when coming back from vacation to where i had a couple ram slots not working. Re-seating the cpu did the trick, theres definitely very low pressure onto the die itself.


----------



## NBrock

Hey everyone. I have been trying to find some info on long term effects with using liquid metal tim. I am looking to delid my 4790k as was wondering if I have anything to worry about other than application and making sure it doesn't touch anything where conducting electricity will cause problems. I was also wondering how long it can go without needing to be re-applied. Thanks!


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NBrock*
> 
> Hey everyone. I have been trying to find some info on long term effects with using liquid metal tim. I am looking to delid my 4790k as was wondering if I have anything to worry about other than application and making sure it doesn't touch anything where conducting electricity will cause problems. I was also wondering how long it can go without needing to be re-applied. Thanks!


I've been using it for about 18 months. Temperatures continue to be superior to any suspension based compound.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NBrock*
> 
> Hey everyone. I have been trying to find some info on long term effects with using liquid metal tim. I am looking to delid my 4790k as was wondering if I have anything to worry about other than application and making sure it doesn't touch anything where conducting electricity will cause problems. I was also wondering how long it can go without needing to be re-applied. Thanks!


I would be particularly careful when placing the IHS on the chip. Make sure you place it slightly higher than stock so when the clamp comes down it moves slightly into the right position. Also, make sure you have a steady hand as resetting the IHS is not ideal. Finally, I would apply some dielectric grease on caps (?) just in case. If you are feeling really nervous you could scotch tape around the die during application.

I've seen terrific results with my 4790K. 4.8Ghz/1.3v at <55c peak, ~48c avg under gaming load from 60c+. OCCT AVX/64BIT/Linepack status around 70c. I can go all the way up to 5.1Ghz at 1.45v at ~65c in 3DMark Firestrike physics test.


----------



## jdorje

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NBrock*
> 
> I have been trying to find some info on long term effects with using liquid metal tim.


Long term effects include:

Increase in energy.
Chills.
Drop in blood pressure.
Increased libido.
Feelings of wellbeing.
Having a vice in your kitchen.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> No doubt it's better(temps-wise) to run naked. But I'd be too worried of cracking the die with my block to do so. Sooooooo for me a lapped IHS is better. If I could lay my hands on a die shim I might feel otherwise inclined but those MSi shims are few.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I was worried as well until i used pressure paper to test out the pressure of the block onto the die. Theres more pressure on the cpu socket then on the die so it is TOTALLY safe. Ive even had an issue when coming back from vacation to where i had a couple ram slots not working. Re-seating the cpu did the trick, theres definetly
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NBrock*
> 
> Hey everyone. I have been trying to find some info on long term effects with using liquid metal tim. I am looking to delid my 4790k as was wondering if I have anything to worry about other than application and making sure it doesn't touch anything where conducting electricity will cause problems. I was also wondering how long it can go without needing to be re-applied. Thanks!


Just use nail polish/liquid electrical tape, anything that hardens over the transistors. Thats the longest part of the delid is waiting for that to actual dry fully so it doesnt stick to your IHS haha.

Doesnt really need reapplying either unless you remove it and disrupt the liquid metal. As far as temps go, you'll see a good temp drop depending on your voltages and your chip. For me i dropped 7°C or so going from stock to delided and dropped another 3-5°C running bare die, this was at 1.1 and 1.2v. Didn't test it before and after at 1.3. Now with cooler ambient temps i run even cooler. At 1.21v my 4690k hasn't seen 50°C its usually around 46-47°C and thats after hours and hours.


----------



## jdorje

I strongly recommend just ignoring the transisters. I've heard of more people who killed the chip with the insulation than who killed it by spilling clu.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jdorje*
> 
> I strongly recommend just ignoring the transisters. I've heard of more people who killed the chip with the insulation than who killed it by spilling clu.


I think you're the first person ive heard that from. Never heard or seen anyone say transistors were ruined by using nail polish/lacquer/liquid tape.


----------



## paskowitz

I mean, if you lather it on like shampoo... I'm sure its not good. I take a drop on the end of a toothpick and spread it lightly over the transistors. I can't imagine that being thermally insulating.


----------



## NBrock

Thanks for the responses guys. I'll let you know what I decide and how everything goes. I plan on doing a few tests before and after to see how much temps drop. I doubt they will drop much but it might just give me that extra bit of headroom to test the higher clocks. 4.8 seems to run fine but it is higher temp than I'd like to do proper long term stability tests on. I'd really like to try for 4.9+ but I don't think the h100i is up to the task of keeping it cool enough.


----------



## Ovrclck

So I'm pretty stoked right now!

So previously I had a 4770K, stock running on full load. I was hitting 20C difference between the hottest core. When I took apart my rig I noticed the IHS was damaged when I dropped my cpu during the delid process. I think the dent did not allow for the IHS to rest evenly. You can see it on the upper right corner where the clamp makes contact.





I just got my SL 4790K 4.8 delid, running stock under full load for now until after I finish flushing then the overclocking begins











Almost 30C difference. Crazy!


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> So I'm pretty stoked right now!
> 
> So previously I had a 4770K, stock running on full load. I was hitting 20C difference between the hottest core. When I took apart my rig I noticed the IHS was damaged when I dropped my cpu during the delid process. I think the dent did not allow for the IHS to rest evenly. You can see it on the upper right corner where the clamp makes contact.


For the 4770K you can just lightly lap the underside of the ihs where the dent is and makes contact with the pcb


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> For the 4770K you can just lightly lap the underside of the ihs where the dent is and makes contact with the pcb


I'm on a full acrylic build and did not want to chance pulling everything apart again. It's such a hassle lol. It was just easier for me to replace the cpu, peace of mind.


----------



## NBrock

So I did the Delid on my 4790k. I ended up using some liquid electrical tape on the capacitors.

After doing a half hour run of Intel Extreme Tuning stress test before and after my peak temps went from 76*c to 62* The package temp is down too.
from 76*c to 63*c. The cores are also a lot closer in temp rather than there being one or two at 69*c and the others at 76.

I ended up using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut.


----------



## NBrock

Unfortunately my 4790k just doesn't seem to want to run at anything higher than 4.7. Any ideas of things to adjust or check? I did up the input voltage to 1.94. I tried my ram manually at 1333 rather than 2400.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NBrock*
> 
> Unfortunately my 4790k just doesn't seem to want to run at anything higher than 4.7. Any ideas of things to adjust or check? I did up the input voltage to 1.94. I tried my ram manually at 1333 rather than 2400.


what voltage are you running? I'd try disabling turbo mode and any other power saving features temporarily to see if that clears anything up (if you haven't already)

My last resort was upping the baseclock to get the last hundred mhz or so (watch your ram speeds, like you have been doing) . That and setting my boot mode to "max battery" or whatever is slowest also helped me get to 5.0GHz from 4.9GHz and only had a minor impact on my boot time. I kinda hit a wall at 4.9 (1.31v) and it wouldn't go to 5.0 with any amount of voltage (tried up to 1.5v. Base clock got me down to 1.39v)


----------



## NBrock

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> what voltage are you running? I'd try disabling turbo mode and any other power saving features temporarily to see if that clears anything up (if you haven't already)
> 
> My last resort was upping the baseclock to get the last hundred mhz or so (watch your ram speeds, like you have been doing) . That and setting my boot mode to "max battery" or whatever is slowest also helped me get to 5.0GHz from 4.9GHz and only had a minor impact on my boot time. I kinda hit a wall at 4.9 (1.31v) and it wouldn't go to 5.0 with any amount of voltage (tried up to 1.5v. Base clock got me down to 1.39v)


Thanks for the response.

So for turbo mode on this board (Maximus VI Impact) it is on but it is set to max turbo speed and that is what I have been setting to 47,48,and 49. It just always runs that instead of downloading. Other than x58 Xeon overclock and various AMD platforms this is my first time really messing with a bios that has soo many different settings for stuff. I know to watch for the adaptive mode for voltage and stuff. mostly just trying to see what combinations of settings are best for getting stuff done.
I'll try disabling turbo and just setting the multi up that way.
as for voltage I tried various things all the way up to 1.36 in bios (came out to about 1.4 when running under load with llc and such.


----------



## NBrock

So changing tactics and adjusting base clock seemed to make a difference. I stopped playing around atm and set it back to 4.7.
so in hardware monitor my board is reporting that vcore is 1.392 and my 4790k is reporting VID of 1.375 to get it to boot and start stress testing at 4.9.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ovrclck*
> 
> So I'm pretty stoked right now!
> 
> So previously I had a 4770K, stock running on full load. I was hitting 20C difference between the hottest core. When I took apart my rig I noticed the IHS was damaged when I dropped my cpu during the delid process. I think the dent did not allow for the IHS to rest evenly. You can see it on the upper right corner where the clamp makes contact.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just got my SL 4790K 4.8 delid, running stock under full load for now until after I finish flushing then the overclocking begins
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Almost 30C difference. Crazy!


----------



## Benjiw

OCN name: BenjiW
CPU: i7 6700K
on die-TIM: Coollabratory Ultimate
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly
Mhz gained: Unsure, still testing
OC after delid: 4700MHz
Temp drops: 30c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Image of delid to come.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> OCN name: BenjiW
> CPU: i7 6700K
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Ultimate
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly
> Mhz gained: Unsure, still testing
> OC after delid: 4700MHz
> Temp drops: 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> Image of delid to come.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Gurkburk

I was thinking about whether i need to change the thermal paste on the inside after a while, just like changing the regular thermal paste of a processor. Should this be done ?

Have a 4770k that i delidded and have had the same paste since it was delidded.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> I was thinking about whether i need to change the thermal paste on the inside after a while, just like changing the regular thermal paste of a processor. Should this be done ?
> 
> Have a 4770k that i delidded and have had the same paste since it was delidded.


If temperatures haven't changed, there's no need.


----------



## Gurkburk

While I'm at it I'm lapping it.

Is a 1000 paper enough as last run? & is all the silver supposed to be gone?


----------



## Gurkburk

Sitting here re-clocking my 4770k. I've set the volt to 1.150 and only changing the frequency.

Is the temperature supposed to increase while stresstesting even though you haven't changed the volt?


----------



## ForNever

yes, temperature will rise with freq only, but not nearly as drastically as it does with voltage increase+freq


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> yes, temperature will rise with freq only, but not nearly as drastically as it does with voltage increase+freq


Alright. Been a while since I overclocked from scratch









Also. Somehow, my 4770k has fixed itself...?

I've reapplied and remounted it like 5 times today. Everytime the temperatures been about the same.

Now I checked around on the web about the H80i and the backplate, since its loose when not mounted to the cooler.

& i just screwed it loose again and checked if i could screw the backplate scews loose and check everything out, but they are too firm.

So i just placed everything back, didnt reapply the paste, now the idle temp has dropped to closer to 30*C and my stress-test temp is just around 70*C while at 1.3volt(!) and 4.4Ghz.

This is insane, what the hell just happened? Did the "loose" backplate hit the jackpot when i placed it back or something?


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> While I'm at it I'm lapping it.
> 
> Is a 1000 paper enough as last run? & is all the silver supposed to be gone?


That would be no.

lapping should start with 1000 grit for 20 passes each rotation(4) and step to 1500grit for 20(4) more and then 2000grit for 20(4) and at the end you should see a copper square encompassing the cooling surface of the IHS that is mirror in quality.

To clear this up a touch more a single pass is started at the down stroke for half a pass and the upstroke is the other half. So you're actually pulling it down to the end of the paper and finishing the pass at the top of the paper. Hope this helps.









If you've already started your lapping process and you're sitting round and your IHS is at the Nickel, then jump to 2000grit and run your IHS until it's all copper in color.









~Ceadder


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> OCN name: BenjiW
> CPU: i7 6700K
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Ultimate
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly
> Mhz gained: Unsure, still testing
> OC after delid: 4700MHz
> Temp drops: 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> 
> Image of delid to come.


Update:

OCN name: BenjiW
CPU: i7 6700K
on die-TIM: Coollabratory Ultimate
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly
Mhz gained: 100MHz, still testing
OC after delid: 4800MHz 1.568v
Temp drops: 30c
CPU-Z validation of max OC:


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Update:
> 
> OCN name: BenjiW
> CPU: i7 6700K
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Ultimate
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly
> Mhz gained: 100MHz, still testing
> OC after delid: 4800MHz 1.568v
> Temp drops: 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Updated!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Update:
> 
> OCN name: BenjiW
> CPU: i7 6700K
> on die-TIM: Coollabratory Ultimate
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly
> Mhz gained: 100MHz, still testing
> OC after delid: 4800MHz 1.568v
> Temp drops: 30c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:


Damn Benji that thing runs warm huh. Guessing thats a pic of the before the delid haha.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Damn Benji that thing runs warm huh. Guessing thats a pic of the before the delid haha.


No the max temp was after stress testing for a few hours or so, might be warm but if it doesn't thermal throttle I don't care, I'll probably be on Kaby lake by the end of 2017 and I highly doubt I'll see any degradation by then.

If you can cool it, you can clock it.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> No the max temp was after stress testing for a few hours or so, might be warm but if it doesn't thermal throttle I don't care, I'll probably be on Kaby lake by the end of 2017 and I highly doubt I'll see any degradation by then.
> 
> If you can cool it, you can clock it.


Oh yea i can cool it alright, my 4690k reaches 47°C but only at 1.21v, this new chip is **** not gonna bother with more. I think next one will be i7 7700k or zen not sure yet.


----------



## vasyltheonly

Well this morning I got my father in laws vice and went with it. It took a total of 2 minutes or so. Every time I turned, I waited a few seconds or so until it gently opened up. Now I just have to clean it and apply some CLU once it comes in. Will be using MX4 for now.


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vasyltheonly*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well this morning I got my father in laws vice and went with it. It took a total of 2 minutes or so. Every time I turned, I waited a few seconds or so until it gently opened up. Now I just have to clean it and apply some CLU once it comes in. Will be using MX4 for now.


Congrats on the success! You'll still see a fair bit of improvement with the MX4, it's pretty good stuff. Please post some results between stock, MX4, and CLU if you have time. Enjoy!


----------



## vasyltheonly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Congrats on the success! You'll still see a fair bit of improvement with the MX4, it's pretty good stuff. Please post some results between stock, MX4, and CLU if you have time. Enjoy!


So right not I am testing the CPU temps. It looks like my cores on my 4790K are at different temperatures with 8 degree difference. Core 0 and 4 are about 70 while stressing and cores 1 and 2 are around 78 with core 1 always being higher. Does anyone know the placement of the cores on the die which can help me understand the spread of the TIM on it. CLU won't be here till next Tuesday


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vasyltheonly*
> 
> So right not I am testing the CPU temps. It looks like my cores on my 4790K are at different temperatures with 8 degree difference. Core 0 and 4 are about 70 while stressing and cores 1 and 2 are around 78 with core 1 always being higher. Does anyone know the placement of the cores on the die which can help me understand the spread of the TIM on it. CLU won't be here till next Tuesday


Sorry you just won't have equal temps, they'll be off a few degrees at any stage, You're best waiting for CLU then testing.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *vasyltheonly*
> 
> So right not I am testing the CPU temps. It looks like my cores on my 4790K are at different temperatures with 8 degree difference. Core 0 and 4 are about 70 while stressing and cores 1 and 2 are around 78 with core 1 always being higher. Does anyone know the placement of the cores on the die which can help me understand the spread of the TIM on it. CLU won't be here till next Tuesday
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry you just won't have equal temps, they'll be off a few degrees at any stage, You're best waiting for CLU then testing.
Click to expand...

Even then there will always be a temp deferential between cores. Best to average the Temps divided by core amount to get the average as to whether or not the delid works. If using CLU between the die and the IHS ( properly) I doubt that it would be Fail.









~Ceadder drink:


----------



## Xox1de

Just delidded my i7 6700k, temp dropped 10C from full load (81C before now 70C), Hyper212, artic silver MX5 both side of lid. Did the razor method and works fine, but my hand was shaking as F


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> Just delidded my i7 6700k, temp dropped 10C from full load (81C before now 70C), Hyper212, artic silver MX5 both side of lid. Did the razor method and works fine, but my hand was shaking as F


MX4 is still subject to "pushout" between the die and the IHS. I would suggest replacing it with CLU as soon as you can. MX4 will be fine for your Hyper 212 though.









~Ceadder


----------



## Xox1de

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> MX4 is still subject to "pushout" between the die and the IHS. I would suggest replacing it with CLU as soon as you can. MX4 will be fine for your Hyper 212 though.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


What you mean by pushout? Isnt the mx4 non conductive? 10c is enough a drop for me though.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> What you mean by pushout? Isnt the mx4 non conductive? 10c is enough a drop for me though.


Means it wont last long, temps will rise within a week..


----------



## Xox1de

Correction, what I used is MX-2 not mx4. Maybe the higher viscosity will help prevent pushout. Ive never had such problem before and I used this stuff on bare die CPU for years.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> Correction, what I used is MX-2 not mx4. Maybe the higher viscosity will help prevent pushout. Ive never had such problem before and I used this stuff on bare die CPU for years.


No it won't it will still pump out, and 10c drop isn't good, 20-30c is the norm after a delid.


----------



## Xox1de

stop sprayin the lie about pushout or pump out... Ive been in overclocking since 2004 and NEVER heard that crap. If push out is true then the bare die CPU back in the time will all need maintenance once per month. ***


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> stop sprayin the lie about pushout or pump out... Ive been in overclocking since 2004 and NEVER heard that crap. If push out is true then the bare die CPU back in the time will all need maintenance once per month. ***


You are about to go places with the conversation that have already been explored.

They had suggest CLU paste for a much better thermal conductivity. This type of paste is basically a liquid metal. It gets spread so very thin there is no pump out.

Most conventional pastes pump out. It's normal. Has very little effect on end temps in reality, but does not conduct as well as CLU paste.
http://www.coollaboratory.com/product/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/

I would imagine the 10c drop with MX paste is decent for your application also considering your only using H212 heat sink. It's the best "cheap" heat sink you can buy I suppose.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> stop sprayin the lie about pushout or pump out... Ive been in overclocking since 2004 and NEVER heard that crap. If push out is true then the bare die CPU back in the time will all need maintenance once per month. ***


Yea you are wrong, overclocking since 2004 doesnt mean anything haha.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> You are about to go places with the conversation that have already been explored.
> 
> They had suggest CLU paste for a much better thermal conductivity. This type of paste is basically a liquid metal. It gets spread so very thin there is no pump out.
> 
> Most conventional pastes pump out. It's normal. Has very little effect on end temps in reality, but does not conduct as well as CLU paste.
> http://www.coollaboratory.com/product/coollaboratory-liquid-ultra/
> 
> I would imagine the 10c drop with MX paste is decent for your application also considering your only using H212 heat sink. It's the best "cheap" heat sink you can buy I suppose.


Actually, pump out has quite a bit of an effect on bare die on INTEL (since youre used to AMD for the most part ill clarify lol), i went from 47°C to 54°C in the matter of 24hrs with Noctua paste.


----------



## Xox1de

I aware the CLU conduct heat better, but saying the temperature will go up in a week using normal thermal past is foolish.

I will let you know if temp raise. So far 3 days no change whatsoever.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> I aware the CLU conduct heat better, but saying the temperature will go up in a week using normal thermal past is foolish.
> 
> I will let you know if temp raise. So far 3 days no change whatsoever.


Try heating up your chip and then letting it cool down. Thermal cyclin yada yada... This is kind of like beating a dead horse.


----------



## Valgaur

Hi Peeps!

Just to notify everyone here. I will be away for the next week for a business Conference in Finland. Just letting people know I wont be around is all









Have fun!









-Val


----------



## Ovrclck

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hi Peeps!
> 
> Just to notify everyone here. I will be away for the next week for a business Conference in Finland. Just letting people know I wont be around is all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have fun!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Val


Safe travels my friend!


----------



## Ceadderman

Typical TIMs, even nonconductive, will pushout due to heat *liquifying* it. CLU is metal based so the heat won't affect it the same as typical TIM.

Here is a good way to see and observe what I am talking about. Take a tube of what you used and put it in a ziploc baggie. Boil a pot of water and drop the baggie into it. Wait for a bit pull it out and squeeze some onto a smooth surface and you immediately see that the TIM is thinner in consistency due to heat. Which is why some Intel chips benefit from a delid. Why this group exists and why we do it. Intel TIM is not nearly as good as many of the mid tier TIM, and cannot compare to the top tier. Just look inside the IHS after delidding a chip the spread is simply awful.

Pushout is real and it can even happen to top tier pastes. It takes more applied heat to get CLU to the same consistency and since the die won't get that hot CLU doesn't pushout.

~Ceadder


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Typical TIMs, even nonconductive, will pushout due to heat *liquifying* it. CLU is metal based so the heat won't affect it the same as typical TIM.
> 
> Here is a good way to see and observe what I am talking about. Take a tube of what you used and put it in a ziploc baggie. Boil a pot of water and drop the baggie into it. Wait for a bit pull it out and squeeze some onto a smooth surface and you immediately see that the TIM is thinner in consistency due to heat. Which is why some Intel chips benefit from a delid. Why this group exists and why we do it. Intel TIM is not nearly as good as many of the mid tier TIM, and cannot compare to the top tier. Just look inside the IHS after delidding a chip the spread is simply awful.
> 
> Pushout is real and it can even happen to top tier pastes. It takes more applied heat to get CLU to the same consistency and since the die won't get that hot CLU doesn't pushout.
> 
> ~Ceadder


It is also the black silicone used to glue the lid on creating a gap, along with the mentioned thermal paste quality. Intel recognized the issue as the TIM, and supposedly fixed it in Devils Canyon, but DC still benefits from a delid, so there is more to play than just TIM quality.


----------



## fleetfeather

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> stop sprayin the lie about pushout or pump out... Ive been in overclocking since 2004 and NEVER heard that crap. If push out is true then the bare die CPU back in the time will all need maintenance once per month. ***


"It's my first delid, and I haven't heard of a concept so it must be wrong"

Sigh...


----------



## Xox1de

Look, if this pushout is true, then all the bare DIE cpu decades ago will need periodic maintenance. My athlon XP 2500+ never had pushout for decade and still working, no difference in temps. I'm not gonna wasting my time arguing, I will experiment myself and report back, i'm just not the guy who do whatever people says on the forum.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> Look, if this pushout is true, then all the bare DIE cpu decades ago will need periodic maintenance. My athlon XP 2500+ never had pushout for decade and still working, no difference in temps. I'm not gonna wasting my time arguing, I will experiment myself and report back, i'm just not the guy who do whatever people says on the forum.


1. AMD and Intel vary vastly in running bare die, ask shrimpbrine he will tell you.

2. My testing was done bare die as to eliminate the variable (in this case the IHS).

3. The smaller the die, the more heat concentration there is. The faster the pump out. There is a very good reason why everyone who delids (especially silicon lottery), use CLU with each delid and re-gluing.

Its the fact that the gap from the silicone is gone and now the IHS puts correct pressure onto the die that causes the pump out. Its such a small footprint with sometimes as much tdp as 125w plus that will do it.

Case in point. I use hydronaut on a 3350p (35w or so cpu) that has not pumped out in the past 6 months. On the other hand 4690k at 1.21v the same hydronaut on bare die pumped out in 2 days. Taking the waterblock back off the paste was liquified.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> I aware the CLU conduct heat better, but saying the temperature will go up in a week using normal thermal past is foolish.
> 
> I will let you know if temp raise. So far 3 days no change whatsoever.


Good luck with your future endeavors, I won't help you from here on out as you think I'm talking rubbish, tested it myself yada yada and if you're not willing to listen to experience then god help you.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> Look, if this pushout is true, then all the bare DIE cpu decades ago will need periodic maintenance. My athlon XP 2500+ never had pushout for decade and still working, no difference in temps. I'm not gonna wasting my time arguing, I will experiment myself and report back, i'm just not the guy who do whatever people says on the forum.


You mean something we've all tested, several times, with several TIMs and so on? Yeah we're just sheep aren't we...


----------



## Ceadderman

Luvely meme Benj.









The issue isn't disputable if one has ever heated their TIM because of frugality. If any of you have done it raise your hand...









As was mentioned after my experiment post part of the issue stems from too wide a gap between the die and the IHS. So it's kinda like heating butter in a pan without putting grilled cheese makings on right afterward. Just gonna cook off the TIM (butter) and not get cooled by the block or heatsink.

To those who don't believe pushout is real? Science is your friend.









~Ceadder


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Awsan*
> 
> So hello everyone i would like to report that i killed my Skylake CPU as my clumsy hands chipped a small piece of the core it self and now i own a dead CPU as a souvenir (Even though my motherboard is 90% dead in the first place because of my magnificent AX860 ~THANK YOU CORSAIR~ ) So wanted to share my experience with everyone.
> 
> The irony is i delidded "5" haswells with a razor and everything went fine but when it came to the easiest one it died, oh well fair well my new friend
> 
> (Fun fact it was new out of the box didnt even boot it once
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )


Reseal it with black stuff and send it back for warranty saying it doesnt work. Works just fine and enjoy your new CPU.


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 1. AMD and Intel vary vastly in running bare die, ask shrimpbrine he will tell you.
> 
> 2. My testing was done bare die as to eliminate the variable (in this case the IHS).
> 
> 3. The smaller the die, the more heat concentration there is. The faster the pump out. There is a very good reason why everyone who delids (especially silicon lottery), use CLU with each delid and re-gluing.
> 
> Its the fact that the gap from the silicone is gone and now the IHS puts correct pressure onto the die that causes the pump out. Its such a small footprint with sometimes as much tdp as 125w plus that will do it.
> 
> Case in point. I use hydronaut on a 3350p (35w or so cpu) that has not pumped out in the past 6 months. On the other hand 4690k at 1.21v the same hydronaut on bare die pumped out in 2 days. Taking the waterblock back off the paste was liquified.


This pushout thing is just a load of crap. Never had that problem, ever. But then again I haven't used inferior pastes for years now, liquid metal all the way.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

I am assuming that delidding is safer for a watercooled cpu than aircooled because a waterblock is lighter than an air cooler and is less likely to crush the die. Is this a correct assumption?


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0451*
> 
> I am assuming that delidding is safer for a watercooled cpu than aircooled because a waterblock is lighter than an air cooler and is less likely to crush the die. Is this a correct assumption?


The weight doesnt really matter, they only crack when people are stupid and overtighten it when finger tight is plenty... Just tighten on opposite corners little by little and there will never be an issue.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> This pushout thing is just a load of crap. Never had that problem, ever. But then again I haven't used inferior pastes for years now, liquid metal all the way.


Lol... You don't get pump out with liquid metal TIM... That's why we use it and tell others to use it. Plenty of evidence in this thread alone.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0451*
> 
> I am assuming that delidding is safer for a watercooled cpu than aircooled because a waterblock is lighter than an air cooler and is less likely to crush the die. Is this a correct assumption?


EK do a kit for naked mounts for 3xxx and 4xxx chips of yesteryear but skylake isn't compatible with it. If you're reusing the IHS then finger tighten the mounting screws in a criss cross pattern and you won't hear that dreaded snap.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Stige*
> 
> The weight doesnt really matter, they only crack when people are stupid and overtighten it when finger tight is plenty... Just tighten on opposite corners little by little and there will never be an issue.


Like this man said.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> Lol... You don't get pump out with liquid metal TIM... That's why we use it and tell others to use it. Plenty of evidence in this thread alone.


Benji don't bother lol. He's a troll its why I've blocked him. I tried this out over a period of 2 months with Hydronaut, Kryonaut, NH-T1, MX-4, MX-2, AS5, and GC-Extreme. They pretty much all had pump out sooner or later, i guess the top thermal pastes are all inferior lol.

Had pump out anywhere from one day to one week. I was using bare die so they IHS was gone as the variable, and from what ive noticed using test paper, pump out with or without IHS is indeed real. The idiots who think don't are the same idiots who think using AUTO for OC is an actual overclock haha.

OH and P.S. this was tested over a period of 2 month with 1.2 and 1.3v as OCs on a 4690k.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> EK do a kit for naked mounts for 3xxx and 4xxx chips of yesteryear but skylake isn't compatible with it. If you're reusing the IHS then finger tighten the mounting screws in a criss cross pattern and you won't hear that dreaded snap.
> Like this man said.


The fact that you can hear a crack is kind of terrifying. However, I don't remeber heat spreaders being a thing until the later Pentium 4 (except for the P3 and Athlon Nintendo cartridge design). I'll try delidding when I pick up a Kaby Lake, but I'll wait for the how-to guide,


----------



## vasyltheonly

So I have good and bad news. Bad news, I must've chipped my chip between the delid and applying MX-4 to it twice before my CLU came in. Good news, chip still works and I can now achieve 4.8/4.0 cache with 1.355v and 1.9 VIN. Up from 4.6 1.28. Temps at 4.8 are actually lower than 4.6 at low 70s. I got about a 12C drop of temperature at same previous voltage. Other than the chip on the die, 100% worth it.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *vasyltheonly*
> 
> 
> So I have good and bad news. Bad news, I must've chipped my chip between the delid and applying MX-4 to it twice before my CLU came in. Good news, chip still works and I can now achieve 4.8/4.0 cache with 1.355v and 1.9 VIN. Up from 4.6 1.28. Temps at 4.8 are actually lower than 4.6 at low 70s. I got about a 12C drop of temperature at same previous voltage. Other than the chip on the die, 100% worth it.


That chip just took some of the blank silicon off the top there, but it might make the whole die itself more fragile in the future so be careful with it.


----------



## vasyltheonly

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> That chip just took some of the blank silicon off the top there, but it might make the whole die itself more fragile in the future so be careful with it.


Oh trust me, my heart is still pounding from when I saw that on the die. I think that was the most stressful part of this whole thing. The delid was far easier than installing the cpu after seeing that last night. But thank you, you actually made me feel much better.


----------



## wizardbro

Is it worth delidding a 4690k if I'm using regular TIM? I've got a delid tool so it would take seconds to do.
Reading this thread tho it seems like it's not worth it because TIM breaks down, or is that wrong?

Edit: I mean bare die use cases only.


----------



## Xox1de

day 4, prime95 temps (72 69 71 71) still the same as day 1. so far pushout is non existant.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> day 4, prime95 temps (72 69 71 71) still the same as day 1. so far pushout is non existant.


Water or Air?

Let us know if you make 2 weeks w/o issue. Kinda doubtful but those Temps are a bit high considering an average of 70.75c

Is that base temp or full load?









Pushout doesn't happen instantly. It takes some time to happen. But you'll know when it'starts happening when your Temps start increasing steadily over what your base temp is.

One question however, how can you expect to be taken seriously Rep ping Xoxide? I used to shop with them too. Now I'm primarily a PPCs and MNPCTech shopper. But I would never choose to Rep any company unless I was truly a Rep for that company. You might consider changing up the screenname.









~Ceadder


----------



## Xox1de

Air, Hyper 212 Evo, full load prime95 temps. Before delid was 84ish C.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Water or Air?
> 
> Let us know if you make 2 weeks w/o issue. Kinda doubtful but those Temps are a bit high considering an average of 70.75c
> 
> Is that base temp or full load?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pushout doesn't happen instantly. It takes some time to happen. But you'll know when it'starts happening when your Temps start increasing steadily over what your base temp is.
> 
> One question however, how can you expect to be taken seriously Rep ping Xoxide? I used to shop with them too. Now I'm primarily a PPCs and MNPCTech shopper. But I would never choose to Rep any company unless I was truly a Rep for that company. You might consider changing up the screenname.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


From my testing was anywhere between 24 hrs (NT-H1) to 5 days (GC Extreme), however on my i5 3350p (35w chip) has not happened yet with GC extreme over a period of a couple months.

Now provided he actually delided it correctly and removed the silicone (you know not buying into that bull that the real issue is the Intel TIM) its going to happen eventually, and 20$ says you won't hear about it in this thread from that guy as to keep his ego up.

There is a solid, scientific reason as to why everyone recommends (and real professionals like Silicon Lottery) use CLU and not TIM on the die.

"IHS is removed from the CPU using various methods proven to be risk free.
VRMs and contact pads are coated with liquid electric tape, if applicable.
Stock thermal paste is replaced with Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra.
IHS is sealed back into place, so the CPU can be treated just as if it were stock."


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xox1de*
> 
> Air, Hyper 212 Evo, full load prime95 temps. Before delid was 84ish C.


Give it some time. Pushout doesn't happen overnight except in extreme situations. I fold 24/7 so that would qualify as extreme under an Air Cooler like the Hyper 212 , which for an air cooler is one of the better ones. Prolimatech Coolers are considered better, but the cost doesn't make it the best for me to only get a few C in performance benefits.









~Ceadder


----------



## outofmyheadyo

https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3378&XTCsid=cui8l00e12lpidp7k7qu50lapm51qhc0

Anyone had any experience with this thing
?


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> Is it worth delidding a 4690k if I'm using regular TIM? I've got a delid tool so it would take seconds to do.
> Reading this thread tho it seems like it's not worth it because TIM breaks down, or is that wrong?
> 
> Edit: I mean bare die use cases only.


If you delid or go naked, use liquid metal tim, please.... it's a one time thing, you'll never need to mess with anything and the temps will be amazing.

see images, max temp 85-87c can't remember slept since...



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3378&XTCsid=cui8l00e12lpidp7k7qu50lapm51qhc0
> 
> Anyone had any experience with this thing
> ?


Not yet will order one when I go naked... if I go naked that is... Still unsure.


----------



## nrpeyton

*Why would anyone "not" want to go naked?*

GPU's are practically naked these days (my GTX 1080 certainly doesn't have an IHS on it) and even with normal thermal grizzly kryonaut my temp difference between Core and Water is only about 8c.

I would love to make that even better (and use liquid metal on GPU) but I'm scared it will damage the top of the DIE. (block is okay as its copper).

Definitely putting some conduconaut on my FX-8350 this weekend though


----------



## ForNever

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you delid *or go naked*, use liquid metal tim, please.... it's a one time thing, you'll never need to mess with anything and the temps will be amazing.


I'm all for liquid metal, but please remember using any gallium TIM on a copper based heat sink isn't a good idea, as it's aggressive on copper. It's not anywhere near as aggressive as it is on aluminum, but it will cause pits to form on the surface of the heat sink (if it's copper based). I found that out the hard way. If the heatsink/water block has a nickel finish it's no problem though.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you delid *or go naked*, use liquid metal tim, please.... it's a one time thing, you'll never need to mess with anything and the temps will be amazing.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm all for liquid metal, but please remember using any gallium TIM on a copper based heat sink isn't a good idea, as it's aggressive on copper. It's not anywhere near as aggressive as it is on aluminum, but it will cause pits to form on the surface of the heat sink (if it's copper based). I found that out the hard way. If the heatsink/water block has a nickel finish it's no problem though.
Click to expand...

Only if you go naked.









~Ceadder


----------



## Stige

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> I'm all for liquid metal, but please remember using any gallium TIM on a copper based heat sink isn't a good idea, as it's aggressive on copper. It's not anywhere near as aggressive as it is on aluminum, but it will cause pits to form on the surface of the heat sink (if it's copper based). I found that out the hard way. If the heatsink/water block has a nickel finish it's no problem though.


Nope, zero issues. Use the thing that comes with CLU to get the old paste off and put new one on. Smooth as silk. My Phobya CPU block is copper and has seen Liquid Metals for 3 years now or something, or more.


----------



## Benjiw

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ForNever*
> 
> I'm all for liquid metal, but please remember using any gallium TIM on a copper based heat sink isn't a good idea, as it's aggressive on copper. It's not anywhere near as aggressive as it is on aluminum, but it will cause pits to form on the surface of the heat sink (if it's copper based). I found that out the hard way. If the heatsink/water block has a nickel finish it's no problem though.


It's aggressive on aluminium, on copper it sinks into pores, there is no ill effect.


----------



## methadon36

I'm having a someone local 3d print a delliding tool for 10 bucks. I contacted him last night and sent him the link that has the specs on the tool. it will be done this afternoon and I will go about delid once the post office delivers my liquid medal this afternoon.


----------



## Valgaur

Hi all, I'm back!

And with a flu to boot!


----------



## methadon36

So I had the local Machinist who happens to build 3d printers in house make me a Skylake delid tool. First try was off a little bit but the second try was perfect. I used phobya liquid metal on die and Thermal grizzly Kyronaut. I got almost a 18c drop in temps. While playing bf1 overclocked to 4.9Ghz 1.41 volts it was getting 74c underwater but not it doesn't go past 58c now. I have some pics of the tool that was made up and if anyone needs a contact for custom made tools I will gladly give the email for the guy I used


----------



## Radmanhs

Please tell me I didn't kill my CPU from that scratch on the bottom left


It didn't hit anything externally, but I don't want to go through the whole process of putting it in my system and testing it due to custom watercooling


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> Please tell me I didn't kill my CPU from that scratch on the bottom left
> 
> 
> It didn't hit anything externally, but I don't want to go through the whole process of putting it in my system and testing it due to custom watercooling










Testing it is going to be the only way to find out.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> Please tell me I didn't kill my CPU from that scratch on the bottom left
> 
> 
> It didn't hit anything externally, but I don't want to go through the whole process of putting it in my system and testing it due to custom watercooling


Could you take a closer HD picture of the cut on the PCB? I've seen chips get cuts/notches in those locations before and survive, but is always a chance.


----------



## Radmanhs

This is about as HD as I can get it thanks to my potato phone camera.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> This is about as HD as I can get it thanks to my potato phone camera.


I would try it and hope it works!


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> This is about as HD as I can get it thanks to my potato phone camera.


Do not feel to bad about this. It happens. This is how you learn to be a lot more careful.

I've killed an FX-9590 by cutting the PCB. It look not quite as bad as this, but you could see the break in the tracing with the naked eye. But I hadn't known better and tried the CPU and it was a no post solid CPU light.

My fingers are crossed for you.

PS

I don't like trying processors like that in a good board. Just in case it want's to take something with it.... I had a low end board for testing processors. Never had a cpu with a cut take out a motherboard, but sure as heck nervous about finding out.


----------



## philhalo66

Anyone ever use the silicon lottery delid service? I haven't got the nerve to delid my 3570 myself so i was thinking about sending it in i got a 25C difference between core 1 and core 2


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> Anyone ever use the silicon lottery delid service? I haven't got the nerve to delid my 3570 myself so i was thinking about sending it in i got a 25C difference between core 1 and core 2


If you buy the Delid Die Mate, you will be able to safely delid your processor, with no risk or damage whatsoever. It is very easy with this tool.

There is also the cheaper 3D Printed Delid tools, but you have to be careful with those, because if they are not printed precisely or with the correct strength filament, then they can end up breaking and causing damage to your cpu, since they are used in conjuction with a vice.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

The delid mate cost 100USD in Norway. Cheaper to import perhaps?


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> The delid mate cost 100USD in Norway. Cheaper to import perhaps?


I bought mine straight from CaseKing, it cost 69.99 Euro which is 75.38USD, plus shipping. So yes i'd say it would work out a bit cheaper to import it yourself.

The way I justified the cost of the tool, is that its better to spend $75, then risk damaging a $300-400 cpu. Plus I can delid as many cpu's with it as I want, without having to worry about any damage whatsoever.


----------



## philhalo66

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> If you buy the Delid Die Mate, you will be able to safely delid your processor, with no risk or damage whatsoever. It is very easy with this tool.
> 
> There is also the cheaper 3D Printed Delid tools, but you have to be careful with those, because if they are not printed precisely or with the correct strength filament, then they can end up breaking and causing damage to your cpu, since they are used in conjuction with a vice.


yeah im not confident enough to do something like that, i'd rather leave it to professionals. their website lists it as 49.99 USD so its alot cheaper than a replacement CPU if i botch it up.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> yeah im not confident enough to do something like that, i'd rather leave it to professionals. their website lists it as 49.99 USD so its alot cheaper than a replacement CPU if i botch it up.


Honestly with the Delid Die Mate, you will delid your cpu so easily. Take a look at the following video by Roman, who invented the tool.


----------



## philhalo66

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Honestly with the Delid Die Mate, you will delid your cpu so easily. Take a look at the following video by Roman, who invented the tool.


they dont even ship the the united states so kind of a waste of time telling me about it. plus thats a 90 dollar tool, almost double what silicon lottery charges.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> they dont even ship the the united states so kind of a waste of time telling me about it. plus thats a 90 dollar tool, almost double what silicon lottery charges.


If you PM Roman at Hwbot Forum, his username is "der8auer", he works at CaseKing and can organise it to be shipped to the US.

Yes it may be more than what it costs compared to Silicon Lottery, but if you then change/upgrade your cpu, then it will not cost you anymore to delid again, versus having to pay multiple times for each delid.

It's upto you, just trying to help you with some options.


----------



## philhalo66

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> If you PM Roman at Hwbot Forum, his username is "der8auer", he works at CaseKing and can organise it to be shipped to the US.
> 
> Yes it may be more than what it costs compared to Silicon Lottery, but if you then change/upgrade your cpu, then it will not cost you anymore to delid again, versus having to pay multiple times for each delid.
> 
> It's upto you, just trying to help you with some options.


I won't be upgrading for a while so that's a non issue. ill consider it but over 100 dollars for something i would only use once every few years is pretty steep man.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> I won't be upgrading for a while so that's a non issue. ill consider it but over 100 dollars for something i would only use once every few years is pretty steep man.


For what it is, it is SO overpriced. Theres way cheaper ones on the market that work just as well (if not better) then the delid mate. 100$ is outrageous for what that tool is and does.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> I won't be upgrading for a while so that's a non issue. ill consider it but over 100 dollars for something i would only use once every few years is pretty steep man.


$10 off Silicon Lottery delid: http://www.overclock.net/t/1616199/overclock-net-promo-code-2016/0_20


----------



## methadon36

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> they dont even ship the the united states so kind of a waste of time telling me about it. plus thats a 90 dollar tool, almost double what silicon lottery charges.


The guy i used is state side and his tool is solid


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Will he send to Norway as a gift? That way I can get a delidding tool cheap.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Will he send to Norway as a gift? That way I can get a delidding tool cheap.


If youre in norway check out entersetup.com, i believe hes based in finland or norway not sure.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> If youre in norway check out entersetup.com, i believe hes based in finland or norway not sure.


Hi!

He's out of stock, but seems to be in Finland. I'll email him and talk to him. I can wait without any issues. I don't even have the 6700K yet. Coming in the end of the week.









1+ rep


----------



## Unnatural

Yes, it's from Finland, I was going to suggest it but I forgot the site name


----------



## javiasiva

Hello everyone!

I am new to the site, but I have been reading for quite a while now. Yesterday I finally did the delid of my 4790K (with CLU inside). pro-post delid temps have lowered about 10 degrees with a CoolerMaster Hyper 212 Evo using the thermal compound included. I have managed to get it to 4,8Ghz @ 1,325v on bios (or 1,340v according to CPU-Z) at an average of 82º, which I believe is not bad...(correct me if I am wrong!)

But, after showing the pictures I took of the process to a colleague he has suggested I have applied too little CLU to the DIE, IHS...so I am now a bit concerned I may be missing some of the extra performance I could get (I know every CPU is unique and the same thing won't be valid for 2 different units).

What do you think? Shall I redo it when I have a chance or is it fair enough? Worth saying this was my first ever attempt to do this kind of thing...!


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> Hello everyone!
> 
> I am new to the site, but I have been reading for quite a while now. Yesterday I finally did the delid of my 4790K (with CLU inside). pro-post delid temps have lowered about 10 degrees with a CoolerMaster Hyper 212 Evo using the thermal compound included. I have managed to get it to 4,8Ghz @ 1,325v on bios (or 1,340v according to CPU-Z) at an average of 82º, which I believe is not bad...(correct me if I am wrong!)
> 
> But, after showing the pictures I took of the process to a colleague he has suggested I have applied too little CLU to the DIE, IHS...so I am now a bit concerned I may be missing some of the extra performance I could get (I know every CPU is unique and the same thing won't be valid for 2 different units).
> 
> What do you think? Shall I redo it when I have a chance or is it fair enough? Worth saying this was my first ever attempt to do this kind of thing...!


Definitely plenty on there, I'd say you're set!


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> Hello everyone!
> 
> I am new to the site, but I have been reading for quite a while now. Yesterday I finally did the delid of my 4790K (with CLU inside). pro-post delid temps have lowered about 10 degrees with a CoolerMaster Hyper 212 Evo using the thermal compound included. I have managed to get it to 4,8Ghz @ 1,325v on bios (or 1,340v according to CPU-Z) at an average of 82º, which I believe is not bad...(correct me if I am wrong!)
> 
> But, after showing the pictures I took of the process to a colleague he has suggested I have applied too little CLU to the DIE, IHS...so I am now a bit concerned I may be missing some of the extra performance I could get (I know every CPU is unique and the same thing won't be valid for 2 different units).
> 
> What do you think? Shall I redo it when I have a chance or is it fair enough? Worth saying this was my first ever attempt to do this kind of thing...!


non-sense, You've got plenty on there. Any more and I'd be a bit worried about it seeping towards the not-covered FIVR's though. 82°c sounds reasonable depending on the program (considering its a 4790k and 212 evo) but what were the temps like before?


----------



## fleetfeather

I've never used that much CLU. Now I see why people seem to kill their processors all the time


----------



## Radmanhs

IT LIVES


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> Hello everyone!
> 
> I am new to the site, but I have been reading for quite a while now. Yesterday I finally did the delid of my 4790K (with CLU inside). pro-post delid temps have lowered about 10 degrees with a CoolerMaster Hyper 212 Evo using the thermal compound included. I have managed to get it to 4,8Ghz @ 1,325v on bios (or 1,340v according to CPU-Z) at an average of 82º, which I believe is not bad...(correct me if I am wrong!)
> 
> But, after showing the pictures I took of the process to a colleague he has suggested I have applied too little CLU to the DIE, IHS...so I am now a bit concerned I may be missing some of the extra performance I could get (I know every CPU is unique and the same thing won't be valid for 2 different units).
> 
> What do you think? Shall I redo it when I have a chance or is it fair enough? Worth saying this was my first ever attempt to do this kind of thing...!


First post to OCN is about the CPU you just delided. I think you just unlocked some type of achievement!

Looks perfect actually. No bubbles or accumulations.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> Hello everyone!
> 
> I am new to the site, but I have been reading for quite a while now. Yesterday I finally did the delid of my 4790K (with CLU inside). pro-post delid temps have lowered about 10 degrees with a CoolerMaster Hyper 212 Evo using the thermal compound included. I have managed to get it to 4,8Ghz @ 1,325v on bios (or 1,340v according to CPU-Z) at an average of 82º, which I believe is not bad...(correct me if I am wrong!)
> 
> But, after showing the pictures I took of the process to a colleague he has suggested I have applied too little CLU to the DIE, IHS...so I am now a bit concerned I may be missing some of the extra performance I could get (I know every CPU is unique and the same thing won't be valid for 2 different units).
> 
> What do you think? Shall I redo it when I have a chance or is it fair enough? Worth saying this was my first ever attempt to do this kind of thing...!


That is a pro application. Well done, anymore may be too much, the mirror finish and the constant stretching of the CLU with the brush to get to the edges is what you are after. I feel you are good to go!


----------



## vasyltheonly

Has anyone been running at above 1.4v on their 4790K for the past year or so? That is my expected necessary lifetime of the CPU and since my temps are ok after delid, I am able to push it to 4.9. Your experience with this will be great.


----------



## javiasiva

Thank you very much guys! That is a real relief! When I was doing it I was pretty sure I was doing it the right way...then this friend started seeing faults...









I would say temps wise I have improved a lot, pre-delid I was getting the 82º average at pretty much stock voltages (4,[email protected],225), getting to this point (4,[email protected],325) before delid was impossible, the chip would start throttling went setting it @ 1,275v (obviously with temps along 90-100 degrees according to hwinfo)

I have testest both with XTU and IntelBurnTest, but it is true that this second one reaches the temp limit and cpu start throttling down every now and then....I was hopping to get the to the magic 5Ghz...but I believe I will stick down here...maybe test 4,9Ghz but according to my calcs I will need to apply 0,050v more (1,375v total on bios, probably about 1,40 on CPU-Z) and I will probably start to be uncomfortable temps wise...anyway....providing I am under a Hyper 212 I believe it has been quite an improvement!


----------



## GreedyMuffin

I might purchase the delidding tool and such.

But is CLP the way to go between IHS and DIE, or is Gelid extreme good enough?

Can I use CLP between the block and ihs as well?


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> I might purchase the delidding tool and such.
> 
> But is CLP the way to go between IHS and DIE, or is Gelid extreme good enough?
> 
> Can I use CLP between the block and ihs as well?


Any "liquid metal" will do, conventional pastes suffer from pump-out.
You shouldn't use CLP on aluminum as it will pretty much just fall apart. It also tarnishes copper to the point where you need to use sandpaper to clean it off, but there shouldn't be any performance penalties. It's fine to use if your heatsink is nickel plated.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> Thank you very much guys! That is a real relief! When I was doing it I was pretty sure I was doing it the right way...then this friend started seeing faults...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I would say temps wise I have improved a lot, pre-delid I was getting the 82º average at pretty much stock voltages (4,[email protected],225), getting to this point (4,[email protected],325) before delid was impossible, the chip would start throttling went setting it @ 1,275v (obviously with temps along 90-100 degrees according to hwinfo)
> 
> I have testest both with XTU and IntelBurnTest, but it is true that this second one reaches the temp limit and cpu start throttling down every now and then....I was hopping to get the to the magic 5Ghz...but I believe I will stick down here...maybe test 4,9Ghz but according to my calcs I will need to apply 0,050v more (1,375v total on bios, probably about 1,40 on CPU-Z) and I will probably start to be uncomfortable temps wise...anyway....providing I am under a Hyper 212 I believe it has been quite an improvement!


The thinner the application the better. Nothing compares to copper in terms of thermal transfer. In a perfect world youd want to fuse the IHS to the die with nothing in between lol. Other then that we're forced to use TIM/LMs. Your applications look fantastic, if you notice your temps are still too high with a delid you could always try repasting again with either more or less CLU. For me i apply, then test then reapply if necessary. I run bare die though.


----------



## 9colai

I'm currently waiting for my new rockit 88 delid tool arrive with the mail! I already have some CLU and glue ready.

My 3770k is hitting about 90 Celsius with prime95 at 4,5GHz and 1,24 vcore, so I hope to achieve good results now when it's an Ivy bridge and the vcore is fairly good :-D.

I'll reply again when I hopefully are ready to join the club


----------



## javiasiva

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The thinner the application the better. Nothing compares to copper in terms of thermal transfer. In a perfect world youd want to fuse the IHS to the die with nothing in between lol. Other then that we're forced to use TIM/LMs. Your applications look fantastic, if you notice your temps are still too high with a delid you could always try repasting again with either more or less CLU. For me i apply, then test then reapply if necessary. I run bare die though.


That is what I thought! But then my friend made me doubt with things like "huuumm...you've left a bit of thermal adhesive, you have applied to little CLU...." NON SENSE!









I believe I am sticking to 4,8...currently lowering the voltages as much as possible, I would be willing to push it a little bit more...but for daily usage 82º average @ full feels like a little on the hot side for me...providing it is winter and the house is cooler...just if only having a better heatsink...







(or not sharing my case with 2 R290 "oven style")


----------



## GreedyMuffin

I'm using Aida64 now with my 6700K.

1.264V at 4600. Max temp is 51'C. This is without delid. I don't think It's worth delidding this?

Temp is 45-45-47-47 between the cores.


----------



## javiasiva

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> I'm using Aida64 now with my 6700K.
> 
> 1.264V at 4600. Max temp is 51'C. This is without delid. I don't think It's worth delidding this?
> 
> Temp is 45-45-47-47 between the cores.


Nah, in your case I wouldn't do it, those are brilliant temps


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> I'm using Aida64 now with my 6700K.
> 
> 1.264V at 4600. Max temp is 51'C. This is without delid. I don't think It's worth delidding this?
> 
> Temp is 45-45-47-47 between the cores.


Hard to say for sure, but I would guess your gains would be very minimal - that's very good core spread. Even after a delid it's rare to have less than 2C difference between them fully loaded.

Seems that's a great chip, though I don't have much experience with the new gen so maybe not so surprising.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Will check more if there is not more than only 2'C between the cores. It seems too good to be true. ^^

Testing 4800 at 1.352V with cache at 4500. Is that an OK chip?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I'd say so... Silicon Lottery believes 4.8GHz at less than 1.424V to be worth nearly $50 premium over retail...









Reference Link


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I'd say so... Silicon Lottery believes 4.8GHz at less than 1.424V to be worth nearly $50 premium over retail...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reference Link


Thank you!

I'm happy if it's stable! :-D


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Cinebench R15

998

Cache at 4400, core at 4500. Voltage is 1.216V. Max temps is 52-53-51-52'C. So the spread is the best I've ever seen.









I'll drop the idea of deliding, keep this at 4500 for the low 50s in temps and game happily!

Thank you all for your help!


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Cinebench R15
> 
> 998
> 
> Cache at 4400, core at 4500. Voltage is 1.216V. Max temps is 52-53-51-52'C. So the spread is the best I've ever seen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll drop the idea of deliding, keep this at 4500 for the low 50s in temps and game happily!
> 
> Thank you all for your help!


Very consistent.

I never thought much about how consistent the core temperatures were until I read your post, so I decided to try it myself.

4864MHz, 1.39 VCore (fixed) I got 57°, 57°, 54°, 53° running Cinebench R15 CPU test (1075).

Not as consistent as yours, but not too bad I guess...


----------



## 9colai

Sign me up! :-D

Pictures of the delid process:












An average temp drop of approximately 17,5 celcius at 4,5 GHz

I'm currently testing 4,6 GHz which went over 93 celcius before delid and the max temp is now 71 celcius under prime95 stress test!

I hope to hit 4,7 GHz, 4,8 GHz would be even better, but I think i will hit a voltage wall before i can reach that (1,4 as max)

The CPU is cooled by an corsair H80i GT cooler with noctua nf-p12 fans


----------



## feznz

Anyone got a theory why Intel does not use CLU as TIM it would save us a lot of hassle with these de-lids here


----------



## Ceadderman

Cost. Strictly cost. The cost of their supplies is counted in their annual budget. The TIM they use is cheaper in bulk than CLU or CLP would be. If they used either it would make the MSRP higher and they likely believe that would impact their bottom line negatively. Profit goes to day to day operation as well as R&D. Less money means lower R&D budget. There are obviously other business related reasons but to keep this simple I narowed it down to the basic reasons.

Of course some of that budget could be sorted out by maintaining a proper gap between the die and the IHS with less adhesive being applied. Pushout wouldn't happen to their chips and the need for CLU wouldn't be.

So in effect they don't need CLU. It would be great if they used it but not necessarily needed.

~Ceadder


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> Anyone got a theory why Intel does not use CLU as TIM it would save us a lot of hassle with these de-lids here


As a mechanical engineer, I assume that it's not only related to the cost of TIM, but also the challenges in high volume production process equipment that handles the IHS with diretcly contact on the chip, and it has to glue it at the same time. This kind of process equipment can be surprisingly limited at higher volume productions.


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *9colai*
> 
> Sign me up! :-D
> 
> Pictures of the delid process:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> An average temp drop of approximately 17,5 celcius at 4,5 GHz
> 
> I'm currently testing 4,6 GHz which went over 93 celcius before delid and the max temp is now 71 celcius under prime95 stress test!
> 
> I hope to hit 4,7 GHz, 4,8 GHz would be even better, but I think i will hit a voltage wall before i can reach that (1,4 as max)
> 
> The CPU is cooled by an corsair H80i GT cooler with noctua nf-p12 fans


I might be able to run at 4,8 GHz @ 1,425 Vcore... The max temps are 81 celcius (still lower than 85 @ 4,5GHz before delid), i expect it to be lower than 80 celcius at normal usage. Has anybody ever experienced degredation or a chip dying at this voltage?


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *9colai*
> 
> Sign me up! :-D
> 
> Pictures of the delid process:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> An average temp drop of approximately 17,5 celcius at 4,5 GHz
> 
> I'm currently testing 4,6 GHz which went over 93 celcius before delid and the max temp is now 71 celcius under prime95 stress test!
> 
> I hope to hit 4,7 GHz, 4,8 GHz would be even better, but I think i will hit a voltage wall before i can reach that (1,4 as max)
> 
> The CPU is cooled by an corsair H80i GT cooler with noctua nf-p12 fans


Very good job!


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Very good job!


Thank you! The delid tool with the provided guide made it quite ready . I made a test on my old i5 before I tried with the i7 and it was a success both times


----------



## javiasiva

I was just curious as run a stress test with RealTemp to check the temp spread between cores...and found it is not as even as I would expect!

Any advice? Or worth re-doing the delid?


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> I was just curious as run a stress test with RealTemp to check the temp spread between cores...and found it is not as even as I would expect!
> 
> Any advice? Or worth re-doing the delid?


I saw the same tendency on both if my newly delidded cpu's 1 core is lower than the rest, and it was either the first or the last core. I've seen another guy with the same result so I don't think that it's a problem


----------



## 0ldChicken

Hey, so I have noticed since my last update less than 4 months ago, that my naked mount temps have gone up about 10°c using IBT on high and xtu. I've been using Phoyba LM and I'm wondering if CLU will make a difference? I've noticed temp increases before and upon investigating have found less LM than I put there. I've used the waterblock a few times before so it's been stained with LM already.

Here is an AWFUL picture of my LM application, I also applied a very thin coating to the inside of the IHS since I had issues in the past with temps going up and it becoming dryish.

anyone else experince temp increases with Phoyba LM? I'm assuming switching to CLU will help but any input is appreciated

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> I was just curious as run a stress test with RealTemp to check the temp spread between cores...and found it is not as even as I would expect!
> 
> Any advice? Or worth re-doing the delid?


5c isn't too bad of a spread, i wouldn't worry about it at all


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> 
> anyone else experince temp increases with Phoyba LM? I'm assuming switching to CLU will help but any input is appreciated


I have found zero difference between the two LMs. I switched about a year ago to Phyobia for the price, and temps were then, and are now the same as they were with CLU. I have been quite pleased with Phyobia, and it is now on 4 GPUs and 2 CPUs in my home.

Your mileage may vary.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have found zero difference between the two LMs. I switched about a year ago to Phyobia for the price, and temps were then, and are now the same as they were with CLU. I have been quite pleased with Phyobia, and it is now on 4 GPUs and 2 CPUs in my home.
> 
> Your mileage may vary.


Thanks! Perhaps I'll give it one more try and use just a tiny bit more next time I have things apart. Are any of your cpu/gpu's using LM being pushed hard? I guess it's probably worth noting that I was running 5.0ghz @ 1.4v pretty much the entire time. Heat was never an issue as my gaming temps are still in the 50's but bench temps are up with same ambient temps.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I have found zero difference between the two LMs. I switched about a year ago to Phyobia for the price, and temps were then, and are now the same as they were with CLU. I have been quite pleased with Phyobia, and it is now on 4 GPUs and 2 CPUs in my home.
> 
> Your mileage may vary.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! Perhaps I'll give it one more try and use just a tiny bit more next time I have things apart. Are any of your cpu/gpu's using LM being pushed hard? I guess it's probably worth noting that I was running 5.0ghz @ 1.4v pretty much the entire time. Heat was never an issue as my gaming temps are still in the 50's but bench temps are up with same ambient temps.
Click to expand...

Yes, all components are being run overclocked and overvolted. The 3570k is naked under a copper EK block and runs 5.0 @1.38, the 5820k is 4.5 @ 1.36 under a plated EK block, and all of my GPUs are pretty much max clocks with modded bioses at max voltage, all with EK blocks.

Completely off topic here, but my daughter just poured water into my x99 rig from her sippy cup. I was away from the keyboard and didn't see it happen. The PC was on when I walked away, and I came back to a blank monitor...then I saw the water on the top air vent...I yanked the plug at the wall, pulled out my trusty heat gun...and besides a usb header on the board that seems to have given up, all the rest of the hardware is fine....I feel very lucky in this moment.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Yes, all components are being run overclocked and overvolted. The 3570k is naked under a copper EK block and runs 5.0 @1.38, the 5820k is 4.5 @ 1.36 under a plated EK block, and all of my GPUs are pretty much max clocks with modded bioses at max voltage, all with EK blocks.
> 
> Completely off topic here, but my daughter just poured water into my x99 rig from her sippy cup. I was away from the keyboard and didn't see it happen. The PC was on when I walked away, and I came back to a blank monitor...then I saw the water on the top air vent...I yanked the plug at the wall, pulled out my trusty heat gun...and besides a usb header on the board that seems to have given up, all the rest of the hardware is fine....I feel very lucky in this moment.


Glad to hear the LM is withstanding all of that torture! Thanks








Terribly sorry to hear about that incident though! the irony of a watercooled rig like that being done in by a toddler with a sippy cup would've been too much. Glad everything is ok


----------



## wizardbro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Benjiw*
> 
> If you delid or go naked, use liquid metal tim, please.... it's a one time thing, you'll never need to mess with anything and the temps will be amazing.
> 
> see images, max temp 85-87c can't remember slept since...
> 
> 
> 
> Not yet will order one when I go naked... if I go naked that is... Still unsure.


Alright, so I should put CLU inside, and TIM outside?
Any idea if going naked with CLU would give better results?
I'd prefer option number one, if the difference is very minor ~1c because It's easier to reseat the waterblock when there's TIM under it.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> Alright, so I should put CLU inside, and TIM outside?
> Any idea if going naked with CLU would give better results?
> I'd prefer option number one, if the difference is very minor ~1c because It's easier to reseat the waterblock when there's TIM under it.


Depends on the voltage. I went naked and saw about a 5-6°C from delided to naked. Was enough for me to do it since the EKWB screws were ridiculously cheap thought id give it a try. I5 4690k with an ambient of around 23-24°C reaches around 48°C under full stress. Before that was around 52-53°C at the same voltage.


----------



## wizardbro

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Depends on the voltage. I went naked and saw about a 5-6°C from delided to naked. Was enough for me to do it since the EKWB screws were ridiculously cheap thought id give it a try. I5 4690k with an ambient of around 23-24°C reaches around 48°C under full stress. Before that was around 52-53°C at the same voltage.


Oh, wow. Is the CLU easy to remove off the waterblock? Worried about it damaging it.


----------



## bluej511

false
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> Oh, wow. Is the CLU easy to remove off the waterblock? Worried about it damaging it.


Its probably going to stain it but thats not an issue. Ive removed it and reapplied it quite a few times (testing purposes and i changed CPUs), havent had an issue removing it but it hasnt been on more then 2months when i removed it. Right now its been on a while and i have no intention on removing it yet. When i did, it was quite easy, ran a quick stress test, turned off the PC and removed the waterblock right away, it wiped right off with an alcohol pad like nothing.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> Oh, wow. Is the CLU easy to remove off the waterblock? Worried about it damaging it.


It gets pretty deep into copper. Which I think technically makes it better, because it fills the natural voids in the copper. I tried to get it all the way clean one time, and even lapped my block, but it was stained beyond surface deep. Now I just clean with alcohol and reapply.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> It gets pretty deep into copper. Which I think technically makes it better, because it fills the natural voids in the copper. I tried to get it all the way clean one time, and even lapped my block, but it was stained beyond surface deep. Now I just clean with alcohol and reapply.


Might even make it better for using TIM afterwords, making the need for TIM even less therefore working better.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Regardless of what is happening in the 'staining' (which I think inedenimadam is correct about) - it's a non-issue either way. We know the thermal transfer capability of the CLU, as well as the block are constants... so even if it were 'pitting' the block (_which it's not doing_) it would simply require slightly more CLU on a subsequent reapplication to fill those voids.

In any case it's a CPU->CLU/CLP->Heatsink/Block thermal flow... which isn't ever going to be better than the capabilities of the CLU/CLP beyond a nominal amount induced by seating irregularities (which again would be an issue of voids in the surface or pump-out, etc.)

I will certainly admit to being neither a genius nor an expert in thermodynamics - but if there are known transfer rates of both materials (and both are much, much higher than air) then there shouldn't be a significant variance unless there's a similarly significant change in the mated materials.

Is this thinking wrong somewhere?


----------



## StullenAndi

Who want´s to see whats under the hood from a Kaby Lake CPU?


----------



## wizardbro

I want to see some game benchmarks


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> I want to see some game benchmarks


You can't when the delid kills the CPU. That's often what happens after pictures then silence...


----------



## sakrosankt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> You can't when the delid kills the CPU. That's often what happens after pictures then silence...


http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f139/intel-ivy-bridge-haswell-skylake-gekoepft-erfahrungen-ohne-hs-mit-gewechseltem-tim-891243-338.html#post25150844


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mouacyk*
> 
> You can't when the delid kills the CPU. That's often what happens after pictures then silence...


Oh no Sir, it works just as fine as before


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Oh no Sir, it works just as fine as before


Is it possible to get it higher than 5 ghz? And was it easy so far? :-D


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Oh no Sir, it works just as fine as before


2 hours so far on that prime 95 is actually pretty good. You know what would be more impressive? 2 more hours but on small fft 8K, which is pure core stability.


----------



## StullenAndi

This prime run is just for comparism. For stability testing Linx is used. And yes, it does the big 5 with less then 1.3V stable. But thats another topic, here I just won´t to share some pics about the delidding.



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *9colai*
> 
> Is it possible to get it higher than 5 ghz? And was it easy so far? :-D


5.2G with less then 1.4v was possible on cinebench and blender. on hwluxx you can find some pictures.


----------



## tiger style

I delidded my 6700K with a Rockit88 last night. No pressing issues to do it but did it anyway. The Rockit88 was very easy to use and took seconds to delid. CLU on the die and Kryonaut on the IHS/waterblock.

Using RealBench Stress Test:

Before (68, 67, 67, 70)


After (54, 53, 54, 55)


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> This prime run is just for comparism. For stability testing Linx is used. And yes, it does the big 5 with less then 1.3V stable. But thats another topic, here I just won´t to share some pics about the delidding.
> 
> 
> 5.2G with less then 1.4v was possible on cinebench and blender. on hwluxx you can find some pictures.


Awesome, I'm looking forward to see how they clock in average


----------



## StullenAndi

I think on monday you can find a bunch of postings about the overclocking capabilities.


----------



## wizardbro

Is there a review embargo going out on monday?
If these can hit 5ghz reliably, I'm going to upgrade. My Devils canyon was supposed to hit 5ghz too... but it can't even run 4.8ghz without overvolting a lot.
4.7ghz at 1.33v on 4690k atm.


----------



## StullenAndi

Hehe no, a few peoples order will arrive on monday, that´s the only reason.


----------



## Chaoszero55

Anyone just used heat gun plus vice on 6700k? I dont think my hand is steady enough for razor


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> Is there a review embargo going out on monday?
> If these can hit 5ghz reliably, I'm going to upgrade. My Devils canyon was supposed to hit 5ghz too... but it can't even run 4.8ghz without overvolting a lot.
> 4.7ghz at 1.33v on 4690k atm.


My first one did [email protected] and [email protected], my new one does [email protected] the silicon lottery is real haha.


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chaoszero55*
> 
> Anyone just used heat gun plus vice on 6700k? I dont think my hand is steady enough for razor


Very bad idea with Skylake. The pcb is so thin and bends very easily. Just get a cheapndelid tool and save your sels from many problems.

https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool


----------



## StullenAndi

The second 7700k delidded for my brother is slightly better then the first one.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> The second 7700k delidded for my brother is slightly better then the first one.


damn, 5.0 GHz under 1.3v... That's some sweet stuff right there


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> The second 7700k delidded for my brother is slightly better then the first one.


That IHS looks ridiculously beefy. I wonder if they will run a whole lot cooler running bare die.


----------



## Chaoszero55

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> Very bad idea with Skylake. The pcb is so thin and bends very easily. Just get a cheapndelid tool and save your sels from many problems.
> 
> https://www.youmagine.com/designs/skylake-delid-tool


Thanks for the link; will try to use the 3d printer at work


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> damn, 5.0 GHz under 1.3v... That's some sweet stuff right there


Unfortunately, the screenshot does not show VCore at full load...


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> This prime run is just for comparism. For stability testing Linx is used. And yes, *it does the big 5 with less then 1.3V stable*. But thats another topic, here I just won´t to share some pics about the delidding.
> snip
> 5.2G with less then 1.4v was possible on cinebench and blender. on hwluxx you can find some pictures.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> The second 7700k delidded for my brother is slightly better then the first one.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> damn, 5.0 GHz under 1.3v... That's some sweet stuff right there


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Unfortunately, the screenshot does not show VCore at full load...


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Unfortunately, the screenshot does not show VCore at full load...


I wonder If you realbench guys know what full load is?


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> I wonder If you realbench guys know what full load is?


Excuse me? I can only surmise you meant that as an insult?

My post did not imply, nor explicitly state, that you were applying less than 'full load'.

My post did state that I see no evidence of maximum VCore at that 'full load'. CPU-Z, as I am certain you are aware, will display a constantly varying voltage. I merely want to confirm that the voltage in your screen shot is the maximum?

If you feel like it, and you are certainly under no obligation to do so, then screenshots of HWiNFO running concurrently with your stress-testing application of choice (LinX, I presume) would help to demonstrate the actual maximum VCore.

However, it is up to you.

Again, despite what you may wish to believe, I was only wanting to see actual low, high, and average voltages during the testing.

BTW, I usually use Intel Burn Test as my stress application, although RealBench can be useful. I believe multiple applications should be used.


----------



## mouacyk

Quote:


> In no way should it be misconstrued that I do not disagree.


----------



## sakrosankt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Excuse me?


With all due respect but LinX is equal to full load ... Keep in mind that Realbench or Prime95 aren't as stressful as LinX.


----------



## Arctucas

OK guys, is anyone actually reading what I post?

Please quote my post where I say that a 'full load' is not applied?


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Unfortunately, the screenshot does not show VCore at full load...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> OK guys, is anyone actually reading what I post?
> 
> Please quote my post where I say that a 'full load' is not applied?


Cpuz shows the current vcore voltage being used at any given time. As the cpu was at 100% load in the screenshot, the 1.28 volts in cpuz is the vcore voltage at that load and multiplier.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Excuse me? I can only surmise you meant that as an insult?
> 
> My post did not imply, nor explicitly state, that you were applying less than 'full load'.
> 
> *My post did state that I see no evidence of maximum VCore at that 'full load'. CPU-Z, as I am certain you are aware, will display a constantly varying voltage. I merely want to confirm that the voltage in your screen shot is the maximum?*
> 
> If you feel like it, and you are certainly under no obligation to do so, then screenshots of HWiNFO running concurrently with your stress-testing application of choice (LinX, I presume) would help to demonstrate the actual maximum VCore.
> 
> However, it is up to you.
> 
> Again, despite what you may wish to believe, I was only wanting to see actual low, high, and average voltages during the testing.
> 
> BTW, I usually use Intel Burn Test as my stress application, although RealBench can be useful. I believe multiple applications should be used.


He did included multiple applications in each screenshot confirming that the CPU was at 100% when taken. CPU-z has always shown me the "current" voltage being applied to the CPU so I have no problems with what he submitted being truthful to the full load voltage that was being applied during that stress test. Doesn't really matter anyways since he's just putting them out there for us to look at anyways, but I don't see the problem you have with it not showing full load voltage? Seems apparent to me, perhaps you just missed it? Perhaps I'm a naive fool?









Looks like core temp and task manager showing 100% usage in the bottom left of both screenies in the spoiler


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







edit: ah I see, perhaps you meant that he may have encountered higher voltages at some point in the test then at the time of screenshots. But saying "Unfortunately, the screenshot does not show VCore at full load..." STRONGLY infers that it was showing something besides full load


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Cpuz shows the current vcore voltage being used at any given time. As the cpu was at 100% load in the screenshot, the 1.28 volts in cpuz is the vcore voltage at that load and multiplier.


I am not accusing @StullenAndi of anything nefarious. If he has taken that from my comment, I wish to convey that is not my intent.

However, look at the CoreTemp display. The current temperature at the time the screenshot was taken.

Here is a some quick runs of IBT I did with CoreTemp showing temperatures, CPU-Z showing voltages (I know they are off, but that is how CPU-Z works with my motherboard), and Process Explorer showing CPU usage.

At idle:



At 100% (or at least as much as IBT can apply at the setting I used) load:



In between first and second pass:


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> I am not accusing @StullenAndi of anything nefarious. If he has taken that from my comment, I wish to convey that is not my intent.
> 
> However, look at the CoreTemp display. The current temperature at the time the screenshot was taken.
> 
> Here is a some quick runs of IBT I did with CoreTemp showing temperatures, CPU-Z showing voltages (I know they are off, but that is how CPU-Z works with my motherboard), and Process Explorer showing CPU usage.
> 
> At idle:
> 
> 
> 
> At 100% (or at least as much as IBT can apply at the setting I used) load:
> 
> 
> 
> In between first and second pass:


From having seen your other screenshots, where there is something strange going on with your VID readings stopping at 1.22 volts, when you overclock your cpu, id say the same is happening here, where your cpuz vcore reading is not going over 0.600 volts.

Its something to do with your particular board and either the sensors are not reporting correctly or the software is reading incorrectly on your board.

I think you said you had an EVGA board, have you tried using EVGA's own monitoring utility for your board and seeing what that displays?

Also does your board have voltage probes, that you can connect a DMM to and check the readings?


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> From having seen your other screenshots, where there is something strange going on with your VID readings stopping at 1.22 volts, when you overclock your cpu, id say the same is happening here, where your cpuz vcore reading is not going over 0.600 volts.
> 
> Its something to do with your particular board and either the sensors are not reporting correctly or the software is reading incorrectly on your board.
> 
> I think you said you had an EVGA board, have you tried using EVGA's own monitoring utility for your board and seeing what that displays?
> 
> Also does your board have voltage probes, that you can connect a DMM to and check the readings?


The point I was trying to illustrate, notwithstanding the wrong voltage, is that Task Manager can show 100% usage, but looking at the CoreTemp temperature and the voltage in CPU-Z, the processor is not actually at 100%. Otherwise, the Voltage and temperatures would be higher.

As CPU-Z shows the *real-time* voltage, I suggested that using HWiNFO would display the *peak* voltage, as well as the real-time voltage.

I can post screenshots illustrating this, if it will help clarify my point.

Also, HWiNFO and AIDA64, thanks to the assistance I received from Martin Malik and Tamos Miklos, respectively, do show the correct voltages. I asked the makers of CPU-Z if they would update the application to display correct voltages for my motherboard, but I received no reply.


----------



## Chrisch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Unfortunately, the screenshot does not show VCore at full load...


vcore is fix @ 1.28v, same CPU another run but only a photo (but @ 100% load)



same CPU, 1.264v load with lower uncore clock


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> vcore is fix @ 1.28v, same CPU another run but only a photo (but @ 100% load)
> 
> 
> 
> same CPU, 1.264v load with lower uncore clock


Thanks for that.

LLC is disabled, then? VCore never fluctuates?


----------



## Chrisch

LLC is set to 2. On 1 its overvolts at load and at 3 it drops ~60mV load. at setting 2 it is idle & load the same voltage, sometimes it fluctuates a little bit on CPUz depending on the voltage step you set..

for example: 1.300v Bios = 1.280v idle & load and 1.305v Bios = 1.280v idle & 1.296v load (measured with dmm it fluctuates between 1.284 & 1.289v).

Regards
Chris


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> LLC is set to 2. On 1 its overvolts at load and at 3 it drops ~60mV load. at setting 2 it is idle & load the same voltage, sometimes it fluctuates a little bit on CPUz depending on the voltage step you set..
> 
> for example: 1.300v Bios = 1.280v idle & load and 1.305v Bios = 1.280v idle & 1.296v load (measured with dmm it fluctuates between 1.284 & 1.289v).
> 
> Regards
> Chris


Using CPU-Z?

My motherboard has issues with CPU-Z, so I have been using HWiNFO and AIDA64, both of which are reasonably accurate, thanks to the developers of each helping me get the correct sensor readings.

I hesitate to ask, but if it is not too much trouble, would you be able to post a screenshot with HWiNFO showing VCore running alongside your stress application?

If you do not feel like doing so, I understand.


----------



## Chrisch

i have already screens with hwinfo64, but these are earlier tests.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> i have already screens with hwinfo64, but these are earlier tests.


Thank you. This is all I was wanting to see, but somehow things got a bit skewed...

So, the Maximum VCore under the load is 1.312V.

Excellent for 5000 MHz!

I may need to get one to replace my 6700K, which is not bad, but not great.

On the other hand, X299 is coming and if I start saving up now, that could be a better option going forward.

Thanks again.


----------



## Chrisch

No, the maximum vcore at load was 1.296v









and it was good, not excellent









excellent is this one











replacing the 6700K with a 7700K makes only sense for benching, for daily use its not worth. i mean 5GHz instead of 4.7GHz, i think you dont feel the difference









for me its just for fun, playing with new toys


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> No, the maximum vcore at load was 1.296v


Sorry, but does the HWiNFO screenshot not show 1.312V?


----------



## sakrosankt

That's the idle voltage I guess ...


----------



## Chaoszero55

Took the plunge and delidded my 6700k..used a delid tool made at work but somehow the dimensions weren't quite right and I had to file down one side to allow the cpu to fit. After that debacle, thought I fried my coy after a spec of clu got on pcb. Miraculously survived and temps are somewhat better. Near 50c on prime95 at 4.5ghz 1.200vcore.


----------



## Arctucas

Any value reported in the Maximum column is the highest observed during the time HWiNFO is active.


----------



## Chrisch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Any value reported in the Maximum column is the highest observed during the time HWiNFO is active.


and if you look at the time, HWInfo64 was ~25min longer active as LinX because i started it before i start the LinX test


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> and if you look at the time, HWInfo64 was ~25min longer active as LinX because i started it before i start the LinX test


Interesting, what were you running that required higher VCore than LinX?


----------



## sakrosankt

-.- ... The idle voltage is higher because there is no vdroop.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sakrosankt*
> 
> -.- ... The idle voltage is higher because there is no vdroop.


I believe the VCore was set to fixed voltage and LLC was on, therefore, without a substantial load, there should be no significant increase.

I understand all hardware combinations are different. I have my VCore set to Override (fixed voltage) with LLC on Auto, and I can let my rig sit idle for hours with no increase in Maximum VCore, although the Minimum VCore does drop from 1.391 to 1.389 (-.002V).


----------



## Chrisch

omg

i am out now...









think what u want, i know what was and i know what the cpu need (as u can see on the other screens / pics).

i hope u know that there are different LLC steps (1-5) and not only "on" or " off".


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> omg
> 
> i am out now...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> think what u want, i know what was and i know what the cpu need (as u can see on the other screens / pics).
> 
> i hope u know that there are different LLC steps (1-5) and not only "on" or " off".


This is what has confused me *"for example: 1.300v Bios = 1.280v idle & load and 1.305v Bios = 1.280v idle & 1.296v load"* I obviously misinterpret you to say your VCore is sometimes higher under load.

If you prefer to not help me figure it out, no problem. Best of luck in your overclocking.

EDIT:

I did some reading up on the LLC on your AsRock Motherboard.

I believe I understand it.

My board only has Auto (voltage scales with frequency at load and idle), Disable, and Enable (uses Intel specs). I keep it on Auto, with VCore on Override, that is why my VCore does not increase at idle, and only increases under load.

Anyway, sorry to be a bother. Your screenshots were helpful, though.

Thanks.


----------



## mrgnex

So I wanna delid and relid my CPU for safety and reselling reasons. But I have a hard time figuring out what to use to deal the IHS back on. Epoxy of some kind might create a gap I've been trying to fix by delidding and normale glue might not hold.. Does anyone have advice? I couldn't find anything on the internet..


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> So I wanna delid and relid my CPU for safety and reselling reasons. But I have a hard time figuring out what to use to deal the IHS back on. Epoxy of some kind might create a gap I've been trying to fix by delidding and normale glue might not hold.. Does anyone have advice? I couldn't find anything on the internet..


You can use caulk that seems to work best, any type of thin automotive glue would work as well.


----------



## 0ldChicken

I had good results using just a tiny tiny drop of rtv silicone on each corner


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I had good results using just a tiny tiny drop of rtv silicone on each corner


+1, used PermaTex black gasket sealer. A pin-head sized drop on the end of a toothpick.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> You can use caulk that seems to work best, any type of thin automotive glue would work as well.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I had good results using just a tiny tiny drop of rtv silicone on each corner


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> +1, used PermaTex black gasket sealer. A pin-head sized drop on the end of a toothpick.


Awesome! Thank you very much. I'll try and find something similair in my country. Thanks again.


----------



## Chaoszero55

Should have relidded. Don't want to take it out now and hoping I never have to.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chaoszero55*
> 
> Should have relidded. Don't want to take it out now and hoping I never have to.


Reliding is over rated, it will keep its place once secured so its not an issue. But yea you want to use the least amount possible and apply pressure while sealing. Preferably put a dab on each corner then mount it right away so it dries in place with pressure on the IHS.

The common misconception is that the Intel TIM is garbage but its not the case. The main issue is the gap the silicon creates between the IHS and the DIE, therefore needing a thicker application of TIM which in turn makes it function poorly. In a perfect world you want NO gap at all, even a microscopic gap of air is still a gap, hence why we use TIM/LM.


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> So I wanna delid and relid my CPU for safety and reselling reasons. But I have a hard time figuring out what to use to deal the IHS back on. Epoxy of some kind might create a gap I've been trying to fix by delidding and normale glue might not hold.. Does anyone have advice? I couldn't find anything on the internet..


I used Locitie super glue "gel" version. Worked perfectly


----------



## wizardbro

De-lidded for the first time with my 4690k. Put a very very thin layer of clu on the die. Thin enough that the layer looked matte grey instead of shiny metallic silver. Put a small amount under the IHS aswell and gelid extreme dot method on top of the IHS. Silicone glue was scrapped off the pcb etc.

Got a 1 degree drop in temps. Guessing my CLU application was wrong because I know seated my block perfectly. Also forgot to take a pic of the CLU application








I'll just go bare die next time I dismantle my loop.


----------



## Yuhfhrh

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wizardbro*
> 
> De-lidded for the first time with my 4690k. Put a very very thin layer of clu on the die. Thin enough that the layer looked matte grey instead of shiny metallic silver. Put a small amount under the IHS aswell and gelid extreme dot method on top of the IHS. Silicone glue was scrapped off the pcb etc.
> 
> Got a 1 degree drop in temps. Guessing my CLU application was wrong because I know seated my block perfectly. Also forgot to take a pic of the CLU application
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll just go bare die next time I dismantle my loop.


I'm guessing not quite enough CLU.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yuhfhrh*
> 
> I'm guessing not quite enough CLU.


Would be my guess as well, unless its at stock speeds and not overclock but who are we kidding haha. Better to start off too thin and add then too much and have it run.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> *The common misconception is that the Intel TIM is garbage but its not the case*. The main issue is the gap the silicon creates between the IHS and the DIE, therefore needing a thicker application of TIM which in turn makes it function poorly. In a perfect world you want NO gap at all, even a microscopic gap of air is still a gap, hence why we use TIM/LM.


The Intel TIM is garbage, regardless of the gap. All the 6700K's I have delidded, the Intel TIM was very dried up, flaked off, and not covering all of the die.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> The Intel TIM is garbage, regardless of the gap. All the 6700K's I have delidded, the Intel TIM was very dried up, flaked off, and not covering all of the die.


Huh yea and you think that makes it garbage? Id rather have a tim LOOK dried up and still function then one that pumps out like EVERY SINGLE TIM I've tried on the die.

You want the TIM to form a bond that lasts not a bond that lasts a year and needs reapplication. We've been over this way too much for me to start up again, there's even a thread proving that with the .06mm gap caused by the silicon the intel tim did BETTER then the Noctua tim (which is always top 5 in all the tim tests online)


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Huh yea and you think that makes it garbage? Id rather have a tim LOOK dried up and still function then one that pumps out like EVERY SINGLE TIM I've tried on the die.
> 
> You want the TIM to form a bond that lasts not a bond that lasts a year and needs reapplication. We've been over this way too much for me to start up again, there's even a thread proving that with the .06mm gap caused by the silicon the intel tim did BETTER then the Noctua tim (which is always top 5 in all the tim tests online)


The Intel TIM does pump out, hence the reason why there is not full coverage when removing the IHS.

You cannot be serious trying to say, that a TIM application that has dried out completely and is all brittle and broken up into small dried out fragments, that no longer fully covers the die, is a good TIM.

Because that is what i see every time i delid a 6700K and it definitely does not look good at all.

The Noctua paste, while decent is not in the top 5 of all tests online.

http://overclocking.guide/thermal-paste-roundup-2015-47-products-tested-with-air-cooling-and-liquid-nitrogen-ln2/6/

Plus it is a well known fact that liquid metal pastes, like CLU is what needs to be applied after delidding, as it does not pump out.


----------



## Chaoszero55

so CLU shouldnt have any problems "pumping out" ? Never really had issues with any other TIMs pumping out but I did delid my 6700k with some CLU and it would be good to know I shouldnt have to mess with it again


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chaoszero55*
> 
> so CLU shouldnt have any problems "pumping out" ? Never really had issues with any other TIMs pumping out but I did delid my 6700k with some CLU and it would be good to know I shouldnt have to mess with it again


No CLU does not pump out.


----------



## Enzarch

I guess I will toss in two cents, I have run a bare die 4690k since release under an EK Supremacy. The only TIMs I did not have pump-out with out of a half dozen choices were ICDiamond and CLU, and ICD left something to be desired.

The poor thermals and lack of 'pump' on the Intel TIM I think has less to do with the composition and more with the application, IIRC the IHS from the factory applies little to no pressure on the silicon itself. I would bet the Intel TIM would perform well but also pump right out of a typical bare application.


----------



## paskowitz

Yeah... Intel's TIMs are not garbage. Given how many CPUs they have to make a year, with very low tolerances, the fact that there are so few bad eggs is nothing short of impressive and should be appreciated. Intel reps even stopped by for an OCN podcast talking about this subject. The paste they use is very intentionally the way it is to provide the best results for thousands, millions of chips on average. Could they use a TIM with better thermal performance? Sure. But that isn't the only metric of importance. I wouldn't be surprised if they try to improve other aspects like the die/ihs gap through tighter milling in the future.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Yeah... Intel's TIMs are not garbage. Given how many CPUs they have to make a year, with very low tolerances, the fact that there are so few bad eggs is nothing short of impressive and should be appreciated. Intel reps even stopped by for an OCN podcast talking about this subject. The paste they use is very intentionally the way it is to provide the best results for thousands, millions of chips on average. Could they use a TIM with better thermal performance? Sure. But that isn't the only metric of importance. I wouldn't be surprised if they try to improve other aspects like the die/ihs gap through tighter milling in the future.


THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Chaoszero55

Pretty sure there are posts somewhere on this forum with lots of comparison TIMs to show that it is, in fact, the gap caused by the black sealant that accounts for a large percentage of the poor thermals with lidded chips. CLU might be a little better just because it is a fact that meta conducts heat much better than most TIMs on the market but yes it is the gap.


----------



## Chaoszero55

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Yeah... Intel's TIMs are not garbage. Given how many CPUs they have to make a year, with very low tolerances, the fact that there are so few bad eggs is nothing short of impressive and should be appreciated. Intel reps even stopped by for an OCN podcast talking about this subject. The paste they use is very intentionally the way it is to provide the best results for thousands, millions of chips on average. Could they use a TIM with better thermal performance? Sure. But that isn't the only metric of importance. I wouldn't be surprised if they try to improve other aspects like the die/ihs gap through tighter milling in the future.


Yep, for the majority of users, the TIM works fine and people who dont overclock prob won't see ridiculous temps anyway.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And there goes the noobish reply of the century. You keep going on and on and on about the 6700k so thats your experience well done.
> 
> Second, it is FACT that the intel tim is not the issue. Actual, undeniable FACT and not idiots on the internet going around saying intel tim is garbage. I will end it here as people in this thread already know without people coming in and spewing worthless information that intel tim hasn't and was never the issue.


I never said that the TIM is solely responsible for the higher temps, prior to delidding. I know full well that the gap between the die and the IHS is the main factor of increased temps, but the Intel TIM that is used is not of the high quality you are making it out to be.
Compared to Kryonaut and Gelid Extreme it is garbage and has been proven multiple times in overclocking scenarios, such as tested in the following thread.

http://forum.hwbot.org/showthread.php?t=144316


----------



## MattBaneLM

you are deluded Blue511.... i have "fixed" a number of intel cpu's now and the Intel TIM is rubbish. Tk is 100% correct....


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattBaneLM*
> 
> you are deluded Blue511.... i have "fixed" a number of intel cpu's now and the Intel TIM is rubbish. Tk is 100% correct....


Right, and how exactly have you "fixed" a number of Intel CPUs? By removing the silicon holding the IHS to the wafer? Yea i would say that would fix it, again no one have actual scientific proof that the Intel TIM is garbage. I have yet to see intel TIM against any other TIM running delided or bare die.

All i hear is how people keep saying "oh yea i delided the CPU and now i have better temps, the Intel TIM is garbage."

1. Any gap of any sort between two metal conducting heat is BAD, ie Intel is to blame for the higher then we should be having temps because of manufacturing process.

2. Have you ever wondered why almost a dozen TIMs compared almost all of them have the same exact temps within a margin of error? Thats because pretty much 95% of TIMs are all made of the exact same material with minor differences.

Ever wonder why a TIM of 8-12w/mK is only a couple degrees higher then a liquid metal thats rated at 36-68w/mK? Clearly people need to look up what w/mK means instead of looking at the higher number and thinking its better.


----------



## Ceadderman

I would love to get hold of Intel's TIM to run a comparison vs. the top rated TIMs' on the market. That would silence quite a few people in either camp.









~Ceadder


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Right, and how exactly have you "fixed" a number of Intel CPUs? By removing the silicon holding the IHS to the wafer? Yea i would say that would fix it, again no one have actual scientific proof that the Intel TIM is garbage. I have yet to see intel TIM against any other TIM running delided or bare die.
> 
> All i hear is how people keep saying "oh yea i delided the CPU and now i have better temps, the Intel TIM is garbage."
> 
> 1. Any gap of any sort between two metal conducting heat is BAD, ie Intel is to blame for the higher then we should be having temps because of manufacturing process.
> 
> 2. Have you ever wondered why almost a dozen TIMs compared almost all of them have the same exact temps within a margin of error? Thats because pretty much 95% of TIMs are all made of the exact same material with minor differences.
> 
> Ever wonder why a TIM of 8-12w/mK is only a couple degrees higher then a liquid metal thats rated at 36-68w/mK? Clearly people need to look up what w/mK means instead of looking at the higher number and thinking its better.


While you are correct, in regards to the gap between the die and the IHS being the main reason for the heat increase, you are incorrect about the quality of the Intel TIM. It does not compare to the high performance after market TIM's currently on the market.

The following link shows a test done between the TIM's, that you say you have not yet seen. It is performed on a delidded CPU, so the gap is not relevant during this test.

There is an 8-10 degree core difference, between the Intel TIM and the top performing after market TIM, that being Kryonaut.
Between Kryonaut and a Liquid Metal (LM) TIM, there is a further 5 degree core difference.
Between the Intel TIM and the LM TIM there is a 15 degree core difference.

A 10-15 degree difference is a huge difference when it comes to overclocking.

When using CLU on a delidded cpu, the temperature drop is anywhere between 15/20 degrees to sometimes as a high as 30 degrees. Now factoring in that there is a 15 degree difference between the Intel TIM and the LM TIM, this does prove that it is not just the gap that is a factor, but actually both the gap and the TIM combined.

Silicon Lottery were also asked the question of whether it is the TIM or the gap, and they have replied stating it is also both and they are the foremost experts on delidding, as that is all they do and no one delids more cpu's than they have.

Link to Test Between TIM's including Intel TIM - https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com.au&sl=auto&sp=nmt3&tl=en&u=http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f139/kurztest-intel-tim-vs-kryonaut-grizzly-phobya-hegrease-gelid-extreme-und-lm-1082553.html&usg=ALkJrhgFHy3bsQWgGcF1S1p7rnSXgd1jUw#post23729410

Link to Silicon Lottery's statement - http://www.overclock.net/t/1619534/is-it-the-tim-or-the-glue-that-is-the-issue#post_25739952


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I think where the confusion is with those results (in light of bluej511's statements) is that unless you have a supply of the Intel TIM _to be able to re-apply it_ during testing... then it's apples to oranges.

The only way you can test it currently, unless someone working at Intel can provide some, is either:
a) with the gap as the chip came from Intel directly... or
b) after it's been delidded and the original TIM has been disturbed (i.e. cracked, flaked, etc.).

Almost anything is going to seem better once the gap is dealt with, but judging the TIM application overall from a few samples _after delidding_ isn't proof of anything one way or another.

Is CLU better? YES, most likely as the transfer specs are better as admitted by Intel in their whitepapers.

However, the only way to truly test is to either have Intel _manufacture_ two chips from the same production run with similar die QC results... one with CLU and one with the normal TIM

-or-

Have a quantity of their TIM to apply after delidding so that it can be compared directly to CLU on the same die under identical conditions.

As neither of these are likely to be possible ever... it's an argument for which no proof can be scientifically achieved. Conjecture and correlations are not proof of anything.

That being said I will delid and use CLU whenever and wherever possible... just to see if I can't get a little better results.

EDIT: But I'm not going to worry about Intel's TIM having any issues on any CPU I'm running at or near stock clocks and voltages because they do perfectly fine for years and years under those circumstances - which is exactly what they chose that TIM for. Their TIM is definitely great, it's just not the "ultimate" - nor is it supposed to be.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I think where the confusion is with those results (in light of bluej511's statements) is that unless you have a supply of the Intel TIM _to be able to re-apply it_ during testing... then it's apples to oranges.
> 
> The only way you can test it currently, unless someone working at Intel can provide some, is either:
> a) with the gap as the chip came from Intel directly... or
> b) after it's been delidded and the original TIM has been disturbed (i.e. cracked, flaked, etc.).
> 
> Almost anything is going to seem better once the gap is dealt with, but judging the TIM application overall from a few samples _after delidding_ isn't proof of anything one way or another.
> 
> Is CLU better? YES, most likely as the transfer specs are better as admitted by Intel in their whitepapers.
> 
> However, the only way to truly test is to either have Intel _manufacture_ two chips from the same production run with similar die QC results... one with CLU and one with the normal TIM
> 
> -or-
> *
> Have a quantity of their TIM to apply after delidding so that it can be compared directly to CLU on the same die under identical conditions.
> 
> *As neither of these are likely to be possible ever... it's an argument for which no proof can be scientifically achieved. Conjecture and correlations are not proof of anything.
> 
> That being said I will delid and use CLU whenever and wherever possible... just to see if I can't get a little better results.
> 
> EDIT: But I'm not going to worry about Intel's TIM having any issues on any CPU I'm running at or near stock clocks and voltages because they do perfectly fine for years and years under those circumstances - which is exactly what they chose that TIM for. Their TIM is definitely great, it's just not the "ultimate" - nor is it supposed to be.


That is what the test was - a direct comparison of the TIM's, applied to the same cpu die, after the cpu had been delidded, including a reapplication of the Intel TIM. It is not apples to oranges, it is apples to apples.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Because no proper test procedure with several comparisons and average values was made, of course, only as a clue to see. But looks to cover well with other tests


I see no indications at all in that review or in the following discussion that indicates that fresh Intel TIM was applied after delidding...

Those values clearly (to me at least) indicate that the Intel values were taken as a baseline prior to delidding. If not where does it indicate they procured the Intel TIM to apply it after the delidding?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> I see no indications at all in that review or in the following discussion that indicates that fresh Intel TIM was applied after delidding...
> 
> Those values clearly (to me at least) indicate that the Intel values were taken as a baseline prior to delidding. If not where does it indicate they procured the Intel TIM to apply it after the delidding?


Yup exactly, i need to find the thread where the guy actually used leftover Intel TIM (and yes i know that doesnt count).

I'm really sick of having idiotic arguments about this. We have yet to see anyone test actual Intel TIM (and not reused from a delid) against any other TIM. Any liquid/paste that can conduct heat will work the same way TIM works, hell you could use melted copper and it will work 100x better then any TIM. Again the paste is not the problem, it never was.

Because misinformation spreads like wildfire on the internet people tend to believe it. Read about thermodynamics and heat transfer then come back and post intelligent comments. Any gap and i mean ANY even as small as .01mm, between two surfaces that transfer heat is BAD.


----------



## inedenimadam

Intels TIM on its best day is still not going to be as good as any LM. Replacing it with LM is a no brainer since we are already in there and going to extremes to bring temps down.

I think I am going to cut the head off of my 5820k tonight. I have burned the cache on it a bit, and I am outside of my 1 year option for the tuning plan...

Blowtorch and razor blades here I come!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Intels TIM on its best day is still not going to be as good as any LM. Replacing it with LM is a no brainer since we are already in there and going to extremes to bring temps down.
> 
> I think I am going to cut the head off of my 5820k tonight. I have burned the cache on it a bit, and I am outside of my 1 year option for the tuning plan...
> 
> Blowtorch and razor blades here I come!


Were not comparing TIMs to LMs though, if the case is better temps then every other TIM in the world is garbage compared to liquid metals haha.


----------



## inedenimadam

The lid of the 5820k came off clean, but now i get 00. Poop.



No transistor damage. No die damage. Im at a loss.

edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.

ah well...


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> The lid of the 5820k came off clean, but now i get 00. Poop.
> 
> 
> 
> No transistor damage. No die damage. Im at a loss.
> 
> edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.
> 
> ah well...


Thats a shame that your cpu is dead. But 5820K are soldered on, there was no need to delid it anyway.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> The lid of the 5820k came off clean, but now i get 00. Poop.
> 
> 
> 
> No transistor damage. No die damage. Im at a loss.
> 
> edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.
> 
> ah well...
> 
> 
> 
> Thats a shame that your cpu is dead. But 5820K are soldered on, there was no need to delid it anyway.
Click to expand...

It was on its way out, and I wanted to see what was under the hood for myself and check thermals. Like i said, I burned the cache a bit, then my daughter spilled her sippy on my motherboard. I am surprised it lasted as long as it did, it was already +.030 core and + .050 cache to stay stable at stock clocks. The chip was a bad clocker, and dying...so I thought "for science!"

I wasn't even worried about the transistors on top outside of not driving the blade too deep, which I didn't do. The PBC has no scratches, and the die is beautiful. I must have knocked them off with a credit card when i was cleaning the die or the glue. 

You can see 3 missing on the right side.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> It was on its way out, and I wanted to see what was under the hood for myself and check thermals. Like i said, I burned the cache a bit, then my daughter spilled her sippy on my motherboard. I am surprised it lasted as long as it did, it was already +.030 core and + .050 cache to stay stable at stock clocks. The chip was a bad clocker, and dying...so I thought "for science!"
> 
> I wasn't even worried about the transistors on top outside of not driving the blade too deep, which I didn't do. The PBC has no scratches, and the die is beautiful. I must have knocked them off with a credit card when i was cleaning the die or the glue.
> 
> You can see 3 missing on the right side.


Fair enough if it was for science lol!

What are you going to replace it with a 6950X maybe?


----------



## Cakewalk_S

4 months after my delid and CLU application. 0 issues thus far and no increase in temps. Hopefully get a good year out of it without needing new CLU under the IHS...


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> It was on its way out, and I wanted to see what was under the hood for myself and check thermals. Like i said, I burned the cache a bit, then my daughter spilled her sippy on my motherboard. I am surprised it lasted as long as it did, it was already +.030 core and + .050 cache to stay stable at stock clocks. The chip was a bad clocker, and dying...so I thought "for science!"
> 
> I wasn't even worried about the transistors on top outside of not driving the blade too deep, which I didn't do. The PBC has no scratches, and the die is beautiful. I must have knocked them off with a credit card when i was cleaning the die or the glue.
> 
> You can see 3 missing on the right side.
> 
> 
> 
> Fair enough if it was for science lol!
> 
> What are you going to replace it with a 6950X maybe?
Click to expand...

nope, going to stay hex core, probably haswell for the clock advantage (mostly gaming rig) maybe a 40 lane this time since I always run 2 of whatever cards i buy, and I want to do some pcie storage as well.

Edited to add: I will still probably take the lid off of my next processor now that I know how to do it and know what to be careful of


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> 4 months after my delid and CLU application. 0 issues thus far and no increase in temps. Hopefully get a good year out of it without needing new CLU under the IHS...


.

Are you sure that CLU will degrade that fast when it's used under the IHS?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *9colai*
> 
> .
> 
> Are you sure that CLU will degrade that fast when it's used under the IHS?


Wont degrade at all. Provided its not touched/modified/moved, CLU definitely will last more then a year before re-application.


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> ...edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.
> 
> ah well...


Did you have someone there with good soldering skills? If you already have the resistors you can solder them back to the pcb.


----------



## 9colai

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Wont degrade at all. Provided its not touched/modified/moved, CLU definitely will last more then a year before re-application.


That's my impression too, of course you can find incidents in other applications where CLU are used with other metals but I'm quite sure that it's developed to last longer if it's applied correctly.


----------



## MicGGGGGG

I just delidded my 3770k, after 3-4 years of use. Made a scratch and was worrying so bad until I put it back on. Everything works like a charm, and I went from 4.6GHz+hyper 212 evo to 4.7GHz+Scythe Ninja 4. Temperature went from about 95c peak to 80c peak (for same speed, 4.6GHz, temp dropped about 20 degrees C), and I am soooo happy about it. Used Noctua NT-H1 for both TIM and cooler.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MicGGGGGG*
> 
> I just delidded my 3770k, after 3-4 years of use. Made a scratch and was worrying so bad until I put it back on. Everything works like a charm, and I went from 4.6GHz+hyper 212 evo to 4.7GHz+Scythe Ninja 4. Temperature went from about 95c peak to 80c peak (for same speed, 4.6GHz, temp dropped about 20 degrees C), and I am soooo happy about it. Used Noctua NT-H1 for both TIM and cooler.


Dellided my 3770k a while ago now @4.6Ghz max temp is never above 65c. I used CLU on the die and grizzly between block. Its also water cooled xspc raystorm and 240mm rad :-D Idles in the mid 30s celsius, gaming barely ever hits above 55c even with cpu hungry GTA V.

Edit.
I should mention I live in Darwin Australia so ambient is barely ever under 30c. When I run the aircon and ambient is lower temps get better again(obviously)


----------



## Kryton

Delidded my 3770K last week and may have to go back in because I do have a core running hotter than the others, the other three are about the same but the one is about 10c higher overall.
Under load it seems to do fine as in temps aren't getting way out of hand but I'll have to try it again just to make sure all is well with it.

Used Noctua NT-H1 as the TIM so the TIM itself shoudn't be the problem and resealed the lid with Permatex Black RTV sealant. May go for a thicker TIM this time and that would be AS5 Ceramique in my case, if it's nothing more than needing a thicker TIM it should do the trick. Also noted afterwards there was little to no change in temps from before to after so.... Maybe this one didn't need delidding but the deed is done.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Did you have someone there with good soldering skills? If you already have the resistors you can solder them back to the pcb.


Thats a rather easy fix, I've done such before and doesn't take long to do - Just being careful is the biggest thing about it.


----------



## Ceadderman

A trace pen could fix that...

possibly.









~Ceadder


----------



## Kryton

I woudn't use a trace pin - The solder connection where the component is still attached has been stressed and needs to be reflowed to ensure a good connection.

Biggest thing is to get that piece resecured to the chip's PCB properly.

I've fixed a few boards with such things knocked off on the back of them and it was a quick and easy fix, the work itself literally took less than a minute once I had my equipment setup and the boards where I wanted them to be for doing the repair.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

He already mentioned that the processor was on its way out.

I would just give it away for the cost of shipping to anyone who wants to fix it.


----------



## Kryton

Would be a nice soldering project for someone, I personally have nothing to run it in so I have no use for it.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> ...edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.
> 
> ah well...
> 
> 
> 
> Did you have someone there with good soldering skills? If you already have the resistors you can solder them back to the pcb.
Click to expand...

I looked for them, but I had already cleaned up my work area, and I couldn't find them on the top of the trash bin. They are so small on the front side that I am not even sure I could solder them if I wanted to...I have done some soldering, but nothing that small.

That big fat one in your picture I am pretty sure I could handle.

Edit to add, I am actually enjoying running my Ivy Bridge i5. I got a pretty solid chip that does 5.0 at 1.36ish. Dellided and naked... Temps are waaaaay low too. Barely breaks 40, and only one one core after an hour long gaming session. It has like a 10C delta over my GPUs at 5 Ghz.


----------



## Kryton

If I'm not mistaken you could find another dead chip with similar parts and do the repair if you want.

I did my repairs by robbing boards with the same size and colored pieces - Made sure the color was _exactly_ the same right down to the shade of color they were and the boards worked fine, in fact they still work to this day.

Used the desoldering wand on my soldering station to remove them and used it also to resolder them in place. Using a tiny flathead screwdriver I reoriented them, held them down squarely in place and heated them until the solder melted, completing the work.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> ...edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.
> 
> ah well...
> 
> 
> 
> Did you have someone there with good soldering skills? If you already have the resistors you can solder them back to the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I looked for them, but I had already cleaned up my work area, and I couldn't find them on the top of the trash bin. They are so small on the front side that I am not even sure I could solder them if I wanted to...I have done some soldering, but nothing that small.
> 
> That big fat one in your picture I am pretty sure I could handle.
Click to expand...

Well if you could find them I would give it a go. My soldering iron is just sitting round bored right now.









~Ceadder


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> ...edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.
> 
> ah well...
> 
> 
> 
> Did you have someone there with good soldering skills? If you already have the resistors you can solder them back to the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I looked for them, but I had already cleaned up my work area, and I couldn't find them on the top of the trash bin. They are so small on the front side that I am not even sure I could solder them if I wanted to...I have done some soldering, but nothing that small.
> 
> That big fat one in your picture I am pretty sure I could handle.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Well if you could find them I would give it a go. My soldering iron is just sitting round bored right now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder
Click to expand...

If I could find them...I would mail it to ya!

Maybe if I screw up the new 6800k dellid, I will mail them both to you. ( and find a new hobby)


----------



## Kryton

I'll say if Ceadderman doesn't want it I'll take a crack at it anyway - Nothing better to do here myself.
I have the pieces needed to fix it just lying around here already.

Would be an excuse to pickup a new board/socket for messing around with on my part.


----------



## Jimbags

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kryton*
> 
> Delidded my 3770K last week and may have to go back in because I do have a core running hotter than the others, the other three are about the same but the one is about 10c higher overall.
> Under load it seems to do fine as in temps aren't getting way out of hand but I'll have to try it again just to make sure all is well with it.
> 
> Used Noctua NT-H1 as the TIM so the TIM itself shoudn't be the problem and resealed the lid with Permatex Black RTV sealant. May go for a thicker TIM this time and that would be AS5 Ceramique in my case, if it's nothing more than needing a thicker TIM it should do the trick. Also noted afterwards there was little to no change in temps from before to after so.... Maybe this one didn't need delidding but the deed is done.
> Thats a rather easy fix, I've done such before and doesn't take long to do - Just being careful is the biggest thing about it.


With your 3770k, using CLU is so much better than a thermal paste. Im talking directly on the die to ihs. Honestly its almost not worth delliding unless you do (my personal opinion). Its the closest thing to liquid solder imho. Sorry but it really gets to me when people use normal paste there


----------



## Kryton

Not worried so much about it, I'll go back in it, see if I can't improve things and also see how the TIM did with it's contact pattern to the lid and core.
As long as temps are fairly even across the board and not excessive I'll be happy with it.


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> ...That big fat one in your picture I am pretty sure I could handle....


You can send it to me if you want, I have spare parts at home. The SMD components are tiny but I can handle that.


----------



## paskowitz

Based on the Kaby Lake reviews, I have a feeling this thread is a going to get a lot more popular...


----------



## vabeachboy0

I delidded my cpu a while back only had thermaltake TG-7 at the time. Had decent temps if i spread the tim fairly thin, about a 5-8 improvement. I now have liquid ultra on die and IHS massive improvement. This is with the volts that high prime95 running small fft's.


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Based on the Kaby Lake reviews, I have a feeling this thread is a going to get a lot more popular...


No doubt. Rumors are rumors of course, but I hear 5.0 on air for a healthy % of chips with safe voltage. Also heard that KBL is more resistant to electron migration, meaning higher voltage ceiling and longer life! Since I killed my 5820k in about every way that you can (over-volt, pour water on it, and fail at delliding), KBL looks better and better every day...The z270 boards all look like the bastard child of a disco dance and a christmas tree, but looks aside, the whole industry seems to be on point with what we want out of overclocking boards...I will have a 5.0+ KBL, even if I have to bin 10-15 of them.

I might just snatch a xeon to throw into the empty x99 board and get started on my wife's office build while I wait for KBL...


----------



## mAs81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> I will have a 5.0+ KBL, even if I have to bin 10-15 of them.


Lol,that's how I felt about DC but even after delidding , that magical GHz number still eludes me


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Based on the Kaby Lake reviews, I have a feeling this thread is a going to get a lot more popular...


You could be right


----------



## paskowitz

Stealth brag, I paid $250 for my 5.0Ghz/1.42v 4790K at Microcenter on my first try. That being said, I went through 3 980 Tis to get to 1500mhz and my first couldn't hit 1400. I think I ended up loosing ~$100 so it all evens out in the end.

I started out with an H100i and could manage 4.7/1.3v at like 80c. Delid and custom loop are the only reasons I got to 5.0. Also following the debaur OC guide helped a lot.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Based on the Kaby Lake reviews, I have a feeling this thread is a going to get a lot more popular...


Gooooood, gooooooooood


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> The lid of the 5820k came off clean, but now i get 00. Poop.
> 
> 
> 
> No transistor damage. No die damage. Im at a loss.
> 
> edit: knocked off 3 transistors from the top side. must have happened scrapping off the solder.
> 
> ah well...


Just PM me if you still have the Chip. Wouldn't mind trying my hand at repairing it.

I'm sure I can find replacement resistors somewhere. Even if I have to kill an earlier CPU or pick up a dead chip.









~Ceadder


----------



## Radmanhs

Does anyone know how he delided this cpu? I'm only familiar with printed/milled tools, hitting the cpu with a piece of wood and razor blade techniques. It seems he squeezed it a bunch and peeled the ihs off

https://www.facebook.com/officialsingularitycomputers/videos/1511583395536369/


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> Does anyone know how he delided this cpu? I'm only familiar with printed/milled tools, hitting the cpu with a piece of wood and razor blade techniques. It seems he squeezed it a bunch and peeled the ihs off
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/officialsingularitycomputers/videos/1511583395536369/


Vice method. Not sure whether or not there is a 3D printed delid tool for Broadwell, but if there is I cannot stress enough the importance for getting away from the Vice method.

Especially when you say things like...

the things I go through for my customers;
ya gotta have ballz of steel;

and my personal favorite...

I think I'd rather put those in a Vice.









~Ceadder


----------



## Radmanhs

I delided my 3770k by hitting it with a piece of wood and it worked fine. i tried deliding my 6700k with a 3d printed separater, but it broke before I was able to separate it...


----------



## MattBaneLM

Easiest thing I found was using this scraper

but with a metal blade not the plastic one

Good control

Blade won't go too far in


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> ...the things I go through for my customers;
> ya gotta have ballz of steel;...


A reason to never ever spend a cent at this company


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> Does anyone know how he delided this cpu? I'm only familiar with printed/milled tools, hitting the cpu with a piece of wood and razor blade techniques. It seems he squeezed it a bunch and peeled the ihs off
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/officialsingularitycomputers/videos/1511583395536369/


razor blades and a lighter got the soldered lid off for me


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> ...the things I go through for my customers;
> ya gotta have ballz of steel;...
> 
> 
> 
> A reason to never ever spend a cent at this company
Click to expand...

I don't think so. It was obviously a joke.









~Ceadder


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I don't think so. It was obviously a joke.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


And from my side its no joke







If I would know that a company handles my hardware like shown in the vid than I would not deal with them. It´s so easy to machine a tool for this kind of work, no need to use methods like shown.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Hey guys, I'm about to get a 6700k, is it worth the delid since I'm simply going to be using air cooling?

Thanks for the help fam. (Also if I do delid, should I use CLU?)


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Hey guys, I'm about to get a 6700k, is it worth the delid since I'm simply going to be using air cooling?
> 
> Thanks for the help fam. (Also if I do delid, should I use CLU?)


Yes yes yes. Mine is on air and I dropped at least 10c.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Yes yes yes. Mine is on air and I dropped at least 10c.


CLU on both the IHS and underneath?


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Yes yes yes. Mine is on air and I dropped at least 10c.
> 
> 
> 
> CLU on both the IHS and underneath?
Click to expand...

I did just the IHS and die. I could have done both but wanted to keep the cpu top intwct


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Hey guys, I'm about to get a 6700k, is it worth the delid since I'm simply going to be using air cooling?
> 
> Thanks for the help fam. (Also if I do delid, should I use CLU?)


yeah, I saw good drops when I first delidded my 4790k. Was using a NH-D14 at the time and dropped about 7c using kryonaut. CLU came shortly after with a waterblock.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> yeah, I saw good drops when I first delidded my 4790k. Was using a NH-D14 at the time and dropped about 7c using kryonaut. CLU came shortly after with a waterblock.


Awesome, I'll have to do it then. Kinda scared of the razor method, but I heard it's the safest way to go for the 6700k. I remember using a vice for my old rig's i5 4670k


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Awesome, I'll have to do it then. Kinda scared of the razor method, but I heard it's the safest way to go for the 6700k. I remember using a vice for my old rig's i5 4670k


The safest way to delid a 6700K is to use a delidding tool, such as the Delid Die Mate or the Rockit 88 Delid Tool.


----------



## dailo01

Get the rockit88 tool, did it first time last week and it went super smoothly. I'm on air as well and temps dropped around 11c on my 6700k


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> yeah, I saw good drops when I first delidded my 4790k. Was using a NH-D14 at the time and dropped about 7c using kryonaut. CLU came shortly after with a waterblock.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome, I'll have to do it then. Kinda scared of the razor method, but I heard it's the safest way to go for the 6700k. I remember using a vice for my old rig's i5 4670k
Click to expand...

I used van der hagen double sided razor blades which are like twice as thin as a normal carpet knife blade. Cut through the epoxy like butter and didn't ruin the chip. I did that method since a lot of people have had great results and I'm super cheap..lol


----------



## geriatricpollywog

Is delidding the 7700k exactly the same as delidding the 6700k?


----------



## StullenAndi

It´s the same procedure. Only difference is the little change in heatspreader design.


----------



## unkletom

Anyone who used Grizzle Kryonaut on the die want to share their experience? Does it pump out?

Whats this pumping out anyway. Everything pumps out except Intel's paste and CLU? Sounds like crock to me.

Obviously if you put a ton of paste on the die some is gonna go to the sides but you'll still have enough for contact I would think

I just delided my 7700k with a razor and there is some silicon on it which seems hardened out. It looks to have made a strong bond with the pcb and tough to come off. Ya think it will impact performance if i keep it on? I scrapped the silcon off the IHS.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *unkletom*
> 
> Anyone who used Grizzle Kryonaut on the die want to share their experience? Does it pump out?
> 
> Whats this pumping out anyway. Everything pumps out except Intel's paste and CLU? Sounds like crock to me.
> 
> Obviously if you put a ton of paste on the die some is gonna go to the sides but you'll still have enough for contact I would think


it pumped out for me within a month or so and temps went up. I think a lot of it depends on the voltage/heat. someone (bluej i think) has been using regular paste on a lower tdp chip and it's been fine


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> it pumped out for me within a month or so and temps went up. I think a lot of it depends on the voltage/heat. someone (bluej i think) has been using regular paste on a lower tdp chip and it's been fine


Correct on a 3350p (no igpu) im using hydronaut and its perfectly fine on my moms HP. On mine at 1.21v bare die (IHS as a variable out of the way) i had pump out in about a day with Noctua and about 3 days with Kryonaut lol.


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dailo01*
> 
> Get the rockit88 tool, did it first time last week and it went super smoothly. I'm on air as well and temps dropped around 11c on my 6700k


Alright, I ordered one. Did you remove the glue and use the relidding tool? (I tossed in a relidding tool when i ordered the rockit88). How exactly does relidding work when you remove the glue?


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *dailo01*
> 
> Get the rockit88 tool, did it first time last week and it went super smoothly. I'm on air as well and temps dropped around 11c on my 6700k
> 
> 
> 
> Alright, I ordered one. Did you remove the glue and use the relidding tool? (I tossed in a relidding tool when i ordered the rockit88). How exactly does relidding work when you remove the glue?
Click to expand...

You add your own adhesive put the CPU and the IHS into the tool and put them together. The tool is to ensure that the IHS doesn't slip on the pcb.









~Ceadder


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> You add your own adhesive put the CPU and the IHS into the tool and put them together. The tool is to ensure that the IHS doesn't slip on the pcb.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


hmmm do you think gorilla glue would work just fine? Just happens to be what I have on hand. Thank you for your advice my man


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> hmmm do you think gorilla glue would work just fine? Just happens to be what I have on hand. Thank you for your advice my man


something like rtv silicone or something else that isn't as permanent as gorilla glue. iirc that stuff is basically super glue?


----------



## Bourgeoisie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> something like rtv silicone or something else that isn't as permanent as gorilla glue. iirc that stuff is basically super glue?


yeah, it is a super glue, was thinking it might be ok since the guy uses super glue in this vid? 




But something less permanent would probably be better.


----------



## tknight

Get yourself some Sikaflex black silicon window sealant. It works perfectly and can be delidded again if need be.


----------



## bluej511

Isnt the whole point of deliding to get rid of the outrageous excess gap that Intel has while mounting the IHS to the wafer haha. Why relid it when its going to leave a gap again.

If you remount it with silicone would be nice to press down on it to get rid of the gap but otherwise its much better without silicon.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Isnt the whole point of deliding to get rid of the outrageous excess gap that Intel has while mounting the IHS to the wafer haha. Why relid it when its going to leave a gap again.
> 
> If you remount it with silicone would be nice to press down on it to get rid of the gap but otherwise its much better without silicon.


Yeah, but there are still a pile of misinformed souls out there who think that they are removing the IHS for the sole purpose of replacing the stock Intel thermal compound.
Then re-lidding it again, using a silicone or other adhesive, causing the same gap issue over again.









Edit:
Example:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1619964/various-intel-core-i7-7700k-reviews/150#post_25757261


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> yeah, it is a super glue, was thinking it might be ok since the guy uses super glue in this vid?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But something less permanent would probably be better.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Get yourself some Sikaflex black silicon window sealant. It works perfectly and can be delidded again if need be.


Unless you're planning on not being able to ever replace the TIM between the die and the IHS again, I would not advise reattaching the IHS to the PCB. Once the CPU is back in the retention bracket, it will not move again, so there's no real need to glue the IHS back on. Even CLU/CLP will need to be replaced eventually.

What DerComissar is saying is correct, the main point of delidding is to eliminate the gap that's created by the adhesive. Replacing it would basically put you back at square 1 again, which completely negates the point of delidding in the first place.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> Alright, I ordered one. Did you remove the glue and use the relidding tool? (I tossed in a relidding tool when i ordered the rockit88). How exactly does relidding work when you remove the glue?


I bought some black silicone glue. It arrives saturday. I will report my findings.


----------



## davidcapi

Well, count me in among the people who reattached the IHS. I did it mainly because I wanted to have a CPU that anyone could handle in case I sell it. I delidded it maybe 8 months ago. I put the IHS back on after applying CLU. Then installed the CPU back on the mobo and had the IHS stay in place while the pvb cured. (Clamped by the motherboard).

After all this time it keeps being the same chip after re-lid, capable of 5ghz at 78c. Lower temps than it had with the stock paste at stock clocks.

I posted some photos a while back where you could see how my cpu not only had a gap between the die and IHS but it also had the gap "filled" with what would look like the adhesive used by Intel. Like it had evaporated and slowly condensed in this gap over time probably.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Unless you're planning on not being able to ever replace the TIM between the die and the IHS again, I would not advise reattaching the IHS to the PCB. Once the CPU is back in the retention bracket, it will not move again, so there's no real need to glue the IHS back on. Even CLU/CLP will need to be replaced eventually.
> 
> What DerComissar is saying is correct, the main point of delidding is to eliminate the gap that's created by the adhesive. Replacing it would basically put you back at square 1 again, which completely negates the point of delidding in the first place.


That is incorrect and simply not true. Reattaching the IHS with silicon adhesive after having delidded it and applying CLU on the die, does not put you back to square one.

Delidded lowered temps are maintained after reattaching the IHS, which clearly proves that the Intel TIM is inferior and causes the heat not to be dissipated effectively.


----------



## 0ldChicken

I reattached my ihs to the pcb but there is just a thickness that you cannot pass. When you set the IHS on the die it is actually not touching the pcb at all, there is a very small gap. I placed just BARELY ANY silicone in the corners, i mean just a tiny bit, enough to connect the ihs and pcb together. It was then immediately clamped in the mobo to hold pressure.

I re-delidded this chip after a while (very easily, used my bare hands) and I haven't used any adhesive since then since I don't really see the point. The temps remained the same though, adhesive and no adhesive. I'm NOT saying that Intel's black lagoon that they place around the pcb isn't a problem, but I do genuinely believe that people CAN reattach the IHS without sacrificing performance. It just has to be done with thought and care (like anything else delidding related) I really don't think that I "created a gap" by attaching the ihs with a tiny dab of silicone, I was simply filling the TINY gap that remains between an IHS and the bare pcb while it's sitting on the die.

That being said, I'm skeptical of the flexible nature of silicone and it's ability to hold the IHS down when applied in the very small scale that I did. I could see the silicone expanding when the CPU is removed from the motherboard which could ruin a TIM application easily. All in all, I took the easy way out and took the IHS out of the equation entirely. Naked mount is fantastic


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> That is incorrect and simply not true. Reattaching the IHS with silicon adhesive after having delidded it and applying CLU on the die, does not put you back to square one.
> 
> Delidded lowered temps are maintained after reattaching the IHS, which clearly proves that the Intel TIM is inferior and causes the heat not to be dissipated effectively.


Another misinformed comment haha.

Lets finish this and finish it CLEARLY. You do know that a gap, any gap of any kind is BAD for heat transfer correct? Air has a thermal dissipation of .24w/mK compared to 36w/mK that CLU provides. You do know that it should be applied in unbelievably thin layers as the thicker it is the less heat it dissipates. Compare all that to copper which has a rating of 300-400w/mK you can see how useless any and all TIMs really are.

If you theory, and that is a THEORY, of CLU being the best thing out there and using silicone does not put you back to square one was true, then why is it that removing the IHS entirely and eliminating the gap entirely provide even MORE temperature drops. I dropped 7°C at 1.21v going from CLU/IHS to bare die and CLU and dropped 11°C at 1.3v going from CLU/IHS to CLU bare die. So you see your theory is just that a theory. The intel tim is not the entire part of the problem but only a minor one that everyone blew out of proportion.

Almost a dozen or so TIMs on the market including liquid metals all come within 2-3°C of each other when applied between two copper plates and tested. This means that your theory of intel tim being garbage is false and inaccurate.

I will repeat this once and for all. A GAP, ANY KIND OF GAP BETWEEN TWO HEATED SURFACES WITH NO THERMAL INTERFACE MATERIAL BETWEEN IT IS BAD, THE LESS YOU USE THE BETTER. That .06mm gap created by silicon between the IHS and wafer is bad, and this is without taking into consideration how flat/flush the ihs sits on the wafer. Even the slight bend or edge on the ihs will cause horrific temps.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *B NEGATIVE*
> 
> I know because I have a Zen chip sitting on the desk opposite me that was delidded.
> 
> Shown by delidders? I AM a delidder......its been proven more than once that the glue is the biggest culprit for temps.


----------



## Ceadderman

Gorilla glue is not at all like super glue. Super Glue doesn't foam like Gorilla Glue does. Even a thin application of GG foams up to a thickness larger than a piece of paper. So using that to hold on the IHS would be counter productive to the intent of shortening the gap between the die and the IHS. RTB silicon Black would be the stuff to go with and it can be applied as thin as you want w/o the worries of a widening gap. Blue and clear will work too, but RTB Black is probably the best solution.









I cannot believe we're still talking about Intel TIM being garbage. When are people gonna stop flogging that opinion. Whether it's crap or not don't make a danged bit of difference if the gap between the CPU Die and the IHS is wider than it's supposed to be. Other than having a tube of Intel thermal compound on hand to test with, there is no way of knowing. I will say however, that Intel wouldn't be using the same stuff for as long as they have if it was "garbage". I don't believe that it is, but some people aren't gonna let facts get in the way of their opinion. That's just how the human race rolls these days.









~Ceadder


----------



## blaze2210

Basically, anyone that thinks that the gap is not the issue, should actually read through this thread. Considering the fact that this opinion has been mentioned several times already, it should essentially be a moot point by now. When I last actually "frequented" this thread, I put in the time to learn and read virtually every post (admittedly, it took me a while, but also answered a lot of questions I had and didn't know I had), and saw that mentioned almost every other page. For those people who say "I don't have the time to read every post", I can point out the "Search this thread" function that is present in every single thread on OCN. This opinion seems to get brought up quite often in here.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

What's the problem with running naked die? Do you need to shim the height of the IHS?


----------



## alpsie

I´ve been reading for a while in this thread, but there are simply too many pages for me to get trough.
I have a question and hope someone can provide me with an answer.

When delidding the IHS makes contact with the die, but wont the pressure from putting it in the motherboard mount risk cracking the die?
Im mostly curious about this regarding to the 7700K, since die and PCB seem to be getting thinner and thinner.

Follow up question, I´ve seen that a delidded 7700K have 4 small copper circles under the IHS, would you cover these up, incase the liquid metal could flow out and onto them ?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0451*
> 
> What's the problem with running naked die? Do you need to shim the height of the IHS?


The answer to that depends on what cooler you're using on your CPU, and basically the mounting solution it uses....


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Another misinformed comment haha.
> 
> Lets finish this and finish it CLEARLY. You do know that a gap, any gap of any kind is BAD for heat transfer correct? Air has a thermal dissipation of .24w/mK compared to 36w/mK that CLU provides. You do know that it should be applied in unbelievably thin layers as the thicker it is the less heat it dissipates. Compare all that to copper which has a rating of 300-400w/mK you can see how useless any and all TIMs really are.
> 
> If you theory, and that is a THEORY, of CLU being the best thing out there and using silicone does not put you back to square one was true, then why is it that removing the IHS entirely and eliminating the gap entirely provide even MORE temperature drops. I dropped 7°C at 1.21v going from CLU/IHS to bare die and CLU and dropped 11°C at 1.3v going from CLU/IHS to CLU bare die. So you see your theory is just that a theory. The intel tim is not the entire part of the problem but only a minor one that everyone blew out of proportion.
> 
> Almost a dozen or so TIMs on the market including liquid metals all come within 2-3°C of each other when applied between two copper plates and tested. This means that your theory of intel tim being garbage is false and inaccurate.
> 
> I will repeat this once and for all. A GAP, ANY KIND OF GAP BETWEEN TWO HEATED SURFACES WITH NO THERMAL INTERFACE MATERIAL BETWEEN IT IS BAD, THE LESS YOU USE THE BETTER. That .06mm gap created by silicon between the IHS and wafer is bad, and this is without taking into consideration how flat/flush the ihs sits on the wafer. Even the slight bend or edge on the ihs will cause horrific temps.


The only misinformed comment is your one.

The discussion in which you quoted me, was not about whether the gap or the TIM is responsible for the high temperatures. It was in regards to the incorrect statement made that re-attaching the IHS with silicon adhesive after delidding, puts you back to square one, which is simply not true.

If that were the case, then the cpu temperatures would be exactly the same as they were prior to delidding, however with the IHS siliconed back on, there is still a 20-30 degree temperature drop, after applying CLU on the die. If you ran the delidded cpu, with the IHS just placed on top of the die and not secured down with silicon, the temperature drop would still be the same 20-30 degrees.

This has been tested and proven and is not just a "THEORY' as you incorrectly put it.

Your temperature comparisons between running the cpu with and without the IHS, has no bearing on this discussion and is a totally irrelevant comparison. Of course removing the IHS completely is going to lower temperatures further, as there is no longer an extra layer of solid metal that the heat has to dissipate through, between the die and the cpu block.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> The only misinformed comment is your one.
> 
> The discussion in which you quoted me, was not about whether the gap or the TIM is responsible for the high temperatures. It was in regards to the incorrect statement made that re-attaching the IHS with silicon adhesive after delidding, puts you back to square one, which is simply not true.
> 
> If that were the case, then the cpu temperatures would be exactly the same as they were prior to delidding, however with the IHS siliconed back on, there is still a 20-30 degree temperature drop, after applying CLU on the die. If you ran the delidded cpu, with the IHS just placed on top of the die and not secured down with silicon, the temperature drop would still be the same 20-30 degrees.
> 
> This has been tested and proven and is not just a "THEORY' as you incorrectly put it.
> 
> Your temperature comparisons between running the cpu with and without the IHS, has no bearing on this discussion and is a totally irrelevant comparison. Of course removing the IHS completely is going to lower temperatures further, as there is no longer an extra layer of solid metal that the heat has to dissipate through, between the die and the cpu block.


And this is why i won't read or believe anything you post. No one has seen a 20-30°C drop on any Intel cpu being delided haha. We will keep you to your theories while everyone else here with even half a brain knows whats what.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Gorilla glue is not at all like super glue. Super Glue doesn't foam like Gorilla Glue does. Even a thin application of GG foams up to a thickness larger than a piece of paper. So using that to hold on the IHS would be counter productive to the intent of shortening the gap between the die and the IHS. RTB silicon Black would be the stuff to go with and it can be applied as thin as you want w/o the worries of a widening gap. Blue and clear will work too, but RTB Black is probably the best solution.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cannot believe we're still talking about Intel TIM being garbage. When are people gonna stop flogging that opinion. Whether it's crap or not don't make a danged bit of difference if the gap between the CPU Die and the IHS is wider than it's supposed to be. Other than having a tube of Intel thermal compound on hand to test with, there is no way of knowing. I will say however, that Intel wouldn't be using the same stuff for as long as they have if it was "garbage". I don't believe that it is, but some people aren't gonna let facts get in the way of their opinion. That's just how the human race rolls these days.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Correct
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Basically, anyone that thinks that the gap is not the issue, should actually read through this thread. Considering the fact that this opinion has been mentioned several times already, it should essentially be a moot point by now. When I last actually "frequented" this thread, I put in the time to learn and read virtually every post (admittedly, it took me a while, but also answered a lot of questions I had and didn't know I had), and saw that mentioned almost every other page. For those people who say "I don't have the time to read every post", I can point out the "Search this thread" function that is present in every single thread on OCN. This opinion seems to get brought up quite often in here.


And correct again. Guess i shouldn't fight with stupid people though, they'll drag me down to their level and win with experience haha.


----------



## Digitalwolf

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And this is why i won't read or believe anything you post. No one has seen a 20-30°C drop on any Intel cpu being delided haha. We will keep you to your theories while everyone else here with even half a brain knows whats what.


So you are saying this information from Silicon Lottery in their Delid section is incorrect?

"Temperature improvements vary depending on processor sample and architecture. Temperatures under an overclocked load (1.3V-1.4V) will decrease anywhere from 5° to 25°C. Typical temperature improvements are listed below:

Ivy Bridge: 10°C to 25°C
Haswell: 10°C to 25°C
Devil's Canyon: 7°C to 15°C
Broadwell: 8°C to 18°C
Skylake: 8°C to 18°C
Kaby Lake: 12° to 25°C""

The source for that information is:

Going to your direct statement: "No one has seen a 20-30°C drop on any Intel cpu being delided haha"

My response isn't even about the person you quoted as I don't know them. Its about the nature of your response and your wording. From what I can tell Silicon Lottery sells a great number of delided cpu's and does keep track of their data on them. Of the six CPU families they have data on, half are showing temp drops of up to 25C which would mean that at least some Intel CPU's do in fact have temp drops of over 20 degrees after this process.

*edited to add this clarity section* Obviously if you were a person that only got a 10C drop on your chip you didn't see a drop of 20C to 30C. If you were one of the people that got a 25C drop on your chip you did. This goes directly to the "No one has every seen a 20-30C drop of any Intel cpu being delided" part of your reply. Obviously.. some people did.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And this is why i won't read or believe anything you post. No one has seen a 20-30°C drop on any Intel cpu being delided haha. We will keep you to your theories while everyone else here with even half a brain knows whats what.
> Correct
> And correct again. Guess i shouldn't fight with stupid people though, they'll drag me down to their level and win with experience haha.


The only one who has absolutely no clue what they are talking about is you.

There are quite a few people who have seen temp drops of between 20-30 degrees using CLU under the IHS, including myself.

The only thing you are good at, is resorting to insults and abusive words when people do not agree with what you say.

It still doesn't make you right and with what you just wrote, clearly shows you have no idea whatsoever.

Your experience with your single 4690K cpu and you basing everything that happens to you on your one cpu, as the official source of knowledge, shows you are just full of delusions of grandeur.

You are dead wrong about what you have written. And you should not go writing incorrect information on the forum and misleading others.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Digitalwolf*
> 
> So you are saying this information from Silicon Lottery in their Delid section is incorrect?
> 
> "Temperature improvements vary depending on processor sample and architecture. Temperatures under an overclocked load (1.3V-1.4V) will decrease anywhere from 5° to 25°C. Typical temperature improvements are listed below:
> 
> Ivy Bridge: 10°C to 25°C
> Haswell: 10°C to 25°C
> Devil's Canyon: 7°C to 15°C
> Broadwell: 8°C to 18°C
> Skylake: 8°C to 18°C
> Kaby Lake: 12° to 25°C""
> 
> The source for that information is:
> 
> Going to your direct statement: "No one has seen a 20-30°C drop on any Intel cpu being delided haha"
> 
> My response isn't even about the person you quoted as I don't know them. Its about the nature of your response and your wording. From what I can tell Silicon Lottery sells a great number of delided cpu's and does keep track of their data on them. Of the six CPU families they have data on, half are showing temp drops of up to 25C which would mean that at least some Intel CPU's do in fact have temp drops of over 20 degrees after this process.
> 
> *edited to add this clarity section* Obviously if you were a person that only got a 10C drop on your chip you didn't see a drop of 20C to 30C. If you were one of the people that got a 25C drop on your chip you did. This goes directly to the "No one has every seen a 20-30C drop of any Intel cpu being delided" part of your reply. Obviously.. some people did.


Oh not saying their information is incorrect its just very rare in real world applications from users who have delided to get much more then 20°C, and that being the top end. The people who will see a 30°C are people who are using their chips over 1.4v (ie maybe 1% of overclockers), or people using LN2.

Reason ivy bridge saw such a HUGE temp drop was because the gap between ihs and die and the glue used were horrendous, this is all over the net. They also ran hotter as in bigger architecture and way more tdp then newer cpus.

Same reason kaby lake is seeing such huge temp drops as well, horrible glue, ihs not being pressed down while assembly and you end up having GOOD tim that does not function how it should. The other user posting thinks absolutely everyone replacing there TIM to CLU will ssee a 20-30°C temp drop and thats just not true, from the 100s of CPUs ive delided and OCed for my customers its no where near 20-30°C. On average between a span of a decade id say its closer to 15°C in an ambient test room of 21°C, and obviously the difference would be way more obvious if under water.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> The only one who has absolutely no clue what they are talking about is you.
> 
> There are quite a few people who have seen temp drops of between 20-30 degrees using CLU under the IHS, including myself.
> 
> The only thing you are good at, is resorting to insults and abusive words when people do not agree with what you say.
> 
> It still doesn't make you right and with what you just wrote, clearly shows you have no idea whatsoever.
> 
> Your experience with your single 4690K cpu and you basing everything that happens to you on your one cpu, as the official source of knowledge, shows you are just full of delusions of grandeur.
> 
> You are dead wrong about what you have written. And you should not go writing incorrect information on the forum and misleading others.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Oh not saying their information is incorrect its just very rare in real world applications from users who have delided to get much more then 20°C, and that being the top end. The people who will see a 30°C are people who are using their chips over 1.4v (ie maybe 1% of overclockers), or people using LN2.
> 
> Reason ivy bridge saw such a HUGE temp drop was because the gap between ihs and die and the glue used were horrendous, this is all over the net. They also ran hotter as in bigger architecture and way more tdp then newer cpus.
> 
> Same reason kaby lake is seeing such huge temp drops as well, horrible glue, ihs not being pressed down while assembly and you end up having GOOD tim that does not function how it should. *The other user posting thinks absolutely everyone replacing there TIM to CLU will ssee a 20-30°C temp drop and thats just not true, from the 100s of CPUs ive delided and OCed for my customers its no where near 20-30°C. On average between a span of a decade id say its closer to 15°C in an ambient test room of 21°C, and obviously the difference would be way more obvious if under water.*


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Returning my 6700K for a 7700K now. Hopefully I'll see the 5 ghz mark.

My old 6700K was good with the temps. 2C spread between the cores. Hopefully the 7700K will be good as well.

Kaby-lake "needs" deilding, right?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Returning my 6700K for a 7700K now. Hopefully I'll see the 5 ghz mark.
> 
> My old 6700K was good with the temps. 2C spread between the cores. Hopefully the 7700K will be good as well.
> 
> Kaby-lake "needs" deilding, right?


Idk if id say need it, need to get more in the wild samples then engineering ones to see whats up. But from the looks of it, looks like Intel went back to a thick IHS and thick glue like Ivy Bridge so we'll see as more people get their hands on it. Looks like they hit 5ghz quite easily from what we've seen SO FAR.


----------



## spddmn24

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Returning my 6700K for a 7700K now. Hopefully I'll see the 5 ghz mark.
> 
> My old 6700K was good with the temps. 2C spread between the cores. Hopefully the 7700K will be good as well.
> 
> Kaby-lake "needs" deilding, right?


There seems to be quite a big lottery on lid quality of kaby.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Another misinformed comment haha.
> 
> Lets finish this and finish it CLEARLY. You do know that a gap, any gap of any kind is BAD for heat transfer correct? Air has a thermal dissipation of .24w/mK compared to 36w/mK that CLU provides. You do know that it should be applied in unbelievably thin layers as the thicker it is the less heat it dissipates. Compare all that to copper which has a rating of 300-400w/mK you can see how useless any and all TIMs really are.
> 
> If you theory, and that is a THEORY, of CLU being the best thing out there and using silicone does not put you back to square one was true, then why is it that removing the IHS entirely and eliminating the gap entirely provide even MORE temperature drops. I dropped 7°C at 1.21v going from CLU/IHS to bare die and CLU and dropped 11°C at 1.3v going from CLU/IHS to CLU bare die. So you see your theory is just that a theory. The intel tim is not the entire part of the problem but only a minor one that everyone blew out of proportion.
> 
> Almost a dozen or so TIMs on the market including liquid metals all come within 2-3°C of each other when applied between two copper plates and tested. This means that your theory of intel tim being garbage is false and inaccurate.
> 
> I will repeat this once and for all. A GAP, ANY KIND OF GAP BETWEEN TWO HEATED SURFACES WITH NO THERMAL INTERFACE MATERIAL BETWEEN IT IS BAD, THE LESS YOU USE THE BETTER. That .06mm gap created by silicon between the IHS and wafer is bad, and this is without taking into consideration how flat/flush the ihs sits on the wafer. Even the slight bend or edge on the ihs will cause horrific temps.


You're off by a factor of 10 of air's thermal conductivity. It's ~.024 not .24.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spddmn24*
> 
> There seems to be quite a big lottery on lid quality of kaby.
> You're off by a factor of 10 of air's thermal conductivity. It's ~.024 not .24.


A shoot what a stupid typo haha. It is in fact .024 my bad.

And yes absolutely correct about the lottery of the lids on Kaby but then again its true of EVERY Intel cpu not just kaby, same with glue thickness. The manufacturing tolerances vary greatly its why the guy blaming Intel TIM has absolutely no idea what he's talking about or how Intel even manufactures its IHS.

If one IHS has a slight beveled edge that wasn't cleaned up it would completely destroy the heat transfer of that cpu


----------



## Bourgeoisie

is it safe to go die > heatsink? Can you use CLU without messing up your heatsink if you do it this way?


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bourgeoisie*
> 
> is it safe to go die > heatsink? Can you use CLU without messing up your heatsink if you do it this way?


So long as it's a Copper base heatsink/block you should be just fine. CLU will stain copper but it won't harm it.









If you have a heatsink that is aluminum and Copper, you probably should avoid using it as CLU will start to process to Gallium(?) and damage the Aluminum cooling surface. Heatsinks like Hyper 212 come to mind since I'm looking at my 212+ sitting on the bookcase across from me. I would never use that in an application with CLU. It's no bueno.









~Ceadder


----------



## eXistencelies

OK so after getting my 7700k I want to delid it. As I have been reading people say reattching the IHS cover is fine and others say go without the IHS cover. I have a full custom loop with a solid copper block (XSPC Raystorm Pro) for my CPU waterblock. To get the best temps I should leave the IHS cover plate off and just apply the Coollaboratory Liquid Metal Thermal, attach to mobo then attach waterblock directly onto chip?


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> OK so after getting my 7700k I want to delid it. As I have been reading people say reattching the IHS cover is fine and others say go without the IHS cover. I have a full custom loop with a solid copper block (XSPC Raystorm Pro) for my CPU waterblock. To get the best temps I should leave the IHS cover plate off and just apply the Coollaboratory Liquid Metal Thermal, attach to mobo then attach waterblock directly onto chip?


That will not work as the pcb of the 7700K/6700K is thinner than previous generations and sits lower than the corners of the socket.
Therefore your cpu block will not make proper contact pressure with the cpu and result in it not even posting.

Some have filed down the corners of their cpu socket to try and get it working, but has resulted in worse temps when compared to using the IHS, as it still does not make proper full contact.

There has also been a test done by modifying the base of cpu waterblock to make it sit lower than the corners of the socket and even then the results are not worth running without the IHS on.

Just apply CLU on the die and put the IHS back on top, mount your raystorm pro with Kryonaut on the IHS and enjoy 20-30 degree lower temps.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> That will not work as the pcb of the 7700K/6700K is thinner than previous generations and sits lower than the corners of the socket.
> Therefore your cpu block will not make proper contact pressure with the cpu and result in it not even posting.
> 
> Some have filed down the corners of their cpu socket to try and get it working, but has resulted in worse temps when compared to using the IHS, as it still does not make proper full contact.
> 
> There has also been a test done by modifying the base of cpu waterblock to make it sit lower than the corners of the socket and even then the results are not worth running without the IHS on.
> 
> Just apply CLU on the die and put the IHS back on top, mount your raystorm pro with Kryonaut on the IHS and enjoy 20-30 degree lower temps.


ok good info. Now I ordered a full kit from rockitcool and got the gelid solutions gc extreme. Is that up to par with kryonaut?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> ok good info. Now I ordered a full kit from rockitcool and got the gelid solutions gc extreme. Is that up to par with kryonaut?


gc extreme is amazing, if you have it stick with it. The top 15 TIMs only vary by a couple degrees anyways so its totally pointless.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> gc extreme is amazing, if you have it stick with it. The top 15 TIMs only vary by a couple degrees anyways so its totally pointless.


good to know. Now obviously I use this on the outside of the ihs then apply block. Just like normal thermal paste.


----------



## alpsie

I fear my post got lost, in the discussion earlier, so I´m asking again just in case someone do have answers.

I have a question and hope someone can provide me with an answer.

When delidding the IHS makes contact with the die, but wont the pressure from putting it in the motherboard mount risk cracking the die, due to the gab no longer being there?
Im mostly curious about this regarding to the 7700K, since die and PCB seem to be getting thinner and thinner.

Follow up question, I´ve seen that a delidded 7700K have 4 small copper circles under the IHS, should/could these be covered up somehow, in case the liquid metal could flow out and onto them ?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alpsie*
> 
> I fear my post got lost, in the discussion earlier, so I´m asking again just in case someone do have answers.
> 
> I have a question and hope someone can provide me with an answer.
> 
> When delidding the IHS makes contact with the die, but wont the pressure from putting it in the motherboard mount risk cracking the die, due to the gab no longer being there?
> Im mostly curious about this regarding to the 7700K, since die and PCB seem to be getting thinner and thinner.
> 
> Follow up question, I´ve seen that a delidded 7700K have 4 small copper circles under the IHS, should/could these be covered up somehow, in case the liquid metal could flow out and onto them ?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


No it does not crack the die.

No there is no need to cover these up, the liquid metal will not flow onto them.

The only time you need to be careful, is when you are actually applying the liquid metal to the die and ensure that you do not get it on anything but the die itself.


----------



## alpsie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> No it does not crack the die.
> 
> No there is no need to cover these up, the liquid metal will not flow onto them.
> 
> The only time you need to be careful, is when you are actually applying the liquid metal to the die and ensure that you do not get it on anything but the die itself.


Thank you tknight for the quick responce
I´m less worried about the whole procedure now.

+Rep


----------



## unkletom

Temps dropped from 95c to 74c @ 5ghz 1.39v after a delid, new aio and change of thermal paste from mx4 to Kryonaut on both die and IHS.
Great succes


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *unkletom*
> 
> Temps dropped from 95c to 74c @ 5ghz 1.39v after a delid, new aio and change of thermal paste from mx4 to Kryonaut on both die and IHS.
> Great succes


Let me know if your temps change within a week. Thermal pastes don't seem to fair well on the die for some reason.


----------



## eXistencelies

So when I add the liquid metal to the die how long will it last? Do I have to keep maintaining it or is this a one time deal?


----------



## ROKUGAN

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Returning my 6700K for a 7700K now. Hopefully I'll see the 5 ghz mark.
> 
> My old 6700K was good with the temps. 2C spread between the cores. Hopefully the 7700K will be good as well.
> 
> Kaby-lake "needs" deilding, right?


I started a thread to find out average OC, volts and temps until an "official" KB thread comes out with broader statistics.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1620203/kaby-lake-5ghz-milestone

Depends on the cooler and the lottery it´s perfectly possible to achieve a 5G stable on a non-delidded chip, not sure about the exact probability (40-50% maybe).
Silicon Lottery reported 62% of their chips reaching 5G but they test @ 1.408v which is pretty high.


----------



## ROKUGAN

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> So when I add the liquid metal to the die how long will it last? Do I have to keep maintaining it or is this a one time deal?


Requires reapply, usually once a year. Just check your temps regularly looking for degradation after time.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> So when I add the liquid metal to the die how long will it last? Do I have to keep maintaining it or is this a one time deal?


I applied CLP to my 4790K roughly a year ago (2/18/16 to be precise) and haven't touched it since. Still runs the same. Might take a look at the one-year mark to see if it changed consistency at all.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROKUGAN*
> 
> I started a thread to find out average OC, volts and temps until an "official" KB thread comes out with broader statistics.
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1620203/kaby-lake-5ghz-milestone
> 
> Depends on the cooler and the lottery it´s perfectly possible to achieve a 5G stable on a non-delidded chip, not sure about the exact probability (40-50% maybe).
> Silicon Lottery reported 62% of their chips reaching 5G but they test @ 1.408v which is pretty high.


Its funny how things change so quickly, just a month ago before Kabylake came out, running a 6700k stable at 5ghz with 1.40 volts would have been considered a dream cpu, now its considered far too high and below average lol!!


----------



## ROKUGAN

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Its funny how things change so quickly, just a month ago before Kabylake came out, running a 6700k stable at 5ghz with 1.40 volts would have been considered a dream cpu, now its considered far too high and below average lol!!


Lol, SO true!


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROKUGAN*
> 
> Requires reapply, usually once a year. Just check your temps regularly looking for degradation after time.


Reapply every year? Ugh.....Something I really would rather do without. Draining loop, removing fans, removing tube, removing waterblock, removing chip, using rockitcool tool, reapplying liquid metal, then reverse process. Take me a good hour to do all that. Why would the LM degrade unlike the paste?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> I applied CLP to my 4790K roughly a year ago (2/18/16 to be precise) and haven't touched it since. Still runs the same. Might take a look at the one-year mark to see if it changed consistency at all.


Do you only game with the PC or do you do heavy stressing? I would think just normal gaming it would not stress the chip to hell to cause the LM to degrade over time from heat. I know they say to drain your loop once a year especially when you are using Mayhem's Pastel. Some have gone up to two years on same coolant.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Reapply every year? Ugh.....Something I really would rather do without. Draining loop, removing fans, removing tube, removing waterblock, removing chip, using rockitcool tool, reapplying liquid metal, then reverse process. Take me a good hour to do all that. Why would the LM degrade unlike the paste?
> Do you only game with the PC or do you do heavy stressing? I would think just normal gaming it would not stress the chip to hell to cause the LM to degrade over time from heat. I know they say to drain your loop once a year especially when you are using Mayhem's Pastel. Some have gone up to two years on same coolant.


Yea it definitely does NOT need reapplying every year thats just idiotic. It's not like a TIM its actually made to NOT degrade. Anyone who needs to reapply a liquid metal to the die just did it wrong in the first place.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Reapply every year? Ugh.....Something I really would rather do without. Draining loop, removing fans, removing tube, removing waterblock, removing chip, using rockitcool tool, reapplying liquid metal, then reverse process. Take me a good hour to do all that. Why would the LM degrade unlike the paste?
> Do you only game with the PC or do you do heavy stressing? I would think just normal gaming it would not stress the chip to hell to cause the LM to degrade over time from heat. I know they say to drain your loop once a year especially when you are using Mayhem's Pastel. Some have gone up to two years on same coolant.


It's mostly used for photo editing, occasionally video encoding and a bit of rendering. Gaming too. Temps stay below 60C so I don't think it's going to be all dried out.


----------



## ROKUGAN

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Reapply every year? Ugh.....Something I really would rather do without. Draining loop, removing fans, removing tube, removing waterblock, removing chip, using rockitcool tool, reapplying liquid metal, then reverse process. Take me a good hour to do all that. Why would the LM degrade unlike the paste? .


Your mileage may vary, liquid metal degrades over time and under high heat loads. It just degrades faster than normal TIM, but TIM won´t last forever either. Depends on the LM and how much heat are you putting into your chip. Just check temps and as long they´re ok don´t worry much. Your temps will tell when you need to reapply.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROKUGAN*
> 
> Your mileage may vary, liquid metal degrades over time and under high heat loads. It just degrades faster than normal TIM, but TIM won´t last forever either. Depends on the LM and how much heat are you putting into your chip. Just check temps and as long they´re ok don´t worry much. Your temps will tell when you need to reapply.


You really think LM degrades? Thats quite amusing. TIM doesn't last but a couple weeks best case scenario on the die. And since its the delid thread we are talking about on die paste/lm. It is true that if you notice temps changing then yea a reapply is necessary but i don't see this as being every year.

If you applied it correctly and in a thin manner like its supposed to be, i don't see this stuff degrading for a couple years. Ive had CPUs with CLU on em go for years without temps changing.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea it definitely does NOT need reapplying every year thats just idiotic. It's not like a TIM its actually made to NOT degrade. Anyone who needs to reapply a liquid metal to the die just did it wrong in the first place.


Good to know.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> It's mostly used for photo editing, occasionally video encoding and a bit of rendering. Gaming too. Temps stay below 60C so I don't think it's going to be all dried out.


Gotcha. So you actually put more stress on the cpu than I would. Mine is strictly gaming.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROKUGAN*
> 
> Your mileage may vary, liquid metal degrades over time and under high heat loads. It just degrades faster than normal TIM, but TIM won´t last forever either. Depends on the LM and how much heat are you putting into your chip. Just check temps and as long they´re ok don´t worry much. Your temps will tell when you need to reapply.


Like with my 4770k OC'd I would hit a max of 50*C during long gaming sessions. I think that is pretty good on a custom loop in a Phanteks Evolv TG. Cooling isn't all that great. My next mod on that case will be to get a machine shop to cut three holes in the front of the case and well as the top for better cooling. I would assume with this delid I will hit the same temps if not better during gaming.

Right now with the 5GH chip at 1.310v the temps go from 55-65 during gaming. That is also within the first 10 mins. It also spikes a lot and at great jumps too. Never seen a chip spike 15*C+ like that. Well one core that is.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> You really think LM degrades? Thats quite amusing. TIM doesn't last but a couple weeks best case scenario on the die. And since its the delid thread we are talking about on die paste/lm. It is true that if you notice temps changing then yea a reapply is necessary but i don't see this as being every year.
> 
> If you applied it correctly and in a thin manner like its supposed to be, i don't see this stuff degrading for a couple years. Ive had CPUs with CLU on em go for years without temps changing.


I watched the rockittool video and he applied the LM to both the die and the IHS. Using scotch tape seems like a good idea too. Keeps it an even spread. Also sine I am on that topic is the LM like paint? When you apply it with the brush you try to make the thinnest layer, right? Basically just like using paint and a brush?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> I watched the rockittool video and he applied the LM to both the die and the IHS. Using scotch tape seems like a good idea too. Keeps it an even spread. Also sine I am on that topic is the LM like paint? When you apply it with the brush you try to make the thinnest layer, right? Basically just like using paint and a brush?


You want it as thin as possible to begin with, because of the manufacturing tolerances and variances every IHS is slightly different. You might need a thin layer while someone else might need slightly more.

Also a good tip is to cut about half of the brush off so you get less CLU lost in the brush and more on the die. I usually cut half of the brush off then apply.


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> I watched the rockittool video and he applied the LM to both the die and the IHS. Using scotch tape seems like a good idea too. Keeps it an even spread. Also sine I am on that topic is the LM like paint? When you apply it with the brush you try to make the thinnest layer, right? Basically just like using paint and a brush?


That's how I did it. Nicked one of the girlfriends make up brushes (unused), cut the most of the bristles away, leaving them only few millimeters long and painted the CLU on.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> You want it as thin as possible to begin with, because of the manufacturing tolerances and variances every IHS is slightly different. You might need a thin layer while someone else might need slightly more.
> 
> Also a good tip is to cut about half of the brush off so you get less CLU lost in the brush and more on the die. I usually cut half of the brush off then apply.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> That's how I did it. Nicked one of the girlfriends make up brushes (unused), cut the most of the bristles away, leaving them only few millimeters long and painted the CLU on.


Yea I read about the brush thing. I was already going to do that. I just want to know if I need to also apply to the IHS as well like in the rockitcool video?


----------



## ROKUGAN

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> It's mostly used for photo editing, occasionally video encoding and a bit of rendering. Gaming too. Temps stay below 60C so I don't think it's going to be all dried out.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> You really think LM degrades? Thats quite amusing. TIM doesn't last but a couple weeks best case scenario on the die. And since its the delid thread we are talking about on die paste/lm. It is true that if you notice temps changing then yea a reapply is necessary but i don't see this as being every year.
> 
> If you applied it correctly and in a thin manner like its supposed to be, i don't see this stuff degrading for a couple years. Ive had CPUs with CLU on em go for years without temps changing.


Yes, maybe once a year was exagerated specially since he´s not putting that much stress in his CPU. I definitely remember reading people talking about LM degradation in some thread here a while ago, though. Wether application was flawed from the beginning or not, I can´t tell. I remember also about Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra having some issues in the past with some product drying up too soon, but it was years ago. There are always bad experiences out there, but that happens with everything:






I already said not to worry too much and just let the temps say you when it´s time for a change!


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ROKUGAN*
> 
> Yes, maybe once a year was exagerated specially since he´s not putting that much stress in his CPU. I definitely remember reading people talking about LM degradation in some thread here a while ago, though. Wether application was flawed from the beginning or not, I can´t tell. I remember also about Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra having some issues in the past with some product drying up too soon, but it was years ago. There are always bad experiences out there, but that happens with everything:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I already said not to worry too much and just let the temps say you when it´s time for a change!


I think the drying up was the CLU drying up in the tubes, could be that if stored for too long in a warehouse with humidity it might not do well idk.

My CPU peaks usually at 47°C with the ambien we have now, ill sometimes get a random peak of 51°C for no apparent reason. So i think unless your consistently getting higher temps then usual then yea could need a re-application.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I think the drying up was the CLU drying up in the tubes, could be that if stored for too long in a warehouse with humidity it might not do well idk.
> 
> My CPU peaks usually at 47°C with the ambien we have now, ill sometimes get a random peak of 51°C for no apparent reason. So i think unless your consistently getting higher temps then usual then yea could need a re-application.


could be referring to me. I've been having issues with Phoyba's LM drying up on me. I've been applying a little more each time and within a few months temps go up about 10c across the board. I'm to the point now where I don't feel comfortable putting more on so I'll be switching to CLU next time I've got my loop apart. Could be the 1.42v but I feel like that is reasonable enough to not require multiple applications per year


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> could be referring to me. I've been having issues with Phoyba's LM drying up on me. I've been applying a little more each time and within a few months temps go up about 10c across the board. I'm to the point now where I don't feel comfortable putting more on so I'll be switching to CLU next time I've got my loop apart. Could be the 1.42v but I feel like that is reasonable enough to not require multiple applications per year


Interesting. Mine so far with my new cpu, its probably been 3-4months and temps haven't changed. They've actually gone down but that's just due to lower ambient temps haha.

You could try CLU but pretty sure most liquid metals all have the same ingredients, might just be different specs but worth a shot.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Interesting. Mine so far with my new cpu, its probably been 3-4months and temps haven't changed. They've actually gone down but that's just due to lower ambient temps haha.
> 
> You could try CLU but pretty sure most liquid metals all have the same ingredients, might just be different specs but worth a shot.


I dunno, I was so stoked to go naked and now I'm pretty much back to regular delidded temps. I thought maybe my copper block was soaking it all up but I'm pretty sure it did the same thing when I was using the IHS, just not as quickly since I was at a lower voltage/freq. I've been using 2 different syringes of LM and both seem to act the same way. If CLU doesn't resolve it I may just get a 5820k for dat solder


----------



## eXistencelies

I have another question. Do I also put the LM on the IHS and waterblock (copper) or do I use actual thermal paste?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I dunno, I was so stoked to go naked and now I'm pretty much back to regular delidded temps. I thought maybe my copper block was soaking it all up but I'm pretty sure it did the same thing when I was using the IHS, just not as quickly since I was at a lower voltage/freq. I've been using 2 different syringes of LM and both seem to act the same way. If CLU doesn't resolve it I may just get a 5820k for dat solder


Oh i run naked and have for the past 6months at least on 2 dif 4690ks and haven't had a single issue with CLU. Temps have been identical as the day i put it on.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> I have another question. Do I also put the LM on the IHS and waterblock (copper) or do I use actual thermal paste?


Between the IHS and waterblock i would use regular tim, you could use LM but you won't see any temp difference, maybe a couple degrees if that.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Oh i run naked and have for the past 6months at least on 2 dif 4690ks and haven't had a single issue with CLU. Temps have been identical as the day i put it on.
> Between the IHS and waterblock i would use regular tim, you could use LM but you won't see any temp difference, maybe a couple degrees if that.


Ok. Just wanted to make sure. I will be doing the delidding today. Found out rockitcool is 20 miles from my house lol. So I will be picking it up myself. So LM on dye + inside of IHS and gelid thermal on outside of IHS + waterblock.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> I have another question. Do I also put the LM on the IHS and waterblock (copper) or do I use actual thermal paste?


2-3c difference vs Noctua NT-H1 for me. Maybe a bit more, ~5c on an HEDT CPU or GPU. Only really noticeable thing is LM cools down much faster after load is no longer applied... but that doesn't really matter.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> 2-3c difference vs Noctua NT-H1 for me. Maybe a bit more, ~5c on an HEDT CPU or GPU. Only really noticeable thing is LM cools down much faster after load is no longer applied... but that doesn't really matter.


Exactly and thats on the IHS. Ive tried so many TIMs and CLU/Conductonaut and i kid you not at least 5 TIMs and CLU all have identical temps. Tried it on a 6700k as well and same temps. I will try it on a 7700k if i can get my ends on one or ryzen when i update this summer.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alpsie*
> 
> I fear my post got lost, in the discussion earlier, so I´m asking again just in case someone do have answers.
> 
> I have a question and hope someone can provide me with an answer.
> 
> When delidding the IHS makes contact with the die, but wont the pressure from putting it in the motherboard mount risk cracking the die, due to the gab no longer being there?
> Im mostly curious about this regarding to the 7700K, since die and PCB seem to be getting thinner and thinner.
> 
> Follow up question, I´ve seen that a delidded 7700K have 4 small copper circles under the IHS, should/could these be covered up somehow, in case the liquid metal could flow out and onto them ?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


I would still recommend to cover those spots, its more so just a precaution and safety of your chip and hardware.


----------



## Rampage24

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Ok. Just wanted to make sure. I will be doing the delidding today. Found out rockitcool is 20 miles from my house lol. So I will be picking it up myself. So LM on dye + inside of IHS and gelid thermal on outside of IHS + waterblock.


Where are they located?


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rampage24*
> 
> Where are they located?


Houston, TX.


----------



## alpsie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would still recommend to cover those spots, its more so just a precaution and safety of your chip and hardware.


What could I use to cover them?
I´m guessing it should be something that can handle heat?

Would something like Starbrite Liquid Electrical Tape work, from what I can find it has a operating temp of 200-255F, 93-123 celcius


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alpsie*
> 
> What could I use to cover them?
> I´m guessing it should be something that can handle heat?
> 
> Would something like Starbrite Liquid Electrical Tape work, from what I can find it has a operating temp of 200-255F, 93-123 celcius


yup, That or clear fingernail polish. I had issues getting the liquid electrical tape to stick to my volt regulators at first, but it's been on there for a long time now without problems.


----------



## eXistencelies

So little update...Delidded my chip. Temps dropped by 22-25C. Overclock stable at 1.275v @ 5ghz. Ran a 15 min stress test on real bench (didn't have time for the 1 hour. Will do that later) and max temp on one core was 65C. Before it was hitting 87c with side panel off and 90c with side panel on. This is all in a Phanteks Evolv TG case. Another thing is before the delid I would get outrageous spikes that shot up randomly 15-20C. Now I do not ever get those spikes and all cores are within 5C of one another.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> So little update...Delidded my chip. Temps dropped by 22-25C. Overclock stable at 1.275v @ 5ghz. Ran a 15 min stress test on real bench (didn't have time for the 1 hour. Will do that later) and max temp on one core was 65C. Before it was hitting 87c with side panel off and 90c with side panel on. This is all in a Phanteks Evolv TG case. Another thing is before the delid I would get outrageous spikes that shot up randomly 15-20C. Now I do not ever get those spikes and all cores are within 5C of one another.


Massive temp drops, seems like the 7700k (as we previously thought), is another thick glue disaster from intel. I wish they would put pressure on the ihs/pcb while mounting it. My guess is, there afraid that the pcb will bend/break because of its thinness.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Massive temp drops, seems like the 7700k (as we previously thought), is another thick glue disaster from intel. I wish they would put pressure on the ihs/pcb while mounting it. My guess is, there afraid that the pcb will bend/break because of its thinness.


Yea I am very happy. I am willing to bet during normal gaming sessions I don't go over mid 50's which would be in par with my old setup. If I don't even get into the 50's I will be really happy. Obviously gaming doesn't stress the cpu anywhere near as hard as realbench does.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Yea I am very happy. I am willing to bet during normal gaming sessions I don't go over mid 50's which would be in par with my old setup. If I don't even get into the 50's I will be really happy. Obviously gaming doesn't stress the cpu anywhere near as hard as realbench does.


Youd be very surprised, intel stress test gets me identical temps as a cpu heavy game (ie anything that plays online multiplayer). Siege, GTA V online, etc. They tend to get the same peak temps as intel stress test. I use that and see no point in x264 and real bench and all that bs. My rig is a gaming rig, if its stable with 6hrs of gaming its stable haha.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Youd be very surprised, intel stress test gets me identical temps as a cpu heavy game (ie anything that plays online multiplayer). Siege, GTA V online, etc. They tend to get the same peak temps as intel stress test. I use that and see no point in x264 and real bench and all that bs. My rig is a gaming rig, if its stable with 6hrs of gaming its stable haha.


That is pretty much me, but my big ego gets in the way and I want to know what my chip is really capable of. Before the delid my temps were mid 60s during gaming. To high for my taste when you are on water. I want 40s. Low 50s are good too.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> That is pretty much me, but my big ego gets in the way and I want to know what my chip is really capable of. Before the delid my temps were mid 60s during gaming. To high for my taste when you are on water. I want 40s. Low 50s are good too.


Mine is at 46°C today during gaming at 1.21v on devils canyon so not too bad, seems like skylake and kaby run quite a bit cooler so it's either going to be Kaby or Ryzen next. Im only at 4.3ghz as well thats the sad part. My first 4690k did 1.2 at 4.5 so good to see 5ghz with such low voltage and low temps.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Mine is at 46°C today during gaming at 1.21v on devils canyon so not too bad, seems like skylake and kaby run quite a bit cooler so it's either going to be Kaby or Ryzen next. Im only at 4.3ghz as well thats the sad part. My first 4690k did 1.2 at 4.5 so good to see 5ghz with such low voltage and low temps.


Those are good temps. Damn 1.2v at 4.5 is good too.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Those are good temps. Damn 1.2v at 4.5 is good too.


Was good till i destroyed that chip testing it and got a subpar one at 1.21v @4.3 haha


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Was good till i destroyed that chip testing it and got a subpar one at 1.21v @4.3 haha


How did you destroy it?


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Was good till i destroyed that chip testing it and got a subpar one at 1.21v @4.3 haha


Wow that is indeed sub par.. Maybe sell it and buy another?
I'll never forget my 4790k at 4.8 and 1.28 V..


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alpsie*
> 
> What could I use to cover them?
> I´m guessing it should be something that can handle heat?
> 
> Would something like Starbrite Liquid Electrical Tape work, from what I can find it has a operating temp of 200-255F, 93-123 celcius


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> yup, That or clear fingernail polish. I had issues getting the liquid electrical tape to stick to my volt regulators at first, but it's been on there for a long time now without problems.


Agree, I used clear nail polish for my 6700K.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> How did you destroy it?


Bent it by accident and wouldnt post anymore.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> Wow that is indeed sub par.. Maybe sell it and buy another?
> I'll never forget my 4790k at 4.8 and 1.28 V..


No point, getting a Z270/AM4 mobo and new chip in a few months so no point, waiting for Vega as well.


----------



## alpsie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Agree, I used clear nail polish for my 6700K.


The nail polish is a lot cheaper xD and something i can get localy, the glue I have to import from the UK.
Nail Polish dont behave strange under heat?


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alpsie*
> 
> What could I use to cover them?
> I´m guessing it should be something that can handle heat?
> 
> Would something like Starbrite Liquid Electrical Tape work, from what I can find it has a operating temp of 200-255F, 93-123 celcius


Should be fine. I'am using Kapton Tape to cover smd parts or check points.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *alpsie*
> 
> The nail polish is a lot cheaper xD and something i can get localy, the glue I have to import from the UK.
> Nail Polish dont behave strange under heat?


Should be fine, many people have used this for that purpose without any issues. I haven't read any on here anyways.


----------



## Boulard83

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Should be fine, many people have used this for that purpose without any issues. I haven't read any on here anyways.


Yup, i've nail varnished my 4770k back in the days and this CPU is still rock solid with Coolaboratory liquid paste.


----------



## HowYesNo

hello guys. I've been going through this forum, and it's a long one. this got me interesting in deliding my 3570k, especially i see rockit 88 quite easy to use.
I am now at 4.6 with offset +0,010, turbo +0,053 LLC 2, currently 4hours of prime temps around 66C, max76C (noctua U12S), with Vcore 1,248 - 1,264. thats with room temp of 16C, come summer and its 15 more.
i wanted to know how does CLU stand after long time use, say 1 year, does it dry out, lose performance, any other issues?? tx.


----------



## inedenimadam

In my experience, CLU under a lid, or in use with a nickel plated block wont dry out at all, with copper it will seep in some and drying out may occur within that 1 year mark.


----------



## Enzarch

Have been running bare die and copper block with CLU for well over a year with no degradation.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Enzarch*
> 
> Have been running bare die and copper block with CLU for well over a year with no degradation.


My Apogee XL had some heavy degradation after about 8 months (dried out with dark spots). CLU had seeped into the block and very little was left on the IHS. I did apply too thin of a layer so that was likely more my problem... but it did seem like a lot had dried out. The block was also kinda stuck to the IHS. YMMV I guess.

Nickle is no problem though. I've had CLU on my GPU for a while now and the appearance of my GPU block hasn't changed.


----------



## ssateneth

I delidded my i7-5960x (yes, the HEDT CPU with the soldered IHS) mostly successfully and got a 10C drop with the IHS still in use. But some people are recommending some solution to the possibility of die cracking under pressure. My waterblock's mounting pressure isn't directly from screw tension but rather with springs and I can alter how much mounting pressure there is simply from how far I tighten the springs.

I was hoping maybe someone that has an MSI x99 xpower motherboard still has their x99 delid guard. I feel like that may be a good solution since the socket mounting mechanism is still pushing down on the IHS which pushes on the die to cause all pins to make contact where the delid die guard pushes down on the PCB around the die to make pin contact.


----------



## bfedorov11

Is it possible to run no IHS with a push pin heatsink? Few years ago, I ended up short an IHS thanks to problem with an ebay buyer. I have a little i3 4360 here collecting dust that I would like to use. I stole the IHS off it to use on another chip, so here I am.

I have a heatsink that appears to make decent enough contact with the die (socket clamp removed), but I do not think it is enough pressure to boot. I tried using a rubber band around the die and that didn't work. Do I need a shim on top of the die?


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bfedorov11*
> 
> Is it possible to run no IHS with a push pin heatsink? Few years ago, I ended up short an IHS thanks to problem with an ebay buyer. I have a little i3 4360 here collecting dust that I would like to use. I stole the IHS off it to use on another chip, so here I am.
> 
> I have a heatsink that appears to make decent enough contact with the die (socket clamp removed), but I do not think it is enough pressure to boot. I tried using a rubber band around the die and that didn't work. Do I need a shim on top of the die?


Why not just buy copper shims?


----------



## inedenimadam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bfedorov11*
> 
> Is it possible to run no IHS with a push pin heatsink? Few years ago, I ended up short an IHS thanks to problem with an ebay buyer. I have a little i3 4360 here collecting dust that I would like to use. I stole the IHS off it to use on another chip, so here I am.
> 
> I have a heatsink that appears to make decent enough contact with the die (socket clamp removed), but I do not think it is enough pressure to boot. I tried using a rubber band around the die and that didn't work. Do I need a shim on top of the die?


The push pin heatsinks have plastic arms and pins, and dont provide much mounting pressure at all. I would be surprised if you could get enough force out of the push pin system to get good enough contact to boot. use the lid and latch if you are going to use the push pin heat sink.

I also just wouldn't suggest overclocking to hard on a push pin heat sink in the first place...any cooler that doens't come with its own mounting hardware is probably also not going to come with very good cooling results.

We are talking about an intel provided circle heatsink, coper in the middle and aluminum fins... with a fan mounted on top, right?


----------



## bfedorov11

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inedenimadam*
> 
> The push pin heatsinks have plastic arms and pins, and dont provide much mounting pressure at all. I would be surprised if you could get enough force out of the push pin system to get good enough contact to boot. use the lid and latch if you are going to use the push pin heat sink.
> 
> I also just wouldn't suggest overclocking to hard on a push pin heat sink in the first place...any cooler that doens't come with its own mounting hardware is probably also not going to come with very good cooling results.
> 
> We are talking about an intel provided circle heatsink, coper in the middle and aluminum fins... with a fan mounted on top, right?


No, I have a Scythe Shuriken rev B. But it is basically the same type of mounting system as the stock intel one. It won't be overclocked.. it is only going in a HTPC.

Yeah, you're right. I found a piece of metal about the size of an IHS. Got it to boot if I press lightly on the heatsink.

I think I'll try some plastic washers on the back of the mobo. If that doesn't work maybe some nuts and bolts if these push pins come out.

:: success.. so far.. popped out two push pins on the intel heatsink (fits now with a shim). Used a round pop out from a metal electric box as a shim. Nuts, bolts, and plastic washers to mount. Sub 30 degrees in windows.


----------



## khemist

7700k might be a candidate for a delid, this is 5.0 1.34v in bios adfter two hours of bf1 with a 480 rad.

My 4790k @ 1.31v 4.8 was 59 max after delid for reference with the same cooling setup.


----------



## cephelix

@khemist nice oc. I couldn't even get my 4790K stable @4.8 with 1.38v.


----------



## GekkeGerrit

I did it!
I used this delidding tool. It worked exactly like shown in the video. My sister has access to a 3D printer so the tool only cost me about 2 euros. Load temps of the CPU dropped by about 10-15 degrees Celsius so I'm happy. Should give me enough wiggle room to hit 4.8 while keeping it P95 stable.

Pictures of the process:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








(I actually had to re-apply the CLU because the IHS wasn't in exactly the right spot when I put the CPU in the socket for the first time.)



Some quick benches to measure the temperature drop (pre & post delid):
(Yes I know, my maths is off. I also know this OC is stable enough to rum P95 Small FFTs for 4 hours, I just needed a few quick screenshots of the temps. Sorry the files are so massive, I was too lazy to compress.)


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!












BTW, it's a 6600k @ 4.6GHz with a Vcore of 1.34.


----------



## madweazl

temps.jpg 215k .jpg file
I decided to delid my 6600k this morning. I'm waiting on a couple more items for the water cooling but used some of the EK TIM from a GPU block just to see if it made much of a difference. Package temp dropped by 11° (previously maxing out at 86°) but there is still a large delta between cores with the coolest at 67° and hottest at 75° (likely my fault but that was the same core that ran hot previously too). HSF is a CM 212 Evo while I wait for a couple more WC components to arrive.


----------



## unkletom

Originally I had kryonaut on the die so I took it out today to clean it and noticed some scratches on the surface of the die inflicted by the IHS.

Is this normal or is it rekt? I got CLU coming in tomorrow so ill be able to test tomorrow.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *unkletom*
> 
> Originally I had kryonaut on the die so I took it out today to clean it and noticed some scratches on the surface of the die inflicted by the IHS.
> 
> Is this normal or is it rekt? I got CLU coming in tomorrow so ill be able to test tomorrow.


I have scratches on my die. Lots of them in fact. No issues. YMMV


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *unkletom*
> 
> Originally I had kryonaut on the die so I took it out today to clean it and noticed some scratches on the surface of the die inflicted by the IHS.
> 
> Is this normal or is it rekt? I got CLU coming in tomorrow so ill be able to test tomorrow.


That's normal - if it were possible to get glass and metals absolutely perfectly polished... we wouldn't need TIM to fill anything in. Two of my delids had quite a few light scratches, one was perfect. Unfortunately the perfect one was a horrible clocker so doesn't matter. My 5G+ 3770 had a bunch of scratches and stays nice and cool with the CLU on it.


----------



## khemist

What's the best delidding tool at the moment?, i've not been keeping up since i done my 4790k.

I'm considering doing my 7700k.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> What's the best delidding tool at the moment?, i've not been keeping up since i done my 4790k.
> 
> I'm considering doing my 7700k.


I have the rockitcool tool and it works wonders.. It's not that expensive too!


----------



## khemist

Shipping costs almost as much as the tool, ordered it anyway.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> Shipping costs almost as much as the tool, ordered it anyway.


Damn really? Sucks you live in another country. I found out I actually live in the same city (20 miles away) and I went and picked mine up.


----------



## bluej511

I use the entersetup one, the owner hasnt made one in a while and has a new revision that he's working on and will be compatible with Kaby Lake as well. The debaure one or wtv its called is SO expensive for what it is.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> Shipping costs almost as much as the tool, ordered it anyway.


I think if you buy the relid kit the shopping cost drops


----------



## khemist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> I think if you buy the relid kit the shopping cost drops


I did and it didn't.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> I did and it didn't.


Oh maybe the discount is over then..
At least it is still way cheaper than other delid solutions.. I mean what der8auer is asking is ridiculous.. It's a nice tool but not worth more than 1/3 from what he's asking. Rockitcool's is nicely priced.


----------



## khemist

I'll probably sell this one on after i've used it and include some of the postage price in that, not a big deal.


----------



## unkletom

Was getting high temps after a few days on Kryonaut. I believe it pumped out









I applied Phobya liquid metal now and getting 68-70c running realbench on 240MM AIO watercooling at 5 ghz 1.44v.







The fans on the radiator are running at quite low speeds too.

Liquid Metal Magic baby. Crazy stuff. Still got Kryonaut on top of the IHS.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *unkletom*
> 
> Was getting high temps after a few days on Kryonaut. I believe it pumped out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I applied Phobya liquid metal now and getting 68-70c running realbench on 240MM AIO watercooling at 5 ghz 1.44v.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The fans on the radiator are running at quite low speeds too.
> 
> Liquid Metal Magic baby. Crazy stuff. Still got Kryonaut on top of the IHS.


sounds about right! Make sure to keep us updated on your temps, I've been using Phoyba's LM and my temps keep going up after a few months. Also running 1.4v+ and I think that may be contributing but it'd be good to have others results.

I'll be switching to CLU asap to see if it makes a difference


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *unkletom*
> 
> Was getting high temps after a few days on Kryonaut. I believe it pumped out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I applied Phobya liquid metal now and getting 68-70c running realbench on 240MM AIO watercooling at 5 ghz 1.44v.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The fans on the radiator are running at quite low speeds too.
> 
> Liquid Metal Magic baby. Crazy stuff. Still got Kryonaut on top of the IHS.


We do try to warn people in here but some know it alls insist that TIM is perfectly fine on the die and that Intel TIM is crap. But hey guess what, Intels TIM doesnt pump out though does it? Oh right cuz the issue is the gap and not the TIM. Unless rockittool is wrong as well in saying its the gap.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> We do try to warn people in here but some know it alls insist that TIM is perfectly fine on the die and that Intel TIM is crap. But hey guess what, Intels TIM doesnt pump out though does it? Oh right cuz the issue is the gap and not the TIM. Unless rockittool is wrong as well in saying its the gap.


Its both the gap and the Intel TIM, as Rockit also says "that a new more efficient TIM can be applied".


----------



## Arctucas

And I am certain that new, less efficient TIM can also be applied.

Just because there are TIM that are better than the OEM, e.g. liquid metals, does not mean that the Intel TIM is not good, just that it is not the absolute best.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> And I am certain that new, less efficient TIM can also be applied.
> 
> Just because there are TIM that are better than the OEM, e.g. liquid metals, does not mean that the Intel TIM is not good, just that it is not the absolute best.


Don't waste your time arctucas, he has it dead set in his little mind that Intel TIM is utter garbage (as thought by the internet loonies who don't understand thermal efficiency.

"-can be applied in a much thinner layer giving major increase in heat transfer efficiency." It's all there! Black and white, clear as crystal! You stole Fizzy-Lifting Drinks!


----------



## Ceadderman

Funny how something so simple to understand as pump out can be lost on someone so smart.

Without full contact between *any* TIM and the IHS, the TIM will boil and pump out. The worst TIM or even the best, will pushout. It doesn't mean Intel TIM is crap. It's just not in direct contact with the IHS due to the gap created by the liberal amount of sealant applied at the manufacturing line.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Funny how something so simple to understand as pump out can be lost on someone so smart.
> 
> Without full contact between *any* TIM and the IHS, the TIM will boil and pump out. The worst TIM or even the best, will pushout. It doesn't mean Intel TIM is crap. It's just not in direct contact with the IHS due to the gap created by the liberal amount of sealant applied at the manufacturing line.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Well said


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Don't waste your time arctucas, he has it dead set in his little mind that Intel TIM is utter garbage (as thought by the internet loonies who don't understand thermal efficiency.
> 
> "-can be applied in a much thinner layer giving major increase in heat transfer efficiency." It's all there! Black and white, clear as crystal! You stole Fizzy-Lifting Drinks!


Either you must have shares in Intel's TIM or you are simply in denial, as Rockit clearly writes in the quote that YOU posted, that a better more efficient TIM needs to be applied.

Its hilarious how you reference everything but that one aspect of his quote, because it goes against your babbling in your ongoing ridiculous quest, of trying to convince people that the Intel TIM is not part of the heat issue.

The only loon is you, as you have absolutely no evidence to support your argument whatsoever. There is substantial evidence to the contrary of what you are saying, that proves that the Intel TIM is contributing to the poor heat dissipation and that aftermarket high end TIMS, specifically designed for overclocking are far superior.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Either you must have shares in Intel's TIM or you are simply in denial, as Rockit clearly writes in the quote that YOU posted, that a better more efficient TIM needs to be applied.
> 
> Its hilarious how you reference everything but that one aspect of his quote, because it goes against your babbling in your ongoing ridiculous quest, of trying to convince people that the Intel TIM is not part of the heat issue.
> 
> The only loon is you, as you have absolutely no evidence to support your argument whatsoever. There is substantial evidence to the contrary of what you are saying, that proves that the Intel TIM is contributing to the poor heat dissipation and that aftermarket high end TIMS, specifically designed for overclocking are far superior.


Guess reading definitely owns you. And no i don't have shares in dow corning thank you very much.

Two. Rockit88 wrote CAN be used not SHOULD be used. If you don't understand the difference between can and should i don't know how to help you. At least half a dozen people have agreed with me and disagreed with you but you still seem to think Intel TIM is the issue.

And P.S. According to your theory all TIMs are absolute garbage as they're outperformed by CLU anyways. By your logic liquid metal should be used and should always be used no matter what. We could even use liquid diamond for heat dissipation and compared to that CLU is even worse.


----------



## madweazl

After a little more testing the other day, the EK Ectotherm ended up being 2° hotter on the highest core (88° vs 86° prior to the delid). The NTH1 arrived today so I opened it back up and applied it; the Ectotherm looked to have stayed in place just fine (no oozing down the chip anyways) and the IHS was well covered. While it certainly isnt conclusive, I'd say the stock TIM is every bit as good Ectotherm on air cooling. The last piece of the custom loop arrives tomorrow so I wont be doing any more testing with it on air but I thought those were interesting results regardless.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> After a little more testing the other day, the EK Ectotherm ended up being 2° hotter on the highest core (88° vs 86° prior to the delid). The NTH1 arrived today so I opened it back up and applied it; the Ectotherm looked to have stayed in place just fine (no oozing down the chip anyways) and the IHS was well covered. While it certainly isnt conclusive, I'd say the stock TIM is every bit as good Ectotherm on air cooling. The last piece of the custom loop arrives tomorrow so I wont be doing any more testing with it on air but I thought those were interesting results regardless.


Wait are you using EKs paste on the die or on the IHS? On the IHS its fine to use, thats decent TIM at best, i wouldn't use TIMs on the die though as we've discussed before it will def pump out. Ive had mine pump out and get 10°C higher temps within a day, if i OC it to 1.5v it pumps out within hours at full gaming tilt haha.


----------



## Ceadderman

Intel is *NOT* going to put high dollar CLU, CLP or any Liquid metal between their dies and IHS plates. That's a pipe dream of the silliest kind. Their TIM is not the best but it's fine for their chips.

Now if AMD does it and they successfully take some of Intel's marketshare then they would likely follow suit. But since AMD won't do that we can rest assured Intel won't.

After all this, I'm thinking we're being sucked into an argument of semantics by a kid. I have a teenager in my life, I know how they think.









~Ceadder


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Wait are you using EKs paste on the die or on the IHS? On the IHS its fine to use, thats decent TIM at best, i wouldn't use TIMs on the die though as we've discussed before it will def pump out. Ive had mine pump out and get 10°C higher temps within a day, if i OC it to 1.5v it pumps out within hours at full gaming tilt haha.


It was used on both as that is what I had on hand. Right now, NTH1 is on both but the system wont be up and running again until Thursday I image. "Pumped out" is the term for it getting hot and oozing out of the contact area I take it? While this is my first delid, I've never seen this happen in other applications. Not saying it isnt possible, just find it odd that I've not encountered the issue with other applications. What causes this between the IHS and die?


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> It was used on both as that is what I had on hand. Right now, NTH1 is on both but the system wont be up and running again until Thursday I image. "Pumped out" is the term for it getting hot and oozing out of the contact area I take it? While this is my first delid, I've never seen this happen in other applications. Not saying it isnt possible, just find it odd that I've not encountered the issue with other applications. What causes this between the IHS and die?


Pressure. Heat.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Pressure. Heat.


As opposed to what? I'm not trying to be argumentative here but the heat is marginally different at best. It looks like there is less pressure between the IHS and die so that is understandable I suppose. Ordered some CLU so it will be interesting to see what happens over the next week.


----------



## Ximplicite

after delid it is ok to put the ihs without any glue?

also 1 more question it is ok to put nt-h1? im still waiting for clu.


----------



## TritonianYeti

Can I join??

OCN name: *TritonianYeti*
CPU: *i7-6700k*
on die-TIM: *Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut*
ihs-TIM: *Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut*
Mhz gained: *200 Mhz*
OC after delid: *4.8 Ghz http://valid.x86.fr/bdzrua*
Temp drops: *right around 20C degree drop, won't go above 41C degrees when gaming*

Can't get my chip to go above 4.8. System becomes unstable and BSOD or won't boot.

Don't have any pictures of the delid process, but I am doing an ITX build with a 6600k here in the next couple of months, I will be sure to take some then!


----------



## TritonianYeti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> after delid it is ok to put the ihs without any glue?
> 
> also 1 more question it is ok to put nt-h1? im still waiting for clu.


#1: I don't know what the general consensus here is about the reglueing of the IHS, but I am running my 6700k without reglueing the IHS to the PCB. I have not had any issues with it the 2 months or so that it has been delidded, and I moved the MB to a new case that changed the MB orientation. If you do not glue the IHS back down, just be careful when you are putting the CPU on the MB and apply slight pressure to the IHS when placing the load plate on to the IHS, so that the IHS does not slide along the PCB. That is what I did and had no issues.

#2: From my understanding it is ok to use regular TIM grease like the nt-h1, but for optimal performance, the liquid metal variety is preferred. But I don't have experience with using grease under the IHS, hopefully someone can give you a more concrete answer.


----------



## tknight

[
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Guess reading definitely owns you. And no i don't have shares in dow corning thank you very much.
> 
> Two. Rockit88 wrote CAN be used not SHOULD be used. If you don't understand the difference between can and should i don't know how to help you. At least half a dozen people have agreed with me and disagreed with you but you still seem to think Intel TIM is the issue.
> 
> And P.S. According to your theory all TIMs are absolute garbage as they're outperformed by CLU anyways. By your logic liquid metal should be used and should always be used no matter what. We could even use liquid diamond for heat dissipation and compared to that CLU is even worse.


I think you need to go to back to school and learn how to read, as it CLEARLY says in his quote, "A More Efficient TIM", which CLEARLY indicates that he is saying, that the Intel TIM is not as efficient as other TIMS.

Your half a dozen people that agree with you, unfortunately pale in comparison to pretty much the rest of the overclocking community, including the world's top overclockers, who infact were the ones who worked out and came up with the whole delidding solution in the first place and they have proven that the Intel TIM is not a good product. And if you think you know more than them, you are delusional.

It is a FACT not a theory, that CLU should always be used under the IHS for the best thermal results, when cooling by air or water.

Again stop trying to act like an arrogant, rude, insulting, think you know it all with your one 4690K cpu, that you base all your knowledge on.

Especially since you have only learnt how to build your first pc, just 10 months ago and prior to that, the extent of your pc knowledge was barely knowing how to swap out a graphics card in premade systems, built by others as per the link below..

http://www.overclock.net/t/1595391/build-log-the-french-touch

I am sick of people talking absolute BS on forums, and thinking they know it all, when in reality haven't done a fraction of what they are trying to act like an expert on and have just read what others have written and then go around duplicating it like they are knowledgeable on the subject and misleading those who are actually trying to learn.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Intel is *NOT* going to put high dollar CLU, CLP or any Liquid metal between their dies and IHS plates. That's a pipe dream of the silliest kind. Their TIM is not the best but it's fine for their chips.
> 
> Now if AMD does it and they successfully take some of Intel's marketshare then they would likely follow suit. But since AMD won't do that we can rest assured Intel won't.
> 
> After all this, I'm thinking we're being sucked into an argument of semantics by a kid. I have a teenager in my life, I know how they think.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


What are you talking about? Who is saying anything about Intel using CLU. Nobody. It's about the Intel TIM not being a good enough product that is being used in unlocked cpu's that are intended to be overclocked, but then are limited due to the ineffective heat dissipation.

If you along with Bluej511, think that the Intel TIM does not contribute to the heat issue, then you two are both as lost as each other.

The heat issue with all cpu's that use TIM instead of solder, is caused by both the gap between the IHS and cpu die and ALSO the Intel TIM.

It is not just the gap alone that is the problem. The Intel TIM is also a part of the problem as it does not dissipate heat as efficiently as the high end aftermarket TIMS. These superior TIMS do achieve considerably lower cpu temperatures of upwards of 10+ degrees diference from the Intel TIM.

When compared to the aftermarket high end TIMS, that have been specifically made for overclocking and handling the higher heat output, the Intel TIM is garbage.


----------



## Ceadderman

You're kidding right?









You can overclock *ALL* AMD chips and they're pretty much using the same TIM that Intel is using. Your argument is fail. Intel isn't going to change TIM whether or not it's for "Enthusiast" class chips. That's a ridonkulous thought process where it would hit their bottom line. If you don't like it you can vote with your wallet. Good luck finding a better Enthusiast CPU since AMD isn't using better TIM.









~Ceadder


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> You're kidding right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can overclock *ALL* AMD chips and they're pretty much using the same TIM that Intel is using. Your argument is fail. Intel isn't going to change TIM whether or not it's for "Enthusiast" class chips. That's a ridonkulous thought process where it would hit their bottom line. If you don't like it you can vote with your wallet. Good luck finding a better Enthusiast CPU since AMD isn't using better TIM.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I never once said that Intel are actually going to change anything, so why do you keep referring to Intel changing anything, when that is not even being discussed.

The topic was simply about the current Intel TIM and it not being as good as the aftermarket TIMS. That's all.


----------



## Ceadderman

And nobody said it was. Duh.

But it's not garbage.









~Ceadder


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TritonianYeti*
> 
> Can I join??
> 
> OCN name: *TritonianYeti*
> CPU: *i7-6700k*
> on die-TIM: *Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut*
> ihs-TIM: *Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut*
> Mhz gained: *200 Mhz*
> OC after delid: *4.8 Ghz http://valid.x86.fr/bdzrua*
> Temp drops: *right around 20C degree drop, won't go above 41C degrees when gaming*
> 
> Can't get my chip to go above 4.8. System becomes unstable and BSOD or won't boot.
> 
> Don't have any pictures of the delid process, but I am doing an ITX build with a 6600k here in the next couple of months, I will be sure to take some then!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## mrgnex

*OCN name* mrgnex
*CPU* Intel Core i7 6700K
*On-die TIM* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
*IHS TIM* Artic Cooling MX4
*Mhz gained* 0 Mhz
*Max OC* 4800 MHz
*Temp drop* 15-21 degrees (15 on the core with the least difference and 21 on the core with the biggest difference) Average drop of 18 degrees Celsius.
*Proof* http://valid.x86.fr/44j28w

Haven't tried to push higher yet cause I am more concerned about voltage and sail happy at 4.8 GHz.

Note: I have set a custom fan profile in teh BIOS so the temperature difference might be bigger.

Using a stress test these are the results:
Before:


After:


----------



## willtron3000

Just waiting for my Rockit88 to arrive so I can delid my 7700k.

Just curious, would a dab of superglue (Loctite/Gorilla Glue) in the corners then keeping some pressure on the IHS while it dries be sufficient for relidding? Or should I stick with my original idea of a floating IHS?

Pretty excited to delid, I think I've got a decent chip seeing as I'm getting 5.00GHz at 1.35v and ~85c in prime96/ 60c in Battlefield 1 right now.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *willtron3000*
> 
> Just waiting for my Rockit88 to arrive so I can delid my 7700k.
> 
> Just curious, would a dab of superglue (Loctite/Gorilla Glue) in the corners then keeping some pressure on the IHS while it dries be sufficient for relidding? Or should I stick with my original idea of a floating IHS?
> 
> Pretty excited to delid, I think I've got a decent chip seeing as I'm getting 5.00GHz at 1.35v and ~85c in prime96/ 60c in Battlefield 1 right now.


I've had no problems with not resealing the IHS. I just apply pressure to the IHS as I'm securing the latch to make sure it doesn't shift.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> As opposed to what? I'm not trying to be argumentative here but the heat is marginally different at best. It looks like there is less pressure between the IHS and die so that is understandable I suppose. Ordered some CLU so it will be interesting to see what happens over the next week.


Madweazl, before you delid there is a .06mm (depending on your cpu of course, some are less some are more) if its less youll see LESS of a temp drop after delid and if its more well youll see more.

The issue is that people look at core temps in software and think thats the actual temp of the die, the die gets quite a lot hotter then people think and there is no die temp sensor. Reason that pretty much 99% of TIMs pump out is because the heat is so concentrated on the die compared to the IHS thats probably about 5-6x the size of the die hence why its called integrated heat SPREADER.

Most TIMs just dont have the viscosity to keep going under heat on the die. Im shocked you haven't experienced it before but it seems to happen faster the higher in voltage you go because A+v=w and hence far more heat.

I have Kryonaut on a 3350p that i gave to my mom to use, i delided that for testing purposes, its a 35w tdp cpu with no igpu. The paste and temps have been perfect for 6months. On customer builds that i've done (i pretty much delid every single one and apply CLU) i dont put thermal paste on the die at all.

In this thread its been confirmed that TIM just does not last on bare die. Ive tested it with about a dozen TIMs i had lying around, temps changed anywhere between 24hrs to a week. And btw its not that CLU will give you better temps its just far more reliable and not prone at all to pump out.


----------



## madweazl

It hadn't been running for 24hrs before I started switching over the to the custom loop. We'll see how the NTH1 goes while I'm flushing things out awaiting the CLU to arrive. Should provide four or five days worth of data.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> It hadn't been running for 24hrs before I started switching over the to the custom loop. We'll see how the NTH1 goes while I'm flushing things out awaiting the CLU to arrive. Should provide four or five days worth of data.


Its what i used was Noctua, was shocked how quick it pumped out and btw this was WITHOUT the IHS and less then ideal mounting pressure on the die even on haswell haha.

P.S. I actually tested the mounting pressure with pressure paper, something most people who test there TIMs dont do.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its what i used was Noctua, was shocked how quick it pumped out and btw this was WITHOUT the IHS and less then ideal mounting pressure on the die even on haswell haha.
> 
> P.S. I actually tested the mounting pressure with pressure paper, something most people who test there TIMs dont do.


Is your reference to less than ideal pressure synonymous with lower or higher mounting pressure?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> Is your reference to less than ideal pressure synonymous with lower or higher mounting pressure?


Lower. Ideally you want it closer to high so the TIM is in an incredibly thin layer between the 2 surfaces. Its why most waterblock/heatsinks/coolers are convex in the middle to put more pressure where the cores actually sit (dead center)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> *OCN name* mrgnex
> *CPU* Intel Core i7 6700K
> *On-die TIM* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *IHS TIM* Artic Cooling MX4
> *Mhz gained* 0 Mhz
> *Max OC* 4800 MHz
> *Temp drop* 15-21 degrees (15 on the core with the least difference and 21 on the core with the biggest difference) Average drop of 18 degrees Celsius.
> *Proof* http://valid.x86.fr/44j28w
> 
> Haven't tried to push higher yet cause I am more concerned about voltage and sail happy at 4.8 GHz.
> 
> Note: I have set a custom fan profile in teh BIOS so the temperature difference might be bigger.
> 
> Using a stress test these are the results:
> Before:
> 
> 
> After:


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Thanks! Not that it matters but I use MX4 for my IHS TIM


----------



## madmeatballs

So I decided to delid my 7700k right away. I used vice only method like I did with my 4790k. Looks like I have bent the IHS? I should probably lap this right?


----------



## madweazl

Preliminary run at 4.5 on the custom loop using NTH1 on die and IHS (CLU inbound). I used a razor blade for the delid and was surprised at how easy it actually was (no reseal). The only before temp I have prior to the delid was on air at 75° (4.5 @1.32v). SR2L4 X548B401

CPU-Z validation


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!





__
https://flic.kr/p/RbRx2a




It did boot at 4.9 for the first time but required 1.50v to do so and locked up shortly after. I'll try again at 1.51 to see if it will run any benchmarks but 4.5 will be the daily OC.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!





__
https://flic.kr/p/Q64pKu


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> So I decided to delid my 7700k right away. I used vice only method like I did with my 4790k. Looks like I have bent the IHS? I should probably lap this right?


Honestly depending on what cooler you use might not even touch the edges. I would def clean em up though, either send em down or grind em down it wont matter. Those edges shouldn't contact anything (unless youre cooler/waterblock base are massive it might and would keep the block elevated giving you worse temps.)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> Preliminary run at 4.5 on the custom loop using NTH1 on die and IHS (CLU inbound). I used a razor blade for the delid and was surprised at how easy it actually was (no reseal). The only before temp I have prior to the delid was on air at 75° (4.5 @1.32v). SR2L4 X548B401
> 
> CPU-Z validation
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/RbRx2a
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It did boot at 4.9 for the first time but required 1.50v to do so and locked up shortly after. I'll try again at 1.51 to see if it will run any benchmarks but 4.5 will be the daily OC.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> https://flic.kr/p/Q64pKu


Damn those little suckers run HOT haha.


----------



## madmeatballs

Well I just proceeded with lapping it anyway







. Don't want to have to do it later on when I find out my water block isn't seated properly.
It is my first time to lap, took me an hour to get this mirror finish.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> Well I just proceeded with lapping it anyway
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Don't want to have to do it later on when I find out my water block isn't seated properly.
> It is my first time to lap, took me an hour to get this mirror finish.


Honestly more people should lap the IHS, makes a bigger difference then switching from TIM to CLU on the die.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Honestly more people should lap the IHS, makes a bigger difference then switching from TIM to CLU on the die.


What is lapping?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> What is lapping?


We sanding the IHS to make it completely FLAT. The flatter the IHS and heatsink/waterblock are the less TIM you need to use and the better the heat transfers therefore giving you better temps but also quicker temp drops from load to idle. Mine because its bare die my temp drops instantly from load down to idle(ish)


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> What is lapping?


Lapping is very fine polishing to get a super flat surface. Often this word is wrong used for grinding the spreader surface cause you can´t lap with tools you have at home.


----------



## Ceadderman

Sure you can. 3 differing grits of sandpaper does the same thing as a hone does. Just in different ways.









~Ceadder


----------



## madmeatballs

Well I used 5 different grits from 220 - 320 - 600 - 1200 - 1500. Some suggest 2000 grit to finish it off. But these grits were the only ones I could find in my hardware store.


----------



## madweazl

4.9 was a no-go but 4.85 works








CPU-Z Validation


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> Well I used 5 different grits from 220 - 320 - 600 - 1200 - 1500. Some suggest 2000 grit to finish it off. But these grits were the only ones I could find in my hardware store.


I did a Thermaltake CPU cooler, finishing with 4000 grit.

I got it at a local automotive paint supply store. I believe they had as fine as 8000 grit.


----------



## spddmn24

I just realized I forgot to leave a small gap when I resealed my lid. Any purpose to that other than intel making sure they don't overlap with a big glob of sealant? I don't think the pressure buildup from heat will hurt anything will it? I just rubbed a thin layer of rtv with my finger over the ihs before putting it on.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spddmn24*
> 
> I just realized I forgot to leave a small gap when I resealed my lid. Any purpose to that other than intel making sure they don't overlap with a big glob of sealant? I don't think the pressure buildup from heat will hurt anything will it? I just rubbed a thin layer of rtv with my finger over the ihs before putting it on.


Idk where you're trying to leave a gap but a pic would help. You want no gap anywhere PERIOD.


----------



## spddmn24

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Idk where you're trying to leave a gap but a pic would help. You want no gap anywhere PERIOD.


I ment a small gap in sealant coverage so it's not a full 360 degrees leaving a little hole. Not sure if it's needed as a vent or just to make production easier.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spddmn24*
> 
> I ment a small gap in sealant coverage so it's not a full 360 degrees leaving a little hole. Not sure if it's needed as a vent or just to make production easier.


Yea its weird they have a gap, for people who reseal and put pressure on it id honestly just put a dot in each corner then press it down so theres absolutely no gap between IHS and die and youre good to go.


----------



## StullenAndi

It´s no problem to apply the ihs like intel does.


----------



## AndreVeck

I've just delidded my i7-3770k, looking forward to submit all the data to be a proud member!
(currently I don't have a motherboard)


----------



## postem

Hi people.
Im in love with my 7700K 5ghz stable, but going over 82c for daily usage is a no way.

So i brought everything needed for a safe as possible delid:
- Rockit delid tool with relid tool
- Isopropyl alcohol
- Coolaboratory Ultra
- Gelid GC extreme for IHS
- Color less nail polish for contact points on internal pcb.

Im probably going to relid it back with the glue suggested by rockit cool, as it seen to be detachable with acetone (its plain cyanocrilat). Gonna do a test now on other surface. Watched a ton of videos, things seen okay. I dont want to use a silicone adhesive, it seen to take a lot of time to cure and there is the bump it may make.

Some questions:
1) Did you people try to use as low as possible CLU or just enough?
2) Did you put CLU in the IHS or just on die?

Any other recomendations?


----------



## geriatricpollywog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Hi people.
> Im in love with my 7700K 5ghz stable, but going over 82c for daily usage is a no way.
> 
> So i brought everything needed for a safe as possible delid:
> - Rockit delid tool with relid tool
> - Isopropyl alcohol
> - Coolaboratory Ultra
> - Gelid GC extreme for IHS
> - Color less nail polish for contact points on internal pcb.
> 
> Im probably going to relid it back with the glue suggested by rockit cool, as it seen to be detachable with acetone (its plain cyanocrilat). Gonna do a test now on other surface. Watched a ton of videos, things seen okay. I dont want to use a silicone adhesive, it seen to take a lot of time to cure and there is the bump it may make.
> 
> Some questions:
> 1) Did you people try to use as low as possible CLU or just enough?
> 2) Did you put CLU in the IHS or just on die?
> 
> Any other recomendations?


Sorry this is not an answer, but I'd like to know what voltage you are using at 5 ghz. My 7700k is not stable at 4.8ghz at 1.3v.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0451*
> 
> Sorry this is not an answer, but I'd like to know what voltage you are using at 5 ghz. My 7700k is not stable at 4.8ghz at 1.3v.


Sure 1.3v got stable with memory 2133. Upped to 1.33 (readings up to 1.34 on hwinfo). Got around 81c on H110i max fans, but luckly im on several days of heavy rain in mid of brazilian summer. If time was dry cpu probably was around 95, im getting just a low ambient temperature of 22-25c. Worse summers here got 39C


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Sure 1.3v got stable with memory 2133. Upped to 1.33 (readings up to 1.34 on hwinfo). Got around 81c on H110i max fans, but luckly im on several days of heavy rain in mid of brazilian summer. If time was dry cpu probably was around 95, im getting just a low ambient temperature of 22-25c. Worse summers here got 39C


That corsair h110i won't do any better then your high end air cooler sorry to say.

Pro tip, don't glue your IHS back on until your positive you're fully happy with your temps. Use as little clu as possible, put the cpu back in the socket, put the IHS on and pin it down with the mechanism. Run a benchmark and see how your temps are. If your cores are +10°C from each other or your temps are still high, remove and reapply a thin coat of CLU then repeat. If happy with your temps remove the CPU and glue the IHS down in 2 to 4 corners (a bead all the way around is totally useless as there is so much pressure from the cpu socket mechanism to hold the IHS down anyways, most of us don't even re-silicone the IHS back on)

Just make sure you're putting pressure down on the IHS if you're resealing. Contrary to popular belief you won't get better temps just from changing the thermal material. You want no gap between the IHS, the silicon, and the wafer. The bigger the gap the more thermal material you have to use, the more thermal material you use the less likely it is to do its job CORRECTLY.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> That corsair h110i won't do any better then your high end air cooler sorry to say.
> 
> Pro tip, don't glue your IHS back on until your positive you're fully happy with your temps. Use as little clu as possible, put the cpu back in the socket, put the IHS on and pin it down with the mechanism. Run a benchmark and see how your temps are. If your cores are +10°C from each other or your temps are still high, remove and reapply a thin coat of CLU then repeat. If happy with your temps remove the CPU and glue the IHS down in 2 to 4 corners (a bead all the way around is totally useless as there is so much pressure from the cpu socket mechanism to hold the IHS down anyways, most of us don't even re-silicone the IHS back on)
> 
> Just make sure you're putting pressure down on the IHS if you're resealing. Contrary to popular belief you won't get better temps just from changing the thermal material. You want no gap between the IHS, the silicon, and the wafer. The bigger the gap the more thermal material you have to use, the more thermal material you use the less likely it is to do its job CORRECTLY.


The decision to use a h110 was that i didnt wanted to deal anymore with giant coolers. My options were either a big corsair or a big noctua, so a choose the former. Im tired of having to deal with memory heights, weight, unmount to transfer these things.

I dont expect miracles even because im not running a custom loop, my target is to reduce at least 10C, which seem very feasible.
I know that the major problem with intel cpus is the silicone adhesive gap, because of that im considering to either float it or place it back using a super glue soluble in acertone in the corners, so i can maintain basically almost zero extra height.

Also i believe probably any quality paste could hold on, but it seen as majority says, they worn out pretty fast, so at least clu remains more stable.

My current thermals are so bizarre that i think i can get better with it. Currently, im getting a top difference of 14C between core 0 and 3, with stock sealed paste.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> The decision to use a h110 was that i didnt wanted to deal anymore with giant coolers. My options were either a big corsair or a big noctua, so a choose the former. Im tired of having to deal with memory heights, weight, unmount to transfer these things.
> 
> I dont expect miracles even because im not running a custom loop, my target is to reduce at least 10C, which seem very feasible.
> I know that the major problem with intel cpus is the silicone adhesive gap, because of that im considering to either float it or place it back using a super glue soluble in acertone in the corners, so i can maintain basically almost zero extra height.
> 
> Also i believe probably any quality paste could hold on, but it seen as majority says, they worn out pretty fast, so at least clu remains more stable.
> 
> My current thermals are so bizarre that i think i can get better with it. Currently, im getting a top difference of 14C between core 0 and 3, with stock sealed paste.


That's strange. My core temps are within 1-2 degrees of eachother, but I can only reach 4.7ghz on a ridiculous custom loop.

Your CPU might be an extraordinary overclocker once you delid.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> The decision to use a h110 was that i didnt wanted to deal anymore with giant coolers. My options were either a big corsair or a big noctua, so a choose the former. Im tired of having to deal with memory heights, weight, unmount to transfer these things.
> 
> I dont expect miracles even because im not running a custom loop, my target is to reduce at least 10C, which seem very feasible.
> I know that the major problem with intel cpus is the silicone adhesive gap, because of that im considering to either float it or place it back using a super glue soluble in acertone in the corners, so i can maintain basically almost zero extra height.
> 
> Also i believe probably any quality paste could hold on, but it seen as majority says, they worn out pretty fast, so at least clu remains more stable.
> 
> My current thermals are so bizarre that i think i can get better with it. Currently, im getting a top difference of 14C between core 0 and 3, with stock sealed paste.


Yea makes sense, i went from a nh-u14s (not even a huge cooler) to a custom loop and my temps honestly didn't drop much. At 1.088v before on air it was running at 54°C and now at 1.21v running it naked it peaks at 46-48°C depending on the ambient temp in winter here. But the reason i went custom loop is for GPU temps and sound. Gpu went from 74°C to today it barely peaked at 40°C and the noise is slightly less then what i was running my card at 60% but i also have one rad on push/pull (6 fans right there) another rad with 2 fans, 3 intake fans and 1 rear exhaust and its still quieter then the Sapphire Nitro was at 60% haha.

I think in this thread alone between all the posters/users we've tried every paste and maybe 1-2 actually last on bare die, everything else just fails because of either the pressure or the heat or both.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea makes sense, i went from a nh-u14s (not even a huge cooler) to a custom loop and my temps honestly didn't drop much. At 1.088v before on air it was running at 54°C and now at 1.21v running it naked it peaks at 46-48°C depending on the ambient temp in winter here. But the reason i went custom loop is for GPU temps and sound. Gpu went from 74°C to today it barely peaked at 40°C and the noise is slightly less then what i was running my card at 60% but i also have one rad on push/pull (6 fans right there) another rad with 2 fans, 3 intake fans and 1 rear exhaust and its still quieter then the Sapphire Nitro was at 60% haha.
> 
> I think in this thread alone between all the posters/users we've tried every paste and maybe 1-2 actually last on bare die, everything else just fails because of either the pressure or the heat or both.


If I had to make a guess I think it's the extreme temperatures shift in a small area that make common pastes dry.
Intel Tim isn't the best but it's engineered to remain stable for life chip. If at least Intel don't used that ton of black glue...


----------



## postem

Question: what you think about rockit suggestion to use superglue? Should I try first with float method first?


----------



## zorvalth

Ok, I decided to delid my old 4790k and apply Grizzly Conductonaut liquid metal. I did it and installed the cpu back. But just to be sure its all working i didnt place metal between the IHS and the cooler(Noctua U14s). And as you can see the temps are 16-19c lower. I really didnt expect that without applying metal under the cooler too. As far as I new, its not worthy replacing the thermal paste under the IHS unless you put some metal over it too. I didnt even used my best paste (grizzly kryonaut), i used arctic silver 5(as i said i wanted to be sure the cpu is fine after deliding it and placing metal under the IHS).

The temps are recorded after 10 mins of heating up the cpu, then resetting the sensors and then 10 mins of reading them. Ambient after the deliding is around 1c lower. For stresing cpu i used prime on this settings:

So is it worth putting liquid between IHS and the cooler? Did somebody test the diff?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *zorvalth*
> 
> Ok, I decided to delid my old 4790k and apply Grizzly Conductonaut liquid metal. I did it and installed the cpu back. But just to be sure its all working i didnt place metal between the IHS and the cooler(Noctua U14s). And as you can see the temps are 16-19c lower. I really didnt expect that without applying metal under the cooler too. As far as I new, its not worthy replacing the thermal paste under the IHS unless you put some metal over it too. I didnt even used my best paste (grizzly kryonaut), i used arctic silver 5(as i said i wanted to be sure the cpu is fine after deliding it and placing metal under the IHS).
> 
> The temps are recorded after 10 mins of heating up the cpu, then resetting the sensors and then 10 mins of reading them. Ambient after the deliding is around 1c lower. For stresing cpu i used prime on this settings:
> 
> So is it worth putting liquid between IHS and the cooler? Did somebody test the diff?


It's been tested, though I can't remember the exact results, it's very close. Most people only use it on the die (myself included) because it just isn't worth getting a couple degrees from putting it on top of the IHS


----------



## madweazl

Applied the CLU this morning but it didnt have a positive affect (up about 5° from the NTH1 if I had the side panels on). Perhaps it wasnt applied thick enough (brushed it on the die and IHS). I needed to drain, flush, and add the PrimoChill dye to the system anyways so it wasnt all for not.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!





__
https://flic.kr/p/RcJWeG






Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!





__
https://flic.kr/p/Rfv7P8


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> Applied the CLU this morning but it didnt have a positive affect (up about 5° from the NTH1 if I had the side panels on). Perhaps it wasnt applied thick enough (brushed it on the die and IHS). I needed to drain, flush, and add the PrimoChill dye to the system anyways so it wasnt all for not.


What ambient temps? Considering its hammering AVX temps are not that bad.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> What ambient temps? Considering its hammering AVX temps are not that bad.


21.5°, same as when the NTH1 results were captured (my saltwater reef tank is in this room so everything remains very constant.


----------



## madmeatballs

Has anyone here tried both CLU and Conductonaut? Which one is better?


----------



## ParanoidZoid

I have used to have three 7700k CPUs (sold two, kept the best OC'ing one) all of which I delidded once with CLU and another time with Conductonaut. Conductonaut would give me anywhere between 1-3C better temps than CLU. However, CLU was way easier to apply than Conductonaut.


----------



## madmeatballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ParanoidZoid*
> 
> I have used to have three 7700k CPUs (sold two, kept the best OC'ing one) all of which I delidded once with CLU and another time with Conductonaut. Conductonaut would give me anywhere between 1-3C better temps than CLU. However, CLU was way easier to apply than Conductonaut.


Why was the conductonaut harder to apply? I've read somewhere that its more water-y?


----------



## ParanoidZoid

At least for me, the watery-ness made it really hard to get it to stick to the die or heatspreader. Next time I used it I put tape around the die and the position of the die on the heatspreader. Made applying it 10x easier since I didn't have to be so restricted in my brushing movements.


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ParanoidZoid*
> 
> At least for me, the watery-ness made it really hard to get it to stick to the die or heatspreader. Next time I used it I put tape around the die and the position of the die on the heatspreader. Made applying it 10x easier since I didn't have to be so restricted in my brushing movements.


This is not the watery mess, this happens if you don´t clean the surface enaugh, then the lm will not stick. I am doing this every day and using different lm and they stick all on the same way but you need to clean the surface very carefull. if you clean with acetone or something like that that you will leave residue on the surface and have the problems you are telling from.


----------



## ParanoidZoid

I clean with 99.9% alcohol and remove the silicone IHS glue manually using my fingernails (no Acetone or Adhesive removal compounds). I probably just have a weird batch. I found that CLU was easier to apply as it stuck better than Conductonaut for me, but Conductonaut performed marginally better. Either way, I don't think I messed any of the three delids up by not cleaning well enough since I can maintain a temperature of 70C even under 1.37v with those 7700ks on a 240mm radiator.


----------



## khemist

My rockit tool shipped on Thursday, i'll post my results on my 7700k when delidded.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Looks like a new Delid/Relid-tool is coming around from Der8auer
https://www.guru3d.com/news-story/der8auer-delid-die-mate-2-released.html



sorry the image is so small, hopefully the tool is full sized


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> Looks like a new Delid/Relid-tool is coming around from Der8auer
> https://www.guru3d.com/news-story/der8auer-delid-die-mate-2-released.html
> 
> 
> 
> sorry the image is so small, hopefully the tool is full sized


I can already see the disasters coming with this tool haha. Let me guess the price on this one, 150€?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I can already see the disasters coming with this tool haha. Let me guess the price on this one, 150€?


other way actually, 30. But yeah, we'll see. Doubt I'll ever get any tool but I might if I switch to kaby


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ParanoidZoid*
> 
> I clean with 99.9% alcohol and remove the silicone IHS glue manually using my fingernails (no Acetone or Adhesive removal compounds). I probably just have a weird batch. I found that CLU was easier to apply as it stuck better than Conductonaut for me, but Conductonaut performed marginally better. Either way, I don't think I messed any of the three delids up by not cleaning well enough since I can maintain a temperature of 70C even under 1.37v with those 7700ks on a 240mm radiator.


All the delids i do (lost count over the years haha) i use an old credit card cut up in half. The sharp corners make it SO much easier to remove the silicon from the corners and from the IHS and wafer itself. Makes it SO easy and leaves such a smooth finish.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> other way actually, 30. But yeah, we'll see. Doubt I'll ever get any tool but I might if I switch to kaby


Ill believe that price when i see it haha. On the other hand the comments in that article are hilarious, people STILL believe that the TIM is the main issue of high thermal temperatures its the funniest thing ive ever seen. People also think putting the IHS back on without any silicon is going to crack the die/wafer. People have no idea how strong the wafer really is do they.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ill believe that price when i see it haha. On the other hand the comments in that article are hilarious, people STILL believe that the TIM is the main issue of high thermal temperatures its the funniest thing ive ever seen. People also think putting the IHS back on without any silicon is going to crack the die/wafer. People have no idea how strong the wafer really is do they.


people are very odd about delidding. On LTT I see tons of people delidding and using regular TIM and then trying to defend the decision when told it wont last... I'll tell people once, but I'm not going to sit there and try and convince them of the reality we've all experienced. Another fella is convinced that going naked on skylake won't be any issue at all and I'm making things up when I say that the socket is higher than the die







oh well, what're you going to do other than link them to users having the same experience on this thread


----------



## khemist

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/der8auer-delid-die-mate-2-hs-003-dr.html

£26 on OCUK.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> This is not the watery mess, this happens if you don´t clean the surface enaugh, then the lm will not stick. I am doing this every day and using different lm and they stick all on the same way but you need to clear the surface very carefull. if you clean with acetone or something like that that you will leave residue on the surface and have the problems you are telling from.


I'll agree with this statement after using CLU for the first time yesterday. I prepped the surface per the instructions and it painted on without issue.


----------



## postem

Hi dear folks, here just to inform you of another successful delid.
I delided with rockit tool, CLU on IHS, gelid on top.
Turned on temps reaching 89c when I remember that I didn't turned the pump. Anyway before, 5ghz 1.33v cinebench reaching 80c. After delid 60c.
Before I got 14c between cores now max difference is 4c.

Man there is a lot of difference after deliding kaby lake. When I cracked it I saw how poor the Tim was and the gap was perceptible.

So a max of 20c on hottest test. It's the difference that allow me to pursuit 5.1 or to run silent cooling.

Thanks for all the help


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Hi dear folks, here just to inform you of another successful delid.
> I delided with rockit tool, CLU on IHS, gelid on top.
> Turned on temps reaching 89c when I remember that I didn't turned the pump. Anyway before, 5ghz 1.33v cinebench reaching 80c. After delid 60c.
> Before I got 14c between cores now max difference is 4c.
> 
> Man there is a lot of difference after deliding kaby lake. When I cracked it I saw how poor the Tim was and the gap was perceptible.
> 
> So a max of 20c on hottest test. It's the difference that allow me to pursuit 5.1 or to run silent cooling.
> 
> Thanks for all the help


The spread of the TIM actually looks perfect, but if you notice the REAL issue, look how thick the TIM is compared to if you put TIM on the IHS and then mount a cooler on it. On the IHS it spreads unbelievably thin and it works as it should. Because of the thick glue the TIM ends up being thick and therefore cannot function properly. No gap+less tim=very high thermal efficiency.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The spread of the TIM actually looks perfect, but if you notice the REAL issue, look how thick the TIM is compared to if you put TIM on the IHS and then mount a cooler on it. On the IHS it spreads unbelievably thin and it works as it should. Because of the thick glue the TIM ends up being thick and therefore cannot function properly. No gap+less tim=very high thermal efficiency.


I didn't put any silicone back. Didn't wanted the risk of further gap.

If you zoom in there seen to be a small area on the center of die that looks like paste is thinner.

Nevertheless very happy now will monitor if situation remain stable.


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ParanoidZoid*
> 
> I clean with 99.9% alcohol and remove the silicone IHS glue manually using my fingernails (no Acetone or Adhesive removal compounds). I probably just have a weird batch. I found that CLU was easier to apply as it stuck better than Conductonaut for me, but Conductonaut performed marginally better. Either way, I don't think I messed any of the three delids up by not cleaning well enough since I can maintain a temperature of 70C even under 1.37v with those 7700ks on a 240mm radiator.


Maybe it is your lm as you mentioned. 99.9% isop. alc is very good, but if you use arctic clean instead it would be perfect. I know nothing better than this stuff to prepare the surface. the die is not the problem, there the lm sticks most of the time without any problems, but the nickel plated ihs is the thing that makes me cry the first few times.


----------



## brenopapito

I'll delid with rockit cool tool, to re-lid, should I use super glue or silicon glue? Which one is the best thermal option?


----------



## madmeatballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Maybe it is your lm as you mentioned. 99.9% isop. alc is very good, but if you use arctic clean instead it would be perfect. I know nothing better than this stuff to prepare the surface. the die is not the problem, there the lm sticks most of the time without any problems, but the nickel plated ihs is the thing that makes me cry the first few times.


What is that stick you are using to spread the TIM. I use the paintbrush looking tool that came with my CLU. I also use 70% ispo as I cannot find 99% or arctic clean anywhere where I live. 99% is really hard to come by here they probably sell it by barrels only or gallons b2b only.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brenopapito*
> 
> I'll delid with rockit cool tool, to re-lid, should I use super glue or silicon glue? Which one is the best thermal option?


I re lided with the glue rockit suggests. The glue is actually very weak and can be removed with the own delid kit.
The good part of it is that it doesnt add height to the IHS.

With the glue i got -20C on max temperatures.


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> What is that stick you are using to spread the TIM. I use the paintbrush looking tool that came with my CLU. I also use 70% ispo as I cannot find 99% or arctic clean anywhere where I live. 99% is really hard to come by here they probably sell it by barrels only or gallons b2b only.


Here in germany we call it Q-Tip.. That is a stick with cotton on both ends to clear the inside of the ear, you know them? Just cut in half and then you have a perfect stick for application. I don´t like the brush.

70% Isopropyl alc is not really good, it does not clean very well. Where are you from that you can´t get the stuff? Here in germany we can buy it in the pharmacy 24/7. Not very cheap 6€/l but you can get it.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Here in germany we call it Q-Tip.. That is a stick with cotton on both ends to clear the inside of the ear, you know them? Just cut in half and then you have a perfect stick for application. I don´t like the brush.
> 
> 70% Isopropyl alc is not really good, it does not clean very well. Where are you from that you can´t get the stuff? Here in germany we can buy it in the pharmacy 24/7. Not very cheap 6€/l but you can get it.


I tried the paper with 70℅ isopropyl that came with CLU it's horrible it leaves water. Throwed it out and used 99℅ isopropyl, electronic store paid 6$ for half a liter.


----------



## madmeatballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Here in germany we call it Q-Tip.. That is a stick with cotton on both ends to clear the inside of the ear, you know them? Just cut in half and then you have a perfect stick for application. I don´t like the brush.
> 
> 70% Isopropyl alc is not really good, it does not clean very well. Where are you from that you can´t get the stuff? Here in germany we can buy it in the pharmacy 24/7. Not very cheap 6€/l but you can get it.


Oh yea, q-tips, we call them cotton buds here







is the q-tip's stick plastic? There are two kinds here one with straw like plastic and one with like what they use on toilet paper rolls. Nice tip anyway! Yea I hate the brush too. Well, I'm from the Philippines, I've been looking for 99% isopropyl and can't really find them. I can find the online locally but damn minimum order of 10 drums, they sell it for industrial use only.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> Oh yea, q-tips, we call them cotton buds here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is the q-tip's stick plastic? There are two kinds here one with straw like plastic and one with like what they use on toilet paper rolls. Nice tip anyway! Yea I hate the brush too. Well, I'm from the Philippines, I've been looking for 99% isopropyl and can't really find them. I can find the online locally but damn minimum order of 10 drums, they sell it for industrial use only.


You have some electronics store or a electronic district on your city? Retails that sell things like resistors, capacitors, diodes, etc they usually have in stock.


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> Oh yea, q-tips, we call them cotton buds here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> is the q-tip's stick plastic? There are two kinds here one with straw like plastic and one with like what they use on toilet paper rolls. Nice tip anyway! Yea I hate the brush too. Well, I'm from the Philippines, I've been looking for 99% isopropyl and can't really find them. I can find the online locally but damn minimum order of 10 drums, they sell it for industrial use only.


Yes, it´s the qtips plastik stick, just cut in half and cleaned with isopropanol after touching.

Here you can see why superglue is not recommended to use on the cpu, it´s a damaged 3770k.


----------



## Radmanhs

just took a look at this thread and notice the rockit cool tool. Is that the one that a lot of people go with? Or just brand new?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Radmanhs*
> 
> just took a look at this thread and notice the rockit cool tool. Is that the one that a lot of people go with? Or just brand new?


Seems like its the one most people go with.

And yes i would def not use superglue on a cpu. Honestly just put the IHS back on the cpu and put the retention bracket back down and its fine. I dont know why people tell you to re-silicon skylake/kabylake or why people are saying the pressure would break the wafer.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Seems like its the one most people go with.
> 
> And yes i would def not use superglue on a cpu. Honestly just put the IHS back on the cpu and put the retention bracket back down and its fine. I dont know why people tell you to re-silicon skylake/kabylake or why people are saying the pressure would break the wafer.


I put small dabs of glue on the 4 corners and my 7700k has been running just fine for the past week.


----------



## HowYesNo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Yes, it´s the qtips plastik stick, just cut in half and cleaned with isopropanol after touching.
> 
> Here you can see why superglue is not recommended to use on the cpu, it´s a damaged 3770k.


what superglue did u use? rockitcool store has super glue gel
http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/loctite-super-glue-gel-control
and in this video it is used on corners only.


----------



## StullenAndi

The picture is not from me so I don´t know what superglue he used. I would never use superglue. Here is the youtube link to this cpu.






If I delidd a cpu and reglue the spreader it looks like from factory and I never produced a mess like on the picture before.


----------



## madmeatballs

LOL if you watch the video he used a glue named "Krazy glue"


----------



## StullenAndi

A frend of me told me it´s a common glue in the united states?! now we know that krazy glue produces a crazy mess









now I understood what he say´s, he usesd not enaugh lm and tried to relidd the cpu with the superglued spreader. seems a very strong glue, he rips the first layer partly off.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> A frend of me told me it´s a common glue in the united states?! now we know that krazy glue produces a crazy mess
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> now I understood what he say´s, he usesd not enaugh lm and tried to relidd the cpu with the superglued spreader. seems a very strong glue, he rips the first layer partly off.


Rockit uses a gel glue and not a liquid glue. Also he mentions you can remove the gel glue with acetone very easily and not damage the pcb board.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> The picture is not from me so I don´t know what superglue he used. I would never use superglue. Here is the youtube link to this cpu.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I delidd a cpu and reglue the spreader it looks like from factory and I never produced a mess like on the picture before.


That still looks like it has a ridiculous gap in between. My guess is this is a non delided cpu. If its reglued i def wont do that to my kaby lake.


----------



## Lake75

Found some 1/4" thick acrylic sheets in the basement and spent ~2 hours making a delidder myself. It doesn't look that good, but put it on a vise and it did the job.







Applied CLU on both the silicon and the cooler. Before delidding, my i7-7700K hit 99C at 4.9GHz 1.330V even with Corsair H100i v2 AIO. Now I'm looking at 68C under load--that's a decrease of 31C! Sweet.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Rockit uses a gel glue and not a liquid glue. Also he mentions you can remove the gel glue with acetone very easily and not damage the pcb board.


Acetone also removes cyanoacrylate (Krazy glue) so it could also be a "super glue."


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lake75*
> 
> Found some 1/4" thick acrylic sheets in the basement and spent ~2 hours making a delidder myself. It doesn't look that good, but put it on a vise and it did the job.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Applied CLU on both the silicon and the cooler. Before delidding, my i7-7700K hit 99C at 4.9GHz 1.330V even with Corsair H100i v2 AIO. Now I'm looking at 68C under load--that's a decrease of 31C! Sweet.


Damn what a sick temp drop, goes to show you that every single CPU is completely different. High voltage and hyperthreading=high temps. Good work though, ist either 7700k for me next or ryzen not sure yet.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Lake75*
> 
> Found some 1/4" thick acrylic sheets in the basement and spent ~2 hours making a delidder myself. It doesn't look that good, but put it on a vise and it did the job.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Applied CLU on both the silicon and the cooler. Before delidding, my i7-7700K hit 99C at 4.9GHz 1.330V even with Corsair H100i v2 AIO. Now I'm looking at 68C under load--that's a decrease of 31C! Sweet.


That's a fantastic improvement... but I'm having problem concentrating on anything other than the adorable kitten avatar, so maybe after watching it for another 10 minutes or so I can again think about that near 30% decrease in load temps.


----------



## StullenAndi

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> That still looks like it has a ridiculous gap in between. My guess is this is a non delided cpu. If its reglued i def wont do that to my kaby lake.


Nope, both CPUs are delidded. The glue is black silicone and that´s what you see there, no gap. All the CPUs I am relidding have best possible temps.

I just apply the right ammount glue evenly so that it looks like before.


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Nope, both CPUs are delidded. The glue is black silicone and that´s what you see there, no gap. All the CPUs I am relidding have best possible temps.
> 
> I just apply the right ammount glue evenly so that it looks like before.


What are you using to cover the 4 pads next to the die with ?


----------



## StullenAndi

It´s Kapton Tape


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> It´s Kapton Tape


Do you put the Kapton tape on just when applying CLU incase it goes on the pads, or do you leave it there permanently ?


----------



## StullenAndi

I leave it there permanently.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Rockit uses a gel glue and not a liquid glue. Also he mentions you can remove the gel glue with acetone very easily and not damage the pcb board.


I used the gel glue it's acetone soluble it's cyanoacrylate.
Also it's no mean to replace silicone you just use a dot on corners. It's also easy to remove on pressure.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> What are you using to cover the 4 pads next to the die with ?


I just used simply nail polish. It's just to protect it will not heat enough.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> people are very odd about delidding. On LTT I see tons of people delidding and using regular TIM and then trying to defend the decision when told it wont last... I'll tell people once, but I'm not going to sit there and try and convince them of the reality we've all experienced. Another fella is convinced that going naked on skylake won't be any issue at all and I'm making things up when I say that the socket is higher than the die
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> oh well, what're you going to do other than link them to users having the same experience on this thread


Even if you do remove the retention lockt and use a custom, the risk of applying uneven pressure on bare mount and cracking the die is unworthy.

Using the IHS even unglued is okay it will distribute the load even.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Even if you do remove the retention lockt and use a custom, the risk of applying uneven pressure on bare mount and cracking the die is unworthy.
> 
> Using the IHS even unglued is okay it will distribute the load even.


I wonder if thats really true though. I'm sure people who have done it wrong have had issues but im sure if done right theres no problems. The IHS on skylake/kabylake is even thicker then haswell i could see temps dropping quite a bit more.

I have yet to try it as i don't want to risk on a customer build and my next upgrade might be ryzen. If its kaby it should be plenty easy to test using pressure paper. On haswell there is more pressure on the cpu socket then on the die itself so its 100% safe (at least with an ekwb, you would need to test with a different waterblock). My guess is, if done CORRECTLY on skylake/kabylake you should have no problems at all. Youd be surprised how little of pressure you need for the CLU to work and for it to post.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I wonder if thats really true though. I'm sure people who have done it wrong have had issues but im sure if done right theres no problems. The IHS on skylake/kabylake is even thicker then haswell i could see temps dropping quite a bit more.
> 
> I have yet to try it as i don't want to risk on a customer build and my next upgrade might be ryzen. If its kaby it should be plenty easy to test using pressure paper. On haswell there is more pressure on the cpu socket then on the die itself so its 100% safe (at least with an ekwb, you would need to test with a different waterblock). My guess is, if done CORRECTLY on skylake/kabylake you should have no problems at all. Youd be surprised how little of pressure you need for the CLU to work and for it to post.


Actually you don't need pressure at all if you manage to make contact between block and die to transfer temperature.

The ticker IHS I still don't get why. It don't seem to be pressure related.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Actually you don't need pressure at all if you manage to make contact between block and die to transfer temperature.
> 
> The ticker IHS I still don't get why. It don't seem to be pressure related.


Yea exactly so idk why people are so worried about it bending/breaking. That just happened with skylake with coolers that had inferior mounting hardware/solutions. Mine barely has any pressure and i dropped 7°C from going delided to bare die, was worth it for the 5€ it cost me for the screws.

The thicker IHS is because the wafer is thinner, therefore sits lower in the socket, if they kept the IHS the same thickness as haswell would not contact the cooler properly so they went thicker.


----------



## eXistencelies

What if one used copper shims with CLU instead of the IHS cover when putting waterblock/air cooler back on?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> What if one used copper shims with CLU instead of the IHS cover when putting waterblock/air cooler back on?


Pointless, would have no retention mechanism to hold it in would slide around during installation. Defeats the purpose of going bare die. I do think they could have made it thinner but it is what it is. I have to investigate this further the whole sky/kaby breaking/bending if going bare die.


----------



## HowYesNo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> What are you using to cover the 4 pads next to the die with ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> It´s Kapton Tape


what is Kapton tape. I don't see it on photo? u mean something to protect surroundings of the die when applying CLU?


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> what is Kapton tape. I don't see it on photo? u mean something to protect surroundings of the die when applying CLU?


If you look at the picture of the cpu die, you will see 4 small circles(pads) to the bottom left of the die, that has a square around it. That square is a piece of Kapton Tape covering them.

https://www.kaptontape.com/1_Mil_Kapton_Tapes.php


----------



## HowYesNo

u mean this?? thats to prevent short circuit as CLU is conductive right?


----------



## StullenAndi

Exactly, it´s just to prevent a short circuit. Never happened but better safe than sorry.


----------



## StullenAndi

Another 4790k just finished.


----------



## HowYesNo

you use black silicone to glue IHS back. someting like this http://www.ebay.com/itm/351197981882?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
and there is no gap right??


----------



## StullenAndi

I am using this one from UHU https://www.amazon.de/UHU-Hochtemperatur-Silikon-schwarz-46735/dp/B008YE3ABA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1485532569&sr=8-1&keywords=uhu+hochtemperatur+silikon

There is no gap if you apply a little amount of the silicone to the spreader.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Another 4790k just finished.


Seems like a lot of CLU you have on there.


----------



## StullenAndi

Maybe it seems, but it´s the right amount. Less will get higher temps and more brings no better temps.

It´s the angle you are looking at, LM is never looking the same on my pictures as what I have in front of me.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Maybe it seems, but it´s the right amount. Less will get higher temps and more brings no better temps.
> 
> It´s the angle you are looking at, LM is never looking the same on my pictures as what I have in front of me.


I dont think I used enough when I did mine as the temps were actually a few degrees higher than with NTH1. If it wasnt such a pain to remove the monoblock I'd redo it but it's will have to wait until I replumb some things now. I used the included brush and painted it on the IHS and die just thick enough to cover the surface.


----------



## StullenAndi

Did you clean all the glue from pcb and ihs? And what LM are you using? The Coollaboraty stuff is not as good as the Grizzly Conductonaut or Phobya LM.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Did you clean all the glue from pcb and ihs? And what LM are you using? The Coollaboraty stuff is not as good as the Grizzly Conductonaut or Phobya LM.


I did clean all the sealant off and I used CLU. I'll order one of the above and replace it next time I have everything torn apart.


----------



## StullenAndi

You can try to apply a small amount on the die and on the ihs instead of only apply to the die. The LM does not stick very well to the nickel plated ihs.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> You can try to apply a small amount on the die and on the ihs instead of only apply to the die. The LM does not stick very well to the nickel plated ihs.


I'll just apply it to the die until it forms a meniscus next time.


----------



## Morenomdz

So......

I ****ed up.

While doing the delid of my own 6600k I got distracted and the piece of wood I was using slipped thro the smds. It broke off five big caps, one or two small ones and a small layer.

Well, I work with soldering for living so I did my best to solder the big caps back, the small ones I said f it, not sure what these filter there.

All I can say is the cpu is working, and I will keep it that way.

Dont do what I did.


----------



## madweazl

Ouch, that sucks. Think I'm actually glad I used a razor instead.


----------



## Morenomdz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> Ouch, that sucks. Think I'm actually glad I used a razor instead.


Not sure but you may have easier results by heating up the glue with a hot hand before doing it.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Morenomdz*
> 
> Not sure but you may have easier results by heating up the glue with a hot hand before doing it.


I didnt have any issues really. One corner was a bit tough but the rest was really easy.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> You can try to apply a small amount on the die and on the ihs instead of only apply to the die. The LM does not stick very well to the nickel plated ihs.


Yeah, CLU's inability to wet the nickel plating really surprised me. Nothing like what the videos showed. I ended up just putting a bunch on and gasketing the IHS with silicone.

P95v28.5 smallFFT and only hitting 75C with 25C liquid temperature so I guess it worked

Just waiting for the metal goop to squish out somewhere and ruin the whole thing







.


----------



## Morenomdz

Need some indications here, I am looking to buy a decent delid jig for skylake and kabylake, found out very few options on ebay only, most of these are 3d print tools. Could you fellas recomend me a place that ships overseas?

Thanks!


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Morenomdz*
> 
> Need some indications here, I am looking to buy a decent delid jig for skylake and kabylake, found out very few options on ebay only, most of these are 3d print tools. Could you fellas recomend me a place that ships overseas?
> 
> Thanks!


Overseas where lol, I'd go with either Rockitool or Der8auer's new delid die mate 2. I believe both ship overseas

http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/

https://www.caseking.de/der8auer-delid-die-mate-2-fsd8-019.html


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> I'll just apply it to the die until it forms a meniscus next time.


CLU works far better with very thin layer on both die and under ihs. scuff up the underside of ihs with the scrub pad thats included for cleaning/removal and clean with very high % isopropal alcohol or pure acetone and use a microfiber towel (no dryer heet) or paper,shop towel that has no oils or moisturizer. I've applied CLU at least 30 times (5 syringes worth) and did a lot of testing on water and Single stage phase and noticed that if not done right the clu will literally slide away meaning there will no longer be contact between the 2 surfaces. Not the example i had in mind but can even happen if applied to both as in pic. If happens when only applied to die, clu has tendancy to stay together so all of it will move, slide together

Pic shows what happens when under ihs not cleaned/prepped properly, temps were worse than stock and didnt happen on first run. Happened week later


----------



## Morenomdz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> Overseas where lol, I'd go with either Rockitool or Der8auer's new delid die mate 2. I believe both ship overseas
> 
> http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/
> 
> https://www.caseking.de/der8auer-delid-die-mate-2-fsd8-019.html


Brazil lol

Bought one, no more hammering my smds all over the place.

Tyvm


----------



## StullenAndi

Be carefull with the Rockit Tool if you want to delid a broadwell cpu.


----------



## Morenomdz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *StullenAndi*
> 
> Be carefull with the Rockit Tool if you want to delid a broadwell cpu.


In my case it is for sky and kabylake.


----------



## StullenAndi

No problem with them cause they have no smd parts on the pcb.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> CLU works far better with very thin layer on both die and under ihs. scuff up the underside of ihs with the scrub pad thats included for cleaning/removal and clean with very high % isopropal alcohol or pure acetone and use a microfiber towel (no dryer heet) or paper,shop towel that has no oils or moisturizer. I've applied CLU at least 30 times (5 syringes worth) and did a lot of testing on water and Single stage phase and noticed that if not done right the clu will literally slide away meaning there will no longer be contact between the 2 surfaces. Not the example i had in mind but can even happen if applied to both as in pic. If happens when only applied to die, clu has tendancy to stay together so all of it will move, slide together
> 
> Pic shows what happens when under ihs not cleaned/prepped properly, temps were worse than stock and didnt happen on first run. Happened week later
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


I applied the CLU to both sides when I switched over from the NTH1 but the results have been underwhelming leading me to believe I didnt have enough to make good contact. I did use the scuffing pad and the CLU stuck to both surface really well but something must not be right. We'll see whenever I tear it back down and change over to something else I guess.


----------



## thegreatjmlol

I saw some delidding tools on ebay, it looks not bad and a guy even posted a video of his tool. But it looks like it takes strong force to delid, is it normal? Is it a good tool in your guys mind?

Thanks, long time lurker but got a lot of help from the info in this forum


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> I applied the CLU to both sides when I switched over from the NTH1 but the results have been underwhelming leading me to believe I didnt have enough to make good contact. I did use the scuffing pad and the CLU stuck to both surface really well but something must not be right. We'll see whenever I tear it back down and change over to something else I guess.


Yea i dont see a point in scuffing up anything, CLU will stick no matter what. All scuffing does is make it so that the CLU has to fill in more gaps/scratches in the IHS. I dont see a point. If temps are underwhelming then apply a tiny bit more, people need to remember going from TIM to CLU on the die won't give you a 10°C temp difference lol, at MOST you'll see a couple degrees.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i dont see a point in scuffing up anything, CLU will stick no matter what. All scuffing does is make it so that the CLU has to fill in more gaps/scratches in the IHS. I dont see a point. If temps are underwhelming then apply a tiny bit more, people need to remember going from TIM to CLU on the die won't give you a 10°C temp difference lol, at MOST you'll see a couple degrees.


I wasnt expecting 10° but I wasnt expecting higher temps (roughly 5°) either.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madweazl*
> 
> I wasnt expecting 10° but I wasnt expecting higher temps (roughly 5°) either.


My guess would be too thin a layer, i added a bit more to mine and went from 51°C on the hottest core to about 46-47°C so you might be able to drop a few degrees with another thin application.

Problem is some will use more and some will use less, manufacturing tolerances means one IHS might be flatter then another, one IHS might have burs on the bottom therefore doesnt exactly sit flush. You can always sand down the edges on the bottom of the IHS slightly if youd like as well if it looks bured.


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i dont see a point in scuffing up anything, CLU will stick no matter what. All scuffing does is make it so that the CLU has to fill in more gaps/scratches in the IHS. I dont see a point. If temps are underwhelming then apply a tiny bit more, people need to remember going from TIM to CLU on the die won't give you a 10°C temp difference lol, at MOST you'll see a couple degrees.


Yeah, scuffing is more of a last resort. What I think is most important is both urfaces are truly squeeky clean and free of oils from fingers and wrong qtips/towels etc. esp those who use dryer sheets with microfiber towels


----------



## khemist

I've only used used CLU on my previous delids and it's all i have to use just now, is conductonaut any better?.

There doesn't seem to be any in stock in the UK apart from the 5g tubes.


----------



## vb10

My delidded 4770k died last week. Ran for a while at 4.2ghz @ 1.3v full load (WCG) for many months. First ran noctua paste between die and heat spreader, then switched to CLU for the last 7-8 months.

It wouldn't post, so first thing I did was try a different PSU, which upon hitting the power button, made the motherboard release the magical smoke. I then later tried the CPU in a different working system, it wouldn't post either.

Anyone hear of anything similar?


----------



## StullenAndi

did you reopen the lid? maybe some clu is dripped on the smd parts or did you cover them?


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Morenomdz*
> 
> Brazil lol
> 
> Bought one, no more hammering my smds all over the place.
> 
> Tyvm


Another Brazil bro? Purchased the rockit cool kit. Delivered in my home from local mail, couldnt believe thy didnt tax me. Paid a total sum of 225 BRL, including glue, relid tool and gelid.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i dont see a point in scuffing up anything, CLU will stick no matter what. All scuffing does is make it so that the CLU has to fill in more gaps/scratches in the IHS. I dont see a point. If temps are underwhelming then apply a tiny bit more, people need to remember going from TIM to CLU on the die won't give you a 10°C temp difference lol, at MOST you'll see a couple degrees.


I though it was common sense by now that the main reason to use CLU or any LM, beside few degrees less is that it remain stable, what dont happen to any paste on die.


----------



## 6u4rdi4n

My paste has remained stable, but that's on the IHS. I swear by paste, but even I would use a LM (liquid metal) on the die itself if I were to delid, which Im considering. Got an i7 7700K recently after upgrading from an i7 2600K.


----------



## vb10

I checked, there wasn't any excess CLU anywhere.


----------



## Morenomdz

You went for the whole package, I got just the delid jig to stay "safe" under the 50$ mark!


----------



## OldManCassius

Just got my first delid done after lurking around here for a long while. I can run it at 4.8ghz and 65c but the voltage is up there and the chip was still acting up on a few tests. It's solid at 4.7ghz and 1.43v which sits around 62c in IBT. Running a 212 cooler with crappy paste, but it's all I got for the moment.

OCN name: OldManCassius
CPU: i5-6600k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Generic Insignia crap
Mhz gained: 200
OC after delid: 4800mhz max, 4700mhz 24/7
Temp drops: 18c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/n5n7s2

i5-6600kdelid.jpg 869k .jpg file


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Morenomdz*
> 
> You went for the whole package, I got just the delid jig to stay "safe" under the 50$ mark!


yep i asked james to cut the invoice prices to do so.
A tube of gelid for 13$ is much cheaper than here. Damn i hate this government.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OldManCassius*
> 
> Just got my first delid done after lurking around here for a long while. I can run it at 4.8ghz and 65c but the voltage is up there and the chip was still acting up on a few tests. It's solid at 4.7ghz and 1.43v which sits around 62c in IBT. Running a 212 cooler with crappy paste, but it's all I got for the moment.
> 
> OCN name: OldManCassius
> CPU: i5-6600k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Generic Insignia crap
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4800mhz max, 4700mhz 24/7
> Temp drops: 18c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/n5n7s2
> 
> i5-6600kdelid.jpg 869k .jpg file


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









I put in the generic paste entry as well, gotta have humor some times


----------



## khemist

Anyone in the UK that has ordered the Rockit tool, how long did it take for delivery?.

Mine was posted on the 19th of this month and last i heard it was in UK on the 25th, i've heard nothing since.


----------



## madweazl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I put in the generic paste entry as well, gotta have humor some times


Pretty sure that is cooler than mine on water LOL.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OldManCassius*
> 
> Just got my first delid done after lurking around here for a long while. I can run it at 4.8ghz and 65c but the voltage is up there and the chip was still acting up on a few tests. It's solid at 4.7ghz and 1.43v which sits around 62c in IBT. Running a 212 cooler with crappy paste, but it's all I got for the moment.
> 
> OCN name: OldManCassius
> CPU: i5-6600k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Generic Insignia crap
> Mhz gained: 200
> OC after delid: 4800mhz max, 4700mhz 24/7
> Temp drops: 18c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/n5n7s2
> 
> i5-6600kdelid.jpg 869k .jpg file


IBT isn't too stressful its what i use its way more consistent with gaming temps then useless stress tests people use. I gotta say though, your ambient must be ridiculously cold for you to get temps like that with that voltage on air i mean thats insane.


----------



## peter2k

glad I made that pic, good for looking at it on my Desktop









7600K



doing 5.2 in RealBench


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



what I "settled" on








usin an AiO


before delidd on AIR

n after delidd, on AIR as well


----------



## OldManCassius

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> ... your ambient must be ridiculously cold for you to get temps like that with that voltage on air i mean thats insane.


TBH it's still about 72f/22c in my house but I am running push/pull on the 212 which may or may not help. What actually did seem to help was changing from my old case to an Air 740, both the CPU and the 1080 dropped about 5C max and are much quieter when gaming. Probably got pretty lucky with the chip too.


----------



## Ceadderman

lol









A case that's 100% fan grill. Now I see.









All things being equal, I'm neither bashing case or owner. Just not a fan of the AIR series because I hate dust.







lol

Although Bill Owens did a great job modding with one.









~Ceadder


----------



## StullenAndi

This is how it looks like if something went wrong. Got this cpu for delidding but it was delidded before


----------



## tiger style

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> Anyone in the UK that has ordered the Rockit tool, how long did it take for delivery?.
> 
> Mine was posted on the 19th of this month and last i heard it was in UK on the 25th, i've heard nothing since.


Mine disappeared too. The tracking said it had been collected which worried me. Got a slip through the door a few days later that it was being held at my local Royal Mail depot awaiting customs charges, I think around £13.


----------



## khemist

The cost is mounting then, i'll have a look tomorrow as I work for RM.


----------



## xGeNeSisx

Just received the updated version of the Enter Setup Breakfree delid tool v2. New design is really sleek and it feels sturdy. No need to tighten the 4 plastic bolts like the previous version. It's all integrated in new version. Going to experiment on a G4400 and maybe an Ivy Bridge before I delid my friends Haswell. Never delidded Haswell before but I'll need liquid electrical tape to put over the what is the FIVR if I'm not mistaken.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xGeNeSisx*
> 
> Just received the updated version of the Enter Setup Breakfree delid tool v2. New design is really sleek and it feels sturdy. No need to tighten the 4 plastic bolts like the previous version. It's all integrated in new version. Going to experiment on a G4400 and maybe an Ivy Bridge before I delid my friends Haswell. Never delidded Haswell before but I'll need liquid electrical tape to put over the what is the FIVR if I'm not mistaken.


Liquid tape, nail polish, even just electrical tape will do the trick. I saw the process of the tool and it looks fantastic, id try it out but no more CPUs to delid until i get either kaby or ryzen so no need yet. The design does look wicked cool though.


----------



## brenopapito

Is it a good idea to use CLU between the die/IHS and Kryonaut between IHS/cpu water block?


----------



## Ceadderman

lol







Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brenopapito*
> 
> Is it a good idea to use CLU between the die/IHS and Kryonaut between IHS/cpu water block?


Yup. good idea.









~Ceadder


----------



## spddmn24

Hows liquid ultra hold up between the ihs and a copper waterblock? I have enough left over to put there, but apparently it can dry out and bond to both surfaces?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *spddmn24*
> 
> Hows liquid ultra hold up between the ihs and a copper waterblock? I have enough left over to put there, but apparently it can dry out and bond to both surfaces?


Its pointless to put it ON the ihs, it works much better on the die itself. Between IHS and waterblock just use any TIM its not going to matter much.


----------



## Braxil

Sorry if this has been covered a million times, but 3000 pages in this thread is a lot to search through.

What is the point of re-gluing the IHS back on? Does it effect performance or it it more of a protective measure? Won't you have to remove it again later to re-apply CLU? It seems like an un nessisary risk to me. Specifically looking at delidding a 7700k and a 4690k.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Do you think its worth deliding a potato ? My 6700K needs 1.35v for an overnight x264 run @ 4600 and it wont do it @ 4.7 with 1.4v I quess delliding wont help that ? Temps are in the early 80s but thats because i run aircooler @ 50% fan speed wich is 700rpm for silence ( noctua C14S ) Got the 3D printed delid tool in hand and some CLU but not sure if its worth all the trouble if the silicon is a poor one.


----------



## madmeatballs

Is the die size and position of Skylake and Kaby Lake exactly the same?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Braxil*
> 
> Sorry if this has been covered a million times, but 3000 pages in this thread is a lot to search through.
> 
> What is the point of re-gluing the IHS back on? Does it effect performance or it it more of a protective measure? Won't you have to remove it again later to re-apply CLU? It seems like an un nessisary risk to me. Specifically looking at delidding a 7700k and a 4690k.


You can run without an IHS but you have to be careful when mounting the cooler on top

if you apply too much pressure you're damaging the DIE

that assumes that the cooler actually makes contact at all
all Coolers and they're mounting systems are expecting an IHS
most likely they will not make contact with the CPU die at all

everyone I have seen running "bare" have modified the mounting of the Coolers they used

as far as we know CLU does not need to be replaced

there are some who say it dried out and temps shot through the rough
but this refers to CLU between IHS and the cooler

there are some who looked under the IHS and everything was fine

however I have been hearing a lot of good things from other liquid metal pastes
the grizzly and Phobya one

my CLU on my "old" skylake was still fine when I put my kaby in, 1 year old or a bit more

but this time I used the one from Phobya


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> You can run without an IHS but you have to be careful when mounting the cooler on top
> 
> if you apply too much pressure you're damaging the DIE
> 
> that assumes that the cooler actually makes contact at all
> all Coolers and they're mounting systems are expecting an IHS
> most likely they will not make contact with the CPU die at all
> 
> everyone I have seen running "bare" have modified the mounting of the Coolers they used
> 
> as far as we know CLU does not need to be replaced
> 
> there are some who say it dried out and temps shot through the rough
> but this refers to CLU between IHS and the cooler
> 
> there are some who looked under the IHS and everything was fine
> 
> however I have been hearing a lot of good things from other liquid metal pastes
> the grizzly and Phobya one
> 
> my CLU on my "old" skylake was still fine when I put my kaby in, 1 year old or a bit more
> 
> but this time I used the one from Phobya


Really depends on the CPU. Haswell/Broadwell/Devils Canyon are FINE running bare die and it works great, for skylake and kaby (unfortunately) because the wafer is thinner it sits lower in the cpu socket, even with a bare die kit it sits on the socket without making contact on the die. The best way to make it work is to shave down the cpu socket slightly (by taking careful measurements with a digital/analog caliper) and shaving down the EXACT amount. Shouldn't even bend the wafer or anything if done correctly, most of the pressure is on the cpu socket instead of the die.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quick question for you guys...

Not sure if anyone has a quick reference or pictures of it... I've heard that CLP dries up more so than CLU or any other liquid metal... is that true or just something some people have said? Reason being is I have a new tube of CLP and I'm planning on using it on my new laptop... Just wondering since the heatsink will be bare copper directly on both dies...Wondering if anyone has had some bad experiences with CLP on bare copper and it drying up....?


----------



## skingun

You shouldn't apply liquid metal directly to copper because copper is porous. The liquid metal doesn't dry out per say, but it is absorbed by the copper over time.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skingun*
> 
> You shouldn't apply liquid metal directly to copper because copper is porous. The liquid metal doesn't dry out per say, but it is absorbed by the copper over time.


And so is every single gpu cooler in the world haha. Copper is also one of the best for heat transfer hence why its used (and cost), if clu is absorbed into the copper it will make it function even BETTER because once the thermal paste/ liquid metal is used there is no pores for heat to get trapped in.


----------



## khemist

Rockit tool has left customs at last!, should be delidded by the weekend.


----------



## skingun

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And so is every single gpu cooler in the world haha. Copper is also one of the best for heat transfer hence why its used (and cost), if clu is absorbed into the copper it will make it function even BETTER because once the thermal paste/ liquid metal is used there is no pores for heat to get trapped in.


True. But you will probably have to reapply it a couple of times depending on thickness of the copper. You won't have this issue with nickle plated copper because nickle is a much harder (less porous) metal.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Really depends on the CPU. Haswell/Broadwell/Devils Canyon are FINE running bare die and it works great, for skylake and kaby (unfortunately) because the wafer is thinner it sits lower in the cpu socket, even with a bare die kit it sits on the socket without making contact on the die. The best way to make it work is to shave down the cpu socket slightly (by taking careful measurements with a digital/analog caliper) and shaving down the EXACT amount. Shouldn't even bend the wafer or anything if done correctly, most of the pressure is on the cpu socket instead of the die.


Not saying it's not possible

but for someone new or who really doesn't want it better to put it back on

the difference temp wise is like 5-7 degrees from what I've usually seen

its not gonna turn a dud into a stellar overclocker
or even a golden CPU into higher regions of an OC

I've never broken an Athlon XP or Duron back in the day
but people who did where plenty

for me the aversion to running bare is simple

I'm using an AiO, there's additional weight on the DIE as well as a certain amount of pull from the hoses

in a custom loop with pipes there's way less force on the CPU that way


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> Quick question for you guys...
> 
> Not sure if anyone has a quick reference or pictures of it... I've heard that CLP dries up more so than CLU or any other liquid metal... is that true or just something some people have said? Reason being is I have a new tube of CLP and I'm planning on using it on my new laptop... Just wondering since the heatsink will be bare copper directly on both dies...Wondering if anyone has had some bad experiences with CLP on bare copper and it drying up....?


I'm really loving that liquid metal drying out over time argument

I'm not sure on pro vs ultra mind you
and I'm not sure most people are aware that there are actually 2 different from coollabority

but here look at the manual for PRO version
at the end of the second page

http://www.coollaboratory.com/pdf/manual_liquid_pro_englisch.pdf
Quote:


> At period about 48 hours after the application (depending on the thickness of the application) the applied liquid
> metal consolidates.


Quote:


> consolidate
> verb
> 
> make (something) physically stronger or more solid.


It doesn't dry out
it gets solid on purpose, at least the pro is supposed to

reason from manual:
Quote:


> hereby the already really good heat conduction changes for the better continuing, as also
> 
> the safety of use.


btw
I'm using a different brand
Phobya LM

but I had my ultra from coollabority on my skylake for over a year and it was still liquid when I popped in a kaby

though staining is normal


----------



## xGeNeSisx

Delidded an old Ivy 3570k in seconds with the new Breakfree delid tool,havent had the chance to boot it up yet. Was debating whether delidding a G4400 would yield even better overclock potential. Already on 4.4ghz on the intel stock cooler (family pc), but I never want to touch an intel stock cooler again and remove it. Don't really care about clocking it higher, it's just another chip to practice on.

Delidded i5-6400 and i7-6700K are both still running great. Gotta test this new 3570k


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> Anyone in the UK that has ordered the Rockit tool, how long did it take for delivery?.
> 
> Mine was posted on the 19th of this month and last i heard it was in UK on the 25th, i've heard nothing since.


I got one in brazil in 3 weeks even with horrible brazilian customs.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> It doesn't dry out
> it gets solid on purpose, at least the pro is supposed to


One of the reasons i dont think its suitable for laptops. As laptops are made to be on moving, when the CLP bounds and solidify, movement and shocks can make micro ruptures on the bound that make the LM dont work as expected.

Anyway, laptops are almost all thermally capped and overclock limited. Ya you can run cooler, but it isnt tha much of an issue, when the frequency usually is so crap, core count is reduced, etc.
As long as you keep the fins clean there isnt much performance wise that you can do. I never see a Mobile K processor.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> however I have been hearing a lot of good things from other liquid metal pastes
> the grizzly and Phobya one


I dont have the tools to confirm, but basically all liquid metal "pastes" seen to be just basically galium + indium + zinc or other metals alloy, in diferent proportions depending on manufacturer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galinstan
Galinstain is a alloy that is liquid at room temp.


----------



## gosa

Hi all,

New to the forum - at least as a registered user - have been visiting as a lurker on and off for quite some time now.

Anyway - apologies if this have been up before, but 3000+ pages are... 3000+ pages.. Also - please bare with me - I tend to write a lot, but I promise - a question will come.

My question/problem is a bit different than the majority of the posts here as I'm not actually looking to overclock - not this time anyway::

I got my hands on a 4790 (non-k) last week.
I have a small case where max cooler height is 52mm that is looking for a CPU
I have a Noctua NH-L9I - recomendations are against using it with a CPU with a TDP as high as the 4790

So I put all the pieces together knowing that heat would probably be a problem.

Intel burn test returned 80+ (Celsius) temps which is to high for my liking - I knew it would happen, but still...

My first thought - after having decent amount of success undervolting my i5 3570k (while still overclocking it slightly) was to do the same with the 4790, and while that does lower the temps quite nicely I'm having problems with stability.

So - next thought was delidding, and here is my question:

Can delidding the 4790 compensate for the fact that the cooler I have isn't exactly rated for the CPU I'm combining it with?

I know that the delid itself reduces temps quite a lot having done it with the same 3570k that I'm also undervolting - but that is on the other hand with good cooling. Can it help me in this build, or do I need to move it all to a case with more space? I'm fully aware of the fact that the heat needs to go somewhere - delidded or not, I can't just work out if I will get anywhere with the setup I currently have...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gosa*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> New to the forum - at least as a registered user - have been visiting as a lurker on and off for quite some time now.
> 
> Anyway - apologies if this have been up before, but 3000+ pages are... 3000+ pages.. Also - please bare with me - I tend to write a lot, but I promise - a question will come.
> 
> My question/problem is a bit different than the majority of the posts here as I'm not actually looking to overclock - not this time anyway::
> 
> I got my hands on a 4790 (non-k) last week.
> I have a small case where max cooler height is 52mm that is looking for a CPU
> I have a Noctua NH-L9I - recomendations are against using it with a CPU with a TDP as high as the 4790
> 
> So I put all the pieces together knowing that heat would probably be a problem.
> 
> Intel burn test returned 80+ (Celsius) temps which is to high for my liking - I knew it would happen, but still...
> 
> My first thought - after having decent amount of success undervolting my i5 3570k (while still overclocking it slightly) was to do the same with the 4790, and while that does lower the temps quite nicely I'm having problems with stability.
> 
> So - next thought was delidding, and here is my question:
> 
> Can delidding the 4790 compensate for the fact that the cooler I have isn't exactly rated for the CPU I'm combining it with?
> 
> I know that the delid itself reduces temps quite a lot having done it with the same 3570k that I'm also undervolting - but that is on the other hand with good cooling. Can it help me in this build, or do I need to move it all to a case with more space? I'm fully aware of the fact that the heat needs to go somewhere - delidded or not, I can't just work out if I will get anywhere with the setup I currently have...


Its not that deliding nets you better temps, its that it helps heat transfer better by reducing/eliminating the gap between the die and IHS. The better the heat transfer the less heat is randomly lost and the better the temps.

This might help you as well. http://noctua.at/en/nh_l9i_tdp_guidelines

In essence you can delid and youll see temp drops, unfortunately your temps might still stay high depending on how good the airflow is in your small case. Ive done it to a 3350p (uses a bit bigger cooler master cooler then the tiny junk intel uses now) and i did see some temp drops on a 35w tdp cpu, not much temp drops but it def made a difference. And thats without using CLU just used hydronaut.


----------



## gosa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its not that deliding nets you better temps, its that it helps heat transfer better by reducing/eliminating the gap between the die and IHS. The better the heat transfer the less heat is randomly lost and the better the temps.
> 
> This might help you as well. http://noctua.at/en/nh_l9i_tdp_guidelines
> 
> In essence you can delid and youll see temp drops, unfortunately your temps might still stay high depending on how good the airflow is in your small case. Ive done it to a 3350p (uses a bit bigger cooler master cooler then the tiny junk intel uses now) and i did see some temp drops on a 35w tdp cpu, not much temp drops but it def made a difference. And thats without using CLU just used hydronaut.


First of all - thanks for taking the time to reply...

The guidelines most definitely speak against me (I knew that before getting into this build), and I also know that the case isn't really optimal for what I want to achieve.
- I just thought I'd have to at least give it a try. It does kind of make sense though that I won't gain that much. It's still gonna be the same heat that needs to get out,
I'm just kind of holding on the illusion that if I help the heat pass from die to cooler more easily it will be a bigger surface it has to dissipate from... (I probably need to pinch myself in the arm and wake up from that one though).


----------



## Braxil

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> You can run without an IHS but you have to be careful when mounting the cooler on top
> 
> if you apply too much pressure you're damaging the DIE
> 
> my CLU on my "old" skylake was still fine when I put my kaby in, 1 year old or a bit more


I wasn't intending to run it naked, but to just sit the IHS back ontop of the die and let the motherboard CPU mount hold it inplace, to avoid having to reglue it. Is this a good idea?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Braxil*
> 
> I wasn't intending to run it naked, but to just sit the IHS back ontop of the die and let the motherboard CPU mount hold it inplace, to avoid having to reglue it. Is this a good idea?


I've run all of my Ivy's that way and never had any problems at all. The clamp holds the IHS in place solidly and unless you are _trying_ to damage it by massive overtighting of the block/heatsink (and using non spring-loaded pins) you won't lose anything... and you might gain a better mating between the IHS and the die. Which is nothing but a good thing!

Not to mention if you need to add/remove a little CLU to try for better temps... it's way easier than having to delid all over again!


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Braxil*
> 
> I wasn't intending to run it naked, but to just sit the IHS back ontop of the die and let the motherboard CPU mount hold it inplace, to avoid having to reglue it. Is this a good idea?


It's fine
but you have to press you're finger on the IHS when you clamp it all down

the clamps have a lot of force
the IHS might slide a bit

would it matter?
well it's just a few mm
I'm not sure anyone would know, actually know for a fact, if it actually matters if the IHS slides a few mm out of place

I've applied liquid metal on the inside of the IHS as well as the DIE
I'd think there's enough paste to move around just a little

also as long as temps are fine and cores are roughly the same temps then everything is fine


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I am gonna delid my 7700k tonight x264 seemed to be fine @ 5ghz and 1.360v but temps were ridiculous hoping delid will fix that, using noctua C14s with the fan @ 700rpm because I dont want to hear it.
Would you say adding CLU on the inside of the IHS helps, or is it good enough if I just do the core?
I have previously delidded one 4770k and 2x 6700k only ever applied CLU on the core on the inside of the IHS.
Also not to sure if ill go CLU ontop of IHS aswell or not because all I have is a poor swiftech thermalpaste, I've done it before but not with kaby, is it worth it vs a mediocre tim? I would think so.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> I am gonna delid my 7700k tonight x264 seemed to be fine @ 5ghz and 1.360v but temps were ridiculous hoping delid will fix that, using noctua C14s with the fan @ 700rpm because I dont want to hear it.
> Would you say adding CLU on the inside of the IHS helps, or is it good enough if I just do the core?
> I have previously delidded one 4770k and 2x 6700k only ever applied CLU on the core on the inside of the IHS.
> Also not to sure if ill go CLU ontop of IHS aswell or not because all I have is a poor swiftech thermalpaste, I've done it before but not with kaby, is it worth it vs a mediocre tim? I would think so.


YouTube rockit 88 and watch. Apply to did and IHS and use tape so you don't apply too much to the wrong places.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> I am gonna delid my 7700k tonight x264 seemed to be fine @ 5ghz and 1.360v but temps were ridiculous hoping delid will fix that, using noctua C14s with the fan @ 700rpm because I dont want to hear it.
> Would you say adding CLU on the inside of the IHS helps, or is it good enough if I just do the core?
> I have previously delidded one 4770k and 2x 6700k only ever applied CLU on the core on the inside of the IHS.
> Also not to sure if ill go CLU ontop of IHS aswell or not because all I have is a poor swiftech thermalpaste, I've done it before but not with kaby, is it worth it vs a mediocre tim? I would think so.


Dude honestly its a Noctua fan, you can run it higher then 700rpm and still not hear a thing. I absolutely love the quietness of some of their fans.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Well that turned out to be interesting evening, I had the 3D printed delid tool for skylake, wich I blindly hoped to work for kabylake, but as it turns out their IHS are shaped differently and it did not work.
So instead of putting the delid plan on a hold for a week and spending 30€ needlessly I grabbed a razorblade wrapped some tape around it and delidded it this way, took like a whole minute!
I used CLU on the core and not on the inside of the IHS, between the cpu and the cooler i applied some CLU aswell, worked like a charm.
Now onto the temperatures ( I run a Noctua C14S cooler with the fan set @ 50% power, that means 6v and just under 700rpm, just because I dont want to hear it or any part of my PC so its SILENT only fans are the CPU and the ones on my GPU the fan on my PSU has never moved as far as i know ), my ambient is ~22c measured by my aquaero.
All tests were ran on a 7700K @ 50x core @ manual voltage @ 1.35v + LLC5 = 1.360v under load, memory was set to XMP ( tridentZ 3200 14-14-14-34-2T ) and did not change any other settings.
Before the delid I ran one loop of the custom X264 on the same settings and stopped because the hottest cores hit 90c








But now after the delid I ran 3 loops of the custom x264 and the hottest cores were 68c 68c 66c 62c I am really happy with the result and can truly reccomend delidding your kabylake if temperatures are ridiculous. I also used clear nailpolish to cover the doodads in danger of being shortcircuited on the pcb just incase, I havent really tried going past 5ghz yet, but I`m sure to try and let you know how it went, but I am happy with where it is currently 5ghz on a good aircooler with fan set on 6v an inaudible :setup:thumb:
I am sure I could lover the temps more when cranking up the fan, but I`ll take silence over few degrees anyday!





Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!














Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Dude honestly its a Noctua fan, you can run it higher then 700rpm and still not hear a thing. I absolutely love the quietness of some of their fans.


Thats the exact reason I run it @ 50% and 700rpm above that I can tell it`s working and that is no bueno


----------



## ducegt

Nice work. Glad you pulled it off the hard way. I'm nervous about my doodads but I believe CLU solidifies after 2 days.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> Well that turned out to be interesting evening, I had the 3D printed delid tool for skylake, wich I blindly hoped to work for kabylake, but as it turns out their IHS are shaped differently and it did not work.
> So instead of putting the delid plan on a hold for a week and spending 30€ needlessly I grabbed a razorblade wrapped some tape around it and delidded it this way, took like a whole minute!
> I used CLU on the core and not on the inside of the IHS, between the cpu and the cooler i applied some CLU aswell, worked like a charm.
> Now onto the temperatures ( I run a Noctua C14S cooler with the fan set @ 50% power, that means 6v and just under 700rpm, just because I dont want to hear it or any part of my PC so its SILENT only fans are the CPU and the ones on my GPU the fan on my PSU has never moved as far as i know ), my ambient is ~22c measured by my aquaero.
> All tests were ran on a 7700K @ 50x core @ manual voltage @ 1.35v + LLC5 = 1.360v under load, memory was set to XMP ( tridentZ 3200 14-14-14-34-2T ) and did not change any other settings.
> Before the delid I ran one loop of the custom X264 on the same settings and stopped because the hottest cores hit 90c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But now after the delid I ran 3 loops of the custom x264 and the hottest cores were 68c 68c 66c 62c I am really happy with the result and can truly reccomend delidding your kabylake if temperatures are ridiculous. I also used clear nailpolish to cover the doodads in danger of being shortcircuited on the pcb just incase, I havent really tried going past 5ghz yet, but I`m sure to try and let you know how it went, but I am happy with where it is currently 5ghz on a good aircooler with fan set on 6v an inaudible :setup:thumb:
> I am sure I could lover the temps more when cranking up the fan, but I`ll take silence over few degrees anyday!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats the exact reason I run it @ 50% and 700rpm above that I can tell it`s working and that is no bueno


I can't imagine what speed you keep your gpu at and what temps you must be getting because those are VERY loud. I run my noctuas at 1100-1200rpm and its plenty silent for me, especially while gaming with headphones you hear nothing so doesn't bother me. Low temps over noise any day.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Thats the deal I dont game with headphones mostly, gainwards phoenix 1070 is really quiet I like to enjoy the sounds of the game not a whining computer, but to each their own.


----------



## MooMoo

Has anyone measured difference when using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut vs KRYONAUT as compound between die and IHS? or some other liquid metal vs paste?

I'm afraid that liquid metal would evaporate or run off from the die.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MooMoo*
> 
> Has anyone measured difference when using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut vs KRYONAUT as compound between die and IHS? or some other liquid metal vs paste?
> 
> I'm afraid that liquid metal would evaporate or run off from the die.


Temp difference won't be much but reliability will. Kryonaut will start to pump out after a week or so (Hydronaut and Kryonaut for me both lasted a couple days before temps started shooting up), while CLU (same composition as conductonaut just in different mixtures) has been going on for 6months with no temp rise at all.


----------



## nrpeyton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MooMoo*
> 
> Has anyone measured difference when using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut vs KRYONAUT as compound between die and IHS? or some other liquid metal vs paste?
> 
> I'm afraid that liquid metal would evaporate or run off from the die.


I done some controlled testing comparing the two pastes purely from a 'performance' angle. (kryonaut vs conductonaut) *Not under a de-lid situation* but it could still help purely as a temperature/performance comparison?

Conductonaut Max Temp: 48.0c
Kryonaut Max Temp: 51.0c
https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/kryonaut-12-w-mk-vs-conductonaut-liquid-metal-73-w-mk.229167/

P.S.

_Reason for test:
I needed something comparing the market leading paste with the highest w/mk rated LM_


----------



## brenopapito

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> Well that turned out to be interesting evening, I had the 3D printed delid tool for skylake, wich I blindly hoped to work for kabylake, but as it turns out their IHS are shaped differently and it did not work.
> So instead of putting the delid plan on a hold for a week and spending 30€ needlessly I grabbed a razorblade wrapped some tape around it and delidded it this way, took like a whole minute!
> I used CLU on the core and not on the inside of the IHS, between the cpu and the cooler i applied some CLU aswell, worked like a charm.
> Now onto the temperatures ( I run a Noctua C14S cooler with the fan set @ 50% power, that means 6v and just under 700rpm, just because I dont want to hear it or any part of my PC so its SILENT only fans are the CPU and the ones on my GPU the fan on my PSU has never moved as far as i know ), my ambient is ~22c measured by my aquaero.
> All tests were ran on a 7700K @ 50x core @ manual voltage @ 1.35v + LLC5 = 1.360v under load, memory was set to XMP ( tridentZ 3200 14-14-14-34-2T ) and did not change any other settings.
> Before the delid I ran one loop of the custom X264 on the same settings and stopped because the hottest cores hit 90c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But now after the delid I ran 3 loops of the custom x264 and the hottest cores were 68c 68c 66c 62c I am really happy with the result and can truly reccomend delidding your kabylake if temperatures are ridiculous. I also used clear nailpolish to cover the doodads in danger of being shortcircuited on the pcb just incase, I havent really tried going past 5ghz yet, but I`m sure to try and let you know how it went, but I am happy with where it is currently 5ghz on a good aircooler with fan set on 6v an inaudible :setup:thumb:
> I am sure I could lover the temps more when cranking up the fan, but I`ll take silence over few degrees anyday!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thats the exact reason I run it @ 50% and 700rpm above that I can tell it`s working and that is no bueno


Can you explain me what you did here and why? I'm about to delid my 7700k and I would like to understand the delid process before I start.

Thanks!


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I just covered it with clear nail polish so incase the CLU gets there it wont mess anything up, better safe than sorry


----------



## Ximplicite

Question: How to remove the black adhesive on processor?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I scratched mine off with a creditcard, have always done it like that, then scrubbed abit with isopropyl alcohol


----------



## mrgnex

I just used my nail but I think a credit card might be nail friendlier.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> Question: How to remove the black adhesive on processor?


used an old credit card


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brenopapito*
> 
> Can you explain me what you did here and why? I'm about to delid my 7700k and I would like to understand the delid process before I start.
> 
> Thanks!


I put some of the original TIM from Intel on those gold contacts

so I understand his reasoning using nail polish ;-)

I've seen others use some kind of tape


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MooMoo*
> 
> Has anyone measured difference when using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut vs KRYONAUT as compound between die and IHS? or some other liquid metal vs paste?
> 
> I'm afraid that liquid metal would evaporate or run off from the die.


missing the grizzly conductonaut, but that's a liquid metal as well










btw
I know us folks are snobby about reading a manual
however the manual for the coollabority liquid metal pro (not ultra) states that in a period of 48 hours it actually solidifies

for safety reasons (also claims better temps)

so the stuff isn't drying out per se
haven't found that in the manual for the ultra

also I wonder if people realize there are actually 2 versions


----------



## TritonianYeti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> Question: How to remove the black adhesive on processor?


Best way that I have found is to use gun cleaning pads with isopropyl alcohol.

These are what I use: http://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/sportsmans/GunSlick-Patches/productDetail/Brushes-Jags-Mops-and-Patches/prod9999005893/cat100067

Just use elbow grease and it comes right off and I don't have to worry about it damaging the PCB any.

I have read that others have used a dremel with a polishing bit on the end with isopropyl alcohol as well.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> btw
> I know us folks are snobby about reading a manual
> however the manual for the coollabority liquid metal pro (not ultra) states that in a period of 48 hours it actually solidifies
> 
> for safety reasons (also claims better temps)
> 
> so the stuff isn't drying out per se
> haven't found that in the manual for the ultra
> 
> also I wonder if people realize there are actually 2 versions


I actually used CLP for my first delid years ago on a 4770K took the cap off months later applied some isopropyl alcohol and wiped it off, nothing had solidified.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> I actually used CLP for my first delid years ago on a 4770K took the cap off months later applied some isopropyl alcohol and wiped it off, nothing had solidified.


never happened for me either, but I used the ultra before
and now Phobya LM

but people are concerned about the drying out, and the manual says solidifying might be normal

might I ask if you used the CLP also between IHS and cooler?

Btw
this is something people concerned referred to
same user, same build

cooler "dried" out








under IHS is fine


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> never happened for me either, but I used the ultra before
> and now Phobya LM
> 
> but people are concerned about the drying out, and the manual says solidifying might be normal
> 
> might I ask if you used the CLP also between IHS and cooler?
> 
> Btw
> this is something people concerned referred to
> same user, same build
> 
> cooler "dried" out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> under IHS is fine


Thats a nice big glob there haha. id never use it between a cooler and IHS though, but im also running bare die so its between my die and waterblock anyways haha.


----------



## khemist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tiger style*
> 
> Mine disappeared too. The tracking said it had been collected which worried me. Got a slip through the door a few days later that it was being held at my local Royal Mail depot awaiting customs charges, I think around £13.


Did it say collected or delivered?, mine says delivered but i don't have it.


----------



## jonathan1107

I'm considering to delid my i7 7700k
What liquid metal would you suggest I use (what are some of the best?) for contact between die and ihs and for the paste between the ihs and water block, is as5 good enough or should I buy Gelid extreme?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

You can use liquid metal for both no need to buy anything else, liquid ultra is really nice and affordable, that's what I use under the IHS and between IHS and cooler aswell.


----------



## jonathan1107

So should I get coollaboratory liquid ultra or thermal grizzly conductonaut?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Whatever you get make sure you have some isopropyl alcohol to clean stuff up, helps alot.
On paper conductonaut should be better but I havent tried it so cant say if it really is Thermal conductivity: 73W/ mK @ conductonaut and Thermal conductivity: 38.4W/ mK @ liquid ultra


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MooMoo*
> 
> Has anyone measured difference when using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut vs KRYONAUT as compound between die and IHS? or some other liquid metal vs paste?
> 
> I'm afraid that liquid metal would evaporate or run off from the die.
> 
> 
> 
> missing the grizzly conductonaut, but that's a liquid metal as well
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> btw
> I know us folks are snobby about reading a manual
> however the manual for the coollabority liquid metal pro (not ultra) states that in a period of 48 hours it actually solidifies
> 
> for safety reasons (also claims better temps)
> 
> so the stuff isn't drying out per se
> haven't found that in the manual for the ultra
> 
> also I wonder if people realize there are actually 2 versions
Click to expand...

No G751 in that comparison either.









~Ceadder


----------



## tiger style

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> Did it say collected or delivered?, mine says delivered but i don't have it.


I can't remember now. It was a few months ago.

Have you rung your depot or chased it up with Royal Mail?


----------



## khemist

No, it only showed as delivered yesterday, i will wait until Monday.


----------



## Tristanguy1224

Ok So I've decided to delid my 7700k I've done this once before on an i7 930 so it's been a while.... I've seen the delid tools and I like that way a bit better than trying to razor blade it. I've ordered Liquid Metal Ultra and have a few days for it to arrive.
Now I do have a couple questions. First I've seen the 3D printed tools and they look decent. I don't really want to buy the Rockit 88, so I've decided to try the 3D printed tool first. I work at a Microcenter so I'm gonna see if I can just have the demo model 3D printer make me one. I would like to hear from anyone that's used one before and if they are as decent and easy as they look? Anything I should keep in mind (besides being SUPER careful) while getting my IHS off? While I've watched TONS of videos of applying the Liquid Metal Ultra is there anything I need to know that isn't common knowledge?

I've been reading and watching all the relative info. I think I'm prepared but if there are any tips I welcome them.

My reason for delidding is simple 80-84c temps at 4.8Ghz @ 1.312v -unacceptable I'm using a Corsair H115i with Corsair ML-140 fans.


----------



## MooMoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tristanguy1224*
> 
> Ok So I've decided to delid my 7700k I've done this once before on an i7 930 so it's been a while.... I've seen the delid tools and I like that way a bit better than trying to razor blade it. I've ordered Liquid Metal Ultra and have a few days for it to arrive.
> Now I do have a couple questions. First I've seen the 3D printed tools and they look decent. I don't really want to buy the Rockit 88, so I've decided to try the 3D printed tool first. I work at a Microcenter so I'm gonna see if I can just have the demo model 3D printer make me one. I would like to hear from anyone that's used one before and if they are as decent and easy as they look? Anything I should keep in mind (besides being SUPER careful) while getting my IHS off? While I've watched TONS of videos of applying the Liquid Metal Ultra is there anything I need to know that isn't common knowledge?
> 
> I've been reading and watching all the relative info. I think I'm prepared but if there are any tips I welcome them.
> 
> My reason for delidding is simple 80-84c temps at 4.8Ghz @ 1.312v -unacceptable I'm using a Corsair H115i with Corsair ML-140 fans.


If you are going with 3D printed tool, make sure the model is made for Kaby Lake, as Skylake and Kaby Lake don't have same IHS, they differ a bit. So you have higher chance to f things up if you use skylake model.


----------



## Tristanguy1224

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MooMoo*
> 
> If you are going with 3D printed tool, make sure the model is made for Kaby Lake, as Skylake and Kaby Lake don't have same IHS, they differ a bit. So you have higher chance to f things up if you use skylake model.


Thanks, I have an object file for Kaby Lake so I'm gonna hopefully get it printed tomorrow at work. If not I'll have to find someone with a 3D printer. So as long as I'm using the correct model I should have much to worry about as long as I'm careful?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan1107*
> 
> I'm considering to delid my i7 7700k
> What liquid metal would you suggest I use (what are some of the best?) for contact between die and ihs and for the paste between the ihs and water block, is as5 good enough or should I buy Gelid extreme?


I would NOT put CLU between the IHS and air/water cooler. As a few people have noted liquid metals are made to harden (form a better bond like soldering does). It can make it very VERY difficult to remove your cooler from the cpu if indeed you need to. I always tell people the difference in temps from LM to TIM on top of the IHS is so minimal its not worth the hassle.


----------



## Tristanguy1224

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I would NOT put CLU between the IHS and air/water cooler. As a few people have noted liquid metals are made to harden (form a better bond like soldering does). It can make it very VERY difficult to remove your cooler from the cpu if indeed you need to. I always tell people the difference in temps from LM to TIM on top of the IHS is so minimal its not worth the hassle.


From everything I've read it's NOT bad advice. But I DO have a question. If I plan on taking my system down let's say once every 3-6 months would it really bond that strongly? All the stuff I've read where this has happened it was usually a person who had a year or more with it like that. I'm going to put the liquid metal between the die and IHS and was considering using it between the waterblock and IHS as well. However I also take my system apart regularly to keep it clean. Would that advice still apply? I also see many of those having issues being... Well less experienced. Could that gave anything to do with their issues? Maybe not cleaning the surfaces enough and having tiny amounts of aluminum left from TIM like AS5? I know gallium will corrode aluminum so I plan on cleaning to the point of being obsessive. Will that change anything? Also I see posts about temperature being a factor. Is there ANY validity to that? Will having too cool a work environment for removing and cleaning the liquid metal have a detrimental effect on the ease of removing the CPU cooler?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tristanguy1224*
> 
> From everything I've read it's NOT bad advice. But I DO have a question. If I plan on taking my system down let's say once every 3-6 months would it really bond that strongly? All the stuff I've read where this has happened it was usually a person who had a year or more with it like that. I'm going to put the liquid metal between the die and IHS and was considering using it between the waterblock and IHS as well. However I also take my system apart regularly to keep it clean. Would that advice still apply? I also see many of those having issues being... Well less experienced. Could that gave anything to do with their issues? Maybe not cleaning the surfaces enough and having tiny amounts of aluminum left from TIM like AS5? I know gallium will corrode aluminum so I plan on cleaning to the point of being obsessive. Will that change anything? Also I see posts about temperature being a factor. Is there ANY validity to that? Will having too cool a work environment for removing and cleaning the liquid metal have a detrimental effect on the ease of removing the CPU cooler?


Makes no difference experienced or not, the manual itself states thats its made to harden. Provided I'm sure if you run a stress test then take it apart immediately after it might come right off. Me personally i wouldn't risk having it fuse together its just not worth the 1°C temp drop haha.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tristanguy1224*
> 
> From everything I've read it's NOT bad advice. But I DO have a question. If I plan on taking my system down let's say once every 3-6 months would it really bond that strongly? All the stuff I've read where this has happened it was usually a person who had a year or more with it like that. I'm going to put the liquid metal between the die and IHS and was considering using it between the waterblock and IHS as well. However I also take my system apart regularly to keep it clean. Would that advice still apply? I also see many of those having issues being... Well less experienced. Could that gave anything to do with their issues? Maybe not cleaning the surfaces enough and having tiny amounts of aluminum left from TIM like AS5? I know gallium will corrode aluminum so I plan on cleaning to the point of being obsessive. Will that change anything? Also I see posts about temperature being a factor. Is there ANY validity to that? Will having too cool a work environment for removing and cleaning the liquid metal have a detrimental effect on the ease of removing the CPU cooler?


Why not just use a different brand of liquid metal

there's also grizzly and Phobya
haven't heard anything gets bad about them

btw
liquid metal TIM is kinda ok to put on, once you have a bit of experience
but wiping it away is no small feat

or the next best thing besides a liquid metal
there isn't a huge difference if you look at the comparison I posted (liquid metal to good "normal" TIM)


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> Why not just use a different brand of liquid metal
> 
> there's also grizzly and Phobya
> haven't heard anything gets bad about them
> 
> btw
> liquid metal TIM is kinda ok to put on, once you have a bit of experience
> but wiping it away is no small feat
> 
> or the next best thing besides a liquid metal
> there isn't a huge difference if you look at the comparison I posted (liquid metal to good "normal" TIM)


Peter although those graphs are true, none of them actually test on die comparison. Its either tested ON the ihs or between copper plates. Doesn't take into consideration mounting pressure and direct contact heat. Pretty much ALL liquid metals have all the same ingredients, just in different consistencies so technically they all do the same job.

Cleaning up liquid metal is easy if done right and you used a thin layer, do a 20min benchmark get the CPU hot then shut down immediately makes life a whole lot easier.

Having it between ihs and cooling solution doesnt get anywhere near as hot as the direct contact of the ihs to the die so therefore it doesnt get as hot and solidifies rather quickly. To me for a 1°C ON the ihs its not worth the headache of it etching and having to sand it down off the cooler. On the die and IHS idc about as it doesn't get removed as frequently (removing an air cooler or waterblock to clean is done a lot faster and more efficiently if removed). Its just not worth it at all.


----------



## khemist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tiger style*
> 
> I can't remember now. It was a few months ago.
> 
> Have you rung your depot or chased it up with Royal Mail?


Just got the card from RM, i'll pick it up tomorrow.


----------



## Ximplicite

Sorry for my ignorance where do i put clear nail polish? i just delid my 3570k and use CLU and straight without adhesive.


----------



## gosa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ximplicite*
> 
> Sorry for my ignorance where do i put clear nail polish? i just delid my 3570k and use CLU and straight without adhesive.


For the 3570k there's no need for nail polish...

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but as far as I understand it the nail polish (or you can also use regular non-conductive TIM) is used as a safety measure against the CLU leaking onto the row of capacitors on for example Haswell CPU's (where there is a row of them very close to the die). "Painting" them with nail polish creates a protective layer in case any CLU gets pressed out onto them.

I have a 3570K that I de-lidded a couple of years ago, and that one doesn't have anything but the die "on top".

(I have since then successfully removed, cleaned and re-applied CLU one time to "freshen things up" - for anyone having doubts about solidifying or difficulties in removing the IHS from the die)


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Peter although those graphs are true, none of them actually test on die comparison. Its either tested ON the ihs or between copper plates. Doesn't take into consideration mounting pressure and direct contact heat. Pretty much ALL liquid metals have all the same ingredients, just in different consistencies so technically they all do the same job.
> 
> Cleaning up liquid metal is easy if done right and you used a thin layer, do a 20min benchmark get the CPU hot then shut down immediately makes life a whole lot easier.
> 
> Having it between ihs and cooling solution doesnt get anywhere near as hot as the direct contact of the ihs to the die so therefore it doesnt get as hot and solidifies rather quickly. To me for a 1°C ON the ihs its not worth the headache of it etching and having to sand it down off the cooler. On the die and IHS idc about as it doesn't get removed as frequently (removing an air cooler or waterblock to clean is done a lot faster and more efficiently if removed). Its just not worth it at all.


what I'm saying is:
if liquid metals are not for you just look at the graph and pick a "normal" TIM
just a good one


----------



## HowYesNo

ok. so today i received rockit 88 delid tool, and plan to delid this weekend. i also got relid kit.
i also got loctite gel control glue, from their web site, but think i will use black silicon from permatex to reseal IHS.
got CLU for die, and Coolermaster MasteGel for IHS.
my 3570k runs @4.6 with 1.264 Vcore, temps in prime around 70C, max with 12h run goes to 80C.
any final advice i can get here? will i need to reaply CLU anytime in future?
thanks


----------



## khemist

https://imageshack.com/i/po7Y74oIj

Delid tool showed up at last!, i'll post before and after results as soon as it's done.


----------



## HowYesNo

what that yellow piece of plastic? i did not get it.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> ok. so today i received rockit 88 delid tool, and plan to delid this weekend. i also got relid kit.
> i also got loctite gel control glue, from their web site, but think i will use black silicon from permatex to reseal IHS.
> got CLU for die, and Coolermaster MasteGel for IHS.
> my 3570k runs @4.6 with 1.264 Vcore, temps in prime around 70C, max with 12h run goes to 80C.
> any final advice i can get here? will i need to reaply CLU anytime in future?
> thanks


Not advice but just curious why spend so much money on delidding 3570k ?


----------



## khemist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> what that yellow piece of plastic? i did not get it.


I bought it seperate, i'll be using it to scrape off the crud.

It uses plastic blades to remove adhesive and stickers.


----------



## HowYesNo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> Not advice but just curious why spend so much money on delidding 3570k ?


well it seems as a good overclocker, and very interested in process and results.
also going to a new platform is bit more expensive.


----------



## razcalzz

Hi everyone, i'm kinda new in this delidding cpu thingy, however i've successfully delidded my i7 7700k with razor blade.
How can I reglue/relid the IHS back to the PCB? i might be able to get Permatex Ultra Black at my local shop but I don't know how to apply it.
Is there any tutorial to apply the thermal silicone?
I know that some people recommend to not glue back the IHS, but if I wanna sell the i7 7700k I'll have to glue it back first.
thanks for anyone who can answer my questions


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *razcalzz*
> 
> Hi everyone, i'm kinda new in this delidding cpu thingy, however i've successfully delidded my i7 7700k with razor blade.
> How can I reglue/relid the IHS back to the PCB? i might be able to get Permatex Ultra Black at my local shop but I don't know how to apply it.
> Is there any tutorial to apply the thermal silicone?
> I know that some people recommend to not glue back the IHS, but if I wanna sell the i7 7700k I'll have to glue it back first.
> thanks for anyone who can answer my questions


First I had a funnel like add on bundled with my tube of Silicon but it got clogged up all the time. The last delid I did I just put some silicon on my finger (maybe wear a glove) and then applied it to the metal rim of the IHS.


----------



## razcalzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> First I had a funnel like add on bundled with my tube of Silicon but it got clogged up all the time. The last delid I did I just put some silicon on my finger (maybe wear a glove) and then applied it to the metal rim of the IHS.


can I use toothpick to apply the permatex? and how thick / how much should I apply it to the IHS? just the corner or all round the square edge ?


----------



## jonathan1107

Ok guys. Today is delid day. I intend to do it with a cutter blade. I also don't have any "glue" here at home to reinstall the ihs to the die after I'm done putting the CLU. Is it OK if I don't use anything to glue it back together?

Also if I don't glue it back together, is there any precautions I need to take to make sure I don't do a mess?

I heard of some people that sanded the ihs a bit to make the distance between the die and ihs as small as possible. Any words of advice for that part before I start?

Any other precautions I need to take for an i7 7700k using CLU for die and Gelid extreme for water block contact?


----------



## cyan

Can i use car silicone gasket for re-lid purpose ?
since it can stand 300c
or is it a stupid idea ?


----------



## Crazy9000

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Can i use car silicone gasket for re-lid purpose ?
> since it can stand 300c
> or is it a stupid idea ?


The car gasket stuff usually isn't meant to be used as a glue. It's to make a gasket between two items that are clamped.

Since you will be clamping the cpu cooler on top, it will probably work, but when you take it off, you won't be able to trust the gasket to actually hold the lid on


----------



## javiasiva

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Can i use car silicone gasket for re-lid purpose ?
> since it can stand 300c
> or is it a stupid idea ?


That is exactly what I used, no issues whatsoever


----------



## khemist

https://imageshack.com/i/pouqyvoej

https://imageshack.com/i/pmzBCQJFj

Here is mine before and after delidding.

I managed to lose one of the metal washers from my cpu waterblock and also ran out of CLU so maybe that's why one core is out of whack but i'm happy with the results and will redo it when i get some more clu and another washer.

30 mins of realbench 7700k @ 5.0 1.36v on water.


----------



## Arctucas

DELETED.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Crazy9000*
> 
> The car gasket stuff usually isn't meant to be used as a glue. It's to make a gasket between two items that are clamped.
> 
> Since you will be clamping the cpu cooler on top, it will probably work, but when you take it off, you won't be able to trust the gasket to actually hold the lid on


Basically, the same thing Intel uses, so...


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *javiasiva*
> 
> That is exactly what I used, no issues whatsoever


I used the PermaTex black when I did my re-lid.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *razcalzz*
> 
> can I use toothpick to apply the permatex? and how thick / how much should I apply it to the IHS? just the corner or all round the square edge ?


I dipped a toothpick in PermaTex black, and applied a tiny dot to each corner of the IHS only. Then, I clamped it in the Rockit 88 re-lid jig for about 8 hours.


----------



## Caos

Hello, I am wanting to delid my 7700k, I would only need the delid kit of
1-Rockit 88 - Black Body
2-Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut High Performance
3-https: //www.amazon.com/Permatex-81158-Silicone-Adhesive-Sealant/dp/B000AL6WLA/ref=sr_1_2? Srs = 2598395011 & ie = UTF8 & qid = 1486680465 & sr = 8-2 & keywords = PermaTex + black

anything else? I lose the intel warranty?

With the permatex back seal, but can it be opened again if this badly put the thermal paste?

On the site of Rockit88 use Loctite Super Glue - Gel Control

Which is better to re-seal permatex or super glue?

thanks


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> Hello, I am wanting to delid my 7700k, I would only need the delid kit of
> 1-Rockit 88 - Black Body
> 2-Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut High Performance
> 3-https: //www.amazon.com/Permatex-81158-Silicone-Adhesive-Sealant/dp/B000AL6WLA/ref=sr_1_2? Srs = 2598395011 & ie = UTF8 & qid = 1486680465 & sr = 8-2 & keywords = PermaTex + black
> 
> anything else? I lose the intel warranty?
> 
> With the permatex back seal, but can it be opened again if this badly put the thermal paste?
> 
> On the site of Rockit88 use Loctite Super Glue - Gel Control
> 
> Which is better to re-seal permatex or super glue?
> 
> thanks


I like permatex (or any other black silicone) for the stock like look and easy delidding but I assume super glue can be delidded aswell..


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> I like permatex (or any other black silicone) for the stock like look and easy delidding but I assume super glue can be delidded aswell..


I understand and thanks for replying, when I open the processor, how do I remove the rest of the original thermal paste?

The black silicone when reclosing is placed on the 4 corners of the IHS?


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan1107*
> 
> Ok guys. Today is delid day. I intend to do it with a cutter blade. I also don't have any "glue" here at home to reinstall the ihs to the die after I'm done putting the CLU. Is it OK if I don't use anything to glue it back together?
> 
> Also if I don't glue it back together, is there any precautions I need to take to make sure I don't do a mess?
> 
> I heard of some people that sanded the ihs a bit to make the distance between the die and ihs as small as possible. Any words of advice for that part before I start?
> 
> Any other precautions I need to take for an i7 7700k using CLU for die and Gelid extreme for water block contact?


1. take very much care with a blade; the thinner the best. I would use the thinnest blade avaliable, some shaving ones. Points upward and dont cut too deep. Do not use a metal blade or tool to scrap the black silicone glue, use a plastic card or similar.

2. You should be fine without reliding the ihs, in fact its the best temp wise. You just need to take care when closing the latch lock that the ihs will not move, once its secured in place its good to go and will remain in location.

3. Sanding any surface make it thinner not bigger. Once you sand you will in fact be removing material. Some people want to lap inside and outside, its up to you but just dont remove much material. Once you lap enough you will remove the nickel plating, not a problem but a warning to not keep scratching. I see some people lapping the die, dont try to lap the die, its pretty mirror already.

4. Just use enough clu to make a fine layer. I used nail polisher to cover the contacts next to die.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> I understand and thanks for replying, when I open the processor, how do I remove the rest of the original thermal paste?
> 
> The black silicone when reclosing is placed on the 4 corners of the IHS?


You should use a lint free paper like coffee filters. Try to clean the die and ihs the most you can, because if you use liquid metal it can react with older paste and residues like finger oils. I used 99% isoprophyl alcool ,its good and almost instantly evaporates.

You can place the silicone glue (if you are thinking on using it), its advisable to use as less as you could because if you use much as intel you will end having same temps issues, the black glue expands and creates a gap between ihs and die. You just need enough to keep the ihs attached, corners is just fine.

When the glue cures it expands so its a good measure to apply some sort of controlled pressure on ihs while the glue cures.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> I like permatex (or any other black silicone) for the stock like look and easy delidding but I assume super glue can be delidded aswell..


The super glue james from rockit advices, i used it, its soft enough to be remove and cleansed with acetone and leave small to no gap, however dont use it like the silicone under the ihs, use it on the ihs corners just to make opposing dots so the ihs dont move. If you put between the pcb and ihs it probably will need you to soak the entire pcb on acethone to clean.


----------



## razcalzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> https://imageshack.com/i/pouqyvoej
> 
> https://imageshack.com/i/pmzBCQJFj
> 
> Here is mine before and after delidding.
> 
> I managed to lose one of the metal washers from my cpu waterblock and also ran out of CLU so maybe that's why one core is out of whack but i'm happy with the results and will redo it when i get some more clu and another washer.
> 
> 30 mins of realbench 7700k @ 5.0 1.36v on water.


1.36v cpu voltage mode Override or Adaptive? and LLC level ?


----------



## khemist

Set to 1.34v override in bios 1.367 under load LLC7.


----------



## razcalzz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> Set to 1.34v override in bios 1.367 under load LLC7.


on idle it will stay at 1.34 volt or it will go down?


----------



## khemist

It drops down.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Crazy9000*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Can i use car silicone gasket for re-lid purpose ?
> since it can stand 300c
> or is it a stupid idea ?
> 
> 
> 
> The car gasket stuff usually isn't meant to be used as a glue. It's to make a gasket between two items that are clamped.
> 
> Since you will be clamping the cpu cooler on top, it will probably work, but when you take it off, you won't be able to trust the gasket to actually hold the lid on
Click to expand...

The MB socket will keep it on when removing the cooler. If you use RTB black then it should keep the IHS in place when removal of the CPU is necessary since the best way to do that is with the case on its side.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> The MB socket will keep it on when removing the cooler. If you use RTB black then it should keep the IHS in place when removal of the CPU is necessary since the best way to do that is with the case on its side.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


EXACTLY what i was thinking haha. Last time i checked its the actual IHS being clamped down by the retention mechanism. What i would do however is put a dab of glue in each corner then install it right away so the retention mechanism can put pressure on the IHS and HOPEFULLY leave no gap between the IHS and DIE. This is kinda why 99% of people dont reglue the IHS on, just putting it in place is plenty to hold it in place. Unless your removing your cooler monthly (for whatever reason) gluing down the IHS really isn't necessary. Its held down by the retention mechanism then by the cooler on top of that thru its mounting mechanism.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> I understand and thanks for replying, when I open the processor, how do I remove the rest of the original thermal paste?
> 
> The black silicone when reclosing is placed on the 4 corners of the IHS?


The original thermal paste comes offwith just a paper towel and then clean it with alcohol. For the silicon I just used a credit card to scrape off the majority of glue and the rest I did with my fingernail. Cleaned everything with alcohol again.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> The super glue james from rockit advices, i used it, its soft enough to be remove and cleansed with acetone and leave small to no gap, however dont use it like the silicone under the ihs, use it on the ihs corners just to make opposing dots so the ihs dont move. If you put between the pcb and ihs it probably will need you to soak the entire pcb on acethone to clean.


Yeah I don't even think the delid tool would have enough force to get it off XD


----------



## DR4G00N

Popped the lid off a PIII-S 1.4GHz (literally). I'm now preparing myself for those astronomical OC gains! _/s_









I had nothing else to do so why not lol.



Check out that 14 year old thermal paste!


Mounted direct to die like a boss!


----------



## Kryton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> EXACTLY what i was thinking haha. Last time i checked its the actual IHS being clamped down by the retention mechanism. What i would do however is put a dab of glue in each corner then install it right away so the retention mechanism can put pressure on the IHS and HOPEFULLY leave no gap between the IHS and DIE. This is kinda why 99% of people dont reglue the IHS on, just putting it in place is plenty to hold it in place. Unless your removing your cooler monthly (for whatever reason) gluing down the IHS really isn't necessary. Its held down by the retention mechanism then by the cooler on top of that thru its mounting mechanism.


This is true - With an Intel the retention mechanism will keep it in place so unless you have a real need to seal the CPU off from well.... Let's say condensation from running it frozen there is no need to completely reseal it.

With my 3770K I did reseal around the entire lid with Black Permatex RTV since there is always the possibilty of me freezing it at some point so went ahead and did that to it. I made sure first that the old gasket material had been completely removed so the lid would sit flat onto the CPU die's surface, any irregularities in thickness of the old stuff to one side can cause the lid to sit crooked on the die and that's not good.

When you delid _you should clean the old gasket/sealant off completely from the lid *and* the chip's PCB_.

Most know this already but it had to be said so there it is.

Yes - Resealing/resecuring the lid can be done with two tiny drops of super glue to just two opposing corners of the lid and it will hold. Using RTV sealant as I did with mine works too and for the purpose of going sub-zero with it that would probrably be the way to go to keep condensation out.
You could try coating the electrically exposed parts of the chip within with vaseline or dielectric grease if you have to use a conductive TIM or decide not to reseal it fully and freeze it.
All you'd need is a thin film or coating and no more to repel any moisture that gets in or to protect it from a conductive TIM from causing a short. Just be sure everything is coated completely when you do.

TIM's used - Whatever you'd like but I'd advise against using any diamond dust TIM's since those can and will scratch the surface of the chip's die regardless of how it used.
If you relid it with the diamond dust stuff and just leave it alone once relidded that should be OK.

If running a straight naked die then I'd say don't use it - If leaving it alone once mounted it should be fine but if you tend to swap coolers and chips around you will eventually destroy the chip because with each cooler/block removal and remount the diamond dust stuff is literally gouging/grinding the die's surface since the cooler/block will move around a little with each remount and removal.

Anytime you remove the cooler or block some gouging of the die's surface will happen with the diamond dust TIM.


----------



## Ceadderman

Anyone considering IC Diamond TIM for their die should seek mental treatment post haste. That stuff is liquid sandpaper.


















~Ceadder


----------



## Radmanhs

anyone know of any discount codes for rockitcool delidding tools?


----------



## outofmyheadyo

I know a guy called razorblade is offering 100% discounts on delid tools, but seriously the delid tools are a waste of money, for the cpus with usual tim on the die, I understand why people would buy tools for 5960x and 6950x tho


----------



## Ximplicite

I suggest buy a vice and use this method


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DR4G00N*
> 
> Popped the lid off a PIII-S 1.4GHz (literally). I'm now preparing myself for those astronomical OC gains! _/s_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I had nothing else to do so why not lol.
> 
> 
> 
> Check out that 14 year old thermal paste!
> 
> 
> Mounted direct to die like a boss!


I forgot P4 had soldered models. However, solder prooved no match to the mighty hand vice!


----------



## lever2stacks

Got a kaby lake i7700 In route can't wait to get it in and pop the top. So whats the best liquid metal out now it seem that everyone is liking the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut. I have some coollaboratory pro left over from some of my last delids should I grab up some Thermal grizzly? What's the census these day's?


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lever2stacks*
> 
> Got a kaby lake i7700 In route can't wait to get it in and pop the top. So whats the best liquid metal out now it seem that everyone is liking the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut. I have some coollaboratory pro left over from some of my last delids should I grab up some Thermal grizzly? What's the census these day's?


I heard the Thermal Grizzly is the best with the CLU being the best price/celsius. But honestly.. It's probably 3 degrees max difference between the best and worst LM? If you have CLP laying around I'd just put that on it..


----------



## DRKreiger

So I just got a 4690k (well 2 weeks ago) and delidded it. I knocked off the top 2 micro caps. Still posts and works great. BUT, the IGP is not longer functioning. I assume I crippled the power source for the on die GPU by knocking off the caps. OH WELL

My main reason for the post is this. Before the Delid, and subsequent damaged IGP. I was requiring a considerable amount more voltage for a lower clock in most voltage settings.

Input voltage requirements went from 2.12, all the way down to 1.75. Core voltage for 4.7 CPU, and 4.2 cache is 1.248V's.

Previous to this 4.5ghz cpu required 1.271. Cache was not stable past 3.8ghz with any voltage.

The temps have come down quite a bit. prime 95 v26.6 small fft loads to 64 C°. Before delid (and damage) at 4.5 reached 76-78 C°

So has anyone else experienced anything else similar to this?


----------



## Ceadderman

For warranty question earlier in the last 20 posts...

iirc Intel will honor their warranty so long as you purchase the extended plan. Not sure whether this applies to extending within the original period or all chips. But iiarc, it's about $60 more or less.









Just search this thread for confirmation.









~Ceadder


----------



## Buska103

Hey guys, I run a direct die waterblock on my 4670K and am finally thinking about trying out CLU/CLP.
Anyone know how it reacts with nickel plated copper (stains, etc)?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buska103*
> 
> Hey guys, I run a direct die waterblock on my 4670K and am finally thinking about trying out CLU/CLP.
> Anyone know how it reacts with nickel plated copper (stains, etc)?


Its perfectly fine, might etch it very very slightly over time but it doesnt really matter. Im running it on my copper block and all it did was stain the copper and fill in the pours so im ok with that. Its supposed to be even better on nickel cuz its nickel plated.


----------



## escalibur

It's been a while but I'm back in business.







7700K delided with Rockit 88. Using Liquid Ultra + Thermal Grizzly Kyronaut:



4,8GHz just to test the temps. OC hasn't even started yet.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Buska103*
> 
> Hey guys, I run a direct die waterblock on my 4670K and am finally thinking about trying out CLU/CLP.
> Anyone know how it reacts with nickel plated copper (stains, etc)?


You can buy some copper polish and make it shine after use if it does stain..


----------



## jonathan1107

This thread is so huge. I went to check how to delid an i7 7700k on the first page but there's only mentions of Ivy bridge and haswell.

Could the thread be updated to include the specific little bits about kaby Lake?


----------



## OutlawII

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *escalibur*
> 
> It's been a while but I'm back in business.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 7700K delided with Rockit 88. Using Liquid Ultra + Thermal Grizzly Kyronaut:
> 
> 
> 
> 4,8GHz just to test the temps. OC hasn't even started yet.


I just ordered the Rockit 88,hopefully gets here this week. Did you order the white model or the black one? They look the same


----------



## brenopapito

I delided my 7700K yesterday, is it recommended to reapply the thermal paste and CLU after how long time?


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan1107*
> 
> This thread is so huge. I went to check how to delid an i7 7700k on the first page but there's only mentions of Ivy bridge and haswell.
> 
> Could the thread be updated to include the specific little bits about kaby Lake?


Just follow the instructions of whatever delid tool you have. Nothing special about Kaby other than don't delid without tool








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *brenopapito*
> 
> I delided my 7700K yesterday, is it recommended to reapply the thermal paste and CLU after how long time?


After temps get worse. If they start to rise it's time to reapply although I never heard of someone who had to do that?


----------



## StullenAndi

Tried something different, maybe you like it


----------



## Ceadderman

Bad video link no playback.









~Ceadder


----------



## Chrisch

try this


----------



## skingun

+rep


----------



## ROKUGAN

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> try this


Superb, well done!


----------



## Ryahn

I am thinking about attempting this fate. I have an i7 5960X (Ya, $1150). Currently with [email protected] and a 4.3 OC, I get 89-92C depending.

Is it possible with this CPU and would it be worth it?


----------



## 6u4rdi4n

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ryahn*
> 
> I am thinking about attempting this fate. I have an i7 5960X (Ya, $1150). Currently with [email protected] and a 4.3 OC, I get 89-92C depending.
> 
> Is it possible with this CPU and would it be worth it?


Possible? No, maybe. Worth it? Definitely not. i7 5960X are soldered.


----------



## Ryahn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *6u4rdi4n*
> 
> Possible? No, maybe. Worth it? Definitely not. i7 5960X are soldered.


Well darn. Thanks for the answer.


----------



## lever2stacks

I just delidded my 7700k. Do I need to cover the 4 contacts near the die with finger nail polish before I apply my clu for safety measures?


----------



## lever2stacks

Nevermind I just did it with out the nail polish no problems so far. I haven't loaded into Windows yet but I already see a 10 degree drop in idle temps in bios.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ryahn*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *6u4rdi4n*
> 
> Possible? No, maybe. Worth it? Definitely not. i7 5960X are soldered.
> 
> 
> 
> Well darn. Thanks for the answer.
Click to expand...

It can be done with a clothes iron. Search this thread for AMD or 5970k and you will have success stories.









~Ceadder


----------



## jonathan1107

Wish me luck!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan1107*
> 
> Wish me luck!


*wishes profusely*


----------



## jonathan1107

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> *wishes profusely*











Looks good.

Let's see if boots


----------



## jonathan1107

To clean the Die paste. Same method as traditional paste removal?

Isopropyl alcohol?


----------



## MooMoo

Looks like you scratched it lil bit.


----------



## jonathan1107

Where?


----------



## jonathan1107

Can I use clu between the ihs and water block as well?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan1107*
> 
> Can I use clu between the ihs and water block as well?


Yes but why would you? Once it hardens of fuses together you'll wish you hadn't haha.


----------



## OutlawII

Between your index finger and thumb is that a scratch?oooooo


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OutlawII*
> 
> Between your index finger and thumb is that a scratch?oooooo


I see those as well, another one in the top right corner. It looks like it missed all the traces so should be fine.


----------



## Ceadderman

That seems like that spot is too straight to be a "scratch", but I don't know so members it cud be.









~Ceadder


----------



## jonathan1107

CPU is officially fine!
It boots. Hallelujah

4.8ghz for now. Just a test run. On air using clu = load temps = 50c avg

Holy cow!


----------



## skingun

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan1107*
> 
> CPU is officially fine!
> It boots. Hallelujah
> 
> 4.8ghz for now. Just a test run. On air using clu = load temps = 50c avg
> 
> Holy cow!


Under stress?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Finally reapplied Tim (PHOBYA LM) to my bare mount. Opened it up last night to swap motherboards (going back to the Classified, ditching the Gryphon) and it was dry as a bone. Just really, super dry. I noticed my temps had gone up a bit, but it never looked this dry under there.

I'll have to look when the last time I applied, but it was no more than a few months ago and I thought I used a decent amount last time. The only thing I can really think of, is I rotated the cpu block last time so the die was touching "fresh" parts of the block base. There was almost no staining at all on these parts of the base when I took it apart so this time I tried "priming" the base of the block a bit with LM and also used a bit more on this application than the last.

Hoping to see those sweet, sexy temps once again when I finish up this afternoon








Edit: no pics cause I'm a bit daft lol


----------



## jonathan1107

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *skingun*
> 
> Under stress?


Yes prime 95 blend test

Do I need to apply clu both on the CPU ihs and the water block?

Or just on the CPU ihs which will make contact with water block?

Reason I'm asking is because water block is considerably larger than cpu ihs therefore hard to determine where to apply clu on water block without having some touch outside the ihs perimeter


----------



## gopanthersgo1

Hello, I'm sorry if this has been asked before (I searched to no avail), but is there a 3D printable Ivy Bridge delid tool? Thanks!


----------



## paskowitz

So it looks like my CPU *may* be dead. I have to do some final testing but I am putting my chances at <20%. Intel is sending me a replacement as I am still in warranty. Obviously since I am in this thread... my CPU is delided. And since I am on this site... it has been overclocked. How boned am I? Any chance they will take a relided CPU? What paste and adhesive should I use? Would the Intel overclocking warranty plan this be a good idea at this point?


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> So it looks like my CPU *may* be dead. I have to do some final testing but I am putting my chances at <20%. Intel is sending me a replacement as I am still in warranty. Obviously since I am in this thread... my CPU is delided. And since I am on this site... it has been overclocked. How boned am I? Any chance they will take a relided CPU? What paste and adhesive should I use? Would the Intel overclocking warranty plan this be a good idea at this point?


How did you managed to kill it ?! let the details pour over us peasants!








As far as I know if you send it "re-sealed" and they figure it out you face RMA fraud ..
Have a look at these and these. Happy reading


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> How did you managed to kill it ?! let the details pour over us peasants!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As far as I know if you send it "re-sealed" and they figure it out you face RMA fraud ..
> Have a look at these and these. Happy reading


It's pretty ridiculous. One day my OS freezes. NBD, I'll just hard reset. Then I get a 00 post code and a lit CPU Q-LED (power resets, then hangs). No BIOS, no OS. Call Asus, RMA mobo. Next day, out of nowhere my systems POSTs and gets to the OS. I run stock BIOS settings and stress tests, no problems. I am obviously confused. Mobo short? IDK. Then I shut my PC off and the 00 no BIOS comes back (same as original issue). So I send in my mobo thinking it must be the mobo. Nope, Asus says it is fine. PSU is fine. RAM is fine. Only thing I have not swapped out or alt system tested is the CPU (only have the one). My 4790K has worked since the day I got it, until this incident.

I have no intention of pissing off Intel. I can get a 4790K for about $250, not the "end of the world". I figured, and likely erroneously, that I might as well try the warranty process. I am just wondering what actually happens in this situation? I guess if there is a problem, I send back the CPU they sent me. They charged me for the CPU they are sending me so I guess they could just stick me with that bill (which I would be ok with).


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*


Really hard to tell what would happen as not a lot of people who have done it have posted back feedback...
Real world scenario...you could play the "I don't know" card and pretend your IT friends suggested you to do that...and offer to return the new CPU or pay for it ( maybe you get lucky and they send a golden chip lol*) I really do not know what to say...


----------



## Surprentis

So this is probably a dumb question but I'm going to delid my ivy bridge with a tool i bought from rockit ( this place http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/ ) and was wondering can I just put it back in my computer just like that without the lid and use some really good stuff like coollabratory liquid ultra thermal paste? I see some people apply paste under the lid and I guess they re-lid it??? Whats better to do? Really just want to know if its fine to put it back in like that using AIR (my coolers is this COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO RR-212E-20PK-R2 and has two noctua fans on it)

Thanks
Joe


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeSamo86*
> 
> So this is probably a dumb question but I'm going to delid my ivy bridge with a tool i bought from rockit ( this place http://rockitcool.myshopify.com/ ) and was wondering can I just put it back in my computer just like that without the lid and use some really good stuff like coollabratory liquid ultra thermal paste? I see some people apply paste under the lid and I guess they re-lid it??? Whats better to do? Really just want to know if its fine to put it back in like that using AIR (my coolers is this COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO RR-212E-20PK-R2 and has two noctua fans on it)
> 
> Thanks
> Joe


99% of people put the lid back on because it can be dangerous and a pita to run naked. The only known kit i know of is the EKWB bare die kit for its waterblocks (works on pretty much everything that has a base big enough to cover the cpu socket as it ends up sitting on the socket and not the actual standoffs, tested this with pressure paper).

I personally wouldn't do it with a hyper 212, ive never seen anyone do it and my guess is there's a reason why. Depending on voltage and cooler you might see anywhere from 1°C to 7-8°C going from delided to bare die.


----------



## Surprentis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 99% of people put the lid back on because it can be dangerous and a pita to run naked. The only known kit i know of is the EKWB bare die kit for its waterblocks (works on pretty much everything that has a base big enough to cover the cpu socket as it ends up sitting on the socket and not the actual standoffs, tested this with pressure paper).
> 
> I personally wouldn't do it with a hyper 212, ive never seen anyone do it and my guess is there's a reason why. Depending on voltage and cooler you might see anywhere from 1°C to 7-8°C going from delided to bare die.


Blue thank you for the insight


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jonathan1107*
> 
> Can I use clu between the ihs and water block as well?


Like I mentioned, I would prefer use of normal TIM, something like Gelid Extreme (very high end) CLU can harden as mentioned before, then its a real nightmare.


----------



## HowYesNo

guys/ for how long does it take for permatex black silicone do dry and become firm. I delided my cpu and left it under pressure with silicone applied for 2 hours i wanted to see did it stick firmly, and moved it. Now got to do it again.
Also a bigger issue, not sure about 4 contacts in upper left corner, while cleaning adhesive with paper tissue i might rubbed one slightly.see photos before and after. Did i kill my CPU?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> guys/ for how long does it take for permatex black silicone do dry and become firm. I delided my cpu and left it under pressure with silicone applied for 2 hours i wanted to see did it stick firmly, and moved it. Now got to do it again.
> Also a bigger issue, not sure about 4 contacts in upper left corner, while cleaning adhesive with paper tissue i might rubbed one slightly.see photos before and after. Did i kill my CPU?


Looks fine to me, only way to really know is put it into a board and see if it boots honestly. With the silicon, this can be really hard as the PCB is very flat with hardly any surface for the silicon to grab onto. This can make the re-lidding process quite trouble some. I still recommend people dont re-lid and just place the IHS back on when installing, like the OP states.


----------



## HowYesNo

Well here is second attempt.Gonna leave it over night. I will probably spend the night praying i didn't kill my cpu.
Where am I going to find another with this one dead, at ebay it's around 80 -100 US.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> Well here is second attempt.Gonna leave it over night. I will probably spend the night praying i didn't kill my cpu.
> Where am I going to find another with this one dead, at ebay it's around 80 -100 US.


Just dont use silicon to begin with or just do it in the 4 corners. Silicon takes a good while to actually dry up and seal its a nightmare.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> Well here is second attempt.Gonna leave it over night. I will probably spend the night praying i didn't kill my cpu.
> Where am I going to find another with this one dead, at ebay it's around 80 -100 US.


My tube of silicon glue suggests letting it dry for 24 hours..


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> guys/ for how long does it take for permatex black silicone do dry and become firm. I delided my cpu and left it under pressure with silicone applied for 2 hours i wanted to see did it stick firmly, and moved it. Now got to do it again.
> Also a bigger issue, not sure about 4 contacts in upper left corner, while cleaning adhesive with paper tissue i might rubbed one slightly.see photos before and after. Did i kill my CPU?


I believe the amount of silicone, temperature, humidity, would all be factors in the drying time.

I left my 6700K, with a tiny dot of PermaTex black applied to each corner of the IHS, in my Rockit88 re-lid jig for eight hours, before I installed it.


----------



## OutlawII

Just put mine back together temps went from 77 to 59 running x264,what a difference WOWOW!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OutlawII*
> 
> Just put mine back together temps went from 77 to 59 running x264,what a difference WOWOW!


Yeeeeeees, rejoice in the world of moding


----------



## Tristanguy1224

Am I correct that Prime95 v28.9 build 2 has AVX instructions? Because if so. WOW.... No really.... Temps went from 88c to 73c on the hottest core. Hell even if it doesn't use AVX that's still an amazing drop in temps! SAME SETTINGS!!!!


----------



## jprovido

Just delidded my i7 7700k today with the rockit88 delid tool











used coolab liquid ultra and arctic mx4 tim

one run of cinebench @ 4.8ghz same settings

before delid


after delid


temps dropped by 22.5 degrees on average. this is unbelievable


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> Just delidded my i7 7700k today with the rockit88 delid tool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> temps dropped by 22.5 degrees on average. this is unbelievable




I have my Rockit88 on the way. Excite!


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> Just delidded my i7 7700k today with the rockit88 delid tool
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> used coolab liquid ultra and arctic mx4 tim
> 
> one run of cinebench @ 4.8ghz same settings
> 
> before delid
> 
> 
> after delid
> 
> 
> temps dropped by 22.5 degrees on average. this is unbelievable


Yep I got a temp drop of 25C with my delid. I also drove to Rockit's place of business and picked up my kit and got to see around the office.


----------



## paskowitz

I had a nice email conversation with James. If all goes well we may see some new, interesting offerings from his shop pretty soon.


----------



## HowYesNo

guys, I want to report that thanks to almighty above I did not kill my CPU.
did a short prime test and I am seeing around 15 -18C lover temps.

OCN name: HowYesNo
CPU: 3570K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS TIM: Coolermaster MasterGel Maker
Mhz gained: ? did not try to go above frequency before deliding
OC after delid: 4,6Ghz
before

after


still not sure about i contact in upper left corner, but hey it works.


----------



## OutlawII

Anyone who wants to delid let me know i have the tool


----------



## DRKreiger

I had asked a few pages back about anyone having damaged the IGP only, and having more head room for OC, lower temps, and lower voltages.

am i alone in this experience???


----------



## DRKreiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> guys, I want to report that thanks to almighty above I did not kill my CPU.
> did a short prime test and I am seeing around 15 -18C lover temps.
> 
> OCN name: HowYesNo
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: Coolermaster MasterGel Maker
> Mhz gained: ? did not try to go above frequency before deliding
> OC after delid: 4,6Ghz
> before
> 
> after
> 
> 
> still not sure about i contact in upper left corner, but hey it works.


It looks like the 7700k has some really bad TIM application.


----------



## OutlawII

Yours dont look to bad mine was dry and almost crumbly


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DRKreiger*
> 
> I had asked a few pages back about anyone having damaged the IGP only, and having more head room for OC, lower temps, and lower voltages.
> 
> am i alone in this experience???


I've never heard of such a thing but you've got my interest. I've always wondered why they waste the die space with IGP on high end unlocked CPUs. How did you damage the IGP only?


----------



## DRKreiger

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I've never heard of such a thing but you've got my interest. I've always wondered why they waste the die space with IGP on high end unlocked CPUs. How did you damage the IGP only?


I was delidding the chip with a razor, and clipped the top 2 micro caps next to the die knocking them off. Was so sure i turned my chip into a potato. But it turned out that it was the power conditioner/supply for the HD4600 IGP. The bios sees it (likely due to the mnicorcode ID) but has no voltage registered, nor does it output video.


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DRKreiger*
> 
> I had asked a few pages back about anyone having damaged the IGP only, and having more head room for OC, lower temps, and lower voltages.
> 
> am i alone in this experience???


How much more headroom, and whats the delta on the temps and voltages? I can't imagine it being a significant amount, not worth deliberately damaging the pcb and effectively disabling the iGPU at least.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DRKreiger*
> 
> I was delidding the chip with a razor, and clipped the top 2 micro caps next to the die knocking them off. Was so sure i turned my chip into a potato. But it turned out that it was the power conditioner/supply for the HD4600 IGP. The bios sees it (likely due to the mnicorcode ID) but has no voltage registered, nor does it output video.


hm, I wonder how different that is from just disabling igp in the bios







(no I'm not going to rip caps off my 4790k)


----------



## DRKreiger

I am not recommending in any way doing this. But if there is a way of disabling the IGP, it may help.

I was at: 4.5 Ghz 1.287v's, 3.9 cache, 1.21v's, Input voltage of 2.15 temps of 80° ish in IBT, - 75° in prime small FFT.- AIDA 64: 68°

now at: 4.7 1.248V's, 4.2 cache 1.179V's, input voltage 1.7V's. Temps of 70°-72° IBT, 65° Prime Small FFT, AIDA64 58°


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DRKreiger*
> 
> It looks like the 7700k has some really bad TIM application.


Oh God i hope we're not starting the "Intel TIM is bad debate" are we?


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Oh God i hope we're not starting the "Intel TIM is bad debate" are we?


Not only is the TIM bad but the adhesive they use to stick the IHS on is too thick which causes a larger gap between it and the die. I have also never seen a single delid where the TIM wasn't spilling over onto the PCB. I don't understand how hard it is to have a perfect amount of TIM in a straight line put on the die by a machine so when the lid comes down it will spread it nicely with no overflow.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Not only is the TIM bad but the adhesive they use to stick the IHS on is too thick which causes a larger gap between it and the die. I have also never seen a single delid where the TIM wasn't spilling over onto the PCB. I don't understand how hard it is to have a perfect amount of TIM in a straight line put on the die by a machine so when the lid comes down it will spread it nicely with no overflow.


The spilling over isn't a problem, pretty much all GPUs ive taken apart have the same problem. The issue is the pressure the IHS DOESN'T put on the die, the .06mm (sometimes more) gap the glue ends up causing, and all this and ONLY all this keeps the DECENT thermal paste from working correctly.

The intel TIM can't be any worse then the TIMs packaged in some coolers and waterblocks ie cooler master and ekwb (on there gpu blocks), everything else is pretty much the same TIM, same composition.


----------



## jprovido

wow 5.1ghz and still got destroyed by ryzen at stock. AMD is crazy man


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> 
> 
> wow 5.1ghz and still got destroyed by ryzen at stock. AMD is crazy man


Source?


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> Source?


Don't feed the troll







. He is comparing 6/8 cores to 4 cores. Single core values is a different story.


----------



## jprovido

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> Source?



Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> Don't feed the troll
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . He is comparing 6/8 cores to 4 cores. Single core values is a different story.


troll? that is *MY* Delidded 7700k.

yea it got destroyed on single threaded but the 1700x was still on stock. if it can overclock to atleast 4.5ghz whew I see a lot of us intel boys switching to team red


----------



## Malinkadink

I mean its a 3.5ghz 8 core vs a 5.1ghz 4 core. Beats it in overall, loses in single core, and it will still lose at single core but not by quite as much at say 4ghz. By the looks of it i dont think the 8 cores will get to 4.5ghz successfully, maybe 4.3 at the most? Still not terrible. The 1600X i believe will steal the show, I can see it getting 4.5ghz, perhaps even more, regardless the 6 core will tear intel's margins apart if they dont start slashing prices.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> 
> troll? that is *MY* Delidded 7700k.
> 
> yea it got destroyed on single threaded but the 1700x was still on stock. if it can overclock to atleast 4.5ghz whew I see a lot of us intel boys switching to team red


They needed ln2 for a 5.1 or 5.2 GHz overclock.. I fear for overclockability..


----------



## geriatricpollywog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> They needed ln2 for a 5.1 or 5.2 GHz overclock.. I fear for overclockability..


What's the LN2 record on Kaby? 7ghz?


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> They needed ln2 for a 5.1 or 5.2 GHz overclock.. I fear for overclockability..


That was on all cores though, aren't some of these records done where just the 1 core reached that high of a clockspeed? But i agree 5ghz+ requiring LN2 means these CPUs won't go too far past stock, at least not the 8 cores. Linus' video showed/mentioned 4.1ghz, so i can see a manual OC getting 4.2-4.3. It's not ground-breaking but think about it, a $400 8 core 16 thread cpu at broadwell levels of IPC running at 4.3ghz and using less power than intel counterparts. That's still a success.


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0451*
> 
> What's the LN2 record on Kaby? 7ghz?


Some guys are running Super Pi 32m at 7150MHz at 2/2 or 3/3 , tho it's a single threaded bench. At 4/8 I'm stuck just under 6700MHz due to heat, new cpu pot should help me hit or pass that. My Cinebench R15 score is 1500, the 7700k record is 1546 done at 6850MHz.

http://hwbot.org/submission/3446546_hideo_cinebench___r15_core_i7_7700k_1546_cb


----------



## geriatricpollywog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> Some guys are running Super Pi 32m at 7150MHz at 2/2 or 3/3 , tho it's a single threaded bench. At 4/8 I'm stuck just under 6700MHz due to heat, new cpu pot should help me hit or pass that. My Cinebench R15 score is 1500, the 7700k record is 1546 done at 6850MHz.
> 
> http://hwbot.org/submission/3446546_hideo_cinebench___r15_core_i7_7700k_1546_cb


Well, I hope you are sponsored. That's unreal. What is your sustained OC under water or air?


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0451*
> 
> Well, I hope you are sponsored. That's unreal. What is your sustained OC under water or air?


Only have this es 7700k at the moment and only did this test on water. I have a Single Stage phase so quick bin only on water then to SS to see if scales with cold before LN2. Recently started to work with Asrock since I love M OC Formula and the team,



http://imgur.com/sueM2


----------



## paskowitz

I'm going to assume something around 5.5Ghz with 1.4-1.5v is the max on water.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> I'm going to assume something around 5.5Ghz with 1.4-1.5v is the max on water.


Talking about Kaby or Zen?


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> Talking about Kaby or Zen?


Kaby. And a golden chip at that.


----------



## savagebunny

So my h80i GT took a dump a while ago, grabbed a Arctic Liquid Freezer closed loop. Still the same as before. 4790k delid @ 4.6 1.260vcore, 1.810vccin.


----------



## Tilmitt

Hi all,

After some massive trials and tribulations I managed to get some good results from my delid.
I used the vice-only method. It was really easy.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








Initially I tried to run naked with a die guard but I couldn't get good contact with my heatsink.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







After that I tried with the lid back on but I couldn't make good contact. My temps were worse than before delid. It looked like only the sides were contacting ok.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








So I lapped the IHS. I used 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 & 2000 grit paper. Unfortunately I didn't do a great job but it did seem get rid of the convexity on the IHS.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








As you can see taping the capacitors on the CPU was a good idea. I tend to get CLU all over the place









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







I went a bit light on the CLU application as that seems to be the recommendation although I always felt it could do with a bit more.


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!










OCN name: Tilmitt
CPU: i5-4670K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU
Mhz gained: Not tested yet
OC after delid: 4.2GHz
Temp drops: 15+
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jt9dca

I'm using a Noctua NH-L12 in an ITX build so the cooling capacity is very limited. I'm at 4.2GHz 1.225v which would throttle after reaching 101 degrees in OCCT Linpack with AVX enabled. Now I'm at about 86 degrees under the same test so that's at least 15 degrees gained considering it probably would've gone higher than 101 pre-delid except for the throttling.

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. I spent much time reading it, it's an amazing resource. I'm thinking I might buy an AIO cooler and have the rad placed on top of my case since I never put the lid on it anymore anyway. I guess it would give a massive gain over my NH-L12.


----------



## WarThox

OCN name: Warthox
CPU: I7-6700k
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: 2000
OC after delid: 48x 1.45v bios, 1.44 vdroop
Temp drops: 25*C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jt3ma5

This was the best I could do at 46x because of the temps, max = 89*C


Now this is after delid with the rockit88, max =65*C


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tilmitt*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> After some massive trials and tribulations I managed to get some good results from my delid.
> I used the vice-only method. It was really easy.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Initially I tried to run naked with a die guard but I couldn't get good contact with my heatsink.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After that I tried with the lid back on but I couldn't make good contact. My temps were worse than before delid. It looked like only the sides were contacting ok.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I lapped the IHS. I used 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 & 2000 grit paper. Unfortunately I didn't do a great job but it did seem get rid of the convexity on the IHS.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see taping the capacitors on the CPU was a good idea. I tend to get CLU all over the place
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went a bit light on the CLU application as that seems to be the recommendation although I always felt it could do with a bit more.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Tilmitt
> CPU: i5-4670K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: Not tested yet
> OC after delid: 4.2GHz
> Temp drops: 15+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jt9dca
> 
> I'm using a Noctua NH-L12 in an ITX build so the cooling capacity is very limited. I'm at 4.2GHz 1.225v which would throttle after reaching 101 degrees in OCCT Linpack with AVX enabled. Now I'm at about 86 degrees under the same test so that's at least 15 degrees gained considering it probably would've gone higher than 101 pre-delid except for the throttling.
> 
> Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. I spent much time reading it, it's an amazing resource. I'm thinking I might buy an AIO cooler and have the rad placed on top of my case since I never put the lid on it anymore anyway. I guess it would give a massive gain over my NH-L12.


Don't run CLU on your IHS, it solidifies and doesn't have any cooling benefit. Awesome job with everything though! (Maybe a little too generous with the CLU application on the die, I advice putting some tape around the die and wiping away the exess.)


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> Don't run CLU on your IHS, it solidifies and doesn't have any cooling benefit. Awesome job with everything though! (Maybe a little too generous with the CLU application on the die, I advice putting some tape around the die and wiping away the exess.)


IMO the solidifying isn't really a problem because you can just hair dryer the CPU area for a couple seconds and it instantly removes any viscosity. Removing the CPU block/cooler right after the system was on also works. In terms of temp benefit, yeah it is pretty minimal compared to a quality TIM like Grizzly. Compared to something like AS5 or stock paste, there is a noticeable difference though. Biggest reason not to is the risk of getting some place it shouldn't be.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> IMO the solidifying isn't really a problem because you can just hair dryer the CPU area for a couple seconds and it instantly removes any viscosity. Removing the CPU block/cooler right after the system was on also works. In terms of temp benefit, yeah it is pretty minimal compared to a quality TIM like Grizzly. Compared to something like AS5 or stock paste, there is a noticeable difference though. Biggest reason not to is the risk of getting some place it shouldn't be.


Considering the top 10 TIMs are all within 1-2°C of each other its really totally pointless to run a liquid metal on top of the ihs. Once it solidies it doesnt re-melt and become liquid again lol, it pretty much stays solid. Its why when i remove my waterblock from my bare die cpu the cpu comes along with it, and thats with it running a 10min stress test prior to turning off.


----------



## PentiumK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tilmitt*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> After some massive trials and tribulations I managed to get some good results from my delid.
> I used the vice-only method. It was really easy.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Initially I tried to run naked with a die guard but I couldn't get good contact with my heatsink.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After that I tried with the lid back on but I couldn't make good contact. My temps were worse than before delid. It looked like only the sides were contacting ok.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I lapped the IHS. I used 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 & 2000 grit paper. Unfortunately I didn't do a great job but it did seem get rid of the convexity on the IHS.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see taping the capacitors on the CPU was a good idea. I tend to get CLU all over the place
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went a bit light on the CLU application as that seems to be the recommendation although I always felt it could do with a bit more.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Tilmitt
> CPU: i5-4670K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: Not tested yet
> OC after delid: 4.2GHz
> Temp drops: 15+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jt9dca
> 
> I'm using a Noctua NH-L12 in an ITX build so the cooling capacity is very limited. I'm at 4.2GHz 1.225v which would throttle after reaching 101 degrees in OCCT Linpack with AVX enabled. Now I'm at about 86 degrees under the same test so that's at least 15 degrees gained considering it probably would've gone higher than 101 pre-delid except for the throttling.
> 
> Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. I spent much time reading it, it's an amazing resource. I'm thinking I might buy an AIO cooler and have the rad placed on top of my case since I never put the lid on it anymore anyway. I guess it would give a massive gain over my NH-L12.


I got that same particular die guard and never got it to work. Although it sits flush with the cpu die surface, it had an issue that it doesn't make adequate pressure to collapse the pins on the socket, no matter how much pressure is applied from the waterblock/heatsink, the system refuses to post and just gives 00 post code. This was with Asus Maximus 6 Impact board which I believe use Foxconn type socket. Either it has issues with manufacturing tolerances or it might be designed for different board with different socket type.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> guys, I want to report that thanks to almighty above I did not kill my CPU.
> did a short prime test and I am seeing around 15 -18C lover temps.
> 
> OCN name: HowYesNo
> CPU: 3570K
> On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: Coolermaster MasterGel Maker
> Mhz gained: ? did not try to go above frequency before deliding
> OC after delid: 4,6Ghz
> before
> 
> after
> 
> 
> still not sure about i contact in upper left corner, but hey it works.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tilmitt*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> After some massive trials and tribulations I managed to get some good results from my delid.
> I used the vice-only method. It was really easy.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Initially I tried to run naked with a die guard but I couldn't get good contact with my heatsink.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After that I tried with the lid back on but I couldn't make good contact. My temps were worse than before delid. It looked like only the sides were contacting ok.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So I lapped the IHS. I used 400, 600, 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 & 2000 grit paper. Unfortunately I didn't do a great job but it did seem get rid of the convexity on the IHS.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see taping the capacitors on the CPU was a good idea. I tend to get CLU all over the place
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went a bit light on the CLU application as that seems to be the recommendation although I always felt it could do with a bit more.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Tilmitt
> CPU: i5-4670K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU
> Mhz gained: Not tested yet
> OC after delid: 4.2GHz
> Temp drops: 15+
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jt9dca
> 
> I'm using a Noctua NH-L12 in an ITX build so the cooling capacity is very limited. I'm at 4.2GHz 1.225v which would throttle after reaching 101 degrees in OCCT Linpack with AVX enabled. Now I'm at about 86 degrees under the same test so that's at least 15 degrees gained considering it probably would've gone higher than 101 pre-delid except for the throttling.
> 
> Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. I spent much time reading it, it's an amazing resource. I'm thinking I might buy an AIO cooler and have the rad placed on top of my case since I never put the lid on it anymore anyway. I guess it would give a massive gain over my NH-L12.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WarThox*
> 
> 
> OCN name: Warthox
> CPU: I7-6700k
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: 2000
> OC after delid: 48x 1.45v bios, 1.44 vdroop
> Temp drops: 25*C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jt3ma5
> 
> This was the best I could do at 46x because of the temps, max = 89*C
> 
> 
> Now this is after delid with the rockit88, max =65*C


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Psilosoph8

I'm slowly piecing together my build and am buying parts each week with every paycheck, this week I decided to grab a 7700k along with a rockit88 delid and relid tool, plus loctite gel control + CLU, is there any harm if i get eager and delid it tomorrow even if the CPU won't be in a running system for a month or two?


----------



## Ceadderman

Only if you Bork the delid in your excitement.







lulz

But you need to meet all requirements to be entered to the club.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Psilosoph8*
> 
> I'm slowly piecing together my build and am buying parts each week with every paycheck, this week I decided to grab a 7700k along with a rockit88 delid and relid tool, plus loctite gel control + CLU, is there any harm if i get eager and delid it tomorrow even if the CPU won't be in a running system for a month or two?


I hope you waited for the Intel prices to go down thanks to Ryzen, i think the 7700k is 90$ off now or something like that.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I hope you waited for the Intel prices to go down thanks to Ryzen, i think the 7700k is 90$ off now or something like that.


isn't that all just regular Microcenter in-store pricing though? Didn't seem like anything new to me, their prices always make me wish I had one in town


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> isn't that all just regular Microcenter in-store pricing though? Didn't seem like anything new to me, their prices always make me wish I had one in town


I'm in France so all our prices are up the ass anyways haha. Wish i had something even remotely close though. Prices are according to this article so idk if they dropped yet or will drop in price.

http://wccftech.com/intel-amd-price-war-ryzen-processors/


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I'm in France so all our prices are up the ass anyways haha. Wish i had something even remotely close though. Prices are according to this article so idk if they dropped yet or will drop in price.
> 
> http://wccftech.com/intel-amd-price-war-ryzen-processors/


yeah that is basically a microcenter ad, same ridiculously low prices as the last couple years and nothing has changed. Also very deceptive for them to say "retailers" in the title since it is only one place and it is an in store only deal (like almost all their good deals)

I do bet prices will come down IF things actually work out the way AMD has been touting.

Speaking of which, has there been any talk/leaks of ryzen delids?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> yeah that is basically a microcenter ad, same ridiculously low prices as the last couple years and nothing has changed. Also very deceptive for them to say "retailers" in the title since it is only one place and it is an in store only deal (like almost all their good deals)
> 
> I do bet prices will come down IF things actually work out the way AMD has been touting.
> 
> Speaking of which, has there been any talk/leaks of ryzen delids?


Dunno but i already pre-ordered mine muahhah, r7 1700x here i come. If, and its a big if, they're using liquid metal/solder under the lid i don't see it being delided for any reason would truly be pointless. The rumors are though that they run fairly cool on air so i can't even imagine how nice it should run on water on my pc. Rough idea, my 4690k at 1.21v peaks at 49°C package temps, i have 2 cores that run at 41°C the other two are around 47°C, im hoping the ryzen runs around there (more then likely will run a bit hotter its clearly 8c/16t.

If they do need a delid i would absolutely love to delid mine and give it a test, lower temps are always welcome.


----------



## invincible20xx

man i remember this thread when i delided my 3770k 4 years ago !!!

i was scared while doing it lol


----------



## Tilmitt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PentiumK*
> 
> I got that same particular die guard and never got it to work. Although it sits flush with the cpu die surface, it had an issue that it doesn't make adequate pressure to collapse the pins on the socket, no matter how much pressure is applied from the waterblock/heatsink, the system refuses to post and just gives 00 post code. This was with Asus Maximus 6 Impact board which I believe use Foxconn type socket. Either it has issues with manufacturing tolerances or it might be designed for different board with different socket type.


Did you buy it from aliexpress? I bought some flower seeds there too and none of them germinated. Maybe the whole thing is just a scam!


----------



## PentiumK

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tilmitt*
> 
> Did you buy it from aliexpress? I bought some flower seeds there too and none of them germinated. Maybe the whole thing is just a scam!


Yeah bought it from aliexpress. I've seen people using it succesfully with different Asus boards, might be it just won't fit with the M6I or my unit happens to be faulty, not sure


----------



## KnightLion

OCN name: Kabylake
CPU: i7 7700k
on die-TIM: Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Deepcool Z9
Mhz gained: 500Mhz
OC after delid: 5Ghz
Temp drops: 15-20
CPU-Z validation of max OC: Still testing


----------



## madmeatballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnightLion*
> 
> OCN name: Kabylake
> CPU: i7 7700k
> on die-TIM: Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Deepcool Z9
> Mhz gained: 500Mhz
> OC after delid: 5Ghz
> Temp drops: 15-20
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Still testing


Nice! Was it hard to apply conductonaut?


----------



## KnightLion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> Nice! Was it hard to apply conductonaut?


Not so much on the CPU die as on the IHS, I just started with a circular motion and it "bonded" nicely. But it does come out the syringe quickly even with little to no pressure.


----------



## madmeatballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnightLion*
> 
> Not so much on the CPU die as on the IHS, I just started with a circular motion and it "bonded" nicely. But it does come out the syringe quickly even with little to no pressure.


have ever used clu before?


----------



## KnightLion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> have ever used clu before?


Not available in my country


----------



## Surprentis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 99% of people put the lid back on because it can be dangerous and a pita to run naked. The only known kit i know of is the EKWB bare die kit for its waterblocks (works on pretty much everything that has a base big enough to cover the cpu socket as it ends up sitting on the socket and not the actual standoffs, tested this with pressure paper).
> 
> I personally wouldn't do it with a hyper 212, ive never seen anyone do it and my guess is there's a reason why. Depending on voltage and cooler you might see anywhere from 1°C to 7-8°C going from delided to bare die.


Blue I have recently received conflicting PM's that 99% of people dont relid as you have said and I've been getting many PM's stating people just slap the cooler right back onto the de-lidded CPU, can someone else give me an opinion on this?

thanks


----------



## KnightLion

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/07/7600k_naked_die_cooling_temperature_followup/
Maybe this can help.
My personal opinion is to either reseal the IHS or just do the floating method, Im using the floating method.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeSamo86*
> 
> Blue I have recently received conflicting PM's that 99% of people dont relid as you have said and I've been getting many PM's stating people just slap the cooler right back onto the de-lidded CPU, can someone else give me an opinion on this?
> 
> thanks


On skylake/kabylake/(and more then likely coffeelake) i would absolutely always put the IHS back on. Its thicker then haswell/broadwell (which is bad for heat transfer) but it is a giant PITA to run those bare die. Has to do with how low the wafer sits in the cpu socket. They are also very prone to bending/breaking under force.

Honestly the best way to do it and to get best temps for Intel cpus PERIOD, delid, remove ALL the glue, if you can wet sand the top of the IHS and the bottom (not the part that touches the die but the part that touches the wafer, sand it a handful of times only), then use liquid metal, put the IHS back on and lock it down. No need for glue or super glue or silicon.

People need to understand that air is piss poor at heat transfer, liquid metals and TIMs are equally bad when used in a thick quantity (notice how i said thick and not just over used). You want the die and ihs to have perfect contact and perfect pressure, you DONT want a lot of TIM between the two surfaces. Compare the 300-400 w/mK of copper (ihs and quite possibly whatever the die is made of) to TIMs that max reach 12w/mK and liquid metals that reach 70w/mK max youll see why you don't want any to begin with (if we lived in a perfect world, we don't thats why we use TIM/LM).

Short answer. Yes put the IHS back on without silicon or glue, leave it as is.


----------



## jprovido

OCN name: jprovido
CPU: i7 7700k
on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Arctic MX4
Mhz gained: 300MHz
OC after delid: 5.1Ghz
Temp drops: 25-30
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/tml2vj

did I miss anything?


----------



## S0nny

I would love to join this if I could OC my 6400


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *S0nny*
> 
> I would love to join this if I could OC my 6400


There's only one person in the world that's de-lidded the AMD Athlon 6400+ windsor. http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2125351

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZmheiN4XOtqyuljGGHg4LR8UOsIW6Nby16QcSmQYCl0/pub?hl=en_GB&hl=en_GB&output=html

Click the AMD tab


----------



## KnightLion

So done testing.
OCN name: KnightLion
CPU: i7 7700k
on die-TIM: Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Deepcool Z9
Mhz gained: N/A
OC after delid: [email protected]
Temp drops: 15-20
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/f4jwll
Cooler: Corsair H115i

I'm happy with the 5Ghz @ 1.392v running stable for 2 days now and passed 8hr RealBench test.
Pics:


http://imgur.com/uI0NZ


----------



## Surprentis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnightLion*
> 
> http://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/07/7600k_naked_die_cooling_temperature_followup/
> Maybe this can help.
> My personal opinion is to either reseal the IHS or just do the floating method, Im using the floating method.


is the floating method where you just put it back in the cpu chassis on the mobo and just leave the ihs on like that without resealing it?


----------



## Surprentis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> On skylake/kabylake/(and more then likely coffeelake) i would absolutely always put the IHS back on. Its thicker then haswell/broadwell (which is bad for heat transfer) but it is a giant PITA to run those bare die. Has to do with how low the wafer sits in the cpu socket. They are also very prone to bending/breaking under force.
> 
> Honestly the best way to do it and to get best temps for Intel cpus PERIOD, delid, remove ALL the glue, if you can wet sand the top of the IHS and the bottom (not the part that touches the die but the part that touches the wafer, sand it a handful of times only), then use liquid metal, put the IHS back on and lock it down. No need for glue or super glue or silicon.
> 
> People need to understand that air is piss poor at heat transfer, liquid metals and TIMs are equally bad when used in a thick quantity (notice how i said thick and not just over used). You want the die and ihs to have perfect contact and perfect pressure, you DONT want a lot of TIM between the two surfaces. Compare the 300-400 w/mK of copper (ihs and quite possibly whatever the die is made of) to TIMs that max reach 12w/mK and liquid metals that reach 70w/mK max youll see why you don't want any to begin with (if we lived in a perfect world, we don't thats why we use TIM/LM).
> 
> Short answer. Yes put the IHS back on without silicon or glue, leave it as is.


Thanks Blue. Just started to get confused when I received PM's that you dont have to. Being a n00b I had to ask again.

Thanks


----------



## S0nny

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> There's only one person in the world that's de-lidded the AMD Athlon 6400+ windsor. http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2125351
> 
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZmheiN4XOtqyuljGGHg4LR8UOsIW6Nby16QcSmQYCl0/pub?hl=en_GB&hl=en_GB&output=html
> 
> Click the AMD tab


...i5 6400 ;-;


----------



## KnightLion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JoeSamo86*
> 
> is the floating method where you just put it back in the cpu chassis on the mobo and just leave the ihs on like that without resealing it?


Yeah you just hold the IHS in-place and clamp down the bracket, easy.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *S0nny*


...i5 6400 ;-;[/quote]


----------



## S0nny

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> ...i5 6400 ;-;












Yeah, so there isn't much of a point for me to delid....


----------



## bluej511

So i'm back. Seems like Ryzen is indeed SOLDERED!!!!!!!! Score +1 for me. Doesn't mean you can't delid it, der8auer has done it (and destroyed 2 chips in the process haha) but it looks like some of us might be able to run it bare die if need be. From what I've seen and hear they do run fairly cool on air and thats compared to a 7700k that just run hot to begin with.

Heres a video for you guys to enjoy. I'll wait to see if the temp drops are massive between IHS and no IHS then decide.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> So i'm back. Seems like Ryzen is indeed SOLDERED!!!!!!!! Score +1 for me. Doesn't mean you can't delid it, der8auer has done it (and destroyed 2 chips in the process haha) but it looks like some of us might be able to run it bare die if need be. From what I've seen and hear they do run fairly cool on air and thats compared to a 7700k that just run hot to begin with.
> 
> Heres a video for you guys to enjoy. I'll wait to see if the temp drops are massive between IHS and no IHS then decide.


Would you happen to know what TIM Intel uses for their soldered chips? Indium as well?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Would you happen to know what TIM Intel uses for their soldered chips? Indium as well?


Would be my guess yea, doubt they're using regular solder. Only their extreme editions are soldered so very hard to get a hold off. I do know for everything else they use dow corning TIM.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnightLion*
> 
> OCN name: Kabylake
> CPU: i7 7700k
> on die-TIM: Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Deepcool Z9
> Mhz gained: 500Mhz
> OC after delid: 5Ghz
> Temp drops: 15-20
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: Still testing


Your OCN name is KabyLake????
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jprovido*
> 
> OCN name: jprovido
> CPU: i7 7700k
> on die-TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX4
> Mhz gained: 300MHz
> OC after delid: 5.1Ghz
> Temp drops: 25-30
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/tml2vj
> 
> did I miss anything?


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KnightLion*
> 
> So done testing.
> OCN name: KnightLion
> CPU: i7 7700k
> on die-TIM: Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Deepcool Z9
> Mhz gained: N/A
> OC after delid: [email protected]392v
> Temp drops: 15-20
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/f4jwll
> Cooler: Corsair H115i
> 
> I'm happy with the 5Ghz @ 1.392v running stable for 2 days now and passed 8hr RealBench test.
> Pics:
> 
> 
> http://imgur.com/uI0NZ


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









I've Been looking at the "data sheet" of all the past users results from delidding. Would it interest anyone if I were to condense it to show the average drops in temps and gains in mhz speeds?


----------



## KnightLion

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your OCN name is KabyLake????
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've Been looking at the "data sheet" of all the past users results from delidding. Would it interest anyone if I were to condense it to show the average drops in temps and gains in mhz speeds?


Lol sorry for the first post ****** moment from my side, thanks though.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Your OCN name is KabyLake????
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've Been looking at the "data sheet" of all the past users results from delidding. Would it interest anyone if I were to condense it to show the average drops in temps and gains in mhz speeds?


I think it is safe to say this chip has a high chance of clocking to 5ghz with no problem. Well that is after delidding. I am at 5ghz @ 1.290v on water. My temps dropped 25c. More than happy to add me to the list. I posted a month or so back.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> I think it is safe to say this chip has a high chance of clocking to 5ghz with no problem. Well that is after delidding. I am at 5ghz @ 1.290v on water. My temps dropped 25c. More than happy to add me to the list. I posted a month or so back.


I don't mean to sound lazy, but could you find the post for your application? Or you can make a new one. Forgive me, not often that I miss someone


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I don't mean to sound lazy, but could you find the post for your application? Or you can make a new one. Forgive me, not often that I miss someone


Here. I redid the bench test. I was stable at 1.275v (a few weeks ago), but after playing RE7 for 3 hours it crashed. So I upped the voltage to 1.295 and haven't had any problems since. So here are my results.

5ghz @ 1.295v
Max temps 67c
Before temps reach into the 90s.
Everything on water.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Here. I redid the bench test. I was stable at 1.275v (a few weeks ago), but after playing RE7 for 3 hours it crashed. So I upped the voltage to 1.295 and haven't had any problems since. So here are my results.
> 
> 5ghz @ 1.295v
> Max temps 67c
> Before temps reach into the 90s.
> Everything on water.


67°C on water huh damn. Whats your setup?


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> 67°C on water huh damn. Whats your setup?


Last time I benched it was at 65c, but that was a fresh load into windows. I have been gaming for a few hours before I did that test. 2c isn't crap though. Here is my setup....

https://pcpartpicker.com/b/qmd6Mp

This was the old setup, but the loop is the exact same. Only difference now is the 7700k/Asus IX Hero/DDR4 Ram.

Here are idle temps after cooling down some....


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Last time I benched it was at 65c, but that was a fresh load into windows. I have been gaming for a few hours before I did that test. 2c isn't crap though. Here is my setup....
> 
> https://pcpartpicker.com/b/qmd6Mp
> 
> This was the old setup, but the loop is the exact same. Only difference now is the 7700k/Asus IX Hero/DDR4 Ram.
> 
> Here are idle temps after cooling down some....


Seems a bit hot for a dual rad setup no? My guess is, your front rad pushing in all that hot air in the case for the top rad to exhaust and get in warm air.

Sick setup though, i have 2 rads as well on my core x5 but have them both set to exhaust, got 3 intake fans up top works out pretty damn well. My water temp is usually 7°C above case temp. With my R7 1700x cpu coming in its going to add a bit more wattage to my system but should be fine.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Seems a bit hot for a dual rad setup no? My guess is, your front rad pushing in all that hot air in the case for the top rad to exhaust and get in warm air.
> 
> Sick setup though, i have 2 rads as well on my core x5 but have them both set to exhaust, got 3 intake fans up top works out pretty damn well. My water temp is usually 7°C above case temp. With my R7 1700x cpu coming in its going to add a bit more wattage to my system but should be fine.


Well first of all it is the Evolv ATX TG. Not best air flow case. Front 360 rad is intake. Top 360 rad is intake. Rear fan is exhaust. I have the top all taped off too. During gaming (which is all I do) temps are mid 40's to low 50's depending on game and time I play. GPU (1080 GTX OC'd to 2GHz) also sits mid 40's during gaming and sometimes hits low 50s on long sessions. The rads are also 360GTS which are very slim.

Res>Pump>Rad>GPU>Rad>CPU>Res


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Well first of all it is the Evolv ATX TG. Not best air flow case. Front 360 rad is intake. Top 360 rad is intake. Rear fan is exhaust. I have the top all taped off too. During gaming (which is all I do) temps are mid 40's to low 50's depending on game and time I play. GPU (1080 GTX OC'd to 2GHz) also sits mid 40's during gaming and sometimes hits low 50s on long sessions. The rads are also 360GTS which are very slim.
> 
> Res>Pump>Rad>GPU>Rad>CPU>Res


From the pic the front fans look like intake and the top as exhaust, unless youve switched em since then.









Too many intakes i think, hot air might just be sitting in the case. You could try the top as exhaust since its only a 240mm. I changed my rad config 2-3x before i got the temps i wanted.


----------



## becks

@eXistencelies

Wouldn't back intake...front and top exhaust with fans in pull (pull trough - not push trough - to exterior ) be the best option for that scenario ?


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> From the pic the front fans look like intake and the top as exhaust, unless youve switched em since then.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too many intakes i think, hot air might just be sitting in the case. You could try the top as exhaust since its only a 240mm. I changed my rad config 2-3x before i got the temps i wanted.


Actually had the top as exhaust before. Switched it to intake and it dropped by 1c. It was pulling in the cool air rather than the warm air inside. Also I'm running two 360mm rads.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> @eXistencelies
> 
> Wouldn't back intake...front and top exhaust with fans in pull (pull trough - not push trough - to exterior ) be the best option for that scenario ?


your post confuses me. Not trying to be rude.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*


No worries







) I'm hectic at times...

Have it like this: Rad-Fan -> rather than Fan-Rad...and make sure they are exhausting the air out of the case


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Actually had the top as exhaust before. Switched it to intake and it dropped by 1c. It was pulling in the cool air rather than the warm air inside. Also I'm running two 360mm rads.
> your post confuses me. Not trying to be rude.


He means set your rear fan as an intake and both rads as exhaust. Id normally agree but a single intake fan just wouldn't cut it.

Could be that your fans need more static pressure, idk what the fpi is on your rads. But its a sick setup none the less I'd just rather have you see it function even better haha. Its the perfectionist in me. I drained my loop 3x and setup my rads 3 different ways before sticking with one i like, should tell you something.

Them 7700k seem to love running hot though.


----------



## eXistencelies

edited


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> No worries
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) I'm hectic at times...
> 
> Have it like this: Rad-Fan -> rather than Fan-Rad...and make sure they are exhausting the air out of the case


I don't want to exhaust warm air through the rads. Top is pulling cool air through. Front is pushing cool air through. The single 140mm is just fine for exhausting. I have the top cavity of the case all taped off so warm air doesn't recirculate into the top to where the fans pull warm air back into the case.
He means set your rear fan as an intake and both rads as exhaust. Id normally agree but a single intake fan just wouldn't cut it.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> He means set your rear fan as an intake and both rads as exhaust. Id normally agree but a single intake fan just wouldn't cut it.
> 
> Could be that your fans need more static pressure, idk what the fpi is on your rads. But its a sick setup none the less I'd just rather have you see it function even better haha. Its the perfectionist in me. I drained my loop 3x and setup my rads 3 different ways before sticking with one i like, should tell you something.
> 
> Them 7700k seem to love running hot though.


I am running TT riing fans and they have good reviews for SP fans. Also 40's and sometimes low 50s during gaming is perfectly fine. I also live in Houston TX where it is pretty warm year round. I keep my home at 72C.

Here are my normal temps. Computer has been on for 15 mins and these are idle.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> I don't want to exhaust warm air through the rads. Top is pulling cool air through. Front is pushing cool air through. The single 140mm is just fine for exhausting. I have the top cavity of the case all taped off so warm air doesn't recirculate into the top to where the fans pull warm air back into the case.
> He means set your rear fan as an intake and both rads as exhaust. Id normally agree but a single intake fan just wouldn't cut it.
> I am running TT riing fans and they have good reviews for SP fans. Also 40's and sometimes low 50s during gaming is perfectly fine. I also live in Houston TX where it is pretty warm year round. I keep my home at 72C.
> 
> Here are my normal temps. Computer has been on for 15 mins and these are idle.


Yea those are my idle temps as well, sometimes ill dip into the 19s or so haha.

My gaming temps and load temps are the same on my cpu, a bit weird but considering they match, using intel utility stress test seems to work just fine. I have NO idea if it will work with my ryzen (i dont see why it shouldnt) but should be nice to compare the two. Its going to add around 50w or more so to my loop but i have so much overhead I'm good to go. My loop can dissipate about 500w+ and still have awesome temps, yours will be a bit more probably close to 600w or so for a delta T of 10°C between case temp and water temp. Also depends what speed you have the D5 running at. I run mine at 75% 3600rpm and i dont hear it for nothing.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> I keep my home at 72C


Uhhhh... damn, didn't realize global warming hit Texas that hard.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Uhhhh... damn, didn't realize global warming hit Texas that hard.


lol derp moment. Meant to say 72*. LOL


----------



## HowYesNo

guys, why is it after delid and using CLU in idle 1st core is always hotter than others? at load all cores are within 2C difference. (almost 20C lower than before delid).
core 1: 37C core 2: 27C core 3: 21C core 4: 25C
is that fine?
it's 3570K.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> guys, why is it after delid and using CLU in idle 1st core is always hotter than others? at load all cores are within 2C difference. (almost 20C lower than before delid).
> core 1: 37C core 2: 27C core 3: 21C core 4: 25C
> is that fine?
> it's 3570K.


i haven't experienced that on my 4790k, perhaps check your per core utilization and see if something is using that first core only? If they're all within 2c at load that's all i can think of


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> i haven't experienced that on my 4790k, perhaps check your per core utilization and see if something is using that first core only? If they're all within 2c at load that's all i can think of


Either that or bad clu application? Could be either/or. 10°C on one core after a delid is pretty damn high. Unless you have a core doing something it shouldnt its going to be CLU application.


----------



## DeathAngel74

OCN name: DeathAngel74
CPU: i7 6700k
on die-TIM: GELID GC XTREME
ihs-TIM: GELID GC XTREME
Mhz gained: 100mhz (from 4.6 ghz @ 1.370v)
OC after delid: 4.7ghz @ 1.409v
Temp drops: 15-20 (84C)
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/0kdee3
Cooler: Corsair H100i v2


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Here. I redid the bench test. I was stable at 1.275v (a few weeks ago), but after playing RE7 for 3 hours it crashed. So I upped the voltage to 1.295 and haven't had any problems since. So here are my results.
> 
> 5ghz @ 1.295v
> Max temps 67c
> Before temps reach into the 90s.
> Everything on water.


But... I need all the info... The OP has a list of things needed. Or provide as much as possible!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> OCN name: DeathAngel74
> CPU: i7 6700k
> on die-TIM: GELID GC XTREME
> ihs-TIM: GELID GC XTREME
> Mhz gained: 100mhz (from 4.6 ghz @ 1.370v)
> OC after delid: 4.7ghz @ 1.409v
> Temp drops: 15-20 (84C)
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/0kdee3
> Cooler: Corsair H100i v2


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## DeathAngel74

http://valid.x86.fr/g8ptzf


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> But... I need all the info... The OP has a list of things needed. Or provide as much as possible!
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Ok let's try this....

OCN name: eXistencelies
CPU: i7 7700k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: GELID GC XTREME
Mhz gained: 800mhz
OC after delid: 5ghz @ 1.295v
Temp drops: 25c
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/l28m2i
Cooler: XSPC Waterblock (Full Custom Loop)

and what goes in sig?


----------



## HowYesNo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> i haven't experienced that on my 4790k, perhaps check your per core utilization and see if something is using that first core only? If they're all within 2c at load that's all i can think of


ok. i am not eager to delid again, as i have to remove cooler clean it all up, put it back in, and I don't have isopropyl.
anyways load temps at 4,6Ghz Vcore 1,274 temps go max 66C for all core, so i think that to be fine.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Ok let's try this....
> 
> OCN name: eXistencelies
> CPU: i7 7700k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: GELID GC XTREME
> Mhz gained: 800mhz
> OC after delid: 5ghz @ 1.295v
> Temp drops: 25c
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/l28m2i
> Cooler: XSPC Waterblock (Full Custom Loop)
> 
> and what goes in sig?


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









Code:



Code:


[CENTER]:skull: [URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][B][Official] Delidded Crewman[/B][/URL] :skull:[/CENTER]


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> i haven't experienced that on my 4790k, perhaps check your per core utilization and see if something is using that first core only? If they're all within 2c at load that's all i can think of
> 
> 
> 
> ok. i am not eager to delid again, as i have to remove cooler clean it all up, put it back in, and I don't have isopropyl.
> anyways load temps at 4,6Ghz Vcore 1,274 temps go max 66C for all core, so i think that to be fine.
Click to expand...

You can pick Isopropyl up at any pharmacy on the cheap. ~2€/£/$

70% or greater is preferred. The less water in the bottle is best.

So if you can pick some up, I suggest doing so. If you're in the US48 then there is also Arctic Silver Creamer and Conditioner for ~7$. Which is my preferred option. Isopropyl when I am out.









~Ceadder


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> [CENTER]:skull: [URL=http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/delidded-ivy-bridge-club][B][Official] Delidded Crewman[/B][/URL] :skull:[/CENTER]


Ok so where I can find my sig? Looked everywhere and I feel dumb not being able to find it like any other forum lol.


----------



## Taint3dBulge

Hey guys, So I delidded my cpu afew months ago and used Grizzly Kryonaut to replace the stock tim. Only saw afew deg C difference. So now i have ordered the CLU liquid metal but am wondering since i super glued the heat spreader back on, will it harm the pcb of the cpu using the delidder tool from der8auer delid tool? Also best way to get rid of the superglue on the pcb too? I hear nail polish with acetone? Oh and last question, what is the longevity of the CLU before it "hardens" and will need a new coat be put on the cpu?


----------



## Taint3dBulge

Going to Bump this. Was also wondering what kind of nail polish is needed to protect the transistors. I hear clear nail polish but am unsure as to if there is a certain kind that is truly needed or just any random one?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Taint3dBulge*
> 
> Hey guys, So I delidded my cpu afew months ago and used Grizzly Kryonaut to replace the stock tim. Only saw afew deg C difference. So now i have ordered the CLU liquid metal but am wondering since i super glued the heat spreader back on, will it harm the pcb of the cpu using the delidder tool from der8auer delid tool? Also best way to get rid of the superglue on the pcb too? I hear nail polish with acetone? Oh and last question, what is the longevity of the CLU before it "hardens" and will need a new coat be put on the cpu?


Some people can't take advice huh lol. The super glue was a mistake, there is a possibility that it might destroy the traces, depends how well it bonded.

Between Kryonaut and clu you wont see much difference either, unless your kryonaut application was awful and it pumped out within a few hours.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Taint3dBulge*
> 
> Hey guys, So I delidded my cpu afew months ago and used Grizzly Kryonaut to replace the stock tim. Only saw afew deg C difference. So now i have ordered the CLU liquid metal but am wondering since i super glued the heat spreader back on, will it harm the pcb of the cpu using the delidder tool from der8auer delid tool? Also best way to get rid of the superglue on the pcb too? I hear nail polish with acetone? Oh and last question, what is the longevity of the CLU before it "hardens" and will need a new coat be put on the cpu?


I would make sure to heat up the heat spreader and wearing the glue with some light razor blade work. Then give it a push in the delid tool. It's obviously a risk though.


----------



## DeathAngel74

Ouch. This why I did not use glue or black silicon RTV. I used the ASUS CPU alignment/safety "thing", held the IHS down by hand while lowering the retention clip.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Taint3dBulge*
> 
> Hey guys, So I delidded my cpu afew months ago and used Grizzly Kryonaut to replace the stock tim. Only saw afew deg C difference. So now i have ordered the CLU liquid metal but am wondering since i super glued the heat spreader back on, will it harm the pcb of the cpu using the delidder tool from der8auer delid tool? Also best way to get rid of the superglue on the pcb too? I hear nail polish with acetone? Oh and last question, what is the longevity of the CLU before it "hardens" and will need a new coat be put on the cpu?


http://www.supergluecorp.com/?q=removingsuperglue.html

probably try soak over night and try remove

I use Acetone all the time its safe for most things apart from plastic

you probably can get 100% acetone at the hardware store it is used for fibre glass clean up


----------



## sizziano

So I delided my 4790K about a week ago. While I saw a pretty good decrese in temps I still have 1 core that is between 5-10C cooler than the rest. Should I redo the delic?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *sizziano*
> 
> So I delided my 4790K about a week ago. While I saw a pretty good decrese in temps I still have 1 core that is between 5-10C cooler than the rest. Should I redo the delic?


You might need to reapply your liquid metal. Could be that its not covering the cores fully (on intel the cores are more on the side then centered, the rest is the igpu and memory controller). But cores withint 5°C of each other isn't bad its actually normal. I had one core that used to run at 49°C and another at 41° or 43° i don't remember. I didnt bother reapplying because it ran so cool.


----------



## Taint3dBulge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Some people can't take advice huh lol. The super glue was a mistake, there is a possibility that it might destroy the traces, depends how well it bonded.
> 
> Between Kryonaut and clu you wont see much difference either, unless your kryonaut application was awful and it pumped out within a few hours.


? not sure what you mean by take advice. I just followed the directions that came with the delid kit. Also the application was very very small, so not sure how it could be awful? But just afew deg more difference from where im at now ill be ok with... I hope its more of a 10 C drop, since from the factory till now i only saw afew degs change.. but that could be do to the fact that it did get superglued and the die isnt touching the heat spreader well enough. Which is why im going to redo it. But thanks for the snark remark anyways.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> I would make sure to heat up the heat spreader and wearing the glue with some light razor blade work. Then give it a push in the delid tool. It's obviously a risk though.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> Ouch. This why I did not use glue or black silicon RTV. I used the ASUS CPU alignment/safety "thing", held the IHS down by hand while lowering the retention clip.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> http://www.supergluecorp.com/?q=removingsuperglue.html
> 
> probably try soak over night and try remove
> 
> I use Acetone all the time its safe for most things apart from plastic
> 
> you probably can get 100% acetone at the hardware store it is used for fibre glass clean up


Luckly I did just a very very tiny amount on each corner of the cpu. very very small. just enough to make sure it held the head spreader on. so im thinkn this wont be to big a deal i hope. If so, then ill just have to get a new cpu.

Anyways im going to not glue it on this next time. I did read that not gluing it will also make sure there is less gap between the die and the spreader...

Also what have you guys used to cover the transistors? I want to get the exact same thing so i dont end up melting the wrong nail polish on the transistors and fryn them. Thanks for the response.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Taint3dBulge*
> 
> ? not sure what you mean by take advice. I just followed the directions that came with the delid kit. Also the application was very very small, so not sure how it could be awful? But just afew deg more difference from where im at now ill be ok with... I hope its more of a 10 C drop, since from the factory till now i only saw afew degs change.. but that could be do to the fact that it did get superglued and the die isnt touching the heat spreader well enough. Which is why im going to redo it. But thanks for the snark remark anyways.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Luckly I did just a very very tiny amount on each corner of the cpu. very very small. just enough to make sure it held the head spreader on. so im thinkn this wont be to big a deal i hope. If so, then ill just have to get a new cpu.
> 
> Anyways im going to not glue it on this next time. I did read that not gluing it will also make sure there is less gap between the die and the spreader...
> 
> Also what have you guys used to cover the transistors? I want to get the exact same thing so i dont end up melting the wrong nail polish on the transistors and fryn them. Thanks for the response.


Because we've gone over it in this thread so much lol. No need for superglue, no need for TIM on the die (liquid metal lasts a lot longer). It's just something that you didn't need to do and redo thats all.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

I finally delidded my 7700k! I gained 200mhz (5.0 to 5.2) under reasonable temperatures. I tried 5.3ghz @ 1.525v, but Cinebench kept crashing. Not that I want to run that much voltage anyway. 1.44v is already high enough.

Before:

85 C max after 5 repeated Cinebench runs W% 5.0ghz, 1.325v
92 C max after 5 repeated Cinebench runs @5.1ghz, 1.4v

After
73 C max after 5 repeated Cinebench runs @5.2ghz, 1.44v

Coolaboratory Ultra under IHS, TG Hydronaut above


----------



## Taint3dBulge

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Because we've gone over it in this thread so much lol. No need for superglue, no need for TIM on the die (liquid metal lasts a lot longer). It's just something that you didn't need to do and redo thats all.


Ya I didnt read about the superglue part. Wasnt sure at the time about running liquid metal. But now i know i need to. I have read about CLU drying up and getting hard. Is that true or no?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Taint3dBulge*
> 
> Ya I didnt read about the superglue part. Wasnt sure at the time about running liquid metal. But now i know i need to. I have read about CLU drying up and getting hard. Is that true or no?


Lets put it this way, i just took apart my pc to rebuild (went with a ryzen 1700x), i was running my 4690k bare die with liquid metal. I don't think ive taken it apart since probably beginning of july 2016 (when i got my new 4690k after breaking my first one







). Took it off and the cpu came right off the cooler, was still liquid. I also run it on a bare copper block which stained it a bit and needed to be scrubbed off but it was still liquid and came right off. (i also rested a bowl to drain my loop on the cpu socket like an idiot and may have bent pins on my 1150 board, tried to straighten em might see if it posts on my test bench tomorrow, but off topic haha)


----------



## MattBaneLM

you sure? pastes go like that, especially intels... after "pump out"


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Ok so where I can find my sig? Looked everywhere and I feel dumb not being able to find it like any other forum lol.


I was looking for it at first too.
Go to your profile by clicking your name and then just scroll down until you see "Your Forum Signature".


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> I was looking for it at first too.
> Go to your profile by clicking your name and then just scroll down until you see "Your Forum Signature".


Such in an awkward place lol. Found it and thanks!


----------



## XavieRElvis

Ok, I've almost read 3000 pages of posts and still things are not totally clear to me.
I am about to undergo the delidding procedure on a 4790k and awaiting the tool.
1) Price irrelevant are : Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut for die/ihs and Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut for ihs/cooler the best liquids tempwise?
2) Floating ihs method had no downsides?
3) Reapplying the pastes is not necessary?
4) How can I tell if lapping is necessary?
Trying to get most things right the first time
Thanks for sharing ur wisdom and experience


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> Ok, I've almost read 3000 pages of posts and still things are not totally clear to me.
> I am about to undergo the delidding procedure on a 4790k and awaiting the tool.
> 1) Price irrelevant are : Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut for die/ihs and Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut for ihs/cooler the best liquids tempwise?
> 2) Floating ihs method had no downsides?
> 3) Reapplying the pastes is not necessary?
> 4) How can I tell if lapping is necessary?
> Trying to get most things right the first time
> Thanks for sharing ur wisdom and experience


1. Some people find conductonaut hard to apply, seems like clu is the best for application, and after having mine 8month on bare die, was easy to wipe up. Had to slightly sand the extra on my copper block but that was to be expected.

2. only downside. If you move it around too much while remounting and latching it down you may/may not mess up your liquid metal application.

3. Reapplying CLU isn't necessary, as usual with any reapplication youll be checking your temps over a period of time. A year down the road if temps have gone up reapply the TIM first if still high reapply under the die with liquid metal.

4. You can check lapping with a straight edge, or a ruler or anything solid that is PERFECTLY straight.

Lapping is amazing if you have the time and patience to do it, will give you good temp drops on top of the delid. You want both surfaces as flat as possible, the less TIM you use on the IHS the better it works. No need to lap under the IHS as its incredibly difficult and probably end up with worse temps.


----------



## XavieRElvis

+ rep and thank you for the detailed breakdown
Regarding the application I don't mind the difficulty if the paste is better. I'd take even -1 C over the small headache it may involve. So it the Conductonaut better than CLU or are they identical?
Thank you


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> + rep and thank you for the detailed breakdown
> Regarding the application I don't mind the difficulty if the paste is better. I'd take even -1 C over the small headache it may involve. So it the Conductonaut better than CLU or are they identical?
> Thank you


The top 4 liquid metals are all made up of the same thing, conductonaut has twice the w/mK rating as CLU but they perform identically from what we've seen. I think after a certain amount of w/m the thermal rating doesn't matter anymore, it probably exceeds the wattage could possibly be why.


----------



## lostsupper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> Ok, I've almost read 3000 pages of posts and still things are not totally clear to me.
> I am about to undergo the delidding procedure on a 4790k and awaiting the tool.
> 1) Price irrelevant are : Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut for die/ihs and Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut for ihs/cooler the best liquids tempwise?
> 2) Floating ihs method had no downsides?
> 3) Reapplying the pastes is not necessary?
> 4) How can I tell if lapping is necessary?
> Trying to get most things right the first time
> Thanks for sharing ur wisdom and experience


1) Yes to both. Conductonaut yields lower temps by a few degrees Celsius. Some people say it's harder to apply, but it's not. It just takes a minute of rolling the little ball of lquid metal around on the die to warm it up.

2) The CPU retaining bracket can slide the IHS down as you close it, but this is easy to avoid.

3) Reapplying the liquid metal is absolutely not necessary. I recently parted out an Ivy Bridge system that I had delidded. Having not seen the liquid metal since applying it in the summer of 2013, I expected some degree of curing or hardening. It looked exactly as when I originally applied it. Temps had never changed either.

4) Lapping will at most yield a degree or two difference, and that only if the IHS is exceptionally out of the norm or your cooler is old or poor. Modern IHS's and cooler bases are extremely well machined.


----------



## XavieRElvis

Thank you
So just to clarify this, on the Conductonaut application I use the pea method (mentioned as ball) instead of spreading a thin layer to the die?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lostsupper*
> 
> 1) Yes to both. Conductonaut yields lower temps by a few degrees Celsius. Some people say it's harder to apply, but it's not. It just takes a minute of rolling the little ball of lquid metal around on the die to warm it up.
> 
> 2) The CPU retaining bracket can slide the IHS down as you close it, but this is easy to avoid.
> 
> 3) Reapplying the liquid metal is absolutely not necessary. I recently parted out an Ivy Bridge system that I had delidded. Having not seen the liquid metal since applying it in the summer of 2013, I expected some degree of curing or hardening. It looked exactly as when I originally applied it. Temps had never changed either.
> 
> 4) Lapping will at most yield a degree or two difference, and that only if the IHS is exceptionally out of the norm or your cooler is old or poor. Modern IHS's and cooler bases are extremely well machined.


I will disagree, respectfully, with 1 and 4.

1. Conductonaut may yield lower temps but thats at best 1°C, they use the same chemical ingredients between Coollaboratory and Thermal Grizzly (and even Phobya for that matter).

4. I think lapping has a more profound effect on temps then changing thermal pastes ON the IHS. The reason? Thermal efficiency. Almost all cpu heatsinks/water blocks are CONVEX, meaning the center is lightly protruded. Why? Reason is simple. You don't need to make contact with the entire IHS, the cores/memcontroller/igpu are all dead center, the rest is EMPTYNESS!!!

The reason you want to lap your ihs and heatsink (provided its not nickel plated, its not an issue youll just have no more nickel lol), you want to make both surfaces flat so that the heat radiating on the sides of the IHS away from the cores can also be thermally conducted away. It works much better.

Techyescity did a cheap (50$) waterloop test and used a super cheap aluminum cpu block, temps were in the 80s or something, once lapped it dropped down to the 60s. yes this is an extreme case but lapping does indeed work. Youd be surprised how convex/concave the IHS and heatsinks can be.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> Thank you
> So just to clarify this, on the Conductonaut application I use the pea method (mentioned as ball) instead of spreading a thin layer to the die?


Nope, still needs to be spread on the die in a very thin layer. Any liquid metal needs to be spread.


----------



## paskowitz

I would also add, put LM TIM on the die side of the IHS. I have found this to give more consistent results. Too little or too much LM can be hard to judge sometimes. I have found a thin layer on both to be just right.


----------



## S0nny

should I delid my 6400.......


----------



## lostsupper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I will disagree, respectfully, with 1 and 4.
> 
> 1. Conductonaut may yield lower temps but thats at best 1°C, they use the same chemical ingredients between Coollaboratory and Thermal Grizzly (and even Phobya for that matter).
> 
> 4. I think lapping has a more profound effect on temps then changing thermal pastes ON the IHS. The reason? Thermal efficiency. Almost all cpu heatsinks/water blocks are CONVEX, meaning the center is lightly protruded. Why? Reason is simple. You don't need to make contact with the entire IHS, the cores/memcontroller/igpu are all dead center, the rest is EMPTYNESS!!!
> 
> The reason you want to lap your ihs and heatsink (provided its not nickel plated, its not an issue youll just have no more nickel lol), you want to make both surfaces flat so that the heat radiating on the sides of the IHS away from the cores can also be thermally conducted away. It works much better.
> 
> Techyescity did a cheap (50$) waterloop test and used a super cheap aluminum cpu block, temps were in the 80s or something, once lapped it dropped down to the 60s. yes this is an extreme case but lapping does indeed work. Youd be surprised how convex/concave the IHS and heatsinks can be.
> Nope, still needs to be spread on the die in a very thin layer. Any liquid metal needs to be spread.


In my own experience I've never seen that dramatic of a temperature drop from lapping. The difference is a few degrees at best, which is what I've seen from my own applications of Coollaboratory Pro, Coollaboratory Ultra, and Conductonaut. It's easier for me to recommend choosing a different liquid metal over lapping because of the significant time/labor difference between the two.

It would be interesting to see comprehensive testing of lapping on a variety of IHS's and coolers.

Also, in response to paskowitz, applying liquid metal to the underside of the IHS means over-applying in every instance I've seen. If you've completely removed the RTV from the pcb and IHS, the gap between the die and IHS is extremely small. Spreading any more than the bare minimum of liquid metal to the die results in some of it being pushed off of the die and onto the pcb.


----------



## XavieRElvis

How come that LM is not also recommended for use on the IHS and the cooler other than the corrosion issues?
In my case I have a NH-D15. Could I apply Conductonaut both over and under the IHS for better results or am I taking nonsense?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> How come that LM is not also recommended for use on the IHS and the cooler other than the corrosion issues?
> In my case I have a NH-D15. Could I apply Conductonaut both over and under the IHS for better results or am I taking nonsense?


I wouldn't youll see like no gains. Its a possibility that the liquid metal will harder there. Why? Because that changes temps much faster then on the die. The temps your seeing are core temps, youre not seeing actual on die temps or IHS temps (which believe me, get quite a better warmer then actual core temps lol)


----------



## lostsupper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> How come that LM is not also recommended for use on the IHS and the cooler other than the corrosion issues?
> In my case I have a NH-D15. Could I apply Conductonaut both over and under the IHS for better results or am I taking nonsense?


You can, but the risks associated with over-application and push-out outweigh the small difference in thermals. Liquid metal is conductive; even a small bead can cause a short on the motherboard.

And if I can trust my recollection, it seemed like the thermal benefit over conventional paste wasn't expressed to the same degree as when applied between the die and IHS.


----------



## XavieRElvis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I wouldn't youll see like no gains. Its a possibility that the liquid metal will harder there. Why? Because that changes temps much faster then on the die. The temps your seeing are core temps, youre not seeing actual on die temps or IHS temps (which believe me, get quite a better warmer then actual core temps lol)


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lostsupper*
> 
> You can, but the risks associated with over-application and push-out outweigh the small difference in thermals. Liquid metal is conductive; even a small bead can cause a short on the motherboard.
> 
> And if I can trust my recollection, it seemed like the thermal benefit over conventional paste wasn't expressed to the same degree as when applied between the die and IHS.


2 excellent points to steer me away from doing so


----------



## HaGa

So complete delid with a delid die mate cleaning and glueing







8minutes 25 seconds












and here is my howto, sorry for my bad english, its not my motherlanguage







have fun to watch


----------



## skingun

What is the music in the first video? @HaGa


----------



## Molitro

Since I learned everything I needed to delid my 4790k from this thread, might aswell join the club.

OCN name: Molitro
CPU: i7 4790k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
Mhz gained: 200Mhz
OC after delid: 4.8 @ 1.33v
Temp drops: ~ 12ºC
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/0v0qhz
Cooler: Noctua NH-D15


----------



## godboy

how long do I need to wait to let ultrablack cure on my 7700k delid? I have heard 3-24 hours


----------



## OutlawII

Black silicon is safe to use but that super glue GOOD LUCK!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *godboy*
> 
> how long do I need to wait to let ultrablack cure on my 7700k delid? I have heard 3-24 hours


Overnight for it to cure,but i just waited about 3 hours and just held it together when i put it in the socket


----------



## S0nny

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HaGa*
> 
> So complete delid with a delid die mate cleaning and glueing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 8minutes 25 seconds
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and here is my howto, sorry for my bad english, its not my motherlanguage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have fun to watch


Do you have a link that I could buy one?


----------



## skingun

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *S0nny*
> 
> Do you have a link that I could buy one?


I believe they are EOL. Version 2 is released at the end of this week and can be pre-ordered from caseking.de and overclockers.co.uk


----------



## becks

@S0nny

Depends on the country you are in ( the links to buy it..)

From what I can tell its a Rockit 88 Delid
I have used they'r website to order it.

NB. I am at work so can't really look at the y movie properly to see 100% sure if its that or not.


----------



## S0nny

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> @S0nny
> 
> Depends on the country you are in ( the links to buy it..)
> 
> From what I can tell its a Rockit 88 Delid
> I have used they'r website to order it.
> 
> NB. I am at work so can't really look at the y movie properly to see 100% sure if its that or not.


I am in the US


----------



## godboy

How important is the small gap you're supposed to leave in the RTV. The tutorials I watched never mentioned this and I'm currently waiting for mine to cure right now.


----------



## becks

@S0nny

Had the chance to look at the video properly and its this one: der8auer Delid-die-mate

Send OC UK an email and see if the ship it to US.
Or try amazon.com / ebay for the matter...

I looked at all 3: Delid-die-mate, Delid-die-mate 2, Rockit and went with the last mentioned...seems more "straightforward" for me..but you have to decide for yourself.


----------



## paskowitz

I used the Rockit 88. Quick, easy, well made, cheap. Good options for US customers.


----------



## DeathAngel74

Rockitcool.myshopify.com
I'm using the beta. It was in my closet for a year before deciding to use it.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> So it looks like my CPU *may* be dead. I have to do some final testing but I am putting my chances at <20%. Intel is sending me a replacement as I am still in warranty. Obviously since I am in this thread... my CPU is delided. And since I am on this site... it has been overclocked. How boned am I? Any chance they will take a relided CPU? What paste and adhesive should I use? Would the Intel overclocking warranty plan this be a good idea at this point?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> It's pretty ridiculous. One day my OS freezes. NBD, I'll just hard reset. Then I get a 00 post code and a lit CPU Q-LED (power resets, then hangs). No BIOS, no OS. Call Asus, RMA mobo. Next day, out of nowhere my systems POSTs and gets to the OS. I run stock BIOS settings and stress tests, no problems. I am obviously confused. Mobo short? IDK. Then I shut my PC off and the 00 no BIOS comes back (same as original issue). So I send in my mobo thinking it must be the mobo. Nope, Asus says it is fine. PSU is fine. RAM is fine. Only thing I have not swapped out or alt system tested is the CPU (only have the one). My 4790K has worked since the day I got it, until this incident.
> 
> I have no intention of pissing off Intel. I can get a 4790K for about $250, not the "end of the world". I figured, and likely erroneously, that I might as well try the warranty process. I am just wondering what actually happens in this situation? I guess if there is a problem, I send back the CPU they sent me. They charged me for the CPU they are sending me so I guess they could just stick me with that bill (which I would be ok with).


TLDR: So my delided CPU broke, Intel sent (and charged) me a warranty replacement, Intel refunded the replacement charge.

Honestly, I don't think anyone should take this experience as a moral OK, or an indication that you will have the same result. While I don't know exactly what broke my CPU, the lessen here is use a delid tool, be careful, use common sense and accept that there are risks when deliding.


----------



## becks

@paskowitz

Let me see if I got this correct








You delided... And the CPU broke..
And you sent Intel a delided chip ? and they sent you a new CPU and charged you for it as in *Sold* it to you at market price ?!


----------



## DeathAngel74

I had the opposite. Delid 4790k in vise in neighbors garage. Chip flew across garage, landed in laundry basket of neighbor. Went back home cleaned everything off. Motherboard was shorted due to bent pins and artic silver 5. I think thats why I was so leary and waited so long to delid the 6700k. Too many potential risks...


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> @paskowitz
> 
> Let me see if I got this correct
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You delided... And the CPU broke..
> And you sent Intel a delided chip ? and they sent you a new CPU and charged you for it as in *Sold* it to you at market price ?!


CPU broke long after delid (NOT because of delid).

It was an advanced ship RMA. They sent me a new chip and charged a hold ($230). I would then send in my dead chip and they would refund the charge once they received/checked it.


----------



## becks

@paskowitz

I'm not even interested in the fact that the CPU was dead or how it ended up being dead..
For me its fascinating that they actually...legitimately...accepted a delided chip...


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> @paskowitz
> 
> I'm not even interested in the fact that the CPU was dead or how it ended up being dead..
> For me its fascinating that they actually...legitimately...accepted a delided chip...


Yup. I was shocked. I did relid the chip but it had scuff marks all over the IHS.

I want to reiterate again, please don't go to Intel thinking they will just replace your chip because you wanted to throw 1.5v volts at it or because you hacked off some part.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molitro*
> 
> Since I learned everything I needed to delid my 4790k from this thread, might aswell join the club.
> 
> OCN name: Molitro
> CPU: i7 4790k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Arctic MX-4
> Mhz gained: 200Mhz
> OC after delid: 4.8 @ 1.33v
> Temp drops: ~ 12ºC
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/0v0qhz
> Cooler: Noctua NH-D15


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## anthonyg45157

If anyone has a delidder they aren't using anymore and wish to sell please contact me. I have a 7700k


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anthonyg45157*
> 
> If anyone has a delidder they aren't using anymore and wish to sell please contact me. I have a 7700k


If you live anywhere near Houston, TX I don't mind letting you use it.


----------



## anthonyg45157

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> If you live anywhere near Houston, TX I don't mind letting you use it.


Thanks so much for the offer, sadly I'm located near Cincinnati Ohio.


----------



## HZCH

Hello all! I'm waiting for a delid-die-mate do delid my 4670k (gotta give back my xeon 1231v3)... Already ordered some CLU.

My question is: do anyone could share a link (or PM me) for a clear nail polish or some liquid electric tape for the transistors...
... In a French-speaking shop?
I'm actually not sure how you call liquid electric tape in French, and I don't anything about clear nail polish ?

Thx for your help !


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> Hello all! I'm waiting for a delid-die-mate do delid my 4670k (gotta give back my xeon 1231v3)... Already ordered some CLU.
> 
> My question is: do anyone could share a link (or PM me) for a clear nail polish or some liquid electric tape for the transistors...
> ... In a French-speaking shop?
> I'm actually not sure how you call liquid electric tape in French, and I don't anything about clear nail polish ?
> 
> Thx for your help !


Ask any female nearby about clear nail polish. They'll know.


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> Ask any female nearby about clear nail polish. They'll know.


I would, but what's the exact translation for "clear nail polish" in French ? ?


----------



## bind777

Got my tool, got my CLU and ready to delid MY 6700k. Having a serious internal debate on whether or not to reseal the IHS. Can someone clear a few things up for me?

I ordered some Permatex Red RTV with the intention of using a thin seal on the IHS but I am having second thoughts. It is my understanding the reduction of the gap between the IHS and die is what improves cooling for the CPU as well as a slight convex to the PCB. It seems that it would make more sense to go with the floating option for the IHS to reduce the gap created by the seal. It is also to my understanding that some form of ventilation needs to be in place between the IHS and PCB.

So what is the best route? Do I attempt a thin seal with the RTV and leave a space in the sealant for ventilation or do I go with the floating option? Something else to consider would be readjusting the IHS over time if any movement takes place and temps start to increase.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bind777*
> 
> Got my tool, got my CLU and ready to delid MY 6700k. Having a serious internal debate on whether or not to reseal the IHS. Can someone clear a few things up for me?
> 
> I ordered some Permatex Red RTV with the intention of using a thin seal on the IHS but I am having second thoughts. It is my understanding the reduction of the gap between the IHS and die is what improves cooling for the CPU as well as a slight convex to the PCB. It seems that it would make more sense to go with the floating option for the IHS to reduce the gap created by the seal. It is also to my understanding that some form of ventilation needs to be in place between the IHS and PCB.
> 
> So what is the best route? Do I attempt a thin seal with the RTV and leave a space in the sealant for ventilation or do I go with the floating option? Something else to consider would be readjusting the IHS over time if any movement takes place and temps start to increase.


The gap you're talking about is .06mm usually, doesnt seem to need to vent i think the gap is just because of the tooling process. Plenty of us have used the floating method without issues.

Resealing is quite unnecessary, i don't see anyone removing their cpu on a daily basis to warrant actually using silicon lol.


----------



## S0nny

Congrats you guys, I've learned enough from you guys to earn a place in my description so others(on pcpartpicker) will go to this thread to learn about delidding.

I'm pretty known on there so it will get plenty of traffic lol

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/S0nny_WarBucks58/


----------



## lostsupper

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bind777*
> 
> Got my tool, got my CLU and ready to delid MY 6700k. Having a serious internal debate on whether or not to reseal the IHS. Can someone clear a few things up for me?
> 
> I ordered some Permatex Red RTV with the intention of using a thin seal on the IHS but I am having second thoughts. It is my understanding the reduction of the gap between the IHS and die is what improves cooling for the CPU as well as a slight convex to the PCB. It seems that it would make more sense to go with the floating option for the IHS to reduce the gap created by the seal. It is also to my understanding that some form of ventilation needs to be in place between the IHS and PCB.
> 
> So what is the best route? Do I attempt a thin seal with the RTV and leave a space in the sealant for ventilation or do I go with the floating option? Something else to consider would be readjusting the IHS over time if any movement takes place and temps start to increase.


The only reason I would consider resealing is if you don't trust your hands to keep the IHS in place while you lock down the CPU retaining arm. In that case, I'd apply RTV on the outside of the IHS at its edges where it meets the PCB. A small amount will be sufficient to hold the IHS in place during installation, but won't add to the gap between the CPU and IHS. It would also make re-delidding very easy if you ever decided to.


----------



## bind777

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The gap you're talking about is .06mm usually, doesnt seem to need to vent i think the gap is just because of the tooling process. Plenty of us have used the floating method without issues.
> 
> Resealing is quite unnecessary, i don't see anyone removing their cpu on a daily basis to warrant actually using silicon lol.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lostsupper*
> 
> The only reason I would consider resealing is if you don't trust your hands to keep the IHS in place while you lock down the CPU retaining arm. In that case, I'd apply RTV on the outside of the IHS at its edges where it meets the PCB. A small amount will be sufficient to hold the IHS in place during installation, but won't add to the gap between the CPU and IHS. It would also make re-delidding very easy if you ever decided to.


OK thanks guys. I think I'll go with the floating method. I'll check some videos on YouTube but in the meantime, are you suppose to hold the IHS while you lock it into place? I thought you offset a bit and let the clip push it into the center. I guess that would in spread the CLU onto the PCB


----------



## Molitro

false
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bind777*
> 
> OK thanks guys. I think I'll go with the floating method. I'll check some videos on YouTube but in the meantime, are you suppose to hold the IHS while you lock it into place? I thought you offset a bit and let the clip push it into the center. I guess that would in spread the CLU onto the PCB


From my experience, it'll most likely move when you lock it in place, but it'll be fine. Just hold it in place as best as you can. In my case it moved to the left side a bit, and I just recentered it and locked it. Works just fine.

I did cover the pins on the side of the DIE that the 4790k has with non conductive paste to make sure even if some of the metal TIM got displaced it owuldn't cause trouble.


----------



## bluej511

The easiest way to do it is to place it down, without moving it. Slowly push down on the latch mechanism till it just barely makes contact. Then you hold it so it doesnt slide around then clamp down rapidly not giving it a chance to move. Its how i do all my delids and reinstall and its yet to fail haha.


----------



## bind777

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Molitro*
> 
> false
> From my experience, it'll most likely move when you lock it in place, but it'll be fine. Just hold it in place as best as you can. In my case it moved to the left side a bit, and I just recentered it and locked it. Works just fine.
> 
> I did cover the pins on the side of the DIE that the 4790k has with non conductive paste to make sure even if some of the metal TIM got displaced it owuldn't cause trouble.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The easiest way to do it is to place it down, without moving it. Slowly push down on the latch mechanism till it just barely makes contact. Then you hold it so it doesnt slide around then clamp down rapidly not giving it a chance to move. Its how i do all my delids and reinstall and its yet to fail haha.


Thanks for the tips. Hope to get at it tonight and run a quick bench. I'll report back!


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> Hello all! I'm waiting for a delid-die-mate do delid my 4670k (gotta give back my xeon 1231v3)... Already ordered some CLU.
> 
> My question is: do anyone could share a link (or PM me) for a clear nail polish or some liquid electric tape for the transistors...
> ... In a French-speaking shop?
> I'm actually not sure how you call liquid electric tape in French, and I don't anything about clear nail polish ?
> 
> Thx for your help !


The translation may be in this guide:
http://www.linguee.com/english-french/translation/clear+nail+polish.html

I like to use Sally Hansen "Hard As Nails" clear (for my cpu vrms, lol!







)
Perhaps this shop sells it?
http://www.biuky.fr/sally-hansen?


----------



## godboy

Hey guys, just completed my delid on the 7700K. On stock clock speed my Aida64 stress test caps out around 52-54C after 4 hours. Can anyone give me an idea on how this result is? I haven't started any OC'ing yet and have no comparison as this is a new chip.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *godboy*
> 
> Hey guys, just completed my delid on the 7700K. On stock clock speed my Aida64 stress test caps out around 52-54C after 4 hours. Can anyone give me an idea on how this result is? I haven't started any OC'ing yet and have no comparison as this is a new chip.


We need more information to be able to reply to you..
This is the temperature with Cpu at stock ?
What cooling solution you have ? Air ? Water ?
What have you used to replace the TIM on the chip... etc etc
What were the temperatures before ?

The more we have the better we can reply to you


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> The translation may be in this guide:
> http://www.linguee.com/english-french/translation/clear+nail+polish.html
> 
> I like to use Sally Hansen "Hard As Nails" clear (for my cpu vrms, lol!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> Perhaps this shop sells it?
> http://www.biuky.fr/sally-hansen?


Thanks for your help ! Therefore a clear nail polish, aka "vernis à ongles transparent" it shall be ?


----------



## TK421

For 7700K and delid, is it beneficial to relid and replace adhesive glue?

If so, what glue should I use? I have the rockit88 relid kit.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> For 7700K and delid, is it beneficial to relid and replace adhesive glue?
> 
> If so, what glue should I use? I have the rockit88 relid kit.


For reselling purposes and ease of use I relidded mine. There is no negative impact on temps so why not.
Just use some silicon adhesive used for oil pans. Like a gasket. I have some UHU stuff but I'm sure other things will work just as good.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*


This has been recommended by many users before: SUPERFLEX BLACK SEALANT, 5940

Re-gluing it back together is not mandatory..


----------



## NIK1

I just got my Rockit 88 delid and relid tools a couple days ago. There video on delid and relid shows to put a small dab of Loctite superglue gel on each corner of the processor, let her dry and she's done.I will be doing my cpu sometime this week and will post re
sults..


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*


Its been discussed and discussed over and over again here on this forum...Use super glue at your own risk!








Check Y-tube for a sec and see how many "cpu delid fail" videos are up there in regards to using super glue and cracked pcb's

Edit. Enjoy watching ^_^


----------



## NIK1

Ok.So you think even when putting a little dab on each corner can still wreck it.Maybe I will not do it then..Here is the Rockit 88 video they have on there site on this procedure..


----------



## DeathAngel74

You're better off letting the ihs "float" or using red/black RTV, if you really want to reseal. Makes it easier to reapply TIM later down the line.


----------



## DeathAngel74

@becks
That was painful to watch,lol.


----------



## becks

@DeathAngel74

The guy actually made a video of hes mistake which is actually very rare ...as most just do videos of their success and not failures... so hands down for him
We have to learn from our mistakes sometime


----------



## TK421

Rtv black is the loctite 5940?


----------



## XxSilent22xX

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> Rtv black is the loctite 5940?


I googled and it appears so, temps -50c - 200c looks good.


----------



## becks

@TK421

This is the RTV

Not a lot of difference, in fact I think they are pretty much the same, loctite being cheaper and easier to find on the market


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XxSilent22xX*
> 
> I googled and it appears so, temps -50c - 200c looks good.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> @TK421
> 
> This is the RTV
> 
> Not a lot of difference, in fact I think they are pretty much the same, loctite being cheaper and easier to find on the market


So using loctite is ok.

How about warranty? Can intel differentiate loctite and the permatex?


----------



## NIK1

How about this stuff...Permatex Ultra Copper® RTV High-Temp Gasket Maker.OEM specified. For high operating temperatures common in 4-cylinder, turbocharged or high-performance engines. The most advanced, high temp RTV silicone gasket available. Sensor-safe, low odor, noncorrosive. Superior adhesion. Three times more oil resistant than conventional silicones; eight times more flexible than cut gaskets. Temperature range -65°F to 700°F (-54°C to 371°C) intermittent; resists auto and shop fluids and vibration. I can get this at crappy tire, or would the Loctite SUPERFLEX BLACK SEALANT 5940 be better.


----------



## Vario

Get black rtv. Ultra copper is made for exhaust gaskets and flanges. It doesn't spread as thin as black rtv. I have worked with both types as a backyard mechanic. The Black is close to the stuff intel uses. I'd recommend just getting basic Permatex Black RTV. It spreads fairly thin, and its easy to work with. As far as temperatures go, the Black RTV and other color RTV like Gray (also a good one) are made for things like Valve Covers, Timing Chain Covers, Water pumps. It can withstand much higher temperatures than your PC will make. RTV is RTV really, don't think brand matters. But the black will look closest to Intel's OEM. You can get RTV at any auto parts store. Its something that mechanics use a lot of.


----------



## NIK1

Right on. The Permatex Black RTV it is then. Thanks...Forgot to ask,Black RTV Adhesive Sealant or Ultra Black RTV Gasket Maker.


----------



## Cakewalk_S

I ended up selling my delided i7-6700k. I used CLU between the die and IHS. I never glued the IHS back down and left it "floating"... I ended up parting out my rig and just very carefully removed the CPU from the motherboard. The IHS easily spun on the die since that was the only thing making contact at that time and I never lifted it to check if the CLU was still liquidy. I assume it was since I could spin the IHS on the die without any resistance. No idea if the buyer needed to repaste it or what...


----------



## tocirahl

I'm thinking about delidding my 6700K, but I don't really want to have to use liquid metal between the IHS and the die. How much of a problem would it be down the line if I used Noctua NT-H1 instead?


----------



## Cakewalk_S

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tocirahl*
> 
> I'm thinking about delidding my 6700K, but I don't really want to have to use liquid metal between the IHS and the die. How much of a problem would it be down the line if I used Noctua NT-H1 instead?


You're better off not deliding if you won't go the liquid metal route. Thin pastes tend to pump out and its well documented here...


----------



## tocirahl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cakewalk_S*
> 
> You're better off not deliding if you won't go the liquid metal route. Thin pastes tend to pump out and its well documented here...


Does this also apply to GPU coolers which are all bare-die? Are there any good non-conductive pastes that don't pump out for bare-die applications?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tocirahl*
> 
> Does this also apply to GPU coolers which are all bare-die? Are there any good non-conductive pastes that don't pump out for bare-die applications?


No because its a much bigger die and believe it or no its not as concentrated so TIMs tend to work a lot better on GPUs then on CPUs:


----------



## tocirahl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> No because its a much bigger die and believe it or no its not as concentrated so TIMs tend to work a lot better on GPUs then on CPUs:


Ok well that's a relief at least. Thank you very much!

I'll try overclocking the 6700K without delidding first and then I guess I'll have to decide if it's worth having to deal with liquid metal.


----------



## TK421

What's the difference between the two RTVs?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Permatex-Ultra-Black-Maximum-Oil-Resistance-RTV-Silicone-Gasket-Maker-3-35OZ-/201258810197?hash=item2edbf5bb55:g:d28AAOxylpNTUdSv&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Permatex-Ultra-Black-Maximum-Oil-Resistance-RTV-Silicone-Gasket-Maker-3-35oz-/321827204450?hash=item4aee656d62:g:MOoAAOSwg3FUqb1G&vxp=mtr

Same no 82180


----------



## bind777

What are your reservations against liquid metal? Generally a regular TIM will not suffice as a medium between the die and IHS. It simply won't last and will need be replaced on a regular basis.


----------



## hayame

For my reseal I used the one like in the second link since it was readily available at walmart, I think the one in the first link just has higher temperature range and oil resistance.


----------



## DeathAngel74

I left mine floating to allow ease when needing to replace tim. I do it once every 12-18 months anyway. Gelid gc xtreme on die and between pump and ihs.


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tocirahl*
> 
> Ok well that's a relief at least. Thank you very much!
> 
> I'll try overclocking the 6700K without delidding first and then I guess I'll have to decide if it's worth having to deal with liquid metal.


I would add for the sake of redundant information that if your GPU is seated vertically (like plugged on a horizontal motherboard), liquid metal might drip and short your GPU, as it happened on my GTX 770 back in the time... So yeah, probably not worth it ?


----------



## Caos

Hi, I'm about to buy the delit rockit88 tool, but I have two doubts, is it safe to use the superglue they offer on the rockit88 page to re-paste the IHS to the cpu pcb?

And how clean the remains of bad thermal paste and black glue?

thanks


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bind777*
> 
> What are your reservations against liquid metal? Generally a regular TIM will not suffice as a medium between the die and IHS. It simply won't last and will need be replaced on a regular basis.


Xigmatek PTI-G4512 - Hard to come by at this point, but it is specifically advertised as pump out resistant. I can attest to its ability to do so after using it on my direct die cooled 4770k for the last few years. It went around 2 years without being disturbed, I then wanted to test out Thermal Grizzly's Kryonaut as the thermal conductance is listed as much higher than the G4512; 2.5 w/mK ~vs~ 12.5 w/mK. The Kryonaut pumped out within a couple of hours and temps were not better than the G4512.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> I would add for the sake of redundant information that if your GPU is seated vertically (like plugged on a horizontal motherboard), liquid metal might drip and short your GPU, as it happened on my GTX 770 back in the time... So yeah, probably not worth it ?


Did this to a GTX 970 and while it did short the GPU and cause problems, I was able to clean up the CLU and surprisingly there was no harm done to the GPU. Still functioning in my friends PC as I was just at his house Monday to help him overclock the card after installing a Corsair hydro kit on it.

In that particular scenario I had used some liquid electrical tape around the die in an attempt to protect the transistors etc and it failed after a couple of months. Next time I make this attempt, it is going to be using some Hondabond. That is Honda's sealant for various things on engines/transmissions and is essentially 'liquid' gasket...marvelous stuff!


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> Hi, I'm about to buy the delit rockit88 tool, but I have two doubts, is it safe to use the superglue they offer on the rockit88 page to re-paste the IHS to the cpu pcb?
> 
> And how clean the remains of bad thermal paste and black glue?
> 
> thanks


I was researching a little and I think the superglue is not the best option. The permatex ultra black recommend, but found in my country this permatex. It does not matter?
Https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/ultra-series-gasket-makers/permatex-ultra-grey-rigid-high-torque-rtv-silicone-gasket-maker-2/

But I still do not know how to clean the remains of paste and glue that I leave intel


----------



## bind777

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> I would add for the sake of redundant information that if your GPU is seated vertically (like plugged on a horizontal motherboard), liquid metal might drip and short your GPU, as it happened on my GTX 770 back in the time... So yeah, probably not worth it ?


With that logic wouldn't that mean most CPUs are subject to said dripage?


----------



## DeathAngel74

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> I was researching a little and I think the superglue is not the best option. The permatex ultra black recommend, but found in my country this permatex. It does not matter?
> Https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/ultra-series-gasket-makers/permatex-ultra-grey-rigid-high-torque-rtv-silicone-gasket-maker-2/
> 
> But I still do not know how to clean the remains of paste and glue that I leave intel


Use the highest concentration of rubbing(isopropyl) alcohol you can find..90%+ for the old paste. You could find it at the local drug store/pharmacy. The safest way to clean off the old glue is the edge of an old credit card or Id card. This is what I used for clean up after removing the ihs from the pcb:


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bind777*
> 
> With that logic wouldn't that mean most CPUs are subject to said dripage?


I never said it was logic ? But I guess the pressure exerted by the locking mechanism or lga cpus might be enough, especially if you're careful about liquid metal application... And also, that's why your supposed to protect the vrms on lga1150 cpus anyway.

My guess is the mounting pressure is generally lighter on a gpu die, and there's no IHS to act as a barrier on the PCB if something goes awfully wrong, but I might be... wrong.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> I was researching a little and I think the superglue is not the best option. The permatex ultra black recommend, but found in my country this permatex. It does not matter?
> Https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/ultra-series-gasket-makers/permatex-ultra-grey-rigid-high-torque-rtv-silicone-gasket-maker-2/
> 
> But I still do not know how to clean the remains of paste and glue that I leave intel


Yep awesome glue choice.

Just wipe off most paste with a paper towel and then use some high percentage alcohol with a lint free cloth.
For the old glue I use credit cards and my nails for the finishing touch.


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> Use the highest concentration of rubbing(isopropyl) alcohol you can find..90%+ for the old paste. You could find it at the local drug store/pharmacy. The safest way to clean off the old glue is the edge of an old credit card or Id card. This is what I used for clean up after removing the ihs from the pcb:


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> Yep awesome glue choice.
> 
> Just wipe off most paste with a paper towel and then use some high percentage alcohol with a lint free cloth.
> For the old glue I use credit cards and my nails for the finishing touch.


Thank you very much for the answers .. I will look for the alcohol that I recommend.

But in the end, they only have this permatex in stock
Https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/ultra-series-gasket-makers/permatex-ultra-black-maximum-oil-resistance-rtv-silicone-gasket-maker-4/

Is the same true?


----------



## DeathAngel74

It will work. Just put some black glue on a paper towel, dab the end of a toothpick into the glue, a thin layer on the bottom of the ihs, let it sit overnight once you put the ihs back onto the pcb.


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DeathAngel74*
> 
> It will work. Just put some black glue on a paper towel, dab the end of a toothpick into the glue, a thin layer on the bottom of the ihs, let it sit overnight once you put the ihs back onto the pcb.


ok. thank you very much..


----------



## bind777

Finished my delid and everything went smoothly. It really is such an easy process. One strange thing though. I took a baseline to see my increases but now I don't know if it's possible to know the exact gains. I have vcore set to Auto in BIOS (haven't done any OCing yet). It is this way for both default settings and when I use XMP. According to HWinfo my vcore is lower now than it was, under load, prior to the delid. Nothing in the BIOS has changed. Am I going crazy or this is normal? It seems the only way I can see the delidding gains is if I set the vcore in the BIOS to match what it was prior to the delid. Obviously the temps are going to be lower if the vcore is lower so I doubt I am really seeing a 20 degree improvement. Very strange.


----------



## hayame

I mean it does sound like your delid was successful even without recording numbers to compare before and after. With that being said, less vcore, less power, probably more thermal headroom for overclocking and best part: knowing you didn't kill your cpu in the process


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> ok. thank you very much..


I always let black rtv silione cure with cpu held in delid tool or socket to make sure pcb remains flat (for pin contact) and that the glue doesn't expand making TIM contact poor. If you choose to do socket method loosen 3 screws 1 ¹/₂ to 2 full turns and slowly tighten in this pattern





http://imgur.com/qJXvj


----------



## DR4G00N

Went on a delidding spree on my poor s478 cpu's. Used a razor and hot air tool for the soldered ones, IHS comes off with a loud crack.










From left to right:
P4 2.8GHz HT NW
P4 3.2GHz HT NW
Cele D 320 2.4GHz Prescott
P4 2.8GHz HT Prescott
Celeron 2.8GHz NW
P4 2.6GHz HT NW

Edit: Looks like the p4 3.2 didn't make it, there goes $5.







(I knew I should've bought two instead of one).


----------



## anthonyg45157

Just popped the top on my 7700k






How long should I let the silicon dry?


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anthonyg45157*


Usually you have to let it overnight..
6-7 Hours should be enough.


----------



## OutlawII

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *anthonyg45157*
> 
> Just popped the top on my 7700k
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How long should I let the silicon dry?


I let mine dry for about 2 hours then just held it with my finger when i strapped it in the mobo


----------



## Ziver

Is it safe to use ? I cant find permatex :/


----------



## OutlawII

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ziver*
> 
> Is it safe to use ? I cant find permatex :/


Looks fine to use


----------



## Ceadderman

You can find Permatex at your local auto supply shop. Trust me. I worked in that field for a few years. They carry Red, Blue, Black and Copper. Some even carry Clear.









Even places like Wal*Mart KMART and Sears carry it.









But yes that will work too, in answer to your question.









~Ceadder


----------



## Ziver

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> You can find Permatex at your local auto supply shop. Trust me. I worked in that field for a few years. They carry Red, Blue, Black and Copper. Some even carry Clear.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even places like Wal*Mart KMART and Sears carry it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But yes that will work too, in answer to your question.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I cant find in Turkey but i ll look again ?


----------



## NoDestiny

Did my i5-4690K. Used the Rocket cool kit to pop it. Took my time and cleaned it up nicely. Used Gelid as I didn't have anything better on hand. Didn't glue down the lid again, probably do that later down the line if I end up putting CLU or something else on it. The Gelid was a real pain to spread as anything more than about 2 strokes of a spreader made it ball up real bad. Drop was between 15*C and 20*C! Was easy enough to do and allowed me to feel a little better about some higher clocks (was topping out on air at around 4.4Ghz, now at 4.6Ghz with headroom to spare).


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NoDestiny*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did my i5-4690K. Used the Rocket cool kit to pop it. Took my time and cleaned it up nicely. Used Gelid as I didn't have anything better on hand. Didn't glue down the lid again, probably do that later down the line if I end up putting CLU or something else on it. The Gelid was a real pain to spread as anything more than about 2 strokes of a spreader made it ball up real bad. Drop was between 15*C and 20*C! Was easy enough to do and allowed me to feel a little better about some higher clocks (was topping out on air at around 4.4Ghz, now at 4.6Ghz with headroom to spare).


Gelid might be dried up if it balled up like that. My hydronaut had the same issue. Maybe once warmed up might spread easier


----------



## NoDestiny

I think the thermal paste was fine, just spreading it on a super smooth core like that, was hard to get it to stick if you "overworked" it. Could be wrong! The pic I posted is after I finally got a "perfect" 2-stroke spread.


----------



## Caos

In this tutorial of rockit88, it puts liquid metal in the IHS, is that correct?


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> In this tutorial of rockit88, it puts liquid metal in the IHS, is that correct?


You don't have to. If you do, be sure to put a THIN layer on each side. The amount in the site in the picture is enough for both sides, maybe even a hair too much.


----------



## ViTosS

Hello guys, I just ordered my Rockit 88, planning to delid my i7 4790k, I'm looking for the super glue to buy here in Brazil, I didn't find the exact same model as the official site recommends, so I would like to know if I can use this one (it is GEL too):



Translating the image:

''GEL extra strong and flexible - rubber in formula''

Thanks!









Edit.: I saw the last posts saying about the Permatex is better, I found this one for sale in my country (Brazil):


Is it better than the Loctite? And How I apply this one? 4 spots in the corner or grab a toothpick and spread all the edges and corners? I only imagine these two options:



There is also this one:



I didn't find 5940 here...


----------



## hayame

I think you should definitely use the silicon adhesive over the superglue, Just to make sure that you'd be able to delid again if ever needed (Not to mention it is what SiliconLottery does as well).

As for how to apply the permatex for a reseal, I say go all around instead of just 4 dots on the corner. HardOCP had a video (



 link with timestamp and full article just incase you need it is in the description) where they had problems with only putting adhesive on the 4 corners of the IHS, while applying it all around the IHS (Make sure to leave a small gap!) had better results when using CLU/liquid metal tim.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hayame*
> 
> I think you should definitely use the silicon adhesive over the superglue, Just to make sure that you'd be able to delid again if ever needed (Not to mention it is what SiliconLottery does as well).
> 
> As for how to apply the permatex for a reseal, I say go all around instead of just 4 dots on the corner. HardOCP had a video (
> 
> 
> 
> link with timestamp and full article just incase you need it is in the description) where they had problems with only putting adhesive on the 4 corners of the IHS, while applying it all around the IHS (Make sure to leave a small gap!) had better results when using CLU/liquid metal tim.


I see, a friend of mine said the glue indicated in Rockit site is better because with the silicone I would create a situation just like Intel did, a small gap between the DIE and IHS and poor dissipation, I showed the video where that guy glued all wrong the IHS, he said just need 4 dots in the corners just like shows in the official site of the tool, but you recommend using the Permatex Ultra Black I showed in the image?

Thank you!


----------



## Ceadderman

The problem existed not because of the quality of their glue but the application of it. Too much was applied at the factory.









~Ceadder


----------



## hayame

Yeah I'd recommend using permatex/adhesive silicone with going all around while having a small gap for heat expansion and whatnot.

I'm for this way because of the problems that the guy from hardocp ran into where there were possible gaps/z height between the ihs and die causing it not to perform as much as it should have with CLU/liquid metal tim (based on other results of changes/reduction in delta t).

However I know that I could be wrong and that the superglue (gel) method could be completely fine and doesn't have the same problems z height when applied to just the corners, and when I went about to see which method I should use for reseal like you have, the only problem I have seen someone with the superglue method was that they didn't use gel superglue and tried to delid a second time where the superglue took some of the pcb off with it. Other then that it just seems to boil down to whichever method a person prefers.

Edit: oh and I'm almost certain I used a lot more liquid metal tim (conductonaut) and permatex for when I delidded when compared to how hardocp or some of the other videos using the rockit 88 delid tool and relid tool. But I can't argue when I see <73c temps at load for my 7600k at [email protected] with only a 92mm rosewill air cooler and while using a h110i gtx, not seeing even 72c underload when at [email protected]


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hayame*
> 
> Yeah I'd recommend using permatex/adhesive silicone with going all around while having a small gap for heat expansion and whatnot.
> 
> I'm for this way because of the problems that the guy from hardocp ran into where there were possible gaps/z height between the ihs and die causing it not to perform as much as it should have with CLU/liquid metal tim (based on other results of changes/reduction in delta t).
> 
> However I know that I could be wrong and that the superglue (gel) method could be completely fine and doesn't have the same problems z height when applied to just the corners, and when I went about to see which method I should use for reseal like you have, the only problem I have seen someone with the superglue method was that they didn't use gel superglue and tried to delid a second time where the superglue took some of the pcb off with it. Other then that it just seems to boil down to whichever method a person prefers.
> 
> Edit: oh and I'm almost certain I used a lot more liquid metal tim (conductonaut) and permatex for when I delidded when compared to how hardocp or some of the other videos using the rockit 88 delid tool and relid tool. But I can't argue when I see <73c temps at load for my 7600k at [email protected] with only a 92mm rosewill air cooler and while using a h110i gtx, not seeing even 72c underload when at [email protected]


Alright, you convinced me







I will be buying the Permatex Ultra Black from the image I showed. Also this video:






He doesn't look like used the GEL super glue, seems like the old one where it is more like a liquid and runs off and that's why made all that mess over the PCB and even the tool. Actually seems exactly like this one here in this Loctite video:






The green brand they censored, but anyway, I will use Permatex all around and leave a small gap!


----------



## NIK1

Today I am going to use the Rocket DeLid and ReLid tool.Got some RTV black silicone gasket maker to fix the IHS to the PCB.Just wondering when using the black silicone if its ok to put a line on the left and right sides of the IHS
and not put any on the top and bottom.Or is it best to put it all the way around with a little gap.


----------



## XavieRElvis

I hate to beat a dead dog but I just read this:
http://edgeup.asus.com/2017/01/31/kaby-lake-overclocking-guide/
If you scroll down to the delidding part they used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut not only on the die-ihs but also on the ihs-cooler part
I was going to use Kryonaut between the latter but now I feel baffled
From what I've gathered so far in the forum this should not be applied to the cooler side cause of corrosion, hardening and conductivity issues.
Or am I missing something?
I'd love some in depth insight from the more experienced


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> I hate to beat a dead dog but I just read this:
> http://edgeup.asus.com/2017/01/31/kaby-lake-overclocking-guide/
> If you scroll down to the delidding part they used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut not only on the die-ihs but also on the ihs-cooler part
> I was going to use Kryonaut between the latter but now I feel baffled
> From what I've gathered so far in the forum this should not be applied to the cooler side cause of corrosion, hardening and conductivity issues.
> Or am I missing something?
> I'd love some in depth insight from the more experienced


It really is pointless, especially if you clean your pc regularly and take off the cooler to remove dust(like should be done anyways lol)

Its a hassle and pointless for a 1° drop. Use Kryonaut its amazing stuff anyways.


----------



## mrgnex

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Hello guys, I just ordered my Rockit 88, planning to delid my i7 4790k, I'm looking for the super glue to buy here in Brazil, I didn't find the exact same model as the official site recommends, so I would like to know if I can use this one (it is GEL too):
> 
> 
> 
> Translating the image:
> 
> ''GEL extra strong and flexible - rubber in formula''
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit.: I saw the last posts saying about the Permatex is better, I found this one for sale in my country (Brazil):
> 
> 
> Is it better than the Loctite? And How I apply this one? 4 spots in the corner or grab a toothpick and spread all the edges and corners? I only imagine these two options:
> 
> 
> 
> There is also this one:
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't find 5940 here...


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Today I am going to use the Rocket DeLid and ReLid tool.Got some RTV black silicone gasket maker to fix the IHS to the PCB.Just wondering when using the black silicone if its ok to put a line on the left and right sides of the IHS
> and not put any on the top and bottom.Or is it best to put it all the way around with a little gap.


I did just the 4 corners when I did my friends 6700k. It worked great and was just as strong. I did the whole corner though instead of just a little dab.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mrgnex*
> 
> I did just the 4 corners when I did my friends 6700k. It worked great and was just as strong. I did the whole corner though instead of just a little dab.


And you did you use Permatex or Loctite Super Glue?


----------



## MooMoo

Just don't use super glue, you will most likely regret it someday.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MooMoo*
> 
> Just don't use super glue, you will most likely regret it someday.


Alright, I just need one last confirmation, I can get this:



OR THIS



Whats the best?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> Alright, I just need one last confirmation, I can get this:
> 
> 
> 
> OR THIS
> 
> 
> 
> Whats the best?


Id get the top one and just do 4 corners (hell you can even do 2 corners and be perfectly fine), the high temp one just seems pointless, our cpus dont reach 1500°C haha.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Id get the top one and just do 4 corners (hell you can even do 2 corners and be perfectly fine), the high temp one just seems pointless, our cpus dont reach 1500°C haha.


But the problem is, only the second one is sold here in Brazil, the first one is from Amazon, so I would have to wait a couple time to arrive here and probably would be more expensive in the end, but if the first one is better I can do that sacrifice


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> But the problem is, only the second one is sold here in Brazil, the first one is from Amazon, so I would have to wait a couple time to arrive here and probably would be more expensive in the end, but if the first one is better I can do that sacrifice


There both fine for re-sealing, shame you only need a little bit. They come in such big quantities, id say if its that hard to come by just go to a machine/mechanic shop and have em give you a tiny bit. Its odd i know but you really really only need like a pea size, same as thermal paste.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> There both fine for re-sealing, shame you only need a little bit. They come in such big quantities, id say if its that hard to come by just go to a machine/mechanic shop and have em give you a tiny bit. Its odd i know but you really really only need like a pea size, same as thermal paste.


I will put a little bit around the sides and corners, also will leave a small gap as said to do, all I want is just to hold the IHS without move when I pull down the lever in the socket


----------



## peter2k

OCN name: Peter2K
CPU: 7600K
on die-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal
ihs-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal

Mhz gained: if I look from stock boost on 4 cores 1.2 Ghz







(100Mhz more compared before delid, but those temps







)

OC after delid: 5.2 (could get 5.3 stable, but having to use 1.44v makes me nervous as 24/7







)

Temp drops: 20 degrees
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/kaicj6

those pics are with an air cooler, (using a Kraken X62 now, temps dropped again some)
but the delid did quite a lot

used simple black silicone to re attach the IHS, as thin as possible
in retrospect, could have done just the corners or not glue it back at all
did the delid back in January

I used Asus RealBench for stress testing (8 hours on each run)

before delid


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






and after


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







and the final clock I've "settled" on
though this is with the AiO, so temps are just not before and after anymore










Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







also
mmm look how thick that layer of TIM is


----------



## GTRtank

Sent my 7700k to silicon lottery for delid, 30c drop which I'm stoked about, gave me loads of headroom. A little more than my 3770K. Can't wait to push this thing! It'll do 5.0 at 1.25v so I'm hoping for 5.2 at less than 1.4v, but well see.


----------



## NIK1

How long after Reliding do you let the black silicone cure/dry for..


----------



## GTRtank

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> How long after Reliding do you let the black silicone cure/dry for..


In automotive, we go off what's on the tube. I would do the same here since we're talking temperature. So for RTV black let it cure a full 24 hours before applying a heat load onto it.


----------



## NIK1

Thanks for the info.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Anyone know a good pump out resistant Thermal Paste for the under IHS - CPU interface?
I'm keen to delid but not so keen to use liquid metal.
Also, realistically, how bad is the pump-out risk?

I currently have access to HeGrease Extreme (equivalent to GC Extreme)

Cheers


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Anyone know a good pump out resistant Thermal Paste for the under IHS - CPU interface?
> I'm keen to delid but not so keen to use liquid metal.
> Also, realistically, how bad is the pump-out risk?
> 
> I currently have access to HeGrease Extreme (equivalent to GC Extreme)
> 
> Cheers


All non conductive pastes will pump out over time and will not give you anywhere near the temperature drops, compared to using a liquid metal such as CLU or Conductonaut under the IHS.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> All non conductive pastes will pump out over time and will not give you anywhere near the temperature drops, compared to using a liquid metal such as CLU or Conductonaut under the IHS.


From the testing ive done thats not entirely true. Youll get the same temps from TIMs that you will with liquid metals. It proves that the glue gap is the issue.

Problem is the pastes dont last its why we use clu not because it gives 1-2°C drop over pastes.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> From the testing ive done thats not entirely true. Youll get the same temps from TIMs that you will with liquid metals. It proves that the glue gap is the issue.
> 
> Problem is the pastes dont last its why we use clu not because it gives 1-2°C drop over pastes.












That's basically exactly what he said... which part was not entirely true? I guess the words "anywhere near"... OK then I guess.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's basically exactly what he said... which part was not entirely true? I guess the words "anywhere near"... OK then I guess.


Yea he said TIMs wont get you anywhere near the temps as clu, problem is, the temps are IDENTICAL when using a quality TIM and liquid metal UNDER the IHS. Above it doesnt make much difference either.

Ive tested over a dozen TIMs on die, bare die (eliminating the IHS as a variable) and the top 5 pastes (gc/noctua/kryonaut/hydronaut/mx4 all had the same temps are clu, given the margin of error. The problem is they dont last, noctua pumped out for me within 24hrs, gc extreme lasted 2 days then temps shot up.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Yeah, and if it's one of the lower viscosity pastes I'm sure just the pressure of the block on the IHS (or in your case die) has already started some of the pumping by physical force alone.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Yeah, and if it's one of the lower viscosity pastes I'm sure just the pressure of the block on the IHS (or in your case die) has already started some of the pumping by physical force alone.


Correct, i even used pressure paper to test it (which honestly bare die the pressure was mediocre at best, it puts more pressure on the cpu socket then the die, which is a good thing for the die), and nothing really last beyond a few days. Both paste and liquid metal gave me 49°C at 1.21v on a 4690k, higher tdp chips like the 7700k would probably be even faster, smaller die and more concentrated heat.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> From the testing ive done thats not entirely true. Youll get the same temps from TIMs that you will with liquid metals. It proves that the glue gap is the issue.
> 
> Problem is the pastes dont last its why we use clu not because it gives 1-2°C drop over pastes.


I don't doubt you're testing and I have not done it myself
and testing review style is kinda hard to come by (in fact I've only found one site who tried to compare, opposed to one or 2 users)










https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/02/intel_kaby_lake_i57600k_cpu_delid_relid_temp_results/


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea he said TIMs wont get you anywhere near the temps as clu, problem is, the temps are IDENTICAL when using a quality TIM and liquid metal UNDER the IHS. Above it doesnt make much difference either.
> 
> Ive tested over a dozen TIMs on die, bare die (eliminating the IHS as a variable) and the top 5 pastes (gc/noctua/kryonaut/hydronaut/mx4 all had the same temps are clu, given the margin of error. The problem is they dont last, noctua pumped out for me within 24hrs, gc extreme lasted 2 days then temps shot up.


ahh
I see
yeah temps are the same for whatever good TIM you're using on the IHS

sorry


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I don't doubt you're testing and I have not done it myself
> and testing review style is kinda hard to come by (in fact I've only found one site who tried to compare, opposed to one or 2 users)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/02/intel_kaby_lake_i57600k_cpu_delid_relid_temp_results/


Yea i see that, but read this under it lol.

"These drops are not as sizable as we saw with the 7700K, but we are also dealing with a much cooler loaded temperature as well, so we should expect diminishing returns."

It can vary greatly between CPUs thats the problem. No 2 are really alike if you think about it.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea i see that, but read this under it lol.
> 
> "These drops are not as sizable as we saw with the 7700K, but we are also dealing with a much cooler loaded temperature as well, so we should expect diminishing returns."
> 
> It can vary greatly between CPUs thats the problem. No 2 are really alike if you think about it.


well it's also with the 7700k they went straight to liquid metal
like everyone else really

they only tested a different TIM *under* the IHS on the 7600K

it's just hard to come by such a thing

people really just go straight liquid metal

and having used it several times

I feel like it would also give best results for long times as adhesion and cohesion are so extreme

in fact I had trouble (compared to more traditional TIM) to spread the liquid metal

felt like
painting oil on a water surface









that said
the liquid ultra performs better in handling than the Phobya LM


----------



## NIK1

I have a Z97 mb with a delided I7-4790k with Liquid Ultra under the IHS for 2 years now, checked it a month ago when swapping the Swiftech water block for a aqua-computer pure nickel one and the liquid ultra looks the same as it was 2 yrs ago when I first put it on.


----------



## paskowitz

Just put CLU on my Lenovo X1 Carbon and temps dropped by 10c! Magic!


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Just put CLU on my Lenovo X1 Carbon and temps dropped by 10c! Magic!


Isn't that an aluminum heatsink under the cover? Hope you don't have to reapply before it'shows time to replace it.









~Ceadder


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Isn't that an aluminum heatsink under the cover? Hope you don't have to reapply before it'shows time to replace it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Correction... The entire cooling assembly is copper. Lenovo didn't cheap out.


----------



## Ceadderman

My next lappy will be Lenovo.









~Ceadder


----------



## geriatricpollywog

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My next lappy will be Lenovo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I have one for work. The old T410, T420, and T430 had a sturdy metal frame. The new T440 and T450 have a flimsy plastic frame. I'm on my 2nd 440 in a year. First one dropped when I was carrying it, but good riddance as it had many hardware glitches. My 2nd 440 is good so far, but I get a BSOD about once a week. It could be all the J&J company software, though.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Mmmm ic

I guess the extreme stress destroys the low viscosity pastes.
If durability is a concern, is there a reason why nobody has tried ICD? I used to use it in laptops where HSF contact is poor and extreme durability is needed.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> OCN name: Peter2K
> CPU: 7600K
> on die-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal
> ihs-TIM: Phobya Liquid Metal
> 
> Mhz gained: if I look from stock boost on 4 cores 1.2 Ghz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (100Mhz more compared before delid, but those temps
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> OC after delid: 5.2 (could get 5.3 stable, but having to use 1.44v makes me nervous as 24/7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Temp drops: 20 degrees
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/kaicj6
> 
> those pics are with an air cooler, (using a Kraken X62 now, temps dropped again some)
> but the delid did quite a lot
> 
> used simple black silicone to re attach the IHS, as thin as possible
> in retrospect, could have done just the corners or not glue it back at all
> did the delid back in January
> 
> I used Asus RealBench for stress testing (8 hours on each run)
> 
> before delid
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and after
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and the final clock I've "settled" on
> though this is with the AiO, so temps are just not before and after anymore
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> also
> mmm look how thick that layer of TIM is


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Caos

96 ° rectified alcohol can I use to clean the die?


----------



## Ceadderman

Should be just fine. Just make sure the die is dry before applying liquid metal to it.









~Ceadder


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Should be just fine. Just make sure the die is dry before applying liquid metal to it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


The pcb around the die where the black glue also has to clean with alcohol?

Excellent , ,. Thank you very much for the reply.


----------



## Ceadderman

Nope. Use a thin plastic such as a business/credit card to remove the epoxy on the side. I don't recommend a razor or alcohol for that.

You are most welcome.









~Ceadder


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Nope. Use a thin plastic such as a business/credit card to remove the epoxy on the side. I don't recommend a razor or alcohol for that.
> 
> You are most welcome.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


ok, Thanks again


----------



## hai-one

OCN name: hai-one
CPU: i7 3770k
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.4 @ 1.16v
Temp drops: ~ 15ºC
Cooler: Le Grand Macho RT

PROOF:

Before:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!







After:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hai-one*
> 
> OCN name: hai-one
> CPU: i7 3770k
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.4 @ 1.16v
> Temp drops: ~ 15ºC
> Cooler: Le Grand Macho RT
> 
> PROOF:
> 
> Before:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## CreamyBeast

I just ordered the de8auer delid-die-mate 2, grizzly conductant and kryonaut and are planning to delid my 7700k and put grizzly conductant inbetween the die and IHS.

I do have a few questions and I am too lazy to browse 3200+ pages.

1. Is there any risk for my grizzly conductant (LM) to sip out from between the die and IHS and run down my cpu onto the socket itself while being positioned vertically? Or does the LM stay firmly in place? I am going to relid the cpu by just mounting it in the bracket without any glue so there will be no glue stopping the LM in case it runs down my cpu.

2. Is nail polish or tape really necessary for covering the capacitors or whateverthey'recalled on the cpu? (my sister has a LOT of nail polish so that won't be a problem, I am just wondering).

3. Should I apply the LM on both the cpu die and the IHS or just the die? Wouldnt applying on both of them cause there to be too much LM = the LM sips out from inbetween?

4. Since I am not using glue, do I have to take extra precautions not to crush the cpu while mounting the cpu cooler?

5. Can I apply the LM between the IHS and the cooler? There seems to be mixed opinions about this all around the internet, I do not plan to ever remove the cooler.

The store I ordered from is based in Sweden and they have ordered a large batch of the delid die mates from Germany so there will be plenty of time for answers before I begin my delidding process







.

My 7700k runs at 5GHz 1.35V and XMP 3200Mhz 16-18-18-36 at 85 degrees max in Aida64 with thermatake water 3.0 ultimate and the preapplied paste, after delidding I will also post my results here so others can see the results from this specific cooler since I myself had trouble finding more than a few thermal test results with this cooler.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CreamyBeast*
> 
> I just ordered the de8auer delid-die-mate 2, grizzly conductant and kryonaut and are planning to delid my 7700k and put grizzly conductant inbetween the die and IHS.
> 
> I do have a few questions and I am too lazy to browse 3200+ pages.
> 
> 1. Is there any risk for my grizzly conductant (LM) to sip out from between the die and IHS and run down my cpu onto the socket itself while being positioned vertically? Or does the LM stay firmly in place? I am going to relid the cpu by just mounting it in the bracket without any glue so there will be no glue stopping the LM in case it runs down my cpu.
> 
> 2. Is nail polish or tape really necessary for covering the capacitors or whateverthey'recalled on the cpu? (my sister has a LOT of nail polish so that won't be a problem, I am just wondering).
> 
> 3. Should I apply the LM on both the cpu die and the IHS or just the die? Wouldnt applying on both of them cause there to be too much LM = the LM sips out from inbetween?
> 
> 4. Since I am not using glue, do I have to take extra precautions not to crush the cpu while mounting the cpu cooler?
> 
> 5. Can I apply the LM between the IHS and the cooler? There seems to be mixed opinions about this all around the internet, I do not plan to ever remove the cooler.
> 
> The store I ordered from is based in Sweden and they have ordered a large batch of the delid die mates from Germany so there will be plenty of time for answers before I begin my delidding process
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> My 7700k runs at 5GHz 1.35V and XMP 3200Mhz 16-18-18-36 at 85 degrees max in Aida64 with thermatake water 3.0 ultimate and the preapplied paste, after delidding I will also post my results here so others can see the results from this specific cooler since I myself had trouble finding more than a few thermal test results with this cooler.


1.
I don't think there are any long term experiences with the grizzly liquid metal, that being said, they all use the same ingredient, Gallium
I'd say its fine, once you use it you notice how high adhesion and cohesion in those are

I'm in the same boat as you, have not seen anything seep out, that being said more is not always better right?







(in volume)
I've used Phobya LM *on* my IHS before I delidded, then after delid as well

first try, in retrospect I used too much











still there was no liquid "lost" to the sides
I used less on the AiO I'm using now

2.
I used some of the original TIM from Intel, handles more like a wax anyway and is not conducting
I used it for the same reason you ask, I think I've seen literally everyone doing it (btw its 4 gold contacts only, older generations had more stuff in the way)
just do it








its not much of a hassle, hell if you do it like me you already have it in front of you

3. I've seen different opinions on the matter
however one reason why temps are so high with stock TIM is z-height

the IHS is just a tad too far away from the IHS (because of the glue), you'll notice once you have it off how thick the TIM is
also the inside of the IHS was kinda rough for me, so I felt like I needed a bit more liquid to fill up the ridges

anyway that's how I did it, but then I've seen others do it that way



4.
no
the IHS is there to protect it, the glue is more the reason we have problems
the IHS will slide a bit once you put the clamps down
just press youre finger hard on the IHS when you do to keep it in place (of course clean the IHS afterwards)

on a side note, putting just a bit of glue on each corner will improve handling, as in the IHS doesn't just fall off or slides, it has nothing to hold it in place









5. yes you can

it does not make a big difference, like 1-2 degrees maybe (compared to the kryonaut you also have)

its more of a convenience thing

the liquid metals stain (which actually means they react a bit with the metal of the cooler and form an alloy, even copper; Nickel plated cooler should be fine) and you at least have to scrub with some metal scrap pad (like found in coollaboratory LM packaging)

on temps
AIDA isn't exactly the hottest test of the bunch


Kaby Lake Overclocking Guide [With Statistics]

My guess is with a more demanding stress test program you'd probably hit above 90 normally


----------



## CreamyBeast

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> 1.
> I don't think there are any long term experiences with the grizzly liquid metal, that being said, they all use the same ingredient, Gallium
> I'd say its fine, once you use it you notice how high adhesion and cohesion in those are
> 
> I'm in the same boat as you, have not seen anything seep out, that being said more is not always better right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (in volume)
> I've used Phobya LM *on* my IHS before I delidded, then after delid as well
> 
> first try, in retrospect I used too much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> still there was no liquid "lost" to the sides
> I used less on the AiO I'm using now
> 
> 2.
> I used some of the original TIM from Intel, handles more like a wax anyway and is not conducting
> I used it for the same reason you ask, I think I've seen literally everyone doing it (btw its 4 gold contacts only, older generations had more stuff in the way)
> just do it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> its not much of a hassle, hell if you do it like me you already have it in front of you
> 
> 3. I've seen different opinions on the matter
> however one reason why temps are so high with stock TIM is z-height
> 
> the IHS is just a tad too far away from the IHS (because of the glue), you'll notice once you have it off how thick the TIM is
> also the inside of the IHS was kinda rough for me, so I felt like I needed a bit more liquid to fill up the ridges
> 
> anyway that's how I did it, but then I've seen others do it that way
> 
> 
> 
> 4.
> no
> the IHS is there to protect it, the glue is more the reason we have problems
> the IHS will slide a bit once you put the clamps down
> just press youre finger hard on the IHS when you do to keep it in place (of course clean the IHS afterwards)
> 
> on a side note, putting just a bit of glue on each corner will improve handling, as in the IHS doesn't just fall off or slides, it has nothing to hold it in place
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5. yes you can
> 
> it does not make a big difference, like 1-2 degrees maybe (compared to the kryonaut you also have)
> 
> its more of a convenience thing
> 
> the liquid metals stain (which actually means they react a bit with the metal of the cooler and form an alloy, even copper; Nickel plated cooler should be fine) and you at least have to scrub with some metal scrap pad (like found in coollaboratory LM packaging)
> 
> on temps
> AIDA isn't exactly the hottest test of the bunch
> 
> 
> Kaby Lake Overclocking Guide [With Statistics]
> 
> My guess is with a more demanding stress test program you'd probably hit above 90 normally


Thank you for the in depth response! I think my high temps in Aida64 is also due to the fact I got my AIO cooler with the pre-applied thermal paste kind of "ruined" since a tiny spot of maybe 5mm in diameter was entirely wiped off of thermal paste and also 1/5 had a very thin layer of thermal paste... So I guess I could be getting even better thermal results after I delid. (When it comes to Prime95 Small FFTs I turn the stresstest off after 2 seconds because the cpu instantly thermal throttles...)


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *CreamyBeast*
> 
> Thank you for the in depth response! I think my high temps in Aida64 is also due to the fact I got my AIO cooler with the pre-applied thermal paste kind of "ruined" since a tiny spot of maybe 5mm in diameter was entirely wiped off of thermal paste and also 1/5 had a very thin layer of thermal paste... So I guess I could be getting even better thermal results after I delid. (When it comes to Prime95 Small FFTs I turn the stresstest off after 2 seconds because the cpu instantly thermal throttles...)


not by huge margins better (most important is the center where the DIE is directly under)

@5 Ghz and 1.35v hitting really high temps would be normal without a delid

yeah thermal throttling in prime








that delid gonna do wonders

oh and don't go overboard on stresstesting

for instance I get the drift that 8 hour RealBench is considered stable by most
but most of us do only gaming

if one runs Blender all day long maybe something even more demanding to be sure


----------



## tknight

As most of us know, when liquid metal is used on the die and under the IHS, after having delidded a cpu, it lowers the temps considerably more than using a non conductive thermal paste under the IHS.
Some people on here have tried to debate, that the difference in temperature drop between using a liquid metal and a non conductive paste under the die is the same and even though there has been quite a large number of people who have achieved greater temperature drops with liquid metal, you still have the few trying to argue their case.

Well now Tom's hardware has done a delidding and overclocking article and it clearly shows, that liquid metal under the IHS gives a temperature drop of 22 degrees, compared to using Kryonaut under the IHS which only gives a temperature drop of 6 degrees.

So the theory that non conductive paste and liquid metal give the same temperature drop, and that it is only the gap that causes the high temps, is not correct. Whilst the gap does play a role in the high temps, the use of a superior liquid metal TIM does make a considerable difference to improved temperatures.
And to further prove that its not just the gap alone that improves temps, when the Kryonaut is applied in the article, the gap is no longer there as the cpu has been delidded, so the comparison results between the Kryonaut and the Conductonaut are purely based on the TIM's performance, as the gap has been eliminated in both scenarios.



Delidding/Overclocking Article - http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/kaby-lake-de-lidding-overclocking-test,4970.html


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> As most of us know, when liquid metal is used on the die and under the IHS, after having delidded a cpu, it lowers the temps considerably more than using a non conductive thermal paste under the IHS.
> Some people on here have tried to debate, that the difference in temperature drop between using a liquid metal and a non conductive paste under the die is the same and even though there has been quite a large number of people who have achieved greater temperature drops with liquid metal, you still have the few trying to argue their case.
> 
> Well now Tom's hardware has done a delidding and overclocking article and it clearly shows, that liquid metal under the IHS gives a temperature drop of 22 degrees, compared to using Kryonaut under the IHS which only gives a temperature drop of 6 degrees.
> 
> So the theory that non conductive paste and liquid metal give the same temperature drop, and that it is only the gap that causes the high temps, is not correct. Whilst the gap does play a role in the high temps, the use of a superior liquid metal TIM does make a considerable difference to improved temperatures.
> And to further prove that its not just the gap alone that improves temps, when the Kryonaut is applied in the article, the gap is no longer there as the cpu has been delidded, so the comparison results between the Kryonaut and the Conductonaut are purely based on the TIM's performance, as the gap has been eliminated in both scenarios.
> 
> 
> 
> Delidding/Overclocking Article - http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/kaby-lake-de-lidding-overclocking-test,4970.html


Furthermore, they also proved that liquid metal is pretty much as close as we can get to Fluxless solder.
http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Furthermore, they also proved that liquid metal is pretty much as close as we can get to Fluxless solder.
> http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/


It is VERY dependent on the CPU. A badly glued CPU will of course give you better temps no matter what you change.

People need to understand what the w/mK means or else you just wont get it. Its why i find posts disproving what we already know as fact is hilarious lol.

I don't know about you guys but i'm not measuring my temperatures for CPU cores in Kelvin.

P.S. They delided wrong btw, they glue wasn't removed and the gap is still going to be there. And guess what? Liquid metal works just as well thin or thick, thermal pastes DO NOT. So yea that article (from someone who actually understands heat transfer, is void)


----------



## Dasboogieman

Umm I rechecked the link to make sure we were reading the same article.
der8auer came to the same conclusion you did lol, I don't understand why that makes his study void.

The gap of course is king but I suspect the reason he left the glue there was he was still perfecting his soldering technique so presumably he wants easy access for practice. If anything, it proved how much we lost when Intel stopped using Fluxless solder. All the same, the usual Galinstan alloy is good enough to replace the solder so I'm satisfied.

Though, it was interesting to read about the risks of die damage when the Fluxless solder is applied, especially at intimate IHS contact pressures with small dies.


----------



## peter2k

https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/02/intel_kaby_lake_i57600k_cpu_delid_relid_temp_results/

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tknight*
> 
> Well now Tom's hardware has done


mmm
chuckles

Tom's hardware a month too late to the rescue


----------



## mAs81

Hey guys,

I just want to make sure;
I want to re-apply the Coolaboratory Liquid Pro on my delided 4790K , and I'm having kind of a brainfreeze moment here...Should I use 95% alcohol to clean the clp that's already on or what?Should I just wipe it off using a coffee filter or something,being extra careful that the liquid metal doesn't touch any conductors next to the chip?

I know it might sound stupid,but I've only done this once









Any input will be highly appreciated !


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/02/intel_kaby_lake_i57600k_cpu_delid_relid_temp_results/
> mmm
> chuckles
> 
> Tom's hardware a month too late to the rescue


See exactly what i mean lol.

You got one sit dropping 7°C from a quality TIM to liquid metal and another dropping 16°C haha. Its laughable at best.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> Hey guys,
> 
> I just want to make sure;
> I want to re-apply the Coolaboratory Liquid Pro on my delided 4790K , and I'm having kind of a brainfreeze moment here...Should I use 95% alcohol to clean the clp that's already on or what?Should I just wipe it off using a coffee filter or something,being extra careful that the liquid metal doesn't touch any conductors next to the chip?
> 
> I know it might sound stupid,but I've only done this once
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any input will be highly appreciated !


well since no one has comment yet

gonna reply something sounding stupid









I used baby wipes
worked good for me (of course I cleaned with alcohol afterwards)

paper towels were highly ineffective for me
in fact I can roll small pearls of liquid metal over a paper towel all day long since they don't really like getting soked into it

mmm
coffee filter
haven't tried yet
could maybe how it reacts

and yes, the liquid touching anything where it shouldn't is a no no

btw
for some users LM seems to have hardened out
then it gets really interesting how to remove it from the DIE

I'm not actually counting on needing to re apply my lquiqid metal
if temps are like they used to be


----------



## mAs81

Thanks for replying , but wouldn't baby wipes leave some residue on the chip?Not liquid residue , but the kind that kinda looks like hair,If you know what I'm talking about..At least the ones we have at home have that feel to them...


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> See exactly what i mean lol.
> 
> You got one sit dropping 7°C from a quality TIM to liquid metal and another dropping 16°C haha. Its laughable at best.


And in none of them was _fresh, new_ Corning TIM of the same SKU as the Intel TIM sourced so that it could at least be a decent comparison.

All of the tests pull the intel numbers pre-delid and the others by swapping post-delid. Until the Intel TIM is applied and tested in the exact same manner, it won't ever be anything other than conjecture as to how good/bad it actually is.

Of course, I agree with you that the gap between IHS and die is much more critical, but without a different methodology of testing there's never going to be anything close to consensus on this matter. No matter how many articles are written about it.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> Thanks for replying , but wouldn't baby wipes leave some residue on the chip?Not liquid residue , but the kind that kinda looks like hair,If you know what I'm talking about..At least the ones we have at home have that feel to them...


course (though no hairs, fibres and so on, more the liquid solution its drenched in)

that's why I cleaned up after them with some paper towels and some alcohol

its just to get the most of the liquid metal off first without it running away somewhere


----------



## Caos

Ready to delid my 7700k


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> See exactly what i mean lol.
> 
> You got one sit dropping 7°C from a quality TIM to liquid metal and another dropping 16°C haha. Its laughable at best.
> 
> 
> 
> And in none of them was _fresh, new_ Corning TIM of the same SKU as the Intel TIM sourced so that it could at least be a decent comparison.
> 
> All of the tests pull the intel numbers pre-delid and the others by swapping post-delid. Until the Intel TIM is applied and tested in the exact same manner, it won't ever be anything other than conjecture as to how good/bad it actually is.
> 
> Of course, I agree with you that the gap between IHS and die is much more critical, but without a different methodology of testing there's never going to be anything close to consensus on this matter. No matter how many articles are written about it.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

Kyle should really know better, than just spouting off about how the Intel tim is inferior, well of course it is, when the IHS is that far above the die.
And you have to use a liquid metal tim once the "gap" is removed by scraping off the glue, to get effective, lasting results.

I still have a problem with re-applying any kind of glue to the IHS after delidding, kind of defeats the whole purpose, imo.
I realize that some folks want the IHS to stay put afterwards, but holding it steady while clamping it down again will do that, while eliminating most of the original gap that was there pre-delid.


----------



## invincible20xx

does delidding considerably lowers temperatures on the 7700k like back in the day when the 3770k was the latest ?

i lowered my 3770k's temp back in early 2013 by as much as 25c by delidding it and applying CLU on it


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> does delidding considerably lowers temperatures on the 7700k like back in the day when the 3770k was the latest ?
> 
> i lowered my 3770k's temp back in early 2013 by as much as 25c by delidding it and applying CLU on it


Yes


----------



## invincible20xx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yes


i heard they fixed that starting devil's canyon


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *invincible20xx*
> 
> i heard they fixed that starting devil's canyon


Devils canyon delids didnt net 20-25°C like ivy saw, BUT on skylake and kaby lake they went back to using too much glue, and a thicker IHS so you see way more temp drops on sky/kaby then you did haswell.

My 4690k didnt see much when deliding, the 7700k are seeing some fairly significant temp drops.


----------



## Remizon

Hi guys, one question:

Will EK precisemount work with older EK blocks?
I have a EK Supreme HF, would it work without damaging the dye, anyone that has tried it?


----------



## Big Pappa Pump

So I just ordered the Rockit 88 LGA 1151 Delid kit + Relid Kit.. So I guess my first question for somebody in here.. Does anyone know any type of shipping time to Canada? Website gives very little information on anything. I also ordered (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material).

Something I forgot to do was in the suggested check-out page was to add the specific Glu that Rockit88 suggested. Now I don't want to place another $5 order through them and pay $12 shipping just for a little bit of Glu. I attempted to find the exact same Glu on Amazon and could not find anything. I know some people don't reseal the IHS back to the board but I would rather reseal it especially after paying for the re-lid kit. So I guess my last question is what other types of Glu/liquid rubber urethane?? can I use to reseal it. I would appreciate if somebody could point out a specific product so I don't F up and get the wrong thing!

Thanks!
~BPP~


----------



## KipH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Big Pappa Pump*
> 
> So I just ordered the Rockit 88 LGA 1151 Delid kit + Relid Kit.. So I guess my first question for somebody in here.. Does anyone know any type of shipping time to Canada? Website gives very little information on anything. I also ordered (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material).
> 
> Something I forgot to do was in the suggested check-out page was to add the specific Glu that Rockit88 suggested. Now I don't want to place another $5 order through them and pay $12 shipping just for a little bit of Glu. I attempted to find the exact same Glu on Amazon and could not find anything. I know some people don't reseal the IHS back to the board but I would rather reseal it especially after paying for the re-lid kit. So I guess my last question is what other types of Glu/liquid rubber urethane?? can I use to reseal it. I would appreciate if somebody could point out a specific product so I don't F up and get the wrong thing!
> 
> Thanks!
> ~BPP~


You will get the wrong thing. I already told you: Gorrilla glue fixes everything


----------



## Big Pappa Pump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KipH*
> 
> You will get the wrong thing. I already told you: Gorrilla glue fixes everything


lolz somebody might take your post seriously


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KipH*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Big Pappa Pump*
> 
> So I just ordered the Rockit 88 LGA 1151 Delid kit + Relid Kit.. So I guess my first question for somebody in here.. Does anyone know any type of shipping time to Canada? Website gives very little information on anything. I also ordered (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material).
> 
> Something I forgot to do was in the suggested check-out page was to add the specific Glu that Rockit88 suggested. Now I don't want to place another $5 order through them and pay $12 shipping just for a little bit of Glu. I attempted to find the exact same Glu on Amazon and could not find anything. I know some people don't reseal the IHS back to the board but I would rather reseal it especially after paying for the re-lid kit. So I guess my last question is what other types of Glu/liquid rubber urethane?? can I use to reseal it. I would appreciate if somebody could point out a specific product so I don't F up and get the wrong thing!
> 
> Thanks!
> ~BPP~
> 
> 
> 
> You will get the wrong thing. I already told you: Gorrilla glue fixes everything
Click to expand...

Lol!


----------



## Garrett1974NL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Rammoshe*
> 
> Hi guys, one question:
> 
> Will EK precisemount work with older EK blocks?
> I have a EK Supreme HF, would it work without damaging the dye, anyone that has tried it?


It may not work at all, since the die is actually *lower* than some of the plastic parts that surround the socket pins. So the waterblock would rest on those areas instead of directly on the die. Your best bet would be to delid, then apply Liquid Ultra between the die and IHS, glue the IHS back on and mount the waterblock in the normal way, as if the CPU was never delidded in the first place.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Garrett1974NL*
> 
> It may not work at all, since the die is actually *lower* than some of the plastic parts that surround the socket pins. So the waterblock would rest on those areas instead of directly on the die. Your best bet would be to delid, then apply Liquid Ultra between the die and IHS, glue the IHS back on and mount the waterblock in the normal way, as if the CPU was never delidded in the first place.


only sky/kaby lake I believe. Devils canyon sits higher due to the thicker pcb. I'm running naked mount on my 4790k and there was no issue with the mobo socket. Not sure if the naked mount kit works with older blocks like the hf though the EK site does say Supremacy EVO, I assume they'd say if it supported other blocks but maybe not.
https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy


----------



## NIK1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Big Pappa Pump*
> 
> So I just ordered the Rockit 88 LGA 1151 Delid kit + Relid Kit.. So I guess my first question for somebody in here.. Does anyone know any type of shipping time to Canada? Website gives very little information on anything. I also ordered (Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra 100% Metal Thermal Interface Material).
> 
> Something I forgot to do was in the suggested check-out page was to add the specific Glu that Rockit88 suggested. Now I don't want to place another $5 order through them and pay $12 shipping just for a little bit of Glu. I attempted to find the exact same Glu on Amazon and could not find anything. I know some people don't reseal the IHS back to the board but I would rather reseal it especially after paying for the re-lid kit. So I guess my last question is what other types of Glu/liquid rubber urethane?? can I use to reseal it. I would appreciate if somebody could point out a specific product so I don't F up and get the wrong thing!
> 
> Thanks!
> ~BPP~


I live in London, Ontario,and for me the Rocket kit took about a week and a half to get. Also, I was wondering what to use for the re-glue and the best to use on it I found here was Permatex Black RTV Adhesive Sealant...Crappy Tire or Home Hardware has it...11.49 for a 300ml tube.


----------



## Big Pappa Pump

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I live in London, Ontario,and for me the Rocket kit took about a week and a half to get. Also, I was wondering what to use for the re-glue and the best to use on it I found here was Permatex Black RTV Adhesive Sealant...Crappy Tire or Home Hardware has it...11.49 for a 300ml tube.


Thanks for the suggestions m8. Did you ever compare the Silicone to Glu? From my limited research in the last 10 minutes. Some people are suggesting Silicon would defeat the purpose of the delid as it would not allow the IHS to sit directly on the DIE. But just Glu'ing it on the corners would make that a non issue. The problem is the Glu on the corners are ugly and I would like to to look original haha.

I'm doing a 7700k btw.


----------



## NIK1

Just put a very small amount on with a toothpick,just around the 4 corners and not around the whole IHS like Intel did. Just a little dab underneath the 4 corners and let it dry overnight in the re-lider and she will be like Fort Knox.


----------



## wholeeo

Has anyone tried lapping the underside of the heat spreader? Is it even worth it?

Also,

Since I don't plan on reusing my Rockit 88 Delid Tool & Re-Lid Kit for a while I may start something where I share it with the rest of you guys. Perhaps a list can be compiled where it will be traveling. Once a person is done they send it to the next person in line until it eventually makes it's way back to me. There would be a minimum rep requirement. A few years ago someone here did something similar with a Spyder Calibrator and it seemed to go well. I may have to get mod approval as well.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> Has anyone tried lapping the underside of the heat spreader? Is it even worth it?
> 
> Also,
> 
> Since I don't plan on reusing my Rockit 88 Delid Tool & Re-Lid Kit for a while I may start something where I share it with the rest of you guys. Perhaps a list can be compiled where it will be traveling. Once a person is done they send it to the next person in line until it eventually makes it's way back to me. There would be a minimum rep requirement. A few years ago someone here did something similar with a Spyder Calibrator and it seemed to go well. I may have to get mod approval as well.


Brilliant idea actually nice technique.

As far as lapping under the heatspreader i wouldnt. Would be very difficult to get a flat surface that it might end up making it worse. Its pretty flat under there in the first place. Lap the top of the IHS and the heatsink/cooler base and youll have better results.


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Brilliant idea actually nice technique.
> 
> As far as lapping under the heatspreader i wouldnt. Would be very difficult to get a flat surface that it might end up making it worse. Its pretty flat under there in the first place. Lap the top of the IHS and the heatsink/cooler base and youll have better results.


Thanks, if that's the case I won't even bother.


----------



## NoDestiny

What about lapping the mating lip (the very bottom, where the original silicone was) to get the IHS closer to the core? Would be hard to gauge how far to go without some precision instruments, though...


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NoDestiny*
> 
> What about lapping the mating lip (the very bottom, where the original silicone was) to get the IHS closer to the core? Would be hard to gauge how far to go without some precision instruments, though...


I would do it if it looks like it has some burs on it or anything like that. And even though i would probably only try to take off like .01mm nothing more.


----------



## ViTosS

Well, I bought the:



But received this:



Not much of a difference or I need to talk with the seller and change for the one I wanted? Also, last question, I put all around the sides and corners or only in the 4 corners?

Thanks!


----------



## Reggie10

Tried delidding a 7700k yesterday using the Rockit tool and ran into some difficulty. The chip would not sit flush inside its pocket in the delid tool. I was under the impression that it would easily drop in and out as with a motherboard socket, but the tool's cutout for the chip was just a fraction of a millimeter too small to allow this. I had to use quite a bit of force to push the chip all the way into the tool, and getting it out was so difficult I wound up popping my IHS back off. Am I just a spaz or is there something wrong with my tool? (And yes, I did have the chip aligned correctly, i.e. bottom-left arrow symbols matched up.)


----------



## NIK1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Reggie10*
> 
> Tried delidding a 7700k yesterday using the Rockit tool and ran into some difficulty. The chip would not sit flush inside its pocket in the delid tool. I was under the impression that it would easily drop in and out as with a motherboard socket, but the tool's cutout for the chip was just a fraction of a millimeter too small to allow this. I had to use quite a bit of force to push the chip all the way into the tool, and getting it out was so difficult I wound up popping my IHS back off. Am I just a spaz or is there something wrong with my tool? (And yes, I did have the chip aligned correctly, i.e. bottom-left arrow symbols matched up.)


Did you line up the gold arrow on the chip with the triangle on the block..


----------



## Reggie10

I did.


----------



## NIK1

I am using the Rocket Delid tool today and am curious if anyone has put some clear nail polish on the 4 gold dots that are close to where the Liquid ultra is going.


----------



## chevy350

Need to get in a few more clubs and update system specs but here's what I've got goin on as of now








Also used Rockit 88 for de-lid and relid









OCN name: chevy350
CPU: [email protected] 4.8GHz now
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
Mhz gained: not attempted yet
OC after delid: original at 4.9GHz
Temp drops: 17C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jb58lb


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I am using the Rocket Delid tool today and am curious if anyone has put some clear nail polish on the 4 gold dots that are close to where the Liquid ultra is going.


I think nearly everyone does put "something" on

up to you what
nail polish, some special tape

personally I just used some of the original TIM, handles a bit like wax, is not conductive and was right in front of me when I delidded anyway


----------



## NIK1

No Nail polish handy,what about a dab of the Permatex clear RTV Adhesive Sealant Silicone over the 4 gold dots.Would this be ok.....


----------



## Zorgon

I didn't do anything with those 4 dots, and none of the guides or YouTube videos I've seen have either.


----------



## NIK1

Your right, I never noticed any one either covering up that spot in any video. Its so dam close, if any of the ultra leaks out and hits them, it might fry her. I will get some clear nail polish later this aft and put some on that spot anyway just to be safe.


----------



## wholeeo

Let me know how that works. Going to be sealing mine up for the last time later today after slapping some Conductonaut on the die.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> No Nail polish handy,what about a dab of the Permatex clear RTV Adhesive Sealant Silicone over the 4 gold dots.Would this be ok.....


literally everything would be fine
as long as it's not conducting

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zorgon*
> 
> I didn't do anything with those 4 dots, and none of the guides or YouTube videos I've seen have either.


as well as no one actually NEEDS to glue the IHS back on

people who are selling those delid services (with LM add on







) put some stuff on those contact

though older generations had more in the way under the IHS


















also people are not always experienced or even handy at all

like this old one that got opened after being bought from EBay









or like this










I'm not saying this is how things will end up

but we got people delidding that usually wouldn't have if they had to delid with a vice


----------



## Zorgon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*


I am one of those first-time delidders with Kaby Lake/Rockit88 tool (7700K in Silverstone SG13 ITX).

What are the causes of those horrendous relid attempts? I just used a thin amount of CLU with brush and then 4 corner dots of the Ultra Black RTV pictured on previous page.

Also, what is the benefit of covering up those 4 pins?


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zorgon*
> 
> I am one of those first-time delidders with Kaby Lake/Rockit88 tool (7700K in Silverstone SG13 ITX).
> 
> What are the causes of those horrendous relid attempts? I just used a thin amount of CLU with brush and then 4 corner dots of the Ultra Black RTV pictured on previous page.
> 
> Also, what is the benefit of covering up those 4 pins?


Most likely a precautionary measure for those who may be afraid of shorting them with conductive pastes.


----------



## TK421

I have the RTV "Permatex Ultra Black 82180 OEM specified"

Is this the correct RTV to use with intel 7700K?

How do you apply the RTV and how much should you apply to the CPU IHS?


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> I have the RTV "Permatex Ultra Black 82180 OEM specified"
> 
> Is this the correct RTV to use with intel 7700K?
> 
> How do you apply the RTV and how much should you apply to the CPU IHS?


Your Permatex Silicone will work just fine.
Apply just like Intel did.


----------



## TK421

so very thin lines of the permatex along the edge of IHS?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chevy350*
> 
> Need to get in a few more clubs and update system specs but here's what I've got goin on as of now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also used Rockit 88 for de-lid and relid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: chevy350
> CPU: [email protected] 4.8GHz now
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
> Mhz gained: not attempted yet
> OC after delid: original at 4.9GHz
> Temp drops: 17C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/jb58lb
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> so very thin lines of the permatex along the edge of IHS?


Exactly, Just be sure to leave a little space like Intel did.


----------



## Arctucas

Actually, a dot of PermaTex on each of the corners of the IHS, clamped in the Rockit88 re-lid tool for 8 hours to cure, should hold the IHS on well enough.

At least, it did for me.


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vommok*
> 
> Exactly, Just be sure to leave a little space like Intel did.


ok I'll try to do this when the relid tool is in

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Actually, a dot of PermaTex on each of the corners of the IHS, clamped in the Rockit88 re-lid tool for 8 hours to cure, should hold the IHS on well enough.
> 
> At least, it did for me.


minimum of 8 hours or more is better?


----------



## wholeeo

I only let my silicone set for about 2 hours. Seemed like it set well once I mounted it on the board.

Does anyone know if it's safe to use conductonaut between the heat spreader and a nickel plated block?


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> I only let my silicone set for about 2 hours. Seemed like it set well once I mounted it on the board.
> 
> Does anyone know if it's safe to use conductonaut between the heat spreader and a nickel plated block?


Safe? Yes. Necessary or recommended? No.


----------



## wholeeo

So it won't stain or corrode the block? I love my mirror nickel finish


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> So it won't stain or corrode the block? I love my mirror nickel finish


I did it on my Watercool Heatkiller IV PRO and it looks the same as the day I got it. Discoloration only happens on bare copper.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zorgon*
> 
> I am one of those first-time delidders with Kaby Lake/Rockit88 tool (7700K in Silverstone SG13 ITX).
> 
> What are the causes of those horrendous relid attempts? I just used a thin amount of CLU with brush and then 4 corner dots of the Ultra Black RTV pictured on previous page.
> 
> Also, what is the benefit of covering up those 4 pins?


man beats me what people think sometimes

more is better I guess









its just a precaution to cover those dots

I'm not convinced the liquid metal moves at all
adhesion and cohesion of that stuff is actually quite good

but I remember hearing Raja from Asus having concerns about the stuff migrating

but again it's just a precaution and there are CPU's with so much more under the IHS than a kaby lake
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> So it won't stain or corrode the block? I love my mirror nickel finish


gotta be careful with anything copper

Nickel is fine

I've only seen pictures of staining with copper surfaces


----------



## bluej511

Using it between the IHS and block/heatsink is honestly pointless. It may not stain but it might end up etching the nickel plating. The 1°C difference isn't worth the headache if u need to take it apart and it solidifies lol.

Me personally its TIM all the way, i may purchase some Kryonaut and give it a try on my new 1700x cpu and see if it makes any difference.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Big Pappa Pump*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *NIK1*
> 
> I live in London, Ontario,and for me the Rocket kit took about a week and a half to get. Also, I was wondering what to use for the re-glue and the best to use on it I found here was Permatex Black RTV Adhesive Sealant...Crappy Tire or Home Hardware has it...11.49 for a 300ml tube.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the suggestions m8. Did you ever compare the Silicone to Glu? From my limited research in the last 10 minutes. Some people are suggesting Silicon would defeat the purpose of the delid as it would not allow the IHS to sit directly on the DIE. But just Glu'ing it on the corners would make that a non issue. The problem is the Glu on the corners are ugly and I would like to to look original haha.
> 
> I'm doing a 7700k btw.
Click to expand...

With or without Ptex the IHS will *never* sit directly on the die. Even if you were to run with no TIM between the IHS and the die. A slight amount of Ptex applied will make zero difference as it will not raise the IHS off the die as noticeably as the stock sealant did. Unless you left the stock sealant on the pcb.









~Ceadder


----------



## TK421

12usd for the tube? mine only cost 6usd on ebay lol


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Totally off topic but your new avatar makes me cringe and feel like crying Ceadder.









Although my first roommate back in college had a desk that looked nearly identical to that.


----------



## Ceadderman

I changed to that because it was sourced thru fB around the time the wife told me my desk was too messy. That was a couple years ago. It recently resurfaced so I changed it for the Yuks value.









If you enlarge it you will notice several bottles of yellow liquid. All of them water. So dude at least was hydrated.


















~Ceadder


----------



## ValhallaReject

I didn't find this thread until after I already delidded/re-lidded and installed. I did record a bunch of temps for various benchmarks at 4.9GHz both before and after to check temp differences, but I didn't use IBT. I didn't even take a picture of my 7700K without the lid. Bad ValhallaReject, bad.

Here's what I do have:

OCN name: ValhallaReject
CPU: intel i7 7700K
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: ProlimaTech PK-1
Mhz gained: 100MHz
OC after delid: 5.0GHz (this is 24/7 OC, I actually did 5.1 also, but didn't validate it)
Temp drops: 27C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e5ta4n

For the temp drop, I ran IBT on my current OC and noticed that the temp was close to what I got with SiSoft Sandra at the same OC. So, I had 4.9GHz OC temps recorded for SiSoft Sandra both before and after delidding. That's where the 27C drop came from (92C - 65C).

For photo evidence, all I can provide is my empty 7700K box along with the Rockit 88 delid kit and Conductonaut packaging. And a note with my username and date. That work?


Edit: I updated my CPU-Z validation link - I'm new to CPU-Z validation so I had left the default Name which didn't match my forum name and had it marked as private. All fixed now!


----------



## wholeeo

I'm still fine tuning my 5.2 clocks before I officially report. Waiting on a new radiator and fans as well. I feel that my cooling can be a bit better


----------



## ValhallaReject

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ValhallaReject*
> 
> I didn't find this thread until after I already delidded/re-lidded and installed. I did record a bunch of temps for various benchmarks at 4.9GHz both before and after to check temp differences, but I didn't use IBT. I didn't even take a picture of my 7700K without the lid. Bad ValhallaReject, bad.
> 
> Here's what I do have:
> 
> OCN name: ValhallaReject
> CPU: intel i7 7700K
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: ProlimaTech PK-1
> Mhz gained: 100MHz
> OC after delid: 5.0GHz (this is 24/7 OC, I actually did 5.1 also, but didn't validate it)
> Temp drops: 27C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e5ta4n
> 
> For the temp drop, I ran IBT on my current OC and noticed that the temp was close to what I got with SiSoft Sandra at the same OC. So, I had 4.9GHz OC temps recorded for SiSoft Sandra both before and after delidding. That's where the 27C drop came from (92C - 65C).
> 
> For photo evidence, all I can provide is my empty 7700K box along with the Rockit 88 delid kit and Conductonaut packaging. And a note with my username and date. That work?
> 
> 
> Edit: I updated my CPU-Z validation link - I'm new to CPU-Z validation so I had left the default Name which didn't match my forum name and had it marked as private. All fixed now!


New 5.2GHz CPU-Z validation w/ 32GB DDR4 @ 4000MHz: http://valid.x86.fr/1a5fyf


----------



## Anth0789

I guess its worth delidding after all, I'm going to order the Rockit 88 kit soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ValhallaReject*
> 
> I didn't find this thread until after I already delidded/re-lidded and installed. I did record a bunch of temps for various benchmarks at 4.9GHz both before and after to check temp differences, but I didn't use IBT. I didn't even take a picture of my 7700K without the lid. Bad ValhallaReject, bad.
> 
> Here's what I do have:
> 
> OCN name: ValhallaReject
> CPU: intel i7 7700K
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: ProlimaTech PK-1
> Mhz gained: 100MHz
> OC after delid: 5.0GHz (this is 24/7 OC, I actually did 5.1 also, but didn't validate it)
> Temp drops: 27C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e5ta4n
> 
> For the temp drop, I ran IBT on my current OC and noticed that the temp was close to what I got with SiSoft Sandra at the same OC. So, I had 4.9GHz OC temps recorded for SiSoft Sandra both before and after delidding. That's where the 27C drop came from (92C - 65C).
> 
> For photo evidence, all I can provide is my empty 7700K box along with the Rockit 88 delid kit and Conductonaut packaging. And a note with my username and date. That work?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: I updated my CPU-Z validation link - I'm new to CPU-Z validation so I had left the default Name which didn't match my forum name and had it marked as private. All fixed now!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ValhallaReject*
> 
> New 5.2GHz CPU-Z validation w/ 32GB DDR4 @ 4000MHz: http://valid.x86.fr/1a5fyf


Updated!


----------



## gammagoat

Edit, I don't have a picture. Was in such a hurry that I forgot. So maybe none official.

Had to see if this would work for me, happy to report that it has.

Already had 4.6 on cpu 10 runs of IBT at an ambient of 69f hottest core was 73c before delid, After delid 10 runs IBT hottest core 60c with an ambient temp of 71f.

Piece of cake to get the IHS of with razor blade, applying clu and cleaning of goo was more difficult.

Vcore is 1.355 so feel like I have a little room for say 4.8, we'll see in the near future!

OCN name:Gammagoat
CPU:6600K
on die-TIM:Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM:Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained:0
OC after delid:4.6
Temp drops:13C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/lh7uc1


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gammagoat*
> 
> Edit, I don't have a picture. Was in such a hurry that I forgot. So maybe none official.
> 
> Had to see if this would work for me, happy to report that it has.
> 
> Already had 4.6 on cpu 10 runs of IBT at an ambient of 69f hottest core was 73c before delid, After delid 10 runs IBT hottest core 60c with an ambient temp of 71f.
> 
> Piece of cake to get the IHS of with razor blade, applying clu and cleaning of goo was more difficult.
> 
> Vcore is 1.355 so feel like I have a little room for say 4.8, we'll see in the near future!
> 
> OCN name:Gammagoat
> CPU:6600K
> on die-TIM:Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM:Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained:0
> OC after delid:4.6
> Temp drops:13C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/lh7uc1


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Tilmitt

After getting an AIO cooler (Arctic Liquid Freezer 240) I reattempted the naked mount and this time it worked. At first I put a very light application of CLU but I noticed my temps got slightly worse. I unmounted the cooler and applied some extra CLU after which the temps plunged way down. I've read a lot of advice saying to go easy on the CLU but too little also seems to cause issues.

Here's a picture of the first application (*this was too little*).


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Well, obviously there has to be enough to make full contact with the mating surface. In your case I would guess that the die guard has a little extra thickness to make sure it does the job... hence requiring slightly more CLU. Likely if you used TIM it wouldn't require the extra because it would (initially at least) have a little more viscosity. Of course, then it would pump out and leave you back at square one so some extra CLU was the proper solution.


----------



## Ceadderman

Wonder if anyone is going to attempt a delid of Ryzen 7?









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Wonder if anyone is going to attempt a delid of Ryzen 7?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Already been done and shows like no improvement, its already soldered so honestly why would you? Plus it sits lower in the socket so youd hit the am4 socket/bracket before the die.


----------



## Ceadderman

How would you hit the socket/bracket? That sorta makes no sense my friend. Considering we don't delid while sitting in the socket.
















Color me confused.









~Ceadder


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> How would you hit the socket/bracket? That sorta makes no sense my friend. Considering we don't delid while sitting in the socket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Color me confused.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


The waterblock/heatsink would hit the am4 gray cpu socket that sits behind the cpu, the latch mechanism. Der8bauer already tried and said it made zero difference, was a 1°C drop in temps.


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> How would you hit the socket/bracket? That sorta makes no sense my friend. Considering we don't delid while sitting in the socket.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Color me confused.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The waterblock/heatsink would hit the am4 gray cpu socket that sits behind the cpu, the latch mechanism. Der8bauer already tried and said it made zero difference, was a 1°C drop in temps.


His mounting was flawed. The Cpu sits higher than the socket retention bracket. I've de-lidded some 15 soldered AMD processors. The socket style is the same since s754. We where de-lidding these since then, few have done soldered chips.

He should have seen an easy 5c temp drop but in most cases 10c.

I only bring these numbers to the table by experience. My FX-9590 showed very nice improvement in temp drops.

I won't have any Ryzen de-lid information for at least another month or so. I'd really like to do more than one chip to have additional data provided.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> His mounting was flawed. The Cpu sits higher than the socket retention bracket. I've de-lidded some 15 soldered AMD processors. The socket style is the same since s754. We where de-lidding these since then, few have done soldered chips.
> 
> He should have seen an easy 5c temp drop but in most cases 10c.
> 
> I only bring these numbers to the table by experience. My FX-9590 showed very nice improvement in temp drops.
> 
> I won't have any Ryzen de-lid information for at least another month or so. I'd really like to do more than one chip to have additional data provided.


Its soldered and soldered well why bother. There is no way you'll see 10°C from going from solder to lw. Especially on ryzen. Fx is a different story all together

Btw the socket style may be the same, HOWEVER the cpu and wafer are FAR from the same from my understanding.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its soldered and soldered well why bother. There is no way you'll see 10°C from going from solder to lw. Especially on ryzen. Fx is a different story all together


I agree, whatever gains are expect will come purely from the closer intimacy of cooler to die. Unlikely to yield 10 degrees unless the solder job was super bad and there are voids/debonds everywhere.




Also was testing out the Rockit tool on a poor old E2140
dayummm, Intel have been using thermal paste since C2D, esp for budget units. Check out that phat Silicon liner. gg


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its soldered and soldered well why bother. There is no way you'll see 10°C from going from solder to lw. Especially on ryzen. Fx is a different story all together
> 
> Btw the socket style may be the same, HOWEVER the cpu and wafer are FAR from the same from my understanding.


Why Bother?

Why bother to do anything we do with LN2? Or a water cooling setup with a chiller.....

Well, because I can. Simple as that.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ShrimpBrime*
> 
> I'm not going anywhere. I'm a de-lidder and happen to belong to this thread as much as any one.
> 
> However I've already flagged your previous post. Perhaps you should take a step.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Flag anything you want man. Unless you've delided 17 ryzen chips you really can't talk. I guess you forgot the fact that its a new chip, new architecture, new design and might be soldered differently. Or you just think its a remade am3 chip and its going to be delided the exact same way.


Eh hem.....

Move to PM, or end the argument please.


----------



## dmo580

Any thoughts regarding Conductonaut vs Liquid Ultra? Any advantages of using one over the other? I hear conductonaut is more runny/watery?


----------



## nizinizi

I will be doing deliding for some time. My first







. Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut is sold as 1gr and 5gr. Do I need more than 1gr or?

Also, about additional accessories, I found these :

http://www.ebay.de/itm/172560794078

http://www.ebay.de/itm/172101398312

Is there anything else I need? I already have bought Rockit Cool delit tool.


----------



## dmo580

What do you guys mean by traditional TIM pastes pumping out over time when you use them between IHS and die? Does that mean it seeps out?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> What do you guys mean by traditional TIM pastes pumping out over time when you use them between IHS and die? Does that mean it seeps out?


Seeps out and becomes unbelievably thin that it ends up not being useful at all.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Seeps out and becomes unbelievably thin that it ends up not being useful at all.


Interesting.... Not doubting anyone's reports, but I'm trying to understand from a technical perspective--given how watery liquid metal is I'm surprised thicker TIM pastes (MX-4, AS5, IC7, Kryonaut) are seeping out.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Interesting.... Not doubting anyone's reports, but I'm trying to understand from a technical perspective--given how watery liquid metal is I'm surprised thicker TIM pastes (MX-4, AS5, IC7, Kryonaut) are seeping out.


Because liquid metal can handle the highly concentrated heat a lot better then pastes can, and don't forget the pressure from the IHS as well.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Because liquid metal can handle the highly concentrated heat a lot better then pastes can, and don't forget the pressure from the IHS as well.


Thank you.

Some other questions if you have the time (I apologize as I'm a newbie delidder):

1. So my understanding is delidding is done to both eliminate the gap between the IHS and die and to replace the crappy TIM with a better one. Regarding the gap though, is the gap because Intel uses a lot of glue to keep the IHS glued to the PCB?

2. If my assumption in #1 is true, isn't it a bad idea to use silicone RTV in doing the relidding? It would seem to me that would once again introduce the gap because RTV is so thick?

3. What's the consensus on relidding in terms of securing the IHS? What "adhesive" should I use? Rockit recommends 4 dots of super glue, a lot of people use RTV, some people just clamp down the IHS by force with their cooler.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Some other questions if you have the time (I apologize as I'm a newbie delidder):
> 
> 1. So my understanding is delidding is done to both eliminate the gap between the IHS and die and to replace the crappy TIM with a better one. Regarding the gap though, is the gap because Intel uses a lot of glue to keep the IHS glued to the PCB?
> 
> 2. If my assumption in #1 is true, isn't it a bad idea to use silicone RTV in doing the relidding? It would seem to me that would once again introduce the gap because RTV is so thick?
> 
> 3. What's the consensus on relidding in terms of securing the IHS? What "adhesive" should I use? Rockit recommends 4 dots of super glue, a lot of people use RTV, some people just clamp down the IHS by force with their cooler.


Its mostly to get rid of the gap, the more TIM you use the WORSE it works, ideally you don't even want TIM to begin with.

Some people use a tiny bit of silicone in the corners and use pressure to even lessen the gap. I personally think its pointless as the retention bracket holds it in place anyways.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quick question...What RTV do you guys use for the reapply? Have someone off reddit coming by to use my rockit tool and he wants to go the RTV route instead of superglue gel (like I used).


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Quick question...What RTV do you guys use for the reapply? Have someone off reddit coming by to use my rockit tool and he wants to go the RTV route instead of superglue gel (like I used).


Maybe I should find someone with a Rockit tool kit and buy him a 6 pack of beer or something because unfortunately Rockit production is down right now due to some equipment issues


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Maybe I should find someone with a Rockit tool kit and buy him a 6 pack of beer or something because unfortunately Rockit production is down right now due to some equipment issues


Ha. I wouldn't mind that either. I actually lived 20 miles from Rockit so I was able to stop by their place back in Jan. They were busy as hell. Just a guy and his nephew running it. Very nice people. Any idea on the RTV?


----------



## ValhallaReject

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Ha. I wouldn't mind that either. I actually lived 20 miles from Rockit so I was able to stop by their place back in Jan. They were busy as hell. Just a guy and his nephew running it. Very nice people. Any idea on the RTV?


I used this stuff: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002UEN1U/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Doesn't take much, just enough to hold the lid in place. I think I clamped it in the Rockit 88 tool for about 3 hours before I put it back in my system.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ValhallaReject*
> 
> I used this stuff: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002UEN1U/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> Doesn't take much, just enough to hold the lid in place. I think I clamped it in the Rockit 88 tool for about 3 hours before I put it back in my system.


Thanks........

Ok so he got his chip and sent me this early morning.
Quote:


> As of right now I can't hit 5ghz even at 1.4v It crashes before I can get into windows. At 4.9ghz @ 1.39v temps are sitting around 80c with my li quid sitting at 42c and slowly creeping up.


Not sure what the quid is..Maybe gpu he meant. Anyways he told me he is running a 7700k and Asus IX Code board. I delidded his chip with my rockit cool the exact same way I did mine. I used 4 small spots of super glue gel in each corner just like mine. Let it sit for 3 and half hours before removing clamp. I used the Liquid Metal that came with the rockit cool on both the die and the on the bottom side of the ihs. Just like Rockit Cool's video. He is running an NZXT X62 for his cooling. Something isn't right. I told him he either has a very bad chip or he doesn't have a setting in the bios correct.

anyways..I am waiting for him to reply and I also told him to post here for help.


----------



## OutlawII

I have a Rock It send me a pm ill rent it out


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OutlawII*
> 
> I have a Rock It send me a pm ill rent it out


Lol I have one too but did it for free. Wasn't going to charge him. But I did everything the same like mine and mine runs at 5ghz @ 1.285 volts. Never has been over 65 under stress test. Gaming stays in the mid 40s to low 50s.


----------



## nizinizi

Is anybody able to provide insight for me about Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut quantity needed for delidings. It will be my first delid, so I do not have previous expirience. There is 1gr and 5gr for order. For example, roughtly how much times you can delid 4 core cpu with 1gr? tnx


----------



## Sedril

I'm getting ready to delid my two 7700k's and of course right when I go to order, apparently there's been a problem with the mill and Rockitcool isn't shipping or selling anything right now... We really should set up some delid tool rentals on the site!

On another note, I've read a few people seeing their liquid metal changing over time, drying out in spots or something to that effect... Almost makes me just want to use my normal Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut.

You all have any thoughts on that?

EDIT: I guess after reading back a few pages there's an issue with regular TIM seeping out... Maybe I'll go ahead and try the liquid metal first... I won't be using much glue to hold it in place so another de-lid / re-lid down the road won't be as big of a deal....


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sedril*
> 
> I'm getting ready to delid my two 7700k's and of course right when I go to order, apparently there's been a problem with the mill and Rockitcool isn't shipping or selling anything right now... We really should set up some delid tool rentals on the site!
> 
> On another note, I've read a few people seeing their liquid metal changing over time, drying out in spots or something to that effect... Almost makes me just want to use my normal Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut.
> 
> You all have any thoughts on that?
> 
> EDIT: I guess after reading back a few pages there's an issue with regular TIM seeping out... Maybe I'll go ahead and try the liquid metal first... I won't be using much glue to hold it in place so another de-lid / re-lid down the road won't be as big of a deal....


Yeah I'm a bit conflicted myself but my temps look so bad I want to delid









I'm also a bit concerned when they get their new mill back up if the new delidders are made exactly the same. I wouldn't be surprised if the first batch run into issues.

Also I feel like there's also enough people who haven't had any long term issues with liquid metal either so maybe it's just scattered bad apples?


----------



## Sedril

I had that same thought about the first batch, but I'm going to order as soon as it's available again unless I come up with one some other way.... I'll let you know how it goes...


----------



## 0ldChicken

@Sedril @dmo580I think I'm one of the only ones here I've seen with LM issues and I've only tried one batch of one brand so it seems LM is fine, regular paste will definitely have issues though


----------



## Sedril

That's good to know... I ordered Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra Thermal Paste Compound today, and as soon as I can get my hands on the de-lid tool I'll be giving this a shot.. I have two 7700k's and I'm trying to figure out which is the best of the two, but will be de-lidding both either way... Just want to find out which one to put in my main gaming rig....

Thanks for the input.


----------



## Boost240

Hi. Just delided and dropped some Conductonuat on my 6700k. Wow. WOOOOOW! I dropped 20+ degrees at 4.7ghz at 1.375 volts vs the stock settings on intel burn test. I'm now running at 1.402 at 4.8 and not only are temps low, but very stable. In Overwatch, for example, my temps used to bounce from 45-56 degrees celsius. At 4.8 it's very stable between 32-35. This is great. Also, I didn't reglue my lid. Was a little nerve-wracking though lol/


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Boost240*
> 
> Hi. Just delided and dropped some Conductonuat on my 6700k. Wow. WOOOOOW! I dropped 20+ degrees at 4.7ghz at 1.375 volts vs the stock settings on intel burn test. I'm now running at 1.402 at 4.8 and not only are temps low, but very stable. In Overwatch, for example, my temps used to bounce from 45-56 degrees celsius. At 4.8 it's very stable between 32-35. This is great. Also, I didn't reglue my lid. Was a little nerve-wracking though lol/


Gooood Gooooooooooooooooooooood. Enjoy the temps and the unlimited fraps


----------



## DidYouSeeDat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Ok so he got his chip and sent me this early morning.
> Not sure what the quid is..Maybe gpu he meant. Anyways he told me he is running a 7700k and Asus IX Code board. I delidded his chip with my rockit cool the exact same way I did mine. I used 4 small spots of super glue gel in each corner just like mine. Let it sit for 3 and half hours before removing clamp. I used the Liquid Metal that came with the rockit cool on both the die and the on the bottom side of the ihs. Just like Rockit Cool's video. He is running an NZXT X62 for his cooling. Something isn't right. I told him he either has a very bad chip or he doesn't have a setting in the bios correct.
> 
> anyways..I am waiting for him to reply and I also told him to post here for help.


I'm the one he is talking about. Awesome guy who's been helping me out throughout this process but we can't seem to figure out why I can't seem to overclock well at all.

My temperatures are okay according to him (36c idle and no higher than 70c underload at stock voltages and clock speeds ) my x62 kraken is running at 100% and the liquid has hit at the max 42c . I can't hit 5.0ghz at all and can't have a stable 4.9 overclock but I can boot because of high the high voltage of 1.4v . I don't know what else to do and my numbers aren't close to others . Hopefully can get some help here


----------



## skingun

Another delid


----------



## ValhallaReject

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DidYouSeeDat*
> 
> I'm the one he is talking about. Awesome guy who's been helping me out throughout this process but we can't seem to figure out why I can't seem to overclock well at all.
> 
> My temperatures are okay according to him (36c idle and no higher than 70c underload at stock voltages and clock speeds ) my x62 kraken is running at 100% and the liquid has hit at the max 42c . I can't hit 5.0ghz at all and can't have a stable 4.9 overclock but I can boot because of high the high voltage of 1.4v . I don't know what else to do and my numbers aren't close to others . Hopefully can get some help here


I don't have a Kraken, but I use a Corsair AOI. I had not installed the software that monitors the water temp, so I decided to do that and compare to your readings. After 1hr 47min (I went to make pancakes and forgot!) of Prime95 small FFTs, my hottest core temp was 74C and max water temp was 31.0C. That's at 5.0GHz @ 1.376V.

It seems like the heat from your CPU is making it to the water in the Kraken, but the Kraken is not removing it fast enough. I don't know if maybe your fans/pump are not operating correctly, or maybe your Kraken is in a place with poor airflow so it is recycling warmer air through the radiator? Just first thoughts off the top of my head.


----------



## ValhallaReject

I forgot to mention that my ambient temp is about 74F (air conditioning) and my system is an open air setup so the radiator is constantly getting cool room air through it.


----------



## hayame

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ValhallaReject*
> 
> I forgot to mention that my ambient temp is about 74F (air conditioning) and my system is an open air setup so the radiator is constantly getting cool room air through it.


You have a lot better water temps than me, the water temps for me gets up to about 36c in the worst scenarios on this h110i gtx but I'm able to keep my temps below 74c underload with a [email protected] Granted it does have some nf-af14 ippc 3k on them but I think his x62 should be around the same performance as my AIO (based on this http://www.gamersnexus.net/hwreviews/2788-evga-clc-280-review-vs-nzxt-x62-corsair-h115i/page-3 where the h115i is pretty much the same thing as a h110i gtx with newer firmware for the asatek stuff)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DidYouSeeDat*
> 
> I'm the one he is talking about. Awesome guy who's been helping me out throughout this process but we can't seem to figure out why I can't seem to overclock well at all.
> 
> My temperatures are okay according to him (36c idle and no higher than 70c underload at stock voltages and clock speeds ) my x62 kraken is running at 100% and the liquid has hit at the max 42c . I can't hit 5.0ghz at all and can't have a stable 4.9 overclock but I can boot because of high the high voltage of 1.4v . I don't know what else to do and my numbers aren't close to others . Hopefully can get some help here


I think you should focus on bringing down the water temps of your x62.

And I also heavily suspect that you would have been better off resealing with permatex/silicon adhesive as you might still have some unevenness with the z-height between the die and ihs


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hayame*
> 
> You have a lot better water temps than me, the water temps for me gets up to about 36c in the worst scenarios on this h110i gtx but I'm able to keep my temps below 74c underload with a [email protected] Granted it does have some nf-af14 ippc 3k on them but I think his x62 should be around the same performance as my AIO (based on this http://www.gamersnexus.net/hwreviews/2788-evga-clc-280-review-vs-nzxt-x62-corsair-h115i/page-3 where the h115i is pretty much the same thing as a h110i gtx with newer firmware for the asatek stuff)
> I think you should focus on bringing down the water temps of your x62.
> 
> And I also heavily suspect that you would have been better off resealing with permatex/silicon adhesive as you might still have some unevenness with the z-height between the die and ihs


Damn, my water temps only reach 36°C in the summer, sometimes not even that high. I'm only at 28°C with an case temp of 24°C


----------



## dmo580

Rockit Cool is back btw. But looks like no black parts. I'm so desperate I just ordered but the black delidder would look cooler









But really who cares, these are tools you use once and you put it away until your next upgrade (assuming it still fits)


----------



## hayame

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Damn, my water temps only reach 36°C in the summer, sometimes not even that high. I'm only at 28°C with an case temp of 24°C


Yeah I think my case causes an extra 2-3c or so when all the panels are on and the front of the case is also on.
When my computer is on for a good 4 hours with the A/C off, my room temp is around 27c


----------



## wholeeo

Well if anyone is interested here goes,

http://www.overclock.net/t/1627022/cross-country-rockit-delid-tool-extravaganza/0_100


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hayame*
> 
> You have a lot better water temps than me, the water temps for me gets up to about 36c in the worst scenarios on this h110i gtx but I'm able to keep my temps below 74c underload with a [email protected] Granted it does have some nf-af14 ippc 3k on them but I think his x62 should be around the same performance as my AIO (based on this http://www.gamersnexus.net/hwreviews/2788-evga-clc-280-review-vs-nzxt-x62-corsair-h115i/page-3 where the h115i is pretty much the same thing as a h110i gtx with newer firmware for the asatek stuff)
> I think you should focus on bringing down the water temps of your x62.
> 
> And I also heavily suspect that you would have been better off resealing with permatex/silicon adhesive as you might still have some unevenness with the z-height between the die and ihs


I did his the exact same way I did mine. My 7700k idles at 26c-28c depending on temp. Also I am at 5ghz @ 1.285v. I also have a custom loop though. His load temps are fine. It is his idle temps that have me confused. It should not idle that high. Also when he has HWmonitor open his VID shows 1.3, yet we have it set to 1.2v in the bios. Also he has XMP enabled.


----------



## hayame

It's probably the water temps for sure, sorry I doubted the reseal method.

I think it might be normal that the VID will do that (happened to me on adaptive voltage settings).


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hayame*
> 
> It's probably the water temps for sure, sorry I doubted the reseal method.
> 
> I think it might be normal that the VID will do that (happened to me on adaptive voltage settings).


but what would cause his idle temps to be high 30s to low 40s? Air temps are even lower than that.


----------



## TK421

Is there something like a syringe that makes the RTV application easier?


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> Is there something like a syringe that makes the RTV application easier?


Nope. Just push a small dab on a paper towel and use a toothpick to apply it to the corners of the IHS and then set that on the PCB.









~Ceadder


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> Is there something like a syringe that makes the RTV application easier?


you ever applied silicone anywhere?

it doesn't just dry out in an instant

you have plenty of time like Ceadder suggested to use anything suitably thin to make a fine line or small thin dots

I used a toothpick as well
picked up some silicone from a bigger blob and applied it as thin as I could

stuck the whole thing together, put it into the board and let it "cure" while being used

the clamps from the board create a lot of force anyway

the glue really is only for convenience if I should take out the CPU


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> but what would cause his idle temps to be high 30s to low 40s? Air temps are even lower than that.


if his VID is so high then why not set it manually to 1.2
it should override the VID at all times right?

at least to try it out
for science








if you haven't done it yet anyway

aside from that

his CPU might just be a dud when it comes to overclocking

high temps

well I was kinda unhappy about the mounting from my X62

so mounting issues aside

it could be too much paste, too high a voltage somewhere (kinda unlikely)
maybe bump the rpm of the pump?

is it the stock TIM that the X62 comes with?

is the idle temp kinda the same between turbo and silent mode?

just a few ideas


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> if his VID is so high then why not set it manually to 1.2
> it should override the VID at all times right?
> 
> at least to try it out
> for science
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if you haven't done it yet anyway
> 
> aside from that
> 
> his CPU might just be a dud when it comes to overclocking
> 
> high temps
> 
> well I was kinda unhappy about the mounting from my X62
> 
> so mounting issues aside
> 
> it could be too much paste, too high a voltage somewhere (kinda unlikely)
> maybe bump the rpm of the pump?
> 
> is it the stock TIM that the X62 comes with?
> 
> is the idle temp kinda the same between turbo and silent mode?
> 
> just a few ideas


Yea we set his vcore to manual then to 1.2v @ 4.5ghz. he said his idle temps were in the high 30's low 40s. Though when he puts a stress test on, it doesn't go above 70c.


----------



## hayame

Is his water temps lower than said idle cpu temps, or higher?

Edit: After changing to manual voltage of course


----------



## khemist

Back on water again, temps after one hour of BF1.

7700k @ 5.0 1.35v delidded, fans at 700rpm.

This is with a 480 rad just on the CPU, still waiting on my GPU block arriving.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> 
> 
> Back on water again, temps after one hour of BF1.
> 
> 7700k @ 5.0 1.35v delidded, fans at 700rpm.
> 
> This is with a 480 rad just on the CPU, still waiting on my GPU block arriving.


Very nice, i think my 1700x hits like 40°C in BF1 but then again ryzen temps arent reliable but then again the chip is soldered though and only uses like 60w in bf1.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hayame*
> 
> Is his water temps lower than said idle cpu temps, or higher?
> 
> Edit: After changing to manual voltage of course


I think he said his water temp is in the 40s....

http://www.overclock.net/t/1626971/delid-i7-7700k-achieving-good-temperatures-but-voltage-causing-problems-even-at-stock/0_100


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Nope. Just push a small dab on a paper towel and use a toothpick to apply it to the corners of the IHS and then set that on the PCB.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Ok I'll do that.

In this video though, I saw that the guy was using a needle tip thing for the RTV.


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> Ok I'll do that.
> 
> In this video though, I saw that the guy was using a needle tip thing for the RTV.







Check this video at 11:00-13:00 minutes. IMHO, this is the best way to apply silicone in the IHS.


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vommok*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Check this video at 11:00-13:00 minutes. IMHO, this is the best way to apply silicone in the IHS.


Wow that's a lot messier than what I expected.

Maybe with toothpick can be more precise, but slower?


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> Wow that's a lot messier than what I expected.
> 
> Maybe with toothpick can be more precise, but slower?


Pretty much, take your time and do it the way you think it will work better


----------



## Ceadderman

Some dude is selling his FX 8325 and CVF on ebay.

I so wanna call him out as he is showing "stable" 4.8ghz clock on nothing but an h70 cooler. No delid. 4.8ghz is ridiculously high on an FX chip and on an AIO??? If he could keep that 24/7 stable I will eat my hat. iirc he's running 1.35v with 1333mhz RAM.

No way he's running that Clock speed on 1333 sticks imho. Just too many reasoms why I wanna call BS on his sale.

I could maybe see it if *maybe* he somehow delidded w/o cracking his die. It's happened before. But on an AIO? I wish I could link the sale, but I'm on my mobile atm. I found it while looking up the 1100t product code in Google search if anyone would be interested in double checking my thoughts on the matter.









~Ceadder


----------



## b0oMeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Some dude is selling his FX 8325 and CVF on ebay.
> 
> I so wanna call him out as he is showing "stable" 4.8ghz clock on nothing but an h70 cooler. No delid. 4.8ghz is ridiculously high on an FX chip and on an AIO??? If he could keep that 24/7 stable I will eat my hat. iirc he's running 1.35v with 1333mhz RAM.
> 
> No way he's running that Clock speed on 1333 sticks imho. Just too many reasoms why I wanna call BS on his sale.
> 
> I could maybe see it if *maybe* he somehow delidded w/o cracking his die. It's happened before. But on an AIO? I wish I could link the sale, but I'm on my mobile atm. I found it while looking up the 1100t product code in Google search if anyone would be interested in double checking my thoughts on the matter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


That avatar picture...How does it even get THAT dirty?...I mean did that guy seriously just ash and dump butts on his table with THAT many Gatorade bottles in front of him?


----------



## Ceadderman

dunno, but the water bottle have a yellowish liquid in them and not a single cig butt... I think we know what that means.









Found the link...

http://m.ebay.com/itm/201864673586?_trksid=p2141725.m3662.l6403

Dude actually conned someone into buying it for $199.50 with boxed photo of the board and chip and stock photos of the Formula Z.









Suckered born every minute I guess.









~Ceadder


----------



## dmo580

Do you guys recommend RTV over the 4 drops of super glue that Rockit Cool recommends?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vommok*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Check this video at 11:00-13:00 minutes. IMHO, this is the best way to apply silicone in the IHS.


I see a lot of peoople put this much RTV, but isn't that too much? Maybe it's less than what Intel does but if you really clamp the CPU down that RTV is just going to get everywhere. You see it in the end when he delids and the RTV is too much.

Finally, how do you guys apply CLU? With a Q-Tip?


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Do you guys recommend RTV over the 4 drops of super glue that Rockit Cool recommends?
> I see a lot of peoople put this much RTV, but isn't that too much? Maybe it's less than what Intel does but if you really clamp the CPU down that RTV is just going to get everywhere. You see it in the end when he delids and the RTV is too much.
> 
> Finally, how do you guys apply CLU? With a Q-Tip?


I've seen someone damage the PCB trying to delid a chip that was once relid with super glue. Sadly, i dont have the link anymore. If you're going the superglue way, IMHO dont delid this chip ever again.
RTV can be delid again, no matter if you use 4 drops in the corners, or thin lines all over the IHS.


----------



## stubass

Not sure if this is the right place to ask. I have delidded an I3-6320 and what to use that IHS on a I7-7700k as i dont want to lap the 7700k IHS.
Anyone see a problem using a Skylake IHS on a Kabylake CPU??


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stubass*
> 
> Not sure if this is the right place to ask. I have delidded an I3-6320 and what to use that IHS on a I7-7700k as i dont want to lap the 7700k IHS.
> Anyone see a problem using a Skylake IHS on a Kabylake CPU??


Not sure about the tolerances between the IHS and the core between them - they are both 14nm so you'd think it'd be fine but they are different from the top (kaby has the little tabs at the top and bottom of the IHS). Can't say as far as the underside from that however.

I can't see it hurting much as if anything I'd expect the Sky IHS to be a little thinner than the Kaby - but a micrometer would confirm that for ya. (Of course, if you don't have one I can't help - I only have the micrometer but not a Sky or Kaby IHS to measure).

I say try it and see...


----------



## stubass

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stubass*
> 
> Not sure if this is the right place to ask. I have delidded an I3-6320 and what to use that IHS on a I7-7700k as i dont want to lap the 7700k IHS.
> Anyone see a problem using a Skylake IHS on a Kabylake CPU??
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure about the tolerances between the IHS and the core between them - they are both 14nm so you'd think it'd be fine but they are different from the top (kaby has the little tabs at the top and bottom of the IHS). Can't say as far as the underside from that however.
> 
> I can't see it hurting much as if anything I'd expect the Sky IHS to be a little thinner than the Kaby - but a micrometer would confirm that for ya. (Of course, if you don't have one I can't help - I only have the micrometer but not a Sky or Kaby IHS to measure).
> 
> I say try it and see...
Click to expand...

Cheers mate,
I can get a hold of a micrometer so will measure both...








Someone on facebook said maybe becarefull the SKL IHS will damsge the die but i dont see how :S
I have to be carfull as it is an expensive binned 7700k so i must be sure


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I would definitely measure both the outside lip and the inside (above the die) to make sure that the distance is the same for both - though AFAIK the kaby core is the lowest (hence direct die mating issues) so at worst I could see needing to lap a sky IHS a little more.

The likely outcome I would presume is that if you get it 100% perfect for use on the 7700K... it will no longer be good for the sky i3 - but I'm guessing that was a 'sacrifical lamb' for this project anyway.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stubass*
> 
> Cheers mate,
> I can get a hold of a micrometer so will measure both...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone on facebook said maybe becarefull the SKL IHS will damsge the die but i dont see how :S
> I have to be carfull as it is an expensive binned 7700k so i must be sure


wanna really try one of those








Quote:


> I got my Bitspower IHS today, finally got to install it.
> It will fit perfectly on Kaby Lake. To be honest it took down my temps ~3-5C.
> I originally had lapped my Intel IHS.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1622289/bitspower-intel-ihs


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> wanna really try one of those
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1622289/bitspower-intel-ihs


Damn if knew about this before delidding I would have used this IHS cover. Looks like it fits the die nice and snug.

Also for those who use glue. If you redo the delid just use acetone to remove the glue. Also you're supposed to use the superglue GEL not the liquid. Only tiny drops in the corners. Not the whole cover.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Damn if knew about this before delidding I would have used this IHS cover. Looks like it fits the die nice and snug.
> 
> Also for those who use glue. If you redo the delid just use acetone to remove the glue. Also you're supposed to use the superglue GEL not the liquid. Only tiny drops in the corners. Not the whole cover.


Yeah, acetone melts super glue in no time. I have the Super Glue Gel by Loctite so it will work just fine.

Is acetone OK for PCBs though? I'm always a bit more concerned with plastics and acetone given it's a stronger solvent.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Yeah, acetone melts super glue in no time. I have the Super Glue Gel by Loctite so it will work just fine.
> 
> Is acetone OK for PCBs though? I'm always a bit more concerned with plastics and acetone given it's a stronger solvent.


I dont think rockit cool would do the gel if it damaged the pcb.


----------



## stubass

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *stubass*
> 
> Cheers mate,
> I can get a hold of a micrometer so will measure both...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone on facebook said maybe becarefull the SKL IHS will damsge the die but i dont see how :S
> I have to be carfull as it is an expensive binned 7700k so i must be sure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wanna really try one of those
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> I got my Bitspower IHS today, finally got to install it.
> It will fit perfectly on Kaby Lake. To be honest it took down my temps ~3-5C.
> I originally had lapped my Intel IHS.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1622289/bitspower-intel-ihs
Click to expand...

Cool, Bitspower IHS


----------



## TK421

made the delid

not sure if that is too much gap, can anyone here comment on it?

I also put kapton tape on the 4 gold dot

trying to be tidy with the RTV, is this thick enough?

think also making that tab on the IHS made the "drop-in" process much easier to the realign tool


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> made the delid
> 
> not sure if that is too much gap, can anyone here comment on it?
> 
> I also put kapton tape on the 4 gold dot
> 
> trying to be tidy with the RTV, is this thick enough?
> 
> think also making that tab on the IHS made the "drop-in" process much easier to the realign tool


I think its ok. When you apply the pressure from the relid kit, theres not a lot of gap. Let it dry/cure for at least a couple of hours and you should be fine.


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vommok*
> 
> I think its ok. When you apply the pressure from the relid kit, theres not a lot of gap. Let it dry/cure for at least a couple of hours and you should be fine.


Going to leave it out for 24H, what do you think?


----------



## 77792

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> Going to leave it out for 24H, what do you think?


24H is the full cure time, its the best to do.
But if you feel anxious, i would say at least 2 hours.


----------



## IMI4tth3w

Man all those freshly delided 7700k chips look nice...

This will probably get lost to the massive amount of posts, but i've been running a delided 4790k for a while now. It's been great but I had a few issues i felt like sharing. The chip is cooled with a custom water loop (ek supremacy evo). Chip was delided using vice method and TIM was replaced with CLU. At first i just set the IHS back on the cpu and used the force of the socket mount to hold it in place. Then i picked up the naked ivy kit from ek to get direct contact with the CPU die and the waterblock. However, i feel like i was never able to get really good contact with the waterblock and the cpu. I thought about picking up a delid die guard to help with pressure onto the CPU in the socket so the waterblock pressure on the die isn't also pushing the cpu into the socket (noticed some slighly warped pcb on the cpu after a while). But ended up going back to using the IHS and ditching the naked ivy kit. The temps with naked ivy were better on one or two cores by only a few C and on the other cores it was actually worse. I also used CLU between the die and the waterblock. Now it has CLU between the die and IHS. Then Artic MX4 between the IHS and waterblock.

She's not the greatest clocking chip, I daily it at 4.6GHz/1.3V mainly for reliability reasons. I'm thinking next generation i'll upgrade this thing and try and get something that i can daily at 5.0GHz.


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Vommok*
> 
> 24H is the full cure time, its the best to do.
> But if you feel anxious, i would say at least 2 hours.


ok I will leave it for 24H


----------



## Sedril

I thought I had seen somewhere someone was making custom IHS for Kaby Lake, I think some were made out of copper... Anyone know where to get those? I plan on using the RTV as well but probably only around each corner leaving openings on each side, should make it easier if I ever decide to pop the lid again....


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sedril*
> 
> I thought I had seen somewhere someone was making custom IHS for Kaby Lake, I think some were made out of copper... Anyone know where to get those? I plan on using the RTV as well but probably only around each corner leaving openings on each side, should make it easier if I ever decide to pop the lid again....


http://www.overclock.net/t/1622289/bitspower-intel-ihs

Also I used the wood pick tool that rockit included, scraped the pcb pretty hard but no damage. Think CPU is still ok?


----------



## b0oMeR

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1622289/bitspower-intel-ihs
> 
> Also I used the wood pick tool that rockit included, scraped the pcb pretty hard but no damage. Think CPU is still ok?


Only one way to find out


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1622289/bitspower-intel-ihs
> 
> Also I used the wood pick tool that rockit included, scraped the pcb pretty hard but no damage. Think CPU is still ok?


Back of my credit card also seemed fine. That being said, I've been practising on a bunch of dead C2D models.


----------



## Sedril

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1622289/bitspower-intel-ihs
> 
> Also I used the wood pick tool that rockit included, scraped the pcb pretty hard but no damage. Think CPU is still ok?


That link for the Bitspower IHS just says product not found.... I did see that post earlier, but I remember seeing a third party IHS that was milled out of cooper, looked pretty cool...


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMI4tth3w*
> 
> Man all those freshly delided 7700k chips look nice...
> 
> This will probably get lost to the massive amount of posts, but i've been running a delided 4790k for a while now. It's been great but I had a few issues i felt like sharing. The chip is cooled with a custom water loop (ek supremacy evo). Chip was delided using vice method and TIM was replaced with CLU. At first i just set the IHS back on the cpu and used the force of the socket mount to hold it in place. Then i picked up the naked ivy kit from ek to get direct contact with the CPU die and the waterblock. However, i feel like i was never able to get really good contact with the waterblock and the cpu. I thought about picking up a delid die guard to help with pressure onto the CPU in the socket so the waterblock pressure on the die isn't also pushing the cpu into the socket (noticed some slighly warped pcb on the cpu after a while). But ended up going back to using the IHS and ditching the naked ivy kit. The temps with naked ivy were better on one or two cores by only a few C and on the other cores it was actually worse. I also used CLU between the die and the waterblock. Now it has CLU between the die and IHS. Then Artic MX4 between the IHS and waterblock.
> 
> She's not the greatest clocking chip, I daily it at 4.6GHz/1.3V mainly for reliability reasons. I'm thinking next generation i'll upgrade this thing and try and get something that i can daily at 5.0GHz.


I'll be doing the same with my 4790K, I have a delid tool though.

I have the same EK block, I also bought the EK naked mount kit, but have decided to stay with the IHS, just too many potential issues going direct-die, as you have found out. The temps. with clu on the die, using the IHS, are generally so much better regardless, after delidding and getting rid of that damn gap.
Going with my trusty Arctic MX2 between the IHS and block. Not the latest and greatest tim, but it's been good for me.

I'm also going to avoid using any sealant or glue on the IHS, kind of defeats the purpose of delidding it otherwise, imo.

Looks like you're doing very well with your 4790K. 4.6 is a good clock, and at a reasonable voltage.
It seems that 5GHz on these chips is a big lottery win, lol.

Looks like 5GHz or more is almost a given with Kaby Lake, and perhaps the next gen. as well.
Sometimes I do miss my old 2500K 5GHz Sandy chip though!


----------



## SeraphicFury

Hey People, I've been following this thread for 100+ posts or so now, but I have several questions.

Once the CPU is delidded and used for an extended period of time, does the TIM between Die and IHS need reapplication?
I Have already bought Liquid Ultra, but am second guessing myself on going ahead with the operation.

I just wanna know (as long as I don't take the chip out of the socket) how long does the Liquid Metal last? I've read that it is an absolute pain to remove, would I need to re-apply every 12, 24, 36 months? Or can it just be left and forgotten?
I guess I could just be over-thinking it, people have chips for years and years without hassle.

Two things to note, I plan on having a floating IHS and I am undervolting. I have an ITX system and want to keep it as cool as possible.

Thanks in advance


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SeraphicFury*


There are so many variables in a system that I doubt there will be a definitive answer out there on the internet...
Due change date in 15 months or something of that nature..

There are a lot of programs out and about like hwinfo 64 witch can be set to start with windows and minimized and have a little gadget over the screen with temperatures and such.. best to go with one of those and just look at it once in a while..
When you see a 10 degree increase and threes no dust in the fans at first look, its a good indicator...
Also when this indeed happens...its usually time for the TIM between the IHS and Cooler to be changed...not the LM under the IHS...
So double check before doing anything.

LM from the dye can be wiped clean with any paper towel and some isopropyl alcohol (99.9%) just make sure you run some burn tests on the PC before disassembly for about 30 to 1 h so the chip goes to a toasty 80+ degrees

Edit: Something like this...


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SeraphicFury*
> 
> Hey People, I've been following this thread for 100+ posts or so now, but I have several questions.
> 
> Once the CPU is delidded and used for an extended period of time, does the TIM between Die and IHS need reapplication?
> I Have already bought Liquid Ultra, but am second guessing myself on going ahead with the operation.
> 
> I just wanna know (as long as I don't take the chip out of the socket) how long does the Liquid Metal last? I've read that it is an absolute pain to remove, would I need to re-apply every 12, 24, 36 months? Or can it just be left and forgotten?
> I guess I could just be over-thinking it, people have chips for years and years without hassle.
> 
> Two things to note, I plan on having a floating IHS and I am undervolting. I have an ITX system and want to keep it as cool as possible.
> 
> Thanks in advance


I have never heard of anyone needing to reapply *under* the IHS

only a handful of people needing to *between IHS and cooler*

it's a pain because it reacts a bit with copper and leaves a "stain" which needs to be scrubbed in some cases (or lapped)

but as far as I ever heard people said *under* the IHS it stays liquid

but its a small sample size

most people and aftermarket services (like silicon lottery) re-seal the IHS

if something is *amiss* were talking about 20-30 degrees Celsius, not a handful of degrees

at that point it'll shut down to prevent damage anyway

like the liquid metal hardened out, you moved the case/cooler and the connection between the surfaces "broke" (again if it hardened)

that would most likely be the case for people having trouble with "all of a sudden higher temps; liquid ultra dried out"

there's no way you accidentally move the IHS with the clamps on later
there's quite some pressure on it once it's clamped down

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> LM from the dye can be wiped clean with any paper towel and some isopropyl alcohol (99.9%)


you must be using very different liquid metal than mine

mine doesn't actually want to go into any paper towel

maybe I should try to make a gif with it


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*


You got me wrong haha...
It wont go into the paper as in ...soak the paper...but the paper will get it away from the dye...
When I wipe Tim with same method it does not go into the paper...it goes away from IHS..


----------



## SeraphicFury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> There are so many variables in a system that I doubt there will be a definitive answer out there on the internet...
> Due change date in 15 months or something of that nature..
> 
> There are a lot of programs out and about like hwinfo 64 witch can be set to start with windows and minimized and have a little gadget over the screen with temperatures and such.. best to go with one of those and just look at it once in a while..
> When you see a 10 degree increase and threes no dust in the fans at first look, its a good indicator...
> Also when this indeed happens...its usually time for the TIM between the IHS and Cooler to be changed...not the LM under the IHS...
> So double check before doing anything.
> 
> LM from the dye can be wiped clean with any paper towel and some isopropyl alcohol (99.9%) just make sure you run some burn tests on the PC before disassembly for about 30 to 1 h so the chip goes to a toasty 80+ degrees
> 
> Edit: Something like this...


Thanks for the heads up, the gadget is pretty cool, I run Afterburner in the background because of my GPU fan profiles, I have CPU temps showing as well. I like the display of the App you're showing though. Good to know it's not impossible to remove the LM

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I have never heard of anyone needing to reapply *under* the IHS
> 
> only a handful of people needing to *between IHS and cooler*
> 
> it's a pain because it reacts a bit with copper and leaves a "stain" which needs to be scrubbed in some cases (or lapped)
> 
> but as far as I ever heard people said *under* the IHS it stays liquid
> 
> but its a small sample size
> 
> most people and aftermarket services (like silicon lottery) re-seal the IHS
> 
> if something is *amiss* were talking about 20-30 degrees Celsius, not a handful of degrees
> 
> at that point it'll shut down to prevent damage anyway
> 
> like the liquid metal hardened out, you moved the case/cooler and the connection between the surfaces "broke" (again if it hardened)
> 
> that would most likely be the case for people having trouble with "all of a sudden higher temps; liquid ultra dried out"
> 
> there's no way you accidentally move the IHS with the clamps on later
> there's quite some pressure on it once it's clamped down
> you must be using very different liquid metal than mine
> 
> mine doesn't actually want to go into any paper towel
> 
> maybe I should try to make a gif with it


Thanks for the reassurances, I'm feeling a lot more confident, I just need to order the delid tool, then I can get cracking







- Thanks heaps again for the info. Cheers


----------



## madmeatballs

Okay guys, I sent an email to Bitspower yesterday. They told me that they still have the Intel IHS on stock. You just have to ask them about it. Just send them a message on their website.

@Sedril @peter2k


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> Okay guys, I sent an email to Bitspower yesterday. They told me that they still have the Intel IHS on stock. You just have to ask them about it. Just send them a message on their website.


thx

they're site said using Skype
and the IHS wasn't listed any more

I've send them a message
curious what comes out of it


----------



## madmeatballs

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> thx
> 
> they're site said using Skype
> and the IHS wasn't listed any more
> 
> I've send them a message
> curious what comes out of it


When did you send the message? They'll probably reply soon since its within working hours for GMT +8 right now.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> When did you send the message? They'll probably reply soon since its within working hours for GMT +8 right now.


in the middle of ordering


----------



## SeraphicFury

Would really like some results on the bitspower ihs vs stock if anyone can provide a solid comparison.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SeraphicFury*
> 
> Would really like some results on the bitspower ihs vs stock if anyone can provide a solid comparison.


I'll try and do what I can








probably run an hour RealBench before (standard delid/Intel IHS) and after
when it arrives and I have some time at hand (something like a month, should ship next week, takes 2 weeks or so for delivery)

I payed 25€ now
including shipping
if stores would have it handy in you're country it seems like a no brainer


----------



## SeraphicFury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I'll try and do what I can
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> probably run an hour RealBench before (standard delid/Intel IHS) and after
> when it arrives and I have some time at hand (something like a month, should ship next week, takes 2 weeks or so for delivery)
> 
> I payed 25€ now
> including shipping
> if stores would have it handy in you're country it seems like a no brainer


Yeah, I just payed $60AUD to get delivery of the rockit kit. Ridiculous. If the two drops are significant, I will get it. Not to forget I'm only undervolting.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SeraphicFury*
> 
> Yeah, I just payed $60AUD to get delivery of the rockit kit. Ridiculous. If the two drops are significant, I will get it. Not to forget I'm only undervolting.


madmeatballs actually tried it and saw a drop of around 5 degrees
though mileage will vary of course

at that low price it just kinda interests me


----------



## TK421

OCN name: TK421
CPU: 7700K i7
On-die TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
IHS TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: -
OC after delid: not yet attempt
Temp drops: from thermal shutdown to usable
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e5ta4n

It's a heatsink, I think?


----------



## Caos

Hello, a doubt. My chip is delid, it is 4.9 with vcore 1.3, in games the vcore is 1.28, but in the desktop I have peaks of temperatures of 65 ° C, it is the same as when it was not delid alone that happened from peaks of 80 ° C At peaks of 65 ° C, is this normal or will I have to reopen?


----------



## BigOG

hey folk,

noobie here so don't be harsh. couldn't go through 2000+ pages of chat so I have some questions.

I have a 4790k and I want to delid it.

Is anyone around Birmingham that does it? PM me if so.

Anyone you used and recommend, let us know! (if around Birmingham even better)









take care folks,
BOG


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> Hello, a doubt. My chip is delid, it is 4.9 with vcore 1.3, in games the vcore is 1.28, but in the desktop I have peaks of temperatures of 65 ° C, it is the same as when it was not delid alone that happened from peaks of 80 ° C At peaks of 65 ° C, is this normal or will I have to reopen?


Are you saying that when just idle at the desktop you are hitting peaks of 65°C and 80°C when gaming? Regardless if you're seeing temps that high when doing nothing at all I'd say something isn't right unless you're using the stock cooler and then that's probably normal.

Or are you saying it's hotter when at the desktop than when you're gaming? That shouldn't happen normally, but I guess depending on the situation (i.e. you have inadequate case airflow and the GPU fan running at a higher speed is actually helping move stagnant air around better) I suppose it could happen.

I assume English isn't your native language, so I'm not sure what's a translation failure and what's just me being up too late to comprehend the issue. Sorry.


----------



## MattBaneLM

I have lapped a few and I seemed to get a better result in the lga775 days than now

Dunno why just did

Make sure you don't round of any edges though and make it harder to seat your hs


----------



## MattBaneLM

Do y'all know about the bitspower replacement ihs for sale btw?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattBaneLM*
> 
> Do y'all know about the bitspower replacement ihs for sale btw?


since no store anywhere in the world seems to have it, no

I only found it through overclock.net

also is this a general question as in we know about it
or did they change it?
because bitspower pulled it from the page last time I checked (support still sold me one though)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *MattBaneLM*
> 
> I have lapped a few and I seemed to get a better result in the lga775 days than now
> 
> Dunno why just did
> 
> Make sure you don't round of any edges though and make it harder to seat your hs


because the IHS wasn't always even
some were even concave which is the worst kind of shape to be in (looking at you q6600, damn thing dropped 8 degrees in temps after lapping)

but these days the IHS is rather even (since skylake)


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> Hello, a doubt. My chip is delid, it is 4.9 with vcore 1.3, in games the vcore is 1.28, but in the desktop I have peaks of temperatures of 65 ° C, it is the same as when it was not delid alone that happened from peaks of 80 ° C At peaks of 65 ° C, is this normal or will I have to reopen?


I think it's something with kaby lake

you probably mean spikes of higher temperature that last only a second or so

yeah I'm seeing those as well (I think many reported that behaviour)

as to the question of temps

you're not saying what kind of temp you're having when idle when you're not having this heat spikes

something from 20 to 65, somethings wrong

from 45 to 65, could be normal

that is of course if I'm understanding you right


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Are you saying that when just idle at the desktop you are hitting peaks of 65°C and 80°C when gaming? Regardless if you're seeing temps that high when doing nothing at all I'd say something isn't right unless you're using the stock cooler and then that's probably normal.
> 
> Or are you saying it's hotter when at the desktop than when you're gaming? That shouldn't happen normally, but I guess depending on the situation (i.e. you have inadequate case airflow and the GPU fan running at a higher speed is actually helping move stagnant air around better) I suppose it could happen.
> 
> I assume English isn't your native language, so I'm not sure what's a translation failure and what's just me being up too late to comprehend the issue. Sorry.


I read it as

there are spikes in temperature sometimes (I have this too, even when there seemingly is nothing going on, maybe the temp sensors are more accurate these days when the CPU cycles up in frequency to do something in the background)

reaching 80 degrees before delid
65 after delid

what I'm missing as info is a baseline of idle temp


----------



## MattBaneLM

got hwinfo ?


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> OCN name: TK421
> CPU: 7700K i7
> On-die TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> IHS TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: not yet attempt
> Temp drops: from thermal shutdown to usable
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e5ta4n
> 
> It's a heatsink, I think?


What is that ? A laptop ?? Which model ?

That's insane ?

I just repasted my UX31A, only 17W TDP, still able to thermal throttle... discovered it was a bare i73517u... I won't be able to put some liquid metal ?


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I think it's something with kaby lake
> 
> you probably mean spikes of higher temperature that last only a second or so
> 
> yeah I'm seeing those as well (I think many reported that behaviour)
> 
> as to the question of temps
> 
> you're not saying what kind of temp you're having when idle when you're not having this heat spikes
> 
> something from 20 to 65, somethings wrong
> 
> from 45 to 65, could be normal
> 
> that is of course if I'm understanding you right


thanks , for the reply. My idle temperatures are 34, 35, 37, 36


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> thanks , for the reply. My idle temperatures are 34, 35, 37, 36


so youre temps spike about 30 degrees

seems high
mmm

so it spikes to 65, did you run any stress testing (RealBench, Prime, IBT, Aida)? and if yes how high are those temps

also I assumed its a kaby lake
while I actually can't be sure youre using an Intel from 7th generation (7700k, 7600k and so forth)


----------



## Caos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> so youre temps spike about 30 degrees
> 
> seems high
> mmm
> 
> so it spikes to 65, did you run any stress testing (RealBench, Prime, IBT, Aida)? and if yes how high are those temps
> 
> also I assumed its a kaby lake
> while I actually can't be sure youre using an Intel from 7th generation (7700k, 7600k and so forth)


Yes, I have a 7700k to 4.9 with voltage 1.30, the temperature peaks are on the desktop in idle. Playing BF1 I reached 66 ° C. would I have to re-open my chip?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Caos*
> 
> Yes, I have a 7700k to 4.9 with voltage 1.30, the temperature peaks are on the desktop in idle. Playing BF1 I reached 66 ° C. would I have to re-open my chip?


I would still say no, depending on youre cooling solution and if the mounting is good
66 degrees is well below any throttling temperature

I've just seen youre post in the kaby lake overclocking guide
I think no one responded right?

err

well
66 degrees with a "mild" overclock and only 1.3v is kinda high in "only" a game

going by this chart (I know it doesn't list battlefield 1, but at least battlefield 4) you would probably run into higher temps if using a stress test



how did you exactly delid?

did you use a liquid metal paste (there are 4 different I know of, if you count liquid pro and ultra as 2 different)

did you use any kind of glue?
did you use a lot?

are you sure youre cooler is mounted alright

did you use only a bit of paste between cooler and IHS?(less is better) and what kind of paste?

and what kind of cooler do you use anyway?
AiO
custom loop

air cooler of some kind?

did you confirm stability of youre overclock with anything besides Battlefield?

idle temps are fine
maybe temps at load are fine too depending on the cooling solution you have

the spikes of 30 degrees?

well I wouldnt worry if they are the same temp as under load, or less
something in the background is probably just waking up the CPU and pushing it for a second or 2 (could be anything really, teamspeak, antivirus, sensor software and so on)

but I do would confirm the overclock with a tool and not "just" a game

I had a look at my temps back when I had an air cooler (run of the mill, nothing special)
5.1 Ghz, 1.375v 67 degrees after 8 hours of RealBench
but with a 7600k, ht does make for higher temp on average, keep that in mind



so youre temps do seem a bit on the high side of things considering I used more voltage and more frequency on an 30€ air cooler

*bottom line*

considering youre "load" temps are kinda the same as those spikes the delid is most likely fine

the spikes will come and shouldn't last long

but the temp I would say is a bit high under load considering its only mild settings as far as kaby lake overclocking goes

but still nothing to worry about temp wise (maybe noise wise, as in fans spinning up)


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> What is that ? A laptop ?? Which model ?
> 
> That's insane ?
> 
> I just repasted my UX31A, only 17W TDP, still able to thermal throttle... discovered it was a bare i73517u... I won't be able to put some liquid metal ?


P870KM1, see signature for full specs

Overclock to 4.9ghz with some voltage tuning

Actually bare die is easier to put liquid metal on, I have done it in many other laptops with mobile CPU which does not have an IHS.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Nice! Don't need/want SLI but a laptop that exhausts out the back and takes a desktop CPU and 64MB of RAM... do want.


----------



## Sedril

Finally pulled the trigger and de-lidded both my 7700k CPU's...

I can't believe how easy it was with the Rockit 88 tool... Dropped around 13 - 15 C so I'm happy..

On one I used the Cool Laboratory Liquid metal, and on the other I used the Kryonaut Thermal Grizzly stuff... I have only tested the liquid metal one so far... I'll test the other when I have time and compare the temp difference if any...

On another note, I have a friend that's a high level manager at Intel here in Portland, OR and I showed him the pics of what I had done and explained that Intel should really have another chip offering that has this already done from the manufacturer... He said he would bring it up and see what they say...


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Nice! Don't need/want SLI but a laptop that exhausts out the back and takes a desktop CPU and 64MB of RAM... do want.


comes in single card variant too

with the vapor heatsink and some thermal pad work, the GPU will never cross 55c on a 24c ambient room (no cooling pad, just back raised)

the gpu is 190w tdp for the 1080, regardless if SLi or not


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sedril*
> 
> Finally pulled the trigger and de-lidded both my 7700k CPU's...
> 
> I can't believe how easy it was with the Rockit 88 tool... Dropped around 13 - 15 C so I'm happy..
> 
> On one I used the Cool Laboratory Liquid metal, and on the other I used the Kryonaut Thermal Grizzly stuff... I have only tested the liquid metal one so far... I'll test the other when I have time and compare the temp difference if any...
> 
> On another note, I have a friend that's a high level manager at Intel here in Portland, OR and I showed him the pics of what I had done and explained that Intel should really have another chip offering that has this already done from the manufacturer... He said he would bring it up and see what they say...
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Spoiler!


Nice job.

I'm sure that Intel is quite aware of delidding, it seems that they have been attaching the IHS for the lowest cost and ease of manufacturing.

It would be nice if they could come up with a method of attaching the IHS that allows it to properly contact the die of the chip, but that would require the use of LM to avoid tim pump out.

Unless they solder it on, as with some of their other cpus, lol.


----------



## Sedril

I was thinking more along the lines of Intel offering a higher end chip that they actually applied the IHS correctly... I'm sure they're aware of de-lidding, and I'm sure the reason for their process is time and money... But they could easily offer another product that they spend a bit more time and do it correctly essentially doing what we do with de-lidding, but have it done correctly to begin with.. I'm sure many would pay more to avoid de-lidding it themselves...


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sedril*
> 
> I was thinking more along the lines of Intel offering a higher end chip that they actually applied the IHS correctly... I'm sure they're aware of de-lidding, and I'm sure the reason for their process is time and money... But they could easily offer another product that they spend a bit more time and do it correctly essentially doing what we do with de-lidding, but have it done correctly to begin with.. I'm sure many would pay more to avoid de-lidding it themselves...


7740K?


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sedril*
> 
> I was thinking more along the lines of Intel offering a higher end chip that they actually applied the IHS correctly... I'm sure they're aware of de-lidding, and I'm sure the reason for their process is time and money... But they could easily offer another product that they spend a bit more time and do it correctly essentially doing what we do with de-lidding, but have it done correctly to begin with.. I'm sure many would pay more to avoid de-lidding it themselves...


Yeah, that would be a nice option.

Avoiding the hassle as well, lol.
It's cool that you have a "contact" within Intel, and were able to mention it to him.
Who knows, eh?


----------



## BigOG

up!

anyone can help with this?


----------



## wholeeo

Just a heads up if you guys missed it. I have a thread in the freebies section for free use of my delid tool. I'm going to ship it out to the first person today.

http://www.overclock.net/forum/newestpost/1627022


----------



## Garrett1974NL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sedril*
> 
> Finally pulled the trigger and de-lidded both my 7700k CPU's...
> 
> I can't believe how easy it was with the Rockit 88 tool... Dropped around 13 - 15 C so I'm happy..
> 
> On one I used the Cool Laboratory Liquid metal, and on the other I used the Kryonaut Thermal Grizzly stuff... I have only tested the liquid metal one so far... I'll test the other when I have time and compare the temp difference if any...
> 
> On another note, I have a friend that's a high level manager at Intel here in Portland, OR and I showed him the pics of what I had done and explained that Intel should really have another chip offering that has this already done from the manufacturer... He said he would bring it up and see what they say...


Did you reattach the IHS, and if so, with what?


----------



## Sedril

Yes I did reattach it. I didn't want any movement. And with the re-lid tool it's easy to make sure it's compressed the entire cure time so there isn't any gap...

I used this RTV material: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JH0KGV2/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Works great. I didn't use as much as Intel does at stock but I covered the four corners with some space in between... I would never use superglue, and I wouldn't leave it un-attached, I think the RTV in small amounts is perfect... I leave it in the clamp for the full 24 hour cure time...

The first one I de-lidded I actually popped it off the next day just to be sure my method was good... Once I knew it was good to go I redid it, then I did my second one as well...


----------



## nrpeyton

Hi,

Anyone know if the "EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy" works with a i7 7700K?

Thanks,

Nick


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Anyone know if the "EK-Supremacy PreciseMount Add-on Naked Ivy" works with a i7 7700K?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Nick


ohhh I would have to dig deep for that one

I remember people having a discussion here on these boards about naked DIE cooling for Skylake
and having a rep from EK saying it fits

but a user or 2 actually tried it and it didn't work

seeing as ivy bridge, skylake and kaby lake have all different thicknesses for the IHS and substrate I'd say no

also give this a read

https://m.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/07/7600k_naked_die_cooling_temperature_followup/

or watch the vid




but he got a reduction of 3 degrees out of it
and the DIE is rather small, making mistakes when mounting a cooler easy to do


----------



## Big Pappa Pump

Alright boyos! My results.

My Rockit Cool delid/relid kit showed up today. Took me about 45 minutes to do everything. Was super nervous! And very happy with the results.

Just for an Apples to Apples comparison to start. I used my Asus Maximus IX motherboard "5.0Ghz Preset Overclock" for a benchmark with temperatures & Prime95 for about 30 minutes with those settings for about 20 minutes. (They are crapping preset setting Voltage way to high) Anyway's the deault Asus settings was like 1.46V @ 5.0Ghz.

Prior to Delid, at this setting I hit a scary 92C

After Delid max 65C!!!!

So a 25C improvement. insane.

Under more real, custom settings. Unfortunately I don't think I got a 5.0 chip. I could only get Prime95 not to report errors at 5.0ghz if I was at 1.42v (No crashes tho). But as soon as I dropped the chip to 4.9ghz @ 1.28v I was stable with no errors + max temp of 52c.

Previous to all this my chip was hitting 65C at stock 4.5v..

This was all done with a Corsair H100i v2 with 4 Corsair SP120's fans in (Push/Pull)
Also I ended up using rubber sealant, no glu. So it never looks like its even been opened in case of re-sale.

Thank you everybody here for the guidance!

~BPP~


----------



## dmo580

After a painful 2 nights of swapping my motherboard out and figuring out why my system doesn't POST it comes down to my oldass Radeon 7850 not having a UEFI BIOS and having major incompatibilities with these new motherboards. I suppose I will retire a former Bitcoin mining champion and pulled the trigger on a new GTX 1060. While it's a huge upgrade over the 7850, the old card was good enough for Dota 2.

So now finally I'm ready to delid. Has anyone tried *re-delidding* after the 4 drops of super glue? Is it hard?


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> After a painful 2 nights of swapping my motherboard out and figuring out why my system doesn't POST it comes down to my oldass Radeon 7850 not having a UEFI BIOS and having major incompatibilities with these new motherboards. I suppose I will retire a former Bitcoin mining champion and pulled the trigger on a new GTX 1060. While it's a huge upgrade over the 7850, the old card was good enough for Dota 2.
> 
> So now finally I'm ready to delid. Has anyone tried *re-delidding* after the 4 drops of super glue? Is it hard?


Do not use super glue. Way too strong. You want adhesive or gasket sealant.


----------



## Jbravo33

What's best delid tool for 6850k?


----------



## dmo580

*Done with my delid! I used the following:*

- Rockit Cool

- Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra (for the die)

- Thermo Grizzly Kryonaut (on top of IHS)

- Red Silicone RTV for re-sealing

*Images below. A few things I did learn though as well as a few thoughts:*

- Probably used too much RTV to reseal it back. I would use less in the future. I used a syringe and needle for the thin application.

- Rockit Cool tells you to use your fingers to rub the silicone off the CPU. I tried that but it was slow even with nails. Credit card worked beautifully. Be gentle though because if your card isn't all worn out it may have relatively sharp edges that can remove the silicone fast. I wouldn't recommend using metal credit cards (ahem Chase Sapphire owners). As a tribute to United (RIP), I decided to pull out my old MileagePlus Explorer card.

- Kryonaut was applied horribly as you can see, but I suppose it should still work out in the end once you smash it down and let it spread naturally.

- Not sure if I put enough CLU. I put very little on and was able to spread it and saw little bumps suggesting there's still too much so I tried to get it down to a film. But every video I watched seemed to put way too much and some applied to the IHS too.

*As for temperatures? I ran the exact same settings at 4.7 GHz, 1.25V, and while previously I got a max of 84C, my max temp is now down to 71C in Prime 95. A 13C drop in temperature. I'll take it.*


----------



## TK421

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> *Done with my delid! I used the following:*
> 
> - Rockit Cool
> 
> - Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra (for the die)
> 
> - Thermo Grizzly Kryonaut (on top of IHS)
> 
> - Red Silicone RTV for re-sealing
> 
> *Images below. A few things I did learn though as well as a few thoughts:*
> 
> - Probably used too much RTV to reseal it back. I would use less in the future. I used a syringe and needle for the thin application.
> 
> - Rockit Cool tells you to use your fingers to rub the silicone off the CPU. I tried that but it was slow even with nails. Credit card worked beautifully. Be gentle though because if your card isn't all worn out it may have relatively sharp edges that can remove the silicone fast. I wouldn't recommend using metal credit cards (ahem Chase Sapphire owners). As a tribute to United (RIP), I decided to pull out my old MileagePlus Explorer card.
> 
> - Kryonaut was applied horribly as you can see, but I suppose it should still work out in the end once you smash it down and let it spread naturally.
> 
> - Not sure if I put enough CLU. I put very little on and was able to spread it and saw little bumps suggesting there's still too much so I tried to get it down to a film. But every video I watched seemed to put way too much and some applied to the IHS too.
> 
> *As for temperatures? I ran the exact same settings at 4.7 GHz, 1.25V, and while previously I got a max of 84C, my max temp is now down to 71C in Prime 95. A 13C drop in temperature. I'll take it.*


I see that you're using the United airline card to FORCIBLY REMOVE the old RTV

huehuehue


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> I see that you're using the United airline card to FORCIBLY REMOVE the old RTV
> 
> huehuehue


I actually keep all my old credit cards and there's at least 30 in my desk drawer. The first card I pulled out was that card. And as I started use it I noticed the irony and I decided to take a picture of it showing that it was a United card.


----------



## Garrett1974NL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> After a painful 2 nights of swapping my motherboard out and figuring out why my system doesn't POST it comes down to my oldass Radeon 7850 not having a UEFI BIOS and having major incompatibilities with these new motherboards. I suppose I will retire a former Bitcoin mining champion and pulled the trigger on a new GTX 1060. While it's a huge upgrade over the 7850, the old card was good enough for Dota 2.
> 
> So now finally I'm ready to delid. Has anyone tried *re-delidding* after the 4 drops of super glue? Is it hard?


Yes, 4 small drops, 1 in each corner, works fine here








I dropped 13C @ full load.
When I play GTA V which is pretty CPU-intensive imo, I reach 66C max on the hottest core.
This is 5.0GHz @ 1.32v with a Noctua NH-U14S with 1 fan @ 5v


----------



## dmo580

X-post from Kaby Lake Thread: Here are my stats in Prime 95 before and after delidding my 7700k.



I did make a motherboard change in the process, but the cooling is still the same. So keep in mind this isn't the best apples to apples test.


----------



## FedericoUY

Hi. Would like to join the delid club! Delidded my 7700k:

Some pics of it











Temps went down at least 15c, since (without changing voltages as there were without delid, temps where reaching 72 and 74c.
Now after some quick stress tests, there are around 55c at 5000 1.175mv set on bios with llc6:





Happy with the temp gain!!!
EDIT: Used the rockitcool tool with the relid tool, with coollab ultra...
The tool is excellent and really easy to use. I recommend it.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FedericoUY*
> 
> Hi. Would like to join the delid club! Delidded my 7700k:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Some pics of it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps went down at least 15c, since (without changing voltages as there were without delid, temps where reaching 72 and 74c.
> Now after some quick stress tests, there are around 55c at 5000 1.175mv set on bios with llc6:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Happy with the temp gain!!!
> EDIT: Used the rockitcool tool with the relid tool, with coollab ultra...
> The tool is excellent and really easy to use. I recommend it.


Great job.
Also excellent photos, and info.
Reperoonie+


----------



## FedericoUY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Great job.
> Also excellent photos, and info.
> Reperoonie+


Thank you very much man!


----------



## dmo580

Ok so I wasn't satisfied with my temps so I re-de-lidded my CPU to take a look at it.

It seems the amount of CLU I used was sufficient, but perhaps too much RTV?


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Ok so I wasn't satisfied with my temps so I re-de-lidded my CPU to take a look at it.
> 
> It seems the amount of CLU I used was sufficient, but perhaps too much RTV?


You only need to put the RTV in the corners. No need to go all around the IHS like you did. What were your stock temps and delid temps?


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> You only need to put the RTV in the corners. No need to go all around the IHS like you did. What were your stock temps and delid temps?


Problem is everyone has different opinions. Some say just have a loose IHS. Some say super glue. Others say RTV, etc.

As for temperatures? I ran the exact same settings at 4.7 GHz, 1.25V, and while previously I got a max of 84C, my max temp is now down to 71C in Prime 95. A 13C drop in temperature. I was hoping for more of a drop, so that's why I took my IHS off again.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Problem is everyone has different opinions. Some say just have a loose IHS. Some say super glue. Others say RTV, etc.
> 
> As for temperatures? I ran the exact same settings at 4.7 GHz, 1.25V, and while previously I got a max of 84C, my max temp is now down to 71C in Prime 95. A 13C drop in temperature. I was hoping for more of a drop, so that's why I took my IHS off again.


Well those temps are already great out of the box. I hit 92c with my 7700k at 5ghz with 1.31v. Delidded and temps dropped to low 70s. Reduced the voltage. Stable at 1.285v and now I get 65c. This was with Asus Real Bench. What is your cooling? I am on a full 720mm custom loop. I also used the glue method.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *eXistencelies*
> 
> Well those temps are already great out of the box. I hit 92c with my 7700k at 5ghz with 1.31v. Delidded and temps dropped to low 70s. Reduced the voltage. Stable at 1.285v and now I get 65c. This was with Asus Real Bench. What is your cooling? I am on a full 720mm custom loop. I also used the glue method.


Temps shoots shoot up exponentially though so going to 1.3V definitely pushes me into the 90s. I'm using a Noctua D14 and the previous temps were with MX-4. So really it comes down to the chip.

I am a bit worried though because in my re-de-lid I added a bit more CLU but in re-examination my photo seems to have enough, and seeing actually some of it leaked off the die (perhaps it was during the relidding process).


----------



## Shadorino

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Problem is everyone has different opinions. Some say just have a loose IHS. Some say super glue. Others say RTV, etc.
> 
> As for temperatures? I ran the exact same settings at 4.7 GHz, 1.25V, and while previously I got a max of 84C, my max temp is now down to 71C in Prime 95. A 13C drop in temperature. I was hoping for more of a drop, so that's why I took my IHS off again.


You should use a thin layer of thermal paste on the die, no paste under the HIS, and no glue at all. That's what I'll do when I receive my Rockit Cool 88 and Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shadorino*
> 
> You should use a thin layer of thermal paste on the die, no paste under the HIS, and no glue at all. That's what I'll do when I receive my Rockit Cool 88 and Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut.


I used a thin layer initially, and in my disappointment over the small delta I added a little more. It's not like mountains full, but I put down like half a grain of rice. I'm just worried now it may leak onto those bridges. I'd be less concerned if I had put something like clear nail polish.

My CPU Is sitting in the Rockit spider relidding tool right now, but now I'm itching to take it apart *yet again.* I'm also used less RTV this time but may consider doing just the 4 corners.

1st RTV:


2nd RTV:


Another data point is that at 1.34V for 4.9 ghz now I'm getting 82C max (before it would soar past 90s). My chip is definitely not the best and I don't see hitting 5ghz for 24/7 use with those voltages, so I may just settle with 4.9. I just want to get cooling improved a bit. I think lower-mid 70s would be nice.

*Edit:* Gaming in BF4 never surpassed 69, so it may be good enough for me as we all know Prime 95 isn't accurate.


----------



## eXistencelies

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> I used a thin layer initially, and in my disappointment over the small delta I added a little more. It's not like mountains full, but I put down like half a grain of rice. I'm just worried now it may leak onto those bridges. I'd be less concerned if I had put something like clear nail polish.
> 
> My CPU Is sitting in the Rockit spider relidding tool right now, but now I'm itching to take it apart *yet again.* I'm also used less RTV this time but may consider doing just the 4 corners.
> 
> 1st RTV:
> 
> 
> 2nd RTV:
> 
> 
> Another data point is that at 1.34V for 4.9 ghz now I'm getting 82C max (before it would soar past 90s). My chip is definitely not the best and I don't see hitting 5ghz for 24/7 use with those voltages, so I may just settle with 4.9. I just want to get cooling improved a bit. I think lower-mid 70s would be nice.
> 
> *Edit:* Gaming in BF4 never surpassed 69, so it may be good enough for me as we all know Prime 95 isn't accurate.


Yea gaming for me I stay in the mid 50's. The Real Bench puts me into mid 60s. I really go off gaming temps cause that is all I do, but for benching purposes I use the software stuff.


----------



## FedericoUY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Problem is everyone has different opinions. Some say just have a loose IHS. Some say super glue. Others say RTV, etc.
> 
> As for temperatures? I ran the exact same settings at 4.7 GHz, 1.25V, and while previously I got a max of 84C, my max temp is now down to 71C in Prime 95. A 13C drop in temperature. I was hoping for more of a drop, so that's why I took my IHS off again.


Cooling hardware? Prime95 is not often used to test stability because burns the cpu to temps it will never reach in normal use. I try other test programs like realbench (bench and stress), intel xtu (bench and stress) and real life apps like bf1...


----------



## Shadorino

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> I used a thin layer initially, and in my disappointment over the small delta I added a little more. It's not like mountains full, but I put down like half a grain of rice. I'm just worried now it may leak onto those bridges. I'd be less concerned if I had put something like clear nail polish.
> 
> My CPU Is sitting in the Rockit spider relidding tool right now, but now I'm itching to take it apart *yet again.* I'm also used less RTV this time but may consider doing just the 4 corners.
> 
> 1st RTV:
> 
> 
> 2nd RTV:
> 
> 
> Another data point is that at 1.34V for 4.9 ghz now I'm getting 82C max (before it would soar past 90s). My chip is definitely not the best and I don't see hitting 5ghz for 24/7 use with those voltages, so I may just settle with 4.9. I just want to get cooling improved a bit. I think lower-mid 70s would be nice.
> 
> *Edit:* Gaming in BF4 never surpassed 69, so it may be good enough for me as we all know Prime 95 isn't accurate.


By using glue you recreate a gap between the IHS and die, which affects temperatures. It isn't a problem at all to not glue everything back on, when it's locked on the mobo socket it won't move a bit. The only reason why you would want to relid is before RMAing it to Intel








You will have to redo the liquid metal pasting if you remove the CPU from the socket though.
At least it's safer IMO.
I wouldn't be comfortable putting back on the CPU cooler on the IHS without cleaning everything up and repaste, so the liquid metal on the die should be no different.

Prime95 uses AVX2 instructions, which is why it runs so hot. It hits the silicon harder than anything else. The load that is put on the CPU is nowhere near what a game would, plus a little more voltage is needed as well.
That's why they made an AVX offset option in the BIOS (at least on Asus motherboards, I don't know about the others). If you pass stability at 5.0 GHz on games and Aida64 for example, but not AVX2 enabled applications like Prime95 or Intel Burn Test, you can set the AVX offset option to let's say 4.8 GHz, and no more BSODs. Sadly you can't set a custom voltage with the AVX offset, that would have been great.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FedericoUY*
> 
> Cooling hardware? Prime95 is not often used to test stability because burns the cpu to temps it will never reach in normal use. I try other test programs like realbench (bench and stress), intel xtu (bench and stress) and real life apps like bf1...


I agree with you there Prime 95 isn't accurate for real world testing but at the same time I want my system to be rock solid stable. The thing about builds is once I finish I don't ever want to look back at it, so I'd rather be safe than sorry. I don't want 2 years later to figure out why my system keeps crashing or if I need to raise vcore at some later date what I should raise it to. I also know that Prime 95 runs very hot, but I've also seen people obtain lower temps on Prime 95 or other AVX benches too.

That's why I'm shooting for lower temps still. I'll give my CPU a whirl tonight and if the temps are better with the job redone I'll be happy. If not, oh well. I can live with a mediocre chip I suppose. I have yet to become lucky with the silicon lottery.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TK421*
> 
> OCN name: TK421
> CPU: 7700K i7
> On-die TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> IHS TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: not yet attempt
> Temp drops: from thermal shutdown to usable
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/e5ta4n
> 
> It's a heatsink, I think?


Holy crap...... You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> *Done with my delid! I used the following:*
> 
> - Rockit Cool
> 
> - Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra (for the die)
> 
> - Thermo Grizzly Kryonaut (on top of IHS)
> 
> - Red Silicone RTV for re-sealing
> 
> *Images below. A few things I did learn though as well as a few thoughts:*
> 
> - Probably used too much RTV to reseal it back. I would use less in the future. I used a syringe and needle for the thin application.
> 
> - Rockit Cool tells you to use your fingers to rub the silicone off the CPU. I tried that but it was slow even with nails. Credit card worked beautifully. Be gentle though because if your card isn't all worn out it may have relatively sharp edges that can remove the silicone fast. I wouldn't recommend using metal credit cards (ahem Chase Sapphire owners). As a tribute to United (RIP), I decided to pull out my old MileagePlus Explorer card.
> 
> - Kryonaut was applied horribly as you can see, but I suppose it should still work out in the end once you smash it down and let it spread naturally.
> 
> - Not sure if I put enough CLU. I put very little on and was able to spread it and saw little bumps suggesting there's still too much so I tried to get it down to a film. But every video I watched seemed to put way too much and some applied to the IHS too.
> 
> *As for temperatures? I ran the exact same settings at 4.7 GHz, 1.25V, and while previously I got a max of 84C, my max temp is now down to 71C in Prime 95. A 13C drop in temperature. I'll take it.*


Oooooooh, I need the info to add you to the list but love the photos!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FedericoUY*
> 
> Hi. Would like to join the delid club! Delidded my 7700k:
> 
> Some pics of it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Temps went down at least 15c, since (without changing voltages as there were without delid, temps where reaching 72 and 74c.
> Now after some quick stress tests, there are around 55c at 5000 1.175mv set on bios with llc6:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Happy with the temp gain!!!
> EDIT: Used the rockitcool tool with the relid tool, with coollab ultra...
> The tool is excellent and really easy to use. I recommend it.


Give Vagur the required info and I'll add you to the list! Awesome pictures though!


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shadorino*
> 
> By using glue you recreate a gap between the IHS and die, which affects temperatures. It isn't a problem at all to not glue everything back on, when it's locked on the mobo socket it won't move a bit. The only reason why you would want to relid is before RMAing it to Intel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You will have to redo the liquid metal pasting if you remove the CPU from the socket though.
> At least it's safer IMO.
> I wouldn't be comfortable putting back on the CPU cooler on the IHS without cleaning everything up and repaste, so the liquid metal on the die should be no different.
> 
> Prime95 uses AVX2 instructions, which is why it runs so hot. It hits the silicon harder than anything else. The load that is put on the CPU is nowhere near what a game would, plus a little more voltage is needed as well.
> That's why they made an AVX offset option in the BIOS (at least on Asus motherboards, I don't know about the others). If you pass stability at 5.0 GHz on games and Aida64 for example, but not AVX2 enabled applications like Prime95 or Intel Burn Test, you can set the AVX offset option to let's say 4.8 GHz, and no more BSODs. Sadly you can't set a custom voltage with the AVX offset, that would have been great.


I couldn't agree more.

Excellent post, Reperoonie+


----------



## FedericoUY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Give Vagur the required info and I'll add you to the list! Awesome pictures though!


OCN name: FedericoUY
CPU: i7 7700K
On-die TIM: CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS TIM: IC Diamond 24carat
Mhz gained: -
OC after delid: 5ghz (as before), not tested for max OC
Temp drops: 20c avg
CPU-Z validation of max OC: (will give later)


----------



## dmo580

Well did my re-delid, and I don't think temps changed much. Core #2 is a bit cooler but Core #1 is warmer now. Shrug. I think I'll just leave my system alone now.


----------



## dmo580

Here we go:

OCN name: dmo580
CPU: i7 7700k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzy Kryonaut
Mhz gained: 300
OC after delid: 5 GHz
Temp drops: 13C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/ldzke0


----------



## Dasboogieman

Weird thing about my delid, my 7700k IHS is actually slightly shorter than the core. When I placed it on after cleaning up the black glue the IHS "floats". Figuring this will crack the core if I mounted on as is, I padded around the core with pro-grade electrical tape to give a couple of microns of space so after mounting the IHS digs in to the tape.

Pasted core with Conductonaut, went from 95+ degrees to 70 degrees max.

Can do stable 5ghz, -2 AVX offset, 1.36v LLC5 now.


----------



## TheInternal

Hey all.

Been reading up a bit on what others have done / what's worked for delid and/or relid on a 7700k before I make the leap.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but some observations I've made;

- Delid without relidding the IHS offers too little gain considering all the modding you have to do to your socket to get a decent connection between the CPU and heatsink
- a liquid metal TIM sounds like the way to go for the chip to IHS heat transference
- removing the original IHS sealant is a pain in the ass / can result in damage to the PCB if not done carefully
- "silicon gasket maker" sounds like the most popular way to go for remounting the IHS due to higher chance of damage from gluing
- most folks use too much silicon the first time they remount their IHS, so going super sparingly would probably make sense
- most folks seem to be using relatively pricey delidding kits and relidding kits, and having positive experiences with them

Some questions / concerns I have;

- Does remounting the IHS with silicon result in the same firmness as the original Intel sealant? What exactly is the original sealant / can it be obtained by consumers at a reasonable price point?
- Does the waxed dental floss delid approach actually work? Seems feasible and low risk... really tempted to try it since I'm pretty broke after buying all these computer parts.
- What's the best bang for the buck on safe relidding tools?

Other thoughts;

So, I'm not really looking to OC as much as I want to simply lower temps on my 7700k. At 100% sustained load at stock settings, I easily went into the mid 90C range. Yikes. I'm running the chip in a cramped Node 202 case with a Cryorig C7 cooler, so it's not exactly getting a lot of airflow. Undervolting has gotten the chip to the high 80C range at max load, and a more reasonable mid to high 70C range during Time Spy stress testing... but that's still much warmer than I would like. With average decrease in the 15C-20C range for many folks from a delid, it seems like it'd be worth the effort.

Being a long-time computer nerd, I remember most of the builds I did not involving any processors with a new-fandangled "IHS" thingie... just straight CPU die to thermal paste and a heat sink. I kinda wish there was an easy way to just run the processor naked without a crapload of high risk modding needed


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheInternal*
> 
> Hey all.
> 
> Been reading up a bit on what others have done / what's worked for delid and/or relid on a 7700k before I make the leap.
> 
> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but some observations I've made;
> 
> - Delid without relidding the IHS offers too little gain considering all the modding you have to do to your socket to get a decent connection between the CPU and heatsink
> - a liquid metal TIM sounds like the way to go for the chip to IHS heat transference
> - removing the original IHS sealant is a pain in the ass / can result in damage to the PCB if not done carefully
> - "silicon gasket maker" sounds like the most popular way to go for remounting the IHS due to higher chance of damage from gluing
> - most folks use too much silicon the first time they remount their IHS, so going super sparingly would probably make sense
> - most folks seem to be using relatively pricey delidding kits and relidding kits, and having positive experiences with them
> 
> Some questions / concerns I have;
> 
> - Does remounting the IHS with silicon result in the same firmness as the original Intel sealant? What exactly is the original sealant / can it be obtained by consumers at a reasonable price point?
> - Does the waxed dental floss delid approach actually work? Seems feasible and low risk... really tempted to try it since I'm pretty broke after buying all these computer parts.
> - What's the best bang for the buck on safe relidding tools?
> 
> Other thoughts;
> 
> So, I'm not really looking to OC as much as I want to simply lower temps on my 7700k. At 100% sustained load at stock settings, I easily went into the mid 90C range. Yikes. I'm running the chip in a cramped Node 202 case with a Cryorig C7 cooler, so it's not exactly getting a lot of airflow. Undervolting has gotten the chip to the high 80C range at max load, and a more reasonable mid to high 70C range during Time Spy stress testing... but that's still much warmer than I would like. With average decrease in the 15C-20C range for many folks from a delid, it seems like it'd be worth the effort.
> 
> Being a long-time computer nerd, I remember most of the builds I did not involving any processors with a new-fandangled "IHS" thingie... just straight CPU die to thermal paste and a heat sink. I kinda wish there was an easy way to just run the processor naked without a crapload of high risk modding needed


The delid tool is seriously worth it, no joke, I've yet to see something die (pun).
I guess once you figure out the delidding part, the relidding part has only 2 real sources of problems.

1. Double and Triple check that the IHS is actually lower than your core die, mine was not so it was literally floating there supported by the die after I cleaned the black stuff off. Failure to do this may lead to a cracked core upon remounting. I got around it by shimming it with black electrical tape, the pressure from the mounting will dig in to the tape thus preventing core cracking but the slight give also allows intimate die-IHS contact.

2. tape over/use nail polish on any gold pins or exposed circuitry near the die, this saves your core from accidents if the liquid metal ends up overflowing


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheInternal*


What @Dasboogieman said + if you are broke....check out this link:

http://www.overclock.net/t/1627022/cross-country-rockit-delid-tool-extravaganza#post_25979426


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheInternal*
> 
> Hey all.
> 
> Been reading up a bit on what others have done / what's worked for delid and/or relid on a 7700k before I make the leap.
> 
> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but some observations I've made;
> 
> - Delid without relidding the IHS offers too little gain considering all the modding you have to do to your socket to get a decent connection between the CPU and heatsink
> - a liquid metal TIM sounds like the way to go for the chip to IHS heat transference
> - removing the original IHS sealant is a pain in the ass / can result in damage to the PCB if not done carefully
> - "silicon gasket maker" sounds like the most popular way to go for remounting the IHS due to higher chance of damage from gluing
> - most folks use too much silicon the first time they remount their IHS, so going super sparingly would probably make sense
> - most folks seem to be using relatively pricey delidding kits and relidding kits, and having positive experiences with them
> 
> Some questions / concerns I have;
> 
> - Does remounting the IHS with silicon result in the same firmness as the original Intel sealant? What exactly is the original sealant / can it be obtained by consumers at a reasonable price point?
> - Does the waxed dental floss delid approach actually work? Seems feasible and low risk... really tempted to try it since I'm pretty broke after buying all these computer parts.
> - What's the best bang for the buck on safe relidding tools?
> 
> Other thoughts;
> 
> So, I'm not really looking to OC as much as I want to simply lower temps on my 7700k. At 100% sustained load at stock settings, I easily went into the mid 90C range. Yikes. I'm running the chip in a cramped Node 202 case with a Cryorig C7 cooler, so it's not exactly getting a lot of airflow. Undervolting has gotten the chip to the high 80C range at max load, and a more reasonable mid to high 70C range during Time Spy stress testing... but that's still much warmer than I would like. With average decrease in the 15C-20C range for many folks from a delid, it seems like it'd be worth the effort.
> 
> Being a long-time computer nerd, I remember most of the builds I did not involving any processors with a new-fandangled "IHS" thingie... just straight CPU die to thermal paste and a heat sink. I kinda wish there was an easy way to just run the processor naked without a crapload of high risk modding needed


Let me try to answer your questions:

1. No the Silicone RTV is a bit different than the original Intel sealant. I delidded AGAIN after putting too much RTV on, and honestly the "POP" that you get when delidding was a LOT louder with the Intel adhesive meaning it was glued on a lot tighter and required more pressure with the allen wrench on my delidding tool.

2. Honestly many say you don't even need the IHS mounted. Don't do waxed dental floss. Either get the right tools or just lock the IHS in place with your heatsink.

I did spend a few dollars (delidding tool, RTV, Thermo Grizzly Kryonaut), but honestly if you have a $300 CPU do it right. Plus you can use it in future builds or loan your tool out locally for a small fee.

I understand your purpose and quite honestly I'm not a huge OCer. I don't plan on pushing my system to the limits and running at that 24/7, but I do want to run at a mild overclock. Is your 90C range with Prime 95? If so keep in mind thats worse case because most tasks won't be as demanding with Prime 95. I bench with Prime 95 too just to know what my system will hit, so here are a few recommendations. First, if you plan on running stock, observe the load vcore. My chip isn't even great (4.9 @ 1.34vcore), but at stock 4.5 Turbo I can run 1.15V on Prime 95 no problem. If your chip is pulling in 1.25V when it only needs 1.15V, that's easily a 10C difference. So keep note there. If you don't want to delid, just observing voltages would get you far.

I know everyone wants to be lazy, but I always recommend building a few curves--temp vs vcore and min vcore vs frequency. Understand what your CPU runs at and what temperatures you get, and you can better figure things out. You can also decide at that point if you want to delid. For instance, I was hitting a wall at 4700 mhz at 92C previously. I delidded and my temps dropped in no time to around 71C. However that's because I really wanted to hit 5 GHz. But if I looked at no delid and running at 4.5ghz, 1.15vcore, I was maxing out at 78C only, which was reasonable IMO. Not great but at least not concerning. So my thought is have a look at vcore then decide if you really want to delid, and if you want to delid, do it right.


----------



## Imprezzion

I never bothered to glue my 3770K IHS back on.. I just delidded it, smacked some liquid ultra on it, put the CPU in the socket, put the IHS on and closed the socket.. I did replace the liquid ultra a few times as i switched coolers a few times but temps are always the same.

This is the OC i've been running for the past 3 years and it's held up very well. No voltage degradation, no thermal degradation, no stability issues. Can run any stress test (inc avx like this one) 24 hours straight if it has to.. Max game temps are high 60's with very managable fan and pump speeds (40-60% ish PWM)


----------



## philhalo66

Does it matter what type of clear nail polish i use to cover the caps?


----------



## Juggalo23451

Can I be added please.


----------



## Anth0789

Just did mine today so far so good:





Not delidded Stock temps:


With delidded stock temps:


OCN name: Anth0789
CPU: i7 7700K
On-die TIM: CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra
IHS TIM: Arctic MX-4
Mhz gained: - ?
OC after delid: 4.5ghz
Temp drops: 10c avg
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/72lq3p

Will overclock it now to at least try 5ghz.


----------



## Shadorino

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheInternal*
> 
> Hey all.
> 
> Been reading up a bit on what others have done / what's worked for delid and/or relid on a 7700k before I make the leap.
> 
> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but some observations I've made;
> 
> - Delid without relidding the IHS offers too little gain considering all the modding you have to do to your socket to get a decent connection between the CPU and heatsink
> - a liquid metal TIM sounds like the way to go for the chip to IHS heat transference
> - removing the original IHS sealant is a pain in the ass / can result in damage to the PCB if not done carefully
> - "silicon gasket maker" sounds like the most popular way to go for remounting the IHS due to higher chance of damage from gluing
> - most folks use too much silicon the first time they remount their IHS, so going super sparingly would probably make sense
> - most folks seem to be using relatively pricey delidding kits and relidding kits, and having positive experiences with them
> 
> Some questions / concerns I have;
> 
> - Does remounting the IHS with silicon result in the same firmness as the original Intel sealant? What exactly is the original sealant / can it be obtained by consumers at a reasonable price point?
> - Does the waxed dental floss delid approach actually work? Seems feasible and low risk... really tempted to try it since I'm pretty broke after buying all these computer parts.
> - What's the best bang for the buck on safe relidding tools?
> 
> Other thoughts;
> 
> So, I'm not really looking to OC as much as I want to simply lower temps on my 7700k. At 100% sustained load at stock settings, I easily went into the mid 90C range. Yikes. I'm running the chip in a cramped Node 202 case with a Cryorig C7 cooler, so it's not exactly getting a lot of airflow. Undervolting has gotten the chip to the high 80C range at max load, and a more reasonable mid to high 70C range during Time Spy stress testing... but that's still much warmer than I would like. With average decrease in the 15C-20C range for many folks from a delid, it seems like it'd be worth the effort.
> 
> Being a long-time computer nerd, I remember most of the builds I did not involving any processors with a new-fandangled "IHS" thingie... just straight CPU die to thermal paste and a heat sink. I kinda wish there was an easy way to just run the processor naked without a crapload of high risk modding needed


Like said before, the delidding tools are a very good idea, and not just for noobies. It's faster, and much safer. With a vice you risk bending or breaking the PCB (provided that you own a vice in the first place), and with a blade you risk scratching the PCB resulting in a dead or partially working chip. You can use duct tape on one side of the blade to be a bit safer though.

Aside from the cheap plastic 3D printed ones (which you still need a vice to use them, so rather pointless), there is 2 delidding tools currently for Kaby Lake :
Delid Die Mate 2
and
Rockit Cool 88.

The Delid Die Mate 2 is a little faster to use because it has only 1 screw. The Delid Die Mate 1 had 6 screws, but it was already fast and easy to use, the Delid Die Mate 2 is child's play at this point really.
It has an include relid kit.
2 major drawbacks though IMO :
First, it doesn't provide a base to hold the CPU while you clean off the glue and thermal paste, as opposed to the Delid Die Mate 1 and Rockit Cool 88.
Second, the availability is really bad right now. I originally ordered it march 6th, it was tagged available starting from march 13th, but once the date passed, it stated a different date, and so on. I got tired of it, plus I realized that it couldn't be used as a holder to clean off the CPU after the delid, so I canceled the order a week ago and bought the Rockit Cool 88.
1 thing that I really didn't like and never accounted before, they charge a 2 € fee if you don't choose the option "pay upfront".

The Rockit Cool 88 is the better choice in terms of the product itself IMHO, but 1 drawback : the price is the same as the Delid Die Mate 2, but the relid kit is not included, it's sold separately for 8 $.

The Rockit Cool 88 is shipped from the US, the Delid Die Mate 2 from Germany.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shadorino*
> 
> Snip. Good summary.


Rockit was down for a while, but the minute they came back up I ordered, and I emailed James asking if black parts would be available. He emailed me back saying they'd be made the next day and changed my order from white/silver to all black. He shipped on a Monday (I ordered Sunday), and I got the parts on Wednesday in CA.

Very satisfied. I've looked at the guides for Delid Die Mate and I think Rockit's guide is just so braindead simple. Part of why I got it was the relid kit, although Delid Die Mate2 seems to have one too.

You make some good points and I'm 100% satisfied with the Rockit Cool tool. Delid Die Mate 2 is definitely faster, but honestly putting a few screws together with my thumbs and turning the allen key is not a big deal. It's like a total of 30 seconds. Plus, I think I spent more time hesitating (how far do I turn?) and waiting for that POP than I did screwing my kit together.


----------



## Shadorino

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Rockit was down for a while, but the minute they came back up I ordered, and I emailed James asking if black parts would be available. He emailed me back saying they'd be made the next day and changed my order from white/silver to all black. He shipped on a Monday (I ordered Sunday), and I got the parts on Wednesday in CA.
> 
> Very satisfied. I've looked at the guides for Delid Die Mate and I think Rockit's guide is just so braindead simple. Part of why I got it was the relid kit, although Delid Die Mate2 seems to have one too.
> 
> You make some good points and I'm 100% satisfied with the Rockit Cool tool. Delid Die Mate 2 is definitely faster, but honestly putting a few screws together with my thumbs and turning the allen key is not a big deal. It's like a total of 30 seconds. Plus, I think I spent more time hesitating (how far do I turn?) and waiting for that POP than I did screwing my kit together.


I got it all black too. Black and silver wasn't available. I took the relid kit as well, which I will need before RMAing the CPU if I break. Wasn't available. I haven't received it yet, it shipped from Texas on April 7th, but I'm in France&#8230;


----------



## Shadorino

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> The delid tool is seriously worth it, no joke, I've yet to see something die (pun).
> I guess once you figure out the delidding part, the relidding part has only 2 real sources of problems.
> 
> 1. Double and Triple check that the IHS is actually lower than your core die, mine was not so it was literally floating there supported by the die after I cleaned the black stuff off. Failure to do this may lead to a cracked core upon remounting. I got around it by shimming it with black electrical tape, the pressure from the mounting will dig in to the tape thus preventing core cracking but the slight give also allows intimate die-IHS contact.
> 
> 2. tape over/use nail polish on any gold pins or exposed circuitry near the die, this saves your core from accidents if the liquid metal ends up overflowing


I don't think the IHS resting on the die is a problem, as long as you don't apply a crazy amount of pressure with the cooler. In that case the thin PCB would break before the die IMHO.
Glue removed => thinner paste => better thermal conductivity of the liquid metal. All of that contributes to lower temps. One of those 3 things might very well contribute more than the others though.
I don't know about Kaby Lake, but with Sandy Bridge the thing that made the biggest difference was the removal of the glue and the thinner paste, which greatly reduced the gap between IHS and die.


----------



## peter2k

there's a load of people always saying they didn't bother using glue

the very first post explains how you're supposed to put you're finger on the IHS before you clamp it down

I have yet to see a single post about a chipped DIE because the IHS put too much pressure on it

if anything the PCB would bend that hundredth of a mm before the DIE does anything


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Double and Triple check that the IHS is actually lower than your core die, mine was not so it was literally floating there supported by the die after I cleaned the black stuff off. Failure to do this may lead to a cracked core upon remounting. I got around it by shimming it


while I wholeheartedly concur on the delidding tools and putting something on the gold contacts

I have literally no one see shimming the IHS, *ever*

not der8auer
not any review site that delid themselves, YouTube video, not silicon lottery or any user

ever

I know what you mean
I had my IHS float on the chip as well

was fun to turn

but this could also come from the IHS and the PCB since those 2 surfaces are also kinda perfect flat

I'll try to remember

I have a bitspower custom IHS coming in 3 weeks or so

gonna remove my original (delidded) IHS and see if I can make contact between IHS and DIE

gonna take some contact colour from work


----------



## mAs81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> Does it matter what type of clear nail polish i use to cover the caps?


Free bump,cause I'd like to know that too..


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> Free bump,cause I'd like to know that too..


errr

I'm not sure anyone has tested clear nail polish for its non conductive properties amongst different brands
I'm sure we're just assuming here that they are all not conductive (*when dry* of course)

that said I have used clear nail polish from my wife to stop the coil whine on my GTX 1060, sooo I guess its not really conductive

if one is afraid of putting whichever nail polish on youre wife or girlfriend is using, you could use any other TIM that is not conductive
or some tape, or a dab of silicon, the original TIM from Intel (thats what I used), orrrrr ....
or if you use that RTV stuff to glue it back on, that works as well (or again any plain old silicone)

as long as it is not conductive, sticks in place and doesn't run away if its heated 60 to 100 degrees, so bees wax is out









of course you could buy this as well



or give this a read

http://www.overclock.net/t/1606542/is-nail-polish-conductive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *philhalo66*
> 
> Does it matter what type of clear nail polish i use to cover the caps?


look at the answers you received in youre own thread
http://www.overclock.net/t/1606542/is-nail-polish-conductive

like this one
Quote:


> The answer depends on the actual contents of the specific polish. But in general acrylic films are not conductive. Even better would be shellac. Shellac was what was used to insulate transformer windings back in the days before alkyd chemistry.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *gmm26*
> 
> I was workiing on a motor controller a while ago, and I used some nail polish to coat some custom made wire wound resistors that were submerged in water for cooling (green thingy in the photo), It is probably gonna work for your application. If you want to play it safe, you could use something like this https://www.amazon.com/Gardner-Bender-LTB-400-4-Ounce-Electrical/dp/B000FPAN2K


Quote:


> I think a better option would be using some common RTV silicone (or the liquid electrical tape of course).


----------



## Ceadderman

Clear nail polish is a laquer. There are zero conductive properties in it. We (outdoorsmen) use it for all kinds of threading that can get snagged and unravel. Fishing rods specifically.

Yeah I know there is no electricity flowing in our rods, at least mine, but it's perfectly safe to use. Plenty of us use it on our GPUs (lots here have to) to keep conductive materials from contacting those important chips. Hence the reason for using clear nail polish to seal them off from a messy spread that could otherwise fry them.








It's all good people.









~Ceadder


----------



## TheInternal

Does anyone know the exact material Intel uses to keep the IHS attached to the PCB and/or where it can be purchased?

Is there any solid consensus on what non-glue material to use to reattach the IHS?


----------



## Sedril

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TheInternal*
> 
> Does anyone know the exact material Intel uses to keep the IHS attached to the PCB and/or where it can be purchased?
> 
> Is there any solid consensus on what non-glue material to use to reattach the IHS?


I've done 3 now with this stuff and it works like a charm....

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JH0KGV2/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


----------



## ssateneth

Its the same consistency room temperature vulcanization silicon, otherwise known as RTV silicon. It's often sold as a gasket sealant in hardware stores. As long as its black and says some variation of "RTV Silicon", thats what you want. I delidded my i7-5960x just fine but messed up about 2 weeks later. Slapped it back together with some RTV silicon (and thermal gunk) and intel took it back, got me a new 5960x. Just make sure to clean away the excess so it doesn't look obvious.

RMA'd 5960x i got back was a silicon winner so far







initial tests 4.7/4.5 core/cache at 1.31/1.26v respectively so far. Still tweaking, running GSAT to test new memory kit.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FedericoUY*
> 
> OCN name: FedericoUY
> CPU: i7 7700K
> On-die TIM: CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: IC Diamond 24carat
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: 5ghz (as before), not tested for max OC
> Temp drops: 20c avg
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: (will give later)


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmo580*
> 
> Here we go:
> 
> OCN name: dmo580
> CPU: i7 7700k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzy Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: 300
> OC after delid: 5 GHz
> Temp drops: 13C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/ldzke0


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Juggalo23451*
> 
> Can I be added please.


Would love to add you! I need the required information from the OP, or as much as you can give me








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anth0789*
> 
> Just did mine today so far so good:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not delidded Stock temps:
> 
> 
> With delidded stock temps:
> 
> 
> OCN name: Anth0789
> CPU: i7 7700K
> On-die TIM: CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra
> IHS TIM: Arctic MX-4
> Mhz gained: - ?
> OC after delid: 4.5ghz
> Temp drops: 10c avg
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/72lq3p
> 
> Will overclock it now to at least try 5ghz.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## hsypsufan

If any of you are thinking of purchasing a bitspower ihs for your skylake or kabylake processor, I would pass. I got two, one for my skylake rig and another for my kabylake rig. Both had the same result of higher temps by 3-5 degrees. CLU between the die and ihs and gelid gc extreme between the ihs and heatsink. Noctua NH-D15 cooler for my skylake box and Noctua NH-D14 for my kabylake box.

All tests were run on the same day with the same ambient temps.







YMMV, but i would avoid the expense and invest in a better cooler.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hsypsufan*
> 
> If any of you are thinking of purchasing a bitspower ihs for your skylake or kabylake processor, I would pass. I got two, one for my skylake rig and another for my kabylake rig. Both had the same result of higher temps by 3-5 degrees. CLU between the die and ihs and gelid gc extreme between the ihs and heatsink. Noctua NH-D15 cooler for my skylake box and Noctua NH-D14 for my kabylake box.
> 
> All tests were run on the same day with the same ambient temps.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> YMMV, but i would avoid the expense and invest in a better cooler.


I'm not saying that you did it wrong or anything...
But I had very bad temps with gelid gc extreme till I figured out how to properly apply it...the rice drop in the middle doesn't really work with these paste....you should check that...
Ended up using a bit more and spreading it all over the cpu in a thin as possible layer...


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> I'm not saying that you did it wrong or anything...
> But I had very bad temps with gelid gc extreme till I figured out how to properly apply it...the rice drop in the middle doesn't really work with these paste....you should check that...
> Ended up using a bit more and spreading it all over the cpu in a thin as possible layer...


I usually do that with all but the most liquid pastes. Pulled too many only to see either a coin shape which leaves the corners conducting nothing (if it was just enough) or pump out on one or more sides (if it was more than enough). Naturally the corners don't have any direct heat applied... but the entire IHS is a conductor... so any lost surface area is lost cooling potential.


----------



## Zero Clocker

i7-7700K
Asus Strix 270i
Corsair Vengeance LPX
Noctua NH-12

OCN name: Zero Clocker
CPU: i7 7700K
On-die TIM: thermal grizzly Conductonaut
IHS TIM: Arctic Silver V
Mhz gained: -
OC after delid: 4601,10 MHz (Perfomance Setting UEFI and Power Options)
Temp drops: 20°C-35°C on load
CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/75dmuu

Besides, I'm not about occing my CPU at this time, just let it recover from brain surgery.









Here's my de-lidding/re-lidding experiment. The de-lidding is so decent I haven't even noticed the lid was off already and it was inaudible. The technique is to use the force at all 4 angles simultaneously. There is no bang as with other tools. I used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut which is not easy to handle as too much of the fluid emerged and it's a mess to clean it. Could not suck in the liquid metal with the syringe.





Before I hit 100°C after 40 minutes GTA V. even with DDR 2133MHz, Turbo disabled.


After De-lidding and Re-lidding: DDR 2400, Turbo 4500 MHz.
Idle and Turbo. The 76°C happened during CPU-Z Stresstest.
 

Most of the time about 60°C to 65°C after 40 minutes GTA V.


----------



## Zyther

Hi All,

Looking at delidding a 3770k.
I see most people use Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra, how does Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut compare to it? Any benifits from one over the other?

Also is it better to relid with a Gel Super Glue or Silion?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> Looking at delidding a 3770k.
> I see most people use Cool Laboratory Liquid Ultra, how does Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut compare to it? Any benifits from one over the other?
> 
> Also is it better to relid with a Gel Super Glue or Silion?


no difference really

there are 3 different liquid metal "pastes" on the market (4 if you count Cool Laboratory pro and ultra as separate products; where only ease of application is a bit different)

they all use the same ingredient as main component and have all about the same wmk and application "difficulty"

and react the same with aluminium and ("staining") copper

most have used silicone to glue it back together

some are worried about super glue "ripping" off some PCB if you would delid again

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero Clocker*
> 
> I used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut which is not easy to handle as too much of the fluid emerged and it's a mess to clean up


is that compared to Phobya liquid metal or cool laboratory?
because those don't handle that great (compared to more traditional TIM) either

and both are hard to clean up

I had a drop of Phobya LM drob on my hard wood floor
the only way to remove the drop was to smear it and then clean up the smear
the drop itself did not want to go into any paper, be it drenched in alcohol or dry

as a hint and tidbit
picked something up from another forum

on the IHS I used baby wipes (not oily ones) to wipe off the liquid metal
worked suitably ok

and then of course cleaned it up properly
no idea if it was what the wipes where drenched in, the texture, or whatever

but it worked better then anything I tried before


----------



## Zyther

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> they all use the same ingredient as main component and have all about the same wmk and application "difficulty"


Thats what I thought but seems like Conductonaut is alomost double :/
Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut - 73 W/mk
Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra - 38.4 W/mk


----------



## Zero Clocker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> ...


As this is my first encounter with liquid metal I've no comparisons. What I've found out after wiping and smearing a drop of it with tissues is India Rubber. My clean white table was covered with smears and the more I've been wiping the worser it came.
But with a rubber eraser the stains vanished totally (after a bit of work).
Will use Conductonaut for my CPU cooler as well. This time I'll cover the whole table and myself.As well the black sticky silicon Uhu glue was hard to clean from may hands and my jeans as well. What did you use for sticking the IHS to the CPU? I've read the manual today and it says 1 mm silicon takes 24 hours to dry and you should not heaten it up before. The Delid-Die-Mate creator says only for 30 to 60 minutes. I've waited an hour.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> Thats what I thought but seems like Conductonaut is alomost double :/
> Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut - 73 W/mk
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra - 38.4 W/mk


yeah I'm kinda prepared for that statement
it's basically an error

many shops don't even have the wmk for any of them
even the manual doesn't say
hard to come by actually










another user replied basically the same
mistake on the low value a few pages ago

still if you wanna go save then it's either Phobya LM, grizzly LM or the pro from which I pulled that pic

also









Phobya LM has also really high wmk
just finding it difficult to actually see it somewhere
sigh
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero Clocker*
> 
> As this is my first encounter with liquid metal I've no comparisons. What I've found out after wiping and smearing a drop of it with tissues is India Rubber. My clean white table was covered with smears and the more I've been wiping the worser it came.
> But with a rubber eraser the stains vanished totally (after a bit of work).
> Will use Conductonaut for my CPU cooler as well. This time I'll cover the whole table and myself.As well the black sticky silicon Uhu glue was hard to clean from may hands and my jeans as well. What did you use for sticking the IHS to the CPU? I've read the manual today and it says 1 mm silicon takes 24 hours to dry and you should not heaten it up before. The Delid-Die-Mate creator says only for 30 to 60 minutes. I've waited an hour.


some standard silicone really
put it on the IHS

put the CPU in the socket, pressed my finger down so it won't slide (like in the original post) and clamped it down and tried it out right away

I've seen users using silicone that's save for 400 to 500 degrees Celsius

kinda overkill


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero Clocker*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> i7-7700K
> Asus Strix 270i
> Corsair Vengeance LPX
> Noctua NH-12
> 
> OCN name: Zero Clocker
> CPU: i7 7700K
> On-die TIM: thermal grizzly Conductonaut
> IHS TIM: Arctic Silver V
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: 4601,10 MHz (Perfomance Setting UEFI and Power Options)
> Temp drops: 20°C-35°C on load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/75dmuu
> 
> Besides, I'm not about occing my CPU at this time, just let it recover from brain surgery.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's my de-lidding/re-lidding experiment. The de-lidding is so decent I haven't even noticed the lid was off already and it was inaudible. The technique is to use the force at all 4 angles simultaneously. There is no bang as with other tools. I used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut which is not easy to handle as too much of the fluid emerged and it's a mess to clean it. Could not suck in the liquid metal with the syringe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before I hit 100°C after 40 minutes GTA V. even with DDR 2133MHz, Turbo disabled.
> 
> 
> After De-lidding and Re-lidding: DDR 2400, Turbo 4500 MHz.
> Idle and Turbo. The 76°C happened during CPU-Z Stresstest.
> 
> 
> Most of the time about 60°C to 65°C after 40 minutes GTA V.


Awesome results!

That 20C-35C temp. drop is impressive.
Looks like the AC Dr Delid is a good quality delidding tool.
Nice to see a few good choices on the market now.

"V" is my game of choice, so I appreciate seeing your results running it, lol.

Excellent post and photos.
Rep+


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero Clocker*
> 
> i7-7700K
> Asus Strix 270i
> Corsair Vengeance LPX
> Noctua NH-12
> 
> OCN name: Zero Clocker
> CPU: i7 7700K
> On-die TIM: thermal grizzly Conductonaut
> IHS TIM: Arctic Silver V
> Mhz gained: -
> OC after delid: 4601,10 MHz (Perfomance Setting UEFI and Power Options)
> Temp drops: 20°C-35°C on load
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/75dmuu
> 
> Besides, I'm not about occing my CPU at this time, just let it recover from brain surgery.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Here's my de-lidding/re-lidding experiment. The de-lidding is so decent I haven't even noticed the lid was off already and it was inaudible. The technique is to use the force at all 4 angles simultaneously. There is no bang as with other tools. I used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut which is not easy to handle as too much of the fluid emerged and it's a mess to clean it. Could not suck in the liquid metal with the syringe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before I hit 100°C after 40 minutes GTA V. even with DDR 2133MHz, Turbo disabled.
> 
> 
> After De-lidding and Re-lidding: DDR 2400, Turbo 4500 MHz.
> Idle and Turbo. The 76°C happened during CPU-Z Stresstest.
> 
> 
> Most of the time about 60°C to 65°C after 40 minutes GTA V.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Zyther

Ordered a rocketitcool delid kit and some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra


----------



## Zero Clocker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> Awesome results!
> 
> That 20C-35C temp. drop is impressive.
> Looks like the AC Dr Delid is a good quality delidding tool.
> Nice to see a few good choices on the market now.
> 
> "V" is my game of choice, so I appreciate seeing your results running it, lol.
> 
> Excellent post and photos.
> Rep+


Thank you so much for your acknowledgment. Dr. Delid is is very useful tool but the manual (just pictures) is not really helpful. I've found a description yesterday what was missing in the package.
Phoned Aquashop and the friendly guy explain it to me and that he himself was surprised about the easy handling. Unfortunately they have no video either. What I did not know was to put relidding frame in first and after the heatspreader. Tried that by intuition but the heatspreader with the nasty black silicon glue seem to not fit through the frame. But it does. The manual below describes the steps.
What GTA V concerns I'm waiting for GTA VI. There is no open world game currently which is at the level of GTA V. So it's still my favorite game and I'll play it over and and again (PS3 PS4- eventually PC).

http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/aqua-computer-releases-dr-delid.html
Quote:


> "Heat spreader removal process
> Aqua Computer's no. 1 priority: Prevention of CPU damage
> 
> 1. The processor is inserted into an exact, CNC machined recess in the acetal base. The relatively soft acetal material prevents damage to the CPU by excessive punctual pressure or scratching.
> 2. Before the actual removal process, the CPU is locked in place. The tool can be handled without risk of the CPU dropping from the tool.
> 3. The removal process is facilitated by rotating the hexagon socket screw by hand using the supplied wrench. A mechanical stop limits the rotation of the heat spreader in the tool.
> 4. During the removal process, the heat spreader is secured in the tool. It can not hit the CPU die by accident.
> 5. After removal of the heat spreder, an aperture in the tool allows to lift the CPU from the tool without touching the gold contacts.
> 
> Reinstallation of the heat spreader
> After cleaning the CPU and application of new thermal grease, insert the CPU into the tool again. Dr. Delid can be used for precise installation of the heat spreader:
> 
> 1. A stainless steel frame for heat spreader alignment is inserted into a recess in the tool. The heat spreader can now be inserted into the frame, resulting in perfect alignment to the CPU. The heat spreader can be installed with glue (for instance silicone or polyurethane).
> 2. A stainless steel bracket supplied with the tool can be used to apply slight pressure to the center of the heat spreader, until the glue is cured. A knurled screw made from polyamide prevents damage to the heat spreader."


----------



## Zero Clocker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Thank you! I feel highly honoured to join your club.









What I've forgotten while delidding was to take pics being that hightly focused on making everything right.

Meanwhile after having read a bit about delidding I've some questions left and I'd be happy for an answer of you guys.

Next step could be applying liquid metal between IHS and CPU cooler.
Is this a good idea? Some claim the surfaces of IHS and Cooler backplate are damaged afterwards (not only aluminium type) or hard to get loose.

Next question: This guy takes Scotch Super 33+ Vinyl Electrical Tape to isolate the PCB around the DIE:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/liquid-metal-showdown-thermal-grizzly-conductonaut-vs-cool-laboratory-liquid-ultra-pro.791489/










*Is this recommended and is here someone who taped the PCB?

*Could the liquid metal move to the untaped PCB after re-lidding and damage it? So is it dangerous for the CPU not to isolate the PCB while using liquid metal on the DIE and inside the IHS?

* Can I delid my CPU another time (after having relidded with UHU silicon glue) to tape it with Scotch33+ or is this risky?


----------



## Zyther

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero Clocker*
> 
> *Could the liquid metal move to the untaped PCB after re-lidding and damage it? So is it dangerous for the CPU not to isolate the PCB while using liquid metal on the DIE and inside the IHS?


I dont think the LM would hurt the PCB on the cpu unless it has components on it, if it gets on the green would be fine?


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

My delid apparently went fine. I got a decent OC on air, then delidded the 7700K and stuck it back together. Booted up just to bios with the CPU water block on it - no water - and the OC was still registering just like before I delidded, volts fine, RAM OC still showing. Temp never got above 35C even without water in the system, but just posting to bios isn't too stressful.

Rockit de/re lid kit, CLU, Permatex black RTV (just a tiny smear), Gelid Extreme on the IHS before the waterblock went on. Quite a bit of stuff just for a single use, I don't know that delidding is something I'll make a habit of. It was a lot easier than I figured it would be.

Looking forward to getting the loop finished so I can see how it stacks up to before,


----------



## Zyther

When putting liquard metal on the Die, do you also have to put some on the inside of the IHS where it touches the die.

Ive seen videos of people only putting it on the die and some putting it also on the inside of the IHS


----------



## Malinkadink

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> When putting liquard metal on the Die, do you also have to put some on the inside of the IHS where it touches the die.
> 
> Ive seen videos of people only putting it on the die and some putting it also on the inside of the IHS


Yes put some on the inside of the IHS, as you may have seen, applying CLU evenly requires a lot of brush strokes and even then it can be a bit stubborn to get to spreading at first. If you dont apply any on the IHS and just put the lid back on, chances are you wont have filled the microscopic spaces for better thermal transfer and you'll get less bang out of your delid.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> When putting liquard metal on the Die, do you also have to put some on the inside of the IHS where it touches the die.
> 
> Ive seen videos of people only putting it on the die and some putting it also on the inside of the IHS


while any TIM is supposed to fill up only the smallest imperfections between 2 surfaces, I have to say I found the inside of my IHS to be more on the rough side
so I ended up adding just a tad more even

we're also trying to bridge a gap between IHS and DIE
we just don't know how much of a gap it is
and I think I even read somewhere here that there are variances in the IHS itself, depending where it was sourced from apparently
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Yes put some on the inside of the IHS, as you may have seen, applying CLU evenly requires a lot of brush strokes and even then it can be a bit stubborn to get to spreading at first. If you dont apply any on the IHS and just put the lid back on, chances are you wont have filled the microscopic spaces for better thermal transfer and you'll get less bang out of your delid.


what he said


----------



## mrsus

I know there a tools out there for delid, but this guy make it look easy haha.


----------



## theGucky

I'm hoping to get my Delid-Die-Mate 2 this Week.

My Current PC (less then a Month old):
i7-7700k
AIO be Quiet! Silent Loop with 280mm Rad and 2x140mm Stock Pure Wing 2 Fans.
ASUS IX HERO (Z270)
2x8GB 3200MHz Corsair Vengeance RAM (Running on 3200MHz XMP)
ASUS STRIX GTX 1080 TI
An 5 Year old Gold 660W PSU from Seasonic (scavanged from my old PC, hey Quality build for life)

atm my CPU is at 60-65°C under full load at baseclock with 1,296V Vcore and 1,280V LCC

Tested it with Multiplicator on 50 = 5.004GHz no change on other settings.
Ran with Cinebench R15 and Prime 95 for about 5 min....
Temp was about 90-92°C and Vcore about 1,380V (dont know the exact V anymore)
I didnt want it to run too long at 90°C to I reversed the OC. But still I didn't have a BSoD.

My Preparation for delidding:
First this Vid. Nice step by step from a neat German:





What im gonna do:
On-Die Tim: TG Conductonaut
IHS TIM: TG Kryonaut
LM on Die and downside of IHS.
No taping at all (im confident that im not gonna spill anything)
Quality Black Silicon (UHU) put on like original.
No Lapping

My idea is having it at 50°C or less at Baseclock (5GHz at maybe 70°C) after delidding. So I hope for around 20 less.

My Question:
Did i get a good CPU?
It wasn't pretested or binned. Just bought regulary as bulk.

Do you want Pictures from delidding?
I havent found Pictures from how putting the IHS back on for the Delid device i intend to use.









Edit:
Btw
Does it matter if i make the LM on the Die thicker in the Mid then on the edge? That should prevent airbubbles, doesnt it? And yeah it does sound far more easy then to actually do it XD At least the tighthly bound cottonswaps from the Conductonaut are far better then the brush from CLU.


----------



## jetpuck73

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Malinkadink*
> 
> Yes put some on the inside of the IHS, as you may have seen, applying CLU evenly requires a lot of brush strokes and even then it can be a bit stubborn to get to spreading at first. If you dont apply any on the IHS and just put the lid back on, chances are you wont have filled the microscopic spaces for better thermal transfer and you'll get less bang out of your delid.


So it would be a good idea to take apart again and put some on the IHS? I only put it on the DIE.


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jetpuck73*
> 
> So it would be a good idea to take apart again and put some on the IHS? I only put it on the DIE.


Consider this as advice from a guy who had zero delid experience before I just did my first one...

After I put the CLU on the die, I placed the IHS on the die/PSB to check that it was making contact. When I pulled it back off, there was just a faint trace of an outline where the die had made contact - no CLU to speak of had stuck to the IHS. So I used that outline as a guide of where to apply CLU to the IHS, and I pulled CLU from the die to apply to the IHS as I thought I might have had just a touch too much on the die itself.

So I don't think it would be a bad idea to apply CLU directly to the underside of the IHS, though I have no data to say it will help or not.

Tangential thought. When gluing structures together, applying the glue to one part is called wetting the part, if you apply glue to both parts to be joined it's called double wetting. And double wetting generally produces better bonds than single wetting. That was what was going through my mind when I put the CLU on the IHS.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> Consider this as advice from a guy who had zero delid experience before I just did my first one...
> 
> After I put the CLU on the die, I placed the IHS on the die/PSB to check that it was making contact. When I pulled it back off, there was just a faint trace of an outline where the die had made contact - no CLU to speak of had stuck to the IHS. So I used that outline as a guide of where to apply CLU to the IHS, and I pulled CLU from the die to apply to the IHS as I thought I might have had just a touch too much on the die itself.
> 
> So I don't think it would be a bad idea to apply CLU directly to the underside of the IHS, though I have no data to say it will help or not.
> 
> Tangential thought. When gluing structures together, applying the glue to one part is called wetting the part, if you apply glue to both parts to be joined it's called double wetting. And double wetting generally produces better bonds than single wetting. That was what was going through my mind when I put the CLU on the IHS.


That's how I've done all of mine... hasn't let me down yet.


----------



## jetpuck73

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> Consider this as advice from a guy who had zero delid experience before I just did my first one...
> 
> After I put the CLU on the die, I placed the IHS on the die/PSB to check that it was making contact. When I pulled it back off, there was just a faint trace of an outline where the die had made contact - no CLU to speak of had stuck to the IHS. So I used that outline as a guide of where to apply CLU to the IHS, and I pulled CLU from the die to apply to the IHS as I thought I might have had just a touch too much on the die itself.
> 
> So I don't think it would be a bad idea to apply CLU directly to the underside of the IHS, though I have no data to say it will help or not.
> 
> Tangential thought. When gluing structures together, applying the glue to one part is called wetting the part, if you apply glue to both parts to be joined it's called double wetting. And double wetting generally produces better bonds than single wetting. That was what was going through my mind when I put the CLU on the IHS.


Thank you for the info, I will do it over again. REP+


----------



## RuneDunes

Anyone willing to rent out a delid tool? Preferably a Rockit 88, but a delid die would be fine. Even better if you got CLU or some other LM.

I'm located in California, so if you're in that state we might be in the same city. I'd love to rent it locally.


----------



## SevHollywood

So I'm in the process of relidding my IHS with RTV Silicone Adhesive and I'm wondering how many hours should I let it set?

EDIT: Nevermind, seems waiting 3-4 hours was enough!


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *RuneDunes*
> 
> Anyone willing to rent out a delid tool? Preferably a Rockit 88, but a delid die would be fine. Even better if you got CLU or some other LM.
> 
> I'm located in California, so if you're in that state we might be in the same city. I'd love to rent it locally.


Check the Freebie threads for a delid tool swap. I am 4th on the list, so if you find it and read through the OP you will see that it will only cost you shipping to the next leg of its journey.









~Ceadder


----------



## beercooled

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theGucky*
> 
> I'm hoping to get my Delid-Die-Mate 2 this Week.
> 
> My Current PC (less then a Month old):
> i7-7700k
> AIO be Quiet! Silent Loop with 280mm Rad and 2x140mm Stock Pure Wing 2 Fans.
> ASUS IX HERO (Z270)
> 2x8GB 3200MHz Corsair Vengeance RAM (Running on 3200MHz XMP)
> ASUS STRIX GTX 1080 TI
> An 5 Year old Gold 660W PSU from Seasonic (scavanged from my old PC, hey Quality build for life)
> 
> atm my CPU is at 60-65°C under full load at baseclock with 1,296V Vcore and 1,280V LCC
> 
> Tested it with Multiplicator on 50 = 5.004GHz no change on other settings.
> Ran with Cinebench R15 and Prime 95 for about 5 min....
> Temp was about 90-92°C and Vcore about 1,380V (dont know the exact V anymore)
> I didnt want it to run too long at 90°C to I reversed the OC. But still I didn't have a BSoD.
> 
> My Preparation for delidding:
> First this Vid. Nice step by step from a neat German:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What im gonna do:
> On-Die Tim: TG Conductonaut
> IHS TIM: TG Kryonaut
> LM on Die and downside of IHS.
> No taping at all (im confident that im not gonna spill anything)
> Quality Black Silicon (UHU) put on like original.
> No Lapping
> 
> My idea is having it at 50°C or less at Baseclock (5GHz at maybe 70°C) after delidding. So I hope for around 20 less.
> 
> My Question:
> Did i get a good CPU?
> It wasn't pretested or binned. Just bought regulary as bulk.
> 
> Do you want Pictures from delidding?
> I havent found Pictures from how putting the IHS back on for the Delid device i intend to use.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Edit:
> Btw
> Does it matter if i make the LM on the Die thicker in the Mid then on the edge? That should prevent airbubbles, doesnt it? And yeah it does sound far more easy then to actually do it XD At least the tighthly bound cottonswaps from the Conductonaut are far better then the brush from CLU.


I'm new to this process so I'll be following up on this thread to see how you and others make out. Yes please include pictures. I'd say you hit the silicon lottery with it running prime at 5GHz.

I'm a bit confused on your TIM selections, are you saying you're going to use LM on die and the underneath of the IHS and TG on the top side of the IHS?

Oh, Why reseal the IHS to the PCB?

Good luck to you & your chip!


----------



## RuneDunes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Check the Freebie threads for a delid tool swap. I am 4th on the list, so if you find it and read through the OP you will see that it will only cost you shipping to the next leg of its journey.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I saw it before. I need a minimum rep of 35. So it's either a journey to fish for rep, or an exception needs to be made.

Edit: Looks like OP gave the okay for some people below the minimum rep, I'll put my name in for a shot.


----------



## dmo580

I was doing some other testing and I did a 10 minute Prime 95 run today just to look at Vcore measurements.

I noticed my max CPU temp already jumped up to 2C higher than my previous 8 hour Prime 95 run. I'm wondering if my CLU is misbehaving or if I put too much.

Also, @RuneDunes where in CA are you located? I have a Rockit Cool also.


----------



## dmo580

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SevHollywood*
> 
> So I'm in the process of relidding my IHS with RTV Silicone Adhesive and I'm wondering how many hours should I let it set?
> 
> EDIT: Nevermind, seems waiting 3-4 hours was enough!


24 hours is the cure time. I personally couldn't wait that long but 12 was good enough for me. Keep in mind you're not really putting any shearing forces on it so it's not a big deal. The RTV is just supposed to make your IHS not run away or anything while you mount your CPU and cooler. The retention clip is going to keep it in place in the end anyway.


----------



## SevHollywood

*i7-7700K*
*ASUS MAXIMUS IX HERO*
*G.Skill TridentZ RGB 2x8GB 3000mhz*
*NZXT x62 Kraken*
*EVGA GTX 1070 FTW*

*OCN name*: sevhollywood
*CPU:* i7-7700K
*On-die TIM*: Cool Labatory Liquid Ultra
*IHS TIM*: Arctic Silver V
*Mhz gained:* N/A
*OC after delid:* 5.0Ghz (before and after)
*Temp drops:* 13C-16C
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.x86.fr/j36t2k


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## bfe_vern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SevHollywood*
> 
> 
> *i7-7700K*
> *ASUS MAXIMUS IX HERO*


Running the same board and chip. I'm on the list for the delid tool going around the country. Going to see what type of temps before replacing the temp. cooler (hyper evo 212) for either the NH-D15 or the Corsair H100i v2.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SevHollywood*
> 
> 
> *i7-7700K*
> *ASUS MAXIMUS IX HERO*
> *G.Skill TridentZ RGB 2x8GB 3000mhz*
> *NZXT x62 Kraken*
> *EVGA GTX 1070 FTW*
> 
> *OCN name*: sevhollywood
> *CPU:* i7-7700K
> *On-die TIM*: Cool Labatory Liquid Ultra
> *IHS TIM*: Arctic Silver V
> *Mhz gained:* N/A
> *OC after delid:* 5.0Ghz (before and after)
> *Temp drops:* 13C-16C
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* http://valid.x86.fr/j36t2k
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## theGucky

Damn my retailer said, that the Delid Die Mate 2 Batch is in its finishing stage, but it'll take 1-2 Weeks until i get it -.-


----------



## Garrett1974NL

I bought the Dr. Delid from AquaComputer...works just as well


----------



## Raxus

So I'm looking for a little expert advice here. Got a 7700k that will clock to at least 5.1 but becomes hot as the suns bunghole. Been doing some reading about delidding and will probably go ahead with it. My only real concern is the liquid metal TIM. So what happens if you put on just to much and it makes its way to the pcb?


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raxus*
> 
> So I'm looking for a little expert advice here. Got a 7700k that will clock to at least 5.1 but becomes hot as the suns bunghole. Been doing some reading about delidding and will probably go ahead with it. My only real concern is the liquid metal TIM. So what happens if you put on just to much and it makes its way to the pcb?


Kaby lake don't have capacitors/VRM like older models. But on the sustrate have some test pad. So be carefull when you apply the TIM or put a small piece of tape on the pads close to the die


----------



## Raxus

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lexer*
> 
> Kaby lake don't have capacitors/VRM like older models. But on the sustrate have some test pad. So be carefull when you apply the TIM or put a small piece of tape on the pads close to the die


What kind of tape would you recommend putting over them?


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raxus*
> 
> What kind of tape would you recommend putting over them?


If you do it carefull isn't necessary. But any type of electrical tape only or nail varnish on the pads close to the die


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

The little string of 4 in a row are the only ones that go back under the IHS, the rest will be outside.

And it's hard to picture how little of the liquid metal TIM you need to cover this tiny die. That stuff really spreads out, but it's not uncontrollably sloshing around, it just spreads out really well. So don't start off with too much and I don't think you'll have anything to worry about.


----------



## cdnGhost

Been reading a lot on the new delid and relid tools...
my last go around (4770k) I did the old vice trick and used an ek direct die kit....
so for this go around I'm using an nzxt x52 kraken.... do I have to reattach my ihs? Or can I just ad my liquid paste in and then just mount the chip
Place the ihs on it with no glue or silicone etc and add my cooling solution back on and use it's pressure to keep her together?


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Been reading a lot on the new delid and relid tools...
> my last go around (4770k) I did the old vice trick and used an ek direct die kit....
> so for this go around I'm using an nzxt x52 kraken.... do I have to reattach my ihs? Or can I just ad my liquid paste in and then just mount the chip
> Place the ihs on it with no glue or silicone etc and add my cooling solution back on and use it's pressure to keep her together?


You just put the latch mechanism back on the board and that will hold the IHS on the CPU. It may try and slide around a bit but a finger should be able to hold it in place








edit: i suppose if you don't have the latch then you could use the cooler to hold it all together but it'd be a lot harder to keep everything aligned


----------



## theGucky

I got my DDM2 Delidtool much earlier then expected ^^

Here's my Data:

Intel i7-7700k tray
Be QuietQ AIO Silent Loop 280
Asus Maximus XI Hero
2x8GB Corsair Vengeance 3200Mhz (using XMP)
Asus STRIX GTX 1080TI
1xM.2, 1xSSD, 1xHDD
A DVD-Rom Drive!!!
660W Seasonic-X Gold (discontinued)

OCN name: theGucky
CPU: i7-7700K
On-die TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
IHS TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: potentionally 500Mhz
OC after delid: 4,5Ghz/5Ghz
Temp drops: For 4,5Ghz 10-15°C/ For 5Ghz 25-30°C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/r1b01s

Used CinebenchR15 and Prime 95 v28.10 to test.

The reason I gave 2 Numbers is simple, I don't want to OC my CPU, but I wanted to know if I can do 5Ghz.
Also im a noob when it comes to OC, I've tried some things. Like changing Vcore.
Vcore [email protected] Cinebench R15 did run, but Prime95 crashed the PC.
Vcore upto [email protected] Cinebench R15 no Problem, but Prime95 did crash the PC (with 1.385V at 30min the latest).
Vcore [email protected] seems Stable so far.
Vcore at Auto is around 1.412V.

Tested with CinebenchR15:
@4,5Ghz 993 Points | Temp before delid: 62°C / After delid 51°C
@5Ghz 1103 Points | Temp before delid: 90°C / After delid 61°C

Prime95 Temps (without more then 30min running, Temp increases a bit when running longer (AIO cooling))
@4,5Ghz Before delid: 65-70°C After delid: 52-56°C
@5Ghz Before delid: 92-95°C (aborted after less then 5min due to high Temp) After Delid: 62-65°C

Deactivated AVX2 for Prime95...leaving it activated @5Ghz crashes 3 threads (they stay idle), while the other 5 are runing @100%.

Fact is that my 5Ghz Temps are now my predelid 4.5Ghz Temps XD
Also the more Heat my CPU produces/the quicker my CPU is, the more it benefits from the LiquidMetal see the Temp drop at top.
*
EDIT:*
I tested my [email protected] with playing Battlefield 1 on Ultra 1080p 60fps, while looking Vids on my second Monitor. CPU was at 56/7°C. And it didnt crash, while it does crash with Prime 95 (BSOD) XD.
*
EDIT2:*
Tested [email protected] 4.5Ghz (CPU is sucking 1.25V but setting is at 1.2V) BF1 at Ultra WITH 4k downsample to 1080p at 60fps.
Temp at 50-52°C sucking about 55W...kind of awesome...

Here are the Pictures from Beginning to End: (sry for the bad angle used my iPod and a Desklamp for Light XD)

First what i used:
No Tape or anything to cover was used.
Used a lot of Q-tips for cleaning with Isopropyl-Alcohol 99.9% (not on Picture) better save then sry.



Here is what the CPU looks like with the centering aid on it....it fits the IHS inside.



Opened CPU...it seems like there were air bubbles in the TIM, could be from the delidding...



Cleaned CPU/IHS



CPU AND IHS with Liquid Metal and Silicon
(Silicon was hard to apply since the tube opening was much bigger -.-)
Liquid Metal was easy to apply, only a 2mm diameter drop for each of CPU and IHS.
My Tip first pull the syringe a bit back and then squeeze gently.



Waiting to dry inside the Delid-Die-Mate 2


----------



## Zero Clocker

@theGucky
Congratulation! Super gain in temps as well!
How are your gains in real life apps like gaming?

And how did you manage the syringe? In my case a bit of pressure resulted in polluting nearly all of the fluid and it did not suck in the sytinge again.

I'd ordered DM2 as well but Dr. Delid was faster. And yesterday DM2 arrived which I'll probably return. Waiting for Kryonaut now to replace AS5.
So you didn't tape either.
I've posted the question before: Will the liquid metal move if you move the case or because of it's nature? Or will it stick where it's located on the DIE and inside the IHS?


----------



## theGucky

@ Zero Clocker.
Well I do refill Ink Cartridges a lot XD
First i pulled the syringe back up, pulling air in then, I press gently with my thump while holding the syringe in my Fist. And I did that over (not in) a paper towel. When I had a small drop of about 2-3mm on the tip I put it on the Die.
I used the Conductonaut and sucking it back wasn't a problem either.

Moving around the Liquid Metal shouldn't be a problem if you havent used too much, since it really sticks to the surface. My CPU is vertical like all normal Towers and no problems so far XD

Even IF (big IF) it moves over a long period, if you put the Silicon on like the original it wont leak from the IHS and it can't touch anything that may short on its way. ^^

Edit:
@ Zero Clocker
if you look at my Pictures you can see 3 little dots near the DIE, those are the ONLY contacts inside the IHS.
If you want to seal them, there are some methods floating around the Forum, like Heatresistant Isolatingtape or Clear Nailpolish or Resin, but i never used it.


----------



## Zero Clocker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theGucky*
> 
> @ Zero Clocker.
> Well I do refill Ink Cartridges a lot XD
> First i pulled the syringe back up, pulling air in then, I press gently with my thump while holding the syringe in my Fist. And I did that over (not in) a paper towel. When I had a small drop of about 2-3mm on the tip I put it on the Die.
> I used the Conductonaut and sucking it back wasn't a problem either.
> 
> Moving around the Liquid Metal shouldn't be a problem if you havent used too much, since it really sticks to the surface. My CPU is vertical like all normal Towers and no problems so far XD
> 
> Even IF (big IF) it moves over a long period, if you put the Silicon on like the original it wont leak from the IHS and it can't touch anything that may short on its way. ^^


Thank you for your advice. Have to order Ink Cartridges for training now to be prepared for the upcoming delidding.







I've done the delidding already using Dr. Delid.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/32880_20#post_26036477
I've used Conductonaut as well.


----------



## Zero Clocker

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> I dont think the LM would hurt the PCB on the cpu unless it has components on it, if it gets on the green would be fine?


The problem is that there are components on the PCB. Would be nice to know if a re-delidding is recommended for additional taping. Next time I'll isolate the contacts for safety reasons.


----------



## peter2k

got the Bitspower IHS a week ago


Spoiler: Bitspower IHS fresh n new











been thinking about deliding again, but his time I didn't have a tool (was rented the last time I used it)
so did with a razor

I've been having a bit of practise with a core 2 duo and a Pentium 4

but I have to say once you put just a *little* glue (used silicon) under the IHS it becomes a more nerve racking thing getting that blade under the IHS without scratching the PCB
had a feeling the glue was thinner than the blade








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *madmeatballs*
> 
> When did you send the message? They'll probably reply soon since its within working hours for GMT +8 right now.


so finally got the time to do something again

removed my AiO (Kraken X62)
keep in mind, I used Phobya Liquid Metal, so for all intents and purposes this would be how Coollaboratory Ultra or Pro or Grizzly Conductonaut would look like *on* IHS


Spoiler: removed cooler, some cleaning








this is a "leftover" from removing a bit LM from the IHS with paper towels



so that's how it looked like under the IHS after a delid, note I tried to put as little glue on originally as possible (or those thinking it might be too much, gonna leave the hint here, temp wise it all was for nothing







and I used no glue at all this time )
the delid is about 3 months old

the small dab on is original Intel TIM I used to cover the gold contacts under the IHS




cleaned the silicone, can see nice the "run off"
funny note

look where the corner on the PCB is (golden arrow), now remember the corner is the bottom left in the board
so the the LM actually went up
and my case is standing (rather wall mounted)


ohh, ahh










both IHS side by side, the thinner one is the original Intel




Spoiler: do IHS and DIE make contact? like the IHS floats on the DIE, right?



cleaned up both to test


doesn't really want to stay on the DIE (some special contact color)



took some good ol thermal grease, put as thin as I could make it on the DIE
result

seems close enough to actually make contact
from wobbling and trying out I do think the IHS rests on the DIE













new Liquid Metal on the DIE


and back into the board





cleaned up the AiO as good as possible



probably have to lap if I remove it again








mmm
would probably switch to more normal paste *on* the IHS, like Grizzly Kryonaut

liquid metal sure likes to be spread















so was it all worth it?

well as a learning experience certainly









but temps are *exactly* the same if I remove the change in ambient temp of 1 degree








used half an hour of RealBench to test before n after
same spread temps between cores (3 degrees from coldest to hottest)

but I always was interested if the IHS kinda rests on the DIE, and if there is some run off from the liquid metal

so there ya go

a bit run off, *but* I put LM on the DIE and IHS
so I might have had a bit too much volume

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zero Clocker*
> 
> The problem is that there are components on the PCB. Would be nice to know if a re-delidding is recommended for additional taping. Next time I'll isolate the contacts for safety reasons.


did not matter for me

now if there would actually be stuff under the IHS that really needs covering
n´but Kaby is kinda clean in that department

you can see in my pics where the LM runoff to

i would actually worry at all


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theGucky*
> 
> I got my DDM2 Delidtool much earlier then expected ^^
> 
> Here's my Data:
> 
> Intel i7-7700k tray
> Be QuietQ AIO Silent Loop 280
> Asus Maximus XI Hero
> 2x8GB Corsair Vengeance 3200Mhz (using XMP)
> Asus STRIX GTX 1080TI
> 1xM.2, 1xSSD, 1xHDD
> A DVD-Rom Drive!!!
> 660W Seasonic-X Gold (discontinued)
> 
> OCN name: theGucky
> CPU: i7-7700K
> On-die TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> IHS TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: potentionally 500Mhz
> OC after delid: 4,5Ghz/5Ghz
> Temp drops: For 4,5Ghz 10-15°C/ For 5Ghz 25-30°C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/r1b01s
> 
> Used CinebenchR15 and Prime 95 v28.10 to test.
> 
> The reason I gave 2 Numbers is simple, I don't want to OC my CPU, but I wanted to know if I can do 5Ghz.
> Also im a noob when it comes to OC, I've tried some things. Like changing Vcore.
> Vcore [email protected] Cinebench R15 did run, but Prime95 crashed the PC.
> Vcore upto [email protected] Cinebench R15 no Problem, but Prime95 did crash the PC (with 1.385V at 30min the latest).
> Vcore [email protected] seems Stable so far.
> Vcore at Auto is around 1.412V.
> 
> Tested with CinebenchR15:
> @4,5Ghz 993 Points | Temp before delid: 62°C / After delid 51°C
> @5Ghz 1103 Points | Temp before delid: 90°C / After delid 61°C
> 
> Prime95 Temps (without more then 30min running, Temp increases a bit when running longer (AIO cooling))
> @4,5Ghz Before delid: 65-70°C After delid: 52-56°C
> @5Ghz Before delid: 92-95°C (aborted after less then 5min due to high Temp) After Delid: 62-65°C
> 
> Deactivated AVX2 for Prime95...leaving it activated @5Ghz crashes 3 threads (they stay idle), while the other 5 are runing @100%.
> 
> Fact is that my 5Ghz Temps are now my predelid 4.5Ghz Temps XD
> Also the more Heat my CPU produces/the quicker my CPU is, the more it benefits from the LiquidMetal see the Temp drop at top.
> *
> EDIT:*
> I tested my [email protected] with playing Battlefield 1 on Ultra 1080p 60fps, while looking Vids on my second Monitor. CPU was at 56/7°C. And it didnt crash, while it does crash with Prime 95 (BSOD) XD.
> *
> EDIT2:*
> Tested [email protected] 4.5Ghz (CPU is sucking 1.25V but setting is at 1.2V) BF1 at Ultra WITH 4k downsample to 1080p at 60fps.
> Temp at 50-52°C sucking about 55W...kind of awesome...
> 
> Here are the Pictures from Beginning to End: (sry for the bad angle used my iPod and a Desklamp for Light XD)
> 
> First what i used:
> No Tape or anything to cover was used.
> Used a lot of Q-tips for cleaning with Isopropyl-Alcohol 99.9% (not on Picture) better save then sry.
> 
> 
> 
> Here is what the CPU looks like with the centering aid on it....it fits the IHS inside.
> 
> 
> 
> Opened CPU...it seems like there were air bubbles in the TIM, could be from the delidding...
> 
> 
> 
> Cleaned CPU/IHS
> 
> 
> 
> CPU AND IHS with Liquid Metal and Silicon
> (Silicon was hard to apply since the tube opening was much bigger -.-)
> Liquid Metal was easy to apply, only a 2mm diameter drop for each of CPU and IHS.
> My Tip first pull the syringe a bit back and then squeeze gently.
> 
> 
> 
> Waiting to dry inside the Delid-Die-Mate 2


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> got the Bitspower IHS a week ago
> 
> new Liquid Metal on the DIE
> 
> 
> so was it all worth it?
> 
> well as a learning experience certainly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> but temps are *exactly* the same if I remove the change in ambient temp of 1 degree
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> used half an hour of RealBench to test before n after
> same spread temps between cores (3 degrees from coldest to hottest)
> 
> but I always was interested if the IHS kinda rests on the DIE, and if there is some run off from the liquid metal
> 
> so there ya go
> 
> a bit run off, *but* I put LM on the DIE and IHS
> so I might have had a bit too much volume
> did not matter for me


Nice job documenting your process ! I think lapping the block would have helped cut a couple C's more. the contact point on asetek style aio's is right in the center as they bow out that way, you can kinda see on the cooler removal pic. Same thing with the new BP ihs, the electrical plating technique for nickel causes it to bunch up and grab the edges/corners. All ot the SKL and KBL BP ihs' I've seen were far from being true. Be careful with the mount too as I've seen chipped corners and that "small pocket" for die style is the worst. In the pic with fresh LM it looks like alot since it looks perfectly smooth and shiny when it puddles, could just be me or the fact I've only used CLU and Conducto but from my exp. an uber thin coat on both the die and underside of ihs work best. Even at -40C on single stage phase. Nice setup you've got there too, not trying to say you did anything wrong, just sharing my experience since I've put alot of time testing different application and mounting techniques !


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> Nice job documenting your process ! I think lapping the block would have helped cut a couple C's more. the contact point on asetek style aio's is right in the center as they bow out that way, you can kinda see on the cooler removal pic. Same thing with the new BP ihs, the electrical plating technique for nickel causes it to bunch up and grab the edges/corners. All ot the SKL and KBL BP ihs' I've seen were far from being true. Be careful with the mount too as I've seen chipped corners and that "small pocket" for die style is the worst. In the pic with fresh LM it looks like alot since it looks perfectly smooth and shiny when it puddles, could just be me or the fact I've only used CLU and Conducto but from my exp. an uber thin coat on both the die and underside of ihs work best. Even at -40C on single stage phase. Nice setup you've got there too, not trying to say you did anything wrong, just sharing my experience since I've put alot of time testing different application and mounting techniques !


it's as thin as I was able to do it, the fith time using the stuff

it's just the Phobya LM and how it handles really

I also have coollabority LM and it handles better

if you look carefully then you can see a small crater in the middle of the AiO cooler
it's really tiny, but I noticed the first time I put it on

just saying, yes I could maybe shave off a few degrees by lapping

I just wanted to do an apples by apples approach
not apples to oranges

wanted to keep as many things the same as possible
before Bitfenix IHS and after

this is my third time mounting the AiO

it looked like this before (after normal delid) LM reacting with the cooler and all
wanted to keep it the same for this custom IHS for comparison

that being said

I appreciate the candor and experienced
I really do
stuff like this is hard to come by

I also was curious how the first normal delid worked under the IHS
is there runoff, how much contact does the IHS make with the DIE and such

last comment
on the Phobya LM
I think I could build a whole bridge using that stuff if I had enough
just by how it likes to stay in place and refuses to spread


----------



## socalmvp

Hi,

I am going to delid my I7700k in a couple of days, but have a couple of concerns. First is, I will be using liquid metal. What do I do if I spill a little bit onto the substrate and if I do will it fry the chip? Also, should I glue the lid back on or just place it back on?

Thanks for your help,

Mark


----------



## Anth0789

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I am going to delid my I7700k in a couple of days, but have a couple of concerns. First is, I will be using liquid metal. What do I do if I spill a little bit onto the substrate and if I do will it fry the chip? Also, should I glue the lid back on or just place it back on?
> 
> Thanks for your help,
> 
> Mark


Watch this guide:





I put scotch tape and it helps.


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anth0789*
> 
> Watch this guide:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I put scotch tape and it helps.


Thank you for the video. Best one I have seen yet. How about the super glue, will it come off if I ever have to delid again?


----------



## OutlawII

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> Thank you for the video. Best one I have seen yet. How about the super glue, will it come off if I ever have to delid again?


Just use RTV silicone i do not understand why people use superglue.


----------



## Zyther

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> Thank you for the video. Best one I have seen yet. How about the super glue, will it come off if I ever have to delid again?


As long as it's a gel superglue. The liquid super glues can damage the pcb
https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/loctite-super-glue-gel-control


----------



## Anth0789

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> Thank you for the video. Best one I have seen yet. How about the super glue, will it come off if I ever have to delid again?


Yeah just use Permatex Black RTV instead of super glue.


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> Thank you for the video. Best one I have seen yet. How about the super glue, will it come off if I ever have to delid again?


I don't like Superglue Gel because have a small "window" for correction. dries in 30s.
Automotive Silicone start forming a "skin" in 20m, you have time to put the glue, place the IHS and install the processor on the socket to make the smallest gap possible. So you can make this delicate operation without having to rush


----------



## bfe_vern

I think Superglue was selected due to it allowing the ihs to sit on the die closer than an rtv type adhesive.

Check this article out if you haven't already.

This one, too.


----------



## Ceadderman

Yes that is why. But in most cases, the chip will not be deli died again. In case you *tinker* I would suggest not applying an adhesive and go with that or use RTV. Just because one or a couple people happily report success using superglue or superglue gel doesn't mean everyone will have the same success. Remember, *results may vary* .









~Ceadder


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bfe_vern*
> 
> I think Superglue was selected due to it allowing the ihs to sit on the die closer than an rtv type adhesive.
> 
> Check this article out if you haven't already.
> 
> This one, too.


I never had such a big difference of temps between "zero gap" and glued, but I always sand a bit the IHS base of the processors i delid


----------



## theGucky

I'm not a pro or something like that, i just delidded my first CPU 2 Pages back.

Thickness:
But I think it doesn't matter of you have 1,5mm of LM between IHS and Die or just 0,5mm (no exact numbers, just an example). The thermal conductivity of LM is just that good.
Thermal Paste is a different matter, thinner is better in that case, otherwise The Tim-Paste might act as a Thermal isolator (or kind of a weakness in the Thermalchain)

It IS important to get it to cover the WHOLE gap between Die and IHS.
Since the LM really likes to stick to itself its a good choice to put LM on Die AND IHS, so gets into the gaps inside the Materials pushing the air out.
By putting it only on the Die there may be miniscule Airbubbles trapped between LM and IHS.

So first cover the whole surface by dropping a maybe 2-3mm drop in the middle and smearing it outwards. Dont worry about covering it evenly the LM also spreads a bit like normal Paste, as long as it is enough in the middle. Repeat with the other one. (with the IHS try to only cover the place where the Die is)

Lapping:
When using LM, lapping is only useful if you want to remove either old LM or that Nickelcoating (which has the same or a bit higher thermal conductivity then the LM, so its less of a reason).
If you use Thermal Paste lapping can reduce the miniscule cracks in the Metal, thus greatly enhance contact. But removing the Nickel can make the copper vulnerable to oxidizing.
Ive heard that some IHS's don't have an even surface but are either concave or convex in which lapping can help making an even surface.

Thermal Paste and Liquidmetal are different about that, since LM does go easier into little cracks inside the Metal (thats why it sticks so hard later on).

Glueing:
Well in this regard i can only say glueing shouldnt make a difference in Temperature, but it secures the IHS on the PCB. When installing the CPU the IHS might slip forward when its not glued or move around when moving the Case. That could raise Temperatures since the TIM isnt spread properly anymore if the IHS moves. If the TIM is dry it can even result in air pockets.

All that is more opinion then fact, but i tend to be close to the truth XD

@ Valgaur
My TIM on the outside of the IHS was Kryonaut not Conductonaut


----------



## socalmvp

How about my other concern. What if the CLU gets onto the PCB, can I just remove it or is this stuff pretty tacky that it won't spill onto the PCB? I don't want to fry my chip.


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> How about my other concern. What if the CLU gets onto the PCB, can I just remove it or is this stuff pretty tacky that it won't spill onto the PCB? I don't want to fry my chip.


I always cover with varnish any capacitor, vrm or pad close to the die if I use liquid metal. But liquid metal don't split easily only if you apply too much, be careful


----------



## Dantrax

I de-lidded my i7-7700k & applied a small 3-4mm bead of Cool Labs Liquid Metal to the CPU. I followed the YouTube video instructions spreading it with the brush & then I cleaned the brush by wiping it off on the IHS where the CPU would contact the IHS. So I only used a small amount of CLLM. I bought this ram>> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232460 << and used XMP to get it to run at stock settings of 4K MHz, 1.35V, 18,19,19,39,700,2T & I was shocked that it actually worked. I used Mem Test ver7.3 at the default 2133MHz & at XMP 4K MHz with 0 faults. I then used Prime95 ver291 at the XMP 4KMHz Ram settings with no problems. At stock CPU Speeds & Voltage I saw 72C package with Hardware Monitor x64 v1310 & Core Temp v1.7 while running Prime95 v291. But at Asus Max9Code bios 0906 4800MHz & 5K MHz one button presets I had 92-93C temps while running Prime95. But I also had 1.344V - 1.375V. I didn't even think it would boot into Win10 at 5K. Amazing board & bios by Asus. Anyway my question is did I use enough CLLM on the CPU? Or is the 93C temp normal at that Voltage & Speed? I'm using a Kraken X61 280mm AIO cooler with Noctua fans.


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lexer*
> 
> I always cover with varnish any capacitor, vrm or pad close to the die if I use liquid metal. But liquid metal don't split easily only if you apply too much, be careful


What type of varnish and how do I apply it?

Thank you


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> What type of varnish and how do I apply it?
> 
> Thank you


Steal the clear nail varnish of your mom or sister








EDIT: Just apply a small layer on the parts you wanna protect


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> What type of varnish and how do I apply it?
> 
> Thank you


clear nail polish for instance
a bottle obviously comes with a brush









for the gold contacts under the IHS
the PCB itself is not an issue

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theGucky*
> 
> I'm not a pro or something like that, i just delidded my first CPU 2 Pages back.
> 
> Thickness:
> But I think it doesn't matter of you have 1,5mm of LM between IHS and Die or just 0,5mm (no exact numbers, just an example). The thermal conductivity of LM is just that good


I delidded my chip again just a few pages ago

this time no glue

temps are no different at all

LM is just that good,like you said

acts/is as good as solder, so size of a gap should not matter (people where delidding soldered parts, but difference in temps were negligable back then as well)

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lexer*
> 
> I never had such a big difference of temps between "zero gap" and glued, but I always sand a bit the IHS base of the processors i delid


careful with that advice

while playing around with the IHS and trying to find out if it rests on the DIE I came to the conclusion that it does rest on the DIE without glue









and I took my time trying to find out if it does make contact
before I was thinking it does not, but it clearly rested on it

sanding even a bit too much might make trouble

sure if it's only to get the IHS clean (but wasn't needed for me in both cases)
but using some old credit card is best for people who are new methinks


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *theGucky*
> 
> I'm not a pro or something like that, i just delidded my first CPU 2 Pages back.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Thickness:
> But I think it doesn't matter of you have 1,5mm of LM between IHS and Die or just 0,5mm (no exact numbers, just an example). The thermal conductivity of LM is just that good.
> Thermal Paste is a different matter, thinner is better in that case, otherwise The Tim-Paste might act as a Thermal isolator (or kind of a weakness in the Thermalchain)
> 
> It IS important to get it to cover the WHOLE gap between Die and IHS.
> Since the LM really likes to stick to itself its a good choice to put LM on Die AND IHS, so gets into the gaps inside the Materials pushing the air out.
> By putting it only on the Die there may be miniscule Airbubbles trapped between LM and IHS.
> 
> So first cover the whole surface by dropping a maybe 2-3mm drop in the middle and smearing it outwards. Dont worry about covering it evenly the LM also spreads a bit like normal Paste, as long as it is enough in the middle. Repeat with the other one. (with the IHS try to only cover the place where the Die is)
> 
> Lapping:
> When using LM, lapping is only useful if you want to remove either old LM or that Nickelcoating (which has the same or a bit higher thermal conductivity then the LM, so its less of a reason).
> If you use Thermal Paste lapping can reduce the miniscule cracks in the Metal, thus greatly enhance contact. But removing the Nickel can make the copper vulnerable to oxidizing.
> Ive heard that some IHS's don't have an even surface but are either concave or convex in which lapping can help making an even surface.
> 
> Thermal Paste and Liquidmetal are different about that, since LM does go easier into little cracks inside the Metal (thats why it sticks so hard later on).
> 
> Glueing:
> Well in this regard i can only say glueing shouldnt make a difference in Temperature, but it secures the IHS on the PCB. When installing the CPU the IHS might slip forward when its not glued or move around when moving the Case. That could raise Temperatures since the TIM isnt spread properly anymore if the IHS moves. If the TIM is dry it can even result in air pockets.
> 
> All that is more opinion then fact, but i tend to be close to the truth XD
> 
> 
> 
> @ Valgaur
> My TIM on the outside of the IHS was Kryonaut not Conductonaut


Barely saw this Fixed


----------



## theGucky

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dantrax*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> I de-lidded my i7-7700k & applied a small 3-4mm bead of Cool Labs Liquid Metal to the CPU. I followed the YouTube video instructions spreading it with the brush & then I cleaned the brush by wiping it off on the IHS where the CPU would contact the IHS. So I only used a small amount of CLLM. I bought this ram>> https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232460 << and used XMP to get it to run at stock settings of 4K MHz, 1.35V, 18,19,19,39,700,2T & I was shocked that it actually worked. I used Mem Test ver7.3 at the default 2133MHz & at XMP 4K MHz with 0 faults. I then used Prime95 ver291 at the XMP 4KMHz Ram settings with no problems. At stock CPU Speeds & Voltage I saw 72C package with Hardware Monitor x64 v1310 & Core Temp v1.7 while running Prime95 v291. But at Asus Max9Code bios 0906 4800MHz & 5K MHz one button presets I had 92-93C temps while running Prime95. But I also had 1.344V - 1.375V. I didn't even think it would boot into Win10 at 5K. Amazing board & bios by Asus. Anyway my question is did I use enough CLLM on the CPU? Or is the 93C temp normal at that Voltage & Speed? I'm using a Kraken X61 280mm AIO cooler with Noctua fans.


Ram infos:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Ram is designed to run at 2133MHZ, but many makers sell RAM with higher speeds. All higher speeds are Overclocked speeds.
XMP is an Overclockprofile supported by Intel, Boardmakers and Rammakers.
IF your CPU supports high speeds, IF your Board supports high speeds and IF your Ram supports high speed, you can just use that XMP Profile and it works most of the time without tinkering.



Your board runs upto 4133MHz. The i7-7700k has 2 Ram limits. 1. is only Single or Dualchannel. 2. only upto 64GB. So no Issues with speed either.

Temps:
Well my i7-7700k @5GHz @1.4V with XMP 3200MHz Ram only gets to 65°C with Prime 95v291.
95°C was my Temp BEFORE delidding the CPU.
Ram speeds shouldn't impact your CPU Temp.

My CPU @4.5GHz Stock with 1.25V gets only 55°C warm on Prime 95.

I'm using an be Quiet! Silent Loop 280, its similar if not a little worse then your AIO.

My guess is that either there is a problem with your Cooler (problem with Pump, Liquid? or bad Thermal Paste on it) or your LM was distributed improperly.
Even with an Aircooler it should be max 75-80°C @5GHz after delidding.

*EDIT:*
Just wanted to add that lightweight Games like Heroes of the Storm get the CPU to 45°C, but only in heavy Teamfights, else its just 35-40°C. More like idle...
My ASUS STRIX 1080 Ti does the heavylifting ...although it gets 55°C warm, the Fans are configures to start spinning at 55°C, so my WHOLE system can stay at 40-50°C if i use earlier Fancurves..
Offtopic:
Thanks to delidding and lower Voltages, my Mainboard-Chip stays under 40°C too. Before delidding and before tweaking the Fancurve the X270 Chip got upto 60°C.
My M.2 SSD which is right under the Graphicscard stays cool too, since i put in a Fan at the bottom of the Case, even if some cables from the PSU obstruct the Airflow.
My Case: Fractal Design R5 with 280 AIORad and 2x140mm Fans on pull at the FRONT. 1 Bottom 140mm Fan blowing inside in the middle and 1x140mm Fan at the Back. No Fans on top. All 4 Fans are running at about 500RPM. HDD is in the 5.25" Driveslot and probably the loudest thing in idle or easy gaming.


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*


LOOL !
That its a Kaby Lake ? I never delided one
Ivy and Haswell without TIM the IHS sits on the sustrate and I delided only a few Skylake but i don't sand the IHS base on those processors


----------



## socalmvp

Hey guys,

One more question. I am really torn between using gel super glue or RTV or nothing at all. Is the super glue safe? Has anyone successfully delided a super glued cpu? If I go with no glue, what is the best way to make sure the IHS doesn't move?

Thanks again for any help


----------



## Sedril

I recommend using small amounts of RTV on the corners, it's enough to lock it in place but not enough to cause a gap or make it hard to redo the de-lid.

I personally would never use superglue, not enough control IMO...

If you don't use anything you can just lock it into the CPU holder but you have to make sure it doesn't move or slide around before it's locked, and be ready to redo it if you have to pull the CPU for some reason...


----------



## RuneDunes

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Sedril*
> 
> I recommend using small amounts of RTV on the corners, it's enough to lock it in place but not enough to cause a gap or make it hard to redo the de-lid.


I agree. The whole point is to not let the IHS budge, so the bare minimum would be best.


----------



## Dantrax

theGucky, thanks for the info & quick response. I didn't think the ram speed had anything to do with CPU temps. I think ram sold as "4k ram" should work at 4k. Otherwise sell me 2133 ram. Just saying. My high CPU temps as you demonstrated have me wondering what I did wrong. Don't know if I didn't put enough Liquid Metal on or if it's my old Phobia paste between the IHS & cooler. Anyway I'll start with the easiest options 1st. I'm not sure if I can clean that Liquid Metal off or just add another BB sized drop to it. Anyway thanks for the info about what my temps should be after de-lidding.


----------



## Jsunn

Hello All,

I purchased the Rocket Cool delidding kit and am really impressed. I did not have the Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra TIM so I went with Artic Silver 5 to replace the stock TIM. I have a few questions.

I was now going to purchase the Coolabs TIM, but I wanted to ask if it would be worth it? Can I expect anything more than decrease that I already have?

Also, I used the Loctite superglue to relid, can I use delid kit to remove the IHS again, or am I out of luck with the super glue, how would you recommend removing the superglue without damaging the PCB on the CPU? Can I use nail polish remover?

Thanks for your help!
-Jason


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> I purchased the Rocket Cool delidding kit and am really impressed. I did not have the Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra TIM so I went with Artic Silver 5 to replace the stock TIM. I have a few questions.
> 
> I was now going to purchase the Coolabs TIM, but I wanted to ask if it would be worth it? Can I expect anything more than decrease that I already have?
> 
> Also, I used the Loctite superglue to relid, can I use delid kit to remove the IHS again, or am I out of luck with the super glue, how would you recommend removing the superglue without damaging the PCB on the CPU? Can I use nail polish remover?
> 
> Thanks for your help!
> -Jason


that's the only test I ever came across
(there's no really big differences in the silver 5 vs noctua, but the noctua is better if I remember correctly)

https://m.hardocp.com/article/2017/02/02/intel_kaby_lake_i57600k_cpu_delid_relid_temp_results/









the drop *is* considerable again
note a 7600k runs cooler on average due to missing HT
a 7700k would benefit even more
also some chips run hotter on average
long story short
sure it would be worth it

on the loctite

beats me man
however there are some who have suggested nothing should happen if the force is not pulling, but shearing it off
like you would with the rockit tool

also I'm guessing here that you didn't just drowned it in glue, but put only a little on, right?


----------



## Jsunn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> that's the only test I ever came across
> (there's no really big differences in the silver 5 vs noctua, but the noctua is better if I remember correctly)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> the drop *is* considerable again
> note a 7600k runs cooler on average due to missing HT
> a 7700k would benefit even more
> also some chips run hotter on average
> long story short
> sure it would be worth it
> 
> on the loctite
> 
> beats me man
> however there are some who have suggested nothing should happen if the force is not pulling, but shearing it off
> like you would with the rockit tool
> 
> also I'm guessing here that you didn't just drowned it in glue, but put only a little on, right?


Thanks for the info, it does look like it might be worth it, I mean, that's why I got the delid kit in the first place.









I only put a very small drop on each corner to relid, I didn't want to completely seal it up again.

I would like to "soften" up the glue before using the delid kit again, I just want to make sure that nail polish remover won't attack the PCB.

I'll keep researching and post back.

Thanks,
-Jason


----------



## Jsunn

I just got a reply from Rockit Cool.
Quote:


> There is quite a difference between Arctic Silver 5 and Cool Lab Liquid Ultra.
> At least 4 to 5c lower with the Cool Labs.
> 
> If you followed the website and applied the super glue to the outside on each corner then there is no problem with delidding and relidding again. The Super Glue will not harm the PCB or the IHS.
> You are correct, acetone or most types of nail polish remover, will dissolve the super glue after the delid clean the PCB to like new status.
> The CPU in this computer has been delidded and relidded 5 times already and it still looks like new.
> 
> Let me know how it goes.


So it sounds like I should be able to delid the CPU again and put some better thermal compound.

I'll post back with temps!
-J


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> I just got a reply from Rockit Cool.
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> There is quite a difference between Arctic Silver 5 and Cool Lab Liquid Ultra.
> At least 4 to 5c lower with the Cool Labs.
> 
> If you followed the website and applied the super glue to the outside on each corner then there is no problem with delidding and relidding again. The Super Glue will not harm the PCB or the IHS.
> You are correct, acetone or most types of nail polish remover, will dissolve the super glue after the delid clean the PCB to like new status.
> The CPU in this computer has been delidded and relidded 5 times already and it still looks like new.
> 
> Let me know how it goes.
> 
> 
> 
> So it sounds like I should be able to delid the CPU again and put some better thermal compound.
> 
> I'll post back with temps!
> -J
Click to expand...

The other thing to keep in mind is that when you use a thermal paste after delidding, you are likely to experience "pump-out" after a while.
Whereas, a liquid metal such as CLU doesn't do that.
That is one of the primary reasons for using a liquid metal under the IHS, as opposed to a thermal paste.


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> I just got a reply from Rockit Cool.
> So it sounds like I should be able to delid the CPU again and put some better thermal compound.
> 
> I'll post back with temps!
> -J


I've tried both on die and CLU/CLP is much better than artic silver, for me 5-13C better using i7


----------



## Jsunn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> I've tried both on die and CLU/CLP is much better than artic silver, for me 5-13C better using i7


Cool, thank you for the info. I just ordered some Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut to redo my delid. I've used AS5 for a long time and that is what I had on hand. I figured I'd see if I could get a few more degrees out of it.

Thanks,
-Jason


----------



## Zyther

How did I do







?
Also did a thin layer underneath the IHS, will post temps later tonight.


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> Cool, thank you for the info. I just ordered some Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut to redo my delid. I've used AS5 for a long time and that is what I had on hand. I figured I'd see if I could get a few more degrees out of it.
> 
> Thanks,
> -Jason


Good deal, T.Grizz is solid
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> How did I do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> Also did a thin layer underneath the IHS, will post temps later tonight.


Very nice, guessing you'll see some hefty drops in T


----------



## socalmvp

Alright guys,

Got it delidded and back together. Thanks for all your help. One other question, I went with Permatex silicon. Do you all wait the 24hrs before using it to let the stuff cure? The waiting is killing me to see how I did.

thanks again


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

I put a dab on a piece of paper, set that next to the whole re-lid jig assembly, and put them both in a warm spot. Only took a few hours before the silicone was set, so that's when I put the CPU into the mobo.


----------



## Dantrax

I got a new NZXT Kraken X61 with dual 140mm fans. I'm running Prime95 at 4600MHz at 1.328V with temps of 69c to 71c. Better than the 92C I was getting with my old Kraken X61, I guess it was time to get a new one.


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dantrax*
> 
> I got a new NZXT Kraken X61 with dual 140mm fans. I'm running Prime95 at 4600MHz at 1.328V with temps of 69c to 71c. Better than the 92C I was getting with my old Kraken X61, I guess it was time to get a new one.


What chip are you running?


----------



## cdnGhost

Another delid success...



but dammit my temps are still in the 250-800 degree range








Now to grill some steaks as I await my new clu and thermal paste....

Can't wait for the North American delid extravaganza tool to arrive!


----------



## Dantrax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> What chip are you running?


an i7 7700k I put weatherstrip adhesive on the IHS when I closed it back up. I opened up the chip again & redid the CLLM, the adhesive & renewed my x61 kraken, which dropped my temps. I have a Lian Li D600 case with the 280 mm radiator mounted on the back wall. The hoses go over the top of the mobo to the rad on the other side. I got a kraken because the fan holes are 15mm apart in Lian Li cases which matches the kraken radiator holes. I would like it to run cooler & I might try another cooler, I'll let you know.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Alright, just beheaded my 7700K - can't say using the tool was much easier than doing my IB CPUs with a hammer and a block (or HDD housing) - however, I can say it was way less stressful doing it with a tool.









Put RTV on with a micro screwdriver (used it like a miniature trowel basically) since I found (as others) that the IHS does indeed make contact with the die - so figured it will still basically be no gap really. There was hardly any TIM at all on it when I popped the IHS... there was way more on the sides actually. So I'm not really expecting a ton more headroom with this, but we'll see. I was easily able to OC to 5GHz with tons of voltage headroom - but with air cooling I'm already against the thermal stops for it even at 1.248V Vcore. (https://valid.x86.fr/8w6fx3)





I didn't get a shot of the RTV application as I wanted to move fast to mount/adjust and clamp (not using a re-lid kit - just using the socket clamp). Suffice it to say as thin as you can have it... that's what it is.


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dantrax*
> 
> an i7 7700k I put weatherstrip adhesive on the IHS when I closed it back up. I opened up the chip again & redid the CLLM, the adhesive & renewed my x61 kraken, which dropped my temps. I have a Lian Li D600 case with the 280 mm radiator mounted on the back wall. The hoses go over the top of the mobo to the rad on the other side. I got a kraken because the fan holes are 15mm apart in Lian Li cases which matches the kraken radiator holes. I would like it to run cooler & I might try another cooler, I'll let you know.


I thought you might have an I7700k, I think you may have too much voltage. I am running my chip at 4.7 with only 1.20V and it is stable. I would lower it and stress test it.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> I thought you might have an I7700k, I think you may have too much voltage. I am running my chip at 4.7 with only 1.20V and it is stable. I would lower it and stress test it.


This. Although anything is possible, I too find it hard to believe you would need that much voltage to hit only 4.7. Mine could do that without adjustment at all and can do 5.0 well under 1.3V (granted maybe I got lucky, but I'm basically never lucky).


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> This. Although anything is possible, I too find it hard to believe you would need that much voltage to hit only 4.7. Mine could do that without adjustment at all and can do 5.0 well under 1.3V (granted maybe I got lucky, but I'm basically never lucky).


Are you saying I can go higher with 1.200V? I am going to try, I was just waiting to delid. I just put it together and running test now.


----------



## ttnuagmada

Random update:

I delided my 3770K at about this time 4 years ago. I've run it at [email protected] since then with an NH-D14 cooling it for the majority of that time. I re-do the CLU every year or so. CPU still runs fine with no degradation, and there has never been any unwanted side-effects from the CLU or anything like that. If i get another Intel CPU that benefits from deliding, I have absolutely no qualms with doing it again.


----------



## Dantrax

Thanks for the info. I just did the Asus 1 button selection in the bios. I thought it was okay, but I'll give the lower voltage a try and I'll post back how it works out. Why give it more than it needs.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dantrax*
> 
> Thanks for the info. I just did the Asus 1 button selection in the bios. I thought it was okay, but I'll give the lower voltage a try and I'll post back how it works out. Why give it more than it needs.


because every CPU is different and for Asus to at least *sort of* guarantee a one button overclock they give too generous voltage on average
playing it safe

actually most people try to get as low voltage for as high clocks possible
trying to keep temps down and too high voltages *could* degrade a chip over time

edit:
you could have a look here

http://www.overclock.net/t/1621347/kaby-lake-overclocking-guide-with-statistics

at least at the list and how high people got with what kind of voltages

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ttnuagmada*
> 
> Random update:
> 
> I delided my 3770K at about this time 4 years ago. I've run it at [email protected] since then with an NH-D14 cooling it for the majority of that time. I re-do the CLU every year or so. CPU still runs fine with no degradation, and there has never been any unwanted side-effects from the CLU or anything like that. If i get another Intel CPU that benefits from deliding, I have absolutely no qualms with doing it again.


cool









anything on the LM running off, even just a bit?

because I had a bit of LM escape the DIE
















funny thing
my case is standing
if you look where the arrow is on the PCB then you see it run up not down


----------



## socalmvp

My delid is done. I only lowered my temps by 7 to 10C. Should I be happy with that or should I try again?


----------



## ttnuagmada

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> My delid is done. I only lowered my temps by 7 to 10C. Should I be happy with that or should I try again?


Did you use CLU or something else? Also, did you glue the IHS back on, or just let the socket clamp hold it on? a 20C drop with a moderate overclock is pretty common, mine was more like 22-23C.

The black glue that holds the IHS on is part of the problem due to the gap is creates. Did you scrape all of it off? If you glued it back on, you might want to make sure you used as little as possible, as you don't want to create a gap between the core/IHS. Personally I just let the socket clamp hold mine on.


----------



## ttnuagmada

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> anything on the LM running off, even just a bit?
> 
> because I had a bit of LM escape the DIE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> funny thing
> my case is standing
> if you look where the arrow is on the PCB then you see it run up not down


I don't remember, but I want to think it might have done that the first time or 2 that I put the CLU on. It didn't this last time for sure (re-did it just a couple of months ago). Yours looks like you might have used a little bit more than I did. I put on as little as I could while still covering the whole core, same with the backside of the IHS. Maybe I just got the perfect amount on it this last time.


----------



## Zyther

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> How did I do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> Also did a thin layer underneath the IHS, will post temps later tonight.


OCN: Zyther
CPU: 3770k
on die-TIM: CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: nil
OC after delid: - same as before. 4GHZ
Temp drops: down 24c








CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/46ercu


----------



## Dantrax

I set the Vcore to 1.300V & ran Prime95 at 1.264V & 1.248V at 4600MHz for about an hour. Power was down 20W & temp was 64C.


----------



## Dantrax

Going to try 5KMHZ next. These imported pictures are hard to see even at highest res.


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ttnuagmada*
> 
> Did you use CLU or something else? Also, did you glue the IHS back on, or just let the socket clamp hold it on? a 20C drop with a moderate overclock is pretty common, mine was more like 22-23C.
> 
> The black glue that holds the IHS on is part of the problem due to the gap is creates. Did you scrape all of it off? If you glued it back on, you might want to make sure you used as little as possible, as you don't want to create a gap between the core/IHS. Personally I just let the socket clamp hold mine on.


yes, I used clu. I did scrap everything off and then glued it back on. I think I may have put too much. Is there a amount of time that the clu needs to set before testing, meaning does it improve over time?


----------



## ttnuagmada

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> yes, I used clu. I did scrap everything off and then glued it back on. I think I may have put too much. Is there a amount of time that the clu needs to set before testing, meaning does it improve over time?


results should be instant. I would maybe look at the amount of glue you used to put it back on.


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ttnuagmada*
> 
> results should be instant. I would maybe look at the amount of glue you used to put it back on.


Wow, that is a lot of work. Is it easy to remove the clu?


----------



## Raxus

Can anyone recommend some rtv to reattach the ihs?


----------



## ttnuagmada

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> Wow, that is a lot of work. Is it easy to remove the clu?


what type of temps are you getting? it could be that yours was not as bad as some from the start.


----------



## Zyther

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raxus*
> 
> Can anyone recommend some rtv to reattach the ihs?


I used Permatex Ultra Black
https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/ultra-series-gasket-makers/permatex-ultra-black-maximum-oil-resistance-rtv-silicone-gasket-maker-4/


----------



## HZCH

I'VE RECEIVED THE der8auer DELID DIE MATE !!

I'm not delidding my 4670k for fun yet, gonna test on my brother's 4790k.

I have a question: can I use any silicone compound to protect the transistors on the 4670k, or should I get a particular product ? I want to get something like the permatex rtv silicone black, because I WANT to fix the IHS, as I'll benchmark the CPU on two different motherboards...

I know the standard answer ; the problem is I live in *Switzerland* and I speak *french*, so I don't really know how you would call an rtv silicone compound in french...

Could someone help me? ?

[edit] I've already delidded a 2500k and a 3750k with my brother, with the vice-and-hammer method. But we didn't use anything to fix the IHS, as we wouldn't move the CPUs.


----------



## Zyther

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> I'VE RECEIVED THE der8auer DELID DIE MATE !!
> 
> I'm not delidding my 4670k for fun yet, gonna test on my brother's 4790k.
> 
> I have a question: can I use any silicone compound to protect the transistors on the 4670k, or should I get a particular product ? I want to get something like the permatex rtv silicone black, because I WANT to fix the IHS, as I'll benchmark the CPU on two different motherboards...
> 
> I know the standard answer ; the problem is I live in *Switzerland* and I speak *french*, so I don't really know how you would call an rtv silicone compound in french...
> 
> Could someone help me? ?
> 
> [edit] I've already delidded a 2500k and a 3750k with my brother, with the vice-and-hammer method. But we didn't use anything to fix the IHS, as we wouldn't move the CPUs.


You delidded a 2500k? There a soldered TIM.

Just go to any automotive car store and look for gasket maker silicon


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> You delidded a 2500k? There a soldered TIM.
> 
> Just go to any automotive car store and look for gasket maker silicon


Was it??? If it was soldered, we didn't delid it. I have a bad memory, probably messed up ? (I know there was at least an ivy-bridge; the chip flew 2 meters away because we didn't tape it correctly the vice. Gonna ask for the other one, maybe that's a false memory or something)

Thanks for the suggestion, going to roam garages near my place.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> Was it??? If it was soldered, we didn't delid it. I have a bad memory, probably messed up ? (I know there was at least an ivy-bridge; the chip flew 2 meters away because we didn't tape it correctly the vice. Gonna ask for the other one, maybe that's a false memory or something)
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion, going to roam garages near my place.


I wonder why people are under the impression they need something special
I have seen users buying silicon that's good for up to 350 degrees celsius


Spoiler: AERZETIX: Silicone 350C Noir - C1750




https://www.amazon.fr/AERZETIX-Silicone-joints-carter-vitesse/dp/B00I3XEF7A/ref=pd_cp_263_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=S0ZE182P7PS0GXW37N60


I'd wonder if something else on a CPU wouldn't give out at those temps before the silicon does









personally i used a standard silicon I had (hint: if people use super glue successfully then sort of anything might work)
you're supposed to only give the corners a small drop of it anyway

if you really want to buy something

here is a pic of the silicon that the delid die mate comes with, which is actually a silicon good for up to 270 degrees, that's probably what the english native ones here mean with gasket silicon







(which I guess is used in motors in cars, so its heat resistant)





I know I can get it either from Amazon or in a hardware store

https://www.amazon.fr/UHU-Mastic-silicone-temp%C3%A9rature-46735/dp/B008YE3ABA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1494146960&sr=8-1&keywords=uhu+silicone

or loctite like this one



https://www.amazon.fr/Loctite-Joint-D%C3%A9tanch%C3%A9it%C3%A9-Haute-Performances/dp/B00B49W4SW/ref=pd_sim_263_1?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=M97X052XVATEM01TN3NB

they are all just heat resistant silicone

if you go in a hardware store and ask for some silicon that is heat resistant I'm sure they can point out one as well


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I wonder why people are under the impression they need something special
> I have seen users buying silicon that's good for up to 350 degrees celsius
> I'd wonder if something else on a CPU wouldn't give out at those temps before the silicon does
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> personally i used a standard silicon I had (hint: if people use super glue successfully then sort of anything might work)
> you're supposed to only give the corners a small drop of it anyway
> 
> if you really want to buy something
> 
> here is a pic of the silicon that the delid die mate comes with, which is actually a silicon good for up to 270 degrees, that's probably what the english native ones here mean with gasket silicon
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know I can get it either from Amazon or in a hardware store
> 
> https://www.amazon.fr/UHU-Mastic-silicone-temp%C3%A9rature-46735/dp/B008YE3ABA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1494146960&sr=8-1&keywords=uhu+silicone


UHU is a brand I can find easily here! Thanks for your advice !


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> UHU is a brand I can find easily here! Thanks for your advice !


I edited some other choices in


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HZCH*
> 
> I know the standard answer ; the problem is I live in *Switzerland* and I speak *french*, so I don't really know how you would call an rtv silicone compound in french...
> 
> Could someone help me? ?
> .


Silicone rtv via google translate

https://translate.google.com/#auto/fr/rtv%20silicone


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raxus*
> 
> Can anyone recommend some rtv to reattach the ihs?


that sort of defeats the purpose, as it expands slightly when drying, and causes the gap between the IHS and the die. Most people dont reattach to look factory, just touch the corners of IHS and PCB with super glue and let it dry. it keeps it from coming off.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> that sort of defeats the purpose, as it expands slightly when drying, and causes the gap between the IHS and the die. Most people dont reattach to look factory, just touch the corners of IHS and PCB with super glue and let it dry. it keeps it from coming off.


there are so many that used silicone
I wouldn't really worry about it
and many apply some kind of force to glue it together and holding it tight while curing (like the clamps of the socket, delidding tools come either with a way to hold it together or an add-on)

the liquid metal wmk is so high it doesn't matter
it's like solder in that regard

I re-did my delid and used no glue this time around
exact same temps while idle and under load (same ambient)

the tip here is, like you said, use as little as possible
like only touching the corners
but which kind of glue is used isn't really important here

people probably just think of heat resistant silicone
because of high temps and being flexible
I've been asking people why they think they need a special silicon that's rated for temperatures so high (somewhere around 300 degrees)

no one actually replies

ehh

if they want to
it's not just the gap

it's the combination of a gap and terrible paste *compared to* either liquid metal or solder

if Intel used solder to close the gap instead of TIM then delidding would be still a niche thing even amongst overclockers
but I guess lapping would still be a bit more common

what interests me more these days is how a "big" store that works together with der8auer (and partners with OverclockersUk) can claim better temps by using a silver custom IHS over the stock Intel IHS (both delidded with conductonaut)
I think it was like 8 or 10 degrees
doesn't seem plausible to me

thats 10 degrees with the same delid and conductonaut
just one with custom IHS and one with stock Intel (I think they also offered a stock Intel, but lapped version)


----------



## Dantrax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Raxus*
> 
> Can anyone recommend some rtv to reattach the ihs?


A little bit of weather-strip adhesive. Use a toothpick to apply it very sparingly on the IHS & leave an air vent. Don't apply it all the way around the IHS. You can de-lid it again without damage if you need to, I did..


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

OCN name: digicidal
CPU: 7700K
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Zalman Cheap Stuff
Mhz gained: 300MHz
OC after delid: 5.3GHz
Temp drops: 26C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/5cncp6

This is on really crappy air (Zalman cnps9500 held on with a velcro strap) - as it's just test bench until I get the build going.

Once I got to 5GHz, even though I was still around 1.3V at that point - stressing would hit the bumpstops at 100C on two cores - so stopped immediately and delidded at that point.

After delid, the exact same settings would do IBT standard runs at same temps as stock (~74C on hottest core).

At 5.3GHz I could only do validation and a Cinebench run because I was hitting 78C/84C on those - so IBT would have cooked the crap out of it. Once it's under water I'll post another update - and maybe try for 5.4GHz (or at least be able to test for stability at 5.3GHz).


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Zyther*
> 
> OCN: Zyther
> CPU: 3770k
> on die-TIM: CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: nil
> OC after delid: - same as before. 4GHZ
> Temp drops: down 24c
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/46ercu


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!







Ivy for life!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> OCN name: digicidal
> CPU: 7700K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Zalman Cheap Stuff
> Mhz gained: 300MHz
> OC after delid: 5.3GHz
> Temp drops: 26C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/5cncp6
> 
> This is on really crappy air (Zalman cnps9500 held on with a velcro strap) - as it's just test bench until I get the build going.
> 
> Once I got to 5GHz, even though I was still around 1.3V at that point - stressing would hit the bumpstops at 100C on two cores - so stopped immediately and delidded at that point.
> 
> After delid, the exact same settings would do IBT standard runs at same temps as stock (~74C on hottest core).
> 
> At 5.3GHz I could only do validation and a Cinebench run because I was hitting 78C/84C on those - so IBT would have cooked the crap out of it. Once it's under water I'll post another update - and maybe try for 5.4GHz (or at least be able to test for stability at 5.3GHz).


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Cl2G

What is the lifespan of Coollabratory's Liquid Ultra when used between the ihs and die?

Is it necessary to ever reapply it again, or has anyone seen any drop off in performance over time?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> OCN name: digicidal
> CPU: 7700K
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Zalman Cheap Stuff
> Mhz gained: 300MHz
> OC after delid: 5.3GHz
> Temp drops: 26C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/5cncp6
> 
> This is on really crappy air (Zalman cnps9500 held on with a velcro strap) - as it's just test bench until I get the build going.
> 
> Once I got to 5GHz, even though I was still around 1.3V at that point - stressing would hit the bumpstops at 100C on two cores - so stopped immediately and delidded at that point.
> 
> After delid, the exact same settings would do IBT standard runs at same temps as stock (~74C on hottest core).
> 
> At 5.3GHz I could only do validation and a Cinebench run because I was hitting 78C/84C on those - so IBT would have cooked the crap out of it. Once it's under water I'll post another update - and maybe try for 5.4GHz (or at least be able to test for stability at 5.3GHz).


while I don't doubt that you're cooling solution is cobbled together









I have to tell you that all Asus boards I've heard about are overvolting some secondary voltages (if left on auto) to the extreme and causing very high temps for nothing
*when reaching 5.3Ghz* and beyond

this is my system with an AiO in use
no settings have been changed except setting the multiplier from 52 to 53




Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silicon Lottery*
> 
> Sort of a bug with Asus boards. When moving past 5.25GHz auto values for PLL Termination, PCH Core, and CPU Standby voltages are set to 1.6V which is way too high. Set all of these manually to 1V.


keep that in mind when chasing speeds so high


----------



## Raxus

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> that sort of defeats the purpose, as it expands slightly when drying, and causes the gap between the IHS and the die. Most people dont reattach to look factory, just touch the corners of IHS and PCB with super glue and let it dry. it keeps it from coming off.


Can you still remove the lid after supergluing it? I've read than you can use acetone to dissolve it?


----------



## Jsunn

Hi,

I am going to be doing the same thing, I am going to use Acetone to remove the superglue on the delid I just did. I want to put some different TIM in the CPU die.

The Acetone shouldn't harm the PCB.

-J


----------



## Gurkburk

Can a bad lapping job cause bad contact between cooler & heatsink, resulting in low idle temps, but really high load temps ?

Just went from H80i to a Noctua DH D15 or something, the huge cooler and the temps arent any different when in full load, intel burn test.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> while I don't doubt that you're cooling solution is cobbled together
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have to tell you that all Asus boards I've heard about are overvolting some secondary voltages (if left on auto) to the extreme and causing very high temps for nothing
> *when reaching 5.3Ghz* and beyond
> 
> this is my system with an AiO in use
> no settings have been changed except setting the multiplier from 52 to 53
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> keep that in mind when chasing speeds so high


Hmmm... I would have thought that would have jumped out at me if it applied - I was scrutinizing all of my voltages... but now that you've brought that up I'll definitely check to see if I can adjust downward further. I'm thinking I had already manually set almost every voltage but I definitely may have left standby at auto, and maybe a couple others.

And yes... I think cobbled together is accurate:


----------



## socalmvp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ttnuagmada*
> 
> what type of temps are you getting? it could be that yours was not as bad as some from the start.


Before delid 73C at ambient temp of 28.8C or 84F. CPU overclocked to 4.7 at 1.200V. After delid, same overclock, temps dropped to 63C but only at 27C or 81F. I think I will do it again.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> while I don't doubt that you're cooling solution is cobbled together
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have to tell you that all Asus boards I've heard about are overvolting some secondary voltages (if left on auto) to the extreme and causing very high temps for nothing
> *when reaching 5.3Ghz* and beyond
> 
> this is my system with an AiO in use
> no settings have been changed except setting the multiplier from 52 to 53
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> keep that in mind when chasing speeds so high
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And yes... I think cobbled together is accurate:
Click to expand...

I'll say. Is that a Rubberband or a large ziptie?









~Ceadder


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> there are so many that used silicone
> I wouldn't really worry about it
> and many apply some kind of force to glue it together and holding it tight while curing (like the clamps of the socket, delidding tools come either with a way to hold it together or an add-on)
> 
> the liquid metal wmk is so high it doesn't matter
> it's like solder in that regard
> 
> I re-did my delid and used no glue this time around
> exact same temps while idle and under load (same ambient)
> 
> the tip here is, like you said, use as little as possible
> like only touching the corners
> but which kind of glue is used isn't really important here
> 
> people probably just think of heat resistant silicone
> because of high temps and being flexible
> I've been asking people why they think they need a special silicon that's rated for temperatures so high (somewhere around 300 degrees)
> 
> no one actually replies
> 
> ehh
> 
> if they want to
> it's not just the gap
> 
> it's the combination of a gap and terrible paste *compared to* either liquid metal or solder
> 
> if Intel used solder to close the gap instead of TIM then delidding would be still a niche thing even amongst overclockers
> but I guess lapping would still be a bit more common
> 
> what interests me more these days is how a "big" store that works together with der8auer (and partners with OverclockersUk) can claim better temps by using a silver custom IHS over the stock Intel IHS (both delidded with conductonaut)
> I think it was like 8 or 10 degrees
> doesn't seem plausible to me
> 
> thats 10 degrees with the same delid and conductonaut
> just one with custom IHS and one with stock Intel (I think they also offered a stock Intel, but lapped version)


true, maybe its the stores pushing product on why to not use RTV.

Speaking of RTV...even the basic clear silicone is heat resistant to well over what a CPU will throw at it. Most of the little tubes of permatex at automotive stores are rated for up to 500 degrees farenheit at minimum. No need for high temp. No need for high temp red, unless you are tacking up a gasket to the transmission pan on a hauling truck prior to installation. Then again, my friend has always lived by overkill is under rated. not this guy.

For science and your reading pleasure:
https://mechanics.stackexchange.com/questions/18377/red-vs-black-vs-grey-rtv-whats-in-a-color

I particularly like Permatex products...I had a few mechanics in the family who influenced me growing up.








http://www.permatex.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Permatex_GasketMakerSelector.pdf

***ON A SERIOUS NOTE***
Should I even use a Rockit88? I am so tempted to buy one, with a relid adapter for 38 bucks...but Der8auer just carefully used a razor blade. I do have a steady hand and patience. I may attempt on an old CPU that isnt even used anymore just for practice.


----------



## Jsunn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> ***ON A SERIOUS NOTE***
> Should I even use a Rockit88? I am so tempted to buy one, with a relid adapter for 38 bucks...but Der8auer just carefully used a razor blade. I do have a steady hand and patience. I may attempt on an old CPU that isnt even used anymore just for practice.


I would recommend it. I bricked a 7700k with a razor blade. I got it and it made the whole process super simple on my second CPU.

-J


----------



## Gurkburk

So I bought the 7700K today. I'm not impressed with the STOCK temps in Intel burn test, reaching 100*C. (Noctua DH 15H~ something, dual fan)

Is this normal? Or did i get an exceptionally bad chip?

I delidded my 4770k, considering doing the same with this.


----------



## Jsunn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> So I bought the 7700K today. I'm not impressed with the STOCK temps in Intel burn test, reaching 100*C. (Noctua DH 15H~ something, dual fan)
> 
> Is this normal? Or did i get an exceptionally bad chip?
> 
> I delidded my 4770k, considering doing the same with this.


That is really high, what is your cooling solution? I am O/C'ed to 4.9 @ 1.33v and I only see 89 on Real Bench. I have a custom W/C loop.


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> That is really high, what is your cooling solution? I am O/C'ed to 4.9 @ 1.33v and I only see 89 on Real Bench. I have a custom W/C loop.


With each "push" Intel burn test does, mine jumps to around 90-94*C.

I've got the Noctua DH 15H or whatever it's called, air cooler. Supposed to be extremely good and the best one out there?

This is at 4.5Ghz and around 1.25-1.27v.


----------



## Jsunn

Yeah, if you are on air, temps are going to be a lot hotter. That does seem high for stock clocks, but also intel burn in test is one of the most severe test apps as well.

I want to try and keep my temps below 80 degrees for normal use. Maybe someone with an air cooled setup will chime in?

-J


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> Yeah, if you are on air, temps are going to be a lot hotter. That does seem high for stock clocks, but also intel burn in test is one of the most severe test apps as well.
> 
> I want to try and keep my temps below 80 degrees for normal use. Maybe someone with an air cooled setup will chime in?
> 
> -J


Supposedely this cooler is supposed to be better than all the closed watercoolers, like corsair h100 etc.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> I particularly like Permatex products...I had a few mechanics in the family who influenced me growing up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.permatex.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Permatex_GasketMakerSelector.pdf
> 
> ***ON A SERIOUS NOTE***
> Should I even use a Rockit88? I am so tempted to buy one, with a relid adapter for 38 bucks...but Der8auer just carefully used a razor blade. I do have a steady hand and patience. I may attempt on an old CPU that isnt even used anymore just for practice.


thx
good read

the tools make it hassle free

if you can try it on a core 2 duo for instance that would be a start
those aren't soldered and there's nothing under the IHS except the DIE, just like a Kaby

that being said
its easy to scrape just a bit of PCB


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> That is really high, what is your cooling solution? I am O/C'ed to 4.9 @ 1.33v and I only see 89 on Real Bench. I have a custom W/C loop.


I guess 7700K do run considerably hotter than my 6700K.

I only see ~60° in RealBench; 4850MHz, 1.39VCore.


----------



## Gurkburk

5Ghz @ 1.35V , reaching 100*C and downclocks a little. I'm gonna consider delidding. Seems like a good chip though? Thoughts? (Realbench)


----------



## SevHollywood

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> 5Ghz @ 1.35V , reaching 100*C and downclocks a little. I'm gonna consider delidding. Seems like a good chip though? Thoughts? (Realbench)


Not too shabby. I have to be at 1.4v to hit 5.0ghz. And mine is delidded. I would def delid if I were you.


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SevHollywood*
> 
> Not too shabby. I have to be at 1.4v to hit 5.0ghz. And mine is delidded. I would def delid if I were you.


What temps did you have before/after delid?


----------



## SevHollywood

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> What temps did you have before/after delid?


I couldn't get stable at 5.0ghz before. Now I can stress test at 5.0ghz and peak at around 68c


----------



## Piddeman

Hello all!

I'm really into this with delid the CPU..but I am not sure if its worth the risk?

Here is my OC and load temps.

Do you think I can get better temps if I delid my 4690K?



NH-D15s with one fan.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> What temps did you have before/after delid?


maybe it helps you a little

this is on air, 5.1 Ghz, 1.376v (set 1.375 in bios)
my 7600k before delid









and after










88 degrees vs 67 degrees after (though ambient might have been 1 or 2 degree colder)
20 degrees is quite worth it
it also means running silent instead of loud fans

keep in mind using other stresstesting tools would yield even higher temps


----------



## Gurkburk

I delidded & I'm on air. I think the temps are SLIGHTLY lower. I'm not reaching 100*C anymore, so that's good. But I am still circling around 90~*C.

Is getting the liquid metal worth it? I've put the cooling paste that Noctua sent with their D15 cooler, both between IHS and cooler. I've also redone the paste, to make sure i did it properly & see if there was any difference.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> I delidded & I'm on air. I think the temps are SLIGHTLY lower. I'm not reaching 100*C anymore, so that's good. But I am still circling around 90~*C.
> 
> Is getting the liquid metal worth it? I've put the cooling paste that Noctua sent with their D15 cooler, both between IHS and cooler. I've also redone the paste, to make sure i did it properly & see if there was any difference.


youre asking if liquid metal is worth it, so I'm guessing you don't have any liquid metal paste *under* the IHS?
because if you had the stuff you would've used it for the delidding

for this single purpose its worth it
if there is no liquid metal under the IHS then replacing it could see a temp drop of another 10 degrees

on the IHS it matters little (its actually quite a hassle on the IHS)


----------



## Ceadderman

Delidded the locked 4790 in my Dell CPS 8700 last night.

Replaced all TIM with TG Aquanaut, so it should be okay for push out til I get some CLU as this chip will not be clocked due to the limitational board Dell packed into their systems.

Sadly, I cannot report on Temps at this time, so I cannot join the group as anything but subbed. Been subbed for a while now. Do you take mascot apps?









Before delidding, base temp was mid 40s at ambient. Gaming pushed it up to 60c. I suspect that I will see around a 5-10c drop in temps. But since my HDMI cable is over at my brother's house in a box I cannot connect it to a monitor til later in the week. Maybe as early as tomorrow night. Hopefully. My Magnavox smart TV only has AGP connection or HDMI. No DVI even though it's less than 3 years old.









~Ceadder


----------



## socalmvp

I redid my delid. Wasn't satisfied with my 1st effort. Here are the screen shots. 1st one is for 1/2 hour real bench at ambient of 84F. 2nd one is after the 1st delid and the ambient was only 81F. Both overclocked to 4.7 with 1.200V. The last one is at ambient temp of 76F, but overclocked to 4.8 at 1.250V. All test were 1/2 hour. What do you think I could push this chip to? Also, notice the fan speed on the third shot, much lower then the other ones.

The difference I think is the first time I used silicon and think I put on to much. 2nd delid, no silicon.

First time posting screen shots. Hope I did it right.


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> youre asking if liquid metal is worth it, so I'm guessing you don't have any liquid metal paste *under* the IHS?
> because if you had the stuff you would've used it for the delidding
> 
> for this single purpose its worth it
> if there is no liquid metal under the IHS then replacing it could see a temp drop of another 10 degrees
> 
> on the IHS it matters little (its actually quite a hassle on the IHS)


Precisely, I used normal paste on my 4770k & now as well under the IHS. So I guess i'll place an order on some liquid metal


----------



## orvils

Got one question for you guys.
About half a year or so ago I delided my 4790k. Now I moved it to a different motherboard and temps gotten a little worse.
I used Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra between IHS and die.
So here is the question - do you think it should be re-applied? Maybe IHS moved when I was switching motherboards and contact got worse?
If so, what should I use to clean existing tim from die?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *orvils*
> 
> Got one question for you guys.
> About half a year or so ago I delided my 4790k. Now I moved it to a different motherboard and temps gotten a little worse.
> I used Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra between IHS and die.
> So here is the question - do you think it should be re-applied? Maybe IHS moved when I was switching motherboards and contact got worse?
> If so, what should I use to clean existing tim from die?


what's a little?
some boards provide a bit more voltage on average than others
like overvolting the voltage a little bit
some provide less, and others provide a LLC setting to better fine tune

that alone could be a few degrees

there have been users reporting worse temp after a while (I think usually moving the case with big tower cooler on or something alike)

but firstly those were reporting like 30 degrees more (saying the liquid metal hardened / dried out)
and secondly I think only between IHS and cooler
as the liquid metal reacts a little with copper
but the IHS is Nickel plated the liquid metal doesn't react with either the IHS and DIE

I think it's kind of accepted that the liquid metal stays liquid under the IHS

still if you want to open it up again
maybe make some nice pics how it looked like after a while

usually people leave it as is and there isn't a lot of long term info readily available

it's not so easy cleaning the stuff
gotta try to more or less lift most of it off with paper

if you smear over the PCB that's not an issue
you can clean that up easy enough with some kind of alcohol, nail polish remover so on

so work away from those small condensators (or what those small nubs are again)
did you put something on those for protection?


----------



## orvils

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> what's a little?
> some boards provide a bit more voltage on average than others
> like overvolting the voltage a little bit
> some provide less, and others provide a LLC setting to better fine tune
> 
> that alone could be a few degrees
> 
> there have been users reporting worse temp after a while (I think usually moving the case with big tower cooler on or something alike)
> 
> but firstly those were reporting like 30 degrees more (saying the liquid metal hardened / dried out)
> and secondly I think only between IHS and cooler
> as the liquid metal reacts a little with copper
> but the IHS is Nickel plated the liquid metal doesn't react with either the IHS and DIE
> 
> I think it's kind of accepted that the liquid metal stays liquid under the IHS
> 
> still if you want to open it up again
> maybe make some nice pics how it looked like after a while
> 
> usually people leave it as is and there isn't a lot of long term info readily available
> 
> it's not so easy cleaning the stuff
> gotta try to more or less lift most of it off with paper
> 
> if you smear over the PCB that's not an issue
> you can clean that up easy enough with some kind of alcohol, nail polish remover so on
> 
> so work away from those small condensators (or what those small nubs are again)
> did you put something on those for protection?


It is hard to tell now because I have change from liquid cooling to air cooler. I did the motherboard change while I was still on liquid and it was about 5c change.
Now with air cpu temp goes to low 70's.

It is not too critial. I just hought taht as I still have tim laying around I might as well do it.

I used nail polish on those small things (capacitors?) on the left side.

I am thinking about doing few mods to the case so might open up the cpu then.

Thanks for info.


----------



## Jsunn

I just redid my de-lid on my 7700k. I originally put AS5 between the die and the IHS and only really saw a 5 degree drop on average on real bench.

I used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut (TGC) and I'm seeing a huge drop on temps. I put TGC on the die and IHS and also on the IHS and cold plate of my heatsink (EK Supremacy EVO).

I'll post my temps after I run some tests, but my initial run was showing a 20+ degree drop.

I'm running 4.9 GHz @ 1.33v Vcore.


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> I just redid my de-lid on my 7700k. I originally put AS5 between the die and the IHS and only really saw a 5 degree drop on average on real bench.
> 
> I used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut (TGC) and I'm seeing a huge drop on temps. I put TGC on the die and IHS and also on the IHS and cold plate of my heatsink (EK Supremacy EVO).
> 
> I'll post my temps after I run some tests, but my initial run was showing a 20+ degree drop.
> 
> I'm running 4.9 GHz @ 1.33v Vcore.


That gives me some hope. Put normal paste since i didnt have any CLU. Getting my CLU order home today, so i hope i get the same


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> I just redid my de-lid on my 7700k. I originally put AS5 between the die and the IHS and only really saw a 5 degree drop on average on real bench.
> 
> I used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut (TGC) and I'm seeing a huge drop on temps. I put TGC on the die and IHS and also on the IHS and cold plate of my heatsink (EK Supremacy EVO).
> 
> I'll post my temps after I run some tests, but my initial run was showing a 20+ degree drop.
> 
> I'm running 4.9 GHz @ 1.33v Vcore.












not surprised though

there's a huge difference between the liquid metal TIM's and more traditional TIM

if you use LM between 2 perfect surfaces it doesn't matter that much (I have used it on the IHS as well, but it becomes a hassle if you want to do maintenance)
but we're still trying to bridge a gap here (DIE to IHS), no matter how small

cool it worked out for you


----------



## Jsunn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> not surprised though
> 
> there's a huge difference between the liquid metal TIM's and more traditional TIM
> 
> if you use LM between 2 perfect surfaces it doesn't matter that much (I have used it on the IHS as well, but it becomes a hassle if you want to do maintenance)
> but we're still trying to bridge a gap here (DIE to IHS), no matter how small
> 
> cool it worked out for you


I was kind of surprised how much of a difference it made after I fired things back up. I actually went back into the BIOS to make sure that everything was still the same and I didn't accidentally clear the BIOS and put everything back to stock.
So, so far the hottest I've seen running prime95 small FFTs has been 62 deg C.

I was in the mid to upper 80's before. I need to put my side panels back on and run some more comparisons, but I am just floored with the temp drop.

I didn't want to try for 5.0 GHz because of the temps I was seeing, but now I think I have the headroom to go to maybe 5.1 GHz.


----------



## outlawsbba

So i finally grabbed my balls and delidded my 4770k, was getting high and erratic temp's.

Would say after delid at least a 20C difference.

4.4GHz at 1.35v was throtteling allmost instantly when trying p95.

Now max i am getting is 65C. CPU is getting cooled by a H115i with 2 Noiseblocker NB 14-3 fans.

Paste used is CLU.


----------



## Gurkburk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outlawsbba*
> 
> So i finally grabbed my balls and delidded my 4770k, was getting high and erratic temp's.
> 
> Would say after delid at least a 20C difference.
> 
> 4.4GHz at 1.35v was throtteling allmost instantly when trying p95.
> 
> Now max i am getting is 65C. CPU is getting cooled by a H115i with 2 Noiseblocker NB 14-3 fans.
> 
> Paste used is CLU.


Are you using CLU between cooler and processor? I'd recommend not doing that. That can ruin your cooler. Messed with my H80i. You'll see very very little temp diff with CLU there, just use normal paste.

On a sidenote. I'm running my 7700k @ 5.2ghz, 1.42volt.


----------



## SeraphicFury

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gurkburk*
> 
> Are you using CLU between cooler and processor? I'd recommend not doing that. That can ruin your cooler. Messed with my H80i. You'll see very very little temp diff with CLU there, just use normal paste.


I have been subbed to this thread for a while, and people say don't use LM between IHS and Cooler if it's copper.
I have an ITX system and a Noctua NH-L12 cooler, it's nickel plated - just like the IHS - I'm waiting for a day where I have the free time before I delid (I have the LM and Delid tool already waiting)

Now being that the IHS and CPU cooler are both Nickel plated, would the consensus still be not to use LM, just wondering if it would give me better temps over the Noctua paste??


----------



## Ceadderman

It's fine with copper. It will fill the cracks and valleys of the surface but it's fine. Where people say it should never be used is with Aluminum. It will wreck an aluminum/copper cooling surface such as the type the Hyper 212 has.

Otherwise copper is okay. All lm does to it is discolour the surface. It doesn't melt it. It can start to harden to the suface as it bonds to it but so long as you scrape the lm from the surface it should be fine. I wouldn't recommend using it between the IHS and any cooler but if your mind is set to do so, you should know what not to use it with and what you're in for.









There is plenty of input here so you don't have to take my word for anything without checking through this thread.









~Ceadder


----------



## outlawsbba

No i am using clu between the die and the IHS, using regular AS5 between cpu and water block.

And nice! Cant seem to get this puppy stable at 4.7GHz event at 1.5v vcore.
Which is to much for my taste so i backed down to 4.6GHz 1.425v.


----------



## Ceadderman

You would likely see better results with a better TIM. AS5 requires a burn in time of 8 days minimum. That's 8 days of full load. Newer TIMs don't require a burn in time at all.









~Ceadder


----------



## stephenn82

I OFFICIALLY JOINED THE DELID CLUB!!!

6700k with Gelid GC Extreme under IHS and under h115i.

PRE to delid were at 57-60 degrees c max core temps using Intel XTU bench and stress testing.

POST delid max temps with same testing are at 43-46 degrees c. Not bad, eh? I know, its not CLU, but it still gets the job done









Did the delid with an Irwin razor blade, patience, and steady hands.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> You would likely see better results with a better TIM. AS5 requires a burn in time of 8 days minimum. That's 8 days of full load. Newer TIMs don't require a burn in time at all.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


EXAAAACTLY

Get some Gelid GC Extreme or Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. awesome, awesome stuff. I made switch from AS5 alone and dropped 10 - 12 degrees.


----------



## undercoverb0ss

Plan on doing my 6700K today or tomorrow. I have the Rockit delid and relid kit, Conductonaut, and the Noctua TIM which I forget the name of.

Leaning toward using super glue on the corners for relid and Conductonaut for on the die and between heat sink and IHS, heat sink is Noctua D14.

Sound good? I could use the Noctua TIM for over the IHS if it has better compatibility with the D14.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *undercoverb0ss*
> 
> Plan on doing my 6700K today or tomorrow. I have the Rockit delid and relid kit, Conductonaut, and the Noctua TIM which I forget the name of.
> 
> Leaning toward using super glue on the corners for relid and Conductonaut for on the die and between heat sink and IHS, heat sink is Noctua D14.
> 
> Sound good? I could use the Noctua TIM for over the IHS if it has better compatibility with the D14.


Sounds good.

Are you planning on doing before/after temperature testing?

Personally, I used the black PermaTex to re-lid, since I believed the super glue might made a subsequent de-lid much more difficult.

Anyway, good luck and let us know how it goes.

P.S.
Pics of the procedure are always a plus.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Sounds good.
> 
> Are you planning on doing before/after temperature testing?
> 
> Personally, I used the black PermaTex to re-lid, since I believed the super glue might made a subsequent de-lid much more difficult.
> 
> Anyway, good luck and let us know how it goes.
> 
> P.S.
> Pics of the procedure are always a plus.


I forgot who did an article (ive read so many times but keep forgetting) its either anandtech or techpowerup, he got lower temps by using super glue instead of using silicone. The gap is still the issue and as long as your sealing your IHS on the OUTSIDE and not how Intel has it done then your temps should be fantastic.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> I OFFICIALLY JOINED THE DELID CLUB!!!
> 
> 6700k with Gelid GC Extreme under IHS and under h115i.
> 
> PRE to delid were at 57-60 degrees c max core temps using Intel XTU bench and stress testing.
> 
> POST delid max temps with same testing are at 43-46 degrees c. Not bad, eh? I know, its not CLU, but it still gets the job done
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Did the delid with an Irwin razor blade, patience, and steady hands.
> EXAAAACTLY
> 
> Get some Gelid GC Extreme or Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. awesome, awesome stuff. I made switch from AS5 alone and dropped 10 - 12 degrees.


Proof that the TIM isn't the issue but the gap is, yet again haha.

Stephen keep an eye on your temps though, ive tried gc extreme bare die (essentially delided but without a lid) and even with an IHS, it doesnt seem to hold very long, ie your temps might start going up after a couple days. Its the sole reason to use liquid metal.


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I forgot who did an article (ive read so many times but keep forgetting) its either anandtech or techpowerup, he got lower temps by using super glue instead of using silicone. The gap is still the issue and as long as your sealing your IHS on the OUTSIDE and not how Intel has it done then your temps should be fantastic.


I agree that the gap with the OEM sealant is a problem, but I am confident that the miniscule amount of Permatex I applied (a pin-head sized drop on the end of a toothpick) just on the IHS corners, along with the pressure applied by the re-lid jig, resulted in a bondline of minimal thickness, and consequently, no discernible gap.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> I agree that the gap with the OEM sealant is a problem, but I am confident that the miniscule amount of Permatex I applied (a pin-head sized drop on the end of a toothpick) just on the IHS corners, along with the pressure applied by the re-lid jig, resulted in a bondline of minimal thickness, and consequently, no discernible gap.


Yea as long as your doing that then its fine.

I wish i still had CPUs to test i would have loved to send the bottom perimeter of the IHS and then use silicone anyways to see what would happen. The pressure from the mounting bracket would probably create perfect pressure.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I forgot who did an article (ive read so many times but keep forgetting) its either anandtech or techpowerup, he got lower temps by using super glue instead of using silicone. The gap is still the issue and as long as your sealing your IHS on the OUTSIDE and not how Intel has it done then your temps should be fantastic.


Its minute. There is a potential, but its not that bad or will be a problem. We aremt pushing 6.2ghz on LN2 are we? I dropped 12-14 degrees with using a touch of black rtv on corners. Just like hardocp youtube channel.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Its minute. There is a potential, but its not that bad or will be a problem. We aremt pushing 6.2ghz on LN2 are we? I dropped 12-14 degrees with using a touch of black rtv on corners. Just like hardocp youtube channel.


Anandtech dropped 4c by going from silicone to superglue while using liquidmetal. That's an impressive temp drop if you think if in percentage of how much liquid metal already drops temps by. If you dropped 20°C then drop another 4°C thats a 20% temp drop, it's ridiculous, and its pretty much FREE if you're already doing a delid.


----------



## undercoverb0ss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> Sounds good.
> 
> Are you planning on doing before/after temperature testing?
> 
> Personally, I used the black PermaTex to re-lid, since I believed the super glue might made a subsequent de-lid much more difficult.
> 
> Anyway, good luck and let us know how it goes.
> 
> P.S.
> Pics of the procedure are always a plus.


What's the best way to do the temperature testing before and after? HWInfo/Intel CPU burn test sufficient?

I'm feeling comfortable with the super glue. Does this guys technique look good? 




I might practice a bit with the super glue, I just don't want to over add it.


----------



## undercoverb0ss

Going to run to home depot soon to buy the glue, any opinions on which of these is better?

http://www.gorillatough.com/gorilla-super-glue vs http://www.loctiteproducts.com/p/4/3/sg_ug_cntrl/overview/Loctite-Super-Glue-ULTRA-Gel-Control.htm

Guy in the video used the Loctite stuff.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Its minute. There is a potential, but its not that bad or will be a problem. We aremt pushing 6.2ghz on LN2 are we? I dropped 12-14 degrees with using a touch of black rtv on corners. Just like hardocp youtube channel.


welcome









bluej is saying the Gelid might pump out after a while (I have no experience with it)
if temps go up you know why (also I think you want to give it away as well)

liquid metal has really great adhesion and cohesion

anyway
cool it worked out for you









I did it the same way like HardOCP (the first time, second time without any glue actually, but didn't matter temp wise; but using a liquid metal)
thin as possible line all around
temp drop of 20 degrees
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *undercoverb0ss*
> 
> Going to run to home depot soon to buy the glue, any opinions on which of these is better?
> 
> http://www.gorillatough.com/gorilla-super-glue vs http://www.loctiteproducts.com/p/4/3/sg_ug_cntrl/overview/Loctite-Super-Glue-ULTRA-Gel-Control.htm
> 
> Guy in the video used the Loctite stuff.


I think most people who I have seen using super glue went with the Loctite

just put a small dab on the corners
that's enough

if you put it all around the IHS it might cause damage if you want to remove it again
but then you could weaken it with nail polish remover before trying

I'm not sure anyone has experience delidding again with using super glue *and* using plenty of it
but there's no need to use plenty of glue anyway


----------



## Arctucas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *undercoverb0ss*
> 
> What's the best way to do the temperature testing before and after? HWInfo/Intel CPU burn test sufficient?
> 
> I'm feeling comfortable with the super glue. Does this guys technique look good?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I might practice a bit with the super glue, I just don't want to over add it.


I typically use IBT (maximum memory) for 3 hours, and HWiNFO to check my overclock stability and temperatures. If you are only wanting to check temperatures, one or two passes should suffice. If you are doing screenshots: clocks, voltages, and temperatures are most important to record.

With regard to using super glue; personally, I would not use it, but it is your processor.

Looking forward to seeing your results.


----------



## undercoverb0ss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arctucas*
> 
> I typically use IBT (maximum memory) for 3 hours, and HWiNFO to check my overclock stability and temperatures. If you are only wanting to check temperatures, one or two passes should suffice. If you are doing screenshots: clocks, voltages, and temperatures are most important to record.
> 
> With regard to using super glue; personally, I would not use it, but it is your processor.
> 
> Looking forward to seeing your results.


I'm honestly more worried about over applying the conductonaut. When I did my GPU I used a thin layer of liquid electrical tape slightly outside the die for a little insurance.

Any real downside to covering the 4 traces that are in the area? I'm thinking just a tiny brush stroke of the stuff.


----------



## Ceadderman

Yes. Like all liquid metal pastes it'seems conductive and you don't want to bridge a circuit with it. Killso a CPU right quicklike.









Danged mobile.









~Ceadder


----------



## valkeriefire

I just delidded my new 7700k. This is my 2nd delid (my first was a 3770k several years ago already in this thread).

I looks like I netted a 13-15C drop across the cores. I am using a Corsair H75 in the open air for these tests, but I'm building a small ITX rig. My goal was 5ghz under 80C in a small Ncase M1 or Silverstone ML08. Looks like I could push a few more Mhz if I wanted to.
*
OCN name: Valkeriefire
CPU: i7-7700k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: CLU*
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: +500mhz (5ghz)
*Temp drops: 13C*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: see below



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



BEFORE


AFTER


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *undercoverb0ss*
> 
> I'm honestly more worried about over applying the conductonaut. When I did my GPU I used a thin layer of liquid electrical tape slightly outside the die for a little insurance.
> 
> Any real downside to covering the 4 traces that are in the area? I'm thinking just a tiny brush stroke of the stuff.


no downside in covering those 4 gold contacts

thats my 7600K after 3 months of being delidded

you can see it does move a little, though considering it moved upwards, maybe it moved once I put the whole thing together and not later

I covered those contacts simply with the original Intel TIM, handles like wax anyway


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *valkeriefire*
> 
> I just delidded my new 7700k. This is my 2nd delid (my first was a 3770k several years ago already in this thread).
> 
> I looks like I netted a 13-15C drop across the cores. I am using a Corsair H75 in the open air for these tests, but I'm building a small ITX rig. My goal was 5ghz under 80C in a small Ncase M1 or Silverstone ML08. Looks like I could push a few more Mhz if I wanted to.
> *
> OCN name: Valkeriefire
> CPU: i7-7700k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: CLU*
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: +500mhz (5ghz)
> *Temp drops: 13C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: see below
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> BEFORE
> 
> 
> AFTER


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## wholeeo

Was going to post my new stuff but realized I joined this club way back during Ivy.


----------



## stephenn82

how do I go about getting this sig?


----------



## Calibos

I've a 6700k since this time last year and at the time of purchase I also bought some CLU and Thermal Grizzley Kryonaut. I also have some Icy Diamond left over from previous builds. I never ended up doing the delid at the time of first build and have had the PC a year now. Some mods I need to do to my case necessitate a full strip out and rebuild of the PC so I would be remiss if I didn't take advantage of that to finally get the delid done.

Obviously I'll use the CLU between the die and IHS but could/should I also use CLU between the IHS and Corsair H110GT AIO. I've nothing to worry about with regard to chemical reactions do I? The Corsair has a copper baseplate. All previous builds I've done have never been parted out, always repurposed or hand-me-up/downs to family and friends, so I don't ever anticipate needing to sell the 6700K or Corsair AIO separately so permanent staining of the IHS or copper baseplate by the CLU is not an issue. Also, the mods I intend doing to my case chassis are the final mods I'll ever do to it, so short of my motherboard or AIO dying at some point I don't ever anticipate having to remove the AIO from the CPU again so regular reapplication of CLU between IHS and AIO won't ever be an issue either.

I also wonder is it worth replacing the tim with CLU on my Palit Super Jetstream GTX1080. This GPU also has a copper baseplate.


----------



## kfxsti

OCN name: kfxsti
CPU: 7700k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: None
OC after delid: 4.7-5ghz depending
Temp drops: 19c

I don't have any before pics. But can verify lol
Have done 28 CPUs so far


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> OCN name: kfxsti
> CPU: 7700k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: None
> OC after delid: 4.7-5ghz depending
> Temp drops: 19c
> 
> I don't have any before pics. But can verify lol
> Have done 28 CPUs so far


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Arizona4005

*OCN* name: Arizona4005
*CPU*: 4790k
*ON Die* TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
*IHS TIM*: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
*MHZ Gained*: Unknown
*OC After Delid*: 5GHZ baby!
*Temp Drop*: Unknown

I bought the 4790k as a motherboard/combo. I didn't verify that the 4790k worked, I just delided and popped it in afterwards. So I don't know what the previous temps and overclock was. But I can say for a fact it does 5GHZ at 1.37V! Ran Aida64 for an hour







and then have used it since. Reaches about 75C with Corsair H100i V2.

PICS:
https://i.imgur.com/s6NfYYo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/jQUux7b.png
(Voltage is 1.37V I'm using a Z87 board that's why it's showing incorrect voltage)


----------



## Arizona4005

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Yes. Like all liquid metal pastes it'seems conductive and you don't want to bridge a circuit with it. Killso a CPU right quicklike.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Danged mobile.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Killed a 4690k like that.

Put liquid metal on it, put into a testbench, no boot. Took it out, realized there's a bit of metal on touching the caps. Took it out, cleaned it, wiped with alcohol, wasted about 2 hours running around and came to conclusion it's fried. Will use tape from now on, rofl


----------



## dyrdevil

I just delidded my 7700k.

It boots! Yay. Idle temps 35 c.

One question: I didn't glue on the IHS. When I put it back on the CPU, It went on ever so slightly crooked. I twisted it slightly to straighten it, and also, it was off center a mm or so towards the side with the gold contacts.

Now I thought about redoing it, but at this point, if it boots should I assume I am good to go? How precisely perfect is everybody putting their IHS's back on when they have to drop in into a socket?

Thanks!


----------



## stephenn82

OCN name: stephenn82
CPU: i7-6700k
on die-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
Mhz gained: 0
OC after delid: 4.8ghz (but I run 4.6 daily)
*Temp drops: 14C*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/0ktxau *updated*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Arizona4005*
> 
> *OCN* name: Arizona4005
> *CPU*: 4790k
> *ON Die* TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> *IHS TIM*: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> *MHZ Gained*: Unknown
> *OC After Delid*: 5GHZ baby!
> *Temp Drop*: Unknown
> 
> I bought the 4790k as a motherboard/combo. I didn't verify that the 4790k worked, I just delided and popped it in afterwards. So I don't know what the previous temps and overclock was. But I can say for a fact it does 5GHZ at 1.37V! Ran Aida64 for an hour
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and then have used it since. Reaches about 75C with Corsair H100i V2.
> 
> PICS:
> https://i.imgur.com/s6NfYYo.jpg
> https://i.imgur.com/jQUux7b.png
> (Voltage is 1.37V I'm using a Z87 board that's why it's showing incorrect voltage)


You're In!








Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> OCN name: stephenn82
> CPU: i7-6700k
> on die-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
> ihs-TIM: Gelid GC Extreme
> Mhz gained: 0
> OC after delid: 4.8ghz (but I run 4.6 daily)
> *Temp drops: 14C*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/0ktxau *updated*


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## dyrdevil

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> no downside in covering those 4 gold contacts
> 
> thats my 7600K after 3 months of being delidded
> 
> you can see it does move a little, though considering it moved upwards, maybe it moved once I put the whole thing together and not later
> 
> I covered those contacts simply with the original Intel TIM, handles like wax anyway


Are you saying it's okay to cover those 4 gold contacts w liquid metal? IKnow I don't want to oversupply the stuff, but I was trying to avoid that happening. I'm a bit confused about exactly what the liquid metal shouldn't be touching.


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dyrdevil*
> 
> Are you saying it's okay to cover those 4 gold contacts w liquid metal? IKnow I don't want to oversupply the stuff, but I was trying to avoid that happening. I'm a bit confused about exactly what the liquid metal shouldn't be touching.


They used Intel's tim to cover those contacts, which isn't conductive.


----------



## dyrdevil

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> They used Intel's tim to cover those contacts, which isn't conductive.


Thanks, that what I thought might be the case. Can you confirm for me it is indeed bad to get any liquid metal on those contacts?


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dyrdevil*
> 
> Thanks, that what I thought might be the case. Can you confirm for me it is indeed bad to get any liquid metal on those contacts?


I wouldn't get any on them just as a precaution, I'm not sure what actually would happen if they were shorted.


----------



## Calibos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> They used Intel's tim to cover those contacts, which isn't conductive.


I intend to use CLU on my GTX1080 die as well as my 6700k. While I wasnt worried about migrating CLU on the 6700k because there doesnt seem to be any surface mounted components on that side of the pcb, when I looked at my GPU die I noticed some very close components to the die so was worried about overspill. After ruling out non removable nail varnish to protect them from CLU, I remembered that the oem tim I'd just removed from the gpu die was all over those components alongside the die so it obviously cant harm them or cause them to overheat. I realised I could apply some regular TIM to them to insulate them from any CLU migration.

Is that what you are talking about here, using regular TIM to protect components from CLU migration?


----------



## mr2cam

Finally decided to try a little delidding, bought the delid and relid kit from rockitcool, first 2 cpus I did were some i3's I had laying around, after I figured out small things I did wrong on the i3s I decided to try my 6700k, man what a difference in temps, will work on the overclock tomorrow night, would be cool to hit 4.8 / 4.9, highest I could achieve before delidding was [email protected]


----------



## amang

This is first time delidding attempt on my newly acquired 7700K. Yes, with a freakin' *razor*!










And this is after cleaning up all the mess Intel put inside this chip:










And.... I forgot to take a photo after applying LM on the die, as I was too excited to put the CPU back









Once the CPU is in place, I turned on the machine, and it didn't POST at all with black screen. I said to myself, "_Fark a duck! Get ready to spend another $400 tomorrow for a new chip. My first delidding attempt failed epicly!_" But then, I did a small troubleshooting on my motherboard. During the power on phase, the motherboard shows a DRAM LED and I thought that was strange because the memory shouldn't post any problem at all. I took the memory modules out and check the pin. To my surprise, there's a tiny speck of dust sticking on the pin. I removed it with my mighty stinky breath (mind you it's 2am here and I haven't brushed my teeth and it was about time for me getting sleep!), and put the memory back and voila, everything works like a charm.









All in all, idle temp is now 22-23'C. While running Prime95 with small FFT, all 4 cores didn't go over 53'C.

BTW, this is all running at stock with Turbo to 4.5Ghz, so it may not be too exciting


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Calibos*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> They used Intel's tim to cover those contacts, which isn't conductive.
> 
> 
> 
> I intend to use CLU on my GTX1080 die as well as my 6700k. While I wasnt worried about migrating CLU on the 6700k because there doesnt seem to be any surface mounted components on that side of the pcb, when I looked at my GPU die I noticed some very close components to the die so was worried about overspill. After ruling out non removable nail varnish to protect them from CLU, I remembered that the oem tim I'd just removed from the gpu die was all over those components alongside the die so it obviously cant harm them or cause them to overheat. I realised I could apply some regular TIM to them to insulate them from any CLU migration.
> 
> Is that what you are talking about here, using regular TIM to protect components from CLU migration?
Click to expand...

I wouldn't trust any TIM(nonconductive or otherwise) for covering chip contacts. Those are supposed to be +/- contacts sfaik. CLU will heat up the TIM if it comes into contact with them and a fried chip is a good possibility outcome.

So to answer the question again, no and no. Just use tape to block off the die. If you're extra cautious then I suggest clear nail polish. Those may be testing points for Intel RMA service. Cause they certainly don't contact the IHS.









~Ceadder


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dyrdevil*
> 
> Are you saying it's okay to cover those 4 gold contacts w liquid metal? IKnow I don't want to oversupply the stuff, but I was trying to avoid that happening. I'm a bit confused about exactly what the liquid metal shouldn't be touching.


not the liquid metal one my friend

the stock Intel TIM

but you could get liquid electric tape for instance
or clear nail polish

the DIE is safe from anything electrical conductive

but obviously nothing else

the liquid metal only touched the DIE (and underside of the IHS if you want)
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I wouldn't trust any TIM(nonconductive or otherwise) for covering chip contacts. Those are supposed to be +/- contacts sfaik. CLU will heat up the TIM if it comes into contact with them and a fried chip is a good possibility outcome.
> 
> So to answer the question again, no and no. Just use tape to block off the die. If you're extra cautious then I suggest clear nail polish. Those may be testing points for Intel RMA service. Cause they certainly don't contact the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder












the stock Intel TIM is more like wax

the smudge had the exact same shape as I put it on

that being said I'd recommend buying liquid electrical tape
or hell clear nail polish


----------



## Juggalo23451

CPUZ

http://valid.x86.fr/ebgeap

Temps


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I wouldn't trust any TIM(nonconductive or otherwise) for covering chip contacts. Those are supposed to be +/- contacts sfaik. CLU will heat up the TIM if it comes into contact with them and a fried chip is a good possibility outcome.
> 
> So to answer the question again, no and no. Just use tape to block off the die. If you're extra cautious then I suggest clear nail polish. Those may be testing points for Intel RMA service. Cause they certainly don't contact the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I agree, btw Women's nail hardener is ridiculously overengineered for its intended use and is perfect for this under IHS electrical insulation. I got some of this stuff and insulated all my contacts.
Just to test it out, I put it on an old Core2 Duo, put the heat spreader back and blasted it with a heatgun from the top and underside 170 degrees for 10 minutes. Not even premium electrical tape could survive this treatment (they all curled up at the edges) but the Nail Hardener didn't even change or melt.

Plus I guarantee most people with a significant other can easily source this. I'm rather partial to my naked Intel chips with a little bit of turquoise.


----------



## bfe_vern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> I agree, btw Women's nail hardener is ridiculously overengineered for its intended use and is perfect for this under IHS electrical insulation. I got some of this stuff and insulated all my contacts.
> Just to test it out, I put it on an old Core2 Duo, put the heat spreader back and blasted it with a heatgun from the top and underside 170 degrees for 10 minutes. Not even premium electrical tape could survive this treatment (they all curled up at the edges) but the Nail Hardener didn't even change or melt.
> 
> Plus I guarantee most people with a significant other can easily source this. I'm rather partial to my naked Intel chips with a little bit of turquoise.


What a great idea! I am going to be relidding my 7700k this weekend and will be trying this out!


----------



## Jsunn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Juggalo23451*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CPUZ
> http://valid.x86.fr/ebgeap
> 
> Temps


What is your Vcore in the bios?


----------



## agung79

Hello, can I join too.
Actually 2 years ago I did this, 18 September 2015...

OCN name: agung79
CPU: 6700k
ON Die TIM: CLU
IHS TIM: CLU
MHZ Gained: 0.7Ghz
OC After Delid: 4.9Ghz
Temp Drop: before delid, no way with 1.55vcore

The only limit of my oc is my mainboard with max 1.55vcore







Thanks


----------



## Juggalo23451

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jsunn*
> 
> What is your Vcore in the bios?


1.32


----------



## Calibos

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> I wouldn't trust any TIM(nonconductive or otherwise) for covering chip contacts. Those are supposed to be +/- contacts sfaik. CLU will heat up the TIM if it comes into contact with them and a fried chip is a good possibility outcome.
> 
> So to answer the question again, no and no. Just use tape to block off the die. If you're extra cautious then I suggest clear nail polish. Those may be testing points for Intel RMA service. Cause they certainly don't contact the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> I agree, btw Women's nail hardener is ridiculously overengineered for its intended use and is perfect for this under IHS electrical insulation. I got some of this stuff and insulated all my contacts.
> Just to test it out, I put it on an old Core2 Duo, put the heat spreader back and blasted it with a heatgun from the top and underside 170 degrees for 10 minutes. Not even premium electrical tape could survive this treatment (they all curled up at the edges) but the Nail Hardener didn't even change or melt.
> 
> Plus I guarantee most people with a significant other can easily source this. I'm rather partial to my naked Intel chips with a little bit of turquoise.


I may have confused matters by including a question about CLU on a GPU die in this CPU delidding thread.

I am not worried about the CLU on my 6700K in the slightest. Theres no contacts on that side of the PCB anywhere near the CPU die. Most videos or photo's of CLU after delidding again after a few months show no migration whatsoever. The few that did have some migration showed just a little bit that ran a millimetre or two off the side of the die. Still miles away from the nearest contacts. Add to that fact, I use an Corsair Air540 case on its side, so my motherboard and CPU is horizontal and thus gravity is on my side.

I was asking about the surface mount components around my GPU die. Seeing as those things are covered with non conductive TIM overspill straight from the factory, I know that covering them with TIM is not an issue. Heat is obvioiusly not an issue for them either. So thats what I did. Covered those little caps or whatever they are with some non conductive Tim and used CLU on the GPU die. If the CLU migrates off the die a bit, the TIM on the caps should prevent the CLU from making contact with them and shorting them. Because of my case orientation, gravity is not on my side for the GPU though. My GPU is vertical like a test bench rig if you get me. Great for not having any sag or putting pressure on the pcie slot, but the GPU die is vertical. Hopefully its true what they say about CLU and that the surface tension of CLU keeps it between the IHS/Coolers and dies. If it goes up in a puff of smoke, I'll have an excuse to upgrade my 1080 to a 1080TI. My wallet won't thank me though









It didn't explode when I booted up anyway. Before figures are what I can remember. I've let my Mobo overclock my 6700K to 4.6 but assume its using a lot more volts than it probably needs to. Core Temp showed 1.37v max for a bit when all cores were at 100% Load during Cinebench. I'll get around to manually overclocking myself one of these weeks when I find the time. Anyway, I know Cinebench 15 was heating the CPU up to 70ºc+ with my H110GT AIO before the delid. After the delid with CLU between die and IHS and CLU between IHS and H110GT, its maxing out at 53ºc with only 1-2 degree between cores. ie. 2 were 52º, one was 53º and one was 54º.

So its looking like I've got the usual 15-20ºc temp drop from the Delid. ie. Exactly what I hoped for.

My Palit Super Jetstream GTX 1080 2.5 slot width card always boosted to about 1900mhz. I ran Heaven Benchmark and its now boosting to 2012mhz and holding it. So the CLU seems to be making a difference there too. Need to start manually overclocking that too when I find the time


----------



## dieanotherday

razer blade delid with liquid metal ~25C drop on 7700k

intel really puts bird crap in between the ihs and die.

but tbh i think the biggest problem is the ihs die contact distance which is extended due to the adhesive


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *agung79*


The best a man can get!


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dieanotherday*
> 
> razer blade delid with liquid metal ~25C drop on 7700k
> 
> intel really puts bird crap in between the ihs and die.
> 
> but tbh i think *the biggest problem is the ihs die contact distance which is extended due to the adhesive*


Bingo.


----------



## stephenn82

HardOCP totally debunks this. He relidded many CPU's and put just a touch of RTV and quite a bit of RTV on there, like the factory amount. With a proper clamping force to cure the sealant, it actually thins out very, very much.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I would argue (from my experience at least) that the gap plays less of a factor in the Kaby's than it did in the previous gens. At least in my case there wasn't any gap at all - the ihs would actually spin on the die without any RTV on a cleaned PCB. I don't necessarily think the 'bird crap' is all that bad per se - it's just nowhere near the conductivity of liquid metals.

On the other hand my IB CPUs had a ton of gap and required a decent amount of CLU to mate properly.

I do agree about the sealant thinning out well - and with Kaby at least - it takes a little of the stress off the die in case you get stupid with the block/HS clamping force.

But regardless of which is the greatest factor - I think we can all agree that CPUs that can top 5GHz with relative ease is a very nice thing.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> HardOCP totally debunks this. He relidded many CPU's and put just a touch of RTV and quite a bit of RTV on there, like the factory amount. With a proper clamping force to cure the sealant, it actually thins out very, very much.


Its not a debunk if not tested properly. As soon as you go from tim to lm any info afterwords is invalid. Why? Because liquid metal doesnt care about gaps it functions totally differently.

The fact that anandtech used silicone and super glue with lm and super glue had better redults theres the proof.


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

The part I don't get is this-

My IHS contacted the die well before it contacted to PCB substrate. There is a gap between the edges of the IHS and the substrate regardless of what adhesive is used there. So why would one glue perform better than another?


----------



## bfe_vern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> The part I don't get is this-
> 
> My IHS contacted the die well before it contacted to PCB substrate. There is a gap between the edges of the IHS and the substrate regardless of what adhesive is used there. So why would one glue perform better than another?


I just blew the top of my Kaby and this was exactly what I experienced!


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its not a debunk if not tested properly. As soon as you go from tim to lm any info afterwords is invalid. Why? Because liquid metal doesnt care about gaps it functions totally differently.
> 
> The fact that anandtech used silicone and super glue with lm and super glue had better redults theres the proof.







this he uses both noctua TIM and CLU LM.






Many people say the IHS hits the subtstrate long before the die...hence why they only glue corners after reassembly. I think they have revised the chips the last couple of generations.

But he compares TIM to LM on his die. The sealer was applied the same on both.


----------



## Tahlzair

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Many people say the IHS hits the subtstrate long before the die...hence why they only glue corners after reassembly. I think they have revised the chips the last couple of generations.


I just delidded my 7700K out of the box, and after cleaning up all the TIM and silicone adhesive, I can actually make the IHS spin on top of the die with just a little push. So yeah, it does seem like just a little adhesive to keep everything in place should be fine.


----------



## Tornadojoe

So my 6700k had a contact patch that at best was 52% peppering area was a lack of contact also TIM was dry and crumbling


----------



## becks

Intel TIM be like...


----------



## Dimensive

i7-4790K throttled quickly because it hit 98c in seconds at the turbo boost clock of 4.4GHz...



I wonder why?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> i7-4790K throttled quickly because it hit 98c in seconds at the turbo boost clock of 4.4GHz...
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder why?


Thats one hell of a gap. If anyone thinks that the thermal paste and not the amount of thermal paste is the problem, the proof is in the pudding right here in pictures haha.


----------



## Dimensive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Thats one hell of a gap. If anyone thinks that the thermal paste and not the amount of thermal paste is the problem, the proof is in the pudding right here in pictures haha.


So at stock the CPU peaked at 77c, now it's 61c. With turbo boost at 4.4GHz, it peaked at 98c, now 85c. Obviously not the best temps, but pretty good for a CRYORIG H7. Tests were run with AIDA64 on the CPU, FPU, and cache.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> So at stock the CPU peaked at 77c, now it's 61c. With turbo boost at 4.4GHz, it peaked at 98c, now 85c. Obviously not the best temps, but pretty good for a CRYORIG H7. Tests were run with AIDA64 on the CPU, FPU, and cache.


Yea, a bit odd that you didn't gain much at higher voltage but makes sense. Not a bad drop though.


----------



## Ceadderman

Which paste on the IHS? If it's AS5, not that difficult to believe. As AS5 has an 8 day burn in period.

If not, could be that CLU isn't making full contact with the IHS.









I used Hydronaut between the die and the IHS and my locked 4790 hasn't gone over 60c while gaming in an ambient of 80F under srock Aluminum Dell heatsink. Which tells me that the deli was successful. System has shut down a few times due to GPU heat throttling, but that was due to fan being set at 50% during the winter and my forgetting that. Oops.









Also applied a thin coat of Hydronaut between the IHS and the stock cooler. I need to get some CLU and I will see what's what when I get under the hood.









~Ceadder


----------



## Dimensive

I put CLU on the die, Noctua NT-H1 on the heatsink.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ceadderman*
> 
> Which paste on the IHS? If it's AS5, not that difficult to believe. As AS5 has an 8 day burn in period.
> 
> If not, could be that CLU isn't making full contact with the IHS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used Hydronaut between the die and the IHS and my locked 4790 hasn't gone over 60c while gaming in an ambient of 80F under srock Aluminum Dell heatsink. Which tells me that the deli was successful. System has shut down a few times due to GPU heat throttling, but that was due to fan being set at 50% during the winter and my forgetting that. Oops.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also applied a thin coat of Hydronaut between the IHS and the stock cooler. I need to get some CLU and I will see what's what when I get under the hood.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~Ceadder


I have Hydronaut on a 3350p 35w cpu and its been fine. However, on my 4690k bare die, that stuff lasted 2 days before temps rose up 6-7°C. CLU has been solid and temps dont budge whatsoever.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> I put CLU on the die, Noctua NT-H1 on the heatsink.


iirc NT-H1 is old paste. It's not one of the best ones. So my advice is to change it out with something more modern. Thermal Grizzly hydronaut, MX4, Ektotherm or something in that range. Even G751 would be better even though that is also an old paste but it ranked at the top with AS5 a few years back. It actually tied with AS5 due to the burn in time of the latter. Doesn't have even a full day of burn in where AS5 has an 8day or longer burn in. I used to use it exclusovely, but since TG came round I have switched up unless cost preventative for an emergency application where TG is OoS and G751 can be had. But I have a few tube of Ektotherm on hand so that's not necessary at this time.









~Ceadder


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *agung79*
> 
> Hello, can I join too.
> Actually 2 years ago I did this, 18 September 2015...
> 
> OCN name: agung79
> CPU: 6700k
> ON Die TIM: CLU
> IHS TIM: CLU
> MHZ Gained: 0.7Ghz
> OC After Delid: 4.9Ghz
> Temp Drop: before delid, no way with 1.55vcore
> 
> The only limit of my oc is my mainboard with max 1.55vcore
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## feznz

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/intel_s_skylake-x_and_kaby_lake-x_cpus_will_not_be_soldered/1


----------



## becks

And the drama continues...the new Skylake X and Kaby Lake X are not soldered and there's already a delid tool there for them


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *feznz*
> 
> https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/intel_s_skylake-x_and_kaby_lake-x_cpus_will_not_be_soldered/1


We posted at the same time


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> And the drama continues...the new Skylake X and Kaby Lake X are not soldered and there's already a delid tool there for them


Even more glue, sweet Jesus lol. I cannot wait to see temps on those. My 1700x barely reaches 40°C in gaming its amazing.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> We posted at the same time


I ninjaed you by 2min








I feel the need for a new Motherboard etc I have officially 8Gb ram and 11Gb 1080Ti, don't want to waste money on DDR3 system mem so I am planning sometime this year for upgrade...... keeping eyes peeled


----------



## Dimensive

Even brand new the paste looks like garbage.


----------



## Ceadderman

Looks like hot garbage to me.









~Ceadder


----------



## PrimoGhost

Guys. I need some help









i'm looking for some good measurements of Kaby Lake or Skylake processor to finish my tutorial. I' need this....

BEFORE ( original )



and this..
AFTER ( 100% clean chip )


Already have 5 KL/SL chips, but every on is delidded







just need some more comparsion to minimize the measurement error

I would be extremely happy with the photos like as above. I'm only found this comparsion:


----------



## 0ldChicken

@PrimoGhost i have a 7700k coming today. I'll get some measurements this evening if no one gets them first


----------



## PrimoGhost

Thank You so much









P.S
Does anyone here own a processor with crooked DIE?


----------



## mr2cam

Anyone make a kit similar to the rockitcool kit for LG2011? I want to delid my 5820k


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mr2cam*
> 
> Anyone make a kit similar to the rockitcool kit for LG2011? I want to delid my 5820k


Have you any experience de-lidding soldered IHS CPUs? It might turn out different than you hoped.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mr2cam*
> 
> Anyone make a kit similar to the rockitcool kit for LG2011? I want to delid my 5820k


So you can gain nothing and probably kill it? Well, I guess if you're going bare die then maybe "so you can gain 200MHz and 2C and probably kill it..."









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> Have you any experience de-lidding soldered IHS CPUs? It might turn out different than you hoped.


This.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mr2cam*
> 
> Anyone make a kit similar to the rockitcool kit for LG2011? I want to delid my 5820k


only other person I can think of that makes one is Diemate from Der8auer..good luck finding on in the USA though.


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PrimoGhost*
> 
> Thank You so much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S
> Does anyone here own a processor with crooked DIE?


4.24mm-4.29mm depending on which side i measured. Sorry I'm too hamfisted and clumsy to take pics while measuring.
And no I've never had a crooked die, that would be interesting... Have you?


----------



## bfe_vern

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PrimoGhost*
> 
> Thank You so much
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P.S
> Does anyone here own a processor with crooked DIE?


Crooked die no, but an uneven gap between the pcb and the IHS after delidding - yes. I remember seeing an explanation for this on another forum. The pressure from the retaining clip should even out the gap for you.


----------



## PrimoGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> 4.24mm-4.29mm depending on which side i measured. Sorry I'm too hamfisted and clumsy to take pics while measuring.
> And no I've never had a crooked die, that would be interesting... Have you?


Thank You so much! It's tragedy how Intel combines IHS with PCB sometimes... difference in height are usually not so big, but it's affect the temperature for sure! One of my friend bought 7700k with 4.32+ mm









It's not my chip. I'm working on it for someone from forum.

*@bfe_vern*

i/m not sure that "crooked" is a good word, but the result is that *the middle* of the DIE has very poor contact with IHS after delid.







It's like "fish eye" Hah.
I have no idea how to do it well. i tried to give a fat layer of CLU, but the thermal performance goes down because i try to minimize the gap between IHS and PCB. Then CLU flows away







i think my only option is try some non-metal paste. Something dense like Grizzly Kryonaunt.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PrimoGhost*
> 
> Thank You so much! It's tragedy how Intel combines IHS with PCB sometimes... difference in height are usually not so big, but it's affect the temperature for sure! One of my friend bought 7700k with 4.32+ mm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's not my chip. I'm working on it for someone from forum.
> 
> *@bfe_vern*
> 
> i/m not sure that "crooked" is a good word, but the result is that *the middle* of the DIE has very poor contact with IHS after delid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's like "fish eye" Hah.
> I have no idea how to do it well. i tried to give a fat layer of CLU, but the thermal performance goes down because i try to minimize the gap between IHS and PCB. Then CLU flows away
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i think my only option is try some non-metal paste. Something dense like Grizzly Kryonaunt.


Easy fix, sand down the parameter of the IHS that makes contact with the pcb. Its a possibility that the entire die/pcb is slightly concave (it happens even brand new) that should fix your issue if your temps are really bad.


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PrimoGhost*
> 
> Guys. I need some help
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i'm looking for some good measurements of Kaby Lake or Skylake processor to finish my tutorial. I' need this....
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> BEFORE ( original )
> 
> 
> 
> and this..
> AFTER ( 100% clean chip )
> 
> 
> Already have 5 KL/SL chips, but every on is delidded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> just need some more comparsion to minimize the measurement error
> 
> I would be extremely happy with the photos like as above. I'm only found this comparsion:




heres one I done in 2013 I know its a Ivy but just the whole glue gap etc was instantly debunked look at the gap I need a load of glue to fill the gap in

Simply Liquid metal has surface tension that adheres to the die and IHS any paste will simply harden and have reduced die contact.

This is an interesting clip look at the 1min mark see how liquid metal is made


----------



## 0ldChicken

You're welcome! @PrimoGhost It really is unfortunate! I'm hoping this will be a good chip, perhaps pre-delid temps will be a little better with a lower ihs than some? Id be interested to see those measurements from others too! I'll post my measurements after delidding as well, if it overclocks decently (if it wont do 5.1 I may just sell it for a sure 5.2ghz 7700k)


----------



## PrimoGhost

*@bluej511* - U have right. I need to delid again this one and try









i have done So far over 30 Delids of Skylake and Kaby Lake and never had problems like with this one.

*@feznz* Nice video. Yes. The surface tension is a problem. This is why i always try to calculate the measurement of PCB - DIE and PCB -IHS before and after delid. Minimize the gap DIE - IHS helps a lot if the gap IHS-DIE is as small as possible. TGC/CLU *always* stays in place then. Take a look of one test :



This chip had over 4.28 mm after delid. Same as stock. TGC flowed away Not possibile to get lower If i remove all glue - still 4.28 mm.







Other "clean" chips ~ 4.21mm. Usually i can achieve 4.22 - 4.25

I can't figure out what's is wrong... DIE is not straight for sure, but pcb too? hmm... i really must delid it again.

but... just in your pictue of IVY - PCB is 1.04 mm ( Skl 0.78 ) and all chip is around 4.15 mm. IHS of Skylake and KL is of course higher, but normal clean chip has minimum 4.22 mm. This is why i start wondering about this... So *with the clean chip the gap IHS - DIE is below zero like in IVY?* i mean - is the IHS rest on the DIE. i dont think so.

Next week i will do some more measurement of my own Skylake 6700k. I'm so stupid... I had so many chips, and just don't thought about this "problem" until now


----------



## Dimensive

Out of curiosity, has anyone tested to see differences between Liquid Ultra and Conductonaut?


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> Out of curiosity, has anyone tested to see differences between Liquid Ultra and Conductonaut?


I'm quoting Der8auer: "...I prefer Conductonaut because it doesn't tend to dry up like Cool-laboratory..."


----------



## stephenn82

and THAT right there is why I shall buy a tube of it on amazon...like real soon.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mr2cam*
> 
> Anyone make a kit similar to the rockitcool kit for LG2011? I want to delid my 5820k


Not worth it. 2011 has solder for the TIM, which is one of the best materials for processors. Leave the 2011 chips alone


----------



## PrimoGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> Out of curiosity, has anyone tested to see differences between Liquid Ultra and Conductonaut?


Next week i'll try to test it in controlled conditions.
So far, the biggest difference for me is - how to apply TGC or CLU on the DIE... But i think if we have perfect equal DIE and automatically - the contact on line IHS - DIE - so, the TGC wins then.

It has little bit better conductivity and lover density than CLU.


----------



## Dimensive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PrimoGhost*
> 
> Next week i'll try to test it in controlled conditions.
> So far, the biggest difference for me is - how to apply TGC or CLU on the DIE... But i think if we have perfect equal DIE and automatically - the contact on line IHS - DIE - so, the TGC wins then.
> 
> It has little bit better conductivity and lover density than CLU.


Nice, I look forward to seeing the results.


----------



## PrimoGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> Nice, I look forward to seeing the results.


*unofficially...* TGC vs CLU

chip with original gap ( IHS - PCB ) ( 4.28 mm++ )

TGC Win by 4 TC* ( delta - ambient // core package ) but - there's problem with holding the DIE in that case. .img - above.

Chip with "custom" gap.


No difference at all over measurement error, but it's my personal compare. I'll try to do it right on my 6700k. It's great chip. cold and straight.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Not worth it. 2011 has solder for the TIM, which is one of the best materials for processors. Leave the 2011 chips alone


true, but you people that will buy the new socket 2066 i9's will swap the TIM for LM. as they arent soldered. As demonstrated by Der8auer at Computex with Steve from Gamers Nexus.


----------



## Ceadderman

I would think Intel would have solved the issue by 2066 chips. How difficult is it to use a minimal amount of sealant on these CPUs?









I understand why they don't use LM but sealant application.should be old hat by now.









~Ceadder


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> true, but you people that will buy the new socket 2066 i9's will swap the TIM for LM. as they arent soldered. As demonstrated by Der8auer at Computex with Steve from Gamers Nexus.


2066, yes, care to provide a link for that? I haven't heard anythign about 2066 being delidded.

2011 though, best left to traditional solder.


----------



## Feklar




----------



## PrimoGhost

no way to delid it by the razor... great buisness 4 delid tools

EDIT:

Need little help again... Does anyone know what are the distances in *original - non deliddedl* 7700/7600/6700K


2 and 3 is the same i think, but what the difference beetween 1 and 4 is?


----------



## blazarbot

i'm buying a kit from rockitcool and will attempt my 1st ever delid.

I'll probably try it first on my g4400, just to get my bearings haha
With the intention of taking the G4400 to it's max.... on water at least (i'm still a noob to use LN2).


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PrimoGhost*
> 
> no way to delid it by the razor... great buisness 4 delid tools
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> Need little help again... Does anyone know what are the distances in *original - non deliddedl* 7700/7600/6700K
> 
> 
> 2 and 3 is the same i think, but what the difference beetween 1 and 4 is?


this is why you mark around the IHS with a sharpie...I plan on doing this from now on as well. I would like to get my hands on a delid/relid kit from rockit...but never in stock


----------



## Dimensive

Never in stock? They've been in stock and still are.


----------



## PrimoGhost

Nope. I'm only want to know this difference. All my chips were de-lidded by rockit 88 and the IHS is in the middle of the Pcb


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> 2066, yes, care to provide a link for that? I haven't heard anythign about 2066 being delidded.
> 
> 2011 though, best left to traditional solder.


here ya go




from the mouth of the master himself...in a german accent as well. DANG...I didnt get to it in time, but i will just levae this right here.

Did you buy it from Rockits site? I looked about 3 weeks ago, it wasnt in stock. I may give it a go now


----------



## Dimensive

Yup, both white & black have been in stock, just have to use the silver hardware.


----------



## stephenn82

im in the process of getting white/black hardware...it says in stock....sweet! Do the have a discount for OCN members?


----------



## Dimensive

Not that I know of.


----------



## stephenn82

i just found THIS...
http://www.overclock.net/t/1627022/cross-country-rockit-delid-tool-extravaganza

but I dont meet requirements of rep. dang!


----------



## Dimensive

He's made exceptions for others, won't hurt to ask.


----------



## stephenn82

just did...see what they say.


----------



## OCDev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> Out of curiosity, has anyone tested to see differences between Liquid Ultra and Conductonaut?


I couldn't decide on my build so I used Conductonaut on the chip and Liquid Ultra on the IHS








Temps are good...


----------



## PrimoGhost

One month from now and the CLU stays on Yours IHS forever.


----------



## OCDev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *PrimoGhost*
> 
> One month from now and the CLU stays on Yours IHS forever.


Yeah. I've heard that's a possible issue, but I'm not worried about an IHS stuck to the waterblock (pretty sure I can problem solve that when/if the time comes).

From my own personal experience, I used CLU on my work laptop over a year ago and haven't had any issues. Honestly, it was the best thing I ever did to that wanna be space heater.

If you are talking about staining the metal I really don't care since it hasn't affected performance and you can't see it .


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OCDev*
> 
> Yeah. I've heard that's a possible issue, but I'm not worried about an IHS stuck to the waterblock (pretty sure I can problem solve that when/if the time comes).
> 
> From my own personal experience, I used CLU on my work laptop over a year ago and haven't had any issues. Honestly, it was the best thing I ever did to that wanna be space heater.
> 
> If you are talking about staining the metal I really don't care since it hasn't affected performance and you can't see it .


Problem is, if the IHS gets stuck to the cooler base you have no way to remove it since the latching mechanism wont open that far and you pretty much get screwed. Easiest way is just to get the cpu really hot with a stress test then immediately shut down and remove the cooler.


----------



## OCDev

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Problem is, if the IHS gets stuck to the cooler base you have no way to remove it since the latching mechanism wont open that far and you pretty much get screwed. Easiest way is just to get the cpu really hot with a stress test then immediately shut down and remove the cooler.


To be clear here, are you talking about liquid pro or liquid ultra? Just want to double check because everyone on the internet with pictures to back up complaints have been talking about liquid pro. I've used ultra on multiple machines and haven't had any problems. Have I just won multiple good batch lotteries or are people referring to clu and clp interchangeably when they shouldn't?

And thanks for the heating advice should I ever need it.







I'd go the hair dryer route myself but the input is appreciated!


----------



## PrimoGhost

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *OCDev*
> 
> If you are talking about staining the metal I really don't care since it hasn't affected performance and you can't see it .


This' cooler and 6600k of one of my friend from other forum 5 weeks after installation of CLP





three days we tried to advise how to remove it. hair dryer - faild. acetone - faild. heat gun (after removal of the IHS ) faild

Ended up graining both surfaces. Hardly.

I would never buy cooler after this. Also the chip. Destroyed hardware for me. And i don't talk about look of chip and cooler. I mean performance with scratched surfaces.

Interestingly - base of cooler was'nt made from aluminium.


----------



## OCDev

Ugh. That's like 4 hours of sanding there. Yet another horror story to chalk up to liquid pro. I'm thinking even though I haven't had any problems with liquid ultra, I'm not comfortable using a product so similar to pro. On my next breakdown I'm just going to repaste with thermal grizzly.

I'll always be curious as to why it's never done that to me on several machines though. Luck I suppose...


----------



## PrimoGhost

i don't know my friend... I just believe it's not a good product for use to IHS - Cooler line. With a delidded processor i'm always get better performance with kryonaunt on IHS. And it's save for sure









I don't want to scare you... It's your hardware. I just say it can make an unnecessary problem like above. And with a new chip - for sure You get lose warranty because clenaning of CLU/CLP will erase the serial number.

Even delid does not necessarily invalidate the warranty if chip was glued correctly. But loss of serial number - 100 %


----------



## blazarbot

Edit


----------



## blazarbot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> here ya go
> 
> 
> 
> 
> from the mouth of the master himself...in a german accent as well. DANG...I didnt get to it in time, but i will just levae this right here.
> 
> Did you buy it from Rockits site? I looked about 3 weeks ago, it wasnt in stock. I may give it a go now


I bought one last Friday from them and got an email yesterday saying the Item has been shipped.

The shipping costs to UK, $28 ......... is dear but in fairness they give u a cheaper solution, but that could take up to 4 weeks to arrive.
I spent around £100+ in deliding tools (Rockit 88 + high temperature resistant UHU glue + Grizzly Conductonaut).... not cheap, but because I have 3 chips to delid, it's not too bad.


----------



## EDK-TheONE

I sent my CPU to my friend for delidding because i have not any tool


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blazarbot*
> 
> I bought one last Friday from them and got an email yesterday saying the Item has been shipped.
> 
> The shipping costs to UK, $28 ......... is dear but in fairness they give u a cheaper solution, but that could take up to 4 weeks to arrive.
> I spent around £100+ in deliding tools (Rockit 88 + high temperature resistant UHU glue + Grizzly Conductonaut).... not cheap, but because I have 3 chips to delid, it's not too bad.


Why buy a rockit kit when you have der8auers diemate 2 there?

Also it is a gimmick fir "high temp" sealants. All RTV adhesive is 500 degree limit. This is the base entry adhesive. I dont think any of our CPU will ever hit 500 degree Fahrenheit..lol


----------



## blazarbot

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Why buy a rockit kit when you have der8auers diemate 2 there?
> 
> Also it is a gimmick fir "high temp" sealants. All RTV adhesive is 500 degree limit. This is the base entry adhesive. I dont think any of our CPU will ever hit 500 degree Fahrenheit..lol


When i bought my rockit there were no other kits on sale, only the Rockit 88.
I went to der8auers site first but all he had for sale was LN2 pots, mainly, and a few other small bits, no delid kits at the moment. At least last Friday.
In one of his last videos, he says his latest kits will be on sale soon, it just needed a few small tweaks.

About the sealant.... you praise der8auers diemate 2 kit but then almost dismiss his choice of sealant







As long as the sealant does it's job I don't care about the rest mate.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blazarbot*
> 
> When i bought my rockit there were no other kits on sale, only the Rockit 88.
> I went to der8auers site first but all he had for sale was LN2 pots, mainly, and a few other small bits, no delid kits at the moment. At least last Friday.
> In one of his last videos, he says his latest kits will be on sale soon, it just needed a few small tweaks.
> 
> About the sealant.... you praise der8auers diemate 2 kit but then almost dismiss his choice of sealant
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As long as the sealant does it's job I don't care about the rest mate.


he was the one to yell about the rockit kit on OCN. Overclockers UK has his kits for cheap. I did the conversion for shipping one to the states, and it was about the same as what you spent on the rockit.

The sealants are what I was saying. If its good enough to hold your auto together AND less than 5 quid...why bother going expensive on 'high temp" labeled products, when the basic automotive grade silicone rtv is rated to 500 degrees farenheit? (260 celsius)

wasnt trying to upset anyone, just help many people out that the basic tube of silicone RTV at the auto parts store is more than good enough.


----------



## pawelekd9

Delidding i7 7700K with steel tape


----------



## blazarbot

My kit arrived yesterday.
I'll do the deliding at the weekend


----------



## reqq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pawelekd9*
> 
> Delidding i7 7700K with steel tape


Like the creativity!

Used thin razorblade myself on 6700k. Looked scary first considering how thin the pcb is but as soon you get in a little bit it was super easy.

However my temps with my air cooler are still ****ty. Dont know whats going on.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reqq*
> 
> Like the creativity!
> 
> Used thin razorblade myself on 6700k. Looked scary first considering how thin the pcb is but as soon you get in a little bit it was super easy.
> 
> However my temps with my air cooler are still ****ty. Dont know whats going on.


bingo...maybe the air cooler? or the TIM between the IHS and cooler? Just an idea.


----------



## Corder

Hey guys, what's your opinion. I've got 7700k a week ago. I found a guy who delid CPUs nearby for 20$ he is ready to delid with pro tool and glue it back together. What bothers me what liquid metal he is using "Сoollaboratory Liquid Pro". Is it really that bad?

And what is the best Liquid Metal? I guess I can just buy one myself and give it to the master.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Corder*
> 
> Hey guys, what's your opinion. I've got 7700k a week ago. I found a guy who delid CPUs nearby for 20$ he is ready to delid with pro tool and glue it back together. What bothers me what liquid metal he is using "Сoollaboratory Liquid Pro". Is it really that bad?
> 
> And what is the best Liquid Metal? I guess I can just buy one myself and give it to the master.


There have been reports that the Liquid Pro bonds the substrates together leaving heavy corrosion behind. The gold standard seems to be either CLU or Conductonaut (as vetted by Der8auer).


----------



## Corder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> There have been reports that the Liquid Pro bonds the substrates together leaving heavy corrosion behind. The gold standard seems to be either CLU or Conductonaut (as vetted by Der8auer).


CLU stands for coollaboratory liquid ultra?

Conductonaut - Grizzly Conductonaut 1g TG-C-001-R, right?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Corder*
> 
> CLU stands for coollaboratory liquid ultra?
> 
> Conductonaut - Grizzly Conductonaut 1g TG-C-001-R, right?


yes. he did a thread and thermal testing on both, and found thermal grizzly conductonaut far superior in ability to transfer heat. will we ever notice it? probably not. buy whichever is cheaper for you, or whatever fills the peace of mind. I picked up conductonaut for 14 dollars on amazon, showed up at the house 3 days later.


----------



## Corder

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> . buy whichever is cheaper for you, or whatever fills the peace of mind. .


But not CL Pro right? that one is definetely bad?

I don't know why, but all masters around here using CL Pro and they refuse to use my paste, says they can gurantee only with that one.


----------



## reqq

69,74,67,72
69,75,68,72
71,75,66,73
71,75,66,73
71,73,66,72
71,75,67,73
71,75,68,73
71,74,58,63
71,74,68,75
72,74,68,72
72,75,67,73
71,75,57,64
71,76,67,73
72,75,66,74
72,76,67,73
71,75,67,74
71,75,67,74

These are my temps every second in time spy cpu test. Logged with core temp. delidded 6700k at [email protected](1.36 when llc kicks in). Cooler master tim on both die and cpu cooler(TRUE120 air cooler). I got perfect air flow with my silverstone fortress, 180 mm fan directly by the motherboard. So bad temps, maybe to much tim? I guess its not the best tim but still, should be lower shouldnt it?


----------



## Nebulous

I delidded both my 3570K and 4790K because of temp limitations. Got a 7700K and I'll be danged I don't need to delid this one as the temps are uncanny low @ 5.0Ghz with 1.31v. Finally my wish came true this time


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Nebulous*
> 
> I delidded both my 3570K and 4790K because of temp limitations. Got a 7700K and I'll be danged I don't need to delid this one as the temps are uncanny low @ 5.0Ghz with 1.31v. Finally my wish came true this time


very nice!









I wasn't quite so lucky, running 5.0 at 1.376v on the 7700k I just got on the bench but the temps are miserable bumping into the 90's with a full custom loop so it will be delidded soon (thanks to @wholeeo for letting me take their delid tool for a spin!)

I'm really hoping for 5.1 but I'm not sure this chip will do it, we'll find out after I pop the top I guess


----------



## smithsrt8

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> very nice!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wasn't quite so lucky, running 5.0 at 1.376v on the 7700k I just got on the bench but the temps are miserable bumping into the 90's with a full custom loop so it will be delidded soon (thanks to @wholeeo for letting me take their delid tool for a spin!)
> 
> I'm really hoping for 5.1 but I'm not sure this chip will do it, we'll find out after I pop the top I guess


So on a custom loop you are @ 90?? all my stuff finally showed up for my loop so I am going to be doing it next week..but right now with a Fractal Celsius S36 I am hitting about 77-80c...I am at 1.375 @ 5ghz currently


----------



## 0ldChicken

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *smithsrt8*
> 
> So on a custom loop you are @ 90?? all my stuff finally showed up for my loop so I am going to be doing it next week..but right now with a Fractal Celsius S36 I am hitting about 77-80c...I am at 1.375 @ 5ghz currently


yes when running x264 at 1.376v I topped out at 88c with a 26c ambient temp. Gaming stays in the high 60's right now. I do have a new monoblock and am currently using the wrong ports but they'll be switched soon. I'll try and check temps with proper ports before I delid.


----------



## reqq

How many of you run without any silicon or other adhesive? Thinking redoing mine and go without it..but read on other forum that without a small hole you insulate hot air and might fry the chip?


----------



## smithsrt8

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reqq*
> 
> How many of you run without any silicon or other adhesive? Thinking redoing mine and go without it..but read on other forum that without a small hole you insulate hot air and might fry the chip?


Although it doesn't fit in your question I didn't use silicon and just followed Rockitcool's direction and used superglue


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reqq*
> 
> How many of you run without any silicon or other adhesive? Thinking redoing mine and go without it..but read on other forum that without a small hole you insulate hot air and might fry the chip?


Depending on how your chip is, that seems unlikely to me (well, it seems unlikely from a thermodynamic standpoint as well... but that's another matter). In my case my IHS sat freely on the die and would actually spin - so there was at least a small gap between the edges of the IHS and the PCB without anything. I decided to do RTV because of that - to give a little more pressure buffer against possibly cracking the die.

In any case - the die itself is all that creates heat (well 99% of it at least) so unless that isn't in contact with the IHS, or you have big gaps/voids in your LM/TIM application - you should be putting all the heat into the IHS - even heat from the air gap surrounding it. Again, unless you're woefully under-cooled on the block/cooler side as well - all of that heat should be dissipating faster than it's accumulating... or you will overheat and go into protection mode.

I can't come up with a scenario where the heated air surrounding the die under the IHS is going to be at issue unless you're doing something very, very wrong... regardless of what you use (or nothing).

I think a more likely reason for allowing a gap might be to deal with the possibility of condensation under the IHS, which with untreated traces could _theoretically_ allow for a short to occur. Just conjecture on that however. And I think you'd have to be in the jungle or using sub-zero cooling to even have to consider that possibility.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *reqq*
> 
> How many of you run without any silicon or other adhesive? Thinking redoing mine and go without it..but read on other forum that without a small hole you insulate hot air and might fry the chip?


I didn't glue mine. My IHS is free floating on top of the CPU die anyway, theres a small 0.3mm gap which I shimmed with 0.2mm high quality electrical tape. When I fasten the socket down, the IHS digs in to the electrical tape slightly (which tells me the die bowed a bit under pressure) which prevents it moving.


----------



## reqq

oki thanks guys


----------



## Piddeman

Hello! Here's my project on deliding an i5 4690k

I can hit 4,9GHZ and stay at 80c under XTU stresstest.

Remarkable what a delid can do..intel should be at shame for making such a bad work on their TIM..




I used nail polish to protect the pins

My album on Imgur, all pictures on the delid is in the link below


http://imgur.com/NQpa9


----------



## Mr-Dark

Hello all

I just Delided my 7700k today, and need some opinion









here is some pic



after applying the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra



Basic test, everything at default expect 50X Multi and 1.300v

Before the delid



after Delid



10C drop.. is that enough or ? any comment on this ?

The cooler is Corsair H110i and the ambient around + 25c

Thanks


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr-Dark*
> 
> Hello all
> 
> I just Delided my 7700k today, and need some opinion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> here is some pic
> 
> 
> 
> after applying the Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> 
> 
> 
> Basic test, everything at default expect 50X Multi and 1.300v
> 
> Before the delid
> 
> 
> 
> after Delid
> 
> 
> 
> 10C drop.. is that enough or ? any comment on this ?
> 
> The cooler is Corsair H110i and the ambient around + 25c
> 
> Thanks


Could try using another thin coat of CLU. CLU is much MUCH more finicky to apply then TIM. A TIM pretty sure gets applied by pressure, CLU does not, if you get the thickness wrong youll have a very minuscule air gap between the IHS and CLU and thats no bueno.

Also you have one core running quite a bit hotter then all your other ones, so id reapply lightly and give it a go.

P.S. Look at max temps and not what its running at now, average would be better but i dont see it measured.


----------



## Mr-Dark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Could try using another thin coat of CLU. CLU is much MUCH more finicky to apply then TIM. A TIM pretty sure gets applied by pressure, CLU does not, if you get the thickness wrong youll have a very minuscule air gap between the IHS and CLU and thats no bueno.
> 
> Also you have one core running quite a bit hotter then all your other ones, so id reapply lightly and give it a go.
> 
> P.S. Look at max temps and not what its running at now, average would be better but i dont see it measured.


Thanks for the reply bro

I'm thinking about ordering new thermal paste to use between the IHS and the block as i'm using the MX2 now which old and not good enough..









will report back after reapplying all


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr-Dark*
> 
> Thanks for the reply bro
> 
> I'm thinking about ordering new thermal paste to use between the IHS and the block as i'm using the MX2 now which old and not good enough..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> will report back after reapplying all


Yea old or dried out thermal paste can be a problem as well. I got some Hydronaut thats dried out (barely came out of the tube) and i used it on my new ryzen build and my temps were at least 5°C warmer tctl temps.


----------



## Mr-Dark

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yea old or dried out thermal paste can be a problem as well. I got some Hydronaut thats dried out (barely came out of the tube) and i used it on my new ryzen build and my temps were at least 5°C warmer tctl temps.


That tube is new not old at all, its 1 month old but the MX2 vs Gelid or Noctua there is good 3-5c improvement


----------



## cnckane

Hi,
I'm going to delid my 4790k this weekend but I'm not sure about some things so I'd like to ask first.
Can I use nail polish and thermal pads to cover the IC-s next to the die ? I really afraid the CLU will touch them and cause trouble so I want to make sure







How long should I wait before using the CPU after I reglue the IHS, 1-2 hours or 24 ? This is the glue I'll be using: https://www.amazon.de/UHU-46735-Hochtemperatur-Silikon-schwarz/dp/B008YE3ABA


----------



## Wrecking

7700K @5GHZ (V1.295) - 30 minutes full stress - Temp Max. 79°

not delid. Is it good ??


----------



## smithsrt8

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wrecking*
> 
> 7700K @5GHZ (V1.295) - 30 minutes full stress - Temp Max. 79°
> 
> not delid. Is it good ??


Holy crap...you won the silicon lottery...that isnt bad at all...


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Wrecking*
> 
> 7700K @5GHZ (V1.295) - 30 minutes full stress - Temp Max. 79°
> 
> not delid. Is it good ??


Yep that's a great chip - and it seems to be one of the better 'lidded' ones from Intel. Mine was only slightly worse voltage-wise but way worse temp wise. Of course, that was with a crappy air cooler just resting on it as well - so not the best test. I saw core temps hit the stops at full stress at 5GHz @ 1.31V - after delid it topped at 74C and was stable at 1.30V.

Based on mine - if you have good water cooling you should be able to hit 5.3GHz no problem - mine does that at 1.42V and tops out at 89C... but I've decided it's not worth the extra so I'm running 5.2 for my 24/7 clock because that only takes 1.375V and stays under 80C.

You'll get even better with a delid most likely, but since your chip is only slightly warmer than mine _after_ delidding - I'd be surprised if you dropped more than a few degrees even at full load.

Seems like Intel might have tweaked production somewhat for better gaps and less TIM required.


----------



## PrimoGhost

Collaboratory Liquid Ultra vs TGC. My test made for polish forum. Need translate.



Shows:

*Average temps of Cores in stress and average temps from three sensors putted on the nh-d14 ( STRESS, IDLE, LINX and OCCT )

- Down of cooler ( nh-d14 )
- middle ( first radiators rib )
- TOP of the cooler*

Blue Column - CLU
Orange - TGC

TGC seems to transfer a little more heat from DIE to Cooler, but the temperature of cores is pretty the same. The CPU is 6700k *without adhesive* ( 4.22 mm on both tests )

+/- The same results like in Roboyto's test.http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/29800_100#post_24869257

I've made a really big test. This is only one graph, but result is exactly like this.
And measurement from Anandtech...



And my 6700k:


first picture ( from left ) - 6700kk delidded by rockit cool 88 with adhesive
Second - the same CPU without adhesive
Third - IHS ( edge )
last one - PCB used in Skylake and Kaby Lake.

One more graph


Translate - the same averages like above, but the

Blue Column is - Delid with adhesive ( 4.27 mm )
orange column - Delid with adhesive but applied otherwise. Like that. The size os chip's 4.22 mm. Like without adhesive or like with super glue


From techpowerup


Its working







Not an amazing progress, but safer than using super glue


----------



## Argowashi

Do you *have* to reglue the IHS after delidding or can I just not do that?


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Argowashi*
> 
> Do you *have* to reglue the IHS after delidding or can I just not do that?


You definitely don't have to.


----------



## Ceadderman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Argowashi*
> 
> Do you *have* to reglue the IHS after delidding or can I just not do that?
> 
> 
> 
> You definitely don't have to.
Click to expand...

Agreed, but I would recommend it. Certainly makes remounting an easier task. I delidded my locked 4790 and due to not having CLU on hand and in the testing phase of things, I left things alone. Remounting the IHS is a slight chore. As it likes to slip around on the replacement TIM. Thankfully my temps have not been the worse for it. But they could've been. I'm using TG Hydronaut and it's still holding up even though my system GPU crashed a few times due to ambient temps being too high in my room.

But if you don't mind the IHS sliding around then it's not that big a deal.









~Ceadder


----------



## PrimoGhost

I would recommend it too.

I can sell my chip in one piece
IHS does not move during fastening socket. No risk of wiping the CLU/TGC during this.
Little more work, but its one-time work....
Still... I'm disappointed with the performance of Grizzly Conductaunt.









I made additional tests..


No difference at all


----------



## kfxsti

Ok guys.. have a odd predicament..
Someone sent me a 7700k.. Traded some used older hardware for it, but the CPU has be delided.. temps on a few cores are higher than they should be.
4 corners are glued with what looks like regular super glue.. not the gel like I use.. IHS is not on straight.. but enough to be mounted correctly.. But the IHS is also turned upside down where the info on the IHS is upside down..
Anyone think it will be ok to pop back off the IHS with the Rockit? Or should I carefully slice the super glue a little first ? Have never seen one in a mess like this.. and why I offer this service to others for free lol.
Or is there an acetone or super glue remover that will not damage the substrate ?


----------



## smithsrt8

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> Ok guys.. have a odd predicament..
> Someone sent me a 7700k.. Traded some used older hardware for it, but the CPU has be delided.. temps on a few cores are higher than they should be.
> 4 corners are glued with what looks like regular super glue.. not the gel like I use.. IHS is not on straight.. but enough to be mounted correctly.. But the IHS is also turned upside down where the info on the IHS is upside down..
> Anyone think it will be ok to pop back off the IHS with the Rockit? Or should I carefully slice the super glue a little first ? Have never seen one in a mess like this.. and why I offer this service to others for free lol.
> Or is there an acetone or super glue remover that will not damage the substrate ?


I believe that acetone will take care of the super glue...as long as that is what it is...if it is like some of the stuff I use in my shop (3m 4747) you are going to have a bad day


----------



## kfxsti

Got clarification on what was used.. I have a bottle of the same stuff. But I have never used it on a CPU. Lol


----------



## smithsrt8

You are good with Acetone...it shouldn't be too much of a hassle


----------



## kfxsti

Sweet. Once I get a chance to do it all. I'll snap some pics. This is the first time out of 28 CPUs I have been nervous lol


----------



## ttnuagmada

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> but tbh i think the biggest problem is the ihs die contact distance which is extended due to the adhesive


Thats been known to be the real problem since the the IB days. I don't understand how everyone still talks like TIM is the issue.


----------



## stephenn82

A lot of people use that glue. I used permatex silicone rtv.


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> A lot of people use that glue. I used permatex silicone rtv.


So I should be ok using a little acetone then popping the top back off with no damage to the substrate then right?


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ttnuagmada*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> but tbh i think the biggest problem is the ihs die contact distance which is extended due to the adhesive
> 
> 
> 
> Thats been known to be the real problem since the the IB days. I don't understand how everyone still talks like TIM is the issue.
Click to expand...

Exactly.


----------



## smithsrt8

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> So I should be ok using a little acetone then popping the top back off with no damage to the substrate then right?


try to use the acetone on a q-tip and focus on the areas that are glued...you then should be able to pull it right off


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

After reading about a hundred different guides/videos, I recently de-lidded my freshly purchased 7700k - straight out of the box.

I used the Rockit Cool delid/relid kit, some CLU, and Black Permatex Silicon RTV.

The process went smoothly, the most aggravating part was removing the old silicon, which was a ***** to remove.

One scary part was that I applied scotch tape on the PCB prior to applying the CLU - but when removing the tape, it left patches of sticky adhesive. Some even got on the little golden dots that I was trying to protect. I was alarmed! I used some diluted isopropyl alcohol as that's all I had, and managed to get it off, but I was still worried I had damaged it somehow.

Nevertheless, I progressed with the process and applied the black silicon and clamped that **** down, then left it overnight. I put it into my mobo and used the Noctua thermal paste that came with my NH-U14S cooler.

I ran Aida64 stress test for 2 hours on the CPU stress setting, and these were the results: Max temp of 55 degrees, and all 4 cores were within 2degrees of each other.

How did I do?? I can't believe the results, it seems too good to be true. Is it?

delid.png 18k .png file


----------



## smithsrt8

Great results....what's the ambient in your room.


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

It's winter here now, so hard to say - probably about 15 degrees celcius.

But I think I might be safe to assume that even considered the low ambient temperature, it was a big success?? Especially the low variance between cores- seen lots of posts with 5-10 degrees variance


----------



## smithsrt8

Yea...considering you are on air...those temps are strong


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

Great.

I just wanted to make sure I hadn't....I dunno, wasn't missing anything, or had done the stress test properly. Was having trouble believing the temps.


----------



## stephenn82

Good results man! 15c in winter? Wooo. Its a nice chilly setting in my basement (below grade) at 21c. Outside it has been humid and about 28-35c. What region of the world are you in? South of the equator obviously. Australia, NZ?


----------



## thiussat

I delided my 6600k last night. After reapplying paste I noticed about a 5°C drop on stock clocks (used Noctua-NT-H1 paste).

While delidding I noticed that my PCB was bent. I used the razorblade method and I didn't feel as if I was applying some extreme force to the PCB, but it's still bent anyway. Anyway, the CPU still works, but it's now acting funky. I get strange intermittent lines across the screen while gaming. If I try and minimize the game to do something else, sometimes it freezes and I get red and green artifacts on the screen. It _never_ did this before.

So, I think I killed my CPU. It still works for day to day tasks (videos, browsing, etc.) but it doesn't seem stable even if I set everything to stock speeds.

So, I recommend against delidding, unless perhaps you have one of those tools made specifically for it. Even then I wouldn't risk it. Before delidding, my AIO cooler kept my temps well within the TJmax even at a pretty hefty OC. So, I see no benefit unless you are just overclocking for lulz to see how much voltage you can pump into the chip.

I would be really pissed right now if I had broken one of those $1000 X99 CPU's. Hell, I am pissed at breaking my $250 chip as I have no money to replace it. I guess I am stuck with it.


----------



## stephenn82

I did mine with a razor and dont have any issues as you do.
Those x99 cpus are soldered on btw


----------



## IMI4tth3w

When there's kits like the rockit cool i dont understand why people bother with razor blades or vices these days. its too easy and too cheap not to use a delidding tool......

Before there was special tools i did the razor method and killed/stunted a 3570k (lost dual channel memory functionality). But that was the only real option back then (plus i was itching to upgrade. which i did)

special delidding tools are practically 100% safe. i've used my rockit cool kit for 4 cpus now and its worked flawlessly.


----------



## thiussat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMI4tth3w*
> 
> special delidding tools are practically 100% safe. i've used my rockit cool kit for 4 cpus now and its worked flawlessly.


Been testing my CPU today some. When gaming I was getting the blue/red/green artifacts on the screen and then sometimes the game would freeze causing my entire system to crash along with it.

So I took out the video card and put in an ancient GTX 660 I had laying around and I am not getting those artifacts now. Everything is running fine.

So I am wondering if when I redid the thermal paste on my r9 390 if I screwed up somehow? My temps are fine, but this card doesn't have a way to monitor VRM temps. When I took the cooler off the video card, some of the thermal pads were cracked/broken and I didn't replace them. Would hot VRM's cause artifacting?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I delided my 6600k last night. After reapplying paste I noticed about a 5°C drop on stock clocks (used Noctua-NT-H1 paste).
> 
> While delidding I noticed that my PCB was bent. I used the razorblade method and I didn't feel as if I was applying some extreme force to the PCB, but it's still bent anyway. Anyway, the CPU still works, but it's now acting funky. I get strange intermittent lines across the screen while gaming. If I try and minimize the game to do something else, sometimes it freezes and I get red and green artifacts on the screen. It _never_ did this before.
> 
> So, I think I killed my CPU. It still works for day to day tasks (videos, browsing, etc.) but it doesn't seem stable even if I set everything to stock speeds.
> 
> So, I recommend against delidding, unless perhaps you have one of those tools made specifically for it. Even then I wouldn't risk it. Before delidding, my AIO cooler kept my temps well within the TJmax even at a pretty hefty OC. So, I see no benefit unless you are just overclocking for lulz to see how much voltage you can pump into the chip.
> 
> I would be really pissed right now if I had broken one of those $1000 X99 CPU's. Hell, I am pissed at breaking my $250 chip as I have no money to replace it. I guess I am stuck with it.


if you would've used a liquid metal paste the drop would be bigger







(and kaby is on average hotter, but can also clock higher; it also comes down to how generous Intel was with the glue)
there is also no long term experience using anything but liquid metal pastes that I know off
the noctua might pump out over time
not saying it will

if one uses a tool it's pretty safe

if you buy a 1000 dollar CPU meant for OC'ing
well either you know what you're doing
or you let a service do it for you, like silicon lottery
hell if one spends a 1000 bucks and hopes to OC, you can buy a pre binned one from silicon lottery, they come delidded this time around

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> Would hot VRM's cause artifacting?


could be
VRM's are rated for higher temps though
hope you didn't scratch something on accident

well it's not good
would be better to replace the pads to make sure
edit:
what about the RAM? having pads? getting cooled?

this artifacting reminds me more of RAM clocking too high
clocking the chip too high results for me in hangs and crashes
but the RAM causes artifacts

not saying you're RAM clocks too high, only asking if the RAM is taken care off


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

Yup, down in South Island of New Zealand. Roughly 15 degrees during mid afternoon here. I searched and searched and tried to find someone in NZ or even Aus that would do the delid for me, but found nobody, so had to order the stuff myself from overseas.

So if anyone from NZ is reading this and wants theirs done, I'll do it for you.

Glad to hear I've got strong temps and that the de-lidding was apparently a success. Is 2 hours long enough to run the CPU stress test???

Like I mentioned, I was pretty worried about the sticky adhesive from the scotch tape that remained on the PCB (and some of the golden dots!) when I removed it, even after cleaning it off I was slightly worried it might've have affected the operation of the CPU in some way. It seems to be running OK, I imagine if I had done any damage that it would be instantly noticeable? I guess I'm being paranoid about it.


----------



## smithsrt8

2 hours is a bit short...but still effective...people always talk about running something like realbench for a solid 8 hours...that will really give you a good idea...but then again how often are you really stressing the CPU for that long at one time...if you are a gamer then probably not...however for some applications (rendering etc) you may be...


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I don't have nearly as much time for gaming as I did (or as I would like to) but some careful selections can make 'stress testing' more enjoyable. At least is more enjoyable than watching progress bars slowly fill or a graph slowly fluctuate while running meaningless calculations in the background.









Many of the established benchmarks run CPU and GPU cycles plus a blended load. They may not be the same level of stress as AIDA64/XTU/IBT/Prime95/etc. but they are pretty good representations of real world loads for heat/OC stability testing.

Unless you're worried about instability to the extent that it could cause data corruption - just test briefly and then use it to do everything you do normally (preferrably at once - to stress the RAM too somewhat). If it does all that without crashing - it's stable enough IMO.

(Just don't let your friend who does virus progression modelling use your system for his mission-critical calculations maybe).


----------



## dmitriykhita

Hello!
I have a Sandy Bridge i3-2120T on my back up PC. It has started warming up more than usual and I'm thinking about deliding this processor (I have already changed the paste and coolers, and not satisfied by the results).
On the other hand, I've read that Sandy Bridge has soldered and there is no reason to delid it.
Does somebody knows or imagines if all Sandy Bridge are sodered, or the low-end processors (like mine) could have the paste on IHS?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts.

Dmitriy


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liquidsrightarm*
> 
> It's winter here now, so hard to say - probably about 15 degrees celcius.
> 
> But I think I might be safe to assume that even considered the low ambient temperature, it was a big success?? Especially the low variance between cores- seen lots of posts with 5-10 degrees variance


OMG that sounds heavenly to me right now... we hit 117F(47C) here yesterday. Of course, not inside, but still.









Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dmitriykhita*
> 
> Hello!
> I have a Sandy Bridge i3-2120T on my back up PC. It has started warming up more than usual and I'm thinking about deliding this processor (I have already changed the paste and coolers, and not satisfied by the results).
> On the other hand, I've read that Sandy Bridge has soldered and there is no reason to delid it.
> Does somebody knows or imagines if all Sandy Bridge are sodered, or the low-end processors (like mine) could have the paste on IHS?
> Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
> 
> Dmitriy


All SB CPUs are soldered, plus that's a low TDP processor - what temps are you considering 'more than usual' because it could simply be air flow issues or poor mounting. About all that you could reasonably do if there were imperfections is lap the IHS and HS bottom... but on that chip why bother. You should still be way below the thermal envelope (Tjmax) even if it's warmer than it once was.

You might try under-volting it if your MB allows this - probably will be stable with a bit less vcore. If you're using the IGP you could throw a cheapo GPU in it... would make it run a little cooler and a $40 ebay GPU will smoke that intel 2000 at everything.


----------



## dmitriykhita

Thank you, DiGiCiDAL for your promt reply.
I think I avoid the deliding of I3-2120T

My concern was because I have delided the Celeron G3900T and it does not exeeds 60 C on passive cooling after 50 runs of LynX now.
I3-2120T got 86 C on the same passive cooler and other conditions after only 4 runs of Lynx and than the system was shut down by me to avoid further warming up..
This is a great difference which made me think that there is something wrong with the cooling interface under IHS of I3-2120T.
But probably, it is just old generation, not so effective in energy utilization.
I actually has 2 pieces of I3-2120T and both of them behave the same way in terms of heating.

Thank you, Dmitriy


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

That does seem very hot for a 2120T... almost as if it's not being cooled at all. It's been a long time since I ran anything similar, but I did have a few workstations with 2100's in them and they were cool enough with the stock cooler...

Of course, we weren't stressing them like that.

AVX instructions were just introduced on Sandy IIRC - so I'm sure the implementation was nowhere near as optimized as later generations. Definitely no where near the level of Skylake... so you really can't compare those two CPUs - that G3900T isn't working nearly as hard to make the same computations - even though they're clocked the same.

That is if you meant "LinX" as opposed to "Lynx" - if Lynx is something other than a LinPack Benchmark - then maybe I'm wrong.

Regardless, with those i3's they're never gonna be a 'beast', no matter what - but anything that they are the bottleneck for wasn't meant to be run on them in the first place. They're great CPUs for running a 'casual' desktop PC in Windows or Linux... and that's it. They might work for an HTPC or very light gaming as well provided it's not decoding 4K Hi10p video or playing the latest and greatest.

No need to stability test them like that anyway... they can't overclock so they either work or are dying and need replacement.


----------



## maddangerous

Hi everyone,

Does anyone know where I can get a delid tool for Haswell/Devils canyon here in the states? It seems like casekings doesn't ship to the US, and on overclockers they don't have any in stock.

I don't really fancy using a razor/exact knife, and I don't have access to a vice or a 3d printer..

Thanks in advance


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddangerous*
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> Does anyone know where I can get a delid tool for Haswell/Devils canyon here in the states? It seems like casekings doesn't ship to the US, and on overclockers they don't have any in stock.
> 
> I don't really fancy using a razor/exact knife, and I don't have access to a vice or a 3d printer..
> 
> Thanks in advance


I used the vice only method for my 4790K. Pretty easy since the pcb was thick enough. Check youtube.


----------



## maddangerous

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> I used the vice only method for my 4790K. Pretty easy since the pcb was thick enough. Check youtube.


I don't have access to a vice. Also don't want to put my cpu in one lol


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddangerous*
> 
> I don't have access to a vice. Also don't want to put my cpu in one lol


You don't want /have a lot of things. Good luck!


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddangerous*
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> Does anyone know where I can get a delid tool for Haswell/Devils canyon here in the states? It seems like casekings doesn't ship to the US, and on overclockers they don't have any in stock.
> 
> I don't really fancy using a razor/exact knife, and I don't have access to a vice or a 3d printer..
> 
> Thanks in advance


Try Rockit Delid.


----------



## maddangerous

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> You don't want /have a lot of things. Good luck!


A tool seems the safest way to do this. Dangerous as it might be in nature, I figure this eliminates some of the other ways I could screw it up. Nothing wrong with that, right? Lol
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Try Rockit Delid.


I'll check it out in a moment, thanks. Have you used it?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddangerous*
> 
> A tool seems the safest way to do this. Dangerous as it might be in nature, I figure this eliminates some of the other ways I could screw it up. Nothing wrong with that, right? Lol
> I'll check it out in a moment, thanks. Have you used it?


I used it on my Kaby and it was very easy. Of course, I used the vise + block & hammer method (arguably the most dangerous) on several Ivys and never had a problem either.

However, for the cost of the Rockit... it was well worth it IMO - especially considering the price of a binned & delidded CPU. I wound up getting a pretty good 7700K... so I decided risking making it a keychain just to save $50 was a pretty bad idea.









Plus, if you're totally sure that you're never going to be using it again (and while the 115x platform is still commonly in use) you can probably get >80% back selling it here or on ebay.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddangerous*
> 
> A tool seems the safest way to do this. Dangerous as it might be in nature, I figure this eliminates some of the other ways I could screw it up. Nothing wrong with that, right? Lol
> I'll check it out in a moment, thanks. Have you used it?


Yup, I tested it on a half dozen old C2D era chips before doing my 7700k. Worked a treat and cheap too, definitely would recommend. The only drawback I guess is the attachment for precision re-gluing is a separate purchase, didn't matter for me because I never reglued mine.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *maddangerous*
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> Does anyone know where I can get a delid tool for Haswell/Devils canyon here in the states? It seems like casekings doesn't ship to the US, and on overclockers they don't have any in stock.
> 
> I don't really fancy using a razor/exact knife, and I don't have access to a vice or a 3d printer..
> 
> Thanks in advance


http://www.overclock.net/t/1627022/cross-country-rockit-delid-tool-extravaganza/


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *smithsrt8*
> 
> try to use the acetone on a q-tip and focus on the areas that are glued...you then should be able to pull it right off


Got around to deliding it...
ANYONE planning to delid a 7700k.. any CPU period...
Please for the love of all things Holy... DO NOT Glue the whole damn IHS....


----------



## stephenn82

oh no!

just the corners if using super glue. I just did the corners with tiny blobs of RTV. I plan on doing the same with my RTV once the delid/relid kit makes it to my house and i put some conductonaut on there! I also plan on popping off a g3220 top and a 4670 top. These soldered on? I hope not...


----------



## kfxsti

I know I probably shouldn't be as pissed as I am about this.. as I'm hoping the green piece of substrate missing is ok.. I'm only out two Radiators and a 7970 waterblock for the trade on this CPU.. but 4 dabs in the corners... That's all it needs... Not the whole IHS.. I have it cleaned up CLU back on.. and waiting on the glue to dry on the 4 CORNERS.. while in the relid tool.. lol


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> I know I probably shouldn't be as pissed as I am about this.. as I'm hoping the green piece of substrate missing is ok.. I'm only out two Radiators and a 7970 waterblock for the trade on this CPU.. but 4 dabs in the corners... That's all it needs... Not the whole IHS.. I have it cleaned up CLU back on.. and waiting on the glue to dry on the 4 CORNERS.. while in the relid tool.. lol


There is no possible way that CPU is okay.


----------



## kfxsti

Wellp... It boots. It runs 4.8ghz @ 1.20v @ 54c during Bf4 and The division. I cpuz stressed it at 5ghz @1.25v and it never peaked above 58c
Here's the kicker... Had to put my ram in the first two slots of the Mobo to get it to boot.. put MY cpu back in.. and guess what.. I have to leave the sticks of memory in the first two slots now.. could only imagine what the CPU possibly could have done to my board.

Oh well..

And let this be lesson everyone.. DO NOT RUSH a Delid. Take your time. If you use glue.. only on the 4 corners.. not the whole IHS. And if you don't feel comfortable doing it.. have some one else do it. I have done many... But this one takes the Cake of shear laziness..
I will do so more testing tomorrow to make sure my board is ok. Lol


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

That's amazing! I was with Seijitsu on that... no way was it OK. I guess you got super lucky that no traces were actually broken with that chunk of PCB... which has to be a 1/1000000 chance IMO. I've seen nicks in the top that were barely visible at all that killed CPUs... so the fact that yours boots at all is a certifiable miracle!


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> That's amazing! I was with Seijitsu on that... no way was it OK. I guess you got super lucky that no traces were actually broken with that chunk of PCB... which has to be a 1/1000000 chance IMO. I've seen nicks in the top that were barely visible at all that killed CPUs... so the fact that yours boots at all is a certifiable miracle!


Just worries me what that Cpu did to my motherboard. I put my original 7700k back in and only dimm slots 1and 2 work as if I was using the gimped 7700k. Everyone remember I have 2 lol. And the ugly one with the 70ounces of super glue that was all over the substrate is one I traded some old hardware for. As my original delidded 7700k is nice and clean and was glued in only 4 dabs. Lolol not the entire IHS .


----------



## stephenn82

Im surprised it still works at all. Even at a limited capacity. Seems like you got a short end of thr deal. I would ask for some money or a radiator back...


----------



## kfxsti

Already working on that. Lol. don't dare worry my good man. Something's going to work it self out on the deal.
I figured I would have seen a performance hit running single channel vs dual channel. As I'm having to run my ram in the first two slots. But all is good. Actually scored higher in firestrike lol . Temps are better.. just lost the ability for dual channel on my mobo. Is it possible that the gimped 7700k messed up my mobo?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> Already working on that. Lol. don't dare worry my good man. Something's going to work it self out on the deal.
> I figured I would have seen a performance hit running single channel vs dual channel. As I'm having to run my ram in the first two slots. But all is good. Actually scored higher in firestrike lol . Temps are better.. just lost the ability for dual channel on my mobo. Is it possible that the gimped 7700k messed up my mobo?


Hopefully not. But stuff like that could happen. Especially if its pushing strange voltages or shorted out, since cpu does have control over ram. Only thing I can think of is place a known good cpu (possibly ram too.) and verify total functionality is restored. If not, it may have cooked it ???


----------



## kfxsti

I put a 6600k and my other 7700k , and 2 other sticks of ram in. Same issue..
I'm going to pull the mobo out and check for bent pins. If all else fails.. I'm clocking this mofo back up to 5ghz and hope it makes it to coffee lake lol. Or Ryzen here I come LOL


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> I put a 6600k and my other 7700k , and 2 other sticks of ram in. Same issue..
> I'm going to pull the mobo out and check for bent pins. If all else fails.. I'm clocking this mofo back up to 5ghz and hope it makes it to coffee lake lol. Or Ryzen here I come LOL


Oh boy. It may have broke the memory channel chips on board if giving out bad voltages/short. That really sucks. Coffee lake looks promising, but i really wish it was regular 1151 board not this touted "v2" socket. They are just forcing everyone to hand over money to get meager results. Like they did before amd dropped the 64 bit k8's. Then they scrambled, came up with the easy upgrade solution of same board for 2 or 3 generations and tick tock planned cycles. Now, they are running around like chickens with their heads cut off again.


----------



## kfxsti

I agree. The V2 is a dumb move.
Back to doing some testing. Going to snatch the mobo out and examine the pins. After some googling , bent pins is a possibility. Not holding my breath. But what have I got to loose lol. Single channel so far hasn't hurt my performance in games lol


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> I agree. The V2 is a dumb move.
> Back to doing some testing. Going to snatch the mobo out and examine the pins. After some googling , bent pins is a possibility. Not holding my breath. But what have I got to loose lol. Single channel so far hasn't hurt my performance in games lol


Thats good news the games run fine.


----------



## smithsrt8

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> I agree. The V2 is a dumb move.
> Back to doing some testing. Going to snatch the mobo out and examine the pins. After some googling , bent pins is a possibility. Not holding my breath. But what have I got to loose lol. Single channel so far hasn't hurt my performance in games lol


Wow...you got lucky! I am glad there are no other issues...I would have for sure thought you would have other issues...


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *smithsrt8*
> 
> Wow...you got lucky! I am glad there are no other issues...I would have for sure thought you would have other issues...


I agree... I just knew it was dead lol.. but the 2nd 7700k did jack up my msi mobo. I tested my 1st 7700k and the 6600k and my ram in my ASRock mobo and they work. So.. 2nd 7700k is staying in the msi mobo and going to run single channel until it either explodes or all gets replaced lol.
You were right though . The Acetone removed the glue from the corners.. just not from under the entire IHS LOL
The wife has been laughing this whole time.. I got the "you don't need two 7700k's" I was like.. well.. it's not to bad of a trade.. so... Now.. I'm eating it.. lol


----------



## xOverClocked

OCN name:xOverClocked
CPU:i7-7700k
on die-TIM:CoolLab Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM:Coolmaster Mastergel Maker
Mhz gained:300mhz
OC after delid:5.1Ghz stable at 1.385v gets to 1.4v though.
Temp drops:30c+

Wonder if i can drop the voltage later on as its using the on board graphics card for stress testing. My 1080 died rma in process so i bought a 1080ti on sale which will come within the week lol

I delidded using the RockIt Cool tool and used no glue for the IHS. Whole process was fairly fast to my surprise. As you can see the intel TIM was hardly on my die i had temps up to 100c before i stopped the stress test. Sadly no before pics.


----------



## kfxsti

Well after a long night and some help from @smithsrt8 . We have established that the bad CPU is good and it's indeed my msi Mobo..

Both 7700ks work flawlessly in my wife's rig with her z270 Mobo.
Thanks @smithsrt8 for the second set of eyes last night


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

What exactly is the issue with the mobo???


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> Well after a long night and some help from @smithsrt8 . We have established that the bad CPU is good and it's indeed my msi Mobo..
> 
> Both 7700ks work flawlessly in my wife's rig with her z270 Mobo.
> Thanks @smithsrt8 for the second set of eyes last night


What exactly is the issue with the mobo?


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liquidsrightarm*
> 
> What exactly is the issue with the mobo?


See the gold showing around the Cpu mouting hole?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Looks like one trace is broken but how did that happen? Was this the first time you used the board or was it damaged mounting/unmounting the block/heatsink retaining hardware? I guess although that sucks it's good to know you've got two working 7700K's - hard to believe with all that pcb damage the CPU is fine but a tiny little scuff on the MB PCB was good enough to break a critical trace!


----------



## stephenn82

Holy smokes!! Sorry about the board traces man. But its great news the badly abused cpu still works like a champ!


----------



## wholeeo

Can't those traces be penciled in?


----------



## stephenn82

I bet they could...but will it work as expected? for a time? Try it kfxsti and see if it works again.


----------



## smithsrt8

There has to be some sort of repair kit soldering tool or something (hell...maybe even nail polish!) that might work to repair it...I am not sure


----------



## blaze2210

I've seen conductive pens, from the days of connecting pads on an LGA 775 CPU. If you applied that, then went over it with liquid electrical tape, it might work out.

Conductive pen: https://www.radioshack.com/products/caig-circuitwriter-pen


----------



## stephenn82

Yeah man, or boot strapping the old athlons to unlock 400 mhz fsb from the 266/333 limit. Even a regular pencil. Then the three pin tab was made. Good old days!


----------



## blaze2210

Yep, just gotta channel that "inner MacGuyver" and find a solution. Chewing gum and a copper wire should be reserved for an extreme emergency though.


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> I bet they could...but will it work as expected? for a time? Try it kfxsti and see if it works again.


I'll give it a whirl.
Smithsrt8 and I noticed on the swiftech mounting screw there was a bur on the plastic washer on that mounting point..

When you guys say pencil in. What do you mean? It will probably dawn on me tomorrow... Been a looong day at the Dr. Lol and my brain is mush atm.
Should I heat that spot up? Or use a true lead means on redrawing that trace?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xOverClocked*
> 
> OCN name:xOverClocked
> CPU:i7-7700k
> on die-TIM:CoolLab Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM:Coolmaster Mastergel Maker
> Mhz gained:300mhz
> OC after delid:5.1Ghz stable at 1.385v gets to 1.4v though.
> Temp drops:30c+
> 
> Wonder if i can drop the voltage later on as its using the on board graphics card for stress testing. My 1080 died rma in process so i bought a 1080ti on sale which will come within the week lol
> 
> I delidded using the RockIt Cool tool and used no glue for the IHS. Whole process was fairly fast to my surprise. As you can see the intel TIM was hardly on my die i had temps up to 100c before i stopped the stress test. Sadly no before pics.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!









Apologies for the late entry..... crazy week


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Just checking, is the 'vice only' method still the recommended/most safe method?

I'm planning to delid my 3570K, I bought a E7300 to practice on and it was really easy. I just slapped it in a vice and the IHS was off in less than 5 seconds. Will it be that easy on an Ivy Bridge chip?


----------



## stephenn82

should be! We still recommend a tool, but the older chips the vice method is ok. just dont do it on the thinner pcb of skylake and above. it will snap that sucker in half...


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Righto, sadly the tool things are all sold out where I live, and I already have a vice to hand anyway. Going to swallow some brave pills and try it later on.

Does the orientation matter if I'm doing it this way? I guess since it's side on to the die anyway it doesn't really matter, or... ?


----------



## stephenn82

put the IHS into the vice, and a block of wood on the side, lightly, but firmly, tap it until the IHS comes loose. You can find the vice method all over youtube.


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Sorry I musn't have said it clear. I mean the vice only one, like, without a hammer. Where you put the CPU in the vice at an angle, one jaw on the chip, the other on the IHS, and just tighten till it comes off.

Is that not an approved method in your opinion? I hear some people think it risks bending the chip, but it seems way safer to me than hitting it with a hammer.


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Cookybiscuit*
> 
> Sorry I musn't have said it clear. I mean the vice only one, like, without a hammer. Where you put the CPU in the vice at an angle, one jaw on the chip, the other on the IHS, and just tighten till it comes off.
> 
> Is that not an approved method in your opinion? I hear some people think it risks bending the chip, but it seems way safer to me than hitting it with a hammer.


Vice only should ok for your CPU. I did it on my 4790k easily. It is not recommended with latest CPU like the 7700k since the board is much thinner and fragile. I did the razor on my 7700k without issue.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> Vice only should ok for your CPU. I did it on my 4790k easily. It is not recommended with latest CPU like the 7700k since the board is much thinner and fragile. I did the razor on my 7700k without issue.


like i said here? and its not recommended on skylake or above.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/33270#post_26191641


----------



## blurp

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> like i said here? and its not recommended on skylake or above.
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/33270#post_26191641


Your point ? Worthless reply.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> Your point ? Worthless reply.


two edged sword man. you said the same thing i did in a different word order, all I was saying.


----------



## blaze2210

Haswell has a good and tough PCB - vice, block of wood, and a hammer did it for me. Tried using the razor method, but an untimely twitch can result in an expensive keychain, so that was a no-go for me.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blurp*
> 
> Your point ? Worthless reply.










The irony is killing me...









(Yep... this is a worthless reply as well)


----------



## Tiggymala

Does anyone in the UK near Bristol or Gloucester have a Rockit88 / Delid-Die-Mate 2 for sale or I can use?

I cannot find them for sale anywhere in the UK.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tiggymala*
> 
> Does anyone in the UK near Bristol or Gloucester have a Rockit88 / Delid-Die-Mate 2 for sale or I can use?
> 
> I cannot find them for sale anywhere in the UK.


Overclockers.uk is out of them?


----------



## Tiggymala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Overclockers.uk is out of them?


Yea they have been for a while mate unfortunately









I was going to order one when they had stock a few weeks ago by the time I got home they was sold out typical!


----------



## stephenn82

what about here?

https://www.caseking.de/en/der8auer-delid-die-mate-2-fsd8-019.html


----------



## Tiggymala

I was tempted from caseking.de before they had 29.06.17 for a while then it changed to that date and there is postage time from there even if it is in stock then will take ages









Might just have to result to the knife/vice method lol


----------



## stephenn82

the razor isnt complicated, just takes a lot of patience and gentle but firm handling. I got my 6700k opened up that way. Im waiting for the tool mostly to do a proper relid. Silicone on the corners works, but I want to get it on there just right and leave it more permanently with the liquid metal on the core vice a great thermal paste.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tiggymala*
> 
> I was tempted from caseking.de before they had 29.06.17 for a while then it changed to that date and there is postage time from there even if it is in stock then will take ages
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Might just have to result to the knife/vice method lol


wait I'm confused, these guys still have the tool in stock. Hell, I got one shipped to friggin Australia from the US. Why are people saying no tools are in stock?

https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/cart


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Right after delidding:
> 
> All cleaned up:
> 
> CLU applied:
> 
> 
> Temperatures before delid:
> 
> After (I uninstalled Asus AI Suite and HWMonitor shows more stuff):
> 
> 
> 5.0 Ghz OC (1.51V, runs a bit too hot to use daily, but stable):
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 21 degrees Celsius improvement! That's pretty awesome!
> 
> OCN name: Nikiz
> CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 200 Mhz
> OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz
> Temp drops: 21 degrees Celsius
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: http://valid.x86.fr/8ynll0
> 
> EDIT: Added proof of 5.0Ghz OC.


After almost 1 year, my 6600K is still going strong at 4.8GHz in daily use! 4.9GHz and 5.0GHz are stable, but they require a lot more voltage and are running too hot for my liking.


----------



## Arctucas

Going on one year for me as well.


----------



## Cookybiscuit

Finally got around to deliding my 3570K, the temperature drops are like 25C under load, also refreshing to see it idle in the 30's rather than the 50's. Still doesn't help the fact mine is a crappy overclocker and needs 1.45v for 4.7Ghz :'(

Anyone know if it's normal to hear a bunch of horrible crunching sounds when securing the IHS down on the die in the motherboard with the retention bracket? I thought I broke it when I heard it, but it works just fine, for now. Trouble in the future maybe? I used liquid ultra if it matters.


----------



## tabbycph2

How do I delid my 7740X cpu, im running it at 5.3 Ghz with 1.4 volt (temp around 85 max).


----------



## Tiggymala

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> wait I'm confused, these guys still have the tool in stock. Hell, I got one shipped to friggin Australia from the US. Why are people saying no tools are in stock?
> 
> https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/cart


The delid-die-mate is not in stock anywhere, there is one going on german ebay it is up to £50+ with a while to go and £16 postage no chance.

I ain't paying more for delivery than the item is worth from rockit88...

Rockit 88 - Black Body Silver / Silver 1
$ 30.00

Shipping $ 31.00

.....

Then got to pay for relid components etc...

Appreciate pointing it out but I have looked everywhere high and low so just trying any forums for anyone around Bristol / Gloucestershire area in the UK might get lucky might not, got to ask though!


----------



## peter2k

well besides the DIE mate 2 being out of stock, but seemingly coming again (CaseKing put up a date)

there is another new one out

being for skylake-x

on a first glance it looks like it would do the trick with other CPU's








but it arrives in stock even later

there is also the dr delid from aquacomputer

https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3617
Quote:


> Notice for international shoppers: Due to its light weight and compact size, we can offer attractive shipping costs of 5.00 Euro for this product to any destination


----------



## IMI4tth3w

i don't understand why people even both with razor blades and vices these days. the rockit cool kit is $30 and works fantastically. i've successfully delided 6 CPU's with mine now. 3770k, g3258, 4790k, 5775c, 4770k, and a 4670 non k.

before these kits were available i used the razor method for my 3570k but somehow scratched the pcb (no visible damage). it still worked but i could only use half of the ram slots as running memory in dual channel caused crashing.


----------



## stephenn82

Because not everyone is in the US or willing to pay 65 bucks for a 30 dollar tool.


----------



## IMI4tth3w

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Because not everyone is in the US or willing to pay 65 bucks for a 30 dollar tool.


its still really unfortunate because i think a lot of people who don't really have that much income see this as a "cheap" upgrade and then end up killing their CPU and throwing away much more than they would have if they would have just invested in a cpu delidding tool. could probably even make their money back delidding cpus for friends.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Because not everyone is in the US or willing to pay 65 bucks for a 30 dollar tool.


Yes but the alternative is a $300 keychain.

Seriously, it sucks but having the right tools for the right job matters. I sympathize with people who don't want to pay $65 for a $30 tool but sometimes it can't be helped (frick, I had mine shipped to Australia, NOTHING ships here cheap). But telling people the vice/razor method is viable is exceptionally dangerous in unpracticed hands, even the tried and true vice method is not safe anymore due to the thin Kaby Lake PCB.


----------



## Tiggymala

Never seen the dr delid before, cheers for pointing it out - I will be checking it out now.

the new delid-die-mate have you seen the price? ***..


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Tiggymala*
> 
> the new delid-die-mate have you seen the price? ***..


everything x299 is premium









/s


----------



## Ceadderman

If you are in the States and the tool works, why not do it the right way and jump on the list for the Rockit88 in the OCN freebie section.

For the cost of return shipping there will be no issues from a failed delid.









~Ceadder


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Yes but the alternative is a $300 keychain.
> 
> Seriously, it sucks but having the right tools for the right job matters. I sympathize with people who don't want to pay $65 for a $30 tool but sometimes it can't be helped (frick, I had mine shipped to Australia, NOTHING ships here cheap). But telling people the vice/razor method is viable is exceptionally dangerous in unpracticed hands, even the tried and true vice method is not safe anymore due to the thin Kaby Lake PCB.


No, the safe alternative is to wait for the die mate to come back into stock for a heavy duty tool


----------



## thiussat

I thought I had killed my CPU delidding it with a razor, but it turns out my GPU just happened to be going bad at the same time. So I put in an old GPU and the weird artifacting and crashing problems went away, thank God.

The bad news is that I did not reseal my CPU with silicone. Why does that matter? Well, these Skylake/Kaby processors are the weight of a saltine cracker without the IHS (literally they are feathers). And when the IHS is sitting freely on the CPU, it is very easy to accidentally knock it off when inserting the CPU into the socket. And when you do that, it becomes easy to bend pins on the mobo. That's what happened to me. You need to be VERY careful when you are inserting a bare CPU into the socket with no IHS on top -- its so light that it's easy to bend pins when you attach the IHS. Anyway, I had to buy a new motherboard, which I got the other day and everything is working again.

When I got my new board, I didn't want to deal with a free floating IHS, so I sealed my CPU with silicone. Only problem is that 3 of my cores (even at stock) were 80-90°C on Prime95 while one of the cores was chillin at 58°C. I knew that when you have cores that vary by 20+°C that you have a problem with either the IHS or the cooler being seated properly. So, I knew that I was going to have to delid AGAIN. So, I got in there and delidded with my trusty Stanley razor blade. Luckily the Permatex black silicone came off MUCH easier than the factory stuff. I cleaned it all up, reapplied the NT-H1 to the die and reattached the IHS. Then I went and dropped them both (without sealing the IHS) onto the mobo.

I opened prime95 and ran it again. Temps were 45-50°C on all cores. LOL. Like a 40°C drop. Why? My sealing job with my first delid was crappy and uneven.

What's my point in telling you kids this story? *BUY A DELID TOOL.* Do not waste your time and money like I have done. It is worth the $40 if you can find the Rockit88 tool (be sure and get the Relid tool add-on as well). It is not only a pain in the izzle to delid with a razor but it's even HARDER to relid and properly seal the IHS unless you have the proper relid tool.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I thought I had killed my CPU delidding it with a razor, but it turns out my GPU just happened to be going bad at the same time. So I put in an old GPU and the weird artifacting and crashing problems went away, thank God.
> 
> The bad news is that I did not reseal my CPU with silicone. Why does that matter? Well, these Skylake/Kaby processors are the weight of a saltine cracker without the IHS (literally they are feathers). And when the IHS is sitting freely on the CPU, it is very easy to accidentally knock it off when inserting the CPU into the socket. And when you do that, it becomes easy to bend pins on the mobo. That's what happened to me. You need to be VERY careful when you are inserting a bare CPU into the socket with no IHS on top -- its so light that it's easy to bend pins when you attach the IHS. Anyway, I had to buy a new motherboard, which I got the other day and everything is working again.
> 
> When I got my new board, I didn't want to deal with a free floating IHS, so I sealed my CPU with silicone. Only problem is that 3 of my cores (even at stock) were 80-90°C on Prime95 while one of the cores was chillin at 58°C. I knew that when you have cores that vary by 20+°C that you have a problem with either the IHS or the cooler being seated properly. So, I knew that I was going to have to delid AGAIN. So, I got in there and delidded with my trusty Stanley razor blade. Luckily the Permatex black silicone came off MUCH easier than the factory stuff. I cleaned it all up, reapplied the NT-H1 to the die and reattached the IHS. Then I went and dropped them both (without sealing the IHS) onto the mobo.
> 
> I opened prime95 and ran it again. Temps were 45-50°C on all cores. LOL. Like a 40°C drop. Why? My sealing job with my first delid was crappy and uneven.
> 
> What's my point in telling you kids this story? *BUY A DELID TOOL.* Do not waste your time and money like I have done. It is worth the $40 if you can find the Rockit88 tool (be sure and get the Relid tool add-on as well). It is not only a pain in the izzle to delid with a razor but it's even HARDER to relid and properly seal the IHS unless you have the proper relid tool.


Excellent post.
Rep+


----------



## stephenn82

We all agree with what is said, get the tool. The problem is, a lot of our brethren and sisters in this thread are OCONUS from us. Meaning they will pay for the price of two tools and relids for one. Not many want to do this. They are waiting on UK kits to hit the shelves, like the die mate 2 and the likes. Only other thing I can think of is them finding a maker fair and printing out their own 3d printed tools.


----------



## reqq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I thought I had killed my CPU delidding it with a razor, but it turns out my GPU just happened to be going bad at the same time. So I put in an old GPU and the weird artifacting and crashing problems went away, thank God.
> 
> The bad news is that I did not reseal my CPU with silicone. Why does that matter? Well, these Skylake/Kaby processors are the weight of a saltine cracker without the IHS (literally they are feathers). And when the IHS is sitting freely on the CPU, it is very easy to accidentally knock it off when inserting the CPU into the socket. And when you do that, it becomes easy to bend pins on the mobo. That's what happened to me. You need to be VERY careful when you are inserting a bare CPU into the socket with no IHS on top -- its so light that it's easy to bend pins when you attach the IHS. Anyway, I had to buy a new motherboard, which I got the other day and everything is working again.
> 
> When I got my new board, I didn't want to deal with a free floating IHS, so I sealed my CPU with silicone. Only problem is that 3 of my cores (even at stock) were 80-90°C on Prime95 while one of the cores was chillin at 58°C. I knew that when you have cores that vary by 20+°C that you have a problem with either the IHS or the cooler being seated properly. So, I knew that I was going to have to delid AGAIN. So, I got in there and delidded with my trusty Stanley razor blade. Luckily the Permatex black silicone came off MUCH easier than the factory stuff. I cleaned it all up, reapplied the NT-H1 to the die and reattached the IHS. Then I went and dropped them both (without sealing the IHS) onto the mobo.
> 
> I opened prime95 and ran it again. Temps were 45-50°C on all cores. LOL. Like a 40°C drop. Why? My sealing job with my first delid was crappy and uneven.
> 
> What's my point in telling you kids this story? *BUY A DELID TOOL.* Do not waste your time and money like I have done. It is worth the $40 if you can find the Rockit88 tool (be sure and get the Relid tool add-on as well). It is not only a pain in the izzle to delid with a razor but it's even HARDER to relid and properly seal the IHS unless you have the proper relid tool.


Ye get an even fit for the IHS is important. But not even a delid tool will save you from overtighten your cooler. I bent my 6700k like half a mm and lost 10% floating point math because i overtighten the screws. My recommendation is to buy ryzen with faster memory no reason to support Intel uber greedy practices.


----------



## TahoeDust

Who is going to be the first member, besides Silicon Lottery, to nut up and delid a Skylake X?


----------



## Silicon Lottery

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TahoeDust*
> 
> Who is going to be the first member, besides Silicon Lottery, to nut up and delid a Skylake X?


Why don't I count?


----------



## TahoeDust

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silicon Lottery*
> 
> Why don't I count?


Because you won't let me send you mine to delid!


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Silicon Lottery*
> 
> Why don't I count?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TahoeDust*
> 
> Because you won't let me send you mine to delid!


Hehehe....


----------



## YOONdawg

So i never delid before but already purchases my rockit88...and have Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and Kryonaut with ArticClean kit and lastly permatex ultra black in the Amazon cart.

Why the heck am I being so scared!!! People on this forum seem pretty chill about it nowadays but people from linus tech tips amd other forums are shouting for no!!! I watched multiple videos using this delidding tool and the process from start to finish. Is this really not worth going for?? 15-20 temp gain seems pretty dope.

Sorry if im being repetitive to some other reply or thread. I tried but this thread is wayyy too Long to go through n I'm a noob here


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YOONdawg*
> 
> So i never delid before but already purchases my rockit88...and have Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and Kryonaut with ArticClean kit and lastly permatex ultra black in the Amazon cart.
> 
> Why the heck am I being so scared!!! People on this forum seem pretty chill about it nowadays but people from linus tech tips amd other forums are shouting for no!!! I watched multiple videos using this delidding tool and the process from start to finish. Is this really not worth going for?? 15-20 temp gain seems pretty dope.
> 
> Sorry if im being repetitive to some other reply or thread. I tried but this thread is wayyy too Long to go through n I'm a noob here


Its OK if you use a delid tool. Its only really dangerous if you are using a razor, vice or are very clumsy. Just do the right procedure and you'll be OK. If you're nervous, practice on some old vintage C2duo chips.


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YOONdawg*
> 
> So i never delid before but already purchases my rockit88...and have Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and Kryonaut with ArticClean kit and lastly permatex ultra black in the Amazon cart.
> 
> Why the heck am I being so scared!!! People on this forum seem pretty chill about it nowadays but people from linus tech tips amd other forums are shouting for no!!! I watched multiple videos using this delidding tool and the process from start to finish. Is this really not worth going for?? 15-20 temp gain seems pretty dope.
> 
> Sorry if im being repetitive to some other reply or thread. I tried but this thread is wayyy too Long to go through n I'm a noob here


Take your time, RTFM and trust yourself.

With a delidding tool, you can't make much mistakes. I just did a delid with a Delid-die-mate, and it's nothing compared to slamming a PCB taped on a vice with a hammer ? I mean, I've really taken my time, it took me 2 hours instead of 15 minutes to do the delidding...

Just do it ?


----------



## thiussat

I have a question: My IHS was put back on loose (no sealant), which means the motherboard socket latch is holding it down. I have reseated my CPU and IHS several times and each time I get good temps for a few days, then one core starts shooting up in temp (like core 1 will shoot to 99°C while the others are at 85ish). Again, it takes a few days for this to happen. When I first reseat, all the cores are within 1 or 2 degrees of each other no matter how long I run P95. But after a few days, one core ALWAYS starts getting hot. Why is this? I just don't see how my IHS could be moving under there.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I have a question: My IHS was put back on loose (no sealant), which means the motherboard socket latch is holding it down. I have reseated my CPU and IHS several times and each time I get good temps for a few days, then one core starts shooting up in temp (like core 1 will shoot to 99°C while the others are at 85ish). Again, it takes a few days for this to happen. When I first reseat, all the cores are within 1 or 2 degrees of each other no matter how long I run P95. But after a few days, one core ALWAYS starts getting hot. Why is this? I just don't see how my IHS could be moving under there.


The socket latch doesn't just apply downward pressure, it also has a little forward movement when the latch is being closed. So its possible that the IHS may have shifted a little during those reseats.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I have a question: My IHS was put back on loose (no sealant), which means the motherboard socket latch is holding it down. I have reseated my CPU and IHS several times and each time I get good temps for a few days, then one core starts shooting up in temp (like core 1 will shoot to 99°C while the others are at 85ish). Again, it takes a few days for this to happen. When I first reseat, all the cores are within 1 or 2 degrees of each other no matter how long I run P95. But after a few days, one core ALWAYS starts getting hot. Why is this? I just don't see how my IHS could be moving under there.


What are you using for tim/lm?


----------



## thiussat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> The socket latch doesn't just apply downward pressure, it also has a little forward movement when the latch is being closed. So its possible that the IHS may have shifted a little during those reseats.


It's happening even when I don't reseat. Like I can do a fresh reseat and the temps are perfect for a few days. Then suddenly one core is 30°C higher than the others (only under load) and stays that way. In other words, the IHS appears to be moving even after it's latched down with a cooler on top.


----------



## blaze2210

It shouldn't have any play to it while the latch is secured. That latch should be closing with a pretty good amount of pressure.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> It's happening even when I don't reseat. Like I can do a fresh reseat and the temps are perfect for a few days. Then suddenly one core is 30°C higher than the others (only under load) and stays that way. In other words, the IHS appears to be moving even after it's latched down with a cooler on top.


sounds like pumpout to me really

just like bluej asked
what TIM did you use

the IHS isn't moving


----------



## Dasboogieman

Does anyone know the following dimensions for the 7700k IHS?
1. IHS thickness
2. Total Height of the die

I'm getting a quote for a custom vapor chamber heats preader made.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> It's happening even when I don't reseat. Like I can do a fresh reseat and the temps are perfect for a few days. Then suddenly one core is 30°C higher than the others (only under load) and stays that way. In other words, the IHS appears to be moving even after it's latched down with a cooler on top.


Still didnt answer what paste youre using.


----------



## toggLesss

need some advice/guidance:

i delidded my 7700k using the Rockit 88 tool and it went perfect... CPU works fine; however, my idle temps are sitting around 35-40C and 100% load temps around 75-80C @ 1.12v on a stock cooler.
is this normal? it's been so long since i've used a stock cooler on anything. i typically watercool everything and my testing hyper 212 was being used at the time.

i used CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra on the die and just some extra EK ectotherm on the cpu for testing.

i wanted to stop by here for some guidance before i tried a 2nd take on the delid. any suggestions?


----------



## bfe_vern

Your idle temps won't change too much. You will notice the impact more on the loaded end. That being said stock fans don't do much for you there. Hyper 212 would be your bare minimum for air cooled.

I run the 7700k delidded with a Hyper 212 and get ~74c max running RB for 15mins. That's at 29c ambient. Planning on throwing a NH-D15 on it later. CLU on the die and Noctua's TIM on the IHS.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *toggLesss*
> 
> need some advice/guidance:
> 
> i delidded my 7700k using the Rockit 88 tool and it went perfect... CPU works fine; however, my idle temps are sitting around 35-40C and 100% load temps around 75-80C @ 1.12v on a stock cooler.
> is this normal? it's been so long since i've used a stock cooler on anything. i typically watercool everything and my testing hyper 212 was being used at the time.
> 
> i used CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra on the die and just some extra EK ectotherm on the cpu for testing.
> 
> i wanted to stop by here for some guidance before i tried a 2nd take on the delid. any suggestions?


The tiny little fan that intel provide is what youre using? Im surprised you're not throttling lol. Buy a hyper evo or noctua or something half decent, your temps will drop like crazy.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> The super glue james from rockit advices, i used it, its soft enough to be remove and cleansed with acetone and leave small to no gap, however dont use it like the silicone under the ihs, use it on the ihs corners just to make opposing dots so the ihs dont move. If you put between the pcb and ihs it probably will need you to soak the entire pcb on acethone to clean.


Yes I done the same. The glue is soft enough and if you used over the substrate and IHS you end up with almost no gap.

Running h110i max 1000rpm 5ghz 1.34 temps don't go over 65c


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *toggLesss*
> 
> need some advice/guidance:
> 
> i delidded my 7700k using the Rockit 88 tool and it went perfect... CPU works fine; however, my idle temps are sitting around 35-40C and 100% load temps around 75-80C @ 1.12v on a stock cooler.
> is this normal? it's been so long since i've used a stock cooler on anything. i typically watercool everything and my testing hyper 212 was being used at the time.
> 
> i used CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra on the die and just some extra EK ectotherm on the cpu for testing.
> 
> i wanted to stop by here for some guidance before i tried a 2nd take on the delid. any suggestions?


Tbh there isn't a stock cooler bundled with 7700k because it would trottle.

With a half decent cooler you can keep up.
I suspect even a good air cooler can maintain 5ghz delided


----------



## toggLesss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Tbh there isn't a stock cooler bundled with 7700k because it would trottle.
> 
> With a half decent cooler you can keep up.
> I suspect even a good air cooler can maintain 5ghz delided


10-4.
i went ahead and purchased an H55 just to have around for testing purposes. so we'll see what the temps look like with that installed.

thanks for the replies


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *toggLesss*
> 
> 10-4.
> i went ahead and purchased an H55 just to have around for testing purposes. so we'll see what the temps look like with that installed.
> 
> thanks for the replies


Per hwinfo even hammering p95 I can't get past 120w on chip only avx manage to get more power.
The real problem with this chip is that the surface area is very small so it's much harder to transfer heat fast enough, even using liquid metal.
On my h110 it usually runs package around 40c on small loads, and under full load around 65 just to show you how hard is to deal with thermal transfer on this chip.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Per hwinfo even hammering p95 I can't get past 120w on chip only avx manage to get more power.
> The real problem with this chip is that the surface area is very small so it's much harder to transfer heat fast enough, even using liquid metal.
> On my h110 it usually runs package around 40c on small loads, and under full load around 65 just to show you how hard is to deal with thermal transfer on this chip.


huh, what is your core/cache max power set to? its the one that you set a hex number, the max is 255.5 Set it to that and see if it can get over 120w.

*Update*
I have my 6700k overclocked to 4.4 (i know, not much) and volted at 1.264, and I see a max power draw of 103.8w in HWInfo running OCCT CPU Linpack with all logical cores enabled, 64 bit enabled, and AVX enabled with 25% memory...should really be hammering that CPU. Max temps are hitting 68-70c on the cores. I have Gelid GC X right now for TIM, waiting on some thread friends sending the rockit88 to put my Conductonaut on the die. I have the boost power set to 255.5, which is like 4096W of power...which our CPU will never hit.


----------



## stephenn82

ok, another update for you @postem I turned clock up to 4.5, vcore to 1.285 and same settings, power consumption went to 118w max from the 103. Temps spiked from 58-76c on cores. I think the thermal paste either pumped out a little (due to not having a relid kit from doing the razor method) or the paste is just drying up a bit, it has lived under the IHS for a few months now.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> huh, what is your core/cache max power set to? its the one that you set a hex number, the max is 255.5 Set it to that and see if it can get over 120w.
> 
> *Update*
> I have my 6700k overclocked to 4.4 (i know, not much) and volted at 1.264, and I see a max power draw of 103.8w in HWInfo running OCCT CPU Linpack with all logical cores enabled, 64 bit enabled, and AVX enabled with 25% memory...should really be hammering that CPU. Max temps are hitting 68-70c on the cores. I have Gelid GC X right now for TIM, waiting on some thread friends sending the rockit88 to put my Conductonaut on the die. I have the boost power set to 255.5, which is like 4096W of power...which our CPU will never hit.


Don't know which board you are using.
Last time I checked Intel xtu current limit was 250amp so it was not limited, but gonna confirm. Z170 fatality k6 asrock.

Cache 42 core 50x. 1.34v.bumped vccio a little for memory too, 3400 MHz clr 16.

I gonna check with a run of occt to give you the numbers. I had a 6700k, from that 7700k requires much less voltage to operate. I found a hardwall at 4.6 with my 6700.

Also current limit is amperes, so 250*1.34v (for example) would mean a maximum of 335w not 4000w.You would need +2000a to reach that under CPU voltages.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Don't know which board you are using.
> Last time I checked Intel xtu current limit was 250amp so it was not limited, but gonna confirm. Z170 fatality k6 asrock.
> 
> Cache 42 core 50x. 1.34v.bumped vccio a little for memory too, 3400 MHz clr 16.
> 
> I gonna check with a run of occt to give you the numbers. I had a 6700k, from that 7700k requires much less voltage to operate. I found a hardwall at 4.6 with my 6700.
> 
> Also current limit is amperes, so 250*1.34v (for example) would mean a maximum of 335w not 4000w.You would need +2000a to reach that under CPU voltages.


me too. Power hungry. Not swapping though. It will do 4.6 but requires too much voltage to keep stable. Evem 4.7 but i dont want to run 1.41v. I seen almost no difference between stable 4.4ghz and 4.6ghz in real world work other than less heat amd power used. Like 4.4 is my chips super sweet spot

Yes, its a theoretical number for 4096w. Open xtu and look at the power slider. Drag it all the way to the right so no limit. 4096w is what you get. My GPU woupd never come to the 68kW limit set in the delimited bios i have. Its a finite setting on an infinite limit that will not be reached, nor will it be a limiting factor of your equipment when overclocking to the max.

It would be almost 3000 amps to hit that power at 1.34v. 2985a to be exact. If we can get a consumer grade board to run that sort of juice
..why arent we living in space in large colonies??


----------



## kfxsti

@Smithsrt8
@Stephenn82
Just wanted to say thanks for all the help you guys have given me.
Got a i5-7600k coming (got for near to nothing thanks to some Amazon points) and will be doing my last delid for a very long while.
I will be hitting up whomever it was that had the cross country delid tool extravaganza post and adding my Rockit88 delid tool to it if they don't mind.


----------



## stephenn82

@wholeeo had it and get added to the list here, it may be coming from me









http://www.overclock.net/t/1627022/cross-country-rockit-delid-tool-extravaganza/


----------



## thiussat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> sounds like pumpout to me really
> 
> just like bluej asked
> what TIM did you use
> 
> the IHS isn't moving


I'm using NT-H1. Should I just order liquid metal?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I'm using NT-H1. Should I just order liquid metal?


Yes, yes and yes. NH-T1 is GARBAGE when using on bare die under the IHS about 95% of TIMs are. My temps shot up within a day, surprised yours lasted this long. Use either Kryonaut (its very thick) or just get the temps possible and get liquid metal.


----------



## thiussat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yes, yes and yes. NH-T1 is GARBAGE when using on bare die under the IHS about 95% of TIMs are. My temps shot up within a day, surprised yours lasted this long. Use either Kryonaut (its very thick) or just get the temps possible and get liquid metal.


Thank you. I googled "pump out effect" and now I think I understand my problem. Apparently NT-H1 is notorious for not lasting long when used on the bare die.

I must apologize to Corsair as well because I RMA'ed my H115i thinking I had a failing pump. The whole time my TIM was the problem due to the pesky "pump out" effect. It has the SAME exact symptoms of a failing water pump. I guess I learn something new everyday.









Another question: Are there any non-conductive pastes that don't suffer from this problem?


----------



## NiKiZ

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I'm using NT-H1. Should I just order liquid metal?


Yes. I used NT-H1 temporarily and it sucks. I had problems in a day. I replaced it with CLU and now my 6600K has been running at 4.8GHz for a year without any problems.

I used NT-H1 first. Everything seemed to work well with the NT-H1.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Well, I just delidded my i5 6600K. I don't have Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra yet, so I used some Noctua NT-H1. I was a bit surprised by the 15 degrees Celsius temperature drop!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> Just delidded
> 
> 
> Cleaned it up a bit
> 
> 
> Before delidding:
> 
> 
> After delid:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'll have to see, if I can overclock this a bit more.


One day later I hit 100 Celsius on one of the cores..
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> Damn, you were right. The NT-H1 doesn't last that well on the die. I hit 100 Celsius on one of the cores today.
> 
> 
> I get some money on Thursday and I'll order some CLU then. I guess I have to replace the paste daily until then..


It just got worse after about a week.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NiKiZ*
> 
> 1 week of running my delidded 6600K with Noctua NT-H1 on the die and the temperatures instantly goes to 100 degrees Celsius and the computer crashes when running IntelBurnTest at 4.8GHz. Not good. The CLU comes in 2 days, which will solve this problem.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> Thank you. I googled "pump out effect" and now I think I understand my problem. Apparently NT-H1 is notorious for not lasting long when used on the bare die.
> 
> I must apologize to Corsair as well because I RMA'ed my H115i thinking I had a failing pump. The whole time my TIM was the problem due to the pesky "pump out" effect. It has the SAME exact symptoms of a failing water pump. I guess I learn something new everyday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another question: Are there any non-conductive pastes that don't suffer from this problem?


A very VERY small amount, from what ive tried over the period of 2months is that at some point most of em pump out. Liquid metal for bare die is absolutely the best, i even ran it bare die with liquid metal and my waterblock for 6months and had ZERO issues so its safe. Provided you apply it right the conductivity of LM isn't a problem. Has to be applied very thinly like your applying nail polish to a womans nails.


----------



## YOONdawg

Quick question! This may sound very stupid but all the searches turned out blank anyways, when applying the liquid metal on IHS side, how do i know where the boundary is? Is it just by guesstimation? Or will there be smudges from original TIM? Or it doesnt really matter cause there is slight gap with the RTV? Thanks!


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> I'm using NT-H1. Should I just order liquid metal?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Yes, yes and yes. NH-T1 is GARBAGE when using on bare die under the IHS about 95% of TIMs are. My temps shot up within a day, surprised yours lasted this long. Use either Kryonaut (its very thick) or just get the temps possible and get liquid metal.


Kryonaut suffers from pump out as well...about a day from my experience. This was on a direct die mount though.

Only TIM I know of that specifically advertised resistant to pump-out is Xigmatek's PTI-G4512; which is now discontinued. It did not pump out and despite it's very low thermal conductance rating working just about as good as Kryonaut temp wise.

Just get some CLU or Conductonaut...performance difference between the 2 is negligible.


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *YOONdawg*
> 
> Quick question! This may sound very stupid but all the searches turned out blank anyways, when applying the liquid metal on IHS side, how do i know where the boundary is? Is it just by guesstimation? Or will there be smudges from original TIM? Or it doesnt really matter cause there is slight gap with the RTV? Thanks!


Put the LM on the die and set the IHS back down on the die - make sure it's clean first. The LM on the die will leave a slight shadow on the IHS to use as a guide where to apply the LM on the IHS.


----------



## YOONdawg

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> Put the LM on the die and set the IHS back down on the die - make sure it's clean first. The LM on the die will leave a slight shadow on the IHS to use as a guide where to apply the LM on the IHS.


Thanks!this makes alot of sense


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> me too. Power hungry. Not swapping though. It will do 4.6 but requires too much voltage to keep stable. Evem 4.7 but i dont want to run 1.41v. I seen almost no difference between stable 4.4ghz and 4.6ghz in real world work other than less heat amd power used. Like 4.4 is my chips super sweet spot
> 
> Yes, its a theoretical number for 4096w. Open xtu and look at the power slider. Drag it all the way to the right so no limit. 4096w is what you get. My GPU woupd never come to the 68kW limit set in the delimited bios i have. Its a finite setting on an infinite limit that will not be reached, nor will it be a limiting factor of your equipment when overclocking to the max.
> 
> It would be almost 3000 amps to hit that power at 1.34v. 2985a to be exact. If we can get a consumer grade board to run that sort of juice
> ..why arent we living in space in large colonies??


Hi stephen as i said, below the numbers.
Current limit is set to 250A, its stock so no problem at all.

HWinfo says Max draw 127W, this under prime95 AVX FFT 8K.
Just a side note i can only run latest P95 FFT AVX without a failure. This thing is a hell to stablilize, i would need endless voltage to keep it stable.
Since i validated it with realbench 12h, several runs of OCCT, XTU, and some others, im not taking P95 AVX as a measure of stability, even because i have very few AVX usage.
P95 without AVX FFT runs without issues.

Draw under OCCT is usually much lower, even doing linpack is lower. P95 is absolute insane.
Max temperature today is around 70-75, should peak around 75C after an hour on prime. Current on H110i 1000rpm, 20C room temperature.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> me too. Power hungry. Not swapping though. It will do 4.6 but requires too much voltage to keep stable. Evem 4.7 but i dont want to run 1.41v. I seen almost no difference between stable 4.4ghz and 4.6ghz in real world work other than less heat amd power used. Like 4.4 is my chips super sweet spot
> 
> Yes, its a theoretical number for 4096w. Open xtu and look at the power slider. Drag it all the way to the right so no limit. 4096w is what you get. My GPU woupd never come to the 68kW limit set in the delimited bios i have. Its a finite setting on an infinite limit that will not be reached, nor will it be a limiting factor of your equipment when overclocking to the max.
> 
> It would be almost 3000 amps to hit that power at 1.34v. 2985a to be exact. If we can get a consumer grade board to run that sort of juice
> ..why arent we living in space in large colonies??


Hi stephen as i said, below the numbers.
Current limit is set to 250A, its stock so no problem at all.

HWinfo says Max draw 127W, this under prime95 AVX FFT 8K.
Just a side note i can only run latest P95 FFT AVX without a failure. This thing is a hell to stablilize, i would need endless voltage to keep it stable.
Since i validated it with realbench 12h, several runs of OCCT, XTU, and some others, im not taking P95 AVX as a measure of stability, even because i have very few AVX usage.
P95 without AVX FFT runs without issues.

Draw under OCCT is usually much lower, even doing linpack is lower. P95 is absolute insane.
Max temperature today is around 70-75, should peak around 75C after an hour on prime. Current on H110i 1000rpm, 20C room temperature.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> Put the LM on the die and set the IHS back down on the die - make sure it's clean first. The LM on the die will leave a slight shadow on the IHS to use as a guide where to apply the LM on the IHS.


To be fair, the biggest reason to use liquid metal on die is durability. It's good too for better thermal conductivity but the real issue on Intel CPUs is the gap induced by silicone. I hate Intel can't sort this ****.

I'm rocking clu for almost a year no signs of degradation. Be ware that using it on laptops is completely different.

The only tim I know that resists is the Tim Intel uses, it seen to be Corning.
I saw some ppl reporting gelid lasting at least a few weeks but I would just use liquid metal. A very small amount is all you need, and the lack of components on top substrate you don't even need to tape.


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> To be fair, the biggest reason to use liquid metal on die is durability. It's good too for better thermal conductivity but the real issue on Intel CPUs is the gap induced by silicone. I hate Intel can't sort this ****.


As I've mentioned before, my IHS contacts the die well before it contacts the substrate. The gap around the edge of the IHS is determined by the height of the die, not by the glue around the edges - the gap would be the same if silicone, super glue, or chewing gum was used to secure the IHS to the substrate.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> As I've mentioned before, my IHS contacts the die well before it contacts the substrate. The gap around the edge of the IHS is determined by the height of the die, not by the glue around the edges - the gap would be the same if silicone, super glue, or chewing gum was used to secure the IHS to the substrate.


Thats only one case out of, see if you can get this, MILLIONS. Doesn't mean its the same for everyone, I've even received chips for customer installs that were double siliconed, thats right they ended up with two layers of glue.

Its a case by case problem, some people will drop 20-30°C from a delid some will barely see 10°C, there's quite a huge variance in manufacturing tolerances.


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

More than one case, just doing a search in this forum for the word "spin" returns numerous hits of IHS spinning on the die.

If nothing else, this points to variations in the manufacturing process, not " the real issue on Intel CPUs is the gap induced by silicone".


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> More than one case, just doing a search in this forum for the word "spin" returns numerous hits of IHS spinning on the die.
> 
> If nothing else, this points to variations in the manufacturing process, not " the real issue on Intel CPUs is the gap induced by silicone".


Well its been proven more then once, i myself have tested a dozen plus TIMs and guess what? The top 3 all returned IDENTICAL temps then liquid metal has, and when i mean identical i dont mean a degree off, i mean exactly the same. for devils canyon, kaby lake and skylake.

Reason to go liquid metal is because it actually lasts, its WAY more reliable.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Thats only one case out of, see if you can get this, MILLIONS. Doesn't mean its the same for everyone, I've even received chips for customer installs that were double siliconed, thats right they ended up with two layers of glue.
> 
> Its a case by case problem, some people will drop 20-30°C from a delid some will barely see 10°C, there's quite a huge variance in manufacturing tolerances.


Lol, mine was spinning on my die as well. In fact, I can put electrical tape under the IHS and it would still spin. I would definitely check this before doing anything. High chance of crushing the die by accident.


----------



## toggLesss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *toggLesss*
> 
> need some advice/guidance:
> 
> i delidded my 7700k using the Rockit 88 tool and it went perfect... CPU works fine; however, my idle temps are sitting around 35-40C and 100% load temps around 75-80C @ 1.12v on a stock cooler.
> is this normal? it's been so long since i've used a stock cooler on anything. i typically watercool everything and my testing hyper 212 was being used at the time.
> 
> i used CoolLaboratory Liquid Ultra on the die and just some extra EK ectotherm on the cpu for testing.
> 
> i wanted to stop by here for some guidance before i tried a 2nd take on the delid. any suggestions?


UPDATE:

I put the newly acquired H55 on the 7700k and fired her up.

*Stock Clocks @ 1.12v*
Idle: 25-30C
Prime95 (v26.6) Small FFT: 53-54C (package)

*5.0GHz @ 1.30v*
Idle: 27-32C
Prime95 (v26.6) Small FFT: 62-65C (package)

I pushed for a 5.2GHz @ 1.35v but it wasnt very stable, im sure i could get it there with decent temps, but i was in a hurry & really just wanted to make sure the delid was actually successful. So im content with 5.0Ghz @ 1.30v and temps not going over 65C.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *toggLesss*
> 
> UPDATE:
> 
> I put the newly acquired H55 on the 7700k and fired her up.
> 
> *Stock Clocks @ 1.12v*
> Idle: 25-30C
> Prime95 (v26.6) Small FFT: 53-54C (package)
> 
> *5.0GHz @ 1.30v*
> Idle: 27-32C
> Prime95 (v26.6) Small FFT: 62-65C (package)
> 
> I pushed for a 5.2GHz @ 1.35v but it wasnt very stable, im sure i could get it there with decent temps, but i was in a hurry & really just wanted to make sure the delid was actually successful. So im content with 5.0Ghz @ 1.30v and temps not going over 65C.


Yeah that's almost identical to what my 7700K does. You should be able to get 5.3+ before needing 1.4V but the temps start scaling poorly. I've gone back to 5.0 as well for long-term... because it's not like another 300MHz is visible ever - other than benchmarks.

Great gains on the cooling side though... I'm sure at 5.0GHz & 1.30V you'd have been hitting the stops at 100C if you hadn't delidded. I know I was.


----------



## toggLesss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Yeah that's almost identical to what my 7700K does. You should be able to get 5.3+ before needing 1.4V but the temps start scaling poorly. I've gone back to 5.0 as well for long-term... because it's not like another 300MHz is visible ever - other than benchmarks.
> 
> Great gains on the cooling side though... I'm sure at 5.0GHz & 1.30V you'd have been hitting the stops at 100C if you hadn't delidded. I know I was.


Oh i wasnt even able to get past 4.8ghz for nothing on my stock chip with a custom loop.


----------



## Rei86

Question:

I have a 4790K that I delidded because I wanted to have stable clocks above 4.5
After delidding the little guy and putting on some Coollaboratory Ultra or pro (don't remember) put it back in with a Kraken X61... and I did nothing.

Last night I decided to finaly run something on it and went ahead and set the Voltage to 1.35 (adaptive) and pushed it to 4.8
Ran Prime95 and I'm getting read out from CAM software that my core voltage is actually reading at 1.41 and the chip is at 478X.XXMHz.
So after letting it run for awhile nothing catastrophic happened and the all the cores settled at 72c high and 69c low when all cores are loaded.
Just wondering if the temps I'm getting you would all consider to be normal for a delidded 4790K?


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> As I've mentioned before, my IHS contacts the die well before it contacts the substrate. The gap around the edge of the IHS is determined by the height of the die, not by the glue around the edges - the gap would be the same if silicone, super glue, or chewing gum was used to secure the IHS to the substrate.


But you managed to get better thermals after the dellid? We know intel TIM have poor conductivity.
If diferent manufacturing heights on die are a reality, to the point it induces a gap, there is a reason for intel not doing a lot of pressure when sealing with silicone, or they could lose some to cracking.

Even with the poor thermal conductivity of intel TIM, i cant believe only better paste (CLU) that allowed me to shave 25C.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> More than one case, just doing a search in this forum for the word "spin" returns numerous hits of IHS spinning on the die.
> 
> If nothing else, this points to variations in the manufacturing process, not " the real issue on Intel CPUs is the gap induced by silicone".


Sorry for me iliteracy, but what you mean with spinning? I tried to search but it returned a lot of fan spin, obviously its not the matter.


----------



## socalmvp

Hi all,

I delidded my I7-7700K using Rockit Cool. Now I want to delid my I5-4670K. My questions are:

Is it safe to use Rockit Cool on I5-4670K and is it worth it like with the 7700K?

Has anyone done it with 4670K and what kind of temp drops or OC where you able to get?

Thanks


----------



## toggLesss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *socalmvp*
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I delidded my I7-7700K using Rockit Cool. Now I want to delid my I5-4670K. My questions are:
> 
> Is it safe to use Rockit Cool on I5-4670K and is it worth it like with the 7700K?
> 
> Has anyone done it with 4670K and what kind of temp drops or OC where you able to get?
> 
> Thanks


im pretty sure it's safe with both 1151 and 1150 sockets... may have to research it, but i swear i read/heard that somewhere whilst looking at tutorials and reviews.


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> More than one case, just doing a search in this forum for the word "spin" returns numerous hits of IHS spinning on the die.
> 
> If nothing else, this points to variations in the manufacturing process, not " the real issue on Intel CPUs is the gap induced by silicone".
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry for me iliteracy, but what you mean with spinning? I tried to search but it returned a lot of fan spin, obviously its not the matter.
Click to expand...

Edit:
Image from peter2k:

As posted in this thread by peter2k:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1629611/pcgamer-intel-tells-core-i7-7700k-owners-to-stop-overclocking-to-avoid-high-temps/200#post_26080749


----------



## GnarlyCharlie

Yeah, thanks Comissar









Spinning is just where the IHS contacts the die before the substrate, you can check that it's not bottoming out on the substrate (and thus leaving a gap between die and IHS) by spinning the IHS on the die.

If the IHS is contacting the die before the substrate, then it would seem that the glue used to hold the IHS down is not inducing any gap.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *toggLesss*
> 
> UPDATE:
> 
> I put the newly acquired H55 on the 7700k and fired her up.
> 
> *Stock Clocks @ 1.12v*
> Idle: 25-30C
> Prime95 (v26.6) Small FFT: 53-54C (package)
> 
> *5.0GHz @ 1.30v*
> Idle: 27-32C
> Prime95 (v26.6) Small FFT: 62-65C (package)
> 
> I pushed for a 5.2GHz @ 1.35v but it wasnt very stable, im sure i could get it there with decent temps, but i was in a hurry & really just wanted to make sure the delid was actually successful. So im content with 5.0Ghz @ 1.30v and temps not going over 65C.


Have you made a submission for the club?


----------



## toggLesss

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Have you made a submission for the club?


Dont tempt me with a good time...


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GnarlyCharlie*
> 
> Yeah, thanks Comissar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spinning is just where the IHS contacts the die before the substrate, you can check that it's not bottoming out on the substrate (and thus leaving a gap between die and IHS) by spinning the IHS on the die.
> 
> If the IHS is contacting the die before the substrate, then it would seem that the glue used to hold the IHS down is not inducing any gap.


since its my IHS

I tried my best to find out if the boarder of the IHS is floating on the substrate

the bottom of the IHS isn't actually very wide
I think to remember the effect between 2 perfect surfaces and a floating effect from physics but can't remember the name any more
still me thinks that only catered to, not only very perfect surfaces, but also needing a certain area

by turning it so it had the least area on the substrate I was able to glide it sideways
wobbling the IHS made a definitive feel of resting in the middle

since I'm using a custom IHS I can have a looksie on the bottom of my old IHS later on, but the boarder was rather thin


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

I have a Gigabyte GA-Z270-HD3 motherboard, and I've been tinkering with the fan curves in the Smartfan 5 menu in the bios. It's been working great! Until a day or two ago...

Seemingly, my fans (CPU, and 3 case fans, all PWM on PWM/hybrid headers) are no longer ramping up as it gets hotter. I just did a couple of stress tests in Aida64 and OCCT, and both times CPU got to about 75-80 very quickly and the CPU fan stayed at it's base around 500rpm (as monitored by Aida64 and HWinfo)

I have fairly aggressive fan profiles setup in my Gigabyte Bios (Smart Fan 5 in the bios) and it should be ramping up pretty quick. It certainly did until now/whenever this started. Checking the fans in bios, they respond to manual adjustments while within the bios, but don't actually spin up based on temperature when in windows. They're all PWM fans on PWM headers and like I said they were working fine until I noticed this.

So the fans are spinning, and they are capable of going at max (I switched it to 'full fan speed' in Bios briefly and yup, they all worked fine at max).

AFAIK I haven't installed or tinkered with anything in Windows that should affect CPU/case fans. But it just suddenly started happening. What could it be?!

Any ideas?? Please help! If someone actually solves this for me, without resorting to a Windows reformat (if that's even the issue) I'll give them $10. lol.

*EDIT*: This is what Smart Fan looks like


http://imgur.com/f7rho

 ....shouldn't there be fans here?


----------



## Unknownm

so this happened today



*THIS IS WHAT 3 YEARS OF DEVIL CANYON PASTE LOOKS LIKE*




no Liquid pro yet but just ordered. FIRST POST failed on me with 03 error.

Re-seating CPU fixed this. Thank god


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Liquidsrightarm*
> 
> So the fans are spinning, and they are capable of going at max (I switched it to 'full fan speed' in Bios briefly and yup, they all worked fine at max).


I'm using an Asus, so I can't relate completely, but there is something that comes to my mind

I can switch to different temp sensors that control the fan speed (like not even CPU based, VRM for instance)
maybe there is something there

otherwise
mmm

clearing CMOS, or loading default settings in BIOS?


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Unknownm*
> 
> so this happened today
> 
> *THIS IS WHAT 3 YEARS OF DEVIL CANYON PASTE LOOKS LIKE*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no Liquid pro yet but just ordered. FIRST POST failed on me with 03 error.
> 
> Re-seating CPU fixed this. Thank god


This paste looks good.
I remember my devil canyon used to run cool 4.7 it was a really good process on Intel, unlike newer CPUs my kaby was really very shoody.


----------



## Liquidsrightarm

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I'm using an Asus, so I can't relate completely, but there is something that comes to my mind
> 
> I can switch to different temp sensors that control the fan speed (like not even CPU based, VRM for instance)
> maybe there is something there
> 
> otherwise
> mmm
> 
> clearing CMOS, or loading default settings in BIOS?


Surely it MUST be either a Windows or BIOS issue - I mean the temp sensors work and the fans clearly work. So clearing bios is my next step - is removing the battery the only way? Is there no way to reset it from within Bios? I only see a "Load optimized defaults" option in my Gigabyte mobo.

Still really at a loss here as to what could have caused it.


----------



## thiussat

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Unknownm*
> 
> no Liquid pro yet but just ordered.


Yeah, you wont see the real changes until you get the liquid ultra in. I used normal thermal paste on my die for a while and it always lasted about 24 hours before my temps went to 100C. I RMA'ed my liquid cooler thinking it was going bad. Turns out that some normal pastes cant be used on the die (they give out after a day or two). You need liquid metal.

I will say, though, that since you used the razorblade method (as I did), it can be hard to properly apply the liquid pro to the IHS and then get it lined up just right with the die. You will see cores running hotter than others unless you spread that stuff evenly on both the die and the IHS. My core #1 is running 10°C hotter than my other cores under load.

Running P95 (with AVX), my coolest core is sitting high 50's, which is pretty amazing even if I am only at 1.275v. My hottest core hits about 70°C. Again, I can probably reapply and fix it, but since I am nowhere close to a danger zone, I am fine with it.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *thiussat*
> 
> Yeah, you wont see the real changes until you get the liquid ultra in. I used normal thermal paste on my die for a while and it always lasted about 24 hours before my temps went to 100C. I RMA'ed my liquid cooler thinking it was going bad. Turns out that some normal pastes cant be used on the die (they give out after a day or two). You need liquid metal.
> 
> I will say, though, that since you used the razorblade method (as I did), it can be hard to properly apply the liquid pro to the IHS and then get it lined up just right with the die. You will see cores running hotter than others unless you spread that stuff evenly on both the die and the IHS. My core #1 is running 10°C hotter than my other cores under load.
> 
> Running P95 (with AVX), my coolest core is sitting high 50's, which is pretty amazing even if I am only at 1.275v. My hottest core hits about 70°C. Again, I can probably reapply and fix it, but since I am nowhere close to a danger zone, I am fine with it.


Going from a good tim to liquid metal you wont see much temp change. For me at stock, then 1.2 and 1.3v the temps were the same for both. Noctua kept it at 47°C under load and liquid metal was 47°C as well. Don't expect your temps to go shooting down even more, its possible but dont hold your breath lol.


----------



## SDBolts619

So, just figured I'd drop a note here - my delidded 3770k has now been running at 4.5ghz for more than four years now with no issues at all. Finally upgraded the graphics card on the rig last weekend and figure that CPU is good for another couple of years easily at this point...


----------



## Ellner357

So I pulled the razor out tonight to give this a try. Went well, didn't ruin anything and I'm a little confused. I used artic mx-4 thermal paste and my temperatures are exactly the same as before I delided. I have read some things saying the thermal paste is good enough other saying that I need liquid metal. I figured with the thermal paste I'd still be better off than stock before my liquid metal gets bought. Any insight?


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ellner357*
> 
> So I pulled the razor out tonight to give this a try. Went well, didn't ruin anything and I'm a little confused. I used artic mx-4 thermal paste and my temperatures are exactly the same as before I delided. I have read some things saying the thermal paste is good enough other saying that I need liquid metal. I figured with the thermal paste I'd still be better off than stock before my liquid metal gets bought. Any insight?


You need liquid metal. You just replaced one paste with another.


----------



## Ellner357

Well at least the hard part is done. I was under the impression that the stock thermal paste was extremely poor quality so a decent one would still net some gains. The conductive nature of liquid metal does make me nervous.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> You need liquid metal. You just replaced one paste with another.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ellner357*
> 
> So I pulled the razor out tonight to give this a try. Went well, didn't ruin anything and I'm a little confused. I used artic mx-4 thermal paste and my temperatures are exactly the same as before I delided. I have read some things saying the thermal paste is good enough other saying that I need liquid metal. I figured with the thermal paste I'd still be better off than stock before my liquid metal gets bought. Any insight?


And people still think thermal paste is the issue lol. Pretty much the top 5 pastes and liquid metals will all give you the same temps. Its still funny to me that people think going from paste to liquid will drop another like 10°C lol. The only reason to use liquid metal isn't for temps but for reliability.


----------



## Ellner357

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And people still think thermal paste is the issue lol. Pretty much the top 5 pastes and liquid metals will all give you the same temps. Its still funny to me that people think going from paste to liquid will drop another like 10°C lol. The only reason to use liquid metal isn't for temps but for reliability.


That's why I find it strange u have 0 change in temp. Maybe I used too much thermal paste? I'm pulling it appart tonight to see what's what.

As far as liquid metal goes. Is there something I can coat the back if the pcb with so I'm less worried about the conductivity of the stuff?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ellner357*
> 
> That's why I find it strange u have 0 change in temp. Maybe I used too much thermal paste? I'm pulling it appart tonight to see what's what.
> 
> As far as liquid metal goes. Is there something I can coat the back if the pcb with so I'm less worried about the conductivity of the stuff?


If you convert it from K to C its not much difference, turns out to be .08w/mC and .36w/mC instead of 8w/mK and 36w/mK the difference seems much greater in Kelvin. Its why it also surprises me that people think changing TIM will get you a 10°C difference lol.

Even for GPUs theres not much difference, only reason changing the TIM makes a difference is because its better the cheap garbage used by GPU manufacturers, Intel gets **** for it (even though the TIM isnt really the problem) but GPU makes don't and they use the same weak sauce garbage TIM.


----------



## Ellner357

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> If you convert it from K to C its not much difference, turns out to be .08w/mC and .36w/mC instead of 8w/mK and 36w/mK the difference seems much greater in Kelvin. Its why it also surprises me that people think changing TIM will get you a 10°C difference lol.
> 
> Even for GPUs theres not much difference, only reason changing the TIM makes a difference is because its better the cheap garbage used by GPU manufacturers, Intel gets **** for it (even though the TIM isnt really the problem) but GPU makes don't and they use the same weak sauce garbage TIM.


So if the distance from what I gather is more important than the thermal paste, would it be wise to grab some sand paper and follow a procedure like lapping to get the IHS even closer to the chip?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ellner357*
> 
> So if the distance from what I gather is more important than the thermal paste, would it be wise to grab some sand paper and follow a procedure like lapping to get the IHS even closer to the chip?


Depends if it sits close to the die already or not. Some 7700k owners have theirs that spin on the die (meaning it contacts the die before even contacting the wafter), which puts more pressure on the center then on the sides and could slightly warp the pcb (will still function just fine anyways) and some have a 30°C drop after a delid because of the gap between the die and IHS being too big.

Lapping the top of the IHS and the bottom of the heatsink/waterblock will give even more temp drops because of the convex nature of the IHS and heatsink already. I would do it but my temps are plenty low already lol.


----------



## Ellner357

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Depends if it sits close to the die already or not. Some 7700k owners have theirs that spin on the die (meaning it contacts the die before even contacting the wafter), which puts more pressure on the center then on the sides and could slightly warp the pcb (will still function just fine anyways) and some have a 30°C drop after a delid because of the gap between the die and IHS being too big.
> 
> Lapping the top of the IHS and the bottom of the heatsink/waterblock will give even more temp drops because of the convex nature of the IHS and heatsink already. I would do it but my temps are plenty low already lol.


That makes sense, I'll see if mine makes contact or not might be be worth lapping for the top and taking a hair of the bottom too. Times like this I wish I had a little plastic gauge laying around to see what my gaps are.

If I go with liquid metal is there anything I can put on the back of the pcb like clear nail polish to make me feel better about the idea of putting something conductive in there?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ellner357*
> 
> That makes sense, I'll see if mine makes contact or not might be be worth lapping for the top and taking a hair of the bottom too. Times like this I wish I had a little plastic gauge laying around to see what my gaps are.
> 
> If I go with liquid metal is there anything I can put on the back of the pcb like clear nail polish to make me feel better about the idea of putting something conductive in there?


The layer has to be thin so youll be perfectly fine anyway. The back of the pcb youll never get liquid metal to run there, if you do you put like the entire tube on there haha. Clear nail polish is good but for parts that get hot it might trap heat i wouldnt keep it.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> The layer has to be thin so youll be perfectly fine anyway. The back of the pcb youll never get liquid metal to run there, if you do you put like the entire tube on there haha. Clear nail polish is good but for parts that get hot it might trap heat i wouldnt keep it.


The main danger with the LMs on a GPU isn't really during the application, it's more during the removal. If you get careless while removing the LM from the die, then you get greeted with something like the following when you boot up....



Not very fun times, as there isn't really any coming back from that. In the future, I'll be taping off that gap around the GPU die before I start removing LM from the die. While you're using the GPU though, that LM isn't going anywhere.


----------



## Ellner357

Well that's good to know I'm going to be super careful when I try it. I did another application of the Arctic MX-4 and got similar temps to before the delid with the exception of one core. I was getting 85 - 90 - 90 - 88 before the delid. Now I'm getting 78 - 88 - 92 - 88. So one core is showing the gains I'd expect lol. The lid is close enough that it spins on the die now that it's been delided. I dunno I feel like I may end up have taking a big risk for no gains. Let's see how the liquid metal pays off.......


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ellner357*
> 
> So I pulled the razor out tonight to give this a try. Went well, didn't ruin anything and I'm a little confused. I used artic mx-4 thermal paste and my temperatures are exactly the same as before I delided. I have read some things saying the thermal paste is good enough other saying that I need liquid metal. I figured with the thermal paste I'd still be better off than stock before my liquid metal gets bought. Any insight?


Yeah, get gelid gc extreme or thermal grizzly kryonaut. Liquid metal if you dare, conductonaut is best


----------



## reqq

MX2 doesnt seem to work on the die, good temp then after a couple of days it goes mad. Ordered Liquida Ultra. Are you guys running that on cooler aswell or only on the die? I have a cooper face so it should be good to liquid ultra on that?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Yeah, get gelid gc extreme or thermal grizzly kryonaut. Liquid metal if you dare, conductonaut is best


Ok seriously can we stop recommending thermal pastes for on die, its been tested over the past decade that it just flat out does not work and pumps out within a day. Best and only stuff to use on die is liquid metal PERIOD. There really is no danger unless youre a total tool who can't apply it correctly lol.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ok seriously can we stop recommending thermal pastes for on die, its been tested over the past decade that it just flat out does not work and pumps out within a day. Best and only stuff to use on die is liquid metal PERIOD. There really is no danger unless youre a total tool who can't apply it correctly lol.


C'mon don't be so harsh.. it's also been proven over the past decade that Intel paste is the true and only one that holds and lasts on the dye







and in that regards it's the best


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> C'mon don't be so harsh.. it's also been proven over the past decade that Intel paste is the true and only one that holds and lasts on the dye
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and in that regards it's the best


In that regard sure, even wonder why its the best in that regard and lasts on the dye? Because theres no pressure from the IHS, and why is there no pressure from the IHS? Ding ding ding we have a winner, because the silicone keeps the IHS off the die. Intel could easily solder it but it may be too difficult for them to do so, they could also use liquid metal but again, would cost way too much and pretty sure robot application of that would need new robots more then likely.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*


And / Or Intel is simply earning more from warranty invalidation than it would from soldering and market share lost (people switching to ryzen) caused by the crap thermal transfer and no OC headroom...


----------



## DerComissar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Ok seriously can we stop recommending thermal pastes for on die, its been tested over the past decade that it just flat out does not work and pumps out within a day. Best and only stuff to use on die is liquid metal PERIOD. There really is no danger unless youre a total tool who can't apply it correctly lol.


This.^

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> In that regard sure, even wonder why its the best in that regard and lasts on the dye? Because theres no pressure from the IHS, and why is there no pressure from the IHS? Ding ding ding we have a winner, because the silicone keeps the IHS off the die. Intel could easily solder it but it may be too difficult for them to do so, they could also use liquid metal but again, would cost way too much and pretty sure robot application of that would need new robots more then likely.


And this.^

Rep+


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> And / Or Intel is simply earning more from warranty invalidation than it would from soldering and market share lost (people switching to ryzen) caused by the crap thermal transfer and no OC headroom...


Ill tell you one thing, I've rarely seen Intel or AMD CPUs needing warranty, and if they do its never been invalidated. I've sent a few that were delided that weren't invalidated. I even removed the liquid metal and put TIM back on and sent it back sealed in the corners and didnt have issues. I think its just a myth that floats around the forums.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DerComissar*
> 
> This.^
> And this.^
> 
> Rep+


At this point, Intel should just ditch the stupid IHS and go with bare die + Aluminium shim like what the GPUs do now. No solder, no glue, no mess. If people are stupid, its immediately obvious.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> At this point, Intel should just ditch the stupid IHS and go with bare die + Aluminium shim like what the GPUs do now. No solder, no glue, no mess. If people are stupid, its immediately obvious.


Aluminum is a piss poor heat conductor, 99% of GPUs use nickel plated copper, or bare copper even better.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*


I disagree and not based on what I have heard but on my own experience...
I killed not one...but couple of CPU's so far...all delided and luckily all got replaced by the STORE not by Intel.. so just myself, a single individual..burned a 4 figure hole in a company capital..
Now imagine that at a global scale...and also stretch the imagination and bare in mind that CPU's that do not require delid still dye cause of the same cause, that being OC... and those CPU's need to be replaced by someone...
So my assumption is not that far.

I didn't see any dead CPU's either.. but lately it happens and its a real thing that need to be acknowledge. So I stand by what I said previously in regards to why Intel is not shifting away from the dodgy paste or practices... It's almost like they invite us all to Deliding


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Aluminum is a piss poor heat conductor, 99% of GPUs use nickel plated copper, or bare copper even better.


As in direct die contact with the cooler, that is the best thermal contact outside of a small vapor chamber heatspreader (which won't work well if oriented vertically). The Aluminium shim is only running around the edges to prevent over-pressure on mounting.

http://www.tweaktown.com/image.php?image=imagescdn.tweaktown.com/news/5/8/58246_01_amd-radeon-vega-frontier-pcb-shots-surface.jpg

E.g. like what AMD has done with this die, the Aluminium rim around the sides.


----------



## jlp0209

Successfully did my first de-lid and re-lid yesterday on my 6700K using Rockit 88 tools! My CPU had 8-10 degree variance among cores at times, and with a moderate OC of 4.5 ghz at 1.29-1.30V plus H100i V2 on it, I had been seeing core temps reach 83 degrees during Prime95 smallFFP tests. Re-seated several times and finally decided to de-lid. Used CL Liquid Ultra on the die, super glue method per Rockit 88 guide to re-lid, and finally MX-4 on the IHS. My max temps plummeted to 59 degrees after 20 mins of Prime95 and my core temps are nice and even. I am a believer and will de-lid every CPU I get from now on


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jlp0209*
> 
> Successfully did my first de-lid and re-lid yesterday on my 6700K using Rockit 88 tools! My CPU had 8-10 degree variance among cores at times, and with a moderate OC of 4.5 ghz at 1.29-1.30V plus H100i V2 on it, I had been seeing core temps reach 83 degrees during Prime95 smallFFP tests. Re-seated several times and finally decided to de-lid. Used CL Liquid Ultra on the die, super glue method per Rockit 88 guide to re-lid, and finally MX-4 on the IHS. My max temps plummeted to 59 degrees after 20 mins of Prime95 and my core temps are nice and even. I am a believer and will de-lid every CPU I get from now on


Nice you got good results.
Its a pity however, that intel is seeing, more and more enthusiasts prone to delid their cpus, intel have more arguments to not care anymore, as they really wish they could stop overclocking as well. Nothing wrong however, i delided myself, but surely i would prefer soldered, or if intel is lazy or greed, they could sell some "special editions" soldered or even half assembled.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Nice you got good results.
> Its a pity however, that intel is seeing, more and more enthusiasts prone to delid their cpus, intel have more arguments to not care anymore, as they really wish they could stop overclocking as well. Nothing wrong however, i delided myself, but surely i would prefer soldered, or if intel is lazy or greed, they could sell some "special editions" soldered or even half assembled.


That's what I don't get, why don't they just sell a special K edition (Silver edition?) which has a Soldered IHS as a "feature". I would totally pay $50-$100 for such a CPU considering the total BOM of delidding.

Generates a crapton of goodwill and stops giving AMD ammunition to snipe market share.


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> That's what I don't get, why don't they just sell a special K edition (Silver edition?) which has a Soldered IHS as a "feature". I would totally pay $50-$100 for such a CPU considering the total BOM of delidding.
> 
> Generates a crapton of goodwill and stops giving AMD ammunition to snipe market share.


Because people who want that make up less than 1% of the market. To them, it isn't worth their time.


----------



## Kalpa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Aluminum is a piss poor heat conductor, 99% of GPUs use nickel plated copper, or bare copper even better.


Aluminium is one of the best simple thermal conductors out there, problem with aluminium is it oxidizes super easily (and the oxide layer is super bad for thermal conduction) making manufacturing a tad more complex.

EDIT: To clarify sure it isn't as good as copper or silver but to say it's 'piss poor' is definitely an unwarranted hyperbole.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Kalpa*
> 
> Aluminium is one of the best simple thermal conductors out there, problem with aluminium is it oxidizes super easily (and the oxide layer is super bad for thermal conduction) making manufacturing a tad more complex.
> 
> EDIT: To clarify sure it isn't as good as copper or silver but to say it's 'piss poor' is definitely an unwarranted hyperbole.


Dw about it, he totally misunderstood what i was saying. I was saying its better to go with bare die contact to heatsink with an Aluminium shim around the die like what gpus do now to prevent overpressure.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Dw about it, he totally misunderstood what i was saying. I was saying its better to go with bare die contact to heatsink with an Aluminium shim around the die like what gpus do now to prevent overpressure.


Except that aluminium trim youre talking about sits lower then the die so it wouldn't help pressure at all. Intel wafers have gotten much thinner and theres no way for intel to do bare die cooling even with an aluminium surrounding. Gpu and cpu cooling is a totally different ballgame.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Except that aluminium trim youre talking about sits lower then the die so it wouldn't help pressure at all. Intel wafers have gotten much thinner and there's no way for intel to do bare die cooling even with an aluminium surrounding. Gpu and cpu cooling is a totally different ballgame.


Well since we're talking about hypotheticals, Intel just needs to beef up the die too and make sure the shim is the correct height. It might actually be cheaper than their current solution with the IHS being made out of nickel plated copper.

IIRC Der8auer made some Stainless steel shims for direct die LN2 pots which I'm trying to get a hold of, similar concept and actually fairly ingenious IMO.


----------



## wholeeo

Wonder if the current tools will work on Coffee Lake.


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> Wonder if the current tools will work on Coffee Lake.


I think they likely will seeing as we are on 1151 again. Unless Intel gets real creative with a new IHS design.


----------



## stephenn82

Yeah, but v2. How different is 2011 and 2011 r3?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Not really all that different _physically_ (i.e. basically same package/IHS) - just different as far as the supporting chipset and the internal layout/features are concerned (cores, memory management, I/O, cache, etc.). I'm not positive but I believe the socket/retention system is identical.... it's just not compatible due to pin addressing on the MB side... but don't quote me on that because I'm just speculating based on observation. My guess is they will work fine - although it's possible that the difference will largely be that perhaps the new chips will be soldered...











I don't seriously expect that however, and even if it were the case... then there wouldn't be a point to delidding anyway so I'm good either way.


----------



## DarthBaggins

Any tips on mounting a Supremacy EVO to a 7700k naked, thinking of snagging a 7700k off the Marketplace that's been delidded and lapped already. Didn't know if the Sandy/Ivy Naked mounting kit from EK was a viable option if I do this.

Also Intel has stopped the whole Tick-Tock process which is why we're seeing Coffee Lake coming to 1151, they moved to a 3 step process instead.

Do wish it was safe to delid my 5930k.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarthBaggins*
> 
> Any tips on mounting a Supremacy EVO to a 7700k naked, thinking of snagging a 7700k off the Marketplace that's been delidded and lapped already. Didn't know if the Sandy/Ivy Naked mounting kit from EK was a viable option if I do this.
> 
> Also Intel has stopped the whole Tick-Tock process which is why we're seeing Coffee Lake coming to 1151, they moved to a 3 step process instead.
> 
> Do wish it was safe to delid my 5930k.


Yea don't do it, not worth the risk at all. The wafer is too thin for it, AND only way to do it is to trim the cpu socket to the correct height (to do it properly needs to be done with a digital caliper and pressure paper so you get the mounting pressure right).


----------



## 0ldChicken

Id agree with bluej there, not worth it on 6700k and newer. Even my 4790k pcb bent under the naked mount pressure and is now dead. Saw some good gains but using the ihs would be wise imo


----------



## DarthBaggins

Figured, just thought I'd ask to prevent some future headaches and heartaches lol.


----------



## stephenn82

I haven't noticed any rise in temperature on any of my cores after doing a delid with gc extreme. Is it the ideal thermal material? Nope
Am i having issues with it? Nope. Maybe i got lucky or put it on there right. Either way, delid kit inbound to me and conductonaut has been sitting on my bench for 5 weeks waiting for my girl to take her top off


----------



## Valgaur

** *NOTICE* **

Vagur (Val) will be away from his home location for a period of 6 weeks due to a trip to Thailand for his Masters research. If there is a large absence from me, this is why.

Though tI would notify people who make submissions and don't hear anything!









-Val


----------



## stephenn82

Have a good time and learn a lot of stuff! What part of Thailand are you going to? Ive been to Bangkok and Phuket area. Bangkok has many amazing sights to see, the temples, the craftsmanship put into all of it. And the food is amazing! I miss traveling.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DarthBaggins*
> 
> Any tips on mounting a Supremacy EVO to a 7700k naked, thinking of snagging a 7700k off the Marketplace that's been delidded and lapped already. Didn't know if the Sandy/Ivy Naked mounting kit from EK was a viable option if I do this.
> 
> Also Intel has stopped the whole Tick-Tock process which is why we're seeing Coffee Lake coming to 1151, they moved to a 3 step process instead.
> 
> Do wish it was safe to delid my 5930k.


At this point I think even Intel doesn't know the cadence anymore.
They didn't manage to advance nodes but they need to keep releasing new products so we gonna see new products until Intel manages to do a proper real improvement or new node.


----------



## 0ldChicken

I haven't tried trimming down the voltage yet, but it's looking like a solid 16°c drop on my 7700k I just delidded. I was topping out at 90°c and am now only hitting 74°c while running Aida at 1.392v (1.375v bios)
Valgars official method shows 10c drop at 4.5ghz @1.2v

Cooling performed by EK-FB ASUS M8G Monoblock with dual d5 pumps and 2-120mmx360mm rads with fans around 1800rpm (HWlabs gtx 360 with Vardar and HWlabs gts360 xflow with Gentle Typhoon)

OCN name: 0ldChicken
CPU: Intel i7-7700k
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Hydronaut
Mhz gained: N/A (will update if possible but I don't plan on pushing more voltage)
OC after delid: 5GHz
Temp drops: 10°c- 4.5GHz @ 1.2v & 16°c- 5.0GHz @ 1.392v
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/1x0nuz

I know @Valgaur is gone at the moment, but I want to make sure he knows we miss him!


----------



## TahoeDust

You can add me to club, although I pussed out had Silicon Lottery do mine. It got me 10c and 100MHz...maybe more.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Just got this bad boy fabricated and installed. Custom CnC machined Copper IHS by Bartek. Cost me $50 AUD overall + free shipping for 2 units, about 10 day lead time and delivery.





Observations:
from my examination, it seems the custom IHS is almost perfectly flat (because it is machined as opposed to stamped on the stock Intel one) and has a much larger base contact surface area with the PCB (thus much less chance of PCB warping).
The IHS is also a floater design, from my communication with Bartek, there is too much variance in the Z height to risk making full length due to the performance loss from having a thicker interface vs a float design similar to the stock IHS. Be sure to re-seal with RTV or 0.2mm electrical tape shim to prevent PCB warp.

Performance:

So far with standard delid + relid protocols on my 7700k (conductonaut, 0.2mm tape shim, Kryonaut) I got 1-2C reduction at idle and 3-4C reduction under load. Very unexpected, I suspect the massive reduction is a combination of:
1. my stock IHS is too bowed
2. the stock IHS nickel prevents good Conductonaut wetting beyond the very first application (I've redone it 3 times already)
3. The usual 1-2C variance in XSPC Raystorm Pro mounting performance.

I am overall very satisfied with the result, sure it doesn't get massive gains (but I didn't expect such) but I now can keep my stock IHS in a safe place and abuse the Copper IHS I have with confidence. Next up, I might do Conductonaut between the copper and the waterblock.

Unfortunately, my search in to creating a vapor chamber IHS was fruitless, unless I mount the motherboard horizontal, the thermal engineers at Thermacore are sure the performance will not match a solid copper IHS due to the convection pattern of the liquid.

If you guys are interested in Bartek's work, fire him an email at, [email protected], I believe he also makes other stuff like Ln2 accessories on demand.


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Just got this bad boy fabricated and installed. Custom CnC machined Copper IHS by Bartek. Cost me $50 AUD overall + free shipping for 2 units, about 10 day lead time and delivery.
> 
> IHS was fruitless, unless I mount the motherboard horizontal, the thermal engineers at Thermacore are sure the performance will not match a solid copper IHS due to the convection pattern of the liquid.
> 
> If you guys are interested in Bartek's work, fire him an email at, [email protected], I believe he also makes other stuff like Ln2 accessories on demand.


I've worked with him as well. Only guy I know willing and able to make quality one-off custom XOC parts for a fair price with cheap WW shipping. Here are 2 examples of my favorites.


----------



## Loladinas

Cleaned my PC today, thought I'd see how Liquid Pro was doing under the lid. Applied in either January or February 2016, and never touched since. No drying out whatsoever, cleanup was easy with paper towels and cotton q-tips. Some staining on the IHS. There's some pooling of LM along the edges, but I'm pretty sure it happened after I removed CPU from the socket - CPU and IHS were lightly stuck together and I needed to twist it a bit to separate them. Also, you can see that the clear nail polish used to cover SMDs hasn't changed consistency or peeled off at all.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Cleaned my PC today, thought I'd see how Liquid Pro was doing under the lid. Applied in either January or February 2016, and never touched since. No drying out whatsoever, cleanup was easy with paper towels and cotton q-tips. Some staining on the IHS. There's some pooling of LM along the edges, but I'm pretty sure it happened after I removed CPU from the socket - CPU and IHS were lightly stuck together and I needed to twist it a bit to separate them. Also, you can see that the clear nail polish used to cover SMDs hasn't changed consistency or peeled off at all.


Very nice, and thats how you know too much LM was applied haha. Mine had like the smallest tiniest dot next to the die and thats it.


----------



## reqq

Any skylakers running barefooted IHS got any problems with gliding? Just wondering because running like that today..seems to work..


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Loladinas*
> 
> Cleaned my PC today, thought I'd see how Liquid Pro was doing under the lid. Applied in either January or February 2016, and never touched since. No drying out whatsoever, cleanup was easy with paper towels and cotton q-tips. Some staining on the IHS. There's some pooling of LM along the edges, but I'm pretty sure it happened after I removed CPU from the socket - CPU and IHS were lightly stuck together and I needed to twist it a bit to separate them. Also, you can see that the clear nail polish used to cover SMDs hasn't changed consistency or peeled off at all.


Good lord!! Thats a lot of LM on there! All 3 of those little "pools" indicate that there was too much on there. So its a good thing that you covered those components on the PCB.


----------



## jlp0209

So I've been posting in the over clocking 7700K thread about my CPU and now am about to re-lid for the 4th time due to prior issues. Photo makes the situation look much worse, but this is my PCB after using some rubbing alcohol and acetone to remove the dots of glue from prior delids. Does this look like my CPU will be toast? I can't remove any more glue, luckily it does not prevent the IHS from being placed onto the PCB. Hopefully she survives, runs at 5 GHz easily. Nothing appears to be damaged, just pesky glue I can't remove. Also tried Goof Off and helped a bit. The glue is Loctite gel control. I see some gold spots exposed (aside from normal ones) maybe from when I scraped at some glue.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Have a good time and learn a lot of stuff! What part of Thailand are you going to? Ive been to Bangkok and Phuket area. Bangkok has many amazing sights to see, the temples, the craftsmanship put into all of it. And the food is amazing! I miss traveling.


I will be in Bangkok! I'm planning to see as many of the temples as possible and visiting the floating and local markets. I'm beyond excited for the food








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *0ldChicken*
> 
> I haven't tried trimming down the voltage yet, but it's looking like a solid 16°c drop on my 7700k I just delidded. I was topping out at 90°c and am now only hitting 74°c while running Aida at 1.392v (1.375v bios)
> Valgars official method shows 10c drop at 4.5ghz @1.2v
> 
> Cooling performed by EK-FB ASUS M8G Monoblock with dual d5 pumps and 2-120mmx360mm rads with fans around 1800rpm (HWlabs gtx 360 with Vardar and HWlabs gts360 xflow with Gentle Typhoon)
> 
> OCN name: 0ldChicken
> CPU: Intel i7-7700k
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Hydronaut
> Mhz gained: N/A (will update if possible but I don't plan on pushing more voltage)
> OC after delid: 5GHz
> Temp drops: 10°c- 4.5GHz @ 1.2v & 16°c- 5.0GHz @ 1.392v
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/1x0nuz
> 
> I know @Valgaur is gone at the moment, but I want to make sure he knows we miss him!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Loladinas

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Very nice, and thats how you know too much LM was applied haha. Mine had like the smallest tiniest dot next to the die and thats it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Good lord!! Thats a lot of LM on there! All 3 of those little "pools" indicate that there was too much on there. So its a good thing that you covered those components on the PCB.


Well, maybe. It ran fine for over a year and a half, there's no run off anywhere near SMD or contact pads, and there's a rather large void in the middle of the die. Most of the pooling happened as I was removing the IHS and had to wiggle it around (I'm guessing, anyway).
I did use less CLP this time around and the only difference in temps is, it reduced the difference between cores. Cores 2 and 3 used to run 3c hotter than 1 and 4, now first three cores run the same, fourth one running 2c cooler.

Does the amount of LM on die really matter that much, unless you go way overboard and just drown the thing in it?


----------



## TahoeDust

Silicon Lottery 7820x delidding results. The turnaround was 1day and the chip looks completely stock.

Before:

4.7GHz @ 1.234v - Realbench 2hr run gave a max temp of 81c.



After:

4.7GHz @ 1.237v - Realbench 2hr run gave a max temp of 70c.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TahoeDust*
> 
> Silicon Lottery 7820x delidding results. The turnaround was 1day and the chip looks completely stock.
> 
> Before:
> 
> 4.7GHz @ 1.234v - Realbench 2hr run gave a max temp of 81c.
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 4.7GHz @ 1.237v - Realbench 2hr run gave a max temp of 70c.


mmm I'm quite surprised, I figured with the larger surface area of SKL-X there would be better thermals once delidded. I mean, GPUs with similar die sizes but can go in to the 40C range once on water. I'm starting to think it might be something internal with Intel's chip construction, like insufficient thermal conduction pathways? not enough dead silicon?


----------



## TahoeDust

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> mmm I'm quite surprised, I figured with the larger surface area of SKL-X there would be better thermals once delidded. I mean, GPUs with similar die sizes but can go in to the 40C range once on water. I'm starting to think it might be something internal with Intel's chip construction, like insufficient thermal conduction pathways? not enough dead silicon?


No clue. It did get my 24/7 overclock another 100MHz without going up in temps. Now I run 4.8GHz @ 1.285v and max to 81c in the same Realbench test. It also let me bench at 5.0GHz at a voltage I couldn't before. I got my monies worth.


----------



## reqq

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jlp0209*
> 
> So I've been posting in the over clocking 7700K thread about my CPU and now am about to re-lid for the 4th time due to prior issues. Photo makes the situation look much worse, but this is my PCB after using some rubbing alcohol and acetone to remove the dots of glue from prior delids. Does this look like my CPU will be toast? I can't remove any more glue, luckily it does not prevent the IHS from being placed onto the PCB. Hopefully she survives, runs at 5 GHz easily. Nothing appears to be damaged, just pesky glue I can't remove. Also tried Goof Off and helped a bit. The glue is Loctite gel control. I see some gold spots exposed (aside from normal ones) maybe from when I scraped at some glue.


Ye i removed Loctite superglue yesterday aswell took 1.5 hours.. safe to say im not gonna use superglue any time soon.


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> mmm I'm quite surprised, I figured with the larger surface area of SKL-X there would be better thermals once delidded. I mean, GPUs with similar die sizes but can go in to the 40C range once on water. I'm starting to think it might be something internal with Intel's chip construction, like insufficient thermal conduction pathways? not enough dead silicon?


Yeah, I think Intel just isn't giving their transistors enough breathing room, they need to add some more dark silicon in between things.

But the lower gains from delidding on S-X make sense to me. The larger the silicon die, the less benefit there is I think. Look at graphics cards and their massive dies, switching between paste and liquid metal there barely makes any difference. But on small mainstream dies, the difference is huge.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *TahoeDust*
> 
> Silicon Lottery 7820x delidding results. The turnaround was 1day and the chip looks completely stock.
> 
> Before:
> 
> 4.7GHz @ 1.234v - Realbench 2hr run gave a max temp of 81c.
> 
> 
> 
> After:
> 
> 4.7GHz @ 1.237v - Realbench 2hr run gave a max temp of 70c.


Damn not much of a drop. My 1700x hit around 50°C at ur same voltage (i'm on water but still they do run MUCH cooler), i thought those would drop at least 20°C once delided, maybe at higher voltages.


----------



## Mr-Dark

Hello all

I think i will leave this here.. maybe someone looking for this info about delided 7700k and big AIO..

7700k delided.. CLU under IHS and Noctua NT-H1 between the IHS and the block
Asus z270 IX Code
16GB Vengeance RGB @3ghz
ThermalTake Water 3.0 + Triple RGB fan's so Push/pull at 800Rpm..

cpu at 5.1ghz- cache at 4.5ghz- memory 3ghz-- voltage at 1.36v manual at LLC 5



voltage under load is 1.344v.. been using this from over month with Zero problem..

want to say the 360mm AIO is beast.. compared to H115i and H100i V2.. around 10c better and i can push the voltage up to 1.40v without any overheat.. also 800rpm fans is more than enough









Thanks


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> Yeah, I think Intel just isn't giving their transistors enough breathing room, they need to add some more dark silicon in between things.
> 
> But the lower gains from delidding on S-X make sense to me. The larger the silicon die, the less benefit there is I think. Look at graphics cards and their massive dies, switching between paste and liquid metal there barely makes any difference. But on small mainstream dies, the difference is huge.


Plus with GPUs the thermal design is virtually the primary constraint whereas with CPUs it seems that Intel has left that up to OEMs and end users (seeing as how they've stopped including factory cooling for all their CPUs now). I'm not saying that Intel doesn't engineer their chips with thermals in mind - just saying that they're less concerned with how it performs with a 'factory cooler' than AMD & Nvidia have to be.

The aftermarket CPU cooling product inventory is large enough not to worry about, while on the GPU side only a tiny subset is going to use a custom block and loop... with some room for OEMs to put custom cooling to reach slight overclocks to increase their margins.

Hard to say for sure if that's a chicken or if it's the egg... and form factor plays a big part as you can't expect to sell a 4-5 pci slot GPU cooler setup, but you can sell quite a few CPU coolers even if they take up almost all of the space in the case!


----------



## jlp0209

Tried my 4th delid attempt and everything survived. This time when applying the Liquid Ultra (brand new tube) I noticed it was very hard to spread. I used the included brush and when I tried spreading it, it just wiped the stuff off! This happened both on the underside of the IHS and on the die. Has this happened to anyone / is this a bad tube of paste? I had to use maybe 3 drops total for the whole process which is excessive, but much of it was wiped off and I made sure everything was nice and even and not bubbling / pooling before relidding. Took a long time. Anyway, putting the CLU on the underside of the IHS and on the die seems to have helped me. My core temps under load are about 3-5 degrees cooler and core variance is at most 5 degrees now, which is great. Thanks to those who gave me some insight, will post proper results finally and hope to make the chart in the overclocking stats thread.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jlp0209*
> 
> Tried my 4th delid attempt and everything survived. This time when applying the Liquid Ultra (brand new tube) I noticed it was very hard to spread. I used the included brush and when I tried spreading it, it just wiped the stuff off! This happened both on the underside of the IHS and on the die. Has this happened to anyone / is this a bad tube of paste? Anyway, putting the CLU on the underside of the IHS and on the die seems to have helped me. My core temps under load are about 3-5 degrees cooler and core variance is at most 5 degrees now, which is great. Thanks to those who gave me some insight, will post proper results finally and hope to make the chart in the overclocking stats thread.


Its an issue with wetting, especially if you have applied CLU to the surface in the past. This is because of some hybrid layer that forms on the surface, I'd recommend thoroughly cleaning it with Indigo Xtreme clean or something sufficiently strong. If that doesn't cleanse the surface, you might need to apply a small amount of toothpaste and gently abrade the surface.


----------



## jlp0209

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Its an issue with wetting, especially if you have applied CLU to the surface in the past. This is because of some hybrid layer that forms on the surface, I'd recommend thoroughly cleaning it with Indigo Xtreme clean or something sufficiently strong. If that doesn't cleanse the surface, you might need to apply a small amount of toothpaste and gently abrade the surface.


OK, thank you. Everything seems to be running fine when I ran some initial tests this morning. I really don't have the motivation to do a 5th delid, LOL, I just can't. If I suddenly see temp spikes or some other issue I will then do it and clean surfaces as you suggested.


----------



## jlp0209

Well, this was bound to happen.



Figures after another delid, flawless removal of old CLU and old layers this time, and perfect application of CLU on the die. No memory slots work now. Bottom of the PCB is not scratched. No bent pins anywhere in socket or PCB. Only possibility is my removal of glue on the PCB from earlier delids (scraped off glue with razor before trying Goof Off...bad idea) has killed multiple memory controllers.

So for anyone new to delidding, be careful, this is what can happen. It wasn't a total waste of $300, I learned a lot from all of this.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jlp0209*
> 
> Well, this was bound to happen.
> 
> 
> 
> Figures after another delid, flawless removal of old CLU and old layers this time, and perfect application of CLU on the die. No memory slots work now. Bottom of the PCB is not scratched. No bent pins anywhere in socket or PCB. Only possibility is my removal of glue on the PCB from earlier delids (scraped off glue with razor before trying Goof Off...bad idea) has killed multiple memory controllers.
> 
> So for anyone new to delidding, be careful, this is what can happen. It wasn't a total waste of $300, I learned a lot from all of this.


Bummer. I tried telling ya that difference between cores temps might not be related to any paste or IHS application. Curiosity killed the cat


----------



## jlp0209

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> Bummer. I tried telling ya that difference between cores temps might not be related to any paste or IHS application. Curiosity killed the cat


Oh it did help, before killing the memory controllers my core temp variance was under 5 degrees. The IHS wasn't tight enough before. I kept hitting 86 in Prime95 so something was still not right. When I delidded again and inspected yesterday, there was a problem with the CLU. There was an old layer I didn't remove properly because a small part of the die was bare / it had pooled a bit despite being even when I applied it. Followed another member's instructions to remove CLU again and it went back on very easily like it should this time. Sadly the CPU gave up the ghost in the process. Expensive mistake.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jlp0209*
> 
> Oh it did help, before killing the memory controllers my core temp variance was under 5 degrees. The IHS wasn't tight enough before. I kept hitting 86 in Prime95 so something was still not right. When I delidded again and inspected yesterday, there was a problem with the CLU. There was an old layer I didn't remove properly because a small part of the die was bare / it had pooled a bit despite being even when I applied it. Followed another member's instructions to remove CLU again and it went back on very easily like it should this time. Sadly the CPU gave up the ghost in the process. Expensive mistake.


Even my chip will have the temps close under a heavy load of p95 tho, but not any normal load.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jlp0209*
> 
> Well, this was bound to happen.
> 
> 
> 
> Figures after another delid, flawless removal of old CLU and old layers this time, and perfect application of CLU on the die. No memory slots work now. Bottom of the PCB is not scratched. No bent pins anywhere in socket or PCB. Only possibility is my removal of glue on the PCB from earlier delids (scraped off glue with razor before trying Goof Off...bad idea) has killed multiple memory controllers.
> 
> So for anyone new to delidding, be careful, this is what can happen. It wasn't a total waste of $300, I learned a lot from all of this.


And its why i tell people not to use something too strong, super glue or strong sealant. On the coffee and kaby lake and maybe even skylake its need to put something between the IHS trim trim and the wafer if your IHS spin on the die. Id use thermal tape or something because it can be compressed quite easily, easy to remove and should keep the wafer from bending due to all the pressure being on the die.


----------



## ViTosS

So you guys recommend applying the CLU under the IHS and on the DIE? Because there is no way (at least I didn't guess yet) to calculate where is the exact contact area from under IHS to the DIE, I mean, I'm afraid if the CLU under the IHS I apply ends up touching the capacitors or the tiny chips that are close to the DIE, I'm planning to do on my 7700k that is way easier than the 4790k I did some time ago, because the 4790k has a lot of micro-chips really close to the DIE and the 7700k the only thing that scares me are those 4 dots close to the left lower area of the DIE. What do you guys recommend to make a good guess on where the under IHS area will touch the DIE without compromise the CPU life?

Edit: Actually this video showed me a good idea to calculate the area to apply under the IHS!


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> So you guys recommend applying the CLU under the IHS and on the DIE? Because there is no way (at least I didn't guess yet) to calculate where is the exact contact area from under IHS to the DIE, I mean, I'm afraid if the CLU under the IHS I apply ends up touching the capacitors or the tiny chips that are close to the DIE, I'm planning to do on my 7700k that is way easier than the 4790k I did some time ago, because the 4790k has a lot of micro-chips really close to the DIE and the 7700k the only thing that scares me are those 4 dots close to the left lower area of the DIE. What do you guys recommend to make a good guess on where the under IHS area will touch the DIE without compromise the CPU life?
> 
> Edit: Actually this video showed me a good idea to calculate the area to apply under the IHS!


I didn't play the guessing game with my CPU, it has too many little components right next to the die (4670K). I just went a tiny bit heavier with the application on the die - emphasis on "tiny".


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I didn't play the guessing game with my CPU, it has too many little components right next to the die (4670K). I just went a tiny bit heavier with the application on the die - emphasis on "tiny".


Yea, me too, I applied only on the DIE for my 4790k, I had a 12~15ºC temp reduction, but my cores difference temperature is like 8ºC difference and I think is because I didn't apply under the IHS... But I'm not going to risk this CPU for that, but for the 7700k there is much more surface area without risk, as I said, the only problem are the 4 little dots in the lower left area of the DIE (close to that area), I don't know, I would prefer apply the CLU only in the DIE and not under the IHS, but if you guys can confirm for sure that applying under the IHS and in the DIE is better, I think I'm going to risk a bit.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> Yea, me too, I applied only on the DIE for my 4790k, I had a 12~15ºC temp reduction, but my cores difference temperature is like 8ºC difference and I think is because I didn't apply under the IHS... But I'm not going to risk this CPU for that, but for the 7700k there is much more surface area without risk, as I said, the only problem are the 4 little dots in the lower left area of the DIE (close to that area), I don't know, I would prefer apply the CLU only in the DIE and not under the IHS, but if you guys can confirm for sure that applying under the IHS and in the DIE is better, I think I'm going to risk a bit.


I don't personally think it makes that big of a difference by directly applying to the IHS. You should be able to get a similar result by applying a little bit more CLU to the die. If you wanted to apply to the IHS though, you could take some spare TIM (the cheaper and worse, the better for this task), and apply a little bit to the outside edge of the die - just enough to stick up over the edge of the die. The idea I'm going for here is to have the TIM make a crude outline of the die on the IHS, so you'll have a closer approximation of where the die contacts the IHS. Then, just "color between the lines".


----------



## Dimensive

I was able to see essentially a stain on my 4670K from where the previous thermal paste was under the IHS and used that as a guide.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> I was able to see essentially a stain on my 4670K from where the previous thermal paste was under the IHS and used that as a guide.


The problem is that when you clean under the IHS area the mark of the old thermal paste will disapear, and if you put the tape to mark you won't be able to clean the thermal paste that would be under the tape


----------



## Dimensive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> The problem is that when you clean under the IHS area the mark of the old thermal paste will disapear, and if you put the tape to mark you won't be able to clean the thermal paste that would be under the tape


I was lucky enough that my 4670K still showed the outline even after cleaning the paste off. You could put CLU on the die then put the IHS back on temporarily to get an outline of CLU on the IHS then use the tape that way. I did that on my 4790K and it worked out just fine.


----------



## ViTosS

Just a question, after 10 minutes of x264 stress test, do you guys think this 4th core temperature is normal? 6~8ºC higher compared to the 2nd core:



This was a delid applied CLU only over the DIE and NOT under IHS, also glued back with relid kit with Permatex Black Ultra, just 4 little dots on the 4 corners of the heatspreader.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> I was lucky enough that my 4670K still showed the outline even after cleaning the paste off. You could put CLU on the die then put the IHS back on temporarily to get an outline of CLU on the IHS then use the tape that way. I did that on my 4790K and it worked out just fine.


I see... I was thinking doing this:



But also buying a ruler to have the exact measurement of the DIE lenght and width and try to match the tape like in the image, what do you think?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> I was lucky enough that my 4670K still showed the outline even after cleaning the paste off. You could put CLU on the die then put the IHS back on temporarily to get an outline of CLU on the IHS then use the tape that way. I did that on my 4790K and it worked out just fine.


It was the same thing for my CPU, I had a nice little "outline" of the CPU die on the IHS. I just came up with the other method, and figured it should work - kinda like using White Out on the end of a screw to mark a difficult to reach spot.








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I see... I was thinking doing this:
> 
> 
> 
> But also buying a ruler to have the exact measurement of the DIE lenght and width and try to match the tape like in the image, what do you think?


That seems like an awful waste of time - to me, at least.... If that's the method you're comfortable with, then whatever works for you.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> It was the same thing for my CPU, I had a nice little "outline" of the CPU die on the IHS. I just came up with the other method, and figured it should work - kinda like using White Out on the end of a screw to mark a difficult to reach spot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That seems like an awful waste of time - to me, at least.... If that's the method you're comfortable with, then whatever works for you.


I think I will stick with applying CLU on the DIE and close the IHS down and open again and see where the CLU touch the area under IHS and just use tape around it, but my concern is if I can still use the CLU after doing that or will I have to wipe it off and apply again? Because CLU comes in very few amount.


----------



## Dimensive

If you're worried about getting CLU on the capacitors, then put some liquid electrical tape on them


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> If you're worried about getting CLU on the capacitors, then put some liquid electrical tape on them


Yep, or there's always this ^, if you're concerned about it. Applying a covering to those areas would give some peace of mind. I'm personally kinda cheap, so I try to work with what I already have, unless I absolutely need something for a task.

I've seen people also use clear nail polish for protecting items on the CPU PCB, so there are a couple of options.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> If you're worried about getting CLU on the capacitors, then put some liquid electrical tape on them


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Yep, or there's always this ^, if you're concerned about it. Applying a covering to those areas would give some peace of mind. I'm personally kinda cheap, so I try to work with what I already have, unless I absolutely need something for a task.
> 
> I've seen people also use clear nail polish for protecting items on the CPU PCB, so there are a couple of options.


I'm not applying again my 4790k, but I will get in this week a 7700k and I will delid and apply under the IHS like I wanted to do in my 4790k but was afraid, I just need to know if I can reutilize the CLU metal paste when I apply on the DIE and close with the IHS to make contact with under IHS area without need to wipe it off, because the CLU comes in very few amount (sorry for my english, I'm brazilian)


----------



## Dimensive

Once I got an outline under the IHS, I removed the tape from the PCB then put it on the IHS and I just applied a bit under the IHS without cleaning off either before gluing the IHS back.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> Once I got an outline under the IHS, I removed the tape from the PCB then put it on the IHS and I just applied a bit under the IHS without cleaning off either before gluing the IHS back.


I see, thank you for helping me out, so you got the outline under the IHS with the tape already around the DIE? I didn't think of that, but seems better to have the outline concentrated


----------



## ViTosS

I mean, you closed the IHS to the DIE with the tapes around the DIE, didn't remove the tape before closing? To have your outline?


----------



## Unknownm

ordered.

To replace the as5 in IHS and on AIO.


----------



## Dimensive

Yea, I kept the tape on around the die to get an outline on the IHS.


----------



## ducegt

I used tape and guesstimated on the IHS... I put a very thin amount on both the core and IHS, and it worked great. It doesn't drip.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And its why i tell people not to use something too strong, super glue or strong sealant. On the coffee and kaby lake and maybe even skylake its need to put something between the IHS trim trim and the wafer if your IHS spin on the die. Id use thermal tape or something because it can be compressed quite easily, easy to remove and should keep the wafer from bending due to all the pressure being on the die.


Lol I suggested this on the official Delid forum (and I was shot down lol, jokes on them my PCB is still alive after 5 delids) because I am very very concerned about 1mm clearance between the IHS and the die. Except those guys had such a hard on for performance they would rather have their PCB bend if it means the IHS is crushing down on the die. Seriously, I have been using thin .2/.5mm electrical tape for about 10 delids + relids to shim that gap between the IHS and the PCB. It works a real treat because not only does it make the IHS more grippy when you close down the mounting latch (so it doesn't slide) it also provides a measure of structural support to the PCB to prevent bends AND it also compresses a little on pressure thus not compromising performance while adding a nice sealant effect.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> So you guys recommend applying the CLU under the IHS and on the DIE? Because there is no way (at least I didn't guess yet) to calculate where is the exact contact area from under IHS to the DIE, I mean, I'm afraid if the CLU under the IHS I apply ends up touching the capacitors or the tiny chips that are close to the DIE, I'm planning to do on my 7700k that is way easier than the 4790k I did some time ago, because the 4790k has a lot of micro-chips really close to the DIE and the 7700k the only thing that scares me are those 4 dots close to the left lower area of the DIE. What do you guys recommend to make a good guess on where the under IHS area will touch the DIE without compromise the CPU life?
> 
> Edit: Actually this video showed me a good idea to calculate the area to apply under the IHS!


Just use clear women's nail hardener on the little caps. This stuff is riduculously thermal tolerant and is easy to apply. That way spillage is of no concern.


----------



## kfxsti

When you say you used the electrical tape , do you mean you just kinda made a gasket under the ihs with it or how did you go about doing it? I'm interested in this idea


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> When you say you used the electrical tape , do you mean you just kinda made a gasket under the ihs with it or how did you go about doing it? I'm interested in this idea


Just place a single layer of Nitto electrical tape around the die, then apply Conductonaut on the die and seat the IHS down. It should have a slightly squishy bounce feel.






Here I've demonstrated it on an old C2Duo PCB


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Lol I suggested this on the official Delid forum (and I was shot down lol, jokes on them my PCB is still alive after 5 delids) because I am very very concerned about 1mm clearance between the IHS and the die. Except those guys had such a hard on for performance they would rather have their PCB bend if it means the IHS is crushing down on the die. Seriously, I have been using thin .2/.5mm electrical tape for about 10 delids + relids to shim that gap between the IHS and the PCB. It works a real treat because not only does it make the IHS more grippy when you close down the mounting latch (so it doesn't slide) it also provides a measure of structural support to the PCB to prevent bends AND it also compresses a little on pressure thus not compromising performance while adding a nice sealant effect.
> Just use clear women's nail hardener on the little caps. This stuff is riduculously thermal tolerant and is easy to apply. That way spillage is of no concern.


Its why if you delid A LOT or professionally i suggest using pressure paper, its is FANTASTIC thing to use.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Its why if you delid A LOT or professionally i suggest using pressure paper, its is FANTASTIC thing to use.


It still doesn't correct the issue of a gap being present between the IHS and the PCB.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> It still doesn't correct the issue of a gap being present between the IHS and the PCB.


Oh i know, but it helps knowing how much tape/thermal pad thickness to use. Pressure paper is a god sent. The problem with electrical tape is that it eventually starts to compress from the pressure, same with thermal pads but those are usually quite thicker.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> Oh i know, but it helps knowing how much tape/thermal pad thickness to use. Pressure paper is a god sent. The problem with electrical tape is that it eventually starts to compress from the pressure, same with thermal pads but those are usually quite thicker.


Yeah, it definitely does compress. I find the dental articulating paper to be quite good for this. I just asked my dentist if I could have a reel that he was throwing out because of expiry date.


----------



## ducegt

What's the need to relid though? Aside from the fear that the application wasn't good enough or id that was in fact the case.


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Just place a single layer of Nitto electrical tape around the die, then apply Conductonaut on the die and seat the IHS down. It should have a slightly squishy bounce feel.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here I've demonstrated it on an old C2Duo PCB


Thanks man. About to give that a whirl right now. I left my ihs floating this time around


----------



## GraphicsWhore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I think I will stick with applying CLU on the DIE and close the IHS down and open again and see where the CLU touch the area under IHS and just use tape around it, but my concern is if I can still use the CLU after doing that or will I have to wipe it off and apply again? Because CLU comes in very few amount.


You won't want to wipe off and re-apply as wiping off CLU is a HUGE pain in the ass and takes forever.

Nor do you need to do what you're describing.

Apply the CLU and then spread over the die so you have a nice relatively thin layer covering the surface. Use common sense and make sure there aren't any globs of it, especially at the sides that might get pushed out when the IHS is re-attached. You may still have some micro-droplets that don't break down which is fine but again make sure they're not sitting too close to the sides.

Then just re-lid it. FYI, I used Gasket Maker and RockIt's relid tool and it worked perfectly.

I understand people using tape, etc. but a good applicator/spreader is really all you need and I think CLU comes with those tiny brushes usually. if you have one of those or something else that allows you to spread it accurately and thinly, the tape and other crap is unnecessary.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> What's the need to relid though? Aside from the fear that the application wasn't good enough or id that was in fact the case.


Applying blocks directly to the die requires extra work and much easier to damage the component. Ultimate result is marginal improvement over having IHS. Not worth the risk for most people.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraphicsWhore*
> 
> You won't want to wipe off and re-apply as wiping off CLU is a HUGE pain in the ass and takes forever.
> 
> Nor do you need to do what you're describing.
> 
> Apply the CLU and then spread over the die so you have a nice relatively thin layer covering the surface. Use common sense and make sure there aren't any globs of it, especially at the sides that might get pushed out when the IHS is re-attached. You may still have some micro-droplets that don't break down which is fine but again make sure they're not sitting too close to the sides.
> 
> Then just re-lid it. FYI, I used Gasket Maker and RockIt's relid tool and it worked perfectly.
> 
> I understand people using tape, etc. but a good applicator/spreader is really all you need and I think CLU comes with those tiny brushes usually. if you have one of those or something else that allows you to spread it accurately and thinly, the tape and other crap is unnecessary.
> Applying blocks directly to the die requires extra work and much easier to damage the component. Ultimate result is marginal improvement over having IHS. Not worth the risk for most people.


Ive taken CLU off after a year and it wasnt a pain at all, some scrubbing is necessary thats about it. If your cpu gets nice and hot its even easier.


----------



## wholeeo

I used Thermal Grizzly conductonaut between the IHS and water block and while the conductonaut was easy to remove from the block it pretty much stained the IHS. Looks like I'll never see the etched Intel markings ever again.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> I used Thermal Grizzly kryonaut between the IHS and water block and while the kryonaut was easy to remove from the block it pretty much stained the IHS. Looks like I'll never see the etched Intel markings ever again.


I think u mean conductonaut, kryonaut is a paste, if that etched stuff remind me not to use it haha.


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *wholeeo*
> 
> I used Thermal Grizzly kryonaut between the IHS and water block and while the kryonaut was easy to remove from the block it pretty much stained the IHS. Looks like I'll never see the etched Intel markings ever again.


Kryonaut? It wipes off like butter for me, and leaves absolutely nothing behind. No staining at all.

Or did you mean the liquid metal grizzly?


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> I think u mean conductonaut, kryonaut is a paste, if that etched stuff remind me not to use it haha.


Yup, I'll edit my post now. Thanks!


----------



## wholeeo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> Kryonaut? It wipes off like butter for me, and leaves absolutely nothing behind. No staining at all.
> 
> Or did you mean the liquid metal grizzly?


Yeah, I meant to say the liquid metal grizzly.









edit: Oops, double post.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraphicsWhore*
> 
> I understand people using tape, etc. but a good applicator/spreader is really all you need and I think CLU comes with those tiny brushes usually. if you have one of those or something else that allows you to spread it accurately and thinly, the tape and other crap is unnecessary.
> Applying blocks directly to the die requires extra work and much easier to damage the component. Ultimate result is marginal improvement over having IHS. Not worth the risk for most people.


I meant the need to redo the delidding process. Not skimping on putting the IHS back on. I bare died an Athlon 64 3000+ back in the day and would never do that with today's chips.

To relid my IHS, I just put it on with my hands and it did slide a bit so I straightened it out, and just put a glass cup on top of it for the super glue gel to cure. Still not perfectly straight and can't take it off without a lot of risk and work, but no need. I also used a very thin layer like you described very well.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraphicsWhore*
> 
> You won't want to wipe off and re-apply as wiping off CLU is a HUGE pain in the ass and takes forever.
> 
> Nor do you need to do what you're describing.
> 
> Apply the CLU and then spread over the die so you have a nice relatively thin layer covering the surface. Use common sense and make sure there aren't any globs of it, especially at the sides that might get pushed out when the IHS is re-attached. You may still have some micro-droplets that don't break down which is fine but again make sure they're not sitting too close to the sides.
> 
> Then just re-lid it. FYI, I used Gasket Maker and RockIt's relid tool and it worked perfectly.
> 
> I understand people using tape, etc. but a good applicator/spreader is really all you need and I think CLU comes with those tiny brushes usually. if you have one of those or something else that allows you to spread it accurately and thinly, the tape and other crap is unnecessary.
> Applying blocks directly to the die requires extra work and much easier to damage the component. Ultimate result is marginal improvement over having IHS. Not worth the risk for most people.


I see, but I'm thinking to apply under IHS too because that would be better for heat transfering, and for that I would need an outline to know exactly where I can spread CLU under the IHS and not touching the two close 4 dots in 7700k. So I was thinking to apply a very thin layer in DIE and put tape around, then close IHS and open it again to check where is the outline, so I would apply again (if necessary) in the DIE and apply precisely in IHS.


----------



## GraphicsWhore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I see, but I'm thinking to apply under IHS too because that would be better for heat transferin.


CLU will obviously come into contact with the IHS when you put it back on. I don't see any reason to bother doing this and I'll bet money it results in essentially no difference in temps.


----------



## Ellner357

Well, I know you don't need any validation on the liquid metal works so much better than even good thermal paste for my delid. It finally showed up and I'm running a full 20°C cooler than stock and MX-4.







thanks for all the good advice!


----------



## eXistencelies

It has been 7 months since I did my delid with my 7700k. It is on a full custom loop (720mm of rad space) and running at 5ghz @ 1.285v. I believe my temps have raised by 2c or so during gaming. before I would be in the 50's (playing PUBG), but after long sessions I see it creep into the 60s now. Though I probably should take into consideration that I live in South Texas where it gets hot around these times. I do keep my home cooled at 72* when I am home and 70* during late evening. Also that was the last time I cleaned out my loop. I also have noticed I have lost some fluid in my res which I know it normal. I am running Mayhem's Pastel. I am thinking it is probably time to clean the loop. Would this also be a good time to redo the CLU?


----------



## Valgaur

*REMINDER: Vagaur will be away come this Saturday August 12th, 2017. I will return when I can but wont be as common as normal.

Thanks!*


----------



## cephelix

All the best @Valgaur!! I bid u farewell and thank you for making this thread. Without it I would never have had the guts to delid my 4790K


----------



## cstkl1

Anybody successfully delided a skylake-x via razor/vice method?


----------



## Uroborous

Hello!!

My first post here!!! I am happy to find you all. I hope you are doing fine!

I bought a 7700K a week along with a cheap asrock board (z270m pro 4). I installed it with my custom oc and the temperatures were rather disappointing. I get 33-40 C idle and can reach 82-83 C during stress tests. The waterblock I us is an EK supremacy evo and I have a triple rad from them as well. If I actually delid, will kryonaut between die and ihs enough? I dont' really want to mess with liquid metal compounds.

Thanks in advance!!

Uroborous


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> Hello!!
> 
> My first post here!!! I am happy to find you all. I hope you are doing fine!
> 
> I bought a 7700K a week along with a cheap asrock board (z270m pro 4). I installed it with my custom oc and the temperatures were rather disappointing. I get 33-40 C idle and can reach 82-83 C during stress tests. The waterblock I us is an EK supremacy evo and I have a triple rad from them as well. If I actually delid, will kryonaut between die and ihs enough? I dont' really want to mess with liquid metal compounds.
> 
> Thanks in advance!!
> 
> Uroborous


welcome!

Three options

1) send your chip to Silicon Lottery to redo
2) attempt it yourself with a delid tool (there is a kit floating around for free use...just pay shipping to next person i.e. Cross Country Delid Extravaganza. There is everything you need in the box, CLU, the tool, silicone to reseal it, etc) @kfxsti may hook you up








3) Send it to one of us who have a delid kit and materials to do.

I recomment option 2...its really simple to do. I just did three of my chips and a friends, all came out well. my 6700k idles at 19c and max temps at OCCT small test is 51c. My friends 7700k is able to hit 5ghz now and max temps are 42c while gaming. He hasnt ran OCCT yet.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> Hello!!
> 
> My first post here!!! I am happy to find you all. I hope you are doing fine!
> 
> I bought a 7700K a week along with a cheap asrock board (z270m pro 4). I installed it with my custom oc and the temperatures were rather disappointing. I get 33-40 C idle and can reach 82-83 C during stress tests. The waterblock I us is an EK supremacy evo and I have a triple rad from them as well. If I actually delid, will kryonaut between die and ihs enough? I dont' really want to mess with liquid metal compounds.
> 
> Thanks in advance!!
> 
> Uroborous


Please don't use TIM between the die and IHS its just a waste of time, youll get a temp drop deliding and using tim alone but get even more (depending on voltage and chip) if you use liquid metal. It really is totally safe to use, apply it far away from the mobo then drop it in you risk no problems.


----------



## Uroborous

Well.. Thanks for your kind suggestions, but I live in Greece. What I heard about liquid metal compounds is that it is very difficult to take off if it gets dry. Is there a problem if it touches the green plastic area around the die?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> Well.. Thanks for your kind suggestions, but I live in Greece. What I heard about liquid metal compounds is that it is very difficult to take off if it gets dry. Is there a problem if it touches the green plastic area around the die?


Someone just removed some after a year use and had no problems, if you get the cpu nice and hot before removing it (quick 10-15min stress test) then it literally just wipes right off, it does etch very very slightly but thats not an issue at all. If it touches the green its not an issue, couple people put on a bit too much and it touches the wafer but its not a problem.

I'm in France and i could delid it for u but sinde i dont use silicon to reseal id end up sending back a bare die cpu with liquid metal on it and the application more then likely would get ruined, unless i ship it back in the intel box it comes in but still risky.


----------



## Uroborous

thanks again guys. I appreciate your offering. There are guys here in the local community with the appropriate gear. What I am thinking is the warranty and if it would be better to sell my new parts and go for ryzen as they say it is more future proof. What do you think? I do not mean to start an Intel/Amd debate. I am just considering my options.


----------



## kevindd992002

Which is the best delidding tool for the 7700K? Dr. Delid or Rockit 88 delid?


----------



## khemist

Only used the Rockit and it was very very simple and quick, i was done in no time.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Which is the best delidding tool for the 7700K? Dr. Delid or Rockit 88 delid?


They pretty much all do the same, theres entersetup.com as well but not sure if he still makes tool, was a hobby for him but his tool worked flawlessly.


----------



## kevindd992002

It's just that I was reading this:

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Intel/Delidding_the_Intel_Core_i7_7700K/5.html

And it looks like thar with the Dr.Delid you get the advantage of using rotational vs. lateral force in getting the IHS removed but you get easier relid support with the Rockit. So I'm not sure which one to get.

Also, do people here mostly use super glue or silicon glue? In the same article above, the results when super glue was used were better.


----------



## Iceman2733

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> It's just that I was reading this:
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Intel/Delidding_the_Intel_Core_i7_7700K/5.html
> 
> And it looks like thar with the Dr.Delid you get the advantage of using rotational vs. lateral force in getting the IHS removed but you get easier relid support with the Rockit. So I'm not sure which one to get.
> 
> Also, do people here mostly use super glue or silicon glue? In the same article above, the results when super glue was used were better.


I haven't done it yet myself but I have been doing a lot of research seems that the Loctite Gel Control Super Glue seems to be highly recommended, says it works well to hold the IHS on with only small drops on corners. Also keeps the IHS extremely close to the die without worrying about gaps. Rockit recommends the Loctite Gel Control


----------



## ViTosS

I'm thinking to delid again and use Loctite this time, I've been using RTV, I had just a 15~20ºC drop, people seem to have 30ºC with 7700k...









Also when I run Intel Burn Test there is one core 7ºC hotter than the others, and I made sure I applied everything ok, put CLU into DIE and under the IHS...

My core temps are almost equally running x264 59º~60ºC but when I run IBT there is the gap, is this normal? Can anyone with 7700k run IBT and tell me the core temperature variations?


----------



## DR4G00N

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I'm thinking to delid again and use Loctite this time, I've been using RTV, I had just a 15~20ºC drop, people seem to have 30ºC with 7700k...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also when I run Intel Burn Test there is one core 7ºC hotter than the others, and I made sure I applied everything ok, put CLU into DIE and under the IHS...
> 
> My core temps are almost equally running x264 59º~60ºC but when I run IBT there is the gap, is this normal? Can anyone with 7700k run IBT and tell me the core temperature variations?


The amount of drop varies between every chip, some are better than others.

And it's normal to have one core hotter than the rest.


----------



## ViTosS

I'm afraid if I use Loctite and have to delid again in case something goes wrong, the Kabylake PCB is very thin and when I use the delid tool to remove IHS the glue would be harder to broke and I think it can damage the PCB


----------



## GraphicsWhore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> It's just that I was reading this:
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Intel/Delidding_the_Intel_Core_i7_7700K/5.html
> 
> And it looks like thar with the Dr.Delid you get the advantage of using rotational vs. lateral force in getting the IHS removed but you get easier relid support with the Rockit. So I'm not sure which one to get.
> 
> Also, do people here mostly use super glue or silicon glue? In the same article above, the results when super glue was used were better.


Well the RockIt relid tool is separate from the de-lid tool, so you can buy just the re-lid and I think it's like 8 bucks.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I'm thinking to delid again and use Loctite this time, I've been using RTV, I had just a 15~20ºC drop, people seem to have 30ºC with 7700k...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also when I run Intel Burn Test there is one core 7ºC hotter than the others, and I made sure I applied everything ok, put CLU into DIE and under the IHS...
> 
> My core temps are almost equally running x264 59º~60ºC but when I run IBT there is the gap, is this normal? Can anyone with 7700k run IBT and tell me the core temperature variations?


15-20C drop is already on the high end of drops; I'll call BS on anyone claiming 30.


----------



## khemist

https://postimages.org/

Looks like i managed to get a decent mount on my 7700k delid after many attempts and now the cores are pretty much even.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> https://postimages.org/
> 
> Looks like i managed to get a decent mount on my 7700k delid after many attempts and now the cores are pretty much even.


Which stress test software did you use? Beucause IBT makes my core variation 7ºC and 1ºC for the x264


----------



## khemist

Just playing BF1, before it was sometimes around 7-8c different.



Quick 5 min run on intel XTU, using the Cryorig r1 universal, around 1.27v 4.8.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Iceman2733*
> 
> I haven't done it yet myself but I have been doing a lot of research seems that the Loctite Gel Control Super Glue seems to be highly recommended, says it works well to hold the IHS on with only small drops on corners. Also keeps the IHS extremely close to the die without worrying about gaps. Rockit recommends the Loctite Gel Control


That's what I'm reading also.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I'm afraid if I use Loctite and have to delid again in case something goes wrong, the Kabylake PCB is very thin and when I use the delid tool to remove IHS the glue would be harder to broke and I think it can damage the PCB


They say that if you put just small drops in the corners and use pure acetone, you can delid a super glue-relidded CPU without damaging the PCB.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GraphicsWhore*
> 
> Well the RockIt relid tool is separate from the de-lid tool, so you can buy just the re-lid and I think it's like 8 bucks.


Right but with the Dr.Delid you get everything in one package. Although, I'm not sure how easier the Rockit 88 is compared to Dr.Delid when relidding (at least this is what the article is saying).


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> That's what I'm reading also.
> They say that if you put just small drops in the corners and use pure acetone, you can delid a super glue-relidded CPU without damaging the PCB.
> Right but with the Dr.Delid you get everything in one package. Although, I'm not sure how easier the Rockit 88 is compared to Dr.Delid when relidding (at least this is what the article is saying).


So I put the pure acetone before in the corners and let it run for a bit and then delid?


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> So I put the pure acetone before in the corners and let it run for a bit and then delid?


I'm not so sure of the exact process as I have not done it myself but I hope someone can chime in.


----------



## Dimensive

Oi, I re-delidded my i5-4670K with the loctite on it. The IHS came off easier than the first time.


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> I'm not so sure of the exact process as I have not done it myself but I hope someone can chime in.


BECARFUL which super glue you use!! Lol

I posted in this thread a while back . I used normal loctite super glue, and used acetone and tore part of the substrate. I have since used the loctite gel or I let the ihs float .


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> Oi, I re-delidded my i5-4670K with the loctite on it. The IHS came off easier than the first time.


But you have to apply acetone before in the corners where you put the Loctite gel, right? So the glue should break easily?


----------



## Dimensive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> But you have to apply acetone before in the corners where you put the Loctite gel, right? So the glue should break easily?


I only used acetone afterwards to remove the gel from the PCB.


----------



## kfxsti

Yes. The acetone will eat the gel with no problem. The 7700k I ripped was one I traded some.older parts for and the person who delidded it used normal loctite super glue.. not only on the corners . But everywhere.
Use the gel-
Only on the 4 corners- just enough to let it hold it in place-
Use acetone on q-tips and remove. voila


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> I only used acetone afterwards to remove the gel from the PCB.


Oh so I'm confused now, my main concern was about the glue be strong and when I use the tool to ''crack'' again the IHS would result in the PCB being damage, like pulling PCB pieces/surface area together, so the acetone is only for after the delid?


----------



## Dimensive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> Oh so I'm confused now, my main concern was about the glue be strong and when I use the tool to ''crack'' again the IHS would result in the PCB being damage, like pulling PCB pieces/surface area together, so the acetone is only for after the delid?


I'm just stating what I did after asking around. I re-delidded without removing the loctite gel and my i5 was just fine. It took less effort to re-delid than it did with the silicone that was on by stock. If you want to relieve your worries if for some reason you have to re-delid (which you shouldn't), then use acetone to remove or at least loosen the loctite gel.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> Yes. The acetone will eat the gel with no problem. The 7700k I ripped was one I traded some.older parts for and the person who delidded it used normal loctite super glue.. not only on the corners . But everywhere.
> Use the gel-
> Only on the 4 corners- just enough to let it hold it in place-
> Use acetone on q-tips and remove. voila


Oh so there's regular loctite super glue and there's the gel version, I didn't know that. Do they have the same bonding strength though?

Did you use pure acetone or nail polish remover? And what did you use to insulate the gold contact points in the pcb?


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Oh so there's regular loctite super glue and there's the gel version, I didn't know that. Do they have the same bonding strength though?
> 
> Did you use pure acetone or nail polish remover? And what did you use to insulate the gold contact points in the pcb?


I use acetone. Pure acetone , nail polish remover has a tendency to have other additives.
And I took a small dab of TIM- Gelid extreme, and put over them.

Dimensive is right. The gel is strong enough to hold the ihs but not strong enough under normal circumstances to tear the PCB. But after some of the disasters of delidding I have had to fix for other people, I use acetone to losing and to clean.

I personally just dab 4 corners-. Use acetone to loosen. Put it in the Rockit88 , pop- clean it all and start the process of coating in conductonaut , and the four corner dabs.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> I use acetone. Pure acetone , nail polish remover has a tendency to have other additives.
> And I took a small dab of TIM- Gelid extreme, and put over them.
> 
> Dimensive is right. The gel is strong enough to hold the ihs but not strong enough under normal circumstances to tear the PCB. But after some of the disasters of delidding I have had to fix for other people, I use acetone to losing and to clean.
> 
> I personally just dab 4 corners-. Use acetone to loosen. Put it in the Rockit88 , pop- clean it all and start the process of coating in conductonaut , and the four corner dabs.


Makes sense. Some are using liquid electrical tape for insulation too. Is that thing removable?

And do you have experience with Dr.Delid?


----------



## kfxsti

I followed what another ocn user posted with using the electrical tape as an insulator. But didn't like how it was extra cleaning during a relid lol.
And no I don't as far as the Dr Delid goes. I only use the Rockit88.
Check out the Delid extravaganza thread. User pays for.shipping and it gets sent around . I'm about to send mine out for people to use. I'm done with delidding for a while


----------



## Dimensive

Above all else, when it comes to delidding, just take your time and don't rush it. Everything will go smoothly.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> I followed what another ocn user posted with using the electrical tape as an insulator. But didn't like how it was extra cleaning during a relid lol.
> And no I don't as far as the Dr Delid goes. I only use the Rockit88.
> Check out the Delid extravaganza thread. User pays for.shipping and it gets sent around . I'm about to send mine out for people to use. I'm done with delidding for a while


Are you talking about regular electtical tape or the liquid electrical tape I mentioned?

Yeah but I live in the Philippines so I don't think that's applicable to me.


----------



## Iceman2733

For people with questions check out this video on how to directly from Rockit






Also @kevindd992002 Yea there are quite a few different versions of loctite buddy that you can buy the one you want is this one https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/loctite-super-glue-gel-control

In the US it can be found just about anywhere that carries loctite such as Hardware stores, walmart, lowes, home depot, heck even see it at a Krogers. Now I am not sure about where you live brother how that will work.


----------



## Iceman2733

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> Just playing BF1, before it was sometimes around 7-8c different.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quick 5 min run on intel XTU, using the Cryorig r1 universal, around 1.27v 4.8.


Don't use a game as a judge of cooling, they do not stress a CPU evenly. If you run RTSS set it up to show in OSD the CPU load on each core see if they cores are equally stressed very few games will keep all the cores equally stressed. I would judge cooling only but something like Prime, OCCT, or Realbench


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Iceman2733*
> 
> For people with questions check out this video on how to directly from Rockit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also @kevindd992002 Yea there are quite a few different versions of loctite buddy that you can buy the one you want is this one https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/loctite-super-glue-gel-control
> 
> In the US it can be found just about anywhere that carries loctite such as Hardware stores, walmart, lowes, home depot, heck even see it at a Krogers. Now I am not sure about where you live brother how that will work.


That video is straight forward and awesome. Forgot they had that on the site. +Rep


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> Oh so I'm confused now, my main concern was about the glue be strong and when I use the tool to ''crack'' again the IHS would result in the PCB being damage, like pulling PCB pieces/surface area together, so the acetone is only for after the delid?


100% pure acetone is great if you need to re-delid after applying liquid metal/better paste, and if you used superglue (acetone will work for gel or normal) in the corners. just make sure you've soaked the glue thoroughly by using a qtip or syringe to apply the acetone. Acetone will not hurt the pcb, gold pads ihs etc. I use it all the time on motherboards for XOC frequently soaking or submerging hardware. On a mobo the only thing I've found that can damage is the black shiney socket covers and stickers so don't soak your serial number or no RMA for you


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> 100% pure acetone is great if you need to re-delid after applying liquid metal/better paste, and if you used superglue (acetone will work for gel or normal) in the corners. just make sure you've soaked the glue thoroughly by using a qtip or syringe to apply the acetone. Acetone will not hurt the pcb, gold pads ihs etc. I use it all the time on motherboards for XOC frequently soaking or submerging hardware. On a mobo the only thing I've found that can damage is the black shiney socket covers and stickers so don't soak your serial number or no RMA for you


How about the stock silicon glue in the PCB, what do you use to remove that after delidding? Would acetone work as well?


----------



## Dimensive

Use a credit card or something like it.


----------



## khemist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Iceman2733*
> 
> Don't use a game as a judge of cooling, they do not stress a CPU evenly. If you run RTSS set it up to show in OSD the CPU load on each core see if they cores are equally stressed very few games will keep all the cores equally stressed. I would judge cooling only but something like Prime, OCCT, or Realbench


https://postimages.org/

15 minute realbench run with fans cranked up, waiting on another two case fans arriving today.


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> How about the stock silicon glue in the PCB, what do you use to remove that after delidding? Would acetone work as well?


Yes, like the guy above said credit card is good or buy some plastic single edged blades from Amazon or Ebay


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> Use a credit card or something like it.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GtiJason*
> 
> Yes, like the guy above said credit card is good or buy some plastic single edged blades from Amazon or Ebay


After removing most of the silicon glue, how do I keep it super clean? Do I need a solution to remove as much as I can?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> After removing most of the silicon glue, how do I keep it super clean? Do I need a solution to remove as much as I can?


Rubbing alcohol or even water works just fine, the credit card will scrap most of it off so you pretty much wont have anything left. I cut a card in 2 and use the just cut sharp edges to do it, works better then anything ive tested.


----------



## stephenn82

Know what won't be a problem later on trying to redo a delid? Rtv silicone. Don't reinvent the wheel.

If you MUST use glue, get gel. Yes, acetone has to soak in the glue to break it down. Chemical reaction baby! Science is awesome.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Know what won't be a problem later on trying to redo a delid? Rtv silicone. Don't reinvent the wheel.
> 
> If you MUST use glue, get gel. Yes, acetone has to soak in the glue to break it down. Chemical reaction baby! Science is awesome.


Yes. This was the whole point of my question, RTC Silicone vs. Super Glue Gel. Based on @geggeg's article, the results in using super glue are better than when rtv silicone is used because of more IHS contact to the CPU die.


----------



## GraphicsWhore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Yes. This was the whole point of my question, RTC Silicone vs. Super Glue Gel. Based on @geggeg
> 's article, the results in using super glue are better than when rtv silicone is used because of more IHS contact to the CPU die.


Almost certainly negligible difference. I used this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002UEN1U/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Absolutely no issues. There was plenty of contact.


----------



## Dimensive

I'm going to be that guy since everyone is going to tell you something different: do what you feel comfortable doing. You've done the research, just buy the products that are cheapest and/or available to you.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Nobody tried to delid Skylake-X yet..?

My chip seems like a decent one. Two hours realbench at 4800/3200 at 1.260-1.265 and 1.150V for mesh. No AVX offset..

4900 crashes, but the temps are much higher, upto 86'C and I think it might have something to do with that.. Battlefield 1 for several hours is no problem.


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Nobody tried to delid Skylake-X yet..?
> 
> My chip seems like a decent one. Two hours realbench at 4800/3200 at 1.260-1.265 and 1.150V for mesh. No AVX offset..
> 
> 4900 crashes, but the temps are much higher, upto 86'C and I think it might have something to do with that.. Battlefield 1 for several hours is no problem.


Check to see if der8beur has done it or wtv his name is, i think he said its VERY tricky as there is resistors right under the IHS next to the silicone.


----------



## Dimensive

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Nobody tried to delid Skylake-X yet..?
> 
> My chip seems like a decent one. Two hours realbench at 4800/3200 at 1.260-1.265 and 1.150V for mesh. No AVX offset..
> 
> 4900 crashes, but the temps are much higher, upto 86'C and I think it might have something to do with that.. Battlefield 1 for several hours is no problem.


----------



## Bitemarks and bloodstains

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Nobody tried to delid Skylake-X yet..?
> 
> My chip seems like a decent one. Two hours realbench at 4800/3200 at 1.260-1.265 and 1.150V for mesh. No AVX offset..
> 
> 4900 crashes, but the temps are much higher, upto 86'C and I think it might have something to do with that.. Battlefield 1 for several hours is no problem.


@Silicon Lottery offers delidding.

https://siliconlottery.com/collections/frontpage/products/delid?variant=42675748748


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bitemarks and bloodstains*
> 
> @Silicon Lottery offers delidding.
> 
> https://siliconlottery.com/collections/frontpage/products/delid?variant=42675748748


Yeah, but shipping from Norway is expensive. Anybody have a clue about warranty if the package is lost?


----------



## bluej511

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Yeah, but shipping from Norway is expensive. Anybody have a clue about warranty if the package is lost?


Get in contact with entersetup.com i believe hes in finland he may be able to do it for you.


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Yeah, but shipping from Norway is expensive. Anybody have a clue about warranty if the package is lost?


Insure it
?


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dimensive*
> 
> I'm going to be that guy since everyone is going to tell you something different: do what you feel comfortable doing. You've done the research, just buy the products that are cheapest and/or available to you.


Yeah, that pretty much sums it up.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> https://postimages.org/
> 
> 15 minute realbench run with fans cranked up, waiting on another two case fans arriving today.


This is my 15 minute realbench run max core temps:



And this the IBT in Very High preset:



Could you run the IBT same settings I did to compare the core variation temperatures? Do you think is normal IBT varies more than RealBench? Should I redoo the delid? Thanks!









Edit.:

These are my IBT Max preset core variation and Prime95, if possible someone can test with delidded Kabylake, I wonder if I need to redelid because of that:


----------



## ViTosS

The 4th core compared to the 2nd one has 6ºC difference temp in IBT Max preset.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> The 4th core compared to the 2nd one has 6ºC difference temp in IBT Max preset.


So what? My chip can vary as much as 15C, but performance is still great. It was like this before my delidding as well and I just don't think there is anything I did wrong that duplicated the result from my delid. Some chips are different. At 142gflops in IBT your already getting some good results as well. Leave it be IMO and obsess about something else


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> So what? My chip can vary as much as 15C, but performance is still great. It was like this before my delidding as well and I just don't think there is anything I did wrong that duplicated the result from my delid. Some chips are different. At 142gflops in IBT your already getting some good results as well. Leave it be IMO and obsess about something else


I see... Yeah you are right, the problem is that I'm too perfectionist in PC things, I see that my cores variation is really high while reading the ''current'' value, even in games, only the maximum that are closer, is this normal too?


----------



## ViTosS

High I mean like where all the cores are at 100% usage and if I keep checking the current value it is like 50ºC one and 59ºC the other, but also there is times where the same that was 50 and the one that was 59 are exactly in 54 or 55, so I think it's just they way the chip is stressed and how Kabylake works, right? I was thinking maybe there was a gap after my delid between the IHS and DIE, that's why I was wanting to re-delid and use Loctite Gel this time to close the gap.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I see... Yeah you are right, the problem is that I'm too perfectionist in PC things, I see that my cores variation is really high while reading the ''current'' value, even in games, only the maximum that are closer, is this normal too?


Yes. Normal. The harder the load and the longer it's ran will bring max temps closer. Games don't use threads equally so even a perfectly balanced chip wouldn't see even temps.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> Yes. Normal. The harder the load and the longer it's ran will bring max temps closer. Games don't use threads equally so even a perfectly balanced chip wouldn't see even temps.


But the variation in the current values happen even in stress tests where the load is 100% in all cores...


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> But the variation in the current values happen even in stress tests where the load is 100% in all cores...


and that's normal. Knock your socks off and relid if you wish. Happy to be proven wrong here, but confident you will just waste your time and nerves.


----------



## HZCH

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> It's just that I was reading this:
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Intel/Delidding_the_Intel_Core_i7_7700K/5.html
> 
> And it looks like thar with the Dr.Delid you get the advantage of using rotational vs. lateral force in getting the IHS removed but you get easier relid support with the Rockit. So I'm not sure which one to get.
> 
> Also, do people here mostly use super glue or silicon glue? In the same article above, the results when super glue was used were better.


I don't get why there are still people using superglue.

You're risking to harm the PCB if you use too much of it, or if it's too strong; you're thus addind another risk if you have to reopen your CPU on an already risked operation. With silicon-based "glue", the worst thing that could happen is you butcher so much the application it ends up looking like a work actually made by Intel, with temps going up ; just delid again, remove and reapply the silicon (or don't apply it at all) and here you go again !

To answer your questions... I used the Delid-die-mate, so it's up to what you need (would go for the Rockit tool, because I need to reseal my CPU).

As far I lurked in this thread, most people actually don't use anything and don't reseal their CPU, but there's a trend "lately" (last months ?) of people recommending following Rockit's instructions with superglue I guess... I indeed went with 4 tiny points of (automotive?) silicone gasket to seal my CPU.


----------



## ducegt

I followed the Rockit instruction video to a T except I didn't buy the relid piece. I just put the IHS on the best I could and placed a glass on top of it while the super glue gel cured. I bought the glue myself and wanted to keep every cost down being delidding is far from economical for what you get. I'll likely never need to do it again. Worked for me and many others. Nothing wrong with sharing a better way like you have done.


----------



## khemist

https://postimages.org/

Around 1.275v 15 min realbench run @4.8 with Cryorig r1 universal.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

As far as core temp variation is concerned... as long as you are running in Windows (esp. Win10) you are likely to have the OS doing all sorts of stuff behind the scenes. Depending on the amount of time the system has been booted, whether you have AV or automatic updates running, or other random 'housekeeping' - a 100% core load isn't actually the same load.

Plus 100% on any CISC chip isn't a _true_ 100% as some instructions/operations require more than a single tick to complete... so it might be 100% loaded but only have performed 1.3M compound instructions during that second in that thread... it just didn't have any free cycles to interrupt so it reported back that it was at full capacity.

It would be great if there was an IBT-type bench that could be run from a minimal, 100% RAM resident kernel... but I'm not aware of any if there are.

Best test I would guess would be to boot your computer and leave it idle for over an hour before running benches if you want a minimum of interruption - still not guaranteed that something isn't scheduled for that time, but at least the file management and phoning home should have settled more.


----------



## kfxsti

Does anyone happen to know where I can get my hands on a delid die guard for the 7700k or the socket it needs ? Lol or if someone can 3d print one out ?? Lol


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> Does anyone happen to know where I can get my hands on a delid die guard for the 7700k or the socket it needs ? Lol or if someone can 3d print one out ?? Lol


Aqua Computer have some metal ones on their website.

But from what I've seen, its not the die you should watch out for with the 7700k, its the flimsy PCB.


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Aqua Computer have some metal ones on their website.
> 
> But from what I've seen, its not the die you should watch out for with the 7700k, its the flimsy PCB.


I read that MSI had one for the z170 motherboard. And it was used at a few overclocking competitions. It was also supposed to be produced because of Skylake and kabylakes think PCB being bent while using large coolers. But I can't find anything else on their version of it.

And thanks for the info you gave


----------



## GtiJason

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> I read that MSI had one for the z170 motherboard. And it was used at a few overclocking competitions. It was also supposed to be produced because of Skylake and kabylakes think PCB being bent while using large coolers. But I can't find anything else on their version of it.
> 
> And thanks for the info you gave


SKL and KBL cpu sockets have plastic that sticks up higher than where the die must be to make proper contact with the pins. So the only ways to do direct die on 1151 is to

A) use a cpu cooler block that fits within the plastic socket walls or

B) use a razor blade to shave these parts down

For XOC we are lucky enough to have some very talented and devoted members such as Bigblock990 and have made our own custom system for ln2 pots to mount direct die. Since I'm sure you know the word custom is just like BOAT aka Bust.Out.Another.Thousand so I don't own one myself but had 2 weeks with the one belonging to "The Machinist".


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## kfxsti

I see I see. While im taking my loop down today to add another pump and CPU block, I'm going to get some measurements over to my dad and see what he can carve out in our shop.


----------



## kevindd992002

Which of these Loctite Super Glue Gel variants is the best to use for re-lidding: http://www.loctiteproducts.com/super-glue-gel.shtml ?

I know the Rockit 88 webshop has the Loctite Super Glue Gel Control but there are others that may be even better. All of these are available in Amazon so no worries.


----------



## kfxsti

Just use your judgement... Your reading to far into this stuff man. Match the gel per Rockit88 and be happy lol


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> Just use your judgement... Your reading to far into this stuff man. Match the gel per Rockit88 and be happy lol


I know, I tend to be like that on all things, lol. Pardon me.


----------



## kfxsti

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> I know, I tend to be like that on all things, lol. Pardon me.


Its all good man. The more you stress over the less fun it becomes. Yes the cpu is an expensive thing to destroy. But just take your time. Relax and have fun man


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kfxsti*
> 
> Its all good man. The more you stress over the less fun it becomes. Yes the cpu is an expensive thing to destroy. But just take your time. Relax and have fun man


I'm not worried about destroying the CPU as I'm pretty much sure this is an easy job to do compared to other things  It's the thought that I'll be losing the warranty for such an expensive component is all. That said, I already bought a Dr. Delid kit from MMM.


----------



## khemist

https://postimages.org/

15 min realbench with a Bequiet silent loop 120 (switched rad to a 240) 7700k delid - 4.8 1.28v.


----------



## cstkl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *khemist*
> 
> https://postimages.org/
> 
> 15 min realbench with a Bequiet silent loop 120 (switched rad to a 240) 7700k delid - 4.8 1.28v.


Switch to the latest build 2.54..


----------



## EDK-TheONE

Macho RT is really dead silent beast.










4900/4500 Vcore (Idle/Load): 1.248 Power under load: 80 Watts 10 rounds H264 Encode.


----------



## stephenn82

RB2.54 only gets about 119k on my system. huh.


----------



## stephenn82

46 multi
100 bclk
1.295v

ddr4 3200 speed.

what should I tweak to get it higher?


----------



## khemist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Switch to the latest build 2.54..


Will try it later today.


----------



## khemist

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cstkl1*
> 
> Switch to the latest build 2.54..


https://postimages.org/

Max on core temp was around 63.


----------



## XavieRElvis

So after basically reading the whole 3000+ replies! of the thread I delidded a 4790k and now want to insulate the capacitors. My options according to everyone here are:
1. clear nail polish but needs to be of good quality acrylic non conductive and questionable durability on high temps, which sounds kinda flaky and not very reassuring with liquid metal application
2. liquid electric tape that sounds the best solution and one I cannot find on any hardware store in my area and finally
3. kapton tape that has the easiest installation of them all but maybe unknown to me caveats
So to those who chose the kapton tape method what is the tapes condition after usage and to all who know is this tape how I should go about or avoid it?
Thanks in advance


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> So after basically reading the whole 3000+ replies! of the thread I delidded a 4790k and now want to insulate the capacitors. My options according to everyone here are:
> 1. clear nail polish but needs to be of good quality acrylic non conductive and questionable durability on high temps, which sounds kinda flaky and not very reassuring with liquid metal application
> 2. liquid electric tape that sounds the best solution and one I cannot find on any hardware store in my area and finally
> 3. kapton tape that has the easiest installation of them all but maybe unknown to me caveats
> So to those who chose the kapton tape method what is the tapes condition after usage and to all who know is this tape how I should go about or avoid it?
> Thanks in advance


I'm wondering about the same. I hope we can hear morw about Kapton tape here. I just knoe that it is used in a lot of eletronics as insulation.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> So after basically reading the whole 3000+ replies! of the thread I delidded a 4790k and now want to insulate the capacitors. My options according to everyone here are:
> 1. clear nail polish but needs to be of good quality acrylic non conductive and questionable durability on high temps, which sounds kinda flaky and not very reassuring with liquid metal application
> 2. liquid electric tape that sounds the best solution and one I cannot find on any hardware store in my area and finally
> 3. kapton tape that has the easiest installation of them all but maybe unknown to me caveats
> So to those who chose the kapton tape method what is the tapes condition after usage and to all who know is this tape how I should go about or avoid it?
> Thanks in advance


Women's Nail Hardener.

Ask your SO, seriously, I heated this stuff to 150C with a heatgun on a dummy Core2Duo and it was just fine.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Women's Nail Hardener.
> 
> Ask your SO, seriously, I heated this stuff to 150C with a heatgun on a dummy Core2Duo and it was just fine.


And if the _surface of the PCB_ is getting anywhere close to even 80C... you've got much, much bigger problems than uncovered traces...









The cores can get there of course... but you're not removing that heat nearly efficiently enough if the void space under the IHS is getting as hot as the cores are.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> So after basically reading the whole 3000+ replies! of the thread I delidded a 4790k and now want to insulate the capacitors. My options according to everyone here are:
> 1. clear nail polish but needs to be of good quality acrylic non conductive and questionable durability on high temps, which sounds kinda flaky and not very reassuring with liquid metal application
> 2. liquid electric tape that sounds the best solution and one I cannot find on any hardware store in my area and finally
> 3. kapton tape that has the easiest installation of them all but maybe unknown to me caveats
> So to those who chose the kapton tape method what is the tapes condition after usage and to all who know is this tape how I should go about or avoid it?
> Thanks in advance


I would say LET is my favorite, but i would also recommend bugging the SO or sister/mom for some cler nail polish. I've used it a number of times and havent had an issue









Your brave for reading all of the posts...... I commend you for that, many people don't take that approach


----------



## XavieRElvis

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would say LET is my favorite, but i would also recommend bugging the SO or sister/mom for some cler nail polish. I've used it a number of times and havent had an issue
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your brave for reading all of the posts...... I commend you for that, many people don't take that approach


Well braver and more knowledgable ppl took the time and effort to post here so I have the mindset that if anyone is undergoing with delidding his CPU, would do a disservice to himself not listening to the ones before him. Having said that clear nail polish is how I will proceed with the insulation mostly cause of availability and general success stories all around.

Any suggestions on what I should look for specifically? Which one did you use on your processors and do I need to watch out for a special electrical conductive type/brand?

Thank you in advance


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> I would say LET is my favorite, but i would also recommend bugging the SO or sister/mom for some cler nail polish. I've used it a number of times and havent had an issue
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your brave for reading all of the posts...... I commend you for that, many people don't take that approach


I thought LET is messy and hard to remove? Plastidip and LET are one and the same, correct?

Have you ever tried Kaptop tape?


----------



## XavieRElvis

Kapton tape looks like the easiest/safest installation of them all and it sounded like it should be the preferred method if it works as expected (easy to install/remove). I don't know how it behaves in high temperatures or if glue diminishes overtime and tape removes itself. I too am interested in hearing from someone who used this method, long term results. Most here suggests the nail polish mostly for larger availability but again most here suggest the CLU over the superior t.g.conductonaut (even by a smaller margin) so my guess is as good as anyone's.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> Kapton tape looks like the easiest/safest installation of them all and it sounded like it should be the preferred method if it works as expected (easy to install/remove). I don't know how it behaves in high temperatures or if glue diminishes overtime and tape removes itself. I too am interested in hearing from someone who used this method, long term results. Most here suggests the nail polish mostly for larger availability but again most here suggest the CLU over the superior t.g.conductonaut (even by a smaller margin) so my guess is as good as anyone's.


For what it's worth. I tested Nitto electrical tape over a dummy C2duo PCB. With 150C of direct heat from a heatgun then tape started curling at the edges after about 5 minutes.


----------



## Roboyto

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *XavieRElvis*
> 
> Kapton tape looks like the easiest/safest installation of them all and it sounded like it should be the preferred method if it works as expected (easy to install/remove). I don't know how it behaves in high temperatures or if glue diminishes overtime and tape removes itself. I too am interested in hearing from someone who used this method, long term results. Most here suggests the nail polish mostly for larger availability but again most here suggest the CLU over the superior t.g.conductonaut (even by a smaller margin) so my guess is as good as anyone's.


A small piece of thermal tape or thermal pad works well and stands up to the environment. I used thermal tape under my IHS and liked it as it helped the IHS from moving when latching/securing everything into the board.


----------



## Jobotoo

Subbed


----------



## Jobotoo

Does anyone have any experience with 3rd party CPU Integrated Heat Spreaders like this Bitspower one?

If so, any better temps?


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jobotoo*
> 
> Does anyone have any experience with 3rd party CPU Integrated Heat Spreaders like this Bitspower one?
> 
> If so, any better temps?


I have no experience with the Bitspower one but I know a guy that did a custom copper one for me. It was 2 for $38 USD


I did see a minor advantage of 1-2C due to the fact my stock IHS doesn't adapt to my waterblock very well. I also gained another 2C by using Conductonaut between the new Copper IHS and the waterblock, I can preserve my stock IHS in the meantime.

This is the guy, send him an email and he'll work something out for you.
[email protected]


----------



## Jobotoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> I have no experience with the Bitspower one but I know a guy that did a custom copper one for me. It was 2 for $38 USD
> 
> 
> I did see a minor advantage of 1-2C due to the fact my stock IHS doesn't adapt to my waterblock very well. I also gained another 2C by using Conductonaut between the new Copper IHS and the waterblock, I can preserve my stock IHS in the meantime.
> 
> This is the guy, send him an email and he'll work something out for you.
> [email protected]


This is AWESOME! Thank you so much for the info!


----------



## Unknownm

WOW this stuff is amazing.

AS5 on DIE + IHS = Prime95 FMA3 8 - 12K = 96c
LUP on DIE + IHS = Prime95 FMA3 8 - 12K = 70s

BIG difference.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jobotoo*
> 
> Does anyone have any experience with 3rd party CPU Integrated Heat Spreaders like this Bitspower one?
> 
> If so, any better temps?


I didn't know there was something like this and I'm also interested if anyone have used this and got better temps?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jobotoo*
> 
> Does anyone have any experience with 3rd party CPU Integrated Heat Spreaders like this Bitspower one?
> 
> If so, any better temps?


my temps are exactly the same after using the bitspower IHS
that being said
my stock IHS is very even to begin with


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> my temps are exactly the same after using the bitspower IHS
> that being said
> my stock IHS is very even to begin with


When did you buy yours? It seems that there is a newer version (lower height) compared to the one released a few months back.


----------



## bajer29

Is there a good re-lid walkthrough out there? Planning on using a CLC on a delidded 4790k and wanted to re-lid to protect the die a bit from pump vibration. Should I glue/ tape the IHS back on or let it slide? What about insulating the capacitors?

Sorry I'm new to this and the amount of information in this thread is overwhelming...


----------



## stephenn82

yeah, first to get a general overview of it...pretty awesome. I remember reading his articles like 10 years ago...good info here.






and this one, how to do it all without any tools whatsoever. I did this method first...with a tool it is MUCH faster/easier.


----------



## Jobotoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> I didn't know there was something like this and I'm also interested if anyone have used this and got better temps?


There is also a guy that makes custom ones. As soon as he has some for Skylake-X I'm getting one and will post results.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jobotoo*
> 
> There is also a guy that makes custom ones. As soon as he has some for Skylake-X I'm getting one and will post results.


Right, I read that in the post above but which one between his and Bitspower's is better?


----------



## Jobotoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Right, I read that in the post above but which one between his and Bitspower's is better?


That is what I want to test. The Bitspower one is not for Skylake-X yet, so hopping there will be one soonish, and the custom one is in development and should be available soonish also.

So basically, I am Delidding my 7900X, then testing temps with original IHS, the Bitspower IHS, and the custom IHS when they become available. From others experience I have been told that the Bitspoer IHS lowered their temps a few degrees C, while the custom IHS was a bit better. But testing on different CPUs won't give a good picture. I will test on the same CPU to give a better result, imo.

Once I do, I'll post the info so others can decide on which way they prefer to go.


----------



## Seijitsu

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jobotoo*
> 
> That is what I want to test. The Bitspower one is not for Skylake-X yet, so hopping there will be one soonish, and the custom one is in development and should be available soonish also.
> 
> So basically, I am Delidding my 7900X, then testing temps with original IHS, the Bitspower IHS, and the custom IHS when they become available. From others experience I have been told that the Bitspoer IHS lowered their temps a few degrees C, while the custom IHS was a bit better. But testing on different CPUs won't give a good picture. I will test on the same CPU to give a better result, imo.
> 
> Once I do, I'll post the info so others can decide on which way they prefer to go.


I think there's a lot of bias in the results, people are trying to justify their purchases. I've compared the bitspower and stock IHS on my own and there was no difference within margin of error.


----------



## Jobotoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> I think there's a lot of bias in the results, people are trying to justify their purchases. I've compared the bitspower and stock IHS on my own and there was no difference within margin of error.


That is very likely and thanks for letting us know. The more input, the better. I still have the desire to test it out for myself and see which I prefer on using in the end.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> I think there's a lot of bias in the results, people are trying to justify their purchases. I've compared the bitspower and stock IHS on my own and there was no difference within margin of error.


But do you think all of them were biased?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

As the difference is most likely to be contained to the thermal conductivity of the metal itself, and as (I believe) they are all nickel plated copper... the conductivity should be identical.

It _might be possible_ to see a slight difference due to machining tolerances - however, considering the manufacturing prowess of Intel vs. aftermarket... that would likely swing in favor of the OEM IHS actually.

I'd say you buy an aftermarket IHS purely for looks - which is ironic considering you'll only see it while the system is non-operational during building... but hey - some of us spend 30-40 hours just working on aspects of our builds that will be permanently hidden behind case panels or in hidden recesses... who am I to say what's "worth it" or not?


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> I think there's a lot of bias in the results, people are trying to justify their purchases. I've compared the bitspower and stock IHS on my own and there was no difference within margin of error.


I did specifically mention it entirely depends on how good a person's stock IHS actually is.

In fact, the main reason I got mine was so I could use conductonaut between the IHS and the Waterblock without destroying the original IHS. When you use something like conductonaut in such a manner, contact intimacy becomes irrelevant and any gains are directly related to Z-height.

Also, no IHS, stock or custom can exceed the performance of a naked mount which is typically only 4-5C better than a delidded stock IHS.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> When did you buy yours? It seems that there is a newer version (lower height) compared to the one released a few months back.


err
February I think

not gonna matter enough for me to rip it out again
as I would have to redo not only the LM under the IHS, but also probably lapp my AiO cooler this time around for a clean surface
I'm using LM on the IHS as well
which is fine as long as you're not disturbing the stuff
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jobotoo*
> 
> That is very likely and thanks for letting us know. The more input, the better. I still have the desire to test it out for myself and see which I prefer on using in the end.


there is one advantage
if you want to use LM on the IHS like me, then you might appreciate not using the original IHS
as LM eats away the letters on the stock IHS
might reduce resale value

also some people did have some bad IHS with kaby
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> I think there's a lot of bias in the results, people are trying to justify their purchases. I've compared the bitspower and stock IHS on my own and there was no difference within margin of error.


while it might be true (and some did have some bad stock IHS)

those bitspower IHS cost 20 bucks with shipping (was 23€ for me I think)
that's not really in a price range to justify something


----------



## Seijitsu

I guess another point I was trying to make. I can see a 1-2C difference in temperatures each time I remount the same IHS, so seeing a 1-2C difference with a different IHS is really just margin of error. I would say either delidding and reusing the IHS (up to 20C on it's own), or direct die (Maybe another 5C on top there) are the only options really worth considering.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> I guess another point I was trying to make. I can see a 1-2C difference in temperatures each time I remount the same IHS, so seeing a 1-2C difference with a different IHS is really just margin of error. I would say either delidding and reusing the IHS (up to 20C on it's own), or direct die (Maybe another 5C on top there) are the only options really worth considering.


well

agreed

just saying there seems to have been a few with uneven stock IHS

but yeah like 2 degrees difference is something you could have remounting the same IHS

that's why I always say that my temps didn't change when someone asks about those custom IHS

which isn't technically true

2 cores are about 1 degree hotter on average actually

but that's just a margin of error, just because of mounting
mounting pressure of my AiO and so on


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Seijitsu*
> 
> I guess another point I was trying to make. I can see a 1-2C difference in temperatures each time I remount the same IHS, so seeing a 1-2C difference with a different IHS is really just margin of error. I would say either delidding and reusing the IHS (up to 20C on it's own), or direct die (Maybe another 5C on top there) are the only options really worth considering.


it depends, if you use Liquid metal or Indigo Extreme between the IHS and block, mounting pressure matters very little.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Unknownm*
> 
> WOW this stuff is amazing.
> 
> AS5 on DIE + IHS = Prime95 FMA3 8 - 12K = 96c
> LUP on DIE + IHS = Prime95 FMA3 8 - 12K = 70s
> 
> BIG difference.


Welcome to the great world of temp gains!!!


----------



## kevindd992002

Is it worth using a Delid Die-Guard with a bare die vs. just relidding a delidded CPU with the stock IHS?


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Is it worth using a Delid Die-Guard with a bare die vs. just relidding a delidded CPU with the stock IHS?


Bare die with SKL/KBL is a pain because the die sits lower than the 4 plastic posts around the socket. You need to shave those down otherwise the watwrblock/ cooler doesnt contact properly. If you use a copper shim you've just negated the gains from direct cooling.

Imo direct die cooling is too risky and too much work for 3C.


----------



## 21Dante

4690K after 3 years of use



15-20 degrees down,after delid.Not bad.And the 212 evo can keep up at 4,[email protected],224V at prime 95 small ftts and 175 watt load


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Bare die with SKL/KBL is a pain because the die sits lower than the 4 plastic posts around the socket. You need to shave those down otherwise the watwrblock/ cooler doesnt contact properly. If you use a copper shim you've just negated the gains from direct cooling.
> 
> Imo direct die cooling is too risky and too much work for 3C.


Isn't this the purpose of the delid die guard? Or is that something that's only for Haswell?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Isn't this the purpose of the delid die guard? Or is that something that's only for Haswell?


ohh now I have to go all out









the delid die guard


Spoiler: Warning: Aliexpress Delid Die Guard For LGA115X



https://pt.aliexpress.com/store/product/Z97-XPOWER-AC-CPU-Open-Cover-Protector-Delid-Die-Guard-For-LGA115X-Series-CPU/1389904_32621328449.html?isOrigTitle=true




is there so you cant brake the die (chipping it off, too much pressure; one reason why both Intel and AMD now put a IHS on while they didn't in the past, I remember a lot of chipped AthlonXP and Duron)
or it mounts weird on the die (as the die is rather tiny)

but what you need is something like this



https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy

because the substrate is just a bit thinner than previous chips
so your cooler will not make contact with the die

however
this custom mounting does not work on skylake, so it wont on kaby
overclock.net WARNING. EK naked ivy/haswell mounting does NOT work for SKYLAKE CPU!!!

and I think to remember that skylake and kaby don't have the same height either (think the kaby was just a tad lower again), that's without IHS


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Delidding my 7700k tonight.


----------



## Jobotoo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Delidding my 7700k tonight.


How'd it go? Pics?


----------



## stephenn82

pics? pics? pics??? how did it go? was it life changing? no, not the delid...but the drop of temps? I loved it. 6700k went down to 17c on idle for me. ambient in my room is like 17-19c at times. woooo!


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Doing it tonight guys, didn't realize Singapore doesn't sell razor blade (weird!) and rockit cool. Had to order a pair from China, got the package hour ago.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Just did it. Hoped to achieve 5.2Ghz but only 5Ghz for now and the package is 80* under p95 already. A bit disappointed but then I guess that's it. There goes my warranty.
I scratched the PCB - saw yellow thing - and used white out to cover. Didn't clean all the silicon (as shown in the 3rd picture) but I don't know if it really makes a difference.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Just did it. Hoped to achieve 5.2Ghz but only 5Ghz for now and the package is 80* under p95 already. A bit disappointed but then I guess that's it. There goes my warranty.
> I scratched the PCB - saw yellow thing - and used white out to cover. Didn't clean all the silicon (as shown in the 3rd picture) but I don't know if it really makes a difference.


Ouch! You should've used a tool.


----------



## stephenn82

especially the free ones going around on here, "Cross Country Delid Extravaganza" thread


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> especially the free ones going around on here, "Cross Country Delid Extravaganza" thread


I wish I had known it before.
But no next time I'll still go razor. Once you go razor...you know


----------



## stephenn82

I have posted it into this thread at least twice


----------



## cdnGhost

Need some advice... best place to sell a 7600k 5ghz chip
And no I'm not posting to sell here. Just wondering if eBay would be good....


----------



## Unknownm

been about 2 weeks since I applied Liquid Ultra Pro. Damn! with AS5 I would bit hitting 95c easily


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> I wish I had known it before.
> But no next time I'll still go razor. Once you go razor...you know


Hmmm with the temp issues you may be having, I would definitely try liquid ultra or pro. Nothing really compares when that stuff contacts right.







Glad the chip still works!!


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cdnGhost*
> 
> Need some advice... best place to sell a 7600k 5ghz chip
> And no I'm not posting to sell here. Just wondering if eBay would be good....


on here, Reddit.com/r/hardwareswap eBay last resort.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Hmmm with the temp issues you may be having, I would definitely try liquid ultra or pro. Nothing really compares when that stuff contacts right.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Glad the chip still works!!


Is liquid ultra better than conductonaut? Given my 7700k requires 1.4V to be stable at 5Ghz, and my chassis can only host a 120 AIO. Are you sure there's still room for improvement.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Is liquid ultra better than conductonaut? Given my 7700k requires 1.4V to be stable at 5Ghz, and my chassis can only host a 120 AIO. Are you sure there's still room for improvement.


Conductonaut and CLP/CLU should be within a degree of each other, so basically very similar....No one really knows how Conductonaut does long-term yet though, whereas CLP/CLU have been around longer so the behavior is more predictable.


----------



## DeathAngel74

I was wondering the same thing. Getting ready to delid the 7820X soon.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Anyway I'm thinking if buying a pair of SP120 fan would help? I'm using the stock h80i fans and I've read somewhere said they're SP fan as well.
My case is VERY cramped.
OR should I go for air? I'm using bitfenix portal, the airflow is kinda weird (just google it and you'll see)


----------



## Kalpa

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> I scratched the PCB - saw yellow thing - and used white out to cover.


Lucky break! You could easily have a dead CPU instead! Congratulations on succesful operation nevertheless.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Conductonaut and CLP/CLU should be within a degree of each other, so basically very similar....No one really knows how Conductonaut does long-term yet though, whereas CLP/CLU have been around longer so the behavior is more predictable.


check out der8auers site. He does his own studies and swears by them. Sure they may be his sponsor, but he really tests his stuff. Like torture tests it. LM will hold up fine long run like 3 plus years. Just go with what you can get cheapest to your door. Wont notice a difference.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Is liquid ultra better than conductonaut? Given my 7700k requires 1.4V to be stable at 5Ghz, and my chassis can only host a 120 AIO. Are you sure there's still room for improvement.


Ah 120 AIO, now it makes sense. I feel your cramped case pain....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Is liquid ultra better than conductonaut? Given my 7700k requires 1.4V to be stable at 5Ghz, and my chassis can only host a 120 AIO. Are you sure there's still room for improvement.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> check out der8auers site. He does his own studies and swears by them. Sure they may be his sponsor, but he really tests his stuff. Like torture tests it. LM will hold up fine long run like 3 plus years. Just go with what you can get cheapest to your door. Wont notice a difference.


Agreed


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> check out der8auers site. He does his own studies and swears by them. Sure they may be his sponsor, but he really tests his stuff. Like torture tests it. LM will hold up fine long run like 3 plus years. Just go with what you can get cheapest to your door. Wont notice a difference.


Conductonaut hasn't even been out for anywhere near 3 years yet, so how could that claim be made? It's only been available for a little over a year....So far, the most accurate claim that could be made is this: "Conductonaut will last at least a year"....


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Conductonaut hasn't even been out for anywhere near 3 years yet, so how could that claim be made? It's only been available for a little over a year....So far, the most accurate claim that could be made is this: "Conductonaut will last at least a year"....


What I said:
LM will hold up fine long run like 3 plus years. Just go with what you can get cheapest to your door. Wont notice a difference.

Capital F Man...really?

Let's lay it down so you can pick it up.

Liquid metal (see how I left any branding out there?) will last you three years with no issue. People on this thread from 2014 did Haswell and ivy delid with CLU have no issues today.

Now, on paper, and in theory, Conductonaut is better at transferring heat over CLU. Will you notice a difference? Not at all.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> What I said:
> LM will hold up fine long run like 3 plus years. Just go with what you can get cheapest to your door. Wont notice a difference.
> 
> Capital F Man...really?
> 
> Let's lay it down so you can pick it up.
> 
> Liquid metal (see how I left any branding out there?) will last you three years with no issue. People on this thread from 2014 did Haswell and ivy delid with CLU have no issues today.
> 
> Now, on paper, and in theory, Conductonaut is better at transferring heat over CLU. Will you notice a difference? Not at all.


Sorry, but everything I stated is fact....

*Fact 1)* Conductonaut has been out for a little over a year.

*Fact 2)* No one can speak from personal experience about the longevity of Conductonaut, but one can assume though. In order for the claims on longevity to be true, the particular product would at least need to be on the market for that amount of time - anything else is basically just a guess or an assumption.

*Fact 3)* Conductonaut performs very similarly to CLP/CLU/LM - within the margin of error (according to tests people have done).

Yeah, I know about CLP, it's been on my 4670K for a couple of years now, and on my 1070 for about 2 months....


----------



## Jobotoo

I went with Conductonaut and could not be happier. The tamps are fantastic, imo. (I'm pretty sure that if I would have gone with CLU I'd be equally happy).

I put Conductonaut under IHS and Kryonaut above.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Jobotoo*
> 
> I went with Conductonaut and could not be happier. The tamps are fantastic, imo. (I'm pretty sure that if I would have gone with CLU I'd be equally happy).
> 
> I put Conductonaut under IHS and Kryonaut above.


I'm going to be trying it out, as I'm always curious about what works best.

NOTE: If anyone is interpreting any of my statements as though I'm bashing Conductonaut in any way, then my words are being misinterpreted. I've used Kryonaut, and I believe that Thermal Grizzly did a great job, and I expect that to continue on with their Conductonaut. However, I run on facts and information, not assumptions or guesses. CLP/CLU/LM (Phobya) have been around for years, and have a proven track record. This is what Thermal Grizzly is currently in the process of forming, and so far, its going well for them.


----------



## stephenn82

Dude. You aren't picking it up. I will just pass on it.

Yeah, conductonaut is legit. I put it on my die, my friend used CLU on his 7700k and we are both happy with our results. Hence why I said what you can get at lowest cost to your door. Great products, the both of them.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Dude. You aren't picking it up. I will just pass on it.
> 
> Yeah, conductonaut is legit. I put it on my die, my friend used CLU on his 7700k and we are both happy with our results. Hence why I said what you can get at lowest cost to your door. Great products, the both of them.


2 words: "reading comprehension" - you might want to work on it.


----------



## cyan

Just wondering how much is CLU contain in 1 syringe ?
I know conductonaut is 1 gram.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Don't know the exact measurement as my syringe of it isn't graduated... but I'd guess about the same. I can safely say it's enough for about 10 applications at least as I've done 7 so far out of my original kit, and I've got a decent amount left still.

...And on the on going discussion... way more than 3 years is possible as I've not re-done my original 3770K which was about 6 years ago now.


----------



## tps3443

Ive just bought a pretty good used overclocking 6950X. I have not received it yet but i was just curious, anyone here have one delidded?

I delidded my 6600K, and went from barely running 4.8Ghz, to rock stable @ 5.12Ghz.

My temps were like 5C colder at 5.12 delidded vs before at 4.8Ghz.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Ive just bought a pretty good used overclocking 6950X. I have not received it yet but i was just curious, anyone here have one delidded?
> 
> I delidded my 6600K, and went from barely running 4.8Ghz, to rock stable @ 5.12Ghz.
> 
> My temps were like 5C colder at 5.12 delidded vs before at 4.8Ghz.


The 6950X is soldered. You can delid it but you are likely to destroy your chip.


----------



## tps3443

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> The 6950X is soldered. You can delid it but you are likely to destroy your chip.


Well ive removed the IHS on a soldered cpu before, and Im well aware of the the risk involved and the 6950X being soldered. It wouldnt get destroyed if I attempted it.. I was really looking for input on temps differences. Google does not offer a whole lot.


----------



## cyan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Don't know the exact measurement as my syringe of it isn't graduated... but I'd guess about the same. I can safely say it's enough for about 10 applications at least as I've done 7 so far out of my original kit, and I've got a decent amount left still.


So basically grab which is cheaper ? (Conductonaut is $5 cheaper here )
I always thought conductonaut has less content than clu.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> So basically grab which is cheaper ? (Conductonaut is $5 cheaper here )
> I always thought conductonaut has less content than clu.


Grab the one that is a better deal

Usually one de-lids the chip, seals it and leaves it as is
There is no need for several applications

People usually don't like to use it *on* the IHS

using it on you're GPU is potentionally way more dangerous (way more capacitors right next to the chip)
And since the cooler on the gpu has direct contact it matters way less

Or if you would build a Ryzen system, which are soldered, the difference between a high end paste and any liquid metal one would be next to negligible


----------



## Silicon Lottery

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *tps3443*
> 
> Well ive removed the IHS on a soldered cpu before, and Im well aware of the the risk involved and the 6950X being soldered. It wouldnt get destroyed if I attempted it.. I was really looking for input on temps differences. Google does not offer a whole lot.


http://www.overclock.net/t/1613986/broadwell-e-direct-die-mounting-instructions


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Just wondering how much is CLU contain in 1 syringe ?
> I know conductonaut is 1 gram.


the tube sent around in the kit was 1 gram as well.









For you science guys out there:

For comparison, here is the "Thermal Conductivity" values for comparison:
Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut - 73 W/mk
Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra - 38.4 W/mk
Coollaboratory Liquid Pro - 32.6 W/mk
Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut -12.5 W/mk
Gelid GC-Extreme - 8.5 W/mk

You wouldn't notice any differences unless running these at say 7ghz?

Again, there is no noticeable difference between my friends 7700k with CLU and my 6700k with Conductonaut. By nature the 7700k will overclock more...but the idle temps are exact (17-19c, ambient is about 19-21c) and my load temps at 4.6ghz and 1.295v is 48c, His running same volts at 5.0ghz is 49-50c. We both have AIO on top as well...I have h115i he has h100v2.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> the tube sent around in the kit was 1 gram as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For you science guys out there:
> 
> For comparison, here is the "Thermal Conductivity" values for comparison:
> Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut - 73 W/mk
> Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra - 38.4 W/mk
> Coollaboratory Liquid Pro - 32.6 W/mk
> Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut -12.5 W/mk
> Gelid GC-Extreme - 8.5 W/mk
> 
> You wouldn't notice any differences unless running these at say 7ghz?
> 
> Again, there is no noticeable difference between my friends 7700k with CLU and my 6700k with Conductonaut. By nature the 7700k will overclock more...but the idle temps are exact (17-19c, ambient is about 19-21c) and my load temps at 4.6ghz and 1.295v is 48c, His running same volts at 5.0ghz is 49-50c. We both have AIO on top as well...I have h115i he has h100v2.


I think the calculations were something like this
Q= -K x Delta T

Where Q = heat flux, K= conductivity

If you re-arrange the equation, for a given heatflux (which is constant in the case of CPUs), ever greater Delta Ts can only be achieved through an inverse quadratic function (i.e. diminishing returns). That is why you see gradually worse gains as the conductivity of the TIM goes up without modifying any other variables.

So despite the massive numerical increase, you have to constantly double the conductivity in order to double the Delta T and at a certain point, the difference is like 0.5C vs 1C. And once you're in the 0.5C and 1C range, you need to start looking at optimizing other variables such as Z-height for conduction, contact intimacy.

From my testing and calculations, once you are past 32.6W/mk mark the contact intimacy matters much more than the conductivity number. That is why compounds such as Indigo Extreme can outperform Conductonaut despite the worse conductivity because the nature of it's application ensures an almost perfect contact.

Also, this is all assuming the manufacturer is being honest about how they measure the conductivity figure.


----------



## ViTosS

I just opened my 7700k from using CLU and Permatex and now I used Conductonaut and Loctite (to lower the gap between IHS and DIE) and I had -3ºC difference in all cores, I thought would drop more, but can't complain.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I just opened my 7700k from using CLU and Permatex and now I used Conductonaut and Loctite (to lower the gap between IHS and DIE) and I had -3ºC difference in all cores, I thought would drop more, but can't complain.


So what was your temp before and now?
-3 celcius is not exactly worth it right? Maybe you just got a very good 7700k that doesn't really need delidding


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> So what was your temp before and now?
> -3 celcius is not exactly worth it right? Maybe you just got a very good 7700k that doesn't really need delidding


I don't think you understood me, I had already delidded and was using Permatex to close the IHS and CLU between the IHS and DIE, and I re-delidded now using Conductonaut and Loctite Gel to close the IHS and to make less gap between IHS and DIE and I had a 3ºC reduction in all cores, maybe 5ºC because when I stress tested it was more hot than before.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> I don't think you understood me, I had already delidded and was using Permatex to close the IHS and CLU between the IHS and DIE, and I re-delidded now using Conductonaut and Loctite Gel to close the IHS and to make less gap between IHS and DIE and I had a 3ºC reduction in all cores, maybe 5ºC because when I stress tested it was more hot than before.


Ah yeah true, totally missed the context.


----------



## {EAC} Shoot em UP

Holy crap I haven't posed on here in years..........

So I decided I am going to delid my 4770. I am having a 3d print made of a delid tool, have some Conductonaut and Kryonaut on its way, and I will be giving this a try. I have a custom loop so I figure I might as well make it run quieter. That is my main goal. Chip doesn't OC worth a *****, so I figure at least I can make the dies cool down and run the fans slower. I want to get them sub 700 rpm in game, right now they are around 900-950 rpm, don't wan't to hear them.

Any advice in general, and specifically how/should I seal the capacitors on the top of the chip? I will be using liquid metal and have never done it before, so I figure sealing them would be the best idea... Liquid electrical tape? If so, what type?

Just for more info, in normal game load, my package temp is usually around 42-45c depending on ambient and which game, but die temps can easily be high 60's, spikes to low 70's. And that is @4.4 ,forget the votls off hand. My GTX 1080 @ 1999 MHZ for reference usually runs ~48-54c depending on the game and ambient. If I can pull those cpu die temps down, it would be wonderful.run both CPU and GPU at ~60c with literally 0 noise would be ideal.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *{EAC} Shoot em UP*
> 
> Holy crap I haven't posed on here in years..........
> 
> So I decided I am going to delid my 4770. I am having a 3d print made of a delid tool, have some Conductonaut and Kryonaut on its way, and I will be giving this a try. I have a custom loop so I figure I might as well make it run quieter. That is my main goal. Chip doesn't OC worth a *****, so I figure at least I can make the dies cool down and run the fans slower. I want to get them sub 700 rpm in game, right now they are around 900-950 rpm, don't wan't to hear them.
> 
> Any advice in general, and specifically how/should I seal the capacitors on the top of the chip? I will be using liquid metal and have never done it before, so I figure sealing them would be the best idea... Liquid electrical tape? If so, what type?
> 
> Just for more info, in normal game load, my package temp is usually around 42-45c depending on ambient and which game, but die temps can easily be high 60's, spikes to low 70's. And that is @4.4 ,forget the votls off hand. My GTX 1080 @ 1999 MHZ for reference usually runs ~48-54c depending on the game and ambient. If I can pull those cpu die temps down, it would be wonderful.run both CPU and GPU at ~60c with literally 0 noise would be ideal.


Some people have reported using clear nail polish to cover the parts next to the die....Personally, I didn't put anything on my 4670K besides CLP and have had no issues with it shifting around at all.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Some people have reported using clear nail polish to cover the parts next to the die....Personally, I didn't put anything on my 4670K besides CLP and have had no issues with it shifting around at all.


Yeah I've never had any significant shifting on any of the ones I've re-opened to check... but considering the price of clear nail polish it's cheap insurance if you're not 100% confident in your LM application.


----------



## {EAC} Shoot em UP

Why nail polish over a liquid electrical tape?


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *{EAC} Shoot em UP*
> 
> Why nail polish over a liquid electrical tape?


Or just Kapton Tape?


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *{EAC} Shoot em UP*
> 
> Why nail polish over a liquid electrical tape?


Does that hold up at 100C?


----------



## {EAC} Shoot em UP

I am not sure, but I would think electrical tape would do better then nail polish..? Plus, if your capacitors or hitting 100c, you probably have more things going wrong I would think...


----------



## blaze2210

Apparently the nail polish holds up, since the people who have used it keep recommending it....I haven't seen anything that would suggest otherwise....


----------



## {EAC} Shoot em UP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Or just Kapton Tape?


That seems like a decent idea. 180c is pretty solid!


----------



## cyan

any guide/tips for manual relid ?
except the one from hardocp most guide are using delid/relid tool like rock it


----------



## {EAC} Shoot em UP

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> any guide/tips for manual relid ?
> except the one from hardocp most guide are using delid/relid tool like rock it


Good question, because I have the same one.I was going to make a ghetto jig for it, but I am not 100% sure yet what I will do.


----------



## DanielF50

So I delidded my 7700k yesterday & wow, what an improvement!

Originally, it was running at 5ghz (1.34v stable) and full load saw ~80°c on each core, with an ambient temp of about 19/20°c. After delidding, replacing the stock TIM with Conductonaut, reseating the IHS (but not re-lidding) & re-applying my NT-H1: I've seen a drop of .*0*6v (1.28v) to stay stable and I'm seeing 55°c maximum temp at full load while running the custom x264 stress test.

I'm absolutely certain the .*0*6v and 25°c drop isn't 100% down to the delid as my original overclock didn't take into account my VCCIO & SA voltages (both were on auto), & I had also left HT, VT-d and all C states on which obviously meant the OC was less stable & needed more voltage to stablise, meaning more heat.

All in all I'm extremely impressed though, I'm loving how quiet the Noctua D15 is now.

*e: .06*


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *{EAC} Shoot em UP*
> 
> That seems like a decent idea. 180c is pretty solid!


Kapton tape is built to be used for electeonics at high temps and it's not expensive.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Kapton tape is built to be used for electeonics at high temps and it's not expensive.


Women's nail hardener. Dirt cheap, readily available from one's significant other and can tolerate 150c with zero issues.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> any guide/tips for manual relid ?
> except the one from hardocp most guide are using delid/relid tool like rock it


Because they (HardOCP) have been doing de-lids before it was considered necessary

A tip?

If you have not done a delid with a blade before go buy a used/broken core 2duo
For practice
Or any old Intel CPU with IHS that isn't soldered

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Kapton tape is built to be used for electeonics at high temps and it's not expensive.


And yet I don't have it back home, as most people probably don't have either

But if you're married or have a girlfriend then it's a good bet you have access to the alternative
Its even easy to apply and comes with it's own brush

Ehh

This reminds me of people thinking they need a gasket silicone to glue the whole thing together
Because we all know 350 degrees Celsius is a common temp for the glue to withstand on a daily basis


----------



## cyan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> Because they (HardOCP) have been doing de-lids before it was considered necessary
> 
> A tip?
> 
> If you have not done a delid with a blade before go buy a used/broken core 2duo
> For practice
> Or any old Intel CPU with IHS that isn't soldered
> And yet I don't have it back home, as most people probably don't have either
> 
> But if you're married or have a girlfriend then it's a good bet you have access to the alternative
> Its even easy to apply and comes with it's own brush
> 
> Ehh
> 
> This reminds me of people thinking they need a gasket silicone to glue the whole thing together
> Because we all know 350 degrees Celsius is a common temp for the glue to withstand on a daily basis


Thanks but what I am asking is Relid.
I borrowed friend 3d printed device and already delid mine.
He's not relid his processor, but I'm thinking of relid mine.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Thanks but what I am asking is Relid.
> I borrowed friend 3d printed device and already delid mine.
> He's not relid his processor, but I'm thinking of relid mine.


I opened mine up after 3 months as well, basically was just curious
second time I had no tool handy and used a blade

its easier the second time around, usually the silicone is softer and also way less (meaning its a thinner line to cut through) than Intel uses

if your using a tool you cant make so many mistakes, as well as you have done so already

mmm
I think its recommended that when you do a second time, you wett the IHS as well (with LM)

I think its been said here and there that the liquid metal pastes don't stick so well to the underside of the IHS the second time around

also
3d printed?

like this one?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DanielF50*
> 
> So I delidded my 7700k yesterday & wow, what an improvement!
> 
> Originally, it was running at 5ghz (1.34v stable) and full load saw ~80°c on each core, with an ambient temp of about 19/20°c. After delidding, replacing the stock TIM with Conductonaut, reseating the IHS (but not re-lidding) & re-applying my NT-H1: I've seen a drop of .6v (1.28v) to stay stable and I'm seeing 55°c maximum temp at full load while running the custom x264 stress test.
> 
> I'm absolutely certain the .6v and 25°c drop isn't 100% down to the delid as my original overclock didn't take into account my VCCIO & SA voltages (both were on auto), & I had also left HT, VT-d and all C states on which obviously meant the OC was less stable & needed more voltage to stablise, meaning more heat.
> 
> All in all I'm extremely impressed though, I'm loving how quiet the Noctua D15 is now.


Awesome!! .06V btw


----------



## DanielF50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Awesome!! .06V btw


Thanks & yeah, that's definitely what I meant - I was a bit tired at 1am last night! hah.


----------



## ViTosS

1.28v for 5.0Ghz is pretty good chip. I have 4.9Ghz and 1.328v stable, but if I had 20ºC ambient temp would help a lot, current temp now is 34ºC in my city in Brazil.


----------



## DanielF50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> 1.28v for 5.0Ghz is pretty good chip. I have 4.9Ghz and 1.328v stable, but if I had 20ºC ambient temp would help a lot, current temp now is 34ºC in my city in Brazil.


Yeah, I'm pretty impressed with it, especially as I'm using Gigabyte board as with a Asus board I would definitely hit 5ghz with less vcore.

Have you been able to lower your vcore by setting your vccio/vccsa/pch core to a static voltage? Those settings definitely helped me achieve a much lower vcore.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DanielF50*
> 
> Yeah, I'm pretty impressed with it, especially as I'm using Gigabyte board as with a Asus board I would definitely hit 5ghz with less vcore.
> 
> Have you been able to lower your vcore by setting your vccio/vccsa/pch core to a static voltage? Those settings definitely helped me achieve a much lower vcore.


Would you please share your settings for vccio/vccsa/pch? I'm also using a gigabyte board, but I need 1.4V for 5ghz


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Would you please share your settings for vccio/vccsa/pch? I'm also using a gigabyte board, but I need 1.4V for 5ghz


I keep both of mine to 1.2V maximum. That is the lowest needed for my RAM which is 3466mhz CL 14 15 15 42 1.375V Samsung B Die.

My PCH is stock standard, no need to touch that.


----------



## ViTosS

Guys, I noticed something, when I had delidded and was using Permatex to close the IHS down and CLU as TIM I had a solid 69~70ºC in all cores running x264 loop or Realbench 2.54, so I decided to open and use this time Conductonaut and close with Loctite Gel, everything went fine, my temps did drop about 2~4ºC, but the problem is now that I don't have the consistency in the cores temperatures like before, instead of solid 69~70ºC (1ºC difference between all the cores at the most) not I have Core 1 at 67ºC and the other at 64~65ºC, so do you guys think I should re-delid? I would have to buy Acetone 100% pure to make the glue dissolve and don't break the PCB when I use the delid tool or should I avoid the headache and just leave like this? Btw I tried 3 times reapplying Arctic MX-4 between the block and IHS to just make sure it wasn't bad application or something and the problem still persists, so I don't know how but the problem may be under the IHS and DIE, maybe I should reapply the Conductonaut in a different way, I don't know...


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> Some people have reported using clear nail polish to cover the parts next to the die....Personally, I didn't put anything on my 4670K besides CLP and have had no issues with it shifting around at all.


CLP, like the gun cleaner?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> CLP, like the gun cleaner?


Nice try.... CLP (especially in _this_ particular thread, on _this_ particular site) refers to *C*oollaboratory's *L*iquid *P*ro....


----------



## stephenn82

oh man! I was hoping you would say Cleaner, Lube, and Protectant







lol


----------



## theGucky

I just wanted to give a update from my Delid at the 4/29 as seen here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/32920#post_26056970

Temps are the same, no change...which is good ^^
My AIO Coolers died 2 times in less then 3 Months each. Im on my third one now.
I couldn't see any LM leakage from the CPU (when changing the AIO), despite beeing it in vertical position all the time.
Still runs perfect.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Is it a good idea to run @1.45V daily given load temp is "under control"?
I'm looking to push 5.2...


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Is it a good idea to run @1.45V daily given load temp is "under control"?
> I'm looking to push 5.2...


AVX ? maybe... how's the load in W on cpu package ? remember Amps kill not Volts....so even 1.6v might be safe...if cpu package W draw is low...

Not AVX... dif. between 5.1 and 5.2 is marginal.. so not worth it..


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Is it a good idea to run @1.45V daily given load temp is "under control"?
> I'm looking to push 5.2...


Depends on the workload really

If you're basically only gaming should be fine

If you're hunting Prime numbers or running Handbrake 24/7 should be less

The only 2 7700k's that degraded I'm aware off did so because of heavy benching/stresstesting

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> dif. between 5.1 and 5.2 is marginal.. so not worth it..


While its just a number, it's also a hobby


----------



## outofmyheadyo

Does anyone know if this 3D printed delid tool would work with the 8700K ? Long time ago I got 1 printed to delid my 6700K, but the CPU was a potato and I sold it before I had to delid it ( I tried and it fit perfectly inside it tho )
But when I upgraded to 7700K the tool did not fit, the IHS had a different shape than the 6700K, I quess there are slim chances that it would fit the 8700K, quess I got to delid another CPU with a razorblade, just like i did with my 7700K-s.
Or perhaps someone knows a similar tool that I could print for the 8700K ?


----------



## DanielF50

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Would you please share your settings for vccio/vccsa/pch? I'm also using a gigabyte board, but I need 1.4V for 5ghz


Sorry, just seen this.

My VCCIO is 1.1v, my VCCSA is also 1.1v and I've set my PCH to 1v. The VCCIO and SA might need a little bump up depending on your chip, but the Kaby Lake guide says the max for the VCCIO is about 1.25v and the max for the SA is 1.2v so just play around with those and hopefully you'll be able to achieve 5ghz at a lower vcore


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> Guys, I noticed something, when I had delidded and was using Permatex to close the IHS down and CLU as TIM I had a solid 69~70ºC in all cores running x264 loop or Realbench 2.54, so I decided to open and use this time Conductonaut and close with Loctite Gel, everything went fine, my temps did drop about 2~4ºC, but the problem is now that I don't have the consistency in the cores temperatures like before, instead of solid 69~70ºC (1ºC difference between all the cores at the most) not I have Core 1 at 67ºC and the other at 64~65ºC, so do you guys think I should re-delid? I would have to buy Acetone 100% pure to make the glue dissolve and don't break the PCB when I use the delid tool or should I avoid the headache and just leave like this? Btw I tried 3 times reapplying Arctic MX-4 between the block and IHS to just make sure it wasn't bad application or something and the problem still persists, so I don't know how but the problem may be under the IHS and DIE, maybe I should reapply the Conductonaut in a different way, I don't know...


Leave it alone. My core temps vary more than that and it's still one of the better ones.


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> Leave it alone. My core temps vary more than that and it's still one of the better ones.


Thank you, I'm completely stable now 1.360v full load Realbench 2.54 at 5.0Ghz, max temp of 66~67ºC, do you know any thermal paste better than MX-4 to use between the AIO block and IHS?


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ViTosS*
> 
> Thank you, I'm completely stable now 1.360v full load Realbench 2.54 at 5.0Ghz, max temp of 66~67ºC, do you know any thermal paste better than MX-4 to use between the AIO block and IHS?


I use gelid extreme, but I doubt it's significantly better. I run my 7700K with less volts than you and at 5.1ghz, but your temps are much lower. Everything looks good. Tinker with something else lol


----------



## ViTosS

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> I use gelid extreme, but I doubt it's significantly better. I run my 7700K with less volts than you and at 5.1ghz, but your temps are much lower. Everything looks good. Tinker with something else lol


Nice, I had bad luck with my 7700k, not one of the best overclockers in the world, I'm using a H110i with two SP140 LED High Performance (at about 1600RPM each) and the ambient temperature is like 25~30ºC when I tested, also Realbench doesn't stress that much of heat.


----------



## morencyam

Recently did my first delid on my 4770k using the razor blade method. Used CLU on the die and NT-H1 for the cooler, which is an H80i. I used Marine atv silicone to reattach the lid. Not sure what I did wrong, but my temps are really high. I start up Intel Burn Test and it almost instantly jumps to 80c and continues to climb. My though are either the relid is bad or bad contact between the cooler and IHS.

Any thoughts or opinions.


----------



## outofmyheadyo

silicon messed u up, probably as bad as intel had there before, forget the silicon you do not need to relid it, just delid, apply clu and plop the IHS back. the cpu clamp will hold it.


----------



## morencyam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *outofmyheadyo*
> 
> silicon messed u up, probably as bad as intel had there before, forget the silicon you do not need to relid it, just delid, apply clu and plop the IHS back. the cpu clamp will hold it.


that's probably what I was going to try today. Thanks for the advice


----------



## cyan

I use toothpick to apply silicone. and leave it for 12 hours before putting back to pc.

btw did IHS suppose to be fragile ? I manage to scratch it while using nail to clean "intel" silicone.


----------



## morencyam

So I played around troubleshooting my high temps today. As soon as I removed the H80i block it was very apparent that the delid was not the problem. The block was hardly making any contact with the IHS at all. Turns out there is a row of capacitors night next to the CPU socket that the block was touching keeping one edge of the block from making contact. I reseated the block and now am getting much better temps. After 10 runs on IBT, the core temps peaked at 60c, 59c, 56c 55c . I'd say the delid was successful.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Anybody delidded a 7800X yet..?

Mine seems stable at 5ghz at only around 1.310-1.330V. But I need to delid at the temps are closing the high 80-low 90s on 100% load.


----------



## cyan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *morencyam*
> 
> So I played around troubleshooting my high temps today. As soon as I removed the H80i block it was very apparent that the delid was not the problem. The block was hardly making any contact with the IHS at all. Turns out there is a row of capacitors night next to the CPU socket that the block was touching keeping one edge of the block from making contact. I reseated the block and now am getting much better temps. After 10 runs on IBT, the core temps peaked at 60c, 59c, 56c 55c . I'd say the delid was successful.


Just curious mine also 5c different between 1 and 4.
some people said that I suppose to get only 2-3c different if I use liquid metal.
maybe to much or to little liquid metal ?


----------



## ViTosS

Guys, anyone who used Loctite Gel to delid and reopened to redelid how hard was to remove the glue using acetone? Is it safe and dissolves the glue fast?


----------



## morencyam

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Just curious mine also 5c different between 1 and 4.
> some people said that I suppose to get only 2-3c different if I use liquid metal.
> maybe to much or to little liquid metal ?


It's possible. This was my first delid so I'm sure I didn't do the greatest job. But I'm happy with the results


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Just curious mine also 5c different between 1 and 4.
> some people said that I suppose to get only 2-3c different if I use liquid metal.
> maybe to much or to little liquid metal ?


Although a bad application is possible there are many factors which will affect this. How much difference was there to begin with? On several of my IB chips I had similar core temps on some (i.e. 1-2C differences) and on others much higher (5-9C). Although the delid+CLU helped, on the chips with the greatest variance there was less improvement - so they remained a 4-6C difference between cores.

Another thing to think about is the OS involvement - especially if you're running a recent Windows version. There is a crap-ton of stuff that Windows does without your permission - regardless of how 'locked down' it is, unfortunately. So to get a truly good representation you should run your benches and check temps after the system has been booted and idle for quite some time. That will eliminate extra cycles from 'phoning home', downloading updates, virus scanning, scheduled maintenance (if you have an HDD this can be excessive depending on defrag schedules), etc.

Try to do 2-3 runs under similar conditions and look at the averages - or if you're into the 24hr stable thing... look at the temps after a 24hr run. Just running IBT for 10 runs isn't going to be enough to assure that the task load on each core is close to the same.

However, the bottom line is that there is always going to be some variance unless you're ridiculously lucky - and even that isn't likely to hold under most circumstances. Now, if you're seeing a 10C+ delta... that's definitely going to be an application issue - either that or something significant was going on in the background during the benching process.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Just curious mine also 5c different between 1 and 4.
> some people said that I suppose to get only 2-3c different if I use liquid metal.
> maybe to much or to little liquid metal ?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Although a bad application is possible there are many factors which will affect this. How much difference was there to begin with? On several of my IB chips I had similar core temps on some (i.e. 1-2C differences) and on others much higher (5-9C). Although the delid+CLU helped, on the chips with the greatest variance there was less improvement - so they remained a 4-6C difference between cores.
> 
> Another thing to think about is the OS involvement - especially if you're running a recent Windows version. There is a crap-ton of stuff that Windows does without your permission - regardless of how 'locked down' it is, unfortunately. So to get a truly good representation you should run your benches and check temps after the system has been booted and idle for quite some time. That will eliminate extra cycles from 'phoning home', downloading updates, virus scanning, scheduled maintenance (if you have an HDD this can be excessive depending on defrag schedules), etc.
> 
> Try to do 2-3 runs under similar conditions and look at the averages - or if you're into the 24hr stable thing... look at the temps after a 24hr run. Just running IBT for 10 runs isn't going to be enough to assure that the task load on each core is close to the same.
> 
> However, the bottom line is that there is always going to be some variance unless you're ridiculously lucky - and even that isn't likely to hold under most circumstances. Now, if you're seeing a 10C+ delta... that's definitely going to be an application issue - either that or something significant was going on in the background during the benching process.


Not only with these pieces of information is that the CPU physical die package has a memory controller and other materials, which can cause heating dissipation differences, resulting in those core differences, but that 3-5C range is fairly common.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Not only with these pieces of information is that the CPU physical die package has a memory controller and other materials, which can cause heating dissipation differences, resulting in those core differences, but that 3-5C range is fairly common.


Exactly! Even moreso with the chips getting more core density... I can guarantee that 8-16 core chips are gonna have large variances as the only cores with any dark silicon near them most of the time are the outer ones... the inner ones are likely to run hotter all the time, even if they are under lower load levels. Then you add in the 'thread preference boosting' (forgot what tradespeak intel is using for that) where a single core is selected to be the fastest for single-threaded tasks, and OC'd higher... and there's never gonna be linearity in the temps.

It's not like it matters anyway... what matters is the speed, stability, and the ability to get the heat away from the _entire chip_ efficiently enough. At least that's what matters around these parts.


----------



## cyan

I experience weird temperature when helping friend delid his 4770k. (using CLU+NT-H1)
Before delid aida stability test max temperature stock = 67c
first boot immediately after delid aida stability test max temperature = 48c
after leaving it 24hours, aida stability test max temperature = 53c

why the temperature increase ? (ambient almost the same 27-28c)


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> I experience weird temperature when helping friend delid his 4770k. (using CLU+NT-H1)
> Before delid aida stability test max temperature stock = 67c
> first boot immediately after delid aida stability test max temperature = 48c
> after leaving it 24hours, aida stability test max temperature = 53c
> 
> why the temperature increase ? (ambient almost the same 27-28c)


Since it's the pure max temp not the _average_, it could have been at 48c the whole time except for 10 seconds where it spiked an extra 5c due to a system maintenance task running in the background. Could also be that AIDA uses something like prime calculations for stressing (not sure on this) and it's common for Prime95 to run way cooler for 14-16 hrs and suddenly hit a very difficult set and spike.

Regardless, it's still a 14c improvement... which is nothing to complain about.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Okei. I am about to order my Rockit 99 with loctite and Coola. Pro.

What is recommended to use on the caps near the DIE on my 7800X..? In case if a spillover by the LM. Remove the old silicon from both IHS and PCB, or just the IHS?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Okei. I am about to order my Rockit 99 with loctite and Coola. Pro.
> 
> What is recommended to use on the caps near the DIE on my 7800X..? In case if a spillover by the LM. Remove the old silicon from both IHS and PCB, or just the IHS?


That question regarding what to do with the components near the die is asked and answered on the vast majority of the pages in this thread.... Check out the "Search this thread" function at the top of the thread....









Yep, remove all of the old silicon....


----------



## GreedyMuffin

I've not read anything about the Skylake-Xs in this thread.

Der8auer recommends to not remove the silicon on the PCB due to risk. It is very easy to remove a cap. or anything else on the PCB.

I've understood that you can use nail-polish. But does it need to be a specific kind? Can I just go out and buy some random clear nail-polish?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> I've not read anything about the Skylake-Xs in this thread.
> 
> Der8auer recommends to not remove the silicon on the PCB due to risk. It is very easy to remove a cap. or anything else on the PCB.
> 
> I've understood that you can use nail-polish. But does it need to be a specific kind? Can I just go out and buy some random clear nail-polish?


Yes you can

Well if you're not handy/careful then leaving the silicon on the chip is maybe advisable

The liquid metal should be able to bridge the gap
Maybe you're Total temp reduction might be a bit less, but better than before still

I'm not sure there are many users that delidded a skylake-x here

It's a pricey CPU and you can ship it in to silicon lottery to be safe
Or just buy it delidded

I think those 2 Options are popular for many buying a 1000$ CPU

That being said
All HEDT CPU's had caps so broadwell-e should be similar
At least as a hint


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Yeah, but Broadwell-E and Haswell-E is soldered, so I don't see many people deliding that.

A kit is on my way and I'll hopefully delid within saturday. I am not nervous as it is a rather cheap CPU compared to its big brothers.

I def. will not remove the PCB. A user in the Skylake-X thread posted this..


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Yeah, but Broadwell-E and Haswell-E is soldered, so I don't see many people deliding that.
> 
> A kit is on my way and I'll hopefully delid within saturday. I am not nervous as it is a rather cheap CPU compared to its big brothers.
> 
> I def. will not remove the PCB. A user in the Skylake-X thread posted this..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!





Simple solution, lever comes down, compresses the tape and you get IHS to Die contact without breaking anything. Except the Z-height nazis will disagree and froth at the mouth lol.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Simple solution, lever comes down, compresses the tape and you get IHS to Die contact without breaking anything. Except the Z-height nazis will disagree and froth at the mouth lol.


One thought, how thick is that tape in mm? Curious on this being used compared to the stock adhesive and peoples third party adhesives.


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> One thought, how thick is that tape in mm? Curious on this being used compared to the stock adhesive and peoples third party adhesives.


Less than 0.2mm discounting the fact it can compress.


----------



## WoWScoty

I want to join the Delid club, should I post some screenshots and/or photos as a proof?

The results are:

i7 7700K (@4.7GHz(4.5GHz AVX)/1.22V) in a closed cabinet with real bad air flow(one exhaust vent and multiple small holes in the bottom for intake) it went from 90+ °C(at the same 4.7GHz clock, I had it underclocked @4.3GHz(4.1GHz AVX) for everyday work) to 69 - 72 °C under synthetic load. During gaming it went below 65 °C .

I used the Delid Die Mate 2 for the delid, applied Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and relided the the IHS. The cooling that I use is Tt Water 3.0 Ultimate with the radiator attached to the exhaust vent. Thermal paste used: Noctua NT-H1


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WoWScoty*
> 
> I want to join the Delid club, should I post some screenshots and/or photos as a proof?
> 
> The results are:
> 
> i7 7700K (@4.7GHz(4.5GHz AVX)/1.22V) in a closed cabinet with real bad air flow(one exhaust vent and multiple small holes in the bottom for intake) it went from 90+ °C(at the same 4.7GHz clock, I had it underclocked @4.3GHz(4.1GHz AVX) for everyday work) to 69 - 72 °C under synthetic load. During gaming it went below 65 °C .
> 
> I used the Delid Die Mate 2 for the delid, applied Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and relided the the IHS. The cooling that I use is Tt Water 3.0 Ultimate with the radiator attached to the exhaust vent. Thermal paste used: Noctua NT-H1


Yep, definitely post those pics....for proof. Definitely for proof.... Hehehe....


----------



## WoWScoty

Here:


----------



## blaze2210

I don't know if proof was _needed_, I know that I like pics though....


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dasboogieman*
> 
> Less than 0.2mm discounting the fact it can compress.


Thanks! thats good info!!
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WoWScoty*
> 
> I want to join the Delid club, should I post some screenshots and/or photos as a proof?
> 
> The results are:
> 
> i7 7700K (@4.7GHz(4.5GHz AVX)/1.22V) in a closed cabinet with real bad air flow(one exhaust vent and multiple small holes in the bottom for intake) it went from 90+ °C(at the same 4.7GHz clock, I had it underclocked @4.3GHz(4.1GHz AVX) for everyday work) to 69 - 72 °C under synthetic load. During gaming it went below 65 °C .
> 
> I used the Delid Die Mate 2 for the delid, applied Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and relided the the IHS. The cooling that I use is Tt Water 3.0 Ultimate with the radiator attached to the exhaust vent. Thermal paste used: Noctua NT-H1


In the first post it has the requirements, take a look


----------



## Gdourado

Hello, how are you?
So, I have a few questions about deliding.
First is what paste is better to use over the die? Liquid Pro or Liquid Ultra.
Also, how long does the liquid metal paste lasts?
How long after a delid is it required to replace the liquid metal paste on the die?
Also, is the liquid metal paste fluid? Is it better to use a case with a horizontal motherboard orientation to avoid spill of the paste?
Any long term side effects to running liquid metal paste on the die?

Thank for the help.
Cheers!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Gdourado*
> 
> Hello, how are you?
> So, I have a few questions about deliding.
> First is what paste is better to use over the die? Liquid Pro or Liquid Ultra.
> Also, how long does the liquid metal paste lasts?
> How long after a delid is it required to replace the liquid metal paste on the die?
> Also, is the liquid metal paste fluid? Is it better to use a case with a horizontal motherboard orientation to avoid spill of the paste?
> Any long term side effects to running liquid metal paste on the die?
> 
> Thank for the help.
> Cheers!


Hi!

1. Liquid pro or ultra are pretty darn close, more of what one you can get really.
2. The liquid paste lasts quite some time. I still have my first tube of it and it looks just fine (5 years ago) ((oh god its been that long....))
3. I've never once had to replace the TIM due to it being old, I've just replaced it when I do yearly cleaning/maintenance/upgrades.
4. The TIM _IS_ fluid. A little brush/q tip is provided to help spread it out. No need for certain motherboard styles, I've have vertical mounting every since I started this, and have never once had an issue.








5. None that I've seen or heard.... GPU there has been a few, but I believe thats due to the heatsink mounting directly to the die and the die being physically bigger.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

I delidded my 7800X and re-lidded it. The first day I got 15-19'C temperature drop (The high 80s, low 90s to high 60s, low 70s)

, I feel like the temps are increased by a good 7-9'C or so two days later.. I am using LM Pro and the temp difference between the cores are max 6'C. 74-80-79-78-76-75'C after some Cinebench R15 runs at 1.380V or so.. Maybe I am expecting too much and are remembering wrong..? I relidded using 8 small dots on each corner (Loctite)

These was my first results: 60-72-73-72-70-67'C I reported. The ambient should be close.

Pics are in spoiler


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!










Was my delid job poor? The results in benchmarks are excatly the same.

EDIT: I may have had the ambient way cooler as I remembered starting Core temp and some cores were at 19-20'C on idle.. Meanig that the ambient must have been real low.. It did not feel low though.. Hmm..


----------



## chronicfx

Any delids on 8700k's yet?


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> I delidded my 7800X and re-lidded it. The first day I got 15-19'C temperature drop (The high 80s, low 90s to high 60s, low 70s)
> 
> , I feel like the temps are increased by a good 7-9'C or so two days later.. I am using LM Pro and the temp difference between the cores are max 6'C. 74-80-79-78-76-75'C after some Cinebench R15 runs at 1.380V or so.. Maybe I am expecting too much and are remembering wrong..? I relidded using 8 small dots on each corner (Loctite)
> 
> These was my first results: 60-72-73-72-70-67'C I reported. The ambient should be close.
> 
> Pics are in spoiler
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Was my delid job poor? The results in benchmarks are excatly the same.
> 
> EDIT: I may have had the ambient way cooler as I remembered starting Core temp and some cores were at 19-20'C on idle.. Meanig that the ambient must have been real low.. It did not feel low though.. Hmm..


Cleaned my loop today... Something is growing omg. Look at this!!


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!








Everything is cleaned now, but how can I avoid this next time? I am using distilled water only. Do I need to drain it all (60% is new, 40% is two months old) or can I just add a 100-200ml of something..


----------



## stephenn82

Make sure you use a good coolant with biocide in it. How long did the loop sit, untouched btw? 2 months? Yeah, get a biocide additive or coolant.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Make sure you use a good coolant with biocide in it. How long did the loop sit, untouched btw? 2 months? Yeah, get a biocide additive or coolant.


Do I need to clean everything, or can I just flush it and just get some new coolant?

Getting some EK clear pre-mixed or Aquad computer double protect Ultra.

What is the best of the two?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Do I need to clean everything, or can I just flush it and just get some new coolant?
> 
> Getting some EK clear pre-mixed or Aquad computer double protect Ultra.
> 
> What is the best of the two?


I would clean and flush everything.

Here is an untapped resource for you, try not to waste too much time watching his vids
https://www.youtube.com/user/Jayztwocents a great list to start with. dont know why his usual playlists are gone, but this should help a lot
https://www.youtube.com/user/Jayztwocents/search?query=flush

Preference for your coolant. You can find just a small dropper of biocide and run distilled if you would like.


----------



## HowYesNo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Although a bad application is possible there are many factors which will affect this. How much difference was there to begin with? On several of my IB chips I had similar core temps on some (i.e. 1-2C differences) and on others much higher (5-9C). Although the delid+CLU helped, on the chips with the greatest variance there was less improvement - so they remained a 4-6C difference between cores.
> 
> Another thing to think about is the OS involvement - especially if you're running a recent Windows version. There is a crap-ton of stuff that Windows does without your permission - regardless of how 'locked down' it is, unfortunately. So to get a truly good representation you should run your benches and check temps after the system has been booted and idle for quite some time. That will eliminate extra cycles from 'phoning home', downloading updates, virus scanning, scheduled maintenance (if you have an HDD this can be excessive depending on defrag schedules), etc.
> 
> Try to do 2-3 runs under similar conditions and look at the averages - or if you're into the 24hr stable thing... look at the temps after a 24hr run. Just running IBT for 10 runs isn't going to be enough to assure that the task load on each core is close to the same.
> 
> However, the bottom line is that there is always going to be some variance unless you're ridiculously lucky - and even that isn't likely to hold under most circumstances. Now, if you're seeing a 10C+ delta... that's definitely going to be an application issue - either that or something significant was going on in the background during the benching process.


difference between my core are quite large, and that was even before delid, in idle now with only Opera running 40 29 26 28. roughly the same befor delid.
however in prime load difference between core is 2-4C . 59-64C (5min load just now). before deli it was like 80-85.


----------



## stephenn82

did you get a good cover amount across the die evenly?


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> difference between my core are quite large, and that was even before delid, in idle now with only Opera running 40 29 26 28. roughly the same befor delid.
> however in prime load difference between core is 2-4C . 59-64C (5min load just now). before deli it was like 80-85.


Can you chck if that one hotter core is clocking higher than the others when "idle"
Like one core might get boosted to higher speeds and not the others because windows is only waking up that one core

I don't know
Just n idea

I would expect a bad delid to cause bad temps on all cores, not on only one really


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> difference between my core are quite large, and that was even before delid, in idle now with only Opera running 40 29 26 28. roughly the same befor delid.
> however in prime load difference between core is 2-4C . 59-64C (5min load just now). before deli it was like 80-85.


Same situation here. Was like it before delidding and redid paste several times but never redid delid. My difference can be as much as 15-20c at times. Chip still OCs great


----------



## HowYesNo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> did you get a good cover amount across the die evenly?


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> Can you chck if that one hotter core is clocking higher than the others when "idle"
> Like one core might get boosted to higher speeds and not the others because windows is only waking up that one core
> 
> I don't know
> Just n idea
> 
> I would expect a bad delid to cause bad temps on all cores, not on only one really


well it's been some time since i delid, 8 months but even prior to delid core one was always higher than rest, in idle that is, under load 2-4C difference.
here is my post after deliding:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1313179/official-delidded-club-guide/32360#post_25862091
temps now in idle: (cpu fan is not spinnig)


----------



## HowYesNo

lucky for me i read this topic prior to deliding, instead of watching Linus doing it.


----------



## stephenn82

dude, Linus should be used as a source of entertainment only...please.

If you want to delid and learn, watch HardOCP or Gamers Nexus or Der8auer himself. He does vids in german and english.


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *HowYesNo*
> 
> lucky for me i read this topic prior to deliding, instead of watching Linus doing it.


This video legitimating triggered me more than recent political news. People, however stupid they may be, are going to take this video serious and ruin their $1000 CPUs. Not only that, this is at least the 2nd pretty much 100% wrong delid video Linus has put out.

Even Steve from Gamer's Nexus, who usually does a pretty darn good job of dotting i's and crossing t's, did things incorrectly (left adhesive on, too much TIM, put TIM on IHS and die, applied glue back under die instead of the corners, didn't tape off substrate when applying... etc). It really boggles my mind that so many people get his relatively simply process wrong. /rant


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> This video legitimating triggered me more than recent political news. People, however stupid they may be, are going to take this video serious and ruin their $1000 CPUs. Not only that, this is at least the 2nd pretty much 100% wrong delid video Linus has put out.
> 
> Even Steve from Gamer's Nexus, who usually does a pretty darn good job of dotting i's and crossing t's, did things incorrectly (left adhesive on, too much TIM, put TIM on IHS and die, applied glue back under die instead of the corners, didn't tape off substrate when applying... etc). It really boggles my mind that so many people get his relatively simply process wrong. /rant


I'm just wondering, why do you consider putting TIM on IHS and die one of the wrong things to do when delidding? I've seen credible people here in this forum recommending to put the liquid metal on both under the IHS and die instead of jist on the die. Or are you referring to a different thing?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> This video legitimating triggered me more than recent political news. People, however stupid they may be, are going to take this video serious and ruin their $1000 CPUs. Not only that, this is at least the 2nd pretty much 100% wrong delid video Linus has put out.
> 
> Even Steve from Gamer's Nexus, who usually does a pretty darn good job of dotting i's and crossing t's, did things incorrectly (left adhesive on, too much TIM, put TIM on IHS and die, applied glue back under die instead of the corners, didn't tape off substrate when applying... etc). It really boggles my mind that so many people get his relatively simply process wrong. /rant


Yeah, it was Steve's first time. He didn't follow der8auers guide and he later had some help and do it right the second time. He explained that.

Come on man. Who will have a $350k computer build for 10 gamers one box? Or Minecraft on 16k??


----------



## Chrisch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Any delids on 8700k's yet?


not on a 8700k but on a 8600k



before and after temps


----------



## stephenn82

blessed be them overclocks and temp drops!


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> I'm just wondering, why do you consider putting TIM on IHS and die one of the wrong things to do when delidding? I've seen credible people here in this forum recommending to put the liquid metal on both under the IHS and die instead of jist on the die. Or are you referring to a different thing?


Should have worded it a bit better. He put too much TIM on each... thus resulting in WAY too much TIM. You can do both, but each layer has to be really thin. Going through a couple delids, I've found it is better just to put a thin layer on the die and leave it at that.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> Should have worded it a bit better. He put too much TIM on each... thus resulting in WAY too much TIM. You can do both, but each layer has to be really thin. Going through a couple delids, I've found it is better just to put a thin layer on the die and leave it at that.


Thanks for the heads up. I'll do thst when I get my 8700K. How better were your temps if you just put on the die?


----------



## stephenn82

its roughly between 18-23c, depending on your setup..expect about 19c on average on drop.


----------



## The Pook

Got my 7700K (no fancy 8600K/8700K, I know







) and poor thing can do at least 5.1 but at the volts it needs (~1.32v) under my Cryorig H7 is throttling in Cinebench.

Can do 4.9 at 1.265v, and even then it's hitting high 80s in just CSGO. Looks like I'm stuck at 4.8 with 1.26v for now.

Going to grab the Rockit 88, Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra, and some Permatex 82180.

Unless anybody has any other suggestions?

My i5 6400 ran 1.4v daily without issues on the same heatsink, but this i7 with doesn't like more than ~1.25v.


----------



## Mr.Cigar

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> Got my 7700K (no fancy 8600K/8700K, I know
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ) and poor thing can do at least 5.1 but at the volts it needs (~1.32v) under my Cryorig H7 is throttling in Cinebench.
> 
> Can do 4.9 at 1.265v, and even then it's hitting high 80s in just CSGO. Looks like I'm stuck at 4.8 with 1.26v for now.
> 
> Going to grab the Rockit 88, Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra, and some Permatex 82180.
> 
> Unless anybody has any other suggestions?
> 
> My i5 6400 ran 1.4v daily without issues on the same heatsink, but this i7 with doesn't like more than ~1.25v.


Have you tried lowering vccpll oc to 1.1V?
1.32V for 5.1Ghz is pretty crazy(low)


----------



## The Pook

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Mr.Cigar*
> 
> Have you tried lowering vccpll oc to 1.1V?
> 1.32V for 5.1Ghz is pretty crazy(low)


No idea if 1.32v is stable, but it gets into Windows and finishes Cinebench ... but it's throttling and not running at 5.1Ghz haha.

I'll try playing with VCCPLL. No idea what it's at now. Just been playing with vcore and multiplier.


----------



## The Pook

No VCCPLL option in my bios.









VCCIO, system agent voltage, pch core voltage, and that's about it.

Have a bunch of options for boot voltage and for LLC but nothing about VCCPLL.

*edit*

Google says VCCIo is vccpl? Lowered it to 1.15v. I'll see what happens.

*edit 2*

Zero effect on temps going from 1.25v to 1.15v. Worth a shot though I guess


----------



## NorcalTRD

Has anyone put any thought into a pay it forward program with a rockit88 or Delid Die Mate tool?
My only gripe buying such a tool is that I can only use it once or twice and wont need it again.
IE: Someone buys one and uses it, wont be using it again and so ships it to next person in queue, they receive it and delid/relid their cpu and then can ship it to the next guy and so on.

Costs each person $6 or so for the shipping costs rather than buying a $40 + shipping tool they will use once or twice.


----------



## The Pook

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NorcalTRD*
> 
> Has anyone put any thought into a pay it forward program with a rockit88 or Delid Die Mate tool?
> My only gripe buying such a tool is that I can only use it once or twice and wont need it again.
> IE: Someone buys one and uses it, wont be using it again and so ships it to next person in queue, they receive it and delid/relid their cpu and then can ship it to the next guy and so on.
> 
> Costs each person $6 or so for the shipping costs rather than buying a $40 + shipping tool they will use once or twice.


There's a thread in the freebie section for it. Hasn't been updated in weeks, though. I signed up for it but haven't been gotten back to


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> There's a thread in the freebie section for it. Hasn't been updated in weeks, though. I signed up for it but haven't been gotten back to


Thanks, I posted in it and PMd the OP.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> its roughly between 18-23c, depending on your setup..expect about 19c on average on drop.


Is your answer directed to me? If so, I think you misunderstood my question. I wasn't asking about the temp difference between a delidded and a non-delidded chip. I was asking the temp difference between when you put the liquid metal on the die ONLY and when you put the liquid metal on BOTH die and underside of the IHS (in both cases, delidding is involved of course).


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Is your answer directed to me? If so, I think you misunderstood my question. I wasn't asking about the temp difference between a delidded and a non-delidded chip. I was asking the temp difference between when you put the liquid metal on the die ONLY and when you put the liquid metal on BOTH die and underside of the IHS (in both cases, delidding is involved of course).


A difference in temps _should_ only occur if there's an improper application in either situation. Basically, they should perform virtually the same - similar to the difference between the regular TIM application methods (pea-sized glob, X method, line, etc.).


----------



## pluke the 2

Delidding a 8700k using the razor blade method:

https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMtN6fOktbjAbmjBMgFwzISPUAc2CKrRW64outvSlH8exiMqSJIwC_VvI_89X0khw?key=LThqUDlaVlN1a1dlaENoVmUxWU82YVlOVU9MV3B3


----------



## The Pook

I'm debating doing the delid with a razor or just suck up the $40 and buy a delid tool ... not sure if the delid tool in the freebie section is still going around or not, but these temps are terrible.










My i5 6400 wasn't delided and could take 1.4v <85c, why can't my 7700K


----------



## pluke the 2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> I'm debating doing the delid with a razor or just suck up the $40 and buy a delid tool ... not sure if the delid tool in the freebie section is still going around or not, but these temps are terrible.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My i5 6400 wasn't delided and could take 1.4v <85c, why can't my 7700K


it was ezz peasy. i did scratch the circuit board a little bit which is no good but not going to kill it quicker.


----------



## pluke the 2

I need to buy a new thermal paste between the IHS and CPU. My local microcenter has this in stock: http://microelectronics.com/product/429370/7_Carat_Thermal_Compound_15g

is this the same thermal compund from the main page fourth from the best ???


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pluke the 2*
> 
> I need to buy a new thermal paste between the IHS and CPU. My local microcenter has this in stock: http://microelectronics.com/product/429370/7_Carat_Thermal_Compound_15g
> 
> is this the same thermal compund from the main page fourth from the best ???


Just order liquid ultra from Amazon.


----------



## aznguyen316

Well.. first time for everything. Decided to ditch my Ryzen Build since I was able to order a 8600K from NewEgg. Just went right for it before the CPU ever saw a motherboard socket. Used Conductonaut.

Mostly did it for thermals. Booted it last night, 5Ghz at 1.3V without much tweaking yet.


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pluke the 2*
> 
> Delidding a 8700k using the razor blade method:
> 
> https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMtN6fOktbjAbmjBMgFwzISPUAc2CKrRW64outvSlH8exiMqSJIwC_VvI_89X0khw?key=LThqUDlaVlN1a1dlaENoVmUxWU82YVlOVU9MV3B3


I saw this on the reddit intel forum and I wouldnt be surprised if that chip is dead.
You can see where the razer gauged into the PCB on the corner attempts and scraped right over connections.


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aznguyen316*
> 
> Well.. first time for everything. Decided to ditch my Ryzen Build since I was able to order a 8600K from NewEgg. Just went right for it before the CPU ever saw a motherboard socket. Used Conductonaut.
> 
> Mostly did it for thermals. Booted it last night, 5Ghz at 1.3V without much tweaking yet.


----------



## funkyslayer

Is there anyone who can give me exact measurements of coffelake cpu pcb and ihs? Thinking about milling a delid tool in plastic at work. If it work i would like to make a few and just give them away. The best would be measurements of the real tool.


----------



## The Pook

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funkyslayer*
> 
> Is there anyone who can give me exact measurements of coffelake cpu pcb and ihs? Thinking about milling a delid tool in plastic at work. If it work i would like to make a few and just give them away. The best would be measurements of the real tool.


Do it. I really don't wanna pay $40 for something I'm gonna use once









Dimensions should be the same as all 1151 chips ... no? I can get you them off Skylake/Kaby Lake but not Coffee Lake.


----------



## aznguyen316

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *funkyslayer*
> 
> Is there anyone who can give me exact measurements of coffelake cpu pcb and ihs? Thinking about milling a delid tool in plastic at work. If it work i would like to make a few and just give them away. The best would be measurements of the real tool.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> Do it. I really don't wanna pay $40 for something I'm gonna use once
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dimensions should be the same as all 1151 chips ... no? I can get you them off Skylake/Kaby Lake but not Coffee Lake.


There's a popular 3d print one that works wellll just need a clamp or vice to use it. Can print it or buy one off eBay. Don't have a link at the moment. On mobile.

Also I rented the rockit tool from someone. Performance-PCs also rents it. Comes out to like $15 or so if you want to go that route.


----------



## The Pook

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aznguyen316*
> 
> Also I rented the rockit tool from someone. Performance-PCs also rents it. Comes out to like $15 or so if you want to go that route.


Kaby Lake one is OOS.

No one locally is offering it and don't have access to a 3D Printer.

Was thinking of grabbing a cheap one of eBay but rather not go the vice route. Might just go for it.


----------



## funkyslayer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *aznguyen316*
> 
> There's a popular 3d print one that works wellll just need a clamp or vice to use it. Can print it or buy one off eBay. Don't have a link at the moment. On mobile.
> 
> Also I rented the rockit tool from someone. Performance-PCs also rents it. Comes out to like $15 or so if you want to go that route.


I dont want those 3d printed. Going to make one like the rockit 88beacuse i have a hard millable plastic and mill.


----------



## pluke the 2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NorcalTRD*
> 
> I saw this on the reddit intel forum and I wouldnt be surprised if that chip is dead.
> You can see where the razer gauged into the PCB on the corner attempts and scraped right over connections.


its not enough to short or disconnect the circuit. it was just the silkscreen.


----------



## {EAC} Shoot em UP

Well I went ahead and delid the 4770k. I should have done better temp delta tracking, but I left work one afternoon and decided it was the day.

I used a 3D printed tool, but it took a good amount of sanding and filing to get it to fit in there, thankfully I had an old pentium of the same socket to test with, didn't need to take my 4770k out of my system to test fit the delid tool.

It was way easier then expected, and putting on the TIM was easy as well. Some clear nail polish on the caps, and in my haste I didn't even bother machining the CPU relid tool I had designed. Like I said, I just sorta decided Tuesday was the day to do it. I put some red RTV around the edge of the heat spreader and just popped it all in the socket and let the retention arm and the CPU Block press the IHS down and squeeze out the excess RTV.

Temp drop was HUGE. I ran AIDA64 before and after for 15 minutes just to get a feel for the delta temps. Like I said, I really should have ran core temp and plotted the changes, especially since I am a data driven engineer................................ Whatever, sometimes you just want to get **** done more then collect data on it lol.

Same ambient temp of 79F for both tests from start to end of test.

Pre delid, I was hitting low to high 80's depending on core and depending on spikes. I would say average of 80C at the fan settings I had. I run an extremely thick 280 top rad, and a 240 front rad. Top fans are Noctua 140's (I forget the number, but whatever their static pressure ones are at that size), and fronts are 120mm corsair SP's. Top fan RPM was 752, fronts where 725, and pump was 2331 RPM.

Post delid, the graph was much tighter. I would say the average was right around 65c, with top fans at 584 and fronts at 581, pump still at the same ~2227.

That is one MASSIVE change.


----------



## stephenn82




----------



## NorcalTRD




----------



## nrpeyton

CLU or Conductonaut? (for de-lid)?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> CLU or Conductonaut? (for de-lid)?


Which is more readily available to you? Differences will be negligible - with a very slight edge to Conductonaut IIRC. Likely less than 2-3C difference in even the most extreme cases and no difference at all in most cases.

Though there have been shootout tests, I really consider most to be worthless as we've seen just in this thread how many people have changed their own results by several degrees just by reapplying the same LM to the same setup a second time.

Unless someone has a mechanized, automated method for applying both the compound, and placing the IHS (and if used the silicon/glue)... then it's never going to be apples to apples - or at least it will be green apples to red ones.


----------



## Uroborous

is it worth delidding and using kryonaut between ihs and die? The fact that conductonaut has minimum temperatures 10 degrees celsius makes me skeptical...


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> is it worth delidding and using kryonaut between ihs and die? The fact that conductonaut has minimum temperatures 10 degrees celsius makes me skeptical...


No, it's not worth using a non-liquid metal TIM between the die and the IHS....What makes you skeptical about the minimum temperature? That's basically saying "don't use this if you're going below 10*C"....


----------



## Uroborous

Yeah, but what happens if the ambient temperature goes below 10 when the pc is off. Won't that make the paste dry and hard?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> Yeah, but what happens if the ambient temperature goes below 10 when the pc is off. Won't that make the paste dry and hard?


Couldn't answer that for you, I'm in San Diego. Outside of a freezer, I don't know what that temp even feels like....


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> Yeah, but what happens if the ambient temperature goes below 10 when the pc is off. Won't that make the paste dry and hard?


I had my chip reading 0C @ idle with CLU and it didn't change it an any noticeable way.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> Yeah, but what happens if the ambient temperature goes below 10 when the pc is off. Won't that make the paste dry and hard?


If I had to guess it turns solid as it is, and becomes like a "Solder"
those LM are Gallium based, that's why its a no no to let it touch Aluminium




it might be that there is some wear and tear when it freezes and melts continuously, something seperating from the mix (as it is not just pure Gallium since its melting point is 29 degrees), or maybe it actually starts to run off/pump out
who knows
as far as I know you don't use those LM when using LN2

if you happen to be at a place where your PC hardware can reach that low so many times maybe you should use a product rated for those ranges

I'm not gonna try to convincing anyone to use what countless people have used and some companies are actually selling with a 1 or even 2 year warranty

just be aware that if you use something else that pump out can occur, and I've seen people saying pastes that usually didn't pump out did on the DIE
to most peoples guess that might be because of the DIE`s way smaller size (compared to a IHS) and higher/faster spikes in temps on the DIE compared to the IHS

also depending on Z height there might be an actual gap, and that's not what most pastes are designed for really, as the space between IHS and cooler is rather perfect aside from micro imperfections, and not a tenth of a mm
so a paste might pump out since there's nothing holding it in place per sè, but free to run off given the chance
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> I had my chip reading 0C @ idle with CLU and it didn't change it an any noticeable way.


well it probably just hardened out, and most likely just melted once it came up in temp again

don't think that's an issue, it might become one if its a daily thing
but a *company* has to give out guidelines for a daily usage basis
as far as i know if you expect to reach really low temps (even 0), like peltiers cold side, phase change, you use something else for TIM


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> If I had to guess it turns solid as it is, and becomes like a "Solder"
> those LM are Gallium based, that's why its a no no to let it touch Aluminium
> 
> 
> 
> 
> it might be that there is some wear and tear when it freezes and melts continuously, something seperating from the mix (as it is not just pure Gallium since its melting point is 29 degrees), or maybe it actually starts to run off/pump out
> who knows
> as far as I know you don't use those LM when using LN2
> 
> if you happen to be at a place where your PC hardware can reach that low so many times maybe you should use a product rated for those ranges
> 
> I'm not gonna try to convincing anyone to use what countless people have used and some companies are actually selling with a 1 or even 2 year warranty
> 
> just be aware that if you use something else that pump out can occur, and I've seen people saying pastes that usually didn't pump out did on the DIE
> to most peoples guess that might be because of the DIE`s way smaller size (compared to a IHS) and higher/faster spikes in temps on the DIE compared to the IHS
> 
> also depending on Z height there might be an actual gap, and that's not what most pastes are designed for really, as the space between IHS and cooler is rather perfect aside from micro imperfections, and not a tenth of a mm
> so a paste might pump out since there's nothing holding it in place per sè, but free to run off given the chance
> well it probably just hardened out, and most likely just melted once it came up in temp again
> 
> don't think that's an issue, it might become one if its a daily thing
> but a *company* has to give out guidelines for a daily usage basis
> as far as i know if you expect to reach really low temps (even 0), like peltiers cold side, phase change, you use something else for TIM


So liquid metal can still leak and spread over the PCB when used between the IHS and die? I'm not sure if that's what you meant by "pump out" as I'm new to delidding.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> So liquid metal can still leak and spread over the PCB when used between the IHS and die? I'm not sure if that's what you meant by "pump out" as I'm new to delidding.


wasn't the question
what happens at 10 degrees and below, and if it is an issue?

secondly
most people don't use LM *on* the IHS, but on the DIE *under* the IHS

pump out refers to some other TIM getting lost/running away over time
not LM
I was referring to
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Uroborous*
> 
> is it worth delidding and using kryonaut between ihs and die? The fact that conductonaut has minimum temperatures 10 degrees celsius makes me skeptical...


if using something else than LM would be OK

LM (any LM) has some really good adhesion and cohesion, it stays reliably in place

but what happens when its subjected to actually freezing and melting on a daily basis (gotta remember its not water so melting/freezing happens sooner than 0 degrees celsius?)
not sure anyone knows

but its not rated for this and neither do people subject it to such temps as far as I know

you use different stuff for the cold side on a peltier, phase change and LN2
and a water chiller is not gonna get that low, unless you already start so low with ambient temps that you wouldnt need one in the first place

look
pump out is a thing that usually doesnt happen
TIM *on* the IHS stays in place

but between IHS and DIE (so *under* the IHS) there could be a slight gap (Z height) so more traditional TIM might have a problem staying in place over time

frankly I'm short on time, since my wife called me 3 times now

but there have been a few on this board who have "grown tired" of pump out and replaced the more traditional TIM with a LM, or went bare DIE cooling


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> wasn't the question
> what happens at 10 degrees and below, and if it is an issue?
> 
> secondly
> most people don't use LM *on* the IHS, but on the DIE *under* the IHS
> 
> pump out refers to some other TIM getting lost/running away over time
> not LM
> I was referring to
> if using something else than LM would be OK


Yes, I know it wasn't the question. But I figured to ask what "pump out" means.

If you read my question again, I did say using LM "between the IHS and the DIE" so that's under the IHS. I'll be using Conductonaut under the IHS and Kryonaut above the IHS as many people here do.

Ok. Though, I don't understand how LM can stay in place while traditional TIM won't given that they have the same "gap" between the IHS and the DIE. No pun intended here, I just want to understand what you're saying.


----------



## peter2k

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Yes, I know it wasn't the question. But I figured to ask what "pump out" means.
> 
> If you read my question again, I did say using LM "between the IHS and the DIE" so that's under the IHS. I'll be using Conductonaut under the IHS and Kryonaut above the IHS as many people here do.
> 
> Ok. Though, I don't understand how LM can stay in place while traditional TIM won't given that they have the same "gap" between the IHS and the DIE. No pun intended here, I just want to understand what you're saying.


I never said it would run away

More traditional formulated TIM might, might
That's what I responded, right?
Pump out is just a term you find rather rarely

It's just a simple term for the TIM to get lost over time for whatever reason
It's not common by any stretch

But there are not that many people delidding and using something else than a LM

Why it would do that?

Well TIM is not meant to be used to bridge anything actually
It's meant to fill the microscopic space left by machining the 2 surfaces
Since anything is better at conducting heat than air after all

When you delid youre chip, look at the orignal TIM Intel is using and compare it to anything you have been using in the past
Or, the Kryonaut

The Intel one is more like a wax than an aftermarket TIM
It's more solid, hell one might call it bees wax









I have some Kryonaut here as well, and while a bit on the glue-ish side, it's liquid enough to spread it
The original TIM is probably formulated to stay in place, that's why it's not liquid at all

Traditional TIM is meant to be a liquid, so you can put pea sized drop in the middle and it will squeeze out where it needs to go
Or you can actually spread it really thin over a surface
And fill out any air gaps (again microscopic)
But it doesn't have to hold onto it by itself since its wedged in-between 2 surfaces that have very good contact

Under the IHS there is no contact, well maybe on x299 HEDT chips, saw 1 picture of a broken (split) DIE

The TIM has to hold itself where it is, especially once it gets hot

Now I can see more traditional TIM may go away over time
But experience with the matter comes down to only handful of people, and even then it depends on what kind of TIM exactly

We're talking about a niche (Overclockers) in a niche (delidding) in a niche (users not using a LM) here
That's rare to find









Why does LM hold?
Mainly?
Because we know it works
And there are some users that have lifted the IHS again to have a look, me included
And it looked the same

LM behaves differently
Mainly because it's actually a liquid metal I'd guess
And not just some silicon paste with Metall oxides thrown in
If you want to wipe away Kryonaut you can use a paper towel
If you use a paper towel on LM all you do is smear it somewhere else, but it doesn't actually go into the paper

If you haven't used it, you'll see









Cleaning it up is a b*tch, it likes to stay where it is and God have mercy if you drop it on a floor that was expensive









I'm in the middle of doing a delid for the 4th time (friends) and it becomes easier to handle with experience (and a really short cosmetic brush I scrounged up from my wife)

The only way LM is running anywhere is if one uses too much and the 2 surfaces are squeezing it out
that's why we use nail polish, just to be safe really in case we used too much

At the end of it
Why am I saying maybe traditional TIM could run away over time on the DIE?
Because there have been a few users complaining about it

Why am I sure that LM stays where it is?
Because it works for hundreds of people

And it actually behaves differently than any other TIM (besides another LM)


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiGiCiDAL*
> 
> Which is more readily available to you? Differences will be negligible - with a very slight edge to Conductonaut IIRC. Likely less than 2-3C difference in even the most extreme cases and no difference at all in most cases.
> 
> Though there have been shootout tests, I really consider most to be worthless as we've seen just in this thread how many people have changed their own results by several degrees just by reapplying the same LM to the same setup a second time.
> 
> Unless someone has a mechanized, automated method for applying both the compound, and placing the IHS (and if used the silicon/glue)... then it's never going to be apples to apples - or at least it will be green apples to red ones.


Feels like we have this question come up with the same answer every page or two. Does ANYONE go through the thread and read anymore?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Feels like we have this question come up with the same answer every page or two. Does ANYONE go through the thread and read anymore?


Nope, people definitely don't.... I've been seeing the same thing go on for a while now - no one reads the first post in a thread, or even reads the posts before theirs to see if the question that they have has already been answered. "There are X pages in this thread, you want me to read through all of those posts?" is basically the common reply when I bring it up....


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *{EAC} Shoot em UP*


Just wanted to note that there if you see LM pooling up or looking/acting liquid or watery like this picture, there is too much on there.
Shouldnt be an issue for him because he nail polished the caps in case it runs off the die, but I wanted others looking at the thread to know.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *peter2k*
> 
> I never said it would run away
> 
> More traditional formulated TIM might, might
> That's what I responded, right?
> Pump out is just a term you find rather rarely
> 
> It's just a simple term for the TIM to get lost over time for whatever reason
> It's not common by any stretch
> 
> But there are not that many people delidding and using something else than a LM
> 
> Why it would do that?
> 
> Well TIM is not meant to be used to bridge anything actually
> It's meant to fill the microscopic space left by machining the 2 surfaces
> Since anything is better at conducting heat than air after all
> 
> When you delid youre chip, look at the orignal TIM Intel is using and compare it to anything you have been using in the past
> Or, the Kryonaut
> 
> The Intel one is more like a wax than an aftermarket TIM
> It's more solid, hell one might call it bees wax
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have some Kryonaut here as well, and while a bit on the glue-ish side, it's liquid enough to spread it
> The original TIM is probably formulated to stay in place, that's why it's not liquid at all
> 
> Traditional TIM is meant to be a liquid, so you can put pea sized drop in the middle and it will squeeze out where it needs to go
> Or you can actually spread it really thin over a surface
> And fill out any air gaps (again microscopic)
> But it doesn't have to hold onto it by itself since its wedged in-between 2 surfaces that have very good contact
> 
> Under the IHS there is no contact, well maybe on x299 HEDT chips, saw 1 picture of a broken (split) DIE
> 
> The TIM has to hold itself where it is, especially once it gets hot
> 
> Now I can see more traditional TIM may go away over time
> But experience with the matter comes down to only handful of people, and even then it depends on what kind of TIM exactly
> 
> We're talking about a niche (Overclockers) in a niche (delidding) in a niche (users not using a LM) here
> That's rare to find
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why does LM hold?
> Mainly?
> Because we know it works
> And there are some users that have lifted the IHS again to have a look, me included
> And it looked the same
> 
> LM behaves differently
> Mainly because it's actually a liquid metal I'd guess
> And not just some silicon paste with Metall oxides thrown in
> If you want to wipe away Kryonaut you can use a paper towel
> If you use a paper towel on LM all you do is smear it somewhere else, but it doesn't actually go into the paper
> 
> If you haven't used it, you'll see
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cleaning it up is a b*tch, it likes to stay where it is and God have mercy if you drop it on a floor that was expensive
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm in the middle of doing a delid for the 4th time (friends) and it becomes easier to handle with experience (and a really short cosmetic brush I scrounged up from my wife)
> 
> The only way LM is running anywhere is if one uses too much and the 2 surfaces are squeezing it out
> that's why we use nail polish, just to be safe really in case we used too much
> 
> At the end of it
> Why am I saying maybe traditional TIM could run away over time on the DIE?
> Because there have been a few users complaining about it
> 
> Why am I sure that LM stays where it is?
> Because it works for hundreds of people
> 
> And it actually behaves differently than any other TIM (besides another LM)


Ok, that makes more sense







Thanks!

And yes, I haven't tried using LM yet so I've yet to notice how it behaves.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NorcalTRD*
> 
> Just wanted to note that there if you see LM pooling up or looking/acting liquid or watery like this picture, there is too much on there.
> Shouldnt be an issue for him because he nail polished the caps in case it runs off the die, but I wanted others looking at the thread to know.


How much LM do you need for an 8700K die? Less than a pea size? And do you generally spread LM on the underside of the IHS too?


----------



## NorcalTRD

A very small amount, start with much less than you think you need and continue to spread it. You can add more later if arent able to coat the entire top side of the die.
Theres a good video on youtube that shows proper amount vs too much but i forget whos it was.
And yes, its called tinning the inside of the heatsink. Just lightly coat the area where the die will make contact with the heatsink.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Feels like we have this question come up with the same answer every page or two. Does ANYONE go through the thread and read anymore?


Nope, and in the age of Google - I still have people ask me things all the time that are available as the first search result. I figure it's all good... I get a few seconds of typing practice and they still think I have some massive "wealth of knowledge" in my cranium.

The best is usually with older people, when they ask "How would I search for that?" but for some reason the answer "The same way you just asked me about it" doesn't ever really register, so the cycle simply repeats.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NorcalTRD*
> 
> A very small amount, start with much less than you think you need and continue to spread it. You can add more later if arent able to coat the entire top side of the die.
> Theres a good video on youtube that shows proper amount vs too much but i forget whos it was.
> And yes, its called tinning the inside of the heatsink. Just lightly coat the area where the die will make contact with the heatsink.


Got it. I hope I get it the first time around.


----------



## The Pook

No updates in the delid tool kit sharing dealio thread ... so I ordered my own kit.

So excite.









Got my Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and Permatex 82180 in my Amazon cart ... just need to find $3.23 of something I need for free shipping


----------



## nrpeyton

Would either of these work for delidding? (If I'm careful not to cut in tooo far):

or would the blades simply be too thick?


----------



## stephenn82

Left one. Just take blade out and walk it in by hand. Kyle at hardocp has a vid on how to do it


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> Would either of these work for delidding? (If I'm careful not to cut in tooo far):
> 
> or would the blades simply be too thick?


I would actually say no to both of those options. Reason being is the left and right blades look to be quite dull. The last thing you want is a small bent spot in the blade when you have .2mm to play with.

Just my thought however....


----------



## stephenn82

Agreed. Ensure it is sharp. Once edged under the IHS, push the back away from you to lift the cutting edge off of the substrate and wiggle it on around. Do this at all corners first, then lap around whole IHS to break silicone seal. Slow is smooth and smooth is safe.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Ultimately, if it's to do by hand the 'perfect' blade (of which I'm not aware of one in existence btw) would be one with no sharp point but only enough thickness to avoid deformation - i.e. a .05mm titanium 'credit card' shape or similar.

The problem with exactos or straight-razor blades is usually when someone accidentally digs the point into the pcb... if you could have a blade that was really, really thin but not technically 'sharp' it would be less likely to damage the substrate but still easily fit between the IHS and the PCB.

There probably is something for carving that I don't know of that would be perfect - like an exacto blade but with a rounded point...









Still glad I just bought the Rockit. I figure if it's not worth ~$50 for an additional 300-600MHz and 10-20C better cooling, then it probably isn't worth doing at all. But that's JMHO of course.


----------



## nrpeyton

*Here's how it looks with blade removed.*

I'm so so desperate to do it. And I'm also off on holiday this week. Just worried I mess up.

I've watched so many videos already. I aught to just get my finger out. And get it done. lol

I also run a chilled water loop. (Using an Aquarium Water Chiller hooked up to my loop) so water temps never exceed 12-14c. However I still can't pass every stress test at 5GHZ at 24/7 safe voltages (I.E. no higher than 1.4v in BIOS with LLC on auto).

Although I'm not farr off it. I really think the de-lid will get me there.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> *Here's how it looks with blade removed.*


Mate... you'r in Scotland....send me a PM and we can sort something out...
I have everything...deliding tool, glue, liquid metal...Done mine couple of times already.


----------



## Chrisch

8700K delidded


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> 8700K delidded


Show off  I hate you for being one of the first ones who has a 8700K, lol.


----------



## Frozburn

Hello there, first time here and I have a question. I'll be delidding my 8700k and will use Grizzly Liquid Metal on the DIE, but I was wondering if it's worth using that between the IHS and the block? Or should I use MX-4 (I already have it). If so, is MX-4 the best option for that or is there something better currently (non conductive for between IHS / Block). I tried looking for tests specifically for that (LM on die, non conductive vs LM between IHS and the block) to see if the difference is worth it, but couldn't find anything :/ If someone has seen a good test before I'd greatly appreciate it!

(EK waterblock, 360 rad cooled by 6x GT AP-14, cooling only CPU) if that makes any difference when choosing.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frozburn*
> 
> Hello there, first time here and I have a question. I'll be delidding my 8700k and will use Grizzly Liquid Metal on the DIE, but I was wondering if it's worth using that between the IHS and the block? Or should I use MX-4 (I already have it). If so, is MX-4 the best option for that or is there something better currently (non conductive for between IHS / Block). I tried looking for tests specifically for that (LM on die, non conductive vs LM between IHS and the block) to see if the difference is worth it, but couldn't find anything :/ If someone has seen a good test before I'd greatly appreciate it!
> 
> (EK waterblock, 360 rad cooled by 6x GT AP-14, cooling only CPU) if that makes any difference when choosing.


LM between die and IHS will yield the biggest difference.
Between IHS and block will lower temps another couple of degrees. If you want to squeeze every bit of performance from your processor then option 2 is what you should do.
Not exactly sure if the grizzly stuff is different from CLU, but CLU will stain copper but has no other ill-effects besides that.


----------



## Frozburn

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> LM between die and IHS will yield the biggest difference.
> Between IHS and block will lower temps another couple of degrees. If you want to squeeze every bit of performance from your processor then option 2 is what you should do.
> Not exactly sure if the grizzly stuff is different from CLU, but CLU will stain copper but has no other ill-effects besides that.


The block I'm using is full nickel so I guess I have that out of the way. I've read that having LM on IHS / block can be dangerous (tho my motherboard is mounted horizontally this time so that's better) but I'm thinking I should just go for MX-4 between IHS / block to be on the safe side anyway (I'm fine with temp loss if it's something like 2-5C). Would you say MX-4 is a good paste for IHS / block and do you by any chance know of some article where the IHS is tested with LM and a non conductive paste like MX-4 or similar?

Also, I am going to put liquid electrical tape on the 4 dots that can fry the CPU from LM. Is this good for it? The only one I could find in stock that ships to my country https://www.amazon.de/Performix-LT14023-Electrical-Liquid-Black/dp/B000LNKIFS


----------



## paskowitz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frozburn*
> 
> The block I'm using is full nickel so I guess I have that out of the way. I've read that having LM on IHS / block can be dangerous (tho my motherboard is mounted horizontally this time so that's better) but I'm thinking I should just go for MX-4 between IHS / block to be on the safe side anyway (I'm fine with temp loss if it's something like 2-5C). Would you say MX-4 is a good paste for IHS / block and do you by any chance know of some article where the IHS is tested with LM and a non conductive paste like MX-4 or similar?
> 
> Also, I am going to put liquid electrical tape on the 4 dots that can fry the CPU from LM. Is this good for it? The only one I could find in stock that ships to my country https://www.amazon.de/Performix-LT14023-Electrical-Liquid-Black/dp/B000LNKIFS


I have LM on my IHS/CPU block. It doesn't run. Surface tension of LM is high. You can put the CPU upside down and it won't drip.

The only real danger with liquid metal is during application. Either squirting out too much through the syringe, minor sprays through brush movement or just brushing it where it shouldn't be.


----------



## The EX1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frozburn*
> 
> The block I'm using is full nickel so I guess I have that out of the way. I've read that having LM on IHS / block can be dangerous (tho my motherboard is mounted horizontally this time so that's better) but I'm thinking I should just go for MX-4 between IHS / block to be on the safe side anyway (I'm fine with temp loss if it's something like 2-5C). Would you say MX-4 is a good paste for IHS / block and do you by any chance know of some article where the IHS is tested with LM and a non conductive paste like MX-4 or similar?
> 
> Also, I am going to put liquid electrical tape on the 4 dots that can fry the CPU from LM. Is this good for it? The only one I could find in stock that ships to my country https://www.amazon.de/Performix-LT14023-Electrical-Liquid-Black/dp/B000LNKIFS


I used that same exact liquid electrical tape and it worked perfectly. My 4770K that I delidded back in 2013 is still fine with the same LM and liquid tape application after 4 years of use.


----------



## Chrisch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Show off
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hate you for being one of the first ones who has a 8700K, lol.


I have not only one


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *paskowitz*
> 
> I have LM on my IHS/CPU block. It doesn't run. Surface tension of LM is high. You can put the CPU upside down and it won't drip.
> 
> The only real danger with liquid metal is during application. Either squirting out too much through the syringe, minor sprays through brush movement or just brushing it where it shouldn't be.


Is that the only reason why people tend to not use it between the IHS and CPU block and between the die and GPU block?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> I have not only one


Lucky you


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frozburn*
> 
> The block I'm using is full nickel so I guess I have that out of the way. I've read that having LM on IHS / block can be dangerous (tho my motherboard is mounted horizontally this time so that's better) but I'm thinking I should just go for MX-4 between IHS / block to be on the safe side anyway (I'm fine with temp loss if it's something like 2-5C). Would you say MX-4 is a good paste for IHS / block and do you by any chance know of some article where the IHS is tested with LM and a non conductive paste like MX-4 or similar?
> 
> Also, I am going to put liquid electrical tape on the 4 dots that can fry the CPU from LM. Is this good for it? The only one I could find in stock that ships to my country https://www.amazon.de/Performix-LT14023-Electrical-Liquid-Black/dp/B000LNKIFS


Nickel eh, then you'd be fine. Why would having LM between IHS and block be dangerous? Temp drops for application between IHS and block would net you another 1-3C and for some, the effort required is just not worth it. MX-4 is a good paste. One of the top actually so you're good on that front. I've read somewhere about a thermal paste shootout but I just can't seem to remember where. But there are posts in this very thread where users have done LM between IHS and block that shows a slight temp decrease. LET is fine. I personally just use clear nail polish


----------



## pluke the 2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Frozburn*
> 
> The block I'm using is full nickel so I guess I have that out of the way. I've read that having LM on IHS / block can be dangerous (tho my motherboard is mounted horizontally this time so that's better) but I'm thinking I should just go for MX-4 between IHS / block to be on the safe side anyway (I'm fine with temp loss if it's something like 2-5C). Would you say MX-4 is a good paste for IHS / block and do you by any chance know of some article where the IHS is tested with LM and a non conductive paste like MX-4 or similar?
> 
> Also, I am going to put liquid electrical tape on the 4 dots that can fry the CPU from LM. Is this good for it? The only one I could find in stock that ships to my country https://www.amazon.de/Performix-LT14023-Electrical-Liquid-Black/dp/B000LNKIFS


I used MX4 between my IHS and Silicone. I did not see great results. I think i'm down a 3 -10c vs. Stock Intel Toothpaste.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pluke the 2*
> 
> I used MX4 between my IHS and Silicone. I did not see great results. I think i'm down a 3 -10c vs. Stock Intel Toothpaste.


If you read through, or searched this thread, you'd see that many other people have tried regular TIMs and they don't perform anywhere close to the liquid metals. There's someone on virtually every other page who comes to this _same exact_ realization. If you're going to delid, use liquid metal between the die and IHS.


----------



## chronicfx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> 8700K delidded


Do you know where I can buy the delid tool? I have an 8700k incoming.


----------



## Frozburn

Thank you for the answers.

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *chronicfx*
> 
> Do you know where I can buy the delid tool? I have an 8700k incoming.


https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Not exactly sure if the grizzly stuff is different from CLU, but CLU will stain copper but has no other ill-effects besides that.


It will also remove the letterimg off of the top of IHS that displays what processor you have.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> It will also remove the letterimg off of the top of IHS that displays what processor you have.


Oh yeah, that too. Thanks! Totally forgot about that. been a while since I deliddes my 4790K. Still running like a champ. Reading the last few posts, wondering why the clamp method isn't recommended anymore though. Was the simplest way to delid my 4790K back in the day without worry of slicing the pcb or nicking the vrms


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Oh yeah, that too. Thanks! Totally forgot about that. been a while since I deliddes my 4790K. Still running like a champ. Reading the last few posts, wondering why the clamp method isn't recommended anymore though. Was the simplest way to delid my 4790K back in the day without worry of slicing the pcb or nicking the vrms


You mean like clamping in a vice? Because the substrate is thinner and crackles like pringles in a can when you drop it on a concrete floor.

Razor for the steady handed....or get a delid tool.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> You mean like clamping in a vice? Because the substrate is thinner and crackles like pringles in a can when you drop it on a concrete floor.
> 
> Razor for the steady handed....or get a delid tool.


Ahhh.. ok. No wonder no one does it anymore. The delid tool is handy though. If I had to delid a few i'd definitely get one as well. I just dont trust myself with a blade enough to use it on a processor bit tht's probably just me.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> Ahhh.. ok. No wonder no one does it anymore. The delid tool is handy though. If I had to delid a few i'd definitely get one as well. I just dont trust myself with a blade enough to use it on a processor bit tht's probably just me.


It's not like it can't be done with a vice, it's just not foolproof. First skylake delids were done with a vice.



A small 10cm drill press vice like this basically lets the package sit nearly flat while being sheared. The forces being applied to the package is nearly identical to a delid tool.


----------



## The Pook

Wasn't supposed to come until Monday next week, but my CLU and delid kit are out for delivery


----------



## The Pook

Delided my i5 6400 first ... temps weren't bad on this chip, just wanted to give it a go.



Debating on grabbing some super glue and going ahead and doing my 7700K ... Permatex is on it's way but won't come til Tuesday. That or just leave it floating...

Either way ... some before temps on my 7700K @ 5Ghz. Might be able to raise frequency/drop voltage some, but just threw it together real quick.

Idle, ~36-40c


Load: ~91-97c


----------



## nrpeyton

Well i just de-lidded my CPU using a razor as shown below:



Note: slight discolouration on one side of DIE is only the photo quality/light.

I used Conductonaut *on* the DIE. *(I used nothing on the underside of IHS)?
*Then Kryonaut between IHS and EK Block.

What do you guys think of my new temps?

I used the same settings for the BEFORE and AFTER comparison.

CPU: 4900 Mhz
v.core: (1.35v adaptive).
(all power and LLC settings left to default/auto).

Cache: 4600 Mhz

DDR4: 4000 Mhz
18, 19, 19, 29, 2T. 1.5v
All other timings on auto.

*New delidded temps!*

Prime95 (AVX enabled):

Averages:
Core #0 - difference of: -15c
Core #1 -difference of: -11c
Core #2 -difference of: -12c
Core #3 - difference of: -18c

After 15 min 'core max' was -17c cooler
and 'package max' -12c cooler

Realbench 2.56:

Average 'CPU Package Temp' _at_ 10 mins (on 2nd successful Hash Check) was: 53c
= -18c difference

Max CPU Package Temp (reported in RealBench): 60c
= -18c difference

x264, 16 thread loop

After resetting hwinf64 at 2 mins.

Then taking a reading *at* 5 mins;

'Average CPU package' temp: 52c (-18c cooler)
&
'Core Max': 54c (-20c cooler)

Summary

Most insignificant improvement was prime95 core #1 only seen a 11c drop.

Most promising improvement was core #3 seen a 18c improvement.

And _best_ improvements show 18-20c improvements at best on x264 and Realbench (averages and max cores).

And finally, even large FFT (maximum Heat on AVX enabled Prime95 barely ever exceed 50c. With a maximum core average of only 47c

_Some cores even occasionally hitting the very high *30's*!!







_



Next Step:

I want to see if she can pass all stability tests now at 5GHz 1.4.V. (never possible before).


----------



## Falkentyne

any of you guys try or want to roll the dice with this copper IHS?

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Skylake-Kaby-Lake-i7-i5-copper-IHS-compatibile-7700K-7600K-6700K-6600K-7350K/192338491918?

Slow boat from Europe but I'm sure someone might enjoy this thing.


----------



## The Pook

Soooooo. RIP 7700K.









i5 6400 went great. Went to do my 7700K, apparently mounted my IHS upside down and didn't realize it, went to put it into the motheboard and somehow bent the hell out of the CPU without bending any mobo pins.

Mostly bent the corners of the CPU so I tried to bend them back flat ... and no luck.

i5 6400 is back in now.

Pretty sad.










Feel pretty nooby right now.

Debating to buy another 7700K or say forget it and go Coffee Lake... or 2066.

In slightly better news my i5 6400 is idling at 20c and Cinebench maxes out at 35c. Stock though.


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> Soooooo. RIP 7700K.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i5 6400 went great. Went to do my 7700K, apparently mounted my IHS upside down and didn't realize it, went to put it into the motheboard and somehow bent the hell out of the CPU without bending any mobo pins.
> 
> Mostly bent the corners of the CPU so I tried to bend them back flat ... and no luck.
> 
> i5 6400 is back in now.
> 
> Pretty sad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Feel pretty nooby right now.
> 
> Debating to buy another 7700K or say forget it and go Coffee Lake... or 2066.
> 
> In slightly better news my i5 6400 is idling at 20c and Cinebench maxes out at 35c. Stock though.


----------



## nrpeyton

De-lidded a CPU yesterday for 1st time ever! _(7700k)_

On the Kaby-Lake forum people are reporting a *5c difference between:*

Liquid Metal on DIE *ONLY*
Liquid Metal on DIE _*AND*_ underside of IHS.

Is that true from experience here?

Can't decide whether re-do the job. (It's not glued so won't be that hard).

I'm also considering using Conductonaut between my IHS and EK Supremacy block too. My warranty is void anyway -- so why not fight for every last degree possible? _("In for a penny in for a pound" -- or the American translation; "in for a cent in for a dollar".?
_

Thanks,

Nick
_~De-lidded my CPU yesterday for 1st time ever!_

.


----------



## Exilon

8700K delidded with vice method.



Edit: Regarding LM on die only or LM on die and IHS.

I found that the LM does not like to wet the nickel plating on the IHS unless you really rub it in, so thermal contact may be worse if only apply it to the die.

I applied a generous helping to both and then sealed the thing up with glue. Hope it doesn't run; squishing down on the IHS didn't make it bleed all over the place but who knows when it's at load temperature...


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Falkentyne*
> 
> any of you guys try or want to roll the dice with this copper IHS?
> 
> http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Skylake-Kaby-Lake-i7-i5-copper-IHS-compatibile-7700K-7600K-6700K-6600K-7350K/192338491918?
> 
> Slow boat from Europe but I'm sure someone might enjoy this thing.


Don't use copper with gallistan TIM (basically all the LM stuff). It gets messy from what I've heard.

The IHS is nickel plated copper anyways, so you're not really gaining anything.


----------



## Pedros

hey guys,
so today was cleaning day of my rig. Just got the Delid Die Mate 2 from der8auer and some conduct0naut and kryonaut. So... why not do it today ( oh gawd ... I have the shivers now







)

So what's missing is something to glue the IHS back together and I was thinking about buying some high-temperature silicone ( i only find acetic silicone though ). Is that good enough? If not what do you guys advise?

One more thing ... add Conductonaut on the underside of the IHS too?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> Soooooo. RIP 7700K.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i5 6400 went great. Went to do my 7700K, apparently mounted my IHS upside down and didn't realize it, went to put it into the motheboard and somehow bent the hell out of the CPU without bending any mobo pins.
> 
> Mostly bent the corners of the CPU so I tried to bend them back flat ... and no luck.
> 
> i5 6400 is back in now.
> 
> Pretty sad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Feel pretty nooby right now.
> 
> Debating to buy another 7700K or say forget it and go Coffee Lake... or 2066.
> 
> In slightly better news my i5 6400 is idling at 20c and Cinebench maxes out at 35c. Stock though.


Curious, what do you mean by upside down.....
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pedros*
> 
> hey guys,
> so today was cleaning day of my rig. Just got the Delid Die Mate 2 from der8auer and some conduct0naut and kryonaut. So... why not do it today ( oh gawd ... I have the shivers now
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> So what's missing is something to glue the IHS back together and I was thinking about buying some high-temperature silicone ( i only find acetic silicone though ). Is that good enough? If not what do you guys advise?
> 
> One more thing ... add Conductonaut on the underside of the IHS too?


No glue needed. Just place the IHS on the DIE and then clamp it down with the retention arm. Thats the preferred method however.


----------



## The Pook

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Curious, what do you mean by upside down.....


180 degrees off.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> 180 degrees off.


Oh, so the notches weren't lined up?


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> 180 degrees off.


Okay, just checking. :d

That change really made that big of a difference? Hmmmm


----------



## The Pook

If you mount the IHS upside down and mount the CPU in the socket correctly, no. Doesn't really matter AFAIK. But I was in a rush to get it back together, put the CPU in the socket upside down, and tried to close the lever.

That's why I have no idea how I bent the CPU and not the pins in the socket ...









Also why I feel pretty nooby.


----------



## domenic

I received my 8700k from Newegg the other day but the MB I want is the Maximus X Formula - no ship date other than "November".

In the meantime I did a delid, lapped, and re-attached the lid with RTV.

Used Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut and Rocket 88.

Before lapping I checked with a metal ruler and it looked off & the ruler wouldn't stand on its own. The lap job wasn't as perfect as I wanted but after an hour I just figured it was good enough. Afterwards the ruler stands up by itself and I can't see any gaps. Also i used this non-conductive tape to cover the small exposed metal pins near the proc just to be safe. I lapped the IHS after the delid so there was no chance of damaging the proc itself.


----------



## blaze2210

That looks like a little too much Conductonaut on there....You shouldn't really be seeing a "pool" of it on the die....


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *The Pook*
> 
> If you mount the IHS upside down and mount the CPU in the socket correctly, no. Doesn't really matter AFAIK. But I was in a rush to get it back together, put the CPU in the socket upside down, and tried to close the lever.
> 
> That's why I have no idea how I bent the CPU and not the pins in the socket ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also why I feel pretty nooby.


That's why you don't get in a hurry when doing a delid. Sorry for you bro


----------



## nrpeyton

Read a post the other day; someone said I should of applied Conductonaut to the underside of the IHS as well as the DIE.

What are others experience of this? Is there actually a temp drop to be had here?

Can't decide whether to re-do it now. (I never glued the IHS back on so it wouldn't be too timely).

Is it worth it though? Is thee anyone whose tested both methods?

Thanks.


----------



## Pedros

I just delided my 4690K. Went well but I tried to add some Conductonaut to the understide of the IHS and its hard has f... at the end of the day I just forgot it and went with just the die.

Its really hard to apply the Conductonaut on underside of the IHS. Any suggestions on how to make this less difficult? (it wouldn't stick ... :x )


----------



## tknight

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pedros*
> 
> I just delided my 4690K. Went well but I tried to add some Conductonaut to the understide of the IHS and its hard has f... at the end of the day I just forgot it and went with just the die.
> 
> Its really hard to apply the Conductonaut on underside of the IHS. Any suggestions on how to make this less difficult? (it wouldn't stick ... :x )


I use the tape method as shown in the video below, to apply LM to the underneath of the IHS.
By using the tape, it allows you to spread the LM out onto the IHS and once you get it spread out thin enough, it then bonds to the IHS and once you remove the tape, its a nice clean application.


----------



## Pedros

Thanks tknight. I redid the delid today and finally was able to get the LM underneath the IHS. I'm still trying out but @ 1.285v and 4.6Ghz on Prime i'm hitting 64ºC Max and yesterday i was hitting the 72ºc ... still i was expecting a bigger drop in the temperatures but not bad either way ... at full load only 64ºC is pretty "cool" ( in both senses )

This time around i removed all the silicone and added both LM to the die and IHS ... maybe i added a little more than i should of LM :x

What kind of temperatures are you hitting on yours?


----------



## nrpeyton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pedros*
> 
> Thanks tknight. I redid the delid today and finally was able to get the LM underneath the IHS. I'm still trying out but @ 1.285v and 4.6Ghz on Prime i'm hitting 64ºC Max and yesterday i was hitting the 72ºc ... still i was expecting a bigger This time around i removed all the silicone and added both LM to the die and IHS ... maybe i added a little more than i should of LM :x
> 
> What kind of temperatures are you hitting on yours?


I also just redone my de-lid. (As I never knew I needed LM on the underside of the IHS)

I'm glad I done it.

Here are the *results:*

*LM on DIE only vs. LM on DIE & IHS)*

x264, 16 thread loop
=============

CPU Package Temp Avg:

LM on DIE only: 52c
LM on DIE *&* IHS: 48c
Total difference from de-lid: 22c

Core Max Temp:

LM on DIE only: 52c
LM on DIE *&* IHS: 48c
Total difference from de-lid: 23c

Realbench 2.56
==========

CPU Package Temp Avg:

LM on DIE only: 54c
LM on DIE *&* IHS: 49c
Total difference from de-lid: 22c

Core Max Temp:

LM on DIE only: 60c
LM on DIE *&* IHS: 54c
Total difference from de-lid: 24c

Prime95 (27.9 with AVX)
===============

Core Max Temp:

LM on DIE only: 59c
LM on DIE *&* IHS: 56c
Total difference from de-lid: 20c

CPU Package Max Temp

LM on DIE only: 59c
LM on DIE *&* IHS: 56c
Total difference from de-lid: 15c

Prime95 with LM on DIE _*AND*_ IHS "individual" core averages were up to 2c colder compared with LM on DIE only.

Prime95 BEFORE de-lid individual core temps were:

#0 - 60
#1- 58
#2- 55
#3- 62

Prime95 AFTER de-lid individual core temps with LM on DIE _and_ IHS are:

#0 - 44.....(-16c colder than before de-lid)
#1 - 45.....(-13c '' '')
#2 - 42.....(-13c '' '')
#3 - 43.....(*-19c* '' '')

MISC
====

*-Also noticed less variance between temperatures of different cores.*

-Before I couldn't even stress test at 5 Ghz up to 1.40v. Now I am stress testing at 5.1 Ghz at _slightly_ under 1.4v!

-Was it worth it? YES

- How much did it cost? FREE (I used a razor and some Conductonaut I already owned).

Settings Used For Testing (CONSISTENT)
=============================

CPU: 4900 Mhz
v.core: (1.35v adaptive).
(all power and LLC settings left to default/auto).

Cache: 4600 Mhz

DDR4: 4000 Mhz
18, 19, 19, 29, 2T. 1.5v
All other timings on auto.

Chiller set to: 13c _(water temperature)_


----------



## Exilon

Gigabyte's UEFI still pisses me off after working with it during the last day.

5.0/4.8 GHz stable with 1.375V.

Never run P95 smallFFT FMA with Coffee Lake. I saw 400W from the wall meter, so >300W CPU load.


----------



## nrpeyton

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Gigabyte's UEFI still pisses me off after working with it during the last day.
> 
> 5.0/4.8 GHz stable with 1.375V.
> 
> Never run P95 smallFFT FMA with Coffee Lake. I saw 400W from the wall meter, so >300W CPU load.


wow - I've never seen my 7700k pull more than 120 watts (even overclocked under *extreme* load)

My old AMD-FX 8350 on the other hand -- could pull up to about 400 I think lol (from memory)

I'd love to pair my old FX up with my new 1080Ti (which is shunt modded). Thiat would certainly give my 850w PSU a good workout lol. Currently it barely ever sees 500w.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *nrpeyton*
> 
> wow - I've never seen my 7700k pull more than 120 watts (even overclocked under *extreme* load)
> 
> My old AMD-FX 8350 on the other hand -- could pull up to about 400 I think lol (from memory)
> 
> I'd love to pair my old FX up with my new 1080Ti (which is shunt modded). Thiat would certainly give my 850w PSU a good workout lol. Currently it barely ever sees 500w.


Some motherboards don't display the package power correctly. For example my package power was 180W while the wall meter read 400W. I can account for 70W outside of the CPU due to PSU efficiency and GPU, but I can't account for the missing 150W.


----------



## JackCY

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Some motherboards don't display the package power correctly. For example my package power was 180W while the wall meter read 400W. I can account for 70W outside of the CPU due to PSU efficiency and GPU, but I can't account for the missing 150W.


Almost none do. Mine reports depending on it's mood, sometimes the numbers are reported considerably higher and sometimes they look close to what they should be, depends how it "boots".


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *JackCY*
> 
> Almost none do. Mine reports depending on it's mood, sometimes the numbers are reported considerably higher and sometimes they look close to what they should be, depends how it "boots".


My old Asus Z87 Pro board did it fine. But that one also managed VID correctly.

In other news:

I re-delided my 8700K









On the first time, I used glue to put the IHS back on and it screwed up the IHS to die contact. I guess that's where a relidding tool comes in handy.

Currently running 5GHz no offset at 80C with 230W estimated CPU power compared to 90C before with the same workload.

The only annoying part was needing to sand/scrape off the glue. Be careful with what you use if you glue the lid back on!


----------



## cyan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> My old Asus Z87 Pro board did it fine. But that one also managed VID correctly.
> 
> In other news:
> 
> I re-delided my 8700K
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On the first time, I used glue to put the IHS back on and it screwed up the IHS to die contact. I guess that's where a relidding tool comes in handy.
> 
> Currently running 5GHz no offset at 80C with 230W estimated CPU power compared to 90C before with the same workload.
> 
> The only annoying part was needing to sand/scrape off the glue. Be careful with what you use if you glue the lid back on!


what do you use ?
I used car silicone and it's quite easy to clean.


----------



## Bubblewhale

Haven't posted here in a long time, just wondering about what to do with my 7700K for delid. I bought the Rockit 88 delid tool, Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut, and Permatex Black Silicone Adhesive Sealant. Wondering If I should I use tiny drops of the silicon around the IHS sides or cover the sides completely with small gap to allow heat to escape. Also quite unsure about time letting it to cure with the silicon, heard I can just leave it alone for 30 minutes and it'll be fine.


----------



## Exilon

Don't cover it entirely. For delidding you may just want to dot the sides for ease of handling. Liquid metal doesn't really run. I've put a gob on my die and it's stuck there.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> what do you use ?
> I used car silicone and it's quite easy to clean.


I ran out of silicone sealant and put a dot of gel glue (?) on there. Bad idea, don't do it


----------



## Bubblewhale

I heard the super glue option wasn't a great idea since it can just stick to the pcb, however you can just scrape silicon off if you used it to relid. I'm just more worried about screwing over the liquid tim on the die and relidding process but delidding with the Rockit 88 is a easy process.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bubblewhale*
> 
> I heard the super glue option wasn't a great idea since it can just stick to the pcb, however you can just scrape silicon off if you used it to relid. I'm just more worried about screwing over the liquid tim on the die and relidding process but delidding with the Rockit 88 is a easy process.


You can use Acetone to get rid of the super glue if ever you want to do a re-delid in the future.


----------



## Bubblewhale

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> You can use Acetone to get rid of the super glue if ever you want to do a re-delid in the future.


Yeah I have heard about that as a solution, but I feel like silicon would be a better idea. I know the TPU testing with silicon vs glue, but I guess it's not that much of an difference when it's already 20C+ from switching from the stock TIM/spacing to liquid TIM and smaller spacing anyway.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bubblewhale*
> 
> Yeah I have heard about that as a solution, but I feel like silicon would be a better idea. I know the TPU testing with silicon vs glue, but I guess it's not that much of an difference when it's already 20C+ from switching from the stock TIM/spacing to liquid TIM and smaller spacing anyway.


Yeah, I guess. I was in the same boat as you a few months ago but decided to just go with absolute performance (Super Glue) because, you know, we're OCN members









Truth be told though, I haven't tried using my Delid kit yet because I'm freakin' waiting for the 8700K to be on stock!


----------



## ccozmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bubblewhale*
> 
> Haven't posted here in a long time, just wondering about what to do with my 7700K for delid. I bought the Rockit 88 delid tool, Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut, and Permatex Black Silicone Adhesive Sealant. Wondering If I should I use tiny drops of the silicon around the IHS sides or cover the sides completely with small gap to allow heat to escape. Also quite unsure about time letting it to cure with the silicon, heard I can just leave it alone for 30 minutes and it'll be fine.


Perfect tools, yeah use High temp silicone, I got glue then decided to go silicone - worked great -20-30 degrees under load .. Idling at ambient temp !


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ccozmo*
> 
> Perfect tools, yeah use High temp silicone, I got glue then decided to go silicone - worked great -20-30 degrees under load .. Idling at ambient temp !


what if I told you that the "high temp automotive silicone" that sells for 10 plus bucks is not any better than the cheapest black tube of automotive silicone for 3.79? They both are rated for 500 degrees Fahrenheit. save your money, just saying...


----------



## Bubblewhale

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> what if I told you that the "high temp automotive silicone" that sells for 10 plus bucks is not any better than the cheapest black tube of automotive silicone for 3.79? They both are rated for 500 degrees Fahrenheit. save your money, just saying...


Got the 4 dollar Silicon from walmart, don't get why Amazon is selling it for 6-7.


----------



## blaze2210

You can typically find that same stuff at the dollar store also.... The main difference I've seen is in the amount that you get in the tube, which would still be enough for multiple CPU applications....


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ccozmo*
> 
> Perfect tools, yeah use High temp silicone, I got glue then decided to go silicone - worked great -20-30 degrees under load .. Idling at ambient temp !


And what made you switch from super glue?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Bubblewhale*
> 
> Got the 4 dollar Silicon from walmart, don't get why Amazon is selling it for 6-7.


cuz people like us lol


----------



## Exilon

I've stabilized my 8700K overclock at 5GHz 0 AVX offset @ 1.389V.

This is giving me about 220W CPU power and 80C load with 27C liquid temperature in my loop. Measurements were taken during x265 encode in handbrake

I think 53C rise over liquid when delidded looks high for that power level?

GamerNexus got 14C rise over liquid @ ~120W

8Pack got 60C total temperature with P95 26.6 800K FFT. I get the same in that workload, but he used a 240 AIO and I used a custom 5x140mm loop ?

I guess I'm being too conservative with the amount of liquid metal being used?

Anyone else with a 8700K want to give their input?


----------



## cyan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ccozmo*
> 
> Perfect tools, yeah use High temp silicone, I got glue then decided to go silicone - worked great -20-30 degrees under load .. Idling at ambient temp !


how do you idling at ambient temp ? (other than delid of couse)
a lot of case fan ?
I always get few degree higher than ambient temp.


----------



## ccozmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> how do you idling at ambient temp ? (other than delid of couse)
> a lot of case fan ?
> I always get few degree higher than ambient temp.


Using a Corsair H100i with high pressure Ek EVO fans for CPU. Case has 5 intake fans. It is hot where i am - so ambient is normally about 30 degrees & idle temp is usually same


----------



## ccozmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> And what made you switch from super glue?


Had read some issues about removing the glue if needing to delid again. Decided Silicon was the safer option


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ccozmo*
> 
> Had read some issues about removing the glue if needing to delid again. Decided Silicon was the safer option


I guess you didn't use Acetone, did you?


----------



## ccozmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> I guess you didn't use Acetone, did you?


No I didn't, it is not easy to get where I live. That's one of the reasons I used silicon instead, as need acetone to remove the glue


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ccozmo*
> 
> No I didn't, it is not easy to get where I live. That's one of the reasons I used silicon instead, as need acetone to remove the glue


Seriously (no pun intended)? You can't get regular nail acetone from where you live? I understand if you're pertaining to pure acetone though. As far as I remember, using regular acetone is enough.


----------



## ccozmo

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Seriously (no pun intended)? You can't get regular nail acetone from where you live? I understand if you're pertaining to pure acetone though. As far as I remember, using regular acetone is enough.


Not quite sure what the point is here. The original question was why did I choose silicone. And I still think it is the best choice, regardless of ability to get acetone


----------



## chibi

I picked up a bottle of Ultragel Super Glue and was wondering if this stuff is okay to use on the 4 contact pads underneath the IHS on my 8700K? I will be resealing the IHS with 4 small dabs on each corner.
Super Glue: http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/ultragel-super-glue-adhesive-4-g-0671435p.html

Alternatively, if I chicken out with the Super Glue, can I use the following product on the contact pads and 4 corners to reseal?
Gasket Maker: http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/ultra-black-rtv-gasket-maker-80-ml-0383722p.html#srp


----------



## Pedros

Best to use some high-temperature silicone ... I used one for fireplaces but you can use a different one. It will be easier to remove in the future if needed.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ccozmo*
> 
> Not quite sure what the point is here. The original question was why did I choose silicone. And I still think it is the best choice, regardless of ability to get acetone


I'm not making you believe that Super Glue is better than Silicone. I was just curious why you preferred Silicone. Most reviews say that Super Glue gives better performance but I don't want to start debating on that. The original question was why you chose Silicone, yes, but conversations evolve to different questions. But yeah, if you like Silicone then be my guest.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pedros*
> 
> Best to use some high-temperature silicone ... I used one for fireplaces but you can use a different one. It will be easier to remove in the future if needed.


That silicone he had listed is fine. No need for fireplace silicone. The black automotive stuff is already overkill


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> That silicone he had listed is fine. No need for fireplace silicone. The black automotive stuff is already overkill


This. The 'worst' performing type commonly available at the auto store I looked was 350F... so ~176C... I can guarantee if your PCB-to-IHS interface area is that hot... your cores melted long ago!


----------



## lexer

The thing i don't like about SuperGlue that is a hard glue a can be cracked if some presure is applied, that is the reason because always use silicone is flexible and is easier to remove. But is just my personal preference


----------



## Pedros

Hey guys,
so i got a 4790K and i delidded even before i tried it out









The thing is, i'm getting max 70ºC running at 4.6Ghz @ 1.25v

I'm cooling it with a H105 in push/pull.

Do you think i should re-delid and add more liquid metal in the die / IHS?


----------



## Pedros

Meanwhile, re-delidded the cpu ... got 5ºC lower temps ...

I still can't understand how you guys get max temp at 58C ... damn ...


----------



## Dasboogieman

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pedros*
> 
> Meanwhile, re-delidded the cpu ... got 5ºC lower temps ...
> 
> I still can't understand how you guys get max temp at 58C ... damn ...


Ambients, lower core voltage, thinner IHS. Loads of reasons.

Tbh once delidded, the bulk of thermal bottleneck is no longer the IHS or the interface (assuming it's intimate) but the silicon of the CPU die itself (IIRC I saw a figure of 120mW/k thrown around for Intel CPUs). Naked mounting only removes the Z-height transfer restriction of 2mm worth of Copper which yields 2-3C. This means that the Silicon itself is now limiting the transfer.


----------



## lexer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pedros*
> 
> Hey guys,
> so i got a 4790K and i delidded even before i tried it out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The thing is, i'm getting max 70ºC running at 4.6Ghz @ 1.25v
> 
> I'm cooling it with a H105 in push/pull.
> 
> Do you think i should re-delid and add more liquid metal in the die / IHS?


Are you sure that 1.25v is needed ? Because this CPUs with every small increment of vcore the temps scale exponentially. Mines does 4.5Ghz @ Offset -0.070V (1.21V). 70°C with a AVX application ?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I've stabilized my 8700K overclock at 5GHz 0 AVX offset @ 1.389V.
> 
> This is giving me about 220W CPU power and 80C load with 27C liquid temperature in my loop. Measurements were taken during x265 encode in handbrake
> 
> I think 53C rise over liquid when delidded looks high for that power level?
> 
> GamerNexus got 14C rise over liquid @ ~120W
> 
> 8Pack got 60C total temperature with P95 26.6 800K FFT. I get the same in that workload, but he used a 240 AIO and I used a custom 5x140mm loop ?
> 
> I guess I'm being too conservative with the amount of liquid metal being used?
> 
> Anyone else with a 8700K want to give their input?


Re-re-re-delidded again. Swapped the CLU out for a big glob of Conductonaut and then sealed the bottom and side edges with electrical tape







. I don't think it will run but never hurts to be sure.

All that effort got another 5-10C drop.


----------



## pluke the 2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you read through, or searched this thread, you'd see that many other people have tried regular TIMs and they don't perform anywhere close to the liquid metals. There's someone on virtually every other page who comes to this _same exact_ realization. If you're going to delid, use liquid metal between the die and IHS.


Yeah,I agree. I redid my relid with Liquid Metal and got a 15c drop.


----------



## Pedros

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *lexer*
> 
> Are you sure that 1.25v is needed ? Because this CPUs with every small increment of vcore the temps scale exponentially. Mines does 4.5Ghz @ Offset -0.070V (1.21V). 70°C with a AVX application ?


Well ... i stabilized mine at 4.6Ghz @ 1.24v.

Max temps on Prime blend test is between 60 and 64 for the hottest core now.

This cpu is lazy i guess


----------



## ducegt

I used a method that I havent seen discussed to remove superglue gel control loctite from a delid. Used acetone.

I didnt clean off the old CLU. It looked dried out and hardened. I added a layer of fresh CLU on die and IHS.

Upon boot my idle was 3c cooler than before and to my horror load about 20c warmer. I didnt glue and just clamped it. Idle lower but load higher... *** remounted AIO 4 times so its either applying new CLU on old stuff..about 10 months old.. That messed it up or my clamp. Anyone able to speak to this before I do a CLU cleaning tomorrow?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> 
> 
> I used a method that I havent seen discussed to remove superglue gel control loctite from a delid. Used acetone.
> 
> I didnt clean off the old CLU. It looked dried out and hardened. I added a layer of fresh CLU on die and IHS.
> 
> Upon boot my idle was 3c cooler than before and to my horror load about 20c warmer. I didnt glue and just clamped it. Idle lower but load higher... *** remounted AIO 4 times so its either applying new CLU on old stuff..about 10 months old.. That messed it up or my clamp. Anyone able to speak to this before I do a CLU cleaning tomorrow?


Yay acetone. Did you also scrub off all the superglue on the PCB

So if you just clamped it, did you make sure to loosen this screw first?



One of my screwed up attempts (see re-re-delid post above) was that the socket retention clamp forced the IHS forward when latching it, and it smeared the liquid metal application downwards.

The solution was to loosen that screw, latch the CPU, and then tighten it.

I've never actually tried to reuse CLU though. Did the acetone not get to the old CLU?


----------



## Falkentyne

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I used a method that I havent seen discussed to remove superglue gel control loctite from a delid. Used acetone.
> 
> I didnt clean off the old CLU. It looked dried out and hardened. I added a layer of fresh CLU on die and IHS.
> 
> Upon boot my idle was 3c cooler than before and to my horror load about 20c warmer. I didnt glue and just clamped it. Idle lower but load higher... *** remounted AIO 4 times so its either applying new CLU on old stuff..about 10 months old.. That messed it up or my clamp. Anyone able to speak to this before I do a CLU cleaning tomorrow?


You **NEED** To remove the old CLU ! Don't re-use it. You can buy 5 gram tubes of Conductonaut so there's no need to treat it like a precious material like liquid gold. The exact same thing happened when I didn't remove the hardened conductonaut on my laptop's copper heatsink (I removed the heatsink to put on new thermal pads); temps were much higher and high core differences. When I completely removed it (leaving it smooth but with a stain on the heatisnk) and redid it from scratch, temps were back to where they were before. So always remove and wipe the surfaces clean, in your case, the silicon die and the IHS underside.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Falkentyne*
> 
> You **NEED** To remove the old CLU ! Don't re-use it. You can buy 5 gram tubes of Conductonaut so there's no need to treat it like a precious material like liquid gold. The exact same thing happened when I didn't remove the hardened conductonaut on my laptop's copper heatsink (I removed the heatsink to put on new thermal pads); temps were much higher and high core differences. When I completely removed it (leaving it smooth but with a stain on the heatisnk) and redid it from scratch, temps were back to where they were before. So always remove and wipe the surfaces clean, in your case, the silicon die and the IHS underside.


Thanks for sharing your experience. I thought the old and new would meld together when warmed. Ill clean and redo the CLU.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> Yay acetone. Did you also scrub off all the superglue on the PCB
> 
> So if you just clamped it, did you make sure to loosen this screw first?
> 
> 
> 
> One of my screwed up attempts (see re-re-delid post above) was that the socket retention clamp forced the IHS forward when latching it, and it smeared the liquid metal application downwards.
> 
> The solution was to loosen that screw, latch the CPU, and then tighten it.
> 
> I've never actually tried to reuse CLU though. Did the acetone not get to the old CLU?


PCB is smooth. Qtip doesnt snag anything. I did not loosen that screw, but I didnt see the IHS slide. I didnt attempt the CLU. The upside down chip acetone bath was for breaking the superglue on 4 corners only. Thanks.


----------



## mzimm88

When applying the liquid metal, should I just apply it to the die or should I apply it to the die and IHS? The guides I have found online seem to have mixed/unclear instructions on whether the liquid metal should just be applied to the die or the die and the IHS. So, I am looking for some other people's experience here. Also, when applying the liquid metal, am I trying to get every bit of residual liquid metal off so that it is like a thin coat of paint or leave a few bubbles on it?


----------



## Falkentyne

Best to apply it to both surfaces, and rub it vigorously to the IHS surface with the swab included with the Conductonaut. That way you're insured for a better fit and if there is any reaction of the LM to the IHS, it will use the LM applied to the surface first (and start right away) rather than what's on the silicon. This can give a 1-5C temp drop. It's not just the application, but also the wiping to create a better bond right away.

It's the same basic concept that you heard about years ago, back during the dark ages, called "Tinning the heatsink"


----------



## mzimm88

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Falkentyne*
> 
> Best to apply it to both surfaces, and rub it vigorously to the IHS surface with the swab included with the Conductonaut. That way you're insured for a better fit and if there is any reaction of the LM to the IHS, it will use the LM applied to the surface first (and start right away) rather than what's on the silicon. This can give a 1-5C temp drop. It's not just the application, but also the wiping to create a better bond right away.
> 
> It's the same basic concept that you heard about years ago, back during the dark ages, called "Tinning the heatsink"


I want to make sure I am understanding you correctly. Are you saying I should apply it the IHS but rub it a lot so the application is very very thin, but just do a little rubbing on the silicon?


----------



## Falkentyne

Yeah!
The silicon rubbing is just to get a thin and even coating; you're just spreading it, rather than rubbing it. For the IHS, you're basically tinning and working it into the surface right away, so if there are any imperfections, you start filling the surfaces right away. I recommend before doing that, you clean the underside of the IHS with 93% or better alcohol and a nice lint free cloth, if you have one. Then you can tin with the swab that comes with Conductonaut. I don't know what CLP or CLU comes with. That way you maximize the heat transfer potential. This is most commonly done on copper or nickel plated heatsinks, but it works on the IHS too. At worst, temps won't change. At best, you might get a drop you will appreciate. This is assuming of course that your IHS isn't warped or defective on the underside (a user with a 8700k had a warped IHS underside).


----------



## mzimm88

Okay, that makes perfect sense. So, just filling the imperfections on the IHS with the liquid metal and doing a regular (but still thin) coat on the die. That is really helpful. Thank you again! I had heard you can use coffee filters to clean the die/IHS, should I avoid that? The lint free cloth are the microfiber type things, yes?


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mzimm88*
> 
> I had heard you can use coffee filters to clean the die/IHS, should I avoid that? The lint free cloth are the microfiber type things, yes?


Coffee filters work great. Used them several hundred times myself.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mzimm88*
> 
> Okay, that makes perfect sense. So, just filling the imperfections on the IHS with the liquid metal and doing a regular (but still thin) coat on the die. That is really helpful. Thank you again! I had heard you can use coffee filters to clean the die/IHS, should I avoid that? The lint free cloth are the microfiber type things, yes?


Paper towels are what I tend to use, since I always forget about the coffee filters in my closet whenever I do a TIM replacement....


----------



## Falkentyne

I use toilet paper since I'm a glutton and I have no paper towels (no, I have no paper towels except some old restaurant stuff with recycled paper) but I do make sure any lint is gone after wiping, and I didn't want to have to discard the hotline games microfiber cloths that are far more valuable. I really should use at least some of the lint free cloths that came with all the Hotline Games mouse feet I stockpiled. Guess I'll buy some coffee filters now. Are they expensive?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Falkentyne*
> 
> I use toilet paper since I'm a glutton and I have no paper towels (no, I have no paper towels except some old restaurant stuff with recycled paper) but I do make sure any lint is gone after wiping, and I didn't want to have to discard the hotline games microfiber cloths that are far more valuable. I really should use at least some of the lint free cloths that came with all the Hotline Games mouse feet I stockpiled. Guess I'll buy some coffee filters now. Are they expensive?


Nah, not expensive at all, you should be able to get 100 coffee filters for around $1....


----------



## dante`afk

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I've stabilized my 8700K overclock at 5GHz 0 AVX offset @ 1.389V.
> 
> This is giving me about 220W CPU power and 80C load with 27C liquid temperature in my loop. Measurements were taken during x265 encode in handbrake
> 
> I think 53C rise over liquid when delidded looks high for that power level?
> 
> GamerNexus got 14C rise over liquid @ ~120W
> 
> 8Pack got 60C total temperature with P95 26.6 800K FFT. I get the same in that workload, but he used a 240 AIO and I used a custom 5x140mm loop ?
> 
> I guess I'm being too conservative with the amount of liquid metal being used?
> 
> Anyone else with a 8700K want to give their input?


wow and I thought my 8700 is bad, I need 1.34 for 5ghz.
temps look defo too high for a delidded cpu with LM. mine is currently drying in the rockit88.


----------



## ducegt

Back up and running after cleaning and reapplying CLU. I put superglue on 4 corners again like before.

These drops are comparing my 10 month old delid with a fresh application. 7700K 5.1ghz.

Highest core temp, Cinebench multi after booting.
Before: Idle, 30. Load, 77
After: Idle, 25. Load, 66
Drop. Idle, 5. Load, 11.


----------



## Falkentyne

Nice work ducegt.


----------



## enigma7820

I have to chime in because I am the same way constantly checking temps and making sure tim on die are in still good shape every so often. But I noticed the guy above had problems with higher temps after only 10 months. I used to check every 6 month, than every year when I had my 3770k. But honestly I went 3 years without looking and honestly whether it was 6 months or 3 years the CLU application was brand new every single time and looked nothing like the picture above. That to me having done it like 5+ times appears to be way too much CLU applied. I have a video i made with the tiny amount I apply when doing it. I agree with glue in the 4 corners as well before mounting because when my IHS slid when installing before gluing it down it smeared my clu application and I had to redue it.


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I have to chime in because I am the same way constantly checking temps and making sure tim on die are in still good shape every so often. But I noticed the guy above had problems with higher temps after only 10 months. I used to check every 6 month, than every year when I had my 3770k. But honestly I went 3 years without looking and honestly whether it was 6 months or 3 years the CLU application was brand new every single time and looked nothing like the picture above. That to me having done it like 5+ times appears to be way too much CLU applied. I have a video i made with the tiny amount I apply when doing it. I agree with glue in the 4 corners as well before mounting because when my IHS slid when installing before gluing it down it smeared my clu application and I had to redue it.


The quality of the video doesn't compare to a photograph. Can't really see what your application looks like.You do realize one of those images was me applying new CLU on top of old clu?

Have you ever tested reapplying CLU after X months and saw no differences in temperature? That would be an ancdedote with substance.

It's not that it wasn't working or had gone bad after 10 months. Temps were still much less than prior to delidding, but the numbers speak for themselves. Some efficiency was lost. I did treat my CPU different than most users. I ran stress tests for 500+ hours during this time at voltages 1.4 all the way up to 1.55 on a 7700K which draws 140+ watts. I also subjected my entire PC to winter air on occasion which had the CPU reading an idle temp of 0. Maybe I just put too much on, but you haven't seen an actual picture of what that looked like. Below is the fresh application.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *dante`afk*
> 
> wow and I thought my 8700 is bad, I need 1.34 for 5ghz.
> temps look defo too high for a delidded cpu with LM. mine is currently drying in the rockit88.


Yeah I re-did it with way more conductonaut and it dropped another 10C.


----------



## enigma7820

Sorry for the poor quality video i used my front camera for recording because i was alone. Yes i have tested when reapplying. Because usually once you unlid it it will disturb the tim. My temps were always roughly the same give or take ambient temps.

I wasnt trying to insult you if that is the way took it the layer should be literally a mirror and all i see is an application that looks to thick and not mirror like. Being as i have done it so many times i figured i would offer advice. When i watch my video its clear on my pc it looks like a mirror not rough and sandy looking like your pictures


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> I wasnt trying to insult you if that is the way took it the layer should be literally a mirror and all i see is an application that looks to thick and not mirror like. Being as i have done it so many times i figured i would offer advice. When i watch my video its clear on my pc it looks like a mirror not rough and sandy looking like your pictures


Didn't take it as an insult. It's just hard for me to grasp that I didn't do it well when temps are more than 20C lower than stock. I used more CLU this 2nd time because I saw how the excess from before stayed put even if it got on the PCB. Why would less be more efficient? Worst case, I wasted a dollar of CLU.


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*


This is proper application.


----------



## cyan

Is putting to much CLU/Conductonaut just waste of money or it have impact on temperature ?


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> Is putting to much CLU/Conductonaut just waste of money or it have impact on temperature ?


Both, in addition to the possibility of excess leaving the silicone and contacting capacitors or other parts and ruining the CPU.


----------



## cyan

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NorcalTRD*
> 
> Both, in addition to the possibility of excess leaving the silicone and contacting capacitors or other parts and ruining the CPU.


I already coat the other parts with polish.
but I think I will re paste again when I got the chance.(I hate waiting for car silicone to fully cured) maybe I'll get better than 15c different.


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> I already coat the other parts with polish.
> but I think I will re paste again when I got the chance.(I hate waiting for car silicone to fully cured) maybe I'll get better than 15c different.


There's no way too much LM can make temperatures worse other than shorting out power/ground and starting a small fire.

CLU/CLP/Conductonaut is a poor gap filler. For peak performance, you need to coat both sides (IHS and die) and then put enough on that only a tiny amount squishes out when the IHS is pressed against the die.

I switched from CLU to Conductonaut, and put enough to completely fill the gap. There was a little squishing out onto the substrate when I took the lid off to check, but it didn't run anywhere. Galinstan ( the LM part of LM paste ) has very high surface tension so it doesn't really flow on unwetted surfaces even when vertical.



I also didn't use any glue to maximize IHS to die contact and just 'secured' the IHS with small strips of electrical tape.

This dropped my temperatures by another 10C vs thin layer of CLU + super glue and equalized temperatures across all cores. In the interest of science, I probably should've tested with less variables, but that's too much effort.

Here's my final temperatures @ 230W load on a 8700K



1 last thing. Unless you used a relid tool and let it set completely, I recommend loosening the socket retention mechanism before latching so the socket clamp doesn't push the IHS forward and mess with the application/relid.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> There's no way too much LM can make temperatures worse other than shorting out power/ground and starting a small fire.
> 
> CLU/CLP/Conductonaut is a poor gap filler. For peak performance, you need to coat both sides (IHS and die) and then put enough on that only a tiny amount squishes out when the IHS is pressed against the die.
> 
> I switched from CLU to Conductonaut, and put enough to completely fill the gap. There was a little squishing out onto the substrate when I took the lid off to check, but it didn't run anywhere. Galinstan ( the LM part of LM paste ) has very high surface tension so it doesn't really flow on unwetted surfaces even when vertical.
> 
> 
> 
> I also didn't use any glue to maximize IHS to die contact and just 'secured' the IHS with small strips of electrical tape.
> 
> This dropped my temperatures by another 10C vs thin layer of CLU + super glue and equalized temperatures across all cores. In the interest of science, I probably should've tested with less variables, but that's too much effort.
> 
> Here's my final temperatures @ 230W load on a 8700K
> 
> 
> 
> 1 last thing. Unless you used a relid tool and let it set completely, I recommend loosening the socket retention mechanism before latching so the socket clamp doesn't push the IHS forward and mess with the application/relid.


So even if you see a little "pool" of LM in the die during application, that's fine? Or is a mirror finish in both IHS and die still the way to go?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> So even if you see a little "pool" of LM in the die during application, that's fine? Or is a mirror finish in both IHS and die still the way to go?


I had a tiny pool of Conductonaut on the die w/ a mirror finish on IHS and it was (still is) fine. My advice is if you're nervous about spillage:

1) Put the IHS back on and press down. Lift the IHS to see how much it's squished out. There should only be a little around the edges. Carefully clean up the spilled LM on the substrate and then mix the LM on the die again before replacing the IHS. Consider putting electrical tape over any exposed contacts under the IHS.

2) If you have a relidding tool, secure the IHS with it and seal the IHS to the substrate from the _outside_. This will keep any LM from leaking out without degrading thermal performance, although it's unlikely in the first place since the substrate warps a bit and presses into the IHS when locked into the socket. Also, the high surface tension of the LM will prevent it from leaking through very narrow gaps.

I did #2 with just thin strips of electrical tape on the top and bottom of the IHS.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> I had a tiny pool of Conductonaut on the die w/ a mirror finish on IHS and it was (still is) fine. My advice is if you're nervous about spillage:
> 
> 1) Put the IHS back on and press down. Lift the IHS to see how much it's squished out. There should only be a little around the edges. Carefully clean up the spilled LM on the substrate and then mix the LM on the die again before replacing the IHS. Consider putting electrical tape over any exposed contacts under the IHS.
> 
> 2) If you have a relidding tool, secure the IHS with it and seal the IHS to the substrate from the outside. This will keep any LM from leaking out without degrading thermal performance, although it's unlikely in the first place since the substrate warps a bit and presses into the IHS when locked into the socket. Also, the high surface tension of the LM will prevent it from leaking through very narrow gaps.
> 
> I did #2 with just thin strips of electrical tape on the top and bottom of the IHS.


Gotcha! Thanks for the insight.


----------



## Falkentyne

Or you can use the foam barrier trick (has to be VERY highly compressible foam), this is very common now for laptops (thanks to Mr Fox and others on notebookreview forums) as it creates a barrier that the LM simply can't pass through. But the foam barrier can NOT be used in place of nail polish, Kapton tape or Super33+ tape, but rather in addition to it. The foam barrier is to stop the LM from spilling on the PCB or motherboard, not to protect the SMD resistors.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Falkentyne*
> 
> Or you can use the foam barrier trick (has to be VERY highly compressible foam), this is very common now for laptops (thanks to Mr Fox and others on notebookreview forums) as it creates a barrier that the LM simply can't pass through. But the foam barrier can NOT be used in place of nail polish, Kapton tape or Super33+ tape, but rather in addition to it. The foam barrier is to stop the LM from spilling on the PCB or motherboard, not to protect the SMD resistors.


That's just added protection, right? Or is there more advantage in using foam?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> That's just added protection, right? Or is there more advantage in using foam?


It's added protection, although it's far more useful on laptops since they don't have an IHS.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> It's added protection, although it's far more useful on laptops since they don't have an IHS.


Yeah, so no real performance advantage with desktop CPU's, correct?


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> Yeah, so no real performance advantage with desktop CPU's, correct?


For either desktop or mobile CPU there is NO real performance advantage.
It's just something used on mobile CPU's (Laptops...tablets etc..) because they don't have a IHS and its a direct dye mount.
Because they don't have a IHS and to avoid LM running around they use foam...as a measure of protection.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> For either desktop or mobile CPU there is NO real performance advantage.
> It's just something used on mobile CPU's (Laptops...tablets etc..) because they don't have a IHS and its a direct dye mount.
> Because they don't have a IHS and to avoid LM running around they use foam...as a measure of protection.


Yeah, sorry I used the wrong word (performance). I should've used benefit/advantage. But yeah, I know what you mean, thanks!


----------



## -SpArkLeS-

Delid noob here!

Got a 7700k and I don't like my temps, it's not overclocked an runs at around 40°C idle and goes up to 70-80°C when gaming, my gpu is fine at 50°C max. I have 1x 240mm rad and a 360mm. In a Define S.

I will be cleaning my loop and will also open up my block to see if has gunked up.

From what I read about the 7700k is that it's a hot piece of chip, so might as well try this delid stuff









I watched some youtube video's anything in particular I should look out for. I'll be buying a tool and thermal grizzly (should I get 1 gram or 5 gram), what's this about resealing is it needed?

Thx (still a bit afraid)


----------



## Falkentyne

5 gram is best. Better to have extra than too little.
Be careful when trying to push the initial amount out. It's best to not use the needle spout at first, just try pushing the plunger very slowly normally, get a few drops out, and then try the needle spout after. Once you can get a drop out that way, then do it again and apply it on the CPU.

Remember to not apply alot of sudden force on the plunger when first trying to use it. Be very careful.


----------



## becks

Ye...don't spray LM like I did..

Freaking everywhere...
Motherboard...
CPU..
GPU...
PSU...
Basically everywhere in the PC + the desk it sat on + the carpet underneath....

(I still have stains from it on my desk...)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> Ye...don't spray LM like I did..
> 
> Freaking everywhere...
> Motherboard...
> CPU..
> GPU...
> PSU...
> Basically everywhere in the PC + the desk it sat on + the carpet underneath....
> 
> (I still have stains from it on my desk...)


What?


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> What?


Yep... True story! Panicked so much I ordered 6 liters of isopropil alcohol that afternoon with priority next day delivery.
Saved the PC but not the desk and carpet.


----------



## WexleySnoops

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> Ye...don't spray LM like I did..
> 
> Freaking everywhere...
> Motherboard...
> CPU..
> GPU...
> PSU...
> Basically everywhere in the PC + the desk it sat on + the carpet underneath....
> 
> (I still have stains from it on my desk...)


LM splooge.....nice


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Falkentyne*
> 
> 5 gram is best. Better to have extra than too little.
> Be careful when trying to push the initial amount out. It's best to not use the needle spout at first, just try pushing the plunger very slowly normally, get a few drops out, and then try the needle spout after. Once you can get a drop out that way, then do it again and apply it on the CPU.
> 
> Remember to not apply alot of sudden force on the plunger when first trying to use it. Be very careful.


5 gram Conductonaut is a lot of LM.

1 gram is good for 2 applications on a 8700K size die.

And yeah, don't get LM on carpet. It does not come out...


----------



## Jobotoo

Just received the der8auer Delid-Die-Mate X


----------



## BlivAK

So I got one of these for my 7700K...looks interesting. Copper IHS for Skylake


----------



## d4icon

Anybody know if tool DELID BrakeFree/EnterSetup --> 



is compatible with coffe lake?

thanks


----------



## Satanello

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BlivAK*
> 
> So I got one of these for my 7700K...looks interesting. Copper IHS for Skylake


Ordered the same copper IHS 5 min ago!


----------



## Chrisch

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Exilon*
> 
> 5 gram Conductonaut is a lot of LM.
> 
> 1 gram is good for 2 applications on a 8700K size die.
> 
> And yeah, don't get LM on carpet. It does not come out...


with 1gr i can delid 20 (twenty) 8700K. dont use to much LM


----------



## undercoverb0ss

Isn't the Intel IHS nickel plated copper anyway?


----------



## Exilon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Chrisch*
> 
> with 1gr i can delid 20 (twenty) 8700K. dont use to much LM


If you're being stingy with it sure. IDC showed us years ago that a thin painted layer was CYA from the LM paste manufacturers.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *undercoverb0ss*
> 
> Isn't the Intel IHS nickel plated copper anyway?


Yes it's nickel plated copper. A pure copper IHS is a waste of money... just sand the thing if it's not flat enough.


----------



## d4icon

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d4icon*
> 
> Anybody know if tool DELID BrakeFree/EnterSetup -->
> 
> 
> 
> is compatible with coffe lake?
> 
> thanks


Helppp me plezzz


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d4icon*
> 
> Helppp me plezzz


use a razor instead probably have one laying around so its free and easy as hell.


----------



## d4icon

lol??

never xDD razer

I already have the tool that I commented (Breaker from EaserSetup.com) but I need to know if it is compatible or not with coffelake


----------



## BlivAK

Quote:


> Yes it's nickel plated copper. A pure copper IHS is a waste of money... just sand the thing if it's not flat enough.


How about to preserve the original IHS, you never know if you have to sell or RMA eh?


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BlivAK*
> 
> How about to preserve the original IHS, you never know if you have to sell or RMA eh?


Once you delid, warranty is shot. No RMA.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *d4icon*
> 
> lol??
> 
> never xDD razer
> 
> I already have the tool that I commented (Breaker from EaserSetup.com) but I need to know if it is compatible or not with coffelake


Look's like rev2 is what you need for CL. but if the cpu fits in the slot of your tool, might work.


----------



## Imprezzion

I got myself another 4770K super cheap secondhand locally and i am trying if this one clocks better than my horrible other one which is delidded.
That one struggles to do 4.3Ghz on 1.320v and can''t go ANY higher. Even with 1.40v.

This new one is still horrible, but it's a LOT better. It's not delidded yet but runs 4.5Ghz on 1.336v seemingly stable but can't test with nay high stress test like Prime95 28.7 AVX since temps run in the mid to high 90's. Don't wanna stress that for any length of time (ran it for ~5 minutes and didn't BSOD).

I'm running like, 50 loops of x264 stresstest now and temps are in the low-mid 70's and it's been running for 15 minutes now. Seems like with low enough temps I can get 4.5Ghz stable (running stock 3.5Ghz uncore for now). It does need a lot of VCCIN to run stable. About 1.95-2.0v otherwise it will throw a WHEA BSOD within seconds with 1.80v...

Tomorrow i'll wack the lid off in the vice like i did with my other one and i will CLU it and see if i can get the same 20c drop as my other one had. That would give me mid-high 70's in Prime and low-mid 50's in x264. (Using a NH-D15S with 3 fans)


----------



## cyan

just re-delid because 1st time I put to much conductonaut.
(I did put clear polish but for better sleep .. might as well)

same temp on 3 core, only 1 core 2 C lower.
I guess to much liquid metal doesn't matter much to temperature ?


----------



## NorcalTRD

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cyan*
> 
> just re-delid because 1st time I put to much conductonaut.
> (I did put clear polish but for better sleep .. might as well)
> 
> same temp on 3 core, only 1 core 2 C lower.
> I guess to much liquid metal doesn't matter much to temperature ?


Doesnt matter too much on temp, but does matter in regards to spillage and damaging the cpu or other components.
Hence why it is heavily advised to do the thin coat.


----------



## Craigk19

i would like to pick up a dr. delid or the Delid Die Mate 2 but cant get the dr delid unless i spend over 75 on aquatunning and DDM2 from caseking.de doesn't ship to USA not a fan of the rockit 88 one. this is the only place i know to ask that might get a response. how did everyone go about getting theirs?


----------



## NorcalTRD

Just performed my delid last night. Unbelievable improvements!
Used rockitcool88, Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut, permatex black gasket maker to reseal, and some blue painters tape to mask off while applying LM.
Using Thermaltake Water 3.0 360 AIO cooler.
I overclocked to 5.0Ghz pre-delid on 1.33v, ran games and prime95 blend fine low to mid 50c but I couldnt run small fft's without prime95 giving me an error or immediately being in the low 90c's and stopping less than 30s in.

After delid, system seemed faster and stabilized.
Ran small fft's and reached 80C package max. All cores now within 1-2c of each other regardless of load level, previously was within 6-8c of each other sporadically.
Ran cinebench and score was improved 20-30 with no changes other than delid.

I believe I could probably run less voltage now at the same clock.
Feel this will give me the headroom for 5.2Ghz









Process: popped lid with rockitcool, wiped intel pigeon poop away with paper towels and 97% isopropyl, used bamboo tool to rub away all previous gasket from both IHS and board, wiped down all with paper towel and isopropyl again, leaving the die in tool i taped off the silicone, applied pin head drop to die, spread over about 5-10 minutes working it in, used excess to tin the bottom of the IHS, removed tape, used flat side of bamboo tool to scrape small amounts of permatex and apply to edges of IHS leaving the air gap in same location top right, clamped and let sit 16 hours. Used regular thermal paste on the AIO cooler to cpu.


----------



## Craigk19

if living in the States do we have to settle for Rockit 88?


----------



## l1CappYl1

Delidded an i7 8700k and it went from 73°c @ 4.8ghz (on air) to 65°c @ 5.1ghz. Used a generic 115x delidder and CL liquid ultra.

Getting ready to pop the top


Everything clean and LM applied, it's ready to go into the motherboard.


I only used tape during application to make it easier for an even coat without getting the LM everywhere and I didn't use anything to glue the ihs back on.


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l1CappYl1*
> 
> Delidded an i7 8700k and it went from 73°c @ 4.8ghz (on air) to 65°c @ 5.1ghz. Used a generic 115x delidder and CL liquid ultra.
> 
> Getting ready to pop the top
> 
> 
> Everything clean and LM applied, it's ready to go into the motherboard.
> 
> 
> I only used tape during application to make it easier for an even coat without getting the LM everywhere and I didn't use anything to glue the ihs back on.


looks good man congrats!

and nice overclock too wow!

I am looking forward to monday when i get my 7700k 5ghz silicone lottery chip


----------



## l1CappYl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> looks good man congrats!
> 
> and nice overclock too wow!
> 
> I am looking forward to monday when i get my 7700k 5ghz silicone lottery chip


Cheers man, it certainly feels nice to break 5Ghz.


----------



## moustang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Craigk19*
> 
> if living in the States do we have to settle for Rockit 88?


Is there a specific reason why you don't like the Rockit88?

I've got the Rockit88. I've used it to delid several CPUs. Everything from the i7 4790k up to the current 8700k. It works exactly like advertised. Nice and easy, and the relid tool works perfectly to relid the CPU once done. It may not be the most elegant looking tool, but it works perfectly. Why do you not like it?


----------



## moustang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l1CappYl1*
> 
> Delidded an i7 8700k and it went from 73°c @ 4.8ghz (on air) to 65°c @ 5.1ghz. Used a generic 115x delidder and CL liquid ultra.
> 
> Getting ready to pop the top
> 
> 
> Everything clean and LM applied, it's ready to go into the motherboard.
> 
> 
> I only used tape during application to make it easier for an even coat without getting the LM everywhere and I didn't use anything to glue the ihs back on.


Wish I had taken pics.

I used the Rockit 88 delidding tool and Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut for my 8700k. Can't tell you before temps, because I never even booted it up before I delidded it. However, I can hit 5.1GHZ in the low 70C range under extended Prime95 stress testing after the delid, with normal operations staying under 60C with a Corsair H115i V2 AIO cooler (with fans at only 30%). I can hit 5.2GHZ and have it be 100% stable with temps in the low 80C under heavy stress testing.

I also used tape just to make sure I didn't get the liquid metal on anything I didn't want it on. Very thin layer on CPU and IHS. I've done several delids before, and this was a job I was very proud of. I don't think it could have been done better. Wish I had taken pics now, but at the time I just wanted to put my PC together.


----------



## l1CappYl1

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *moustang*
> 
> Wish I had taken pics.
> 
> I used the Rockit 88 delidding tool and Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut for my 8700k. Can't tell you before temps, because I never even booted it up before I delidded it. However, I can hit 5.1GHZ in the low 70C range under extended Prime95 stress testing after the delid, with normal operations staying under 60C with a Corsair H115i V2 AIO cooler (with fans at only 30%). I can hit 5.2GHZ and have it be 100% stable with temps in the low 80C under heavy stress testing.
> 
> I also used tape just to make sure I didn't get the liquid metal on anything I didn't want it on. Very thin layer on CPU and IHS. I've done several delids before, and this was a job I was very proud of. I don't think it could have been done better. Wish I had taken pics now, but at the time I just wanted to put my PC together.


Im new to overclocking and so far, nothing i try can get it running at 5.2. I think i didnt get a great chip as she wants 1.5v (i set it to 1.4) to run stable at 5.1. Even though it runs stable and never goes past 68°c during stress tests, it always gives me a bsod when i try to go beyond 5.1.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *l1CappYl1*
> 
> Im new to overclocking and so far, nothing i try can get it running at 5.2. I think i didnt get a great chip as she wants 1.5v (i set it to 1.4) to run stable at 5.1. Even though it runs stable and never goes past 68°c during stress tests, it always gives me a bsod when i try to go beyond 5.1.


Some chips just don't like being overclocked. All about the luck of the draw sadly, but hey 5.1 or even 5.0 24/7 is amazing!


----------



## stephenn82

I know der8auer has awesome stuff...but there is NOTHINg wrong with a rockit 88 tool.

Even one boxed up by a great man on this forum who sent his tool all over the US and Canada for people like us to delid. (For FREE mind you)

I delidded all of my cpus (6700k, g3220, i5 4670) and a friends 7700k without issue.

What is your thoughts on it being subpar?

A German dude said it sucked? It's not that bad. And it had the relid tool. I still put conductonaut on it. Best stuff on earth. THAT I did hear from German man.


----------



## Craigk19

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *moustang*
> 
> Is there a specific reason why you don't like the Rockit88?
> 
> I've got the Rockit88. I've used it to delid several CPUs. Everything from the i7 4790k up to the current 8700k. It works exactly like advertised. Nice and easy, and the relid tool works perfectly to relid the CPU once done. It may not be the most elegant looking tool, but it works perfectly. Why do you not like it?


Really it's the design doesn't seem as nice or as well designed. Delid looks to apply force all to one side to push it off. Mr delid looks to apply force to all sides equally and twist to break free. If I'm placing my 8700k over $400 cpu I want to go the way I feel more comfortable wit Is all.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:



> Originally Posted by *Craigk19*
> 
> Really it's the design doesn't seem as nice or as well designed. Delid looks to apply force all to one side to push it off. Mr delid looks to apply force to all sides equally and twist to break free. If I'm placing my 8700k over $400 cpu I want to go the way I feel more comfortable wit Is all.


Dr. not Mr.


----------



## Unknownm

got my qx9300 and was disappointed it doesn't come with IHS. Guessing most mobile CPU's do not come with IHS either! a time when intel gluded 2 dual core cpus into one package


----------



## blaze2210

I'd like to get some opinions on a potential purchase. There's an i7-4790K posted fairly cheap, but I can see a couple of scratches on the PCB (potentially from an attempted delid). Do you guys think it might be ok, or do the scratches in the top-right corner look like they're in a place with important traces?


----------



## stephenn82

Can it be ran in a working PC to test it out, stability, overclock it, etc? If so and it passes...buy it. If no, then I would pass. usually things that are too good to be true...are just that.


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Can it be ran in a working PC to test it out, stability, overclock it, etc? If so and it passes...buy it. If no, then I would pass. usually things that are too good to be true...are just that.


Agreed that chip looks badly taken care of. My cpus have never looked like that ever, looks like he was mad at it and threw it down concrete stairs lol


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Can it be ran in a working PC to test it out, stability, overclock it, etc? If so and it passes...buy it. If no, then I would pass. usually things that are too good to be true...are just that.


I don't think I'd be able to test it until I got it back to my own rig. The price on it is $40, and the ad _says_ that the seller "doesn't have the means to test it". I'm normally pretty skeptical myself, but the price is so low that its kinda tempting.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *enigma7820*
> 
> Agreed that chip looks badly taken care of. My cpus have never looked like that ever, looks like he was mad at it and threw it down concrete stairs lol


I'm not really concerned about the state of the IHS, since my current 4670K's IHS looks a little worse. I'm mainly concerned about the scratches in the PCB. I've seen some people who tried the "razor method" for delidding and ended up with fairly similar damage, yet the chip still worked. So I'm mainly curious if this might be one of those situations.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I don't think I'd be able to test it until I got it back to my own rig. The price on it is $40, and the ad _says_ that the seller "doesn't have the means to test it". I'm normally pretty skeptical myself, but the price is so low that its kinda tempting.


I too, am naturally skeptical. If I waved promise of a 38 dollar 4790k would you go for it? Obviuosly it would be green painted cardboard and tin foil IHS lol. Just beware. If he is selling it, how does he not have the means to test it? Someone like that (like myself, a tinkerer) has parts sitting around enough to build two or three pc's at a moments notice. The wife gets on my case about it lol. I am trying to get rid of some stuff and make room for other stuff in basement...or more room on the micro center card lol


----------



## mAs81

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I'm mainly concerned about the scratches in the PCB. I've seen some people who tried the "razor method" for delidding and ended up with fairly similar damage, yet the chip still worked. So I'm mainly curious if this might be one of those situations.


When I delided my 4790K(using the vice method)I chipped a little part off the pcb,but it still works to this day..


Spoiler: Like this







I've seen people with less damage have their chips stop working and the other way around..It really is a hit & miss situation..If you're willing to take the risk,go for it..

I don't really like the overall look of that chip in that pic you posted , but that doesn't mean it'll not work..


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> I too, am naturally skeptical. If I waved promise of a 38 dollar 4790k would you go for it? Obviuosly it would be green painted cardboard and tin foil IHS lol. Just beware. If he is selling it, how does he not have the means to test it? Someone like that (like myself, a tinkerer) has parts sitting around enough to build two or three pc's at a moments notice. The wife gets on my case about it lol. I am trying to get rid of some stuff and make room for other stuff in basement...or more room on the micro center card lol


I'm a tinkerer also, but limited funds tend to force me into selling my old components as I upgrade. So I can see the potential for not having spare parts laying around. This ad definitely triggers the "too good to be true" flag in my head, but there are also rare times when that feeling has been wrong.

So are we thinking that the scratches in the PCB are in a bad place?
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> When I delided my 4790K(using the vice method)I chipped a little part off the pcb,but it still works to this day..
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Like this
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I've seen people with less damage have their chips stop working and the other way around..It really is a hit & miss situation..If you're willing to take the risk,go for it..
> 
> I don't really like the overall look of that chip in that pic you posted , but that doesn't mean it'll not work..


I've seen the same thing in this thread. I think I'll be passing on this chip, but man, it's pretty tempting. Taking a look at both sides of the chip, it does look pretty rough, but the main thing that concerns me are the scratches on the top.

Here's a pic that was posted of the bottom:


----------



## mAs81

Now that I look at the bottom of it,I really don't like how the top pin outs look in that pic..Rough indeed

Yeah,it's a good deal,but it's better to trust your instincts in these things...

But,again,it could very much be operational..Maybe a bad oc fried the guy's m/b or something..We will never know I guess..There's always a risk involved when dwelling in the used market..

You win some,and then you lose some..At least from my experience..


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mAs81*
> 
> Now that I look at the bottom of it,I really don't like how the top pin outs look in that pic..Rough indeed
> 
> Yeah,it's a good deal,but it's better to trust your instincts in these things...
> 
> But,again,it could very much be operational..Maybe a bad oc fried the guy's m/b or something..We will never know I guess..There's always a risk involved when dwelling in the used market..
> 
> You win some,and then you lose some..At least from my experience..


That's basically where I'm at right now....I see it either being a total paperweight, or a functioning chip. It's a pretty tough one, considering that other things could have gone wrong. If I had more cash to spare, I'd definitely jump on it. Seeing as things are a bit tight, I think I'll have to be passing on it.

Dang, now there's that "what could have been" thought.... Hehehe....

Thanks for all the input everyone!


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> I'm a tinkerer also, but limited funds tend to force me into selling my old components as I upgrade.


I feel you bro. I have wife and two kids, just over one year old puppy and single source of income. I end up giving it away like my last build to a good friend...sucks, because he makes 6 figures a year, his wife makes six figures a year...but he was rocking an i5-760...and got a 3570k and z77 sabertooth, pair of Mushkin 120gb SSDs in RAID, and G.Skill trident X 8GB kit...for free


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *bluej511*
> 
> And its why i tell people not to use something too strong, super glue or strong sealant. On the coffee and kaby lake and maybe even skylake its need to put something between the IHS trim trim and the wafer if your IHS spin on the die. Id use thermal tape or something because it can be compressed quite easily, easy to remove and should keep the wafer from bending due to all the pressure being on the die.


Good question. I already delid 7700k with nice results sealed with dot glue outside loctite gel.
Now on coffee I'm planning in using a small amount of rvt, what brands are okay? Also should I use just corners or a fairly annount? Finally how I check if die is floating before sealing?


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Good question. I already delid 7700k with nice results sealed with dot glue outside loctite gel.
> Now on coffee I'm planning in using a small amount of rvt, what brands are okay? Also should I use just corners or a fairly annount? Finally how I check if die is floating before sealing?


Another question is there a strict margin between too few and too much rvt? I guess there is the risk of introducing gap again or Intel don't apply pressure at all on sealing?


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> Back up and running after cleaning and reapplying CLU. I put superglue on 4 corners again like before.
> 
> These drops are comparing my 10 month old delid with a fresh application. 7700K 5.1ghz.
> 
> Highest core temp, Cinebench multi after booting.
> Before: Idle, 30. Load, 77
> After: Idle, 25. Load, 66
> Drop. Idle, 5. Load, 11.


Did you cleared the glue or just used the tool to break the glue dots?


----------



## IMI4tth3w

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Did you cleared the glue or just used the tool to break the glue dots?


Please use nail polish remover to remove old loctite gel superglue!!! it comes RIGHT off! then clean off the residue left by the acetone/nail polish remover with isopropyl alcohol.

And yes, putting too much new silicon/rtv can possibly create a bigger gap between the die and IHS when doing a relid. This is why the 4 dot superglue method is recommended.

I personally like to sand down the part of the IHS that makes contact with the PCB to make absolutely sure the gap between the IHS and die is as thin as possible. Just make sure you don't sand it down too far where it becomes entirely flat.. although with a relid tool even then it shouldn't be that big of a deal. But the end goal is to make the gap between the IHS and die as small as possible while also keeping the mounting pressure even across the entire CPU PCB. I ran a naked ivy kit with my 4790k for a bit and ended up with a slightly warped pcb. Ended up just relidding it as the temps weren't even that great.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMI4tth3w*
> 
> Please use nail polish remover to remove old loctite gel superglue!!! it comes RIGHT off! then clean off the residue left by the acetone/nail polish remover with isopropyl alcohol.
> 
> And yes, putting too much new silicon/rtv can possibly create a bigger gap between the die and IHS when doing a relid. This is why the 4 dot superglue method is recommended.
> 
> I personally like to sand down the part of the IHS that makes contact with the PCB to make absolutely sure the gap between the IHS and die is as thin as possible. Just make sure you don't sand it down too far where it becomes entirely flat.. although with a relid tool even then it shouldn't be that big of a deal. But the end goal is to make the gap between the IHS and die as small as possible while also keeping the mounting pressure even across the entire CPU PCB. I ran a naked ivy kit with my 4790k for a bit and ended up with a slightly warped pcb. Ended up just relidding it as the temps weren't even that great.


I'm not planning in breaking or opening my 7700k it has the same temps from release day, stable as ever.

I also like the superglue,the only issues I can think and bother me
1) the glue has a service temperature of 82c. I know the IHS probably don't reach this, even my chip didn't reach 70c+ even on Brazilian summer.
2) z height. If your die for whatever reason needs additional space, like the spinning IHS, gluing could be worse?


----------



## GoodDeath

Hello everybody super new here but I'm gonna jump right in.. I'm going to be delidding my 7700k here in few days I have a question. I've been reading and reading and watching information on this subject for months and I'm ready to go through with procedure. I just have this nagging sensation to put the tiniest bead of rtv around the die before I shut it back up. Can someone tell me if and why this would be a horrific idea.My thinking is to seal the liquid metal in place. I'm a big time garage tinkerer and I'm always modifying this and cutting on that. So I need someone to tell me to calm down or thoughtfully go ahead.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GoodDeath*
> 
> Hello everybody super new here but I'm gonna jump right in.. I'm going to be delidding my 7700k here in few days I have a question. I've been reading and reading and watching information on this subject for months and I'm ready to go through with procedure. I just have this nagging sensation to put the tiniest bead of rtv around the die before I shut it back up. Can someone tell me if and why this would be a horrific idea.My thinking is to seal the liquid metal in place. I'm a big time garage tinkerer and I'm always modifying this and cutting on that. So I need someone to tell me to calm down or thoughtfully go ahead.


If you check out how to properly apply the liquid metal, then there would be no need to use any RTV around the die. There are many posts in this thread on how to properly apply the liquid metal.


----------



## foxlite

First dilid with success on a fresh 8700k! Hoping to be added









Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!












OCN name: foxlite
CPU: Intel i7 8700k
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
Mhz gained: 2000Mhz
OC after delid: 5.2Ghz
Temp drops: Unkown (delid performed out of box)
CPUZ Validation: see image (will post link ASAP when tested in my rig and not on my workbench)
vlidation screen shots:


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## UnknownSoldier

Been looking into delidding my 8700k, and the glue method seems to be a nice compromise between the two extremes of sealing or not sealing. Just wanted to confirm that I have to use a gel-based super glue, and it's a dab at each corner of the IHS on the outside?


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UnknownSoldier*
> 
> Been looking into delidding my 8700k, and the glue method seems to be a nice compromise between the two extremes of sealing or not sealing. Just wanted to confirm that I have to use a gel-based super glue, and it's a dab at each corner of the IHS on the outside?


I used a tiny amount of high temp gasket sealer for my delid, left spacing and a really thin application, I feel like this is a better method for resealing, my reasoning here is that if I need to ever delid it again I have less chance of damaging the silicon, super glue can cause damage to the area the ihs is attached to if you need to delid it again for any reason.


----------



## UnknownSoldier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *foxlite*
> 
> I used a tiny amount of high temp gasket sealer for my delid, left spacing and a really thin application, I feel like this is a better method for resealing, my reasoning here is that if I need to ever delid it again I have less chance of damaging the silicon, super glue can cause damage to the area the ihs is attached to if you need to delid it again for any reason.


Doesn't acetone just dissolve the glue nice and easy?


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UnknownSoldier*
> 
> Doesn't acetone just dissolve the glue nice and easy?


Don't know about easy, but yes. I've done it. Pro tip is giving the chip a bath in acetone upside down..IHS side down.. Just keep the liquid below the gap with the PCB. Then many patient swabs with cotton and acetone will entirely remove the glue.


----------



## AshBorer

how often should liquid metal applied to the die be replaced? Annually? Or can you get away with waiting longer?


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> how often should liquid metal applied to the die be replaced? Annually? Or can you get away with waiting longer?


I haven't replaced the CLP on my die in a little over 2 years. It was only replaced at that point because I was curious about what it looked like.... It didn't actually need to be replaced though.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UnknownSoldier*
> 
> Doesn't acetone just dissolve the glue nice and easy?


It does dissolve it, but referring to the other response I agree not so much with ease. I also like the sealant I used because it won't have any thermal degradation issues, honestly if you are that worried about a any kind of gap just lock the ihs down using the pressure of the motherboard socket clip. I've done some research and have found conflicting opinions on gap spacing, obviously the larger the gap the less thermal dissipation you will have. Using the gasket seal worked fine for my relid, extremely thin application, and I have stressed the cpu and noticed no thermal spikes or issues. I've just seen some people who are not careful when removing superglue do irreparable damage to their chips.


----------



## UnknownSoldier

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *foxlite*
> 
> honestly if you are that worried about a any kind of gap just lock the ihs down using the pressure of the motherboard socket clip.


Yea, I've been considering doing that as well, but I dislike the idea of the IHS moving around when clipping or unclipping the retention bracket.

Maybe a minimalist application of the sealant could work as well? Say, a small dab at each of the four corners; just enough to prevent any issues with initial IHS movement, but little enough to not be a factor in other ways.


----------



## Skullzaflare

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UnknownSoldier*
> 
> Yea, I've been considering doing that as well, but I dislike the idea of the IHS moving around when clipping or unclipping the retention bracket.
> 
> Maybe a minimalist application of the sealant could work as well? Say, a small dab at each of the four corners; just enough to prevent any issues with initial IHS movement, but little enough to not be a factor in other ways.


Could do a small dab of hotglue at the corners. Its not hard to remove/apply, and its used on chipset chips all the time


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *UnknownSoldier*
> 
> Yea, I've been considering doing that as well, but I dislike the idea of the IHS moving around when clipping or unclipping the retention bracket.
> 
> Maybe a minimalist application of the sealant could work as well? Say, a small dab at each of the four corners; just enough to prevent any issues with initial IHS movement, but little enough to not be a factor in other ways.


That's essentially how I did mine, unfortunately I don't have pictures of the sealant application, I did record the delid, will try to screen grab it tonight. Keep in mind this was my first delid but I spent hours reading different forum posts and watching tutorials. I also contacted a company who bins and delids and asked them about sealing the ihs and issues related to gap spacing. They seal theirs similarly for the most part and stated they notice no thermal issues as well. Decided I wanted to delid myself, scary as all hell for the first time but I learned a lot. Just go slow and be patient with what ever method you decide on.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *foxlite*
> 
> First dilid with success on a fresh 8700k! Hoping to be added
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: foxlite
> CPU: Intel i7 8700k
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> Mhz gained: 2000Mhz
> OC after delid: 5.2Ghz
> Temp drops: Unkown (delid performed out of box)
> CPUZ Validation: see image (will post link ASAP when tested in my rig and not on my workbench)
> vlidation screen shots:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## owlery

Thanks to the information on page 1.
I practiced on a celeron cpu before attempting to do it on my 3770k.
It was easier than I thought and the whole process of cutting the glue and removing the black silicone took less than 10 minutes.
Tools used was a razor blade, a stainless steel ruler, some 70% ethanol, and a plastic spudger I used for repairing phones.
I found that the temperature dropped ~27C underload after delidding but in the process I also replaced some very old thermal paste on the cooler, which must have contributed to that.
With the 20C thermal headroom, I went from 4.4ghz to 4.6fhz stable whilst maintaining the same voltage.
Maybe with a new cooler and a slight voltage bump I can hit 5ghz.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're In!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Awesome!! Glad to be a part of the group!


----------



## AshBorer

what do you guys use to scrape off the silicone adhesive on Intel's chips? Is isopropyl alcohol supposed to be used? or do you just physically scrape it away with some kind of tool like a knife or whatever. I'm afraid i'll damage the substrate lol. I'm probably just overthinking it.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*


You can use alcohol in combination with anything wooden, plastic that is not sharp..like a credit card...or your nail..

But DO NOT USE! anything sharp...especially not a knife..
The smallest scratch can mean your CPU is now dead...


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> what do you guys use to scrape off the silicone adhesive on Intel's chips? Is isopropyl alcohol supposed to be used? or do you just physically scrape it away with some kind of tool like a knife or whatever. I'm afraid i'll damage the substrate lol. I'm probably just overthinking it.


I haven't delidded yet as I'm still waiting for my 8700K but I bought plastic blades and intent to use them for scraping that sucker off.


----------



## Yetyhunter

First delid I ever attempted was on my 8700k. High stakes for my first try, ended up with success.


OCN name: Yetyhunter
CPU: Intel i7 8700k
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Be quiet ! Thermal paste
Mhz gained: 200Mhz
OC after delid: 5Ghz
Temp drops: pics
Before delid

After delid


I haven't tried going further than 5ghz. I think it sits comfortably at this frequency, any higher is too loud.
I ran a 10 minutes occt run with AVX and it's stable.


Is this acceptable ?


----------



## stephenn82

Just get the cheap permatex at the auto parts store.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *blaze2210*
> 
> If you check out how to properly apply the liquid metal, then there would be no need to use any RTV around the die. There are many posts in this thread on how to properly apply the liquid metal.


As someone around here said, liquid metal, unless you use the whole tube, wont slide outside of the ihs. Even sealing the ihs isnt mandatory, i usually do it for easy of manipulation.
There are 4 contact pins on substrate surface, you should seal it with nail polisher or klapton tape, just to be safe. Putting rvt around the die could introduce more problems on its own, like the glue reacting to liquid metal or even problems when if you need to delid again.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yetyhunter*
> 
> First delid I ever attempted was on my 8700k. High stakes for my first try, ended up with success.
> 
> I haven't tried going further than 5ghz. I think it sits comfortably at this frequency, any higher is too loud.
> I ran a 10 minutes occt run with AVX and it's stable.
> 
> 
> Is this acceptable ?


If you are using OCCT, try the other test. Linpack mostly does heat, the other cpu test i usually find memory issues very fast.
To be sure, i would do Realbench at least 2h. For prime95, i think its mostly trying to catch a dream, everytime i tries it 95 avx i cant maintain stability.
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> what do you guys use to scrape off the silicone adhesive on Intel's chips? Is isopropyl alcohol supposed to be used? or do you just physically scrape it away with some kind of tool like a knife or whatever. I'm afraid i'll damage the substrate lol. I'm probably just overthinking it.


Credit card, plastic car, nail, whatever. I would just stay away from blades.
The adhesive is pretty easy to remove once you break the bound with the ihs.


----------



## Yetyhunter

I did use realbench to test the temperature difference after I delided, but only for 15 minutes.


----------



## spddmn24

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> what do you guys use to scrape off the silicone adhesive on Intel's chips? Is isopropyl alcohol supposed to be used? or do you just physically scrape it away with some kind of tool like a knife or whatever. I'm afraid i'll damage the substrate lol. I'm probably just overthinking it.


I scrape big big stuff off with a fingernail. Then just rubbing a dry rag on it gets the remaining off easily.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Yetyhunter*
> 
> First delid I ever attempted was on my 8700k. High stakes for my first try, ended up with success.
> 
> 
> OCN name: Yetyhunter
> CPU: Intel i7 8700k
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Be quiet ! Thermal paste
> Mhz gained: 200Mhz
> OC after delid: 5Ghz
> Temp drops: pics
> Before delid
> 
> After delid
> 
> 
> I haven't tried going further than 5ghz. I think it sits comfortably at this frequency, any higher is too loud.
> I ran a 10 minutes occt run with AVX and it's stable.
> 
> 
> Is this acceptable ?


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Chris123NT

Did my first delid tonight. 7900X, used Der8auer's tool and it went very smoothly, I will admit I was nervous as hell trying to get that IHS off lol.

Covered the SMD's with High temp Kapton tape, to eliminate any risk of liquid metal hitting them. Used thermal grizzly conductonaut on the die and thermal grizzly kryonaut between the IHS and my water block (EK Strix x299-e monoblock). Oh and I used the 4 dot superglue method to put the IHS back on.

Stock Intel TIM job looked like a drunk hobo just said screw it, YOLO and unloaded half the tube on it.

Anyways Cinebench temps before delid with a 4.6 GHZ OC at 1.18vcore were 90C, sometimes 92. Post de-lid the temps were 62C max, I'm absolutely blown away.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Was going to go for the razor blade method on my 8700k, but the IHS is hair tight to the pcb. Looks like no room what so ever to get a blade in there. Just ordered a Rockit 88 tool this morning. Don't want to take a chance and scratch the pcb with a blade.

Wish I ordered it with the rockit99 tool back 6 weeks ago to save on duty and shipping a little. Didn't know the 8700k would be so awesome.


----------



## postem

Hi folks just delided fresh 8700k with rockit cool.
Just standard procedure, Removed glue, clu on die, loctite rvt on IHS, now waiting to cure.
One thing I must say, the force I needed to delid 8700k wasn't nearly close to 7700k, on the first turn of the tork key it already break the silicone. Dunno if it's related to freshness of the CPU, but anyway, amount of glue was the same of 7700k, it looked dry as same, but much more weaker. Maybe Intel is expecting people using 8700k t delid it?


----------



## stephenn82

Yes, same with the new enthusiast chips...no more soldering and listened to what we do on the internet. lol

Congrats on popping that top and dropping temps!


----------



## rfarmer

Rocket-88 is doing a Cyber Monday sale, 20% off your order and free shipping in the US. Just ordered mine to delid my 8700k. Hopefully will be joining the club soon.


----------



## xFALL3Nx

Just picked up a R88 and some CL ultra. Can I use black RTV silicone to seal the IHS? Should I seal all the way around or 4 dots on each corner? I want to seal the resistors near the die incase the liquid metal drips, can i do this with the black RTV? -thanks!









https://www.amazon.com/Permatex-81158-Silicone-Adhesive-Sealant/dp/B000AL6WLA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1511794274&sr=8-3&keywords=black+RTV


----------



## xFALL3Nx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> You should seal it with nail polisher or klapton tape, just to be safe. Putting rvt around the die could introduce more problems on its own, like the glue reacting to liquid metal or even problems when if you need to delid again.


https://www.amazon.com/Heat-Temperature-Resistant-Adhesive-Electric/dp/B00W3FAFP0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1511794558&sr=8-1&keywords=kapton+tape

Would this do the trick?


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xFALL3Nx*
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Heat-Temperature-Resistant-Adhesive-Electric/dp/B00W3FAFP0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1511794558&sr=8-1&keywords=kapton+tape
> 
> Would this do the trick?


If you are just using it to tape the 4 points on substrate on 1151 platform its okay, but i would use nail polisher as its easily avaliable and easy to remove in case of need.
If you are on lga 2011 platform you wiil something that will insulate all the caps on top of substrate like
https://www.permatex.com/products/adhesives-sealants/specialty-adhesives/permatex-liquid-electrical-tape/

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xFALL3Nx*
> 
> Just picked up a R88 and some CL ultra. Can I use black RTV silicone to seal the IHS? Should I seal all the way around or 4 dots on each corner? I want to seal the resistors near the die incase the liquid metal drips, can i do this with the black RTV? -thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Permatex-81158-Silicone-Adhesive-Sealant/dp/B000AL6WLA/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1511794274&sr=8-3&keywords=black+RTV


The 8700K i relided using loctite rvt, but any good quality rvt should work. I used a tootpick to spread a thin layer across all the ihs except for a small part of it. Worked really well, im getting max 69C on 30C ambient temperature @ 5ghz 1.36v.


----------



## xFALL3Nx

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> If you are just using it to tape the 4 points on substrate on 1151 platform its okay, but i would use nail polisher as its easily avaliable and easy to remove in case of need.
> If you are on lga 2011 platform you wiil something that will insulate all the caps on top of substrate like
> https://www.permatex.com/products/adhesives-sealants/specialty-adhesives/permatex-liquid-electrical-tape/
> The 8700K i relided using loctite rvt, but any good quality rvt should work. I used a tootpick to spread a thin layer across all the ihs except for a small part of it. Worked really well, im getting max 69C on 30C ambient temperature @ 5ghz 1.36v.


I'm using 1151 (7600k)

I've got 5.2ghz on water @ 1.29v but it hits 81c sometimes so i've downclocked to 5, still hits 75c on core 0 and 3. Thanks for the advice, gonna order this stuff now.


----------



## Craigk19

placed my order at midnight pretty excited!


----------



## Panamaximus

First build - Jonsbo U3 and Asus 270G have arrived!

Now I'm wondering about the I7-7700K. (Should be here this week) I read it runs too hot. Maybe I should send to siliconlottery.com right off, then it will be ready for future overclock? Delid $35.00.

Even if I don't overclock, will it help run cooler? I've lost too many electronics over the years from high temps.


----------



## bigmac11

Anyone who doesn't have a delid kit here you go https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rockit-88 use code CYBERMONDAY $31.96 shipped.


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

How long should you let the relid silicone set up for? Just a small drop in the corners using a toothpick, correct?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> How long should you let the relid silicone set up for? Just a small drop in the corners using a toothpick, correct?


If you did just corners, give it 4 hours to settle. About 8-12 to fully cure. 3-4 hours is enough to plop in socket and build.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Panamaximus*
> 
> First build - Jonsbo U3 and Asus 270G have arrived!
> 
> Now I'm wondering about the I7-7700K. (Should be here this week) I read it runs too hot. Maybe I should send to siliconlottery.com right off, then it will be ready for future overclock? Delid $35.00.
> 
> Even if I don't overclock, will it help run cooler? I've lost too many electronics over the years from high temps.


Well, it depends on what you want to do with the chip. Intel TIM inside IHS is suposed to stand 5+ years of constant thermal cycles. Intel CPUs have a pretty high thermal junction, around 100C before thermal throttling. Probably you will have another chip before any sign of thermal degradation.

When overclocking, bad tim will limit you thermally, buy you optimally would want to stay below 70C on daily usage, as hotter chips will need more voltage to remain stable, wasting more energy as heat, in the end limiting your possible frequency.

If you are considering to do just a all core turbo or a mild overclock like 4.7-4.8, i think you dont even need to consider deliding.


----------



## Panamaximus

O.K., so it's a waste of $35 to go ahead and delid. I was originally thinking why not. For $35 if it will run cooler in a tiny case with limited air flow, but if it only runs hot when really juicing it, I guess there is no point.


----------



## enigma7820

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Panamaximus*
> 
> O.K., so it's a waste of $35 to go ahead and delid. I was originally thinking why not. For $35 if it will run cooler in a tiny case with limited air flow, but if it only runs hot when really juicing it, I guess there is no point.


Delid every time! ?
Lowering temps can only help extend life since heat and voltage play a role in how long it will live


----------



## Panamaximus

I was thinking I should do this, mainly because all the reviews I read say it gets hot. Not to mention I just cancelled my order for a 1060 6gb and ordered a 1080 all going in a tiny case. The case doesn't have much venting.


----------



## stephenn82

Maybe its time to get another case?


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

Waiting on TG Cryo to show up, using the 3D printed + vice method. I've debated whether or not to leave it unsealed or use a few small dabs of Permatex silicone and seal with standard work clamps from Irwin. Should do the trick if I can manage it.

Is clear nail polish still a good idea for the exposed transistors on the top of the chip? I have an 8600K.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> Waiting on TG Cryo to show up, using the 3D printed + vice method. I've debated whether or not to leave it unsealed or use a few small dabs of Permatex silicone and seal with standard work clamps from Irwin. Should do the trick if I can manage it.
> 
> Is clear nail polish still a good idea for the exposed transistors on the top of the chip? I have an 8600K.


Nail polish should still be ok.

I would use a little permatex to hold it down better. My first delid on my chip was only held in place by clamping force and it slid around a little. Second time was a charm!


----------



## LostParticle

Hi guys,

The warranty of my Intel i7-4790K expires this month, November 2017, and I am seriously considering delidding my chip. Before any inquiries and before starting reading this thread, though, I'd like to ask you:

- Does it worth it for me to delidd? What is your opinion?

Here is the best, the max, my chip can do:



In the screenshot it is shown that the maximum core freq. I can achieve is 4900 MHz using 1.380V, override (fixed) core voltage, in the BIOS. With a room temperature of 20C my Core max temp is 72C. All that, using my Corsair H110 with 2 x Noctua NF-A14 IPPC 3000 PWM, at "Performance" fan mode, set in the BIOS.

How much will delidding reduce my core temps, you think, and will I be able to gain 100 MHz more, going to x50 on all my cores?
What is your opinion?

My entire system is shown in my sig_rig. Next week, Moday or Tuesday, I'll be receiving and installing my new GPU: the EVGA GTX 1060 SC GAMING, 6 GB.

Thank you!


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LostParticle*
> 
> Hi guys,
> 
> The warranty of my Intel i7-4790K expires this month, November 2017, and I am seriously considering delidding my chip. Before any inquiries and before starting reading this thread, though, I'd like to ask you:
> 
> - Does it worth it for me to delidd? What is your opinion?
> 
> Here is the best, the max, my chip can do:
> 
> 
> 
> In the screenshot it is shown that the maximum core freq. I can achieve is 4900 MHz using 1.380V, override (fixed) core voltage, in the BIOS. With a room temperature of 20C my Core max temp is 72C. All that, using my Corsair H110 with 2 x Noctua NF-A14 IPPC 3000 PWM, at "Performance" fan mode, set in the BIOS.
> 
> How much will delidding reduce my core temps, you think, and will I be able to gain 100 MHz more, going to x50 on all my cores?
> What is your opinion?
> 
> My entire system is shown in my sig_rig. Next week, Moday or Tuesday, I'll be receiving and installing my new GPU: the EVGA GTX 1060 SC GAMING, 6 GB.
> 
> Thank you!


It will be worth it. Your chip may not GAIN any more speed per se...but it will definitely drop temps, and maybe require less voltage to get what you have now, due to thermal leakage etc.

What is preventing you from popping that top anyways? I had my 6700k for maybe 5 months and I already popped the top. If you slowly piece through this thread, you will see a few users who returned their chips under warranty claims, Intel didnt care that they were delidded. They even told them!

Get in on the Cross Country Delid Extravaganza if you can, and just pay shipping to the next guy to delid. In the box is EVERYTHING you need to get the job done. Or, go buy all the stuff individually and venture on your own.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1627022/cross-country-rockit-delid-tool-extravaganza

You already meet the criteria for qualification put forth by Whooleo.


----------



## b0z0

I'm running a 7700k that has been delid. My temps were originally all over the place until I delid the CPU.


----------



## becks

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*


Doing "shady" stuff yourself is one... encouraging others to do it is "mehh"...

Please stop the "delided warranty" propaganda


----------



## LostParticle

Thanks, guys, for stating your opinion!

Personally, I had in mind to delidd my CPU but I appeared on this thread asking questions only after my warranty expired. All these years I kept my CPU intact.

Anyway, I will start reading this thread now, going backwards and not from the beginning. I will do my homework!

However, if anyone of you has the knowledge, the time and the pleasure, please reply to any or all of the following inquires of mine. It will be a huge help for me!



Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



1) Which is the best tool for delidding my i7-4790K? I live in Europe. I do not live in Germany, though. So, the best tool I can get, I think, is the *Delid-Die-Mate 2*. What is your opinion?

2) I found a picture of my CPU, delidded. In which area should I apply that nail polish people talk about? Should this be applied where the red arrow or the blue arrow or the yellow arrow points?


3) Please, give me a specific product when it comes to that nail polish! Like, give me a link to the product so I can see it (and thus know exactly what I will be purchasing).

4) I would certainly like to place the IHS back and "glue it". What product should I use for that?

5) Please, add anything else you think I have forgotten.



In my case it will take up to three weeks, from today, to delidd my CPU. This is because next week I'll get my new GPU and I'd like to test it, play a bit with it, but most importantly because it will take long time to receive the delidding tool, I think...

Thank you.


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *LostParticle*
> 
> 1) Which is the best tool for delidding my i7-4790K? I live in Europe. I do not live in Germany, though. So, the best tool I can get, I think, is the *Delid-Die-Mate 2*. What is your opinion?
> 
> 2) I found a picure of my CPU, delidded. In which area should I apply that nail polish people talk about? Should this be applied where the red arrow or the blue arrow or the yellow arrow points?
> 
> 
> 3) Please, give me a specific product when it comes to that nail polish! Like, give me a link to the product so I can see it (and thus know exactly what I will be purchasing).
> 
> 4) I would certainly like to place the IHS back and "glue it". What product should I use for that?
> 
> 5) Please, add anything else you think I have forgotten.


1) I personally used a table vice, and a block of wood. The PCB is thicker on Haswell and Devil's Canyon CPUs, so a delid tool is not 100% necessary like it is with the newer CPUs.

2) None of the above. You would be applying the clear nail polish to the components right next to the CPU die.

3) Clear nail polish - no color, no glitter, etc....Just regular clear nail polish.

4) The recent consensus seems to be a dot of super glue in each of the 4 corners of the IHS.

5) Read all the info you can about the delidding process LONG before you start it - more info is definitely better than less info here.


----------



## LostParticle

@blaze2210, thanks a lot for replying to all my inquires! Absolutely, I will inform myself as much as possible + I'll watch videos, before attempting anything!

Just to be crystal clear, though, is this the area you mean the pure nail polish should be applied?



And one last question:

- How often should I repeat this process? I mean, is it OK to leave the same metal liquid paste, and all the rest, for 12 months and then reapply them? To repeat the procedure every 12 months?

Thank you.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

No need to re-apply. And yes, that's the areas you'd want to cover.


----------



## rfarmer

Question for you all. I am receiving my Rockit 88 delid kit in the mail today and will be delidding my 8700k. I have watched several how to videos and in about half of them they apply liquid metal to the die and to the IHS, in the other half they just apply the liquid metal to the die alone. Is applying to the IHS advised/necessary? Or will applying to the die alone work as well?

Thanks for any advice.


----------



## LostParticle

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> No need to re-apply. And yes, that's the areas you'd want to cover.


Thank you


----------



## Panamaximus

Received my 7700K in the mail a couple of days ago. Sent it to Silicon Lottery yesterday. I forgot, I think it's around $35. I believe they give a 1 year warranty. I guess I'll find out.









The 1 year warranty is if you buy the chip from them.


----------



## MrTOOSHORT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rfarmer*
> 
> Question for you all. I am receiving my Rockit 88 delid kit in the mail today and will be delidding my 8700k. I have watched several how to videos and in about half of them they apply liquid metal to the die and to the IHS, in the other half they just apply the liquid metal to the die alone. Is applying to the IHS advised/necessary? Or will applying to the die alone work as well?
> 
> Thanks for any advice.


Apply to both as it makes the best contact with each other.


----------



## DaveLT

got around to delidding a 2 year old 6700k after watching temps hit 80+ (Rised 10+ C since new!) and guess what i see

You can bet your dollar I'm never using an intel platform personally from now on. Delidding was fantastically frightening! (and costly!)


----------



## Shweller

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaveLT*
> 
> got around to delidding a 2 year old 6700k after watching temps hit 80+ (Rised 10+ C since new!) and guess what i see
> 
> You can bet your dollar I'm never using an intel platform personally from now on. Delidding was fantastically frightening! (and costly!)


Welcome to the club. I agree the chips do degrade after awhile. Im still running my 4670k 4.4GHz. But, Intel is still king for gaming. Did you use the wood and vice method?


----------



## DaveLT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shweller*
> 
> Welcome to the club. I agree the chips do degrade after awhile. Im still running my 4670k 4.4GHz. But, Intel is still king for gaming. Did you use the wood and vice method?


No, I used what is basically a delid die mate clone LUL

Nah, Ryzen is only a couple of fps off and it's much smoother than my 6700k before i delidding it for reasons i can't explain. And I can DEFINITELY say 8700k is a thermal nightmare AND they just aren't as good as my 1700 at productivity OR streaming+gaming


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Something must be wrong at your end.

My Ryzen was laughable slower in gaming compared by to my old 7800X.. (which was nerfed with dual-channel memory, and a slower than the 8700K due to the mesh).

23-25% lower min and avg. Fps in BF1. PUBG went from stuttring to smooth. Both system was OCed, and the Ryzen was at max OC (3.85 ghz).

I can post the numbers if you're interested.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *becks*
> 
> Doing "shady" stuff yourself is one... encouraging others to do it is "mehh"...
> 
> Please stop the "delided warranty" propaganda


Go search it. This very thread. It has been done.

Pop that top!!


----------



## blaze2210

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Go search it. This very thread. It has been done.
> 
> Pop that top!!


The fact that others have mentioned it, doesn't make it right. Encouraging people to do the same thing is frowned on here (on OCN) - just an FYI.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rfarmer*
> 
> Question for you all. I am receiving my Rockit 88 delid kit in the mail today and will be delidding my 8700k. I have watched several how to videos and in about half of them they apply liquid metal to the die and to the IHS, in the other half they just apply the liquid metal to the die alone. Is applying to the IHS advised/necessary? Or will applying to the die alone work as well?
> 
> Thanks for any advice.


It creates a better contact area between the die and the ihs when you relid it, this also depends on how thin of an application you have applied to each surface. You want to avoid any access as it can bead up and drop onto the capacitors, also too much can cause thermals to rise from what I have researched. I measured from the inside of the ihs and from the inside mark left by the residue left over from Intel's seal to the die location and recorded the measurements of the die and it's location before taping off an exact area of where the die will contact on the inside of the ihs, then applied a thin layer of liquid metal to it. This gave me the exact location of the die as it isn't seated directly in the center of the ihs. It's very important to remember the original placement of the ihs as you need to relid it in the same place and orientation. I used the printed cpu info on the top of the ihs as a reference with the orientation of the placement "triangle". Hope this helps. Starting to edit my delid video of the 8700k but there are some who feel that only applying to the die is ok. I used the method described after a lot of research and made the choice to apply to both surfaces, I would dig a little more yourself as well and use the best information to make your own informed decision. All that being said this was my first delid and I'm really happy with the results. I used a very thin application of the black gasket seal to reseal the ihs making sure to spread it thin and leaving gaps in the four corners but also a bit on the adjacent center of the outside of the lid. Seems the superglue method is the more advised but I haven't had any thermal issues related to gaps *that I know of* and my max temps under load were at 72c (only on 1 of the cores most were at 70c) but this was at 5.2 at 1.44v. While stable I didn't want to push that voltage until I do more research and stability of the chipset etc at that high voltage. I backed it off to [email protected] and and modified the AVX by 1 and it's thermally stable now under 100% load topping out at the 66-68c range +/- 1-2c depending on ambient temps. I'm running a Corsair h115i AIO until I can afford to build my custom loop.


----------



## DaveLT

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Something must be wrong at your end.
> 
> My Ryzen was laughable slower in gaming compared by to my old 7800X.. (which was nerfed with dual-channel memory, and a slower than the 8700K due to the mesh).
> 
> 23-25% lower min and avg. Fps in BF1. PUBG went from stuttring to smooth. Both system was OCed, and the Ryzen was at max OC (3.85 ghz).
> 
> I can post the numbers if you're interested.


No thanks. I know what I'm doing.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaveLT*
> 
> No thanks. I know what I'm doing.


Sure!??


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Something must be wrong at your end.
> 
> My Ryzen was laughable slower in gaming compared by to my old 7800X.. (which was nerfed with dual-channel memory, and a slower than the 8700K due to the mesh).
> 
> 23-25% lower min and avg. Fps in BF1. PUBG went from stuttring to smooth. Both system was OCed, and the Ryzen was at max OC (3.85 ghz).
> 
> I can post the numbers if you're interested.


It's mostly due to single core speeds being notoriously slow on ryzen, you will see better performance from that chipset with a better ram oc and timing combo paired with your chipset oc. The 8700k has extremely fast single core speeds based on my bench marks @5.1ghz oc on my 8700k vs all the ryzen chipset and the 7700k in comparison


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> Sure!??


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaveLT*
> 
> No, I used what is basically a delid die mate clone LUL
> 
> Nah, Ryzen is only a couple of fps off and it's much smoother than my 6700k before i delidding it for reasons i can't explain. And I can DEFINITELY say 8700k is a thermal nightmare AND they just aren't as good as my 1700 at productivity OR streaming+gaming


definitely? Based on what numbers and comparisons, gaming is much faster on the 8700k vs the 1700, I agree it is faster for productivity but all my benchmark comparisons put the 8700k ahead in terms of single core performance related to hyper threading and resulting gaming performance. I've seen others statistical analysis and they have produced similar results when it comes to gaming.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *foxlite*
> 
> definitely? Based on what numbers and comparisons, gaming is much faster on the 8700k vs the 1700, I agree it is faster for productivity but all my benchmark comparisons put the 8700k ahead in terms of single core performance related to hyper threading and resulting gaming performance. I've seen others statistical analysis and they have produced similar results when it comes to gaming.


OC 8700K is superior to 1700 in all aspects IMO.
Even with faster RAM increasing speed of infinity bus, there is still a significant latency penalty going from one CCX to another. Processes that rely on inter core communication suffer greatly from it.

SKX is a mixed bad, it have all goodies that i want, ie 4 channel memory, higher lane count, big L2 cache, but the mesh latency and non inclusive L3 make it a worse chip for the scenarios i have here as a mixed dev gaming rig. I still think up to 8 cores ring bus is the king.


----------



## moustang

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaveLT*
> 
> No, I used what is basically a delid die mate clone LUL
> 
> Nah, Ryzen is only a couple of fps off and it's much smoother than my 6700k before i delidding it for reasons i can't explain. And I can DEFINITELY say 8700k is a thermal nightmare AND they just aren't as good as my 1700 at productivity OR streaming+gaming


Define "productivity" in computing.

I think your idea of "productivity" is probably an extremely narrow, 2 or 3 applications that less than 1% of business users ever touch. Tell me, which is faster in searching and compiling Excel or Access spreadsheets or SQL databases? You know, those common "productivity" tools that 99.9% of businesses use.

Want me to help you with that answer?

http://www.overclock.net/t/1642077/excel-benchmark

My 8700k compiled that Excel spreadsheet 9 full seconds faster than a 1950X Threadripper and absolutely decimated every Ryzen chip tested.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *moustang*
> 
> Define "productivity" in computing.
> 
> I think your idea of "productivity" is probably an extremely narrow, 2 or 3 applications that less than 1% of business users ever touch. Tell me, which is faster in searching and compiling Excel or Access spreadsheets or SQL databases? You know, those common "productivity" tools that 99.9% of businesses use.
> 
> Want me to help you with that answer?
> 
> http://www.overclock.net/t/1642077/excel-benchmark
> 
> My 8700k compiled that Excel spreadsheet 9 full seconds faster than a 1950X Threadripper and absolutely decimated every Ryzen chip tested.


On majority of scenarios, especially user productivity, you end up today having io lag holding even mobile chips. For a purely business or office apps a mere ultra low power CPU is enough. Frequency and ipc are still very very relevant: I delivered one kaby lake Inspiron to a customer to replace a haswell one, and it's absurd how more fast it is just on clocks alone.

I welcome amd by the fact it's pressuring Intel and delivering real competition, but today if I need top performance I still will use Intel. Unless you need to run massive parallel loads that can benefit from threadripper cheaper high volume cores.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> OC 8700K is superior to 1700 in all aspects IMO.
> Even with faster RAM increasing speed of infinity bus, there is still a significant latency penalty going from one CCX to another. Processes that rely on inter core communication suffer greatly from it.
> 
> SKX is a mixed bad, it have all goodies that i want, ie 4 channel memory, higher lane count, big L2 cache, but the mesh latency and non inclusive L3 make it a worse chip for the scenarios i have here as a mixed dev gaming rig. I still think up to 8 cores ring bus is the king.


Right on, just looked at the excell numbers, really interesting data. I'm at 5.1ghz on my 8700k and it's everything I hoped it would be. Still working with my ram oc and timings, my 32gb TridentZ wasn't playing nice with and timing changes and had a poor top end oc, back down to my 16gb Corsair Dominator Platinum and I'm getting stronger benches all around..


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *foxlite*
> 
> Right on, just looked at the excell numbers, really interesting data. I'm at 5.1ghz on my 8700k and it's everything I hoped it would be. Still working with my ram oc and timings, my 32gb TridentZ wasn't playing nice with and timing changes and had a poor top end oc, back down to my 16gb Corsair Dominator Platinum and I'm getting stronger benches all around..


What kind of RAM frequencies are being able to keep? Im currently on tridenz 3400mhz 16, i was going to purchase some ddr4 4000, i just wanna know if its able to hold 5.0 ghz on die while keeping 4000 mhz on RAM or its too much for the combined load on the die?
Anyway, before that i will probably try to OC this ram with 3600 CL 16 and done. One thing i really miss from HEDT is multi channel memory and how much bandwidth you can get using cheaper ram or nice ram with very tight timings.


----------



## foxlite

The TridentZ was posting at 3433 max, its is a "marketed" 3200 dimm set so i was hoping to see a little more from it, it hated having the timing changed and honestly it was becoming more of a fristration, at stock clocks. I the Corsair set, also packaged as a 3200mhz, posted at 3700Mhz but had some instability issues. After rolling back the oc to 3500mhz and changing the timings a little my system has been more stable overall with the CPU oc'd to 5.1Ghz. I'm still fairly new to the oc game when it comes to RAM but I'm putting the time in. Will update if I pick up any more head room on either ddr4 set. I really wish I could find a a set with tighter timings as well...having more headroom with stability at high clock speeds would be nice. It seems to be a fine balance at the top end of the OC when it comes to timings related to Mhz.


----------



## rfarmer

OCN name: rfarmer
CPU: i7 8700k
on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
ihs-TIM: Gelid Extreme
Mhz gained: 200 MHz
OC after delid: 5.0 GHz
Temp drops: 15C to 20C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/mkgx9j

I followed the testing guide with a 4.5 GHz overclock and ran the 10 Intel Burn tests with max single core temp at 71C, didn't seem like much work for the 8700k so I cranked it up to 4.8GHz and ran same tests. Single core temps was 87C. Max after the delid was 56C at 4.5 GHz and 67C at 4.8 GHz.

Bit nerve wracking to do being my first delid but definitely worth the effort.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *foxlite*
> 
> The TridentZ was posting at 3433 max, its is a "marketed" 3200 dimm set so i was hoping to see a little more from it, it hated having the timing changed and honestly it was becoming more of a fristration, at stock clocks. I the Corsair set, also packaged as a 3200mhz, posted at 3700Mhz but had some instability issues. After rolling back the oc to 3500mhz and changing the timings a little my system has been more stable overall with the CPU oc'd to 5.1Ghz. I'm still fairly new to the oc game when it comes to RAM but I'm putting the time in. Will update if I pick up any more head room on either ddr4 set. I really wish I could find a a set with tighter timings as well...having more headroom with stability at high clock speeds would be nice. It seems to be a fine balance at the top end of the OC when it comes to timings related to Mhz.


Yeah, i set the bet on getting some cheap barely new 3600 tridentz 16-16-16-36. Memory is costly now, and even if i manage to OC a little more i guess it will not be that much of a difference, 3600 16 only lose in latency to 4000 16 so i guess is the next to best.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rfarmer*
> 
> OCN name: rfarmer
> CPU: i7 8700k
> on die-TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
> ihs-TIM: Gelid Extreme
> Mhz gained: 200 MHz
> OC after delid: 5.0 GHz
> Temp drops: 15C to 20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/mkgx9j
> 
> I followed the testing guide with a 4.5 GHz overclock and ran the 10 Intel Burn tests with max single core temp at 71C, didn't seem like much work for the 8700k so I cranked it up to 4.8GHz and ran same tests. Single core temps was 87C. Max after the delid was 56C at 4.5 GHz and 67C at 4.8 GHz.
> 
> Bit nerve wracking to do being my first delid but definitely worth the effort.


You're in!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## rfarmer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> You're in!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slappa Dat Sig On!


Good deal, thanks.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Yeah, i set the bet on getting some cheap barely new 3600 tridentz 16-16-16-36. Memory is costly now, and even if i manage to OC a little more i guess it will not be that much of a difference, 3600 16 only lose in latency to 4000 16 so i guess is the next to best.


Just got some new timings, hopefully will stay stable. Posted clean at 3600mhz 16-16-36 need to keep testing.


----------



## DaveLT

I cannot believe the amount of Intel circlejerking going on here. Tbf this is the intel forum so i'm not expecting much but this is a bit much.

FYI : I used to run Intel. X99 drove me nuts.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *foxlite*
> 
> Just got some new timings, hopefully will stay stable. Posted clean at 3600mhz 16-16-36 need to keep testing.


Damn i hate how memories jumped prices up to sky. I was considering get a 4000 vengeance but with current price + brazilian taxes i would pay 700$ that is too much. What voltage are you using there cpuz isnt reporting right


----------



## xSCAR45

OCN Name: xSCAR45
CPU: i5 4690K
On Die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
IHS-TIM: Arctic MX-4
MHz gained: 800MHz
OC after delid: 4.5GHz
Temp drops: 18c

I don't feel comfortable giving out my e-mail to CPU-Z. Sorry for the inconvenience. I did however post my adventure in deliding and OC'ing here on OCN. Link is here. I hope that is good enough to enroll in the club.


----------



## intjmastermind

Can the experts here give me some advice on my why delid failed?

CPU: i7 8700K
On Die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
IHS-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
Cooler: NZXT Kraken X62

Procedure:

1. De-lidded using the Rockit 88 tool
2. Scraped off the original silicone adhesive (some residue is seen on the PCB in the photo below but it feels smooth to the touch).
3. The stock Intel TIM was removed with serial applications of ArctiClean 1 and 2 solutions using a KimWipe.
4. Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut applied to both CPU die and underside of IHS.
5. Four small dots of Permatex 22072 Ultra Black Silicone applied to corners of IHS.
6. Re-lidded and let set for 24 hours
7. Re-inserted into socket, Arctic Silver 5 thermal paste applied to top of IHS.

Results:

3 degrees HIGHER temperatures under load compared to the stock Intel TIM.

Questions:

1) Did I mess up and used too much or too little of either the Kryonaut or silicone?
2) Would using Kryonaut instead of Conductonaut explain the complete lack of improvement after de-lidding?
3) Should I try again with Conductonaut?
4) If I do try again with Conductonaut, do I need to anything about the four gold dots near the CPU die?


----------



## rfarmer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *intjmastermind*
> 
> Can the experts here give me some advice on my why delid failed?
> 
> CPU: i7 8700K
> On Die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut
> IHS-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Cooler: NZXT Kraken X62
> 
> Procedure:
> 
> 1. De-lidded using the Rockit 88 tool
> 2. Scraped off the original silicone adhesive (some residue is seen on the PCB in the photo below but it feels smooth to the touch).
> 3. The stock Intel TIM was removed with serial applications of ArctiClean 1 and 2 solutions using a KimWipe.
> 4. Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut applied to both CPU die and underside of IHS.
> 5. Four small dots of Permatex 22072 Ultra Black Silicone applied to corners of IHS.
> 6. Re-lidded and let set for 24 hours
> 7. Re-inserted into socket, Arctic Silver 5 thermal paste applied to top of IHS.
> 
> Results:
> 
> 3 degrees HIGHER temperatures under load compared to the stock Intel TIM.
> 
> Questions:
> 
> 1) Did I mess up and used too much or too little of either the Kryonaut or silicone?
> 2) Would using Kryonaut instead of Conductonaut explain the complete lack of improvement after de-lidding?
> 3) Should I try again with Conductonaut?
> 4) If I do try again with Conductonaut, do I need to anything about the four gold dots near the CPU die?
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


Yeah you just used a regular TIM rather than liquid metal and from the results not quite as good as whatever Intel uses. I just did my 8700k with Coollaboratory Liquid Pro and saw a 15C to 20C improvement. Not sure what the protocol is on the 4 gold dots, I just made sure and didn't get any liquid metal on anything but the die.


----------



## xSCAR45

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Kryonaut is just TIM and not liquid metal. Intel's TIM is just generic TIM that hardens over time and becomes all crusty. Applying aftermarket TIM wouldn't really make a significant difference. That's why it's important to use *liquid metal* over standard TIM.

Thermal Grizzly's Conductonaut is what I used. Dropped my temperatures at an average of 17.5c per core. Conductonaut is about $14.50 on Amazon and I highly recommend it.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *postem*
> 
> Damn i hate how memories jumped prices up to sky. I was considering get a 4000 vengeance but with current price + brazilian taxes i would pay 700$ that is too much. What voltage are you using there cpuz isnt reporting right


1.36volts on the ram, it's a 3200 set, overclocked to 3500, can't stay stable at 3600 with 16-16-36 getting frame stutters and gpu instability which is interesting, new timings at 16-17-36


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DaveLT*
> 
> I cannot believe the amount of Intel circlejerking going on here. Tbf this is the intel forum so i'm not expecting much but this is a bit much.
> 
> FYI : I used to run Intel. X99 drove me nuts.


This isn't "circle jerking" it's benchmark comparisons and testing on delids, if you can't be constructive why even comment? Can I see your ryzen delid results? That actually might be worth posting in a delid forum.


----------



## HZCH

@intjmastermind, while I support what @xSCAR45 says about Intel's TIM, I'm feeling your temp results with the Kryonaut are abnormally high. My brother delidded his 4790k with some Kryonaut, and "lost" some degrees (up to 10). Maybe you put too much silicon, but I actually put the same amount to seal my 4670k and saw up to 12 degrees less on the hottest core (which Btw is not impressive, as Ive used CLU on the die).

I really should fo through my numbers to actually confirm this. Conductonaut is gold btw, just go for it ?


----------



## AshBorer

will the permatex RTV red perform about the same as the black? I've got some red with me atm, don't know if its worth buying a tube of black if it will literally make no difference


----------



## intjmastermind

Thanks for the advice. I will re-attempt with Conductonaut once it arrives. Should I do it without silicone adhesive? If so, how does that affect the reinstallaton?


----------



## xSCAR45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *intjmastermind*
> 
> Thanks for the advice. I will re-attempt with Conductonaut once it arrives. Should I do it without silicone adhesive? If so, how does that affect the reinstallaton?


I didn't reapply silicone and my chip runs fine. When you install your CPU and IHS onto the motherboard the IHS isn't going to move. Just make sure to seat your IHS correctly onto the CPU before securing your CPU onto the motherboard. There are tabs on the left and right side of the IHS. Make sure the tabs are facing left and right and not up and down.

The CPU should look exactly the same way it appeared when you first received your chip.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xSCAR45*
> 
> I didn't reapply silicone and my chip runs fine. When you install your CPU and IHS onto the motherboard the IHS isn't going to move. Just make sure to seat your IHS correctly onto the CPU before securing your CPU onto the motherboard. There are tabs on the left and right side of the IHS. Make sure the tabs are facing left and right and not up and down.
> 
> The CPU should look exactly the same way it appeared when you first received your chip.


Same here. I didn't reapply any adhesive on when I delidded my 4790K. Placed the IHS on and carefully placed the CPU into the socket and lowered the retention arm. Before I locked it down, I just placed my finger on the IHS, applied some downward pressure and locked the arm. Voila! IHS didn't move and makes it easy to reapply any LM in the future. At most, just place the IHS slightly higher than it's normal position so when the arm is locked, the IHS would slide into it's normal position.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> will the permatex RTV red perform about the same as the black? I've got some red with me atm, don't know if its worth buying a tube of black if it will literally make no difference


If you have one version of RTV already, why buy more? They ALL work for what we are doing (we arent tryign to seal in ATF or motor oil...) They ALL work up to 500 degree Farenhiet...you are good to go.

This has been answered a bajillion times in this thread.

Please, dont go buy more stuff to replace an already owned product. Save that money for something neat like RGB lights, super awesome fans, or that CLU/Conductonaut...or your own delid tool.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xSCAR45*
> 
> OCN Name: xSCAR45
> CPU: i5 4690K
> On Die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> IHS-TIM: Arctic MX-4
> MHz gained: 800MHz
> OC after delid: 4.5GHz
> Temp drops: 18c
> 
> I don't feel comfortable giving out my e-mail to CPU-Z. Sorry for the inconvenience. I did however post my adventure in deliding and OC'ing here on OCN. Link is here. I hope that is good enough to enroll in the club.


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Shweller

Its amazing gow tools have goton advanced. I remember banging on a 2x4 to get my ihs off of my haswell cpu.


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Shweller*
> 
> Its amazing gow tools have goton advanced. I remember banging on a 2x4 to get my ihs off of my haswell cpu.


Back in the cavemen times, they used two rocks to delid their 586 chips!


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> Back in the cavemen times, they used two rocks to delid their 586 chips!


Actually if you remember, 486s have a ceramic package. Good ok'd times


----------



## AshBorer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> Back in the cavemen times, they used two rocks to delid their 586 chips!


i remember melting soldered CPUs over a campfire


----------



## intjmastermind

Okay just wanted to report back that I received my Conduconaut in the mail today and after re-doing the delid process using Conductonaut I got significant (15-20 degree Celcius) improvement in core temperatures. Thanks guys!


----------



## AshBorer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *intjmastermind*
> 
> Okay just wanted to report back that I received my Conduconaut in the mail today and after re-doing the delid process using Conductonaut I got significant (15-20 degree Celcius) improvement in core temperatures. Thanks guys!


Awesome. Just went back and read your first post. Yeah, delidding isn't really worth it unless you use liquid metal as you probably know now, haha. I'm going to delid a couple of weeks once I'm done my finals and have some time off between semesters. Cant wait!

I've got all of the materials ready to go. Rockit 88 kit, permatex RTV red, conductonot, kapton tape. Its hard not to go ahead and delid right now, but i really need to focus on my studies haha.


----------



## rfarmer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *intjmastermind*
> 
> Okay just wanted to report back that I received my Conduconaut in the mail today and after re-doing the delid process using Conductonaut I got significant (15-20 degree Celcius) improvement in core temperatures. Thanks guys!


Yeah that is the same results I got, well worth it.


----------



## crpcookie

I’m lost. Exactly how long should I let the RTV silicone sit until it’s safe to use the CPU?


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xSCAR45*
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Kryonaut is just TIM and not liquid metal. Intel's TIM is just generic TIM that hardens over time and becomes all crusty. Applying aftermarket TIM wouldn't really make a significant difference. That's why it's important to use *liquid metal* over standard TIM.
> 
> Thermal Grizzly's Conductonaut is what I used. Dropped my temperatures at an average of 17.5c per core. Conductonaut is about $14.50 on Amazon and I highly recommend it.


You'd have to remember that all of these are "TIM (Thermal Interface Material)" whether it's thermal "paste" or "liquid metal". I don't know how TIM got loosely used over the years to refer to thermal paste, it just isn't right to call it that









Just saying.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *crpcookie*
> 
> I'm lost. Exactly how long should I let the RTV silicone sit until it's safe to use the CPU?


4 hours to make sure its tacked up. I would let it sit at least 12 hours. 24 to fully cure, on the super safe side.


----------



## pcixopatt

I have 7700k.What means vccpll oc?I lowering this and get less heat about 10c on aida fpu test max core 68c.I have 5ghz and how much i can lower this?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pcixopatt*
> 
> I have 7700k.What means vccpll oc?I lowering this and get less heat about 10c on aida fpu test max core 68c.I have 5ghz and how much i can lower this?


Keep lowering it a bit at a time, like .005 until you arent stable..then go back up. A painfully slow process, but if it drops heat, its worth it


----------



## pcixopatt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Keep lowering it a bit at a time, like .005 until you arent stable..then go back up. A painfully slow process, but if it drops heat, its worth it


Thanks what is maximum safe settings of vccol oc?/


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *pcixopatt*
> 
> Thanks what is maximum safe settings of vccol oc?/


Since every board, CPU, and system is different, this is the trial and error part of the game. Der8auer has very extensive videos that goes in depth with a lot of things most people dont need to know...he is like Rainman with PC clocking and settings in your mobo. Check it out here.





 Part 2 Part 1 is mostly his components and reasons why he picked them.

go to 6:12 for your VCCIO info...but watch the rest of the vid, learn a lot about the settings and reasons he picks them. You may not have an Asus board though, but its somewhat relevant and helpful.


----------



## mmurray

Hey fellas, haven't been on ocn in a while, but I was hoping to get an opinion or two from the community. I recently gave my 5 year old rig an update because I really would prefer to wait for 2H 2018 or Q1 2019 to build my next machine and it was starting to feel its age.









Some people will probably flame me for running a 1080 Ti with an i5-3570k but I know I'm not going to buy a Volta card later on and I will eventually update everything around the gpu. For the time being, the cpu is (obviously) a bottleneck and I wanted to try to get the most out of it that I could for the next year.

After delidding, lapping the IHS & waterblock, and using Indigo Xtreme between the block and the IHS, I have a stable overclock of 4.8 GHz @ 1.4v and I'm getting max temps of 61°C on the hottest core over hours of running several different stress tests and benchmarks. It's idling at 28°C right now and the fans are so low my old platter drive is louder. The lowest core is 17°C which I find odd and don't know how to explain. Did I not lap perfectly? Was the Liquid Ultra application imperfect? Is it just the nature of my particular chip? I'd like to know, but it's not bothering me too much.

Do you guys think these temps and this overclock are acceptable to run for the next year or so? This chip has served me well and I don't want to kill it. Before delidding, I couldn't take it over 4.5 GHz without pushing 80°C so I'm inclined to feel good about this, but I hope you professionals would give me your $0.02 on the subject.

Cheers!


----------



## xSCAR45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mmurray*
> 
> After delidding, lapping the IHS & waterblock, and using Indigo Xtreme between the block and the IHS, I have a stable overclock of 4.8 GHz @ 1.4v and I'm getting max temps of 61°C on the hottest core over hours of running several different stress tests and benchmarks. It's idling at 28°C right now and the fans are so low my old platter drive is louder. The lowest core is 17°C which I find odd and don't know how to explain. Did I not lap perfectly? Was the Liquid Ultra application imperfect? Is it just the nature of my particular chip? I'd like to know, but it's not bothering me too much.
> 
> Do you guys think these temps and this overclock are acceptable to run for the next year or so? This chip has served me well and I don't want to kill it. Before delidding, I couldn't take it over 4.5 GHz without pushing 80°C so I'm inclined to feel good about this, but I hope you professionals would give me your $0.02 on the subject.
> 
> Cheers!


Its kind of strange that your CPU has a core sitting at 17c while the rest are around 28c. That is a big difference, especially after lapping. Are you sure you are describing it right to us? Lapping isn't a science. Its hard to mess up. As long as you use the same grit while rotating your IHS at equal passes you should be fine.

Overall you should be okay until you decide to upgrade in the not so distant future.


----------



## stephenn82

That is what I was thinking.

How did you apply the CLU? Spread it evently with a little paint brush looking jobby, or a q tip that doesnt shed its cotton? If you didnt evenly distribute it it will do that...if not fully covered, it will do that (core temps more than 10 degrees variance indicate incomplete coverage)


----------



## mardon

Got my 3D printed Delid tool on route and will be having a go at this over christmas. Are there any delid guards available for the 3770k? I wouldnt mind giving direct mount a try.

Also is it worth putting some electrical tape on the PCB to protect it from the Liquid Ultra? I killed a 16GB DDR3 RAM stick in my Dell XPS 15 the other day when my laptop slid off my knee on a plane. The force of the impact actually caused the Liquid ultra to slash across the pcb and short the RAM (lucky escape). My PC is mounted horizontally so I dont want gravity to work its magic and have it reach the pcb of the CPU.


----------



## Advil000

Well, got my 8700k delidded and CLU applied. Rockit 88 tool worked perfectly. Applied nail polish to the exposed points on top. Reinstalled lid with tiny amount of red Permatex. I clipped the hairs on the CoolLabs paint brush to half length and it worked perfectly to spread. Also, it can't be said enough, I used a crazy small amount on the die and also on the lid itself. I think I only used what had leaked out around the nozzle and it was more than enough to fully cover.

20C drop at 4.8GHz on Prime95 max heat test and Realbench.

Next project... do the GTX 1080 card. That'll be a little more daunting.


----------



## Garrett1974NL

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Advil000*
> 
> Well, got my 8700k delidded and CLU applied. Rockit 88 tool worked perfectly. Applied nail polish to the exposed points on top. Reinstalled lid with tiny amount of red Permatex. I clipped the hairs on the CoolLabs paint brush to half length and it worked perfectly to spread. Also, it can't be said enough, I used a crazy small amount on the die and also on the lid itself. I think I only used what had leaked out around the nozzle and it was more than enough to fully cover.
> 
> 20C drop at 4.8GHz on Prime95 max heat test and Realbench.
> 
> *Next project... do the GTX 1080 card.* That'll be a little more daunting.


Easy, just use painter's tape around the die, on the small resistors. That way if something DOES spill on there you won't have anything shorting


----------



## jpmad4it

Hi all, I've been looking at delidding my i3770k.

I've looked at lots of videos and read lots of info, but I cant find out whether you're meant to apply thermal paste back on the lid when the CPU has been re-lidded and put back into the PC?

Can anyone advise?


----------



## BrainSplatter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jpmad4it*
> 
> Hi all, I've been looking at delidding my i3770k.
> 
> I've looked at lots of videos and read lots of info, but I cant find out whether you're meant to apply thermal paste back on the lid when the CPU has been re-lidded and put back into the PC?
> 
> Can anyone advise?


After re-lidding you treat the CPU just like a normal one. So yes, u will need thermal paste between CPU lid and cooler.


----------



## jpmad4it

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BrainSplatter*
> 
> After re-lidding you treat the CPU just like a normal one. So yes, u will need thermal paste between CPU lid and cooler.


Thanks for clarifying!

Anyone got any thoughts on the thermal grizzly conductonaut sliver paste?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jpmad4it*
> 
> Thanks for clarifying!
> 
> Anyone got any thoughts on the thermal grizzly conductonaut sliver paste?


Conductonaut ISNT paste. Kryonaut is their laste paste product. Your question is a little confusing.

I am using conductonaut on my 6700k. Works amazingly well. CLU on my friends 7700k worls amazingly well. Get whatever you can get for lowest cost overall. You wont notice a difference.


----------



## jpmad4it

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Conductonaut ISNT paste. Kryonaut is their laste paste product. Your question is a little confusing.
> 
> I am using conductonaut on my 6700k. Works amazingly well. CLU on my friends 7700k worls amazingly well. Get whatever you can get for lowest cost overall. You wont notice a difference.


Yeah sorry I meant liquid metal compound or whatever it is. I've gone for both.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *jpmad4it*
> 
> Yeah sorry I meant liquid metal compound or whatever it is. I've gone for both.


Pick whichever is cheapest shipped to your door. Both are good at what they are intended for


----------



## jpmad4it

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Pick whichever is cheapest shipped to your door. Both are good at what they are intended for


Thank you


----------



## ducegt

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Advil000*
> 
> Next project... do the GTX 1080 card. That'll be a little more daunting.


General consensus is LM on video cards doesn't make a big difference. It certainly didn't for me. Knock yourself out though.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ducegt*
> 
> General consensus is LM on video cards doesn't make a big difference. It certainly didn't for me. Knock yourself out though.


It has for people on the youtubes...but definitely more riaky than a CPU with LM. Beware!! I think better air flow would help with NO potential to toast the card.


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

I'd like to join the club. 1st time delidding and I am amazed with the results. A fun project, but really stupid that Intel has done this to their chips.

5GHz 1.304v (in bios) 8600K. Delid with 3d printed tool, TG Conductonaut and NT-H1 for IHS to Supremacy MX block with a Coolstream PE 240. 19* delta on max load prime95 small FFT 5 passes with AVX on (.2GHz downclock) AVX set to 2 in bios.

I will update the OC eventually as I am very confident this chip can get to 5.1 or even 5.2. I'm in the midst of upgrading the loop to hardline, so I don't feel like pushing the OC on the config I have now.


----------



## stephenn82

Yes!!! Epic! Welcome to *cooler temps*


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> I'd like to join the club. 1st time delidding and I am amazed with the results. A fun project, but really stupid that Intel has done this to their chips.
> 
> 5GHz 1.304v (in bios) 8600K. Delid with 3d printed tool, TG Conductonaut and NT-H1 for IHS to Supremacy MX block with a Coolstream PE 240. 19* delta on max load prime95 small FFT 5 passes with AVX on (.2GHz downclock) AVX set to 2 in bios.
> 
> I will update the OC eventually as I am very confident this chip can get to 5.1 or even 5.2. I'm in the midst of upgrading the loop to hardline, so I don't feel like pushing the OC on the config I have now.


Can you follow the format listed in the OP please?








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Yes!!! Epic! Welcome to the club!


Thought this was my duty


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> Can you follow the format listed in the OP please?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thought this was my duty


Ugh....i uh....

You took too long lol

I didnt use your catch phrase. THAT makes it official, right?


----------



## AshBorer

Ugh, when I ordered the stuff I needed to delid I somehow forgot to order liquid metal, despite it being on my list. I'm dumb.

Anyway, I delidded it earlier today just because I've been looking forward to it for a while I didn't want to wait a week for the LM to arrive.

I'll report to yall my temp drops using kryonaut on the die and the cooler. I'm well aware it usually doesn't help much, ugh can't believe I forgot the LM lol. I'll also report my temps using CLU once I get it.

Anyway, here my CPU is being relidded. Gonna let the silicone dry overnight.


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Ugh....i uh....
> 
> You took too long lol
> 
> I didnt use your catch phrase. THAT makes it official, right?


All good, quite a few people over the years have just snagged the signature and thats all







Sometimes I get really busy


----------



## foxlite

hey guys started a fun little thread related to delids, just wanted a separate spot to showcase those clean CPU DIEs!
http://www.overclock.net/forum/newestpost/1642355


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Valgaur*
> 
> All good, quite a few people over the years have just snagged the signature and thats all
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sometimes I get really busy


I'll submit it proper just for fun. Currently leak testing the hardline for 12-24 hours. Maybe tonight I can have it back in action. The ultimate Xmas present!


----------



## AshBorer

So heres before/after temps in prime 95 v27.9 and in BF1. I had all my case and CPU fans running at max speed for the tests. Ambient temperature i was unable to measure but i cant imagine it would be much different between the tests. Probably around ~18C, its quite cool in my basement. I only ran prime 95 for about a half hour-45min beacuse my temps usually peak at some point during that time span.





Getting a ~10C decrease is pretty impressive for just using Kryonaut. I cant wait for my CLU to arrive. I realize that most people usually get a decrease of 5C or less with thermal paste. My theory is that my chip was a particularly ****ty job by intel. When i delidded it last night there was hardly any thermal paste on the die. I regret not taking pictures of it before cleaning it... didn't think much of it at the time.

I could always tell that my cpu was very bad thermally .... even a relatively low vcore of 1.28 would get me to almost 90C in p95.I couldn't even consider overclocking any higher until i delidded. Once my CLU arrives and i can report my liquid metal temps I'm going to make a post following the format of the OP in order to get into the club.


----------



## k0din

Guys i'm going to delid my 8700k soon, but i'm going to practice first on my bro's I5 haswell. My question is would i have enough Conductonaut in that tiny 1 gram tube to do both processors?


----------



## GraphicsWhore

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *k0din*
> 
> Guys i'm going to delid my 8700k soon, but i'm going to practice first on my bro's I5 haswell. My question is would i have enough Conductonaut in that tiny 1 gram tube to do both processors?


Assuming you're putting them just on the die then yes.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *k0din*
> 
> Guys i'm going to delid my 8700k soon, but i'm going to practice first on my bro's I5 haswell. My question is would i have enough Conductonaut in that tiny 1 gram tube to do both processors?


yes. LM on both die and lid and NOT TOO MUCH will be great for both processors. You can probably do 4+ on one tube.


----------



## k0din

With the haswell CPU, in order to cover the caps, do people leave the varnish or electric tape on the CPU or just use it during applying the liquid.?


----------



## BLUuuE

Many people surround the die with scotch tape and wipe any excess liquid metal onto the tape. After fully covering the die with liquid metal, you can just take off the tape. There's really no need to cover the exposed caps.


----------



## k0din

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000XBDK7G/ref=pe_3187911_185740111_TE_item

I bought that for the transistors, id rather be safe than sorry. I saw a post from someone on this forum who wrecked his Haswell because he put too much Thermal paste on and it leaked onto the them.

and

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00XLO2R2Q/ref=pe_3187911_185740111_TE_item

Got this to seal the CPU heat sink


----------



## Dikonou

Hi to everyone!
I just got my hands on an i7 8700K, a rockitcool kit for 1151 and Conductonaut.....

Since I will delid in the following days and it's my first real build and delid for that matter.......I wanted to ask how much of the LM is enough to put on?
I' ve seen the videos, read a lot, but in certain cases.... only with a thin layer of LM..... some mentioned that they had serious difference between individual core temps.....
Is that something that has been verified by anyone?
I' m asking as a complete ignorant and to be honest i don't wish to open the CPU too many times.....


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dikonou*
> 
> Hi to everyone!
> I just got my hands on an i7 8700K, a rockitcool kit for 1151 and Conductonaut.....
> 
> Since I will delid in the following days and it's my first real build and delid for that matter.......I wanted to ask how much of the LM is enough to put on?
> I' ve seen the videos, read a lot, but in certain cases.... only with a thin layer of LM..... some mentioned that they had serious difference between individual core temps.....
> Is that something that has been verified by anyone?
> I' m asking as a complete ignorant and to be honest i don't wish to open the CPU too many times.....


There is some discussion as a pro did some tests years ago and found out that a lot turned better than thin.

As a rule I use, I apply a layer to both ihs and die. Just don't apply a whole lot, a small dab is enough for die surface, just spread it to cover.

As a safety measure use nail polisher or some insulant on the 4 contact points near die.

I always recommend to reseal, it makes using the chip much more easier than floating. A small and thin rvt sealant is enough.

With a flat layer on IHS and die + IHS my average was 20c. I used glue on 7700k but results was same as rvt so I think it's easier and safe to use rvt.

About temp spread, as long as your Tim is evenly spread you will not have issues. With full stress load I mostly get 2-3 degrees difference. Even up to 5c I would consider it normal. It's only an issue if you are getting very big spreads like 10c, with stock Tim it usually stays below 10c
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> So heres before/after temps in prime 95 v27.9 and in BF1. I had all my case and CPU fans running at max speed for the tests. Ambient temperature i was unable to measure but i cant imagine it would be much different between the tests. Probably around ~18C, its quite cool in my basement. I only ran prime 95 for about a half hour-45min beacuse my temps usually peak at some point during that time span.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Getting a ~10C decrease is pretty impressive for just using Kryonaut. I cant wait for my CLU to arrive. I realize that most people usually get a decrease of 5C or less with thermal paste. My theory is that my chip was a particularly ****ty job by intel. When i delidded it last night there was hardly any thermal paste on the die. I regret not taking pictures of it before cleaning it... didn't think much of it at the time.
> 
> I could always tell that my cpu was very bad thermally .... even a relatively low vcore of 1.28 would get me to almost 90C in p95.I couldn't even consider overclocking any higher until i delidded. Once my CLU arrives and i can report my liquid metal temps I'm going to make a post following the format of the OP in order to get into the club.


I still thinks mostly of the issues are due to z height differences between die and IHS due to production tolerances.

4790k has a much better Tim job by Intel since it's basically 4770k overclocked by Intel. It uses more paste and the glue is better applied.

The biggest advantage of metal Tim is that, besides being excellent conductor, it doesn't degrade fast as other regular tim. I have a 7700k one year on metal without any issues. Most regular tim isn't suited to the extreme thermal cycles of direct die.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BLUuuE*
> 
> Many people surround the die with scotch tape and wipe any excess liquid metal onto the tape. After fully covering the die with liquid metal, you can just take off the tape. There's really no need to cover the exposed caps.


I think this is over care there is not much to worry about if you insulate the contact points on substrate. This doesn't apply to skx, as the die is surrounded by caps.

Even with a large amount of liquid metal Over s highly improbable it will go outside of IHS, the metal Tim has a very high surface tension. Even when I saw I leaking to sides of die, it doesn't fall to the bottom of substrate.


----------



## Dikonou

Thank you very much.... Will do and post pics if I can

here is what i got so far.....
still looking for RAM and GPU with reasonable pricing


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dikonou*
> 
> Thank you very much.... Will do and post pics if I can
> 
> here is what i got so far.....
> still looking for RAM and GPU with reasonable pricing


Good look on your path. I was recently trying to upgrade memory I couldn't even find ddr4 4000 here in Brazil unless at abusive prices like 700$ for 16gb.

I got to an eBay like site here and got a pre-owned 3600 16cl kit for less than 200$ and sold mine for almost same value.

Once you hit 3400-3600 memory is already above 50gb/s bandwidth so it's already very good, then keep an eye on better lstencies. Some cheap kits like 2600 can be overclocked very well, try to stick to Samsung b dies these are the best.


----------



## Dikonou

Looking for Corsair Dominator platinum 3866 CMD32GX4M4B3866C18 but pricing in Europe in general is outrageous these days.....


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Dikonou*
> 
> Looking for Corsair Dominator platinum 3866 CMD32GX4M4B3866C18 but pricing in Europe in general is outrageous these days.....


Hey at least you don't have to pay 100% importing taxes like here.

I don't know what dies dominator uses, for cost alone on Corsair I would go with Corsair vengeance it's way cheaper and you can tighter timings.
Currently I'm using gskill, I really love tridenz heatspreaders. My first kit I sold 3400 to get another 3600 with better timings, gskill too, I purchased when dram was still somewhat reasonable in price. Dram prices are just insane now.


----------



## AshBorer

Wow my CLU arrived today... Way earlier than expected. I guess I'll apply it tonight.


----------



## SpeedyIV

I received my Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut 1 gram tube today. It comes with 2 nozzle fittings - a regular looking small nozzle and a nozzle with a teeny weeny angled metallic extension with a REALLY little hole in it. The directions say to use this metal nozzle to put a REALLY small dot of liquid metal on the CPU. I don't recall anyone talking about using this little metal nozzle to apply the LM to the CPU.

Maybe they must started adding this metal nozzle to the package? It came in a black zip lock bag with the 2 nozzles and a little instruction paper. Has anyone tried using the metal tipped nozzle to apply the TM to their CPU and IHS? Below is a picture of what I am talking about.

This is my first de-lid and I want to get it right. The hole in the metal nozzle is REALLY small. I'm surprised the LM will even flow through an orifice that small.

Thanks!


----------



## xSCAR45

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SpeedyIV*
> 
> Has anyone tried using the metal tipped nozzle to apply the TM to their CPU and IHS? Below is a picture of what I am talking about.
> 
> This is my first de-lid and I want to get it right. The hole in the metal nozzle is REALLY small. I'm surprised the LM will even flow through an orifice that small.
> 
> Thanks!


Yes. I used the little needle attachment. You are supposed to use the needle attachment. The only problem with the needle is that it comes out all of a sudden so you have to be very careful when applying it. When I used the needle attachment one drop came out and then another. Use caution and clean up your CPU if you get any on the PCB. Liquid metal smears so it takes awhile to clean up.

Just be very careful when using the needle and you should be fine. Also, its very important that you just put liquid metal on the CPU die and not on top of the IHS. Liquid metal will eat away at an aluminum heatsink so just use liquid metal on the CPU die.


----------



## SpeedyIV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xSCAR45*
> 
> Yes. I used the little needle attachment. You are supposed to use the needle attachment. The only problem with the needle is that it comes out all of a sudden so you have to be very careful when applying it. When I used the needle attachment one drop came out and then another. Use caution and clean up your CPU if you get any on the PCB. Liquid metal smears so it takes awhile to clean up.
> 
> Just be very careful when using the needle and you should be fine. Also, its very important that you just put liquid metal on the CPU die and not on top of the IHS. Liquid metal will eat away at an aluminum heatsink so just use liquid metal on the CPU die.


Thanks. I already had a little accident with the tube. With no nozzle on, I gently pushed on the plunger, wanting to get just a little out, to make sure I did not get a caked up tube, and just look at the stuff. The plunger didn't want to move, built up some pressure and then let go. Not a whole lot shot out but I recalled a post from a guy who spooged the tube all over his brand new MOBO. So yeah - I plan to be VERY careful. I only bought the 1 gram tube and not that much splopped out so I should have enough to do the CPU and the IHS lid. I am not going to play with it anymore so I don't end up wasting it before the de-lid actually happens. I will use the metal nozzle and aim it at something else for the first drop, until I am sure what it is going to do. I also plan to be far away from my MOBO or anything similar.

I went ahead and bought a tube of Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut for the IHS to cooler side of things.I have some Artic MX5 laying around but I figured I might as well go with Grizzley for both, as most people seem to do. My cooler is just a Corsair H110i 280mm rad - copper block, but even so, yes I know not to put the LM between the IHS and the cold plate.

I am debating spending $8 on ArticClean Thermal Material Remover and Surface Purifier but just using denatured alcohol to clean the surfaces first should be fine. I also don't think there are any SMDs or capacitors right around the 8700K die so I may not need any liquid tape. Time to watch You Tube again. The Rockit88 guy told me that 8700K's seem to have a weaker adhesive than Kabylake chips and they come off really easy, especially if you warm the chip up a bit with a hair dryer. He did caution that if you do that, it gives so easily that there is no pop or feeling and it's easy to keep turning and go to far.

Thanks !


----------



## rfarmer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SpeedyIV*
> 
> Thanks. I already had a little accident with the tube. With no nozzle on, I gently pushed on the plunger, wanting to get just a little out, to make sure I did not get a caked up tube, and just look at the stuff. The plunger didn't want to move, built up some pressure and then let go. Not a whole lot shot out but I recalled a post from a guy who spooged the tube all over his brand new MOBO. So yeah - I plan to be VERY careful. I only bought the 1 gram tube and not that much splopped out so I should have enough to do the CPU and the IHS lid. I am not going to play with it anymore so I don't end up wasting it before the de-lid actually happens. I will use the metal nozzle and aim it at something else for the first drop, until I am sure what it is going to do. I also plan to be far away from my MOBO or anything similar.
> 
> I went ahead and bought a tube of Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut for the IHS to cooler side of things.I have some Artic MX5 laying around but I figured I might as well go with Grizzley for both, as most people seem to do. My cooler is just a Corsair H110i 280mm rad - copper block, but even so, yes I know not to put the LM between the IHS and the cold plate.
> 
> I am debating spending $8 on ArticClean Thermal Material Remover and Surface Purifier but just using denatured alcohol to clean the surfaces first should be fine. I also don't think there are any SMDs or capacitors right around the 8700K die so I may not need any liquid tape. Time to watch You Tube again. The Rockit88 guy told me that 8700K's seem to have a weaker adhesive than Kabylake chips and they come off really easy, especially if you warm the chip up a bit with a hair dryer. He did caution that if you do that, it gives so easily that there is no pop or feeling and it's easy to keep turning and go to far.
> 
> Thanks !


There was a very definitive pop when my 8700k IHS came off, but I didn't warm it up first.


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xSCAR45*
> 
> Yes. I used the little needle attachment. You are supposed to use the needle attachment. The only problem with the needle is that it comes out all of a sudden so you have to be very careful when applying it. When I used the needle attachment one drop came out and then another. Use caution and clean up your CPU if you get any on the PCB. Liquid metal smears so it takes awhile to clean up.
> 
> Just be very careful when using the needle and you should be fine. Also, its very important that you just put liquid metal on the CPU die and not on top of the IHS. Liquid metal will eat away at an aluminum heatsink so just use liquid metal on the CPU die.


That makes no sense. The LM on the die will contact directly with the heatsink, so why bother with it at all then?


----------



## AshBorer

Well I applied my CLU tonight, gonna report the results tomorrow and then, assuming it worked correctly and my temps dropped a lot, I will see how much higher I can overclock


----------



## Falkentyne

My tubes didn't come with the metal thing. I guess they started including that for some reason. Maybe the plastic needle nose attachment were causing people problems. My 1g tube and my 5g tube didn't have the metal angled thing at all. Just the needle nose plastic.

The trick to getting it out first is to push VERY VERY slowly on the plunger, with enough backwards force so you only move it millimeters at a time. From there, you keep slowly working it until a dot emerges from the hole. Once you get that out (not on the CPU, on some spare surface), then put the needle attachment on, and then you can more easily work a drop out.

For best results, use a fine paint brush, or one of those brushes used for female eye care (that cost a few bucks at CVS or Rite Aid).


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SpeedyIV*
> 
> I received my Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut 1 gram tube today. It comes with 2 nozzle fittings - a regular looking small nozzle and a nozzle with a teeny weeny angled metallic extension with a REALLY little hole in it. The directions say to use this metal nozzle to put a REALLY small dot of liquid metal on the CPU. I don't recall anyone talking about using this little metal nozzle to apply the LM to the CPU.
> 
> Maybe they must started adding this metal nozzle to the package? It came in a black zip lock bag with the 2 nozzles and a little instruction paper. Has anyone tried using the metal tipped nozzle to apply the TM to their CPU and IHS? Below is a picture of what I am talking about.
> 
> This is my first de-lid and I want to get it right. The hole in the metal nozzle is REALLY small. I'm surprised the LM will even flow through an orifice that small.
> 
> Thanks!


I didnt get a tiny nozzle thing...seems like it would make it easier!


----------



## mardon

Feedback on my 3770k delid experience. The 3D printed delid tool I purchased off ebay worked a treat, really took the risk out of the process. One thing interesting to note was the CLU i'd previously applied between the CPU and the Water loop plate had gone completely rock solid. I had to use the scourer pad which came with my new pack of CLU to get it all off and clean.

I applied CLU to the die and heat spreader and then CLU for between the corsair h50 plate and CPU. Booted and temps had dropped a little. I wasn't too impressed so tried again but this time used thermal grizzly kryonaut between the CPU and cooler. This time I got the expected results with around 25/30C drop in temps. Very very impressed. I have gone from 4.3ghz @ 1.2V to a tweaked OC of 4.75GHZ at 1.34V. Paired with my new 2400mhz 16GB RAM (up from 1800mhz 8GB) i'm getting what I would consider a generational leap in performance. For some reason my GPU seems happier to GPU boost higher than previously.

My standard fire strike went from to 15953 to 16457. Which for the cost of the upgrade im very happy with. I think I can OC further on my 1070 and am considering a re-paste on that.

Thanks as always to the community for documenting this so others can follow.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xSCAR45*
> 
> Yes. I used the little needle attachment. You are supposed to use the needle attachment. The only problem with the needle is that it comes out all of a sudden so you have to be very careful when applying it. When I used the needle attachment one drop came out and then another. Use caution and clean up your CPU if you get any on the PCB. Liquid metal smears so it takes awhile to clean up.
> 
> Just be very careful when using the needle and you should be fine. Also, its very important that you just put liquid metal on the CPU die and not on top of the IHS. Liquid metal will eat away at an aluminum heatsink so just use liquid metal on the CPU die.


But it is ok to apply LM on the bottom of the IHS, correct? At least that's what people usually suggest.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kevindd992002*
> 
> But it is ok to apply LM on the bottom of the IHS, correct? At least that's what people usually suggest.


Yes. Under ihs where it touches die is fine
Quote:


> Originally Posted by *mardon*
> 
> Feedback on my 3770k delid experience. The 3D printed delid tool I purchased off ebay worked a treat, really took the risk out of the process. One thing interesting to note was the CLU i'd previously applied between the CPU and the Water loop plate had gone completely rock solid. I had to use the scourer pad which came with my new pack of CLU to get it all off and clean.
> 
> I applied CLU to the die and heat spreader and then CLU for between the corsair h50 plate and CPU. Booted and temps had dropped a little. I wasn't too impressed so tried again but this time used thermal grizzly kryonaut between the CPU and cooler. This time I got the expected results with around 25/30C drop in temps. Very very impressed. I have gone from 4.3ghz @ 1.2V to a tweaked OC of 4.75GHZ at 1.34V. Paired with my new 2400mhz 16GB RAM (up from 1800mhz 8GB) i'm getting what I would consider a generational leap in performance. For some reason my GPU seems happier to GPU boost higher than previously.
> 
> My standard fire strike went from to 15953 to 16457. Which for the cost of the upgrade im very happy with. I think I can OC further on my 1070 and am considering a re-paste on that.
> 
> Thanks as always to the community for documenting this so others can follow.


Mouting a cpu block with CLU between it and an IHS is a waste. A good quality paste will jave same results.


----------



## IMI4tth3w

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> That makes no sense. The LM on the die will contact directly with the heatsink, so why bother with it at all then?


I think he's talking about using LM between the CPU die and the IHS, and not on the otherside between the IHS and heatsink. And i agree with him.

Also if you are applying liquid metal and apply too much on the die, use the syringe to suck back up some of the excess. Thermal Grizzly always goes everywhere as it requires some pressure to force it out of the syringe initially. I've done 6 delids with the small amount i have with plenty left.


----------



## k0din

How many of you use the method to apply LM onto to the HS on-top of the die, or do you just put it on the CPU die?

Has anyone tested if this makes a difference?


----------



## AshBorer

Well after replacing the kyronaut with CLU on the die, my temps didn't change much so i assume i screwed up the application. Which is weird because I thought it was absolutely perfect and was proud of how thin and even it was. I noticed two of the cores (#0 and #2) are quite a bit hotter than the two, so I'm gonna reapply the CLU tonight.



My temps with the kryonaut topped around 76C in p95.... two of the cores are reaching the same temp. The others are quite a bit cooler at 67 and 70C.

Temps before delid/kryonaut were at 87 so 67C will be a ~20C improvement, so im gonna do another application and see if i can get it sorted out

Whats the best way to remove liquid metal from the die/ihs?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> Well after replacing the kyronaut with CLU on the die, my temps didn't change much so i assume i screwed up the application. Which is weird because I thought it was absolutely perfect and was proud of how thin and even it was. I noticed two of the cores (#0 and #2) are quite a bit hotter than the two, so I'm gonna reapply the CLU tonight.
> 
> 
> 
> My temps with the kryonaut topped around 76C in p95.... two of the cores are reaching the same temp. The others are quite a bit cooler at 67 and 70C.
> 
> Temps before delid/kryonaut were at 87 so 67C will be a ~20C improvement, so im gonna do another application and see if i can get it sorted out
> 
> Whats the best way to remove liquid metal from the die/ihs?


Isopropul alcohol. Cover your caps first!


----------



## SpeedyIV

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *xSCAR45*
> 
> Just be very careful when using the needle and you should be fine. Also, its very important that you just put liquid metal on the CPU die and not on top of the IHS. Liquid metal will eat away at an aluminum heatsink so just use liquid metal on the CPU die.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> That makes no sense. The LM on the die will contact directly with the heatsink, so why bother with it at all then?


I THINK what he is saying is don't put LM on the OUTSIDE of the IHS where it will contact the cold plate of the cooler. Painting the INSIDE of the IHS, in the exact area over the die (as close as you can get it) is OK to do and recommended to do, although I have read posts from people that only coated the die itself.


----------



## stephenn82

Yes...but one poster said he put it OUTSIDE his IHS under a corsair h50 and it turned rock hard. Its not needed...at all. Hydronaut or kryonaut would better work there. Or gelid gc extreme...or the likes.


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IMI4tth3w*
> 
> I think he's talking about using LM between the CPU die and the IHS, and not on the otherside between the IHS and heatsink. And i agree with him.
> 
> Also if you are applying liquid metal and apply too much on the die, use the syringe to suck back up some of the excess. Thermal Grizzly always goes everywhere as it requires some pressure to force it out of the syringe initially. I've done 6 delids with the small amount i have with plenty left.


AH, makes sense now. I read the prior response incorrectly.


----------



## Unnatural

Hi, possibly a silly question: if I delid my CPU, relidding it with a silicone layer thinner than the factory one, will it be ok with a cpu+mobo waterblock? I know the total heigth difference would be minimal, but I'm afraid that could be enogh to compromise the aderence with the coldplate, or put too much pressure on the VRMs.

Also, months ago (may over a year) I bought a delid tool compatible with the i7-6700k: should it work with the 8700k too? Vendor's site seems in maintenance
Thanks!


----------



## Falkentyne

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> Well after replacing the kyronaut with CLU on the die, my temps didn't change much so i assume i screwed up the application. Which is weird because I thought it was absolutely perfect and was proud of how thin and even it was. I noticed two of the cores (#0 and #2) are quite a bit hotter than the two, so I'm gonna reapply the CLU tonight.
> 
> 
> 
> My temps with the kryonaut topped around 76C in p95.... two of the cores are reaching the same temp. The others are quite a bit cooler at 67 and 70C.
> 
> Temps before delid/kryonaut were at 87 so 67C will be a ~20C improvement, so im gonna do another application and see if i can get it sorted out
> 
> Whats the best way to remove liquid metal from the die/ihs?


Temp problems like these are ALWAYS caused by one of three things.

1) uneven pressure on Heatsink, CPU core, or IHS to either surface, or bad relid or balance..
2) improper coverage or insufficient LM painting of CPU core and/or HS (if used on a copper heatsink surface; usually applies to laptops here, whether BGA or LGA (desktop) processors), or underside of IHS, with the liquid metal. Always paint and work in (with a paint brush or similar lint free tool) a layer of LM to the backside of the IHS.

3) residue of leftover material, old thermal compound, old dried LM, on either CPU surface, heatsink, or IHS (either side). You can use very fine sandpaper to get these remnants off until it actually looks clean (even if there is a bright shiny silver residue, e.g. on copper heatsinks, when cleaning off old LM).

#3 is often the biggest cause of cpu core differences (usually one core getting much hotter, (1 or 3, vs 2 or 4, if 4 cores), with the second corresponding core slightly cooler, and the last 2 cores running at normal low temps.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Unnatural*
> 
> Hi, possibly a silly question: if I delid my CPU, relidding it with a silicone layer thinner than the factory one, will it be ok with a cpu+mobo waterblock? I know the total heigth difference would be minimal, but I'm afraid that could be enogh to compromise the aderence with the coldplate, or put too much pressure on the VRMs.
> 
> Also, months ago (may over a year) I bought a delid tool compatible with the i7-6700k: should it work with the 8700k too? Vendor's site seems in maintenance
> Thanks!


Yes, the tool will work.

No, the silicone wont cause any issues. There is no z height issues anymore.


----------



## SOCOM_HERO

Ok! I can finally formally submit my membership after moving to hard tubing.

I was able to find a lower stable voltage for my 5.0Ghz OC after delidding - from 1.34v to 1.315v. That probably going to be my daily overclock unless the 5.1Ghz is good for temps in games. The one below at 5.1Ghz will not be used regularly as the vcore is higher than I am comfortable with for now. I did not get around to perfect stability at 5.2, but I'm sure it is out there, just at a very high voltage and temperature that is pointless.

The temp drop comparison is from p95 AVX load 15 passes pre-delid 5.0GHz to IBT Standard 10 passes 5.1Ghz! Pretty much the same test given the time vs. severity of IBT, but what is really impressive is the temp difference at a substantially higher voltage and clock.

*OCN name:SOCOM_HERO
CPU: 8600K
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
Mhz gained: 1000Mhz
OC after delid: 5100Mhz
Temp drops: 15*
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/8zw15c
*


----------



## AshBorer

Well i reapplied the CLU. Maybe I should have started with just reseating the cooler to make sure I got an even pressure, but meh. Again I tried to make sure I got a perfectly even coating on die and underside of IHS.

I will say that I wish that either the LM or the die was a slightly different color so I can easily tell if part is not covered haha.

Hopefully I can bring all my cores down to that ~67C mark, that would give me an exact 20C drop.


----------



## kevindd992002

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Isopropul alcohol. Cover your caps first!


Why do you need to cover the caps when cleaning LM with isopropyl alcohol?


----------



## stephenn82

just to be safe...liquid metal not fully cleaned off of those bits will make for a great old time on power up.


----------



## AshBorer

After redoing the application of my LM, my temps are now great. Here is my official submission:

*OCN name:* AshBorer
*CPU:* 7700k
*on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
*ihs-TIM:* Thermal Grizzly Hydronaut
*Mhz gained:* 200Mhz
*OC after delid:* 5000Mhz
*Temp drops:* ~20C*
*CPU-Z validation of max OC:* https://valid.x86.fr/p8hpxe

*Unfortunately i didnt read the testing methodology for recording temp in the OP until after i delidded... so i have my own results. Everything was kept constant other than the ambient temp which i am unfortunately not able to record, though i doubt it changes much... i estimate it to be around 18C.

Here are some charts showing the max temp drops. I got anywhere between 15-20C depending on the die, i reported the drop in max temp before/after which is why i used 20. For reference, my cooler is a True Spirit 140 Power. I used P95 as a synthetic test, and BF1 as a "real world" test because its the only game i own that stresses my CPU in a similar fashion to a synthetic test.




And here are temps with my now-achievable overclock of 5.0 Ghz. Not bad!


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> Ok! I can finally formally submit my membership after moving to hard tubing.
> 
> I was able to find a lower stable voltage for my 5.0Ghz OC after delidding - from 1.34v to 1.315v. That probably going to be my daily overclock unless the 5.1Ghz is good for temps in games. The one below at 5.1Ghz will not be used regularly as the vcore is higher than I am comfortable with for now. I did not get around to perfect stability at 5.2, but I'm sure it is out there, just at a very high voltage and temperature that is pointless.
> 
> The temp drop comparison is from p95 AVX load 15 passes pre-delid 5.0GHz to IBT Standard 10 passes 5.1Ghz! Pretty much the same test given the time vs. severity of IBT, but what is really impressive is the temp difference at a substantially higher voltage and clock.
> 
> *OCN name:SOCOM_HERO
> CPU: 8600K
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Noctua NT-H1
> Mhz gained: 1000Mhz
> OC after delid: 5100Mhz
> Temp drops: 15*
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/8zw15c
> *


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!








Quote:


> Originally Posted by *AshBorer*
> 
> After redoing the application of my LM, my temps are now great. Here is my official submission:
> 
> *OCN name:* AshBorer
> *CPU:* 7700k
> *on die-TIM:* Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra
> *ihs-TIM:* Thermal Grizzly Hydronaut
> *Mhz gained:* 200Mhz
> *OC after delid:* 5000Mhz
> *Temp drops:* ~20C*
> *CPU-Z validation of max OC:* https://valid.x86.fr/p8hpxe
> 
> *Unfortunately i didnt read the testing methodology for recording temp in the OP until after i delidded... so i have my own results. Everything was kept constant other than the ambient temp which i am unfortunately not able to record, though i doubt it changes much... i estimate it to be around 18C.
> 
> Here are some charts showing the max temp drops. I got anywhere between 15-20C depending on the die, i reported the drop in max temp before/after which is why i used 20. For reference, my cooler is a True Spirit 140 Power. I used P95 as a synthetic test, and BF1 as a "real world" test because its the only game i own that stresses my CPU in a similar fashion to a synthetic test.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And here are temps with my now-achievable overclock of 5.0 Ghz. Not bad!


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## k0din

Right I did a successful delid today on my bro's I5 haswell







, before delid it was getting 80+ temps in real bench and after delid its getting 59 degrees max, on a ****ty arctic cooler 7. There was barely any cpu paste on the the die most of it had stuck to the top.

Gonna be doing my 8700k soon


----------



## DR4G00N

Pentium II Deschutes 333MHz. Cpu was already dead so I figured I would see how it was put together.

IHS was soldered on and the die had paste.


----------



## Piddeman

Just got my hands over an old (But unused) i7 4770K..anyway, at stock this CPU throttled in XTU Benchmarking..It did hit 99c..

I made a delid on the bastard and suddenly my temps on the 4770K dropped from 99c all way down to 55c in the same XTU-test, and now I can hit 4500MHZ topping 75c in XTU now.

Sad I came over a bad example and I can't go past 4600mhz.

I use liquid metal between the Chipset and IHS, and I used a 3D-printed Delid-tool and I did put some transparent nail polish on the CPU-PCB pins..works like a charm.


----------



## IIron

Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra

I did a new case, MB, overclock, gpu aio coolers and cpu aio cooler (evga280), at same time so can't say for certain what change is from the de lid

But since I'm only hitting 68 to 70c on cores (hwmonitor peak max) with 1.42v adaptive plus, llc 4 after 2 hrs of real bench version 2.56, pretty happy. I was hitting mid 80s on a r1 ultimate at lower vcore prior. Actual vcore during runs on hwmonitor shows 1.376 with a spike on start up to 1.424.

Not the best cpu only 4700mhz on i7 6700k but not super hot anymore.

Those $11.00 eBay 3d printed de lid tools plus a vise are great.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *k0din*
> 
> Guys i'm going to delid my 8700k soon, but i'm going to practice first on my bro's I5 haswell. My question is would i have enough Conductonaut in that tiny 1 gram tube to do both processors?


Plenty, I've done 3 with it and prob have room for more.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

I've done two (and a half) SK-X and got plenty left.


----------



## foxlite

Fresh delid and relid of my old 6700k


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## Ripple

Will do my first delid soon. To relid, can I use the blue RTV sealant? Or should I get the black?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## AshBorer

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Aenra*
> 
> And there was me, asking a reviewer in the EK thread to include voltage regulating RPM scales in his future reviews.. a suggestion that other posters somehow found to be backward thinking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is there anyway we can make sure if they have an issue with PWM? Your posts leave it ambiguous, but might be me having misunderstood.
> (talking about the new EKs, Silent Wings 3 we already know)


this stuff? https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/gasket-makers/permatex-sensor-safe-blue-rtv-silicone-gasket-maker/

should be absolutely fine. Temp range says -54C to like 250C.... you'll never be anywhere near those temps.


----------



## foxlite

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ripple*
> 
> Will do my first delid soon. To relid, can I use the blue RTV sealant? Or should I get the black?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


Blue is perfectly fine, it's max temp is way beyond what your cpu temps will ever reach.


----------



## stephenn82

ALL RTV, regardless of color, is rated to 500 degrees Fahrenheit aka 250 C. There are specialty colors, like Red, that seal against harsh chemical environments, like oil and ATF. Not needed. Black and Blue are best, and cheap, for doing what we do. Even basic Orange is fine.

Whatever you can get your hands on for the lowest cost is good. Autozone had the 2 oz tube of black for 6.97 or 4.99, one of the two. The blue was out of stock, but was same price.


----------



## KarlAzytzeen

I did another delid to a new processor.
Didnt Oc it yet, but i made a short vid testing my 3d print delid tool.

OCN name: karl_azytzeen
CPU: i7 7700k
on die-TIM: will be CLU (just delidded waiting fr the MB)
ihs-TIM: NT-H1 to finish the last tube (next mount with kryonaut)


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *KarlAzytzeen*
> 
> I did another delid to a new processor.
> Didnt Oc it yet, but i made a short vid testing my 3d print delid tool.
> 
> OCN name: karl_azytzeen
> CPU: i7 7700k
> on die-TIM: will be CLU (just delidded waiting fr the MB)
> ihs-TIM: NT-H1 to finish the last tube (next mount with kryonaut)


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Ripple

In my searches for delid/relid instructions using the Rockit 88 tool, I noticed that there are quite a few people using the top relid tool upside down. In photos and even some popular videos they have it all wrong. This is the correct way:


----------



## KarlAzytzeen

I delided another processor, I7 8700k, sorry for the vid bad quality.



My OCN username can be seen in the tool frame.
Dont know temps or overclocks, even whatt the Tim will be... i dont even cleaned the Intel toothpaste!


----------



## DAHchribzzz

hii,
Anyone tried the Metapads on bare die/ delid? seems like CLU slowly degrades copper and stuff which i don't like the sound of, 99%TIM lasts only 4 weeks, but found no data on Metalpads. https://www.conrad.nl/nl/coolaboratory-metal-pad-pcp-koellichaam-870586.html

There might be problems with microcracking the die during heat cycles (different expansion coeficients when solid) . But It's not a liquid under 60 deg celsius which leads me to beleive it never bonds to the die since it also has no gold plating. http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/ This would mean it could last a long time but never found more info than someone on a german forum: https://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f139/intel-ivy-bridge-haswell-skylake-gekoepft-erfahrungen-ohne-hs-mit-gewechseltem-tim-891243-346.html.

Any thoughts? I'am still hesitant trying it.


----------



## IIron

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DAHchribzzz*
> 
> hii,
> Anyone tried the Metapads on bare die/ delid? seems like CLU slowly degrades copper and stuff which i don't like the sound of, 99%TIM lasts only 4 weeks, but found no data on Metalpads. https://www.conrad.nl/nl/coolaboratory-metal-pad-pcp-koellichaam-870586.html
> 
> There might be problems with microcracking the die during heat cycles (different expansion coeficients when solid) . But It's not a liquid under 60 deg celsius which leads me to beleive it never bonds to the die since it also has no gold plating. http://overclocking.guide/the-truth-about-cpu-soldering/ This would mean it could last a long time but never found more info than someone on a german forum: https://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f139/intel-ivy-bridge-haswell-skylake-gekoepft-erfahrungen-ohne-hs-mit-gewechseltem-tim-891243-346.html.
> 
> Any thoughts? I'am still hesitant trying it.


The CLU/LM lasts a lot longer then 4 wks man. Guys have checked 20 plus months on and still good. Personally I won't plan on touching mine until upgrade in a yr or 2 or if temps start to rise.

The die/IHS isn't copper. IHS is nickle coated.

If you are that worried though and/or temps are ok just leave it factory.


----------



## GreedyMuffin

People have had CLU/CLP since the Ivy-bridge days (3770K) that is 4-5 years ago.

4 weeks? LOL! :rofl:


----------



## feznz

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> People have had CLU/CLP since the Ivy-bridge days (3770K) that is 4-5 years ago.
> 
> 4 weeks? LOL! :rofl:


thats about right I just upgraded from a 3770k and I only done one application CLU on the die 4-5 years ago between the IHS and waterblock thats a whole nother storey.

I might add that I probably won't delid my 8600k temps were topping out 74°C with prime with small FFTs @ 5Ghz so I'll keep an eye on it but not a delid candite in IMHO


----------



## KarlAzytzeen

I looked at my 4770k a pair if weeks ago and CLU seems to be as good as the first day. Didnt notice any kind of issue with It, the ihs And the die


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *SOCOM_HERO*
> 
> That makes no sense. The LM on the die will contact directly with the heatsink, so why bother with it at all then?


He is just saying no metal Tim on top of IHS, it can damage aluminum coolers. Nevertheless I stongly support to not use metal Tim over ihs, it's a mess to deal with and not worth temps wise. Metal inside is is the best usage.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *IIron*
> 
> The CLU/LM lasts a lot longer then 4 wks man. Guys have checked 20 plus months on and still good. Personally I won't plan on touching mine until upgrade in a yr or 2 or if temps start to rise.
> 
> The die/IHS isn't copper. IHS is nickle coated.
> 
> If you are that worried though and/or temps are ok just leave it factory.


Quote:


> Originally Posted by *GreedyMuffin*
> 
> People have had CLU/CLP since the Ivy-bridge days (3770K) that is 4-5 years ago.
> 
> 4 weeks? LOL! :rofl:


If you properly seal it should remain stable for a long time, metal is already liquid at room temperature and don't seen to degrade after countless thermal cycles, mostly because it's already liquid.

Reason so much people tell things like very early degradation is because they use regular tim that just breaks after a few weeks.

A floating IHS could introduce some issues with liquid metal sliding if you open the latch but I seen clp working for years without a sign of degradation.

About cracking or migration, you will see some bound to the nickel plated ihs and some stain on copper but it's very superficial. I also don't believe it suffers from same fracture issues as indium gold solder as it not fully solidify on room temperature.

When you clean metal Tim from die, it looks like shine new, nothing like solid solder.


----------



## Ripple

This is the only 'before' screenshot that I have running IBT:



The same test on 5GHz overclock:



The same 5GHz overclock requires 1.4V to run Prime95. Anything less results in BSOD after 15 minutes:



OCN name: Ripple
CPU: i7 8700K
on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
Mhz gained: 300 MHz
OC after delid: 5.0 GHz
Temp drops: 20C
CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/vndbrh


----------



## Valgaur

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Ripple*
> 
> This is the only 'before' screenshot that I have running IBT:
> 
> 
> 
> The same test on 5GHz overclock:
> 
> 
> 
> The same 5GHz overclock requires 1.4V to run Prime95. Anything less results in BSOD after 15 minutes:
> 
> 
> 
> OCN name: Ripple
> CPU: i7 8700K
> on die-TIM: Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: 300 MHz
> OC after delid: 5.0 GHz
> Temp drops: 20C
> CPU-Z validation of max OC: https://valid.x86.fr/vndbrh


You're In!







Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## taowulf

8600K came today and Rockit 88 will be here later this week. Already have the Liquid metal and the RTV sealant is easy to pick up.

Of course, I will be testing the processor first, but I will be joining the club officially within the next couple of weeks.


----------



## ftln

7700K 5ghz, 1.325v vcore in bios & 1.36v shows in cpuz, LLC set to 4 Konductonaut on the die & Kryonaut on the IHS

No AVX offset and max temps 79c after 45 minutes

AIO H115i

Ambient temps 22c

Motherboard Z270i


----------



## Inacoma79

What up my dudes. Been forever since I've posted here and i wanted to drop a long term update. I was part of the early wave of delid-ers and I'm happy to report that my 3570K is on CLU and STILL running @ 4.7 on the original application from 4 years ago. Temps have remained constant and no sign of chip degradation so far. I just finished my first syringe of CLU before Thanksgiving because these last 6 months I've used it on anything with a die that's come into my possession. I.E., I LM'd my 2011 MBP, 5 GPUs and a Gen 1 Lenovo X1 carbon (work laptop). I just recent bought conductonaut and LM'd my new work laptop a Lenovo T470s. Sidebar: This laptop even when new screamed with just a couple office applications running. I applied LM after a week of dealing with it and the fan barely ramps up now. I will say I couldn't verify temp drops because for some reason HW Monitor wouldn't report temps on either Lenovos (anyone here know why?). But the evidence was the fans would ramp up far less than before LM application.

Apart from benefiting CPUs and GPUs, laptops really benefit from an LM upgrade over the "captory" applied paste. Anyway hope this helps the community and I'll check back in probably in another couple of years.

Cheers!

3570K @ 4.7, 1.44V, delid, CLU on die/IHS, IC Diamond on base plate.
Sabertooth Z77
Strix 970 in SLI w/LM treatment idles @ 28c with fans off.
4x4 GSkill quad channel RAM @ 2033 (Way cheaper than 1600 kits at the time)
256 GB Samsung 850 Pro
Corsair H80 push/pull
Cosair Carbide 300R
EVGA Supernova 1000P2


----------



## Dikonou

Guys a question...is there a specific type of sealing paste to choose for closing the IHS? I have a Reinzosil 300SI standing by.....will it do the job?


----------



## inflatablemouse

I've asked some advice over at the Z170 board in the past for an overclock when I got the GA Gaming 7 mobo. 4.5Ghz was doable, 4.6Ghz was reachable but temps were just too high on air. Just want to share some progress I've made the past days. I've upgraded my case to a NZXT H700i, and got a Kraken X62. I got me some Coollaboratory Ultra to upgrade the mediocre thermal paste as well.

I was very disappointed that I still couldn't reach 4.6Ghz @ 1.42v. Temperatures skyrocketed in a matter of minutes to 85C. Lower voltage would crash or hard hang the system.

Watching liquid temps of the Kraken, I noticed that was like 30 to 35C. Lowered the fans and pump to their minimum, temps got up maybe a few degrees.

I figured thermal paste was a problem, as heat got stuck in the CPU and didn't seem to get tranferred to the cooler.

I redid the paste a few times but it didn't work. Now, the Coollaboratory is a ***** to apply and I figured that was the problem. So I did some regular paste but I got the same result.

So, I took the risk and I did a delid/relid with Thermal grizzly conductonaut since the Coollaboratory wasn't available (and some say the Conductonaut is a little better and easier to apply).

Applied the Conductonaut to the CPU/Cooler as well and the result is really, really crazy. I am now running 4.7GHz at 1.45v and the peak temps in the past hour running Prime95 is 65C. Average is around 55C. Every few minutes it will hit >60C, fans spin up a bit and temps drop down to ~55C.

The delid with the Conductonaut made more than 30C difference, and I am running a higher clock and voltage than before. The original paste wasn't applied very well and it was completely dried up. It was more like old toothpaste. This was the reason it was running so hot, and wasn't conducting the heat to the IHS.

The only disappointment now is that I can't run 4.8Ghz or higher. I tried, it almost immediately crashes or hangs, and upping the voltage (went up to 1.48v) doesn't matter. I tried increasing PPL overvoltage, SA and VCCIO but it doesn't matter. It is always 4th core that stops in Prime, if it doesn't crash. I was hoping to get 5GHz, but alas.

TL;DR: delid and replace that Intel toothpaste!


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *inflatablemouse*
> 
> I've asked some advice over at the Z170 board in the past for an overclock when I got the GA Gaming 7 mobo. 4.5Ghz was doable, 4.6Ghz was reachable but temps were just too high on air. Just want to share some progress I've made the past days. I've upgraded my case to a NZXT H700i, and got a Kraken X62. I got me some Coollaboratory Ultra to upgrade the mediocre thermal paste as well.
> 
> I was very disappointed that I still couldn't reach 4.6Ghz @ 1.42v. Temperatures skyrocketed in a matter of minutes to 85C. Lower voltage would crash or hard hang the system.
> 
> Watching liquid temps of the Kraken, I noticed that was like 30 to 35C. Lowered the fans and pump to their minimum, temps got up maybe a few degrees.
> 
> I figured thermal paste was a problem, as heat got stuck in the CPU and didn't seem to get tranferred to the cooler.
> 
> I redid the paste a few times but it didn't work. Now, the Coollaboratory is a ***** to apply and I figured that was the problem. So I did some regular paste but I got the same result.
> 
> So, I took the risk and I did a delid/relid with Thermal grizzly conductonaut since the Coollaboratory wasn't available (and some say the Conductonaut is a little better and easier to apply).
> 
> Applied the Conductonaut to the CPU/Cooler as well and the result is really, really crazy. I am now running 4.7GHz at 1.45v and the peak temps in the past hour running Prime95 is 65C. Average is around 55C. Every few minutes it will hit >60C, fans spin up a bit and temps drop down to ~55C.
> 
> The delid with the Conductonaut made more than 30C difference, and I am running a higher clock and voltage than before. The original paste wasn't applied very well and it was completely dried up. It was more like old toothpaste. This was the reason it was running so hot, and wasn't conducting the heat to the IHS.
> 
> The only disappointment now is that I can't run 4.8Ghz or higher. I tried, it almost immediately crashes or hangs, and upping the voltage (went up to 1.48v) doesn't matter. I tried increasing PPL overvoltage, SA and VCCIO but it doesn't matter. It is always 4th core that stops in Prime, if it doesn't crash. I was hoping to get 5GHz, but alas.
> 
> TL;DR: delid and replace that Intel toothpaste!


Sounds like CLU wasnt spread evenly as when you did the Conductonaut. Good work though getting temps down and clocks up!


----------



## DiceAir

So I did my 4790k. I didn't use liquid metal but my temps still reaches 80C-90C 4.4ghz 1.2V on stress test. I uses cooler master mastergel nano on the die and same on the die.

Check my sig for detail specs on the rest of my system. I cleaned all the black glue of the ihs and also run all fans speed on max speed in my case but still in stress test like asus realbench. in some games like bf1 it reaches 75C and spikes to 85C on demanding maps. I would love to overclock it to about 4.7GHz but don't know what to do anymore to get it lower. So far it hasn't crashed in games etc so maybe I should just leave it as it is for now untill I upgrade my cpu and then ask the shop I can order from to do the delidding for me cause they will stress the cpu and give me before and after temps as well and use thermal grizzly conductonaught.

The cooler master thermal paste should still decrease temps on load to about 70C max but still nothing. I'm running a ph-tc14pe cooler on the cpu as well so should be much lower temps than what I get now. My work pc have a 6700k non delidded 4.5GHz 1.3V hyper 212x and case with worse airflow it runs 70C max temp. I know a 6700k runs a bit cooler than a 4790k but not that much
So I don't know.

I read somewhere that maybe my ihs is not making propper contact to either the die or the cpu cooler.

like I said maybe I should just leave it as it is and wait for upgrade and let the shop do the delidding for me as that insures that it's done correctly.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiceAir*
> 
> So I did my 4790k. I didn't use liquid metal but my temps still reaches 80C-90C 4.4ghz 1.2V on stress test. I uses cooler master mastergel nano on the die and same on the die.
> 
> Check my sig for detail specs on the rest of my system. I cleaned all the black glue of the ihs and also run all fans speed on max speed in my case but still in stress test like asus realbench. in some games like bf1 it reaches 75C and spikes to 85C on demanding maps. I would love to overclock it to about 4.7GHz but don't know what to do anymore to get it lower. So far it hasn't crashed in games etc so maybe I should just leave it as it is for now untill I upgrade my cpu and then ask the shop I can order from to do the delidding for me cause they will stress the cpu and give me before and after temps as well and use thermal grizzly conductonaught.
> 
> The cooler master thermal paste should still decrease temps on load to about 70C max but still nothing. I'm running a ph-tc14pe cooler on the cpu as well so should be much lower temps than what I get now. My work pc have a 6700k non delidded 4.5GHz 1.3V hyper 212x and case with worse airflow it runs 70C max temp. I know a 6700k runs a bit cooler than a 4790k but not that much
> So I don't know.
> 
> I read somewhere that maybe my ihs is not making propper contact to either the die or the cpu cooler.
> 
> like I said maybe I should just leave it as it is and wait for upgrade and let the shop do the delidding for me as that insures that it's done correctly.


You really need LM between die and IHS.


----------



## stephenn82

At first, I popped my top and cleaned the Intel pigeon poop off and put Gelid GC Extreme. it dropped a couple degrees, maybe 4 off of the cores...and improvement. But within a month, it was starting to creep up. I already had my name on a list for the delid/relid tool for my buddy, and I used the relid once it arrived. I also had some LM from Amazon on order so all was planned well. This was last spring, mind you.

You NEED the liquid metal (LM) for the delid to really awaken...its a MUST. The high end thermal compounds like Gelid, Kryonaut, etc...the pastes, WILL break down with that much direct heat. The corning pigeon poop was made NOT to have great thermal conductivity, but have extensive abuse for a long life between IHS and the die. Its not great at thermals, but it can do it a long, long time.

Now, LM brings both THERMAL ABILITY with LONGEVITY.

But I know, give it a page or two, and people will be asking this very thing again...and again. Its almost like these comments need to be stickied on the beginning of the thread, and every time you click through a page, its tacked at the top comment. So it is seen every page, no matter where they go on this thread.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> At first, I popped my top and cleaned the Intel pigeon poop off and put Gelid GC Extreme. it dropped a couple degrees, maybe 4 off of the cores...and improvement. But within a month, it was starting to creep up. I already had my name on a list for the delid/relid tool for my buddy, and I used the relid once it arrived. I also had some LM from Amazon on order so all was planned well. This was last spring, mind you.
> 
> You NEED the liquid metal (LM) for the delid to really awaken...its a MUST. The high end thermal compounds like Gelid, Kryonaut, etc...the pastes, WILL break down with that much direct heat. The corning pigeon poop was made NOT to have great thermal conductivity, but have extensive abuse for a long life between IHS and the die. Its not great at thermals, but it can do it a long, long time.
> 
> Now, LM brings both THERMAL ABILITY with LONGEVITY.
> 
> But I know, give it a page or two, and people will be asking this very thing again...and again. Its almost like these comments need to be stickied on the beginning of the thread, and every time you click through a page, its tacked at the top comment. So it is seen every page, no matter where they go on this thread.


A local retailer here in Brazil claims he was doing delids with kryonaut and still keeping good results after few months. I never bothered to try, even because the guy was totally against using liquid metal without giving me any reasonable reason.

I have lm on die for more than a year strong as the first day it was applied.


----------



## postem

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> ALL RTV, regardless of color, is rated to 500 degrees Fahrenheit aka 250 C. There are specialty colors, like Red, that seal against harsh chemical environments, like oil and ATF. Not needed. Black and Blue are best, and cheap, for doing what we do. Even basic Orange is fine.
> 
> Whatever you can get your hands on for the lowest cost is good. Autozone had the 2 oz tube of black for 6.97 or 4.99, one of the two. The blue was out of stock, but was same price.


Also on rvt, keep it bare minimum you don't need the copious amounts Intel uses. Last time I used a toothpick to spread a very thin layer on IHS and it sealed as a champ, I tried to force it with hands off substrate and it was pretty strong.

Some people prefer floating imo rvt sealing is the best, it can be removed easily and don't causes the Tim to slide when you are closing the CPU latch.


----------



## stephenn82

Exactly. I only put RTV on the corners of my IHS when sealing my 6700k up. Easier to break it free later and still gets the job done. A lot of people are asking "should I get the black, the red, etc?" Get whatever is in stock and is the cheapest is my answer. It will all get the job done.

I dont think the 90% seal with RTV is necessary unless you are reselling CPU to someone and you want it to look stock.


----------



## DiceAir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> At first, I popped my top and cleaned the Intel pigeon poop off and put Gelid GC Extreme. it dropped a couple degrees, maybe 4 off of the cores...and improvement. But within a month, it was starting to creep up. I already had my name on a list for the delid/relid tool for my buddy, and I used the relid once it arrived. I also had some LM from Amazon on order so all was planned well. This was last spring, mind you.
> 
> You NEED the liquid metal (LM) for the delid to really awaken...its a MUST. The high end thermal compounds like Gelid, Kryonaut, etc...the pastes, WILL break down with that much direct heat. The corning pigeon poop was made NOT to have great thermal conductivity, but have extensive abuse for a long life between IHS and the die. Its not great at thermals, but it can do it a long, long time.
> 
> Now, LM brings both THERMAL ABILITY with LONGEVITY.
> 
> But I know, give it a page or two, and people will be asking this very thing again...and again. Its almost like these comments need to be stickied on the beginning of the thread, and every time you click through a page, its tacked at the top comment. So it is seen every page, no matter where they go on this thread.


Ok cool to know just one issue is that we used to get Thermal grizzly conductonaught here in South Africa but I can't seem to find any LM any more. To order from Amazon is not feasable but might be the only way. The reason I didn't use any LM on the chip is beacause I was scared I will break the chip. Temps is way better then what it was. before it used to make my pc crash instantly when playing games like bf1 etc due to overclocking so it has done something. at least it doesn't crash anymore.

I think I'm at a dead loss as I might as well keep this pc as it is and wait a bit then upgrade my cpu and gpu.


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiceAir*
> 
> Ok cool to know just one issue is that we used to get Thermal grizzly conductonaught here in South Africa but I can't seem to find any LM any more. To order from Amazon is not feasable but might be the only way. The reason I didn't use any LM on the chip is beacause I was scared I will break the chip. Temps is way better then what it was. before it used to make my pc crash instantly when playing games like bf1 etc due to overclocking so it has done something. at least it doesn't crash anymore.
> 
> I think I'm at a dead loss as I might as well keep this pc as it is and wait a bit then upgrade my cpu and gpu.


you check wootware? arent they in SA?

I know UFD Tech talks about them a lot lately...worth a shot.

Just checked...they only have basic pastes. How much is Amazon shipping there? UFD uses them all the time...but he also has 75k subs and makes some money to cover costs, im sure.


----------



## DiceAir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> you check wootware? arent they in SA?
> 
> I know UFD Tech talks about them a lot lately...worth a shot.
> 
> Just checked...they only have basic pastes. How much is Amazon shipping there? UFD uses them all the time...but he also has 75k subs and makes some money to cover costs, im sure.


Yes. I don't know how much it is. all i know is it depends what you order.


----------



## stephenn82

maybe somehow reach out to UFD and ask him to hook it up...if he will? That would be sweet.


----------



## hyp36rmax

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *stephenn82*
> 
> Exactly. I only put RTV on the corners of my IHS when sealing my 6700k up. Easier to break it free later and still gets the job done. A lot of people are asking "should I get the black, the red, etc?" Get whatever is in stock and is the cheapest is my answer. It will all get the job done.
> 
> I dont think the 90% seal with RTV is necessary unless you are reselling CPU to someone and you want it to look stock.


How much RTV did you use on the corners?


----------



## stephenn82

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *hyp36rmax*
> 
> How much RTV did you use on the corners?


Just a little dab. Not much is required. The dot was maybe 3 or 4 mm wide when I applied it with a tooth pick.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiceAir*
> 
> Yes. I don't know how much it is. all i know is it depends what you order.


How are shipping costs from overseas? I know you can order Coolabs Ultra direct from the company.


----------



## DiceAir

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *cephelix*
> 
> How are shipping costs from overseas? I know you can order Coolabs Ultra direct from the company.


I ordered a sound card from Amazon that I can't get here and with shipping was $14.06 just for reference so if I order coollaboratories liquid ultra it will work out to $50 including shipping and then there might be additional fees. Maybe I will ask the local shop when they will be getting it in again.


----------



## cephelix

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *DiceAir*
> 
> I ordered a sound card from Amazon that I can't get here and with shipping was $14.06 just for reference so if I order coollaboratories liquid ultra it will work out to $50 including shipping and then there might be additional fees. Maybe I will ask the local shop when they will be getting it in again.


Ouch. That is quite pricey. Yeah. Conductonaut and Coolabs Ultra are the 2 you should keep an eye out for. For long term use, LM is the only one that would give you the best temps.


----------



## ViTosS

Just delided my 8700k, stressing now, should I redelid because of the thermal difference between the cores? My old 7700k used to be almost the same temperature across all cores:


----------



## mxthunder

Delidded my 3rd CPU yesterday with the vice only method - 3770 non K in my HTPC. Wanted lower temps so I can run the fans slower. Saw a ~10*C drop but have a very bad mount on my coolermaster vortex, and I was almost out of coolabratory pro


----------



## Juub

Didn't realize there was a thread for this. I'll just copy/paste my post.

So I have a 7820X on a ASUS Apex Predator X299 motherboard. When I bought the CPU+motherboard used, the CPU was already delidded. I figured I may as well use liquid metal to make the best of it. I heard liquid metal is a bit risky and I can kiss my motherboard goodbye if I drop it on it though. Also heard it stains and is much harder to clean than regular thermal compound. Would it be worth it to attempt it? I don't overclock much but I plan on gaming at 120Hz soon and if I can get my CPU's clock speed as high as possible, it would be great for high fps gaming.

Thank you in advance for your answers.


----------



## mouacyk

ViTosS said:


> Just delided my 8700k, stressing now, should I redelid because of the thermal difference between the cores? My old 7700k used to be almost the same temperature across all cores:


I have a spread of about 7-8c on my vise-delidded 8700K. I think it's due to more cores.


----------



## Reva

ViTosS said:


> Just delided my 8700k, stressing now, should I redelid because of the thermal difference between the cores? My old 7700k used to be almost the same temperature across all cores:


On my delided 8700k I have a difference max 2-3C between the cores. Not sure what is normal, but yours 5c is a bit big difference for me.


----------



## mouacyk

Reva said:


> On my delided 8700k I have a difference max 2-3C between the cores. Not sure what is normal, but yours 5c is a bit big difference for me.


Is that at idle? I think 3 tests would be good to check:

1. idle 15 minutes
2. non-AVX all-core load 15 minutes
3. AVX all-core load 10 minutes


----------



## alanthecelt

CPU number 3 delidded
so far, 7600k, and a G...something or other celeron (kaby lake)

On to my current 8700k with aftermarket IHS
the machine isn't actually running yet as i am awaiting some tube fittings grr..


----------



## rfarmer

alanthecelt said:


> CPU number 3 delidded
> so far, 7600k, and a G...something or other celeron (kaby lake)
> 
> On to my current 8700k with aftermarket IHS
> the machine isn't actually running yet as i am awaiting some tube fittings grr..


Looks good, can you tell me where you got the copper IHS?


----------



## alanthecelt

those industrious polish people 
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Coffee-L...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

i believe its actually designed so that removal of the old glue is unnecessary..


----------



## rfarmer

alanthecelt said:


> those industrious polish people
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Coffee-L...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
> 
> i believe its actually designed so that removal of the old glue is unnecessary..


Damn that is interesting, up to 20% increased heat exchange. Curious to see how much better the max temps will be using one of those, price is decent too.


----------



## ottoore

https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3238-custom-copper-ihs-tested-on-intel-i7-8700k-cpu-rockit-cool


----------



## alanthecelt

and now i am worried my mono block isn't seating correctly... ah well we will see


----------



## chevy350

rfarmer said:


> Damn that is interesting, up to 20% increased heat exchange. Curious to see how much better the max temps will be using one of those, price is decent too.


Guessing i would be over non-delid since most get close to that already.....but if I could get another 20% off my temps after already de-lidding sign me up. May have to look around and see if they have them or can make them for DC, wouldn't mind another couple C's drop in load temps with summer on it's way


----------



## mouacyk

ottoore said:


> https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3238-custom-copper-ihs-tested-on-intel-i7-8700k-cpu-rockit-cool


3-5c nice!


----------



## rfarmer

mouacyk said:


> 3-5c nice!


Yeah not bad. Don't think I am going to bother with my 8700k since I am getting the full 20C improvement with the delid, but next one I do I am going to use one of these.


----------



## kevindd992002

ottoore said:


> https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3238-custom-copper-ihs-tested-on-intel-i7-8700k-cpu-rockit-cool





mouacyk said:


> 3-5c nice!





rfarmer said:


> Yeah not bad. Don't think I am going to bother with my 8700k since I am getting the full 20C improvement with the delid, but next one I do I am going to use one of these.


Do you guys think the copper IHS from Rockit Cool is better than the one posted a few posts above (eBay)? I'm planning to buy one if the temp drop claims are for real. I'm still in the process of building my system so the delidding comes last although I already have the tools (except for the copper IHS) for the job.


----------



## taowulf

kevindd992002 said:


> Do you guys think the copper IHS from Rockit Cool is better than the one posted a few posts above (eBay)? I'm planning to buy one if the temp drop claims are for real. I'm still in the process of building my system so the delidding comes last although I already have the tools (except for the copper IHS) for the job.


I have one, haven't delidded my i5-8600k yet...maybe tonight.


----------



## rfarmer

kevindd992002 said:


> Do you guys think the copper IHS from Rockit Cool is better than the one posted a few posts above (eBay)? I'm planning to buy one if the temp drop claims are for real. I'm still in the process of building my system so the delidding comes last although I already have the tools (except for the copper IHS) for the job.


I think if you are using the Rockit Cool delid kit it would be a good idea, make sure everything works well with the relid kit. Not sure if it is really any better or not. I just bought my Rockit Cool kit before Christmas, wish they had this at that time.


----------



## kevindd992002

taowulf said:


> I have one, haven't delidded my i5-8600k yet...maybe tonight.


Which one of the two copper IHS do you have?



rfarmer said:


> I think if you are using the Rockit Cool delid kit it would be a good idea, make sure everything works well with the relid kit. Not sure if it is really any better or not. I just bought my Rockit Cool kit before Christmas, wish they had this at that time.


I have the Dr. Delid kit but they do the same job. I hope someone review the one posted in eBay.


----------



## alanthecelt

kevindd992002 said:


> I have the Dr. Delid kit but they do the same job. I hope someone review the one posted in eBay.


As soon as i get my pipework in (fittings have been delayed) i do plan on spending some time putting some figures down


----------



## kevindd992002

alanthecelt said:


> As soon as i get my pipework in (fittings have been delayed) i do plan on spending some time putting some figures down


Great! Thanks.

I'm kinda contemplating now if you really need to relid the CPU or just leave it clamped in between the socket and the metal CPU holders. My original plan was to use liquid glue to relid it.


----------



## taowulf

kevindd992002 said:


> Which one of the two copper IHS do you have?
> 
> 
> 
> I have the Dr. Delid kit but they do the same job. I hope someone review the one posted in eBay.


The one from Rockit 88


----------



## kevindd992002

Ok. If I have the Dr. Delid delid kit (already has a relid kit included), I can just buy the standalone copper IHS from Rockit88 without the relid kit, correct?


----------



## taowulf

kevindd992002 said:


> Ok. If I have the Dr. Delid delid kit (already has a relid kit included), I can just buy the standalone copper IHS from Rockit88 without the relid kit, correct?


I believe you should be able to , I don't recall anything on the site that said it had to be purchased with the delid tool.


----------



## hyp36rmax

Got it all delidded and installed, didn't get stock IHS results though but I notice my temps hovering around 45C. I'll get the requested app temps later.


----------



## kevindd992002

taowulf said:


> I believe you should be able to , I don't recall anything on the site that said it had to be purchased with the delid tool.


I emailed Rockit and James (owner) said no it won't the Dr. Delid. Bummer.


----------



## taowulf

kevindd992002 said:


> I emailed Rockit and James (owner) said no it won't the Dr. Delid. Bummer.


Does that mean the replacement IHS is not compatible for relidding?

You don't HAVE to reattach the IHS when relidding. So I don't see why you still couldn't use the replacement IHS if you wanted.


----------



## mouacyk

EBay. They exist.


----------



## hyp36rmax

taowulf said:


> Does that mean the replacement IHS is not compatible for relidding?
> 
> You don't HAVE to reattach the IHS when relidding. So I don't see why you still couldn't use the replacement IHS if you wanted.


No the Copper Rockit IHS has a specific relid mount that fits only the Rockit 88. It is a little different compared to the stock IHS. But yea you can get really close without using the rockit 88 relid for the copper ihs.


----------



## taowulf

hyp36rmax said:


> No the Copper Rockit IHS has a specific relid mount that fits only the Rockit 88. It is a little different compared to the stock IHS. But yea you can get really close without using the rockit 88 relid for the copper ihs.


Thanks for the clarification, I think I was losing something in the translation. I have both the Rockit 88 and the IHS they sell, so I am fine. I hope @kevindd992002 gets his question sorted with that reply.


----------



## hyp36rmax

taowulf said:


> Thanks for the clarification, I think I was losing something in the translation. I have both the Rockit 88 and the IHS they sell, so I am fine. I hope @kevindd992002 gets his question sorted with that reply.


Yea same. Looks like he'll just have to be creative when relidding. Its just pressure too hold it together while it cures. He can technically add enough silicon on each corner (Not too much for it too ooze out the side) and use the motherboard socket clamp to secure and let the Rockit copper IHS cure. Should be enough pressure.


----------



## feznz

taowulf said:


> I have one, haven't delidded my i5-8600k yet...maybe tonight.


did you delid yet I am debating with the 8600k I have... top out @ 82° with 5.2Ghz with AVX of 2 stable as.... thats after 6 hours of stress programs but daily rarely peak over 70°c with daily computing so probably not worth it.


----------



## taowulf

feznz said:


> did you delid yet I am debating with the 8600k I have... top out @ 82° with 5.2Ghz with AVX of 2 stable as.... thats after 6 hours of stress programs but daily rarely peak over 70°c with daily computing so probably not worth it.


I'll be doing it this weekend.


----------



## kevindd992002

Yeah, I'm more for precision and I have zero creativity  So if it won't work with the relid mount of the Dr. Delid then I think I'll pass. I was more than ready to buy it already until I thought of asking the question. I was really expecting it would be compatible though.


----------



## HeliXpc

stephenn82 said:


> Quote:Originally Posted by *crpcookie*
> 
> I’m lost. Exactly how long should I let the RTV silicone sit until it’s safe to use the CPU?
> 
> 
> 4 hours to make sure its tacked up. I would let it sit at least 12 hours. 24 to fully cure, on the super safe side.


Not at all needed to wait that long, 1-2 hours is more then plenty of time to cure, I speak from experience, I have delided 10+ cpus


----------



## taowulf

The new IHS is resealing now.

From earlier


----------



## taowulf

Since I got everything sealed up last night I have been working on a little problem. First time I put the delidded CPU back in with the Rockit 88 IHS, I could only boot up with DIMM 1. I tested all four sticks in DIMM 1 and every single one of them booted so the RAM itself seemed fine. If I tried to use DIMMS 2-4 though, my board (Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7) would cycle through the boot cycle 3-4 times until hitting a C1 code and then finally restarting the whole loop again. I tried 1 and 3, 2 and 4 with no luck. 

Last night was mostly spent making sure I had not damaged the CPU and making sure the Liquid Metal application was good. FYI, I used Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro. CPU to heatsink is Thermal Grizzly.

So I tried a long CMOS clear of about 8ish hours while I slept and still no joy when I got back up. I had to run some errands, and I planned to see The Black Panther (2nd time!) tonight, so I planned to take a close look at the pins on the CPU socket when I got home. I found one slightly out alignment (thank you jeweler's glasses! No way I would have seen that with the naked eye) and managed to push with a blunted needle a little until it lined up with it's little buddies. Put some RAM in DIMM 3 and it booted with with no problem. Loaded all 4 DIMMs and I have it testing with OCCT Linpack right now. Clocked at 5Ghz, with 1.3V Core and about 15 minutes in it the cores are between 61-67C. Oh, I am using my temp air cooler, which is a Cyrorig M9i which is a dinky little cooler, right now.

Glad I got it working, I was contemplating an RMA on the motherboard, so happy I found the slightly off pin. Wasn't really bent much, just angled towards the backside (towards the I/O panel) just a hair.

When it goes in the case, it is will be under the EK monoblock for the Z370 Gaming 7.


----------



## feznz

taowulf said:


> Last night was mostly spent making sure I had not damaged the CPU and making sure the Liquid Metal application was good. FYI, I used Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro. CPU to heatsink is Thermal Grizzly.
> 
> So I tried a long CMOS clear of about 8ish hours while I slept and still no joy when I got back up. I had to run some errands, and I planned to see The Black Panther (2nd time!) tonight, so I planned to take a close look at the pins on the CPU socket when I got home. I found one slightly out alignment (thank you jeweler's glasses! No way I would have seen that with the naked eye) and managed to push with a blunted needle a little until it lined up with it's little buddies. Put some RAM in DIMM 3 and it booted with with no problem. Loaded all 4 DIMMs and I have it testing with OCCT Linpack right now. Clocked at 5Ghz, with 1.3V Core and about 15 minutes in it the cores are between 61-67C. Oh, I am using my temp air cooler, which is a Cyrorig M9i which is a dinky little cooler, right now.
> 
> Glad I got it working, I was contemplating an RMA on the motherboard, so happy I found the slightly off pin. Wasn't really bent much, just angled towards the backside (towards the I/O panel) just a hair.
> 
> ]



Nice I take about 1.41v to get to 5.2 with AVX of 2 so I would like to see how far you can go with your clocks I don't think I will push mine any further because of the voltage already


----------



## taowulf

feznz said:


> Nice I take about 1.41v to get to 5.2 with AVX of 2 so I would like to see how far you can go with your clocks I don't think I will push mine any further because of the voltage already



I really haven't played with voltages at all yet to see if I can get there with less voltage. That will probably happen when I am under water.


----------



## Valgaur

taowulf said:


> Since I got everything sealed up last night I have been working on a little problem. First time I put the delidded CPU back in with the Rockit 88 IHS, I could only boot up with DIMM 1. I tested all four sticks in DIMM 1 and every single one of them booted so the RAM itself seemed fine. If I tried to use DIMMS 2-4 though, my board (Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 7) would cycle through the boot cycle 3-4 times until hitting a C1 code and then finally restarting the whole loop again. I tried 1 and 3, 2 and 4 with no luck.
> 
> Last night was mostly spent making sure I had not damaged the CPU and making sure the Liquid Metal application was good. FYI, I used Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro. CPU to heatsink is Thermal Grizzly.
> 
> So I tried a long CMOS clear of about 8ish hours while I slept and still no joy when I got back up. I had to run some errands, and I planned to see The Black Panther (2nd time!) tonight, so I planned to take a close look at the pins on the CPU socket when I got home. I found one slightly out alignment (thank you jeweler's glasses! No way I would have seen that with the naked eye) and managed to push with a blunted needle a little until it lined up with it's little buddies. Put some RAM in DIMM 3 and it booted with with no problem. Loaded all 4 DIMMs and I have it testing with OCCT Linpack right now. Clocked at 5Ghz, with 1.3V Core and about 15 minutes in it the cores are between 61-67C. Oh, I am using my temp air cooler, which is a Cyrorig M9i which is a dinky little cooler, right now.
> 
> Glad I got it working, I was contemplating an RMA on the motherboard, so happy I found the slightly off pin. Wasn't really bent much, just angled towards the backside (towards the I/O panel) just a hair.
> 
> When it goes in the case, it is will be under the EK monoblock for the Z370 Gaming 7.


Heck ya Jewelers Glasses! I used those for my first delid, before I compiled all the info here


----------



## feznz

taowulf said:


> I really haven't played with voltages at all yet to see if I can get there with less voltage. That will probably happen when I am under water.


not the first or probably the last time I've bent pins too but yes I am on full custom loop but non delidded just debating if would be nice to see lower temps but I am happy with the OC 
Just new TIM from what I can tell definitely better than the original Ivy stuff but only time will tell if it will be stable over time.


----------



## AshBorer

im going to have to get an aftermarket IHS next time i take my CPU out for whatever reason. I delidded at Christmas 3x - the first because i didnt have any liquid metal at the time and was too excited to wait (10C improvement in temps), the 2nd because my liquid metal came and i delidded again to put it on, the 3rd time because my LM application apparently wasn't good and only two of my four cores improved so i redid it and got another 10C drop (on top of the initial one). Now all my cores are within 3-4 degrees of each other. One is a little hotter, one is a little cooler, and the other two are about the same inbetween the aforementioned two.. Good enough for me. 

So after doing it 3x over Christmas i just want to leave my PC alone for a while and enjoy it haha


----------



## laskutapa55

Anyone here from san diego, ca or orange county,ca areas....need help with. I have delidded my cpu but somehow cant find the conductonaut i ordered....must have lost it during moving houses recently....now my cpu is delidded and sitting here.....shipping is crap on these....i ordered one anyway and its goin to take 5 business days....so searching my luck to see if anyone is from my area that has some LM to borrow


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## blaze2210

laskutapa55 said:


> Anyone here from san diego, ca or orange county,ca areas....need help with. I have delidded my cpu but somehow cant find the conductonaut i ordered....must have lost it during moving houses recently....now my cpu is delidded and sitting here.....shipping is crap on these....i ordered one anyway and its goin to take 5 business days....so searching my luck to see if anyone is from my area that has some LM to borrow
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I'm in East County (San Diego), I think I could potentially help you out with some CLP. Shoot me a PM.... :thumb:


----------



## laskutapa55

blaze2210 said:


> I'm in East County (San Diego), I think I could potentially help you out with some CLP. Shoot me a PM.... :thumb:




Pmed


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ViTosS

Quick question, I've delidded my 4790k, 7700k and now 8700k, but never left the IHS without putting silicon, I heard the gap is minimal if I left the IHS sit down without putting silicon or glue, but my question is: if I let the relid kit pressuring the IHS to the DIE and do not put glue or anything on it, when I pull down the socket lever will the IHS slide or not? Using Conductonaut as liquid metal.


----------



## feznz

ViTosS said:


> Quick question, I've delidded my 4790k, 7700k and now 8700k, but never left the IHS without putting silicon, I heard the gap is minimal if I left the IHS sit down without putting silicon or glue, but my question is: if I let the relid kit pressuring the IHS to the DIE and do not put glue or anything on it, when I pull down the socket lever will the IHS slide or not? Using Conductonaut as liquid metal.


the IHS will slide a little so you need to offset the IHS so it ends up central when the clamp is completely closed I have never used silicon to reseal the CPU but you could do a few dry closing runs before applying the LM to get a feel for it


----------



## alanthecelt

Re custom IHS i was talking about earlier on my 8700k
So, when i relidded it i was unable to use the dr delid plate to orientate the lid, i literally did it by eye and it fits the CPU clamp fine

I have no before and after comparisons
My setup on my Gigabyte Aorus 5 has been tricky, it was unstable from stock
I have also had issues with the core v and LLC not playing as i would have expected

last night i feel like i have actually got a stable run i am happy with, there is more available i feel
Dynamic v core, all c states and EIST enabled
+.1v on the dynamic voltage
IA AC and DC 1
CPU LLC High
core multiplier 50
uncore 50
AVX offset 2

EK Monoblock

2 hours of realbench stability test using 32Gb of ram
core v fluctuating between 1.3 and 1.4v .....(sounds like it should not be stable right)
core 0 topped out at 80 degree c initially, rising to around 84 degree at the end of the stress test most likely due to loop temp rise, my CLT sensor isn't reading nice in windows ATM but i would say that was in tandem with the core temp

I plan to try some other stress tests and look at the core v behavior


----------



## kevindd992002

alanthecelt said:


> Re custom IHS i was talking about earlier on my 8700k
> So, when i relidded it i was unable to use the dr delid plate to orientate the lid, i literally did it by eye and it fits the CPU clamp fine
> 
> I have no before and after comparisons
> My setup on my Gigabyte Aorus 5 has been tricky, it was unstable from stock
> I have also had issues with the core v and LLC not playing as i would have expected
> 
> last night i feel like i have actually got a stable run i am happy with, there is more available i feel
> Dynamic v core, all c states and EIST enabled
> +.1v on the dynamic voltage
> IA AC and DC 1
> CPU LLC High
> core multiplier 50
> uncore 50
> AVX offset 2
> 
> EK Monoblock
> 
> 2 hours of realbench stability test using 32Gb of ram
> core v fluctuating between 1.3 and 1.4v .....(sounds like it should not be stable right)
> core 0 topped out at 80 degree c initially, rising to around 84 degree at the end of the stress test most likely due to loop temp rise, my CLT sensor isn't reading nice in windows ATM but i would say that was in tandem with the core temp
> 
> I plan to try some other stress tests and look at the core v behavior


Which custom IHS do you have? The RockIt? If so, James (RockIt owner) said it really won't fit the Dr. Relid when relidding.


----------



## alanthecelt

kevindd992002 said:


> Which custom IHS do you have? The RockIt? If so, James (RockIt owner) said it really won't fit the Dr. Relid when relidding.


Ebay, as i stated, it didn't fit the plate that locates it, but you can still lock it in place with the clamp screw of course


----------



## ViTosS

Guys which is the most used or the best thing to use to isolate the capacitors or those little golden dots in the 8700k? I want to make sure the area under the IHS is covering the whole DIE with liquid metal but I don't want it to touch those little golden dots that are close to the DIE edge.

Edit.: MG Chemicals Conformal Coating works great? I saw Linus recommending it in one of his videos.

Also I never saw someone recommending it, but does this really works? Could be the final solution for the IHS not moving when pulling down the socket lever, for those who isn't going to glue the IHS:


''I just remove the torx screw from the bottom of the holddown, potition the IHS on the old glue outline, put the socket holddown back down (but of course it won't clamp anything with the bottom screw missing) and then I reinstall the bottom screw, using that as the clamping force on the holddown. Its a bit tricky, but if done right, you can use this method to clamp it down without the IHS moving.''


----------



## taowulf

ViTosS said:


> Guys which is the most used or the best thing to use to isolate the capacitors or those little golden dots in the 8700k? I want to make sure the area under the IHS is covering the whole DIE with liquid metal but I don't want it to touch those little golden dots that are close to the DIE edge.


https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01JOKXZS0/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


----------



## Lord Xeb

Add me!

OCN name: Lord Xeb
CPU: 3770K
On-die TIM: Coollaboratory Liquid Pro
IHS TIM: MX4
Mhz gained: Same (4.5GHz - Chip gets too hot beyond here...)
OC after delid: I'm at 4.7GHz http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2533967 (higher overclock coming when I have time)
Temp drops: On average dropped ~5-7C. Idle temps dropped ~15C. Stable at 85C full load after 3 hours with H105.
Validation: https://valid.x86.fr/p9zer5


----------



## ViTosS

If I remove this screw showed in the image, when I pull down the lever, there would be no resistance, right? How can I install the screw back and not forcing the IHS downward like the guy said he does like that? I'm confusing trying to understand, when I install the screw back what I would do to not force the IHS downward like the natural way the lever does when installing the CPU?


----------



## taowulf

ViTosS said:


> If I remove this screw showed in the image, when I pull down the lever, there would be no resistance, right? How can I install the screw back and not forcing the IHS downward like the guy said he does like that? I'm confusing trying to understand, when I install the screw back what I would do to not force the IHS downward like the natural way the lever does when installing the CPU?



You don't need to remove that screw at all. Leave it as it is. The lever is all you need to ensure proper mounting.


----------



## feznz

there needs to be resistance when pushing the lever, by doing this you put pressure downward on the CPU to enable the pins to bend slightly so there is proper contact between CPU and pins 
There is no need to touch that screw


----------



## white owl

ViTosS said:


> If I remove this screw showed in the image, when I pull down the lever, there would be no resistance, right? How can I install the screw back and not forcing the IHS downward like the guy said he does like that? I'm confusing trying to understand, when I install the screw back what I would do to not force the IHS downward like the natural way the lever does when installing the CPU?


Exposing the pins to any damage is not worth the risk at all.
Yes you can do it but why risk it? You'd need to remove every screw to be able to sit the locked down bar retainer thing on the CPU.
It would take way more time doing that than trying to square up the spreader 10 times.

Just hold your finger down on the spreader while you pull the lever. If it slides just lift the lever back up and try again.
As long as it's somewhat square in the socket it'll be fine. Hell mine's crooked af but I left it like that. Same temps as before.


----------



## Falkentyne

ViTosS said:


> Guys which is the most used or the best thing to use to isolate the capacitors or those little golden dots in the 8700k? I want to make sure the area under the IHS is covering the whole DIE with liquid metal but I don't want it to touch those little golden dots that are close to the DIE edge.
> 
> Edit.: MG Chemicals Conformal Coating works great? I saw Linus recommending it in one of his videos.
> 
> Also I never saw someone recommending it, but does this really works? Could be the final solution for the IHS not moving when pulling down the socket lever, for those who isn't going to glue the IHS:
> 
> 
> ''I just remove the torx screw from the bottom of the holddown, potition the IHS on the old glue outline, put the socket holddown back down (but of course it won't clamp anything with the bottom screw missing) and then I reinstall the bottom screw, using that as the clamping force on the holddown. Its a bit tricky, but if done right, you can use this method to clamp it down without the IHS moving.''



Any cellulose based transparent nail polish works. Just get basic cheap stuff from a local pharmacy. Just make sure it's cellulose. Not expensive at all.


----------



## feznz

Quick question to these who have delidded coffee lake and kaby or previous 
Just checking to see it seems that the glue intel uses on coffee is weaker compared to previous generations?
I want to delid but getting a tool here ends up being too expensive and considering that I have a stable 5.2Ghz with no delid been a month and no WHEA errors...... considering trying the plastic card as a knife method but I guess once you start you are committed to finishing the job.


----------



## white owl

Push it off with a vise. 
Too many people killed chips or parts of them with sharp things.


----------



## feznz

white owl said:


> Push it off with a vise.
> Too many people killed chips or parts of them with sharp things.



I have a vice in the garage and it had done 3 IVYs just the thinner PCB on coffee makes me worry I haven't seen any post on vice method on coffee
But when I look at the rockit it is essentially the same but a flat line of push rather than slightly angular maybe I need to grow some..


----------



## white owl

I understand.
One way I've seen it done is by locking only the spreader in the vice with the PCB up. Take a crescent wrench and fit it to the PCB. Give it a very light twist till you feel it then pull it off by hand.

If something is going wrong you'll probably see signs like flex in the PCB before you mess it up. Be careful and pay attention. 

You might heat the IHS up with a blowdryer to soften the glue stuff.

But don't let me talk you into it. I'm just proposing an alternative.
I don't see twisting it off damaging anything though.
When I did my haswell chip I was surprised by just how little pressure it took using a drill press vise.


----------



## feznz

I might talk myself into it got LM TIM there are so many methods I like the spanner idea and I forgot about the heat gun then again the hammer and block in vice might be the go too. last 2 were vice only the first 2 were hammer and block it has been a few years.


----------



## mouacyk

I delidded a 5775c and an 8700K via vice-only method, after a few minutes of heating the glue with a hair-dryer. The delid itself took literally seconds and both chips survived and are overclocking well. Their PCB may be thin, but they're stronger than you think.


----------



## ckoons1

does delidding the 8700k increase or decrease your ability to re sell the processor ?

thx


----------



## SavantStrike

ckoons1 said:


> does delidding the 8700k increase or decrease your ability to re sell the processor ?
> 
> thx


Increase for sure. No one wants the pidgeon crap TIM.


----------



## ckoons1

so losing the warranty wouldn't be an issue ?

thx


----------



## SavantStrike

ckoons1 said:


> so losing the warranty wouldn't be an issue ?
> 
> thx


Maybe for some people, but warranties on second hand goods are a crap shoot any ways.

I would personally pick a delidded chip first. Especially on an unlocked chip, who really cares about the warranty


----------



## ckoons1

does everyone else pretty much agree with this ?

want to make sure before i choose to delid my 8700k

thx


----------



## white owl

Don't use a hammer.
Either push it off with the vice jaws or twist it off with a crescent wrench.
You can crack the PCB hitting it.
I guess that's how the premise devices do it though.
If you do it with a hammer use a very hard piece of wood or plastic block. Tape the IHS to the PCB with masking tape so it can't fly away.
Ideally you give it light taps till you see or feel it getting weak. Might use some heat.


----------



## ckoons1

i would use one of the new tools that are out.

i just want to make sure that the resale value is still there when i grow tired of playing with it


----------



## feznz

Thanks guys might try in the weekend just read people getting better stability with lower voltage same clocks 
Just the price of those delid kits.... I need to get over my anxiety if it been done plenty of times before if you can do it I can do it:thumb:


----------



## white owl

Paying 30 for a tool you'll use once seems silly imo
Maybe look on eBay to find a used one from someone who thought the same.


----------



## ckoons1

good point white owl


----------



## AshBorer

paying $30 for a tool that will guarantee you a safe delidding process seems smart to me


----------



## white owl

Not when you can buy a binned and delided chip for and additional 30 or so.
I've never heard of anyone killing one with the vise only method.
That was the razor method.
After doing if myself I'd say you'd have to be pretty incompetent to kill one by pushing or twisting the IHS off. It takes such a small amount of force at room temp to make it give. With heat it's probably easier.
1mm is all you need to peel it of. It's like 5lb of force.
Remember how these tools started?
3d printed plastic. That's how easy it is.
And you used the word guaranteed. They are not guaranteed, they will not buy you a new CPU if you crank down and crush something or insert it crooked.
You can still kill your CPU with one.

And you missed my point. My suggestion wasn't that paying 30 was stupid, it was to take advantage of the used market.
If you can't get one used, sell yours.

Post a WTB here on OCN if none can be found locally.

I practiced using a core 2 duo chip. Made a nice keychain. (Probably would have worked but had no use for it).


----------



## ViTosS

I re-delidded my 8700k, this time not applying silicone to reseal, just left the IHS forced down be the socket lever, but for my surprise the temperatures were the same, I think that's because when I applied silicone I put so minimal that the gap created by it was almost inexistent. Now I'm thinking to reseal again, for future purposes in case I want to sell this chip.


----------



## pyra

Hi Guys,

Delidded my 8700K yesterday, managed to squeak another 100mhz out of it (5.1Ghz now) but i haven't fully stress tested yet.

just here to recommend the Der8auer delid tool, really easy to use, well made and took a lot of the worry out of the process, granted, i was still terrified but all's gone well.

Temp wise I'm sitting at a max of 65C after an hour of none AVX full load (P95) at 1.4 volts using a custom, CPU only, 360 rad loop.

I used the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut on the CPU die and between the waterblock and IHS. A word of warning to all first time users with this stuff... it can be messy!! I pushed out a small blob onto some random plastic then used the supplied swabs to pick a small amount up and apply... applying it straight to the CPU might be problematic as it is difficult to control the speed it leaves the syringe


----------



## Unknownm

pyra said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> Delidded my 8700K yesterday, managed to squeak another 100mhz out of it (5.1Ghz now) but i haven't fully stress tested yet.
> 
> just here to recommend the Der8auer delid tool, really easy to use, well made and took a lot of the worry out of the process, granted, i was still terrified but all's gone well.
> 
> Temp wise I'm sitting at a max of 65C after an hour of none AVX full load (P95) at 1.4 volts using a custom, CPU only, 360 rad loop.
> 
> I used the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut on the CPU die and between the waterblock and IHS. A word of warning to all first time users with this stuff... it can be messy!! I pushed out a small blob onto some random plastic then used the supplied swabs to pick a small amount up and apply... applying it straight to the CPU might be problematic as it is difficult to control the speed it leaves the syringe


Nice but I would of used a razor, living in the wild side! 

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk


----------



## white owl

pyra said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> Delidded my 8700K yesterday, managed to squeak another 100mhz out of it (5.1Ghz now) but i haven't fully stress tested yet.
> 
> just here to recommend the Der8auer delid tool, really easy to use, well made and took a lot of the worry out of the process, granted, i was still terrified but all's gone well.
> 
> Temp wise I'm sitting at a max of 65C after an hour of none AVX full load (P95) at 1.4 volts using a custom, CPU only, 360 rad loop.
> 
> I used the Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut on the CPU die and between the waterblock and IHS. A word of warning to all first time users with this stuff... it can be messy!! I pushed out a small blob onto some random plastic then used the supplied swabs to pick a small amount up and apply... applying it straight to the CPU might be problematic as it is difficult to control the speed it leaves the syringe


It really is messy if you aren't expecting it. There is an uptake thing for the syringe.
5.1 @ 65c is pretty good IMO.
Instead of hammering with synthetics for a long time I'll use them for an hour or so then use Handbrake and screen captures or movies to run all night. It's pretty cool and simulates a real load. GTA5 is good for crashing OC's with the frame rate unlocked @ 1080p or lower to keep the CPU pegged.


----------



## feznz

white owl said:


> Paying 30 for a tool you'll use once seems silly imo
> Maybe look on eBay to find a used one from someone who thought the same.


I would gladly pay $30 USD for a delid tool... but in New Zealand IF you can find 1 which I have then it was over $100USD did fid a SH oneseller wanted near new price for it and a person asked if he could hire it for 10 mins for $20 the seller declined 
So I will use what I got on hand don't need to buy something to use once I have a 16" wrench heatgun and vice on hand and LM TIM 
Though I am thinking of a simple jig to use in the vice which is a 12" so plenty of grunt 
Any enough talking I must just do it.


----------



## pyra

Unknownm said:


> Nice but I would of used a razor, living in the wild side!
> 
> Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk


I did consider it but the tool was cheap enough and I have 2 cpus to delid so i thought it was worth it.



white owl said:


> It really is messy if you aren't expecting it. There is an uptake thing for the syringe.
> 5.1 @ 65c is pretty good IMO.
> Instead of hammering with synthetics for a long time I'll use them for an hour or so then use Handbrake and screen captures or movies to run all night. It's pretty cool and simulates a real load. GTA5 is good for crashing OC's with the frame rate unlocked @ 1080p or lower to keep the CPU pegged.


i think it's pretty good, especially for the volts i'm pumping into this chip (1.4) I did manage to get it to boot into windows at 5.5Ghz, it crashed as soon as i tried to open HWmonitor though.... and 1.52 volts to do this might have been a little stupid 

I might try the GTA5 test, i don't usually do synthetics for too long anyway.


----------



## white owl

feznz said:


> I would gladly pay $30 USD for a delid tool... but in New Zealand IF you can find 1 which I have then it was over $100USD did fid a SH oneseller wanted near new price for it and a person asked if he could hire it for 10 mins for $20 the seller declined
> So I will use what I got on hand don't need to buy something to use once I have a 16" wrench heatgun and vice on hand and LM TIM
> Though I am thinking of a simple jig to use in the vice which is a 12" so plenty of grunt
> Any enough talking I must just do it.


You could fab a steel plate to fit the PCB perfectly to basically make a jig but before that I'd try a simple crescent wrench and a light twist. I don't see how it could possibly hurt anything if the crescent wrench is tight on all three sides and you just bump it with a wooden block or give it a twist. If a light touch doesn't do it then I'd just make my own jig.
Had I realized you were able to fabricate stuff like me, I'd have suggested that.

If it were my 8700k I'd do it and I'm not wealthy enough to just buy another. $30 plus the TIM makes it a +$400 CPU and that just seems too steep unless you need to delid several CPUs.

They are really easy to take off. It's just silicone.
If you see any sign of flex just stop. Try something else.


----------



## feznz

white owl said:


> You could fab a steel plate to fit the PCB perfectly to basically make a jig but before that I'd try a simple crescent wrench and a light twist. I don't see how it could possibly hurt anything if the crescent wrench is tight on all three sides and you just bump it with a wooden block or give it a twist. If a light touch doesn't do it then I'd just make my own jig.
> Had I realized you were able to fabricate stuff like me, I'd have suggested that.
> 
> If it were my 8700k I'd do it and I'm not wealthy enough to just buy another. $30 plus the TIM makes it a +$400 CPU and that just seems too steep unless you need to delid several CPUs.
> 
> They are really easy to take off. It's just silicone.
> If you see any sign of flex just stop. Try something else.



you got me thinking now thats a great idea with a 4 sided jig that would be 4 points of contact :thumb:

I had been thinking of a slotted block that would allow the PCB to pass though and give a square edge to push against the IHS so I could used the vice to push the PCB though the slot


----------



## white owl

Not to rain on your parade but 4 sides vs 1 side is the same thing. You're only applying force to one side to push the IHS off.
That's why I brought up the crescent wrench. You can tighten it to fit snug over the PCB so when you've tapped or twisted it the PCB will stay in the wrench.
If I were making a jig I'd probably take 2 pieces of 1/4" plate and cut a IHS side and PCB side. From there you could integrate a screw to push it apart like a jig does or put one plate in the vise and tap the other till it gives.
No matter how you do it you're applying the same pressure to one side of the PCB with the exception of twisting it off which uses 2 sides of the PCB...actually 3 but the brunt of it will be on the jaw sides.

Applying horizontal force in some direction is the important thing.

Just using the vice (diagonal force) 
seems like the one that might bend it but it's such a small force I can't imagine it actually flexing if you get the right angle.

Any way you decide to do it, you should be able to get the job done sucessfully. I have 100% faith in ya.

If you can fab up a jig and it makes you feel safer then more power to you. My main point was it takes the same pressure on one side of PCB either way.

Remember not to separate it 100%.
You just want it to give enough so it can be pulled off. Pushing too far might hit a cap or something.


----------



## Kryton

When I did my 3770K in my vice (The lid push method) it gave a noise that was like a "Crack" or "Pop" when the glue gave up. 
If using the lid-push method in a mounted workshop bench vice (Like I have), apply the pressure slowly in baby steps and when you hear the magic noise, stop - It's done. 

Next on my list is the 7700K I'm using in a build I just got working yesterday and will be using the vice like before to do the job but the method used will be different. 

Not going to try it with the lid-push method like I did with the 3770K because the PCB is thinner and you can break it if the angle of pressure on the chip/lid is applied wrong, all too easy to do in a vice. 

The cresent wrench idea is interesting and worth looking into - Only worry I'd have is whether my vice is small enough to get a grip onto the lid itself since the lid's edge is a very small surface area to get a grip on. If it can't I can always have the chip rightside up instead with the PCB held by the vice and place the wrench on the lid. 
Give it a twist while holding the wrench down onto the lid's edges by hand - It will try to "Walk up and off" when you do it and that's why you'd need to hold it in place.


----------



## white owl

I believe mine made a sound as well.
I'd imagine so long as your vise is in good shape (not like the ones we use in my shop) and it has nice, square edges you should be able to bite on the IHS. 
Even if from the PCB to the top of the IHS was only 2nd you could still get a good bite.


----------



## Kryton

white owl said:


> I believe mine made a sound as well.
> I'd imagine so long as your vise is in good shape (not like the ones we use in my shop) and it has nice, square edges you should be able to bite on the IHS.
> Even if from the PCB to the top of the IHS was only 2nd you could still get a good bite.


Well, I've ditched the vice for doing it - Had a very close call when I tried and was lucky to avoid having a dead chip. 
The chip simply put, began flaking apart right on the outer edge of the PCB when I applied pressure for twisting the lid off - And the lid on this chip is stuck on rather well, didn't budge a bit. 

I wil get a cheap delidder tool and do it right instead of taking a risk with this one since I can't replace it if it gets killed. 

Thanks for the help and tips, someone should be able to use them but in this case it's game over for any vice based delidding.


----------



## white owl

Yeah you definitely shouldn't need that much force. I'm glad you stopped.


----------



## Falkentyne

Just a heads up for you delidders or for people using LM on a laptop's already delidded BGA CPU:

Don't bother buying 1 gram of Conductonaut for $15 or 5 grams for $40.

Buy this:

You'll get it in less than 2 weeks.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Galinstan-...372053?hash=item4b38602455:g:488AAOSwzBJaf3aT

The only hard part is, you will need to get a syringe. you may be able to get one free from the local pharmacy. But that's still not the hard part. 
The even harder part is, you will need to find a cap that will fit the syringe. Something like soft flexible plastic caps from old Arctic Ceramique tubes will work great, but many newer ABS Caps may not fit properly. So you will have to work on that.

You *CAN* use an existing Conductonaut tube, if you have one that is already used up, and put this in there (no harm will come from mixing residue from both pastes).

Pro tip:

First fill the syringe up with the Galinstan, with the CAP cover on the tip (important).

Then after it's filled up, put the plunger in just enough to get past the "stop" which secures the plunger in the tube. Do NOT depress it past the stop !!!
Then, flip the syringe UPSIDE DOWN, and REMOVE THE CAP! This is important because air will need an escape for the next part.

Now, press the plunger down until the liquid metal fills up the bottom area (by the end of the tube). Having the syringe upside down will prevent any from escaping from the tip, as long as you go nice and slowly. The tip cover being removed will prevent air pressure from causing problems and prevent any LM from squirting all over the place. Once you have the plunger fully inserted so that there is no longer any air at the very bottom of the tube, then put the cap on and you're done 

Very easy to do.

You need to do the same methods if you were trying to fill up the original Conductonaut syringe as well.

This is worth.
$30 dollars (22+shipping) for 30 GRAMS of Liquid metal.

What would you rather buy?
5 grams of conductonaut for $40? 1 gram for $15? or 30 grams of Galinstan for $30?

Fun fact: I bought both 1 gram of Conductonaut then 5 grams of Conductonaut.
Now I learned to swim and bought this and put it on my r9 290X. Zero difference between this and conductonaut. ZERO. And it's MUCH cheaper.
Whether it lasts longer or conductonaut lasts longer or has some extra material to make it remain liquid at -11C (according to an article about Galinstan) or not, who cares at a price like this?


----------



## Penicilyn

Finally got around to delidding this stupid processor after owning it for years. It's always run hotter than the sun. Just put some painters tape on the vice and then it popped off nicely for me. Used whatever the TIM is that Noctua supplies with the NH-D14 that I used to run.

Dropped 15C off my load temps.


----------



## white owl

@Falkentyne 
I hope your 290x has a copper heatsink or bottom plate.


----------



## Falkentyne

white owl said:


> @Falkentyne
> I hope your 290x has a copper heatsink or bottom plate.


It does. I have LM on my laptop CPU and GPU heatsinks also. 
I know full well not to let this stuff touch aluminum.

BTW there's a reddit post and pics on how to make your own Galinstan (costs more up front but cheaper in the end):

https://www.reddit.com/r/watercooli...yd_liquid_metal_thermal_paste_and_so_can_you/
https://imgur.com/a/T6JlP


----------



## mAs81

Falkentyne said:


> Just a heads up for you delidders or for people using LM on a laptop's already delidded BGA CPU:
> 
> Don't bother buying 1 gram of Conductonaut for $15 or 5 grams for $40.
> 
> Buy this:
> 
> You'll get it in less than 2 weeks.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Galinstan-...372053?hash=item4b38602455:g:488AAOSwzBJaf3aT
> 
> Whether it lasts longer or conductonaut lasts longer or has some extra material to make it remain liquid at -11C (according to an article about Galinstan) or not, who cares at a price like this?


Thanks for this,will surely keep an eye out for it..

I need to see if my vapor x 290 and msi 280x have copper coolers


----------



## feznz

Another successful delid 8600k vice and wrench method with a twist 

Average core temp drop 14°C

before










after










Thanks White Owl for the suggestion

Might as well go for the 5.3Ghz now


----------



## white owl

Hell yeah man. Glad it worked.
Did yours pop right off or did you see any cause for caution while doing it?
Edit: Your after temps are higher. You get the slides mixed up? Or maybe the attachments thing is just showing them backwards. I'm on mobile and can't see them without opening them.
If so that's a nice drop. You might not need much vcore to get 4.3.
Where's your LLC?


----------



## feznz

Ah it took a lot more force than expected I would recommend a bigger wrench than a 12" but it did the job
Put duct tape in the jaws to help soften the grip on the PCB first time the CPU slipped out and did chip the edge quite badly I was so frustrated so just got a bit rougher and gave it another go just sat the PCB deeper in the vice 
should have taken photos but I was more concerned if I had damaged the CPU that I just had to thow the CPU back in ASAP almost took off 1/3 of a contact pad:doh:
LLC set to 6 already but now got thermal and voltage headroom to try 5.3 hey might get real lucky and hit 5.4

Overall all good I don't really have time this weekend to test as got t put a new motor in my truck which I am off to do now 

but would recommend vice and wrench with a twist just set the PCB low as possible in the vice :thumb:



Falkentyne said:


> Just a heads up for you delidders or for people using LM on a laptop's already delidded BGA CPU:
> 
> Don't bother buying 1 gram of Conductonaut for $15 or 5 grams for $40.
> 
> Buy this:
> 
> You'll get it in less than 2 weeks.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Galinstan-...372053?hash=item4b38602455:g:488AAOSwzBJaf3aT
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> The only hard part is, you will need to get a syringe. you may be able to get one free from the local pharmacy. But that's still not the hard part.
> The even harder part is, you will need to find a cap that will fit the syringe. Something like soft flexible plastic caps from old Arctic Ceramique tubes will work great, but many newer ABS Caps may not fit properly. So you will have to work on that.
> 
> You *CAN* use an existing Conductonaut tube, if you have one that is already used up, and put this in there (no harm will come from mixing residue from both pastes).
> 
> Pro tip:
> 
> First fill the syringe up with the Galinstan, with the CAP cover on the tip (important).
> 
> Then after it's filled up, put the plunger in just enough to get past the "stop" which secures the plunger in the tube. Do NOT depress it past the stop !!!
> Then, flip the syringe UPSIDE DOWN, and REMOVE THE CAP! This is important because air will need an escape for the next part.
> 
> Now, press the plunger down until the liquid metal fills up the bottom area (by the end of the tube). Having the syringe upside down will prevent any from escaping from the tip, as long as you go nice and slowly. The tip cover being removed will prevent air pressure from causing problems and prevent any LM from squirting all over the place. Once you have the plunger fully inserted so that there is no longer any air at the very bottom of the tube, then put the cap on and you're done
> 
> Very easy to do.
> 
> You need to do the same methods if you were trying to fill up the original Conductonaut syringe as well.
> 
> This is worth.
> $30 dollars (22+shipping) for 30 GRAMS of Liquid metal.
> 
> What would you rather buy?
> 
> 
> 5 grams of conductonaut for $40? 1 gram for $15? or 30 grams of Galinstan for $30?
> 
> Fun fact: I bought both 1 gram of Conductonaut then 5 grams of Conductonaut.
> Now I learned to swim and bought this and put it on my r9 290X. Zero difference between this and conductonaut. ZERO. And it's MUCH cheaper.
> Whether it lasts longer or conductonaut lasts longer or has some extra material to make it remain liquid at -11C (according to an article about Galinstan) or not, who cares at a price like this?


Nice I still trying to use the first 1gm tube I got 5 years ago I don't use that much and found that no reapplication need but yes for sure given the choice to buy the 1gm tube or 30grm 5 years ago I would have got the 30grm


----------



## trn

7900x, covered the SMD's with clear nail polish and re-lidded with liquid metal.


----------



## feznz

was worth the delid gained 200Mhz might have to see how 5.5Ghz goes tomorrow


----------



## cyan

just wondering if anyone get white mark/dust when using super glue ?
any way to prevent it ?


----------



## Kryton

feznz said:


> Ah it took a lot more force than expected I would recommend a bigger wrench than a 12" but it did the job
> Put duct tape in the jaws to help soften the grip on the PCB first time the CPU slipped out and did chip the edge quite badly I was so frustrated so just got a bit rougher and gave it another go just sat the PCB deeper in the vice
> should have taken photos but I was more concerned if I had damaged the CPU that I just had to thow the CPU back in ASAP almost took off 1/3 of a contact pad:doh:
> LLC set to 6 already but now got thermal and voltage headroom to try 5.3 hey might get real lucky and hit 5.4


That's largely how it happened with mine, the edges of the chip started flaking off and the chip almost fell and hit the floor because it got loose when some of the PCB material broke away from the chip itself. 
In my case I'm in no position to replace it should I kill it so for me it's either do it with a proper tool or just leave it alone. 

ATM I'm running it at stock, don't have a real need to clock it up since it's just being used as a DD and it's on air too but delidding would be of benefit to the chip regardless.


----------



## feznz

cyan said:


> just wondering if anyone get white mark/dust when using super glue ?
> any way to prevent it ?



why the heck you using super glue I hope not to reglue the IHS back on you will struggle to get it back off if the need arises I have heard even soaking in acetone for days won't make it budge then if you force it then it will rip some of the PCB off with the IHS



Kryton said:


> That's largely how it happened with mine, the edges of the chip started flaking off and the chip almost fell and hit the floor because it got loose when some of the PCB material broke away from the chip itself.
> In my case I'm in no position to replace it should I kill it so for me it's either do it with a proper tool or just leave it alone.
> 
> ATM I'm running it at stock, don't have a real need to clock it up since it's just being used as a DD and it's on air too but delidding would be of benefit to the chip regardless.


the chipping was from the PCB slipping out of the vice I had a fair amount of pressure on the jaws just rotate 90° and go again lol if you are brave..... should have used the heat gun 
but a successful delid in the end 14°C temp drops and get 5.2 to 5.4 tried 5.5 get BSOD after 20min of non AVX prime 95 so will work with 5.4 but try lower the voltages


----------



## WiSH2oo0

From this:



WiSH2oo0 said:


> I figured I better post my results here with the 3570K. That way people know that is is not always all sunshine and rainbows on the other side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My experience did not go over well. Once I dropped the CPU into the motherboard and fired her up. I did not get a picture on my monitor. So then I took out my graphics card and tried with the on board video with no luck. My 3570K is junk


To this: There is a tool for every job. 

Edit: So I was just reading a few posts. Did I fail again super gluing my IHS back on?

OCN name: WiSH2oo0
CPU: Intel i7 8700k
On die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
IHS-TIM: AS5
Mhz gained: Untested
OC after delid: Untested
Temp drops: Untested
Before delid: Untested

No before testing took place. I went right for the Delid tool and I'm not looking back.


----------



## rfarmer

WiSH2oo0 said:


> From this:
> 
> 
> 
> To this: There is a tool for every job.
> 
> Edit: So I was just reading a few posts. Did I fail again super glueing my IHS back on?
> 
> OCN name: WiSH2oo0
> CPU: Intel i7 8700k
> On die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: Untested
> OC after delid: Untested
> Temp drops: Untested
> Before delid: Untested
> 
> No before testing took place. I went right for the Delid tool and I'm not looking back.


Only if you ever need to remove the IHS, you can do serious damage. As long as everything works you should be good.


----------



## cyan

feznz said:


> why the heck you using super glue I hope not to reglue the IHS back on you will struggle to get it back off if the need arises I have heard even soaking in acetone for days won't make it budge then if you force it then it will rip some of the PCB off with the IHS


I currently use black rtv silicone
but I read that people got lower temp using super glue on each corner method.
so I'm tempting to re-do mine with super glue..


----------



## pyra

cyan said:


> I currently use black rtv silicone
> but I read that people got lower temp using super glue on each corner method.
> so I'm tempting to re-do mine with super glue..


or just dont re-glue? my 8700k has the IHS just resting ontop and kept in place by the motherboard retention bracket... no real need to reglue


----------



## white owl

Just don't glue it. If you glue it before testing then how do you know you applied it well?
If you must glue it just use the nail polish as glue so acetone can dissolve it.

I haven't taken my cooler off in a long time because there's no point when things are going well. When I did need to mess with it the lid was removed 2x without redoing the CLU and temps were always the same.


----------



## Kryton

feznz said:


> the chipping was from the PCB slipping out of the vice I had a fair amount of pressure on the jaws just rotate 90° and go again lol if you are brave..... should have used the heat gun
> but a successful delid in the end 14°C temp drops and get 5.2 to 5.4 tried 5.5 get BSOD after 20min of non AVX prime 95 so will work with 5.4 but try lower the voltages


That's how it went, the PCB started flaking and there was nothing solid for the vice to hold the chip with. 

I'm still going to do it with a delidding tool, as said I can't replace it if I kill it and didn't spend the $$ on the rest to let it sit. 
Delid tools are cheaper than wasting $$ on chips and such.


----------



## ViTosS

I don't recommending glueing with Loctite, even the Super Gel version (the one they recommend in Rockit Cool), because it will leave a lot of white marks that I don't know how they appear and how to remove them, I also bought 100% Pure Acetone and even putting a lot and scratching with cotton it wasn't dissolving at all, I glued my 7700k, but this time I left the IHS hold down by the socket lever in my 8700k, I also didn't notice any difference in temperature going to no glue and no RTV, so I switched again to RTV, if you put very few quantity in the 4 sides, up, down, left and right the Cº you will gain going to no glue/RTV will be none, I tested both methods and can confirm this. I only used RTV again because in the future if I will sell the CPU separately from motherboard, the future buyer won't have trouble to install if in the motherboard socket. Also if you hold the IHS applying force against the direction of the socket lever force, the IHS won't move at all so no need to glue anything.


----------



## Kryton

I could almost kick myself here - Turns out I had what I needed all along but didn't think about it until I began looking for delidding tools. 
Noted some have used a simple razor blade and that made me think about a tool I have that I modified for delidding PS3 CPU's. 

Set it up, put the tool to use and the top came right off, no extra $$ spent on a tool and the lid came off cleanly. 
Set it back up in the system and let it go. 

Temps ATM don't seem to be any different, in fact they look to be a touch higher but could be the new TIM is still settling in and this will improve as time passes.


----------



## white owl

Did you remove the glue? That's the main thing here. Using better TIM us just a bonus.


----------



## Kryton

Yes I did - Used the tool for that on both the lid and chip. 
Had the same effect with my 3770K I did earlier, nothing really changed with it either but I know now the crap TIM is gone, used some Tuniq TX-2 I had sitting around. No prob to redo the TIM since I also have Ceramique and Noctua NT-H1 here, would have used the Noctua but with the brainfart on my part I used the Tuniq instead. 

At least it's better than the pidgeon poop it had under there.


----------



## The Pook

WiSH2oo0 said:


> I figured I better post my results here with the 3570K. That way people know that is is not always all sunshine and rainbows on the other side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My experience did not go over to well. Once I dropped the CPU into the motherboard and fired here up. I did not get a picture on my monitor. So then I took out my graphics card and tried with the on board video with no luck. My 3570K is junk


if it makes you feel any better, I killed my 7700K being reckless. Special place in the CPU afterlife for our poor CPUs 

of course it's the most expensive CPU I've delided so far - my i5 6400 and i7 6700 are doing more than fine after deliding though. :thumb:


----------



## trn

I sent 2, 3770's to failed-delid-heaven back when delidding was new and good tools and instructions weren't available. Having ybr right tools and good instruction videos helps a lot. 


And even now plenty to learn. I just relidded my 7900x with a few dabs of the Super glue gel on the corners of the IHS only to then see about a full page of comments warning against super glue. When I put it on I was thinking the delidding tool could crack office glue if ended but now I think I'll just leave it be and not try test that out.


----------



## feznz

Kryton said:


> Yes I did - Used the tool for that on both the lid and chip.
> Had the same effect with my 3770K I did earlier, nothing really changed with it either but I know now the crap TIM is gone, used some Tuniq TX-2 I had sitting around. No prob to redo the TIM since I also have Ceramique and Noctua NT-H1 here, would have used the Noctua but with the brainfart on my part I used the Tuniq instead.
> 
> At least it's better than the pidgeon poop it had under there.



keep an eye on these temp I have used traditional TIM 95% "pump out" over time some even less than a week best to use Liquid metal TIM


----------



## white owl

Hitting the clocks again now that I have a GPU to make it matter.
So far...
4.5ghz @1.25v to 4.8 @ 1.344 ( I can't get the load vcore to drop past this). Just ran an hour of realbench.
LLC is 6 and input is 1.82 I think. Most everything else is on auto.
1333mhz to 1400mhz on same timings (ram is poop)
Still have cache at 4ghz

I reTIMed the 1080 SC. Went from 1800ish @70c to around [email protected] 60c under load. +600 on the ram.
Stock voltage and max TDP. 
This card would have good potential if I could edit the BIOS to bake things in.

I almost can't believe how easy this has been. One day of OCing and still haven't crashed a CPU OC.


----------



## cyan

pyra said:


> or just dont re-glue? my 8700k has the IHS just resting ontop and kept in place by the motherboard retention bracket... no real need to reglue


I want to sell my 4770k. (thinking of upgrading to 8700k)
and the buyer want it sealed, incase in the future he want to resell again.
I guess I'll stick with rtv silicone


----------



## alanthecelt

yer, i've just used standard black silicone sealant on the 3 i have done, my 8700k i just put a blob on each corner and left it over night, was more than adequate and seemed to hold it in position as the clamp was applied


----------



## white owl

alanthecelt said:


> yer, i've just used standard black silicone sealant on the 3 i have done, my 8700k i just put a blob on each corner and left it over night, was more than adequate and seemed to hold it in position as the clamp was applied


This.

The silicone is what's making the gap you're aiming to fix by delidding. If you must seal it I'd take a qtip and blob the corners or apply a very thin layer around the IHS. Then clamp and dry.


----------



## alanthecelt

white owl said:


> This.
> 
> The silicone is what's making the gap you're aiming to fix by delidding. If you must seal it I'd take a qtip and blob the corners or apply a very thin layer around the IHS. Then clamp and dry.


i hasten to add, mine is an aftermarket IHS which has a small gap left between it and the PCB


----------



## The Pook

trn said:


> I sent 2, 3770's to failed-delid-heaven back when delidding was new and good tools and instructions weren't available. Having ybr right tools and good instruction videos helps a lot.
> 
> 
> And even now plenty to learn. I just relidded my 7900x with a few dabs of the Super glue gel on the corners of the IHS only to then see about a full page of comments warning against super glue. When I put it on I was thinking the delidding tool could crack office glue if ended but now I think I'll just leave it be and not try test that out.


what warnings about super glue? that's how I do mine


----------



## feznz

The Pook said:


> what warnings about super glue? that's how I do mine


it fine the problem arises if you want to take the IHS back off but LM doesn't degrade so in theory you won't be taking it off again IF your application was perfect :thumb:


----------



## Kryton

feznz said:


> keep an eye on these temp I have used traditional TIM 95% "pump out" over time some even less than a week best to use Liquid metal TIM


Believe me, I'm watching things here. 

I seen to recall in the past TX-2 dries out quickly but still does it's job, turns into something that's like a gray chalk/clay once it does. If it does that I believe it will be OK.
I haven't glued/siliconed the lid on so getting to it won't be a problem, no more so than it is taking the chip out and setting it back in again.


----------



## The Pook

feznz said:


> it fine the problem arises if you want to take the IHS back off but LM doesn't degrade so in theory you won't be taking it off again IF your application was perfect :thumb:



super glue is easy to remove. don't see the issue


----------



## trn

The Pook said:


> what warnings about super glue? that's how I do mine


Without doing a fancy multi-quote some of the discussions I took as warnings pasted below. Has anyone successfully removed an IHS re-attached with dots of superglue? I was originally interested in trying the Der8auer direct die mount but since I glued my IHS down maybe i'll just leave my lidded IHS alone.





why the heck you using super glue I hope not to reglue the IHS back on you will struggle to get it back off if the need arises I have heard even soaking in acetone for days won't make it budge then if you force it then it will rip some of the PCB off with the IHS

Only if you ever need to remove the IHS, you can do serious damage. As long as everything works you should be good.


I don't recommending glueing with Loctite, even the Super Gel version (the one they recommend in Rockit Cool), because it will leave a lot of white marks that I don't know how they appear and how to remove them, I also bought 100% Pure Acetone and even putting a lot and scratching with cotton it wasn't dissolving at all


----------



## The Pook

maybe it's because I'm using the cheap-o dollar store no-name super glue, but acetone removes it ez.

put some on a q-tip and spread it onto the glue and it literally falls apart.


----------



## kevindd992002

I haven't delidded my 8700K yet as I'm still in the process of building my system but I read that Loctite Super Gel is easy to remove with Acetone that's why I have it ready for relidding after delidding with Dr. Delid. And now I see these comments saying not to use it. There's just no conclusive answer to super glue vs RTV here


----------



## taowulf

I used clear RTV in small dabs on each corner, worked fine.


----------



## kevindd992002

taowulf said:


> I used clear RTV in small dabs on each corner, worked fine.


Right. But Super Glue should work just as fine. And it should be easily removable with Acetone.


----------



## taowulf

kevindd992002 said:


> Right. But Super Glue should work just as fine. And it should be easily removable with Acetone.


RTV scrapes off. Or don't glue it on at all.


----------



## kevindd992002

taowulf said:


> RTV scrapes off. Or don't glue it on at all.


Which you can also do with Super Glue, right?


----------



## taowulf

kevindd992002 said:


> Which you can also do with Super Glue, right?


Just mentioning options.


----------



## ViTosS

Well, I just said my opinion and what happened, I used Loctite Super Gel to glue my 7700k and when I tried to remove the glue using pure acetone it wasn't coming off completely and I was afraid to pop the IHS again using the tool and broke the PCB together, so I didn't open again and now using 8700k I only use RTV that is very easy to remove and if you use few quantity there is no gap and no difference between using RTV or going no glue/no RTV at all, I tested both methods.


----------



## AshBorer

the difference in temps is almost certainly due to the amount (thickness) of adhesive material used, rather than what the material is


----------



## ViTosS

AshBorer said:


> the difference in temps is almost certainly due to the amount (thickness) of adhesive material used, rather than what the material is


Certainly, if you apply very few RTV or use glue or nothing, the temps will be the same.


----------



## The Pook

can I get some info from you good sirs and gals? what's the difference (at load or at least high utilization) between your socket temp and your core temps? 

when you run a modified BIOS to base clock OC non-K Skylake CPUs on Z170 you lose the ability to monitor per-core temps and just get a package temp reading.

just delided my i7 6700 and temps dropped ~20-22c at the package but not sure how much hotter the package runs compare to the cores. I know it's not a good direct comparison but should be relatively close, no?


----------



## AshBorer

The Pook said:


> can I get some info from you good sirs and gals? what's the difference (at load or at least high utilization) between your socket temp and your core temps?
> 
> when you run a modified BIOS to base clock OC non-K Skylake CPUs on Z170 you lose the ability to monitor per-core temps and just get a package temp reading.
> 
> just delided my i7 6700 and temps dropped ~20-22c at the package but not sure how much hotter the package runs compare to the cores. I know it's not a good direct comparison but should be relatively close, no?



for my 7700k the package temp pretty much perfectly mirrors the temperature of whichever core is hottest at the time


----------



## Kryton

AshBorer said:


> for my 7700k the package temp pretty much perfectly mirrors the temperature of whichever core is hottest at the time


That's largely the case here too. 

As to thickness of the material used to reseal the lid, with RTV when you first apply it and set the lid on the excess will squish out. 
I tend to use a thin strip of it and once I have it on, I just place the CPU into the socket and once the CPU retainier has it, the RTV will cure and the lid will remain where it is. 

Also with RTV to unseal the lid is the same basic operation as the original delid, no need to worry about acetone or anything else along those lines BUT super glue is supposed to be dissolvable with it. 
I know guys that use a tiny drop on each corner/ two opposing corners and that's more than enough to resecure it. 

As for planned CPU use, I'd use the RTV all the way around period if using it for sub-zero benching, this way condensation will not get in and cause things to fry - Otherwise it's fine to use super glue as I described if you want.... Or just go with the RTV anyway.


----------



## The Pook

thanks guys! 1.405v and never seeing over ~74c in Cinebench :thumb:


----------



## Valgaur

WiSH2oo0 said:


> From this:
> 
> 
> 
> To this: There is a tool for every job.
> 
> Edit: So I was just reading a few posts. Did I fail again super gluing my IHS back on?
> 
> OCN name: WiSH2oo0
> CPU: Intel i7 8700k
> On die-TIM: Cool Laboratory Liquid Pro
> IHS-TIM: AS5
> Mhz gained: Untested
> OC after delid: Untested
> Temp drops: Untested
> Before delid: Untested
> 
> No before testing took place. I went right for the Delid tool and I'm not looking back.


You're In! :thumb: Slappa Dat Sig On! 

I exist, promise! Working through my Masters Thesis right now and life has been a little busy with wedding planning and all. I'll try to be faster than I have been the last few weeks. Apologies again everyone!

-Val


----------



## Martin778

Even though I'm on OCN I'd never buy a pre delidded CPU unless you can back it up with your reputation or you're a store like SL.
I'd rather get a stock one and delid it myself so I'm 100% it's been done well.


By the way, I've sent my broken i9 to the store I bought it from for RMA and according to them it works perfectly (which I am 1000% sure is a lie, they probably didn't even open the box) so I'm giving up on them, have no time for a court fight with lawyers etc.
How can I RMA it directly to Intel? I wonder if they crack them open nowadays?


----------



## The Pook

Why do you care if they crack it open? If you delided, warranty is gone regardless how they're gonna test it.


----------



## AshBorer

intel should have an enthusiast option for the already supposedly-enthusiast xxxxK series CPUs. Sell it without the IHS attached, you have to buy your own adhesive and thermal compound.


----------



## white owl

Martin778 said:


> Even though I'm on OCN I'd never buy a pre delidded CPU unless you can back it up with your reputation or you're a store like SL.
> I'd rather get a stock one and delid it myself so I'm 100% it's been done well.
> 
> 
> By the way, I've sent my broken i9 to the store I bought it from for RMA and according to them it works perfectly (which I am 1000% sure is a lie, they probably didn't even open the box) so I'm giving up on them, have no time for a court fight with lawyers etc.
> How can I RMA it directly to Intel? I wonder if they crack them open nowadays?


Contact customer support.
I'm not sure what info they can get from delidding one but if it's under warranty and died according to their terms for replacement, I doubt they'd bother knocking the lid off. They could though. 
Lol contact them with a different email address asking if delidding voids the warranty.


----------



## Martin778

It's obvious it does  However it's been done that way that probably even the designer won't see the difference.


----------



## nyk20z3

Looking to delid my 8700K and came across this kit after seeing a review on the copper ihs. I know i will need some sealant so what do you guys recommend ?


----------



## cyan

nyk20z3 said:


> Looking to delid my 8700K and came across this kit after seeing a review on the copper ihs. I know i will need some sealant so what do you guys recommend ?


I asked the same question few pages back.
3 options :
- don't put any glue, just let cpu retention hold the IHS. best temp
- use super glue, but I heard it's "hard" to remove it if you want to delid it again
- RTV silicone. usually a few degree higher temp than no glue option.


----------



## taowulf

nyk20z3 said:


> Looking to delid my 8700K and came across this kit after seeing a review on the copper ihs. I know i will need some sealant so what do you guys recommend ?



That is exactly what I used for my 8600k. I ended up with dabs of clear RTV sealant on the corners, although I could have easily have done without.


----------



## feznz

nyk20z3 said:


> Looking to delid my 8700K and came across this kit after seeing a review on the copper ihs. I know i will need some sealant so what do you guys recommend ?


looks good to me the review in the IHS did drop 3-4°C 
I am a cheapskate so just used what was at hand vice and wrench with a twist.
the LM is good same stuff I used brought it 5 years ago never had to reapply for the original 3770k delid and the LM was still good 5 years later for 8700k delid
could have used sealant of almost any description had several tubes laying around but just as easy to use none 
TBH I don't plan on removing the CPU from this motherboard again I am more likely to upgrade whole motherboard and CPU in 3-4 years maybe but still I don't see any reason to remove this CPU from the motherboard again.


----------



## white owl

That's my point of view too.
Why would you remove your CPU once it's in?

After the delid I did take it out once to verify that the LM was as good as it would get. No changes so it's stayed that way for 2 years or so now. 
Hell it's running faster now that it ever has. XD


----------



## ssateneth

Has anyone run coffee lake CPUs naked? There are a number of "Delid Die Guard" devices that say they fix the CPU to the LGA1151 socket without the clamshell retention mechanism and instead hold the CPU down directly with a shim-like cover around the die edges, leavign the die exposed to whatever cooling solution you want. But I'm worried about the height of the CPU die not being high enough. Any thoughts?


----------



## white owl

From what I've seen going direct die doesn't do much. Maybe a custom loop on a naked CPU might give it a little more head room but there is probably a solution from EK. I know there was for past CPUs.
You needed the naked kit plus a block for it to work.


----------



## feznz

white owl said:


> From what I've seen going direct die doesn't do much. Maybe a custom loop on a naked CPU might give it a little more head room but there is probably a solution from EK. I know there was for past CPUs.
> You needed the naked kit plus a block for it to work.



I would agree with you generally a few degrees cooler but other than that no real world advantage also the need for nickel plated blocks for LM


----------



## TwilightRavens

Bit late to the party but here goes nothing.

OCN username:TwilightRavens
CPU: Intel Core i7-5775C (Stock clock is 3.3GHz) (Broadwell)
Motherboard: ASUS Z97-E/USB 3.1 (LGA 1150)
Delid TIM: Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra
TIM on IHS: (whatever the stock stuff is on the Corsair H100i v2) I seriously don't remember what brand it is
Original overclock was 4.2GHz, after delid I hit 4.4ghz, so basically 1.1GHz overclock from stock, or I gained 200MHz from delid whichever you prefer.
At 4.2GHz dropped from 69C to 48C, at 4.4GHz went from 89c to hottest core being 78C (rest are in the high 60's low 70's)
Pictures for proof see here.
Validation in sig, click Project Broadwell.


----------



## kelun1

hi to all the pros!






i just saw the above video, worth to try for x5680?


----------



## white owl

What does worth it mean?
If you want more OC or thermal headroom then I'd say yes.
I used a drill press vise on my 4690k and it as much easier than I'd expected. With the thinner PCB on Skylake it's more risky. It can still be done without buying a $30 tool if you clamp the PCB tight in the vise and twist the IHS off with a crescent wrench.


----------



## kelun1

white owl said:


> What does worth it mean?
> If you want more OC or thermal headroom then I'd say yes.
> I used a drill press vise on my 4690k and it as much easier than I'd expected. With the thinner PCB on Skylake it's more risky. It can still be done without buying a $30 tool if you clamp the PCB tight in the vise and twist the IHS off with a crescent wrench.


sorry please pardon me. 

what i mean is from what i checked online, it was mentioned that x5680 and 5690 are all soldered on chips. therefore i have this question. 

if i use a vice, i will rip off the solder and the chip right?


----------



## TwilightRavens

kelun1 said:


> sorry please pardon me.
> 
> what i mean is from what i checked online, it was mentioned that x5680 and 5690 are all soldered on chips. therefore i have this question.
> 
> if i use a vice, i will rip off the solder and the chip right?


Probably, but didn’t der8auer delid a 6950X? and that is soldered. 




I know that’s a different chip but maybe it will help.


----------



## white owl

It it's a soldered CPU then no, the solder is better. If your core temps are whacky just RMA it.

Sure it can be done but unless there's a 20c drop I don't see much point.


----------



## saberkick

Well I've asked this on another thread and I'll ask here again so here it is:

I'm planning to delid my 7700k, using a razor blade and I won't put any glue to seal the IHS back, it will just be secured with the socket.

My main concern is about if I should or should NOT put Liquid Metal (conductonaut) on the backside of the IHS as well, or if it's enough on the die only.

Thanks very much !


----------



## white owl

I'm the same guy in the thread you started. Do it if you want, or don't. It's not like you can't pull it out and try again if you aren't happy.

I recall doing this 3 times after I delidded trying to get cores 1 and 2 as cool as 0 and 3 but no matter what I did there was no difference. The only thing that can screw you is not using enough, not spreading it out, not clearing the caps or using way too much. Also the razor blade method is very sketchy, it's easy to cut into the caps or gouge the PCB. If you don't want to buy the tool just put the IHS in a vise then tighten a crescent wrench around the PCB as tight as you can and twist it off.


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> I'm the same guy in the thread you started. Do it if you want, or don't. It's not like you can't pull it out and try again if you aren't happy.
> 
> I recall doing this 3 times after I delidded trying to get cores 1 and 2 as cool as 0 and 3 but no matter what I did there was no difference. The only thing that can screw you is not using enough, not spreading it out, not clearing the caps or using way too much. Also the razor blade method is very sketchy, it's easy to cut into the caps or gouge the PCB. If you don't want to buy the tool just put the IHS in a vise then tighten a crescent wrench around the PCB as tight as you can and twist it off.


How do you even know that the amount you put in the CPU is already "enough"?


----------



## white owl

Paint that crap on the die till you have a nice even coat. Hold the CPU vertically with the die up and down, if you have big blobs dripping down you need to remove a tiny bit, spread and repeat till you have a die that's totally covered. It's ok to have a little extra but you don't want to little. If you've cleared the caps that tiny bit of extra won't hurt anything. I actually start putting the IHS down with the cap side lower so the extra pushes off the other side.

It's really not a huge deal if you use too little or too much, if you aren't satisfied just take the lid back off and try again. I've taken my CPU out after a few days and had the lid come off then just put it back where it was and temps were the same. This CPU probably got messed with 3 or 4 times before I left it alone for 2+ years. Just decided to redo it with Conductonaut and between cleaning all the trash out of my cooler and using a different paste on the IHS I only dropped 1-2c if any.


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> Paint that crap on the die till you have a nice even coat. Hold the CPU vertically with the die up and down, if you have big blobs dripping down you need to remove a tiny bit, spread and repeat till you have a die that's totally covered. It's ok to have a little extra but you don't want to little. If you've cleared the caps that tiny bit of extra won't hurt anything. I actually start putting the IHS down with the cap side lower so the extra pushes off the other side.
> 
> It's really not a huge deal if you use too little or too much, if you aren't satisfied just take the lid back off and try again. I've taken my CPU out after a few days and had the lid come off then just put it back where it was and temps were the same. This CPU probably got messed with 3 or 4 times before I left it alone for 2+ years. Just decided to redo it with Conductonaut and between cleaning all the trash out of my cooler and using a different paste on the IHS I only dropped 1-2c if any.


A couple of clarifications:

1) What do you by "with the die up and down" while holding the CPU vertically? The die will sit vertically (obviously) when you hold it vertically so what is "die up" and "die down" in this case? 
2) Are you saying that if there are big blobs dripping down, I should catch those blobs and re-spread them to the die?
3) What do you mean by "clear the caps"? I know the caps need to be either painted with clear nail polish coat or use gold tape to isolate them. Is this what you meant by "clearing"?

* I will be gluing back the IHS with super glue after doing all this, just so you guys know.
* Well, if one can do it for just one time then that's super. It's harder to take the CPU out when you're doing a custom watercooling loop especially if it's just a mid tower, you know


----------



## saberkick

I do also have a custon watercooling loop so removing my cpu might not be that easy, and I'll delid now cause I'll soon change the water and clean up everything in my case.

What cpu do you have kevindd992002 ? The 7700k doesn't have any caps around the die so I guess it's safer.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Personally when I delidded my Broadwell I did liquid metal on the die’s and on the backside of the IHS and it works fine for me, just make sure you don’t put too much on to where when you put the IHS back on that excess will squeeze out onto the pcb, painted transistors or not its good to not have it do it either way.


----------



## white owl

Having the CPU vertical has noting to do with how the die is turned. The die could be left to right on a vertical CPU or it could be up and down with a vertical CPU.

You remove the excess...the word remove is in there.

Yes clearing over the caps means putting the clear over the caps.

Why would you glue it back down with super glue of all things? Or glue it at all? If you do that you'll need to knock the lid off to do any changes...and superglue? You ever see the nasty residue it leaves behind? If you had to glue one using the tiny layer of silicone would be the way but I'm still not sure why you'd want to delid it again if you needed to change anything.
But it really doesn't matter to me, it's your stuff.

With all the guides out there this is a super easy process once you get the lid off. Using enough liquid metal is your main concern, it should look like a nice puddle on the die without rolling off when tilted. Also be careful when you glue it...too much glue will put the gap back in there. I guess if you're using super glue that won't happen if you act really fast and get it squared up and under pressure before it gets hard but I can't imagine having to delid one twice, it was scary enough the first time with the vise lol. Knowing my luck the glue would rip the PCB off with it.

Like twilight said, you can do it either way (I have) you just don't want way too much on there.


----------



## rfarmer

Also you can seriously damage the pcb removing the IHS again using super glue, possibly enough to ruin your CPU.


----------



## white owl

That was my thoughts on superglue. The silicone is soft so it gives a little, super glue is hard af.


----------



## TwilightRavens

This is what I used to "glue" mine back together, probably the closest thing that you'll find to what Intel uses: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002UEN1U/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It has not given me any issues, this is also what Silicon Lottery uses in their delid service.


----------



## white owl

Yeah RTV Silicone is what's supposed to be used there and it wouldn't surprise me if AMD and Intel use the same formula to seal them up. You can get it at any hardware or parts store, even Walmart.
If you must seal it that's the stuff. I prefer to not seal it until it's at least been tested once so you know the temps are as good as can be and when you do, spread it very thin and use the clamping force of the delidding tool or the socket. Steve at GN said he uses the socket.


----------



## kevindd992002

saberkick said:


> I do also have a custon watercooling loop so removing my cpu might not be that easy, and I'll delid now cause I'll soon change the water and clean up everything in my case.
> 
> What cpu do you have kevindd992002 ? The 7700k doesn't have any caps around the die so I guess it's safer.


I have the 8700K so caps are definitely there.



white owl said:


> Having the CPU vertical has noting to do with how the die is turned. The die could be left to right on a vertical CPU or it could be up and down with a vertical CPU.
> 
> You remove the excess...the word remove is in there.
> 
> Yes clearing over the caps means putting the clear over the caps.
> 
> Why would you glue it back down with super glue of all things? Or glue it at all? If you do that you'll need to knock the lid off to do any changes...and superglue? You ever see the nasty residue it leaves behind? If you had to glue one using the tiny layer of silicone would be the way but I'm still not sure why you'd want to delid it again if you needed to change anything.
> But it really doesn't matter to me, it's your stuff.
> 
> With all the guides out there this is a super easy process once you get the lid off. Using enough liquid metal is your main concern, it should look like a nice puddle on the die without rolling off when tilted. Also be careful when you glue it...too much glue will put the gap back in there. I guess if you're using super glue that won't happen if you act really fast and get it squared up and under pressure before it gets hard but I can't imagine having to delid one twice, it was scary enough the first time with the vise lol. Knowing my luck the glue would rip the PCB off with it.
> 
> Like twilight said, you can do it either way (I have) you just don't want way too much on there.





rfarmer said:


> Also you can seriously damage the pcb removing the IHS again using super glue, possibly enough to ruin your CPU.


So what do you mean by the die being up and down in a vertical CPU then? I understand left and right but how can it be up and down when the die is in the center of the board when it is either vertical or horizontal?

Got it, so remove the excess and then spread the remaining until you don't have any blob dripping over, correct?

There has been this never-ending debate between using Superglue and RTV Silicone when resealing. It's just one of those things that have two sides. What I've read here is that RTV Silicone creates more gap than when using Superglue. And superglue can always be removed easily with Acetone. This is why I'm choosing to go with it. Again, expectedly there would be both supporters and haters of using superglue. This is why I'm laying down my plan here, so that everyone can try and pitch their ideas/reactions in. I know you don't care about my stuff but since you're helping us out, of course I'm open to any fresh ideas


----------



## white owl

RTV doesn't make a gap unless you use too much, GN did all the testing and there wan't really a difference between a thin layer and nothing. Might have been 1 or 2c but you can make that difference with thermal paste too.

The PCB can be held vertically with the die vertical or horizontal, hence me saying up and down instead of vertical twice.

But yeah I remove the excess and spread until the whole die looks like a puddle. I've seen others remove more until it looks like crumpled foil but since I don't paint the IHS and the only way you can really mess it up is to use too little I prefer the even puddle look.

Another thing about super glue is the dry time, if I had to do it that way I'd put the CPU together and get it in the socket then just put a tiny bit on each corner of the IHS. If you spread it thin under there there is a good chance you'll only get one shot putting the IHS down and in my experience the surface tension of the LM is enough to push the IHS to the side if you put it down square.

I'm still an avid fan of using nothing, I'd have never though I'd get back under the lid but after seeing it 2 years later I'm glad I did. The CPU probably didn't care though haha.


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> RTV doesn't make a gap unless you use too much, GN did all the testing and there wan't really a difference between a thin layer and nothing. Might have been 1 or 2c but you can make that difference with thermal paste too.
> 
> The PCB can be held vertically with the die vertical or horizontal, hence me saying up and down instead of vertical twice.
> 
> But yeah I remove the excess and spread until the whole die looks like a puddle. I've seen others remove more until it looks like crumpled foil but since I don't paint the IHS and the only way you can really mess it up is to use too little I prefer the even puddle look.
> 
> Another thing about super glue is the dry time, if I had to do it that way I'd put the CPU together and get it in the socket then just put a tiny bit on each corner of the IHS. If you spread it thin under there there is a good chance you'll only get one shot putting the IHS down and in my experience the surface tension of the LM is enough to push the IHS to the side if you put it down square.
> 
> I'm still an avid fan of using nothing, I'd have never though I'd get back under the lid but after seeing it 2 years later I'm glad I did. The CPU probably didn't care though haha.


Dammit, now I'm not sure if I want to use RTV silicone or just superglue (Loctite since I already bought it). I guess it's just a matter of choice.

Ah I see what you're saying about up and down now.

So if you end up with the even puddle look and then still the paint the IHS, will that be too much already?

Yes, that makes sense about the super glue. Although I have the Dr. Delid kit and it comes with the mechanism of re-lidding the CPU so no issues with that.


----------



## white owl

I doubt it would be too much, I just prefer to use as little as possible because it goes much faster than you'd think. As long as it isn't just piled up everywhere you'll be fine just make sure to clear over those caps and still avoid contact with them.
If you can't make up your mind on how to glue it down and you've never done one just try it without gluing it. There's no risk if you think about what you're doing, I lay my rig on it's side so there's no possibility of it falling out but that may be different if you have a WC loop. I have taken it out upright by resting my finger on the lid as I released the tension arm, that worked pretty well too. Putting it back in is a different story lol.


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> I doubt it would be too much, I just prefer to use as little as possible because it goes much faster than you'd think. As long as it isn't just piled up everywhere you'll be fine just make sure to clear over those caps and still avoid contact with them.
> If you can't make up your mind on how to glue it down and you've never done one just try it without gluing it. There's no risk if you think about what you're doing, I lay my rig on it's side so there's no possibility of it falling out but that may be different if you have a WC loop. I have taken it out upright by resting my finger on the lid as I released the tension arm, that worked pretty well too. Putting it back in is a different story lol.


I see. Do you like misalign the IHS intentionally to compensate for when it slides while locking it into place with the CPU retention brackets?


----------



## white owl

Nah, the slider doesn't push against the CPU very hard so you can square it up with the retainer thing down then hold the IHS with your finger as you tighten the lever.

Step by step:
Lay the case down
Place the PCB part in the socket [carefully!]
Place the IHS squared up on the PCB, it will slide a little so just slide it till you're happy
Close the clamp part over the IHS but don't tighten it yet
Square it up again then press your finger down in the middle of the IHS so it won't slide
Tighten the lever while watching the IHS, you can open, adjust, close, repeat till you're happy but I usually get it on the first try
If you think it's just slightly out of square don't worry about it, the IHS will do just as good if it's a tiny bit twisted or a little high/low

IMO if the RockIt IHS looks pretty cool, I'd try it if I had a newer CPU.


----------



## urbanman2004

saberkick said:


> Well I've asked this on another thread and I'll ask here again so here it is:
> 
> I'm planning to delid my 7700k, using a razor blade and I won't put any glue to seal the IHS back, it will just be secured with the socket.
> 
> My main concern is about if I should or should NOT put Liquid Metal (conductonaut) on the backside of the IHS as well, or if it's enough on the die only.
> 
> Thanks very much !


https://hardforum.com/threads/my-first-g5-mod-atx.1815956/

If you scroll down, you'll see where I delidded my i7-4770K which I didn't glue to seal back the IHS. Happy delidding


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> Nah, the slider doesn't push against the CPU very hard so you can square it up with the retainer thing down then hold the IHS with your finger as you tighten the lever.
> 
> Step by step:
> Lay the case down
> Place the PCB part in the socket [carefully!]
> Place the IHS squared up on the PCB, it will slide a little so just slide it till you're happy
> Close the clamp part over the IHS but don't tighten it yet
> Square it up again then press your finger down in the middle of the IHS so it won't slide
> Tighten the lever while watching the IHS, you can open, adjust, close, repeat till you're happy but I usually get it on the first try
> If you think it's just slightly out of square don't worry about it, the IHS will do just as good if it's a tiny bit twisted or a little high/low
> 
> IMO if the RockIt IHS looks pretty cool, I'd try it if I had a newer CPU.


I see. Can I still use the CPU holder (comes with the ASUS Maximus X Code) on the CPU though? Does it even matter when you delid without relidding?


----------



## white owl

Not sure what that is or what it does.


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> Nah, the slider doesn't push against the CPU very hard so you can square it up with the retainer thing down then hold the IHS with your finger as you tighten the lever.
> 
> Step by step:
> Lay the case down
> Place the PCB part in the socket [carefully!]
> Place the IHS squared up on the PCB, it will slide a little so just slide it till you're happy
> Close the clamp part over the IHS but don't tighten it yet
> Square it up again then press your finger down in the middle of the IHS so it won't slide
> Tighten the lever while watching the IHS, you can open, adjust, close, repeat till you're happy but I usually get it on the first try
> If you think it's just slightly out of square don't worry about it, the IHS will do just as good if it's a tiny bit twisted or a little high/low
> 
> IMO if the RockIt IHS looks pretty cool, I'd try it if I had a newer CPU.





white owl said:


> Not sure what that is or what it does.


Here's what it does:

https://rog.asus.com/articles/guides/quick-guide-asus-cpu-installation-tool/


----------



## white owl

It would work with a delidded CPU as you haven't added or removed anything externally, the dimensions remain the same. I'm not sure how using it is any easier than just sitting the CPU in the socket though, you just sit the thing in there. How many people called customer service for them to make that? "Can you help me, I can't figure out how my CPU goes in the thing...should it be standing up or flipped over? Maybe it goes in one of these long slot things!"


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> It would work with a delidded CPU as you haven't added or removed anything externally, the dimensions remain the same. I'm not sure how using it is any easier than just sitting the CPU in the socket though, you just sit the thing in there. How many people called customer service for them to make that? "Can you help me, I can't figure out how my CPU goes in the thing...should it be standing up or flipped over? Maybe it goes in one of these long slot things!"


I know. I just put it anyway for the heck of it. It's there so why not use it, right  I'm just wondering if it would make things easier for a delidded CPU that is not re-lidded. Would it keep the IHS from moving, or something like that. I'm just not confident in a un-relidded CPU but I guess I have to try it for myself first.


----------



## white owl

I don't think there would be any difference. The whole thing is really easy, getting the lid off was always the scary part. With Haswell we had a thick PCB so pushing it off with a vise wasn't nearly as scary as what it would be now. If you have the tool there really isn't much that can go wrong. De8aur lapped the die on an Intel CPU and it lived on to have more even core temps, you'll be fine.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Edit: Ignore, posted in wrong thread.


----------



## RichKnecht

Just reading through this thread and when I delidded my 7900X, I decided not to reglue the IHS down and rely on the locking mechanism to keep the IHS in place. Worked just fine. I'm glad I did it this way as I am getting ready to remove the IHS once again and install a Direct Die Frame to eliminate the IHS altogether. According to DerBauer, the frame should net me a few more degrees. We'll see how that goes.


----------



## Sedril

RichKnecht said:


> Just reading through this thread and when I delidded my 7900X, I decided not to reglue the IHS down and rely on the locking mechanism to keep the IHS in place. Worked just fine. I'm glad I did it this way as I am getting ready to remove the IHS once again and install a Direct Die Frame to eliminate the IHS altogether. According to DerBauer, the frame should net me a few more degrees. We'll see how that goes.


I would love to know how that works out for you... I can definitely see an advantage to bare die cooling, but I've always been too scared to try it... Plus it seems like there isn't a lot of adapters to help you line it up perfectly... When I did my delid I put a small dot of RTV in each corner, just enough to hold it in place so nothing moves, but not enough to create extra gap or anything... Always concerned that the IHS would slide or move and liquid metal would get off the die... 

Let us know how it goes, what frame are you using?


----------



## RichKnecht

Sedril said:


> I would love to know how that works out for you... I can definitely see an advantage to bare die cooling, but I've always been too scared to try it... Plus it seems like there isn't a lot of adapters to help you line it up perfectly... When I did my delid I put a small dot of RTV in each corner, just enough to hold it in place so nothing moves, but not enough to create extra gap or anything... Always concerned that the IHS would slide or move and liquid metal would get off the die...
> 
> Let us know how it goes, what frame are you using?


Using DerBauer's Direct Die Frame. Workmanship looks amazing. I'll be doing it tonight or tomorrow so I will repost with my results.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Sedril said:


> I would love to know how that works out for you... I can definitely see an advantage to bare die cooling, but I've always been too scared to try it... Plus it seems like there isn't a lot of adapters to help you line it up perfectly... When I did my delid I put a small dot of RTV in each corner, just enough to hold it in place so nothing moves, but not enough to create extra gap or anything... Always concerned that the IHS would slide or move and liquid metal would get off the die...
> 
> Let us know how it goes, what frame are you using?



I too would like to know what frame that is so maybe I can find a similar one for my 1150 socket.


----------



## RichKnecht

TwilightRavens said:


> I too would like to know what frame that is so maybe I can find a similar one for my 1150 socket.


Here is the link to what I bought:

http://www.performance-pcs.com/der8auer-skylake-x-direct-die-frame.html


----------



## mouacyk

> This inconspicuous component unlocks a world of possibilities when it comes to CPU performance enhancement...


.

Yeah folks, it's not the delid.


----------



## white owl

Both are true.


----------



## RichKnecht

Tried the frame 3 times today. I just could not get it to work properly. First time it booted, but went right into thermal shutdown. Took it apart, remounted, checked screw tightness, and then it wouldn't post. Did that twice and gave up and remounted the chip with the IHS (unglued) as it was before.


----------



## Sedril

RichKnecht said:


> Tried the frame 3 times today. I just could not get it to work properly. First time it booted, but went right into thermal shutdown. Took it apart, remounted, checked screw tightness, and then it wouldn't post. Did that twice and gave up and remounted the chip with the IHS (unglued) as it was before.


Do you have to remove the CPU holder to go bare die? I haven't tried it yet but I've been more tempted lately... Maybe the holder is keeping it from making correct contact? Sure seems like there should be more support for running bare die, that has to be the best cooling possible... Makes me nervous to try tho when I see others struggling with it...


----------



## RichKnecht

Sedril said:


> Do you have to remove the CPU holder to go bare die? I haven't tried it yet but I've been more tempted lately... Maybe the holder is keeping it from making correct contact? Sure seems like there should be more support for running bare die, that has to be the best cooling possible... Makes me nervous to try tho when I see others struggling with it...


Yes, the locking CPU holder and its back plate need to be removed. The die frame has its own back palte and screw that hold everything together. I was pretty disappointed that I could not get this to work.


----------



## white owl

Afaik the only way to really do it is with custom loops. They make a safe bare die block and EK makes kits where you remove the retainer and replace it with 4 pegs which support the block so you aren't pushing the CPU. The purpose made blocks are very impressive.

I just wish some one would make something so I could put a tower cooler on one. If I had a cheap board and a cheap coffee chip I could make one but I'm not risking it on my own stuff. I'm still on devils canyon if that tells you anything lol.


----------



## TwilightRavens

white owl said:


> Afaik the only way to really do it is with custom loops. They make a safe bare die block and EK makes kits where you remove the retainer and replace it with 4 pegs which support the block so you aren't pushing the CPU. The purpose made blocks are very impressive.
> 
> I just wish some one would make something so I could put a tower cooler on one. If I had a cheap board and a cheap coffee chip I could make one but I'm not risking it on my own stuff. I'm still on devils canyon if that tells you anything lol.


I'm actually half tempted to 3D print one for Haswell and/or Broadwell, but if CLU hardens like solder then that would be awesome and I probably wouldn't even need to go bare die anyway. Plus it would probably have to be two seperate mounts even though its the same socket, definitely something to think on to see if there is a way that I could indeed make it a universal design.

-Edit: To clarify I meant the bare die thing that is for Skylake-X, except for Z97, Z87 etc.


----------



## white owl

Broadwell and haswell are on the same board so it should work. But yeah a little 3d printer experiment should yield an air cooled die mount.


----------



## TwilightRavens

white owl said:


> Broadwell and haswell are on the same board so it should work. But yeah a little 3d printer experiment should yield an air cooled die mount.


Same board yeah, but two totally different die layouts and sizes.


----------



## white owl

TwilightRavens said:


> Same board yeah, but two totally different die layouts and sizes.


If the IHS is the same it should work. The coolers and boards already interchange so unless one HS is thicker or something it should be the same.


----------



## Loladinas

white owl said:


> Afaik the only way to really do it is with custom loops. They make a safe bare die block and EK makes kits where you remove the retainer and replace it with 4 pegs which support the block so you aren't pushing the CPU. The purpose made blocks are very impressive.
> 
> I just wish some one would make something so I could put a tower cooler on one. If I had a cheap board and a cheap coffee chip I could make one but I'm not risking it on my own stuff. I'm still on devils canyon if that tells you anything lol.


Mate, I've got a NH-D14 sitting on my bare die 3770k, currently waiting for another die guard to do the same to my 4790k. Mounting pressure is not an issue if you take your time and be smart about it. Measure everything and use appropriate thickness washers. Temperature difference isn't drastic, in my case it was like 3C.


----------



## white owl

I've seen it make a 10c difference on water vs delidded so tha't pretty disappointing lol.
I knew about the die guards but what do you do to make up for the gap when you remove the IHS? My cooler will only screw in so far. Do you just ditch the factory hardware and bolt it on?


----------



## TwilightRavens

white owl said:


> I've seen it make a 10c difference on water vs delidded so tha't pretty disappointing lol.
> I knew about the die guards but what do you do to make up for the gap when you remove the IHS? My cooler will only screw in so far. Do you just ditch the factory hardware and bolt it on?


Yeah I believe you bolt it down without the retention bracket, otherwise I can't see it working like you said.


----------



## white owl

Yeah you ditch the bracket but I don't know how to mount the cooler lower. The die guard just keeps you from crushing the die but the socket and CPU are in the same place. All the coolers are made with the IHS in mind and there would be a gap left when you remove it.
The springs may be enough to make up that gap though.
Direct die plus die lapping could get you a pretty good drop with a perfect spread across the cores.


----------



## Loladinas

white owl said:


> I've seen it make a 10c difference on water vs delidded so tha't pretty disappointing lol.
> I knew about the die guards but what do you do to make up for the gap when you remove the IHS? My cooler will only screw in so far. Do you just ditch the factory hardware and bolt it on?


In my use case it was rather simple, I only had to use 2mm washers on the backside of the motherboard to shorten the mounting posts and lower the entire NH-D14 retention mechanism.
Maybe the small temperature difference is due to relatively low mounting pressure (I didn't want to overtighten) and there simply not being a lot of heat to begin with. It's only cooling a 3770k running at 4.4Ghz, at like 1.172v. As it is now the hottest core is barely reaching 30C above air intake temperature under P95 FFT 1344. I also have a rather large difference in temperature between cores themselves, hottest to coldest is about 8-10C difference. The difference has always been there. Before delid, after delid, running bare die, multiple coolers, re-mounts, re-pastes... Which kind of makes me believe that the die itself is uneven. der8auer recently published his video of lapping a 7920x, but I'm definitely not there yet.


Code:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnd2LO0IBic


----------



## kc5vdj

Just got my i7-8086K... All I have to say is THIS is lame: https://click.intel.com/tuningplan/purchase-a-plan


----------



## white owl

What's a plan and what is it's relation to delidding?


----------



## Loladinas

white owl said:


> What's a plan and what is it's relation to delidding?


A no questions asked warranty, even if YOU break it overclocking, basically.


----------



## white owl

Oh that's cool. Delidding is pretty safe though IMO and so is overclocking.
I'd buy it if I were planning on using my CPU on a daily suicide run lol.


----------



## kc5vdj

white owl said:


> Oh that's cool. Delidding is pretty safe though IMO and so is overclocking.
> I'd buy it if I were planning on using my CPU on a daily suicide run lol.


heheheh. it's just a feel good thing to people who think they might cause damage. it gives you one free replacement chip under the plan, should you overdo something and kill a chip. i've been delidded since 2015, without issue, but I still would like the insurance.


----------



## merlin__36

So i delidded the I7-8700k and it seemed fine for two days then I transported the pc to another location and i noticed that it wouldn't boot into bios with a red CPU led indicator after moving to the new location.

Looking at my ReLid job it's not perfectly square so i am probably going to delid it again and get it square also i ended up bending some pins inside the socket when I tried to put a plastic insert in the wrong way instead of on top of the CPU mount.... ugg.

I see some marks on the edge of the metal cover showing from the latch clamping on them.

How does the Liquid Metal look?


----------



## merlin__36

Bent most the pins back looks good but i can still see a difference on height on three pins.

cleaned up that liquid metal that was dripping over i didn't mess with the liquid metal on the lid.


----------



## merlin__36

Still no good the CPU Indicator LED on my Motherboard is still red even after the Relid and bending the pins back. Wonder if it's really the CPU or the Motherboard?


----------



## white owl

Plastic insert? What on earth?
Not sure shoving anything around the socket with the CPU is a great idea to begin with.

Since you had the delid and bent pins at the same time then you moved it after it was working, it's kinda hard to say what might have happened.

The IHS doesn't need to be perfect just close. You can just let off the lever to square it up then hold your finger on it while you put tension on it.

Do you have any CPUs you could try to see which is the problem?

Edit: the LM application was good the first time but you should remove the silicon. The main benefit with delidding is getting rid of that to lower the IHS over the die.


----------



## TwilightRavens

white owl said:


> Plastic insert? What on earth?
> Not sure shoving anything around the socket with the CPU is a great idea to begin with.
> 
> Since you had the delid and bent pins at the same time then you moved it after it was working, it's kinda hard to say what might have happened.
> 
> The IHS doesn't need to be perfect just close. You can just let off the lever to square it up then hold your finger on it while you put tension on it.
> 
> Do you have any CPUs you could try to see which is the problem?
> 
> Edit: the LM application was good the first time but you should remove the silicon. The main benefit with delidding is getting rid of that to lower the IHS over the die.


Yeah you just use as little as possible of the silicone sealant, i dabbed just a tiny bit of it around the edges of the IHS with a toothpick, really that thin amount is more than enough to hold the IHS together. You can also go the way of not sealing it on but that is a method I highly recommend against unless you plan to take it out of the socket frequently, where as I don’t really plan to take mine off unless my H100i dies for some odd reason, so I sealed mine down and haven’t had any issues.


----------



## merlin__36

Hahaha yeah, apparently it wasn't an insert but a protective cover that snaps on top of the motherboard socket. 
I don't have another Processor to test but wish I did. I sent the Processor back for a refund since it's only a few weeks old.

The Silicon you are referring to is the gasket sealant I put on the outer edges? Maybe next Processor delid i will try to use less.



white owl said:


> Plastic insert? What on earth?
> Not sure shoving anything around the socket with the CPU is a great idea to begin with.
> 
> Since you had the delid and bent pins at the same time then you moved it after it was working, it's kinda hard to say what might have happened.
> 
> The IHS doesn't need to be perfect just close. You can just let off the lever to square it up then hold your finger on it while you put tension on it.
> 
> Do you have any CPUs you could try to see which is the problem?
> 
> Edit: the LM application was good the first time but you should remove the silicon. The main benefit with delidding is getting rid of that to lower the IHS over the die.


----------



## white owl

Oh my bad I hadn't realized you sealed it back up.


----------



## Spiriva

I delided my 8700k when I bought in Nov-17, yesterday I got my new 8086k and delided it too. Anyhow I gave my 8700k away but before I did that I tought I was gonna check the liquid metal on it, and replace it for some new. This is how it looks after 7 months of use, cpu was running at 5.2ghz, 1.420V, 24/7:









Still very liquid.









All old liquid metal removed









I masked of the die/ihs with tape to make sure not to spill over.









Applied the new liquid metal.









Tape removed, im happy with the result.









Ready for shipping


----------



## white owl

I ran my chip under LM for about 2 years and when I took the lid back off a month or so ago it looked horrible. Cleaned it (needed to scrub the IHS with steel wool) then put it back together. after doing that, cleaning the gobs of crap out of my cooler and switching from AS5 to MX5 dropped a whopping 1c across each core lol. Room temp could have just as easily dropped too.
Any degradation from the voltage?


----------



## merlin__36

white owl said:


> Oh my bad I hadn't realized you sealed it back up.


Yeah, it seemed happy for the first 48 hrs before I moved the pc i was letting it run to test the heat until the SSD showed up in the mail to finish the build. Was only running it at 4.8ghz @60c 1.280v 0 avx. With the Asus Motherboard Automatic overclock for custom water cooling it was at 5.150 72c-75c Not sure the voltage. 


Well i sent the Processor back yesterday let's see if they replace it. I am tired of waiting it took the fella 3 weeks to send me a 970 evo drive for this build so i just ordered another 8700k from the same company I really need to find out if the CPU was the issue or the board but the CPU is the easiest piece in the build to swap instead of pulling the Custom loop out to send the motherboard in.


----------



## white owl

You used auto OC? I doubt that killed it but it's a generally bad idea due to the board having preset voltage that it's dumping into the CPU which gets even higher under stress. 
No one has ever recommended that feature lol.


----------



## merlin__36

Yeah, your right about that definitely uses higher voltages with the Automatic overclock settings but I really just tested it too see what the Auto would be vs my Manual clock. I generally like to under volt and find the best starting point and make a profile for ea additional Leap in overclock. 

I hope that it was simple like it died from Auto overclock voltages hahaha! That is much preferred than swapping out the MOBO.

I ran the CPU in auto for maybe 30 min - 1 hr seen temps in the 72c-75c didn't like it so I went on a 48 hr test on my 4.8ghz clock 1.280v Didn't seem to get above 60c.

The good news is the PC isn't 30 days old.


----------



## kevindd992002

merlin__36 said:


> So i delidded the I7-8700k and it seemed fine for two days then I transported the pc to another location and i noticed that it wouldn't boot into bios with a red CPU led indicator after moving to the new location.
> 
> Looking at my ReLid job it's not perfectly square so i am probably going to delid it again and get it square also i ended up bending some pins inside the socket when I tried to put a plastic insert in the wrong way instead of on top of the CPU mount.... ugg.
> 
> I see some marks on the edge of the metal cover showing from the latch clamping on them.
> 
> How does the Liquid Metal look?





merlin__36 said:


> Hahaha yeah, apparently it wasn't an insert but a protective cover that snaps on top of the motherboard socket.
> I don't have another Processor to test but wish I did. I sent the Processor back for a refund since it's only a few weeks old.
> 
> The Silicon you are referring to is the gasket sealant I put on the outer edges? Maybe next Processor delid i will try to use less.


What was that "plastic" you were referring to? Isn't it like the plastic installation tool from ASUS boards: https://rog.asus.com/articles/guides/quick-guide-asus-cpu-installation-tool/ ?


----------



## white owl

I really don't understand those things. It's the most user friendly socket ever, if someone couldn't install the CPU I doubt a plastic guide would help.


----------



## stephenn82

I used the insert tool that Asus gave me. It has alignment marks on it just as a cpu socket/cpu does, the little arrow mark. I used it, why not? lol I havent had any issues...been in my rig since built Nov '16 and when I delidded last summer.


----------



## fireedo

hi,
2 days ago I recieved my 8700K and gigabyte Aorus Z370 gaming 5, despite I already have 7820x still tempted to use this 8700K CPU, so long story short, I move everything to my new cpu.
and last night I found that I only can push my 8700K to 4.9 Ghz with 1.335v tested with prime95 small fft for 2 hours and passed, couple times spamming with Cinebench too, but with the highest temp is 95 C. While gaming my temp are about 72 C.
I'm using a Corsair H115i AIO. My room temperature is about 27-28 C (I live in a rather hot country)
So do I need to delid? will it give me a headroom to do 5.0 Ghz ? (I have tested 5.0Ghz can run cinebench with 1.415v but I wont stress it because of high temp)


----------



## white owl

Firstly 4.9Ghz is great for 1.33v so congrats on that.
Since you have an AIO you should verify that the mount is giving enough pressure to remove the heat from the CPU. Turn your screen towards your PC so you can see the temps change when you push on the block, I and everyone else recommend HWinfo for this and everything else really.
If adding a bit of pressure with your hand doesn't do anything then yes, delidding is the only way to get a huge drop in temps.


I said that about the pressure because a lot of people using Asetek coolers are having this issue.


FYI, allowing high temps like 95c will eventually degrade your CPU so until you delid I'd back the voltage down until you're stressing in the low 80s.


After the delid you probably won't need that much vcore for 5Ghz. As chips get hotter they leak voltage so the lower temps will help you a lot.


----------



## fireedo

white owl said:


> Firstly 4.9Ghz is great for 1.33v so congrats on that.
> Since you have an AIO you should verify that the mount is giving enough pressure to remove the heat from the CPU. Turn your screen towards your PC so you can see the temps change when you push on the block, I and everyone else recommend HWinfo for this and everything else really.
> If adding a bit of pressure with your hand doesn't do anything then yes, delidding is the only way to get a huge drop in temps.
> 
> 
> I said that about the pressure because a lot of people using Asetek coolers are having this issue.
> 
> 
> FYI, allowing high temps like 95c will eventually degrade your CPU so until you delid I'd back the voltage down until you're stressing in the low 80s.
> 
> 
> After the delid you probably won't need that much vcore for 5Ghz. As chips get hotter they leak voltage so the lower temps will help you a lot.


thankyou a lot
I have try to add pressure and nothing change, so I think need to delid then.
Will try today 
Hope everything is going well


----------



## white owl

Which method do you plan on using? The vise method is sketch now since the PCB is thinner now than it was when this guide was made.
You can slice the IHS off with a butterfly razor though. Some wrap them with a layer of electrical tape to keep the razor from touching the PCB.
If you're using a tool made for delidding you'll be fine, pretty hard to mess up there.


----------



## fireedo

OMG, Really thankyou GOD !!!

first of all I tought I can use my old rockit tool then I realize that what I have is a rockit 99 (for only 2066 cpu), so I have made up my mind, my body, my soul, LoL
I still have to delid this 8700K cpu
so I use a razor blade, cpu plastic cover from intel box and success !!!
and that not the most important result, after all cleaning, putting LM, and put back the IHS, I still have a doubt that maybe I made a mistake, but this is a one shot only, whatever it is 
then I put back the cpu to the motherboard socket, paste again using kryonaut paste and of course the corsair H115i AIO
before I put my computer on, I pray a lot.... LoL
then, ok, I can boot up (first step done)
so I enter to the BIOS menu and without further ado, I set my clock speed to the 50 (5.0 Ghz) with a pesimistic set using a 1.38v vcore, I know it is not going to win best voltage but before delid I use 1.415v and not even passed cinebench
so next, save and exit BIOS
entering windows
launch HWiNFO64
Launch Cinebench (5 times in a row)
Launch AIDA64 (FPU test for 10 minutes)
and all are success 
Load temperature maximum when cinebench are around 79-80c (before delid it is around to 95-97c)
Load temperature maximum when using FPU stress with AIDA64 for 10 minutes is 84c (before delid is sky rocketing around 100c and throttling very bad )
so I got around 16c-19c delta maximum temperature
really happy 

Now, I can use my old clock speed that is 4.9 Ghz with 1.3v but 5.0 ghz is more tempting 

What is this tricks??? so amazing, 
well intel at least gives us who has nerves to delid a great reward, LoL (well I think intel should do this from the beginning)

So thankyou a lot for the motivation

add note :
tested while gaming :
Rise of the tomb raider benchmark, Thw Witcher 3, around 10 minutes cpu temps detected around 58-60c, before delid I get around 72-74c


----------



## white owl

That's great! Did you remove all the silicone bits left on the PCB and IHS? That stuff leaves a gap.

If you didn't you can just pull the lid off, scrape it and put it back on. I've done something similar without using new TIM and temps were the same.


----------



## fireedo

white owl said:


> That's great! Did you remove all the silicone bits left on the PCB and IHS? That stuff leaves a gap.
> 
> If you didn't you can just pull the lid off, scrape it and put it back on. I've done something similar without using new TIM and temps were the same.


I have clean up everything, then I put LM and re-seal again using silicone/gasket for high temperature things


----------



## TwilightRavens

fireedo said:


> OMG, Really thankyou GOD !!!
> 
> first of all I tought I can use my old rockit tool then I realize that what I have is a rockit 99 (for only 2066 cpu), so I have made up my mind, my body, my soul, LoL
> I still have to delid this 8700K cpu
> so I use a razor blade, cpu plastic cover from intel box and success !!!
> and that not the most important result, after all cleaning, putting LM, and put back the IHS, I still have a doubt that maybe I made a mistake, but this is a one shot only, whatever it is
> then I put back the cpu to the motherboard socket, paste again using kryonaut paste and of course the corsair H115i AIO
> before I put my computer on, I pray a lot.... LoL
> then, ok, I can boot up (first step done)
> so I enter to the BIOS menu and without further ado, I set my clock speed to the 50 (5.0 Ghz) with a pesimistic set using a 1.38v vcore, I know it is not going to win best voltage but before delid I use 1.415v and not even passed cinebench
> so next, save and exit BIOS
> entering windows
> launch HWiNFO64
> Launch Cinebench (5 times in a row)
> Launch AIDA64 (FPU test for 10 minutes)
> and all are success
> Load temperature maximum when cinebench are around 79-80c (before delid it is around to 95-97c)
> Load temperature maximum when using FPU stress with AIDA64 for 10 minutes is 84c (before delid is sky rocketing around 100c and throttling very bad )
> so I got around 16c-19c delta maximum temperature
> really happy
> 
> Now, I can use my old clock speed that is 4.9 Ghz with 1.3v but 5.0 ghz is more tempting
> 
> What is this tricks??? so amazing,
> well intel at least gives us who has nerves to delid a great reward, LoL (well I think intel should do this from the beginning)
> 
> So thankyou a lot for the motivation
> 
> add note :
> tested while gaming :
> Rise of the tomb raider benchmark, Thw Witcher 3, around 10 minutes cpu temps detected around 58-60c, before delid I get around 72-74c


They need to just go back to soldering the CPU's, like Sandy Bridge and before, I'd gladly pay $15-$30 more for a K sku if they were actually soldered and could handle the temps like they are supposed to. I mean look at Ryzen, AMD solders those and they massively undercut Intel on all fronts so it can't cost that much more to actually do it, even if they don't pay for fabs and stuff. On a CPU like a 7980XE having 18 cores non soldered is just stupid, especially with a price tag of $2000, I mean if you are going to charge that much for unlocked 18 core that in theory can clock to 5GHz but is held back by the TIM, that's just stupid.

Of course though if they did that that kinda takes the fun out of doing things like this for better temps.


----------



## merlin__36

kevindd992002 said:


> What was that "plastic" you were referring to? Isn't it like the plastic installation tool from ASUS boards: https://rog.asus.com/articles/guides/quick-guide-asus-cpu-installation-tool/ ?




It looks like this

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Process...150-ASUS-GIGABYTE-INTEL-FOXCONN-/281216496407


----------



## merlin__36

merlin__36 said:


> Yeah, your right about that definitely uses higher voltages with the Automatic overclock settings but I really just tested it too see what the Auto would be vs my Manual clock. I generally like to under volt and find the best starting point and make a profile for ea additional Leap in overclock.
> 
> I hope that it was simple like it died from Auto overclock voltages hahaha! That is much preferred than swapping out the MOBO.
> 
> I ran the CPU in auto for maybe 30 min - 1 hr seen temps in the 72c-75c didn't like it so I went on a 48 hr test on my 4.8ghz clock 1.280v Didn't seem to get above 60c.
> 
> The good news is the PC isn't 30 days old.


New processor came in last night and it fired right up. Now just need to pull it out and delid the new one.


----------



## merlin__36

*Second 8700k Delid*



merlin__36 said:


> New processor came in last night and it fired right up. Now just need to pull it out and delid the new one.


Second 8700k Delid this one I did more freehand without tape hope it works well. I haven't tried to apply any nail polish to the four gold contacts to the bottom left of the processor I wonder if the black high temp Silicon sealant would work to protect them? 

I did test the unit last night before the delid it seemed to run around 80c-82c at 5ghz 1.3ish volts but I had my Cache also clocked at 5000.


----------



## kevindd992002

white owl said:


> I really don't understand those things. It's the most user friendly socket ever, if someone couldn't install the CPU I doubt a plastic guide would help.





stephenn82 said:


> I used the insert tool that Asus gave me. It has alignment marks on it just as a cpu socket/cpu does, the little arrow mark. I used it, why not? lol I havent had any issues...been in my rig since built Nov '16 and when I delidded last summer.


Same here. I use it because "I can". I doubt I'll be stupid enough to install the CPU the wrong way being how perfectionist I am with everything, lol.



merlin__36 said:


> It looks like this
> 
> https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Process...150-ASUS-GIGABYTE-INTEL-FOXCONN-/281216496407


I see. Every board that I had had those and they're obviously covers. If I get what you're saying correctly, you installed that back on top of the CPU? So that is the one sandwiched between the CPU IHS and heatsink base plate?

@All

Anyone here have tried using the relid piece of the AquaComputer Dr. Delid kit with Loctite Gel Super Glue? Based on what I see in the pictures, the square metal piece that goes around the IHS will contact the whole perimeter of the IHS. So that could pose a problem because there's a high chance that it will touch the glue in the corners as well making it stick to the IHS itself.

As recommended by RockIt cool, it's best to put a little bit of super glue in the corners like so: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1134/8418/files/Glue_Drop2_large.png?11458059898017049119


----------



## merlin__36

merlin__36 said:


> Second 8700k Delid this one I did more freehand without tape hope it works well. I haven't tried to apply any nail polish to the four gold contacts to the bottom left of the processor I wonder if the black high temp Silicon sealant would work to protect them?
> 
> I did test the unit last night before the delid it seemed to run around 80c-82c at 5ghz 1.3ish volts but I had my Cache also clocked at 5000.



So tested after the delid the highest core temp is 67C running 5ghz on all cores 1.328v Max @99.8% CPU Stress. Does this voltage seem appropriate? Maybe i should try for a higher clock?


----------



## rfarmer

merlin__36 said:


> So tested after the delid the highest core temp is 67C running 5ghz on all cores 1.328v Max @99.8% CPU Stress. Does this voltage seem appropriate? Maybe i should try for a higher clock?


Mine will do 5.0 GHz at 1.308v so yours seems about right. Try for higher, you can always go back.


----------



## merlin__36

I see. Every board that I had had those and they're obviously covers. If I get what you're saying correctly, you installed that back on top of the CPU? So that is the one sandwiched between the CPU IHS and heatsink base plate?

No i had taken the CPU out for an RMA and tried to place the cover inside where the CPU goes instead of on top. But i digress it all fixed and up and running.


----------



## merlin__36

rfarmer said:


> Mine will do 5.0 GHz at 1.308v so yours seems about right. Try for higher, you can always go back.



5.2 seems stable @ 1.376 - 1.392 Max 72c. Chasing 5.3.

I was noticing Silicon Lottery says their 8700k @ 5.2ghz 1.425V Is guaranteed stable so maybe i will have to try that voltage for the 5.3ghz.


----------



## TwilightRavens

kevindd992002 said:


> Anyone here have tried using the relid piece of the AquaComputer Dr. Delid kit with Loctite Gel Super Glue?11458059898017049119[/url]


The one thing I do know is do NOT seal it with super glue if you plan or think you will ever take off the IHS again, it will destroy your CPU if you try to delid it after relidding it with super glue.


----------



## kevindd992002

merlin__36 said:


> I see. Every board that I had had those and they're obviously covers. If I get what you're saying correctly, you installed that back on top of the CPU? So that is the one sandwiched between the CPU IHS and heatsink base plate?
> 
> No i had taken the CPU out for an RMA and tried to place the cover inside where the CPU goes instead of on top. But i digress it all fixed and up and running.


Ahh, I see what you mean now. Glad you got it all fixed up.



TwilightRavens said:


> The one thing I do know is do NOT seal it with super glue if you plan or think you will ever take off the IHS again, it will destroy your CPU if you try to delid it after relidding it with super glue.


Not if you use pure acetone to weaken the super glue bond first. And that the super glue shouldn't be put between the IHS and the board itself but just in the corners like in the pic I've posted above. That way, only a very little amount will go in between the IHS and the PCB.

What are your thoughts on this?


----------



## TwilightRavens

kevindd992002 said:


> Ahh, I see what you mean now. Glad you got it all fixed up.
> 
> 
> 
> Not if you use pure acetone to weaken the super glue bond first. And that the super glue shouldn't be put between the IHS and the board itself but just in the corners like in the pic I've posted above. That way, only a very little amount will go in between the IHS and the PCB.
> 
> What are your thoughts on this?


I don't know, maybe its just me but I wouldn't really trust anything other than isopropyl alcohol on the pcb, but yeah I guess that would work but still a tube of silicone sealant can be had for about $4 where I live ($4.78 on amazon) so I see no reason not to use that over super glue, but that is just me.


----------



## white owl

You can use superglue, it's been done before. Yes you'd use a tiny bit in the corners and you'd need acetone to get it back off as the glue might take some PCB with it. Also I doubt the acetone will dissolve all of the glue from under the IHS so you'll likely need to delid it again.
You can not seal it but if you must seal it back up the best way is using RTV silicone (available everywhere) which is the same stuff Intel uses. Just dab the corners and use the tool or the socket to apply pressure.


----------



## RichKnecht

FWIW, I didn't use anything to reglue my 7900X IHS after delidding. I relied on the pressure from the ILS and it was just fine. It also allowed me to easily delid it again t install my Direct Die Frame. The IHS now lives in the back of my desk drawer


----------



## Josu

Guys, anyone got 7700k dellided? i am worried about my temps, i got 75 max in AIDA stress test only with 4.5 hz with H110i GTX, and CPU was dellidded more when year ago
Maybe time to re-dellid, or my cooler soon will die?)
And how to remove liquid metall from CPU crystal?


----------



## deepor

Josu said:


> Guys, anyone got 7700k dellided? i am worried about my temps, i got 75 max in AIDA stress test only with 4.5 hz with H110i GTX, and CPU was dellidded more when year ago
> Maybe time to re-dellid, or my cooler soon will die?)
> And how to remove liquid metall from CPU crystal?


Do you remember the temperatures you originally saw? Do you maybe have old screenshots to compare to what's happening now?

Don't forget to keep in mind that your room temperature will influence the temperatures you see. Maybe when you originally delidded your CPU the weather was colder, and now it's summer and hot? If your room is for example 5°C warmer, you'll see 5°C higher temperatures.

About cleaning, using toilet paper worked for me.


----------



## Valgaur

Hey peeps!

Just an inquiry here. Did anyone perhaps happen to submit a join request at all? I've been without internet the last 2 weeks....


----------



## TwilightRavens

Valgaur said:


> Hey peeps!
> 
> Just an inquiry here. Did anyone perhaps happen to submit a join request at all? I've been without internet the last 2 weeks....


I don’t remember if I ever submitted one but here it goes anyway:

OCN name: TwilightRavens 
CPU: Intel i7-5775C (LGA 1150 Broadwell)
on die-TIM: CLU
ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
Mhz gained: 200MHz
OC after delid: 4.4GHz
Temp drops: at 4.2GHz was 71C before, 55C after
CPU-Z validation of max OC:
https://valid.x86.fr/2jgfr3

Pics are here: https://www.overclock.net/forum/5-i...adwell-c-ownership-club-230.html#post26539026


----------



## TwilightRavens

Edit double post


----------



## Valgaur

TwilightRavens said:


> I don’t remember if I ever submitted one but here it goes anyway:
> 
> OCN name: TwilightRavens
> CPU: Intel i7-5775C (LGA 1150 Broadwell)
> on die-TIM: CLU
> ihs-TIM: Arctic Silver 5
> Mhz gained: 200MHz
> OC after delid: 4.4GHz
> Temp drops: at 4.2GHz was 71C before, 55C after
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> https://valid.x86.fr/2jgfr3
> 
> Pics are here: https://www.overclock.net/forum/5-i...adwell-c-ownership-club-230.html#post26539026


You're In! :thumb: Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## TwilightRavens

Valgaur said:


> You're In! :thumb: Slappa Dat Sig On!


Hooray!


----------



## Uroborous

Well...

I decided to delid my 7700k. What can I do to protect those contacts next to the die? I suppose that it the liquid metal touches them, there will be damage.


----------



## white owl

Clear cellulose nail polish.


----------



## Uroborous

white owl said:


> Clear cellulose nail polish.


Really? you apply that directly on the contacts?


----------



## white owl

Yes. Luckily my wife had some.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Uroborous said:


> Really? you apply that directly on the contacts?


You can also use the silicone gasket maker that is commonly used to reseal the IHS, to cover the contacts from what I hear. Also apparently electrical tape too.


----------



## white owl

liquid electrical tape is an option to clear over it or you can use any tape to mask off the die.


----------



## lperik

Hi guys. First post on this forum.

Got a i5-8600k im not so happy about, it seems like a poor overclocker. Used Der8auer's OCguide so all the settings should be in order.

Hardware:
ASUS Rog Strix Z370-G Gaming
2x8Ghz Corsair Vengeance 3200Mhz
Corsair H100x 240mm watercooler
Corsair TX750 psu

I get it Prime95 v26.6 stable at 4,8Ghz 1.280V.

When trying 4,9Ghz I have to punch it up to 1,360V, and for 5Ghz i gotto take it all the way to 1,410V to get it stable ish. (Gets way to hot when running prime95 so I stop the workers after 10-15min) Not comfortable with giving it that much volt for 24/7 use either even if i get it to reasonable temps with delidding. 

Cant push AVX furter than 4,6Ghz, it seems to be the maxiumum regardless of volt. Its always the same core who fails both on AVX-prime, and v26.6. It also runs from 7-10C hotter than the rest both on stock and with OC. Im guessing this is the reason I have to increase the voltage by so much to get it stable at 4,9Ghz + also?

Can delidding help getting it stable on lower vcore or is it just a bad core that are holding me back and nothing that can be fixed?

Also, general question about delidding; Must the thermal compound (grizzly conductant) have to be reapplied frequently or is it a one time job?

Appreciate all answers 🙂


----------



## white owl

One time job. Redid mine after 2 years and it made no difference. 
Delidding can help stabilize on less voltage, CPUs don't like being hot so everything helps.
You shouldn't be trying that much vcore on a stock chip and AVX usually burns even hotter so this all sounds exactly normal especially if you have one hot core. I wouldn't even mess with AVX until you have your core, ram and cache sorted out.
It also doesn't help that you have an 8 phase board, it does have the capability to push plenty of amperage to an 8600k but the power delivery won't be as smooth as a board with a better VRM. From my searching several people we're able to stabilize their 8700ks with less voltage after getting better boards but since your CPU doesn't need as much power I wouldn't do all that. Just something to keep in mind when comparing your results to others.
De8 usually specializes in extreme overclocking using exotics cooling so it's possible that's not the best guide for AIOs. 
https://www.overclock.net/forum/5-i...locking-guide-statistics.html#/topics/1621347
I'd give this a read. Overclocking is actually pretty simple and very little often needs to be changed on the board.
Firstly I'd save your settings to a profile then load defaults to get your stock voltages and settings back.
I disable spread spectrum, enable more current on the board and set my LLC to the middle setting or just under it.
Other than that my method is the same as the guide...I eliminate variables by setting things manually (static) at stock speeds and voltage.
Set the cache to 4.2 with stock voltage manually. Then ram would be set to 2133 but first I'd enable XMP to load my timings before dropping the speed down, then set voltage to 1.2v.
Now you can set a multiplier like 4.8ghz, start with a low vcore and work up, if you crash instantly add 0.01 or so till it runs for a while then you can fine tune 0.001 or so. I tend to add a bit more voltage than I think it might need in hopes that it will be rock solid next time so I don't need to keep stressing the CPU. Keep input voltage at around 0.5v over vcore.
I'd stress the core with non AVX Prime95 small FFT until it runs for 2 hours or so. Then I'd set the ram to it's rated speeds and stress with non AVX Blend for an hour or so. Then the cache, still using manual voltage on everything. It can be stressed with Small FFT.
After all that and each step will pass over an hour of relevant stress testing and you're happy with everything just run blend over night so you know it will all work together.
After that you'd experiment with AVX and it's offset till e everything is stable under any workload.
Now you can set the same voltages in offset or adaptive and save a new profile.


----------



## lperik

I'll give it another go and see if it will improve

Seems nice to have it run 10-20C cooler regardless of it will help with the vcore or not, so think Im gonna try delidding it at some point also

Thank you for your answer 🙂


----------



## TwilightRavens

white owl said:


> One time job. Redid mine after 2 years and it made no difference.
> Delidding can help stabilize on less voltage, CPUs don't like being hot so everything helps.
> You shouldn't be trying that much vcore on a stock chip and AVX usually burns even hotter so this all sounds exactly normal especially if you have one hot core. I wouldn't even mess with AVX until you have your core, ram and cache sorted out.
> It also doesn't help that you have an 8 phase board, it does have the capability to push plenty of amperage to an 8600k but the power delivery won't be as smooth as a board with a better VRM. From my searching several people we're able to stabilize their 8700ks with less voltage after getting better boards but since your CPU doesn't need as much power I wouldn't do all that. Just something to keep in mind when comparing your results to others.
> De8 usually specializes in extreme overclocking using exotics cooling so it's possible that's not the best guide for AIOs.
> https://www.overclock.net/forum/5-i...locking-guide-statistics.html#/topics/1621347
> I'd give this a read. Overclocking is actually pretty simple and very little often needs to be changed on the board.
> Firstly I'd save your settings to a profile then load defaults to get your stock voltages and settings back.
> I disable spread spectrum, enable more current on the board and set my LLC to the middle setting or just under it.
> Other than that my method is the same as the guide...I eliminate variables by setting things manually (static) at stock speeds and voltage.
> Set the cache to 4.2 with stock voltage manually. Then ram would be set to 2133 but first I'd enable XMP to load my timings before dropping the speed down, then set voltage to 1.2v.
> Now you can set a multiplier like 4.8ghz, start with a low vcore and work up, if you crash instantly add 0.01 or so till it runs for a while then you can fine tune 0.001 or so. I tend to add a bit more voltage than I think it might need in hopes that it will be rock solid next time so I don't need to keep stressing the CPU. Keep input voltage at around 0.5v over vcore.
> I'd stress the core with non AVX Prime95 small FFT until it runs for 2 hours or so. Then I'd set the ram to it's rated speeds and stress with non AVX Blend for an hour or so. Then the cache, still using manual voltage on everything. It can be stressed with Small FFT.
> After all that and each step will pass over an hour of relevant stress testing and you're happy with everything just run blend over night so you know it will all work together.
> After that you'd experiment with AVX and it's offset till e everything is stable under any workload.
> Now you can set the same voltages in offset or adaptive and save a new profile.


Yeah my Broadwell was the exact same way with AVX, it wasn't stable past 3.9GHz, and my 4690K past 4.2GHz before that if you are gaming though AVX stability doesn't matter one bit so I wouldn't even test for it..


----------



## ftln

First thing I did tonight once I got the 8086k out of the box was delid, 5.2ghz avx stable @ 1.325v, temps maxing out around 70c on a a H115 :


----------



## TwilightRavens

Delidded and killed an old Pentium 4 630 today (wasn't really trying to kill, but didn't really care if I did because I will probably turn it into a keychain anyway)


















You can see where I scratched the crap out of the substrate, oh well lol (by the way yes, this chip *was* soldered)


----------



## Uroborous

I did it on my 7700k... About 15 degrees lower! That is quite a difference I think!


----------



## mouacyk

Uroborous said:


> I did it on my 7700k... About 15 degrees lower! That is quite a difference I think!


That is an expected improvement. Congratulations!


----------



## Doolie

Interesting day today. First time delidding but I’ve watched and read so many delid walkthroughs and I’ve had the kit sitting for months. Decided to delid my 8600k because temps have always fluctuated on the slightest usage. Anyway, started the process all went well, scraped all silicone off substrate, cleaned it, looked mint, applied the liquid ultra on the die, then ihs, didn’t use nail polish to cover the substrate, also didn’t use silicone to relid - went the way of just laying the ihs back on. All went well, pc posted - then I decided to remount aio. After remounting, it wouldn’t post, I later figured out it was pressure, any pressure on the cpu would result in no post. Loosened aio, it would post. So I took it apart, re did everything triple checked if any LM was touching anywhere it shouldn’t and all was good. Pc posted, but again, as soon as i mounted cooler it wouldn’t post. Took it apart again, and this time moved the ihs a bit upward, and kept checking post after sitting the cooler and applying pressure it was finally okay. I can’t tell you the amount of times I made sure the ihs wasn’t touching any contacts. It was finally good to go - almost 20c in dropped temps - if I was to do this again, and when I re do it, I’ll use some nail polish to cover the substrate.


----------



## blaze2210

Uroborous said:


> I did it on my 7700k... About 15 degrees lower! That is quite a difference I think!


No pics/screenshots?


----------



## Uroborous

It goes about 67 degrees celsius on small fft on lowest llc at stock frequency. Still pretty hot I guess, it is a pretty hot summer nevertheless, but it is an improvement when compared with the pre delid state. My motherboard (asrock z270m pro4) does not have the cpu pll oc option in the bios, that everybody says makes a great difference.


----------



## Jakerz

OCN name: Jakerz
CPU: i7 8700K
on die-TIM: Cool Laboratories Liquid Ultra
ihs-TIM: Artic MX-4
Mhz gained: N/A (I didn't attempt to OC the chip before the delid)
OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz @ 1.280V
Temp drops: Max Temp or 88C afterwards
CPU-Z validation of max OC:

I didn't try to OC anything before I did the delid, because the build is in a small case and I figured I'd be pushing my limits even with the delid with an 8700K and a 1080Ti on a 360mm Rad.

Prime95 on Small FFT to 88C and jumped to 91C for a split second a few times, Large FFT and Blend were mid 60's on average, think I'm running it to hard?


----------



## Uroborous

Jakerz I think your numbers are fine. I hope you enjoy your chip!


----------



## white owl

Are you using AVX? If you're using a version later than 26.6 or you haven't disabled AVX then you're likely using it. Hitting 90c with less than 1.3v seems really high to me especially since the CPU is the only thing heating the loop at the time.
What vcore are you getting under load? CPUZ doesn't show much useful info. If you aren't using a static voltage and you have P95 using AVX on Small FFT with HT enabled you're basically setting it up to be as hot as possible during the stress test. You're likely getting extra vcore during the stress test.


My recommendation would be to reset the BIOS, set your cache to it's stock speed and stock voltage in manual mode. Set your ram to 2133 just to be safe. Now go back to vcore and set it to your desired voltage in manual mode. Boot Windows and get P95 v26.6 (it doesn't have AVX) then run Small FFT.


My stress testing method goes like this:
Set everything but core speed and voltage to their stock values MANUALLY.
Set the multiplier and start with a low voltage and work my way up. I use P95 v26.6 Small FFT for about two hours on the core.
Once I pass that I move onto cache, again setting voltage manually. Small FFT again but I don't let it run as long this time, since the cache isn't going to deliver much performance I'm often on the lower side of what speed I think will be stable for a given voltage so I know it won't crash.
Now that all that is done we go into the BIOS again and set XMP. Now your core and cache should be OC'd and still using manual/static voltage and your RAM should be running at the advertised speed and timings, I'll run P95 blend for 6 hours or overnight.


After that you can stress test for AVX using a newer version of P95 and using the AVX offset in the BIOS, it's possible that you're just as stable with AVX and won't need the offset but that's the point of all this testing.


Once that's all done you can take your manual voltage from the core and cache and set them in adaptive or offset mode.


While your stress testing you should be monitoring things with Hwinfo so you know the vcore is where it should be.


Side notes: I like my input voltage set to 0.5v over vcore, I enable more current in the BIOS so it doesn't current throttle and I set LLC to either the middle setting or just below it. These are things I do before even overclocking anything. If you change your LLC it shouldn't be really high as that can cause spikes under load which is worse than sag but each board is different so that's something you'll need to test yourself.


----------



## Valgaur

Jakerz said:


> OCN name: Jakerz
> CPU: i7 8700K
> on die-TIM: Cool Laboratories Liquid Ultra
> ihs-TIM: Artic MX-4
> Mhz gained: N/A (I didn't attempt to OC the chip before the delid)
> OC after delid: 5.0 Ghz @ 1.280V
> Temp drops: Max Temp or 88C afterwards
> CPU-Z validation of max OC:
> 
> I didn't try to OC anything before I did the delid, because the build is in a small case and I figured I'd be pushing my limits even with the delid with an 8700K and a 1080Ti on a 360mm Rad.
> 
> Prime95 on Small FFT to 88C and jumped to 91C for a split second a few times, Large FFT and Blend were mid 60's on average, think I'm running it to hard?



You're In! :thumb: Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## Ginola

De-lided 8086 today, custom loop 2x rads (240 black ice2 and aquacomputer tripple rad) 

liquid ultra and grizzly kryonaught paste, differences where unbelievable.. more than 20 degrees drop across all cores on average! now sitting happy at 5.2ghz 1.35v neg 2 offset for avx and stable with temps that make me smile  

Before... prime 95 load.. @5.1ghz : 1.31v :- https://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=208362&thumb=1

After: at 5.2ghz prime running in the background at 1.35v :- https://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=208364&thumb=1


Super happy! (and glad I didn't break my CPU!)


----------



## GorbazTheDragon

lperik said:


> Hi guys. First post on this forum.
> 
> Got a i5-8600k im not so happy about, it seems like a poor overclocker. Used Der8auer's OCguide so all the settings should be in order.
> 
> Hardware:
> ASUS Rog Strix Z370-G Gaming
> 2x8Ghz Corsair Vengeance 3200Mhz
> Corsair H100x 240mm watercooler
> Corsair TX750 psu
> 
> I get it Prime95 v26.6 stable at 4,8Ghz 1.280V.
> 
> When trying 4,9Ghz I have to punch it up to 1,360V, and for 5Ghz i gotto take it all the way to 1,410V to get it stable ish. (Gets way to hot when running prime95 so I stop the workers after 10-15min) Not comfortable with giving it that much volt for 24/7 use either even if i get it to reasonable temps with delidding.
> 
> Cant push AVX furter than 4,6Ghz, it seems to be the maxiumum regardless of volt. Its always the same core who fails both on AVX-prime, and v26.6. It also runs from 7-10C hotter than the rest both on stock and with OC. Im guessing this is the reason I have to increase the voltage by so much to get it stable at 4,9Ghz + also?
> 
> Can delidding help getting it stable on lower vcore or is it just a bad core that are holding me back and nothing that can be fixed?
> 
> Also, general question about delidding; Must the thermal compound (grizzly conductant) have to be reapplied frequently or is it a one time job?
> 
> Appreciate all answers 🙂


I would be inclined to blame the board (VRM)...

It is a 4 phase board with dualed (not doubled) phases, the mosfets aren't exactly top of the line either. A number of boards of same or similar configuration have trouble pushing stable voltages for those higher power loads.

Try finding ways to reduce the fet temps, should get you a bit more headroom and stability, but I would not expect too much.


----------



## monohouse

5000 mhz, 90 degrees, this is worth !


----------



## taowulf

Ginola said:


> De-lided 8086 today, custom loop 2x rads (240 black ice2 and aquacomputer tripple rad)
> 
> liquid ultra and grizzly kryonaught paste, differences where unbelievable.. more than 20 degrees drop across all cores on average! now sitting happy at 5.2ghz 1.35v neg 2 offset for avx and stable with temps that make me smile
> 
> Before... prime 95 load.. @5.1ghz : 1.31v :- https://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=208362&thumb=1
> 
> After: at 5.2ghz prime running in the background at 1.35v :- https://www.overclock.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=208364&thumb=1
> 
> 
> Super happy! (and glad I didn't break my CPU!)


Snapping pics of a computer screen is not the best way to do this. Press the print screen button, open any photo editing software, even MS Paint will work, paste the pic in, and then use the crop tool to cut out the part you want to share.

The second pic is so tiny on a monitor, none of the info is visible

Glad you got great results though!

I noticed you title says "Linux Lobbyist" and if you are using Linux, you can do the same thing, just sub something like GIMP (hey, it is free) instead of MS Paint.


----------



## fireedo

"successfully" delidded my i9 7940x 
Oh mighty GOD what have I done


----------



## Valgaur

fireedo said:


> "successfully" delidded my i9 7940x
> Oh mighty GOD what have I done


What happened?


----------



## fireedo

Valgaur said:


> What happened?


I'm curious also, how could this happen, I have delidded 7820x, 8700K and 8086K so far, they are all success without a single failure
2 days ago I try to delid my 7940x using the same tool I use to delid 7820x then this disaster happen.... 
Fortunately or I can say if this some of miracle, my 7940x still live and kicking, but I cant run a quad channel memory now, if I put 4 Memory/RAM then only 3 slot detected
have been two days I try to test my damaged 7940x and seems like only about Memory quad channel support I have been lost

Well, still, I think I will replace my cpu to 7960X or even 7980XE, such as a PITA


----------



## white owl

Valgaur said:


> fireedo said:
> 
> 
> 
> "successfully" delidded my i9 7940x
> Oh mighty GOD what have I done /forum/images/smilies/frown.gif
> 
> 
> 
> What happened?
Click to expand...

PCB on the right side.
If I had to guess I'd say you used a Coffee lake tool on a Skylake X and there was a clearance issue or the tool pushed the IHS into that side?
Sorry man that really sucks.


----------



## SpeedyIV

Wow. That really sucks!! I saw your posts in the Skylake Kabylake thread leading up to getting that i9 7940x. I guess you are lucky it still works at all. Did you figure out how it happened? Was it the wrong de-lid tool? I'll admit I am a chicken. I bought an 8700k and a Rockit de-lid tool, and a tube of Conductonaut, and chickened out. I don't push the chip that hard so my AIO does OK so I never did the de-lid. If I hadn't spent the money on the Rockit, I would probably send the CPU to Silicon Lottery and have them do it. 

So many posts say how easy it is, and you have successfully done several other chips, yet still had this happen. Now I don't feel like such a wuss. Anway, sorry to hear this happened and good luck. It's really amazing that it still runs. Any chance of repairing the damage somehow? Can you take a close up of the damage?


----------



## fireedo

white owl said:


> PCB on the right side.
> If I had to guess I'd say you used a Coffee lake tool on a Skylake X and there was a clearance issue or the tool pushed the IHS into that side?
> Sorry man that really sucks.





SpeedyIV said:


> Wow. That really sucks!! I saw your posts in the Skylake Kabylake thread leading up to getting that i9 7940x. I guess you are lucky it still works at all. Did you figure out how it happened? Was it the wrong de-lid tool? I'll admit I am a chicken. I bought an 8700k and a Rockit de-lid tool, and a tube of Conductonaut, and chickened out. I don't push the chip that hard so my AIO does OK so I never did the de-lid. If I hadn't spent the money on the Rockit, I would probably send the CPU to Silicon Lottery and have them do it.
> 
> So many posts say how easy it is, and you have successfully done several other chips, yet still had this happen. Now I don't feel like such a wuss. Anway, sorry to hear this happened and good luck. It's really amazing that it still runs. Any chance of repairing the damage somehow? Can you take a close up of the damage?


Really thankyou, 

I use rockit 99 the same tool I use to delid for my previous 7820X
and I dont know how this happen, I follow the instruction the same as before, I also open up a youtube video about a man delidded his 7980XE with the same Rockit 99 tool as mine. If this tool advertised as "a precised CnC tool" then I say they were wrong, because this happen to me
and about repairing this thing, hmm, I dont think possible here in my country, but maybe I can still sell this CPU for maybe around $250-$350 even at this condition, better than nothing 
I will add some photos later, soon, because for now if I see my CPU, my heart feels hurt, LoL, but really, it hurts


----------



## Beagle Box

SpeedyIV said:


> Wow. That really sucks!! I saw your posts in the Skylake Kabylake thread leading up to getting that i9 7940x. I guess you are lucky it still works at all. Did you figure out how it happened? Was it the wrong de-lid tool? I'll admit I am a chicken. I bought an 8700k and a Rockit de-lid tool, and a tube of Conductonaut, and chickened out. I don't push the chip that hard so my AIO does OK so I never did the de-lid. If I hadn't spent the money on the Rockit, I would probably send the CPU to Silicon Lottery and have them do it.
> 
> So many posts say how easy it is, and you have successfully done several other chips, yet still had this happen. Now I don't feel like such a wuss. Anway, sorry to hear this happened and good luck. It's really amazing that it still runs. Any chance of repairing the damage somehow? Can you take a close up of the damage?


I just de-lidded 8086 and it's definitely worth it, if only for the temperature drop. 

Idles @ 32C while running 5.3 GHz. Can run all day @ 5.2 GHz with a max 1.35 VCore. EIST, C-states, Adaptive+Offset. 
Used the Rock-it kit and Conductonaut. Used 4 small dabs of Black RTV to replace the IHS. 

I didn't like the way the tool unevenly pressed on the IHS for re-lid, so I placed the chip in the tool and applied overnight pressure with unopened bottled water sitting upside down in a shot glass. The base of the shot glass fit perfectly into the yellow cover.


----------



## Beagle Box

fireedo said:


> "successfully" delidded my i9 7940x
> Oh mighty GOD what have I done


Yours is a cautionary tale. I've de-lidded 2 chips this week. The i7-6700k was a perfect fit for the Rock-it tool's socket.
The 8086 was a very tight fit. I had to *snap* it in. It was dumb luck that a double checked before clamping the top down and doing the deed.

My guess is that your wafer was a tight fit and wasn't fully seated when the plunger mauled your silicon.


----------



## Mat_UK

Hi All,

As a de-lidding virgin, can anyone tell me if any of the ingredients below in the nail polish I am looking at might be unsafe for sealing the PCB components before applying the LM?

Ethyl Acetate; Butyl Acetate, Nitrocellulose, Adipic Acid/neopentyl Glycol/trimellitic Anhydride Copolymer, Trimethyl Pentadiol Diisobutyrate, Isopropyl Alcohol, Violet 2 

Thanks!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Mat_UK said:


> Hi All,
> 
> As a de-lidding virgin, can anyone tell me if any of the ingredients below in the nail polish I am looking at might be unsafe for sealing the PCB components before applying the LM?
> 
> Ethyl Acetate; Butyl Acetate, Nitrocellulose, Adipic Acid/neopentyl Glycol/trimellitic Anhydride Copolymer, Trimethyl Pentadiol Diisobutyrate, Isopropyl Alcohol, Violet 2
> 
> Thanks!



Looks like pretty much any nail polish to me - regardless it should be safe as the majority are just there to keep it 'liquid' and will evaporate within minutes as it cures. I've used nail polish on both my 7700K and 8700K (both running well over 5GHz) and not had any problems. If you're really concerned you could just use liquid electrical tape. Although that uses Naptha as a solvent which is going to be quite a bit stronger (both smell and reation-wise) than Iso Alcohol... in either case it won't cause a problem - the stuff that can easily dissolve PCB material requires a hazmat license (and suit) for the most part.


----------



## Mat_UK

DiGiCiDAL said:


> Looks like pretty much any nail polish to me - regardless it should be safe as the majority are just there to keep it 'liquid' and will evaporate within minutes as it cures. I've used nail polish on both my 7700K and 8700K (both running well over 5GHz) and not had any problems. If you're really concerned you could just use liquid electrical tape. Although that uses Naptha as a solvent which is going to be quite a bit stronger (both smell and reation-wise) than Iso Alcohol... in either case it won't cause a problem - the stuff that can easily dissolve PCB material requires a hazmat license (and suit) for the most part.


Brilliant, thanks for the reply. Looks like I will go with this one


----------



## SgtRotty

My 4790k was delidded about three years ago. Last application was 1 and half years ago. Held up nicely!!


----------



## raider89

OCN name: Raider89
CPU: 8700k
on die-TIM: Conductonaut liquid metal 
ihs-TIM: Kryonaut thermal grease
Mhz gained:1.3 ghz gained
OC after delid: 5.0 ghz
Temp drops: 12 degrees


----------



## Valgaur

Do you have a photo for proof?


----------



## kevindd992002

Does anyone know how to contact James from RockItCool aside from the contact us section in their website (he's not replying there anymore)?


----------



## raider89

Valgaur said:


> Do you have a photo for proof?


Wish I would have taken pictures of it, I did the delid at work at my desk lmao. Tech guy for the company had the tool kit and let me use it.


----------



## Valgaur

raider89 said:


> Wish I would have taken pictures of it, I did the delid at work at my desk lmao. Tech guy for the company had the tool kit and let me use it.


You're In! :thumb: Slappa Dat Sig On!


----------



## GreedyMuffin

Can a delid suddenly go bad?

For the past two months one core is 12-15'C hotter than the others. One core is peaking 75'C at 5.3ghz 1.4V, the others are around 60-63'C..

It was relidded by a shop, so I'll need to delid it again. I've delidded a few X299 CPUs, but bought this binned.


----------



## TwilightRavens

GreedyMuffin said:


> Can a delid suddenly go bad?
> 
> For the past two months one core is 12-15'C hotter than the others. One core is peaking 75'C at 5.3ghz 1.4V, the others are around 60-63'C..
> 
> It was relidded by a shop, so I'll need to delid it again. I've delidded a few X299 CPUs, but bought this binned.


I don’t really think a delid can go bad, its more or less some cores just run hotter than others in my experience, I know on my i7 i’ll have one core that is hotter than the other by about 10C, but it stayed like that after 3 delids to test if that was the issue.


----------



## deepor

TwilightRavens said:


> I don’t really think a delid can go bad, its more or less some cores just run hotter than others in my experience, I know on my i7 i’ll have one core that is hotter than the other by about 10C, but it stayed like that after 3 delids to test if that was the issue.


You mean you reapplied liquid metal three times, and every time there was this one core being hotter than the others?

I'm asking because I have the same here, but I thought I just made a mistake when I applied liquid metal. I planned to re-do it at some point, but was always too lazy.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

deepor said:


> You mean you reapplied liquid metal three times, and every time there was this one core being hotter than the others?
> 
> I'm asking because I have the same here, but I thought I just made a mistake when I applied liquid metal. I planned to re-do it at some point, but was always too lazy.



There's two distinct possibilities for that. One would be that one core is having a higher load (this is especially true of 2066 CPUs if using Turbo Boost Max 3.0) - but even with earlier/consumer CPUs 1055/50/51 there is still a 'go to core' as far as OS thread priority is concerned. I'm not sure how many do it, but you can assign thread priority in software, so it's also possible that AV or some other constantly resident app is prioritized to a single core.


The other, and far more likely case IMO, is that there is slight variance in the DTS (Digital Temperature Sensor) for that core and it's simply reading a different value. Obviously there's less of a calibration issue with those that are part of the die itself as opposed to a surface type thermistor - but in my experience I've never had two of those measure exactly the same... so I think it would be unlikely for the on-die sensor to be 100% accurate across the board either.


On the other hand, a 10C delta is pretty huge if you're talking about peak core temps (in my experience I've never seen more than 5-6C post delid)... but if you've redone the mount more than once and still see it, then I'd guess it's one of the mentioned cases - an thus there's nothing you can really do about it. It's like a different kind of silicon lottery fail... nothing to do but buy another 'ticket' and try again.


----------



## TwilightRavens

deepor said:


> You mean you reapplied liquid metal three times, and every time there was this one core being hotter than the others?
> 
> I'm asking because I have the same here, but I thought I just made a mistake when I applied liquid metal. I planned to re-do it at some point, but was always too lazy.


Yeah, I reapplied it 3 different times, every time the temps were within a degree or two of what I tested beforehand, and one core still being like 5-15C hotter than the rest. So yeah it is absolutely normal for that to happen on a lot of chips, both my current i7-5775C and my former i5-4690K before I sold it to a friend of mine did the same thing.



DiGiCiDAL said:


> There's two distinct possibilities for that. One would be that one core is having a higher load (this is especially true of 2066 CPUs if using Turbo Boost Max 3.0) - but even with earlier/consumer CPUs 1055/50/51 there is still a 'go to core' as far as OS thread priority is concerned. I'm not sure how many do it, but you can assign thread priority in software, so it's also possible that AV or some other constantly resident app is prioritized to a single core.
> 
> 
> The other, and far more likely case IMO, is that there is slight variance in the DTS (Digital Temperature Sensor) for that core and it's simply reading a different value. Obviously there's less of a calibration issue with those that are part of the die itself as opposed to a surface type thermistor - but in my experience I've never had two of those measure exactly the same... so I think it would be unlikely for the on-die sensor to be 100% accurate across the board either.
> 
> 
> On the other hand, a 10C delta is pretty huge if you're talking about peak core temps (in my experience I've never seen more than 5-6C post delid)... but if you've redone the mount more than once and still see it, then I'd guess it's one of the mentioned cases - an thus there's nothing you can really do about it. It's like a different kind of silicon lottery fail... nothing to do but buy another 'ticket' and try again.


Hmm I would have thought it more as that particular core isn't as well of an overclocker as the other three and runs at a higher voltage to stay stable than the others, therefor causing it to run a bit hotter. Or like you said that is just the go-to core for Windows, Linux or w/e OS you use, or maybe a combination of the two. But then again I remember on X99 you could view your best OC'ing core unlike on Z97/170/270 etc, not sure if X299 has the same feature but I don't see why it wouldn't.

-Edit: For example on my Broadwell i7 core 1 would run at like 83C, whilst 2, 3, and 4 would be at like 68-73C. And on the Haswell i5 it was core 2 that ran the hottest (I think 70C ish) whilst the other 3 were like upper 50's/lower 60's (didn't have an insane overclock on the i5 because it was a terrible overclocker, whereas the Broadwell chip for some odd reason as it is a Broadwell overclocked quite a bit better than my Haswell). The one chip i didn't have the issue with was my ES Ivy 3770K, but that was direct die cooled and suicide overclocked to 5.3GHz and by no means comparable, mainly because they all hovered around 90C on a custom water loop (I was feeding it 1.62v so what else did you expect the temps to be) but it wasn't throttling ᵇᵃʳᵉˡʸ ᵗʰᵒᵘᵍʰ.


----------



## Imprezzion

Little update. I delidded my 6700K 2 years ago with CLU and have not reapplied it since. Temps are still incredible. 

I just upped my OC to a bit more.. On the edge. Now running 4.6Ghz @ 1.408v load, 4.2Ghz ring @ 1.050 SA and max temps in prime95 27.9 AVX Small fft is 77c hottest core after about 1 hour.

Games run at high 50's low 60's but the fans only ramp up from idle at 66c so.. Yeah. 

It's cooled by an H115i in push-pull btw.

Don't see the need to refresh the CLU at all for now.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

TwilightRavens said:


> Hmm I would have thought it more as that particular core isn't as well of an overclocker as the other three and runs at a higher voltage to stay stable than the others, therefor causing it to run a bit hotter. Or like you said that is just the go-to core for Windows, Linux or w/e OS you use, or maybe a combination of the two. But then again I remember on X99 you could view your best OC'ing core unlike on Z97/170/270 etc, not sure if X299 has the same feature but I don't see why it wouldn't.
> 
> -Edit: For example on my Broadwell i7 core 1 would run at like 83C, whilst 2, 3, and 4 would be at like 68-73C. And on the Haswell i5 it was core 2 that ran the hottest (I think 70C ish) whilst the other 3 were like upper 50's/lower 60's (didn't have an insane overclock on the i5 because it was a terrible overclocker, whereas the Broadwell chip for some odd reason as it is a Broadwell overclocked quite a bit better than my Haswell). The one chip i didn't have the issue with was my ES Ivy 3770K, but that was direct die cooled and suicide overclocked to 5.3GHz and by no means comparable, mainly because they all hovered around 90C on a custom water loop (I was feeding it 1.62v so what else did you expect the temps to be) but it wasn't throttling ᵇᵃʳᵉˡʸ ᵗʰᵒᵘᵍʰ.



I guess the next question is what are you using to load the cores and how long is the sample size? If you're running something like IBT at higher loadings (RAM-wise I mean) or Prime95 for more than an hour - then that does seem anomalous to me. I didn't have a Broadwell x99 setup but I did have a Haswell Xeon 1650v3 which was a good overclocker... and it was nearly 'perfect' as far as balanced temps - according to my notes the peak temps at the cores were 74,73,69,72,72,73 on a 12Hr Prime run with a 4.25GHz OC @ 1.16V. Obviously I had more headroom but it was a workstation so stability was much more important to me at the time. At idle after about 1 hour the temps would all stabilize within 1C of each other. I would also assume that the tollerances are better with XEON SKUs than with the 'Enthusiast' ones (despite being same chips).

Like I said it's highly likely that there is a somewhat significant variance in sensor accuracy as well... so if you have a 'hot' sensor on a 'hot' core it might even exaggerate 3-4C just from that.

Regardless, if you're not having a core hitting the bumpstops (throttling) then I wouldn't worry about it - you're still getting heat away from all of the cores fine under load... 

Both the TIM/HS/Loop process and the CPU sensor/MB chipset/Software process have loads of variables built-in so if there's not something way, way out of line - it's probably just coincidental.


Until recently you couldn't set separate VCORE values per core, so I'm not exactly sure what you mean by a less "overclockable core"? With Ivy, Haswell, Broadwell a 'bad core' would reduce the maximum clock stability could be reached with, but as all cores ran at same max clock and vcore the temps should also be very similar? Or am I misunderstanding altogether?


----------



## Sugita2Junko

*Not enough liquid metal on my delid?*

Thermal Grizzly conductonaut on IHS, spread as thin as possible so it looks wet, not pooling, same with die, adhesive scrape of clean, RTV silicone reseal thin as possible smeared on wing of IHS and clamp to cure. Kryonaut thermal paste between IHS & heatsink.

https://i.imgur.com/KgrXgee.jpg

1.35V, 1.05v VCCIO/SA, 5Ghz all cores, 0AVX, Prime95 v29, Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT cooler equiv to NH-D15

I've tried this twice now. 8086K delid but 93-95C which the same temp as people not delidded. 

Did I not use enough liquid metal?


----------



## mouacyk

Sugita2Junko said:


> Thermal Grizzly conductonaut on IHS, spread as thin as possible so it looks wet, not pooling, same with die, adhesive scrape of clean, RTV silicone reseal thin as possible smeared on wing of IHS and clamp to cure. Kryonaut thermal paste between IHS & heatsink.
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/KgrXgee.jpg
> 
> 1.35V, 1.05v VCCIO/SA, 5Ghz all cores, *0AVX, Prime95 v29*, Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT cooler equiv to NH-D15
> 
> I've tried this twice now. 8086K delid but 93-95C which the same temp as people not delidded.
> 
> Did I not use enough liquid metal?


Bolded is reason temps surpass 90C -- there is no way around it because AVX sucks power. Most people test with AVX off and temps should be in low 70Cs or high 60Cs with full custom water cooling. To turn off AVX, edit local.txt file in prime95 folder and set the following options:

CpuSupportsAVX=0
CpuSupportsAVX2=0
CPUSupportsFMA3=0

Air cooling at that speed and voltage also is a lot to expect.


----------



## Sugita2Junko

mouacyk said:


> Bolded is reason temps surpass 90C -- there is no way around it because AVX sucks power. Most people test with AVX off and temps should be in low 70Cs or high 60Cs with full custom water cooling. To turn off AVX, edit local.txt file in prime95 folder and set the following options:
> 
> CpuSupportsAVX=0
> CpuSupportsAVX2=0
> CPUSupportsFMA3=0
> 
> Air cooling at that speed and voltage also is a lot to expect.


I see people with p95 AVX load 8700K at 5Ghz in low/mid 80's but I am like 10C higher.


----------



## cyan

SgtRotty said:


> My 4790k was delidded about three years ago. Last application was 1 and half years ago. Held up nicely!!


14 months on my 4770k.
Temp still good, but when I clean the IHS there's a darker spot.


----------



## cyan

SgtRotty said:


> My 4790k was delidded about three years ago. Last application was 1 and half years ago. Held up nicely!!


14 months on my 4770k.
There's a darker spot on IHS when I clean the liquid metal.
Temp still the same as the first day I delidded though


----------



## Imprezzion

Bought a pre-delidded 7700K that was never overclocked because it was in a mITX system.

It's running 5.0Ghz 1.360v vcore, 1.1v VCCIO, 1.05v VCCSA, 4.2Ghz bus, 0 AVX offset.

Prime 95 27.9 AVX Blend 12000MB RAM 5 min per fft16 hour test, no errors and max temps of 77-76-77-74 in 22c ambients. Amazing CPU lol.

Any normal load like x264 or even HCI Memtest with all 8 threads fully loaded barely touch 60c with fans on 40% PWM. 

Unfortunately it needs quite a bump in voltage to run 5.1Ghz. I did get it to run at least 1 hour Blend 5 min length 12000MB RAM on 1.416v but it got a tad hot (averaging 84c). I'm sure it will do 5.2 at about 1.448v but not really worth it.


----------



## TwilightRavens

DiGiCiDAL said:


> I guess the next question is what are you using to load the cores and how long is the sample size? If you're running something like IBT at higher loadings (RAM-wise I mean) or Prime95 for more than an hour - then that does seem anomalous to me. I didn't have a Broadwell x99 setup but I did have a Haswell Xeon 1650v3 which was a good overclocker... and it was nearly 'perfect' as far as balanced temps - according to my notes the peak temps at the cores were 74,73,69,72,72,73 on a 12Hr Prime run with a 4.25GHz OC @ 1.16V. Obviously I had more headroom but it was a workstation so stability was much more important to me at the time. At idle after about 1 hour the temps would all stabilize within 1C of each other. I would also assume that the tollerances are better with XEON SKUs than with the 'Enthusiast' ones (despite being same chips).
> 
> Like I said it's highly likely that there is a somewhat significant variance in sensor accuracy as well... so if you have a 'hot' sensor on a 'hot' core it might even exaggerate 3-4C just from that.
> 
> Regardless, if you're not having a core hitting the bumpstops (throttling) then I wouldn't worry about it - you're still getting heat away from all of the cores fine under load...
> 
> Both the TIM/HS/Loop process and the CPU sensor/MB chipset/Software process have loads of variables built-in so if there's not something way, way out of line - it's probably just coincidental.
> 
> 
> Until recently you couldn't set separate VCORE values per core, so I'm not exactly sure what you mean by a less "overclockable core"? With Ivy, Haswell, Broadwell a 'bad core' would reduce the maximum clock stability could be reached with, but as all cores ran at same max clock and vcore the temps should also be very similar? Or am I misunderstanding altogether?


Actually on mine the temps have stabilized a bit to where its not as much variation anymore, but one core is still a tad hotter. Oh and mine isn’t X99 Broadwell, its Z97 Broadwell, so lower core count one.

And what I am saying in most cases there is usually at least one core that can’t clock as high as the rest/runs hotter than the rest or both and yeah you can’t disable that core most of the time but what I meant was usually that’s what limits you from say going to 5.2 to 5.3GHz is one core not quite being stable. So basically what you said in the second part.


----------



## mattxx88

hi guys

i'm going to delid my 8086k today, and wanna ask you a tip, make it sense to cover those 4 little pins near die (red circle on image) with a drop of attak glue? to insulate them


----------



## Sugita2Junko

mattxx88 said:


> hi guys
> 
> i'm going to delid my 8086k today, and wanna ask you a tip, make it sense to cover those 4 little pins near die (red circle on image) with a drop of attak glue? to insulate them


I covered mine for added safety, but people don't. Use some of adhesive used to reseal, proper clear nail polish or kapton tape.


----------



## TwilightRavens

mattxx88 said:


> hi guys
> 
> i'm going to delid my 8086k today, and wanna ask you a tip, make it sense to cover those 4 little pins near die (red circle on image) with a drop of attak glue? to insulate them


Personally I didn’t cover them, I just put liquid metal on the die and underside of the IHS and resealed it with rubber gasket maker. Its almost been a year since I’ve done it and it’s still holding up strong.


----------



## mattxx88

Sugita2Junko said:


> I covered mine for added safety, but people don't. Use some of adhesive used to reseal, proper clear nail polish or kapton tape.





TwilightRavens said:


> Personally I didn’t cover them, I just put liquid metal on the die and underside of the IHS and resealed it with rubber gasket maker. Its almost been a year since I’ve done it and it’s still holding up strong.


thanks for your reply guys, i covered them with just a drop of sealant used also for ihs as sugita suggested


----------



## Falkentyne

mattxx88 said:


> thanks for your reply guys, i covered them with just a drop of sealant used also for ihs as sugita suggested


Good call. Better to be safe than sorry.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Falkentyne said:


> Good call. Better to be safe than sorry.


Yeah that is very true.


----------



## kevindd992002

I bought the Rockitcool copper IHS for my 8700K, sent them my CPU and they delidded it for free. They tested the CPU before and after and had around 20C drop in temps. Overall, I'm very happy with their service.


----------



## Bluescreendeath

Does anyone know a good way to remove silicone? I tried to use a razor to remove Intel's silicone adhesive, but I can only shave off small bits at a time. Then it gets to a point where I can't shave any at all and am just scratching the die, but there is still thin layers of silicone left.

Also, does anyone recommend putting silicone underneath to IHS to glue it back to the CPU substrate? Or is this not recommended and we should only glue the side corners and not have anything between the IHS/CPU substrate?

And if anyone can offer me help/suggestions for my delidding 4790k, that would be greatly appreciated.

https://www.overclock.net/forum/5-i...emps-then-spike-temperature.html#post27733418


----------



## TwilightRavens

Bluescreendeath said:


> Does anyone know a good way to remove silicone? I tried to use a razor to remove Intel's silicone adhesive, but I can only shave off small bits at a time. Then it gets to a point where I can't shave any at all and am just scratching the die, but there is still thin layers of silicone left.
> 
> Also, does anyone recommend putting silicone underneath to IHS to glue it back to the CPU substrate? Or is this not recommended and we should only glue the side corners and not have anything between the IHS/CPU substrate?
> 
> And if anyone can offer me help/suggestions for my delidding 4790k, that would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> https://www.overclock.net/forum/5-i...emps-then-spike-temperature.html#post27733418


Use an old Credit/Debit card to remove the black goo, that’s what i did and it didn’t scratch the pcb and it got all of it off. As far as resealing it goes its a matter of opinion, personally I did reseal mine with the same stuff Intel uses and I couldn’t be more pleased with the results, just be very conservative with it and putting a really thin layer on, that way the IHS can make full contact with the die. For that I squeezed some of the rubber gasket maker on a paper plate and applied it with a toothpick to the bottom edges of the ihs.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

You might also want to consider one of these... easier to get the little bits between the SMD's than a credit card. Obviously not a zero-cost solution but still cheap and useful for a number of electronic related jobs.


Nylon Spudger


----------



## Jspinks020

DiGiCiDAL said:


> You might also want to consider one of these... easier to get the little bits between the SMD's than a credit card. Obviously not a zero-cost solution but still cheap and useful for a number of electronic related jobs.
> 
> 
> Nylon Spudger


Good Luck Finding one of those still. Or any Good and Real job for that matter, sit at you're Residence and Smoke Cigarettes and Coffee and Tell me about it etc lol


----------



## TwilightRavens

DiGiCiDAL said:


> You might also want to consider one of these... easier to get the little bits between the SMD's than a credit card. Obviously not a zero-cost solution but still cheap and useful for a number of electronic related jobs.
> 
> 
> Nylon Spudger


A tube of Kryonaut comes with a very similar tool that can be used for that purpose.


----------



## Bluescreendeath

TwilightRavens said:


> Use an old Credit/Debit card to remove the black goo, that’s what i did and it didn’t scratch the pcb and it got all of it off. As far as resealing it goes its a matter of opinion, personally I did reseal mine with the same stuff Intel uses and I couldn’t be more pleased with the results, just be very conservative with it and putting a really thin layer on, that way the IHS can make full contact with the die. For that I squeezed some of the rubber gasket maker on a paper plate and applied it with a toothpick to the bottom edges of the ihs.


Thanks, it worked!


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

TwilightRavens said:


> A tube of Kryonaut comes with a very similar tool that can be used for that purpose.



True. Great tip. Also with a little extra effort (due to the flimsy nature of them) those TIM spatulas included with many different kinds of paste and in block kits would also likely work decently.


----------



## Jayce1971

I used the RockItcool delid tool on my new 7700k. Worked like a charm, and with conductonaut on both sides of the bigger ihs, dropped temps around 15c under load. Very pleased with this product and the results.


----------



## Dreamliner

I'm just a bit lost here. I'm going to be delidding a 7820X and already ordered RockIt tool. I'm trying to find Conductonaut but am only really finding that great big 3.9oz version but I don't know if it comes with the black swabs or not and the tip looks wide, not a needle point. Also not sure on how exactly to cover the extra components on the chip.

1) I saw a guide of someone who did this to a laptop and covered the chip with black electrical tape. Thoughts? (http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160516/3280ef11a640ae86cfff031ab8456881.jpg)

2) Can I spread Conductonaut with a regular q-tip?

3) If I don't use black electrical tape to cover the chip, should I use nail polish, and exactly what kind?

4) Exactly what kind of sealant should I use? I've got some red gasket maker silicone, will that work? (I only plan to do a very small dab in 4 corners, just enough so the IHS doesn't fall off when handled gently.)

I'm a bit nervous and am looking for the best/simplest solutions I can find.


----------



## GraphicsWhore

Dreamliner said:


> I'm just a bit lost here. I'm going to be delidding a 7820X and already ordered RockIt tool. I'm trying to find Conductonaut but am only really finding that great big 3.9oz version but I don't know if it comes with the black swabs or not and the tip looks wide, not a needle point. Also not sure on how exactly to cover the extra components on the chip.
> 
> 1) I saw a guide of someone who did this to a laptop and covered the chip with black electrical tape. Thoughts? (http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160516/3280ef11a640ae86cfff031ab8456881.jpg)
> 
> 2) Can I spread Conductonaut with a regular q-tip?
> 
> 3) If I don't use black electrical tape to cover the chip, should I use nail polish, and exactly what kind?
> 
> 4) Exactly what kind of sealant should I use? I've got some red gasket maker silicone, will that work? (I only plan to do a very small dab in 4 corners, just enough so the IHS doesn't fall off when handled gently.)
> 
> I'm a bit nervous and am looking for the best/simplest solutions I can find.


No need to be nervous. The process is a lot less complicated than it seems. As for your questions:

1. Electrical tape is fine.

2. Sure 

3. Use tape

4. I used gasket maker. Works well.


----------



## white owl

Most of us just clear over the caps and stuff with clear cellulose nail polish. It seals them 100%.

Cotton isn't ideal because it leaves the fibers behind, that's why the included ones are rubberized. Use a nylon paintbrush.
I don't use any but RTV silicone is what most people use since it's what came on the CPU. Scrape all the original off with a credit card first.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

I just used a small nylon brush, no masking - but I used CLU as I still have a bunch and in my own testing the difference is negligible (despite claiming twice the conductivity, I've never seen more than a 2-3C delta at load over CLU). I still apply it (Conductonaut) with a brush however as I don't like their little q-tips as much.


Latest one done:










I only wish it was as great an overclocker as the buggy HWMonitor shows it to be. :specool:












I'm thinking 8GHz with an 18GHz core and a 9.5GHz core is a record in more than one way... especially since peak temps were in the 70s. In reality it's 4.6GHz on all cores with the best 2 running a little more voltage and set at 4.8GHz. Good enough for a 3093 in Cinebench R15.


----------



## Dreamliner

DiGiCiDAL said:


> I just used a small nylon brush, no masking - but I used CLU as I still have a bunch and in my own testing the difference is negligible (despite claiming twice the conductivity, I've never seen more than a 2-3C delta at load over CLU).


What is CLU? Also, your pictures did not work.


----------



## mouacyk

Dreamliner said:


> What is “cellulose” nail polish?
> 
> I found that $5 nylon mini-paintbrush set, that the right one to get? Any place to get the same Q-Tips included? (I’m looking at getting that bigger tube so I don’t know if it comes with them or not).
> 
> So you just leave the IHS loose and put lock it down with the socket?
> 
> 
> 
> What is CLU? Also, your pictures did not work.


Coolaboratory liquid ultra. Not the villain from Tron.


----------



## Dreamliner

mouacyk said:


> Coolaboratory liquid ultra. Not the villain from Tron.


Ha!


----------



## Dreamliner

white owl said:


> Most of us just clear over the caps and stuff with clear cellulose nail polish. It seals them 100%.
> 
> Cotton isn't ideal because it leaves the fibers behind, that's why the included ones are rubberized. Use a nylon paintbrush.
> I don't use any but RTV silicone is what most people use since it's what came on the CPU. Scrape all the original off with a credit card first.


What is “cellulose” nail polish?

I found that $5 nylon mini-paintbrush set, that the right one to get? Any place to get the same Q-Tips included? (I’m looking at getting that bigger tube so I don’t know if it comes with them or not). 

So you just leave the IHS loose and put lock it down with the socket?


----------



## Falkentyne

Dreamliner said:


> What is “cellulose” nail polish?
> 
> I found that $5 nylon mini-paintbrush set, that the right one to get? Any place to get the same Q-Tips included? (I’m looking at getting that bigger tube so I don’t know if it comes with them or not).
> 
> So you just leave the IHS loose and put lock it down with the socket?


It's an important ingredient.
There are a few types of nail polish. The ones that have Cellulose in it are what you're supposed to use on CPU's. The ones that don't have it shouldn't be used (i don't know why. It was mentioned in a delidding article).


----------



## Dreamliner

Falkentyne said:


> It's an important ingredient.
> 
> There are a few types of nail polish. The ones that have Cellulose in it are what you're supposed to use on CPU's. The ones that don't have it shouldn't be used (i don't know why. It was mentioned in a delidding article).


I looked for it and couldn’t find it. Any idea how to find cellulose nail polish?

Also, do you just keep your IHS loose? Do you know where to get the black q-tips? Are those $5 mini paint brush kits the right things?


----------



## DeliddyDoo

Hi guys!

One quick question.: Do you have experience with Permatex Ultra Grey? This is the only one available in my country, but everyone recommends the black one... There should be not much difference between the two in theory, but I am curious if someone has already tried it or not.

Okay, bonus question.: If you wan to delid your cpu again that you previously glued back with just a little bit of rtv silicone, do you use the delid kit again, or you just try to scrape off the silicone with something like a thin plastic card. I am just asking this because I have read it in more than one places on the internet, and I was thinking to myself why not use the delid kit again?? Why risk scratching the pcb? It should be much much easier to remove the "cap" with a delid kit for the second time than it was with the factory sealing as one would never want to use as much adhesive as Intel does. lol


----------



## Falkentyne

Dreamliner said:


> I looked for it and couldn’t find it. Any idea how to find cellulose nail polish?
> 
> Also, do you just keep your IHS loose? Do you know where to get the black q-tips? Are those $5 mini paint brush kits the right things?


You go to a pharmacy or beauty shop and look at the ingredients listed in the package.


----------



## Dreamliner

Falkentyne said:


> You go to a pharmacy or beauty shop and look at the ingredients listed in the package.


Ok. Thx. 

Also, do you just keep your IHS loose? Do you know where to get the black q-tips? Are those $5 mini paint brush kits the right things?


----------



## Falkentyne

Dreamliner said:


> Ok. Thx.
> 
> Also, do you just keep your IHS loose? Do you know where to get the black q-tips? Are those $5 mini paint brush kits the right things?


Don't have a delid. Never delidded before. I only did this stuff on a laptop.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Dreamliner said:


> I looked for it and couldn’t find it. Any idea how to find cellulose nail polish?
> 
> Also, do you just keep your IHS loose? Do you know where to get the black q-tips? Are those $5 mini paint brush kits the right things?



It should say in the ingredients (you might have to look it up on the website). As far as I'm aware, almost all nail polishes are made with nitrocellulose coupled with maybe some placticizers and acetate. There are some that have benzene derivatives (for UV protection) which I think react badly with PCB.


I use this: CVS Pop-arazzi Clearly Thinking which hasn't had any problems (so far at least...).


I put the smallest amount possible of gasket maker (I apply it with a toothpick) on the corners only. I apply about a 1mm dot in each corner - it basically squishes flat to nothing and you can easily twist off the IHS after it cures with minimal force - however it does keep the IHS in place during moving and seating the CPU on the board.


I've never found the exact ones they use in the kit (but nylon brushes do work well) however, I think I might try lipstick wands in the future... they should work well and are cheap. Plus they're one sided, which is better IMO - once you've used one side, you really don't want to use the other or you'll get leftover LM on yourself and possibly your work surface, etc. You should be able to do dozens of CPUs on the two that come with it though - it's not like it 'goes bad' on the tip, and that's less wasted the next time as well possibly. :thumb:


----------



## Dreamliner

Just curious, what is the best program to use to stress test? I've read Prime95 isn't so great because of unrealistic loads that could damage the CPU. In the past I've used ROG RealBench but right now a bone stock 7820x is only showing 58c max with the test running. I know OC will increase this, but for how loud everybody is screaming about Intel TIM, I expected much higher stock temps.


----------



## Falkentyne

Dreamliner said:


> Just curious, what is the best program to use to stress test? I've read Prime95 isn't so great because of unrealistic loads that could damage the CPU. In the past I've used ROG RealBench but right now a bone stock 7820x is only showing 58c max with the test running. I know OC will increase this, but for how loud everybody is screaming about Intel TIM, I expected much higher stock temps.


Prime95 with in place fixed FFT's 1344K, with both AVX disabled and enabled (toggled in the local.txt and undoc.txt file for instructions) is a decent test for basic stability


----------



## white owl

There's nothing unrealistic about P95 Small FFT without AVX. Blender is real software that is just as hard on CPUs as Small FFT.
P95 is the only thing that's been able to help me get a stable OC on a gaming rig. P95 can crash much faster than anything else, it can crash in 10 minutes what might take RealBench 2 hours to crash. Tbh my thermals are about the same using RealBench vs Small FFT without AVX. Hell even using blend which is fairly cool will crash much faster than RealBench.
I don't feel like overclocking should take you 12 hours to fully stabilize the core just for you to repeat the process with cache and then ram. And what if you've had a crash after 2 hours? That's 2 hours of time and degradation wasted.
I undershoot my vcore (static) with manual ram and cache, P95 crashes immediately. Bump vcore accordingly then you get a crash after 5 minutes. Give it an extra 0.005 or 0.01 until you can run v26.6 Small FFT for over an hour. Once you're well past an hour leave your vcore settings and set your cache voltage to what you're comfortable with and pick a speed you know is too high then work your way back until Small FFT runs for over an hour. Once you get to the ram you can use Blend to stress the ram really hard, I let it run for 6 hours. If your core, cache and ram can hold up in blend for over 6 hours you should be pretty damn stable. When you do core and cache you can run for longer than an hour, that's pretty much my minimum, I run the core for 2 hours.
P95 Blend is equally capable of finding your core stability at a lower temp but you'll wan to run it longer.
I came up with this method after struggling to get game stable when using Handbrake. RealBench or Aida. Both have their uses but imo core stability isn't it.
If you think P95 is magical and works components too hard just because, I'd suggest Blender as it's equally hard.
If you think P95 is just a normal stress test utility that gives you the option to run it how you'd like (including crazy hot), I'd give it a shot.


----------



## Dreamliner

Perhaps I'll have to try P95. I just built a rig with a bone stock 7820X in a Asus TUF Mark 1. I set all cores to 4.8Ghz and changed zero other BIOS settings. Cinebench R15 gave me a 2040 score and RealBench ran for over 2 hours with a max temp of 101c. I bought a delid kit and Conductonaut is on it's way, but I'm not sure its neccessary?


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Dreamliner said:


> Perhaps I'll have to try P95. I just built a rig with a bone stock 7820X in a Asus TUF Mark 1. I set all cores to 4.8Ghz and changed zero other BIOS settings. Cinebench R15 gave me a 2040 score and RealBench ran for over 2 hours with a max temp of 101c. I bought a delid kit and Conductonaut is on it's way, but I'm not sure its neccessary?



Although every chip is slightly different - I can tell you that it will definitely make a difference. How much that difference is, that's the unknown.


In my case with my 7820X - I was about the same situation as you... and 101C is why it will make a difference. After delidding I was able to do 5.0GHz on all cores with .07V less vcore than I required to hit 4.8 previously - although I ultimately opted for a more conservative per-core OC with 2 cores at 5GHz and the remainder all running at 4.5. This allowed me max temps of under 80C on a RealBench run and a nearly identical 2029 Cinebench score. It made even more difference on my 7920X which runs all 12 cores at 4.8GHz and never goes over 85C - it turns in a 3025 R15 score. 



Although 101C is still technically under max... that's definitely not a temperature I ever want to see on my cores, even for a reasonably short time. You're definitely requiring extra voltage to maintain stability under those thermals... once things are cooler, you won't need quite as much and will reduce the likelihood of degrading the chip.


----------



## white owl

101c on RealBench? Jesus.
How much vcore was that?


----------



## RichKnecht

white owl said:


> 101c on RealBench? Jesus.
> How much vcore was that?


Ditto that. I don't like it when my 7900X hits 85 on any core. I would either delid or lower your OC.


----------



## xutnubu

I got a cheap 3770K from a friend, it runs really hot so I'm going to be delidding it. I've never done this before, can you guys tell me if there's something I should insulate here?










I'm thinking of the golden contacts, but I'm not sure.

Do you think it'd be wise to cover those with a thermal pad? I've found some Kapton tape, but it's expensive here.

I've noticed the 3770K is not like other more modern dies that have contacts very close to the die, so I'm probably safe not insulating anything?


----------



## ThrashZone

white owl said:


> 101c on RealBench? Jesus.
> How much vcore was that?


Hi,
Auto probably just over 1.3v


----------



## white owl

xutnubu said:


> I got a cheap 3770K from a friend, it runs really hot so I'm going to be delidding it. I've never done this before, can you guys tell me if there's something I should insulate here?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm thinking of the golden contacts, but I'm not sure.
> 
> Do you think it'd be wise to cover those with a thermal pad? I've found some Kapton tape, but it's expensive here.
> 
> I've noticed the 3770K is not like other more modern dies that have contacts very close to the die, so I'm probably safe not insulating anything?


 You don't have to insulate anything that won't come in contact with the liquid metal. Those contacts aren't even under the IHS.

Tape? Thermal pads? Why not use what's been mentioned in the OP? Or even on the last page.


----------



## xutnubu

> You don't have to insulate anything that won't come in contact with the liquid metal. Those contacts aren't even under the IHS.
> 
> Tape? Thermal pads? Why not use what's been mentioned in the OP? Or even on the last page.


Well, obviously the intention is for the liquid metal to stay only on the die, but things sometimes don't go as planned, that's why I was wondering if I should insulate anything should things go south one way or another.

I've read about nail polish, but I'm not sure if I can get the right type here (cellulose?). That's why I was going to use electrical type, "kapton-like" or such.


----------



## Falkentyne

xutnubu said:


> Well, obviously the intention is for the liquid metal to stay only on the die, but things sometimes don't go as planned, that's why I was wondering if I should insulate anything should things go south one way or another.
> 
> I've read about nail polish, but I'm not sure if I can get the right type here (cellulose?). That's why I was going to use electrical type, "kapton-like" or such.


Nail polish is all over the place, everywhere.
Just go to your local beauty shop and look at the ingredients. It's not a rare ingredient. It's everywhere.
And it costs like...$3 dollars (USD) to buy.

I mean you could also buy this stuff:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008O9YIV6/ref=ox_sc_saved_title_5?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1

But a lot more expensive. But it works.

And yes, you want to insulate everything exposed but if it's not under the IHS, there's no point in insulating it. I mean, think for a moment.
If liquid metal ever managed to get onto those areas outside the IHS, you have far more important issues to worry about --like your motherboard getting destroyed by conductive balls of doom.


----------



## xutnubu

Fair enough. Sometimes I overthink things. I was just worried that the IHS might move during installation to the socket and the LM could spread, but I got some silicone sealant now to put a bit on each corner to hold it together.


----------



## Falkentyne

xutnubu said:


> Fair enough. Sometimes I overthink things. I was just worried that the IHS might move during installation to the socket and the LM could spread, but I got some silicone sealant now to put a bit on each corner to hold it together.


Overthinking things is a good quality. Better than not doing enough and letting mistakes happen.


----------



## xutnubu

Well I managed to take like 20C off. I got it OC'd to 4.5GHz @ 1.34v (not the best chip). I've noticed the temp on one of the cores is up to 6C higher than the others but only when benchmarking, in games most cores stay consistent at around 55-65C.


----------



## suprc4

Delidded my i9 9900k last night with the der8auer tool(Which der8auer claims is 100% impossible to kill the cpu). Cleaned it up and put it in with the der8auer oc frame so I could do direct die. I was getting error code 23 on my aorus master pro and the computer would just boot cycle it wouldnt stay on. I'm thinking a short somewhere? I tried putting back on the original socket tensioner and ihs just to see if it was the mounting pressure that was not enough from the direct die but I get the same error code too. The error code is not listed in the gigabyte manual or anywhere online. I tried only one stick of ram in the 1st and 2nd ram slot but I haven't tried the 3rd or 4th yet because I ran out of time but I will try that later today. Has anyone else had this happen before? The cpu doesn't seem like its dead because otherwise the motherboard would show the error code for the cpu and it would just stay on and not boot cycle. Also I couldn't figure out how to get all of the black silicone off of the die? I used a plastic credit card to scrape most of it off, could that be an issue too?


----------



## TwilightRavens

suprc4 said:


> Delidded my i9 9900k last night with the der8auer tool(Which der8auer claims is 100% impossible to kill the cpu). Cleaned it up and put it in with the der8auer oc frame so I could do direct die. I was getting error code 23 on my aorus master pro and the computer would just boot cycle it wouldnt stay on. I'm thinking a short somewhere? I tried putting back on the original socket tensioner and ihs just to see if it was the mounting pressure that was not enough from the direct die but I get the same error code too. The error code is not listed in the gigabyte manual or anywhere online. I tried only one stick of ram in the 1st and 2nd ram slot but I haven't tried the 3rd or 4th yet because I ran out of time but I will try that later today. Has anyone else had this happen before? The cpu doesn't seem like its dead because otherwise the motherboard would show the error code for the cpu and it would just stay on and not boot cycle. Also I couldn't figure out how to get all of the black silicone off of the die? I used a plastic credit card to scrape most of it off, could that be an issue too?


Did a little research and error code 23 corresponds to CPU and RAM. Hopefully that helps.


----------



## pdasterly

any tips for delid on maximus vi hero board?


----------



## PrimoGhost

pdasterly said:


> any tips for delid on maximus vi hero board?


Remember to protect the FIVR. That's all.

Does enyone know, what's thats four pads on series SL and CL?


----------



## white owl

They're contacts used at Intel.


----------



## XLifted

Valgaur said:


> Quote:Originally Posted by *Daredevil 720*
> 
> "Direct-die again"? What happened last time?
> Did they ask you to glue the IHS back on?
> 
> Also are you sure this hasn't anything to do with the overclocker's insurance plan?
> 
> 
> Nope the delid was covered by normal warranty! no insurance plan needed. I glued my IHS back on to make it easier for them.


Is this still accurate? Intel is covering RMAs with delidded CPUs? 
Thought they hit you over the head for delidding and then tell you to kick rocks with that warranty claim ??


----------



## Valgaur

XLifted said:


> Is this still accurate? Intel is covering RMAs with delidded CPUs?
> Thought they hit you over the head for delidding and then tell you to kick rocks with that warranty claim ??


I would say it is heavily looked down upon. I have it posted in the main posting of this thread that any risk is on the individual attempting this mod. I would follow the vice method, which is much safer and simply take your time doing the act and reading all the materials in this thread. Let me know if you have any other questions.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Valgaur said:


> I would say it is heavily looked down upon. I have it posted in the main posting of this thread that any risk is on the individual attempting this mod. I would follow the vice method, which is much safer and simply take your time doing the act and reading all the materials in this thread. Let me know if you have any other questions.


I agree, the vice method or one of the delidding kits like der8ers or the Rockit. You could do the razor blade method but I would only suggest that if you have a steady hand, I don’t and have killed two CPU’s because of it.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Ah the 2700X was easier to de-lid than the FX-9590. The adhesive is cheaper on the Ryzen chips and cuts much easier.


----------



## rhkcommander959

ShrimpBrime said:


> Ah the 2700X was easier to de-lid than the FX-9590. The adhesive is cheaper on the Ryzen chips and cuts much easier.


Is that a peltier? I don't recognize the block.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

rhkcommander959 said:


> Is that a peltier? I don't recognize the block.


Indeed it's a Peltier 136W TEC # 12715

The block is a modified ThermalTake Big Water SE. It's served me well for an easy 10 years!!!


----------



## rhkcommander959

ShrimpBrime said:


> Indeed it's a Peltier 136W TEC # 12715
> 
> The block is a modified ThermalTake Big Water SE. It's served me well for an easy 10 years!!!


That is awesome! I definitely recognize it from that picture.

I used the same bracket for the big water to make my swiftech mcw-6002AT compatible all the way up through lga1366. Got it for a deal at a garage sale in the socket A era, the guy had some leak-prone 5.25 bay reservoirs, then hooked the peltier up backwards, killed his CPU. His loss, my gain!

The base plate got lost after I tried to fix the bad grind job so I'm making a new one using a piece of "bullion" copper bar - it's about a quarter inch thick but they stamped it so I plan to solder fill the stamping then lap it to mirrorshine. When I cut it it doesn't look cast so here's hoping it works out. If not I might buy some 1/2" telco or similar. The original baseplate was for socket A and had an offset hump, I then flattened it back flattish after a bad grind down and used it on delidded 939 opteron 165s and some athlons. Saw some 775 use too but not as much.

I still have it, should try it out on these lower power modern CPUs, I think mine had a 226w TEC. How well does a 136w handle?


----------



## ShrimpBrime

It does pretty good, but then the Cpu it's running on is 105w so it's a little hairy getting it dialed in. To Fry a cpu with a TEC is a big concern for me. These TECs once heat soaked turn into heat pumps and both sides get hot, the Cpu is in trouble. 

Right now running the 2700x at 4Ghz 1.1990v all 16 threads no boost. I've installed a larger plate, at least twice the size in the picture above and I can maintain a better temperature. 

As far as I know for the 40mm TEC I'm running it's the largest in wattage. # 12715. If yours was 226w, it was likely 50 or 60mm. 

Also did some TEC cooling on a couple of FX processors a few years back. I thought the results where pretty good. using the exact same peltier as a matter of fact. Think I was up around 5.6Ghz on one or two cores... but I had fun never the less.

I don't want to take away too much from this thread as it is in the Intel section, so I invite you to Warp9-systems to have some good reading. you can view all the TEC pictures and stuff there, but you'll have to register.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

Copper Bullion is good stuff. I've got a hand crafted LN2 GPU pot that I've made. Never used it yet though.... I generally Cpu overclock. Can't remember how big, but it was more than a quarter inch thick. 

I stopped lapping to a mirror finish some years ago, the results where not enough to take the time even though it looks cool as heck. So I'll generally stop at 1500 grit. As long as the surfaces meet flat, the heat transfer should be good.


----------



## rhkcommander959

ShrimpBrime said:


> Copper Bullion is good stuff. I've got a hand crafted LN2 GPU pot that I've made. Never used it yet though.... I generally Cpu overclock. Can't remember how big, but it was more than a quarter inch thick.
> 
> I stopped lapping to a mirror finish some years ago, the results where not enough to take the time even though it looks cool as heck. So I'll generally stop at 1500 grit. As long as the surfaces meet flat, the heat transfer should be good.


I fully agree, it's just so beautiful. I've only done a handful of soldered processors and a few blocks, it has to be a passion project or it's too much work.


----------



## TwilightRavens

So I have a really... odd question, one I can’t really find a straightforward answer to but I figured I’d ask here. Has anyone tried Liquid metal between the IHS and the cooler on a soldered CPU? If so is there a noticeable difference in temperature vs conventional thermal paste? I ask because I’m looking for every possible bit of headroom I can shave off of my Core 2 Extreme QX9650 so I can get it clocked as high as possible, if its just one degree then I’m not going to bother but if it’s like 5C or so I may do it.

Not to confuse people into thinking I am replacing the solder with liquid metal, that’s not what I would do, the chip would stay soldered, I would just put liquid metal on top of the IHS and sandwiched between it and the AIO i am getting, and yes I am very aware about liquid metal and copper/aluminum.

If anyone has any insight on this it would be welcomed very much.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

The solder will conduct better than the liquid metal, there would be no reason to de-lid a soldered processor to re-lid with liquid metal.


----------



## TwilightRavens

ShrimpBrime said:


> The solder will conduct better than the liquid metal, there would be no reason to de-lid a soldered processor to re-lid with liquid metal.


I literally stated I’m not delidding it lol, what I meant was between the heatspreader and the cooler.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

TwilightRavens said:


> I literally stated I’m not delidding it lol, what I meant was between the heatspreader and the cooler.


It took you two paragraphs to state you where not de-lidding in a thread for de-lidding.... how the heck am I supposed to know?>? lol

So, if you use liquid metal, and the cooler is basically a permanent fix, how would you remove the cpu from the board later while the cooler will cover the retention bracket arm?

Would LM be better than TIM = Yes


----------



## TwilightRavens

ShrimpBrime said:


> It took you two paragraphs to state you where not de-lidding in a thread for de-lidding.... how the heck am I supposed to know?>? lol
> 
> So, if you use liquid metal, and the cooler is basically a permanent fix, how would you remove the cpu from the board later while the cooler will cover the retention bracket arm?
> 
> Would LM be better than TIM = Yes


Yeah sorry didn't mean to come off as salty on it, was not my intention. Anyway I am not sure what 100% I plan to do, its still somewhat in the planning stage as to what I am going to do and am just formulating ideas. Was just thinking about ways to shave off a degree here and a degree there without exponentially increasing my budget on the build to the point where its not worth it (kind of already there but oh well). Anyway thanks, I wasn't sure if it would be like liquid metal on a GPU where it makes one degree of difference give or take.


----------



## rhkcommander959

TwilightRavens said:


> Was just thinking about ways to shave off a degree here and a degree there without exponentially increasing my budget on the build to the point where its not worth it (kind of already there but oh well). Anyway thanks, I wasn't sure if it would be like liquid metal on a GPU where it makes one degree of difference give or take.


Don't waste the cash with liquid metal and the IHS on an AIO. Is it better? Sure. But if there if either surface is untrue (not PERFECTLY flat), you lose those gains anyway. You COULD lap each surface, but why spend that energy on an AIO.

Without lapping, there will be maybe 1ºC difference, but it could go either way depending on surface prep and mounting. With lapping, you will see maybe a little more efficiency but the same can be said with TIM. This is comparing good TIM to it, not AS5 or worse.

And there is extra hassle running that crap. 

----------------

tl;dr my opinion - just don't.


----------



## skupples

liquid metal typically voids your warranty too (if you still have your IHS on that is) as removal removes the IHS markings.


----------



## rhkcommander959

skupples said:


> liquid metal typically voids your warranty cuz cleaning it off often times removes the info on the IHS too
> it will 100% take it off if u use the scotchbright pad they send.


Too true, it eats into the nickel coating, I've experienced that as well. That or staining, depending on how long it's sat.


----------



## skupples

Yep, 

I love CLU, but its definitely a damaging product.

I believe we decided it was likely the gallium contents as its an indiscriminate metal eater. 

the scotch bright pad they send for prep & cleaning doesn't help the IHS either


----------



## mouacyk

oh yeah, it could roll out onto your CPU socket or motherboard components


----------



## skupples

I used one of those reflow solder pads once. It was pretty legit, but a pain in the ass to properly install.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

TwilightRavens said:


> Yeah sorry didn't mean to come off as salty on it, was not my intention. Anyway I am not sure what 100% I plan to do, its still somewhat in the planning stage as to what I am going to do and am just formulating ideas. Was just thinking about ways to shave off a degree here and a degree there without exponentially increasing my budget on the build to the point where its not worth it (kind of already there but oh well). Anyway thanks, I wasn't sure if it would be like liquid metal on a GPU where it makes one degree of difference give or take.


All good, thought it was kinda funny actually....

So an easy way to shave off a couple of degree is by lowering your ambient temps. See, ambient temps are the end of all liquid and air coolers (providing chilling is not implemented). In example, if your room is 75f, try and lower that room temp to 70f and you should notice the temp drop on your system. This is probably THE cheapest way to lower temps with your existing system.

However, you DID say that you where not going to de-lid the processor. BUT if you do de-lid, you'll drop more than 1 or 2c in most cases while the stock TIM under the IHS plate doesn't do well. Hence this thread


----------



## TwilightRavens

ShrimpBrime said:


> All good, thought it was kinda funny actually....
> 
> So an easy way to shave off a couple of degree is by lowering your ambient temps. See, ambient temps are the end of all liquid and air coolers (providing chilling is not implemented). In example, if your room is 75f, try and lower that room temp to 70f and you should notice the temp drop on your system. This is probably THE cheapest way to lower temps with your existing system.
> 
> However, you DID say that you where not going to de-lid the processor. BUT if you do de-lid, you'll drop more than 1 or 2c in most cases while the stock TIM under the IHS plate doesn't do well. Hence this thread


Yeah I knew that, with my i7-5775C I dropped probably about 20C or so from 4.4GHz using my Corsair h100i. Though I really would consider going bare die on this QX9650 if there was a fool-proof way of delidding a soldered chip. I mean I have seen one of der8aur's videos where I think he delidded a 6950X and It dropped a few degrees off like 5C-6C. Idk just kinda of a weird project to do, mainly because 775 CPU's are cheap if you screw something up . Its mainly difficult because of the 2 dual core dies under the IHS so theres more solder holding it in place than say a 6950X or similar CPU, or at least that's what I think. The only soldered CPU I delidded was an old P4 and I know I killed that but I was also not really trying not to lol.


----------



## skupples

portable ACs have gone way down in price 

I'm actually planning on buying one when the hurricane sales come around.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

TwilightRavens said:


> ShrimpBrime said:
> 
> 
> 
> All good, thought it was kinda funny actually....
> 
> So an easy way to shave off a couple of degree is by lowering your ambient temps. See, ambient temps are the end of all liquid and air coolers (providing chilling is not implemented). In example, if your room is 75f, try and lower that room temp to 70f and you should notice the temp drop on your system. This is probably THE cheapest way to lower temps with your existing system.
> 
> However, you DID say that you where not going to de-lid the processor. BUT if you do de-lid, you'll drop more than 1 or 2c in most cases while the stock TIM under the IHS plate doesn't do well. Hence this thread /forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah I knew that, with my i7-5775C I dropped probably about 20C or so from 4.4GHz using my Corsair h100i. Though I really would consider going bare die on this QX9650 if there was a fool-proof way of delidding a soldered chip. I mean I have seen one of der8aur's videos where I think he delidded a 6950X and It dropped a few degrees off like 5C-6C. Idk just kinda of a weird project to do, mainly because 775 CPU's are cheap if you screw something up /forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif. Its mainly difficult because of the 2 dual core dies under the IHS so theres more solder holding it in place than say a 6950X or similar CPU, or at least that's what I think. The only soldered CPU I delidded was an old P4 and I know I killed that but I was also not really trying not to lol.
Click to expand...

I only know one guy thats delidded enough processors to help a guy like you with a solder chip. Me.
My last soldered delid was tge 2700x. Ive done multiple Phenom and FX chips successfully. 16 in total if memory serves well today. 
I have a ryzen 1200? 1300? On the way, thats getting a delid. Have a 1400 that needs it too.... Doesn't need it, I just like delidding.

But when delid a soldered chip, its best to run without IHS plate on a custom loop.


----------



## TwilightRavens

ShrimpBrime said:


> I only know one guy thats delidded enough processors to help a guy like you with a solder chip. Me.
> My last soldered delid was tge 2700x. Ive done multiple Phenom and FX chips successfully. 16 in total if memory serves well today.
> I have a ryzen 1200? 1300? On the way, thats getting a delid. Have a 1400 that needs it too.... Doesn't need it, I just like delidding.
> 
> But when delid a soldered chip, its best to run without IHS plate on a custom loop.


Yeah that's the plan in the future possibly, I used to have an old 3770K that I ran bare die at like.... 5.4GHz or 5.6GHz if my memory serves me (for benching) but those are cake to delid vs having to heat up the IHS and such to get solder off, which I am pretty sure you know since you have probably done a fair amount more of them than me . But for the most part have semi-retired from that because it got expensive killing top of the line mainstream socket (at the time) hardware for a few months until i'd have to get a new one. It'd just be fun to actually delid this thing in all honesty, without killing it of course lol.


----------



## ShrimpBrime

A rule of thumb I use for de-lidding. Never heat the IHS plate for more than 60 seconds. if the solder isn't melted within 60 seconds, you will kill the processor. With a Med to High flame with my Power Probe solder torch that's about the time it takes. usually 40-50 seconds. If the room is quiet enough, you'll actually "hear" the solder let go. 
The nice thing about AMD IHS plates is that they are large and rather tall. I use a heat sink on the pins. Hold the PCB with a model vice and clamp a pair of vice grips onto the plate. I only use just enough force with the vice so that the cpu stays pins down onto the heatsink with the weight of the vice grips attatched hands free. Once the solder melts, I just pull straight up and the plate comes right off. With AMD chips a heat sink under the pins is a must. i won't tell how I learned that the hard way 'whistles"
But yea, that's pretty much my secret above. pretty much exactly how I remove soldered IHS plates. Super easy and super quick. If I didn't need to cut the glue, it would literally take me 1 minute per de-lid. but throw in cutting glue, removing solder and lapping the core a bit.... more like 1 hours or more. haha.


----------



## rhkcommander959

ShrimpBrime said:


> A rule of thumb I use for de-lidding. Never heat the IHS plate for more than 60 seconds. if the solder isn't melted within 60 seconds, you will kill the processor. With a Med to High flame with my Power Probe solder torch that's about the time it takes. usually 40-50 seconds. If the room is quiet enough, you'll actually "hear" the solder let go.
> The nice thing about AMD IHS plates is that they are large and rather tall. I use a heat sink on the pins. Hold the PCB with a model vice and clamp a pair of vice grips onto the plate. I only use just enough force with the vice so that the cpu stays pins down onto the heatsink with the weight of the vice grips attatched hands free. Once the solder melts, I just pull straight up and the plate comes right off. With AMD chips a heat sink under the pins is a must. i won't tell how I learned that the hard way 'whistles"
> But yea, that's pretty much my secret above. pretty much exactly how I remove soldered IHS plates. Super easy and super quick. If I didn't need to cut the glue, it would literally take me 1 minute per de-lid. but throw in cutting glue, removing solder and lapping the core a bit.... more like 1 hours or more. haha.


Neat, was the gain worth it?


----------



## Sea Monkey

4690K 4.5GHz @ 1.27v with 32GB RAM @ 2133MHz. IntelBurnTest 10x run on Maximum - max core temp of 85C. Some stability tests included as well. POVRay benchmark, OCCT 5min. LDS, x264v2 five loops.


----------



## Falkentyne

suprc4 said:


> Delidded my i9 9900k last night with the der8auer tool(Which der8auer claims is 100% impossible to kill the cpu). Cleaned it up and put it in with the der8auer oc frame so I could do direct die. I was getting error code 23 on my aorus master pro and the computer would just boot cycle it wouldnt stay on. I'm thinking a short somewhere? I tried putting back on the original socket tensioner and ihs just to see if it was the mounting pressure that was not enough from the direct die but I get the same error code too. The error code is not listed in the gigabyte manual or anywhere online. I tried only one stick of ram in the 1st and 2nd ram slot but I haven't tried the 3rd or 4th yet because I ran out of time but I will try that later today. Has anyone else had this happen before? The cpu doesn't seem like its dead because otherwise the motherboard would show the error code for the cpu and it would just stay on and not boot cycle. Also I couldn't figure out how to get all of the black silicone off of the die? I used a plastic credit card to scrape most of it off, could that be an issue too?


I haven't seen you post back here for 2 months. What was the resolution of the issue? Was the CPU gone?
And removing the leftover solder is easily done with the quicksilver kit that rockitcool sells. But you have to leave it on awhile and also work it in and scrub it with a Q tip. I delidded my 9900K with the rockit 89 kit and got all of the quicksilver off, but it took awhile, and was slow. Then you can use their fitz(?) metal polisher to get it nice and shiny. If you wind up with some super hardened mark or something that simply won't come off, you can try 3000 grit sandpaper, but be very careful and wary of damaging the backside. If there are any scratches on the die, however, you may have to actually truly sand it with the way der8auer mentioned in his video. 

What was harder than cleaning the solder was cleaning the Intel RTV or whatever they used black glue off the PCB. Now THAT was scary, even using a credit card that took an amazingly long time and required being careful not to damage the PCB or break something off the back.

If you didn't damage any motherboard pins, then the only thing I can think of is that you static shocked something or damaged a SMD or something on the backside. Since you were using the direct die frame and I've seen people have problems with POST failures and that frame, I would see if you can test it in another motherboard and re-lidded with LM.


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## ShrimpBrime

rhkcommander959 said:


> Neat, was the gain worth it?


Almost always.


----------



## flexy123

(I am sure I might have posted here 4-5 years ago, when I attempted to delid my 4770k. I had a knife slip scare and stopped my delid attempt, and thought I destroyed the CPU, but I was lucky that I didn't cause any damage and that the CPU worked flawlessly)

Anyway, today, after so many years I tried it again out of boredom. I must have seen 9000 videos of people delidding with razors, and even a vid with someone delidding with the plastic package from his CPU, and another guy using a small plastic card. The idea was that you only need a tiny 2mm cut in one edge, and then use the card and do the rest. Sounds totally trivial, right?

Anyway, to make a long story short: I really tried today with a small exacto knife just to cut a small 2mm slit in the side. NO DICE. I tried several times and took my time, doing exactly what I must have seen a million times in videos. The black silicone is just so rock hard I wasn't able to even get into it, whatsoever. So I aborted that attempt too. I figure there is no other way than using a tool, fortunately you can now get these mini vice delid tools from China for €5 where people had success with. If I am bored again I might just get one of those, but not sure whether I care with such an old CPU. I was sooo convinced I get it right today...grrrrr....


----------



## tictoc

5 years since I posted in this thread. 

The 4790k, that I posted in this thread, is still running at the same clocks and volts (4.8GHz|1.28 volts), with the original application of CLU.


----------



## white owl

flexy123 said:


> (I am sure I might have posted here 4-5 years ago, when I attempted to delid my 4770k. I had a knife slip scare and stopped my delid attempt, and thought I destroyed the CPU, but I was lucky that I didn't cause any damage and that the CPU worked flawlessly)
> 
> Anyway, today, after so many years I tried it again out of boredom. I must have seen 9000 videos of people delidding with razors, and even a vid with someone delidding with the plastic package from his CPU, and another guy using a small plastic card. The idea was that you only need a tiny 2mm cut in one edge, and then use the card and do the rest. Sounds totally trivial, right?
> 
> Anyway, to make a long story short: I really tried today with a small exacto knife just to cut a small 2mm slit in the side. NO DICE. I tried several times and took my time, doing exactly what I must have seen a million times in videos. The black silicone is just so rock hard I wasn't able to even get into it, whatsoever. So I aborted that attempt too. I figure there is no other way than using a tool, fortunately you can now get these mini vice delid tools from China for €5 where people had success with. If I am bored again I might just get one of those, but not sure whether I care with such an old CPU. I was sooo convinced I get it right today...grrrrr....


It's much easier to knock it off with a vise. I've pushed 3 off without issue.


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## TwilightRavens

white owl said:


> It's much easier to knock it off with a vise. I've pushed 3 off without issue.


Or for peace of mind get one of those chinese knock off delid kits, or if you really want to then go the Rockit delid or Der8auer tools but the chinese knock offs work just as good for half the price.


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## Imprezzion

tictoc said:


> 5 years since I posted in this thread.
> 
> The 4790k, that I posted in this thread, is still running at the same clocks and volts (4.8GHz|1.28 volts), with the original application of CLU.


I'm quite surprised that CLU stays good for so long yeah. My 7700k is on my original delid and CLU 2 years exactly now and still the exact same temps as when I first delidded and OCed to 5Ghz.

I'm thinking of cleaning my H115i rad a bit and going for a bit more of a "dangerous" overclock as I have some room left in the voltage before it really gets up there. Running 1.36v now but I know it will survive up to 1.45-1.46v for a while, even if it will probably degrade at that voltage, but yeah 7700k's are pretty cheap nowadays so.. let's see if I can make 5.2Ghz or something on all 8 threads.

It will pretty easily do even 5.3Ghz without HT enabled so I have high hopes 5.2Ghz will run on HT enabled . If my H115i can keep the temps low enough (<90c with AVX stressing) before saturating and getting too hot.

EDIT: Ok, holy mother of.. It needs a LOT of volts to even remotely run 5.2Ghz stable with HT enabled... So far it seems 1.488-1.496v will kind of do for Prime AVX and temps aren't even *that* bad yet (94c hottest core) but that is a bit too much voltage even for my suicidal liking. I mean, i ran a 2500K on 5.3Ghz 1.525v for over 2 years and that thing is still alive somehow so..

EDIT2: It hates multipliers over 50.. I'm using BCLK OC now for 50x102.5 for 5125Mhz core and 4715Mhz ring and 2733Mhz RAM and this works just fine on 1.448v load. Temps maxed at 86/88/80/76 in Prime 27.9 AVX Small. Probably going to run high 60's low 70's in games. Totally acceptable temperatures imo. It should live for at least another year or so at that voltage / temperature before degrading too much.


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## El Media Vida

Hey guys I wondering, someone has lapping the die on 9th gen to remove the solder?
How much height reduce it? Do you use the stock IHS or 3th?


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## Pinnacle Fit

El Media Vida said:


> Hey guys I wondering, someone has lapping the die on 9th gen to remove the solder?
> 
> How much height reduce it? Do you use the stock IHS or 3th?




Rockitcool makes a 9th gen IHS. It’s only about $15


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Falkentyne

Pinnacle Fit said:


> Rockitcool makes a 9th gen IHS. It’s only about $15
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Removing the solder isn't the same as lapping the die.
Removing the solder doesn't exactly reduce the IHS height. To reduce the height you have to remove the Intel silicone adhesive and then relid (which is only a mm or so).
So you have to remove the original black adhesive (and preferably sand the edges of the IHS also)


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## 113802

Had the itch to de-lid something since I didn't have anymore Intel chips to de-lid I took a razor to my Athlon 64 x2 3800+ that kept running at 112c no matter what heatsink I used. 70c drop after de-lidding and using Noctua paste between the die and IHS.


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## Pinnacle Fit

WannaBeOCer said:


> Had the itch to de-lid something since I didn't have anymore Intel chips to de-lid I took a razor to my Athlon 64 x2 3800+ that kept running at 112c no matter what heatsink I used. 70c drop after de-lidding and using Noctua paste between the die and IHS.




Yea but you’re not ‘supposed’ to use a non conductive paste between die and ihs. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Pinnacle Fit

Falkentyne said:


> Removing the solder isn't the same as lapping the die.
> 
> Removing the solder doesn't exactly reduce the IHS height. To reduce the height you have to remove the Intel silicone adhesive and then relid (which is only a mm or so).
> 
> So you have to remove the original black adhesive (and preferably sand the edges of the IHS also)




Right. That’s true, and I misunderstood his point. My point was that instead of lapping, you’re better off just buying a new IHS when someone else has already done it and is charging a nominal fee. 

Frankly I think you lose a lot of the performance gains by relidding in the first place but that’s just my opinion. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## 113802

Pinnacle Fit said:


> Yea but you’re not ‘supposed’ to use a non conductive paste between die and ihs.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


NT-H1 isn't conductive: https://noctua.at/en/nt-h1-3-5g

Also there isn't anything wrong with using conductive heat transfer. I use liquid metal which is conductive, I placed clear nail polish on the surface around the die of my 3770k and 6700k. Don't use abrasive paste like IC Diamond that would scratch up the die.


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## Ceadderman

Pinnacle Fit said:


> Yea but you’re not ‘supposed’ to use a non conductive paste between die and ihs.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Since when? Every delidder pretty much uses CLU or CLP or TG LM between their die and IHS. I used CLU on my non K i7-4970 after prepping the PCB with clear nail polish. No pushout is the benefit of using liquid metal. Whereas a non conductive will pushout over time. :mellowsmi

Using LM dropped my Core 0 temp by nearly 20c. I doubt any of the non conductive TIMs on the market would have done that.... in retrospect I think that the temp was between 15-20c lower. :thinking:

~Ceadder :drink:


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## ShrimpBrime

WannaBeOCer said:


> Don't use abrasive paste like IC Diamond that would scratch up the die.


Scratch up the die? Well I gotta do that after de-lidding soldered processors. Aaanndd, I've always used nano-diamond pastes such as Antec Formula 7/6. Granted I do not re-use the IHS plate (most of the time) but I don't think diamond dust is going to hurt anything, at least I've yet to see an issue personally.

The "FX-5000" in my avatar was lapped down pretty good.. I took a lot of silicon off the top. Used Diamond nano pastes on that one too.
Here's a better picture of the FX-5000...


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## Pinnacle Fit

I just delidded my 9900k yesterday. Direct die from rockit cool. It doesn’t go over 60 sustained at 1.35V




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## ViTosS

Guys can I use liquid metal on the block of my Corsair H150i Pro? It is copper, but the radiator is aluminum, mey 8700k is delidded with LM between IHS and DIE but for the top of IHS I'm using Arctic MX-4 (tried Kryonaut but had worse results). So I'm thinking of using LM between the H150i Pro block and IHS, what do you think?


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## TwilightRavens

ViTosS said:


> Guys can I use liquid metal on the block of my Corsair H150i Pro? It is copper, but the radiator is aluminum, mey 8700k is delidded with LM between IHS and DIE but for the top of IHS I'm using Arctic MX-4 (tried Kryonaut but had worse results). So I'm thinking of using LM between the H150i Pro block and IHS, what do you think?


Liquid metal will stain copper but not eat it away like aluminum, although people say it seeps into it so far I haven’t seen any evidence of cooling temps being affected.


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## deepor

ViTosS said:


> Guys can I use liquid metal on the block of my Corsair H150i Pro? It is copper, but the radiator is aluminum, mey 8700k is delidded with LM between IHS and DIE but for the top of IHS I'm using Arctic MX-4 (tried Kryonaut but had worse results). So I'm thinking of using LM between the H150i Pro block and IHS, what do you think?



I used liquid metal between IHS and my NH-D14 and in the end I was pretty unhappy with how it turned out. I regret using it.

The base of the NH-D14 is nickel plated copper so should be a bit better than pure copper when using liquid metal. I left the cooler on the CPU for about five years before I had to remove it because the temperatures had turned bad. This was on a delidded i5-3570k. The liquid metal I used was CLU. The cooler was installed in 2013 and I left it on there until 2018 without touching anything. It took about four years before I noticed that the temperatures had gotten worse than they were originally. After five years, temperatures were about 10 °C higher than normal and then I removed the NH-D14.

The liquid metal had turned into a sort of tiny crystals. That dirt was stuck to the top of the IHS and to the base of the NH-D14. It was not possible to remove all of that dirt without force. I ended up using sandpaper on both the IHS and the NH-D14's base. After working on things, you could see that the liquid metal had moved through the nickel plating of the NH-D14's base and into the actual copper. Between the die and IHS, the situation was looking better. I could remove the residue on the inside of the IHS with a metal sponge, I didn't have to use sandpaper there. On the die, things came off with paper and cloth.

I have polished off all of the nickel plating on the base of the NH-D14. The edges of the base are now a red copper color, but it has a silver color in the middle where the liquid metal was touching it. When I tried putting a scratch into that silver area, I couldn't see a red copper color in the groove of the scratch. I guess this means the liquid metal has moved deep into the actual copper, it's not just a color change on top of the copper surface. The temperatures of the NH-D14 are still good.

I would recommend against liquid metal for the cooler because (1) it seems temperatures won't stay good indefinitely so in that sense it's not better than normal paste, and (2) it seems after a long enough time it will require sandpaper to clean which is pretty annoying and much worse than normal paste.


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## skupples

liquid metal eats metal, period. copper or nickel. Nickel will actually slow it down some. 

however, as noted - it takes a long time for that to matter, and usually it ends up just being the TIM thats the issue, not the pitting.

this will continue to be the case will all liquid metal until galium is no longer used as part of the ingredient set.


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## mouacyk

Pinnacle Fit said:


> I just delidded my 9900k yesterday. Direct die from rockit cool. It doesn’t go over 60 sustained at 1.35V
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


What kind of cooling and overclock are we talking about?


----------



## Falkentyne

deepor said:


> I used liquid metal between IHS and my NH-D14 and in the end I was pretty unhappy with how it turned out. I regret using it.
> 
> The base of the NH-D14 is nickel plated copper so should be a bit better than pure copper when using liquid metal. I left the cooler on the CPU for about five years before I had to remove it because the temperatures had turned bad. This was on a delidded i5-3570k. The liquid metal I used was CLU. The cooler was installed in 2013 and I left it on there until 2018 without touching anything. It took about four years before I noticed that the temperatures had gotten worse than they were originally. After five years, temperatures were about 10 °C higher than normal and then I removed the NH-D14.
> 
> The liquid metal had turned into a sort of tiny crystals. That dirt was stuck to the top of the IHS and to the base of the NH-D14. It was not possible to remove all of that dirt without force. I ended up using sandpaper on both the IHS and the NH-D14's base. After working on things, you could see that the liquid metal had moved through the nickel plating of the NH-D14's base and into the actual copper. Between the die and IHS, the situation was looking better. I could remove the residue on the inside of the IHS with a metal sponge, I didn't have to use sandpaper there. On the die, things came off with paper and cloth.
> 
> I have polished off all of the nickel plating on the base of the NH-D14. The edges of the base are now a red copper color, but it has a silver color in the middle where the liquid metal was touching it. When I tried putting a scratch into that silver area, I couldn't see a red copper color in the groove of the scratch. I guess this means the liquid metal has moved deep into the actual copper, it's not just a color change on top of the copper surface. The temperatures of the NH-D14 are still good.
> 
> I would recommend against liquid metal for the cooler because (1) it seems temperatures won't stay good indefinitely so in that sense it's not better than normal paste, and (2) it seems after a long enough time it will require sandpaper to clean which is pretty annoying and much worse than normal paste.


The IHS is also nickel plated copper. Keep that in mind.
Some people suggest using a compressible seal (like a polyurethane foam dam) around the LM application (whether it's under the IHS or around the heatsink), because dams help stop oxygen from getting between the contacted surfaces. Oxygen causes GREATLY accelerated absorption of gallium via oxidation which makes it even worse. Try putting a THICK coat of liquid metal on a copper heatsink (think) and leave it exposed to air for 2 weeks. It will be hardened thick with no liquid left at all.


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## Pinnacle Fit

mouacyk said:


> What kind of cooling and overclock are we talking about?




This kind of cooling.









And it’s about 5.2 semi-stable. It’s between 1.35 and 1.37 actually and around 75-80 now. I’m going to swap out the CLU for conductonaut since I’ve heard it works better. Maybe another polish of the die 




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## Pinnacle Fit

WannaBeOCer said:


> NT-H1 isn't conductive: https://noctua.at/en/nt-h1-3-5g
> 
> 
> 
> Also there isn't anything wrong with using conductive heat transfer. I use liquid metal which is conductive, I placed clear nail polish on the surface around the die of my 3770k and 6700k. Don't use abrasive paste like IC Diamond that would scratch up the die.




You and Ceadderman both misunderstood my point. I said you’re ‘not supposed to use nonconductive between the die and ihs’ 

As in you’re supposed to use a conductive one like CLU/clp/conductonaut. 

You’re supposed to put conductive on the bare silicon and then non conductive on top of the ihs where it makes contact with the heatsink. This was supposed to be as close as we could get to the true soldered interface that exists on some HEDT chips


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## 113802

Pinnacle Fit said:


> You and Ceadderman both misunderstood my point. I said you’re ‘not supposed to use nonconductive between the die and ihs’
> 
> As in you’re supposed to use a conductive one like CLU/clp/conductonaut.
> 
> You’re supposed to put conductive on the bare silicon and then non conductive on top of the ihs where it makes contact with the heatsink. This was supposed to be as close as we could get to the true soldered interface that exists on some HEDT chips
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You're right I did misunderstand you but there isn't a rule. I used CLU on both my 3770k(2013 w/ vice method which I ran naked with an EK block) along with 6700k(2016 w/ tool). I'm not wasting my CLU on an Athlon 64 x2 3800+, it had dried up thermal paste that just needed to be replaced.


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## Pinnacle Fit

WannaBeOCer said:


> You're right I did misunderstand you but there isn't a rule. I used CLU on both my 3770k(2013 w/ vice method which I ran naked with an EK block) along with 6700k(2016 w/ tool). I'm not wasting my CLU on an Athlon 64 x2 3800+, it had dried up thermal paste that just needed to be replaced.




Ok that’s one way to look at it. You got better performance than the garbage Dow Corning stuff that was there before but not nearly as good as if you used something conductive. 


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## NIK1

I just delidded a i7 7700k with my Rockit 88 CPU Delid/Relid Tool and Relidded it with 4 Tiny Dabs in the Corners of the IHS with Black Permatex RTV Silicone..Anyone know how Long I should let this Cure in the Relid tool block/clamp before removing it and reinstalling it back in my PC.


----------



## Gunderman456

NIK1 said:


> I just delidded a i7 7700k with my Rockit 88 CPU Delid/Relid Tool and Relidded it with 4 Tiny Dabs in the Corners of the IHS with Black Permatex RTV Silicone..Anyone know how Long I should let this Cure in the Relid tool block/clamp before removing it and reinstalling it back in my PC.


No need to wait. The socket clip will keep things in place.


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## TwilightRavens

NIK1 said:


> I just delidded a i7 7700k with my Rockit 88 CPU Delid/Relid Tool and Relidded it with 4 Tiny Dabs in the Corners of the IHS with Black Permatex RTV Silicone..Anyone know how Long I should let this Cure in the Relid tool block/clamp before removing it and reinstalling it back in my PC.


I gave mine about 15-20 minutes and then slapped it in and bolted on my AIO, but yeah as stated you don’t have to wait, i just did because I wanted the IHS to be suctioned to it before lifting it up and sticking it in the socket.


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## NIK1

Has anyone played with different Tims on the market..Like whats the best one to put on between a waterblock and the IHS.I have 2 at my disposal.Thermal Grizzly thermal Grease and Icy Diamond.Which of these two would you use.I have never tried these two before on a cpu,I did try the Grizzly on a gpu last year and it worked pretty good though.Is there something better than the two I have or are they close to the same when it come to thermal pastes.


----------



## Shawnb99

So what are the signs that I have a bad delid and have to redo it rather then reapplying my thermal paste?
I can see spikes from 30 degrees up to 71 while idle, I suspect it's my bad thermal paste job as I had nothing but trouble getting it to apply, but still wondering if I might have to re-delid it since I had SL do mine and ship it back to me and shipping could of shaken something loose


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## ThrashZone

Shawnb99 said:


> So what are the signs that I have a bad delid and have to redo it rather then reapplying my thermal paste?
> I can see spikes from 30 degrees up to 71 while idle, I suspect it's my bad thermal paste job as I had nothing but trouble getting it to apply, but still wondering if I might have to re-delid it since I had SL do mine and ship it back to me and shipping could of shaken something loose


Hi,
I my case it was core temperatures way different from each other 
So off the multiplier had to be lowered and lowered to get the same temperature limits as the good ones were set at.

It wasn't pretty 
Silicon lottery was insistent the higher core temps were normal which I called no way jose and I was right 
New LM and removing all of the Intel sealant silicon lottery left was the ticket the excessive amount of LM to fill the gap naturally dropped after time where not much was on the top of the chip I expect 
A thin layer of LM on the cpu and cap and clamped worked like a charm to bring the core temps within 10c of each other at the same voltage and multiplier pretty much a new chip again :thumb:


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## Shawnb99

K thanks. I'll keep an eye on it and see once I reapply. I know I did a terrible job and before I knew it the whole tube of Kryonaut was gone. Ordered more but will use some MX4 this weekend.
I wouldn't be surprised if I have to redelid it. Just checking HWIINFO and I can see as much as 10 degree difference between the cores at max but that could be my bad pasting job.


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## ThrashZone

Hi,
Yep just my 9940x is within 10c too 
Might improve might not with paste

I did have it worse too at first so paste and pressure can make a difference for sure and of course how flat the top of the cpu is I imagine and also how well the cpu block sets on the cpu.


----------



## TwilightRavens

I have about an 8C delta between my coolest core and hottest core on my 5775C under load, but at idle they are all roughly within a degree of each other at 4.4GHz and 1.4v. So its not unheard of but at idle then it may be a mix of both bad paste job and bad delid.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Shawnb99 said:


> So what are the signs that I have a bad delid and have to redo it rather then reapplying my thermal paste?
> 
> I can see spikes from 30 degrees up to 71 while idle, I suspect it's my bad thermal paste job as I had nothing but trouble getting it to apply, but still wondering if I might have to re-delid it since I had SL do mine and ship it back to me and shipping could of shaken something loose



I’ll use my latest delid as an anecdote that might apply in your case. 

My 9900k under direct die custom loop at 1.285V turbo LLC goes from 30 idle to 65C under load. It was going up to 77 before but then I switched from CLU to konductonaut and removed the plastic washers, which lowered the waterblock by 1mm. Check hw info to make sure that you’re not getting any voltage spikes along with that temp increase due to background processes. If you’re idling, then you might be right about a bad interface. 

When I delidded the 9900k, I had to polish the die using metal polish (gently) to get it to a mirror shine. If you look at your die and it’s scoffed, that might have an impact. 
Hope that helps

One thing I’m assuming - you did apply a conductive metal TIM between die and IHS, right? If not, I don’t think you’re doing yourself any favors. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ThrashZone

Hi,
Funny don't think I ever posted this here 
Little silicon lottery work I had to eventually redo


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> 
> Funny don't think I ever posted this here
> 
> Little silicon lottery work I had to eventually redo




Yea from the look of it, that rtv gasket was preventing complete contact with the die. I had those same burn marks on my 9900k since it wasn’t making good contact with the waterblock via direct die. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ThrashZone

Pinnacle Fit said:


> Yea from the look of it, that rtv gasket was preventing complete contact with the die. I had those same burn marks on my 9900k since it wasn’t making good contact with the waterblock via direct die.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hi,
Yeah it also did weird stuff to the bottom of the cpu cap 
I had to scrape it with a razor blade to get some crud off heavy burns is probably accurate description almost thought it was LM reaction to the nickle or something ?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> 
> Yeah it also did weird stuff to the bottom of the cpu cap
> 
> I had to scrape it with a razor blade to get some crud off heavy burns is probably accurate description almost thought it was LM reaction to the nickle or something ?




I really doubt it. Last cpu before the delidded 9900k was a 4790k. I ran it as a direct die with the same waterblock. There weren’t any burns and I removed the block and replaced it three or four times without having to reapply the CLU. Temps were fine. 

Did the same with my 9900k and got the same burns on my nickel waterblock, and my cpu. I had to repolish the die. Rockit cool suggested removing the plastic washers to get it 1mm closer, and I’m getting a much more solid connection now. 

Yea I doubt that it was a reaction. I think it was too much gasket. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Shawnb99

Pinnacle Fit said:


> I’ll use my latest delid as an anecdote that might apply in your case.
> 
> My 9900k under direct die custom loop at 1.285V turbo LLC goes from 30 idle to 65C under load. It was going up to 77 before but then I switched from CLU to konductonaut and removed the plastic washers, which lowered the waterblock by 1mm. Check hw info to make sure that you’re not getting any voltage spikes along with that temp increase due to background processes. If you’re idling, then you might be right about a bad interface.
> 
> When I delidded the 9900k, I had to polish the die using metal polish (gently) to get it to a mirror shine. If you look at your die and it’s scoffed, that might have an impact.
> Hope that helps
> 
> One thing I’m assuming - you did apply a conductive metal TIM between die and IHS, right? If not, I don’t think you’re doing yourself any favors.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I had Silicon Lottery delid it for me so not sure what they did.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Shawnb99 said:


> I had Silicon Lottery delid it for me so not sure what they did.




Ah ok. I wasn’t entirely sure what silicon lottery was before. I just found out that they provide ‘binning’ and delidding services. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ThrashZone

Shawnb99 said:


> I had Silicon Lottery delid it for me so not sure what they did.


Hi,
I do visual already posted of a decapitated 7900x SL did 
If it goes wonky after a little while you'll know why don't bother contacting them over higher than now core temps it's a waste of time all they will say is it's normal


----------



## Shawnb99

Yeah I'll likely end up redeliding it myself at the end of the month, I'll add the Rockit copper IHS as well. Not point complaining.


----------



## ThrashZone

Shawnb99 said:


> Yeah I'll likely end up redeliding it myself at the end of the month, I'll add the Rockit copper IHS as well. Not point complaining.


Hi,
I wouldn't redo it unless it goes wonky you're just asking for trouble 

You already have a copper cap just lap the top flat and it's copper on top 

Take a picture of the top of the cpu cap first before lapping it just for kicks.


----------



## Shawnb99

I'll see what temp I get when I reapply my paste, finally the back-plate for my WB is in stock so I'll wait for that first before I decide if I'll redo the delid myself.


----------



## NIK1

I delided my i7-7700k last week and used liquid ultra on the die.Relidded and did some testing.Ran RealBench for 1.5 hrs and the cores were 64 65 67 69 cel with a 5.0 oc at 1.375 volts.Before the delid it was in the high 80's low 90's.One weird thing though.Idle temps are fine 29-30 but sometimes spike up to 50 cel for a split second then back to 30.HWMonitor shows all 4 cores do this about once or sometimes twice spike during idle with that 20 cel jump for 1 or so seconds.But when stressing there is no spiking and all the cores are pretty much within a few degrees of each other.Core 0 and core 3 there is a 6 cel spread though.Anyone know or have any ideas on what might be causing the idle 20 cel spikes for the split second.It only happens like twice per minute when I was watching HWM and Not at All when Stressing.I have never seen this before..


----------



## TwilightRavens

NIK1 said:


> I delided my i7-7700k last week and used liquid ultra on the die.Relidded and did some testing.Ran RealBench for 1.5 hrs and the cores were 64 65 67 69 cel with a 5.0 oc at 1.375 volts.Before the delid it was in the high 80's low 90's.One weird thing though.Idle temps are fine 29-30 but sometimes spike up to 50 cel for a split second then back to 30.HWMonitor shows all 4 cores do this about once or sometimes twice spike during idle with that 20 cel jump for 1 or so seconds.But when stressing there is no spiking and all the cores are pretty much within a few degrees of each other.Core 0 and core 3 there is a 6 cel spread though.Anyone know or have any ideas on what might be causing the idle 20 cel spikes for the split second.It only happens like twice per minute when I was watching HWM and Not at All when Stressing.I have never seen this before..


That's normal, probably a background service of windows doing something that causes the load to quickly jump up would be my guess. Both my old soldered Core 2 Extreme QX9650 and delidded i7-5775C do it.


----------



## NIK1

Thanks for the info..I thought i had screwed something up in the delid maybe.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

NIK1 said:


> Thanks for the info..I thought i had screwed something up in the delid maybe.



If you did, I haven't had one go 'right' in the past 10 years. Windows has more background processes now than ever before... even without AV and other things... there's basically _always_ something running in the background.


Core delta at load is a much better indication of how well distributed the temps are (and even it's not perfect - since the cores themselves have a variance from the factory in most chips). Your temps look about as close as you can expect unless you pull some unicorn from the silicon lottery.


----------



## Imprezzion

Meh, I should've glued my IHS back in my 7700K.

I've been switching boards a couple of times now and still haven't really found the board I wanna have (MSI Z270 M7 or Titanium) but my IHS isn't glued on. Just held in with the retention bracket and the CLU itself.

I think it must've moved a bit as temps are "fine but at least 8-10c higher then they used to be before remounting the CPU like 6 times in the past week..

I have CLU on it now but I ran out of it. I do have some new Conductonaut tho..

Is it worth remounting the IHS with new Conductonaut in stead of 3 year old CLU?

I'm running 4.9 @ 1.308 with low 70's Prime AVX load and low 60's game load. The CPU has been capable of doing 5.0 @ 1.368 but that gets too hot now.. mid to high 80's while it always ran high 70's..


----------



## Falkentyne

Imprezzion said:


> Meh, I should've glued my IHS back in my 7700K.
> 
> I've been switching boards a couple of times now and still haven't really found the board I wanna have (MSI Z270 M7 or Titanium) but my IHS isn't glued on. Just held in with the retention bracket and the CLU itself.
> 
> I think it must've moved a bit as temps are "fine but at least 8-10c higher then they used to be before remounting the CPU like 6 times in the past week..
> 
> I have CLU on it now but I ran out of it. I do have some new Conductonaut tho..
> 
> Is it worth remounting the IHS with new Conductonaut in stead of 3 year old CLU?
> 
> I'm running 4.9 @ 1.308 with low 70's Prime AVX load and low 60's game load. The CPU has been capable of doing 5.0 @ 1.368 but that gets too hot now.. mid to high 80's while it always ran high 70's..


That's exactly why you seal with 4 tiny tiny dots of RTV silicon around the corners of the IHS and don't just apply it floating.
You do that and you never have to deal with the IHS moving when you reseat it.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Falkentyne said:


> That's exactly why you seal with 4 tiny tiny dots of RTV silicon around the corners of the IHS and don't just apply it floating.
> You do that and you never have to deal with the IHS moving when you reseat it.


On mine I just squeezed some out onto a plate and spread it around very thinly with a toothpick on the bottom of the ihs, zero issues so far and its been a little over a year.


----------



## Falkentyne

TwilightRavens said:


> On mine I just squeezed some out onto a plate and spread it around very thinly with a toothpick on the bottom of the ihs, zero issues so far and its been a little over a year.


This works as long as you use a very small amount.
The main issues are :

1) RTV silicone expands as it hardens, if you use too much, this will cause the IHS to move upwards after it cures, which will cause terrible temps.
2) a tiny air gap is best left around the sides of the IHS (if possible) to help against thermal expansion and contraction. If the entire IHS is sealed airtight, this can cause a lot of problems (I believe this was discussed earlier in this thread).
The tiny 4 dots in corner method thus works well to satisfy both criteria. This also makes it easy to delid again without using the re-lid tool.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Falkentyne said:


> This works as long as you use a very small amount.
> The main issues are :
> 
> 1) RTV silicone expands as it hardens, if you use too much, this will cause the IHS to move upwards after it cures, which will cause terrible temps.
> 2) a tiny air gap is best left around the sides of the IHS (if possible) to help against thermal expansion and contraction. If the entire IHS is sealed airtight, this can cause a lot of problems (I believe this was discussed earlier in this thread).
> The tiny 4 dots in corner method thus works well to satisfy both criteria. This also makes it easy to delid again without using the re-lid tool.


Yeah I used a very minuscule amount, like maybe not even 1/4th as much as Intel did on it originally. Thought about lapping the IHS to shave a few degrees off so I can do a 24/7 4.5GHz overclock but probably won’t make much of a difference when pushing the 1.49v though it that takes to get it semi stable.

Only lapped one CPU and that was my old Xeon X3230 (Q6700 equivalent) and it helped quite a bit but this IHS isn’t nearly as concave or convex as that was.


----------



## Imprezzion

Well, I removed my CPU and delidded it again, the CLU did move a bit and was quite hard so it didn't really flow together anymore causing the higher temps.

Cleaned the IHS and die with some 1500 grit sandpaper and re-applied it with Conductonaut and a few tiny droplets of high-temp gasket maker in the corners. Works like a charm. Coretemps came much closer to each other again and about 10c lower.

I can now run Prime95 29 with AVX/FMA3 Small FFT on 4.9Ghz 1.308v with no AVX offset with 74-71-72-71 peak temps. Stabilizes around 68c tho. 

In-game and regular usage saw a peak temp range of 56-58-60-59 on the cores with a Cooler Master ML360R in push-pull (6 stock MF120RGB fans) on 900RPM.

I can run 5Ghz+ but the CPU needs quite a lot more voltage for that to be AVX stable. Have to push as high as 1.376v for 5Ghz and 1.440v for 5.1Ghz and that does result in high 80's in Prime and high 60's in normal usage. Not really worth the extra 100Mhz honestly. 

I'll be upgrading to a Ryzen 3900x with an MSI x570 board anyway as soon as they release.


----------



## Falkentyne

Imprezzion said:


> Well, I removed my CPU and delidded it again, the CLU did move a bit and was quite hard so it didn't really flow together anymore causing the higher temps.
> 
> Cleaned the IHS and die with some 1500 grit sandpaper and re-applied it with Conductonaut and a few tiny droplets of high-temp gasket maker in the corners. Works like a charm. Coretemps came much closer to each other again and about 10c lower.
> 
> I can now run Prime95 29 with AVX/FMA3 Small FFT on 4.9Ghz 1.308v with no AVX offset with 74-71-72-71 peak temps. Stabilizes around 68c tho.
> 
> In-game and regular usage saw a peak temp range of 56-58-60-59 on the cores with a Cooler Master ML360R in push-pull (6 stock MF120RGB fans) on 900RPM.
> 
> I can run 5Ghz+ but the CPU needs quite a lot more voltage for that to be AVX stable. Have to push as high as 1.376v for 5Ghz and 1.440v for 5.1Ghz and that does result in high 80's in Prime and high 60's in normal usage. Not really worth the extra 100Mhz honestly.
> 
> I'll be upgrading to a Ryzen 3900x with an MSI x570 board anyway as soon as they release.


Now do you see why I tell everyone to apply the four tiny dabs in the corner?
*it just works*.
yet you see all these people who keep saying you don't need to.
It's just lazy and haphazard to not reseal it securely, and that's no way to overclock or mod.


----------



## ThrashZone

Hi,
Yep a couple dots on each top corner and a line across the bottom is the only difference I would do 
Line across the bottom would catch any LM that might drop off or run after clamping pressure is added for a typical desktop.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> 
> Yep a couple dots on each top corner and a line across the bottom is the only difference I would do
> 
> Line across the bottom would catch any LM that might drop off or run after clamping pressure is added for a typical desktop.




This is why I direct die. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ThrashZone

Pinnacle Fit said:


> This is why I direct die.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hi,
Why because you don't mind if LM drips out and onto something else below the chip kind of tough to seal a direct mount
I know the contact/ cooling reasons for direct mount.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> 
> Why because you don't mind if LM drips out and onto something else below the chip kind of tough to seal a direct mount
> 
> I know the contact/ cooling reasons for direct mount.


If you apply LM properly, it seems highly unlikely to seep out. LM has a high surface tension and tends to pool, rather than spread. This is why it’s difficult to get it to spread without forcing it into a very thin layer. 

I just feel that if you’re delidding, and have access to a direct die solution, it doesn’t make sense to re-lid. I get why people would want to relid (use the same mount, etc), but with a slight modification, you can direct die. 

I direct cooled my 4790k using the naked ivy standoffs (which cost about $10). I bought the direct die cover for the 9900k and used the standard standoffs (sans plastic washers). Honestly it seems a lot of people have issues with the relid because they negate their efforts by applying the gasket too thick. And no matter how thin you make it, you’re still applying material between the two contact surfaces. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Shawnb99

I'll be redoing my delid next week and going direct die. It's intimidating enough doing the delid for the first time, going direct die seems much more extreme so I can understand why people would be hesitant to go that extra step.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Shawnb99 said:


> I'll be redoing my delid next week and going direct die. It's intimidating enough doing the delid for the first time, going direct die seems much more extreme so I can understand why people would be hesitant to go that extra step.




Yea I get it, but on the new 9th gen, there aren’t any transistors on top, and there are direct die mounts that keep the die from separating from the socket, for a matter of $30 extra. It’s too easy to negate your delid efforts by relidding imo


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ThrashZone

Shawnb99 said:


> I'll be redoing my delid next week and going direct die. It's intimidating enough doing the delid for the first time, going direct die seems much more extreme so I can understand why people would be hesitant to go that extra step.


Hi,
Just have your heat gun and a couple of razor blades to get the SL delid apart 
SL uses some tough freaking sealant 

Don't get the chip too hot either.
I used my arm behind the chip to judge the timing of how long to hit the chip with the heat gun.
110c your arm hair will burn well before reaching that temp


----------



## Shawnb99

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Just have your heat gun and a couple of razor blades to get the SL delid apart
> SL uses some tough freaking sealant
> 
> Don't get the chip too hot either.
> I used my arm behind the chip to judge the timing of how long to hit the chip with the heat gun.
> 110c your arm hair will burn well before reaching that temp


I bought Rockit Cool clean and prep kit and their Quicksilver solder removal so I hope to have no issues but thanks I'll try that if I need to.


----------



## ThrashZone

Shawnb99 said:


> I bought Rockit Cool clean and prep kit and their Quicksilver solder removal so I hope to have no issues but thanks I'll try that if I need to.


Hi,
You bought a binned silicon lottery 9900k didn't you or was this a retail purchased chip ?


----------



## Imprezzion

I did try direct die but then I would have to run without the plastic spacer bushings on the ML360 mount otherwise it won't reach the die.

I couldn't get the mounting pressure right easily and I have the feeling the CPU wasn't pushed into the socket deep enough as it would randomly fail to POST with CPU_LED or miss memory channels or PCI-E slots if it did boot..

Is there a retention kit for the 6xxx / 7xxx CPU's so the retention mechanism can still lock a direct die CPU into the socket properly?

I mean, I'm replacing it soon anyway, nothing wrong with a bit of direct die "suicide" OC of 5.2 GHz core @ 1.480v, 4.8Ghz cache and 3000Mhz RAM @ 12-15-15-35-400 @ 1.20v VCCIO / SA hehe. I know those settings are AVX stable but can only run it with like 5c ambients in the winter with all windows open or it will run low 90's load with a lid on it.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Shawnb99 said:


> I bought Rockit Cool clean and prep kit and their Quicksilver solder removal so I hope to have no issues but thanks I'll try that if I need to.




Yea...don’t use the razor blade method. The quicksilver is much better. It takes some time but it works. 

When you polish, apply the flitz a lil at a time and wipe away as it turns black. It’ll take some elbow grease. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Falkentyne

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Why because you don't mind if LM drips out and onto something else below the chip kind of tough to seal a direct mount
> I know the contact/ cooling reasons for direct mount.


Direct die mount is easily sealable with a cutout foam dam.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002GKC2US/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Falkentyne said:


> Direct die mount is easily sealable with a cutout foam dam.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002GKC2US/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1




I still don’t really see the point of having to seal...the stuff is unlikely to run as long as you color within the lines. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Falkentyne

Pinnacle Fit said:


> I still don’t really see the point of having to seal...the stuff is unlikely to run as long as you color within the lines.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's called free insurance.
(or rather, $5.00 insurance).

When you have expensive, valuable hardware, why not take precautions to insure that -nothing- goes wrong, when there are no drawbacks to using it?
I actually have a foam dam around my IHS right now since I have conductonaut between IHS and NH-D15, but that's almost 100% required insurance! I also have Super 33+ tape around the socket going to the edge of the IHS, to prevent LM from getting around the edge of the socket also. (the Super 33+ tape is admittedly more important--LM drips off the edge of the IHS and you're in serious trouble).

Now you might scream "paranoid delusions" but have you ever seen those posts with people complaining about thermal paste between the pins? What exactly would you do if that were liquid metal between the pins? How would you get rid of it? I'd rather not take chances.

I have foam dams on everything.
Laptop BGA CPU, Laptop MXM 1070 both LM'd,
Vega 64 and around CPU IHS. That's how I roll.
I even tried to put a foam dam under the IHS for the re-lid, but the space is too small and applies far too much separation pressure on the IHS/package so I gave that up quickly


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Falkentyne said:


> It's called free insurance.
> 
> (or rather, $5.00 insurance).
> 
> 
> 
> When you have expensive, valuable hardware, why not take precautions to insure that -nothing- goes wrong, when there are no drawbacks to using it?
> 
> I actually have a foam dam around my IHS right now since I have conductonaut between IHS and NH-D15, but that's almost 100% required insurance! I also have Super 33+ tape around the socket going to the edge of the IHS, to prevent LM from getting around the edge of the socket also. (the Super 33+ tape is admittedly more important--LM drips off the edge of the IHS and you're in serious trouble).
> 
> 
> 
> Now you might scream "paranoid delusions" but have you ever seen those posts with people complaining about thermal paste between the pins? What exactly would you do if that were liquid metal between the pins? How would you get rid of it? I'd rather not take chances.
> 
> 
> 
> I have foam dams on everything.
> 
> Laptop BGA CPU, Laptop MXM 1070 both LM'd,
> 
> Vega 64 and around CPU IHS. That's how I roll.
> 
> I even tried to put a foam dam under the IHS for the re-lid, but the space is too small and applies far too much separation pressure on the IHS/package so I gave that up quickly




Ok good point. 

For the record, non conductive Tim in the socket pins hurts nothing. I had this happen. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Medusa666

Hi guys, 

I'm going to delid a new X299 CPU that I'm looking to purchase soon. 

I can't find the Permatex Ultra Black in my country, and I would like to ask if this will be OK to reseal the delid? - https://www.permatex.eu/product/supra-blue-gasket-maker/

I will use the Rockitcool kit 










Would be thankful for any replies.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Medusa666 said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I'm going to delid a new X299 CPU that I'm looking to purchase soon.
> 
> I can't find the Permatex Ultra Black in my country, and I would like to ask if this will be OK to reseal the delid? - https://www.permatex.eu/product/supra-blue-gasket-maker/
> 
> I will use the Rockitcool kit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would be thankful for any replies.


Should be fine as it looks like its just blue instead of black in color.


----------



## DiGiCiDAL

Yeah that's definitely overkill on the temp range... but will work perfectly fine. If your IHS reaches 250C+ the seal failing will be the least of your concerns. :devil:


----------



## wasdz0r

Guys, any suggestions why my z390 system with delidded and sanded i9 9900k doesn't start after 2 semi-successful attempts (both ended with BSoD, but anyway PC started and Windows loaded)?
Also, there is photo of CPU die after final sanding


----------



## deepor

Perhaps check the socket for bent pins or for dirt.


----------



## wasdz0r

wasdz0r said:


> Guys, any suggestions why my z390 system with delidded and sanded i9 9900k doesn't start after 2 semi-successful attempts (both ended with BSoD, but anyway PC started and Windows loaded)?
> Also, there is photo of CPU die after final sanding


nvm, just 1 of 4 ddrs dosen't work. CPU is ok, dropped like 10c in stress tests.


----------



## H2OMachine

I purchased an 8086k, got the copper IHS and did the delid myself with conductonaut. Would this be the right place to post temps and voltage I achieved?


----------



## Falkentyne

H2OMachine said:


> I purchased an 8086k, got the copper IHS and did the delid myself with conductonaut. Would this be the right place to post temps and voltage I achieved?


Try to make posts on PC, not mobile, if at all possible. Mobile's text is showing garbage codes when viewed from windows 
No problem with posting temps but its best to post before and after temps so people see your gains!


----------



## Shawnb99

Just tried to delid my CPU and I don’t know what SL used when they delidded it but I can’t remove the IHS. It’s stuck on there real good, am having to use so much force I’m afraid I’ll break it. 
Is there a way to get it unstuck or do I just keep forcing it?


----------



## Sugita2Junko

Shawnb99 said:


> Just tried to delid my CPU and I don’t know what SL used when they delidded it but I can’t remove the IHS. It’s stuck on there real good, am having to use so much force I’m afraid I’ll break it.
> Is there a way to get it unstuck or do I just keep forcing it?


What tool are you using to delid?


----------



## Shawnb99

Sugita2Junko said:


> What tool are you using to delid?




Rockit Cool’s kit.


----------



## Falkentyne

Shawnb99 said:


> Just tried to delid my CPU and I don’t know what SL used when they delidded it but I can’t remove the IHS. It’s stuck on there real good, am having to use so much force I’m afraid I’ll break it.
> Is there a way to get it unstuck or do I just keep forcing it?


Why didn't you buy the Rockit 89 tool?
https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rockit-89-i9-9900k-delid-relid-kit

They even have a tool + direct die mount bundle special.
https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/co...ucts/9th-gen-direct-to-die-frame-kit-complete

Might as well get the entire kit since it's just $10 more, and they give you the flitz polisher and a 1 CPU tube of Quicksilver, which you'd usually have to but separately. 
The frame is $29 by itself also.


----------



## Shawnb99

Falkentyne said:


> Why didn't you buy the Rockit 89 tool?
> 
> https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/products/rockit-89-i9-9900k-delid-relid-kit
> 
> 
> 
> They even have a tool + direct die mount bundle special.
> 
> https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/co...ucts/9th-gen-direct-to-die-frame-kit-complete
> 
> 
> 
> Might as well get the entire kit since it's just $10 more, and they give you the flitz polisher and a 1 CPU tube of Quicksilver, which you'd usually have to but separately.
> 
> The frame is $29 by itself also.




That’s what I got, just grabbed it all from PPC a month ago


----------



## Sugita2Junko

I went with 3D printed delidder and used a vise for clamping. Takes a lot of force to dislodge the sealant. You might not be using enough. Go very slowly. It will make a popping sound when it dislodge.


----------



## Falkentyne

Shawnb99 said:


> That’s what I got, just grabbed it all from PPC a month ago


Ok, so what was the issue?
Did you hear a 'pop' when you turned it?
If you did then all you have to do then is just keep twisting the IHS and it will work its way off.
The solder and silicone are much weaker than the package.


----------



## Shawnb99

Seems SL uses a silicone sealant that’s sticker then what Intel uses, hence the need for more force.

Finally got it off. Damn sealant was really sticky


----------



## HardheadedMurphy

I'm considering stripping my 9600k to the die,

Pros?
Cons?

Cooling performance gains?

Limitations to consider when mounting my waterblock?

I know... Short and sweet... But at 230 am and getting ready for work with a very low coffee level in my resivoir... I can barely string comprehensive sentences together at this point. Lol

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk


----------



## ViTosS

I think I will have to delid my 9900kf, I need 1.312v for 5.0Ghz and 4.7Ghz cache clock and it's hitting 85~90 stressing in RealBench 2.56, do you guys think I can reduce like 10ºC delidding it and relidding applying Conductonaut as always? I really want to use it at 5.0Ghz.


----------



## Falkentyne

ViTosS said:


> I think I will have to delid my 9900kf, I need 1.312v for 5.0Ghz and 4.7Ghz cache clock and it's hitting 85~90 stressing in RealBench 2.56, do you guys think I can reduce like 10ºC delidding it and relidding applying Conductonaut as always? I really want to use it at 5.0Ghz.


Entirely your choice.


----------



## ViTosS

Falkentyne said:


> Entirely your choice.


But do you think there will be a huge drop in temperatures like happened in 7700k and 8700k when both were delidded? If I can drop at least 10ºC I will definitely do it.


----------



## Falkentyne

ViTosS said:


> But do you think there will be a huge drop in temperatures like happened in 7700k and 8700k when both were delidded? If I can drop at least 10ºC I will definitely do it.


Did you read silicon lottery's page? They answer this for you already.

Average temp drop is 3-7C. 
https://siliconlottery.com/collections/coffeelake-r/products/9900kf50g


----------



## TwilightRavens

Falkentyne said:


> Did you read silicon lottery's page? They answer this for you already.
> 
> Average temp drop is 3-7C.
> https://siliconlottery.com/collections/coffeelake-r/products/9900kf50g


And you might be able to sneeze out an additional 2-3C if you lap the IHS, I saw a Gamers Nexus video with Kingpin on it with 9980XE but I imagine it’ll still apply since it also uses the STIM.


----------



## Shawnb99

ViTosS said:


> I think I will have to delid my 9900kf, I need 1.312v for 5.0Ghz and 4.7Ghz cache clock and it's hitting 85~90 stressing in RealBench 2.56, do you guys think I can reduce like 10ºC delidding it and relidding applying Conductonaut as always? I really want to use it at 5.0Ghz.




Might as well go direct die while your at it


----------



## ViTosS

Shawnb99 said:


> Might as well go direct die while your at it


I don't know if my Corsair H150i Pro fits good without washers to bring the block to contact directly the DIE...


----------



## ViTosS

Shawnb99 said:


> Might as well go direct die while your at it


Oh I see that the direct die kit includes also the Rockit Cool 89 and the solder cleaner, that's nice, almost the same price I will pay in the kit itself, maybe I will get one, can you confirm it includes everything I need to delid? It says included:

https://rockitcool.myshopify.com/co...ucts/9th-gen-direct-to-die-frame-kit-complete


----------



## ViTosS

But I see they say support only 9900k, 9700k and 9600k, mine is 9900KF, I don't know how is the DIE size of an 9900KF, I searched the web and aparentely no one showed an 9900KF delidded yet (?)

Edit.: I sent a message to SL, maybe they can tell me how is the 9900KF die compared to 9900k.


----------



## Falkentyne

ViTosS said:


> But I see they say support only 9900k, 9700k and 9600k, mine is 9900KF, I don't know how is the DIE size of an 9900KF, I searched the web and aparentely no one showed an 9900KF delidded yet (?)
> 
> Edit.: I sent a message to SL, maybe they can tell me how is the 9900KF die compared to 9900k.


KF is the exact same as 9900K.
It isnt the die that is any issue.
The reason the 8700K version won't work with the 9900K version and vice versa is because of the extra work needed to pop the solder and far more importantly, the size of the CPU package. The 9000 series have a much thicker package than the 8700K does, so the delid kit had to be retooled for it. That's also why you don't want to ever risk your processor buying those chinese 3d printed delid kits from ebay. They may look like a badly finished rockit, but some people have crushed the edges of the CPU package with them. Rockit will replace the CPU if this type of damage occurs on their own units (because it won't, just align it properly).


----------



## ViTosS

Falkentyne said:


> KF is the exact same as 9900K.
> It isnt the die that is any issue.
> The reason the 8700K version won't work with the 9900K version and vice versa is because of the extra work needed to pop the solder and far more importantly, the size of the CPU package. The 9000 series have a much thicker package than the 8700K does, so the delid kit had to be retooled for it. That's also why you don't want to ever risk your processor buying those chinese 3d printed delid kits from ebay. They may look like a badly finished rockit, but some people have crushed the edges of the CPU package with them. Rockit will replace the CPU if this type of damage occurs on their own units (because it won't, just align it properly).


Well, if the die size of the 9900kf is the same of the 9900k, I will buy the direct die guard kit, that was my question if it would work well because I heard some people comparing 9400f to 9600k and the die size is different because the 9400f is smaller, no iGPU.


----------



## Falkentyne

ViTosS said:


> Well, if the die size of the 9900kf is the same of the 9900k, I will buy the direct die guard kit, that was my question if it would work well because I heard some people comparing 9400f to 9600k and the die size is different because the 9400f is smaller, no iGPU.


There is a big difference between a chip with no iGPU and a chip with the iGPU disabled.


----------



## ViTosS

Falkentyne said:


> There is a big difference between a chip with no iGPU and a chip with the iGPU disabled.


Oh so the KF have the iGPU but disabled, I didn't know that, I thought they completely removed it from it


----------



## Falkentyne

ViTosS said:


> Oh so the KF have the iGPU but disabled, I didn't know that, I thought they completely removed it from it


Feel free to double check on it (I mean it doesn't hurt to ask questions), but from everything I've ever seen, the KF have *defective* iGPU silicon, so the iGPU is disabled on them. Feel free to double check.


----------



## ViTosS

Falkentyne said:


> Feel free to double check on it (I mean it doesn't hurt to ask questions), but from everything I've ever seen, the KF have *defective* iGPU silicon, so the iGPU is disabled on them. Feel free to double check.


Yep, I will wait for SL answer, because I couldn't find anything about it on internet, hope they can answer me or Rockit Cool maybe. Thanks buddy!


----------



## ViTosS

SL confirmed to me the 9900kf is the exact same die as 9900k


----------



## mouacyk

ViTosS said:


> SL confirmed to me the 9900kf is the exact same die as 9900k


... with the iGPU disabled (reiteration)


----------



## ViTosS

mouacyk said:


> ... with the iGPU disabled (reiteration)


Yep, I hope I can not only reduce the temperatures with the delid but also reduce the vcore needed for the same 5.0Ghz, exactly what happened with my 8700k when I delidded, before delid it used to need 1.35v for 5.0Ghz, and after the 20ºC temp drop I could reach the same 5.0Ghz but at 1.28v


----------



## Deathtech00

I tried to Direct Die mount my 9900K this weekend, it seems that either there is a spacing issue with my GB Aorus Master z390 + Corsair XC7 Waterblock, or I need some kind of different posts. It seems to not make great contact with the block. It "seems" like it is hitting the caps by the socket, but its hard to tell looking straight down at it. cleaned everything off, tried a bit of Kryonaut to see what kind of pressure I was getting, and despite having the Rockitcool mounting plate, it just "barely" pushed and spread the thermal pastedown. 

Anyone here with a similar setup might be able to chime in, I hope, anything board-specific I am missing? or am I just SOL with the XC7 block and a Z390 master?

I know EK sold an adapter type kit with different sized screws for Ivy (Naked IVY I think?) but I didnt think it would be compatible.


----------



## Uroborous

I delidded my 7700k a year ago. the temps look ok. Should I do anything (clean up and reapply?)?


----------



## buellersdayoff

Uroborous said:


> I delidded my 7700k a year ago. the temps look ok. Should I do anything (clean up and reapply?)?


I checked my delidded/resealed 6700k after about 1.5 years, no issues with it temps were still the same, only the ihs needed a good scrub and was slightly stained. I think some people have mentioned oxidisation (probably when unsealed) with liquid metal but I'm not sure. If it wasn't resealed then maybe worth a look, someone else here can chime in on that. Haven't bothered re-popping the seal on the 7700k and 8700k yet


----------



## spyshagg

What material do you guys recommend to really clean the solder off of the 9900K ? Can't get my die to shine


Also, I applied liquid metal but cleaned it off the next morning after realizing that overnight the liquid started to slightly sludge down with gravity into the D8bauer OC frame. My board is vertical on a PC case. I applied the absolute minimum liquid metal.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

spyshagg said:


> What material do you guys recommend to really clean the solder off of the 9900K ? Can't get my die to shine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, I applied liquid metal but cleaned it off the next morning after realizing that overnight the liquid started to slightly sludge down with gravity into the D8bauer OC frame. My board is vertical on a PC case. I applied the absolute minimum liquid metal.




Quicksilver, followed by flitz. I suppose if you can’t get quicksilver from RockItCool, you could potentially just use flitz and elbow grease but I wouldn’t recommend it. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Deathtech00 said:


> I tried to Direct Die mount my 9900K this weekend, it seems that either there is a spacing issue with my GB Aorus Master z390 + Corsair XC7 Waterblock, or I need some kind of different posts. It seems to not make great contact with the block. It "seems" like it is hitting the caps by the socket, but its hard to tell looking straight down at it. cleaned everything off, tried a bit of Kryonaut to see what kind of pressure I was getting, and despite having the Rockitcool mounting plate, it just "barely" pushed and spread the thermal pastedown.
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone here with a similar setup might be able to chime in, I hope, anything board-specific I am missing? or am I just SOL with the XC7 block and a Z390 master?
> 
> 
> 
> I know EK sold an adapter type kit with different sized screws for Ivy (Naked IVY I think?) but I didnt think it would be compatible.




Naked Ivy is too short. I spoke with the owner of RockItCool and he said to take the white plastic washers off and it’ll make good contact
I’m using the direct die frame and had the same issue. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ViTosS

Pinnacle Fit said:


> Naked Ivy is too short. I spoke with the owner of RockItCool and he said to take the white plastic washers off and it’ll make good contact
> I’m using the direct die frame and had the same issue.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


How much you have an improvement in temps delidding and using direct die? Also what is your cooler? Your voltage seems almost the same as mine before delid (1.30v for 5.0Ghz/4.7Ghz cache and 0 AVX offset)


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

ViTosS said:


> How much you have an improvement in temps delidding and using direct die? Also what is your cooler? Your voltage seems almost the same as mine before delid (1.30v for 5.0Ghz/4.7Ghz cache and 0 AVX offset)




My temps are about 5C or so lower. I really can’t remember but it wasn’t huge. The 9900k doesnt have as much of an issue with temps at low voltage...it’s got problems with temp spikes above 1.4v and there’s no cooling solution other than exotic that can help with that. 

I have a EK supremacy EVO on a custom loop with a single D5, 240+360 rads, and a gpu 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Falkentyne

Pinnacle Fit said:


> Quicksilver, followed by flitz. I suppose if you can’t get quicksilver from RockItCool, you could potentially just use flitz and elbow grease but I wouldn’t recommend it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You can even use liquid metal if you wanted to. If you don't mind wasting expensive liquid metal.
Or you can buy your own gallium and indium and tin and just make liquid metal yourself.

The Quicksilver that rockitcool sells is basically gallium based liquid metal but without the thermal transfer properties and it's a lot more runny (Quicksilver does not contain indium).


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Falkentyne said:


> You can even use liquid metal if you wanted to. If you don't mind wasting expensive liquid metal.
> 
> Or you can buy your own gallium and indium and tin and just make liquid metal yourself.
> 
> 
> 
> The Quicksilver that rockitcool sells is basically gallium based liquid metal but without the thermal transfer properties and it's a lot more runny (Quicksilver does not contain indium).




Agreed. It seemed they didn’t have the quicksilver so my thought was to just go with the flitz or mothers mag polish straight up and use a toothbrush. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Deathtech00

Any other Z390 Aorus Master users here have the Intermittent random C4 Code thrown when rebooting? for some reason When trying to OC my 9900k, it will boot fine, run great for hours, stability test passes without issue, but if I reboot it hangs with this C4 Code. It is not listed in their codes (or rather listed as "reserved"). 

Replaced the Board, but the issue persists. Someone mentioned a new F10b bios so I am going to try that. The intermittency of it just has me for a loop. I can leave it off for a while, come back, boot up and it will once again be perfectly fine. Reboot for windows updates with no BIOS changes? bam, C4 code over and over. 

Also, someone mentioned a Power supply could be at fault? Sometimes the lights on my motherboard will just stay on even after shutting completely down, and it will take me actually having to hit the kill switch on the PSU for it to actually drain power and go off. Would this be an indication of a PSU issue? it did this on BOTH Aorus master boards.


----------



## TwilightRavens

Deathtech00 said:


> Any other Z390 Aorus Master users here have the Intermittent random C4 Code thrown when rebooting? for some reason When trying to OC my 9900k, it will boot fine, run great for hours, stability test passes without issue, but if I reboot it hangs with this C4 Code. It is not listed in their codes (or rather listed as "reserved").
> 
> Replaced the Board, but the issue persists. Someone mentioned a new F10b bios so I am going to try that. The intermittency of it just has me for a loop. I can leave it off for a while, come back, boot up and it will once again be perfectly fine. Reboot for windows updates with no BIOS changes? bam, C4 code over and over.
> 
> Also, someone mentioned a Power supply could be at fault? Sometimes the lights on my motherboard will just stay on even after shutting completely down, and it will take me actually having to hit the kill switch on the PSU for it to actually drain power and go off. Would this be an indication of a PSU issue? it did this on BOTH Aorus master boards.


That last part sounds normal because the lights are an indication that you have power to the board, even though it is shut down there will always be power to it unless unplugged or the psu switch is off, both my Z97 and 790i Ultra do this.


----------



## TwilightRavens

So what is better conductanaut or liquid ultra for under the ihs application? Or does it really matter that much?


----------



## HardheadedMurphy

I have found that when trying to oc RAM and CPU at same time I would get that c4 post code

Sent from my OnePlus 7 Pro using Tapatalk


----------



## Deathtech00

HardheadedMurphy said:


> I have found that when trying to oc RAM and CPU at same time I would get that c4 post code
> 
> Sent from my OnePlus 7 Pro using Tapatalk


But if you didn't overclock the ram, you *should* be able to apply an OC to the chip without getting a C4 code, right? I am testing different ram tonight, and if that doesn't work I am using a friends power supply to make sure it isn't an issue with power delivery. TeamGroup just requested a copy of diagnostics from CPU-Z (report.txt) so maybe they can help me determine if its a memory chip or not.


----------



## HardheadedMurphy

Deathtech00 said:


> But if you didn't overclock the ram, you *should* be able to apply an OC to the chip without getting a C4 code, right? I am testing different ram tonight, and if that doesn't work I am using a friends power supply to make sure it isn't an issue with power delivery. TeamGroup just requested a copy of diagnostics from CPU-Z (report.txt) so maybe they can help me determine if its a memory chip or not.


Correct. That C4 post code appeared only when applying XMP profile with a moderate oc on my 9600k with an ASRock z390 taichi. Tried same ram in xmp on my older z170 board with similar oc and there was no issue. 

My working theory at present is the z390 chipset. And yes I have updated bios to the 4.10 current release.

Sent from my OnePlus 7 Pro using Tapatalk


----------



## Deathtech00

I was able to boot without issue. Ran a stress test. All was well. Went into the bios, made a conservative 5.0 GHz 1.325v overclock with all my normal settings, cstates disabled, MCE off, etc. Rebooted without a problem. Ran a stress test for 15 minutes. Reboot. No issue. Dropped down to my normal Vcore , 1.3, and no issue.


So I decide to try and enable xmp, rebooted without issue. Ran all night without a problem. Never broke 73 Degrees. Rebooted over and over, could not reproduce the C4 error. I am going to borrow a quad stick dual channel kit from a friend, GSkill TridentZ so more reputable than my current setup. 


I realize that a single stick of ram isn't going to stress the systems IMC as much as using dual channel would, but in previous tests, even with a single stick, I could not apply my CPU OC profile, nor leave the CPU stock and use XMP, much less the two together.


----------



## Lewinr

Hi all, I have a i7-7700k and I just built a custom loop for watercooling and am not getting a great result, I still get around 30% throttling when running AIDA64 system stability test.

I think it is because I didnt design my loop well and the flow is not great, and I also have high ambient temps (we dont have AC at home and now it is around 82F in the house...)

I'm thinking that I can delid and run the waterblock direct-to-dye to help improve the temps. Yes, I'm aware of the risks.

A quick question to anybody who did this before: did you need to sand the corners of the LGA1151 socket to get the waterblock to make contact with the die? I've had bad experiences damaging the pins on the socket and I dont want to take that risk... if I can do this without needing to modify the socket (except for removing the bracket that fastens the CPU) then I'll give it a try. But if I need to start messing with modifying the socket I'm too afraid of damaging the pins again...

thanks


----------



## TwilightRavens

Lewinr said:


> Hi all, I have a i7-7700k and I just built a custom loop for watercooling and am not getting a great result, I still get around 30% throttling when running AIDA64 system stability test.
> 
> I think it is because I didnt design my loop well and the flow is not great, and I also have high ambient temps (we dont have AC at home and now it is around 82F in the house...)
> 
> I'm thinking that I can delid and run the waterblock direct-to-dye to help improve the temps. Yes, I'm aware of the risks.
> 
> A quick question to anybody who did this before: did you need to sand the corners of the LGA1151 socket to get the waterblock to make contact with the die? I've had bad experiences damaging the pins on the socket and I dont want to take that risk... if I can do this without needing to modify the socket (except for removing the bracket that fastens the CPU) then I'll give it a try. But if I need to start messing with modifying the socket I'm too afraid of damaging the pins again...
> 
> thanks



You can get waterblocks designed for running a CPU bare die to avoid any mounting issues. But if your loop is poorly designed in that its got poor flow a delid probably won’t help all that much as redesigning your loop.


----------



## UltraMega

Lewinr said:


> Hi all, I have a i7-7700k and I just built a custom loop for watercooling and am not getting a great result, I still get around 30% throttling when running AIDA64 system stability test.
> 
> I think it is because I didnt design my loop well and the flow is not great, and I also have high ambient temps (we dont have AC at home and now it is around 82F in the house...)
> 
> I'm thinking that I can delid and run the waterblock direct-to-dye to help improve the temps. Yes, I'm aware of the risks.
> 
> A quick question to anybody who did this before: did you need to sand the corners of the LGA1151 socket to get the waterblock to make contact with the die? I've had bad experiences damaging the pins on the socket and I dont want to take that risk... if I can do this without needing to modify the socket (except for removing the bracket that fastens the CPU) then I'll give it a try. But if I need to start messing with modifying the socket I'm too afraid of damaging the pins again...
> 
> thanks


I can't answer you're question about using a water block but I have the same CPU as you and I will just say that doing a standard delid with liquid metal under the heat spreader worked really well for me. My temps dropped like 15-20c at least. I would suggest you try a delid with liquid metal and use the heat spreader first because that might be all you really need to start getting the results you want.


----------



## Lewinr

TwilightRavens said:


> You can get waterblocks designed for running a CPU bare die to avoid any mounting issues. But if your loop is poorly designed in that its got poor flow a delid probably won’t help all that much as redesigning your loop.



Thanks for the advice, I looked for a "bare die" waterblock but didnt find anything for Kaby Lake except the nudecnc Ncore which doesnt appear to be actually shipping. Which waterblock do you recommend for kaby lake bare die?


----------



## Lewinr

UltraMega said:


> I can't answer you're question about using a water block but I have the same CPU as you and I will just say that doing a standard delid with liquid metal under the heat spreader worked really well for me. My temps dropped like 15-20c at least. I would suggest you try a delid with liquid metal and use the heat spreader first because that might be all you really need to start getting the results you want.



If I cant do the the bare die cooling then that's what I'll have to do. But I decided that if I can get a bit better cooling and not have to bother with remounting the IHS then it's a double win


----------



## UltraMega

Lewinr said:


> If I cant do the the bare die cooling then that's what I'll have to do. But I decided that if I can get a bit better cooling and not have to bother with remounting the IHS then it's a double win


It's actually really easy on a 7700K because there is nothing exposed under the heat spreader so you don't have to worry about using too much liquid metal and messing up the chip like you would have to on an older chip.

You can also get cheap delid tools on ebay now, which is what I used. https://www.ebay.com/itm/CPU-Delid-...067199?hash=item289592077f:g:sAwAAOSwhw5exXF-


----------



## TwilightRavens

Lewinr said:


> Thanks for the advice, I looked for a "bare die" waterblock but didnt find anything for Kaby Lake except the nudecnc Ncore which doesnt appear to be actually shipping. Which waterblock do you recommend for kaby lake bare die?


Anything even as far back as LGA 1155 and Ivy Bridge will work, Haswell too, any blocks designed for them will work as they all have the same mounting holes. Pure copper if you can get it but at least a high quality nikel plated one should work almost as well if you have conflicting metals on your loop with copper. Could also look into the delid die guard from our favorite German extreme overclocker.


----------



## Lewinr

TwilightRavens said:


> Anything even as far back as LGA 1155 and Ivy Bridge will work, Haswell too, any blocks designed for them will work as they all have the same mounting holes.



Just to be sure I understood, you mean any such waterblocks in general, not specifically made for bare die, correct? Or you mean a waterblock made specifically for bare die on LGA115X/IvyBridge/Haswell? Because I am still not able to such water blocks (at anything still available)...


----------



## TwilightRavens

Lewinr said:


> Just to be sure I understood, you mean any such waterblocks in general, not specifically made for bare die, correct? Or you mean a waterblock made specifically for bare die on LGA115X/IvyBridge/Haswell? Because I am still not able to such water blocks (at anything still available)...



The latter. If you have an EK Supremacy you can use this mounting kit: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-supremacy-precisemount-add-on-naked-ivy

Its all on the mounting kit on whether or not you can bare die mount it or not.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

UltraMega said:


> I can't answer you're question about using a water block but I have the same CPU as you and I will just say that doing a standard delid with liquid metal under the heat spreader worked really well for me. My temps dropped like 15-20c at least. I would suggest you try a delid with liquid metal and use the heat spreader first because that might be all you really need to start getting the results you want.



I concur with this. You’d want to use conductonaut and not liquid metal though, as the W/K thermal dissipation is much greater (almost double actually compared to CLU)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Falkentyne

Pinnacle Fit said:


> I concur with this. You’d want to use conductonaut and not liquid metal though, as the W/K thermal dissipation is much greater (almost double actually compared to CLU)
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Liquid metal and conductonaut are literally the same thing. Conductonaut is Galinstan with a few trace metals added (like atimony or bismuth) to help with wetting or oxidation, and you can make your own for close to 10 times cheaper per gram. I have 150 grams of *homemade* galinstan I made myself from smelting indium, tin and gallium, and it's about at worst, 2C worse than conductonaut, at almost 1/10th of the cost.

And btw, conductonaut will harden and oxidize just as easily, in a weak fitting laptop anemic pressure heatsink also. It's no better unless you do the prep work to insulate it.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Falkentyne said:


> Liquid metal and conductonaut are literally the same thing. Conductonaut is Galinstan with a few trace metals added (like atimony or bismuth) to help with wetting or oxidation, and you can make your own for close to 10 times cheaper per gram. I have 150 grams of *homemade* galinstan I made myself from smelting indium, tin and gallium, and it's about at worst, 2C worse than conductonaut, at almost 1/10th of the cost.
> 
> And btw, conductonaut will harden and oxidize just as easily, in a weak fitting laptop anemic pressure heatsink also. It's no better unless you do the prep work to insulate it.



Wow... I had no idea it was that easy. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Falkentyne

Pinnacle Fit said:


> Wow... I had no idea it was that easy.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yeah the hardest part (besides the mess!) is measuring properly and dealing with the gallium. Indium is so soft it can be cut with a sharp knife or razor at room temperature. But Gallium is as hard as a rock at room temperature, which is weird because it starts becoming liquid at around 31C. So it's hard to get a good measurement unless you just smelt the entire sample at once and then cut enough indium and tin to balance it. 68% Ga, 21% In, 10% Sn and 1% Bismuth and Atimony should work. Throw them into a crucible then put them in an oven at 150C for awhile and stir it until it's melted and fully combined.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Falkentyne said:


> Yeah the hardest part (besides the mess!) is measuring properly and dealing with the gallium. Indium is so soft it can be cut with a sharp knife or razor at room temperature. But Gallium is as hard as a rock at room temperature, which is weird because it starts becoming liquid at around 31C. So it's hard to get a good measurement unless you just smelt the entire sample at once and then cut enough indium and tin to balance it. 68% Ga, 21% In, 10% Sn and 1% Bismuth and Atimony should work. Throw them into a crucible then put them in an oven at 150C for awhile and stir it until it's melted and fully combined.



You can do all this in an apartment? You don’t need a fume hood? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Falkentyne

Pinnacle Fit said:


> You can do all this in an apartment? You don’t need a fume hood?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Gallium, indium and tin don't give off fumes. They are not toxic metals. But please don't eat them. That would be very bad for you.
They just stain everything, although you can wipe it up completely with isopropyl alcohol. But if it gets onto carpet or fabric, you're NEVER getting it out 

You don't remember the science experiments some kids did where they put gallium in their hands and let it melt?


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

Falkentyne said:


> Gallium, indium and tin don't give off fumes. They are not toxic metals. But please don't eat them. That would be very bad for you.
> They just stain everything, although you can wipe it up completely with isopropyl alcohol. But if it gets onto carpet or fabric, you're NEVER getting it out
> 
> You don't remember the science experiments some kids did where they put gallium in their hands and let it melt?



We never had cool experiments like that. And don’t worry. I grew up in the generation before the tide pod eating one. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## TwilightRavens

Pinnacle Fit said:


> We never had cool experiments like that. And don’t worry. I grew up in the generation before the tide pod eating one.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yeah THAT generation is well, I don't think I can say the word I want to say here, but we can use our imagination.


----------



## Pinnacle Fit

TwilightRavens said:


> Yeah THAT generation is well, I don't think I can say the word I want to say here, but we can use our imagination.



Lol yea. I think so. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Loladinas

TwilightRavens said:


> Anything even as far back as LGA 1155 and Ivy Bridge will work, Haswell too, any blocks designed for them will work as they all have the same mounting holes. Pure copper if you can get it but at least a high quality nikel plated one should work almost as well if you have conflicting metals on your loop with copper. Could also look into the delid die guard from our favorite German extreme overclocker.


You can use pretty much any block on the bare die, it's just the question of accurately measuring the thickness of the IHS and compensating with washers on the back side of the motherboard. I've been running bare die 3770K under a NH-D14 and a bare die 4790K under an EK-Supremacy block. Neither of them gave me any issues in over the year and a half I've been using them. Delid die guards absolutely help, and you can get them reasonably cheap from AliExpress, as I think derb8auer only sells the Skylake-X one.


----------



## zlatanselvic

Hey Guys,

I had a misstep delidding a 10700k today for my office rig. The tool pushed down when pressing the IHS off. Never seen that happen before. (I did a 10900k a few weeks ago, and 9900k for a buddy over the weekend without issue.) Motherboard won't get here until tomorrow. 


What do you think? Is it toast? I covered the gash with some super glue. I wish I knew how these PCB's were printed to determine if the traces are indeed on the surface or go down further.

From what I'm reading, if you're below the copper; you've gone too far. I think I am only through the soldermask and silkscreen layer.


----------



## JackCY

@zlatanselvic:
If you've cut any of the traces, it's RIP.
If you get liquid metal on those traces, it's RIP.

The slider in the delid tool should have 2 large rails on both sides, there should be no way it can dig down, I guess what happened was that the IHS while being pushed tipped down and dug into the PCB. This is why the better delid tools rotate the IHS instead or the expensive pusher delid tools are more precise and provide top support for the IHS so it can't angle.

Even if you only smashed some traces together, it's RIP.

As far as I know the PCBs are multi layer, there are tons of connections to make.


https://www.anandtech.com/show/9505/skylake-cpu-package-analysis

@Falkentyne: Yes the liquid metal should be that simple. The thing is getting the materials and at a cost where it makes sense over buying the ready to use finished product.


----------



## zlatanselvic

JackCY said:


> @zlatanselvic:
> If you've cut any of the traces, it's RIP.
> If you get liquid metal on those traces, it's RIP.
> 
> The slider in the delid tool should have 2 large rails on both sides, there should be no way it can dig down, I guess what happened was that the IHS while being pushed tipped down and dug into the PCB. This is why the better delid tools rotate the IHS instead or the expensive pusher delid tools are more precise and provide top support for the IHS so it can't angle.
> 
> Even if you only smashed some traces together, it's RIP.
> 
> As far as I know the PCBs are multi layer, there are tons of connections to make.
> 
> 
> https://www.anandtech.com/show/9505/skylake-cpu-package-analysis
> 
> 
> @Falkentyne: Yes the liquid metal should be that simple. The thing is getting the materials and at a cost where it makes sense over buying the ready to use finished product.




Thanks man,

I immediately saw the gash and cleaned it out and glued over it. I then let it cure and applied the metal followed by another coat on top of the glue just in case. It didn't seem pressed or dented, only the green layer and masking being removed. I have a new board on it's way arriving tomorrow. We will see if it runs. I got this tool from Rockitcool, and it's been solid on each use. I don't really understand what or how it happened. I imagine user error of some sort. Hopefully it's not dead. Fingers crossed for tomorrow!


----------



## JackCY

It's really weird how it could get damaged right in between the silicone. Even the IHS being pushed off wouldn't do that. In the Rockit tool I don't think it can even move anywhere as it does have a top.
How does the pusher dig into the PCB like that and not damage any of the silicone around, weird.

I used a cheapo tool so I got to see where and how things can move with all the imprecision of it and no clamp on top to keep the IHS down beside a screw running above it.

Aren't the 10 series soldered anyway? Why bother deliding it, doesn't seem worth it to me. I know some do it and there is a tiny gain but it's far from toothpaste vs liquid metal.


----------



## zlatanselvic

JackCY said:


> It's really weird how it could get damaged right in between the silicone. Even the IHS being pushed off wouldn't do that. In the Rockit tool I don't think it can even move anywhere as it does have a top.
> How does the pusher dig into the PCB like that and not damage any of the silicone around, weird.
> 
> I used a cheapo tool so I got to see where and how things can move with all the imprecision of it and no clamp on top to keep the IHS down beside a screw running above it.
> 
> Aren't the 10 series soldered anyway? Why bother deliding it, doesn't seem worth it to me. I know some do it and there is a tiny gain but it's far from toothpaste vs liquid metal.



I hear you. I wish I knew how I got it wrong :/

I had good performance results on my 10900k with delidding. I figured what the hell, if you've got the tools and materials might as well get a bit more out of it and some lower temps. Crossing my fingers when the board arrives tomorrow it works. If not life goes on right


----------



## Falkentyne

zlatanselvic said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> I had a misstep delidding a 10700k today for my office rig. The tool pushed down when pressing the IHS off. Never seen that happen before. (I did a 10900k a few weeks ago, and 9900k for a buddy over the weekend without issue.) Motherboard won't get here until tomorrow.
> 
> 
> What do you think? Is it toast? I covered the gash with some super glue. I wish I knew how these PCB's were printed to determine if the traces are indeed on the surface or go down further.
> 
> From what I'm reading, if you're below the copper; you've gone too far. I think I am only through the soldermask and silkscreen layer.





JackCY said:


> @zlatanselvic:
> If you've cut any of the traces, it's RIP.
> If you get liquid metal on those traces, it's RIP.
> 
> The slider in the delid tool should have 2 large rails on both sides, there should be no way it can dig down, I guess what happened was that the IHS while being pushed tipped down and dug into the PCB. This is why the better delid tools rotate the IHS instead or the expensive pusher delid tools are more precise and provide top support for the IHS so it can't angle.
> 
> Even if you only smashed some traces together, it's RIP.
> 
> As far as I know the PCBs are multi layer, there are tons of connections to make.
> 
> 
> https://www.anandtech.com/show/9505/skylake-cpu-package-analysis
> 
> 
> @Falkentyne: Yes the liquid metal should be that simple. The thing is getting the materials and at a cost where it makes sense over buying the ready to use finished product.


Contact Rockitcool. They will warranty any product damaged by their delid kit, however I do NOT know for sure if it covers 10th gen.

Jacky, the ingredients are pretty cheap for how much you get.
I got 100g for $30 but its more expensive now.

https://www.amazon.com/Gallium-Science-Projects-Experiment-Syringe/dp/B07L2XYF66/ (x2)
Indium (x2=40g): https://www.ebay.com/itm/Indium-Met...Ingot-99-995-Pure-Periodic-Table/223117510144
Tin: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tin-Metal-...llets-99-997-Pure-Periodic-Table/372414604222

Then a crucible to smelt it in the oven and some syringes and tips.
That's enough to make 150 grams. Not too expensive considering how much money you guys pay for other stuff. 
And you can always sell small amounts leftover to someone else too.


----------



## zlatanselvic

Falkentyne said:


> Contact Rockitcool. They will warranty any product damaged by their delid kit, however I do NOT know for sure if it covers 10th gen.
> 
> Jacky, the ingredients are pretty cheap for how much you get.
> I got 100g for $30 but its more expensive now.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Gallium-Science-Projects-Experiment-Syringe/dp/B07L2XYF66/ (x2)
> Indium (x2=40g): https://www.ebay.com/itm/Indium-Met...Ingot-99-995-Pure-Periodic-Table/223117510144
> Tin: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tin-Metal-...llets-99-997-Pure-Periodic-Table/372414604222
> 
> Then a crucible to smelt it in the oven and some syringes and tips.
> That's enough to make 150 grams. Not too expensive considering how much money you guys pay for other stuff.
> And you can always sell small amounts leftover to someone else too.


Sent them an email with screenshots. Will know more tomorrow when I assemble the rig and see if it works.


----------



## mattxx88

zlatanselvic said:


> Sent them an email with screenshots. Will know more tomorrow when I assemble the rig and see if it works.


any news about? it works?


----------



## Peter Watson

zlatanselvic said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> I had a misstep delidding a 10700k today for my office rig. The tool pushed down when pressing the IHS off. Never seen that happen before. (I did a 10900k a few weeks ago, and 9900k for a buddy over the weekend without issue.) Motherboard won't get here until tomorrow.
> 
> 
> What do you think? Is it toast? I covered the gash with some super glue. I wish I knew how these PCB's were printed to determine if the traces are indeed on the surface or go down further.
> 
> From what I'm reading, if you're below the copper; you've gone too far. I think I am only through the soldermask and silkscreen layer.


I never knew about the copper layer on the die until I've just seen it here, I just kept sanding until the layer was completely gone as I thought the die was not perfectly flat, cpu seems to be working perfect though and temps are great now, hope your cpu is not dead..

Edit: Did the cpu work or was it toast?


----------



## eminded1

i delided and used the rockitcool 10th gen Copper IHS on my i7 10700k and temps are 8-10c less than stock.. not bad... i used Cool Labratory Liquid Pro inbetween the IHS and Silicon, temps used to get to low 90,s now there in the high 70s, low 80s when doign the same p95 smallfft AVX load tests at 5GHZ all Core 1.35 Vcore with LVL6 LLC. Not bad i bet i could get 5.1 or 5.2 stable with all core now becuase of the copper IHS i put on. i bet once somone releises a Direct Die Kit for the 10th Gen Intel Processors ill be able to get another 5-7c going direct die to cooler. (h150i)


----------



## TwilightRavens

Dunno if GPU's count but I just delidded my GTX 285 tonight with a razorblade and a heatgun


----------



## ViTosS

A question about this, my friend's notebook has an i5 5200U and I'm considering put liquid metal on it, but there are two very close dies, would it be a problem if the liquid metal touchs each other (making these two dies contact)?


----------



## mouacyk

ViTosS said:


> A question about this, my friend's notebook has an i5 5200U and I'm considering put liquid metal on it, but there are two very close dies, would it be a problem if the liquid metal touchs each other (making these two dies contact)?


It will be fine. There is no electrical conductance through the die substrate. What you don't want to get liquid metal on are those exposed pins on the surface -- use liquid electrical tape to seal them off.


----------



## Peter Watson

eminded1 said:


> i delided and used the rockitcool 10th gen Copper IHS on my i7 10700k and temps are 8-10c less than stock.. not bad... i used Cool Labratory Liquid Pro inbetween the IHS and Silicon, temps used to get to low 90,s now there in the high 70s, low 80s when doign the same p95 smallfft AVX load tests at 5GHZ all Core 1.35 Vcore with LVL6 LLC. Not bad i bet i could get 5.1 or 5.2 stable with all core now becuase of the copper IHS i put on. i bet once somone releises a Direct Die Kit for the 10th Gen Intel Processors ill be able to get another 5-7c going direct die to cooler. (h150i)


Yep direct die for me at 5.0ghz all core avx 0, 1.36v prime95, I hit around 62c on my custom loop. I would imagine yours would be very similar with good cooling..


----------



## Sedril

I finally did the delid to my 9900k and was happily surprised at the improvement...

I had been putting it off thinking it wasn't going to be huge, at least not like the 7700k's I did...

But it helped quite a bit... temps are way down and with the same voltage (1.35) I was able to go from 5ghz to 5.1ghz no issues... Stress tests great with lower temps by far than 5ghz was with the lid...

I used the rocket cool delid kit with direct die frame... and thermal grizzley conductonaut

Now I'll see how high I can go keeping within comfortable voltages for a 24/7 build...

Good stuff!


----------



## murenitu

*dude lapping ihs and monoblock hero xi ekwb*

Hello

Sorry to bother you but I need some help, I have an i9 9900ks in which only lapping the ihs without doing anything else! until leaving it in the copper!

Now I want to build a monoblock ek momentum for the hero xi and I have many doubts and fear if it will not work for me so I could eat sanding!

It's critic? or is it very little difference?


----------



## Avacado

murenitu said:


> Hello
> 
> Sorry to bother you but I need some help, I have an i9 9900ks in which only lapping the ihs without doing anything else! until leaving it in the copper!
> 
> Now I want to build a monoblock ek momentum for the hero xi and I have many doubts and fear if it will not work for me so I could eat sanding!
> 
> It's critic? or is it very little difference?


PLEASE! DO NOT EAT THE SANDING, FOR GOD'S SAKE, DO NOT EAT THE SANDING!


----------



## inedenimadam

10700k Naked Mount, [email protected] 75C Asus Real bench 1 hr stable.


----------



## taowulf

inedenimadam said:


> 10700k Naked Mount, [email protected] 75C Asus Real bench 1 hr stable.


NSFW tag needed


----------



## makina69

very good forum I have the rockit89 is it possible to make delid to my i7 10700K ...?


----------



## murenitu

Please, no one can tell me if having lapping the 9900ks to leave the copper (just remove the nikel bath) do you think ihs lapping would help me if I installed an Ek momemtum? I have no way of knowing what the oem thickness of the 9900ks cpu is to take it out and measure it with a micrometer.

From Ek, they do not give me the tolerances of the cpu, nor do I find them on the internet, the most I can find out is the thickness of the ihs but not the complete set of the cpu pcb + ihs.

It will be mounted on a Hero Xi and this board as well as the EKWB momemtum Hero Xi monoblock are 8º and 9º compatible. I don't know if the 8700k is a little thinner than the 9900k itself. (We always talk about total thickness)

Any help to know the value?

Also reviewing youtube and forums I never see anyone mount a VRM + CPU monoblock to a lapping cpu and this also creates doubts.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

murenitu said:


> Please, no one can tell me if having lapping the 9900ks to leave the copper (just remove the nikel bath) do you think ihs lapping would help me if I installed an Ek momemtum? I have no way of knowing what the oem thickness of the 9900ks cpu is to take it out and measure it with a micrometer.
> 
> From Ek, they do not give me the tolerances of the cpu, nor do I find them on the internet, the most I can find out is the thickness of the ihs but not the complete set of the cpu pcb + ihs.
> 
> It will be mounted on a Hero Xi and this board as well as the EKWB momemtum Hero Xi monoblock are 8Âº and 9Âº compatible. I don't know if the 8700k is a little thinner than the 9900k itself. (We always talk about total thickness)
> 
> Any help to know the value?
> 
> Also reviewing youtube and forums I never see anyone mount a VRM + CPU monoblock to a lapping cpu and this also creates doubts.


If you were installing a normal waterblock it wouldn’t matter if you lapped the CPU. However a monoblock has thermal pads which contact the VRM and possibly other components. Ultimately you may lose some mounting pressure over the CPU which the thermal grease will compensate for. It really depends how much you lap off. It doesn’t make sense why you are doing all this. Monoblocks are known to suck for CPU temps and VRMs don’t need to be watercooled. And why not get a copper IHS instead of lapping the stock one? You can sell that CPU for $300 in a few years unless the lettering on the IHS has been lapped off. I lost 20c with a copper IHS and I can just reinstall the stock IHS when I sell this CPU.


----------



## Avacado

makina69 said:


> very good forum I have the rockit89 is it possible to make delid to my i7 10700K ...?


It should be, but please make sure that deliding is the only thing that you make to that processor behind closed doors.


----------



## murenitu

I think I will forget the monoblock and mount a magnitude ekwb! With that I would not have any problem right?


----------



## geriatricpollywog

murenitu said:


> I think I will forget the monoblock and mount a magnitude ekwb! With that I would not have any problem right?


I have a Supremacy EVO which is 1/3 the price of a Magnitude and it doesn’t stop my CPU from hitting 5.4ghz. If you are thinking of getting a magnitude, just sell your 9900k, get an EVO block, and put the extra money towards a Comet Lake setup.


----------



## murenitu

0451 said:


> I have a Supremacy EVO which is 1/3 the price of a Magnitude and it doesn’t stop my CPU from hitting 5.4ghz. If you are thinking of getting a magnitude, just sell your 9900k, get an EVO block, and put the extra money towards a Comet Lake setup.




I don't know if it would pay off. you mean put a 10900k? Currently I have a 9900ks at 5.2 all cores with avx 0 at an adaptive voltage of 1.28v / 1.29v with an aio of 240m

I intuit that with a good magnitude block I could surely do 5.3 to all the cores, I don't know if it would be worth it ...


----------



## geriatricpollywog

murenitu said:


> 0451 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have a Supremacy EVO which is 1/3 the price of a Magnitude and it doesnâ€™️t stop my CPU from hitting 5.4ghz. If you are thinking of getting a magnitude, just sell your 9900k, get an EVO block, and put the extra money towards a Comet Lake setup.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know if it would pay off. you mean put a 10900k? Currently I have a 9900ks at 5.2 all cores with avx 0 at an adaptive voltage of 1.28v / 1.29v with an aio of 240m
> 
> I intuit that with a good magnitude block I could surely do 5.3 to all the cores, I don't know if it would be worth it ...
Click to expand...

No, a magnitude will only get you a couple degrees C under a lesser block and will definitely not be enough to raise the multiplier. Delidding with a copper IHS brought my CPU from 5.3 to 5.4ghz and a 20c improvement at the same clocks. 5.2ghz is amazing for a 9900k and a 10700k or 10900k is unlikely to be better. Go with a direct die kit or copper IHS if you want any chance of raising the multiplier.


----------



## murenitu

I will think about it, although it scares me to make delid a cpu soldier, here in Barcelona I don't know anyone who does it! and I am not very clear.

I would have to put another copper ihs back in and then use the ekwb block is correct?

or do you mean literally to use the block without ihs? on the die?

Pardon my ignorance.


----------



## JackCY

The newer soldered Intel CPUs... not sure it's worth the bother, for direct die it can be but using the IHS and LM instead of solder... sure maybe some tiny improvement but is it worth the freakin hassle?
There are instructions, guides on how to delid soldered CPUs and you should definitely know what you're doing. Maybe some can be just cracked/sheared but others may need extra heat. The indium has low melting point.














---

So shiny, you know you want to.


----------



## geriatricpollywog

murenitu said:


> I will think about it, although it scares me to make delid a cpu soldier, here in Barcelona I don't know anyone who does it! and I am not very clear.
> 
> I would have to put another copper ihs back in and then use the ekwb block is correct?
> 
> or do you mean literally to use the block without ihs? on the die?
> 
> Pardon my ignorance.


No, see the videos above, but don't follow the liquid metal application technique. When you are ready PM me and I'll walk you through it. Rockit Cool sells both the copper IHS and the direct die kit. I have the copper IHS and my direct die kit arrived this weekend.



JackCY said:


> The newer soldered Intel CPUs... not sure it's worth the bother, for direct die it can be but using the IHS and LM instead of solder... sure maybe some tiny improvement but is it worth the freakin hassle?
> There are instructions, guides on how to delid soldered CPUs and you should definitely know what you're doing. Maybe some can be just cracked/sheared but others may need extra heat. The indium has low melting point.
> 
> ---
> 
> So shiny, you know you want to.


Again, I am speaking from actual expereince. 20C improvement. +100mhz. Der8auer applied TG Conductonaut to both the die and the underside of the IHS. I used CLU and applied to only the die. I am not sure if he took his time, but it took me about 20 minutes to spread perfectly and evenly as thin as absolutely possible. I then applied thinly and evenly to the top of the IHS as well.

I did not see such an improvement to my 7700k as I did with the 10700k. Even though the 10700k uses solder, it generates so much more heat than my 7700k so it makes sense why taking care of thermals produces such a benefit in clock speed.


----------



## mouacyk

From the various delidded 9th and 10th gen experiences, is it too far a reach to say that Intel did things deliberately to put a ceiling on their products. The die just a tad too thick, the indium just a tad too much, and the IHS not as flat as normally possible. They did not want their products to run away on clock speed and detract future sales.


----------



## vodkapl

Is it necessary to glue the IHS back to CPU after applying Liquid metal? Also I found this inexpensive tool to delid with :


----------



## Loladinas

vodkapl said:


> Is it necessary to glue the IHS back to CPU after applying Liquid metal?


No, it's fine to leave it just hanging, just a bit more fuss when you're putting it back in the socket to align it properly. You can even run them bare die if you get a bracket for it (comes with some risks).


----------



## criskoe

0451 said:


> No, see the videos above, but don't follow the liquid metal application technique. When you are ready PM me and I'll walk you through it. Rockit Cool sells both the copper IHS and the direct die kit. I have the copper IHS and my direct die kit arrived this weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> Again, I am speaking from actual expereince. 20C improvement. +100mhz. Der8auer applied TG Conductonaut to both the die and the underside of the IHS. I used CLU and applied to only the die. I am not sure if he took his time, but it took me about 20 minutes to spread perfectly and evenly as thin as absolutely possible. I then applied thinly and evenly to the top of the IHS as well.
> 
> I did not see such an improvement to my 7700k as I did with the 10700k. Even though the 10700k uses solder, it generates so much more heat than my 7700k so it makes sense why taking care of thermals produces such a benefit in clock speed.


I recently ordered both a copper ihs upgrade kit and a direct die frame for my 10900K from rockitcool. 

Got both just in case. Situation I’m running into is I already own a magnitude block and unfortunately I’m pretty positive that I can’t use it for direct die on this Asus XII extreme due to the large cpu block frame will contact the inner row of caps just to the left of the socket. Right now with the stock ihs it sits just over the caps with barely any clearance room. 

So I’m waffling back n forth as to if I should just use the copper ihs lid and slap the magnitude back on. Or grab a optimus foundation block and go the direct die route. The optimus block has a smaller footprint and fully clears the caps. 

What do you think the temp difference will be between copper ihs upgrade vs direct die? Not sure it’s worth it to buy a whole new cpu block. 

What you think?


----------



## ThrashZone

criskoe said:


> I recently ordered both a copper ihs upgrade kit and a direct die frame for my 10900K from rockitcool.
> 
> Got both just in case. Situation I’m running into is I already own a magnitude block and unfortunately I’m pretty positive that I can’t use it for direct die on this Asus XII extreme due to the large cpu block frame will contact the inner row of caps just to the left of the socket. Right now with the stock ihs it sits just over the caps with barely any clearance room.
> 
> So I’m waffling back n forth as to if I should just use the copper ihs lid and slap the magnitude back on. Or grab a optimus foundation block and go the direct die route. The optimus block has a smaller footprint and fully clears the caps.
> 
> What do you think the temp difference will be between copper ihs upgrade vs direct die? Not sure it’s worth it to buy a whole new cpu block.
> 
> What you think?


Hi,
Been said by optimus foundation doesn't have enough bow in it's cold plate to reach the bare die 
Only the SigV2 does.

Mag may work but you'd have to likely whittle the mounting bracket some and use different mounting hardware.


----------



## criskoe

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Been said by optimus foundation doesn't have enough bow in it's cold plate to reach the bare die
> Only the SigV2 does.
> 
> Mag may work but you'd have to likely whittle the mounting bracket some and use different mounting hardware.


Dam. Must be pretty close tho cause I’ve seen a few peeps running a foundation on a 9900k with good results. The 10900k does have a thinner die so maybe that’s the issue. Sounds like a pretty expensive gamble. Lol.


----------



## ThrashZone

criskoe said:


> Dam. Must be pretty close tho cause I’ve seen a few peeps running a foundation on a 9900k with good results. The 10900k does have a thinner die so maybe that’s the issue. Sounds like a pretty expensive gamble. Lol.


Hi,
Might just buy the direct die water block mount been floating around there are a few members here that have them atm
Think you can reach them on facebook and order one 
*Supercool Computer* 
Nice example 
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/341758082/ncore-v1-naked-die-cooling-waterblock-designed-by

You can see super computer on this search page second link direct link to their facebook
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Supercool+Computer+cpu+direct+die+water+block&t=ffab&ia=web


----------



## criskoe

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Might just buy the direct die water block mount been floating around there are a few members here that have them atm
> Think you can reach them on facebook and order one
> *Supercool Computer*
> Nice example
> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/341758082/ncore-v1-naked-die-cooling-waterblock-designed-by
> 
> You can see super computer on this search page second link direct link to their facebook
> https://duckduckgo.com/?q=Supercool+Computer+cpu+direct+die+water+block&t=ffab&ia=web
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w0aNJO8gwM
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0pk-_D1IFpI


Yeah I’ve seen those. It’s posted like every ten pages on the 10900k thread. If it was easier to acquire and was sold by a reputable WC store I might give it a try one day but Till then ima pass on it. 

So far direct die 10900k blocks I’ve seen posts for are a magnitude on non Asus boards with no inner row of caps. Also seen a Velocity direct die on a Asus board. And a bitspower block. 

Anyone out there with a direct die 10900k, mind sharing your MB and cpu block and method (rockitcool frame, naked, etc etc )

Looking for non modified block options.


----------



## vodkapl

I've got a CM 212 Evo, and have been looking forward to delid. But for 1g Conductnaut and 4G Artic MX-4 it costs about $33 (shipping included). Is it worth paying that high price for a 4770K? Would it not be better to use the money to buy better cooler on used market? Alternatively, does anyone know of where I can get inexpensive thermal paste and liquid metal (that's not shoddy) from AliExpress or Ebay (with free or very low international shipping)?

I'm aiming for a 4.5GHz OC. My temps has been far to high and it has been many years, so deliding seems appropriate. I have also considered maybe using non liquid metal between IHS and DIE, as a way to cut down on that high price. Issue is, no retail near me sells Coollaboratory or Conductnaut, so I am forced to buy online.


----------



## deepor

@vodkapl:

You definitely need liquid metal. You can't delid without it. You need it between the die and IHS, a normal paste is not good there. A normal paste will go bad very fast on the die, it will only last a few days.

You don't need MX-4 for use between the IHS and your cooler. You can use any thermal paste you can find cheap where you are.


----------



## vodkapl

deepor said:


> @vodkapl:
> 
> You definitely need liquid metal. You can't delid without it. You need it between the die and IHS, a normal paste is not good there. A normal paste will go bad very fast on the die, it will only last a few days.
> 
> You don't need MX-4 for use between the IHS and your cooler. You can use any thermal paste you can find cheap where you are.


MX-4 is not much more than cheapest paste I could find, It's the shipping and liquid metal that's adds most to the cost. Thanks for your help!


----------



## criskoe

Well I got my rocketcool delid kit and a direct die frame and a copper IHS aswell for my 10900k. I can now confirm 100% that the EK magnitude CANNOT direct die on a Asus XII Extreme due to the inner row of caps... I figured it wasnt going to work but thought i would try anyways... Pretty sure all of the Z490 Asus boards have that inner row of caps. So yeah in case anyone cares. For now I decided to just use the copper IHS. I didnt bother glue or silicone down the IHS. Just used the socket clamps to hold it in place.. Used Conductonaut between die and Rockitcool copper IHS and kryonaut on top... Overall process was easy....

Results arnt bad . Shaved 10c off max temp.... Cores still have the same 8C deltas as before delid but max is 10c cooler.. Same 2 cold cores but even cooler now.... I dunno. I feel like i applied right amount of LM. Oh well. Pretty happy with these 5.3ghz temps now... Prolly gunna just leave it at this... Dont really wana tear down again...


----------



## Robertomcat

Hello colleagues!
EKWB brand blocks can be combined with RockitCool direct die tools?


----------



## Avacado

Yep.


----------



## Robertomcat

Hello, good morning. Do you know if RockitCool ships its products from the United States or from the European Union?


----------



## dng25

Robertomcat said:


> Hello, good morning. Do you know if RockitCool ships its products from the United States or from the European Union?


If you order from their website it will be shipping from US.


----------



## Robertomcat

dng25 said:


> If you order from their website it will be shipping from US.


I was asking this question mainly because I live in Spain, and I'm sure that when I send it from the United States they will apply tariffs, but I don't know for sure. Have any of you bought from the European Union?


----------



## Satanello

Robertomcat said:


> I was asking this question mainly because I live in Spain, and I'm sure that when I send it from the United States they will apply tariffs, but I don't know for sure. Have any of you bought from the European Union?


I ordered directly from RK USA and received the package here in Italy in August so no problem for Spain.
Edit: the will apply taxes obviously, you will pay import fees to Fedex 

Inviato dal mio LYA-L29 utilizzando Tapatalk


----------



## Robertomcat

Satanello said:


> I ordered directly from RK USA and received the package here in Italy in August so no problem for Spain.
> Edit: the will apply taxes obviously, you will pay import fees to Fedex
> 
> Inviato dal mio LYA-L29 utilizzando Tapatalk


And to know more or less the fees I have to pay; how much money did you spend and how many fees did you have to pay?


----------



## Robertomcat

Hi guys, good morning.
Have any of you tried the direct die with Kryonaut or Kryonaut Extreme thermal paste?
Or is it worth to use liquid metal directly?


----------



## Imprezzion

Robertomcat said:


> And to know more or less the fees I have to pay; how much money did you spend and how many fees did you have to pay?


Month old post, I know, but figured I'd pitch in. I'm from the Netherlands and bought the kit from rockitcool as well, was about €11.40 import tax and shipping was around €17. Got it from Texas in 6 days with fed ex express shipping option.

I got my 10900KF direct die cooled now using a EK Phoenix 280 kit (Supremacy block and mount) with Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra and it fits fine on the MSI Z490 Ace with the stock hardware. Did not have to do anything special to the mount except add the included washers.

I am at 5.3Ghz all core AVX0 4.9 cache 4400C17 memory with 1.390v vCore (VCC Sense) LLC3, IO 1.35v, SA 1.40v. Temps are sitting at 78-81c non-AVX stress test and 90-93c with full on Prime95 28.9 AVX FMA3 small FTT everything enabled so basically worst-case scenario at over 355w of power draw.

While just gaming the cores never even reach 70c which is still idle 900 RPM fan speed for my rad. Fans only ramp up above 75c.


----------



## Peter Watson

Robertomcat said:


> Hi guys, good morning.
> Have any of you tried the direct die with Kryonaut or Kryonaut Extreme thermal paste?
> Or is it worth to use liquid metal directly?


Only liquid metal on direct die, paste can't transfer the heat it could kill your cpu using paste.


----------



## mouacyk

Robertomcat said:


> Hi guys, good morning.
> Have any of you tried the direct die with Kryonaut or Kryonaut Extreme thermal paste?
> Or is it worth to use liquid metal directly?


Most non liquid metal paste have a pump out effect that degrades thermal conductivity within days.


----------



## Robertomcat

mouacyk said:


> Most non liquid metal paste have a pump out effect that degrades thermal conductivity within days.


Then I directly put the liquid metal. I was just saying that to test it, since I have the Kryonaut, but if you say it's not a good idea... Conductonaut will be the best option. Thanks


----------



## inedenimadam

Robertomcat said:


> Then I directly put the liquid metal. I was just saying that to test it, since I have the Kryonaut, but if you say it's not a good idea... Conductonaut will be the best option. Thanks


Can confirm regular paste doesn't last long direct die.


----------



## Robertomcat

inedenimadam said:


> Can confirm regular paste doesn't last long direct die.


Ok perfect. Eskerrik asko!!


----------



## GraphicsWhore

Just got my complete direct-die kit for 10850K with LM from Rockit. I've de-lidded before but this is my first time going naked. Using EK Quantum Velocity and Maximus XII Formula.

May have been mentioned: are there any considerations on periodically replacing the LM with DD setup or is the same as if you have IHS? I'm using LM now on 7700k but that was delid and relid and I haven't touched it since summer of 2017 - no issues.


----------



## mouacyk

GraphicsWhore said:


> Just got my complete direct-die kit for 10850K with LM from Rockit. I've de-lidded before but this is my first time going naked. Using EK Quantum Velocity and Maximus XII Formula.
> 
> May have been mentioned: are there any considerations on periodically replacing the LM with DD setup or is the same as if you have IHS? I'm using LM now on 7700k but that was delid and relid and I haven't touched it since summer of 2017 - no issues.


Some of the better advice for applying LM only once is to apply multiple coatings against the block in 15 minute intervals. I would have avoided the LM turning into power after months of usage if I had been aware of this method.


----------



## HITTI

Can the i5 10600k be delidded? I delidded my i7 3770k long time ago.


----------



## GraphicsWhore

HITTI said:


> Can the i5 10600k be delidded? I delidded my i7 3770k long time ago.


Yes. Rockit has a kit for all 10th gen


----------



## HITTI

GraphicsWhore said:


> Yes. Rockit has a kit for all 10th gen


Rockit who? Thnx.
I see. ROCKIT Delid & Relid Tool Kit - Intel CPUs


----------



## GraphicsWhore

HITTI said:


> Rockit who? Thnx.
> I see. ROCKIT Delid & Relid Tool Kit - Intel CPUs


Yes, that Rockit


----------



## HITTI

GraphicsWhore said:


> Yes, that Rockit


What are they talking about a copper ihs? Says relidding with one dont work, did intel switch to copper ihs?


----------



## GraphicsWhore

HITTI said:


> What are they talking about a copper ihs? Says relidding with one dont work, did intel switch to copper ihs?


It’s just one of the options. I watched some videos comparing the copper to factory IHS and assuming you clean off factory TIM and use liquid metal, there’s a difference but how much of that is the copper IHS vs just LM is hard to tell. If you’re going to bother de-lidding 10th gen and have experience I think liquid metal + copper upgrade is a good way to go but you obviously don’t have to do it.


----------



## HITTI

GraphicsWhore said:


> It’s just one of the options. I watched some videos comparing the copper to factory IHS and assuming you clean off factory TIM and use liquid metal, there’s a difference but how much of that is the copper IHS vs just LM is hard to tell. If you’re going to bother de-lidding 10th gen and have experience I think liquid metal + copper upgrade is a good way to go but you obviously don’t have to do it.


I delidded my i7 3770k with a vice long time ago and used lm, with a tool now available i bet its a breeze in the park.


----------



## GeneO

GraphicsWhore said:


> It’s just one of the options. I watched some videos comparing the copper to factory IHS and assuming you clean off factory TIM and use liquid metal, there’s a difference but how much of that is the copper IHS vs just LM is hard to tell. If you’re going to bother de-lidding 10th gen and have experience I think liquid metal + copper upgrade is a good way to go but you obviously don’t have to do it.


And you don't have to remove the solder from the original IHS 😉


----------



## HITTI

GeneO said:


> And you don't have to remove the solder from the original IHS 😉


Solder? It aint a glue like i7 3770k?


----------



## GeneO

HITTI said:


> Solder? It aint a glue like i7 3770k?


The TIM is solder (die to IHS) rather than thermal paste for the last three generations. IHS is still glued onto the PCB but you have to remove the solder from the IHS before you add liquid metal to it and relid it.


----------



## HITTI

GeneO said:


> The TIM is solder (die to IHS) rather than thermal paste for the last three generations. IHS is still glued onto the PCB but you have to remove the solder from the IHS before you add liquid metal to it and relid it.


Omy, so going copper is best thing but cant cuz rockit website says cant relid with copper?


----------



## HITTI

Oic i read wrong. "The guide"

The relid guide included with this kit will NOT work for the copper IHS, it is larger than the stock IHS. 

How can the copper be bigger than the stock IHS? And fit? And how do you remove the solder Do you have to have a heat gun?


----------



## HITTI

So i dont get it. They have vid of guide "In which I thought guide was a tutorial until I seen it's a tool" with the copper IHS. But then they say that it won't work? "The relid guide included with this kit will NOT work for the copper IHS, it is larger than the stock IHS. "


----------



## GeneO

HITTI said:


> Oic i read wrong. "The guide"
> 
> The relid guide included with this kit will NOT work for the copper IHS, it is larger than the stock IHS.
> 
> How can the copper be bigger than the stock IHS? And fit? And how do you remove the solder Do you have to have a heat gun?


It is a bit wider so needs a different template to hold it in the correct position for relidding than is provided for the normal IHS. The proper template is provided with the copper upgrade kit.


----------



## criskoe

A bit of advice.. When deliding 10th gen. Heat the cpu up with a heat gun or hair drier if you dont have a heat gun to help soften the solder. It makes deliding much easier and vastly reduces the risk of cracking the die.

You want to try to get the ihs up to at least 200F. If your gun doesnt have a temp sensor a cheat is once a drop of water boils on the IHS, it’s ready.
Sort of a hack to see what the temps are if you don’t have a temp gun  Water boils at 212F which is perfect for the IHS. Anything around 200F softens it nicely and the IHS comes off with little force....

This is advice directly from James at Rockitcool And I can confirm it works well....

The relid frame guides are really only for if you are going to glue either the stock ihs or the copper upgraded ihs back on... One frame for the stock ish and one frame for the upgraded copper ihs. Thats why its saying the one will not work with the other. The foot print is slightly different. But honestly if I were you I wouldnt bother gluing the ihs back on. Once delided and you have cleaned off the excess solder from the die and prepped the cpu, apply the liquid metal to the die and the center of which ever ihs you are going to use. (Stock Or Copper One, I recommend the copper upgraded one from rocket cool.) and then set the cpu in the socket. Then carefully set the IHS on the cpu in the center then clamp down the socket cpu bracket. The motherboard cpu clamp bracket will hold the IHS in place no problem. Also makes redoing the liquid metal very easy. Again. Only reason I personally would glue the ihs back on is if I was selling the cpu to someone else and they are not comfortable with something like that.

Also not sure what you plan on running on top of your cpu. Full loop? Aio? Air cooler? But if your block/cooler has enough clearance and can sit low enough and you can just direct die the cpu Id fully recommend just getting the delid kit and the direct die frame and go with out a IHS at all. Of course do your research before to make sure your block or cooler can work with direct die. 

Oh yeah and dont forget to cover the little contacts on the top of the cpu beside the die with some nail polish or liquid electrical tape.... You dont want any liquid metal seepage to touch them and short your cpu 

Good Luck.


----------



## HITTI

criskoe said:


> A bit of advice.. When deliding 10th gen. Heat the cpu up with a heat gun or hair drier if you dont have a heat gun to help soften the solder. It makes deliding much easier and vastly reduces the risk of cracking the die.
> 
> You want to try to get the ihs up to at least 200F. If your gun doesnt have a temp sensor a cheat is once a drop of water boils on the IHS, it’s ready.
> Sort of a hack to see what the temps are if you don’t have a temp gun  Water boils at 212F which is perfect for the IHS. Anything around 200F softens it nicely and the IHS comes off with little force....
> 
> This is advice directly from James at Rockitcool And I can confirm it works well....
> 
> The relid frame guides are really only for if you are going to glue either the stock ihs or the copper upgraded ihs back on... One frame for the stock ish and one frame for the upgraded copper ihs. Thats why its saying the one will not work with the other. The foot print is slightly different. But honestly if I were you I wouldnt bother gluing the ihs back on. Once delided and you have cleaned off the excess solder from the die and prepped the cpu, apply the liquid metal and then set the cpu in the socket. Then carefully set the IHS on the cpu in the center then clamp down the socket cpu bracket. The motherboard cpu clamp bracket will hold the IHS in place no problem. Also makes redoing the liquid metal very easy. Again. Only reason I personally would glue the ihs back on is if I was selling the cpu to someone else and they are not comfortable with something like that.
> 
> Oh yeah and dont forget to cover the little contacts on the top of the cpu beside the die with some nail polish or liquid electrical tape.... You dont want any liquid metal seepage to touch them and short your cpu
> 
> Good Luck.


This is what i did with my 3770k, cpu clamped, It been many years since I delidded it, I haven't changed the liquid metal or the Tim since 2014/15. temps are great, [email protected] 

Nail polish sounds like a cool trick. I did not do that with my 3770k, its bare.


----------



## criskoe

HITTI said:


> This is what i did with my 3770k, cpu clamped, It been many years since I delidded it, I haven't changed the liquid metal or the Tim since 2014/15. temps are great, [email protected]
> 
> Nail polish sounds like a cool trick. I did not do that with my 3770k, its bare.


I dont think the 3770K had and contacts on the top of the cpu. You will notice them when you delid a 10th gen tho. Make sure you cover them..

Yeah just cpu clamp it again and dont worry about the relid frame guides. You really dont need them like I said unless you want to glue the cpu ihs back on perfectly strait like from the factory.


----------



## HITTI

criskoe said:


> I dont think the 3770K had and contacts on the top of the cpu. You will notice them when you delid a 10th gen tho. Make sure you cover them..
> 
> Yeah just cpu clamp it again and dont worry about the relid frame guides. You really dont need them like I said unless you want to glue the cpu ihs back on perfectly strait like from the factory.


nail polish like revlon or any brand?


----------



## criskoe

HITTI said:


> nail polish like revlon or any brand?


I cant really recommend a particular nail polish cause I actually prefer to use
*Permatex Liquid Electrical Tape*
Reason I like it over nail polish is its much easier to remove if want. It literally will just peel off if you want. Nail polish take chemicals to remove.

Also Thermal grizzly sells stuff just for this but is basically red nail polish and is kinda expensive but its called Thermal Grizzly TG Shield if you want to check it out.


----------



## HITTI

criskoe said:


> I cant really recommend a particular nail polish cause I actually prefer to use
> *Permatex Liquid Electrical Tape*
> Reason I like it over nail polish is its much easier to remove if want. It literally will just peel off if you want. Nail polish take chemicals to remove.
> 
> Also Thermal grizzly sells stuff just for this but is basically red nail polish and is kinda expensive but its called Thermal Grizzly TG Shield if you want to check it out.


Wouldn't you want to protect it all the time? Even after you lay down the IHS.

Permatex Liquid Electrical Tape i'll take that into account.


----------



## criskoe

HITTI said:


> Wouldn't you want to protect it all the time? Even after you lay down the IHS.
> 
> Permatex Liquid Electrical Tape i'll take that into account.


Not sure what you mean or are asking. You can use either. They will both cover and protect from electrical shorts. I just prefer to use the liquid electrical tape cause its easier to remove. IF I wanted to... I use it for other stuff too. Ive used it to coat around laptop cpu sockets to apply liquid metal on them. And if I ever needed to return it to stock to send for rma or what ever. The stuff just peels off... Nail polish would require chemicals to remove it.... Thats all im saying. Will you ever have to remove it. Who knows. Probably not... I just like having the easier option... 

Example of a laptop cpu socket i coated.... You can see the black liquid tape covering the stuff around the die.... That stuff will just peel off if i want to remove it for what ever reason...


----------



## HITTI

criskoe said:


> Not sure what you mean or are asking. You can use either. They will both cover and protect from electrical shorts. I just prefer to use the liquid electrical tape cause its easier to remove. IF I wanted to... I use it for other stuff too. Ive used it to coat around laptop cpu sockets to apply liquid metal on them. And if I ever needed to return it to stock to send for rma or what ever. The stuff just peels off... Nail polish would require chemicals to remove it.... Thats all im saying. Will you ever have to remove it. Who knows. Probably not... I just like having the easier option...
> 
> Example of a laptop cpu socket i coated.... You can see the black liquid tape covering the stuff around the die.... That stuff will just peel off if i want to remove it for what ever reason...
> View attachment 2514008


The liquid tape will not melt under heavy CPU load?


----------



## criskoe

HITTI said:


> The liquid tape will not melt under heavy CPU load?


Temperature range: -50°C to 135°C

if your cpu socket is hotter then 135c. You gunna have problems anyways.  lol.


----------



## MattBaneLM

I'm aware this will be unpopular with some aand it's not an issue for all either but worth being mindful of. seen a few cracked cpu substrates lately.


----------



## Altimax98

Just a heads up about the MSI Z590-I Unify (dont know if it affects other MSI Z590 boards). There is a tiny capacitor below the bottom of the socket that prevents the RockIt Direct Die mount from sitting flush to the motherboard. It pushes it up just enough that the CPU doesnt make even contact on the socket and it fails to boot. I ended up grinding down the whole of the mount behind the screw on the bottom border to fit the capacitor and fit flat.

Took me like 3 hours of debugging to come to this solution


----------



## criskoe

Altimax98 said:


> Just a heads up about the MSI Z590-I Unify (dont know if it affects other MSI Z590 boards). There is a tiny capacitor below the bottom of the socket that prevents the RockIt Direct Die mount from sitting flush to the motherboard. It pushes it up just enough that the CPU doesnt make even contact on the socket and it fails to boot. I ended up grinding down the whole of the mount behind the screw on the bottom border to fit the capacitor and fit flat.
> 
> Took me like 3 hours of debugging to come to this solution


Got any pics?


----------



## The Pook

anyone go direct die with a Liquid Freezer 2 on 10th Gen? does the RockitCool kit come with the needed hardware?

One of the reviews for it said they never got the hardware for their LF2 and had to buy it separate, really would like to buy everything I need to do it in one go.

I already emailed them twice and haven't gotten an answer


----------



## Altimax98

criskoe said:


> Got any pics?


----------



## criskoe

Altimax98 said:


> PICS**


Nice. Good catch...


----------



## Evry1lovej

has anyone figure out how to get ekwb magnitude to fit on a z490 apex for a 10900 delid


----------



## mouacyk

holy cramp


----------



## mattxx88

got the same issue with a Gene z390
i went for a custom ihs, but you can take out some material from the magnitude chassis with a turbine and a milling bur (?) (dunno how do you call this items in english:

i use them in mine workshop


----------



## criskoe

Evry1lovej said:


> has anyone figure out how to get ekwb magnitude to fit on a z490 apex for a 10900 delid


I ran into this issue before om my Z490 Extreme. Im pretty sure all of the asus boards have that inner row of caps too. 

Nothing you can do but grind a notch in the magnitude frame to clear the caps if your determined to use the magnitude. 

I ended up just buying a Optimus Foundation for direct die. It has a smaller foot print and clears the caps on the asus boards. I didnt want to butcher my $300 dollar magnitude block.


----------



## Evry1lovej

criskoe said:


> I ran into this issue before om my Z490 Extreme. Im pretty sure all of the asus boards have that inner row of caps too.
> 
> Nothing you can do but grind a notch in the magnitude frame to clear the caps if your determined to use the magnitude.
> 
> I ended up just buying a Optimus Foundation for direct die. It has a smaller foot print and clears the caps on the asus boards. I didnt want to butcher my $300 dollar magnitude block.


So I did grind it out the inner cap isnt issue but the contact is now.
2-3 cores get to 100 real quick


----------



## criskoe

Evry1lovej said:


> So I did grind it out the inner cap isnt issue but the contact is now.
> 2-3 cores get to 100 real quick


You have the flat coldplate? If so you might wama give that a try. Any possible way you might have cracked the die when deliding it?

But sounds mostly likey just poor contact on part of the chip. You might need to try mounting it a few times and add a bit more liquid metal. Dont go crazy tho.


----------



## Evry1lovej

I tired both. I took out whole mb


criskoe said:


> You have the flat coldplate? If so you might wama give that a try. Any possible way you might have cracked the die when deliding it?
> 
> I have the flat one. It maybe mounting but I screw that shiet all the way down. I did crack it a little delidding but I don’t think that’s effecting the cores temp. It’s always 2 or 3 cores that are highest.
> 
> But sounds mostly likey just poor contact on part of the chip. You might need to try mounting it a few times and add a bit more liquid metal. Dont go crazy tho.


yea I’m trying to figure it out.


----------



## criskoe

Evry1lovej said:


> I tired both. I took out whole mb
> 
> 
> yea I’m trying to figure it out.


Your last post quote is all messed up BTW.

Anyways. You dont want to mount the block too tight when direct die. You don't tighten it down as much as you do with a normal cpu. It doesn't need to be real tight or else you will hurt the die.

Dam thats not good about cracking the die. Ive read a few times that cracking the die can cause exactly what your experiencing. High temps on some cores. But hopefully your good.

Good luck. Post back when you get it figured out.


----------



## Evry1lovej

here’s with a flat cold plate. My question is am I going about thiswrong? I’m not putting any lm on the cpu block becuase I want to make sure it makes contact. Or does it actually make contact and the lm doesn’t stick like thermal?


----------



## NorySS

Evry1lovej said:


> View attachment 2526016
> View attachment 2526017
> 
> 
> here’s with a flat cold plate. My question is am I going about thiswrong? I’m not putting any lm on the cpu block becuase I want to make sure it makes contact. Or does it actually make contact and the lm doesn’t stick like thermal?


 The thing with direct die, is the mounting hardware. You need to make sure the mounting hardware will allow the block to travel far enough down (z-height), to make contact with the die.

Your flat cold plate isnt help either. Its not helping becuase you are reducing the overall height of the block. With a flat cold plate you dont have the convex, or buldge which might help reach the block. I've made a crappy diagram here:










Assuming the block ISNT bottoming out on the caps, you might just need to shorten the standoffs, or replace them.
Heres a video i made about a year ago. hope it helps.


----------



## Evry1lovej

criskoe said:


> Your last post quote is all messed up BTW.
> 
> Anyways. You dont want to mount the block too tight when direct die. You don't tighten it down as much as you do with a normal cpu. It doesn't need to be real tight or else you will hurt the die.
> 
> Dam thats not good about cracking the die. Ive read a few times that cracking the die can cause exactly what your experiencing. High temps on some cores. But hopefully your good.
> 
> Good luck. Post back when you get it figured out.





NorySS said:


> The thing with direct die, is the mounting hardware. You need to make sure the mounting hardware will allow the block to travel far enough down (z-height), to make contact with the die.
> 
> Your flat cold plate isnt help either. Its not helping becuase you are reducing the overall height of the block. With a flat cold plate you dont have the convex, or buldge which might help reach the block. I've made a crappy diagram here:
> 
> View attachment 2527132
> 
> 
> Assuming the block ISNT bottoming out on the caps, you might just need to shorten the standoffs, or replace them.
> Heres a video i made about a year ago. hope it helps.



do you have a discord or something to contact you with? I was able to get it to work and it was stupidest reason. I didn’t lm the block itself so I was missing that contact. After screwing it all in, it works well but core 1 is a bit high, but I’m fine with.

I want to shave down the stand-off but honest have no idea. If you have any idea or can help. I appreciate it.


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## Kaltenbrunner

With direct die, how easy is it to crush or crack the silicon, from uneven pressure ? I will soon have an Arctic LF2 420, but I'm not overly afraid to mod it's mounting, I did that to old current cooler to get a nice fit w/o paying for a new bracket. But yeah, not if it's easy to crack/crush it. I'd put the lid back with LM

I lapped my 12700k, I pray it doesn't break, but I guess it should be easy to sell on here down the road if I want (working of course but no label).

Now I'm tempted to delid it too, but I wish someone would sell me their once used delid kit.


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## criskoe

Kaltenbrunner said:


> With direct die, how easy is it to crush or crack the silicon, from uneven pressure ? I will soon have an Arctic LF2 420, but I'm not overly afraid to mod it's mounting, I did that to old current cooler to get a nice fit w/o paying for a new bracket. But yeah, not if it's easy to crack/crush it. I'd put the lid back with LM
> 
> I lapped my 12700k, I pray it doesn't break, but I guess it should be easy to sell on here down the road if I want.
> 
> Now I'm tempted to delid it too, but I wish someone would sell me their once used delid kit.


You don’t really need any pressure at all when going direct die. The goal is just To have good contact with the cold plate to the die. That’s it. Your basically just mounting the block With light pressure so it doesn’t fall off and stays in place.

it shouldn’t crack easy unless you go ham and try to mount the block like on a normal CPU.

Your biggest risk in my opinion is deliding 12th gen. It has a few chips at the edge that can easily be damaged if your not careful and paying attention. Its not as easy and strait forward as 10th gen was. It’s totally doable but be careful and make sure you get the proper tools.


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## Kaltenbrunner

Ok so probably lap both the die, and cooler block. And then it should just sit flat. If it's comparatively loose, at I won't have a big heavy air cooler torqing on the die, (if I left the case vertical)

But IDK, the kit's are kind of expensive, IRL the only hard thing I run is a few games, so I don't need to worry about this stuff yet. OCing is fun in itself, I have lots of tuning room left yet, and I barely touched my ram yet.


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## Eddy de Vere

Thought I'd leave this here re. the adhesive used by CPU manufacturers to glue the IHS (heat spreader), because in years of discussion I've never heard anyone confirm definitively what it is.

Well, it's polyurethane (PU, 'urethane'), same stuff as used to retain automotive windshields (and other parts). In terms of hardness, it's going to be c. Shore-A 80 - 90 harder than any silicone/RTV but softer than most epoxys. 

It's readily available, albeit usually in tubes or cartridges big enough to re-attach about 10,000 IHS's.

It is in fact the best stuff to use (unsurprisingly really), assuming the IHS is held/clamped properly while it cures (which is NOT by installing it in the socket). It ensures proper distribution of the clamping force of the ILM and cooler to the PCB via the IHS flange (RTV is too soft) while still being flexible enough to accommodate differential expansion between the parts.


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## Eddy de Vere

Forgot to add; I fill a small syringe (5ml) with the stuff which allows one to apply a perfectly uniform, thin bead (with a bit of practice).


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## WayWayUp

Is the rocketcool 10th gen delid kit and direct die bracket compatible with 13th gen? or will i need to buy new tools?

I want to reuse my optimus cpu block as well


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## Agent-A01

WayWayUp said:


> Is the rocketcool 10th gen delid kit and direct die bracket compatible with 13th gen? or will i need to buy new tools?
> 
> I want to reuse my optimus cpu block as well


Not compatible.


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